4 Episode results for "sequoia Andriessen"
Better diversity in venture capital investing might mean putting it in the contract
"Hey, it's molly would hear one of the most uncomfortable things to talk about with your kids is money especially now. We've got you covered though with a new podcast for kids and their families million Brazilian for marketplace helping dollars make more sense subscribed wherever you get your pod tests. Bringing diversity into venture capital investing might mean you got to put it in the contract from American public media. This is marketplace tech I'm Ali would. This week, a group of venture capital firms announced that they're planning to make diversity a core part of their deals with startup founders. The ten firms committed to including new standard language in the contracts called term sheets that they make with startup founders. It's a diversity writer that says that the company and lead investor will make every attempt to include a member of an underrepresented group as a CO investor. It's not. Binding language but the idea is that it will create opportunity for underrepresented investors to participate in deals and also attract founders who prioritize a commitment to equity. The initiative was started by Alejandro Guerrero, a venture capitalist based in Los Angeles with the firm act one ventures I wanted funds to feel because, yes, this is important and everybody out here is talking about it and all the founders are trying to see more. That we're the ones signing up for it. We're actually going to be the ones that have the competitive advantage because founders are looking to work with individuals that are trying to do more. It doesn't have the teeth to see it is enforceable, but that wasn't the point. Right the point here is that all of us know what this is about all of us are making a commitment it's going to it's GonNa. Take some effort it's GonNa. Take a bit word particularly if you know maybe you didn't have the diverse network of potential investors to bring in but now it's reason to do that right it. It's a reason to go out and build more networks meet individuals that you know that you can invite and you'll get to know more, and then hopefully when you build that trust, you'll start seeing incredible new deal flow. I mean I guess I wonder why wouldn't affirm WANNA have diversity rider like this I can't speak to why they wouldn't want to do right. Every fund is different. The way that they're structured their make up their cash, their LP's I don't know. What will success look like I'm hopeful that yeah within. A few years year to that, we see this in the majority of venture funds, and hopefully we'll take it to further and say what you embed this in my term sheet. Yeah. Best case could you see a scenario where as this conversation becomes more prevalent? The push from founders right. The competition could incentivize firms to bring on more underrepresented partners. Yeah. Exactly. That's where I hope this is all GonNa go right like the matter what we do it's not enough right hire more people write more checks do the writer create officer programs, cohorts, all of it like not enough the gap is so wide right diversity is forever, and if we start thinking about it in that regard, then it won't become part of our. Normal behavior when we're out building networks when we're looking for companies when we're out doing deals, how we structure them, you know how advise our our founders to think about building their executive ranks their boards, all of it. Right. We'll give them off to a more equitable than just roll and that's the world that I wanna live in I'm an optimist and I'm hopeful that that's where we're going to see ourselves in and some in the coming years here. Alejandro Guerrero is the principal with the firm act. One ventures. And now for some related links as we mentioned in the interview, there are some notable absences from the diversity writer program big Silicon Valley names like sequoia Andriessen, Horowitz client of Perkins we asked all three if they had plans to join this totally non-binding voluntary inclusion of language and their term sheets with the goal of starting a conversation about diversity at all stages of the investing life cycle. Andriessen Horwitz pointed us to its cultural leadership fund and eighteen million dollars. So Fund made up of one hundred percent black limited partners whose primary investor is also black with one goal being to quote enable more. Young African. Americans to enter the technology industry. I should note that the LP's who've put money into the Cultural Leadership Fund are pretty much all celebrities, corporate executives and some athletes. So not the scrappy would be investors who guerrero says he's hoping we'll get a foot in the door with something like the diversity writer. And teepee insights piece from last month notes that the Cultural Leadership Fund has invested in sixty five companies and of those just three have at least one black founder and eleven have at least one female founder. To saying maybe more conversations wouldn't hurt. Cleaner and sequoia didn't get back to us in time for air. And here's what else we're watching in tech on Tiktok watch apparently, maybe you Walmart and Microsoft might team up to buy it and then Walmart would pivot Tiktok towards a more full on ECOMMERCE shopping experience. So creators and influencers could just. Sell you things which listen again privacy and data collecting are real concerns with Tiktok may be no more so than with facebook instagram. Google or Amazon, but considering the awesome and fun and diverse breadth of content on talk and the true love that people have for it. You ve kind of couldn't even engineer sadder fate. tiktok CEO Kevin Meyer who just took over a few months ago saw that Pale horse coming and promptly quit the announced the move Thursday Stephanie who produces marketplace? Tech. Alvarado our assistant producer Michael Lipkin our senior editor Becca Wineman, and Robin Edgar our engineers I'm Ali. Would that's marketplace tech. This is a PM.
SaaStr 374: 10 Mistakes the CEO of ZoomInfo Made on His Journey to IPO with Henry Schuck, CEO @ ZoomInfo and Jason Lemkin, CEO @ SaaStr (Part 1)
"Welcome to be official faster podcast. What do sales was vase and hub spot having common they use calculators, Graydon's at quizzes to attract relevant uses to their website and turn them into pain cuts to Liz bond at how you can vote these same tools for Yoga's at Acworth dot com forward slash stats that is at grown dot com forward slash S. A.. S. Today's Sasser inside a we have one of the ten sakes. The CEO of Soup Info Mate on his journey to IPO with Henry Shaq CEO at Zoom Info and Jason Them Kin CEO at Sastre. Every company big and small is realizing that high quality data is a necessity to go to market. My Name's Henry Shotgun the CEO. Or? There's no platform out there dots together wrath than death and accuracy of business information, the way that we have. Business information is constantly changing. We built is this core I. AM machine learning in that takes literally millions and millions of unique sources so that we can deliver ninety five percent accuracy for. Data. Scientists who are bedded into our go to market motion. We're looking at every single metric figuring out how do we convert out a little bit better a little bit better a little bit better. I really WANNA build a business that in every single department leather it's sales and marketing like development I want every single piece of that business to be literally best in class. The culture of continuous of our company is a big part of our success. We're used to grind this thing out. We're going to work harder. We're GONNA care more. About the be paranoid when it's good because I wanNA make sure that it's repeatable I wanna make sure that if there is something that we did last week the made it the best week ever that we keep on doing it. Wasn't IPO in the middle, of, pandemic. It's not a celebration. It's really just a launching point for the next day. ooh, right. Sometimes on these digital things, the crowd can be a little quiet but let's all give it up or friend respect Zoom Info. It's great to have him here. and. Henry. Thank you so much for making the time and. You can just sit here and watch that movie on loop fifty. Life. Pretty. Good. Little Fitter now, than you were a for a brief moment in that journey, I hadn't noticed that before is that fair to say. I was more I was more. During the journey out now. Maybe might just be the camera angle might just be the cab rank. Yeah. It's funny. I've learned. Over the years, it's subtle. But if you see a CEO founder that you know and you see them get fitter, it's a good sign like vast like do whatever you can when because. Tell right will end looking good. I had somebody tell me once I. Feel. Guilty. If I take time away from work to work out and I had somebody tell me like you've. Henry told me that when you work out your more productive at work, you're a better version of yourself at work and so why are you not just thinking about that and then investment into your productivity at work? Yeah. It was like, yeah. Okay. I get behind that. Is True. So, this is a special session. First of all, we will try to do some Q. and a. a click on a at the bottom. If you're watching this on zoom rather than on social media clicking there, we'll try to get some these questions and this will be fun session. For Two reasons first, I think as as a case study. Zoom Info Super, interesting company we've obviously all used the product. I think and I think. But when when I I was shocked at the scale of the company, right I didn't know there's a lot. There's a lot of vendors I knew at broken out. So we were shocked in Henry. We'll share some stories as we went through this of how folks may be underestimated him on the journey right in what it took for him to build a deck of corn and it's so interesting to see one of these products that we know are like Whoa, my God, this scale of the product and why and. Why did Zoom Info breakout and it is a competitive space and how does this really work? So I think it's it's Super Fund in Harry pointed out the company did not raise eleven hundred million dollar rounds from Sequoia Andriessen and had its own sort of path through private equity and other things, and in some ways as a company, not a product might have flown under the radar a little bit until it kind of exploded this year. So a lot of interesting Henry asked what he could talk about it sastre and he did us a gift. which we're going to go through is he he laid out his top ten mistakes getting to the first four, hundred million or so in revenue. So I'm going to ask him about these mistakes and what's great is so many of these are themes that we've all talked about. In Our community and Sastre for years and I think it's special. Have to get his time to sit down quietly and write them, and it's so interesting when a co or does because you can hear their brain in their heart the number one mistake probably was the number one piece of scar tissue have. Just pure peer into their brain. So so with that, let me kick this off because this could mean so many things but mistake number one. Being risk averse in investment outside of sales, a lot of founders might have the opposite experience but what does this mean? Where were you? Where did you hold back too much and I think you could probably replace sales with like your area expertise if you're founder or CEO and so. I'm really tied into sale Anderson how it worked I did all of the sales for the first novel who sales on the front line doing sales for the first five years a company's existence like I was I on regular quota carrying sales rep on top of. Everything else and so I had. So every time it came to spend the next dollar I was much more likely to spend it in sales than really anywhere else in the business. Yeah. I was thinking about this this this mistake. I was thinking about why wasn't that I that I wanted to put all the dollars in sales and I was much less likely to put it in marketing HR customer, success. And really I think sales was easy because you can see a direct line. You put a dollar and sales you saw getting into mind. And everywhere else in the business that one was less clear. So you can put it in marketing and do you trust the reports during getting about attribution and where the leaves are coming in you could put it in hr but you really believe that they're going to strategically grow your talent and when you think about not making the investments and all those other areas when you really telling yourself is either you don't trust the people in the department, and so you're going like I'm not going to give money to marketing because I just don't really trust that they're going to be able to execute with those dollars. So. Go fix that don't not make the investment in marketing because you don't trust the execution of the leader. If you're, not GONNA make investment in product you have to ask yourself like why would I not be make none investment And it's probably because either you're chasing the wrong day. You don't trust the You don't think your customers are going to engage with outside of the product. And so I think on this one. We always wanted immediate payoff, and so we never looked to like for the early portion of the business. Then we look to making investments that have long term pay in a lot of that is because we didn't trust or I didn't. Trust the leader in those organizations that deliver me the results that I trust the leaders in sales to delivery, and so the learning here is if you don't trust. A team and you're not making investment in nineteen because you don't trust them, you have to fix the underlying issue there because investments go a long way. Well that's an interesting point, you took a slightly different place than I was expecting I thought you were going to say I trusted sales just put with limited capital. I put it where I knew but you're really saying I didn't know these other areas and I'm not sure about the leader's I hired you hire the wrong first generation of management team because you hadn't done those functionaries before what was. Not Able to trust them. Did you just make the classic hires? Classic. Ms Hires and then after I made the classic new tires. Like if I took marketing Berg sample. Classic. Miss Higher there what I convince myself. was what I was getting from. Them was better than what I would do myself in the limited time that I would have focused on marketing. Across, all of the other things I was focusing on instead of. AM. I getting what I would interest back what I would expect from a fantastic marketing organization. And I wasn't ever getting that in the early days when I was getting instead was something better than what I was able to do on my own and it was just the wrong lens look at it. And what was the first like vp you hired outside of sales? That was your ought moment that changed the game that moved the needle how did you? How were you able to change us? What was that game changing VP's? I hired a great sales later revenue ops and now he's our chief revenue officer and what you saw when he came in and you've written about this to Jason is the mini came in all we thought we were really good and he was immediately making all over like why are we doing this? Let's do this and not just like allowed leaders can come in and just like who on everything I can't believe you guys are doing it this way it's an embarrassment that we're doing it this way the great leaders go hey, we're we're missing this opportunity. Then they execute against that opportunity and giving you results against it and they're able to do that over and over and over and scale. Heard this revenue operations leader all the sudden. You could see like every everything he put his hand on turns and gold and you're like, okay leadership can really turn around really any area, the company. Yeah. One other one on this I want to get mistake number two I but what you focused on sales because of this looking back obviously, it ended up ended up being an amazing journey but did you end up with certain types of product feature gaps and technical debt because it wasn't an area or focused on? Did you did you miss some investments in the product in those first couple of years because of this? Totally missed investment in the product along the way. We missed investments and building like a great engineering team early on. And then I think maybe more so than anything we missed investments in on the account management and customer success. So we were focused on sale side that we didn't invest the same sort of bigger around talent training and on boarding and just getting the right people and continuously giving them feedback in the account management side and so in. The early years of the company would really struggle from a NAP retention. And Logo Charm Perspective and thousand other area where when we hired somebody good and you saw the numbers turn. Yeah. It's magic and you actually kind of convince yourself at some point light. My business is different. You know my business is different I have SNB's my business is different. Data and software together are just more complicated and less sticky than other things just convince yourself of all of these of you have this very special thing. So it can't be best in class and that's just like not true. You just don't have the right leadership or structure to get off. That's a really good insight. You you hear that a lot from data focused companies tide turns. Okay right. You hear it from a lot of HR, focus companies that NPS is going to be low because employees hate using those tools right? They hate doing self assessment they hate it. And that is true. Probably true. Historically right. If you went into G to look but you shouldn't settle for that. Should you know? Webex users and sittard users how they built their conferencing solution like early on they might tell you like Oh, I hate conferencing and I. Like what you saw. Zoom Communication View was make that an enjoyable experience and that was a big differentiator. You. Didn't have to sell low NPS or video conferencing. You couldn't be a lot. Yeah it's a super good insight in. I want the next number two but. Especially engaged is so many folks make so many excuses right? It's ephemeral. It's a marketing tool. Of course, it's going to churn if if they asked it to perform the data's not great, I'll just leave and try another one right. This isn't like salesforce it's not sticky but don't your lesson here I think is a profound challenge to founders which is don't settle it's on okay you can have a Thirty forty, fifty sixty S in any field not just. This one this one, this one will is nick, but it's interesting not doing mergers and acquisitions sooner I don't know that every every founder would put this this mistake number two, but it's interesting because you put it you put it second here. So. Maybe I'll give a little bit of a lineage. bootstrap the company with my co-founder UNSEE thousand seven but twenty, five, thousand dollars, our traffic cards and went market. We built a really profitable business that high high margins and we didn't bring in our first outside capital until for seven seven years later, the business was already at a twenty five million dollars. A our run rate and we're doing audibly and when you have a profitable business, you have the opportunity to do emanate actually emanate with. WE DID EMANATE WITH DEBT And so you built this growing profitable business. In the you're able to loan against your balance sheet you go by and acquire competitors in your space or other technology Tuck ins in your space along the way like that is absolutely in my opinion play you should run. And we were always kind of late to this for every are big acquisition along the way company called ranking in two, thousand, seven at two, thousand, seventeen and Zoom Info which we were I found the business as a company called discover order you change the names fell after that acquisition made that zoom in. So acquisition in twenty nineteen, and both of them we have looks at those businesses a year or year and a half before, and if we had done the acquisition earlier, you WanNa save seven hundred million dollars in acquisition costs. Now it's hard to go. Oh you know one mistake that was it's a mistake nat like the cost of capital was things ended up working. Great But part of the reasons why we didn't do that as and I think probably a lot of founders feel this way is when you're looking at your business, you're you've grown up inside up, you start to feel like. You're just like a kid pretending elect an adult world like people who do a don't feel like thirty year olds who started their companies and like we just didn't have the confidence that we could pull something like that all and so we are always like a year behind getting the competence to be able to actually do. Successfully and it just money along the way. Yeah, the first points interesting because we we're all we're all kind of there's been a bunch of Sorority at this event. We're all woke to the power of debt in SAS if you do it right right. It has to be for leverage. It can't be in lieu of equity on its own because ideal spend it and you'll get into trouble on the service, right but. Five million air are predictable and how much did you borrow to do the first acquisition? two, hundred, million oh. Okay. Well. You take advantage of the growth in multiple that we've had over the last years, right? The growth in multiples and. And we protected equity in Dutch equity but you are able to somewhat confidently say, Hey, I can service that debt right giving their reputable slows, right? Yeah and that's that's something that whether it's just to take a little bit of debt to hire that extra VP product that you wish you tired back in the day or whether it's Dr to do something we should all if we have. Strong metric strong revenue retention. We should be confident to do this. It's sort of what you're saying be confident. God into do it ear- early because we were going to, you're going to get there right. You sell it already in the numbers at twenty, five, million air or you're going to get to one hundred yards from twenty five to one hundred approached one hundred percent at that point, right? It's just the resolution was unclear, right? and. If you're competent about from emanate perspective confident that you could put two businesses together get synergies, Outta grow them faster and make them more efficient in the process. You have even bigger plot of. Sort of cash flow to make to service. And did you its niche want the next one but? Could. But it is interesting. Did you feel like you had to get a discount that they have a lower multiple than you as you build up your confidence from a? Is it hard to pay for having to pay down I? Did feel that way I? I don't mind having some room to make mistakes on execution along the way and so I do look for. Today you get some companies will tell me like well, Henry, your training this multiple. So why shouldn't we get that? I get higher, we should get higher growing howser because we're more strategic. Shoot is like a lot of there's a lot of execution risk when you when you do and you have to be organized and focused and. So leaving new some room to to you know slip somewhere is a useful thing to have. Yeah. It's a good lesson for founders because I mean, fund the other side it's confusing right like like like Zoom Infos. Great. But whatever whatever your trading at your growing I don't know what you're growing your public. But let's say fifty percent forty, matter sixty. Four percent. But but Henry, I'm going eighty percent. And so like I deserve forty acts era because I know I know I know but like it's not fair and we just draw a line and you're an founders are in this. It's just you just need to be aware of it. Right? You just need to be aware of IT AND It's an every situations I. Remember back in the day when salesforce wanted to bias in the beginning the biggest acquisition they done was sixteen million at the time. And with us, we really WANNA buy you but like sixteen would-be too much. They look at Tableau and we soft right and then you look at like Jeff Lawson it. He's like I'm not messing around like I'm not buying an Itty bitty mail company I'm by the best thing said grid. I don't care what even though the multiple was a little was A. Like going in. It's a spectrum and companies of all the different rates right you're kind of in the middle I think right you didn't want around. I think the way that like I was. Thinking just shoot. One of the things that I'm thinking is like when I bring this asset in what am I able to do with it when I put it in the product might give it access to my go to market team. How much faster can I grow in where the synergies from that perspective not was always really important actually not thinks as the mistake number three. Which is not appreciating marketed the strategic advantage what? So this means like when we were doing I when we were doing a when we were growing a business. I never thought of how valuable it was to have an incredibly efficient go to market engine we have and we have a go to market engine that drives a annex elsevier caq. Does a thirty day. There's a thirty day average sale cycle super-efficient in generating leads and driving through the pipeline with automation. and. What I didn't appreciate what when you look at a business and you're like, what are the key assets in that business? You in your founder or you're a senior executive company, you're thinking about your business. One of the strategic advantages for business or other strategic lavers here go to market is just something you don't even think about. As part of that, a major mistake because go to market how you generate leads an new customers and up sell and grow your customer base not as a major be a major strategic advantage for your business. It's so often I see companies where you have to companies they're feature than product our new imperative and one is just running circles around the other one. When you see that happening, it's because one big out go to market in a more precise more efficient way, and that gives gives them an incredible advantage along the way. But. Okay. So that that's I get that but I've observed but. What do you mean by leveraging that you've got to companies right both have the same product maybe even the slower growing one is is better right sometimes that happens because they're inwardly focused but once figured out their go to market motion, right but okay if that's you and that's what you were right. But what do you mean take that to the next level? Why was it a mistake? At that's the piece missing what what's the what's the investment or the action you didn't take your when you have that advantage sue. So along the way when we were looking at acquisitions especially on, we're looking at acquisitions bolted in Bolt Yeah. When you look at an acquisition, you would go I have an opportunity to take. One is a company that didn't focus on go to market as. As in such a focused way we did, and if I can take this team on twenty sellers who are doing ten million dollars a year in a are. I can take bad team and make them do twenty million dollars by just bringing in our go to mark emotions on top, not not get rid of them you know but actually just add your expertise to their team take the same talent without training and tools and people just leverage up their leather revenue per lead just increase their revenue per lead. Revenue per lead from neighbors back internally the way I think about it too is like if you can make going to market incredibly efficient incredibly effective then gives you a strategic advantage to be able to take dollar that you would be spending their and spend time in product and. Spend them in account management and spend them. In customer success in marketing the more efficient, you make your go to market motion the more dollars you have to spend across the company and I never really actually when people would tell people say like, Hey, zoom in Bo is salesperson company and I'd be like, no. No we're a product company customer first company I e need hearing that. And it took a while to not moisturizing. That's a k. like that is a strategic advantage of the business we shouldn't be embarrassed. Other. There's something really interesting. You said, which I think is against some typical twitter advice, which is that if you have an efficient go to market engine, right the classic advice from ABC's and others pour gasoline on the fire right? If you have an efficient if you have fifty great reps higher five hundred, right go go raise two, hundred, million years saying an insight, which is what I feel philosophically although I don't know if it works in the world, which is if you have an efficient engine that means you can free up versus and other areas, it's a weapon, right? If you're inefficient, you end up having to spend every nickel in sales and marketing right every edit it consumes. Consumed all your oxygen. So you're saying if you're sales focus by good. L. Swear Right. Don't don't give into the fuel and the fire mentality necessarily. And then by the way, if you're putting money elsewhere and you're making those investments in a smart way that just your drive your ability to continue to invest in a disciplined way inside of your sales organization. So if I take the dollars from that strategic gas, put it in other places, and then that's driving reinvest should die reinvest in dock into the sales. Makes Sense. So this only might hit and I like the fuel the fire at the end. Of last thread. We might have hit this a little bit in the in the beginning. But what does this mean hesitation stop going even faster? Yes. So I think that we did kind of hit us in the beginning, I think the weather and I think this was we were always we've always been a pretty high margin business. One of the things that we didn't do really think through prescriptively, where should the margin in the business being and how should we trade? How should we think about growth versus Bob, inability and what is the market actually? Prefer here and instead of doing and the reason why we didn't do that I think is we had like hesitation around like trusting where that investment would go to change the profile of the business and so of today were forty percent growth in forty seven percent margins than saying like, Hey, in the future, what is sixty percent growth and thirty percent margin work like? It was tough to have that conversation along the way because we didn't trust it. The dollars invested downstream would turn into that result I gotta go have been convicted about making investments and how it changes the face of the business and trust in your ability to put the next dollar and marketing your next dollar in sales to have it grow I think we got comfortable with who were and how we were operating the business, and then then take rests on on that. So. Your whatever your own version of the rule of forty is a ticket while to believe it at got leveled at would work. that the rule of forty like a rule of eighty. And It was hard. It was hard to. His true whether it's eighty like it's hard I didn't believe that was true. I thought. That was a silly ISM right? The rule of forty or eighty, but he doesn't have a well oiled machine. It is true for a while at least. Isn't it? Yeah fluid. Machine should be able to like continue to invest and continue to grow in those area. And I think we were just not convicted that the additional dollar would would not would not the same rights aren't And there's particularly this man. Where on the sales team you go from you start, you have to believe that it really is bodies in bodies out assuming quality right and it's it's a tough transition because in the beginning, you're like Linda and Henry are so good I just need more of them. Your your sales eight like no I need forty reps and you don't believe that you don't believe that it's capacity but you're doing capacity planning for twenty twenty one right now right? You know you need. Wraps in twenty, twenty, one, I think one of the interesting base here is. I think a lot of people say you hear a lot of people when you ask why your company successful, they say, well, it's because of the people and early in the early days zoom in a where I got really frustrated with that answer. So I'd be on a on a on a Webinar like this and the CEO and say really successful because of the people and it'd be like. You really successful. Product it's got to be. A platitude gone like A. Totally but then I found myself often to that point same like man if I had And this guy or twenty dot guy or two or thirty of this one. How much faster could I grow the business and that's really just saying like growth in your business from down to the people like if you can look in your business, I know everybody on this call can and say if I had ten war of hammer ten more for how this business would grow exponentially faster than you really do believe that talent drives. Your Business row and not that easy waiting get to the core of what drives it is to go. If I, want this person ten time with the business grow faster answer to that question is Yes for any number of folks in your organization that you really do believe Alan at the driver's success. That's a good insight. If there's someone I'd say if I had ten of her I one, hundred percent convict then you gotta find the VP to go find that person for it can't be going to your first point because you can't recruit ten yourself Ya, go find the VP to do it and this was amazing. This was one of my favorite sessions of all time. These are the. Mistakes we all make keep making but I think you've given us an incredible set of challenges to just make fewer of these steaks. Isn't it just just make a couple of fewer and then watch how much faster you? That's right. So this this was a ten. I'm sure everyone is quietly applauded cyberspace during this global pandemic. I'm deeply appreciative for the time as we all are. So thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you, everybody. Serious, how you can grow your SAS company while how many shift operations online show you customers how you can help him by changing your forms to tools with some poll customers result page choose from over one thousand templates at our dot co but would slash sats. That's awkward. Dot Com slash S. A. S..
Mon. 02/11 - Trump Wants US To Get Serious About AI
"The. Welcome to the tech main ride home for Monday, February eleventh twenty nineteen I'm Brian McCullough today. The Trump administration wants America get serious about AI. Hatch is actually profitable read. It raises around apple health for vets and hands-on with a our navigation for Google maps. Here's what you missed today in the world of pets. At some point between me writing these words and you hearing them spoken. President Trump is today expected to sign an executive order called the American AI initiative to prioritize federal funding for AI create resources for researchers establish standards and much more by all accounts. This is a direct response to China's twenty seventeen plan, which I've told you about recently to create a homegrown AI industry in that country by twenty thirty which would make it the world leader in artificial intelligence technology, if you'll recall when a is I feed it humans at the ancient game of go in may of two thousand seventeen it really shook Chinese society where go is exceptionally popular. Some have described it as China's Sputnik moment the moment win in the nineteen fifties the Soviet Union beat the United States have become the first to launch a satellite into orbit that shock here lead to. A flood of federal funding for science and research that resulted inputting men on the moon and the development of the internet among many other knock on affects. However, this executive order might not actually lead to anything similar as axios puts it in their dorm house style quote, but but but it's not clear yet. How much muscle the administration intends to put behind its words? The new initiative appears to little more than sent a strong signal to the federal government that AI is a prime concern. For example. The administration said it would quote prioritize AI research funding, but did not announce any new resources for development in area in which the US lags significantly behind China, quote, if there's no implementation behind the executive order with details deadlines and funding, then it may be worse than no EEO. At all said, Wendy are Anderson general manager for defense and national security at spark cognition and AI company and. Who was previously chief of staff to Defense Secretary ash Carter and quote. But I mean, I steps right. Remember, I've told you before how geopolitical thinkers are increasingly word that AI is a zero sum technology game. Whoever is I truly master AI would immediately leap to such a technological lead. The strategist fear that that country could affectively suppress the development of competing technologies and effectively have a hedge monarch advantage for a generation or more. So at least getting people in the US to start thinking about that might be important. The US army has enjoyed global hegemony for several decades because of technology that the US has led the way and not the least of which was in things like microprocessors and all the other stuff that we talk about on the show when we talk about modern tech in that regard. Drones have however controversially been heavily deployed by the US military for about twenty years now. So it's no surprise that. The US army is also aggressively rolling out micro. Drones Flers black hornet Nanno drones measure six point six inches way. Less than thirty three grams have a range of one point two four miles at speeds of up to thirteen point three five miles per hour and are able to fly up to twenty five minutes on a single charge. The idea is that the army wants to give at least one of these black hornet drums to nearly every ground combat unit to allow them to provide H. See photo and video surveillance in the field. The drums could be paraded using operators on the ground with hand-held control units, which communicate with the drones via a s two hundred fifty six encryption quoting from ZD net. Flare says the first batch of drones in route to forces now is part of the soldier borne sensor program, which involves investment in both unmanned aerial vehicles and ground control systems quote with a camera in the air vehicle. Soldiers will be able to see further around obstacles that they previously wouldn't be able to see in near real time. The US army says and quote. You might remember at I o last may that Google announced a our navigation was coming to Google maps. An essence you'd be able to walk down a city street. Pull out your phone point, your camera to get a live video of whatever's in front of you and Google overlay directions points of interest and other information features from Google maps, well, David Pearson. The Wall Street Journal got to try out an early version of the new features. And he described it working this way, quote, the app instructed me to move my phone around and point it's camera at things across the street while it tried to figure out my location after a few seconds. The camera seem to recognize some landmarks and realize where it was with remarkable precision and quote, Google maps still used GPS to find pieces location, ultimately, but then match that with all of the street view data that it's been collecting for years quoting again a moment after the app found me a set of bold can't miss them. Three d. Arrows appeared on my phone screen hovering in the middle of the street, the arrows pointed right? So I headed right? That's when a rectangular blue sign appeared floating above the sidewalk two hundred and forty nine feet until my next turn at the corner. The Aero's again pointed right and down the street a phone booth size red pin, Mark, my destination. It was as if maps had drawn directions onto the real world though. Nobody else could see them and quote now Google does not want you to use this when driving of course, and it doesn't even want you to walk around like a zombie with your phone in front of your face the whole time either. If you lower the phone, you see a standard, Google maps view, the air stuff only pops back up when you pop your phone backup. So the idea would be would just check to make sure of your progress periodically pierces ultimate verdict of the experience. Quote, I found the our feature most useful at the beginning of journey usually when I'm heading somewhere new pick a direction start walking. Then check the blue dot halfway down the block to see if I'm going the right way often. I am not with Google's view. I could fire up the camera. Check my surroundings and set off with much more confidence, and quote, don't expect to see this anytime soon. However, you can only use this new feature. Now, if you're one of Google maps is local guides the services most dedicated users, and there is no word on when this will be rolling out to the general public. But it doesn't sound like it will be happening. This year. Notable race today from what I tend to think of as the never ending startup read. It has announced that it has raised three hundred million dollars in a series D round at a three billion dollar valuation with a murderer's row of investors participating including tencent sequoia Andriessen Horowitz and fidelity with the news read. It also announced that it has reached three hundred thirty million monthly active users and the company says it will use this money to really build out its advertising efforts to tap into that massive user base, which you'll note is definitely in Twitter and Snapchat territory, quote when we are talking about competing for ad dollars. Of course, we are talking about Facebook and Google who take up the vast majority of adspend read at CEO Steve Huffman told CNBC in an interview the sporting he said that when it comes to competition for consumers, quote, we are competing with anybody or anywhere people spend their. Free time CNBC's Steve kovic tweeted about the news. How many companies have said they take digital ad money away from Facebook and Google actually did it oath injure now read it and quote. The tech main right home. This week is sponsored by tiny tiny, as you know starts vise and invest in wonderful internet businesses tiny is not your typical buyer because they won't try to flip your business in three to five years tiny won't mess with your team or your culture. What lucky in the golden handcuffs or push complex deal terms? They won't renegotiate and grind you on arms. Tiny keeps things dead. Simple. They'll make an offer within seven days and closed in thirty the founders started tiny to create the buyer. They wish they could have sold to. So if you have a boot strapped company, maybe a company that's doing great. But we'll never ten x a company, maybe that's generating serious revenue, but things are a bit of a mess, and you just need someone to come in takeover and make things profitable. Whether you're interested in selling your business sharing tip or you just want to talk shop checkout tiny at tiny dot website, that's tiny dot website. And when you get in. Touch tell them Brian sent you. Let me tell you about using data dog with AWS cloud formation might know cloud. Formation is a configuration management service from AWS that allows you to create an update infrastructure programmatic. -ly a cloud formation template is infrastructure as code you can use AWS cloud formation to automatically deploy infrastructure. That is pre configured to send metrics analogs today to Doug and cloud formation can deploy infrastructure, that's readily observable, so including the configuration and deployment of the data dog agent in your cloud formation tablet, gives you the visibility into your infrastructure as soon as it comes online. The data dog agent is a lightweight open source application that collects and forwards metrics logs and distributed requests, traces to your data dog account as soon as the agent is running on your e c two instances, you'll be able to see host level metrics beyond what's reported by Amazon cloud watch and you'll be able to visualize your logs and APM data in data dog. If you want to try. Out deploying data dog with cloud formation right now. Go to data Doug HQ dot com slash ride home for fourteen day free trial. That's data dog HQ dot com slash ride home. One more quick check in on digital media since we've been discussing it so much recently local news network. Patch is now profitable. According to Peter Kafka with twenty million dollars in at revenue this year, if you're not familiar with patch. It was one of Tim Armstrong's biggest initiatives when he was head of AOL he launched patch in two thousand seven and it ran into the early two thousands under direction Armstrong convinced AOL to invest upwards of fifty million dollars in patch. Although I've heard it was significantly more than that over time. And the idea was to create thousands of local news sites staffed by hundreds of paid journalists passionate indeed higher many of those journalists, but the service ended up gaining the reputation as being something of a costly money pit AOL sold. Patch to hail global in two thousand twelve and Armstrong went on to convince Verizon to buy a oh L bundle it with Yahoo. And create oath. And if you've been listening to the podcast for the last several months, you know, how that turned out. Well, apparently, though path has lived on under the auspices of hell global and quoting Kafka. Here is the glass half full news about patch. Charles HALE, the investor that has owned the company for the past five years says his network of twelve hundred hyper local sites are turning a profit generating more than twenty million dollars in annual ad revenue. Without a paywall the company led by former New York Times reporter warned Saint John now employs about one hundred ten journalists who make an average base salary that ranges from forty five thousand to sixty thousand dollars a year and a total of one hundred and fifty employees at its AL owned peak. Patch had close two thousand employees on the other hand if your idea of a local news operation involves a team of reporters and editors that can exhaustively cover your hometown. You will be disappointed with patch, which usually assigns a single. Journalist to cover multiple towns, those reporters than generate five to ten stories day, which means those stories are almost always generated quickly and quote. And if you have been listening recently, you'll know that the latest narrative that I'm super keen to follow is the idea of self-driving groceries. Well, this has combined with my longstanding habit of tracking Masan investments because today Thomas vehicle startup neuro says it has raised nine hundred and forty million dollars from soft bank's vision fund valuing the company at two point seven billion dollars. Neuro was founded by two former engineers on abets self-driving projects narrow produces a little self driving buggy the size of Gulf kart, no room for passengers inside this tiny vehicle, though, just too simple wing doors that flip open tesla or DeLorean style to reveal just enough room to contain a family's typical order of groceries from grocery store neuro largely operates in the San Francisco Bay area right now. But it recently announced a partnership. With US grocery giant Kroger. And of course, Chrissy, far put health tech on our radar and big way for this year. Go listen to that. If you haven't already apple continues to look to be serious about moving into health in a big way as Chrissy talked to us about apple today announce it has partnered with the US department of veterans too soon. Let veterans access their digital health records via the iphones health app. Quote, with health records on iphone veterans across the US will be able to see medical information from participating institutions, including the VA organized into one view all in the health app. Apple said this marks the first time the VA has partnered with an outside party for digital health records sharing with apparently nine million veterans eligible for using this new program on their iphones quote. We have great admiration for veterans. And we're proud to bring a solution like health records on iphone to the veteran community said Tim cook apple CEO quote. It's truly an honor. To contribute to the improved healthcare of America's heroes. We know Amazon is really really big, right? Sometimes the biggest company in the world by market cap. But something that we can forget unless we really look at the numbers is the timescale in achieving that bigness. I mean, you can see it by looking at annual reports Amazon had almost one hundred billion dollars more in revenue in twenty eighteen when it did two hundred thirty three billion dollars in sales than it did just two years earlier when in two thousand sixteen it did a hundred thirty six billion dollars in sales. So while you might be aware of how big Amazon has gotten you might not be aware of how recently it did. So over the weekend. I saw this piece in the Atlantic by Alexis Madrigal, and it's worth looking at to get a sense of how recently get big fast actually happened Damas on its in just the last couple of years, quote, according to its latest annual report Amazon now has two hundred eight million square feet of warehouses office. Retail stores and data centers in twenty seventeen the biggest growth year for the company's properties alone. It added more square feet of building seventy four point six million than the company had in total in two thousand twelve when it had seventy three point one million when it was already the largest online retailer in the world. Amazon has added more buildings face from two thousand sixteen to twenty eighteen than it did in all the rest of its history. Go back a little further in time, and the growth is even more astounding. Amazon has forty eight times the square footage. It did in two thousand four and quote Maddrell notes that this is not from AWS growth. The whole of AWS only occupies ten million square feet of real estate. And it's not from the whole foods aquisition all of Amazon's retail real estate only accounts for twenty million square feet. No, the remaining two hundred and fifty million or so square feet that Amazon has at this point comes from. Warehouses 'em, logistics, and other words, just from simply getting stuff to your door. Again, though, the point here is that Amazon is operating at the law of large numbers at such a scale now that when I don't know you hear sales go up twenty percent or head count went up exper- sand or square footage or whatever went up whatever percent at the scale, Amazon is operating at even minute changes can account for just massive massive numbers. And even if those numbers haven't over just a couple of years, it's at the scale now where it can dwarf even numbers that were unimaginable. For Amazon only a few years previously. That's all for today. I've been your host as always Brian McCullough. Follow me on Twitter at Brian MCC and follow the tech meme editors on Twitter at tech me talk to you tomorrow.
Power Laws with Meltem Demirrors
"All right everyone. Welcome back this Ryan Lucas. And you're listening to him. Saris unqualified opinions. Where each week? I interview Crypto. Top builders investors and personalities discuss key trends in the industry can discover more about Massari. I'm sorry dot. Io but for now. Let's get right into the episode. It's going to be a good one. This episode is brought to you by the only lender offering instant crypto credit lines which let us digital assets as collateral to get cash and forty five different Fiat currencies and stable coins. Also Park idle assets next earn the eight percent annually. His company's strategic partner of exchanges OTC desks and Crypto fons borrow land and grow their assets using next oh explore next dot co or reach them at institutions at next dot io to learn more. Save money this tax season with Luke attacks. Only tested crypto. Tax Software listened to your feedback. Now he can calculate capital gains and see the results using three different accounting methods side by side. All for free. You only pay if you want to access their detailed tax reports Luca supports unlimited transaction blows from all major changes in wallets and helps optimize your cash reportings. He can Max out. This year's refund hookah tax wants to help and Saris unqualified opinions listener. See even more this year so use Promo Code Massari tax. You'll get five dollars off the normal price at thirty nine ninety five win downloading today go to L. U. K. Kate A. T. A. X. dot com and save money this tax season. Have you seen with? Crypto DOT COM. Team's been up to lately talking about the MC Visa Card. It's a beautiful metal card. You can top up with crypto and spend anywhere visas accepted you get up to five percent back on all your spending. Plus one hundred percent rebates on spotify Netflix. Amazon prime travel how `Bout Unlimited Airport Lounge access interbank exchange rates. So many perks in just one card. You can download Crypto Dot Com ads in reserve yours today. This podcast is presented by blocks group on the top blockchain events in media production companies. I've worked with for exclusive content and events could help you with insight into the crypto and blockchain space check them out at block works group DOT ISO and you will not be disappointed work to another episode of unqualified opinions. I'm Ryan self is at to bid and that's Milton with police background. Starting Lake Reading Seinfeld sits sits out and fired. It's just like a New York. Sitcom WOULD START MELTING MIRRORS. The Chief Strategy Officer Chief Investment Officer. Which one of these days both all again for coin shares Nelson? I have a long history together. digital currency group Both in in the industry for quite a long time by Bitcoin and CRYPTO standards. There are probably a million different things. that we could by talking about for the five people that are. GonNa Listen to podcasts. Do not already know who you are melting. Why don't we just start with the rabbit hole story and how we got to start working together and then ultimately your trajectory up through three point shares shot so bitcoin the where to start a twenty thirteen oil and gas consultant joining most of my time on airplanes Working one hundred hours a week. As a young ambitious whippersnapper she will And was just really disillusioned by corporate life in corporate America and emanate in the energy industry at the time and was hanging out a lot on the Internet. As does I am a child of the Internet Early teenage years were spent in chat rooms. looking up she codes for video games because I had no friends I moved to America when I was ten. I not speak a word of English when I first moved to the states. And nobody in a small town in Michigan that I moved to thought I was cooled. They thought it was weird so I spent a lot of my time in my parents. Basement playing video games Hanging out on chat rooms and talking the stranger on the Internet of things. All the things that you're generally not supposed to do. I WANNA pull on one one thread there. Do you think that's grow moving to America when your ten and not speaking the language? How did that impact the way these? Because I think most people listened to you. Talk and present in front of Congress and Just generally get on stage and Chrismas one thing. That's why everyone loves having you speak. But you're also Insanely articulate thank you for for for a non native speaker and probably more eloquence I think that presents the industry at how much of over correcting and being extremely cognizant of having either an accent or not being native speaker. Do you view traits your general speaking ability. Persona How is that factored in at all? Yeah so I think factors in into ways so I had to the small town in Michigan. I had grown up in the Netherlands but I grew up speaking two languages so my parents both Turkish. My whole family is still in Turkey but I grew up in the Netherlands speaking Dutch and Turkish on both of them were quote unquote my mother tongues and I still speak both then. When I moved to the states the way I learned English we moved on the fourth of July and so school was not in session man so I spent a lot of my time at the Public Library. Reading books and reading has continued to be really big part of my life and something. I really enjoy talk about a write by La so I think the reading component components big part of it in religious appreciating how important it is to communicate effectively being a consultant in the energy industry as typically the youngest person in the room and the only woman in the room and so to that extent. One of the things I learned early on was in order to have ideas heard I had to try a lot of different ways of articulating. The same thing because you never really knew what was going to resonate with people and so a lot of what I did in my early days as a consultant was really think about different ways to communicate the same message so that it would resonate with a corporate executive someone who's in the field or working on an oil rig on someone who's in a different part of the business I was doing a lot of international whilst when you're traveling a lot and spending a lot of time in different cultures their different ways of communicating. So you're constantly trying to figure out how to communicate effectively which I think Ryan you seen my psychotic emails and how I write. Emails like bullet points in bold words. A lot of structure. I have just learned that communicating effectively across all mediums whether that's making sides way that's writing highly organized emails or talking in a manner that's easy for people to follow. Don't use a lot of big words. communicate ideas with structure is a lot of the same principles that really are informed by the fact that. I read a lot and learned a lot from reading and then second I was in a lot of different environments. Were trying to communicate. Things were not always easy to understand a lot of different types of people so you just start to develop these certain habits and that haven't it gets reinforced from people. React positively to what you're communicating. I think communications in general is one of the most underrated skill sets that is in short supply with within the industry. Right now and the advice I always give to non engineers that are getting into the field with particular on business side working side innocent softer a softer side. More or less. Just start writing or Canada podcasters or started doing interviews or or meet APPs But basically just start doing something and on the one hand. That's the advice. I give everybody on the other half everybody's got a newsletter podcasts. Live stream these days okay. Here's here's the thing about crypto. Okay so this goes back to the origin story. There's script so twenty thirteen. You know I'm in the middle of nowhere and China working on a project unlike manufacturing mining equipment so like a lot of work but so bored out of my mind what I've been doing for the last four years and I start reading about bitcoin. My brother sent me this link about the Clinton heard about it and I had spent a little bit of time on Reddit but I really started learning more about. Bitcoin knows this is really weird. The people are really weird. These online chat groups are really weird. And you remember this. 'cause YOU'RE GETTING INTO. Crypto at this time and I was like there's a lot going on here this subcultures very strange very interesting a lot of overlap. I would say like the early days of the Internet. A lot of the weird stuff unity's developed there and so of course I was pumped. Great people are psycho morning but it was like a giant cu-ltive belief. I think one of the things on talk about today is Beliefs and what was really cool about. Bitcoin is it was a cultural belief that had aspects of economic monetary philosophy monetary policy. It had asked of social Things really entrusting it had elements of Sort of this really strong ideology around sovereignty in what it means to be private citizen there were all of these really interesting ideological seems that were getting played out in these Chats on Bitcoin? Talk all these other forms or people working out the second thing. Those really interesting thing about a lot as an investor is reality distortion and what Anita by that is I think. All startups and all movements to some degree require require group of people to believe something unreal right so five years ago started working at digital currency group teasing laughing. Because we're not sure how much of this we're GONNA have to edit out. Keep going let me think a lot of what we were talking about in those days. I mean you remember the first time we had that event in Palo Alto at the four seasons were brought together crypto land with VC land with corporate land number was like wait a minute. Bitcoin's not insane these are actually real businesses that generate a lot of cash flow. Oh that makes sense but I think what's interesting to me is people people who can create reality distortion field and how strong that reality distortion field can be a great example. Something we work right. We work created incredible. Reality distortion field where you know whether it's Adam Newman. Or the industry's he had or the whole venture ecosystem we all collectively bought into the shared. Reality distortion that. This was not a real estate or capital intensive business but it was attack play and in hindsight we feel so silly because it was so obvious. But when you're living in that moment there's this element of distortion or this element of suspending disbelief. That so critical to getting things off the ground. Anything in the early days instill now like Bitcoin has that in so strongly ending whenever you see communities where people have this collective like reality dismore Shia where they believe in something that is improbable in Insane. Tassels another great example. Then it's a place I want to hang out because that's a place where a lot of money is going to get either made or lost in honestly it's also plays for a lot of fun and entertainment is going to be had so. I'll hang out there. Yes so There's a difference between recognizing that reality distortion field exists and picking the right ones that you're going to get behind right at an early enough stage rates so you picked by the way and the draft shine right right with the general trajectory right so we were you know on one hand two thousand seventeen probably in that bucket. Bitcoin twenty thirteen probably better bucket. Tusla probably better bucket. How did you make the decision to leap both feed into the industry and twenty and fifteen them he got after having some exposure to it in twenty thirteen and then adding a couple of mutual friends? Where for the audience that doesn't know melts almost classmates at mit we. Weren't you made the decision? Maybe I think the the winding path is generally the same outcome. But I don't think I would have. I think I would have been more of a misfit room for two years Dean In bitcoin two years earlier when it was real it was pretty already and look. That's kind of what I felt right. So here you are. You're in business. School at Mit everyone wanted to be a consultant or Banker when I start funny thirteen and then twenty fourteen. Two Thousand Fifteen Fintech became Thing especially in Boston and I started working with this fintech accelerator. That's called Fintech. Sandbox shoutout to the sandbox and a lot of what we're focused on companies in the capital markets stay surround up data research data provisioning so we worked with companies like can show Cuanto Paean etc kind of that Fintech. Darlings wave of twenty fourteen two thousand fifteen and in that process. I started doing a lot more on the venture. Capital sides are looking at private equity and as I started going out and talking to people ever remember this so clearly it was march twenty fifteen. I was graduating quote unquote. In two months I was spending most of my time off campus or the media lab like not doing business school stuff really other than going out with with friends and having fun but not really isn't a slow stuff so much spending a lot of our time in different parts of the Boston startup ecosystem. Remember what we want to do with my life definitely not going back to you. Consulted definitely not working in corporate America. It's not really a good fit like a Weirdo doesn't work well for me And then I started talking to venture firms was like I don't really WanNa deal with this bullshit like the whole political venture firms very political nature. You know most of them. There's not a lot of lateral movement. You typically come in. They hire two people for role where there will be one promotion use like after Duke. It out I was like Other sounds so not fun. Degree in her new venture capitals bureaucratic homogeneous and firmly entrenched and. I'm not a white dude. Like so you know. Good luck with that. At that time I would say there was so little diversity adventure. Actually I would go for job interviews and people thought I was flirting with them because I laughed at a joke and I was like wow I came from oil and gas venture was thirty times worse. Which was really interesting but I think a lot changed which is good to see So just looking around. Now's like I don't really want to do any of these things I talk too much. Startups is startup. Tried starting companies. Not really feeling it. I was like okay my friend. Dan Alexander Who now runs ideas co lab and ideas venture investing arm that invest in crypto starts. He classmates in we started. Mit Fintech Club together and I ran the MIT entrepreneurship clubs. Refined like you do all the extracurricular things deny started. We've been talking about Bitcoin. Joaquin Working Bitcoin That's when he introduced meets you Ryan Lucas. I E you and that's when I met through you bury you and Mary put your heads together. You Or D. C. J. at the time. And you're like she's not too bad. I guess we should do something with her and I was like okay. We'll out of all of the things I could do all the things I'm excited about. This is fun. This is interesting. It's still do with weird people. I'M GONNA learn a lot and even if I fail like even if this is a total pipe dream in it never goes anywhere at least will be really interesting and so that really was the only Mental Calculus. That weapon into is like okay. I could be small fish in a really big pond or go to tiny pond and go figure it out The incredible thing about Your having joined DC g at the time you did. It was basically this kind of operating company kind of venture firm wanted to be kind of like an index for Berkshire Hathaway for the industry and the biggest open role that we had was very ambiguous role of like head of community which was which is like and that thing that the word community is like a mind map in of itself. Hold on hold on. I know I know that was the role that was open and that was the role that you came into and basically just created a new genre at argue. Germs for providing connective tissue amongst the portfolio companies and broadening out the network. The DIGI had. So can you talk a little bit about the the role he came into? And then how it broadened and how. I'd say you are one of the kind of inventors of this category. That now is very critical for every single open source protocol right. There is a development network coordinator. You know gets worse liaison whatever you WANNA call it. I duNno I agree. That community probably sells it short in a bit of a mind trapped. But how did you think about the role when you first joined? And then based on what you learn how to craft this genre step once I remember. I started D. C. J. before I graduated in so you know there was google sheet. That had a list of all the companies that had been estin which at that point was twenty five or thirty and my first order businesses. Like let's go figure out what these companies do. 'cause I didn't know much about these companies. I knew a lot about bitcoin but they didn't know that much about the industry has look. Let's go talk to these people and figure out what they're thinking about what they're challenged by. And at that time you have to remember there weren't really any specialist firms that were investing in crypto companies. There was like digi watching capital. Maybe Pantera boost. We see right but they were all two or three person operations. There fairly small. Didn't have a ton of resources. In capital I think was the only other one that would write checks. So I'm from DC. Yeah that sounds right and so what was really interesting so I started talking to all these companies and I learned all of these things about what companies are struggling with and some of them were really basic like how to run a business one. Oh on things. Some of them were specific to their business model for example getting banking licenses keeping account open and then some of them were specific to the industry. Like nobody understands this category in which I'm operating. Nobody would even take a call for me because I have bit locker chains wherein my company named Jd and so I started to think about in breakdown. Okay here the issues. That people are having company level at the industry or sector level. And then here. The issues people are having because they're effectively orphans within the venture portfolios. They sit and so as I started looking at that was. Okay wait a minute. There's three things we need to do. Number one we need to create basically way to give these companies tools and resources that Dick don't feel like orphans and that's where the idea for the venture capital platform group came from a group of about four of us in New York at the time who shared the title of head of platformer headed of community at different investment firms. In so we get together and have breakfast about once a month. We would talk about all the challenges of our role now. That community is three hundred people online. We did our first summit in twenty seventeen it now happens. I think twice a year people from firms all over the world participate Super Cool to see So I was like. How do we help? People not feel like orphans in a portfolio. The second which you'll recall was how do we actually legitimize these companies and give them a platform to talk to the broader world in the broader set of not just investors but perspective corporate partners out there governments institutions? How do we help them or Ticu? Late what it is they do and then the last one was. How do I become an expert on all these different companies? And you'll remember like my brain's look a filing cabinet. You could give the name company. I could tell you everything about that. Company a disease start to finish and so really like how do I become the expert on CRYPTO STARTUPS? Not just the ones in our portfolio. The ones that outside our portfolio so for my first two years in the role all I did was go to meet up with people like literally anyone that would talk to me. I would go sit down with them and say. Tell me what you do. Tell me what you're thinking. Tell me about this and I was a complete idiot and I had no issues telling people like. I don't understand how that works. Please explain it to me and people were really generous with their time and people are really generous with their time in. I still know nothing but like now I know more of nothing. I know that I know nothing so it works out. But that's really what I did. And then eventually that evolved into like. How do we actually use this to make money? Our business helped exit these companies and then starting to morphine morphine. More more of that's already started to be able to say the Union. Nothing is always generally a superpower being able to say and have people believe well. That's only about twenty five percent. True is like a whole other level to the super power and one of the things that I think is daunting through people getting into the industry for the first time. As the amount of jargon Yuppie like insular nature the the online bickering and hostility all the reasons that we love crypto reasons that it is so insanely intimidating to come into right. So you know I think that strategy definitely works but I don't know that it was a strategy rate. You make it sound like it was premeditated I think it was like. Let's just throw literally anything the wall and see what works and there are a lot of things that didn't work so I don't understand my point being. I don't understand this could be. I just haven't taken the time to figure it out. I generally do not understand this lease help. Communicate it in a way that is not in keeping with a PhD students like Esther topic and then there's IRA understand this. Are you sure this is what you're trying to do with your life because this makes no sense whatsoever and that was where I think? Some projects were in two thousand fifteen. There were certainly a lot of science projects in two thousand seventeen back into that. We were bucket of. Yes. You're trying to create a reality distortion field. But even though I might be a little slow on the uptake I don't have any you're doing because it doesn't make any well with the reality distortion field right like I think. A big part of that is a lot of what really offended me. Like twenty seventeen era which is when September October twentieth seventeen. I sat down and took a look at my life and I was like. What absolutely not was this. When the Potato Fund was Great Potato Fund was created it was January fourth two thousand eighteen. Remember exactly where I was January. Fourth two thousand eighteen. I was on the phone with Joseph Weinberg from Case Love Justice investor in that company advisor to shift network which is their identity protocol that they're building okay so on the phone out for him still in the office. Don't fucking ask me why those like another part of Juneau sitting there and he and I were laughing at the fact that markets were going crazy and he would name some random idea like time travel. There's an I would find the coin for that and then we left the logo. And then we'd be like I'm GonNa buy something like Yola so I took half a bitcoin so four to four thirty was like laughing joking about the fact that all of this ridiculous stuff was on the market and that it was probably GonNa pop right. That was the thing that was so obscene about. It is probably going to go bonkers. So four thirty emeralds rhinos. Were already doing this. I'm GONNA take half An I'm just GONNA DEPLOY INTO BUNCH OF RANDOM ASK projects that have cute logos and really grandiose site is so time new bank which is creating an accounting system for your time Dragon Dragon chain does a deep brain shading will plus the blockchain plus quantum computing deep brain DC. We just picked these coins. What sounds really grandiose Really cool and that was it I was like I'm just going to track these and to me it was an exercise in just highlighting. How ridiculous things were. At the time I was crazy about it is that there were people who are professionally. Nsa professional very loosely but there were people were professionally. Investing like this was what they did. Raise I laugh at people who are stock tickers for living Not because I don't think it's an an interesting profession but like you look at technical analysis. In the way that people analyze stocks I call it charts lines and triangles right. It's the art of divining. What's GonNa pump and what's not gonNA pump look in a Stanley traded market with only handful of players? It's all manipulated and fighting the act of being a coin. Picker is just such a funny thing to to try to sell. Because it's just the active figuring out what can be manipulated and making sure you're on the inside of nippy relation not on the outside so one of those things where we're reputation if you're good at it. There's probably something that raises eyebrows. Right and look at a lot of it was club deals as well. I mean you know this is well as I do and it happens by the way venture all the time. This is how we were and other companies like it happen where there are people who are investing. They all assume that the person they think is smarter than them has done. The diligence who thinks the other person has done the diligence so infection. Nobody's actually done the diligence. You have all of these credible reputable people investing in it. And then you end up having this club deal where nobody actually really spent that much time on the diligence. The bigger thing is everyone assumes that the other people on the Cap table will do the work and this is a big theme in venture like who on the Cap table is GonNa do the work when Shit? It's a fan usually. I'm not person and that's really interesting to me on. But who on the cap tables GonNa do the work and you have all these people will just assume okay if XYZ investor is in IT DAVID ON DVD? And they're going to do the work when Shit hits the fan and unfortunately that's not the way things have worked out. That's not always a way things work out so it's just interesting to see. How the market overall crypto market broader venture market and then macro market overall has finally figured out that like maybe people action makes you work at you so I think you've touched on two of the three attributes that most people myself included would look for in a good invest right. Who's going to actually do the work not just piggyback because there are other locals cap table. Who's GONNA be a connector? You mentioned in you do For those that have met you outside of just maybe public appearances. Have a file cabinet mine. Maze that is sane terms of being able to track not just track but then triage potential introductions or make lateral connections amongst different Firms or partners or like and then being able to not get caught up by the hype and get sucked in everything and and being able to suspend disbelief back. A person or team or project seems to have captured a legitimate reality distortion field. That's worth getting behind and worth deluding himself into believing versus just getting hoodwinked and coming across his gullible and ultimately a failed venture capital investor. Which the good news and bad news is. You won't have good or bad for like ten years but at least having a system. I'd say those are the three things that you'd alternately optimize for if you're actually I you WanNa you wanna stay sort of within what I always think about is like extremes right so I never want to be in the camp where I think that everything on investing in are excited about is really amazing. I want to be skeptical and I think it's important to be skeptical. And I'm naturally a skeptic so I have to often discipline myself to be less of a skeptic suspend disbelief a bit more but then I think at the same time if you are overly optimistic and you are constantly amt about things you don't look at the facts of the situation. You don't think practically about building a sustainable business model. Then you're gonna be in the situation. A lot of companies are today where they have no recurring revenue. The revenue run rate is like sub one million a year. They're trying to do a monster series around eight to ten million out of fifty to sixty million pre money. I'm like I'm sorry I don't know what kind of crack your smoking. I want some because it was real good you know so. I think there is kind of Banshee. You WanNa stay within where you can't Too Far outside of that. Sort of range And a lot of times. I want to invest in things. Because they think they're super fucking cool like Mesh networking. I'm obsessed with the idea of peer to peer connectivity. I do believe that at some point in the future. Peer to peer activity will be huge. We massive angry. I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon. And the reasons why have to do with hardware proliferation of hardware and the difficulty of getting people to buy a new hardware. They have to do with the fact that the protocols are really immature with the fact that we don't even have robust capital markets around data center capacity right in a lot of this is creating Operating Systems and the financial tools to hedge production into hedge accessing capacity. Like all of this stuff that has to exist for that version of reality possible doesn't exist yet so I think it's okay to say. Hey I'm really excited about this and I believe someday it'll be huge but I don't think that inflection point yet. Similar thing with defy right. I think defies super interesting. There a lot of really cool ideas I think. Ninety percent of them are practically infeasible stage. Which doesn't mean they're not really valuable experiments they're just not a venture companies because there's no version of reality in which those companies reached a stage commercially. Viable is not going to happen. Yeah I think one thing that people don't recognize you think about the term crypto investor. An editor in of itself is a loaded term but some some merit in in be skeptical of those projects. You can invest in because other critical sectors. Just have not involved to a far enough along state that the CRYPTO project crypto element is invest so much networking and maybe the controller on the hardware side There are other projects like decentralized media. Where a few years ago you'd hear about projects likes team. And how many different iterations of decentralized namespace there now been for for you are else and at the center mediating icon. The there are a lot of lot of landmines. You can avoid if you have a little bit of awareness for where the bottlenecks are in legacy systems and it strikes me that during the twenty seventeen year. Four all that went out the window because everybody more or less just became a flipper in a stake in your state. How do you? How do you do the work you come up with sector the-these and then ultimately fall through on them on the venture side? Do WanNa make sure we get into coin shares proper in terms of how any deal flow that you might have her for areas. You're spending time with ultimately to opportunities throughout the rest of the business. Yeah so so I think when it comes to see so good point because I'm just about to hit published on twenty twenty investment. Theses like where I think that can happen. What has been a really strong honest. Guiding prescription forgery. No no so. This is an investment theses on the venture. Investing side the CRYPTO trends report. I think we may actually do on over the summer because it'll be interesting to see where things are going into the having letting there's GonNa be some interesting news. That comes out in the in the next few months. It's going to really materially change the landscape Both good and bad which is always exciting. So what I think is really always really interesting. To think about is the idea of categories right. So there's this interesting principle that you see in nature that you see in you also see it in investing in. It's something called a power locks and what power laws state is that typically on eighty percent or so. Roughly of the value accrue to the one entity that wins particular category right at the powerful entity. And what's actually interesting is. We've had power laws adventure for a long time and in other types of investing look at the data in category Christian meaning creating new category of businesses creating new categories business models creating new category go to market creating new categories product categories typically category kings. I e the leaders of the category will capture seventy six percent of the value of that category. So if we look at the data actually proves what venture capitalists have long sort of known to be the power loss. And so what I think's interesting in a lot of places in Crypto we already have quote Unquote Category Leaders Right. So if we look at Exchanges right on and offering Arguably coin is the category leader there and there are a lot of others that are gonNA crew value but by far the most value is GonNa crew to coin if we look at a new market structures are if we look at something like finance To crypto exchange where there is no in and out it's just offering a huge breath of products and services in the most listings in the most off their winning that category. And if we look at protocols right. Bitcoin is clear protocol category winner right now if we look at it from a price of asset perspective bitcoin has roughly seventy percent dominance in. So they're all of these different ways to see these power laws emerge now. I always think about is. I could invest in established category and hope to identify someone who's going to capture a little bit of that category or more I could go and find. Companies creating new categories use my influence on my network and my you know writing and research to help substantiate that category and then position company as a winner of that category now both will get me good results than investor but the category creation and then the establishment sort of positioning of companies. This category leaders is by far the one that has higher upside potential in. So that's what I've been focused on is figuring out okay. What are new categories? That are being created. How do we create a argument? Those are actually investment categories and then how to position companies within that category so take Mesh networking right now not really interested in thesis but Iran a monthly Mesh. Networking needs crypto. Up where we're exposing all these different projects meeting meet a lot of people. I'm talking to a lot of other people in the peer to peer Connectivity Mesh in Space. And when the time comes we'll have the capability to that. Category in the subcategories within it and work with people who you think might be category winners by the way what that means like. I'm not just talking to my portfolio companies. I'm talking to all of the companies out there and I'm constantly reaching out to people just wanting to understand wanting to learn Because things evolve very very quickly that I think from an investment thesis perspective. It's okay let's look at is existing investment categories say it's infrastructure right which. I would categorize his on and off ramps and payments and transfers in those areas. They're pre existing categories that already have clear winners and their new categories that are getting created for example one category. I'm really excited about looking. For companies in this category is wallets that are aggregate rights instead of you. Portering service from one service provider if one wallet interface that aggregates all of this different stuff for you. Whether that's your existing crypto exposure. Your lending your borrowing if aggregates. Everything gives a simple interface in. This has a great analog and this is what happened in the fintech space with stuff like personal capital nerdwallet dot com and so looking for the crypto analog of an aggregate after is an interesting sort of approach arguably our shot right now is the best known example of that but that stays hasn't been clearly defined yet it hasn't been clearly carved out yet if I find something there that I want to invest in that I want to think about okay. Can I actually make this company? Category winner and there's a lot of calculus that goes into that. Sorry that's a long winded. Answer I know no. It's it's it's per perfect a jumping off point because what we I mean what you did it at DC. G was essentially build the network. Connectivity right and traditionally the way they've done that venture capital investor as you just checks and older network can name your portfolio and try to basically just help them leverage each other's best she can does not necessarily optimal model though right. The optimal model is to sit on the sidelines. Let some of these theses play out understand all the players. Put them all together before you hop into bed with any one team or company or projects. And if you've done it right in terms of network-creation you should be able to opportunistically invest as a co lead or at least some sides. We'll check in category creator once it's a little bit clearer but is very good and who might be. Here's the interesting thing about what I learned at DC. Gee that I think applies very much to coin shares as well so the interesting thing is when you are venture investor in the only way you really make money as you make cash on cash returns for your investor. And that's when you get paid and the hard part is a lot of venture. Investors have paper marks materializing paper marks into cash Account which is how you get paid is a very different thing right. So for a lot of investors you know the first five seven years with our fund or Great. 'cause they're marking round after round and UNIM- paper. They're doing really well right there. Unrealized IRR or their internal rate of return is high but they're realized IRR is low right and ultimately at the end of the life of the fund their td Pi or their total value created to paid-in capital is going to be low especially if your accounting for the market. We're living in now or the. Snp does twenty percent. You're not really clear if performances there especially given the opportunity costs in the time value of money right so then the question that I think becomes more interesting is. How do you stay a venture investing strategy into a broader sort of play where you are an operating company is a bunch of different ways of making money and so a coin shares we have capital markets team where we have historically been Meaning we don't interact with external counterparties we trade our own book but we're starting to change our capital markets offering an open it up to external partners. So we do there is we do market making cross number of different markets where we have a bunch of stuff. We've built to help our trading team. We've built a bunch of different connectivity offerings a bunch of different solutions for traders that we can now start to offer externally to the market. We have a cash lending books that were working on expanding and instead of working with just one or two counterparties wieland cash too we WANNA go directly to the people who want to borrow There's a lot of things you can do in the capital market side where we start plugging our companies into what we're doing there. We start providing them with liquidity connectivity. Let starts to get really interesting. That on the asset management side right. We're creating financial products. We have eight listener products in the European market. So what are the opportunities to create new listed products that we can bring to market for both retail and institutional investors and then on the advisory side? We've got some really cool stuff. Planned on capital raising 'em as well as project emanate that we've been working on the we think's GonNa be really interesting compelling for the market inciting a gun is you think about being an investor. They're all these different hats. You sort of wear but at the end of the day. It's not just like nobody's a one trick pony anymore right if you look at the direction. Adventurous headed there. Basically only chew ends of the spectrum where I think it makes sense. One is your mega firm. You have billions of dollars of a U. N. and you are a powerhouse investor. Because of your you got an early before the remodeled really existed and you helped create that category so effectively. You're the category King Adventure and if you look at the firm there it's like Sequoia Andriessen these firms that have been around for over a decade the opportunity to post returns and they've built their own unique special sauce. The by the way like a lot of what goes into the secret sauce at these firms is corporate development. Dave whole army of people who are going out and finding customers for their companies going out and finding potential acquirers for managing a lot of the connective tissue. That most people don't think about right. You see Marc Andreessen on the screen like delivering his talk. There's a whole organization of hundreds of people who make that possible right. They help create that magic and I think on the other and they were playing here in that regard right. I absolutely were. I'd say. Dc G was certainly one of the early movers in that regard and in building out at work and having the roll around you is as prominent as it was in winter up to threats But the model is moving to write in what we're seeing more of like to be ineffective in investor and to help companies today. There are three things you need. One is capital two is influenced at three as a network. Right and what? I think it's been really interesting here. You look at someone like myself right. I don't necessarily have a lot of capital to invest but have influenced. I have a a network. You look at someone like Tom Brady. When pomp came into the industry he didn't have capital to invest but he had influence he built influence and he started building network through his influence and he got the capital piece on the end by partnering up with someone who had capital. Didn't have influenced or network right so you find different ways to piece. That together would think so interesting. About Kirk does have a bunch of people who created wealth for themselves who have capital who now are starting to have influence in world. Starting to have a fairly sizable networks. Who can start to apply that capital different ways inciting the really big challenge here is like we just saw the first series get done. That didn't have a single institutional lead. It was all Angel Investors. Right which pretty cool fifty seven million dollar round and it was a bunch of angels over one hundred people on the CAP table. I think we're working on a deal right now where I'm trying to do something. A little bit similar. Where there isn't one massive institutional lead. We have a group of people who bring their capital influence a network to the table. He is arguably capitalist cheap. Right money costs nothing as we've learned from she eats what's happening in macro markets. Money is fucking everywhere. One point five trillion dollars of dry powder on the sidelines right now in P. E. N. B. C. There is a faulk load of money like an absolute metric. Fuck load of money out there. Huge amounts and the difference between a company that wins a category and a company. That doesn't a lot of times is not how much money you have. It's the people around the company who have influence and the people around that company who can connected to valuable network. So who's GonNa help you find? Your first customer is great if she can raise you know huge round of really favorable terms. But if none of those people on your table can help you find your first customer. Help you hire a VP marketing helped you connect with to corporate partners for going to help you distribution the amount of You have doesn't make a difference and so I think we're at the starting point of a huge change in venture works where we're seeing a lot of people look at Angel. Funds seed fund scout funds different models. For how sourcing might work but also I think a lot of it goes back to category leadership and how you create an peddle influence right is done on the Internet. And if you're not spending time on the Internet peddling influence like I don't know what you're doing investing space could not agree more. I've I've come at this from a couple of different angles. You know when when I think about Bring it back to cryptos nothing like Dallas Don't get excited about community allocation of capital I get excited about community allocation of LP commitments yet Batesville picking the stock pickers picking the people that have networks that have influence because the logos are not as important as the faces anymore And even when the logos are important they're usually only important as like resume fodder for the faces that are now the new influencers and what. I think is so interesting one thing. I've definitely started to notice is a lot of the deals. I'm doing is like the same ten people in the deal right and so we're starting to see in the crypto space is. You're starting to see like when you own is. Starting Crypto Ryan Twenty fifteen. It was one massive category. And I feel like there's been these sub communities that have formed like I might no means an expert defy. I'm not hot on the pulse there because it's not a big part of mine mustn't thesis moment professionally personally hugely interesting. But there's a lot of stuff going on. I can only focus on so many things so when I want to know something about defy their five people go to and they're the in my view. The people who are best equipped not privacy. A lot of time on it by no means expert. Either list of five or ten people who I go to both inside and outside. Cryptography right and applied. Cryptography of people will talk to. Who knows way more about that than me? Who I think are the influencers atteberry. I'll go ask them questions about it. So you think the other piece is also constantly keeping a Rolodex in your mind of who you think is the smartest on different topics that you are not smart on and going talking to them and testing the validity of your ideas because all listen to someone explain something to me are all find a company and be like this is so interesting so cool and then. I'll go to six people who know that idea better than I do by the way also connected to six people who've built businesses like that in a legacy status and they'll tell me a million reasons why Willer won't work with the issues distribution model or Motto are receive. You're constantly testing your own thinking and talking to people who are smarter than you. By the way the way I find all of these people twitter like ninety nine hundred. Ninety percent of the Missouri team has been hired from twitter me most of my professional relationships. They all start on twitter. Pd leads You know even folks that are interesting that I didn't And this is the real shame of twitter that I can't tell you how many thousands of dollars per year I would pay for some enterprise subscription that could triage the gold mine of followers that you just don't even know about in many cases because they might just have Egg and there are more passive and they're not pushing content out so much as absorbing it but still could be highly would pay a lot of money for is messaging aggregated. Because I feel like I have a telegram. What's up like all of these different channels and it's literally twelve platforms. The thing is like twelve so the hard part is like. Where do you action things right so I get all of this like fodder everywhere but none of it is actionable unless it hits my inbox because I use my inboxes a to do list which why delete of emails some like? I don't have to do anything goodbye. There's no way to effectively action. And so what ends up happening in this age of like ideas coming from everywhere is everything goes into this giant unless funnels down into one place for your actioning is really hard which I think by the way. Big Trend of the next decade is GONNA be aggregation in different forms. We already see this like in financial services and we see a messaging but it's very very low low level and it's because things aren't interoperable futures could be hugely important because if it doesn't get into your final filter and then it might as well basically not exist so I think as inkster to learn more about the Roi across these different platforms. People are going to optimize for the places where they're going to maximize our ally and so you're gonNA see networks Value because starting networks aren't good at creating value and that just goes back to the CRYPTO premise. Right which is the networks that create and sustain value. Are the networks? Where people are going to spend time. Bitcoin has created a lot of value in staying out of values. So lot of people. Spend time calling and by the way if you talk about Bitcoin you way Martin attention on social media because the bitcoin network is much larger than the network for anyone. Individual Protocol like. I don't think enough people think about how network effects compound across a lot of different Sort of categories so financial network value on social network value and then beatty in SORTA monetization should network value and starting to bring those together like Bitcoin has done not the best so far. We'll always do that. The not sure maybe not at right now. You know odds are looking good again. Just don't understand why people don't think about optimizing Roi. I see a lot of people spending time on things that are very low. Roi In every sense of the word and if it's low are Y and there's no way of scaling it it's not GonNa work. I don't mean Quin Quin. Shares in menuires wide certainly were obviously information aggregate or the Creator. Sorry bitcoin chairs as many ways and activators. Well right it's an. It's an aggregate or financial products or folks are looking for exposure this asset class between lending side market side the demise and look by the way. We didn't do a job at that internally. I think we spent a lot of the last twelve months. Searing out. How do we want to go to market? And we realize being in aggregation point is the best play. Now the next step is how do we aggregate in? How do we bundle a new ways? You know if you told me. Hey go run you know an ETF company would be like so was your closest companies gene. Probably and I think the reason why is the business model that works and I think it's without a cash cow business which is asset management trading. It's really hard to do all the other stuff right. So effectively of all of these loss leaders that bring people into the top of the funnel and then what really makes the business tick is? The thing that makes money consistently really is not Is Not a really complicated? And by the way the only thing that the only reason the cash cow exists is. Because you've so much coming into the top of the funnel so it's almost like the self sustaining flywheel where the two parts of the machine need to coexist. And so what I'm constantly thinking about is how do we get more into the top of the funnel and then how to create more opportunities to leverage what comes in and turn it into dollars on our balance sheet and just keep that cycle spinning which requires investing in companies ecosystem requires creating these new categories requires putting the research arm ending? Research was effectively effort to attempt to establish the cost of producing bitcoin. Right which I think is a noble effort. Like how do you know what you're cogs is rate? How do you know what the cost is or in the oil and gas industry would call this? The lifting cost rate. What is the cost of getting a barrel of oil out of the ground all the way through the process to where you're actually shipping a barrel of oil out of the refinery? So there's a lot of really William until questions WanNa answer that. Make it possible for us to sell all these products and services by the way. It's not a zero sum game. We do a ton of stuff that will never make a dollar of money but it's important to do in our view is the right thing to do on. There is also a lot of like. Hey let's try something stif it works. We did this. Digi L. D. Digital Gold token we issued on top of a Bitcoin blockchain. Let's see if this works. And if so skeleton if not then Steph thorough hundred other different conversation threads we could have an engulf tangents maybe that could be a full day conference conversation like the virtual conference. It's early it's early in the works so I did So we're going back to the degen thread The coin VR. Degenerates ELWAY hold? I have to pull up something that I think Phyllis. Nah This is a two thousand. Eighteen relic the sky. There we go very nice very nice. Yeah we're I. I can't wait for customers. Tars I'm I'm all the way down the rabbit hole with with everything that's going on with the corona virus. Obviously in I think it'd be more virtual conscious coming I know you have to hop off to another call. Why don't we just end with lightning round question because you teased it and it's going to be the one thing that everybody wants to know? What's the good news and the BAD news coming out? What is in your crystal ball that you believe? is on the horizon of both good and bad for the industry next few months. Yeah if you WANNA find out. They should follow me on. Twitter at TAB melts underscored them look South Like full full throttle on all fronts? I M patient zero right so people people should tune in to find out a look at the end of the day. I think what's really interesting like the world is a very interesting place. There's a lot happening. A lot of different fronts The Madness we see in crypto. Is President a bunch of other industries? We just don't see it because we're so far down this particular rabbit hole but their trust me. They're thousands of rabbit holes. I've been down probably eighty percent of them because I am a psychopath extreme assisi issues so I spend a lot of time on various things. That are very niche and really strange just like the coin the client has just had the pleasure of becoming mainstream right to go back to where we started the reality distortion field around. Bitcoin wasn't so far removed but also bitcoin benefited from a bunch of different macro events from existing in the time that existence which is where we are today so stocks stunks if you will or last seven days have lost ten percent now posting four percent gain today like nothing matters anymore because the world's fucking insane is night away from that We're about to see massive amount of Qe. Hong Kong has resorted to dropping helicopter Bank accounts which I think is really really fascinating Political tension global economic recession is coming. Maybe maybe not a political turmoil in every country in the world we are living in some very very interesting times and then you layer on a global health crisis in a global pandemic. Who knows what's GONNA come out of that combination of ingredients? I have some thoughts on what's more probable versus less probable to happen. I think that's really interesting. Who knows? There's the great unknown unknown out there of like all the shit that could go haywire. That will completely change the outcomes of this experiment and I think we continue to live in a world where the inputs to experiment continued to change in very unpredictable ways and the resulting outcomes are very addressed. This in Milton's musings hers is going to be in your twenty twenty trends. This is going to be at Melton museums in hard hitting the publish button on stuff. I need to get better at like five. Post queued up that I just haven't had published on. It's tough when you're perfectionist on and you expect that all of them are going to be be begin so I totally get filter myself. Also because I realize sometimes when I say things like the whole political angle to. Who's going to get upset and I'M NOT GONNA have to deal with this. I've never cared about the. I think the bigger question is you know. We're regulated asset manager. I shouldn't be very careful what I say is potentially making illegally liable. Although nothing is ever investment advice I think the other thing just to think about like their things may be funny to you and I but if we're trying to legitimize this industry in this asset class. I think sometimes taste goes out the window. Nyc that in the last few weeks. Unfortunately I'm so it's always important keeping fun. Keep it humorous keeping entertaining but also keep it tasteful and I think right now is just a time where we have to be exceptionally careful because they see things crossing that line between what's funny and what's distasteful. Some last question is another lightning round You have the luxury of operating the. Us and in Europe attitude is hotter luxury. It's I would imagine. I am not envious travel schedule and not of the Gauge. The multiple fronts from perspective. But it is I'd imagine interesting to see the difference between what's going on in the U. K. Last rich region in the West most bullish on right now in and through two thousand twenty next year's I think is still the US for me thinks the big market looked at the end of the day. There's a lot happening in Europe France. Germany are trying to embrace crypto. The U K. I don't know what they're doing 'cause five. Mld makes no sense at all and like I think there's a lot of just confusion in the UK generally and in other parts of Western Europe. A look at the end of the day the US is the largest capital market in the world has been in my view for the near term. It will be Maybe like Europe is becoming less and less relevant as Switzerland's tried to carve out a niche for itself but at the end of the day. You know what we've seen companies. In Switzerland people monitoring products in Switzerland. The uptake is less than stellar. In my view. If you WANNA go gangbusters and build a massive company. The United States of America is still the best place to do that. And I think it's going to continue to be the best place to do that. Because at the end of the day would I go back to the medium doesn't change the message just doesn't whether it's a token whether it's a law where do people wanna be they wanna be where the opportunities are in. That's right here. Remains that way selfishly is? It might not earn some of the. Us will sing all the tons on the election. Our healthcare system and how prepared to your the Circus Fam- you and your basketball team can always talk up shopping. Go go abroad. If Malta ever becomes you know the next hub of capital markets. First of all you know slot new silly scan be completely ridiculous but second you can always pack up and move their scraping about humans were portable prefer not to leave just Donald Shirley's in us like the city. Stay for a while some good. Let's help it still here. Six weeks from now by this is good. This is going to be like a time capsule that we release a couple of weeks for this episode. She's so they were ready or they're going to be like these people are idiots and both both would be correct. Both would be very stop. Thanks for having me on Ryan at melt. Underscore THEM CIO C. S. L. All around hero that shares. We'll see ensue. Melton and everybody thank you for tuning in next time this rap. Thanks for listening. New EPISODES OF UNQUALIFIED OPINIONS. Go live weekdays at noon eastern time. You can follow me in the meantime on twitter at two bit idiot. Want to continue the conversation trolling. Otherwise I'll see you next week.