3 Burst results for "john winthrop winthrop"

"john winthrop winthrop" Discussed on The Political History of the United States

The Political History of the United States

12:14 min | 1 year ago

"john winthrop winthrop" Discussed on The Political History of the United States

"Circulated. Amongst the relevant groups was one of the primary pieces of propaganda to get people on board with the idea of immigrating among among the ideas espoused in the general observations were one bring the gospel into america and raise a bulwark against the kingdom of the anti christ to go to a place of refuge from judgement of god that was about to descend on europe in light of the thirty years war three escape. The overpopulation of england england four escaped the growing inflation problem in england now just to interject briefly here. This may well be referring to the growing economic issues throughout throughout the region recall back from two episodes ago we had actually discussed the textile collapse that was devastating. The economy southeastern england five get away from oxford and cambridge and they're increasingly corrupt practices and teaching six god has given them the entire new world to go and improve and to once again. It's your jet here. All that uninhabited land just sitting there was wasting away against god's will it was in with rips mind their job to improve the land now of course he may be saying that the land wasn't an inhabited that the indians were there however for winthrop that doesn't really seem to count as of this moment. Nobody really recognizes can ask the indians had much right over the land. Don't worry that this belief will soon be challenged and that's something that we're going to have to wait until next time to address. Seven those going to new england would have the chance to lay the foundations of a new church eight. This entire observation ended with a plea from winthrop trip that basically positions the trip to new england as some kind of a mission. It was something that they had to do. The takeaway from from this seems pretty straightforward. England was an overcrowded pit of despair filled with heathens and a faltering economy new england offered a decent chance to escape this and start over again at the foundations of a new and better society by august of six twenty nine winthrop was one of a handful of men who had signed an agreement agreement to wrap up their business in england and agreed to make the voyage to settle new england throughout the summer of sixteen twenty nine meetings and negotiations continued towards the ultimate goal of moving moving the headquarters of the corporation to massachusetts for all of his work over the past year winthrop found himself elected governor of the colony on october twentieth sixteen twenty nine. It is a position that he would hold off and on for the rest of his life. It was decided that winthrop would initially travel alone. His wife would be following in the future sure she was pregnant. At the time drain his time as governor will still in england winthrop was involved in the actions of negotiating with those investors in england that didn't plan on going along to new england in flowery language winthrop told the investors that look the company is moving to new england. You guys aren't going to have a say in matters do the right thing. Take take the settlement and drop your interests. Oh and by the way god is watching you well. He was not entirely successful of pershing all of the lenin investors who will continue to cause problems for him in the coming years. He did manage to eliminate the majority of them. Thus ensuring more power would find itself centered in massachusetts and not back in london finally on april eighth sixteen thirty when th rope along with seven hundred other colonists would leave england and embark on a journey to the new world it is at roughly the same time that he left england that winthrop would deliver the sermon that would cement his legacy though unclear if the sermon malysz given in england shortly before the departure on the trip over or even possibly new england itself winthrop delivered a sermon known as the model of christian charity the sermon offered nothing in the way of plans for the colony a declaration of what the government structure should be or really anything that would be of any practical use in the colony when did deliver however was a vision for what new england should be. The model of christian charity was one of three works which was primarily aimed at stayed in the goals of the new immigrants to massachusetts. Their goals were twofold. They wanted to lay out what their mission was. The mission was to go over and work actively towards reforming forming the church these works the other being god's promised to his plantation by john cotton and the humble request which was also by winthrop sought to establish avenue that will reforming the church was the main priority they were not separatists when the rope and company had no plans to separate from the church of england they wanted to make that clear to everybody involved winthrop and those involved wanted to make sure that everybody backing lennon understood that they were all working for the same team in the model of christian charity winthrop will conclude by saying we shall find that the god of israel is among us when ten of us show be able to resist a thousand of our enemies enemies when he shall make us appraising glory that men shall say of succeeding plantations the lord make it likely that of new england four four we must consider that we as a city upon a hill the eyes of all the people are upon us so that if we shall deal falsely with our god in this work we we have undertaken and so caused him to withdraw his president help from us. We shall be made a story and b word through the world. We shall open the mouths of enemies. He's to speak evil of the way of god and all the professors for god's sake we shall shame the faces of many of god's worthy servants and caused their prayers to be turned into curses upon us to we become consumed out of the good land whether we are going the line from that speech for we must consider that we shelby as a city upon a hill. The eyes of all the people are upon us has the place as one of the most famous lines in american history. It serves almost <music> as a mission statement for what the united states itself wants to stand for today. The legacy of the line is so often portrayed in terms of democracy eighty or the moral attitudes of the united states which genuinely really is not winthrop had intended however the fact remains that the simple line by winthrop has withstood the the test of time and remains one of the building blocks that the united states recipe poetic sermons aside winthrop still is a columnist travelling to a harsh and unforgiving land after an initial dispute over the location of the colony in salem winthrop personally relocated to a new settlement off the charles river near massachusetts massachusetts bay in what would become boston winthrop's next task was going to be the establishment of a government. We talked last time about the government that was established in new england. The freemen who were members of the church had a vote for the assistant magistrates those magistrates would then vote for the office of governor it is important do not get carried away here and begin thinking that john winthrop was in any fashion early republican and just a quick note here on terminology because i want to be clear about this until we basically reached the civil a war. If you hear me mentioned republicans please no. I'm referring to small are republicans. In other words. These are not members of the modern republican party but rather these are those who advocate the creation of republic got it good terminology side. John winthrop was no republican winthrop government. It was essentially a limited democratic dictatorship sure members of the church did get a vote for their leaders but that's where democracy ended. This was not a complex complex form of government in fact it was unbelievably simple vote for the guy you want and then up until the next election they are going to have near absolute power additionally with was not a supporter of universal suffrage he in fact did all he could to limit the electric winthrop insisted that only those freeman men who were members of the church could vote this of course is going to have a widespread chilling effect members outta the church would have no voice in government likewise likewise by limiting who could vote it should the church would remain powerful. This isn't to say that when through wanted to establish anything looking like a theocracy instead he wanted wanted to limit suffrage to men whom he knew would support the puritan way of life in this way winthrop had not established democracy where the people act as the source the power rather winthrop had designed a system where a small group of loyal men tied more centrally to the church would become the source from which power could be obtained so sure john winthrop was willing to let church members be part of the electorate but at the same time is going to be a vast overstatement to refer to winthrop rope as being a pro republican or even particularly democratic the power of the governor which more often than not met winthrop had full rights over both the practical tactical function of the colony and the legislative function in terms of legislative action there was relatively little early in the colony law and order was important but they already had a law code the bible winthrop turn to the bible asses legal code and was sufficiently satisfied to simply follow out the punishments prescribed within initially during those early years winthrop would develop a rivalry with thomas dudley dudley would often find himself at odds with winthrop deadly repeatedly call that winthrop's policies then would become a general pain in the side of john winthrop biggest conflict between the men came over the laws. Both men supported the bible was there legal basis winthrop took a more lenient view understanding that colonial life was harsh winthrop supported acting in a manner that gave more lenient punishments deadly looking at this said. Hey we have a covenant with god. Who are you to disobey him when he came up with these punishments. Do you see a list of exceptions lunacy yeah me neither eventually winthrop would lose out and with those the governorship over these debates but don't feel too bad for winthrop. He is going to be back as governor soon enough well. There's really goes to show hover is that it's not like winthrop exists on an island in the colony. He does does have to deal with political pressures of the day and navigate the seas like anybody else. Ultimately with rope would become something of a moderate politically wedged in between the the more conservative thomas dudley who we've been talking about and eventually the more liberal minded roger williams who we are going to talk about in depth next time this isn't to say that winthrop would be a moderate by contemporary standards because no he really isn't but at this moment he found himself occupying that position this also moves us to a more central point about the politics and the beliefs of john winthrop winthrop often talks about covenants between the settlers and god this dominated the worldview of winthrop and was something that seemed always to be at the forefront of his policies in winthrop's mind. The people had an agreement with god in some ways this this is not terribly dissimilar from the political thought a century later during the american revolution john locke one of the biggest influences in the revolution believed that a social contract contract existed between the individual and their government. This is a very popular line of thought throughout the age of enlightenment and would be a central theme of the entire era winthrop's beliefs are not that out of line with this however he views the contract not as one between a body politic and the government but rather with god god as the sovereign in other words. There was a social contract between everybody and god and again. This is not to say that winthrop is some enlightened enlightened thinker. The guy really isn't winthrop was as previously discussed anti-democratic at his very core. If winthrop would right at one point that a democrat is amongst the most vile nations accounted the meanest and worst of all forms of government because i already said it once i want to be clear that democrat macron in this instance is a small democrat in this fashion winter viewed politics with a top down approach..

john winthrop winthrop winthrop england John winthrop salem winthrop boston winthrop england england massachusetts cambridge church of england europe john locke republican party america thomas dudley united states
"john winthrop winthrop" Discussed on The Political History of the United States

The Political History of the United States

12:01 min | 1 year ago

"john winthrop winthrop" Discussed on The Political History of the United States

"He's to speak evil of the way of god and all the professors for god's sake we shall shame the faces of many of god's worthy servants and caused their prayers to be turned into curses upon us to we become consumed out of the good land whether we are going the line from that speech for we must consider that we shelby as a city upon a hill. The eyes of all the people are upon us has the place as one of the most famous lines in american history. It serves almost <music> as a mission statement for what the united states itself wants to stand for today. The legacy of the line is so often portrayed in terms of democracy eighty or the moral attitudes of the united states which genuinely really is not winthrop had intended however the fact remains that the simple line by winthrop has withstood the the test of time and remains one of the building blocks that the united states recipe poetic sermons aside winthrop still is a columnist travelling to a harsh and unforgiving land after an initial dispute over the location of the colony in salem winthrop personally relocated to a new settlement off the charles river near massachusetts massachusetts bay in what would become boston winthrop's next task was going to be the establishment of a government. We talked last time about the government that was established in new england. The freemen who were members of the church had a vote for the assistant magistrates those magistrates would then vote for the office of governor it is important do not get carried away here and begin thinking that john winthrop was in any fashion early republican and just a quick note here on terminology because i want to be clear about this until we basically reached the civil a war. If you hear me mentioned republicans please no. I'm referring to small are republicans. In other words. These are not members of the modern republican party but rather these are those who advocate the creation of republic got it good terminology side. John winthrop was no republican winthrop government. It was essentially a limited democratic dictatorship sure members of the church did get a vote for their leaders but that's where democracy ended. This was not a complex complex form of government in fact it was unbelievably simple vote for the guy you want and then up until the next election they are going to have near absolute power additionally with was not a supporter of universal suffrage he in fact did all he could to limit the electric winthrop insisted that only those freeman men who were members of the church could vote this of course is going to have a widespread chilling effect members outta the church would have no voice in government likewise likewise by limiting who could vote it should the church would remain powerful. This isn't to say that winthrop wanted to establish anything looking like a theocracy instead he wanted wanted to limit suffrage to men whom he knew would support the puritan way of life in this way winthrop had not established democracy where the people act as the source the power rather winthrop had designed a system where a small group of loyal men tied more centrally to the church would become the source from which power could be obtained so sure john winthrop was willing to let church members be part of the electorate but at the same time is going to be a vast overstatement to refer to winthrop rope as being a pro republican or even particularly democratic the power of the governor which more often than not met winthrop had full rights over both the practical tactical function of the colony and the legislative function in terms of legislative action there was relatively little early in the colony law and order was important but they already had a law code the bible winthrop turn to the bible asses legal code and was sufficiently satisfied to simply follow out the punishments prescribed within initially during those early years winthrop would develop a rivalry with thomas dudley dudley would often find himself at odds with winthrop deadly repeatedly call that winthrop's policies then would become a general pain in the side of john winthrop. The biggest conflict between the men came over the laws. Both men supported the bible. Their legal basis winthrop took a more lenient view understanding that colonial life was harsh winthrop supported acting in a manner that gave more lenient punishments deadly looking at this said. Hey we have a covenant with god. Who are you to disobey him when he came up with these punishments. Do you see a list of exceptions lunacy yeah me neither eventually winthrop would lose out and with those the governorship over these debates but don't feel too bad for winthrop. He is going to be back as governor soon enough well. There's really goes to show hover is that it's not like winthrop exists on an island in the colony. He does does have to deal with political pressures of the day and navigate the seas like anybody else. Ultimately with rope would become something of a moderate politically wedged in between the the more conservative thomas dudley who we've been talking about and eventually the more liberal minded roger williams who we are going to talk about in depth next time this isn't to say that went through would be a moderate by contemporary standards because no he really isn't but at this moment he found himself occupying that position this also moves us to a more central point about the politics and the beliefs of john winthrop winthrop often talks about covenants between the settlers and god this dominated the worldview of winthrop and was something that seemed always to be at the forefront of his policies in winthrop's mind. The people had an agreement with god in some ways this this is not terribly dissimilar from the political thought a century later during the american revolution john locke one of the biggest influences in the revolution believed that a social contract contract existed between the individual and their government. This is a very popular line of thought throughout the age of enlightenment and would be a central theme of the entire era winthrop's beliefs are not that out of line with this however he views the contract not as one between a body politic and the government but rather with god god as the sovereign in other words. There was a social contract between everybody and god and again. This is not to say that winthrop is some enlightened enlightened thinker. The guy really isn't winthrop was as previously discussed anti-democratic at his very core effect winthrop would right at one point that a democrat is amongst the most vile nations accounted the meanest and worst of all forms of government because i already said it once i want to be clear that democrat macron in this instance is a small democrat in this fashion winter viewed politics with a top down approach. There is a compact between god and the people as part of that government arises and liberty is something that comes from the government itself the takeaway from all of this is that well it is tempting to try and make winthrop into some pro republican. He just isn't winthrop believed in a system that was top heavy power flow down from god through through the government and then eventually reached the individual god was the sovereign all power originated with him in idea like the people being the sovereign would have been ludicrous to winthrop so when looking at winthrop it is important to always keep in mind what he was and what he wasn't as much watches we want to shoehorn winthrop into enlightened voice. Preaching democracy winthrop wasn't that and shouldn't be seen as such winthrop's policies are rooted in the bible able not in the enlightenment for when throughout the chief argument against him over the years. We'll continue to be his relative leniency. The argument which began again with thomas dudley would continue as a running narrative through the later part of the sixteenth thirties despite the ongoing controversy winter would become governor again in the later half of the sixteenth thirties when throughput alternately four cents as the governor of massachusetts for a total of twelve years when ups chief concern remained the risk of separatism well certainly believed in reforming the church he would remain a staunch anti-separatists for the remainder of his life. This would often lead to tension between the the more separatist leaning members of the colony. This is going to be of particular importance to one dealing with roger. Williams williams was in comparison to winthrop. Nothing thinks short of a radical in his ideology a fierce separatists williams would into bouncing from church to church. None of them reached the level of purity that he was seeking. We are going to go ahead and leave roger williams alone for now however he is going to get his time in the next episode. It is the injured play however of these two men in that is really going to set the stage for some of the biggest controversies of the day and we're gonna see more of that next week for winthrop he would spend much of the rest of his career attempting into perry the repeated attempts to change the religious direction of the colony in two episodes time we are going to dig deeper into the increasingly complex religious situation in new england during the later half of the sixteen thirty s and moving into the sixteen forty s these attempts to steer the religious direction of the colony are always going to remain the most important thing for winthrop as you'll see drain that episode winthrop would spend the rest of his life right in the thick of the religious debate around new england well practical governance was was a pretty huge part of what he did after all the guy is the colonial governor in harshened unforgiving land he always remained tightly tethered to his puritan beliefs every decision he made was directed at maintaining the religious order that he helped established upon arrival in massachusetts however keep in mind that despite winthrop using religion as the basis for basically everything including how he runs the government he is not in favor of theocracy in fact winthrop was distinctly aware of the dangers that come with a theocracy and actively sought to avoid it and this makes sense think back to the origins of where the puritans come from cacophonous. They're coming out of the reformation. The entire purpose of the reformation is because the catholic church hierarchy had become so corrupt in the eyes of people liked luther so for winter he wants to avoid letting that kind of hierarchical structure form where the government and the church are so closely intertwined winthrop winthrop recognized the danger of having the church and the government being the same entity when they're wanted a government that would be protective of religion the government guided by religion however the church needed to remain separate of government and went through new it the church had no official authority in the government government and the government was careful not to allow the church to affect civil rights winthrop spent much of the sixteen forty s working through twin crises. The first question is was going to remain in massachusetts to begin with king charles finally relented and called for parliament that the great migration that had been going now for a decade not only ended if threatened to reverse course with parliament meeting again the doors were open to return to england however for winthrop he viewed his place as being in massachusetts wither had built something in massachusetts heat viewed his place in the world as remaining in the new world and working on supporting his more pure church at the same time however a crippling depression hit the colony in the sixteen forty s this depression that winter was personally forced to sell large amounts of his property property to pay his personal debts now without going into detail. The loss of his money was largely not winthrop's fault personally one of them in that he he had put in charge of helping rented the state's james lectured was basically really awful business and possibly corrupt lectured begun taking out large loans in winthrop's name loans loans that.

john winthrop winthrop winthrop winthrop winthrop John winthrop salem winthrop boston winthrop massachusetts thomas dudley roger williams republican party Williams williams united states england thomas dudley dudley charles river shelby catholic church
"john winthrop winthrop" Discussed on KQED Radio

KQED Radio

01:47 min | 3 years ago

"john winthrop winthrop" Discussed on KQED Radio

"Di named john winthrop's winthrop was the elected leader of the colonist news very clear about what they were doing their new world they were creating god's kingdom on earth who's gonna be a religious community they would obey god's laws that was the point of it his young roger williams at the radical idea that need they should be a separation of church and state on this new continent several the powersthatbe including john with you at this point as the governor of massachusetts got together and agree that this could not stand this radical anti christian agenda had no place on this new continent and they voted to expel roger williams senna back to england in this dark our one person steps in secret wait to help williams that person was the governor of massachusetts williams main adversary john winthrop's there are all these fascinating hints that winterbrook lights roger williams this is ted widmer historian director of the kirby center for research at the library of congress and by the way from speechwriter for president clinton and fact at the crucial moment when roger williams is about to be arrested and put on a ship and sent back to england winthrop sends word privately it we don't quite know how that williams really ought to go down to near against the day in and winthrop helps them to escape even as he's publicly voting for his banishment williams does good arrogance at bay when he found the state of rhode island and then he and the guy who's administration just kicked an out had this kind of amazing correspondence which last few years the governor winthrop wanted to hear how williams were surviving.

congress winthrop england winthrop president director ted widmer england rhode island clinton Di kirby center john winthrop massachusetts john roger williams winthrop john winthrop