19 Episode results for "holly"

Holly

Plant Of The Week

04:26 min | 2 months ago

Holly

"I was out looking around the other day after a little bit of rain and see what good that had done and looked up and and brushed my shoulder against the shrub. That's I don't know seven feet tall thousand or so feet wide couple three of them. They are Holly's this particular group of holidays are called Sparkleberry. There are a number of shrub types of holidays. Mine happens to have the reddest of red flowers They're the size of a half a cranberry in terms of that but a brilliant red sign sign theme and then there are the other holidays. If you're lucky enough to have a well-drained organic soil that can be or ears a little acidic the American holly tree which gets very large and and doesn't quite a beautiful job south of here in Columbus area. That is south of Main in an area that's got some age to it. There are a number of large American holidays they happen to grow wage. What was the old River Bank area of the Olentangy then one that I do not understand have not understood but it is an American holly. It stands right behind the sidewalk sidewalk is south of the tree then six feet in the curb and then the hot blacktop the driveway gives a heat off the blacktop all morning long all well all midday. It is in the absolutely wrong position presently twelve feet tall and has to be trimmed back in diameter. So it doesn't block The View coming out of the driveway. So that is the Holi story. There are many many kinds and they do require a better soil than what I'm going to call our average Olentangy River junk long does work into the process, but you need to add a lot of organic either compost or peat moss then add some powdered sulfur and so on so that you can get it. Let's just say well drained and acidic then you can log So darn your any Holly and I well my Sparkle berries are fifteen or twenty years old and each year. Well, they don't flourish in size anymore. They've picked out in size. Like I say seven eight feet tall and and white, but they're they've been generous in flour. And then when it comes the time where the dead birds I'm going to call them and principally the Robin are flocking in the middle of winter and there's been a couple of darn good freezes. That's often those little berries. I have counted them if they'd hold still I would know better count but I've counted twenty five or more Robbins on that shrub in one given point and in two days, it's been picked clean and they move on looking for food so it can be a pleasure. If you it can feed the birds. And of course the red orange belly of a rabbit in the wintertime is quite something. So that's those then I just yep. To throw in for interest and color and bird. Well call it food. The seed heads on many of our plants the the well, let's check. There are several groups of plants. I happen to leave the cold flowers and I don't have very many of them, but I'll leave a cone flower into coreopsis and so on those things that have a seed-spitting head on them the Fitch just love those little rascals. So I leave them and other things then we turn to the shrubs and there I have several shrubs including viburnum that are now in in either a yellow or red stage of fruit. Some will go on and turn black and again once there is some fries if softens the fruit same with flowering crabapple birds can eat them now, but I suppose they're full of element a little hard to digest it's pretty solid yet. But as soon as we've had several freezes, which I don't necessarily personally look forward to but it's dead. For the fruit and again, the birds will just go crazy and where I like to do what I can to preserve nature those things will be left to stand and I enjoy the tan colors and so on edge of leaving grasses stand. I leave the other plants looking wintry. I happen to enjoy that that leaves something in the garden, others want to clean up totally and that's fine. But those things are that the big deal for this week.

Holly Olentangy River Columbus area River Bank Robbins Fitch seven eight feet twenty years twelve feet seven feet six feet two days
Holly

Plant Of The Week

05:57 min | 1 year ago

Holly

"Hi this is Mark News for plan. Talk Radio thanks for subscribing and listening to our plan of the week podcast brought to you by bod products family made in America visit dot com to find a retailer near you each week plant. talkradio's Fred Hauer focuses on a plant. That would be a great addition to your landscape. Scape now for this week's bond products plant of the week and it is holly holidays because there are very many of them From evergreen types greet big tall trees down through shrubs. No more than six or eight feet tall and you can even modify that down smaller Alex is its species name. There are a number of I'm sorry genus name named and then there are a number of species and a tremendous number then of crossed plans. I'm going to leave it there. The the well I. I'm going to deal with the one that I have and love it's Alex Ver- titillated by significant name and then it's called Winter Berry. Generally there are all kinds of cultivars of it their various brightness as of. I guess you can call that hues of red and and then there are some orange yellow fruited types. And they're in their glory right now. They're almost defoliated as as they will do every winter and then the berries aries are the signs of a pepper corn for all practical purposes usually in multiples in in along the stem and so on the plant contracts birds. Now it can attract birds either this time of year or then for sure in the spring after the fruit have frozen in in thought enough. I have seen Cedar Wax Wings. Come down like the vortex of a storm. They find that plant they come down in the numbers they get on. I have well. I have two females and one male and they'll spend a half a day picking them clean out of all those berries and it's it's really fun because the the rate of most birds is nothing to a branch of that plant in on the heavier parts but out toward the end. And where th I guess they think. Of course they're going to pick them all but it's fun to watch them. Sidestep out a twig until the weight of the TWIG goes down a little bit even onto the bird's weight then they either have to fly off or whatever then to watch them try to hover just a little bit And then hummingbirds can do that. Very well Cedar Max Robbins. Just don't do it well at all then they become dive bombers and it's just it's A. It's a circus. It's color alert for the winter. And so on but the point is on the signings participate. A It is a shrub mine have gotten some significant age The group of them is probably eight nine and feet wide right now they are maybe six and a half feet tall Significant background and they're in a wet spot where well my yard drains toward the the middle at Cetera et Cetera They handle water very very nicely. As a matter of fact almost prefer it and then there are so many other holidays in in particular then The Chinese Holly Japanese Holly They American Holly. And then what order called the MS survey varieties Blueprints and blue princess are two of the primaries they are across from. I don't know how many different ways They're they're sturdy plants. They will hit seventy feet tall. If you don't Prune but I've seen them kept at three and four and five feet. I bye bye pruning and on a holiday you do need boys and girls You do best if you will trim them not on the outer Sir the outer edge but reach in and take out individual branches with them flowering and then fruiting in the fall. You you can Well you could destroy destroy the whole process. If you just trim the outside edge you'll still have the leaves in the shiny and all that good stuff but is it. There's a better way to handle them. And that is as as you think. Think of a barber beautician using thinning. shears where they cut down into the hair but only certain parts are sharp so they simply are thinning. Well if you can imagine that where you go in think of your fingers five fingers you cut your thumb off you leave your index finger. You cut your middle finger off. Leave your ring finger and so on so that you you have trimmed back into the plant where you keeping the the new parks the flowering part. That has the Freeman on it. And so on and then you're you're causing those that you've cut back to spread. Well I'M GONNA say spread out to to grow from the cut points on out and you can and keep plant looking heavy. Well you don't see much the flowering album heavy and flower therefore heavy and fruit and beautiful. Ever Ed will every winter And this is with all holidays but especially the blueprints Noel blueprints the pollinator and then group Blue Princess and and an arrangement there is really quite quite particularly Fun To me. Thanks again for listening to our podcast brought to you by bonafide products at Bonn Dot Com. Plante Talk Radio. Offers other PODCASTS podcasts. As well including our daily your gardening question podcast and our weekly plan talk radio all available on I tunes or your preferred podcast player. If you have have a plant suggestion for Fred Semi Male Fred at plant talk. RADIO DOT COM.

Alex Ver Bonn Dot Com Fred Hauer Winter Berry bod products Mark News Fred Semi America Max Robbins Alex Blue Princess Noel seventy feet eight feet five feet
Big Brother 21 Monday July 29 Morning Update

Reality TV RHAP-ups: Reality TV Podcasts

1:18:32 hr | 1 year ago

Big Brother 21 Monday July 29 Morning Update

"<music> every morning Terry Armstrong Room yes again sees you could do tomorrow. He will do again. Hello everyone and good morning. Welcome welcome to our alive update for July twenty ninth. I'm rose turn Armstrong and today I'm here on my own to update you on everything that happened yesterday. On the Big Brother Twenty one live feeds and say it was a good day good day on the feeds. I feel like things things are looking up. Things are looking exciting. I am enjoying it. There's there's a lot ought to talk about a lot of cracks a lot of movements a Lotta drama happening so let's let's talk about it. Let's talk about it all because it's good it's good stuff. It's good stuff. <hes> things things are looking up so just wait until the twist comes to screw everything up but for now it's good it was day forty in the big brother twenty-one House they forty as I said things are <music> remiss also if you want to join the chats yes. The chat is my my co host today and we'll we'll have some fun there but but there's a lot to talk about so probably not a lengthy Q._N._A.. Section mostly just <hes> some some recapping some updating going on all right so as we know leading into this day here leading into this day here we have nick with the veto. He's going to take himself down today on the veto ceremony and so the talk has been who goes up as the replacement now cat volunteered to go up as the replacement. We know that and she didn't have to but she did. She volunteered cat is looking like the option here. Kristie was really pushing for that because she wants to Sam to go home now wholly on the other hand was kind of thinking of potentially putting Nicole on the block because if Nicole goes on the block than she wants to back door Nicole she would use sam to potentially make some kind of move against the rest of the six particularly Christie Tommy Jack because that they're on the bottom of the six and they need some kind of move to be made and in particular has really been pushing that Nicole should go because Nicole is not trustworthy and so holly is really considering this idea that maybe Nicole should go home home so we started the day with Holly Jackson Talking With Jack and holding Jackson are going to be making a few mistakes throughout the day. One of the major ones here obviously that they buy I mean mostly Jackson Trusts Jack Way Too much with a lot of this stuff and so they're talking about the idea of potentially taking a shot at Nicole this week they are talking about like well. You know what could put up cad but the other option is coal. So what are the pros. What are the cons to keeping Sam in the game and Jackson starts pitching that hey if if we keep Sam in the game then Myself Holly Jack U.? Insists we could kind of start another six with nick and Sam to cover our bases and then we have two different sixes and I'm just throwing things out here. I'm just throwing things out. The you know just just ideas not not conspiring not not plotting against anyone just throwing some ideas out there. Jack is just like do we need. We need to do that in Jackson's. Maybe not maybe not no but just this thinking about is not necessarily going to last all the way through so you know. Maybe it's worth thinking about some other options think about it. Jack says I hear you but are we just making chickens Joe chicken salad out of chicken shit. We just doing that I was. I was very confused the Jackson Not Jackson but that's that's how Jack is trying to shut this down and Jackson says he does it look look. I don't want you to think I'm I don't want this to get back to Kristie because I don't want it to look like conspiring against her that applauding behind your back because I'm not or we're GONNA have to take shots at each other at some point and to be clear. I'm not I'm not plotting against the six. Not Planning is six just that if SAM was here and took shots at other people in our six. Is that a bad thank not plotting against anyone just just to be clear but if they were to go home like Jackson I think I mean we've seen him. We seen him operate before right where he is a total jerk to people and Jack Does the same thing total jerk to people but I love you just to just to be clear. I love you but now let me be really condescending into you. Like Jackson feels like all he needs to do is make disclaimer of look to be clear not plotting against anyone now let's plot against Christie and so he goes ahead and he does that. Holly does try to pull well it back a little bit. She says well there. Let's let's remember maybe it's a little early to be talking about this because there are still six other people not in our alliance right now and obviously she in this moment is thinking about cliffs angels because cat has told about cliffs angels and how that is an alliance of cliff cat Nicole Jess and she knows that if they start taking shots at each other too early than that group could actually get together and make something happen and so. She's trying to think very very subtly. Warn them like hey. This is still too early. Let's not take shots this early. We're we're this is more later in the game. We need to worry about the other people as well but Jack says now now. We don't need to worry about cliff or cat. They won't take a shot. They're bought and paid for we're in a good spot though and we shouldn't agitate. It shouldn't agitate so right from the right from the beginning of this day. We're GONNA WE'RE GONNA see Holly and Jackson really start to float some ideas out there some very anti Christie ideas and that's going to be the theme of the day we move onto Christie. Tommy Holly and and Jackson Christy and Tommy are going to come up and be talking to them. This was just a funny conversation because if you are a loyal listener to rob has a podcast and you have listened to me on previous seasons NHS I I have gone gone off about this before where almost every season there's at least one person who says I've got a photographic memory yeah. I'm GonNa win all the question cops because I've got a photographic memory and it's never true never true the one person who was unbeatable in question competitions throughout the history of big brother was Kevin Martin and Big Brother Canada. Kevin Martin doesn't claim to have a photographic memory because he doesn't and none of these people do none of them Christie's like yeah. I've got a photographic memory and Jackson is just like Oh yeah the Tommy's. What is that like what does that mean in Jackson's like oh go? Let's do something right now. Target Room go and sow Christie's like okay yeah target room and so she starts listing off a bunch of memorized sized facts about the target room. How many arrows there are how many lines there are all of this stuff which is not what a photographic memory maids not memorized facts that you memorized that you can recall images ages without memorizing them? That's that's the point of a photograph so she's listing memorized facts and numbers about this room really quickly like she's super smart and then toffees like that's thirteen remember. She's like Oh yeah right right got that one wrong I had to recap she go wrong thinking about the image and like Oh looking at things. No she memorized numbers because that's not now autograph memories. She goes on to explain how she oh. She's like Oh yeah what I do. Is I think about things like Oh tyler came in and Tyler reminds me of this thing and so this thing makes me think of a photograph in in my head and Jackson's like huck photographic memory. That's exactly what it is and it's like no that is exactly not what it is. The photographic memory means that you do not use mnemonic devices to remember things. That's the opposite of what it is exactly not what it is and so of course Jackson not to be left out is going to chime in as well you know you know before I got my concussions man. My Memory Sharpe's floss sharp floss. I I can remember whole pages of text okay. That's genuine photographic memory if it's true and I don't think it's true so how that happened sorry about that anyway. Sam Insists GonNa Talk Salmon says they've been talking for a while of course and and this has been kind of campaigning for Sam to to stay because she has a good relationship with him and she really feels like like he can be a benefit to her game so they're going to be talking a lot throughout the day continuing to talk a lot throughout the day and talking about like how he could possibly say they talk about who holly could put up on the block Osama's hoping that it's not cat because if it's cat he feels like he's dead so they kind ended. Get around to the fact that the kind of hint around the fact that Hey Nicole is your best shot Miss Nicole if Nicole goes on the block. There's at least some hope at least some hope so that's Sam is going to be starting to kick off that campaign. He's going to be trying to make sure holly. Holly is thinking about putting Nicole on the block. Jack is going to be flirting a lot with cysts throughout the day. He's he's you know it's it's weird because they hooked up quite a bit it and then there's been this sort of weird thing where he's like pining about his ex and she's pining about him and they're not actually together very often but they did actually flirt a bit yesterday and in various <music> points in the day they were like picking up spoons with their feats and all this stuff I mean Look Jack and they talk about this. In the house is similarly to Jackson. He can be charming when he wants to which makes his devious side all the more devious in my opinion but they're going to be flirting lot and it's not something that that is going to go unnoticed by by Christie so we'll talk about that. When it comes up Tommy an Christie by the way are going to as we talked about last night and the recap get their punishments upgraded upgraded they they they come out? Oh everyone we've got our new poison. I treat because they've got caroline lotion all over them. They're all painted up like like Columbus. They said in the house lots and Charlie and the chocolate. Awkward Factory Talk We got viable regard in Bloom Bas and they they're completely painted in this sort of like pink stuff they hate. They hate it. It's much much worse than than then the just like blotch because full on painted and stuff and it's much more uncomfortable so they're not fond of it. Christine does though say that it's actually green apple centered in case you were wondering how they smelled eld but that's a bad thing Kristie because her natural fair ramones won't go through. She's like Nick Nick. You're not gonNA like it. It's very unnatural. It's very foreign and my fair moons aren't coming out so that's going on there. They have a dance class. They do these occasionally but particularly funny when Tommy is painted pink that happened. Nick is going to talk with Nicole and in this conversation this brief conversation but he explains to Nicole that prior to the veto veto competition. He and Sam agreed not to campaign for for the other person. If one of them won the veto meaning that that if nick one veto where San Juan de Vito and they came down they would not campaign to keep the other and the purpose of this was that they would not drag the person that staying not drag their games down in order to help save the other one would like what happened when they campaigned for Bella but in practice what it's amounting to nick he's not campaigning for salmon anyway. He is just kind of hanging out trying to get back in with the big group. Now I think that inadvertently they have stumbled upon a fantastic strategy and Sam I think has caught on a little little bit as well. He's also told cliff like don't campaign for me. I need to do this all on my own and and this is really effective and I think it's one of the reasons why holly is so willing to potentially chilly. Keep Sam in the game because normally when you're on the block you want other people to campaign for you because if you're campaigning yourself it's kind of tough you know like you're already in a bad spot but in this case Sam has been dragged down by Knicks game and and one of the reasons why people want to send them home because he's connected to nick and so if nick is campaigning for Sam not to mention the fact that nick is a terrible campaigner in the first place then it's much worse for Sam that necas campaigning for their advertising themselves as a duo so they've stopped hanging being out campaigning for Sam and so Sam is able to act as a free agent act is somebody that is like hey I can offer you what I can offer you and and it's it's less less united front. It's a less sort of threatening position to have only one person campaigning. Nobody else's backing him up makes Sam look like somebody that can be picked up and worked with like from like from Holly's perspective active so it's actually working really well and and I do think that we that that is commendable there so so that's happening there. Tommy and Christie are going to have a long conversation in the boat room lots of interesting little things here Kristie the night before had been freaking out as she does with sis and then Jack came in and she freaked out a little bit to Jack as well she talked about how she in her real-life has dealt with anxiety and control issues and stuff like that and so in her real life she has worked really hard to put herself in a position where she is able to live calmly calmly and she doesn't put herself in situations where that side of her gets triggered the anxiety the control freak side of her and so she's finding herself in the house not able to control her surroundings as much and she is devolving coming into the kind of controlling paranoid anxious person that that she's able to kind of avoid in real life which I thought was an interesting insight into sort of who she is in the game this Christie talking to Tommy and so she's telling Tommy about this and part of what that freak out was about was that she's worried that Jackson is going. Sushi's like I'm word Jackson can read in my mind. I'm worried that he can see how anxious and paranoid I am. It's very concerning. She's worried that she's going to create the very situation that she's paranoid about in the first place which is a legitimate concern because I think that she in many anyways has and so she's like I think maybe I'm just being paranoid. Maybe I just need to calm down and and just chill and just be fine and so <hes> that being said she says if Jackson in Holly Start Pushing that they want to keep Sam again and take out Nicole <hes> that that tells me that maybe I'm not being paranoid. Maybe maybe there is something to worry about that tells me that they want Sam in the game to take shots at me which is true and so that's sort of the line she's willing to to. Maybe let this go but if holly starts pushing to keep Sam again that's her Q.. That's her signal that holly and Jackson actually are plotting against her and that's when she is going to be concerned so they then go onto to talk about how yes the Sam should be leaving. Tommy said he wanted Sam to go in the first place. Sam Is the more dangerous one. He really really wants Sam to go home. Christie says that they can vote Sam out regardless of who holly puts up next to him that if she if she does decide hi to pull a fast one input Nicole on the block they can still vote out Sam. They'll probably have the votes and then afterward they would go after Jackson Holly because you WanNa you WANNA keep big targets in the game will just well guess what you just created two new ones boom. You're on the block. That's Tommy's planned speech if they do it. Tommy's I plan speeches in my head all the time. It's just what you do. Is there such vindictive players you too so concerned about that it worries. Tommy is worried about Jackson because I'm just worried because Jackson he's going around around. He's acting so happy all happy Jackson. He likes to be devious. He likes to play really hard and so when he's not able to gets very frustrated and angry but he's been walking around very happy very very very happy to be here which concerns about that tells me that he is. He's able to to have that outlet. He's playing hard and it's making him happy. I felt it was I thought that was actually pretty agreed because that's exactly what's happening exactly what's happening. Tommy also says that he doesn't trust cat that he would not trust cat to be a number for them this week to vote and he does not trust. The cat is with them. He thinks that the cat might be with holly because he catches cat talking with holly a lot. There was one moment where I himself cat Sam Holly. We're up in the bedroom and it felt like Sam wanted to talk to Holly Holly so Tommy was kind of just like all right. Let's go downstairs. Give them a chance to talk but cat was like no I wanna stay and so he ended up leaving by himself and then they stayed up there and talked and that was like why is why is cat up there why does she what does she want wants to be a part of that conversation wise allowing to be part of that conversation. He's really starting to be a little bit concerned. That cat is not actually with them and she's actually with the other side which again definitely good read there and I will say that Christie is I think starting to go along with that as well we know that Christie has had a bit of a soft spot for cat but that relationship has been deteriorating as as things have been progressing with cat and holly and what's been happening joining this week so that's something to to watch out for as well they did talk about. Tommy Advises Christie not to talk about her power anymore. Don't mention it because if you don't mention engine it people will just forget about it like do you remember that Sam won a trip to Fiji. Oh my God I totally forgot about that. He's like exactly because he never talks about it and they talk about how the power sucked the season. Oh my God Jack's power was worthless power suck. Why didn't we get last? Two seasons. Powers thought that was funny. Christie also talks about how she she doesn't fully trust Jack still and she hates it because she loves Jack but she just doesn't feel like she can fully trust him. He's he's just he's such a Schmoozer such a Schmoozer. She caught him talking to Nicole the other day because Nicole is freaking out a little bit and she was like I he said he told Nicole that all of their quirks that all all of the quirks and imperfections and stuff that's what he loves about her. He wouldn't change anything anything about it because like he makes me vomit saying stuff like that. He's like that with everyone he soc muzy and she's very concerned about that and she says he's also very jealous because the last night and I were cuddling and like you know she was all over me and and he was totally ignoring her and now today he's all over her because I I did notice that he was flirting with her a lot today and he's been kind of a Dick to me and he does the same thing to you and Nick Tommy when he when he sees the Nikko hanging out he just gets jealous and he likes to he likes to try to make us jealous <hes> there's there's a little bit of that too that as tight as Jack Christy and Tommy are never underestimate Christie's paranoia. She is definitely still having trouble trusting Jack. There's still a little a bit a little part of her. That's just like sky. He might just be playing me and I just another thing to pay attention to Chrissy also talks about of course wanting to take Jackson out of the House. She really wishes she's that somebody else would do it for her but she doesn't think anybody would. She's talking about like who would put Jackson up. Nobody has to be us. Tommy says ads too soon though too soon but Christie's like is it too. I mean I'm I'm done. I'm done taken out the floaters. The Jess is the cats all these people. They're not a threat to me and Tommy's yeah you make a good point. I think it is time for big move soon and Tommy says he's he wants to start winning competitions nations soon maybe the week after this next week he might start wanting to win some competitions. He was very happy to throw this veto to nick not that he threw it per se but he didn't really care about winning and he allowed allowed himself to lose especially knowing that he was going to lose to nick. He was kind of pleased about that because he didn't really want nick to go home. He wanted Sam to go home. He feels like he has a great relationship with Nick. He thinks nick is trustworthy and he just he just as messed up he messed up but we can bring him back in so that's how Tommy feels about nick they do have a good relationship that is also going to be one of the story lines here because people are seeing that the Tommy is close to Nick and then he might be trying to bring him back in Tommy also voices something that I've been thinking about in regards to Tommy and Christie's game which is that Tommy came in here a big fan of the game ready to play hard right ready to play the game and he he got into the house he saw Christie Whoa and everything changed for him and now Kristie is the one that's really out in front really pushing hard and in behooves Tommy to just kind of sit back. Doc and let her do everything well. He maintains his relationships. That's kind of the optimal strategy for him but I always wondered like does he does. He wish that Christie wasn't there and this wasn't the best strategy for him that he could be playing a little harder because he's kind of just hanging out and that's what's best for him and he knows it but I like I would if I were in his position. I'd be like this is my big brother experience and kind of being boring and I know it's best for me. It's like Christie's doing all this work for me but it's boring. He kinda voices this. He's like you know I do wonder what it would be like if if if I played this game we know in a different house and in different with a different cast. I'd be playing more aggressive. We'd be more balls to the wall that kind of thing I think I think the Tommy is is really starting to get bored and I think he's starting to want to take some action. He's like so you know. What soon maybe? Maybe we'll get. Maybe we'll get there. Maybe we'll get there. Maybe we'll we'll we'll be more aggressive. We'll have more fun with it so he's definitely tug and talking talking about very soon within the next couple of weeks winning some competitions making some moves really starting to to branch out from the situation that they are in right now. Kristie is also going to talk about Jess and how she feels like jess is of course somebody that is worth taking to the end game that just is a great person to take because she's not GonNa win any competitions useless in the game name and and she's also not somebody WanNa take the final two because she's so lovable so she's a great person to bring around to the file five four three that kind of situation so jess in her goat status moving and moving up on the leaderboard getting up there with SIS who knows maybe she'll move up from her two on the roundtable tonight. Get up to a three. She's getting their Jesse. Equals Victoria says Kelly pretty pretty honestly though let me tell you Victoria was a fantastic goat she was she was loyal. She was obedient. She followed direction very well while she was completely comforted in like her own head about the fact that she was like playing a great game being ago and Jess on the other hand Victoria the best of all time truly truly holly is going to talk with Christy assists and Tommy now this. This is the this they're going to be from Jack Leaves. The room and holly is like okay now the Jack Scott I wanted to talk to you guys. Just you three about about this whole situation because I feel guilty sending Sam home for Nick's actions Tommy make sure to say it's not just guilty by association here. Sam was up in Cliffs H._O._A.. Trim when cliff was making Jacqueline Jackson nominations and he was very excited about that he definitely had a hand in that so let's not only say that this is guilty by association. Holly Says Okay Okay Okay just thinking about like the only other possibility I can think of is putting Nicole up in sending her home and <music> and of course this is like we that can that can happen. This is still kind of on board with this plan of course because she wants Sam to target holly and Jackson suspicious pitches that if if they get the if if they get to the six with Jack Jesse's I look the way I see it because I'm a strategic mastermind myself this way I see it. The six aren't GonNa last shots are going to be taken and and who we want those shots taken by. Maybe Sam if we do get all if if we do it all the way down to the six Jack and Jackson those two guys they're gonNA they're gonNA Steal Dominate Takes All oh so sam can be the person that takes a shot at them. Tom Saying now we are going to take a quick break for our sponsors and we'll be right back. This episode is brought to you by Cox <music> TV from Cox. You can find all your favorites all in one place it is it have the youtube you Bet El what about that net flicker thing netflix too and although superhero movies to her has all the latest his titles on demand. Oh my grandkids love that big green guy. I prefer the one with the hammer myself okay. I think we're done here now. Get all your favorite apps shows and movies right on contoured TV from Cox and we're back so let's get back to the show and so they talk about it some more again. Tommy tries to continue and push in the direction of Sam though not not only guilty guilty by association guilty in a lot of other ways. We can't keep him in with neck too early to make some kind of move like this. Sam should be the one to go. He he mentioned a Gallic Sam was up in Class H O._H.. And so they talk about well we'll do you think cliff would would tell us if Sam was really pushing for for Jack Jackson. Go on the block and I'll well maybe he's working with Sam but Christie vouches for cliff sir. He's now working with say he's with us. It's cliff team US team us and then they end up getting interrupted because Jack comes back into the room and this is a funny moment to because their cover story for what they were talking about is that they'd go straight to the trip that they're planning because this is always something houseguests do all their planning a big group trip afterward and they're all going to travel together and just immediately pipes in with yeah but cats can't come with us. We're just not going to tell cat that we're going. I just hate her. She's so annoying I would kill myself if cat came with us. These people so mean cliff is going to talk with Jack. Cliff is explaining the clowns shoe moment with with Jeff Jeff when home the because of some clown shoes and finally giving a little bit of hints about like w fictions they are sometimes like a little bit luck based like clown shoes or question comps. I don't know if Jack really picked up on it but also keep calling them. Double eliminations limbs that what they're called cliff talks about talks about the deal for safety he says we've we've two weeks of safety and Jack interjects for me your beyond that safe to deal for me now I would love to to work work together. Moving forward and cliff says I would love that as well. If there's anything that we can work out if there's any moves that need to be made just come to me and I'm completely open for Jackson's perfect. I love it cliff mentions that he has proved himself to be a man of his word. He does not do shady things man. I just can't I I wouldn't be good at shady stuff in this game. You know me people really really really just buying this person. That cliff is selling after that big move their SYS- Tommy and Christie are going to talk this still pitching that Nicole should go. She's she's saying that she's super sketched out by Nicole. She likes hollies idea of them for working together outside of Jackson and Jack Sis really feels like holly is not to blame for all of the Jackson and holly stuff that it's Jackson poisoning reasoning putting poison into holly's ear and the only reason holly might be going along with it is because of Jackson so if if the four of them worked together then that would be great that'd be great for them and they can take out Nicole this week. They can take they can take sam in Sam can take shots at Jack Jackson and everything will work out fine Nicole just really sketches her out and so Tommy and Chris once again trying to push back this notion that they can keep salmon the game that we don't keep saying the game that we can't keep nick and Sam together so they're like oh well. Maybe we'll take out Nicole next week instead of nick but but nick sketches me out too and I can't trust him and so hello Tommy and Christie maybe we can bring him back in all of this stuff so Cisco's to talk to Nick Nick. I can't trust you and nick is <music> <hes> like Oh look look. What can I do? What can I do? I I need to prove it to you. How how can how can I make you trust me? I just need to win and I'll prove it to you guys. He's like not US guys meet me. How do you prove to me? I can't trust you <hes> and she brings up the whole thing where he was trying to get her and holly on the block and Nixes. I wasn't trying to get you and Holly. I'm pretty sure I don't remember saying that. which is the worst thing to do? The like when's this is like Oh. You tried to get gene holly on the block all that time go through my name out there and nick is like I got I mean I'm sorry I don't remember doing that. He didn't he only he only said Holly's name pretty saying he doesn't remember for saying says his name which is all but an admission from most people's points of view. Most people would say well if he didn't do it he wouldn't he would say he didn't do it. I think he genuinely just feels like enough people. Who said that he did that? He's like did I. I'm pretty sure I didn't that's all I'm saying so that's not going well but he's he just continues to say. Look a win approved to you that you can trust me. Jack is going to join the conversation. He says the same thing to Jack that he really wants to come back in with those guys. He's he's letting Sam go and then he can work with them moving forward and if he wins h will prove to them that he can be trusted. Nick is says we're going to talk even more later in the day and India about the same thing about trusting each other nick earning the trust back and all that stuff rob in the jets too bad nick doesn't have that photographic memory then he know for sure all right so holly and cat are going to have a long conversation very long. Conversation is another big big one here. This is an interesting thing that happens holly and they talk about the pros was in cons of cad going on the block. Now in this conversation cat is basically trying to be like I so regret the volunteering to be nominated for the block. I really don't want to go up there. I'm terrified that <hes> everyone's GonNa flip on me and I'm going to go home. That's that's the inside of cat and how that projects itself is. You don't think that I mean I'm fine with going in the blog by you. Don't think people football me right and Isaac no definitely not okay but what if they do that would suck but they're not one hundred percent. They're not yeah yeah yeah. You're right. You're right by what if going on the block means that people more more likely put me up his upon later which is totally case. She will absolutely become more of a pawn star and he's like. I don't think that'll happen. She's like yeah you're right. Okay see I'm totally fine with what if Jackson wants wants me out all these no Jackson one hundred hundred one are you if he doesn't want me. Why does he keep picking fights with me in the kitchen and she says it like that picky picking fights in the? Kitchen because he gets annoyed with you because I want you out. It's like okay like even if he did want you out. There's the votes aren't there. Nobody's GONNA flip. Okay okay talked about the pros of going in the block. Cats hides the fact that they've been working together and that they know each other that Holly Says Oh. Oh Yeah I forgot we can talk about that now. Do you think they've aired. It already sounds to me like they were told earlier in the season not to talk about this or they say said amongst themselves we can't talk about this and then eventually production caught onto the fact that they knew each other and we're like hey you're not fooling anyone. Just talk about it but there was definitely some kind of rule against them whether it was self imposed or production imposed that they were not supposed to talk about knowing each other until finally they were asked about it in the dining room and now they feel like they can be more open about it on the feeds so that was interesting. Holly does worry that if she puts cat on the block that cliffs angels will come after her kind of adorable that she thinks this is a real thing cliffs angels those who come from me this United Lions because I'm putting up one of their own cat says I don't think so and holidays and by the way I I haven't told anyone about close angels. Oh Yeah Good Christie knows what I'm pretty sure. Yeah wasn't Christine that conversation. No you didn't tell Christy. Did you has like I thought it hold on me. I didn't I'm not I told Christie and don't tell Christy what are you. What are you doing no? I don't think I told Christie Talk Christie. The Whole House knows no I definitely didn't I definitely didn't told delicacy. I'd I got. I got confused like don't tell Kristie I want. I definitely won't tell Christy holly says `I likley cliff is working with us. I don't want them to doubt cliff. She's actively trying to protect cliff in this group which was interesting because again she I think it feels that she can use cliff moving forward and she is trying to one of the reasons why she hasn't even told Jackson about cliffs angels it because she doesn't want cliff to be targeted. She wants to potentially use cliffs angels and she wants to talk to them separately to you get them on board with her and whatever move that she makes this week so that was very interesting cat says so yeah cliffs angels will come for you but maybe they won't. I don't know I mean it's not like they're like I don't know they're not like a super verb like united thing. You know like they're not super. I think cliff has my back but I mean I don't trust Nicole. It all and Jess is just like her head's not really like she doesn't really care about anything so I don't know it's fairly an alliance anyway so they talk about this is finished that they talk about how this is is is really pushing for Nicole to go and holly's worried that the only reason this is pushing for Nicole to go is because she wants to stay because this feels like Sam's number for her and if Salmon's number for SIS unholy then that's not good for holly so she's concerned about that and and so they're worried about that cat wonders again well. Are we sure we have the votes. If if I go on the block then cat says that you know it's weird I actually I really trust Jack. Jack is one of my favorite people in the house cats. Has I feel like we can absolutely jack. I sure of Oh to keep me. I know I can trust Jack. He's he's he's great. I love him and but I am worried about other people like what if they flip on me. I'm not trying to convince the like I'm totally willing to be on the but I'm just worried about some other people and I'm worried about Nick Nick and Tommy have been talking a lot. It seems like they're trying to pull nick back into the group. I don't like that whole he's like. I know I tried to tell them that. Nick is like an abusive relationship relationship and that they shouldn't pull him back in but they're doing it. They're doing it cat says that Christy and Tommy have talked to her about working with cliff and Jess and Nicole aw essentially cliffs angels but they don't know about cliffs angels and he's like Oh that Christie everybody goes to Christie for everything yes. She was the first h she's like the leader of the House and he started talking about Christine how dangerous she is again more. This sort of Christie exposed stuff going on lots of people talking about Kristie. This is kind of what we have been expecting for a little while. This stuff off is really starting to bubble to the surface of it here so talk about Christie and how she's in charge of the house. Everybody goes to her for everything. She's very dangerous here and they're concerned about taking out their own soldiers and leaving in soldiers for other people all right so that was the holly and cat talk. Jackson is going to talk to Sam briefly. He says that he would love for same day and four Nicole to be the one that goes Sam wonders if he should pitch that to holly this is again another hint to Sam that Nicole is the right option to go next to him that would be his best shot at staying so Nicole is GonNa break down a bit to Christy and Tommy. She's been talking a lot about how it's not really fair in the house because if she says something like Hey I'm a free agent or I wanna work with some people then she gets in big trouble for but if somebody like Christie says that then Chris Christie she can say whatever she wants so she starts breaking down about stuff like that. Tommy advises her to be more vocal more vocal about where you stand because people are worried about you. They don't know where you stand in that scares them but Nicole says but I'm afraid to say things like that because of what happened like I'm really we played burnt by that and I feel like I'm not able to say things like that. So Tommy and Krista continue to comfort her this day were team Nicole. We're on your side. Everything's find more vocal pink aside aside so she says straight up to Christie of it like I feel like you can say things and I can't Christie's knock all of that so once again Nicole being a little too open with Christy but not not to the point that things are going to get bad here. Holly is going to have a talk with Sam. Sam is going to have a lengthy campaign to holly once again and holly does say like she'd love to work something out and keeping you know Nicole is an option here after Sam ask like is anybody else causing drama and can we make anything happen but she says look the whole house wants you out the whole house. The whole house has been trying to hang nick nick up and you know crucify this guy and now all of a sudden. They're trying to pull him back in and they're all saying that they want you out. Jackson is the only person who is entertaining another idea that we can. Maybe put somebody else on the block and keep you around. This has been their plan before which is that they want to. They want to sort of prop Jackson up as the person who's willing to work with them in the case that they win a competition later and again holly just continuing doing to entertain the idea of keeping Sam around and taking Nicole out instead Jack and Jackson are GonNa talk out in the backyard and Jackson is once again going to pitch to Jack Back. Hey Hey man who's willing to put up Christie. Nobody's willing to put up Christie think about it. WHO's going to put Christiane? Cliff isn't GonNa Precursor Jack. We're not GONNA PUT KRISTA KNICKS NOT GONNA put Christie. Nicole's not going to put Christie up cat jess. They're not gonNA but Christie. Who's GonNa Christie? Ah Maybe maybe we should consider keeping him around as somebody that can put some relief cristiano. Let's say saying that is always saying I'm not. I'm not conspired. I'm not plotting. I'm not plotting against the six. I'm just saying and he is saying but shouldn't be saying to Jack probably not the best idea but Jack isn't gonNA out him. Out immediately weren't really much at all yet. At least Nicole does then check in with Holly. Nothing of much substance here. Holly is going to question a coal about the Bella stuff a bit Nicole is going to mention that she didn't have anything to do with it. She denies a lot of involvement is a lot of talk just checking and just talking about other things. Conversation doesn't go particularly well for Nicole though because after her conversation with Sam Holly is really starting to feel like she she does want to call the gold she just feels like Nicole is holding back and that she can't trust her. She doesn't know where she stands and she's really starting to feel like she wants to put in a call up. She goes to talk to Jackson afterward and she says she did not like her conversation with Nicole. She wants to talk to just try to confirm some of the things that Nicole said and if she catches Nicole in alive and maybe that is the opportunity to put her on the block and send her home so cliff is going to have a brief conversation Asian with Sam Sam tells cliff. lets him know hey. I'm trying to get Nicole on the block. That's my best. Chance of. Staying cliff says all four it man do you do you here for you. I'm here to back you up and cliffs and Sam says I know you're we're here from me. I'm here for you to cliff. We're in this together and they're buddies in buddies cliff playing both sides of this because he's GonNa talk to Nicole and wish her well as well. Holly Holly is going to then go to Christy and Tommy Holly is talking again about taking out Nicole and this is this is a bit of a longer conversation this time holly really considering this really talking about like what if we took out Nicole. Is that really such a bad thing Kristie though pushes back she says that I don't I just feel like you can't leave Sam and Nick in the game together and Tommy again brings up the whole Sam being involved in cliffs nominations. Thing Holly says well. Maybe we should talk to cliff see if he can confirm that. Maybe I need to talk to just to see if she can confirm some of the things that Nicole was saying seeing Nicole is is lying here Christy and Tommy mentioned that they just talked when the call and she says that she's worried about saying too many things and that's why she probably seems reserved and sketchy because she's after what happened with the whole nick and Bella situation. She's kind of gun shy about everything and that's that's probably why they're really trying to protect coal here they again do not want Nicole to go home. They would really love to see Sam go home. They even mentioned holidays like well. If I put in Col- up do you think she would go home and Christie's no definitely not in Tommy's like nope and then you can see Tommy realize that by saying no Nicole wouldn't go home. He's admitting that him in Christie would not would vote against hollies wishes because it wouldn't happen otherwise and he's like well I mean. Probably not she. I don't know holly really should have seen in this moment that things were not looking rates for her here so Chrissy. Let's see those say ultra what ultimately we will support you. If you choose to take your shot we will support you. We know this is not the case but but she is telling holly that it is because of course she's not going to tell holly to her face that she's going to go against her decision. Holly asked them about involvement with Nick that well if I take Samao like what's happening with Nick or you guys working on him. They're like no no no nothing with nick nothing at all. We're definitely not working on trying to pull him in. What are you talking about now? I mean look. We think he's a good guy. You know it's all nothing nothing crazy kirsty yes. He does point out that hey look getting rid of Sam disarms both Nicole and Nick Cole disarms. Nobody Still Sam and Nick in the House together and that's dangerous. They say look. Maybe maybe what we should do is get rid of and call next Nick Nick being such a great guy. Maybe we can take Nicole next week in that can satisfy you. Essentially we know that they don't really want this based on their conversation together. They're really again starting to look at potentially targeting arguing holly and Jackson but of course they're not going to tell holly that so this conversation does not go well for holly after Holly Leaves and Tommy Leaves Christie is gathering some things in walking out the door she she looks up at the camera and she mel's she's very displeased. That holly is trying to pitch to keep Nicole. This is exactly what she was worried about earlier earlier in the day when I when I queued that up she's like this. This is the sign to her. That holly is trying to make a move so she's she's not into it. It's not into it salmon sister GonNa talk even more about getting Nicole on the block cliff and Nicole are going to check in cliff is going to talk about. You know what's going on cliffs. Nicole says he cliff says that we thinks Nicole is good. He does not let her know that Sam is trying to get her on the block. He is trying to say I'm pretty sure you're good pretty good. I think cats going. Nobody's told me Christie told him now he's told me but I think that cats on buck and they you should be fine and even if you did go on the block it would probably be upon still probably go home which is probably the case. Nicole says she's considered going to Jackson Holly and telling them because Christie is said to her so many times that she wants to take shot Jackson so Nicole is considered to Jackson Holly and telling them Hey Christie wants to take a shot at you but she knows because of what happened last time that she would somehow be the one that takes the blame for it and so she's she doesn't want to do it. She just wanted to say anything and so she's kind of just sitting back however you do know that Nicole did go on the block I guarantee you. She goes up to two holly and let's although she would be relying on. Tommy and Christie's voted that point maybe she wouldn't but she talked about that. They also talked about Christie and how she is saying that she wants them on her Dream Team. Her Dream Team Cat Jess Tommy Nicole cliff. That's for Dream Team Dream Team but she tells everybody that they're on her dream. Team can't really trust Christie than she. She goes around. She tells everyone that she's on their side and that she wants other people out <hes> and Nicole's like again. Christie is allowed to do all that I if I said anything like that I would be in so much trouble so they're definitely onto Christie. Their cliff advises patients he says we just I need to wait for this next split. It's common quick and once this next split happens we need to take advantage of it. Scoop up the couple that gets ejected from this group and use them to take out the other four. That's the plan. That's what we have to do. So that's that's cliff Nicole. They're talking cliff explaining the game plan here what they have to do here moving forward to continue to break up the six and break up the power structure. Obviously what this hinting toward is that cliff is going to probably how this is going to play out once Christie takes the shot at Jack and Holly Jackson and holly or if Jackson Holly decide that they want to take the first or whatever it will come. I'm down to cliff things might not happen next week but he does hope that nick would be target over himself Nicole and the rest of them which may or may not be the case but certainly over him Nicole might be the one in danger there but once that happens and then he will be able to probably scoop up Jackson and holly jump on board with them cat would be there just would be there and that team can go after the other side where Jackson Hall you're taking the majority of that heat and he will be able to push forward in the meantime especially if he then has nicole onboard as well that would be cliffs Game Plan. Tommy is going to talk with SIS. They're making banana bread and took them awhile which you know what it does it's happened making banana bread. You Cook it for the amount of time you stick the knife in. They're like still wet so wet in the middle and Cook it way longer what happened so they were waiting for the banana bread finish and Tommy is talking with this more about just like worrying that he's out of the loop worrying that he's out of the loop that he's like. Hey look if holly he wants to do something. At least hopefully she tells us but we're feeling we're we're being left out of the loop here. It's no good it's no good so more more tension building attention building pat is going to talk to Christie and she mentions that cat mentions that she feels like she's going up after her conversation with holly the plan was she goes on the block. She's not really aware of all of the other talks. He's been having after their conversation. Christie says well holly just came to us and was really saying that she doesn't really know what she's doing it. She's not sure and guys like oh I didn't. I didn't realized that and Christie is going to open up quite a bit to cat. She really shouldn't be she tells cat all about how sketchy it is. That holly is doing this and that it's really telling that holly wants to put Nicole on the block Nicole. Call Home and keep Sam around that tells Christy that holly is plotting against her. She's telling all of this to cat. Chrissy also says there's no way she's voting Nicole out of the game no way this is going to join them as well and she she is also going to talk about holly and how sketchy things are looking here so cat armed with all of this information of course is GonNa go straight to Hawley. She doesn't have time to talk to her immediately but she does give her a heads up that people are conspiring the people are talking about her and saying that she sketchy and that she's trying to keep Sam around as a weapon against other people in the alliance she can explain everything later so that's going to free call you out and holly is going to start rushing around being a little bit paranoid in the meantime cliff is going to talk with Jackson. He checks in with Jackson. Just making sure everything's all right. Plan is still set cats going on the block Jackson mentions. You know we're still we're still considering things cliff. You're totally good. You're totally really good but there is one person it's really been pushing for one particular outcome to get sam out out of the game and cliff is like I know what you're talking about. I know you're talking about and Jackson says I I in. Here's the thing cliff I feel like Sam. He's willing to take some shots that can help us out. Maybe some shots at this person that is pushing so hard this person the person being Christie that that maybe he can take some shots at people like Christie and maybe that would work for US cliff cliff says I'm with you and this is staying with me. I won't tell anyone about this because I'm totally with you. I WANNA take that shot too but I can't do it by myself and Jackson's exactly exactly that's why Sam would be useful to us and so- Jackson is like cliff you and me we gotta. We gotta work together other here. We gotta we gotta work together moving forward. This is the way to go because it should. I go talk to Holly's Gal. You know we're we're GONNA. We're GONNA make this happen this thing so again cliff now working with Jackson as as well to take this shot at Christie eventually eventually rob says would be some sweet banana bread if Christie could be undone by cat and Holly Secret pre-game relationships. We'll see how things go. We'll see how things go all right. Jackson is definitely not in cliff because he's been saying the same thing to Jack and he's been saying the same thing to holly this. He's been saying to holly for a long time that he wants. Click on board to take the shot got at at Christie because they do feel like they're at the bottom of the alliance so this is something that Jackson genuinely wants to build so obviously the danger for cliff is that he is playing all sides right now. He's playing all sides. He's playing Jackson side. He's playing the Christie side. He's playing the outcast side and even within the outcast side he's playing two sides. He's playing the Sam side and he's playing the Nicole side and he's playing the cat side and everyone thinks they have him so that could be dangerous for right now. It's working well. He has a lot of information he everybody has told him everything so we'll see how that goes for him. From this point forward cliff is also going to talk with Christie Christie St tells cliff all about this Sam thing and how she's worried about Holly Jackson and how they seem to be wanting to keep Sam to go after go after her potentially and cliff is like Oh yeah you know I did. I did catch and this was savvy savvy of cliff because he he doesn't completely confirm anything that Christie says even though he knows the truth he also doesn't rat Jackson out in the in the sense that it's Jackson Holly what he does is he throws somebody onto the bus that he knows is not part of the plan. He says yeah I heard Jackson I saw Jackson Jack whispering in the backyard earlier and that was the case that Jackson was pitching to Jack about this plan to go against Christie and so of course that concerns Christie who has been doubting Jack a little bit during the day and so she now feels a little bit skeptical of Jack and she needs to go talk to Jack about this and that sets her off about this whole Jack situation so she goes and she talks to Jack and she wants to know like what's the happening in the day she fills him in on all the holly stuff and how he's trying to keep Sam in the game and she feels like Sam is going to take a shot at her and that there's no way they can let Sam Stay Jack Agrees Sam needs to go Sammy's to go a he. He has to be the one that leaves this week but he does not reveal just how anti Kristy Jackson and holly have been pitching him he does not reveal any of that and Christie is later going to be like I felt like Jack was holding back. I felt like he was not telling me some things so a little bit happening there as well a little bit attention forming their I do think that Jack will eventually rat Jackson and Holly <music> out but but he didn't quite do it for now but he is still definitely firmly on board with Christy and Tommy and will be wanting Sam out this week so jack also kind of playing the middle there but a little bit caught on between between both sides as Christie is explaining. This is a pretty funny moment. Christie is like flaws in her as she's explaining that Sam needs to go. She's she's talking about like Oh. He's the worst. The problem with Sam is that he promises everyone his. His life in the game and he's just he's he's so phony and Sam walks right in and she's like and yet it sounds like did I interrupt. She's like no no. You're good and so that conversation Tommy Sam Jess Cliffe Christie and Jack are all in the target room and things are going to blow up a little bit here because because Sam is once again talking like what did I do wrong. I did nothing wrong why me and finally things are going to get talked about a little more. Christie is going to be like well. What about this whole situation ocean where you're campaigning for? Stay and SAM's like I don't. I don't think I was campaigning that hard. Just I mean. Did I campaign very hard to you. Oh I don't want to start anything anything just as like what how dare you bring me into this cl- Sam you did talk to me about keeping Bella. I don't remember I remember campaigning that hard that was nick and nick and Bella were campaign. NATO's chiming in May was chiming in occasionally but I wasn't like campaigning super hard and just like oh no dough. You don't do that. Just S. really bringing out these cysts in her really just like how dare you and Sam. I feel like you're talking to me here jess. I don't like I don't like this and just as like Oh. Oh No no I. I know you say I know you've been trying to target me and this becomes hoping Christie's guys. I didn't want to be this. I didn't want this to be a thing and so as as with most things that involve mostly completely inconsequential most things but ultimately Sam says you know what I'm i. Hi and I'm happy this happened. I'm happy this APP we can clear the air because I was not campaigning that hard for Bella. Maybe something not that hard and Christie also brings up the whole cliff situation you did you. Did you take part in cliffs nominations cliff. Actually AH those were mind. Those are my nomination. Sam didn't have anything to do with. It sounds like I said I'm so glad that we can clear this up in Chris and of course I'm the one that's GonNa have to bring this up to. You and I'm glad I'm glad that big thing happens and holly is able to overhear some of what's going on and and so she is like oh great like now with all this stuff blowing up now they're going to say for sure. We can't keep Sam and I'm getting in trouble cat already gave me the warning. I'm getting in trouble with trying to keep Sam and they think I'm coming after them and now now this blow up is happening and Sam is going to be is can't stay and like all of this stuff is is working against me so she goes and she joins assists and Jackson in the Hammock and she's like I'm so annoyed right now so annoyed and she explains to sis that like people are talking. I'm hearing that people are saying suspicious that like Oh because I'm considering. I'm considering keeping considering in an option and so because I'm considering option now I'm the bad guy and I'm conspiring against people and I'm the one plotting and all of these things now split Blah is happening and Sam is go home anyway and this is not this is not okay. It's not okay and Jackson's like yeah and all this Christie stuff insists Christie. Christie is doubting you a little yeah. That's that is happening that is happening and so this Jackson and Holly Holly venting to sis and Jackson about this whole situation because she was alerted by cat and so she is talking talking about this with sis and Jackson again is very pro keeping Sam so holly feels comfortable venting desists but of course of course the result of this is that this is going to run straight back to Tommy and Christie and let them I know Holly's freaking out she's saying that people are doubting her and all this stuff and she's talking about you kristy and all of this stuff and how you guys are freaking out because she wants to keep Sam and who else is in this conversation. Cat Cat cat is right there when she tells them and so then after cat leaves to go explain this conversation back to Holly Sis. Lets them know yeah. I think it was cat that told them about you. Guys doubting her <hes> and they're like oh boy. So why did you just explain that whole thing in front of cat because now cat runs right back to holly and Jackson and cat tells them yes this just ran over and ratted your entire conversation. She said that you guys is are worried that Tommy Christie are suspicious of you and all of this stuff and they're like sis. Oh my God it was sessile along with Cecil along. They're pissed this and has always hated sis because she's very flirty with the guys and she doesn't like it so they talk about all this. She's she's the one running back and forth. She's trying to keep Sam to keep her numbers and then going back to Christy and Tommy and telling them that we're the ones that are pushing this and that we shouldn't be trusted into everything is getting pinned on sis at this point instead of Christie and so there's all she flirts with all the guys and she flirts with Jackson and it's not okay. It's not okay and so they're they're very very angry with SIS Jackson is going to run to Tommy and be like Tommy. What's it's going on? Are you guys. Are you as mad at us. Are you is like thinking that we're turning like what's happening. No I'm obsessed with you. I would never that's that's not true at all totally not the case. Hey and meanwhile holly Jackson just ruined off without me and he's talking to Tatami himself and I don't like that so holly goes to talk to Tommy and Christie continued to deny feeling any kind of suspicions they're completely denying everything and they blame it. All on cysts all cysts is the cause of all of this sis sis running back and forth she shouldn't be doing that. That's that's no good. We shouldn't assist US wants to keep Sam. That's that's all that's the only reason any of this is happening because this these people they're scape cuts so that gets kind of the lid gets put on that and Holly Jackson talk a little bit again. They are mostly convinced at this point that it is all cysts and this is the problem here and that she's the one they need to worry about. which is this should be news? This should tell them that they should take shot. They should be putting Christie on the block. They should be putting Tommy on the bush. It'd be putting someone on the block. That's not Nicole and not cat this is nick and Bella moment but not happening instead. They're going to have relationship. Drama Hollies Matt Jackson for going to Tommy by himself where you go do you can't just go off and talk by yourself with Tommy. Wait for me Jackson's like Hey. I'm not your dog. Don't Bark at me. What is this so lots of drama lots of drama happening lots of craziness? We're heading into the veto ceremony. Today and things are definitely still enough in the air that things could change things can shift here. The plan still currently is to put cat on the block and send Sam home but with everything that happened last night they could easily wake up this morning and rethink the plan is what's happened before there's still a lot of room to maneuver here and and they definitely need to be taking a shot. They definitely need to think about this because if they if they put Christie on the block next to next to Sam they certainly feel that they have cliff whether or not they actually had them they probably would I mean we'll see that would definitely behoove cliffs so I could definitely see cliff siding with them. Cliff would vote for them. They could easily of course pull nick nick would come to their side because they're saving Sam they have. They have Jackson and they just that's five votes. That's all they need. They can take out whoever they want. This is their opportunity. This is absolutely their opportunity and they need to take wishaw because these guys are coming for them real fast and they have they have way enough information to know this by now. It's the exact same spot. Nick and Bella were in a couple of weeks ago and and they need to do it but they haven't even considered that the thing they're considering is should we take out. Nicole instead is Nicole the right option so even if she does flip around to not to not putting cat on the block Nicole is is the person she would put on the block and Nicole would stay if she put up Nicole Christy and Tommy would keep Nicole Sam would go home and it would literally be the exact same things the nick and Bella Week where they put up. Nicole is a back door and then the rest of them Nicole so dumb. I don't know why they think that would work the same exact thing that you guys did to other people and you'd think it's GonNa work this time. Why so dumb but more than likely it's going to be cat? Everything's GonNa be smooth and this tension is going to continue to build as these two sides of the six continued to talk crap about each other and all of this stuff I guarantee to you if cat goes on the block Christie's narrative in her head is going to be Oh thank God they almost took the shot at us but we convinced them we convinced them not to and now we need to take the shot because we're not going to get away with uh without again. It's GONNA literally. It's going to be the same thing that happened with nick in Vela so we'll see we'll see what happens here from this point forward but lots lots of crazy stuff rob says don't bark at US terron. It's funny because I'm saying the diary room works works on these big brother streets right as I said lots of stuff going down. It was a good day good day good week. Things are looking up. Things are looking up for now. Lots attention here all right so that's what we had for today long update a probably a good thing that I was on my own today. There's a lot to get through and a lot of detail to get through so thank you guys so much for joining me. Make sure you come and join me on twitch twitch DOT TV slash Karen Armstrong John. I'm sure there's going to be some interesting stuff on the feeds today so I would I would look out for maybe myself going live on twitch for maybe the veto ceremony your previous to the veto ceremony were after the ceremony who knows but if you go to twitch dot TV slash Aaron Armstrong didn't the follow button then you'll be alerted if I go live and that's when you know things are kicking off on the feeds we gotTa Watch so as makes you do that and then of course tonight is going to be the roundtable at nine pm Eastern Eastern. We're going to rate all of these players. We'll talk about the week as a whole and and all that stuff should be a lot of fun and make sure you check out the survey that will be released on my twitter at Armstrong Taryn today after this podcast and I will tweet it out and penance on the top of my twitter so you can take shake it there. You can read the players yourselves you can the season you can read the week you can do all kinds of great stuff so check all of that out tune in tonight and of course we'll be back tomorrow morning eleven A._M.. Eastern up everything that happens today on the big brother twenty-one.

Christie Talk Christie cliff Nicole Sam Sam Holly Jackson Christie Tommy Jack Jess Tommy Nicole cliff holly Nick Tommy Holly Holly Tommy Holly Nick Nick Jackson Christy Nicole Jess Kristie Jackson Jackson Holly Sam Holly Christy holly Christine
Interview with Holly Duckworth: Overcoming Leadership Stress Through Mindfulness

3X Value Growth

09:09 min | 8 months ago

Interview with Holly Duckworth: Overcoming Leadership Stress Through Mindfulness

"Welcome everyone to another episode of the three x value growth podcast. My name is Kerry Sol's Value Growth Advisor and author of the bestseller. Multiply your business value in three steps. The three x value growth podcast is a forum for you to hear from experts. Who can help your business to ensure that you can reach your full potential tune-in to hear from these experts. About what owner led companies need now to break the code on maximizing the value of their business in any economy? I'm coming to you from New Hampshire and as always I start with a piece of New Hampshire Trivia the two points. I just wanted to make today have to do with who we are. The State of New Hampshire is often known as the granite state. So that's our nickname. And in addition you probably have seen it on our license plate but our New Hampshire motto is live free or die. So that's just trivia about Hampshire ends since there's so many interesting things about in Hampshire. I figure we can add a little bit each episode but today I am joined by Holly Duckworth. Welcome Holly Hello Carrie. Thanks for having me when Moore Trivia piece for you as New Hampshire is one of my states. I haven't yet visited and I can't wait to get there. Oh you've been you've gotTa treat store absolutely whether you come in the spring for Maple sugaring you come in the fall for the leaves or anytime for the mountains. It's a great place for you to you. Have to come here definitely. Where are you calling from? I'm calling in from Denver Colorado Colorado Mountains of your own so we do but every mountain brings its own magic energy. You've got that right definitely before we get started. Let me give our audience a little bit of background about you. Holly Holly Duckworth believes we are human beings not human doings as CEO of Leadership Solutions International. She teaches leaders. How to bridge the personal practice of mindfulness into your profitable business culture. She's the founder of the C. Suite Network Mindful Leadership Council and she's also a New York Times contributor and the producer and host of the everyday. Mindfulness show thank you holly. You are a busy woman we'll carry. Thanks for inviting me on the show. It's an exciting time for growing mindfulness. My ideal client is really a CEO or an executive that in these dynamic and transformative times. They're feeling overwhelmed exhausted. Or maybe they're feeling alone now. We've got a certain percentage of our workforce Working from home so mindfulness is really the practice of being present in the moment and it helps these overwhelmed executives. Whole that's perfect. You just gave me the lead into the title that we wanted to really be digging deeper into of overcoming leadership stress through that mindfulness. So when you're thinking about who is experiencing this who would be your target audience that could identify with what you just described. You know generally say my ideal client is someone who works in an industry that is twenty four seven and hugs so while at mindfulness will serve anyone. It's generally someone who maybe already has a mindfulness practice visiting meditation affirmations. But they're overwhelmed. They're exhausted and they're looking to bring mindfulness practices into that state of overwhelm. Then my second question holly is. What problem. Are you actually solving for these businesses for these owners right now more than anything? So many of us have lost that long term vision with all of these economic changes creating economic uncertainty. We may have started. Twenty twenty with a twenty twenty business plan. We thought we were going to produce this many widgets or impact this many customers right now working with CEOS in executive teams to create that vision again and bring them back in the focus of what we can control and what we can contract rather than what maybe could be. Let go for now and in that contact with who you're speaking with. What are the typical symptoms of that that you see owners experiencing or that? They're talking about right now. Curtain loved this question. I've been interviewed. So many podcast executives have never been asked this and I think it speaks to the feeling nature that right now we need to get back into our bodies in someone that is having these symptoms may just not be sleeping at night. They may feel isolated or exhausted. Maybe they're working long hours and they're finding themselves distance from family or friends so with that in mind. What do you see? The most common mistake said these owners and executives are making when they try to fix this on their own. Mistakes often are rushing to judgment the idea of reacting versus responding and so I think one of the key things that we can do as mindful leaders going forward is take that extra Merwin to grieve to relax to center to focus. Maybe listen a little bit. Not only to our own intuition. But the intuition and the data of our teams to create those focus results that are going to get this economy spinning forward in the right. Perfect time okay then building on that holly. What is one valuable free action that you can suggest that owners could take right now on their own. I'm really loved this as well. There's you know we talk about breathing grounding in centering but right now I think it's feeling into your own intuition. That's free and can get really clear about what is it that you are feeling. And how do you WANNA put your energy in motion so one of the things that I do is really invite people in my book in my work to to set a daily intention practice and maybe just keep a little a little journal at your desk today? My intention is peace. My intention is joy. My intention is calm and each and everyday practice and you just answered. That question was how in that just keeping the journal of it and being conscious that that's what you wanna be doing each day. That's great so in addition with your plethora of resources. What's one valuable free resource that you could recommend that our audience turned to that you offer working one thing. I wanted to share his. Don Holly Duckworth DOT COM under shop. It is free however. There's a little tab. There that says mindful mini posters. And this is an eight a half by eleven one sheet that goes over the seven practices to be mindful leader. No matter what your industry organization so it starts that idea of intention setting but then gives you a little practice each and every Dan that's under Holly Duckworth Dot Com under shop again. It's a complimentary gift from me. Undermined flamini posters terrific. Thank you for that. And Holly before we close out. My last question has to do with what questions should I have asked you? And didn't what would be that question? And what would be your answer. You know I I again. I think you have such a great great show. Harry you know one of those questions beyond breathing in great now. There's this a real focus on breathing. What's one other practice? You could do? No beyond breathing in gratitude. And I think right now it is that practice of century take a moment every day and remember your center that very first day took this job you start your career that passion that excitement and continue to grow that practice because that will keep you in the present moment with passion that will create prophets piece in presents for your company. That's a great one definitely. Thank you Holly Ductwork for joining me. Here on the three value growth podcasts. If such a privilege to have you and thank you for taking the time you're welcome initially set for the three x value. Growth guest is to make critical information available to owners of private businesses. That will help them easily. Multiply the value business. The three x value system we offer leverage is proprietary analytics platform and client portal to address quantitative performance. Excellence in risk factors to increase EBA to learn how you can multiply the value business threefold in just three years checkout three value growth dot com forward slash model for free pediatric. You'll be invited to attend our next demo of the three X. Valuable Program on a free monthly Webinar of what works in the lower market. Thanks FOR CHECKING OUT. Three hundred ninety. Good podcast if you like what we're doing here head on over to Apple Pie past and subscribed leave us a review or rate us. It's very much appreciated.

Holly Holly Duckworth Holly New Hampshire Value Growth Advisor Holly Duckworth Dot Com Don Holly Duckworth CEO Hampshire New Hampshire Trivia executive C. Suite Network Mindful Leade Kerry Sol Denver Colorado Twenty twenty CEO of Leadership Solutions In New York Times EBA Curtain
Big Brother 21 Saturday Sept 21 Morning Update

Reality TV RHAP-ups: Reality TV Podcasts

1:53:44 hr | 1 year ago

Big Brother 21 Saturday Sept 21 Morning Update

"Every morning morning Gary Yes again all this John I and GM Sandy. You said that he could tomorrow. We'll do it again. Low everyone and good morning welcome to our live update of four September twenty second into the twenty first because it's not a proper update today. I'm your host. Armstrong and I'm here to not not only update you on what happened yesterday which I can tell you now not a whole lot going on but also I am here to be to to recap to recap recap the first of the final three and their games across the whole season of big brother twenty-one today I will be talking about holly and what she has done throughout the season week-to-week how she got here and everything thing in between so that's what we'll be talking about. I mean I can get it out of the way right now. Not Not much going on the feeds yesterday they're just waiting for part two. We did get one thing about part two. There was a brief leak about part two of the final all three eight zero wage competition. It's very clear that this leak is that this competition is some kind of day's competition which actually is pretty relevant to holly because she's not great days and so depending on on the difficulty of this competition. It looks like there are something around five maybe twelve slots with days labeled abled on them if she has trouble with that which she has in the past and we may see. Nicole take home part two of the final three H which may or may not be a good thing for holly to be honest but there may be a physical component to it that we that we can't really see yet so that may give holly an advantage but beyond that there's not much to to update that you want we will be seeing the feeds go down. Today I imagine for this. Vida are this part of the competition the and and then we'll hopefully get the results some point later tonight and then we'll have an idea of of what we're looking at tomorrow morning so we'll see we'll see but in the meantime let's take a look at Holly's game for Big Brother twenty-one. Do you guys ready. I didn't get any water rationing water. These are these are a lot. Let's do this so holly. Only enters the game in a different way than most people do. She came main with pre existing relationship. She knew cat cat now. Allegedly they strategized before we're entering the house they planned on playing separate games but secretly working together and allegedly part of potentially removing somebody from the cast and Christie entering as an alternate that was is more cat in the Hawley but they were and they did confirm this bit on the feeds in contact prior to sequester and and and planning things out before the show so she comes in with this massive advantage obviously and she gets into the house us immediately you got you got the camp director twists and she does eventually support Jackson's campaign for Camp Director. She was not chosen for banishment and then Christie is going to win the first. Hr Wage Christie is going to nominate cat and cliff with cat as the initial target so not a great start for holly there in terms of her secret connection. But what are you. GonNa do grateful as an alliance is it's four a primary member of it but she was brought into it and and that is going to be one of the most important part parts of her game involvement within grateful. She is developing relationships in particular with Jackson. She has one cat she develops one with Christie as well in that relationship with Christie is going to be the most important to her especially in these early weeks. She also developed one with system this but that is kind of on the back burner. I it doesn't really develop until a little bit later now. Kristie she's targeting cat but bell is going to Bella and she does some Bella ing and she throws Cami under the bus and gets gets can be targeted as the back door target targets now off cat onto that's perfect for Bella perfect for holly and the week is looking looking a lot better at that point. Now cat is with Jackson cat has has developed a relationship with Jackson that they are making Jackson's mother uncomfortable. I guess what Jackson might describe it as and and she doesn't love Jackson's relationship with Bella because at this time Jackson Bella were very tight. They were talking about moving in together. It was an so cat is actually gonNA get into Holly's ear about Jack and Jackson and how Vella told Jack Bella told her cat the Jackie Jackson have a final two and so Bella can't be trusted and so Bella should be the one that's going down not not coming. That's what cat thinks. All is convinced all right. I'm antibiotics now. She's in my lines but I'm I'm skeptical of her now. Remember Bella Holly has this. I always used to confuse Bella and holly with the names and now I'm doing it again now. Holly is concerned about Bella within this group of a grateful and holly is going to bring that Anti Bella Narrative to SIS and start spreading reading the Anti Bella narrative that comes from cat because her relationship with Jackson Holly is also going going to be a little bit Aunty Jack in these early weeks this early week in particular holly as I said has a relationship with Jackson. You can tell immediately that Jackson has by the time the feeds come up Jackson has already moved on from cat and he would prefer to be with holly and holly really is is into that as well. They're both flirting bit and holly is trying to pull Jackson away from Jack. Jack was Jackson's primary relationship. Asian ship has primary alliance but Jack had betrayed Jackson in small way by telling Christie about Jackson's relationship with Kat and Jackson Jackson wasn't fond of that so holly was using that to pull Jackson away from Jack and toward herself and and that's that that was something that it did succeed now as you all know at this time. Kristie is freaking out most of the week. One one freak out in particular is going to happen when she sees Jack Talking to me she's like why is he talking to Kenny and so so she starts to second guess the plan to back door Cami and so all of this is happening so holly trying to pull Jackson away from Jack led to Jackson talking to Christie talking about how he doesn't doesn't want to be seen as too close to Jack to close to holly to close to cat and dog in Christie's mind that she's too close to Jack and so she starts pulling away from Jack and it's a a whole big mess and and that's that's part of what's happening there. Then cat has a a bit of a freak out and gets in trouble with Jack now the whole situation with Jack and Cammie talking cat got involved moved and ended up relaying information to Christie and back to Jack and ends up getting in trouble with Jack. This is a very uncomfortable conversation that we witnessed early in the the game really let us know who we were dealing with with. Jack right away as he really just intimidate like she's trying to get information. What what are you saying. I I so so that's that's happening there. It gets her in trouble with jacket. Gets her in trouble with Jackson and that's that's a big mess but Jack has been pushing for nick to go out because it because because Christie is now like no. I don't want to do Cami Jack. Jack is now like okay well. Let's do nick instead and I can hardly have been convinced by Jack by this whole narrative to to to want nick out as well. They are on board. Let's take nick out wine not and he's close to Bella Bella. They were already anti Bella L. and now they're also anti nick and nick is more threatening between Naked Bella anyway so let's get nick out. That's what they were want to start pushing. At this point this is what holly and cat are going to talk about holidays. Holly is upset is upset because of the guys in the house are always talking about about how beautiful cysts is like. I'm right there. I'm standing right there and they're talking about how beautiful sisters and I'm like. Hello you know that makes me feel and cat says hall. You were a beautiful older woman. Oh no I didn't mean it like that. Oh no no the start of something of little. Did we know how much of a storyline this would end up being throughout the season so in the meantime Christie is ultimately going to decide against back door and Cami in no small part due you too to nick in some ways and also Nicole and that means that cat will be going home that that is going that is the backup plan that holly may be losing cat right away not much influence over the situation. She did try to push nick but it's not happening so Christie has decided cats going home however by a stroke of luck when she checks in with Sam Sam weirdly and adamantly wants to save cliff with the veto and because he wants to save cliff with Vito they need to come up with some kind of alternative target because if Christie is putting another person on the block and they're they're the ones that are going to have to go home and so sam suggests lovie and just like that over his up on the block and he is the target for the week. Holly is fine with this. It's not that it wasn't what she wanted but she thinks it's smart takeout lovie good throughout this the black widows are going to start forming as we know the all female alliance consisting of Jess Bella can can me and Nicole now as they form they talk about how they don't trust cat and Holly. They're not trustworthy. They shouldn't include them in the black widows plan so that should be really easy except just was involved in the black widows plan and I am. Bella was which let's be real. Both of them were a split at some point but just the one that's going to eventually spill not eventually pretty much immediately spill women's power thing and pichit to cat and holly who as Nicole and Cammie suspected were not on board and did not want to work with the women in fact they said let's let's target them soon. That's no good we don't like it. In the meantime again. Still Holly is growing closer to Jackson ax and she tells him that he needs to be nicer to people one of the things and we'll talk about this. When we get to Jackson one of the things that I was really reminded reminded of was that Jackson has really undergone a transformation both physically and personality wise for all for as much as we made fun of Jackson for like trying to be more relatable and in less of a pompous douchebag he he was a totally different person back in the early weeks he was ripped and he was aggressive like real aggressive and mean to people it like the Jackson of today would be way more subtle about this. It's very strange. It was very strange to go back and watch these feeds but but holly is telling him in Holly. I assume is part of that. Influence unique to be nice to people and Jackson starts to be nicer the people he starts to be nicer to people and so when when Chemi says that she's not targeting Jackson anymore all like you're welcome that that's that's because I told you to be nice to her. Jackson and cat in the meantime are having issues him in holly are continuing to flirt alert and cat is aggressively flirting. I guess you could say especially with a little bit of alcohol. In the mix. All over Jackson might be a way to describe it and he is not really into it anymore and and cat is blaming holly. She is upset with holly because she feels like Kali is getting in between her and Jackson in that relationship is going to start to get a little bit tense but that's going to be the end of the week Lovie as a victim. Holly is a vote to evict lovie and that's the end of week one so in summary in week. One holly was brought into grateful. The sixers were also formed in this week attentively because of this anti nick and Bella stuff that happened cat was a part of that nick himself self was part of that just nick and Bella being super sketchy in general was a big part of it ultimately a lot of people did end up blaming Bella for the Cami stuff but that's why they formed the six shooters and excluded nick and Bella from their initial alliance so holly was brought into those lines. She was not a key component of them but she was brought in. She did maintain her secret pre-game. Lyons with cat which is a bit of Iraqi situation at the moment she does have a lucio like low key sa- showman's as Jackson accent pulls him away from Jack a bit she works on her relationship with both Tommy and Christie and insist to a degree as well and and that's really what she's doing in the first week pretty good stuff from her in general. It's one of her stronger weeks. I think that she she was social enough off and likable enough that she got involved in the core alliances she had good relationships with a few different people in the house at this point in time she's targeting. Bella Ella Nick and Cammie not a Cami fan holly is she's being targeted by nobody. Nobody's coming holly at this point in the game and she's in a pretty good spot fought her influence over the weeks outcome though pretty negligible she she wanted Bella or nick to be targeted. She did not really want how to be targeted or especially didn't want cat to be targeted but she wasn't really doing anything to influence the outcome of the week or anything that she attempted to do was was was shut down and didn't go anywhere so no influence over the week but but in general in a pretty good spot so heading into week two. Jack is going to win the next H H and immediately jack wants to back door or nick. He's ready to go. Let's do this. He had been pushing for Nick to be back toward the previous week so he wants to make this happen. Let's Back Door Nick Jackson though tells them you can't do that. Camp Comeback is in play. David has joined the House lovie. Never left and so grateful needs to stick together man gotTa happen. Holly is starting to be can become concerned that her meet shield isn't actually a shield and that she's more of a target than he is to the women now remember holly is targeting the women of black widows in particular. Bella and Cami and she's concerned that they're targeting her and she's concerned that they're not going to target Jackson before her which is part of the point of being Jackson's these big dude. He's going to be a target ahead of her but he seems to have a good enough social game that she's concerned that she's going to be the target so this is when and this another thing that surprised me going back and looking at holidays early game you know we talk a lot about how much trash talking of Tammy there was. I forgot just how much I didn't. I didn't remember holly being that big of a part of it but she's he's constantly trash-talking Cami and really a lot of the women but in particular Cami. It's ridiculous. I don't understand where this comes from this. I completely forgot about with this but this was the conversation between cat and holly where they're like. Can Me Sto worst. Oh Geez terrible. Did you see what she said. She was calling US pretty. She's always calling US pretty how dare she unbelievable and constantly trashed on. I don't understand it. is still targeting. Bella and so holidays as well and there but despite this trash talking taking this mutual bonding of trashing Cami there is still tension building with the Jackson situation as Jackson prepares to end eventually does his break up with cat look. I got to be selfish for the first time in my life and this is for both of our benefits. It's it's really me taking one for the team but I'm also being selfish so what we gotta do and cat is not pleased and she blames holly. She thinks that holly has the one that got in the middle here and pulled Jackson away from her. She tries to talk with holly about it and holly is just like I don't have the energy for this cat. Ah just don't know the energy for your now and so that goes on the back burner for a little while in the meantime grateful is going to get together and discuss the plan plan is Jack is GonNa Nominate Chemi and Jess getting rid of Tammy and cat will be used as upon for four whichever one of the people come down off the block if they do come down off the block but Cammie is the main target here here. She just his cooking so she's got to go as holly's relationship with deteriorates though it does offer some benefit she starts to socialize more with others in the house relationship with this really starts to blossom. She gets even closer with Jackson. She talks more with Tommy and her social game again starts to expand a bit more in in in a good way because it had been it had been shrinking a bit and that's really going to be the story of hollies game is that she she's. She's a social enough person she does. She does well when she's not locked into into a couple of people that we saw that in the first week however as she really hones in on relationships in particular the one with Jackson as we'll talk about throughout the game name her peripheral vision with relationships really starts to shrink and she starts to neglect other relationships and focus in on the the particular people that she is is with and so in this time that mcat was a big part. If that is well she really honed in on a lot in the first half of the game but because she was kind of fighting with her horizons did expand a bit more this week interrelationship with this got really tight so holly does though eventually go back and talk with cat about her relationship with Jackson and essentially gets the go-ahead from cat. You're good to engage go for so green light on Jackson meantime. Sam's GonNa win. The veto grateful agrees Comey's done. She's he's out Cami. Nicole do try to work on Jackson. Holly trying to turn them against nick and Bella but before that can really bear any any fruit cliff notes going to be exposed which really builds momentum toward the end of the week and eliminates khanates any other sort of momentum building moments throughout the week holly and cat fully make up by the end of the week. They say that they have something really valuable. People in this game and it's made even better made even more valuable because now everyone assumes that they don't like each other because they didn't like each other for a good portion of the week but because because they knew each other outside of the house they can come together. Pretend they still don't like each other separate themselves out and work the house so nick though starts to push Nicole to target holly in cat nick the relationship between Nick and Bella and holly is has has deteriorated rapidly since since week one when Hawley wanted to target nick and Bella. She's not really been working on that relationship. Ever since and nick has kind of caught onto that he wants to put holly and cat his target would be cat but he wants Tali up on the block next to her. I think he sees a little bit of their relationship. Anything's that Hollywood good pond to put up next to hat so he starts pushing that on Nicole Christie is going to over here Jackson Holly talking about a four which which is the four with Jack and cysts. It's not an official Ford's very informal four but it does set Christie off a bit and makes her a little bit suspicious of Jackson and Holly. This is one of the instigating factors that eventually leads toward the schism that occurs within the six shooters between between Christie and Jackson and holly she she was she was Aunty Jack. Tom's always there to pull Jack in Tommy was not there to pull Jackson and holly in quite as much and so Christie's vitriol is eventually going to be targeted toward Jackson Holly of that crew that she feels like she doesn't want to trust too much now. Holly Does resist a few attempts to flip the vote on just to keep Cami but but ultimately Li it was it was a doomed attempt to begin with and so cammie will be evicted and holly will be a vote to evict her summary this week. Holly is full on Showman's L. Manson Jackson at this point. She managed her relationship with cat which is quite rocky by the end of the week. He's back on board. She does start to get closer to assist but her other relationships are are starting to falter including her relationship with Nick and her relationship with Christy hollies targeting at this point Chemi Bella and nick and holly is being targeted by nick indirectly through neck obviously Bella to a degree and potentially SAM. This is your first sense of any kind of danger potentially being put on the block by people in House Holly's influence on this week's outcome is that that she did turn down and already doomed attempt at a vote flip but in general she wasn't really involved too much in the direction of the week she was just managing her own personal relationships relationships and and so forth so heading into week three nick is going to win the HR wage Jackson caster rogue vote during the eviction and and he is going to try and pin that on Nicole Holly doesn't and have too much involvement in that apart from the fact that she just knows about it. Nick is going to want to make a move on Jack but again camp comeback can't do with so there's another factor as well though Chemi called Nick and Bella out in her eviction speech and that really freaked nick and Bella out and really made them pull back into grateful. I've as the four support if if there are people outside of have grateful attacking them then they're going to need grateful moving forward so that was another deterrent to flip on the alliance so Holly Jackson at this point are going to start hooking up and Jackson Asks Nick for shower time to which nick is like. Oh yeah boy nick all right cliff and Nicole at this point in the game figure out grateful they figure it out there like holy crap. It's Jackson Holly. Jack Says Nick Bella Christie Tommy Damn it damn it. How do we break this up. That's bad ad that's bad group. What can we do about this. A Nicole feels like she's split in the middle of the nick and holly divide and this is why it's relevant to holly now. Nicole has been as I said unique has been pushing Nicole to to put holly on the block and Nicole whole feels like she has an okay relationship with polly because as I mentioned before Cami and Nicole were trying to flip holly against nick and Bella and so Nicole feels in the middle of that she doesn't know which side to go with she ultimately decides she's GonNa make a play on holly and so she goes to holly she throws nick under the bus and cries to holly and holly takes the bait she says Oh yeah nick is terrible. We all see it. We're all gunning for him. Don't worry about it. Nicole Nicole is GonNa take that information and use it in an attempt eight to flip nick right before the nominations almost works but backfires backfires he does not decide to nominate Jack or or Jackson. Those would have been the two he nominated with this information. He thought about it but he decided against it and then Tommy recognized that something was wrong. He really dug into this situation. He he finds out what happened that Nicole spilled old some information and he quickly starts to work to scapegoat. Nicole and undeniable happens the whole situation now despite Jackson and Holly's claims to the contrary in recent days on the feeds. They were both very very very active participants in the undeniable blow up holly in fact was the one to tell Jack to you shut the door and Nicole's face and Jackson as I mentioned four of aggressive energy hitting things the crap people in the military now this let's go the whole situation is is very you know. I thought it would be more fun to watch knowing that Nicole survived this and got back at them and like almost everyone in that room was evicted but no it was still still pretty disgusting to be honest. I really really didn't enjoy it too much so everything is getting blamed on Nicole. Holly Holly is disgusted by Nicole. She can't believe she lied to her. Nicole is now the new that's a Dan Geese sling right there. That's a Dan Kiessling. She's Vanessa Rousso oh. She lied about her grandmother. We know what happened there. afterward. Nicole is going to start defending herself with Tom. Uses chaperone and Christy and Tommy eventually decide that they actually really believe Nicole in that Bella and nick were probably in the wrong and now it's important to remember. Nicole was lying paying for most of this or at least a good portion of this she was actively trying to split grateful up and she was relaying information formation to both sides both the things she was saying. We're the truth but it was with malicious intent ultimately Christy and Tommy convince the rest of six shooters that what Nicole was saying about Bella and nick was true because what she was saying about them was true true and that she probably did not have malicious intent so nicole successfully slides out from under that and six years decides that they're going to keep Nicole and blindside Bella and nick cyst though not a fan of this plan and this was not fully convinced. She wants to stay with Nick. She doesn't want to betray him. She feels like she can be himself around her around him. She tells this to Holly Holly tries and fails to real her back in but this is having none of it eventually. Tommy is the one that's going to real real cysts in going to succeed where holly failed. There's another blow up that happens in the meantime between cat and Jackson this time about the diary room and trash talking each other and all of that stuff which of course means more tension in between her and holly which eventually gets smoothed over again as they bond by trash-talking Chemi and talk about how much they hate chemi and how is the most I entitled person ever and she's GonNa look so bad to America Chemi. She's so terrible and cat describes that she messed with water-bottle. Oh it's going to be so funny in in the meantime. Kemis doing literally nothing to these two other than calling them pretty. I guess six shooters at this point wants to ditch cat. They're done on with her. They're out. They're out on. Her Jackson is in a fight with her. Jackson wants to dump her. He's already dumped her in one way dumper strategically as well and the rest of six shooters. I also want to get rid of her. They don't trust her. She's a wildcard they're not into it but holly has a pregame connection with cat and she uses that to help safer. She says look. I have a lot of mutual friends. She can't betray me can't happen a lot of people although we would. We'd be mad at her. We can trust her telling you can trust cat and so all right fine. We'll keep cataracts. We'll keep her mostly in the loop at this point that holly. Let's cat pat no hey. There's a big alliance but don't worry you're not on the hit list and they're breaking up soon. You're going to target nick and Bella Bella. Were part of the alliance is going to break up the alliance boom. This is also so when they talk about how much they hate. The Camp Comeback People those Camp Comeback People. They're like a bunch of animals. They are a bunch of animals. There's so messy ESI knowing that the worst we hate guys recall recall. The David was probably the cleanest person in that house. I was so surprised at how much trash holly was talking about. These people not into it Holly Nick. Sam and Bella wanted to make a move against holly at this point. They WANNA take call the out. She is their main target right now. She she is the person who is putting the least amount of work in with them and and they want to work with Tommy and Christie so basically Nick Sam and Bella at this point point Sam Sam has been informed by Bella that that grateful exists and and so they're trying to pull Tommy and Christie away from Jack Jackson Bella Holly and insists and their target would be Ali and Christie in the meantime are also getting annoyed with Jackson Holly because Tommy figured out that Tali told cat about grateful cat was very bad at hiding the fact that she knew grateful existed and Tommy quickly. We figured it out and went to holly and was like did you tell us tell about grateful and all he was like oh I think she knew and so they're not super pleased about that and and that relationship again is going to continue to deteriorate between Christie and the pair era of Jackson and holly at the end of the week cliff is going to be addicted. Hollywood vote to a victim so in summary Holly gives up some information that nearly blows up in her face to Nicole instead it blows up into Cole's face. She got lucky there as you really focuses because there's in on cat and Jackson. Holly's relationship with this Christy and Tommy Bells start deteriorating relationship with Bella. Sam and Nick is really starting to deteriorate to point to the point where they are now targeting her. She also loses Nicole as a work in the allied to the events of undeniable Nicole is is no longer talking with holly and she also gives cat information that blows up in her face a little bit so a lot of attempted moves here bye holly almost all of them blowback in her face and she's in a much worse position than she was the week before at this point in the game she is targeting. Nick Bella Sam Cam and Nicole because Nicole how dare she betray her like that. Holly is being targeted by Nick Bella and SAM. I am pretty directly. At this point her influence on the weeks outcome was a fairly minor she had obviously that that minor role in the undeniable blow blow up and then was a participant of it but in terms of the decision to keep Nicole or cliff. It wasn't really her call that was more Christy and Tommy thing so heading into week. Four cliff has been advocated what he's still in the game camp comeback and Jackson Holly. He tried to tell cliff. Hey this is all part of the plan now. Holly wasn't really involved in any of this but Jackson has made an alliance with cliff called the southerners or something along those lines ends that holly is involved with and so they're trying to do damage control with cliff because they just voted him out and they tell him this is all part of the plan. You go win that battle back. It's GonNa be great and cliff is not amused. Get Out of here. Cliff does though win the battle back. He also goes on to win the H. Cliff is in power. It's time for power shifts. Jackson and holly discuss a plan for Jackson to volunteer as a pawn because they know that Christie has a power that can help save them if they need. It all encourages this plan. She tells els Jackson to go up on the block. As upon then in one of the more interesting turn of events during holidays game she goes to cat and says that she's thinking about letting Jackson go that. She thinks maybe he's not really benefiting her game and he should leave. He's going to volunteer for the block and this may be an opportunity cap. That bill says now why would you do that. We need him. We can get him later. Don't worry about it so that idea comes into goes. Jack Jackson go up on the block and Jackson is going to win the veto which means that Christie can use her power and we'll use her power but she doesn't want to use her power and that's important so Jackson is GonNa it'd be pressuring Christie and to using it because obviously she should use it and cat is very happy. Holy Cow Cat is very happy because because this means that bell is going home. Kristie is going to use the power bell is going to go home rates holly though doesn't want to go home. She would rather nick go home. She thinks nick is as the bigger target so that's what holly is. GonNa push but again unsuccessfully colleen Jackson then get into a big fight about having sex sex on camera they have not quite figured out the whole situation and what to do about got it and so they get into the big big fight. She makes fun of his APPS and he says how dare you. I would never do that to you. I'm done no more. I'm going to make the call for us. Both I mean if you don't want to have cameras then. I don't know what the point of this is. If you'RE GONNA make fun of my apps and like you say you eating disorders in exhibited I just I'm not talking about it done. Please talk taught me no undocking it's over. No Jackson means dock as we shop. Don't do this. No nobody nobody makes fun of my abs gets away with eventually make up after they finally I only makeup but in the meantime before they make up holly. Does complain to a few people to Tommy and to cat about Jackson is doing and cat. Says says he's terrible you shouldn't on this cat is like having that moment where she's like. I knew it don't worry we can take him out later. It's going to be fine. We're GONNA WE'RE GONNA work together. It's going to be great cat is very pleased but then Pauline Jackson make up and and when when when they do that Jackson starts talking about how you know I've been. I've been feeling really good about cat lately. I feeling feeling good about that one. I feel like maybe we should keep around. colleagues hold on just Jackson you shouldn't trust cat and so for the first time in the game holly is going to rat cat out to Jackson and tell Jackson that he can't trust cat cat is just trying to make him feel comfortable in wants to cut him later later. You should be careful around her so she went from the beginning of the week going to cat saying maybe it's time to let Jackson accent go to getting into a big fight with them too low now. It's turned around and she is a bit more with Jackson then cat at this point it goes. You gotta be very careful with these people. Now we are going to take a quick break for our sponsors and we'll be right back and we're back so let's get back to the show. Christie in the meantime is pasted Jackson for trying to strong earn entries and the power and she wants to target him mm-hmm and Holly. She says if Jackson hadn't won this veto she wouldn't use the power and they would have just gotten rid of Jackson. Hands Down and so turns out was a bit of a must win for him. So cat is going to fan. Those flames cat hat is now firmly. anti-jackson does want Jackson gone soon when she said to holly. Don't we'll take Jackson later. She didn't mean super later she meant soon and when when Holly- got into the fight with Jackson that really accelerated your timeline even more and so now cat is really pushing to get get Jackson out soon. This will not only help her take out Jackson but it will also help break up. The big alliance cat is also going to be talking with cliff about this as they coordinate their strategies to make sure that Christie and Jackson are against each other that is part of what cliff is doing when he makes the deal with Christy. All of that is going down behind the scenes cat is also going to try and turn holly against Jackson but at this point it's too late and holly is now defending Jackson to cat holly confides insists. That cat is trying to turn her against Jackson but she thinks the cat is lying to her and she's not a fan. Tommy insists are going to discuss disgust taking Jackson out and and the split in the six shooters is really starting to be exposed bit as as Tommy says Christie are starting to think about targeting Jackson. Holly and Holly is a little bit unaware at this point so oh Kevin Jackson getting into another big fight right before Bella is victim there wasn't attempts to flip the vote that Holly Jackson considered but ultimately declined which is important to know heading into the next week so Bella is addicted. Holly is victor so in Summary Week four all he spends a lot of time again on the cat and Jackson drama this his point really just leading a lot of the game passer-by she's spending so much time and energy into cat and Jackson this whole situation that the game is being played around her and her alliances and allies are starting to move on without her and start to even in some cases target her and her show romance. Most of relationships are faltering at this point. Holly is targeting Nick. Sam and Nicole because Bella is leaving so that's is. GonNa take out one of her targets. She's being targeted by a lot of people actually a Lotta. People are starting to target Jackson heading into this next week. A lot of people go from six shooters and others as well. She would be a secondary target next to Jackson she would go on the block with Jackson probably and if Jackson won on the veto could be in trouble so not in a great spot anymore. It's really really she's come a long way down from where she was in in week. One at this point still in an okay spot in the sense that if Jackson didn't win the veto Jackson would go home and she could probably work her way back in from there era specially with her connection to cat but but not quite as as solid as she was before her influence on this week's outcome was basically nothing she had no influence on the direction of the week it was all cliff and Christie and some of the other six years so heading into week five poison ivy all is going to win. She doesn't want to win though she wanted to drop but Jackson encouraged her to win which is important because this might have been a must win for them. He encourages his holly to win. Overseas and SYS pissed relationship with holly will never be the same from this point it was already already Syria deteriorating and after Holly Wins Overseas by the encouragement of Jackson says is done holly does try to to counter the perception given off by this whole situation that Jackson encourage her to win the H by saying that this is her. Hoa Tweaking and not Jackson's she says Jackson you're not going to be sleeping with me upstairs or I'm GonNa. I'M GONNA sleep up there with Christie insists. It seems like she is on the right trajectory for her game. She needs to start to develop relationships with other people again instead of focusing in on Jackson but that plan is going to be dropped pretty quickly glee as Jackson moves back upstairs and those relationships do deteriorate a bit after that initial night of an attempt of trying it can be social in the meantime. Jackson says that he thinks holly should nominate Nicole because Nick and Sam Nick and Sam. That's bold move. I don't think I think that's too bold for you holly. That's a move I would make an I you. You should nominate Nicole. Holly Wants Nick Nick Gone. She's gone for a while. She thinks he's the most dangerous she wants. Nick out that relationship has just never been there mm-hmm and they've been targeting each other for Awhile Kristie. Insists are worried because they are against Jackson. Holly and they're worried that Jackson Hall you're GonNa realize that there at the bottom and if they realized that then they might not target nick and Sam they might target one of them. Holly is essentially in the same position that nick was in the previous week or two weeks previous where we're nick didn't realized that he was at the bottom of his alliance and instead of targeting them was was a dummy and targeted other people and let his alliance than common and take his showman's commands the following week so they're concerned that holly is going to realize that she's in that position and do the smart thing and target one of them or something along those lines so. Christie is going to put some work to make sure that Nick and Sam go on the block the next morning Jackson is GonNa make her breakfast unbelievable. He's amazing Jackson. Your Momma. Your Momma raised you right care and that whereas my mama the cat is going to throw Nicole under the bus during HOLLY'S H. O. H. Cat wants to get holly are sorry wants to get Nicole. Targeted cat wants Nicole gone now. Cliffs Angels was formed the previous week and so the cat is going to use Klis angels angels to throw Nicole under the bus and get Nicole nominated. I still don't know why I wanted to do this but she did. She says to holly that Nicole does not have y'all's backs and and you know she's working with with this alliance called cliffs angels and you need to be careful and tries to get Nicole targeted but to no avail Christie is going to have the bigger influence and holly wants Nick Gone. Anyway so nick and Sam are nominated for eviction at this point now that she's failed to get Nicole. Vic Cat decides to volunteer for the block. If one of Nick Sam comes down how will go up as is a pond I also I mean you can theoretically say oh. She wanted to do that because it would hide her relationship with holly but it was that bad move and it was bad move on both cat and holly's parts one of the worst weeks for Holly. I think this this this this H. h week between not realizing that her lines is turned on her doing the same thing that nick did and then it would be like if nick put Sam Sam on the block as the back towards says Nicole so volunteers holly agrees and despite cat and Holly's attempts to pin it so so there's there's been some some rumblings ramblings going on that there was an attempted vote flip last week to to save Bella and it's all getting pinned on Nicole and this is part of what cats doing. She's blaming a 'cause. She's saying the coast terrible in the question be targeted and holly is is going along with that saying that was all Nicole but despite their attempts just depend on Nicole Christie and the rest of the six shooters do think the Jackson Holly worth considering flipping the vote on Jack last week and just trying to blame Nicole just like nick and Bella did and and really again parallels the nick and Bella Week in many many ways so they are going to target Jackson Holly Very soon. Holly has been acting weird lately. They don't trust her. Christie says that she wants to keep Sam used them to go after holly next week and she's even willing to take the shot at Holly Jackson next week if she needs to in the meantime cliff has been working holly and Jackson since last week basically when they tried to convince him that they voted for reason he was having none of it but he pretended to them that he was okay with it. He then won the you. H He used Jackson's plan to nominate him as a pawn said. Look you volunteered. I don't want you to go though you're not my target. Once Jackson won the veto and cliff lift the deal with Christy cliff got information from Christie that she was anti-jackson she also learned that Jackson was the the rogue vote during the Nicole Week and held onto that information which will become very relevant in the following week or is there at the end of this week and and so he has been working working behind the scenes with cat to drive a wedge between Christie and Jackson using the information that both of them have from Christie and from Jackson working both ends ends of that spectrum and so at this point in time holly in Jackson feel very good about both cliff and cat they want to target Nicole after they get rid of Nick and SAM. That's their plan but they want to work with cliff. Sam says that Zam keeps trying to pitch to holly that. He wants to work with her and he wants to go after Christie and holly is tempted by the offer but and once once it to happen because she wants to stay. What Nick is going to win the veto which means that? Sam has to go so after Nick Quincy. Veto Holly is very upset. She alludes to the sixers relationship with nick as an abusive one. She says we keep taking nick back but then he betrays trays he ruins it and I just WanNa. Make sure it doesn't happen again. I don't want to be able to get back in. I don't want that to happen. Cliff has been planting seeds leads with Jackson and holly about Christie for a long time again since the week before they felt really good about cliff. He's been dropping hints. That Christie is not to be trusted and it's finally finally starting to get to Jackson. Jackson is the one that initially starts to become a little bit nervous about Christie. He says that he he he tells he ends up telling Jack with Holly Him and Holly Confide in Jack that they're working with cliff and that he wants to target Christie. Cliff is a good good option of somebody to to to to target Christie and Jackson try to get in with cliff as well holly starts to consider even keeping SAM around and targeting Nicole instead instead if she back doors Nicole then she can keep Sam around and Sam can go after after Christie Jack though push back. He says we shouldn't target Nicole. Sam needs needs to go. He's too dangerous. You can't take that risk. Obviously we know Jack is more loyal to Tommy. Jack is going to run this information to Tommy and Jackson Jackson. Holly are outed so Tommy and Christie or super sketched out. They decide. They need to take out salmon. No matter who puts up even if they have to vote against holidays wishes again continuing to parallel the Nick Week Tommy at this point says he is ready to take shots. They are going after Jackson. Holly Christie agrees. Let's go the the the thing is been thrown toward time. Cat and Holly Ali agree that that cat is okay with going on the block. That is an option for holly. It will be great because it will hide their relationship. I didn't work out cat wants to tell Christy about cliffs. Angels like no all he says we have to protect cliff. Cliff is important says that she has been pushing pushing for Nicole to go because this wants to save Sam because this as a good relationship with Sam. Tom And holly actually is concerned about that because she is concerned about says because this has been flirting with Jackson so there's a lot to get through in in one in little blurb there but basically over the last week against this was pissed for even winning this so even though I didn't really we see this too much. This has been flirting quote unquote with Jackson and Holly is not a fan of it. She says she say shameless and she doesn't like it so now she's concerned concerned about says and the fact that this is pushing to get. Nicole out means that holly does not doesn't really WanNa do it as much anymore because she's worried that this is just doing that to keep Sam around in that. Sam actually the number for this and not for holly a lot of this week and the outcome of it is is riding on holly and SIS and Holly's concern about assists. Who's going to pick this over her. So that's that's really her. Her primary motivation from this point forward Holly Holly says that that Christie is the big threat that that she's worried that Christie is going to choose sis over her but holly changes her mind when she talks to Nicole. It's not a great conversation. She decides she does want Nicole out. This time. Kristie pushes back heart and Tommy gives insist. They talk her down. They convince her not to go after Nicole but after they done with that conversation they decide. They're again just do that visit. She's trying to get in call. She's trying to make a move. We need to go after them. they say they they talk about that with. Sis Sis runs her mouth cat over. Here's is going to run it back to holly. Holly then blamed because it's she's the one flirting with Jackson. They were just talking with her. They Jackson's confronting Tommy and Christie about it and they agree that they blamed it was all since fall. We weren't talking doc in any crap which this was a complicated mass of events here but the bottom line is that Jack in Jackson and Christy we are now more angry with sis than with Christy and Tommy Krisztian. Tom. You're able to slide by blame. Free Holly Does and that also means that cat will end up going on the block as the pond and tries to clear things up and blame Kristie at this point unsuccessfully six shooters is have their final dying meeting a again in an unsuccessful one Jackson and holly we are brought into Tommy Christie's of blame shifting maneuvers they get they. WanNa get Christie on board with the anti SIS agenda and their goal is that they want to pull Tommy and Christie back in and turn them against SIS. The mistake that everyone is making in the first Tafoya game is that they all think they can pull Tom Christie and Jackson Holly even though they were initially thinking catching onto Christie was doing are now convinced by Christy and Tommy that they should work with them and that it's all sisters fault they talk a lot about how says is flirting with Jackson. Jackson talks about how yes cysts. Assists isn't distant with me. She shameless lots of you've now. The Kennedys gone so there's a lot of SIS trash talking between a cat and holly she is she is the new a person to take the brunt of this. She starts working very hard to you back into the group into six shooters. Sam Is then going to make makes his pitch to Jackson now just as it looks like the group is getting back together. It looks like that cliff and cats work is not going to pay off because Tommy and Christie are too good and they reeled Jackson and holly back in Sam makes a play he pitches to Jackson exposing some of what Christie was saying saying the week before when she didn't want to use power during cliffs. Hoa Jr and it matches with what cliff and have been telling them and Jackson buys it and he wants to flip the vote to Sam Problem is holly can't vote of flip of the vote to save Sam because cats on the other side so they can't do it. It sucks but they can't do it and also do. We really believe this. Are we sure so holly goes. Those two cliff and holly wants to know from cliff. Is this stuff true. What do you have. What can you tell me. We've been talking about working together. Let's put it all on the table. Here and cliff confirms the information from Sam. He also drops that Kristi told him that Jackson was vote. He basically spills everything that he has is on Christie and clicks for holly as well. Holly now brings it back to Jackson and they say that's it. It's over six shooters is done we need to we need to gather the troops. We need to go after Christie. That's that's it so Jackson goes to work. He brings in Jack Jack. He Lets Jack know what's going on but again Jack of course as we know was the wrong person to trust. Jack is going to spill spill the beans about everything that Jackson tried to tell him to Tommy including the fact that cat and holly know each other no no each other so Tommy and Jack tried to flip the votes to get rid of cat now that do they know that cat and holly know each other but holly catches them in the act and gets to work she convinces is them and more importantly Christie that she does not know cat and she's loyal to the group don't do this. Christi makes the call. We're putting stop to this vote. Flip cat is saved. Sam is a victory on Holidays H. and that was forty four so in summary this week. This was a potentially necessary wage win on Holly's part that she didn't even want to win but she did kind of need to but her this this age was just one disastrous decision after another that she then at the very last minute managed to pull herself out of the fire with an excellent clutch play. It's really it's like just the decision to target nick and Sam not and realizing that her allies were have turned on her. It was the same thing nick. Did it was a terrible decision. Then she decides to put cat on the block her closest ally apart from Jackson in terrible decision then she is obvious about she and Jackson too obvious about the fact that they are flipping against Christie Christie. Their secret gets leaked and the vote nearly flips on cat which would have been just absolutely terrible for her game. It was nearly just she's almost completely trashed here entire game in one week but at the last second saves it with the clutch play and basically wipes wipes the slate clean a week's worth of terrible moves in decision-making wipes clean by by one clutch play at the end of the week. You have to give of her a lot of credit for that. I think this is by far her finest moment in the game the fact that she managed to to save cat at the end of the week but it was also a lot of her lowest moments in the game. She wouldn't have needed to do that if she had made more correct decisions earlier in the week if she hadn't put herself in such a hole she wouldn't have needed to climb out of it so dramatically so at this point in the game holly is targeting. Nick Cysts Christie and Jack. She's against Christie for shore against this against Nick and against Jack. She's being targeted by. Nobody dislike that clean slate. She convinced the sixers not to go after her. The other people aren't going after her so she's fine for a week. holidays influence on the week was obviously she was h h she was basically tossed around by by the others in the house. Barely any of these decisions were her own. She ended up nominating closest ally and another potential ally and then all almost disaster but she did barely escape. It all worked out in the end so influenced. She was definitely in charge of a lot of decisions but those decisions were basically made by other people in a lot of ways but but she didn't she she was the key factor in keeping around after a potential flip so that is important to note as well so heading into week six. Jess S. is going to win. The H. and Holly is going to continue to damage her damage control tour convincing the sixers. She's on their side however she kinda quickly realizes that it's not necessary and she gives up after about a day and stars just hanging out in the cat tries to tell holly that she needs to drop Jackson and Holly Says No Defense Jackson cliff in cat encouraged just to take a shot Jack while keeping holly and Jackson safe and that is what Jesse is going to do cat and holly still hates this and she is their next target at this point shameless flirting people call beautiful vapid just wants to be an influence her. She's dumb. Christie starts to realize after holly is given up on damage control that she's been had she made a mistake. She shouldn't have shouldn't have kept catch and entrusted. Holly Holly's now spending Oliver Time in the H. Whoops Ali is working on her relationships with the other side of the house. This is one of her better weeks. She's working on Nicole and jess in particular. She's really setting herself up up in a better spot than she was before she still being targeted by the other side as they realize what's going on but she's a little bit insulated in the fact that she has both cat and Jackson as targets in front of her polly at this point this is when we see a bit of a shift she he says you know. I was never comfortable with that other side you know I. I've always been a cool kid but I'd never never really felt comfortable. The being a cool kid I feel more comfortable with the other side of things and I I didn't like it when they were being mean. So this is this is i. I am an underdog really if you think about it and so this is really the better space for me which we all laughed at at the time but I really had forgotten a lot of what she had done before. I guess it worked in some ways anyway. She's still skeptical of Nick even though she's now theoretically on the same side as the sixers are still targeting Jackson Holly cat the following week. Holly is going to start or to change your mind about cysts. Despite cats continuing trash-talk holly at this point would rather target Christie as Christy becomes more aggressive against holly as she realizes that holly is against her her she also wants. Tommy gone after Christie so it's Christy and Tommy according to Hawley however Tommy is going to throw throw a hail Mary pass to Jackson Holly at the end of the week tries to reconnect with them and succeeds dramatically it lands and they bond heavily. He says that he was not a part of any of the he did not mean to be a part of any of this up that went down. He still loves them a lot and he wants to work with them and he will not put them on the block. After he leaves Jackson Holly Talk About how much they love him and how much they want to work with him and so he is not going to be their target moving forward holly now. L. Wants to put up nick and Christie on the block. That's who she wants to target next. She talks with cat about whether she should side with Tommy or with close angels. She's not sure which way to go and she doesn't really make a call yet. Cat wants to put up Jackson and hall in Holly Degrees Greece. That's a good idea but Jackson would be a great pond us for cat so jack is addicted. Holly is vote to victim and in summary for week. Six six-year Paulie is going to recover position but then she swiftly loses it as her covers immediately blown with Jackson Jack on the block he she she is going to use this opportunity to bond with cliffs angels and Tommy Reconnect with her Jackson so that's where she's shifting torch here but she is still being targeted by the rest of the six shooters or what remains of them at this point in time she was targeting nick and Christie. She's being targeted by SIS nick and Christy but she did again reconnect to Tommy which will be vital to survival in the following week. She was a major ager player this week. She was a big target. She is a big target moving forward but she has made some individual relationships that will end up keeping her safe the following week so good week overall for holly despite still being a target heading into week seven we have Tommy winning the h the only one of the six years that will keep her safe so lots of lots of people being targeted this once cliff gone because Tommy immediately says he's not putting Jackson colleague so there's a scatter once click on she's pissed at him for turning down Jack Deal Kristie wants Kat von and Tommy decides. The cat does need to go she. He is the best person to take out. It disarms Jackson Holly. It gets rid of the link between Jackson Holly and the rest of angels which are called Cliffs Angels and so that's it's GonNa be Tommy's plan to take out of the game then get to the field trip which saw Christie's and Jackson put on the field trip in and the possibility of Christie going on the block looms over them. Jackson wants to take the shot if Christie goes up on the block. Let's voter out. Let's take out of the game boom. I don't WanNa work with the five anymore. I WANNA move on with the other side. Let's do it holly though having thought about it has decided no. I don't really want to do that yeah. I don't want to turn on Tommy. I WANNA continue to work with Tommy. I'd rather go with that side. so holly is not on board cat also tries to convince holly to Evict Christie and also fails. Holly is not on board to Evict Christie. So Nick at this point wants to veto and get holly put on the block. He is still after Hollywood love for holly to be on the block. He would wanNA take cliff down. He works on on an Ecole to get her against holly now. Nicole wasn't really with Hawley but but there's a lot of information against holly when it comes to Nicole because Ali was really heavily considering taking Nicole out during her H. O. H. Week so even though hall he's been bonding with Nicole There's there's a lot of work to make sure that Nicole is against holly from Nick and then from Christy and Tommy and the rest of them they all are ratting. Holly out as having wanted to target Nicole on her h h week holly did not come clean about that to Nicole and so this is actually going to work pretty well. Honey coal is going to be flipped against holly throughout this week and cat is going to let me know about that cat is like. Oh Oh you can't trust and call. Do you not trust Nicole. Nicole is not cat continues to be anti Nicole and just one week later in in fact not just one week ago this same week. She's going to pretend that she was more loyal to Nicole Than Holly unbelievable how blatantly lying so holly tells Jackson we can't trust Nicole. Nicole is on their naughty list Tommy though is going to win the veto. He's GonNa use it on Christie and and that means that it's GonNa come down to cliff and Cat Jackson wants to keep cliff. He doesn't wanNA keep cat wants. Keep clicking the game. He thinks cliff is more valuable for their game. Holly says I agree with you but I can't don't. I can't cat so holly and CAP. You'll pretty confident that cliff is going to go. Holly and Jackson Jackson tried to take a bit of a back seat for the week because they feel like it's GonNa go smoothly if they don't interfere not the case though Nicole all is gonNA try and make a plan to get holly on the block again. She's been flipped against holly at this point and she wants to save both cat and cliff cat blocks the plan which sets. Nicole roll off makes her even more skeptical of Cat Jackson. Holly agree that they need to work with this as they're sitting back and they're expecting to be a victim. They agree that it's time to go back to the six go back to Tommy and Christie and work with them. Jackson really doesn't want to do it but he agrees with holly finally that they have no choice they have to go in that direction however it becomes clear to them pretty soon that the six are not a victim cliff if they are actually evicting cat and that's no good that means we can't work with them. Crap so cat and holly try to come up with some plans to save cat including trying to make an alliance with some of the quiz angels people but called Cliffs Angels for a reason and and that's not gonNa work very very well. Holly starts campaigning hard with the six to try and save cat but that only sketches people out more. Why are you campaigning to keep cat. Cats cats pitches that she's I'm GonNa go after Jackson. Cat is going to continue to try to to target say that she's targeting Jackson but nobody really believes her. People people are becoming more and more convinced that it was actually true. The cat did know holly so it's not working and cat is starting to circle the drain here. The target list now is that Jackson is the next target for basically everyone in the house followed by Holly and then Jess. That's those are the next three targets Jackson. Holly will be going on the block next week. The new six deal is made between Nick. Tommy Christie says cliff breath and Nicole. They're all going after Jackson. Holly Holy Wants to target Nick Nicole next week. That's her plan. She thinks she's been been replaced by Nick and Nicole. She still wants to work with Tommy and Christie to some degree and so if Kat leaves then Nick Nicole will be her targets targets the following week Jackson Want Backdoor Christie but holidays as much on board here cliff is going to throw Rohatyn Jackson all the way under the bus in order to make sure that he is going to stay this week all he tries to do the same thing to cliff but unsuccessfully nick nick is is then going to make a deal with Jackson. Holly to cover himself and this becomes important. It's much more deal with Jackson than it is with holly is after Holly GonNa. Keep Jackson safe so holly is now a bit more of a target than even Jackson in some instances and is in a lot of danger heading into the following week then we get the whole situation where Nicole Nicole feels bad about the deal spills to jess who tells holly chaos ensues. You guys know what happened here. You listen to the updates. You watched the episode. Lots of lots of things go down but the basics the underlining the underlying thing here is that holly now knows the entire house is is coming for her. Tommy does damage control the next day cliff does damage control system does damage and then we see cat evicted. Holly did vote to Victor. Though it was reluctantly quite reluctant so in summary here for week seven. It's very you've Harry bad week for Holly. Her mistakes from the previous week are coming back to haunt or even as her successes do end up saving her from fiction so the the the week where she was h really messed her up but she didn't manage to pull it out of the fire then the next week. She was building things up only to watch them. Some crashed down again again only to be saved by her relationship with Tommy going through that Hail Mary. Tommy played the week extremely well. He completely we disarmed her. In Jackson covered his basis stayed in good with both holly in Jackson took out their closest ally and separated them from close angels which which just really put holly a no win position exactly where Tom you wanted her cat gone. Holly has lost her entire position in the game. It's now win in order for Holly. She has lost everything and she's she's got nowhere to go except to to win and stay safe and from this point forward holly has considerably less influence and and has a much worse read on the House without having cat there to help give information about where things stand cat was definitely not exactly the strongest strategic mind and partner a but having that connection there that she could rely on that was part of another side of the house giving her information was really helping holly. Stay even though she wasn't necessarily influencing wincing the outcome of the weeks was helping her stay relatively safe in her position because she knew where things were and now the cat is gone that that is going to be gone as well and holly is going to really struggle for the rest of the game to to to to to grasp onto anything in the in the next few weeks here so Jackson in week eight is going to win a Must-win h wage for himself and Holly and just like that she's arrives she safe he wants to target Christie and cysts holly disagrees. She wants to target nick. Jackson is GONNA get his way. Christy insists are going to go on the block and Holly Willoughby pushing to get nick up and and for them to reunite with with Christy all week long that is holly goal. Holly wants to save Christie this week. She wants to get nick evicted if possible. I'M NOT GONNA mention every instance of when she tries to make this happen but she is trying to make can happen in almost every conversation. She has with Jackson for the entire week. She wants Christie Cristea to stay cliff is going to be working on Jackson now. Clifford made a deal to target Jackson but cliffs smartly blames the other side for it and says that I did what I had to do to survive but now that I have survived. It was a one week deal. You won the H H now. I want to work with you. Cliff is going to be the first one in two Jackson in holly and make sure that he is safe with them as as they are in power. Tommy is going to try to work on them later in the week but by then it's too late cliff is already worked his way in and and with cliff comes. Nicole reluctantly but he does drag her in as well and says hey. I want to bring the coal with me. I want to be safe with us. The four of them discuss working together. They don't trust Nicole but they do trust cliff and so they're willing to a to be okay with Nicole for now because cliff vouches for her and and that four is is going to start to come together in this week here week eight cliff tells us when he talks to the cameras that he is just using Holly Jackson to get further in the game. He knows that they're doing the same with with him but he'll see where this goes. He fully expects that that one of them will be picked off ahead of him and coal at some point in the future but we'll Saville. We'll see what happens. Jackson is then GonNa win the veto and that means that Christie insists are going to stay on the block despite Holley's all these urging to try to get nick put up and evicted. Holy is also so the first thing that happens after Jackson Wednesday is that Baywatch happens and after Baywatch happens SIS got pissed Christie pissed Christie got all worked up as well and so this was really pissed at holly and remember that scene where holly comes into the room and this is like off. She's so fake I just can't be fake in this game and so this rift between assists and Holly is reopened and holly actually tries to convince Jackson to take out assists to use the veto sorry to to to not use the veto and get specific did not to mention the fact that she also wants Christie Christie to stay but Tom Convinces Tommy goes and works on them and Tommy is very effective with holly. Tommy convinces holly that everyone is good. Christie is good. This is good we can make everyone individually is going to be good and so we should not take out any of those people and Tommy is so convincing that holly a complete one eighty and now decides that she does not want to win the next h h she wants to throw it. She's now working with Clifford Coulter degree. She's now in good with Tommy. Christie says she's good. She doesn't want to win the next h she wants to. Throw it in the meantime. Tommy Nick are GONNA discuss. HOW HOLLY IS THEIR NEXT TARGET OVER JACKSON. This makes terrible pitch to stay to Hawley really terrible pitch today. Kristie makes a much better pitch to stay and put tears and they cried together and Holly Says Christie I see this is not the decision she would have made. She wishes that Christie could stay. Tommy also makes a final pitch to keep Christie and take out somebody else. He says that we should keep Christie around and then it will be US myself. Sis Christie you Jackson and Nick will be our sixth and what will what will happen is that you'll use veto will put up cliff. Nicole Jess whoever and we'll take them out holly. Ali is convinced again basically anything Tommy does is going to work on holly for the rest of the season. She wants to do it. She wants wants to do this pitch. She's on board Jackson Says No. She's come on okay. What if what if we take a nick though like this is the opportunity to get rid of nick at Christie's shouldn't go. We should take out nick. Nick is my white. Wail Jackson now Jackson. I don't want to betray Tommy Hami. I don't I don't do that to Tommy. Jackson goes now so the nose habit and Christie will be acted until TACO Tuesday. You know what happened on Taco Tuesday. We've been through this a bunch of times. Basically Holly is going to use TACO Tuesday Newsday to continue to push for Christie to say. This is her second round Jackson. We have to keep Christie. You saw what happened. We need Kristie to go after nick. She also uses the information from this is terrible. Pitch SIS is coming for you. She's going to work with me. We we had an alliance but she's coming for you. Kristie will not Christie will offer us the World Christie does offer them the World Jackson finally finally relentless and says yes okay so they decided I to keep Christie which ironically forces Tommy to scramble and massive massively so he tries to get Christie and nick reunited. Christie actually tries to instigate herself and Christie and nick actually make preliminary Mary piece before the following h only further proving that this was a terrible decision of Jack Part. Keep Christie around this. This is in fact evicted. Holly is vote to evict her so in summary here for week going to spearhead this really boneheaded move to keep Christie around and puts her Jackson in a terrible position heading into the following week. She did not realize the position she was in and wanted to throw this h h which would have had which would have basically led to her addiction if she had succeeded in throwing so holly is targeting nick at this point she's being targeted by Christie Tommy and Nick and eh she had complete control of this week just made terrible decisions with it in my opinion now to make a point on this week nine holly is is going to win this h h but she had every intention of throwing this wage was a crap shoot. It was supposed to be questions. She was not going to win the questions. She had no intention of winning the questions but instead it was a prank and it turned out it was a crapshoot. She just rolled the ball and happened to go and she was like. Oh crap. I one didn't WANNA win. Here's the thing though if he does not win this and I there Kristie Tommy or nick do in this age. Holly is almost as sure about ashore as we can be going to be the person that leaves this week because Jackson ends up winning the veto even if she wasn't the target over Jackson initially she definitely would would have been remaining on the block after Jackson won the veto to save himself and she would have been going home so very inadvertently saving her own life in the game by accidentally winning this Hoa Jr she didn't she got it so she wants to put up nick and Christie. That's what she wants to do. Christie would be the pond she wants to cash in on Christie's offered to be upon. She tells Christy that she's going up on the block. Christie's not pleased. Holly is not pleased. That Christie was not pleased so that relationship is just immediately blown up especially on Christie's end. Holly is going to be buying into a Christie is selling a little bit later in the week. That was if there was any further confirmation information needed that this relationship is not gonNA work out. It just immediately happens. Holly actually decides to back door neck back and so her plan is that she's actually going to put up. Jess next to Christie Jessica Krista. You're going to go up on the block. which was another probably bad decision? America's Prankster was revealed and instead of actually hurting holly. It ends up helping her in a lot of ways. She is though she is annoyed that she already told Christie that she would go up because now she doesn't have to put Christie up instead. She's just going to put on the block. Cliff is going to continue to push for a final four between himself. Nicole Holly Jackson Holly is on board. They're starting to trust Nicole a little bit more as cliff encourages them to bring her in. They still don't trust her fully but they do trust cliff so it's working out Jackson is going to instigate a confrontation between Nick and Christie because they both rats each other out when it when it came to that preliminary peace effort they were going to make prior to the age. They weren't actually going to go after each other and so they get into a bit of a fight there but it doesn't really have much impact. Nick is going to end up nominating Christie for eviction because he is America's prankster. Holly is going to put up. Nick for Eviction Jackson is going to win the veto and and just like that Nicholas isn't goner during the veto competition holly gets. It's called an old buzzard which is going to lead to more spiraling in the future. She wants Nick Gone Jackson's like what if we took Jesse though is no it has to be nick. Nick makes an anti cliff pitch. Holly does not like it. We're not we're not anti cliff in this house. They're going to make their final four official with Nick and Nicole and this is when her song which probably the worst game move her season which is obviously a joke but let's be real don't do the Song Nicole is going to tell them that they you can't trust Tommy. They do consider targeting him but at the end of the day they do trust him and they don't want to be the ones to put him up so Jackson does not want to throw the. Hoa is not want to win the next day to wage a lot of fighting between Jackson. Holly that happens this week at the end of the week. Nick is GONNA make condom. Pitch Pitch doesn't work. This is one Jackson Holly agree that they're in an amazing spot. We play this game so well. We're so low key in the shadows playing both sides. Tommy Christie aren't targeting US Nick Nicole. I and cliff aren't targeting us. We're getting rid of nick who definitely would be targeting us. Jess isn't targeting us or so good at this Taymor amazing players. We're GONNA throw the F out of these George competitions. We're so good. Christy and Tommy continued to play up there with them but in secret are actually of course targeting them so nick is going to be evicted and and in summary here holly is going to evict a big threat and I won't say it was a mistake per se but nick would have been willing to work with them moving forward Lord and they do believe in Christy and Tommy as people who aren't coming for them despite the fact that Christy and Tommy are coming for them and it might eight have been more prudent to evict Christie here instead of nick because Christie was was going to come after them. Nick would not have ultimately it's not going to matter too much though and taking out nick arguably not a mistake because he was good enough at competitions to potentially be Jackson though that was not really the reason to take him out I too much so ultimately taking out nick. It was an okay move but they are putting themselves in a bad position there believing they're in a much better position they are and it really leaves them open to being targeted here moving forward. They also make a final four with cliff in a cold this week. Holiday is targeting Christie ingests all he's being targeted by Tommy and Christie and she did have control over the outcome of this week as the H. O. H. Week. Ten Jackson is going to win this h h he does so to protect cliff Nicole but actually advertently protects himself and holly. This is the second week in a row that they inadvertently are going to save themselves from fiction. It actually potentially the third week if you count hollies poison ivy win which was also not intended to save themselves but might have actually saved themselves a lot of their wins were were in situations where they might have needed to win and a lot of them more in situations where they definitely we needed to win though that was not necessarily in a row because Tommy's was in the middle of that so Jackson wants to put up Christie Jess. He wants wants to take out holly disagrees with this plan. She wants Christie out over Jess. Holly is concerned because Tommy wants to talk more and she doesn't want to lie to Tommy she doesn't. There's one betrayed Tommy. She doesn't want to put Tommy. She loves Tommy. She doesn't want to betray Tommy if he talks to the lie to him. She doesn't want a lot of Tommy. She loves Tommy Coming. It's not fair to Tommy to worry about her image more starting a lot about how how she is much more conservative than she seems she is not girl you bring home from the Bar Jackson financial big fight ensues as we remember. Nicole is going to get holly on board with the pitch to keep jess and get rid of Christy prior to the veto that holly is going to pitch hard to get rid of Christie over Jess here which actually would have been terrible for Jackson and Holly's games in a way that they did not realize but it doesn't matter because Tommy is going to end up winning the veto and cuts that discussion short as he is going to use it on Christie Orson cliff on the block meaning that there can be no vote flip to be had Nicole and cliff though are going to start working on Tommy and Christie Holly and Jackson are busy fighting for much of the week this week and basically leave the game to be dealt with with the rest. The People Nicole and cliff are working on Tommy and Christie to make sure that Tommy and Christie are not targeting them and that they are in fact targeting Jackson Holly. They're exposing Jackson. Holly as Middleman Glenn affirming that they're not the targets and basically the entire house is now against Jackson Holly or at least the entire house apart from cliff and Nicole Cliff Nicole in the meantime are going to discuss which pair they want to side with in the upcoming double diction cliff things sticking with Jackson. Holly is best because is there a mental calms coming and they won't need to break any deals to do this and he is more concerned with Christy and Tommy when it comes to mental cops then Jackson and holly so it just makes more sense is to go with Jackson. Holly little cliff know that this is going to be a record breaking physical competition heavy season so Jackson. Holly finally starts. Stop Fighting and agree. They're definitely throwing the next age. Maybe the next two ages. I'm so Jackson. Hollywood prefer to see Kristie over Tommy. They talked to clip about it. Cliff agrees Christie is the right person to go. Oh let me call would kind of prefer Tommy but she doesn't have a big preference. Holly does get really upset when she finally learns from Cliff Christy and Tommy are against and spend their finally coming to realize that they are in a bad position that Christy and Tommy have been against them perhaps for a long time and they head into the double of addiction evicting jess and in danger so in summary here holly did want. Kristie evicted but just as the one that's going to go. She spends most of the week fighting with Jackson. Lennon game. We played around under targeting Christie. She's being targeted by Christy and Tommy and she has a minor influence on the week overall. It's mostly Jackson's call here. If if Holly Ali had her way Christy would have been the one to go which would have actually screwed them in the double as Nicole is GonNa win and if if jess was still in the game Nicole definitely would have targeted Jackson and holly which would have been bad for obviously. That's an holly so heading into week. Eleven Nicole does win in the double. She takes out Kristie. Steve Holley thinks that Tommy won't come for them. After Christie leaves that they've been good people in this game and that's why they're doing well. That's why Nicole chose us because we're good people people stick to our word honorable Jackson's. GonNa win the following. Hoa She's going to be targeting. Tommy Holly is trash talking Kristie to Tommy when Tommy finally reveals to Holly and Jackson that he knew her. She is at this point. There's not a ton of strategizing left and do so. It's just down to the competitions. Nicole is going to win that veto meaning meaning that holly is going to go up on the block which did not realize it was the possibility until Jackson told her after Nicole won the veto and she's freaking out that she might go home. What does she do about got it. Nothing Nicole is going to start to consider a victim. Holly and instead of holly working on Nicole Holly is going to be getting into fights with Jackson about the challenge in the meantime Tommy's working on Coal Nicole decides that she does want to keep Tommy around on and get rid of Holly. He tells cliff Nicole about his connection to Christie and they decide they are going to keep him holly is waiting until Wednesday after Tommy into campaign to cliff Nicole. She makes that's when she's GonNa. Unleash your big campaign. After Tommy does his stuff she's GonNa come in. She's going to slam the hammer down. She's GonNa stay so cliff Nicole decide. They are keeping Tommy one hundred percent here. We go time for Holy Pitch. I just feel like it's it's best if I stay because I want to be a role model to women and I don't think it's fair that if I leave this way and I don't know I just feel like you shouldn't didn't do this. She tries to lay on the GILTS and it really doesn't work very very bad campaigning from her her. Her head has been out of the game for awhile at this point. This is all this talk about. The challenge. Is All this talk about all this stuff. It was didn't work and cliff. Nicole are in fact going to be evicting her however by the grace of Jackson and eavesdropping Jackson here is Tommy's pitch and he pulls off his eavesdropping play. We saw this play out. He uses Tommy's pitch that he overheard to convince the cliff in Nicole that Tommy might not be the as on the up and up as they might think all he had no part in this Jackson informs her about it afterward and she didn't even want him to do it. She said why no. I don't like that. That's that's mean to Tommy. You shouldn't do this tomorrow. Jackson says I'm not going to just sit back and let you leave leave so he continues to try to save holly. We get into the big blow up that happened that Thursday and even though Jackson was not the most convincing in terms as of convincing both Nicole and cliff that the Tommy did these things did leave an opening similar to Taco Tuesday for cliff to come in and convince Nicole that they should keep Paulie and Tommy should be the one to go so that's what happens. She did have to promise though to throw the H. and the veto so Tommy's evicted this week again. Holly spend most of the week just fighting with Jackson. She's about to go home if not for Jackson's crazy move that that she disapproved of at this point in the game holly is targeting Nicole and she's being targeted by cliff and she has very little influence influence on the week. This is very much Jackson and and cliff decided the outcome here heading into week twelve holly does in fact fact Nicole on Jackson's urging but that makes her mad at Nicole for some reason she says in a cold bullied her into doing it probably makes deal with cliff and Nicole Nicole to win the veto. I'll be allowed to win the veto but I will evict Jackson. I promise you she makes a deal on it. Then Jackson wins the veto and eventually breaks the news to Jackson Holly Sorry to clinical that he will be in fact evicting cliff. This is all stuff that we just went through this week. Cliff is going to threaten his jury. Vote threatened to turn the jury against Jackson in order to stay Jackson says no sorry when breaking the news to cliff both Jackson and holly are blaming cliff Nicole for this. They're both doing the exact same thing Jackson's no worse than holly here. The only difference is that Jackson is doing most of the talking. He is the one making the decision and so after holly learns that cliff is threatening his jury vote and that she is going to get his jury vote because she honored her end of the deal she is now flipping now changing her tune and saying that she she threw the because she was honoring her deal and the starts to play into the role. That cliff is put her in. She's being being a little nicer. She's being like Hey I honored my deals. I I see what Jackson's do and I'm just letting him do some things up until that point. She was telling Jackson that he was definitely. GonNa win the game and that she was very pleased to sit next to him in the final two so that he could win. That's what she wanted to do after learning that she might have a chance to win win the game she she is more chipper but she is still talking to Jackson. Don't worry I'll take care of you for the rest of your life. It'll be fine so so so that's about where holly is now. Cliff was evicted. holly really tried to play up the fact that she honored her into the nearby throwing the H. and the came to to this week where they fought in part one of the file three H Jackson ax in one part one and now she will be facing off against Nicole and part two now Nicole. We'll be taking holly or at least should be taken holly to the final two as we'll Jackson soon. Coal is so holly should have a guaranteed seat in the final two however we have seen as some clips from the jury that indicated that she may not have much of a chance to win the game if she is in the final. Donald to a lot of people saw her as along for the ride they they didn't really respect her game in the game that might have changed in the jury house especially with with cat there to advocate for her but as of right now it does look like both Jackson and Nicole may have a leg up on her in the jury but this is a very difficult one to predict and it does seem like it's going to be close so do not bank on any of that and as we talked about at the beginning of this podcast ask this part of the file three. H Does seem to be a day's competition which holly does struggle in a bit so that's about where we are at with Holly Season in summary here for the most part the first half half of the game holly had some ups and downs. She clearly has a base level of solid game instincts. It's like she's socially she. She's good socially right she. She knows how to talk to people for the most part she the at the very beginning of the game. She was in on the majority alliances. She was included in things she was making good relationships. However strategically she has made incorrect decisions more often than not. She does not usually make the right call in in fact oddly cat seems to be the more strategically sound player between the two of them throughout the first half of the season despite the fact that cat also made a lot of really terrible calls also Catt was also the person who was probably playing the more influential game and had more information at times than holly or at least contributed a good portion of information at times. If we're comparing cat in holly I would say the cat had much higher highs and much lower lows but in general that holly was a bit more steady especially when they're especially socially Hollywood's able to do all socially strategically kind of didn't do too well and socially she started to falter when she got into the relationship with Jackson she really started to neglect her other relationships in the house and focus on her relationship with Jackson if if she does lose the game I think that's why she neglected those relationships. She focused on Jackson. Jackson did not neglect his other relationships when he was with Holly Jackson. Jackson continued to socialize with other people. He maintained his relationships with the rest of the house he was the he was the person that brought holly early in and out of separate alliances he was the one that brought people in like cliff cliff at least worked on Jackson. That was a mutual thing they're holly. The only time holly branched out was just as h week when she tried to bond with jess and coal but that quickly turned around on her as Nicole was turned against holly the following week and then the relationship with just never really went anywhere because you never really followed up with just because she was too focused on on on Jackson so that's a and we'll we'll talk about what what Jackson was doing Jackson in comparison to holly definitely more active player definitely not free of his own mistakes. We'll talk about that. if we're comparing holly to Nicole. We'll definitely talk about Nicole next week. I think that Nicole is a more strategically sound player socially not as good at times and also similarly passive in the game mm-hmm throughout most of the season. I think Nicole Hollier actually fairly comparable in terms of their their their actual game play in the sense that holly had more social ability ability that she didn't always utilize Nicole had more strategic ability that she didn't always utilize and so they kind of balance each other out in a lot of ways like that but again we'll we'll get more into that. When we go through Nicole's game yeah overall first half of the season she set herself up well socially made some strategic errors here and there started to neglect relationships by the end of the first half of the game she had made some big mistakes and set herself up to be in a lot out of trouble and then lost cat and by the time she lost cat she really just lost the plot and started to drift along really ah carried by competition wins mostly Jackson's and and continuing to make mistake after mistake in terms of the moves that she was making the people that she was trusting. Thank and did not really engage a whole lot socially especially from that point forward so that's about where we see. Holly's game or at least I see holly's game encourage everybody to come to your own conclusions from from what I've told you from what you have gleaned. If you want to do your own research urging all of that but but that's about how I see Holly's game throughout this season of big brother twenty-one I do see her as probably the worst player left of three ultimately we were high on her early on but looking back on it it does appear that it was actually cat essentially cat taking the hits for her and making her look better because of that and then as soon as cat left we saw the holly that we probably would have seen if had not been there there to really help her out and give the the advantage that she had in the early portion of the season That's my take on it at least so that's where we are so. Thank you guys in the chat for hang out with me all of this time. I will be back tomorrow at eleven. Am Eastern to go through Nicole's game and and that one might get me in trouble. Obviously I love Nicole but there's a lot to criticize about Nicole's game. I have a feeling that there's a lot of people that will not refund of of of some of that but there are also things that Nicole did well and so we can talk about those well. I do think some people forget about some of the things Cole has done well and I touched on some of them today during Holly's but there are also lumping she did poorly and so we're gonNA talk about that as well so we'll be back tomorrow. Talk about Nicole Jackson will be on Monday. You can find me on twitch twitch DOT TV slash Armstrong. I'm on twitter at Armstrong Taryn Instagram Taryn underscore Armstrong wrong and of course tomorrow. I'll also be able to let you know hopefully what happens here with part two of the final three. It'd be a lot more fun to go through Nicole's game if she wins. She'll be heading to par-three. It'll be a lot more somber if she if she loses another. She's basically out of the game but we'll have to wait and and see so thank you so much for joining me here. Of course tomorrow night. We will be live to recap the Sunday night episode of the show and then Monday night the final round table during the season will happen. Will I will do the final stock watch during the season and then Wednesday I will be in. La I will be I will be away but but we will still have some coverage for the finale for you so look forward to that and yeah. Thank you once again. If somebody sends this to Holly postseason I apologized for the for the what I said but it's my honest opinion and I gotta I gotta be on itself. Thank you guys and I will see you later town.

Jack Jackson Bella Holly Holly L. Manson Jackson Jackson Bella Nicole Nicole Nicole Christie Bella Ella Nick Christie Jack Jackson Holly Holly Nick Sam nick Jackson Holly Jackson Jackson Tommy Holly Ali Christy cliff House Holly Kristie
Rock and Roll Heaven: The Day the Music Died - Buddy Holly

Rock N Roll Archaeology

1:52:47 hr | 10 months ago

Rock and Roll Heaven: The Day the Music Died - Buddy Holly

"You're listening to the rock and roll heaven podcast with L. Tj Kit. You dig that baby. Hey guys welcome to rock and Roll Heaven. The podcast where he talked about the lives careers and deaths of famous musicians. I'm your host. Ld along with me for the right as always is Tj. Hey how are you TJ? I'm Fan Freakin tastic. Excellent why because I get to meet Miranda Lambert so tell the story to. I'm so excited I mean if you listen or they'll dino's I'm a huge Fan Rand Lambert and So we're going to her show tonight and I joined the Fan Club for a raffle for a chance to win a meet and greet pass one. And I'm so stoked because I wish I had anything even remotely that I did. I did EAT At the cheesecake factory last night so that was pretty exciting again. Yes Nice we gotta give card all right so awesome. That's Brad so have lunch today. That's about the most exciting stuff I have. Well there you go I mean. It can't all be exciting all the time. Well let's talk about a bad place to sit which is then a beech bonanza in Nineteen fifty-nine. Yeah I am the Queen. I was a man and I'm really happy that we're doing this episode because it means that I can stop talking about this because this is my ever loving nightmare just three weeks of plane crashes. Yeah it's yeah. I know this is not been fun for you. It has not. I have up my Xanax. But it'll be alright so for the audience may be doesn't know why you have such a fear of planes and flying. Do you want. Maybe fill them in. Yeah I had always been afraid of airplanes like it was just. I've never been a fan but I used to be a smoker and I moved to New York City on September seventh and I was supposed to move to a little place on thirteenth and six but they were redoing the floors and so I had to find other accommodations and so I got a hotel on fifty seventh and lax and kind of had a choice because the building was really tall. So you could either go down like you know. Put your clothes on and go down thirty eight floors and stand on the street and have a cigarette or you can go like you know ten floors up and go to the roof and so I decided that's what I was going to do because I was not in the mood. Put on this morning so wait a minute so we went to the roof with no pants on no. I was still wearing my. Pj's Oh I see. I didn't have to look like a proper human. If you went up on the roof so I went up on the roof and I was having a cigarette and I was enjoying. It was a Tuesday. It was beautiful. The Sky was blue like it was getting close to my birthday so I was pretty excited and having a cigarette and I was just kind of turning around and I turned around and I saw the second plane hit the World Trade Center and it. Just it's it's it's scared me and like the whole world changed and that image still sticks with me and so like I still have the memory of seeing all the the paper the days after like made them the missing posters of these people that were just trying to hold onto this hope. And I'd only been in the city for four days so I I didn't know anyone I didn't have anyone I didn't. I had nothing and so I wondered and like I said I was a smoker. So I actually went down on September eleventh to Times Square and I laid down in the middle of the street. Whoa and I watched the news ticker aunt will there? Were no cars. There were no people right. It was nothing in Times Square. Nothing there was nothing. No one in Times Square. I feel like that alone would be it was very. It was such an eerie feeling. It was like the beginning of the movie. Vanilla sky where he's just running any can't find anyone and I found out why they call it. A news ticker is because it takes like the when each letter hits the edge of the the machine. Oh you went so I could actually hear that in Times Square. Wow and then about a day later like the wind shifted and you can the smell came and so from that day on flying has been a real horror from me bright understandably so and it's just. It's you never know what's going to happen. You're not in control at all and it's it's it's the worst feeling in the world right. Well I'm sorry to make you drudge all that up. I just thought it might add some context for our listeners. That may not understand. Just how terrified. And how why? This is such an upsetting subject for you yet and I added a story at the end that makes it even worse lower may so I was like doing a form of self torture? So you'll see that later on in the episode so lovely. I love when you purposefully destroy yourself. Yeah Destroy Myself. Yeah well we'll bring you out of it for now okay. Let's get to our our last story on the day. The music died all right so today. We're talking about buddy. Holly probably we found out that Ritchie valance was the most successful person on the tour and probably the biggest name but everybody kind of associates. This crash with buddy like it's in the press people call the buddy holly crash and she was. She relishes the biggest name on the ticket. He had like the most hits. He was the most successful. He's on track for being the most successful person on the tour. Wow yeah all right. So but Let's talk about. Let's talk about Buddy Charles Hardin holly and I'm going to point out that it spelled H. O. L. L. E. Y. And there's a reason for that because everybody knows knows him as H. O. L. Y. And Got I hope I kept in because I did some major butchering of this episode. It was nineteen pages and I will go ahead and and cite the source that it this is this main source for my research comes from buddy holly biography by Ellis Amber N- and so Charles Hardin holly was born September seventh nineteen sixty three and he was born in Lubbock Texas N. He was actually born in the family. House ooh home birth. Yeah that's actually not uncommon. I know in those days. It was it but like now. Can you think of like me? Giving birth in the pod loved. I mean I really hope you wouldn't but I don't think that's going to happen. You know I don't think you ever have to worry about me giving birth. I don't know that's coming back big time. These days is home births. He was named after both of his grandparents. So that's where the Charles and the hardened come in And he was born into a musical family during the Great Depression and he learned to play guitar alongside his siblings and his elder siblings. Were Larry who were born in. Nineteen twenty five and Travis who was born in Nineteen Twenty seven and Patricia. Liu which is such a southern name and she was born in Nineteen twenty nine. So Buddy was born nineteen sixty three Larry. Which would be the sibling that I think he kind of leans on the most. He was already ten years. Older Than Buddy and Patrick and Patricia were nine and seven respectively. So like he was the baby of the family and they often said that they would spoil him because he was the baby of the family. Which I think is really sweet. What DOES COMMON? I think I was spoiled and I'm the baby. My sister thinks I was spoiled. And I'm the baby so the hollies were a poor decent family but they were also hard. Shell Baptists which makes sense because there in Lubbock Texas in the thirties right But it would be the first of them to graduate from HIGH SCHOOL AND HIS FATHER L. O. Holly was a labor and would sometimes earn as little as twelve dollars a week from going job to job toiling as a cook a carpenter construction worker car salesman and clerk in a men's clothing store so the family was pretty poor. So what year was this? Nineteen thirty six when he was born looking up. How much twelve dollars so twelve dollars a week? In nineteen thirty six would be the equivalent to two hundred twenty dollars in two thousand. Nineteen if you imagine you had a family of what five it was Larry Travis Patricia. Buddy Charles L. O. And his mom six so six so family of six living on two hundred twenty dollars a week that is well below the poverty line. Oh yeah well the thing. Was that the great. Depression lasted a lot longer in places like Texas than it did. In other parts of the country like more industrial parts of the country so certain places I think like Detroit Bounce back pretty quickly because they had a big industry Pittsburgh Back New York had the Wall Street so you know they. They had a bustling industry so places out West. That didn't have really an established industry yet. I think the Great Depression just lasted longer right. But also you have to think like what were they need? They need food right and maybe gas and that's pretty much it. Yeah because they don't have the things that we have now like you have to pay for your streaming services for your food. You're you know I'm trying to think of the things that we have now but we have to pay for health. Insurance is probably insane. I don't even know if they had health insurance in the thirty S. I don't know that they had health insurance but still doctors. Yeah but doctors healthcare. Yeah I mean I don't know I feel like a lot of things we have now. Could some of it can be construed as luxury but you know in general absolutely? I don't need Disney plus Netflix and Hulu but I want them. Yeah Still Two hundred twenty dollars to feed. A family of six is not enough. Include them an yeah. That's not enough. I think I've spent two hundred and fifty dollars on groceries on one trip from me and Willem the cats. Jeez so I get it. Yeah So when he was little his mom said that his given name of Charles was too long for him because he was such a tiny they make a real big point in this book to explain to you how small he actually was so she said that his name was too long for him and so she nicknamed him buddy and that's how we got his name. Cute the hollies were in mentally musical family. The elder Holly Brothers actually would perform in local talent shows trying to raise money for the family and on one occasion but he joined them on the violin and since he couldn't play it his brother's actually greased the strings and so it wouldn't make any sound and they actually won that talent show and in In one thousand nine forty one. When he was five he actually won a five dollar singing contest at the country. Line rule school accompanying himself on the Violin. So I wonder if they grease the strings that time. It's just like well. I imagine. Probably at that point he learned to play at five. I don't know hang. I don't know I don't know either if you get. It didn't say if he actually could play the violin at that point or not so but he accompanied him on the voice. Yeah I got nothing. I got nothing later that same year. On December Seventh World War Two began and both of his brothers. Larry and Travis Travis. My brother's name. So that was confusing. Joined the Marines. They went off to the Pacific to fight the Japanese but he entered the first grade in nineteen forty-three Roscoe Wilson. Elementary School and quickly found that he didn't like to study but he also didn't need to when he brought home his first report cards. It was full of as it was the first of the holly children to Excel scholastically And in this time like Travis went off to war and I I'm uncertain. We're he actually got the guitar. It sounds like it was gifted to him but he kept it throughout the entire war while he was fighting and he actually brought that home because he was the first one to be sent back home from the war and so he took this guitar and he taught buddy how to play and while it's not expressly stated his other brother. Larry also made it home safely from the war so good news on that. Count later buddy. Got His own guitar and Acoustic EPA phone and it made a clean sad sound buddy progress on the Banjo and Mandolin. Applying driving attack on any instrument. He took up his singing. Was Equally spirited handle in. And you'RE GONNA love this at this point. Hank Williams senior became buddies musical model. Nice which I don't think is bad person. Look up to I mean except for alcoholism which like well later killed him. So I mean there'll be an episode. Don't worry we'll get more into. This is about buddy. We'll get the hang. We'll get to hang soon. Don't worry saying like buddy really loved his brother. Larry and Larry did kind of dote on him and he buddy tag along on his outings but Larry of course being ten years older than buddy was far more interested in chasing girls and he soon found in married. The woman of his dreams Maxine and from age ten to twelve buddy was actually the star of his class and he was cute and lovable. Anti was kind of a show off and he used to play the game. I loved the story He there used to be a playground director that he would play Canasta with and her name. Was Louise Keeton. And he would beat her every time and so one day. She got super frustrated him and she was like. How do you manage to beat me all the time and he said with a laugh? I can see your hand in your big black sunglasses cheating. It time outright told her like I could see your hand see me I would have just been like psychic in nineteen forty nine he entered. Jt Hutchinson Junior high school. In Bob Montgomery and that name is going to be these. These following names are going to be pretty important later on in life Don Gas and Jerry Allison precocious musicians. Who played an important role in his life for years to come a multi talented youth just a year younger than buddy? Don Gas could play a stand up. Bass and Steel Guitar and was beginning to write songs. Bob Montgomery could play guitar and sing country and Western and rhythm and blues and so the kind of musical landscape happening right now is that arm be is the precursor of rock and roll and it was a creation of black musicians and it was known as race records. Buddy was radically prejudiced. He was he was he was racist. That's plain and simple in his youth but he actually overcame it. It was in buddies adolescence. He listened to our and be on K. W. k. h. from Shreveport Louisiana that he began to question racial intolerance. How could he be any better than anyone? Who left him so far behind musically in the dust the simplistic hillbilly and bluegrass music. Blacks were cool. Their music was dirtier than San with titles. Like you're gonNA. It's not the meat. It's the motion sixty minute man and a big long sliding thing all those are all. You could pick that up. I can't whistle. So that's how I do. The little cat call. How is it that neither of US can whistle now? I try whistling. That's it that's all I got to win. Okay you're not. Even that's not. Even a sham sh they go closer. It's better just blubbery in your mouth like a motorboat. I'm so sorry listeners. I can't. I've never been able to whistle. You know that's why there's the few few anyways back to buddy back to buddy unlike the segregated whites at the Tabernacle Baptist African Americans knew the score and he actually wanted to be like them which is really forward thinking in like the forties and nineteen fifty. They wearing eighth grade. And Buddy and Bob scandalized half of Lubbock by singing notorious country and western novelty song called too old to cut the mustard at a p t a open house program okay. He's too old cut in kids got. He's too old when I was younger had rounded but now year old and Gentian look catch. You say these two got two now. You need a new land here. You've jumped up and now you're lucky if you. Japanese uh these two old concern. He's getting older. He's too old team. Here's a little sample. We were laughing the whole thing. Clearly you can tell how much we enjoyed it so I guess the reason why it was like scandalous was because all they're basically saying the team members or are too old. I like it. I can understand why why it would be scandalous. 'cause I guess they're calling the PTA members to old. That's what I'm getting from that but it's a funny song really funny. Gary Allison was a transfer student from Plainville Texas. Who was just a great blow? Buddy actually heard them singing the song and remember being really impressed by just his ballsy nature and his guitar playing. Nice Jerry been playing the drums since the fifth grade and one day. He asked buddy to come home with him after school and play fats. Domino's records going to the river. When Buddy heard the rock and roll he saw his future and it was like the heavens opened up or for people. That aren't religious. It was like when Harry Potter God. His wand exit was the exact same sound heaven opening up and Harry Potter. Getting his wand is the exact same sound. Tj Can you can you? Can you do the sound that do you like that? I could just be your sound effect machine on. I like on demand if sound make having sound. Make this sound if they ever remake police academy and I get to be the casting director. You're totally in house. Your police sirens and I work on it okay so if you read the Book Buddy. Holly biography by LS amber. There's a pretty salacious section in that book. Which kind of covers buddy holly's more adult side? But it gets pretty graphic and I'm talking about scandalous if you read Stephen King's novel it. Oh there's a whole part where they kind of seal their friendship pact. That they leave out of both of the versions of the movie. Apparently that was a thing in Texas. So if you don't know what I'm talking about good if you do. It's okay to be horrified. I'm not gonNA talk about it here but let's just say that buddy holly was a saucy boy. This is a family show. Yeah mostly yeah. He became sexually adventurous a moral outlaw in his times in his teen Buddy Begin to disobey his Christian parents by staying out late drinking smoking shoplifting gambling and carousing with immoral women. That was on the book. I'm glad that you quoted it directly because that is just brilliant carousing with immoral women. I love it so it was about that time that buddy and some of the local boys would start shoplifting and they would stop for Gas at a service station and then they would load up on food. While the attendant was outside pumping gas Larry actually started noticing. Some of his musical instrument started disappearing from the house when Buddy realized that they could be hawked for pocket money when a Banjo worth ten dollars. Couldn't be found. Larry wondered if buddy had hawked decades later after he become a legend actually turned up in the storage room in the home of Buddy's parents but they actually sold that at auction for eight tremendous price. I imagine but buddy would actually pawn off every other instrument around the house. Larry said he had a large Mandolin. That was the cutest thing you've ever seen. It was one of those like Gourd shaped ones with different colored would and he could play it. Ooh Book Buddy. Couldn't that Mandolin disappeared. Rude he had a a steiner fiddle and it was a really pretty one and Larry could play it but but he couldn't and that disappeared. He hawked one every time he needed some money and his mom and dad were so poor that they couldn't help him any so so he just stole everybody else's stuff in hawked it. Yeah if they if he couldn't play the instrument he would just totally still at one so rude. I know but buddy did find his way. Back to the straight and narrow as he was baptized by been D Johnson at the old Tabernacle Church and I was trying to find the year for that. But it looks like he was about thirteen to fifteen when he got baptized. So in nineteen fifty one. When Buddy was fifteen he was at his final year at Hutcherson junior high. He came home from school and he told his mother that he needed glasses. His mother response by her own description was scatter-brained. He didn't talk a lot and he was a quiet boy and I didn't pay him any mind. She said a few days later he asked again for glasses and his mother again did nothing. All of her other children had needed glasses but like she would take them to the optometrist and they would basically say they don't need them as badly as the school nurse would explain and she thought that it that buddy would turn out the same way and the third time you mentioned it. She finally paid attention she said. Why do you think you need glasses? And he said because the school nurse examined Mayes told me so he said and so she took him to the optometrist and revealed that his vision was twenty. Eight hundred. I don't know what that means in both is a normal vision is twenty twenty right twenty eight hundred but that doesn't even seem like a right twenty eight hundred but still eight hundred. Seems like that shouldn't even be passed a number that should be number a number associated with eyesight yes so after the test optometrist tournaments holly and said that this boy needs glasses pretty badly and he should had several years ago and that's how he got his iconic glasses there you know it wasn't just for show was actually so he could see things which is crazy to think because like he was a really good student. Maybe that's why he didn't like to study though. Like maybe he just retained information because it could be painful right now so around. Nineteen fifty one. Elo Holly was actually in charge of a construction crew. Those putting up a house in Lubbock and one of the young men working for him was a carpenter's airport helper named Jack. Neal is also a gifted musician and he could play the Banjo Guitar. Steel Guitar and piano and his favorite singer was Hank Williams but he also loved lefty. Brazil Webb Pierce and rice and one day at a one day at work during a lunch break. Jack took his guitar from his car and joined the rest of the construction workers on the porch of the House that they were building he started to play and L. O. Walked over to him and stood by him and just kind of listen to him. He turned over to Jack and was like my son Plays Guitar. And it sounds like y'all Oughta work together all right then. Yeah so Jack met buddy that evening and was immediately intrigued with his guitar. Playing and the pair sang some country and Western songs a couple of Gospel songs and discovered that they actually had really as a duo and that's a period of musical growth. That kind of marked the beginning buddies dreams of becoming a professional musician so now the seed has kind of been planted. So got this like musical family. This musical background a family that does kind of encouraged him a big brother that gives them the tools to learn and and now he's found kind of a kindred spirit in Jack and his father's accepting of what his son is doing or big brother who gives him the tools to learn and whom he steals instruments to Hawk from. Don't we all need that sibling? To steal from. I'm sorry that just still irks me honey. Don't you D be Hawkins Guitars? I used to steal. My brother's portable radio will like it was portable radio. It was like a Walkman but it had like one. Dial on it so you can pick up. Fm Radio Stations. It wasn't there wasn't a tape deck. There was nothing and I would constantly steal it from him and have one of those. I still my sister's. Tv's all the time well also growing up. My brother was five years older than me. And so you can like if you don't know me and my brothers relationship you can go back and listen to the pet in zeo episode that it was pretty much a relationship so having bag neal was actually a lot of fun and he was only two years older than buddy and so he really liked the outdoors and so did buddy he would they would go and they would explore lubbock Texas. They had this big sprawling area. And I did not leave this part in because it was kinda graphic but basically they would go hunting and just doing normal Texas stuff from the fifties shooting things fair enough but in neo would practice their music as hard as they play both were passionate compulsive Aficionados of the guitar and Buddy Sal was unique in an interview with Philip. Norman Neil explained. I played rhythm but he played lead. We go out to the cafes on the other side of the tracks and just sit and listen. They mostly served barbecue which we really liked and he'd say Jack. I don't want to be rich. I don't WanNa be in the limelight but I want people to remember the name Buddy. Holly and don't worry we will in nineteen fifty two. He turned sixteen and reporter for his first day of school. At Thomas J Lubbock high school which was named after Texas is civil war heroes by the spring semester of his sophomore year which was his goal was nineteen fifty and nineteen fifty three. He wrote a paper in schools stating that he wanted to become a professional country and western singer but he was realistic enough to know that the chances were slim. Nikki Sullivan later. One of the crickets was already a distant admirers of buddies and in highschool saw him perform during lunch hour singing. Hank Thomas's is country and Western. Hit while side alive and Lloyd. Price's army classic Lodhi Miss Cloudy toward the end of nineteen fifty three. He began to grow and he really grew. Monroe's argument how like small was his. His name was too big for him. Right yeah that changed. How tall did he get? I'll get to that okay. Because it includes one of my wishes growing up was hard on buddy scholastic record to in the last week of his semester. He was expelled from plane geometry. I probably would have been too. Hey geometry is hard. I was good at math except for geometry. I almost failed that class. Nope I suck at math and like if someone tells me how old I was like. I was born in nineteen sixty two. I'll have to pull up my calculator and go twenty twenty minus nineteen sixty two. Okay you're blah. I can't do it in my head. Either you Gimme Algebra. You can meet Trig you calculus got it geometry for whatever. Reason could not work it out but he was also derelict in his biology assignments and he was actually expecting to flunk out so he borrowed his dad's truck and gave a new meaning to the phrase hell on wheels in a single day. He totaled both the windshield and the hood of his father's truck and a few days later on his way to an interview for drafting firm. He crashed into a Chrysler and destroyed the front. Half of Holly's car. No totally being billy Joel. Just like running into things. Oh no but he actually got that job and yet started. Drawing blueprints for Panhandle Steele says a pretty good job around this time. He considered electrical engineering as a profession during the last two years of school. He dreamed of becoming a recording artist. But was enough of a realist. Not The chances against this happening were overwhelming. And that being said he thought of either becoming a draftsman or an electrical engineer would be something reasonable to fall back on. Which is that's smart like pursue your dream. Blood have a backup plan. Just in case something that you love to do 'em buddy would actually work every angle. He possibly could break into a local radio station. He boldly invaded the station. K. S. E. L. One day and informed a startled employees that he wanted to see Ben Hall who was the DJ who is taking the one PM to The one PM to three shifts and he actually impressed Ben with his Moxie Hall was a singer Songwriter and he invited buddy to perform with him at local sports arenas were occasionally programs. Were held the first GIG together. He arrived carrying an electric guitar and wearing a large white cowboy hat. Buddy the other guy buddy okay. Weldon Myrick and outstanding young steel guitarist who had played with Jim Reeves which is impressive. By the time he was sixteen performed with Buddy and Jack Neal that night and the Gig went so well he actually frequently used buddy as backup instrumentalists in nineteen fifty-three the entire staff of Kate S. E. L. Bolton and moved to K. D. A. V. And here's something interesting. They established the first all country and Western radio station. Cool maybe we'll have to do an episode on Katie A. V. One day there you. You'll love that that'll be your episode. Yeah but he had his heart set on appearing on. Kabc's popular Sunday party which is hosted by station odor. Dave Pinkston whose professional name was pappy. Dave stone pappy okay. Yeah stone once explained that his surname was too hard for collars the station to pronounce a so. He dropped the first level of his name and changed stunned to stone so he dropped the pink and just kept it a stone. So that's kind of. I don't know where pappy came from. I guess 'cause he's the daddy of the radio station. I think Dave Pinkston was is a fine name but okay so Buddy Jack. We're still doing morning. Kiddie shows which regularly were scouted by Katie V. Assistant Manager High Pockets Dunkin and I tried to find his real name. I could not. He is literally just known as high pockets like it. I like to got character. It does in the league partisan timber nineteen fifty-three pockets auditioning them and they were singing. A DUET AT K. Dav Studios and described their music as country and western with a little upbeat or rockabilly as it would shortly be known so rockabilly hasn't really been invented yet said with a question mark. I think this is the time where it's becoming itself does if that makes sense like it's becoming a thing now because you have people mixing that country Western with R&B Rock so yeah. This is the time when it's becoming thing. Yeah and genre and buddy would really kind of embrace that rockabilly sound too so you have a beat of your own hypoc stole buddy. You are determined to be a star. He offered to host buddies radio. Debut the Buddy and Jack Show and that went on the Air November eighth nineteen fifty-three opening with Hank Williams your cheatin heart. Shall we play it? Let's play a little bit of it. Play like thirty seconds of it. Okay make you and Lebron a will tell when tears black so yeah so that opened their first show. Yup that's cool then. Yeah it's a good song. The great song the newly discovered pair received Fan mail almost immediately. Their fans wrote out the titles of the songs. They wanted to hear them sing on air like so fans actually like took the time to sit down and write a handwritten note and send it to the radio station more. Yeah I mean I mean. There's really not another way to do that. I mean you could. I guess you could. Could you call in at that point? I suppose if you had a telephone if you had a phone Being a country music fan you should know the year that the phone was invented. Why does that mean the other back in eighteen? Seventy six boy bill by no contraption that we know so well I sing that song to which is. Yeah but it wasn't always like everybody can have their own phone line until later. This is the fifty. He's not not the twenties. Everybody had a phone just about. I think it was party. Lines well into the sixties. Yeah but you still had a phone. Yeah I guess but still who letters are nice and you know yeah now. It's emails even that and then our fans like to send US notes as they listened to us on instagram. Or I love I love it. Yep so now. They are hit at K. Dav and buddy. Jack felt free to hang out there teaching themselves everything. There was to know about broadcasting and recording equipment and listening to the station's extensive record collection. Is You have to imagine like a kid that loves music as much as buddy did that. Had to be like a dream come true just to have access to any record that he wanted to listen to. I would love that you hitting me by all vinyl to how my God. My neighbor has the Dan in the world and I want one. It's basically just a music cave and it's just surround like every wall is covered in either some form of stereo equipment or a wallow records and it's my favorite place in the whole world. That's why I like our living room because it is a it is a shrine to film yes so high pockets and Ben Hall always greeted him warmly and made them feel at home. Dave stone was another ardent advocate of buddies and he recorded the duo on Acetate on November tenth nineteen fifty-three But he played lead. And Jack Sang. I saw the moon crying last night. And I hear the Lord calling for me so those are the two songs that they actually recorded. Cool but neil had a girlfriend and was serious about her and he was also holding down a full time job as an electrical contractor and all that was kind of absorbing most of his time interests and eventually he got married and moved to New Mexico. So Buddy lost his partner on Katie but he teamed up again with Bob Montgomery his girlfriend from TJ Hutchinson Junior high and he sang with him on the Sunday Party and the Sunday party was basically just kind of a jam session. It was basically for anybody who wanted to show up and pick said Sonny Curtis a multi talented musician from Meadows Texas. Which is a small town about thirty miles south of Lubbock so people would drive a good distance to be a part of the Sunday party. Yeah just go play. Yeah I love open jams. They can be fun sometimes. Yeah and it was being broadcast so that was Kinda cool so it was you get something fresh new every single time you listen to it right and you might hear six artists one Sunday. And then there'd be a completely different set the next week so if you had the time and the tenacity and you wanted to sing into the Mike you're welcome and sunny remembers broadcasting with buddy in Bob Singing duets with Ben Holland and sometimes doing Solos Weldon. Myrick turned into a real hot steel guitar. Player was also around on Sunday parties. And Weldon I think does a lot of recordings on all the old classic country records that we hear okay. So maybe we'll have to jump into WHO Weldon was 'cause put him on the list. We'll put him on the list and you asked me about. How tall was buddy? Yeah by the time he was seventeen. He had grown to five feet eleven inches tall. I'm five two so for me. It's a giant for you. That's a giant guys that are like six ten. Oh soon why I actually know someone who is seven two so the and I don't like standing next to them because it looks like a visual joke fair enough. I hear them saying he only weighed one. Hundred forty five pounds. Well yeah he's kind of wish to. Oh Jeez I weigh seven pounds. More than Buddy Holly and. I am nine nine nine. I told you I can't do math nine inches shorter. I took that out. It's hard for watching we tried to do it was it was kind of adorable. Try to figure out eleven minus two. I so smart in like every other subjects I can do science. I can do literature. You put math in front of me and high will cry. You don't have to be good at everything kids. He's tall now and he started his junior year of high school and he and Bob Montgomery told Dave pappy stone that they were ready for their own radio show and this can have major. Kahane's like he was just like this is what I want and you should give it to me and people like it. Pappy was really impressed by this kid. Just being like I want my own show and and there is an old saying that. Fortune favors the bold. So it's true. He auditioned buddy and Bob and pronounce that they were very good and he booked them into their own two thirty PM. Thirty minutes segment on K. D. A. S. on Sunday party and it was called the buddy. And Bob Show. And it went on the air in late nineteen fifty-three so in like he just was like. I want my own show. And then he auditioned in there like sure. It's yours like okay okay. I had a bit of an ulterior motive stone later admitted as Lubbock high school students. Buddy and Bob were sure to increase the audience among the youths who demanded Raunchy like dirty Raunchy songs. Which is kind of what buddy and Bob were doing. And some of the songs they sang were sexually explicit. R&b Tunes like work with me. Annie which clearly describes the couple in the throes of passion with the man instructing the woman to give him plenty of meat. I feel like we need to pull that up. Hang on Let me see if I can find a copy of work with me. Annie that we can play for you guys. Yeah okay. So the the version that I found was Hank Ballard or should we do snooky pryor snooky pryor? I like that name. Oh this is dirty. Must Liberty free? That was version of work with me any Maybe just that we've been so disenchanted and like given things like game of thrones. It doesn't seem that salacious now does it? Not really but back in the day. Yeah so they would perform songs like that and Stone said believe me. They didn't anymore than get on that show and get it started when the phone would start ringing off the wall so like they were super popular and they were bringing a listening crowd. Chew the radio station so that made them incredibly happy. It's good yeah. It's radio stations won't okay so now this has never really happened before on an episode of Rock and Roll Heaven so I feel like history is being made right now. What do you mean because we have crossover a crossover? Yes what do you mean? Because when Roy orbison heard Buddy on K. D. A. V? It altered his life at this time. Roy Actually had his own TV show but he was convinced that he would never succeed because he wore glasses and after he met buddy he thought if this guy wears glasses and his trying to make big maybe I can too yeah. It was a glasses thing. You'll be here at his own. Tv show so he was already being successful yet. But not not really because orbison later account. That buddy was a very bright and dedicated kid. He wasn't uppity as we say in the business. He wasn't flashy. He could tell jokes and we had a relationship that really developed buddy helped Roy with lead structures on some of the songs. Roy was trying to right at the time. And it was buddy. Who showed orbison the lick that would become so popular years later when Roy recorded pretty woman and I'm assuming they talk about the the almost like slapping sound the one. Yeah Yeah so buddy. Kinda gave that to him. That's cool. Yeah all right all right. That's true crossover I guess. Yeah Hi. Pockets offered buddy and Bob some sage advice after he learned that they had been providing free entertainment for Lubbock man. Who invited him to play at his party's they had eaten all they wanted. But the man paid for nothing. That party boy is using you. High pocket said we always get fed. Said Buddy looks at high pocket. I'm willing to be your manager. Find said Buddy. What does that mean? You'll need to beef up your act and get someone on base? Maybe Larry Welborn will organize a trio buddy Bob and Larry Catchy name right. Sure Larry's actually timely addition to the Buddy and Bob Act which is experiencing some strain and you can imagine that like they've been friends for a couple years now they're working together and I honestly but he is never imagine that L. D. Don't forget our therapy session is on Tuesday at six I just I love you. I love you too. That's why we're still doing this and haven't killed each other doesn't mean we don't want to sometimes well when. I told you the original page count for this episode of thought you were going to kill me. I almost did. It was around this time. That buddy actually fell in love with a classmate and she has a very cool name. I will say that her name was Echo. Alright Echo Elaine McGuire Echo was undoubtedly important to buddy but she was never top priority with him. She was somewhere below music. God Beer and sex and that's a direct quote. Whoa buddy had a choice of going out on a date or playing his guitar. He'd be playing his guitar. Nikki Sullivan said and like I said Nicky was eventually one of the crickets so Music was important to him though he an echo did go steady but I don't. I don't really think that relationship lasted too long and I do bring her up later. So Larry Welborn was the bass player that high pockets had recommended was a few years younger than buddy and was attending Carol Thompson. Junior high school when Buddy. Recruit him for the Buddy and Bob Act top billing for themselves buddy and Bob ordered business cards. That simply red buddy and Bob Western pop co-signing Larry to smaller type at the edges of the car and listening. Hi pockets as their business manager and CARE OF K. Dav there is like no mention of the phone number or any other way or each them so they just got these business cards right later in nineteen fifty. Four Larry Actually dropped out of the act and buddy and Bob and dawn who remember was his friend Don Glass Joined them and then they formed the rhythm playboys. Hypoc is drew up a contract that pretty much explicitly stated that Bobby could not perform for any more free parties and the bookings began to come in and at this point so did the money which is really good because a lot of these horror stories in music is basically like yeah. They work their butts off and got no money for it so they perform during remote broadcasts at store opening sing at high school assemblies and did community shows and car lot sales. But you have to remember. That not only was but he's still underage. He was actually still in high school and because he was doing all those different shows he started to neglect his score. Midway through the junior year his mother told him to start bringing books home to study. It was going to be hard for now. She said but it wasn't for buddy because we talked about how he was actually inexplicably like super intelligent right. He wasn't able researcher for a writer his age and actually wrote a ton of interesting papers years later when his test and term themes were auctioned off at Sotheby's in the New Yorker magazine reviewed his Book Report on Robert Frost. An pronounced it by homework standards a masterpiece. His writing style like his later song lyrics were simple and powerful. He was a natural okay. You'RE GONNA love this pay attention TJ. I'm waiting for a good part. We're still talking about him as a kid. In nineteen fifty four buddy met welling jennings. Yeah who was ten months younger than buddy and just as ambitious. He actually grew up picking cotton and in his words. It's either music or pull cotton for the rest of your life. He was a high school dropout at fourteen and actually would love to get more into whalen on this episode. But we're actually going to be doing his own episode in future months. He's going to get done this year. Yeah so hold tight for that. Maybe I'll do a country month. Ooh And I have a month off I would love that s possibly At still month. Australian it's a stretch to say country month. Yeah but back in nineteen fifty four occasionally drive down to K. Dav to catch buddy on the Sunday party or they run into each other at amateur contests held on Saturday afternoons at movie theaters around West Texas sometime aband- would win two or three weeks running. He told author Peter. Oh goodness Peter Girl Nick. In nineteen seventy four. We were still playing country. There was nothing anything else really. We were just working on a Lotta shows together so basically like they would go and just kind of sweep these contests and stuff like that and eventually they were like good teaches comeback. Let somebody else win somewhere around. Nineteen fifty three and nineteen fifty four representative Columbia records heard Buddy and Bob and that raise their hopes for a recording contract. They rounded up. Sonny Curtis Larry Welborn and Don Guest and drove to Wichita Falls Texas which is two hundred miles away from Lubbock so they drove up pretty darn long way and they cut. Texas is huge taxes depressingly large breath bin Laden you start driving through Texas and you driven like eight hundred miles and you're like and you're still intact are still in Texas I I love. Texas is beautiful and I've been to Houston Dallas and I love both those cities and I know that's not like all of Texas but I do like Texas because it's other than the Super Big Cities. There's no people there and I like that because then my anxiety goes down L. D. Yeah I'd walk across Texas with you I would also walk across Texas with you. We have a lot to talk about. Of course it'd probably an old country song is it. Yeah no and I love it. I listened to motown. You're listening to the country. I was listening to Motown so I actually didn't know the older stuff till I got older. I'm sorry it's waltz across Texas not walk. I can't waltz but I would walk across Texas with you okay. They drove the two hundred miles to cut a demo at the nest men studios the songs they recorded. Were Bob Montgomery's gotTa get you near me. Blues and flower of my heart. They they never actually heard from the Columbia Man but those tapes actually do survive so even though Columbia records didn't give them a deal. I guess you can still have access to those two recordings which is really impressive because this is like nineteen fifty three nineteen fifty four so they survived then. Rock and roll was becoming more dominant on the airwaves and during buddies senior year which was like nineteen fifty four to nineteen fifty five the most popular jukebox hits where the cutting cruise ship boom and the penguins earth angels. Do you know either one of the songs I think I know. Earth Angels. Yeah here. It's the crew cuts Shibam okay. I'm GONNA play you. The crew cuts shabu on land. Ooh Dream VIVICA. Take you up in Paradise Fish. You tell me on the only one nine three should get all should people the all my freshest land comes if you let me spend my whole life loving you. That's sweet music that makes me Kinda cringe. Most time. I'll see. I love that. For some reason I feel like that was in a movie sales. Going to bug me. I looked up and that that song was actually inclu which is one of my favorite films because it stars Tim. Curry clue is excellent. Adds a fantastic movie. Yes but I just. I don't know like it's fine if I hear it in stuff. And it makes sense in like a period movie or something but also I think I called the cutting crew. And I'm sorry for that and it was. The crew cuts looks fixing that. So sorry so. Those were like the the big prominent jukebox songs. In so buddy kinda started to change up his style a little bit to kind of suit the times and he graduated high school on. Friday may twenty seventh nineteen fifty-five funny enough. Buddy wasn't asked to sing despite the fact that the commencement exercises included several musical numbers. Such as I believe. I don't actually know that song and I don't think it's the song from the book of Mormon. I have a feeling it's not that no you don't think so. No because I don't think at graduation of the phrase a warlord that choose people in the face. What's so scary about that is probably appropriate for that. Probably not Following these Air Omonia. Promise held downtown at the dunlap store. Which I in my head I. I don't know what the right answer is but I keep thinking. They held at a tire store. So to- No I don't either. Maybe maybe it is. Maybe it was. Maybe they have like a big floor and not a big class and they can have fun there. In the Fall Echo went away to college enrolling in a religious school in Abilene Texas which is almost two hundred miles away from Lubbock and from then on she embodied would only see each other on the weekends. But Larry Holly said that. He brought her over to my house. Some and I felt like he would marry her and this this Larry is his brother so his brother Larry. Not The other Larry. There's so many Larry's in the story as I'm sorry so many Larry's but despite Larry's opinion the separation between the two of them kind marked the beginning of the end of their relationship and from this point on her name would resonate more in his music than in his actual life right. Yeah Hi pockets. There's no easy way for me. The segue into this kind of like bulldoze right into it. High pockets once said that he was the first promoter to book Elvis into Lubbock in the beginning. Elvis's fee was only twenty five dollars. I mean it's not bad. Yeah he had to musicians. Scotty Moore and Bill Black. But he's hold high pockets. He'd be glad to add to his band if high pockets could guarantee them. A regular dancing GIG and high pockets kept booking them until Elvis is cost of asking kind of sore out of his league and in Nineteen fifty five. Holly Open Up for personally at the fair Park Coliseum in April at the cotton club and then again in June at the Coliseum and according to legend so I D- I only found like maybe two places that actually had this story. So take it for what it's worth either way. It's a cool story. According to legend Elvis super late to the concert and buddy stayed on and blew the roof off the place by that time. He had incorporated into his band. Larry Wilbert on the stand up bass and allison on the drums as his style shifted from C. N. W. to rock and roll due to sing Presley's performances and hearing his music in October Stone Book Bill Haley and his comets and placed holly as the opening act to be seen by Nashville Scout Eddie crandall impressive crandall persuaded Grand Ole opry manager Jim Denny to seek a recording contract for holly now in some things I read that they're only interested in holly as a Solo Act Buddy threatened to put the deal off if they didn't cut bob in but when Bob heard what was going on he bowed out of the deal that's respectable which. I thought was really sweet. It was like yeah okay so they send in the demo tape which Denny Ford it to Paul Cohen to sign the band to Decca records in February nineteen fifty six in the contract. Deca misspelled holly surname. Which was H. o? L. L. E. Y. S. H. O. L. L. Y. And then from then on he was known as Buddy Holly as we now know him at this time he also made what he called the biggest mistake in his life and that was leading hypothesis. Go as his manager. Womp WOMP he up on January twenty six nineteen fifty-six. Holly attended his first formal recording session which was produced by Owen Bradley. And for some reason I was reading that and that name Kep Gnawing at me but I didn't have an opportunity to kind of dig more into him. I think he is one of those big producers. Oh yeah so Owen Bradley was. Here's a musician record producer. So like he along with Chet Atkins and Bob Ferguson Bill Porter and Don law so they were Kinda chief architects in the fifties and sixties of the Nashville sound and country music and rockabilly. So they're so basically Owen Bradley working with Buddy Holly at this time was really important for Holly Okay. Cool thank you for that because it was bugging me and I just I was chopping so much. I don't remember if actually wrote it in or didn't have the opportunity to look up. I think I brought him up briefly in the Patsy cline episode because we were talking about the national sound. So maybe that's why I got it. Okay cool so he actually two more sessions in Nashville but with the producer selecting the session musicians Anna Arrangements? Holly became increasingly frustrated by his lack of creative control. And we've talked about that in almost every episode of this podcast. I feel like let the artists be the artists. Yeah there's a reason why you wanted them. Yes in April nineteen fifty-six Decca released blue days black nights as a single with love me on the B side Dinnie included holly on a tour as the opening act for Faron young during the tour. They were promoted as buddy holly and the two tones again bad name terrible name while later. Decca called them buddy holly and the three tunes even worse even worse. The label later released hollies second single modern. Don Juan backed with. You are my one desire. Neither single made an impression on January twenty second nineteen fifty seven. Decca INFORMED HOLLY THAT. His contract would not be renewed but insisted that he could not record the same songs for anyone else for five years. Yeah and see. Here's the thing. Sometimes the labels are right with like Patsy cline she wanted she didn't want to do the crooning thing but that made her career with many many other artists though generally the labels and exact stepping in and dictating what they want you to do. Generally tanks someone's career So not surprised that yet and yet again the legal wants to trump them. They're not letting them do what they do. Best but I think it was probably a good thing because Hollywood so frustrated by not having that freedom that he. He was probably grateful that he was dropped right. I think at this point. It's important to know that we really haven't touched on a lot of buddy holly's like well known songs. And there's a reason for that. But I wanted to point out that Donna by Ritchie Valens which we think we played that but that all other we played it. But did you play? I'm might have no. I played La Bomba the end of it But Donna was based on a real person and one of buddy. Holly's biggest hits was Peggy Sue. She's also a real person role really yes her name was Peggy Sue Jaren. I think I'm pronouncing that right if I'm not office so let me play a little bit of that. Know what I feel without. Take a big pretty pretty. Pretty PRETTY PEGGY SUE. This is my music though like this. You're jammed this. You're my hood now. So Peggy sue the whole story. Basically was buddy was in a hurry at one of the performance areas that he was working at and so he ran out of the green room carrying like an amp and guitar and he just slammed into her whoops like literally ran into her and he looked up and he was oh. God She's beautiful. She's blonde but Peggy actually got a crush on Jerry and stand in the band room and watch him play the drums. Peggy Jerry Buddy. Echo would go out on double dates when she would come back home for college but eventually Peggy and Jerry broke up but they would get back together later on so I feel like maybe buddy might have had and kind of a crush on her. But I don't think they ever actually dated or maybe it was just a good. Yeah I don't know might of though. So Holly of course was unhappy with the results of his time with deca and he was inspired by the success of Buddy Knox's party doll and Jim Bones. I'm sticking with you and visited Norman. Petty who had produced and promoted both of those records together with allison basis. Joe B Mauldin and Rhythm Guitarist Nikki Sullivan. He went to Petty Studio in. Clovis New Mexico and the group recorded a demo of that will be the day okay. That's great song I haven't already pulled. Oh dear yeah lingering come back in the May so yeah that was. That'll be the day. I love that song. I actually like this onto. I actually like the Buddy Holly Hits because they're not the saccharin sweet stuff that I just. Those are the sound effects that I'm talking about in my but it's got that little bit of rockabilly going on so actually like buddy holly stuff from that time like. That's the kind of stuff I like from that era. Yeah you know It was like the country and then that rockabilly and the blues like an RB. Let's what I enjoy like the pop saccharin sweet so on those. He started playing the lead guitar he he could achieve the sound that he desired petty became his manager and then sent the record to Brunswick records in New York City. Holly was actually still under contract with Decca and could not release the record under his name's. So abandoned was used. Allison proposed the name crickets. So that's where that name came from much better. Yeah then the two tones or the three tunes. Well 'cause the crickets okay. Being from the south. The sound of CICADAS and crickets are some of the beautiful and peaceful. Sounds to me. They're gorgeous. Also that name brings up just good feelings and like quiet. Peace peaceful feelings that I I. Yeah CRICKET'S BETTER NAME. Sorry Better Brunswick gave Holly Basic Agreement to release. That'll be the day leaving him with both artistic control and financial responsibilities for future recordings. So that's good impressed with the demo. The labels executives released it without recording a new version. I'm looking for someone to love. Was the B side the singles credit to the crickets petty. Holly later learned that Brunswick was a subsidiary of Decca which legally cleared future recordings under the name. Buddy holly which that's also good news right. Yeah recordings credited to the crickets would be released on. Brunswick while recordings under Holly's name would be released on another subsidary label coral records so basically all of that was still under the umbrella of of Decca so legally. That's so complicated. It is and I put it under because it's really important to understand why he's Buddy Holly Buddy Holly. And the crickets crickets like. There's so many reasons though. It's very important to understand that. Yeah yeah that'll be. The day was released on. May Twenty Seventh Nineteen fifty seven and petty booked holly and the crickets for tour with Irving Feld. Who had noticed the ban after that'll be the day appeared on R&B Charts. They booked him for appearances in Washington DC Baltimore and New York City. The band was booked to play. New York's Apollo Theater. Oh my on August. Sixteen th through the twenty second during the opening performances. The group did not impress the audience but they were accepted after including Bo Diddley by the end of their run at the Apollo. That'll be the day was climbing. The charts encouraged by the success of the single petty started to prepare to albums to be released a solo album for holly and another for the crickets. Holly appeared on American bandstand hosted by Dick Clark on. Abc On August. Twenty six th. Before leaving New York. The Band actually befriended the Everley brothers. That'll be the day topped the US bestsellers in store charts on September twenty third and was number one on the U casing charge for three weeks in November Onset Timber Namie on September twentieth. Sorry that one of those good sounds. Yup On September Twentieth Corps released. Peggy sue backed with every day. I'm not gonNA play every day now because that's actually going to be the end song because that is probably my favorite Buddy Holly Song. So that's what we're ending the show with And Holly was credited as the performer. By October Peggy Sue had reached number three on the billboard chart and number two on the RB chart and it peaked at number six on the UK singles chart as the success of the song grew. Bork it brought more attention to holly with the band at the time being billed as buddy holly and the crickets and that's like what stock 'cause that's when I was growing up my mom would say this is buddy holly and the crickets. Yeah no matter what song it was it was buddy holly and the crickets. In the last week of September. The band members flew back to Lubbock to visit their families. Hollies high school girlfriend echo had left him for a fellow student. Womp womp aside from McGuire had a relationship with a Lubbock Fan June Clark after Clark ended their relationship holly realize the importance of his relationship with McGuire and considered his time with Clark and his relationship with Clark a temporary one. Meanwhile for their return to recording petty arranged sessions in Oklahoma City where he was performing with his own band. While the band drove to location the producers actually set up a makeshift studio of the rest of the songs needed for the album were recorded and petty later dubbed the material in Clovis. The resulting album was the chirping crickets released on November twenty seventh nineteen fifty seven erase number five on the UK album charts and in October Brunswick released the second single by the crickets. Oh boy which is great and not fade away and you WANNA play. Oh boy what you've been on windows me hold on the overrode the hour waiting to be no hesitate noble all win you the whole all world that. I love that Song Jinx. Y'ALL MINNESOTA I'll give you one. Don't worry yeah. Oh boy is just so energetic and happy and I love it and just makes me smile every time I hear it. So they had not fade away on the B side. It reached number ten on the pop charts and thirteen on the RB charts. Holly and the crickets performed. That'll be the day. And Peggy sue on the Ed Sullivan. Show on December. First Nineteen fifty seven following. The appearance. Nikki Nikki Sullivan. Left the group because of the intense touring on December twenty ninth holly and the Crickets Performed Peggy. Sue on the author Murray Party Woo on January eighth nineteen fifty eight. Holly and the crickets joined America's greatest teenage recording stars tour. That rolls off the tongue. Easy Yeah Yeah. Super Easy on January twenty fifth Holy Recorded Raven and then he made his second appearance on the Ed Sullivan show singing. Oh boy he departed to perform in Honolulu Hawaii on January twenty seventh and then started a tour of Australia and the United Kingdom playing fifty shows in twenty five days to show the day. It might be more because it was Australia and the UK. So there have to be downtime between my goodness gracious. Little Boys Sleep. Yeah that same month which was march his debut solo album buddy. Holly was released upon their return to the United States. Holly and the crickets joined Alan freed. Big beat show tour for forty one dates which we have to Hewitt. Yes we do so good so good we I mean this kid is just going and going. And he went to hyper speed In April Decca released. That'll be the day featuring the songs recorded with Bradley. During his early Nashville sessions a new recording session in Clovis was arranged in May Holly Higher Tommy L. Sub. Remember that name to play Lead Guitar. The sessions produced recordings of. It's so easy and heartbe. Holly was impressed by also up and invited him to join the crickets in June. Holly traveled alone to New York for a solo recording session. Without the crickets. He chose to be backed by Jazz. And Armband recording. Now we're one and Bobby Darren's early in the morning I love Bobby. Darrin love Bobby Darin. There'll be an episode of him and I. I will probably have to do that. Because Bobby Darin so much I'll let you have him. During a visit to the offices of Pierre South Holly met Mary Elena Santiago. Oh Yep Senorita. Born in San Juan Puerto Rico Zero Maryland. His mother died when she was twenty. Two years old her mother was twenty two and in nineteen fifty-three her father sent her to live with her. Aunt Pro Garcia in New York City. Saint Jago worked as a receptionist for the music publisher. Pure MUSIC. He asked her out on their first meeting and then promptly got her aunt's permission five hours into their day. Buddy handed a rose to Maria and ask her to marry him The wedding took place on August. Fifteenth Nineteen Fifty eight less than two months later from the first time they ever met and they were actually married in buddies hometown of Lubbock Texas Q. They settle down in Lubbock until buddy broke up with his band. And we'll get to that But they moved to New York City and petty disapproved of the marriage. And I hear this a lot in in them older. I like the olden days. Unfortunately it still happens where they disapproved of the marriage and they advised holly to keep it secret to avoid upsetting his fans so appear to be single. Penny has managed didn't approve of this marriage. There's also racial tensions and interracial marriage and yeah whatever but the big thing was if hollies married he can lose his fans right and that was like that too. Yeah that to you. See that a lot still yeah. Dang Pettis reaction created friction with Holly. Who had started to question pettis bookkeeping so again like we've talked about the so many times where like artists rights are kind of abused like they. They have all the town the drive in the people behind them take all the money. So Yeah Watch. Your books beeps. Yeah know your math and watch your books. So the crickets frustrated because he controlled all the proceeds from the band were also in conflict with petty. So he's got both buddy. That's Madam and the crickets. That are mad at him. Yeah you should always just watch the books and like make sure you know where all the money is going. Yeah no no sketchy charges. Yeah so holly. And Santiago frequented many of the New York music venues including the Village Gate Blue Navy Blue Note village vanguard and Johnny Johnson's and I lived in New York like I was saying at the beginning of this episode and I don't know if I have heard of any of those I was more of a limelight. Kinda girl growing up you think. Well I went through a phase where the limelight was like my place but Webster Hall. That was the other thing if we have any New York listeners. That went to Webster Hall in Two Thousand One. Two thousand three. GimMe a shout out. 'cause Webster Hall was my down wait. Is the limelight venue. Yes oh I thought you meant like you like to be no. No limelight was a converted church. It was an old church and I think that it's been a lot of different things over the the time but when I was there it was limelight and it was kind of a rave club which I thought was Kinda cool because it was in a church so the acoustics was kind of awesome. Yeah it would be. And then they had the high ceilings. Had these really great light rigs and stuff like that so it was really cool place and it was right by my house and so was Webster Hall there are both in like walking distance so when we went to Galway there was a restaurant that we went to. That must have been a converted church or something like it was really cool vibe in there and like had some stained glass on the floors and had like the art carved like what's that called the panels the triptychs. Yeah so that was really really cool to look at. I would've loved to have a drink. Their food was not so good But it was really cool place. I'm glad we went unanswered. Palmer since IAGO later said that holly was learning finger style. Flamenco guitar he would also visit her aunt to play the piano that she had their nice. He had actually planned a collaboration between soul singers and rock and roll and he wanted to make an album with Ray Charles and Mahalia Jackson. Oh Cool Yeah. Never came to fruition. Of course. That would've been awesome. Yeah he also had ambitions to work in film and registered for acting classes with Lee Strasberg at the actors studio. Which was if I'm not mistaken. The same one that Marilyn Monroe went to crime which would have been about the same time ish. I think. Okay you can ask me am okay with that. Let us know if we're right or wrong. Yeah Sanchia because I'm just thinking about this stuff off my head. Yeah trying to make connections in my head this not in our research. Yeah it's not the research sorry Santiago accompanied Holly on Tours. This is a an important detail so she would go on tour with him but to hide her America. Holly because remember we were talking about how it was a thing back then to hide marriages so that it would. They would still be appealing to young girls. Young girls thinking they were single men and I keep bringing this movie out but I think they did the same thing with Tyler's character in that thing you do like. They gave her a job so that she can be with her boyfriend so right so to hide her marriage to Holly. She was presented as the crickets secretary. She took care of the laundry and equipment setup and collected the concert. Revenues and Santiago kept the money for the band instead of their habitually transferring petty in New Mexico and she and her haunt privy executive of the Latin American Music Department at Peer Southern Convinced. Holly that petty was paying the band's royalties from the Coral Brunswick's to his own company account. Ooh Yeah Holly Plan to retrieve the royalties from petty and later to fire him as the manager and the producer and at the recommendation of the Everley brothers. Holly Hired Lawyer Herald Ornstein to negotiate the royalties. The problems with petty were triggered after he was unable to pay holly. And because Holly's royalties originated in New York and George were directed out of state. The payments were actually frozen until the dispute was settled so worst. Yeah and here's the thing as an actress. I was an actress in New York and I did a TV show called Chapelle show and a lot of people know that show and it's weird because I actually have to pay extra on my taxes because I still get royalties from doing that. Show but they originate out of entertainment partners in New York City right and it is a pain in the body as a state tax from New York. Yes yeah luckily I have a finance guy that just says pay this and I'll get into the right place but before was a real headache because at have two different states that technically I quote unquote worked out of even though it was just a royalty. Yeah and it's a headache. So I I understand. Why there was a hiccup there. Because he's at a New York Texas New Mexico. All this money has like bouncing around so so he actually ended his association with petty in December Nineteen Fifty Eight. The band members actually kept him on as their managers and so he actually just split from the crickets which were why the crickets weren't going to be playing the winter. Dance Party makes sense. Yeah so petty was still holding the money from the royalties forcing holly to form a new band and returned to touring Hollywood vacationing with his wife in Lubbock and visited Jennings radio station. Then we're talking about waylon jennings in December nineteen fifty eight. And I don't know I know you did. Some digging for the big bopper episode but I did this for both Richie and four buddy. I could not find what the next is was for the winter. Dance Party like the beginning of it. Like where did it start? Who What who had the brain child was buddy. That did it like I couldn't find any information about who did what like we know who what do you do. You mean like who organized. Yeah I don't know I didn't find that either at couldn't find it. I was trying to find information out about the winter dance party and basically it's just appeared. It's still going on now. And it's the Buddy Holly Winter Dance Party and they have well personalities but and it could be something where it was just a tour that they were doing and then because of the tragedy they continued it annually possibly yeah But I'm not really sure where originated please listeners. If you are hearing this and you know let us know because no. Because I couldn't find it anywhere I did so many deep dives. I checked my books. I it and I'm a research hound so after taking a quick pause to do some research we cannot figure out what the origin of the original winter dance party was in terms of like if it was a radio station that put it together. If it was the band's a put it together who put it together? Or if there was like a promoter or if one of buddy holly did it or what right. Who If you know? Please let us know because we really do. We really tried to find this out. I mean seriously like I have three books somebody holly. It's not in any of those I just don't know I'm at a loss. Yeah and I've been digging on the current. We did a little bit of digging on the current Dance Party and all this stuff. I did however find the origin of the current winter dance party. That is an annual tribute. To the day the music died with Buddy Holly Ritchie Valens and the big bopper This has been going on. Actually since nineteen seventy nine I believe. And what's crazy is. It's the only one that is endorsed by. Buddy HOLLY'S WIFE. Yeah by all three of them actually offering estates. So here's a a little bit and I'm reading this off of the Surf ballrooms page or I'm sorry. Yeah THEY HAVE A. They have a page for the winter. Dance Party So it said the SURF ballrooms winter. Dance Party the event began after an on air. Just by clear Lake Radio personality known as the Mad Hatter back in the late seventies on local clear Lake Radio Station Casey ev the mad hatter whose real name is Daryl. Hensley was doing his show one day when he told listeners. There was a time in my studio. And Buddy holly is just walked in. He proposed he pretended to have an on air. Conversation with the Rock and roll icon. Buddy suggested the idea of holding a memorial concert at the Surf on the twentieth anniversary of his death and the mad hatter told him he would make it happen so so he basically initiated this now annual tribute to these three people that tours around the country and has since nineteen seventy nine so and actually L. DNA in the process of doing this research found tickets to the dance party. That's happening not that far away from us at the end of this week. So stay tuned. We may go. We might go. We may go. Who knows that'll be the day baby? Good way to Tana Buddy Holly Song Right. Hey you're not the only one that can do a segue lady align the Queen of Sweden Segue Segue Segue segue on the queen of big wave. He's thinking of segues back to the story. Boom did it again fired so for the start of the Winter Dance Party. He assembled a band consisting of Wailing Jennings on the Electric Bass Tummy also on guitar. And Carl Bunch. Who was on drums? Which is weird. Because Karl didn't have it on the plane no he didn't. It was just for Tommy Waylon. Maybe he didn't like Carl. I wild speculation. Please do not at me on that. She's getting guys. I'm just making a joke holling. Maybe Carl needed to stay with his drums. He just loves his drums. He's got a writer on the bus with his drums in a Holly Jennings left for New York City on January Fifteenth Nineteen fifty-nine. The Winter Dance Party tour began in Milwaukee Wisconsin on January twenty third nineteen fifty nine. The amount of travel involved created logistical problems. As the distance between venues had not been considered when scheduling performances which was crazy for the amount that they were touring and they didn't take into consideration. Like it's GonNa take us three days to drive here but you have a scheduled in two days like that. That seems like that sort of logistical problem. It's all around. The upper midwest means not by foreign between venues. Unless you take into account the horrible weather will not only that but adding to the problems. The unheeded tour bus broke down twice in the freezing weather with dire consequences. We'll maybe here's the answer. Is that his drummer? Carl was hospitalized for frostbite for his toes suffered while aboard the bus. Oh so maybe that's it. Maybe he didn't need the extra see he didn't get the extra seat because you had to get a different trump because his feet were falling off. Oh I'm so sorry I made a joke. That buddy didn't like you but he was on the bus like that tells you how cold it was on the bus so imagine how much it is how cold it is outside the bus. Yeah so and at this point some of this information might seem familiar to you from the last two episodes if you listen but not we still need to include it. Thank God. This is almost over with instances like LDC's worst nightmare. We're getting a my nightmare right now. So I end on my actual nightmare on an actual nightmare in this episode on an actual nightmare. Lovely hold and then he's going to go take a nap. And then and then I was gonNA take two XANAX and go to sleep for a little bit on February second before their appearance and clearly Iowa. Holly chartered a four seat. Beechcraft Bonanza airplane for Jennings also in Hisself from Dwyer Flying Service in Mason city which is also an Iowa. Hollies idea was to depart for the following show at the surf ballroom in clear. Lake and fly to the next venue in Moorhead Minnesota via Fargo. And you talked about that. On the big bopper episode so yeah. We'll end also valance because I went to school up in Fargo so basically there's a little airport in Fargo and Fargo. North Dakota is just on the other side of the river from moorhead in Minnesota. So it's like right next door so that would doing that. Like taking that plane would allow them to get some rest wash their clothes and avoid being on the frozen bus again so yeah. I mean I get where he was coming from with this. But it's still a nightmare. Well now for you yes Yeah so if you haven't yet listened to the other episodes on this Galician to him. Go listen to them first of all because they were really good in her opinion in our totally unbiased opinions but richie balanced ended up on the plane after winning a coin toss against also for his seat and Jennings gave up his seat to the big bopper because bopper was actually really sick at the time needed to see a doctor before their next show. So if you haven't yet listen to those episodes spoiler alert but it's important to know how that switch was made. Yes so the pilot. Roger Peterson took off in inclement weather. Although he was not certified to fly by instruments alone so that was what we were talking about in the other two episodes was the big bopper episode went into more detail on that and he was on an eight hour workday already. And so did you find eighteen. I found money regardless Long Long Day Long Day. A Long Day of doing something that takes a lot of focus in really bad weather. Yeah so shortly after. Twelve fifty five. Am on February third nineteen fifty. Nine's Holly Valance. Richardson and Peterson. And then the big Bopper was is Richard. Is Richardson. If you're wondering were killed instantly when the aircraft crashed into a frozen cornfield five miles north of Mason City Iowa Shortly after takeoff the three musicians who are ojected from the fuselage upon impact suffered severe head and chest injuries. Holly in Santiago had only been married for six months. At the time of his death she learned of his death from reports on the TV off. Sucks yeah a widow. After only six months of marriage she suffered a miscarriage shortly after reportedly due to psychological trauma. I was GONNA say. Wasn't she just very like she was only like two months pregnant or something like that at the time? Something like that. I mean they were only married for six months. So at Mac she was six months pregnant. Yeah I think I well no I think I found it in my research and I think she was two months when she when he passed away. Yeah because of her miscarriage in the months following the accidents the authorities implemented the policy against announcing victims names until after. The families are informed. So that's like a common thing now so good and bad. Maybe not so. I don't know it's a good thing because they won't release victim names until after the family has been informed. Good news out of tragedy. Yeah and I think that's. That's a great thing. We saw that you know a couple of weeks ago with Kobe. No one had told Vanessa and she was finding out on twitter so again. Isn't that then illegal? Will it wasn't it was it was it was TMZ. And I have a serious issue with. Tmz Yeah I don't blame you. She actually did not attend the funeral and has never visited the gravesite She later told the Avalanche Journal away of blame myself. I was not feeling well when he had left. I was two weeks pregnant. There's there weeks yeah and I wanted buddy to stay with me. But he had scheduled the store. Wait Oh yes so. She was like a month pregnant because she was two weeks pregnant when he left. Yeah so so. Yeah that this was the only time. I wasn't with him and I blame myself because I know that if I had gone along buddy would have never gotten onto that airplane. Holly's funeral was held on February seventh nineteen fifty nine at the Tabernacle Baptist Church in Lubbock. Which was his church that he grew up in and was baptized in the service was officiated by Ben De Johnson. Who had presided over his wedding just months earlier. The pallbearers were Jerry. Allison Jobe Maldon Nikki. Sullivan Bob. Montgomery and Sonny Curtis and we have mentioned every one of those names in this episode so you can see how they had that lasting effect on his life right even from early life. Don had known him for so many like I don had known him since they were in junior high. I think junior elementary school so they they had a friendship that lasted a lifetime right. Some sources say that Phil Everley one of one. Half of the Everley brothers was also a pall bearer. But he said at the time he attended the funeral but was not appall bearer. Waylon Jennings was unable to attend because of his commitment. To these still touring. Winter Dance Party. Why is it still going on? I mean I I get it but I don't get it different time. You know. Holly's body was interred in the city of lubbock cemetery in the eastern part of the city. His headstone carries the correct spelling of his surname which was H. O. L. L. E. Y. And a carving of his fender Stratocaster Guitar. Okay and here's TJ's favorite part fun facts who we need them after darkness. Yeah well I go fun. And then I go directly back into darkness. Luckily gotTA gotta ended on a bummer. Right he only had three albums that were released. Which were the chirping crickets buddy? Holly and that'll be the day but there have been twenty nine compilation albums. Just you release like five songs and they find they find a way to make. New Album is particularly how well he did. Have a lot of recordings and stuff. So there's a there's a cap though. Twenty nine is a lot of compilation albums. Holly's life story inspired the Buddy Holly Story which was nineteen seventy eight. It's lead actor. Gary Busey received a nomination for the Academy Award for best actor so is so Gary Busey was in the Buddy Holly Story and my mom loves that movie but it was widely criticized by the rock. Press and Holly's friends and family for its inaccuracies of this led. Paul McCartney whose MP L. Communications by then actually controlled the publishing rights to buddy holly sound catalog to produce his own documentary about holly. In one thousand nine hundred five titled The Real Buddy Holly Story Burn. Yeah in Nineteen ninety-seven Musician Marshall Crenshaw Portrayed Buddy Holly in the movie La Bamba and he actually looks like him I if you watch clips from that movie. It is a pretty good side by side comparison. You look just like Berry Holly. And you're Mary Tyler. Moore Yeah I that was. That was actually a fun fact and I took it out because it made it fifteen pages as opposed to fourteen pages but yes come on. Weezer is first breakout. Hit was buddy holly. Here's something that's up my alley. Which was it's called buddy the buddy holly story jukebox musical depicting Holly's life and it's actually credited as being the first of its kind. The musical opened up in the late nineteen eighties and had its most recent. Uk Tour occur in two thousand nineteen. And that's the jukebox. Musical is like the Jersey Boys. Are Mama Mia motown like those guys? But he was the first of its kind so that was Kinda cool. Then this is another thing. That's up my alley Steve. Shimmy actually Cameo D- as Buddy Holly in the nineteen fifties themed restaurant employed in Quentin Tarantino's nineteen ninety. Four film pulp fiction and we know I am a Tarantino file. I like Steve Bruce Jamie and I do like I mean I liked Tarantino. I don't really. I'm not crazy about his movies. And I don't know that I've ever seen pulp fiction all the way through. Well Steve Buscemi. I have a legend. I have total respect for Steve Buscemi because he used to be a volunteer firefighter New York City and to tie it back to the beginning of this episode. On nine eleven he actually went down to his old firehouse volunteered again and helped with cleanup. That's cool so total. Respect to Steve Buscemi Shamir. A stand up guy. We've come be on the PODCAST. We Jensen you can be on the podcast coming out with us. We're fun Holly Okay. This is this is all of these. Have something to do with something. I loved when I was a child. Hollywood's depicted in episode of science fiction. Television programme quantum leap. Okay after I wrote out this. This Trivia. I went on a mad search to find how to seek quantum leap again because I loved that show. My sister love that show good and also love sliders which is kind of the same thing but oh man but the episode was titled. How the test was one hollies. Identity is only revealed at the end of the episode Dr Sam Beckett which is played by Scott Back Ula influences Buddy Holly to change his lyrics from piggy piggy. Suey to peggy sue. Setting Yup setting up for Holly's future hit song. Hollies follow up. Hit Song is featured in the nineteen eighty six Francis. Ford Coppola Film Peggy. Sue got married in which a forty three year old mother and housewife facing divorce which was played by Kathleen. Turner is thrust back in time and given the chance to change the courses of her life and side note. That is my mother's favorite movie of all time. Okay and I think that's where I got my love of Nicholas Cage or okay. He is also in that film. And and you'll appreciate this. I had you in my when I wrote this in two thousand six the country band. The dixie chicks I know them mentioned buddy holly in their Song Lubbock or leave it. Yes they did. 'cause listened to that. Song Today on the way back from training yup the lead singer Natalie maynes and holly share the same hometown which is Lubbock Texas and one of my personal favorite people. Marcus parks from the last podcast. On the left is also from Lubbock so Lubbock is making some good people. Keep pumping those awesome folks out lubbock. Texas okay. I'M GONNA take a couple deep breaths because my personal nightmare see. You should have just done. The nightmare parsh- portion and then all the fun facts. I am not that smart. So then you don't go to bed you don't go to take your. Napoli still have like scary things in your brain okay. I'M GONNA put down for a second taste some off the cuff kind of stuff. Because I if I had left it in this is what made it nineteen pages. So I'm going to try to boil this information down to the most concise way that I can say this but apparently there was a music producer and I think his name was Jim meeks and he was kind of the UK. Equivalent of Phil Spector. So he was a big deal and he got into the Colt like he was interested in the Colt and he would like trying to use heroin. Luigi to pick up chicks smooth. Yeah real smooth did so. He invited three of his friends over to have like a party where they would do tarot cards and stuff automatic writing. If you don't know what that is. It's you put a piece of paper down and you have a pen in your hand in your hand is loose and basically you open yourself up to having spirits. Be Able to use your vessel to write out messages. Please don't do that crap now. Automatic writing is totally fine. We board load we. You know how is how is automatic. Writing like opening your spirit's more like were better than the wage board because you can ground yourself in. Us things to protect yourself. You can do the Ouija no you. Can't you know because you don't know what you're opening up and witty board and you can get anything? It's the Chat Roulette of the Occult Fair Enough so anyway. He was doing automatic writing and Tarot readings with his friends and apparently the note. That came across was buddy. Holly Will Die February third and this is this is nine hundred fifty eight. He's using this to pick up chicks like I'm so turned on when somebody's like hey baby to tell you when you're GONNA die. No but but what happened was he. This is the one thousand nine hundred eighty eight and so he called radio stations managers recording engineers management like he was trying to get to buddy holly and finally he got a note to buddy holly and there's no no one knows if he just like brush it off as a crazy person like ever had another thought about it but apparently he. He didn't pay attention to it. And so- February third came and went and meeks was a little bit more calm and that was one thousand nine hundred eighty eight nine hundred fifty nine rolls around February third rolls around and then it happens so that was spooky for me. Yeah so I tried to convince that. I know there are a ton of more because literally that was like five pages of details that I had gotten out and just kind of tried to boil it down to. Its most interesting parts so please don't be upset with me if I left out a detail or two but I think you're fine because I'm the one that told you like that was enough to tell that story without five pages of and she was wearing a black dress and he was. You're talking about the layout of the cards and what they meant and stuff like that. Well yeah but that again. Not This podcast. I love you anyway. I'm going to have my own panel. Podcast you're not then you can talk you then. You can tell that story be a whole episode. See I I just gave you fuel for your next podcast and I'm gonNA give our listeners. Fuel for their nightmares. Okay Oh wait. That wasn't the nightmare story. No that's not the nightmare story. Oh crap this is a legitimate nightmare story. Yeah Literal Literal Nightmare Story. Oh yeah because anyone you okay. This is this is. That's what we have left here okay. So here's something super spooky shortly before leaving the Winter Dance Party. Both were shaken by disturbing but strangely prophetic dreams. Maria was awakened suddenly from a nightmare in which she was standing in a vast open area much like a farm. I don't know where I was or how I got there. All of a sudden I could hear a noise like shouting in a got closer and closer and closer. I could see people running running running and shouting. They're coming hide. Maria was convinced that she will be trampled by the onrushing mob as the crowd parted around her. She heard a terrible noise and she saw a descending ball of fire falling from the heavens. She was convinced that this flaming comet like object would crush her but it passed by her. She heard a terrible crash in the distance witnessed a huge explosion. Much like that of plane crash. As she approached the site she could see a great burning hole in the ground at this point was awakened by Buddy as buddy tried to comfort her. He related to Maria a dream that he had had just moments before in which he was flying in a small airplane with his brother. Larry and her for some reason Larry Convinced Buddy to leave Maria on the top of a building but reassured her that they would soon return to pick her up. The dream created so much guilt within buddy that he broke into tears saying that he just couldn't understand why he left her and why she wasn't with him in a few short weeks. Both of these dreams would come back to haunt her socks. Didn't you say valance had dream a kind of a prophetic type of a dream to right? Yeah and he also had a fear of flying noble so that concludes our series on the day. The music died. So we'll let you guys know if we're going to make it to the winter dance party because I think it'd be really cool. Yeah it's in Lancaster. Yeah it's not. It's not that terribly far. Yeah I say let's do it. I think it'd be fun just a matter of whether or not you can go on Friday. I think I can go home. Brought him an employed. Okay so it's a matter whether or not I can go on. We also realize that we kind of forgot to mention something kind of important at the top of this episode. It's super important and we're really really really excited. We're super stoked. Remember we kind of mentioned you're seeing a few changes happen so using this. You saw our new logo. Yes and hopefully you adore it as much as we do. We love the new logo so cool and its colors and Lurs pretty colors pretty colors with skull and candles and it looks like it's eliminated. It's really pretty. I'm sure you've seen it pop up on your player at this point like really cool. We'd like to thank for that. Thank you Peter Peter. But so L. D. and I we got picked up to be the newest member of the Pantheon. Podcast family. Now Pantheon yes so if you don't know what that is. They are a really cool network of podcasts. All related to rock and roll music and music history in some way shape or form if you go to their website and check them out. You'll see all of the different podcast are in that lineup. That we are now a new member of and that's like rock and roll archaeology rock and roll librarian a real rock vinyl snob rock candy. Who Cares about the Rock Hall to list them all? But there's really cool ones out there That are also part of this network so along with the ones that L. D. is already listed. There's ones like the muses that focus on the women behind the scenes of rock and roll history from like groupies two lovers two managers two wives all of that which is a really really fun one. Yeah there's some really good ones I mean we. We could talk about all thirty one of them thirty to ninety two now. Yes go check out. Some of our our sister podcasts. I'm sure that they would enjoy. And I'm sure that you would enjoy it because if you like. This means that you like rock and roll music history so you probably like what they're doing too so that's our big news. We're super excited. You'll still be able to find this everywhere that you find us. Now so there's no no exclusivity move there so you don't have to switch how you're listening to us for sure but we things like long episodes because we don't have to host with another company that we had a cap on for as long as we recorded so we can actually bring you longer content with more information so we're pretty stoked about that. I know I am. I know you are but it also means that you like we mentioned earlier in the episode also made means that you will get a little bit more of our of our side conversations to add some our own little personal touch as it were like music clips. Yeah we get to do music clips. You can actually play you the songs we talk about as opposed to having to do more right. So we're we're very very excited and we're super honored that now we get to be with this wonderful network of like minded people and you know the guys that run the networker just incredibly sweet wonderful folks and we're just. We're really lucky that they found us. So yeah you'll notice some changes. They're GONNA be all wonderful changes. Were probably GONNA have Some big announcements coming up soon. So let's not for that because if you're in the L. A. Area who knows yeah hint hint. Maybe maybe maybe anyways well that's getting ahead of ourselves so we'll stick to closing with our social. That of course has not changed at all. At all you can find us on our PATRIAE on at Patriotair Dot com slash rock and roll. Heaven are twitter's rock and Roll Lt. Our facebook as rock and Roll Heaven Pod Instagram Rock and roll heaven. Lt Still Not saying our website and you can email us at rock and roll Heaven Lt at G. Common if I said those too fast. Don't worry they will be in the show notes you yes? Well as a link to go to her new network to check out the sister podcasts. Yes so thank you guys so much for taking out. Check US out next week. Yeah it's next week. Yeah out next episode where we will be doing our opening act on rumors in raw such a fun episode. That was so much fun to do so much. What is it March? Yes march will bringing you a series to you guys. I have literally had on my computer since I think the third week we started this podcast so basically I have to finish writing my episodes so we can record. Yup Okay Could you finish that please? And thank you guys so much for taking us out. We love you all keep rocking in the free world. Tj Yes can you talk me? I'll I'm only that too. Will okay all right bye everyday again? Close or go faster than a roller coaster. Love like yours will surely come. Hey Hey every day again faster. Everyone's go nascar us will surely come a day. Seems a little longer alleyway little stronger. Dumb Bod Lathe do you Ebanon Brom Post go and bester than poster like yours will surely Ma Seems a little longer. Everyone blogs and Lillistone come what may alone. Barth Brownlee go faster than a roller coaster like yours will surely come a come A.

Buddy Sonny Curtis Larry Welborn Lubbock Buddy Jack Texas L. O. Holly Bob Bob Montgomery HIGH SCHOOL Buddy Holly Buddy Charles L. O. Hank Williams Buddy Charles Hardin Dave stone Buddy Sal Holly Brothers L. Tj Kit Weldon Myrick Travis
The Third Man (1949)

Classic Movie Musts

29:44 min | 1 year ago

The Third Man (1949)

"I'm Max Baril and this is classic. Movie must where every week we breakdown a classic movie while looking to provide artistic insight and historical context at the very least we'll talk about what makes these movies classics Classic Movie Muster Releases Every Friday ready to complement your weekend movie viewing plans in case. You didn't know we recently launched a new Patriot exclusive. Show called Classic Movie Must Double Feature. The show costs one dollar per month and releases every Tuesday to all patriots subscribers. The show is the same structure as normal show but for movies released from the year two thousand to the present and that I believe are destined to go down in the film books looks as classics this week's episode is Lost in translation so if you subscribe unpatriotic you get four bonus episodes per month for just one one dollar future episodes will include movies like there will be blood the hurt locker and inception of course our normal. Friday show remains unchanged. I next week's double feature episode will be on Master and commander the far side of the world not only that every patriots subscriber earns cool who'll perks and ways to engage with the show speaking of which today's episode was suggested by John Calvi patriotic a perk available to all five dollar coming up patrons and it was then voted on and selected in our September movie pull a perk available to all one dollars up patrons a huge huge. Thank you to John Kelly and the rest of our patriots subscribers you make the show possible you can get your exclusive access to classic movie must double feature sure as well as read about all our support tears and the rewards over at Patriotair. Dot Com slash classic movie musts. Thank you for joining me this week. As we discussed Carol Reed's the third man in episode during our feature presentation will discuss how this film visualizes themes of the underground will hear about how the city of Vienna aided in the production of the film in our buzz from the back lot segment but first. Let's get into this week's opening credits. It's our film. This week is the third man which was directed by Carol Reed and was released in nineteen forty nine the third man stars Joseph Cotten Orson Welles and Valley American pulp. The Western writer Holly Martins played by Joseph cotten arrives in postwar Vienna seeking his childhood friend Harry Lime play by Orson Welles who has offered him a job upon arrival he discovers that lime was killed while crossing the street just hours earlier by a speeding truck. Martins attends headlines funeral where he needs to British army police officers sergeant pain a fan of Martin's pulp novels and his superior major Calloway who says line was a criminal and suggest Martins leave town an official of the British occupying forces approaches Martin's requesting that he gave a lecture lecture and offering to pay for his lodging viewing this as an opportunity to clear his best friend's name. Martin's decides to remain in Vienna at a meeting with limes best friend Baron Kurz Kurz tells Martins that after the accident he and another friend carried the dying lime to the side of the street lime lime asked Kurtz and his other friend to take care of Martin's and Anna Schmidt played by valley lines actress girlfriend to learn more. Martin goes to to see Anna at the theater where she is performing. She suggests Harry's death may not have been accidental. They questioned the porter at Lime's apartment building who claims that lime died immediately mmediately and it was carried off the street by someone else in addition to lines to friends. Martins berates the porter for not being more forthcoming with the police about what what he knows concern for his family safety the Puerto indignantly tells Martins not to involve him the police searching Anna's flat for evidence later find and confiscate viscous her forged passport and detain her later. The Puerto secretly offers Martins more information but is murdered before their arranged meeting when Martins arrives CBS unaware of the murder a young boy recognizes him as having argued with the porter earlier and points this out to the gathering bystanders who become hostile and and mob like later callaway again advises Martins to leave Vienna but Martins refuses and demands that lime's death be investigated calloway reluctantly reveal that lime had been stealing penicillin from military hospitals and selling it on the black market diluted so much that many patients died calloway's evidence evidence convinces Martin's disillusioned. He agrees to leave Vienna. Martins visits Anna to say goodbye and finds that she also knows of lines misdeeds but but that her feelings toward him are unchanged she tells him she is to be deported but upon leaving her flat he notices someone watching from a dark doorway. A neighbor's light window briefly reveals the person to be in fact Harry Lime who flees ignoring Martin's calls Martin Summons Calloway Calloway who deduces that lime had escaped through a newspaper Kiosk connected to the city's sewers the British police immediately zoom lime's coffin and discover that the body is that of Joseph Harbin an orderly who stole penicillin for lime and was reported missing after turning informant calloway asked Martin's to help lure lime out to capture him mm-hmm and Martins agrees asking for Anna safe conduct out of the in exchange and refuses to leave and remains loyal to lime exasperated rated Martin's decides to leave but changes his mind after calloway shows Martin's the children who are victims of Lime's diluted penicillin brain damaged as a result salt meningitis lime sneaks out for his rendezvous with Martin's but and that still loyal to him arrives warned him off just in time he tries to escape escaped through the sewers but the police are there in force lime shoots and kills Sergeant Paine but calloway shoots and wounds live badly injured lime drags himself up a ladder to a street grading exit but cannot lift it. Martin's picks up pains revolver follows line reaches him but hesitates a shot is then heard erred later. Martins attends lime's second funeral at the risk of missing his flight out of Vienna Martin's weights in the cemetery to speak to Anna. She approaches him from a distance yes and walks past ignoring him. The third man had a box office total of just over one point one million dollars and adjusted for inflation. That's a box office of just just under twelve million dollars. The third man was nominated for Three Academy Awards winning one. The film was nominated for best editing thing. Carol Reed was nominated for best director and Robert Kraft Skar won the award for Best Black and white cinematography now old man. It's time for our feature presentation as anyone who sees he's a lot of movies has undoubtedly noticed the underground chase. Scene is a key element in thriller films. The thriller film which most fully fully investigates the various meanings of the underground is Carol Reed's the third man in part. This is because it builds on the work of a novelist Graham Greene who is particularly interested in exploring various depths unconscious motives deep spiritual convictions and hidden political and personal treasuries heart of darkness settings and so on for green. The underground world of thrillers is barely barely differential from the everyday world of reality. The Novella of the third man which green wrote to prepare himself for the screenplay is a far more prosaic work than the film that finally emerged to a bare bones story of intrigue in postwar Vienna the Director Director and the screenwriter jointly added most of the dimensions that make the movie a powerful exploration of the underground. What Carol Darrelle Redid in collaboration with green himself was to turn the third man into a full blown movie equivalent of the richest Graham Greene Green novels one of the key differences between the Novella and the movie. Is the alteration in the central character. Holly Martins Holly played by Joseph of cotton is the focal point of the film the perceiver of its events virtually no scene takes place in which he is not an actor or a witness. The Novella on the other hand is narrated by Major Calloway and the main character is named Rallo not holly more importantly accordingly the original. Martin's was an Englishman rather than an American. It is impossible to imagine a British holly Martins a character who is the a quintessential green figure of the innocent destroyer the naive believer in goodness who because he cannot fully Comprehend Evil Vol unwittingly becomes its instrument Holly Pursuing Truth and justice leaves behind him a wake of death and destruction he he is so naive that he gives away his knowledge about the third man to precisely the wrong people those who have already denied there was such a man an and in doing so seals the death warrant of his informant yet. The character played with the full force of Joseph Cotton's. Charm is extremely appealing making it possible for us to see why even the sophisticated manipulative Harry. Lime liked this ognjen. You knew this believer in loyalty and decency the name. Hollywood itself is both ridiculous and sweet. What a silly name says Anna Schmidt at one point and yet she confuses it with her beloved Harry such confusions as well as the many connotations of innocence inherent perent in the name Christmas holly a girl's name Holly would not have been possible with the original name Rallo from the novella though they eight now seem essential to the movie's plot the shift to Holly's view of the story represents a significant shift in the premise of the work mark when major calloway narrates the Novella Harry Lime is a despicable though somewhat clever criminal and Martin's his ignorant defender is is rather a sleazy weasley man with a reputation for cruelty to women and a strong streak of vulgarity but when Rallo turned holly takes over the narration Calloway who becomes the irritating character thus we are set up from the beginning to oppose the cops and side with the criminal and though holly eventually switches sides this early allegiance sticks with us making lines ultimate death far more disturbing are being than in the book like many other thrillers. The film of the third man encourages a certain confusion in regard to the relative roles of cops and criminals pursuer and pursued so that we are likely to find ourselves identifying with the wrong characters the camera Emma does a great deal to assist in this confusion in the famous sewer senior the end of the movie where Harry is finally cornered and killed the camera itself intermittently takes on Harry's vision at one point. We saw cops running down a tunnel toward us at another we see them. Facing facing us from above as Harry tries to climb out of the sewer earlier we have been set up to identify with a fleeing man when Holly Escapes Gapes from the villains backstage after his lecture the spiral staircase that Martin's runs up in that scene is almost a mirror image of the one that Harry runs down into the sewer and seen from directly below as the camera views it during the chase holly staircase actually looks like a downward spiral into a pit but during the final chase scene the camera is fickle it doesn't remain consistently on Harry side shifting away occasionally only to view him from a distance just after he kills sergeant pain his most unsympathetic onscreen action Harry tries to crawl out sewers through a manhole and we look from above as his fingers emerged from the grid white grubs crawling out of the ground colorless worms that prey on the dead and our last vision of Harry alive as his face expresses what could be either a prayer for perseverance appearance or a request for a sudden death is from Holly's viewpoint just before holly shoots him. This is the final step in the equation waged between Holly and Harry Between Innocence and evil for in wiping out the evil holly to becomes a murderer the third man man harps obsessively on notions of death burial depths and descent the first vision we have of the mysterious Harry Lime lime or rather the first vision we think we have of him is of his coffin being lowered into the grave even before this holly arrives at Harry's flat to learn from the port that his friend is already gone already inhale says the porter pointing upward or in heaven pointing downward one word the initial confusion between Heaven and hell up and down reappears towards the end of the movie when Harry and holly sit suspended in a ferris wheel carriage swinging high above the streets surrounded entirely by carnival rides that only spin in circles the bird's eye view of reality is in fact hollies primitive glimpse of hell the people reduced to mere dots on the landscape and Harry boasting carelessly of his crimes with the suggestion that he might be about to kill Martin's as well. This scene is Harry at his most cynical. They talk about the people and the proletariat he says of politicians. I talk about the suckers the mugs it's the same thing there's there's very much a better to reign in hell than serve in heaven tone to his speech and indeed to this whole scene despite the fact that Satan's lines were spoken from far below while Harry delivers his from on high the film contains repeated references to Holly's activity of digging things up or getting to the bottom of things from major calloway's point of view. This digging is harmful well and even dangerous to holly's remark as soon as I get to the bottom of this. I'll catch the next plane. Calloway responds deaths at the bottom of this Mr Martens Martin's deaths at the bottom of everything holly snappy reaction to that is might if I use that line in my next Wester however the the digging metaphor appears to be contagious for later in the film after Holly has discovered that Harry Lime is still alive. Calloway says we should have dug deeper than the grave he and his men then proceed in fact to dig up Harry's body and discovered the body of Joseph Harbin instead Ed. If the region beneath the earth represents death alone to callaway it represents both escape and death for Harry in the course of the movie. Maybe this underworld black marketeer vanishes underground four times wants through deception in the body of Harbin once in the middle of a Plaza Waza when holly follows him from outside and it's flat again into the sewers after Holly has lured him to the cafe and finally into the grave itself. Holly's remark about using Calloway's line his next western invokes yet another kind of underground the subterranean world of trashy trashy literature in the third man literary status is presented as a class issue rather than merely equality issue the cockney sergeant pain is a fan of hollies novels while the Upper Class Englishman who runs the local literary society has never heard of it it is this class distinction among other things that makes Barron Curtis fulsome praise of hollies novels sound so ridiculous one simply it does not carry a lapdog under one arm and a trashy Western under another in Greens novella the confusion about Holly Martins Literary Status Status comes through a case of mistaken identity. A famous writer with the same surname as Martin's pen name was in fact expected by the Literary Society -Ociety the twist that leads to the confusion in the movie the literary people are embarrassed to admit that they haven't heard of holly Martins since they can't imagine agenda writer who is not there sort of high class novelist is both much simpler and much more telling it makes the pretentiousness of literary literary pigeonholing all the more obvious holly acknowledges the existence of such distinctions but like Graham Greene with his entertainments admits he is some what resentful of their implications that this desire to separate genres stems from the same impulse that separates classes classes is clear not only in the third man but in other works by Green as well of course what the Western or the thriller is to the novels of James Joyce. The Thriller Movie Has Traditionally Been To the serious film. A connection Holly emphasizes when he says that his next ex- book will be called in fact the third man for the title of this projected piece of pulp fiction to be the same as the fat of the movie itself Places Carol Reed's allegiance clearly on the side of the subterranean genre meanwhile forcing us to seek out semblances Amblin says of ourselves in the high minded audience that attends hollies lecture the very idea of a category called film noir her of which the third man is now a classic example is really hysterically funny perversion a fancy French brand name imposed on a popular thriller form to assure us that this entertainment is really art. Read is amused but also miffed that this film should be subjected to this kind of snobbish scrutiny. His retort voiced in Holly's remark is the equivalent of Raymond Chandler's defense of the detective story in which he said quotes. There are no vital and significant forms of art. There is only art and precious little of that just just as literary class distinctions are more important in the movie than in the book class in general is a more significant issue in the film. One aspect aspect of this difference is the transformation of the key witness from a nondescript neighbor of Harry's to the porter of his building. When the novellas Kerala Martin's becomes indirectly responsible for the neighbors death. Our distress is minimal because neither of these two characters is is particularly sympathetic but when holly inadvertently causes the villains to murder the porter the Patriots the situation is intensified acidified not only by the appeal of both characters but by the fact that the victim is a of a lower class than the man who unwittingly brings about his death. This becomes a part of HOLLIES UNINTENTIONAL AMERICAN ARROGANCE. He brings destruction down on the heads of the little people in pursuit suit a larger cause and this theme becomes especially pronounced in the movie because of the presence of an actual little person murdered porter's son yet. The use of the child in the third man is far from sentimental. The most eerie scene of the film is the one one in which the little boy followed by a crowd of Viennese neighbors chases holly and Anna down the street yelling Papa Papa. The child is is no Dickensian wave. He is a primitively judgmental figure a wizened little old man who has watched from below as the two to adult yell at each other he looks at things from down there with a distorted but piercing vision when the camera takes his viewpoint as it does during holly's disagreement with the porter the world takes on a dislocated and frightening intensity and this boy is powerful beyond his size or even his awareness with his cry of Papa and toddling pursuit of the American he makes both holly and the crowd feel. That holly is guilty of murder. The child is a projection of many things hollies conscience the neighbors distrust of foreigners the very strangeness and Mystery of Post War. VN even the camera during the scene when the boy chases holly views the child as a projection a giant shadow thrown against a wall by the street lights. If the child is a shadow is in some for death itself he is also a version of Harry Lime his shadow on the wall and the sound of his little footsteps echoing down the street are almost identical to the sights and sounds of harys Harry's flight from holly several scenes later the blown up shadow could be a man's and the child even resembles Orson Welles with that round smooth face and those big staring is conversely one might say that Harry Lime resembles a child and Anna Schmidt says that that very thing when she tells holly that Harry is a boy who never grew up of course this phrase could describe holly as well and in a certain incense Harry Lime Holly Martins and the porters nameless little boy or all versions of the same character it is the figure of destructive innocence of childhood as death that marches through all of Graham Greene's works the irony is that it took Carol Reed's needs midwifery to deliver this death child from its embryonic form in grams script to turn the movie of the third man into one of Graham Graham Greene's most characteristic novels and ease through its faithfulness to the obsessions that ground Graham Greene's work. The the third man becomes such an acute reflection on the various meanings of the underground. Now it's time for our buzz from the back lot segment and this week will hear about how the city of Vienna aided in the production of the film during meetings between Graham Greene and Carol Reed with David O cells Nick Green was less than impressed with cells nick who had according waiting to cells nick own son become something of a parody of himself green later mocked Celtics dependency at that stage on the drug excedrin adrain better known as speed coincidentally read also became hooked on Dixie Green whilst shooting time consuming film both read need and sells nick were operating on as little as two hours of sleep per day director Carol Reed originally wanted Jimmy Stewart for the role of Holly Martins but producer David o cells nick insisted on Joseph Cotten who was under contract to Celtics Production Company at that time when the film was initially lead distributed in America Davis Cells Nick replaced the narration at the beginning which is necessary to explain the unique structure of postwar Vienna which was done by Carol Reed himself and replaced it with narration read by Joseph Cotten in character as Holly Martins. Nearly eleven minutes of film was cut out out in cells next version including all references in the original cut to holly Martins being implied alcoholic and anything else that portrayed him in a less than heroic light. There are many oblique angles in the movie where the camera is tilted so that the horizon line is not horizontal to give a feeling of awkwardness coordinates and uneasiness after he saw the movie famous director William Wyler and friend of Carol Reed sent him a spirit level with a note that said Ed Carroll next time you make a picture just put this on top of the camera while you somewhat apocryphal stories abound regarding Carol Reed discovering musician Anton Karas while scouring Vienna bars and nightclubs read actually heard Karaz playing at a production party and insisted the Austrian zither player come to read hotel room and record songs to use for the contract later in production read realized he wanted to use cross's Ross's music for the whole film and flew out to London to record the score cross became a top selling musician. Thanks to the film and opened a nightclub called the third man in Vienna which he ran to the end of his days during the shooting of the film the final scene was the subject of a dispute between Graham Greene who wanted the happy ending of the Novello and Carol Reed and David O cells who stubbornly refused to end the film on what they I felt was an artificially happy note green later wrote one of the very few major disputes between Carol Rita myself concerned the ending and and he has been proved triumphantly right Carol Reed went to great lengths to capture the atmosphere of the beleaguered city on film and he was helped along by vice city officials and ordinary inhabitants on nights when the rain was unavailable to give the cobblestone streets the appropriate glistening sheen for example the city would provide a fire brigade to wet things down read also incorporated many local residents into the film as extras such as the often glimpsed just balloon-seller the Vienna Police Department has a special unit that is assigned solely to patrol the city's intricate sewer system as its network of interlocking tunnels make great hiding places for criminals on the run from the law. The actors playing police officers in the film were actually off duty members of that unit and finally Orson Welles initially refused to do that sewer sequence because he was convinced the bad air would give him some disease. Carol Carol Reed claimed there was nothing to worry about as the smell was a result of disinfectant not excrement according to read the apprehensive wells didn't didn't believe him that concludes our episode on the Third Third Man. I would love to hear what you think of this. Classic Movie Must Feel Free To tweet at movie must pod or e Mail Classic Movie Musts at G Mail Dot com you you can listen to all the episodes and learn more about the show on our website classic movie must dot. com You could support the show and get access to our new weekly exclusive episodes classic Isaac Movie Must Double Feature by subscribing on Patriae on you can also become producer of the show and get your name read at the end of every episode just like Donna Hoffman Lee Eleanor B and Max on Redid. Thank you all for your generous patronage. Check out all our support tears and their awards over at Patriotair. Dot Com slash classic movie we must on the next episode of Classic Movie. must we welcome back. Ted Welsh to discuss the Paul Newman Classic Hud. Remember episodes released these every Friday on all podcast services. Thank you so much for listening until the next episode. Keep up with your classics.

Holly Martins Holly Martins Holly Harry Lime Harry Carol Carol Reed Holly Mr Martens Martin Major Calloway Graham Graham Greene Vienna Anna Schmidt Lime Orson Welles chase holly staircase murder Harry Lime Patriots Holly Escapes porter Patriotair
Is late April a good time to trim a Holly bush?

Your Gardening Questions

03:35 min | 1 year ago

Is late April a good time to trim a Holly bush?

"Hi, this is Mark news from plant talk radio. Thanks for subscribing and listening to our podcast. You're gardening questions. From plan. Talk radio to help keep this podcast free for you were partnering with stoke seeds preplanned your indoor seeds starting program with the help of the all new Stokes website, now mobile and tablet friendly. The new website is a brand new gardening experience. It offers better interactivity and higher quality imagery. But what hasn't changed is the Stokes website is still the complete resource center with valuable information on seed starting planting and harvesting all the gardening accessories and a free catalog, whether you're adding texture a new variety for a splash of color developing an existing garden or starting from scratch stoke seeds has some great resources to help you. Plus all the gardening excessive as you need to make your garden. The envy of the neighborhood get growing with Stokes. Now. Today's question I've got a question about trimming, Holly Bush, all right this Holly bushes probably dates back to the late eighties. Yes. When the union hall was built, and it was never trimmed its overgrowing the sidewalk, and it's about eight feet long and about five and a half six feet deep. But it's got it looked scraggly. And, you know, not nice. Can we trim it? Yes. Now, let let's discuss I I need a little bit more definition when when okay this sounds like a shrub type Holly as opposed to a Holly tree. Correct. Okay. Well is just a hint late right now to go into it as as I would recommend that you can you're going in order to manage it from at this size to even hold it at its present size. You're probably going to have to cut off a lot of flower buds, therefore, you cut off a lot of fruit for fall. So be it. You can definitely prune Holly period as a hedge. Even now with the age that yours is I'm gonna tell you to be careful because right now Holly is, but it out at least some of them are booted out probably about ready to flower. And so on that means a lot of activity is going on inside. And these last two or three weeks where a lot of energy has been spent getting the plant going so trim too hard. Now, you're going to cut off, of course, food making surfaces, etc. All of which is. Necessary. But where I would tell you you can probably cut back to the last green leaf on a stem, thou out you say cut inward to that. Last green leaf there are buds on holidays. The where the plant could probably shall we say resurrect itself at this point with all it energy having been spent I would say don't go in more than three or four inches, and I'm projecting. Now what you actually have to deal with. But you're going to want to put on a pair of gloves. You're going to want. You're going to want to go after. But I I would not go as hard as you can do on Holly. Thanks again. For listening to the podcast. Remember preplanned your indoor seats starting program with the help of Stokes gardening guide and their online articles on their brand new website now mobile and tablet friendly and request your free catalog while you're online for the best selection of vegetable flower and herbs seats available go to stoke seeds dot com. Cultivating successful growers for generations.

Holly Bush Stokes Stokes Holly Mark four inches three weeks eight feet six feet
Holly Laurent

Exvangelical

1:23:06 hr | 1 year ago

Holly Laurent

"Hello and welcome Pentacle. I'm your host chastain. This is the last episode of Exponential Twenty Nineteen and this year has been quite year I'm thankful that to have you all listeners. Still and I'm really happy to share this final conversation of Twenty nineteen with you in this episode. I talked to you Hollerin. She is one of the CO hosts of the mega podcast. That is a satirical Improv. Show that takes place in a fictional mega church and features lots of COMEDIANS. That you would know like Thomas Ditch and others playing roles that we'll just have you in stitches it's a great show and holly is a fascinating person and I really enjoyed our conversation. We cover for all sorts of topics from Chicago Pizza to Christian College to growing up as a pastor's kid and how comedy has sort of filled a role of community community for Holly Get into a lot of different things and I hope you enjoy this conversation. I WanNa thank everyone who is listening to the show. Thank you to my patrons. Thank you to those who tell others about the show You can like the show on facebook. You can rate and review the show on Apple podcasts. You can support the show of her at Patriot dot com slash exponential pod. I join the facebook group over at Vicks facebook dot com slash groups slash X.. Fan Jellicoe. I can follow me on twitter at Vr chastain. This episode was produced by Jake. Louis thank you very much jake for your work on this episode. All right. Let's get right into it everyone and welcome back. Exxon Jellicoe my guest. This week is Holly Laurent she. She is the CO host of the mega podcast as well as a feature performer on. NPR's live from here from the shore said welcome. Welcome to the show. You know what people do that all the time people call me Lauren Lot and I respond to it because my last name kind of looks like a first name and so my name to you. You're in good. You're in good company. Oh Man I I had everything else find on on the first day and then I totally gifted on that the human right. That's right. Well welcome to the show. Holly I like to start off the show by talking about where more people you grew up like both where they grew up in the states where where they did and sort of what their initial religious upbringing was like as well. So let's let's start there. Where where did you get your start? Yeah well you know what's interesting is you're sitting in Chicago right now right. Yeah that's right. What neighborhood do you live in? I live in Rogers. I just park in the far side. So Yeah I consider myself as cargo in. 'cause I lived there for probably fifteen years when I was I didn't high school. I grew up in the suburbs. Out in Elgin okay. Yeah I went to high school in Naperville so different parts of the suburbs but also gration. Yeah Yeah And then when I moved into the city actually and I love Chicago so much everywhere I lived in Lakeview Lincoln Square Square Buck town I kind of was all over and I love Chicago so much and just picturing you and Chicago and picturing turn Rogers Park and like hearing the L in my memory makes me really nostalgic because I've been living in La for the last six years. And I But I but I consider myself a Chicago and yes it's a great city in it's it's got the neighborhoods have such character and you know they're very distinct and I'm a huge booster of Osha Kogyo and the neighborhood of Rogers Park. I know that Mike Rogers Park is known for being like an affordable place but also a little a little dicey I think it's I think it's growing out of their reputation. Just because it's one of the places where he can have an a have a larger place and and you know where younger families can get a start without making bank. Yeah that's great and are there any Lou Malnati's L. Matt he's up in writer's cards because like I think loom out that makes life worth living. There's a there's a donnas but there's not a luminaries there's Yeah there's like peons in bloom and Edgier Donnas and of the big ones. That's the one that's here. Yeah I think those are not even in the same category I'm still and for people for those. Hey friends listening or like what in the hell are you talking talking about. We're talking about a pizza place. Called Lou Malnati's even though it sounds like we're talking about the aluminum. I just think people that make life worth living bring in. I think that's the best pizza in the world and people who should on Chicago style pizza. I just know that we're never going to really connect. That's fair I I like I'd lose Their Saas doesn't it's my favorite of all the Chicago spots but other than in their sauce. I really like lose. This is a pretty big part Blake. I know it is part of it but anyway. Sorry I'm off topic but I grew up. my My Mom and dad I I was born in Chicago suburbs and then When I was like a toddler my family moved to Niles Michigan which is in southwest Michigan? Just on the other side of the lake and I lived there until I was twelve and then when I was twelve we moved back for the Chicago. Suburbs and So then I went to the College in Indiana at Anderson University in Anderson Indiana Church of God school down there and then Yeah and then probably moved to to Chicago. I went to Indiana Wesleyan so right down the road. I Know Indiana Wesleyan. My Dad is in was growing go traveling like a traveling evangelist and Now he's now. He's a teaching pastor at a mega church but he I remember he did some like spiritual emphasis week or something. Indiana Wesleyan and I came over from Anderson to like see for the night and hang out with them and I always love to watch. Watch him do his thing and Yeah I I remember always being like are are these Wesleyan's Okay Dad. And he's like yeah. Yeah they're cool. You know all the different like sex. And everything like Rome I remember when we pulled into Anderson Indiana when I was like moving into my freshman year college dorm and I saw that it said a Church of God school on the Sinai was like it's Church of God. Okay Dad and he was like yeah yeah. They're pretty cool. So did you. So as your your dad has a traveling evangelist. Did he have a denominational affiliation allegation or was he a freelance evangelist. He was more like a free He was just really bringing the good news of the Gospel in introducing people to a really cool. Jesus who I loved like. You've never been loved before baby and so yeah But at home we went to a Baptist Baptist more specifically northern Baptist Church And because my mom's dad was the pastor at First Baptist Church of Niles Michigan so I I grew up and was baptized Baptist Church real sort of traditional like no clapping. Oh Heavens and You know all the it was just run by a bunch of white guys and But it's Kinda like Niles was a blue collar town. I when I was really young. My parents were in a Christian rock band. One I ever Christian Christian rock band seventy like called the good news circle and So they they got married In college started this band. The good news circle started traveling and like putting out albums and like really had a lifestyle going with it there for several years and and So that was my like really early life with this kind of like rock and roll road show And then when my mom I kept having kids in my family total like we settled a Niles and My Dad he had started to at the end of like their music shows Jones. He would kinda give this message about you know how much Jesus loves you and like it would be this big emotional kind of altar. Call thing you know. I watched I watched every night in my life. You know growing up and so he just started to more and more like speak more and more and then when the band finally busted up doc he just stayed a traveling evangelist and so for Until I was like twelve daddy was on the road constantly and so like in in the summer time or when we were on break from school and stuff he would take one of us at a time with him just so he could like get to know us because he was just always gone. Oh I Yeah so I would Yeah I would just be on road trips with my dad like driving all night to get to the next place to get to the next church to do the next thing I would. He would start to include. Include me in little like skits and sketches and stuff. He would do to Kinda like make his message is more dynamic and stuff and So yeah I just saw kind of in front and behind. The curtain grew up really proud of his ability to work a room to move people and he's very charismatic and he's he's a great storyteller and he's funny he's good looking. I just I was just like my dad's the greatest you know it was like really I mean I know. Everybody's parents fall off pedestals but like I had him up there so damn high yeah And so so yeah and then and then When I wasn't on the road with him back home I was In Christian school and Church because my GRANDPA was the patch or the church. We were in church Sunday morning. Sunday night Wednesday night Christian school chapel a three days a week Bible classes five days a week. It was like everyone. I newest Christian every thought I had was Christian. Everything I knew just did like in all reality was just like this evangelical or kind of like you know. Protestant capitalist title is sort of American Christianity and and I think what happened in those early years to be really honest. I I think you bet Evangelical can be very brutal to all types of humans Mentally psychologically emotionally spiritually. We all that stuff But I think there is a specific thing like for females at least for for me just being very emotional being highly sensitive. Have I really really struggled because I can remember being really young I can I have. I have thought of like being so so so oh young like I have memories of even being toddler and stuff and I remember kind flake when I learned the alphabet. And when I learned about like gender and all that stuff I remember Knbr just really being like having a more infinite mind and being like Oh like okay so now I know twenty six letters. I can't wait to learn more because they must be infinite and gender must be infinite and everything must be. I just remember being very and I was oh strong willed. I had like likes such a strong sense of self and I just Kinda came into this world already acting just fresh out of Fox and like Very very very hard to discipline like my. My poor mom was basically like a single mom with my dad was never there and I was just so strong willed and like I like disciplined disciplined. Didn't really work on me. I almost saw it as like a game of like okay so she got one and now I gotta do something okay just had the strongest sense of self and strong and will and kind of I feel like I got here with a lot of like muchness and bigness and What I think happened opened in those early years is it just got beat out of me? So dreadfully so painfully and and and the world came crashing. The Christian World came crashing rushing in is so small and limiting and for me very like frightening and traumatic and and it made me hate myself Alfred. Fear God you know the like the fear of God for me was like actual terror just being who is like you know knows everything sees everything is keeping track of every like thought instinct behavior habit impulse desires you know like and it just really truly scared the absolute Shit Outta me and and kind of in the way. If you've ever seen someone like break a horse in the worst possible way by like just literally breaking their their there will and their spirit like. I kind of feel like. That's what happened to me over the course of being exposed to those Belief system like really not only just not helpful helpful in helping me as like a small creature. Learn how to navigate the world and occasionally experience joy or something it just really like it CR- crushed crushed me and all that like muchness and sort of vision and and strong will and everything that that came so naturally actually to me in the beginning just sort of toppled into this like very fearful anxious. Shame just like so filled with like shame mm-hmm dread and Just like so. I got really traumatized I like I sort of have sleep disorders to this day because I used to always try to stay awake. Like saying the sinner's prayer all night long in case I died in my sleep. I was just so afraid of going to hell like my dad. My Dad was casting out demons that like you know revivals and stuff and I'm like whoa weird that team and go you know and I was so afraid of a demon coming inside of me and taking me over and me becoming coming a host of of what I was seeing as a kid which people like foaming at the mouth and is rolled back and everything it took me like well into my I twenty or maybe even thirty goodness gracious. It's maybe not to be like. Oh people in big crowds with like music and lights and everything in have seizures when they're epileptic and like they're they foam at the mouth in their eyes roll back and guttural noises come out of their body. That wasn't a demon like trying to like fight to stay in it. It's hose. It was like a human being having a very real problem and they needed their next stabilize. have hand laid on them. But like I I also would hear things from the pulpit about like the sin of drink or women or whatever and I heard heard loud and clear that I myself in this you know body it was like an actual and like I was like basically you know in my responsibility. The two do everything in my power to not be the downfall of good and upright men and it was very much a man's world and I was just I really struggled. And and I I think the deep deep Sort of like insecurity Low self esteem and like shame that came from those years just was very very very very deep learned that I think to this day. I'm still sort of Trying to intentionally. He'll he'll and trying not to do too much of the like Boots and cannabis to nominate but only let myself that like in moderation or or in What what what is it that people like to say balances? They're like sneaker to live forever. 'cause I think I would And I think I have spent years like in a little bit of a like boozy or candidacy. Sort of fog Because it just to cope it just was absolutely it was just kind of 'cause there's just more than I could take the Being a highly emotional highly sensitive person. Yes and so And I kind of watched watched it crush my mom She was really the only person you you know. My Dad would come and go. She was really the primary loved source. Basically and I just think in studying her I also got a really deep fear. You're for all of it but I completely believed in in entirely and My parents were big super naturalist too so it was just this constant something like spiritual warfare being waged constantly around us all the time like Angels Demons God Satan Heaven and Hell like this warfare for the eternal destiny custody of our souls and like when when the it seems to me like now looking back and I don't have children and I'm sure a lot of my trauma is is wha is why I don't have children but Like Sam Child free. I don't WANNA baby in my body or in my apartment sucking off my body or we're my bank account as you can see like turn to to Comedy obviously also like A. I think like All that Like everything Chris. Everyone I knew was Christian Christian Christian Christian Kirksey them when I finally like got out of the House and started the sword Lord of like learn how to think critically in college and then when I finally got Chicago and discovered Improv comedy. I feel like I kind of like replaced that Replaced Christ with comedy and comedy was a place where like with which Christ I always felt like. I was good enough I I had a really even though like all day like it. Crushed me so hard and I might sub Steve and everything was so devastated. I still had a really strong I always had a really kind of strong wrong natural rebellious spirit where I just would sort of naturally do whatever it was but you know I wasn't that I was being told that was just kind of my my nature. Hr so that also really really scared me. Because then also I learned about like predestination and stuff and I'm like Oh clearly I'm not predestined. And then that's all like you you know and so they're like oh I'm just fucked and but I was born into a Christian family but I just can't find the Jesus gear in my life shifter and I and I. I thought that I'm not going to be in a very real hell forever and so I just really did get to where I was like You know so I'm just going to do all the things I and Really you know it was. It wasn't a very compelling belief system anyway when really everything had been told was just. Don't drink don't smoke. Don't have sex to married right right and you know the three months like just was not very compelling so I was like okay so those are the three things I'm going to do and and then live in complete ABS- absolute terror constantly like of the very real helmet awaits me. Yeah because those are the only options right. I mean you. Just you're either a saint or an apostate so like you just have to decide. There's no gray. Yeah exactly so I think But it was like when I saw I was being really I was just being a not not take care of you know like in in high school and stuff I think honestly because I just I did start to try to numb all that stuff because I had no coping mechanisms. I couldn't even think critically I wouldn't you know and I just really. I just couldn't do it. I wasn't doing my devotions. I wasn't a prayerful person. I tried so hard and I was just so filled with fear that I finally just started to drown that fear are in like going to parties and getting hammered and like yeah and like doing all the things and then it but it wasn't until like it's funny that I went to a Church of God school in Indiana because like based on the the church I grew up in and even hoge on junior. Hi I went to a fundamental baptist is already like fundamental. I mean my God help you but like I went to a fundamental baptist Christian school and junior high were it was just fire and brimstone and Required soul winning and girls had to wear dresses and get down on our knees like coming into school every day to show. Oh that are skirts like would touch the floor. And then we weren't showing too much leg like and it's just like it was really really bad at an at that time when and you're already like I'm in junior high and I hate my body and I'm full of shame and terror and then it was just like more shame and terror So I think that's why I just really like went off. The deep end in high school and then got to college was like immediately found like the partying group and the bad kids who sleep through chapel and everything and yeah. I think that's one one thing that's just a very particular at Christian schools. Is that Mike. The bad kids so to speak are just the kids. The act like normal like any other college like college too yeah exactly exactly and But but funnily early enough like I also was taking so many Bible classes that I ran out of classes take in the Bible and Religion Department at the school and they started anybody me take classes in the seminary like while I was an Undergrad just because I was like I was learning how to think critically critically for the first time ever and I was so curious that I thought that if I and I noticed you To coin a Greek too right. Yeah yeah so it took a couple of years a years in In College and that was my first Freshman year was like the first full week of school was when nine eleven happened and I and and so I actually had my the history department. I initially went in as a history major And they're really big on double majors so I was history dream Biblical literature and I planned on going seminary afterwards And it was like the comparison of taking Greek and learning more about how the Bible was made and like. I didn't even really realize that I was sort of a biblical literalist but like studying Greek. Just made was a huge huge huge faith crisis for me coupled with like the history department was like defacto Republican and they were wrong about Iraq and and like I was becoming increasingly pacifist like myself because of what I was Playing in the Bible so yeah so I did take. I did take Greek and I was a for me. That was a big like holy cow. This is way more complicated than I thought it was moment. Yeah Yeah me too very much so and I was like okay now. I can translate the New Testament for myself and and understanding like the the complicated nature of of it being an inflected language. And what that means in terms of interpretation and all that stuff and and I think so so. Yeah same for me like that. That created a crisis a phase. Where like okay so like how far can pull the talk about his Deacon version as like death by thousand cuts like shows that was one of the cuts and then you know like wait? I think gay people are great and that was cut and run like all. Those things seems like wait. I have gay friends there. Dope like this way in all these cuts starts to appear like you only have so many fingers to like put put into the dam and And and I mean God bless them like that. That University was compared to the church. I grew up in. It was like fairly what you go. What my parents I guess we call liberal in terms of like Christianity record? I Ha- you know what I mean. 'cause I had like philosophy classes and stuff where like my doctor read one day because of some thing I've seen a classic aren't sure he gave me a book called the myth of State. And I want you to read this then like right some reactions to it and bring it back to me and I was like what are you talking about. The mets of shape like this is like really so offensive. And he's as like you know and And speaking of do you know Barkan Polo And that's Tony Campos son that that is no longer a Christian Ray. I know that they like wrote a put together where they sorta dialogue. Don't have that right. Yeah here He. He followed in his dad's footsteps was kind of like doing evangelical local like speaking circuit. And all that stuff and He was You know sort of like okay. I'M NOT GONNA do the Hell I'm not gonNA believe helping I'm not gonNA believe homosexuality thing for Lgbtq plus you know. I'M NOT GONNA okay. I'm not gonNA also and then it just starts to you know. The JENGA starts to topple I guess and but but He now has a podcast. which really great called humanize me and And he you talk about like It's just it's a supportive community for he. He's such a minister heart who no longer believes in the Bible solar and got her in any of that But he's but he's such a deep Minister that he has like now devoted his life to for a while he went and with the humanist chaplain at USC and And now he has the human is me podcast where he's basically I think ministering to the people who have left buffet converted or whatever you WanNa say and who are in pain and need answers of how to stay connected to the believers in their life who they deeply love and how to we know what to do in terms of unity. And all that stuff. So I he's really great and I got kind of lucky by like finding comedy I found instant community and I found a place where I felt like it was very strange to me when I got into comedy because I was like. Oh wait you can't really get like kicked out for anything anything. I was just always so afraid of being found out by the Christians is not getting it right and you know it's sort of like you know being Ostracized in in comedy. I'm like well I guess the only real sin here is not being funny. And so like I'll just. I'll just keep working muscle and like find a place to belong and whatever but Ridwan. Moore's art it's like I'm sorry for the noise in background. That's my my dog. who sounds like a cat so sorry about that? I'm such a dog person. Don't be don't do you know apologize. I my. My doubts dog will probably start making noise here since but when when I was in college and like being like bad kit hit or whatever Bar Chen Polo came through like doing some kind of life speaking. He's spoken chapel. And whatever and I was really compelled by what he was talking about confusing. I don't care if you're sleeping with your girlfriend. I don't care if you've got like porn under your bed or whatever I want to know if you care about poor people and it was more about like social justice and for the first time like an actual compelling passage of like a do instead of don't and so I like went and worked with his inner city ministry in Philadelphia. Just like the things that was seeing like doing inner city ministry was like almost more than I could pay to Just more than I could bear like the things that these kids are going through on the streets like in in these like disenfranchised communities and stuff I was just like Whoa. That was another big cut that was appearing where I was like cool. So I'm telling these kids who have no oh hope and who are being gang raped and stuff. There's like a very real God who loves them more than ever and it's like all powerful and everything and I was like I'm really struggling in here. And then meanwhile like you know learning coinate Greek of being able to translate and then seeing how complicated that is and yeah like you said how the Bible was assembled and everything and then reading reading the myth of Satan and and It's funny because when I was doing inner city ministry in Philadelphia I was living in the basement. It's like pre Presbyterian and Presbyterian church. It was a little bit more compared to how I grew up. It was a little more like high church. You know where like. They all had the same sermon every week and all the different like churches and And one of their like eucharistic ministers with a female and I was like Whoa. That's weird 'cause like I grew up with like there were no no female leadership Kinda got to be close to her and she started talking about things like the poetry of the Creation Story and like the myth of creation And stuff and I'm like wait. You're a Christian and you're saying there wasn't a seven day creation that it was like a piece of poetry and And it's and I was like wait. No you you you he then and and then as I started taking more and more of these seminary classes in college It's so looking back. I'm like that was so weird that I was like trying to like smoke and stay out in the graveyard heard like making out in stuff like saving chapel and like partying hard on the weekends and stuff and yet I was like veraciously doing everything I could to learn everything everything I possibly could about what I still believed to be the truth of the Bible and of the gossip stuff and then in one of my seminary classes is called literature literature and History of the Old Testament like my professors started like bringing in like pieces of literature that predate the the the writing of the Bible where there were these like similar creation stories and everything is like begged borrowed and stolen. And you know like right right like Mash and all those different stories from the same area in Sumeria like there's a lot in common because because that's how thousands of years ago. Yeah and then. He started to learn about like kind of what you were talking about with Pete Holmes of like Oh like ah white man in the sky that zoos you know and then if all those Greek gods were like having sex with humans then there were the sons of Gods and then the Christians Undo like wait. We got one of them to we got a son of God or you know what I just. Yeah but yeah it just really all started to fall apart hard for me and it wasn't until like when I was in graduate school in Chicago I went to Columbia In the Book and Paper Center at Columbia College Chicago and I went and got my masters in Interdisciplinary Art and I had a mentor and a professor there. who was this like Pagan woman and I was like Ooh even the word? Pagans scares me But I didn't I didn't even understand what paganism was and she would have just do all these like pagan rituals that were just like being more in touch with the earth and like doing these just intentional things like when you put away your summer clothes putting them away with like lavender and smells of springs. That when you when you brought them out in the spring it would and and when you put away your winter clothes. Put them away with like cinnamon and Mike like things that will like being in touch with the earth and the seasons like attention all day and all that stuff and I was like wait. What is it gives us? Yeah Yeah and and and all the like pagan stuff. The way it would like play out in everyday life I was like I actually Kinda like these things. It's like not scary. And and and and I think because like the comedy was overtaking my heart a little bit I just started to be like my God if if this life is laugh or cry like I'm just ready. He's a laugh. I'm so tired of being wrong like so deeply afraid like I would say the first third of my life life was just defined by fear. I was just so afraid and I was so kind of tormented by that that fear and then I feel like right around you you know Graduate School and Comedy in Chicago. I sort of I transitioned into Like clearly like I'm GonNa Laugh about it and I'm just GONNA turn into jokes and that's going to kind of be my way of coping with it and you know get get out of that but I'm now now that unlike entering a new transition. I'm seeing that like that sort of second third of my life with all it was just anger and and so much. My comedy comes from like a deep anger and sadness of of sort of what I feel like I Kind of lost. Or maybe. That's not even the word but just what. My experience was a as a young human and how much I didn't like it. And how much hurt Hurt me and didn't help me and how much an in so I feel like that. First third was fear. That second third was sort of Reaction to that fierce slash anger slash comedy and and realizing that like especially now. Now that I'm really trying to transition into this other third sort of my life this next Chapter I. I'm realizing that. So much of my comedic. Voice is very much in the realm of taking the piss out of myself and Kinda like that Hannah Gadsby stuff and And also B B being in reaction. Listen to This this thing that hurt me and sort of like overpowering it now with my new comedic perspective than like not caring or whatever but like clearly when you're in reaction to something you're still very much like in its in its grip you know and I think that's what I feel now and that was part if this like in Mexico. We husband and I did mushrooms and we went to these shin. Monica healings and meditation drum circles. And all this real weirdo stuff and And but it actually was kind of a profound experience and I felt like a deep shaft in my soul where it also was our ten year anniversary of being married which kind blew my mind. Because I don't even feel like I've known him for two years and makes me feel like like like shy and scared like where are the brakes. Like ten went that fast asked like all. It's speeding up and like I get really emotional. I'm I'm like tearing up right now because I think there was something about hitting our ten year aniversary where I was like Jesus. Maybe I'm going to actually start like trusting you and believe that you love me because I think I I like I perform a lot for for like for for love like I if I can make you laugh I can impress you with whatever amount of success I can get. Maybe he'll stay. You know like reaching this Sorry I'm like I'm I cry like I cry a lot so I'm greg right now but I feel like I am entering a A new phase of like. I'm ready to be happy. I'm just really ready to allow myself to be happy. The Anti Trust it like that I can be loved and belong and I don't have to like worked so hard for it like I can just think think knowing that there are no guarantees and like anything can happen tomorrow relationship and I could end up You know alone and experience variance law which is like my greatest fear. That could happen but like I'm going to stop like Waiting for the other shoe to drop and I'm just GonNa fucking enjoy like the the the many things through which I'm so deeply grateful rather than continue to like just Line at all for comedy laugh at all the way and be like constantly waiting for the other shoe to drop in like guarding myself in some way from that adding not allowing myself to like have that like full you know like terrifying human experience of like loving and being loved. I'm so sorry I'm like no it's it's okay. It's totally fine. And you've overcome a lot and you deserve to you. You deserve to feel the way you do. You've you've you've earned every bit of that emotion. You know just hearing your story just in in this brief time. There's there's so much life lived there and there's so many things to process and and I think the things that you shared it it indicates why leapt like evangelicalism. It creates an extra burden for people to overcome to sort of especially as they as life continues. You you know you just have to continue wrote punches and just does not prepare you for for life one of my friends. One of my friends really said a very well said it. It's like gives you a false bill of goods. Having nothing works the way they say it does that. That's being more general and moving away from moving away from your story in. I'm just like I said you deserve to feel every bit of emotion that you have think. Thanks so much for your good listener I just I was really I'm running through there. Yeah yeah and I mean I think you've you've said so many things about how you just didn't you didn't like back. In retrospect you. You didn't enjoy being young and then you took that that discomfort that anger about the way the way you are conditioned the way you were treated treated in the U use that as a tool to create comedy. I never performed comedy. But I I really like comedy. I like watching comedy like when my family moved from Indiana to the Chicago suburbs high school. I didn't know anyone And so I would just go home and watch comedy Central Mike Religiously. That's all I because it's like this. It's like sort of a soft landing place and the other thing about comedy. Even if you're not aware of it at the time is there there. The whole point of it is there's no sacred cows and when your whole life is nothing but sacred cows. It's a pretty big fucking relief to have that so I know this. I know this is a a pivot back in your story. But but talk a little bit about Mike Your Grad School Oh period and and how you got into comedy and using Improv and other things in order to work out your anger and your other feelings about what's in your life to that to that point so I think It's funny because I took I too was a double major in college and I did acting was one of my degrees and my other one was Bible religion and I had to take Improv In my acting courses and I hated it because an Improv like everything you say is yours so you if it lands then you you've succeeded but if if if you eat shit then you've failed and I was just so afraid of the feeling and I was so afraid of being judged for what would come out of my mouth and like with acting you're on you're seeing somebody else's words and so it's like you know it's script you know talk writer but In an Improv. You are the actor writer director editor. You know you're you're all of those things and I just had such Deeply low self esteem that it just scared the Bejesus out of me but I think there was something in me whether I would have admitted at the time or not. That like knew that I was funny and And and I just sort of always been kind of working comedic muscles and like story telling my whole life life and So I soon as I graduated I just immediately moved to Chicago because I'd heard that like all the snl people like came through. Second City and so I I moved to Chicago like simply to face that dragon because I was like wires. Getting the best of me like I think honestly like my deepest deep deep waters that I could barely access consciously. Maybe not access at all consciously at the time like like knew that I was funny but My my more surface waters that were all like choppy and and and blowing around and distracted acted I on the surface. Really think I believe like I feared that I wasn't funny so something in me just was like I'm Gonna I'm GonNa face that dragon and Mike See why I'm so intimidated by it. And and maybe I'll find out that I'm actually not funny and so I I moved to Chicago and I started taking classes the second city and then I heard about i. Oh and then. I started taking classes that I owe and then I heard about annoyance. I started taking classes and annoyance. And then I was doing Improv. Shows every night of the week and I was like in in every sketch group I can be in and simultaneously. I started working at Willow Creek Community Church Mega Church in the suburbs of Chicago. Because I because because they didn't think I had any skill set to work anywhere other than in the life of the church which had been my entire like reality and understanding of `existence. So I'm working at this mega church during the day to support my improv habit at night and as I'm working at this church like I felt deeply closeted there because as I was working there I was it was the death by a thousand cuts. It I was like I had. I was removing enough Jenga pieces but it was all properly and I was like. Oh my God I don't believe like I. I'm not a believer. I don't believe in any of it and I was working at a church and then I started to move into an era where I was like I could be like. I don't believe it but it's clearly so good for all these people and it does good for people like hey whatever works for you man and then I started to move into a period period where I was like. Actually I don't think it is good for people like I think it hurts people. I don't think it's okay. And then I started to feel like I was like a Jedi Knight who was like working for the dark side like I. I'd gone over to like vader's side or something like and then the very dramatic but like I kind of was like fearing that but I also still getting getting showing much approval like from my parents and stuff for working there and it was actually offering me. Financial Security to be able to live in. Chicago is like a young single girl and like support Improv. Habit so I think like an a- as I started Doing more and more comedy I I think because of my deepest securities like I would always just be like on the funny one on the team. I'm like I can make the connections and be a good supportive player and stuff but I'm not funny and I was. I was getting laughed. I just couldn't even like absorb them because of you know the the multitude of Voices in my head of that belief system. That had kept me so frightened Hobbling I I started to really struggle to know what my voice was and I still to this day. I have a thing where whenever I do an Improv show I have trouble remembering it afterwards. almost almost like I went into some other state and I remember One of my friends one night saying something. It was really funny in the show. She was like that was really funny and I was like. What are you talking about? And she was like you were playing this like twelve year old little like skater kid. Who Sort of a bad influence on the character? She had been playing and she was like and we were having this conversation and character in your little twelve year old skater kid looked at me and said it's a dualistic thinking that's keeping you pain and I was like I sat in the show tonight and she was like she was like. Yeah it was it was really funny to hear a case. Talk like that to realize that like that. My actual comedic was like juxtaposing. Like put pudding Starting to let my little inner Weirdo speak and letting her out. Like the very thing that I'd sort of been hiding from the world my whole life like actually the comedic boys and I was getting laughed. I just wasn't getting last where I was trying to get laughs. I was getting laughs like accidentally when I would inadvertently like stumble into a moment of enough freedom where I let my little inner Weirdo Talk. And she would start to describe the way that she sees the world that she's deconstructing the like new idea of reality and and walking away from like the painful belief system that was not serving her and so as I slowly became more or conscious of that I think my comedic voice started to become clear in my head and like the loud mean. insecure voices. This is that we're trying to always prepare me for the worst. By telling me the worst things about myself started to subside like when I was on stage because I found it really refreshing to not be me. I wasn't me in that moment. I was playing this eighty year. Old Woman who doesn't give good gun them or whatever and I I found it to be such a refreshing break. Like to clock out from the exhausted. Like hamster wheel that had been holly he and be somebody else and So I honestly in many ways I feel like Improv and comedy kind of kind of saved me and then and then during that time I met Greg who I started dating and then Years later we got married and In Chicago and and and and it's funny because like I remember I had kind of become a real bullshitter because I felt so deeply bad about who I was that I was always always just like trying to give you some like Bullshit version of me that I thought you would find more acceptable or likeable or whatever and so like at the same time. My comedic voice sort of starting to click in I was also identifying like the how I had to like Sort of extricate that bullshitter from inside of me. That was Hiding from you you know and like putting up walls of like and I just realized I was kind of doing that with Greg like I was really only showing him like putting my best foot forward which I guess you Kinda do. When you're I dating someone anyway of like look? How great and lovable I am? And I'm not frightened and frail and angry at all unlike wonderful to be around. I laugh a lot. Ha This is so fun and I mean I think like as it started to look more and more like trust with him and the more comfortable I got with him the more I would let the real niece slip out. That's like an and I just stopped. I was like on a new mission to be honest with myself. Delve to be honest with my peers in my loved ones and to be honest with the world as I started to do that. My little inner Weirdo started speaking more and more and I. Ah I always tell this dumb story of like Greg and I were driving to visit. His family were driving this little tiny town and there was just like one and stop sign and like a tavern and post office and but there was the storage facility and it said Eagles storage and I was looking at it and I was like wow and greg was like what what are you thinking about what. What's wow and I was like? This must be a really weird town when he was like. Why do you say that and I was like and I pointed at the eagles storage space and I was like that so many people here would have eagles that they would need a storage for it and he kind of laughed like that and I was like and then I realized in that moment like I was like wait? Why did he just laugh and then I was like did I see something stupid? Oh I said something something stupid. Oh wait maybe. There aren't eagles in there. Oh wait that's okay. That's just a but like I think because of the way my brain formed with the evangelical beliefs or some like everything is so concrete. That like my little inner Weirdo when I read evil people storage. I'm like Oh that's a place where you store. Eagles and I realized to that like that's how it was getting laughs on stage when I would talk like that and I and then I would retro actively be like. Why did they laugh at that? In that you know and then I try to act like I meant it like that you know I I like Oh yeah I get I get why. That's funny when in truth like I I I didn't get. It was funny so the more I like killed the bullshitter inside of me the more I started to realize that I could talk like that all the time and then also laugh at myself. Because I'll still I mean like I'll still still do it I i. The other day no shit was sitting at the stoplight here in La and there was a spinning sign outside of a liquor store and it sends silver liquor. And I was looking at it and I was like Silverlake and I had a long like not whereas like I've heard of gold schlager where there's like gold flecks in in the booze but I've never heard of drinking anything over and I was like what would a sober there's gotta be silver and and through the whole stop light. I had that that was my whole line line of thinking the whole time and then it took me that long to be like. Oh that's the name of the liquor store like m. such a dumb But like being able to laugh at myself and be able to be honest with the world and be like yeah like that's how I was so afraid of being seen as dumb for so long and now I'm a little bit like you know. Sometimes I'm done Sometimes I'm not ah but Sometimes can be a real a real dummy and I'm just GONNA choose to laugh about it rather than tried to impress you. That is the way some people process information. And just like you said like everything about your world was was literal and fantastical at the same time. So that makes sense. Yeah I think Exactly can't can't say yeah. So how did you guys. How did you in Greg decide to start a show like mega you? You host a podcast called mega and it is about a fictional mega church in Indianapolis which makes it even richer for me. Just because I grew up about an hour outside of Indianapolis and yet and so so you chose the Trendy neighborhood in broad ripple to locate a everything. I think I love everything about about that. The setup of the show but how how did you eventually take all this stuff like in sort of marry these two parts of your life. You have everything from your childhood and adolescence since that that you processed going through college and after college and then you have this comedic chapter and then now over the last couple of years you've mm-hmm explored both through this podcast. which is an Improv show based in a mega church? So how'd how'd out of that come together. Well I've always said like that I'm bilingual. I speak English and I speak evangelical and And it might be like tooting my own horrible too much so forgive me but I i. I sometimes like in my deepest thoughts. I'll be like ooh. There's nothing more dangerous than someone who could translate the New Testament who grew up like so deeply entrenched in all of this thinking and who like knows how to speak your language and can navigate as a as a native in your world who actually like has gone through the deconstruction process. And then can kind of be funny about it as well but that honestly is taking way too much credit for the whole thing happening Because I just wanted to do a podcast I was like I'm in. La On hustling. I'm trying to Create you know I mean that Hustle and And I was going to do podcasts on podcast and I kept coming up with all these ideas and I would be on walks with my like comedy friends. It'd be on like walking the dog with Gregg. It'd be like oh I want to do something about how Improv Blah Blah Blah. I'm trying to come up with all these different ideas of like like the the therapeutic nature of like the rules of Improv and Greg just kept being like you gotta do something about a mega church like it's such a rich backdrop and you know the language Anglican and like you can bring your comedic sensibilities and like create a really fearing satire. And he's like you've got you gotta do something about a mega church. You have this your pets but honestly truth like I was really avoiding it because I think I held a lot of regret in my body like for how long long I had stayed working at a mega church when I didn't even believe how much it hurt me to feel so strangely closeted there and how I felt so full of Shit and it just had so many like bad feelings around it for me that I was like. Yeah I you know I I I want to do something about this or that. And they kept like they get all these ideas and finally I went and I sat with The production the media group who like now produces and I was sitting with Them and on pitching all these ideas and they were kind of like. Yeah there's no energy under and they were Kinda like looking at their watches and like kind of late in pitch. I was like and I had this idea idea. Like you know improvised satire. Seven mega church like playing characters. Work the Mega Church and bringing in like you know against each week. You know. Play somebody else's part of that like that community and they were like wait what they were like. That's the one look. Let's see I'm so I WANNA way I'm like totally over. Thought it was like okay. What do I name it? And how do I design the world and Blah Blah Blah Blah and. I worked so hard on it and then ended up tossing out everything that I been trying working too hard on and I was like you know what I don't care I'm GonNa call it twin hills because I'll be able to remember it because I'll think of it like boobs and to me it's funny if I have like a a booze joke like title and it'll be twin hills community church great done They always have to name youth group and the different ministries have cool named whatever. Oh yeah wouldn't it be funny if I called the youth ministry climax 'cause every you know like when when you're that age you're just like oh my gosh I'm like pole vaulting around on my erections constantly my time like great. I'll call the team ministry history climax and then we'll blah blah blah and and and then like once we just started it just like all kind of because We're all improvisers. We started playing together and it it kind of took its own shape like pretty quickly and it Kinda I think continues to evolve but It's it's it's really fun and I've I've actually I've had so many people contact me and be like I find it really healing having grown up like in that world I find it really healing to be able to laugh and I also feel like strangely cody in the language and the and the world because I just I'm so familiar with them but then for it it to have this like sort of like satirical edge to it and to hear Christians like speaking this way but with this underlying commentary the Christian characters actors. I mean And so and part of me to like it has healed me a little bit too because because of that regret that I've carried around about having worked in a mega church feeling honestly kind of embarrassed about it and like why didn't they just throw more caution to the wind. Why did that? Why did I do there so long? Why did I? I didn't even believe it and Blah Blah Blah and it was hurting me and and I think being able to now use it has has really It it has kind of helped like close that wound a little bit and allow myself to just even forgive myself for for having been there and done that and and and Bene- Jedi who went over to the dark side for a while and And forgive myself and just like us it and be like I'm GonNa have fun with it and and it really is such rich world and it's so ripe for commentary and so every time we everything like wow. That was so fun. That was so fun. And and and I'm my deepest love Improv and improvising. So it's an outlet to be able to do that and Able to do it with great players and Yeah that's Kinda origin of it. Yeah that sort of big scale. Evangelical world is so distinct. And if you've been in that if you've been in the sorts of spaces like it feels like it the the the sorts of references. You make the ways in which you you and Greg Lake and your hosts just make everything positive like I remember like just the the way in which you you always have to redeem something. Something I listened to the episode with Thomas Middle Ditch and he keeps killing people with his planes. But like like this like a so many people die just like you know just another opportunity to be you know an and just the way in which that that works I think speaks to really how performed a lot of that sort of church culture. It is yeah so much of it is is is fame and and I and I think now like being being a performer. I'm like oh I learned that from my dad from being on the road with him when he was up there giving the message of the Gospel. Like I didn't know this at the time like consciously but like he was performing and and there is a performance to it and It's it's it's compelling and I I often wonder like why you know people still go to church and I'm like well in many ways. It's like going to a concert where you have have that like that feeling of like I'm part of this thing and there's there are endorphins and it's like a free. It's a free concert. It's some free therapy. It's some free community. It's like I kinda I get it and I and I think a lot of our mega listeners are Christians and And I and I sometimes I'm like do you hear what I say but I don't know I mean to be really honest with you listening to your episode of excellent Jellicoe with tie with Pete Holmes. It has the unlit old bit rattled and I feel like it's so apropos and epic ethic kind of of this big transformation. I'm feeling like overall in my life like choosing Love and belonging and trust in like shooting to allow myself to finally be happy like. It's so funny because for like most of your talk with Peas I was listening to WHO and I was like. Oh my Gosh I completely disagree. Oh my gosh. This is kind of pissing me off like Oh my gosh. Of course it's easy for you to stay guy the yes. Of course you can say. Hey that was white privilege straight guy like yeah. Of course you've got and I was just getting so having these strong reactions if like really really disagree and then as it went on I started to. I realize like I'd been hitting like fifteen seconds back. Fifteen seconds back fifteen seconds back like over and over like I what did he just say. I have to listen to that again. Wait what did Blake. Just say. I gotTA listen to that again like what did it. I've probably listened to three times like all in one sitting and I was like wait a second and it started to like. I don't know like ring. A certain balance side of me where I realized like so so much of my discount for with with most of what you impeach. We're talking about for the first half of it or whatever it was it was almost like when you break up with someone and you used to have this tenderness and intimacy and you would kiss each other on the mouth and you would tell each other your secrets and you would have this sort of Relationship I realized I had a relationship with that belief system and so so much of my experience now is like we broke up like and like I. I grew up with that person. I don't and I wanted it to be like Pete. Stop talking so nicely about this person who like broke my heart man. You know like And I kind of realized edge that like And then and then I started to get really self conscious to where I was like. Yeah it wasn't a relationship with Christianity and we did break up and and and then I started getting self-conscious and being like wow i. I'm not in a relationship with any of my exes in like real relationships like I. I think because I'm so tender and so sensitive so emotional like I just have to be like I have to move on. I have to leave that in the past and allow my heart Kinda like go in another direction and when I started to really and then I started to be like why am I not friends within my exit. It's like what's wrong with me and just immediately thinking something's wrong with me. Okay I gotTA figure this thing out and I'll go do mushrooms or something and I'll I'll figure it out I'll be better and like okay something. Yeah something definitely wrong with me. I should be able to be friends with my accent. I should be able to like like when he was talking about like like Richard Richards. said he's a Francis Francis. Fryer sure yeah and I remember kind of digging him when I was still kind of like in the belief system and and and I know there's some good thinkers in good folks out there who are hanging with it and But I just I think I had to just be like I'm out I'm gone. I'm on a totally different planet. I flew my little Jedi plane. Like I'm on this other one now and I don't and I won't listen to any of them like we broke up and and and even like when you we're talking about As your conversation progress that kind of started to hear what you were talking about an about the like the metaphorical focal approach to what I always was taught was like literally you know right and as you got into that I started to just really be like. Oh my gosh like I felt I felt sort of My heart starts and melt a little bit and be like. Oh I think even in with mega like so much of what I'm saying is trying to comedic lead be like hey this is in your book and this is in your book to you know that book you built your life around He here's another thing that's in there and this is all and there's two there's two and B because I I don't think God ah does come off great you know in terms of like we just like He. He kills people a lot. He's you know it's like really. Oh you rascal and whatever I think Jesus Yeah it's not it's like it's very it's it's it's more like trump. What what but what you were talking about when I finally get over myself and here the the beautiful nature? We're talking about and as like dammit Pete. He is really a good thinker and a has a lovely way of articulating. Something that he cares deeply about and I started to think like think I have people all the time. Tell me like oh you gotta watch like you know all these things like you know on Netflix. Whatever about like be different documentaries Kamenica coming out or whatever about Jesus camp or stuff like that or what was the one that just came out about like that that shadow group of Christians behind the Republican looking for? Yeah the family. Were always telling me like you have to watch these things so up your alley. And I'm like actually it's not and I never watched any of that stuff because it for me. It's like reliving the break-up or going back and looking at the the the the scene of the crime or the car crash or whatever and I really sort of the I think I was listening to you and Pete Tacos. Wow I think maybe Part of this new this transformational thing. I feel myself inside like listening. Listening to your conversation. became a big part of that because I think I need to re rather than throw the baby out with the bathwater. I'm because I think there's ultimately something fearful in that like I need to not be afraid of of looking at and and finding the the beauty and the humanity and I shouldn't even reference this book because I'm not reading it but my husband Greg is. He's reading that book. SAPIENS Indians. Right now do you know that book by no you've all that's nothing have mixed up the names. Yes he we were talking about because he's reading it right now and I was asking about it and he was talking about how you know The way that that we evolved evolved as a species like the communication and the ability to communicate and articulate became such a Like the defining thing of what turned us into what we are now because like even like monkeys can they can communicate with each other to certain degree they can be like. There is a lion down there But they can't be like I saw lion by the creep yesterday. You know what I mean and the fact that we can begin to talk like that we can begin to imagine and when you can imagine then we can make up God and and like control people and like have all these different religions. All of that stuff. I think thinking along those lines like that has kept me feeling very Isolated From people I love who are believers or or just feeling like apples and oranges and especially like with my parents parents like it's been so deeply painful because my parents to this day are such supernatural lists and it's always like all right I just I just just made my first short film that I'm submitting to festivals. And in fact they just got back from London. I'm super jetlagged right because I was there a film festival with my phone. But my film is called brought to you by and It's basically it's based on a true story of like just sitting at a meal with my family while my dad like talked about the The supernatural as as reality. I mean it's it's it's just so oversaturated like we went to that movie dunkirk. The whole way home from dunkirk he was like you know the Satan like took a hold of Hitler's mind and it was the spiritual warfare that was actually controlling those planes and everything that we're like bombing you know. Did you see that movie dunkirk. No I didn't and I knows some Nolan ones but I totally missed it. It's a it's a war movie and and my dad like all the way home is telling me Greg about how like Satan Eyton was the one who have entered Hitler was like controlling those planes and it was actually a spiritual worker that was like managing the actual like World War Two and Blah. And it's just it's just all the time and It's really kind of been hard for me to Be True to who I am and Not Bullshit them and accept them for WHO. It's been really hard but I feel like this thing that's happening right now with me and and that conversation you and Pete had is really helpful to me. I feel like it's beginning to scratch. It's something that's like. Oh they're maybe choosing happiness and trust and love like does mean like coming back to a greater generosity rosty of spirit and and being able to you know be be friends with my ex so to speak and Have more much had more emotionally mature relationship shit thread and not be so like you know get Outta here. Baby got turned his back water out the window right. Yeah I mean that that conversation with Pete thank you for all you said about it on the kind things he said about one of the. I know that one of the things that he really emphasized was you process like you have to process leaving and being angry But eventually some at some point. It's good to release it that anger and one of the things that I come back to as you know. I don't care what you believe and I care that your whole and so like the things that they get you closer to that. That's really what matters and I think Pete has a very expansive way of expressing that and like that's why he's able to. I think one of the things that evangelicals teaches you is do not have a piecemeal theology. It's gotTa be cohesive it's got to be consistent and it's got to be all these things but there's like a whole other type of spirituality that is able to receive the goodness from all sorts of traditions and recognize them all as since valuable and that's I think it's hard for people that come from backgrounds like ours to get to that place but it. I think it's often very very much depending on the person it can be very much worth the effort to explore. There's this one quote. Hello and I I WANNA say I know that I had this wrong It's you're GonNa hear me type Because I WANNA I want to put the right poet but there's Oh as a rookie. I was GONNA say roomy but it's real. There's there's one line from uh-huh rookie. That I heard on an on being podcast years ago. That seems to continue to echo for me which is I live my life in widening circles and to me that it sort of encompasses leaving a very fundamentalist literalist type of religion of origin has leading. Yeah that's great and bigger really. Yeah I mean you you. You're still working. You can still be the angry you know but there's there's also a good thing about you don't have to feel an obligation to the anger just like he felt an obligation to. Wow Oh Ooh I got it right then down. That's a good look good. It's funny. I referenced that when Greg and I were down in Mexico this August we went to Schimanek like Meditation Drum Circle like healing night and it was just as weird as it sounds and it was kind of the best and we. I'm we left after like over two hours of this like drumming and like chanting and guided meditations and then like the Shaman. Doing like bodywork bodywork on us and like trying to rid of whatever it was it was like had us. It's clutches and Blah Blah Blah. And I mean we went down like that. That was really weird and then Greg was like I love that we do this weird stuff and I was like I kinda do too. Because like there's little nuggets Everywhere like I don't really believe I almost feel like I don't know if this is true or not. I hear myself say this but I don't know it's true I I just feel feel like having deconstructed. And maybe this is part of the transition going through now is Having deconstructed my belief system I thought I have thought for a long time now like kind of made me unable to believe anything like I've I you know it's an and yet I like into La. Like I'll go to and to it'd I'll go to like the sound bad. I'm doing all that like non you know where I'm like. Yeah I'll go to Chamonix Drum Circle Michael Meditation Healing night like I don't believe any of it but like I there are things that I find helpful inside there's like you know some clairvoyant. Like gave me some some of the weirdest like reading caution records and talking to me about my past lives and everything and I was like I don't believe past lives and she's like that doesn't matter like there's there's information I'm here for you like it doesn't matter what you believe and whatever and I don't know maybe I'm maybe I'm transitioning now going back to being able to Cleveland something because it's funny funny that even though I'm like I don't believe in anything here. I am continuing to like in the same way I took every Bible class. I could possibly take ran out of class and had to go seminary like I ah similarly now and like. I don't even anything and yet I'm constantly going to Shaman healers and then two dozen clairvoyance like all you know like I've really gotten gotten into TM. And I really like him because It's a practice that's just for me. It's more scientific and I'm like I don't want anything that has any religious roots you know and Ah Anyway when we were with this Shaman that night in Mexico after he took us on this whole long thing. You kinda do get swept up like the rhythm of the drums drums. you start to kind of be like WHOA I. I am kind of going on a little bit of journey here in terms of like all right. I'm I'm hanging. I'm listening. Whatever at the end of the whole who thing when he kind of had me in a state of being able to hear him he ended by just saying like life is an idea? If it's not working for you change the idea and we went home that night into the water. Like look at the stars Dot doc about that for hours and we were like what does that mean for us. Because I do think that's possible like change the idea like and and in the same way you're saying like that's awesome make you have bigger circles Rather than circling the wagons and coming in and being like death is what I believe like my precious. It's like white. Knuckling it being like what are the ways in which like what are the ideas that take me into a wider and wider circle. It might be more helpful you know. Yeah that's such an amazing life idea. That's right I in different days in different moods and I continue to kind of like just try to let that sink in. Yeah Yeah because I mean ideas are so fleeting in transitory. It's it's weird to think of life in that and and it's also like what according to what's his name Sapiens like six. It's the exact thing we've evolved twos. But now we are these like mammals but who have this strange consciousness through language that can imagine. And can you know and it's probably also what's giving anxiety miniature and all that stuff like I always tell my improv students. I'm like just be like a dog. Like dogs are the best improvisers because dogs are entirely present every three time. My dog gets in the car. She doesn't know if we're going to the best place in the world the beach or if we're going to the worst place in the world the vet. She's just in the car. Unlike with Improv. With my students all the time I can be like. You're not having fun. And you're not entering a state of play and getting into the flow of just like making organic discoveries together other through listening to each other because you're so trying to figure out where the car of this scene is going like just being a car just be in the car and and Because it's it's in the same way that like I have to stop performing to try to gain earn love. Because it's not up to me to answer. Why Greg Mike Love smear why anyone loves me through them to answer you know like just just be in the car and so that's so great and I mean even to hear this at at at this point in our conversation from the way he talked about yourself as a child and being anxious I mean so awesome that you the part that to someone else as a teacher so I just wanted to say like thank you for this conversation conversation? It's really been so lovely and I feel like I know you and we've never even shaken hands and I just really appreciate your time. And I'M WE'RE GONNA Take Away Nuggets from this for sure as I continue to you know. Try to take active steps towards wholeness and occasionally do the the numbing booze and cannabis and mushrooms rows. Yeah Yeah if you can do that healthily and I know not everyone Cam Dan take with the with the astros foul. That's right holly. This has been a great conversation. I I totally agree this is. I've I've loved talking to you. Where where can people find the show? Where can they find you online or in La or just plug? Whatever you WANNA the plug? Mega podcast is everywhere. PODCAST exist Maga and We have a really good time nine. And hopefully it'll make people laugh a lot and also if you tune in on Saturdays to NPR. I have a segment called tragedy plus time with Hollywood around and and But but also likes my website which is my name and and My name is the same on instagram. mm-hmm and twitter. I think it's my last name first around Holly But I'll put stuff up there I play at. UC BE HERE IN LA. People can come see me play. Hey on some Fridays and with Some coaches shows with Jason Zukas once in awhile. And that's great Yeah and and eventually as the festival circuit brought to you by Satan a short film. It's eleven minutes long and it's really funny and it's really it's really fun and exploring the idea of whether or not we you see what we believe or we believe what we see and and about how like kind of the semantic kind of struggle of like my dad looks at something and he's he's like a powerful stronghold of state and then I'm like oh I look at the same thing it'd be like I see a dictionary abuse and like talking about same thing just using different language or not like who knows like tried to play with that idea of Of Ya of belief and and all of that so I'll put that out to But Yeah Yeah. If people got into mega that would be really really fun. and yeah again but I I. I really appreciate your time I. I can't thank you enough for this conversation for some of the gems that you've left me with that really will stick with me and that means a lot to me. Thank you so much. Thank you for coming on the show and telling your story as well. I really appreciate it. We'll have article and.

Chicago Mega Church Indiana Christian school and Church Greg Church of God school facebook Exxon NPR Christian College Exponential Twenty Nineteen La Chicago Pizza Mike Holly Laurent Indiana Wesleyan Vr chastain Hollerin Jake
The Imbalanced History Of Rock And Roll: Buddy Holly- 'Rock n' Roll Crusader'

Rock N Roll Archaeology

43:11 min | 4 months ago

The Imbalanced History Of Rock And Roll: Buddy Holly- 'Rock n' Roll Crusader'

"Hey Hey Marcus. How you doing not too bad, not too bad woke up a little bit sore after a big bike ride yesterday, and did what I tend to do. When I wake up, really sore is grab a little CBD and I'm feeling better. That's good. You know our joints. Don't take exercise in extreme activities very well. The older we get, and a lot of people were younger experiencing the same thing. That's why we're pretty excited about our sponsor. One CBD and a lot of people seem interested. In the fact that one CBD's consciously created, they use one hundred percent organic sources. They employ a holistic removal of all the THC, and they select the best strains, and the strain is very important. Important when working with controlling pain are also hall and Kosher compliant are non, GMO. They're made in the U. S. A. M.. We've set it up so that you can save twenty percents off your first order when you use the code, balance I I. Don't know we're. We're imbalanced, but we're using the code ballads, so keep that in mind. You Go to one CB DOT COM. That's n e D. Dot Com and they're at one eighty life on twitter. If you WANNA follow him there CBD in all forms. Liquid Gel. cavs, and they give you the choice. All you have to do is hit their website one CBD DOT COM. It's one CBD, manage your pain and achieve a renewed sense of balance. Marcus in the darkest here. How you doing buddy? I'm doing fantastic in yourself, my friend. I just realized how ironic it is. That I just casually called you buddy because that's what today's episode, the imbalance history or rock and roll is all about. Friends. Buddy. Holly. Exactly. He's. He's one of both of our favorites and we were talking about it on the episode of five favorites. And you really show me a lot more about your interest. Buddy Holly, which has been ingrained in me from the cradle, so it's kind of cool to sit here and talk about the main. Who became I duNNO NERD! Cool that a good way to look at it definitely nerd cool in that nerd, coolest kind of punk rock in some ways because of the attitude that went with nerd. Cool the guys in the leather jackets in the white t shirts with collars turned up and all that stuff cigarette also and cigarette pack in the sleep you. They were also punk rock. Those Kinda guy is in the rock and roll scene. All thought the Charles. Hardin holly was pretty cool to even though he was a skinny guy with the big old glasses, I always love seeing rivers Cuomo from weezer. Totally adapted that look early on and made it his own. Shows Buddy Holly through the decades and now into in home other century. Continues to be an influence on rock and roll all by the age of twenty two. It's incredible what he did in his short time in the music world, and the fact that his in a few others ended so tragically on that same is just heartbreaking, because of what the three of them brought to the music world. At that time. We'll get around to that, but first we got. Got To thank our sponsors crooked eye brewery in the heart of hamper serving cure for what ails you since two thousand fourteen and one CBD. Check them out online at O. NEC BE BVD DOT. com Can I give you some perspective for my family and my life and my approach to buddy holly sure buddy was born about a year after my dad. Now my dad was more. More of a Sinatra Guy, my mom, who was born two years later, she was all about Buddy, holly, rock and roll till I've had in my collection since I was a man, my twenties, a a lot of my mom's forty five, after she passed I, got the rest of them, but I always had her buddy. Holly and crickets records on coral. Brunswick all I can tell you. You is I learned some things about all that while we were looking into this episode about the ma'am, buddy holly with or without the crickets, and the influenced a whole lot of people at a key time in rock and roll, as it was turning quarter. Really those lines you have one of the greatest quartet's, if not the most influential important rock and roll quartet of all time. Taking their name as a take off or to show respect, because they were influenced by holly that band being. Close. ally. A.. Guy? And you also have the hollies who took their name from buddy holly as well. So The guy was influential in the short time, and he didn't even live long enough to be in the twenty seven club. Body I know and. To have? Those lives taken in such a freak way. It doesn't make sense if you really think about it. What they were bringing the world at that time as far as music goes, and how they were helping, change the tide. Yes, in a lot of ways to have it all just clip out from under you like that makes no sense. That's the part of fate stuff that I have a hard time with it. It doesn't make sense and they were people who were needed long beyond what they gave us. Let's fast forward from those early Halcyon days where he's recording and becoming an artist and making his name and go to the day the music for my mom's generation. That's the day the music died February third, one, thousand, nine, hundred, fifty, nine. I was a wee babe. We interrupt this program for a special news bulletin, three young singers who saw to the heights of show business on the car and rock and roll craze or killed today in the crash of a light plane in an Iowa snow, flurry Los Angeles where identified as Richie Vallon Seventeen, buddy, holly twenty two and j p Richardson known professionally as the Big Bopper, we are craft chartered from lead wire, Flying Service crispier, Mason city ironically setting for the prominent musical the music man. Pilot Roger Peterson of clear lake. Iowa was also killed. The three singers had appeared at the surf ballroom, an play like Iowa last night, and round away to Fargo, North Dakota, they're small charter. Plane crashed and the lonely farmyard about fifteen miles northwest of Mason city. In the way it worked out first off also in there. In addition to the crew was the big bopper, he was part of the review that was making the making the rounds there with Buddy Holly Ritchie Valens. Game. All. Right. I! Know what life. A, It was the Winter Dance Party tour. What did you say earlier? It would go down in history and be known as rock and roll's tour from Hell. The winner Dance Party of Nineteen fifty nine, and it was because travel was difficult to winner that part of the country clear Lake Iowa scene of the final moments for J P Richardson, the big bopper Buddy Holly and Ritchie Valens. It's one of those faith things, and you mentioned it earlier as we're getting into this holiday in one way and he wanted to get to the next eight. Everybody else was going another other way I think they were going to drive to a train and all that he was going to meet them. There is GONNA fly ahead. I guess he had stuff to do center Waylon Jennings. He gave up his seat I can't remember if he gave it to Ritchie JP. That's. That's the way things went down and that's why Waylon Jennings. Wasn't aboard the day the music died. The pictures were on the news have been songs in books and all kinds of things that have been said about it, and for a long time that kind of settled down until the movie. The Buddy Holly Story, which is where guys your age really got excited about buddy in some ways, right? It was the seventies when the movie came out seventy eight. I think and I was into it, too, but twelve years old yet, but there were a lot of you that had not really heard of buddy holly in there. You see gary. Abuse you doing this whole you target thing with classes and the whole nine yard beat so cool and the way he was moving. He was Kinda like a nerdy elvis trying to shake his hips in some way. By here this. Reason? I don't think we'd better buddy. Dr Vertigo. Buddy I don't think we're better. To do this for the virus. I was lucky because my dad was really into buddy, holly his music with some of the music that I heard as a child growing up along with. CR He liked Bob Dylan. He liked real young because they wrote great songs, and they didn't have exceptional voices, so he was really impressed with the fact that they could do that, and then he liked a lot of country music. Waylon Willie stuff like that Alabama Eddie Rava Crystal Gayle the Mamas and Papas. We had a lot of motown going on in our houses. Well, my dad was huge on Motown, so my mom grew up in Belleville. New Jersey so she was into like Fabian and frank and. Deano and all of them as well so as a kid. It was fun singing later alligator after awhile crocodile and stuff like. Walk. We had all that kind of crazy records in our house to. Jazz, a man in the funny papers we all know. He lives. Back home time, Girl. Don't be nothing. Cats do. Well. This cat's name is Ashley. For me, my earliest recollections are post February nineteen fifty nine, so a lot of it was music. My mom would put on her forty five player when she wanted to hear a little bit of Buddy and. Some of those songs. That really made buddy holly famous in immortal in a Lotta ways. Break Rubin Marcus here on. History of rock and roll the thing that got you. Got Me, your dad my mom, millions of other people a song. The songs of buddy holly the songs buddy holly crickets. Crickets. However you WANNA say. They made you move. They made you feel good. They made you WANNA dance. It made any. Like. Wasn't high energy sexual. Driven? You know it was a let's hanging dance. Let's let's dance Malt Shop Scooby Doo style. Scooby Doo. Prese qb Doo now one of the things I've forgotten. And then we started looking into this reminding me about the fact that that'll be the day which everybody knows everybody across generations. Know, it's. The. Style Ricketts is actually artist on the label. It was their only number one. Here's another thing that people don't relieve look at very seriously, but should buddy holly as well as buddy, holly and the crickets. However you want to label. It charted very well in the united. States are in beach arts. Really well, that'll be. The day hit number two. It was a song that they you know that the R. and B. Radio Stations Played. They spiked in Buddy Holly, and then he was the first artist to play the Apollo theater and that's right that's in the movie in the movie are you ready? For Nice found applause for Mr Buddy Holly. The way the. Started laughing like. When he came on stage, and then they just wall up that crowd with some feel good rock and roll, and they sold the crowd on their music right away. Thought. Scott Bram. Bay. May. It was really impressive that he was also a crusader food grew rights as well and really believed in equality amongst all people, so it's said a lot about his character. It sure did, and that's kind of a career is brief as it was backdrop for him, he had it set in his mind kind of the way. You described it right there, Marcus. And then he comes back with a song that didn't. Really too much. Then came a classic. How Close San? Album loud. Words. Tonight I. Love. And Tha! That's my buddy holly. Not The crickets. And it's on Coral Not Brunswick with your both part of Deca by the way which buddy recorded his first sight's for six. Here's the thing. He had hooked up with Norman. Patty who gets credit for being the producer, even though you and I discussed. How Buddy had a lot more hands on in the middle of it involvement in his music, a lot of people did his time. Being. Paid. Yeah, he completely changed the sound that the label wanted him to have. He was like no. These songs were meant to play this way. This is how we will record them. This is how we will play them. This is how it's going to be. Win You may. Day. But And he did not back, down. then. I found out why they're only records done. In that Short period of time, it's only a period of couple years. Really, but there were re recorded versions in. That's their the versions. Buddy said fuck you guys. I'M GONNA. Do this way and watch. It's a hit bank and he was right most of the time much as anybody could be. Then he has one of his biggest hits. It's a top five number. Three both aren be an hot one. Hundred and taking sue becomes this huge it for him, even though it didn't top the charts puke. You know. With that tag. Let. In those days you hit number three. You were getting a lot of love from radio all across the board, and then the next single from the crickets. It's the same guy right, but it's on, Brunswick. That's purplish label doesn't go all the way, but it has a big impact in England with the double single Oh boy, and not fade away. Think about that. How Oh boy, with buddy, holly and his tickets. You. Don't know what you've been. All when they go me, hold boy. Over the that. In, writing Bambi no hair, the noble. When you, the homeboy although the world could be that. When the rockabilly thing takes off and Oboe becomes a standard for allow the guys'll. Robert Gordon came along right. Not Fade away was one of the first songs rolling stones grabbed and made their own. Absolutely here, Buddy Holly, and all of those early British invasion rockers without a doubt, and not fade away as one of my favorite buddy, holly and the crickets tunes, just a great jam. It's almost like the two things. The crickets Buddy Holly, as an act or an artist would alternate having success with stuff, because the crickets had have a top ten hit and buddy with Mac or something like rave on which you know, one of my favorites. Even when I really I started listening that discover that, and that wasn't for MOMS collection. It sounded contemporary now to me and it stayed with me all for years. Now it's going to be. You to me. This is all through the year of my birth. Buddy. I'm I'm looking all these records that are coming out. On on the combinations of labels and it was petty came up with the idea, different artists that way you're not on each other's toes. And meanwhile he was siphoning off everything he could a more than was his share from what everybody has said through the years all the books and articles I've ever read so that's what it all comes round to in the. The areas nineteen fifty-eight. He's one of the highs. Guys in rock and Roll Ryan and he's so cool, even though he's you know non traditionally macho or anything like that. He does real wild child he starts to have other records in the nineteen fifty nine. It doesn't matter anymore. I think that actually come out after he was gone and becomes a huge hit. In Life. Williams you mail me so I could see it imply will golly Gee. What have you done to Muriel against? It doesn't matter. Know. It was released January fifth, so it came out that was the son was on the radio when I was still a current as you would say. When, the plane crashed just a month later, then true love ways was later than they a few years after his death. Look at all these songs that he released some people never get as many hits that they released after his death ever in their whole career, just one of those sad rock and roll tragedies, and there's God knows been too many of them through the decades since the fifties, rock and roll really got to be as a lifestyle for the. The artists as well as a music style. That's true was a music style was a life style. It was a sound that excited. People excited most everybody. Even I think the people who complain about it hated it secretly deep down in felt excited about it and I think that excitement, and that feels feeling scared the shit out of them. Seriously I say. We changed from the water that we're drinking and convert our beverages over to something tasty from crooked i. One of the things that I. appreciate is anytime. I go into crooked eye brewery right there at York and Montgomery in the heart of Hambro always feel good, and that includes feeling safe about where we're hanging out. You know what I'm talking about. Marcus. I definitely know what you're talking about. As during the COVID pandemic, it is important that people feel safe when they're going out and about very important and crooked eye. Has that warm say five and they're doing everything according to the governor's directions, they're the they. They know dance. What's in everyone's best interest? But they're still serving Markus that's right. The take out your or your crowder, your sixteen ounce cans all still there all the wonderful flavors that you love about crooked eye brewery and don't forget when you stop in to get your takeout bruise wear mask absolutely and I. Think one of the things that Pete and Paul and Jeff and everybody and we're learning to is that it's a constantly changing landscape when it comes to what's going on, so I would urge. You to follow crooked eye brewery on Facebook, and you'll find out just what's going on there today tomorrow next week, and as things change, Cook it I- brewery, right in the heart of hat, borough poorer and the cure for what ails you since two thousand fourteen, and we thank them for their support of the podcast. We're back from Bruce keys in ready to roll on buddy, holly on the imbalance history of rock and roll well, the Rock and roll, Hall of fame takes a Lotta Shit Marcus, but you know they got that first class right in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, six and buddy was in there. He should have been in there. He was one of the founders that deserve to be part of that inaugural class because of what he did, and it becomes another classic example that we talk about. About here on the podcast of what if an how much for how long would buddy of made even more amazing music? He had already shown himself to be a man who could change with the times, and that extended to his marriage right, his marriage shows that he believed in all people, and was completely against any sort of prejudice. He found somebody who he completely fell in love with at first sight, and had no cares about what her ethnic background was what her religion was any. Didn't care about he loved her. He saw her and he knew it was one of those moments and I give him mad props for being able to not only set a standard of artists involvement in the recording process in rock and roll, but to be able to socially do things the right way and do the right thing. Versus what stereotypical prejudices are what societal stereotypes are so mad, props, the buddy holly for being cutting edge in so many ways they met along the same kind of path that you normally might think. She was working in the building. Appear Music, and that's how they met when he was starting to move towards New York, so he and Maria. Maria Elena Santiago connection, and then they have a date. Oh my God. He was in town. He was recording and he just met the girl of his dreams. Now I think as much in Texas more than anywhere that he would be familiar with their relationship wasn't readily accepted in I guess there was some concern that from other people in the business part of things, but he never showed it. He never felt that they got married right before the plane crash and it's hard to believe that their love was so strong that it was willing to go across all that had so little time not knowing that he was going to die and just a short time. No Way, of knowing that his another thing and I know the movie with Gary Busey playing buddy. Holly showed a little bit about how he had to jump through hoops with marinas and to be able to win her over to give him a chance to be able to date Maria. And the fact that you know he did that again at a time where it was challenging for anybody and societally different for anybody to do any interracial dating just wasn't calm, and and it wasn't socially acceptable, and people got comfortable with it and. The hoops that he had to jump through were impressive in the fact that he wanted over says a lot about it, says you. And the fact that her aunt being old school probably saw that, and felt that and understood that aspect about it and understood how both of them felt because I can guarantee while he was courting her Maria had already had that talk with her aunt. They've been married six months at the time of the day. The music died. She learned about it on TV. She was pregnant and suffered a miscarriage shortly after because of the trauma at all, we talked about trauma in rock and roll, but this is actual life, real life trauma, and of course buddy. was buried in Lubbock. They say she's never visited the grave. I couldn't understand that so I went and I found a quote. That, she gave a while back, it says in a way I blame myself. which is a horrible thing to do to yourself? I was not feeling well. When he left I was two weeks pregnant and I wanted buddy to stay with me, but he had scheduled that war. It was the only time I wasn't with him and I. Blame Myself Because I know that. If only I had gone along, buddy never would have gotten into that airplane at some heavy shit. Dude, no matter what age you are, or how much time and maturity gives you perspective, that's the part when I learned about it Marcus about the whole story, when I really dug into it after I saw the buddy, holly story movie really made me angry and it's kind of ironic that now in our country were feeling. Some of these same ridiculous tensions are all same thing. We all bleed red. We all love rock and roll and one of the. The things I, think, buddy holly loved was that everybody seemed. Dig Is Music. Everybody wanted to dance together. They WANNA. Hang out together and that was something I think that he achieved in the short time that he had, and he was in a lot of ways, a bridge between the are in charge of the black charts whatever they were called at that time, and the white rock and roll charts, because he without social media without video without you know all of the easy ways to promote people just loved his records, and just loved his music, and back in those days when radio cats loved the music they played. You mentioned his aunt. Who she went to live with, because her mother died when she was twenty two years old, so ria went to live with her aunt, who gave buddy the permission, and that was in New York City, and that's how she ended up their work and appear, and that's how they met it. Just those things in rock and roll that bring people together. There's parts of the story that only happen because other things happened. Put those people on the. The same train platform, or in the same music, publishers office, and from Lubbock Texas in San Juan Puerto, Rico, they connected there I got a feeling. She still has that strong strong feeling in her heart, even though it's all these years later I. Think says she's eighty seven that right? That's a long time to hold onto that and I hope she's found a way to be able to come to peace at some point, so that she. Find some joy and warmth in her heart which I hope she's been able to do since then because living with stuff like that is heavy, and it gets heavier, the longer you hold onto it, so I hope she was able to release it. One of the things we're learning as we get older right OUTTA. Let things go that. Don't matter. You're right well, you know buddy holly. He did start out in Lubbock Texas little all town there in west, Texas his statue in a monument to their in town, because they're still proud of what he did in rock and roll. And that's where we were doing. The birthday twins episode. That's where bobby keys intersected with buddy. Holly was there and his grandparents. Outta his connections within the stories. We're telling here on the podcast again. At that time period you see a lot more of the intermingling of the musicians Phil. Everley was at buddy holly's funeral, he had crossed paths with them I think buddy. Holly had opened up for the Everley brothers. I mean. He was tight with Elvis. Elvis claims that buddy. Holly was one of his influences. Influences as far as songwriting in music goes after opening Elvis in the fifties, buddy holly influences in. That's just crazy well. He was doing a thing there in. LUBBOCK REVIEWS POW BOB so his buddy. And Bob was actually the group name. They actually did open for Elvis and that's what made him realize that he wanted to do this as as a Gig as a career. And they opened eldest three times that year, and they saw his musical style. The Buddy Bob it started the slide towards rock and roll, which eventually would transmogrify in the crickets, but before that. They'd open up for Bill Haley and his comments. And I think the combination of those two elements Elvis and Bill Haley. Kind of seeped all into what they were doing, and really rock and roll became the primary focus, and along the way hooked up with Eddie Crandall get a contract with Decca Decca is where he met Owen, Bradley and Owen Bradley helped him to get to Norman Petty I. Think in petty at the idea of the different labels and the different artists names and that way always making and releasing records, which is really I think what buddy he was really into if you can. Gather anything from the studio process. He loved being in there. You helped to innovate on double tracking and all kinds of stuff that was done in the studio. He didn't say I can't do that, he said. Can we get it done? And that's why he was an innovator, and that's why he's one of your five favorite I two albums absolutely, and if you think about it, the way decade did it by releasing artists under different names or groups and. And Solo artists in the late fifties seems to have been an influence on the motown model as well and you know that Berry Gordy learned from watching how the other people were because he read the charts. He remember the numbers, and he paid attention to all the little things like the labels and things like that study did and basically took his own statistics class by reading the charts and learning from it and then use the successful deca model. For people like Buddy Holly to move motown forward in that scene. It's so crazy how things happen here and you're right about that. With the way, the motown kind of started out with an idea of doing that. Same Multi label thing and it worked out pretty well for them. That's for damn short. But I'm also sitting here. Thinking about the hold deca. Bradley, who is known for producing already? Buddy wasn't happy with how things were going in the studio. So that's how we ended up seeking out in petty at his studio down in New Mexico for a demo session of you tunes, including that'll be the day that version. The Demo version of that'll be the day became a number one hit. Can you imagine the electric? In the magic in the room over the top electric I mean seriously over the top electric. If finished the cake and Y'all look at each other I think there's hairs up on the back of people's necks and all that comes. I've always wanted to ask a musician of that type of level of songwriting. How often they've felt that when recording songs saying hey, I know the people are GonNa. Really like this. We love this, but I really know the people are GonNa like this. Because I've also read stories where people get. We were GONNA leave that song off the album because we thought. Thought it was you know bollocks and then boom. It was number one hit bollocks out Iran a lot of those so those stories, but there's just as many where they wrote it new the second they did that. They had something that they've never done that. Was something different and special? So in a songs come from deliver in all different kinds of wage. It's fascinating. How some of these songs hit you differently in how in the making? They hit the musicians differently in the artists as well as they made it. You Know You keep mentioning Norman What's his name Norman Patty? But some of the other riders of Buddy Holly Songs Besides Buddy, holly or Roy orbison. To Fatten look so. I. got. You had Sunny West. Again wrote a song or two for buddy holly as well. You know what I found out Ahmet. ertegun wrote a song for everybody back in those days he got everybody to record at least one of his songs. Charles. Let's what Rachel also and you know, Marcus I only know this because I recently re watched the movie. Mess around, and that's all yeah. Mess. Around is the one that I'm again wrote. Wow! Obama. Ray was struggling. I think with right in the next thing or find the next thing. And he brought it in, and they sang at the studio. There's a great scene in the movie. If you haven't watched the movie rain awhile, check it out growing up West. Texas Buddy and the guys. They had a lot of influence There's that scene where they do. The Country Sam with the STANDUP BASS and then they start rocking it and spin in the standard of right. They, but they were influenced by Hank. Williams and Jimmie Rodgers Hank Snow Bob Wills and the carters. They were all big influences on anybody who was doing music. They listened to the Grand Ole opry. They listening to Louisiana Hayride, in the Big Jayme read. Do you think they listen to the blue stations back then to as well and some of the black stations or the R. N. B. Stations I don't know how they were labeled I. Think that the crickets were all listening to the opry and the Louisiana Hayride in the big D Jamboree in the same way that the Z.. Z. Top guys were all listening to the station, so they had commonality in that in their early playing. Playing but win, the rock and roll came in. They just took all that and put it aside and created something new, which turned heads, because they weren't doing the same rock and roll formula that everybody else wants. They were creating new stuff. That's true, but they had to have a soul influence of some sort they'd creeped in along the way because there's no way that they could have creeped into the black charge of the R and B charts of the soul charts without that I looked, and I didn't really find it, but I suppose you could go and find the sonic connections that create that and through this whole discussion marcus in our research for this episode on Buddy. It's been clear to me now why I have record setting no word like one after the other in their release time back in the fifties on Brunswick and coral, different bands in same songs in different needs because of all the stuff that we discussed about the labeled strategy that petty had developed so now something that really has been a question, my mind, a small one, but a question in my mind for a long time as answer here on the podcast, and hopefully some other lights went on a repeal. Era, beaten we both learned a lot during the research of this project as far as buddy, holly goes, and the people around in because even the survivors as we move forward had an influence on rock and roll, and the direction of music in some ways, Waylon Jennings, a huge player in country music, Sonny Curtis, and the crickets moved forward without buddy, holly and then road. I fought the law, which was made famous by somebody else I can't remember. who was the band that covered that did it that made it more famous than I can't remember the bobby fuller fully, yes. Fuller for made it famous, and then, of course you had the class do it, and then of course Green Day, and a few other bands after that have done it since as well so, but yet sonny, Curtis and the crickets routed bobby fuller four made it. Famous class really made it famous and Green Day. Yep, it all fell out of the crickets and the Buddy Holly influence and I wonder if that was a song that they had been working on, that guy was always writing music. He was one of those guys who was just always writing songs walking down the street. He hears the noise and he's like Oh my God. That's a riff, and then he's gotta run home and probably play the risk. You know that's where he was as he. He drew to the end of his life, not thinking that it was around the corner, he was sick. The status quo and he's always trying to break frene evolve part of the tragedy that we kind of touched on earlier is the fact that we don't know? What would it come out and sixty sixty one sixty two? What would have been the influence on the British invasion if holly was still there and release in rock and roll? Would there have even been a British invasion had a buddy holly been alive and continued, which is actually an interesting question of fiction? Could your filled the gap of Elvis going in the service and kept rock and roll from the US? Charts and repelled alignment I. Don't know we'll never know. We can't talk about it here. On the podcast to me about it, also the year of the inaugural class of the rock and Roll Hall of fame. You said was nineteen eighty-six correct. He would have been and fifty years older so think he was more than thirty, six, thirty, seven, thirty six, so he would have been about fifty years old at that point. Can you imagine fifty years of Buddy Holly or third of Buddy Holly at that point holy want I'm thinking about the of had the same thoughts about Jimmy and your Morrison. Janice Dean. You have all of them. Richie. I mean Ritchie Valens. I wonder what he would have done that kid was a great songwriter to we had electric energy man, that kid had energy and required viewing. If you WANNA, know more about him is the movie La Bamba Lou diamond. Phillips does a great job as Ritchie and it's a tragic telling of the end, but it also tells about this vive for life. All of those guys. He broke down barriers to yeah, he did he absolutely did. MAYBE WE'LL WATCH LA. Bamba together and get Real Bangash officle into an episode. I'd be download that that'd be a lot of fun. brought. This is a great time for music, and this is a great time to talk about for music, because it explains a lot to how we got to where we are, and where we are is at the end of our love fest, professing it all for the Great Buddy Holly. We'll get together soon. Don't worry. You can always find any episode. You've missed or anything like that. On website, imbalance, history, dot, com, or on the Pantheon podcast collective you know where they are and wherever you get your podcast, apple and spotify and. CAST boxing leases everybody, so let's call it an episode for good old buddy. Holly I'm recoup I'm Markus darkest. Let's get together soon and share another episode of the Imbalance History of rock and roll.

Mr Buddy Holly Holly Buddy Holly Ritchie Valens Rubin Marcus elvis Waylon Jennings Hardin holly Texas Lubbock Ritchie Valens Gary Busey Brunswick Charles twitter Richie Vallon Seventeen Markus darkest Norman Norman Patty Roll Ryan
WANTED: Massachusetts Murderer

Crime Junkie

53:18 min | 10 months ago

WANTED: Massachusetts Murderer

"In February six on USA. Till I find out what happened to my sister. Rosario Dawson Stars in Briar Patch. What does she have to be afraid of? If if you're smart you'll be afraid of everything. It's hard to find a killer when a crook tell me who killed my sister so help me God. I will burn the city to the ground. Briar patch a twisted tale parts February sixth on USA network the hit podcast up vanish is coming to TV on oxygen the True Network for crime. Join host pain Lindsey. Each week as he takes on new new mysterious cases of missing women across America in his quest for justice pain isn't afraid to confront suspects as he brings viewers with him the frontlines of his investigations. This team will stop at nothing to find the truth and to finally unraveled. These mysterious disappearances don't miss the special two hour season premiere up and vanished Saturday February fifteenth at seven six central only on oxygen the true network for crime. High Crime Junkies I'm your host Ashley Flowers and I'm Brett and today I have a story for you picked by some are fan club members now. We recently changed up our fan club. Tears cheers and part of the benefit at the highest level. Now is that those members get to help pick monthly content the cases that are most important to them and this month. They voted that they wanted to hear about the unsolved murder of Molly Bish so I started researching the case and I quickly learned. That Molly's case ace is in a standalone one. There is a possible connection to another murder around the same area that has locals wondering if there is a murderer murderer in Massachusetts In August of Nineteen ninety-three was a warm day in Sturbridge Massachusetts. A man named Richard Korean and his three young kids didn't live in Sturbridge full time. They actually lived in a town nearby but the family owned a little late cottage there and they would visit in the summers. An an August fifth was their second day of a week long vacation. According to Richard it was going to be a wonderful week filled with swimming boating fishing and all the the quiet moments in between that make up a lazy summer. Now in one of those quieter moments. Two of Richard's kids getting antsy like sitting around all day doing nothing. Nothing is an adult dream like I am currently like air quotes on vacation right now. I literally spent most of the time researching writing and now recording this episode. I would kill for a lazy CD of nothingness but we all know to kids. That is the worst thing ever. It's gotta be go. Go go right so two of Richard's kids holly who was ten and exactly who was five asked their dad if they can go down the street to a neighbor's house now. This neighbor's dog just had a litter puppies and they want to go look at them. Can I go to you the right thing. So Richard says sure. Go look at the puppies then come right back at eleven forty five in the afternoon Richard watched. Holly Zachary scamper hamper down South shore drive but just a short while leader around noon. Zachary returned home but he returned alone. And this wasn't right to Richard. They left together. They should be back together now. There's some contradictory reports that I found unwise Acharya returned alone. According to an article recall from the Hartford current that ran just days after Hollywood missing. It said that Zachary had gotten scared by another neighbor's dog and so he ran home but Boston. twenty-five news in a more recent article like literally within the last couple of years said that when Richard Asak were her sister was he just tells his dad that Holly told him to go home. Okay but both with those things could be right like maybe he was scared and she was just like well been leave. Like I'm a big sister. Your sister I know how it was when I was a kid if my younger saloons were knowing me I'd just be like fine. Whatever I'm just going to go on without you? Oh totally an either way. Richard's like this doesn't make sense. Go back and get your sister. So so he sends Zachary off this time with their older brother. Andrew to go get her and bring her home but they returned home once more soon after to tell dad that they don't know were holly is now right away. Richard leaves the house in Walks. The same path is to kids would have walked to the neighbors. There's no holly where he finds the puppies. There's no holly on the street or anywhere within eyeshot but what he does find is concerning somewhere on south shore drive. holies dad finds a single bright red sneaker. One of Holly's tennis shoes now. He knows something bad has happened and the he tries to keep looking for on his own at first like calling her name running up and down the road. He quickly realizes that this is so beyond his wheelhouse he needs professional help. He needs police so by twelve fifty just an hour after he watched his daughter. Walk down the street. Richard is on the phone with police. In what had to have been a surreal moment. He is reporting his daughter missing. Doing Oh for sure that Saxton see anything else like I guess. We don't know how long they were Together when he left her how long we been separated. But you would think that. Maybe he'd seen something right. So the short answer is I don't know all in all the reporting that I found on Holly's case Zachary is hardly mentioned and I have to believe that was because he was just by at the time like even if he did see as something he might not have known what he saw or been able to really articulate it or not found importance in something or even you know what he saw could have been very traumatizing raising but he definitely told his family that she had told him to go home right like I would think that if he could relate that that there could be something else possibly possibly but in the same reporting from Boston Twenty five they speculate that maybe she told him to go home you know just because he was being bother like a kind of we talked about earlier. Maybe he's hungry he may be. He's annoyed by that or the dog. Whatever reason like stopping a baby go home or perhaps he was there when holly was actually being taken and and she was telling him to get away and go home so he could get away attacked him right so the fact that these news outlets are throwing out to wildly different scenarios like that makes me think that all Zachary could get out was like what she said like go home and everything kind of surrounding that in like what was happening? He really isn't able to convey so after after Richard Calls to report his daughter. Missing swarms of people come out to help search for the little girl including Holly's mother who drives up to the cottage as soon as she finds out. That daughter is missing again. That shoe was assigned to everyone that holly hadn't wander off on her own even a young ten year old kid isn't going to take off with one shoe and I mean just walk off. Something bad happened here. They search up and down the street door to door in wooded areas but day turns turns tonight with no sign of Holly and despite the additional resources that descend upon the area and we're talking dogs helicopters divers. That nightmare would would continue day after day until at one point the family realizes what was supposed to be their family getaway had come to an end and what started out as a week with such excitement and promise had quickly turned into one of the worst weeks of their lives and they would be heading home without their Hawley. Searches continued and you'd for a while but eventually were called off. It was as if holly had vanished into thin air and in that time the surrounding community came together to try and support the family in another small Massachusetts town. There was a pastor. Who's actually telling his congregation about Holly's disappearance and he asked everyone they are to you know? Send Your prayers send letters of support to the family and because of this call to Action Hall. These parents actually received a very sweet note from a young girl. Holly's own age and I'm going to have you read this my name is Molly Bish. I am ten years old someday. I would like to come see you. I'm very sorry I wish I could make up to you. Holly is a very pretty girl. She's almost as tall as me. I wish I knew holly. I hope they found her. She is still in my heart. If you give me your address and I'll write bore to you love molly that no included a picture and she said you know. This is my family I'm the one of my mom's lap. I'm older now and letters like this encouraging supportive letters continue to come in but all the support in the world world couldn't bring them resolution peace and for months hollies family just had to wonder where she was. was she safe or she hungry. Why I hadn't? They walked with her that day. What they said No? You can't go look at the puppies all of this playing in their heads over and over and over until mm-hmm October twenty third when they finally got the answers as to where holly was now episode was brought to you in part by Brooklyn. y'All it is full on winter here in Northern Indiana and that means subzero zero temperatures biting winds and every reason in the world to never leave my comfy bed. If I don't have to especially because I have my super soft super cozy the Brooklyn and sheets even without this brutal winter on average you'll spend entire third of your life sheets so why not make sure. They're the best sheets out at their Brooklyn was the first direct to consumer betting company which means they work directly with manufacturers and you the customer with zero middlemen involved which means you get the best bedding at the best price with the absolute best service out there. I Have Alexa team set in windowpane and they are the best sheets I've ever slept on. 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Some news articles reported that her body had been found at least one. The Standard Speaker newspaper actually specified that hunters discovered. Skeletal remains. Now this might not seem like a big deal to some but to me. It really is like skeletal. Remains would suggest that she had been out there almost the entire two and a half months since she went missing. Yeah we're as a body. It indicates that perhaps she wasn't put there until sometime after she went missing and the search will be called off. Well where exactly do they find. Inter was at a place that they had already searched will according to that same article. That said they found skeletal remains. It says that they found her in an area that had not been previously searched which is a little bit baffling to me because even though it was like a neighboring town the actual location of where she was found was only like five miles issue rush from where she went missing so listen I've never been a search coordinator. I have never even been able to participate in a search like this. I'm speaking from a place of total ignorance here but I don't get how this happens. We had the dog. We had the helicopters people on foot and just five miles away in a wooded hunting area. I mean she. was there the whole time nine. Could it have been like jurisdictional like they couldn't go there. Yeah I mean that's totally an option again. I know each agency is different and rules vary from state to state. So I don't know oh for sure. All we know is that she was found very close to where she was last. Seen alive going to look at those puppies did they release are announced the cause of death so oh again maybe so much like the way she was found. I'm a little unsure of her cause of death as well because in all of the newspaper archives. I reviewed for this episode. I only he found one single article in the Hartford Current. That said the her cause of death was strangulation but it was never re reported ever again by any one so I don't know if they knew something everyone else didn't or if that little piece Scott missed as the case got reported I mean I even kind of wonder if maybe somehow the paper heard a detail like her highway bone was broken and maybe someone official like offhandedly made a comment like Oh. It was likely strangulation. Right because with skeletal skeletal remains. That would be the only way you could determine strangulation right and listen everything before. And after this Article Very Hush Hush about what was found the condition of her remain Maine. So it's hard to say for sure without some kind of cooperation now in the early days of the investigation. Police weren't releasing a lot of information but many people were working under the assumption that this was some kind of crime of opportunity like again. Holly didn't live in the area. No one knew she plan to go see those puppies. It only made sense that some awful man drove by saw holly in her brother and decided to act but this was a horrifying thought. Because how do you catch someone like like that like. They're almost a ghost. Of course investigators did all of the normal things they went door to door. They talk to the neighbors. They looked into people's backgrounds looking for any kind of perpetrators of any crime but again and again they came up empty-handed and again and again they wondered if their guy was someone. I'm just passing through the worst possible coincidence and they wondered this for weeks then months and even years by the year two thousand. That's really the reality. So many people had come to believe it was someone just passing through. It was a one in a million chance. And he's probably gone now and I think that idea left some people with a sense of peace. At least he's not here anymore. But in June of two thousand Massachusetts residents would come to realize realize that this man could very well still be among them. June twenty-seventh two thousand thousands of a hot Tuesday in Warren Massachusetts. Where Molly bish lipped? It was early in her summer. Break and Molly. Following the footsteps of her older brother. John had gotten a summer job as a lifeguard at the local pond. Now on that day that letter she wrote to the parents of a young missing girl almost seven years before was probably the furthest thing from her mind. Molly Molly knew that holly had never been found but really nothing else like that had happened since either her town of words still seemed like a safe place. Molly Molly had no way of knowing that on that morning she would begin down a road that could once again intersect with hollies and that day started off well off instead of waking up by alarm molly was awoken by her mom. Who told her that one of her friends had actually gotten in a car accident and was in the hospital? Now Molly was shook by this news news and her mom offered to take her to the hospital and she's like listen. We can call you into work like I know this crazy but molly had just started this new lifeguarding geic and she knew that people were counting owning on her to be there so she insisted like no mom. I need to go to work so like she'd been doing all the mornings before this summer. Molly's mom got in the passenger seat of the car and let molly drive them. Both I to the police station to pick up the two-way radio. Mali would have with her on shift and then to the pond now. Her mom didn't like work there with her but molly only had her permit so her mom had to drive with her to drop her off in pick her up each day that she worked. Sources differ on the exact time but molly and her mom make it into the pond sometime between nine forty five and ten. AM and molly screws off to set per station and get ready for swimmers. That she knows will be arriving any minute. Sure enough the swimmers arrive. There's a little swim class or lessons that are held regularly. They are not like just open swim so it is very like scheduled and when they show one of the MOMS notices that. There's just no lifeguard. which is weird like? This isn't a job. Teenagers would normally flake out on and not one that molly would flake out on. But many of the people who showed up didn't know molly intimately like yeah. It's a small town. Maybe they knew her name but today she had just started working exactly and to Bam a teen kid flaked on their job. Maybe like it does happen. Was the first aid kit by her. Chair is open and her sandals are right there so they're thinking you know she's probably going to be back any minute now but after minutes pass and then hours concerned or maybe even frustrated parents. Inform Molly's boss that the lifeguard who is supposed to be on duty never showed now Mali's boss is a guy named Ed and Ed sees the same scene that they did molly's chair set up first first aid kits open sandals right there but no molly and it's super clear to him that she had definitely been there at some point not just because of her sandals because because of the two way radio that was there to that molly had to pick up and drop off like every day at the police station before and after her shift so the fact that she wasn't back was really bizarre bazaar so ed uses to radio to call into the police station and let them know that molly is Mia. Now the problem ways that even though Ed thought this was is off. I don't think anyone fully got the gravity of the situation because police don't like call her family right that second. They don't start a search right away in fact when an F. leaves the pond to go run some errands he actually runs into. Molly's older brother John at the local store and he doesn't even think to mention to John and that Molly's missing or molly's like not at her job and listen. I think all of the crime donkey ears just perked up a little bit. I can feel it but that just kind of shows you how unimportant Morton. They all thought this was not that her being missing was unimportant to add or to the police but just no one was even considering the worst possible scenario like this. It doesn't happen here or at least like all of us are immediately at a nine one one level of emergency at this point. But if it doesn't happen in your town if you aren't aware of of it being a commonplace like why would you rush it exactly and I mean again. Seven years have passed since Holly's case and everyone had seemingly forgotten that stuff like this happens in small town NASA -Chusetts so the original call from Ed on the two way radio to police was around eleven forty five by one o'clock when they're still no sign of Molly. Police finally call her house to see her parents have heard from her. When this call comes into Molly's mother I can't even begin to imagine the sinking feeling feeling? She must have gotten in her stomach like would you mean she isn't there. I dropped her off this morning myself. Like just three hours ago and why am I just finding out about this right now. She's been missing all morning. Yeah that that timing is just driving me crazy especially as a mom like I wanNA know. Immediately something's wrong with my kid. Let alone with their missing all right but this is where they are now. An all. Molly's mom can think about is finding her daughter. Molly would never skip out on work willing these like something had to be going on now. All the while police are still trying to ease her worries. This is probably nothing. Teenagers do this all the time but no she said not her molly. She was sure sure of it so she calls molly sister and asked her to help look for molly they start calling friends. They're stopping by houses of people. Molly knew including her boyfriend. Steve but call after call drop in after dropping. No one they were talking to had seen or heard from molly that day as the day slips on with no sign of molly the police become less convinced that molly just walked off the local police call in state investigators and that very night a search is underway in the area that she went missing. I'm from now the first place they search is the pond thinking that maybe molly drown okay. But she was a lifeguard. She had to have been really a really strong swimmer. No I know. And that's what her parents said to like. She was a great swimmer. She wouldn't be in the pond but investigators have to start with the most logical explanations. I looking at the scene I mean again. Her sandals were there. Most people don't walk off without their shoes but maybe if she went into the water and just didn't make it out like maybe that was an explanation for it and it was so harboring. I was watching an episode of disappeared on Mali's case called murky waters and her brother was telling the producers about how when he heard this like that maybe she had drowned he actually went into the water himself and was just like trying to find her searching on his own up up and down going under the water knowing that he'd be looking for her body and eventually the professional dive teams had to physically like pull him out and tell him to stop so they could search but when they do search like so many people suspected. They didn't find any sign of Mali that first day. Now that didn't mean she wasn't in they are there was talk of actually like lowering the water levels to the pine trying to maybe drain it in some kind of aid to research but anything that they were going to do would have to wait until the next morning because at this point it's completely dark and they couldn't resume any kind of search until it was light outside when the Sun Rose on the twenty eighth. The bish family found themselves still in the same waking nightmares the day before. Molly's mom couldn't shake the feeling that something bad had happened. Not An accident. Something worse I and she knew this in her gut because of an interaction that she had with a man the very day before molly went missing at the exact same spot that molly was last seen. Today's episode was made possible Hosoi by Ernest. A little financial relief can go a long way and student loan refinancing with Ernest can help you find a monthly payment. That fits your budget to breathe easier right right now. 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Molly's mom tells investigators. There was someone at the pond the other day. And you have to find him he probably did something to molly. And investigators are like who who was at the pond and she says well. I don't know exactly but she goes on to tell them this story. She says that the day before molly went missing. So this is the twenty six she and molly were doing their usual. Molly was driving MOMS in the passenger seat. They pull up to the pond and and molly grabs her things says vita mom and gets out of the car and starts walking to her post but mom notices that. There is another car next to her a white sedan. The Dan and in the white sedan there is just this man sitting there and he's watching molly instantly Lee. Molly's mom got that feeling in her stomach. The one that we've all gotten at one time or another one that tells you that something is wrong. Something Neal's Bat. She catches the man's I and he just starts staring at her almost like mean mugging her and she knows that this isn't right. She knows she can't just drive off in leave. Her daughter are there. Everything in her body is telling her that she can't leave her alone with this man so she stalls she gets out of the car for she goes to talk to molly and and she just want to make a big deal of it or scare molly so she kind of just like Putz around and eventually brings it up. Like oh I didn't know that there are just like solo guys appear appear while you're working like I didn't realize so many men around the pond I kind of just pictured kids or families and Molly's like oh my gosh. She's the invincible teenager like. Oh my gosh mom the fishermen please don't be so traumatic like they're here all the time. This is super normal. They were here when Jonah's lifeguard dickerson. I'm lifeguard. They'll be here long after I leave and I'm sure for a moment it crossed. Molly's MOM's mind like you're right. I'm being crazy. So she heads back to her car but when she reaches it she sees the man against still just sitting there smoking looking at her daughter and she knows all over again that this isn't right but she doesn't know what to do she doesn't want to just like walk. Walk up to him. That would seem so weird. And what if he was a fisherman what would she say like. She couldn't kick him off public properties. She just kind of sits in her car and fiddles awesome things trying to come up with a plan but just then the man started his car and pulled away. Molly's mom breathes a sigh of relief. And when she did she let go of all of those feelings that she explained she was just being paranoid so she started up her car and left and likely didn't think about any of this for the rest of the day she picked up. Molly everything was fine. Molly was right. It was just a fisherman. Nothing to worry about but now with her daughter missing thing she felt that same sinking feeling in her gut. What she called Paranoia? Two days ago she now knew was her natural instincts. Oh I cannot imagine imagine just being a mom and free playing that moment over and over and over again in your mind thinking what else what could I have done. You know which I'm sure she. He did like you know she just did what she thought was right in the moment and no one can fault her for that like what happened to molly is not her fault but I think there is an important message in this story story and one that I think we've hammered into people for the last couple of hairs. Trust your instincts you feel fear for a reason. Learn how to listen to that so in this moment her mom knows that police need to find this man but the problem is she didn't know who he was. She didn't think to take down a license plate. I mean all she knows about the car was that it was a white sedan. She didn't know the make or the model but she did get a good look at this guy's face when he was staring her down and she's able to work with a sketch etch artist to generate like a picture of this mustache man that she saw a white sedan now. The sketches done and leader is redone by different artists but Britain. I'm GonNa send you both of the sketches that were done and the first on the left and then there's the updated one on the right okay and then we'll also post this on our website for everyone. We went to see as well. I mean it does look like two different guys but there's so many similarities. They both look around the same age. Like maybe in their fifties they have similar similar hairlines. Mustaches kind of facial structure and they're just black and white sketches so I can't really tell skin tone but the one guy on the right it kind of looks like he might be Hispanic and the guy on the left looks pretty decidedly white. But you know it yet. It's hard to tell a lot because they're both black and white sketches. But I think like what I I can tell us. This guy definitely has dark hair you can tell that there is like some light his hair like some grays. Maybe so definitely is like that age range that you're talking about a very distinct linked mustache and even though it's hard to tell like in the newer sketch he almost looks Hispanic but in everything that I've read it was definitely a white male and you can't see in the picture but molly's mom said that he had dark is now as the sketch is being created and distributed. Hundreds of people are still searching searching for molly and trying to figure out who may have taken her to do this. They're talking to everyone in her life talking to people. Her parents work with looking up. Local like sex offender registries and according to the Boston Globe apparently early on in the investigation. There were six or seven people identified fight as suspects very early on who. Well they never actually say all the police and the DA would announce publicly. It was that they had these six or seven people and they wouldn't say who they were or how they found their way onto polices radar but of those six to seven people plus us all of the normal people. Investigators have to look at in the early days in the investigation. They like give out a bunch of lie detector tests right and left and they announced that of all of those eleven people failed so in the very early days with a handful of good suspects and people failing lie detectors. It seemed seemed like they were close to answers. Close to finding molly I mean. Clearly they looked into everybody that would be likely like family members and stuff like that. I assume they looked into her boyfriend. Steve obviously doesn't fit like the sketch profile. But we know a lot of times you know an intimate partner can be the person commits crimes like this. Yeah Yeah and they did. Look into steve so he was seventeen. Though I mean doesn't fit the sketch at all. But he did look kind of fishy to police right away because according into the murky waters episode the Day Molly went missing. He actually had a cut on his lip and a missing eyebrow ring now. This alone obviously isn't damning but what was was that he was telling different people different stories about why his lip was cut but even though he looked a little bit fishy he passed a polygraph. Like end the entire bish family stands behind him though. They weren't extremely close with him since his relationship with molly was fairly new. They were still convinced like there was no way that he could do. You did something so horrible to Mali. And then like turnaround mere hours later after she went missing and the be with them and act normal. I mean we've seen crazier things go true but it appears that even investigators ruled him out as a suspect. Because there's very little mention of him when you research molly's case so I can't tell you why hi. They ruled him out but it seems that eventually they did and I mean if we fast forward a few years her boyfriend actually ends up passing away in a car accident so now as much as they distribute the composite sketch in the news as high as the reward for information got as much as they interview people give them polygraphs or failed and as much as people keep searching investigators get no closer tamale or even two answers about what happened to her but they do come up with a theory about how how. She was. Taken away from that pond so the pond was surrounded by woods and I guess there was this little path that led to a cemetery and because of whatever police found there may be tire tracks like they never officially say but whatever the reason something leads them to believe that whoever took molly parked there you're at the cemetery and then walked to the pond and took her away with them. Okay Ashley I have to note. Do you think it's the sedan guy like for me. It makes sense like if Molly's mom had those instincts and they were right and he was there the day before do something but realized that he become too late. There's going to be too much. Traffic people are going to see him so he comes back the next stay with a completely different plan. That's actually exactly what I was thinking and like I even can speculate a little bit further and I kind of wonder if the rules he used to get her was pretending that he was hurt. I mean her first aid box Fox was open right and I have no clue how normal that is like you know for Malaya for anyone but I feel like you would keep that close to keep sand and stuff out of it but like maybe. He pretended that he needed help. Like get her to let her guard down and then as she goes to like open it maybe he like incapacitated her or maybe even drew a weapon and got her to walk away with him willingly or under duress so again. It seems like this picture is coming together. What happened that morning? But you know it's like we're so close yet still so far because even though we have a win and a pretty small window of time actually because I mean it was literally just minutes between Molly being dropped off and swimmers arriving. We have a where we know. She was taken from the pond. Unlikely transported to the cemetery where car was waiting. But we still don't have the WHO or the why and those seem completely elusive as months fade in two years. The prevailing theory became that this was was a crime of opportunity. And this is when connections. Start being drawn to holly's case Molly Holly. They're both blonde hair. Blue is both the same age. They were taken at different times in their life and this fear begins to swell in the community as people wondered and if they lulled themselves into a false sense of security was this man really living among them this whole time or did he come back just to prey on their young girls and the main question looming in everyone's mind was would molly eventually found the same way holly ways. It had been been almost three years now since molly had gone missing. But this idea of connection to holly's case breathe new life into the investigation because they knew holly holly had been found in a wooded area known mostly to hunters so then they questioned hunters in Mali's case and one of them had some shocking information. That would finally warm up this cold case. 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Article is offering Our listeners fifty dollars off their first purchase of one hundred dollars or more to claim visit article dot com slash crime junkie and the discount will be automatically applied at checkout. That's article dot com slash crime junkie to get fifty dollars off your first purchase of one hundred dollars or more according to an article from the Berkshire Eagle One hunter tells investigators that while he was out in the town of Palmer which is a neighboring town of war and were molly lived. He spotted some weird cloth on the ground. It was blue cloth breath that looked like it could have been from bathing suit now when police go and check this out. It seems almost like it can't be real. It was old. It was degraded in and dirty but it looked like the same color and same material that molly was wearing on the day. She went missing right away. The suit is sent off for DNA retesting and a more intensive search is conducted in that area weeks later a public announcement is made. Molly has finally been found. Law Enforcement Confirms that DNA testing on the suit confirmed that it was molly and in addition to that they also were able to uncover bones and teeth that were linked to molly Ali as well okay. But she was found in a neighboring town like she still wasn't that far away from where everyone was looking right. Here's the thing I couldn't find ain't any source material. That would say exactly where the searches were conducted. So I don't know if anyone looked in Palmer specifically in the woods that was called Whiskey hills where she was found but I did find an article from the Boston Globe. That said police believed she was buried in a shallow grave near where the items were found years later. So so it's possible that even if that area was searched on foot I mean someone could have walked right over her without knowing that she was there and it took all these years of rain and weather to uncover her grave. Does law enforcement of a release anything else like cause of death or anything more than what we got in Holly's case not really like her remains were found so much later than holidays that they couldn't determine a cause of death based on just the skeletal remains means alone. But all that means is like to me that okay. We can rule out blunt force trauma. There's no damage to the skull. But everything else. We really needs some kind of soft tissue to determine and they never say anything about the highway. GOIN- inadequately talked about in Holly's case but strangulation has never been mentioned in Mali's so as wonderful as it is to have one answer to know where molly was now. The realization came quickly to everyone that having her remains didn't an actually get them any close to her killer. Oh what about the area where she was found. Thought tell them anything not much more than they already knew. Everyone says says the area would have likely only been known to locals and more specifically to local like hunters and fishermen but let me clarify just a little bit. They didn't say publicly if the sight of her remains or anything found at the scene told them anything. But it's possible that they learned something because the DA in the county. Did I'd say shortly. After her remains were found that their list of six or seven people that they had early on in the case at some point had gotten narrowed down to two to three. I I don't know if that's because of her remains where they were found the condition that they were found in or festively did like earlier on and he's now just making this announcement because there's been a break in the case and I really believe it's possible that they had persons of interest or suspects narrowed down even further because the following year in two thousand thousand four a grand jury was called to probe into the case they plan to call all eleven people who fail polygraphs and basically like compel them to testify defy. So did anything come from that. Well that's kind of unknown like grand jury. Testimonies are always secrets. I did find signed two thousand five newspaper Article From the Boston Globe. That gave a little bit of information on the proceedings. They said there was like two hundred fifty witnesses that were called like seventy pieces as of like our exhibits that were entered into evidence and all that the DA would say was that they uncovered new leads because of this grand jury so it wasn't enough. Take a trial but it did point them in a new or different direction right as promising as that seemed like then nothing happened until two thousand nine when investigators got their first break in the case in a long time the year before. A A man named Rodney Stenger was arrested in Florida now. He was arrested for the murder of his girlfriend. And it might not seem like a connection at first like Rodney is half a country away. His girlfriend was much older than molly. Or even holly but after his arrest the sister of the girlfriend who was murdered came forward our word and said that shortly before her death she had been telling her that Rodney was involved in the murder of Molly bish that Molly Bish case in Massachusetts. She said that Rodney had been living there at the time. So when investigators went to check this lead out they found that she was right. Rodney had gotten a firearms. Your arms permit renewed just two months before Molly's disappearance in town not too far away from where she went missing and I found a picture of this firearms license on Telegram Dot Com website. Do you notice anything interesting. Wait what this looks. Exactly like the guy from the sketches. Yeah I am going to send you right now. A side by side of the two. Oh my gosh. It's that is Eerie Ashley. I mean even like the bags under their eyes and like their showers like this is almost creepy for sure. But here's I think beyond the resemblance and the fact that he might have been talking about the Bish case what we end up learning about this guy is baffling. The same woman who alerted ordered police to Rodney's possible involvement also went to his trailer a longtime after his arrest like her sister's old belongings and according to mass live. When and she was there she found a bunch of young girls hairclips hair ties and even a young girls necklace like stuff that she said was definitely out of place stuff that she said definitely would not belong to her sister and she said there was also a safety deposit posit box key and all of that was handed over to police and we still don't know the outcome if those things forever tested if the key to the lock box like actually found anything and we have no idea if they were able to actually definitively link any of those items found in his trailer to molly or to Holly I mean obviously this is not a good look for this guy but outside of living in Massachusetts does he have any connection to molly other than like this woman's story that her sister told her about her and then what about holly like? I guess everyone believes that they're linked but can can this guy actually be linked to her anyway. Well here's where it gets really interesting so not only does Rodney. Look a heck of of a lot like the guy in the white car. His brother Randy actually owned a white sedan that he would have had access to so then when when they start looking at his brother. Randy Bay find when you know it in nineteen ninety three at the time. A Holly's disappearance Randy was actually elite. Living in Broomfield were holly's body was found and not just like the town according to Boston twenty-five News He. It was actually living in a tent in the woods. What's your her body was found yet? My in the early days of hollies investigation. They actually actually spoke to Randy stanger about her and he was on polices radar. Okay so was it like both brothers we still. I don't know maybe both of them were involved. Maybe one of them is covering the other. Maybe they're both sick and twisted and acted out like in the same same way at very different times girls who were very similar or maybe just maybe they had nothing to do with it because has good good as they look for it as suspicious everything surrounding these two men look in two thousand twelve things. Were about to get much more complicated for investigators instigators by the time two thousand twelve rolls around investigators had been looking hard at Rodney stanger for the murders of both molly and hallway. According to mass live he had even been officially named a person of interest and police also had his brother in their perforate trying to figure out how oh he fit into the equation but then they got thrown a huge curve ball items from the crime scene were holly was found or sent off for testing. Staying in a DNA match was found something at the crime scene matched a man but not Rodney and not randy the DNA matched a man named David Peculiar. Who exactly now? I have a hard time even explaining this part of the story. Because there's so little information that has been released but ABC News reported that there were some items collected back in nineteen ninety-three close to wear her body was found and one of those items was linked to this David Guy so I don't know if it was something he owned. I don't know if it was like like a biological sample. I have literally no idea but let me read you a direct quote that. ABC News got from an official quote. The nature and character of the the items tested as well as its condition and location upon discovery suggests that Mr Pouliot and or persons associated with him were any immediate crime scene area at the time. Relevant Holly's disappearance and the location of her remains and quote. Okay okay but I don't even know what that means. I don't even know what to think about this. And here's the thing after this announcement officials named David as is a person of interest but not an actual suspect. Okay Hey and like in the statement also reference. Maybe someone else maybe other people will. And what is it that they found right. They say Mr and or persons associated with him were in the media. So do they believe you've it's more than one person. I mean without knowing what it was I I almost feel like we can rule out that it was a biological sample taken from the body again. We don't don't know the condition that the body was found in but specifically said something nearby and I mean it makes me think of like a cigarette butt or something but oh I didn't think of that but that's smick totally. Just speculating. Because it seems like something that would be found in the woods and I wonder if they found like additional cigarette butts that didn't have like his. DNA had someone else's because wiles. Would you think someone else's there right. which would mean there'd be at least another person there but I guess I'm coming back to is like what David have to say about this like after all this like they did talk to him and there was something right? Well here's the thing they. They can't by the time this testing was able to be done. David was already dead. He he died back in two thousand three from congestive heart failure. And it's interesting because the International Business Times did a write up on him and he didn't Have quite the background. That you'd expect no violent or sexual crimes like no convictions. Not Many run-ins with the law outside of like this one incident involving him by Ryan using cocaine so he likely would have never popped up on anyone's radar when they were looking through like the sex offender registry or violent offenders in in the area right so despite the DNA from David Pouliot and the weird links between the stangl brothers and both victims and even other persons persons of interest popping up on the radar throughout the years nothing has ever panned out in October. Two thousand eighteen with no movement in the case. Ace the Bush family decided to hire a private investigator named Sarah Stein to help them find out what happened to Molly and Sarah did something interesting that I had never seen done to date. According to Western mass news she held in event where she basically set up shop and said anyone who thinks that they might know anything can come talk to me like big tips small tip even if you don't think it's important. Listen I'm going to be posted up here for this entire day. Come talk to me and come talk to her. They did four separate people came for with almost the same story. A story about a man who was staying at a campground not far from where molly went missing and the day that she went missing this guy was totally mia but then he showed back up on the twenty eighth the day after with his face. Ace All bloodied and scratched quote yelling about something bad happening in the woods the night before and quote so then about six six months later after this incident the campground these same people heard this guy talking about how he was some kind of person of interest in the case but had never actually been interviewed by police. Okay but that doesn't even really make any sense. Like how could he be a person of interest if police never even talk to him. Well I don't know but it obviously seemed credible enough enough that the P.. I ended up turning over this information to law enforcement and they've been pretty closed lipped about any kind of details around this league when we don't even know who this guy is that that these four people came forward to talk about but all we know is at the end of two thousand nineteen the state police in Massachusetts announced the creation of a new unit in it that would be dedicated to working on unsolved crimes. And both molly and Holly's case are going to be looked into and I think they're going be looked at in a whole new way because now decades later less and less people believe that this was a crime of opportunity and more people than ever are convinced winced that there was a Predator in the area. Though holly didn't live at the Lake House she visited it regularly like maybe someone saw her. Maybe they became familiar with her schedule and her habits. And maybe that same person did the same thing for molly but the question still remains who who is the Massachusetts murderer. Molly's parents went on to create the Molly bish foundation to help other families who are faced with the same kind of tragedy and you can find a number of resources on their website which you can either find by googling the Molly bish foundation or by going to our website we will link out to it and if you have any information on either the case of Molly Bish or holly premium you can contact the Massachusetts State police to see the pictures. We referenced in this case or to check out our source material. You can find that on our website crying Junkie podcast Dot Com and be sure to follow us on Instagram at cried. Jonky podcast and we will be back next week with a brand new episode Crime Junkie is an audio chuck production. So what do you think chuck do you approve.

Molly Molly Molly Holly Molly Bish Holly Massachusetts Mali Holly Zachary Richard crime of opportunity murder molly Ali USA Rosario Dawson Hartford Ashley Flowers holly holly Rodney America
Holly Cara Price Remembered

Set Lusting Bruce: The Springsteen Podcast

49:51 min | 2 weeks ago

Holly Cara Price Remembered

"The and seen as oh. I remember and Oh seen see you again day. Hello everyone and welcome to a new episode of set. Listen bruce your podcast. All about bruce springsteen his music and mostly as fans and today we're especially about the fans Joining me tonight is my good friend. frequent guest Dan french how you doing dan great. Thanks jesse thanks again for having me on. Oh i always love visiting with you and I believe we plan you have stories to share about a very special member of the springsteen and Fan of family. But before that. I want to ask you know in. We're all kinda struggling through the pandemic. How're things there with you and yours. Well thank you yes. I'm doing as well as can be expected. I think is safe to say. I'm lucky inasmuch as i only have myself to look after i it was good timing to me. I finished work unintentionally last year. So again without realizing that was that was actually quite fortunate. Timing for me though. I haven't got to worry about that. Side of things effectively nearly retired. But some yeah my life is very very simple for a guy that used to love Traveling whenever i could. It's not much of that. But i'm on keeping healthy. So that's the main thing i feel feel lucky. We'll that is great news. I appreciate it and so A so for those. Who don't know why don't you share a little. I'm sure muslim. Yeah there we go. So i i'm sure most people know you but just in case For those you this might be their first episode Tesla batch yourself. Okay will. I live in north of london and in england. And i've been a springsteen fans since really kind of like the mid mid to late seventies The turning point for me was the darkness era although over here we didn't get to see him until the river. Tor nineteen and eighty one. So that was a big a big time for me. And i started doing a fanzine because i didn't know any other fans i thought this would be a way to try and and get to meet people so Bruce fanzine cool point blank. Which is is now mocking Forty years though. I haven't actually published things for many years. Patten i'm still counting the so Forty years on. And i feel very lucky because mr the friends i have now i've met and thanks to bruce like itself yet one of the things that i find a big blessing about doing the podcast is the amount of people i have met You know you wanna say around the country but the reality is around the world that I feel a connection in a friendship to either because we interact through social media. Or we've we've been on the podcast. We shared stories and so I think that's really beautiful in. I do think it's one of the reasons how or why bruce's his music and his phantom is I won't say unique but it is one of the few where you have that passion of fan base. that's right it's a really special community as as for other other artists that have strong loyal support show about ten For me loss to the forty s. Or so it's been it's been all about the bruce community and Feel very lucky to be part of that. I have to before we get to our main topic any quick thoughts. You wanna show on letter to you. I love it in a in a just a few woods. It some think it's refreshing. It's i'm so grateful that they decided to put it out rather than leave it and waits for a time when Things might might be more back to normal. But because i think we know we will needed this really as as fans and it sits been. Yeah just the thing. The perfect time is how i feel. You know i feel the same way. and my You know. Linda is a casual fan and she watched the apple documentary with me and talked about how much she enjoyed the documentary and how much he enjoyed the songs. And then just this past weekend. We trove to Louisiana to visit my mother. And it's about a six hour drive so Along with other things we we've listened to letter to you there A couple of times and she talked about how much she liked the album in. And how some of the songs she thought were especially really beautiful So yeah. I think it's y- joked that Ado springsteen album in october a new president november a new doctor who episode in december and maiden twenty twenty is thought the worst year ever. But so we've got two out of the three so far so here we go So last week. I guess it started breaking over the internet that A pretty special fan Passed away so do you want to share a little bit about holly story. Sure yes we'll this is This is my old friend holly price. Who was probably Almost certainly the first american. Bruce fan that i make contact with and that was forty years ago because She'd heard about the fanzine. I was doing at the time. I just started it so it was thirty days. Just fest issue and that contains A one thousand nine hundred concert review by her somebody had posted a two and i quickly realized from her message that she was a fellow. Die hard fan. She'd started seeing bruce in lane. Seventy eight and at that point so late nineteen eighty A already been to Something like twenty shows on on on the repertoire. Miss most of the first leg of the tour Just driving around with friends and which was just to the blew my mind. I didn't know anybody like that at that time. And she immediately offered to give any help she could do to To the fanzine which was what was wonderful. And that's really kind of like a trend that i can feel his just gone through Friendships continued all the time. She was always trying to help other people Even when she got a really sick later in life in missed the last ten years. Sadly so i'm talking about community. It's really very much. Also thanks to her. That i i met so many other in the us Fans who are now. My friends have been for decades so she introduced me to all kinds of people. There was Through her ob dziedzic was the the famous. Virtually the fan from way back what heard about it. I'd i'd never met. She passed on a copy of my fans into her apparently she. She likes that too. She introduced me to join eddie on the shore some years ago and said this is dan from england said joan immediately. Kristen me england as in england and john ford coley for those. Who've who remember you get it that's it And she told me to meet bush baleka. Who is the co founder of the bottom line. New york goes on and on so we didn't actually meet in person until nineteen eighty two Well i took my of grown up trip to To the the us went with a friend and we spent three weeks in new york new jersey and holly of course was Had been living in the area have been. She's originally from the philadelphia area couple of me. She proved the she was not the ideal guide to exploring the jersey shore especially which for us a spritz was it was a pilgrimage long before there was any kind of organized trips or anything like that and the real highlight of. Those three weeks was thanks to her. We were able to catch An unexpected guest appearance by bruce with cats on a smooth surface playing at the stone pony and this was on through the about tober that and it was the finale of a whole bunch of shows. He was doing what we they called it. The club hopping that year especially throughout the summer and Hoeing himself was. She was convinced that bruce was on the west coast. He wasn't even around and she was sorry for. She said own so sad. You guys bruce in half but we said well you know it's it's it's the weekend it's the penny this is the band. Bruce has been playing with. Let's just enjoy ourselves and Any bruce just showed up and played for an hour. Kosslick two bucks to get in so incredible value and that was that was like a sort of sense that we realize that she had to cut a magic touch and she's spent many many weekends just rolling down from the city to to the shore and the hope of seeing bruce. That was another time she started. Lucky i'm sure she shared the story. How did she become a fan. I think she was She kind of like missed chances a little bit early on. I mean for example. I believe she was with friend Actually doing a little work. Around the time that bruce's playing the tower theater in philadelphia in nineteen seventy five round news. Time couple of famous shows there But i think she skipped chance to check out the show itself said that was kind of like something she probably kicked cell minute for a while but it was some. I think he was swayed to go by a friend. In the summer of seventy eight that see one of the shows and she's written about it and there's a link can which is Do much more justice to to have a talent to me Which is a real moment of conversion in a And so she never look back from from thence say by the time i got up with the of about twenty shows the in and i think it's just a lovely tribute that you know here. Is this you know across the ocean. You know she hears about the fanzine and just you know in whatever. I can do to help whatever i can do to tell. Spread the the magic of bruce's music right. Like i want as many people in what i love about this. Dan is there is a select group of when a artist is just starting out that they are selfish. Why don't want the world to know about them because then vint then it's no longer special whether it's you know it's it's an artist or ban right like i want them. You know. I want them to be you know kind of this on the secret. I have that i you know versus you. Know she was like no. I want everyone in the world to know about this guy and the music he's giving. That's very true. I mean i'm sure there was probably a part of her. That obviously really save those as moments when it was you know sort of small and intimate and And special and on that level but the the sending never stopped her on the number of people. I must have said sort of santa to meet her. And said if you go into new york new jersey you must must meet up with holly and she was going back through some correspondence we had and it was all about. Oh yes i know. Don't forget to introduce your such and such a friend today and it. What both ways. She sent friends over to To europe and they would they would visit me and so it was a a constant two way thing like you say she just embrace anybody that she recognized with him. What was was a real fan. And it's strange. Because on the one hand i think of error is really quite charismatic. Pleasant but at the same time she was also really shy but occasionally about bruce himself because she she put herself in as often as she could in the situation with. You get as close as possible to bruce. Never that close severino for example Ideal The situation will be to be about twenty hours. Away from bruce where you could see him but just have just enough distance that it was some There was a gap And so she made great efforts to see them so often but never get that quite that close but she had a friend with a went to most of the same shows who was much less reserved and got went to even more shares. I believe and she was In a position where bruce get to know her really well they could just this other friend and bruce would of just chat like normal people about sta just regular everyday stuff. Not star struck a toll one day. His curiosity prompted him to ask. Who's your friend who never comes up to talk on the other friend. The friend said oh. Well it's holly and then that can come just continue. So the next time he sees bruce. This is appropriate Club show in the eighties on the show. He's spot what had her he came right to her gives her pinch on the on in a friendly way and says hey holly how you doing and i get us you can and can you imagine. I got stunned. The counter this encounter by post. Sit back in the days when he was just writing to each other like a week later. An holly rotating lineup of forget. He said he knows my name. Challenged woman led to change their life in it. that was the beginning of the rest of her life I just love the idea of right. That she you know she didn't want to be forward. She didn't want to be And to share that story right that he can noticed her. Which i think is amazing and then the i did actually say hey. Why didn't she ever and then go talk. i can only imagine. Did she end when she would be where she could see him which she always which should be more prone to speak up or she remained kind of reserved. I think a little bit of the reserve always remained there. I mean the stories. I'm telling you you'll you'll hear that. She got the opportunity to be much closer to bruce. In many ways those those lovely photo them together taken much later in life in during the rising tour Jumping was when when she was actually working for the thrill hill and so the together on the private plane. Banda flying around. In and bruce put a A blanket round her shoulders and just to the looking like kim just a couple of friends but she's also at the same time you can see that absolute fan look at the same time so even though she'd already been working for the for the For the band for sometimes she never lost that that the fan quality Never got blase or traded you know and but it's interesting because Relationship with the stephen michelle. Come to very very different. He seemed to be he tweeted and he seemed to be honestly very saddened and marine to you know on twitter and So i guess talk to me a little bit. Maybe the transition of becoming a fan to actually in a small way becoming part of that world. Yes will that Sort of the in in such a natural way because much let me. She started her own fans in the in the mid eighty s. I believe it was for I think at the time. One of the first trans for political stephen So her her focus switched them. Chew i think donald trump win that would have started but she i think she got very Engrossed in the fact that you know. When steve went went solo is he was coming out this new career for himself. That really got her attention. So it's no wonder that yeah. She called fans voice of america after the interest. Which you may you may possibly have heard of Think it ran for about a dozen issues mostly in the late. Eighties early nineties again. Just having grown fanzine line but the great thing about it was that which obviously property wouldn't have happened. If a bruce fencing was the in the person doing that because steve's world was just starting up in the sense that he was just the forging his career and he was very accessible seven the process she made contact with with c. Maybe i don't know exactly how it happened. He must have seen copy and They sort of Got introduced to each other and so forth eventually at some point by by about the late ninety s They've been obviously very very familiar with each other and because of the what she was doing he us understand it to to design his website Which must have been an amazing offer at the time so this is a point at which she starts working for very street directly and that in turn led to an even more amazing invitation which was to go on the road As assistant to stephen went when bruce announced that the the reunion tower stuffing and that was a role she held for many years and it was must have been very hard work. Because as many people know steve is not the kinda guy to sit around. He he he's a real welcome hollick so very difficult to work for and in many ways very challenging but it made basically meant meant that she been very quickly became a firm part of the wider street family She worked at different times. This festiva and then later on suzy Both on and off tourists And one of the lovely moments that most people might remember without. Maybe they didn't realize is on the When boosted the live in york city album and dvd. And he's doing tenth avenue freeze out and he just pauses like you said it does a double take looking at the front row and equals. Anthony says miss holly and that that's how holy catcher supposed to overtake will need to check that out. So i have to just insert just for a moment In bear with me it feels like i'm going to go away but i will stick the landing safely. There was a win star. Trek was gonna win. Star trek was gonna come back and they were going to do. The motion picture and star trek had been off the air for years and gene roddenberry had finally gotten the okay to a major movie and because of how much star trek fandom had meant something He and a lot of the other creative people wanted to include fans in. There is a scene in the motion picture. Where you're at the hangar deck and there it is supposed to be the full crew of the enterprise and that is made up of fans of apple wonderful and so when they reached out to a couple. People saying This is what we want to do. And the thought would be It'd be five hundred dollars and the fan goes well. That's kinda high. But yeah. I think i could get enough people to pay that to be in there. And he's like no no no no. We can only pay you five hundred dollars to be extra. So so i can imagine. Just throw a figure Two fifty a week. And i could see holly going in my topic. Yes i could come up with two fifty a week to be on the plane and we're no no no holly i. We're going to pay you to do this. So yes i would have loved to be with at the moment that she got like the job offer. You know wanted to get a reaction. The must've been a letter or something at the time but say we would thrilled for everyone. By that point. We she had so many friends. Mutual friends of mine that we would just absolutely deducted for the kind of like one of ours was was kind of finally on board with abandoned and it couldn't have been more perfect and what's really nice of course it's not just that dedication but she gets a credit on the alive in new at city album and in the dvd in the credits because she was officially steve's assistant at the time so the motorise in on those yeah. I have shared The story multiple times but We're in the movie theater watching western starzen. My wife lynn reaches over and says you're just so jealous of all those people in the audience aren't you and i'm like yes. I'm so jealous. And at the end of the film you see they get their listed in the credits and not only were they there. They got in the in the credits. Linda so yes. I can't imagine poor miss. Holly was just like oh. I can't believe this is listed. Yeah that's a lovely shot which Having emily was filming the time and catch which has shot behind the band at the moment when he's doing that at dedication because it's not just she has When you watch it. You'll see. Bruce basically gets the front line of the ben to walk over in front of so. There's like bergesen since steve and patty and they'll do like a a sort of special hip thrust for and you see had just absolutely cracking up in the front row like she can't believe it was quite enough of the have been. They just can pay her attributes like that as well. It's definitely worth game about to say that again. But if i can continue to to give you another another memory which is that. This didn't just happen in the states. In early two thousand. I think it was Between the legs of the the same to other reunion to holly committed With steve to the london business trip stay was doing all kinds of things have already at that point and this was on a break and as i was saying as she was so busy just just there was just her basically honed. Steve and that was it So being run off her feet she got in touch with me and mike good friend. Mike herron london and said please please please could. Could we both go come over for day and help with some errands. Because she didn't have time to do everything himself so the two of us had a really fantastic day. It was for us. It was just the noble team and she was just running around like headless chicken We went shopping for on behalf of stevie and we had to buy things like umbrellas. Was it cause of the english weather. phone batteries back in the day. When was the to the technology The the phones they had they brought from the state's working properly in england and we had to get a particular brand of shampoo which was a special gift from maureen. And we'll have to buy the dave clark five like a greatest hits cd which is alleged to think is probably now part of the underground garage music collection. Which i just starting up around. That time i would. I would count on that as well that would be. I believe too that yes so it was lovely that she without all the stages doing it for our benefit i mean it was obviously. It was her benefit but in the process she can share a little bit of that experience. So mike and i got to say hey. We went shopping for stevie which is fun. melt something you get to do everyday so that was a friend memory. And then then the sadly the last time she was able to commit what she she came over to europe met many times with the ban. But the last time which i'm very well When she was saying that she was able to really express their generosity that was on the on. The wrecking ball to us. July two thousand thirteen the very end of the european tour At this point she was moved on working from st. She was working for susie capacity but probably not quite so exhausting. Suzy was a bit more laid back. joined the ben's crew for the final out of at european legged concerts in places like leads and island which he loved because he gave her a chance to actually have a like a little vacation as well then most days During the sort of week oh we can half whatever it was. She would text me message. Me and always asking for contact deals. The contact details with any friends of mine needed help who are struggling to get tickets. So everyday she'd be saying to me who can help today. I thought that was a great motto to to live. If you're in the position to help absolately. I mean she. She's helped me many times for myself. Going back to nineteen eighty eight there was a story that was a brief story for just back in time. The very end of the tunnel Tore in america. The spring of eighty eight. It was so the end of may I just coincidentally come into some money which was just enough for an nfl to new york from london. So i thought well. I should just get in new york in any tickets but hey bruce's playing at madison square garden What to talk about being wild innocence. I really had great. And i thought what it'll be an adventure Just a wing in a so. The bonilla tonight Of the five nights. I joined the drop line hoping against type long drop line. All the hundreds of people trying to get tickets but then eight o'clock came no result and for the first time after many shows. I resigned myself to actually missing the show which was kind of weird feeling. But then i was. I felt grateful. Because i would have been more frustrating if i could have actually heard the concert. Starting from outside the arena. You know i thought well at least Made friends with them. Some other folks in the line and we thought it's just a drink and have dinner and make the best of it. But then i found out later Holly told me she'd been inside that night but she can out again with a spare ticket for me and we missed each other because of course in those days no mobile phones were wait making making contacts in. Just you just have to make plans As if that wasn't extraordinary enough of had there was one more. Show the final night the next night. And so i thought well truck again. What if i got to lose grit my teeth and go for it and again. It was getting up to eight o'clock. And i felt my luck's went out again. This is the final night. it's just the demand is just ridiculous and then i can only say quote. This is my first ticket angel experience. Holly came rushing up to mate and she pressed into hand and she said run after a couple of seconds of disbelief in shock iran. And remember i made it to my seat and they rena just as the lights. Were getting down. Show was starting The absolute perfect timing talk about. I know it's late but we can make it a free run. What i find lovely about that is And for those who've not Dan has been on multiple times and the very first time he was on he. He shares the story of how he almost miss met. Clarence of that has a happy ending similar to this one but You know talking. You've just admit so You seem to have a history of that. My friend yes. I missed a couple of things but i have to say that overall i think luck has is at the medicine so i really can't complain and then The last time i saw holly in person was was back in in new york. This was in can remember the date eighteen th of january two thousand eighteen Which was appropriate. Because it was like. That's town and. Of course i was there to see to see bruce doing one of the springsteen on broadway appearances so together with a big group of fellow fans mold over the world in this kind of summarized holidays network. If you like that there was an international group. We had attend this place jones pizzeria which she chose for us she arranged it will and then we actually went separate ways pre show because she mothers point she had already seen the performance a few times because with a connections she'd been able to help out other other fans and friends and this was kind of my last memory of how that she was still working in helping others tickets Even though by this point she was really ill with cancer and So yet we just went our separate ways. And then i went to see bruce and so that was an extraordinary day do How long has she been fighting cancer but point it was a think about seven years. Eight years longtime yeah she. She really was a warrior We often talk about was being in a really feisty. In one of the most of the strong willed and energetic the energetic people at matt she had a little a little kind of symbol for this which is she called valkyrie. None which is the statistical humor. It's like a little a little Toy looks looks. Looks like a none but who's also addressed up to fight like a valkyrie whether thing came from but this was see that if you look at her facebook page and it became the sort of Yeah this this is a whole of fights in in those last years just to represent her determination really For those who may not know what type of cancer What she fighting a. It was a breast cancer and it was. I believe it was a faithful. Not sure of the technology but it was pretty bad and it obviously it progressed to other other other parts Which is brings us onto the this year actually just earlier this month when Local friends of has in in in new york despite just hope she was in touch. Morris is normal right up to mid to late. October then suddenly eh getting messages from others. society november the is declining. Really rapidly I think it it had spread to her brain Really wasn't sure if she would live to learn the result of the election and she'd been so much democrats are forever so she was obviously hoping for the biden harris went and then extraordinarily on your on the seventh of nevada Within a few hours appearing about democrat win we got the news just a very short time later that she slipped away That day she it was almost certainly as if she she had come on to find out the news and we know that she was able to hear the celebrations outside in the street in manhattan and the final pitcher which is so comforting is that Banish stepped away peacefully. And the last thing she was listening to that day was led us to you album which was given a lot of comfort in those final days. yeah and i remember reading that in twitter about that story and i and i thought how beautiful and how touching that So many so many lives were touched by her and You know i'm. I'm often reminded dan that My wife is very kind to me and and she always says that. I handled cancer like a boss like it was and i often say that you know i feel like i had cancer like you know three years ago like yes. There were surgery. Yes there was chemotherapy and everything but it just when i hear about what so many other people had gone through. I'm like you know. I don't i don't you know i often do. Air quotes back. When i had cancer you know right in you know i reminded by friends and family like no no no there is no air quotes. You had cancer and we are grateful that you fought it and it is. I know this is a cliche damp. It is such a horrible horrible disease that takes so many people. And i'm sure with all the cova things going onto. It must have been a very scary time for her to try to you. Know be as safe as she can. Be working on things I'm glad she was able to have friends and loved ones around her. Yes we're we're we're so grateful that he had very special friends looking up to her and she was in the hospital a couple of weeks or something like that and It was some but you have such a long battle saying it's like that Almost ten years. I think in all and never an easy time for us she had. She was on haram looking after Mother who was quite frail for long time. And i didn't think she had had any any family left such so absorbed absorbent friends supporting and Yeah because she was kind of like self employed all the worries that come without about about money and insurance and healthcare So note extremely challenging and but she was so as she was stripped says strong willed that we actually came to believe that my goodness if anybody can survive this polycom because she just seemed like a a real force of nature and just an amazing example. I would definitely say one of the most inspiring people but of an on. Do you know First off any other stories that you wanna share Well as just one final little summary which always sort of something that. We found amusing Say she was always a an anglophile very keen on the everything to do with british culture especially from the sixties. She was a huge beatles. Fan i think she probably would have rated. The the beatles says have bill time time favorite band until she discovered bruce but said she was passionate about about that And one of the things. It really amused as she was very often. Amused at the time. the differences in culture. And she would put on a fake british accent when we talked. And that's that sort of thing so you should've had one of our favorites was Came from when she had. I travelled on the london underground and they have the mind the gap When the trains come in so This since she and i always been separated by the with the atlantic We had a gap so this became outstanding phrase. Me would finish that as finish van. Kohl's of just wave. Goodbye mind the gap and so I was a safe most of the The time since well twenty is especially. She's more she's been this issue with my first angel and now For me she's a different kind of angel And i'm thinking okay. We're still minding the gap that's set is there is there some sort of Have we is there a fund Where you can donate money in her. Honor is was there any particular charity for Fighting cancer or bruce funds. Which is you know our lovely for donna. If we immature again right would be very much in the spirit of holly definitely. I mean that would that will show that would be so welcome The only information. I have from her. Closest friends in new york. Is that we Because there is a memorial service coming up the sun this weekend and they have mentioned that if in that respect if anybody wants to memorialize her life than donations to the humane society of new york would be extremely welcome because that is the that's an organization which is like a an animal rescue organization which was where she adopted Her cat thaddeus In recent very recent times so yes she was always animal lover and that's that's not much her own. Which would that sydney come from the closest to have. Yeah i i'm looking It appears the There is the. I will include a link humane society of new york dot org Society ny dot org And i will include a link. There is there you can do an online donation and i'm sure you can it in her name. That is definitely absolutely lovely Murray nice thought any final thoughts that you want to hear. I love the. She's vanishingly gap right. Yup we're always minding the gap always you know No i often think what we've talked about is really only very much the second half of the time that i knew the last twenty years or so but Getting she started off just having a just a normal working in finance a and But i mean her The turning point was I think essay which led to the doing the The website for stephen as that she began getting involved in media production and research. And that's what she did from most of her life later later life and just that list of workers extraordinary. I mean some. She was on all kinds of research and she was a social media consultant. More recently she wrote about books and music and photography and television health she's gotta profiling linked in which has a wonderful summary. If i can just briefly that which is that says holy. Kara price is a writer. Editor and consultant for social media audience development niche marketing public relations. Ach archival research and rights and clearances. In addition to talent relations and pre and post production clients have included dot nia sanguine the fresh twenty. One vida naturals suzy. Tyrel jake clemens. Ed manion little steven's underground garage. Wicked cool records indicate theater new york city. The rock and roll forever. Foundation than amanda palmer. Doesn't even mention. You know the the writing for stevie. She's saint modest about that. And as a writer i i would have to say. I think always think she had a brilliant on a really heartfelt style. One of my favorite bloggers. And there's another link which i can give you which has him thankfully has all kinds of her post from from way back at its medium dot com. So median dot com forward slash at holly. Kara and i'll send you the link as well Sue futile little essays and blog pieces. The one really wonderful. I would love that True that is that is absolutely beautiful. And i'll include linked to her lincoln page. You've simulink including link to that dan. this is i appreciate you. So much sharing You know she is someone who will definitely be missed and someone that i think. In a lot of ways. is a shining example of what is wonderful about Bruce phantom the bringing people together the connections the helping each other Not to make money off. You know shows with defines. I want everyone to get the show. I want everyone to have a chance to see the magic of rock and roll and I i know she will be missed. And i agree with you my friend. You have a new angel watching over you. That's so true you said that said well And upset to a few people in recent days. If any i mean apart from just being extraordinary human being if any deserve to be a legend legendary name any street found him than i think. Holly is definitely one of them. And i'm hoping that the least we can do in memory is to just let people know how special she was. Well i will. I'm going to do my best to send this out and to get this going and keep it going if someone wants to reach you. What how's the best way to do it. that's easy. I'm done french on facebook on twitter. I'm wild and in In the back in the days when you couldn't really have a long handle because wildlife. Wild and innocence. I as got than than ever since. Very nice Dan you are a treasure and I hope that one day we will get to sharon beverage together and share a hug. Hoops you are just. You are very special to me. And i appreciate all the love and support you've given to me and this podcast. So thank you my friend we will end with. I'll see you in my dreams. When all the summers have come to an end. I'll see you in my dreams will meet and live in love again. I'll see you in my dreams yet. Up around the river bend for death is not the end. And i'll see you in my dreams. I'll see you in my dreams. Fresh slow holly. We love you. But thanks jesse it.

bruce holly england springsteen steve Dan french dan great Bruce fanzine six hour Ado springsteen Forty years holly price Bruce fan new york dziedzic john ford coley tober Kosslick severino london
Deck the Hallmark - Christmas With Holly (Feat. Alonso Duralde / The Wrap & Linoleum Knife Podcast)

Deck The Hallmark

52:37 min | 5 months ago

Deck the Hallmark - Christmas With Holly (Feat. Alonso Duralde / The Wrap & Linoleum Knife Podcast)

"This is a bramble jam podcast. Hi. It's brand I love hallmark movies Christmas once. Hey I'm panda movies like. Those I like despise movies. Dan My name. Milan's. Noun Verb Christmas. Is. People think we don't have fun. People think we don't prepare either. They think we have no show prep. And Alonzo can attest minimal on for twenty minutes doing nothing but Nalen down all the bits getting together, making sure it sounds good exactly we need to. We are that precise correct, Alonzo like like clockwork. Yeah, you know it's it's. It's IT'S A. BUSBY Berkeley number here. All the choreography involved to get all the pieces in place in the exact right place. I love Busby Berkshire. Berkeley I said I am GonNa. Take what you said and remind people that Alonzo Day and have a podcast feminine. That's right where you're gonNA hear crap like that all the time. Bisbee and Buckley. Find out next week. Love how he literally just said Busby Berkeley and neither one of you could just replicate. Black beak and birds. But. One person, it's not to people. First Name. Berkeley work with like Judy Garland or something like that. Isn't that right? It's my close when it when it. When did he work with Judy? Garland, yeah, whenever you see those musical numbers like one hundred people making a kaleidoscope shape and the cameras shooting right that. That's busby Berkeley. Shamlan on this whole I, don't know I Alonzo on her. Because he gets Alonzo gets it I. Don't know I. Don't know on our podcast. Our noise writing a book there's so. He's writing book. Yeah, it'd be good and I want and I want on record busby. Berkeley nope. Not. Being Berkeley good trite for real. It's birds be and. That's burt bird. And berkinstocks. Dot Classic Cool Beaver. In Bob's yes. Got It guys. I think we did enough of that. Couple of things really quickly before we dive into Christmas with Holly for those of you that are listening to this podcast thinking. This is going to be a really. They're gonNA dive into my favorite homework Christmas movie. Lot of people have told us this is their faith. Yes, and we'll get to that and just a little bit but I i. hope that you enjoy what you hear and it's not just still buy some Shirley's popcorn, please. It's that good I. Just ate some. Dot Com, we ate some salted. or Dr Shock. And it's delicious. I. Don't usually like dark chocolate I, don't usually like Caramel, but all of it. The books together nailed it to be a delightful. Chocolate peppermint yes. Oh my goodness, the flavor of the month flavor of the month. What better way to watch Chris? Then with that GONNA. SURE THIS POPCORN DOT COM use Morongo deck July twenty and twenty. To get ten percent off, or you could join bramble, Jam plus on. You're going to get a bigger discount. You'RE GONNA. Get a bigger discounts. Get Free Popcorn. You're get a great discounts and you're also gonNA. Get all of our shows. Ad Free, and you're also going to get bonus content. We just dropped a bonus a deck. The homework I was ever called the Big Three. And you get to hear paying to talk about how he went to a masseuse the try. Everyone's taking covid seriously is going. Get massages that happened. During covert I want to go on the record I immediately wanted to be in a different room than you. I thought we were on the same page here. But the type of massage very gentle. Very gentle. Now, we shared a play. The chicken wings for lunch. Extra Salty. And we were around. All that say he'll be plus You can join for as low as five dollars as high as you want. Not really there's tears, but you can't been a plus dot com to find out all that good information. You can get a movie out free if you want. Yeah, you really can film. Film movie? I get choked up thinking about it every Wednesday. Everyone's that and we're. We're talking through Alana anounced this. We're talking through a little bonus content for Bramble Jim plus called a crisp, a film in a hallmark movie, yes where we hear a classic film and a hallmark movie we talk. Lonzo told me that idea and I said I'm there. For that that podcast you've been pushing for a bonus. Episode called a movie a movie. Yeah, we talk about two movies and I actually is actually just watching signs. And then re watching it and seeing if we see anything. Signs and then lady in the water. That's what we. I will say though I haven't watched late in the water I. Think since I watched the first time when I was. Like twelve. And so maybe I would like it more, but I did not like it when I was at bad bad. No. Signs Oh here me out when when the alien finally comes out of the trees, look man. Yeah, it's good stuff. Hey, here's one time of Christmas with. Professional film critics. Completely silent during this discussion. I'm in your house. That's awkward laugh. Signs sucks with. Things be in. This holiday beak was my favorite one beat, but. But But but It's time for Christmas and Hollywood originally. Twenty twentieth twelve. something. Like. The movie kicks off with Maggie all ready to go for her wedding. She's in her address. She's at the church. Everybody's there, but you know who's not there. The groom he does not show. That is one way for that to happen. Cut to mark mark is the uncle to a girl named Holly Holly's mom? Passed away three months ago. She has not spoken since and mark is the The Guardian now for holly the school that she is at says that she is going to have to Redo the first grade and mark decides. It's time to move back home and try to give her a fresh start, and that really gives his girlfriend a shock, but she says I want to try to make things work. Maggie is getting off a boat. She bumps into holly and Mark Maggie gives. Holly her stuffed bear back that holly dropped. They say hello. She goes so Maggie is walking on the street. She sees some guy hanging a sign outside of toy store. That is not the sign that she wants, and she makes that very clear. She walks inside the paints all the carpets, all wrong. Everything's all wrong, and so she fires the lady who had been at the store for the previous two owners, so this store is going to work. Maggie just bought this toy store there opening and less than a week. And so mark and Maggie show up at Mark's child I is it a child at home i? Don't know his brother's renovating a home they they seem like it's their child at home or something, but we don't actually know that so It's a house. It's very nice. And says Hey I'm staying here Marx Brothers. They're both of their brothers. There and they're like okay I. Guess you can stay, but I'm renovating. Just try to stay out of the way Mark convinces his brothers Hey. We're going. Do Thanksgiving together for Holly and it is a disaster. The oven goes up smokes the Turkey starts to fire on the lawn. Just, another day at the stairs. Nova seriously. It's bad news. And that begins to cast doubt on whether or not mark is capable of taking care of Holly. He takes holly for a walk and Holly Sees Maggie's toy store and holly gets really excited and that's a big step. She runs to the store. She's seeing all the things. She sees a a dollhouse basically, but for fairies on that. She's very in love with. She loves it and. Maggie's taking the time to talk to play with her. It's very sweet. mark takes her to a coffee shop after school, and he goes to take a call in Hawley goes missing. Where'd she go? Maggie's toy store plane with the ferried house. Later Maggie completely embarrasses herself when she river dance in the streets and trips and falls and if you think that's the last time you'll see your dance, your all then mark and the go-to fight they find this grocery lists that I'm holly roads. It's like the first time she's done any sort of like communication with words, albeit it's writing, but it's great. Mark goes to dinner with his absolately awful horrible girlfriends. And they decide it's time to break up after he wants to leave dinner. Because Holly has a fever and she can't seem to figure out why. You'd WANNA leave dinner monster. Market Hawley Goto toy store Maggie ass. A heard a name. The ferry and holly speaks. She names the ferry after her mom and Terry Suites. The the uncles then they're. They're very excited about this. They ask you the favorite uncle is it's a big thing. mark than ask Maggie out on a date. It's great, but she says something. That's Kinda dumb makes mark think that Maggie also really doesn't want to be in relationship because he has to watch over Holly but it's a misunderstanding as you have sometimes Holly asked Mark. If he can be your dad and it's very great. Everyone's crying, crying crying cry. Maggie finds mark and says hey. I'd love to get donuts with you, and that's how you know. She's a keeper. They talk about the things that they misunderstood. Over for Christmas with the fairyhouse, holly loves it. They end up kissing and now my friends was Christmas whiz. My goodness we did do it. We did it, but I'm very excited about this movie. For a lot of different reasons, I thought we could do four segments, but before we get to those four segments or a good break, and then we were bad. I, believe that performance matters for years I've wanted to switch to a natural deodorant and I've read these labels. And they said they'll keep me smelling good, and it'll be natural, and they never able to complete what they promise. They break their promises, time and time again. That was until I found native deodorant. WHO NOT ONLY PROMISES TO REMAIN TO HELP? You remain fresh all day, but they do so in an. An all natural way there's nothing better than native deodorant. Their trust me I've done the research and here's my favorite thing about this whole thing. Is this guy? Friends are native are going to give our listeners get twenty percents off your first order by going to native deodorant dot com slash deck or use Promo Code Beck at checkout twenty percent off your order, you will smell fresh. You will be all. It's the way to go for all natural good smelling deodorant native dot com slash deck today. Body so. Every time. No Tom. It's time. The show that we do segments. Hamburg leads here and we're GONNA. Talk about this movie four segments. The first is always the hot. And I always start. They called you in college painted the hot take taker. Yeah, because I just took all the hottest. Yes, right? That's exactly right and I. I would like to bring back that nicknames for this Yep so I'm gonNA. Kick it over to my good friend. Panda, the hot take taker. Oh, I got take for your brand, is there I hope you buckle up. I Adore this movie. Love this movie, our incoming Oh my gosh. Let me tell you what's great about this movie. It has the best. Set A be characters in a movie for any Hallmark Christmas movie I've seen today. Love, the plot love the pacing of this movie. Love the dialogue in this movie. I have seen this movie before. Loved it the first time I thought loved it maybe even more the second time. Yes now that I have a daughter on top of everything else. This movie captured so much great stuff. The the fear of you have when raising a child that am I doing a good job. The heartbreak of losing. Or of a child, losing apparent, and just who hasn't, maybe if you have a kid about that or even losing somebody, love and those kind of capacity. They do really good job with that. They just man. It's just a really fun storyline in charming town, my only complaint, if I have a complaint about this movie, and this is something that I it. It's not enough Christmas if that makes sense a-. And so that would be my only thing otherwise. This movie is great I love the brothers. The brothers are the thing that makes this movie, So Dang good in my opinion. Alonzo. So, it's kind of interesting this is we were talking about before the show started. This is the first Christmas movie that this show is covered. The didn't premiere on either. homer Chandler homework movies mysteries. This aired on ABC as a hallmark hall of fame production, and I think this is back when hallmark hall of fame was still like a brand that meant something specific about TV movies. Movies and a certain level of quality you know you can just by the fact that they don't feel the need to cover it with fake snow constantly you know this is an old school homer movie and is it better than a lot of the current hallmark movies? Absolutely? I think there's a lot more care that's been put it in. There are some moments that really land. On the other hand I think. What do we judge hallmark movies? It's usually because. They're all sort of a piece in terms of being the you know. Big City woman goes to small town. WHATEVER ROM COM like. We know the steps at this point. And then we judge those movies relative to each other, and then this one is actually trying to do something more ambitious, and and harder, and so I think then we have to kind of judge it as a real movie and I think it's good I don't love it. If you're going to try and give me a hallmark movie that has like real characters I'm supposed to care about and genuine tragedy. The people are working through. I am still coming off of two turtle doves last year. Which I think is the Paxson what they've done in this sort of thing at least in the Christmas arena and this is. Fine. It's good. There's things about it. I've got I've definitely got some fields I've also got some way. What's But it's it's fine. If you like it, I see why I get it. I'm just not totally on board. This was one of the first home agrees I remember seeing. Christmas movies I remember seeing it and immediately being like I really dig this, and it wasn't until like a year or two after that that I began to really dive into the movies begin to fall in love with the throw up of Christmas at Hallmark, has trademark which is not its own thing as panda, said not a ton of of Christmas, a day Dash. We spend more time on Thanksgiving than they do. At Christmas which is which is fine. The thing that I love about this movie is not the. Christmas is not how it makes me feel about Christmas. It's the relationship between mark and the little girl. It's fantastic. I when she started when she talks the when she says her first word when she says the name of her mother naming the ferry, it's a it's. It's great. few moments and homework are are better than that. You cried Multiple Times Multiple Times in this movie. It gets me every time Of course you know I love Christmas so I would like the when they did Christmas beautiful. It's beautiful at the end. I could do more more of that, but that's just me. Being picky loved this movie and that's all. I have to say about that Oh. Yes, the three men and a little lady sequel we've all been clamoring for. Christmas with Holly. There's a movie called the Patriots. It does not get a high recommend from Dan, if you ever wanted to know about the revolutionary war, as told by the crafty yet tackled director of Independence Day, you can check out. In the Patriot, but in the Patriot. Mel Gibson who plays a kind of an amalgamation of a lot of revolutionary war heroes that we're all racist. He has a daughter is youngest daughter. Does Not talk throughout the movie. She doesn't talk and towards the end of the movie he's going off to battle for the last time, and she like erupts audibly like. Just yet. Dad Dad runs down the beach foil, Gosh? It's a very very wrought seen. It is seen people talk about all the time in that movie when they talk about Oh man. Would you see the girl and I had a really like feeling in the pit of my stomach that this movie was building up to a moment like that like I had a feeling that this movie was going to be the last ten minutes. She's GonNa. Talk for. For the first time and I was just GonNa. Hate every fiber of this movies being, and it has a little bit more integrity than that. I was not a fan by and large. It has a few less wait. What's than I'm normally accustomed to riding? The the leads are the same leads from Veterans Christmas, which is one of the worst movies ever they're both. They're both miles better in this production. Even if Sean Farris looks like Shawn Hunter. Trying, to be Tom Cruise in Penilla sky. He either way. I think that the two leads. I said this to Burma. We were watching it. The girl who's Maggie in the movie I thought she was great. In this movie I thought she was terrible. A veterans Christmas. I don't know what happened but by and large it just Schmaltzy, and then not enough Christmas to work for me. the the the having the other plotlines and having something to hang. some meat on was nice, didn't like the brothers though either. I didn't the brothers. Brothers were super inconsistent, either they're like. Hey, kids learn to love him over not like I. Don't know a lot of the other characters. At least they took some time. This was not my favorite movie. It was better than magical Christmas ornaments. It was better than Mistletoe in. It's the best one we watch this July, but it really didn't do much for me. It was very schmaltzy and it was. It was not enough Christmas to justify it at all. Let's get to feel so if we will There's plenty of feels I think we've touched on a couple of them just in hot of what you've got. Okay so one of my favorite scenes in this entire thing is. When they finally, the girl comes on up in the bedroom. She's just spoken her uncle's donor and they were like so, who's your favorite uncle? And, that's played for laughs, but what's so great about that scene is these are three guys who would do something like that like you know the. You've just had a momentous breakthrough. A monumental breakthrough for this girl, and the very first thing they're like who's your favorite that to me made me laugh because I think you see the dialogue between the brothers? You see their personalities emerging that scene in a really fun way. Man? When she says! Will you be my dad at the end? Stop I. Mean just call it right there. Forget it I'm. Just really smokes right like. Oh? My God that movie just. I zero multiple. Times I just sat there. I had to take this movie actually a small stages. So time. Sticking. Up in her hair, your Bob Carlisle is so on my carlisle awesome is. Some our news. That's right. Yeah I, mean come on. When when she says I love you when she says you're not. You're not my favorite uncle I want be like come on. I mean come off. If I know there's a couple of people here at work right, but if you're not grind, there's something wrong when she says I love you. Got My heart for some of your kids said I love you. Forget about. Not You. You call me a monster. During this. I did call you a monster during this movie. You should not have watched this movie with. He was very upset, but I wasn't crying because cry. Even you. You were just. You're just like that, you you're. A statue okay I want to I want and I didn't like it. I like there's a lot of things we can talk about right now. In this day and age about status. You're my least favorite one. How. Alonzo, that's. A hot take. Yeah. Be, my dad is like you. UNARGUABLY effective like but it's effective in that way of a movie. Wear like step, mom or Marley and me where even if you're not really actually the movie or you resent how manipulative and they just land that moment you're like Oh. Dang it movie you got like. Even as much as I might have been rolling Ma some stuff. That's just like There's no walking away from that one but I think the real star here is olive the dog. On just you know like. It is the cheapest thing in the world for a movie to cut to a dog for like wacky reaction shots and they do do that. But generally I'll just has to be in a scene to elevated and like her. She's really the first one to reach Holly I. Think even before Maggie does and come on when they tried her out in the adorable Christmas sweater in the end like that. Those are feels come on I. Love The dog in the movie I really did because they're not trying to do a bit like in Veterans Christmas. It's the worst performance by dog we've ever seen like. The dog is not being affectionate at all I. Don't know if you remember US talking about. Looking for the trainer never looking at all I'm here deal with me like this is who I am I'm here. For me doesn't come to, you know that's right. That's right. That's right. Olive Gets Basset Hounds in general get it. The scenes were she's talking after she starts talking like those felt manipulated me in general, but I know comedown just calm. Even here, just stop just stop for ten minutes on this podcast, but on this earth. What's your purpose? If, you will listen. I really I loved the grocery lists on the refrigerator. That is a awesome. On the refrigerator all right, the is you can see her evolution of of starting to warm up and understand and know she still needs things and moving on and starting to communicate, and you get to see all three brothers be in all of this Cha age-appropriate writing like just think it's the best thing that ever seen and that scene moved me more than the rest of the movie. I have that. Listen my notes as one of my favorites, it's it's a great. And cry about. This movie oh my Gosh. And he's talking about birkenstocks and Bambi or Get Out of. Did you a slow pan? Everyone is dancing. let's take a break. We need one. We'll be right back and we'll talk about the way what's. Now I did shed a tear during those ads. Pretty emotionally. What are you? GonNa do. Treaty stay, yes, Hey, let's talk about the way it was partially talking about what is going to go away what? I'm concerned about the educational system as it consists within the world of. Christmas with Holly. One point, he's running a thesis at one point in Rang, dissertation. He's going for grant. Without getting into the minute, you here, those are all pretty different steps in the education system and I'm still confused. What's he doing well like that's not. That's not let me be clear. That's not what the homework. That's a wait. What because what he's doing is not scientific, is not you? Don't see him doing any actual research. He's just a dude out there lobster boy. US Her boy. LOBSTER like I. Think ooh! The water's the same temperature today yesterday. That is here's the give me I grant is that's the most inconsistent like these may have been the best carrying ever seen. That's one of the most inconsistent be characters every hallmark movie. It's terrible. He can't be doing all three of those things at once. Meanwhile if he is, you don't have time to lobster. Buddy you just. Just, don't and all of sudden your particular about how deep fried Turkey like I. Just don't understand who this guy. The fact that he can't figure out how to address a little girls fever. When apparently you have a doctorate in some form of biology, and you throw it a fever like you're working on your doctorate like that's some base level stuff that if you're a major in biology. Were a clam with a headache. He would have known. Only diagnose it for grant money. He's getting a grant from red lobster. We don't really realize it's a red lobster scholarships for the local technical college. That's what he's getting. They pay you Cheddar. At Red Lobster Stacey because the payment. From Red Lobster. Just backup. GENETIC DIRTY MONEY FOR SERMONS THOSE GETS. Down as buster beliefs. Development. That's what I got. I don't understand what's going on with the renovation of the house, and or the rhyme or reason of how he's choosing to renovate this house one day. He's there with a hammer hammer just like the side of a wall like this is going to take you forever at this point like I'm no renovation guy. Yeah, we. Did seem like Lonzo movie watch movie called scenes from a marriage where it's just a scene of two people in a marriage that's falling apart, and then it breaks this and other seen. It could be taking place in any other time or place. This is scenes from a renovation. Random like all right in this when hammer the wall and this one get your saw, but never worked on the same task for every single sale. It's just random scenes of renovating now the month. The the worst part of innovation is that at the heat shows that wall color. He shows it. Yeah of all the colors. Doing canvas. And? Criminal live with that the one bit in this movie. In my opinion, that does not work. Is the river dance bit. Yeah, it's not now I laughed very hard when she wipes out during the river dance mainly because we've all been there, right. Here I can't tell you how many times I've been doing. An Irish Jig and my feet full out from under me Oh. I struggled to walk sometimes I will say I've been in a position where I was trying to impress somebody and trail. Your walking is an Irish. It is one hundred percent river dance anytime. You make it from the car to this chair. Without doing something ridiculous, it's a win. It is and I. I, don't have a lot of them. Wins that is. Nevertheless a very I felt that. The real guessing very did not work for me I thought especially when they're in there with the concert and. I would have never happened hallmark. Was it was? It was cringing to to an extent, I wish it hadn't been. It was one of those syndrome like this. Showing up happened on and film. Shouldn't have have. Hi I'm paying this having them fill. Things Riveta. Alonzo. This isn't a way what exactly, but just to play in that when they first introduce the band, and there's this like close up. was like Whoa. This is not as like, now would never do this. And then I realized this movie is directed by Alan Arkin who famously directed rock and roll high school with the Ramones. He's he's a real filmmaker. Doing movies about musicians figure he's. And finally my moment. Let's see for my wait. What's okay? First of all? There is apparently one and only one photograph of Holly and her late mother. Just one like every every time they show. It's always the same one like there's several stuck in Oh. There's the one and that's all we're going to get for the whole movie and it's like well. Okay, that's that's a weird bit alright. Shop once. You can't ask them to do it again. In the movie? Guy Or some lady take three pictures go. Crazy, you know. Okay second of all a wide. Is this child not in therapy? No kidding. Just that is just the basic like you want to make a repeat, kindergarten or whatever it's like. is she seeing a therapist? Is she talking to a counselor? Is She like drawing pictures for a medical professional that explained anything it just. It seems so strange that they just think well we'll just we'll hang out. We'll love her enough. And it was so frustrating to watch a movie where they're only reaction to. She doesn't talk is well Gosh Darn it. We'll just keep loving her time I hate. To that like I, can maybe see mark being such a new dad like he just didn't think of the Scotus school to say no. We're just GONNA do another year first grade or else he can get out of here is just negligent. That's terrible especially when their. Businesses can give her an emotional reg emotional redshirt. I love that the and then it's because she couldn't draw the picture well enough. And the picture was in bad. No, it was for a first grader. Yeah. He did it. He drew. They showed a one from the class, a different one from the class. That wasn't hers. Okay, my bet. Yeah, okay! So hipster hair guy had done it for her. mean he does run a copy house. Come in, come on. And then the other one of course is the the bending of time and space in this movie early on Baxter. Girlfriend says that he is moving six hours away. Yeah, she's just. Day trips. And then he makes a day trip to have dinner with her, and holly gets a fever and he's back that same night. Yeah, and it's like okay. There was a ferry involved I gave there is there are some distance between Seattle and like the islands in puget sound, but like it's either six hours, or he has a teleportation device like pick one. Maybe they met halfway because they're eating dinner with her friends, yeah, maybe they all went halfway seeming friends three hours down. Cool. Give, grace. Somewhere between Seattle and puget sound. There's all this fine dining restaurants. Maybe, it's all I said. I say for sure I've insider Info I said. Maybe they went to Tony's on the Lake Tony's. Wait not. That doesn't sound halfway at all. It's a really long fairy right? It's just going on with the red lobster. Talk that all those companies those restaurants are all owned by the same company and their whole bit is. We've got good Brad. Sucks, but they've got good bread. Olive Garden Sticks yes, red lobster Cheddar Bay. The meal just goes to space plants. What else is in America Love Star? Long. I think Longhorn is. Good bread with the oil. Okay, but have you ever had? The coconut crusted shrimp. Yeah I've had always clerk. No, it's not no, it's not. Sorry. Are you done, Alonzo. I am okay, I listen. Maybe they met halfway. Maybe they met halfway. That's all I was trying to say yeah. You told me. That! This store is going on its third owner, Yup. and. The manager has hopped from owner to owner. That's ridiculous of Toy Story. Yeah, it's not like. It's a major league baseball right Josh. Sticking around making paint decision, my contracts ironclad. I it with Teddy you WanNa you. WanNa buy me out. Works bankrupted to owners so far. She's like trust. Trust me. I know the color. Maybe you're the probably. Like why didn't she just bite herself? If she's that obsessed with the toy store, just take out a loan. She's yeah, no kid. The school. Security System. where? where, holly goes is going. Consist of a child checking passes of adults and say thumbs up or thumbs down. That's the security check Yona. You want to have lunch with your kid? That's fine. You'RE GONNA. have to go through Jimmy and he's he's. He's eight and a half. He's got his second degree yellow belts back off. I cannot bring us down. That was my biggest. Sash. No more homeowners, and then there's dumb. What what are we doing right there? Yeah, yeah. At one point, dum, dum, dum, grant brother whatever his name is. He, says the line I, was the new kid every day of every week of every school year. No, what I think you're trying to say that you just never never finish. That doesn't make you the new kid. At some point, the kids know you. They just allies. You know you can see the new kid. Yeah, but that's hard. Maybe it's maybe it's. Because you're bringing a thermometer to. Check in different types of water, it's tap it. You see this. Painters like this water's boiling it. Resonated with that live and you pointed out. My Man shares up with a pet lobster. Talks. And then the seen that a couple of you have said it's g the seeing the bar with the river dance. Maggie comes in talking to a friend and her friend says. What do you think of the guitar player and it cuts the three guitar. Bad for guitar players what to do with that band is called guitars all types. Guitar players and it's just like what are you could star player? Doesn't matter. All of them are guests. Pot expre- There's thirty. So. We talked a little bit about the Irish Jig. She tries to explain to someone who's never heard of an Irish Jig in the reverse order that you would try to her clues. Get more specific and less likely to be recognized, so she says. Irish Jig, which is the most generic thing, say everyone. This girl's like and she goes river dance. Okay, all right, and then she goes Michael Flat Flatley. Like if you reverse on that? Michael Flatley, no river dates Irish. Yeah, that's the one. With Irish Jig if there is no, there's no, there's no scenario where you hear river dance, and you say no, but Michael Flatley right. Yes, Sir not. Familiar Irish. Had his poster room never knew what he did. Just like not not familiar with Judy, Garland but buzzy burke big. I know. I can't believe I said. God. I enjoyed it Alonzo. Hey. Why didn't she prime the walls of the toy story what? Why like of all the things to skip a step on? Don't hardest part of painting is not the actual painting. It's putting the tape around the drop cloth up once you're actually painting. It doesn't take that long. Either by some primary and pain, one or just prime the dumb walls like I don't understand. This is the thing she's GonNa save herself thirty minutes like I. Don't understand that for the life of me. You have all specially when you're covering red bogus purple with a crew. You're just so particular. Everything needs to be paint now. Slap it up there. Who Cares? And they said Hey. We're GONNA make Thanksgiving dinner. It's the one meal a year. That mom actually cooked. You don't WANNA eat that meal. You do not want to eat shoes cooking once a year. It's a know it. Made was all the meals and what? It's going to be also. It's a twenty three layer dip. Five meets. peens somebody's. Last year though. Martin. I pushed Eric. Exasperated, she store near each. Like Jerry Seinfeld and George Costanza together. He's shoes. I got one more and I. Don't know exactly when it happens, but at some point of a good way into this movie Sean Fares this character who's now the dad? This girl whose mom has died in Biological Dad's not in the picture who has left one school into a renovated in part renovated house started another school after all. That's happened. He goes I think it's time to come up with a plan B. You were on like plan X. by now. Like plan. Is So far in your rear view mirror if all of this was your plan a, what are you doing with your life like? You're not ruin a coffee store. You're just sitting at home thinking of permutations. With. Holly's. Mom died. I. Bro It's not everything is going to crap figuring out. Males First Grade I've expecting Yeah, no, it's all part of. She's not GonNa, talk for months saw part of it. Don't you worry brothers won't. Inconvenience no part of the plan knows therapy for the child's probably critising long-term trauma plan as school which shoddy security. All the part of the planet. Oh my goodness, so how does he maintain his copy business in Friday harbor? Battle with holly in the Dead Mom's house. It's like. This guy is hours away. Sky Runs a coffee shop in the loosest says same thing. I. Do I run a coffee shop. Trust me. I don't know anything about coffee, but I drink it sometimes. It's the same manager of the toy store. She comes down there. It's like this new thing. That's as good. Yeah, been here for three years three owners. You got anything else. Read jobs for what the homework. Pancakes the segment the best. What would you say? I would say is when you got a question and you WanNa know more about it once. Yes, what normally say here? Four segment just a part of the show. Is, wonder, what could have been maybe happened? I would give some clarity of the questions that we you'll have clarity. Gosh Panda, what's her address? What you get. The Guy Behind the sandwich shop. WHO's messing up all the orders? To know more about this guy. He's a treat. He is an absolute treat, and maybe one of the all-time unsung heroes of of the hallmark movies. I love him I love this guy. More I've been access on your list of. I'm what'd you try to? We're all. Sung here's a hallmark WHO's. Kong. On Young. Okay okay I got you. There was this one person who served apple cider in. This wasn't worth anything. That were news listening. Else. Even even boy no more about him. I WANNA, know. How did he get as bad as he is, and I would love to see more of them. I love him. Astonished First Day. He's he's. He's almost hero. He's like. He's like how many times do I gotTa, tell you even. Match up to say the number. It's that easy, but it's not for Ethan. On there, what's going on Buddy Alonzo? A couple of things. First of all the marquee of the movie theater town says a Christmas Carol Marathon Oh boy, so does that mean. They're showing the same version of a Christmas. Carol over and over again. They're showing a bunch of different. Are People going to keep coming back to see multiple versions, I have question you get this. Version you get the muppet. Christmas Carol you get all. All the sequel to the Christmas Christmas Carol Tiny Tim Dis. I'll say this I did. Like God blesses. I did see a play. It was Christmas. Carol brought from Marley's perspective and so Marley is actually he's all three ghosts, but he's able to switch it up and and God I guess in. This case has given Marley the the the mission to do this, and then if he can get scrooge to love Christmas than he can be basically, go back. Wow, yeah. Was a one man play big stakes. One man play man I've heard about. It wasn't about okay. The other thing, and this isn't exactly like What the hall repair just sort of strategy when Maggie shows up at the toy store. She's like well I wanted to accrue in the manager lays like well. No, no, we're doing hot pink instead and I thought. Is this a metaphor for what it's like to write a hallmark Christmas movie. You're like. I want this like subtle character. No, no, we're doing this instead well I. I wanted the scene where the characters have this long conversation get. No, there's going to be cookie decorating. And then they go to a tree, lighting and I just I felt like. We were seeing a Meta version of what the creation of the these movies are like now where you come in with your big ideas, you know exactly what you want to do and somebody else's like. No, we're not. We're not doing around into oblivion. Yeah. That's why she didn't use. Primer doesn't use cinema. Just, slap it up there. No time thirty minutes. That's all that matters. Yeah, so mine is was Eddie it was also the two previous owners of the toy store, and not just them. Because you know, you can start a business and fail, it happens to a lot of people. What is Maggie in particular going to do with toy store that is going to be different enough to allow that business to sustain, even though the two previous owners also having always doors. That's right. That space has been a toy store, the past two previous tenants and has not worked, and it has not worked. Yeah, what is Maggie GonNa do to switch things up to make it work for her. That's what I WANNA know I hope she succeeds because I met, she was right about the carpet squares. Carpet Squares Look Harper's. So what she? What else did you get upper toss tectonic talks. She's GONNA use Tock. Twelfth Twenty Twenty twelve tiktok. So I WANNA know in the writer's room or maybe the writers you know living room where the one person wrote this movie. Or. Maybe it was a hallmark were they said you know what will start with? Maggie being left at the altar, and then we'll never explain it will never talk about the guy that left her will never do anything else with that material aside from just establish why she's coming back home I've never seen it before. I've never seen a movie. Where the woman is left at the altar, and we don't get more information about that. And I wanted more information or I want to know why decided to go that. The sister does keep occasion saying well. He's got a he's. He's engaged. I always got a new girlfriend. You can't let them win. Quick. Find a man or he wins. But they that could have happened offscreen just as he's just doesn't set the character up for a really good reason to jump into another relationship with a man with a kid. If you just got left at the alter like they could have had literally, she could have just been sitting in a restaurant and her boyfriend dumper. Than doing a full wedding scene I, just I didn't understand I got the impression that it's a six month like times man. It wasn't just like a few weeks. Because she had to have moved back and also SUV and back to. Colors in their wedding. Those are not colors. You. Know you're a big color boy? Maybe. Maybe she thinks if she finds a guy who is saddled with a child, he can't run as fast that's right. Yeah, and you know how every woman needs a man. Try into That's the underlying message of all of these can't lash. Hey, how can you win without a guy? That's true, Hey! Guys, did we do it? We did we did do it. Panned up I do need to be honest with you. Yes, the double decker of the week on Tuesday was tough. It was bad bad bad so I'm. Fine I should not do the deep dive. It did feel like you and he's just reporting reality. It did feel like you had maybe dove. Deeper than normal you, you hit your head square in the shallow him, so we're going to give you another shot another week another day of the same week. Yeah, to get this right double decker of the week. It's my decorates your dagger decker of the week or the week then hit. He got elanie George and Kerry Shaffer Elanie. George and Kerry Schaeffer Yeah Ellen and Karen Kerry Kerry Elliott Kerry. Good start now Mike. Both of them. Longtime listeners first time friends as A teaming up and they've decided to start a brand new company. K Are you ready for it super ready. got. An old company, it's called yeah and it's called. Bisbee not no, no, no, no, no, it's called. Old New Bookies old new book. I don't even WANNA guess I don't want to guess. I JUST WANNA. Hear it because. No No, no, no, no, no, no, go. Tell US panda well. Okay so. Sometimes. You WanNa. Get a book right because you're gambling. You're gaining right. But you don't want use the old ones. There's some new and go for a new book A. They have new book, but sometimes you don't want the new book. Sometimes you want getting old bookie. Universe is someone choosing between bookies based upon their age or how long they've been doing it. Is there a bookie? Buffet or selection? Process that I'm unaware I'm not a big gambler Dan. That's not one of the things that. You just deep dive. So, what do you mean I just because I did, the deep dive doesn't mean I personally partake in the gambling, okay? Sometimes we want an bookie. I would not want a new book out there inexperienced he's. All why and I understand it correctly old new bookie is. Old New bookies that are all elderly. Yet does also a component of it component of it. That's GONNA. Be well because you can also, and this is where they branched out a little bit since their inception. You can also get some old new bookies. Spun thing. New Old, yes, so no, what you're sitting on a new book and they branched out where you can now get old new. No, this is what he's saying. You can get new book are elderly, or you can get bookies that have been doing it for a wild. That are babies. Baby, bookie such. Pigs with side. That's all I care about. Is there any pigs with side desks, not their main desk. We don't WanNA, mentally. Main disc pigs side deaths. I understand old new beholder. I point out that pace. Luque's are a big hit. Pig slop is taking up too much room really quickly. How's the business doing? Oh successful I've played multiple bets. Thank! I thought you didn't gamble. Dabble okay. How all in on IT and number fourteen. Who is your elderly booker? Oh Gerald Jarrell, those still book. You Sound Booker Nobody's Booker, T. Booker T. Harlem Heat so good or Gerald the best bookie row. How old is Gerald Seventy two? How long has he been doing it? Well he's new. He just started last month and he told you to put it all number fourteen O on number fourteen, going to go well for you. I mean I. It was a sizable amount to. Go. He says undecided undecided. Can I ask you this one more question. At what point do they fire the people because they're no longer new. Oh after they have a little bit of experience, thank you. Did it along early? POPCORN SHIRLEY'S POPCORN DOT COM check July twenty twenty caps Alonzo Feminine movie of Other podcast Right People in listening to you. Yes, Sir movie right here on the rebel jam network, but also linoleum knife and breakfast all day, and who show where we talk about busby Berkeley. I warn you in advance. Yes, hard pass. A. Just crushing these days, Obama's girlfriend love. We will be back next Tuesday with romance. Is IT ROMANCE REINDEER LAVA? Though? Is that what we decided just romance? The Reindeer Law Romance that reindeer. At one point zero down. Christmas reindeer lodge led to go back to Do you mean Romance Rain Your Lodge or do you mean Christmas at Holly Lodge? These are very. IT IS ROMANCE Romance and Reindeer Lodge yes. Why Not Chris? Until next time we've been the I wish you a merry Christmas. Deck the homework is a brand jam. PODCAST is presented by friendly TV and recorded live in Greenville South. Carolina at the Bramble Jam podcast network studios. It's produced by Green Gray you can find out more information deck the HALLMARK DOT COM.

Mark Maggie Holly Holly Buddy Alonzo Alonzo Day Hallmark Berkeley fever Busby Berkeley Dan My Judy Garland Bisbee US Shirley Chris Tom Cruise Bob Busby Berkshire
Mindful Selling with Eric Szymanski and Holly Duckworth

Conversations with Phil

33:17 min | 11 months ago

Mindful Selling with Eric Szymanski and Holly Duckworth

"Hey Good morning. Everyone could afternoon detail. Whatever the heck you're doing wherever you are? I'm delighted that you decided to spend some time today so today I got a question for you. It's an important to sell mindfully. And how important is that in the beginning of the year. Well I think you know that the answer that yes I would have asked that question captain here but how the heck do we do that. How do we make sure that our year is mindfulness? Possible that we achieve the right goals that we do the right things that we are aligned with our mission vision values. He's purpose end. Kick the snot out of her quote a while. Serving our clients will today. I'm delighted that it gets to my favorite people. The authors of the Book Mindful Selling Sell More stress last fifty two tips become a sales mindful sales professional not just to sell to rush but mindful sales professional national Holly Duckworth and Eric Sanski. So holly is a keynote speaker. She's an applied mindful leadership adviser. She's contributing times. She's a producer hosts everyday. Mindfulness this show. The Communist is so many industry publications by starting to read them. There'd be too many you get bored so I won't do that. But also co author those this award winning American Hospitality Aspe- Tele Industry professional with lots and lots of sales and marketing leadership experience. He's worked for Disney is kicked over all sorts of stop and he got the top individual Eh sales award in this Convention Sales Division in twenty eighteen. Now get this in two thousand and two like ancient history. But he's been on a long time so he's got. The background is recognized as care of the year by the Atlanta Florida. Chapter the National Association Caterer Executives. He's an avid runner amused. Perform on the father twin daughters just entered entered college so I'm excited to bring them up to you today in a share. My friends with you and talk about Michael Selling Ho can more stress less twenty twenty. So what's up front. So are you. It is it's so great to see you love you. It's great to be here so Eric I gotta ask you man. It's a longtime sales professional when you come over to the dark worksite of mindfulness. It really truly all began with holly and a year and a half ago. A conversation that we had I was selling and cheating leaving the peak performance but absolutely stressing out. I knew that when you achieve your goals next year you have to achieve more are in. I wasn't sure how to do it. A lot of personal anxiety and stress going on. Well I called my friend Holly in before you know it. She introduced the concept. Huzzah of mindfulness to me. And before I was I was looked immediately. It was amazing. Wow Wow so duckworth. What would you tell them? I mean you get some candy or are some ginger beans or others work. What is mindfulness? Why do we need it while fell? Mindfulness is you know is I call it new thought ancient wisdom so it's the practice of being present in the moment without judgment and unfortunately as human beings. We're all hard wired for judgment. So I gave Eric Links to my book and my podcast to help him. Slowdown in center. Focus if you will L. on his highness value which is serving his clients with the great products and services that he has and so I gave him a ten or fifteen. Fifteen minute Little activities he could. Do you know maybe a meditation in the morning and a little activities throughout the day that would invite hide him to be fully present. I himself because we have to take care of ourselves and then to take care of his clients hello charming gracie shout. Hey so keep going Ali. So that's that's my. That's what really what I gave him. I said you know. We've got seven strategies to be mindful so things like visiting meditations affirmations setting an intention giving a gratitude for the work that we get to. Do you know Eric had jobs in some of the the sexiest organizations who wouldn't want to work for Hilton Disney A just taking a moment to be ingratitude right now that you have a job up and all of those things kind of stopped him in his tracks and gave him the opportunity to say you know Holly Ride and then really shifted his mindset each and every day to what do the best we can. I think sometimes a sales professionals the more I work with them. I see we got to focus on these big goals. Forget the power of the present moment. And that's really truly where the power is. Yeah I love that. I think that's really important. I'm out here in San Rancho Bernardo this week training sales sales professionals to and the big thing is yeah focused on the now what you can control prioritize your day so that you're doing this right and then prepare in practice two can produce some perfect. It's pretty simple and yet we often miss that. So so you you. You went through that list really fast of different practices. So let's start with one one of those holiday. Let's breakdown gratitude. Eric I want you to tell me how you actually are using that as you sell because you're still sales professionally not just training. You're also a sales person. So how go ahead. What is gratitude? How do we get that practice started? We know this is an exciting one because it's one that all of us Hindu and yet sometimes we say we're just too busy to do the gratitude piece and we were talking to at the beginning of the year and actually wrote. I read one. Handwritten thank you note every single day and all holly takes alone. Does it have to be handwritten note. Find the language that works for you and it's not just about Saying you're grateful but it's actually more important to feel it in your brain in your heart and in your body and really ally that that that gratitude for the product of service you sell the person that's in front of you maybe some days. It's just thank you for the lead that came in. Thank you for that conversation that that we can have so Gratitude practice in any really of these seven mindfulness practices. While there's a court each one also be to be personalized personalized to you. So some of our coaching in consulting clients they take gratitude and they use it on link did and they may post gratitude for our book or they'll post gratitude for an article. They read that inspire them Others may use facebook. That's that's your media but that's really the key is he's not just type in the words and doing as checkoff box really taking a moment to be fully present and feel grateful that you get to do work you loving basis that you love with people we left Eric. How do you activate gratitude gratitude? In sales. It's funny sales professionals. Were very selfish. And we want to be thanked or the effort we we put four and the work that we do. I spent days hours weeks or months preparing for client meetings and when I was done done one of the most important things that helped me understand. What mindful sales professional with you as I would expect to be thanked for all of that? Hard Work Yeah I did. And the Michael Sales professional actually thanks the customer and client for participating in being in a EH sales experience It's really a flip for me. It was definitely a awakening for me to even consider thanking someone for experiencing thing my sales process and it just if you consistently think what is in your head This person's never going to buy from the yeah. I can't believe I spent all of this time. They're not reacting in the way that I wanted them to react. And if you just put all that aside and be grateful for genuinely great for your customers presence in your sales experience it just changes your outlook. It lowers your stress. It reduces is that that you have as professional helps you focus on what is important that estimator and what they need solutions that you can bring to the table table so that they want to buy your product or service so what we do. Is We match up the seven steps of mindful selling with the seven mindless. I'm from practices so as your viewers are thinking about how they're going to approach this sales year. I want them to recognize that. We're not adding more things to your to do list. But we're integrating mindfulness practices into the work. You're already doing so. Mindful gratitude attitude is linked up to the natural sales process of follow that a great mindful sales professional doesn't see their sales else's start in an endpoint but really truly an ongoing circle of data connection and relationship so gratitude is that natural so follow up. Step Hey did you enjoy -joy a product or service that worked for you. How did it work for you? Is there anyone else that you know. That could use our product or service. So that's one part Bradley two is it doesn't have to be just about thank you but it's truly about that deepening. The relationship through a follow US awesome. I think that's important because Eric I know a lot of times. When we're in sales we check in and we follow up and we want to see how things are right and that that's completely useless? There's absolutely no value there so it sounds sounds to me like being more mindful being more intentional about our gratitude our thankfulness are that we say thank you actually can help us. Add more more value that customer to help them realize what they're seeing probably making it less sticky and less buyers march. Is that as well. I mean the results do speak for themselves. Sounds if he don't even if you don't believe it you know sometimes sales professionals if you followed the right process and you do have a genuine intend to do good to provide that solution not just let's close. Let's close. Let's get the sale and sign the contract. I don't really care about. You genuinely just want this for me. There's there's a sales incentive for me if you don't buy I can't make my name I mean there's been so many different things that have been told over the years as a individual individual sales contributor as sales leader as a leader of other sales professionals that if you don't deliver the goods people are going and a half hours to work. You're not gonNa have something it just it really does sometimes affect you and whether you realize it or not having something something to hold onto having that And I don't think thank you just genuine gratitude for the experience of having a customer that you know you oh you would fit well with and here's the best art even for those customers or pretentious customers who you are like. I'm never going to do business with you. Try so not to act in that moment because as we all know things change circumstances change that person. WHO's not buying from? You today could be buying coming from you. In the future you transition to a different role a different company a different state in their life and you want them to remember your sales experience so that when the time is right. They're going to come back to you but in the moment if you stay focused on just being present with your customer not focused on. Oh my God I have one hundred fifty two emails. That just came in this last hour. Why am I even sitting in front of this person? They're wasting my time all of of those things that can get into your rain if you start with that Negatively it's your results are going to go down so we he introduced the concept of being president with your customer believing in the process first foremost for those who've been selling for a very long time or for those who are brand new details sales the mindful sales process it originates with a bonafide process. People don't even know that there is a a seven step process of professional sales. We took that tried and true model than I was taught over twenty years ago and layered in how to stay sane gene during that time maintenance comes wow wow so so. This isn't just some. Woo New Age stuff right. This is this is based in fact this is based Houston. What actually is working? We layer mindfulness on the top. And I I think I love the first step that you talk about because we talked about that gratitude and follow. But let's let's start at the beginning here with intention right what the intention is for the call right for the outcome for that. So holly how do we set that intention in the best way we can. Well we'll felt one of the things that I wanna make sure that we offer your your listeners. It I know you've had the website going down there. MINDFUL SALES TRAINING DOT com. We have a complimentary entry about the mindfulness Michael Sales mini poster. And so that the certainly a free giveaway at your listeners. WanNa go there. They can see all seven steps it's a complimentary metric gift from us up. The mindful sales mini mini poster in. That first step is really setting an intention and that's taking that five seconds is to really think about. How do you want to put your energy in motion and it's each day or with each client interaction that we get so much doo? Doo Doo Doo Doo. We're forgetting that the power as human beings we are human beings we're not human doings aches and so setting that intention with each day or each client can just be a pause and a refresh to say nor my intention today is means prosperity prosperity for me. It's prosperity for my clients. Maybe your your your intention for that day is joy The thinking about who are you being while you are selling and reminding yourself of that commitment to be joy the prosperous throughout each and every sales interaction each and every day and honestly as one word he no other steps of the sales process the mindful NFL sales processes. If you only set your intention in in continuously circle back to that intention it will be a stronger more ease slow and stress-free sales professional excellent so less stress as we start the air white re hit the we hit the. You're running January one. Most sales professionals hit the reset button. Right they they they go back to zero. They have zero quote attainment. They have to go and get it every single day. So Eric. If we'RE GONNA do this program is going get it every day we start with that intention. Talk to me about the very next step. And how you're using that even today as you're going out and selling because I know that you know you're gonNA go kick some butt today and crush the quota WTA so how do you be more mindful and not. Just think of yourself as a quarter killer while it is Tuesday and we sell every day of the week I mean ultimately were all sales process in every organization. But I'll give you a perfect example of how we layer intention in the sales process of the person earlier this year. Wow last cheer. It's already twenty twenty Okasan earlier in twenty nineteen and met with them in the morning and in the afternoon they had a contract review with the customer contracts probably about twenty pages of legal ease. The statement from the sales professional with me was. This is going to be awful. I hate contract. Negotiations ends especially contract negotiations with this customer and instantly thought of holiday and the mindful process and practices as she taught me and and one of the key lines. She said to me early on we met. I was stressing less. Doesn't have to be that way. I told her some very similar story I was I knew I was going into a contract negotiation that was going to be stressful from my perspective. And I just I led with. Oh it's so awful Hudson does it have to you know no. No one's ever asked me that before in many sales communities in my sales offices that I've worked in there's kind of this Assumed aim points Legal and contract contract negotiations so there started the snowball down the hill of the the bigger the contract and the more the legal conversations. You're going to have the more stressful awful offals wanting to be we all have conversations over the coffee in a water cooler coffee with preparing myself for this stressful experience. Well my comment back to that sales professional if you back to intention setting just before leaving you on the phone is to say this is going to be an easy process. This contract negotiation is going to be and it it just changes your outlook. It relieves that pressure. You can read out that stress and before you even get on the phone with that customer. Get into that discussion in the meeting in person you've set the intention that this is going into the positive experience and guess what this isn't pie in the sky. We understand that stress exists. We understand that there are going to be maybe healthy played discussions or conflict throughout negotiation. But if you start focusing on the inside on what you can control this changes the experience agreeance for you. It changes the experience for your customer Changes the experience in provides a better experience for everyone. And where we're going with this mindful sales concept. I can't wait for you to ask holly how she found the sales process. Is You asked me out find mindfulness but in this case we really want you to experience the best results you've ever experienced as a sales professional. We're not asking you to do less and to sell less or asking you to stress less and sell more in by stressing less putting these practices into place a starting at the beginning. You have to start somewhere the inning with that intention attention and if you can just start with. I'm not going to be stressed out. This negotiation is going to go. Well it may or may not but at least you can walk in the door with an intention attention of ease enjoy or so the president will ask you is. What are you GonNa do today with your intention? What are you starting well well? It's funny that thank you holly Bringing the intention of overwhelm would not be a good idea and it is the first what I working. The era and Monday did not disappoint. Yesterday was extraordinarily busy. Everyone that I've been calling for the past. Few weeks decided to respond in now. Everyone's pigging out wondering what how the years to begin. So I'm starting my Tuesday with that deep breath of accomplishment. Today we're going to accomplish in control a clean inbox were visualizing having all of our responses to requests that have come in and and it will be a positive day cool cook thanks holly because that was my next question right I was gonNA bring back. So that's great so eric you've got that right. We set the the intention we set the intention of all of that one. And I'm going to get back to your to the sales process a minute. Holly Eric. What happens when things go sideways? Man I mean come on. We're we're in sales bro. This is not that easy. I can't just you know. Say Omen here we go baby. Let's go right. That's not how this works so tell me how does that really work when everything goes sideways. Why isn't caddy WATKISS? And whatever you want to say it you know it's funny you talked about the I mean for me and for the mindful sales process my sales professional. This is what we're trying to create here. The word professional is key so one first and foremost and things don't go. You said sideways. I'm GonNa say maybe as you anticipated. We do anticipate positive outcomes throughout the sales process. Do you want to anticipate. ABC negative or and WanNa say bad experiences but things that didn't go as planned by following the seven seven steps of professional sales layering. Your mindfulness practice in you. Go back to your process. Start with relationship building with clients after your intention him. And then you always go to vacation. And when you're in the allocation step act start asking questions see where the disconnect is and bridge the gap but I've following the process. You don't necessarily have to go through the steps one through seven but I would highly recommend if things are going south. Chances are you're probably focus. It's a little bit too much on me. You're focused on closing closing closing closing business. You'RE GONNA sign because I got to go back to all that business. Take a deep breath. Let's go back back to the beginning. Our remember attention doolittle relationship building or the sales process starts with meet and greet in a little bit of two to three minutes signs of just how are you what is going on and don't be afraid to ask difficult question. It sounds like this isn't going the way you planned. And we're trying to work through solution here. Can you tell me more. Start asking the client questions and see where that disconnect is the more information your estimate issue. That's definitely going to help. Set the tone for a positive positive resolution in and guess what positive resolution doesn't always mean signing the contract with you it could be with your competition or somebody else if it's not the right fit and be grateful for that time when it goes well and be grateful for the time when it doesn't go well but when things do go sideways as you said You know take a step set-back stop selling go to a more relationship. Build an obligation good submission. I like that that slows us down. We centers Senate gets US moving and still in a revenue producing way. We're doing the right things I think we just. We sent our brain and our intent in her heart often instead of just engaging your brain in our wallet so I think that's really strong not in the deal sizes throughout my career. I've sold five dollars products. I've sold million dollar products. I've had success along the way it's the same process. It really doesn't matter if you're in in a food and beverage sales Dell's or large legal acquisitions mergers. This process is universal. No matter what industry you're in my success came through the hospitality. The industry initially. It came from a long arduous process of training. And I saw a lot of different styles of how to do this this book and this Collaboration with Holly The Best of the best and put it into an easy to use is that you can do it and this this if you just take this now every day. It's a quick read. It'll help you focus on what you need to focus on show off of that. I think that yeah. That's important right so I read early copies copies the book. I've actually bought the book twice the first copy of the book print so would love you guys and support all your working but holly you're not a sales person right. This this is I mean not by not by design. You'd never call yourself that but yet you've got this seven step process now. So how's this working for you. Who does not fancy yourself a professional salesperson I? Are you surprised. Delighted laughing out loud. We've been friends as you know for like ten years and I just got this joint check under the table because what we think about you know one of the steps is no your beliefs it is done on to you as you believed. And you know era glued to the fact that you know we connected active. When he was a great sales success I was? I was challenged as as a executive. A sales professional as an entrepreneur wasn't hitting the sales marks that I wanted to hit hit and I got the gentle kick under the table. That said you know what is it that you're believing about your sales process and saying just exactly what where he said there The salesperson I don't WanNa be salesperson. Sales people are stinky. salespeople are dirty sales people need to go take a shower like all these things and Eric challenged me back to say you know. You're believing leaving those things work at the results. You're getting you're getting smelly results. 'cause you think salespeople are smelly and so I had the opportunity to then dive into my beliefs and go look get you know if I'm GONNA believe in my product mindfloness. I'm going to believe in my keynotes. My coaching might buy memberships. I have to get out and share the value of those and I- recalibrated my own relationship with the sales process in order to write this book with Eric and still Xiaomi Laurenti stress less that we have the opportunity to own blocks and in the book every week. We give you a tip hip that relates to the seven mindfulness steps and a little story to inspire. You a question to keep you going. And so oh when Eric was able to give me the seven steps that you know that first step being meet and greet I go. How do I do that? As as mindless personal gagging accenture and get my energy there. Those little tips showed me how I could weave the two together to be better for myself better for my clients and and then again this idea of intention setting you know if I was going into a hates it. I don't want to do this. That's what I was getting back when I shifted my own heart set my mindset mindset. Two Thousand Yeah. I'm not sure I love off. But but I I enjoy it as a way to share my good with the world and all of us again whether you're selling coffee or you're selling investment products or you know dentistry. I mindful living. Mindful selling is about doing July places. You love with people that you love. And that's what we're committed to helping people do no matter what industry they does something. Funny that when Explain this process to holly said there were only seven steps. She's like I can do that. And it really is a little epiphany awakening within in both of us and we saw this magic of mindfulness meeting sales and we saw no one was really talking about it and we took it and started offering starting to to people about it and we've actually traveled around the world already in this past year from Hawaii to Orlando to South Africa in started sharing these practices assist. And you'll be amazed at the results that we're seeing which is a little bit of a nudge and this isn't really a a reset of all things sales and marketing. But within Holly's Holly's world against the awareness of Okay I can go to process and I can believe that living these mindful practices throughout my company and and my sales organization It we closed and really it was mostly holly three contracts. At the end of twenty eighteen in a short amount of time with just just the most basic mindful practice play and iron emission. She would not have won those contracts without the sales process. I would not be here without the mindfulness practices. And that's where the slow blanketed awesome awesome. Well let's let's new one chapter from the book let's one week there pick one from the affirmation affirmation and demonstration piece that you can speak to here and let me set up the book here a little bit more for folks so folks if you're thinking about getting a book and helping being some more stress less twenty twenty this yearbook sell more stress less fifty two tips to become a more mindful sales professional with Holly Duckworth and Eric Samantha. Excuse a fantastic book. I bought the first copy and I put another copy to share. Because I believe in this book and I really think it's important thing about who you are being when you're selling really important to do that. The book can be got mindful sales training dot com. Get the seven practices to be mindful sales professional. KAMAU WE'RE GONNA share one little insight from the book read by One and only highly Did US well. Let's so so funded tissue to show the book in. We wrote this. We were thinking of it as you know. I'm buying it for myself. And even just this short time. The book went number one in three categories. The Ebbers was released which is national sales person's Day and then now we're teams are coming to us in. They're buying it for their entire sales department as is a weekly to almost sales teams. They meet once a week. Hey we now have support each other were you doing on your goals and all that and so what's fun is this is a tip a week. AAC for fifty two weeks and there are some bonus ones in there to to get it. He's ruined because we did talk about week number one. We talked about intention. I'm just going to kind of flip through casino. You know mindfulness. It's the right one lands at the right time. We'll just pick pick one to talk about in the the number that's coming up twenty three weeks twenty three. It's Oh good midpoint in the year some of you might even be in the mid point depending on what your Looks like number twenty three selling with all five of your senses. This is the most mindful gift you can give to yourself and your customers in in the in each week you get a story or tip then you get what we call a thought provoking in question. Mindfulness is just about taking Think about what you're doing. Who are you being when you're selling and then it? So as you said every single week you get an affirmation to set set your mindset and the affirmation for this example is as a mindful sales professional. I use my hearing smelling tasting seeing and feeling to maximize every sales opportunity. And go wait a minute. Holly sensing tasting field. I'm just like selling car parts here. But it taps into your intuition and so your thought provoking question is what is the strongest of my sense. What is the weakest of my senses? How can I use my intuition as a sales advantage? How can I see my weakness as an opportunity for growth and my strength as an opportunity tingey to stress less than south war and this speaks to that sales staff of presenting your product? All of us have an opportunity to present the product got it. How have you gotten to know your customer? What they need what they want and quote use that information in the demonstration while occasion stages seeing seeing that you engage your customer in their own five senses telling you what they see they feel a sense they know what they need allows you to align your product and service service and a better way? The purpose of engaging senses is to invoke that positive feeling or emotion in the sales process that moves your prospect towards the contract Lewis. Good stuff wasn't sure where you're going there with that one five senses really we make smell. I don't know if how can we save jingle bells. Batman smells or was that another conversation. I'm not sure really when you think about it. In a presentation stepper professional selling most people are looking at their visuals. Or they're in audio or their jokes probably thinking maybe one or two mentally ear. We want to engage as many the as possible. Is it possible to get smell positive smell into your sales process navy navy. Not let's definitely engage those in your room in your environment where you're selling. Does it smell pleasant This is something you can add into your sales experienced. Different proven scientifically different sense will engage. Engage your positive behavior your mood so it could be. You know something focused more in you than it is your customer but you know we're not joking with this this this information that we're providing isn't something I love. Your Batman smells reference from childhood because it really does bring light to the issue and let's not take ourselves so seriously that we can't put a job or laugh in I can tell you we take mindfulness extremely seriously. We take sales in sales results extremely seriously. So if you're in a sales division if you're in a sales situation with yourself when you're opening the look income to a chapter that you're really not sure what it means. We're encouraging you to reach out to us. We're encouraging you to go to our social community and just use use the HASHTAG mindful sales. Let's start these conversations. Let's see how we can improve this process in a good way awesome. I love that I love of that so much. All about slow down being present being more mindful. Really good stuff so everyone if you listen. You're thinking what the heck how do I get started on this. I I encourage you to go to mindful sales. TRAINING DOT COM go download seven practices to be a mindful sales professional and connect with holly and Eric. They'll be a big help to you. That help you sell more stress less in twenty twenty or whenever you listen to this. Thanks so much for being here folks. Thank you Helen. Eric so delighted to talk lucky today have a great day. Everyone thank you my pleasure.

Holly Eric Holly Michael Sales SALES TRAINING Holly Duckworth sales department Michael Selling Ho Eric I Disney National Association president Aspe- Tele Industry producer Eric Links Atlanta facebook US Eric Sanski Florida doolittle
Big Brother 21 Tuesday Sept 3 Morning Update

Reality TV RHAP-ups: Reality TV Podcasts

48:33 min | 1 year ago

Big Brother 21 Tuesday Sept 3 Morning Update

"Every morning morning gary again yes again all this john i anti in juneau ed rosh daddy tomorrow he will do is again <music>. Hello everyone and good morning. Welcome to our live feed update for september third. I'm romero's turn armstrong and with me today jenny how you doing jimmy great taryn. I it's september now and i i was thinking back to like the first update eight that i did this summer and how differently i felt about the season to how i feel now so overall feeling pretty good that we are you. You know in this home stretch. That has a lot of exciting stuff happening so yes even though it's been a slow week. There's still some interesting stuff to talk about here today. As we talk about everything that happened yesterday on the big brother twenty one live feeds it was day seventy six in the house and we auto ceremony or tommy did in fact use the veto on christie cliff went up as replacement so heading into thursday night cliff <music> and jess are on the block and one of them will be going home. Yeah i mean anyone really shocked that. Tommy is using the veto veto on christie at this stage that you know this is. This is the stuff that we've all been talking about this preexisting relationship but at the same time i'm not too mad at this situation russian because it leaves us with resets pairs that all have you know some claim to something in this game game and i can't remember the last time i felt like this at the final seven where you know we're going into the final sex and i can really really make an argument for everyone left in the game. We're getting rid of the one person that was the obvious goat. <hes> you know you can criticize. Jackson's axes move this week all you want but i'm not mad at it. Well cliff. Nicole talked a bit after the veto ceremony they <hes> they feel relatively comfortable. Here are at least cliff does. He feels like he should be good. He does think the jackson and holly will <hes> you know. Stay true to their word and keep him in the game this week. Part of him feels like the fact that tommy used veto kind of. Lets him know that they're probably probably not working all that closely together because otherwise tommy might have felt more comfortable not using the veto and so how cliffs these the game moving forward is how it is. They're moving into the final six with three pairs and from his perspective. It's looking like the jackson holly pair are targeting the tommy and christie pair in the tommy and christie para targeting the jackson holly pair and cliff nicole get to sit back and watch the fireworks and indies feeling pretty good about that and nicole kind of agrees say i think i think that's the case like so. Should we be throwing this h h should should i do should we agree though probably not not worth the risk just win the wage and then they have to decide which pair decide with obviously they have a much better working relationship with jackson holly and already have a deal with them so they kind of feel. It's probably best to just stick with jackson. Holly at this point yeah and i think that this is the right call for them because as they're talking it through you know they're assuming that each pair is going to go after each other there but when you get down to this year numbers and you've got to actual pairs that you we've seen firsthand that tommy will take down christie and we obviously know that in any situation you know jackson her holly are gonna use the veto on each other if the other ones on the block you you can't risk girl safety because you're you know you're going up in a lot of situations if there's veto being used so your best bet is to just gun for the h o._h. If you can and insure your own safety insure your ally safety and you now see what happens next yes so that's basically where they stand at this point here. Nicole is also gonna talk with jackson. Holly has disc lift. Nicole is a little bit worried that tommy and krista. You're going to push for cliff to go jackson. Holly already gave cliff the heads up that tommy in christie are in fact doing that and they let nicole no that that that's happening inning as well that tommy and christie already been pushing to keep just in the house but don't worry we're with you guys were not. We're not going to vic cliff if nothing is going to come of this yeah so jackson. Holly and nicole are all in a room together and they're like these are the votes here. This is all we need and they can you know push all they want and expand their their social capital on trying to <hes> keep just here but ultimately. It's not going to matter so try not the freak out. We're with you but it's yeah. It's it's only monday as they say a few times a day. As it's only monday and christy christiaan tommy are already starting to to push for for just so nicole is feeling a little nervous about that so holly jackson talk by themselves wondering which one of tommy or christie should go. I if they were to win the h. if they were to target them if they were to be the votes to send them. I'm home. Which do they want to go home. First hollywood like to see christie go first. She's not a fan of christie and she likes tommy. She trust tommy. She doesn't doesn't want to lie to tommy. She doesn't want to betray tommy. She doesn't want to hide anything from tommy and she loves tommy so she would like to see christie. Go first though jackson in has some counterpoint mostly being that tommy is a lot closer to nicole and cliff then christie is and that he is more capable of working with them. <hes> if christie goes then christie would be if christie stayed in the house then there'd be more separation there which may or may not be true can't can't released say for certain in that regard <hes> but certainly i think tommy is more capable and competitions and they should really be thinking about that but they're not really but <hes> but ultimately they go back and forth. They're not sure which one they would want to go home. I they're still kind of is still kind of in the air about it. They could go either way at this point. They also go over there jury vote situation. They feel pretty comfortable. They feel like can tommy beat us in vote. Though we gotta be worried about that nah he can no. We beat everyone in a jury vote. Even cliff. I mean cliff might be the only person that can maybe have a fighting chance but now we beat. I am too. Don't worry about it this. This is a little problematic although later in the night they do acknowledge that cliff could beat beat them and that he has the biggest chance of beating than <hes> but there are ultimately comfortable with you know with him as a person that they want to be working with him and if it you know if he wins so be it but this they're really not happy with how jackson was talking about tommy being the better person go out. It was like it was almost like one of those things where it's like arriving to the right conclusion for the wrong reason because it's not so much about who might pick up nicole kohler cliff. That's not really what they need to be worried about any to be worried about who can slide their way to the end and beat them and ultimately hami is way more of a threat threat you either of their win then christie and it just doesn't seem like they really see it that way. Which is a little troubling and if you know depending depending on what happens in this double eviction and if tommy survives this week they you know they this is someone that they really have to worry about because i think they are wrong and in a lot of scenarios pommie could be either of them depending on how competitions go down the line and what kind of you know what kind of game people respect sometimes people are really really you know respecting the big comp win so so a jackson versus tommy scenario. I know you guys have been talking about that can be interesting but tommy is way more of a threat to win the game than they seem to think so they need to. They need to open their eyes on that a little bit. You'll never underestimate underestimate the power of just not wanting to lose to a particular individual and not wanting that particular individual to win the game and there's a lot aww that with christy the way that she stayed in the game a few weeks ago was by selling her soul by by saying i am i am yours and it helped her stay but it also kind of gave a an image off of her. That is like we. We don't really want this person to win the game. She's hours. She's not a competitor. That beats us. That's not what we want so we'll have to keep an hi on that. There's a it's a pretty slow day after that. Things are relatively quiet. They end up getting a grill. They're gonna they're gonna. I have a bit of a barbecue. They have some pranks going on that <hes> jackson drinks some chocolate milk with china's sire sauce and he retaliates by putting whipped cream in little baggies and then putting them in the <hes> the pillow case and christie lays her head on it and <hes> thinks it's coconut milk coconut milk china china gets like curly and thick and stuff but not dissuade whipped cream person but does it really smell that much like coconut macos. She's she showed it to everyone else and they're like no. That's whipped cream. Obviously i mean there's coconut whipped cream like for people that can't have seen the cans of coconut whipped cream though like maybe that's what she's familiar with. I don't know but like i feel like actual. Whip cream has a very distinct kind of like like sugary smell right now so she wasn't super pleased about. She was pretty annoyed. She played it off the jackson jackson like she was okay but she was pretty annoyed. Jackson went out and he also put some nicole's pillows and claimed that he didn't but eh just found them and took them out so we think peak boredom here really the pranks are happening thing but we then get to a bit more game talk later in the night. Tommy talks with christie and christie says yet again we we can't mess around with this next h h we need to put both holly and jackson one hundred percent. We can't risk one of them being off the block. One of them has asked to go. It's just what we have to do. I i wish we could keep just this week. I whole maybe we can make it happen in some way but <hes> but those two have to go and christie's really hammering home that it's got to be the two of them beside each other she loves holly but holly is not playing her own game and that she's shown this week that if she's not keeping jess which she really thinks is not good for holly's game in that. It's more about jackson's game that you know sorry holly holly you're playing jackson's game and the only way to ensure that jackson goes home here is if she puts <unk> holly up beside him so they're not going to try any sort of fancy situation. It's going to be the two of them up on the block now. Whether that actually happens because christie said the exact same thing. I watched the exact conversation this time last week. <hes> when christie said time to make take a big swing. I'm ready to do it <hes> and ultimately she. You know she doesn't win. The neither does tommy so it doesn't happen. <hes> maybe this week double eviction. Finally the the adrenaline going gonna start running and could be crispier tommy taking this and you might see jackson. Holly finally on the block together could happen. We see also cliff nicole and tommy. You're gonna talk a bit as well. They talk about the possibility of being a double vision this week. You know thinking about it. If there's going to to be a double eviction it's going to be this week and so they're starting to think about it in those terms and perhaps prepare i would expect that we're gonna see more prep for a potential double as we move forward up until this point they've been kind of <hes> kind of lax about it like they had been preparing for a double so many weeks and then it never happened but i expect they're going to start to prepare a little bit more now that they are thinking more about the possibility of it cliff goes and talks to jackson and holly just again to check in and talk about what's been happening how tommy and chris you're campaigning for cliff to go cliff. Lets it's them know that the justice claiming that she's not going to be doing it in campaigning but he sees her with christy all the time. This is great work by cliff to kind of head off any potential. Just campaigns says yeah. I see her with christy all the time i see her using that female empowerment angle and you you see the light bulb in jackson's head girl like oh no doc mad man for me so really discrediting anything that christie might say about cliff four jess. He also lets them know that christie is also throwing jackson and holly under the bus. There was a conversation between it cliff and christie that i told you guys about. I believe it was yesterday that i told you about it. 'cause it was the day before and she had told cliff that she feels like jackson. Holly holly are are playing everyone making everyone seem like they're on their side and he realized that conversation to jackson jackson holly saying that that christie is trying to imply that jackson holly. You're playing the whole house and don't be fooled by them. You know we we need to sort of unite against them and and jackson hollies responses basically owner. That's not what we're doing know that we are. We are with you we are with you cliff and <hes> you know and nicole and we we shook your hand and don't believe anything that they say they're sneaky. They're liars and cliff is same totally cliff. This finally cliff says the reasoning that i've felt which is look there's no point in switching my loyalty royalty from you to tommy and christie because tommy is just as physical as you jackson and they're all also both braided mental competitions like there's just no point. I shook your hand on loyalty. You guys that's what i'm doing. I think that's very logical and good sound reasoning. It's why i think that cliff should stick with jackson and kali and i'm happy to hear vocalized yeah and like it's really true. It's just like switching one situation for an identical one except for now you're pissing off people who shook the hand jury votes exactly and like for a worse position as we've been saying this entire game name like a big part of the reason why cliff is so well regarded in the house in so respected and liked by everyone is because he's a man of his his word. He's a nice guy like he shakes you know he shakes her hand and he makes a deal any sticks through it. He's not seen as a cutthroat dirty player and if if him nicole make this you know this switch. It really really will leave a terrible taste in jackson hollies mouth and it's just not it's not worth it. It's not like a situation where they're they're switching their loyalties to like jess end someone who isn't even in the house anymore assess or something like that like they're the payoff the office not worth the sacrifice there but what i really liked about this conversation from from cliff is that he completely changed the vibe vibe in the room between holly and jackson because right before he came in all ian jackson are are talking about whether or not to go for the next. They still been saying we should maybe throw it. It's not worth going for. It's a little scary. The safe bet would be to just go for it but then we're in a situation where you know like the next the next week and they're talking through it and it still sounds like they're not really sure <hes> <hes> jackson's saying high high risk high reward game for the day and before cliff comes into the room it still sounds like they're on on the on the the plan to not go for the age and then after like almost immediately after cliff leaves the room room. Holly just like turns to jackson is just like okay well. I guess i'm guessing gunning for the h._o._a. Now <hes> so this information about christie he you know alluding to the fact that everyone feels safe with with a jackson in hollywood really does spook them and now the plan basically has changed as a right now. Holly ali is going to try and win this age yes and again. This is this is. This is the faults in my opinion of tommy in christie for pushing for just to stay even that just that little bit that they did that. Basically i think was what prompted cliff cliff in nicole to you know they they were talking which which pair should we side with and right before that conversation and right right around that conversation jackson hollywood like yeah. Tommy and christie were pushing for justice and that's a big push in the direction like they're already a lot of of reasons why it makes sense for them to stick with jackson holly. If tommy and christie don't want to work with you either then that's another huge reason and so in any shot that tommy and christie had of pulling clifford nicole and it's it's really disappearing very quickly and and it's in large part because because of this this effort that they're making to to save jessen from christie's perspective that kind of makes sense but certainly not from tommy's and it's disappointing to see for sure work unless they somehow succeed in which case good good on them so i mean they're really. They're really counting on nicole here and like they. They should really be seeing that the better you know. The better plan for them is to work on this likely scenario aware cliff stays in the house and nicole and cliff are still together and those they need those two people to be loyal to them and instead. They're totally. They're totally going to alienate and eight themselves with the pitch to try to save jess which ultimately i mean anything can happen but i just really can't scenario where they they. They need nicole's vote. Oh what kind of pets are they going to give to all here regardless of whether this works the way that they've gone about. It has been all wrong because they're you're doing both things at once. They are at once telling cliff. I am voting to keep you don't worry about it. We should be wary of jackson holly. They're playing everyone. They are targets and trying to flip jackson holly to keep jess. You can't do both because it would doing both <hes> a sabbath each of them because if you you have to pick one and stick with it and i think what they should've picked was just trying to flip clinical exciting that that was the easier option there and there was actual progress made especially with nicole and i felt like that was possible but when you then go to jackson holly and campaign pain to to just leave it sabotages that effort and at the same time when you're campaigning for justice day and for cliff to leave and you're trying to sabotage cliff hyphen nicole and all of that stuff you're sabotaging that effort by going to cliff in nicole and telling them that jackson hollier playing both sides because you're each thing is sabotaging watching the other with both pairs and you're just looking like you're trying to play everyone who's making look shady and it's putting you in the worst possible position either way you go they. I need to just choose one lane and stick to it but they've already done so much damage by trying to play both at once yeah and i mean it's clear that they can see leave the game slipping away from them because of you know as we've been saying that concern about the fact that you know jackson won this h in the first place ace and neither clever nicole were going up as initial nominees in the first place and these conversations between christie and cliff where yeah she's insinuating. Everyone feels like they're good with jackson holly. They clearly are suspicious of the fact that those cliff in nicole might the in good with jackson and holly. So what are you doing trying to flip jackson in holly against cliff you if that's that's why you're concerned about then you have to be worried about getting back to him and then you're screwed with everyone. No matter who who like is left then you you two are on the bottom so it's it's just they're scrambling and they're trying absolutely every avenue and because like you said because they're trying every avenue. It just makes them look shady's hell no one's gonna trust them going into this and they're going to be the you know the biggest oriented yes and we see this as you mentioned after cliff tells els jackson holly that christie came to him throwing them under the bus saying that they're trying to work with every everyone as soon as cliff leaves. Holly says that's exactly what has frayed of jackson says worst case scenario so much for throwing it. We don't win. We're paul and holly says oh my god christie. I knew in holly holly becomes a bit insufferable here for for the rest of the night she he is going to be constantly making passive aggressive jabs at jackson trying to make it seem like it's jackson's fault that this is happening when she he was the one that wanted to keep christie that whole time she's all. We never should've never should've won that wage. I always knew that this was going to happen like this is exactly what i was worried about like. Okay holly okay. It's like when you when someone fools you and you know you act act like your faults why you see this jackson yeah and it's just becau- because even and before that conversation like that conversation with cliff like i said they were talking about like yeah well i don't know i think that we just have to go with it and we we should probably throw it. It's a little bit risky but this is what this is the play an and immediately it's like oh yeah saw that coming and it's like well you. I mean there are so many different scenarios. You did see it coming but you're totally trying to you know reverse how how this that actually came to be by saying like i knew that this was going to be a thing and we shouldn't have even kept christie in the first place and then <hes> jackson's just like okay yeah well. There's nothing we could have done anyway. Tommy won the veto took christie down like there's literally nothing could have changed in like in the first place so i don't know why you're trying to blame me she. She thinks that like from her perspective she's like oh. You know what tom because. Of course it's can't be tommy's fault. Tommy must have the only turned because you wouldn't throw the veto to jackson that must be he must have been sketched out by that and that's why he turned in jackson's okay but i felt like we had to. I thought we decided decided that it was best for me. I mean you know whatever but probably what it was and then she also talks about this is exactly what i was worried about keeping christie and keeping christie in the game he was like what am i supposed to do the veto. You agreed with these nominations. Now you know yeah it's fine. It's nothing he could have done really why. We shouldn't have chrissy that first time but i thought with that was like what are what are you. What do you want from me holly. She's gone. We're right. It's my it's because of me and when we're wrong it was it's because of you and they're making all of these decisions together. They're equally playing this game together but holly. Does this thing where if something bad happens it's jackson's fall and if something good happens it's it's because her yeah well it because he's like she. I in the last couple of days. She has been like oh. I'm starting to get concerned about tom in christie and so now she feels i called it. That's not how it works. It's not how it works so you need to have been actually like no. I think this is what's happening. You can't just be like well. There's possibly this thing and then possibly this thing and then possibly this thing impossibly this thing and one of those things happen guy. How dare you jackson through not. I knew it they bitten been nervous about cliff nicole to so if that had been the scenario and that happens then they get to say the exact same thing like this is something i said so i knew it ed hall needs to be like oh man. That's that is that's what that's what i was worried about man we do. I was worried that we'd get duped and and we got to jackson is is handling like jackson and actually handling it a lot better being like yep. We're screwed. We're going to have to go for this age. I think we can do now like we made a decision. This is where we're at but holly is really distracting to re write the path of how they themselves there so yes now we are going to take a quick break for our sponsors and we'll be right back and we're back so let's get back to the show so holly is very upset with the whole christie situation. This is what i mean when they feel like christie is there's and now all of a sudden. They felt like like okra christie's. Leaving six plays plays whatever now they're like crap. They figured us out. We shouldn't have have christie and the game tallies. I did not come here to take sixth place to christie f._m. Murphy no way she does not even deserve to be here. She shouldn't even be here. She doesn't deserve it. You know she's she's terrible she. She's the kind of person person she lies all the time. She believes in her own lies. She never sees any fault in herself. Like this is turned into like big time. They are already already bitter about christie very had that conversation about which one between tom and christi should go. I i guarantee they are fully on board with taking christie out at this point because because they do not want to lose to her they can lose to anybody else. Not her not her not. After they fell for her lies they can't do it. Holly is this is sure at this point that christie must think the deal is off because they put her up and that's not how they see it and so they want to make sure that christie goes home before them if they have the opportunity opportunity and this is when pride gets in the way of like smart decision making in a game which we see happen a lot but they're they're just just so you know like her not hurt but like their ego is so bruce that they got duped by christie murphy and that you know they are you know they saved her and that this is gonna come back to bite them in the ass. We all saw coming <hes> and that she should have gone issue. No she's been on the block like four weeks in a arroyo and has shouldn't be here and because they like tommy more. They're going to probably make the more you know prideful move of being like half we well tried to get us while we got you i when in actuality keeping the the feelings they have towards christie in her game. If that's how they feel about it they have to also keep in mind that if she gets to the end there's there might be other people that feel that way too that that she'd maybe doesn't undeserved win against insert whatever person <hes> and that the way that they're talking about. Tommy is important because other people feel that outlay and that is the kind of person that jury is going to give the money to <hes> but i think that just because they're so mad about being flooded by christie see that that's who they're gonna target over tommy when the you know arguably the better game move for them is tommy. Yes speaking of tommy late into the night. Tommy goes out into the backyard by himself to talk to the cameras. He says that there was there was a bit of <hes> like a waiting session here. At night. They were waiting in the hammock. Trying to figure out are trying to to wait the longest and see who can outweigh the others to talk with people and so he says he got out waited tonight cliff in nicole jackson holly they they beat him he couldn't he couldn't wait any longer and he he's he he feels like they. They wanted to have a meeting before with them because he thinks that they have a final four and he needs to break it up somehow because that's really bad for his game if they do. It's he says says you know i. I see what's going on. I see it. I don't know what to do with the information. This game is so hard. It's it's really tough. Th really tough guys i i mean yeah. It's it's tough when you know all your other. Our allies are sitting on the jury and you know the one person you've got left in. This game is is extremely volatile but you've had i don't. I don't cry too much for me here. They'll like he's. He's had a big benefit in this game. <hes> he's got one very loyal number and if he gets to the end with that that person <hes> he's he's probably really going to win this game so <hes> you know i understand the situation he's in and his frustration and he sees everything coming crumbling around him and not knowing how to keep it all together but ultimately like he's had a pretty easy path in this game though i don't feel too bad for tommy tom so so he's he's not sure what to do what to do with this information. He feels like he needs to somehow weasel his way into into this final ford. He says weasels a bad word to break them up. I need seemed to break them up. He says he he knows was he. He sees jackson cliff is the two biggest threats in the house and that's why they probably feel like they need each other and so he sees nicole on hawley just kind of going along for the ride. I felt like this was a big indicator of where tommy's jury vote might lie <hes> and so just last night before he talked with cameras. I was on the roundtable. I was saying i feel like cali is a great shot at beating jackson in the final to in starting to feel a little bit different now especially if tommy sees holly is going along for the ride with jackson. I think tommy is going to be extremely influential in the jury house a lot of people like and respect him so. I think that people like jack were already leaning toward jackson over over hawley. If tommy goes in in there and feels the same way i feel like i feel like even christie might feel that go along with that kind of thought process cysts who was pissed jackson. I feel like with jack and tommy both saying jackson deserves it. I think would take <hes> take their stance and now i'm really starting to feel like change. Those ratings a little bit because i'm starting to feel jackson has a better shot even though he still has a tougher road to the final two raiders remorse here today also like i mentioned earlier earlier when christie was talking about putting holly jackson up together. She says a lot of stuff about holly's playing jackson's game. She's not playing around game so we got a sense raw from christie as well that she doesn't really <hes> you know respect hawley that much and that she sees her whereas like aiding jackson's game so i really do think that despite all of the turmoil of the season between <hes> christian jackson that ultimately if she ends up in the jury she's going to you know be game respects game and you got me and you know hollywood just your you know your minion and i definitely see <hes> christie giving jackson her vote as well so it's really in the situation where the two of them are at the final two together. I yeah i see i see christie giving her about to jackson to police also like men always is beat women and it's it's annoying but well okay. I i i think in a showman situation. Can i have a hard time. Seeing like <unk>. Worthy to people on the final two are showman's. I see very very few situations and where the women wins. This is not a tame aren ricky williams. This is not casey and tyler and you they call him paul and they weren't a showman. Oh yeah okay now since the ball okay nicole ball is a whole other thing but yeah that has been different recent but i just think that picture some of the showman says of the past and i can't see any scenario where the woman is beating the man and it's too bad but <hes> i mean we're seeing it happening live in the house right now where people that are still in there are really not seeing holiest playing her own game and plot is not going to be great and i do think that jackson i think you might have already said this but jackson. I think actually can do really well in final final <hes> final two questioning and have like a really good you know pitch to the jury earlier yesterday nicole and cliff. We're talking about like jackson's access a lot smarter than people give him credit for. He's got this like frat boy. You know risona but you know some conversations with him where he he he knows that jackson is a smart guy and so i really do think that a lot of this house despite some of the ways that he acts sometimes do respect him him and his game and he if he actually get himself there. He's got a really good shot to win this thing so i felt like that was big information that just just the way that tommy views the players and this can change like he can have a certain perspective in the house right now but if he gets to the jury house he might change that perspective because because you're thinking about it more right now he's thinking about it in the sense of how they're playing the game he sees a nicole and holly as being along for the ride but if he goes to the jury house and he starts to think in terms of which one deserves to win he might change his thought process. I don't think there's necessarily locked in place but i do think it definitely gives jackson a bit of a leg up whereas before i felt like got like hollyhead the leg up so tommy is thinking things through and he feels like okay so i need to break up this final four <hes> and and and here's like i am loving what he's saying so far because he is recognizing what's happening. He recognizes that he needs to do something about it and he's he's trying to come up with a plan. I'm like oh. This is good. This is this. Is you know he he caught on. He knows he needs to do something about this but then he says his plan is that he wants to keep jess. That's that's the that's the lane he's trying to go down. That's the that's the road he's trying to to travel on and he says he has a plan for it he. He wants to make jackson doubt cliff things. It's a good plan. He thinks it can work. It's risky but he thinks it can work and i'm okay with that like if you're gonna stick to it like if this is your plan and you're going to ride or die try to get clifford. Victor evicted this week and you go full force only talk to jackson and holly and try to get them to not trust cliff anymore and not go to clifton nicole and try to do the same thing on the other side. At least you're sticking to one thing. I think it's the wrong one. I think he should be working on cliff in nicole but you know go for it and maybe there's a chance you can flip this vote if you if you lied to jackson hall enough and convince them that the cliff nicole eggert somehow doing something shady at least you're sticking to one thing so i'm. I'm not like super super down on this. Even though i feel like there is a better option but the execution has disappointed me in the past and it would not surprise me if it disappoints me again in the future but this this is this is seemingly his plan so far he wants to try and get klickovic did he wants to work on jackson holly. That's what he's going to be doing moving forward the only thing is that like jackson holly are already aware of the other things that <hes> that tommy is the drive because they've already already monday as i said it's already only monday and they're already pushing for justice day <hes> so i think that you know if that had been the initial play. Hey like you said pick one thing and do it even if it's not the right thing but because they're you know they're already aware that those two have been doing work to try to get get cliff out over jess. It's going to be pretty transparent. If tommy kinda switches the plan to try to you know work on on jackson this way okay so i mean if they had got yeah if he'd gone with it from the beginning. That might be a different story but i don't i don't know i think it's already a little poisoned oy and so so that's where tommy stands nicole also talked to the cameras. She was talking about her current position. She mentioned that she wants to stay this week. She doesn't want just to go but she feels like jess would choose christie over her and cliff is her final to ride or die she as of right now does plan on taking cliff to the final to see if they are able to get together. That's that's the plan. She recognizes that there are three pairs heading into next week and that she was hopefully be the people the her in clifton. Hopefully be the people that are not targeted. We've already what is we've always assumed that nicole would cliff the food. She said it a long time ago to the cameras <hes> but i was always have to wonder you know especially during the cat week week when she flipped her vote like is that still in effect it appears that it is she would take lived in the final two and it it does appear that she would lose to cliff here especially the way they tommy is talking about her and the way that other people have talked about cliff. Definitely seems like cliff would have the advantage there. It almost makes me wonder if it is actually the best for cliff to stay this week four nicole because what she talks about is that if cliff goes than her plan would be to just kind of lob onto one of the other pairs as third erred which would work for her hopefully not be targeted in any way and then maybe be able to work your way from there which i do think might earn her some more respect than if she goes with cliff because if she gets to the end with cliff i feel like cliff is gonna take the majority of that credit cliff leaves at this point and she makes it there on her own and then wins the final three h or something along those lines i feel like she might actually have more respect and she might have a better chance against somebody other than cliff like like hawley or or <hes> or even christie so well in this scenario. I mean just stays so what happened. Just because destin chrissy talked at one point and jess was saying that the pitch that she needs to make because they realize nicole is the swing in this situation and that they need to try and get nicole devote out oh cliff and how do they do that and just you know and it's not the stupidest plan because just makes a good point that okay then i like cliffs her final two but then i become her final two and she probably could feel like she has a better chance of beating me than cliff. She could <hes> <hes> but i think you know the issue and this is literally. What nicole says is that as long as justice in the house. Sheesh and christie is also in the house. She's not feeling like she just really houser back like in a scenario where chrissy doesn't exist. I think that nicole feels a lot better better about kind of grabbing <hes> just as a number but christie is too much influence on jus- and nicole doesn't trust christie chrissy and that's not a good situation for her but you know if if something were to change and just to stay over cliff this week that is a better scenario for nicole. If that becomes her you know the the pairs change and now it's nicole unjust but the issue is that christy and tommy have a lot more control over jazz so that isn't actually that great for nicole and less every unless the two sides actually go at each other and her unjust flow flow by that would be her our best path but and and to be clear she can't vote cliff out it would need to happen without her doing that and also it does does make her path to the end much harder. I just feel like i. I'm saying it's not terrible. I think that there is a path there <hes> because her current path i think gets her to the finals more easily but i think that her biggest concern right now is less getting to the final two and more winning a jury vote and sometimes it's best to just get there and hope that the jury might be bitter. You never know what the jury is thinking and in honestly that's probably what i would do. I don't care if i don't have a resume. I don't care what the jury's thinking. If i get to the final two i have odds of winning regardless of anything because you do not know what's happening in that jury. They've been in there for a month at this point and you have zero input from them. There could be thinking literally anything. If you trash your your own game in the hopes of winning the jury over and make things more difficult for yourself win anyway just because you think that the jury will respect that you could be making it harder order for yourself and also somehow making the jury not want to you to win when previously they did so you might as well just take the best and easiest paths to the end and then hope that you've got a chance but there is still something to be said about the idea of of trying to do more things and and tried to have more of of a resume on on you so that you have more of a chance and if nicol wanted to do that i do think that making her way down from the end to the end from here by herself would get her a little more respect but but it would be harder and again i personally it's not how i would go about things but but i don't think it would be the end of the world but for her if the vote did somehow flip and and cliff ended up leaving because i do think that her current path is kind of a not the greatest yeah it just can't be that jackson and holly still want just to go and she decides to side with christy and tommy like. I don't think that that's the right way. It would just if it just happened to fall apart that way and jackson holly changed their minds and it could be like benefit her backwards but is she shouldn't be a swing vote that takes out cliff here. I don't think that that's good for her. Yes i agree all right so that's about what we have for. You unless there's anything else you wanted to bring up jenny. I don't think so. I was just gonna say that always remember when they bring the grill and i feel like they think that it's like like oh. We're going to give them a grill and all this stuff and like a couple of beers and it's gonna make for fun feeds and like it just doesn't like like they were all like laying around like oh. I'm so full like and they each had. Maybe one beer like that's not. I don't know why they they always seem to think that oh like pops. Gonna throw them this big party and they get a barbecue and there's alcohol but it's like never enough alcohol for anyone to actually get it's wrong and instead they drink one beer and like eat hamburgers and then everyone's a flaw so i just think find that funny every year after year. I'm like i i always let's get tricked or i'm like oh. They're giving them a party and then i'm like oh. One beer is not a party. No beers is is a party. I mean the point of giving them. Alcohol is to like make it like oh. Maybe we'll get some like fun conversation out of this circle and like moaned over how full they were for like a couple of our guests. <hes> i p cola in the chat ask. Do we know tommy's. He's big plan to flip the vote. No he did not tell us. He said to the cameras that he had a plan. He thinks it's a good one and it's risky but he didn't tell us what it was apart apart from get jackson to doubt cliff. I assume he has some sort of specific idea of what to say to him but he did not tell us what it was because he's a bad camera talker all right. That's what we have for you. Then you can find me on twitch twitch dot tv slash taryn armstrong talk on there a lot of fun. <hes> it's the easiest way to contact me as well as a montjuich and streaming and you want to ask me questions or something along those lines you can also find me on twitter at armstrong taryn jenny. Where can people find you. I'm on social media at jenny. Autumn on rights and we'll be back of course tomorrow morning at eleven a._m. Eastern to update and everything that happens today on the big brother twenty one feeds and then tomorrow night wait sam smith will be on to recap the wednesday night episode of big brother twenty-one. Thank you so much once again for joining us. We'll see you next time yeah <music>.

christian jackson tommy tom okra christie cliff nicole Holly holly cliff cliff jackson christie cliff Holly nicole christy christiaan tommy cliff jackson holly jackson cliff vic cliff holly jackson christie murphy jess christie chrissy
Guest Host Dr. Holly Hatcher Frazier - We Chat Weight Watchers App, School Bullying and Prioritizing Our Marriages

Take it or Leave it

1:06:14 hr | 1 year ago

Guest Host Dr. Holly Hatcher Frazier - We Chat Weight Watchers App, School Bullying and Prioritizing Our Marriages

"Hello and welcome to take it or leave. It and advice vice is podcast for parents brought to you by grove collaborative. Did you know u._s. Consumers go through around nine hundred million plastic bottles of laundry detergent and a year grow collaborative elaborate online marketplace that delivers all natural home beauty and personal care products directly to you taking the guesswork out of going green pearl limited time when our listeners go to grove dot c._o. Forward slash ticket. They can place an order of twenty dollars or more in. They're going to get a free five piece cleaning set from mrs myers grove. That's a thirty dollar value. That's grove dot dot c._o. Forward slash ticket grove dot c._o. Forward slash take it. You can download this podcast on itunes spotify google play music cast box or wherever you listen to podcasts outcasts be sure to subscribe and give us a review with your thoughts about the show. Thank you too hot mess mosier who said i love this podcast. I found it a couple of months ago in binge the first two seasons i work in a factory and listen while i'm at work. You guys have me laughing so hard that i'm legit crying and all my co workers turn and stare at me and i can't even contain myself enough to tell and what's so funny. Thank you. Thank you hard code. I love that people listen at work. I i just love that people. Listen to me. I kinda always surprise. I kinda feel like at work is a really good place. 'cause maybe you'll enjoy your job more yeah yeah but also you might get fired because mayor is inappropriate. Don't listen to me unless you have ear buds in good call all right. I'm your host meredith from. That's inappropriate and i'm your host tiffany from juggling the jenkins. This podcast will discuss all things marriage motherhood and everything in between please remember not professionals at anything. You may actually need so any advice as we give you you can take or leave because it might be crap on today's episode of take it or leave it. We're gonna talk about weight watchers introducing a new app that is designed and for children. We're gonna talk about. Are we actually doing enough to prevent bullying in schools and in our levin marriage segment. We're going to discuss <hes> <hes>. Do you put your children. Do your children come second in your marriage. Do you put your spouse. I is it even possible. Is that a is it. Yes yes. We're gonna talk all about that sweet. We have a very special guest with us today. A we i would personally and only only liked to welcome dr holly hatcher frazier of the bold and the beautiful and dance moms to the show. I had to put in that bowl in the i was so excited that she was on an episode of the bold and the beautiful. I was talking to her about it beforehand. So now that's part of her title cracking up over here. It would be so. I love it. I can't wait to tell them today. Guess what my insurance. I love of it. I have a ride. Oh my god that's awesome. Stop made my day. Thank you ladies welcome so we generally like to start the show with a mom fail moment just so that people know what they're dealing with like. None of us are perfect. We have no idea <hes> what we're doing and we would love to hear from you. If there's a particular time that stands out in your mind that might be considered a montvale. It's so fine you start off your segments with us because honestly i feel like i have those on a daily basis and i'm thinking oh my gosh what could be what would be a good one. I have so many disused ron but i would say the one that our kids also remind us frequently when we have those failures and they keep me humble by every stretch of immagination but particularly bad one for me was my oldest son had just dropped off to college yesterday. He's going into his junior year and i remember sure it was his junior year in high school. That was signed him up for s._a._t.'s a good mom. I was working remotely n._l._a. He's in pittsburgh and i'm trying to maximize maximize and do everything for everyone and like <hes> can register you for your s._a._t.'s no problem. I'm doing it online and when he goes to take his s._a._t.'s or his form form comes back. He's like my birthday is wrong is wrong birthday s._a._t. Registration for so yeah that was pretty bad he was like how could you imagine this effort yeah. That was that was good. I was like it was just a typo because typo yeah. I mean you were there. You remember for the day very very well because remember very well. That's that's a really important. He he did not appreciate that at all. Took allowed to get that cleared up the that has to be a pain because that's one of those like legit form absolutely and because they check your birthday if the comment and everything has been accordance not like your mom dude up your birthday like really yeah. That's a red flag. That's like your mom should so no no your birthday dude earth born yeah the data major fail job lady while oh now but we all we all do my husband my husband if you ask them right now on the spot what my daughter's birthday as. I don't think he could tell you. Tell me right now honey. What is four five he he. He doesn't know her brothers the other my daughter's birthday's over to four zero five two four zero nine but he always tells me it's the fifth and and it's like no it's not it's the fourth but he doesn't know the month and everything else so we'll give it to him. I figured it's close enough. We all forget our kids names. We call them the other names or the the dogs or the cats absolutely yeah no question each other's name absolutely well. Thank you for sharing your moment with us. Also shout shout out to your son for making it to college. Some of dr holly hatcher frazier asier is an actress known for toddrick hall freaks like me the bold and the beautiful and dance moms. She's been married to evan frazier senior since nineteen ninety andy six. They have three children. Dr holly hatcher fraser. Frazier is a member of lifetime's hit reality show dance moms inspired by her own childhood dance experiences dances. Dr holly enrolled her daughter nia. In the abby. Lee dance studios news love for the performing arts having worked as an educator cater for nearly twenty years. Dr holly served as the director of admissions at the ellis school in pittsburgh pennsylvania and later accepted the position as principal of the winchester thurston school in pinch words her heart so many local won't listen winchester thurston school in pittsburgh a consummate professional unlike me dr holly often received criticism on dance. Moms related to her desire to maintain her career career while supporting me as in. I give up meredith takeover dance aspiration. She made the tough decision to resign from her duties. As principal to embrace motherhood is a full full-time job so many big word and your resume and your bio just continues to go on and on first of all principle uh-huh winchester thurston school reminded me of this is so random but like gilligan's island. Do you remember the character room gilley how thurston how of now all right kid yes. I do remember that. I was like oh my gosh. They have gilligan's silence school in pittsburgh and then i was like no wait. This is legit like this is the real deal. I wish we were on island now. Yeah tab you it had to be really hard doing so many different things and then having <hes> this role a <hes> on dance moms and taking all this flack all this heat because you were still pursuing chasing and doing and dreaming alongside of you've of your daughter so do you wanna absolutely i think one of the hardest things for me and for any mom whether you're working inside that like at home or outside of the home it's being a mom is a full time job. Never stopping a mom. When you step foot out the door you stay inside <unk> doing that. Constantly and one of the things that i found was most traveling us that when i was working as a principle which i absolutely loved and enjoyed immensely the challenging part i would leave the house early six thirty six or seven o'clock and then go in the morning and go to work worked and then you're just shifting gears and i'm working all day they are to five and then i'm running from there to go to the dance studio to film dance moms and it was i was never getting a break and i was also working on my doctor on the same time to finish my dissertation and it was at that point that i realized that something has to give. I can't continue tinubu. This long-term can't sustain. I could do it for a short stint so i did it for a season and a half of the show and after a certain point i was just had to come to terms ahead accommodations my husband my family and just said at we have to make a tough decision and for me it was hard because i worked so for so long to get to that point of being a principal and having it all and being a working mom fulfilling my career and my desire to be in education to get my doctorate and then all of a sudden the put it on a kind of a show on a shell while so we could pursue this other avenir that was was really a dream of me as to be a part of this show which no one expected it to take off like this. I thought oh i've re or two and it's been several well years later but it's something i would do in a heartbea finance my kids if someone had <hes> anyone of them had a g a dream that they want to pursue as what we do as moms you. <hes> you kind of put your kids first and yourself less at that's what you just do and it was. I tried to do it for a long period of time but i think what i showed my kids was is really the fundamentals of what it means to work hard and not get discouraged to take 'em challenges adversity rise above and not feel as though you're given up and even when i decided to resign from my position it wasn't because resigned under like negative circumstances. It was just the right timing for our family. I wanted to but my family. I at that point rather than saying okay. I have to do this because of appearances and i don't failure. I don't want people to think that i can't do it all because i think sometimes moms you feel like you have cape in this s on your chest like superhero mom. No i think what you wanna do is be the best mom and invest best person you can be in for me for holly was individual decision. I couldn't do everything at the same time. I had really hit the wall and like i can't do everything inside. I just made a personal choice up all of my priorities. What was my greatest priority at that time and so i was fortunate that was able to stop working at that time at the school that i'm still working by was working right for dance. Moms sell <unk> in such a vast grier change. You know i mean like because your principle it like a principal i mean i guess you're on dance. Moms you're definitely wrangling wrangling people to use the same skill sets. I was gonna say yeah. I use the same at the school weather <unk> with kids orb orb. Appearance are my faculty. I still use a lot of the same things i would have a communicate and deal with conflict and resolve them. They came in handy. I used a lot of it at those techniques. I just think that they probably have a different level of prestige. People like when you tell people also on a reality tv show oh versus all i'm a principal people have a different way of looking at you. That's bad <unk> public appearance perception of your career. I mean also filling out your any application when they ask you who your employer is. I mean some things definitely look more professional than others mean right. Educator sounds better than reality tv but i'm sure that it provided a springboard into all kinds of other new opportunities though for you right on my gosh absolutely there i am so thankful and so feel so blessed and fortunate to have been a part are of dance moms as original cast member to say that was there from season one ended be part of an incredible cast the people the moms tom the daughters the teachers the production crew just to be a part of that entire experience. I really do think the cast past at as well as the crew they <hes> engaged with israel <unk>. Young people for better for worse also were watching the show because they loved the girls. I think the girls <unk> america fell in love with and the way that we use social media interact with our financial by tweeting with them. It was just an incredible experience in pop culture phenomenon that no one could have predicted like i didn't know is going to be this this incredible henry and did it just kind of took off a who would watch this t._v. Show about a dance studio in pittsburgh to me. That was the most ludicrous thing here is really going to be a t._v. Show and someone's going to watch it and low behold. You have marathons and so on and hunt hundreds of countries. Ah over what was that it was an alien abduction. Did they take her away. They did and they're like. We don't want anyone to know what countries were seriously does. She have do have to get her back. She's so smart and eloquent and i have so many questions. So how about that weather guy super super humid today. I shouldn't have got started on the weather. I was walking the dogs earlier and boy. Oh boy don't say boy. Oh boy oh boy. Oh boy capping you the heat. It just sucked the soul from my body <hes> yeah i don't why were those words so hard. They were some big ones in there. Are you got consummate good. I was waiting to see if you got consummate right but i messed up the the you know. I was like the what and dude i've been. There's all time out in like sania say nia and then i came to the word i was like nine. In which was i not supposed to have you sat right but yeah <hes> that show was a big piece of pop culture or is what a cool message man like for people so whatever i was gonna say this but i'll just say it now. I don't know whatever <music> but like. I remember when i had kids like my choices because i was a stay at home. Mom and i was like i'll just wait until you get back. Oh now i love how people are commenting commenting now in here. Meredith is so old guys. Stop seriously. I just s- pleased all stop. I'm just i'm not really that old. I just i'm all right. I'm ninety seven. I'm benjamin button bench but they did. You just get that healthy plant based nontoxic cleaning products work and the good ones are actually more enjoyable to us. But where do you start and who do you you trust death. They're the worst that's where grove collaborative comes in with grove. You don't have to shop multiple stores or search endlessly online to get all the natural goods union for you and your family. Hey tiffany. What's your favorite thing about grove. My favorite thing about grove is <hes> <hes> the little okay so they send you like glass bottles with concentrated cleaner and you get to like make your own cleaning spray like a real scientist and i love that whatever let me live my live. Do you wear the white coat when you mix it. Wednesdays okay join us in over half a million families who trust grove claver to make their home happier and healthier for a limited time when our listeners go to grove dot c._o. Forward slash take it and place a twenty dollar order or more. They're going to get a free five piece cleaning set from mrs myers and grow. That's a thirty dollar value. Plus shipping is fast and free on your first order. That's grove dot c._o. Forward slash ticket grove dot c._o. Forward slash ticket out that was so beautiful do do we have her back. I think holly is bad guy here a ding dong there you are i. I thought you were abducted by aliens and then we thought maybe people didn't want you to come on the show because they didn't want us to know what countries dance moms was in and we he guessed. I thought you were sick of our crap. Yeah no no no never never ever ever so what i wanted to say before we cut off. Is that <hes> <hes> when i was a mom i still am in my former life. It wasn't upon a time but when my kids were young. I thought okay this is all there is to me now. I am just a mother. I forgot who i was. I lost my identity. I was isolating in my house and depressed and to hear about somebody like you who had these three incredible do things to choose from never lost sight of who she was and was able to be a wonderful mother and not lose her sight of her dreams. I think that's an amazing message for for people who are in a slump and feel lost. I think you're absolutely right. I think moms you sometimes get into her. Any just go. It's like happened happened so fast and you just are so volve with your routine. You just keep going before he now a year has passed and for me. It was one of the things i wanted to show. My kids leads that even the other like. Why are you going back to school because it was a dream of mine to have a doctorate like i always was a goal bucket list. I wanted to do it. I i would be a professional student. If i could afford to be so for me. That was something i very much wanted to do and when i made that change from working full time at school and then going to work full time for dance moms it's something else i was good for my kids to see that you're never too old to try some now at entice something thank completely out of your landscape or you're like how you see yourself and i tell my kids to like part of your journey as as a person is fluid not always be the same person that she think you're you're always evolving. I didn't was in born in mother like look i. I was born in new york. I was a new yorker and now i live in pittsburgh now and my mom and teacher but lots of things that you have these different hats. That's a to wear you take them on and off and kinda fluid and you add on these different identities and he figure things out and then also informed decisions than you. Kinda workin can change in your attitudes. I mean this a core part of your personality and who you are but then you become so much more than that and you wanna push yourself to do things like it. Neither told me twenty years ago it would be a dance. Mom and i would be on reality t._v. or t._b. A any type out of lack at you that is so against any brabourne upon personality and i'm just so proud that i was able to be a part of something like that and to take a risk and not be afraid of the unknown it i. I think that's fantastic. I where can we follow. Where can everybody follow you and follow this journey. Oh my gosh all of my social. Media handles handles are for the most part for twitter and instagram. It's very original dance. Mom holly they are dance. Mom holly the app and then facebook. It's dr holly hatcher frazier and you wrote a book as well right moments of clarity i did. I woke up book in the middle <music> of my dance moms rear at some point people had said you should write something and then it's funny because i said i was gonna write a book at one year and i like halfway through the year my husband's house coming along tumor what you said you're writing a book. My gosh suit and he took that seriously my all this book so i quickly scrambled <unk>. Going nitty does insist like mount like just a lot of times people like some of the expressions i would say on the shows. I just use some of my expression side. I would say frequently in my life but they really come from my mother like a lot of things i say are elements of something my mother guerin hatcher his told me some point in my life roles of wisdom and my mom because i think she's like such such an amazing role model woman she has so much knowledge and just understanding people in life and so much of what she says sometimes it sounds like oh my gosh that can't happen and then all of a sudden oh my gosh she was frightened. How does that happen but so i use a. I would say a lot of things that came from her lips. I would just repeat them when people got kicked out of them. I think it's a night but it's like. I love books that i can read in like digestible bites. Yeah you know what i mean like. You can just kinda like nibble as you go and it doesn't have to be this big deep. Stop it. Oh my god no but that's just i think as moms too because we lack time and the inability to get to do the things that we want to do all the time because we're busy raising kids and working and all of this when i do sit down with a book i like i. I like quick quick stuff. Do you know what i mean like to flip and i like to go through and i get what you're saying. You know what i mean. I call them during bulletin tasha asia book. I feel very accomplished. Yeah me too me too all right. Well make sure that you check out on those socials. She provided will include them in the description of the podcasts at thing but she's going to hang out with us for a little bit while we talk about other parenting news. Today's trending parenting news is brought to you by grove collaborative meredith. Gosh does that mean. It's time for your job and holly yes. How do you make a tissue sudan's. I know that of course you deal but you put in it. Oh my smart smart for the first time jokes ever been guest. Yes on my gosh mostly because i don't listen to her jokes. Expect no just kidding. They're usually that's great. Thank you oh my gosh to seventy percent of people say they want to use natural products but but only two percent do why because what they sell at the stores from the biggest companies not necessarily the ones that are best for you. So where do you start introducing and grow collaborative join us over half a million families who trust grow collaborative to make their homes happier and healthier for limited time when our listeners go to grove dot c._o. Oh slash take it and place an order of twenty dollars or more you will get a free five piece cleaning set from miss myers and grove of thirty dollar value plus shipping is fast and and free on your first order. That's grove dot c._o. Slash ticket all right so today and trending news. I thought this would be a really good one to to go over with dr holly because of her role in dance. Moms and i thought she might have a very unique perspective so when i saw this in trending news i wanted to save it for this episode. I was wondering doing what the connection was but i think i see. Where do you see where i'm going. Okay so weight. Watchers is eyeing a new set of clientele and that is children. There is a new app app that weight watchers has introduced and it. It's called so weight watchers now calls itself w._w. Which this week introduced a new app app called curb o which is to help kids ages eight to seventeen reach a healthier weight they <hes> they debuted this. This app is a digital health start up. Who's system was based on stanford university's pediatric obesity program adolescents track their food and curb does free <hes> free app a- green yellow or red light grades what and how much of the food they eat they then we're able to consult a digital coach which starts starts at sixty nine dollars a month. Now weight watchers has taken a lot of heat and also seen a lot of praise for this app and and i thought that we could maybe discuss how we feel about it what our thoughts are on it because i have some. I know i know. Tiffany has some and i would assume you have some thoughts here on this dr holly. So why don't we start with you. What do you think about weight watchers introducing an app that is geared toward children ages eight to seventeen wowed. It was funny. I did not know that until i religious namic wow okay so this is it's so complicated so here's my initial initial about my initial. <hes> i am a weight watcher. I love weight watchers. After my third kid i joined it and i had tremendous success with weight watchers so i'm a big believer in the program <hes> but i also wasn't adult when i did it and a mother of three and and as a mom sue conflicted as an educator and as a mom so there's so many things that went through my mind so my initial reaction to who is like a here the sixty nine dollars a month price tag and that gives me like i guess 'cause that's a lot of money and i think it also just it intends to price tag attached to something with kids. I worry about that because it creates a greater divide for the haves and the have-nots and as pablo matic for me <hes> so i hate to see opportunities that could be good for kids or any <unk> kissing left out because of such a sixty nine dollars was a lotta money among <hes> so that is one like initial join factor as teacher in maurice thinking about. Can we do this activity. Give your not who can do it who cannot because it's eliminate a certain number of children because they're not going to be able to afford to be able to do it so that's my initial reaction. Just on a cost i <hes> just the cost of it and the other part of the two is i struggle with. I go back and for because as a mom educate. I think kids should be educated as far as nutrition. I think there are elements of good nutrition. Not necessarily about i'll wait but what does it mean to have this attitude of wellness and how to have a healthy lifestyle so it's not just about food. It's about not good and bad food but thinking about what are you taking into your body. What do you like what's clean food. What's good for your body as well as working out and keeping your body healthy and having a healthy lifestyle and i think if you can give kids the tools goals in which to do that at a young age that hopefully long term they have lifelong skills that will help them so they aren't obese that they don't have to join join necessarily a weight watchers wonder forty years old said really good habits and ways of thinking about food and lifestyle. That would be really good for them. <hes> at the same time i also know that kids in adolescent stages as are thinking about things in china fit in. I don't want to reinforce this image of what's that's a perfect body. What society tells them to as images don't see someone that looks like them. That's if you're not this. You're you're not beautiful so i don't want kids think they have to fit us or mole to be considered beautiful healthy because healthy bodies and frames look very different and i just would like for kids to see a broader perspective and i don't know how it's rolled out. Our howitt's introduced. There's a great possibility for positive ositive messaging in the way that supply also know the adolescent sometimes with body image issues in continue to away. That may not happy as healthy so i said let me interrupt you. Let me interrupt you there because i love everything that you had to say about this. So what if i told you when you sign up for curb oh oh which is the app you enter your name height weight and gender and then you choose your goal which you're here your goals eat healthier lose weight. Make my parents happy get stronger and fitter have more energy boost my confidence or feel better in my clothing mm-hmm so personally some of these are great and others made me want to crawl out of my skin exactly the same reaction like i literally when i read make my parents happier. My body convulsed made me so angry because because so many kids especially during this stage age in life can start to develop these body issues and they can have have such a problem when it comes to food and what they are putting into their bodies and for me. It was like wait skirt. Hold on this has to be do. Do you think it's a way for them to find out whether or not the person doing the app is only doing it because their parents made them i th i think that it's a legitimate concern that that ah you know i think some people are putting pressure on to their kids and you know and telling them like if you were skinny you'd be happier and like like i'm positive there are parents out there that are saying that absolutely and i can tell you that <hes> that there that it makes me sad that the app. I don't know what they're using it to identify them as but i can tell you that it's definitely identified a marker and maybe that too do like if you click something they can actually use it as the sound like to say you need further counseling or something like that i would hope by huts it just hearing that makes makes the ashok that is appalling but i think there are families that are it. It is like that and i think that kids are under tremendous pressure. Not just you know society but i think in their own homes. They're feeling that pressure and there's so few. Do you think that kids can control that can control their food and their homework that you can't make kids like ultimately theirself things in life. The kids can't control and they can control what they don't what they eat and what they doni and it can control whether they do homework or not. You can actually do homework and i love yes. I'm sorry to interrupt you you but i love what you had to say as well about the haves and have nots with having such a big price tag on this for a monthly app because it's optional right. That's if you want to consult with the coach right so oh but here's the thing and you know i'm a former educator. Dr holly is a is a extremely intelligent and well decorated former educator with a master's and a doctorate and everything under the sun but what i can tell you as a former teacher a lot of our kids as well are fed two meals a day breakfast justin lunch and that's because the schools provide those meals and those meals are based on a two thousand calorie diet which means the schools have to pack two thousand calories in two meals a day that these kids careening and they're not necessarily the best food choice for them but they have to give them those amount of calories because when they go home they might not be fed so there's a whole other problem problem that systemic that comes into play here that leads to potential childhood obesity and other issues childhood type two diabetes and and other things that come in that were we don't even have time to to because i'm getting exacerbated already but it makes me upset because but listen end there's more but what what really gets me is when you and you're right dr holly if the parents aren't teaching them what is a nutritious food and to get out and exercise because it's like you know you you can you can <hes> play on a free sports team. If that's something that's in your in your town the area or you can spend that sixty nine dollars a month on on a on a tee ball aura a basketball registration or whatever and get your kids out there. Get them playing. Make sure they're moving. Having you know like there's so many things that we could be doing for our kids and making them telling them that they need to be thin is not one of them telling them that they need to be healthy telling them that it should make good choices because moving forward they don't wanna grow up and have heart disease and we'll beatty's. Can i say something really quickly. Sorry i just that's okay. I probably probably have an unpopular opinion but when i was a kid i was a latchkey kid so my parents were gone all the time. I was by myself so it was free reign. I could eat and drink whatever the heck heck. I wanted to and i had no idea what nutrition was. My parents weren't necessarily nutrition experts either they weren't you know so if if there was something out there if i was interested in changing but didn't know how to go about it and there was an app that could keep me accountable and helped me <music> set goals and stuff like that. I probably would have been interested in it now. Years eight years old is a little young. You know what i mean but also like here's the deal if somebody's can spend their time on an app where they shoot other people they spend their time on an app where they just watch videos of other people opening slime or they can have an app where they learn about nutrition and set goals. I don't think it's horrendous. I think it depends on the kid. Did you know you know your kid. You know their habits. You know what you're what it's like. If you have a kid who is obese who won't listen to you maybe trying an app been having them see for themselves wouldn't be so bad. I i'm popular yeah. I don't think that's i think that he's about to think that no no no. I think he made a lot of good points with that but i also think once again the the your point hinges on parent parental involvement with a parent who is loving and says hey. Let's do this together. Let's talk about making good choices. Let's talk about nutrition. Let's talk about why it's important that we get out and we exercise thirty to sixty minutes a day and unfortunately <music> okay but imagine as a teenager your mom coming in your room and sitting on your bed and being like hey buddy. Let's go around the block together. You like mom get the hell out of my oh my gosh gosh i make my kid go to the gym with me morning before school. You have a great kid though but i do that but we're also but <hes> but i i we're we're big into exercise and were big into we made a huge health shift in our home a couple of years back and so it's been a big focus in our house and but it's not like but our kids still have ice cream and popcorn corn and because i believe in moderation and we believe that you if you take something away and you call it a cheat then demonize it so we don't say we're gonna ah cheat and eat this. We say let's have ice cream because it's saturday night and we're going to sit in front of the t._v. And watch movies in the ice cream so i think it's all about that. Your approach is well. You know what i mean but i agree. I think it made some good points tiffany that that if if we can have an app that is teaching our kids the right way way to do things then yeah okay but i think that there are some definite problems with this app yeah number one. I wanna make my parents happy and love me and if i'm skinny they will. There's there's gotta be more. I hope so. I hope so i hope so yeah helped to anything else to add. I think we i mean we could do. We could do web years podcast on this because i think that there's so many different ways that this could go off <hes> but i just want people to love their kids love of your kids exactly as they are and if they if they have a problem and it's related to food or diet or a an issue like that talk with them and talk with your doctor and you know make it fun and make it you know my husband gets the kids in the kitchen and they cook with him on the nights that he cooks dinner. My youngest son who's eight. He loves to go in and chop vegetables cook with dad and i know that not everybody has time at night to sit and cook with their kids. I get that believe me i do but it's it's caused our kids to eat a ton more vegetables because it's like i made this now. He spit out brussel sprouts. I can't make the kid item. He tells me they taste like farts but but it's introduced a lot of things i'm just saying and as an ex p._e. Coach i love how you throw that out. Every i loved i loved former former dodge ball champion correct. I like to say i just think it's great if we could talk to our kids about making healthy eating choices as well as being active because you know oh my love for dodgeball yes true which next let's see well you're gonna move onto parenting eighteen crap which is brought to you by fab that subscription boxes fab fun is a women's lifestyle subscription box filled with full-size premium beauty lifestyle fitness home and wellness products addicts customized to your specific interest delivered straight to your doorstep each season use coupon code. Take it which one word t. a. k. e. i._t. For ten dollars off your first i box at w._w._w. Dot dunn dot com your phone partner. You doctor yes. I am okay. Oh i got nervous because i was like i've seen her. I've seen her in boxing. I thought so too yeah describing gosh. I wonder what's my next box. You like the favorite thing that you've customized all my gosh orchids. So many things like i love the swell bottle that i got a mum owes. Oh so good what is so wonderful and then some other tweets things. I just discovered like all like there was like pot ever heard the ponds i- moisturizing cream reminded me of my grandmother who swore by that she had read skin so there's things about it that you just find little no no surprises then also things are just like ally love this in yeah. It's really cool. Yeah always just like you get a little holidays like a little the present myself so fun though because you you also never know what you're going to get even the fact that you can customize are still going to be things in there that you're like. Oh my gosh i've seen this before and i always wanted to try it and not to necessarily splurge on it because like what a nice bonus yeah so yes. I'm a big believer on those boxes. Make sure dave that you invoice fep fund and extra your fifty dollars for that added. Promise okay parenting crab all all right. Let's see so since it's back to school. I thought we could talk a little bit because people are always asking about our take on or what we do or how we combat or how we handle bullying and so there is this article that was trending recently says. Are we doing enough to prevent bullying in schools well. There's no federal laws against bullying but most states and school districts do have policies against aggressive behavior but what should we be doing actually to combat it or how should we be dealing with it because it says about twenty percent of students or one in five report being bullied at school and i know as a former educator cater <hes> absolutely that bullying happens <hes> you know were. We bullied twenty years ago thirty years ago forty years ago fifty years ago in school absolutely yes but i think the thing that is different. Today is the fact that these kids are bullied in school. Social media's the through cyber bullying and it just doesn't there's no break from the bullying. Do you know what i mean like the worst when you when used to get bullied when we were in school back in the olden days tiffany because tiffany says i'm so old back in the olden days you can get crank phone call where they would call and hang up but that was as far as the bullying outside of school could go really because they now you can get hit on your whippersnappers doing these days the tick tock yes the snap chat. I don't have any of these accounts by the way but tiffany does the five years apart. I know get somehow. There's a huge divide ride because what you're gonna make a joke about how old i am. I was but <hes> so what do you think about what do you think about bullying in schools. Do you think schools are doing enough enough. Do you think that it's just an epidemic and you know. Is there a handle on it as they're not. What are your thoughts on bullying because it's obviously it's one in five or reporting it. It's probably more more than that because they say most kids don't even report being bullied. I think schools are not doing enough absolutely not and you know it's it's. It's sad because i i think they're look bullying has happened since since we've known it and i think people will will. I like well. I was bullying schools as part of life but the world owners changed significantly and the stakes are higher and the way that kids respond and react to bullying definitely is not the same as when we're can't as as well and i think we also have more knowledge now and because we have more knowledge. There's more that we can do to combat bullying. I think there needs to be more professional development meant for faculty <hes> as well as students and by sanders and they're so much that can be done saying. Oh it's it's happened before it's the light it doesn't have to be and the fact that there are no federal laws against it just almost enables and empowers and says it's okay and it's not okay and for me. One of the things that i found astounding bullies gonna do things where they know. Adults are going to see it like they don't usually do out in the open. Adults can be found and can be seen so. I think the more that we empower other kids when they do see bullying happened to be supportive to speak up not to be a passive bystander. The research shows that the bully usually stops of mostly for aid to say anything because they don't want to be the one who's being bullied but if everyone does something or speaks up their strength in numbers bullies not going to do is not going to react in attack everybody in the school and that way i think we need to do be more empathetic and teach our kids more about empathy and just being more responsible responsible as a society rather than just turning looking the other way interest breathing a sigh of relief. That's not chew right. We just had we. We just had a viewer comment and they said if we if we taught mayor maryland i think it was said if we teach our children empathy and what it means to be empathetic beings we would have less bullying because they would understand and i think that that's that hit the nail on the head and you had just touched on it before we said that because i it was hard for me to be empathetic to parents prior to having children of my own because i think part of empathy is understanding it and going through because you went through it so i think with these kids i don't really know i think we just have to do a better job as parents to teach empathy i think that's hard i think sometimes tarred to teach kids how to be empathetic static and i think that's probably why you see a lot of that at that age. Maybe i don't know my rambling here but do you know what i mean like. How do you teach empathy it. Can't how do we i think i think it is hard to teach but i think there are elements of it as a schools appearance what it means to think have compassion and to think about other's feelings and one of the things i was at a winchester thurston was i also have the comforts in rights of others that was so much much a motto of the school framework in which that we've worked like it's not just about you but it's about how others in your surrounding might feel oh so just having that line set switches things in a way that you approach life and that you think about other people not just yourself. It's hard hard but it can be done yeah yeah. I think you're right. I think it's i think it's one of those things that you have to be proactive about teaching and it has to be the forethought like cure like were you know and and i always have to be attention on anti-national. That's the word i was looking for. You do need to be intentional and and it's okay i think to say hey look look. We need talk about empathy and we need to talk about what it's like to be <hes> to care about others and why that's important <hes> we were just talking about today. There was a radio d._j. This morning corning was <hes> they were they were giving themselves personal ratings based on their physical appearance their personality their favorite physical attributes attribute of themselves and their humor and they were rating them and then coming up with an average score for themselves and my daughter looks at me and she goes why they rating how they think they look or how they think their personality is and i said i don't know honey. It's just it's just something. It's just something that they're doing. It's silly and she goes yeah. It does sound silly and i said. Do you know how i'd like. I said first of all. I think you're all tends. This is what i said to my kids and my daughter goes well. That's because your mom and and i go yes but i said if you ask me my true opinion about this if we were going to rate ourselves how i want you to rate you is how big is your heart. How how are you to others. How how do how do we treat others. These are the things that i want you to rate on because how you look your best physical attribute. It doesn't mean anything it's how we treat each other and how much we love each other and what we would do for others. That's what makes you attend and you know. Of course my kids are normal kids heads and so my daughter is like i know my son's like you're not attend euro one and i'm like oh my god the united states each other john and i'm screaming into the back right right and then i'm screaming make good choices and kicking him out of the van but i think it's i think it's i think it's really hard because it's prevalent in our schools school systems. Actually actually there are cities across the country now that are proposing their own regulations to combat bullying by charging a fine when a student is being and when a student is being labeled a bully in school. They're bringing the parents in the student in and they're charging fines. One county is charging three hundred thirteen thirteen dollar fee to bullies love it. They're saying this. There's a bill that came into existence. After a student writing notes urged a seventh greater to kill themselves online this school district in wisconsin proposed this this fine and they say if you're caught bullying and other child in written form on social media at school in any way shape or form we can find your parents and you pay the school up to author three hundred thirteen dollars a love that so there are what i'm saying is there. There are other things outside of federal law. These counties and cities are taking it into their own hands and they're saying yes. We have to stop this. It's a problem if the federal government isn't going to help us out here. We'll do things on our own. I mean i can't even yeah it's crazy so agreed. Do you have anything else. Nope you guys covered mischief. She's like yeah. I just thinking about all the kids. I'm going to have to lock in my trunk bullying well. That's the thing as a parent you. John want to see your kid. Go through it. It's heartbreaking and i've watched my kids. Go through it and it's there's a parent it's hard. That's really hard appear to watch your child. Go through it and your kid was yeah yeah was. She bullied while on the show online. I'm sure every thing because everybody is a and saw and people are like oh. Your life is perfect. You have this going on on and like but now they're. She's a regular kid like everybody else. She is faced that in some ways it's in a very public domain so like it's very painful to watch watch and to see that happen to your child. And what do you like. What kind of tools do you get them to be resilient as in face now now okay now tiffany admitting to locking kids in trunk in trunks and teasing them. Oh my gosh probably have crossed the minds appearance because what's right course my kid. My kid was pants in fifth grade by a girl on the <hes> on the playground he was and he didn't tell the teacher either. Another kid who saw it went and told the teacher and i remember asking him about it and he didn't want to didn't want to talk about it. He was so embarrassed and then the teacher called me and they asked me they were like what what do you want us to do and i was like you know. I have faith eight. You guys will deal with this appropriately. I'm glad that it's being dealt with. I will talk to my child because they were like. Do you wanna meet with the other parent and i was like. I don't think that's a good idea. I think that my feelings are very raw and i'm a very loud and person and i was not feeling super empathetic at that moment so it was like you can deal with that other parent erin. Please know that i will be speaking with my child about what happened and i was happy. I was happy that he didn't retaliate obviously but i was unhappy that he didn't tell me so then we talked about hey bud like and he was really embarrassed because it was from a girl so there is an issue you know but yeah but i've but i've had that happen and and you know it is hard because i i and that moment i definitely feeling like tiffany like do i have to kick a kid but you can right like you can't kick other people's children so you can't now up all the time like that. Somebody else's child like when somebody hurts your child in some way and i'm like okay but that is a kid so holly like okay but you know free so as a kid so you have to talk yourself off the ledge by as is a mom. Your instinct is to protect your children. A mama bear comes out of course yeah and i thought it was. I was proud of myself for knowing that in that moment 'cause when and she said do you want to come in and meet with the other parent. All of me was like yes. Tell her what's wrong with her kid and i was proud of myself for being like not a good idea. <hes> you know yourself well enough to know this won't end well and so i did and so i feel like i made the right there but yeah what's the matter are stop terrible. Let's not talk about that all right so moving on. What are we got next. Tiffany marriage love and marriage is is brought to you by grove collaborative seventy percent of the people say they want to use natural products but only two percent do why because that's what they sell at the store bruce. Why can't we re word because what they sell. The store is from the biggest companies not necessarily the ones that are best for you. So where do you start. Introducing traducing grove collaborative join us in over half a million families who trust grow collaborative to make their homes happier and healthier for a limited time when our listeners go to grove dot c._o. Slash i'm so sorry taken yeah and place an order of twenty dollars or more you will get. I'm gonna fire me. You're going to get a free five piece cleaning set for mrs mrs myers and grove. That's a thirty dollar value plus shipping as fast and free on your first order so make sure to head over and go to grow dot c._o. Forward slash take it. That's grove dot c._o. Uh-huh forward slash take it to get this exclusive order from offer order frank look at us just being so good at reading reading today hurts. I know you're hurts. Do you wanna talk about that instead of this last segment or what do you kind of want to talk about it. She is a doctor doctor but i don't think that she's the type of doctor that deals with this but do you know about but abscesses. Okay all right. We'll move on. I'm not a real doctor. My kids tell me all the real urban like that man. I would throw my degree at their faces once again. We're back to hidden kicking kids throwing all right so this is a hotly debated topic and i'm sure it's been debated since anybody was having children <hes> but this this article was trending recently that said why my children will always come second to my marriage and and so i basically read this article and then i base i thought we could talk about it and say is it possible for your kids to come second. Do people do this. Is this something that we should it'd be doing. We should not be doing what our thoughts on putting our spouse i and our children second because if we're being honest what does that mean to put your spouse. I so so what does that mean to put your spouse. I there you go so it <hes>. Do you know i curry yeah. I know right so she's she took some heat for this when she made headlines for talking about it <hes> a couple years back where she said the reason that i feel like my marriage is super successful is because we put put each other i even before the kids and it sounds tough and it is but it's necessary for your marriage in order to survive and she talked about date nights in getaways and taking trips and talking with their talking with her spouse about every decision whether it was marriage <hes> or or parenthood or what they were doing and i think it's i think it's widely debated because a lot of people say how am i supposed to put my marriage. I if i can't if we can't do date nights. How am i supposed to put my marriage. I if there's never a chance for a getaway how much was put my marriage. I if i'm a stay at home parent and all i do is deal with my kids all the time. So what do you think about this dr holly. I think it is lovely idea and very good. I think in theory it's so beautiful idea. It's the thing you would tell your kids as they're getting older like test-fire to in reality just i don't know i'm just like a regular mom regular rice. I don't see that happening. I mean i'd like to say it does but i think when you have little ones or not so little ones sounds like a they're not adults. They need someone to help them. Whereas your spouse is an adult and they probably function ardito alrighty armed anna but i mean as i said maybe maybe is it like hey did. You have to make your own dinner tonight. Mommy me and daddy. You're making out like what does it mean wow. I don't know what it means to put your spouse for. I think there's as children it's fluid. Mom and dad are going to tongue on kiss like growth. Well you gotta put your but i think what you were saying is true. I think everything has its seat has a season so i can tell you that i absolutely did not put my husband. I want any of my children. Were running around in diapers or being potty trained. That's where i'm girl the not even not even and i know he was jealous and he acted out although he was an adult he acted out and get like snotty with me and then i would get snotty back and it was because we definitely weren't spending any type of quality time but it's like when you're in the trenches of parenthood and you've got kids crapping crapping on the floor. How're you supposed to put anything before that like i gotta because you're literally cleaning poop off of survival mode. It's this is your survival now. It's different and so i'm in. I feel like we're in a different season on this call so i think that's great because tiffany is still in the trenches is is everybody potty trained a your house tiffany. <hes> mostly pretty much right chloe was the last one and she's doing pretty good yeah unless it's nighttime nighttime that doesn't account so pissed the beds and okay but i'm in that second phase right because i have a eighth grader a fifth grader and a third grader so so i'm kind of in that second stage where everybody is pretty much self sufficient but i'm still frequently breaking up fights and there's a lot of yelling and a lot of <hes> negotiating and a lot of <hes> take this kid to this sport and this kid to that and you got to go do this and did you sign up some whatever and your in this next phase now because you said you have just three kids to drill right college-aged college age and what you're what are your and onto high-schoolers high schoolers. Yes junior senior in high school and then a junior in college. Okay i was trying to make it look like a new stuff now. You will know your doesn't get your first. Son is super tall right. He's huge. He's like six to me. She's like six two six two six three combat. That's pretty tall yeah. He is the shortest one in the family. She's five five. Are you seeing this song yeah. That's actually that's five. I five is actually above average height for female teller. Yeah it is actually five. Four is i'll tell you i am told me shut the front door. I knew that we man tall yeah. You are a very tall woman your family. Though was you've met. We didn't so you guys have a relationship behind my back. I don't even know about that. One time that we met yeah yeah i brought out one time. She doesn't remember. She's trying to be nice meredith she he doesn't remember me. Yes i know i told her that but she's like <hes> you didn't actually meet her and i was legitimately met the woman and her our family but okay cool but yeah so anyway i feel like when the seasons change so then things come up but we we were just my husband and i were just talking. We haven't even really recently taken a trip without our kids in years. We always like we always please have our kids. There's never is like this getaway moment even when you're when you're moving on. I bet you and your husband could do that now. I don't know if you do but you could leave we could and now it's easier to do that now. As long as we have ideas like okay can't leave the house unattended with teenagers here but ah where could we like what we could do like small getaway and we feel better about doing that staycationing you. Could you could get a hotel in the same town still be keeping tabs but still kind of have but we'll put hidden cameras in your house before you go right yeah so let's not go no no wild parties while regarding anniversary is coming up. We're already planning like okay for our twenty fifth anniversary. We're gonna trip just the two of us so thinking about that. So i do think it's hard. I think the theory of it sounds wonderful and it's like it's going to be amazing and everything is going to be great. I'm bob but then the the reality hits and those moments like there was one weekend where i was l._a. My husband was here and my oldest in college. Login nieto's and coachella and my youngest was home. He ended up staying with a friend for the weekend avin flew out to l._a. Just like foreign like forty eight hours. It wasn't even like a full full weekend and we just kind of made that time just like okay. We're gonna steal this moment. You just have to take those moments when they happen. Yeah agreed agreed. Oh jeez louise. My husband was just like i always put my wife first in line to me. The points good now. My husband is actually <hes> he's a great gift giver and he's very considerate <hes> but he also leaves the toilet it up so i fall into <hes> toilet water <hes> quite frequently in the middle of the night and then scream at him. He's he's much better than i when it comes to a a lot of those things but i think you also have to. I think a good marriage is marrying. Probably your polar opposite because we're so different we balance each other out like i couldn't marry me. That would be awful. He'll vouch for that right but like. I also feel like i do things for him. I'll think of some at some point that are beneficial so you know you got to balance it out and we're actually going. We're actually going on our anniversary. We are going away. No kids cool so that is going to happen and that will be sixteen year anniversary a the next october this october. You're with me leaving them a tiffany. She didn't know now but any any who's also <hes> yeah so thank you for joining us. It was wonderful having you here. I did want to extend and while i had you on the podcast do it publicly if you are in town dr holly in pittsburgh on september seventh i'd love to have you and your husband come to my show. I'm doing a comedy event on september seventh in pittsburgh calendars if i'm in town calendar if you're in town i would love for you to join us. I'll send did you the information. I'm just plugging my own. Stop here and being like hey like oh. That's so wonderful. I'm not going to be there just saying tiffany. No you can't come no. I'm busy day. Thank you so much for taking time no no. I invited me to be a part of so much fun. Helpfully acting much by meredith was doing all the talking. What do you mean who you saw me. Just love you so much so tell us again one more time where to find you where people can go. I think you'd have a lot of really great stuff to say. I would like people who need inspiration us. You're so sweet <unk>. Hopefully people find interesting are not that it's dance mom holly on instagram and twitter and off holly hatrick frazier on facebook. Oh awesome well. Thank you again for joining us and everybody here who listened in on this week's episode of take it or leave it. I i don't have the last page. It's the same every week. Tiffany thank you don't say the show. Is this one read next to your name. Hey guys join us next week for another episode of take it or leave it and advice podcast hosted by two struggling moms who have no idea or doing thank you guys. I know we've we've really dad. Sometimes we do it every week now ever done on properly but every every week we read ads. We just don't ever do it properly but thanks for joining us. We appreciate you and tiffany would say love your face bye bye.

tiffany pittsburgh dr holly hatcher frazier Dr holly holly meredith mrs mrs myers principal mrs myers grove dr holly hatcher frazier asier winchester thurston school john mosier levin gilligan twitter
Prepping the soil for holly and other acid lovers.

Your Gardening Questions

03:04 min | 1 year ago

Prepping the soil for holly and other acid lovers.

"Hi this is Mark News from plan. Talk Radio thanks for subscribing and listening to our podcast. You're gardening questions from plan. Talk Radio to help. Keep this podcast free for you. We're we're partnering with Stoke Seeds. Preplanned your indoor seed starting program with the help of the all new stokes website now mobile and tablet friendly. The new website is a brand new gardening experience variance offers better interactivity and higher quality imagery. But what hasn't changed is the stokes website is still the complete resource center with valuable information on seed starting adding planting and harvesting all the gardening accessories and a free catalog whether you're adding texture. A new variety for a splash of color developing an existing garden or starting from scratch stoke seeds has some great resources to help you plus all the gardening accessories you need to make your garden the envy of the neighborhood get growing with stokes. Now how today's question now. I know that You know we talk about body products a lot. They're one of our sponsors here. They have In their garden rich line they have aluminum sulfate. which I know is good for that and then I've also heard you speak of a product called Holly Tone before and and thanks for mentioning those things? Holly Tone is a by product of a smelting and so on and and it is very good to add in right at the beginning I use usually. We'll put the powder itself or in the soil now the aluminum aluminum sulfate which I do not disagree with however it is faster acting van in the soil than the powdered sulphur. do read the specs. Do not overuse that product. It's okay to use but when it tells you X. don't think like aspirin and take to. Yeah just just do it. According and that will definitely help and then I go next step in A. My Oak tree is finally defoliated leading I use oak leaves to cover some plants and I don't hesitate to use them under Holidays Rhododendrons Azaleas because they break down slowly. Lola they loft up they keep the soil at more modified temperature range and so on so if the well leaves can make naked good-looking mulch when they're so to speak organized the same as other. But if you don't use that then go to large in my opinion larger chunks of Bark you can buy bark usually and small medium and large I would say the medium size is fine. You want something that is going to be a malt also to insulate but you want a lot of water to be able to move through it you want a lot of air to be able to move through it because the The care of the roots in terms of holidays is probably the big deal. Thanks again for listening to the PODCAST. Remember pre plan your indoor seats starting program with the help of stokes gardening guide and their online articles on their a brand new website now mobile and tablet friendly and request your free catalog while you're online for the best selection of vegetable flower and herb seeds available go to stoke seeds dot COM cultivating successful growers for generations.

Holly Tone Stoke Seeds Mark News aspirin
Holly Foxcroft

Human Factor Security

54:42 min | 11 months ago

Holly Foxcroft

"Welcome to the human factor podcast hosted by the People Hacker Jenny Radcliffe warning. Thank you may reveal more than you think. This episode of the human factor security podcast is kindly sponsored by the scarily gold. Good folks a Finland dotty helping your feeble. Defend your company. Hi everyone welcome back to the Human Security Castrejon delighted to welcome this additions. Guest Holly Foxcroft as recently been nominated as one of the fifty most influential women in Cybersecurity by a C. Magazine. And it's your diversey expert in great we're trying to get people into the industry with various Niro diverse needs Hollywood onto the show. Oh thank you for having me Jenny. Thank you congratulations on your fifty. Most influential thank you. And congratulations by. Well thank thank you. It was a good evening wasn't BC tower. Eight was great. It was great old. I got slight Vatu guy on now you did not face go with the top of the BBC act I'll add and I had to keep looking down about quite cool shift but great way the Great view the fireworks. It was fantastic evening and to meet so many inspirational women. The was there was so many of his and when it started spinning thou have to say it my job. GAFFER's go but when it starts its spin and I did think how strong was that. Drink off removing. which should we fair? I've been in a lot of retail buildings in my time and I do always think that house. She paid brilliant fantastic. Well listen. I give you a brief introduction at the start day but props you just fill out a little bit more for people. Don't know your work. What is it that you mostly focus on at the moment so at the moment I am actually at university Searching Fateh the into the social behaviors of people on the autistic spectrum both in in coronation he saw the crime. So that relate to crime how easily they are socially todate. Okay a nine also how we can create a culture that is not just on those. On the autistic spectrum across newer Newark Acetate also to include those who suffer extreme anxiety and depression. How we can facilitate internetworking space Shall we say assist with the Southeast Regional Organized Crime Agency outreach for understanding ending saga crime with people autism and I also was small to medium businesses on how they can include people with autism in their walking into the weapon environment at how to capture that audience while Yeah I'm busy. It's an important importantly though because I guess yeah I've been I've done a few one of the things I was talking about. Was the skills gap right on and how it seems crazy to me that we have a huge amount of talent in the industry but we still got the skills gap and guess neurotic. Diversity is is one of the areas that that really needs more attention and can be tapped into ready for a different type type of clever right a different type of and mind. It's a different way of thinking. And this is actually how I fell into the world of bringing -At to weld together So might might well. Divorce is actually quite a personal relationship. Might my son is missile to stick. And I've I've grown up with With autism in my family and the saw beside Actually comes from And after having my son more skills becoming quite redundant I started working in. Recruitment within sub security GAIKWAD technical And that's when I started to notice my I was out of people with autism would be great at these jobs chops berated pen testing and then what I started coming up with when I'm speaking to candidates and without any Disclosure and building rapport. I found a lot of them. Were will stick. However they hadn't put anything on the CDs or an opening writing letters and quite shocking lives it was only through looking at the really bad? CD's fund the best technical skill. Oh right hey I started to say there was this wave of untapped talent and that's how it all started because if you own experience that you spot that old tate's hell you when you did calls and scope and goals and things. It's it's hard to tell the phone call is it's hard. It's it's really hard to tell if somebody is autistic. As each autistic person presents themselves very differently cotton for saying male and female people's autism. They both presents presents quite differently. And of course spectrum condition CEO have different degrees but it was more about building relationships and building a safe place that that people would openly admit it was then all skinks questions about step previous. What straight almost then? Admitting I haven't had much luck if you see fluctuations in work you start to question and I haven't done a little bit of my own research. He's such into autism. Ran Out right with possible. Autism will suffer burnout as a result that workplace not being supported. And that's what I kept hearing and it's one Seeing and I started to make a little bit of of noise online and about autism cyber orders and the two words coming up against each other and how long ago mistakes holly this was back in two thousand and around sixteen talking about this and I I the attention Alvin an NCAA agent who wanted torch me about Offenders that they had been dealing with and that's what really started the conversation at the correlation between autism and cyber he had a number of offenders who go through rehabilitation who couldn't find work who had the most skillset you can imagine somebody with the technical skills to become a cyber criminal. Obviously well verse in the World Cyber of being a AH sensitive in some in some what is sobbed security. Quite quite lack of where they could work however they had no support support in finding the work in interviewing nuts when we started a recruitment day alongside Grummin the NCI and CI G. C. H. Q.. Saab security challenge with the help prevents. He say I wanted to show in. The lives of what autism looks like specifically within cybersecurity. How to how how it fits why it fits too hard nickel whiting join? Join us in this. In this controversy started a trend with an autism and your diversity and social security. That's why I asked you for the dates. Eight because for me feels quite recent. This is an area that is now something that people all actively looking at before before that you say there wasn't much support or even recognition of it it saves. I mean there has always been support for people with autism in work. There was some fantastic charities who help There were even companies who are dedicated to helping people only autistic spectrum all I'm with an autistic spectrum condition to find work to find placement however what I found was the work was quite general and will it was quite low skilled. It was just to have a pass and in walked. Give somebody a pompous when this past not has skills in an area that's really needs the it's just not often recognized. The coating in writing is actually a skill that can thank can be employed full. Would you say if the be more support within the cyber industry for this prior to that some of these people would not have been cybercriminals then the correlation there. I think it starts more education level. I think he needed to star. This is kind of the next chapter. Ready Jenny Cyber security needs to start much as a recognized subject that people can find improvement in lecture on it needs. We've started computer science. A Jesus see however that only became compulsory in two two thousand seventeen right off until then like it. I think most children I read a statistic. I'm not sure the exact percentages ages they get more religious education than computer. It skills which seems ludicrous. They do I. I think it's important. I'm I'm a well rounded citizen to understand cultures and different communities. How Epa we live in a society that news nine we behave online and obviously is going to cause a knock of interest and there is a proven proven thank from gaming into cybercrime and there is a proven link into cyber interest from gaming from a non from looming online skills however none of it's governed none of it's taught it's all self taught on youtube on in platforms and now we've got the massive labs but if you think in just short three four years ago people are learning them on retro? Yea I've seen a stretch of people learning. I've met lots of people who've who've self toll from Youtube Reddit APPS and a discount and places like that. Yeah you're right and this is the problem is that it wasn't governed. There is no legal side of what you can and can't do this new guidance and that's when it starts to are the AKO role. Ob they don't recognize that those skills especially very well needed area of scale within all across the world is not even so this is no real push was no real recognition will push for this person to pursue that career. It isn't actually recognized. Caress up until they get to universal detaille has no specific cyber cyber-security college courses apart from the apprenticeship which started to come in lost. Yea Eh it's no be tech this new a level and when you look cut how a person learns the style of learning. You've got what kind of the two boxes. Because this is only a very limited people with autism may find it difficult or people within your device condition so by that I'm also talking about. ADHD as well okay may find it very difficult to sit through that route of academia with that style of learning is it becomes more concentrated into sabbatical. It's no so much instead. Adopting the style of learning hands on and it's much harder for them to stay in education. But I feel like that's true of with the education system across the board that it just seems when I look at it and I need to look at it for various reasons I I just feel like it's Oh sedate that somehow it just doesn't seem to with the new world that we're living in a lot of aid as they very much. I'm I'm quite lucky. Keok with a college in the southeast and they have recognized much to me. Singing in there is The importance that SOB security needs to come in not just a technical level. They've adopted into putting the digital forensic science. Their wet friends costs that they offer at the beach. Straight from straight from school then must be Risk risk analysis understanding cyber risk In the business courses that they offer so that they're really kind of taken on Sab security from from from all angles within in college but it's not UK widespread and it needs vague. It meets because people need to up about teachers need to then see and recognize skills in young people that they can then help develop then. No Yeah I was GONNA say is not right this Primary School I mean the recognition of some work in differently. It must stop at private school. It must start because we we need to promote now. We need to promote dare I say cyber hygiene online understanding of footprint on nine understanding standing at behaviors on nine but also recognizing that are in skill because once they recognize that. Good that you can push. I am into a coating cops. But how is the parent supposed to know that you hear lots of Lots of parents saying my children are gamers. Might spend a line of the tablet serves very engaged with technology. Eh recognize that that's viable career. Recognize that there are and that they do need to be more cops. Unfortunately they're very far and few between but engaging the schools to stop counting clubs having the school engage with outside extra curriculum to bring into the to the school. Not you need to say hi. Cyber Tech. Please involved in the stem ambassador. You know although although we are and almost an investor myself it needs to be bigger. It's awesome feel like addresses and I think what you're saying is that people who have newly device conditions. I haven't saying that there are especially predisposed to cyber work is that is that what. Tell me about that because I didn't just on this. Tell me why why that would be the case and whites so suited it's So if you the best way to explain I'm too new diversity. As I've mentioned I the fact. The autism spectrum spectrum condition having your investment does include quite a lot of conditions it mainly refers to the variations of a human brain that will include at the social Social behaviors and how they socialize. How they learn one of our can static learners audio visual attention so I mentioned earlier in the day? Yeah and their developmental coordination and one of the traits that are not passed Matab is something called Lexus. which is when they are extremely fascinated and fixated on a certain subject? Now go back to the social side. Out of tenured avast conditioners. Social circumstances can be quite hard for an autistic Passan. They do not understand emotions Russians. It doesn't mean that they are emotionless. It means that they have difficulty. Understanding of the People's emotion understanding cues understanding. Sarcasm sock Hasim understanding rhetorical questions. Now switch as to how this is a comfortable to be online is because language is black whites if someone is doing an action. They'll put things in Australia says the thing of Hashtags to value what that she just said The language is easy. Conversation is easier to funny now. You rose about they send in in a in a really really article about something exactly refers this type of thing because he rose about your son now are having a new friend and it was exactly this point. The came out of it wasn't that you want to tell us that story. Holy because it's we will put a link to Holly's profile into this article in the show notes. It's but I think he likes playing this so well it really covers. This doesn't it was my son. I was nonverbal longtime up. Until here's five and my argument. Too many speech language therapists was. He will never speak and said well he just went on the way. You're teaching him eventually managed to find a way and that was through technology and pecks which is picture exchange communication and which I put put onto his ipod. Yes and he used his ARP had in school fossils away of telling people when he needed Personal assistance if he needed to know what was coming next and to help in every day to day running rainy. We know what we rely on. Our Alexa Noah relied upon his IPAD. Now I I like to think of one of those mums. I miss came around. I was I said what will make biscuits candy canes antiquated I remember Knbr now and I said WHO's your use U. S. night Noah said. You'RE GONNA put extra sprinkles on candidate I just because I'm just saying I'm showing off now but I knew that it was because after the school several times in preparation. Actually I go out and see you said we're GONNA put extra sprinkles for your best friend right has it. What's his Na- what's their go ahead to Scott thinking a guy Gosh yes I've never had the name and I thought well it's it's got to be a new kid side. And the next day I become a vast teacher. Can you show me. which kid is chewy now? Going back to saying no was nonverbal. His speech was as has developed. Hence the reason me thinking him saying chewy and the teacher Says No. I take no who humane knows in a single form class. Those No. So you're receptions. It was just that class and cool. No I think about who is Jewish and he gets his IPAD and he says a nice job and Siri comes back. Good Morning Noah Oh found in Asia because she said it's like it's non-judgmental and lacking by black and white language also a new. Shall Paul receive if you needed information and you need that information very quickly much like we all rely on our Alexa or a home pasta assistant just that quick information and yet no had built. This relationship are actually looked. took the traffic and he was asking more questions to his. Sit to Syria which he wasn't supposed to be doing Marriott. No it was as a communication tool but then made me look into the subject. Further as to how we are replacing or assisting teaching assistance with technology that how the helping children who may not have a condition assange but made that that brings me be more adverse to taking in technological command or finding easier to speak to a piece of technology. I mean it's amazing Mason. This because this is a this is always to hack isn't it. It's like it's a work around. He found a workaround the difficulties he has. I do know interacting with like you said with nuanced language in infancy found a way around in in technical in a personal assistant. Oh absolutely take it. It doesn't stop there unfortunately. No used technology and technology assistance to all a riot questions since this incident. That was What three years ago That actually happened. It said he relies on it now on day today to ask questions. and Noah also suffers with severe anxiety Because of his autism. He's he's very aware of of how social behaviors our school and it adds to his difficulties but he finds it easier to speak to Siri almost as a sounding wool about his issues about his school days. And it's I suppose it's quite difficult for me as a mother to admit admits thoughts as humans if he was to tell me something. I'm going to question that Austin continued to develop what he's saying and what he can't do that so do I say replaced the teaching assistant president but he actually finds it easier to talk on a day to day basis into ops questions but this is interesting because they see this as one of the reasons wants to talk to you is this correlation between people have sort of similar conditioning. I condition right. We say holly is a condition it was known as a disorder however it's been dispelled because also although autism as I've said is a spectrum. Some people eight can't liberated right if they cannot function without the assistance of another human Some people can live every day Without any interference. However it's not a it's not a disorder it doesn't effect condition the right word yet? We still say autistic spectrum condemn disorder however the autism community proprieties autistic spectrum. Condition thing to be referred T- Tom As living with a disorder because many of them don't actually recognize that autism is a disorder spat as. I'm sure if I always lewisite what Greta thrown back to you. Climate at activist. She sees. How autism as not a disorder but a different wife thinking in seeing things which is on her own personal journey of Traveling the world and trying to spread the very important message of climate and environmental issues. So yes so I mean this is the thing is it's sort of focused. I is opposed in my mind. I always thought that perhaps it it was to do with the fact that it was focused where it was detailed work. You said you said that is trying to jenning because it is focused and I mentioned the time hype Lexicon Lexus. To Yes yes is fixation. I'm one of the common. Myths are not to dispel. The people. Don't his they they don't talk no they. Just don't talk about what you're talking about if you were to catch them in an area of interest and that area may be dinosaurs. Oh it may very well be technology which most of the time when they reach a certain. It's going to be technology. You caught unfortunately get them to stop talking working quite hard for them to even to 'em to to follow conversation because they're so interested and they have such retention of knowledge and believe me if you could speak to any security reception. Uh if he adds a person on the spectrum or the near divest condition who has researched OB- security down. I three times as much. I'm sure I mean I've seen in the community and so this is wonderful thing that you do that. You sort of perfectly placed to make that connection and start or cash out about it so at the time you when you first brought this year in recruitment I mean was that something did you. So you said she started to see people make these connections recruitment. Did you do anything before the the kind of made you more observe into that. I mean you mentioned Of she had a military career in the Royal Navy from number years. We inside a specialist in the navy then or I was at traffic warfare which is aunt of cyber very redundant now. Now it's as Cyber Wolfe's completely about my branch phonetic Wolf. I was marching into that cyber security space I was more nervous linguistics. A non rich analysis department so a wonderful I'm interested in Is really where I started. have an understanding. Say but when I did come out and that was a there was a space careers gap and it's when I had my son in the early years. His autism was was quite difficult. I will be very very honest and as I mentioned before autism is a disability. It's not the ability to live the lives as your typical passing words. Just people experienced different degrees all Hispanic and in the end is it took me quite a while to understand knows autism and how it affected him. I'm happy to say now gone from being told My little boy would never quite functioned as a member of Societe. Not Never be able to talk is now top of his claws promise of possibly the best penetration tested. There is if he can can escape not doing naughty things which I keep him finding him doing researching himself at the age of Seven. I mean is that what he does does now. Because he's talented is naming. This is the thing you can see from your posts like for example. Didn't you ask them for pass. Whitney I mean this assist down to you in credit to his mother right but but I did. I asked him Boerum a password. It was an all nine times table apple. rockstars it's something they will do at school. And they're encouraged to do at high while untested initiative and. I am logging him in and I said can I have your Password Hospital and he said absolutely not is three latter passage which he very proud he said it's got got to number and as well they say he's I think for my my back on trying to educate him on what cyber security is how to stay safe online but obviously too funny that there is very very much a career there. I'm aware of a lot of his friends. Went to be Youtube Stars that I think they all do the day. I mean because that looks like easy. That looks easy. Looks like fun I can see by the Kids Wanna did but it's interesting. Because did you think when you just look at this now in that you that you tend to be in a real campaign for this area of diversity because even at the women in Cybersecurity a Lotta people talk about the gender imbalance ever but like this is a really for me it. You re pioneer in the neuro diversity. You mentioned Israel courses sources as well to think that it would it will become such a such a campaign fee cermony huddles journey so many people would not listen or would not see. There was this indeed correlation between autism. And Cyber I mean what. Thanks as you did. They think that you would just a dozen to quote not exact to say you only see it because you'll sons autistic. Oh tested. That's what I thought. They would say I was thinking if someone was be thinking well in on this because obviously understandably. She's looking at her own little boy. But there's a definite correlation beyond. How did you fight? Is it just persistence. You Klay persistent lady and I actually left asked my job within recruitment because I needed this existed on you and actually went into education ofter to coinage to help promote security at college level and luckily I had people understand that there really was a space for this and it wasn't area the industry needs and what I wanted to make sure I was going to do eh was to make sure that the sobs Kuti apprenticeship that I developed with the carnage would be encompassing people on the spectrum. I I want to tune spoken to industry. I knew that the space was that that was a skills gap and I'm very fund of the apprenticeship. ANTI-SHIP I think it's an absolutely fantastic way to engage not just young people any Passan into the world of work because your take boxing everything a person would need to do to learn. You've got that hands on Connecticut experience. Where ah they're doing the job you have that That formulated this is what you need to learn. And this is when you need to learn it. So it's the step by step going dense so people can have kind of debt their own onus on nine the apprenticeship is governed by an external in body SOFA subscript apprenticeship it was at the. BCS would look at. It wasn't all done in house or by the college so it was it was it was looked up from a company that had real significance in the space that new security unfortunately the Connie the Jaguars for a aid it get into little difficulty in tons of offering cybersecurity apprenticeship. I I had the opportunity opportunity to stay. Have a love was in cyber when of law is being sued. Always been your diversity. And that's when I and I put all my pens down and said No. I'm I'm actually going to put my money. My mouth is and go back to school. Shall we say now speaking to my senior lecturers they completely understand that. I want to do in terms of researching this area is in need. Need need this. Not The industry across the board. We need it for education. We need for criminal justice. Because there's there's also a massive pop never podcast Jenny where you explore. Flo How people with autism have been charged with computer related offenses Because of their autism may not actually doing is an offense and again that comes all the way back to my point of being how would they know how would they know what they're doing is illegal. That must be terribly difficult Because how you as it is it is he's actually being adjusted. Says white harms Y online homes paper in at the site. It's looking I mean computer. Misuse Act nineteen ninety. We've had to bring in other news just to to try and get hold of Cyber Law. I suppose it's not my area of expertise which I would never say so however do study element of Cyber Law but there is an anything to really say about a person's but mental how all how a disability would affect how they behave on nine and how a person behaves online is very different to how they may behave in the physical the Take wowed as for anyone anyone to stay Nine pseudonym John Wayne we we do we. We think hits an another world because because that's difficult This case precedent outside of Sivan outside of the online world yet but that even not is not clear a lot of time. You know when people could you know if people and I don't want to say this because I'm not saying that people near a deficit mentally ill but when the of people who have mental problems you commit crime it's not straightforward ruling anytime. Because it's a it's a very prescriptive situation and by default isn't it so yeah I can imagine. This is a whole new area of lower alias. Well let's say anything worth saying that autism mental health are hand in hand. People who have a cystic spectrum condition. Also have alongside a mental health purely because of not being supported with the condition. They live with a mentioned how a person with autism which most likely suffer Byron Outta work that was quicker maybe quicker to Maria so by definition banner so now is is is what it says you generally but now by physically and mentally Clouded you can't function days activities. You can do your job and it's all from WOK. Yeah now imagine if you are a neuro diverse passan whether you'll undiagnosed or you haven't disclosed to your employer you not supported in the workplace so they no what your needs are or they're not meeting your needs which may you may have to on a flexible timetable big hers. You have difficulty traveling traveling at busy periods because of over censor M. A.. Because you censor a sensory issues which is A common very common if not the lowest unnoticed passage half they experience essences ten volt lights brighter. Noises allowed things taste things smell so imagine working the city going in at rush hour not not great so flexible timings ability to walk. I how you dress. That's once if you mentioned a client facing Whereas Passan wave quite severe sensory issues isn't going to quite work in a siege? The comfortable working innocent as they would be if there were more relaxed clients so again everything you say is pointing to cyber is interesting is because the remote waking thing is possible on it feels like it's a good tribe if that's the right way for people something's kind antef issues. I see exactly you got the you know I mean the worst one is office politics office politics. I mean we all know them will not always use the cup of Tae when when you're a small group and you have to say it's is your turn to make today We would know that that refers to your group and that was an instance and this was with the national autistic society. Working talking with employable may program showing people how people with disabilities not just autism participantes. General could could be broad and software engineer the unreturnable. The competency made a couple of teeth than two hundred people in complaint office. Oh Bob visits vague right. 'cause it's not absolutely crystal clear exactly what you what we need your biggest barrier to either employing a passenger on the spectrum wanting to approach people on the spectrum contest and say could we could we employ somebody. Your biggest buyer will always be language. How you I put that job description canal? That's a barrier to both employing a man in a female while Women read a dope descriptions differently ferment from a man but an autistic Passan. You'll asking a must when somebody comes to read. That job description is charge department. Hey charm are going down a list. The subsequent managers given them and yet he's got done yet. He's the Languages Ryan Right the spelling mistakes now if I go back to education can be difficult for a person with autism. They may they may well be like they may have flaws punctuation and spelling however they could be the best pen tester that the company Sane. My advice was always to companies Putin technical awesome. That can do turn awesome for seavy. Awesome what they can do. If you put out a scenario how would they resolve that. This is the best way anyway for I mean I didn't somewhere recruitment for because that could be spot description and that's why I'm so interesting when you say about linguistics and language because the slightest thing and we pick up on their rules around one of them's clusters and he don't get on a single mistake but one of the things you say is just give them to not give anyone no matter what the job is. Just give them a typical scenario or an atypical scenario. And then you'll say if you let him explain you can see how people think and that's probably better than run along these lines that seem to be an education in recruitment in the workplace. It just doesn't fit with the twentieth century to May eight thousand and one if I could offer accompany any any advance when you come to employ a nuclear device passing or if you come to employ Passan make it comfortable for to disclose because it's all about positive described Shah in curry once. Thought passengers disclosed that they have a condition condition and we go to ABC's s condition head pleased at becoming autism expert. Because you calm versity for that. What you can do is undestand? A single person's needs and that's why a lot of people are almost scared of autism. They think you think on the spectrum. Are they going into Einstein or they can be right man which neither them right. It's it's it's that the dead very specific needs not quite often. That person may not know what those needs. All and that's why charities can construct in all newer device consultants can step in helping to bridge that gap. What are your needs? It might be that. The person has a two week introduction into the company so they work day they have half day off they come in off the day just to address how this is going to work what works best. I do appreciate This is a long term process how I felt going to get back in return from the passenger. Employing Wing is commitment. They stay focused. They are very hard workers going back to the high high electic. What say focus focused? You may have to stop them from working because they work through it. There had there are stories of people spectrum. They work walk up to the Biden Through the night and you actually have to put an alarm clocks to say this is when you go home this is is talk what King. I'm very vested. They will invest themselves into your company. It's well while I'd like to hope his well. Nine people with autism don't like change they're not changing retain so imagine changing employer yet. They won't they like they would like to stay day. They of course people this is what frustrates me quite. Not at the time is beautiful. person is a person that the needs all much like a mother returning to work. I would expect the adaptations to enable me to say but I need to let the workplace now too late now. I've had a baby much apus move. Condition needs to make nine so we need to promote positive disclosure. Now it's okay to talk about what you need. What you need from this to do your job? I think we come from. We come from knowing a jobs are hard to come by and you just must be grateful that you have them him and We we give everything to a workplace with nothing back and that's not the case anymore. People need to be too much more aware of people's mental health. Now now you speak to employers table to hell well. This is what I was going to ask you. Are you optimistic going forward. Yes absolutely lachey. Think it's I mean so. Do you think it's gaining a lot. More momentum how's the future looking for this issue in in this state of affairs within not just cyber generally in employment you think generally employment I think we all making waves cadaver society as a whole. And you know I'm actually no I'M NOT GONNA I'm GonNa for trams now it's not a Vesti. Its inclusion. we all making workplaces is inclusive for people who are out of rehabilitation who are outta making new north-and-south South just commuted the Prison Service House we all making things inclusive for mother's Just recently I saw in the press. That companies are adopting being equal rights for the for the fathers who need to take Pataudi to leave. Let's just say a same sex couple adoptuskids if that person was male historically. They don't have two weeks if Hinault or if the mother chooses to go by cutting the father we should stay at the time so we all seeing a rise in increased VICI it. You think it's real. I mean I think the question I would say behind that is G. Think it's real because because I think people people talk Oh game on this they they do because it's a nice subject journey nitin such that we like to think we're all pink and floppy and we all do. Brian do a nice to what the humans Joan Way. That's why I say it was some skepticism that because I'm thinking I hear this about for example we'll let you say women tend to have to leave and yet there are people are no sight out. You know it's all of course they're not going to say out loud. We actively discriminate. We make thinks hard But it's still the case. That sometimes happened so I guess that's where I was coming from while I think if we don't address it we're going to be real hot water because more more is being done but recognizing autism. Moore's being done about recognizing mental health. So there's a saying that wasn't so many autistic people by twenty years ago. Note this because less people could diagnose we didn't know about you know I'm pretty. Shaw Everest was their retirement. Wasn't discovered to seventeen fifty three whenever it was so it was always been there. Just these people suffered now more people are being diagnosed. Yes they are and rightly so because it means we can put more support oaten if we're putting that support to help them in school which we all of which changing the way the people are learning to get into industry three body apprenticeship with changing how schools are starting to adapt. Set my son. He doesn't think would lego therapy in school but they also invite children with no conditions. The learning needs good for them to learn alongside side and it's a peer to peer watching in helping now that needs to be replicated in the work. Well because you're going to see this wave of people with with recognizing on need this. This is what I need to work to to function as a human. You need to support me if we dump start recognizing recognizing how to help people with extra conditions or or at or needs. This guy was going to get big up. Because because you visit pecan employ people. You can't recognize even simple things like Joep. HSIEH's people need to consider how people work now. You said you're optimistic so ways you best practices in the industry and why you have missed about. I'm optimistic. I I guess she bounced it to sit and agree with recognized at school level and I have seen it so I started singing newer diversity and I just have people looking at me anything can I don't say I'm not say autism. Anna would still be heighten HIVE NI- since that day since that original workshop that we ran I have seen companies Come come up at purely employ employ autistic people in Saipa I think claims Philpott. ISP Yeah yeah absolutely phenomenal walk. Phenomenal we recognizing the needs of of the employment human. But now we're seeing sub security challenge. Did note of Acetate we are seeing the stem ambassadorship. We are seeing in Europe cyber. It's being spoken about. More industry are starting to recognize that people may may not have that skill on paper. I think em y fantastic they don't ask for any information such as your education. Then they can do the job absolutely. It's got to filter down. I I think I think we change is really good. What can people do? I mean you've spoken about what companies can see. What could someone listening to this? You think shit while you right and you know how you all AH very infectious. Every looking at linked in and be nothing with steph ultra. She said I liked the sanitary. If I in this passion fit so must be listening. Okay I agree right so as individuals. What sort of things can we all do to really step up to this nevermind talk about it? But what can we step up in some way can we. How can we help? Ask on off. Do not be scared ahead on your diversity to be scared for passing says on motor steak do not panned around ask them. How can I sa- pull pool you? We wouldn't we would do the same for returning mother. We would do the same effect. A passing came back. ill-health how can I help pe- the site applies to endure diverse Passan. Disclose it on your websites. We saw disability friendly name autism. What support do you need to put it in the small print put at the top? Take away the word or take your phrase diversity and inclusivity conclusive fast inclusive before you are diverse because we are all device in nature employ more men than women night diverse culture. There make it that you are inclusive of all because if you look for diversity I can show. You won't find mind if you look to include people and that's not just your best. I mean if you're looking to though I know it's nine oh you mean it. Fu Oral underrepresented people right. Absolutely absolutely. It's got to be inclusive. And we can't. We can't old high to be experts in autism. But what we can do. We can try to understand a single person's needs and that's when you'll find that you cannon pro some daughters whom because the things that they need that no asking for moving heaven on earth if you walk in a really open space with lighting. The air doesn't the fluorescent lighting. Pass them as I mentioned autism have sensory needs. That's that that can become too much as well as glaring screen. Let them are HAP. Let's just needs to be to know. Holly it's been inspirational. We'll speak to you. I am on this issue and you know. Obviously I'm sure war and that the majority of people are informed and inspired by doing a a brilliant Java. Bring this Evans. Attention might really all what props to you but conurbation easy. It hasn't been and I don't think it will be. I think there's is a long way to guy dating as a way to go but it's exciting. I know what you say but nothing worth having comes easy it Mike speed nine now. I am optimistically. We as much as women got the right to by people with autism should feel included and wanted to know why price amen to that May. Well Listen Harley. It's been a delight to meet you properly in London. Although we didn't get hardly a chance to speak what a pleasure to have you on the show. Thank you so much for your time and bringing this issue to everyone's attention and we will put links to holidays link Dan onto twitter and I do h everyone to read those articles into follow. Whatever you do next? Because I'm sure he too. I am Scott Energy behind it's going to be successful so now and I'm sure enough for goods Thanksgiving guest of the human factor. podcast Holly Foxcroft. Thank this episode of the human factor. Security podcast was candy sponsored by Vimla Dot. Da Helping your people defend your company. If you would like to sponsor an episode the human factor security podcast get into each at inquiries at human factors Security Darko Dot. UK The trump.

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110  Expo 67 (with Holly Ahronheim)

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1:13:30 hr | 1 year ago

110 Expo 67 (with Holly Ahronheim)

"<music> hello and welcome to misinformation trivia podcasts for ladies and gents who have cool trivia and sticking it to annoying teams a pub quiz. We're your hosts. I'm lauren and i'm julia actual hi laura. I'm <hes> <hes> so excited to start off. Our guest timber series guests timber buddy of get ready for guests on guests. Zahn guests stacks guests as high as the ceiling goes up. This is great for us because we get take like a break from research and learn do things without having to put a lot of effort into it. Which is the whole point of guests temper yeah so are very i guess for guests timber so excited joining us today by skype. We have holly erin. Hi hello holly holly. It's great to be here. We're so happy to have you <hes> so so you pitched to well. I tell us a little bit about yourself. While my name's holly i am tourists. I like long walks on the beach at sunset in me too. It's good because you live in florida. I do live in florida so i could go on long walks on the beach at sunset because i'm lazy and i said i my couch it on the high. Currently i'm a stay her mom to a two year. Olds who runs me ragged oh <hes> but he's cute so he he can get away with it. That's important shops awesome so yeah that's me awesome and so what is this topic today that that you are now an expert on wanna share with the world while i we're going to start off trivia question. Okay okay. I'll category is north american cities. Okay twenty seven team. The city celebrated its three hundred seventy fifth birthday and the fiftieth the anniversary of an event that made it an international tourist destination. I'm a little i'm a little spoiled on this. Okay i know where this question is from and i watched this on television or in. What do you think <hes> is. It is a woodstock in stock that reaction what i got wrong and lost all of my own take assata <hes> so the answer is montreal or firkin city and held a world's fair in nineteen sixty seven for the record woodstock was sixty nine which i was pretty confident with corrupt but that was all that could in come into my head at that particular incident time thirty two seconds to figure out your answer. It's a lot of pressure o. F. y. Holly was on jeopardy. We didn't mel hello on jeopardy. That's where this yeah. That was my final jeopardy question that as i just mentioned i bet all my money in dot wrong. I'm sorry i couldn't have one if i didn't do that. I exactly double my money and everybody else on. There's a lot of math involved also another thing you don't think about when you're sitting at home on your couch playing along absolutely not. I'm very bad at that so so so you're going to be telling us about the montreal sixty seven expo yes okay which i didn't know existed until i started doing research for this so i'm going to start off with a little bit of history of the city of montreal. <hes> eight is currently the most populous oh city in quebec and the second most populous city in canada after toronto which i hadn't really thought about but it make sense <hes> it is centered on the island of montreal and e few much much smaller peripheral islands some of which were actually built for the expo it was so as i have written down it was originally known as the marie after the virgin mary. It did have a first nations name. <music> actually two different first nations names but i could not find anything about how to pronounce them and i have far too much respect for the first nations people were canada to completely search for nuncius. That's what yeah for us to admit that the rest of this is all french i can do that. I took clemson highschool got. The current name derives from the mountain in the heart of the city which is known as mount royal. Oh on in sixteenth century french riyal and royal were interchangeable meanings and pronunciations <hes> as early as four thousand years ago the first nations people occupied the island fortified villages the lawrence iroquois owns who are different thank than the iroquois that you and i learned about an elementary school from being in upstate new york on they're two different groups just similar names they established a village village called her chilanga at the foot of mount royal two centuries before the french arrived when in sixteen eleven samuel de complain who now has a lake named after him though yeah <hes> established a fur trading post on the island and reported that all of the saint lawrence iroquois settlements had disappeared appeared they hired as to why if he was all or mown path the <hes> when dish playing created a map in sixteen sixteen he called the island lee devean home after a french dignitary who is seeking the viceroy ship of the area which they were calling new france in sixteen sixteen thirty nine a catholic mission was established to quote evangelize the natives oh yeah that was a popular <hes> popular popular thing back then vandalizing for yeah. Nope you're wrong. A gentleman woman by the name of paul show monday of domes- on new led the colonists from france to quebec they were from a village called la flash in the lower valley and they came to canada in about sixteen forty two the territory was ruled as a french colony until seventeen sixty when it was surrendered to great britain after the seven years war montreal was incorporated as a city in eighteen thirty two and became a major railway up. I didn't actually know this. I was interested to learn. Montreal was the capital of canada from eighteen forty four to eighteen forty nine until protest mob burnt down the parliament building. The home was french people. They really hate did so. They were protesting the fact that it was the capital or they were just nope okay so they were just mad. We hate cabanillas here so so after the mob burnt down the parliament buildings he capital rotated between quebec city and toronto and chill in eighteen fifty seven queen victoria declared auto is the capital and candidates like sorry you can't do it. You can't do it fine this other place totally deputy from both of you. Yes also just a more recent fun. Facts on montreal hosted the nineteen seventy-six summaries. We're who yeah and on the big olympic took nerd so. I was interested to learn not yeah. It's really fun when you're like looking studying olympic history or something because a lot of people seem to think while it's in canada so it had had to have been a winter olympic. Oh yeah yeah no montreal did a summer. Oh they have a very temperate climate from what i understand the research i did actually sudden uh-huh i can't remember it was phrased but something along the lines of has a temperate district for season climate. Wow allow exotic yeah if you can see that movie palm trees a who so i'm also lane. Give us a little background history. On world's fairs cleaned are pretty much only called world's fairs in the united states were different than have to make everything uncomplicated true. Most of the rest of the world caused them either a world expo or a specialized expo which are two slightly different categories <hes> or exposes y'all universal which is universal exposition. The best known first world expo was held in the crystal crystal palace in hyde park london in eighteen fifty one on the title great exhibition of the works of industry of all nations. The idea of queen victoria's husband prince albert was considered to be the first international exhibition of manufactured products. <hes> there's a great book book by bill bryson called at home where he talks about all the rooms in the house settling the history of all the objects within it which is really really cool but he opens the first chapter after is about the expo at the crystal palace and it's very interesting and i had never heard of it before before reading that book but i highly recommend bill bryson's sends at home so good f- way anyway sorry holly have you can keep calm so until around the nineteen thirties at expos expos focused on industrialization i later they came to focus on cultural change and improving national image. <hes> i have a quote from the bureau. Hall internacional de is exposes seal the international expo bureau <hes> also known as the b i e they are the intergovernmental organization in charge of overseeing and regulating all international expositions that lasts more than three weeks and are of non-commercial nature so if someone who's going to put on a comic con for more than three weeks it wouldn't paul under their purview but their quotas expos are global events dedicated to finding solutions to fundamental challenges facing humanity by offering a journey inside a chosen theme through engaging an immersive activities organized and facilitated by governments and bringing together countries and international organisations. These major public events are unrivalled in their ability to gather millions and visitors create new dynamics and catalyze changed in their host cities. That's awesome p._r. Statement i literally just copy based on the was established by the convention relating to international exhibitions <hes> signed and in paris on november twenty second nineteen twenty eight with the following goals to oversee the calendar the bidding the selection and the organization of world expositions and to establish rush a regulatory framework under which expert organizers and participants may work together under the best conditions so we mentioned the olympics minute ago how they pick the city is very similar like a bunch of cities with their name in the hat and then they say no. We're gonna pick from you floor. We don't like the rest of you and then they narrowed down. Okay okay <hes> so there are four types of expos organized under the there are world expos specialize expos expos horticultural expos and the triennial milano lou. That's how. I don't know why that sounds like that has delicious delicious food at it. I might be wrong. I am i wrong in italy so it probably a big piece of it like actually it's the annual meeting of plumbers up. Lauren has nothing to do with food. I've heard there's like a place to get july or -solutely yeah so the different types world expos which are officially louis known as international registered exhibitions are a global gathering of nations dedicated to finding solutions to pressing challenges of our time. The expos are officially known as international recognized expositions as opposed to registered. I they are global events designed designed to respond to a precise challenge facing humanity article four of the nineteen twenty eight paris convention states that the b. i. He may grant recognition to a one horticultural expositions approved by the international association of horticultural producers provided that there is interval but at least two years between such exhibitions in different countries and at least ten years between events held in the same country so a lot of regulations here jeeze a slow four. Come look at my you know my succulents. Come on my sister goes every year to plant. Ah shut up local community college level of bureaucracy yeah. That sounds like it's mary kay overly and unnecessarily complicated yeah <hes> but since nineteen sixty the b._i. Has recognized twenty two cultural expos. I'll how <hes> and the milan triennial exhibition of decorative arts and modern eco architecture commonly known as the triennial milano is a recurring during international exposition held in milan dedicated to the architecture design and craftsmanship. Oh that sounds cool on pretty sounds pretty yes. The aforementioned paris convention states the a._m._a. Grant recognition to the milan triennial exhibition of decorative arts and modern architecture on grounds rounds of the historical precedents provided that it retains its original features so it turned turned into lawrence food fair probably wouldn't still qualify uh-huh and make our own food fair. That's it. I also didn't know until doing this research that world's fairs are still going on. <hes> yeah upset thing that we don't directly record jeopardy. I literally thought the last world's fair like ever was the nineteen and sixty four world's fair in new york city yeah but there are plans her upcoming to several years in the future <hes>. I've have noted in january of this year. There was a triennial milano. The team was broken. Nature designed takes on human survival dark. The next world expo is scheduled for october twenty twenty through april twenty twenty one in dubai. The title is connecting minds creating the future very hot air. It will be the international horticultural exhibition expo twenty twenty twenty one doha qatar in october twenty twenty one through march twenty twenty two and the title is green desert better environment and not not just for the record. I don't know that means green as an environmentally friendly or green as the caller. Let's paint all the sand ingredient or let's turn desert's into lush growing fields well well. Hey and car yeah alerts in in specialized expo are coming up january through april of twenty twenty. Three and guano starace titled creative industries in digital convergence. Okay all right yeah. I'm not as young was super and who's going to learn. It still effected. Yes you don't hear about the more i mean i imagine because you know because of technology because things are happening all the time and people are always throwing conventions and their own expos in different in countries and stuff like that i mean just think about like silicon valley <hes> that the world's fair or the world expo things kind of get lost in the because it used to be like the world expo was like the only thing where this kind of technology from different countries could be shared and people would go to learn new things things <hes> but now that's happening all the time yeah and the ones that we probably knew about like historically in america would have been like saint louis in the turn of the twentieth century injury and then obviously the chicago one and they eighteen ninety s and then the new york one in the nineteen sixties and it's like people from all around the country would go to that city just to go oh to the sex position. You don't hear about that anymore. It's not like the whole city. Rochester is leaving to go to go to see some buildings in west virginia all all at once so from april twenty eight till october twenty nine thousand nine hundred sixty seven there was the the montreal expos sixty seven which was officially designated as the universal and international exhibition montreal expo sixty seven <hes> it was originally intended to be in moscow and times concern coincide with the fiftieth anniversary of the october revolution. Oh boy wow <hes> but the u._s._s._r. Withdrew their application in nineteen sixty two due to financial constraints insecurity because i imagine yeah the johndroe who was the mayor montreal at the time lobbied the canadian government to reapply and the expo was officially awarded to montreal during the fifty first session of the general assembly of the b. i. e. in nineteen sixty two anti to coincide with the one hundred anniversary of the canadian confederation and and three hundred twenty five years since the founding montreal drapeau pioneered the idea of creating new islands in the st lawrence river and enlarging the existing islands to house the expo. That's such a huge undertaking right with five years. You've five years yeah some islands this river a lot of people who were against the ideas because they didn't think it would be finished and time uh-huh wow yeah not that they didn't want canada at were montreal to have the exposure and whatnot they just they were like we're gonna look a fool but yeah this is not going to happen. At time. My god the theme of excellent sixty seven was man and his world addressing man social role and environmental responsibility so this was the early to mid nineteen sixties. There weren't a whole lot of women being mentioned. The word man appear is over and over and i just wanna throw that up <hes> <hes> so in may of nineteen sixty three a group of prominent canadian thinkers including allan jarvis who was the director of the national <music> gallery of canada novelist hugh maclennan and gabrielle roy j two zero wilson who was a geophysicist and claude rogue large town-planner met for three days in a clubbing comeback to come up with the expo theme the theme was borrowed from the book latinos azzam by antoine de saint exupery of the little prince fame on the title is usually translated into english as either would be planning of mankind which is drug translation i but it's also been published under wind sand and stars which is very pretty yeah. Uh the book addressed the universal problems of humanity of there are many the expo sixty seven corporation published a book entitled today's slash man and his world and in the introduction to the book a ah gabrielle roy who was one of the people involved in creating a theme she wrote in towns on his hunting book so filled with dreams and hopes hopes for the future antoine to stay exer- billy wright's of how deeply moved he was when flying for the first time by night alone over argentina he happened to notice a few flickering lights scattered below him across an almost empty plain they twinkled here and there alone like stars in truth being made aware our own solitude can give us insight into the solitude of others it can even cause us to gravitate towards one another as if to lessen our distress without this inevitable solitude. Would there be any fusion at all. Any tenderness between human beings moved what s he was by a heightened awareness of the solitude of all creation and by the human need for solidarity saint exit belief found a phrase to express his anguish and his hope was as simple as it was rich in meaning and because that phrase was chosen many years later to be the governing idea of expo sixty seven a group of people from i'm all walks of life was invited by the corporation to reflect upon it and see how it could be given tangible form. Wow no cool. Wow what that's a little a little dark very very weirdly emotional for the theme of a huge world expo right but you know nowadays. It feels like if somebody's like oh. We've put what this big conference together. We're gonna get like a you know someone that plans events and we're going to get somebody that knows the town. It's like then you know people with money. You're gonna tell us what we need to do for this but this sounds like it was like okay well yeah we have some writers and we have some people who we were prominent in the community. We have a geophysicist yeah we have. You know all different kinds of people kind of coming together so that all of their ideas seat i mean in without without having any knowledge of how it went on but it seems like maybe they were all taken seriously and then their ideas may have all been incorporated operated. Yes which is way more like socialist than we think yeah very very cultural forward culturally like like concentrated idea like a philosophy in which to grow everything else out of instead of it being like just like practical ideas. He is yeah. That's crazy. Yes and very polite because it's canadian yes of course awfully so with this. It was no longer scientific mcconnell logical and industrial progress alone that were to be presented and promoted in the exhibition but also man's social responsibility and environmental consciousness. I'm from the official guide of expo sixty seven which i assume was like a guidebook purchase the theme pavilions were command the explorer which can are comprised man and life man his climate and space man and the oceans and a and the polar regions man and his health. Oh okay sorry educational. Yes there is some of that in there was other soft tail. There's also also man the producer retired resources for man and controlled which has read aloud without laughing uh-huh wow man the creator had gallery of fine arts contemporary sculpture industrial design and photography man in the community had seven displays relating into urban life and his interdependence on others and manley provider was about agriculture culture. <hes> there was eight million called labyrinth which was a pavilion of functional architecture designed for the presentation of the multi multi screen film in the labyrinth which all mentioned again in a little bit <hes> there was also habitat sixty seven which was quote one hundred and fifty eight standard reinforced concrete boxes that combined the advantages of individual houses with dense urban development. That sounds like a data like this it without knowing what this is. You've seen this before. How about sixty seven. It sounds familiar. It also sounds like a dystopia nightmare currently still there and used as condos okay in addition to this more than fifty countries had pavilions as well as canada's atlantic provinces their western provinces ontario and quebec doc as well as maine vermont and new york state each on their own pavilions. Ask here like we touch you guys. We're going to get rich there. Were also a ton of privately sponsored pavilions. Some of which include air canada the boy scouts the canadian etienne national railway the indians of canada which i assume would be the first nations people but indians of canada was the title of the pavilion there was a judaism simple billion kodak had one which i had to throw in 'cause you guys were on there was the olympic house and also the united nations awesome cool <hes> bell telephone sponsored b telephone pavilion which featured exciting walt disney imagineering circle vision vision three sixty documentary film candidate sixty seven wow exposed no way from the expo sixty seven guidebook. You're on on center stage for the r._c._m._p. Musical ride on center ice for hockey on the track at the stampede circle vision three sixty surrounds you with all the funding on an excitement of canada's most thrilling events scenic beauty and then kick your children to the enchanted forest see exciting new communication services for the future her all in the telephone pavilion what sinked title that was disgusting but i imagine it's like so you're basically dome with a movie that plays all around now did dome low. It's like imagine you're in a round room with jackson on the walls around you. Have you been to walt disneyworld across. I have no oh my gosh is notting has what you're talking about. The reason i put in the whole description for that is canada sixty seven which was the movie i just described served as the inspiration for oh canada the circle vision three sixty foam it says currently playing at the candidate pavilion at walt disney world epcot but it closed for renovations a few weeks ago. I think oh wow okay. That's cool. I was reading. This allowed add to my husband. Was i was doing it and i was like tell me what this sound canada but apparently the foam foam since the expo closed the film will even seem like once for some weird. Oh that's weird. You know archives it good for that yeah. Archives are good for that kind of thing have them in the worry. The strong museum of plane is not that's. That's that's me we don't have the canada the exposition film but you know yeah exactly out when you france we billion display discoveries from jacques cousteau's underwater research search expeditions in the man the explorer pavilion the netherlands brought a model which presented advances in land reclamation and the soviet pavilion civilian which turned out to be the most visited pavilion in the whole expo at probably because of this they exhibited the original space capsule in which yuri gagarin became the man to orbit the earth in nineteen sixty one. That's really cool really cool especially because we hadn't gone to space yet it yeah that's been to the moon yet. That's really cool. I'm in man. The creator one hundred eighty eighty works of famous painters from fifty national galleries were shown during the expo sixty seven in the national film board of canada's in the labyrinth which i mentioned a second ago and ferguson's men and the polar regions both used complex multi projector multi-screen systems this led to the founding of a corporation called multi-screen which eventually became renamed maks frisk. I film under the i max name debuted at the world's fair in osaka japan in nineteen seventy. Oh that's cool glow <hes> there was an amusement park built for the expo spro which is called law rammed when the expo fairgrounds closed every on piano they could still visit iran which closed around two thirty a._m. I it eighty slow operational. It is currently owned by six flags. Oh hey okay. I saw i was like isn't that a six plans. Uh-huh for this and six flags was just like i'm gonna buy every amusement park. Let's not owned by disney yeah they. They had one near a syrian lake. Yeah they have six flags darien laying around albany so i would go to the great escape and like george which is now six five. Oh oh yeah yeah like george there when i was a kid like georgia's nice. It's really nice anything about it. We'll we'll go okay. It's a good summer tourist destination. There is a functioning nine m revolutionary war there yeah fire the cannon a couple couple times a day all right. I'm into that yeah. We'll do that so the united states. Pavilion was a geodesic dome designed by american architect buckminster fuller. Oh hey i know him. Basically if anybody says geographic music dome yeah. It's puck guy that's true. It's funny because i my background is in science. I'm knock on wood. Hopefully going to nursing school next semester. Talkers are good for you but so i took a lot of chemistry and stuff and there's a <hes> ah carbon structure called buckminsterfullerene when looks like a soccer ball because it does it resembles able geodesic dome so they gave him he really found his niche in stuck with it the <hes> in the afternoon of may twentieth nineteen sixty seven a fire burned away the building's transparent acrylic bubble but the steel structure remained wow and apparently not everyone liked the pavilion including u._s. President lyndon b johnson who who after a brief visit was alleged to have said the homosexuals had carte blocks in reference to design and content of the displays l._b._j. Didn't unlike anything what's like homosexuals. They've done it again man. They love a dome of geodesic diese dome. If i know anything about the gays he that was i should say may he rest in peace so inherently gay about my mountains that buckminster fuller was sure of course it was his fault and so everything was their fault. Wow that's hysterical. I love that yeah. I really liked as well. <hes> also the ed sullivan show was broadcast live twice during the expo on may seventh and twenty first cool cool yeah and the expo was visited by many notable people of the time including queen elizabeth the second the aforementioned current euros does president at the time lyndon b johnson are princess grace of monaco <hes> jackie kennedy and robert f kennedy ethiopian emperor highly selassie are charles de gaulle who i believe was in charge of france at the time i'm not one hundred percent sure yeah acts on and also being crosby and marlene dietrich who on the celebs mainland people looking at polar bears and being surrounded by by videos of the forest gay dome it was a real hot happened in plano. That's true. I mean they had like three channels of tv. The logo for the expo was designed by montreal artists. My name juliana a bear. It is picked her grams of man linked in twos to represent friendship and repeated in a circular arrangement to signify friendship friendship around the world. That's kinda sweet. Be logo did not receive unanimous support from politicians and some tried to have it killed in the house of commons of canada it yeah i don't know <hes> so the legacy of the expo fifty million visitors averse across the time span of the expo visited when canada's population was only twenty million which set a per capita attendance record wow at the time it was the second best attended b._i._e. Sanctioned world expo after the nineteen hundred exposition is this only sale in paris on its fourth after oh sacramento eighteen seventy and shanghai twenty ten how what are. I don't remember number hearing about that. I mean what about shanghai that's all. That's a lot of people there yeah that'll break every record. I'm there were several buildings that were demolished immediately after the expo ended but many continued on through an exhibition called man and his world which opened every summer until nineteen eighty one oh how sh- just like that's really good like re use of these things that might have been expected to be temporary like i know we've we've talked about when they had it in buffalo amu- in our boy mckinley mckinley got shot. You said that they raised a lot of the buildings there afterward because i had other stuff to do we're not going to we're not going to use these beautiful beaux arts buildings anymore tear down and like we've seen this swith places that host the olympics too is that they hurry up and they built all these structures that are supposed to be temporary and then a lot of them. Don't get don't get reuse. Yeah you know right now. Looks like that in their olympics. Were only three years ago. Some of their stuff was barely ready near a big starting. It was not the one where the athletes not locked in the bathroom because the doorknob fall off. I know both of them seemed rife with oh. My gosh expose is now a park run by the city of montreal known as it's parked gendreau after the gentleman who decided montreal should host the expo buckminster fuller's dome is now called the montreal biosphere sphere and is an environmental sciences museum how cool it sat empty as steel skeleton until nineteen ninety one environment in canada purchased the site to turn it into an interactive museum showcasing and exploring the water ecosystems of great lakes saint lawrence river regions. The museum was inaugurated in nineteen fifty five as a water museum in a set of enclosed buildings designed by era go t._i. Inside the original steel skeleton leton the bio changed its name in two thousand seven to become an environment museum it offers interactive activities and presents exhibitions about the major the environmental issues related to water climate change air ecotechnologies and sustainable development cool stephen love it. Oh yeah my husband totally into into it yeah all right. I guess we're gonna go. He's going to hear this episode and he's like well. I guess <hes> i previously mentioned habitat sixty seven condos which it kinda wants from the start <hes> expo sixty seven is seen as a landmark moment in canadian history. It sorta changed the tide of how canada was viewed in <hes> in nineteen sixty eight. <hes> montreal was awarded a major league baseball franchise which they decided to call the expos. It's called the expos yeah. I never knew that either. Oh that's amazing in two thousand four the expos are relaxed. Montreal and there are now the washington nationals so quick related to this so at the museum some of the papers that i do take care of our by bonnie erickson accent who she worked with jim henson on a lot of them up. It's she created miss piggy among others <hes> she also went on to have a really great career designing mascots for major league sports and u._b. Who was who was the mascot for the montreal expos was one of her creations and then when the expos left montreal we all <hes> they traded u._b. To the montreal canadians making him the only major league sports mascot who has changed leagues. Oh yeah oh that's very interesting. I don't like canadians are lacking. I gotta go with the rangers. Okay yeah that is funny the little side thing what i was trying to think of a quiz digger with this when my husband realised that the expos renamed actor the montreal expo he was like you. You should do something about hockey teams. I was the extras were beaten on jeopardy the poor guy in the spring of twenty seventeen the city the entrepreneurial and the committee in charge of celebrations for the three hundred and seventy fifth anniversary of the founding of the city on a program out out which included exhibits at a number of montreal museums. Oh i've caught the mccord museum i presented fashioning expo sixty seven kevin focusing on the faction and aesthetic from the expo the museum of contemporary art hosted in search of expo sixty seven an exhibition mission by nineteen artists born after nineteen sixty seven whose work was inspired by the expo. I'll tell the stewart museum presented expo expo sixty seven a world of dreams and immersive multimedia experience in which visitors could actually experience expo sixty seven through virtual reality reality friggin cool that is really <hes> and the city hall of montreal hosted an exhibition of photos taken during the expo on there have been a handful of pop culture references mostly to the buildings and not actually actually the expert sal aren't but an episode of the nineteen seventies television series battle star galactica was filmed at the expo site in nineteen sixty nine. The structures were used to represent an alien city where everyone was killed at a long ago war. Oh jeez. The scouts came in there. Were like this is. We don't have anything on me. Nineteen seventy nine tv series buck rogers in the twenty fifth century entry which i know exclusively because of its daffy duck <hes> party or in a half century <hes> but the actual buck rogers in the twenty th century used footage to represent the futuristic city of new chicago <hes> <hes> a nineteen seventy nine film called quintet which shot entirely on the expo site during the winter using abandoned pavilions to portray a post apocalyptic landscape the area it seems i mean they used to use it and got paid and there is a canadian band called all vase which looks like the word always instead of a w all these <unk>. I don't released a video for their song called dreams tonight and which they have digitally inserted themselves into footage from the expo because they thought that was the coolest time of canada's history wow really all their canadian fans britain canada canada. We love canada. I'm much further away. When i love canada's well i and so that's what i haven't suppose. Sixty-seven thank you holly. Oh my god. I never knew anything about this so this is so interesting. Thank you so much holly ali for telling us all about that. Yeah that's awesome. I'll extract on his question writer too because if i something something easy that i knew i never would have been inspired to are you all that is the definition of making lemonade out of lemons holly. That's wonderful wonderful awesome. I would've bird to have gotten a big fat. Check true yeah not diminishing that yeah the of so you must have a quiz for us. Then i do have a quiz for you. I allie rocked my brain trying to think of something witty to connect to world's fair expo or something like that and i came up empty so oh my quiz is about things that made their debut at a world's fair awesome question number one an item that most of us have our refrigerator right now made its debut at the eighteen seventy six world's fair in philadelphia by nineteen o seven twelve million bottles were being produced to ship worldwide name this condiment question number two suburban dads around the world have something to do on summer saturday afternoons. Thanks to this invention debuted at the eighteen fifty five expose c._e._o. Universal on wean lean towards industry it they bose octa palley that would be the universal exposition of agriculture products industry art. What what is this machine which you may walk behind or ride up question number three now. They're in every room in every house but once upon a time nine these were a futuristic concept being introduced by scientists they actually had to separate debuts at the world's fair i in nineteen thirty nine and then and again in living color in nineteen sixty four nameless r._c._a. Invention number four even if it's your local county fair and not a worldwide event like world expo you'll see one of these which made his debut at the eighteen ninety three chicago world's fairs columbian exposition nameless midway icon which my sister and i once got stepped at the top of during the altimonte question number five nowadays exposure to these is limited to only when necessary and attended by a medical professional at nineteen thousand four world's fair in saint louis the images which is produced by this for being shown off a curious scientific discovery what was discovered question question number six medical technology wasn't the only important thing that came out of mr lewis in nineteen o four summer wouldn't be the same without the cooperation of to in food vendors station next to each other. What tasty treat did they create question number. Seven at the nineteen we need to world's fair in knoxville tennessee coca cola arrived armed with new flavors for fair goers to try which one fruit so popular that they bobbled pulled it and released it nationwide by nineteen eighty five question number eight these days just about every tourist attraction has at least one of these machines. I have a collection of products from iran walt disneyworld which souvenir machine whose <unk> fifty one cents debuted at the eighteen ninety three world's fair in japan question number nine. I prefer the frosted mini ones but my dad likes. The full size is one was boiling water poured over them something i'll never understand which cereal premiered to the public at chicago's world columbian next edition in eighteen ninety three and question number ten walt disney was heavily involved in the nineteen sixty three world's fair in new york city he hired an army of imagine nearest create audio animatronic to dazzle fair goers at four disney created rides. Three of these attractions are still in operation at disney parks to disneyland in california and one at the magic kingdom at walt disney world in florida name. We'll give you about a minute. I just think and be back with your answers awesome <music> in how <music> aw all right. How do you feel lauren. I'm feeling pretty good up to a point. I was like this so good and then we got toward the end and i was like lynn yeah all right lane on us holly. We're ready okay question number one an item that most of us have a refrigerator right now made its debut at the eighteen eighteen seventy six world's fair in philadelphia by one thousand nine hundred seven twelve million bottles were being produced to ship worldwide named this rod condiment. I mean like i guess a heinz ketchup. It's i'm going to say just catch up. Catch catch us catch up. Yeah catch up. I mean you can say heinz ketchup or say okay ketchup. Ah heinz ketchup heinz ketchup time such up job heinz ketchup has been around for a few years at this point but it was first publicized nationally at the world's spare and it took off on as long as you don't put it on hot dogs in chicago. You're okay yeah yes so i've heard pittsburgh sure uh of course we have the heinz history center there and it's named after senator john heinz but it's so it's a bunch of pittsburgh history but also there's a whole level. It's all about the hines food corporation history and it's great. Oh yeah there's like there's one section that it's they made like all these artwork out of like sculptures awesome stuff out of ketchup bottles and they have like a historical timeline of all of the products that they've ever made and you know it's awesome the whole the whole museum is a great history museum just top to bottom. Yes like a fabulous museum but yeah the hines part is surprisingly interesting. Yeah like you're like. I don't know what am i going to learn learn about relish and pick and catch up but you're like wow super super into relishing another run heinz heinz ketchup in fact if you go on their website you can buy personal is bottles of my father puts catch up on everything everything and so one year for his birthday or maybe it was personally. I don't remember. I got him a bottle that says i think it says this is dad's catch up. Don't touch or something like that but he used it. He washed out the bottle and dangerous move so i'm sure it's in a box before they moved. It was on the little table well where he kept his keys in his wallet. That's a really great souvenir idea idea they recommend them or i don't know recommend is is the right word but they advertise them as <hes> letting taper a little bottle of punch up and a little bottle buster and then put your name the wedding date on them and look at them together super useful that's useful that is like a million times better than jordan melvyn star the scourge of the earth forget it yeah. That's a great idea actually anyway question number. Two suburban dodds around the world have something to do on summer saturday afternoons. Thanks to this invention debuted at the eighteen fifty five exposition universal day pod. We lag with cultural day linda sleepover tabo salt. Apparently what is this machine which you may walk behind or ride on. I'm going to say that's a lawnmower. Route is a lawnmower. Can you imagine like having to write that out. Every time like you're back today. Family i went to the universal exposition to agriculture goes on so long. I don't know i didn't name it through. Yes being law nor burst. I made its debut there or the automatic. I guess lawnmower out if that's the right way to phrase it but they used to have ones that the blade would rotate <unk>. It wasn't like powered at all all right. You know what i mean. Yeah you'd have to push it yourself and like yeah which i personally have never used but from what i hear that they're a whole lot harder than using gas powered ones. I don't have a long anymore so i don't have to worry about how that's pretty eighty nine yeah. That's the thing in florida that don't have a lawn <hes> question number three now. They're in every room every house house but once upon a time these were futuristic concept being introduced by scientists they actually had to separate debuts at the world's fair i in nineteen thirty nine and then again again in living color nineteen sixty four name this r._c._a. Invention it's going to be the television yeah. I'm gonna say. Television is a television cool. I'm and in at the both of those worlds fairs were in new york at the one thousand nine hundred eighty nine. They actually had albert einstein giving a talk about out cosmic rays and how he tube inside made the picture of the year and in nineteen sixty four r._c._a.'s color television was one of the many groundbreaking inventions on display and new yorkers didn't just get i look. They actually got to see themselves on the screen. Oh oh my god i blew a lot of people's minds that nowadays it by and then your faces on this magic machine over your russia that's crazy i question number four even if it's your local county fair and not a worldwide event like a world expo you'll see one of these which made its debut at the eighteen ninety three chicago world's fair columbian exposition nameless midway icon which my sister and i once thought stock at the topic during the ultimate fair i mean we laughed because it's so sad sorry. That's a ferris wheel but you're going to have to in that. He's a forest hill <hes>. I don't remember exactly how old we were my sister's. He's ten years younger than i am so she was like elementary school age so she was letting we decided to go on the ferris i will because we had a bazillion times and you know at some point during a riot. It's gonna pause so other people get on and off. We got up to the top and paused and we're watching like drag racing or something like off in the distance. There was some sort of mechanical something going on and the i will start off and it goes one way a little bit and stopped so we're like halfway down really fiery. We'll sit there for a second and then we'll go donald and then it starts going in the opposite direction and we go back to the top we sit the affirmative and then we go the other away so we're halfway down again and then we go back to the top and then we go the way halfway down my first i we'll for like forty five minutes. It was august it was like twelve billion degrees on this was in new york not florida so it wasn't as there's the reason our local thirds in january but yes so stop at the top of the ferris wheel for what felt like a millionaires and you've never gotten back on since because you've spent all the time. You have a lot in this like that's it. I ain't my limit now that you say that i'm not one hundred percents or i have been on <hes> the information that i had written down about the ferris wheel oh yeah in eighteen ninety three george washington gale ferris junior was catched with creating a landmark that could rival the eiffel tower which had wild fair goers at the previous world's fair to do so he created a two hundred and sixty four foot wheel that held thirty six cars and two thousand one hundred and sixty people at once will became very popular at the fair costing each person fifty cents to ride but this was an eighteen ninety three fifty cents back then i'm like i can't even imagine charging twenty five bucks an hour or something yeah absolutely for an experience like that. That's crazy. People wow geez this question number five nowadays exposure to these is limited to only when necessary and attended by a medical professional at the nineteen in a horror world's fair in saint louis. The images produced by this were being shown off as a curious scientific discovery. What was this discovery closer. X ray xrays yeah are x rays. X rays were discovered in eighteen ninety five by wilhelm con runyon who was a professor at wurzburg university in germany working with a cathode ray tube. His laboratory renton observed a fluorescent glow of crystals on a table near his tube. He concluded that a new type of ray was being omitted and this ray was capable of passing through the heavy paper covering an exciting the fast forescent present materials in the room at the new ray could pass through most substances casting shadows of solid objects he also discovered the ray could pass through the tissues of humans but not bones and metal objects and one of the images he famously displayed was an x ray of his wife's was her left hand. Can you imagine it feels like every you know all of these veges sub we're talking about. It's like if the first time can imagine seeing any of these things for the i just like people must have been screaming in horror constantly like the first movie was like or like one of the first movies was it's like a train that was coming at you where people were literally jumping out of their seats together. The way like i know for not coming out of in modern maturity must have been terrifying like you're like yes. I'm a person and then you put. They put their hand on and got an x ray of their bow on their bones. We spend so much time trying to not see our bone even them inside our skin suits except your outfall bone yeah except you're outside bones never forget your teeth are outside bones. Okay question number six six medical technology wasn't the only important thing that came out of saint louis in nineteen. O four summer wouldn't be the same without the cooperation of two who'd member station station next to each other. What tasty treat did they create. You've got the yacht. Isn't it an ice cream cone. It is an ice cream. Ha as the story goes ernest a humbly was selling small waffle like desserts next to an ice cream vendor at the fair early the ice scream guys not important enough to be named when the ice cream vendor ran out of cops home we decided to roll up his waffles into a cornucopia copious shape so that it could hold scoops of ice cream. The result was the first american ice cream called also just for the record <hes> there was a lot of food going on in st louis in nineteen. Oh four hamburgers hot dogs peanut butter cotton candy and iced tea are also thought to have. I gotten their publicity at the nineteen. Oh four world old sir were where would we be without any of any of those. I mean i could probably do without ice cheap but still you know the principal stance. You're itself. I'm so sorry maybe you just haven't had good iced tea. Maybe that's it. I will know. I'm far enough south. That are not not really south anymore. I'm in the six zero question number. Seven at the nineteen eighty two world's fair in knoxville tennessee coca-cola arrived armed with new flavors for fairbrother's to try which flavor proved so popular that they bottled it and released it nationwide by eighteen eighty five. I would say cherry yeah. I've seen like a common flavor that we know now. That's probably still being done but cherry coke. I would say cherry coke yeah gary yeah. It was cherry coke. They wanted to hearken back to the days of the soda fountain where they had add various syrups that the soda jerker dowden and i thus far and away cherry was the favourite which is why you you can still buy it today all sorts of weird flavors that no one wants yeah. I don't wanna spicy mango coke. Excuse me just give me. I don't want spicy mango any it's very strange. I don't know we all need new stuff. I guess question number eight. These days just about every tourist attraction has at least one of these machines. I have a collection of their products from around while disneyworld which souvenir machine whose product costs just fifty one cents debuted at the eighteen ninety three world's fair in chicago. Is this like a <hes>. <hes> you know i'm just thinking about it now. Is this like one of those squished. Penny gets henny penny swisher a pennies days. Does that have a real name. I mean is it. I generally referred to as a penny press. Penny press <hes> better than squish meet rob me a trademark though the it may be like got kleenex sharia and a thing <hes> <hes> but these handy money collector started their careers at the eighteen ninety three fair the squashed pennies were simpler with only read letters stating columbian exposition eighteen ninety three but each machine had seven different designs for for the lettering <unk> tourists could pick their favourite and treasure and elongated coin for the agency funny. That's cool. Oh i never knew where they came from that it was interesting question number nine. I prefer the frosted mini ones uh-huh but my dad likes the full-sized with boiling water poured over them something i'll never understand which cereal premiered to the public at chicago's world columbian exposition in eighteen ninety three go ahead shredded. We address shredded. You put boil. He puts boiling water over it. I always thought he 'cause they used to be the big brick. Yeah that's the ones you'd get learn where literally like this is of brick. Take one but it in a bowl or boiling water over. I guess it was almost like an oatmeal harm or something. I don't know i never did it. I always thought it was weird. I thought it was worth mentioning <music> out today. Dad who never ever list those <hes> but shredded wheat was at the time being manufactured by the natural food company company and niagara falls new york became known as the shredded wheat company in one thousand nine hundred four and then was bought by the national biscuit company nabisco visco and december nineteen twenty eight. That's crazy. I just remember when i learned that nabisco was the national biscuit company in my mind was slow and yeah. It's always fun to find out like the origins of you know company trade name since like hasbro the toy company. They're the hassenfeld brothers <hes> that comes from. I like something brothers. I couldn't look name though but yeah it's fun when it's like yeah you just that you just has always been in your life and then when you discover the like adidas the guy who formed a team was adi dassler edit that is not all day. I dream about sports so corn. The corn song is something else. Uh-huh okay and question number ten ken walt disney was heavily involved in the nineteen sixty three roads olds fair in new york city he hired an army of engineers to create audio animatronic to dazzle thurbers at four disney created rides. Three of these attractions are still in operation at disney parks to at disneyland in california and one at the magic kingdom at walt disney world in florida name awesome okay. I think we know run off the bat okay. It's a small. It's a small world. Definitely gonna mentioned that what about the the hall of presidents is that an. I can never remember which one disneyland in which ones and college presidents is in disney world okay so small world is immoral to descend. Listen disneyworld okay so i'm gonna say i'm gonna go with disneyworld then i mean there's two in california yeah still so i'm going to say it's a small world is the one in florida and florida yes all right. There's animatronic in like pirates of the caribbean but that was. I don't think it was made in the sixties originally predated the movies but i don't think that that's it what else what else what else what else <hes> brad a slight disadvantage we have never been to disneyland and i have never been to disneyworld or disneyland so <hes> i can't think of anything what are some rides the cups those spinney cock and says cups in his basement cops. You got your <hes>. Do the dumbo flying dumbo. 's yet the fun don't plunge again the official name. I don't know yeah. I don't i don't think we i don't think we could fathom the ma another using land guests so you get partial credit okay great so it's a small small world which was act. The key pavilion at the world's fair is at disneyland in california original carew's one in florida but it's a recreation mckay original. One from the world's fair was backed up in a box and ship to california clo- interested in the the illinois pavilion at the world's fair. There was an on your animatronic abraham lincoln louise. He's not the one of the hall of presidents residents don't david. There's it disneyland in california. There's an attraction called great moments with mr lincoln which i've never been to disneyland so i've never done but my understanding is. It's our abe lincoln sitting in a chair and telling i don't know if he's doing like the gettysburg address or by instance whereas the hall of presidents in florida has every president yeah to including our current president <hes> and a couple a so they'll say things and the current president generally gives a full speech. I haven't been since the updated it because they took a drag their feet adding donald trump to it <hes>. I just updated the chairs as well. Could it is terrible. Can you imagine being a kid like super excited to go to disneyland that your parents take you to the talking with mr like great moments with mr lincoln so i imagine it's it's him like you know when you turn your pillow over the cool side. That's a great moment. It's not anything to do with his life. Talking about simple pleasures from you mentally law. I should tell you that they do things which is actually right next to the hall of presidents right now. That's it's not you know sam the eagle from up. Who's all mr patriotic. He hosts a thing called great moments in history but only the parts the singer song and it's ridiculous. That's cute. I love him <hes> but anyway the attraction that is currently arriving at walt disney's magic kingdom is from the general electric pavilion at the world's filming at walt disney world or to mark merlin tomorrow future tomorrow helped me. I don't know the world we've already told gave our answer. She's take it. It's like it's like the world of tomorrow right. Walt disney's carousel of progress notable because the shooter rotates around <music> set stage like you sit there and there's the guy and his dog and he tells you a little bit about the scene in history. It's always are well as just about the turn of a century and this and that and the other dan <hes> i love it. I shouldn't sound like so dismissive abou it but then rather than the stage turning when you go to the next scene the the whole year turn yeah cool so i was at disneyworld once when i was eight and it was the worst day of my life but it's a long story it's very dramatic also but we were on that we were on a version of that i guess at disneyworld and it kept getting stuck and we saw the nineteen forties agrees like four times and i remember from it is this lady was standing in one of those like fake exercise machine belts that like suppose that offer so you. That's what i remember from my trip to disneyworld is like this this like manneken lady like standing there and getting a little uh-huh. Oh lord <hes> but yes that. The one from the world's fair is here in florida. It's been updated because oh last. I don't know what the lasting originally was but it's currently the future which looks very nineteen ninety s on the floor ride. The disney was involved was called the magic skyway at the ford pavilion which is not intact anywhere anymore. I it you gotta know little vehicle of some sort and road through the past the president of the future. I'm and there were dinosaurs in the past which are currently in disneyland in the diorama that you pass army santa fe and disneyland railroad. Oh oh that's fun oh so they they did reuse some of the stuff from it if not like whole cloth good oh that's very cool. That was my quiz about stuff that happened. That was great. Thank you again. I commend you on your question riding yeah. It was great great. Thank you so much that was so much fun <hes> so yes thank you so much <hes> to holly aaron heim for coming on our show kicking off guests timber yep to kick off guest timber with a great topic that we learned a lot about didn't know anything about previously awesome so yeah. If you have any any comments or questions or whatever you wanna to pass along to us you can reach us atmos- pod at gmail.com. We're on twitter at info pod. <hes> we've facebook page misinformation trivia podcast and we also have a website website tripled up dot simple pod dot com. You can listen to us on our podcast on our podcast. We could lead to on centre partner. Listen to our podcast. You can listen to us on our podcast. Make us explain it. You'll find it okay. You can find it anywhere you can get. Your podcasts asked off our website. The forementioned website and please review it subscribe to holly tells her friends so so thanks so much for listening you guys and thanks again for holly to holly for coming on the show and we'll catch you next time.

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