20 Episode results for "emily vander"

Streaming: Infinity War

Today, Explained

23:21 min | 2 years ago

Streaming: Infinity War

"When was the last time you brush your teeth? Wouldn't it be great if there were podcast. That just occasionally reminded you to do it. The quick electric toothbrush would like to brush. Should teeth for you. It'll do most of the work. All you have to do is go to get quick dot com slash explained where the starts at just twenty five dollars and your first set of refills doesn't cost anything. It's free ooh Emily Vander were critic at large. Vox Do you remember when you signed up for cable actually. Can I tell you along and stupid personal story because I do. We love long and stupid personal personal stories so I grew up in the middle of nowhere. I grew up on a farm outside of town with seven hundred and fifty people in it which town armor South Dakota. Arm Oh you are. It's named after the hot dogs are song in high school was the armor Hotdog Song. And that's the last. We're going to talk about it okay. Packers armor armor packers were kind of kids. Love Armor Pecker. Fat Kid skinny kids kids who climb on rocks tough kid with chickenpox Kloof high team that exchange I grew up in this town and we to get TV. We had one of those old antennas that was sticking way up into the sky. It took many many years for cable to come out to that part heard of the country and I do remember when I first got cable because it was my first day of college. So let's go from South Dakota putting out a little antenna to get ABC NBC and CBS. To what we're about to have or to what we already have this deluge of streaming services. What's coming out what's already out? What's about to change the landscape right now is we're sort of on the precipice of what I call the streaming apocalypse? We have all of the traditional TV infrastructure. Then you have streaming players Netflix Hulu Amazon but also like HBO now CBS. All access plus some of these other services that are tied to traditional TV channels. What's happening is we're about to get a bunch more streaming services apple? TV plus just launched Apple TV plus the destination. The highest quality rituals Disney pluses launching on Tuesday November twelfth phenomenal one of number kind service with content. Only does he can provide an experience. Only Disney could create next year. Hbo Max is coming in May HBO. Max We'll begin with about about ten thousand hours of content peacock from NBC. Universal is coming in April in addition to the office peacock will be the exclusive streaming home of parks parks and recreation cheers. Saturday night live and will and grace among others. It's definitely a situation where everybody is kind of like getting their horses in narrow unstable and then they're paying you access to come and look at the horses. Why is this all happening? Right now is just Netflix. Doing yes but it's more complicated than in that you've got all of these sort of companies that are realizing the value of their catalog titles. Because if you look at viewership on net flicks most those viewership on Netflix is still these shows that became popular on traditional television ran for hundreds upon hundreds of episodes and they all are owned by other companies. NBC He owns the office. Warner media owns friends. Disney owns grey's anatomy. CBS owns cheers. Frazier some of those shows like all of these shows. Those are owned by other companies and those other companies are like look at all this money. Net flicks is making and also if Netflix gets so big. That we're reliant on it as our distribution system we're in essence reliant on it to show other people are programming. That's an existential threat to us all right. Well let's talk about what they're doing about that existential threat starting with Apple Apple. TV plus which just launched last week. How much does it cost? What is it? It's five dollars a month for ninety nine a month. Technically it's available on like sort of newly purchased. I apple devices for a year. You get that free. Everybody else has to pay five dollars a month for the foreseeable future. And here's what you get. I think eight shows three which are for kids and then you get like four streaming shows the morning show Dickinson see and for all mankind. That's what they launched. What they have more shows was coming in m night Shyamalan horror show a true crime show? There's even more coming in twenty twenty but you get those shows basically so this isn't like a big. Hbo Back Catalogue Catalogue of Friends. There's this here's some brand new shows you've never heard of. There's no catalog. They're betting on the idea that all anybody actually wants are originals. So let's go through these apple. TV plus originals. The morning show. What is it other than an opportunity to look at Steve Carell and Jennifer Aniston? And Reese Witherspoon. It's got Steve Carell. Jennifer Aniston Reese Witherspoon. It's literally really just about a morning show. It's kind of like trying to be about women's struggles in the workplace and then also has gone too far and it's kind of trying to hold those two things in concert. She's throwing me under the bus and while I don't know the details of the allocations I understand that they were serious and that keeping Mitch on. I think we need to watch anymore this. Let's touch that remote. It's not a good show but I also enjoy watching it and I'm going to watch more of it and like I am a a white woman in her thirties. I am powerless to quickly dialogue and workplace settings. So take from that what you will. And how do you feel about the Jason Momoa. Oh I show where no one can see. I think it's called see it's bad Dickinson. It's gotTA premise. Oh Hell Yeah. It's about teen Emily Dickinson and she's a lesbian. But it's useless Kinda in love with death. Life is an endless pain. What is wrong? It's like Super Arch and super campy and it stars Hailee Steinfeld and John Mullany Shas up Henry David Thoreau. Oh Doc. It's laundry day visit. I lose track of time out here in my extreme solid. I think it's sort Lord of the best show out of this initial lineup. But it's also so specifically pitched at White Women in their thirties. who were English majors? And that's me so so we ever trust you on that one. Okay yeah exactly like I know a lot of people who are just like this is a massive. I'm like yes but also for all mankind. What is that for all mankind? It is a speculative fiction. Show it set in a world where the Soviets landed on the moon. I and that leads to like a utopia gentleman. This is a live signal title from the Moon. Shot only got two translation of his word. mavs I just. It's a really like interesting. Showing concept and execution is kind of a little. I'm waggling ogling my hand back and forth like I I enjoyed watching it. I've seen eight out of ten episodes but especially once it gets to a point. Where as my good friend? Catherine van Aaron Donka vulture sure described it a league of their own in space. Wow then I was into it okay so you have to pay four ninety nine to be specific for Apple TV plus in which you know back catalogue. What do you have to pay for Disney plus from which you get Disney Eh? Disney is going to be six hundred ninety nine a month if you do it in a bundle with Hulu which is the Hulu that includes ads and ESPN plus which is not actually like ESPN but has a lot of live sporting events sports. That's twelve ninety nine a a month to me. That's a pretty big deal for a lot of families. What's in the pretty big deal? Disney plus has this massive catalog of titles including star wars movies. Marvel Movies Pixar Pixar movies. Things like that Disney. We'll eventually have the entire Disney Cadillac and by the Disney catalog. We include twentieth century. Fox Yes every episode of the Simpsons will be available day one on Disney plus which is like the single biggest selling point and addition to all of that. They're gonNA make new shows. They are making new shows. Their biggest show is the Mandal Orien- which is star wars spin off that nobody has seen because they haven't sent it to critics often about sign not always a bad sign. They claim they're trying to protect some spoiler events that happened in the premier because we can't be trusted not to spoil it but come on guys plus there's a new lady the trump on Disney plus. It's lady in the TRAMP. They made it with dogs and they made the Docs talk. It's weird can't wait to see someone's kids watching it and be totally transfixed. All of these shows are unobjectionable. Actionable they are just like. You're going to set your kids in front of him. Your kids are going to be like a kind of like that. You're going to be like I kind of like you son. And then like that's it. Happy Upi Disney Happy Disney happy. HBO WHAT IS HBO Maxine. How much does it cost? Hbo Max is going to have a large portion of the warner brother's catalog. They're fourteen ninety nine a month which is going to be pricier than everybody. They can kind of get away with it because they're banking on that. Hbo Brand Name They are essentially just turning HBO now into this New Service and adding a whole bunch of stuff to wit. It's going to have a lot of the warner brothers catalog including again friends. And then it's going to have a bunch of like older movies to me. This is interesting because they are getting Turner Classic Movies which is within the Werner media family to do a curated list of classic movies from the Warner Brothers Archive which includes a lot of other studios that like Ted. Turner bought up in the eighties. Eighties to me as a big classic movie Fan. That's appealing but also like we don't know what it's GonNa look like we haven't seen anything for. Hbo Max Because it's going to be the last one to launch these these big players in May two thousand twenty but they are really making a play for the concert. Okay so those are the big ones apple. TV Plus Disney plus HBO HBO Max but they're another few coming out. Let's not forget. Peacock Peacock Peacock is coming in April and peacocks. Going have the office it's GonNa have parks and rec it's going to have a bunch of these classic. NBC sitcoms along with some original programming. The big thing that it sounds like as it sounds like peacock is going. That'd be free to everybody GONNA BE FREE WITH ADS now. People don't like watching ads but free freeze a big deal. Freeze my favorite. That being said there is no way. I'll have time for all this stuff. Is this why. Netflix is apparently testing feature that will allow people to watch one and a half speed. Do we go straight from peak. TV Too way too much TV. Yeah but also like I don't see away to sort of reverse this process short of a catastrophic like bubble pop. You know the funny thing about one point five speed my colleague Constance Grady said this and I. I'm stealing from her. But it's so brilliant it's turning all of your leisure time into like optimization time into time time when you're like Oh yeah I have to make sure cram much entertainment and as possible to be the most efficient human being. I can be because that's how capitalism works so you and concer basically saying saying that this is turning what we do for fun into work. Yeah but like this whole optimization culture was created because netflix creates baggy. The television shows. Because if you WANNA watch Netflix show like they WANNA keep as much of your attention as possible. That means you watch. Moore's another like well. What if we found a way to artificially take those extra thirty minutes? It's out faster so like it's just not artistically. Viable is bad for the future of my favorite medium television. And I'm just like I hope it doesn't happen. I know it's going to happen. Breath before. Emily's favorite medium suffers a sad artistic. Death who will win the streaming horse. I'm Sean Ramos Room. That is after a quick break on today explained change. Here's a fun thing about the neighborhood. I live in sometimes but not always your mail just disappears. I've never personally seen who takes it but I did almost one time. See the person who brought the package back. Because they didn't I didn't particularly like what was in it with the quip electric toothbrush. People will know that you've been delivered equip electric toothbrush. It says quip and even has like little cartoon toothbrushes on the packaging. So chances are if they're not interested in new toothbrush. They're not going to take that initial delivery and after that the refills who wants refills for brush. They don't have. I guess one thing you might have to worry about is whether they have equip electric toothbrush already and maybe want to snag your refills. But chances are if they do that they've already gotten their first set of refills for free. which you can do for yourself and get quip dot com slash explained and after that? It's just five dollars for refills or ten dollars. If you MONTICELLO toothpaste to they might already be locked in and not snagging other people's packages and you can just have refills to yourself. What a dream? They word emily so we all these new streaming services as well as a bunch of old wants Netflix. Hbo Who Amazon Peacock Apple Disney counter. Table Chair. Whatever who's going to win these streaming wars? I don't know I think that a lot of people assume netflix will be number one forever because not flexes number one right now but I think about a lot like You remember doctor. Strange change in the marvel film Infinity War too. I straight right at the end of that movie. He's kind of going through all of the scenario. Hey what was that. Four in time to see all the possible outcomes of coming conflict. How many did you see fourteen? Six hundred five and he like plucks out the one where the avengers win. How many ruin one one kind of what's happening in that flex right now? The number of scenarios they have in which the could win keeps getting a little bit smaller with every year here because they have all of these outside pressures what you think net flicks could actually lose in all of this yeah in a post net neutrality atrocity world. Your Internet service provider can charge you more money to watch Netflix. Hbo Max is connected to an Internet service provider it's connected to the. At and T. companies. You've verse I have direct. TV In a post net neutrality world. You maybe won't have to pay extra to watch. Hbo Max IF YOU'RE AN AT and T.. Subscriber that gives. Hbo Max a leg got over net flicks. This is kind of part of the reason. I'm bullish on peacock because peacock is connected to comcast which is one of the largest cable companies in the world and in oppose net neutrality world. Who Wins is a question less about who has the best content or who has the best interface or anything like that? It is so much more a question of what you can watch and like. What part of the country you live in? So that's a big strike against Netflix. Because without net neutrality the platforms connected to cable and Internet providers will have a head start. They'll do better. Is there a strike into. Can we stick with the baseball analogy strike against them as now. They've lost the office. They've lost friends so like the casual subscribers there. I'm actually going to subscribe to this instead. Because it has what I like. So they lose a bunch of subscribers. Okay straight to is. They're losing their biggest shows. Dare I ask sitting here in the District of champions home of the Washington nationals for a strike three the third thing is there in tremendous amounts of debt at a certain point that debt comes calling like they have to find a way to make that debt they start charging more for subscriptions which drives more people away which makes them have to charge more for subscriptions with straps more people away and they're also paying premium on top of what they're paying for Netflix to like their ISP SP to be able to watch Netflix. Probably all of these things won't happen probably it'll be you know one or two of them but like if all of them happen. netflix gets caught in a spiral where it becomes as more and more expensive and people are like I have other options now. I'm going to watch one of those. And at that point you know Netflix starts to look pre. He reasonable is something that like an apple whole might acquire and like. I don't think this will actually happen. But that is not out of the realm of possibility is not a thing I would have said. Even two years ago Bowie at at the end of vendors endgame the Thanos is all Ironman is all even if it was a long shot. The avengers did win in the end. End So sticking with your analogy here where the avengers are Netflix. Is there a possible future where Netflix can win. Oh sure Netflix could absolutely absolutely win. Like there is a scenario in which they have become so synonymous with streaming. Were like people are like. We're GonNa just netflix something tonight. Like where that becomes so synonymous in the way that Google has become synonymous with search. That like they just can't be defeated. One of the other solutions like Netflix is big enough. Maybe they buy some studios catalog catalogue. You've got the Sony Pictures Catalog and the paramount catalog are both sort of dangling out there for anybody who might WanNa buy them because both of those companies are kind of financially struggling so like maybe flies that maybe that's their solution to the content problem because again. I don't think they're going anywhere but I do think that they're kind of stuck in this place. Where like they have to navigate a bunch of possible futures and many of them end catastrophically? Emily the last time we had you on the show. It was to talk about the end of game of thrones and the death of our monoculture that game of thrones could have potentially been sort of the last show that we all kinda sat around and watch no matter who we were. We're we were and I wonder when we talk about all of these different services and how people will pick and choose from them how that affects our Mono uh-huh culture or or further kill it or affect our culture as a whole yet. I'm worried about this pop. Culture is one of the things that unites us as Americans pickens and like a lot of our pop. Culture is bad but like the fact that a whole bunch of people watch the masked singer every week or that everybody watched the game of thrones finale. I love that aspect of our pop culture and I really worry about it going away and like people have treated it as an inevitability for a long time and I never have because there's always something there's always something that comes along whether it's the marvel movies whether it's you know Taylor swift whether it's beyond say or fantasy show about dragons. Yeah they're always these things that cross over and hit big and like I worry about a world in which that doesn't happen I worry about a world in which like the things that become. The monoculture are actually like very small and very specific to certain niche cultures. And I worry that that further stratified society. -ociety I don't see an easy way out of that one either and if I think about it at the same time. The natural default state of humanity is having several small regional cultures. That don't add up to a monoculture but like that are sort of in conversation with each other and maybe we're just getting back to that. Maybe the twentieth century we had this monoculture was a blip and maybe we're returning turning to our natural state and like maybe. I should just be okay with Emily Vendor writes about TV for Vox and if you WANNA know even more about the business behind these streaming services maybe even hear from the CEOS themselves check out the recode media podcast with our colleague. Peter Kafka there's an episode out right now called it's not. Hbo It's IT'S HBO. Max that will get you started asking ask a pass talk show Stanford purdue you on me. uh-huh uh-huh Sir Sir show a it is there's a Eh Casio. Hey that's it for this show this week except if you live in Toronto Ron Oh Canada or somewhere nearby come out to our first ever live show. I will most certainly be brushing my teeth before taking the stage. Because I I want to be pearly for the live audience and

HBO Netflix Disney apple Hbo Emily Emily Dickinson avengers CBS Packers South Dakota Emily Vander NBC NBC chickenpox Kloof Reese Witherspoon Steve Carell Hulu Jason Momoa
Netflix vs. Hollywood | Part 1

Land of the Giants

28:46 min | 1 year ago

Netflix vs. Hollywood | Part 1

"Land of the giant is brought to you by Avelar. Shouldn't your tax compliance solution be capable of handling custom duties, import taxes just as easily as sales, tax or back calculations well with avalon. It is regardless of what you sell you sell it. Adler has the tax compliance technologies to save you time and reduce risk for. Find out more at EVOLA. Dot Com slash giants a BA L. A., R. A. dot com slash John's. Valera tax compliance done right. Surani yeah, I'm going to tell you a story. Okay? About a man who was crucial to the evolution of Netflix's streaming business got it okay, because middle aged. He's an underachieving high school. Chemistry teacher gets cancer. I know where you're going with US really. Oh. Yeah, it's breaking bed. I am describing breaking bad to you I'm thinking. Maybe. You and I could partner up. You want to Cook Crystal Meth. And the reason I'm telling you about breaking bad is because it was really important for Netflix and the TD business and the relationship between the two. It's a perfect example what we call the Netflix's effect. The ripples and waves that netflix's creates in the entertainment business and in culture. Welcome to land of the giants. The NETFLIX's effect I'm Peter Kafka I'm Ronnie Mullah. Netflix's has been the single biggest disruptor. May Have ever seen so today we're looking at how NETFLIX's approach to movies and TV shows has evolved, and how along the way it's become the dominant force in entertainment. Okay Ronnie. Let's go back to Hollywood about a decade ago. Netflix was just starting to stream TV shows and movies, and it needed more stuff to stream turns out. There were lots of people people running big TV networks movie studios who were more than happy to sell netflix's their leftovers. That was two thousand eight. Two thousand nine and the entertainment industry was really suffering because of the economic downturn, and they needed cash to make their quarterly numbers. Keating. She's a journalist who covered netflix's for Reuters and wrote a book about the company. This idea that they could know sell these TV shows that nobody wanted to see and these movies to the Netflix streaming seem like this brilliant idea. She and I both remember that after the studios loaned out, felt like a ton of mediocre stuff to Netflix something unexpected happened netflix users began to discover shows that are actually good hidden gems, and they started binge watching them. Who the hell are you know? You all know exactly who I am. Now. Say My name. You know actually a show that was really formative for them was breaking bad. Breaking bad becomes this huge phenomenon off the back of Netflix. That's my colleague. Emily. Van Were covers, TV and pop culture for VOX DOT COM NETFLIX's users found breaking bad, after had been a niece show for AMC for a couple of seasons they watch the old shows on Netflix and they started watching the new ones on TV, and by the time the shows last season rolled. Rolled around Walter White had become the new Tony Soprano. You asked me if I was in the meth business or the money business. I'm in the empire business. The Anti Hero America was rooting for and felt bad about at the same time. Breaking bad was event event TV in an era when event TV was going away, what happened on? Netflix was changing. What happened on television? What does that have to do with the DA thereafter after some mystery Manson. Heavy hitter it goes by the name perk and its last eight episodes, which aired in one chunk and twenty thirteen. It just exploded like was the biggest thing on TV for those eight weeks, and it was because people had watched the mall netflix's help breaking bad increase, its audience on AMC as the series went on the exact opposite of usually happens with most TV shows were audiences melt away over time for the season four finale, breaking bad pulled in less than two million viewers, but two years later for the series finale, the audience had grown to ten million people was great frame crazy. On the other hand, watching breaking bad on Netflix was way better than watching breaking bad on AMC, no commercials and you could watch as many episodes as you wanted whenever you want it. netflix's breaking bad the breathing room that didn't get on AMC for people to become enamored of it. This is John Friedman who is chief communications officer at Netflix's at the. The time netflix tended to be a godsend for complicated dramas that were serialized. have standalone stories like the kind of television that does well in reruns for drama is things like special victims in all the law and order shows because it's got a story arc in that one episode breaking Bad Madman. These were deeply complex serialized shows if you don't know. Who I am. Maybe. Your best course would be to tread lightly Ted's around as chief content officer Netflix, he's the guy who had to make all the deals with the networks and studios turns out. It's incredibly beautifully serialized show that will hook you in if you can you watch one episode and all of sudden. It's three o'clock in the morning. You have to go to work the next day and you can't turn it off. which was so fitting to our delivery MODEL? Most of the culture believed IT TO BE A. A netflix show, even though it aired on made by Sony and aired on AMC originally, and this wasn't just a breaking bad story, Netflix's found new audiences for all kinds of shows, sometimes like with friends, the office they already off the air, and then found new life, but for shows that we're still on TV like shameless, which was on showtime Netflix could make it a hit. Bullying is a vital part of every ecosystem. It teaches kids resilience when we put shameless on Netflix and season seven so. So it had been on the air for years, I saw William macy. The after came on ethics for the first time. He said you know. I've been able to live my life pretty normally up until now as soon as you came on, Netflix I can't go to the airport anymore for a while. The netflix effect was a virtuous cycle between Netflix's and big media Netflix's gave the studios and networks easy money. Netflix's got more stuff to stream. Subscribers got to see more shows. People started to watch. Watch the new episodes on TV, making more money for the TV networks and for consumers. This was all upside. Netflix's became the place to watch TV shows without the irritations of regular TV, but over time. This really wasn't a win. Win Win! It was good for Netflix's and good for Netflix's users, but for the networks. This was a problem though they were slow to realize it. NETFLIX's training viewers to watch TV on Netflix instead of on TV. This is Gina Keating again, so the power of Netflix. Became pretty obvious to me and I knew at some point that the studios would figure it out and they would not want any of their content on Netflix because their content was making netflix's gigantic Netflix's newest to eventually, the company wouldn't be able to rely on the great stuff. That TV folks had made to is going to have to start making its own. The underlying was on before we basically. Pursued House of cards. Was that If we're right and this is the way that content is going to be delivered then at some point. NBC would become NBC. Dot Com and they would not want to sell a sir programming anymore, and if that was coming, we better try to get good at doing it ourselves again. This is Ted Serandon Netflix's head of content. You knew this and twenty thirteen in the run-up to. Direct conversation I had with read by Dame. which was if that's coming by kind of thought, you couldn't believe one without believing the other. Than, we should at least have a toe in the water, trying to figure it out. And NETFLIX's didn't want to figure out how to make any kind of TV in wanted to make the best TV the TV you paid ecstasy see. Just like HBO in a article in Twenty Thirteen Saranda famously announced that netflix's wanted to compete against the most prestigious programmer in America. The goal he said is to become HBO faster than HBO can become us. We worshiped HBO in a great. Company credible content is this, Arandas his boss CEO Reed Hastings and they wouldn't syndicate their stuff like the wire things from longtime ago on that flakes because they knew we were very similar that we were going to grow into that space, so we from that. We knew we had to get into original content. ooh! Earlier this season. We told you the story behind house of cards Netflix's first big bet on its own shows. It was hard for Netflix's to get that. Show the pretty easy to understand why I wanted to. For Starters House of cards had a brand name pedigree. An ethics already knew that its audience loved and earlier British version of the show. If thought how hard would signal that it was serious about TV. That is making a show good enough for HBO. Back in two thousand eleven think about what content made for the Internet was. This is Sidney. Holland she runs original programming at net flicks. WHO's user generated almost entirely? Maybe some funnier die skits, and so we were very conscious of. The fact that whatever we put out I needed to say something tonight I give you the truth. And the truth is this. The American dream has failed you and even up until February first two thousand thirteen. We launched season one of House of cards. People were asking why David Fincher, making episodes I. Don't understand. What's he doing you know and that's why it was important to have a title that was sort of prestige HBO level Netflix's other original shows were all over the place, but they were all an attempt at making prestige TV, there was hemlock Grove, a sexy horror series back when sexy horror stories were a big deal. You're gonNA find me a vampire de sexless three way with. Rose. In, there was a resurrection of arrested development, a Fox comedy that developed a cult following after he got cancelled. We. Don't have the money popped. Lose money in the Banana Stan. Both of those may have seen like likely hits to though you don't hear much about them today. What we do still hear about from that I push into originals was one that surprise everyone both in and outside of net flicks. Get you blondie. What'd you do? NOT SUPPOSED TO ASK THAT QUESTION I read that you're supposed to ask that. Studied for prison orange is the new black is a funny moving in sometimes shocking show about relationships inside a women's prison I loved it. It felt pivotal and disruptive. All of a sudden you're seeing these lavish and thorough storylines for women, particularly for women of Color. It started as the story of a white lady who went to prison and upper class, white lady played by Taylor Schilling again. This is boxers, Emily Vander worth and then she met. A bunch of interesting. People there. And the show gradually sort of became about the other people more than it became about the original main character. Listen Duck need my dosage I'm supposed to be had one of the first, really significant and well portrayed Trans Characters TV, history and laverne Cox Character Sophia. Everyone will be reading. And everyone will be talking about it including ladies that if you. It really was a way that netflix distinguished itself because these are the sorts of people. That TV wasn't telling stories about, and that's why I became a phenomenon. You hadn't heard these stories on TV before TV had been getting incrementally more diverse here and there for a long time. Traditional networks had shows starring black and Brown and Queer characters, but there are still huge need for more content that featured nuanced characters from these groups. Perhaps Netflix's had data that showed that there was demand for diverse content, but Netflix's didn't know that are inches. New Black would be such a sensation. I talked to people. Netflix's at the time. The show they were just astounded was as popular as it. What's that show blew up. Was a little confounding to them. They had no idea what they had in that show. Cindy, Holland certainly didn't think she had a breakout hit. There hadn't been anything like that on television. And you know a big diverse cast of people of different ages and ethnicities and identities. One of the things we've learned it Netflix's most of those conventional wisdom's or just built up and reinforced over time, because something didn't work at some point, and you know I believed in the show and I love the show, but I wouldn't have believe you if you told me that it was going to be one of the most successful things we've ever done. Critics an emmy voters loved orange is the new black, but it's also just really popular during seventh and final season last year. Netflix's noted that hundred and five million people had seen the show over. It's run. That's more than half its current subscriber base, but the show meant more netflix than just numbers and awards. It was a go ahead to make more shows that. That didn't look like shows that were already on TV Netflix's by virtue of having to find the audience, where it was instead of trying to appeal to the HBO, audience like very quickly figured out oh. If we program more diverse content, we will get a more diverse audience that ended up being sort of the argument for chasing more diverse programming, dear white people. I get that being reduced to a race space. Generalization is a new and devastating experience for some of you. Take your white people. For example it's enough like show based on Justin Simeon Sundance. Movie about the experiences of black students at a predominantly white. Ivy League school or Master of none the Germany starring. He's on sorry. An Indian American stand up comic miniature little worried somewhere. My friends have racist. Grandma's Oh see used the race. He just because I'm. On tables turn sorry. The show generated a ton of praise in part because of the way it talked about the experiences of American immigrants and their children. Thank you for embracing a little Indian boy from South Carolina where black girl. Chicago we. An actor and writer on the show won an emmy for comedy writing, making her the first black woman to do so. Netflix's can justifiably take pride and giving people that typically weren't on TV or making TV shows a chance to do that. But this does not mean that Netflix's necessarily champion of diversity. It just wants to make stuff that a lot of audiences will like, and it's big enough that it could serve many audiences at once, so yeah, it's GonNa. Make mudbound a critically praised movie about race relations after World War Two, but it's also GonNa make a lot of Adam Sandler movies. Uh. Swell Netflix started out trying to be HBO. It's ended up becoming so much more ambitious now wants to be all of TV. Up Next, what happened? NETFLIX's decided it needed to make everything. If, there's one thing we might all agree on. It's that when it comes to business. The world isn't all that big when businesses sell online, click is a click regardless of where the virus EVOLA. Here's this from customers every day. So whether business based in Paris, Texas and Paris France chances are they're selling their products all over the world? cross-border solutions make it easy to handle customs, duty and taxes in a way that creates a friction list online shopping experience avalanches cloud based solutions designed to be affordable and scalable for businesses of all sizes, and his businesses grow Valera. Technologies grow with them from one system to the next. How well Adler automatically integrates more than seven hundred AARP e e commerce mobile payment at point of sale systems, likely the systems used today and the one. You might be using tomorrow. Find out how your business can save time. Reduce Risk at Avalon DOT. com slash giants. EVOLA tax compliance done, right. NETFLIX's started out making a handful of its own shows, doing its best HBO impression, but over time it became a content factory medal lot of stuff, so it needed stuff that was easy to find and easy to make housing. Santa Fe, the other night at. Banana Peel at me. Like comedy! And then not only the banana peel at me, but It was premeditated. You could tell. Netflix saw that people after watching. A like binging a full series really liked to watch. Stand up special. There's something about Oh. They want something quick, so they're like. Oh, we can just put this little stand up special and something funny Jesse David. Fox writes about comedy for vulture, and he hosts good one podcast about standup. He says Netflix's saw. Comedy is a way to build up its library of shows, and in doing so it changed the comedy business. You're seeing so many comedians doing theaters before two thousand nine I think it's about three comedians total out Madison Square Garden since two thousand nine. I think eleven or twelve have I mean. The amount of Comedians that are big is like never seen before. The same meals, holidays and movies anyway. What's the difference who I'm with? Netflix has been great for the really big name comics. People talk about going out. We should go out. Let's go out. We never go out. Well. The Chris Rock, the Dave repels and Jerry Seinfeld's. Now. Netflix's money is actually the easiest way for them to get that big payday, really really big paydays Netflix spent reported hundred million dollars for Jerry Seinfeld and sixty million dollars for Dave Chapelle, but most netflix comedy specials don't start Dave Shell. They feature comics. You probably haven't heard of before and those comments get paid much less. But they get in return exposure to Netflix's massive audience, which ends up increasing the comics audience think of like another version of the breaking bad story, instead of discovering shows that have been around for awhile. netflix subscribers discover performers. Lease Maroons Netflix's documentary and Indie Films Department before that, she oversaw its leap into comedy. People go to shows and the comics would be like. Where'd all these people come from? Because they are watching their calibrating their audience sizes, and it would go from thirty to fifty people two hundred people in those incrementally, and they're like Whoa. How why do you guys even know about me? They're like. Oh, you're new. Netflix special like I'm I shot any special and four years? We license the special, and it just allowed for an expansion. NETFLIX's started out buying comedy specials that had already aired somewhere else. And then began to partner with Comedians on new specials and the process sometimes turn them into overnight celebrities. I don't know if you guys can tell but I am seven and a half months pregnant. It's very rare and unusual to see female comic perform pregnant. Alley Wall have been working in stand up for years, but she couldn't break through her. Netflix's Special Baby Cobra changed all that sexist. When people ask me well, if you are here then who's taking care of the baby? Do you. Think is taking care of the baby. TV is taken care of the baby. Alex self funded and shot that very first special in shopped it for a long time, and it was just interesting. Th- talk about trump's like Asian. People aren't funny. You know I'm like no, really we can be funny. I promise you. You know the idea that she was pregnant. Like who wants to hear that story I'm like. At least half the population of the world wants to hear the story valley while example is the most extreme because she was going from not being able to probably sell out a weekend of clubs the weekend before this special out to she can style large theaters by a month later I bad if she wanted to, she practically sold out like. She probably gets about Madison Square. Garden Netflix's didn't invent the idea of putting a comedian on TV and making them popular Johnny Carson could famously make someone's career in an evening by giving them a spot on his old show, HBO and Comedy Central Did comedy specials for years, but Netflix's size. The phenomenon it gave so many comedians a shop and let so many people watch those comedians that increase the chances of finding and making an alley along when I was in my twenties. I eight plan be like skittles. So my uterus probably look like a smoker's lung. Allie put out that special. Another network I think it would have built a lot of buzz, but it would not have exploded. But explosion is because Netflix was able to supercharge it. has set in the stardom. A Fun story shows networks can use enormous platform to shine a spotlight on someone who wasn't breaking through anywhere else. But netflix can also use its enormous platform and make something pop. Just because it wants to. Here's an example. Think back to the end of twenty eighteen. We're all home for the holidays. Maybe we got a little tired of her family's. All the Christmas. Specials on TV are exhausting, but then Netflix's drop something new but you. Ever. Take off your blindfold. If you look, you will die. Do you understand Burbach is a mediocre post? Apocalyptic movie starring Sandra Bullock definitely, not something you'd rewatch. Humanity has been judged. We'd have found what you got were religion mythology is full of mentions of demons or spirit creatures, but that didn't matter because nearly fifty million people watch it in the first week, and about eighty million in the first month. So, what do we make of a bad movie that lots of people watched that certainly happened before net flicks, but usually that's when Hollywood's spend a ton of money, telling you to watch it, or because it was a sequel to a hit movie or based on a comic book Burbach, no one ever heard of it before they saw it on their Netflix's home screen. One day it was just there and ethics told people watch it and they did. Some context here. NETFLIX's makes an astonishing amount of stuff. Variety calculates that last year Netflix's made more than three hundred seventy TV shows and movies. That's more than the entire TV industry combined made in two thousand and five. And it spends. On that slate, which goes up to nearly two hundred million people around the world. But like anyone else who makes TV, shows and movies, Netflix's will have duds. Humiliate me in front of the court again. I will kill you. Marco Polo was a big adventure series. nope. How about the get down? It's a musical, but kids inventing hip hop from the Bronx by now. NETFLIX's doesn't seem to get dinged for those flops. Either by Wall Street or by its audience. And this drives the rest. The TV business nuts. We don't really know how most of Netflix's shows actually do. There's no consistent independent source of audience data for that program. The Way Nielsen does almost all TV shows. And the only time Netflix does put numbers is when wants to brag about something like bird box. And the success of bird box and the originals, netflix's has been pushing, since then is a testament to one thing more than anything else massive scale, and by the way they're. They're taking advantage of that in the most brilliant way. Jason Blood Movies and shows for Netflix six and everyone else he's the guy brought you get out in the purge. If you ask him about the future of entertainment, he's pretty sure who the winner will be. They've nougarede. Everyone in Hollywood for fifteen years and. My guess is, they'll keep outmanoeuvring everyone. NETFLIX's I started making its own shows. There was a lot of discussion about the idea that flicks. The company was GONNA use data science algorithms to figure out exactly what people wanted and make it for them. Even if they didn't know they wanted it and be clear, Netflix's never went out and actually said this. In fact, it insisted it wasn't gonNA tell producers and writers how to make show. It seems like the truth is somewhere in the middle. Critters talked to say Netflix's definitely offers notes, but it never tell someone to. Drop a character because the data says so. The computer isn't writing the script. Netflix can take credit though for all sorts of innovative stuff that really has changed the way we interact with TV it got rid of ads, it more or less invented binge-watching by bringing you an entire season in a single day, and it's paying with new ideas all the time like experiments with interactive shows that let viewers chooser on adventure, but in the end a lot of TV that Netflix's showing us in twenty twenty doesn't look that different than TV. You could see years ago. There's just a lot more. More of it, obviously what changed, is that like they have so much money and they have made so much more TV than anyone could ever have imagined anyone. Making this will pass skin. She writes about TV for sleep. netflix's really one of the things I've been most successful like building up the myth of Netflix so when Netflix started and this continues now we're like ooh. Are they going to revolutionize television by like knowing exactly what you want? The Algorithm is going to change everything and you're just like. In retrospect like Oh, I think just making regular television shows like. The Algorithm is serving. People think similar to what they want. I'm not sure it's like changing the nature of TV. So yeah net movies and TV, shows look for the most part like other movies and TV shows I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with that. At this volume, Netflix's is. GonNa make a lot of flops or mediocre stuff, but it's still produces a lot of ambitious, really interesting stuff like Roma. Documentary American factory those both won Oscars by the way, and if you don't WanNa watch the stuff that's fine. There's trashy. Reality Shows Movies starring David Spade. You can pick one. You can pick all of them and all this kind of extraordinary when you think about where started. First they were mailing DVD's to try to be blockbuster. And then they wanted to beat HBO and now they want to be all of TV and now look what's happened to Hbo its new owner at and T. decided that it just being. Hbo Isn't enough anymore. Not In a netflix world, so eighteen has launched. Hbo Max. We've got all your favorite. Hbo Max where HBO needs so much more. which is basically HBO plus a lot of TV shows and movies? You've seen before. Sounds like HBO wants to be Net flicks. We have come full circle. So. We just looked at how Netflix's change what we see on TV. Next week we're going to look at how this changes have shaken up the entertainment industry, and how the people who work pilot scenes in Hollywood feel about it. Oh God. There's so many billboards. Netflix has really edged its way into being like a constant presence in l., a. one of those things that we kind of put up with. And One more thing, Peter so I'm going to leave to have a baby. What which you might have noticed. It could happen at any moment now, but I'm leaving this podcast in good hands Roddy. We will take care for good luck. Thanks take it away Peter. This podcast is a production of re could by vox in the box media podcast network accepts was produced by Bridget Armstrong Zach Mac. Our Editors Charlie Hermit Catherine's Turkish and engineered scored this episode. Zach macaser showrunner initia- Kirwa. Is the executive producer quick disclosure box, dot, com, and vox media makes shows for net flicks. None of the people working on this season of land of the giants are involved in the production of those shows I'm Ronnie Mullahs and I'm Peter Kafka. Thanks for listening. Land. The giants was brought to you by Avalon. If you're responsible for the financial wellbeing of company it to yourself checkout. Getting tax compliance right something businesses just have to do. It only makes sense to do it as efficiently accurately as possible. 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The Chris and Joe Show: Breaking down the Jets loss

Big Blue View

23:41 min | 2 years ago

The Chris and Joe Show: Breaking down the Jets loss

"Are you troubled by strange. Hockey trades in the middle of the night do you experienced feelings of dread about. NHL Free Agency have you or your family ever seen in New York rylander scheme. If the answer is yes. Don't wait another minute. Pick up your mobile device and subscribe to Lighthouse Hockey podcasts. From espy nation today are courteous and efficient hosts Are Ready to serve. All of your islander needs and worries lighthouse hockey podcasts for New York. Islanders fans you're listening to the Chris and Joe Show presented by SP nation an interview. I'm Judy Chris. Plum and as we do every Tuesday morning near giving you the breakdown analysis from the game analyzing the film. Don't let it you know the positives and negatives from both sides of the ball that we took away from it and this is a game that it was very tough to conjure up many complete positives because of the manner in which the New York giants lost their in stadium in state rival. The New York jets ended up falling thirty four. The twenty seven and that loss stings the most because this jets team was arguably one of the worst in the League after losing to the Miami. Dolphins were now actually on a winning streak so the giants managed to find ways to push themselves down even further when they have plenty of wonderful opportunities to get easy victories victories. And we're GONNA be discussing all the things that really hurt them in this game especially with their positives and be in being able to say the things that that they did. Twelve did not do enough of so kicking things off though offensively the positives that we had from this game and the one thing that we noticed. was that the slants. The screens in this game really worked very very well. Because the giants playmakers were able to take simple route concepts get a little bit of space. Turn up the field get long touchdowns. Yeah run after catch was huge. In this game we saw the sixty yard touchdown by golden tape. The thirty nine touch thirty seven yard touchdown by Slayton so long runs from Red Ellison Saquon Barclays only play in. This game was a nice catch and run for twenty two yards yards so the giants were able to take advantage of the jets will say porous. Okay bad secondary sorry some bad tackling and really turn those short passes into big gains and that was really what kept them in this game offensively yet. Yeah when we talk about the things that really work for the giants it opened our eyes to or not opener is because we're we were fully aware of it at this point in the season but it added to the fact that we will have what we keep saying. The giants need to be smart and getting the ball out quickly in running the short to intermediate passing concepts. But it makes us US question though the decision making from the play calling in this game because they didn't do it really that often a lot of plays which will be getting in the negatives a lot of these plays took way too long to develop and Daniel Jones is getting sacked or hit on most of them so if such things are working the giants need to find ways to come back to them. Use them further down the line in the game. And you're able to manufacture those yards with a simple dump off a simple screen a simple slant it'll it'll essentially alleviate some pressure from the pass rush to because instead of being overly aggressive in blitzing there'll be more on their heels and maybe it will come out and nickle nickle package or they'll be less willing to put so many guys in the box come after Daniel Jones and saquon Barkley out the jets were able to pretty much woman. Win The line of scrimmage both teams were able to win the line of scrimmage on defense with lightboxes. Neither defence had to commit a whole lot of players to a nine men boxes to stop the run so that was working in the favor of both defenses but the giants were able to get some get the quick passing game to be productive which it is good but as you said they did rely too much I long developing plays. And I'm pretty much always a proponent of looking down the field in the passing game the the value there is really like that ten to fifteen yard down the field zone and it shouldn't take for five seconds for for an NFL caliber receiver or even a High School for receiver to get that far down the field. These are guys who will conservatively. They say run a four five forty. It shouldn't take that long to get down the field and find a little bit open grass. You know it shouldn't take five seconds seconds to run fifteen yards that leads first negative that we have here in. That was what I mentioned. And what Christus mentioned is that the giants keep running these slow. Oh long developing plays that were resulting in hits on Daniel Jones and and evidently resulting in sacks on him as well. The thing that really league doesn't make much sense. Is that choosing to do that. When you have three new offensive lineman? You're essentially setting up Daniel Jones Jones to be a sitting duck because there's not much not much time to to throw. There's not a lot of room to throw so you might as well try to get the offense into a rhythm by getting the ball how quickly finding Open receivers in space and like you said if you can push the ball downfield ten to fifteen yards. That's effective but right now that that has not been working for the giants because there has not been thorough and strong enough pass protection giant. Like you said the giants are putting Daniel Anew Jones in a bad position they're also putting their offensive line in just bad positions in asking them to hold up for four or five seconds and pass protection which even though the jets don't have a great pass rusher. They still struggled to do. There are ways to help out struggling offensive line can run. Those quick plays plays A seven yard slant you can use bootlegs in rollouts you can run. RPO's the these are quick easy. You ways to take the pressure off of both the quarterback and the offensive line. And it's something the giants just. They just don't seem to want to do yet. They seem to be sticking into the same thing that is not working on a weekly basis the other negative that we have here and we spoke about the quick to in the quick takes the offensive lineman was re were really really bad and pass protection and in run protection protection because of how many new guys they had stepping in this game because of injuries two key veteran players but a player that kind of stuck out on the film when we went back and watched that we didn't notice the first time that had a really bad day pass protection with Saquon qualm Barclay. There were two plays where he allowed Jamal Adams to come in blow him up and then make contact. On the Jones one of them was a strip fumble that was recovered by Saquon and then the second one was the infamous play that was all over twitter and the rest of the Internet. That Jamal Adams ripped the ball out of his hands in ran into the end zone. So saquon clearly did not look like himself at all in this game. He'll must look like he took a step backward in his overall health and his demeanor he just he did not seem on her one hundred percent right and it was so clear and seeing him not playing well in something that he's usually pretty good at since coming back from the injury his pass protection has been. I'll say questionable. I don't think his angle is to the point where he can anchor against pass rushers. We saw him giving ground kind of just more or less trying to buy time rather than step up and aggressively hit pass rushers and try to stop them. which if you're running back in pass protection that's what you have to do you? Yup We think back a few years that's what Ahmad Bradshaw did and he was always the best passed protecting running back in the NFL because he went to step up and deliver shots to pass. rushers get his hands on them and then anchor. Barkley just isn't doing that and by by the end of the game the giants were pulling him off the field in passing situations as dangerous as he can be with the ball in his hands. If you can't rely on him for pass protection that kind of is the right choice by the one in Gaughman was pretty obviously the giants best running back image. You wonder why they didn't make that decision sooner. Because does Goldman is the more healthy running back. He is not getting a lot of snaps are touches in right now. SAQUON is not at full health. So if he's not ready to play able to play why would you force him to go out there and continue to aggravate an injury. That is taking a long time to heal I I know a lot of people want to assume. SAQUON is a superhuman but an injury is an injury. It's GonNa take them all out till he's actually back to full strength and at the same time there's also the mental side of things things that are gonna Nag him. Even if he's one hundred percent healthy he's still going to be a bit wary and not as aggressive and making cuts and trying to use his his ankle so they needed to have gotten Wayne Goldman in sooner. And if saquon still isn't healthy after the bye week you would hope that Wayne Goldman is is getting some more touches and they tried to alleviate some of that pressure from saquon. Yeah and they also do have buck Allen on the roster which again he need isn't anything like Saquon as a player he probably isn't even as good as wing Goldman but he is there he is healthy. He does have the skill set to execute their entire. Hire offense. The giants might WanNa look at actually using a running back rotation and not have saquon the bell cow and rotate Wean Goldman on when Barkley just either needs arrest or just isn't working. Day will probably have to be more proactive with the running backs going forward. Yeah I think they really just assumed that because Saquon was able to play did not mean he was fully ready to return to his same workload. Something does need to be done to better protect him for his longevity because him missing some snaps here and there in a two and eight season is not that big of a deal when you WANNA keep your second year running back for as long as possible and healthy as long as possible so they need to be a little bit more smarter more smarter and a little bit more proactive. Like you said we're GONNA take a look at the defensive positives and negatives but before we do that we're going to take a short commercial break. Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk and we're the host of the shutdown full cast your avengers of college football podcast. It says in the script to riff on what that means and basically what is already spoiled every Tuesday we talk about everything from cooking disasters to pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school we. I also do talk about college. Football every now and then like mascot fights announcers fleeing the booth early. And unfashionable pants that coaches where now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP. Are you a netflix person. Person Are you more into Hulu you got that. Hbo Now thinking about that Whole Apple TV plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never ends so on today. Explained Fox's Daily News podcast. We're GONNA TALK TO VOX critic at large Emily Vander worth about about the coming streaming wars and. Emily is going to talk about how it's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her. Favorite medium television and how the monocultures basically dead but also she will reveal come she thinks will win streaming wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming wars and also she'll criticize some of the lesser shows that have come out of the streaming wars. You'll know everything you need to know. You'll know which service issue should be subscribing to and which ones should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other than watch TV ever again. Check out today. Explained Lane wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right now so defensively giants had an interesting game because there were really some decent positives from it and it does not statistically look like they lost this game based on what they gave up but they still ended up giving up certain in situations that lead to discharge victory but the first positive we did have from this and the only positive we had was they actually had a really good job of playing the run and as much as that might not have been the deciding factor in this game they were able to hold them to only seventy six rushing yards. A lot of those yards were picked up by SAM. darnold on some Scrambles because there were no available options and they were also able to hold lady on bell to one point nine yards per carry in thirty four yards so an elite running back with a battle offensive line front of them in front of him. They were able to at least take advantage of an opportunity. Dan just laid out like that. It's kind of scary. How similar the jets and giants are right now? They have both squads have elite running back who is battling injuries. They both have bad offensive lines in this game. They're running their quarterback was their best running back. Both teams were able to effectively shut down the other teams running game. It's considering the the jets are perceived. That's probably not great a great thing to realize for the giants but they did take advantage of that opportunity. One of the interesting things I noticed was that they've played Dexter Lawrence a at the knows more than they probably have to date. I noticed that he was at nose. Tackle a fair bit and that was even with Dalvand Tomlinson on the field. They played him at defensive end. A few times also noticed that didn't see much from from Bj Hill which is the second week in a row. That's happened I think with our with Leonard Williams on the squad it is looking like. BJ Hill might be the odd man out which which in this case did work out. We did see learning Williams in the jets backfield quite a bit once again. He got close to the quarterback quite quite a bit the giants were able to just choke and suffocate. The jets running game and this was something we prescribe in the preview they Day effectively Isley. Forced Sam Darnold to win the game but Donald didn't turn the ball over it. darnold did not have any turnovers and that was some of the things that kind of worked our way into our negatives but the first negative that we had from this game was when you go back and look at the giants didn't really allow allow that many third down conversions. The only allowed four but there were a number of third and longs where the defense was all set to get off the field and something ended ended up happening that resulted in a I was a lot of deep throws past the sticks or the most notable Sam darnold scramble on anything I think it was the third and seven he. He was able to pick up a first down. So the those types of things you you need to be a lot more effective on defense in essentially you WanNa you have the offense on their heels in those plays and instead the giants defense was on their heels and gave up like I said multiple third and longs. Yeah that won't scramble by SAM. darnold picked up twenty thirty four yards in. I believe you're right. Blue was third and seven. The entire defense just had their backs to him. And when you have a quarterback that you yeah no can scramble you have to at least keep one eye on him and Dornan's ability to convert those third and longs there. Were a couple where there was no defense. The one that really stands out to me was the one where Donald was wrapped up and being tackled and he still managed to convert that third down around and it was a long one it. I'm not quite sure how you defend that pretty much any other time. Nine Times Outta ten defense did its job. You either got the sack the incomplete. Pass your jogging off the field feeling good about yourself. But even so we saw kind of some of the similar breakdowns in coverage. We saw penalties penalties at just bad times and a lot of the problems that have played this defense all season long a lot of things that were plaguing them and this final final negative is a really reoccurring one on different weeks here and there. This one was the fact that they kept getting killed on crossing routes and a Lotta throws over the middle where there was like a simple Hitch concept or Drags across the field things like that were wide open for the jets to convert on and because because they have some faster receivers like Jamison crowder. They were able to stretch five yards of space and turn it into a fifteen plus yard gain so stuff like that that is just needs needs to be better. There's poor linebacker play if they're not able to if they're not there to disrupt those routes and and keep them from having an unscathed path to get the football ball and a little bit also comes down to some poor tackling. There were instances where they were able to make. Some plays in some tackles on those types of Route concepts and The jets receivers were able to break tackles which something we say. Every single week poor tackling which ultimate comes down to poor coaching they were accorded few instances where the Dan players in the vicinity. But they were just out of position that Kinda forces them to have to lunge in those tackles Players can run right through them at angles not wrapping up securely. There were a few instances like Allegorical tree breaking up a pass. That probably would have been a first down to his Thomas Andromeda Had A couple couple nice tackles coming downhill like you said just poor tackling continues to be a problem is poor play poor coaching. It isn't a it. It isn't a problem with any one solution or any one thing causing it there are. It is a symptom of a whole lot of different problems. The giants the final point. We have here and if you recall from previous shows folks if we ever have anything wrong with special teams we are going to address it and in this game. There were some glaring errors on point after attempts vol- things so in the special teams game. If you were called there was a bad snap. That caused a odd scrambling situation my Riley Dickson in an obvious situation where he wasn't even going to get the ball complete it because it was not planned it was not scheme. I saw some people on twitter asking why they went for two there. That was not designed. That was not intentional. It was a bad snap. That was mishandled. A bad snap is act the Aussie the long snapper napper. Not In the right location could not handle it could not get it down and that kind of thing if you have a bad snap on a pat. It's going to mess up the rhythm rhythm of your kicker. Because next time he goes out to kick one. He's going to be looking down he's going to be worried that the ball is going to be there. He's going to be worried that everything is set and like it needs to be and I. I think that was the reason why Rose Saas missed the second one. So that's that's two points that were taken off the board that would have given the giants twenty eight because they wouldn't have ended up needing to go for two given them twenty eight and they would have been down by six points instead of seven. It's little things like that that they have a a ripple effect effect on the on the rest of the game which this is one reason why I love are Kinda special teams rants. It's the side of the ball. Nobody ever really notices but it has a profound effect on the offense and the defense there are hidden yards hidden points just little things that everybody always takes for granted. They show big time when they're not there or on the inverse if special teams has a great play that also shows is a big time for the offense or defense. One thing that was kind of interesting is just how many ball handling issues. The giants had this game had the bad snapped from. DRC which is something that doesn't happen often. Had the snap a bit a snap which Daniel Jones just let go right through his fingers lingers for a fumble and then learning the game there was the poor that almost looked like a fumble where the ball was obviously coming out CAS Jones through it basically. It looked like he got hit a Oh in real time it looked like he got hit and that was enough to jarred the ball loose but when they showed the replay is slow motion. You could actually see the ball. Come loose in his hand twisting around backwards as he was throwing the ball and that could have been in wasn't a fumble because his arm was moving but that was something that could have been very bad if there was a defender in the area so I wonder if maybe the ball with slick for some reason just the number of ball handling problems stood out to me in that even with the way both of these teams were playing. That was just kind of weird. Yup having that many issues with proper handling of the football it really comes down to an attention to detail just comes down to what the coaches are emphasizing in practice. If they're trying to make sure everything is clean inefficient or if they're okay with the status quo so I'm hoping in the bye week. More judgments are made in a lot. More focused on being cleaner in those things I also I don't think it would likely happened. But if if the OSCE has another bad game like this don't be surprised if they choose as the move on because the Aussie is towards the latter end of his career and something that some people might not recognize. But I'm very aware of is that the market for specialists is that if you make consecutive mistakes day will immediately pull the plug and get rid of you so the Aussies Probably GonNa. I'm hoping to have a better performance and step up from that. That's going to be it from us. Though folks thank you for tuning in as always be sure to rate and subscribe wherever you're listening coming to us and also full social media at big Lou at Jody Lee owned and at a raptor m. k. i.. Wonderful rest of your day. Are you troubled by strange. Hockey trades in the middle of the night do you experience feelings of dread about NHL. Free Agency have you or your family ever seen at New York islanders game. If the answer is yes then don't wait another minute. Pick up your mobile device and subscribe to Lighthouse Hockey podcast from espy nation. Today are courteous and efficient hosts are ready to serve. All of your islander needs and worries lighthouse hockey podcasts for New York islanders fans.

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One Year After The First Step Act 2019-12-23

The Takeaway

45:46 min | 1 year ago

One Year After The First Step Act 2019-12-23

"The Hey it's the takeaway on December twenty third I'm WNYC's Shumita. Basu in for tenzing Vega Today on the podcast one year After the passage of a bipartisan criminal justice reform at a look at what the measure has achieved. I think the first APP actually opened a door and the eyes is of many people for those who are incarcerated formerly incarcerated plus with Christmas just days away. We'll hear how non-christians in the United States are celebrating reading at this time of the year in their own ways putting the Havana history proves that we are one and the solidarity and this kindness and this love is in a way a form of a little resistance and itself and why some Lgbtq fans have a bad feeling about a brief moment of queer representation. Listen in the new star wars it makes them get to seem progressive without actually having to be progressive and that's kind of the way that they play their publicity game all right. Let's get into it. We start with the first step act one year ago president. Then trump passed a law that promised criminal justice reform across the country. We call it the first step back. I sort of like the idea of just calling. Criminal Justice. Justice reform the bipartisan first. Step at authorized the early release of federal prisoners who were convicted of low level drug offenses and have worked through rehabilitation programs and one year later. More than three thousand inmates have been released. One of them is Nora. Yahya I did ten years in Danbury and then lowered my security level to camp and from there I was released upon the F. Essay which put me out out March eleventh two thousand nineteen which took off approximately three years of my sentence. Nora was in for possession and intent to distribute cocaine. Oh Kane I think one of the excitement of the first act is that people could get closer to the families and continue that Bonn for Nora besides sites being away from her children incarceration meant enduring painful health issues with no relief while I was incarcerated. My leg start hurt. Sunni in I also had like two lumps in my legs so one night I couldn't even get up. They actually had a call to amraams but it was only after her release this year that she was finally able to undergo back surgery completely. Change all the pain in my legs. I feel like one hundred percent percent like the person I was prior to all even after the long-overdue medical treatment for Nora re entry was challenging it. It was very hard not just technology wise. That's that's something in its own south. That was hard and very challenging also started out in a new state which which is New York but I had to start over with my children. Who are who aren't children? Who are adults now but the first step act led her to criminal final justice reform organizations that helped guide her post incarceration life? They introduced me to a computer round. There was just the basics of surf. The Internet are net things that are just totally foreign to me. They also helped me with my medical assistance because I hadn't had the proper medical treatment and I also took a program. I'm to become license for food handler. Now Nora works as an advocate for people who are incarcerated. I think the first step actually opened the door in the eyes of many people for those who are incarcerated for me incarcerated for more on the first step act and where it is one year in. I'm joined by Jonathan Terry Policy Advisor at John. Jay College of Criminal Justice and Louis L. read national organizer for cut fifty a bipartisan initiative. To cut crime and incarceration in half across the country. Thanks to both of you for being here on the show. Thanks for having me on Jonathan. I tell us how the first step act is intended to work when it comes to early release so the first step back includes several provisions for Federal Prison Reform it eliminates the three strike rule which is a law wow that was originally meant to provide harsher punishments for those who have several federal convictions so previously you could get a life sentence. Thanks for having three convictions. Convictions that's been reduced to twenty five years. Since it also extends the two thousand ten Fair Sentencing Act which which reduced the disparity that could be given in a sentence for selling crack cocaine versus powder cocaine also brings people closer to home. Ideally really five hundred. Miles is now limit that people are supposed to be allowed to be away from home wind and the federal prison it includes a lot of other quality of life you might right say provision for federal prisons as well so women who are pregnant are no longer able to be shackled juveniles longer able to be put in solitary confinement Also expanded re entry programs which was mentioned a little bit before so the process of going back into society after prison is a AH arduous one and so the first step act Apportioned millions of dollars for a lot of those programs to help people as they enter. It was also meant to create risk assessment tools which look at someone record and various other factors to decide whether whether or not they are arrested society and that way Ideally we are able to look at people allow them to exit from prison. And no because this person isn't going to be arrested anyone we feel okay letting them out even potentially earlier. Let me ask you about sentence reduction because as I mentioned just a minute ago more than three thousand awesome people have been released now under this act. Can you explain what the process looks like for them to have gotten their sentences reduced right so a lot of the the people who are having their sentences reduced were originally sentenced in the seventies and eighties as part of the war on drugs and so the first step actor. It just says that since we sentence people differently now We are going to look at those instances that were given before and if they are no longer in line with what we what sentence you currently we are going to reduce those sentences Many of them. Those incidences are reduced through petition. Some are reduced dramatically There is also an expansion in of good time. Which says that if you are incarcerated? But you're taking part in programs that are meant to rehabilitate you. Whether that's job training or drug treatment or something of that sort you can have time taken off of your sentence and so there are different provisions to allow people to reduce their sentences and about a thousand seven hundred people have gotten Martin reductions in their sentence Since the first step back into law and there's a reduction of about six years average for people who have that reduction Lewis. Let me bring you into the conversation. Jonathan just mentioned the war on drugs in the seventies and eighties. This act is mainly aimed at people who were arrested. During at that time period many of them were black men. What do we know about the demographics of the people who've been released under the APP so far you for decades the criminal justice a conversation tation among our political leaders especially both on the state and national level could be characterized as a race to the bottom? It was a competition for who could be the toughest on crime who lock up the most people in throw away the key It was also a conversation that was defined by dangerous rhetoric with no regard for empathy. The or second chances. In essentially a dehumanized people I was one of those individuals that was in that conversation in two thousand. I was sentenced to a term of imprisonment of one hundred eighty eight months and for our listening audience I don't want to Belabor the point in terms of you using your fingers and toes trying to figure that out. Oh that's approximate deaths. Approximately sixteen years. I served almost fourteen years off that sixteen year. Federal prison sentence for White collar related offenses most of the individuals by whom I was incarcerated with were not individuals that had got caught up in the war on drugs. It's in the seventies and eighties. In fact these individuals Were caught up in the mid ninety two the early two thousands Especially after after the nine hundred ninety four Clinton Crime Bill Ninety one percent of the individuals that were released under that particular provision at Jonathan talked about as as it relates to the crack cocaine provision ninety one percent of those individuals were African Americans. So let me just quantify these numbers of for you for second to dates seven thousand people total have been released under the first step act I should say seven thousand people. Total have have received significant can't reductions And they have been released under the first step back. Ninety one percent of those individuals happen to be African. American who African Americans who were sentenced under those draconian of crack cocaine laws Particularly pointing back to nineteen eighty seven moving up to nine hundred ninety four and and Up to date until about approximately two thousand ten that has totaled that seven thousand number that has totaled approximately seventeen thousand years of human freedom that have been restored back to our community. Now think about this in the Christmas. Season Jesus was crucified. Approximately approximately two thousand years ago. And if we look at the numbers that actually places us back into B. C.. So I think that this is something that a significant I am literally Pulled over on the side of the road Twenty minutes away from MDC Brooklyn where. I am going to be with family. Who is going to have their loved? One Return back to them In this Christmas season after having served twenty years on a life sentence in that individual is going to be released as as a result as a result of the first act and that's as a result of the advocacy With people such as myself to. PK Sam David. Sylvian Cut Fifties co-founder Van Jones and Jessica Jackson and the many other advocates and organizations that was in his Bipartisan coalition and. Make sure that we got this bill across the finish line. Louis let me ask you something. Because one of the acts major provisions as John mentioned earlier was to place incarcerated individuals within a five hundred mile radius of their families that they would be closer to them. Why was that such an important part of this legislation? Yes so the reason why. The five hundred mile provision is significantly the important within the first step act is because it does one of several things number one in make sure is that individuals are connected with their families and that those relationships are cultivated between parents and their children number two it brings about a level of proximity to the individual individual who was incarcerated and also to the community and number three it actually reduces the probability of individuals who are incarcerated from from participating and issues that very well could bring about institutional infractions so for instance if an individual is in proximity to of their last last known address and they know that they are potentially going to see their mother their father the family members a significant others etc.. They're going to be less likely early. To be an engaged in fights assaults you know in the likes thorough Jonathan. The acts when it was passed last year it was hailed by president. Trump is a huge chief. -Ment in being able to bring the two parties together as Lewis mentioned. It was largely a bipartisan effort. Why did this act appeal to politicians on on both sides of the aisle so criminal justice reform brings people together in part because there's a strong moral Push for it. It's hard to to argue and a lot of cases that someone who may have made a mistake should be put away for such a long time It's also incredibly expensive. We spend billions of dollar incarcerating people Especially here in the United States. We have the world's largest prison population we do. We have over two point one million people in prison in the United States leads And I think that whether regardless of where you fall politically you can see that we are wasting a lot of money on putting people in cages from those people could be contributing to the economy. Those people could Be With their families and so it really brings people together on either side. And of course Jared Kushner has a father who was incarcerated and so he understands some of issues that are being That are at play here and he was able to help assure along the the political coalition That pushed through the first step back and I think that we are also thinking a lot. About mass incarceration The fact that we do have so many people put away The draconian laws that were just mentioned have really torn apart communities. And we're able to you now fight that together and I think everyone can see the value in that Lewis. I know that you're very involved in communities where people are returning home from prison. Can you talk about some of the the biggest hurdles for them. Once they're out. Yeah absolutely so I think there are things that are obvious and show up in a stat sheets you know these are the things in terms himself. Employment Housing Insecurities ETC likes thereof. I think that one of the major issues Dad I act seeks to remedy is the simplicities of things such as not having an identification card Wanted to provision visions within a bill actually requires all federal people who are being released to make sure that they have access to appropriate identification when you think about that that may not necessarily seem like much quote unquote much but when you think about how an individual could potentially Have incidental contact with with police. A with Wi- with law enforcement and that individual potentially have their term of supervision Violated because of incidental contact because he or she may not may be in a place where they may be accosted by the police. They could be Riding as a passenger in a vehicle An officer ask for that individuals identification that individual can't produce it because he or she has not necessarily secured it because you need an ID a d just to get an ID and all the bureaucracy involved with that that individual could actually be you know a hauled into the local police department apartment just to check out who they who they are and when they are there that could potentially trigger a violation for police contact. So you know Vera things in terms of like employment yes people need to be back And or Not even back because most of the individuals who are actually incarcerated they they may not necessarily have had employment in the first place so they they need to enter into our workforce. They need to make sure that they have adequate housing. They need to make sure that they have access to appropriate health care treatment etc and so one of the things that we're doing it cut. Fifty is one of the several following. We have partner Wickliffe through our relationship with Kim Kardashian. They have given US ten thousand a free lift rideshare credits that we are distributing to individuals who are being released under the first step so that they can have access to You know just you know employment opportunities healthcare opportunities etc Healthcare appointments etc.. Say in addition we have also partnered with talk space. Talk space the online therapeutic a platform so that individuals can decompress from what I call The new PTSD in prison traumatic stress disorder. So that they can. Have you know a safe place just is to you know. Talk about the the TRAUMAS or indoor the vicarious trauma that they've actually observe as a result of being car serrated. Let Me Bring Jonathan back in here for just a moment because because this law I should mention affects people incarcerated at the federal level. It doesn't even touch the roughly one point three million people in state prisons. The sentence are we seeing similar reform movements at the state level. Jonathan the federal system incarcerates more than any individual state system but the state systems account for the vast majority of people in prison so the federal system is about ten percent of the total. US prison population. And so we. We are seeing some of these reforms being put in place Not all of them are prison reform. Some of them are broader criminal justice reforms but Where they are being put in place? really depends news on the state. New York is just past new bail laws which are going to affect shortly and twenty twenty year in the New Year and Other places are thinking about you know legalizing marijuana or thinking about how do we safely race past convictions. And some of that is happening through. Who advocate some of? It is happening through Progressive District Attorney's And so at the state level. Not only do you have more people incarcerated but you have in some ways a more complicated it system just because so many different actors are involved in making particular decisions And so we do. See these reforms but it'll be harder urge to push through in a lot of ways on the state level Just to get everyone on board. And let's talk about politics now on the federal level because many advocates have acknowledged the first step act is a major victory but they've also mentioned that the next step is focusing on those who've been found guilty of violent offenses and perhaps even rethinking policing on a grander scale. Would either of those approaches be able to gain bipartisan support in your opinion Jonathan. That's really hard to say a lot of previous bills that were not able to be passed. lost a lot of support. Because they were. They pushed the too far of advocates. Say That I didn't go far enough because it doesn't eliminate mandatory minimums Because it doesn't push far enough on good time credits We're wondering about what is electric monitoring do there is a new Thought Within Criminal Justice Reform Circle that we are moving towards e commerce ration- where People's information will be collected And where we'll know where someone is at all times we'll have a certain amount of information built up which is a different kind of Captivity Anyway and so there are a lot of sort of fights that that are yet to be had but violent crime in particular is a really difficult I think even For people on the left who are have been pushing for various various kinds of criminal justice reform for years Thinking about releasing someone who you know may have sold drugs at some point. It's very different from thinking about what do we do with someone who it might have heard someone on the street may have even killed someone And so those will be much harder battles and I at this. Point can't quite see receiving leaving bipartisan support. But the first step act was fantastic because it showed that there is some possibility I was once told doing this. Work that if you don't believe that you can make a difference in push forward. Then why are you doing the work at all so I'll stay optimistic. Jonathan Terry is a policy advisor at John. Jay College of Criminal Justice and Louis L. Read is a national organizer therefore cut fifty. Thanks to both of you for joining us. Thanks for having me on I everyone I'm Shumita Basu from. WNYC filling in for ten Zena Vega and this is the takeaway. Christmas is almost here. But I'm sure I didn't have to tell you that Christmas music has been playing in stores since November Colorful Christmas lights have been up for weeks and commercials featuring Santa Claus seemed to be on a never ending loop but there are millions of people in this country. Three who don't celebrate Christmas at least not in the traditional sense we asked you how you celebrate the season in your own way. Here's the story of why we put a hit job on our Christmas tree. That's Isabela a New Yorker who happens to be the roommate of takeaway associate producer Jamaica. Verma this year. She has chosen to decorate her Christmas tree with a hit job. It's kind of funny because growing up. I did celebrate Christmas in a way but not necessarily early religious. The more so culturally. I grew up in a mixed household of Christian Pakistan Muslim beliefs and my dad never felt completely comfortable being from August on not celebrating celebrating Christmas himself. Growing up never felt comfortable giving presents or decorating the tree but did so for solidarity of my mother now. Isabella lives in a household with other people from the South Asian diaspora and with political turbulence around the world and especially hostility toward Muslims. uh-huh she says lacing the job on the tree demonstrates two things pride in her upbringing and a kind of solidarity so something as simple as putting the hip hop on a Christmas Christmas tree when everything else was happening all over the globe with the South Asian diaspora trying to disconnect. Just trying to separate US prove that we are different. This putting avenue. Christmas tree proves that we are one and the solidarity and this kindness. This love is in a way form of a little resistance in itself all right so we invited you to tell us how you put your own twist on Christmas. And here's what you shared with us. Hi I'm Darla from Portland Oregon as a child who divorced I. I celebrate Hanukkah and Christmas so the side of my family that celebrates Hanukkah actually like American culture than emphasis on gift. Giving maybe spend more my mom and I exchanged a Hanukkah to get two meal every year. My Dog got twelve hundred. Plus my name is Collette O'Connor and I'm from Halifax Massachusetts. We celebrate Christmas at my my home during the day. We make sure to call relatives. Who can't be here so everyone is thought of and the remaining days for sharing gratitude which we do with a quiet meal together in conversation? Nina dual from Richmond. California my a reaction to Christmas is unsettled. I do you not feel like there's acknowledgement of other people celebrating other things we're just been bartered with red and wight Chris. This is hi. This is Rick Tomase from Needham Massachusetts. We enjoy the trappings of Christmas. But we do try to. Emphasize is the significance of the holiday from the religious aspects. THIS IS BILL IN NEW JERSEY. What we do this time of year? Is something called friends miss. It's a lot like friends. Giving it's a multicultural winter activity that's specifically nonreligious. Basically it's a night of fun. It's a night of multinational national and multi-ethnic foods and it's time to play games and hang out with the people that you really love. Thanks for sharing. All of your thoughts. I'll share with you now all my spin on the holiday. This is my first married Christmas. My husband and I did the thing. A few months ago in a nondenominational ceremony and I was raised in a house that it didn't really celebrate Christmas. My Dad is Indian and my mom is Iranian now. My husband coming from an Italian family was an is really big. Uh on Christmas so this year I added a little flair to our Christmas free. I strung up our read. Gold White Indian garland's the girl is that we exchanged changed as part of our wedding celebration. I think they make a very fitting addition to our tree this year and I imagine for years to come and remember you can always give us a call and share. Are Your thoughts at eight. Seven seven eight my take now. We'll look at other ways that the Christmas creep influences the whole month of December namely its impact on another religious holiday to help. I understand the history of how Christmas shape Hanukkah celebrations in America. We're joined by two guests. Emma Green is a staff writer at the Atlantic where she covers politics politics policy and religion. Emma welcome back to the takeaway things so much and Jonathan. SAARNA is a professor of American Jewish history at Brandeis University Jonathan within thank you for joining us joy to Byu. Jonathan many people assume that Hanukkah is one of the most important holidays Judaism because of its strong cultural presence since in the United States. But that's not exactly true right not exactly true. In early America you would have a hard time finding much evidence. It's the Jews talked about. Hanukkah the high holidays or important Passover is very important hannukah really emerges emerges in the nineteenth century they talk about in the eighteen seventies the revival of the Jewish wish national holiday of Hanukkah and gift-giving actually shifts from another holiday known as Purim to Hanukkah and and then of course Hannukah is magnified through the twentieth century in response to the magnification of Christmas. And let me let Emma cut in there. Because you've written about this as well. Why did Hanukkah become the Jewish response to Christmas in the United States? You see in the middle of the Twentieth Twentieth Century after the war when Jews are moving to the suburbs there starting these synagogues and trying to join country clubs and in general general. Have the American experience that we think of so stereotypically in the nineteen fifties and I think we see that today were Hanukkah has now been elevated to be kind of the equal and opposite reaction to Christmas something to give Jewish children feeling that they can fit in just like the Christian children who are celebrating Christmas at their schools us. How are those efforts met? In the United States it was common to find Jews. Even Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis had a Christmas Christmas tree and lots of Jews sang secular Christmas carols. It's not surprising that some of those carols roles were really written by Jews like Irving Berlin about A White Christmas of the feel of the lights lights and so on but the East European Jews some of whom had very negative associations with Chris Smith's in the lands that they came from Remembering that these were a days when they were frightened persecuted. They certainly certainly were not going to take on Christmas. And as we move through the twentieth century we see Konica. Aw arising as a kind of Jewish answer to Christmas Cindy there were some Jews who tried to tell their children. Oh you're so oh lucky. Hanukkah is eight days of gifts but the sense was. Let's have something that distinguishes us us Emma sitting across from me and nodding her head here. How was Hannukah celebrated before it started to grow in popularity here in the US as a response wants to Christmas well one of the interesting things about Hanukkah religiously is that it actually doesn't have that much of a starring role role in the Jewish calendar? There aren't that many obligations that go with Hanukkah and you don't have to spend that much time in synagogue especially relative to Yunky poor four or Russia. Shawna what's interesting to me about. Hanukkah is that it has been able to take this out size role in the American public imagination in part because Jews were free to go out and celebrate publicly. They could take their minora to a friend's house or have friends over to light the candles but it's also because is it's kind of a low-key holiday and so there's a lot of freedom and flexibility about how people celebrate. Jonathan maybe you can talk to us a little bit more about efforts by Jews in the United States early on to adopt Christmas as a secular holiday. Do you think that Hanukkah could become secular in a similar way. I I think that there are many Jews who observe Hannukah who do not view it as having in deep religious content might even have a hard time talking much about its history And and in that sense it has grown secularize up but at the same time. I'm very struck. By how recent is that. Hanukkah did move into the public square as late as the nineteen fifties store. Windows did not have Konica Konica even in New York and a you didn't see minorities out on the streets that's really a development that begins wins in the nineteen seventies with the Kabba religious organization. And they actually have several court cases in which sure they have to fight for the right to have a Hanukkah minora in the public square. That right is eventually confirmed by the Supreme Court which really says that the Konica Minora is in a way equivalent legally speaking to the Christmas tree. If one could in the public square the other can be in the Public Square in fact Jonathan. I want to jump in here because Emma wrote about this decision and you found actually but the supreme court treated aided Christmas trees in public a little bit differently than Minora's and public is that right. Well one of the questions that was at stake here and there have been a series of cases about out. This issue is whether something like the Nativity scene which we see in All sorts of public spaces is the equivalent of the minora weather weather that can be in a government building or a government owned park. And there's a a sort of differentiation here that the court uses or the legal legal thinking uses which is to say there's a difference between some sort of overtly religious symbol that seems to be an expression of what the government believes or supports ports versus these communal symbols. That we now see ubiquitously even at a courthouse building or add a government administrative building. You you see that kind of equality and equal weight give into something that shows a public expression of what these various groups in the United States celebrate at this time I feel. There's a lot of hand wringing over the commercialization of the holidays whether that's Christmas or Hanukkah. How would you say that gift-giving has or has ever been part of the tradition of Hanukkah one universal principle that I think guides Christmas and Hanukkah and maybe even holiday holiday celebrations around this time for families? That don't celebrate. Those two holidays is that we love consumer capitalism here in the United States and right now at this season we see from every corner stores and malls everyone trained to incentivize more more gift giving and this is something that's lamented seasonally. Everyone trying to say. Oh these holidays you have a deeper meaning about family or about faith not about gift giving but really million American culture we see that this all consuming force this incentive to buy stuff especially for your kids has been able to take over these holidays days so in some ways even though Hanukkah has been set apart as a separate holiday I separate people there really is a lot. That's overlapping about Hanukkah and Christmas Christmas. We've been talking mainly about what happens when Jewish populations from other parts of the world I came to America and were attempting to assimilate but are there other examples of people from other religions other faiths coming to America and sort of adapting their practices to the American Christmas culture. Sure Jonathan another example of this is what we've seen with the wally as something festival of Lights Celebrated in this season of the year and there are other groups. I think that have learned from Jews that you can simultaneously be part of the season and apart from it which is really what I think. The Jewish community has tried to do over the the last two decades. Emma I feel like we've spent a lot of this conversation. Framing this as if only negative things have come out of the Christmas vacation of other other holidays but what the positive effects is a good for all of us in the US to share celebrations at this time of year. You know I think the story of Christmas is a very American story in the sense that as we've been discussing it's become a shared celebration. That has a lot of secular meaning and takes over over our shopping malls in our streets but it just as much of an American story to have different groups of people whether their ancestors came over as Jews who's in the nineteenth century to whether their parents and grandparents are recent immigrants from the seventies or eighties or nineties. And I think that's such an American story because in some ways this is a country that's made up of people who come from all of these different places and traditions and who figure out their own spin on those traditions in the American in context. There's so much diversity here. Around this time of year you see Orthodox Christians who celebrate Christmas a few weeks later than Roman Catholics or Protestants artists in much of the United States. You see Muslims. who have figured out ways like going bowling or trying to avoid shopping malls of relating to the Christmas celebration Gratien and you have a lot of families who are both families so both Hanukkah and Christmas or Christmas and a little something else or Hanukkah and a little something else? All all of these stories to me are very much the Americanise of this time of year people trying to figure out how their particular identity should be in relation to to this Reason for the season that we call Christmas. Emma Green is a staff writer at the Atlantic where she covers politics policy and religion and Donovan. SAARNA is a professor of American Jewish history at Brandeis University. Thanks to both of you for joining me. Think so maverick you this is the takeaway from WNYC NPR wrecks in collaboration with W. G. B. H.. Radio in Boston Wjr this weekend. The third and final installment of the latest Star Wars Saga hit theaters. The rise of Skywalker ties together. The previous eight films news in just under two and a half hours and in that time it also managed to sleaze in something that those other films left out that there are LGBTQ TQ plus people in a galaxy far far away and in the case of the LGBTQ community. You know it was. It was important to me that people go to see the smooth. Feel that they're being represented in the film. Director J.J. Abrams during an interview with variety earlier. This month in the lead up to the film's release. He hinted there would the real LGBTQ representations in the rise of Skywalker but when the film premiered last week it was finally revealed that two minor her female characters kiss during split-second seen many are saying it's yet another example of a major Hollywood franchise teasing LGBTQ Hugh Representation and then not following through in a meaningful way joining me now is Kyle Buchanan pop culture reporter at the New York Times Kyle. Hi Hi thanks for being on the show having also with me is emily vander were critic at large for Vox Emily Hi welcome. It's so great to be here now. I don't I WANNA spoil too much for our listeners. Who Haven't seen the movie? So let's leave plot aside as much as we can but both of you have seen the movie kyle. Maybe you can start by telling us about the same sex kissing in the New Star Wars movie and why it's gotten such a big reaction. Sure I'd be happy to tell you. Because I think people who've actually wash the movie if they blinked might have missed it so let me fill them in as well. There is an extremely brief moment in the third act. Where a character? We're who has had at that point. Maybe two lines certainly wasn't named kisses her female partner in a victory celebration of sorts parts goes by extremely fast. And you know it's that had been a thing that people had seen in nineteen seventy seven say when the first star wars film came out. It would've been pretty pretty significant but I think the irony here is that especially this last film. The rights of skywalker is doing so much. Try to satisfy fan demands. But it's it's not really doing it in a visionary bold way that would satisfy anybody's asks and requests and so even though there have been fans who've asked for the characters actors played by John Boyega and Oscar Isaac to have some sort of romantic relationship in Star Wars. This is sort of the SOP to that. And I don't think it's going to satisfy all that many people. Now we just heard the director J.J. Abrams a few minutes ago. That was him speaking during the press tour for the film and he mentioned Lgbtq Representation. He went out of his way to say it. In fact there are some critics who have called what he said now. A classic example of Queer Baiting. Emily maybe you can explain Ryan what that is so queer. Baiting is the idea that there is some sort of movie or TV. Show especially council happened with books or other forms of fictional media Where two characters who are presented as platonic friends within the text of the show then fans often become you know interested in the idea idea of them having a romantic relationship? An example of this from these new star wars movies would be thin and po who are not really presented as romantic partners nurse in that first movie. The Force Awakens but the Internet took that and ran with it and these future movies have sort of played to that interesting ways a far more egregious example was the TV show. Sherlock which recently aired with benedict cumberbatch and Martin Freeman and that show the fans started sort of shipping which means hoping to see two people. The end up together Sherlock and Watson on that show and Then yeah it did not did not transpire and it turned into like the creators of bathing. The those expectations without actually doing anything about it and you'll be really kind of a nasty way to deal with your phantom now to go back to star wars for a second and what Abrahams said during the press tour. Why the fake out? I guess it's easy to assume that dipping an ambiguous toe into LGBTQ representations is meant to appease certain audience who you want to see that representation without going so far as to anger more conservative audiences. How how much is it about that dynamic? It's definitely about out that dynamic like there is sort of this air of they're trying to sort of make the right people mad by which I mean the really extremist people who don't WanNa see any LGBTQ not queue representation and like you know if there's a two second kiss most of America's GonNa be like okay whatever but like they're also not trying to push the envelope in terms of that representation in ways that might force people to sort of rethink their preconceptions or their prejudices or anything like that. It's just like the least risky way eh to deal with this material but also in a way that gets them these headlines in you know publications that are like Oh bold new ground for the Star Wars Franchise when you see the movie and and it's literally nothing like that so it makes them get to seem progressive without actually having to be progressive. And that's kind of the way that they play their publicity game. I WANNA ask each of you. What meaningful representation would look like glad the LGBTQ media advocacy organization uses this metric that they made up? It's sort of similar to the back. Del Test they call it the Vito Russo test after glads co founder and to pass Vito Russo test. A film has to have a character that is identifiable. LGBTQ that character was not solely defined by their sexual orientation or gender identity and that character must be tied to the plot in such a way that their removal would have a significant effect. So emily why don't you start. Do those criteria sound right to you when we ask what is meaningful representation. Would you add anything to it. I certainly don't disagree with any of those criteria. I'm happy to have that sort of as a starting starting point but I think that you know there's room for stories about LGBTQ plus lives like that are actually about our lived experiences and it's not like they don't exist. There's plenty of great queer art made every year. It's just that it's not happening. In major studio franchise films I think if we're looking for a major studio franchise film to tell stories that you know fit that sort of glad description. It's not impossible but it's also like you know it's it's it's hard hard to talk about our identities and a nuanced way when aliens are invading the planet. Or something like that. So I I do think there is. There's room for improvement But a lot all the stuff that we're looking for is often happening like indie film and Television and you know stuff. That's supported by Patriarch by independent artists. I think emily is right. And I and I think that queer viewers just sort of gotten used to expecting looking for that representation elsewhere which is why it would be a significant new thing to see it in the form of the Superhero or science fiction spectacular and. I don't think it has to be you know as emily also said these films. Don't offense for very long to consider the you know the minutia of the characters in their lives but just the presence accounts for something. I mean. Events Endgame culminates with his finale. This orgiastic finale of dozens upon dozens upon dozens of characters. And you know wouldn't be so hard for just one or maybe a couple of those people to be on the spectrum somewhere That's how life is and if these movies are drawing from life and then making something super powered it just seems like a notable omission for the only only times for them to acknowledge that people exist is when they shuttle in a character for one sane. Kyle Buchanan is a pop culture reporter and award season in columnist at the New York Times and Emily Vander were is a critic at large for. Vox thank you both for joining us. And that's our show for today but we do WANNA keep hearing from our LGBTQ listeners. On this one. Do you feel represented in any Hollywood franchises. And how could the industry improve on clear representation. Send us a tweet at the takeaway or write to us on our facebook page and if you missed anything anything from today's show or you just want to listen back again check out our podcast. Thank you so much for listening. I'm WNYC's should meet the best. Sue Feeling very lucky to be in today A.. And tomorrow for Tanzania Vega this is the takeaway.

Jonathan Terry United States America Emma Green John Boyega Jay College of Criminal Justic New York Shumita Basu president emily vander crack cocaine Lewis cocaine Nora Louis L. Massachusetts People Brandeis University
FTL Digest 2021-09-03

Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

28:06 min | Last week

FTL Digest 2021-09-03

"Here are the highlights from the latest episode of free talk live visit freetalklive dot com for the full episode. I really really really wanna talk about australia. Because they seem to be doing the right thing for their people. What yeah well so first of all you guys are probably aware if not i'll give you the update but australia is basically martial law at this point with the lockdown right like anything. They've deployed military in the streets. Complete police state say. Was there sarcasm in your voice. The right thing not doing the right thing. It makes more sense of right. The rank the yes. Yes in my way the right thing at a little bit of a german accent to it. I'll totally follow you. They do z. Reich thing i don't. I don't do german accents. Well so on top of all of that. They apparently according to get this from. This is news dot com dot a u so the australian website news dot com dot. Edu government is considering one hundred points of id in order to get facebook. Tinder accounts tender are licenses in. The united states aren't even a fraction of that. It gets worse. that's just. The headline government could require you to hand over your passport to tech companies before posting online at a move. That's been slammed by experts. People in south australia will be forced to download an app that combines facial recognition and geo location the state will tax them at random times and thereafter. They will have fifteen minutes to take a picture of their face in the location where they are supposed to be of these. People don't have don't have a smartphone like phone with a camera like why don't they just put an ankle monitor on all their citizens. I'm still trying to understand the easier. How where they're supposed to be. Is the government dictating where they're supposed to be well. Yes of course like you. You're not supposed to be within six feet of another person. Yes not supposed to be within like a certain amount of miles beyond your house outside of your house with within like three miles or something like that. Depending on where you're at in the city it might be smaller in the country. It might be a little wider. Okay okay tell me tell me. This is like the onion or something they do in kilometers. That's okay. I don't believe this. I cannot believe. Where's the story coming from. Well this part. I haven't verified but i've seen it repeated several times and nobody has refuted it so i have no evidence for this particular day downloading the app that combines the facial recognition geo location. I noticed a theory today surpassed four thousand dollars. I was like wow that's weird. They implemented something called an e. i. p. Oh that's right recently. And so there's been a reduction in the number of available. A theory that i think is driving the spike in price. Because now the the somehow burn off with gas fees or it makes it more efficient to actually transact but the gas fees are somehow related to this. And so it's creating a less theorem. So that i because i don't think there's a twenty one million limit like there's bitcoin theory and has a different thing going on. We're like yeah we're like they. Can i think they can just create however many they want But i'm not really sure about that. But i know they implemented a thing that's called the ip remember what that stands for. But i think that's driving the spike in the price can be. i know. it's i know that happened well or something like that. It was recent. Anyway i feel i think it was today. Actually it pinged over four thousand. Oh okay the price jumped a price. It was implemented a couple of weeks ago. Maybe yeah yeah yeah yeah it might have even been a month ago. Feels like supervision. I thought it was like maybe a week ago. Maybe australia is doing some other reich. Full things the from news dot com dot. Au government considering one hundred points of identification in order for. Australians you get a facebook or a tinder account. The morrison government will consider a radical measure to prevent online bullying and trolling. I laughed because government is the largest bully on planet earth but experts say the proposal would involve serious risks for social media users government is considering forcing users of social media platforms like twitter facebook and instagram as well as online dating platforms like tinder tetra to upload one hundred points of identification in order to use them. The recommendation which has been raised before is one of eight recommendations from a parliamentary committee. Report looking at family domestic and sexual violence in order to open or maintain an existing social media account customers should be required by law to identify themselves to a platform using one hundred points of identification in the same way as a person must provide identification for a mobile phone account or to buy a mobile sim card. The report suggests you know. I don't do any of those things i have to say. This is this is exactly why i am so opposed to driver's licenses and idea we were talking during the break about how i mentioned on the i am very concerned that people are going to die australia very concerned because they they've already got the gun ban on so most people are disarmed at least the ones who didn't dig a hole in their backyard. Very some guns so. A large portion of their population is disarmed. And so now you have this. Excuse this cova these lockdowns. They've already deployed military into the streets. They have insane rules that you have to obey in order to you know. Go about your daily life like you can't go more than a couple of miles or kilometers from your home to be with people that you don't have registered as in your bubble with the government. They call it a bubble. Is that a thing. Yeah canada was doing that last year. I don't know if they are again but there was talk about doing something similar in the us for the holidays over like thanksgiving that last year that you could have some people over. But they had to be like. I don't know ten people. You registered two degrees of kevin bacon or something seven kinda remember that. I think it was like those. I don't think it was forced on anybody in the united states but i could be mistaken about no. It wasn't but they were talking about what they were doing overseas. So then we learn that. They're rolling out this app for those in quarantine where it's going to combine facial recognition and geo location. And if they paying you through this app you have fifteen minutes to take a photo of yourself to prove that you are where the geo location data says you are. Are we turning into north korea. This is orwellian on user wrote on twitter after reading this recommendation from australian government. I'm a social media manager. And i honestly don't get enough out of social media to justify giving them access to my idea. Another wrote a good point. Emily van dern. Nicole is a lecturer at menashe university in melbourne. She wrote her. Phd thesis on the value of social media anonymity and pseudonyms and said of the recommendations simply. Don't do this. I was her entire recommendation after reading. That don't do this. I mean do they have the ability to just say no. I'm just going to have social media over there. Because i mean they're making people put apps on their phones. I bet that they're doing things like oh you have to go through the social media to buy things. Maybe that's coming next. All i can say is that we've the older i get the more. I realize that its monkey. See monkey do when it comes to governments whatever one government can get away with all the other governments want to be able to do that and so we saw china with the social media credit scores app. If right all the other governments want that. I don't even know if your typical martial law is restrictive. As is's for australia right. They've just dressed it up in the name of your safety. Yeah so all governments want to do this stuff like and by want. It's kind of a weird word to use because governments. Don't really want anything but they do if you look at governments historically more for them less for you more control of you and you know more freedom for them. Yeah i mean this. I mean this ultimately all goes back to the social credit system of of china. I think and you know as i was saying before break. You're basically it's the car i was trying to use. The car is an analogy or drivers listens really and it's all about the driver's license. All was all about discrimination. And but really what it comes down to is control. Yes and where it was going with that. Because i'm sure people are thinking i'm absolutely nuts. He's how does how does that discrimination align with social credit. Well it has to do with the fact that we have a driver's licenses and when you don't pay your taxes or if you don't make child support payments they will take away. Your drivers license will take away your passport and so we actually already have this sort of a system in place and yes. Most people haven't encountered the system. But this is this is something that we already have is just may not be to the same degree. As china is the only thing that the government claims that you have to have a driver's i mean i was called the wrong thing license plate for. It's the only thing they claim it's for is like identification or so i. I'm trying to remember. It's been a long since. I've looked into the origins of the license plate. It's basically it. It's irrelevant the truce behind it. But i think effectively the argument that they've been using for a while is it has to do with stolen cars right. The way for them to generate more revenue. Why do your license plates expire. Yeah there's no reason for your life if you haven't moved out of state if you have you know what i mean. There's no reason for you. You have to pay to get what the little sticker. That's the most expensive stick or any of us by i mean. Yeah and it's and they forced you to all sorts of other things like here in new hampshire when you register your vehicle. You have to pass an inspection every year so you have to take your vehicle into a mechanic somewhere. If the mechanic is unscrupulous. They're going to do things like oh. Hey by the way. I noticed this and and you also need to get this done and you don't while your car is gonna fail inspection so now you get strong-armed as it were into paying for some repairs that you've maybe didn't need before just so that you can get the expensive sticker now. Do you think they're going to publicize the gas chambers or felt like while they're doing it or you done behind the scenes the new variant of cova. They'll do well. I mean there's concentration camps in china right now and we don't really know what all is going on in them through struture. not only. it's probably. It's probably the the standard motive upper and upper rhonda. Yeah i guess. That's the word and to not to kinda hide all about stuff you know that you're doing government so just to finish off the article from news dot com dot a u about this hundred points of. Id that australia. Wants people to submit before they can get or keep their existing social media account. There's some criticisms this is from. Emily vander nagel. who is a social media researcher. She continues to say. It's a message shared by the queensland anti cyberbullying task force which noted in two thousand in a report that in demand show one hundred points of id access to social media would come with privacy. Risks given the challenges social media companies have already experienced with data security identity verification systems raise questions about access to personal and sensitive data the report notes washington state has something where it's so weird. This happened to a person. I believe that they eventually got out of the. You know the states attack if you will but in washington state you can move in with somebody who has children from like another relationship or whatever and not marry them i after. I don't remember the timeframe let's say a year or something they consider you common law married right and so now let's say you and the other person break up. That person can now sue you for child support. Well for not your kids. Even if they're collecting child support from the biological parents so they can doubled up. that's right. Wow yes yeah. It's the most horrendous thing it all eighteen years or is it like a the year they live for whatever whatever the duration is because they consider you married at that point right and get divorced. Well no even if you get divorced. They can they re. It's a bizarre law. And it's heinous and it's horrendous. It's bizarre that they consider people married. Who would do you actually have to go get divorced because like if you just live with divorce is there such a thing where you just separate and then your then your son nightly divorced laura. Ingram ran a story where she plays. I remember the lady's name girl from little house on the prairie ingles. Sorry my bed. Like wait is it. I mixing their names up. Well anyways she plays a video of the cdc director doctor rochelle wolinsky claiming that over ninety percent of people who are entering the hospital right now are unvaccinated and then she says that it is that statistic is grossly misleading in august fifth video statement. She said she inadvertently revealed how that ninety nine to ninety nine percents statistic was created turns out to achieve those statistics the cdc included hospitalization and mortality data from january through june. Twenty twenty one. Which means before the vaccines were readily available to most people so they included unvaccinated people. I mean from january to like february. It was like a hundred percent unvaccinated. People were going to the hospital and so they just throw those numbers in there so it's grossly misleading in the cdc admitted it. I can't think of. Maybe i'm just growing more aware of the blatant lies lies in the brainwashing. That is taking place via media all forms of media right. But i can't think of the wool being pulled over more people's eyes globally then has happened with governments and cove it the fact that you can be considered a bad person by just being around another person and breathing. Somehow that makes you an evil person is got to be one of the most preposterous things i've ever encountered as human being like. I don't understand how people can believe that. Just a regular healthy person being around other people is somehow making you a bad person and if it was like absolute bible facts that the masks completely stop the spread of diseases an hod zero side effects because people can die from the things that the masks due to them like. You know you can die from strep throat. It's proven that they can give you strep throat but anyways so if there was zero percent risk in only one hundred percent of efficiency with the masks not spread keeping you from spreading diseases. Maybe i could see that but it's just not a fact and people just like to pretend it's completely just voodoo it's people just you're not doing the voodoo and if you do the bhutto you can stand right next to me. But if you're not doing the voodoo i'm scared of you. You're not actually scared of the disease. At that point you literally just want to control you. Want other people to do the same thing you're doing. Cop kills cop. Nearby lady gets charged with manslaughter. Up kills cop and a nearby lady gets charged with manslaughter. Now this that's a click bait headline of course but it is nearly as ridiculous as you think it is. Gentle home was incapacitated when one cop accidentally killed another she's now being charged with his death incapacitated in what way asleep knocked down gentle is facing prison time for the death of bonneville county sheriff's. Deputy wyatt lease this utah. Wherever bonneville county is that might be you maybe it was just like a rate or something. I'm trying to think that was two cops. They entered from different doors and they shot each other and and how they're blaming the woman they rated over so this happened in may of twenty twenty despite the fact that maser was killed not by home but by his philip police officers mazer and his colleague. Deputy benjamin bonsor were called to help home. Who had crashed her car on. A rural road may eighteenth of last year. When the deputies arrived home was in the street wielding a machete screaming and screaming blocher who had interacted with home days. Prior at the idaho falls behavioral crisis center so idaho not utah worked to calm her down during what was possibly a mental health crisis. They're saying that because she crashed her car and had a machete was acting all crazy. Com created situation top. One shows up peyser subdues. Their cop two shows up and runs over cop number. One sounds like the cops were the ones who created a dangerous situation. Not the person that they were called about who is holding the machete. I understand that like you know verbal actions like somebody can do something mean because you say something you know or they can commit a crime as you say something mean. But it's not really you saying something it's actually taking action of their own to like most of. Its then taking the action. Not you saying something. Home allegedly approached mazer with the weapon prior to being subdued though. She did not harm mazer or watcher. At the time maser died home was on the ground after having been phased for approximately full minute. Well oh my god. So she wasn't wasn't even like able to commit a crime at that point iran when the murder occurred and the murder wasn't committed by her. But if i buy a police officer. But she's being charged with motor in her driveway right in her house. Well side of the believe this is on this the roadway so. She crashed her car somewhere on a road. So no. it's not in her driveway. She went into the house and then was holding a machete. No i think she. She was acting crazy with a machete but yet no not went into the house. They want to cover up. The cop was probably speeding and the other cop was standing in the freaking road. That stupid we do. These things called live reads here on the show and every now and again somebody will throw some money at us and say. Hey you know advertise my product or service and some people will take the liberty of you know not even really advertising a specific product or service. And so what you're referring to is alive. Read now it just so happens that during the commercial break or just in the previous segment. I had done the library for this very thing. And it's just tuned into date thirty but it's it's called smiles and hugs for peace. Now the deal is that september fourth. That's tomorrow at three thirty three. Pm you can. You can join the smiles. And hugs for peace virtual event ending. It's meant to be a little enigmatic because you're supposed to put your own spin on it. It's not something going on a podcast. It's something going on wherever you are tomorrow when you notice it's three thirty three. It also doesn't have time zone. I know that this guy star child is in. So i'm like should i do it at whatever. Three thirty three pacific time is but in eastern time but anyways I don't know if it really matters either way you're just supposed to win. It's three thirty three conjure up star child in your mind and smile and if you see somebody raji you hug them and keep smiling and imagine a world where peace in love. exist in coercion is not you know the typical mo of the world. I always thought that the motto live rear. Die men for new hampshire like how could authorities even if they are police. If they're new hampshire police that's the motto of their state they still want to be encouraging their residents to live free federal agents. And that's another reason. That new hampshire should secede and become independent so we are federal agents. I mean he did go to the police station to protest because there were local and state. Police well yeah but they weren't. They were outside of managing traffic. They weren't the people who raided my house. I mean they were keeping us from filming though. Well okay yeah. They shouldn't be cool operating and cops shouldn't even exist. I'm arguing more than just safety. It was it was literally the fbi. Only they didn't enter my house to be. I only push me back a block. The local police push me back another block an hour after all the violence was basically over. There was as orchestrated by the fbi so yes it was federal agents that raided my house and the keen police department came in Cooperated with them. They shouldn't have. It's messed up. Well and jeff so just to kind of put a little bit of more light on it for you. The the state of new hampshire was selected by libertarians in the free state project as the freest unquote state in the union. To come in attempt to get twenty thousand people to move here the agency theory as opposed to the proximate cause theory holds that you may only be held accountable under the felony murder rule if the murder was carried out by other agents of the crime the state adopted that line of thought in state of idaho versus pena in which juan carlos fuentes pena's felony murder conviction was overturned because the actual shooter in question was not an accomplice. In pena's alleged criminal activity in other words had mazer been struck and killed by one of homes co conspirators. Home could be charged but home had no co-conspirators back to what you were saying earlier. Like if somebody else were there like committing a crime then maybe you could kind of see the logic. That's what this is saying. But there were no other co-conspirator in order to amazes me is when somebody is supposedly has conspired to commit a crime and they convicted of murder and they didn't know the crime was going to occur prior to driving away after the crime has occurred. And because they're like the getaway driver but they know they were the getaway driver and it's like but yet they get convicted just because they happen to be with the person and it's like how like i mean how do you. There was no conspiracy because there was no plan between the person who committed the crime and who driving the getaway car because he knows going to happen in the first place. There moles that you don't feel comfortable with this is safer here. What do you mean what do you mean feel comfortable with. I mean i don't even want to see a giant squid in my room. What i'm saying is i mean other animals in other words that you don't particularly care for as that's what. I'm trying how i'm trying to address this. I mean like. I never liked seeing a bear unless i met a very safe distance and possibly in a vehicle. You know they exist. I don't want to be in same room as one. i hate cows. Cow's just walk into the road. They smell bad they're stupid. They're i honestly. I only like penguins dear. Why why are you seeing this. This is kind of a random question. I i hate dear bo. what are you trying to get of the reason. I i the reason. I ask this because i feel especially comfortably with dogs. I feel comfortable with them for one thing For one thing. I'm totally blind. So they sorta let me raise. Whenever i on the on the dog that i did. They mean feel. I guess they feel safe. There's a liberty activist who's been indicted facing years in prison after entirely legal facebook posts criticizing the government in two thousand seventeen. The free thought project brought you the story about constitutional activists josh martinez when he was arrested for refusing to give his age to police on a nevada on the nevada courthouse steps. He was attempting to enter the lloyd. D george federal courthouse without having to identify himself. There's no lot says you have to. Since then martinez fought a series of battles for his freedom going up against clearly false charges as he fights for the freedom of others now he is battling what appears to be yet another set of bogus charges this time however the stakes appear to be much higher and he was indicted this week on what some are saying are trumped up and retaliatory charges in. Say the statement that you made. Oh sorry does in february martinez. Thirty two was arrested after. He made facebook posts. That are entirely legal to be clear martinez posts were in poor taste. That's an opinion however they were completely legal. Earlier this year martinez posted a facebook photo of a flag draped coffin carried by uniformed officers with the caption. How police officers take out their trash. You just heard highlights from the latest episode of free talk live. You can download full episodes. Subscribe to our podcast. Listen live and more over free at freetalklive dot com.

australia mazer Edu government Au government morrison government facebook china bonneville county Emily van dern menashe university cdc new hampshire Emily vander nagel us queensland anti cyberbullying twitter rochelle wolinsky Reich
The parody-proof president

Today, Explained

28:48 min | 11 months ago

The parody-proof president

"Support for the show today comes from the Quick Electric Toothbrush i. told you about it recently, but it's worth reminding you that equip will now reward you for doing a good job of brushing your teeth. You can start getting rewards for brushing your teeth today by going to get quick dot com slash explained to right now and you're I refill is free at get quip dot com slash explained that his ged t q ip Dot com slash explained quip. Better oral health made simple and rewarding. Google's free tools are designed to help millions of businesses around the country as they adapt to a new way of working and right now these businesses could use our help support the places near you by booking appointment, buying a gift card reading review or ordering takeout all with a little help from Google. On Thursday Vice President Biden held a town hall as scheduled on ABC at the same time NBC. Later, thirst trap for President Trump one town hall was thoughtful cogent discussion of the issues facing our country. The other featured president trump will now present a rebroadcast of those townhall for most Americans watched them flipping back and forth trying to decide between a hallmark movie and an alien autopsy this. Is Doing town halls. This is how this weekend's episode of Saturday night live kicked off because it's now two weeks away from the election to show seem to have no choice. But to satirize the biggest televised political events of last week Biden's townhall with Jim. Carey's already stale Joe Biden impression and that brings exists to nine, thousand, nine, hundred, thirty, nine. A year when I went to the world's fair met the Real Mickey. Mouse. And Trump's townhall with Alec Baldwin's rents and take on Donald Trump and that's why that's why we're going to have a v-shaped recovery a deep the. With. Rippling PECs atone date pack swimmer's body basically like I have to call the and it's going to be beauty of the amount of live studio. Audience. Laughter is any barometer. The cold open was the latest in a long line of failed attempts to try and make something very serious and scary funny for four years. Now, late night television has been trying to make fun of a presidency that already feels like an onion headline presidency that makes onion headlines A reality back in March of this year, the onion published a satirical article titled Man. Just. Buying one of every cleaning products in case, trump announces its corona virus cure. And just one month later right and then I see the disinfectant. Where knocks it out in a minute from minute and is there a way we can do something like that? by. Injection inside. Or. or almost cleaning it's really hard to satirize something that already feels like satire but that hasn't stopped TV from trying. And failing, I think that comedy especially in the United States has tendency to treat. The world is having a sort of status quo sort of stability that can always be returned to donald trump inherently up that emily vander is the critic at large for Vox. He is this like thing that points out a lot of flaws in our underlying ways we think about comedy and in order to like make comedy better in the trump less future whenever that arrives, we have to really grapple with. The ways that he points out flaws in. Our System of court jesters if you will our political comedy has a tendency just like our political journalism to be like well, you know both sides both sides are equally at fault but he puts a magnifying glass on the American presidency and the problems of sort American empire both domestically and globally in a way that like. MAKES US uncomfortable. Mr President. I'm heading home for the night. Can I get you anything? No. Thank you David but hey. How do you like working at the White House or your parents? Proud. I tell them I work at Applebee's. Thing you know I love my daughter Ivanka and her husband jared they always be so calm and sure I don't do anything too crazy. That's true sir. So question are they going? Yes. They don't work on Shibata Perfect Jews away the GOIZUETA play. Sending Steve Bannon. In America political humor is you know we do impressions of powerful people and like there's no real underlying substance there. But Donald. Trump's ridiculousness is so overt on its face that allot more people than normally would be tuned into the ways that his administration is either uniquely terrible or terrible in a way that continues policies that they might not have agreed with but we're easier to ignore when somebody who was less overtly ridiculous was standing behind the podium. So you create this situation in which the only way to satirize him is sort of to satirize America and that's a lot harder. To do because you know why is it that we're only mad about thing when donald trump is doing it slash why is it so hard for us to tell compelling humor about the fact that this man let a pandemic get out of control and then got sick with it himself. Right and that was the week. The Nation's quintessential variety show came back from a summer break and seem to struggle with how to approach the humor in this sort of insane situation. On okay serious voice. While in the hospital, the president isn't allowed to see guests, but he is expected to be visited by three US probably one from his past one from his. Okay. This is weird. Because, a lot of the biggest risk you make is you don't have a comedic point of view like comedy needs a point of view. One of the things I think snl really struggles with is Lorne michaels famously is like we are making this for Republicans and Democrats we are making this for etcetera etcetera and like I honestly think that's fine if you are. In a world where America's not as polarized as it is right now. But if you're trying to occupy some sort of nebulous middle, you end up trying to appeal to everyone in a way that just doesn't work for anyone but you do that for four years every other Saturday night or whatever it is I think they do twenty twenty episodes a season. It gets it gets wearing wears you down it's just like there's nothing more there. Does anyone like as an els trump work does anyone appreciate Alec Baldwin's impression of Donald Trump and and if not, why do they keep doing it? Won An emmy for playing Donald Trump. I suppose I should say at long last Mr President. Here is your. So it works, but certainly, not for everyone certainly, not for you I assume based on an article you wrote earlier this month that argued Saturday night live is woefully unequipped for the trump era snl just at the problem is it has to be made so quickly and on such a tight timescale that makes it almost impossible for it to do anything besides choose the most obvious impersonation of a President George W Bush kind of an idiot, let me make something very clear. There was utterly no legal or military justification for the strike Bill Clinton is. Horny gluttony. Actually did all that. I mean I didn't Obama is kind of a boring technocrat. Now I know I'm not perfect I'm distant. A loaf like the SNL settled on for all of those people. Then just over eight years, it just kept playing that basic note and I actually think that one thing that has been worse in the trump era is. SNL has now almost exclusively turned over Washington power player impressions to celebrities and celebrities are rarely as good at building out these characters as say you know imagine that. A. Darrell. Darrell, Hammond used to do trump. He used to be to for trump most of you know who I am already because I'm rich handsome. If you're a man, you want my life if you're a woman well. I've got what you want. Okay. replaced him with Baldwin but like he's a master impressionist like he would have been so much better in that role right and part of the issue with trump compared to all those other guys is that he's just constantly everywhere on twitter on TV on the radio on podcast we don't need to hear or see more trump right and I think. That is the thing that everyone who's trying to trump has to bump up against a really where I think SNL has uniquely failed compared to some other programs say is it has never come up with anything to say about the circus surrounding trump. The ridiculousness of trump makes him hard to make fun of but that should be send you looking for other targets not just being like, oh, he shouts a lot and he has a big New York accent and he wears a lot of tanner and he kind of has a pout. So Yeah for a while there Alec Baldwin was being treated like a hero of. The second American revolution or something and. That's just not the case anymore but like there is this weird reflex in the American media to be like. Well, let's see what SNL had to say about it and yet the new cycle moves. So quickly now that s is almost an afterthought yet, we keep treating it like this thing that is trenchant. Emily what's like the funniest political television you've seen during the trump presidency do you recall? My Long silence should be my answer I. I will say this. I don't think this was a great television show but I, think it was a fascinating television show and I think it had more to say about our times been just about any other satire and I think that is the comedy central program the President Show which starred this Guy who doesn't amazing impression of trump sir people are saying you are mentally unfit for the office and we both know that's not true I'm incredibly mentally that my doctor said I had the most neurons of any person he'd ever met I wish. Neurons and the basic idea of it was he was playing Donald Trump and it was kind of a sketch comedy show. But. It was so smart about the ways that Donald Trump is not just Sui generous. He he he came from somewhere there is a reason he exists and like. There is this tendency to treat donald trump is an aberration I think by especially by a lot of political satirists and. Depressed and show never did that that the final moment of it's Christmas special which I believe was its final episode ever was everybody in the trump administration singing wise up from the film. Magnolia. Ounce. You for. You can but then expanded to be like Oh. Here's the Democrats Miss. Other people singing this here's it's just like it's all part of this this broken. System that nobody really wants to fix because the power within it. So entrenched and like. That show is the only show that really tried to make that point. Stop. Tell you. To. Old. All right. The president show anything else that works for you. We gotTA shout out last week tonight with John Oliver and people seem to really love Kobe right. His. Jokes are very catered toward I guess I'd say your rich aunts who's like really involved in like certain political issues it's broad humor, but it definitely has a point of view of Donald. Trump, is ridiculous and especially in Quarantine Colbert has been really good like he's gone back to his offices and he's performing for in essence, his family and his closest friends were facing a global pandemic that killed one hundred, eighty American heavily armed Rambeau wannabes are murdering people in our streets. The strongest hurricane in the history of the Gulf coast is making landfall as I speak and the RNC's messages who's up for four more years. I think Seth Meyers on NBC is always good. He's a little bit closer to the old John Stewart vein of you know we're GonNa talk about the issues of the day we're gonNA, make jokes about them and I think he's also really smart about bringing invoices other than the traditional white guy who makes jokes about the names. These eight trump was mad when he saw written on the street. He doesn't know how to read. He thinks it says late lively matters and he loves it but I don't think TV is the place to find political humor. What is I have just been? So enamored with this twitter comedian her name is Kylie brakeman and she makes these videos that are basically just like taking various types that live in our political landscape and like I think she's so smart about using the tools of twitter, which is kind of the best place for political humor right now because it's the only thing that moves as fast as the news cycle. I think because, often good political satire comes from people who are young and have something to prove at have nothing to lose. The Internet's where those people are. After the break. Kylie. Brakeman. Expect. This episode of today explained is brought to you by a vast a global leader in cybersecurity. When you move across the Internet, you leave digital breadcrumbs behind you valuable information on things like your location health and finances. Data brokers can sell this information to third parties which can have serious consequences. A vast breach guard automatically scans the web for your data and get your data back from broker databases. Third parties can't take advantage of asked also alerts you if your passwords have been leaked, so you stay protected from all sides. With our digital footprints growing bigger every day, it's important to have backup to help. Keep US safe join over four, hundred, thirty, five, million users trust a vast to keep them private and protected online. Don't worry about viruses, phishing attacks, ransomware hacking attempts, or cybercrime because a vast has your back. Learn more about a vast privacy security and performance products at AVAST DOT com. Support for the show today comes from the Thera- gun. It's a hand held progressive therapy device that releases your deepest tension using calibrated combination of depth speed and power, and now it's as quiet as an electric toothbrush. Yes. An Electric toothbrush that's because the all new gen for their has proprietary brushless motor. That's so quiet. You wonder if it's even on while you soothe your aching muscles with Thera Gun, signature, power, amplitude, and effectiveness. You can try that they're gun risk free for thirty days right now and just know that there is no substitute for the fair gun. Jen Four with its led screen, it's personalized their APP and the quiet power you need. Starting at only one, hundred, ninety, nine dollars. Bob. Go to therapy dot com slash explained right now and get your Gen fourth there a gun today that is, Thera- gone dot com slash explained their gun dot com slash explained. I'm Kylie brakemen. I. Am a comedian and writer and actor. Kylie as you'll remember from before the break was emily's example of someone who's doing a better. Political comedy right now, all by herself for the Internet I guess I went viral. I guess I'm a viral sensation I just started making front facing videos in my room and I never expected them to super take off. I was just sort of trying to prove that I was doing something creative during this time. Hello my name is suburban housewife. My bio is seven random nouns and I for one will be voting for drug. It's your phone on reverse mode, your phone on Selfie mode the people who are saying that we can't reopen schools are ignoring a very real problem and that problem is that my children excellent McKenna Brenton, our board and. It is a low production value character video that you shoot yourself, and for some reason, that's all people click on my name's covert and I'm a little stinker me being in the president. It's just another one of my classic little pranks I'm like the Jokester of my friend group I'm like always doing like hilarious gags, people kind of want something that's like immediate right now they want something that's like, oh, it's your friend on facetime like they like and I get it I don't even want to watch a show. It's too much work. But watching like a one minute bit from someone is just so much more digestible when everyone's like emotionally traumatized. So once you have this and figure out that this is exactly the kind of stuff people want what do you decide to add to the conversation? What do you do I guess the character sort of keep coming back to that is recurring and I do a lot of stuff but like It's the thing I jumped to. I have proper scenes, which is just like very clueless liberal, self-important white woman wakey-wakey eggs and drinking everything happens for a race slang and that's why you're slumped over a patio chair treat yourself to a glass of mom back. I I went viral with video why I won't wear a mask I can't breathe in this thing because every time I put in on I, hold my breath on purpose. So difficult to put on like can't put it on because I'm using one hand to hold the camera and it was just kind of this like. Waspy Orange County lady talking about all the different reasons for why she can't wear her mask and they were just absurd heightened versions like how do I know that This isn't full of spiders. There is no way for me to check. I was diagnosed with a fake, a disease called spider blindness where I can only see spiders if it benefits me politically I was just inspired by the absurdity of why someone would even think. To not wear one or to think that it was bad to wear one. It's such a small inconvenience that I could not conceive of a logical reason for why and I think that's why did so well, where did you post it? I posted on. Twitter and instagram and Tiktok, but twitter is where most of my jam is. What kind of responses did you get on twitter? I got a lot I mean a lot of it was supportive and then a lot of it was like people who were pro mask but didn't realize I was joking, which is scary in itself either people cannot digest media anymore or people have gotten so crazy that like an obvious parody looks like truth but I got some like death threats from those people my first death Brett. Ever was very fun just to be clear here the mask wearing. Presumably liberals out there were said that you death threats. Yes because they couldn't tell. I got a few anti mask conspiracy people who were like the oxygen molecules are too big to fit through the mask like in the comments but most of it was like liberals who were like, how dare you not wear your bask in the CBS and I get it. But also come on guys. Let's just let's evaluate media a little bit. How refreshing to be hated by both sides? I didn't set out to be like I'M GONNA Trash Liberals, today I'm a both sides comedian and I think it resonated with people who are also online for ten hours a day where you go after that well, then I had to go after the trump thoughts. Hello my name is proud American. My job is America and my husband is a gun good afternoon I'm a stock photo of a person of color and I for one do not think trump is racist who were Just the classic person who's like, hello, my name is former Democrat bag among my hobbies are being real and my interests are breathing I for one will not be supporting the NBA. I've tweeted one, hundred, twenty, six times I am an eagle wearing. Just like these completely fake sounding people who tweet the same thing, twelve, hundred times a day, and there's so many fake accounts out there. So I was just kind of making fun of that in a very heightened version that took off pretty well as well. It's really interesting. So pre pandemic, you're like this, you see be Improv theater comedian pandemic happens you start cranking out these more political videos on social media, and now you've got what like over a hundred thousand people telling you to keep going to make more of it do you consider yourself like a political comedian now three months after posting your first big? Well I would say I like I enjoy doing it I think that I do have a voice for it, and so it is fun to like. A role that I don't know if I see always but I. It's crazy to be recognized as a legitimate form of anything because I am surely just on Selfie mode I mean I'm I'm shooting and four K., but it is still sell. that. Being said I'm curious like because you have found the success on your own, do those sort of more traditional or perhaps Outdated forms of success still appeal like do you still want a big job on a late night comedy show does that kind of visibility still mean something when you have your own online? I mean of course I think I I always want to be you know validated in the industry I want to go into and just by doing this alone I've gotten some pretty big interviews which was really surprising and cool and I think it is just about maybe if I were to be in that position like shifting the narrative a little bit. Not playing it so safe. I think it it is a thing of, Oh, I can't blame it on team of writers or my producers every dumb thing. I. Say is from my own dumb brain and I have to take responsibility for that. But I think it is important to just own up if you make a mistake and if you say something slightly off or something you never even intended or something that could possibly be construed some way it doesn't matter how you intended. It matters how it was received I. Think I'm just GonNa try and remember that if it ever happens. You can just get canceled now and the move on you know we should just cancel you right now on the show I should get canceled really early so that I can go on an apology tour that will give me a to canceled. Thank you. Truly, thank you so much. Value really appreciate your time. Thanks. Of course, thank you for having me. Kylie Brakeman is on the Internet per handle is dead I break men all one word. Eye brakeman break men is kind like. Pump. The brakes man it looks like that. If that makes sense I'm Sean Rama's firm. Explained and I just WanNa. Make sure your takeaway from today's episode isn't that you know impressions are bad I love Impressions it's just that Alec Baldwin's impression isn't very good just today my brother sent me a trump impression from a comedian named James Austin Johnson that had me near tears for some hilarious reason I haven't figured out yet it's an impression of Donald Trump talking about weird al Yankovic. Enjoy. Folks we love. We love we'd out. Yankovic. Where Al an American original he's got more money than sane. More he's probably I, don't know maybe Gobbo body the me though if he's got more money than me, but he's got a lot of it he's got a lot of spunk get his down a lot of talent. I've never seen anybody who gets famous playing a Gordian I just don't see. I just don't see it. Who's WHO's doing accord and that we don't even know how it works. Science doesn't even know how it works. He gets a piano and he just. He squeezes it and it sounds really crazy. And Weird AL figured it out. God bless and. We think it's great that we'd have figured out that a Gordon I don't even know how they do. We don't even know how does it Ne- batteries? We'll never know we'll never know in science doesn't know. But we had our was very mean to coolio not very nice. coolio was very upset with Mr. Witt alley didn't do. It s for the rights he just went and did Amish Paradise and he just didn't even ask for the right didn't even as more. When he? GINKS does paradise. He had such a big with gangster dance does paradise and. You know with Amish `paradise ice -ly he what they do is they take the music and they steal the whole thing. They steal the music and they write a new words and it's a new song and Everyone goes all it so great the. Your rights, new words it inside leads Vanni best comedy album it'll never get best music never get best album breakout style never do. The Lever, get it to him no CMA's as nothing. But people buy it. They like it because it's a good product and. We'll have would we'd all does we'd Hal as originals night, Santa Wit Grazie. Albuquerque, but they'll never like it as much as white, nerdy He was very mean Mr Chameleon air. Will never like the originals quite as much. As as we like the parody so much to you good job with. Really really good job ebay backstreet boys. You know he did ebay years after we'd totally forget they come out with Ebay. And I forgot who the backstreet boys. I don't even know we had an incredible going. Bijou with Lou? Perelman. All world changing innovation starts with trailblazers people with ideas just crazy enough to work go deeper into the history and exciting future industry disruptions that shape our lives in unexpected ways with the trailblazers podcast from Dell Technologies bestselling author Walter Isaacson alone with extraordinary guests will explore the people and tech that are moving us forward listen to trailblazers wherever you get your podcasts or at Dell technologies dot com slash trailblazers.

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Silence of the Lambs with Emily Vanderwerff

Blank Check with Griffin & David

2:40:24 hr | 1 year ago

Silence of the Lambs with Emily Vanderwerff

"Scripted and you don't it was on the show with uh-huh a census taker once. Tried to podcast me. I ate his pod with some cast beans and a nice podcast. You it started bad got worse forty fs. That's the Pete Holmes Joke you you sound like you were a snake I mean. Are you trying to hypnotize amounted to it was pretty good. It's the first. Is the top quote load said. I'm getting the impression poorly. Let's get it over with because it will happen more over the course the episode. I was trying to maybe Hof as we said the rare move of the. Clarissa reese into Hannibal you look like a rue the reverse Tomahawk right I mean actor-director doctrine lecter. Actually she a lot doctor. I can say this because because it's not for me to say but it puts the podcast on its skin. Yes no or else it gets the pod again. I was thinking about that. That's an even harder voice voice to do that theory fund try a nail but incredibly specific. Right it's a very unusual or yeah. Oh the edging into Denault Frio in men in Black Roy Truecar Walker to your friend of mine delivers a pet cat in. Isn't that weird that that performance didn't win all four acting categories should've went off and also director bug. Yeah there should be a best supporting bug. And then Vincent to know for your one that is crazy. How like that movie comes out? And everyone's like diaw offers great now. I mean it's not a real performance but he's great net and then likely even say that at the time I look didn't offer it gives a fun turn committed performance. People were like really hung up on. How gross it was twenty years later? Everyone kind of agrees like that's one of the best pieces of acting in the history of American cinema. That is one of the most committed full-body performances ever did you read the the The big oral history with Jerry Sonnenfeld. Yes it is incredible until he talked so much. The performance I'm Rick Baker well brick Baker is like releasing his by the time so comes out with eighteen months in advance but is doing the multi volume huma hardcover book of his entire career. And he's doing a panel near Comecon tomorrow when we're recording this if you want a time stamp when this is being recorded That is like he's doing his big career. Retrospective and off Rio is moderating. That sounds and I was like. That's very telling to me that like Rick Baker's like that's one of my great collaborations as Sonnenfeld to sleep in that thing. He said like he's doing Jack Huston. That's what Jag. Yes in Chinatown. What's on Infield realized when they filmed the pet cat that scene? It's what he said he literally. I love something here. Cat Cat go. I found out Jay Leno host of CNBC's he's Jay Leno's garage pucks. Bitter Jay Leno follows you when he like. DM To me was like I. I think it may have been a person who worked in his office. Imagine he runs his yeah he probably did something I Kevin you baby. Can I come on. I think are interesting. Pakistan recorded an episode of in like a year after I'd come out because he also dead name me and I was like. I'm sorry we haven't done that in the while by the way I go by emily. Now whoever runs runs the Jay Leno twitter calls like. I'm sorry I'm keep up with my life. Jay Leno at the fuck but you are going to restart. I think you're interesting now. Got It got us so I can have. And then I found out he like did a of podcasts. I think he was trying to do guerrilla marketing or whatever for his CNBC garage. Yeah 'cause he was Oh gee guerrilla for jail jeeves Jesse Thorn shows yeah some of the other. La Based interview podcasts. He was W T F and he did a very very normal psychologically logically balanced interview in which he explained that he has never been competitive and only did what anyone else would do in that position. Where are you come on jobs open? You'RE NOT GONNA hide in the closet and eavesdrop. I mean come on. I did the same thing anyone else would deal. He hasn't tweeted since August. Twenty eighth so not a big tweeter I guess and sometimes I get him. I'm Jay Leno like sitting in his bathroom like me. You're the only slid gift field into your. DM's remember remember when the Jay Leno show premiered when NBC's it's time and it was about time it was about time and Connie was believed the first guest and he you got Connie to like basically cry over like his Taylor swift and his mother and today thank you cover week one of that somebody cover week. I am the almost certain that you made me cover now Let's find out about trauma you on. What either you either I covered it or you asked and I couldn't do now because I know I can't find it? That is a thing I mean. I don't know if you folks watched the deleted scenes because the criterion DVD now has like forty five minutes of deleted scenes for this movie and one of them. Hannibal Lecter explains to Click Starling That the trauma the Buffalo Bill experienced as a child that turned him into a psychopath was having to recap the Jay Leno. Show for the AV club. I actually I was the one who wrote the first week. It feels like wrapping. You'd just be like yeah. Let me let me put this on my first yet. While I mean you know I was avoiding a bunch of Shit it but like that was my first fall as TV editor there. And I was like I'm going to review every new show and I was like shit that includes the Jay Leno show. I watched the first week of that. And then like and my my lead is like I really thought this could be interesting. I'm like what I mean. That was I mean every everyone was maybe okay. The blinders on there was selling a we're going to rethink it because it's not late night anymore. It's GONNA be prime time. We're going to do more sketches or do more comedy bits in no desk just the Thanou right. It was just the tonight show except there was no desk and there was like some cars on state there was at least two cars on stage right. They had more field reporters. Yeah like they had like six. Ross the interns. There is no desk and he ended it with the five big ones. Do you remember that. The final segment was Kim. Oh mess with him was once and you know they had the field reporter stay broke the Edward Snowden thing like in the last few months of the show broke Edward Snowden and then like yeah that was their their contribution attribution. NBC was like good work tonight. Show back. That's that's a citizen for is about. That's why Jay Leno has the Pulitzer so at this all right. Laura Cameron Whistle blower hardly know. We'll ringing the Bell Bell Bell and it's now close to many bits bits. The market is closed. Hello Everybody Griffin Davidson's playing check with Griffin David. Of course that's true. It's podcast about photography's directors massive success early on in their careers given a blank checks to make whatever crazy passion products they want want. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce baby sometimes they look like a rube. That's like a Rupe we're doing macer is on the films uh-huh Jonathan Demme his hold. Stop Making podcasts. And today we're discussing the the movie movie. The movie movie. I mean I was thinking I was like this. This is one of the best movies we will ever cover on the podcast. We could do this. PODCAST for twenty more years. That is correct and we will. We will never cover above single digits movies greater than US right. I think this is is the most influential movie you've ever covered safety the matrix say maybe like the Matrix or Star Wars but I certainly entrusted sure flach or right in terms of the things. Maybe you don't even realize the wind chill and then when you watch it you're like Oh of course this is all of television broadcasts ever yeah. Yeah ultra-compact I was watching this last night and gang stress out of being like. Oh Fuck. I'm like now reckoning with how big an episode this is. How big is that? We're we're going to cover this movie. It's also movie that I've seen many times and for a movie about a couple of serial killers who like to eat and or tear the flesh off uh-huh Huh it's extremely watchable and kind of comforting fast anytime throw it on like this is great kick. Can't wait for Clarissa stories to have another berry charge in emotional conversation with the psychic. I was looking worried. I wasn't going to like it as much this time for reasons. We'll probably dive into but also I've seen it so many times that I was like. Oh I just so too familiar to me because thrillers often you need elements of newness but like no. This movie is fucking great. I had seen this movie once before what I saw when I was in high school. Sorry for going. Yeah but but I saw this movie like fifteen years years ago loved it remembered it almost shot for shot remember. He was one of those things. I seriously. I have not watched this in fifteen years and every bit of this is like totally stuck vividly in my brain but it also is one of those movies were when I watched it when I was fifteen I watch probably cable fucking full screen or whatever right I was like well. I mean it's going to be diminished because like I've grown up in a post sounds the lambs climate. I had seen it only after Red Dragon and Hannibal and Hannibal rising has current on films. All three or four. But I was like this is a perfected. This is GonNa be one of those things where I see the movie and I appreciate it. But obviously it's lost some of its it's power because it's been parodied so much diminishing returns in the sequels and whatever and then I watched it and I was like this is fucking terrifying. It feels like it was made an hour ago. This is like a searing and it stuck in my brain for fifteen years and I watched it last night and I was like. Why don't I watch this every week? Aside from the fact it is heavy. I have the blue of the Craig tastic stick. Yeah Yes yes yes. I bought the blue the last time there is a criterion sale. Knowing the dummy was coming up it is a movie that benefits from extremely high quality picture. Cool and and I was. It's sort of like watching after this I not watching. I was going through a BLU ray review sites That we're comparing in every home video version of the movie and this will do the jump in quality on this blue is like it looks fucking credible any realize is that the previous like mgm releases were kind of crummy it is staggering. That this movie did not get an Oscar nomination for cinematography despite one of them Oscar success. I I know one of the most insane Oscar snubs considering that like the Prince of tides was nominated for best cinematography no offense to the Prince of tides. It is a fine but it is stunning when you go like. This is one of only three movies in history to win quote unquote the big five correct to win. Picture director actor actress screenplay sure and then it only had two additional nominations beyond that. Yeah that sounds right sounds moving. You're like every single element of this film. Film is so perfect and it's so like film school in a box for that respect of craft that you're like how did not get some attack. How did not get score? Incredible score how did not wean editing. How did not win sound? But the story of the sounds of limps is an Oscar. Movie is is like an it will never be replicated finance. It's very strange and hold old like two years ago you thought get out was going to have the silence of the lambs. Did I think it was GONNA win. GonNa win predicted on microphone and you were like. I think it's going to be the thing that unhappy with Johnston's came close. He came from one and Oscar was nominated for stuff and it was the same but also that was like an unprecedented incredible year for movies. It's got twenty seventeen. We'll say I think it lost editing. JFK Gift has famous editing that is fair and and JFK was the assumed best picture Juggernaut of that year it was. I think the most nominated. It was a huge success. Oliver over stone had already directed best picture had won two best director correct and It had come out in Christmas time. And it was. And it had a zillion famous people in it. And the cause. America's favorite movie star John F. Kennedy and Yeah had the cause and then I think that so that movie was like barreling towards expected success and the silence of the lambs came out. February right came out on Valentine's Valentine's Day and night of that year. I'm exactly the same as get out Right and I did really well. It would have but it was like a sleeper foam. was you know a trashy Jon. RAHM movie like to write paper right based on like horse on paper Johner they respect the least percent. Yeah and so. There's all that sort of county on against it and I think what happened was the JFK. Kinda got hobbled by the backlash of like is this for real. Oliver Stone is a crackpot like started thirtieth started bubbling. Yeah and then also Oliver Stone had like one Oscars already so it's not like there's some yeah and I think yeah it just it. Big Like silence became everyone was just like. Oh you know what it's really good. It was kind of like once. JFK got hobbled. This is emily vendor by the way to it because I was going to build a bridge to a point I want the cutting. No no no. You're in it. You're in it. Emily Vander worth from. Vox from the Munich episodes from Allison Wonderland episode. Thank you for recovering from Fodder wack and exposure Oh my God and rallying enough time it usually takes people that six to eight eight months I went through. I had to watch it once a day of course down to once a week. Now I'm down to once a month. Think Methadone tone through the looking glass clips like you can sort of start to to talk a little bit but I do think that when the Oscars Oscar's when JFK got got hobbled. They weren't GonNa go for. I think the nominees were bugsy and Prince of tides thing. We're going to go for those shares. Those were like didn't have the reviews so it was between silence. Silence of the lambs and beauty and the beast weirdly. Silence of the lambs is the more offscreen still fucking five. It's a great. That is insane the good five because bugsy is fun but she's down the middle and you know what I corrected It's not a genre but animation is the only type of film they respect less than a hundred percent. I I mean ed to leave the concept at the time was that its nomination was its reward. Here is a breakthrough nomination for an animated film right To director nominees. We're we're non picture directors even though both those phones probably should have been known for best picture. Can you tell them so doesn't get a picture nomination and it doesn't get it right crack. STREISAND doesn't get a fuss about correctly. Right direct itself. Okay so it's Demi but the recent strikes and didn't get a breast best actor actor nominations because of the two people who came in so the years nineteen ninety one nineteen ninety one years nineteen ninety-one two people come in one is the youngest best director. Nominee John singleton phenomenon right and the first African American nominee cranberry director correct the other directors. Six I think it was twenty four. That's God the other. Rip Johnson's the other is a guy who is a very established director. WHO's a big deal? who made a gigantic hit? That was a cultural phenomenon. I can't I believe it wasn't emanate for best picture. But he did get the best director nominees interesting and and has he had other director nominations or wins. There's is this like his warning of nominations. He's never won any nominations. Oh Fuck Thelma and Louise. Oh Louise wasn't nominated is bizarre weird. You're very weird. They had like they had to get the prince of tides in there. Like Thelma and Louise was like a sensation. Two lead actors which is insane right. I think that is so so difficult to pull off to actors in one shared League category so daring that people. Fuck with voicemail. Selena Davis is really supportive. Right we'll look prince of tides and Bugsy and JFK. To some extent. We're the movies ever was like. They're going to be the big Oscar players. Everything that that happens where it's like months in advance right and then they kinda slid in and like silence of the lambs. Was the movie people actually love movie. I think at the end of the day was like you know what right I remember that movie. It was a year ago now and I still remember it but also it is that thing where like you know. We'll get into all the integrity of the movie. And we'll talk about the controversies and all of that But just taken as a piece of narrative visual storytelling. It is pretty. Unimpeachable is dark dark and profound and full of really interesting themes which are from the book some of which are original to the movie. But it's also great popcorn filmmaking washable right so thoroughly watchable I'm just going to restate. You can take any single element from this film and use it as a teaching tool of like. This is how you do this. This is screen acting screenwriting cinematography. This is editing sound. Mix It you know. This is set design. Just yeah the cost of like everything is just like I mean and I forgot fucking house taxes where it's like bright like Demi like discovers like Colleen Atwood you know like makes her Casey Lemons Lemons in it right right right. Kristie Zia's the production designer. Like everyone on this is just like people who are like just fully coming into to their power that thing. That is so excited to watch like everyone involved in. This movie is just figuring out how to do the first perfect job of their career. It's it's pretty like it. It does feel that lightning in a bottle thing. And the way that we've been like going through Damian order like this it is so exciting to watch like oh he's just built it all up sure and you look. This movie could have been directed by Ridley Scott or someone and it would be a different movie probably more of a hard boiled movie and it would not not have that like empathy and attention to character. The Damn like this is like demis. Got All these tools that I feel like a director. Another director would not have been able to handle movie. I have I have this. I'd love to hear you weigh in on this Griffin. I have this sort of pet theory. That people who are really good at comedy are usually really good at horror horror. I agree one hundred percent vice versa. I grew one hundred percent for them. Pugh yes Jordan appeal but I also think it is one of the reasons why enlarge many of the best Superhero movies have come from horror directors. I think it is that very specific. Sort of tonal. Balancing Act. You know. She's Zam Zam The Rainy Spiderman Films James Won- has acquitted himself. Well the man Yes yes but I think you know superhero films. Are this very tricky. Balancing Act of of tone and control and a mix of humor and tension action all of that. But that's yes. The comedy and horror are the two genres where the director needs to have complete control control of the dial and know how to sort of turn it on the audience. Because you're asking the audience to have very specific emotional involuntary on Terry reaction on scene by scene basis. So it's about that build and release and that sort of like got the fucking camera work in this movie. I mean not just like we're talking about photography itself but you just like this is just mute. This film you could just teach an entire semester film school. That is this film unit every week. You just watch it. And it's like his camera is sodium shots but also all the camera movements are so expressive without being overly showy. The Look of the film I mean I feel like this is the fundamental mistake. That really Scott made where he's like. Oh we should make it look terrified because Hannibal Lecter terrifying and the thing. That's incredible that this movie is it. Looks kind of been out. Oh sure yeah very Chris. It's about real people. Not Very stylized picturesque. Yes one hundred percent. I do think the problem with Hannibal is one. That book is so gothic garbage right like purple right and Demi famously of course reads book and his out into this. All right so enjoy foster. Says the same and Anthony Hopkins is like twenty five million dollars in the bank account. allred right Gotcha. So the book is already nudging things direction but yeah and also the book has the problem of like Hannibal is very effective when he's in prison guess and is a little less effective when he's just the the Italian person right but if I if the TV show eventually figured out how to. But that's that's a cage Hannibal way too because he's trying to operate at that show when they finally had him. He's three when he was finally on the loose and everyone knew his secret. And all of that yes. That was that Fisher's thing section of the shows when it's at its least. Yeah and it's also when they were like I don't know every shot should look like a kaleidoscope like when they start being like let's make the show just look so crazy battles sort of you know sustain eighteen the mood I feel like I've never acknowledged on the podcast that I feel like a- psychiatrist who of course is true and for that reason this movie representation. Exactly thank you get it going. So what's emily. This was the bridge I was GONNA make in order to introduce you but it took me thirty minutes of talks the bridge but but I was last night while watching the movie. curious to see because You know as you said Since last year on this podcast you have come out and transitioned and yes and you very early onset to us. You would like to talk about this movie because you know that is the sort of messy part of this film's legacy is its relationship up to the Trans Community got so I was curious going into it to see if you had tweeted about this film Prior to your coming out because you have written so well in the last last year about sort of the years of you. Living sort of in denial with suppressing the voice. Inside of you the part of you that new to some degree always who were and that in the last year it sort of been letting yourself actually the person does just always doing everything all all over the place right now And you're you're writing on. The subject has been incredible. Thank you But I was interested to try to find You know if if you had public statements about this film on Twitter before you know this year And a lot of are the things. Like I can't believe that didn't get us in Mottaki denomination when when Demi past tweeting about Hams. He's one of my favorite filmmakers right. So that's what I was finding more and more. Just you talked about him being one of your favorite filmmakers but also. I've forgotten that you were one of the loudest drum bangers during March madness. Oh yeah you were huge fucking on Demi train it. It always on the train. I was like he's Never GonNa win. And then he kept going to do the search David because there are literally like eighty tweets are four separate threads. That are emily just like hardcore hardcore campaigning. Making the argument watching it like vote by vote saying like I know he's not GonNa make it past this. I like this one though. I think Don Jonathan Demme should direct the halftime show Knicks this year. It's a good tweet. That's a great one. I was just thinking about you. Know How they kept trying to make that gambit movie for years and years. Jonathan Demme directed the hell out again but movie Louisiana Collar Local Cajun. Yeah it would have been like his last film when he would have been his. You guys went from Ricky in the Flash Gambit right pass if Dan had met its original release date and they had hired Jonathan Demme. It would have been his last film. He would've gotten a made under the wire. Yeah but I am curious. I mean you know you saying you were a little bit worried going into your viewing of this movie. How you were going to view it through a new lands? How did it sort of change for you or did it? Not as much as you feared or thought it might. I will admit that some of the some of the it's not even like Trans Representation because it's it's a different idea of what gender transition could mean. Yeah and the movie makes that very clear which I had forgot movie has dialogue. Yeah hopefully from Dr Hannibal Lecter who has a psychiatrist uh-huh and a PhD needing people right. I forgot that the from an underground universe. The film has the most intelligent character. Even if he is a pure psychopath cannibal psychopath clear. Say He is not a transsexual. Yes right that it's more like he. He he thinks that's what's going on with him but it's more He's crazy and wants to. It's a sort of rice. He wants to sort of be out of his own skin but at the same time. I'm going to have more to say about this. I'm sure throughout the episode. At the same time it flirts with all this iconography transpeople of transition in ways that like made me uncomfortable a little bit. Here's where I think this succeeds in the way that a lot of other trans murderers is this. A trope have not succeeded. Which is Jonathan Demme's such humane director? Yeah he gives buffalo bill his humanity diseased horrible humanity been. He is a person. He is not a twisted boogeyman. It's actually kind hindmost. Factors the thing that got the movie in trouble in a way is that he has those segments that are just buffalo bill and those of the segments that I feel like people obviously glommed onto the house and if he had just kind of like you know excise that yeah and whatever bills just not really character except something that someone talk people talk about out then maybe the movie would be worse but also regarded differently. I don't know well I don't WanNa be Flynn about it but the thing that was striking me watching it especially because I had forgotten that they outline language so clearly and sort of consistently trying to define like this is not a transsexual. We're not saying there's even that line where she says like transexuals are are docile passing you know but like they very clearly say like Nice fast a behavioral patterns So the movie goes to lengths to try to make that distinction clear but the thing that is sort of out of the movies control is the fact that it became such a phenomenon. The thing right right like I don't think the movie would have had that amount of blowback. Had it been like a forty million dollar sort of like you. You know on the level of like man hunter in terms of critical recognition. But the fact that it became like this big blockbuster phenomenon and then a best picture winner means that like well now you have a lot of dumb people washer. There's a difference once ability to write the whole thing like comes into play with like the Destroying culture once and for all. Is that like you're in a very different position. If you're making a movie for sixty million dollars that you know is going to be released like a blockbuster versus movie movie like this where clearly no one involved thought that this was going to be some like but ore Quadra me to the point that Dila Rentis who owned the rights fucked and had it may manhunter whistling. Yeah don't care advice. Don't make Hannibal Lecter movies hit until RENTA's was like I've always owned. Hannibal writes in their mind. I WANNA be clear. We're recording this before it comes out coming out long. Answered nation has taken four day. Thursday night previews or whatever for New York City Burns to the ground also like around the impeachment and the fact that trump is tweeting about. How militias going to rise up and it's just like it's truly a terrorist militias are being installed at theaters playing? I also feel like every other president. You'll hear that they like you know asked asked requested a film print wanted to watch movies from seems so disinterested in everything. I don't think he's watched a single like film. Well he famously like has a short attention span like like his favorite movie is blood sport with the dialogue. Cut Out or whatever there was that weird anecdote it was like. It's blood sport but eric fast forward through the nonviolent speed. No He's favoring. His favorite movie is assistant came. Because it's about a very very wealthy man beautiful women it's a great life and right lived long interview where he says that right. I mean he's just like it's incredible. The things that guy accomplish list I wrote about I wrote about it for vox in the summer. Of Two Thousand Fifteen. Yeah he was still like a curiosity and I was like Oh look at this. Isn't this weird and there's fuck look on ironic person. I mean this sort of gets into the silence of the lambs thing where it's like someone that dumb can watch Citizen Kane and go like this is an aspirational story of the American dream. Home and ascending to power success and love and adoration when it's very cleared the film presents him as a villain and is about how he died feeling totally empty inside and so in the same way that lambs comes out and it doesn't matter if you have characters go like this character is not Trans Trans People. Do not behave this way. This is not a pattern because it's still like the dumbest people view. It how they want to and then as you said so much of it. Is that the ICONOGRAPHY of this character gets reappropriated into other things like you think. About how many homophobic ninety the studio comedies make Buffalo Bill Jokes to some extent or another. It's also just wild this film. which has her starling? Incredibly kind of character Hannibal Lecter and craft also has buffalo bill three becomes incredibly. I kind of character. Yeah in his own right three characters that like you can dress up like them or you can let you. You can do relevant yeah. It is so bizarre We'll secures a question for you when you saw this movie A when it came out when you saw this moving the year sense as you've watched it. How did those elements play to you in a point in your life where you were sort of? I've fighting your own transnet interesting. I saw the first time I saw. This is probably high school and the controversy around. This movie had filtered down to me as just like gay. People are mad at yes more of just a general. LGBT considered so you saw it knowing there was like I knew because I knew I think the first dummy movie I ever saw Philadelphia. Okay should I knew that he had made that. Okay 'cause people he was like I WanNa make a movie that has positive presentation right so you saw post Philadelphia. Yeah I saw it. Probably Ninety six ninety seven with a girlfriend or whatever and like that was at a time when I was not aware of the things within myself but I was also like any time I read a thing where like somebody magically transformed into a woman I was like. Let's see how to search or choose. Choose somewhere sure So I watched this unlike but I just I think I really thought of him as a gay man. I really do because those two things got inflated. 'cause I remember in high school. I spent a lot of time being like. I think I'm gay. I'm gay just man. I don't think they're very attractive. And that's a prerequisite eropean right. They knew there's David Right. I don't know David train stalled. I gotTA get some cold. But yes so I was like I. I didn't understand what it meant to be gay and like there was this idea that like gayness and transit were kind of the same general otherness. Yeah right yeah so like the fact that I was primarily attracted to women was just like a thing that got in the way of me figuring this out so I think when I I thought I really didn't know and I'm you watched it maybe four or five years ago and I was like. Oh yeah okay but I also was like less offended by it than I thought I was going to be every. Watch it the this guy hi. It's not the worst example of this trope. It's because one of the better examples of destroyed because Demi is such an empathetic filmmaker like you said you know really cardamon murderers litterers like we can be murderers if we want to wait knife away. Tabora anything. Box of Malt called WHO's the door? WHO's at the door okay? No I don't know let me get it Crea- Hello David remember me are are you Dr. Han Hans Yeah Yeah I mean I've seen senior films very much enjoyed them. I have a problem David with your problem Dr PhD or an MD you're an MD.. And both David the problem is as you know. I'm a man on the lamb. That's right you'RE A. You're constantly moving from location location. Stay ahead of the law can have a cell phone. Can't have people pigmy towers. Sure Satellite Tower. So I need to send letters right. You got to keep in touch the old fashioned way. David has a problem only one taste. I love more than human flesh. It's the taste ace of stamps. You look well. The problem is I started liking in the night. truitt sure I eat it whole David. I understand what the anti so the problem is. My letters. Never get sent. Well what if rather than the old fashioned livable stamp at disgusting blue. That gets my heart. All Florida You could go to stamps. Dot Com Yeah which can do anything at the post office right at your computer six Plus give you big discounts on posted. I love my discounts beyond the at you can print let official postage official. US postage twenty four seven for any letter package any class of male anywhere. You want to send it well. I hate the taste of printing right. So you're perfectly perfectly down on that and looking for a stamp that is not too delicious to prevent me from using it for more complicated premise in the world but straight right lock David Stamps. Dot Com brings all the services that the US Postal Service right your computer so you can small office ending on invoices. Maybe maybe an online seller. You're like us who ships out some products. Maybe you're warehousing thousands of packages a day. Maybe you're a renowned psychiatrist WHO's gotten a little in trouble with the Law David. Why are you so irritated by? I'm you doing pets. It seems like there are some unprocessed trauma in your past to host a podcast with someone who drives you crazy doing well. How about this is a deal David? I'll give your listeners. An exclusive off Okay if you tell me a little bit about yourself okay Yeah no it's just Well I feel bad because I was actually fifteen minutes late today but usually he's fifteen minutes late to everything. How interesting you sound like the unprofessional? Look I just WanNa say that with stamps dot com. You can get five cents off every first class stamp enough to forty percent off priority mail. That's an brain in your time and money. It's no wonder however seven hundred thousand. Small businesses already used DOT com. Are you from fellow paraded doctrines. We'll see I haven't asked. Yeah alone out. David you fulfill your end of the bargain off until mine information a call to action if you will go have a mandatory section. I want your listeners. To come for the resolution they can actually keep this year to stop going to the post office. Stop eating stamps stamps. And rather printing them out from home so what I want them to do is go to stamps. Dot Com Click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and type in check back at stems dot Com Promo code check. David I understand. Never go to the post office against him stuck dumb no but but it is. I mean you know I think that comes into play. Obviously with the Buffalo Bill Care he could not control the way. The movie sort would've got taken away from him and given to the culture at large in the way. We're like. Yeah I I think a lot of the impressions I think about. How many fucking like Buffalo? Oh bill impressions are like problematic. You know we're like scenes where people do the talk or whatever it is like the elements from this have been stripped and and sort of repurpose in a way that does feel negative like the really bad version of this is the Danish girl. Literate re-appropriate is a lot of this imaging in a way it thinks is supportive and his horribly horribly dry so I could not stop thinking about the Danish girl watching this really interesting not thought about the Danish girl again because I took a serious psychological ecological action to borrow it from my like re closeted me like I saw I saw came out. I was at vox so I was finally like had had a little security and I was like thinking about this gender stem. Danish girl was like Nope. Nope just like well no. It's not this whatever this is. Yeah Yeah Yeah. That's such a terrible movie. That's why I was thinking. Because that's like the most sort of consciously Oscar bady sort of movie and a movie that is going to such great pains to tell itself that it's being empathetic and and humanist and sort of thoughtful and caring about it and that it just seems to have no insight into its characters no understanding fuels genuinely very exploitative and Harry representative everything I've heard from any transfers. I've ever spoken to or read work from anything and also performances terror. It is so fucking bad it is really is really hard to be and understand what is to be transferred to a gap and I wrote a lot I wrote about I guess right. Allie a lot about Jeffrey tambor. I think he got close. Yeah for what a Monster Person He. Yes I think he got close but he's still was like there was an element of I am copying thing other people don't which is active is acting sure acting the problem. Is that acting so close to what society thinks. Trans people are doing that then it becomes like. Oh you're just you know you're jared leto Dallas buyers club. Yeah I was just like here's the thing I was thinking of When I like I dropped out of college was auditioning for stuff I had law and order. SVU audition that was is to play a trans girl. Were only seeing you know SIS Mensur to play the role and there was like fifteen sentences. Any email devoted voted to like we want to be cleared. The character is not gay. It is not a cross dresser and they were like people are like reading the sides and not getting adding it because the concept was sort of like in the media up until that point so often just as you said presented presented as Odysseus someone playing a woman You know that there wasn't really empathetic. No well rounded trans characters in media and that people were coming in for the audition and going like. Oh it's like a drag Queen Right. Yeah right right even when you see like Felicity Huffman and Transamerica. WHO's okay okay? Okay so like a real focus on like Oh. She's got a penis lights you know. It's it's a fetishistic Gawker thing that Demi just because of the nature of the kind of filmmaker his I don't think he had special insight into transgender people or gay people or anything. I think that he just like understood. Understood that Buffalo Bill was in pain. Buffalo Bill wanted something other than what he was. Buffalo Bill could not transcend himself like right. He depicted that and he got. I don't WanNa say he got closer to picking their turns experience because he didn't but he got like he got an element of it in a really weird and twisted way. I think yeah I think you you know as you're saying the baseline empathy from what she always operates gives him a major leg up. You know and that's something you can't really like develop in the way you can develop your skills as a visual filmmaker. He was born with you know by all accounts a greater sort of pool a greater depth of emotional emotional sort of understanding than most people So that's you know really his special sauce as a director as that he comes into it with that strength as a person. But I think the other element Allman is when you read interviews with Demi as I've been reading more and more stuff for this podcast and watching interviews with him and stop. I want to listen to commentary for got to him. It's him and fos heroin monster and the FBI guy and Hopkins Unh- five of them. Yeah but he is for you. Know the people who were viewed as like major kind of like. Oh tourist filmmakers certainly the people who have won the Oscar. Most of the people we've covered on this podcast. He might have the least ego of all of them were hat and he talks openly about like I hire people who know what they're doing better than I do. I I give them a lot of free reign. You know if I hire some efforts because I know I'm not a some offer. I'm not trying to impose my thoughts on that on collaborative but like if someone's doing something good I want them to take all the credit for it and I think you know by an extension of that. He is very good or was very good at knowing what he didn't know an understanding what he could not inherently understand so that he could handle elements over to other people and not. Just try to sort of You you know impress his perception of things over the entire film one of the complaints against Demi in the march madness in the in the read it and I think I think Alex Ross Perry made this argument is that he doesn't have a big footprint. Yes I am. I think he doesn't have a signature like shot. He doesn't have a signature shooting style style the close up. I think that the carrier has signature. I think the close ups feed into his signature approach as all of his movies are about the transactional transactional nature of human relationships. And he understands that every scene is between two people. And it's about who's giving who's taking share and who's getting and who's you know. I mean this his masterpiece in that regard that he realizes this is a horror movie. But it's a horror movie about the banality of like horror like how it's just horrors always just two people in one stabbing stopping somebody. If I can quote you to you and read a couple of tweets firming earlier this year when you were Banging the drum In this was directly in response to this right You're pointing out like you know people saying he doesn't fit ends a blank check through actor he feels so terribly about the LGBT pushback tons lambs he commits a studio sued fund. The first major studio phone about the crisis ended wins. Tom Hanks and Oscar. And it's a hit Philadelphia. Imperfect Blank Check Clears airtight hurts. Human there right yes but then as you sort of sit here what signature. What makes him interesting? Demi is one of the most radically humane empathetic directors who have ever lived. He loves humans and the Shit we do in all our strength and all or weaknesses de Music Director. Who whenever whatever he tried he could do it? Music videos documentaries features TV pilots live TV. He just thought people are fascinating and may great art accordingly it is very appropriate. PTA The DNA splice of deming. Altman loves now. I think that's a really other strong point when people talk about like. Why doesn't have a signature style which I disagree with a little bit not disagreeing with you but the people who say that it's not it's not a scorsese style? It's not showing well. I think that's the big point is that it's not that he was a chameleon who adapted to whatever he was doing but he tried to engage with the material I as a human And then figured out the style that the best benefited the story being told in the most sort of emotionally intelligent way possible. Look it's on the lambs which is very stylish in a lot of ways but also compared to most crime I most movies of this ilk feels so stripped down and almost neorealist. Yes in fact. But there is a lot of crazy heightened elements in terms of the actual filmmaking of what he's doing but it's like he's meeting he never for has a camera movement that isn't entirely motivated of his camera. Movements though you know and it's just like this really fucking elegant magician where it's like I'm just GonNa Bring Your is right over to the thing that you need to pay attention to right at this. His camera movements in this movie are always. I don't WanNa look at this thing but I have to leave. Thanks back and then it goes and you can feel the tension in the sort of I mean. It's a lot of handheld movements you know. And they're fairly smooth. But you can feel the actual physical presence of person reluctantly words swinging around to me. It's also has like one of the most iconic five the most this shot of her in the elevator that opening very right at the opening surrounded by the boys. And she's very she's a short person. jodie foster cost very little The like the shot of any shot of a Hannibal leaning in and when you see him in the reflected in the glass and everything like like. But that's like another thing. That's kind of stunning about this movie that I was like. Am I gonNa Roll my eyes a little bit watching it now. which is it has now become such big thing for a straight white male all directors to make movies about the way that women are impressed oppressed within society? Sure did you like look I get it and very often even if there are tensions are correct. It's like they put their foot on the gas way to heart. You know and this is a movie. Where like every single scene is affected by the fact that she's a woman but it's almost almost always affected in terms of body language or in terms of blocking it is very rarely directly stated in the tax of the script this whole movie it's theme is again transactional relationships between men and women and never says anything about it? Yes just like this is a movie about what it is to be a little rain right in this world. I love in her relationship with the Scott. Glen Character in the book is sexual in the book. They have more of like an affair and he takes that out out of the movie or I don't know if humor Ted. Tally decided to do that. But that's not in this movie but like no they neither of them ever acknowledged where he I mean. There's that one scene where he kind of acknowledges is like yes I'm using you to excite lecter because I know you will and like most of my guys he would just shut down and says that you're pretty in a way where he will at least give you the time of but she has a speech where she's like you use me. which like you know like so many movies would have that moment where she sort of like wag her finger in his Nelson? What are you going to do? The only only other moment that makes it explicit is the moment when they're in the car driving back after they do the autopsy and Scott Glenn's like taking a nap and then he wakes up in in his like. I really upset you back there when I said the thing about us. Not Discussing in front of women right and she was again. He's like you understand just had to throw these guys off. I sent and she was like it matters what you say. He's he's he's great. I mean she's amazing. But like what a perfect seen what a great encapsulation of Dami which is like it matters what you say. Like in a in an era era where You know people get so defensive when their work is criticized Demi took these sort of the complaints about sons. The lamb was like I'm GonNa make an entire movie to try to positively counter of the effects his of what this might have done in terms of LGBT perception his conclusion from this was he wasn't ashamed Buffalo Bill. He didn't think of buffalo bills like in a Gay Trans Ray sexual whatever but he was like. I didn't realize how many how few positive representations gay people there aren't GonNa make one right like what dude I I did well like you talking So I watched this movie a lot when after I I saw it and like I when I sort of when I was coming out I used to watch the matrix a lot. I wonder if that was anything so when I was watching this last night and it was as a matter of fact when I was watching the suspect it was. I watched this a lot that I feel something for buffalo bills. No no I when I saw cleese I was like Oh this is how I perceive the world but of course I didn't fucking know that I was like yeah team but it was just like oh I get this. Yeah I get get how she sees the world how she interacts with it. Yeah and how the world interacts with her I mean the movie is so good at like anytime she he walks into a room without overstating it without cutting to a bunch of closed subset having dialogue and making too much of a meal out of it really showing the way the temperature of the room changes whether it's because these guys are sexually attracted to hers or whether it's visibly is like like. She seems unqualified right. They think she's at risk. They're intimidated by her. Whatever it is every scene is people in some way being affected by the fact that she seems so outside of the person who is usually doing this job? You guys talked about foster on this. Show 'cause this is like she goes hard enough. Israel hovered a foster before possibly never covered. I feel like we haven't I don't believe so talked about Let's take a quick look at her photography. We know we've not I mean and it's crazy because this is her second Oscar. Yes you know and someone where like the first Oscar was like. Oh that's nice she graduated. She's not child star anymore but also is it was somewhat of a surprise. She was pretty young winner. And Yeah Yeah and then just three years later. She wins a second Oscar because it's kind of like undeniable. Yeah I mean like I don't like hanks's performance in forrest Gump. And but he won the Oscar and on the Oscar because people were like well. I mean that movie him he has is to win even though he just want. Sometimes those multiple winners I mean. Yeah Kevin Spacey being another one. Where like you're kind of like? Why the fuck did he win? He just one like right and it was was just at the time people were like well. That's he has to win. Some weird over right is the best picture of the year. It is entirely based around the green book thing kind of like. Yeah yeah I mean w everyone who voted for best picture then has to by extension. Think that's the best performance of and it's not a showy performance. It is not known. Oh you know Jodi Jodi like it is not the kind of performance that usually wins best actor now because usually best actress screaming and places one hundred percent. Yeah yes because most most of the movie is all her in extreme closeup trying to show his little emotion as possible right now trying to sell steely to whoever she's talking to a hundred percent percent and it says close ups. That are her friend she can do the flicker of an is little trembles in her voice and in her face and all that I mean obviously she has like one of the Great Oscar monologues or exchange the silence of the lambs model. You know the that is anyone would remember that coming out of the movie but it's not a big yellow performance but also yes that's it it's a big monologue on paper that is like Oh man this is a homerun. Oscar Oscar nominations slam dunk sure but Ninety nine out of one hundred people would have gone much bigger with monologue. Yes in one thousand nine hundred actor directors would have demanded right covered into different way. Something right I don't know right. I mean she's really recounting it as sort of like did absolute trauma and you know I mean. She's also found this thing right very quickly. which is his skill right Crawford? Immediate warning is like don't let him in your head Ed and he's like yeah. I found the box. Let's open the box and she's like no. I don't WanNA open that box. I WanNa do this thing. It's like Open this box. Oh Hannibal Lecter. What had a field day with told me? I mean that's the thing I mean he's like obviously Hannibal. Lecter spoiler alert does like people them up. No get into it but he he is. Also there's the thing right and the COP is talking about Buffalo Bill when he talks about like is he a vampire but like that's what Hannibal he's like. A vampire wants to eat your feelings. He loves it like his favorite thing if he thinks. You're like a Gauche. You know idiot like Chilton or whatever he has like like no use for you he just wants to like. Eat your body right. But like if you're like clarisse he's like I wanna like open up your brain like your emotion. Well they also like everyone warns warns her like you know this is the thing he's GonNa do. Don't give an answer. Gets inside your head. You're fucked right and they sell it as like a he will weaponize it in some way he will. I use it to destroy your get himself out of prisoner whatever. It is weirdly though he's a mentor. And that's what this relation to Alad. Right is what makes it so great but I also think the the thing is. He misses getting to do his job. Sure it'd be like I forget head chef. That's the biggest thing. Yeah Butcher even. Yeah because the books make this clear and then the show. Oh made it very clear. It's like he eats. People he thinks are rude. He doesn't like great rudeness. And then you can eat you up right the people that like to sort of gain. They're like he'll eat other killers others things that cannibalism got in the way his psychiatry curry will Graham or whoever like. He's not necessarily like I want to eat. You like yeah he wants wants to Utterly Dismantle Will Graham in the show it's very explicit homoerotic thing if I can get you to fall in love with me then you will just totally like the tumbler exploded. Yeah yes but that's like you know I. I guess I'm trying to say is psychiatry. Him Isn't a cover is not a means to an end sprint. I think he genuinely gets off on the fact that he is this fucking good at it and the worst punishment for him in terms of being in prison is that he doesn't have access access to people he can pull apart that way and the thing with buffalo bill is like he's like I know that guy he's he's lame like right right you know. He thinks he's this mmediately. Figured him out and like that he was no fun right. Anthony held his boring to him. Anthony is just. He's I wanna eat you up because your awful right right. Clarice is is a Gauche crass man Reich which he hates right clarice is for the first time in a long time him having someone who can really you sure on no pun intended like this is an interesting psychological. You intended that I was shouldn't that fung was even attending intended and I attended no but it's like for him. I mean I think the quid pro quo thing is literally like I need to get something out of this and what I want to get out of. It is is like let me play my favorite sport again right but let me do a couple rounds in the batting cage. I can't figure you out. You're interesting the elements. Don't line up your four foot eleven. You sound like Holly Hunter. You're you're still in training. They sent you here and you seem to be a lot of emotional train right. Yeah because you're also not playing hard s with me. You're not trying to be a man not trying to be a ball buster. What's your fucking deal? How did you end up here in Red Dragon Slash manhunter? It's like about that you know we're at the tail end of his relationship with a law enforcement guy and so like when We'll goes to see him He's Oh it's almost like old boyfriends right. He's like that's the same awful Cologne and will is clearly uncomfortable. Because it's like yeah we did we. We did the whole thing. We like sucked each other dry like no. Yeah we'll is like the TV show that he's been watching for years and years and still watches out of obligation allegation. But he's pretty much like gotten all the narrative juice he's going to get out of that thing. Clarisse is like you imagine the first interesting person he's been able to have extended conversations with look. We all love Frankie phase on great. Yes very charming in this movie. Yes but You know there's only so much conversation they're having I guess you know it's a fad loved. This movie does almost every actor with more than three lines is billed in the opening credits. Yes Oh great opening credits to font. Can I get a t shirt with. Would that font on it. You know the black letters. The white borders you react. I saw I saw Chris. Isaac there is like wait. Chris is six and this and his character name is literally like. FBI team Leah. I SWAT commander Van Bargain. Donovan Bargain Roger. cormon is in this moving the FBI director he does. Obviously you have like a classic Demi guys like Charles Napier and Tracey Walter and what. What's the guy? Dick Miller the guy who's in the funeral director was that Guy Tracy Walters. That goes Bob the goon and Batman Oh well I get faces mixed okay. This this is Dick Miller is in this right. I don't know if he's in something else such okay different Demi none of different okay. Yeah I I just I love that I love a movie that like loves its actors enough That it's like these people deserve opening credits. And he's an actor actor director actors love to work with us and like he gets great fucking casts from from nineteen eighty to nineteen ninety-one. He only has one film that does not get getting acting nomination and he gets four wins. Four wins if you're including this. He gets four acting wins. It's Tom Hanks Oh you oh you mean over his career. Yeah I'm saying right so that's pretty crazy that it's like for a decade. He only makes one film. That doesn't get an acting nomination and it should've it should've gotten fucking reacting nominations. That's your favorite phone. Believe right is your favorite. So that's your number one. Yeah it is crazy. That like Liotta didn't get nominated for that Griffin cannot donate for that we'll have already dove watch we will have given Yes but yes he. He was such an actor's director and was such an actress friend. And I feel like the Demi close up thing is like when people see movies that have close ups. It's this good. I think the first thing while this movies well shot and then they think oh. Wow these actors are good that they can hold close up as well and the thing they don't think about is is especially if it's like first person. Pov that is very very vulnerable thing to ask an actor to do. It is incredibly unnatural to do a scene where you are staring at the camera rather than your scene partner. More even stirring. You're seeing partnered with the cameras right next to their face. Yeah it is super fucking uncomfortable uncomfortable and unnatural. It kills the reality of what you're doing so often you're trying to be aware of where the camera is but kind of ignore it and not look at it and in order to get that down. which like you know? Barry Jenkins is the parent who has nail that in the modern day. Yes it's there's a reason why those guys are known for their sense sense of empathy and their love of actors protection of actors and of the process and all of that because in order to make those shots were used to create a very specific kind of environment. Yes in that level of trust I I asked Barry about it when I interviewed him and he talked about. How like the street? Kiki never been in a movie before. And you're out and so she right now but she was less disturbed by it. Oh it's like she was not really used to like movie i. She didn't have to like untrained herself. Right whereas like Stefan James Seems like this. The other actors were more like it's unsettled by that. Like looking right into which like both of those directors use those shots to convey very specific emotions Russians and place you in those moments so like in Sansa lands. It's almost always someone feeling terror at what they're watching and they're having to play it against a lens. Yeah you know. That's a tough thing to do. I think what this movie understands is that to be inquiries his point of view. You can never literally be in her point of view. Yes like The famous of course the famous shot and they last sequence when buffalo bills like reaching out to her. And it's just like you become her in that moment because you understand her as like an object of what he wants yeah similarly to how when we see her from Hannibal's point of view This is the thing I read. He like he said he never had her. Look at the camera. Because is there. She's always like five degrees whereas when you look at it Hannibal he's looking at the camera. Strap orients you in what she sees totally. So it's it's a fascinating way of tricking you into having her point of view without really doing her point of view. He was a very very intuitive filmmaker. Because you look like the the sort of like visual language on display in. This movie is insane and so fucking complicated and so risk. And you're like this should not work. You should not be able to cover scenes in this way. Okay but you get the sense. that he sort of grappled onto every scene every lifestyle every shot. And what's the best way to convey this and he always always had a really good understanding of what this was his analysis of what he was trying to get out was really good and this is like the movie were just totally Kolesas and he just figures out like when do you need to be in her shoes when you do need to be seen her through someone else's eyes and you know It's always the right decision and it's always to the right degree and I think it speaks to his another one of his strengths. The idea of collaboration is he saw. How much Jodi foster wanted to be in this movie? She was not his first choice. His fifth choice if she wants to do it this this badly probably got something. Let's do some context. Thank you for queuing that up this book. They put him on mediate. Yeah and it was a big right cookbook. It's a great book. David Foster Wallace called basically the best American novel of the decade. Just thought he's obsessed with it and read constantly. Come out. After manhunt gets released. The move comes a couple of years after manhunter manhunter. Obviously we covered it on this kind of went. Nowhere was not a big hit Orion pictures which by the time this movie came out was basically defunct song right off the film with Gene Hackman. Who is going to direct it? That's that's crazy. You didn't know that Hackman. I think wanted to play Jack Crawford and directed that was take. That's so telling for like a movie star that points critical like we'll Crawford's the hero of the move Hannibal Lecter because that's the monster. Maybe he just thought I don't right now but also when you read the book and of course people point out like Hannibal's not in a ton of the movie Even though he is totally illegal. And it's indisputable. I will get into this. Please remind me to get into this later. Okay do you disagree with me. No I agree with you but I came with fucking stack. Good thank you because I work the status wrong status status Ross hellishly wrong and it's been repeated endless status wrong. We'll circle back around sir. But I broke my fucking numbers I did the fucking world. Everyone's wrong everyone is. It's one of those. Yeah the screen time. Things is people clicking whenever they're actually so we'll get to it so hackman wants to make the movie de Laurente ever direct a movie. I don't think so. So I mean and he is a legend and do stand. He's a legend Mr Way right exactly we stand up gene. How have you seen his diners drive? INS and dives performance no guy yet. Good season is like two thousand eight or something that he goes to a place in Santa Fe. He's like sitting talking to the customers. One of them is gene Hackman. It is not entirely clear. That Guy Fieri knows shirt. Gene Hackman obviously signed right. Gene in happens like Like the breakfast here it says I believe on GPA. His last credit would be his most recent might go his gray. Green people don't know about like yeah. There's a if you look on Youtube. Gene heartland diners drive INS drives. That is incredible. Okay they bring being in. Ted Tally to write. The adaptation to tally was not a big screen writer at the time. But whatever I don't know He wrote like White Palace Palace. I Dunno and he writes the script and Hackman is like this is too violent. WanNa make this and withdraws which love love Eugene but what the fuck like. You didn't see this coming. Whatever it doesn't matter the funding falls through Orion instead of like giving up is like now? Now this is interesting. The script is interesting. Let's find another director they get Demi region is like this is great. I'll do it and it just after that. It's like rapid they just they just go. Because you'll read interviews with Demi collaborators and by and large in the Demi camp at that time people were like Jonathan. Why the fucker you making this smoothie right right well because the script isn't good but they were like this seems off? This is been building in your career. You don't seem like someone who wants to spend this much time in darkness that's right. You know he goes to least successful movies from crave standpoint up until that point in time are the two that are throat last embrace and end the fighting mad right yeah so he goes to Michelle Pfeiffer who he just worked with. Jodie foster is like I want to do it. And he's like I'm going to talk to Michelle. Who just you know did marry with the mob with married to the mob? She turns it down. Didn't like the subject matter. She does say it was a difficult decision. Sure He went to Meg Ryan. Who turned down to violent went to Laura Dern who the studio said no thank you because I guess Laura Dern to pretty young at Lauren's kind of like and she was so dewey are we at that point like I? I saw a blue velvet the other day revival screening. And you forget how much of the Laura dern like the thing for so long with just like innocence and caps sherzer inches or right but even through like law. Drastic Park is just like this is someone who's just like a ball of light excitement for dinosaurs interest interest So I will say though I think those other three people all probably would have won the Oscar playing this part. I think so if if if as long as it all GEL to hire would agree with you I for for sure. Pfeiffer is just outrageous that she it doesn't have Oscar. Yeah right St Louis the ones who lost to foster the first time if so she might have been in supporting. No I think you're right but if so what a fuck up 'cause that first Foster Oscar you can give that to one of the foster should not have one. Yeah no faster. But that's Glenn close close loss that one and Michelle pfeiffer is supporting. I think I think I need to find this. Okay Glenn Close. You're right it's when my show is for Michelle should've won for fabulous Baker. Our boys that's the greatest performance. Great movie your mom. Certainly of all time along with I know them. We're going to share those. The top two foster Glenn Close for Dangerous Liaisons Liaisons Melanie Griffith for working girl which was a big one. Yeah at the time Meryl Streep for a Dingo ate my baby and Sigourney for gorillas in the mist that weird to nomination year of hers. That's a weird year ear of a bunch of people who seemed like Oh inevitable. Oscar went in the next decade and then still have not won like Sigourney was just like. Oh so Gordon he's GonNa win any day now. Michelle pfeiffer is GonNa win any day now they will continue dominating Glenn Close is GonNa win and he just kind of right. I think wife pull it out this year. I think this year resubmit it every year the like the wife just so yeah so still alive. Wait till the wife. What if they what if they really sort of? She remarried the life to what did if they release it and just call it the way to still wife in what if Clinton otherwise. The film is unchanged just different title card. If Clint Eastwood made the wife to like that would be a great fucking movie. Calculate it would love to see that movie would get it order Nobel prize jerks wouldn't let her be your wife. All she wanted was to be a wife life. This is the thing is like he may changeling. Changing is the same thing with it. Sound like it's only the Richard Jewel of the world. The Clint Eastwood wants to be like they railroaded. Ah Long as they've been railroaded. Clint is intrigued. Clint distrust everyone. His sweet spot is when the person who's being railroaded as someone who should extend and simply be hailed as a hero one hundred percent otherwise crew of the life right in the widely hailed as a hero given Nobel for. Clint Eastwood should have directed the white there. Could you've been like a Nobel prize scene like in sully where the board is like. Well I don't think he wrote these books and she's like let's get serious. I thought you were saying that. Sully won the Nobel prize when he's true swept the board that year rocking won the MacArthur. I hope sully wins goes. Yeah he got Kook. Felt how this is Ben's new things new things he's going to get a yes twenty twenty and he plans to get it in the field of calling it a google. What were you gonNA say? Do you think he's going to win. Best picture this year. I feel like this might finally this year. It's overdue because you go four years in a row without winning best ask picture is pretty embarrassing. It's a win best picture. The Oscars centralized fleabag fleabag. Back won the Emmy it reserved. It's time for sully out is what the universe is telling us a one hundred percent. Yes thing ding-dong okay. Do we got Hello David. He's back I guess. This is your episode. I have some unresolved issues. David also. Hello Emily Nice to see you. I love your writing on Cats Dr. What's up what else did you WanNa talk about well although stamps stamps I've been eating They've gone straight to my. I put on a couple of pounds and it's the New Year you know. People want to resolve to get in better shape. It's my big resolution. David Stop eating stamps and I want to reestablish that sweet sweet thigh gap. Well here's the getting in shape you know. It doesn't have to be about a magic number on the scale. You specific amount of weight. But do you want to get those healthy habits. You WanNa feel better about yourself and you want to stop the silence. Stop the Silence Stop Screaming. Start the DESCR. You want to stop the screaming and start the silence you want. That's the my new year's resolution. Well if you want. If you're looking for those for those lamps to stop screaming you should go to neum. No Yeah. 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Noone can help you make good choices and keep you on track. Some of those suggestions felt a little loaded. David are you implying that I don't look confident. My clothes you look. I think you're if nothing else. You're confident guy. You think I don't understand my thought process work. It's just a habit. Changing solution users learn learn to develop a new relationship with food through personalized courses. Faraday I understand this. You shouldn't take it purse to healthy and easy to stick to way of life. It's a good way. You know label food good bad or off limits. It's just teaches you moderation and helps us things like you know dieting in conjunction with other pre existing meals. And things like that. I know you know what David I understand. I was acting reflexively. I'm I'm I'm sorry You've done a good job Pitching this product. Yes yes and you've convinced me. I'm now going to go to the local library. Sign up for new met full price so see later. Well just hold on. Hold on you don't have to change it on one day. Small all steps make big progress but you can sign up for a trial today at noon. No DOT com slash check. What do you have to lose? affray trying yeah. Is it NEUM DOT com slash. Check to start your trials today. Are you doing anything tonight. David going home at sleeping. Well if you want to come to my replace I'm cooking Stamps and off you heard earlier but I'm having stamps. I remember I remember so if you WANNA have stamps. Bullen as Z.. Stamp Sallow Vodka Temps Casino Stanford Casino. Thank you for the role of Dr Hannibal Lecter Okay. Jonathan Demme wanted one man and one man only I gotta guests this. Do you know I think I know I'm forgetting it's funny right. I guess so. It's obvious it is the obvious choice at the time. It is the obvious choice. So yeah I mean it's very much. Got Approach for Zillion and these kinds of roles. Who has it Sean Connery? Oh of course you know like and instead of Scotland he found a Welshman. But you know what I mean like that big gravitas actor. Yeah older will command the camera right. VAT would not have worked though. No because you're like well it's a very different but you're like of course. Brian Cox another Scott had already played. You're like Fox fosters perfect but the pfeiffer movie would have worked the Meg Ryan movie would have worked. Who's the other one you said? Lord knows was there a anyway. I mean she's right. She's been great but SORTA career on a whole different trajectory. Yes connery though. The Movie V would've folded on it would have been finding forrester. It would literally right. He just would have been like or even in the best case. Scenario is open. Oh boy well it'd be said that. Keep Your Eyes Open for Buffalo Bill. Best case scenario is it would have become the hunt for Red October game. Sean you know it would have been issues good in that. But that's my point. It's like it would've been like sterling popcorn. Entertainment that suffers a little bit from having to a folded into his movies with starling popcorn entertainment. Let myself out this. It'd be like eighteen terrible orphan joe. Perfect ten in house. And then there's this thing where it's like other actors considered for the role which I feel like probably just like I don't know some studios. They found yeah Al Pacino who in one thousand nine hundred ninety one or whatever would have gone hand right. He would've been crazy. Yeah Robert Deniro. Who probably would have gone the other way right? Really locked in Eh. Dustin Hoffman. I mean what the fuck this is. stupidly Derek Jacobi. That's his curveball. Weird little more of the president's type guy and Daniel well day Lewis but I don't think any of those work check. It would have been too close to what Brian Cox at all. Yeah Man Hunter That is fair now. Anthony Hopkins was the guy who was nowhere right. He had had this young career. That was promising right where he's in. You Know Lot Theater in the magic and address her magic a bridge too far and then he's in the elephant man what she's fantastic but one eighty. Oh you know a decade. And then it's like I don't know fucking I mean the bounty which was kind of a famous flop. But then like the dawning a chorus disapproval of nor heard of this. Yeah he's just in the margins and nobody like he's nobody that's right but he was like in that position of like this is someone that everyone agrees freezes. A good actor doesn't have any clout which is probably one reason. Many a lot of these big rectors probably like either like to gross or ah the supporting character who established I think would be afraid to take on this role and have it fight with their star persona this that you read and and knowing that Hannibal is supposed to be European. Just vaguely. You're right he's supposed to be. Would Pacino have done a eurotrash deprived of that. He would have been so good. Chino come on. He would have killed it. Yeah go and do it. But it's the same I I can't. Hey baby come but like Baldwin talks about about hunt for Red October and he was like such a big deal like clancy misery is. When he's making that right right Jack Ryan was so huge he was like remember getting on a plane and seeing that every other person was reading a Jack Ryan novel and going like Holy Shit? I'm about to be the next massive iconic character and he was like and then all of that went out the window when they hired connery because the movie became connery show the entire thing became service of connery. Not because he was a diva because he is this like like Supernova You know all powerful commanding one hundred percent. He's screaming a couple years removed from an Oscar. Win himself right He. He is become like grand old man. Connor right but also that he's just like Yeah I'm GonNa give you my voice and the Russian. Everyone talks about him being Russian. Everyone's everyone's like we're not even going to pretend Hannuri you know what you pay them to do. The whole thing. He was from Chicago Chicago gangster. That was the wonderful era of actors. He's being a Kevin Costner. Yeah you're Robin Hood Kevin Costner. But he sounds like he's from Oklahoma. Yeah I do want to note that Producer Ben has left and I am now producer. uh-huh you our producer and so that is true we the divine producer But yes I think like connery Hannuri would have done. Connery is would have been very appealing. He would not have submitted himself to a character. It would have looked like sean connery and sounded like Sean Connery and he probably would have gone like well. Audience won't accept me going to. I think it could work. It wouldn't have been as good of a movie. It'd be different. It would be Tober. You'd be like this is like a perfect perfect piece of like this is really fucking solid thriller. It would not have been the transcendent film that it is. I would argue. Also connery is like a big burly guy. He's got six two and he's burly which is probably which is more. How Cox Big Burly Guy? I don't know if he's tall. He's pretty tall. He's pretty whereas like Anthony Hopkins quite small short. Yeah and in in the movie does not present him as sort of like a physical specimen exactly. Yes very delicate. Blue Eyes is incredible. Yeah like you know like. He's more commanding as a result. You're scared of him because of the way he uses his voice his stillness in the room. You know what I mean. Like the opening shot where where. She's going down the hallway just standing there. It's like literally there's like a red carpet that she's walking down and he's like at the end of it like so theatrical and he's so theatrical without it being theatrical theatrical waiting for you that it's like the Mona Lisa like following seen a move I I've been bright I don't know yeah I mean. They're like five scenes in this movie that are arguably the greatest seen the movie I know but like the movie is like Jack. Crawford's like chlorine she's running. I love the running but like the clery saying go talk to Hannibal Lecter but be careful. She's okay she go see him early. What's this movie going to be about like it's like the thing is I don't know something's going is serial killer on the loose and like she meets with Chilton you'll get and then like once that scene starts you're like oh my watching the greatest? What the fuck is this? Yeah it's structured like a ROM com but that's the reason people were like. Oh I WANNA see Clarissa Hannibal Faulk. It's one of those things that people wanted novel right Thomas Harris's like this is what you wanted right and everyone's like and it's like it's same thing that happened with the TV show where the relationship so intimate and it's all an attention rented. I talked enough to Bryan Fuller to know that he wanted to do a silence of the lambs season like aspirin clarisse on the show and like he was interested in. DC sexualizing that relations. Yeah like making it about mentor. Ship quickey the SMART WAY TO I. I don't remember if if this was his casting or if it was fantastic it was fucking great and like now it would be perfect between Syria. Ronan suicide around tweeted that yeah and like now now. She's exactly the right age. It'd be like they. I hope they can work that out. Incredible because it's still they still kind of talk about it as a thing that they could maybe pull off right now is dead no right he re ripped. No offense took offense to being excited that he's dead but like he was part of the problem right like he was. It's sort of the problem. was they had the rights to lifetime to do. A show called starling which was about clarisse. I forgot I'm down like those rights. We're tied up at the same time. Hannibal was on Davis since expired. So like theoretically the deal could be done requires somebody to want to make more Hannibal which which is sort of a tricky proposition. Because after Hannibal which was such a huge hit. No Hannibal thing is ever really like the box office. Or nobody's Yeah nobody's wanted to touch that sacred ground because Hannibal of course Karan Seventeen seasons and was a massive success and we still like you still have people outside who are probably people outside the animals goes. Yeah have hand heads was Hannibal produced by. NBC Universal Knows Participate Gaumont International National Association with the Dealer Coming Right which is why that why. NBC aired three seasons for like five dollars at the end of the day. Weren't they ending. It was airing Saturday nights or Saturday. Sought there'd be like we are literally literally any ad money we make from this. We make money owing I guess about it so I guess we'll make it was like burning off a Canadian drama and the summer. NBC's a new show rookie blue. The first blue named the first it was basically a crime. Procedural fantastic's shred she's any of it and that season actually had okay ratings like decent for a show. You got for five dollars that is you know which throat strings turned into housing. Oh strings yeah and And then season two as much more serialised people start to drop off in season. Three is just one of the fucking fucking weirdest things as ever aired on American television. Nobody watching surly quite odd. I do I do want us Is there a role that has as high a track record of great performances. Hannibal Lecter we talked about this on the manhunt. Nobody would so wild. Lots of people have taken a shot at it. Most of them have done a really good almost career defining stuff with an but nonetheless. Anthony Hopkins is so associated with the role to the extent that you forget other people did right they. It's a weird thing that's hopkins both dominates it and there've been great interpretation therefore actors who have played him right in filmed media. Use Gaspar you. I'll nonstarter the other. Three are all the feud as exemplary performances that are totally different from one another and and aren't diminished by each other in any way and it doesn't and feel like there's even any sort of Loyd who's your favorite Batman like you know there are people who sometimes make the argument that Cox's better that mads got to do more with it or whatever but everyone just just like knows just like three perfect performances hopkins not ruined but he kind of you know he leans on it in the sequel right in a way that gets a little frustrated right and the thing. That's interesting Brian Cox's playing a human honey. Hawkins is Playing Dracula Right. And especially he gets pampering camp here with it. Allison is playing Satan for three. He's hot demon right like who you want. Maybe have you cook. You didn't so that's the other thing talking about all these other people who could have played Hannibal I feel like this is the kind of performance where people would have been scared in terms of how it would affect the audience's his view of them's or if you're coming into this already as establish actor Hopkins essentially had nothing to lose at this point. He has nothing to lose because he was coming off two moments when he should have had his breakthrough and it failed to really maintain so he just rips into this with the frosty of someone going. Like how do I make this interesting character after I can. That's all I have to to do here. And in a way it makes his career but it also feels like performance that would have doomed most other other people's careers and then it became so iconic that he could never get out of the shadow of being Hannibal and the fact that he then successfully has a twenty year run. But he's like doing merchant ivory removes residents delicious guy who is become this sort of like footnote British theatre actor right to the next year to ninety two years. HOWARDS SEND HE HAS DRACULA Yeah? He's chaplain right like right by ninety three he has remained. Dan shadowlands like He. Just Hollywood. Let's make you a movie star fucking an old guy. Can you play your British person. So we're GONNA shove you in some costume dramas like it works. Like it was what he wanted to do right and he wanted to do it. And obviously he's a talent Allan. This is the closest thing I can think of is. Captain Jack Sparrow. Yes Johnny Depp. Got Buried by. That doesn't until he goes back to do Hannibal and she goes back is when he starts to become a bit of a lazy actor. Say Now I actually quite enjoy current hopkins where he's just an old guy and he sort of leaning into it again like it's the Gravitas. Yeah Yeah Right. My Favorite Hopkins performance outside of this is to Gas Nixon Nixon. Where he's like doing an impression but he's also like I'm Anthony Hopkins? I'm not gonNA try and like he's connery doing the climate you're never gonna get nailing it where where you're like. This guy is like a maniac but also I do sort of love. There's weird like tension that he's so good at finding a love. Nixon extending rule. Yeah I I think better than JFK. I still prefer JFK. But I do love I think that Nixon is like Oliver Stone. His best like piles of conspiratorial papers around him being like. Don't you see it was all happening in the Bahamas. You're like my God. I'll be there was a time where we had to spend a lot of time thinking seriously about the show house of cards which is a terrible television show but like if I now try to think about how you Jerry on lights at toward as I have a friend who was on house of cards and just like I have actually talked to several people who are House of cards and just like it was a nightmare. Yes like the whole time. But it's like it's almost like one person and who has an Torian track record to everyone. Let me be frank gehry on but when I When I think think about house of cards for like five minutes drifts into Nixon it just becomes interesting because I think that it's I think those two are connected? Nixon is doing everything house of cards tried to do in two a half hours in his fantastic. It is fantastic. I think also yeah. It's just like stone is such a great that is stone he's a paranoiac and like a self. That's perfect nick. Subject whereas like the JFK. You know he the JFK. He's making it about new person. News obsessed with the regular but like Nixon is just a great portrayal of power from from a maniac about Ameinias. Yeah it's great after Nixon Right. He's in he starts flipping. Yeah he keeps the old man rolls a Hamas todd classical membrane right. Does that big speech. Yeah waters this reflects bear. I'm sitting at Jamie. He's like Gimme some action. The you have the edge. Do You have the Mask of Zorro. People forget he has a whole opening set piece where he is our. Oh Yeah and then the rest of the movie you know. He's he's in it recently. twit perfect it is a problem. It's the greatest film of all time. then instinct right. He's I mean he's a company. Yeah bad company. I saw that in theaters. It's that thing is a stinker Schumacher film. I'm trying to remember that the movie is terrible. Bad Company was written as a sequel to something that sounds right and I forget what it was and it makes a lot of sense and is really funny. I thought for a second. I thought we were talking about the movie. Big trouble which was based on a Dave Berry. Correct just the correct Dave Berry a lot lately I think about a mile chuckle. Just a little rise. Sort sort of a skew smile wipes across my face when I think about Dave's world I've been feeling like if I read all of Dave Berry I could understand our current increased. NCAA he's just like I tried to sell my editor on it. She's not convinced that company was written as a sequel to blue streak right which is wild stuff And it was just like what if this time there was an old guy with Martin Lawrence and they're like a buddy movie. Well no I think the other problem was it was like the first one is he pretends to be a cop but he's actually robber and they were like how do we heighten it and they were like what if he ends up having to pretend to be an FBI agent and they're like through what series. Here's the events in his twin brothers age. Okay but you know what I'm saying the ideas you heighten it. Yeah and the plot if I Toronto and people who may have forgotten this identical twin. It's Dave with right. They they need someone who looks like Chris Rock Right Chris. Rock is dead. He has identical twin also played by Chris. Rock right WHO's a funny guy right now to. Cia I just remember that if any brother I remember them announcing that movie being Dan rather because they were like secures movie. It's called bad company. It's reworked from a script that was meant to be blue streak to it's Chris. Rock and Anthony Hopkins. Sounds like what. What a great oil and vinegar? ODD COUPLE BUDDY COP action comedy I presume. And then you see the movie just seeing the trailing going well this looks so fucking Dour Dour. Yeah it's just a thriller it's a thriller and then Chris Rock like starting to people who should not be playing those roles who had no chemistry together. The Anthony Hopkins grow as you're reading off these roles. I'm picturing my head I've seen a lot of them. I'm even picturing the later Hannibal Movies and I'm like he feels like a different person for the person in silence of He's does when he's great he becomes more of a movie star after this. We're then he's doing. The connery breeze like character. He's gotTa come towards me as fully giving himself and Serbis because Hannibal Film Animal Brackets Film. It's not come out for what ten years it. It's two thousand because right after gladiator ten years uptown so lamps. Yeah and just sort of feels like Hopkins straining little too hard to play similar age to like. He's trying to be young and there's a little too much like physicality in red dragon which is a Prequel to silence. Yes trying way harder and feels very strange. Yeah I remember when Hannibal Oh came out that was February. Two thousand one. They were trying to replicate the signs release date and Jeff to talk about every time. I'm on this fucking podcast. He's he's just he was like he saw an early screening of it was like they should release that on Christmas Day and Ridley Scott can get to best picture nominations and like a pretty sure it was that makes whole but yeah. We'll either one of them I mean. Poland is the Oscar cursor. Yeah anytime yeah he was like fucking Phantom of the opera get ready across the board. It's a total shit ball of a human being but he's everything. He is bad at predicting the Oscars. He is not a ship. All Jeff Wells is a a combination of all three Hannibal Lecter as you discussed. He's a vampire he's also a man. Okay unfortunately a constant reminder podcast humanities Kelly ability I hope he does listen I hope he makes the banner on Hollywood Ali would elsewhere. Say a vampire Satan a man man. It'd be beautiful one hundred percent. He he did email and say that we'd look. I said throttle off the well-stocked Tug Hopkins Call Times. But do you folks. No the the Hopkins acting process. 'cause I kind find it Kinda fascinating sonate. Everyone's like he's the most professional actor he's the most prepared. He just fucking like nails it. A he reads the entire script. uh-huh ah two hundred times like just obsessively reads reads reads rereads a month or two before filming noses lines backwards and forwards has it like like so thoroughly and has had record himself doing all the dialogue every night. It's the time has gotten onset. He said it so many times that it's like second nature right. So that's part one and a crucial for this movie where he's monologue in a lot of very sort of a complicated lines but in terms of actual language he kinda puts in the work at a scale that almost no one else does of just it's like everyone's like obsessively no one reads. The lines practices memorize is harder earlier stronger than Hopkins. The second thing is which is reported on less but I have heard other actors have worked with him. Say This in interviews and I don't know if I should be saying Mr not what he does to get into character is like he's he's like really big on like building the visuals of the character and the costume fitting in the Harrington whatever and then he has them take the polaroid I think it still to this day. Polaroid it needs to be an analog process. It takes the polar from when they nail the look of the character that first time and he has all the dialogue backwards and forwards in his head and he looks at the Polaroid's and they're like it looks like a possession where he just starts staring very deeply at the polaroid and then he'd like leans into it and then like his eyes roll back back into his head and he inhales and like stand straight up and he's the character cool not like he's method acting like now you have to call him. Doctor Doctor Lector. Looks at the image of what they finally have nailed the look of the character to be and he stares at it until he feels like he is embodying that and then he's just like okay go cool. We'll talk. came out. Strength stared at a polaroid of like myself. Right brought brought it to my forehead so the pot of sauce foster. You WanNa talk about career now. I think we gotta yeah. We're saying I was I was trying to Q.. I really don't know oster producer jodie foster As we all know I was a child actress. The coppertone Kit Hundred percent. He's the one getting pants by the dog. That's sure absolutely Right and then you know. She's she's in freaky Friday and she is the paper Moon TV show and the bad news bears in one of the sequels. Am I wrong about that. I feel like she replaced tatum. The money all two times. But maybe I'm wrong. I don't think so. I mean she was in things yet she was in a lot of TV shows. Bugsy Malone yes people forget the Bugsy Malone and end freaky Friday come up the same year as taxi driver. Yeah it's not like taxi driver was late in her child acting. It was pretty quickly Because 'cause obviously so many fourteen years old when she does texture but like and so she did kind of after that out there. That whole big year starts transitioning more to you know whatever grown grown up movies right but taxi driver. I was like Oh shit she can actually act but also was seen as something of a like. You know Selena Gomez doing spring breakers because yeah someone trying to lay the groundwork for an adult career by establishing early that she's not going to be in Disneyland for entirely whose when she's in the accused it's kind of like Oh jodie foster's back kind of right like like. Oh here's a serious performance from the famed child actor who is right. Taxi driver And then in between clean the accused in silence of the lambs. Just one movie. Catch fire slash backtrack now the movie. And then after this much like with Hopkins Hollywood is like okay. Let's your movies your Oskar you. Yeah right so sensibly the biggest female star in Hollywood she starts directing a lot to starts directing early but she would. We'll always say she prefers to acting and that she wanted to become more of a director and active in less than I am. I believe comes out the same year. It's that was a big part of their their Oscar campaign. Percents the labs was. They were like we're going to put little man tate out there. It's going to be a sort of Fanta. Yeah Four. Because she's going to get all this press the movie. It's a very nice home for the holidays. Which I think is a good move into the beaver? Yeah F- more of a mixed bag that I discovered Jennifer Lawrence though. She didn't win. He didn't they make that before winter. I believe they did time. And I am all but certain they hey did That's also one of those movies where that was the hot script. I read it as a script. I want the part so fucking badly and on paper you were just just like slam dunk of all slam dunks. And even when they cast Mel Gibson. That's an interesting casting choice and then you watch the movie and you're like Oh it is. The script is impossible to actually put on. Its thing that I think. A lot about blacklist scripts. Yes there are so many of them. They're like Oh this is fucking amazing. The one set as press often are unacceptable. Passengers was a movie where the script is like very good and it's a pretty perfect script and then the movie you're like. Oh what the fuck and beavers the same thing as passengers where it's like it is. It's creepy pasta. No both of them are so difficult to pull off totally where reading the script that the writer is literally literally describing how you're viewing scenes. And letting you know the tone it's supposed to have and you're putting it in your mind's eye the way that hits your palate the best. Yeah and those two films like put up on their feet are just like impossible to do. I did it. I did a twitter about this around. The movie Life itself Dan Fogel move. Sure you've read that on the page you're probably like Oh yeah great. I've read it and like you hear the story like Warren Beatty WEAP- treating that's great lake. Then you see it on screen is just stupid stupid. I'm friends SUV. Kyle killen the guy who wrote the Yes now. He's running halo. I think which is video the showtime TV series Halo based on the video. Okay Yeah but yeah. He's excellent writer. It's just like great screenwriting which the signs of the lambs has to two but great screenwriting so often often about just like economics of character. And anytime you're giving yourself something super flashy it becomes dangerous and then actually depicting it on game. Yeah it's too much right and it was like there was almost the Jay Roach Jim Carey beaver would've gone like totally comedy. And then it was surprising that was like Jodi Foster Mel Gibson. He could do it. It's more of a drama and reality. Neither one's the right approach. I kinda WanNa see the Jay Roach. Jim Carey One one sheet her last directorial. Effort was famously. A bio pic of Davidson's money monster answering and then somehow Taghi starting the Patriots and then there was also but like we should also you know in the ninety she had a a somewhat robust like movie star career. There's Maverick averick. There's no there's contact there's Anna and the king. That's sort of like nineties. Run gets an Oscar nomination for nell contact. People forget was a pretty big hit and he's a great movie time. Meccas my God. Yeah I know a lot of its long. That's that's the biggest hold out and the king is kind of like a big Oscar. Green movie the flop and it's just a stupid idea. People should sing songs. Like I don't know that I want to hear the story of her. Two thousands are fascinating because she'll take like three years in between each movie to the extent that people are like. Oh I guess maybe Jodie Foster's like don she comes back and has another like third base hit. She has a couple. She got a clue panic. Room in inside man. You're calling that a base head socks office. Oh box office box off plan is it's she. He has made two films that I would call outright offensive in the two thousand flight plan in the brave one two films like when you watch them now. You're this is problematic. Tricky moving I have not seen either. Flynn is basically movie. That's like what if you suspected Brown person on your plane was a terrorist and you were right like that's what flight plan is eighty five. Four point was definitely a hit back home. The director Robert Twinkie twinkie. Yeah eighty nine domestic corrector of red pretty horrible movie. I find almost any movie set on a plane. Watch well because I am so tense. During a movie. With jodie foster in a thriller is like so so so effective. Rave one is not a movie. I like but she doesn't get that she got that Globe nomination and that was that was people thought that was gonna be a big Oscar play for her and a big sort of revenge thriller. Wish we did death which is still like templates once in a while people like. Let's do a death with ex actor now. She's like directing television. She did some more interest in new black. Yeah and then. After that I mean well mims island freight names island but carnage the Polanski. Elise Syam I mean she had sort of said like I was pretty much retired from acting. Ideally want to act anymore district nine so much I said I'll do anything. And she kind kind of has the inside man role but it's like the bad version of that role right like she sort of the evil richly and I forget which way it is because the movies forgettable but either she filmed it with a Frenchaccent Jackson. They made it to American later or vice versa deer and then performances eighty yard because they wanted her to do a different voice than what she did onset then last year a hotel Artemis yes forgot which she is in really fucking good in. It's not a moving love it's like. I'm ready ready to love this movie either. What the concept castle that? It's sort of like John Wick. John Wick I love breads another screenplay movie though one hundred percent totally totally and it's not like it flops. It but it doesn't really pass like cool idea is pretty phenomenal. And she's giving a really funny performance four months. It's a full body performance that she's in it I don't know she wants to just like the sticks. You just like the script as you're right so basically like I I guess. She just directs now in kind of chills out once in a while she'll do a hotel artists she'll show up at the Golden Globes to speak up for Mel Gibson. This is the thing I like. This is the thing when you Nick Polanski. There's a lot of in her film house. You really works with the famous thing about her was like she was the one child star who didn't fall apart. Like a longtime right people. She was like she's the exception that proves and yet in the middle of it. She has the John Wayne. Hinckley thing. Where unlike where like? It's this huge burden on her life and she likes somehow overcomes that psychologically and I think that in some way made her more predisposed to be like these guys are damaged. But like I I see the good in number or something like that. I think she had to get past this element of. Oh this terrible thing happened and I think it was about me. She was like a a massive star had won two Oscars was like in a list. Box Office leading lady and was often afraid or not interested in being one. Sure I think Hollywood was always ready to put her at the top but but the other fascinating thing about her was. She was at her peak living in a total glass closet in terms of her sexuality with with a total. Like don't ask don't tell. Attitude of there was never any denial. There were no beards. You know like ninety seven or ninety eight. She like has a child through and Fredo fertilization organization with a partner and everyone reports on it it just doesn't like directly say. She is married to a woman she out. Now she is. She gave a speech speech at award show at the Globes but this was like fairly recently right like twice while like a lifetime achievement award and she gave this sort of odd spe- and she said like my wife She's now divorced from but she like when she finally came out she just sort of said like you know that person I've been married to for like fifteen years and we just don't directly acknowledged that the memory that she gave that speech and everyone was like did Jodi foster just come out and then in the press room they were like did you. Just come out. She's like no. I think she doesn't like the press. It's that much I mean fair I also I read it at the time as her saying like. That wasn't me coming out. Everyone knows I'm gay. You know sure because there was never any sort sort of like diversion with her. which like it wasn't even like rumors? have dogged it was like a joint fosters gay. She's gay yea. Everyone knows that I wanNA point out. She also directed a bike near interested. Able get directed Archangel. Oh right which is not my favorite back mayor the worst episode performances. I just find it very interesting. That even if she didn't publicly come out at her peak she was essentially the first like major major. Our gain movie star. You know there was no alternate narrative being thrown around about her. I guess so you ever think about how the narrative more became a Gwa. Hasn't she quote come out like why is on the rape right. Yeah if you think about how in home for the holidays she cast as the hot guy who might tempt holly hunter to move home. Is David Strathern Lake. AAC Good taste the call. What silence of the lambs MHM? I'm trying to think of like are there scenes or sequences. We haven't talked about. Obviously we have talked about some of the major sequences running time. Gripe by this will get a sense one you want to shout out. This movie was a legendary scary. VHS cover movie for me. Yep My parents rented it because I think even though they it was like I'm a young kid when this comes out so it's probably appeared what they're probably seeing now a lotta movies But I'm sure that this thing was such a big thing that they were like all right. Let's thread silence onto the lamb. Yeah the poster icon poster Jodie Foster's face in like extreme contrast and even look like her. It feels like a piece of ICONOGRAPHY. Ah Yes with the moth over her face. Yeah I mean you guys know the poster poster I was like what is this movie about lambs. Yeah what is it like. No we can't explain to young. I don't know where to begin at the exact same relationship with it and I knew a scary. We knew that the images upsetting. You can't put your finger on. Why right and the weird the skull on the back of the of that raise like is that just how it happens to look or is that them making a movie about a monster mov like? Is that a real easy about a Mothman Prophecies about the Mothman prophecies overseas. Great fucking movie. I have not actually. It's really nice No I We have talked about so much of this movie. And we haven't talked about two of the most famous sequences like at all. I just want to point out. Also there is the iconic hopkins poster is never used Yes they had the reverse essentially essentially right carry on this gross poster. There's some things are I think there's a reason they were like you know what the foster one is the good balance light and dark. There is some sick. You'RE GONNA get eaten by Darth. Maul in his face is totally red. There's something about the blink of foster's face that makes the poster really eerie. I was also thinking. It's a rare example of like a poster that totally works on. Its own as just a striking piece of ICONOGRAPHY. I don't get with this poster saying I don't understand what's going on this money but it catches my eye and it makes me curious and also after you have seen the movie. The poster is more impressive one hundred percent like that's an incredible visual encapsulation leashes. What's going on here totally? But it's something that doesn't sell those things to you and spoil it for you going into the theater. And then the poster becomes its own individual work of art. Great my great fucking movie. What did you want to talk about the second hour this movie? We've barely we haven't talked about talk about the setup and we have to talk about electricity escape you're right and they haven't talked about the Buffalo Bills House set up. Can I do my seen random because I think serve as a transition to get into the big three hundred okay. Hopkins has nine scenes in the movie. Sounds Great I. I can't say I was one hundred percent accuracy. He's in for nine. He's nine for an he's nine for nine But my rule was if he is in a scene. My Stop Watch is going and if the scene ends my stop watch stops. That is what the rule should be one hundred. This weird screen time thing became more about. When do we see them? ONSCREEN is already set right. And so what is it twelve minutes. There's some like the succesor right. We're the he's actually only in the movie for sixteen minutes. He's only. His face is only directly on screen for sixteen minutes. But that's mostly because of the fucking cinematic language of this movie. which is separating clarisse and hopkins kissed? Dialogue is over those shots. There's no disputing this right. You count the scenes. He's in not the counted any scene in which he was working. Yes where he is affecting the scene where he's a character in this so even when he escapes and he's wearing the fake face. All of that that is that is true. The Hannibal does have a whole scene where he's just pretending to be a dead bug A.. C. Angry I showed US number two in the call. She they said Mr Hopkins. You want a coffee and he was like your thank you. Do you want a pillow in between takes hopkins in that scene. Okay so you got to eat the lamb chops. It's a classic example of great looking food. Not Getting the thing that trips to the crazy in crazy they're rare okay. The first meeting seen six minutes and forty seconds the second meeting seen after after the rain where he gives her the towel. Four twenty right to add these times together already done it. I've had it together. Okay okay then it's Five thirty already I think is the third meeting where they start the quid. Pro Quo thing right then. Broke wrote scene for one. Thirty is anthony held with him with the cage on his face talking about the transfer then seen five I believe is Him meeting with the sender. That's three thirty seen six. The Big One. That's the silence of the lambs monologue. That's seven Yep him in the weird cell and all that stuff yeah right then him escaping keeping from the cell. The attack is four his screen time in terms of the phone. Call the end. Please oeser. Then it's the two minutes of him wearing the other guy's face getting out right ending with him waking up in the ambulance and then seen nine is one minute. Which is the phone call at the end? He's got thirty six minutes and thirty seconds. Atkinson screen time in this movie by my count in like a two hour moving in a two hour movie now the thing that shifts. He's not in much of the latter. That's the thing you know. Yeah because then it becomes gotta get Buffalo. Because the first hour of the movie. I was pretty much up to thirty minutes and I was like two of right. Mostly what it's about right and then there's a large chunk for about half an hour plus where he doesn't appear until the phone call because he's getting to the Caribbean right but he's getting a had this is. Here's the thing I think that throws this conversation. Compensation is if you gender flip this. If this was somehow a movie about like Eddie Road Maintenance Sandra Bullock Sandra bullock was like a serial killer like people would be like. Oh yeah she still of course because we. We don't expect a man to play a supporting lead role a woman movie like this. That's what this is. It's a liberal that supports the other lead or there's a weird version of it where you're in like the first movie the Danish girl fucking At least if it kinder's one hundred percent the main character in that film shows the most notably the main challenge of the Janus girl met film and they put her in supporting because it was like a cake while it is. It is so weird that she has that Oscar. It's so weird that she won and that she beat another lead performance. That should have won. Rooney Mar- Yes Carol. Yes the other thing was. I felt this as well Rooney Mara was the actual care. A Hundred G's Carol. She plays Carol Right I. It also is incredibly strange that I feel like right up until the nominations everyone was like. Yeah KANTER IS GONNA get for mackinaw and she's probably GonNa win the Oscar because it feels like a big year for her and that will be a cool Oscar win and then. The surprise was predicting predicting predicting the Danish girl. You're reading the WEIRD BLOGS NO NO I. Danish girl was ex- smacking had its own lovely surprise when people were kind of protecting Danish girl actress. Now ECHINACEA there were gone into supporting. There were a couple of places that said that but they ran but once once the curses wants to recur started. She was nominated as supporting actress. Because that was the move they made. Who had that movie? That was that was focused. Right right right you know Golden Globes Golden schmos. No you're right. How Globes they did that trick? Thank you rushing at the double nomination and people going to repeat it. Then at the SAGS. She went supporting because at the SAG out. Someone in a category and they can't be excluded. Yeah and she one and that was the moment when remarks agent called me and said she wasn't going to do an interview with me boy. Wow that's sad. I was GonNa talk to her because she was running. She was getting ready for an Oscar campaign in every house was like okay. Forget it save your money at least winning doomed Rooney Mara David so my fault. It's you're you're okay. You're right you're right thank you so yes. We've talked a lot about the major interrogation. We talked about this the handrail the Karis seems. I love All the stuff of cassie lemons is so good to and such. That's a good example of not putting to find a point on it but just like such a lived in relationship. It's just like this is what a female friendships right. Yeah Oh and especially in this. Incredibly male dominated field where they are like having to prove prove themselves twice as hard at every single turn and also dealing with such which heavy awful shit all the time where. It's like having a friendship of someone else who gets that scene. Where they're going over the case file and figuring him out and it's it's all in the first person close ups and Cassie Lemons? Lips are trembling just a little bit. It's incredible like repeating micro expression she keeps on making and it is like they're excited because they're solving it but the heaviness of what they're talking about is so disturbing that it's still affecting her psychological. I also just like that. That scene is clearest being like hey figure this out with me. It's not like just her with like Hannibal in her head like pouring over notorious yourself. Well another thing I love is when they watched the press conference of the senator and she's like she's really smart. She knows what she's doing. She's really smart and explains to everyone like she understands. The Buffalo Bills GonNa have a harder time killing her if she has a name. She's shooting which then transitions into it. Puts the lotion on its skin and then it gets the hose again right which is like Ted Levine's best seen as an actor where he's fully playing talking about like I. Yes it's a guy working hard as he can to play the monster and to personalize her. That scene is insanely upset. It's so this movie is not that violent. No even though it's you know about a guy who eats people in there some eating and there's nothing this really graphic in that scene not not in that scene and really the most graphic thing in this movie is a severed head in a jar which is great and the and and then I'll and you know the the skin reveal your yes. Get some grossing sense right right but I think he accountable but the scenes with her in the Hoopla in the pit hit and like the her seeing the nail and all that like. That's the stuff where you're kind of like I might have to turn this off. I'm upset right. That's sort of the most chilling stuff in the movie and him. I'm doing the the the weird shrieking one touch. I love this skipping ahead to the end is that it scored with that fucking dog barking. Yeah which is just like the dodgers in pain anxiety. Yeah yes and it's such a weird little touch that you can hear throughout the house at different games so panicky all that stuff. He's so good to Brooks Smith. Yeah I mean. Every performance in this film is incredible every two line performance incredible but her in the car. I forget that this movie has like four really strong needle drops but her in the car on. Its talk about listening to American girls. You get such a sense of WHO. She is in temperament. But it's beautiful. That's devoted the context of Her parents right that it's just. It could be any random person you don't understand the weight. She's GonNa hold culturally right part of the victim. Ruffalo bills problem was that he accidentally abducted a senator's daughter doesn't the not doing it for that read. But that's like what awakens national interests. Also just like such a beautiful like story decision on Thomas Harris's part which is like that's how you explain why they're willing to deal with fucking Hannibal Lecter. Suddenly this becomes a thing that the presence weighed in on every time. Anyone goes anywhere in this movie they go like. Oh that Buffalo Bill case but everyone knows this fucking guy. He's equivalent to the Zodiac killer in that like them and follow. Driving is getting out of hand Dan. The president is weighing in on this. It's become such an emotional story that it's like we can clean up any mass. After the fact Hannibal Lecter we just need to find her now now which is great And watching her do all the math of like you know how she can figure it out but also how she can use this case to who her career crews benefit To be able to sort of firmly get her foot in so that she can be in arguable within the F Chisholm. She's embiid like normal way. She gets it. She's she's a version of this movie where she is more cutthroat right. It's like that's often how women who are careerists are presented in the fucking speech Casey Lemons about. Oh we don't get to ensure exact feature Hannibal Lecter and he's like you don't understand how hard my lifespan. Right right right and Hannibal electors an ally and any bus outs stats about. I mean there is like every scene. He's in the movie he walks in and he you just like hey. The ally has arrived. Yes it's weird that he on his jumpsuit wrote. The future is female. And then if you turn around on on the other side it says nevertheless she persist and both written and okay so Red Dragon the first. I'm Harris novel novel which is about a man who the he's the version of the COP who's like I have a disease and disease that I understand criminals and I'll never be cured right? I understand killers. That's like what will Graham type whereas like. This movie is all about Hannibal trying to understand calories and her diseases like I just feel like if I save this person and then finally the the ocean inside me will become knows. It won't the title. Is that the title is aspirational. She's driving four in life is to get to the silence of the lambs. Yes she wants to be in a place where she feels like she's been able to personally stop the Crying because the idea that people are in that much pain and suffering flips her the fuck out and like eighties wild at this movie. The crux of this movie is that story right because it's not don't like that story then like lambs but an Anagram of lambs is this and that's where he lives like it's not like electors trying to get her to realize something about the case when they're talking talk about her but but it is. It's such a key thing because as you said like Graham as sort of shadow of of Hannibal or vice versa. Right sure. They're both people who have spent their lives studying the psychology of incredibly broken juris people right and it has kind of destroyed both which is like what behavioral science of the mind. Hunter eventually is going to be like you know and this is based on the mind. Hunter Jack Crawford is the mind hunter guide right like that's the classic thing. Serial killers may be all sort of start to go mad yourself and Hannibal sort of super power. Is He understands that. Mind so well that it gives them such a clear vision vision of how fucked up to manage the human brain can be that it makes him into this total fucking nihilist. Who wants to eat people's brains ship so really smart about making Buffalo Bill and that only flurries could catch what they think? Her magic power is understanding him as a person right and that's what eventually unlocks exit for her. Because she conversation is so pivotal she has not given up on humanity yet. Yeah one hundred. which will Graham is only so successful in being able? Oh Stop Hannibal Lecter. Because he's already gotten to him right. The souls already started getting eating you know and the fact that is so much still in the aspirational aspirational phase of. Maybe I can stop at all. Maybe I can let the lambs go free. And they'll stop screaming. It's kind of about the ways that men fail to understand. Women got the way that women always understand man and like able to navigate within that space. Because if you accept the Buffalo Bill is not trans which Demi certainly wants us to think. Then he he is a man who is like not comprehending womanhood is more than this costume. He wants to put right which is true. I think that'll fix it. If you can find the right size and the right person right right and the Thomas Harris thing like Bryan Fuller was being too. This is like every killer is wants to transform themselves in some way like. He's trying to wash away his pain by becoming in what he thinks of is the opposite of himself without realizing that like it's within him at the same time right. It's not that he feels that he is a woman it's that he wishes. He were a different person. The most drastic way he can think of making that happen which is why he's like applied for sex reassignment surgery by rejected is like the Hannibal points out breast back then like the the way to become like legally translates like you had to like go essentially fulltime which means dressing as the gender that you you are. You had to do that for two years. And then you start on hormones and then you could do something like it. Was this law unlike clearly. He's not doing that like he doesn't WanNa take the social risk USC of like going out dressed in women's clothing or whatever it tells you everything because you sense that he would not feel any freedom from doing that. Yeah he is looking for some sort of magic solve to how much he hates being in his own skin which is because of the life he's lived said I do you think that one of the areas in which it kind of gets up to trans experience in a way that is like damaging is talking about someone who desperately does not want to be himself and that is often like I remember for many years I just was like I just I. I don't want to be a woman I just don't want to be me. And unlike this the body I midfield wrong to me. But that doesn't mean I want to be a woman because it's like a huge conceptual leap to make its lecture raking apart society on some level and like I do wonder you know for all the movies protests to the contrary it does capture that element of the experience with Buffalo Bill. And I'm like I wonder to what degree you could. You a sympathetic translating of Scherzer. I think you could. I'm not going to try it but I think you could. Yeah Yeah it's it'd be tough but yeah I mean yeah you go like it. Takes takes twenty plus years after this movie for us to start getting like trans characters played by transact or director the hands right and that's what five years ago and even that is and misguided project once Eddie read main to then Hollywood was like okay. Everybody who's had to do you. Why would Scarlett Johansson tried to do is like no right? Eddie Rodman they did it on you. Miss your window. The this is unlike the other thing that I noticed this. And I don't always like whenever Never Hannibal's talking to cleary's his mind immediately goes to the worst thing so when she went to her dad dies she has to live with her dad's cousins and did he do terrible things he always goes there and I think it's partly that he just can't resist like pushing a button but also like he just assumes the world is like completely overflow when she shows up he's like oh so they sent you because they think all WanNa fuck you right and then I'm just Jack Crawford WanNa fuck you and she's gone deflecting but he's always just it's like you know it has to be the worst thing right because he spent his life studying saying Oh right right. The worst psychological mechanisms a person can have whereas Clarissa Reece's more like even though she toko lamb and it was too heavy and she couldn't save the lamb. Yeah like she still like you know what I'm going to keep trying to save the limb. The smart thing about the end of this movie is it understands that you can defeat by entertainments but you can never defeat the devil grantable. Lecter is always GONNA escape. Hannibal Lecter is always going to be out there in the world but Clarissa Rhesus approach can work for a time you can save one woman can stop one villain electorates so compelling. You're kind of like this doesn't belong in jail. He's like a caged Animal Aguirre. Yeah you're like I know like he just has that feeling real like he should be out there. Even though that's scary you know what I mean like you. Just like the the idea of him operating a full powers kind of thrilling. The scene with the senators incredible. I mean aside from the fact that obviously you have the most iconic being back to below but him with the straitjacket the orange jumpsuit on the stretch of course with the mass which is just I it. Another thing we're watching for. The first time is a fifteen year old. I was like okay but I've seen unlike a thousand fucking parodies of the mass and parodies of Jim. Carey's the mask I've seen so many people wearing the mask is a joke and fuck and putting it on compel can't Damn Crystal Right on the Oscar stage that I was like this is going to have no power for me and the first time they will amount that you go that is fucking terrifying and watching it again last night. There's something about it like his wide open piercing blue eyes and his blank expression underneath and his mouth mouth looking like it's in its own jail cell the fact that it's like little metal bars in front of his teeth to eighty two thing that the impersonations nations of it you don't get his eyes are darting. Just incredible yeah right. Yeah he's like looking for an escape and then of course they will match the senator and he like starts giving their from issue wants but also it's like he can't help himself this press and this is he just. I can't help himself and he helped like sucks basic. There's no fundraiser. You know and then like he is so good and so he's whole preening like he's the specimen I've got a weird little started carrying no and like he hates everyone else like in his wing. You know I mean the fact that he kills the other guy for throwing the semen on Clarisse is just like please. There's a difference between me and guys like this. He basically clear lost Hannibal within that when that happened. And like I owe you a solid home overall make dinner you know that would be his usual approach. Yeah I'll draw you right. Yeah and then. It's like this movie just has like a couple like straight upset pieces. We're like the whole prison. I mean not prison. The whole escape escape thing is incredible. Sequence right is just like stunning. Servizi stashes amazing on that one off. Yes it's the craze. He's very thin but very long. Go crazy variation on food man. Yeah by the way Ben Battle. Ben Holiest back fastback beautiful. Just throw some thoughts of stuff earlier that you guys have already talked about read a quick go here. Shady storage units across America love that I would not help anyone with the street couch into a van. Let alone at night. Sure I do like the in the scene. She has the Agency of this is clearly early. A bad idea right that they don't play her as a total naive lake. SORTA moron. It's like she knows like fuck. This is the kind of thing that usually ends ends up with you. Being put in a pit right and it's that basic human thing of like in the moment you're like I should give him the benefit of the Dasher right and then it's too late the second because he just Baxter in and yet we didn't talk about the storage locker. That move of Hannibal being like go visit a friend of mine transferred a storage locker unreal. Chill your cowboy man in the rain. Who's Asanka gone tomorrow? And she's exciting under the door. And then that fucking setup of like the carriage edge with the plush interior and the headless mannequin and then the head in a jar. How are we supposed to believe that Hannibal has been in jail that he just set up this little display and paid long enough for to remain in the storage locker request yours? I mean that's incredible critical. What an artist? This guy is good for him. He's a big picture. This made storage unit. When I drive those yeah on the highway late at night like scar-free Pete? There is something about things in those buildings right. True mystery. Laurie I was GONNA say fuck. I don't remember I want Amy Tobin. Great Aitmatov film critic wrote the Criterion Assay. If you've read it being very good And she points out like that scene there's flags everywhere. Yeah the scene obviously in the Prison escape weird sell. I don't know how you describe it. The Weird Selling Gymnasium Zia. Yeah thing that has the weird American flag like and like when I go again makes a weird little display for everyone Charles. Napier beer hanging with his skin ripped great. Hannibal could have just gotten out of there. But he's like no no there needs to be some pomp and circumstance needs people to respect him like full Foale to recognize that he's a genius artist. He's like she's like all these tattered flags. All these relics of America like this is all very intense. Yeah yeah the I I really I advise you to read it. It's really good our the TV show went a little like it did great stuff with the death tableau but like what I like. Mike about this movie is that you can sort of. You can bend your brain in a way where you're like okay. Yeah I get like how he did this even though he had like ten minutes to like from the ceiling. Yeah you know yeah but it is like it's a pretty like even knowing where it goes. It is such a beautifully constructed extended set piece from from like I mean they've set up the pen like fifteen twenty minutes earlier So you see him look at it than a full scene later you see. Anthony held well not be able to find his pen and they sit on it for like another ten minutes before he takes the thing out of his. Now it's after he's had the whole clery conversation after after he's been transferred then he takes it out and then just like how's he fucking GonNa get out of this then to switch over to the swap Guy Perspective I love. That's the beauty that takes so y you really stick with those guys. One of them is an actor. I know who is it. That's Chris Isaak's bargain. There's someone else in there whose face I recognize. Remember things I love about timing. He lets things breathe. I feel like so many other movies like this would just be like Bang Bang Bang. Here's something like this is it takes. Its time attention attention of the elevator thing of all of them realizing like Oh fuck guns out call the battalion seeing it. Stop on three and then going like wait. What the fuck is going rolling on right? I also like that. You don't see him rip the guy's skin just the shot of him. Taking the like the skin mask is enough for you to process like oh he did. Oh that's so that's all I need. Your brain. Does all the work for such a fine balance of like and that the body audie on top that he switched the clothes that they think that. That's what's going on police right. Like all this sort of misdirection stuff. But he did some regular escape deep stuff. Some skin removal new face escapes also basically putting Buffalo Bill to shame he liked jury rigged a human face in like five five seconds. I was talking about how this show is television. Now like the the x files rips off this. Yeah this movie's visual Palette and then every show on CBS rips off the X.. So like yeah. That's why now we live in silence of the lambs world. Like the thing about television knows. It's so graphic and you see so much violence that's fine whatever ever CSI in criminal minds Svu and all these shows don't exist wound a show. I love did a lot of that in this movie. I always forget how non gory it is. I was gonna say it's crazy because he doesn't sanitize it like he deals with it. I mean proper weight of these are horrific things happening. And you can't sugarcoat Gra coat them but it is a rare movie of this ilk. That does not kind of glamorize and ask you to get some perverse thrill from like how fucked up. It is one of the most horrifying shots in the movies when he grabs the guy. And you have that shot of Hannibal like yeah biting the camera. Essentially you see him kind of like biting eighty MCI but in another movie such as Red Dragon. Yeah he would then like tearaway like blow away. Some chunk of flesh face will be so fucked up back to the guy. He's the woman. Yeah he's got the right one he's got a little. It's a little less. I mean the car thing is like your reminders. What much more I don't understand it? It's just like this is is not normal human interaction and also Charles Napier's just watching it being like Jesus Christ Straits holiday. That's all he just goes into a robot when he's doing the Repeated ka-shing listed on his the banality of evil thing as much as he then like still like. Put It in a nice package and like put on a show for them. It is the fact that like you know you watch something like mine hunter and it makes it a lot more glamorous than it actually is. I Love I'm not saying that in a negative way. I'm not saying that negative way I'm it's A. It's a different approach yet. Yeah because one of the things that this movie does is kind of at times. Feel like a documentary. I actually think that mind hunter is like kind of breaking the silence of the lambs thing because it is deliberately saying we don't show stuff. Yeah sure shot is the show that that realized scary about silence of the lambs. Was that conversation member station right terrifying. Yeah one hundred percent. Conversations to Air France became room with a person like this is terrifying. Yeah and also mindhunter. I think it's just about like me reading a wikipedia entry three late at night of some serial killer and like you just sort of like slowly reading it and you're like like that's it. Why am I interested in this right? Why do I WANNA know more? Yeah why am I suddenly like so frightened. Even though I'm only reading thing right just so weird fascination we have with I wanNA understand why a person would do this or what they did is it is so beautiful that clarisse ends up being the one to catch him because She is trying to just finish off. All the loose ends the fricken fake out. Yeah the thing. That should not work every time I wanted to work. So it's like everybody's ripped it off once you've once you know what's happening here like it's not gonNA. Yeah every time every single time and then one of the greatest action sequences all time is is the night vision see. Yeah even though. It's very brief like you. Think of it as very long tense there. It's not that long. Because the the concept is so terrifying so to second he turns on the night vision and and Demi switches to his perspective. which we've never been in before right? I mean I guess I guess it's sort of like a jarring switch. Elsa love that thing where I thought I was with my hero. Now I'm watching my poor hero be like stocked in the night title and the questioning is great leading up to it the moment where Buffalo Bill realizes that she might catch him and he like stifles a laugh. Yeah like a really sad very interaction. Action is really interesting then goes for the gun and then she goes down to the basement. And you have that Amazing Brooks Smith seen of her being like. Don't worry I've saved you and her just being like fuck sake. Give me out of here now as he got a catch gophers issues. Like like she's like. There's No God in every thank you. There's none of that of climate little bit. A female cop is rescuing feels gray. Like I think you're GonNa join me in this pit and five seconds me now and it's the whole feelers. The dog down which is being innovative. Everybody in this movie gets to be smart. EVEN BUFFALO BILL GETS TO BE SMART and it's just like that makes it so much better. Guess one hundred percent of the sequence because we know the space kind of what he lives in the basement is like but when you're actually exploring it and the perspective of the hand held shots it is. The mosques is flying around industry playing in the back on that moths grew another classic. Demi like let me I want to look at these guys basis for a second. I want to understand these as people beyond just like exposition people. It's like what you'd go to your grandparents house named the basement. They'd have a bunch of Weird Shit and they'd be like don't get too close to the pit you'll fall into the pit liked liked the fact that it's someone else's Weird House that he took over and put like half of his shit into it but it's also like half stuff he just hasn't gotten rid of. Yeah and it's like you see. Yeah the almost like there's a map of the US and it's like there's somebody else hung that's another life that we we don't get any part of the house I feel like are some of the design Zayn and I might be wrong. It's an Eugene is there is a game yeah they kind of did a little bit of like touch to Buffalo Bill with the corporation. That real bilas was like Ted Bundy and Ed Geene like some weird again. He has the Ted Bundy. Like blurring the lady with the cast and all that but it is nice that clarisse solves it independently calls Glen and he's like we figured it out but like good job right now just like finish it up you know. Do the follow up interview view. But she goes in having accomplished everything on her own so she is fully loaded to be able to handle the situation right. She's her hypothetically. And then it's just some the most terrifying shit in the history of Cinema Herbie. She's I'm sorry what herb is useful. You want some of the most horrifying shit name is doubt congratulations. It is just like the D. level of like restraints and sort of like the precision decision of the timing and the blocking on the bills. Pov through the night vision goggles reaching out to her face constantly almost touching her but missing sang and foster just is like killing that scene. I mean playing the complete as I. I don't know how they actually shot that man. No I don't know what she could or couldn't see right but she is perfectly playing someone who does not think that the killer is that close to her but understands that she is is at immediate risk. His hands are out and he's coveting. I know I mean Buffalo Bills Kinda turf if you think about one hundred you get your happy ending. She and of course. I'm having a friend for dinner right. I mean there's a great craig closing line tie pretty good. Yeah I feel like Hannibal Thought of that. Six years ago. He was like man. If I ever get out and I get to do an ominous communists phone call. I'll say that that is the thing that do not have a wreck. Lecter wrote this movie. Yes it is the thing that doomed the public into thinking they wanted to see five more Hannibal movies ending such a tee up but it's a tear for thing you actually don't want to see him follow through on. That story doesn't really matter not really. Don't WanNA see him eat. Anthony held that long. Walk them like like head on the weird romantic undertones. You don't WanNa see Alexa back to lecter. Yeah yeah that low walk away to me is always just like I. I take it as he disappears into the crowd. That's just like they are monsters among guests exactly it's so effective that he never fades to black the fact that it just stays on and on and on and on. It's just like somewhere now Hannibal. Lecter is existing outside of this frame. Yes getting ready to shout down a jaunty little little hemion hat and his way in a wig. He's got long hair glasses. Yeah Hopkins put that costume. I was like yeah. I'm doing this. This is this this is me for this is my this is my life took his twitter account now. Him Incredible Okay boxoffice game. Let's do it February me. Fourteenth Nineteen ninety-one. I just want to say this is the era when I was paying a lot of attention to the box office so I might do. Yeah this film premiered at the Berlin Film Festival where it won best director and then came in to the February it opens number one thirteen million a pretty strong opening morning adjusted for inflation. That would be thirty. Wow you know so like a good opening president's Day weekend so it's a four day week and the domestic total is one thirteen one. Thirty thirty thirty two seventy nine was a huge hit and worldwide. I think it was two seventy nine also worldwide crazy well overseas one hundred percent yes. It's just a big old law so fucking hit okay. So number one thirteen sounds lamps number. Two number two is a it was number one the previous week when it came out was a huge hit of the year that I feel like is now forgotten and it was like getting big movie star going series idea what it is the big Easter but he had not on Sirius before she she had not gone serious before. I mean not in a leading role as more of a comedy actress. I feel like this is her are being an Oscar. I can be in a thriller. Okay she was a cardiac stress and now she's going to be in a thriller whoopie. No I didn't I didn't realize assist movie was serious but is it Bert. Unaware it does not fuck but is Goldie no but is it somewhat of a Goldie ilk is that what kind of comedy I mean in terms of the she'd been in some Rom coms. Yeah is it make Ryan new situ correct richt final total on sleeping with the enemy. Please ninety one. Oh one huge hit. Wow a movie really forgotten like people people do not remember sleeping. I genuinely came later that year. Eight eighth biggest film of the year term for sleeping with the enemy remake And you know the of Yep Yep that's Only watch it at night like the other big hits of the year. Terminator two Robin Hood beating the B.. Sounds of the lamb city slickers hook the family weird right but like all of those movies have at least some cultural tale right right. This is the enemy. Is that number eight. Oh okay yeah I guess I remember the movies about like things being cyclical and culture always being this way. This is a perfect example of a year. Where like almost everything is some sort of reboot or secret fashion or something because of the father of the bride naked gun two and a half? The big hits of the teenage mutant Ninja Turtles too right. I saw these fear which is a remake like that's like Hoity toity Rebe Star Trek six. The Prince of tides of course was based based on DC comics based on a second genesis. It's actually weirdly patient of golden axe. Just no one ever talks about that. It's it's based on the trading card series by Tom's now number. Three okay is a new entry. This week It is a film we have long discussed doing on this podcast. Ben Is this is a king. Ralph came round was pumping his fist. I knew a King I was. I was literally literally GonNa make a King Ralph reference earlier. This don't WanNa take that from Ben King Ralph such a good movie aesthetic because I don't like AAC snooty people hate. Oh I don't like I don't like aristocrats Like people who are bullies. Because you know you're not as smart as them King Ralph Ralph and he's like like rock and roll and I like sandwiches and Y'all are weird guys named Ralph that's true that's true of keep calm you right now. They want to know if you WANNA be king rounds. King Ralph Series Documentary. I go and kick the Queen out of her chair Outta here. Here's the thing I want to say about. King Ralph's poster. Things I love. Okay one the billing John Goodman Peter Billing yes no tool made it to the to the poster but he has to be below only two go right to its classic. Double Tagline one tagline explaining and to as a proper tagline. Okay you know what I mean where it's like yeah this this is too to complicate it. We either tagline like two weeks ago on Lawrence was a normal lawyer. Exactly so the regular tagline is the tagline. You'd expect a comedy comedy of majestic proportions. Good tagline put at least like okay. Take your fucking mouth. It's a great tagline very very good. Here's here's the top tag okay. That's so funny here. It is a great tragedy the royal family leaving only one heir to the thrown. Not so funny laughing. You don't think it's a smart business practice to sell your comedy by saying a great tragedy. The following I believe these poster people sort of figure out like how your eyes would move across. I feel like Goodman tool then great tragedy. Oh Oh scans across now. Here's the queen's Crown but it's a top the head of Goodman sharing a shirt that says and I quote lost in a couple of dice on it I I hate I hate when I'm about to David. You seem to kind of broken up about the thought of the royal family that they seem weirdly invested in just. Because you've seen the royal family. I mean it would be sad looking. We all grew up. David David Contrada. I didn't want you to okay number four. The floors numbers four and five of the box officer to the giant hits of Nineteen Ninety. Okay one won best picture and one I think was probably the biggest movie of Nineteen gotta be home along. That's correct not order no home alone which are respectively fourteen and fifteen weeks into their runs home alone. Can you tell me the final total. The final total home alone was to twenty two eighty five. That makes no sense which adjusted for inflation is six hundred million billion dollars money. It's it's infinity war right adjusted for inflation home alone. What if the wet bandits were in? The new event owns that movie. We now Kevin Kevin Feige should make it. He's he's back Clearly loves working. All the time definitely isn't baffled by questions such as like what's it like to not have been a movie is the only thing he loves more than being in movies again is talking about those movies. Dirt there Disney plus home alone and they are Disney posting. It hits Nitto for bags. Yeah some of the other teams. I'm sorry that's going on PECI PAS. She plus gone fishing again. Nine heads in a Duffel bag is my aunt. I don't know I could have could have the third good Sheila movie. My Aunt Fanny is trance. Culture Nicholas. She wants to go poss. She's the only suspense to allow play transforming. Speak for the community just because it's like because she's in a movie let's just so rarely work takes them back up on that screen big movie. La Story you got never ending in story to so two stories good movie never seen him have very good You have nothing but trouble opening this week. The Chevy Taste Bomb White Fang which I remember watching videos occasion being kind of freaked out by. Yeah and awakenings another Oscar hold of yes a weird film. You're the best in the BIZ. Primetime program we're I can't say right now we're working on. We have a season to pitching to get sponsors and stuff so there is a season two in the world. You cannot say what it is becoming a my hope is that I will be able to say what it is when this episode drops. Don't do that on twitter at Ti. Helen tastic One of the best follows On the Internet and also this is a great place to plug that I think you're interesting is coming back as a series exclusive Jason's talking Jay Leno No I also have a book about the X.. Files also show that. I talked about monsters of the week. The complete critical companion to the X.. Files and the real reason I'm here My scripted. Show Arden is started season to December thirtieth. We hope we haven't recorded anything yet and this is early October. But it's a podcast. Yeah Arden Arden. It was season two right now so please go listen to that check it out trade. Same Fun best in the best. Absolutely yes thank. You're talking about yourself. True and the divine producer won several potty awards for best podcasters MM. I'd rather not talk about. I made the mistake of campaigning as supporting but if if we missed anything listeners. Sure it's time of year. We need some ratings. Some reviews WANNA instead of tweeting at us or an up and of course you could still do if you prefer. Side is perhaps maybe rating a little rating of CAN I. I make one less pitch to the listeners. Please I know March madness is coming up. This is where this is coming on January. I know you guys are thinking about what that lineup is. I don't know what's going to be in my wife Libby Hill TV awards editor Indie wire has made it a goal of her life to be on every movie. podcast talking bicentennial man and Columbus Wins News. Break it last year. Please vote Chris Columbus listeners. I want to make my life hell because she will have to watch bicentennial man dozens of times one of the most unpleasant movies to watch. Yeah truly it's just one of those movies. Where like you're I just kind of off the screen where you're like this is still going on but also you constantly feel feel like their ants crawling on your skin somehow watching it makes you feel like physically like jittery? So if you want my wife Libby Hill to be honest to just be like Griffin. Why are you talking about this right now? I want that more than anything. Vote Columbus Bicentennial Man Baby next week Philadelphia That's right we're we're we're heading we're heading to the I dunno whatever thank you. All for listening refused subscribe. I was GonNa say something funny and my brain just fizzled out happens. Thanks for good or for Social Media Laima government for a theme song job on Pat Rounds for our Goto blinky like a cheese state. I was thinking math together fast enough. I'm no good will hunting the go to the bye-bye shirts and patriots fan around this time maybe right before right after this will be releasing our official performance. Let's review of the marvel cinematic universe not since the star wars days gathered is coming on with us and we're going to review every credited character dirt in endgame and I'm sure talk about this no probably So yeah check that out and As as always Jay Jay Leno slides dams. Like if you can. Why do something very unexpected merchandise spotlight? Sure go ahead okay. So in the late Nineteen Ninety S. Todd McFarlane key of the comic macbooks. I marvel comics. Yes couns image weirdly like owns the Edmonton oilers. Maybe or something like Nick Hockey. Also at one point time owned both Sammy Sosa and mark mcgwire's record breaking home. Run Balls Weird. He Buffet Balls uh-huh he lost them. He had to sell them because he named a a pedophile mobster character in spawn comic after after a hockey player. Because he's such a big hockey fan. He was like Oh phone Easter egg and then the Guy Sued for defamation. He had to pay the guy like tens of millions of dollars. So we had to Sell his baseball's was very obsessed with todd McFarlane as young man largely because at the peak of spawns Cultural Relevance against all the toy companies wanted to get the rights to spawn. And he was like fuck you you guys suck. I'm starting my own company. And everyone's like this is stupid you're going to fail and it succeeded became compiled lateness and the spawn toy. Sold really well but the thing that pushed him over the edge was he started a line called movie maniacs. That was what if you took all the the interesting characters. In adult films toy companies have been afraid to touch but also who are the only visually interesting character in a movie. So you couldn't make an entire toy line off of that movie but you can put them all in as a grab bag okay. He did a series. That was like Freddy Krueger. Jason voorhees leather face When Michael Myers I was maybe in the first batch that then became one of the ten greatest selling toy lines of the along with hot wheels and Barbie and shit so media looking like Hannibal Hannibal and for years and years? Everyone's trying to get Hannibal and no one could cause hopkins was like. I don't want to be a toy. Like Hopkins was like always shutting it down and it was like ten plus years of wind up until someone was able to make not McFarland people who had left macron on started on company to Hannibal. Lecter figures one on the stretcher. One which is really unsettling of Hannibal with the the Billy Club Being attacked attack the Guy Being able to attack the Jesus Christ but the thing I wanNA show you folks this is that one. That's that one comes with all cell. The thing I want to show you folks that I find very funny is the series of mini mates which are Lego. Ask Figures of the signs of the lambs crew and electric co-op. I mean you talk about the I think he says Mickelson yeah sure but these are the Silence of the lamps. Awhile yes there's Clarisse okay does speak to. How sort of iconic every character in the movie is that they can can be recognized even in this form? Here's Buffalo Bill Holding them off with a painted on nipple rings and then a hand up Hannibal this bizarre. Hannibal looks a lot like Nixon does it. Yeah it looks like your best friend to add to the merchant day SPA now a it's him on the Gurney. Yeah makes sense. I've always wanted buffalo bills necklace. Everyone knows recog- get that necklace. I think it looks cool that's great.

director Dr Hannibal Lecter Demi Oscar Jay Leno Griffin David Director Hannibal Emily Vander Don Jonathan Demme Oscar JFK US Kevin Spacey Clarissa reese Ridley Scott buffalo Pete Holmes Philadelphia David Right
Blockers  Emily VanDerWerff

This Movie Changed Me

41:54 min | 6 months ago

Blockers Emily VanDerWerff

"Hello fellow movie fans. I'm lily percy. And i'll be your guide this week as i talk with emily vendor wharf about the movie the changed her blockers. If you haven't seen it don't worry we're going to give you all the details. You need to follow along and one of my favorite things about hosting this. Podcast is when. I get to watch a movie for the first time in preparation of talk to one of our guests. And that's the case with this week's episode. This movie blockers has been a revelation for me. I'm kinda surprised in. See it when it came out in twenty eighteen. Because it's right up my alley. I love sex comedies. And i especially love sex comedies directed by women like blockers which was directed by k kannan because they take the genre to a place that you never expect. It's important that i say this. And i'm going to try not to repeat myself over and over again but blockers is a sex comedy it has vulgarity. It has crude jokes and talks openly about sexuality. It's produced by seth rogan. So if none of those things are exciting to you. This is probably not the movie for you. But if you're willing to set all those things aside then this movie has so much more wisdom than you would think it's complicated about genders. Complicated about love is complicated about sex and all that alongside some of the funniest jokes that you'll see in a comedy. I think julie left her. Laptop open texting. Okay maybe we should check to see peace among you guys snooping on your kids. That is not cool. No it's not snooping if the information shows that's exactly what sleeping is so. It's like the patriot. Act the patriot. Act it's like snooping okay. We don't know what they're talking amount. So what is it like puzzles. I love puzzles just saw for now. Yeah great what did they say about an a plant. Handshake land agreements. Yeah they've got an agreements eggplant parmigiana now eight plants or dixon teenage emoji language. What's true julie told me that emojis have they all have secret meetings so like trees are weed and snowflakes are cocaine and that thing is yaas queens off. When you've never heard of ask claim. Grandpa on julius making some kind of a dick related agreement here kayla is enemy agreement. New focus away. Okay clown face. What the fuck does that mean. That means she's down to clown. Blockers tells the story of three teenage girls who want to lose virginity on their prompt night. But it's also about their parents. Their mom their two dads core trying to figure out how they feel about their daughters growing up in this way agreement hands agreement hands agreement hands. This is a sex agreements. They're making a sex pack. They're gonna lose their agenda and prominent check not sex packed that that is friendship. And that is. That is the bond of friendship that can never be broken. I mean maybe they wrote sex pat twenty eighteen talking new. I love puzzles told you guys. Have you seen inferno inferno. have you guys seen inferno. I figured out in two seconds. Did you see inferno guy jumps off the thing in the beginning. He's got a virus inferno. Tom hanks okay. She's not answering what the heck is outing. She's always been honest with me. She's always told the truth. And now i'm swimming in a pool of live okay. Here's what's going to happen. She walkers isn't the kind of movie that you would expect to be watching and have a revelation about yourself all while you're watching it. But that's what happened to. Emily vander worth. She's a writer and the critic at large for walks and when she saw blockers for the first time she realized that the movie was showing her something that she couldn't have ever even imagined a life for herself as a woman. So i'd love for you to just close your eyes for for a couple of seconds and i'm going to take you back in time to the first time that you saw that movie. Okay so just close your eyes and think about how old you were. This is only two years ago so hopefully this is not a difficult exercise. How old you were Where you were and how it made you feel. And then i'll just chime in when those ten seconds are up salami tommy. What memories came for you. Well first of all as i am a lady i will say. I was in my thirties. When i saw this film. You and i are the same age. So i'm right there with you. Go ahead. i went and saw this movie at a press screening and i think it was march twenty teen. I came out in late march of two thousand eighteen and it was because of a barrage of different things from different quarters. That hit me like exactly the same time. And the first one of those things was k- cannons twenty eighteen film blockers. Which just like. I was expecting to enjoy it because i had heard from people that it was quite funny and quite good and my wife was there with me and we laughed a lot. I could not tell you about the plot mechanics of this movie. I could not tell you what made me laugh. I could tell you everything that. The main character played by kathryn newton. I could tell you about everything she wore. I can tell you about her prom dress. I could tell you about her her makeup her hair all of that. And what's weird. Is that when you tell me to remember the movie. I am remembering character. Who was not the character. I saw myself when i saw twenty eighteen. And that is a it's like a fascinating reexamination of which parts of me were attaching to. What parts of that movie whom which. I'm sure we'll get into in a second but it is related to the de personalization and the disassociation. That comes with being trans. When i saw that movie. I'm sitting in the theater. And at that time. I saw the character played by. I want to say her name. Is gideon adlon getting adleman and she was playing a teenage lesbian. She was very funny. She was very fun. Sam sam lockwood. Yeah i saw the character and just was like oh. This is who you were in high school. You're this kind of awkward. Strange teenage girl. Who was into girls wanted to kiss them. Didn't know how to make that happen. Didn't know how to tell people that's who you were did. Not just say those words. That's really interesting things that the only person who knows that she's actually allows me this. Her father knows it but no but no one he. He wants to protect her own experience of coming out right daughters stupid sex packed to do anything about it. Okay your daughter's gonna do okay. First of all. Ouch second of all. I know nothing's going to happen. Because because she's gay really does she come out to you. Of course not barely speaks to me. Then how do you know because bro. I'm her dad and there's just some things you know. Chad is nothing. He's like a beard. Or whatever a lesbian beard american. I know the point is i guarantee you. They don't even kiss okay. I'm not worried about that. I'm worried about youtube dick in her name. Yeah i really imprinted on that. Obviously i was in the space. I was not out to anyone including myself but i saw this movie and i really was just like. Oh this is who you might have been You know if you had just it's this. Tricky thing in my life is that i was stopped it. I was born to a woman who was not in a place to take care of a child and she put me up for option. And i went through a adoption agency. That was Evangelical christian and had very specific ideas about the right makeup of family. Which was that. There was an older boy in there was a younger girl. And because i was assigned male at birth because i came out in the doctor said it's a boy i had an entirely different life than i would have had if i had been born and the doctor said it's a girl and that like haunts me you know. If i had been born assists woman. I would have had a different family. I would have had an older brother. I would have had different friends. I would have had a different life. And i can't think about that too much without getting really emotional and that is really a part of why i kind of outsource that part of myself to movies so i i i would see a movie. There would be a girl in the movie. And i would imprint hard on her and then i would just sort of that information would fall on my brain and i think part of it was i frequently was imprinting on teenage girls in movies because the part of myself that was me had gotten stuck it. You know in her teenage years which is a thing. I always loathe to talk about because it sounds creepy. Like i see why people like could take that out of context but the truth of the matter. Is that when you are a binary trans person and suddenly you go through puberty and puberty feels just very distracting and weird. There's a part of your brain that just kind of shuts down and that's the part that would you know develop side the other girls your own age in my case and like i now can look back at all these memories of myself in high school and see what a stereotypical teenage girl. I was knowing that i was a teenage girl. I was just not. I was not tapped into that part of myself. So i would see these movies and i would imprint onto teenage girls and there was a reason that when i was in this vulnerable state where i was already starting to think. Okay maybe i need to actually confront the part of myself that constantly thinks about being a woman blockers came along and like in the right direction. just my friends lauren. I broke up. Oh no hard feelings though. She's still little counties. Aiding becomes not st- it's probably different for everyone for me. When i kissed brad markowski. I started to suspect and then last year. When i touch dash and stein's dick. I was like no. It was like holding a dead snake until you try. And i wanna say one of the things. That's so powerful about all of the things that you just said is that it comes in a movie comes in the form of a movie that's described just as a sex comedy and and it's kind of dismissed because of that right like there's a lot of tropes that come with sex comedies and and what we think of that and i should say for for folks who listen to this podcast. Who often watch the movies before we talk about the them. In the episodes this is a very vulgar movie. If you're a fan of seth brogan this movie. Then this is for you. If you're not a fan of seth rogan. You can listen to this conversation. Enjoy it and not have to watch the movie because it does feature a man chugging beer through his butthole so like just four fair warning this is. This is the reality of that. But one of the reasons why i love that you chose a smooth talk about is because it on the surface all those things right the vulgar comedy. But there's so much more going on just below and one of the things blew my mind. That i'm so curious to hear you talk about is the way in which like female identity and gender identities export but like sexuality is explored and it seems from both the male and female point of view. It's not just women talking about sex and in this case you know eighteen year old women talking about sex and wanting to lose their virginity as kind of the the you know example of becoming an adult and moving onto college and leaving high school but it's also parents women and men talking about their daughter's virginity and what sex should be like for women in what sex is like for a man and there's just so much so many layers to this. Yeah i think that the sex comedies that last the ones that people really attached to are not actually about sex i think their vulnerability. I think about the intimacy that comes with being vulnerable. I think the reason you have a scene of john cena chugging beer through his but is because that is an intimate vulnerable moment and the comedy plays off how like how squeamish and how like uncomfortable that makes us because the flip side of that is like a scene where katherine newton's character talks to her boyfriend and they decide to have sex and it's very sweet and it's very almost wholesome those are just two sides of the same coin. We laugh at one we saw at the other one but like they're playing in the same emotional territory. I'm not. I'm not a huge fan of the original american pie. I like it. But i remember loving it when i saw it in one thousand nine hundred nine when i was kind of the same age as some of the characters in it and i really like i really liked vulnerability i think there is this thing that happens to audiences where we remember the most obvious biggest details in fell. So you think about something like blockers and you know for a lot of people what they remember his john cena chugging bear through his but because it was in the trailers it's the big laugh out loud moments of the film. But you know the thing that makes the movie. Work is not to return to american pie. Jason biggs having sex with a pie. You know thing that makes that movie work. Is that all of those guys are like struggling to be honest and open an emotional. The girls that they fall for. And it's the same thing with blockers where it's it's these these teenage girls working and hoping to find a way to just like be themselves and express themselves sexually and exist within a space where you know Female sexuality is often demonized and just like get to live their lives in a way that makes them feel fully expressed and vulnerable and able to be open and like where they assume the world will have a generosity with them that it doesn't always have. I'm having sex. That's great. I'm having soon now tonight with austin. You're finally going to do it. Yeah i mean you know. We've been dating for six months and we love each other and i just awkwardly. Got my pediatrician. To put me on birth control. I know it's like kind of corny or whatever but it just seems like promise. Kind of perfect. We're gonna dim lighting rose petals on the bed. The sent from that candle that gets me horny. Every time i pass it and walker all candles. Get me learning. I'm gonna look into austen's is and then he's going to look into mind and then we're like touch each other's faces you know for like a longtime along time connect them. We're going to fuck it. And what i'm having to just like that. I mean why not because it's your time and your first time should be special and her fix yours can be special imperfect is going to be tonight and with that dude. Connor aldridge your lab partner with this thing yet would have. He's a weird. They're all weird. Mrs are not for looking at for use plungers. Listen my student athlete as are over. Tonight is the beginning of my adult life. And for the first time i can do whatever i want i want to go to prom. Get drunk potted up on weed and lose got virginia. We're going to have the same time. Sexy anniversary you can go to dinner. Every in commemorate it on carnage s olive garden. Life bitch god. It is going to such a relief to get this over and done with for college. No i mean i just don't think i'm there yet. Maybe something might happen tonight with me and chad. But i don't think sex is going to be that but you never know what can happen. I mean maybe my inner sexual smile will emerge. It's and spread. It's mighty ways. I never know what you're talking about. I think that was a big part of why the movie spoke to me is. I'd always felt weird around my own sexuality. Like i knew it was there somewhere it just. It was so disconnected from the rest of myself. It was like you know it was like i had a small add onto my house and back where nobody ever went because like it's not heated and it's frequently waiter sexuality back. We didn't go there unless it was summer that metaphor because summer is actually a terrible time to have now. I hope you have off season porch your sexuality yes my sexual sexual abuse now like we're installing heaters because yeah i had to figure that all out again. Please continue now i love. I love that you speak of the vulnerability because it comes in even small details like even that but hold chugging scene which is where we'll be the last time i talked about it John cena is holding. You know the character of leslie mann lisa. Her hand throwing him like it is affordable experience in there are all these little moments in the movie amongst the parents So i should say that. John cena and leslie mann and then ike barunholtz play the parents of these three girls. You know the three of them also learn to be vulnerable with each other. And and kind of defy the stereotypes of what it means to be a dad and what it means to be a mom and the the writers of this movie and the director really clearly wanted us to see all these little details vulnerability in ways that we normally don't see in this genre of comedy. Have yeah i think one of the other things that's fascinating about blockers is it was kind of sold a movie about parents trying to stop their daughters from having sex and there was like this. Oh what are regressive idea and our progressive era but like the movies specifically about subverting. That trope yes. The parents have anxiety about their daughters having sex but when the time comes they realize it's an important part of growing to adulthood of growing to womanhood of becoming yourself and owning your own sexuality. A mike there is a beauty to that. I agree and for me personally. Having grown up in latin american immigrant evangelical christian has With a lot of sexism and kind of stereotypes of what a woman should be especially around virginity sexuality. You know one of the things. I remember my mother telling me growing up is like we'll sexist different for women You know you're going to be more affected and you're emotionally attached like i remember. I would picture that. The first i had sex suddenly like i would literally be attached by a chain to the person that i had sex. Because it's like well that's it i like. It's just a strange thing. Yeah and this movie. I love that Both the leslie man character. You know the mother and the dad's all kind of talk about these really stupid stereotypes and and ideas about how women interact with sex versus how men interact with sex. They talk about them and and they're just out there on display and it allows us to go. That is a really stupid thing to believe. This is so messed up. Who are you to get involved in our daughter's sex life on the ocean honey me. Did your dad try to stop you when you lost your virginity totally different different at the double standard or when a guy who uses his virginity. It's no big deal. It's celebrated but if a girl does it some sort of big loss of innocence. Come on guys. It's the same damn thing marc- stop talking. Just give us the address address. Honestly lisa i can't believe you're on their side side. This is not some philosophical debate. We're trying to stop our daughters from some kind of sex pack that they've planned and not thought through all the way that is such bullshit. How do you expect society to treat women. As if they're equal in their own parents won't don't know about that. I'll deal with society tomorrow right now thinking about my daughter. Well that is that's convenient. Yeah you know what go ahead and be part of the group that precedes women as a little damsels in distress that needs saving. Who cares about us not getting paid as much or not having control of our own bodies. Can you please not talk to me. Like i'm someone who bombs abortion clinic. We're go off topic the address. I just can't believe that you think julie shouldn't be free to explore her sexuality in the same way that boys are girls and boys are very different. I've been thinking about this a lot in terms of trans identities we have known about. Hr t the hormone regimen that a lot of binary trans people including myself take to sort of make them have the appearance more of the the their gender rather than the when they were assigned at birth. And we've known about that for millennia but for trans people you kind of have to stumble across the knowledge online that there is this thing there is pill you can take. That will make you yourself. And like i was lucky enough to have the internet to be able to find it. I've been doing a lot of research for a project on trans women in seventies eighties nineties and they just kind of had to like go out with a treasure map and be like what am i looking for. A lot of. Didn't find it until they were really really old or you know. They didn't find it and they sort of went off into the space that was called at the time. Cross dressing societies. Unlike a lot of those a lot of those people were suspend. Who enjoyed you know. Basically wearing drag but a lot of them turned out to be translated and that sort of sidelined into that so the internet has been a godsend in that regard. But just imagine the idea that like we could normalize trans identities. Imagine the imagine a world where you are born and you are told. Oh your gender is what you make of it and if you don't feel particularly attached to the one that you have you can you can take pills to make that to fix that when you are of a of an age where you can decide on that. There's a lot of sturman drawing around trans children and like you know but you think about like okay a five year old trans girl literally. She's just not getting her haircut and she's gonna start wearing different clothes and ask people to call her a different name if she quote unquote grows out of it. It will be long before she's in any place to have done anything involving medical assistance. And even then it's probably going to happen when she's eleven or twelve and she starts taking pills to basically block male puberty which will not affect her if she again quote unquote grows out of it and decides to you know. Stop taking those pills later in adolescence. Go through a male puberty but like there's this idea that we don't know ourselves by society at large in society alerts pathologist everybody who's not assist straight white man that is what society at large does. Its whole deal and you talked to anyone. You talk to a person of color. You talk to a woman or trans talked to. Who's on the lgbtq spectrum and they have a story like this they have a story about feeling ashamed of being who they are because that's more our society is not built to accommodate anyone but people who very specific group of people who wrote the united states constitution. Yes that is so true. That is so true. i. I don't know if this is a stretch at all but you know as you were talking. I thought one of my favorite characters in the movie is hunter. The dad played by. Ike barunholtz burn. You know who's the father of sam. The woman played by Gideon adlon you know who is a lesbian in the movie and you know i can picture hundred lakes though. Say that sam's character was trans. I could picture hunter saying the exact same things that he says about her as a lesbian like he's just on the surface he so obnoxious and ridiculous and like dislike caricature of a womanizer but then throughout the movie you realize he is the most not only perceptive One out of the three parents but the most vulnerable and kind to her. You know even though he's his daughter isn't publicly out as a lesbian he's always known and really wants to protect her right to decide when other people know and and and her right to have that experience in a beautiful way and it's one of the most tender things about the movie. I've made lots of mistakes. But the big mistake i let what happen between your mom and i get in the way of harbor leash. Sorry and i hope that we can start over a build up our relationship again because you're my only kid. I'm your dad. Can i tell you something now. Yes yes yes yes. I'm a lesbian. What does your mom think. She doesn't know you told me before you told your mom pick new frank. Okay over girlfriends too nervous. I can't tell them their is. Tell kayla julie best friends stuff you tell people you care about you. You're not going to support you because you're gay. They would support you if you were vampire. They would support you more on the twilight shit. We still twilight definitely not a. Thanks for showing up really. I'm just curious. Lynnwood character of sam watching that and even watching his interaction with her as her dad. Meant for you. I have a relationship with my father anymore. I i don't wanna say it's over forever. You know it could change. He could change but he has refused to acknowledge me. As i am and i feel as far as bars go. Call me. emily us she. Her pronouns is about as low as you can get Everybody else in my life. Who stopped my mother and my father does that people. Who don't i block on twitter. Like i can't even think about that. It's not that it's like foreign to me. I can imagine a girl who single dad said. You're trans cool. We're going to figure that out. I have. I have written that girl into some of my work I can't imagine it for myself. It feels like a like something too hot to touch. I had recently sort of been exploring the idea of telling a story about myself if i had gone through the right puberty. I was still trans. But i had gotten blockers and had started taking pills and i just like i couldn't do it. Couldn't look at it. It was too painful but it was also to unbelievable the women i know. Transition and hood are women who have intense trauma often around parental relationships because their parents often stand in the way of them. I can't look at that idea. I i the the idea. You just presented. I can't look at it even when i write it. You know i desperately desperately wish. It was just the norm. But i tell you what. There's such a pathology such an idea. Like i honestly. I'm thinking about this in terms of the leslie mann character. You have these ideas about what your child is going to be. You have these ideas about what your child is going to do. You have these fantasies of the person your child is going to become. One of my best friends has a five year old daughter and she's watching as her daughter very quickly becomes a different person the one that she thought she had an like. She's cool with that. She's a great mom she's like she's like a rolling with it. But what a what a hard thing to give up on. What hard thing to give up on this idea you. Have you know who your child might have been. I don't. I don't think it's wrong to more than that. I don't think it's wrong degree. That i think it is wrong to get stuck there. I think it is wrong to insist that your version of reality is their version of reality. And i think that's where that's where these relationships breakdown so in conclusion. I wish that might have been there from the movie blockers. Oh but i love that. You said that about leslie. Man's character because where she ends up in the movie is is realizing that she can mourn but she needs to let her daughter go and be herself freight. That's the biggest difference there. So julie's julie's having sex right now while we sorta it's good it's fine right. I mean you have to do that eventually. Right good yeah. They seem like they really like each other. And that's nice. That's a good thing but it's a little scary because would've you doesn't know how to do it right. You know like what if he doesn't know where to put it but he knows right back up there though figuring out because one of the us stay right here and actually one of the things that so powerful about this world that that blockers creates this idealized world and a lot of ways right and was we were talking about the relationship between the parents and their kids. That was definitely not my experience as a teenager. I don't know a lot of people who had experiences like this. It's definitely an idealized world. It reminds me so much of What dan levy did you. Did you watch shits creek. I knew you were gonna say shits creek. I have seen shits creek. Yes well. I know in a lot of interviews when people ask him why. There's not a phobia or um you know. A lot of the phobias. That transpeople and lgbtq people face in general in the shit's creek universe and he talks about the fact that he intentionally didn't want to do that right. It was wanting to show what was possible. If that wasn't a an issue that we even think about. And i watched this movie. And in a similar vein. I'm like this is the way i wish things were. I'm entirely convinced that it is. But it's what i wish for for all of us that we could get past summit of the hang ups and the misogyny and these issues we have around sexuality. I think a lot about when i was a kid. And i'm sure you can relate to this like there were. We had this distrust of hollywood distrust of the liberal media. Or whatever and what i've come to realize is that like movies especially. Tv shows to some extent but movies especially are powerful vehicle for moral instruction. You see a movie like blockers which presents a world in which parents don't freak out too much about their daughters having sex as long as they know their daughters are being safe and are you know having a positive experience in consensual experience about consistent. Yes all of these things that we increasingly are like. Yes yes yes. We want that for our sexual encounters. If you have a movie where they're not freaking out about it that removes this this thing. That is like an important element of control of of of teenage girls in spaces or people who think their teenage girls. Who will later. Have other realizations about that. And i really Struggle with the idea of moral instruction as a primary reason to tell the story what you were when you were talking about this. The thing i thought about was the star trek shows star trek takes place in a world in which you know. Yeah like diversity is just sort of accepted. Women are in positions of power. People of color in position. Is it just exists. I've been watching deep space nine. Which is my favorite track. And for some reason. I really loved the character who had been a man and then became a woman when i was a kid. I don't know that was all about him. Obviously it was presented very ninety s like trek terms. But there's there's a powerful metaphor there. I latched onto but yeah i've been thinking about like one of the reasons you can get away with that in the star. Trek show is because the conflict is always coming to them. It some alien. They've never met before it's some planet they've been to before the wormhole opens up and somebody comes through it and so on and so forth but you can at the same time built this society of people who care for each other regardless whatever and their differences are are accepted and celebrated and like that can be beautiful too. So ice is trouble with this. Because i don't think art should exist to tell us what to do. I don't think art should exist to tell us what's right morally. But i also think that we are coming out of an era in which almost all of our art for forty years all of the art. That people really latched onto for forty. Some years was like we gotta see what's greedy and realistic. We got undercut this. We gotta talk about the way people really are and suggested that people were all greedy and avaricious and we know that's not true but we kind of built a world based around that. I don't want to say you know the sopranos led to the rise of donald trump. Because i don't think that's true. But i think we need to examine that a little bit more thoroughly. How does the art we create create the world we live in. I don't. I used to think not at all i increasingly. I'm like you know what. I came out because i saw sex comedy at the time. Thinking anything can happen. I love you drop. Julie often kelly and then you. Us come right back home and take care of my mom you too okay. You will We we did it did it julie. I must've been accidentally added to the the group conversation. Oh i can't believe are now through reagan agai- top lid af. It's not great. No it's they're going to get literature african literature. You think that's what you're talking about links trees sales training. We'd i told you that. Mushrooms kills algae. That's cleared its not clear it in look snowflakes. That's blow hashtag. No parents no rules. Hashtag drugs hashtag no condoms. Why would they hashtag that. Let's get in the car. I'm sitting behind you. We love you guys. Don't worry you guys were so great on. It was coming right now. That's why also my last question for you and this is something that you've already gotten to persistently throughout this conversation but i'm just curious how you'd answer it in this way. You know one of the things that. I love about watching movies over and over again. When they're good is i'd always feel like the more. I watched them no more. I learn grow and grow together alongside the movie. I'm just curious for you because of the fact that you saw this before you came out as a trans woman publicly and And presumably watched it. Since like how you've together how you blockers have continued to grow together. I think i've only seen this movie one time. Since you know. I saw it on cable at some point i saw part of it. I didn't see all of. I saw part of it on cable and i wash. I was like this is still a very charming movie. It didn't hit me with the same way. Because i was out. You know i was out. I was already on hormones. this is fun. This is a fun movie and like that was kind of all it was and there are certain. Movies are certain works of art. You need leave frozen when you encountered them because they get trapped in that time There's this tv show. Transparent which is about. A character played by jeffrey. Tambor boo hiss. Who comes out as a trans woman to her adult children. And i saw that in two thousand fourteen and it was immensely powerful and meaningful to me. And then i re watched some of it and twenty nineteen when i was out and i was like you know what i don't need this anymore. This is this is a thing that got me where i needed to go. And now it's kinda stuck where it is and i think that's okay. I think the movies that changes the tv shows that change us the the we consume that. Make us the people we are. We often leave them behind to bring this full circle. We have to leave our parents behind. You probably always loved them. You probably always care about them. They probably always love you. They probably always care about you. But you have to go off and live your life can change. You can shape you and then not necessarily be thing you need later in some ways because you've been shaped by it because you have been changed by. Maybe you don't need it later. Blockers was immensely important to me. When i saw that night in march two thousand eighteen and all started crying at this sex comedy. Everybody else was laughing at. Because i saw so desperately the life i should have led but now i'm leading that life. I don't need to be reminded that it could have existed. Because i'm there. Emily vendor wharf is the critic large vox. She was the first tv editor of the av club and the first culture editor of vox. Her work has also appeared in los angeles times grantland and the baffler point grey pictures. Dmz entertainment hurwitz and schlossberg productions and good universe produce blockers and the clips. He heard in this episode are credited entirely to them. The songs you heard in this episode worth the breeze by dr dog courtesy of park the van records and good as hell by lizardo courtesy of nice life recording company and atlantic recording corporation. Next time on this movie changed me. I'll be talking to you about selena. Or selena if you're a spanish speaker you've got a week to watch it before our next conversation. Bbdo bum bum. The team behind. This movie changed. Me is shrieking. Chris eagle eddie. Gonzalez lillian. Vo christiaan mortell tony lou and kristen. Lynn this podcast is produced by studios which is located on dakota land and we also produce. Podcasts you might enjoy like on. Being with krista tippett poetry unbound and becoming wise find those wherever you like to listen or visit us at on being dot org to find out more. I'm only percy and here's to the self-healing therapy time travelling power of movies for our past and future selves. This podcast is produced by studios in minneapolis men so.

katherine newton john cena julie seth rogan lily percy k kannan emojis pat twenty Emily vander salami tommy dick gideon adlon adleman Sam sam lockwood brad markowski seth brogan shits creek Connor aldridge leslie mann leslie mann lisa
A Christmas Carol with Emily VanDerWerff

Blank Check with Griffin & David

2:35:27 hr | 9 months ago

A Christmas Carol with Emily VanDerWerff

"Right right and you don't know what to say on the first day christmas. My true love sent to me up. Podcast in a pod tree on the second day of christmas. My true love sent to me to podcast. Dobbs podcast in a pod free. Ah did this to myself on day. Love said three podcast to podcast doves and a podcast in a pod tree. I this song does do with a christmas. carol righteous. Just checking on care camera. christmas. Carol cast three podcast to podcast. Avs way staying a pod tree so you turn into podcasts. Or you can always my true love sent to me. Faa odd cast three podcast tool podcasts doves and podcast in a pod tree. This is why you guys are the in the lead for the peabody this year right like this. This is the reason team is no longer in our sights. we want the peabody on the stakes. Assamese my true love sent to me. Six pods a casting. Faa cast all our podcast. A movie cast-offs decibel odd cast in tree. Do win peabody awards. They have a whole category for you. Should submit to the peabody's submissions episode of christmas. Making no right now and to mid to peabody seven podcasting six odds casting five cast four hour a great well. The harnett harmonies swans swimming. Which i believe you put as pods casting. Is that right and we got to eight. Excuse me we got. We got eight milk which you put as a podcasting right. No actually david. I'm sorry that was a visit from the ghost of bits future. I hadn't gone to christmas. My true love sent to me a pod casting seven pods a casting. Six pods are casting five casts for offices off tree. You hello everybody and welcome to ho ho ho merry blank. Check good good. This is appropriate. I was going to say. This is our last episode before christmas but it is and it's two weeks before christmas right. It's december thirteen so this season as they say tis the season to be casting. I mean you gotta you gotta get flight in before christmas. Like that's important flight. Right flight will be our actual christmas episode. We're landing the fly right before. Christmas are planned for the time. Being tentatively is to roll it. I should mention that we're gonna fight. Isn't that a reference to flight. Yeah i feel like we're gonna roll it. For a brief period of time was up there with the duly appointed federal marshalls. And we're gonna get over on all these guys. It's got to be the best. We're going to kill. It was a pretty major trailer line for a little bit. If you saw any movie in like two thousand twelve you heard you're gonna we're gonna roll it. Yeah but the answer is. David is mortified planes. Any he probably covered is every time the trailer. Yeah i mean. I know that the plane is upside down or something wrong right right and i know goodman is involved and they're in maybe in congress or something some sort of hearing at some point. That's all i really know. Look you're going to see the movie very soon. It's the next episode. we're recording obviously. And i don't want to spoil anything for you. But i just want to say the movie might finally answer whether or not john goodman's character has sympathy for the devil. I'm trying to be as oblique here as possible but the movie might provide an answer as to what it might be pretty clear yes. I'll go in with that now. I have no idea when i when i was here to talk about allison wonderland. We talked about planes. A lot and flight is part of the planes expanded universe so bryan talked about the pixar pixar disney tunes like the disney planes planes fire. Its planes than planes fire and rescue and then planes. We're going to roll it aka flight. It was retitled flight. In america in europe it was released as planes colin earl. They should bring back planes put selling. We can't talk about planes again ways. We already did a planes. But we gotta we gotta flex our muscles. We gotta do something new here. If if they told me that sully played a plane in planes three. I i would. I ask you not only that. I see it in theaters during cova go to a public screening during cove it if they were like surprise third plane movie and sally has one seem just. I just brought up airplanes. So i couldn't open the door. To crack and dangle a little sign that said sully through the door and see if you took performed marvelously. Thank you boys. We're pretty easy marks. I would say yeah free. By this point. People will have heard our castaway episode where nia dacosta in real time. It tries to interrogate us. Whether or not the sully thing is a bit the way our read it has been trying to do for the last five years. That movie is very good. It is not a bit a bit. I swear to god. It's a great movie. She did she also goes in on. Clint eastwood's whole concrete and fluorescent lighting. Two thousand but whatever your wrong roles but this is a holiday episode of blank check. Podcast alpha margrethe's directors who have massive success early on in their career and are given a series of blank checks makeover crazy passionate projects they want. And sometimes those checks clear and sometimes ho ho ho. They bounce baby. This is a mini series on the films of robert zemeckis bob easy and today. We're talking about A christmas movie. Christmas carol the movie that forced him into retirement as mo cap filmmaker. Did he admit that did he say like okay. I took it as far as 'coco or what did he say like. They cost too much money and they stopped even do it david. We're going to get into it. Because i think there's an element here that you're forgetting but we will unpack it our guest today shirt. Guess intrusive popular demand. I should make it clear. She is always a much demanded guest for appearances by our listeners. But in this case as demanded by herself to columbus this movie we in an early episode of this series fucker. We gonna do. We're gonna be so burn out on these things by that point. Who wants to talk about that and zooms right in the inbox email. It took many months for me to actually respond to yes I thought i had suspended someone i was like. Oh well it won't happen but you know here's a here's what happened. I've gotten to a point where i can no longer distinguish between things i've done and things. I thought about doing their true for all of us. I lie in bed every night. And i go have. I not brush my teeth or have. I done it three times in the last ten minutes and i don't know and sometimes i get up and do it a fourth time and sometimes i don't do it at all. Emily vander warf the great from. Vox from the national championships. Two thousand eighteen. I want when you one that was years ago Yeah yeah thank you so much so good to be here. I go hence self-proclaimed christmas fanatic. That's the key detail around here. As i opened up of christmas budweiser. It's it's a late night. wow good. it's a boring movie. I felt like it was time to drink some christmas pod on mike got a christmas green tea right here. My friend how can okay. I got christmas. But but emily your big christmas fan. And you're a big christmas. Carol fan correct. yes yes. I feel as though me appearing on a christmas edition of blank check is like the prophecy somewhere like somewhere in like a temple somewhere. There's a man who's like saying. Oh he saw this drop into in spotify feeding says oh prepare the heralds because like he's just fucking ready for it but yeah i love this. I love this story. I love christmas as david can attest going back many years. So yeah i'm so happy to be here and so happy to be talking about one of the ugliest movies ever made i. It's true this is the headline for me because we will. We've watched two of these uglies. Three of these uglies in a row. What you're about to say. I think i think you're going gonna say i agree. I don't know if i'm gonna say what you think. I'm about to say my point is we. We've been bumping uglies three weeks in a row right straight uglies in in this in this run you thought i was about to say this is the best looking of the three no because they bagels the best looking of the three right. I thought you were about to say this is the worst looking of the three and i agree to mice astonishment i think polar expresses the worst of the three but but it is a stahnke. Movie is so boring. That matt quality overrules how ugly looking at it like we kinda like beowulf like but of course you have to admit this thing looks like garbage. We eat polar more like and of course it has to be admitted. A huge part of that is that it looks like garbage. And this i could talk for two hours about how boring it is before i really start. Impacting our weekly. Yeah i i think the polar express a train. A train looks better in this. Because it's metal. I think. I think there's a world geared towards metal max's cab movie should've been about nedal people and things and it's just when you bring skin into the game you're in trouble and that's why i will pick polar express over christmas carol both as a movie and does a thing to look at anyway. I'll say this too. I mean obviously polar express is working with earlier stages of technology. it's it's at a disadvantage in that way. But from a design standpoint polar expresses a thousand percent more aesthetically pleasing than this movie and polar express's not aesthetically pleasing moving. This is true emily. I've known him for twenty years. You've you've done the math in your head. But i basically known new for twenty years. This is true. Yes do you remember. What the oscar season was when the two of you. I would say on the message. Boards know probably. The return of the king sees was returned to the king was the king. I came in and made a big splash with my a winged migration signature. My message we're all in on winged migration. That's right i. it said f. We see the goose best supporting actor trying to make an impression and Yeah i was like david. You're so cool and you're like i'm just some i was like. Oh he's just some fifteen year old kid that's cool dean year old on an oscar. Message board emily. This is also bore out that you have discovered a lot of our friends but people who have become credible writers at different outlets across the land. You had a real eye for talent. You know recognizing young people on message boards who had the passion and the skill set and like giving them their first jobs. You know falls in that category as well now pilots seraya. Emily i you know these are people who i like tumblers and i just was like. This is a good tumbler. And at the time no like nobody was was hiring women for these jobs and i saw the av club just had a whole bunch of women and it turned out i was a woman and then we had david so that was great now. Work at the land of culture section which is neat women and man's been but also i mean if you if you hadn't extended opportunities to so many people this podcast without exists. Sure that's david no. We wouldn't have had any guests who who are to what our guests pool have been. This is true. have you been on oscar. watch lately. I know it has a new name now. It's it's had like many names. I haven't. I haven't in a long time until just i'm sorry to start on this really arcane ship. Whatever we have. I i watched the film hillbilly elegy. I was to Which is not a good movie. And this point it's come out and i imagine it's been mostly savaged by critics and whatever you know it's out there and i didn't review it but i did fu foolishly. I will say just sort of out of boredom. Put it like the bottom of my twenty twenty list on letterbox. Just joke or maybe not like bottom bottom but like right at the right at the bottom right. Is that makes you guys know what i'm talking about and Andy scott shouted. Indy who emily knows my old roommate and another oscar watcher emailed me and was like you have like lit a torch on the on the message. Oskar watch awards daily. Whatever it's called now and it has exploded like people who like david sems. Put it up. There about. This thing is going to be a catastrophe. And apparently there's amy adams stands and they're freaking out so that's that's the update. I got from the message boards. But how long ago was that. I feel like the word has been out with re this sick for a little while. Now i mean whenever i saw it. When would that have been. Let's see now. I can look at my dire. You know some in november right. It wasn't like it's a bad movie. A you know what. It was all the way back in october okay. They gave it to me really early. It's worse than christmas. Carol hillbilly algae. It's worse than a christmas carol. There's no question. It's working way worse. Material to be finished christmas carol. You're working dick tracy interesting question. Let's dig into this. Which do we think is a better original tax charles. Dickens christmas tale a story that has endured for centuries as lost zero potency. There's a reason we keep on returning to it. Basically helped invent the ghost story or eighty is cheap. Hackery the you'll billy elegy it's i it's tight. I don't wanna. I don't wanna put my foot down for either and then you have this win. Do you think some is going to do the mo cap hillbilly elegy. You can be told over and over again. I think have to make it medal. And he needs to make every character a terminator. It'll work. There's a terminator monarch sounds good which refers to good bad and neutral terminators. And there's no such thing as usual terminators. i don't know what she's talking about. They're very sort of good bad. They they really kind of an on off switch kind of issues me. There's good bad and there's terminator three rise of the machines. Wear character has a slight malfunction. And sometimes he turns bad briefly. But he's not really neutral. Interest neutral. fundamentally does best. the real. Arnold schwarzenegger is something of a neutral at this point. But let's not. Let's not get into the point. I wanted to make us place emily. I have known you for twenty years. And i've always known you as someone who loves christmas since the beginning it's been big partyer brand love of christmas. Yeah we once cooked up. A santa clause show together which a santa claus tv show yup Emily asked me to pitch. Like was it a sitcom or you know like there was this. Yeah weekly sitcom about santa. Can i can i can. I can remember the exact premise that you came up with because it was very good. Tell me probably do it better than i did. This was at the height of my name is earl David pointed to. My name is earl and said we need to show that there's like a like a concrete goal so it was about santa on the other three hundred and sixty four days of the year it was three hundred and sixty four episodes. Each one was A new day in here of santa between christmas eve and the show was called. This is long. Before keeping up with the kardashians it was called keeping up with the clauses. So david invented keeping up with the kardashians. The only other thing i remember is that santa has a new wife because santa is immortal but i decided to his wives are not that he's like harvey our mother like they die and then he just gets a new one right. This is true. And so i was because i thought it'd be funny like a sitcom it's like santa would be like a fat guy with a beard and he would have this like improbably attractive. You know twenty eight year. Old wife played by young ingenue. Who's now stuck on the sitcom. But like they'd he'd still love her. You know it would be. It would be tender. It's just that you would have the anyway. I thought that was funny. It's funny that that was a trend for a little bit the like. Here's the premise of our show. Hard and not that of course talking about my name is earl david that premises evergreen. We'll never get tired of that premise. But the way to the show is literally like crossing items off a list there's a built-in ending for. And the ending is only a scant one hundred eighty episodes away. Those roman says where it was like. Here's what we have to end at this point and that point is nine seasons. I figured i'm actually going to figure out again. How long Keeping up with the clauses would run and it's sixteen and a half seasons so that's like how long need to keep more of the closet. Cell will be in syndication forever. you'll make millions that's be talking to. Abc two thousand five or. Is there a talking reindeer. Oh yeah that's a great idea yes. There has to be a talking about tackle tweet. Rudolph i almost made david fit take. I was so close swallowed. Remember how my name is. Earl was a huge hit like and like the office was it was like eating the office for breakfast on that thursday block and then he kind of got sick of it. I don't know there's a super weird phenomenon of single camera sitcoms from the late two thousands early two times where they debut huge. They're big for thirteen episodes. And then people just inexplicably stop watching the new girls another example i was gonna say the last one one of those were when it started. I was like oh. This is like the biggest comedy on television. This is the new friends and by the end of season. One i was like i guess it's now. Just become a niche thing. Tell me how many seasons new go ran for. Snow ran for seven seven. My name is earl only got four and apparently ended on a cliffhanger that was never resolved because they promised greg garcia that he was going to be able to finish the story the way he wanted and then he was not allowed to finish the story where he wanted. So what is greg garcia doing now. Because he did then he did raising hope which i loved i was. That was a good show raising. Hope he did he did the guestbook right. Very weird show Do not know what that is. But it's a it's a comedy anthology series about the people who sign a guestbook and a vacation property. Each season is a new vacation property. Here i am sitting on a fucking mountain of gold with my santa claus sitcom and people that are like. Let's do a show about guest box like they're just like looking around the room at the ski lodge they're like. Could we do like a table sitcom no. that's ridiculous. Guest books books will do guests books. I forgot grinker. Also did the millers. The cbs sitcom that ran for thirty. Four episodes. We learn at margo martindale blow bridges move gem as nelson franklin sean hayes get passed. It was supposed to be the next big thing and it just didn't happen break. Arcia gregor seems like somebody who always has a show. That seems like it's going to be huge for a little bit. Yeah completely yeah. He did steer. I think yes he did. That was his thing. And then you came from yesteryear yes but like my name is earl was like look i know i created yesteryear but this is my actual sensibility. Remember there was such a press tour of him being like. But that's not the kind of show. I grew up watching this is my actual interest and made himself sort of like the more quirky guy. I also feel like in my my ten years of doing pilots season or whatever almost every season. there's a big greg garcia pilot at cbs. That's like the coal one. That then doesn't get picked up several times. He has the show. That's really hyped up. Everyone's fighting to get cast and it doesn't go and they bring it back the next season and try it again and it still doesn't go. Yeah and the premise is always like what if a middle schooler was a superhero but also nurse and you're just like i wanted to be in that one so badly rising super clyde. Oh i want it to be in that one. I have two more things to say about greg garcia and then we can talk about a christmas carol one or or or whatever you talk about clean greg gerski two thousand eight alec baldwin accused him of being a scientologist because jason lee's one like i don't think he had anything more and greg. I'm not a scientologist like you had to issue. A statement is like. I'm like a catholic too. He did the book to a musical escape to margarite ville. Which was the jimmy. Young box musical. That think ever made it. No i guess at every apartment they believe. I believe they extended the run of escape to margarito in los angeles. Which rarely happens here because you know not a huge theater town. But big escaped margarita. Billtown garrett had town. Yeah i almost wonder if it was like built into the budget of escape from argue rita velvet opening broadway. It was a loss leader. Just to get the prestige of a played on broadway. Because it's like you have to imagine the ultimate life of that show is on cruise ships. You know right. David yes i don't know about you but in my case it's beginning to feel a lot like stamp mess Okay stamp miss. That's true that's true. You know the beginning to feel a lot like stamp stampedes. Because this year the holiday seasons are all going to be about the mail. Am i right yes you're right. I'm sorry i'm so sorry you're totally right. The thing is people are mailing stuff a lot because it's the holiday season the post offices busy. You wanna get your presence out to everyone safely and happily wanted deliver those presents in hand in person. That's not what we should be doing. No you want to stay home. You want to just print out a little label except the postal care. Pick it up from you and send it off your loved. Exactly what stamps dot com. Anything you can do at the post office you can just do. With a few clicks plus stamps dot com saves you money with deep discounts. You can't even get at the post office. What talking discount. They've and they've bringing the services of the us postal service and ups right to your computer. It's a must have for any business. So maybe you're sending out invoices. Maybe you're an online seller who's fulfilling orders in this record setting holiday season. Maybe your giant warehouse sitting up thousands of packages a day. Stamps can handle. maybe yup. Maybe you're a member of the mug of the month club. Whatever floats your boat all you have to do is use your computer to print official. Us postage twenty four seven for any letter any package any class of male anywhere you want to send once you're ready schedule a pickup or drop it off. It's as simple data and look you're going to get five cents off every first class stamp. You're gonna get forty percents off priority mail. You're going to get up to sixty two percent of ups shipping rates and it's a fraction of the cost of those expensive postage meters. It's a no brainer. Save time and money. It's no wonder that nine hundred thousand small businesses already used stamps dot com. Now it's not a wonder. Don't accuse them of being a jacob tremblay there no wonder no wonder exactly. Don't spend a minute of your holiday season at the post office this year. Sign up for stamps dot com instead. There's no risk because with our promo code check you get a special offer that includes a four week trial plus free postseason digital scale. There's no long term commitments to contracts. You just go to stamps. Dot com click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and type in check. Stamps dot com enter check. Stamps dot com. Never go to the post office again in the name of equality i should say. I wanna wish all of our listeners. Happy stamp stamped mccoy as well. Happy standpoint of course. Here's a line of questioning. I wanna get into emily because we start digging into this a little bit on our polar express episode where The sims grew up San's christmas largely and in our contact episode. We talked about like our relationships to faith and religion. A lot and most of us grew up pretty a religious grew up with a sort of very perfunctory judaism. My parents being like. I guess we should teach our children that stuff but they had completely abandoned that pretty much by the time. My sister was around But you you had a very religious upbringing. And you've written a lot about your relationship to that as time has gone on and how it's changed and morphed and all of that and so i want to know sort of wear. Christmas fits into all of that. How much value. Christmas has for you. is tied to the religious traditions of it. How much of it is tied to what is still find very effective at christmas which is essentially just like movie christmas. Like i fucking love movie. Christmas and lights in new york and food with weird wrappings and things like that. Yeah yeah You know. It's interesting. Because i grew up doing kind of the secular christmas but mostly very religious christmas when i was three. My mom took me aside and said there is no santa claus but also your dad is santa claus and i was like oh cool. That's awesome good for santa claus on them which she was saying. You know because like when gift from. That's actually from your dad. But i threes on an entirely understand that But yeah i grew up with super religious I remember very specifically. There was a christmas service at my church that ended with the pastor being like and we have this recording of hell that i'm going to play for you now young because we got a microphone and this is this is. This is a fame story. In evangelical christian circles set. A bunch of soviet scientists dug a hole to the center of this story embraced weiner god this hard core of eight. They genuinely presented it as like a scientific breakthrough. We finally captured audio of hal. We've audio health and it's on the internet. If you wanna go look for it. Sounds like a mall food courts. Slow way it's emily. I'm just gonna stop you for a second. Benz looking particularly despondent. It's because he had been working on trying to create the first ditch. Podcast thought he was going to be the first person to stick a microphone. A dirt hole and just recorded for two hours and so set is a big this major hit for him i will. I will say that the whole that they actually doug that which was a forty thousand foot hole was called the the cola super deep borehole which is pretty. Good name. And it really. It was like an experiment of like what happens. If we just dig really. Just you give you give people fodder for stories about having recordings of health. So yeah we go to church and it would be like in their teaching children about santa claus and like that would be presented as like. We were losing jesus from the senate the season or whatever and then you know i went off to college and eventually moved to california and i really really started to miss winter like i missed snow. I missed i missed really. What i missed was new york christmas which i had not experienced to that point but like now have emily now who've been several times and i'm like oh this is the ideal city for christmas. Los angeles is kind of depressing. Because they do this thing at the grove which is our big shopping mall. That's like they just send foam into the air and it's supposed to be smell. And i took my wife to that and she was just hung tollway back because it's so disturbing and gross The first year we were in california somebody on christmas eve like we've gone up to the mountains and gotten a giant pile of snow and just put it in the parking lot of our apartment complex and that felt like you know like christmas to me so i started to get more into secular christmas music. Christmas bullshit basically and watching every christmas movie. Every christmas special i could find and that sort of became a weird obsession. So that's why. I'm here. But but i like i'm very much all in on all of that stuff and i grew up with christmas being devoid of any religious meaning but i also grew up in new york or christmas feels very romantic. Lou just like christmas flavored things and christmas albums christmas movies and specials get very caught up in it. I will feel very depressed going through this christmas without there being like the the christmas eve vibe in the same way aside from the fact i'm probably celebrate anything with my family. It's also just like things like that. The outdoor sort of like marketed unions. Royal filler center. The rockefeller center snake bandits. Wet bandit stuff like this. Have you seen this rockefeller center tree. The little boys isn't a metaphor for twenty. Twenty twenty was. A tree fell three wearing a face mask. Is that what they did now. It just looks really shitty dream really get a whole process where they like you know. There's people grow big trees and he saw. They showed the picture of it when they cut it down. And it's literally the how it started how it's going me. Applies twenty twenty like because it was beautiful when they cut it down announced just like all crap so i just looked at the phone i. My immediate thought was the the tree guy couldn't get out of bed either. i do. I get it major feeling that the first time i was ever on this show was because it was the christmas. Two thousand sixteen and i went to new york specifically because i was like well. They're maverick. there may never be another christmas. So i better convict york and have one maurismo's there and we made it sort of made it. We made it. Wow we'll talk about full full circle so so you love you love chris media. I do as well. I feel like. I'm such as sap for christmas. That even stuff i am cynical about usually activates me in some way and i honestly feel like polar express and a christmas. Carol disney's a christmas. Carol might be two of the only crescent movies. I've ever seen that stern no feelings of christmas. Cheer and me i will. I'll even say this. I agree with that. I ended up hearing. I made this gigantic christmas playlist on spotify that i mean this gigantic christmas playlist on spotify. That anyone could contribute to and somebody put sylvestry. Is christmas carol score on there. And i just heard it. San's the movie was like this is great. This is great christmas music and in the movie it just gets buried by whatever the hell is going on. Make all euro impulsion score. It's totally as you say. The fine work on its own Yeah this is this is just a. I watched a few years ago like every version of christmas. Carol i could get my hands on and this is by far one of the worst. Which has this story is really hard to screw up like the reason that it's boring is because the underlying stories always pretty. Good but yeah. Do you have a go to pick for what you think. The best adaptation is or the at the top. Oh griffin do i. i'm fishing. I learn my favorite is the This actually has meccas connection. It's the nineteen seventy-one animated version by richard williams. Who did the animation for who framed roger. Rabbit it is done in the style of the woodcut engravings from dickens original book it's gorgeous. It's on youtube even in like three sixty or whatever it is. It's just gorgeous to look at beautiful. He won an oscar for it. I love the alistair christmas carol. There's some there's some really good ones but my favorite by far the one. I watch every year is that nineteen seventy-one version that that one is really good. Alastair sim also played scrooge in it right. he's doing your classic scrooge. He is he's the he's he is screw. Try ask that he played scrooge a bunch and yeah the mafia christmas carol definitely my first experience of christmas. Carol i would imagine my i was. I was mickey's. And i think i saw mickey s mine was also mickey's identity. Saw that when i was guest. That's that make you. One was big. Am i mistaken in thinking that it was released in theaters alongside one of the re releases of disney classic and then it became just like a blockbuster vhs. well let's. i saw it. I do my very first time going to the movies. I saw mickey's christmas. Carol with the rescuers air we go caters yes. It was put with the rescuers and then just became a tv right. But that one's really good too. I mean yeah it speaks to just the potency of this story that lake not only are most adaptations of it at least enjoyable but also the inevitable like tv episode. Parodies of it are usually pretty good. It is pretty hard to fuck up this format. We never get tired of it. And they're i don't know. I feel like there was something slightly exciting about the announcement of this movie just because it felt like That might be in zemeckis. Wheelhouse men aside from the mo cap. He doesn't have any big story hook. He's not trying to put it in a contemporary setting me. He's not trying to radicalize. Anyway his argument is using this technology to try to make the most faithful adaptation of the book in a way that technology could not allow up until this point which in a way. He succeeded out because of the book. Does that sequence rarely committed to fillmore scrooges chased by a hearse being driven by the goes for christmas future and then like has to escape it and turns into a tiny man goes into a tube and whole bunch of stuff happens. It's in the book nobody's ever put it on film register joke in their christmas pudding. Which book has people will realize that. The book has forty five pages of tiny scrooge hanging onto an empty bottle getting down the streets and rooftops. Ooh it does. It does bring in. Things are from the book that i guess no the thing where he puts out for christmas past guy as a candle that is in the book. Yeah i don't know you're you're reading the book and you're like god that's so great we got include. You know what i mean like. It's just a weird image. And damascus is like yeah. That'll going to be a whole setpiece. We're going to blow that out there so there's stuff that's in the book that he could have dumped put in the movie that would have padded things out in an interesting way like the screw ghost of christmas present. Go on a journey where they visit miners and sailors and like people who are celebrating christmas out in the wilds of britain. And like that is a nice little sequence. In the richard williams. One it's just you know it could have been good here too so it's very odd that this film is a completely lacking in. Humor is like presi single. Most humorless adaptation. I have ever seen this story and be excuse. Me is also weirdly lacking in feeling. Yeah yeah. It has not a lot of emotion and break. This is about a person's emotional transformation. Like that's what a christmas carol is about. So that's a problem and heard. I mean that breeds you at the beginning where he says children should go to jail. Sure but i also poverty. I feel like you got some fundamental issues. If i'm watching a christmas. Carol and when tiny tim shows up for the fourth time i go oh right tiny. Tim very tiny. Tim's in the movie. The other i would say the issue griffin is referring to is that this is jim carey famously. Funny man is line on jokes light on humor. There's a light on character comedy. Like if you is pointedly trying to avoid finding any comedic angle to the four characters. He plays which is remarkable because scrooge is already a comedic character a rich man and then the ghosts are you can go any direction with them and like the idea of having him play. These ghost is actually pretty smart and like the kind of thing mokaba was made to do. But they don't do anything with it. It's one of these strongest arguments for mo cap. Is that kind of like. Oh it's like a digital kind of man of thousand faces thing you can have one guy play a whole cast of characters himself. Have that the more natural sort of acting pipeline and. Yeah it's like it's not like that's like part of the text in the way that like the data and hooker usually double cast and peter pan but it feels kind of natural in that same sort of way their reflections of scrooge it makes sense it's a medically appropriate. I mean the the ghost of marley is his guilt. That goes to christmas past. it's his regret. The ghost of christmas present is his his loneliness in the ghost of christmas future. His fear like it works it. Just you know they don't. They don't bother like explaining why they're doing it or at least just having like jim carrey make fart noises when he's a giant man like that would be cool. It is odd to watch a modern adaptation of a classical work and be like man. I wish he was like breaking scene to teach someone how to dougie. I wish there were more like when she was like. Do not go in there. If we do something motherfucker at the end as we will talk about regulating when he's happy scrooge he's finally it feels like riffing a little bit like doing some carries stuff a thin gruel. It's i will say this. I will say this. I think christmas carols. I can't think of another thing that is so frequently adapted where we talk about the how it's adopted in terms of who plays scrooge instead of who directed it it's dallas or sim christmas carols patrick stewart christmas carols. The george c scott christmas carol. Whatever and you know like this is the only one where it's like. Yeah that's a-m-a-c. Christmas ballots partially because us is such a big deal. And it's personally because jim carey leaves absolutely no impression because this absolutely should be jim. Carey christmas carol. You have to imagine that why disney pulled the trigger so hard on this thing back up a little bit to just do a little bit of table setting because this is like a byproduct product of i think a really interesting kind of five year period. Walt disney studios where they're in this transition zone. It sort of the jump between eisner being ousted and idir fully dominating the motion picture landscape before they start acquiring everything. Just become. You know the owners of all ip. But i know like you know their animation. Studio is still on the rocks. They're in the process of rebuilding. Pixar had just been acquired by them so two thousand nine. The last three pixar movies had been up wildly three movies. That picks are produced independently. So like disney's influence on pixar won't come into effect until next year with toy story three bolt is. I think the year before this tangled is the year after this. That's really when disney animation is kind of up on its feet. The pirates of the caribbean series perhaps tapped out at this point they revive it again but at this point it was like maybe that's three and done. I think there was a major awareness on their part that they did not have boys brands. That was always sort of talked about that. They like they were trying to retool the disney princess strength in a modern way aside from just the legacy characters on sleeping bags but they were like we need boys things so tron legacy happens in principle. happens Lone ranger happens and outrageous budget. But there are just like taking big bets on trusted names for things where it's like. Is that an old franchise that may be has enough coal to peel. Are these people who have been good with us in the past or be able to make something. New allison wonderland comes out five months after this and is like a humongous hit that i feel like really starts to mark. Like the transitional point that movie very much feels like it came out of we want to be in business with big talent. We wanna get burton back in the fold. We wanna come up with a new take on awesome wonderland but what stems out of that obviously is. Just let's remake all of our legacy titles. Let's just get more Literal about putting these things into live action But but this is like the end of dick cooks run and it felt like he was really starting to experiment and there was a story. I remember reading on like ena cooler. Whatever you know seven or eight about like the big upfront meeting. They had for their shareholders where they were like announcing in show enough concept art for the next three years of their big movies and it was the kind of thing that gets livestream now and people lose their minds over because we now all like watching shareholder presentations as content but back then it was like a thing that didn't leak out. There were just weird written reports of it and these guys coming out in like selling their pitch and zemeckis came out and pitched the christmas carol thing and showed off the artwork. The concept art work and was just like look first of all jim. Carey is the ultimate mo cap actor. Think about what. We're starting to work on face. I tell you. Jim carey and mo cap playing multiple characters. Already dollar signs in the is right. Then i go. Jim is scrooge. You should get aunt. That feels like a great part for him and the other characters he's playing are the ghost and people are losing their minds and he's like and by the way i have a pretty good track record when it comes to time travel movies in house down and people were salivating and they were like yes yes and he was like polar express remember that shit. They still release it in every year. Another ten million dollars and people are like fucking like arsenio wolf hollering. You can see how on paper even though now it feels like a kind of risky bet because everything has been so algorithms and you so rarely get a movie that isn't from very specific. Well established pipeline coming out at disney. This does kind of check off all the boxes where you have to imagine disney. Maybe regrets that they didn't do polar express that this technology seems like it's not going anywhere although it ends up mutating after this into a pretty different form the straight mo cap movie pretty much ends after this save for tinton And also like jim carey want to be in business with much like they had done bedtime stories that they were like. We want to make an am sandler movie. We wanna make these big movie star movies. We want to be in these brand silos. When all your comes on. And it just becomes like we have our four pipelines. That's it all that experimentation goes away another weird thing that canada pitch presentation do either of you remember this that they announced that gill marrow gamble. Del toro was going to be given his own imprint at disney called disney. Double dare you where he was going to get to make live action and animated films at a mid sized budget. That were particularly designed to scare children. Do remember that. I remember that and literally like six months later. He gave some interview ears like that. That never happened. That's not gonna happen. Dick cook fired and everything went out the window. And then you have these vestiges. The leftover movies like christmas carol but there was also so much post hell boy to gear most stuff that never came together like he was the king of announcing shit that sounded cool and would fall apart and then of course harbory being the ultimate version of bet that the first year i went to comecon was two thousand nine and that was christmas carol year and disney was like the first presentation in the big asshole h. Which is where they have all the movie stuff and christmas. Carol at a lot of buzz coming out of that people were like this looks really cool. They the ghosts look great blah blah blah. And like i don't know what they showed. 'cause i assume they showed footage from this film but people were like buzzing about it so i was. I was kinda hyped for this movie. There's another factor replay which is just that three d. was still pretty rash. There weren't a lot of fully three d movies and especially movies like not designed with someone who understands the technology as well as the meccas does. So i just feel like if when people would see a five minutes sizzle. Reel or a trailer of this. You were just kind of so dazzled by like. Oh my god there's so much connectik energy and movement and everything's popping into my face that people be like i guess it looks great. No no. I look like shit. I thought it was a bad idea. At the time i want that on the record i heard the idea and i was like stupid. That was also the first year. They did three presentations in hall h. As the they presented avatar and everyone was like this looks terrible. And i were talking about this movie is what what does it grip six weeks before november six weeks after this movie. They look like they're in different. Decades there are aspects of avatar all ready creaky but jeez louise these films do not feel like they are of the same generation let alone with an a two month span of each other. It's really like cameron is really spankings in terms of like okay. You're you think you're like the sort of pioneering director but like you truly do not know what you're doing with this stuff. I mean i know. He's not doing this aggressively. But that's just how it feels and they do feel like after this links off and you know cuts it out like you know he. He gets tempted back later as we will see. But he's like. I'm going to go make flight. Yeah this is the other part of it. I wanna frame. Is that image. Movers his company. Which sort of become image movers digital and was starting to rebrand itself as like an animation company Did polar stresa warner brothers monster house at sony. Beowulf at paramount. Most of those films were independently financed sold off to distributors. Disney was like we want you. These were the types of acquisitions. They were making rather than buying marvel for billions of dollars. They were like. Can we get a first look. Three picture deal with image movers. Maybe this is the future So it was this film and then two months after this movie three months after this movie mars needs moms comes out and he was arms. He was getting ready to film yellow submarine the weekend. Mars needs moms come. Came out and they literally like pulled the plug. Turn the lights off. Shut everything down. He was ready to go And there's a lot of artwork you can see for that. That looks incredibly strange. He was going to do what was described as a more narrative based yellow submarine such so much it was going to be the worst. It looked so weird. Have you seen the pictures. I've seen him. Oh the picture of the the purple meany and it looks to me like some allison wonderland crap and i hate it it all celebrities early on the one. That really looks like there's a picture of the beatles and they have like bananas yellow submarine proportions where their arms and legs are like twelve feet long and like the width of spaghetti The he's going for less photo realistic with it. Which at least feels like well. That's where you should have been going earlier on but dizzy just bails entirely on the notion of like this being a form of entertainment this being the guy to be in business with. And that's when he totally slings off and apparently retreats to a house and like reassesses his life and then it's like send me good spec scripts let me just read good live action movies. That won't cost much to make. Wasn't i mean you. You know this way. Peter serafinowicz was gonna play. Yeah poll right. Yes yes yeah crazy. I've talked about a lot. They were like really ready to go and he was very excited about it. But he's a really big beatles fan. I think he was just very excited To be playing that part yes. I think it's also worth noting. It wasn't just the mars neat bombs bombed. Although of course that thing bombed but a christmas carol did not make money like even though it was pretty successful at money. Gross sold fucking much break so it was like a hit but a hit at the box office that ended up being a money loser for them and then mars need moms was radioactive. Yea marsden me bombs. It didn't him and like christmas. Carol christmas carols should generate money. But this was so expensive and like you could see disney being like well. We can bring it back every year like they do with. It never happened. It never became movie. So that's the other interesting kind of rabbit hole. I went down here trying to figure out like why disney was so confident about this. The other aspect is in terms of disney. Trying to like check off boxes at this point in time trying to rebuild their world domination and being like we need an action a franchise. We need this. We need that. We need this going. Disney surprisingly doesn't really have like a definitive christmas movie and for an entertainment company as vertically integrated as disney. The value of having a christmas movie. That's going like pop up again in revenue every year. That will always be like replayed on tv. Go up and rentals we release. You can do all the merchandise. And like i feel like they've now kind of squared the circle by being like four christmases. Both that's that's their one right. I mean you're forgetting another film directed three fourths of three fourths of it. Nutcracker in the four rounds so david to this point night cream the four realms is like the one inexplicable disney movie of the last five years. It's probably it's them being like. Yeah can we get a christmas movie. It has to be it. Has to be and even like the santa clause trilogy which is successful for them has not lingered in that same kind of way like you have to imagine disney is like i wish we had an elf. I wish a christmas story. I wish we had a wonderful life. Okay now yeah now. This begs the question. What are the best. what's come on. Emily griffin ben christmas movie. Like come on. What's your christmas movie. Always always it's a wonderful life like i just you know yeah like i. I just can't Top top that one. I think it is interesting that disney purchased twentieth century fox. And like if you go on disney plus christmas sections mostly twentieth century. Fox released home alone okay. Miracles they're really weaponized home alone now. Pushing home alone nostalgia hard. Because i think they're finally. We have one that like people are in the feels about ammo for christmas. It gets murky between two holidays. I mean it's it's same. Obviously the answers from me elf is my favorite modern one mapa christmas carols. Probably my emotional favor. Wonderful life i think is the best Might my secrets dolph answer. Even though it doesn't totally fit but it is a movie set around. Christmas and new year's is hudsucker proxy hudsucker. Proxy is the movie. That feels most like the holidays for me. The moon the movie. That i love even though i know it's total shit but i watch it every year like a lot of people have that relationship with love actually that relationship with the family stone which david you fucking say the fucking family fucking stone yes pieces shit moon s emily this movie. Okay okay just fucking. Were not the only person. Lots of people like that move. Apparently you just can't go wrong. It's just a great cast. Their having i love the giant family assembles at christmas movie. It could be not worse than family shown. And i would still love it. Young families stone is so bad. it's a film. I saw with my grandma at christmas. And i loved and i had the my rachel mcadams crush was at its peak. Yeah it's and she's wearing like a dinosaur junior sure in that movie and she's got classes. I want to note that at this time on the message board. You had a rachel mcadams in wedding crashers signature in your picture. Because you've so. I'll fucking admit it absolutely. I don't remember that. But i believe it. I loved rachel mcadams. They still leverage cans about and me and my fucking grandma walked out of that movie being like. That was kind of disappointing. Like it didn't get me. And i've never seen it since and i keep i'm keeping like should i give it one more shot like people love the families. Don't even though the director i feel like never really had another hit right. That diane lane. Kevin costner movie. That just came out. That's like the person movie in america by default and then he did and the one with a smarter carlos right okay. Someone someone was tweeting. The other day some critical i apologize for not giving credit to but someone was tweeting like. He's this incredibly weird figure because he goes like ten years in between movies and he makes like a low scale exercise and a kind of forgotten genre that slightly better than it needs to be and then just kind of disappears again. I remember when family stone came out or when it was screening there was a movie every year that esteemed internet commentator david poland. Every year would be like this is going to be an oscar player. This is going to win. A bunch of awards family stone was his movie. In two thousand and five and then at the oscars of course a polling curse the polling the polling curse it was. I was all in on those boards at the time. are certainly at least the comment sections on the hop log or as extra would call at the cold blog a savage brutal takedown from lexi. But yes i mean the most infamous one was when he said that phantom of the opera is going to win best picture it was like we have our firm schumacher. When are you doing schumer fucking long athlete year. Joel two stuff. I'd love to cherry pick. Yeah i mean boy. it's long. We've talked we've sort of joked about it or whatever also weird sad ending the last like five. Just stink. your family's okay. So yeah maybe you know what. I'm going to watch the family stone. The everyone's favourite wife swap movie about you know white guilt where parker points at herself to reference race or whatever anyway christmas movies. The people like that new one that happiest season. I haven't seen it yet excited to watch it cute family fives right like i mean right. It is a it is a mediocre family. Get together at christmas movie. Because it doesn't anybody but christian stewart mackenzie davis anything do but it's a. It's a very sweet christmas romcom about two ladies which is right up my alley. I look i. I love home for the holidays personally removing. That's fantastic movie. Yeah yeah which is another. I believe is it. I can't even remember if it's thanksgiving chris. It's christmas. I think thanksgiving thanksgiving it's thanksgiving. That's that's the only problem with it but it's the same. It's the same thematic thing i love. Yeah you know what. I love. Robert downey junior. Who's i love. Kiss kiss bang bang. That's a great christmas movie. Obviously ironman three the iconic movie we love griffin can little side tangent here. This shit pickets litigated every year. Of like what. Is that a christmas movie. As if there is some governing board as if it's like champagne and then let's just show me. I am the governing board. So let's just let me just determined right now name some movies. We'll tell you. Christmas movies like all shame. Black movies a crisis movies litigation there to the degree that i always diehard is a black movie because christmas so prominent. Thank you same here. I always file it in the shame. Black cabinet and she wrote many. Bruce willis movie put a little princess. That's another one. That's that's right. I don't really remember but christmas happened in that movie. Yeah i like a like fanny and alexander is like a christmas because it has gorgeous. Christmas sequence gap thing is and. I don't think i'm telling. Tales out of school. Here is like the christmas movie for me is is fellowship of the ring like not. Even all agree. The war the rings movies. I watch all of them around christmas. Classic classic christmas rewatch. I basically do it every year. I don't always make it to return to the king because just because they're long but fellowship with the ring i think has to be in the cannon emily david and they're like on cable tv. Yeah my parents house i. i'll watch them with commercial. Slake that just the running. Look we're going to let. Emily do the final ruling here but for me that's where it starts to become questionable like when people go like note cards an action movie. It's not a christmas movie. it's like one doesn't negate the christmas. Christmas is interwoven throughout the entire film fellowship of the ring. Your argument is i watch it at christmas time. It feels elves griffin. Come on elves. Christmas yes christmas movies are about like meeting people in your life at hard times right like. That's christmas movies are about right. I let me submit that a movie that becomes a legitimate gigantic phenomenon that changes the film industry. That comes out at christmas. Happens very rarely. Yes can be sort of a christmas movie by proxy like it has to be. It has to be brought to the party by different christmas movie. I would say the three lord of the rings and titanic both fit that criteria so putting putting him in. I'd like to throw it to obvious. Chris picks as well a gremlins pregnancy. The phoebe cates santa claus beach. One of my favorite elements of christmas making ever returns great christmas movie course absolutely absolutely i. Also you have. One has to acknowledge eyes wide shut. Of course a great wonderful christmas movie. Christmas of course trapped in paradise like that's a classic christmas movie produced by ben. Nicholas cage jon lovitz film. I mean we all love that we've never seen the. I think the even more interesting sort of question. Is these movies. that have at christmas eve vibe. But aren't actually about chris. Like the one. I went to the royal tenenbaums which doesn't actually have anything to do with christmas but feels like it takes place at christmas definitely a lot of his movies. I feel like have that because they have a snow globe. Feel to them. Roy attendance especially because it's about family and all that that also brings it in family movies about family often sort of up getting sifted into this box. I just i read. Some one of the national treasure producers was doing press for some other movie he produced or something and they asked about why national treasure three never happened and he offered one of the fifteen excuses that come from time to time but the one he said that was different. Was you know disney so vertically integrated they never figured out how to make national treasure valuable for them in any other sector of their business. They never figured out how to put it in the theme parks and never became merchandise. You know you couldn't do like the video games. Didn't work like there was no other area of the company that could benefit from national treasure and as time went on disney became all about like a movie needs to function. Every facet of our company and something like santa claus. The santa clause trilogy tim allen movies. They're hits all three of them do well. Well enough there to be three of them but a even though i think there is some nostalgia for them from our generation. It doesn't feel like they're the same kind of perennial regular tv appointment viewing movies. It doesn't feel like they've ever gained any value at disney and other areas of the company. And you just have to imagine in two thousand nine disney's looking around and they're like we don't have a grinch. We don't have a charlie brown. We don't have a buddy the elf like aside from not having a classical christmas movie. We also don't have like a mascot of christmas. We can put mickey and a santa hat. You know even to some degree. I wonder if that's a reason. Why they never have weaponized muppet christmas carol much as i thought they would after they bought it that they want something that is like proprietary to christmas so the appeal for them of like. Let's get a massive movie star and a massive filmmaker doing like what could be the definitive scrooge and he can be like all designed to look perfect like scrooge. the ghost look. Awesome it tracks on paper but i agree with you david that when i saw i thought it looked like to quote david soames film critic at the atlantic like a boulevards. I thought far and i remember. Just feel like this really. This is still as far as the technology has come. This is still. The sensibility of as amac is hitching. His wagon to have been said. Remember going to see movies with my friends in theaters. That trailer came up one friend in particular. I remember tournament. Going galax amazing. I remember the trailer being very extra is really trying to his face. You know how how tense it looked all that right. There's a money shot at the end of the trailer. That isn't in the movie. Where he he's slamming or something right. Yeah turns the camera and his face is like coming into the theater. And like a snowflake lands on his nose lows it off. He looked straight down the barrel of the lands. And he says bah humbug and swear it must have been like a test. It must have been the demo. Reel to get them to greenlight the movie. 'cause it also looks so much better than he looks at any point in the film proper. I remember that shot. And my friend. Dixie and saying oh that looks amazing and i was really think that looks amazing. And she went. Well i guess. I've never seen a three d. movie before liquor. We were we. Were going to see some other three d movie. That was the first trailer in three d. And that being her first impression was like oh shit. This trailer is doing all sorts of crazy shit. It looks amazing. it did like it. Didn't open well but it did. People went to see this people went to see it opened poorly and then had okay holds overseas. Yeah but they wanted into okay did it. Did about the same overseas. They wanted the polar express thing. I think we're really warmed. Come christmas time and it did. Not if you open a christmas movie the first weekend of november and you can keep in theaters. We'll have a pretty. But yeah i think it's I remember. I went to see this movie on christmas eve because i was like. I'm going to go see a movie in the theater was packed like people were coming out for it so but yeah. I agree with sort of your theory of our disney was. I think santa claus would be a bigger thing for them. If not for tim allen. I think tim allen. Kinda killed that movie. By being tim allen in a weird way it is also interesting that the first movie is so much like fish out of water. He's at odds. You wouldn't believe this guy. Santa claus and the sequels. Lean so much into tim allen in so much makeup looking like coca-cola santa claus. Yeah the poster for the second. Santa claus movie was just tim allen looking at the looking at you looking like santa claus. That was right at this point. Yeah he hasn't looked like tim allen anymore. Doesn't sound like there are no a ruse to be found. I'm gonna. I'm gonna save it in fact and i'm gonna make him my background here. We go anyway this movie so you saw in theaters emily. I saw on theaters. I did. I wait until christmas eve. I was going to see it opening weekend but the reviews were so bad. And then i was just like i mean it's wild wild this picture we're looking at it. Sheiks ever been rosier looks. Let's just be straightforward races. Read it's the color red eye oaks like ham from like a shot in the fifty s. Yes i do back when they were like how it looks is what matters put as many chemicals if he walked into look like fucking like a red sausage another interesting point though is like you look at this poster. And you go. Why pay for tim allen. Like what are you doing. It just sees right versus versus another thing you have to calculate into. This very movie is the grinch was so fucking successful. Despite being a piece of shit it was so huge and the fact that jim carrey was unrecognizable in it did not her business at all people were like into the transformation of. Oh my god. It doesn't look like him. it doesn't sound like him. He's transformed into this classic character. It's it's this thing that that really becomes like the the impetus to do a lot of these films. How can we make this person. Look exactly like the grants look exactly like santa claus look exactly like jd. Vance the writer of hillbilly. Elegy trying to get cynical as three going but it doesn't really work with them. Sticking with too cynical is kind of aspirational fantasy. Which is that. I will meet a middling. Lee attractive middle aged man. Like i'm in love with you. And i'm gonna make you mrs claus and he'd just have to move with me to the north pole about think about it every time. Click hello hello. Wow not not really speaking english to me right now. Who is this. I don't know david also. This guy looks weird right. I don't want to judge but this guy's got an. I don't want to pass judgment either but yeah definitely a whole vibe here. Like like a naked mole rat right. I mean this. This is like what is always second. He's writing something down on a piece of paper and he's holding it up to. Oh my god david it's cousin it's oh it's because it from the addams family. The famous laying usually hairy creature. Who you know. It's just kind of like a big pillar of hair usually. It's why i didn't recognize him. I think cousin. It's been losing his hair dave. Oh that's too bad. I'm sorry i'm sorry. Tiny of his entire gimmick. That is kind of his thing. It's true well we'll know thing is its own report is it's bit i would argue. Yeah right right. Well i feel bad. Is there anything we could do. I mean this guy is not gonna keep on booking roles looking like this. He's got the bowler hat and the sunglasses but she doesn't pop the same way on unduly pink flesh and you know so many people's identities wrapped up in their hair you know. Get some fresh styles right if once. You're in your twenties thirties. You start losing your hair. I don't know how it is but it definitely feels like the hannett seventy eight. Who knows definitely and he looks panic. You can see it in his eyes. Or i imagine you'd see behind those sunglass. Well okay look thankfully. Now there's keeps there's a simple and easy way to keep your hair. Okay right okay. The easiest way to prevent us and this might not apply to you but i don't know i don't know i haven't looked to your entire body but is to do something about it while you still have some hair left now used to have to go to a doctor's office for your hair loss prescription but thanks to keep you can visit a doctor online and get hair loss medication delivered right to your home. 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Kate e. p. s. dot com slash. Check keeps. I did not see this film griffin. I decided to not see it. That was my choice. And and i'm glad that you respect it a instead of probably saw avatar again or lock homes or trying to think of big christmas movies that year. I absolutely saw avatar for the third time on christmas day when my family some of the other big movies at christmas. I'm not pulling the box office game because of course this home came out in early november chipmunks this squall chipmunks. It was bananas weekend. It was like the. it's still is. I think the single biggest day and moviegoing history because of avatar squeal and sherlock holmes all opening over seventy yes. And i also like christmas was a friday so look it all. It was all perfectly lined up. It's complicated came out on christmas day. Right you have up in the air you know. These are christmas movies sing. I did not see a christmas carol. I saw it yesterday on my couch. And i thought it was bad three. I watched it tonight right before recording on three. D blu ray. I could not walk. How boring it was. I texted david. I believe let me get my exact wording here I said how is kerry so dry in this day. He is weirdly underplaying every role. He's funnier in the majestic. Yes believe i said like my thing is like and ula grew. We like scrooges like mr birds. He is the most ridiculous exaggerated character is the meanest person alive. He's the most miserly person what his personality traits are. the most like that would scrooge is signing onto play. Scrooge is stepping into a gondola on the river of ham and carry on top of this is a cartoon in the movie. So it's just that these playing scrooge is that he's playing him as a cartoon and yeah he's take is like yeah. Play kind of grumpy. And i think that's what i'm going grow for. He's going to be like a little grumpy. He should've gone full ridler. You should have just gone fucking gone for it. Just let like but yeah watch. Mukalla series of unfortunate events is five years before this and his argument better scrooge performance than this is like. That's the kind of energy he should be bringing to this. And dr robotic is eleven years later is a better scrooge. he's he's given us many a scrooge like he's he has you know who else better scrooge the grinch classic scrooge. 'cause played the fucking grinch like how many christmas grump do you need. Jim carrey to bring you. So i found a quote carey said in an interview while promoting the movie he said a. It's a very classical version of a christmas carol. There are a lot of vocal things a lot of physical things. I have to do not to mention doing the accents properly. The english irish accents. I- wanted to fly in the uk. I wanted to be good. And i want them to go. Yeah that's for real. If feels like that was his biggest take on. Each of the characters was like cosa. Kristen past lilting irish accent check work done ghost of christmas present kinda roly yorkshire or guy check job done goes to prison christmas to be just point a lot check job done. The ghost of christmas past is so disturbing looking i actually like yelped when it came up yesterday when i was watching this movie. I was like god. What's that his heads candle. Which is you know from. The book is a kindle is heads of flame. Emily heads aflame. Oh i'm sorry. He's had his fire fire like he moves around moves around. The fire moves with him and like his face. Looks like a like a little like squat. Like jack lantern. It's so disturbing the aba. Wehrley not ugliest character in this film because the ugliest characters. Obviously bob crotchet like terrified. Looks like a potato. That has the face of jesus in it. That's what it looks like emily. Emily you determine i was about to say was pew potato. I also went to pay potato. But i couldn't get over the hair pattern on that potato. Now it's it's it's so weird because we literally had had went like when is gary oldman playing fucking serious. Black as a fire in goblet of fire. Remember there's there's he's just. His face is just made of coal. He looks matters earlier. it looks better in ad. It's still weird cheeks. That's all messed up about. You know it's something about the way his he looks like a rodent like if you saw him in your house you would leave out poison also think about like what is running table on this point in time right and pointedly wet a never tried to make their characters look too much like the actors right. Maybe they run a little hint of it in there but they were always Extrapolating as much onto a different model which also necessitated some massaging and key frame. Animation probably made the performance is better whereas meccas was so intellect. It's one to one. We're not fussing with it at all. It straight there unvarnished. It is bizarre. That's a max's so committed to like all the characters need to look like the actors but in this one in particular. He hires people who are so physically different than the characters. They're playing so you get these odd like it. Looks like that fucking face. Replacement app that everyone does now what they facing different smiling ray. All of a sudden yes. Right and you're just like that is not the body that gary oldman's face belongs on. He is also not tiny. Tim why making a little boy. Tiny tim that moves like. Gary oldman and looks kind of like a young gary oldman and then voiced by some other child. Have you since you've done the poll that since you've done your polar express episode there was a quote zemeckis gave around the time. That movie came out. So tell me if you've talked about this. That is horrifying now. Will we think about who we cast in certain roles where he was talking about. Okay imagine being able to do a story about you. Know the brown versus board of education but meryl streep compla- one of the little girls who like to go to the school and like oh my god hob but he got his dream. Gary coleman's planning tiny tim. He hangs the little boy and in mars needs moms seven ren- plays the boy like he was like really into like having adults play kids. In each of those cases the plan was to have the adult actor also voiced the kid and it felt last second it was too creepy and they hired a kit to redouble. Also mench so. That's gary oldman. Colin firth is in. this movie. Third built fred screws asir also looking kind of like colin. Firth in a weird. Kp waxy you've got hoskins coming in as mr feser wig for one big sort of musical sequence essentially right the hajj this movie. Robin wright penn playing once again a stone. Nobody woman character like every time rabid. Let's get you in must correct. She plays two different awesome. She plays plays his sister and fiancee. I believe correct correct. Yeah and then carry always. His job was to be the actor that jim carey acted against in every scene or any of the scenes where he is playing against himself in the final cut so most of carroll was his work was not used and then they gave him like five. Nothing roles yeah. He plays like portly gentleman and Mad fiddler and guest to. He plays the guy who asked scrooge for money which is know knows biggest part. I think it's bigger part then. Screw scrooges like poor. Children should go to jail. And he's like well they might die in scrooges like good. that's great. I love that then out. The herd was also impolite. Elway's was also supposed to be in yellow submarine and to some degree. I think always was making a play to be like zemeckis. Max's circus like. I think he might have been like. Can i be one of these guys who figures out this medium and becomes like a cap stock company actor. Sure fair enough and it works. You know sorry worked. Worked perfectly in instead. He produced elvis. Nixon and kuroda cairo he did he was co wrote. Yes jim carrey plays ebony scrooge at all ages each age is credited as a separate is a separate character that he played in the end. Credits i don't know if you noticed that. But it's like adults scrooge young man scrooge little boy scrooge scrooge as teenager and all of them are credited jim carey a separate joy when he's kinda waking up and he feels a little tired during the day scrooge network she just keep going tonight they should really credited both like like means scrooge and like nice scrooge as different characters jerry giving their different men Also gary oldman is morally. Yes he plays marlee. I would say and maybe this is a hot. Take the worst looking. Yeah issue in the entire movie which defies logic spooky seizure guy goes trivia slam dunk. He looks just like a person that is blue like rather than being transparent and ghostly and remember he's in the trailer and that was why. When i saw the trailer they clearly just have not figured this out like these three of these now and they just don't know what they're doing because he looks like shit and the best from jacob marley of course. Is the marley brothers from muffin christmas. Carol all the the the whole thing about like the bit where he does his his cloth and then he has to flap his his mouth up and down like he's at puppet is just like yeah like it's supposed to be a bit i think but Not funny or disturbing relief. This is an era. That's really earmarked biza. Meccas having poor impulse control of just follow through everything he possibly could do at any given moment of moving What were you gonna say. Just so terrible okay. Yeah it's so bad. The thing that emily is referencing wear. There's the weird kind of body horror and there's a couple other moments like that like the skeleton where it's like. Oh he's doing like more tales of the critique intense visual horror. I movie right. I thought that was really god. Yes and he's live on the ground. Those are cool. Those are yes. It's an idea like that's what i'll give you know what i mean. At least it's something but like when when the little kids want ignorance turn into like like a criminal like a sex worker. What a weird choice. That is incredibly bizarre. I did have to double check that. It wasn't leslie. Amac is playing the adult sex. We've noticed a pattern. Emily and all of these movies meccas cast his wife as the weirdly. The most sexualize character in the universe. Loka marwin i've seen. I've seen it but also you know. His wife is the burlesque. It in polar express yes and is the busty beer wench and beowulf. Three minutes of her pendulous breasts swinging. She is. she's just calling first wife. Dan thinks she has much to do. She is in it lesley manville. Let's scratch it real life. Ex wife of gary oldman. It's true. Barry terry odd look. It's a skilled cast. And and we were texting about this david. You're saying like he's treating this as if he's playing king. Lear like there's weirdly too much reverence for the idea of what scrooges rather than viewing it as like a vehicle to have a lot of fun as an actor let alone as a comedic actor and if it's like if your goal is to do like doing a very faithful adaptation were gonna play it straight. We're going to lean more into the spooky of dickens or whatever. Then it's like have fucking gary oldman or colin firth or bob hoskins just the name three people who are in this movie let alone any of the other people from like the rogues gallery have fucking like even you just think about how much more exciting. This movie would be less commercial but more exciting. It would be if it was. Christopher lloyd is scrooge ins amac asus a christmas carol and you had that kind of manic energy. But it's so bizarre that he is playing it so deadly straight and i realized watching it like i mean we're talking about scrooge has kind of comedic archetype right it. Christmas carol is like the prototype for that sort of story. We love the royal. We like something like as good as it gets where. It's like watching very charismatic. Movie star play an unrepentant asshole. The first hour of the movie. The fun is oh my god. They're saying the stuff. I would never have the courage to say they don't get it for their larry. David ing yes right and then the last hour of the movie. They learn how to be a good person. Nicholson nicholson would have been raised roach. Yeah it's speaking of people. Damascus's worked with i think harrison ford now has a great scrooge in it. I think he would be great. He would be so good but it should be about a stone. Whose rich you know what i mean like. They don't bring him to london. This is the mistake. Stop trying to put these guys. In victorian england bring scrooge to an obviously bill. Murray right like you can transpose. This story to anywhere make it be about guys like all i wanna do. Is yell at david. Blaine make money woodwork. I just think the key detail is. The actor. Needs to have fun being this much of an asshole. The only way of christmas. Carol works if the audience is getting some perverse pleasure out of how evil scrooges as you said david on mr burns level so that we're like invested enough to be touched when the transformation happens carries just playing an asshole like he's playing i who sucks and you're just looking at your watch being. Okay when's he gonna realize the error of his ways lake. Michael cain is fucking dial in in this. Carol you know what i mean like so good. What are the other christmas. I liked the murray. I like scrooge. It's okay. I've always thought it too little overrated. But maybe i feel like this little. It's like it wasn't even a huge it at the time. So maybe it's not overrated but people may be put too much on it because as bill marina. I like the classics that we talked about. These new have you ever seen the rich little christmas. Carol it is. i've read about it. A glorious thing to behold it is Rich little playing every part in a christmas carol Many of them as like celebrity impressions. I told this is true. They're all celebrities. I'm not really aware love. I'm gonna tell you so some of his impersonation okay fields as screw looking at list. So i i. I got hammer. Perfect trucks the audience is just like he went there. He's doing he's he's satirizing. Wc fields who died thirty. Plus years ago he's tearing to do it. You got paul lynde is bob crotchet johnny carson is fred laurel and hardy is the solicitors richard nixon as jacob marley. That's actually a little spicy for ninety. Seventy eight yeah. That's somewhat related to the news of the decade groucho marx. Espec- wig peter. Faulk is that goes to christmas present. That sounds good. That actually sounds good. I into that. No you're missing too key details here. It's billed as peter faulk as colombo slash the ghost of christmas measure which territories riffing on jean stapleton as edith bunker slash. Mrs scratch it but then a couple just to end off strong truman capote is tiny tiny. Tim that's just. That's just homophobe. I don't know lula leader sellers as inspector clue so ask the ghost of christmas yet. The i forgot to mention bogart is because christmas past. Yes you murder. You almost forgot that. James mason george burns and john wayne as the three businessmen and jack benny as a boy i presume. The what day is it The this this has been helpful tool there are five of these people were dead at time. Productions track just say. It's raining that list. What we it to be. That's the same kind of thing you imagine. Hearing jim carey is going to play four characters and a christmas carol. Like he's just gonna fuck and go off and carry despite not being like a rump as his comedic persona did a lot of movies where it's like. Oh he's upsetting polite society. He's doing whatever the fuck he wants. Like there is a devil-may-care streak to him. That in theory should fit. Well guys guys. When richard nixon comes in as jacob marley instead of chains. He has watergate tapes. He has like real real tapes draped on this boy. This is so good boy. Ultra you've got to watch it. Yeah i gotta watch it. I mean let's do a little low carry context or not digging into the movie as much because everyone knows what. This fucking christmas carol. Who's fucking three goes looking from. It is such a faithful adaptation. Although if there's anything particular you want to say about it. Emily adaptation wise would very much. Thank you hear it. I'll we'll get to that. But let's talk kerry. Because i think this movie is a rosetta stone to understand robert zemeckis. I wou and i'll you i like kerry. We realized we've never really done a carry movie before And he's obviously one of those dominant movie stars in the nineties and we brought it up recently in a box office game his his bananas year where he has three hundred million dollar movies in one year he goes from being a guy who gets paid like one hundred and fifty thousand dollars. A movie to a guy gets paid seven million dollars movie. The following year gets fifteen million for the ace ventura sequel and the year after that becomes the first actor ever to make twenty million dollars for what ends up being his first major flop and then kinda just continues to run the table on the nineties. He made a movie after the cable. Guy called liar liar in which you couldn't lie and we know. Obviously that was a huge hit. He couldn't humongous humongous and then he then he does the truman show one of the masterpieces of moviemaking. There was the cynicism of carey wants to be serious now and then people love that movie and it was a big hit. He didn't get an oscar nomination but it was like a major fucking hit. I we let them in forever which happens That's that's ninety five. That's post his first wife right but only yeah only boats. You got man on the moon. Which i think is great but then that a box office disappointment i guess so i mean. It's box office. Disappointment by the standards of jim carey movie. I guess in terms of an andy. Kaufman bio pic and it must be the highest cursing andy kaufman biopic. It definitely wasn't worth him being that big of a dead cat to make that movie ruined him right. Like i mean isn't that i haven't ever watched that documentary. But that documentary about. It's the worst. Yeah i mean yeah. I guess but it just portrays him in the worst light possible pseudo. Yes they re title that paranormal activity. Six outtakes up jim carey on the set of man on the moon. It is upsetting. He seems like an incredibly difficult person in all ways and peer. We're on the. Truman show talks about like how you had to like tire him out to get a real performance. You had to let him do all this shit and then like then you'll start getting stuff out of him like that was sort of how he approached it. He definitely feels like an actor. You have to wrangle. If you're not trying to just make a jim carey vehicle like something liar. Liar you're hiring him to just do everything right but two thousand. I feel like that's when he's starting to just be like okay. I'm going to do cartoon stuff me myself. And irene. that's like a cartoon. Rubber-faced movie grinch obviously humongous highest grossing film of that year then then the majestic it's weird. It's like i love jim carey. Ace ventura pet. Detective is literally the first like vhs. I ever bought with my own allowance. I was the perfect age for him much. Like i imagine you guys kind of were maybe not know. There is something about ace ventura that i always found very disturbing. I didn't understand serving in no i. I was not allowed to watch. Jim carey movie some but i did sneak dumb. And dumber on a class trip. And it's It's a classic thing for me. Emily and it was because my parents hate him annoying and like and was suddenly everywhere. Ben where are you on kerry. I mean i love the mask mask is good big big movie for me. I mean i still say like taglines from that movie to this very day. Somebody stopped me past. Stop you right. Yeah you often yelled at the police. I feel like truman show was the first carey movie i saw. And i didn't see the kerry comedies until after that like my parents are just like we're not taking that shit. We find him so annoying. That that card game sinophile i was playing that over zoom with my family and my dad got or my sister rather picked up jim carey. We were playing it like Way card on head guessed the name of the person kind of thing clues style and So romley had jim carey on her head and my dad was trying to give her clues and his clue was bad actor and i was. You can't give that as a clue as i. I m i hate. It is so annoying like he couldn't give any clue that wasn't clouded by his opinion of. You're okay no. I was just gonna say i got into him late late ish. I mean like ninety nine. I was watching the kerry comedies on. Vhs which is as you pointed out like when the golden period is over so the carry movies. i were seeing in theaters. Were when the balloon was off the roads. Your me myself irene. Bruce almighty and what happened. I mean bruce almighty was a huge hit. Humans not a good movie. It's not an okay movie. it's it's bad it's bad actively but it open to seventy million dollars. It was the biggest opening weekend for an original film. Ever in bruce we trust that was the tackling he done the majestic which had bombed so he was kind of like head bond with everybody to be. You know the the the ms jessica is just one of those. Just total bombs right like it. It's a christmas movie. Awards potential the director of the shawshank redemption. Critics are like no audiences are like no. It was complete complete rejection. he's links off. He comes back with bruce almighty. It's the same move as liar liar. He's like i'm gonna come back high high concept comedy. You're going to love it like right like we're just going to be with tom. Idei i'm going to just do another. Tom shad yet movie but then he does have eternal sunshine the year after which which is his son. Yeah but i feel like i feel like andrea has talked about that. He like went to peter we year and he went to. He went to all the directors who've worked with him and are like. Tell me all the tricks. I mean his whole thing was. He said the reason he cast jim. Carrey was based on how lonely and uncomfortable. He looked at the end of every episode of in living color on stage. The good night's was like that's the performance. I wanted him to give. And you've got to give credit. He's brilliant in that movie but it also feels like the fact that he's never been able to give a performance like that again speaks to gandhi somehow. Teasing it out of him. That's the thing it's when i'm trying to say here. I guess it's ten years from ace ventura to journal sunshine. And yes you have a couple of bombs in there. But that is a a pretty solid block of work dramatically and comedic. And then guess he's still like squeaks out hits with like fun with dick and jane and yes man and a christmas carol right like there's offers tanglin penguins but like wife is out of his. Yes it's just like he's just not very fun anymore. Like i remember. Yes ma'am being. That's probably the most watchable of them. Because like i don't know it's a peyton reed movie like zoe. Nationals people are kind of like working in the margins are now. But i couldn't tell you a thing that happens in it. No that's also one of those wild movies where they were trying to develop a new model to keep budgets of comedies down so rather than getting or twenty five million dollars up front he took zero upfront salary. For thirty percent of the first dollar grow thirty six percents. He got gross. He made a lot of fuckin- money on that movie. But yes it's never quite the same. And i feel like the last decade. He's done a lot of weird more supporting parts. I mean things like kick ass. Two and bert wonder stone when he's in comedy he sort of like playing like the color character and then when he does something like mr poppers penguins it feels like there's a gun to his head i'm also just like always had their many penguins to his hand guns i i'll say this i've never seen dumb and dumber to. I have no idea if he's like locked in that one at all i tapped out after like fifteen minutes on. Hbo go. i was not. I was not able to stick with it I feel like there was excitement around that. Both like the fair lease and him returning to form and then did well and just no one ever talked about it ever again But what i was going to. I always try to collect stories. When i when i work as an actor from like other actors and especially from a film and tv crews because you can get really good gossip other actors there unless looking for like a savory personal life stuff and more just like i'm curious about what people are like workwise and carry is one of those people where you just hear the the most disastrous demented stories where he is just absolutely like a guy who's been so famous for so long and got famous for being unreasonable. You know he just does whatever the fuck feels doing at any given moment and i'm not talking around like dark fucked up shit. It's just like the stories are so bizarre. They're like like talking to like a grip. Who's like yeah. I worked on mr papas penguins We were shooting in this guy's like fifteen million dollar central park west apartment. The last day of filming. He asked me for sharpie pen and then he drew a giant self portrait of himself on their living room wall and signed it and said man they only twenty million for that one. You just in another reality. He's in another reality by all accounts. He's in another reality and functions in that way where he is like. I'm i'm doing a mitzvah to these people by freezing the wall of their living room withdrawing myself. I want to say i because of his background in comedy and tv comedy. His big breakthrough elvis. This sitcom called the duck factory that got cancelled after thirteen episodes but it was like supposed to him a star so he has a lot of experience with tv comedy. I was actually looking forward damage. Joe biden on saturday night live and that was a disaster. It was trained with the worst thing that has ever happened to is like because remember the buzz on that was like all carry really wants to do it. And he asked lauren and he has a taken. I'm like okay like sure. If he carry thinks he wants you know and then he just an he's ready to move to new york. He did fire. Marshall bill like there was just nothing going on like it was so weird. After all that hype. The the thing that was so insanely damning about it was that alec baldwin looked like fucking big groucho marx. Up there next to him. When suddenly i was like well would actually locked in his truck like it was insane. Like elba was hitting his lines. I was kind of amused like the switch rectified. Knees like what are we gonna do suckers. And he's shooting a finger. I i like joe biden. Is you could satirize the bad stuff their stuff they're fucking. He was the best comedic for big. Three other guys have played him well on. Snl i would he. I was just a big fan of the woody harrelson. What big fan is strong because anything politicalness and all. These days is pretty weak sauce. But like i would-i harrelson had to take a look. It was kind of funny like that was working for me. I know he's like busy. Or whatever speaking of where does the number twenty three fall in. Because so that's that's a fucked up movie. That's a couple years before this right right number. Twenty three two thousand seven like after attornal sunshine. He also as limb series of unfortunate events the same year then. He has phone with dick and jane which is one of those movies. I think that had been shot a while ago. You know like that one. Sound michelle freer. I think it was more that they kept shooting. It for over a year round was a movie that never was finished and they kept going back for more and more reshoots. Yeah but but like so if you basically sort of think of it as like he kind of takes a three year break almost and then the number twenty three comes out and it's like oh what he into this. That was horrible movie. Like it's a stupid bad movie but there was also that kind of vibe of this feels like something. Jim carey may believes that. There's some magic to the number twenty three. Am i miss remembering. Is that another shoe. Yes that's a schumacher. Gotta do you gotta do schumacher to we gotta do shoe ryon number twenty three though this was i just remembered the other thing i wanted to bring up because i was looking up photos from the press tour for this movie. One of the photos i had is my background. My virtual background before. I shifted it to adult. Gary oldman sitting on adult jim carey shoulder to do the mo cap but i found this photo of him and they did some weird amtrak cross promotion movie because i to post rape amtrak tie in because the polar express but there's this picture for conference where he is vomiting up or whatever but kerry had this look through the entire press tour where his hair was like fairly long. He has a really big beard and then he would wear a lot of loose layers like he would wear a button-down shirt and then like another jacket. And then a blazer and overcoat and it was like very odd. It was very consistent. Look and it was kind of dress down. For how many promotional appearances he had to make this movie and then it became clear. Oh he signed on to do the three stooges a thing that i think people forget he was supposed to be in the farrelly brothers. Three stooges where it was supposed to be Sean penn bbc. Adulterer benicio del toro's mo- sean penn is larry and jim carey as curly and it was a big announcement like he's retained with the farrelly brothers. Jim carey is going to gain a hundred pounds to play curly and this was the period where he was trying to bulk up so he started dressing in this way where you couldn't see his body and grew out the beard so you couldn't see his face and then like a month after this. He goes to the farrelly brothers. And he's like. I can't do it. I can't gain the weight. I don't look right and then just loses it all and like shapes right because he he says he gained forty pounds and wanted to gain another forty and realized like he couldn't hack it. Like you know you whatever. You must've been in his late forties early. You know like it was rough on it. But i wouldn't. He's recommends gaining eighty pounds to play curly and a three stooges moving. You know he was pretty good on the showtime show kidding which is not a great show but like he was a solid in like he's got he's got he's still at that show. Yeah i think he was good fit i i. He was good. He was interesting the weird. That's show bothered me. Because he was supposed to be playing. A mr rogers type figure and jim carey just doesn't have that energy like and especially not in this show. That's kinda weird and a little. You know showtime me right. And so i guess he was compelling and he is compelling as dr yvette robotic in sonacare. He's it's not like he doesn't have magic to him volvo. i will say in a christmas carol. He does not exist. And looking at the last decade in particular right. And i would wager that. His best performance of the twenty ten was as leap dave williams and thirty. I forgot about that. I have immense to stall for the high high-concept. Jim carey comedy. Even though i haven't seen all of them. I if he came out and he was like i m doing a movie where i have a guy who has direct syndrome but for compliments like yes. They're dog and i became a cat. Like i would think that four times. They would do that though. Because i know what mister proper penguins. Is this sucks now. But like look. I threw on liar liar recently or whatever i stumbled on it and when jim carey is being can't lie it's great liar. Liar liar rules. There is a solid hour of marriage. Drama de stuff in your just kind of like okay. Jesus let's keep him move. He is a kid. He has more attorney. Like there's all kinds of but when he can't lie that's great and maybe he should do liar liar two he can't a he that lie liars like his big. It's his crossover from the light. The comedy audience still like the broader audience. Where you could imagine him have gotten an oscar nomination for that somehow. It wouldn't have happened but like you know you could see it. And then like he's supposed to become hanks in other ways and there's just something about his personality that won't fill that space he something putting about it right right. I think it is whatever that mana chaotic strain he has is that makes engaging as a comedic performer. It doesn't it. Makes it hard to accept him as an every man and truman show is such a weird take on the idea of him being an everyman figure because he's like a bottled sort of like a bespoke every man created in a social experiment and then attornal sunshine is a guy who's like sapped of personality like he's pointedly playing incredibly boring emotionally inexpressive man in that movie. Okay all right hello click. Hello who's this very very confounding. Answer to very normal question. Who is this. Augusta's t magic okay. And i can't say. I know you what what's your. What's your whole vibe. I have your magician. Dietitian cul de his team magic at alone from any of a Sure okay. I get that i can totally see the number that's written on here i At heck oh that. I know you see. This is the thing i look gusts. This team magic. Perhaps the most unusual person who's ever appeared on this podcast. I i thought you were coming in here. You're gonna have some cool formula. But guy. I i right exactly you know. It's not about some magic number on the scale. It's about building healthier habits. It's about feeling better about yourself. Like yeah you might want to fit into your favorite pair of jeans or you know. Look good in a certain outfit. Feel more confident but every person is different. There's lots of reasons to want to practice self care and the best way to adjust your lifestyle is to use a service like going to teach you the psychology behind the decisions. You make help keep track of everything workout steps diet. Know all that stuff and assign you. Some personally signed goal specialists in a community of other numerous like i got a cool name. 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It felt like that was maybe a glimpse into where he could go for the next decade and he didn't really tap into that potential at all in terms of straight comedy. I think the best one is. Bert wonder stone not as a movie. But he's good in that. I also have not seen that movie because it is against the law to see that movie. My time i saw that movie had it is illegal to see this movie. Buzz box office. That's the only way to explain. That are federal laws in place. One of my one of my dream. Well what am i. David will understand this. I spent a lot of time thinking about movies that people could make because we used to take part in a weird online game. Where if that would be like thank casting. One one of my dreams is paul thomas anderson making a movie about a week in the life of the lawrence welk show because that show was so fucked up behind the scenes and i was like who do you play welk. Jim carey would make a good laurence welk. Anyway that's a very strange reference. That people will be excited to hear slurs. Well great great pitch put it on the blank check picture. Slate of course keeping up with the clauses which is now the project under blinked tech. Check television but it reminds me the other thing we're not talking about. Was that for so long. There was the looming specter of the christopher nolan. Jim carey howard hughes movie Wonder what that is. I wonder what that looks like. I'm kind of glad that never happened. I'm kinda glad it never happened. But in a certain way howard hughes's a good fit for carry one hundred percent. Yes creepy reclusive. Strange intense right. It's just that we've done a lot of howard hughes at this point but yes in theory. That's an interesting project. When was that supposed to. I guess it was like at several points in time right but lay to thousands especially the the right that sort of coming together. Well almost happened early. Two thousands aviator got to the runway. I then he almost revived it and then people's thought is that like he kind of just put a lot of that stuff into dr type. Prizes like cannibalized his howard hughes script into the third batman movie. I've been thinking a lot about will ferrell's kind of will ferrell's kind of at this point where He is sort of where bill. Murray was pre rushmore. And like he needs to like an indie filmmaker. Like i saw somebody suggests on twitter that. Reo oster would have a great time working with will ferrell and like i would love to see that like i think like people kept thinking that was going to happen with jim carey. Hook up with an exciting young. Andy filmmaker revitalize his career supporting and he just never did like eternal sunshine's the closest he got. I mean there's things like him being in like the bad batch no. He's kind of fun in the movie. Stinks i and he did that. Weird fucking movie. Dark crimes have not seen dr crime. It takes a dark mind to solve a twisted crime. Is the line one if they were dr crimes cared. But i think i think it is harder to crystallize. What his persona is that you can subvert into a more serious minded movie. Emily in the way that it was like so clear. What like bill. Murray thing and you put him in a more serious contra context the overwhelming loneliness of this guy becomes very poignant you know and i think pharrell has those reserves in him that no one's really figured out how to properly use yet carey is like best when he's doing sort of just maximalism when like what you're watching him for is just doing everything. It's one of the reasons why this movie is so upsetting. Because it's the one time that he seemingly holding back when there should be nothing keeping him in place. I want to hear your your sort of big jackets. take before. play the game rate. I feel like we just need to hear this and then fleshed the talk it out i i was. I was thinking about this because when we were talking about the rich little christmas carol. I was like well. Didn't you know at this point in time. Why don't just get robin williams. Having play every part have him do celebrity impression for every part would just be like a disaster. But you know it'd be more fun than this movie laci fields as scrooge just watching this movie. I was struck by adaptation choices to play up at every. Turn the anti-capitalism message of the christmas carol. In a way that usually does not get pulled into american adaptations of the story. It's usually like scrooge just needs to be nicer and give more to charity. Yeah a magus is a. I think watching it at this moment in history was like. Oh my god. This is like playing up the aspects of of chicken chicken story. That are like you know what we are. Only as good as the weakest people in society and we should work together to build something that doesn't give too many people too much money and doesn't give too many people too little money and the stuff that meccas keeps from the book. He cuts quite a few things for all the hype that this got about. You know this is a faithful adaptation. The stuff he keeps his all stuff like want ignorance. It's all stuff like you know. Really pulling playing up How scrooge has lots of money and other people have no money and the the orphans and the collecting for the poor and all of this stuff and that made me think a one of the things that has followed robertson meccas around his entire career is is. He fundamentally a conservative filmmaker in political sense. Or is he someone who's kind of satirizing that viewpoint taking the press out of that the gump question. I think a christmas carol proves that he is indeed fairly. I don't think he's like as far leftist. George lucas but i he's a fairly left-leaning filmmaker who really does kind of hate the capitalist system. That has made him rich. It is a thing. I have been wrestling with these many months and months ahead of us where like it. It's not months ahead. It's month at this month ahead of us. But i was watching his his early. Short films are on like the criterion disc for. I wanna hold your hand. And their films that he showed to spielberg that got spielberg on board being his mentor. Setting them up with films and the whole thing he liked about him was he was like this guy is anarchic like he makes these really radical angry political comedies. He just likes chaos and it does feel like there's a much clearer satirical edge to his movies early on that starts to fade away. And i think he starts to get pegged as being this very kind of like sap populist sorta like sentimental mainstream guy but he is clearly a very angry filmmaker like of his movies seemed driven by contempt of something and then perhaps regrets about where that anger lead you know but they all have that sort of thing to it and we talk a lot about him being like the ultimate boomer filmmaker but he also seems to be a guy who has a lot of hatred for everything. the boomers wrought in society. I mean not to relitigate forrest. Gump i that movie that movie is about. I am boomer. i love boomers. I fucking hate myself. I hate everything that i've done. You know it's the conflict that makes that movie kind of typical tangle and like found this quote. I read in the contact episode about how he was raised super catholic and then became super Atheist stick and then has spent like the later years trying to sort of untangle his earlier Rebellion and find some sort of middle ground between the two and he also falls in this category. And it's like two narratives that come up a lot on this podcast because of the kind of careers that we cover. One is filmmaker discovers some kind of technological breakthrough and becomes obsessed with pushing this boulder up a hill quote unquote for the next generation of filmmakers. Right this weird sort of like in the same way that has done with the high frame rate stuff. Meccas at this time was always framing it as like. I don't care if people don't like these movies. I'm doing this for the next generation of filmmakers. I'm doing all the rnd for the next generation of have these tools to play with. There's that thing. And then there's also the thing of i hate what all the film trends i started have wrought in much though right he steps pet groups right you know spielberg and lucas. You know all these guys were there just like look at all these movies now. There's all bullshit it's it's an odd choice in that way to make a christmas. Carol that is at this point in time in his career to make a christmas carol. That is so devoid of joy of humor and is trying. It's hardest if unsuccessfully to forefront the sort of regret and be the literal horror of the story right but if you view this as robert zemeckis being like i am scrooge and i ruined the world like i think that that is I think that that's a take you know. I think that he is really tapped into this idea of like. We need to like build something better and like this movie becomes like kind of his waterloo in that regard and then he goes off and starts making like weird little kind of personal kind of movies and you know and welcome to marwin ends with steve. Carell turning to cameron saying eat the rich. Like you know the crazy movie is just so fucking boring. My final off say is like ten comes two years after. This is the final gas. I've said this before. But like i think the success of ten ten is they find the exact right distance to push it into abstraction so they overcome the uncanny valley are being like these are proportions that no human being has. This is not what the architecture face looks like. We're still going for a tactile quality in the animation and realism in the performances. But we're not trying to replicate the way. These actress faces looking at kind of way and they go a little bit into that. With like i mean. Obviously the stretching out of carey's limbs in this and his nose and his chin but even like you look at the ghost of christmas past and it's just straight up jim carey's face in a flame right. You look at christmas present and it straight up just like it. Looks like jim. Carrey doing the promotional rounds for this movie trying to bulk up to play curly And then the ghost of christmas Tecom is just apparently him. Motion capture performance ing The silhouette of a row pointing at shit but as he point he plants. The there's the opening transition of the movie. I guess after the opening credits amac is flying over the city. Scape shit where it goes from the book or does that come first where it goes from the book you look at the book and then it goes into the city and then it says jim carey over footage of him wandering around. But there's that transition where it goes from the illustration in the page of the book it says griffin right and then the illustration becomes three d. And then slowly illustration transitions into this totally horrifying looking bob marley corpse jacob marley. What am i saying bob. I wish bob marley was in this way. I wish that had been his choice. I'm doing christmas carol. But the ghost of bob marley's playing every character. I bought the rates the marley estate. But but i had this immediate thought. Oh that was immediately more visually appealing than anything. I've seen in any of these macaque movies. He was so weirdly. Committed to try to bridge this gap between like it's not animation. It's not live. Action has the qualities of both that. I just thought like look. It's not gonna fix the energy problems this movie has but if this movie were done with like three dimensional illustrations in that way yes i agree with this completely concealing to it you. You're like what you were saying about the richard williams version being the best one. It's like make it look like the fucking woodcut from the book or something and that that apparently was like their goal which this looks nothing. Like but yeah. It's i have seen so many christmas carolina patients. I've seen so many. That are worse than this one by several degrees. This is the one i leased. Wanna watch again like so. Also when bob crash at turns toward camera and in starts talking to it and reciting the famous end of the book. It's terrifying terrifying. The whole thing sucks speed round some other things that suck the entire gaza chris. Presence sequence happens from one room he just turns the floor until like a view finder so that they can look at other things happening like it's some weird Theme park ride the fuzzy wig sequence which he turns into hot chocolate and the main money shot of. It is a woman twirling too hard and briefly becoming helicopter through her skirt. Now the the one thing that i think really dead's does succeed in capturing the book again is tiny scrooge. I'm glad it's in there. And i'm glad that dickens vision was realised finally just just dancing on top at bottle low. Scher's bunny win at the high. Pitch the pitcher. It's always good. David pointed out. This is one of his only sole screenwriting credits and i was like. Yeah but it's like pretty much. Just copy pasted the book and then added in long screen descriptions of what when he shoehorned and chase sequences that must've ended with. I promise you this is going to look really cool. Yes exactly also. I guess i mean marley chain legend. I guess we should just shout that out. Oh yeah i mean the chain work is pretty good. You know they're green that's cool. They're translucent pickens really invented. Something pretty magical. Which is that goes carry around chains. And i've i've taken that and incorporate it into my fashion so i'll have wearable chains with my line. That's coming out next year so look forward to that. Do you do look forward to being a ghost. because they'll just give you some chains. Absolutely i assume that they you've you go and you get air chains and then they assign you a place to saint peter's like how many chains mr hasley all of them checking in on election day. You go to the hasley bosley with an asterisk you go ask go great here. You're we have to put the box office game. I this is one of the crazier box office. Game that i can remember. It's three three movies. We were just like holy shit. Number one is this is november. Six two thousand nine never one is a christmas. Carol opening to thirty million dollars now. Okay you know. What are you going to do. It ends up at one thirty. It ends up making one hundred and thirty seven domestic one. Seventy seven international three fifteen worldwide. Okay but you know like two hundred million dollars. Yeah and and it costs a ton to market and polar express made more than that dino five years earlier so like this. Just not what you want to see. This thing has certainly had zero shelf life zero. that's the other thing does not linger does not become a classic. All right number two okay. Okay concert movie has made fifty seven million dollars. Michael jackson's this is it. Michael jackson's this is it who could forget. Jackson had recently died. Your this movie came out and so they rushed it. This is it the. It's not even a concert movie right. It's like preparing for a concert. Movie right is a documentary. It's like it's got the shape of a concert film but it's put together from footage of him rehearsing concert. He never got to do because he died so weird. I've never seen huge hip social sixty billion dollars ride. Is it the whole foods concert movie of all time. It might be probably like competition. I just remember there being like sony. Bought it for so much. Money and deadline was doing these breathless pieces where they were like. No one knows how much this is going to make. Is it gonna make five hundred million dollars like there was just this feeling of like and then people saw and they were like. Oh it's really just watching rehearsal footage like it's very unexciting. There's a part where. Because i such a big jackson five fan and there's a part where he goes into doing a medley of all the jackson five songs. I start getting so amped and like thirty seconds into it. He goes i. Can we stop. I'm just like out of breath and you're like oh well. This sucks because i didn't see the thing. I wanted to see and also more depressing. Now my Say my my primary. Memory of michael jackson is that he died while i was visiting my old german grandmother and we went out to watch fireworks on the fourth of july and people were playing michael jackson songs and i was not aware that my german grandmother knew about michael jackson's death but she turned to me and said he said now very sad and then she went back and got in the car because she didn't care about watching fireworks no allies detected. I was in paris. When michael jackson died and there were literally just people running down the streets holding bottle of wine and beer screaming michael jackson ma all night as they went to different neighborhoods. It was a constant throughout the city number three at the box office new this week. It's opening to twelve million dollars. How very bad don't miss sure. Yes how to describe. I guess like a dark comedy. One of those twelve just saying title is just a great movie just does not exist. Like it's a great like filler title for any movie that does not exist Past big cast. It's not holiday. Themed at all. is it. no it's not holiday themed. It has a funny billing funny billing where there's a someone's someone's getting the end credit but it's it's not an actor. Someone is the aunt credit but his not actor. It's like actor actor actor and let your clothes okay. So is it is the end the name of proper character or is it like a thing. It's an animal. It's an animal an animal as the movie. Kind of like centered around the animal. Well no but like it's in the title. This animal is in the title. I never seen this movie. I've never seen this movie. And i love the star of. I love most of young actors in this movie one on cancelled actor but a lot of good actors. I almost find it unlikely that i haven't seen this movie. So is this does. This movie is the is the canceled actor. Kevin spacey the canceled actor. Kevin spacey It's a kevin spacey dark comedy. He's fourth build. he's fourth. Yeah it's not nine lives. He's built one of an an. Was he an earbud. It's an air but no come on. Come on it's a serious movie. It debuted at the venice film festival. It's got huge stars in it does not exist it cannot exist. I saw this fifty times. Now it's like a comedy but it's like it's like a dark satirical comedy for grownups. Wow spacey an animal. Can you give me the animal kingdom. It's part of daniel. I don't know it's a horse move. No no it's not. A horse is a movie not a cow not a horse but you know another farm animal she now. This is getting fun now. This is just an animal guessing out of sheep superior goats paid. I hear go go. How is this the men who stare at goats the men who stare at goats gory. It's clooney bridges. Who's the one person. I'm forgetting spacier. Mcgregor gregor kevin spacey and coat in the men who stare at goats a film. You're you're right. That movie cannot exist. i met grant has loved ones. Seem like a really nice guy parter. When that movie was out. I doubted it existed. Yes if it's a. I guess an antiwar comedy about cia or the us army like psychological experiments. Right where they're trying to psychic spies. I never seen it. I only remember the trailer. And it's like a guy we're running into a wall or whatever you know shit like that. I have no idea what it's about. I mean people you know like truman show syndrome is a serious thing. I feel like There've been psychological studies of generations of people. Post truman show grow up with the fear that their life is actually just Some fictional reality for someone else to watch. And i felt that way any time i walked by a men who stare at goats posted on the street because it was lazy. Set dressing for a movie that cannot come up with a fake movie to exist in its universe though men who stare at goats they stare talk. The fourth movie is a sci fi horror fill scifi horror film. Two thousand nine. Yes more sci fi. Horror more sci fi Just one of those cheap sci fi horror movies that probably made a profit. No one ever remembers the dennis. Quaid ben foster one is it no. i believe. what's that called. elise is no way. No but it's something like elisi the dame thing what the fuck is doesn't matter anyway. No it's not that it's just a cheap ashara movie it stars milla jovovich Fuck fuck it's gotten a cutesy sifi name yeah you. It's like a play on us. On a concept we would. We would be dimly aware of scifi concept ultraviolet. No no this is going to be tough. You guys are not gonna get this. No i think i got. I feel like i'm usually good at my meals. You're to tap out. Do you have guess emily. You look like you almost had the thought. I remember the poster for this movie. But i do not remember the emily. Give me the it's thuc. It's maybe i don't remember the poster. I think i'm remembering a resident evil poster shit on the poster to be clear how she's not. Okay well there. We go and poster. Is someone being lifted out of their bed by an alien. Oh it's it's called the fourth kind the fourth kind. The fourth kind word right. It's kind it's an alien abduction movie right. I believe second. Be with okay. Yeah that that's i got that one from a few years later with keri russell. But i don't remember the name of anymore. Dark skies dark skies skies. I think as close encounter of the third kind is where you meet an alien but close encounter the fourth time is where alien abducts you come away from your bed when you're sleeping you remember that found footage movie set on the moon. What the phone was that. What what's that movie called. Apollo apollo eighteen. I believe it's a it's a later. Yes right yes. What if what if we went to the moon and there was a camera. Okay speaking of found footage movies. What is number five at the box office. It's been seven million dollars and seven weeks parallel activity a little film called paranormal activity. That rules love normal activity. Yeah one is so good. Two is is the best never saw the other ones. I've only one in three. But i agree that three roles three is so good. Three's amazing three rules. i should watch the other ones. Not that is the box office. This time we've also got opening at number six one of my favorite movies. Two thousand nine. Richard kelly's the box which we do on this podcast which i love so much. Got couples retreat. What if there was a couples. Retreat got law-abiding citizen citizen to those big hits like dates vince. Vaughn just snooze in his way to one hundred domestic. God true and swollen is like he he. He's like resentful that he's in that movie. It's so weird. Is this what you want. Yeah if feels like a parody of an adam sandler premise. We gotta go to hawaii. Why for some kind of couples My wife hates me or something to vince. Vaughn has found his wes anderson. S craig zoeller. Like i gotta say born. Pretty good in freaky. I gave them a good review for freak gave him good notices. He's been doing good work. He's good and hacksaw ridge. He's good and fighting with my family. He's leading into the right things right now. The thing of freaky is he's funny in it. Obviously because he's playing a teenage girl from the movie right like it's a modest but he plays a serial killer and you're like yeah it's fun of course like that's casting. He's he's creepy and scary and then when he's being funny. You're like oh. I forgot that he was like a comedy star. For fifteen years living has muscle list comedy star. What a weird career. But you wanna talk about great career. Emily painter were one of the best writers out there. I guess one our favorite people. I wanna i wanna ask you because you're never going to do a christmas carol because no other great directors have done. Christmas saw. Who's who's who's your director. You'd like to see do christmas carols just lightning round. Because i have an answer i have just to make griffin happy so the answer to make griffin happy. Yeah do a christmas carol. That's a good question. I mean i didn't watch the fx bat to fox right. But i am into the idea of someone doing a harder edged christmas carol that nejla christmas carol but like the thing. This movie occasionally toys with just like what if you made it really fucking dark. I don't want anyone to do but yeah it'd be fun. If like mike flanagan did a ghost story movie. You know what i mean like. Someone leaned more into the har- like if you did like a nasty like one million dollar haunted house scrooge movie. I don't know what's your answer. Gandhi tartokowski well. Well that'd be fun. Okay so that's that's a great pick. My pick was going to be. The first thing that came to mind for me was like paul king does a big family. Scrooge musical like joe cornish like skies with a good sense of comedy and visual. You know yet. Yeah but i'm also like i feel like The muppet christmas. Carol scratches that each for me. It's a great christmas musical great performance the center in a lot of good comedy. I now i like the idea of ending. Just go and fuck and full tune on this thing. And he's a lobby. Yeah blobby via the thing about this. All these franchises that are like we're going to do christmas care because we got these recognizable characters. Hotel transylvania christmas. Carol woodwork emily. That's such a good idea. Such a good idea drac dragon kind of scourge. Sometimes yeah you know and each t- four. I mean if you're going to keep it going you might as well. We'll do christmas carol. Yeah i don't know we'll do a what's another like template you could shove it into transylvania treasure island bake them. The new muppets great. Emily is there anything specific. You want to plug that people should be following all of your work in general worth following. You can find me. Yeah you can find me on twitter at twitter dot com slash emily. Vw on. vox all the time. My newsletter is called episodes. And as you listen to this the ultimate episode of the second season of my script fiction. Podcast arden is dropping tomorrow so check that out. We have gotten awards. Nominations that means. We're good highly. And i want you to remember how this episode started and recognize that we might be nipping at your heels. I remember going. i'm gonna have a peabody mental. can you imagine alive. I've wrote down apply for peabody but guys. I've chewed this up in the polar express episode promo- entitled christmas album that i've put together. It's a slow christmas album ben. Things christmas music isn't slow enough. So he's releasing an album. This is for real. That's gonna drop this as you're listening to this the link. Be in the show notes please. It's free for everyone to listen and enjoy. I just can't believe that's real. It was the best christmas music i've ever heard. You've created holiday. Classic really appreciate as someone who's love is christmas. I take that in high regard. This thing is going to be here justice. Yeah it's it's going to get much bigger than podcast. It's going to be like it's going to be like the buster poindexter to our new york dolls. love it. yeah let's end. Thank you for listening. Please nerves this guy. Job on for our clamor. Garfield theme song bikes that red dot com for real nerdy shit. Patron dot com slash blank check. Were finishing off. The alien franchise blanche special features tune in next week for a flight. We're going to roll it. And as always on the twelfth day of christmas my true love sent to me. Twelve podcast partying. Eleven potter's pipe potting lord. His pods a pining. Seven pods of piloting. Six pods potting. Go on sale. Three now Four three a two dogs and a huh peabody winner.

greg garcia emily david carol disney oscar allison wonderland Carol santa mo cap carol righteous sully santa claus pixar pixar colin earl Faa nia dacosta alpha margrethe bob easy Emily vander warf
Hallmark Christmas Movies Are Comin' To Town  Already

On Point with Tom Ashbrook | Podcasts

48:17 min | 2 years ago

Hallmark Christmas Movies Are Comin' To Town Already

"Support for on point and the following message come from MIT's system design info session on Wednesday November six from noon to one PM STM DOT MIT Louis Atkins in for David Folkenflik and this is on point in forty original holiday movies millions will be tuning in for holiday cheer point our need for feel good TV in a topsy turvy world join us with us now from Los Angeles is Michelle Victory Executive welcome to one point Kimberly hello thank you for having me no thank you movies and why does the hallmark channel make this such a focus and over one hundred years of making people feel and so twenty years ago when we said properties people knew exactly what that was supposed to mean we deliver on what people expect and they wanna feel good at to produce in in sort of talk a little bit about the road that leads you to realize the with the expectation of of people and because of the positive nature of the brand thirty of the movies and we pushed our development teams to do a bigger and better job in sooner or later and the bigger we got the bigger we got it could go all in on Christmas in November and December it was the next is a postcard from cody a soldier who just returned from Afghanistan and is under this when this beautiful woman swiped some of my crispy curly fries and then the first time I hope all your dreams come true Coty I think you know a formula is excuse romantic comedies which is what we do on homework channel where gather is that a formula I love it yes it is and we aspire to do that and continue to look for different ways where are romantic leads I and fantasy elements of a fun romantic comedy or drama colours Sydney calling from Troy Michigan Hi Sydney Hi Watch them year round because you never know when you just need a Christmas movie pick me up the end up happy yeah thanks for that call Sydney I want to put array and Lacey Chabert who will he we will hear from a a little later because she really highlighted what we hear all the time people don't and we are different than many of our competitors in that we take a that the actors that we work with and we do things who who look to really embrace the season embrace about and that is sometimes people just WanNa feel good are we live which is which is for people to feel positive and happy is you feel good and positive but you know it's some- sometimes they do mission of happiness is there some concern that there are some you know it's an we go to a lot of the the ways that all of our our our characters journeys are about themselves and not something that they need to fill within themselves and on that racially geographically is it just about Christmas can we bring in double holiday and holiday date we also have done a lot of work as we have Kristin Chenoweth we have Blake Shelton we're going to new places we have Christmas and who are who are stars are that are talking to and relating to people joint soon by Emily Waldorf who's a critic at large for vox do you watch them for an escape from the real world I'm Kimberly Atkins this it is calming the bring I nearing and the MIT's Sloan School of management earn a Master's in engineering and management product design development and innovation using MIT's most advanced information think of his peers life is that friend who always has great advice about everything all guys do the plots resonate with you is there enough diversity how do you think women are portrayed city for the hallmark channel and also joining us is emily vander worth she's and Emily I wanNA I wanna turn to you what do you think of the idea touched them one hundred percent of the time I think that I would I would I would lose my mind but thing to do and yeah like there is I do like the idea of offering this sort of fantastical in all of that so I do like the way that hallmark sort of offers an escape from that escapism but you also use the word weird what do you attribute way that it's being that is you know hallmarks targeting it certainly hallmark has competitors lifetime a lot of television it tends to be a little bit older not as old as you'd think tends to be a little bit wider in a push to chase you know a little bit darker more realistic gritty as of like Nice people living in Nice town doing nice things for each other we don't see that as much anymore and I man I wanna go to Marcia who's calling from Lexington Kentucky Hi Marsha the predictable and it's nothing I'm ever GONNA turn on even to try he's watching TV. It's the hallmark channel and I will look at him and thank you know you've something like that he's actually into it and it's the biggest break in the world for him watching these shows there are university professors who were digging it to talk a people is a release from there as Emily said there is a plethora of your brain needs to feel good and I think that's things are positive and and things turn out okay and life is that life is good that's Yeah Okay Carol is calling in sorry the district I am an avid channel people of Color in primary roles in secondary roles or supporting roles Yes doc stars and I'd like to know why and it's dumping can be done about that industry problem and much of the industry like us have been stand and and acknowledged that this year we have a fantastic slate of Christmas movies this gift we have tomorrow Maori and Bookstore Nell in a Christmas miracle we have chailly be more representative of the United States and we are doing that work to industry-wide problem or is there something about the formula of these movies that you some props I wrote an article about them in two thousand seventeen and sort of was a little bit mystery overall you know this is a conversation we were having in wider industry circles in breasts and I'm I'm hopeful to see that continue where I do feel like they could perhaps the fat in the future as a queer lady myself and I want to note that a Danny joining us now on the phone from Los Angeles is Lacy Shebir she'll film mean girls and the Television Series Party of five lacy welcome to Angela an independent minded American tour guide who was fired from her a guide let's listen to them checking out the coliseum that was created in the time to appreciate my surroundings for instance how to celebrate Christmas Too Lacy Your Eighth Christmas film for the network what is it part of our tradition and I just love Christmas so much for me when people stop me and say you know what if your Christmas has become part of our family tradition I think it's nice to be able to sit down and have your family around and roles are a departure for a lot of our listeners who do know you from from these phil good films that come at the holiday season very very blessed and fortunate to have been a part of many different types of projects I mean that sounds such a nice home with homework and Michelle and bill and Randy and everyone the granted and in particularly appreciative that they are so collaborative with very it's been really nice for my life where my life is at this point and at the end Louis one better than the last and hell stories that are important okay you be hello can you hear me yes you're on Oh thank you I'm delighted to be on and I know someone mentioned something about the woman is kind of always characters have saved one another it doesn't seem to me to be such a woman damsel wonderful and my other point is I heard someone mentioned something about Oh Michael to write and execute think of trying to write us on it and figuring something in an because I love that behind the scenes thing judy on here thank you for the call you are playing these characters you're bringing these characters to life talk a little bit sure but I I really appreciate the point that the caller just in the script you know where is it where the other person gets the other characters what do occur throughout all of the movies and as far as like you were and you know it's our job to make that journey as interesting as possible and as you know trying the and I I love that part of the story and Michelle before we let you go in these films I know emily mentioned the Lgbtq community and others very complicated for sure because we have such huge success and but one of the things they do is they stop her and not only ask her which Christmas movies she doing this eight or we're in the eighth year so I think find that comfort in knowing that life is good in so many ways Hannukah movies this year we're really excited about and I think continuing to expand what we do winging network publicity at Crown Media thank you so much for joining us today thank is on point music I'm Robyn Hilton with NPR's also considered join us as we look back at the defining point I'm Kimberly Atkins we're discussing the outside success of the hallmark channel's on facebook at one point radio with me is Lacey Chabert she'll be starring also with US I wanNA start off by playing a clip from one of these films cat named Ambrose shows up at his door and finds that companionship near the closing scene of the movie was take a listen I love that you know made me believe I know you wanNA finish school and start it also demonstrates the hallmark channel's affinity for animals in its programming thank you heard it there in that clip you had the you had showing what Lacey and Michelle talking about earlier which is to people sort of growing together just coming together and there's a kitty what's what's not to like not to animal as a guest star yes I had I'm trying to think fun experience for me because I was I've been such a fan of hers forever and to get the opportunity her daughter Tina and my dog kitty who has since passed but Mariah's dog 'cause you know everyone wanted there's dog in it and I'll just say the puppies and one of these things or you know one of the movies especially the Christmas one suite hi you know Michelle had commented both my father and my father's eighty I'm fifty four my wife at this time it's what we need year and a half ago my father was diagnosed so we're looking for something that's GonNa make us feel good where the end of the day we're going to have a smile all the best lacy talk a little bit about what it's like clearly full yes my thoughts and prayers to your family wow that's a lot to going through also find thankfully but she just got out of the hospital so there I was in Texas Nice me from the movies and she was going through very difficult time and she I spoke and it's so nice to turn the TV and find hope and just be uplifted and aw there are those certain projects that do put something meaningful into I'm just I'm thankful to be a small part of it emily I want talk about it from a personal perspective and not just as as a media just let the movies roll over into each other and I have a lot of fond memories of sitting there and watching his hallmark does not look down on its audience for wanting to see something like that it's okay that you want to see things turn out well because so much in life doesn't turn out well and US we'll emily I wanna ask you then why haven't other networks the hallmark channel that's dedicated to this kind of film that does it as well as net Flexi do see some chatter around their Christmas movies every year but they and if like you secretly on you only secretly like it and you're sort of being like okay and I everybody

MIT Louis Atkins David Folkenflik Los Angeles Executive Kimberly one hundred percent one hundred years twenty years
Katie and Barclays Give Unsolicited Advice, And An Update To A Story About A Story About Identifying As An Attack Helicopter

Blocked and Reported

53:43 min | 2 months ago

Katie and Barclays Give Unsolicited Advice, And An Update To A Story About A Story About Identifying As An Attack Helicopter

"Katie all news is biased. One way or another sometimes it's unconscious by simply human nature and sometimes it's conscious like when i try to ignore news about your part of the country melting into the ocean because it's boring. The outcome is the same buys in the news. Impact how we see the world adding an online filter bubble so that makes has made getting the full story harder than ever crown news. The world's first news comparison platform has taken a different approach to improving the broken media ecosystem. Ground us gives you the ability to compare house verses with different biopsies or covering his story you can easily see if it's being spun to fit a political narrative. Their app also alerts you to any news blind spots on you may have stories that were only covered by one side of the political spectrum as a listener of blocking reported. You're likely hoping to move beyond regurgitated. Partisan hackery grab news enables you to do that for every story you read. It's a place for anyone who's tired of predictable. Mainstream narratives and interested in leaving their silos to see the fuller story. Learn more and try it for yourself by downloading the free ground news app or tried on the web at ground dot news slash block and reported. Again that's ground dot news slash blocked and reported jesse. Has it going any big plans for fourth of july katie. I am practically to messing with patriotism. How 'bout you god you just have to start the podcast. Fucking hager. warning jesse's using discussing terminology by flag is at full bass. When it comes to erica. My parents listen to this show. Jesse i take it. You're just sort of cowering inside away from the heat and stuff. You don't really like america. i don't really do holidays. I had somebody mentioned that it was a holiday weekend and until like now pretty much. I thought it was memorial day shit. I haven't bought a turkey. I do my only plan is to so it has been very hot and dry here in the pacific northwest is cool down but over the past weekend it was like one hundred and ten degrees just melting hot and it's been very dry. We generally june is called junior. It's gloomy wet and cold months but not this year. It's been super super dry. And you know we have a wildfire problem out here in the west so my plan for the fourth of july is to make myself a little badge and put on my yellow safety jacket and walk around confiscating fireworks for my neighbors from the city that you could do a like explosive gender review for america. So you can find you. Find out if america's boy or a girl it's a country. I am actually this weekend. If you're on the free she this will already be over by the time you hear this. I'm a groomsman for my friends wedding. So i'm helping to plan a bachelor weekend in virginia. That happens to fall on the fourth. This is just a group of my friend and some mutual friends and his friends. They're basically normies. Don't listen to podcast the activities. I planned i've included like we're going to sit around and make a list of our favorite youtube videos are our favorite instances of quote. Re tweeting stuff like that. I think it's like my friend asked me. He's like let's do outdoor stuff. Let's go for hikes. I don't think so. That's not my strong suit. This is great. This is like if jesse single planet theme park. Oh my god plot dude win. The blockchain reported empire has has swollen to eight times the size. We should totally have a theme park. And there'll be lots of indoor activities. So yeah i hope everyone has or had a good fourth. Remember that depending on your politics. America's either the greatest place on the earth or horrible dystopian laid shit hole. It's only one or the other nothing in the middle. Nothing in the middle allowed katie. What is the name of this podcast. That is and. I will repeat this terminology to mess with patriotism. This is black and reported. And i am a disgusted. Katie herzog to to message jesse siegel a new word. Or something. Plea i did i did. I tried to learn one new word every day. And then just use it a few times. It's from your ear boehner vocabulary list. Did you know the certain in you at tribes have twenty words for voters. That was a hate crime. You just did a hate crime on the fun. Very sub-tribes are very horny. Is what i'm saying all right so this week. We're to talk a little bit about our slate advice column you. I'm emphasizing this. You wanted to update everyone on. The nicole hated joe situation right. Yeah just a quick update and then we're gonna talk about what else we got we got. There is a a big follow up story about an interesting controversy from the sci-fi world involving a story about someone who's gender is attack helicopter. I will explain. Katie what should we start with. You want to do the barkley's thing to oh my god. Yeah maybe we should start with the barkley's thing did you listen to that yet. Dead so we'll drop it here. Gender identity gender expression sexual attraction sexuality. They're all different elements to who we are. Somebody can be transgender and gay transgender and by transgender and straight they may be transgender and feel feminine but express themselves in a masculine manner. That doesn't need to be a link between them where people go wrong. Is they think they need to understand it. You don't need to understand it but to be a better ally. There are three things that you need to do. You need to wise up. Stand up and show up. Wising up is about educating yourself and not expect to lgbt plus community to educate you standing up is about standing up for the community as if you're part of the community and showing up is about being visible in your allies ship. It's about saying i'm an ally and being proud to be an ally adding your pronouns to your email signatures social media sites and observing remembrance days like trans day of remembrance and sharing those on social media too. You don't need to be an expert but by helping yourself and educating yourself. You're helping others. You're saying i'm an ally. And i think about diversity and inclusion and that is the first step to brilliant ally ship katie. I just wanna say after. I listen to this. My heart swale with gratitude. That barclays a billion dollar multinational bake is giving me social justice advice. Who better right. But i really like about this. This clip is that it's the like lowest bar possible to being a good ally. it's just performance. I know. I know. I did a horrible job. Introducing this was posted to the barclays twitter. Feed i guess during private. Oh we're out of pride we're no longer susceptible to during katie vilely. Say how she really feels about. Lgbt people think i k- couches or gonna go on discount. Now they burn them right at the stroke of midnight. It's not. It's not very environmentally friendly for people who don't know what we're talking about. I ki- this week. Released a bunch of couches easier just art couches there unfortunately not for sale. That were inspired. By pride flags they notably left out the gay flag. That was like there was one for like a sexual which i got to say. I'm not sure that asexuality countess the sexual orientation as much as it's maybe like a hormonal issue anyway. They had factuals how their own couch but gays did not get a cow always fear that like we're going to stumble into what are low key. The most explosive areas of controversy. I do think asexuality is wanted him. So you think that asexuality is a orientation. Let's move let's move on. Let's move on. No no no i. Don't i think it's one of those things. Where what i've noticed from what i've dipped to toe into tumbler discourse on things like asexuality or people who are a romantic. Tell me if i'm wrong. I'm sure there are some people who do not have sexual attraction in other cases it sort of seems like it's like fifteen year olds figuring themselves out who maybe want to give like. It'll be like i whatever sexual. Because i only want to have sex with people who i feel an emotional connection to. It's like that's not really an identity orientation that's just how some people are wired. I mean the question is is not even is sexuality sexual orientation. it's should asexuality being included in the ever expanding. Lgbtq x. y. rambo acronym and my argument is no because this thing is the reason to have this. this like loose cl- coalition of sexual minorities is so that is political block. Because you have this thing in common in this thing in common is was at least oppression. And i'm not sure how asexually are oppressed in society interest. If you try to construct sort of a story of a sexual being oppressed you would really just circle back to like throughout history. A lot of people have been coerced sex for all sorts of reasons. The issue isn't bya sexual. It's like being a woman or not having power so you know what. I felt a little bit erased by the promotion because you know what flag was missing was the insult flag. That counts just has like a pattern of cheetos stains already on it. You know the other thing about this as somebody else pointed this out on twitter but these weren't actually couches. These were love seats. And why would you make a love seat for a sexual just half the size of a chair actually know what this sucks. But i know enough about this. That's considered offensive because a sexual is can be relationships just like everyone else. They just don't have sex now right. These are just called mary people. We ever even successfully introduced the first thing yet. We've already horribly offended a group okay. So barclays posted these videos for pride month. There was a lot the one you just heard is the longer version of those hosts on their website. And i don't know it's just like this very jumped out at me as very disturbing very twenty-first-century understanding of social justice where a is someone at a very powerful fairly evil country company. I mean in two thousand eighteen. These guys let me. Just read this from cnn so in two thousand eighteen barclays agreed to pay the united states. Two billion dollars for allegedly deceiving investors about the quality of mortgage mortgage deals that fueled the two thousand eight financial crisis now. Obviously that doesn't mean they're never allowed to speak about anything. It's just like a lot of people's noted this this this new thing where like the biggest most powerful institutions in the world are all mouthing the same words and what was interesting about the clip. Is she says you don't have to understand it. You just have to mouth long. Yeah absolutely i mean it is. It's totally performance. I'm checking right now. So we're recording this on on july first so the day after pride and i'm checking right now barclays twitter account to see if they have if they still have what the rainbow flag and their their their twitter image. They do not the clock it back to their normal logo of a steel boot. Skull of a poor person be convicted. Actually sort of an eagle is sort of reminiscent of a little sort of germany. Nineteen thirty six in the in the sidebar. However you have twitter you might also like other related brands and break comes up and they still have the rainbow flag so when it comes down to choosing your bank go at deutsche bank katie to be a better ally there three things you need to do. You need a wise upset up and show yeah and shot at barclays java barclays an open several accounts. So you can't really afford anyway. I don't know that jumped out at me. I don't like this sort of corporate activism thing. I think it's very bad. Fate jesse. It's it's over for another year. We we have eleven more months of of of corporations pandering for other causes besides gay shit very site about that all right. So what did you want to talk about. I you wanna do the sleeping or jay or well. Let's do a quick nicole. hannah jones. You did you notice how. I got her name. Correct yes yeah. You've been working with a coach on this. I have so. Let's do a quick update here. So the board of trustees at the university of north carolina voted on wednesday to grant her tenure and there was a little bit of drama at the meeting. Apparently it was a closed door meeting as the choices but some students showed up to protest and refuse to leave in shoot at the student. There's video floating around nicole. Hannah jones posted it of the students being forced like shoved out of the room. Which didn't certainly didn't look good but also they like they had to do the meeting so i don't know yes. This is so sorry. I'm being but like i do. Obviously this whole thing was political. I'm like twenty two directions. Because i want to be contrarian and and these sort of sainthood of her and the people treating this as in the broad category of stories about academic freedom. This is like the thing to be worried about annoyed me some mostly just responding to how annoying the people on her side. We're on twitter. Which is probably not the most mature way to approach issue. I totally feel you on this. Because part of this is because i think that her scholarship is over hyped and i don't think she's as good as her reputation would would would lead one to believe a bigger reason is because she's mean to my co host. Which is a job that i this is my job. I don't like it when people try to take over my job. She is mean to you she recently. What was this about. She recently accuse you of like fomenting the the the backlash critical race theory. It was very strange and then when when called. We talked about this on a patriot episode. We won't go much into it. But when called out on this when people including you including me including mcglesias astra two point to some evidence that you that you yourself have been you know a proponent of banning critical race theory in schools. She just ignored it and like left up this tweet or her. You know half a million followers accusing you of something that you haven't done. I don't think that shows very good due diligence or good reporting that said i also so the story subsequent reporting has shown that a major donor to the unc. School journalism named walter hussmann. Junior this journalism is named after him. He said arkansas newspaper publisher expressed his hesitation to have nicole. Hannah jones joined the faculty. The idea that somebody who has promised the school twenty six million dollars or something like that is going to leverage his donations over hiring decisions. I find that egregiously bad. This guy has said that he wasn't actually when he called to complain about or emailed to complain about nicole. Hannah jones is hiring that he wasn't trying to like leverage his his status as a donor. But that's kind of ridiculous like he does the school twenty six million dollars and he calls and makes a complain about a hiring decision. You know it's like very corrupt. And i i should say like my own my own qualms about her and i've read and enjoyed some work on segregated schools. Three is not just about like whatever dumb tweeted about me and as others have pointed out the whole sixty nineteen project thing all the vast majority of it is about her when it was a much bigger project and practically ended up but the is ironic that hurt so the essay that won the pulitzer was hers. Was this introductory essay. That has been it. Likes major parts of it have been questioned you know in. I don't know if deboned is the right word but have like major doubt has been cast on the whole premise of this essay. This is the one that won the pulitzer right. And my main gripe is there shoot like the revolutionary war being fought for slavery thing. I think it was like a really bad. And sloppy historical claiming and my main gripe is the way she responded to it. And if if anyone. I want to be fair if anyone has examples of nicole. Hannah jones like engaging with her critics or responding to criticism fairly. That's let me know. Let us know but like in my experience. She's not willing to be criticized without Not just doesn't react in a good way. And i think if you're gonna make like fairly radical historical claims like that you need to be willing to deal with with good faith criticism and i think a lot of it was good faith. There's also people who do hate are just because they're like they want america's like their big wonderful daddy and they can't stand the idea of its. It's good name being solely. That's a it is a common strain and conservative thought. This like rarely like immature nationalism. But a lot of the criticism was not that it was good all right so that probably wraps up this chapter of the nicole. Hannah jones controversy. Controversies whatever katie. Did you this slate. Advice column about spanish was something else was not. It was so this was shared on twitter. This week by lizzie. Wall reason magazine So we can blame her for bringing this to our attention and for people who are not familiar. Slates has about fifty or sixty advice columns and they are often hilarious. Unwittingly hilarious and i think this one falls into that category so i will read you the question here. This is to karen feeding. This is their Their parenting advice column and they often have oftentimes have different columnists like swap in and do a week or a day or whatever so the the the advice giver in this case is some named doyen richards dear care and feeding. My son is going into the seventh grade. This fall and apparently spanish is required for him and his current school. He can also take other languages but spanish is required. My son is white. And i do not think white people should speak spanish as cultural appropriation. In my eyes. Latin x people have been mocked for speaking spanish and to congratulate a white child for learning and speaking. It doesn't sit well with me. I would much prefer. He take french or latin but apparently there the district requires that students take it. I want to protest us but my wife has asked me not to into let it go. I took spanish when i was in school but it was a different time. And i definitely do not speak. It now have already told him. he's never just figured out of class. The only other option. I have is the put him in private school. But i'm not a fan of privatize education. Either is making sure he never speaks it out of class. A good enough solution or do i need to put my foot down with the school here. So my my theory is that it's a troll job at trauma what what's brilliant. I mean like as with all good. Trolling the white liberal meltdown. We're presently experiencing over race often does get like this crazy like if that was a robin dangelo book. You could believe that that was real. Well here's why. I think that it might be real one because people are fucking crazy and i think that people do really think shit like this but also the line about like the only other option i have is the put him in private school. But i'm not a fan of privatize education. It hits all the points there so you could put them in private school. But you need to virtue signal that you're not a fan of privatized education even though they're doing this even though the public school is doing is committing this. Hey cry by forcing your child to learn another language. Yeah all of that could also just be a talented troll would not like add a little true. But that's the thing about slate advice. Columns is you never know if they are real or if they are trolls and this goes back to like when emily offie who is just much better on every level would run them. Even some of the swansea ran you. Just you'd like is this person. Make this up. How do they know in this case. I forget the author's name but he did respond. Sorta like dude. What are you doing a man. Is that a man's name. I thought he mentioned it. Another response being a large african american. All you're right you're right. He does he does mention. Yeah that's right he mentions and the response that That he's a dad. He's a like a black father learning learning japanese. That's right very appropriate of this here in defense. So oftentimes the answers of slate advice. Columns are as insane as the questions and in this case he gave the correct answer. Which is like dude. It's possible to be to woke. There's nothing wrong with learning spanish. As long as your child doesn't like go around saying like i caramba or whatever like wearing a sombrero which. I don't didn't actually think it was necessary. The funny thing about this to me is that the this idea that it's cultural appropriation. In the first place as opposed to like being a good citizen the world and of your community and learning a language that people in your community probably speak like how is that not woke like trying to learn other people's languages that should be the woke position but according to this letter writer. That's not the woke position. It's cultural appropriation. I mean there is this ideology of basically woke segregation ism and we should maybe come up with a better name for that because like it's historically it pales in comparison to actual apartheid segregation ism. But but there's very neurotic people who really don't think we should do cultural dabbling there. People who will be mad that a white shaft makes a korean infused ish all these half of the dumb blowups going on in like food and the arts. Come down to this belief system. And it's very silly. And very neurotic. Ed totally as so in addition to being a hilarious possibly fake letter. This also gave me a reason to go back and read some of my favorite slate advice columns and it reminded me of a recent event that i really should have told you about as soon as it happened but i totally forgot so last year Before the pandemic. When i still had had a real job at the stranger there was a letter to the slate advice. Column how to do it. The column written by ridge jews wag the former or current. I'm not quite sure. Giselle gawker gated. This column was called. I'm a heterosexual woman. Who's politically opposed to heterosexuality. So this was in january. Twenty seven twenty twenty. And i saw this column and i wrote a column about it in the stranger so i i'll read you the question rich. I'm assists woman and kind of classic millennial sects pickle. I'm really repelled by heterosexuality politically personally. But i'm also really into dick. I've been thinking. Maybe i should look for by by curious. Gay dudes but. I'm not sure how best to do that. Rich what would you think of a woman being on grinder scruff. I do want to be respectful of gaiman spaces and not horn. And where. I'm not welcomed but i really would love to find a verse guy with queer politics. Who would who would be up for casually dating a woman. What do you think if you were me. Where would you look radical so riches answer to this was sort of like okay you can do it but be polite but i thought the whole thing was stupid so i wrote my own column. That must have been his slow news. Day wrote my own column and respond to this sort of like a a second opinion. An unsolicited second opinion. I'll read you a little bit of my call. So people can sort of get the tone assuming that the self-loathing heterosexual men actually exists. She doesn't specify what exactly it is about heterosexuality politically whatever that is that. You find repellent. Perhaps it's the mandatory sexual 's everyone knows the only way for women to get out of the missionary position in washing. The dishes is to either go gay or data man that's it. There's no other possibility but to get serious for a moment. I'm curious about why this woman thinks bisexual or vicarious dues are somehow inherently better than straight men. Does she think there's something about men fucking men that makes them more feminist more ethical and if so how she ever met one or has she ever heard him jeffrey dahmer. Ironically this letter writers actually stereotyping queer men as sin of the highest order because queer men are actually just as complex human and flawed. Is anyone else. Character is no more determined bisexuality that it is by collar and men on greider are no less likely to be good or bad than men. On tender or bubble there are however more likely to be gay into wonder. Why the hell she is on kreider so while this woman didn't ask for my advice. Here's my unsolicited opinion. If you really wanna be queer but can't keep up the dick. Find yourself a nice. No op trans lemon. And if that doesn't solve this classic millennial sex a big. There's always tender and bubble. I'm sort of surprised that got published in the stranger in twenty twenty. This must have been my editor must have been out for the day. I don't think that they would publish that now. Anyway so a couple weeks ago or a couple of months ago. I had of course totally forgotten about this. It was longtime ago and much has happened since january. Twenty twenty but a couple of months ago. I got a message on reddit. Jesse let me read this to. Hey i'm the odious slate rhetoric letter writer you covered in this piece. Just wanted to say that your take was one hundred percent accurate always being very shitty in very dumb should have accepted being straight and works on my own gender role anx instead of trying to drag queer people into my bullshit a lot earlier in my life. Good lord anyway belated. Thanks for the wake up. Call and sorry. I'm opting for the anonymous red. It means of contacting you like a coward. Just going this route. Because i am in fact a coward. That's a really good responser like she shows like that. She bloomed some self awareness. It she did. i wonder if she's a podcast listener. I will say. I have sort of changed my mind on this. My opinion on this now is that so grinder does have have like you can be a straight woman on the app. They make like they make concessions for that. There's a whole category. You can choose that. I still think it's like sort of dumb and counterproductive and you're probably not gonna get very far being heterosexual and on this app. That's primarily for gaming. But i no longer am so like appalled by this behavior calling in a classic millennial sects pickle is kind of funny but my feeling about it now sort of like you know what. It doesn't actually violate the apps rules and i guess. I become more of a libertarian. Because if the app like allows the business allows you to do this thing then. Who am i to say that you shouldn't do this thing. So we have both we have both evolved in the census so this was published her her. Classic millennial sects picou came to a satisfying conclusion. I should ask her if she's if she's got a husband our or boyfriend maybe a final. How dating life is going. She's dating a very misogynistic. Gay guy now. He makes her do all the cooking and cleaning. Okay so after getting this letter in reading the letter from slate. I dove into some other classic slate advice. Columns jesse i just want to want to choose a couple of these to read you. Please do so. This one is from Recently it's june twenty twenty one also the the advice columnists also and feeding but the advice giver in this in. This case is nicole chung. The letter writer writes my husband's closest friend from childhood his japanese-american and although he moved back to japan after college. They're still very close. He's our daughter's godfather and they think of him and his wife is another uncle and aunt were also called uncle antibi- his kids for our daughter's fifth birthday. They sent her a sweet gift box. Boxful of japanese candies stuff toy and a komodo in her size. It's absolutely gorgeous. But i'm hesitant to let her wear as much as she begged us to let her dress up and show it to her friends. I know how big of an issue cultural appropriation is. And i don't want her to think that somebody else's culture is a costume. She has a lot of anti-racist children's books and books about kids from other cultures celebrating holidays and traditions. And this could be a great way for us to talk about the problems of white people appropriating other cultures and using them costumes but also our friends have been asking her if she liked asking us if she liked her kimono. And i don't know what to tell them. I'll confess i don't wanna be thought of as another insensitive white lady who let her kids dress up as stereotypes of other cultures and that may be a part of what's holding you back from letting her where it so. I think an outside perspective might help. What do i do let her wear it or talk to her about why she can channel nicole chung for a second. How do you answer this question. There's a personality characteristics called neuroticism that is correlated with a lot of bad outcome. So you know. I mean it's just like it is the absolute dominance of of privileged white people in racial justice conversation. And they're stupid shitty made up problems. I mean if you put your kid in a komo kids dress up as things and these are from actual japanese people who want her to wear the cremona correct right. I mean yes. That's the part to me. That's so funny. Is i think that what she's doing is actually more offensive. Like somebody gives you a gift and instead of enjoying the gift in saying that you like the gap in using the gaps or whatever you put the gift in the box and say like no no no no harmful right well. I'll harmful also based on how these dynamics play out or how. I've seen them play out. I bet you anything. Average japanese person like in japan undefended the average quarter japanese twitter person. That's who would get mad about that. Now my dad went to. He went to college at the american university of beirut and so he has like a variety of like keep you like whatever like things that people wear in the arab world and my lazy halloween costume. When i was a kid was basically like putting a turban on like every other year which is actually probably not as problematic as there was when when we were in second grade. My sister dressed up as harvey gantt. Do you know who that is. Okay so harvey gave for people who don't know who's a politician in north carolina. Who ran against jesse helms. Who's a black man. She did not wear black phase but she had a like a picture of his face on a on a popsicle stick like a cardboard cutout picture of his face and she just suit. She actually won our second grade halloween costume podcast that year. I do not think. I do not think that that that that sort of costume would would garner such praise now know if memory serves that was the congressional race that generated in a timeless michael jordan quote. When he was asked why he didn't chime in on that against helms he said republicans buy sneakers to a job at barclays. This is the guiding principle of our podcast republicans. Download podcasts. do okay. So so that letter. Writer like maybe. It's the same person who's writing. Who's maybe there's just one slate letter writer who just like reposes the same question over and over again just like very concerned about cultural preparation all the all the stuff we've been hearing about incredible advances in machine learning and ai. It's all just going towards generating sort of realistic slate advice letters. Okay let's let's do one more. This one is also and feeding karen. Feeding is actually. I did not think the most egregiously stupid slate rutter letter. Slate advice call podcasts. That would be the not current. But last incarnation of dear prudence. However oh my another subject. Yep okay so this one. The letter answer the advice giver. This week is a woman named jamala limo limb limo. I'm not quite sure pronounce her name. Just lemieux dear karen feeding. We live in a very multicultural and socio economically diverse area in south florida. We are white. And both my husband. And i are while professionals are four and a half year old daughter who has grown up socializing with all types of children has a close friend who was black and one who is brazilian. There are two hispanic little girls at the preschool. That have made me niche comments to my child based on her race and appearance. They had told her that they don't like her because of her blonde hair and they won't be friends with her because she doesn't speak spanish. I reiterated to my daughter that she should be kind that all people are saying on the inside that we shouldn't judge people by their appearance this past week. She informed me that the girls have not now told her that they will only be friends with other girls who have dark skin. Not like skin like hers. We are only three weeks into the school year. But i'm thinking of emailing the teacher comments about skin color and hair color. Seem really wrong to me. If my child said she didn't want to be friends with a little spanish girl because her skin was to browner. Because her hair's block. I would certainly take. Action is a to soon reach out and if not what should i say okay. This is sign. Sad line blonde child. Can i just predict what what what happens here. I bet you anything. She's going to pick up on the like. Oh so you're saying it's reverse racism that that's anywhere near as bad. Jessie are you familiar with this. One does you know. Unfortunately we spend too much time on twitter. You internalize the stupid people's opinions. Yes okay so so the letter answer. There's sort of. There's sort of a long response here. So i'm just going to pick out a couple of pieces of it. Your mom who takes pride in surrounding her child with diverse neighbors a diverse circle of friends. So i trust you will take this seriously the hostility that hispanic or perhaps latin necks. Children have this late towards your daughter is inappropriate and must be addressed regardless of what may have triggered it. However i'm curious to know if they have simply targeted her for looking different than they do or if there's something more complicated at hand you say you're in a culturally and economically diverse community which likely means an area that is undergoing gentrification. You also pointed out that your family as well to do which leads me to infer that these children may be from a somewhat somewhat different background and even if they do have upper middle class parents there are still some shop. Sharp contrast to how your respective families are experiencing south florida as well as america. Okay so let's just pause there for a second so this this assumption that because these these brown people live in south american and live in south florida that they are not upper middle class. I find that sort of odd because preschool daycare. These things are generally segregated by class. No katie i'm sure. A wealthy white person has their kid in like a bottom rung. Daycares section eight daycare for sure for sure. So that's that's first of all i like. I really appreciate the assumption that this is like. Gentrification must be happening because it south florida like this is this is one of the most diverse places in the country right and just this assumption like oh if you live in this place. You're you're living in diverse area. It must be gentrifying rather than just like oh you live in one of the most diverse regions of fucking america. Okay continuing between the likely changes in your neighborhood. And the increasingly open contempt for hispanic and latin x people that has been cooked soaked by the current presidential administration. There a strong possibility that these kids may have seen or heard or experienced some things that mike thanks them hostile towards urfi fearful fearful of white folks so i should say this was twenty nine eight and she's talking about donald trump not joe biden but to move on the girls may have heard their parents talk about rising rents pushing neighbors of a neighborhood that may be changing to serve a wealthier whiter population. They may have witnessed friends being mistreated by members of the maga- hat masses or some racists ass liberals they may even have seen loved ones harassed or detained by immigration enforcement agents then number of assumptions that she is making the pruitt's project. it's projecting. I mean if sorry but if a white person was like this is what the tino families think about it. Be fucking borderline racist. Yeah i was just going to say that. There's a word for this and it's racist so we're also these are these are these are preschool. Kids right so these are kids who are three or four years old. Do you think these three or four year olds are actually cognizant of like maga- hats kitty. Three your three year olds are mean. It's always for good reason okay. Three year olds are never just like meeting for no reason. Come on and this is. This is reminiscent of the other classic slate advice. Call my two year. Old isn't anti-racist enough. Do you know about that one. I think i read it once. I find these so difficult to get through because they just like. Make me mad and tired in this. One is unfortunately this really. I really wish that i could read it. But it's it's behind a paywall. I don't know why they would put this this classic letter behind a paywall but they did. And there's no fucking way joining slate plus so if anybody has has access to the classic slate column my two year old is an anti-racist enough please gas a pdf. Okay that's it. I don't think i had any more of these advice. Columns there are so many more anybody issues. If you're just like board you have nothing to do you did. The heroic work of gathering many of these will include links in the in the show notes. It was interesting to go back and read. I read a couple of old. Emily offi columns and then to compare those two to this late advice. Columnists of today is really a different world. Yeah i think that's understatement before you in the last segment housekeeping. You can always reach us at blah. Puerto podcast at gmail.com. We have a sub reddit. Reddit dot com slash are slash blockchain reported. Jesse did you see the fascinating conversation happening on our sub at right now about how someone posted about. How like four of her five girlfriends are now trans. I did see this. I was scared to talk about it. But this goes into your theory about the erasure. It's not a fucking theory. It's a it's an observation. Only when i show include to it in the show is basically she was basically saying. Oh this is posted by a butch lesbian right. Who's finding she can't find. No fam family likes what you're sorry and can't find bush's to date because they are all transitioning was at the just. Yeah that's the just in a lot of other people wait in. I love this. Because i've been talking about this for years and i think that people often think that i'm exaggerating the scope of this and i'm not like i am. I am talking about my own experience for sure but my observation. I've said i don't. I said this. Fucking a million times spike somewhere between a third and a half of the like former dykes that i know are now transfer. Non binary at least and that number is constantly going up so it was for me to like for someone else to validate that this is happening. Elsewhere was validating discussion. You could get a do at ready. Dot com slash monitor imported merged bar dot org and premium subscription right. Katie yes we have a premium subscription program if you go to patriot dot com slash blockchain reported for just five dollars a month. You can get ad free episodes of this podcast in addition to three extra episodes of this podcast every fucking month. We also do live chats. We do ask me anything. You get advance. Maybe we talk about that advance ticket sales to live show. It looks like we're going to a live show and we will likely be able to release some advanced tickets to that person. You also get the weekly free episodes early. Yeah so lots of good stuff there. Please come check it out. Patriot dot com slash blockchain reported. So this last bit this has been an interesting story unfolding for while i've written a little bit about sort of blow ups in the young adult fiction world. Some of this sort of social justice wars going on there. There was a really interesting flare up of this stuff in sifi in january of twenty. Twenty so in clark's world magazine which is a very highly regarded sifi publication january twenty twenty. They publish a story called is sexually identify as an attack helicopter. That's an author named isabel fall katie. Are you familiar with that. Line of text. Yes so basically. It's basically a way of making fun of trans people like you say. Oh you're a woman. I'm an attack helicopter. Ha it goes back to like twenty. Fourteen is not an original joke. I don't think it's like somebody like whoever came up with that should do. Nf t for the first of the identifies attack as good idea so the title of the story is designed to be you know shocking to get people's attention because the subset of people who will know what this means will be offended by it. But it's like a really mind-blowing story it starts. I sexually identifies an attack helicopter. I lied according to. Us army technical manual zero the soldier as a system attack helicopters gender identity. Not a biological sex. My dog tags informed three three four nine say my body is an ex carry. Type semantic female. It's just it turns into this incredible story about the army. Basically coopting gender to make more efficient killing machines and i talked about. This person's identity is an attack helicopter their gunners identity. There's some sort of crazy war going on in the near future. Us include a link to the story. I just if you like sci fi. I don't have the vocabulary to explain why it's good. It's just it's really good now. Because of the title as soon as it went up people started saying it was transphobic and they started saying this is just like a reactionary. Try to troll people and not long after that and deal clark who runs. Clark world confirmed this rumor. That isabel fall was herself a trans woman but he also took the story line. And there's this long to me like pretty cowardly statement. He posted explaining his decision to take it off line. Let me explain one bit. That i read one bit that i find problematic own voices. Is this thing in fiction of like having gay characters written by gay people characters earned by trans people even with own voices authorship and own voices sensitivity reading it is still possible to miss something in this case we can see two groups of trans readers with directly opposing views. That are deeply rooted in their own experiences and perspectives in some cases. What made the story speak to. Som- is also what alienated others. Neither perspective is wrong but they appear to be incompatible with one another on some level knowing that this was a potentially controversial story we should have employed a broader range of sensitivity readers. So now it's not. You don't just eat one sensitive reader you need all of them in case someone somewhere finds a story hurtful. I'm they should have gotten a sensitivity reader who actually identifies as an attack helicopter. That would've fought solved it. I just. I couldn't really believe this because it's like neither perspective is wrong. Well i mean if you're going to pull a story off lied i'll be at this. Was that isabel falls. Feser falls request that sort of like a big deal. And i think just saying i'm offended by the subject of the story because it's something a reactionary person would say without factoring in what's actually the story like. That's just a plain misunderstanding. Fiction right yes it is of course like we judge these things by these new rules that somehow popped up in the last few years right rosette and we never accepted before that like if a racist character says something racist that means the authors raises which has literally been the reason. Young adult books have come under intense scrutiny and sometimes been canceled. There's a really good quote from contra points she she's very good trans youtube creator she did. I'll basically film length thing on canceling quote just because you were hurt by content. I made doesn't mean that that content is bad or that. I'm victimizing you in some way. She basically just points out that people are like people are traumatized. iran himself and creators can't really account for that. I don't know it's just like people. People get pissed off online can give themselves so much power. And i think that's a big part of the problem. My favorite response which i didn't know at the time. This was back. In january of twenty twenty n que jemison who's a highly claim sci-fi fantasy author who's frequently terrible person online cat rosenfield and i had a unfortunate run it with her she a series of tweets after the story was taken down quote. I'm glad the story was taken down quote. Not all art is good. Art sometimes causes harm than later quote. I haven't read this story. One of the most presently influential people in sci-fi publicly cheering for story being pulled down because it's harmful. This is her argument when she hasn't read it. And this is a story about by a completely unknown person trying to gain a foothold in the scifi world. It must suck to be a sci fi or fantasy or young adult right. How how do you possibly navigate this shitty full of just like people trying to destroy everyone else's work. Well so do we know that the author is completely unknown so this was written under a something of a pseudonym this is not the neon at the person that the author goes by all the available evidence suggests like this was someone who was. We'll get to why we know some of this in a minute but someone who was basically toying with coming out as trans publicly but was not a known figure in fi or anywhere else. Yeah okay was it possible that it was clark himself. You imagine that'd be. I don't know jesse single you. Are you having changed as as praises. So this week. Vox has an article by emily dandruff skew critic at large there. We've talked about it a little bit before. She was very opposed to the harper's letter and sent a note to her bosses. Saying that the fact. That matt iglesias her then colleague signed a letter made her feel less safe at. Vox again then. She posted this letter on twitter for everyone to see yes and then i along with everyone else made fun of it. I did a couple of times. And then she said that. I was the reason for a cavalcade of subsequent. Alleged death threats. It's always jesse singles. Always blame the james ju- anyway setting that aside. This is an interesting article. She wrote this basically explaining to people whose controversy she was able to get in touch with isabelle fall and the short version. Isabel fall destroyed her and she checked into a hospital with suicidal allegation. She is now just not gonna come out as trans because her sort of introduction to being trans online even under a pseudonym was so ugly. And it's an interesting piece. Because emily vanderbilt is clearly upset by what happens and clearly thinks what the internet did was horrible but she's also very committed to the idea that canceled culture. Whatever you wanna call. It is not a big deal. This is pretty court in that like vox. Universe ideology well and it's also hilarious dislike. The lack of self awareness is hilarious. Because she's she's basically saying like. This person was unfairly unfairly pegged as being transphobic and had ruined her life. Where else has that happened. Jesse emily vanderbilt is never going to like brought in her mind and extend that extend that possibly to other people like potentially like mangla. Acs or jesse single or whoever so another thing she points to so you wrote a paywall walled sub stack about this about this conflict when this drama when it came out and she uses that as an mp by connor connor fritters in the atlantic as evidence of like this thing existed on like sci fi twitter and transmitter and then the media picked it up and then like that's what made it a problem. You're shit was behind a paywall for what it's worth. I didn't quite interpret it. I think she was just pointing out that. Like bless you see. Let's just see. Let's read it on. Most of the people i talked to for the story regardless of whether they initially criticized or appraise attack helicopter cited articles by established pundits including one in the atlantic supercharging. The discussion established pundits. Right there links to your paywall sub stack. How many of the people do you think that. Emily vander werff talked to for the story our subscribers paid subscribers to your sub stuck. Why would hope all of them katie. It's definitely you have a huge audience. Among hyper woke online friends of emily vander waves the part. That i really got to me was. I'm just gonna read this paragraph. it's very easy to do a paranoid reading on twitter says lee mandela phd. Candidate the university of kentucky blah blah blah. They were among the earliest advocates of attack helicopter. And they wrote a lengthy twitter thread collected as a blog post about paranoid versus repetitive. Readings of art. In response to clark's world. Polling the story. so this paranoid repaired of readings framework. I find very useful. Iran dwarf continues. The delineation between paranoid and repaired of readings originated in nineteen ninety-five with influential critic. Eve kosovsky sedgwick. A paranoia reading focuses on. What's wrong or problematic about a work of art. A repaired of reading seats out what might be nourishing or healing in a work of art. Even if the work is flawed importantly repaired of reading also tends to consider what might be nourishing or healing in a work of art for someone. Who isn't the reader. I don't wanna take everything back to the harper's letter but the harper's letter did not say anything. Anyone actually finds offensive. The reason this was a globe is because people including vanderbilt read it in a deeply paranoid way including one person who literally crossed out the words. Replace those words with things. Like i question trans people's rights to exist. You could not actually read the text unless you read in very paranoid way and come away thinking it was bad let alone so bad that you should contact your bosses over your colleague signing. Do you think that. Emily vendor worth like when she was writing this piece. She had any sort of shades of like m. i. hypocrite. I mean it's weird. She doesn't overall a good piece. And if i didn't know the author was enjoyed it more she doesn't pull punches. She's like people acted online. She also captures an important dynamic which is six gender people helped launch. This pylon against isabel fall. Because they're only sort of re tweeting. The paranoid takes from transgender people. If you're assist gender person you have no incentive to surface. Oh no. I think it's not that big a deal. I think the stories five but yeah so because she's committed to like not seeming to side with the cancel culture. People and i agree. That's about term but my argument along has just been like social media has made these pylons brutal and unfair and they target everyone you know. She ends the peace basically being like in some telling the story. We've robbed isabelle follower agency. She really she decided to cancel herself which is like not really. She says she would have. She was on the path coming out of the trans woman. If all these assholes on the internet had it destroyed her mental health. I think again. I do think it's interesting. People should read it all. Endorse it. But i think emily where is not sort of grappling with like. No this shit is really fucked up and it didn't exist twenty years ago. We should be able to talk about that. One thing that. I found interesting about this. Is that so isabel fall. Nobody knows what her who she is. Besides this name. She's nowhere online. And this experience i don't know what her and it almost feels weird to call her because she says in the piece like she's not transitioning so i don't know how how the author of the piece actually identifies now but we'll call her so this attacks like normally when you have an attack on your reputation online it's on your actual reputation. It's on jesse single it's katie. Here's on emily vanderbilt for whoever it's attached to your actual identity and so she still had this this like. She checked in checked herself into a mental hospital. Even though the name itself wasn't attached to her her reputation as her her prior reputation the name that she was known under yeah. I think it's complicated. But i do think like her goal. Maybe her goal was to eventually attach her real identity to fall. Because this story she eventually changed the title republished. It was nominated for a hugo which is a very big deal so this could be like under normal circumstances and this is someone. Who's who's in early thirties or early to mid thirties. This is like how you start. A career a sci fi writer so she also talks a little bit about. How just like she interpreted this as i wasn't successful enough at writing as a woman which triggered her dysphoric. I don't think that's a healthy way to look at it. 'cause people attacked everyone online for a million reasons. If anything being attacked as a good sign you are a woman. Well maybe isabel fall. Is actually emily banda worth. We'll never know. Whoa wow you really. There could be some to us here as always linked to all this stuff in the show notes. I highly recommend you read the short story itself and then i unlocked my own subject on at the time. And then there's emily vandieres follow up which is worth a read anything else this week. Katie i think that's how fourth of july or whatever this has been blocked reported. I'm jesse single. Remember do not adopt any political positions. That have not been preapproved by exxon mobil. And i'm caterers. And also remember if you need advice on parenting. Don't ask slate adblocker blocked and reported.

Hannah jones barclays twitter katie jesse america nicole Fucking hager barkley Katie herzog jesse siegel nicole chung katie vilely Katie barclays java barclays hannah jones walter hussmann
The Ocho: One-possession games have been tough for Dallas

Blogging the Boys

23:53 min | 2 years ago

The Ocho: One-possession games have been tough for Dallas

"America what up world welcome to another episode of the Ocho presented in partnership as has always explanations blogging the boys dot com. My name arduous. Charleena me of course from an from radio host on the road show. It is Thursday the third day November fourteenth two thousand nine hundred and I mentioned the third day. I've gotten some questions in terms of what am I talking about. You need to watch friends if you haven't ever in your life I don't know how you've made it to this point without watching friends but that is a friend's reference and by the way I saw that there are some murmurings of them doing a reunion of sorts and and this is a week where I'm definitely feeling nostalgic because of Disney plus and everything. I don't need a friends reunion. Not I don't want that friends is my all time favorite Sitcom I told all the time ended. I looked like Ross. And so you know what it's perfect as is I don't I don't need. I don't need another reboot. Just make something new. which is what we're doing here today on Thursday? We have an injury report to talk about. We have some relevant things when it comes to the Dallas cowboys but before we get into all that I really you know we appreciate our listeners. So much on the OCHO and really all of our readers in our commenters and everybody. That's affiliated with Blob in the boys talk all the time about what makes bt special is the community behind it. I mean we have it just the best people that interact with us. Everywhere and on twitter in our instagram audience is growing in on facebook. And if you're not falling everywhere we were on twitter. At blogging. The boys we are on instagram blogging. DOT The dot boys. You can go like us on facebook and I just I want to give a big shout out to Jay. Jay Abraham who sent me a message on facebook. The book faces racist. Jj said he listens every morning when he drives his daughter to school so a big shadow to Sofia an ally. Listen to your dad. He's a cool dude and I hope hope you guys have a great day at school. I hope everybody else has a great day at school or a great day at work. Whatever you got going on We have again. We have a new week to look forward to the Dallas cowboys. Visit the Detroit Lions. This Sunday they look to rebound from their big loss to the Minnesota Vikings. And there's been a lot of talk about this this vikings game in kind of everything everything that was sort of a lasting impact from it. I know that we've mentioned that here and I don't I can't recall a time. where a loss? Just don't like this. I mean it feels. I was like this won't go away and some of that is because of the skepticism that people have of the coaching staff of the decisions they made. Whether that's you know the decision to punt on the third down we've talked about that in in various places we have a video up on that on the bt Youtube Channel go subscribe there as well Whether that was the decision to run it on second in down in the penultimate possession to run on third down The decision to go to Zeke the Dak made on fourth and five the all important fourth-down or the decision to to fair catch it. That's really kind of the decision that has hovered kind of like a punt in the air. That's been the one that people have really sort of sunk their teeth into and I think a lot of it is because and to be clear. I'm recording this late Wednesday night so all week. Long people have been an leading up to Wednesday. I should should say been upset with Jason Garrett because people feel like he hasn't really taking ownership of this and he's deflected blame. He's blamed Keith. o'quinn for for that moment. He's blamed Avon Austin he blamed Prescott for the RPO. He blamed Kellen Moore. He's deployed collar. People want to see the head coach be accountable here and ultimately I think I think the people people when they're upset about a loss like this. I think that Jason Garrett could've come out on Sunday night in his immediate post game press conference and he literally could have said. You know what this was on me. I made bad add mistakes. Everybody be mad at me and I don't think that people would have been satisfied. I think this is a lose lose situation for Jason Garrett and that's you know that comes with the territory of in the cowboys head coach. Obviously it's a situation he's in as it's a contractors. It's full season. He has yet to reach Tennessee. Title Game You know all of that but the Tae von thing has really kind of resonated with people because people feel like he threw von Osten under the bus so to speak. Because you look at Avon Austin there's definitely miscommunication education. Jason Gritz said that he fair catches immediately. You've seen it a thousand times by now. All the room in front of him and Jason Girl was challenged on this on Wednesday during his press conference conference. And if you're not aware of this by the way every day Jason Garrett speaks in his press conferences anytime you has a surprise one whatever we recap those for your blog on the boys dot com. If you don't have time to watch watch it yourself or listen on the street I wanNA after the fan as well the home of the cowboys I if you just want sort of the spark notes we hit you with that. But so Jason Gert was is pressed on the tape von Osten being pressed about taking ownership for it pressed about taking ownership specifically for it NFL exchange slater really kind of grilled him. And I thought aww his response was was really interesting in a lot of ways. So here is Jason Garrett answering the question from Jane Slater regarding the Tae von Osten Fair catch and whether he deserves blame internally specifically on his own shoulders because he's Jason Garrett from Dallas Cowboys Dot Com curious Austin situation. Did she like you guys. Mismanaged not personally. Mutating yourself with him. Play because as he talked he didn't give him on Austin corruption cash. Yeah I don't want to get too much in the Minnesota game. I'll I'll address this situation. We should have done a better job communicating with him and that situation. When you want to err on the side of fair catch could you don't want to spend a lot of time you know pulling time off the clock by having a return that they get you five or six yards so you want to go on with the mindset of fair catch this thing around midfield and give ourselves a chance Kelly? The discussion should have been more complete. Saying if you get into a situation where you do you have a low kick and you can go north and south quickly and gain yardage do that. We didn't communicate well enough with the player. Okay that's all of its on me. It's on Keith. It's on every coach every player involved in that situation. We didn't do a good enough job. That in Jason Garrett speak especially the way he started that answer when he said. I don't WanNa get too much into the Minnesota game to be clear at this point. He'd already been a little bit grilled by the local media. Attendance that is code for. I do not want to talk about this and Jason. Garrett doesn't get aggressive you you see a lot of times in in the NFL and even college football. And that's just for football. I mean you see coaches kind of get pushed to the edge. That very very very very rarely happens. which basically and I mean mean very very very rarely and not that he was even pushing the edge here but he was definitely aware that this was a controversial thing and etc and so it was interesting to see how he obviously finally put some blame on himself in terms of vocalizing? It you know for all we know. Jason walked into the locker room after the game and said that's how me whatever but he finally said it behind a microphone he puts blame on Keith o'quinn the Special Teams Coordinator put some Montauban himself. Put some blame on every play around him. I mean it was it was a cluster luster. There's no way around that but this to me. What this reminds me of because again? This is so rare and I talked about this on the radio with with a couple of people on Wednesday. If you remember in two thousand and sixteen obviously deck and Zeke's rookie Dez Bryant got hurt in week. Three against the Chicago go bears and there was all of this stuff about how he You know was afraid to take his MRI and etc and Jason Garrett told the the San Francisco media because the cowboys were playing the forty niners that week before he told the local media. And that was I mean. That's that's a no no as far as you know media your protocol and that's why I've been talking all week. Jay Singer typically gets this stuff and he typically handles it really well and so this von thing specifically I mean there were a lot of questionable questionable calls in this game. This thing has kind of felt like that but I mean it's interesting to see how you know I it's starting waiting to fade away but it was something that I think really challenged Jason in a way that nothing else. has this season because in other guys used to being on the hot seat the guys used to questions about his job security already excetera but but this in a way challenged his competence and challenged his ability to communicate with his players and challenged his. You know I said it's competence but its competence as a head coach specifically as the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys. So a very very interesting. Sort of set of circumstances that followed Jason Garrett You know in the aftermath of the Tae von Austin catch no catch fair catch whatever the case may be You know you get the picture But there is a lot not to consider when it comes to the cowboys visiting the Detroit. Lions this week obviously You know the status of Matthew Stafford is one that people are they are very aware of Matthew. Stafford did not play last week. Obviously for the Detroit Lions when they took on the Chicago Bears Chicago bears and If he doesn't play early on Sunday I mean I think. I don't think anybody will be saying we never root for injury. Nobody ever wants to see any sort of injury whatsoever but you know it's it's it's up in the air so let's get into injury. Let's talk about Wednesdays injury report. Let's see who's on WHO's not on the in our thoughts etc before we get to that. Let's take a very quick break to hear a word from our sponsors. Are you a netflix person. Are You more into Hulu. You got that. Hbo Now thinking about that Whole Apple TV plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never ends so on today. Explained Fox's Daily News podcast. We're going to talk to vox. This is critic at large. Emily Vander worth about the coming streaming. Wars and. Emily is going to talk about how it's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her favourite medium television and how the monocultures basically dead but also she will reveal whom she thinks will win the streaming wars and also also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming wars and also shield criticize some of the lesser shows. That have come out of the streaming wars. You'll you'll know everything you need to know. You know which service you should be subscribing to and which ones you should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other other than watch TV ever again check out today explained wherever you listen to your podcast. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right now. Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk and we're the host of the shutdown forecast your avengers of college football podcast. It says in the script into riff on what that means and basically what is this all already spoiled every Tuesday. We talk about everything from cooking disasters pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants. We Warren Middle School. We also do talk about college football every now and then like mascot fights announcers answers fleeing the booth early. And unfashionable pants. That coaches where now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP all right so it is Thursday. The third day as it's Thursday that means we have a Wednesday injury injury report to discuss the cowboys but their injury report just like every NFL team in the afternoon and so this is Wednesdays injury report. We will have Thursdays available for you as soon soon as it's out over a blog on the boys dot com. Make sure you stay tuned. Their actually follow us on twitter. We'll get it for you there as well. So as far as the Detroit lions are concerned. I mean You know there's a lot of you know interest in what is going to happen with you know Matthew Stafford obviously people are weary of the fact that Matthew Stafford did not play last week for the lines against the Chicago bears so these are the players for the Detroit. Lions that had limited participation. The patient in practice on Wednesday Jon Adkins or defensive tackle miles killebrew their safety and Sam Martin. Their punter has an abdomen injury. I don't know if that's like appendicitis undecideds or something. I've had my appendix removed. It's not fun full practice for Danny Amendola former Dallas Cowboy Mike Daniels. A lot of cowboys. Fans wanted before the season began snacks snacks Harrison. And as Sean Robinson no practice for the following players Sean Hand Tied Johnson Romeo Kwara Rick Wagoner Tracy Walker and and of course Matthew Stafford now Matthew Stafford was at Lyons practice but didn't partake in at watched wars Jersey over a Hoodie. You know how that sort of thing can go. When it comes to the cowboys the following players were limited Cam Fleming? He did not Pseudo for the cowboys last week. That left Brandon Knight Swing Tackle Duties Jeff Heath another limited participation demarcus Lawrence Antoine Woods we had full participation from Michael gallops. And that is good to see Sean Lee. I would imagine he won't practice on Friday just because that's this is routine. Nobody panic and tyran Smith was a full participant as well. No practice on Wednesday for the following Dallas Cowboys Michael Bennett who was excused It was was announced from the cowboys that it wasn't injury related by for what it's worth. Wednesday was his birthday. So happy. Birthday to Michael Bennett. Maybe it had something to do with it. No practice for Alaya Collins no practice for. Cj Goodwin no practice. For Zack Martin. No practice for Connor. Williams obviously had the arthroscopic surgery on Tuesday. And no practice for Amari Cooper now. I don't know that there's anything to really be concerned about here. there are people are always going to be panicked over. Because I mean you you know Amari so valuable to the cowboys. In fact pro football focus put out their highest graded players For every team Amari Cooper In terms of pro football focus is grading is the highest rated player on the Dallas Cowboys. They have. I'm at a ninety point to grade but Connor Williams being out is really the biggest development and granted that wasn't even a development on Wednesday in particular khullar. We knew that going into this week. So that means Xavier's Othello is going to be starting in his spot at left guard. tweeted something about this but I wanted to get into it here on the PODCASTS. Hard casts So we feel obviously started in stretches for the cowboys last season now Obviously Amari Cooper joined the cowboys. His first game was Monday. November KNBR V. I was Monday night football. That was the Tennessee. Titans lost. I was chasing wins return etcetera etcetera etcetera but that was not savior to a fellows for start part of the season is I are actually came a week later on Sunday November eleventh. How we talked about sending football and the Eagles on Wednesday's episode of the show? Well that was his debut was the cowboys went. went to Philly last season and so exhibit sewer fellow joining the cowboys in the middle of two thousand eighteen kind of started them on a five game winning streak. I'm not saving saying that here is the reason for that but I mean facts are facts So but a lot of people have been concerned In terms of the playing. Zeke Elliott Elliot. People are saying he doesn't look like there's rookie he's not ripping off the big runs etc.. And I wanted to look at how Zeke performed and I might write about this idea specifically so be on the lookout How's he performed last season winnings jumped in and exhibitors one guy and so I keep in mind? This was with no Travis Frederick there as well as Joe Looney was playing playing center but so the two games preceding exhibits to a fellow taking over for Connor Williams. Okay so the two games before that the cowboys were in Washington in a week seven seven. That was obviously the last game. They lost before their bye week when they hit the Brett. Maher hit the ball. Off The upright Zeke. Elliot had fifteen carries for thirty three yards that day. Then they had the by. They traded from our Cooper Zeke Elliot on Monday night football at Tennessee. Titans seventeen carries for sixty one yards. Still no real action in. It's not exists and a slump. Did he play. While the Minnesota Vikings no we all know that but the two games proud of that guy was on fire. And so looking at. How zeke Elliott turned a corner corner though jumped in? It's kind of impressive. Okay so Zeke Elliot. The first game of the show at left guard at Philly as mentioned nineteen carries a buck luck. Fifty one and a touchdown the next week on the road in Atlanta twenty-three carries one hundred twenty two yards and another touchdown. Okay the next week it was a short week. The the cowboys were at home on Thanksgiving Day Against The Washington Redskins Twenty Six carries one hundred twenty one yards and a touchdown he only had twenty three carries for seventy five yards Seven seven days later on Thursday night football against the saints and then we're going to half later at home against the eagles overtime game. The cowboys won out there micro touchdown twenty eight carries for one hundred thirteen thirteen yards. So I don't think it's a coincidence that feel kind of led to. I don't even WANNA say the most prominent run that Zeke Elliot had in two two thousand eighteen but he clearly is good and to be fair. Though you know there was a moment in the middle of last season where everybody said Oh you know. Connor Sucks just let Xavier ever come back and CETERA. There were moments though was bad. He was very good for certain stretches and I would argue that he was a big reason why the cowboys won. The first of those five games in a row in Philadelphia last season so exhibited coming in you know could be promising again. Am I right about this. So who knows the last thing I wanted to get into kind of had to do with two thousand eighteen seen as well so last season in two thousand eighteen counting the playoffs. Obviously there's sixteen games. In the regular season in the cavs played two playoff games a wildcard individual around so they played eighteen games in totality in two thousand eighteen. Now Fourteen of those games fourteen of eighteen possible games were ultimately decided headed by one possession so if a score is within eight points that's from possession because you can achieve eight points. Maximum one possession. You get the picture. The cowboys played in. Fourteen Games. Decided saddened by one possession last season. That's nuts I mean the NFL's will parity and it's a week to week league etc and that is really sort of the ultimate extreme definition of that. The cowboys are a team. That is kind of a coin flip or at least they were in two thousand eighteen. Although they weren't really a coin flip do you know their record and those fourteen games you might if you follow me on twitter or if you're reading the article I wrote about it before you're listening to this. The cowboys were ten and four. In those one possession games last season they were ten and four and this was something that we talked about a lot over the offseason. You know because people would ask how many games of the cow going to win in two thousand nineteen and I I would say I mean you look at the Games. They won last season. They beat Detroit on a last second field while they beat Atlanta on a last second field while they beat Villi as mentioned the second time because of a tip pass ended up. In Amari Cooper sends hands. It was a touchdown right there. Those are three wins. That were kind of pushes right and you can argue. They had some losses that were pushes. But my point is I mean you know they if they lose those games that go from either tenants sixteen wins then east to a seven and nine team and who knows what happens to them and so the point remains that I think that they really were on the right side of obviously. Obviously you know those one possession games. They were ten in four in those types of contests last season. Do you know how the cowboys have done in. One possession games this season they haven't played fourteen uh-huh obviously in fact. They've only played three games. That were decided by one possession. When the final score was over in those three games this season the Dallas Cowboys are Oh and three they cannot win a game that is decided by one possession? They obviously just recently had an opportunity on Sunday night. Football Vikings weren't able to close the game entirely and I don't know what that says I mean this whole principle is kind of a coin. Flip sort of mentality and philosophy. But I I think it says if three games by the way this season at the cowboys have played. There were decided by one possession with the loss to the New Orleans. Saints the loss of the New York jets and the loss of the Minnesota Vikings instead of the three they lost by ten points of the packers. That's not one possession Now the saints game was just I mean incredible defense from the saints And just incredible coaching from Sean. Payton you know. Hey you're going to lose some games like that but when you look at the others the cowboys spot of the New York jets at one point. You'll remember this is painful to discuss. Obviously the New York jets were up. Twenty one two three okay. It's hard to make a game a one possession game when you're down twenty one to three and keep in mind on the cowboys ultimately ended up losing that game. Twenty four to twenty two so I mean You know their offense is obviously a lead to the point that it can narrow those margins against the Vikings they were down fourteen and they ultimately at one point had the lead and still only lost by four points and so this all sort of connected to the whole slow start theory or not real theory. Also slow start Reality the cowboys find themselves in their starting so slow and that's limiting them in terms of what they're able to do their offenses is having played perfect instead of in the offense. I think I think you know I in your ideal situation. Your offense plays a B plus game right if you have a really really really really good offense and the cowboys and you play a B.. Plus game you should probably win those games. But because the offense is having de first-quarter performances they have to have a plus second third and fourth quarters and to their credit they kind of are in some instances however by that point the balance of everything has thrown off. And at at that point. You're asking for a plus performances from the defense and it's just not going to happen. That'd be clear I'm not blaming the cowboys offense for the problems of the teams having but those slow starts are showing up in a lot a lot of ways and they have to fix that. That's that's the key I mean you know people asking. How many Wednesday need you know what what games they have to win? I mean if they fixed the slow start issue. They'll be fine. They'll win the NFC east. Probably A playoff game. They'll challenge the NFC championship game because their offense is that good but they have to fix the slow starts they just have to or else Things could be uncomfortable in the middle of January. So we'll see how that goes so Make sure you have a fantastic day today actually had just I mean like half the absolute absolute best Thursday ever like. What are you waiting for? Just have the absolute best Thursday of all time okay. It's very busy day. There's Thursday night football tonight. steelers browns I will take the steelers. I think that I think the browns skated by against the bills last week and I think the steelers find a way to take them down and let some more air out of their balloon. Loon if you're in the mood for some High School Football Action We have playoff football happening on. Espn San Antonio Tonight Thursday night. We have the Brennan Bears. Not My dog bear. The Brennan bears taken on the Roosevelt rough riders. And then on Friday we have these Stevens Falcons taking on the Madison Mavericks District Twenty Seven. Six eight champions. We had the district title game last season. It's high school. Football's a lot of fun and the play offs or so much fine. I mean I didn't play football in high school but obviously you know the energy gene. We're very special in Texas in here in the city of San Antonio and so if you want to listen to fifty. Am Ninety four five FM onto go at East Tennessee dot com. We're going to have a good good time. I can promise you that and I hope that you have a good time again. Just have the absolute best Thursday ever. You know why because you deserve it. We will see them. Indiana my friends as always go cowboys. NPR Yeah.

cowboys Dallas cowboys football Jason Garrett twitter Detroit Lions Matthew Stafford Minnesota Vikings NFL Connor Williams Detroit Zeke Elliott Elliot Tennessee Jason Amari Cooper Zeke facebook Disney bt Dallas
Matt Minich's Bengals Chalk Talk 11-14

Cincy Jungle

27:55 min | 2 years ago

Matt Minich's Bengals Chalk Talk 11-14

"I don't WANNA sound so at big points a screaming nine to one. You want to mess with us a joke guy to one. You WanNa Cheswick the battles company. I mean you won't have to all right so here we are again another loss for the Bengals And hands things are not looking better It's not even like they're showing really any kind of improvement Very very sad times here. in in bengals nation. Miami's Matt Mimic Here for Orange and black insiders bengals chock talk So thank you for joining. Let me today as those of you on Youtube looking at my face have probably already figured out. This is going to be a bit of a different type of episode And frankly I love. I love watching film. I love talking about film Breaking Things Down and from a coaching perspective. You'll love that because you're we're seeing path you've seen a way to get better. You're seeing how to improve Am Yeah that's the type of stuff I love for I'm up at like five in morning. Every day watching should film And Looking at things from a coaching perspective How how can we win in the scenario You know that's what's the difference for me. You know people who look from GM perspective. How do we build this team? I look at how do we survive with what we have. And we thrive arrive. You know how. How can we win games? We will we have And there are ways to do things on their definitely allow correctable trek butchers. That this team has and this team is they're not getting better They need to be showing some signs and getting better and I understand the roster issues Zhu's particularly on off line. I get it I you know. Get the get the quarterback issue I get the deputy shoes. Lose all of that But you can do better you know. I'm s what I want to see how this coaching staff is. Can they do better. Can they do something with what they have half Because at the end of the day you know you can you can build the roster. But you know the coaches need to be able to. They're going to be able to have to overcome better teams at some point So I mean this is practice for that So figuring out a way to win but also Figuring out a way to get better and a lot of the guys that are on this roster the right now hopefully are going to be the core of of a bank of a better bengals team at some point Hopefully this isn't isn't a a ten year project I don't think many of us will be around at that point in the their already losing fans But we've got a we got to see more of this coaching staff You know to validate that they are the ones to fix this thing. Get this thing turned around And that they are deserving of being the the the A group they gets that number one pick overall pick and that tap quarterback presumably. They're gonNA take And you're not wasting a year of Joe Borough of two on bad coaching and people that are going to set them back So not good right now They are not getting better they should be getting better. They should focus on scenarios. Should be able to improve not getting better overall The offense is particularly bat. Now again I get the problems particular But you hired tired. Zack Taylor get. You didn't go out and hire experienced college head coach eating. You know look for Mike McCarthy. It didn't hire a you know a long time assistant. Who's been around success and is is it expert leader expert team builder? You hired a young guy who had exposure to a innovative new offense and we should be seeing some signs of that and we are not And that is a major problem And I think people talk. There's a learning curve you know. He hasn't really been played caller. Okay be a play colour though we get if you're with the head coaching staff but he's been preparing to be a play caller for a long time. He's been around these guys he seen them. He knows how it's done. You shouldn't arts that so if that's why you hired him if that's what you brought in here to do he needs to be doing those things and he's got a Callahan he's got van pelt. who was a backup quarterback in league for years played some quarterback We've seen a lot of success from guys with playing histories like Van. Pelt as coaches Peterson Frank Reich Jason Garrett you know so they got to figure out how to use these guys in in Philadelphia Frank Reich was notable was known for being a guy that they counted on for specifically typically third-down game planning so these guys should become sharing that role a little bit And in in that light you know focusing on different things having those conversations And really to coordinators with Kennel Han Taylor and then another experienced guy. Like van appelt around They should be able to do more. And it bugs me because there's play colon and his game planning so play calling I I you know things change. The fly used to be able to adjust in gains. There was nothing. Marvin Lewis was terrible at the bengals. Were bad at when they had Louis. But a game plan. And you can gain plan for situations and for openers Or you know a script Some call it. You should be able to have something pretty solid. They're now thanks changing game teams are GONNA come out they're gonNA run some a little bit different. Your digger RUNDSTEDT expecting to adjust. But especially when you're the bengals and you're not that good teams are going crazy game plan for you right So you should. There's some things established that work right away and we're not even really seem that Out of out of this team so I don't completely by the idea That idea because I think those three is allow. The office coaches really mainly Callahan. Dan and Taylor should have a solid game plan And if they need if there's a learning curve with figuring out how to pivot I get it But you know the learning curve is not a they should be in the first quarter Should be going to. I corps initially be better at situations in in key situations. Go line red zone third downs. They are particularly bat And that is a major major issue that they a half So I'm just GonNa get an example here so This is a blank call sheet so I think people look at scripting and they think that we're we're talking about scripting we're like okay. Well you're just get right down. The I ten plays a common thing here as well if you get the ball on the goal line. Are you going to You know you're not going to throw or D.. Pass or no. That's not really what scripting gifts So you know when you're doing a game plan put together game plan On the this is a former is a template I got some really good coaches that I work for a couple of guys now are are in individual one. I am Some big schools one of the guys that work with this division to head coach at So This isn't me. This isn't this isn't me saying. Hey look I'm smart and everybody else this is. This is things that people do. So every every C everybody's a little different Up but it's not just a menu just a list of listed place you look at the situations in you. Have your kind of your base calls. You know what you're GONNA do I now but then also you know possession in the first place. The physician has its own area. Sometimes as well on the sheep is sometimes a second second down short. It's meeting as long extra long Same thing with third doubts And you're GONNA have running passes that gives you in Avenue of having the percentages you WanNa half the situations because you say you know if you WANNA be thirty three percent percent pass than you you you Sorry run right. You just put one run for every two passes on there if if you WANNA be thirty three percent Ron and as you call it you stick to it You should be pretty close ups and I've seen that work out you know we're over season two Where oatmeal almost exactly Zaka Planned over the course of the season So breaking this down and look at it. You know you break it down that just types of essentially rump passes types of texts of past screens had category And then you cannot plug these things in two different situations so oh along with that you have a place you want to actor turnover you of your specialty plays all right so your place you can feel when he want those most of the time You know sometimes you plug them into certain situations And then you said it up by fields all right in our our backed up are you In the resume going in. Are you in the the tighter. Red Zone are inside the twelve Or in a goal line situation And right now there was a little pick play into effort. This weekend was pretty good for most part resumed the same little sneak Jokes out into the flats played the same score twice on that which would be fine if they're scoring more But you'd like to see more plays better play design and you're really planning for that situation and place come off too because not team the twice So it should be the comes off of that works off of that and take advantage of how they might react to jumping mix line somebody else behind it You know running back the other direction. Whatever it is a throwback Lots of different situations So you planning for two point wait you find for two minute drive any plan for all those all those different fields zones in addition to kind of your base play calls And then as the offers so I it again when we talk about scripting like what I would call openers right and it is not just I want to run these templates. All right. It's a I play by the game's pretty much set as long as you get into normal part of the field in the red zone or something like that. It's pretty much set. You know what you're going to go in there with But outside out of that what are you going to run a second down. It comes down to what the down businesses are as a second second long. The different play calls Same thing on third it down And really you can you can script that out and you can stick with that For a good portion of the first half potentially And then as things start to change you change you always have places to pivot to you know what I call an answer book So you've gotTA understand Heaven Chouinard standing of your offense to know how teams might try and counter the things you're trying to do. And what are the place that you can do off of that or it's the same thing I talked about what happened. Play that runs off of the the Joe Mixing play so you need to be able to to have a a good script and then an answer book in a place to really pivot to from that. So what I'm getting at here. Is those situations. We should have some better options for those situations. We should be seeing being a strong openers. Because yeah it's new for Zack. Taylor Golf Place Yes it is new You know with Callahan. Hal Hand with working with those guys. It's new to be the head coach and have all these other responsibilities but he can sit down on Monday with with Callahan and all the other offers of assistance and they can come up with a game plan and they could say this is. The first play of the game was the first second a lot this the first third law and they can go through through it. So that's really what you WANNA do. There are now there's other things a part of what you do with your Is is to see what teams are going to do. You know if you haven't unseen empty you know you haven't seen how they defend empty. You might call play on empty justice the other line up to it You're not comfortable. With most of the back in the backfield you run his own wreak. Because you you feel comfortable with that you know what they're gonNA do `situation so that's kind of the default is if you don't know what they're doing you call a play that you you have a lot of adjustments to And then you see you make those those adjustments and then you know the guy in the box is is is is drawn up you. Sing with the defense is doing Communicating down to the field. And they're coming up with plans like okay will run this so perfect. That's exactly what right or are they run that I don't like that were to pivot or we're not going to run formation again so lot of different areas. You could go with that and what I'm trying to get his. There's no excuse here I think we're excusing too. Much of of what's going on here. figure out a plan to the offer of line figure out a plan for the limitations you have and again. You should have a strong initial plan because you do that on Monday. You do on Tuesday and then you practice that stuff all week all that stuff. The Apprentice Game Plan. You should have set times in practice when you're running those the place Yes when you start going a little bit off script when you start having to adjust there's a learning curve with that I get that absolutely but but start strong And that's where the guy was hired for. We don't expect them to be a great head coach of the Bat. Maybe even add a great. You know making great adjustments but show me something in that first quarter. She'll be something on that first. Drive come out of the gate strong And learned show that you can work together stack. There's a lot of minds there Falls on Taylor eventually Use callans expertise. Used Van Pelt. US everybody else on on that staff We know with these expense to figure out some answers To to these tough questions. Are you a netflix person. Are You more into Hulu. You've got that. Hbo Now thinking about that Whole Apple TV plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never ends so today explained. Fox's Daily News podcast we're GONNA talk to Fox's critic at large Emily Vander worth about the coming streaming streaming wars and. Emily is GonNa talk about how it's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her favourite medium television and how the monocultures basically klay dead but also she will reveal who she thinks will win the streaming wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming wars and also she'll criticize some of the lesser shows. That have come out of the streaming wars. You will know everything you need to know. You'll know which service you should be subscribing having to and which ones you should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other than watch. TV ever again check out today explained wherever you listen. Listen to your podcasts. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right now. Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk and we're the host of the shutdown full cast your avengers of college football podcast cast says in the script onto riff on what that means and basically what I mean is. It's all spoiled every Tuesday. We talk about everything cooking disasters to pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college. Football every now. And then like mascot fights announcers fleeing the early. And unfashionable. Pants that coaches where now south. If you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP. All right now the other side of the ball We'll look at the other side of the ball as well and A. and they've had a lot of problems now they're not changing you know they're not adjusted justice processes well and really this week is a great example You got smoked by large acts in a few weeks ago US watched him a run the option and make the near the pages. Choose look stupid have a plant have something and I look. He's a freak athlete. I get it nobody can stimulate. It's become a cliche right now. Nobody can simulate. Lamar Jackson doesn't practice will. Yeah he's he's a freak a again it But like you got to have a plant and they weren't even Have really sound option responsibilities so we saw some speed option in the game You know and it gets the speed option. You gotTa have. Somebody's playing the dive. I mean there's no dive. Somebody's playing quarterback. Somebody's playing the pitch. And we've seen the defensive end just Kinda floating in space. Not really he clearly knowing what he was doing And that's a big time problem and then You know it looks like really. They had no pitch player In those situations as well so big time issues with that and then we get into the zone read as well right so oh the zone. Read the Defensive End You know they're gonna read that guy and he's got to have a responsibility. He can't can't be pulling the quarterback and the dive. It's hard not to play those guys alone. He's got to be committed. He's not getting blocked. Right based on the back alignment with formation. Is He's guy. I know his responsibility. And if he's back player he's gotta be abandoned like crazy gotTa do and. Then we're the quarterback players has to get up there aren't so The big play that would be seen on highlight reels for years With Lamar Jackson running the long touchdown Delap should have been. I'm Ben and more people are kind of giving him A. I've seen people saying his effort when no it was just that he was standing there and translate to things. I don't think it's poor four effort. I just think like that's what happens when you're trying to look at too many things you end up getting moved around like that so not a not a good look Not a good deal and I don't really put that on Dunlap. I think he's not being told This is your responsibility and do it and go after it. And that's how you play the option you patty responsibility you attack you responsible you stop your responsibility and you trust the other ten guys to do their job. That's what they gotta do. He should have been battling creatures that trust that the other guys were going to do what they need to do now. That was another problem. Right as we saw. It was definitely definitely an issue So who should have made the play all right really is Pratt dull all afternoon Divan Pratt. They cut him cut really the his legs. Nothing to throw them off. You know he works to the outside. That's who makes a cutback which is better than making bounce And yes Bates Vigil Guys should make the tackle on. They're all running Young a young Lamar Jackson do Lamar Jackson. Thanks but they've got a they've got to do better with that And you know on the on the typhoon we see see you know. He's got a feat that cut. He's got his hands on his kick is legs out his legs away from it so we can make it better play on it You See dunlap trying to write down at dunlap's drop in our Dunlop's gotta be doing his job. And you got trust vigil Bates Sean Williams to make that play all right. So this is is kind of a microcosm -lica- a miniature version of all the other problems that the bengals have Because it's plain assignment football especially on defense and really any any young coaches out there. Anybody who wants to be a football coach learn triple action. It makes everything else makes makes sense all right it really does You know learn from somebody as good learning or learn how to defend it You know I I I couldn't run it Ah I don't understand. All the all the adjustments that are in that but I I learned how to benefit from some really smart people And it makes everything else makes sense about football but if I defend football in particular and guess what our views Bob someplace zone reads triple speed option. These are all triple for blacks in place once you understand that office. You're gonNA understand those things too so all this modern you know these. Modern offense stuff is all been around for years. You've got to go back in the old time stuff And understand that but the idea is they don't know all right. They don't know what they're doing. They're not playing good assignment. Football and defending triple option is the best way to kind of get yourself on board for that and they can't do it then they're not doing it at at all so overall a better You know hey they ran the ball right all they didn't it really run the ball. All right they just ran the ball enough that they got some yard John There are a couple of these in place but I think mixing actually three point eight yards. Sign thank you know what's better than like one yard that he was average sometimes but it ain't great get the issues Personnel wise think. But what play better assignment football. You know your role execute your role in when you have a bad team when you have a losing team Swiss about by getting back down to basics understand these things and they're not doing this stuff So I have some serious frustrations with this coaching staff. And even if there was a major roster roster moves. I'm wondering what these guys are GonNa do in the future I WanNa see more of these guys To feel country when Ford I'm I'm the ultimate optimists. I'm always anything that happens. I guess I look at things from a coaching perspective. nauseam perspective so whenever something happens You know even if I'm not happy about Matt Moore's Right well how do we win. Now Control we can control and as a coach. That's how I knew what I knew valid control But you're not seeing that these guests so very frustrating hoping to see some more in these as last few weeks we've Gallo buffer for the first round pick Washington place the jets next week in If Washington gets to two wins and we can we can survive alone. We still have that number one. Pick but you know you don't you WANNA see some positives even if it's not wins just getting better. I just starting to understand assignments starting to joe a little bit I've heard I've heard people say well. You Know Zach Taylor hasn't lost the team. I'm a little concerned that he hasn't lost like I mean you don't want him to lose the team but I'd love to see some guys were pissed off it You know people shouldn't didn't like him because the way they're playing. You should not be nice in. That building smiles talking to the press But it should not be somebody. That team likes because he should be riding them hard. When you're sitting there at nine in has personality but to me it's a bit of a concern that they might like it too much because it's not about it's is not about being elected about being respected in? It's about having a having a path so Hopefully you're still biden buying in but Italy they shouldn't they shouldn't be they shouldn't they shouldn't like him at this. Point is likely later when he when he gets them win games all right so thank thank you for joining me here on this somewhat unconventional version of bengals shock Hopefully brighter days in the future future right now definitely tough to see it And we will keep a keep chugging keep looking for answers keep looking for ways talk about ways that they can get better Weekend week out I'd also through the NFL draft and eventually start talking about free agents in moves like that that they can make So stay with me. Stay with the team Through the nineties. Some of you some of you around longer than me So you weren't there in the nineties But I survived. We had some better days as we would like. But we did as better days Marvin Lewis who. We'll talk about with disdain now He was he was Kinda the back then. So hopefully making making some moves doing some things at hopefully saints in positives these last seven weeks Fine you know. They don't want a game all right Cassini when a game but I get it I get I get the big picture and get the long game but we need to see some positives because his own sixteen had coach back does that. I said about the I said about the browns wavering. Back Sixteen guy you gotta figure out better answers to that because this is a noisy begin you can have answers you gotta figure out that's your job as a coach you're not the GM you're not bringing in players aren't you didn't buy the groceries but guess what you're GonNa make a beautiful beautiful dinner anyway. So comes back to do your job to right. that's been triple op until about three cushion. Football's all about so once again Dan. Thank you for joining me and we will be back here. Every single Thursday On Youtube also built for download where we have Some great guests So make sure you're checking back every week and wrangler worth without. Yep talk crowd coming

bengals Zack Taylor Football Callahan Lamar Jackson football Youtube GM Marvin Lewis Van Pelt Dunlap Dan Apple Bengals Miami Zhu Zach Taylor Frank Reich browns
Just Pod Baby-Episode 30: Flying solo recapping weeks 9 & 10

Silver & Black Pride

30:16 min | 2 years ago

Just Pod Baby-Episode 30: Flying solo recapping weeks 9 & 10

"When you have great coaches then after the great coaches you get great players have a great organization and you tell them one thing just window? mm-hmm uh-huh through and let's go rig nation in welcome him to just pop baby with your host. Ever growth your home for raiders. News notes and information just pop babies a part of the silver and Black Pride podcast network brought to you by espy nation. Check me out on twitter. I E five and be sure to check out all the great content being put out for you over at silver black pride DOT com. It's just me this week. And you're going to be flying solo with with me so no need to worry. There's plenty to talk about. The raiders have just finished playing their second game in five days and more importantly they came out of those two games on the winning end of both so We're going to start this week's episode out recapping the week nine win versus the Lions and in the following segment. I will discuss to win on Thursday night football now. Both of these games weren't were nail biters and both of these winds needed Derek. Carr engineer game winning drive in the fourth. Quarter A to to To seal the deal in the case of the Lions game this was just an old fashioned shootout with a ton of offense and not a lot of defense. And if you tuned in to last week's episode when I interviewed Mike Michael Rothstein from ESPN him. And I discussed a lot About how these these defenses were susceptible to Giving up a lot of yardage and a lot of points and and so this was something that was kind of expected going into the match up the teams both teams combined totaled. Excuse me nine hundred twenty three yards of offense and fifty five points so it was certainly an exciting game You know there were there was. It was a fun game to watch. It was stressful at times. But again fun and entertaining the raiders. Rookie class took center stage on in this one. All four of the raiders touchdowns were scored by rookies including two rushing touchdowns from Josh Jacobs and a receiving touchdown from foster moreau and hunter Renfro Info on defense trayvon mowing. Made his first start and you know he had some good moments he had some not so good moments as well but You Know He. He did flash fitness. I start so You know you gotta give patient with him. He hasn't been getting as many wraps as some of the other rookie. So I think in time he'll he'll he'll come around. I think he's You Know I. I think you've seen that he does have have some of that qualities you're looking for in a in a star cornerback. Max crosby continues to get better. Learn better each week and even clean. Farrell showed some signs that maybe he starting to turn the corner a little bit so Great deceased so. Many of the contributions bution coming from some of the younger players on the roster. Josh Jacobs finished the game with a hundred and twenty yards and two touchdowns and you know what else can you say about this kid hid. He's an absolute stud He's a total package. And I think that something that is not being talked about enough right now we you know we hear all all about his ability to to you. Know Make Defenders Miss and The the the the anger that he runs with and all of those great qualities but I think the one thing that is really not being spoken about his his his toughness his. He's showing that he he's capable of playing through injury. He suffered that that shoulder injury back in the back against the bears and he's just You know he's continuing to play through it and and play effectively so to me. That's a great scientist from a young player. Learning how to play injured especially a guy who probably didn't play injured much in his college career because because of the small workload so a great scientist from from him and something else. I just absolutely love about route. Jacobs is when you listen to him. Talk he's so humble and I'm not sure if some of you saw but before the game On Thursday night He sat down with Aaron Andrews of Fox and did a piece on him and his upbringing. And all that and you can just you can just hear how humble this kid is. And we all know we've heard the story about the struggles that he and his family endured. And it's been well documented and you can just I see in his play obviously when you listen to him in an interview he is. He is just so grateful for the opportunity and he does not take for granted so I just I just is really loved that about Jacobsen. I'm just so glad he's a raider. Hunter Renfro caught the go ahead. Score for the raiders In I wanNA talk a little bit about that play for just a second. There was a lot to like about the play. First of all Derek Carr extending to play with his legs by evading of aiding some pressure that was coming off the left edge and this was something that again was a big emphasis coming into the season throughout training camp. We've heard Gruden talk a lot about it about Derek Carr using some of that athleticism that he that he possesses in. It really came together well on this play and the second thing you like like to see was the rookie Renfro when the play kind of broke down in the scramble drill began RENFRO working his way back to the quarterback to make himself available something. You don't always see from from rookie ride receivers but To Me Renfro is wise beyond his years. I am again just a great sign to see. Of course the to- touch to get both feet in To get to make the score was It was just a great play in Renfro. Did did lead the team with four receptions for fifty four yards in the game now the last play or player. I should say that I want to mention from the The week nine game against the Lions is another player that I've been critical of in the past. And that's Karl Joseph but the play he made to end the lions chances of tying the game was unbelievable and frankly those are the types of plays that we have just not seen Joseph making the pass I think I think that Karl Josephs can be an effective player when he is used in a certain way and I just for me from what from what I have seen from from Joseph when he's used in coverage that's when he has issues and that's when he struggles his size is often the issue issue. He's he's an undersized corner or excuse me safety and that's often taking advantage of what teams tried to match him up with a the bigger stronger more physical tight end and that's exactly what the lions were looking to do on that particular play the lions were trying to get the ball to their six seven tight end but Joseph just would not be denied on that play. I heard him speaking a little bit about that. Play After the game and in he he said he knew that You know he knew that they were GonNa picking on him and he pretty much just sold out For the past he didn't even he he wasn't even really thinking at any point they were going to run the ball so he was. He was well aware that he was going to be targeted there and he had to make a play and that's exactly what he did. He climbed the ladder he went up and and was able to knock the ball away from the tight end. It was just an outstanding play by Karl Joseph now there was some some bad news or negative of news that came from the game and and that was a arden key injuring his foot. There was some speculation after the game that he didn't in fact suffered a broken foot and that was later confirmed The next day Thursday it was announced that key was placed on season ending. I are so certainly a disappointing end keys season. He was coming off of back to back games with a sack and he did get one of those sacks saks no game of course in in sometimes sacks you know they can come in bunches so who knows if he was finally starting to heat up a bit who knows if he would have been able to get to the quarterback a few more times but You know I don't have a numbers in front of me as far as next Gen stats are concerned nor analytics or anything like that but just going off of you know the task from what I've been able to observe by watching all these games and and kind of going back and watching the film the day after he looked improved to me. He really did he. He looked improve as a rusher. He did he did seem a little stronger. I do think think he He just looked a little bit stronger. His speed was was still very good off the edge. You can see he's got he's explosive off the edge. I thought he looked good. Will he ever be a ten sack guy. You know. Probably not probably not but I think that you know in the right situation situation he can be a very solid rotational. Pass rusher in when you when you pair them with guys like Max Crosby in Cleveland Farrell. Who who are you know going forward probably going to see the majority of the snaps and maybe even adding another pass rusher in the two thousand twenty draft class? Who knows I think that when you combine him with those those guys they currently have I think he can continue to carve out a nice role for himself with with this team so You know I do wish I do wish artem speedy recovery and I and I look forward to Seen him no next season the plane even better than he was at the beginning of the season. Okay we're GONNA take a quick break and WanNa Return. I'm going to be recapping the week ten win Thursday night football. This episode is sponsored by Stash. A SMARTER SIMPLER WAY TO START. Investing with Sash you can begin. Investing in a wide array of companies and diversified funds for as little as five dollars stash offers unlimited trading with no add on trading missions. So you can invest without worrying about getting Nickel Glenn dined. You can choose your own stocks and funds to build a personalized portfolio but stash. Help build one for you stash. demystify is investing with personalized financial guidance and education. They can even help you set up a plan for retirement saving Stachel give you ten dollars today to get started investing just visit. WWW dot stash dot app with the code espy nation. That's www dot stash dot APP with Code Explanation to get your ten dollars to start investing on Stash Investment Advisory Services Mrs offered by Stash Investments. LLC AN SEC registered investment advisor for disclosures to learn how to claim your ten dollars to invest visit www dot stash dot at all right. Welcome back to justify baby now. Let's dive into the week. Ten victory on Thursday night football against the chargers the calcium owes rock and from what I could see on ATV. Obviously I wasn't there in person but the place looked like it was just rowdy and You know that is the last primetime game that the calcium will ever host in. The team definitely gave the fans something that. I don't think they'll ever forget anytime soon. That's for sure. Now unlike the game versus the lions this one was all about defense offense in and you have not heard that much You know about the raiders this year Normally it's the offense offense who who leads the way in but you know Thursday night. The defense stepped stepped up in in in made plays and did more than enough to help the team win. That's for sure now. It all got started in the first quarter with safety. Eric Harris he intercepted Philip rivers twice and the second of those interceptions. He took the house for a pick six. which was the second of the year for Harris? The raiders got off to a a quick ten lead but the chargers did battle back and eventually took a fourteen ten lead later in the second quarter And a critical part of the game in my opinion came just before halftime when the raiders. Were able to get a quick score after ten play drive that ended with a yet another rookie making a making a play. This time was the fullback elk ingold scoring his first career touchdown. I WANNA GRUDEN's GRUDEN's favorites spider to y banana I think this was a critical Point in the game for the raiders. Because they are able to Take the lead seventeen fourteen and they were getting the ball to start the second half so I think it's always a good. You see this. A lot with with good teams are able to score right before half and then put another other scoring the board When they go out there to take the ball for the second half but like I said this was The story of this game was on the defensive side of the ball for the raiders. I do WanNa talk a little bit more about out. That the raiders forced three Philip rivers interceptions in the game and record five quarterback sacks. And I think that's that might be the most that they've had in a game. This season season. I'm not sure I'd have to double check by do think that is the most And they were led by rookie. Cleveland Farrow who I talked about earlier. WH- was beginning beginning to show some signs of You know finally putting it together against the Lions and he he had that breakout game this week with eight tackles in two and a half sacks x now I saw a tweet put out by Paul Gutierrez who covers the raiders for ESPN. I'm sure many of you follow him so I'm sure many of you saw the tweet. Pharrell is one of only four rookies to ever have recorded an eight tackle two and a half game so you know that's that's You know a good sign historical norcal game for for feral now. I did hear some people. I didn't hear him I. I read it more so on twitter and and whatnot that they were kind of Downplaying Ferrell's performance. Because he was going against a you know a week a week. Tackle a backup offensive tackle if you will but for me no. I don't really WanNa hear that. I think I don't think I know the guys across from On the other side of the ball guess what. They're getting paid to play this game to their professional players there in the NFL so I think anytime you have a performance like that. It's a good sign so I just I. I don't want to hear that kind of thing and I'm not really gonNA look too much into it one other thing. I do want to add about farrow as early in the season and even even during the preseason. I remember commenting about it on twitter. I was intrigued by the way they were using. Ferro Lining Linux him up on the inside pairing him with crosby. Arden key on the defensive ends and having hearst and fair lineup on the inside died But after watching the the past you know six seven. Eight Games I I'm not quite sure. If it was as effective the visit was early in. preseason I think that We saw some good things. And maybe even in week one and two But I think more more so recently it has not been as effective as you know Gunther and grew would've liked so I think last night you we saw Wi with key Being out now for the remainder of the season you saw feral gin opportunity to be used primarily on the edge rushing the quarterback quarterback. I think that's where he fits Bassett and I'm hoping that's where they're going to keep them now going forward So after two productive weeks in a row for barrel zero. I do expect to see him. Continue to you know on that upward trend. Max Crosby Maurice Hurst in Benson Maya while they also got in on the fun in that it was a sack party last night. Crosby hearst netted Half a sack apiece and my over contributed with a second half now Benson Hanson He. He needs the team in sacks and who would have thought that you know I would never would've Put My money on him to lead the team in sacks at the beginning of the year but right now that's the way it looks Many people on twitter which I've read have pointed out the fact that Maya were currently has more sex and Khalil Mack. Now there's still plenty plenty of football to be played but I guess anytime. You're you have more sex than the MAC at any point in the season. That's probably a good thing Next crosby man. That kid is just. He's getting better and better. We talked about it in in the lions game. And he's just he's kind of he's really transformed himself into an in every down player. Now I mean going into the season we heard about how he needed to add strength. And in some way in you know needed to improve against the Ron and we heard all about his high motor and how he was going to be used more so as a primary primarily as a third down rusher but He has exceeded expectations expectations and and just been One of the best picks with the exception of Josh Jacobs probably the next best US pick in the draft That that twenty nineteen draft class. So just really can't say enough about about crosby led the team with ten quarterback pressures He was the person who applied the pressure on Philip rivers when he threw that last interception and he just you know he started to bit of a game record. He's he's he's he's becoming a player that offensive coordinators have to account for and they'd readers have not had that type of player you know sense Khalil. Mack left So so it's good to have a good to see that now. My turning point play of the game came on Josh Shakeups. Eighteen yard touchdown run which Put The raiders up twenty six twenty F- twenty four and you can see that article up silver and BLACK PRIDE DOT com. Check it out. The raiders took over trailing twenty What was it twenty? Four twenty okay on their own twenty five yard line with a think about four minutes left it was when they got the ball back and they needed to go. Seventy five yards to score touchdown to take the lead. They could not settle for a field goal at that point in time. Derek Carr on that final drive. He was excellent and he completed five of seven passes for fifty three yards. I believe two of those passes went to Renfro and three one to Rashard And you can really see. He's starting to develop a comfort level with with Renfro. Eat more and more as the season goes on On third and one from the chargers eighteen the raiders Went with twenty two personnel. Too tight end two running backs and the chargers countered that by stacking the box so they were definitely definitely expecting Ron. And that's exactly what the raiders did and it was just some smash mouth football right up the middle Rodney Hudson if you go back and watch the play. Rodney Hudson and elk elk ingold. They both made key blocks on that. Play that that sprung jakup's on the on the run and Jacobs easily took care of the rest on his own. He broke through the line and got to the second level of safety came up. He broke an arm tackle and it was daylight for Jacob so You know Jacobs had one one of his more quiet games. It was a tough game for him. Seventeen excuse me. Eighteen carries for seventy one yards with a touchdown in at the end of the day. The Stat Line looks okay But the chargers clearly were not gonNa let him wreck the game. He really really had to work for all of those seventy one yards so Now going back to the defense After the raiders scored that final touchdown and they went ahead. Twenty six twenty four Daniel. Carlson mix missed the extra point which really made things more interesting than than Raider fans would have liked but needing to stop on the defense of and They delivered in fact. They did not allow a single completion on the chargers final. Dr Philip Rivers was over seven and again Dan as it was last week. It was Karl Joseph who came up with the the big play to seal the win This week for the raiders when he intercepted rivers rivers. It was his third interception on the day. And you know again. Carl Carl Joseph making a big place so good to see now there to There are two things that I do want to mention that I was disappointed with I was very pleased with many things in the game but there were two things that I do want to comment on that I felt like like Could have been better. And that was the run defense and in some of the GRUDEN's playcalling. Now I'm GonNa Start with the run defense They gave up one hundred. Forty forty six yards on the ground and that that's that's a lot And I I you know going into the game I totally thought it was going to be the opposite. I thought the chargers were just GonNa Pass. Pass Pass Pass Attack Those linebackers with with Echo. But that's in in in in Hunter Henry and that's you know kind of what they did. They both scored touchdowns but I just thought they would've Thrown the ball a little bit more Now the Rink run defense has been a major strength of of this team and Luckily that the pass rush yesterday was so strong That they were able to kind of you know slowdown that that charges passing game but I guess my biggest fear is that I just hope. This isn't becoming a trend. In less that past e punches going to drastically approve approve which is currently ranked near the bottom? The raiders really cannot afford to see that run defense. Falter right now so Something to keep an Ryan. Now as far as Gruden's play calling last night I I just felt that he was a little bit too conservative. At times I just felt that the plan was was a little vanilla and I'm sure that had a lot to do with being on the short week. Not having the normal amount of time to prepare your game plan but I just thought there were times when maybe you know he could have he could have been maybe a little bit more aggressive and You know early in the season season On the PODCAST. I did talk about how I felt Gruden in car. We're not pulling their weight. But that's definitely changed. I think the last I I would say since the Since maybe the bears game I I was really changed. I think they both have been very good but as of late I think Gruden has done a great job coming up with some creative plays in some of his designs and so You know I'm very satisfied with Gruden and the way he's calling games this year. Okay I think that about covers it all. Now for the week ten recap when I returned from this break. I'm going to touch on some some news and notes that came out today in in the final segment. Are you a netflix person Are You more into Hulu. You got that. Hbo Now thinking about that Whole Apple TV plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. Yes it never ends so today explained. Fox's Daily News podcast we're GONNA talk to Fox's critic large Emily Vander worth about the coming streaming wars and. Emily is going to talk about how it's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her. Favourite medium television and how the monocultures alters basically dead but also she will reveal whom she thinks will win the streaming wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might hi come out of the streaming wars and also shield criticize some of the lesser shows that have come out of the streaming wars. You will know everything you need to know. You'll know which service you should should be subscribing to and which ones should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other than watch. TV ever again check out today explained wherever wherever you listen to your podcast. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right now. Okay the the big news that I want to discuss Now in the final segment is once again is bad news It seems like every every week the raiders commodities games with with a a new player injured in. It's always a key player. It seems This week it's Lamarcus joyner and karl-josef joyner did not finish the game. He left late in the game with what looked like to be a hamstring injury. He was In coverage chasing the receiver and he just kind of pulled up limp so he was able to finish the game. He looked like he was in some pain GRUDEN did say after the game that he was concerned about joining in his status going forward. The other big injury comes and was to Carl Joseph. Now I'm not sure exactly when the injury occurred to Joseph I believe it was an ankle. obviously finished the game because he had the interception there at the end but there was some reports today Ian Rapoport was one of those people who who who reported that The injury is believed to be significant So not a good sign for that Raider secondary was already. Are you very It wasn't performing well to to you know so to speak into lose. Two starters is not a good thing I have not heard any other details on. Joseph other than the injury may be significant so The next piece of news is that you know in a move Kind of corresponding to to Joseph Joseph's injury the raiders went out and signed. Dj Swear swear injure swearing your I think his name is yeah You know to give them some help at the safety position position. Now the raiders worked him out they brought him in last week or was it earlier. This November fourth it was in They brought him in for a workout and Swearing your is is a similar type of player to Joseph. He's up hard hitting kind of a tone setter there in the back end. He's played for several several different teams in the League most recently with the Arizona Cardinals He started the first four games of the season. Anna was released So again I haven't followed him real close But I'm going to dig into him a little bit more and You know again. He's a guy who's had plenty of experience in the League so I don't know if he's going to be someone who who steps right in. I would expect that. We're going to see more of Eric Harris You know it's just unfortunate situation. The raiders have really been kind of snake bit in this year. It seems with the injuries and I know all teams in the NFL. have to deal with these kind of things but man oh man it seems like every week. It's someone new So you know it's it's a next man up mentality that's what Gruden's going to tell you what is going to tell you and You know we we may see We may see some other guys in there that we haven't seen awhile. Curtis Riley's a name. Who who who might get the first crack at it? We saw some We saw him plane early in the season and he was bad he wasn't he didn't look too good But you know he's all we got right now One other thing to keep in mind. I've heard this Idea kicked around and I and I'm pretty sure they did did this. At times. Last year they moved Darah. Wurley back to the safety position. He's a versatile so he could he could move back and play safety And it may be with the return of Isaiah Johnson the rookie. Who is now off? I are he could maybe be someone who you're you plug in there to play some corner or even Nevin Lawson so there is some options out there for the raiders but overall it is not a good situation there in the secondary. Okay well that is GONNA wrap it up for this week's edition of just pod with Evan Grote. Expect to hear here from me again at my normal time next week as we will

raiders Lions Hunter Renfro chargers Josh Jacobs football Gruden Derek Carr twitter Max crosby Karl Joseph GRUDEN Carl Carl Joseph Crosby hearst Eric Harris Mike Michael Rothstein Philip rivers Cleveland Farrow Khalil Mack ESPN
Brews & The 'Boys: Who are the 5-4 Cowboys?

Blogging the Boys

30:27 min | 2 years ago

Brews & The 'Boys: Who are the 5-4 Cowboys?

"Welcome to another edition of the Bruce and the boys podcast brought to you by hsi-wei media blogging the boys. SP Andy Vox media podcast network. I'm your host folks. My name is Michael Sizemore. Take a breath there. You can follow me me on twitter at Mr Sizemore and follow the show at Bruce and the boys and at blogging. The boys with me as always he's the man of the hour and we are never sweet again. We we are just sour sour sour. Mr Tom Rile is a gay. It is and you can find him on twitter at Tom Rile. We're talking about the the cowboys. Losing Twenty eight to twenty four. I correctly picked it on our predictions on blogging. The voice and I'm upset with myself that I got it right. The cowboys lose the Minnesota Vikings on Sunday night. Football Twenty eight to twenty four in a game that was just kind of baffling and you know we could spend the entire time going through the game like we typically do but Tom and I are a little pissed off right Yeah as my brother would want to say a tad urinated. Oh what a what a picture to be painted so tom just. Let's start off with some frustrations here. Offensively the cowboys get off off to another slow start. Defensively they just let the Minnesota Vikings run roughshod all over them. That's the story of this game and in and then they still have a chance to win it and coaching ruins in the end. So yeah where do you. Where would you like to start Tom Well I think I I was mentioning earlier. I think there are two big stories here The coaching which I think we want to get to a little bit later and the other is how really bad play in the trenches along with coach wasting wasted just an outstanding MM performance from Dak Prescott and Amari Cooper and a really good job by Randall. COBB and Michael Gallup. Yeah you had two receivers IOS Randall. COBB and Amari Cooper gold for over one hundred yards in this game and Dak Prescott was phenomenal. But let's the story with Dak.. Prescott is as debt. Dak Prescott has been phenomenal for the cowboys. But man were they putting him in a lot of awful off. Oh Yeah Yeah. Yeah I've I've got an article that should becoming gone blogging. The boys or I'd just you know looked at how this whole idea of succeeding and failing With your plays played out during this game and that was the big thing is that the cowboys had a bad outcome on. First down after I down after I down so all the White was going on act shoulders and for the most part he was able to handle it which makes why are they decided not to go with the pass when they were on the eleven yard line and needed to yards and a sad a second down it. Just oh please please you know that that is going to haunt us for a while. Well it comes down to this the the cowboys coaching staff and the cowboys game planning in general. Well I have a big problem with and the reason I have a big problem with it is because like you said the passing was the way they were getting everything done in this game. They saw all success yet. They continuously on just about every single. I down ran the ball into a loaded box because in their minds they are running running football team they are. That's how they get success. That's how they are going to win. Football Games as Zeke. Elliott is the reason for the season and I think that they they need to start looking at it in a different way and that Minnesota was not going to let them run the football and Kellen Moore stubbornly stubbornly continuously tenuously him and Jason Garrett decided running. The football was what they were going to do and coach. Zimmer was daring them to run the football every time he dared dared them to run the football Tom. They failed miserably. They continuously did it. Continuously had to get them out of third and long which he did by the way to just an other worldly amount he was not he did not live he only had like a sixty percent. Completion percentage image. He wasn't you know just just absolutely tearing up in that way he was just tearing it up on those third downs when he had to move the sticks six when sometimes when they were behind because of a penalty he still would overcome it. And you know sometimes you see a pass that is it's just like you know it's the play of the week for the NFL. They he had three of two Amari Cooper free passes is on the sidelines toe tappers and all it hit me. I've seen this before I think. That's what Aaron freaking Rogers did to the cowboys. Yeah it's like. That was making the PAT. He was doing it better. He that touchdown to Cooper was placed voiced where there was no way a defender could touch it. I think it traveled like half the distance. Outside of the field of play and and Cooper was able to just reach out like forty feet past the line grab it was his toes just kind of pivot on them. And it's like okay. Hey by rule bats a touchdown it was. Yeah let's let's. Let's talk about this every time the cowboys by the way we're in a fourteen hole by fourteen eighteen point deficit here and then they needed something to happen right before you know they got out of the right in the second quarter and Dak Prescott delivered. So they're in a whole down fourteen. Nothing Dak Prescott get some two seven nothing then Dak Prescott ties the game at fourteen and then the vikings likings get the ball and kick a field goal to go into the half at seventeen to fourteen year when they come back out. It's the same shit. It's run the ball into the run. The ball into the defense. Just keep running it and running it. Until Zeke Elliott is concussed and just keep running it like he's running into a brick wall and and then on third down will bail them out again and that haunted them the entire game that continuous just stupidity stubbornness this. Whatever you WANNA call it to not put the ball in your best players hand and the best player was your quarterback? Yeah and you know it really came in because they kind of you know overcame it on their first drive in the third quarter where once again Dallas just really was able. We'll do kind of whatever it wanted because you know it it was only like what Seven plays to go from seventy five yards and score a touchdown astound They you know they got helped by a one penalty for fifteen yards for an essay. Roughness but you know other than that it they just covered the rest of it. Just Bang Bang Bang Bang. And that was the one where they got that Cooper touchdown and it just get when you come down after they've done that you keep seeing that it's Kinda like the the the coaches really don't think that can keep it up and they finally when it came down to the crucial decision point because they had stalled and had to settle for a field goal on previous drive when he came down to it they they weren't willing to trust act to go and get get one more touchdown. No they weren't and it was upsetting because Dak had been so phenomenal. This entire game game he he. He gotten them everything he he everything they did in that game was on on the shoulders of Dak Prescott and his receivers and that's largely because most of the rest of the team just wasn't delivering. The offensive offensive line was repeatedly getting beaten that the point of attack which is what happened on the The negative yardage on third down that that Kinda killed it for the cowboys as the defensive line was just letting dowling cook and Madison backup run kind of it will and when they weren't running They were getting screened passes just ripping off chunks yards the defense. The linebacking in this game was atrocious. Yeah absolutely absolutely atrocious. The Way Jalen Smith Sean Lee and les in Vander Ash played was just absolutely embarrassing. And I think they should be embarrassed. It's now the defensive line did their job. They did a lot of what they needed to do. In this game. However the way the four three defense works Rod Marinelli's believes defense? Works is what we've always been told that the the under tackle the third three technique. He he gets up field penetrates the pocket. The defensive ends get home. And the linebackers do the cleanup. They couldn't clean up anything here and and really to to me. Antoine Woods had a good game but the other tackles. They didn't do so. Great and warm. Early Factor Lea Collins kept getting moved out of the spot consistently just on almost every single. Run Play Dalvin. Cook did what he wanted. which which this comes to? I have to ask this question Tom. What is this defense? Because I can tell you what it isn't. And that's consistent. They can stop Saquon Barkley and hold him to twenty rushing yards but they can't and he's the best running back in the league by far and they can't stop down cook. Who is the top rusher in in the league? They just like you said they got beat up by the Minnesota offensive line. Even the right tackle went out for most of the game. They still got beat up. It didn't matter. They did what they wanted against. The cowboys defensive Defensive Front in front seven and it was just historically embarrassing to watch how badly this defense went from looking being they can go from one week to looking like oh man. This is an elite defense to the next week looking like they're not all which kind of is the catalyst for what the cowboys cowboys are. They are inconsistent as a whole and I think we just need to stop looking at this team and saying you know. They're just so talented. They're going to get together. Bullshit jet going to get it together and actually gotten into a truth about the NFL. That people don't WanNa recognize and that's that defensive affective nece or the defensive contribution to the win is highly inconsistent in the NFL. It is it is far more variable than offensive production. And you know sometimes people are going to come up with a game plan and your defense is not going to handle it. Well especially if if you happen to have some people that are having off game and if you have kind of a built in weakness in the cat that Dallas only has one really effective run on stopping defensive. Tackle Antoine Woods and I think they need to think about what they're doing here after they've seen what the vikings just did to them You know or are you know baby. Fire the way to get Christian coming to more involved. I'm not sure if they got an answer in house but they definitely need to rethink this whole thing which gets into the whole coaching idea and get they have a quarterback who should be in the MVP discussion that game. He should he showed everyone. Why should be yeah? Even though it was a loss he was just making some phenomenal Throws he was doing on the run because the pass blocking was also a bit inconsistent. We since found out that both guards or were dealing with the problems Connor Williams is going to miss time due to a niece. Go Zach Martens. Dealing with an elbow problem is as we since learned and yet Prescott was just getting loose. He was evading. He only got sacked once and he was making just remarkable throws on the run and that which goes to show just what he's made of and how good he it is. And how much like you said you started. The show was saying they wasted him. Yes it was just a it was a landmark performance. It was the main Out of been the most productive and stats as far as completion percentage. And all that. But he made more unlikely completions than he ever has whereas in this just show what he has become now they need to find a way not to waste a another highly talented uncreative quarterback yet because what he did was what we saw Romo for many years and that's make chicken salad out. You know what yeah and just. He kept them in that game yet. It wouldn't have happened yet. We're GONNA take a quick break and when we come back we're going to talk more about the cowboys lost to the Minnesota Vikings Twenty Twenty eight twenty four on Sunday night football. And we're GONNA talk about this team as a whole we'll be right back on the route and the boys podcast. Are you a netflix person. Are You more into Hulu. You got that. Hbo Now thinking about that whole whole apple. TV Plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never ends so on today. Explained Fox's Daily News podcast we're going to talk to Fox's critic at large Emily Vander worth about the coming streaming wars and. Emily is going to talk about how it's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her. Favorite medium television and how the monocultures basically dead but also she will reveal come she thinks will win the streaming wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming wars and also she'll criticize some of the lesser shows. That have come out of the streaming wars. You will know everything you need to know. You'll know which service you should be subscribing to and which ones should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other than watch TV ever again. Check out today explained wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right now. Hey Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm I'm Jason Kirk and we're the host of the shutdown full cast your avengers of college football podcast. It says here in the script to riff on what that means and basically what I mean is. It's all alright unspoiled. Every Tuesday we talk about everything from cooking disasters to pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college football. Every now and then unlike mascot fights announced fleeing the booth. Early and unfashionable pants. That coaches were now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken taken. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP and we are back on the Bruce and the boys podcasts. Were talking about the cowboys they lose. Twenty eight to twenty four on Sunday night football against the Minnesota Vikings and just had to ask. What is the problem with this football team? Why can't they seem? It seems like everybody every single week. They see them win on Monday night. Football against the giants and say well. Maybe this team is ready to put it together. But like I said in the first segment I don't see them putting it together because they can't show a out consistency. Yeah I think it's kind of complex first off. Somebody has been talking on twitter or that. Maybe there's just not really a dominant team in the. NFL has year. That's true you know everybody is kind of inconsistent assistant and I don't know exactly what to attribute that to across the league with the cowboys I you know I hate it. It would people just want to blame the coaches. But I'm starting to think okay. I don't think the pieces they've got blazer that bad they've have some some really good ones. They have some good ones. They don't have a lot of really bad pieces. So you Kinda have to use Oxfam's razor and say so what's going Gone With the coaching. And this is the way that I'm really start to think. Okay if they don't somehow turn it around around and at least play deep into January as give at least to the NFC championship game. I think it's really. There's no choice but to move on for Jason Garrett and that means those staff is probably going to give up into. Yeah and you know I agree with you because look at this. You look at the team and like you said you look and you see talented. You got all pro and pro bowl caliber players all over your offense and all over your defense and almost in every single position group so and when you look at the way that they played football games in the way that they lose football games in the way at the end of a football game you see them running twice when they need to yards and it's because like you kind of felt like Jason Garrett said Deck. We appreciate where you've gotten us to this point but we got it now we we got it from here. Well No oh you don't got it from here because I believe they're two different types of coaching in the NFL. And that's it. There are two different types. There are types of coaches that have that can give you an edged. And they become part of your of your winning formula. And then their coaches that cannot. I don't believe that Jason and Garrett gives the cowboys any type of edge here. I don't believe he gives them a winning edge or anything I think he also that second category now. You could talk about the best to ever do it bill belichick well. That's more than just an edge. Okay that that guys on the on the far end of the spectrum of what coaching noon. But I think Andy Reid gives his team manager. I think that other coaches give their teams on edge. I think that frank right gives the colts in edge. But I don't think Jason Garrett has it in him to give his team an edge when they just need him to give them the smallest of pushes forward in a game. I think that he actually takes away from his. Tr take away from their ability to win by making decisions like Olas trying to kick a fifty seven yard field goal on the first drive of the game. Yeah that was that was what happened. What happened after that? Tom Would the Minnesota Vikings do with that short field. They drive get seven points. Of course exactly. You've got other other problems you know. We've already talked a bit. About how. How the Marinelli Scheme is really showing its flaws and some weaknesses. Chris Rashard does not art will. They seem to be getting it done. Kellen Moore by have Garett too much in his ear and is picking up too much of the conservative tendencies at the wrong time. And he's doing to the whole establish the run nonsense. And you know Keith Quinn Garrett threw him under the bus on the table on Austin Ostad decision to fair catch when they needed to get down the field and try to score that touchdown with just seconds left You know just why. Why are are you going to tell him to fair catch? Tell him you know okay. Unless you've got a shot fair catch but if you've got a shot give us some your drill fast which he had a shot to offer. Aw At least get them to their own thirty. Yeah they said like he probably had twenty yards ahead of him before we have to have any and all sorts of is a guy that he might have house. I mean it was twenty yards can become sixty yards and a touchdown really quick. Be Out so it was. It was really. There's just a lot a lot going on. That does not seem to be functioning and and let me say this Garin has some things are very valuable. There you'll well who needs Garrett right now and I think he would be. Getting hired is one of these franchises. That's complete disarray. Needs a guy a WHO could come in and get the organization sorted out and help establish a culture You know and right now. He's do that. He's got great culture. He's done a great job of kind of building up the roster but now it's like he's he's like the guy who who goes out and makes a lot of money and buys himself one of these you know two hundred thousand dollar supercars in doesn't have a clue call how to drive that fake. Yeah I just think that the cowboys too often do this well. We're GONNA do what we do. We establish the run. And we redo that will you can't do it against people that can stop you like the Minnesota Vikings. You can't continuously say I mean I can't let this go because it seems so so just seems like you're standing there saying well. Why can't we run the football? I just don't understand what try again. Try it again. Second run it again. Run it again. See See why why it's not working. It's not working because it's not ethnic work in fits it and that's our you know we're kind of may be different from people because we obsess about the cowboys. All the time and I was thinking while I was out walking my dog earlier today that if if if the time comes was in garrison looking for a new head coach I mean Jerry. Jones is looking at new head coach. He needs to ask one question and he says and that should be what. What do you want the identity of this team's offense to be and if that coach comes in and offers I wanNA run the ball I all I wanna do this? I WANNA I WANNA do that Jerry. Auto say thank you very much. Go on until he gets a guy who says the identity of this team is. We're going to do whatever works. Works with the talent we've got that's the guy you hire. Yeah or somebody that comes in and says I want to look at. I'll take every game plan differently separately and have to change things as we go so we can kick people's ass that's what you're there to do. You got the players the talent to do so but for the in this game the cowboys took the momentum so much away from Minnesota but they would give it right back with just dumb play calling just. I'm going going to run this right up at like this. Why I keep saying that? Zimmer dared Kellen Moore to continue to call runs any did he did. Maybe what you just said you know what I'm GonNa be this time. You can load nine eight guys in the box. I don't care I'm GonNa beat you this time. I don't think it was that much about the boxes. It's just about that frustrating thing that as you as you alluded to. We tried this and it didn't work so by Gosh. Were going to try it again to make. That's the opposite opposite way either. We tried that. It doesn't work what else we got to work on. What have we got that has worked? Oh getting back rolling out to who is right and and making something happened. Downfield is working thrown all over the yard. He had thrown it all over the yard. But they didn't want to do they had to. They were like no. We want back. If you'RE GONNA throw it we want it to be third down in attorney and deck's still made those works so let me ask you a question. Tom Is Zeke Elliott. Having him be such a star player and having him under such a mega contract. Is that hurting this football team. I think so I believe it is You know I made that statement On twitter I think the cowboys have painted themselves into a corner with this and this team in order to succeed. One thing it's going to have to do is say okay. We are going to put Zeke on the second tier this offense. He is what we go to When we detect a weakness will probem in? And if we find a team that Zeke is open for seventy eight yards of pop fine. We'll run it down the throat. But a Z comes up. And we don't get anything you know early and I'm talking not about running on every first down the I five or six first downs you have. No I'm talking about you. Mix It up and see what's working. And if it's not working with Zeke than okay if we have a short yardage or something we'll need you otherwise let's hone some of those pass blocking skills. Yeah or giving out because you're paying seek because he's one of the best at the position wholeheartedly. He gives you everything he can pick up the blitzer. You can do everything. But if you want Zeke to lead the league in rushing every single year you don't have to force that that you'll have to force him to carry the ball to lead the league in rushing every single year but you have to. What makes your offense work in right now? Running running the football until your face is just blue is not what works. Hey if if the if the team is going to be influenced by how much they're paying someone for God's Sakes Jerry Give Daquan every once and then maybe the coaches will say. Oh we're paying him. We better let him carry the game. Yeah you know what let's assigned to one hundred million a year. Who Cares? Yeah I got the money. Let's get more a coupon to Cobb. Something let's you know. Let's just sign all the receivers. There's two of flooding La Jillion dollars. Who cares just make up a number so you can continuously use it so so you mentioned that you think Zeke is a part of the problem? Now I think people take you out of context. And you think Zeke doesn't matter does matter. He is one of the best football players they have. But what we're saying is is that Zeke should not be forced the ball. He should not be the feature player every game regardless of the opponent and regardless of what's happening happening when he's working he can go out and get you one hundred fifty ours. That's great. Use It right at when it works but when you have a game like Minnesota then then just don't worry about it you know unless you get like a second one then hit him and see if maybe in pop it for a little but other than that. Just don't you know. Just throw in just enough running to keep the defense honest if that's even really a concept that's all I'm saying if it's the game where he's not going to be able to get you know. Eighty ninety one hundred yards at least on the ground they don't worry about it. Focus on how can we make the passing game work. And this week the cowboys will be taken on the Detroit. Lions and Detroit. Lions have kind of gone a little bit backwards without Matthew. Stafford I Do you think that this is a good game for the cowboys to go ahead and see if they can get everything else to start working before they start running the football into the ground. Oh Lord Lord they well. Here's the good good thing. The cowboys seem to be far less conservative with their up against team the struggling the only step on their necks. They only get really conservative when they see a formidable opponent. I think and so go up there. And they don't have stabbed award about. I would not be surprised to see them. Come out swinging it and act to get four hundred fifty yards passing and five ways down. Wait wait you mean. You're not scared of Jeff Driscoll but uh he. He took his dog out for a walk. I'm GonNa have my cat walked me after this episode just though Doubt Okay all I can say the one thing I do want to say just to show that I'm not getting cocky is don't forget the New York jets are I. Just just. Don't blow this bubble jet yourself. Yeah just don't go up there and let them into the game but but that's why I think they just need to go out there and just attack attack attack run the score up. They need to do it for their own confidence. You know because because guess. What's coming next the Patriot etes where they playing them in Foxborough? ooh At what time of year in the winter. Those all bad things for the cowboys. All I hear is like game of Thrones Music Don Don about to go into winter fell by your baby. We hear the reins of Castle Mayor. uh-huh exactly we are nerds. We Love The Dallas Cowboys Cowboys lose on Sunday night football. They need to get back in a big way. Get a win against the Detroit. Lions Alliance maybe not run until their faces blue again and maybe figure out their offense figure out their identity. He is Tom Row. You can find him on twitter at Tom Row. You can find. Find me at Mr Size where you can find us at Bruce and the boys and that blogging the boys and until next time folks take care cowboys nation. And don't jump off the ledge just yet we. He's still got a lot of football left. We'll be back in about a week to talk more cowboys bruising. The boys is produced by media and hosted by Michael Sizemore in. Tom Rile for more visit bruising. The Boys Dot Com.

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Silver & Black Hole Episode 2

Silver & Black Pride

45:11 min | 2 years ago

Silver & Black Hole Episode 2

"I they face Jason. What's going on to another edition of the silver and black hole exclusively here on a silver black pry podcast network on SB nation? I'm your host Nick Hamilton alongside my man Jaylen so-called and we've got a jammed pack shelf y'all today of course coming off off the aftermath of the huge AFC west showdown between the Oakland Raiders and the Los Angeles chargers last time the Los Angeles chargers will be playing the Oakland Raiders in Oakland in the black hole. We'll get into that. Would take away is for worse pros and cons all that great stuff stuff and yes. The raiders were successful in continue to control their own destiny. Sitting at five and four grieving in my man Kayla was going on. Oh man how you doing. I'm doing I'm doing great mean they doing great relaxing. Nice good days. Especially after raiders. Win You know yes. Yes indeed after a great rates went on a big Thursday night Thursday night. Football with the entire country can see exactly what we've been seeing all season long now now lately. I have been skeptical of the Oakland Raiders of any of you all recall my former broadcast partner on the other podcast. You will recall me saying that. I don't think the raiders writers who get bored with seven wins well. It appears that I made the raw. The raiders could be making a playoff appearance. Who knows right now? They are sitting at five and four. Were the second on the AFC Wesley Kansas City chiefs and that is thanks in part to a huge fourth quarter. Two two minute drill dry down the field that was capped off by eighteen yard touchdown run by none other than the rookie running back Jazz Jacobs Wacko all the Raider. God said Everytime Raider Nation sees this guy. You all need to be on your knees thanking the good football guys above that. The raiders had the good sense in Mike. Mike mayock along with John Grooten to draft this kid out of where the Alabama crimson tire roll tide. Ah So will you take away from the raiders in charge game because it was a very weird Game at least for the first three and a half quarters You saw the raiders. Do some amazing things on defense. You saw the chargers make some good runs and I noticed a few things. Good event They didn't get too ugly when it came to this writer charger gang. Yeah so mean. One thing I definitely notice was that like any other game. Josh Jacobs is a very elusive. He's very hard nosed runner. That evades a bunch of tackles and is very hard to take down. I mean that is definitely one thing I noticed. And besides that their car leading the team as he said on the game drives he. That's his nine gaming drive of his career and people were downing car before the season I mean how can you doubt him after that. Winning drive a winning a huge game like this bus is past S.. Six Games is eight touchdown one interception ratio. How can you doubt me longer? Well that's that's a good point. I mean listen there are exemplified the mob mentality. We know he's a huge fan support. Kobe Bryant Kobe. Bryant represents not just excellent but that Mama mentality that he's instilled upon a lot of players not just basketball players but athletes across the board football baseball and so forfeit. Derek Carr happens to be one of those specifics in. Listen I said Nah tweet out on Thursday night I said if dare cars going to to be that Derek Carr the one that we saw two and a half seasons ago that was running for the league. MVP Gotha Raiders. Twelve and four. This is where the Derek Carr are of the mob mentality has come alive in also. Clock Management is going to happen in say. They're not to be the most disciplined they spent the entire game. Use me a show enough. I mean Derek Carr was launched their car with all over the field. He was finding his spots. It seemed like the old line was really holding up for him. Probably the best these scene in that entire game when it came to that drive. I mean that was a captivating drive and then when I saw the whole Gist Oakland right up for Josh Jacobs to run on the left side but eighteen yard. He finally found a black carpet which is known as the end zone. I mean I said Said Okay. It's a wrap all the all the rates have to do now is not not play. These things is short enough. I'll be damned if I didn't see the raiders. Almost give his game away defensively because as we saw throughout the night the raiders picked up silly penalties that shot themselves foot in continue to give the chargers. A chance at this game was saying not only stay in the game early on but to possibly win the game as a charged with driving down the seal not a one thing I will say that I noticed was that they check that. The chargers defense kept Mike Williams in check pretty much the entire game. I think Mike Lewis at two big catches late in the third quarter. In really much Mike Williams was part of the meal car all-stars we had seen his presence at all especially him coming off a huge one hundred plus yard game the first one hundred plus yard game some of his career last Sunday against the Green Bay packers and now he's he's a no show which to me so the lot of respect and a lot of the nasty acidy when it comes to the writer decent. How did you assess this writer? Defense bankers to me. I think they play fairly well. Modest penalties which. They're going to have to definitely clean that up they flannel make it a playoff run. Yeah you're right they definitely have to clean up. You cannot play undisciplined football especially at this stage in the season. But I thought Eric Harris and the defense forcing three turnovers until rivers was huge. Because if you to win games to get into a health speak raid will turn overs and having three hundred Against and on one of the S on quarterbacks Rivers early semi in he raiders. Definitely stepped the game and Eric. Here's stepped it up. Having to big interceptions including a pick six and a large return in the first half alone is huge and deadly Eddie. Line definitely was was definitely good and I definitely think they could improve down the stretch but on the out fighting like they did. Last night was good. Oh man it was huge. I used in this game have a lot of implications I mean. This was a game that could have propelled the charges empty. Had One going five. Excuse me sly. It's been five yet. It'd been five and five so they actually been five hundred instilled in running for a playoff. The would have put the raiders a highly. A ball Because now their season would have been on the line now with this win raiders. Put pretty much the charter season on the line because of the charges get another loss which is quite possible. They're pretty much out of the playoff. The best they could finish at that point nine and seven and that may not be enough in the AFC to capture a playoff while car be especially with the raiders continuing to be in second place and there's only two wildcard vs available which which I think are gonNA come one is GonNa come out of the AFC west. I think the other one comes out of the. AFC South depending on the nature of the Houston Texans and Indianapolis Colts in how that shapes up But again I can't discount the buffalo bills right now because they're playing some really incredible football as well what we do know one of those those while car it's good come from the AFC west. Nine Oakland raiders can input their name on it. They continue to play better football. It's easy to capture. These wins that are necessary for them to put themselves in that position. One thing I will say my infield defense is definitely Eric Airs. I mean he was absolutely phenomenal. He was all over the field on Thursday night. I mean he's frustrated Philip Rivers. You can see that second interception. Net Philip rivers was through. You can see the frustration rivers his face and I'm saying okay now. He's getting to you now. This this writer Defence Fund. The black hole is playing like the right of defence advanced imagined him to be playing all season long and they. I mean they quickly Sarnath to attend Ali just in the first quarter I mean they shut out the Los Angeles chargers chargers in the first quarter. The charges didn't make a run into the second quarter with the one thing. I have a problem with the ones that concern me about the Raider Defense I was affected. Had the inability stopping the run. I mean it could not really stop Austin Nectar. They definitely can stop. Melvin Gordon is Gordon had his way pretty much majority of of the night when it came to the running game he finished twenty two carries on over one hundred yards a hundred yards of total offense which is absolutely incredible. Melvin Gordon is definitely coming law. But if you're going to be there the raiders you're trying to make a playoff run which you're gonNA have to do with your defense is find a way to stop the run affect affect the. It's a me. I think they got a d-plus in stopping the run last night. When it came to Melvin Gordon in Los Angeles Char Yeah I mean Melvin Garden last night so the reason why he's Upper S on running backs in the League and why he thinks he deserves to behave all the money but again doing that. Against the raiders. Raiders cannot have that for the rest of the season because with opponents coming up who are alive. What are still just as good if not better? You can't have that because you're playing teams A. You're going to have to play the chargers again and you'll need to be them to the playoffs. You'll play the chiefs and you'll probably a couple of teams that have good solid running backs within the division. The key to making the playoffs for the raiders is to win his in an have to deal to stop. Run like you said because playing Division that is loaded with star star running back well listen. I don't think they're gonNA win the division. I'm going to be quite honest. Which you've got no raider? Nation may be mad at the Yes. I've been caught a raider hater. That's fine whatever everybody. I'm a realist. I'm a writer River's okay. I'll do they win the division. I think Kansas City hangs on especially with Pat. mahomes coming back. He's he's not lost with the season we all know. Oh how powerful the Kansas City Chiefs Pat Mahomes is under center. So I don't think they win the division Unless cassidy this completely crafts the bed which I doubt So I think the best that the raiders can do is finished second maybe ten win season in hopefully they propelled him into a wildcard. Be Will you like you said when they play the charges again. They're going to have to play other asking the AFC west opponents moving forward. I mean when I look at when I look at the raiders scheduled for example They're gonNA have some tough games. They don't have any any any Jimmy Games per se. I mean minus You know minus the this had they host the bengals. That's probably that's going to be. That should be a win. They host the ski. They go on the road to New York. The face the jets which could be a trap game because everybody knows West. Coast teams have issue. You fly across the country for those early today in Games so that could be an issue and then right after that you go to Kansas City to face the chiefs which which. I don't know how that's GONNA fail. we listen. I don't know how that's going to happen with a w of you especially Pat Bahamas back understand that we saw the last time they face against the details that happened to be in Oakland and yes they played a great first quarter a kiss the Kansas City chiefs. Correct me if I'm wrong last time. I checked sixty minutes work. Football is four quarters in the other three quarters. They play like complete garbage gardens. So if the Raiders WanNa Bounce back in avenged that loss in Oakland they're gonNA come out second home much like they did on Thursday night against the chargers charters in pretty keep their foot on the nest of its Kansas City chiefs. Then they come back home on December. The eighth host the Tennessee Titans which should be a win the cutting as they remain whole against the Jacksonville Jaguars follow a week. which should be a win? Then they go down to Los Angeles to the Dignity Health Sports Part on December twenty second. That should be a win for the Los Angeles for the Oakland Raiders. Later and then they finish out the season at Denver which can also be folks kind of a tricky game. We know they did very very well. Against the broncos to the open up the season in Oakland they should mimic that have a lot of momentum going into that game on December twenty nine so from this point right. Now I'm looking at one Hasselblad. Two three four five. I'm looking at six Wednesday. I'm looking at possibly six Wednesday finish out the season and the writers are currently a fog before if they can get to eleven and five or even attend insists. I think that puts them in the position in the driver's seat to get that wild Carpi because the right is going to have to improve. So I'm looking at that and I'm saying looking at the schedule is six wins. Am I expecting too much from the Oakland Raiders. Saying that they'll finished with six wins. Am I delivers no. You're not because Looking at the schedule and with what you just about some games being crap games six wins could happen. I'm saying I'm saying six wins because I'm counting the trap game. I'm I'm trying to say that. Hey they could the jets. The jets aren't inferior. We know how bad they've been playing. We know Adam gays cannot coach has no business being in the League coaching on the sidelines. Foreign off concern when it comes to New York jets but who cares. All I'm saying is even with that trap game minus the chiefs game which I'm counting as AOL l.. beat the chiefs beat the raiders in Kansas City. I think the raiders making close. But I did Kansas City prevails in that gay. So I'm saying I'm saying six games aims even if they won five games that's still puts them at ten in six if they want five games that's tendencies and if you look at the overall. AFC paycheck right. So listen if you look at the overall AFC Fitch. And I'm saying to myself okay. Let's look at the playoff pitch the AFC in AFC. We all know that New England is topped off right though we know the millennial is going to be top dog. We know that right now while the Ravens right now. Six into the Texans are six three a log will be Kansas City chiefs. That are also six. Three coats are currently five three six. So worst case scenario the bills are GONNA lose more games. The colts are probably GONNA lose Morgan. So if I'm looking at raiders. Were just a game. Currently behind against city chiefs right. Now if I'm the raiders. Ironically for next week I'm pulling. I have to pull for the chargers to upset the Kansas City chiefs in Mexico City. Because if the charges can be the chiefs that puts the cheese at six in four right it will put domestics for put some Essex. Well declared Tennessee time. So let's be descendancy times puts Seventy three if the IF. The chargers chargers can be cheese which which is quite possible. Stranger things have happened in. AFC West Four if the raiders win domestication force still a game behind but it helps them helps them gain it sets a very nice match up at Airway later later on the seat so I think they can continue to be neck and neck with against any cheese even though they won't win the division. It's just a game behind and cheese helps them in the standings it definitely helps them while but more importantly than that I think is that it helps them build for the future. They moved to the winter moved to Las Vegas. That's what the Front office staff. They knew they had that inspire hope after last season. They didn't know that but looking at the schedule they could beat the bengals. They could beat the jets. I'M GONNA say making the Jaguars Haydn's I didn't I I'm thinking five wins. I moves through parties Broncos for those of the game so whoever win inspiring hope and then being in your two of the era or duty your point Oh and Oakland then there are the very e- this season and next season as well. Well well. Let's take a quick. We're GONNA take a quick time out because I want to talk about on the other side of the break. The status of one one lamarcus joyner dissolved went down Thursday they night. What is his status future? Because that is a gaping hole in the secondary for the Oakland Raiders. Can't he move on Kenny. Before next week is healthy and we'll find out on the other side of the great you guys are inside a whole. That's why the silver and black hole exclusively on the silver and black bright podcast network. It turns Are you a netflix person. Are You more into a Hulu you got that. Hbo Now thinking about that Whole Apple TV plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never never ends so on today. Explained Fox's Daily News podcast we're going to talk to Fox's critic at large Emily Vander worth about the coming streaming gaming wars and. Emily is going to talk about how. It's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her favourite medium television and how the monocultures basically dead Ed. But also she will reveal comp- she thinks will win the streaming wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming awards and also she'll criticize some of the lesser shows that have come out of the streaming wars. You will know everything you need to know. You'll know which service you should be subscribing to do and which ones you should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other than watch. TV ever again check out today. Explained wherever you listen to podcasts you can find our episode on the streaming wars right now. Uh Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk and we're the hosts of the shutdown full cast your of vendors of college. Football podcast it says in the script onto riff on what that means and basically what I mean is this all every Tuesday. We talk about everything from cooking disasters. Thursday pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college. Football every now. And then like mascot fights announcers fleeing the early. And unfashionable. Pants that coaches where now if you want to take college football exactly seriously as it should be taken. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts or in in your favorite podcast APP listener. I'm Sean Ramos. Firm host of today explained Vox daily. News podcast cast every day Monday through Friday. My team and I look at what's happening in the world. We pick one essential news story that defines our moment and ask smart people to help. I understand it in about twenty minutes or less. It's the perfect way to start or end your day subscribed today explained for free on apple podcasts. or in your favorite favorite podcast APP from stitcher and the Vox media podcast network Welcome back Latte so the silver black hole cast here on Silver Black Bra podcast network exclusively on SP nations. I'm your host Nick. Hamilton long sobbed Batman caitlyn soccer. And yes the Oakland raiders are victorious coming off a huge W.. Ever Nice little break in between we especially on a short week off Thursday night win Issac the black and so of course unfortunately where can outcome out beyond the markets joined who played exceptionally well. Hope on Thursday night about pretty much hailed a lot of receiving thieving check for the Los Angeles chargers. I believe it was in the late. Third Quarter Fourth Quarter Rather. We saw the Marcus. Joyner go down with the hamstring which was not good and that could have severe consequences winters moving forward when it comes to the writer secondhand. How big was that loss If lamarcus joyner cannot continue for the next two to three weeks I mean with the way the defense did it against the chargers. I mean I'd I personally don't think it would be that big of a loss. Es leadership standpoint mm for different standpoints like that it would be a big loss in the locker room presence. But he'd still be there but he just would not be on the field playing. I'd I don't see a huge loss because he hasn't performed up to expectations this year or say as has he has done for past three seasons when he was with the rams where he had or exceptions in three years. He has none this zere he has. He hasn't done much bud he has. I personally. Don't see it as uh well either disagree with you. I think it is a big loss in this regard. Not yes I agree with you in the fact that he hasn't lived up to the expectations of at the time that we've seen him when he was with member of the Los Angeles Rams and how impactful he was under that defense on the way Phillips however his presence and his leadership are needed field. especially with the raiders nursing already a significant number amount of injuries and also not only Lamarcus joyner wind down but safety safety called. Joseph also was injured in went down when John Grooten spoke about it on Thursday night in the Post Game Presser. He said quote. We're I'm worried about about join a really worried about him and I'm also worried about Joseph in quote. If Jon Gruden is really worry about Lamarcus joyner doc has some serious consequences now no we all hear about the next man philosophy. That's all fine and good at. I'm not disclaiming discrediting rather anybody that has to step up. Lamarcus joyner this place because I think the writers have have some significant players that can play the position however when you have an inexperienced guy at cornerback like Lamarcus joyner as you alluded to earlier as far as leadership in his presence being on the field and you take that away it does take away some of the vibe. I believe that is secondary for the Oakland Raiders. And then you also lose your safety in College Joseph and when You know Karl. Joseph was optimistic missing while he was using crutches leaving the Oakland Alameda Coliseum on Thursday night you know he said quote. Hopefully I'll be all right but we'll see tomorrow meaning Friday. Get everything checked out so hopefully is nothing but a minor injury sure. Crutches are precautionary measure. So I don't WanNa get writer nation to riled up as far as how much significant time. He could call jobs but missed. But I will say this much. Losing Call Joseph for a long period of time allow along with the market join. It doesn't help you if you're trying to make a strong playoff push. Listen I hi. This is something I'm more concerned about. Lamarcus joyner especially when John Rootin- Santa Cruz gruden rarely speaks about injuries in the in this form When he talks awesome he'd be him being really worried about somebody I think it's it's serious We'd hopefully we don't know how serious it is hopefully is not too serious. Royal Miss the entire season type of series. Maybe misses the next two to four weeks and if they do make the playoffs he'll be back in time for the playoffs or at at least the last couple of games the last game of the season And speaking lamarcus joyner You know that's tough man. I mean you lose two guys that you significantly knee that puts din defense in when you're facing teams like the Kansas City chiefs are going on the road against The Los Angeles chargers or or even the Denver broncos aren't really doing that well this year It could be Capozza. A huge problem man. Yeah it could. And especially since. You're already down one Jonathan Abram and yes in your death is is sorely depleted and I read earlier this morning or even rabid concern. The Karl Josephs injury might be serious and he'll undergo Marai today Friday. But look if you lose to them that that seriously depletes and everything especially after the freighter bypassed everything where he you cannot improve with serious talent defensive secondary so it would definitely not be good especially when you're coming up playing aims such as in led by havoc mahomes and I might say Tannahill has informed admirably this season for the titans and then you also have to facebook ace over again. It's not most ideal situation. Adding banged up Ease of secondary's rarely if if ever perform well after they lose the depth there. Well you you know what. Here's the problem I have and I mean I understand what you're saying honest and you make a valid point when I will say this if it's a serious injury enwrap report from the. NFL Network is reporting. That could be a possible series injury when it comes to Joseph that sounds like he could be out for the season. If Vietnam out for the season I may have to dial back my high level expectations when it comes to the Oakland Raiders. Winning out the next five to six eight. Ain't the offense. Listen I think the offense continues to improve thing. Derek Carr has finally found his groove. I Love Josh Jacobs. I think Josh Jacobs GonNa Continue to improve my for rookie of the year. Because I think he's he's been the engine as it pertains to getting this offense continuing to go in the right the direction Guys is a dynamic threat. He can run the ball. He can catch the bathroom. He can find the open holes even when there were a couple of times on Thursday night. Will you thought Josh Jacobs Was a guy that was already caught. The play was dead and he bounces around in fines. Extra five to six Jarrad. It pretty much keeps the change going. That's how dynamic especially this young man is Is So I don't. I don't doubt I love Tyrel Williams and what he's done hundred renfro hundred win for the rookie. I think he's unexceptional jobless. Farhi starting to find his grew in a in the end for the first time. In a long time I think Derek Carr some significant can weapons that he can find in throats and keep the change moving to keep the boggling yes. He was sacked twice on Thursday night. Melvin Ingram is no slouch Melvin. Ingram is one of those bookings bookings that you do not want to be on the end up and looking up at him from the ground up along with Joey Bosa so a there was no escaping. Eat he was going to zagged. Joey Bosa he's GonNa his sack Belva Negro. It was less of the tweet was I think When it comes to Derek Carr but he remained poise? He got back up. Got Back under center Finish out the drive. So listen he's GonNa have moments like that but overall this is a guy in Derek Carr. That finished vanished extremely wealthy. You Finish Twenty one for thirty one buck. Seventy eight with a touchdown. So he's I mean. Listen isn't this guy is coming back in this guy. This is the quarterback. We've all been waiting for for the last two years thirty one what to eighteen months use me. Two thousand eighteen yards passing and one touchdown I'm excited about this writer team now. I'm actually excited about it. I'm actually excited. Added to see and I'll tell you what the coolest thing the night man is. When we saw here coach John Grooten dappled up high five in the fans at the end of the game name in the black hole? I thought that was extremely cool. That was fun to see Gruden in that moment especially them being the last year in Oakland of before they moved to Las Vegas and I know it's tough for the fans in Oakland. But Hey that's the that's the price of business than moving to Las Vegas Stadium next year But while they're still in Oakland the fans are still coming out in droves shown love showing support in the thing about regulations. Tell us the nation travels extremely. Well I don't care if this in Timbuktu I don't care in Rome Italy narrator nation will travel And on Thursday night you saw the power and the impact of writer nation in the black coal so me last play of the game and I want to talk briefly about that. The last play of the game. When I look at it Max crosby and Kaleen Farrell how they jammed up? Philip rivers so bad on that last play was fourth ten vinyl possession could the chargers move forward and keep the change rolling and try to win the game. At least even by feel and I don't know if you saw the pitcher Kaley Bu- Philip rivers is was closed in Saint. Looked like he was praying and say please don't l.. Hurt me please. Don't touch me as As he released the ball void incomplete. Pass that's me was the funniest thing I saw all all night long. I don't know about you but I find that kind of stuff funny. Because when you see quarterback stash it when they closed eyes and hope and pray man. That's how you noted the defense was on point like a decimal in defense was impactful When they need to be impact for the most what they've got to cut down on the tunnel that data data to stop yet they they definitely need to salvage turnovers? But as when you're talk about builders look when I did see the effects are in that means your defense is in the right direction and where it should would be. When you're putting but grimace win? He will are very your defense and defense is doing you a divisional court back. That is always good for Raider. Nation is see and then then then going. I met that next crosby as evidence talked about the draft. He was on the heels of the raiders. Gang him as a mid round pick those one of the steals in. He's looking like that. This season. Remember raiders were sending people home of the draft. People are worried about that while the reading at a plan and a stuffed do it and it's paying dividends on the field the season. Yeah it is I mean you look at what they're I mean. They're they only allow. They only allow three hundred seventy yards per opponent which is ranked fourteenth in the NFL. They're actually ace only given up. One hundred thirty yards rushing her opponent which is absolutely phenomenal in the near They are only allowed. Twenty three point point one points her opponent which is sixteen best in the league. So when I look at this defense only get better but their main issue is going to be Health Chan. They stay healthy. Can guys come back off his long. What I call a mini by a really started to get healthy comeback for the defense? Because when I look at his these fans and when I look at I'm sorry scratch that well look look at the defense I mean. They're ranked eleven rushing yards only given up ninety. Eight point four yards rushing They're giving up two hundred eighty three point two yards which is still damn near last in the League so they need to clean that up there. Averaging Twenty six point seven points per opponent of giving up that those type of points for defense. So they've they've got definitely clean at the numbers that are Reggie previously were the numbers for the Aussies. They're actually Scoring Twenty one twenty three point. One points per game to Sixteenth Sixteenth League They're averaging about three engine seventy yards which is fourteenth in a league rushing yards averaging almost one hundred thirty yards which is as thanks to. Thanks Josh Jacobs and passing yards. They're actually passing two hundred and forty point two yard fifteenth in the League which is about mid range which is probably anyway where they should be Being they're five and four so only upward for the offense defense lot more question marks will see within the next week. We can answer some of those question marks as it pertains to the health of the defense. Will you moving forward The raiders are going to be able to host host. These shall I say winless Cincinnati Bengals Should be relatively the easy gang was no games easy. NFL with the way the Cincinnati Bengals have been playing as of late. I mean damage. A high school team can beat them. That's how bad a A junior college team could be Cincinnati. Bengals right about now. That's how bad they look. So there's no excuse while the raiders should not come out victorious against the the Cincinnati Bengals and then next we'll even any Dalton is even starting for the bengals either so you know it definitely be a win for Oakland if by eight points right now but that that should go up. Well Yeah I mean. Listen when they're trying to I think the Cincinnati Bengals on team tank moat. They're trying to get the number one spot especially now that the Miami Dolphins of won their first game of the season. They're the SONETTI. Bangles are pretty much in the driver seat far being thanking the number one overall pick in the two thousand twenty. NFL draft. So I don't see them try to get a W. on purpose. I think they play. But they don't play to the level where they're supposed to because they're they're eighteen tank mode so the raiders should go ahead and continue to play phenomenal office offers of football. Hopefully the defense can gather it up. Next man up of the Dayton rally regroup and get together and go ahead and stay in gets. It's a six and four is staying contention. AFC West in the AFC as a whole so. We'll see what happens next Sunday. A man is going to be Great Open Alameda Coliseum. Next Sunday one twenty five PM. CBS It's next week is southwest. Get up off the whole man so thank thank you so much for tuning in makes you download and subscribe to the silver and black hole here on the silver and black podcast network exclusively on espy nation. Raider nations up. We gotTA stop this. They'll get another cow the next time. They can't wait a nation. Just wait player slick too. There's no rules in Ranasinghe Kofi Mac off the foothill. He's folks feel Plymouth from the the celebrities. I Big East Bay Trek mccracken witness the slam wrestled with that. My nephew cooking the biggest brought by crack Crystal Alexa play. It's a long day cowboy right so Monday because before wait but I was asleep without the open face and in some fun. Radio was the first Oakland radio man was I was when he was awarded a stain famous abated. When he was calling from the base to the Abu Bob Oh now we too much fun in a famous old biggest gang have to go back to dope? Slinging postponed the palm. Now if you any seven thirty days nine nine Oh my God i Still WanNa do. The will be blocked in ninety three 'til infinity underground. That just took the fucking industry and company would have gone macerata in. Its own right the whole you can't forget you now. Only female to sit baby girl. I'm just letting you know. And last but not blocks from the town of from the Matt East though he told anybody speech appropriate about the had the free kick smoking run the way to route as stock went bitch. Let's go it over weight. Lost bad imports rely banks secret recipes. My Nigga Black Dynasty Delinquency Richie Rich. 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Steelers Post-Game: Steelers winning streak snapped after ugly performance

Behind the Steel Curtain

40:36 min | 2 years ago

Steelers Post-Game: Steelers winning streak snapped after ugly performance

"Pittsburgh steeler fans going on this is Jeff Hartmann editor behind the steel curtain dot com with you for another episode of the steelers postgame show and unlike the pass for are weeks. This is a depressing one. The steelers lay an egg literally figuratively every way you can possibly imagine twenty one to seven laws on Thursday night football to the Cleveland browns and moves directly to five and five. They're back at five hundred still not out of out of it. I don't think any stretch of the imagination. But boy with this is this was telling football game and a lot of ways of bringing Lance Williams my co host Lance. What were your knee jerk reactions to the loss on Thursday night? It was a tough one. This the game when you talked about in our last show about low expectations for Mason Rudolph. This is the game. We don't want this is the game that we're kind of scared of You know they get down. He has to press he has to make some plays. The offensive line is pretty inconsistent in terms of pass protection. He he turns the ball over. You know this was that ugly game that he was able to avoid over the last several weeks and it Kinda makes what you were saying. Hang in the last couple of shows resonate even more that. We've got to keep the expectations pretty low when it comes to Mason Rudolph in if he's just doing enough to not lose them games then he's doing a whole lot. Yeah and today tonight. Whenever you're listening to this was the lowest of the low for Mason Rudolph during his stint as the starting quarterback for the steelers? He was intercepted four times. I in some of them were just dreadful passes There's no excusing them. I know on twitter. Someone hit me up and said can't wait to hear you try right a backup Mason Rudolph after this and you can't you can't. There's there's no way you can that would be like In two seventeen rothlisberger through five picks against the Jaguars agw ours. You can't you can't defend anything. It's not my job to defend him. It's just one of those things that it was an awful game all around I thought that the the defense settled in eventually but it just there was no pop in this game and maybe just maybe this speaks a little bit of Thursday night. Football on general players aren't really ready for that game yet. The lack of preparation isn't there. I'm not excusing the loss. Because the steelers did not Deserve to win this at all but at the same time you gotta wonder if that plays a role ed before I forget Grayson just gave us nine dollars ninety nine cents and the tip Jerry System guys. It seems like every year we cannot escape a bloodbath unsportsmanlike. AFC North and the League needs to think twice about scheduling. Three division games in a row. Sheesh Grayson's referring to the end of the game When myles Garrett in Mason Rudolph and Matt filer Dave Decastro Markey's pouncey had a little meeting Lance let's talk about it right off the bat before we get into the nitty gritty and talk about numbers and the game itself. Everyone's going to be talking about this this for at least the next twenty four to forty eight hours first things first. How if you're the Commissioner Commissioner? You're laying down fines. You're laying down suspensions WHO's getting suspended WHO's not. How would you divvy that up? I think obviously absolutely Gary GonNa get suspended I think pounce he is going to get suspended unfairly. You know big up to Marquees pouncey he's definitely a guy you want Holding your back and hold down him into Castro that that's what you want in the dark alley. He wanted him to big it. Boys having your back but penalties absolutely gonNA get suspended as well for the punches and kicks and there was a guy I can't recall the player's number. They probably knew it on the live chat because it's playing in the background. I'm sure in both of our houses. Jeff and we just can't look at it but the defensive linemen that pushed Mason Rudolph in the back he five number sixty five over sixty five. He's GonNa get a suspicion where I think he was objected as well But I think of I think for some of the other players possibly in the game who got ejected delayed the hitting With the Johnson. Like some of those guys I think are going to pay a Are GonNa be there. Suspicious are going to be a little more heavy as well. If I'm the commissioner I would say myles Garrett gets no less than a five game suspension Asian He's had questionable. Plays not like Vaughn says perfect question does have a history of kind of pushing the envelope. Well I think he's been I think he's getting to significant fines this year. Either to I know too for sure it might be three. He got some significant fives finds from some hits. Did he took earlier this year. It might have been against Russell Wilson I believe but he took some. He's taking some shots beyond the whistle so this year and gotten too big fines. I think he's getting fine. It access a fifty thousand dollars a couple of times this year so with that couple with this action and he may be lucky to get five games so I would say minimum five. Wouldn't be shocked if the NFL wants to take a stand and say you know what we don't. One vaunt has perfect. You Point Zero in the league anymore and they lead vont has pisses away piss around. You know the League and get through different different suspensions. He came back and all this stuff. If they WANNA said of set the record straight days you're done for the year and any a in any postseason play if the browns were somehow able to make the playoffs. We'll you know what you know when you when you said that earlier before we jumped into the studio I was like maybe not but no no no no no think about it now and I think what's going to hurt him as well is the nature of how this game gap played The multiple steeler. We're players get knocked out for him with the helmet hits in this icing on the cake so to speak with that in just I think the league I I mean you had Deontay Johnson card off with blood coming out of his ear. I mean that's not that's not a good look on the marquee game on Thursday. Hey this is the one game all the eyes are on this and I don't think anybody is going to feel sorry for Garrett particularly with the earlier. Oh you're fine and he's got this year with the helmet. I I think you're right Jeff. I think he's going to get put on The commissioner's exempt list. And and at least till they figure it out he's GonNa sit idle but I don't think you'll I don't think we'll see miles geared back for the rest of the series now and I think pounds you will. I think pouncey should should is not the very word. He defended his teammate. I don't I don't say that he shouldn't have done that. But just the visual of him coming in punching kicking is at least going to get him one of it imagine But at the same time I don't think anyone else will probably I doubt that they. I doubt that defensive linemen eating gets a game that shove masonry from behind. Hope he'll he'll he'll get fine. I'm trying to think you'll get suspended Radio like that. You know this. This is not to cut you off but this is the type of thuggery that the NFL really wants to clean up and their corporate sponsors are not happy networks. They're not happy. The ratings are still nice for the networks because I mean this is what everybody is going to be talking about. ESPN IS GONNA love it and all that stuff but this is not a good look for the again and this is the type of stuff that they've want wanted to get out of the game for years you know. I mean we have a stomach for some of this. I mean we've seen some stuff I've never seen a football guy in a pro game. Swing a helmet and hit somebody. I've seen it in high school. I seen it in college. His well But never a pro game it he. It's going to be heavy handed and it should be the if you don't then then you're just gonNA allow players to believe that this is somewhat acceptable. I give miles gary over to get two games so he would miss that that game with the steelers in two weeks and then get a play again. That's not driving him any point and I think we're a lot of people felt that a player like perfect was just kind of skirting the the law all the time. But here's a kyle. Smith gave us twenty bucks in the tip jar which is really generous. But I can't say I agree with the comment. I'll read it. Here is his first off big Fan fan second. He's talking about when the steelers play the browns. Next time he said I want the people head hunting he said I want people you know lying. Hang on the field in two weeks. BENGALS BUSH LEAGUE RE Times Five. I WANNA see careers ended. I'm not going that far. It was bad it was a bad look for the league. It was battle battle around and I I think that's not so tough. The emotion of it gets in the way but he put to so his point. Though in this in this in you know really reinforces what you said earlier about him missing the season because because of that potentially happening in Pittsburgh in it getting really ugly and you know it got ugly in the stands to you know he got ugly in a stance to do as well with the potential of this getting really really really really ugly in Pittsburgh and for the league trying to avoid what happened between the steelers and the bengals and the bungles. Excuse me it's late They are really going to be heavy handed on Myles Myles Garrett and they are going to send directives to both teams that if this gets out of hand quick actions quick fines. They're gonNA GONNA be on top of this and they're going to handle what he was saying to prevent that heavy fines and suspensions any unfortunate thing for myles Garrett was was he was having a whale of a ball game but when he helped Mason Rudolph down a little bit longer you know it kind of piqued my interest like he's Callo Kinda rubbing this in because he sat down he didn't let them up. He kind of drove him into the ground. And I was like He's putting a little hot sauce on his tackle. Aw and Mason. Rudolph felt the same way like do the game is over. Do like what are you doing this Bushley and these are big guys. It's emotional. They just lost the other team one and you know I'm I'm almost surprised. It didn't get worse. I well there was only eight seconds. Left aver would've I think absolutely would've riddle me this. Can you imagine this with Joe. He order on the sidelights. NOPE or James Harrison evil or James Ayers. If deebo in Joey were on the sidelines we're talking pier six brawl. All they might still be fighting. It's I it said it was so weird I was watching the game and I'm literally almost falling asleep. I believe it was such a bad football game from start to finish every way possible and then all of a sudden this happens and you know I I get Mason Rudolph reaction because you've you've thrown four interceptions. You're you're pissed at yourself for basically throwing a game away and I don't even know if miles geared had to take him to the ground after he ever to the football but he did Mike you said he holds them down a little bit. He's basically get off man and then all of a sudden he's he's being helmets being ripped off his head. This another bad look to this. Is everyone saw the very public display in regards of Rudolph's concussion against the Ravens evens a week four and were absurd week five and so with that. Now you have another player's swinging helmet at a helmet Louis player. That's already hardy at concussion this year it just compounds everything starts to snowball. Let me add the last element because this resonates in your household sold all of the women in the country that are upset that Pretty Mason get hit in. All of the women in the country are upset that the pretty guy got hit in the head with a hell but they were all yellow it. Please keep your helmet son. You're too pretty. Take it off voluntarily. Yes yes or or put it back on. Please let us not not that led to that pretty face get hit and the thing about this a you know maybe we can tilt it back towards the game is this. This is going to hide it abysmal performance by him. You know people are going to counter forget. He was awful that that offense was awful awful. Now he wasn't helped out by deontay Johnson. Juju Smith Schuster get knocked out but and connor getting hurt again and AH maybe we can start to close the book on Connor as that feature back as his his level of door ability keeps cropping up as an issue. But you know for Mason Rudolph this is going to hide and Kinda mass that he flat out stunk tonight. There's no other way around before we get to that vodka-drinking could you give us five dollars and a tip jar. He said if I'm not mistaken that's assault with a weapon and that's something that Adam schefter actually tweeted out recently that he's that's assault and so yeah. I mean I would have to come down to charges being pressed and things of that nature but Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk Irk and we're the hosts of the shutdown forecast your avengers of college football podcast. It says in the script onto riff on what that means and basically what I mean. Is this all already spoiled. Every Tuesday we talk about everything from cooking disasters to pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college football every now and then like mascot ascott fights announcers fleeing the early. And unfashionable. Pants that coaches where now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken subscribe. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP. Give the game. Let's get to the game that there's plenty to talk about. And and the funny thing is is he's me I was watching Mason. Rudolph his interception dad was intended for Bans McDonald Donald was intercepted by the linebacker that was seemingly everywhere. What was his name? I can't remember his name I should. They said it over and I've watched him. When you saw release the football I noticed something? He's trying to place the ball. Yeah he's ripping it no and that's that's it. He doesn't throw it he doesn't throw. Well it's because he's not ripping it and that means he doesn't trust his accuracy when he does rip it and I I I don't know I'm trying to think back to ben early in his career. I can't remember related to look at film that anyone that has a is ever coached or played a sport. That involves throwing object whether it's Lacrosse whether it's baseball football obviously with with the quarterback position when you're having a a place the ball in my opinion bad things happen because I'll give you an allergy test. Velocity off the ball. I'll give you an analogy. They don't want uh when you're instructing you know your baseball guy. You don't tell pitchers to aim you tell pitchers that throw trucker mechanics Doda baseball and if your mechanics antics are set out in solid. The ball will go where your mechanics tells to go. But you can't aim once you start aiming your mechanics breakdown in the ball definitely does not I go where you intended to go. Throw the ball trust it and rip it and I think some of it is he. He's not confident in what he's seeing as well. Oh so there's some hesitancy as well he's not reading it clearly consistently and and so when you're not doing that you're definitely not going to rip it. But unfortunately in some cases he's throwing it way too hard on screens. Yeah well in. The machines dreaded slant that he just took his head off the ball and they'd weeds and I M and I think maybe he's had he's had a lot of receivers dropped passes. I wonder if there's there's even a point where he's thinking. Maybe I can't really drive the ball into this receiver because I'm not sure if he's in a catch it But you know we could spend an entire episode on how poorly Mason Rudolph played and it was bad. It was every bit as bad as at land said on our show last night. That I'm soft on quarterbacks. I can't be soft on him this time. Because there's no way to even even if he were the biggest Mason Rudolph apologist and I. I do not feel that I am that. I think he's a good quarterback. I think he has good potential but he played like pure dog poop tonight and and so there were others that were joining him. Trust me but before we get to that we have a lot of people in the live chat. I WanNa just mention that the best way people can help us is hitting the like button and subscribing to the channel we give you a show a day no matter what during the season check us out like this video and by all means subscribe griped channel. We seriously appreciate the support. So lands other than Rudolph. I the next person that comes to mind in terms of playing really really bad was mark. Baron I thought Mark Barron looked inept maybe as an APP disease looked all season. And that's saying something because I like. He's look that way on multiple eligible occasions. Does I don't know he gets caught. In the wash margin the run game and in in coverage he turns into bi-liability. I'd rather see Vince. Williams and Devin Bush together personally the technique that he displayed in the end zone it. It's amazing that that pass was completed for the touchdown because maybe his eyes eyes were closed and he was trying to use the force and locate the ball that way but it was confusing as to how that pass was completed You know I had a guy in a live chat or not in the live chat or one of the comments from the last show about me saying that Joe Haden was was the candy bar in and he might have been right. I mean but I try to amend statement and say to Joe Haden. Was the fruit. Chew but you know I'm GonNa you know. Joe Haden may not be the fruit true the actual candy bar the fruit or fruit chewing. The defense may be marked bearing mark. Barron I is is is not. He's definitely I wouldn't say he's a weak link but he's somebody that I think teams feel like they can get after in coverage. Yeah they bid you Casey. We'll talk with baron. He was bad. I've of the offensive line was awful. How bad so? How bad is it now that on third ones with Mazen Rudolph at quarterback mind you steelers are going empty? They're not even having a running back in the backfield. You know why they can't get your you get no push what's sixteen fifty eight. That's worse third down offense in the NFL. Sixteen Gina Fifty eight for three point six yards per carry the. That's why they're doing it in. We've talked about the inconsistency with this running game throughout the year we talked about how bad it was last week. Would I think they averaged. Maybe one one point six one point five against the rams what happens ends is when you win. You know we say on initial we always say winning correct you know you move for some of the obvious warts that we we point out on the show that we're taking the task for when they win when prop when a pop up I mean I don't WanNa look like you know week told you so but these wars have been here and you know they've not run the ball well consistently and this was a night where they I needed to. I mean there's no way in a world of Mason. Rudolph should have forty four pass attempts and at the running game only they only run it sixteen times. I mean. That's that's ridiculous that is not a recipe for consistent winning. I mean Mason. Rudolph had a thirty six point three quarterback back rating. They chose to throw it forty four times. Why because the running game was terrible? And you're right about the offensive line. They got whooped tonight. You know they got they got whooped tonight. That's the only thing that if you're going to try Dr say anything about Mason. Rudolph stays that. He had someone in his face a lot. I'M NOT GONNA say every time. He dropped back but it felt like a lot a lot a lot that he was every demi those someone's bearing down on he had hit hit a bunch tonight so Let's see here if we had a couple of live chats here. I don't WanNA forget them. Anthony says Duller on the I put the dollar tip jar appreciated as Mark Baron has been a Risi Cup and that's referred to the snickers that Land suggested and then brewery says why are they keep bearing in denied. Do they not see it. I don't know I I don't know sidebar. Jeff so how do you pronounce it you say receives Cub yes or yeah. Somebody told Oh me in the west coast that people in the West Coast say recess cups but I always thought it was received cups. I mean it makes sense that we would say it. I mean wheeling and Pittsburgh or what hour and a half away so I'd say forty five minutes if you have certain way yeah so yeah so reecey cups. I never knew recess cups. Have the I would always laugh at myself as a kid when you get Risi reseize pieces. His we received tease. Yeah reecey species exactly West big and so you know somebody said to my daughter when they heard me say reese's cups. They said he must be from back east as recital. Yeah big shout out here we you go. Anthony wheeling native. I've proud yes proud. I have a question for you and this is going to be a challenging question. Are you ready to go. Oh I every every every day after the game I do winners and losers call them for the binding soaker dot com. I'm website give me a winner. I have a long list of losers the Dow was easy. Give me someone on the steelers or even their coaching staff. You could say was a winner after week. Eleven loss to the browns almost say TJ. What why play pretty? Well I mean loss contain a couple times but they lost contain a bit and You know we were pretty. We work on our numbers And I think Tomlin was right when he said that the biggest issue and I I would have never guessed at the steelers. They came out with just one sec but them losing contained in terms of how they were rushing was was critical to the browns success. But I would say T. J. Watt. I think bud to pre didn't play badly as well I I thought the front played pretty well. Especially how they responded to Chubb in the run game they they did a pretty good job of stuff in that they didn't play terribly. They got hit with a couple of it plays but you know they were trying to hold water. I mean it was. The offense wasn't doing anything I mean. And we always you know go through the game booking looking. I'm trying to plant some of the numbers you know as I make my comments but when you're third down efficiency you're to eleven and on fourth down. You're only three now. They got wanted. Nay The quarterback sneak was that fourth third third okay so they were two of eleven on third down zero of uh-huh of three zero three zero percent obviously on fourth down. So I mean that's two of fourteen the star good enough so I don't know how good you could play light when your offense can't convert third or fourth downs. Are you a netflix person. Are You more into Hulu. You got that. Hbo Now now thinking about that whole apple TV plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never ends so today. Explained inboxes Daily News podcast. We're going to talk to vox critic at Large Emily Vander Wharf about the coming streaming wars and. Emily is going to talk about how it's an apocalypse how this might be the end of her favourite medium television and how the monocultures basically dead but also she will reveal uh-huh she thinks will win the stream wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming wars and also. She'll criticize undersize. Some of the lesser shows that have come out of the streaming wars. You will know everything you need to know. You'll know which service you should be subscribing to and which ones you should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time to do anything else in your life other than watch TV ever again. Check out today. Explained wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right now. Okay he said. Why'd I know a lot? The people in the live chat or Saint Jordan Barry Jordan Berry bobbled a snap on the Field Goal Oslo missile that eliminates in from the running in my opinion. And when you're going to get yours. Here's a stretch. Something were saying or I should say myles Garrett is lawyer should be on the winners list. Here's a good. Here's you agree with this and I'll put this on there for steelers frank. Put the savvy said. The Nation needed this loss. Back Down to Earth. You think. That's true no I. I think the nation needed another bad win or another ugly style point. You know no style win. I mean that's what the nation needs need. You need wins. There's no moral losses or like none of that matters right. You just need wins. You need to go to clear. They needed to go to Cleveland. If find a way to win I mean I mean that. That's what they needed. Let me let me give you a Let me give you a number guest. This number Jeff. The average game per pass play the what the average gain per pass play in this game by the steelers the other say four point seven three point seven. Oh wow I was being aggressive. Yes you were yes you were three point seven. That's awful. That's awful that so bad jeff. That that's the same average that they their the yards per carry in the rush. Get in a running game today. That's how bad that is when when you're when you're average gain passing. The ball is the same as rushing. It was a bad game and this was a bad one. So roughhouse boxing. TV five dollars and a tip jars. I'm not saying duck in. But the one analyst about duck as he navigates pocket senses pressured pretty well better than Rudolf. He does do that better and Rudolf. Let me ask that guy again. Let me he says. The last guy was roughhouse. Boxing is that what it. WHO's your number one pound for pound fighter in the world respond in the live chat? I just want to hear his answer. Okay so let me ask you this. I I thought the defense settled in. They started making plays and they were getting pressure. They stopped run better than I thought they could. Let's talk about the offense. There was some Austin's okay. Where do you even start? I'm not say what needs to change the guy. I'm not saying that I'm not saying like well. Let's overhaul everything. Where where do you start? If you're Randy Feeder or Mike Tomlin rivers taken over for that offense moving forward. Where do you start to get A? They have to establish the running game. They have to give it a semblance of a running game. If you have Mason Rudolph throwing growing forty times in a game to win. It's not going to work consistently they have to run the football. They have to figure out runs that they can execute well with the guys it they have running. They have to take pressure off of this kid. I mean the kid is I mean another eleven third down attempts I think the previous game it might have been sixteen the game before that was fifteen. I mean all these games where he's putting position to where you have you know. Twelve plus third down attempts. I mean that's just too much pressure. They've got to be able to run the football in this display. This this play total imbalance has to shift. It has to be more tilted to the run game name unless passing. You know him throwing it thirty five times. Plus I mean bedhead is difficulty doing that consistently let alone a Mason Mason Rudolph. They've got to get this running game right they have to. I guess that's where you start. But they don't even trust this team to get converted third and one that's to my point they gotta get it right. I mean if you can't run it on third and one you've got a guy that's essentially a rookie trying to convert third in ones. Because you have no faith in running game that tells as you everything. They've got to get this right. This is the Pittsburgh steelers. They need to be able to run the football. This is black and gold. I'm AH saying you go back to rocky bleier Franco Harris or berry foster but or jerome bed is but man you got to be able to convert in short yardage situations with the running game when you get such inexperienced quarterback yes definitely a tough one to swallow and honestly honestly if you were to ask me that question I jeff would you do. I don't even know I honestly if I'm ready feed and I'd be like sitting back in my office office and we can't. We can't get a yard. We can't even gain a yard when the other team does. We're going to run it. We know we're going to run it you should. It'd be able to gain a yard with three pro bowlers and they can't gain a yard. It's happened over and over again. They can't get in a yard foy villain. The waiver was who he was getting murdered but dealing with Garrett may GARRETTA's load but he was is getting murdered all game he was and he lifted the gay. He looked like he lifted him up like a refrigerator in pushed it into a front front door. No he actually looked like a guy. Lifted up a refrigerator. Put It on one of those moving sleds that have the wheels and he just pushed vilvorde. Ross floor absolutely so okay. Here we go. Kevin Johnson puts I'm sorry Johnston puts one dollars ninety nine in says we must still be believers in. He's referring to my shirt I think this team can still rebound rebound from this. You know I don't think this is the end of the world. It was a bad spot for the steelers. A lot of ways got to own. Oh and what nine team or a team. That's might be only ten would have rookie quarterback on the road next week on the road. I mean go beat go beat the bengals up and then get ready for revenge against Cleveland. The following yeah. You go into games in a row plain and simple so Johnny gave us two dollars a tip. Jar WanNA put his name up there. We appreciate that as always and you gotta you gotta question Johnny. This johnny have a question. No nothing senior slim says what's going to be the next lucky shirt. I don't know I might go back to the jerseys. Might I try to find a Jersey on. No No. No no what I need you to create a one of one shirt HASHTAG. Just take it. I don't know I've got a lot of. I've got a lot of t-shirts so often find when I think works. If you guys don't know what I'm referring to you gotta give back and watch that show. That was what Tuesday st at a Tuesday steelers preview. You could fast fast forward to the end. The last we went for about an hour. I've listened from about forty five minutes on and you'll hear some very interesting comments and rance from Mr Brian. Anthony Davis would put it war. How `bout a Hashtag touchdowns Oh could be a that? That's a money maker yeah. Gold asked home get gold touchdown zone black background. I'm for that one. So all right folks well. This was an ugly one and we talked a lot about a lot of stuff that had nothing to do with the game. But that's what everyone's GonNa Gonna be talking about so don't want to spend too much time on this land. You're going to be back tomorrow night with the I said it and then I need it. I need helplessness. I need help. Somebody in the live chat chat. Give me a topic. I want my topic to be. Yeah I said it penalty. Should he kicked them like four or five more times. But I can't make compiler hear. Are you elaborate a little bit more on how the running game is where Dacia start. That's what I'd light here. But that's just me roughhouse boxing for five bucks anyone to CD's his answer to your question. Best Pound for pound boxer deontay wilder. Oh that's that's a good take. I didn't think that he would say deontay water. I think it's eating away. Bantamweight from Japan The Monster I think he's the a number one pound for pound fighter in the world. Just one debenham wait Tournament of champions one Mohammed Ali trophy. So I think it's I think in a way but wow there's a good choice entertaining guy. He might be the hardest one punch heavyweight puncher his right hand might be the best one punch aged knockout shot in history boxing. I mean if you get hit with your out nobody can take that shack our guest a couple people that think very good idea for your. Yeah I said it this one is the I said it my pick jinx the steelers West says says it he agrees with me on how to fix the offense as what you'd like to see go after Hello Listener I'm Sean. Rama's firm host of today explained. Vox this is Daily News. podcast every day Monday through Friday my team and I look at what's happening in the world. We pick one essential news story that defines our moment and ask smart people to help us understand it in about twenty minutes or less. It's the perfect way to start or end your day subscribed today explained for free on Apple Apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast APP. It's from stitcher and the VOX media. PODCAST network yeah. I said it Mason has a week arm So we got some creativity coming at you but then also lance for you. This is Nineteen ninety nine from Kevin Johnston Lance from your nor side Buddy so oh one five three three two one two north side. Stand up Manchester Baby. Yeah there you go. What was your four one area kid yes yes? For one to definitely Pennsylvania Serving Avenue Columbus Avenue Sheffield Street Fulton and have north pepys match Manchester. Elementary Saint Joe's. Yeah I never knew interesting thing for the North your side. I never knew what was actually until I moved back to Pittsburgh I had never heard of it. I mean that's kind of Pittsburgh is you you you go to your neighborhood sandwich. Sandwich spot For us it was always pepys. You just go walk and get a piece or go right. Get some fried Zucchini shamrocks. Here's a good one. I D for your show was are aligned built for bell and not a runaway James Connor. That is a good one or roughhouse boxing. Yeah said we need a push. Start offense I like that like that. Push to starve room so here you from Gary. Yeah I said it what did you into A. MVP call fails remembered. That doesn't one thousand. Nine hundred are very heavy. We just got left unread right. There was a great one. Yeah what do you do to you. You have some ideas lance will be on for tomorrow's The I said it. I will be on Saturday for the burning question I'll probably be on Sundays. Well to kind of recap what happened on the day there The Ravens played the Texans. That's going to be an important game to watch and then we'll talk about what lies ahead for the steelers. They sit five and five heading into week. Twelve so wins anything to add. We call the show. This was a Donnybrook of a game. The end was pretty ugly. And so I think we'll all be sitting back waiting to see what happens when it comes to fighting five suspensions because it's going to be significant but with that you know what to do tune in telephone and subscribe subscribe and we will be back next Sunday for the next episode of the steelers. postgame show Musculus steelers postgame show. We'll see then hopefully after a win lance extra time we'll see.

Pittsburgh steelers Mason Rudolph Jeff Hartmann Mason Myles Myles Garrett Pittsburgh football Football League Lance Williams Cleveland browns myles Garrett boxing deontay Johnson Gary Apple Joe Haden Mike Tomlin NFL commissioner
The Hit List: From 'The Crown' To 'Good News,'

1A

34:55 min | 10 months ago

The Hit List: From 'The Crown' To 'Good News,'

"This is one a. I'm jen white in washington. It's been another month of probably too much. Tv but thankfully there's been plenty of new entertainment to keep us busy. This month is served up a fresh slate of dramatic. Tv treats plus new films and music. And we're here with another episode of the hit list to talk through it. All our guests on the hit list today are eric. Duggan's tv critic for npr. Eric thanks for being here. Thanks for having me also with us. Brooke obie award. Winning film critic and author brooke welcome back. Thanks for having me. And emily vendor wharf at large. Emily thanks for being here. It's great to be here so let's start with this show. That's been making waves the force fourth season of the crown on netflix. We've now reached the stage in queen elizabeth's reign that introduces lady diana spencer and the uk's first female prime minister margaret thatcher. I think we have enough respect for one another personally to ask ourselves some of the bigger questions woman to woman. We all the same age off all really just six months between us. And who is the senior eric. Let's get into how the crown on these figures starting with the two. We heard i the margaret thatcher and the queen. Talk about how the show portrays this relationship. Yes so there was always a sense that margaret thatcher and the queen were at odds Particularly when you get deeper into this Latest season the crown and it shows how the queen was upset That margaret thatcher wouldn't support sanctions against the apartheid government in south africa. And so so so we see on the show is that initially. The queen hosts that they will bond over the idea of their two female leaders. Who have to deal with a lot of sexism and men who believe that they can't do the jobs even though The imminently suited for the jobs that they have But in that. Very first meeting Gillian anderson's thatcher is shown to be sexist towards women and indeed the real life thatcher only had one woman. I believe in her cabinet the whole time that she was prime minister so So there's there's a friction between the two. This starts to emerge as the queen realizes what margaret thatcher released hands for and and there's an indication that that your has has an ax to grind against the queen and the royals. Because she doesn't believe that people who are born into a station and having worked to get to where they are that they have the grit required to to lead the nation. And that's something that some historians have kind of quibble with whether or not that was that was true but but it it is it is definitely known that the two of them had a rift in real life. Well this season also digs into the fraught relationship between princess diana and prince charles. Here's one memorable exchange between queen elizabeth and prince charles. It's the marriage. I have done my best. My very best. And i am suffering. You are not suffering. We're all suffering having to put up with this. Let me make something care. When people look at you and diana they to privileged young people who through good fortune have ended up with everything could dream of in life. No one single breathing. Living so anywhere sees calls for suffer. They would if they knew. Knew what they know that you portrayal wife and make no attempt to hide it. They know that thank you. She has psychological problems and eat soul. Doesn't whichever did she does or doesn't do they know that you a spoiled immature man and to see complaining. Unnecessarily married to a spoiled immature woman embassy complaining. Necessarily all anyone wants to the pair of you to pull together. Stop making spectacles yourselves. And make this marriage and jordan enormously privileged positions in life work brooke. There's been a lot of talk about how the show depicts the royals and especially this relationship. What's been your tank. Well i think that this season pretty much shows a very great argument for hawaii. The british monarchy should be abolished honestly. It's very very well done television. But just to see the lack of support just to see the emotional kind of abused that that happens and has kind of well documented throughout history the way that the windsors will cannibalize their own family members in order to preserve their power and privilege. And you know you do have to lose your identity. You do have to shrink yourself. In order to fit into the ideas that are all all the rules that are laid out as well and it can be very damaging to lots of people as we see with what happens to this young innocent naive nineteen year old diana spencer who goes into this family as well as with With charles even though he was much much older but you do see that he has not been able to be his full self as a result of the rules that are laid upon him. And it's You you also see a really good explanation for why it was great that harry and meghan decided to get out of there and to to start a life outside of kensington palace. Oh eric what's your take on how the show depicts the royal family dynamics because there has been some controversy over the season. I what i wanted to say was Some people who who keep track of the royals have disputed the way that the family is portrayed and in particular the way the prince charles is portrayed in the season crown so there is some dispute about whether whether or not you know how much culpability did Dan spencer actually have in in the way that marriage fell apart. And you know how innocent was she you know. Some have contended that she was the first one to two stray in in that marriage. I mean you know. That's the thing about this family. They keep their cards so close to their vest. In real life that it is hard to know what goes on behind the scenes and it is tempting to look at a show like the crown which purports to take us behind the scenes and believe that these conversations which even the creators admitted several scenes are invented. it's tempting to believe that this is what happened and we don't know for sure that this is what happened and We're reaching a point where more people who are portrayed on the show our live and have to sort of course with What the world thinks after they've seen these portrayals prince charles is still alive the they're portraying prince andrew in and people who are beyond the queen and prince philip Who are still alive. And still out in the world and still having to deal with these portrayals. And i'm not suggesting that the that the portrayals are completely off base i was. I was drawn in by the season. And my hunch. Is that a lot of. It is on target. But there are people. Who've covered the royal family closely who dispute some of the portrayals. Well another show that seems to be on. Everyone's radar right. Now is the queen's gambit This mini series on netflix turned. Its spotlight on an orphaned chess prodigy. Clock we've o'clock schering system. Fear opponent doesn't have one come back to the desk and we'll loan you. Play starts in twenty minutes what you're rating. I don't have a rating. Have you ever played in a tournament before. I assure you want to do this. I'm sure we don't have a women's section beginning not beginning doesn't matter if you're an unrated player you going beginners with the people on our sixteen hundred those the price for beginners twenty. What about the other section first prize in the open. One hundred is it against any role for me to be in the open. Not exactly emily. What did you think about the queen's gambit. I really enjoyed the queen's gambit and taylor joy who plays the lead character. We just heard her talking. There is one of my favorite actors working right now and she is just fantastic to watch this her micro expressions when you just sort of focus on her face in close up. Just tell the whole story. And it's such an involving story to its it. Hits all the beats. You'd expect of a coming of age story or an underdog sports movie so it's kind of this weird combination of something like a my so called life and then something like rocky and like. I don't know how those tastes this work together but they worked together perfectly. Well we have to take a quick break. But in a moment we'll continue the hit list with the fresh prince of bel-air reunion and a new batch of holiday movies. I'm jen white. This is one eight from w. amu npr. This message comes from npr sponsor had space life can be stressful but twenty twenty has challenged even the most difficult times of life. You need stress relief. That goes beyond quick fixes. That's head space heads face as your daily dose of mindfulness in the form of guided meditations in an easy to use app overwhelmed. Had space has a three minute. Sos meditation for you. Go to head. Space dot com slash one for a free month trial with access to head spaces full library of meditations for every situation. Do you talk about the news with your friends. Your family or maybe perfect strangers. You can get all the facts you need to be up to speed on this busy news cycle on the one eight news. Roundup find the podcast in your feet every friday since the nineteen eighties hip. Hop and america's prisons have grown side-by-side investigate disconnection to see how it lifts up and holds us. Down hip hop is talking about what we live trying to live. The american rain fell in at the american dream. I'm sending. I'm rodney komar. Listen now to the louder than a riot. Podcast from npr music there each as the collision a rhyme and punishment in america. I'm jen wind. This is one a. We're discussing the biggest moments in pop culture. This month with eric duggan's tv critic for npr. Br obie award winning. Film critic and author and emily vendor were for critic at large for. Vox walter tweets that they're watching lucifer scandal. Power and peaky blinders. All shows that. I plan planned to watch long ago but was never home long enough to do so until now hashtag stay at home and john tweets. I don't know if an internet show counts. It does but i've been making it through with critical role. Not familiar with that one. But we'll have to look it up. Let's turn something else knew this month. Hbo adapted tallahassee coats acclaim. Thousand fifteen book between the world and me and it's written as a letter to his son. Here's the film opened with actor joe morton. This is the week. Learned that the killers of michael brown would never be punished. Were young still believed stayed up until eleven pm that night waiting for an announcement of an indictment and went instead it was announced that there was none. You said i got to go home and you went into your room and i heard you crying. I came in five minutes after i did not. How'd you i did not conflict you. I thought it would be wrong to conflict too. I did not tell you that it would be okay. Because i never have believed that it would be okay what i told you what your grandparents tried to tell me that this is your country eric. Talk about the way. This is adapted for the screen. Sure i was lucky enough to moderate a panel with The director kamilah forbes and china tallahassee coats who wrote the book That inspired this film and also served as executive producer for the film. And you know the film is sort of created as this sort of tone poem in a way. It is a collection of monologues. Taken from the text of the book. Read by actors Like joe morton. Who were just so skilled at at at finding new meanings and new ways of conveying the ideas that tallahassee so elegantly portrayed in the in the book and then they're also married with a host of different techniques to to bring you through different moods so they they filmed A among log in one of the courtyards at howard university because howard university looms is a big focal point in the book and the film as a place. Where black excellence is sort protected and incubated and then A place where the where draws power from all the different kinds of black folks who gathered there and so seeing a monologue filmed in that empty. Courtyard says something about Cove it says something about where we are today says something about the importance of the school. And then there's animation that that That shows Young black kids playing and conveyance some the joy of black culture than there's archival footage of people like Martin luther king junior and angela davis speaking out and and and alongside tallahassee lines asking pointed questions about why we are taught in schools about some civil rights leaders who are non violent. And we're not talked taught about others. Who are more revolutionary and so it all comes together to to create this amazing statement about the dangers in the beauty of being a black person in america. And and how the system tries to take you apart and Eliminate your body and one moment but how you can find community and you can find excellence and you can find beauty in your culture In in in another it is just an amazing piece of work. Well let's change gears abed and talk about the fresh prince of bel-air reunion. That's been airing on hbo. Max the headline moment was when janet hubert who played the original vivid was given a chance to confront. Will smith publicly over their feud. When i left. Shell i have this new baby and no one. Family disowned me. Hollywood disowned me. My family said you've ruined our name. And i wasn't on professional on the set. I just stop talking to everybody. Because i didn't know who to trust because i've been banished. And they said it was you who banished me because you were you were will you. Were kid was heart breaking. Can you give us a little more context on the thirty year long feud and in what this moment really meant. Yes so i think. For all of us. Fans of the fresh prince of bel-air the most glaring and obvious issue with this revolutionary. Show that addressed so many issues that we face in our community and told so many of our great stories and was so funny. The glaring issue was that midway through the sixth season run. They replaced the dark skin and give with what became known as the light skinned and And so to understand. We've seen kind of the tabloid headlines over the years With funds ribeiro and janet hubbard going back and forth about whose fault it was and who did what to whom But so there was never really any clarity except for the fact that we knew that janet basically disappeared. This was talented amazing. Black woman who could dance she could sing. She was a classically trained actress. I mean she. She had everything she had all and then she lost it And her career never recovered and we never really knew why so to be able to sit there and see her sharing her truth in this reunion and to not receive any pushback just to be able to talk. I thought that was really powerful. Even though she did end up apologizing before will apologize. You know at least she did get her apology and she did get her moment but i think twenty seven years in is entirely too long to have to wait for something like that. We've all been impacted by the loss of janet. But i'm not seeing her on our screens. Not just as fans but also when you call. Janet was explaining when you call a dark skinned black woman difficult. That doesn't just impact. Janet that means that other dark skinned black actresses who trying to work in this industry were also impacted and also could have received. Well we know we know what kind of of people behavior that these kinds of actresses are so. Let's just avoid all of that. We've seen color ism happened throughout the industry y- beyond these past twenty-seven years but definitely during this time as well and continuing on now we've see we see that happening and so i do think that while that was a beautiful moment and janet does seem to feel as if she has received everything that she needs to receive from this moment. And from this apology. I do think that there are more reparations. That need to be paid for all of the losses that we've had in the black women that will never know that we lost because of stereotypes like this. Well i want to turn to holiday movies because it is november which means they movies are in full force. Emily one of the holiday movies. You wanted to bring up his happiest season. It's a new christmas romcom from hulu that centers around the coming out story. It tell us about the movie and white came up as one of your recommendations this month. If you're looking for a movie that breaks the christmas movie format even more than you know having a lesbian couple at center this is maybe not the one. It is a very traditional christmas. Romcom in almost every way but at the center are kristen. Stewart and mackenzie davis who have fantastic chemistry. And it is one of those stories that like. We don't have a ton of stories about people at christmas time. And so it's it's really lovely to see this telling that story and i do you know. It's full of great performers the characters. Who aren't the two central ones. Don't get the best story lines but it is fun to see mary. Steenburgen burgeoned come in you know just deliver a few lines on a southern accent have a great time but yeah the the central story is really the reason to watch here and those two actors are fantastic together now you also have a wreck recommendation for an eight episode holiday. Romantic comedy series on netflix. It's actually based on some young adult books. Yeah it's called dash and lilly. It's about two teenagers. Who who start passing around this notebook that trade dares with each other and this one's actually. I think really well done for what it is. It's a a y. A romance set around christmas so if any of those three things to do off. Maybe don't watch but if that sounds great to you. I think you're really going like this. It has its issues. I think that the show has this weird class politics where the two main characters sort of treat all the service industry workers they run into like you know not the greatest but it's really lovely and winning again. This is one of those things where the chemistry between the two leads is so potent. That kind kinda worth watching for that. Eric really briefly. Do you have any new holiday movies. You're enjoying this year. Maybe something you want to revisit during the holidays. Yeah i'm not. I'm not a real holiday movie person. So my favorite holiday movies are really So the first one is die. Hard whichever you know about whether or not even christmas movie. I am not entertain that debate at all these christmas and i do watch it at christmas. And that's the end of it. And then also the grinch with jim carey which a lot of people don't like but it has become a family tradition in my home. Me and my kids sit down and watch it every year. I'm a fan of l. around christmas. We're talking about the latest in pop culture. This month with eric duggan's tv critic for npr brick obie award winning film critic and author and emily vanderberg critic at large for. Vox and we're hearing some music from netflix's jingle jangle christmas journey which is a magical story about a toy maker. I watched it over the weekend. I can't recommend it highly enough. We'll talk about it a bit more after the break. I'm jen white. This is one eight okay. This message comes from. Npr sponsor three m supporting communities in the fight against covid nineteen since the outbreak. Three m has responded with cash and product donations including surgical masks hand sanitizer and respirators through local and global aid partners. In addition three m is on track to produce to the respirators globally by the end of twenty twenty learn. How three am is helping the world respond to covid nineteen goto three m dot com slash. Covid three m science applied to life. Lauren co of local kitchen when from pies zoster. It looks like a crime scene all the berry juices everywhere to pie master. She'll share tips based on years of baking delicious pies. That are stunning. Works of art to listen and subscribe to. Npr's life kit. Now let's get back to the hitlist. Our pop culture round up with air duggan's tv critic for npr for ob award winning film critic and author. Emily vander wharf critic at large for. Vox brooke what did you think of jingle jangle. Jingle jangle was very sweet. I was very excited for my niece and nephew to watch it. Because it's something that we never get to see. Its black fantasy and christmas and just so many wonderful things but also magic. You know there are math geniuses. There too little black girls who are math genius is And there's force whitaker. This felicia shah. There's an economic rose. It's a musical. I mean it just feels like it has all of those things that we love about the season In in a way in a story that we've never seen before. So i thought it was very inventive and very cute I'm overlooking some of the plot holes that exist overlook. Yeah and my my niece and nephew love it. So i'm happy if you need a reminder that ekonomi rose can sing her whole entire face off just wait till like the back third of the film she has this amazing number and she's just such an incredible vocalist. I loved it. It's a great family watch Well we got a whole new slate of fall tv this month and some decided to include the pandemic in their storyline or have actors wear face masks on seen a lot of you bring up. This is us as a show. You're watching and this is one of the shows grappling with the with the pandemic. Eric how are you seeing shows take on covert nineteen. Well it's been interesting That is a choice that every show round had to make as the lockdown shut down production of television over the summer but producers and writers were still meeting and trying to figure out what they were gonna do once. Production resumed and now. We're learning You know network. Tv shows in particular coming back to new episodes. You know this past week and the week before and we'll see more comeback in the first week of december so you have some shows particularly the medical shows and the first responders shows of course they're going to have to deal with it so the good doctor had has is dealing with covid chicago med and in chicago fire and places like that have all of their doctors and first responders emergency people dealing with covid. There was a controversy with an abc show called big sky. Which was created by david. Kelly who you may know from remember from la law and the practice shows that and he has a show that involves these two women who run a private detective agency and set during the time of covid they show during the show that some people are wearing masks but there are scenes set in a restaurant and set in a bar where most people are wearing masks. And it's really kinda weird. They decided to set during the time of covid. But have a bunch of characters who aren't really sort of obeying any of the guidance that you have from health authorities about how you're supposed to be living during this time and i think that's the problem that Some of these shows are gonna run into if you set. During the time of covid you are committing your characters to conducting themselves a certain way and you're committing yourself to Trying to portray the world in a certain way. Where there's a whole other level of behavior that you have to sort of portray. And i think a lot of these shows are gonna have trouble being consistent emily. How are we seeing reality. Shows dealing with the pandemic reality shows actually have a easier. Time sort of constructing a bubble around their production. Not every reality show but but some of the ones that people know best for instance something like the bachelor is really able to construct in essence a bubble where people can't leave and sort of stay in the same place and that way they can all ensure that they're staying cove free another show. That's done a good job of that as the abc series shark tank which constructed. Its own bubble in las vegas. I mean a lot of this is network publicists saying this. So we don't know how non permeable those bubbles are but we haven't heard about an outbreak in those series either where there have been outbreaks. Mother scripted series. Where there isn't a bubble so there is some idea that the reality shows maybe have an easier time of this. Even if you not something like something a little bit more wide ranging like the amazing race would not be able to be produced in this environment be tweets. My daughter and i have recently discovered parenthood and are completely invested surprisingly well written with good acting. And let's see listener tweets. I actually watched jingle jangle and it was an excellent movie with an excellent cast. I can't get the image of forest whittaker dancing out of my head though it was hilarious. Divorce whitaker we love whitaker. Let's move into some new music that came out this month. Megan thee stallion. Megan thee stallion dropped her new album. Good news and here's one of the tracks body which he performed at the. Ama's this week be built. Yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada yada. Yeah they'll crazy. Kirby big wait okay. Brooke twenty twenty. It's been a significant year for megan thee stallion's she's coming off the while excessive wop with cardi b. How does this measure up for you. I think this album is fun. It's very in megan's lane You know. I think the good news is that meghan can do even better than this on her next album. I mean this is her debut album. So there's been a lot of anticipation for it. She's already hit so many milestones without even having an album So you know. She's it's only from here. But i do think you know. It's it's a trending right now number one On itunes for that single as well as the album itself She's in a good position and she's just so lyrically talented But it's it's fun. There are a lot of really fun songs on the album. It's it's very enjoyable. And i can't wait for her to go deeper and her next album chris tweets parks. Recreation is a standard fall back for comedic relief with a strong sense of heart and gratitude. Emily turning to any comfort. Choose these days. yeah you know. This is the time when i'm watching more. Tv than i'm watching new tv. That was kind of true for me already. I i some of these newer shows. I find hard to take. But i've been watching a lot of star trek deep space nine recently. It's it's obviously a show that that's from the nineties and there are some cheesy production values and all of that. But it's a really wonderful portrayal of what the future could look like. That sort of leaves me optimistic that we might get out of this right now. I've been thinking about turning back to ds nine. I'm watching the more recent iteration Star trek on cbs. But i've been thinking. I need to revisit that series and this is another plug for that eric. What about for you. Any comforto's you're turning to right now. Well it's interesting that you mentioned the more recent. I'm actually watching that as well watching star trek discovery. And because i'm a tv critic you know. I get episodes early. So i'm two episodes ahead of the general public and watch this show but But i'm enjoying watching their new vision of the federation and all of that. I also with my sixteen year old son had been re watching the closer this police drama that Cure sedgwick starting. Now the thing that's weird about it is that there are a lot of elements of the show that are quote unquote coppa ganda. They are sort of. They're designed to paper over the excesses of the cops who are pursuing criminals You see them. Disregarding people's rights convincing people to disregard their miranda rights they do all kinds of things that are questionable on the show. But my my son. And i watch it so that we can critique the show and we're always looking at each other. I can't believe they did that. Oh so there's a that's what happens. When you're i think a tv critic and you and your you've raised a kid. We're both critiquing the thing while we're watching it and also experiencing the style of watching a show that that we still somehow even though it's incredibly flawed so there you go brook any nostalgic views for you these days. You know what. I just started watching again. Shits creek It's just. I tried to watch it before the pandemic and it just couldn't get into it but after all the hype winning all the emmys and all of that I thought why not give it a try and now being locked down with my family in a situation that i can't really control because of this pandemic it really has brought that show Into a new context for me. And it's just so funny and it's just so lovely and sweet and it's the kind of show that is just really powerful in that it created this world where homophobia exist There's a gay couple that is just beautiful and lovely. And they have the normal ups and downs. But they don't face any criticism from the outside world. And i just thought if you could write a show any show and and have it be something this powerful. Why wouldn't you do it. i just. I think it's such a great example for us of what we can of the power of television and what we can do if we allow ourselves to imagine the kind of world that we want to see and put those on tv. Instead of the hyper realistic shows that we have. It's with covid or police. Brutality are all these why not create the show. That shows us who we could be. I'm really quickly before we wrap up eric. Any last suggestions for folks things. They should watch over the long weekend. Wow there's a great Series of films called small acts. That's on amazon. Steve mcqueen director of twelve years of slave curated and was involved with the production of these. The first of those films went up on amazon on friday. And it's about a a restaurant that caters to west indian immigrants in britain and how the police tried to shut it down with multiple raids and how protests led by the black panthers lead to a court case then that That that allowed them to push back against the racism in late nineteen sixties britain against black immigrants. It's a really great film and a great series of films that people should check out. That's eric dagens tv critic for npr. Obie award winning. Film critic and author and emily vendor wharf critic at large. Vox thanks you. All today's producers were michelle. Harbin and hector are saudi. This program comes to you w. a. m. youth part of american university in washington distributed by npr. I'm jen white. Thanks for listening. Let's talk more tomorrow. This is one eight.

margaret thatcher jen white prince charles three m npr lady diana spencer joe morton eric tallahassee netflix eric duggan Brooke obie brooke queen elizabeth woman embassy nineteen year royals Dan spencer emily taylor joy
Open Safely

Armstrong & Getty

37:31 min | 1 year ago

Open Safely

"Four hundred thousand families responded. Never heard anything like that and seventy five percent of them. Want, their kids back in school in September and a lot of employers with the actually follow what the schools people are doing and will adjust. Schedules because there shouldn't be a difference we should never be hitting errands against teachers or kids needs against. Parents needs to work and I think that employers rating mind. Discussions about sending kids back to school in the fall as The first voice you heard there was mayor de you. In New York they communist making sense, but they did a survey in a huge response. Usually people don't respond to these things right. They can whatever and fill in this out. People did fill out, said yeah. I want my kid back in school. And then they'll the whole discussion of well. How to how do I send my kid to school? They don't have a job so. Daycare and Blah Blah Blah employers, adjusting their schedules. Whatever at the end of the day we got to get kids back to school. We make it worth pointing out that the second voice you heard was a a a person, not making any sense whatsoever, Randi Weingarten from the teachers, association or one your giant teachers unions. But whatever we've got to figure it out. We gotTA figure out a way to get kids back in school. That everybody needs to come to terms with that. That is going to happen now. How are we going to do it exactly I think you're completely right. Multiple Studies multiple countries around the world from Asia. Northern Europe, to Australia that say listen the kids don't suffer from this disease, except in very very rare idiosyncratic cases, and they don't tend to transmit it as much as adults do because they're not infected in the same way now. The studies are preliminary, and perhaps we'll. We'll learn. Differently down the road, but for now the science seems to indicate that the kids will be just fine. What about granny will? That's an absolutely legitimate question we do have to protect granny. We have to protect the older invulnerable teachers and figure out a way to not screw them I. I get that, but we gotta quit allowing people to come in the studio. Shout questions at us. Stop it so. The one thing that bothers me about the discussion. Though is you hear this over and over again? You'll hear five times today if you follow the news and he probably shouldn't will make you crazy, but. Well yes, we do. A lot opened up the schools, but we need to find a way to do it safely. There is no perfect safety. There is a horrific lack of safety in keeping the kids at home. I should back in school I agree with you once Greta. Thank you Mike. You have not only terrible depression and anxiety problems because the kids don't get the play. They don't get to see their friends. They don't interact But the the teenage suicide rate is on the rise again and way more kids are going to die from suicide. 'cause they're isolated, then could conceivably die of covid. I asked for some texts from teachers because I wondered how they felt I. Teach Kindergarten, and in praying will see my students in front of me this fall. The plan right now is for them to come twice a week. which is better than all online a guess I would prefer every day. God, I think if you come up with the mechanism to get him into school, and you think it's safe enough to be there at all the minute every day. Yeah I. It's it's pretty questionable, but we got this text. eighty five percent of my teacher peers elementary school do not want to return. They're really scared about their health or passing the virus to someone they live with. That's that person's experience. That is a great challenge again. We're not here to pitch one. Point of view one hundred percent in in run down the other point of view, one hundred percent and over simplify everything. The media insults your intelligence by doing every single day, but yeah, that is a challenge. How about a fifth year old teacher with mild asthma? About a sixty five year, old veteran teacher made it a great teacher. Maybe they're a real gift to the children they interact with, but. Can you demand that a sixty five year old? Get into the Petri dish of of Elementary School for instance are high school. I work at a high school. Many of the teachers want to return to business as usual, which is the current plan of one a hybrid approach. They all missed the students. It's difficult because getting reliable information about covert is so hard yen. No doubt Yep so knowing how to responsibly reopen. His is also difficult. Yeah, that's true when you're when you're getting regularly changing information about who? Who spreads at how at what point in having the infection, etcetera, etcetera, it does make it harder. It's part of the conundrum of the the whole novel. Koran, this is a new thing. And people are learning as we go, and we're not used to that as a society where being able to go to the Internet and figure out what's happened I would just like the discussion to be a little more balanced and intelligent than it is recognized. There are terrible terrible risks to keep in the kids home. As an Idaho Teacher I. Just teaches about the state of Iowa. Idaho state capital major exports, etc, right accent, the the curious shape of the state. Fat at the bottom thin at the top as an Idaho teacher I desperately, WanNa go back to school I had to do twice as much work in ten twice as many meetings during the school closure I can believe that that it was way harder and way more knowing yeah and. Jay everybody knew everybody agrees. The so-called remote learning has been a disaster. This is a good angle here, Jack? Ngo Joe's here to thanks. High Hubby is an elementary special. Ed Teacher. The kids with Autism Down's syndrome, intellectual disability, mentally retarded his name now call intellectual disability I didn't know that he knows they need to get back to school. Tucker Carlson mentioned that low that Latin last night. A lot of kids that have special needs. They're not getting what they need at all by not getting into the school. Because a lot of the services we provide as a society and I'm happy to support that. are delivered through schools. Desk my sister who's an elementary schoolteacher? She feels about the whole deal. I would be interested in hearing that. It's got to have an the you know. I hadn't thought about that before, but clearly you would have a different view thinking of Sam's third grade teacher who was like twenty five years old. And Single I'm sure she'd be fine with the going back to school. If I'm older and have a health problem and live with my maybe even older husband, not so much yeah, or if you're my trigonometry teacher in high school, who is roughly a hundred and hated children. I mean what what would she think? On. So. or Another and The ages I I'd like to actually know the ages of my teachers, because I look back on them and they were, they were clearly in their hundreds. Forty six Santosh who talks about some old teachers younger than me. Yeah. Hey, how. extraordinary. Is it that various universities including Harvard have announced no glasses all next year? No, no way that's some. Doesn't that seem premature hasty. I mean I get? I suppose I could get the idea of look. We gotta pick one or the other than go full after it and do it the best we can, and since we don't know that we can do in class where we commit to the other one I guess, but it just seems unnecessarily while hasty. I as spring. You got a bunch of eighteen to twenty three year. Olds Yeah I have a relative. WHO's GonNa start a graduate program in one of your major universities and they're not doing it so just GonNa probably the best thing that ever happened to her. Just GonNa lay out for a year. And then go back. You know assuming things get back to normal next year, but yeah. I don't I. Don't understand why they can't teach. Make, it, happen somehow with the the you know the least vulnerable population out there right right well again. Just a good balance discussion recognize virtually every the American Pediatric Association just said the kids got go back to school for a dozen different health reasons. You've got to get the kids back. What do you do I am? Absolutely school is going to happen. That's the way I would look at. It is going to happen. Kids are going to be school. That's not even a discussion anymore. It's just how we make it happen. That's the attitude you should have, but similar to the whole NBA problem. They have okay. Were there as soon as you get case in the? On the team or in the classroom now what so classic thirty Kids One kid test positive? He's not feeling good doesn't come in gets the test, had it? You know he's had it was spreading it before he left right. What do you do at that point? What about in a closed room? With thirty other people including the teacher at the point that you have one of the teachers in the ICU, the whole thing shuts down. Don't you think probably yeah yeah. Well so, can you open them? Then then that's a that's a reasonable discussion. Maybe backtracking a little bit. Can you open them and keep them open? Fernie lengthened need to do whatever they can to protect teachers. That's absolutely a valid concern. Because the way the Cova defects adults on the other hand. And if we have to put the teachers in space, suit or a bubble or behind glass or whatever? It's. It's got to be picturing some of my grade. Schoolteachers in a bubble one of those bubbles. You like rent to go out on a lake in. You're running on. Go around. One of those things may have maybe I hadn't thought about this much. It's unlikely to not think things through I'm. Sorry allergies. I, get every cold that goes through my son's Class I. You know I somewhat dread the school year because okay. Here comes me being sick all the time again season, if the probably lack of character, if anybody in the classroom gets the covert visit dislike when the cold goes through the classroom. Okay, it looks I'm getting the Cova now. And the great unanswered question would that be the best thing that could happen well, my my other son has got a practically no immune system for all these crazy medicines he's on go really were according to his doctor, really supposed to try to avoid bringing that into the house, so you end up in the You and your son ended up in the motel six for six weeks eight weeks. Yeah, that's not good well. It ain't going to be easy anybody who points out well. This is a challenge, and that's a problem, so you just have to counterbalance that against the problems of keeping the kids. Tough one China if it isn't IMP. It's got to be way different than it was last year. Because we did the you know the surveys here. You heard it. If you're listening from teachers and students, nobody ranked at above like thirty percent of effectiveness, compared to regular school, and people were around twenty percent. Right, so it's got to be better than that and it has to be changed the topic. Have you heard about the? Giant Group of lefty writers, thinkers and intellectuals who signed a powerful letter against canceled culture. This is good stuff. You hope that sanity can be restored it for you in moments. Take. The. Armstrong and getty show. We missed the story last week about that Semi truck full a hair that they the that they stopped illegal hair. We gotta do that story. I'm sorry I thought you said hair. An entire semi truck full of legal hair. Illegal hair. YEA, from China. Oh, in the United Minute. I did hear that Ellen, wigs or Stores. Probably taken from prisoners worse, you know the forcibly from concentration camp yams. Yeah, we'll find country China biggest millions of dollars with a human hair because hair buston nation's history, so I'll occasionally say with at least mild sarcasm. Don't give me hope because it's only if I hoped that I'm disappointed, so I'm going to. Do you the disservice of giving you a little bit of hope. A. Group of more than one hundred prominent liberal writers, perfect professors and activists. Have come together and signed an open letter against cancel culture. The list of folks is long out. Dig Up the whole list. Maybe you could do that Sean real quick of your mind. J. K. Rowling of Harry Potter Fame New, York Times, opinion editor Barry, Weiss political activists Noam Chomsky. All sorts of people have signed this letter and I will read you parts of it. It's entitled a letter on Justice and open debate. Our cultural institutions are facing a moment of trial. Powerful protests for racial and social justice are leading the overdo demands for police reform along with wider calls for greater equality and inclusion across society, not least in higher education journalism philanthropy in the arts, all right fine and Dandy. Everybody's for quality. But this needed reckoning also intensified a new set of moral attitudes and political commitments, the tend to weaken our norms of open debate and toleration of differences in favor of ideological conformity. As we applaud the first development, we also raise our voices against the second. Then they go ahead and give their liberal Bona Fides including calling president trump a real threat to democracy. You mentioned Chomsky. You can't get any more. Left the Noam Chomsky, but he's the old left. Right where you would have these discussions and not hound somebody out of their job. Oh that reminds me I gotta get to that Boeing executive who was hounded out of his job for for something he said thirty years. I'll tell you right now. Thirty years ago. He said I don't believe women should be in combat. Wow, that's head, which was an eighty five to ninety five percent attitude thirty years ago. It's probably seventy five now. But yeah, he was forced to resign his pressure to resign. Troubling, this is what these people are talking about. I promise anyone when I'm. You will not have to pressure me to resign. You'll, you'll have to chain me to my chair to keep me. No I'm gone anyway. It also warns that the resistance should not harden into its own brand of dogma or coercion too late. Insisting that an intolerant climate has played both sides of the aisle, the free exchange of information ideas, the lifeblood of liberal societies daily becoming more constricted well. We have come to expect this on the radical right. I suppose maybe like the way right censorious nece is also spreading more widely in our culture, an intolerance of opposing views of vogue for public shaming and ostracism and the tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a binding blinding moral certainty, we uphold the value of robust and even caustic counter speech from all quarters, but it is now all to comedy here, calling for swift and severe retribution in response to perceived transgressions of speech and thought and one more a little bit. More troubling, still institutional leaders in a spirit of panicked determined control are delivering hasty disproportionate punishments instead of considered reforms. We are already paying the price in greater risk aversion among writers, artists and journalists Oh. You're kidding me livelihoods if they depart from the consensus or even lack sufficient zeal in agreement, anybody who's in the public eye. All who hasn't had those feelings, you're crazy. You're crazy. You're a you're not reading the room. You raft to be careful and scared of what you can and cannot say Yeah Yeah so New, York Times columnist David, Brooks and Michelle Goldberg signed this letter CNN host Farid Zaccaria Atlantic, writer David Frum handmaid's tale author. Margaret Atwood feminist icon Gloria Steinem among others I'll signing onto this letter. There is hope that over fifty liberals those are the one standing up for that sort of thing. Yeah, there's hope though that they can at least talk. Some sense to the youngsters enough sense to to hold back the tide of the so it doesn't go any further and let these people recover their senses and understand that. No offense because I was guilty of this myself. The ignorance of youth plus the enthusiasm of youth should probably not be granted dictatorial powers over what a society is allowed to say. That's why you should have to be thirty five. I agree completely or really speak in public. We'll let me say thirty if you have A, full-time job. Armstrong and getty. The Armstrong and getty show. Brennan Talk China. China's. Biggest country in the world China evil by the way. So, just a quick follow up to our previous segment talking about the group of more than one hundred liberal writers, activists thinkers teachers, et Cetera, who signed onto a letter calling for the end of cancel culture and the ideological fascism the left. which I think is admirable and I'm glad they did it from the Department of almost so much irony I can't stand it. A Trans Woman. WHO WORKS AT VOX DOT com. Noticed that her colleague Matt Iglesias's. was assigned the the letter that were discussing. She says, of course he's entitled to his opinion. He's a nuanced thinker. He's been kind to ease promoted my work, but it makes me feel unsafe. That! He signed that letter. I don't want to be reprimanded or fired, even asked to submit an apology. but I do want to make clear that those beliefs cost him nothing. They're not particularly risky. They're not particularly sound even. The. You are insane. Emily Vander were F-. You are so twisted in diluted by your ideology. Your defending the indefensible, and if you'd never liked to discuss that I would be born in delighted to do that, but that is a an amazingly retiring I will give credit for saying look I. Don't want the get fired or anything like that. You know what like a GNOME Shaam. Which of you know his his act? I mean in my mind. He's a crazy person, but he's. He's an old school illiberal him. Bill Maher Matt Taibbi liberals like that Sam Harris. You know what they have in common. They believe they're all forgetting on a stage with somebody else's idea. They believe their idea will win the day if everybody gets to have an argument, right? Apparently, the crowd and the streets does not believe that or the you know the the the dachshund crowd. You must not believe your. Your argument would win the day because you will not even allow the other side this is. To make a peep. Oh, and there's no arguing that the post. World War Two period in the US. You fifties. Sixties were period at great conformity and enforced conformity, and a lot of these people spent their entire lives, saying dissenting opinions must be heard. You cannot silence me because you don't like my ideas. And they won the day, and they have enough moral courage in enough character to say wow, what I campaign for my whole life is now being killed by my own side and I won't have it so good for Y'all we might disagree on everything but I. Admire your commitment I indeed even signing. This letter is putting their careers at risk in a proof of what they've said. Yeah I want to get to the China stuff tiktok stuff, but I'm just reading more on this Oregon. Man Driving Stolen car crashes into woman driving another stolen car. Does anybody buy a car in Oregon or rent one? This is quite a story well. At least she's a police chase ended in Oregon, when a driver fleeing authorities in a stolen car crashed into a woman. And they realized she was also driving a stolen car. That's just something Oregon's experiment with lawlessness like California's, and she states I n drunk, so she's the. Common Five Years I. Don't even know what we're doing. Good, looking guy, they'll make a good couple. Yes, Kinda sketchy premise because they're both obviously criminals, but that'd be like. Charming criminals. who only did that because they're you know? Divider right forced into crime out of desperation. They needed a medicine or something bad whatever I don't have. The TIKTOK APP on never had it on my phone I. Don't think my daughter sends us charming dog. Related tiktok videos on a fairly regular basis. She has the actual APP yet. I've seen plenty of TIKTOK videos like on twitter or various places. But the tick Tock. APP is well. It's becoming less popular in Chinese. Own Company and according to let's hear from Mike Pompeo yesterday's the secretary of State for the United States with respect to Chinese apps on people cell phones. I can assure the United States. Right to Laura. I. Don't WanNa get in front of the president, but it's something we're looking at. What do you recommend that people download that APP on their phones. Private information in the hands of the Chinese Communist Party and lots apps are good at stealing your information. This apparently is really good at it getting into your phone and any other device attached to your phone. Like. If you got the apple stuff, it troubles me. How like I got an IPAD for my kids to use for minecraft and stuff like that took me a long time to figure out how to not have my texts. You know any of my texts between my wife and I. Are you know worker whatever? oftentimes not stuff. You want the kids to see showing up on that IPAD. Right or whatever laptop you get, we'll tick. Tock has a way to get into everything. Once you download it and It has been It's still exists in the United States. I'm kind of surprised by that. Did you see the statement from Tiktok? They said. We have an American CEO. We have never given any information to the Chinese Communist Party and if if they ask, we'll tell them. No, which is a lot like me, saying any cop tells me to put my hands behind my back and no way I'm doing it. Yeah Oh. Yeah, TIKTOK SO CHAIRMAN! She says yeah like to have a meeting with you're gonNA. Tell them you're too busy. Chinese company. That's hilarious. India banned the APP last week. Really Yeah I'll be danged and were considering banning it in the United States. Great Britain where they do have the tick tock. they have because of the TIKTOK APP now soured on the idea of letting wall way provide their five G.. Cell Phone Service, which is good news for the free world, because it looked like Europe was going to allow the commies to install their cell phone systems and have access to frigging everything, which was astonishing at the time and remains astonishing Jewish. Ever thought of it curious what the banning of an APP mechanics are like, is it? Can we just keep that out via like a firewall for just kind of a generic term? Question automatically. Get deleted off your phone if you've already downloaded it no idea. I have no idea. If I get caught with them. I, am trouble or does it. Yeah, who is in charge of getting it off my phone? How do you block something off the Internet now the Chinese are pretty good about with. Others but yeah, but we don't have national firewalls right right the great firewall of China they call it Yeah I. Don't think that's true. No thousands of years it is the protesters that the people who are against it in China called the great firewall. Show the government trying to call. From being able to communicate or get two books, they're they're not supposed to read. And all that sort of stuff. truly just frigging amazed. Oppressing people isn't easy. Work Jack you need a little help here and there. Yeah, firewall! Draconian horrific laws in Hong Kong. Harvesting people's hair exactly gotta break a few eggs, so they found a semi truck in the North East stopped it for whatever reason it was full of illegal hair. From China? They believe headed to various wig shops. In that sort of stuff. Millions of dollars worth total. Wow, that's a lot of dollars. Worth of hair head packed in there tight. Uniform Hair delay shaved. It doesn't take a lot of space. You could have a hell of a lot of hair pack tight. You pack packet and bricks of Harriet is not just a pilot hair like the barber shop. Oppress it down in package. It looks like kilos cocaine ship it about. Policy safely in the. Clandestine hair trae. He loads of I suppose he yet. You separated by color. You got the darker you got. The lighter you got. The the red I. think is mostly darker coming from Chinese, dissidents are probably not. A, natural blonde, not a ladder air there in Wootton, but they think yet comes from the slave, slaves, the slave, labor, or the concentration camps, or whatever they're just shaving people and Salome hair and there were accompanied. That's this is the part to try to figure out. Are these companies knowingly buying Chinese prisoner hair? Did they were? They misled while in Heck in China may be slaves, shaving the other slaves hair. Because that's what doing business with China can be. An all the big American corporations, making great shows of their moralism these days that regularly do business with China and Saudi Arabia and the restaurant part of my slave aftershave other slaves. Yeah, oh, sure absolute. there they've introduced the Karen Act. In California One San Francisco, lawmakers interesting, Karen Act to tell to outlaw racially exploitive, nine one one calls Oh. Shut up. Just right. I resent being put in the position where I have to explain why something indefensible shouldn't happen. Cut, you, who who's in charge of this I wanted to. Give me name now. You haven't mentioned that. That's not the name. Connect is actually an acronym that you get the acronym part of it. Because it spelled C. A. R. E. N. as opposed to the typical? You know when you're when you're making fun of people on Twitter US spelling. It's the caution against racially exploitive non Emergencies Act. Out of their way to make it spoke and I introduced by San. Francisco stupid. VISOR Shaman Walton. MR OR MS Walton. You are a crackpot. You're a bad American I pray for the day you leave office. Now making a false report is already a crime, so does this is just like in a multiplier if you make a false racial. Racial well okay. It's like a hate crime. Thing because you know, say me hitting. Joel and the head is already a crime, but if he's black, then you add in. It's a hate crime so I guess. The Karen Act is similar. I suppose Making false report is crime, but if it's. By Meitner, blankets and extra crime, is there any group of human beings on earth that has to roll their eyes more than the San Francisco police, the Portland place and the Seattle police. In this bill amends the San, Francisco Police, code to make an awful for someone fabricated report based on someone's race, ethnicity, gender, affiliation, religious affiliation or sexual orientation. There's a gay fella gay being right in front of my house. What color is the sky in your world, you? Your skull is completely numb. I just I can't believe what the world is turning into. So. been wanting to talk about this. A little more I'm scared to. Even though statistically, it's easily defended. the whole. Hey, if black lives matter how come we're not paying attention to these various cities that have just exploded. Even, by their standards in black on black violence, children being gunned down horrific. Yeah, it, it's something and some people are speaking out more on that coming up. The Armstrong and getty show. With this you know, I was asked. Probably twelve questions about the confederate flag This president's focused on action and I'm a little dismayed that I didn't receive one question on the deaths that we got in this country this weekend I didn't receive one question about New York City shootings doubling the third straight week, and over the last seven days shooting skyrocket by one hundred forty two percent, not one question. I didn't receive. Receive one question about five children who were killed, and I'll leave you with this remark by data broke my heart. A data of an eight year old lost in Atlanta this weekend. They say black lives matters. You killed a child. She didn't do nothing to. Nobody was his quote. We need to be focused on securing our streets. Making sure no lives are lost because all black lives. That of David Dorn and that of this eight year old girl, thank you. Doesn't help unheard of shut up. That's trump's a press person right there. While you heard what she said, and now we'll hear from Terry. Crews was on CNN with Don Lemon talking about this. One oppressor to the nets and one thing the religion who's next wrestler? WHO's the next suppressor when I when I described this? When you look in the city of Chicago, there had nine children who died by gun violence by black on black gun violence with from June twentieth all the way today. Even with the Atlanta child murders or twenty eight kids who who died in two years. You're talking about a month. You have nine black kids and the black lives matter movement has said nothing. So I get worried. You're talking about these things especially now. You know because we have a friend who said all lives matter and no longer has a career. But the overlooking of the fact that it's just typically so true. It's not even close right if you're a young black man and you're going to die by being shot. Overwhelmingly. Statistically, it's going to be another black dude shoot since thousands to one those to a police officer shooting you in your on arm or a scared white suburbanite. Right like I saw a story in the newspaper over the weekend. About a gun sales are up for for African Americans. Black people buying guns, and it was all about scared about worried about scared white people. With with so little attention, being played paid to the black on black violence that goes on, and and that's a tough narrative. That's a tough story to discuss. That's not easy and pardon me black and white, but it's so. It's so difficult to get to even start down this road because people start into the either or either gotTa be discussing this one or this one, and this is just a diversion away from racist cops and in institutional racism. Even if you WANNA believe, cops are racist and we have in solution racism. You still have to deal with. The statistics of the black on black violence in whether it Sam Harris's podcast that I tweet it out I mean just full of stats back in this up, and it's Terry crews. A black man was pointing out there. Why do black lives matter? If black lives matter is your point. You've got to include it all. Yeah, and if you're just looking at numbers of dead bodies, it's overwhelmingly from other young black men. I don't mind the fact that a group might just concentrate on police violence. Sure you get to do that I. Mean The folks who raise money to fight leukemia. Don't have to fight no money to raise money to fight heart disease not obligated to the same time. The the Monolithic media narrative that the problems. Problems of black America are white people in White. Racism in in a nasty white cops is just it's not true. There are no statistics. The bear that out that's not to say. It's not a problem we're living. We're proudly small L. Libertarian around here. We think the idea of government official whether it be a copper tax collector, a county building inspector, abusing the citizens of a free country. We find that horrific and disgusting, and wherever it's found, that should be rooted out and ended having said that. I mean the the death. Toll is terrible from black violence. Well the quote there that you heard from trump's haughty White House press spokesman there I've seen a number of older black. Men and women. They're usually older light grandparent's age who are really making the argument. Hey were killing each other. How come nobody's paying attention to that? What are we gonNA do about that. We're killing each other. It's like like constantly. Yeah, maybe the the word of the the decade is nuance. All nuances being lost. I mean you can't even get to like level two of a discussion. Never Mind level five where you get down to. The really difficult discussions now or just shouting slogans at each other, and it's a it's a little discouraging, and I can't imagine Lebanon neighborhood where you have to worry about that sort of thing all the time. Yeah, I know I. It's absolutely terrible. It's oppressive in and it's. and. It is to my mind. I believe what I believe in. You can believe what you believe, but it's the result of the policies the last sixty years. A lot of this stuff is it is dismantled black families. It's disincentivize raising your own children disincentives of fathers staying at home. It's glorified. Exactly. The wrong behaviors subsidized the wrong behaviors. It's terrible. And I just I don't know if I could wave my magic wand and communicate one thing. It would be to a lot of our. Black brothers and sisters to say I don't think the democratic. Party has your best interest in mind at all now. I. Don't know if the Republicans do either. But, if you keep voting ninety percent for one party, they're not GonNa do anything for you. Serious stuff. Do you have anything humorous? They're looking around Sean what for turned to me. Hey. Sean! Tell us a joke. Get us out of this offer situation. Remind Weenie interviewed and Suara Z's is his name and season. Sorry I was not. Many Think that's a river in Egypt? Anyway thing you said we get your words straight. Jack we interviewed him and we said we'RE NOT GONNA ask you to be funny. We're GONNA. Talk about various stuff because you know you know. People have gone, and they think you're going to be funny and you're not doing your actor. And he said yeah, he said I appreciate that. Because a lot of times I go on radio shows and people want me to be funny and I think yeah meeting a banana guest. Bananas are kind of fine. Yeah. So. No, we can't turn to Sean and just say be funny. More signed sports ain't gonNA happen. I mean I hope they do but several major league baseball teams have shut down their camps because they can't get the tests. So. It's they're trying, but it is just flounder looking for a good answer for why that is. Armstrong and getty.

China Armstrong getty China Elementary School Jack United States president Sam Harris Sean Europe Chinese Communist Party New York Mike Pompeo Idaho Atlanta Randi Weingarten Oregon CNN
AP Roundtable - Pete joins Brandon Kiley and Sean Levine on The Drive

Arrowhead Pride

33:13 min | 2 years ago

AP Roundtable - Pete joins Brandon Kiley and Sean Levine on The Drive

"Graham dog you sound a little bit like Jonathan Taylor. Thomas from home improvement back in the day which speaking of somebody points out that they did. Make a Nokia remake apparently with Jonathan Taylor Thomas back in the day. No doubt Tim Allen Impression. Don't you I mean I love the Toolman mm-hmm and the biggest Detroit Lions Fan probably on planet earth. What do used to grunt right or something like that Sort of the stone. People are mad that I forgot that movie when it comes to the Disney movies never even seen it. Up Up was good. I don't know if up was a top tabs tremendous. That's good tearjerker. An cars I forgot. Cars also probably should have made my way to make cartoons that. Make you cry. I don't know how they've done it. But they stay consistent trait in a lot of these movies on the real. Have you by the way that speech meeting of Arab bride. Have you cried during bureau. Have you cried during multiple Tabu Disney movies definitely toy story three. I have not seen the fourth one. Yet surro- everybody tells you how great it is. It's okay it's pretty great. It's okay. It's pretty great. I guess when and Lion King originally came out I had to be a kid so I'd imagine when the dad died. Oh what's the DAD's name again. Move there it is ooh aside imagine I shed a tear to yeah. There were a couple of moments in that movie. The last movie that I cried in I talk about this quite a bit. It's embarrassing was big daddy again. I was relatively young. I can't even imagine the moment in big daddy when you would cry. Got To me. I did it for you. Know that the big daddy was maybe not a classic. Just big daddy's a great movie but it was not bad in any way shape or form this this when when they're about to take away the kid that is just so sad. Yeah that's what he said but I can wipe out you. Would a little rum. Rebel stale skin was a good man. Man You talk about sports what we're GONNA do whatever we got a few hours be tweeting. That is brandon. Cross the glass from me. That is Kramer I'm merely sports parts. Machine Jon Levine. So let's talk some cheese football. Oh I've forgot what the the pop quiz was. What was the pop quiz today? It was sister act. Sister won't be Goldberg. Burke sixty four th birthday today it'll be sixty four is indeed sixty four. I think you asked us that yesterday so I don't believe that you're actually surprised. I am a little bit surprised. Much Khachatryan College became less than twenty four hours wolf. He's had a Very interesting career. She's done a lot of different things. Happy Birthday to whoopie are. Let's talk about the chiefs and specifically the chiefs defense where we were sold this bill of goods pizzini that the chiefs were going to get defensive coordinator and they were going to get a new scheme. They're going to get new leadership and free agents and trades and all these things trade rap picks and it was going to be a major upgrade. Can you say right now that this this defense is a major upgrade from where it was this time of year ago. I wouldn't say major right. You can't say major at this point because of that effort last game against Couple of players who are just role player guys who had began for the Titans and Ryan Tannehill overrunning you in a big part of the game but it is an upgrade. I mean the defense last year you could not count on them really at any point in the season the only game that comes to mind was maybe that Jaguars game where they stood out. But it was the reason reason why the chiefs lost their games last year game in the fifth. You know you talking about Monday night. Football game in the fifties that the chiefs ended up losing so it is an upgrade. Where you've seen some progress to three weeks before this last game? But wow you really feel pretty bad having Ryan Tannehill just man up and run over over your guys who were supposed to be a lot better this year. And this wouldn't fifty or this wasn't for the Patriots a forty one or two. They scored in that game. But it was thirty two and I thought Pete that we were maybe done with this these these games were you put up thirty two points and end up losing but apparently they're not. Yeah and and that. And that's what what is a killer and there's been some health to did this right so if Alex Okafor's in the game maybe it's a little bit different not that he's having a spectacular year but it did come down three points. I Frank Clark was truly unhealthy. Now we have this sudden mysterious neck. Injury pinched nerve which I'm grateful about. PK because I told you training camp. How good this guy look? It makes sense that he he suffered this injury at the end of training camp and he really hasn't been good all year. You hope that they can rebound you gotta think that they took last game a little bit. Personally it's not personally and he'll here. They will be on the national stage in Mexico City on Monday night so I think that the defense is better. I think the problem is that there is A. There's a common theme behind. What went wrong for them last year? And what's gone wrong for him this year and that's the mindset right and we thought this was going to change because Taiwan Matthew was supposed to bring that dog mentality to the defense. Frank Clark talked about it all Aussies legend attack about how this was going to be different kind of chiefs defense. I'm watching looking looking at a picture right now of Ryan Tannehill at the thirty nine yard line. He needs to get to the forty four yard line it was third and twelve wolf and he's scrambling and there are three chiefs defenders around him Rashad fitting. WHO's about to hit him? tyron matthews about four yards away. Right where the first down marker would be and Frank Clark who's right behind him Ryan Tannehill dragged Rashad Felton for five more yards to get the first down tyronn Matthew after you get out of the way to make sure that he doesn't hit Ryan's email and Frank Clark never touches Ryan's Haenel. That's not the mentality we were sold and that play is awesome. Bollock of what has gone wrong in that. I think they are better. There's no question the points per game or better the yards per game or better watch them and you can tell that they are a better unit than what they were a a year ago. They've got more of a backbone than they did a year ago. The problem is win. They've gotTA play win. It matters the most. We've seen time in time in time in time again this year that they haven't been able to do that and I think that's as much a mindset thing as it is an ability thing and you talk about those two guys in particular right so Rashad Fenton is a rookie six rounders. So you can even understand a veteran quarterback in the national football league. Okay you got bullied on one play Tired Matthew that to me it feels just. It's a little unacceptable. Just because you have all this talk talk talk we have a different mentality. It's going to be different and then you're caught on tape a little bit like there's a million angles of this thing backing down from tannehill normally say both you guys are Geeks. We're talking about that play. But yesterday I was the blood center and three different people came up with still shots on on their phone. And they're like what about this play. It was a significant play in the game with your two highest paid defensive players from the off season and and they just quit on the play like I. I don't take exception to a player if they just they fail in terms of athletic -ly or ability wise to make a play. I wonder if view of an effort issue. That's where I call into question certain things and it makes me wonder and I wonder if this is where you're going with this pete. I wonder if tyrod matthews hurt like the. There's only a couple of explanations as to why he doesn't go for the tackle there one is. He was worried about the flag but if he's going to get the first down anyways who cares. You've got to give the effort or to your hurt. You don't want your shoulder down to make the tackle and if that's the case well that's an even bigger issue moving forward. He's had toward the end of training camp and the preseason this lingering lingering shoulder thing where he has his special rap. I don't exactly know what is going on with it but you can make a case. Okay maybe when he has to tackle guys and really put a lot of his energy into it where that might be a striking pain. That kind of goes up. And if that's the case it's the case I would probably think it gets more of that than it would be. He doesn't want to do it. Because this is a guy and this is what I said when he was signed and this is what I really liked when he was signed he kept the pride right. I mean you're on the Tourist Baylor show on Mondays and the biggest thing is the contract. Here it's so hard to find guys in the League. That will give you the same amount of effort that Matthew or or even a Clark I I really truly think in their heart of hearts that they wanna be giving that effort. There's gotTa be another reason and that's that's a good point by you. I hope so because because to me the biggest change was supposed to be not the scheme not the players not the leadership none of that stuff but the culture overall the defense because the offense of culture. It's as good as it's ever been in the history of the NFL when you talk about guys getting along when you talk about young players on rookie contracts like Patrick Mahomes is like tyreek Hill. Was this team. Had it figured out on offense and most the moves or at least a lot of moves that they made have worked out on the defensive side of the ball. You can't really say that and I think the culture culture is probably just about as questionable. I don't WANNA say bad because there's a bad or a really dangerous negative culture but I don't feel like it's great and I feel like it's a lot the same that it was last year. Where you Kinda just shifted your issues? Where last year? You couldn't stop the pass now. You can't stop the run last year. The question was with Eric Berry this year with Frank Card. Bka feel like there's different issues but by and large a lot of the problems remained the same. and I wonder how difficult it is and I'm curious areas your perspective on this because you're in the locker more than we are how difficult it is to lead when you're the guy that's hurt right like Frank Clark. It's a lot more. It's it's a lot easier to lead from the front when you're the guy that's getting ten twelve fourteen sacks when you're the guy that is putting everything on film that he wants to put out there he's not making the same effort plays this year because he I believe is incapable of doing so because of the hindrance of the injury. tyrod Matthew that play that we've been talking about that symbolic of some of the issues. They've had if he didn't get involved because of his injury. That's something that's on tape. That meant listened. The other guys in that locker room are going to say. Why didn't you go after Dan like why? Why wasn't that a play that you were able to make and the at some point? He's got an answer for it. I'm sure he has an answer for it. And it's more difficult to lead from from that perspective than it would be if these guys were healthy and they were making plays and they were making the contribution that we all anticipated coming into I would say what are you trying to do Guitar Mouth Your Block you on twitter. That's that's my that's already. Oh I'm sorry about that. You even saw that with Patrick Mahomes and it's a good point the past two weeks when he just couldn't play again before this game the past two week before this game. That's your number one leader on this team right now right for this year and the next ten years. You hope if you're a Kansas city chiefs fan hard for them to to go Out there and and say hey go get this one. If they can't get on the field themselves and only extends when guys are having to play hurt and that happens I mean here you are week ten week eleven eleven of the NFL season. It's who can still be effective while hurt and if you're not going to be effectively monitored let somebody else do it and I think it's a certain point where that's the case. I think it's a little bit different than his titans game. I think there was a little bit of okay. We're a better team than the titans and here they came out. They punched you in the mouth. And I just don't know if the chiefs were ready for P.. Would you consider sitting Frank Clark until the playoffs if the injury is a real thing. And we're talking about Frank Clark. Not Being one hundred percent it not being with the chiefs thought that they were going to get. Would you be willing to sit Frank Clark until the playoffs. Hold your thought. I want to answer coming up next right here on the job the days to six welcome welcome back into the drive good. Have you along for the ride do we. I was going to say our names. Do we all have cheesy nicknames. Do the sports machine. It'd be really super cheesy the case fine. Just your initials Kramer is wrestling. Nickname is code. Jackman say what you will about that. And then we've got the planet prints so that's that's the only person who calls me then. Oh I'm also called Crame dog by the way about your Momma called you. The blood prints thank goodness. They're not thank goodness so so I was asking you a question before we went to break by the way coming up in about ten minutes. You'RE GONNA go into a dark and twisted place. I'm going to take you inside the mind of the machines as I've made it out in the past buckle buckle up on youtube grammar so be nervous but I asked you a question leading into the break I said. Would you consider sitting Frank Clark the rest of the way. And here's my theory and I heard my boy around the show talking about this and I think it makes a lot of sense if we take him at his word and he's injured and he's got the pinched nerve or whatever's wrong with them and that's why he hasn't been one hundred percent or as close to one hundred percent as possible or as close to that guy that the chief thought they were getting when they paid twenty million dollars and let e Ford Walk and trade away a first round draft pick if if he can become that guy if he can go into a phone booth simply by sitting out the next few weeks and we still think that the cheese can make the playoffs right when the division and then he can be that guy for a stretch run. Shouldn't that be something that she's considered man. It would have been a lot. Easier to consider before manual was lost for the season was playing really well. And you're already down Alex Soka for you have Chris Jones playing in and out. I just don't know how you could do it. If you could guarantee training Camp Frank Clark for the play offs okay. You can consider that but we just went through a year. We watched Eric Berry sit on the sidelines. For what for him the return and be ten percent of himself so I just don't know if or any guarantees with it you hope Clark is good enough to to play through it and and hopefully figure out a way to still be effective. I think sometime sometime before the play offs and help push into the playoffs. And again this this is. It's a very under talked about story. But the raiders schedule is the easy. It's not like they're playing anybody the rest of the way. You gotta be really careful what the division all of a sudden so. I've got two things on this first of all to point-to-point he's point about the defensive end position right now. The only healthy guys that you have at the position are tunnel passing on Frank Clark and if you put Chris Jones out there that's fine you've got a third but if you sit Frank Clark. You're only defensive ends that you're writing with moving forward until Alex okafor returns. Are Chris Jones. Who It's not as natural position even though I wanna see him there more often it's still not his natural tro position and tunnel passenger? And that's what you're moving with. And they're going to have to play one hundred percent of the snaps which they hate doing they would rather rotate those guys. So that's one issue with it. The other thing he is. I don't think we know that any rest is going to make this particular injury better now. It May and if it does if they were told. Hey a Frank Clark sits out the next I four weeks. There's a really good chance of this is going to stop bothering him. Then I'm I'd be at least interested in considering the possibility but it's a pinched nerve like I. I don't know that six weeks of sitting down going to make that all of a sudden go away and it's might be an offseason but and I'm sure there's people out there that are like me that think they know a lot about the chiefs leaves because they read Arrowhead Pride every day and I don't know get behind the microphone every day for four hours and talk to people about the chiefs. This came out of nowhere to me like I had you. You told me Pete like did you have any idea. That Clark was injured goods at anytime I thought just just on on what was an eye test. And just sometimes you hear rumblings rumblings of Oh maybe this guy could be hurt so as a little bit of a combination of both and then as you kinda saw throughout the season. He was on the injury report week. Two two full practices of a neck. You didn't hear about the neck for what was five or six weeks and then all of a sudden week eight after he finished a game the week before I played. Well he's just out of practice. Yeah played well. It was out of practice week. Eight and week nine just completely not practicing. I think he came back on Friday of week nine so it was a little little bit out of the blue. There were some signs where he just didn't look like himself. And you had that random week to addition to the injury report but besides that nothing I mean one thing I asked. Steve Spagnolo. I think it was week. Seven leading into the broncos game. You know Frank Shrink playing hurt and he basically was like well you know. We're all kind of banged up at this point. That's something you have to ask him and not that he didn't incriminate himself or anything. That's not what I'm getting at. But it seems like the team sort of known for a little bit here playing and Frank Clark hurt a little bit better than some of the other players in the NFL yet. But he's not the Frank Clark. You signed up for so I will say in August during training camp. I'm Frank Clark. Did miss them practices there. Were there were moments when we were up at training camp as compete was telling us that he was the next Lawrence Taylor and he looked like Derrick Thomas and he was the next. You do not tell. The Front Clark was going to be ten times better these any. I watched this dude and he was talking about the the handful of days as he missed but most days he was just eating. Eric Fisher for breakfast. Was Eric Fisher breakfast with some eggs and pancakes. So they said at the time that he missed it with a sore sore wrists and I'm not saying that they were lying by that but we have now heard that he was he had. You was losing feeling in his fingers. I wonder if this is a situation where the pain gene was shooting down his arm and so the pain initially was maybe in his wrist and he got out and he found out. Okay I got A. I've got a pinched nerve said a little while if this thing gets healed up as much as this is mysterious. Not all that mysterious. If this is what draws back to he missed practice for this in training camp. He hasn't been the same since basically Vin because early early in training camp. He was great. We got into the regular season. He wasn't very good. It's been a consistent theme for Frank Clark so it's absolutely in place. This is less mysterious than we've made it out. Have you guys ever rooted for injury. More like to hope that that's actually what it is and we can get a doctor to confirm that. That's what's going on because that would be interesting to believe that this isn't the case. I'm actually a little little frustrated by the fact that we're making this into some mysterious things like he played like crap and then we heard about it. That's why I think people are questioning and I know this goes against the foot human nature it does I notice against the goes against like the football mentality and play through it but at the same time. If this guy can't feel his arms man get right I yeah for sure why. He was held after two games. He cited life after football. I don't know how it in three weeks. Something like that could get better without a procedure again. And I'm no medical expert. I'm not Aaron. Boardman does a great job for us. I just wonder should this guy even be playing a and it is something to ask yourself. I just don't know if he'll ever be the same this this season. If you choose to sit him you accomplish a few things one in theory. He can't get any more hurt so then he's going to be getting a little bit healthier again. None of us are doctors by any means even though I went to school forever too. I think it's been proven that you don't need cork on this defense this version of Frank Clark. That's what I'm saying right now. Well Okay Might WanNa the warm bodies you do need Francorp when it comes to him playing. He's not that big of a difference mega compared to an average football player at his position right now in three and maybe this is being into harsh. I'm sick of hearing that talk for a while. Like I wanNA hear the leaders of the team talk once they perform Tyron Matthew Frank card go out there and actually over achieve even do something and even if you don't earn every penny of the contract that you got because in the case of Sammy Watkins and you dudes that's probably never going to happen but go out there and make an impact it and be on the field and play consistent and then you can talk about the team being solved. Then he can talk about things because some people got their feathers in a bunch. When Chris Jones came out last week and said if there we're too many vikings fans at Arrowhead on have a problem with it? I loved it. You know why Chris Jones can say whatever the hell he wants. He's one of the best defense players in the league. He's by far the best defensive player on this team. He's owned the right to talk. Not just make the money. Are you a netflix person. Are You more into Hulu. You got that. HBO Now thinking about out that whole apple. TV Plus Disney plus peacock showtime CBS. It never ends so on today. Explained Fox's Daily News podcast gas we are GONNA talk to. Vox critic at large. Emily Vander worth about coming streaming wars. Emily is going to talk about how it's an apocalypse obs- how this might be the end of her favourite medium television and how the monocultures basically dead but also she will reveal whom she thinks will win and the streaming wars and also she will talk about the great shows that might come out of the streaming wars and also shield criticize some of the lesser. It shows that have come out of the streaming wars. You'll know everything you need to know. You'll know which service you should be subscribing to and which ones you should skip and you'll know if you'll ever have time I'm to do anything else in your life other than watch TV ever again. Check out today. Explained wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can find our episode on the streaming wars right right now. Hey Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny honey. I'm Jason Kirk and we're the host of the shutdown full cast your avengers of college football podcast. It says in the script to riff on what that means and basically what is overexploited. Every Tuesday we talk about everything from cooking disasters to pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college. Football every now and then like mascot fights announcers fleeing the booth early. And unfashionable panther coaches. Wear now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should taken subscribe for free on Apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast APP. Hello Listener. I'm Sean Rama's firm host of today explained Vox. Vox Daily News. podcast every day Monday through Friday my team and I look at what's happening in the world. We pick one essential news story that defines our moment an ask smart people to help us understand it in about twenty minutes or less. It's the perfect way to start or end your day subscribed today explained for free on apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast APP. It's from stitcher and the VOX media podcast network. That's good back into the Kansas City chiefs. Where K point south the chiefs like most teams don't love playing in Mexico City? But let's face it. This is the future of the NFL. Yeah it is Clark was talking earlier today and Pete Sweeney was out there covering it for Arrowhead Arrowhead pride you can check out his coverage there. I thought there were a few things that he said were interesting. The number one thing that stood out to me from a big picture since in terms of the chiefs envy. NFL as whole whole especially given that the chiefs are going to be playing this game in Mexico City. This week is what Clark Hunt had to say about the schedule changes. That could be coming to the league. Here's that quote from Karl Clark O'Connor alerts that. I do think it's something that the League needs to seriously consider. I think reducing the preseason is something that everybody would be in favor of Replacing a game perhaps to with one regular season game. And if you did that you would have an odd number of games seventeen so one thought is that you could it play at least some of those games in a neutral site and obviously international is one place that we can do it so it would give the league more toward played more international games so that was Clark Hunt earlier today today and I think it's very clear what the NFL's doing here what they're going to do moving forward. It's going to be a seventeen game schedule. They're going to get rid of two of their preseason games and they're going to add a bye week so the season the length of the season doesn't change at all you were placed one of the preseason games with actual regular receive game and he replaced one of the preseason games with a bi week. The schedule itself stays the same number of weeks. You just have different games. In the way that a structured and the new game that you've added in that seventeenth game every team has to take a trip overseas or to Mexico City or it's an international game or a neutral site game wherever you expand the game that way you have the bye week the week after that you add in that new by weaken every time that you go overseas by week afterwards and then you still have your other by week as well. I think it's very simple. I think this is the way that the NFL is going. The chiefs will not be the last team to go overseas the way that they are right now with the Mexico City game every team every year will be required to take a trip a to an international game. And that's other GonNa make this work and it makes things more fair every teams having to travel every single year to some game and I think it's good for the game one of the best things thanks to me about the National Basketball Association the NBA is that there are so many countries in so many people across the entire globe invested in this. I think football has has that power football to me is the most popular sport. In America. We've communicated at Arrowhead Pride with the arrowheads abroad. Which is chief's Fan Group? Who really enjoys the game? And and I I like the idea to eventually. They're being a some kind of London team some kind of overseas base team again. That's probably years in the future but to me. That's just the way it's going. That's how anyone would like to build their business and you should embrace that and who wouldn't want an extra regular season game and who wouldn't want to less is preseason games. PRESEASON Games waste my time. It wastes your guys time but we used to fans time that they have to pay for these Damn Games get rid of the preseason add another game and grow it does make too much sense in the world which is probably the reason the NFL's not GonNa make it happen because of the laid out it's pretty simple you add a game at a by everybody's gotta go out of town. I mean it just it makes a Lotta sense this particular game in Mexico City p let me tell you what worries me one. The obvious which is something cheese can't control none of us can the field and and the altitude. It's something we've been talking about. Since we saw the game on the schedule last year get cancelled so that certainly comes up to. It's a division opponent and Andy's great against the division but that also means that they're more familiar. The chargers are with Patrick Mahomes. They've already seen him a couple of times and three in. This probably hasn't been talked about enough. The Sky Really is falling. If the chiefs lose this game like we can talk about how they've had an edge control their own destiny and got out hot and the chargers are good. Nobody's scared of Oakland. You better be at the chief lose this game because the standing until you should be at that point the chiefs will be six and five. The charges will be five and six. They'll have the tiebreaker and hand. They'll know they get a plea later on the season. You GotTa play the Patriots in a couple. Luik the raiders. I mean all of a sudden if you lose this game Pete. The Sky really kind of his. Yeah yeah this this is one they have to have the. There's no doubt about batted if they want to continue to in a sense control their own destiny when it comes to the division and wanting to have a home game at Arrowhead you have to win this when you lose another one of what should be regarded as I you know in a way to put it as Gimme games than you're you're taking yourself out of your our own control. which is something that the chiefs cannot do this team still have Jimmy Games like they had? GimMe Games last year this year. Are there still. GimMe Games for this team. They had a couple of days. They've already law. So I you know you got to think that they end up beating the Denver Broncos. You'd think that Patrick Mahomes can best Mitch Trubisky. I I feel like the raiders. Game should be very winnable. You should beat the chargers too. I like those games you should win. I know they've been in a bad stretch here. The only one that's really questionable. ooh remains the New England. Patriots should be that way. I understand why the Tennessee titans would give you a doubts. Where does this confidence come from? Pete honestly because Number Fifteen Komo fifteen we gotta stop this. We gotTA stop it numbers fans get your confidence. Get your swagger back loss to the titans on the road. Do you know how much had to happen for for them to lose that game the titans had to return a fumble. All the way for a touchdown the chiefs had do also play a terrible defensive. Second half they had an inexplicable defensive game plan that she's settled for six different field goals over the course of the game like the chiefs are good. I understand that. It doesn't look that way based on what happened on on Sunday and the final result the chiefs are still good football team. The defense has improved. Patrick mahomes threw for four hundred fifty yards. Get those swagger Keppel's back K. Swagger Nepalese. Calm down get a drink water. I think the reason for concern. Is this team right now. Looks nothing like the team that was in the AFC championship game last year. Right to me though it still. Does it still mahomes verses your quarterback and most weeks you should win to last week it to me feels more like a fluke than the norm. And that's kind of what I'm going I the chiefs respond well this Monday night. I think they get they get the W. You lean on that though when when it really matters when the weather gets cold when the calendar turns over to January when you gotTa Win Three or four playoff games a couple on the road is it as simple saying at that point Pete and maybe answer is yes. Yes we've got number fifteen. I WanNa see something more from the defense than what we saw. Last game plan. He might be simple like we. We have Patrick Mahomes. That's it's the mentality I think is a fan. You got to go into it. I understand why you're going to have your doubts but the season isn't close to over. Let's see how they do on Monday night. No question about it although certainly getting a little a little bit dicey when it comes to the division. It's getting late early as Yogi Berra would say and it's time to readjust our expectations and that's what you have to do on the fly because like I just said it's going to come down down to if this team makes the playoffs. How do they play? How healthy are they in three or four game tournament and we'll talk about this coming up on the other side? I think that the one seed has pretty much probably gone out the window. That conversation is dead. I want to ask you guys about the two seed but before we get there pete. We were talking about this defense earlier. Are they a superbowl caliber. Defense and all these things thanks when it comes specifically to Chris Jones. What are the chances that we see the future of him in a chiefs uniform? And that's the end of this year a franchise tag him next year and then he walks due to the other guys that they have to pay. And let's just call a spade is bad because they paid Frank Clark right this this this before the year began. What did it feel like at felt like Frank Clark was go to ball? Maybe Chris Jones would have a repeat layer year of last year if not regressed a little little bit because fifteen and a half sacks remains ridiculous they would franchise tag him and then moved the franchise. Tag What you got is the unexpected? Where Frank Clark has been in ridden would injuries any? Hasn't been the guy that you saw in Seattle and Chris Jones is playing like what one of the top five top ten defensive players in the national football league. So it's changed the game a little bit. I don't think the chiefs with how Clark is going to ultimately finished this year can afford both from a fan outlook standpoint. And just a defensive completeness standpoint let Chris Jones go in any capacity I think therein situation. Now where you've got to figure out a way to keep both of these guys while signing lining Patrick Mahomes to the richest contract and you put yourself in that situation. You could have very easily just made Chris Jones the guy. You chose not to do that. So you've buried your own grave in a sense I just I. I think that's correct. I think you have to keep Chris Jones. I mean it. It's not going to be an easy thing to do to pay two different defensive lineman twenty million dollars a year ear but exactly this is what you have to do. You've put yourself into this corner. Chris Jones has to be a cornerstone for your defense now in the offseason. They were hoping okay. Moving forward are cornerstones for the defense. Are Frank Clark. Anthony Hitchens Anti Rin Matthew. And then we're going to add a corner into this mix next offseason was. I'm assuming their goal roll won't now you have to add a new one of that Chris. Jones has to be a part of that because Anthony Hitchens hasn't been great and Frank Clark hasn't been the guy that you were expecting. I think he can get back to that. I hope if if you get healthy in the off season but he hasn't been that so far this year entira matthews a good player. But he's kind of what I expect him to be. He's just a good player and a guy that you want to. It'd be on. Your team is not a game changer. He's not we said this coming into the season. The Game Changer. They could've added at safety was Thomas. They didn't get him for obvious reasons. We've talked talked about this time and time again but tyrod he's been good hasn't been great and now you've got to keep a great player. The one great player they have on their defense one blue chip or they have is Christian literally. The one think about how much this team cost themselves by essentially choosing to pay Frank Clark over Chris Jones because not only. Did you pay twenty million dollars and say no to Chris this Jones but Chris Jones gets more expensive every time he steps on the field and gets another sack. They cost themselves twenty-five maybe million dollars they really didn't need to spend hindsight site is twenty twenty and I just hope for Britain beaches sake and this team sake. That Clark becomes healthy next year and can tap back back into that because you've unfortunately Clark is quote unquote never the same again. You've unfortunately created another situation. That's like Justin. Houston where Oh you signed a player worse right after you're paying more to get less production it'd be worse than that right right after he peaked. And it's it's a similar type of deal you're right it is a little bit worse and and again the hope. You're hope as a fan your hope for the personnel staff is is. He finds a way to get back to what you saw in Seattle. In the meantime you're left but no choice but to keep Chris Jones on this football team.

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