4 Episode results for "dany bell"
End of life care and coronavirus
"What end of life support is available in a global pandemic. Hello i'm a and welcome to matt. Mullins corona virus series of talking cancer. You might have already listened to previous episodes in the series in which case while combat. And if it's your first time joining us. This is a podcast from mellon and boots. Well i talked to experts to get answers to the questions. Million is hearing the most today for our final episode in the series. I'm talking cancer with adrian. Betty who is the strategic advisor for end of life care at macmillan if somebody is pushing into the life they are entitled to benefits this the fifteen hundred which is a banish it for people who have got candidates. We're going to talk about coming to the end of your life. And what support is out there now. Corona virus is in the picture. And i do just want to let you know that. This episode contains content which might be upsetting for some business for anyone in need of support. Please do contact the macmillan support line. it's open seven days a week. Atm till eight pm and you can reach them on. Oh eight eight. Eight double zero double zero. We'll also hear some words of advice from the lovely dany bell. You might recognize her. From previous episodes in the series she's mcmillan strategic advisor for treatment and medicines and she's going to be offering some practical suggestions for those coming to the developed during the pandemic. if you have already started conversations with your family or people that are really important to you about what your wishes are out really encourage you to do that. women melon. I'm talking cancer Lovely to have you with us. Thanks so much for joining us. On the podcast. Great to have you with us today as we've done throughout the series. I'm gonna time stamp. This how you feel but i to me. The information guidance seems to be changing daily. We're recording this room on the twentieth of november twenty twenty and everything we discuss is correct at the time of recording. Now we're discussing a really difficult topic today and of life and i got no doubt that the pandemic has massively debated thoughts around this and i. It's a really emotional time for people at the best of times so adrienne telus wars. The pandemic meant for those who are coming to the end of their lives are still able to visit them at home. Can they get the hospice care. Support for example so many questions. Where do we salt. Okay so i guess amer. It's really worth acknowledging that irrespective of a pandemic so difficult for somebody that is approaching end up ended alive and for their families. The loved ones around them. So that's being made a million times worse for people. Obviously because of all the as he said the government guidelines changes in them. It really difficult to understand what you can and can't access from a support perspective and that's been really hard people another thing i i just wanted to talk a little bit better as well as what we mean by end of life care because i think sometimes people think he's just those last days minutes of life but actually you know when when health professionals talk about end of life care and particularly somebody with cancer is more about somebody who's got for instance an incurable cancer. But they may well have quite a long period of time to live and it may be year months weeks days hours of life. It can be any of those things where it's important that people do get. The supporters areas is possible to then have that continuity to develop relationships with the professionals. So what's what. Impact has the pandemic count. It's obviously made it more difficult. For people. I think particularly the owning the pandemic. It was really hard because people couldn't go to hospital thought they couldn't access services. Were really frightened. Which didn't take you help. People in accessing the support the need but i do want to racial people. They can get that support they can have. District is coming into their homes. You can still go to a hospice. You mentioned hospice daycare. So the helping some services that had to have to be adapted for instance oh some hospices have had to use that daycare and adopted and change into impatient provision in particular when there were more beds needed to clear early on in the pandemic But some of the services is still being delivered in moore's and outpatient and i guess the other thing is to acknowledge that actually health care professionals. Visiting people hiding particularly they really are trying to reduce contact so they don't want to spread the virus the being really cautious so the maybe situations where people are still accessing the services but it may be in a virtual way it may be by telephone it may be a video call and they have less face to face contact which is obviously hard for people. Because they won't see you know a real person in the flesh so to speak But they are still able to access all of those services. There's just expanding a little bit on the palliative care that people can expect at home and yeah that's been a particular concern that we've been hearing mcmillan. Can you just maybe dig a little deeper into what people can expect. And who they might talk to those pathways of communication in order to get the best out of that. Politics can expect at the moment so particular home. The are very different aspects appellative. Kelly can access to palliative care that they can get through the gp through that district nurses community. This is coming to their homes. Could be physio could be occupational therapist and it could be for instance mcmillan special peleliu team which may be especially pud canada's when things are more complex and i guess if people already struggling there are lots of other means of support as well so through local hospices in some areas not areas. There is a million support line which is available seven days a week eight. Am to eight pm. That can offer guidance and support. We got amazing web site. You know you can get all sorts of information on that and also boots pharmacies which rebelled sport people with a urgent supply and delivery of medication which is absolutely vital for people. Because obviously you know the moyal condition deteriorates more likely. You're going to need more complex. Medication can also get virtual -pointment with boots mcmillan information pharmacists. Who can give you and your loved ones and carries information about medication and any potential side effects as well as guiding people most fascist information support. So you can. Book of virtual appointment with boots boots dot com slash. One of the things that's creating the most things -iety amongst people patients relatives harrah's is consistency. A dream would it be fair enough to say. I think with the changing landscape as frequently as is On various areas of the country dealing with this pandemic in their own way to a degree area to area. The is still really important to check with your healthcare professionals. Because what might be a okay. One place isn't the oak is an okay in in another for example. Yeah absolutely fat to say and so there is different provisions across the uk. Know even the fact that we've got four nations who have different guidance so it's really important even within your own country within your own local area if you're being provided support by a healthcare provider for instance they may have different rules and regulations so each hospital will have their own policies about visiting things like that. The community teams will work slightly differently again to fit in with the local needs in the local services. So you absolutely do need to check in with whoever. Your point of contact is whether it's a specialist punter cavernous whether it's your melon nurse that the hospital and whichever the provider is it might be. An acute oncology nurse for instance but but do speak to them about what you can access. We're in the middle of a pandemic. And i guess one of the biggest worries seem so obvious really Is that what happens if somebody is coming to the end of their life and they catch corona virus. What what happens. Then i mean. That's it's hard to believe that. But i'm of course it is in a might happen. What should they do if they're getting symptoms. Yeah so obviously somebody who potentially might be having still palliative chemotherapy approaching their ended. The lives in his going to be for instance. You're more susceptible but that would be the case. If we went in mitzvah pandemic can they could be more settled. Things like a chest infection. So don't feel too alarmed. You know lots of people managed to cope with coronavirus have not. Don't have extreme symptoms. Sometimes people just have lots of taste with might have you know a persistent cough or whatever but it's really really important that you notify your health provider and try and get tested as quickly as possible and follow all the government guidelines as you would in any situation too so it's about reducing any contact about tran stain isolation but i want to reassure people that can still get the support that they need even if they were to get grown virus and they were tim. Instance I don't think it's a news tool that. Of course the pressures on the chest and the pressures on healthcare services are immense during this time and how everybody is dealing with. This is definitely affecting people's care for all sorts of different conditions war if people are being discharged to go home but feel that they haven't been sent home with the right support the right care package. What happens if you are a relative or a career and your concern that people have been sent. I really confident that everything is being done. That could be yeah. I'm not. I can sometimes happen. Even monotony pandemic. so it's really important to get in touch with your local. Gp surgery who can put you in touch with the community nursing team so you can expect to be able to have a visit from a community staff nurse or district s who come out and do listrik assessment. That look all of your needs in your home. they'll think about. Do you need a bed. Downstairs for instance you know how you got access to a toilet or the really practical things as well as you need tools to think about new all you getting the right benefits because that's really important particularly in the current climate when you know people really struggling financially And if somebody is pushing into the lives they are entitled to benefits. So there's the fifteen hundred which is a benefit for people who have got punditry candidates and that can be fast tracked if you are approaching into your life and your gp can sort that out all your melon s But again if you're not sure then please do get in touch with on sport line and they can point in the right direction and sticky on the support line around the finances and we do have benefits gieco which is fantastic. You can do an online check if you getting your benefits or if your loved ones getting the right benefits so i would really urge people to to make sure they do get the right support but it is out that and they can get it. So what are the effects of the pandemic as you. You know clearly explained is that they you know there was pressure on resources and contact is reduce which means that sometimes there may be family relative friends who find themselves in the carrying role That would normally begin by end of life care to buy healthcare professional. She's quite. it's quite scary overwhelming experience for a lot of people. How can they best support their loved ones the end of their lives. And what does the guidance so faw allow for so again. Even when we're not in a pandemic often people do get involved in the care and support of delon's at home because the there isn't usually the twenty four seven support the e would hope to be able to get when when if you are looking after somebody you may get involved in doing some of their personal care things like that. You may be involved in supporting giving the medication for instance but they can still access the support from the community teams. You can talk through all of this whether it's virtual whether it's you know kamala show them how to do things said the won't be alone on a really. Want to reassure people than not to learn and also we need to make sure the carries themselves supported so they're entitled to a carries assessment. The may be other sorts of support that they can get and again they may be entitled to to benefit from sowell's so again it's really worth phoning pau madman support line to see what and talking to and what they can get on like practical basic question so for example if if relative needs to move in with Somebody that they they are then going to look often. He's the i mean. Is that allowed at the moment. So people are still allowed to provide that care for somebody at the end of life and they do have to follow the guidance but the best thing they can do particularly to ask the healthcare provider so speak to their specialist. Patrick kane is for instance millionnaires millionnaire speak to their gpo district. S and just ask what what is feasible. But nobody would stop somebody being with their loved one at home if they were caring for him and obviously people are using their own sensible pragmatic judgment about supporting loved one. Because it's so important to be with somebody isn't it is absolutely crucial. So just just to be clear at and if you are finding yourself in the carrying Role at the moment during the pandemic not expected to take on that role as the healthcare professional. All you oh absolutely not so you may end up doing some practical things supporting your loved one. I home but that wouldn't mean you do bidding really complex things like you know administering high doses of medication or dating with really complex kassar. Anything like that. That would be delivered by a healthcare. Professional will still be delivered by a healthcare professional just briefly as well you mentioned. Obviously we need to make sure that all carriers are looked after In terms of Support out there for carriers you know this is someone only ended the line if this is all too much on occasion and you need you need to offload and and really on some support that way. Yeah unusually The community teams who are providing that support are also there for the karen not just the individual themselves but there are lots of the sources of support so again almonds port line. Is that a people. Please do phone up. Get that support their other sources of support. So there's booklets around carrying for somebody at the end of life is a guide about that is also abbots mcmillan information pharmacists. Who mentioned earlier. It can also support carrozza loved ones so do make him an appointment. Virtual was beaten in store and there was some fantastic organizations as well like an uk who will offer support and advice address. Please go anywhere. Stay with meat. We'll talk more in just a minute questions about cancer. The it's a mcmillan. Your side from the moment to diagnosed through your treatment and beyond our beads mcmillan intimation pharmacists on hand when specialists support from helping you make sense of your diagnosis to advice about living with cancer you can find them. In your likud's fomc online via video appointment visit dot com forward slash mcmillan for more information subject to pharmacist availability at gm. We've been talking a lot about what might mellon. Support line is hearing from Colas walking people do to feel more in control at a time when everything fails uncertain. Even when we're not in a pandemic there is so much uncertainty about and life care and autumn living with 'em constitute treatable but not curable they are living with uncertainty and trying to maintain hope one thing that people find really beneficial is having a really good conversation with your health care professional and it's really important to have open discussions that the professional will tell you around. You know about your prognosis about what you can expect. What treatments choices. There are one of the best ways to do. This is to have what we call in advance care planning conversation. is wilson. Scotland anticipate very care planning. And that's where eighty about nurse or dot talking to you and saying what matters to you what's important to you then being able to write down your preferences and wishes and think about things like if you lose capacity he would you want to make decisions on your behalf And actually naming that person things like would you want to refuse specific treatments at the end of life and when people have those conversations of really really hard conversations to have but actually people feel quite empowered and it does almost instill a sense of hope because people feel is sensitive. Okay after not of soltau fares and will dry would have also written by will talk about my funeral. All of those things then enables them to think about the here and now on the quality of life and trying to get the most out of life so that is a really empowering thing to do and i really would employ people to have those really good conversations and taught elephants about what matters to them as well. I mean it seems like that would be one of the most difficult things in the world to do. But i instinctively understand the kind of Space to breathe that it gives you once. That's once that's done have to say with my mom. She went when she was dying. She had suffered. You'll cancer and she went upstairs with him nurse and had a private conversation. I felt a bit left out to the time but we talked about it afterwards and when she came downstairs she said oh adriana she said i feel so relieved. I didn't realize i could die at home. I plant which batum going to die. Don't want to be in the same bed as you dad. I know what support can get such a sense of relief to have out in the open to talk about it into know what to expect. And that's hugely powerful people. I guess as well. I imagine never forgetting Family members There's always somebody on the end of the nine am a. We know that million. If you're struggling absolutely and i would urge people to do that and particularly for those who are bereaved well so bereavement support is variable across the country. Sometimes how people have to wait to access it. But the and support line is a really great sense for peop- great source to people to actually phone up and just have a listening ear at the other end because sometimes that's all people need just some digital to how they're failing because particularly for grief and loss it's a normal part of of living and dying isn't it you know we we will experience it. Of course of course of course an amazing to talk to you especially with such a sensitive and difficult topics such a bizarre time that we're having at the moment. Thanks so much you take thank you now took to dany. Who is back to give us some practical advice for people coming to the end of their life in a pandemic. I everyone on dany. Might recognize me from previous podcasts. On mr tj adviser and i work commitment said just a few For people around and of life care my first hip. And i'm probably the most important is if you haven't already to compensations with your family or people that are really important to you about what your wishes all round where you want to be careful as you want to do. Except that i would really encourage you to do that. And we have some really good tolls. That can help you do that molin. We have an advanced care plan planning booklets on it. Gives you general information on how to talk about your preferences and your wishes with your family any legal issues so if you need to give power of attorney to anyone against the second tip would be that it would be really nice view to involve people that you care about in the practicalities so that you do things alone. If you haven't got will it's really nice to involve you'll family in that. Say that they know and also kind of think about the support services that you want to draw ronal would help your family and i guess finances is often the thing that people worry about and we do have a guide for end of life care but again has sections in around Getting financial help and also some information in that for you relatives on a guest. Lastly is really important to maintain contact with people on maintaining activity on. It's hard. it's hard at the moment with with restrictions but they're all ways to do things safely to still enjoy that human contact and get fresh air and undertake other activity. So was it's a really difficult time. Probably for you and your family. You know i would. I would absolutely stresses kind of those sorts of things are really important. Thank you so much for that day. Nisam really useful advice. That for more information about the topics adrian and i have talked about in this episode head to our website. Mcmillan dot org dot. uk forward slash talking cancer. There are lots of really helpful resources on there as well as details about where you can reach advice and support. Please use them. It's also where you can find out more about donating to macmillan now that takes us to the end of this series and the last six episodes of gone so quickly it's been so fantastic talking to so many different experts at mcmillan and boots to answer your questions. Remember you can still reach mcmillan on my support. Line seven days a week eight. Am to eight pm on oto eight. Eight hundred eight double zero double zero all reach out to a boots mcmillan information pharmacist. And you could do store online. If you've enjoyed the series. Please give us a rating overview and helps others defined. The full costs more easily. Thanks so much for listening. I'm a talking cancer is a macmillan. Cancer support cost.
"So what does treatment for cancer actually entail? Hello I'm Moab and welcome to talking cancer a podcast from Macmillan. Well I'll be meeting real people to have honest. Conversations about living with cancer also be meeting McMillan professionals who will be sharing advice and information to help anyone living with or -ffected by cancer to find their best way through in this episode. We're talking cancer with Ben. There was a nurse that came over to me introduce expecting along things on a look down a name Badge and seven Macmillan on it without my God things to start really really real really quickly. Two days after his fortieth birthday benzedrine was told he had cancer of the esophagus. The tube that connects your mouth to your stomach and for someone who loved his food like Ben. It was a devastating blow. We all eat together and I was suddenly taken away from not everybody else would be finishing and it would really highlight to me. I'm not well and I'm not normal anymore. Physically Ben who is a nurse himself is now on Chemo. At the end of which he's going to have surgery to rebuild part of his esophagus. You don't really realize how many chemotherapies the row out there. You just presume. It's like a Paracetemol. We talked about the INS and outs of his treatment. The information he received beforehand and we talked about living with cancer and all the things that keep him going like cooking and baking and later Dany one million professionals is joining me to talk about the treatments available when cancer is diagnosed is mind boggling but they are fairly standard treatment regimes for different types of cancer. Women Millan and we're talking cancer Ben Welcome. It's lovely to have you here very well. Thank you Ryan Sparkley. How are you today very good? I'm halfway through Chemo. And I'm about two weeks since last summer so at the moment I pretty much side effect free. Which is nice. It is nice. I slick sparkly healthy and that's great. Thank you for coming. We're going to talk a lot about your cancer treatment Shortly complex and super interesting and specific to you and I wanNA know all about that I it would be really lovely to try and get a picture of you before November last year. So you've just reminded me your forty and you were just turning forty weren't you? Yes so When I got my I guess. My first preliminary diagnosis. It was deer two days. Atma fortieth birthday through the twenty first of November then got my formal diagnoses fight the thirteenth. Thirteen kidding me. Really IT WAS. That was the of carved in Stone Day just turned forty. You kind of expect you to to be a bit life changing and you get into a positive things so it was. It was weird. It was a weird concept. Just suddenly finding out. You've got concert who days after you fought in the run-up to that a year. What was what was life like for you. What kind of a person where so I would consider myself quite healthy person. I'm relatively active. Have a dog that I walk every day and I'm really involved in Yoga. Do Yoga Retreats Healthy Diet healthy weight. DidN'T SMOKE DIDN'T DRINK TO EXCESS? I basically didn't take any of the boxes related to US. Offered you'll cancer so I was really looking. Gp said let's send you some tests you probably won't you probably wouldn't have cancer. Beat the possibility that anybody in your family The had worried you had anything like this ever crossed your mind. No nothing no emily. History of cancer. No family history for software. He'll come sir. I think one of the main causes of of salvager countries acid reflux too. I don't have any reflex either but my brother does. And he's on medication for that so I I was always seems to make sure you take image. Makes you take your meds because the OSCE can cancer cells. Ironically needs no more about your case. Where did you love baking? Come from so. I've always loved cooking because we go. Just Manteris is here today together. Yes so as a kid at always be brought into the kitchen. They would let me help the in the cooking and a more of a savory coke so I do lots of them like breads main meals. I thought actually I'M GONNA try and branch out a little bit and do something a bit sweeter so it's not come naturally but I really enjoy is really good about myself. Stunned Mixer. There's no sending back. What color is it? She's black block and Sparkley. She's called Sinead. I'm really envious of your Mexico. Should I really must meet it. So we've got we've got a healthy active food loving fairly happy man definitely a hurtling towards the fortieth birthday and you get A little sort of rumbling. Something's not right. What at what point did you know that things weren't quite right so I just moved house and with the surface rounded by Boxes Hunt. Set the dining room table up and all of a sudden. Just thought you know what? I'm finding foods quite difficult to swallow but put it down. To the fact that was rushing Mahfoud down because needs to empty boxes tidy rooms hoover and surfer in a position that I guess he's not conducive to healthy eating. I suppose you hunched over. But he continued and it got worse and I thought you know what I'm going to to doctors because painful. I just difficult to swallow the only way I could describe. It was if you've got a really dry beget the take a massive by outfit and it kind of gets stuck in your throat just how to swallow. It was not it all the time and I just thought actually this isn't right. I need to explore this with my. Gpa Bit Mars. That's what did it. Maybe my point with. Gp was it a case of when you were there struggling to find the words to describe it did he. Did he understand he or she understand? Immediately what you were trying to tell them he was asking me different things. Have you been to a lot of stress recently? Had well have display with my partner of just moved house and I've got a new job all all within three weeks of each of the address. Yeah and he was like it will probably be the book. I'm going to instead of sending me away insane. Combine two weeks come back in a month. He's coming to send you for an endoscopy Indus. Get that checked out because I'm not happy with it and I'm so pleased. I'm so look at aided straight away. How long did you have the white between him saying that going? He said you'll probably get an appointment within two weeks within two weeks at Hud. My appointment at Hudson dos copy at biopsies taken a preliminary diagnosis of. We think you've got cancer but we're not to shelve until we get the biopsies back I'd been referred to Macmillan at Maitland millionnaires and I'd been referred to my Dietitian all within two weeks. It was like a whirlwind. It was and in one sense obviously. That's absolutely brilliant. And the way it should be in another sense coping with the enormous amount of information such a short space of time. So you leave you went to the GP on your own. Didn't tell anybody I was going because I didn't think it would be anything and I didn't want to worry. People went mendacity all by myself. And one of my really good friends actually works hospital and she was like up to when you finished your you department. Allah finished works media. Just remember walking up to a she was in the corridors and she said how are things things okay isn't it. I said I think about cancer. I said what do you mean what comes to so the doctors just said. I think you've got come so so you go to have you endoscopy. Did somebody mentioned the cancer word off immediately. After that after I was due on the bed what had been laying having my band occupy. Kim. A SETUP WPS my mouth because you've obviously come down your throat. Dribble everywhere CPR uncomfortable. Yeah and the guy that the doctor went over to the computer hardware look at the images taken came back said these biopsies. I was really interested. Being a nurse. Wants to have a look at the little bits of this growth that taken away and then he said I believe if concer those words ring in your head probably for the rest of my life so yeah it was. It was it was. It was a shock. Can you remember much? After that word of that day it was all a blur so after you get put into recovery for a couple of hours to make sure you're okay you're on your own at this point and I'm by myself. Yeah in this recovery Bay and I remember there was a nurse that came over to me and she explained that she was the specialist per genus. And sat down with me and spoke to me for it is and then I remember. She was expecting a lot of things on a look down a name Badge and seven Macmillan on it and I thought Oh my God things have really really real really quickly and until I saw the words McMillan nece it was just a blur. It wasn't real rarely that really hit her. Because obviously you know my gosh. I've got cancer. So who'd you call? Who did he go into? You bumped into your friend at this point. Have you spoken to anybody so one day? I didn't in fact I was actually out by evening with rugby so met with another friend and said of not told anybody but I just need to know. I think I've got come and you make a list of people that you need to tell a Melissa Person I like it written to next question what do you do. How do you then handle this situation? You would expect you would write down everybody's name and take people's names off as you get them and you tell the important people. I work your way down the list and it wasn't like the all you kind of work. How when you seen people so much? Leo told some people before I would wanNA tell other people but you want to tell the important people in your life face to face rather than a phone. Call 'em so yeah. I told my parents the next day I went to go visit them. Just make out that. It's coming down to visit high. You Work here and then guys I've got some things you need to talk to you about and it all got very serious already quickly either. That's really that was that must have been what kind of information about So tell so tell us what explained to me what you have them at that point. Won't you have been diagnosed with so I was told the I had come say in my Asaf. Agha's thought growths. They said we think you've got some years off against uncomfortable. Needs to make as well the initial information that I got you then sent for a couple of scans later when I was sent. Ct Scan a nice it. Actually you haven't got to grow. You've actually got one growth. Which was relief can show. It's in the base of my asaf ago. Which is where you started right. So it's in that kind of I dip underneath your ribs here. You're you're where you're soft meets. Your stomach writes it grown into my stomach. Thought they thought got to the fired. What he must have mcwilliam s office actually turned out to be would love that grown around and then after another scan which is called a pet scan they could see that it was actually my lymph nodes as well. I was told that didn't know whether I thought it'd be stage. Three arrested for the three means they can treat it with chemotherapy and then get rid of with surgery stage Faris. They can't get rid of it with surgery and they can treat with what they call policy of chemotherapy. Where is it aims to hold in place and shrink it am and hopefully stop it from growing? But it's time limited and becomes the I've got is the people mainly diagnosed with that a man in the sixty seventies and eighties. So there I guess. They don't have great outcomes because of not they've not got youth on the side and some that don't have health from the side and so the information that you're giving is not based on my category. They're like twenty thirty years older than myself. So yes it's difficult. It's difficult to know the right information to believe. Not believe that information for me really. It was a completely different context completely So when you when you end up having that conversation with mom and dad which must have been really hard for them as well obviously and view how much about how they wanted to treat it. Were you able to tell them at that point all I could tell them walls the doctor things. I've got cancer. And then as soon as you say that then wanted to back you up with loads of positives to try and stop them from worrying so much so as I come from a good age. I'm healthy if I'm taking all the boxes that you would want to take if you had cancer basically but then my parents being the having living people that they are wanted to be involved as much as possible so from then on. My mom came with me to every single appointment. She's driven me to hospital. She's hey with me today in. London says dishes so she's got involved. She wanted me to move in with them. I've got a dog who sometimes I can't walk because of the chemotherapy the Amazon and the side effects got the looked after the dog. So they've got involved wholeheartedly. Really did you feel as well? I mean it's something that's kind of coming through. It's quite common taking somebody with you. Indifferent pair of ears really helps to to properly understand what's being said exactly some of whom turns up. She's got little notepad that she writes. She writes down in the Middle Pad and then with the departments that have had you have the appointment with the doctor and also you McMillan. Nason there as well. The the doctors doctor talk she kind of understand but not everything. Then go to another room with Melanin. Andy McMillan nist gives to in Layman's terms makes it more digestible already. Bite size and then minimum our notebook and says this in Comanche about Mason. What could this mean another last year? It's good to have somebody else there. I mean you know this. This is the thing though. Isn't it a New York you know you're used to these environments your the new vocabulary that comes pouring out when you had your first meeting with your oncologist? That was to confirm your diagnosis and to start talking about how they wanted to treat it. Yes so what was said at that first meeting about how they hoped to treat it so by that point at. Hutt my foam diagnosis. So I knew there are definitely cancer and the meteorologist. He basically just explained the type of Kmart. Beyond and what that chemotherapy medication consisted of. And what side effects had probably encounter is just a barrage of information. And it's it's funny until you either have. Cancer are some media? Family has cancer. Are you work in an environment or company that million the involved in cancer? You don't really realize how many chemotherapies the out there you just presume. It's like that's a mall. Everybody has chemotherapy. How did you find out that there were different forms chemotherapy? We told or was it something that you observed found out a thing. Yeah just research online really and also when you go and chemotherapy you in obey with a number of the of the people and above them is a whiteboard with their name and what chemotherapy that on and you look around and nobody is on the same thing and he was like. Oh my gosh. There were so many different types obviously because it needs to be specific to the person and specific to the cancer. You just don't realize it is so I open is yeah. I didn't know that either I did. You know you just wouldn't know exactly so is so eye opening and is partly consideration of the treatment. The you know the kind of person that you are obviously age. What you do you know can we? Can You keep working? Can you know keep working? Are you moving around because tell me tell us then about the treatment that that you eventually agreed on view? The chemotherapy that I'm on is called Flt L. O. F. Teams Ninety for that type of sorry and basically it's an acronym. Epilepsy is mid perform different medications. And I get every two weeks for two days and I have a four times. So it's a period of eight weeks 'em and basically going to hospital on day one and have three medications and then because the chemotherapy that I'm on I come home with off which is in a pump. Which is we expect it to be full of cogs and battery operated or plugged in. But he's just looks like a baby's bottle okay. There's a balloon inside of it yet fully medication and basically the balloon slowly. I guess deflate and push easy medication now. So how was it administered to you? So I've got a pick line in which is basically a Catheter. Straightens in my vein. Okay which is there the whole time. Okay and I'm just so it's just above my elbow a bit. Different to be higher than you would hubbard taken from. And yes. He basically carrying around this baby's bottle full of chemotherapy for twenty four hours and then a district. Eskom's detaches you pump takes off and then you wait two weeks the next law. It's amazing being able to have your medication at home in your own environment around loved ones not in the clinical environment in a clinical environment. It's amazing how far it's on at night. I guess you know the comfort of your own home with the support of loved ones around. You is is is priceless as absentee prices. I'm sure but also. How quickly are you feeling the effects of of those of those treatments? Are you able to kind of Baker home? A you're able to do that for a short while until it really kicks in. Yes so you side effects come in stages and the change each time. You have chemotherapy. So the first time had Makina therapy I was side effect. Free for two days which you didn't expect a little bit tired. I was told to experience nausea which I didn't have either time and then the second time they came on a lot quicker the side effects so had lots of tingles in my extremities. Which would painfully if it was cold out of tangles in my mouth how to call drink so now is Emma. Gin and tonic awful. Oh renders you would have an upset stomach. The in between each side effect you'd have couple of side of fact free days three. It's kind of the same stages it doesn't all hit you at once and different people experience different things as well so this time round. I've had hair loss so member who is naturally behold and has all the equipment said. Get Round here as soon as you start losing your hair. I'm going to Brazil Australia because you. You're very proud of you. Have you have equipped to grow back at some point? Yeah so I've always loved hover. Thick have always lived my hair and always been really proud of my quick and it's almost become like a mask up. That's how I've been known the guy with the quiff gas knowing that it was going to fall out and losing. That control was difficult. Because you can walk around our. I felt I could walk around. Nobody would know. I had cancer. Unless you see pick line in my arm our start talking about it but when you see somebody who has no hair and no eyebrows of. They've lost the beard and you know a person's chemotherapy and it meant that I was certainly very visually constipation. A patient and nuts ahead laughing. It's difficult to get head around. I mean thankfully the moment I do I still have my kid is coming out and I just thought I didn't accept this and I think a major decision from a very early age not to let the come to define me and not be controlled by cancer and not be somebody suffering from comfortable living with cancer and so I thought right. I'M GONNA get shaved off. I'm going to be bald and it's going to be fine and it's I know that the chemotherapy is working and at the end of the day I mean for the long run a minute for the surgery at the end to become a free to lose my hair at the lose quick mascots not there awhile. It's fine that's the great thing about hair. It grows back but it's really interesting and it's really nice to speak to a man about it because I think people often Ashim that men would find it somehow. Easier to lose their And you know it's something that that that maybe only women will really struggle with but but not so an. It's good to be reminded that it's you know it's it's still visually important as a means of identification is made to who you are. It's part of who you are. You're speaking to a guy who he doesn't shave his head completely but had it really shot anyway and he was saying people thought that he wouldn't affect me that much because I really really short hair anyway crew. But he was like it affects everybody not the same but your hair style defines the person that you are. It's almost like the crown on your head foot matches the fashion that you every needs. It's the defines who you are as a person definitely whether it shot whether as long as difficult year did they did the schedule of treatment and the way that they spelt it out to you. Did that give you some comfort? Was that helpful. Yeah definitely so I. I was saying before that things just kind of went really really quickly and I was saying to people that probably have me in for surgery next week. Because everything's gone so quickly but then after that initial investigations that you have there is a period of waiting and you are just left in limbo anything. When am I GONNA get my results? What my results going to be an as soon as you meet when as soon as results of come in an Easter meeting with the doctors in aces and a gift shop timetable of his. When it's GonNa stop this is when it's going to happen bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-ba you can stop pointing your diary and you do feel a little bit more in control. That really really helped knowing saints fans are probably what we okay on this day. So probably can't me up back in the day after the the week afterwards because I think it'll be a bit better than to definitely helps to get control back. Really what goes what goes through your mind in the waiting time. I think everything I think initially like I was saying a did A. I wanted to have this positive outlook. I guess to support myself also to support others as well but you do. Have you bought days and you mind does one? Do you do think what if the chemotherapy doesn't work and I can't have surgery and then a really limited life basically in terms of time. What if this doesn't work? What if it comes back again? All these things go through your head and I think it's healthy to think about these things because you can get mentally prepared for it and you have to come to terms with. Maybe things weren't won't work out as people are saying they might do our as as well as the. I hope they're going to do because it's always a what if you do? You mind goes dark places and I think that's healthy. I think you have to do that once they once. The treatment kicks in. You've got that framework to hang onto and you start doing that. Yes a comedy on Saturday and however you how have you personally found the treatment how how apart from me losing your beloved Quiff How have you found in dealing with it because you're so three doing three number three tomorrow? Yes tomorrow yeah my goodness me. I'm excited I've only just that I mean that's got to feel good to feel good do you do you? Do you. Approach ANOTHER CHEMO. With a sense of dread. Or is it just something that you go to do? So people are saying how you feel about going for your chemo tomorrow or next week. It's it's almost like you are stepping up the ladder to get to the end point. So it's a mixture of feelings. I am excited to be going from chemotherapy tomorrow. Because you know it's chemo three or four and it's a bit closer to an message with is going to be happening but you also know that it's GonNa come with side effects in. It's GONNA come with its downsides. So the party that dreads it but it is a for me. It has been about focus on the positives and accepting that there are gonna be about days physically and mentally and that's what you friends and family life. That's who you pull on when you're having a bad day so it's a mixture of funen excited dreading the fact that you might have to be rushing to the toilet You can have tingles. Ekoku outside or you might be a bit tired. It's it's it's a strange concept. Audi you practically prepared because I know who packs the chemo bag. So I'd actually not even thought about Chemo back until somebody said on twitter Chemo Chemo. Bag is basically just like a bag. You take to chemo. That's basically of anything and everything that you can do to pass the time. Okay so when you've been hospital. Get Chemotherapy you there for about seven seven and a half hours. Oh my gosh. That's a long time as you keep my chemo. Lasts ABOUT TERRITORY? Takes about five hours to fully infuse. It's a bit like a long haul flight bug. You'd have a pack of cards in. You'd have banana grandma scrabble to non time. There's been talk a good game. I like it. You take a book anything that you can find. Comfort in you take the necessities Utah. Might tickets beat my downloaded a few programs on etc. Okay A bit of music and then you take things that are going to help in terms of making yourself feel better so I've got a little pencil case. It's got hand cream it's face what Scott face moisturizer it's got spray missed a glass. Brim is essential rural. On's hunger likes signed censor yourself a little bit? It's just anything and everything you don't use fifty percent of the stuff that you take with you but it's there in case you need topped absolutely talked to did somebody. Somebody suggests that to you on twitter. Somebody suggested on twitter and I'm really pleased the date because you can be prepared and he can be like. Oh yeah might freshened up now and white cream. Ya here. You are absolutely right though. You know you all those little things matter matter when you get when you get home is there because obviously your cancer is a really awkward place for you to eat and you love your food so i WanNa talk about your blog. How have you coped with that side of things? One of the most difficult things I found was not being able to eat food properly and finding difficult to swallow. When you're a big Foodie and you get a lot of comfort food. I got a lot of comfort. Cooking far. People can fall myself and it's almost like ever De Stress. At the end of the day you come in from work you get your sauce pan out you make something and you can kind of reflect on the day and not having now it was really difficult and mealtimes we sit around the table. We all eat together. That'd be big pots of stuff in the middle of the table. You're leaning over. You get any self some pasta some wedges and etc. I was certainly taken away from not and have a plate of food. That would take a long time so we everybody else would be finishing and it would really highlight to me that I'm not well and I'm not normal anymore physically and that was really difficult. I mean at one point. I couldn't eat any solid foods at all and it would take me an hour and a half to of really smooth soup tomato soup hour and a half savings really difficult in thankfully. That's one of the things that I got back really quickly when aside chemotherapy so from day three I love chemotherapy. I certainly bet. And 'cause I couldn't babe and that was one of the things that let's talk independent burke that happened to try and make myself. I thought I can. I eat now tied eating certain things. Like Oh my God the chemotherapies where can I can. Now sit down my family and have a small bowl of pasta with them and finish almost at the same time instead of feeling rushed or pressured. There was no pressure from anybody. But you put pressure on yourself because you wanted. You want to be normal at all you want from this. You've mentioned as we've been speaking. So the chemotherapy sessions finish. And then there's some surgery yes. Tell me about how that scheduled what you expect to happen after my last love. Chemotherapy have a fall to six week period. Where I'm going to recover from chemotherapy. My immune system gets back up and running the way it should do. And then the beginning of April is the planned dates for my surgery because where my cancer is basically. They're going to be taking the bottom of my Asaf. Agus off the top of my stomach off getting rid of that and then they're gonNA join the rest stomach. Optimus Africa's create a whole Safa. Guess and yeah. Basically our smallest Michael have to eat smaller portions more often about five or six times through the day when when when the surgeon was telling me they explain that and he said all right. I said Yeah. That's fine. You do what you need to do. Just going with the flow. So long as you can get me cancer-free that's absolutely fine. You just do what you do. I'm I'm very excited for you. Does it feel like there's light at the end of the tunnel definitely and north of people? They don't have that light and the have through my twitter feed through a blog have connected with people and have met with people who unfortunately asked edge for and this definitely at the end of the tunnel for me. It's difficult because it's it's not there for everybody but there's there is an when our meet people they're saying things like. I'm going to make the most of the time. Now I've got some glimmers of light for everybody it's just it's just different light for different people. One of your lights has been your blog which is brilliant and funny gorgeous and lovely and and I'm sure has has made a massive difference to how you've dealt with all. This was an immediate thought. Did you think I've gotTA write this down? I've gotta write this down you. Are you a writer knowing? This lights? a holiday twitter feed 'em a dump that quite quickly and then got a new twitter feed and that was specifically focused around me and cancer. One of the main things I wanted to do when I was diagnosed was I guess to help with is being a nurse. You want to be able to help with is in terms of their healthcare and it also gave me a purpose as well so. I worked fulltime and when I started my chemotherapy I stopped and I thought what am I going to do? So I started writing these these tweets and quickly got to realize I've got a lot more to talk about. Then they set number of characters. That twitter's giving me on a tweet and people were saying writer blog right blocking us in Conrad a blog of never written a blog. I don't even read blogs. Do People read blogs in him? I didn't know so a very quickly to start. Actually you guys are right. I'm going to start writing a blog. So focus them around very specific areas around concern around. Saggio CANCER RECIPES THAT. Make it easy to swallow what my slots been like. How pick line was done to give people a bit of a a timeframe of all right? This guy waited for weeks for this to happen. Are This is what this person experienced. And it's quite therapeutic for me as well because I get to write down. What's in my head so I get a bit of something positive for me as well. Getting out getting clear people come back. Say and that was really helpful. Mud Scott they saw I'm experiencing they really good to know what might happen to me as well. So there's definitely positive feedback coming from which is all I want. I'm actually just thought no one's going to beat this. My friends might join not state. But there's so many people that read in the recipes. Tell me about the recipes. I see a master chef challenge so one of the things that I found quite difficult knowing. What would be easy to swallow and things that you wouldn't even think would eat as well as people say. Toast anything what toast is dry. Thanks crackers really easy to swallow. That doesn't make any sense. It makes no sense so one of the things I wanted to do was put some healthy recipes out there that would try and stay away from things like refined sugar. Try US more. Natural things like Maple Syrup or honey also things that are going to be easy to swallow really am so things like jolly prawns seafood with was with me for longtime fish and seafood because it was easy to swallow so golic King Prawns garlic mushrooms. Similar is a bit of lubricant in. La Books at our oil. That's that's going to be easy to go down and something that's got taste as well so thankfully my tastes and the moment haven't been affected but I know that the might do in the future but people generally have like a bit metallic taste when the things off throughout the day. So I wanted something that's spice or something flavor to kind of take that away. It's really lovely to meet you and speak to you in you know And share such a positive outlook. And what's the what does the future look like more immediate future? I guess is get through treatment. Get through surgery an Komo on the other side hopefully and things so it quite positive one of the things that has really hit home is a really enjoyed making connections with people who were in the same situation as me. I been through something that somebody is going to be through. And you do almost connections and it has made me think to myself actually. Is there a future in this for me of really enjoyed it and looking at at things like McMillan is this? This is something I can do in the future to be working with a million future. I'm definitely going to be raising money at some point of raise MARINA PASTA FERRUM. Mcmillan before I did the National. Three P twenty four hour challenge back in two thousand and nine. So this is your from Yorkshire. You do this in your city. You guys it's like literally going for a walk for everybody now. I'm very impressed. Yes so are you. Are you saying we are you? I mean could there be milliner in possibly who knows what's the space. It's definitely something I've thought about. Fish are definitely million in and the really helps me unto for me to continue my journey. Hopefully being cancer free with somebody like McMillan would for me would be amazing because I've enjoyed it so much. So yeah maybe on the cards listen. You are literally the that you are literally the perfect combination of of of having experienced natural instinct for caring as a nurse and you can bank coffee mornings exactly. Come on and on that note. Ben Thank you so much. We wish you the best of luck with the rest of you treatment and we will speak to you again. I'm sure in the future but fundraising activities way or life has found itself in Q. Hello date lovely to see you. Dany Bell is one of our magnificent McMillan professionals. What were your thoughts on listening to Ben Story? What he describes really is a lot of people experience when they get a diagnosis in go through treatment with with cancer. So I'm sure a lot of people identified with Ben. He had an interesting combination treatments as well. He had chemotherapy and then surgery And he had no idea that there were so many different types. I know I mean is mind boggling but they are all fairly standard treatment regimes for different types of cancer. And as I said before they're they're given acronyms to make it easier for the professionals to understand but it's not an unusual process for some cancers to have what we call neo atrovent than surgery and some people. Then have something after that as well so it depends on the type of cancer and your response as well to treatments Ben. We know took his fantastic with him. Who took a notebook and a pen to write things down? Don't Google obviously answer some questions for some people If you WANNA find out more about the treatment you've been prescribed. Is this better to go to. There are lots of information sources out there about the different treatments. Essentially the treatment center will have fact sheets or information about the types of treatment that you're having but what they need to understand is what type of side effects that you're likely to get just in case you need support hours equally going to go and hopefully Hitting on one of our web pages We'll give you understandable information. And there's lots of downloadable information of the Internet from our website. That people can use Dania. You entitled to a second opinion. If you don't want a certain type of treatment absolutely you can ask your specialist. If it's possible to be referred somewhere for a second opinion and sometimes you can go to your gp for that as well but the specialist likely to know some people will actually look it up and they will look up their condition and they will compare to other hospitals so but you you do have to have a referral. Unfortunately you can't just rock up so my advice would be if anyone wants a second opinion than they just have to have an open and honest conversation with with their consultant. Ben gave us a super tip about his cancer bag that he took. What are the kinds of things that you see that you you can tell us about preparing people for treatment? One one of the things that people often struggle with is the traveling to from treatment. That takes its toll loss of appetite feeling tired and so sort of planning for that around your kind of Treatment regime can help And just making some adjustments to kind of make it easier for yourself I mean if someone like me I'm always rushing around and I have to do everything but appropriate wouldn't be up to do that and I'd have to make adjustments and not have to accept help and for some people then used to accepting help so I think it's Having an understanding of what your treatment regime as what the potential side effects might be and then also after you've had the first treatment you'll have a clear indication of how it might impact you So that you complain talking about side effects then bless him did lose his beloved quiff. Quick thing about Harry goes back so we will see the quick again taste. Buds are okay. But what are the common side effects of a generalized chemotherapy radiotherapy plan so nausea and? Dara our common one for some people they have Harry saw mouth and added to losing your taste that can be really really challenging in terms of eating some people get issues with Sensations the tingling didn't he yes yes so you can also get something we call it hand on. Foot Syndrome where you get painful sore palms and sometimes blisters. It depends on what type of drug regime you're having and I've heard people say in terms of treatments of all of the treatments. The chemotherapy is what they found the hardest cope with. Tell us a little bit about losing your hair because it was really interesting talking to a man because I think everybody assumes that it's it's just women and we all the people that would care about it but it is a common side effect other alternatives now available to to reduce that to help that there are. I mean there is the coke cap but not in itself seems like an experience that you have to kind of be resilient to coping with just to keep keep your and when you think about how great some wigs are out there made of natural hair and you know. I've come across people and you wouldn't even know that. They're wearing a wig It's very individual really very individual. But I think the the thing to remember it's not just the hair on the head that they lose. They'll lose their eyebrows and their eyelashes. And so it's that whole look really That's tough year. How do you know when you treatments working? Do you feel better How do they tell you yes? This is going to plan the do that by monitoring. So they'll do that with blood tests scans And generally they. I mean because you obviously have to have blood test to make sure you're well enough each time to your body's well enough to cope with the chemotherapy Site before each cycle. You will have a blood test but usually about three months in. If you're on six month regime they'll do a sort of a stocktake and see what the impact is. Do you have regular meetings with your oncologist during that time? Will you dealing with treatment centers? So so you will have monthly depending on the Thai again the type of cancer but generally you will have a a regular visit to a clinic just so they keep an eye on you the GP will be informed. Hopefully that you've you've started treatment. Although sometimes there's communication processes aren't as efficient as they could be but you know ideally the GP will know but equally again that's why we've put roles in specialists because if you're struggling and you've got problems you can phone them and they can even give you advice over the phone or just bring you in ad hoc just to kind of support you with whatever you're managing or struggling with we Met Ben when he was number three or four so the light of treatment was definitely. He was at the end of the tunnel. Amazing what happens then. When treatment stops finish a treatment or the plan treatment has ended what happens then so people often find that rare lyrical. They've had lots and lots of support through treatment and you often hear the term slide falling off a cliff because they suddenly have been given a three or six month appointment to come back for a checkup and then not having that regular interaction out that at that time. I think a few plum yourself into Sapporo. Right from the point of diagnosis. You will still have that when treatment finishes so whatever works for you as an individual in terms of support whether that's peer support or focusing on your health and wellbeing and doing that with peers or whatever is just to keep doing that But if you kind of start out before treatment and I am maintain it then that's helpful. I mean there were always places to drop in like the information and support centres all ringing support worker or a specialist. But it's not the same as peer support and having that support in locally to you they need thank you again as always and our thanks to Ben for sharing his story to get more information about what we've talked about in this episode. Then you can go to our website. Mcmillan DOT ORG dot. Uk forward slash talking cancer. If you enjoying the series why not give it a rating or a review? It helps us find the podcast more easily. I'm GONNA be talking. Cancer is a Macmillan cancer support podcast
Life After Cancer
"What does life cancer look like? Hello I'm Abi. And welcome to talking cancer a podcast for Macmillan. Well I'll be meeting real people to have honest conversations about living with cancer in this episode. We're talking cancer with errol had it not been for. My wife are probably wouldn't be sitting here today. Having this conversation ten years ago errol McCullough went to his. Gp To do something about his snoring. He picked up a leaflet about prostate cancer while he was waiting and it was a decision that would change his life. They said to me Mr Michaela. I'm afraid to say your prostate is covered in cancer. When I sat in my car and I'm not trying to say just burst into tears errol had his prostate removed. And he's now being in remission for ten years he's made it his life's work to educate men like him. Look I'll give you twenty percent discount. If you're GONNA get your prostate checked. Two weeks later. When he came to pick up his car he was waving if piece of paper and he had twenty five percent cancer. Prostate is very funny. He's driven but he's also incredibly open about living with the side effects of having his prostate removed. Plus later Dany on McMillan professional is giving us some practical advice about life after cancer but cancer nurse specialists will would much prefer somebody just ringing and checking and more often lot. They can relieve anxiety over the phone. Women Melon and we're talking cancer Welcome it's lovely to have you here with us. We've spent maybe two minutes together but I'm kind of getting the lay of the land with you. Big Personality extremely driven. Will you always like that before your diagnosis? I've been driven a think since I've had this prostate tissue. I'm actually in the Fast Lane Nassar. Yes I'm much more driven. What was life like for you before the diagnosis? What were you doing well? Qualified mechanic an MIT tester. So I used to run a Gary H in eastern London and part time for all coach at Leyton Orient Football Club. He just throw the football thing away but we know there was more to it than that for those people. Who Don't know very much about you. You have coached them. Names we would know Yeah Yeah I've been very privileged in my football life right to work with the young. David Beckham Ashley. Call Sol Campbell. Liba Jermain Defoe but everyone I've worked with is on an equal par for me when it comes to football. I mean I was just very fortunate to work with some very very good youngsters who have grown up to be complementary adults as well then the the in your line of work on both levels so be you know working in the garbage doing. Mit's and you made this analogy perfectly yourself and then working with young talent you got quite good ears and eyes to to pick things up. Did you pick up anything about your prostate situation before you went to the doctors? Do not so interesting. You say that because had it not been for my wife. I probably wouldn't be sitting here today having this conversation because I only found out about my issues because my wife was complaining about me. Snoring in my sleep ascension should and this is a lesson to all men right when these lady start nagging. Please listen because is painful. If he don't okay to be very clear to be very clear snoring is not one of the symptoms of prostate cancer. So so you went to the doctor to talk about your snoring and nothing else exactly. I went to the doctor because so the nagging at that. My wife didn't quite say I just said the Milwaukee disappointments. I'm here I hadn't you know when you're sitting in the reception room waiting to see the doctor. You know that can be a little while so need to find somebody to occupy your time and I picked up the leaflet purely by accident to this day. I still don't know why picks it up picks it up. Read the leaflet. There was things in that leaflet. The author all this could be something to do with some things that's going on in my life like what getting up three or four times a night to go to the toilet. I'm having lower back. Pain lower abdominal pains. And I thought well you know. By the way they're describing. It's a simple blood tests so I thought. Let me go make an appointment. I wasn't planning on doing anything there. And then I thought if I spoke to the reception lady and She was happy to talk to combat than I would. Come back and but the shock for me was when. I approached her she she turned to me Mr McKenna. You don't need to make an appointment. This is a simple blood test that takes less than ten minutes. You know we can do it now for. Okay let's do it and so none of those situations that you hear so much about about if you want to go and see your doctor. You need to wait. It's impossible to get an appointment. You have to wait months and this is something that can be done by one of the practice nurses quickly I have learned since my journey with prostate cancer. That discount sometimes. We are difficult appointment to get but my messages be persistent and get it done. Can I ask you a question? How old are you now? I'd like to say twenty one but I'm not GonNa get away with that when I look at. That's the idea. Yeah yeah unfortunately. I'm looking sixty two and someday feels sixty two. I'm I'm just wondering as well because you know if you're an active person and you know the the boys amongst us hate going to the dogs anyway and we'll talk more about that but you know some of those symptoms that you described. I just put things down to always as I'm getting older. It was that part of your thinking. You know what you've spot on because everybody. I've spoken to has a classic excuse for every symptom that I mean in my job as a mechanic a here in There was a a delight came up on the dashboard of the car and I ignored it as for. This is very similar to what we do has been particularly as men. What did you expect to hear back as well art? Expect to hear anything else back. But what sort of started alarm bells ringing this week. After that first blood test got called back to do a second one and I also questioned in. The doctor said to me. Now this is just you know routine check. We just want to follow up on what we've done. Okay but then the whole thing to start to sort of escalate in a very rapidly. You know after that second blood test. I'll go phone call. Could you come into biopsy and allow US remember the conversation I said to Dr? So when do you want me to do as well? We've made the appointment feed this morning. And which is quite interesting. Because I'm I put the phone down and I find my wife and said look after phone call from the. They won't meet to come in and do a biopsy and she said to me. When did they want to do that? And I said well. They want to do that today this morning so she turned to me and she said okay. Don't worry if you get a cab to the hospital. I'll meet you at the hospital and just before I put the phone down. An attorney said Oh your body. What's a biopsy? Well who's to say? What point did anybody start talking about? Psa's which you have to explain for and and possible prostate cancer. None didn't have a conversation about any of it until apart from what I read and as the journey went on then I start to get more bits and pieces of the conversation but I still didn't understand the graphics of what it meant. How serious a problem it was. I supposed to say that. You must've been shocked as a massive understatement. Yes because I had a biopsy and that that went. That wasn't very pleasant but it's something that we have to do. I almost immediately after the biopsy then they called me into skin and then things start to unfold. You know because off the scan they called me and my wife in size both down and said to me Mr Michaela I'm afraid to say that your prostate is covered in cancer. Well I'll go up on a walked out of the room because I it. I didn't actually think he was talking to me at the time. came out the building a went and I sat in my car and to this day. I don't know whether I was scared. Frightened DOLE above freely. You know and I'm not trying to save it. I'd just burst into tears. I don't know how else you deal with that kind of news. Because it wasn't a tiny little bit of cancer either was. It was quite serious and in that car. Crime is and and this is why I always encourage mental. Listen to their partners and for mental. Listen to the women in life because you know my wife came in and she sat in the car with men and she looked at me and she said look old years I've been with. You're never seen you quit on anything that you've ever done and they're quite powerful words when you open your eyes out because I stopped crying immediately and I looked and I thought is this her way of motivating because if it is then I need to take it and together we go up and we went back in spite to the doctor said right talk to what do I need to do to deal with. This program said the treatment that you had has has been successful yet. Was that treatment and whether any side effects for you well. The situation for me was When I spoke to the doctor he said look in. If we don't remove your prostate you could be dead in six months so I said okay. Let's let let let's do it. And he said well you know there will be some issues you have to to deal with. They'll be some side effects that you have to come to turn with but you know had your peration agreed to have the operation because there was no point in me trying to save the little piece that was left but after the operation There were still traces of cancer in in and around the area so I had to have navy three months of radiotherapy to burn away the rest of the cancer issues and that was difficult. That was probably the the that was the most because it makes you feel terrible. Yeah I mean it drained me physically and it drained me mentally which was a difficult part to deal with. I'm sure I and you know especially when you've you've you go from being so active so busy to having to you know to sit still and feel terrible. I mean on top of that I mean I was out of work for six months. The body's not used to sort of sit instill for one day let alone. Nearly six months talks about finding out. You're in remission. The light at the end of the tunnel. Well I think the end of the tunnel for me was when I went back to work and a gentleman came into my garage. And we go into compensation and to this day. I still don't know why asked them the question I asked him. I just looked at what was the last time you had your prostate checked. And he looked at me quite short talk about the indicators happy you know he turned to many said. What the BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP GEARBOX? Not Working on my car and while you say that you're able working and then and then on top of that. I turned to him and I said Look Attila are give you twenty percent discount on the work. I'm going to do it in your car. If you get your prostate check. Well I clearly didn't think I said didn't think it fruit because two weeks later when he came to pick up these car he was waving his a piece of paper and he turned to me and he said look he said. I took your advice and did that. Test and to this day I think he must have realized why because I looked up in the sky and looked at him and I thought crisis is just cost me two hundred so so but you know. He turned to me and he said. I don't want you to give the money back right. I want to donate to charity. But he said you need to read this letter. When I looked at the letter that he had he had twenty five percent cancer. And he's prostate. Oh my you are kidding me. But he was the first of forty eight guys that walked into my Garrett was diagnosed with prostate cancer of which two are no longer here. I am so journey. My journey for me you know and dealing with prostate cancer is by talking about every day. Yeah and I decided to set up the mckellar foundation to get mental can and the reason why did that was you know by one hundred of my lady customers in mcgarry and said goals. When when's the last time you went to see a doctor in a year and eighty nine out of the hundred doctors I also same question to my male customers and one and what was frightening about him is not only wind because his wife was moaning. Amy Said and she's decided she's not going to give him any more sex until he gets himself. Checked out Larry's smart journey now to raise this awareness and that's how I've had to deal with the bits and pieces that goes on with it and that and this is I suppose. Lots of people talk about their new normal. Your Journey Newell. The projects that you have in the foundation. The talking that you do is is that the new normal for us this errol now. I think it's just amplifying the stuff of done before but it has to be very direct because not helping people to pursue a career. I'm hopefully helping to save lives and you know and and I can't do that on my own. It's great people like yourselves. The fantastic support I get from my wife Sharon and also family and friends because I found out about prostate cancer by accident while I say to people now is is reading lots and lots of reading to find that because so many different different conflicting things that people talk about. But the most important thing I've learned from the reading I've done is. The numbers are very very high and getting higher one. In eight European men get prostate cancer. One in four effort cabin men get prostate cancer. It's important to talk. This is important to talk it out also as well. Can you explain what? Psa stands right. Psa stands for prostate specific antigen. So that is what is produced inside the prostate in order for you to help with your reproduction and exciting things that men have and dream about so yes so the. Psa We know. And that's the count and that's how they measure whether or not there is something going wrong. This is a simple blood tests and it's important that all men make a point of getting himself tested whether the doctors happy to do or no insist on getting it done because this is something if you try and catch early. You're more likely to stay alive with it. Do you think that what's the work that you're doing in and around prostate cancer in Bringing bringing the discussion to the table getting people to talk more about it has been helpful to you in dealing with the experience that you went through personally often. I think the help has been absolutely massive and I didn't realize how big an issue this was until I started to be involved in and you know and why it's important to talk is because I'm what I've learned from talking. Is that if it's in your family. Then it's very important that the generations know about issues because my dad. When I had the conversation with my dad when I was diagnosed a turnaround to mainly suggests on. I had that issue five years ago. Oh my goodness mainly reaction. Oh my goodness May. That was angry. Upset couldn't speak to him for nearly six months. I'm sure that. What have you come to any conclusions throughout this about why men aren't very good seeking help or being aware of their bodies? Yeah Yeah I have two issues with that. The problem with men as opposed to women is that we suffer with two things ignorance and silence. You know so if we have this issue. We go into denial. We find every excuse to accept that it's not happening and then on top of that we completely shut down. We just go into silence. Women I mean you know. Women are very very good at snagging. Whatever time or do you WANNA put it. You know when they have something wrong for me as a mechanic. If they got problem with their cars they come in straightaway with men we wait. The car breaks down but it is interesting. Isn't it nothing women as well? We can. Because we whether that's to do with puberty and starting periods right through to pregnancy. I think we're much more used to our bodies changing. There's a lot more. We talk about a lot more I am more proactive. But but this is. What you've been doing is made such a huge and significant difference. This is not gone unnoticed. Has IT I hope you hope our can make a difference but I always used the word we because one person's not going to make this change. I know you say way. There was only one and h s hero. Would do I rec- when I when. I told me that they were GonNa give me this award. As I said to them. I will only accepts award. On behalf of all the people at the going through the battles with prostate cancer older people that we've lost fruit issue and for me really. I wouldn't have accepted of the not because I felt that I was taking it on behalf of all the people that are involved in this campaign as well so it's People's award for me more than his personal. I'M GONNA come back to you personally just for a second. Because there's this this is amazing. Work that you do this fantastic foundation. Clearly this work is helping you. Arrow and looking forward into the future. When you were going through that who did you look to for Support? Was THAT FAMILY FRIENDS. Was there any outside? Organizations will else's out there for for for young men in your situation fortunate people at the melon prostate cancer UK but it's forums forums more and more foreign online forums. Yeah see that's a really common thread that we're to WIG IT and you know. Actually there's a lot of very valuable support you get from other people in the same situation. Your in House mustering came from my wife and family. They realized a long time ago that they were happy to share me with everyone so I wouldn't couldn't and wouldn't have got fru. I've got to now without that help and that network and the treatment that you had has there been any lasting impact on you and your health. Yes there has been lasting impact. My situation is that You know I have probably less than twenty percent. Feeling BELOW MY BELLY BUTTON. Erectile function is probably non existent. Okay right but what? I've learned through modern with this. Is that some people will get a lot more than that. It's how you manage what you have. I mean and housed on a day to day basis. I mean you know. That's you love. Your wife is that that's complicated and difficult. If it only difficult if you sit down and and decide to do nothing about it I may not be. What call you same boat. I can still be Mo Farah because that makes sense so you have to you have to improvise the best way possible. But you can't beat you. You know what you have to do is and that's comes to. Why South the charity I say is because by talking drought? You realize that you're not the only one going through this challenge you know and somebody you know a lot of times. People say things to me that our massive help you know so. I'm learning every day to do and I think he's well particularly with with prostate cancer. An with men and they're reticent to talk about talk about things that there are. I'm sure all lots of lots of medicine. Lots of concerns about. What makes you a man that may be gets in the way of of of of going to the doctor and do does that make sense a great great question and I'm glad to have asked the question because a lot of men told me that raw not go through this because if it means they're gonNA lose erection then more issues with continents? And what would you say to those because it is real? That's a real concern. I've had the question and what I have said very frequently is look if you have a chance of being alive and maybe helping somebody. It could be your children. Your grandchildren isn't that more important. Do you ever worry about it coming back. I do worry about coming back. I don't have a prostate now. So you know if the cancer comes back it would be probably more aggressive somewhere else but my challenges is to save somebody from having to go through the battles the ave to go for every day. That's more challenge so I try to be positive and give give the love to other people. You're a magnificent human being. It's been an absolute pleasure to speak to you. I will thank you so very much. Thank you Dany Bell McMillan Professional. Hello Lovely Lady. It is great to have you back again. What an inspiration errol is. Would you make of his story? Oh absolutely an inspiration. I think For men they're not great at talking of a now. We talked to him about life after cancer. Can you please explain remission versus cancer free? Okay so they are very different things But unfortunately sometimes professionals or public perception intertwine them so when somebody is in remission and you can be impartial remission or complete remission And it's really that remission is really that the Kansas not active partial remission is where maybe you've still got some cancer cells but they're not causing you any problems and complete obviously is the Kansas being held at bay or clear. Tends to come when you've been in remission for period of five years with no active cancer and then your condition may be enough to say you are all clear at that point so it's really important to understand that during this remission period from the moment that you'll cancer treatment stops through those partial remission to clear what are the kind of what does recovery look like You've had this incredible trauma the treatment. Whatever that has looked like for you individually What can period then begin to look like so? It is very different for different people. And we've talked about this. Before different types of cancer and different treatments have different impacts so that makes it very individual but there are common things that people struggle with energy I'm fatigue is a is a big one And that can take some while to actually recede but some people struggle with it long-term anyway. Some people have problems with pain as a result of treatment and unfortunately some people will have long term problems With pain just because of the impact of the type of treatment. They've had on their body. And and pain fatigue can be quite intertwined and then unfortunately have a knock-on effect on your emotional wellbeing. Well I was I was GONNA say because they will talk quite quite openly about the effect that his cancer had On his sex life. How do you maintain your emotional health as well through this other places to go? Is it an again something that you should you should talk about when you go back to see your? Gp OVER YOUR CHECKUPS. I think GPA is a really good starting point. Sometimes people aren't necessarily comfortable with talking openly about things that they find embarrassing would prefer to talk to the GP about two and GP's are Used to talking to people and helping people that have like arrowhead erectile dysfunction after Treatment so certain types of cancer treatment have a physical impact on how your kind of sexual activity happens but also some people have has psychological impact on their body image and so there are lots of different reasons. Why my impact on your sexual health and your sex life which actually has a massive emotional impact and there's there's all the people say that GP can refer counseling you join groups where people who've experienced the same thing and learn how they've overcome some people find that very helpful to once you're in remission you own sort of send out into the big world and let go there will be checkups. What does what what do they look like is that is that a visit to the GP say how you feeling a return to the oncologist for Something a little bit more invasive so that's a really good question because historically people always went back to the hospital for a clinic appointment and then they would have their surveillance tests but things have changed and we recognize that actually for some cancers particularly Kansas that very low risk. Gp's manage and monitor them and so you may just go and have a blood test regularly and the GP let you know the result of that and actually we even have electronic systems now where I can actually look up their own blood results. And there's lots of information that goes alongside that so they know how to interpret them so PSA which is our talks about is one of those where they're in some areas. They have a remote surveillance system that patients themselves have access to for other people is going back to see the specialist on every sort of You'll find it will be three to six monthly the first year and then actually wants your kind of two years with stable disease. You'll have an annual check. So you know the the longer you're in remission so to speak that the less frequently you go but you will always have an annual surveillance tests and that can be a scan a blood test or both whatever is needed all just absolutely overflowing with positively such great guy to be around but he he he has worries that it might come back at so. There are emotional scars that it leaves as well. I think that's what we highlighted is a very common problem and you'll often hear people say once you've had you always have cancer even when you don't have active disease because it's always in the back of your mind and You know when a scan or an appointment coming up people will get more anxious than normal and and that's understandable in reality. You know that fear of the cancer coming back is very genuine and people need to find their own ways of of dealing with that for some people it might leave hypersensitive to any ailment. That might be you know a around Wendy you. When do you know whether it's something serious that you know? It's not just it's not just a cold. It's something you need to go and get checked out as a hard question. No no no but actually There are indications when you've had a particular cancer what the likely recurrent symptoms will be I'm people should be informed of those by their specialists team and the GP should be aware of those as well so You can be more vigilant about those and of course obviously if you have something persists for three to six weeks then you shouldn't hang around really it's always best to get it. Checked out was most. Mina almonds will recede within that time. And it's just you know so if you have a back ache because you've heard you back it shouldn't last for a protracted period Unless you've done some damage but then you would need to seek help anyway but so You know so if you have a back ache and you have had cancer where Secondary Bone cancer risk. Then you should know that if if that back pain persists you should go and seek help. So he should be given information so that you could monitor but equally put get very anxious about every ache or pain A maurienne someday. There are lots of telephone support services now so even the specialist teams the cancer nurse specialists would much prefer somebody just ringing and checking and mortar. Not they can relieve anxiety over the phone. Finally Dany if you're a friend or a relative of someone who was recently in Remission. They can still offer support if there's somebody listening. What's your advice to friends and family? I think I think the biggest advice as to carry on Life with that person you might need to make some adjustments if they're fatigued but tight make big delivered be understanding and still do the things that you enjoy doing together equally some people with cancer CEO. No one more talk about it. You know and I'm struggling with all this. I look okay. It's okay to ask people if they're all you. Okay today you know. Is Everything all right so An most of is normal behavior. So don't be afraid to have the normal conversations that you would you would have and do do the normal things that you like doing with your friend or your family member. Danie thank you so very much and my thanks to Arrow for coming in to tell a story to get more information about what we've talked about in this episode go to our website. Mcmillan DOT ORG dot. Uk forward slash talking cancer. Next time we're talking about dealing with the end of someone's life with Max we're sitting Rhonda hostile bed in Coventry are then one of the start cry and immediately do the same thing that lows Boudin. Sorry Straightway I think as my daddy said no it's gonna be rubbish is so we cry together. Subscribe if he'd like to hear that and every new episode whenever it's ready and if you enjoy the series why not give it a rating or a review? It helps other spun the podcast more easily. I'm an obey talking. Cancer is a cancer support podcast.
How is coronavirus affecting your mental health?
"How is Coronavirus affecting your mental health? Hello, I'm Abby and Welcome to our coronavirus series of talking cancer a podcast from McMillan and Boots where I talked to experts to get answers to the questions. McMillan is hearing most dangerous back, which is great news. McMillan's strategic advisor for treatment daily. Bell will help offer some guidance with managing your mental health. If you're living with or affected by cancer in these strange times, we find ourselves in from recognizing the signs of your struggling if they're starting to feel overly anxious about things if they're mood changes and they're feeling low to guidance to help relieve anxiety. Actually. We live in a really connected world now and lots of people have adapted through lock down to stay connected. Also here's some advice from Carol who is diagnosed with breast cancer at the end of last year a few months later. She doubted that the cancer had spread to her bones and we started her treatment in March this year. I dealt with my anxiety by trying to focus on the things that I could control with MacMillan and we're talking Cancer birth. Deney, welcome back. It's lovely to hear you and see you again. Now like in the last episode. I'm going to time stamp this because we recording on the 25th of September 2020 and all the information we're sharing is correct at the time of recording having it's probably helpful. I need to clarify first off. What do we mean when we talk about mental Hai is quite to be back. So mental health really is our emotional and psychological well-being and it's very linked to our social well-being. It's how we think how we feel and how we act as individuals and if we're struggling emotionally it can actually affect how we respond to stress relate to those around us. And also how we make choices for ourselves. I mean, these are really challenging times for everybody clearly a lot of people and especially the British were very good at putting a brave face on so, how do you recognize when somebody maybe need some help that they're struggling so people can log Recognize that they need help if they're starting to feel overly anxious about things people will recognize that in themselves also if their mood changes and they're feeling low and can't really explain it more of the time than the normal cuz we all have our ups and downs with all the ordinary things that affect our life but this is something a little bit different. So you're overthinking things worrying about things more or less every day and for good portions of the day people may lose their appetite. They may not be sleeping. They may not have any interest in doing the things that they normally really enjoy doing that is kind of part of them as a an individual. It's really important to remember if you're feeling those things that you're not alone at MacMillan. We hear our huge numbers of people looking for emotional support once they have a cancer diagnosis. So, you know, it's really important to know that you can reach out and get some help a cancer diagnosis. Turn your world upside down. Anyway in this set of circumstances in lockdown with restrictions, it's going to be quite difficult to distinguish a normal, you know, a fairly normal reaction to a you know, a real life worrying piece of news. Absolutely and I think I think we need to remember and I think we can probably all relate to it. You know those that we really care about the most we do know them and we often know the off-side out and we often we can tell when something's wrong before they recognize it in themselves and I think I would I would say kind of go with your gut and your heart and your head if you feel that about I loved one that something's not quite right. They're not wanting to communicate they're not answering calls or you know to say that they kind of not eating also if they getting up in in the night and sitting on the sofa with a cup of tea and that's not normal for them. I think there would be subtle changes and and yes, you might think that's linked to a cancer diagnosis birth. I think that the key is if it if it persists perhaps goes on for a prolonged time and and is impacting on every aspect of their life. I think I think you know those closest to you would know that something was fundamentally different to just being upset about a cancer diagnosis and and anxious about what's going to happen and with the additional restrictions, which way are only just this week. We've been told that quite possibly may run until the spring now that's going to have an extra impact on people's anxiety about their their treatment programs do they can go to is their reassurance that you can give to people that have just received a diagnosis that they can go and ask reasonable questions about what happens next to make them feel less anxious about what lies ahead in this strange strange time. I think it's really important when people are having to socially isolate and maybe having some of their interactions with their cancer team. Healthcare Professionals in a virtual way and maybe only going actually into the center for any treatment or they may not be having treatment. They may be having a treatment pause and we know that being isolated really does have a negative effect on people's mental health and that that is an addition really to what they're going through in terms of you know, anxiety with cancer diagnosis and their treatment and the future and then the anxiety of covert and then the anxiety of social isolation and not being able to I mean even that physical contact with people that you you love is really really important. It's human nature isn't it to have a hug if you're a hugger and obviously for people that have been told they've got incurable cancer but might be having treatments to kind of hold the cancer at Bay. I mean the uncertainty must must be tenfold what they normally feel but there is a great deal of support out there now McMillan is receiving a number of calls. Support line for emotional support and I spoke with Rosie and Mark in our last episode about people being told that they have cancer without a friend or a loved one for support. Of course many people who are choosing to continue to hold or reduce their contact with the public that's got to take a huge emotional toll why might people be feeling the impact on their mental health more acutely than ever this year is just so different to how we normally live our lives with the social isolation and not being able to do the things that you would normally do. I mean some of the advice we give people when they're when they're worried is phone no to get out and about talk to friends take up a new hobby. And actually that's slightly more challenging. It's not that you can't do it in your own home. And of course if your if your home treatment people may need to socially isolate before their treatment or surgery if you're on chemotherapy then during that you're going to be your immune system's going to be at risk. So yep. And once that's normal ordinarily people can still find safe ways to get out and about and and do things that they enjoy whereas I think that's harder if you're confined to wash your own home as always McMillan are have fingers and and Avenues in all sorts of places and there is support out there for people who feel like they are struggling mentally. So, where is where the first ports of call De me where can people go for some help or support. There's a great deal of support out there and people can choose the means of support that suits them because we're all different. So for example, some people are very comfortable using support groups or peer support and they can do that in a virtual way. So McMillan have an online community but some of our information and support centers have set up virtual support so they can speak to their cancer team or they can bring our support line and they can find out about those dead. Or they can go on to our website and just see what's available if people are really struggling and they like to speak to someone rather than do something virtual. You know, they can bring our support line. They might be able to tap into some of the services that we've put together like telephone buddies well-being of teachers to help them maintain their physical and emotional well-being. There's some information on our website about virtual physical activity cuz we know that actually remaining active can support emotional well-being they can also talk to you know, they cancel team or their GP if they're really worried about how they're feeling and they will facilitate that in a safe way if they're going through treatment with people that really like digital that's a whole range of apps out there that can support them and we've tried to review some apps and create a Marketplace on our website for apps that can help people that home. For calling emotionally so, you know, I think there's there's a wealth of information there. But what I will say is speak to the speak to their cancer team or their GP or go to a trusted web site. I like the McMillian website or pick up the phone and find the support line and and help us there. You you just mentioned their daily the telephone buddy system which roses much in and I love it. Can you tell us a little bit more about how that works? Yeah. So our telephone buddies are our usual volunteers who obviously can't support people in the way that they they normally do because of a distancing. They're basically at the end of the phone to support people with advice practical needs and just to be a listening ear. I think it's really important that you've kind of just really took office eyes that there is something for the super tech-savvy right through to you know, people who who it's a computer I can't do it because it is important because job Not for a lot of people, you know doing a zoom chat with somebody they've never met before it's not great. You know, it's not a great option for some people and I love the telephone buddy system that you've got to go. I think it's it's really cool. So there's there isn't there's an access point for everybody along the tech scale isn't there there is saying that picking up the phone for the first time when you have decided and made that call that you are struggling a little bit is is a big step, isn't it? What would you say to somebody sitting there going after I don't know am I making a Fast I'd really don't know whether I should do this or not. I would say they've absolutely taken the first step in acknowledging that perhaps they need help. And so maybe the first thing to do is just talk it through with someone that they feel comfortable with whether that's a friend or or their GP or even their their cancer team and just to talk it through and certainly having been a cancer nurse. Nothing is ever too slight for you to listen to them. People often think or why don't want to worry them or this is really silly but it you know, but if it's constantly on your mind the best thing to do is to talk to somebody about it and make that first step then to find out where to get help absolutely. Brilliant as always stay there. Don't move. We're going to be speaking to you shortly. Questions about cancer boots and McMillan are by your side from the moment. You're diagnosed through your treatment and beyond our boots McMillan information pharmacist. So on hand with Specialists support from helping you make sense of your diagnosis to advice about living with cancer. You can find them in your local boots Pharmacy or online via video appointment. Visit boots.com forward slash McMillan for more information subject to pharmacists availability. Hi, I'm Carol. I'm thirty-eight and from Manchester. I was initially diagnosed with primary breast cancer in December 2019. And then with secondary breast cancer in February this year lockdown was massive anxiety inducing so much with outside of of all of our control. So I dealt with my anxiety by trying to focus on the things that I could control like, you know the next few hours. So the next few days, I found it quite helpful to limit my exposure to all the Doom and Gloom in the news. I focused on things that made me happy, you know, like catch up with family and friends virtually like that started learning Italian during the lockdown randomly. I exercised and threw myself into things like campaigning for MacMillan. I also found edit ation really really helped as well. I found that was really helpful in trying to make me focus on the present a bit more and not worry so much about the future. Think you'll agree some really useful advice from Carol. They're the people who are having to sell for isolate daily before treatment or surgery or if someone in your household is showing symptoms of coronavirus, we've heard how lonely this experience can be. I mean, it must be awful. How can people stay connected it is difficult. And actually we lived in a really connected world now and lots of people have adapted through lock down to using FaceTime and WhatsApp to stay connected to friends and family. However, it's still hard if you can't get out and about in the page away and so people might want to explore things in in a virtual way and we've seen lots of things like people doing virtual bingo with their family home or if they love Gardens the National Guard and scheme of got virtual Gardens that people can access its kind of a about finding what you like, but there is a lot their home. Do appreciate that there are some people that are perhaps not adapt at that kind of digital but there will always be someone in their family that is and so rather than feeling originated, you know, sit down with a a family member and and and look at what's there and find things that work for you and we've talked a little bit as well which I'm sure adds another layer of anxiety that due to the pandemic. It's meant for some people that they've they're having to face delays to there from diagnosis right through to where they are on the treatment plans. What guidance can you give to help people off that anxiety? They might be experiencing around those delays. What what a reasonable questions that people are you should be asking I think it's really really important that they any anxiety they have about their treatment that they do to their cancer team and the cancer nurse specialist because they will have all the information about them as a person they're cancer. And so if people are worried about delays to their treatment they need Talk it through and understand what the impact is for them. And if you're not going through active treatment in your worried, you know, then have a conversation with your GP about whether you should be worried because those are the people that have the most information about your health and and what to worry about and what not to worry about them as always a font of knowledge and the voice of support and comfort. Thank you so much lovely to speak to you again for more information on a topics daily, and I have talked about in this episode head to our website McMillan. He's talking cancer the resources advice and support. It's also where you can find out more about donating a million, you know, next episode were talking about work and cancer in the age of coronavirus subscribe. If you'd like to hear that and every new episode whenever it's ready, and if you enjoy the series we'd love it if you could give us a callback. Sing or a review so that others can find the podcast more easily. I'm Emma be talking cancer is a MacMillan cancer support podcast.