18 Episode results for "art institute of Chicago"

LaToya Ruby Frazier: What Is The Human Cost Of Toxic Water And Environmental Racism?

Environment: NPR

14:26 min | Last month

LaToya Ruby Frazier: What Is The Human Cost Of Toxic Water And Environmental Racism?

"Ooh. When I say Flint Michigan, do you think General Motors or do you think bad water the state of Michigan announced more criminal charges today in connection with Flint's lead tainted waters people have flint have died as a result of the decisions made by those responsible to protect the health and safety of Fam-, Flint and water. Those two words are synonymous. Now because flint is the site of probably one of the worst water crises in recent US history in two thousand fourteen. The State Switched Flint's water supply in an effort to save money water from the Flint River came out of people's taps looking brown and smelling like sewage. It left nearly a hundred thousand people without clean water. This is the story of government poisoning, its own citizens, and then lying about it and it brought up a lot of big questions about whether we even have a right to natural resource government officials argue they're not liable because clean water is not a constitutional, right? I want you to imagine you know how you fill mind body and spirit not being able to have comfortable access to water or have a comfortable relationship with drinking water. This is low Toya Ruby Frazier. When we all wake up in the morning, the first thing you're going to do is get in the shower right the second thing to brush your teeth well, imagine what that feels like when you can't do that. The toy is a visual artist and a professor at the School of the Art Institute of Chicago, Much of her work focuses on the lives of working class families in the rust belt? What I arrived in Flint the summer of two, thousand sixteen there were well over twenty nine thousand homes that were impacted nothing. For me the most which is where shake cobb and her mother Miss Renee and her daughter Zion who were eight years old at the time they were living in the midst of this. Shea is also an artist and a school bus driver and the Toya's spent several years with Shay. Her mother renee and her daughter. Zion documenting their lives in flint. Yeah I remember the first time I met. Shea. It was quite beautiful We met at a diner, her favorite diner called Captain Cody's. where she likes to go get buttermilk pancakes at the end of her school bus route in the mornings and upon meeting each other sitting down in the booth just looking at each other felt like a double portrait in a way you know she's in her early thirties. And really diligent hard working artist. And so I felt that it was my responsibility to document and cover what it's been like you know raising her daughter during this ongoing water crisis. For people who maybe don't quite understand exactly what Shays Day to day life was like without having easy access to to water because it's it's not like you could just boil the water in flint rate will the water quality was so bad that she couldn't inhabit her family home at three three Mary Street. When I arrived, she is living in another apartment with her mother and you know the water contamination was so severe that she couldn't brush her teeth. Take a shower, brush your teeth while with contaminated water you can't do either of those two things we get a bottle of water. We waterfall it. You were Steve Spit out you waterfall your bottle and you brushing were. We, don't ingest water. On any level you know one of the standout images in the photo essay is seeing. Shave. Pouring. Water from a plastic water bottle into signs mouth to Gargle with it and I shoot it with a fast shutter speed so that it freezes the water drop just before it touches signs tongue, and you see the toothbrush at the bottom right hand part of the frame. So brushing her teeth what bottled water a having paid bottled water having to cook or not cook at all. Since the water situation I'm discouraged to cook in my house in use my kitchen, we'll go out to eat it. We'll eat on the outskirts of the city we go to a restaurant bought a west to eat a dinner there, and even there you know they were serving. A glasses of water and Would never drink it and she would forbid Zion to drink it. The fly. River, is toxic has been toxic for years be Gomez in Flint River toxic chemicals in ways dumped in the Flint River we drink out the flint river. Swimming in it. We. Don't mess with it. We don't even like the smell of. Hot outside. Don't you could smell the flint river it stinks. WHY WOULD WE DRINK It is twenty twenty. This started six years ago Flint might not be headline news any longer but the water crisis is still going on. We can't forget about the men, the women and children and the families in Flint. In a minute Latorre Ruby, frazier on why Flint's water crisis felt personal? On the show today restoring our relationship with water. I'm a new Marone and you're listening to the Ted Radio Hour from NPR. It's the Ted Radio Hour from NPR, I'm a new karate and we were just hearing from artist Luke, Toya Ruby Frazier who spent several years. In the life of a black working class family in Flint Michigan and their relationship to water. How has documenting life in flint spending timely shea, and her daughter changed your relationship would you say to water? Yeah for me it certainly makes me hyper aware of water if it's not necessary for me to take a long shower. I won't do it. I don't leave the water running when I'm brushing my teeth when I go to places I do not drink from the TAP. So. It really has made me hyper aware. But I grew up being worried about the environment. So this wasn't new to me. The Toy Ruby Frazier picks up her story from the Ted Stage. It was natural for me to go to flint because industrial pollution bacteria contaminate water all too familiar from me growing up and my hometown brought up Pennsylvania where my mother and I battled environmental racism healthcare inequity and chemical emissions that were being deregulated and released from the United States Still Corporation. From the Naga he'll river to the flint reverse in the words of W E B do boys. The town the whole valley has turned. It's back upon the river. It is used as a sewer as a drain as a place for throwing their waste. What I saw Shades Zion and Miss Renee going through is exactly what I went through. What my mother and grandmother went through in our hometown in Braddock Pennsylvania, our water was contaminated with bacteria and they never told us I was enraged and I was horrified and traumatized because I was reliving my childhood by looking at what was happening in the flint water crisis. This is personal this political. I'm not about to let it happen again to eight year old girl who is Innocent Zion is innocent. She has yet to begin to dream dreams and aspire to be what she wants. She wants to be an actress. So it became expedient to make these human documents of what her and her mother were going through. So when she becomes an adult when she becomes my age, she can look back at this history and realize not only is she survivor she's a victor. She's a champion and no matter how much this country under it's capitalism it's patriarchy it's hatred of black women no matter what she overcame that and she will continue to move forward and now she'll have a human document archive of how she survived this moment in her life. But you didn't just take photos of Sha-. I should point out that the audio that we've been hearing of. Shea you you recorded that with her two. That's right. I decided in order not to lose her voice. That I needed to take those photographs, print them out, sit down with her at her dining room table and have her speak about what those images mean to her and that's where it turns. The lead a minute video and it opens which shays poem that she wrote called no filter. ooh. Will you think about water you don't consider government. in fact, you don't consider people at all. Even though we built plants in machines to Elkin Nuys in purify when you think about it. You only in your most remote mind if they're all. Think about God something. Nature intended. Think about water you don't. Consider poison. 'cause poison is something you consider for yourself. You don't think about murder. So when you think about water. You never considered self destruction, and even though these considerations are not to be had, it is the reason I am becoming the tin man stiff hollow in heartless because that's the destiny of a dry body clanking tap dances and emotional breakdowns because the tears is the closest to lubrication that you'll get without the oil can would just sitting singin let my people go another Freedom Song the echoes the Oh feels been long gone but we remember room we think about the bags that harvested. Our Future Irrigation and we consider only messes plantations and how keeping them in one place without fair law and fair play just mix for good old fashioned American life and I'm pointing the finger because I read them inconvenience lettuce and I read them notices and before I, even ever paid the bill I was still treated like a bottom feeder like my taxes don't contribute to their vacations in secret sanctions I was treated like I ain't American because when you think about water, you think about. And you line it up the Willie Lich and you place that name Snyder's face to. Face only the WATCHOS self hang. What would I do if I taste God? What would I do? If wasn't served by steel rod what would I do if my baby was going to be safe and sound? What would I do if disease plague in my town? What would I do if I could feel water trickle down my spine drying me out? What would I do if a self destruct in? What would I do if I? Feel. You've always described your work as art. You have been really clear that it is not photo journalism even though you're documenting the lives of people living in a crisis. Yeah. I stay clear of journalism because the method and the approach to how I make my work can't be journalism because it actually is a violation of all the ethics of objective journalism. I am highly influenced by nineteen thirty social documentary work, which we would all know the Margaret Mother which is the most famous portrait during the Great Depression era in the nineteen thirties in the united. States, of the photograph was of a woman in by a woman and both women were silence. So I'm very invested in you know who gets to author the image who gets to offer the story, and who are those images then used for to redistribute power and equity. Why artists play a very important role in American Society It is our job. It is our obligation and duty to hold the mirror up to. Our fellow citizens. Holding a mirror up to the country about its corruption about how it falls short under capitalism and government neglect to provide for community that it clearly has abandoned and I think this is a very important detail because that's what Ralph Ellison and Gordon Parks of did in their series for Allison's book invisible man and so I'm also updating this long legacy and history of black photographers and koets coming together to tell a humane story because outside media doesn't see our humanity enough and we can't trust them to do for us. So we'll do it ourselves. That's Latoya Ruby Frazier. Artist and a professor at the School of the Art Institute of Chicago Her Book Flint is family in three acts comes out next year you can hear her full talk at Ted Dot Com.

Flint Flint River Flint Toya Ruby Frazier Flint Flint Flint Michigan Shea Miss Renee US Shay Zion professor School of the Art Institute of TAP Michigan Latoya Ruby Frazier General Motors frazier cobb
Which is cooler, zero or infinity?

Tai Asks Why

18:35 min | Last month

Which is cooler, zero or infinity?

"I want you to try to imagine a box of nothing. You can't really write because a box would be containing something. What if it's containing something there's not containing nothing. Okay now try to imagine a box of infinity like Everything. And you also can't. Really. Because just Kinda goes on and on and you can contain it if it keeps going. Right. What's up with that? Hi. There I'm. This is my podcast tasks asks why there are so many. Great questions. To get answers questions like. Do you trust your. What happens after you die? On we train. was. Long. How are we gonNA fix climate change. and which one is cooler. Zero. Or. Infinity. Numbers of always meant a lot to me. My first language might have actress been math. When I was young and I still really didn't understand English that well, I knew what a talk but it was still trying to grasp ahold of many concepts of English, but math is just like. Is there. Although I could understand the math at a role level, I couldn't really express it, and apparently it always came out as jumbling confusing and I don't really fully remember how I would express myself. But my dad does mom and I called it made up math because what you would do is that you would quiz me or mom with a math question that you would come up with but since he didn't know add or multiply divide that well. Yet you would just make up words. You'd say something like Hey Dad, what's eleven tiddly fifty nine and I would have no idea because you're the only person who would know what the answer was. You remember that yeah. I remember asking about some sort of like a pancake. Sure you like Thai I have no idea how to do a pancake night like explain it to you. Yeah. I, think even explaining math to me for a long time. Since the Simpler Times of the pancake functions I spent a lot of time reading old secondhand textbooks from this old bookseller in our neighborhood that would absorb more knowledge be like a sponge sir. there. Are numbers that can be put into fractions numbers that can't be put into fractions interest go on forever you know the Sequence right wobbles will be two to three goals five through the length of your belly button to your feet to your head. The ratio of that equals the Golden. Ratio. And then the numbers that we just can't comprehend like zero and infinity. They're both kind of just like the. Ultimate mind boggling what happens if I pit their cruel nece against each other, which was more important more expensive. The mind blow up factor best and kind of only people that I would really talk about it would be none other than mathematician. Hi Do I have both of you you have me. Hi. Okay so on the phone right now, I was able to call up James Grind and Eugenie Chin. There are both super awesome math people who do a lot of thinking about the importance of these numbers I give lots of talks around the world and people might see me on Youtube Channel could number file. Now Eugenia is the scientist in residence. At the School of the Art Institute of Chicago, which is pretty cool and I've written several books and the second one was cooled beyond infinity. I have that book actually. Oh, I'm so glad to hear this is the crazy super debate about coolness of zero versus infinity. James. Can explain to me what zero even is as a mathematical concept. Okay so on one hand zero is a number. As, like the other numbers one, two, three, four, five, two, nine. Zero Times one is zero. Zero. Times two is zero but also that means that it just come. You come sit out Zeros. I'm have one goes to well no, we can't. So we do have to treat zero slightly differently from the other numbers. It's a number that represents nothing. Both of them of an abstract ideas in ways, but that's what matters about. Mathis about going to the abstract to solve problems. Because like even if we just have the drawing of the number one that doesn't mean, it's one that's our interpretation are symbol to represent the concept you could point out one sheep, one, cow, one coin but one of those things have in common is this idea of oneness that they have in common, which is not something you can point at, but is something they all share? When you try and teach small child how to count You keep showing them objects in going one, two, three, one, two three but they have to make a leap inside their head from the objects in front of them to this concept of as James says one nurse. And you can't do it for them. You can't point that's it. You can't see you can't touch it. You can't feel it. You can't eat it and so you just have to do it in your head. It's weird because it's it's there. But at the same time, it's not there. That's how I think of maths. It's kind of it's definitely there in my head, but it's also not fair because it's just in my head the shame applies to zero you can't really point at. Zero is the harder idea. It's harder than one, two, three, one sheep and one cow have something in common but zero sheep zero cows almost have more in common somehow at least to me, it's much easier to get zero sheep and zero cows. I've got them right in front of me. Now what about infinity? You can't go up to your kid like look this is one cow this is no cows. This is everything. Infinite. Yeah. Unfortunately, we don't even have infinite cows on the entire planet so we couldn't even try to assemble infinite cows and it's so it's really something that happens inside your brain but something that you can show to any child and they've probably understood it themselves is that if you eat half of your chocolate cake, then you have Hof left and then if you eat half of what's left, then still some left and if you eat half of what's left there, still some left. If you keep eating Hof of your remaining chocolate cake, you can take an infinite number of bites of chocolate cake and there will still be some left. I have the best producers in the world and they actually brought me a cake God this. Oh, awesome on the traffic cut infinitely and see if it goes to zero. Okay. Here we go. So I'm cutting the cake. Eaten at times? Dom. Yep. We'll just keep eating whenever you. Half again, make the third. Sky The sixteenth. Through I could keep calling it forever and ever and ever ever. Ever ever. Anyway. Back to the question at hand. Is a lot less flashier than infinity is something. That, you would use in everyday life actually came from merchants and traders and accountant rather then they sort of intellectuals studying Matt's but then again, infinity turns out to be practical as well, and it also turns out to be everywhere through the field of calculus, which is a piece of mathematics that really governs everything that changes continuously I'm that means practically. Everything in the modern world including things like well `electricity and that's how infinity can be thought of as very practical as well as having mind-bending and weird properties way you can play around and create strange pistes and strange universes in which peculiar and amazing things happen. Yeah. Infinity is the one that's the strangest I mean strange paradoxes the I can't understand. One. Example of those paradoxes that cake conundrum which explained in the cake break and another one is Hilbert's hotel. That was proposed by the mathematician Hilbert's where he said let's imagine we have a hotel with an infinite number of rooms. Now Hubert's hotels confusing for bear with me. matchy of a really big hotel. Now, this hotel infinite roofs. and. Let's say that one man walks in one night and says, Hey, on the book room, you know you can't send him. To the infant floor that doesn't really seem fair. You know because you still have to walk all that way. So. You sent him to room one and send the person on route one term deal. Then send the person on route to to room three and keep going. So instead of this one guy after travel. So incredibly infinitely far everyone just travels wants. which works out such a small number, but it eventually converges into infinity. And that's quite odd because in a normal finite hotel. If it's full, you can't just fit in other guests dune without asking them to share room which they probably wouldn't want to do. Yes my head hurts. We're all getting clever. Now, James, what do you think of what you genius saying and why do you think Zeros Cooler Think, we're going to find that these two ideas are going to be very connected because they are related ideas. One being nothing won't being everything, but without zero, you wouldn't have any of modern mathematics today the reason zero. So important is because without it you wouldn't have a place value system. So in the old times when you wanted to count thirteen sheep or something like that, you would have to make a mark for each sheep. So you have make thirteen marks you can count them what the Egyptians and the Babylonians did is they started using news to represent lodging numbers. So now if you want to count thirteen, you can just use. A one and a three. So now you need zero in here because what is the difference between thirty two and three hundred to? Well, you need that space in the middle in the old times that would be actually a space. It was any later that zero recognized as a number. But with place value system, you can do the whole of mathematics today. Oh Man. If it wasn't for the concept of the numbers zero, we would still have to use the talents just be no the one where it's like one, two, three, four, and then five is the horizontal line. That won't be pretty bad. It's like that boat will cost thirteen, thousand dollars one, two, three, four, I agree with James Zero is really important and possibly even more important than infinity because more maths depends on zero. Really. But just because something's important I personally don't necessarily think it's cool. There are plenty of things in life that are really important without being cool to me at all like, for example, sleep which I find pretty boring but I recognize that it's very, very important. Hey funeral learn more about the importance of sleep. To check. My upset. About. Dreams. Not. Everybody has to understand in order for it to do its thing in the world around us. If, we didn't have access to an infinite number of numbers, then we get into trouble. Because we'd have to stop somewhere and if you stop somewhere then everything would implode backward. Oh No. At is kind was a weird idea, but it turned out to be the more practical. I'll computers the Internet with just using Zeros and ones you can send any number or any message around the world. It's still is a pretty weird idea. Things seem weird I get to seem less would the more time you spend with them? I like things when they make my mind, bend? If I feel like my brain is kind of exploding out of my skull then I feel like I'm making some progress and that's why I really personally find infinity. Cool because they're mind-bending things like that. Maybe one plus infinity is actually different from infinity plus one a maybe there actually different sizes of infinity so that there's the smallest infinity but then there's a big infinity and then there's an even bigger infinity and you can keep going like that infinitely so that there are infinitely many bigger and bigger infinity's Baugh does just. Exploding. Those sorts of weird things all why I really love maths because it's a place where I can explore things don't really happen in the real world. The real world is very important and it's where we live our lives I really like the world of ideas. It doesn't matter which ones cooler. They're both so interesting. So elaborate, they're different and they're beautiful math is messy but yet in its message is a beautiful elegance math. Really is able to take you away. That's what I love about it. Mawlid Dr Desert House. Walks. In my own. Head. From this earth. Stretching of. ood. Passing defended bosses. Through the sliding glass door. Get, my infinite key car. It's four. Finished floor. I'm must be. What's thirteen pancake five with the flip over of six, eighty four. Thai? Yeah. To the question. Sure. Thank you so much for listening. I'm type the show was produced by Veronica Simmons and Yasmin Return. Our digital producers Livia Pasquarelli. Guests were Dr James Grime and Dr Cina Chang. You guys are awesome. Thanks to crystal do him for the editorial assistance the theme music is by the legendary Johnny Spence an also thanks to drive me writer record the Infinity Song. Next time on tasks Y. climate chain. Do, you ever lose hope. Yes TILL NEXT AREN'T. KEEP BASKING WHY Support. For tracks from the corporation for public broadcasting. This is tracks from P. R.. X..

Dr James Grime James Zero Hof Hilbert Youtube School of the Art Institute of James Grind Livia Pasquarelli Mathis Eugenia Johnny Spence Dr Desert House Hubert scientist accountant Veronica Simmons Baugh writer Matt
#969 - Art Student Turns Creative Process Into Thriving Business

Side Hustle School

10:25 min | 1 year ago

#969 - Art Student Turns Creative Process Into Thriving Business

"School is brought to you by emotion hosting the same service i use for several of my websites sooner or later your hustle is going to need a website and you'll need reliable web host after trying a lot of different companies doing a lot of different things over the years i now use emotion and they have an amazing deal for a limited time. You can get a complete hosted account with with everything you need. Starting at three dollars and ninety nine cents a month again starting at just three dollars and ninety nine cents a month. Check it out of school dot com slash website. That's side-hustle russell school. Dot com slash website <music> talk today about something important walking to school crisco about that's something important is the fact that mental health affects your whole life. They want it to or not. What i mean is. You can't say well. I struggle with an anxiety disorder but not during my work day or i have panic attacks but i just go to the bathroom and hide for a while minutes okay. The thing is if you don't deal with the root problem. You'll always be fixing situational issues that don't end up bringing you real resolution. Why am i talking about this as well as i said it's important but also i really appreciate it. The person in today's story being open about her process so it doesn't relate this person was chicago art student who discovered a love of natural dyes and went on to create a thriving business so we're going to talk about her business. Of course she turns this creative process into this business. She's she's doing really well and she was able to go full time with it but also along the way she encountered some challenges some issues with anxiety and depression which i mentioned from time to time on the program is something that i deal with and in her case she said it took a long time but i finally got the help i need it and if i were to do anything differently i would seek out help sooner i am so much stronger and decisive iso- because of it all right so as i said mental health effects your whole life whether you want it to or not so if you're having any kind of struggle it's important to get help. I've done that myself and i also wish i'd done it sooner. In addition to helping my life in general it's also helped my business just being able to focus more on wellness to take care of myself so without further ado upbringing that story of an introverted chicago art student who creates a thriving business right after the shot out to our sponsor stay tuned sottile school is brought to this week by our longtime partnership station. What's up ship station. We appreciate you guys looking out for us and for many of our listeners and listeners when you're selling something online getting your orders out can be a real pain time consuming expensive. Somebody carriers to choose from. How do you know you're making the best choice. That's why you need ship station dot com the fastest easiest and most affordable way to manage and ship your orders right now. Our listeners can try ship station pre for sixty days when you use promo code hustle sixty days. There's absolutely no risk you can start your free trial without even entering your credit card info visit ship station dot com click the microphone at the top of the homepage anti hyphen hustle. That's ship station dot com and enter promo code hustle ship ship station dot com make ship happened a while attending the school of the art institute of chicago lydia cresco to a class on natural dyes picking. It would add a skill to her portfolio little chino. It would become her specialty. The first time lydia experienced die process her hands understood just how to use it felt like an extension of herself and our interest increased even more once. She learned the chemistry behind the art. Lydia kept playing with di formulas in her spare time and made many silk scarves in the process for school had a studio sale so lee decide to try selling your scarves to make a little money to put back into her art. Though scarfs sold out lydia realize might have something here and started a brand called armagh and defiance why that name well. It may have been destiny. Lydia worked with dies because her name literally means maker of purple cloth. When she was learning about making dies she tended to produce purple. Purple is considered difficult to formulate malate. This led her to the hebrew word argument which refers to the color range crimson or purple and defiance is the name of the town where she visited her grandparents and developed her law of nature. Let graduated during a time when there weren't many jobs. She settled on working in a gallery not a dream job. It helped pay the bills during during this time. Lydia told her then boyfriend now husband that she desperately needed to keep working with those dies soon. After she came home one evening to find all their bedroom furniture moved into the living room. He had converted their only bedroom into her own art studio. So lydia immediately got to work. She received a grant of fifteen hundred dollars to help her continue in her artistic growth growth and she used those funds for started costs. She bought a domain name set up. A website continued her textile education in order to grow argument and defiance she applied to be in many pop up markets. At first she was rejected but she kept applying and was eventually accepted to the does mark in chicago where her scarves sold out once again lydia then began selling wholesale two boutiques across the country she traveled to sell it markets in cities wherever she thought people would buy our products and she stayed an extra day to make contact with local boutiques these efforts letter to her first profitable year and now argument in defiance in sixty peaks across the u._s. and canada but let's not get ahead of ourselves because all this time she was working that regular job at a gallery one day she learned that the building the gallery was in was being foreclosed on she believed that if she didn't panic and instead pushed a little harder she could turn her brand into her full time job or closure takes awhile so lydia us the time to expand their product line increase sales else after her job ended she was able to go all in with armagh and defiance so as i alluded to in the beginning. Let's look at some challenges that are a bit different than what we normally normally consider as the only employees in the business. Lydia is responsible for decisions. If something needs improvement she is the only one who can see the issue and figure out how to solve it and miss can be overwhelming it comes with some freedom of course but it can also be overwhelming and as the business was taking off also struggling with depression anxiety. She knew if she was going to continue to be successful assessable and keep going she would need to get help dealing with some past emotional trauma so she got that help. She began seeing a therapist and gained some coping skills as well as some insight into yourself and here's something else being an introvert which by the way i am too as well shut outdoor introverts out there. Lydia originally thought working on her own ideal situation asian but she began to notice that after attending chicago meet ups with other artisan entrepreneurs she felt energized for the coming days and as she puts it there is so much failure our decision making an isolation and entrepreneurship. It was nice to see other women and hear their stories of success and failure helped me understand that i'm not alone and what i do. It's worthwhile to years ago moved with her husband to saint louis where argument in defiance is now housed in the local arts center there. She's able to connect with the other artisans every day et. She still gets plenty of time but also finds that our mental health is much better. Working alongside brent's one of the newer products. She's known for his a cozy sweatshirt with a modern tie-dye effect. Lydia cuts sows and dies each piece by hand in the winter of two thousand nineteen her cozy sweatshirts sold so well that she couldn't keep them in stock and she's now worked with brands including target west. Elm urban outfitters last year argument and defines grossed seventy nine thousand dollars with a profit of thirty five thousand dollars. What are your plans to continue making cozy apparel and sharing her art. Your local workshops also because it's her fulltime job. She started a new side hustle writing essays about the creative process and so as a business note. I i love her website the website for argument and defines. It's just a stellar example. I think for anyone doing being textiles or or really any kind of commerce but textiles clothing etc in particular. She's got a great about section. She's got great section highlighting press. She's got a little how to wear videos in case you're like. I want to buy this cape or this big scarf. It looks really cool. But how do you actually wear it. There's a video that shows you how to do it. She's got a sale section action for items that that had some kind of minor problem or blemish with them and she's got a wholesale section where you can log in if you have an approved account to purchase wholesale so so i just think this is the kind of thing that can really take off further and it's great that she was able to gross eighty thousand dollars worth it last year but i think i can probably be a lot more so maybe in the future. We'll get an update from her about that also just getting back to this point of seeking help you know at the at the beginning. I share this quote of hers. It took a long time but i finally got the help help. I need it. If i were to do anything differently seek out help sooner. I'm stronger more decisive because of it so same situation for me also something else she said. Is you ask for help. If you need it the miskin kinda help right. It's not necessarily just these issues that i'm talking about. She said there's no shame and asking for help. I don't care if it's emotional health financial or just someone to put a price tag on your items before an event. This is not a sprint so make sure you're not running yourself into the crowds. Thank you so much. I appreciate you being so transparent with our listeners hope that many of them will come and check out your shop online and perhaps locally for those in the greater saint louis area okay friends listeners. Thank you so much as well hope you enjoyed it. Inspiration is good but inspiration with action is so much better. I really enjoy making the show for you. I feel very grateful for the chance to do it every day. Come check out those show notes at school. Dot com slash nine six nine. Another story is coming up tomorrow and i hope you'll join me once again sure to subscribe to tell your friends. It's completely free. My name is christina about and this is exciting <music> <music> from the project.

lydia cresco chicago depression side-hustle russell school art institute of chicago chino saint louis saint louis brent lee canada armagh three dollars sixty days seventy nine thousand dollars thirty five thousand dollars eighty thousand dollars fifteen hundred dollars
Episode 311: Jerry Saltz, art critic at "New York"

Longform Podcast

59:08 min | 9 months ago

Episode 311: Jerry Saltz, art critic at "New York"

"Hello and welcome to the long-form podcast. I am your co host Aaron. Lamour we are really we running some of our favorite episodes over the break. This one is with me and the art critic Jerry Saltz hope you enjoy it It's brought to you you as always by mail chimp. They make this show possible they make it possible for us to play it again enjoy. We'll be back soon. Welcome Jerry Saltz thank you. We're here in the lovely offices of New York magazine which has assertive cryptic hieroglyphic of what appears to me. Javascript instructions. Are you able to decipher this. I have no idea but it tells you that. New York magazine is cracked the way to get to the future some We were actually just discussing The you have listened to the show and in fact your own boss at a mosque has been on the show. It actually struck me that you've been doing this for long enough when you get hired for a job like this does an editor say this is what we want out of you or are you just on your own trajectory actor at this point right. When I was interviewed in two thousand seven by New York magazine I was then that senior art art critic for the village voice which I loved? I've been that for ten years and I had been a long distance truck driver which we can talk about. Yeah I have no education no degrees. No nothing and I got plucked lucky out of when I was was forty something years old. I hadn't started writing till I was forty but that's backing up too far. Well I'm up to backup that far. Well what led you to become a truck driver. I wanted to be an artist. Yeah I graduated about last I in my big big big suburban Chicago High School Oak Park River Forest Illinois. It was the late sixties. Is You have to understand. I'm sixty seven now and there was no art in my life whatsoever. My suburb none. So it's not like I had any serious grounding. Certain things had happened with. Maybe we can talk about sort of primal experiences us but I graduated high school with no idea of going to school. Never even occurred to me realize terrible student never did thing never never never never. And then somehow I started going to the Art Institute of Chicago for about a year or two. But of course repeated the dump pattern I I never went to classes I would go to protest marches and eventually I started an artist run art gallery in Chicago. Nineteen in seventy three called name gallery. It's because we couldn't think of a name and our idea was to show other artists and then we would get the show once every two years or so and I loved doing. I can't tell you how much I love doing it. I loved sort of having a sense control of building in our world of meeting artist of cure rating shows and music platforms at the time in Chicago. I saw any famous blues men or jazz musician you can name any any and tiny rooms with nobody. Yeah they're absolutely nobody and then we would pay them like one hundred fifty dollars also then to perform in this dumb gallery of what was what it was dumb about the gallery well. I didn't think it was wrong. But it wasn't dumb. Frankly I thought cutters pretty fucking great. Yeah and fun and at the time I worked in galleries I had all sorts of jobs. I was a a big fuck up the whole time. I've been fired a lot and I was making art and I started showing my work at name and had two shows there and they both were kind of successful. People bought my work. I got what's called the National Endowment Dowman for the arts grant a massive grant of two thousand dollars that I took and moved to New York City with I started showing being in a gallery there. got into the drawers of the nascent Barbara Gladstone. Gallery here in New York. And she's now a god goddess this of the galleries at the time she wasn't but nevertheless so you know I thought Oh. Gee I guess I'm going to be artists. This is great and then I got here and slowly. The demon started speaking to me. They speak to us. They speak to anybody telling me I couldn't do what I said I was and I began to listen and slowly stopped. Making art is very painful. Being in New York was is hard of course trying to make a living. I eventually became a local truck driver of art. Mind you not of steel. I am Jewish and then that long story short I stopped making art entirely it hurt. It really hurt. I was eaten alive by envy. I could not walk down the streets of New York without looking at every apartment every loft and go you mother fuckers. I that should be mine. I mean I was like nuts I was like self entitled South. Feeling sorry for myself at all times uh-huh and furious with the world. Everybody you know the art world. Everybody and I kind of absented. My seven became a long distance truck carver for many years. Actually and in the trucks is where I was so lonely and so fucking depressed that I thought well I love art. I've got to be in the art world and I started thinking. Well maybe I could be art critic. That must be easy right. You wrote about this experience of giving up in New York a couple years ago this year wasn't that long ago last year. Life is a failed artist and in reading back through that story and in hearing you tell it there the thing that struck me both times James was that you didn't really talk very much about what the art was that you are making Like before that doubt eight you inside. What did the flip side of that feeling like like? What did it feel like when you were an artist an optimistic and believed in yourself and what was it that you believe that you should do? Rats that's a great question because who makes me feel good again because the kind of the quietude the condom internal space of that of standing funding in my case and Listening to music and just being in the flow of making art all day in that sense of the smell smell of the materials the sound of watching something form. I was on a twenty five year project to illustrate. Dante's this divine comedy. I've going to make one hundred works of art for each of the one hundred cantos of Dante's divine in comedy and my thought was I would travel through hell with Dante through purgatory and finally in the year two thousand. I began the project January. First Nineteen seventy five and I was finished on the last day of nine thousand nine hundred ninety nine. Why Two K.? And I made it to Canto Santos three before the real demons in hell. I didn't know that I had invented a project where I would confront what was already there there of course but it felt so great to be an artist. I loved every second except I hate it. I was tortured to did That perception that this was not for you or your work didn't compare come from seeing the work of other people or did it come from inside you. I would say frankly came from inside me because I was getting confirmation in my very small pond and the National Endowment and this interest and the so-called Salesperson. I was reviewed in Art Forum magazine. which then as now house kind of the HIP hipster magazine so from the outside things look pretty good from the inside? They weren't pretty good. We're pretty pretty bad very bad and I just thought I don't know what I thought I just didn't think it was real and it was easier not to work Frankley then to be brave to man up or woman up or grow a pair of whatever it was easier to this day. I think for all people who make things it's easier if more tortuous not to do the God damn thing then and do it to this day. I wake up early and I have to get to my desk to write almost immediately. I mean fast before the demons get me. I've got to get writing and then once I've written almost anything up pretty much right all day. I don't leave my desk. I have no other life. I'm not part of the world except when I go to see shows and and my second self it seems online. Online is quite gregarious. So my second south is having a ball a few times a day but So I quit and it came from the inside the messages I believed were from the inside and I'm I always towel artist. You know you've got to make an enemy of envy. You can't look around yourself and think everybody's got more money better. Education Taller Smarter knows their history is married. Well all of that may be true but you gotta get on with it or get out. The Art World is an all volunteer all anterior army. If you don't WanNa be here there's the door and I unfortunately walked out and it was the right decision in the end but it hurts to this day. It sounds like you wake up and go right for that and write all day that you did find something for which it wasn't easier to not do it like it. Seems like you found the experience that you wanted from art in some way. Yeah I think NCUA right and I think that's very perceptive. What I needed that? I guess I wasn't getting from art at something a little bit more perform. Frankly yeah where my wife Roberta Smith. Who's my favorite art critic she's The CO chief art critic for the New York Times News has said that to write weekly the way that she does. I do only a handful of people do is to perform live on on stage and for me. I got to perform live every night. I am on the road as it were. And in a Sicko way. I'm like Bruce Springsteen Steve. My concerts are three hours long. I will not stop until is there anybody alive there. If I had and killed the entire audience I'll keep going an art. Didn't have that. That's a studio practice to private thing without feedback in real time from a real audience to watch and feel the reaction beyond the streets of New York and people stopped me and go you really. We got that wrong or you got it right or artists contacting me. All of that I realized is what I needed. And I didn't know I wanted. And it might explain my second south my online self which is so so interactive in my real life. My my friends will tell you. I haven't gone to a sit down dinner and decades. I can't do it I'm incapable. I'm not socially well adjusted. You and I would be seated next to each other. You're massively successful. You got this great podcasts. He he can't take it. He's starting to Demur. And we would start talking walking and within three seconds I would say to you so what shows have you seen meaning are chosen. You'd go. None and I would would look forward to not really speak again for the rest of the dinner. I have no other interests. I'm so boring and I'm not GonNa ruin the dinner with trump you know. And if if you're not a Yankee or giants fan and so I don't know where I've come from but I I. This is my whole life. The writing the performing live live is the real mean now. Even if it's no good there's very few like when I think of like my artistic interests what are we call them now. The Fine Arts visual arts gallery are just call mark sorry arts I know a lot more about music and he lovie sure art because those were the things that I was interested in when I was a teenager and as the Internet made being a complete est more valuable to someone who's listening to music music. WHO's interested in older movies? There was no parallel education in art that I received I did however Acquire a certain certain number of United Airlines Miles which caused me to start Getting a MAG for miles promotion which caused me to subscribe to New York magazine for Free at some point shortly after graduating from college. Which means that? I've been reading your writing New York magazine for a period of years wall. Not Going to very many gallery shows so when I think of what's happening out there you're experiencing. I am actually seeing it through your Lens. My very impression of what's happening in art I would say is like twenty five percent from your writing. It's like twenty five percent from your writing twenty twenty five percent from going to museums in Europe when I'm traveling and maybe fifty percent from just weird things that I've crossed paths. That's with an unpredictable ways and artisan timothy dating now all the awful painful real content turned to money money money. Most people look at art and they see something disgusting I to see that disgusting thing. I like that. My I've oyster could be one voice that people read in that. I wanted to be accessible. Open not intimidating Timothy. Dating when you read me I want you to be able to get from the top to the bottom a and B. I want you to be able to understand what I've said and not feel like I've Saturd- done anything that you yourself could not kind of put together by looking again. I have no art history no degrees I am making this up as I go just like everyone is. I don't know what I'm doing but I know how to do it. I think everyone has then a common. I think every great artist frankly is self taught and I'm four people going went to school. I am not here on a podcast thing. You kids. Stay out of school if you can go to school that you don't crew gigantic debt do it. I might be envious. Batik view can get to one of those good schools. But that's what I want my writing to be and then I want you to be motivated evaded to may be stark onto the galleries. You go willy seems to go to these galleries. I'll try to go and then not be afraid because the people behind behind the desks at galleries are exactly like you. The poor. They're incredibly poor. Dave graduated they oh fortune they have have two jobs. They're being paid nothing and they love art. The way you love what you love. There's no difference in yet. People walking the galleries and that you wouldn't believe how cruel they are to the people that work in them. I loved those people my wife and I think of them as people were trying to train the next generation of gala wrists and I love gowers galleries are where new are comes from. And and that's an important part of the system in that part of the system is really under attack. There's a certain kind of a writer a who say even within like sports. I Follow Sports Fan. I guess you know people would say if you read like a bill. Simmons who's a sports podcast are like half of the time he's talking about the NBA as a corporate entity in attendance in Business S.. WHO's GonNa move who where who's going to buy what team there's a tendency and I think the art world is as much like this as anything that you could probably spend all your time just writing about art is business About the people who are getting screwed at the bottom of the galleries and the big art fairs ars and this and how the business is changing all the sort of underhanded ways that things really work how the sausage is made. But I would think that if you wrote primarily early about that it would be hard to write about loving art in the same way that you just described the people as a vessel or being able to have it in the world so I'm wondering for you like how does all that stuff interact like how to use. How do you know whether it's more important to write about? What's on the walls or the lease the building and the really good question? First of all I want people to understand I've written many times did about ninety nine point nine nine nine nine percent of artists. Don't make money and the art world has become obsessed with the zero point. Zero one percent does make money. I too am obsessed with those people when Jeff Koons the famous American artists has a show. I go batch it like is it good it is bad. He's making three million dollars off this ball bowl it's at Larry Gagosian all of that becomes content for the work and I think it's valid content but I want people to always if it's possible to see that content tent and then stop seeing it and see the art scene that content see the prices. See The white box that that it's being delivered in and the like death star energy that might be coming from it except all that judge it as you will all and then put that aside for a second if you can or keep using it and then look at the art and see what do I think of this art. Why why what to doing successfully? How's it new house? It repetitious. How does it use materials? How does it use everything? And then when you walk out you haven't I mean just been an internal a whole of like going if I ever see another gallery this big and this rich. I'm going to shoot somebody. MM Buddy right. You're supposed to be thinking that part of it even the rich gallery. I think that they all will tell you that about each other. It's getting tough off and let alone the middle and the bottom in any event art is doing just fine. I'm not in the least worried hard. I tried to post like ten fifteen unknown artists like a night on my idiot. INSTAGRAM which you should follow at Jerry. Assaults are kind of salon refuse outs. Where all this workers in play you may not like all of it? I I don't like all of it but take a look at it and there's a lot of optical information that's quite interesting that isn't always it's the same fifty five artists written by the same fifty five academics whose work you never understand. Who's right about art in such a way that it sort of bulletproof you don't even know what their opinion is which I can't stand? I Love Art Form Magazine. I can't say say that I've ever understood much of what's in it but it seems very important to me not in a bad way. I mean this with no irony any but there are many are roles art contains multitudes criticism contains multitudes people do not have to be talking about the and painting is dead. Criticisms Dad the art world is dead everything's dead everybody acts like an undertaker. It's a pain. Stop saying that. A medium dies when everything it was ever invented to solve has been addressed painting. We'll stop existing disting- when that happens it's an operating system that was developed in the caves. A two dimensional abstract extract way to represent the three dimensional real world. So you on the outside. Could know what I'm thinking about on the inside aside and it would last wouldn't disappear as it did in the cave dances or the way I painted my skin or sang being a song in the caves. This was an operating system. Unlike on the salty others. And it's still for whatever. Idiotic reason seems to be viable liable to me. So you have got to walk into a gallery or museum wherever you're experiencing art and have this gut reaction I don't know if it is exit got reaction but have a reaction then in some ways try to capture that reaction internally. Get home to your desk. I don't know if it's the next morning and write it up. And if I were to describe the defining defining part of your writing about our that I see as different beyond the sort of like academic language. Stuff numb I think that idea of Trusting your reaction as being really central and I can imagine you brought up the idea of envy before and I've certainly experienced envy in my life of of artists. Art that can poison your ability to have that pure reaction and I would also imagine the doing it three hundred times a year can poison your ability to have that reaction does in many critics and you can you can see it in their work. They hate this. I think that if envy will lead you alive. I think that cynicism will eat your work from the inside wide and it will rot and the only people I block online. I have two rules online. Everybody I've ever blocked always. He says well he blocked me because we disagreed. No I love disagreement. I Live for disagreement. A disagree I don't care I I have elephants skin first of all. You're not gonNA hurt my feelings. You can never say anything worse to me about me or my work than I have said to myself off a day three hundred times a day. I only block cynics. Who Will Tell Me Jeff? Koons for example. He's not real he's as a fait he's now dinars. He only does this for money. People don't know that everybody's pretty sincere. That's how I go in yet Larry Gagosian. Coaching is fucking sincere. I've met Jeff. Koons the guys like teletubby howdy. doody he's totally sincere. You may not like what he makes excrete good for you make case so I block cynics. And then the other people Ibaka's you can call me a name online but you may not recall anyone else in the thread a name. Because that's when the threads go insane I learned them so looking is is the key. You've gotta get quiet inside and listen to what you think. And Yeah you're right. It's subjective art is subjective. Everybody has an opinion. There are people that look at Rembrandt. And it's happened and to me when I go through Rembrandt Gorey's and I look at them for a while. I go kind of Brown Little Bit Brown. I'm having a hard time Cindy's but I'd like to quote a sword of quote from Wallace Stevens. My second favourite American poet after Walt Wittman the the goes something like twenty two people. Crossing a bridge into a village are twenty two people crossing twenty two bridges into twenty two different villages. He's basically saying that while we both do cross into one village. That's the reality. The material reality of our journey your village. The one you entered is very different than mine and the bridge. You Cross is totally different than mine. and My rembrandt is different than yours. And and what's really great about really great. Art Is your hamlet in my hamlet are different and when it gets deeply great every single time you see hamlet. It's it's different so you're ham. Never stays the same that what you're looking for tiny elements of changing. Same Yada Yada. So you go round of the galleries and you keep in mind that eighty five percent minimum of what you see is going to be crap. Eighty eighty five percent of that. I feel like that's generous. Actually I do but I'm not percent back in Nevada that in itself as an optimistic thing. Well I'm going to be optimistic because if I not one inch of one work of art in a full day of looking one inch that makes me feel okay like wow. I'd never seen seen anybody use felt. Yes that way and I think that's great but you have to keep in mind. Lets US you're going to say ninety five percent of what you see is crap. I say. Eighty five but my point is that it's a fairly consistent. Number where eighty five percent of the art made in Renaissance was crap. Yes you just never see it again. It's gone the music written at the time of Bach. It's gone we kept. What consensus said was good? So what I want you to do is go round and understand that fifteen percent of the stuff that you may like. That's good are for you but my fifteen percent may be really different and that's where it gets interesting that where it starts overlap and converge and then go part art. And that's what I like to write about. I've talked to war reporters about you know. Okay you're going to go into the zone you're only going to be. Are there for eight hours intentionally. You're capturing details for an entire feature article in just a portion of one day could be the same for reading reading a profile who only have a couple of hours of access to celebrity so for you in capturing that initial experience that Russia Josh. Does your brain have a way of cataloging details. Do you start thinking of phrases that you're going to use to describe the question I can. I think that it's a lot of different levels. I think this is interesting because first of all one thing I will do is draw picture of whatever I'm looking at. It's a sketch that you would never immidiate years. Recognize this what. I'm looking at a terrible drawer. I couldn't draw then Catra now so this is kind of like a floor or plan. Of what order does it come in and new okay. You draw a picture this culture then that photographed in this panning. You write little words on the checklist. Little idiot words like purple or too big very bumpy shiny. I try to read the press release. But mostly they're gobbly gook art speak and so my secret is to go to the last four four sentences and usually down there it'll kind of try to tell you what it is l.. The rest is this is about nature and culture and the commodified object objective late capitalism. And how the SIMILAC GRA and it goes on and on everybody says the same thing can I ask you because I don't know how this works. Who writes spat it's usually written in conjunction with the artists in conjunction with the gallery? Yeah my recommendation for artists. Here's what I want to say. Listen to me artists and writers. Listen here's how to raise statement. Keep it simple stupid K I S S S.. Right how you talk right how you think. If you're artist statement began I grew up in. I always was interested interested in magic. You've already got me a little. Yeah I'd say that ready yet. I WanNa hear more about this person. Yes I want you to keep it simple. Oh and don't use words like nature and culture. Just write about what you think you're doing in the simplest way and I promise promise you it will be thirty times more interesting than thirty of the next statement you read and it's the beginning of learning to write. Frankly not being intimidated by the process. It's very simple. Writing is easy there. Is You have to learn. There is no no such thing as writing. There is only rewriting. My piece is moved through thirty thousand drafts. Three hundred thousand in and this is I'm a weekly critic or sometimes a daily and I have to work it out. Work it out. It's completely done it's bulletproof. You are a God odd and then you notice the whole first. Two sentences are stupid right before you send it you rewrite them in that last one second. And that's that's the beginning of your piece just like that. The sentence that you spent the most amount of time the opener would that fly. Let's say I got a big solo show at the Golden Gallery out of left field. No big surprise and I was like hey I find this kind of writing pretentious. And it's unethical to my art. I would like the catalog to say this was inspired by my childhood magic. They would hit absolutely yes. You have to understand the galleries. These are not enemies. The galleries are facilitators. Who are looking for ways to make more artists more money Johny while they make money themselves most of the galleries that you see? Even though you don't believe me now they started from almost nothing. You're idiots it's like you. A lot of them wanted to be artists and some of them are successful again. One percent of one percent is successful and Galleries will say yes to artists in every case yes now. Millions of artists are listening to this saying Oh no this gallery. He said no to me. Well then that's bad gallery. Asa Bad gallery good galleries trust their artists to make mistakes mistakes to fail the have to trust that failure that there's something in there. How does your own experience burning a gallery when you're young person affect me and when you walk in Bushwick and there's six people living in the back and that happens a lot and and you know mattresses have been moved to make make room for the show etcetera? How do you reflect back on your own experiences? A young person being in a situation like that. I'm ashamed to to say I've never reflected back. Love the question so much like am I thinking about what it was like. I guess I am all times because a couple of things I I think one any person who has hotspot in the corporation like mean you better Goddamn son. The artist book job. One walk into the gallery. Don't be high and mighty enough not to sign the book they WANNA know. Have you been there. They're dancing naked in public. Artists writers creative people. They have a sick need like you just like me to dance naked in public and they want to be seen if you only dance naked in private some some people in the you know if you only make your own food. That's good for some people. Some people like cooking meals in hearing back from others so you sign the book next. I want younger. Critics geezers like me my wife. Roberta Smith the Great Peter. Shell doll at the New Yorker weekly critic. It extends our and others the older critics. You can't be aiming for us. We're too big in a way the space we have to Phil this is I'm colosseum paper. I want younger critics. Three generations have to start going to three generations nations of younger dealers. Now you gotta go. You can't just go writing. About how bad Larry is. Jeff Koons are Damian. Thursdays is that's low fucking hanging fruit like I say you want to do one of those a year. Go ahead but you had to put yourself make yourself radically Kraivong that's my motto radical vulnerability that you have to be able to criticize your own generations and not just stride dammit positively. Everybody's in a way been coddled mosque artist graduate school never getting even a negative crypt. And and when you get out in the world you're going to hear some stuff's going to hurt your feelings and I'm not seeing enough criticism out there of smaller galleries galleries newer artists positive and negative. And I WANNA see that. It's also time I'm afraid. The institutions are in trouble bull. We're in reckoning right now. My generation built this our world. We built the city and now it's rotting it's big it's beautiful. It's spectacular and parts of it are dying. It's been overstaffed it's over paid. They're overworked museums have to change. Obviously they have to have a thousand times more diversity a thousand times and that's going to start it happening and it is a zero sum game. You'd better listen up people. It's a zero sum game that means older white male critic getting a job means somebody else. Isn't that what zero sum is which means from now on. Maybe we need those. Critics aren't going to get at the job. A white male middle aged painter may not get the show. I'm sorry this is GonNa hurt. It's GonNa hurt for five five years. It's going to hurt for ten years into we get to the point where we can have a black woman painter as mediocre as a white male painter when we reach that point we have parody. And I'm happy I I want that. It's zero sum game which means don't pay so much attention to the gigantic institutions. You have to start start. Your own institutions is time. It's easy if you build it. They will come. I promise you I. It's thirty five people than it's three hundred and fifty if you're any good and you have energy it's all about energy. Put Your own self on the line. You've got to build it you weren't poorer than I was. I WanNa tell you something while you're listening to. This guy is not easy for for him to say I too am one paycheck away from being broke. I posted might total life savings in two thousand fourteen on on facebook instagram twitter. That was I think. Four thousand dollars okay. So you're gonNA listen to this ago. Oh you got a lot of the money okay. I'm a thousand years old and I four thousand dollars. Okay if I lose my job here and I have no contract at New York magazine if I lose my job here. I don't have health insurance. So what am I trying to say woman up man up you at to build this art world you you had to make it up yourself. It's your energy completely don't look to the geezers the way that you described what's happened in museums. There's an idea that they can become more diverse or more modern but that's in some ways modernizing the institution and there's a more radical place that art could go. You're posting artists on your instagram. Feed now like do you ever consider that the the idea that the whole Party will move on these institutions. The museums will just seize to be the kind kind of place and art critic goes. I don't see museums has ever being places that are critics. Wouldn't go to because all for me. All Art is contemporary art. That means when I look at Renaissance Painting Cave painting in Indian Mangala all of it in the present for me this the Eternal Journal present. And then when I'm dead it's over so while I do think we must go not must but I'd I go to the Mat with my wife forty forty times a year and I still only pay like a quarter. You need to sneak in people. You just work it out. When I was a kid I never paid for anything thing not stop paying for things I love going to seal darted speaks to me? I just walk around the museum waiting for something to talk to me. If nothing talks I go to the cafeteria. In the meantime I want generations of younger critics going to the other institutions solutions. What after they go to the met and the Whitney and the Guggenheim and the Brooklyn Museum at Satra after that could other institutions Artist run spaces idiot places in Bushwick that are mostly bad. Maybe something good. Maybe there's something in you better tell it if you don't and we've lost a few generations I think to academia quite frankly I say this. This is a jealous person who didn't go in wishes that he did. And I do miss out on a certain level of the discourse because of it however offer I've seen too many critics not putting out opinion or when they do it's buried into the second to the last sentence where they'll go the sculptures were problem typist. And you go wait. Is that bad that good. What you mean it's problema ties? I don't understand well it's a language I don't understand is my problem. But we need more critics to write without jargon with opinion about work from these generations because people are dying on the vine out. There it's ridiculous that 67-year-old critic it's ridiculous that I'm the one posting all these pictures on instagram. That people are hating liking liking in hating saying I want to talk about the writing because it sounds simple when you talk about it but I find personally that writing about our. It's one of the hardest things for me to write about even casually when someone will say. Hey what did you think of this. The giving of an opinion is very linguistically difficult. Act Act I think and so when you started right what what year do you publish your first I think about. I'm born fifty one. I started publishing. I think in ninety he wants fifty thousand six hundred seventy eighty not four. I was forty when I started right. Okay it's ninety one New York City right. You're sitting down to write your very first few pieces. How does one describe what is on the wall? Show you describe the checklist. The the Ad Right Purple Shiny Bubbly Begin. I began in the wrong way. But it's the way everybody begins by trying to sound smart sheriff. The commodified object of the natural material used in this You know cultural rated blahdy Blah and I had now idea what I was writing about but I knew what the language sounded like. And that's how I began and then deadlines deadlines are sent to us from Hell the heaven. What's so interesting about? A deadline is when they start coming faster. You can't dissemble. You can't don't lie. You can't hide which real thoughts are and that's when it happened to me by fucking accident. I started putting off the writing. The deadline line was coming and I pride myself on never having missed a deadline. It's dumb rule. But it's the one I've kept. I've decided I've listened to mini editors that are too furious at too many writers and I just don't WanNa be that guy that's me. I'm a lot of assholes but I'm not that one deadline deadline is coming and it's time to put out what you think or shut up get out and how do you begin. You know that you're going to mention the artist name way up there so you got at least two words of a sentence and then in my mind I want to get to words of description so the big rectangular Aaron. What's your last name? Lamour has a presence that seems generic generic but ambitious yet in that it wants you know and then and start right there. Put out my feeling. Is that in the first two or three sentences. You should have a sense of some of the things I'm about to do and when I stopped doing them you should stop reading me and I have failed anybody that ever stops me on the street and goes while I I started reading your review and it was really great and I'm going to read it later when they walk away. I think I failed because you don't pick up reviews. Awesome read 'em second time. It's one time I've got to get you by the collar and keep you there for good six minutes and that that is not easy. Do your ideas change a lot while you're writing totally. I never know what I think before. I think it. You never know what I'm going to say before I I say I'm always shocked all of a sudden. I think I liked this guy. I love this podcast. I see his work. I think I like it. I get home I I find. It's derivative in generic. What do I do well? It's very easy. The deadline tells you what to do. I have no time to quit. I don't have health insurance so I've got a now right the truth which is aarons works. Generic and derivative four the following. Nine hundred wirtz. That's why I have to make my case. You can't say titanic is bad movie good movie that's fun that's what you do after the movie That's not would've review is you need to describe and judge describe and the judge that's what reviewing is and it should be a pleasure to read for God's sake and maybe a little helpful for the reader to be a little less this afraid to hate the writer more to like the artist last whatever. Is there a strong distinction between writing about a piece. He's have art that was created this year versus a piece of art. That's in a retrospective versus a piece of art. That perhaps you've even written about previously twenty two years ago like there's the artistic eternal present. These stories are of different half lives. Yeah I often will confront work worked. I thought I'd like that then I don't or that I thought I didn't in than I do. And I tried to deliver that up as well. What happens if your dead will? I be negative. Yes I will if I don't like Turner which don't that much I want to write about out that I find it a little bit Bombastic and over leave obvious that he's painting fuzzy. Goldie clouds of soot and Clay Yada Yada and that I might prefer constable for the following reason. I think it's all the same. It's all in play. It's all opinion you're going to say to me but Jerry. Then it's all opinion in my answer is yeah. So what's what's your opinion. Have you ever seen a cave painting. What's your opinion of it? Have you ever been a lot of our was not meant to be even be seen by humanize. I think of like inside sarcophagi in Egypt. That's only meant to be seen in the afterlife. Some art is meant to heal other art was meant only to sort of fly over your army to show that your army was stronger than the other. Some art is meant to cast spells. FETISHES are meant to get you pregnant or keep you from being pregnant. Art has a lot of uses. It has many uses. There's the famous story. I can't remember who told it of the judge at The Hague who was listening to the Bosnian war trials els who would go see Vermeer at every launch and they said why. Do you see for miracles through beautiful. Anyone will no of course not I see for Mir because he heals pain. You know so. It's only very recently that we've only had one use for art which was to who put up fifty three inches about in the santer of a white room and hang it there and buy it so I'm interested. Chris did in opening up the discourse and understanding. I'm looking for voice. Franklin every case in the writer in the artist in the person. What's Your Voice? Even if I don't like it if I don't like your voice but individual I I love you. What was the biggest moment for you in the development of your own voice? When did you start feeling like I'll I can read this and I can hear my true so all speaking not that trying to be smart that your views things? I think one was what I was trying to say. But deadlines that they force you to hear yourself. The second was how would that sound right. How would it sound well when I tried to sound like academia man and our form and all those good things? I didn't like the sound of my own voice and didn't feel it was mine but then when I read my wife Roberta Smith. I would re polling Kale. I would read people like an art critic. Name Sanford Schwartz. Peter Shall Doll Joan Aca Chela. Who writes some of the best first sentences I've ever read? I don't know whether secret is. I would hear what juice sounded like what it felt like an I thought all I have to do is right how I talk and hope that I can then create a character that speaks in a certain way because I don't talk right in fact. I'm not very good conversationalist you at all will. I'm long winded. You can tell I find this a malaria. Between how you talking right well. You have your your exuberant current in both forms. Yeah desperate exuberant hopeful. Panicked needy exuberance is not I would say the the default tone of art writing and somewhere along somewhere around the opposite. I don't want to be a cheerleader. Exuberance yes cheerleader. There's too many of those. Every critique is a good critique all art is good art get Outta here get Outta here what does it have been like being in an ongoing marriage with someone who does the same thing as you do Do you discuss what you're working on in the house else where I would wish what I have on anyone. I love being married so may the does what I do. We talk about criticism twenty four seven and I love it. I talked very little movies. We have opera as a hobby. That the better all we do. ooh That's it. We are so boring like I said. I haven't gone out to dinner in decades. No interest in it to me. I want to see the shows. We see twenty five to thirty five shows week. There's art to be seen. It's our job to see what's there. Good good the bad. The very bad do we go to galleries alone are together on Saturdays. We begin together and then usually they find our ways criss crossing and then by the end of Saturday. We'll bump into each other at Alaska salary. I love being married to somebody that speaks my language that knows the demons I face and I know hers too knows what it means to live under a deadline. Many artists disagree with me and they go. I could never live with another artist and I say whatever gets you through the night. Whatever gets you through the night and if you want money Mary lawyer whatever? I'm a sociopath when it comes to making your work I really am. I don't care about you the person I only care about your good or bad art. That is all I care about and whatever it takes to get your work made. I do not care if you have to take drugs to do it. That's what you have to do if you're married to a lawyer and that's how you fund yourself good good for you. I don't care I'm not going to judge anybody. Okay Buddy because I know how I've been judged I've been counted out I am out. I've never written for our form I've never. I've been asked to write for those big big catalogs. I'm not on the important symposium. You know I'm good with that. I'm could without. I'm really lucky to be able to do what I do. And to be absolutely honest I think about how lucky I am. Eighty percent of the time I walk around going I I do not believe I'm not a truck driver anymore. I don't believe it how bad how hard that was and I always. I spent a lot of time thinking about a one last thing I wanted to say but the lock is when I was first asked to come here to New York magazine. Your first question. uh-huh I said. Oh God no why would I want are right for New York magazine. I met village voice which is super hip and underground underground cool and hot. I was paid four hundred dollars a week which to me is a fortune to this day. It's a lot of money but I don't I know everybody's different now and I told some friends and they went. Don't you understand. New York magazine is getting really great under Outta Moss in the voice will probably close. And I said you're kidding. Really said I had no idea and I called up New York magazine and I said I've got got to have this job and Adam. Moss took me to lunch uptown news one of the first and last lunches. I've ever done an Ritzy Tizi restaurant and we talked for about three hours in the job never came up and at the very end when we were leaving I went what about the job and he said Oh what about it and I said why would really like it and he went okay like that and he said do you have Germany ideas about it and I said some silly thing or to any went. Sure we'll talk about that. And that was it and my life has never been the same because because I want to ride for a big audience I do. I'm not interested in only specialist. I'm interested didn't anybody that might stumble across my idiotic work begin it and maybe keep going and see that art part. It's about a specialist. Sports art is no more or less important in this universe to me then philosophy or religion economics politics cooking. It's all part of the big ball of wax. And that's that's what I want people to hear. It isn't the scary shit hard. Think it's easy final question. You've been doing this. How many how many reviews do you think you've earned? I have no idea where you did. You Stop County. got a specific number when Google first came out I google myself. Yeah and I stopped definitely definitely over a thousand. Oh yeah is there any summary to this project for you. Do you have any overriding eating ambition to sum it all up or to say something definitive amount of certain streak or a certain artists just the art contains multitudes. Food's really and that I found a way to speak. Yes through this other objects. Some people do dancing others to singing and somehow just looking at art is a way to do it to thank you Jerry Saltz. Thank you Thank you for listening to this. Re Airing of the long foreign podcast asked interview with Jerry Saltz. I'm your co host. Aaron Lamour the show has also hosted by Max Linski and Evan ratliff. This episode was originally edited by Janelle. Pifer our intern is Marina CLEMENTI. We're brought to you by incredible sponsors like mail chimp and pit writers at the University of Pittsburgh they make this show possible to air and re air and we appreciate it. Thanks to everyone who has listened to the show. Oh this year it really means a lot to us. We'll be back with new episodes very soon uh-huh.

New York magazine Jerry Saltz New York City Jeff Koons writer Roberta Smith Larry Gagosian Aaron Lamour Art Institute of Chicago Art Forum Chicago editor chief art critic Art Form Magazine Bushwick Dante Chicago High School Oak Park R Barbara Gladstone Europe
Episode 311: Jerry Saltz

Longform Podcast

1:05:26 hr | 2 years ago

Episode 311: Jerry Saltz

"Hey, before we get going, I wanna talk to you about our sponsor this week. Tapeh call a lot of journalists listening to this show. They should know about Tapeh call. If you find yourself on the phone going a, could you repeat that one more time because you were trying to scribble notes during a phone interview. You need to be present focused yourself and get in Saint with the other person, which means not scribbling those notes and instead using Tapeh call it is the industry standard car recording app is used by journalists from the New York Times, business insider ABC world news and many more, and you can try it. Risk free for seven days by going to tape a call dot com slash long-form. Thank you tape a call, focus on what matters and let typical take care of the rest. Also bringing you the show this week is a podcast that I am personally very excited in very excited about because I have. Been obsessed with the topic for quite some time, and I'm glad someone made a show about it. It's the dream a new podcast about the world of pyramid schemes and multilevel marketing all over the country. People selling essential oils, beauty products, diet supplements out of the garage on social media at parties. The host who Jean Marie used to be a producer for this American life, and she grew up in rural Michigan where almost everyone seemed impacted by l. m. l. m.'s aka make multilevel marketing schemes. You can listen to the dream in your favorite podcast app, apple podcasts, Stitcher or Spotify. Learn how these businesses work and how they go horribly wrong. Thanks to the dream for sponsoring long-form this week. Here's the show. Hello and welcome to the long form podcast. I'm Aaron Lamour here with Evan Ratliff max linski. Hey, guess every few years amid a pilgrimage to the offices of New York magazine, this time it was to talk to a guest who I've been excited about talking about for a long time. I don't think we've ever had an art critic on on the show, have we? I don't think so. There's probably only three of them getting paid in America right now. So it's not that crazy. I think we have the best known one. I'm coming on the show this week, and that's Jerry Saltz who was the longtime critic for the village voice and is now the critic at New York magazine. I did not know a lot about what he does though. I have been reading New York magazine for many years, and I think it's really fascinating. And this was like a really fun one to do, and I want to compliment you on a upping our critic game. I think we, we hear from. People sometimes who say you should have more critics and you've taken on that. I'm not sure I'm satisfying those people. I think that they still want something that we're not giving them. So if you if you feel like we don't have enough critics on this show, Email us editors at long firm dot org and tell us not that we don't have enough critics on the show, but what critics you would like to hear on the show I, there's one person I can tell you who satisfied today. Who's that Adrian Adrian Chan has lobbied for Jerry Saltz being on the show with a passion. I have not seen him bring to his professional life or his personal personal app. It's basically the only thing he cares about was doing that. And actually when I when I get went to Email Jerry to come on the show, the way that I found it was looking into my g mail for Adrian Chan Jerry saw and there was like three different times. He had sent me thanks to Adrian Chen for making this Megan. This happened, it wasn't that I didn't want to have Jerry Saltz on, but never has someone lobbied so passionately for for guests to come on. On the you go, Adrian, you know, who would read a good Email newsletter? Who's that Adrian Chen doesn't does he have one, I don't think so. I don't know felt good. And if he did and Email newsletter, Stewart mail, chimp I love Malcolm, you love Mel. Champ. We all love Malcolm. Thank you for your support of the show Malcolm. And now here's Erin with Jerry Saltz. Welcome Jerry Saltz. Thank you. We're here in the lovely offices of New York magazine, which has sort of cryptic hieroglyphic of what appears to me Java script instructions all are you able to decipher those? I have no idea, but it tells you that New York magazine is cracked the way to get to the future. Some we were actually just discussing that you have listened to the show, and in fact, your own boss at a mosque has been on the show, and it actually struck me that you've been doing this for a long enough when you get hired for a job like this, does it editor say, this is what we want out of you or you just on your own trajectory? At this point? Right when I was interviewed in two thousand seven by New York magazine, I was then senior art critic for the village force which I loved. I've been for ten. Years, and I had been a long distance truck driver which we can talk about. Yeah, I have no education, no degrees. No, nothing. And I got plucked lucky out of when I was forty something years old. I hadn't started writing till I was forty, but that's backing up too far. Well, I'm up to back up that far. Well, what led you to become a truck driver? I wanted to be an artist. Yeah, I graduated about last in my big, big, big, suburban, Chicago, high school, oak park, wherever forest Illinois, it was the late sixties. You have to understand. I'm sixty seven now and there was no art in my life. What so? Ever my suburb, none. So it's not like I had any serious grounding. Certain things had had. Happened with. Maybe we can talk about sort of primal experiences, but I graduated high school with no idea of going to school. Never even occurred to me, realize terrible student never did thing. Never never. Never, never. And then somehow I started going to the Art Institute of Chicago for about a year or two, but of course repeated the dump pattern. I never went to classes. I would go to protest marches and eventually I started an artist run arc Oury in Chicago nineteen Seventy-three call name gallery. It's because we couldn't think of a name. And our idea was to show other artists and than we would get a show once every two years or so. And I loved doing that. I can't tell you how much I love doing it. I loved sort of having a sense of control of building in our world of meeting artist of. Of curing shows and music platforms at the time in Chicago, I saw any famous blues men or jazz musician. You can name any any and tiny rooms with nobody there. Absolutely nobody. And then we would pay them like a hundred fifty dollars also then to perform in this dumb gallery of what was what was dumb about the gallery. Well, I didn't think it was dumb, but. It wasn't dumb frankly. I thought it was pretty full congraulate. Yeah, and fun. And at the time I worked in galleries, I had all sorts of jobs of a big, fuck up the whole time. I've been fired a lot and I was making art, and I started showing my work at name and I had to shows there and they both for kind of successful people bought my work. I got what's called the National Endowment for the arts grant, a massive grant of two thousand dollars that I took and moved to New York City with. I started showing in a gallery there got into the drawers of the nascent Barbara Gladstone gallery here in New York, and she's now a God goddess of the galleries at the time she wasn't. But nevertheless. So you know, I thought. Oh, gee, I guess I'm going to be artists. This is great, and then I got here and slowly the demon started speaking to me as they speak to us, they speak to anybody telling me I couldn't do what I said I was, and I began to listen and slowly stop. Making art is very painful. Being in New York was hard. Of course trying to make a living. I eventually became a local truck driver of art mind. You not of steel. I am Jewish and then that long story short. I stopped making art entirely and it hurt it really hurt. I was eaten alive by envy. I could not walk down the streets of New York without looking at every apartment every loft and go, you mother fuckers. That should be mine. I mean, I was like nuts. I was like self entitled self feeling sorry for myself at all times and furious with the world. Everybody, you know, the art world, everybody and I kind of absented. My seven became a long distance truck driver for many years actually, and in the trucks is where of so lonely and so fucking depressed that I thought, well, I love art. I've got to be in the art world, and I started thinking, well, maybe I could be art critic that must be easy, right? You wrote about this. Experience of giving up are in New York max a couple years ago, this year wasn't that long last year life as a failed artist and in reading back through that story and hearing you tell there, the thing that struck me both times was that he didn't really talk very much about what the art was that you are making like before that doubt, eight you inside. What did the flip side of that failing look likely will like, what did it feel like when you were an artist and optimistic and believed in yourself, and what was it that you believe that you should do? That's a great question because it makes me feel good again because the kind of the quietude the kind of internal space of that of standing in my case and. Listening to music and just being in the flow of making art all day. You know, in that sense of the smell of the materials, the sound of watching something form. I was on a twenty five year project to illustrate Dante's divine comedy. I was going to make one hundred works of art for each of the one hundred Cantos of Dante's divine comedy. And my thought was I would travel through hell with Dante through purgatory. And finally in the year, two thousand began the project January first nineteen seventy five and I was definitive on the last day of nineteen ninety nine why two k. And I made it to canto three before the real demons in hell. I didn't know that I had invented a project where I would confront what was already there, of course, but it felt so great to be an artist. I loved every second, except I hate it. I was tortured to did that perception that this was not for you or your work, didn't compare come from seeing the work of other people or did it come from inside you? I would say frankly, came from inside me because I was getting confirmation in my very small pond and the National Endowment and this interest in so-called sales. And I was reviewed in art forum magazine, which then as now is kind of the hip hipster magazine. So from the outside things look pretty good from the inside. They weren't PR. Good. We're pretty bad, very bad and I just thought, I don't know what I thought. I just didn't think it was real and it was easier not to work frankly, then to be brave to man up or woman up or grow a pair of whatever it was easier to this day. I think for all people who make things, it's easier if more torturous not to do the God damn thing, then do it to this day. I wake up early and I have to get to my desk to right almost immediately. I mean fast before the demons get me. I've got to get writing. And then once I've written almost anything up pretty much right all day, I don't leave my desk. I have no other life. I'm not part of the world except when I go to see shows and and my. Second self. It seems online quite gregarious. So my second self is having a ball, you know, few times a day, but so I quit and it came from the inside. The messages I believed were from the inside and I'm, I always tell artist, you know, you've got to make an enemy event v, you can't look around yourself and think everybody's got more money, better education, taller smarter knows their history is married. Well, all of that may be true, but you gotta get on with it or get out the art world is an all volunteer army. If you don't wanna be here, there's the door and I on fortunately walked out and it was the right decision in the end, but it hurts to this day. Hey, I'm gonna pause things here for a little bit more info about our sponsor this week. Tapeh call. If you are a journalist and you want to do your best work, you should not be trying to scribble notes while you're doing your interviews need to eliminate the need Durant, everything down, and instead offload that worried to take a call, it's a recording app. Journalists rely on to record calls, save them, organize them, a blood them to the cloud and send them to other people right in their app. You'll get unlimited high quality recordings that you can download and access from anywhere. I really recommend you do this. If you don't, you will lose episodes. That has happened to me. I recommend typical because the industry standard car recording up used by journalists from the New York Times, business insider ABC world news and many more many journalists, I know and they all like it. So I encourage you to try it. Risk free. Free for seven days by going to tape a call dot com slash long form. That's tape a call dot com slash long-form. Thank you. Tape a call. Also bring you the show this week. Squarespace. I tell people to use squarespace all the time. There's a lot of reasons. I don't think it makes sense in this day and age to maintain your own site on your own server, unless you really know what you're doing and if you really know what you're doing, you probably have better things to do with your time. If you've got an idea and you wanna make it reality without jumping through a lot of hoops, squarespace is the way to do it. They've got great templates. Ecommerce functionality looks great on phones. They've had twenty four, seven ward winning customer support, nothing to patch or upgrade ever. So you can build a site now and not look great for years to come either empowering many, many millions of people from designers to lawyers to artists. To gamers to restaurants, to turn their idea into something real. If you want to be one of them go to squarespace dot com slash long form for a free trial, and when you're ready to launch your site, so you'll have to pay till you launch it. You can use code long form to save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or Demane again, that squarespace dot com slash long form offer code long form. Thank you squarespace here. I am back with Jerry songs. It sounds like in that you wake up and go right for that and write all day that you did find something for which it wasn't easier to not do it like it seems like you found the experience that you wanted from art in some way. Yeah, I think you're right. I think that's very perceptive what I needed that. I guess I wasn't getting from art at something a little bit more perform, frankly. Yeah, where my wife Roberta Smith, who's my favorite art critic, she's the co, chief are critic for the New York Times has said that to write weekly, the way that she does. I do an only a handful of people do is to perform live on stage. And for me, I got to perform live every night. I am on the road as it were. And in sicko way. I'm like Bruce Springsteen. Mike concerts are like three hours long. I will not stop until is there anybody alive there, and I haven't killed the entire audience. I'll keep going. An art. Didn't have that. That's a studio practice into private thing without feedback in real time from real audience to watch and feel the reaction beyond the streets of New York, and people stopped me and go. You really got that wrong or you got it ride or artists contacting me. All of that I realized is what I needed, and I didn't know I wanted and it might explain my second south my online, so which is so so interactive in my real life. My friends will tell you. I haven't gone to a sit down dinner and decades. I can't do it. I'm in. Capable, I'm not socially well adjusted. You and I would be seated next to each other. You're massively successful, you got this great podcast. See he can't take it. He's starting to demur and we would start talking and within three seconds, I would say to you. So what shows have you seen meaning art shows and yet go none. And I would look forward to not really speak again for the rest of the dinner. I have no other interests. I'm so boring and I'm not gonna ruin the dinner with Trump, you know, and if you're not a Yankee or giants fan, and so I don't know where I've come from, but I I, this is my whole life. The writing the performing live is the real mean now, even if it's no good. There's very few. Like when I think of like my Arctic interests, what are we call them? Now, the fine arts. The visual arts gallery are just calm are. So our yards are. I know a lot more about music and yovany. Sure about art because those were the things that I was interested in when I was a teenager and as the internet made being a complete assed more valuable to someone who's listening to music, who's interested in older movies, there was no parallel education in art that I received. I did, however, acquire a certain number of United Airlines miles, which caused me to start getting a MAG for miles promotion, which caused me to subscribe to New York magazine for free at some point shortly after graduating from college, which means that I've been reading your writing in New York magazine for a period of years while not going very many gallery shows. So when I think of what's happening out there you're experiencing, I am actually seeing it through your lens. My very impression of what's happening in art, I would say is like twenty. Eighty five percent from your writing. It's like twenty five percent from your writing twenty five percent from like going to museums in Europe when I'm traveling and maybe fifty percent from just weird things that I've crossed paths with and unpredictable ways and artisan Touma dating yet. Now all the awful painful real content of money, money money. Most people look at art and they see something disgusting. I to see that disgusting thing. I like that my voice could be one voice that people read in that I wanted to be accessible open, not intimidating. When you read me, I want you to be able to get from the top to the bottom a and b. I want you to be able to understand what I've said and not feel like I've Saturday done anything that you yourself could not kind of put. Together by looking again, I have no art history, no degrees. I am making this up as I go. Just like everyone is. I don't know what I'm doing, but I know how to do it. I think everyone has then common. I think every great artist, frankly, is self taught, and I'm four people going to school. I am not here on a podcast saying you kids stay out of school. If you can go to school that you don't accrue a gigantic debt do it. I might be envious betakeren view get to one of those good schools, but that's what I want my writing to be. And then I want you to be motivated to maybe start going to the galleries. You go willy seems to go to these galleries. I'll try to go and then not be afraid because the people behind the desks at galleries are exactly like you the poor, they're incredibly poor. Dave graduated they, oh fortune. They have two jobs. They're being paid nothing and they love art the way you love what you love. There's no difference in yet. People walk in the galleries and that you wouldn't believe how cruel they are to the people that work in them. I love those people. My wife and I think of them as people were trying to train there the next generation of gallery STS and I love I galleries are where new are comes from, and that's an important part of the system in that part of the system is really under attack. There's a certain kind of a writer who would say even like within like sports. I follow sports. I, I grew up the that, I guess you know, people would say, if you read like Bill Simmons, who's a sports podcast are like half of the time. He's talking about the NBA as a corporate entity in attendance in business who's gonna move, who, where who's going to buy what team? There's a tendency and I think the art world is as much like this as anything that you could probably spend all your time. Just writing about art is business about the people who are getting screwed at the bottom of the galleries, and the big art fairs and this and how the business is changing and all of the sort of underhanded ways that things really work, how the sausage is made. But I would think that if you wrote primarily about that, it would be hard to write about loving art in the same way that you just described those people as of. Vessel or being able to have it in the world. So I'm I'm wondering for you like, how does all that stuff interact like how do you? How do you know whether it's more important to write about what's on the walls or the lease on the building and the robo working? Really a good question. First of all, I want people to understand. I've written many times that about ninety nine point nine, nine, nine percent of artists don't make money, and the art world has become obsessed with the zero point zero. One percent that does make money, I tune obsessed with those people. When Jeff Koons the famous American artists has a show I go batch it like, is it good as bad? He's making three million dollars off this ball bowl. It's at. Larry goes in all of that becomes content for the work. And I think it's valid content, but I want people to always if it's possible. To see that content and then stop seeing it and see the art c. that content. See the prices, see the white box that it's being delivered in and the like death, star energy that might be coming from it except all that judge it as you will, and then put that aside for a second, if you can or keep using it and then look at the art and see what do I think of this art? Why? What's it doing successfully? How's it new house? It repetitious. How does it use materials? How does it use everything? And then when you walk out, you haven't just been in internal a whole of like going, if I ever see another gallery, this big and this rich on shoot somebody, right? You're supposed to be thinking that part of it. Even the rich galleries, think that they all will. I'll tell you that about each other. It's getting tough and let alone the middle in the bottom in any event. Art is doing just fine. Do your networking Niamh not in the least worried art. I tried to post like ten fifteen, unknown artists like a night on my idiot Instagram, which you should follow at Gerry salt. I think it is are kind of salon refuse outs where all this workers in play. You may not like all of it. I don't like all of it, but take a look at it, and there's a lot of optical information that's quite interesting that isn't always the same fifty five artists written by the same fifty, five academics whose work you never understand who's right about art in such a way that it's sort of bulletproof. You don't even know what their Pinon is, which I can't stay. Band, I love art form magazine. I can't say that I've ever understood much of what's in it, but it seems very important to me not in a bad way. I mean this with no wive in the, but there are many are roles art contains multitudes criticism contains multitudes, people do not have to be talking about the painting is dead criticisms dead. The art world is dead. Everything's dead. Everybody acts like an undertaker. It's a pain, stop saying that a medium dies when everything it was ever invented to solve has been addressed. Painting will stop existing. When that happens. It's an operating system that was developed in the caves a two dimensional abstract way to represent the three dimensional real world. So you on the. Outside could know what I'm thinking about on the inside and it would last it wouldn't disappear as it did in the cave dances or the way I painted my skin or sang a song in the caves. This was an operating system unlike almost all the others and it still for whatever idiotic reason seems to be viable. It is to me. So you have got to walk into a gallery or museum wherever you're experiencing art and have this gut reaction. I don't know if it is actually got reaction but have reaction. Then in some ways, try to capture that reaction internally, get home to your desk. I don't know if it's the next morning and write it up. And if I were to describe the defining part of your writing about art that I see as different beyond the sort of like academic lab. Language. stuff numb. I think that idea of trusting your reaction as being really central, and I can imagine you brought up the idea of envy before, and I've certainly experienced envy in my life of artists and art that that can poison your ability to have that puree action. And I would also imagine that doing it three hundred times a year can poison your ability to have that reaction does in many critics and you can. You can see it in their work. They hate this. I think that if envy will eat you alive, I think that cynicism will eat your work from the inside and it will rot and the only people I block online. I have two rules online. Everybody I've ever blocked always says, well, he blocked me because we disagreed. No, I love disagreement. I live for disagreement, disagree. I don't care. I have elephants skin. First of all, you're not going to hurt my feelings. You can never say anything worse to me about me or my work than I have said to myself thrice a day, three hundred times a day. I only block cynics who will tell me Jeff Koons for example, he's not real. He's a fake. He's not in ours. He only does this for money. People don't know that everybody's pretty sincere I, that's how I go in yet. Larry Gagosian as fucking sincere. I've met Jeff Koons the guys like Teletubby. Howdy, Doody. He's totally sincere. You may not like what he makes great good for you. Yeah, make case. So I block cynics and then the other people Ibaka's you can call me in name online, but you may not call anyone else in the thread. A name because that's when the threads go insane. I've, I learned them. So looking is the key gotta get quiet inside. And listen to what you think. And yeah, you're right. It's subjective. Art is subjective. Everybody has an opinion. There are people that look at Rembrandt and it's happened to me when I go through Rembrandt go or is an. I look at them for a while. I go kind of Brown. Little bit Brown. I'm having a hard time seeing these, but I'd like to quote a sword of quote from Wallace Stevens. My second favourite American poet after Walt Whitman, the the goes something like twenty two people crossing a bridge into a village. Are twenty two people crossing twenty two bridges into twenty two different villages. He's basically saying that while we both do cross into one village, that's the reality, the material reality of our journey, your village. The one you entered is very different than mine and the bridge you cross is totally different than mine and my Rembrandt is different than yours and what's really great about really great art is your hamlet in my hamlet are different and when it gets deeply great every single time you see, hamlet, it's different. So you're ham never stays the same that what you're looking for tiny elements of changing same yada, yada. So you go round of the galleries and you keep in mind. Did eighty five percent minimum of what you see is going to be crap. Eighty five percent of that. I feel like that's generous. Actually. I do not pretend that in itself as an optimistic take. Well, I'm going to be optimistic because if I see one inch of one work of art in a full day of looking one inch that makes me feel okay. Like, oh, wow, I'd never seen anybody use felt. Yes, that way. And I think that's great. But you have to keep in mind. Lets us you're going to say ninety five percent of what you see is crap. I say eighty five, but my point is that it's a fairly consistent number were eighty five percent of the art made in the renaissance was crap. Yes, you just never see it again. It's gone. The music written at the time of Bach. It's gone. We kept what consensus said was good. So what I want you to do is go wrong. Round and understand that the fifteen percent of the stuff that you may like that's good are for you. But my fifteen percent may be really different, and that's where gets interesting that where it starts to overlap and converge and then go part, and that's what I like to write about. I've talked to war reporters about, you know, okay, you're going to go into the zone. You're only going to be there for eight hours. We'll actually you're capturing details for an entire feature article and just a portion of one day couldn't be the same for being writing a profile who only have a couple of hours of access to celebrity. So for you in capturing that initial experience that rush, does your brain have a way of cataloging details? Do you start thinking of phrases that you're gonna use to describe the question again? I think that it's a lot of different levels. So I think. This is interesting because first of all, one thing I will do is draw picture of whatever I'm looking at. It's a sketch that you would never in a million years. Recognize this. What I'm looking at a material drawer. I couldn't draw then a catra now. So this is kind of like a floor plan. It's more plants. So what order does it come in? And okay, you draw picture this culture, then that photographed in this painting, you write little words on the checklist little idiot words like purple or too big, very, bumpy, shiny. I try to read the press release, but mostly they're gobbly Gook art, speak. And so my secret is to go to the last four sentences and usually down there, it'll kind of try to tell you what it is l. the rest is this is about nature and culture and the commodified object of late capitalism and how the Similac. GRA and it goes on and on. Everybody says the same thing. Can I ask you? Because I don't know how this works, who writes that it's usually written in conju with the artists in conjunction with the gallery. Yeah, my recommendation for artists. Here's what I want to say. Listen to me, artists writers. Let's. Here's how to raise statement, keep it simple. Stupid k, I s s right how you talk, right? How you'd think if you're artist's statement began, I grew up in, I always was interested in magic. You've already got me a little. Yeah, I'd see that show ready yet. I want to hear more about this person. Yes, I want you to keep it simple and don't use words like nature and culture. Just write about what you think you're doing in the simplest way, and I promise you it will be thirty times more interesting than thirty of the next statement you read and it's the beginning of learning to write, frankly, then not being intimidated by the process is very simple. Writing is easy. There is you have to learn. There is no such thing as writing there. It is only rewriting my pieces moved through thirty thousand drafts three hundred thousand in this is I'm a weekly critic, yeah, or sometimes daily and I have to work it out, work it out. It's completely done. It's bulletproof. You are a God and then you notice the whole first two sentences are stupid right before you send it, you rewrite them in that last one second. And that's the beginning of your piece. Just like that. The sentence that you spent the most amount of time, the opener would that fly? Like let's say, I got a big solo show at the golden gallery out of left field. No big surprise. And I was like, hey, I find this kind of writing pretentious and it's NFL to my art you. I would like the catalog to say this was inspired by my childhood magic. They would say, absolutely. Yes. You have to understand the galleries are not an EMMY. The gal. Stories are facilitators who are looking for ways to make more artists more money while they make money themselves. Most of the galleries that you see, even though you don't believe me now, they started from almost nothing yet are idiots like you. A lot of them wanted to be artists and some of them are successful. Again, one percent of one percent is successful and Gowaris will say yes to artists. In every case, yes. Now, millions of artists are listening to this saying, oh, no. This gallery said no to me. Well, then that's bad gallery. That's a bad gallery. Good galleries, trust their artists to make mistakes to fail the have to trust that failure, that there's something in there. How does your own experience running a gallery when you are. A young person affect meal. When you walk in and Bushwick and there's six people living in the back, not happens a lot, and you know mattresses have been moved to make a make room for the show at cetera. How do you reflect back on your own experiences, a young person being in a situation like that? I'm ashamed to say, I've never reflected back. I love the question so much like am I thinking about what it was like? I guess I am at all times because a couple of things. I think one any person who has hotspot in the corporation like me, you better goddamn son the artist book job. One walk into the gallery, don't be high and mighty enough not to sign the book. They wanna know have you been there dancing naked in public artists writers creative people. They have the sick need like you like me to dance. Naked in public. And they want to be seen if you only dance naked in private, some people the, you know, if you only make your own food, that's good for some people. Some people like cooking meals in hearing back from others. So you sign the book. Next, I want younger critics geezers like me. My wife for Berta Smith degrade Peter shell doll at the New Yorker weekly critics. These are and others. The older critics. You can't be aiming for us. We're too big in a way the space we have to fill. This is on Kolatsi paper. I want younger critics, three generations have to start going to three generations of younger dealers. Now you got to go. You can't just go writing about how bad Larry is. And Jeff Koons are Damien. Hirst is that's low fucking hanging fruit. Like I say, you wanna. Do one of those a year. Go ahead but you had to put yourself make yourself radically vulnerable. That's my motto, radical vulnerability. Did you have to be able to criticize your own generations and not just right. Dammit, positively. Everybody's in a way been coddled. Most artist graduate school never getting even a negative crypt. And when you got on in the world, you're going to hear some stuff's going to hurt your feelings. And I'm not seeing enough criticism out there of smaller galleries, newer artists, positive and negative. And I wanna see that it's also time I'm afraid the institutions are in trouble. We're in reckoning right now. My generation built disarmed world. We built the city and now it's rotting, it's big, it's beautiful. It's spectacular. And parts of it are dying. It's been overstaffed, it's over paid. They're overworked. Museums have to change. Obviously they have to have a a. Thousand times more diversity, a thousand times, and that's going to start happening. And it is a zero sum game, you'd better listen up people. It's zero sum game. It means older, white male critic, getting a job means somebody else isn't. That's what zero sum is which means from now on. Maybe we need those. Critics aren't going to get the job, a white male, middle aged painter may not get the show. I'm sorry, this is going to hurt. It's gonna hurt for five years. It's going to hurt for ten years into we get to the point where we can have a black woman painter as mediocre as a white male painter. When we reached the point we have parody and I'm happy. I want that. It's a zero sum game, which means. Enes don't pay so much attention to the gigantic institutions. You have to start your own institutions is time. It's easy. If you build it, they will come. I promise you, I, it's thirty five people. Then it's three hundred fifty. If you're any good and you have energy, it's all about energy. Put your own self on the line. You've got to build it. You weren't poorer than I was. I want to tell you something while you're listening to this going to easy for him to say, I too am one paycheck away from being broke. I posted my total life savings in two thousand fourteen on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter. That was I think, for thousand dollars. Okay. So you're gonna listen to this. Go, oh, you got a lot of money. Okay. I'm a thousand years old and I four thousand dollars. Okay. If I lose my job here and I have no contract at New York magazine. If I lose my job here, I don't have health insurance. So what am I trying to say? Woman up man up you at to build this art world, you had to make it up yourself. It's your energy completely. Don't look to the geezers. The way that you described what's happened and museums, there's an idea that they can become more diverse or more modern, but that's in some ways, modernizing the institution and there's a more radical place that art could go. You're posting artists on your Instagram feed now, like, do you ever consider that the the idea that the whole party will move on that these institutions the museums will just sees to be the kind of place an art critic goes. I don't see. Museums has ever being places that art critics wouldn't go to. Because all for me on art is contemporary art. That means when I look at a renaissance painting or cave painting in Indian Mundell, LA, all of it in the present premie this, the eternal present. Now when I'm dead, it's over. So while I do think we must go, not must, but it I, I go to the met with my wife forty times a year, and I still only pay like a quarter. You need to sneak in people. You just work it out when I was a kid. I never paid for anything not stop paying for things. I love going to seal. Darted speaks to me. I just walk around a museum waiting for something to talk to me. If nothing talks me, I go to the cafeteria. In the meantime, I want generations of younger critics going to the other institutions, what after they go to the met and the Whitney and the Guggenheim and the Brooklyn museum, it's Satra after that could other institutions artist run spaces, idiot places in Bushwick that are mostly bad, but maybe there's something good. Maybe there's something in you better talent. If. You don't, and we've lost a few generations. I think to academia, quite frankly, I say this is jealous person who didn't go in wishes that he did, and I do miss out on certain level of the discourse because of it. However, I've seen too many critics not putting out opinion. Or when they do it's buried into the second to the last sentence where they'll go. These sculptures were problem ties and you go wait. Is that bad? That good what you mean? It's problem at ties. I don't understand. Well, it's a language I don't understand is my problem, but we need more critics to write without jargon with the pinion about work from these generations because people are dying on the vine out there. It's ridiculous that a sixty seven year old critic. It's ridiculous that I'm the one posting all these pictures on Instagram. The people are hading liking and liking in hading. I want to talk about the writing because that sounds simple when you talk about it. But I find personally that writing about art, it's one of the hardest things for me to write about even casually when someone will say, hey, what. Did you think of this? The giving of an opinion is a very linguistically difficult act, I think. And so when you started, what year do you publish your first? I think about I'm born in fifty one. I sorta publishing, I think in ninety one. So it's fifty thousand six hundred seventy. One eighty not. I was forty when I sorted, right. Okay. It's ninety one right? New York City. Right? You're sitting down to write your very first few pieces. How does one describe what is on the wall of the show you describe the checklist, the rhyme, purple, shiny bubbly begin. I began in the wrong way, but it's the way everybody begins by trying to sound smart. Share the commodified object of the natural material used in this in a culture, aided blahdy blah. And I had no idea what I was writing about, but I knew what the language sounded. And that's how I began. And then deadlines deadlines are sent us from hell the heaven. What's so interesting about a deadline is when they start coming faster, you can't dissemble. You can't lie. You can't hide which your real thoughts are. And that's when it happened to me by fucking accident. I started putting off the writing. The deadline was coming and I pride myself on never having missed a deadline. It's a dumb rule, but it's the one I've kept. I've decided I've listened to many editors that are too furious at too many writers, and I just don't wanna be that guy. That's me. I'm a lot of assholes, but I'm not that one deadline is coming and it's time to put out what you think or shut up, get out and how do you begin? You know that you're going to mention the artist's name way up there. So you got at least. Two words of a sentence and that in my mind, I wanna get to words of description. So the big rectangular Aaron, what's your last name? Lamour has a presence that seems generic. Generic, but I'm bishops in that it wants, you know, and then start right there put out my feeling is that in the first two or three sentences, you should have a sense of some of the things I'm about to do. And when I stopped doing them, you should stop reading me and I have failed anybody that ever stops me on the street and goes while I started reading your review, and it was really great, and I'm going to read it later when they walk away. I think I failed because you don't pick up reviews and read them. Second time. It's one time I've gotta get you by the collar and keep you there for good, six minutes and that is not easy. Do your ideas change a lot while you're writing? Totally. I never know what I think before. I think it never know what I'm going to say before I say it. I'm always shocked. All of a sudden, I think I like. This guy, I love is podcast. I see his work. I think I like it. I get home. I find it's derivative in generic. What do I do? Well, it's very easy. The deadline tells you what to do. I have no time to quit. I don't have health insurance, so I've got an hour, right? The truth, which is Aaron's work is generic and derivative four. The following nine hundred words why I have to make my case. You can't say, Titanic is a bad movie. Good movie. That's fun. That's what you do after the movie. That's not what a review is you need to describe and judge. Describe and judge. That's what reviewing is, and it should be a pleasure to read for God's sake and maybe a little helpful for the reader to be a little less afraid to hate the writer more to like the artist lasts whatever. Is there a strong distinction between writing about a piece of art that was created this year versus a piece of art that's in a retrospective versus a piece of art that perhaps you've even written about previously twenty years ago, like there's the artistic eternal present yet these stories are of different half lives? Yeah, I often will confront work that I thought I'd like that then I don't or did I thought I didn't, and then I do, and I tried to deliver that up as well. What happens if your dead will I've been negative? Yes, I will. If I don't like. Turner, which I don't that much. I wanna write about that. I find it a little bit bombastic and overly obvious that he's painting fuzzy Goldie clouds of soot and clay yada, yada, and that I might prefer constable for the following reason. I think it's all the same. It's all in play. It's all Pinon you're going to say to me, but Jerry then it's all opinion in my answer is, yeah. So what's your opinion? Have you ever seen a cave painting? What's your opinion of it? Have you ever been? A lot of art was not meant to be in be seen by human eyes. Think of like inside sarcophagi in Egypt, that's only meant to be seen in the afterlife. Some art is meant to heal. Other art was meant only to sort of fly over your army to show that your army was stronger than the other. Some art is meant to cast spells. Fetishes are meant to get you pregnant or keep you from being pregnant. Art has a lot of uses. It has many uses. There's the famous story. I can't remember who told it of the judge at the Hague who was listening to the BAAs. Is knee and war trials who would go see Vermeer at every launch, and they said, why do you see for mere? 'cause through beautiful. Any went well? No, of course not. I see for MIR because he heals pain, you know? So it's only very recently that we've only had one use for art, which was to put a fifty three inches about in the center of a white room and hang it there and buy it. So I'm interested in opening up the discourse and understanding. I'm looking for voice Franklin every case in the writer in the artist in the person, what's your voice even if I don't like it if I don't like your voice, but it's individual. I love you. What was the biggest moment for you in the development here? Own voice. When did you start feeling like I'll I can read this and I can hear. Might true soul speaking. Not that trying to be smart. They do things. I think one was what I was trying to say, but deadlines that they force you to hear yourself. The second was how would that sound? Right? How would it sound well, when I tried to sound like I ca- -demia and our form and all those good things. I didn't like the sound of my own voice and didn't feel it was mine. But then when I read my wife Roberta Smith, I would read Pauling Kayal I would read people like an art critic named Sanford Schwartz, Peter shell, doll, Joan ACA Challah who writes some of the best first sentences I've ever read. I don't know what her secret is. I would hear what juice sounded like, what if felt like. And I thought all I have to do is right how I talk and hope. That I can then create a character that speaks in a certain way because I don't talk. I right in fact, I'm not very good conversationalist you at all. I'm long winded. You can tell. I don't know. I find this a malaria between how you talking right? You have your your exuberant yet in both forms. Yeah, I'm desperate exuberant, hopeful panicked, needy exuberance is not. I would say the default tone of art writing and somewhere along somewhere around the opposite. I wanna be a cheerleader exuberance. Yes, cheerleader. There's too many of those every critique is a good critique. All art is good. Art. Get outta here. Get outta here. What does it have been like being in an ongoing marriage with someone who does the same thing as you do? Do you discuss what you're working on in the house? Where I would wish would I have on anyone. I love being married to so may the does what I do. We talk about criticism, twenty four, seven, and I love it. I talked very little move as we have opera as a hobby, that the batter all we do. That's it. We are so boring. Like I say, haven't gone out to dinner in decades, no interest in it to me. I want to see the shows. We see twenty five to thirty five shows week. There's art to be seen. It's our job to see what's there. Good, the bad, the vary bed. Do we go to galleries alone or together on Saturdays? We begin together and then usually find our ways criss crossing. And then by the end of Saturday, we'll bump into each other at Alaska Alary. I love being married to somebody speaks my language that knows the demons I face and I know hers. His to know what it means to live under a deadline. Many artist disagree with me and they go. I could never live with another artist and I say, whatever gets you through the night, whatever gets you through the night. And if you want money, Mary a lawyer, whatever. I'm a sociopath when it comes to making your work, I really am. I don't care about you the person I only care about your good or bad art that is all I care about and whatever it takes to get your work made. I do not care if you have to take drugs to do it. That's what you have to do. If you're married to a lawyer and that's how you fund yourself. Good, good for you. I don't care. I'm not going to judge anybody because I know how I've been judged. I've been counted out. I am out. I've never written for art form. I've never been asked to write for those big, big cud logs. I'm not on. The important symposium, you know, I'm good with them. I'm good. What's out? I'm really lucky to be able to do what I do, and to be absolutely honest, I think about how lucky I am eighty percent of the time I walk around going. I do not believe I'm not a truck driver anymore. I don't believe it how bad how hard that was, and I always spent a lot of time thinking about a one last thing I wanted to say. But the luck is when I was first asked to come here to New York magazine. Your first question. I said, oh God, no, why would I want are right for New York magazine? I'm at the village voice which is super hip and underground cool and hot. I was paid four hundred dollars a week which to me is a fortune to this day. It's a lot of money, but I don't know everybody's different now and I told some friends and they went, don't you understand New York magazine is getting really great under out a moss and the voice will probably close. And I said, you're kidding, really? I said, I had no idea, and I called up New York magazine. I said, I've got to have this job, and Adam moss took me to lunch uptown who's one of the first and last launches I've ever done and a ritzy Tizi restaurant. And we talked for about three hours and the job never came up. And at the very end when we were leaving, I went woo. What about the job? And he said, oh, what about it? And I said, why would really like it and he went, okay like that. And he said, do you have any ideas about it? And I said, some silly thing or to any went. Sure. We'll talk about that and that was hit and my life has never been the same because I want to write for a big audience. I do. I'm not interested in only the specialist. I'm interested in anybody that might stumble across my idiotic work, begin it and may be keep going and see that art. It's about as specialist sports. Art is no more or less important in this universe to me. Then philosophy or religion that conomic six politics cooking. It's all part of the big bowl of wax and. That's what I want people to hear. It isn't the scary shit, hard thing. It's easy. Final question you've been doing this. How many, how many reviews do you think you've run? I have no idea where you did you stop counting at a specific numbering. Google I came out. Yeah, Google myself. Yeah. And I stopped definitely definitely over a thousand. Oh, yeah. Is there any summary to this project for you? Do you have any overriding ambition, to sum it all up or to say something definitive about a certain streak or certain artists? Just the art contains multitudes, really, and that I found a way to speak. Yes, through this other object, some people do to dancing others to singing and somehow just looking at art is a way to do to. Thank you, Jerry Saltz. Thank you. Thank long-form air Lamour is traipsing around Spanish countryside, true thing that he's doing right now. So he's not here to record these credits. I'm maximum ski. Our other co host is Evan Ratliff our editors piper, and our intern is Thailand McCloskey. Our sponsors this week, the fun people at mail chimp who've made this show possible for years Tapeh call squarespace and pit writers reading department at the university of Pittsburgh. Thanks to them for their support, and thanks, Jerry Saltz that interview. We'll see you next week.

New York magazine New York City Jerry Saltz Jeff Koons Aaron Lamour Larry Gagosian New York Times Chicago Adrian Chan Jerry ABC squarespace Art Institute of Chicago Adrian Adrian Chan Instagram Roberta Smith Malcolm Tapeh writer Adrian Chen art forum magazine
Episode 367: Errol Morris

Longform Podcast

51:38 min | 11 months ago

Episode 367: Errol Morris

"Hey before we get going. I WanNa tell you about a master's program in new art journalism at the School of Art Institute of Chicago. What is canoe art journalism? It allows you to take journalism classes along with other kinds of writing classes along with all kinds of interdisciplinary interdisciplinary stuff alert decode. You'll learn adobe I you learn how to make websites how to write for the web how to pitch a story and then make make an immersive story with all kinds of multimedia episodes you might even learn how to make a podcast like this one right here. The application deadline is January newry tenth. That is coming up January tenth. And before that you've got apply as a I C dot edu slash long form arm. Get yourself a master's in new arts journalism at the School of Art Institute of Chicago. Thank you to them For sponsoring this week's show. I also need to tell you about a new podcast and it's actually not that new. It's been around just like the festival. Then it's based on. It's the aspen ideas ideas to go. podcast features in depth conversations with all kinds of innovative thinkers who speak at the Aspen Ideas Festival. You can get a front row. GROSSI to talks from artists scientists. Business leaders policymakers. And other really interesting people you might not have heard of Subscribe to the Aspen Ideas. He is to go podcast. Whatever podcast APP? You're currently listening to this. podcast on or good aspen ideas dot org slash podcast. Thank you very very much to Aspen. Ideas to go go subscribe. Let's do the show. Hello Hello Welcome to the forum podcast. I'm Aaron Lamour I am here not actually here but on the phone with my good friend Max Linski. Hello Max How are you Sir Edmund? Zana signed back on it man. He's in an another undisclosed location reporting I was at an undisclosed. Does location this week interviewing errol Morris for this very fast AEROMAR has a movie coming out called American Dharma it. It is A bunch of conversations between him and Steve Bannon But it's more than that. It's kind of an essay about interviewing Steve Steve Bannon and it also has a lot of clips from old movies in it and highly recommended Aaron. I don't know that we've talked about this on the show before. But you and I have talked without microphones about about how the long-form podcast often feels like a scam for us. Cher like because there's microphones because we do this thing. We have these conversations with people who would one hundred percent want to talk to in any other aspect of our lives also and I feel like the fact that you got to go. Sit Down with Errol Morris as we talk about how he makes movies and how he asks questions as a It's like It's part of the scam. Real scam is Is this related to our NASCENT FESTIVAL CON CON. Lankan long coming to you in two thousand twenty law a long con- slash kind kind coming soon. Buy Your tickets now. Just buy tickets. Let's we'll be announcing more information Aeromar was excellent. He's the kind of person who has so many interests breasts. It's hard to fit them into a single person. And if you're that kind of person with a lot of different interests why not share them with the the world with a newsletter from Champ They make it really easy. You can always you can always change along the way you know you start your newsletter about one the thing becomes about something else going to sue you Those the rare self segue men that was well done self segue okay. Here's Aaron with Arab horse. What were your first experiences with interviewing like like what was the first time you set up mics and tape someone? Can I even remember. I do remember fairly well when I started recording interviews with murderers I imagined and for whatever misguided reason that I was going to do a PhD thesis on the Insanity which interested me that it still interests dress me in. Saudi is a really interesting concept and those days had very little little money. Has Sony Tape Recorder Cassette Tape Recorder. I would put it down on a table usually was already running. I would very rarely ask permission. May I tape this. Is that okay with you. Instead I would put tape recorder down already running clearly visible clearly visible as tape recorder and proceed. It's slow the better way to describe it. It's the shut the fuck up school of Interviewing based on shutting the fuck up and letting other people talk. Because you never know what you're going to hear just watched your newest movie American Dharma. Yes and the first thing I was thinking about in in the wake of watching it was that Shut the fuck up and listen edict and the points in the movie movie where you do so although I do less of that in American Dharma than in most of the films that I've made but please do well. That was what I was going to ask. Skew about is what are the exceptions to the shut the fuck up and listen role. How do you choose how active to be in an interview of that kind? I'm not sure there's an algorithm that I could point to. There are certainly times when it just got to be too much and I felt that I had to say something but the idea is to figure out something about Bannon. Who is this guy? If it's true and I believe it's more or less true that he was responsible for Electing Donald Trump and twenty sixteen gene. How did that happen? I would think everybody in America or it should be at least a lot of people in America should be interested in in this question. How the fuck did this happen? How did it happen and why this is an interesting question? I certainly it's at the heart of my discussions with Steve. Bannon is history chaotic nor is there some rhyme and reason to history so. I know that Dan is in love with various. Cyclical theories of history. The history is this vast turning wheel that keeps bringing up the same themes the same issues periodically. And who are we. We're the people who are destined to do what we're destined to do. The film and Dharma Duty Destiny. All these D- words so on one hand you have this guy. Hi in love with the Crusades you know why not go back a thousand years and relive all of the nightmares of history. Why not fragment the world into pieces so that we can have small nation states as we had in Europe the twentieth century with if memory serves me correctly quite dismal results and on the other side of the table because we are talking to each other across cross table? I think it's made of sensitive Antique Bowling Alley would or something. I don't know that on the other side of the table. You have me me. Who Really ABC's history is chaotic insane unpredictable a roulette ball bouncing around on a gaming table? One question I asked myself while making this film if Western civilization is coming to an end which it very well might be what caused it and I could come up with no better explanation than one man's irresistible desired to post pictures of his Dick on the Internet. Could someone like Anthony. Weiner destroy not just America but everything else is well. It appeals to me. It's perverse. It's sad it's stupid and Bannon. If anything thing is this insane opportunist a guy who sees away to put his foot in the crack of the door and wedged reg in there so you can't close it. Under any circumstances the opportunities of the Internet which other people a lot of other other people fail to understand or use someone he said to me. I can't even remember probably in an interview about the film saying well. You know sex really wasn't part of the twenty twenty sixteen election and I would say a really you really sort of believe that it was all about sex and it wasn't about glass ceiling sex. It was about something far uglier. You're in darker the whole way. Sex was used Pan and smiling like the cat who ate canary with this look of supreme self-satisfaction as the Clinton accusers come into the room. Before the second debate it the Weiner ad which I find quite remarkable I put it in American Dharma where they associate wieners. Dick pics with Hillary's emails. And they do it in a way. That's effective the touches. Some kind of nerve so the kind of dark bullshit it's at the heart of Bannon Annan is something that we all should pay attention to. I know that the film most clearly echoes McNamara. Jack Namara and the fog of war in your own movie graffiti but the movie that I actually found myself thinking of the most in the wake of it was the movie the made about going to mess around the name. Fred Leuchter Fred. Luter the Fred Leuchter. Here's some interesting factoid about Fred luter. Who is Holocaust denier and electric chair repairman somewhat of an accidental Holocaust denier or a holocaust cost denier by misadventure? Well I would say every single one of the movies I've ever made as a mystery and there is a mystery mystery about Fred luter crystal. I did not name the movie correctly. It should have been called honeymoon moon in outfits and if ever I can change the name I will do so gladly. Did you make an attempt to title at that. People said bad bad idea but beginning at so many bad ideas I feel like it is true. That is it Mr death or doctor. Death was the final well. He wasn't a doctor a he was a Mr. So it's Mr Death and then people think he's Dr deathbed title. Can I talk about that movie a lot and no one ever says. I've also seen that movie Eh. Blend the title. But it's a really interesting study of a person who through opportunism Joins a movement meant. That was kind of the ultimate Tabu movement of its time. And you've now made another film about someone who's the figurehead of Tabu movement. Well that's nice to hear. See with Fred. Luter on he did have his honeymoon in Auschwitz. By the way it's not just a proposed title. It's description of where he chose. I was endlessly fascinated by Fred. I'm endlessly fascinated. Aided by Anti Semitism is suppose I was nine years old. Some kid in the neighborhood. I Ju by the way called me a Christ ice killer likewise by the way you also recalled a Christ killer. No I'm also I've never been called a Christ guy I think that's that's period insult. I think it's a period insult assault. Maybe so I'm called a Christ killer. I don't know what the kid is talking about so I go home to my mom and I say mom someone just call me a Christ killer are. What's that about and my mother explains to me? Well dear that's Anti Semitism and and I said well. I know what to do next time. Next time. Someone calls me a Christ killer. I say I promise never to do it again and say I'm sorry so with Fred is an anti Semite publishing these books and pamphlets with various anti Semitic organizations Holocaust deniers the worst worse than the worst. And you know he drives a lot of people batch it crazy. How dare you? How dare you say this? How dare you say that? But that's where I kind of step up. If that's how you want to describe I wanNA know what. How did he end up in this bizarre position is he really an anti Semite? What is Anti Semitism mean at? Its heart I suppose if you say anti Semitic things you consort with Anti Semites but to me Fred. Leuchter speaks to something far more disturbing the human capacity for credulity the capacity to believe anything under any set of circumstances. Our brains are like mashed potatoes. Even nowadays I mean one of the things that so disheartening about politics and is a million things. Disheartening about politics. Is You watch people people capable of believing anything rationalizing anything as if nothing really matters anymore. Truth doesn't matter rationality doesn't matter. Some kind of coherent argument for one thing over another doesn't matter was. Was it always this way. We did go through most of history leaving in religious mythologies that we find irrational rational. I think part of what for me feels the scariest about this. You refer to being scared quite literally in American Dharma. This gives me Mesa. Fear is the feeling of scare. I'm still I'm still scared to the feeling of going backwards. You know if we had just come out of the cave and it was unsafe but it was an improvement or at least. We're sort of on the positive projector always as a kid when I learned about the Holocaust is a young Ju. It's that feeling of turning back towards barbarism turning the busts of humanity around that is really scary and I think that American Dharma dramatizes that pretty effectively Am curious like when you thought. Okay I'm GonNa tell the last story the last two a years since trump has been president. How do you start telling that history that history? That is the necessary back story to what you're interviewing. Thanks Steve Bannon about well. There's a confusion right at the beginning. What we're talking about is an interview? I don't know what interviews are interviews can be a lot of things often when people say. Well it's an interview. It's by way of saying well. We all all know what an interview is. Well maybe we all know it an interview is I don't know what an interview is. I'm quite unclear about what it is but I am a little bit more clear about what I was trying to do in making this movie and it wasn't just simply to interview Steve Bannon. Although that was part of it it was also to allow. ooh Steve Bannon to talk so that I could figure out some things about who he is and why. He's doing what he's doing. And I think this pisses people off instead of D platforming bannon. It's allowing bannon speak. Why 'cause I'm interested in so kill me Sorry Hey I'm gonNA pause things here. 'cause I wanNA tell you about our sponsor this week. It's the Masters Program in new art journalism at the School of the art institute suit of Chicago so what is a Master's in new arts journalism. It's an intensive two year program that prepares students to rate far more or than traditional art reviews. They learn how to use adobe suite building a publication in design fundamentals of Photoshop how to Code and HTML AND CSS this bill the websites and when someone pitches a story there. It's not just an interview. It's also taking the photograph shooting video creating a podcast episode. Putting article into a layout with custom typefaces this is a different way to write about arts and culture and it's a great city to do it in Chicago is is brimming with museums galleries working artists unusual neighborhoods and far more. If this kind of thing seems like a place you might liked to take your career and there are people who are coming there from all over the world. The application deadline is January tenth for more info go to S. S. A. I. Dot Edu slash long-form again. That's the school of the Art Institute of Chicago's Masters in New Arts Journalism. deadline January tenth S. A. I. C. Dot Edu slash long form. Thanks for checking it out. Here's the show. Does the subject ever seem to you. Like it's too much trouble to be worth like knowing that you were GonNa get this reaction to ban and knowing that it was curious ask for. I didn't know that it would be severe. I add okay. I wouldn't say totally surprised. Yeah but I would say I mean my you usual responses that I knew it was going to be a shit storm. I didn't think it would be a shit hurricane. It's actually an essay. Say Much more than an interview. Think I'll stick with that. Why an essay? I'm always looking for a way in with McNamara. It was a book that he had written about his experiences in the White House. Had first person passages that I found really interesting and really compelling for example his description of this moment during the Cuban missile crisis. Where Llewellyn Thompson tells President Kennedy addity to ignore one of the creuse? Jeff Talley Rams in the interest of avoiding atomic war and because he believes based on his knowledge of Khrushchev which is not inconsiderable. That Khrushchev had been misunderstood with Rumsfeld away. In was these endless yellow perils snowflakes flakes the memoranda that he wrote compulsively the thousands of memoranda that he wrote during his tenure as Secretary Terry of defense during the Ford Administration and then during the Bush administration Panin it was is movies the fact that he loved movies the fact that he had directed. Perhaps I've lost track dozen documentary films that he had been a movie producer that he has a graduate of Harvard business. School had been involved in lying and selling motion picture. Businesses is of course is the man of the people who populist twelve o'clock high which is a film. When he saw the week he went to Harvard Business School? They showed the entire class. This movie movies actually a disturbing movie. I've seen literally thousands of American movies. I'd never seen twelve o'clock high now. I've seen it many any times. Gregory Peck's best performance and extraordinary movie and extraordinarily disturbing movie. 'cause what's it about. It's about `bout attempt to win the war against Nazi Germany with air power and the fact that in order to win win this war. You can't think about right or wrong. You can't think about your own life you can't think about anything except wedding. Getting winning at all cost kind of Neil Listrik deeply meal listrik film bannon loves it and I believe it becomes kind of the Zeitgeist of 2016 except this time in two thousand sixteen instead instead of a war against fascism how ironic. It's a war to promote fascism in America most of the fascist tropes reimagined without much nuance at all the familiar stuff. beat up on foreigners start blaming people balkanization or rebulk nizing the world. And then I guess maybe take it over. I want to ask you about those movies as a piece of the process of making this film sure so at what point is the process. Do you say hey I wanNA make a movie with Steve Bannon Would you think about US watching a bunch of old films and then talking about like how. How do you bring these elements together? Is that something to get workshops who decides what movies get watched ultimately. Yeah I suppose I decide what movies get watched but all the movies were suggested by Steve Bannon. They weren't just pulled out of a hat by me Twelve o'clock high is arguably his favorite movie. He gave me a list not just of movies but if scenes that he wanted to discuss from various movies I suppose among the movies picked. Well there's a whole number of mazing examples but the example from John John Ford's the searchers which is a movie to be sure about racism truly ambiguous disturbing serving movie about John Wayne's search for the Indians who have abducted his niece. What's seen as Bannon pick at of the searchers arguably one of the true masterpieces of American cinema? He picks the scene. Were John. Wayne descends into shadow looking at a girl who has been held captive by the command. And saying she's not white come manch filled with rage filled with hatred in that scene. He moves into shadow faces eclipsed what the hell is going on here. What the Hell is going on when Bannon says made in Vietnam about the uniforms worn by the girls? Volleyball team had to rewind that. Pardon listen to the story because at first I thought I had perhaps masturbate estimate that explained why he was enraged about the Vietnamese inclusion. Do you come to. What do you think he was saying? I think he was saying saying that. It's horrifying that Americans are losing jobs. Well Vietnamese workers are former former enemies from my own generation are thriving. It's almost like the analogy. Requires you to take it out of very very simplistic sort of what is good and evil level. I guess how did you take it. I still don't know but I do agree that a lot of these things things force these into simplistic boxes. I thought that was one explanation. One explanation was you know there should be you really. High tariffs that prevent us from trading with these people who are really our enemies it seemed to have a racist edge into it for me that he didn't like the idea that non whites were making clothing to be worn by the girls roles at West Point it makes me think about. My grandparents said they would never drive a Volkswagen. They refused to patronize German. Businesses I says well for their whole lifetime my mother would never buy a Ford doubt similar reasons. Because Henry Ford supposedly paid for the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and was known rabid anti Semite. So I don't know exactly what he meant. I thought it it was. It was something that I had to listen to several times. You're not the only one to try to figure out what the Hell's going on here is adjust xenophobia. I think yes if I were to do the polygraph some piece of the Pie Xenophobia is. Is it racist. I would say yes I would say. Part of the piece of the Pie is racist. Is it against global trade need. Yeah that goes in to the hopper as well again re balkanize the world set everybody against everybody else. I thought about climate change for example say climate change was a hoax which it isn't but say it was. Would it be so bad. If all the countries of the world work together towards some common end the just might save the planet or just might benefit humanity. Would that be such a bad thing for these people. Yes Yeah Party of Davos globalization was Asian. Hack it all up splendor it all up. Instead of creating any kind of global unity go back to the twelfth through the eleventh centuries. I find it so frightening in so appalling. I mean I don't know what's best for the world who the hell am I anyway but I do know that this stuff is not good. It's scary and people should be dealing with. This is not a time to pretend that this stuff it didn't happen. One of the fantasy is on the left is trump's election was just conspiracy. I would say that we have to look at it and try to understand it so that it doesn't happen again or it will in in some form or another it will when you take a moment like the Vietnam moment and I think you're films consistently deliver moments like that that it feels like it's happening in real time you don't. I don't think no that Steve Bannon is gonNA give this Vietnam analogy at all. In fact all the the people with him his producer. You getting something like a cut the tape off Kinda thing. No no no no no not at all. They were moved by it surprised. Oh Oh I've never heard that story before as an interviewer when you're thinking on your feet and you get served up a volleyball all of that sort like. Where are you thinking? I want to go at this knowing that it might take you a whole day or a whole year to unpack all the ideas. Yes in retrospect. What do you do in real time in the interview after I listened? Yeah there's a lot of stuff that has made me think in his continued to make me think in the movie mean there are really destructive elements in in politics. Maybe people have gotten so tired with everything that all they can possibly think of is destroying everything. And if we've come to that point that's a really frightening and sad point in the world at large and in America in particular. I do believe that the anger towards the movie in towards me is just based on kind of hopelessness. That a lot of people feel we've just been plunged into darkness and there doesn't seem to be any clear way out. Do you take get personally. That criticism does it matter to you what people think about you. I think you should take everything personally. So yes it yes it does. 'cause you you make movies about people who are McNamara Bannon who professionally are hated the people who are willing to just take a huge amount of the American population thinking that they are I believe Lucifer incarnate is Brought up once in the movie people who are very willing to be unpopular. And I find as an interviewer myself. One of my great shortcomings is my desire to be liked When you're sitting down with abandoned like how much does bannon liking you even come into play? You probably does come into play but I think beyond just some kind of mister rogers idea. Will you be my buddy visit desire to actually uncover something learn something. I don't know exactly what it was that I saw in my series of Rumsfeld interviews but at the end I had this terrible feeling that there wasn't very much there there there was just supreme self-satisfaction. Did he was like crazy. Carnival Barker with with Bannon. I'm left with a guy who I think has done a really excellent snow job on himself. He's convinced himself off. I don't know who he thinks he is is. He landed on the way to the Finland station is he. Some kind of revolutionary. The ideologue who is going to become the supreme champion of the disenfranchised and the poor we can have discussions. There's a kind of feeling of connection I am. Well aware that my mother who was a schoolteacher in the five towns on Long Island a music teacher. My mother was forced to take these jobs because by I father died. When I was two years old? She was left with no insurance and yet she raised a family she and sported a fair number of people on a school teacher's salary. Could she have done that today. I don't know I don't think so. So is there a problem. Is there a systemic problem. In American American society about the distribution of wealth. You BETCHA. Are we doing anything to ameliorate it to change. In anything to benefit the Working People's of America I would say precious little I do Askham. You really think that these tax proposals coming out of the trump administration benefit anything but the wealthy this kind of a delusional crazy ass element in all of this that evidently people respond to. I don't know how long but they respond to do it. And I think it's just because this a level of anger that has just peeked into the red zone. The horrible danger area where there may not be any going back. I don't know I so you're going somewhere different with the story about your mother. which was that a Dharma as it's defined in this movie this sense of duty you and purpose that maybe that was closer to Dharma? You know taking care of children on your own than wires Dharma in all these movies. The man who destroys the world without morality air brings about the revolution. Why why would we assume that Dharma Emma is to destroy the world? I guess I guess what I think about my mom. I think about my mom all the time I would say there's something different than Dharma which I would call courage. Did my mom act the way she did at of duty. Maybe she was an uncommonly moral indecent person. She felt very strongly. That's what she had to do. She loved her children and was dedicated to bringing them up in educating them Dharma. I don't know maybe I come from a different kind of tradition. This is Dole destiny. There is no destiny in in history. This caprice inadvertent. There's insanity there's confusion also I was really disturbed by the destiny. Dharma talk the talk duty. Destiny Dharma whatever. Because I felt one-size-fits-all you can use it to justify anything you know. Why did X. happened? Why did why happen well? It was destined to happen like predicting a revolution is going to happen sometime. This country not only could that revolution be anything. In retrospect we could say that every generation this country has experienced a revolution. Question is America capable of reforming forming itself. Our politics is just crazy. The fact that we have all of these principles embedded in our constitution from two hundred plus years ago. Does the electoral college make sense. Does a lot of things make sense anymore. We're we're going through so many changes in everything in the way that information is conveyed to the public. I mean it's a different world now than it was twenty thirty years ago and what happens next. I don't know does making films make sense now. That's a good question question that I have no answer for. I mean I don't make films because it makes sense to make probably if I thought carefully. Whether do they made sense. I would stop immediately. I make him 'cause I have a need to do it. I haven't need to think about stuff writing writing and filmmaking from me is a form of thinking it's an opportunity to think about something and I enjoy it. I really in fact enjoy it. I don't know what I would do without filmmaking. I remember when I first saw thin blue line and someone said to me uh-huh yeah like in that part that was a recreation. I was like what there's re-creations in that movie. I have a very strong ability to just suspend disbelief in almost anything anything. I'm watching and I feel like your use. I have a strong ability to suspend belief in there. You go yeah well I was thinking about all the devices you've used all of the SAS Dick Tools that have been in different. Ones your films to me. I would have always said fast cheap and out of control the most an essay at least before American Dharma. But you have these different approaches different ways of putting two things together that creates contrast the same kinds of tools that are used in essays. This film American Dharma is I think the first of your films. Where are we're seeing tweets on the screen? We're seeing headline news and we're actually seeing a lot of footage that was shot in the last just twelve to eighteen months. Yes it's It's history collapsing on itself. A little bit as essay. which is what's happening? I mean we're in a sea of information much of its spurious some of it probably precious little factual actual and it is part of the story of what is happening. Now I think is a good part of American Dharma the fact that we see we all this stuff going on around. It was that like a negotiation among producers. Like how do you define that visual style. Alan say there's going to be tweet sunscreen. We're doing this no discussion. I mean there is my editor myself working on a project in trying to fully realize it Stephen. Hathaway was absolutely fabulous working with me on this movie. But now there's smell they evolve as you're going along. I read Joshua Green. Joshua Greene writes from Bloomberg admitting the book on banning in this comes right after fire and fury which probably was what drew me to baking making American Dharma in the first place. I haven't met Michael Wolff. I'd like to meet him. Bannon was widely believed to be the major source but yet fire in. I believe I don't think that's a particularly contentious allegation for me to make on. This seems to be the interesting outspoken person in the trump administration and reading that I wanted to talk to him reading both of those books. Fire and fury in Joshua Greens book about Bannon and I believe leave it was in Joshua Greens book that I I read. The twelve o'clock high was his favorite movie and it just seemed away in. Let's create a movie. We were inside of Bannon's head. People seem so oh puzzle is like they've never seen an Arrow Morrisville before. They seem so puzzled that I would put Bannon in this quonset hut from twelve o'clock and it's it's clear that the two were running parallel and some kind of crazy way to fantastic clock on the wall. The QUANTA hat could sell replicas of that o'clock I'm in for one of those clocks. Start shelling the cut from the clock in the movie to the clock in the set is one of my more satisfying in cuts. And do you have that clot fabricated. Sorry I have to ask because I looked online and was trying to find the clock. How do you get that clock? You have really great production designer. Adam stockhausen his absolutely fabulous. He's Wes Anderson's production designer among other things that has drawn resume and beat he does. It's Spielberg Healdsburg. Wes Anderson Law Blah Blah Blah Blah. And also he's an uncommonly commonly good guy but yeah finding all the props the details for that it was really beautifully realised I was reading Mark Singers New Yorker profile of you. Oh you you gotta neutral to to This is the one that's when right after thin blue line is coming out. Yes this is the first year probably forty two and the story. Maybe something like that I think that profile is actually aged very well but one of the things I was struck by in rereading it was was how hard it was to see your movies during the whole first part of your career where you know. There's a few prints circulating. It's like if you went to the Roger Ebert Film Festival maybe taught it and now you have this situation with American Dharma where I could read five hundred hundred takes on this movie by people who haven't yet seen the movie and then when the movie is fully out it will be accessible for five. Boxer locks are probably for free depending on what subscriptions you have like. Tell me about that evolution for someone who's making our to go from like a four digit audience the answer to the massive audience but in in a backwards way four digit audience to kind. It's strange it's strange that all of my films have gotten theatrical distribution. It's not clear how many people actually actually seen any of them. Documentary was kind of unseen and unheard for the longest period period of time. The line I always reference comes from Conan the barbarian one of John Milius best limes used to be just another snake cult. How you see it everywhere? It has become virtually ubiquitous. And because of all all of the streaming services endlessly available. It's very very very very different. When I Made Gates AIDS have heaven? It wasn't clear that anyone would distribute it. Talbot New Yorker Films Kylie decided that he would. It was accepted the New York Film Festival which was kind of amazing but there was a newspaper. Strike Nineteen seventy the ADA said possible. It is newspaper strike in New York. No one knew about it. That movie would have vanished completely. If not for two Chicago critics critics that I knew very little about Roger Ebert and gene siskel started talking about gates of Heaven and they talked about doubted that year in four separate shows that they did which was ridiculous. Many many ways I own my career to those guys. Do you have an alternate version to yourself that maybe hung it up after a couple films. uh-huh and you know it's just leading a quiet life now with a few strange digitize films to show your kids of Hey. I made a movie about a pet pet cemetery once when you were a little. Your son's been on this show by the way. Actually I think you're you're my first father son interview really streakier. We have had nat rich and frank rich on before but that was two different hosts. This is both me so yes he was. He was excellent. When did you have Hamilton little to no? It was around when he put out that Harper story about the magic mushroom Zhuhai fantastic story. Check it out. Everyone Orbit Aberfan father and a fan. You clearly clearly raged in original thinker. I've actually always wondered with you about with your son uncovers all this like wild experimental drug stuff and I have a Jewish mother do you do you worry about about. Your son. Says psychedelic explorations nations. Of course why would but. I'm very proud of him as well. Yeah he's created a lot of interesting testing thinking I would say that his series Hamilton's Pharmacopoeia about thinking thinking about the nature of drugs about our attitudes towards drugs he's interesting. His part chemist part anthropologist documentary filmmaker part a lot of different and things. Will Your your part a lot of things yourself and I guess I wonder like having raised a person who is part a lot of things and ahead a career. That's a lot of things like what would you say to someone who wanted to make work like in the spirit of your work now. Oh someone who didn't see necessarily purely within the documentary film or fiction and nonfiction categories. Would someone like you enter this swirled like now. It's a lot easier. I hope it remains easier. Who knows what's going to happen next but it is possible now to be a certain kind of artist hate to use the word? It seems so pretentious awesome so pompous. But it's possible to be an artist in a way that was much harder years ago. That's a great thing to actually a great thing. It's possible to make films certain kinds of films more cheaply although people have found ways to spend more money than ever on motion picture production. Yeah in that sense we live a good time. Is there stuff you still WanNa achieve like. How many are left on your on last if I read all these stories about are you? There always a list of stories that you've always wanted to do most of which are still unrealized. Even the ones from the eighties and nineties. Until I realized what's still bill left out there for you. And and what are your ambitions for. All those stories are still left. They're more. They're more unfinished projects all the time. I'm starting to more series started one already and I'm starting a second one very soon. I'm working all right. Well thank you so much. Hey thanks for listening to the PODCAST. Thanks to Mars for doing the long form podcast. Thanks to the

Steve Steve Bannon America Donald Trump Fred Leuchter Fred adobe producer Fred Leuchter Bannon Annan Errol Morris Chicago John John Ford Weiner Sir Edmund McNamara Aspen Ideas Festival School of Art Institute of Chi John Wayne Aspen Ideas Roger Ebert Aspen
Winsor McCay born - September 26, year unknown

This Day in History Class

07:07 min | 1 year ago

Winsor McCay born - September 26, year unknown

"Today's episode is brought to you by fresh. Cravings fresh craving salsa is made with fresh vine ripened tomatoes crisp handpicked vegetables and Zesty zesty peppers and spices. I had the mild spice version of the Salsa and it was pretty much. The perfect level of spicer me the flavor is all melt together really nicely and the consistency is perfect to put on a chip it also has this homemade salsa taste and it's never cooked or pasteurized. It's refrigerated and sold in the produce section and it's made by a family owned Arizona based company. You can find fresh craving salsa at the store. Nearest you or you can visit it. FRESH CRAVINGS DOT com this day in history. Class is a production of iheartradio Hi. I'm eve welcome to this day in history class a show that reveals a little bit more about history day by day. Today is twenty six twenty nineteen. The Day was September twenty six sometime in the mid eighteen hundreds Ritz Windsor McKay was born McKay was an influential cartoonist and animator well known for the Comic Little Nemo in Slumber Land and his pioneering advances animation McKay was born Zina's Windsor McKay though his birthplace and year is unclear he began drawing during his childhood and he later said that he drew for himself not anyone else he drew incessantly anywhere he wanted to and he said he never saved his drawings. McKay's parents sent him to business college but he continued to be drawn to art. He skipped skipped classes to draw portraits visitors at a dime museum he would sell those drawings and share a cut with the museum he did not finish business school but it all the time he spent drawing in selling his work helped him hone his skills as a professional artist and it instilled in him a desire to perform John Nine goodison an art professor at Michigan State Normal took notice of McKay and began giving him private lessons that helped mackay develop skills in his technique composition and perspective goodison encouraged him to attend the ART Institute of Chicago. He did go to Chicago but he did not go to school there. He worked at a printing company in the city but two years after he arrived there he moved to Cincinnati Ohio there air. He began working at another dime museum but this time he was making a promotional posters and art as an employee outside of his work at the museum them he painted billboards and created drawings in a continuous line not long after he moved to Cincinnati he met Maude Leonore to four with whom he later had two children McKay's ability to do those continuous line drawings and his talent for drawing things for memory proved useful useful after eight years at the Die Museum he began working for a newspaper called the Tribune as an artist reporter illustrating stories and drawing cartoons he also created art is a freelancer for the magazine life a lot of which portrayed racist humor as did other work included in the Humor magazine. When the Cincinnati Inquirer him larger salary he began working there and soon rose to head of its art department. Some of his most popular and notable illustrations were done for a series called the tales of the jungle and they accompanied homes created by the Sunday editor. He was only at the Inquirer acquirer for a few years before he moves to New York and began doing illustrations for the New York Herald and the evening telegram there he began using the comic comic strip format which was new but growing more popular he wanted to have the money and fame that came along with having a popular comic Strip that could be syndicated he found success with his comic Strips Little Sammy Sneeze and dream of the rare bit fiends but he was working a lot and did not feel he was being uncompensated. Fairly he ended up getting a raised and in nineteen zero five his comic. Little Nemo in slumber land made its debut in a Sunday comic section. Any of the Herald Little Nemo was immediately popular being picked up for translations in OPERETTA clothing and Games it ran the Herald until nineteen eleven then in the New York American under a different title until nineteen fourteen McKay also began performing in theatrical reviews as a fast scatter and in nineteen eleven he finished his first animated film which featured characters from Little Nemo McKay he went on to create more films including the story of a mosquito and Gertie the dinosaur with the latter film he used a technique he called the MacKay split a system breaking the dinosaurs movements into small parts and filling in the drawings between the poses in Nineteen fifteen he created his longest film the thinking of the Lusa Tanya which he created using transparent celluloid sheets he found a success and passion in his work on animation but hearst publishing his employer was not happy about how much time he was spending on his outside work between his relationship with hearst and feelings about commercialism of animation he lost some inspiration around cartoon in July of Nineteen thirty four he went into a coma and died at his home in Brooklyn. After having stroke McKay's work in cartooning and animation at greatly influenced the advancement of the animation industry. I'm jeff coat and hopefully you know a little more about history today than you did yesterday. And if you like to learn more about McKay you can listen to the two part episode of stuff you missed in history class called Windsor McKay get more notes from history on twitter instagram and facebook at td. I H fi podcast. Thanks again for listening and we'll see you tomorrow for podcast from iheartradio visit the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows this episode is brought to you by the Rolling Stone Charts Rolling Stone is the definitive outlet for all things music bringing you. The latest news interviews and reviews rolling stone is your go-to source to learn everything about groundbreaking artists and now rolling stone is going even further show you what it means to be on the rise introducing the rolling Stone Charts and Interactive Seta Music Charts that offer an in-depth in the moment view of the biggest songs albums and artists in music the rolling stone charts the definitive guide for trending breaking popular music in the age of streaming his at rolling stone dot com slash charts or search R._S. Charts.

Windsor McKay dime museum Cincinnati Arizona ART Institute of Chicago Cincinnati Inquirer New York Herald Chicago New York apple Inquirer goodison Tribune Michigan Die Museum editor Herald mackay
#1216 - TBT: Clothing Design Co. Adapts to COVID-19

Side Hustle School

08:58 min | 5 months ago

#1216 - TBT: Clothing Design Co. Adapts to COVID-19

"Brande new book. The money tree is now out in the wild. Or at least it's out on lines and somebody. Bookstores are closed. These days but you can still pick it up from any online retailers including Amazon audible dot com or apple books or of course support your local bookseller by going to bookshop dot work. Now this book is really different. From others tells the story of finding the fortune in your own backyard which is the theme. You might be familiar with from listening to the show but the story is told three cast of characters in a fictional setting. I really is the book I wanted to write. I'm proud that we've had over a hundred five star reviews on Amazon already and it was also reviewed by the New York Times. So if you're trying to find your way out of a financial difficulty or perhaps if you know someone who is. It'd be really grateful if you consider buying a copy for yourself and a copy for that friend you can learn more money tree book. Dot Com. Thank you so much for your kind support. I'm excited to keep making the show for you. Hey what's up friends listeners? Sottile school community CRISCO. I have the privilege of making this program for you every day. I have been doing so since January one twenty seventeen. I'm thrilled to continue. Even the age of so much change disorder chaos etcetera but where is the opportunity whereas the opportunity? How can we adopt? How can we perhaps even learn to thrive? That's what we will look at today. This is the throwback Thursday segment where we take an in depth. Look at someone who story has evolved considerably since we first feature them. You've got all sorts of features throughout the year on today in our latest one. We will hear from Lydia Crossbow who we featured a long long ago. I forget the episode number But she will tell you. Maybe it's actually nine sixty nine. I can see that now episode. Nine six nine. She is a textile designer. Who just so happened to be expanding her business into a retail shop. Right is the pandemic known as Kobe. Nineteen began to hit covered. Nineteen if you've heard of it okay. Just just making sure well. Fortunately Lydia has adapted and she's done so swiftly. I've been really impressed with what she's able to do. Both in terms of her attitude and perspective also her action. So in this update. You'll hear very honest report from her. I I'd like to thank our sponsor and I will come back at the end to wrap up if you are still using one of those big wireless providers this year. Have you ever ask yourself what you're paying for you're paying for expensive retail stores inflated prices in hidden fees and you're also being taken advantage of because they know you'll pay well? Internet mobile mobile provides the same premium network coverage. You're used to but at a fraction of the cost. Because everything is online you can use your own phone and keep your same phone number along with any of your existing contacts to get your new wireless plan for just fifteen bucks a month and get the plan shipped to your door for free. Go TO MITT MOBILE DOT COM slash hustle. That's meant mobile dot com slash. Cut Your Wireless Bill to fifteen bucks. A month had met mobile dot com slash hustle. My name is Lydia Crespo. I live in St Louis Missouri. My businesses argument defiance. And I just wanted a second business. Call Cozy Shop. We opened last November and I was featured in episode nine sixty nine. It's a textile design company. We make and sell clothing scarves and homegoods. We focus on service design of the options that we create easing dyes paints in France. To make every piece coming out of the argument in defiance studio unique in one of a kind. When I was an Undergrad I went to the school. The Art Institute of Chicago. I started dying silk Specifically silk scarves after taking a class on natural dyes. I had an opportunity to sell them at a school rummage sale and they completely sold out so I knew I had something special here. Shortly after graduating I was one of fifteen undergrads chosen to receive a grant to continue my work after school and that grant actually ended up being my fulltime career because I used it to invest in my business so now my main hustle is defiance and now running our brick and mortar shop which is called Cozy Shop but before Twenty Sixteen Win. Argument in defiance was still my side hustle. I was many things. I was an art gallery manager a nanny housekeeper. I worked at a hardware store. I was a Barista you name it. I probably worked it. There has been some major changes since I was last featured on side-hustle School Episode Nine Sixteen. I entered a contest called retail next a contest that was looking for the next big idea and retail. I came in second place. However the judges were so impressed. With the idea of combining a boutique with the with an experienced face. Creative maker space. They offered me the grand prize packages. Well the Grand Prize package was one year wrench free From Cohen equities a businessman championship and a marketing build out budget. So it's been an amazing few months But a lot has been happening so one of the biggest challenges that is facing is even though I was given a year rent free. Things that are free aren't always free right so it was came with its new challenges. I had to all of a sudden hire staff were before I had just been a a one woman. Show Now I had employees working for me and And had a a whole lot more responsibilities that come with that like everyone in the entire world right now. We're having to pivot our plans and strategies because of Kobe. Nineteen global pandemic. We closed our shop to the public in early March and within a week we had a brand new website up. That was shuffle cozy shop. Cozy shop is also maker space where we host a lot of workshops and community gatherings so we had to shift that idea to. We turned our workshops. Kits that can be shipped right to our customer's home so that they are healthy in crafting at the same time for my other. Business argument defiance. We pushed up the release dates of a few of our favourite designs We are preparing for a big spring and summer sale where we do all of our pop-ups and festivals and all of those were being canceled since we no longer had to prepare for travel. I did a huge online push about our new products. The quick pivot really paid off. We sold through all of our inventory in a little over a week and we continue to bring in amazing sales last episode. Nine sixty nine. I spoke frankly about My mental health experience. And I think now more than ever. It's incredibly important. Give yourself plenty of breathing. Room in grace to find with this new normal is going to look like for Your Business. And it's not an also it's not a solution that you're gonNA find right away for me. It was allowing myself to agree over their plans and expectations. I have for my business that were lost because of cove nineteen That was the first big step in allowing myself to grieve and find a new direction. It's what allowed me to gain control over my anxiety and move forward heart. What's up with Chris Again? Lydia thank you so much for sharing that detailed update including both the amazing things and what has worked. Well as well as the challenges. I just appreciate your honesty and transparency so much. I know it's going to help a lot of other business owners inside. Hustler is out there. And I'M GONNA continue to look for positive examples of ways that people are transitioning adapting to a world in which you know so much is outside of our control help to keep bringing them to you. I've been talking about this a lot. This topic in general a lot to my youtube series YouTube dot com slash. Chris Gayle about which is every weekday live at nine. Am Pacific Time. Now as I said I'm looking for positive examples but I also think it's okay to just also accept reality and to say that this is a difficult time for a lot of people out there so I try to balance that between saying okay. What can we do. How can we make something positive? How can we adapt just as Lidia has done while also understanding that these are going to be some massive changes and of course disruption is forced to change? So it's not anything that we would have chosen but again so much out of our control. What is it within our control? What can we do? That's what I'm trying to answer myself and explore in different conversations with people so let me know how you're doing with that twenty twenty year of interaction if you have a question comment if you'd like to update us about your side-hustle whether it's related to nineteen or something completely unrelated Come TO SEATTLE SCHOOL DOT com slash questions. We're featuring them throughout the year as you can tell along with updates from other listeners. Thank you so much I really appreciate you. Hi I'm glad you're out there. My name is Chris Keller wrote this is silence from the onward project.

Cozy Shop Lydia Amazon New York Times Lydia Crossbow Lydia Crespo Chris Gayle homegoods Sottile school SEATTLE Art Institute of Chicago apple St Louis Missouri youtube Chris Keller
FOF #2884  Gigi Goode is the Best

Feast of Fun

1:02:40 hr | Last month

FOF #2884 Gigi Goode is the Best

"Four top three Paul's drag race Queen gee-gee good theater and are always been a family affair. Inspired her passion for fashion. and. Even her brothers are designers engineer. After, joining up watching Paul drag race on TV as a teenager. Gt Good Dreams came true. Not only did she get passed on the show she showcase her town, all the ways, the season finale then the pandemic hit and instead of a nonstop whirlwind tour of Dragon Jiji's at home on the Internet just like all the other queens shaking the hips sinking their lives. Customer. Worry. Judy's. Drive the crowd wild in Chicago Ny. Sensible. Distance. Today G good. Paul's drag racing season twelve joins us to talk about Vauxhall events drive and drag first public performance endemic shut the everything down and her season drag race route plus a closer AH tribute. On snatch game and the Elisa affect how the human mind in the blanks and favorable ways when information is missing and transformed the every day and the. Feast of. All could. Face defined as possible because of fabulous listeners just like you for an ad free experience visit feast, dot com slash plus and become a member today. Before we begin, let's listen to radical faces. Cover of goonies are good enough. William say he's starting to feel Polish. Pool Stumble and. Old. fashioned. stage. To. Temporary Hello. Hi Is this gee-gee good. This just happens to be good good enough for you make. All Cindy Lauper goonies. Yes. Honey I know good morning. Hi this is Fausto Mark. How are you today I'm fabulous. How are you? We're not just good. During incredible. Incredible. Fucking Way Gd congratulations on all your success on repulsed drag race season forty, eight, forty, nine, thirteen. Mike that I've lost track over the years. Thank you think the experience like for you being a top three queen in quarantine. Well certainly different than it would have been had not been in quarantine had not happened. However, I have been loving the amount of time that I've had to like really reconnect with my drag art and I'm kind of cultivate and almost plan ahead I don't know what I'm like exactly planning for because. God knows when the be over. But if the nice to really get like a good hold on what I'm doing and what I'm going to be doing I'm sure you're getting a lot more sleep than the drag queens from past seasons of the top. That's the you know that is. Because really I would be like on another plane, another plane, other club, another hotel you know like I. I don't know how those queens like had time to dream up new concepts and ideas hospital came. Well. Yes. That'll to. So. Runs the runs in the faucets there literally around every corner. Well I mean for you. It's it's not that unusual to stay home and work on your drag. I mean in a lot of ways growing up in. Woodstock Illinois your mother really cultivated the creativity, the artistic life of her children, right? Totally totally totally and I mean, both of my my older brothers are they are artistic their designers, my oldest brother's an industrial designer my. The middle brother had spent a lot of time with graphic design into websites and what have you, and so however when we were growing up, that was not really their main interest they really cared more about like sports and skateboarding and like boy stuff and I was just not into boy staff I wanted to do the complete opposite and so I was lucky enough to just kind of be Velcro to my mother's side at all times. Watching him pay close attention to everything that she was doing and so your mother realized she had a very special child when her. That Mommy I want to put on makeup like Pablo Picasso. Well. For a while and this, there was no reason for this because I know that my mom would would have accepted it with open arms but for a long time especially in like middle school and high school I they she and my dad had no idea that I would just stay up like night after night after night and end up having like. Pretend I'm sick the next day because I was so exhausted of pudding like six different faces of makeup on and You, know that's just what I did like single nine. So you would put on lipstick and then be like this is not the right shade, take it off and. Honey honey full face. I would do full faces and then wipe it off and then do another full face on wipe it off and I'd be up for like six hours. It wasn't really until I was like. Fourteen that my mom kind of really saw an interest that I had in the art form. It was kind of like a little like a dry spell because when I was little little little, it was painfully obvious that I would much rather be wearing lip gloss than a baseball cap or like wearing the ruby red slippers instead of a, you know a t shirt. And then it just there came a point in you know me growing up through elementary middle school that I was like you know I wasn't trying to hide anything. It was just kind of slipped through the cracks a little bit, and then came back when I was a teenager. What what age were you when I started watching Paul's drag race when I started watching repulsed drag race and you're going to be a little surprised was on season seven when when season seven came out was when I became aware of the show repulsed drag race oh is the season with a Trixie mattel and Violet Katayama, which I mean still to this day is probably my favorite season of drag race. That's the worst season of. No I know but if you think about it and. It might not have been the best season like while it was happening, but it really came out with some of the most iconic Queens, sure like all a as a collective. Obviously that check. Now, you have national for fashion and art I'm wondering as a kid did your mother cultivate that by taking you to museums? If. Sort of we went to I mean we would go to the children's museum in from. CHICAGO. So we'd go to like the Art Institute of Chicago especially like on field trips that was like the main place to go and the Museum of Contemporary Art is another one of my favorites and I would I would say, yes, I think there was definitely a lot of subliminal inspiration that was being taken but again like when I was. Still sort of this way a little bit when I was younger and I was kind of doing my own art I had no interest in being inspired by other things I wanted everything to come from my own mind all this. So when I say subliminally inspired, yes I was like clearly taking aspects of these things that I had seen but I was definitely too stubborn to say that was inspired by something it just had to be my own is interesting You did a video with John Paul Hey for their social media machine and you really talk about how Madonna's iconic blonde ambition designs inspired. And in the you talk about sort of how important is to cultivate that passion in. In in owning your. Gender and sexual nonconformity is also tied to understanding and really appreciating the cultural things that influence us totally yes and like like I said in a in the video briefly was that. You know I had been made aware of the John Pogo ta blond ambition look. Obviously and I had also been made aware of his like really high men's trousers with suspenders that would like hit you at the ribcage But at the time I had no interest or idea who was creating those pieces I just saw that it was something that Madonna was wearing. Woolen, the nineties, every gay man had one of those John Paul Gautier perfumes for John Paul, gone Ta designed these really. I guess the. Man had a bomb of the I can tell you right now I'm staring at one right now. Yes do with the little. It's the bronze like cone Bra with the pink liquid inside. He did a one for the guys and it was a sailor blue sailor bottle. Oh Yeah. I have the Rainbow version of that right now interests and then realize he did more I think sometimes when you do perfumes like you, you work that perfume for the next fifty sixty. Yes. He also I mean, he gave me. There's there's a new one that he gave me that actually smells. So delicious smells like Welch's grape juice. So I've been wearing now. That's interesting. So like the future of Colognes, perfumes is sort of having more food flavors because I noticed I remember when in the early two thousands of people started wearing vanilla. Vanilla and I was just like. The sent Magadan. Faster. But truly yeah no honey I love I. WanNa smell like something like my winter fragrance is a room spray that smells like pine trees. So, in terms of you like, do you see sent as an important component of drag? Yeah. Too I think that and I think you could ask just about any drag queen that if you're a drag queen you you've got you've got a sense and whether that is just what you have that is traveling around with you until it runs out onto the next one or it's Something that you in love with like I. Know Like Violet got to come out with her very own fragrance called dirty violet, which is something I would love to do if I could make my own fragrance and have that just be like my sense. That's what I want to start working on and just as long as you don't smell like for breeze because back in the day A. Drag Queen in the world especially, the ones that were sure they all smelled like for briskets who's time to wash their clothes between you know well that and it's just cheaper and easier to run to the CVS to grab a fragrance than it is to you know like a Neiman Marcus or whatever. Well. At least you don't smell like pull my finger. Out this is a phone call you. There's no smell-a-vision and I know some drag queens who you're like girl for breeze would stop. Oh honey me too me too. Isn't that just sad washer drag right wash. Your new GIG, voss events drive and drag is that it really doesn't matter what you like as long as the OH. Yes. I am baby. I'm about to smell like stank because I'm doing this in Chicago in the heat of summer are you in Chicago right? Now? Well, I'm supposed to be doing the I was supposed to be doing the LA show but. It got rescheduled and the only reason I'm doing Chicago show is because my grandfather's memorial services that and my mom would have me sooner die than miss this big. You know family event. So I just figured while I'm in Chicago I would do the drive in show in it ended up being the only show I'd be able to do I'm sorry about your grandfather. Thank you very much. It's okay but yeah, it's IT'S GONNA be very hot, very warm and. Is. It not am I wrong like how does it feel today? It was like eighty four degrees I took the dog to the Lakefront and it was it was oppressive in the sun. But if you're in the shade, it's Okay and at night it cools down a little bit but. Who knows it could be one, hundred, ten degrees when you're here. Degrees, we'll have have you done it yet no, I haven't the Chicago is going to be my first and only yeah. Yeah because I saw lady bunny. FACEBOOK and Was the most hilarious thing I've ever so funny but can you oh my gosh just that wearing the mask and performing sweating and she's got eight wigs on her head like might odd and you know what's funny is that this is my very first gig on a stage since the season started airing. Like three four months ago this'll be your first time in front of an audience. Yes. It will be my first time in front of an audience since the season started airing and it's very, it's a little nerve racking. You know because I've I have kind of spent so much time I moved to L. A. Two years ago and instantly was doing drag nearly every single night for for the next couple of years, and then it just went to nothing for. You know three months since so now liked doing photo shoots putting heels on my God these heels really hurt. To say like. Drag has there's windows for dry. You can do drag and then all of a sudden that window shots and then y'all my gosh. I can already feel it like my body is is really not getting used to to all of it. What were some of your favorite venues to performance in Los Angeles back in the day when we had. Back in the day back in my day. I. Loved performing at will make his kind of like the home for me and all my friends we were there every single Sunday we were there one Wednesday throughout the and on Mondays for showgirls I would do a lot of the showgirls performances and I love that stage I've been watching the showgirls videos for years and years and years I also love performing at like my favorite place to perform at a dive bar I love Foo Bar which I don't know if you're familiar but food bar is just teeny tiny little. Hole in the wall with cobblestones floors that do not make it easy to perform on but it's just fun because at my the thing that I miss the most is being able to touch and interact with fans in like just I you know digital drag is fun because you get to really be full control of the creativity and what you're doing but I just love like I yearn for that connection between me in an audience. Well, the drag Vani really influenced the the performer. Early, we're we're really close friends with your uncle Stuart. As here in Chicago he's been a bartender at this venue called big chicks, stig chicks have you been to big tricks? When I was much younger and you know my parents were kind of. Dealing with my gender identity in what have you my mom ended up taking me to go visit my uncle. Just to kind of you know he's the he's the only other person in my entire life that was gay. Still hasn't gone back into it yet, but stay tuned. Worldwide so Engine closer. But yes. So when I picture me at age thirteen, something like that. Walking into big chicks with all the pictures hanging on the walls. And all this stuff. Yes it's it was it was really cool to see. My uncle's life because it was so vastly different than the life that I had been surrounded by Woodstock. Illinois big chicks is a very important gay bar and cargo institution, its owner Michelle Fire. WHO's a dear friend of ours as well. And big checks as a venue that I got my start as a drag queen here in Chicago. was she collects a lot of great photography and art? Yes. All these Diane, artists photo graphs, and they're all having to do with like gender and Feminine Expression Right and so you know I imagine like for you as a twelve year old drag queen seeing those those paintings in the pictures must have caused quite an impression on you. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean it for me also growing up, it was never an internal struggle for me. Gender has never been an internal struggle. It's never been like really a struggle at all the only struggle that has been is me feeling like it was a burden on others in regards to like my dad and my brothers and never my mom because she's always been you know incredible but so. You, know when I did learn all these things. Of course, it really opened my mind up to a whole other world of of people who are like me But if anything it really just solidified my. View of my my own self and so at what age did you turn to your mother? Who is a costume? Designer says mother I want that dress in the catalog. Well you know my mom's been sewing my whole life little things here and there but it wasn't really until I was in the fifth grade. Um and she forced me to audition for Woodstock Children's summer theater and What did you play in that show? Well, in the very first one it was high school musical junior and I was scared number two oh my. That's so cute. Yes. In the continue to do these shows up until my eighth grade year after that, I would go back every summer as like an older kid to to help out with hair and makeup. But because I was in these shows, these shows require costumes and before I had entered the shows, the costumes were little questionable. So my mom decided she would kind of go in full force in she would cost like these entire productions with sixty kids and and do all these things in that kind of really opened my eyes up to what she was able to do and then. I think the first thing that she made me was actually ironically, very similar to my bride wore black runway that Christians your. But it was in white. So she made me a big white Christian Dior wedding dress when I was about fifteen years old. Stage girl you're getting married why? Don't let me down don't let me to. Just do what the Nice man tells you to do. Lip Sing Song on Hall Stars everyone hated it. So much I thought it was A. Song for all stars it was just done very poorly. I there was all this debate on the Internet whether fancy is an appropriate song for drag Queens Lip sync and I'm like, that's like that connick. Song Yeah of all people people are just so up in arms nowadays about so many different things don't realize there's much bigger problems to worry about. If there's something that I just want everyone to understand. It's that drag drag is not meant for censorship we are it has never been the history of drag has never been. You know NSF w Or say you know what? I'm trying to think. It's not safe for it is entirely not safe for work and I it's a shame that it has been censored so much because. So much of of the humor and the comedy in the looks and everything revolved so much on on those you know very wild things that people are now just. All stressed about reason, while it's definitely very much the roots of a lot of that because when you look at those kind of spaces where these things were done, it was usually bars and those kinds of venues, right? So I like pretty much anything goes any kind of humor go any kind of action go. Mainstream. TV and you know the audience for a lot of it is you know twelve thirteen year old girl that your old. Dry can be many things, and of course, we love the Raunchy version of drag but obviously, not to censor anything for a twelve year old totally and don't get me wrong I think it's absolutely incredible that we have these. Fans because if I if if I was that young and I became aware of. A Drag Queen I would, of course, things that they were a superhero I think that's incredible. But at the end of the day, you know real drag like real true drag is not meant for children. Hunting you don't WanNa Piss off a twelve year old girl. You don't WanNa Piss off a twelve year old girls mom quiz drag time with story kids those re drag Queens, reading stories to kids them is that you know no no I love that I mean there there are certain things like for drag. That things like that like conventions and and what not I think. It's amazing for these kids to be able to meet these these drag Queens But odds are a drag queen became a drag queen because they were you know submerged in this. Super Raunchy Queer night life where they learned lots of Raunchy Queer things and it's you'd be surprised how hard it is to really censor your language when you're around children while also one thing you're being spared of as those meet and greets twice a g g good paying touch. Jj. From and. It's it's it's wild I I have never had a meet and greet I have the only fan interactions that I've had are when I'm outside wearing a mask and. Just trying to cross Beverly Boulevard what's Nice? Oh so a lot of ways sort of your snatch game persona, your tribute, which was based on Sofia the first robot arm. Of the country Saudi Arabia. And Maria the. Metropolis that I'm just licensing reasons or copyright whatever. But that's also a character to Maria is is the the robot based that C. Three, Po and Star Wars is based on what? Did you. See See three pl is not only gay but also based on A. Robot, in the film metropolis that your character Maria shares the same name. Interesting. Grew. But together. But I'm about to start a we actually talking to g good or virtual. Her telling you TD's in the other room painting her nails. In well, why did you choose that robot and why did you change your name? Well so so the thing with that was the reason that I I had to change her name because I was originally going to do. So the other is Natura change her name was for because technically she is like a copy written owned piece of machinery however when I was preparing my my loophole was she is a citizen of you know. I think she's a US citizen now to the Arabia she was the first robot to become a citizen of any country was Saudi Arabia right? which is you know it doesn't matter if she has any rights or not because she's a woman right? So Yes exactly. No but I figured listen she has citizenship she has a credit card she's. Card she dies I. Mean I did my I did a quite a bit of research and watched a lot of interviews girl I. Don't know I don't know if she's shopping on Amazon. Jack she needs to be working on her. Her Wardrobe. Certainly fleeting for her but well I thought it was really interesting that you chose a robot and part of that is the concept of the Elisa effect and how it dovetails with drag. So the Eliza effect is the human mind when it gets incomplete option in not only fills in the blanks with favourable information but also assumes that something that's not alive is alive and at some rain that is humble is actually greater than the sum of its parts. So for example, like humanity. Is, always looked into the clouds in the sky and ascribed shapes in there but also described it as a supernatural or religious significance. Totally. Okay. Gotcha. Yes and so for you, it's like the lies the effect is really great because you know your your humor were so sublime but at the same time, very minimalistic right and so every every little thing that you did became much much much funnier because fact that we're wanting to see this robot kind of throws them shade, Rupaul? Zwane. I mean, it's fun and and my only I mean, my my word of advice for any queen who wants to be on ru Paul's drag race is to do someone in history someone who don't really know what they're like. We haven't seen them in an interview. We haven't seen them in motion or or someone who may not be entirely real like a robot or you know what have you because that way you can do your research on them you can find out who they are, what they, what they did for society and what their role was, and then you can just. Say whatever you want to because no one can say that out that's not that's not what you know. So and so sad that's not meritas catchphrase. Exactly. I'm Maria. When she's not on daytime television with drag, it's like you're not really a superstar but now you are because dressed up like one. Yes Sir that is you're right. You're absolutely right. Now you have I mean you have a million subscribers on your instagram I look to your. Three. Dots a real nice round number one million. is satisfying and you know what? I'm going to stay that way and so we had one, million, one, hundred, thousand. So we got a minute before that happens and I'm satisfied with that. Do you feel like sometimes it's overwhelming or that you're putting yes. There's like pressure to talk about things that you're not ready to talk about. Yes. I mean, it's overwhelming in the sense that it I mean you you wouldn't believe the amount of messages that I get every single day in the amount of people who are just so disappointed that I didn't answer them and it's really like. Actually physically impossible for me to get to all these messages and that's the thing that so hard as because I want these fan interactions what like I crave them so bad but there's just no way to be able to connect with each and every fan and You know on the other end of things. Cute ones. Absolutely. Cubans I look for six pack in the profile photo realized just how I go. you know on the other hand it's it's incredible to think that. Each. One million there are one million people human beings who are paying attention to my art and what I'm doing. In in some degree and it's just it's it's a mind blowing my mom. You wouldn't believe how mind blowing my mother about it she is. Just beside herself what does she turned into like Gypsy Rose Lee and be like I had a jury. Funny. About my mom is she has zero counties zero interest in any sort of fame. Any sort of fortune she does not care about making money. She's gotten requests from so many ru girls to make them look and she says no to each and every one of them she just does not care like dragged to her is fine. It's great. It's whatever it's an entertaining whatever but she doesn't care about dressing drag Queens. She cares about you know making her youngest son happy and so she she's you know. To her the fact that she has she has like forty thousand followers or something like that. Now she she hates it. What what is your mother hated like she could just delete her instagram like Rupaul to. I'm well, yes but I wouldn't let her show. That these days we know yet. No one has said anything. You know what I think it is I think that Rupaul is just saying you know what I've I. I've I've done what I needed to do I don't need to pay attention to these fans need to risk onto these fans. The thing about Rupaul is there's always some outrageous rumor. Circling around the Internet totally latest outrageous one was that Rupaul had quit being the host of rupaul strike race and that they're filming season without her and I'm like that is. Audie. Dead Body. I mean that I just I don't think that would happen. You know something about Rupaul that is. Just important to note, and obviously, you can think what you want about her are people have their opinions. But rupaul whether she's done some questionable things in the past or not is a trailblazer end is shake said it so eloquently in the finale of stars. Without Rupaul, we would not have the platform that we have like as queer community let alone just drag Queens. Really pave the way for us so. You know just well, that's why I think you know with social media. It's so important to build coalitions. It is you know when we stand back and think about the role that drag Queens played the black lives matter movement is very, very significant. Role and that role wouldn't have as much of an impact here in Chicago with Shea the Vixen or New York with peppermint and Bob the drag. Queen I wouldn't have that that gravity had it not be for the coalition that was built around Rupaul drag race and there's A lot of shortcomings on repulsed draggers we all will agree. But then that some is a positive gain that can up doors and windows for more inclusivity from other venues in the future. Absolutely. Yes. I mean we just need to recognize. The, the amount of of luck that we've we've been granted as as a community in how we are I mean. If you can imagine everything that's going on in the world right now and remove drag queens like drag Queens are the only people keeping this queer world entertained right now As, you're very welcome planet. Well, you know when we started doing this podcast way back in two, thousand, five, four years before drag race even premiered we would interview drag Queens people conscious like why do you always have these drag Queens on our show? I'm like. When you go out to a bar who's performing in that bar are you seeing a queer stand up comedian chances are no maybe lesbian folk singer or maybe a gay singer-songwriter but no, it is. It's a drag queen that is their entertaining you and that's who are entertaining who we interview on Feast Entertainers. So totally respect to drag queens where it's do. At the. But you know you guys had had to deal with a lot I mean this repulsed drag race has been particularly difficult. You gals. I've had to deal with more challenges than anyone else from any season ever had to. Absolutely. But honey, we have come out the other end us very strong season. I mean with with everything that has gone on and there have been plenty that have been thrown our way I. Can. I can vary proudly say that I think we have one of the best season's just in regards to the drag itself the relationships that we build the the advice that's been given on stage, not only to us but to the general public. And in terms of opening up the world of drag race and dragged to a broader audience with hosts like having Nikki. And all these people on there who was your favorite judge on on the season in terms of like we see guys interacting to some degree on stage. You had shock Akon you have. On. His career. Roese I. mean she is a wild. She is so fine that like really really fun and it was it was a really hard. Thing to balance because that episode widow von do was was really going through it and we were all really feeling for her, and while still trying to you know enjoy widow was to still trying to enjoy the presence of. Shock Akon but I mean she is wild, I would say my favorite guest judge who I think they should one hundred, thousand percent make a permanent judge on that show is Leslie Jones I agree if anybody listening to this podcast can look at the World Away Leslie Joan does we're going to be Avenue exciting and delicious, and flavorful, and and. Lutely and she had the like she had the best advice for all of us like individually as a group and I mean a lot of her advice was things that you really kind of here on the daily from from higher ups in from friends and family but the way that she delivers her advice really hits. Hits home and I would say, my my drag was definitely changed from that day forward, and for a lot of people Leslie Jones began or got cast on Saturday night live in her mid forties. So everyone's going crazy I'm O. Onnor at thirty listen today is the day to pursue your dreams and. All the week. Queens. They've thrown in the towel they've retired now John Chance to. I mean she's been thrown every curve ball you could get you know and she has really really made a name for herself but to her it doesn't matter. She's not there for the fame in for the fortune she's there for the betterment of people's lives. She's there to make people smile and to make them laugh and that's what I love so much about her because a lot of love I'd like Zander a Cossio Cortez. Girls and pretty much all the women in my family are like Aleksandra Calcio Cortez you don't know. Oh. My God she was such a joy like percival she is cute as A. Button likes so adorable. So teeny tiny can rock a read lip and. But she was also it was so. Like beautiful and relieving to hear that like she in her stat in her status in what she's doing for the country. Use to like work at a restaurant and would come home at night in her way of. Of relaxing was to watch Paul's drag race like that is so crazy to me that there is like a a political official who is who is like brought up around like gay people and Rupaul, Hall in like all the stuff in it. appreciation for the show for drag really showed that day. It definitely was a tearful moment for a lot of I mean during the pandemic and the quarantine and I'm at work working from home. I'm be like God thank God. We had season twelve Paul's drag race. What we'RE GONNA do next year if we saw. Honestly honestly, honestly yeah I mean it's going to be I. think that People's work ethics are just GonNa be Fox after this. You know what I mean like people people are so used to just doing what they gotta do from home and staying relaxed and being the sweatpants in the minute people have to start putting on their their monkey seats in going to work and the minute I have to start hopping on a plane in of the world. It's just like. I've gotten used to it. We were really upset about it in the beginning but now that we've really gotten used to it, we're like, okay, what's another month? We're going to be a little bit rusty but you know we just have to oil ourselves up and just to get back to work. Well, make sure you get your car oil check before you go see a drag show now. Yes. Marking Lot, can you imagine what can you guys like run into the parked cars or do you have to stay behind like the fence? Well? Actually part of my number in the opening, I do start at the back of of the whole venue in that walk through the cars to get to the stage I am going to be very cautious about people who might have their doors open or windows down. And again I'm obviously nervous about traveling but got do that Terry some Lysol with you if they get your close. Right now is I worked out at the gym the other day the guy he has this thing it looks like I vacuum cleaning the weights and I didn't realize it was sprang out this this. He was fumigating the weight. Rack. says. Wow. So maybe Get One of those. He said it was absolutely nontoxic. Now we're here in the point of the show where we're GONNA put your pop culture. To the test to know I. Can I can I give you a disclaimer? You're going to fail miserably. It's okay. If you fail I'M GONNA fail I'm going to fail miserably I am so bad with pop culture I'm so bad with music and I didn't even okay. This is gonNA sound so bad but the Madonna radical which. One. At that point new literally nothing about Madonna. Like she's blind knew she was blonde I knew she was ambitious but. When I gue-. Guess when I got home my friend's house of Avalon who are just Madonna freaks they they definitely had me do my homework a little bit more but I mean I'm still not as well versed as I definitely should be well, this is based on your finale performance of us take on me and that you are more a than what? Don't get your hopes. You're playing for face to fund t shirts. Okay. which year did take on me make it onto the charts nine, hundred, eighty, three, nine, hundred, eighty, four, nine, hundred, eighty, five, or nine. Hundred. Eighty six, I'm going to s nineteen, eighty, four, I'm GonNa Guess Eighty, four to I have no idea with answer the questions. Topped the charts it was released in eighty four but then they re released an eighty five and that's made it onto the charts. So she got it right Now eight hundred. God dammit the iconic scene where the driver hero smashes against the sides of the wall as they transform into a real human being is inspired by which movie star Bootie Altered Sates King. Kong. Start. Is it. All I. WanNa say star Bootie but it's altered state altered states Sore Jazz. The DAJA hails from which Scandinavian Country Sweden, Norway or Denmark. Listening to a podcast, you wouldn't know what? Sweden. Me It's it's are way it's doorways. Highway it's always only number one international hat. Swimming. Doorway. Three no sweating far last one, which version of animation is used in the video take on me is it ro scoping or stop motion animation. Wow I don't even know the answer to that either you know I've no idea. I mean I want to say stop motion. Is that what is it? Well, no Kosta isn't stop motion more for like three dimensional things like playstation kind of stuff. Yeah. So wrote scoping is live action footage is traced over frame by frame. Movements honey. I knew that I just didn't know there was a word called Maroteaux scope. Still Win. Three out of five congratulations. You're we'll send you Texas, your mailing address, and we'll send you a little box of Feast of fund goodies. Did you choose that song for your finale piece. So I have to all time favorite songs that have been my favorite songs for as long as I can remember ended is that one and the promise by when in Rome I just. AM So obsessed with the sound of eighties music and just like the the pure like love lust energy of all of it and the take on me was I was so excited to be able to get to do it because I had performed A. A lot of times before and. I think that that music video is really one of the first of its kind in terms of production value in terms of literally creating another world which really had. been done to that caliber or in that same vein until that point. And so I knew because like you know. I'm an artist before I'm anything else in I've been drawing and painting and doing all that stuff for as long as I can remember. So I built and I painted on, I drew that entire set painted on my outfits the name something by hand I you know everything that you saw I did. Nearly. By myself in a living room and I was just so proud of of what I did and I was so excited to. Pay Homage to my favorite and where your roommate's like when is this going to be over? My Gosh, you I gave them quite the stipend. So so there were they were. Living Room for like that week now they cut it and it was really frustrating because. Like seven people living in that house and like the Brady Bunch but drag queen. And you know we've. Knock out a whole lot of room. We just have that one living room and I was occupying it for like. You know however, many time are many days I needed to film all this and Of course I, hit some bumps in the road and had to refill. Mitt. Rebuild the satin while all this stuff and so was very thankful for them for for letting me. Violate their space. Why had no idea like that? You had to put many sacrifices from our vantage point where they thinking like Oh g g good has a warehouse that she can. No no and I know that that was a rumor going around. But honey, I'm here to lay it out on the table. I did nearly everything in that entire finale for like under one hundred and fifty dollars and I. I am the biggest cheapskate you will ever meet my apartment is like. Teen. Teen, I never plan on moving and you know I just I take so much pride in creating everything's from start to finish from scratch and I think a lot of people just assume that I have all these resources because I'm in. La and I'm friends with the House of Avalon and I have all this money which I definitely do not have. So you know it was a check for how two thousand what to somebody else I'm yes unfortunately. But, you know I treated all those comments as compliments because I was like okay. Well, if they're going to say that this was done in a studio I'm happy that it looked like it was done in studio not my living. So in terms of like you know resources and money since you are not able to travel to a lot of venues as it just it's all online right now isn't it? It is. Yeah, I'm obviously like I'm not making as much money as I would hope to be making right now or has or has passed girls have made right off their season. which is sad it's it's unfortunate but I have always been someone who uses their resources very wisely I'm very frugal i. don't really just like spend money A really harbor my money and I keep it safe. Again it all comes back to I started as DIY Queen GonNa die as a diy queen. You know if it's any consolation I, remember reading somebody on facebook was commenting about how hard the people from your season of had it and they're not having any gigs and Raja was the winner of season three chimed in and she's Oh please girl i. Remember like when I one Rupa's drag race season three and they had the premier night or when I one at Mickey's and nobody gave it a rat's ass. Nobody cared I'm performing at I'm thinking to myself I. Just one you guys are just you know outside smoking lime performing and she's like don't worry about these girls they're going to be fine. That's a nice thing. Yeah. Well, you know I. Think Marks Being a little bit harsh on you because. You came after his dragon. I doubt. From Scooby Doo. Oh. Still this mosaic but the bug man messed up good work Daphne. We should have a closer look at it. Maybe. We'll give us just the clue you need. She Burns. Oh baby what attracted you to Daphne. Daphne is one. Okay. So. Talking kind of going back to inspirations as a child on the the things that inspired me the most were fictional women be that Barbie be that Daphne was a huge I mean Daphne Blake is such a major. Just like. To me I mean this is just sounds crazy but she's like the biggest like feminist like icon to me and obviously she always had be saved by the man which is you now annoying but She just was like someone that I looked at as a kid and was like, wow, that's just such. A beautiful girl at I think that's the same kind of draw that I had to. I was like she's very beautiful and. Glamorous especially when you compare it to. But I think as I, watched some of the older episodes like as an adult. Now, I realized just how much she was into Fred and Fred just. Got It and I was like that was a little gay boy. It'd be like, why is my best friend? Not In love with me the way I'm in love with him Yes yes. mean she is she honey she paved the way for some gays for sure honey I mean she's the reason that I think Digi good is a natural. Maybe, Daphne can solve the mystery of Ru Paul's missing and Graham. Account. The Writers What was the scooby episodes that they did like in the in the two thousand twelve or thirteen came out recently, and just that we wrote valve as a lesbian we couldn't say that she was lesbian because you know it was twenty twelve people were. Honey, I could've told you that as a four year old who had no idea what a lesbian was. Well. It's it's part of it is like a lot of these cartoon characters. They really speak to us as people and you know you've talked a lot about in terms of inspiration cartoon characters. Really. Resonate with you. Yeah Yeah. So I mean on top of Daphne and you know. Penelope pitstop and all these characters. There was also these illustrations on on the clothing patterns that my mother would use to make things that were just these tall Lanky, just gorgeous Lee, stunning airbrushed eighties, illustrations of women that I got so much inspiration from an I. I still like to this day that is my. That is what I aspire to at the end of the day. Whatever might look is I want it to look like fashion illustration I. Don't WanNa look like a real girl I. Don't WanNa look like Drag Queen I. WanNa look like that `lustration that's on that McCall's pattern serving up butterick and simplicity real. Concern. Would be drag king name Butterick or simplicity. Either or Well think about it is is like some of those patterns like you your your mind you're like I'm the look so hot. So fierce that you make it and you're like man I look like I personally made their own clothes. We guess because women aren't actually if those women existed today, they would be eight feet tall and have a twenty inch waist. Will you kinda are eight feet tall and twenty inch waist? I'm getting there if I would I would love to be feet tall if I could be eight feet tall and drag that would be so stunning. But unfortunately, I'm the average size of a nice petite. Well, you have that El Greco kind of proportions a very long our. Legs and it's like so when you dress up as Madonna I was like this is Madonna. Madonna. Madonna after she went through the taffy polar. GD We're looking forward to seeing you here in Chicago at the drive and drag Voss. Field. Now. Normally, they have like football games and soccer games and whatnot at soldier field. But now it's a drag show. This is gay football. Sure you're gonNA be in town. Are you are you going to be camping around and from six feet away? I will be in town for about like fourteen days actually just because you know I've got I this. This memorial thing is at the very beginning of my trip dragons at the very end of the trip. So I just. GonNa take this time to see family that I haven't seen for a long time in. I'm I haven't seen my hometown in so long either I'm really looking forward to just like walking past my high school and mild jobs and all of that needs some to stature right now if the world ends in better shape, we would definitely be inviting you to come cook with us on cooking with drag Queens. That is so funny that you say that because. When this when this call was being set up, I was like, Oh Gosh. Am I gonNA have to cook. something. I. I cannot cook I can't I can't even cook like. A pre made cake mix like. Something I've been making A. Whole podcast. But that's part of the appeal to of the of the series I think is know seeing that tension about somebody who's sort of prehensile or just? Curious or not unsure of how food is made and you know food kitchen and food is also been the symbol for femininity. So it's interesting to see like drag Queens or navigate that space. Why be I would love to do I would love to have you on it too. So we always ask the gas is what food speak to you like what inspires you in the dinner plate Join Getting these days I just recently became a vegetarian. Not, for any specific reason I just decided it might be a fun thing to try and I don't hit it yet. So stay tuned for that. It's a call it a right of being on drag races like the Williams. I mean God forbid. -Tarian. Right. I would say though my favorite like genre if you will category if you must of food would be Italian like pastas and vodka sauce and garlic and I love Italian food me to and part of it is like a Good Vegetable Zion can be so try and send. My God how bad come up soon on our Youtube Channel where The Green Ravioli with new disaster. Rina from Fr- Dragulescu. These Dracula to her. She was one of the first drag Queens. I. Got the opportunity to work with a really. Yes. I. I I was made an appearance in her music video as the. Unsuspecting little. Damsel in distress who gets eaten alive by her. She has such a wild sense of humor that one. I love her she's fabulous. was there your neighbors Nas Angeles her her and her wifey they. Yeah I mean if you ever get the opportunity to see where they live, I highly recommend you you go visit their place and pictures and whatnot but Yeah they said come sometime I mean flights la right now we're only like fifty bucks roundtrip cog. Okay. in La it's crazy but it has matt suit in come on over. The e when the scientists come into the House and Put a big giant to look at her yeah I'm I turn old stuff. So. You're going to be coming in Chicago spending time with family performing for people in the park cars, and then after that any new projects or anything that we can talk about I don't have anything mean in a very exciting way I don't have anything I'm actually legally allowed to talk about. So. Just be on the lookout for some very exciting things. Some things that are very much childhood dreams come. Wow. Yes absolutely. So you know. I'm we may be all stuck up in quarantine, but I have been granted some really amazing opportunities. One you ready for me to take those yes. Death Queen has been. ABC. GD, it's a delight to talk to you. You're not just good. You are incredible. To just get no. I did for free. It's a fun name though and your family's name is guy how does that pronounce? GIGGING GAGGING GUY I want to keep trying until you get it right? You. No it's Gigi gaggy because we always known Stewart. But why don't I didn't know Stewart's last day until I do yeah. FACEBOOK came along. You know that's that is how I got gee-gee because the spelling of Gaggy was to Jeez on the good Jag me well good is because of season three of American horror story darling all that's right. Yeah, and the and the E is silent yes. Yes and I guess my full name my full drag name is genevieve good. That's wonderful. Yes. Jean Vive. But she yeah. So Jesus cuter and more petite. genevieve. Good is pleasure. This well, thank you so much for having me. I'm looking forward to meeting y'all by someday from well I'll press my nose against the glass of the car. Okay and my Ted. I. please. Take. CARE. gee-gee by to you too. Have a good one by g G. Good lives in Los Angeles California check her out and be her one million. And One instagram subscribe I guess she said that going to change that talks one point one million now or something like that. So. kind of stuff. So you just have to push that forward you can see. The good on instagram and all social media and and you can check her out at the drag and. Driving drag with Voss eventing, buy your ticket, the events dot com, and that's here in Chicago and the second week of August. So August six, seven, eight, I believe it was we're going to go to that I hope. So I'm looking forward to it. Better. Get your ticket. I. Think we have to ask Brandon Voss there's my tickets as my house and I'm looking forward to seeing it and a lot of amazing drag Queens. You'll get to see them. You know you might not get to see them for a while. So definitely go get your ticket and pocket. and. You know that's a fun thing because you could just you bring all the accent and they're not gonNA know, sorry those dates are August seventh through the night that saw. Soldiers Driving Drag Jada essence hall. The winner is going to be there as well and Niamey's smalls. Who We talked to last week. Delightful to talk to her as well. Just a wonderful lineup there and. Lady. Buddies have been doing it but I don't think she's coming. She's coming to Chicago but I think she did the one in Jersey because. I don't know I don't know if bunnies flying yet. I don't know if money's ready to fly. So they basically way to New Jersey and There's a footage of it on our facebook group. That is so funny. Go check it out facebook groups, facebook dot com slash group slush fund. Thank you so much for listening everyone. I really appreciate you guys taking a little time to have some feast of fun with. And I want to remind folks, we can't do this podcast without your support. So if you're not a plus member yet sign up today at Feast of fun dot, com slash class because your contribution to the show is what makes this show happen? We wouldn't be able to talk to a wonderful people like G G if it weren't for you and you can access thousands of legendary podcast dialing with Mama Rue. Many of the RU. Paul's drag race girls and winners, and even the first eliminated some of the best interviews with the first eliminate. Queens more on fun dot com slash plus you can search that tag Paul's drag race and. Hundreds of podcasts we'll show Howson's. You know well, we were podcast about four years before a drag race started. So yeah. So so check it out folks we're GONNA leave you here with the Acoustic version of a Ha's take on me and by no look by the recording artists Dave. Thank you so much again for listening I'm Fausto, I'm Mark Phelan by. Soon. Be No. Good. Kids. Gone. To. A. Concern. Brand. Lean, this. To me. Spanish.

Queens CHICAGO John Paul Rupaul FACEBOOK Madonna La instagram Los Angeles Cindy Lauper Pablo Picasso skateboarding Dragon Jiji Art Institute of Chicago Paul Fausto Mark
453: Disability design

Spark from CBC Radio

54:08 min | 11 months ago

453: Disability design

"This is a CBC podcast. Hi I'm Nora. Young this spark when we talk about inclusive design what we're really talking about is not excluding anybody. That's particularly clear when it comes to removing barriers for people with disabilities. Accessibility isn't something that just happens happens. It's about making deliberate design decisions. That won't exclude someone with a disability so today on spark explore the relationship between design and disability and why accessibility is not only good design. But also a civil right but we start in an unlikely place the cuisinart. Thank you and welcome if you follow the art of cooking or the trends in kitchen where implements a tall. You'll know that this instrument man sitting beside me on this counter. The cuisinart is become a very important fact of eating and life in the nineteen seventies. That's right the CUISINART cuisinart. Food processor goes back to the days when CBS's Peter Saskia was on television. The cuisinart was introduced in one thousand. Nine hundred seventy three and it quickly became synonymous with food processing thing. But what you may not know. Is that the cuisinart is also a great example of accessible design the designer of the cuisinart Mark Harrison was a professor at at the Rhode Island School of design and did a lot of research into disability with his students and then he incorporated that knowledge of things like manual impairment visual visual limitations. And so on into the design of the CUISINART. So if we think of this food processor that just has these two super simple buttons right calls off freight not a million tiny buttons that your little fingers have to click you know sort of a a large smooth surface a big contrast label So he incorporated this research into a product that just presents itself as sort of the the best you know suggesting that these design responses to disability produce a better product. October all this is best Williamson. She teaches design history at the school of the Art Institute of Chicago. The story of the quiz art is just one example of accessible design from her book accessible America a history of disability and design so my book looks at the design responses to the idea of disability rights basically retracing the way that Americans change attitudes about disability in the later twentieth century and that there are direct design outcomes that come from that so first of all. What do we mean by the term accessible? Would you define it so accessible. I think an interesting term right because it sounds familiar but often applies very very differently. I mean even. We often talk about things like accessibility to education or health care right which aren't specific to particular population. But the way that I approach it is thinking about the physical environment and it's designed for disabled people so looking at the history of accessibility. A you outline the significance of these. Two events injured veterans returning home after World War Two and the polio epidemic. So how did these events affect the perception of the need for accessibility. Yes so a big cultural change in the way that folks in the US. And I'd say really worldwide people. Viewed disability occurred when this convergence of two populations sort of coming into the spotlight at the end of world. War Two with veterans returning Especially in the Austin in the west victorious and a polio epidemic and this created two very appealing populations right people who are seen as very deserving of lifelong success For polio is often depicted through white innocent children to have the rest of their lives in front of them. So this creates the direct connection with shifting sense that something should be done to make the public environment accessible. Yes it was not just that they're suddenly were a lot. A lot of people coming back from World War Two were who were recovering from polio. But it was the way they were seen. Can you tell me a bit more about the narrative and what that looked like for these groups yes so both of these narratives I should say are are very selective right in. Polio affects a broad range of people. Likewise our veterans who are of different races are even men and women Combat Armed Forces are considered to be men but there are some women who fallen set categories while in like like flight nurses and so on but what depicted is the young man you know sort of all futures in front of him who is being limited by why not only his physical disability but by things outside of that right by other people's attitudes there's a big push postwar for employer education eight programs that acknowledge that disability isn't just in the individual but also has a social component and then also in their physical environment so they're for example. There are these. These films are veterans and one of them who became nationally famous Harold Russell. I got my prostheses as they're called and the dock. Explain just how to work than when I came back to the would. I couldn't help flashing my new books. I wanted a drink a toast to the world with my own new hands even if it had to removed versus in an army film and then becomes one of the stars of the best years of our lives. Right these Men who have you know prosthetic limbs in many cases is and what they're doing for the cameras kind of performing all of their skills and so we can think of this in terms of kind of the ideal of of the normal man shaving smoking driving arriving Even like fighting and firing guns right are all things that technology can make possible for them. And I think there's a real sense that technology should make that possible all for them and that the government should make that happen right. It shouldn't be just sort of On them individually so you you also describe this early kind of DIY. Ingenuity of people with Disabilities Elise Hu out of necessity really had to customize household technologies to make their lives more accessible. So these include things like customized ramps mouth sticks modified cars cars. Were there examples that you came across release studio for you. Yeah I mean. This was an amazing discovery. I should say I'm not the only person who's discovered the source. I but I was really amazed by this magazine called the to J. Gazette. That was this kind of Zine for polio generation it started a Ah Polio Rehabilitation Hospital and to Ville Ohio and that but then sort of continued as this community. Publication and people are just mailing in photographs and descriptions of the things. They've done in their everyday home life And one of the things that I noticed you know. There's a particular attention to the house. As as I mentioned in the era of polio and and post war and other illnesses for example spinal cord injury people are surviving a much greater rate in this period. There is a huge huge push to create accessibility. But it's still very limited so there are no sort of public forms of access in the nineteen fifties nineteen sixties really into the nineteen seventies in the US so people are being told and rehabilitation like you should be independent. You should strive to be independent. You should strive to you. Know take up a a role of support in in your household whether it's working as a man or being sort of wife and mother for women and their houses are not built for this right so there's a tremendous amount of information sharing in terms terms of what materials make a good ramp but also a lot of these small things so there's a whole sharing about like products that are helpful like Tupperware Electric Electric Knives Different kinds of spoons and cooking utensils right. So there's this kind of alternative consumer conversation that's happening among disabled people by disabled people for disabled people. It's very sunny and optimistic but at times. They also acknowledged things like loneliness or frustration straight at not being able to participate in you know go to go to college or other Kinds of activities. So I see it as a very interesting you know. I think really the excellent document of the kind of direct engagement with technology that many disabled people had and continue to have That doesn't tend to be credited as kind of great inventor's or great designers in history. Yeah I mean some of it was sort of incredibly invented. There was one guy who basically totally retrofit his car so while Ali was in Wiltshire. Yeah there's there's some amazing cars on the one I think they're referring to this man. Yeah took an old Peugeot and basically the entire back and top off of it and installed a moving platform so he could sort of elevator himself up and then the platform also would rotate around so he could like go in reverse and be able to. Let's see and so on and of course this is like definitely not a legal vehicle on the road. Imagine perhaps he was using it to serve locally and his small town own maybe for short trips but it really speaks to the way that the automobile is a kind of mobility device as well But I also you know. That's such a part of kind of American culture of the fifties and sixties to this idea of tinkering with your car So these diy solutions certainly demonstrated creative approach but were they also in some sense a reminder that the burden was still on the people with disabilities to figure it out for themselves. I think they are I think throughout conversations around access there is always the the sense of giving you know creating a little bit of access but not creating too much. There's there's always this kind of looming danger imagined that if things are too accessible label people will not Gain the character that comes through struggle Even back to the veterans right. There's this whole conversation about giving subsidies for them to have you know specially fitted cars and it's like oh we shouldn't give it to all veterans only veterans that are missing a leg right so they can't drive or you know. It shouldn't be for blind veterans because John Courage them to have someone else drive them so there are some moments of real insight. I think into a kind of conservatism around accessibility. Also that starts from the very beginning and I think really flavors accessible design and architecture as it becomes part of legal requirements leader. Yeah so it's conservatism. And is it also also some sort of sense of like worthiness or something I think. So right there's a strong sense. I think we can also see this kind of script in in other forms of rights and sort of social openness and opportunity in postwar period for women for African Americans this rate that there's a a notion of quote unquote. self-help is a term. That's often described that in order to gain equality. You have to prove that you're worth it. I'm I'm this is something that's echoed and I I had such a fortune of working with a number of mentors who had sort of been of this generation. This sense that you have to prove yourself to have a good attitude dude In order to be considered worth the investment and that that is just so striking when we consider in what circumstances do we consider populations deserving serving of like the best of design as opposed to the bare bones of design. One of the things. You dress in your book is what we might call. The ideology of how access was talked about and accessibility was talked about in the. US context. Can you tell me a bit about that. Yes Oh and this is why you know. It's very interesting to talk about this with people. Outside side of the United States I started this project thinking of the. US is one of the as the leader on this issue because the US is the first country that had a federal nationwide wide law requiring access. The American Disabilities Act of one thousand nine hundred and in many ways the US does remain a leader in some ways when it comes to this but I would also always remember that this is embedded within a very market driven consumer driven approach design and technology right so much of access also emphasizes the individual consumer right. The idea of shopping going to the movies right war and especially working as the outcome of making access as as opposed to countries where there's a broader social security net Especially in health care and so the push may not always be recreating access so that you can create consumers taxpayers Individual workers but instead sense of sort of broad social supports. That would help children children older folks you know people have working age and so on so. That's one of the things that I find in contrast so in the. US There may be tremendous support for accessibility in offices. And at the mall. But there's not as much push for universal healthcare. I'm Nora Young. You're listening to spark. My guest is best Williamson. She is the author of accessible America. A history of disability and design now that was best mentioned the Americans with Disabilities Act enacted in nineteen ninety made the US the first country to have a federal law requiring accessibility here in Canada. The Canadian Nadine Charter of Rights and freedoms protects people with disabilities from discrimination. It took until twenty nineteen to put federal accessibility legislation in place with the passing a bill. C The eighty one and act to ensure barrier-free Canada but as best explored in her book enforcing accessibility is not easy. She found some resistance to the idea the of mandated accessibility public transit is one area where accessibility has always been crucial in your research. You also found that a transit issues created a bit of a backlash actually so what were some of the early criticisms of accessible transit. Yes so You know one of the things. I've found so notable there's a there's there's a publication in the middle nineteen sixties from the US government. That says how could there be any opposition to these changes right. They make take such small effort and they can help millions of people and I think we see this all over the place right where changes that create access and helping broader population. But there is quite a bit out of backlash right. Sort of unexpected. I think and I- pinpoint this. I'm controversy in the nineteen seventies over accessible public transit as one of the most public doc moments when this question of cost versus benefit really comes up there. It's a complicated story. Obviously but they're buses proposed that include. We'll share ramp in the front or sort of bigger and wider and more comfortable that are seen as creating the quote unquote of the future. And I they're accepted but then auto auto companies push back against them because they require a retooling on their Assembly lines and it basically kicks off a decade or more of very contentious lawsuits protests counter protests op-eds in the newspaper. And so on that are over. This question of basically is it worth the investment to retool tool and make these accessible buses. It comes down to all these tiny details like you know the wheelchair ramp in the front or the back right. Should it be one bus loss per every ten or every single bus and then Significantly should it beyond the public bus route or should there be a separate fleet of what we call Para Transit Right individual cars that pick people up door to door And these conversations. I think do a lot to shape the impression that disability access success is very expensive and very inconvenient and that requires a lot of compromise rather than that sort of generous notion like. Why would anybody be opposed to this but does that also reflect a sense when you talk about it being evaluated in terms of cost benefit that it's not really at least at that point installed as being basically he's just a rights issue? It's not really a cost benefit issue. It's a rights issue. Yes I think we still see aspects of this in conversations over access right which is always an emphasis on the idea that if you create access for certain disabled population set you'll end up benefiting everyone which I think is a very powerful design principle but it also raises the question. What about those design elements that don't benefit everyone? Are those still worthwhile. What do we have the right to to and I think that the notion of civil rights being tied to technology in this way you know was very challenging? I think in many cases I mean just as this honestly you know when you get down to the the enactment of rights can often be very challenging to whoever is in power right. I haven't considered this this population relation and so it seems wrong. It seems out of the ordinary so I think this was really a produced in a lot of waste through that conversation around public transportation. How important a role has activism and protests played both in accessibility and also getting society to see? Accessibility is a civil right I think activism activism has played a significant role particularly again as I mentioned there's there's a moment and I think you know ongoing sense of beneficent about this right. This is is a great this is quote unquote helping the handicapped raid. This is a kind of Humanitarian or charitable effort. And as a result they are often new laws and codes often. Don't come with strong enforcement because there's a sense like this is an awareness issue if we educate architects as to the best approach. is they'll just make those changes and and what happened. Is there some initial laws and codes in the late nineteen sixties and early nineteen seventies. That are put out by the government and just are not followed and the disabled activists read those regulations. And say look you know this is what the regulation says so they they find they have to use the strong arm of the law. You know suing protesting. Oh testing sitting in. There's a month long occupation of a federal government building in San Francisco in nineteen seventy seven. That did a lot of the work to push for firm firm regulations. So there's this kind of lesson that's learned. I think which is you can't just require access you have to enforce access And this remains something. A weakness weakness of the Americans with Disabilities Act which requires access but doesn't build in kind of check and enforcement so the only way to kind of get something fixed as to individually individually complain or Su which can be a very slow process? So the Americans with Disabilities Act from nineteen ninety has had a big impact on accessibility in the US. But you you point out that some people felt that it led to this kind of tacked on access just to comply with the law so nearly thirty years later. How much has it influenced the idea of building accessibility into design goals in the first place? Yeah I mean I think you know as years go bond we. We see a lot of improvements but still you know I asked my students into our architecture and design students you know what are the superstars of accessible designed like what are the amazing buildings and there aren't many they don't. We don't have a kind kind of greatest hits of access. There are a few. I mean one. We might point to is Frank Lloyd. Wright's Guggenheim Museum right. It's not built to code. But it has this elegant ramp down the middle home and even to think of kind of aesthetically constructing building around feature like rather than having that ramp be sort of to the side hidden away. It's is really notable so we have there are a few really great buildings That are examples of this but it will be something like the top five out there and so you know we could just think in terms of cultural royal shifts It still remains relatively rare. That access is seen as something exciting and creative and kind of cutting edge architecture world as opposed to just sort of a requirement beyond architecture or more designers starting to to see accessibility as as just a value of good design. Yes and I'm actually. In some cases this is stronger in the non architectural design world. I mean certainly when it comes to graphic design the readability of materials is something that you know cuts across many different spectrums of ability disabilities to simply sort of personal preference so in our devices especially now we. We have so many more options. In terms of controlling things like large type versus small tight color contrast you know these kinds of things that become part of the array of conveniences that we have I think they're they're really not seen as you know something. That is an add onto technology but something that's built into it and that's accepted updated as something that's functioning. Well something that you can easily adjust and figure out how to adopt to your own particular interests or needs. Is there a danger. Though that we get taken with kind of cool designs rather than the sort of less sexy things like accessible subway stations or washrooms on the main floor. You know that kind of stuff. Yes I think I think so. I mean one. One thing that I mentioned in the book is the prosthetic limb. Remains this kind of wonderful object. A fascination nations something that's in films right in fashion in technology museums as this wonderful thing but the number of people well who actually use prosthetic limbs is quite small right and and Issues a personal preference may be different from that sort of technological wonder and dream and so many engineering programs youth programs using three D. printers Fashion runways and so on are fixated on this one in particular object. I always sort of joke like will we have a fashion show that involves an accessible public bus right or or just a ramp even You know the question of of you know how how certain objects come into light and what what sort of implications there are there such a wide range of attentions and I think the role of aesthetics is so powerful but we also always question you know what about the things that are. Not Beautiful. Aren't easy to design What pressures are there on certain populations to kind of find their way into the technological kind of spotlight in that way You conclude in your book that in this quote designing and accessible America still a vision left unfulfilled requires embedding design systems that can support rights and equality in ways that go oh beyond the material so what you mean by going beyond the material well ultimately you know as a design historian it's probably a challenging conclusion Liuzhou to come to but ultimately to say the objects are not it right. You kind of can't tell if something is accessible equitable just by looking at it and I think that is something that I wasn't as confident about when I started. You know I mean one of the things that is remarkable to think of is how how sort of physical all and material these issues are you know to to think of looking at something and considering like is it equitable or is it Exclusive that said you know so much of the truth of things comes down to kind of the details like what is it takes to get access to that object and particularly you know what are the underlying Sort of economic racial kind of cultural divides that keep disability in the realm of the taboo or the sort of second rate when it comes to our our planning and our creation of environments. And I think it tru truly takes both a social commitment to quality and technological commitment to finding things that work really well in order to really fulfil this so it takes kind of the commitment of going beyond just what is as I said right. Just what's beautiful or what functions. Really well toward really thinking okay. Well can we take on the more challenging parts of this and I think that takes really a social commitment best. Thanks so much for talking to us about it thanks Nahra Best Williamson teaches design history at the school of the Art Institute of Chicago. And she's the author of accessible America. Erica a history of disability and design. You got more in our look at disability design designer Liz Jackson tells us about disability. Don Goals flashy but useless solutions. To problems of people with disabilities. Never knew they had what they want is they. They want access they want ramps They want elevators and what they realize is that as designers are spending more and more time trying to come up with a specific. Fix the less less. We're GONNA start to incorporate access to day-to-day lives more on that coming up. I'm nora young as a spark from your friends at CBC Radio Today we're exploring the relationship between disability and design Most designers want gain a deeper understanding of the people. They're designing four. That's why empathy is one of the first word it comes up in discussions about design thinking understand the user how they live their challenges and needs one to build empathy into the design process is through simulation simulation especially when it comes to accessibility design in these simulations design working groups try on the constraints of someone with a disability to invoke empathy but one designer from Portland. Oregon says no thanks. Amelia Abrego is a design researcher and the founder of U. X.. Night School for Amelia. Oh yeah these. Sorts of simulations can feel like stunts. That don't actually involve the people navigate the world with different abilities. These simulations include things like outings in board wheelchairs to try to be more mindful of accessibility or an activity that Amelia encountered submerging your hands in ice water to simulate motor impairments. So this is you would just take a remained tub full of ice cubes into a conference room. And I've seen this done before where you know you. You all take turns dipping your hands into you. Know Tub of Ice Cubes and then you you know squeal very abject uh-huh you say. Oh my God that's so called thing. How could anyone stand to live with arthritis when meanwhile arthritis is a really common thing? So what troubles you about this simulation as empathy As a way of trying to understand the experience of someone with a disability. Well I think the thing that concerns me. The most is that disabilities are incredibly common. It depends on how old you are. or how young you are but you know most of us are born pretty helpless and need need a lot of help at the end of life as well so you know a lot of the way that we think about. Disability is very abject meaning that we think. Oh this is somebody else else. This is somebody else's tragic problem when really disability is a part of life If we're lucky enough to live in to a ripe old age we'll probably probably experience. Some motor impairments visual impairments Cognitive impairments and this is a fact of life so if we WANNA WANNA think about disability. Let's talk about it in the context of everyday life instead of posing it as you know terrible thing that happens to other people Do Do you think these kinds of simulations could also cause someone to underestimate what someone with a disability is capable of doing. Oh definitely and there's research to show that disability simulations actually allow people to form their own conclusions which are once again not based on lived experience but through through a momentary experiment and therefore overlook the point of view of folks. who were living a living with disabilities often living well? Because that's one thing that's come up over the course of preparing this episode. Is that People disabilities often are coming up with innovative techniques and tools. And so on to to help them navigate the world around them and managed the their disability on their own. So I suppose if you're simulating that you're not having full access to that suite of innovation and tools that a person will be coming up with totally you know there's this fundamental disability rights slogan. Nothing about us without without a and people with disabilities have to be creative they have to improvise. And when you're not bringing the full range of human experience into your design process you're going to overlook a lot Empathy is the ability to understand and share. Someone's experience and it's something that gets talked about a lot in design circles but you point out that is more complex than it sounds like. What do you mean by that? Well Embassy isn't like a six pack of beer. You can bring to a party. It's something you can experience and you experience it on a spectrum and I think that we all have blind spots in our empathy fields. You know often joke imus small blonde woman and I work around a bunch of men a lot of the time and I say well you know like you. You can't understand what it's like to be a blonde woman walking on the street like if you were a blonde wig like you only that would that would only give you one a new set of perspectives. Like into my experience and my experience is different than that of another blonde woman. So you know. What are we trying to have empathy for Alec? Why is it thought of his easier to like generate vague empathy for other people than to actually listen to other focuses experiences? The answer is yes. So what's a better way to approach understanding the experiences of people with with a disability. Oh I think first of all number one just acknowledging how Hamas Hominids Eighty percent of adults over the age of forty need reading glasses as I'm a design researcher. That's my job and I think one of the things it's really hard is generating meaningful community relationships and that means having lots of contact with folks for more than transactional purposes so who are living near you and part of your life and sometimes I feel a we can all benefit from just talking to the janitor talking to the other folks at the bus. Oh stop but Talking to the other parents at our kids schools a lot more and I think you know honestly at the beginning of life and at the end of life. We're a lot more democratic attic. I make it a point transplant. Time with elder folks. I think it's really important for my line of work Folks over the age of sixty are the fastest growing growing population of Internet users. They are also you know. There are a lot higher incidences of cognitive issues of motor impairment on an other for vision issues and other form of disability in that group Similarly like young kids are very attuned to you know what it means to be inclusive of what it means to accept other people for who they are so I think thinking about the myriad ways that we all experience the world and how they can be different is so important to designers and it's something that nobody's omniscient. Nobody can anticipate all these things themselves. Something like ramps you know that that can benefit people who use wheelchairs but also people with strollers. So why is it so important to consider kind of diversity of experience when you're thinking about inclusive design. Surely I'm fairly able bodied person. But it was when I had a young child I realized that my my accessibility case was totally different Little children you know require holding and carrying and this limits your mobility ability. It means you need a ramp or a different a different path when I teach design classes often have folks go out into a neighborhood. Accessibility posssibility audit. And this man's I love to have folks walk in Pairs especially with folks who taller shorter than them or just have different perspectives. Love and I think that the physical markers of accessibility can tell us a lot. You know we. We tend to take our own experiences for granted so noticing like taking a fresh set of eyes and saying like Hey. There's a huge crack in the sidewalk. And that would be really hard to get over if you're using a mobility device or saying. Oh Hey the curb. Cut Starts at the side of the street but it doesn't pick up across the street. This shows us how patchy our infrastructure is in everyday life and it it's a good set of parallels for more digital or more immaterial material forms of design I know you've also written about approaching design from justice perspective. You know the designers should consider questions I who gets to speak and why so from in your perspective. What can design do to make sure? The voices of people with disabilities get hurt design needs to work on including a broader cross section of human so And the culture of design is often very driven by privileged white able bodied folks. So so I think there's a lot of work that designers have to do not only listening to other people but bringing those folks to the table. Amelia thanks for your thoughts on this. Thank you for having in me. Amelia brew is a design researcher and the founder of. US night school. I'm Sarah Hendron and I'm a professor at Olin. College of Engineering and teach design and disability studies. Eyeglasses are the most common prosthetic that people don't think of as prosthetics and so it's it's really important to keep talking about the kind of assimilation of eyeglasses in the culture as medical tools. That at some point crossover to become modes of fashion accessories accessories in modes of Kinda identity style. Glasses eye glasses in one symptom of success. If I can call it that is that we really think of them. As medically plants is anymore. My Name's Graham. Pollen and I'm a researcher Electra. Dj Cat which is an college at the University of Dundee in Scotland by glasses of have achieved that ubiquity and in a very ambiguous role in is still corrective that in some ways their aspirations confessional at the same time as Amelia brave pointed out disabilities are incredibly common and she said many adults over forty need reading glasses. I G- losses are so commonplace. We don't even think of them as medical assistive devices but they are just like a cane for example. So why is it. That eyeglasses are considered to be fashionable and a cane. Isn't that question about the stigma. Surrounding certain assistive devices was one that Liz Jackson spent a lot of time. Considering it's funny so I I've been doing some talks and I've increasingly been trying to write out my origin story just because I feel like in disability in order to kind of validate no date your entry into the space oftentimes. What's expected of you as an origin story? But if I were to kind of delve into that I would say the thing that brought me into the space is me acquiring disability about seven and a half years ago And for me. The question is why I had so much choice with my eye glasses and didn't with McCain loses a disability disability advocate and design strategist and the founder of the disabled list in the design world. She sees a tendency towards fixing things. But when it comes to designing for people disabilities that can be a problem. Well I think designers are increasingly seeing disability as a project and they don't really engage in the space with rigor And they you know for as much as designers really spend their life times continually learning about you know their their profession When it comes to disability they think they just know so a lot of times the solutions that come out of it or actually deeply harmful? How can that make people with disabilities feel like a project themselves? In a way I mean there's a variety of ways You know I encounter a lot of cons and you know I think hack Athans are really good a tool for designers to really hone their skills but when it comes to you know a huckaphony around disability what happens is is at the end of the day they may come up with with an over the top solution but you know all of the traction wants that Hacker Thon Ns is lost and the disabled person never actually benefits from all that. They contributed commuted to that day or those hours that week. You know. There's a variety of other ways that It can be problematic. Another one is is that designers frequently. Actually think think they're trying to fix a disabled person rather than to create access or fix a thing and what that does is it it it it further marginalises and stigmatizes the disabled person. I was really struck by. I think it was in one of your talks. You talked about a design school administrator. who was struck by like basically the first week backseat clause? Everybody wanted to design a new cane for her. Yeah I learned this really interesting thing recently. which is that on average in the United States in in in Canada I think it's about eleven percent of college populations are disabled But I recently discovered. Those numbers are much much higher in designed schools in that actually feels a bit appropriate to me right because disabled people were the original hackers. Right we spend our lives cultivating an intuitive creativity. Because we're forced to navigate a world that's not built for our bodies so of course we may be more inclined to enter creative professions For me that begs you know many questions such as what is happening to these students year. You know year after year as they're going through design school I have have a feeling these are the students that are not getting their needs met nor dropping out. And you know I I feel like these are the people who once they enter. Their professional careers are falling through the cracks. But beyond that and this is what you know it was specifically has to do with that one teacher who Dreads the beginning of every school year because students show up wanting to redesign her. Cain what those students don't realize is actually telling her they don't like hurricane perfectly happy with it and so what happens is is. It's not just the disabled designed suits. That are not getting their needs met. You have this whole other up. Cropping of designed Zayn students who are actually deeply interested into ability but have no knowledge. There's no disability studies program in their school so they don't even know what disability is and so they have no way to go all about it and so for me the thing that I really advocate for us if we can start to incorporate disability studies curriculum into design schools. What happens is you have a space for those two groups of students to actually meet and actually meet each other's needs And and to really start to build a culture and a community around it rather than just this idea of disability as a project or a topic or a fix to illustrate some of these points. You've pointed to this phenomenon of the disability dangles so what what is a disability dangle and why is it so problematic so a disability dangle is as I defined defined as an elegant and well intended solution to a you but it's ultimately useless. 'cause it's a problem that we never knew we always had so. I joked that disability dangles sir most frequently created and designed schools in there some specific design firms that really kind of create this problem so oftentimes when a new student or new design firm creates a stair climbing wheelchair What happens is the press gives it a lot of you know it gets a lot of good press and the people that created are are really kind of held up on a pedestal of this a good deed that they did but if you actually talked to disabled people they would tell you that it scares them that it's too expensive? They can't afford it you know that they simply don't want it what they want. is they want access. They want ramps They want elevators and what they realize is that as designers are spending more and more time Kinda trying trying to come up with a specific fix such as stair climbing wheelchair that's time and resources that are not allocated to actually innovating access but more than that the more that we as a society convince ourselves ourselves that Oh we can just give those people a stair climbing wheelchair the more that we do that the less that as a society. We're we're going to start to incorporate access into the day-to-day lives. And so what happens. Is those resources get pulled back and I could elaborate a little bit further so Elizabeth Goofy is She's in design. Historian story I believe an art historian Also disabled and one of the things that she noticed on her campus where she teaches is is that as the new So there's a new Accessible sign that was rolled out over the last I'd say five or six years. It is a an image of a forward leaning wheelchair user and So Uh a lot of states a lot of cities a lot of campuses and institutions have started incorporating this new sort of more active seeming Accessible silage into their institutions but what Elizabeth notice on her campus was as the campus was being loaded for incorporating this new and more active. Sign it at the same time. They were actually rolling back doc access and taking away ramps and so she had called that blue washing And so we get so caught up in our good feelings about all of this that we don't actually question what the impact is of these things. Yes yeah I I have to admit As chason list because I realized that we have profiled our share of disability dangles On SPARC. So what can be done to avoid had this kind of design approach And again I think this is this is really the thing is is most people. Most journalists designers don't understand that disability studies is. This is a field of study. It requires rigor it requires a commitment. And there's really really exciting and good and interesting work being done in the space and you know I oftentimes say question. What you think you know right as soon as I see something in a evokes around us billion and Volkswagen feeling like for me that trigger something to kind of look deeper birth and I would I would beg same view but for me it would? It would be to kind of start to show interest in the best way to styles in the Elizabeth. Duffy's in the Amy Ham. Rays of the world's Cynthia via Bennett. Josh halstead like these are all people who are doing mind-blowing work in this space and and can really educate all of us especially designers creatives people who articulated narrative on disability And I just. I wish that we didn't get so caught up in our own feelings. Yeah this is spark you are listening to spark you're listening to a spark from your friends at CBC Radio There's this idea of well. Technology can be a fix and disability. I mean something is broken. You're already sort of presupposing. The way that they move through the world my name is Merrill Alpher. I'm an assistant. Professor of Communication Studies Thaddeus at Northeastern University and the author of giving voice mobile communication disability and inequality within the technology Laghi itself. There is the you know. The cultural context individuals with disabilities have themselves not only disability as part of who they are but everybody. Nobody has a racial background. Everyone has linguistic background. Everyone has a a class and you know gender background that Intersex and interweaves in different ways as for each person and not only within that within like a disability label or way a diagnosis. So in what ways are policies enacted for for people to gain access to technology not gaining so the first part is to center the voices of individuals with disabilities in the conversations. Decisions about what technology does and doesn't do for them and the kinds of innovations but they make They make do with in how they experience technology for more people with disabilities to be themselves involved in policy decisions in technology development for individuals with disabilities to be at the table. All the real key is to is to center those voices truly Not to give voice but to truly center the voices of people with disabilities in conversations about them nor young. You're listening to spark I'm speaking with Liz Jackson. She's a design strategist and founder of the disabled list. So how do we shift. The values of design. so that people with disabilities are are not seen as just the recipients of design but actually partners in the design protests. Yeah in that. That's that's where I get stuck so and you know as I as I said at the beginning right. I got into the space because I wanted to figure out. I wanted to increase choice in the marketplace right. I wanted more choices with McCain But it didn't take me long to realize that it wasn't actually a lack of choice that was creating the problem that I was experiencing. What actually was this was a failure to attribute and to credit disabled people in design processes? We don't understand the immense value that disabled people hold in terms of game changing innovations. And if you look throughout history right who are the people who created things that changed the world will. It's almost always a disabled person right like we created the bicycle re we created the IPHONE touchscreen. That's Wayne Westerman Apple. We created cruise control. That was a blind man whose driver was making him. Carsick curb cuts the electric toothbrush. Brush email the Internet right. These are all examples of disability onto nudity. But if you were to go onto Google and you were to search design for disability you would would see that it yields more than ten times as many search results is disability design the idea that we are recipients of design has embedded itself into our language. And this this is just simply because we get get caught up in our feelings and the people in power can tell stories about how they did things that were apathetically done for us and in the process they silence us And they you know they don't actually stop stop to consider that We were actually very active in the process. you also talk about honoring what you call the friction of disabilities. What's what's the friction of disability? And how do we are. Yeah so again. A disabled person the world was not built for our bodies and so that in and of itself creates rates of friction in in design. We are so focused on smoothing out and fixing things that we never stop to consider what disabled people want and for me the thing Ah I find the most delighted our creatives who are really working to as I say on a diffraction of disability so the first person that comes to mind is an artist artist here in in New York City where I met her name is Shannon Finnegan Shan Finnegan Dot Com. Just everything she does is just delightful. she was working at an art exhibition space. In with SAIC NEW YORK. It was seven floors. It's a historic landmark. It's an old silo and she has palsy. So she you know she could get up and down the stairs once or twice a day but after that she it was done and the art didn't really start until the second floor and so you know Shannon started quickly realized like other people were showing up to this art exhibition space and they were also not able to to access the upper floors and Shannon realize. She had two choices right. The first one is she could raise hell and really stigmatize herself in the space by demanding an elevator which she was not going to get because again. This is the historic landmark. The other things we could do is that she could get creative and so what she did was is. She saw that underneath the stairs. They had this open space and she asked him if she could have it. And you can go on her website thanks this she coordinated off and she created this hilarious font made of stairs and it says Anti Stairs Club Lounge. You go in you go in the Anti Stairs Club Lounge and on the wall so suddenly realized she's making fun of people who upstairs right because it says the higher you climb the farther you fall and you look around the space and there's refreshments and there's her favorite candy and there's disability studies literature literature but I mean it's all impeccably branded like it's just this amazing adorable space and the thing. That was so interesting. Is that what I heard was at the end of that for summer there. We're actually days when more people went to the club. Lunch then went to the the upper floors right. She rendered the rest of the building obsolete. And so this is what I mean by honoring the friction of disability. Like we don't actually actually consider right things like what we call crip humor where the disabled person maintains agency in the Joe. We don't consider you know disabled sexuality. We don't consider consider the fact that a disabled person may not actually want to be brought into normal but rather they may actually feel very valuable in their lives. Exactly where they are and maybe they feel that they they have something to offer from that space and instead what we're doing is we're trying really hard to bring them into our space you know it's almost like a land grab like we're GONNA WE'RE GONNA own this space space. And so that's that's really my focus. I know that you're also the founder of something called the disabled list that's described as engaging in disability as a creative practice. Can you tell me a bit about that. Yeah so it's me and my partner Alex. Hey Alex is a Canadian Who you would love? Alex is developing this idea of again disability. Lead design is what they call it and what we're doing is we're really looking at disability. From a speculative framework not just asking what is it that a disabled person needs. But what is it that a disabled person actually wants We collaborate we can soult. We have a separate website that we call critical access access. It's critical a x dot org And what we've done is we've created a repository of disability representation in media because the thing that we realized was is that when a designer gets a brief around disability and design when they actually searched the terms disability and design the things that come up or not actually disabled people speaking about their understanding of it but rather what comes up is the brand the ways that brands to pick their interactions with us and so we felt that if we could get brands to to understand that their depictions of us are playing really harmful tropes than We could shift the stories that are told. And then shift what designers do when they receive designed briefs and and what we didn't realize going into it was well what we started doing was as we started counting the amount of words that disabled people spoke and each ad and then we went onto youtube and we would categorize categorize and analyze the comments and so one of the trends that we've certainly glean which is actually really frightening to me. Is the more words. A disabled person speaks the less believable. The AD is perceived to be and so through this actual creating a data set and this repository were starting to understand an NBA able to strategize strategize. And figure out how to make these shifts There's another so it's a two matrix of trump's there's another trope it's called diversity trump in and there's nothing in the diversity trump because there are yet to be any ads that feature a disabled person of color. It's just though advertisers. Don't think that you know black disabled people exist and so you know it's just it's been sort of wild the exciting and infuriating at the same time because like now we feel like we have something that we can use And it's just it's horrifying to realize Oh okay like this is what we have to work from but what I do know. Is that this community of people right like whoever it is That's really focused on this space of disability. The end design is growing. You know were just doing the best that we can. So how do we get to a point where there are more designers with disabilities ladies engaged in disability creative practice as you say rather than non-disabled designers thinking they designed for people with disabilities. How do we change the equation there? Yeah I fundamentally think it actually just goes back to incorporating disability studies curriculum designed schools You know for me when you when you work your way through the process the thing you realize is like okay not only. Are you creating a space. For disabled designers and non-disabled designers taken an interest in disability not only be created a space base for them to actually meet insert to work together and meet each other's needs. What happens is is once? They've worked together a few years by by working together they then enter. You know their professional careers not thinking that disabled people are designed for but actually thinking disabled people are designed with right and so I actually. That's fundamentally what I think is is the start of the process is. How do we start to cultivate this new way of viewing disabled contributions to design? And how do we nourish it. And how do we start to attract more disabled people to design. It's you know we've got to start somewhere and it's just it's going to be a slow build. Yeah Liz Liz. Thanks so much for talking to us. Yeah thank you so much. I appreciate it. Liz Jackson is the founder of the disabled

US founder polio America Williamson Liz Jackson CUISINART professor Art Institute of Chicago Nora Young Amelia Canada Rhode Island School of design researcher Night School Harold Russell CBC
083   Art & Politics w/ Ferrari Sheppard and Sharis Rhodes

Van Lathan's The Red Pill

2:06:20 hr | 1 year ago

083 Art & Politics w/ Ferrari Sheppard and Sharis Rhodes

"Lengthens the repeal. Will we give the brutal truth the brutal honesty two guests on a jumbo size episodes of the repeal today I guess for our shepherd artist musician activists reluctant activists he says and twitter firebrand you guys might know Ferrari for taking on people on twitter for being any one of the best contemporary artists around we talked to him about a great matings. What is I to be black in the art world what is like to live your self expression expression some problems that he's had coming from the hood in Chicago to being one of the hottest rising when young painters and artists of his generation and just sort of the whole gamut of how he sees society how he sees his place in it and how he uses art to affect culture and to change the world that he lives in for our is an unbelievably are interesting fellow with a lot of different ideas on things and he'll tell you frankly why he feels like he has to leave the hood behind nine? He says it right there to get away from it. also we talked to sheriffs rose. She is a a a very impressive young lady. She is running for a county Supervisor County supervisor here on Los Angeles. It's a very inspirational story way to sister not too long ago was homeless with her young son and decided that she was going to get up and do something to change the system that failed her by reshaping it at at the top of it. I think that these are the stories and these are the the the people that for the rest of my career. I'm GonNa want you guys to hear about now. Theresa's young politician she is still learning a lot about about the process you still learning a lot about what it takes to be successful as a politician but listening to her one thing that you will come away with is that there is a burning desire to be an agent for change and anytime that is present inside of someone you'll see them get to the point of success that they want to get to and I am happy to be able to help her. on horizon. She's been very persistent about coming onto the podcast for a long time and we're excited to have her here now. WE'RE GONNA get to a second as well as say some to a specific group of people out here in that group is that trump supporters now normally when I talked to the trump supporters I just say fuck you guys as normal law say I get though that that might be counter-productive in terms of the intellectual discourse in America. You can't just say fuck everyone. You don't agree with right right so I won't say that I have something else to say. Dr Is almost over anyone who is paying attention attention to what's going on in Washington right. Now knows that if you are a trump supporter your asshole is like that before it was like this because he was fucking you in it pretty regularly in widening ended up. It's called a gape my porn days right the shot up but now it's like like this right you asshole like this and why is your asshole so tight shot to flagrant to it's so tight because your boys on the ropes God damn. He's what the reckless and sort of cavalier way it which this man has approached the governing the free world has finally seemingly come back to bite him in the ass now impeachment processes are nasty. the a slowing of the economy is not a positive thing so it gives me no glee in my heart to see America go through what's going to be a long and sort of contentious process to prosecute the president. It's something that we all wish were not happening was using which was not happening. It's something that I'll something that we all wish was not happening. However the reality is that for whatever the reason America made the decision to entrust its safety and its immediate future into the hands of at best Nincompoop fucking poop and at worst a dangerous pretorial MEGLOMANIAC now I don't believe believe that we have seen the full consequences of what we have done to our country yet? I believe that those consequences are to come however I am very very happy that the Democrats have got off their cowardly asses and decided to move on impeaching this president there are millions a million things that he could have he could have been impeached on before if you ask me but now seemingly with this deal over the phone call Ukraine. There is some there there Eh Godspeed to them. Listen the job was always too busy for president trump whether or not he is impeached or not whether or not he is impeached or removed or not there has got to be if you are an objective person at all some buyer's remorse. If you supported president trump there's gotTA BE I. I just can't believe that you guys are that stupid maybe you are. I say all that to say this. This is the last time we're going to be confronted with someone like this who seeks power in our society. I believe that the election of president trump is most dangerous because we're going to see a lot more people that are just like him. I'm hoping that this process of bringing charges against the President of impeaching the president is a difficult one one so that we can see that sometimes the best way to deal with the problem is to avoid creating it in the first place. Hopefully the next time someone who is clearly unbalanced clearly not up to the job steps before us to who seek the highest office in the land that will have the intelligence the patients the dignity and the decency ency to not grant him or her that power right now for me. Fuck you guys trump supporter fuck out. I'm sorry it's good to Ferrari as your is possibility why people clever variety ever what would you crystal. You'll be wanting to clap clap for people right exactly not why MRS mythic metrics King. We were talking about earlier when she walked in here for I made a face because Ferrari notoriously Mexican people and we hope that is one of the things that will I hope to work through on this particular podcast now brother man. You have known each other for a little while now. Tell me you tell them right now. The people that are listening to watching the podcast cool for our shepherd is who is Ferrari Sheppard I'm a hustler. No ooh PLAN NO I. I really am like I mean the were hustle is kind of giving a bad where like somebody trying to get something out of you. I definitely am not that type of person I I work like a maniac of you know some most people think that being your own boss or being entrepreneurs easier because ought to sleep all day if I want to write but you know like you know I have to keep myself in check so a lot of work artist. I'm passionate I wouldn't. I wouldn't even call him. I wouldn't call myself activists at all. I kinda always fought against that title because I know actual activists abyss who you know they do this like twenty four seven and it's their job and I'm not that person like sometimes I feel passionately about something and and I will Organiz around or do whatever I can but to me. That's just being human right. I we all should do that right so let's start cut off with the art because that's what you're calling is and what it is that you do the art. Tell us about the journey first of all tell us about being black artist right okay and when we say artists like not you know you guys are talking about. We're not talking about music ours without Ferrari Paints. Hey Music and you make music. I'm using now right. You can't no no actually I made most deaths. Last album hated a love it and it was my first album who made me made it produced it rains. They've never talked about this. One time we talked about it. We did talk about it at one time so ops gear it is so you so you're an artist in the true sense of is that you you're you do the painting music whatever it is artistic out there and right you know the I I actually you know outside of music. I never really took music seriously to be honest with something I did to like to relax myself where and when most you seem bay is what he's going by now when he heard he was like you know who is that and I'm like it's me so after that we saw just making song after song then it started to become com kind of serious talking to j you know at title and now we're GonNa have album and I'm like Oh shit you know so I think I was in Georgetown down in the ATM and it was like some dude just following me and I'm like Oh you good or and by this time like the news came out that you know December ninety nine Ferrari Sheppard and you're seeing bay will be coming out so this do he approaches me. He was like you know. Don't fuck up. That's what he told me. Don't photo for governor I don't like what did he say he was like literally talking about like this album because he was so much of a fan. I most definitely and I'm like dude. I was just playing like not playing like I take everything I do seriously and I'm passionate but I'm not one of those like hip. Hop heads wishes like J. Diller. Who you know and I'm just I do? I'm I'm actually making art album like this is what I think sounds good and I was at the time I was listed to a lot of joy division and you know obviously a hip hop purcell arap person you know so I was bringing all of those elements together now. I want to couple that with you know you Seem Bay who is super vote versatile people it credit people credit drake is like the first singer rapper but actually you know and Andre Three thousand actually it was also most F- was in there that yeah yeah so you know that's kind of like what I became known for four minute and it was kind of like yeah I gotTa shake that because I do so much so many other things you know in terms of you know fine art. That's how I started. I started at the School of the Art Institute of Chicago. That's where you're from Kogyo. Start at the arts are spent lots. You know a lot of time in New York he's out there partially right and went to school Hula Art Institute and it was like a super culture shock for me because growing up all I knew like black people Puerto Ricans Dominicans pins and to be center in this place where it was like you know one percent black or Latino a lot of Asian people a lot of white people and people doing drugs. You know like where I grew up. It was like if it was anything other than like a blind or a beer or maybe some light some Hennessy Hennessy or them we you a crack heads straight of theme yeah. You can't come back in like that's differ for now because if they do everything when I was growing up you couldn't come back because like yeah man. We were getting high of some blow now about roasting g money from from from New Jersey City you can't you can't do those other times but now it's like yeah yeah. It's just weird to Kinda see that come into the culture like being completely transparent. I basically you know I experimented some and art college you know and you you know you could have like circle white girls during a say on and high on cocaine. Is You know my thing was acid acid. Is it like for real like. LSD actually is not first of all is not as bad is when you say Lsd they say like you know people go jump off buildings and all of that they don't talk about about the Times where someone does. LSD Trip realizes that the universe is actually like this together expand expanding the whatever it. That's why you WanNa see right now because it seems like you are I am because right now. You're talking about university so they turn into gear right now. Draw the people I talked to this one guy and he was like a since one of the most talented people that ever been around and I was I yell Oh man like what how do you see the world differently than what we see and he says he's at acid. No he said acid is the way that he does that. I mean chance had the album acid rap but seriously like when I did. LSD for the first time like it was craziest. Trip Advocaat's first of all it takes our to kick in so I was I remember I was it was a Halloween night and I was fucking wars time that you could choose to try acid. I fuck you wanted to have a battery right exactly so I'm like I'm on the Blue Line. SS Chicago it's L. L. or whatever and this German shepherd dog. There was like a police police dog just started speaking to me you know through my mind or whatever and I was like Oh shit. It's starting to happen right so we left to train. Get Out of the train. I felt like I I was walking on. What was the same I forget? It was something like the universe no in all of this stuff this type of shit like walking on a waterbed waterbed but I was on conquer on the platform you know so we go in up the you know up to street level and I dennis this feeling of like I'm dead and we're going. I WanNa be judged by God right now. Came Shit go into the party. Same situation on this floor was in a basketball court type of thing. I was like Oh you know walking and his like drips of water but it was actually would yeah sky was sitting on the on a speaker across me dress like the devil is Halloween right and he starts to speak to me about the girl that I came with a name was Chris he was like she's trying to hurt you. She wants to uh-huh and I'm like what you describe. The hardest sounds like a lot of fun right. No no no no. I'm GonNa get to the fun to find and was okay. I flipped out for me. I was like Oh God. This dude down went over to the guy and I said to him with my telepathically. I said what I said what I say. What did you just say to me because he told me she's trying to hurt me? He was like you heard what I said but but I was like oh so I'm freaking out some men who did the shit with me. We curse O'hare all right. The did the sheet with me. He was like Ferrari he was like he got calm down right now. You're on a mind altering drug that whatever you creating your mind will will manifest in reality okay says he's let's do something fun so we started moving the cars down the block. He was like you know you see that. Let's make a wave and move this car and it was really like some special affection a movie. We're moving car then became fun. We're looking at our hands with seeing the blood Blah traveled through their yes synthesis so I did this about four. Listen clown with what I'm not calling you at all. I only reveal okay so let's let's keep it. Let's keep right right now. I'm GonNa Pat Myself on back right right. Okay all month. I sold out my slough. Do that's a big deal when you're artist's studio thank you thank you I sold out my studio Canessa big deal for artists because you know especially if you're making large works something because a substantial amount of resources revenue whatever but trying to say in your speech you made a lot of fucking money. How many some money they didn't make a lot of Rs money you no so let's get back so before I did 'cause I did acid four times and college before that art was mediocre man like my thoughts? I I remember it. I used to be struggling to come up with something that was good and it was like mediocre. I dated the fourth time in it. tweak something permanently in me to make the person person that you now know that Senate. He'll chew so just like if I did it again I think it would change something else and then it would be totally different. Friend of mine told me that is acting greatest of all time is he's a fantastic actor but he says that he was able to see wavelengths wavelengths that he couldn't possibly see because of acid and you're saying that he's that is telling the truth so you gotta think about we have they only say we use ten percent of what is it ten percent of our brain between ten and thirteen or something right this opens up another percentage would put it like this. I ended up. You can't eat in on it because you're so sensitive I entered this. cafe on I caffeine lights was so bright I could hear people's teeth clamping against against the forks and this was not all of your senses Haydn so people you know acid is kind of like something that's. CIA came with before for that there was peyote. peyote was something native Americans a user and ritual because they brought you another. The doors of perception will be open. You know now so like I don't need to like older now. I don't need to pass it all needs experimenting. You know like I'm good. I think I know the wine right. It's good for I would drink wine right now. That would give them a commercial but there's some good wines Chardonnay okay. I'm GonNa I got a basketball game later so I'M GONNA go in there and wind hoop. Just go is actually good for you is not good for you but I'm GonNa tell you this so you you asked me this question. You're an artist and that comes from within right and what does art school teaching artists how answer emails you know. I know no no seriously I'm being honest like how to articulate and speak in a way that you know that's that's what I think colleges. It's like basically teaches you how to speak this language of professionalism. You know some people might call that white people's say hi to speak white thing why but it's actually just professionalism awesome and how to organize your thoughts and your ideas but particularly like how can like discredit arts. I went to school at Art Institute of Chicago. So you know every week we had three to four critiques means. You're you're making work and the professor and your in your fellow students will tear you apart or they'll tell you what's right with it so the only rule. was you get if you say excuse me if you say hey. I don't like something you ha- we will have to give a reason why you have to articulate why you don't you don't like how it could be improved. You know so what this is ultimately doing preparing a professional artist for a life of critique because I don't care how good or how much you know claim team you have going. You'RE GONNA have critics home until you're showing their job is to exalt in criticize you you know so you you gotta like Dick Skin. I recently went through something like that. Where this has been the best month of my life to be honest with you you know in terms of like the professional moves I've been making but it D- Has not come without critique so you know I'll get my stuff gets be sent by certain dealers to to museums and some galleries high end galleries in some of them? Were just shit on you. They'll say fuck you and it's comes back to you. And of course you take it personally but then also starting to learn you know what I'm still new in this in a way because you know I moved from move from journalism to music and to back to fine art so it's like I miss miss some things that I'm trying to make up but those same people will turn around next week. Say This is brilliant. They're just fucking with that you like they're just fucking with you and value. Is You accident about that. Before we got on air new you asked about how how as value assigned nine two artists. It's the same as the rap game the same so they'd be like who is buzzing. WHO's Buzzer who you know? I have a collect as my collectors. They'll ask me say the this person. What do you think this work now? Tell him I say is cool like Blah Blah Blah. They say do you think there are they buzzing. Are they buzzing because if someone one let's just say hypothetically someone buys my my work right now for fifteen thousand dollars what they're banking on is that it's an investment that in five ten years is this going to be a hundred and fifty thousand two hundred and fifty thousand one million and it happens so often so what a lot of collectors do it seems things you know from the outside looking in is that they they are hedging their bets and putting up real money and everything but the one thing that they wanna know no is consistent and that you're going to be that you're still going to be doing this in twenty years and you know one. You know you can make some the money or doing it. You know so that whole like the paradigm of the starving artist dismantle like anybody watching his any the kids watching this they wanted to make art put that out of your mind that you're gonNA be starving not true. That's over with okay. The starving artist is over with over. I mean you got you got. You have to start some time to get to where you wanna go but like the ultimate because I think the the main narrative has always been that if your art is you're you're not gonna get any money until your dead or your family. You'll get money you know which used to happen. In the past like van goal famously only sold one painting painting in his life and his brother for rent money you know he's one of the greatest painted that we know in the Twenty First Twenty Twentieth and Twenty First Century Century the thing is though that you know I would say I would say I WanNa say Picasso was the first Rockstar Rockstar he said No. You'RE GONNA pay me millions of dollars. While I'm alive you know and you know Warhol came and he sa- Eh men's pilot more pollick all these all of these artists so in terms of like being a black artists like this is. I had a this guy who who is. Why am I in my studio? I have a live where studio near downtown he came to me and he said you know this is a great time for black artists and art is the best time and and I wanted to like curse him out because you know I think in his mind he he's he's equating you know visibility with power and that's not in my mind or reality right because when you look at something like the highest paid living artist today his name is Jeff Koons Okay God bless them and everything but his pain is it going for something like sixty five million knives paintings by his works like sometimes he does sculpture and this is the white man and to me you know I won't disrespect because one day I might meet him but you know artists like Let's just say Kerry James Marshall Who's been practicing around the same time and whose work is phenomenal is barely scraping that at all you know is great for let's put into perspective. He's not doing bad and he's not bad at all like what is last painting. He sold to Diddy a twenty million Liam twenty million which he didn't get a dime of or you know because he sold that piece actually in nineteen I think it was nineteen seventy seven and if I'm wrong correct wreck me but nineteen seventy seventy sold I think for twenty thousand dollars so you know the way the way the system works is once you're blown up up. You may like me. I may sell bunch of paintings for ten thousand to fifteen twenty whatever it is but once I'm blown up my my my worth has his town went up there. Now you can sell paintings for more money exactly those things become more valuable and stuff like that talk about specifically what the plight fight or the experience of the black artist and the reason why I say that is because we are talking about black artists in history. Obviously People Basquiat people know you know some others but it doesn't seem like even for me someone who has a little bit of knowledge about the art world that I can go as deep into my bag of black painters and sculptors and artists right as I can with just some of the other guys that dominates yeah these household name household names like what is that is that changing is there is there is definitely you know what it is that I understand what the man who told me is great to be a black heart is now what he was saying and there is this is a moment where we are vote. We are at the at the forefront you know in terms of what what I see is that there's a problem still and that is that only a few or one or two of us are let in and then that creates as a certain competition among us. You know recently you know Nathaniel Mary Quinn I don't know if you saw about him but he I I think he was on Colbert show and everything but he was signed by Google Shin which is like the height of the art world when you get in there you know his stuff is six figures now and he's a younger brother. You know he's like I think he's run Chicago actually and his stuff is amazing. Work is amazing but you know like I've ever overheard other artists black artists named mentioning you know this and that and it is like I know what you if their voice in frustration because alike why him only you know so that's playing against that Hollywood for a long time a lot of writing on time if and that's changing too for a long time on if there was a big movie that was coming out and they need a black face it was denzel will and then a couple of other guys and there was a lot of actors that came around ninety seven to like two thousand five hundred thousand six after a while they were frustrated with the fact that didn't seem to be as deep roster as far as leading leading men. It just didn't seem to be deeper Rosser now. That's that's definitely changing. You got five six seven guys that are on their come up right now right. You're saying that we're the art world's a little bit behind. Maybe that right now yeah experiencing it like so I'm going to give a shout out to my sister Mariam Ebrahim she she just opened a gallery in Chicago. She's Big Shit right now and it's because she's rapid some of the MOTZ exciting black artists that on the scene and she started in Seattle because she's molly but she started in Seattle and it was like new you black art there no representation she kind of made that into a Mecca so now she's moved to Chicago so it's like one step once that one step and she's being taken seriously but you know I mean I don't WanNa get I wanNA speak to recklessly but I will say that. Ownership ownership is really important and I bring Mariam to say that that she owns this gallery and she's changing things herself. If anybody's out there look Mariam Ibrahim Brahim she reps she might yeah no yeah okay. She's she's amazing and I just think when you talk about Hollywood and it's like it's you know people talk about a here Jemaine do pre and Jay Z and everybody talk about this ownership thing as this is if this mystified fight thing when it's really not that you know when you demystify it's just like you you own your grandma. So you have resources you start small. You get a little bigger. You just keep going right now myself contain business right now. I'm I'm currently on sign right which is same as enwrap right. Let's just say that you hot but you remaining on signed Dick and power in that because you know I don't like the gallery gallery take a fifty percent commercial you saying signing signed to a gallery to a gal you could be signed multiple galleries galleries take fifty percent commission and most people fifty percent wasn't end the gym and all of this stuff but when you look at it once you start with reputable gallery it has to be the right gallery then they're going to do a lot of things for you. You know there's there's the press there's obviously the logistics and everything but they're going to be out there getting you more and raising your value so fifty fifty percent of two million dollars don't sound too bad at all right so you know that's the ecosystem of the of the art world and what we need to have a more black people people who are of color on museum boards and also just more owners the ownership thing as far as black Americans is concerned is an interesting thing because it seems as if it's a new concept but it's not I think that you know black people in the past we actually actually got talked out of ownership like we started off after slavery really leaning into ownership and and and you know starting our own businesses and only in our own community and I think around the time of immigration some kind of way either conversation was had with us or we had it with ourselves to aware the renting of our culture and ourselves and our talent the leasing of it to people that became a big deal. You wanted to get signed by deal you want went to endorse. You want to draw money from something that you didn't own it was it wasn't necessary for you to have as much exposure when it goes go straight up back to the slave mentality which is I was a massive last night year old adage enough feel like they they have nothing that voices fucked up but you know it is what it is. You know I see it all the time like I I was at one of my collectors had me in it put me up in his place and it was in a nice place and there was a doorman and do look like uncle bins mix with Django the Guy Samuel Jackson Jingo and soon to pull up what you're doing up here Steven from Django what when you're doing your hand. UK Do that but Whoa Sam supposed to be here. You know like I'm staying here yeah and hope who knows that old school you know and it's just like and it hurt me so bad because I was like you know. undestand trust me I understand that may have been and working for forty years and he sees young do roll up and I'm going to the penthouse but I felt like man over that like lease like good for. Oh you young blood like whatever worth is telling you that you can't be there yeah. His worth like his worth is like I have the key is is almost like sometimes what happens we talk about racism in the Police Department it's really not as much black versus white is blue versus white and the the reason why I say that is because a lot of the black cops have a very similar mentality to their their white counterparts and and it's because in order to be accepted in that world you have to look. They're there to tell people who the criminals are and it doesn't who is they the the like a lot of black police officers have oh so they are the style makers are trendsetters to me to me when you get into like the Blackhawks are gonNA listen to this and I've been trying to get one coming on the podcast that we can talk these things but sometimes they even go harder because in order for them to prove their worth they have to disassociate yeah until their brethren who the criminals are and how they act and how they whatever and even if they don't don't have to be active in that they have to ignore so the gentleman that was being the doorman there like his worth impart it is in identifying for the rest of those people dangerous dangerous black people right and that brother's been doing that for a long long time and I think the goal is for us culturally is to live in a situation where no one has to be that were there were there so much there's so much value so much strength and power in our own community in our own circles that no one feels like they have to compromise themselves step out of that and culturally or socially betray that in order to have have a job somewhere and so that that's a hard thing to do because there's such an you look at capitalism and the way that capitalism has been taught as being the saving grace of black America. There's an indoor individualistic nature to it so it like everybody you know we even talk about guys in their hood. That might be dealing dope. Oh baffled hood fuck. I know you're out there. I know that you're out there. You're you're doing what you have to do and you're participate in the economy that is available to you and I'm not knocking anyone. I'll fuck that I am not going to lie. I'm I'm knocking it because you have to have. I'm GONNA go ahead. No go for it. uh-huh did you have to you have to have a solution for that because like to park said long ago he said. How am I going to tell another person how they the operate if I'm not gonNA feed him viewing him well I mean I I mean the options I mean I'm coming from that? I'm coming from. I'm coming from crack. The straight up crack era where I remember I sold crack for three days right and I couldn't stomach you know like the but even though I was not selling crack all of my friends was a lot of my friends would sell the crack. Some you know most of my friends were selling crack and there was the police what they would do. is they will pull us over constantly. That's regardless if you sell the crack not because you black out here. What are you doing? What are you doing on earth? You're not supposed to move not supposed to be anywhere yeah so what that culminated to is basically then pulling you into alley or restaurant bathroom and going joining your asshole with gloves okay. The most kind of is a demeaning things any any person you know so planting drugs folks constantly right so what I noticed was that all of these free all my friends my friends they're not minister society or superpredators. It is as the Clintons will put it. They were my friends totally normal guy right there with my friends and they were impoverished. 'cause I was impoverished and I saw most of them. Never made they only made enough money to buy sneakers so sneakers and some food maybe Italian beef sandwich or hamburger then once they a real up they re up to eight ball that half or whatever that they're doing then they have enough to buy shirt but my by this time now the shoe's old so so they never get a matching axe outfit because it's always just catching pending playing catch now. Where is the property with the rent wears who knows because that's like like the secondary so when we talk about like survival it's coupled with this conversation of ownership? Ownership ownership is impossible. If you're living miserable matrix because survive you know living the minute I get the listen part of part of changing the mindset part part of changing the sort of intellectual understanding of society that our committee would have is getting us out of the Matrix to where we're thinking about living or dying to where we taken talking about. Just how do I make it to the next day because if that's the case that has nothing to do anyone who's in a survival mode who's just thinking about. I'm just trying to live to see but this goes back what you just say. Although I do blame the drug blamed enjoy you. Would you re going to counter the reality is this though at the same time understanding something is different than condoning something and criticizing something is different than in dehumanizing and individual. I I know it's a very difficult conversation to have some people that would be outside of my community. I know gentleman common criminals dudes that are that are good people that that have big hearts that love that like a lot of them. Oh I know guys that I lost that when they passed away the entire who was destroyed right. It sounds like Gambino for Italian right like we were all sad that they were going but if you look at the rap sheet you would think that this was a horrible horrible person. It depends on what Lens you're looking the friends. I'm looking at you as a fucking dude. I'm looking at you as a guy I'm not and so I'm not saying that we necessarily have to judge human beings for the situations that they find themselves was an but the actions and they're right or wrong and what I and and and and and what I would say is not only do I come from a family of drug dealers. I come from a family of drug users and so when you see somebody that's chained to that and cannot beat that do blame the drug dilatot or do you blame the real drug or not. I don't blame. I don't blame the drug dealer what I want the Middleman Che's though I don't blame. I don't listen. There's a lot of blame to go around from the top all the way down but what I'm saying is I want less of that and I want you to know that I can't celebrate how you doing that. I'm not GONNA my going to say you know you're terrible. Bad individual rap is what I think. I think there's I listen. I Hustle rap is a celebration of these people surviving by the wrap. I wrap is a celebration of this of them surviving and a lot of times when you when if we were take me and you were in we have been in Hanoi together right in Vietnam Okay and we're like. Let's say I'll make you John McCain because you said you share his politics so look. Let's go away together right all right if we have been in Hanoi together and we both survivor know we come back. We all fucked up. We Walk Williams Orlando. Whatever whatever no we would do whatever we got together? We talk about in great detail. How fucking difficult it was to make it out of there? We would have a bond. A lot of people wouldn't understand we'd be like hey remember that one fucking God used to come in and all the shit that we went through in hindsight hindsight it will be terrible but it would seem glossy. You're in the fact that we had survived it and we would tell that story of survivor for a long time that to me is what hip hop is yeah. I mean on a personal level like when you brought that up I don't do that. I don't do like I find it. I think that I have I I don't think I know I have some trauma associated with with projects and poverty and crack era so so like you know when we talk about these Vietnam vets like I actually like most of my friends from back in the era. I don't even talk to them and it's not because I'm acting new or extra a Hollywood. It's just that I think that in order to do to to get out of there and this is some flack for this in order to get out how to that you have to get away from it you know and that's one thing away from it or away from them. No away from it because what what it is as human beings we go back to childhood. They'll tell me some Bush because they used to call me some dumb shit. When I was young you know like my nickname only one AH furry why Ferrari and he's like getting high whatever we we share that with like the oldest dumbed call me fighting over it and all of that I love them? You know we're M in my life is just seeing this. I I was looking at a tweet that may be by the time you put this out but ice tea said you know he peed game and I follow him. I love him. I love ice tea man but he was like you know haven't powerful enemies is good because it makes strange now. I was thinking about my last thing nipsy. Say you know and and I'll I'll get moments where I'm like getting drunk and I'm thinking about it. I'm like I wish nipsy. Would not been so down Earth. You understand earth so that that I know you might have talked about this on your so so what you're saying is you're saying. Is You wish that because he might have not been at the marathon store today they they might not have been at the marathon or marathon store might have been somewhere else somewhere else because so I'm looking at this you know hip. Hop Is my our baby you know and this I told him before nipsy died. I was like no I can't take another loss like this is starting to hurt you know so but I think about everyone almost everyone who lost a hip hop and they may expand even go to John Lennon whatever they would down earth and they say I'm down with. It's the same San Down to Earth is the same thing as saying keeping a real right. You know you say I'm GonNa keep a real and I'm GonNa do this and I say I'm here to announce. Announce fucked at like at a certain point. I I wish all of those dues I grew up. Well like you know I hope that they they can feed their families families and they go forward but I can't take them with me. You know and I think that's an important message. Take them with you but you don't have to leave the behind you don't have to leave him behind wind because at a certain point I'm always going to be voucher for live outline standing for them but in terms of you know you said about the Vietnam vet like I don't even want to think about those things because they traumatize me so much so you know is this weird thing about hip. Hop Man and let me ask you this real quick before we move okay so so for me just talking about that because that's a very important piece of information to kind of unpack so this is so in my life I look at effluents empower as this right so being out here having a specific severi voice having a voice that could potentially grow into a larger voice. What good is that voice? If the kids from South Baton Rouge Louisiana who are going to be looking and saying y'all bands from right here van some Gardir Lane then went to McKinley high school their sister went to Lee high school like the people from God from that if I come out here and all of that that happens and their lives aren't affected by that to me my life becomes somewhat of a waste and the reason why I would say that is because it is almost like the NBA is doing something right now called Nba Africa right and so I lived I lived in several countries so what happens is Pascal Seattle. NBA Player comes from Cameroon Cameroon. One player comes out of there they get a couple of different players out of there and then what happens is all the players forget about what happens when the corporation of investment into a situation it's never great but what happens is all the players that come from there that have dreams of being able to get to the NBA now now because one guy made it out they have a conduit doesn't mean he has to go back and stay in Cameroon and lived there he he can live in Toronto live. La Live with whatever whatever but the time that he spends going back and making sure that the next express calcio calm doesn't have such a hard road to get there changes. Everything and I think that that's very important. I think black Americans Americans do that. It's not even just black America Black Americans because the reason why I'm saying black Americans because nobody else is coming coming to give us a fucking hand and we've been trying to appeal to major culture for a long time we have been trying to say treat US bad down do is right but they never come in. They don't give a fuck. They've proven that over and over again they don't care it's not gonNA happen and it's not even it's not my even before them secure. We just got care about us. uh-huh hearing is not staying on your hood and then your block necessarily but it's definitely making sure that people from your blog got a chance that they might not have had you not blown up. I totally the agree you know one of my players not blown up like that but I will be and I do have a plan and that plan is Su know have a school and in school. I'd take at risk students also students who are doing great and not just address. Sometimes I was at risk but we also want to make sure that this kids that might come to families that want to do art that they haven't exactly you. Have a you have a you have agency here as well but what I will do is I will have them where they can travel because that's so important like you know when I went out of the country and I start going around like you start to have a better perspective of the world not saying we can't we can't we can't solve this generation is like trying to move a mountain in one sitting. You can't do it right so we're we have a great task ahead of us and sometimes I'll be honest. We talked off camera about Jay Z and I we had four men. I was trying to think about his new. NFL We've went over this. This is old news by now but I would. I was pressing for early on was a little patience right and a little like with a two year old. Not Saying Dismiss a two year old you know but where we say okay give them some legroom. like we do pop is and we do have I man fuck them. They did this and that and then next next year we lay him. I'm hungry go just give him some room and I think that you know not that things we we have such a greet fear in in his in his valid of being betrayed you know because we've been betrayed so many times right but how many times have we been betrayed by miracle and white people you know and which like these this whole thing is an experiment and when we bring this conversation first of all out of just America and make it into diaspora like all of my people and you know South Africa yeah in Nigeria and ideas Baba Ideo like we're all facing the same similar problems I I went to a conference in Cape Town in two thousand twelve right it was a conference that was actually funded. I didn't know when I I was just like free airplane ticket. Let's talk about yeah now went. It was funded by David Soros right and I didn't know that until I got to go to Jordan Laura Dave. I don't even know this guy's name. That's how deep it is like worst WanNa talk about some. I feel like they had our rooms tapped because we had to answer these political questions in order to to get onto the Internet really weird whatever but at any rate I'm in town I was I free free flight the Cape Town we have the these seminars where they are Africans from every from all the countries around Africa and then there's you know a few people from the states and from the UK and we're having what essentially became a slave meeting as what I felt it was where we talked about our identity was holding us back colonialism slavery slavery and I looked over I had a moment now looked over and it was like a couple white we will sprinkled in audience and they seem to be taking notes not even taking taking a bathroom break and I said you know this theater. This is theater. This has become theater and we're working working through this in a very public way which is unique in a historic from a historic standpoint where there's a group of people who are slight slighted for centuries and instead of violence because usually that's how it's taken care of as violent violent highland insurrection in defense we now must assimilate and try to come up strategize in the eyes of the people who who are holding us back. Many of the people in our group is it's a lot to deal with so one way approaching you know some someone like Jay Z who who has a little power right now he has a little power and when you look at the spectrum that much power they is and we too hard on them. We hard on each other we hard. I don't know how women we hard on us and sometimes it's like. I'm Pisces and I'm sensitive like they would say but also sensitivity is now weakness since it's a sensitive person personal beat you to death but I'm sensitive to that because I know that that's a law doesn't work it. It only works in reverse like I know this personal standpoint like you know that's tough love. It makes you callous makes you callous list and it makes on let's get back into the conversation we'll talk about. It makes a person who wanted to help say Fuck Ya and I've I've had that I've had those situations like in terms of when I you know we can't social media prominence. I guess you WANNA call it. I didn't even take seriously at Tom Sawyer. Oh you twitter famous. They used to get on my nerves because I'm like no. I actually can paint masterpieces those disrespect but now it's something to say your social media famous you know but at the time our social media famous and I saw I say some dumb shit I was growing up in the public not to give any you know excuses is or anything but it's like. I was literally grown up. There's some things that I read that I wrote that ice that are tweeted like years ago my Hugh Fuck Stupid Dude but you also twenty three so but just the way you know with the then we get into cancer culture but that was this was the pre cancer cancer culture cancel cancel called see look at that cancer culture cancel culture where it's like. I'm looking at many of the you know the the faces in the Abbey's that have cursing me out call me less than shit and I ain't nothing and black and I'm like Yo literally like I. I'M NOT GONNA sit out here and put my resume out here but I've done things behind the scenes that like four my people 'cause I can't I couldn't sleep. I'm like I we need to do something so for that. Turn that quicken system like bullshit and then where it's like I'm dismissed completely. Completely dismissed are like that and I feel like that is also holding back because there's a there's element and not to compare my boss to white white America or white Britain. Whatever I know something about this first of all whiteness is a construct WANNA get into that anybody who doesn't know it was created? Whiteness was created you know up until after World War Two Let's just say Jews. Italians and Irish weren't considered white so they would consider it a little underneath white so all this is changeable white people. I've noticed don't roll why people away okay this look at these these serial killers. Let's look at these mass shooters some of the worst people in history they get a place it may be at the bottom of whiteness even white so called white trash gets a place release and they say well he shot up a mall. He was insane. Wow that humanity is preserved as not. He's a monster they call they call the reason for all of this. The reason is that and this is something that black people have to get away from really really a lot of people have died from. There's a belief and the belief bears itself out in society the white people that okay so it was very simple because this was broken down so eloquently by Orlando Jones a monologue he did on his show called American gods where where he talked about he he plays the God of essentially black people on on the show and he was like you know when dealing with these things is I'm a white person person does something that's it. No matter how terrible it is looked at as a person who did a bad thing when black person does something it's them showing you who they really were the entire time and so not only do I feel like mainstream America believes that I feel like to a degree lessening but to relieve that we believe that of ourselves sometimes aunts and the the reason why is because we see a lot of ugliness and the ugliness that we see sometimes comes from one another also we are. We're more forgiving of each other behind the scenes means than we are in public that is the most concerning thing to me because that tells me that we act differently while under the gaze of White America why we're expected to go into gladiator right reality is that when you see all of these people on on the Internet that are that are the lambasting in talking about these are people that have in their families and in their communities all types of people do they put up with fuck shit from forever right like like we all know for our family people that's fucked the friends fucked up like all of this stuff right right and but when when it comes from a celebrity or somebody prominent we want to act like they're the the exception or the the status attained in someone may in some way makes them impervious to having made a mistake or just been being wrong about something right so I think to a degree I gotta look at myself and I say I'm guilty of that not just to black people but you know you come harder. People do come like people you know how many people have called me up but y'all man my name domain foreign fucking problem me I dislike as Mapfre Mapfre Oregon award spirit he just because you because you get on your not afraid to name I mean and at the end of the day it's like I won't unless I take it back because I I did. I'm unnamed name name. Go for Charlene and God I. I'm a I'm a name name. I'm sorry I apologize is brother. You know there was some times where I want to correct him and I could've went about a different way and I did. The fuck boy stands which is I'm GONNA come at. You and there was some real real shit like I'm actually from that culture. Where if you got a problem with somebody you handle it? You know what I'm saying but we also grom in and we are trying. I I see like I wouldn't. I wouldn't apologize right now if I had not seen him trying to. You know to move in a different direction into what he's doing his best right. He's doing his best and I saw I saw I used to be like microchip. My criticism of him was I said you're you have this platform this large platform warm and you're not using it properly not to say that I would do any better but I'm like you know with the It just seemed like he did there was there was a spirit of Harare not harassment on the shirt talking shit on and I know that's entertainment but I was like I'm coming from like I had I had. We've talked about what you had but I no longer do it because I'm doing something else I I had a platform amount in independent. Stop being famous and part of thing that made that popular was that a humanized my guest and that's what I wanted for him to do so badly because I felt there was so much to learn from from the people instead of just you know doing like you said we're expected to go into this gladiator arena and so I heard you suck some dick you know come on Bro Roll. Like what do I know you're better than that and I'm starting to see him move or he'll actually like acts and turns color ism and things like that. He'll act someone like what does this mean. Help me through this because I'm I'm learning. How did we met? How can you be upset with a person like that? You know what I mean but again that was me being us a fuck shit not actually seeing he's his humanity because at the moment I was like this is what you represent you represent some dumb shit right now right so so this is what you are Charlemagne Dumb Shit Dumb Shit saw and that's not true because he guy mom and go home you know he's learned and I saw that I saw other people. I'm going to be honest with you and I I'm. I'm better with this because I actually learned the lesson other night. I'll tell you about these trolls who we talking Shit Yeah I go into today's. DM's quietly and I asked them for a physical altercation and not not too bad as person in the water as being four. I got my ass be be some ass by them Hammer Ashby my thing is so you go straight up you alight less if it's a man right down. I'm going to say what I asked them. What what's your problem with me by what is seriously problem and then when they say they say they know you just say it's the dentist cool? I'm just on Bobby. I WanNa know if you really have a problem with me because right now you harassing me and I don't like that and I guess I'm not new school enough like come from school of you. If you have a problem with someone you talk to a stranger and might end up in the cemetery. Keep that level of I was talking to victims. I took I was the first person that takes big Minnesota to the gun range right. He asked me to take him. I took them first thing. He said it was like you know he noticed there was not put his name out there but fuck it. It is what it is. There was a confederate flag on the wall. At this gun range that we went to the he went off. He went off and went to to owning your why y'all got that up this now. I had to grab him like don't do that don't do that. We're all armed in here and if you notice everyone's respectful by Subaru. Excuse me Hi Louisville problem. Everybody is equally armed. We respect back to each other but somehow because I was talking about having a conversation about this because if something goes left it can go all the way all the way left. Everybody's hurt. Everybody's getting lost their families in loss so on the Internet you know and I know the you know the the saying is either. You're going to change the world of the you're going to be changed by the world. I'M NOT GONNA. I'm changed the Internet. The Internet is full of trolling. It won't stop you know but sometimes the Cathartic release for myself. I need to address these people and say we need to get back back to respect to respect to one time you go yo trying to pull up and it goes yeah Nigga Rice plopping now. I'm the I'm down like I'm. I'm not even I'm not. I'm not fucking with you. I really don't have so much to lose right now. And that's why I'm changing because it's like rory. You made ah that you gotta do that. No more than that. I need to probably this was not probably I need to actually get all of you. Tell me for all you need to get off the Internet in a net and this magazine get off there in an ab telecom yeah the same thing and you're listening but get off the Internet and I'm getting to to a point now where I'm starting to have more to lose and you know this is dumb shit. This is dumb shit but at the same time most of those cases where I find out that these people don't mean any harm and they're not actually threatening me or whatever is just that this this is what this environment breeds which is like fuck. You got people who don't like me. I have never had a conversation with me whenever saw me in person person or even seen like how I speak. It's like wildfire wildfire. This catch on Russia book is like Oh we're tyler when he was like foxy are sorry we even know what you're saying. Sorry for the gave us a reason later but let me ask you this. We're talking talking right now is Monday Kai was supposed to have dropped Friday. You're from Yahoo Chess. You know a lot of people were your feels about Kellyanne Conway. I love you man. I love but now fan anymore aw and that's just the honest truth I can't i. It's hard for me to be personally. 'cause I'd say some wild shit. You expect me to do some wild shit in life. Just anybody out there. I may do some shit but there's certain things within my parameter our never do and I think think if you're a leader right you have to be you have to have qualities that are of a leader right now. He is not in this in a in a state where he can lead man like in. It's not just because of his bipolar disorder or bipolar disorder. Is that you no. I don't think the center spiritually you know what I mean so I'm just kind of out of it. I'm more I'm more that do because I felt the energy where he was the one who doesn't feel that energy where you to underdog. Everybody said she was Never GonNa do you did you took over the world is due like Kanye West at a certain turning point was the hardest thing you know he had to wait till I give my money right. It was so beautiful see him blossom in his genius and four to fizzle will in a moment in this in these studios here you know and for it to turn into this like. I don't know if you're trying to be a cult leader or if you're trying China like I know you love Jesus. I love Jesus for real. That's no faking that but also known if you if you buy polar then there are moments where some bipolar people experienced great feeling of religious awakening also they feel that they can save the world. You know I think there there's a brother I won't won't take credit for this brother. I forget who wrote about this wrote about Conway and his in bipolar disorder and he was awesome self bipolar and he was saying saying how he felt like sometimes he could save the world and that moment where he split Lollapalooza we said let me through. This is my city split like like you now. like Moses that was kind of manifestation of that thing of like I have this great sense of I can save people right so I don't relate to it anymore. I don't relate to it and a criticism. I don't have contact with him anymore. None of that but ah I have problems with him that you know I could discuss them here but they could be discussed privately to mainly Vanessa the Beecroft she deserves to be called by name this woman if you don't know about her Google Vanessa Beecroft Sudan and this is a woman who works with it Kanye West she went to ten years ago this was she went to Sudan and she tried to adopt these two said Sudanese twins okay okay from orphanage but only photo shoot and she filmed it and the nurses there will tell her please don't touch the babies and she snatched a baby baby. This is unheard documentary. Call Art Star. She snatched the babies and she she went and she was crying. She start calling the women names and races his name's Okay and saying how they were selfish and this and that all she wants to his adopt these babies for a photo shoot and which she has he say charter them for photo shoots take take them just to have this photo of them breastfeeding from her and on Internet then she goes on to say that Konya West last gave her permission to say the inward and that she identifies host she's white person with ginger hair as a black male because conway things like this is you can read about it. Read up on Vanessa Beecroft. Tell me finish telling me I never heard this before so like. What is she vanessa? Sob Cross works works with him on the the his his fashion campaigns she did. She did this for the video run away. Okay very very talented artists without a doubt. She's in some of the highest art galleries in the world is just her Blaine Lina racism and she says things about beyond say you have to read about those that are clearly a problem and for Kanye to just go through with tunnel vision and act like this is happening it kind of goes into his whole. I don't WanNa talk about this do for thirty minutes. I love it when I say I love him. I mean I I love him. He's going through some problems. I have some disagreements come sure qualley and a whole bunch of other people who know him even seen scene and everybody has talked to him and we don't know we just don't know but I love him in that same fort because I fell in love with him when he had that when I swing we showed his brilliance right now. He's in a moment where he's down so I won't kick them anymore. When he's down? I stopped that you know and that's what we are so last question ask you as an art is like a full service artists meaning full paint you do music all of that yeah. There's a argument or discussion about the artist's responsibility to the the community and their responsibility to themselves where you stand on now now are now at a man is middle thirties or whatever is very is important. It is a monumental to put yourself first to put your mental health physical health your financial health I because I was one of those art no before I thought we will talk about the people before the people know the art. The art is me man whether there's been times where you know I'm in survival mode like I was homeless man in New York City. I'll sleep shots. Everybody who let let me sleep on their floors. I'm not there anymore but thank you I'm humble enough to say that to the point where it's like sometimes we don't have we need need help. You know the community needs to help us but even then I was an artist always nodded no matter what whether I'm selling on I'm not selling. I'm always going to be hard. It's but when it comes down to I think that question goes more to a rapper or or something because you say well what do you do. You put the people before the art. Oh what was the question again is Is Anything done done in the name of art appropriate. Oh see I misunderstood you can just clip that out. Hell no because first of all Hitler I'd off Hitler had a whole unit of people who specialized in creating propaganda Ganda Art that would ultimately lead to the genocide genocide the Holocaust okay so they they are instances where art is not fucking art is actually just hatred. You know what I mean so you know who's to determine that I don't know who's the determinant determinant is. Just like we know by the results of it. You know I I've seen so many days I only get into yeah I've seen art this visual artists who they're white and they are pushing the lines of what they can do as a white person in terms of what expression they have have in telling black people stories but I've also like I have a friend from college. His duties like Irish Dude. I love them forever. He's not from Ireland White Man and he called me any shoutout Stephen because he c- he called me and he asked me he said you know so. Sometimes you have white people who think that King of black people if so do you think that this is bad for whatever and I had to tell him like I can't tell you what everybody the oath GonNa say but I can tell you what I think about it. The has great idea about the the school bombing of the of the girls in in sixty three or four little girls and he had this idea. He's like man you know I want to go down and I want to talk to the families that actually were involved in that that sounds like go go because you coming from pure play he was like do you think are get backlash because I'm a white person might know coming from a respectful place camp camp ever like even if it is mistaken for something that's disrespectful. It exists in a very intelligent way in thoughtful thoughtful way like we don't look at David attenborough him covering some area me like what the fuck doing over there mess with. You may notice do this. He's trying to give us a better understanding of the world so you can never have a be out of pocket so great art shines through that you don't have. There's no explanation. That's needed like people may not like me. They may not like things that I've said right but when I look at my paintings they have just shut the fuck up because it's not even me is not coming from me as art. Now is documentation something exist outside personality race this and that so. I think that that's important to understand when it comes to art like we won't have to question. Whether what is this art or trash. It's like you know fucking trash man or you know so yeah. That's what I feel about that. You went up for four hours shepherds. You Got Energy Healing Energy. Healing is the thing my thoughts. Don't put you know but I was. I didn't know he was going to bring a girl because I was gonna ask you whether or not we're talking about here. What time if they were our groupies are groupie superstar? You could talk to me about that now now. Now you say that now then we talk about our groupies later on she she's doing some energy Hunan something like that she goes you know I just want to have have just a small conversation about these. Are Group's WanNa know where they are right but we'll talk about. I know that Nah August we'll talk about that overtakes. I these guys we have real black magic in here. Yeah given cerise pick one way roads right. Yes rose not supposed to tell the the list of the repeal who you are. I am sure he's roads. I am also running for a local seton office. Los Angeles County Board of Supervisor Los Angeles yes. I thought it was very important to have you on because of a couple of things number one in the black community we talk about being politically active you talk about being politically engaged but a lot of times when we do that we talk about national elections uh-huh galvanize behind presidential elections sometimes gubernatorial elections sometimes in the to`real elections but we we don't talk about what we need to do in our state and local governments in order to make change in our before where we get into why you feel like it was important to run. I want you to tell people a little bit about your background where you're from how you got to wear yard. I'm from. La My background. I was a former foster youth I was also experienced homelessness in. La County with my three year old son I used the welfare programs programs and so during those experiences. I became pissed off pissed off to the point where I'm I'm not happy the way my community is the way it's being ran. I'm not happy with local government. just like you mentioned about how a lot of times we're focused on presidential elections but little do we know that our local government is what affects our day to day lives use in what's being administered to our counties and to our you know our our Council district so that's even highly more of important to be a part of that process as far as who were voting locally because that's affecting our immediate day to day lives so that was one reason my got fed up with the system. I got fed up with over decades. How many people are more becoming homeless every day? I'm fed up with how many of our young black boys are being and killed and no accountability taken and I just got pissed off in. I said Hey I need to stand up for my community so that we can be represented because right now are being overlooked so tell tell us about the the journey that going from being homeless with your son to being in a position to run for public office offers. That's an amazing story wow so I wanted to get my feet wet. which which was two thousand eighteen? I was homeless with my son that was last year ear and I was sitting there. I'm like what can I do to change the situation. I'm in account. I'm GonNa County building and there's a lady that came in the county building sitting with her five-year-old baby. Infant baby is raining that day and she's like you guys stopped my benefits right and and they're like well. You didn't turn in a piece as the paper. She's like. I came all the way down here to give you a piece of paper that you've already got. `Im came in on the bus and you know it's like I just need help like we just need help and and and they're like Oh we do have the paper and they didn't do their job but she had to her baby sick she had to come all the way down in this county to county building just to get something to move forward Horsley she can feed her baby and I'm and I'm looking around the room. Van and its Latino women is black with tears in their eyes how how much she's just like. Just need help like what's going on here. Where are the resources how come the resources are like trauma? Find a needle in a haystack and I guess just from that is just like somebody to stand up right and you decide that person was you. What was that like so you you see this going on and then you decide I want to do what's the first thing that you saw so what I started doing start looking up? WHO's accountable for this? What are the seats in office? What does this do so what does that do and I came across the county board of Supervisors which word not we know about our city council men and different things like that but we're not to you know hip on what's the county board of supervisors exactly they're they're pretty much referred to as the kings and Queens of the La county that's how powerful they are they administer the funding into our lapd into our fire departments into our county programs anything that is a local government is the La County Board of supervisors advisors supervise that they're right over the council districts trick riders check writers the movers and shakers much representation in terms of African Americans? Do we have on there. I know one person out of how many out of five so one person out of five are these is so for the Board of Supervisors is is this broken up into specific district specific districts overall. the entire district is made up of about ten million people east district is about out two point five million. Wow yes you one person then you have a tremendous amount of power your big as a state. Yes wow wow so okay so you so then the reality is that you took on it. Would this be your first elected office. Missile be my first elected office so you took order a pretty sizable challenge this absolutely absolutely so when I was talking about getting my feet wait van when I saw as I'm looking at what what seats to run for at the time this wasn't available and so I'm like hey let me run for state. Assemblies was in two thousand eighteen. I'm still homeless mind you so I'm sitting there trying to figure out how to do the paperwork. Sid It standing grocery parking lots getting signatures. You have to get a certain amount of signatures mixers and so you know got to a point where where I was a I was on paper as a candidate but I was blocked so so point where I couldn't actually run that time but I got that kind of foundation of experience on running and so I was. I was still trying to do that being homeless at the same time. It was no okay. Let me wait till I get this point of my life. It was a mindset of let me just go and do it and so here I am today and from my experience from twenty eighteen to now is like you have to create allies. You have to know what your platform is and one of my main things is incorporating. Are influencers like yourself to inspire the youngsters and our hip hop culture. Our culture period is powerful and so in our communities our our our youth are following the influencers. They're not following the elected officials. It's important to give our influences political power because that is you guys are the leaders of love our feature Do you think that's wise and this wall asks this. Sometimes something that frustrates is like me. influencers tend to be influenced a lot by the sort of echo chambers that exist online. I could sometimes difficult to actually get in a room with people and get any real coalition volition building done because the people that support you online the people that look at you. They're so loyal to what they what it is that they think that you are then allow you to step outside the box. The dinner like about having someone like you is is an election as elected officials. You have the opportunity to actually influence. The infant is absolutely see I would rather not have have you give me power. I would rather take that power you and give it to people who are working in communities that are doing doing this every single day to be honest with you. I said on television and then I'll talk shooting. I laugh and I do a podcast and stuff like that. I wasn't standing in a parking lot getting signatures issues. I wasn't on the ground. I wasn't in that building. I wasn't doing that work. You were like you're the person that knows how this works. You're the person that has information so it's actually up to people like me to make sure that people like you have with you and that's working together because it's not just about me. It's about both of us like a coalition working together. You have your influence people. Look up to you a certain way you can say something and people start doing that in their lives. I have US different type of influence like you said maybe over the influencers. Oh I would say equal and so me using my power and using your power and your influence working together. It's a force right right. Tell us a little bit about your early life though because there's got to be something in you that made you decide to take this challenge when really you weren't in a position to actually do like tell tell us about like you prior to that like what what did you go in your life so just a little family history. My great grandfather George Rhodes. He was the musical director for Sammy Davis Junior for over thirty years and his best S. friend so real quick. We have a new intern here. What's your name again bro Ethnic? Oh Anthony so Austin's here now. This is your roommate. y'All everybody that listens to podcast of hurt the crack Anthony scores. Oh my God domino it anthony. You're white tell me one fact about Sammy Davis Junior. Yeah just tell me something about San. Jose was union okay but like Jimmy something about 'em though like give me one saw me saying one thing that he did what movie that was in right now you know so. Here's a fucking thing the next time before you come in this room. I need you to be able to give me something about Sammy. Davis junior allowed the top of the cream of the crop cool was white boys get to watch this podcast John Right here married to a black woman really weren't up day talk some. You just said we know our Grayson here. Yes ask your your grandfather worked with. Sami absolutely taps with Gregory hines. That's what are yours for free right yes so I say that to say that music was always in my DNA soaker before this I was in the music industry. I was a songwriter vocal. Producer traveled the world writing for unsigned and signed Zayn Artists Okay world. Yes you did that for the majority of your own the majority of my adult life for you decide yes. So how did you get from there to being homeless. So my my immediate my immediate family members passed away from cancer along and so some in the music industry you have your highs. You have your lows summer and so that was my support system. I didn't have that support system anymore right and so and so you find yourself in the situation where I found myself in a crisis situation where I had to go to a women's homeless shelter with my son. What was what was that experience was we're sleeping on a bunk bed cot with my son in the bed with me and my whole mentality is like my environment not who I am what keep your if if I didn't have my mind signed I would probably I wouldn't I would know what to do? I would probably be lost but state positive. I made sure that I used all the essential advice in Tokyo gives us that was passed down to me from my grandparents and my parents and I use their experiences of where they messed up at and I use that to catapult me and I said I need. I want to do something there's too many black. People in this situation is too many Latinos. Why is it just this group of people mainly just as group of people? What can I do instead of walking on the street and protesting? What can I do to to actually make a difference and one of my friends? Won't you run for office. You know what that's what I'm going to do. No matter what my situation situation is is a my mindset. That's going to push me forward. Let me tell you why that's powerful so everyone that's powerful situation to me. Talk about America in the fabric apropos what the country supposedly bill okay so the idea of America that we have the sort of pie in the sky idea that we have is that there's a person somewhere that's born into a situation finds himself into a situation or that observes the situation and goes. I'm going to change that doc right and then what they do is through. Excuse me guile talent and hard work they build a necessary Seri- allegiances that they need and they start working and they changed that situation they attain some power and then they can look back at the community that they come from and really engineer some sort of new system for those pizzas fright. That's what we're told. America is really. That's not what America is at all when America is now is and what it's really always been is that America is about sort of oligarchs and people with a lot of money working with corporations corporations in order to maintain the power control that they have and that's the way politics normally works. George Bush was a C. student that ended up becoming the president of the united they had asked us was on the mayflower so like that goes back so much further than what any of us can comprehend but every once in a while someone looks at the situation that they're in at the system that they come from and they go. I can change that that is the best of America at Work uh-huh. That's the best of America that's how things are supposed to go. That's all that's specifically like what someone like yourself. Represents you find yourself in the situation and you go. I know that if I did my thing I'm talented enough and I'm driven enough to get myself out of this. Of course I know I can what happens to everybody else and the way real change really gets made is when people take on that responsibility -solutely how has it been for you doing that as a mother mother kind of taking that responsibility on has it changed sort of the relationship or the the time that you get to spend with your son it of course it changed the time but it made my relationship with my son even more valuable because it helped me understand that I don't just exist for me or just my son son I exists for other people too and so by taking him on knock knocking on doors with him he goes. He goes with me taking him with me. These political arenas he's actually really watching and taking this in so it's really teaching him and myself at the same time is helping me become a better woman is helping me understand that giving back to my community giving back to the people it helps me grow it helps me see my flaw that helps me see how to Polish myself and and I'm able to see how influencing other people I'm like doc and I'm just doing this. I can do more and so all around it. It's it's I can say is exhilarating. Sometimes it hurts sometimes. It's I'm excited you know I it's so many different emotions but overall overall is growth growing pains and also just just being grateful. What's been the hardest part of being a politician going could he's into these different arenas I look young? I'm thirty three years old. I'm not ugly person humbly and and you know I'm bad as well. Let's not knock it off but coming into these coming coming into the political arena knowing that there's a huge generational gap and I'm a threat so sometimes people try to bully me but I stand my ground. I stand in my truth. Some people try to you know sway me not to run but I stand my ground. I stand my truth. I know what I'm in this for and I'm in this for my community and and it it sometimes people are threatened. Sometimes they kiss the ring. So who so you said you you use specifically mentioned your looks. uh-huh is that has been an issue has been something that you feel like why how how is that because most most of the Times politicians it's better off if a politician is looking very famous story history time a presidential debate back in the day Kennedy and Nixon John F. Kennedy very handsome guy swamped by the debate was televised people that watched debate on TV thought that Kennedy you want to sort of pours he was sweating. I remember yeah people that listen to it on the radio. They thought that that excuse me people that watch TV thought Canadian want people to listen to the radio. I thought the Knicks right because the substance of what Nixon was talking about. They felt like he was a little bit better so that was one of the first times that the American the president had to be the president on television. This steady affects people in the way they look at this. you like you said before you badass satisfy so those not like us light like you like you said before you're a pretty lady. Has that been a positive live or negative or has it affected in any way when you mentioned it. Have people play with you in any way. Has it been something that you've learned how to use of course it's been something I've learned how to use so it's a gift Emma curse off and I say that because there's a stereotype hey if you're a well looking person person you. You can't be that much intelligent. You know so with that. It's like I'm always being tested you know so that's it from women from men. You know it's easier to maneuver that way but then in every industry or whatever you know ah they come at you you know yeah so it's a gift and occurs and I'll tell you why because when people give me compliments commits his always van. You're so intelligent. Never you're a good looking guy. Never never do that never know sexiest. Hey when you take off your shirt on the instagram posts and comments they sat out to get it. I got a certain demote and Blessing Asi. You're humble a certain demo that I'm killing with grants. You look at so you're so so you're you say that it's a little bit difficult. Sometimes you say that the women don't take you seriously a little bit sometimes. Sometimes how do you get over that. I stand my ground. I stand my thority and then then they'll open up and okay and you know WanNa pass them tools down and different things like that so I guess that's just the way it's set up to be and when you talk about politics you know you win in the scenes that someone lost it absolutely so it's an open seat seat right now. The person who's had this seat is is the only black person on the on the board of five members. It's a male and he's been in this seat for twelve years Mark Ridley Thomas. He's been in CPR over twelve years so he's turned out so he can't see it turned out term Bob limit you what she's talking talk about. GUYS is term limited presidents to whatever whatever right term limit he's turned out now so it's an called an open seat. It's an open seat yes. Who are you up produce? I'm up against a councilman. named her Wesson okay okay. I know you know what I'm saying yeah. I'm up against a councilman. I'm up against the state senator. I'm up against a former councilwoman and two other unknown so we are. You're going to ask you a question right now. The question is what is your platform. How are you going to transform this area of two point? I five million people or whatever what are you going to do if and when you are elected my platform is bottom line reform Boga Gra a lot of our county programs a lot of our LAPD SHERIFF JUVENILE DETENTION CENTERS Criminal Justice homelessness. Everything needs to be reformed. I'm not trying to change the will but I'm trying to Polish it because we we have the foundation of what is it. That's a good politician line. See you've been you get your your learn quick but you know what I don't want to will. I'm not trying to change the wheel. I'm trying to Polish well. I say that because we have the foundation but if you've never experienced being homeless if you've you've never experienced these things how can you really solve the problem and there's nobody on that board has experienced these things that they're trying to combat but they can't solve it because they've never used a county program. They just go by what's being told to them with all due respect. They've probably did the best that they can however her in order to fix something. You have to have experienced it okay so let's just take one of those problems how would you reform the LAPD. Let's LAPD. Let's talk about the section where we are dealing with gangs a researched and there's there's there's no program that I've seen that besides inside the LAPD as far as gang reformer intervention and there's there's an issue right now where if you're affiliated with a gang or you're a gang member mind you you can grow up in a certain neighborhood and automatically be affiliated with the gang member and you take a candy bar from the store. That's an extra ten years to twenty five years to life because you're affiliated associated with this gang that's I I feel that's corruption filled discrimination. I feel that those certain policies needs to be changed and you feel light from your seat as county supervisor you could change that how how how does that so I would come up with a policy because we're able to implement policies inside the county so I would come up with a policy to counter act that so I can't change what's already in place but we can bring about policies to counteract that to null and void that out yeah in terms of what you saw as far as being used to having to use the the the resources of the county if you are a young I'm single mother finds herself in a homeless situation How would you like to see that sort of situation be better and more flu? Thank you for asking that question so right now. If you're a young single mother and you're in a homeless situation. The county only has a homeless program where they give you sixteen days in a hotel or a motel after that you need to go find a nonprofit or something to see if they have shelter. Birdwell shelters are full so the only other way to do it what I'm seeing. Is You have to declare yourself mentally. Ill Oh I have depression win or I have this or schizophrenia in order for them to immediately. Put you into an apartment and help you pay your rent until you're able to stand on your own. There's no program four people who are well competent who have a job maybe have messed up credit and can't get in nowhere so just little things like that. How can how would sixteen days? That's not enough days to get yourself back on your feet so those little things need to be smoothed out run yeah when when you talk about extending programs or widening and for people you know people are GonNa ask you ask you how you're GONNA pay for it. Do you have any plans on. How will you get the money from the A uh? We have the funding we do. We have the funding now. The question is where's the funding going or being diverted to is a whole nother issue. Um well you feel like the money's there but the money is definitely there. It's just not going directly to the people and let me tell you why what else I've experienced is if you house fifteen hundred people on your waiting list to get housing if you house all those people this organization won't have a job anymore so people are holding onto their jobs because if it looks like you're you're in your th but looks like organization is in need then you get more funding this many people in your waiting list to get house. You get more funding. We feel like those people who are in the system in order to keep themselves employed of course as they don't want to solve probably WanNa keep it going. Unfortunately that's one of the issue so I would say divert some of that funding to your smaller organizations that are effective. The smaller ones are being more effective and they're not getting funding from the county but if they did get funding they would they would. They're effective. They've been proven to be effective but the bigger ones absolutely there's definitely corruption going on what specific part of Los Angeles for. La Your Formula Adams in Western. I've also grew up in Inglewood. I've lived in Gardena in Carson sold. The whole second district that I'm running for of. I've pretty much lived in most of those majority of those cities. The Most Prevalent Problem Albums Homelessness when I go to watts there's there's three projects all in one. Most of those people in those projects are blacks. You know another thing that's going on is the police shootings you know and not being held accountable. You know those are the main things thinks or how do you feel like you can change them. Reform bringing bringing programs and funding those programs bringing real tangible resources into are black communities into our Latino communities you go. There's an answer to the gang situation in Los Angeles. Absolutely where would you say the answer I would say bringing influencers in who have been in a gang who have been affiliated with gangs are now successful success stories stories from that bringing them bringing your oh Jeez into the juvenile detention centers and talk into these cities boys who are now productive members of society you know finding a way to bring funding into the gangs as long as they're uplifting and not put him in the way to you gotTa go rob this person or you got to go do this give them give them a funnel of ah funding being to actually bring them jobs to do good work so still an organization right so let's reform how we perceive this organization and uplift these kids because you never know what background are home. They're coming from. You never know if they're being abused. You never know if their parent from the crack cocaine era are not you around so they need to. They need a father figure. Most of our father figures are locked up right so it you utilize that to catapult. How has your life changed in terms of like so you're a politician right so being a politician politician Lord they'll say that representative community politician will so now there comes a different sort of gays that comes with that right like I remember New York evil a manager shot Kinney we were eating at somebody was behind that violate the white one y'all as my manager hazard? Hey before you go to a manager saying because people they look at you different when you have a little bit I am so for you personally. Do you move in different ways. Do you re- do you go. Different places like now that people people know that you're out there like dirty game yeah it is so so like how have you have you switched up. I haven't switched up because you want you went out there you huma out there before you want like hitting the clubs and doing that stuff sometimes on my still go to the club because I got friends that are promoters. I want support them. You know some I'll go hang out with my people in the studios. I do not change who I am. That's what makes me different. I'm in the communities talking to people I'm. I'm still connected to my community the people in our communities where I'm from where I come from so I don't want to change anything. People need to know that I got back. I think trust me. That's that's imported from me because my my special interest is the people I don't know nothing to nobody else but the people and that's why I'm doing this research to another one how you funding campaign the dollar by dollar knocking on doors five dollars by five dollars Yep grass roots real grassroots. You haven't had any sort of business or corporate interests they they have come in and be like Yo. We WanNA will put your no not at all. Are you interested in that. nope not at all interested in having the money comes straight for the straight from the people. How has that been going? It's it's tough. Sometimes honestly it's tough sometimes caused some of my opponents you know they they're already at five hundred thousand with their oil companies companies or with their big corporations but that's not my focus. My focus is hey. You can contribute a dollar five dollars. Twenty one hundred up to fifteen eighteen hundred dollars do that but my focus is to make sure that hey is this as tangible you can run for office to you. Don't have to have a special special degree in all these college to to to do this. This is tangible way that we can perceive things so so. Let's let's look at the worst case scenario. The worst case scenario is like you don't how would you continue to impact and help your community. What would be we'll be your mission until the next time you how do you stay engaged in continuing to change things? Even though you might not have to see that you're a so continue to be in my community mobilized my community build organizations and coalitions use influencers to inspire our youth because if we we don't invest in our youth then our futures not looking too good. It's not looking good right now so continued uses platform to as long term in catapulted to continue to inspire continue to bring awareness continue to acknowledge those who are behind the scenes that don't get acknowledged reached content go out and I mean I'm I am also building relationships with your your county sheriff's your chief of police you know your. Da's I still have these relationships so still using those relationships to benefit the community and spread awareness and bring awareness awareness and change say hey. This is how many boat I may not have won but this is how many voters came out to vote for me. This is still leveraging power still leveraging that power power are there any local politicians here or local organization or organizers here that you see specifically the that are doing good work org that you would like to be closer to work more with yeah. others Guy Compton Hubs Hub city dray okay There's so many van put me on the spire moms. We like really to be honest with you. The one of the reasons why I I I had joined is number one where about to do you're on the repeal podcast that focus more specifically on what's going on home at the local level people understand that is very important. Yeah WanNa have a black share on okay pretty pretty soon. You know you know what I should be fun. drill drill. We'll have conversations with people that resonate it all over the country about what can make us get up and build coalitions like I said before because I've won a my titus holidays at one of the smartest man in this entire country killer Mike always talks about love him always talks about state and the Logan Gore yes yes we don't have these conversations about state and local government funding national level. Yes yes so I asked you about people around town for people that I would like to connect with that. They have what it is do you feel like there is change happening and do you feel like are you. In any way is part of that. What I mean is are the young people that you see now moving differently? Have you been able to have more fruitful conversations with them. Are they more engaged than what you've seen before growing up in. La Absolutely I feel like over the years. The people have become more conscious. Especially Leeson's trump has been in office. We've been forced to to try to work together and figure this out. You know like like when the whole issue with Gucci how we came together other he list not by from Gucci you know we're learning how to do things in a different way and more effective. I definitely see change. I really liked the the revolt summit that they recently happened and that conversation and so I feel like it resonated a lot of people are more aware and more conscious nowadays for ashore. Do you or your rent as a Democrat. I was yes What do you feel about? The idea of political parties have to be with you. I'm no longer Democrat I'll have political party. I'm with you on I am liberal but I don't believe in the structure of little parts anymore how big it worth for route anyone especially black people. What do you think about that? I'm totally with you on that. Ban go in the Democratic Party Arena a lot of people people have turned their backs on me because they're interested in other people their their funding is through those politicians and so I'm like hey do these people really wanna to change things or are they just trying to keep their stuff going or they're all you know and so it has made me get a different perspective. Also I like the things killer. Mark was saying how you know right now. We're arguing over. Who has the best master you know and so I really I really don't believe in any party lines I believe at the end of the they were? US citizens and will get more things done by working together work yeah. Who are you supporting the Kennedy Right now on the dental side? I'm still on the fence right now. I'm narrowing down to Bernie you know they keep putting Joe Biden in the pinnacle of things Joe Biden. You know it's really hard hard Dr everybody else. That's working real hard. He's got some good people but now yeah beauty beauty. Jake's forget yeah yeah. He's he's pretty cool candidate. He's he's awesome is an amazing dairy authentic authentic as a fantastic Kelly. I mean just that I don't know off how he would be as a president raise. you know years have very much experience at that liberty as far as a candidate do can be open about anything absolutely comma hairs. There's a lot of different people. We have yeah warn. She's bad at great problem. This is the problem with me probably did the problem. Is I have hangover. My hangover is from President Obama. Reality is this as a candidate forget about the presidency because that was different than then we can have arguments all day long about whether or not the Obama Presidency delivered on what we thought it was going right. That's a Kennedy you had a charismatic affable black costitutionally a law professor asser swag the editor of the Harvard law had excellent performance personified. You had grace with his wife on an unbelievable journey me of someone who built themselves then you had a god if you ask them a question which is able to deliver liver and then you had this weird sort would've almost spiritual authenticity right. You have someone who like like you see when you see Obama by playing with a kid the reason he's waddles Obama kid videos. He's really having a good on like everybody else. The kissed the baby and then right away turn. It is the robotic mouth. The smell goes away yeah gray but Obama looks like he's legitimately loving people bowl. He now became president then he drove a bunch of people however like the reality is that on the campaign pain trail. I don't feel tethered to any of these people I think a lot of these programs and things that they wanna put forth uh-huh are would be great if they could execute them but if you look at the landscape of government they can't they know that they can't so what I want more out of a president anyone over politician anyone is I want someone I know who cares about people because if you care care about people you won't be so quick to shut anyone down absolutely aiming if you're some if you some gun nut right you you live in Tallahassee Florida or you live unless to Kentucky are you live Tupelo. Mississippi live in Jacksonville wherever you live if I actually care about the fact that you care about that. I'm GonNa treat you like some kind of any now I will tell you that I think that your passions or misdirected as a country might need to calm compromise to get to a better place by my act like use of human right now goes for anything yeah I think now we have our politicians that are really just like social media floors that are angling so hard for applause feeling heartbeat in Seoul. Is something missing. You can tell it's antiseptic at is something messing is there's something not right like and that scares me. That trump is going to get another turn to be honest with you. I'm just being transparent. I hope they offer looks. That's what I'm saying. All the candidates is like some you know. It's like it's not authentic. If something is that it does missing right and in order to believe that someone that has a plan you have to really believe the an order to someone to someone can execute a plan. You have to think they actually believe in it right. We're all in this room right. We're trying to escape escape from his room in the back of all fire and you go and one guy goes. You know I think when we should do this in another goes no uses the line terminated. He says cope with me. If you WANNA live that they say never return this is not saying it was t- to come with me none of them bullshit motherfucking cow recess that let's see what I'm saying. That's my fucking problem with that started in the original terminator cow our reese Connor. He's Cohen me. If you WANNA live then they can't keep recycling it because then the fucking T. eight hundred he then Kim says come with me WanNa live and then they keep coming back to the point is this if everybody's in the room at one guy says I think we should go this way and another guy. This is come with me if you WANNA live. Who are you going to follow it? I'll come in with because I wanNA live. I WANNA live. I'm telling you I believe this is the way out and and everybody else on his fucking. They're all these weird. platitude Cory Booker was talking about cool eight. Don't do that no more on don't do that is something missing was wrong. You brought your eyes anyway. like you have you have you. It's like it's like Cory Booker looks like he's he's getting electrocuted every time man. I'm just saying like I'm not real like ten like it is but you know what I'm saying. Is that like I out of a politician which is essentially a leader you want someone that you think is really invested and has has a belief and so that's what I'm not feeling right same here and that's what I'm looking for people in and around. La that regardless whether or not not just in my my home city Baton Rouge Louisiana Two shots at Ted James I know the Ted got it on lock over there young politician coming up stay with that I can believe in even if you even if we need to work together on some of these plants and we we need to figure out the people we need to. I'm looking for people that I know care about people. That's the number one thing. Absolutely you got got a note at somebody cares about people yeah. You know what I'm saying yeah and talking to you first of all you are very persistent about coming on the podcast S. which means is absolutely talking to you. You've been in a situation to where I know that you're GonNa bust your ass or trying to make something happen right. So what are the next steps they like. When is the election? How much time how much money do you need to be raised? how can people that are listed. How can they help us out? Next Steps Swell. The election is March twenty twenty well we have. We have eleven so I'll be on the presidential ballot was on locally we have eleven days to vote this time around so I think that's around February twenty four to March third. I may be a little off on my numbers but I need at least about to raise. Sixty thousand was in until then the most that individuals can rai- can donate is up to fifteen hundred you can do that from my website. CHERISE ROADS DOT net S. H. A. R. I S. R. H. O. D. S. DOT net and yeah I was maybe about five thousand right. Now we have some work to do go do was that I want to really come yeah we do. What's called the turn-up ticket okay because you say you know allow party promoters right yeah? We should do functions Allo benefit this what you need so I'm talking to pay sky. This is what this is why I do we should have functions in. La to where we party for I'm with it I'm saying 'cause I'm GonNa be honest with you adid fucking milk Deborah and all my guys from Medan attainment Shane all my dues from Supreme Team coming out drink which I'll anyway I drink all the liquor marquette diamond juice olives any but we should party for a purpose because we can take some of the celebration by people we love. We love to have a good time. We love what we do. Is We ended up giving our money to Hennessy. We ended up giving our money who fucking universal music to give money to buck and whoever right after we had we've had the experience we'll have nothing left. It'd be good if we could some way. Take our needs to celebrate and and and and be with one another and turn it into something lasting that we we can put our hands in yeah and I'm talking about economic lab longevity. I'm talking about you know social. I'm also talking about political on so we have to find a way to merge all of these. Do you know these guys. He's promoters. don't just go to their parties man for bring them in yeah because they they they making that money man yeah. I'll tell you how they're making money. I Play Basketball League on Monday nights. Santa Monica Basketball Leagues Go ahead thirty seven Austin talking only pretty good. What's your ass? ooh They know they weren't cloud cloud once they weren't they weren't fifty but they were white and they were five to seven. Is You don't matter if you're on the court your food and the big boy goal ooh fuck over anyway. I got to see you inactive and I'll I'll be a cheerleader. He's doing this on the Internet. Here's the problem with the clips when you're in the game when you're in the game and you and your cooking thinking Joe Lieberman seriously is like turn back the clock nineteen ninety seven at Saint Imam Shit I'm they can y'all. I'm crazy. Then you watch the video of yourself. Oh no and you're like why in the fuck that they let our roker on the basketball yeah. Do you like what you you're moving so slowly. It looks like your knees hurt for yourself. There's no fucking. This is how you start thinking like. Is this because I'm thirty nine or have. I always look like Oh my God. I think ah you think like have I always look this playing basketball. I was I was I plan in high school and then having my mom ago my poor Guy but what I'm saying is with these guys are not got money because I'm rolling up in a Honda Accord Cross tour promoter homeys they they whipping happen so what I'm saying is maybe we should put less money into Range Rover and more of that money industries what we're going to do no matter what it is. This is figure out a way to get you the money that you need okay because win or lose first or second first of all all we want is win. That's right but win or lose first and second one thing that we have to prove as young black people is that we are here to support each other absolutely and we're here to roll with one another man. I do this podcast. I hope to grow as a host. I hope to grow as a voice I hope to grow as an entertainer and educator you hope to grow as a political voice as a community community organizer. We want to look back five six seven years from now. I'd be like yeah remember when we did not look at it in order to do this. We gotTA BUILD PARTNERSHIPS AND I. I am telling you right now. I'm going to do everything I can to make sure that you same here. y'All kloppers roles right now. Man Thank you so so much until they can what they can donate what would they do. Cherise Rose Dot Net S. H. A. R. S. R. H. O. D. E. S. DOT net dot. I never did you ever play any sports. I used to run track the four hundred four by two the four by four eight hundred four hundred with your most trashing wanted to suck the most. Oh my goodness I didn't suck I still got records in high school or work. Yeah I was like that Oh yeah I was I was I was I had long distance had longevity endurance and I was fast yeah it was the thought was fast now muscle fucking race one day then testosterone. That's a little bit. I got a little less weight eight then you equal. You'll think that I'm to the point my life you scoring thirty seven and again matter Oh the school with thirty seven but you know how real it was a real thirty seven cooking but those guys will complimenting me set up so it was a great move. I'm what I'm trying to meet a whole talking shit. The Duke comes over runs up. He goes I can do about that. He goes on

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MadTrio Podcast - Episode 066

MadTrio Podcast

1:10:31 hr | 5 months ago

MadTrio Podcast - Episode 066

"Welcome to the Matt Trio podcast. This week we have the California Pariah Jonathan Charney and Ryan breast this week. We don't have James and figured Ryan deserve some sort of funny middle name because of any. I'm an adequate standard mediocre bet. That's that's funny. Choice of words standing. So here's a piece of news so I'm going to fry and we're GONNA try not to be another dour show and talk about the corona virus or Cove Ad Nineteen By the way hopefully you all have your line. That'll protect you so from Newsweek. Dot Com medical fetish site donates entire stock of scrubs after being contacted by desperate health officials a medical fetish community and the UK has donated its entire disposable. Scrubs the hospital after being contacted by Desperate House officials med fat. Uk said it has been contacted by the chess represented from across the county who are trying to produce procure basic protective equipment. The company didn't identify the hospital. Where the fewer set. You imagine that you're a hospital and the only thing that you could actually get is from people who are into Dr Talking for fetishes. Yeah which which you know would it's It's right up there with I. Think porn hub If I'm not mistaken just gave some ridiculous amount of money. I WANNA say like some millions of dollars that they that they gave is part of like a relief fund and they're donating like shit kind of like the personal protective equipment to you know hospital the nurses and things like that It's it's really interesting you know. It's it's one of those like Hey. Look we're not asking you to do to join. We're asking recognize that. We're we're a business like anybody else so out for respecting David. But that's let's be honest porn hub. Donating is is hilarious. I mean for a couple of facts. The fact that they're saying hey savior. We're saving lives and getting people off at the same time. Yeah what other company didn't say they've done Halford and I I do think it's kind of I'll be completely honest. I do think it's kind of odd. That people have a doctor fetish now. I'm kind of wondering do people have mortician fetishes. Oh sure yeah. I don't know if you're aware rule. I think it's twenty six of the Internet isn't it forty-seven if it exists part of it. Yeah and I think rule twenty seven Or the warned immediately following whatever rule that it is if it doesn't exist it will. Yeah that's just so gross to me. I don't know how else to say it. It's just gross. Well I've got a co-worker worker who I tried to explain this rule to be in his early fifties and a little unfamiliar with Rick. How depraved Internet is you know? Use It for very specific things over the years and and is unaware of what it's true capabilities so in very much trying to explain to him and just different people who are mostly be the role number twenty six Maybe once a week he'll come in and they'll just say random words like like ice cream and I'll be like I don't know Or sometimes I like all automatically no record so time out so well. They see ice cream porn. Are we talk about someone who makes a really delicious looking pile of ice cream bowl? Are we talking about like you know an ice cream with boob showing off too? I mean I. I've kind of the idea of ice cream. Porn is really weird because now getting mental image of. I'm getting a mental image of getting through graphic. Voth I I'm getting a mental image of a ice cream bar. What was it what would you do for a Klondike Bar? That's kind of my mental images now and and I'm kind of disturbed by that thank you. Yeah Yeah I get to to graphic detail both What one might fall under the category? You know the ally like this because it's just sorta satisfied to look at all. The ports both fall into that category too. Did the weirdest thing is everybody. Uses porn to describe something that doesn't involve nudity like abandoned porn or gun porn. Or it's like wait. Hold on hold on you. Porn should be used to describe somebody AN STATE OF UNDRESS. Not Not an ice cream sandwich. Yeah I I agree. I get where people are going with it. But it doesn't apply like like like you said gun port. I'm just thinking people trying to pain gotten by the way. That's a good double entendre. Yeah I was I was. I was trying to sequoia Uh FOR FOR. Read it for example gun. Porn is is not somebody to have. Who's having coitus with a firearm? Basically it's a fancy firearm and people make a neat looking photo we're or or h basically. It's a photo of really high resolution photo of a firearm which is usually right yet. But yeah I mean it's I in if you want porn and guns. It's always a naked person. Usually a lady holding a firearm. I've never seen anybody using a firearm. A tool and to be completely honest. I hope I never do that. I have Absolutely and actually the funny thing is is is where I saw. This wasn't or anybody technically considered high art. So the question the whole right but my my question was male or female because my first thought was depending on the gender and the location of where said firearm was placed. Hope they cleaned it. Because that's GonNa Cause Rust but that's just that's the geeky young. There's there's some issues there if something's not done Yeah what one would imagine there with them. Cleaning involve afterwards female model mail artists. This is what I get for having a decent idea of human and anatomy is overly graphic imagination. Which doesn't do anybody screw it made for a lot of entertaining evening for me a unborn though. I actually I wanted to. I could a Texan James. This out it'll be about a week ago or so I don't know be even jive but My girlfriend pointed out to me that the art institute of Chicago had recently posted like big basically their entire collection like four K. pictures of their entire collection Which includes amazing art like they have been banned. Goes self portrait? The original self-portrait bear gorgeous fourcade photographs of all of these. They have one of the craziest arms and armor sections collections. I've ever seen was personal clown if you it the art institute of Chicago so it's an incredibly large museum so you can go onto their website and they have all of these pictures. They're great high quality photos a lot of old school armor from twelve hundred. No good old school nights in shining armor days piece. No armored you know from all over the world The weapons in the saying some of these things blew my mind. Dude check this out one of them and the first one that she showed me. I think what got her I It is a cane slash sword slash hammer flash like amherst slash history. Wow Yeah yeah. It's out of all the weird weapons. I saw that thing that seemed to be the most practical. Because you know I can imagine the scenario. You're just walking along your cane and you know from Ruffians. Come out of the of the alleys and you can shoot that one. And in that puff of smoke pull your sword and go to town. You know it would cause enough of a distraction even though you only got one shot freaked everybody blinking. You know you're already holding yourself interesting now. I saw one that. Were you know an act is still An axe dagger sword pistol. I mean crazy weird thing soon. I started getting into the multiple barrel. Lebanon's elected pepper box type of thing. Not even I would not even close to that. Elegant design were a try barrel pistol. I. It's so hard to explain this but imagine just ball at the end instead of a grip coming back. It's just a ball and it's three pistols. One you're looking down. The barrel love sank. I imagined looking down the barrel of Old Flint. Lock and imagine that. There's two barrels perpendicular ninety degrees on either side of that barrel. So when you're finished firing the first one you turn it ninety degrees and there's the second barrel and then you turn it another actually. It's probably more like like one hundred degrees hundred ED degrees. I bet more than a triangle shape. I bet more than likely shooting. It shot all barrels of the same time. No it didn't. There's three different triggers with any kind of comfortable grit like you look at the senior. Like how the Hell do you get your hands around this opole those traits so it's into saw so it's each barrel has its own trigger not three Wheelock pistols and weld them together at the base? In a triangle. That's essentially how the thing was designed. The seems like a very uncomfortable. It's incredibly impractical. The one that I did saw they would maze me was a try barrel Flew Lock Musket. The only the barrel and the clock portion the prison and and the The the actual mechanism for it but the actual flint lock mechanism That in the barrel is the only thing that rotates hammer actually is is connected to the Trigger Assembly and the and then you fire and then you turn the barrel and then lock it again and then fire and repeat interesting. So what would you get that thing? Wait if you had if you had to get a three barrel lock musket call it four and a half feet high six and a half pounds. Wow Are you fucking kidding me? Why was I was? I guess that though on the note shit it's ridiculous. I thought six and a half pounds and I thought it was a Hypo. I'm like how the Hell do you get that in six and a half well so's actually dead on everyone. Grand is eleven pounds. Yeah no you were dead on damn because I I was just like pulling that out of my hat off. That explains like Whoa but yeah if anybody get an opportunity or on the Internet later go go to the art institute of Chicago's website. Look at all of their stuff but go to the arms armory collections. The pages and pages of stuff. Like why the hell did they make this That's awesome So I don't know if you've been so we're going to talk a little bit about Cova but instead of talking about how depressing it is. I'm just going to call it the beer virus just because it makes me laugh and hopefully if somebody's listening if I hope you're out there It makes you laugh. So the coolest thing about the beer virus is something is we need ventilators. This has what this is all these different companies who don't make ventilators have been making them. Tesla's making him forward is making them and they're using parts from their cars I don't know if any of you drive a newer vehicle. Some higher end cars have the ability to have a heated and cooled seats. Yeah so they're using that there's another one. Mit Mit this office. Side Tech Daily Dot Com. Mit will post free plans online for an emergency ventilator that can be built for a hundred dollars and that's why tech daily Dot Com. Take a look It's from is there a date? March twenty eighth so basically they're talking about how you can manufacture one super easily and fairly cheaply to to save lives. I this is. This is the one of the reasons I think. Western civilization in particular is pretty bad. Ass is the fact that we have not only. Do we have people who are ingenious? But the fact that the human mind can come up with weird ways to make shit work. It's it's like Scotty from fucking Star Trek. Yeah well you know. It's one of my favorite things about like like NASA watching the Apollo. Thirteen the other day You know the time Tom Hanks for I love that movie and Me Too and it's the same kind of thing that you see like the Martian the the Madina mood it's you you have this this thing in space and they have the exact same thing on the ground as replica and in this these guys in a room trying to solve a problem for people that are a couple hundred thousand miles away and you have the same materials in front of you in the same tools that they wouldn't space and it's just like how do we solve this problem using what we have here in front of. You know that sort of ingenuity where it's like. Hey look give me some scientists and engineers and we're GONNA fucking figure this out one way or another. Some of the most amazing shift in the world has been come up with like that. I do my favorite part of that whole movies. What happens when you have multiple companies making parts for the same basic thing when you have a square filter in one in and around filtered the other I remember. I watched that recently and I was thinking. That's that's kind of America and a key nobody's thinking. Hey what happe here that I think. That's funny I love that movie. Oh I recently listened to the Audio Book of the Martian. If anybody out there wants to listen to a really good book It's really well done. surprised novelization of the movie or was it based on a novel it was based on. The book is based on the book. I'm pretty sure I could be wrong but I'm almost positive it was. It was actually based on a book. Okay there's one woman could have been meaning to read it's It's called packing for Mars. I can't remember what her name is. But it's supposed to be fantastic. It's just as lady who basically laid out you know like this. If you WANNA go to mark this is what it would take. You know Like legitimately logistically speaking. Oh seems very interesting to me so the Martian is a two thousand one science fiction novel written by Andy Weir W. E. I R. O. Nice okay all right so damn good. Yeah I really loved it I wanNa Watch I. I saw it in the theaters. I think we did it for our F- Our I haven't seen it since I've been jonesing forever To to watch it again today you what I bought it like a couple of years back. That movie is in such fucking the heavy rotation for my girlfriend roll their eyes every time to watch it and it's easy watch and really I. You know it's a truly fantastic movie. Ever since we stopped doing our afar. I've been kind of burned out on movies. I recently watched Who Shot Liberty? Vance in my Internet's. Been so fucking slow. I hadn't been able to watch the rest of it like I'm towards the end of the movie. I caught the rest on Youtube. But I haven't actually been able to finish the whole thing Is I've been Jonesing for good movies. This is one reasons. I WANNA watch again. But I've been watching more anime which is weird but it's probably because I get to watch it thirty seconds short embiid's instead of because pausing movies you know you're right. I don't know. Do you do that because I hate. I've know multiple people to do this. They'll watch forty-five minutes there. Posit and then come back a day later and watch it like I like watching movies. Yeah no I can't do that. I do that all the time I mean I try to. I like having my my times like all. Go Out of my way to wake up early on like a Saturday morning. There's a movie I wanted to watch. You know that I haven't seen and all and I'll sit down with my coffee or something before my girlfriend gets up and then just chill out and watch whatever movie. It is usually. She didn't WanNa Watch. I'm assuming that almost generally every night I'll go in and also on a movie usually most likely one that I've seen before And I'll watch half an hour of it and then plan on watching like another half an hour over the next night and you know just something to kind of make my my Dr. Getting have you can't do. Is everybody else like they fall asleep watching TV. I can't do it. I have to turn it off and then physically. Yeah I can't I. I know people who do it like you know. They'll watch your phone and fall asleep from me. I have to put it down or also. Just keep watching it and I hate. I kinda hate having the TV. On when I'm sleeping because they don't like that extra light however I have a my wife bought me one of those Amazon Alexa Slash government. Spying devices I have next my bedside table and it does Sleeping sounds so every night. I go to bed the sound of thunder which I like. I like listening to music. I used to listen to a something blue something like that. It was one of the Miles Davis albums. They used to listen to all the time. Oh some kind of blue yeah Kinda blue I think that's it. Let's see yeah I I like that I used to listen to ambient sounds but I just can't watch TV and go to bed. It's just for. I used to be able to do it as a kid but now I'm just not it's not comfortable let me tell you how bucking a it is that you said that you go to sleep. Seem like sweet sounds so like three weeks ago. Maybe about to go down It was raining a while around here in California. Had a good week or rain and I you know. I'm going to work in the morning and I'm telling Michael we're going. Oh Man I sleep. Great during the round fucking great. I love it when it rains. I go to release. It was fourth night in a road. I said that where I'm like. Wait a minute if I go to sleep that he would rain. They make like those little rain machine sounds and whatnot so I go on the APP and whatnot and of course I find one. And there's a park and download one I to sleep to the sounds of crashing rain in fucking thunder every night speaker thing it'll do was. I felt embarrassed. How pickerel set the alarm or the timer for like thirty minutes. If it would be off of the time she came in the door calling the puck in the House of the whale I mean the the the benefit of having one of the Alexa things is my wife can say. Hey Insert name here turn off in. It'll turn off because like five. Forget to set a timer. There was this APP and I wish you remember what it was because it was the greatest APP it had a metric ton of audio files. It came with a sets a bunch on on the APP. But you could download a bunch and people could record a bunch. There was a a sound of an old boat rocking back and forth and getting here at Creek. It was my favorite one. That sounds off from do I I. I love stuff like that. I used to go to bed too. And this is kind of my geek flag flying and partially pathetic. I used to have the sounds of the original Enterprise of the bridge noises. It used to fall asleep to that because it was just a bunch of random machine noises. Shirt yeah right. Apparently the hassle but one that I didn't like They have those warning was not wave crashing but it was almost like waves lapping on the beach. Which the gurgling sound bug the shit out for Matt went off just like a good old wave crashing against like Like the rocks or something a love that sound so my one of my favorite ones. I the APP on my phone. I made one where I combine a tent and fire and it just makes me laugh because if you actually think about it it's affect your intent and there's a fire in the tent. It wouldn't really be holding water. It wouldn't be keeping the water out but it's such such a relaxing. I wonder if anybody here's actually interested. In the fact we're talking about going to bed to sleeping sounds well. It's one of those things. I was surprised that I got into. I just saw like okay. I WANNA I WANNA keep hearing the rain so let me get this thing going and then like after a week. I'm like cooking longest thing. I saw surprised by. Yeah I always I always liked. That always always been into that. So this is a pitcher pitch that I found. And it's pretty funny so I'll have to its Alpha Amazon. Do you know what a Lewis bag is? Ryan Lewis bag now. So Lewis bag is used in bartending. What it is. It's basically a big bag. You put ice in there and usually there comes with a muddle or or mallet. You just beat the shit out of the ice and it makes crushed ice. I don't you I've seen like home. People use it. I don't know how many bars use it. I'm assuming it's for more fancy upscale bars and the next image is a stainless steel metal ice cube trade the old school ones. And right below it or you can pull out the fuck and things. Yeah it's one of the old old school metal ice cube trays with the easy. Release one of those in like a TV. Show one day where they pulled up the lever and they yanked out the thing and all the cube separated. I got fucking physically angry. Like how the hell did that? Technology fall by the wayside. So fuck man. I didn't know they existed until like couple couple years after I was married. And like what the fuck? I've been struggling all this time breaking a couple of them. And so this is what lays the weird moved at work like half the time and then like my wife bought me a neoprene one like it makes ball so for like I'm drinking. Yeah I use them in my my alcohol mixed drinks and right below it. This is my buddy one of those. This is what makes me laugh right in the below. It is gross on five. Gallon eight bag herbal ice bubble hash bag on what the fuck? That's what made me laugh. It's A. It's two things that make ice in one thing to make hash like Amazon. There's a whole sub bread it to it by the way Amazon. Has this really weird the of the associating things so apparently wanted Eyeso- I WANNA make a. I want to drink and old fashioned make hash the same time. Yeah apparently I thought it was hilarious. It just made me laugh man. Ask You a question. Do what type do you have to work in the standard operation of your of your career So there's what's called universal precautions which is basically you know gloves. And that's about it. You know cover up anything that you are reasonably going to get soil So you know the standard kind of stuff would be Like plastic gown. That goes over the front. Just figure like like a like an April Abram but a really thin plastic and very very disposable All all keep shoe covers. Because you never know when you're going to need to walk through some shit you don't. WanNa walk through and if I'm wearing loafers I'm not trying to get wreck But aside from gloves and whatnot. There's not much my job. I can't do in a full-blown three piece suit. You know mostly just based on the technique though what I'm doing is a lot different than what like nurses nobody. There's not a position that that person's going to be that I'm around that I didn't put them you know so I don't have to worry about somebody. Readjusting and getting closer hit me up in the pace with their harm topping on me. You know doing all of those things I would say Ryan. I really glad to hear that. Because you know if you were having to put a tapping somebody SEAN. So it was. It was going to say. Hey you need a different career. That's creepy yeah. Yeah Yeah there's a lot of thing that people like think that I that I do or is involved in my job where I'd be like no I would. I wouldn't fuck and do this. I was doing that like people. Ask me all the time. If I'm if I'm superstitious or or if I get scared I'm like what would I do this job? I was scared of it. So what's GonNa Happen is GonNa be terrified all day long? So what's the what's the strangest question you've been asked? That made you question the person who asked you if I ever fought the dead body. I bet that's you that question you're like. Do the puck away from me Bro. So so the question was was the person asking was like. Hey have you ever or Hey. Have you ever like like a? Have you ever like Melissa? Fuck you fuck away. From me was he was a friend of yours. No just some guy that I met to make. Arrangements for his bed loved one. Cause I'll be honest that that's a question James and I would totally ask you if we were hanging out together. Just a bust your balls but the fact that somebody asked you in the middle of setting stuff up is probably you just popped me on that. That's yeah record. Jane One of the First Questions. He did ask me. 'cause that's James when I got this job whatever all fucking thirteen fourteen years ago Asked me you done a coal pat and I had no idea the puck you talk about. He was a reference to sons of anarchy. Here's by the way there's something you don't want on your Google search history. Yeah Yeah Yeah. Yeah a lot more mad. I want my google but Yeah Lisa which is what the cold bag because it was usual but it's it's it's grabbing a a a a debt burden is what a call has anybody wondered. I actually didn't all add that to a cold patting all that right next to knowing that a dirty Sanchez's that was another one. I didn't need to know so. Thanks for that Ryan. Oh Rusty trombone that I didn't need or couching those by the way if you're listening to this with your child a actually questioned your parenting and long before now. If your abilities are delicate it reminds me of when when my wife and I went to see dead pool and I. I was really excited. I think my wife was excited and all of a sudden I hear this high pitch. Hey Dad what's this movie about type of thing? I don't remember exactly what he said and I'm like I talked to my wife's like I turn around. It's a fucking kid. He can't be under eight. And then there's I know we talked about this before. And there's a scene. I don't remember it could be two minutes could be five minutes for basically it's Ryan Reynolds and I can't remember the late chicks and they're basically having sex for like Barabbas car gaffer an entire season. I'm thinking that alone was gonna make the little kid asking. Why Ryan Reynolds was on top of the lady so I wanted to I so why. The lady was behind Ryan Reynolds Cheese. There's a whole lot more questions. Yeah yeah yeah the Cana work. Hey Hey dad is she like ace Ventura. The bad guy Now let me ask you this like like you. Me and James Have always been pretty similar in. It'd be Mount Movies and watch and then media that we'd consumed for our lives You had to have started watching you know the the classic of you know kids. Watch the rated R movies when he was done. What as to that? Start What what is what did your parents not give a shit anymore. See Violence was never really a big thing for my parents. The only thing they were questionable was the nudity are particular. I remember this vampire movie and this chick was getting on and I remember my parents hiding my eyes but I think the move right they just reached over and cover your eyes when there's when there's a part like and they were like mom probably was pretty quick on the draw it right it on sometimes really depend on depend on the movie Sometimes they would see it and they go. We need to watch it. I I remember seeing like the movie. Red Scorpion. I probably somebody ever kick you out halfway through like they just like. Oh No never mind. I think my parents at that point would have to stop the movie. They would have never kicked out. I was probably watching. Pg Thirteen rated are probably somewhere in eighty six. I was probably a little kid. Depending I'd say late eighty s to mid eighties is when I was probably watching rated R movies right. I mean what age not US hold on like. This is gonNA sound ridiculous but I gotta get calculator. Really bad it. I'm fried. It's been a long day hold on. Yeah 'cause I figure I was about. Maybe maybe ten eleven years old. When my parents there was a little bit of veiled like okay? We know he's watching. But we're not gonNA say anything but then all of a sudden we're watching movies together. I was probably ten eleven and cover my eyes nudity. Sometimes they would. Have you know thought a movie with something and then have we do like okay? Nevermind matter of fact the one. I absolutely remember them with that was From Dusk 'til Dawn Is I'm sure you remember. There's one half that movie just one thing. I haven't seen that movie in a long time. I was probably SI- anywhere between six and eight. I'd probably say seven thousand nine hundred eight probably seven. Plus or minus. I was fairly young when I was watching movies. Like that I I I remember certain points in certain movies where they kicked me out you know and I had to go like speaking walk layer of mud. I don't I don't remember my parents ever kicking me out. My parents would usually if I remember correctly knowing them they probably just turn it off and say and I'd like come on. It's like you know we're done. You know you need to watch this or they would never kick me out that wasn't really their modus operandi My Dad's credit movie. My Dad's always been really big in the movies One of the things. I'm looking forward to taking my son when I feel. He can sit still long enough in a theatre is taking him see movies. I don't know just because the way movies are two day. I don't know if he'll be seeing radar movies the same age. I did Just because I think the violence is a little bit more in your face depending on the movie versus even Eighties Action Movies depending on which one weren't really as bad as someone out. Say just graphic wise. Yeah like for example. What diehard is Ajar Wick? Oh yeah you know like there? There's some incredible differences. They're relatively kind of the same style of move. Unity mean this guy. And he's killing people and there's blind there's things and there's there's curse word then you know adult content as they say yes needs a far different movie John Wick. That's in your face but you know there's a certain age where a certain rated R. movie would be would be fine. You know so I was thinking I can imagine the type of parrot that I'd be fine with them bringing their kids devil You know but it is a type of parent that has a type of kid you know not every kid is going to be receptive to that. Not Every parent is going to be equipped to handle that sort of conversation with their kids. I think I'll be honest. I think I would say personally. See that movie. You definitely have to be over ten years old because there's just too much content that I don't even think I don't know now I think about it. I think you if you if you skip the sex scene and a few other things. It's really not that violent of a movie. It's more of like the scenes with his hands. It's the sex scene besides that it's actually a fairly clean movie. Now that I think about it the languages which would have done about again very deadpool. The for example I was thinking. Oh Yeah Yeah No. Yeah 'cause he's a very light artists family kind of movie but Tom. Green me out of the way to not be that that Tom. Green movie has more iffy scenes in it. I think Deadpool does Tom Green movie is something you never tell your mom. I saw like I remember seeing. I saw Indiana Jones and the last crusade in the theater so I definitely saw that. Were if not if that however that movie's pretty good. I'm not on thinking about it like so you think about moving. This is what I'm thinking. I'm thinking Louis Movies today. Like you're saying with John Wick show more blood and guts versus. Even though they were shooting guns and people died. It was almost a throwback to the the white hat and black hat cowboy movies. It was a lot of the time it was suggested more than than done like die hard. He Fell Nowadays. He probably would have had his head blown off and then his corpse would fall. You know if they're making it if anything. I just want my kid to hide the gun handling skills. You know what I mean. And nothing that he's gonNA walk out dual wielding forty five and fucking you know. Blow everybody off their feet. You got to be realistic about these things. Yeah I know a great way to solve that. Take the kid paint balling depending on what age he is. That'll that'll that'll solve it or I would love my son to get into. Oh God what are they? Air Soft Air Soft looks fun. It doesn't hurt as much as a paintball is from what little I've played and yeah no they don't. They don't hurt that they can but you know. Hey whatever. It's an older version earth. I think I would. I think it'd be. I think there's a great video. Fuck man remind me later did off. I'll I'll find there's a there's a This Japanese kid who does air soft right like competitive they have like all these these courses same thing anybody can think of what paintball you can do the hyper realistic version of air saw. Anybody who doesn't know it's it's Basically replica of real firearms did hold a lot more. Db's than than would you know nine mill but Still Load in a magazine and you charge the magazine itself. Usually with like a propeller he's in you can have these extra magazines that you just dump and then you load a new one very similar. We're real firearm. And the mechanics are the same still has the slide Still has the same safety action trigger pulls obviously a bit light but whatever you fucking thirteen year old doing a show There's this kid anyway. Who has never fired a real gun in his wife and has done competitive offer a while they brought this kid out to Texas. You know one of these shootings channels Brought him out to Texas to shoot a gun for the first time in at the training. School this kid fucking mocked or discourse dude. I mean is fucking reloaded skilled alone were something to behold any shooter on the planet would be like. Okay no fucking kills well. Because it's an how quickly he picked up how to manage recoil in and Change Carter. Positions was fucking effortless because it was something amazing watch. This kid was reasonably as long as you're not getting the K. Mart special. They're fairly realistic. I was doing so I had a friend who had one of the dance some weight to a man. Like there's something to it. You don't have the weight when load the magazine. That's the different parts you know. It doesn't add all that extra but heavyweight too. I remember I went somewhere. Gyms might have been a halloween thing. I don't remember this kid. Had A I think it was a Galil is an Israeli firearm. And he kept bragging about. This is just like the rate of the wheel. One this is just like the rear one and you just real one and kept bragging about that and I had to tell him that case so What's a shoe arts else? Air Soft? Yeah I don't care if it weighs the same it's not the same. It was one of those things that you had the the down. I know he probably spend two grand on it. But this is like you need to lower. Your expectations of reality was amazing. James's brother when I had my first house came to my door having air soft and he was shooting at me and I literally. I took one of air. Soft gun kept hitting the finger every time I hit him. He's like oh how. How and like two and a half years later we still finding those red fucking pellets. All over my house. You know what I mean. Here's the thing is is A lot of people talk shit about like dry fire. You know like if you just WanNa Kinda get mechanic down on something. You know the standard conventional wisdom's you go and you you fucking rounds downright. You know. We'll dry dry fires only bad if you have like twenty two because it's a rim fire. It's not particularly good for it. You can get. I actually have one for one of my firearms little caps. You actually load them into your magazine. Sure not carry right. Yeah it allows you allows you to chamber the round and dry fire. But generally they don't recommend especially in rim fire to to dry fire because it's not particularly good for the firearm But yeah but here's here's what I was GONNA say is is. You could basically get an ever talked. Pistol the ways the same. Roughly you know what I mean and and actually get the blow back sort of action. It's not gonNA be the same sort of recoil you're managing but if you're trying to get the mechanics of something like a reload out or or you know discipline you know things like that. It's a great Puckett work around for not being able to go to a rain garden. The problem is air soft people quote unquote get fucking weird about it. The thing the thing I don't understand with soft people and and I'll be completely honest just being a gun guy is i. Don't get dressing up like they'll spend thousands of dollars and by the way. I'm not making fun of you to pack the cool button. Dan Guy that just like like okay. That's cool you know maybe with the holder and I'm not making fun of you. I'm not making any of you guys. If it's your thing it's your thing I i WanNa make sure you guys know that. There's plenty of stuff you can make fun of me about but I just don't understand fucking the the the CAMMO. The vast the hats I don't get it. Yeah real hardcore with it. I mean like full-blown Gilly suit dude. Damn you know and to be fair good and it is a fun looking fucking kind of thing. It just really seems like lurking to me. I can't get around it and then it's just meet. Maybe it's my prejudice. Feels like phone swords. And and let's go out and so an editor with with Michael honestly if I was geared if I was bent towards that particular predilection. It wouldn't bother me either. 'cause lopping kind looks fun because it's basically it's a live action. Rpg. I'm not really big to dressing up but honestly if I could see if I was the person into air soft I could see being in the in the cost play. And 'cause it's so you know look into certain corn. I can get a certain bit of it like okay. You go out air soft in one day and you got one got like artists come by guys with Full Auto. Let me go. Get One of those okay. I only got two pockets back pockets. I've been working with our. It'll be a little belt Mack. Okay my fucking finger getting shot. Let me get some gloves. Like I can see a natural workup. Let me get some kneepads of crawling. Around these stupid Bush's I can. I can get the sort of progression of indeed. The instincts grew to a little accessory crazy. Yeah it's it's like the guy it's like the doctor who buys a Harley he's like well let me get a pair boots okay let me get chaps and it's the same thing so there's this website I found called it's ev. K. E. DOT com. No idea how to pronounce it. So here's an store in my home town of it with a one year year. So here's an air soft. It looks like an M. for a are it's nine hundred seventy three dollars. It's five points factor will go by a real one for that. It's five point five pounds actual heft to it but yeah I was Gonna say for for nearly a thousand dollars you can get the real one and because Jeff because air prices have dropped so low you can get a pretty decent one. Well you can't in California anymore but a couple of years ago you might have I. I don't know realistically I'M FOR ANYBODY. Getting outdoors in having fun at this point. I don't really care what you do who you are who you do it with a respectful. Don't give a shit Yeah well one of the things. I'm so pissed off about it The fucking whole Kobe. Thing is I can't go to the GODDAMN RENAISSANCE. Fair was fucking Shit. Do my wife and I hit old timey drunk. My wife and I have always wanted to go to that one and every time we look for one that's in a local area. It's like Oh yeah go to the renaissance. Far It's behind the the the the safe way and it's like. Oh yeah this is like oh I know where that is or or or you look at the Google maps. I'm going why is it that Safeway in that location and I'm GonNa have to carry a real sword if I don't WanNa get mugged in that area Yeah the one they do down here they would do it for probably thirty forty years and it it's It's Fuck I've I've always one of the. I've got a bucket list for it to stop. I WANNA go to like I get made fun of. I think James makes fun of me. I always wanted to see the ballet so I took my wife one year to see the nutcracker because it's literally something I have always wanted to see. I want to go a couple of more time because I don't get it. I understand where it's cool I. I'd do the same thing for opera. I think I think I would give that a shot. Just just to say that. I was like cultured or whatever I do totally like. I don't get the methodist storytelling on on on it. 'cause I I was watching it was on. The Nutcracker is trying to pick it apart. I don't get it. I don't understand this but it was real fun I want to see. What is it? The something masks the Phantom or fuck what the hell my mind's going right now. I want to see family opera. That's that's one of the ones on my on my list of things to see Renaissance Fair like stuff. That just looks fun. I mean I've been to like one of the world's largest airshows that's I want to go back at some point. Yeah do have always wanted to go to an air. Show never done this yet. Oh so yes you get a chance to go rent pairs fucking fun even if you just walk around with like your kids and and you know by a wooden sword fucking shit too. It's fucking good time. I get even if you just like Beja raking. It's great fuck dude as just as a SMART ASS. I WanNa going address. That'd be awesome in a corporate. If you ever get a chance and I don't know why you would ever be here because it's on the opposite end of the country check out the OSHKOSH air show. It is effing amazing. It's one. It was the time I went. It's an Oshkosh Wisconsin. Ever heard of oshkosh b`Gosh the clothing line. Yeah it's or it's in Oshkosh Wisconsin. I think they were. I think we were issued that shit when we were kids in the suburbs. So the Oshkosh Airshow I. It's it's fucking amazing. You gotTa love airshows. I love old planes If you've ever been to Dc Checkout Aerospace Museum. It's the only one I've been to I love fucking planes right my hometown over here. San Gabriel. Actually think it's Rosemead tech technically but anyway There is a museum that I pass for fucking thirty years. You know as long as I've I've lived here And in is this little museum. It's the most overgrown rust bucket. He fucking. You know museum ever all outdoor but it's all old school artillery. That's bad like they have like. Og Hours Thurs from you know. Probably like a Korean War and and whatnot an old Armored personnel carriers and tanks. And they're just all like again it kind of sitting out there sort of roughing with the weeds growing up around her treads and whatnot. But we're going to go there one day. I'm sure they got some gems place. I wonder if they're all D- milled. That would be a shame. But it's probably requirement Gary Hart because if I remember the loss correctly you could have a standard cannon. That's not a breech loader so a breech loader being you know you do something in the back into the Canon is removed. You can't have a breech loader. Yeah you can have a standard cannon do that a lot of these things have been there. Long enough to be grandfathered into whatever new things there. Are you know probably just cement? Down the barrels. Oh that hurts even more. I'd rather have it D- milled because at least you can fix the de Mille. Oh what he just broke my nose. The you know the guy that does Dell ranch Yeltsin ranch yeah He has a video recently. Where you take a high point pistol you know about these shots. Yeah fiber myself but but I know this story is being forced made A high took a picture. Highpoint pour cement down the barrels puerto budget shutdown mantra payrolls and see that. They are seeing that. They were clear and cycle Even the cement concrete barrel weird in cycles out of a high point. That's funny I just something tells me that that I could get a shell into the back of that of breach. I get that Barra clear. Hopefully you're next to when you try fire you have some sort of remote string right to say that that has potential for you to show up on a Darwin award stand behind them like prep bars or something with a string and if you talk James in two of those extra points to it being pocket wanted to pull the streets man refrigerator that'll be good like Another one of the bucket list items. That was for me as I got to see the Louvre in Paris. This a bunch of little stuff I WANNA see in. It's it's funny that the older I get now is just like Shit. I want to do with my son like a bunch of movies. I WANNA watch with my son. I'm really hurting. I can get him into anime because my wife rolls her eyes and and I don't blame her. I mean realistically. Most people aren't insanely anime. Craze animation nuts. Like I am. I've never seen a style of animation that I dislike. As if you've watched us you you you watch a couple episodes of real flex reviews you'll find out Yeah you know just the idea that you that you have this sort of sort of You know captive audience for lack of a better term. We'll get there like curate. Those things for like. Oh I'm going to give them a sort of a best of of what I've seen throughout my life. You know part of it for me is a voice somewhat. Been a loner to some degree I mean I think if you knew James Brian I would not be a big surprise at all. Three of us are very similar in some ways. We all need our own time But I love. I love the medium of animation. One of the limitations to me of live action is. You can't do certain things I it's when you do live action well at the very least. Yeah well I mean like if you do if you do live action you have to make seem real. It's like wrestling. There's a difference between having a tight punch and wrestling or the Dude Mrs. By the guy by a mile and the guy reachs right With with cartoons and animation. You can do all sorts of things and because it's the guy that boundary breaking when it gets to the things and yeah. It's whatever you walk. Wherever you can imagine your mind you could make it was because you're not expecting reality in a cartoon. I can name a handful of cartoons. I can't wait to show home. It's the lensman. Secret lands was one of the first anime I ever saw the first anime ever sobbing. Vampire Hunter d back when they used to do japan-american Sundays on the SCIFI CHANNEL. Akira There's a couple of the ones I want to show him. But just because the nature of the cartoon. I can't until you know well because if you watch any age animation for anybody out there who's never seen it eighties. Animation is at least the ones that came over in America were semi questionable. There's a lot of a lot of naked cartoon boobs at a lot of cussing and I doubt they were in the Japanese version but for some reason they're in the American version cyber CD. Oh by the way is Another one of my favorites. I love the cyberpunk the cyber the cyberpunk kind of visuals if you take a look at like eighty police that has that man machine eighty. Cyborg vibe going on which is fricking cool. I don't know if you've seen in these animism naming off I mean and you know dad or let's see another one of my all time. Favorites is record of the loss war. On if you there's a little bit of a continuation alleging Dalia record. Lotus war is hard the hard edge fantasy. It's basic it's actually based off a game. The rider had So it's slow but it's just this amazing build up in It's amazing aura. Bubblegum Crisis Twenty. Forty eight one. But there's women shopping than lingerie and it's not something I want to explain to a young kid to be honest even eight years old. I don't particularly have a feel like having any explanation of what boobs are because it it eight. You have an idea. Well actually now. They might know considering that faster to has the cell phone. Did EIGHT YEARS. Old is showing all this kid's nudie pictures by the way fuck you if you're one of those parents. Give their kid iphone for some reason at eight years old. You need to cut that crap out. No Kid deserves that. Yeah no kid deserves an curated internet an unfiltered Internet before a certain age. The scares the not like it's not like it. They don't deserve that. I'd outfitted every kid for a little bit longer. Yeah that was my conversation with somebody and I don't remember who it was but they're saying I was more or less kind of Fuddy duddy. It's like it looked. Their kid. Wants wants the bloom is off the rose. It never goes back. I don't care you don't become an adult. You're twenty five if you actually look at the material of human shit lead. Yeah Man I I got this fantasy. That like like my kids would have like Like this goonies style group of friends. You know what I mean that they just roll off on their bicycles with you know go have like little adventures until like high school and then they you know whatever high school still do and then figure out you know what I mean. Yeah I'm sure if future fucking version of kids that's going to bug the crap Outta me. I'll dude I've I I still as an adult wish. I had those band of brothers type of thing. It gets worse being an adult with everybody. Working in you know nobody calling even people. I'm close to. I never fucking talked to at this point in time. I think jams is one of the closest friends I have and the reason I see him or talked to him. Weekly is because the fucking podcast and that's literally it. We're so we're so busy that I don't remember the last time James and I hung out outside of doing the podcast and Ryan lives in. No Way am I say in the middle of nowhere because I live in the middle of nowhere and I feel better about it if I say it. You're yeah gotta be feeling pretty good right now. You know with With all the DIP I. I'm not expecting their your your tiny Fucking ovulation forty eight pounds empires in my county. There's fifteen cases. I actually drive an hour. Two words fuck out here. No on this fifteen cases no deaths. Two of the cases the people actually never went into Into the county. I do however work in our from my house and there's been like six deaths in that area so I'm a little worried about getting it because a dour. I don't particularly want to die from this but if it's just me I at least can live to some degree knowing that it was just me versus if I merck my life. I'm going to be pissed right or your parents or anybody that you WANNA come in contact with any of those things might my little boy. I say I'm not a violent person but the older I get and when my son's involved or my children's involved I have a hard time controlling it. But like for some reason some look if some jackass coughed and my son's face. There's a good chance I'm just GONNA walk up like you know what's funny is. I've been waiting to start. Hearing those stories like led the panic set in with people in this weird and start hearing those stories of course attack for coughing. Here's the thing though is I did of hearing those stories about forty minutes before you called. I'm seeing stories of of people being arrested or purposely going into stores and coughing on the produce Some kid got arrested in some place for putting on I think on facebook whatever but when you where he lived all the fucking like the ones displayed there in the in. The grocery store just ran a strong across like thirty fucking deodorant and my in my the only person that hopes he get some sort of disease. That's not you know that like somehow he gets a titus or or GONNA react attempted murder and and I want to do any five to life. I saw somewhere. I think it was the. Us officials were considering charging people with terrorism. That did stuff like that. And I'm one hundred percent met sent him the Gitmo right next seriously. You deserve to be working waterboarded if you fucking. Shit fucking funny and this was on the last week the last week. It's a couple of weeks ago. The last podcast. We did Ryan James and I were talking about this and one of the things I brought up is. I'm hoping that this kind of unites the country the example I gave us right after nine. Eleven you know you had people you know of different parties sitting together banging on drums. You know smoking weed and Sing Kumbaya on nowadays for some reason because trump that trump derangement syndrome. That dude has an amazing ability to piss everybody off fucking sycophantic and psychopathic. And I'm hoping that this brings the world a little bit what I'd I I'd seen more of the other side and more of the and not as I'm not going to be one of those people that says like Oh despite trump we've all come together and whatnot. I look at him. Almost as a non issue like is Is a zero sum game like you? He's GonNa do stuff and you gotTa do other stuff. But it's everybody else's sort of acting as if he's not around. You know which I should happen by the way. I'm sorry you said the thing is I've seen everybody. Kinda come together and sort of you know. Rally a little bit in in slowly was like in my own neighborhood You know the people that were just like shitting real. He has slowly come around to all of a sudden at all the the places. I have to stop throughout the day. Or whatever there's tape on the ground like a like the gas stations and you know six feet you know where people staying away from each other. And they're trying to mitigate it as much as possible all the companies like we were talking about earlier porn hub and these benesch in groups saying no no. No we got this stuff. We're here to help you know I think it is coming together in that. Same SORT OF POST. Nine Eleven got away. I really hope that after this is over and realistically nobody knows what the United States the world's going to look at look like I mean we could be in the second great depression or we could be after World War Two But I'm hoping because this world downgrade the first Great Depression and we call this now the first Great Depression and we call that when the Bitch Slap Great Depression. It'll be the Great Depression. Redux react like we were wrong. Kale was wrong when we call that the Great Depression. This is the Great Depression that was a mediocre the price and it'll be like apocalypse now read. It has forty five minutes of extra footage. Nobody can get through I. I really hope so I know in my life. I have people who like politically are I. Jokingly say the left Pol Pot I mean. They're they're so politically different from me. That it's almost amusing like how far politics are and it and I my wife thinks they're and other people I know like James can't stand one of them and I'm like you know I love them because a they're different than me. They have different politics. I I I couldn't be married to him That would be polygamy But I love him because the fact that they're generally nice and sweet people and they have different viewpoints. I may not agree on anything they say but I love the argument of the conversation. And I'm really hoping that you this kind of reunites the two sides I will say though if you're listening to this. Thank you for listening By the way stop listening to ABC NBC Fox News. Stop listening to all the alphabet channels. Because most of the time they're full of shit the left leaning ones are trying to stoke the flames of of how bad trump is still the few conservative ones doing the opposite. Stop fucking listening to him. You make your life a whole lot better if you realize. They're just full of shit pretty much. However I saw the Washington Post praise was appraised. Trump was praised conservative one of the Conservatives or something the Conservatives doing and Republicans and it's a blew my mind it's like I never thought I'd see the Washington the WAC poed to pray. Something trump did I was like I was like even if it was horse. Shit I never understood how people don't get that tactic of. Hey Man I'm gonNA call out every single good thing that you do. Because when I call out of baton people are going to believe. Hey this guy is always on the side of this person. So they're saying shitty things about this person. It must be fuck in you. Know he's got no reason that the lies calling all the good thing one of the reasons it's like when Fox News talk show about trump. They're like like Oh man they really fucked up. I I so hate the way news has to be. I mean maybe it was always the same way with Walter Cronkite But I hate the fact if you really want a new that. No the new store. You gotta be like my cousin. You gotTa Watch Fox News. Cnn Al Jazeera BBC News for you gotta read six other articles half of them in another language to find out what the truth is. It's like I don't have time. I barely have time to hang out with my son who I love. I don't care about the fucking news right. Let's see who should I do? Should hang out with my wife and talk about by day or read the most depressing fucking thing ever see him. Hey honey you know I just fucking crazy. The Shit nowadays is nuts and it's gotten worse since the beer viruses is everybody. You're either seeing Kumo or hyperbolic but it's gotten everybody. Forget about politics for ten bucks a minute which you know. Hey Cool I am so. I am so looking forward to like politics. Not being an issue anymore if that ever happens because it's amazing when I was a kid. I know right when I was a kid to a teenager to when I got out of college. I don't remember anybody ever saying. Hey Are you Republican Democrat. Which has come up in conversations in the last five about before anything. They're they're asking your your political spectrum or if for some reason a conversation comes up with politics and like I'm not a big trump fan but I maintain of everybody. You know solve all. I'll say I don't you know. The Tangerine Chattering Tornado did this and they get like a fan like you stab their mother. It's it's ridiculous. They'll Meta praise trump or Barack Obama or biden. You're probably as some people just WANNA wave a flag man. You know what if you'RE GONNA wave a flag choose a different fucking flag. I mean instead of politics how `bout LGBT. I know they have. They need tremendous now. Whether you agree with what the fuck they're doing. That community needs help. How `bout wave that flag health. I just read. Something with the transgendered has the transgender community has Incredibly high unemployment rate versus the Standard Society or gun rights or animal rights. There's something other than motherfucking politics. Please because if WANNA know the truth the politicians don't believe the shit you're actually spouting. They may set it but they don't believe it. Yeah get a Hobby. Fuck make pictures of cartoon porn it. It's got to be more productive than waving the flag eight. How much better contribute to society? Fuck Dude it's it's it's just it's just nuts like how bad it got like this stupid and we're actually way over time but the single trump was just ridiculous and it was it was ridiculous. Did trump do if he shit? Of course all politicians do iffy shit. But let me tell you guys something if I really hope and this is my opinion. I want all politicians all presents from now on to be watched is much as trump. Does I wanted I? I tell you what I want. I want the police body Cam version like in Congress. Oh Fuck you you know. Here's that'd be great. Let me just body cams for politicians. Here's my idea I want. I want to know how many squares of toilet paper the politicians if it comes out of the pocket of the of the People. I want to know how many square toilet paper. How many soaps they use if there's little machine selling tampons and the the Congress congressional women's Room I want to know how many tampons are being. I want everything I want. Their lives stoops. So fucking annoying with how much information is generated by their personal lives. They realized their answerable to somebody. You're right yeah. That's the whole idea of American politics. You know become popularity contest and other thing even distractions in all of that which we did that. We don't have time to go with you as a person who's never been particularly popular. I don't particularly understand politics that way. Like the like the whole trump being so popular. It's like am I. The only person who's conservative. Who can see the mets sightings guy? The only people that are that are fucking like like like boating is. Is the the the the die hard weird one? This is play like sports. You know like like the rest of us can't be bothered you know and and actually then we got shocked. Did News turned into entertainment? You know when we couldn't be bothered to watch the Walter Cronkite. The fucking world of giving real news will turn into you know ninety eight percent op. Ed I you know. Nobody watches the seven o'clock news. They watch DON LEMON OR TUCKER. Carlson is they. Don't fuck real new look like anymore. I like some of the stuff tucker. Carlson plane were to blame for needing to be funding entertained. All go dancing. I realized that this was fucked when people were watching the daily show for real news. And I'm like I know quite a number. I mean. Look if that I got no problem with those years. The reason they didn't have that gives you the colonel to WanNa look into. Hey I wonder if that's a thing going on that thing that he just made a joke about. Oh is that really your thing that's happening and look into it a little bit more. If that gives you some sort of a starting off point cool you know a lot of people? Don't have time to look into every little bit and so it's you know it's curated version but obviously for comedy but there is that subset of people that like like no everything that he says is true even the jokes and they were spouted off as if it's not a joke and different so I'm rambling. No no I mean 'cause we gotta go but before we go. I want to say something that I've noticed this. Anybody else seemed like the cove. Add Corona Beer Virus. Seeing kind of seems like a movie because it reminds me a lot of the the yeah. The plot of twelve monkeys If anybody sees Bruce Bruce Willis. I kind of liked the twelve monkeys. Sing minus the whole post apocalyptic nightmare thing after the fact Right yeah I actually changed my facebook logo to The pitcher actually the twelve monkeys logo. Yeah well last week I figured is winning when it was supposed to cut to three years later and then like the whole city is empty. And nobody's left their house so yeah well no just like there's nobody left alive like everyone's dad and there's like one guy bill trying to solve now that's a way to end a podcast lace. Leave you on a dour. Note a make sure you check out the Art Institute of Chicago Ryan was saying for those Hi Rez amazing images. All I can recommend y'all is is be safe This totally sucks your fucking hands and say the fuck away from me yet but yeah stay six feet away from people. Wash your hands. Wash your hands constantly coughing your elbow and if you cough into somebody's face. Expect to wake up with a machine beeping right next to you. Because that's what's going to happen. You're going to wake up in the next patient. So Ladies and gentlemen for the killing those who produce shelby hanged by the neck until dead. I'm okay with that I'm totally okay You know the old school to quote the bad guy from the the bad guy from Robin Hood in the nineties. Use a spoon. You're more lazy. Jennifer the California Pariahs. Jonathan Charney and Ryan Preston as always. Thank you for listening.

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Talking Future Events & Artistic Endeavors w/ Leslie Marshall  S6Ep4

Beer, Beats, and Business

34:31 min | 4 months ago

Talking Future Events & Artistic Endeavors w/ Leslie Marshall S6Ep4

"Hey there welcome to beer beef and business the business podcast for smart people who appreciate the insights found in a good conversation that guy sitting at the end of the proverbial bar is your host. David J P Fisher that everyone around here just calls. Md Fish. He's an author speaker and business coach. Basically he's a professional talker. So grab a glass of your favorite beverage. Grab a seat and join us for today's episode. Let's see where the conversation takes us. Hello Hello Hello. Welcome back to another interesting conversation with an interesting person today. The part of interesting person is being played by my good friend. Leslie Marshall Leslie is the head of experiential marketing for Morningstar. Try saying that five times fast and she's a hostile a fantastic artist I I love the are that. She's been putting on twitter and instagram feed. But Leslie thanks for joining me today. Thanks for inviting me David. I really appreciate it. Always love talking to you That's that's a good way to make the host. Feel good about himself off the bat. I like that something for all you other guests to learn and you know you want to of course give a shout out to our sponsor for today's episode sketchbook brewing One of my hometown favorites and today. I'm having their snowy owl. Which is a red Ri- Ale and it is delightful so I'll be sipping on that as we go here but let's see here on. Taco. I'll talk about events. 'cause you run some really big events Across the world for Morningstar you also a really involved in a lot of their online digital marketing and with everything that's happened in the pandemic with the Shelter in place in the quarantines. You know obviously a lot of in person events are being pushed back or cancelled. And we're trying to go to virtual events in many cases but Virtual events can be weird right. You're wrestling with this. How how do we make virtual events as useful or at least may not as useful in person events but but not as a deficient as in person event like what are the ways that we can get the same interaction an engagement? From virtual assets. When you think about what I love to come to an event whether that's a large conference or just a meet up with someone of your groups about a favorite topic. We all want that human connection. That's why we shop in a live event. There's so much digital content available now in order for a live event. Stand out. It really has to have a lot of value around personal connections and meeting the people that you want to connect with our learn from and so when we think about how the event landscape is changing in the in the face of this condemning for me personally as extroverted also descend loving event. It's been so hard to not have the personal interactions that to having every day as well to my job and just my day to day life so right my team and I are really thinking about what what's important to our client. What's important to the attendees? And what do they want when they come to a live experience and so As I mentioned the live the personal connections being able to meet the different speakers being able to have yet whether that's Cuban anytime with those speakers as well as a chance to meet each other so when we're looking at our virtual events and we don't have anything set in stone yet but we are looking at adding virtual components on two even the live events. That were rescheduling for later. This year looking at opportunities that will allow attendees to connect with each other. Maybe it's through different chat rooms or like zoom type function where they could all have a happy hour or you're online you can see people face to face. We think these things should be facilitated so that there's An opportunity to ask questions. And it's maybe more facilitated conversation we've thought about roundtables with our own Morningstar analysts roundtables with speakers so in addition to hearing from apple livestream session from speaker. We would love to have something like the Speaker Session. Afterwards where people could ask questions right with all the great technology to that's available. That's one of the fun things that's been exciting about how the technology has helped people connect during this pandemic because otherwise we would just be off in our little bubbles trying to sort everything out and we're looking at mobile APP licenses and figuring out. How could the mobile APP that we already use at our live events via compliment to virtual event? And again all right it's the networking and connections content. Sharing that's available through a mobile APP. We already used so really taking advantage of the technology. We have to do more to help. People connect I think is key and then simple things like one of the reasons. People come to our live conferences. Is it helps them fulfill ce credits so making sure that if people attend a session online. They're able to submit though sessions later to their accrediting organization to get the C credit so really thinking through. What's valuable the customer? And how to bring that through into over Jill because just watching videos online is not no you might see one or two sessions. That are really interesting. But that's not going to bring you back. I think over talk. Yeah right and that's really interesting because one of the thoughts I've had is in this. Is I think even beyond or let's say it preceded A lot of the events being cancelled because of The pandemic is content is is almost getting a kind of meaningless and that's always a little harsh. Maybe but I just think of for example webinars and I host a lot of webinars. I'm speaker on many webinars. It's not to devalue them but there's so many out there that if you're running a and they fulfill kind of I think an important function in some ways. Their function is the content. I WANNA learn how to be better at acts. I WANNA learn how you just platformer Speak a lot on sales in Lincoln and all that kind of good stuff. But what actually propels people to put in the effort of going to invent? It's it's not the agenda. Allot right the I get to be in a room full of bunch of my peers and not only have conversations that I'm planning on with spew lowry. No but almost kind of that serendipitous event. I mean one of the things I love about. Events is literally who I have lunch next to have had great conversations and built relationships based on. Oh we're getting coffee at the same time in the the hall between sessions. How have you seen anything? That kind of helps replace that that. Those interactions I you mentioned Kinda like virtual roundtables which is kind of interesting Is there anything else you've seen? That has allowed people to do that. We'll again I think About roundtables you talk about a coffee break one of the ideas. We thought to as we can schedule. Coffee Break Similar to the online video parties that people are having with their friends and family or coffee break announced time a time to take a break and that we would we would facilitate some type of interweaves for people. Interact like it'd be focused on topic ways for people to introduce themselves so a lot of the virtual platforms. That were exploring. Have these capabilities where you can establish these connections and give people a chance to talk and have those you know kind of unexpected connection points. Ride that Morning Star hasn't used for our events specifically but one of the technologies. I'm interested in Company called brain date. They do the settlement of live events. Where you can schedule you can put in. These are the topics I'm interested in talking about. And then the the programming matches you up and you have a brain date with someone that you might not know or maybe yeah. I love that idea that concept so I think those types of technologies help people meet each other in unexpected ways. I think we'll continue to be really valuable. Even ack with US pandemic slows down our looking for ways to reconnect. I do think Digital digital collection points that bring forth almost alive. Experience will be really valuable. Yeah and I think something that you said which is important this idea of facilitation because and this happens in the offline world going to an event people it can be awkward or they might be. Shire it it can be. I feel pretty comfortable in in a group of people but for example. I've been to your Chicago. Conference the Morningstar Investment Conference at such Kogyo. It's McCormick place. It's huge. It can be really intimidating to walk into that room. If you don't know anybody right. And so you're right. The idea of having facilitated ways to help people get past that awkwardness. And that's something that I've been talking to people a lot about even as far as rank training on. Hey here's how you have a good conversation with somebody. You don't know that well right because just because it's easiest zoom call with pretty much anybody be necessary going to jump into a really comfortable conversation right. It takes a little while but if you know that this person's interested in sustainable investing they volunteer with a local organization and they also have clients in a certain niche. If you knew a few points about them it would be easier to get going into conversation so thinking about ways that we could surface that for ten days are a lot of lot of the different quite that team. Now we're going to be working on us. We plan can come up with our contingency plans for the fall right and and I love that as you said the idea of going. Hey We know if we appeal together that have a few shared common points of interest and then kind of help shepherd the conversation in the beginning and then you can let people take it over each other and I think it's also interesting this idea. You've kind of mentioned something about even beyond twenty twenty where we're going through this odd pandemic and then we don't even know what the kind of the return to quote unquote. Normalcy will look like but in some ways. What will be interesting is even as we get back to. You know in person events. I think what we are seeing is that there's a strong value and desire for the in person world right. I I think anybody who's afraid of us going completely digital after a couple of weeks just having zoom calls. You're like give me a copy something but but I think it is kind of breaking down the barriers between like often an online in really instead of some of these digital components being like cutesy little add-ons on the APP at two alive experience. It they going to become more integrated crazy and think no. I don't think so. I think there's so many opportunities where this technology will help us. Different technologies will help us bridge between live and digital experiences. So you go to a live event. You can take that experience home. Maybe rewatch session. Maybe reconnect on some different types of on the platform Through different media. So I do think this does escalate in A. There's been a lot of this development is technology development with all these different tools but I do think the pandemic is bringing those tools to the forefront and forcing us to really think through. What do we want our digital experiences to be right How do we want to connect with people and I think after this pandemic winds down it will still help us bridge that gap between the time? Maybe that we see people that we've met at conferences. Help US bridge the gap between different learning opportunities that we WANNA explore at a conference that maybe we missed out in the live experience. So I'm really excited about the potential that technology can really bring to live plus virtual events. I think really. I think it will really help actually enhance the live experience. That much more and then I think for people who may still be nervous about traveling still gives people a chance to connect in an environment. That feels safer them where they're still learning connecting with people And we have just have an opportunity so many more people that way. So there's a lot of things I'm really excited about in terms of opportunities even the face of a lot of uncertainty right right. Well you just mentioned like the idea of having Kind of meet the speaker like I think of even what I've been doing. The last couple of years now is most of my speaking engagements. I always have a file while Webinar container. It right where Amadou's message and then in the next couple of weeks You know we'll do like forty five minutes. Our webinar removes attending. They can ask questions especially since a lot of what I speak on. Tends to be very kind of actionable. Practice off you know. Hey how did it work? But you just made me think. Like how cool would it be if you had you had an APP for your events and with Within that you could sign up that you went to. This breakout session or saw this keynote speaker and then almost like within the APP there was either later after the conference or even like a happy hour that at four thirty the speaker will be on answering questions at the event doing a livestream And you ask them you know. And that's kind of like the and part of it when I hear a speaker. I'm always like okay. I don't ask this in this in this in this or I want her to tell me about that more debt. That's actually really. That jazz is me up. That's pretty cool. Yeah I think he's opened up so many more possibilities to learn connect with people in ways that you wouldn't have been possible before speakers other professional. They're busy This just give them other touch points to connect with an audience connect with people that are interested in learning from them in in new and interesting ways. We've also been looking at ways to bring people to conference through virtual reality headset. That's something I've been reading more about looking at how it'd be cool you really do with immersive quality of Vr. You would feel like you're there really cool expiration in in that realm as well so except for you know that you have access to really good coffee going. You're catching me. He gets good. T sit down pop those on well and you guys you've done South with kind of augmented. Vr stuff. Before having you not necessarily for live virtual events but just even for we have working with clients. What kind of stuff have you done with that so far so far twenty? We're entering our third year of using augmented reality and virtual reality. That seems like a long time and in each year. That leads are trying new things. We're always looking at what we're what is the data. Tell us about these different experiences himself with App last year. We launched a functionality within Morning Star magazine so not only at our conferences. Can you get some interesting augmented reality experiences with the magazine on you can look at enhanced data global markets parameter which shows the impact of? What's happening in the markets day? Today you can see that actively today five years from five years ago ten years ago. Really with augmented reality in this live. Data feed you can see version of this map through the mobile device. Also see supplementary content so read an article from one of our analysts. We've got complimentary video that you could watch through the air so we just are trying to think of ways to add value to to printed content that you send it to print. It's done but with augmented reality can add different types of content experiences right and then the other piece that were exploring with virtual reality this year. We're developing virtual reality game called sustainable city where you'll get a series of investment choices and you'll be able to see how your investment choices impact have an impact on environmental social and governance factors related to your investment and see how that what that does to a city or or community and positively negatively. And you can make decisions like I don't WanNa continue invest in that company had a bigger negative impact on the community that I realized or this investment is not performing well and so you've pullbacks you can kind of manage your portfolio and really see the impact that you're having with these different. Ese Risk Factors and we do plan on debut in that game. Now we've push- conferences into the fall. Our plan is still to go forward with about using a game in Mumbai India London Sydney Australia and Chicago goal and we last year was the first year that we did this. Global Rollout with the virtual reality experience in the result of people. Put that headset on. And they're taking somewhere else they. There's a real wild factor related to their learning about investment serve making investment choices and having fun along the way and I think that's one of the really great aspects of VR. Is You people can have have a great experience at also just adds? They're learning about a topic whether that's investing or cooking or or gaming there's a lot of different so many different applications for virtual reality right Like we said there were it really seems at. It's another slash easier way of understanding the data understanding information. I think that goes back to even the idea of bringing that into events. Yes you can watch a live stream video a two dimensional video but when you start to put Three D. nature of being there. Yes obviously artificially but it. It just kind of gives you more information it lets you process things in a different way. Yeah really elevates experience in a whole new way because VR is immersive. You're right in that environment when he put that headset on so does really change. What your experience is all about. You are there. Your mind. Thinks you're there and that just enhanced as what you're learning how you experienced that content information that you're receiving even opportunities to connect with people through the are so that there are so many really awesome possibilities that saw things that were exploring and make make my job even in the middle of feels like all these events are being canceled. One of the exciting things is a little bit overwhelming. Okay what what's the game? Changer hadn't WANNA keep innovating in this environment right well. That's what happens when you have a title like marketing you get to do. Everything is fun. I everyday's is a new challenge. And it really speaks to. I really curious I love to learn new things and loved and understand how things work and it had to think about. How do we make this a great experience for our clients? How do we make them just really help them solve a problem with their business? How do we get them excited about being part of something that Morningstar's put together? How do we help empower investors? So I it's it's a super fun fun role in changing everyday. Well and I know that you always enjoy a new challenge. You took up Imagine this up top but you you actually took up arch kind of a couple of years ago right this. We really kind of dove into classes again. You know I I come from a really artistic family by my dad went to art school of before he decided he had to get serious and get a real job. My Mom and my grandmother artists. My mom designs quilts a wonderful seamstress. Grandmother was our teacher. I grew up surrounded by really creative family members. And wasn't there's nothing wrong. There's no type of wrong our in our family we could. I was allowed to try things and so I had been meaning to get back to just drying sketching and I already had been doing a lot of photography work and so I I am already starting to have a sabbatical. It's Every four years we get six weeks off paid time off and not nice yeah. It's an amazing benefit and we're allowed to do whatever we want with that time and so one year I decided to get back into taking our classes and so I took a class at the art institute of Chicago. They offer lots of different types of sketching classes. And I think the hardest part for me because I like to do things really well. I think the hardest part for me was upsetting. You know sketching something like this is crap like this is anything that I looking at and so but being uncomfortable learning to be uncomfortable with cocaine your learning like it's been as I am that I was learning okay. You don't know how to sketch because this is a new skill for you. We haven't done this in a really long time and one of the things I loved about. It was letting go and not and not worrying about whether something was good or not and then the other piece was once. I got going and sketching that our it happen. Who WERE MY MIND would go? But it felt so freeing to just explorer are exploring try might might skills at something and then as my skills developed. It was fun to see like well. Look I've learned. I've learned so much and that actually looks like a bird not tomato. Yeah if it looked like a bird tomato. That'd be okay right right. So it's really freed me to feel more confident about exploring ideas and Being comfortable with not to go doesn't right now with the quarantine going on our my artists teacher. She reached out group of us to say she was going to start an online sketching group. Every Thursday she sends out the instructions Instructions for the sketching time people share on facebook and she set up a private facebook. Oh cool dribbling with now is mice again. It's been awhile. I'm kinda rusty with my sketches. So everyone's hearing this amazing sketch work like really great. Like hidden are people that are just so talented and I look at my sketches on facebook. Both people there aren't working so much better about that goes against the spirit class while I'm working on getting the guts to post my terrible sketches this week. You you should you gotTa Post Your Tomato. You know it's amazing how much you're talking about technology in the professional space and I. I really do feel that. The damage has really. I think helped people understand. That technology has a place while at the same time. Really reinforcing our desires people to be in relation with other people physically right to be out in the world. Whether that's at your office. You know I think a lot of people are realizing working from home. Isn't necessarily all. It's cracked up to be a good for some people but a lot of people. I've talked to get back to the office. I like seeing my colleagues my clients. My Co workers. You know being out in you know even for me. I don't mind working from home. But Man I could use a coffeehouse frightened now just to look at some different something different than these four walls but it's also saying like what technologies allow us to do kind of on a personal level. I mean my family is kind of scattered almost literally around the world and we had zoom Bingo the other day you know my my mom to see all the grandkids or you know. I love this idea of a facebook classroom or I have friends who are Zuma. Instructors in the gyms are close and so they're like hey. I'm going to be doing Zuma class in my basement. Just for the fun of it or you on a donate something. That'd be great but I'm GonNa do it for an hour and I had a friend who doing that I saw in her class. She had like ninety people like Marines. Can you imagine many people showed up your class? Like that's what I like about. Some of the online things people doing stuff in their homes and even seeing my colleagues in their home settings we gotta bring down the wall and a little bit right like Rome vulnerable when we're in our homes re-showing outside of ourselves you know. I've seen a lot of vulnerability with colleagues who are trying to also home school their kids and keep their keep up with their children's school lessons and my son has made it onto some of my linked in live sessions. Were all dealing with. Hey this is my real life and this is really me. This is what I look like when work out my basement or this is what it's like when my kids are having a meltdown. Seeing I think art were being in a way this being vulnerable showing more of our real selves which I think is really interesting because it's easy to go to work and like have the scenario of what's going on in my life at home and you is to that we are in a more vulnerable place and I do think the way I seen communities. Come together to help people you know. Essential workers don't have the option of work from home. I've been thinking about that a lot in. How do you help essential workers? How do you support people who bag groceries and are the nurses in your neighborhood? Who are helping Save lives. It's really shifted. Even how I think about the people I interact with in regular times right and I've I've actually written some some pieces on this idea that we are all interconnected you know. Sometimes it's very it can be easy to dismiss it as this kind of whoo idea. Oh Yeah we're all interconnected whatever but We we really are you know. And there's this wonderful image is actually from Some Buddhist writing ancient Buddhist writings very old. It's called Andras Net in India's net is incident net that hangs above. It's like a palace but at every there is a jewel and every jewels reflected in every other jewel right. It's kind of this full description of the fact that we all are reflections of each other right. Even your point about the people at me obey groceries for me. It's been I think what we were realizing are essential people that make our economy. Run are often ones at maybe. Were not given the respect. All this happened And you know I say this a lot during the time you know whether it's on a Webinar or linked to live session Ao. Hey to make sure that you're thinking those people definitely the healthcare workers but also just the delivery drivers the person who works at Walgreens the cashier because they're scared is all of us are and they're they are going to work. You know maybe there. I'm hoping and humans are sometimes resistant to to learning lessons. But hopefully were We'll have a better appreciation of how connected. We really are to each other. Help seven I think it can start with just making the decision to recognize that connection so I think everyone like each person. Doing their part sounds corny. But we can make a lot of change. Have a huge impact. So I do think there's opportunity to reach out to our communities and be more connected even what feels like a disconnected world right now no absolutely and and I think even kind of going full circle to to what we started talking. Emma like why did we go to professional conferences? Which technically are about work but You know it's really about the human connection right. It's about us as people showing up into space with other people and connecting with people and so maybe a great reminder to bring some of that vulnerability necessarily bring with you feel about ours is because they're like wait. I get two days away from my kids grade. I'll take a little break but just recognize that everybody. We are engaged with even the professional sphere. I mean they've they've got those home lives right Moreno. Eventually we are going to get back into the swing of a new normal whatever that is but we aren't going to be all working from home and you know the more we can do to remember the lessons the better exactly well this. This sounds like a pretty good place to kind of wrap things up. We haven't had a chance to about beer but I think we've gone into a completely deep place that any good pub conversation gets into This has been perfect. Lese always ask my guests at the end of the show. What's one piece of advice that you give to someone to help them have a better day? Today there's a couple of things I think. One thing I a piece of advice I always tell. People is just always be curious especially like right. Now is a great opportunity to really. Have you always wanted to learn how to cook or have you always wanted to learn how to do yoga? Do you WANNA learn to draw so always be curious and even in times where it feels like. There's so much happening. Is there an opportunity to learn something out as we talk? Talk a lot about technology. I would never have described myself as a technologist or being even very good at technology but My career in my work even today. You know it's kind of forcing me to well. It's fear that let's figure out what our opportunities are continually help assault this deliver a new interesting experience of being curious for me has been a huge career life spark because it's really is the start of something new and started so many new opportunities and then. I always say a priority. I when I get up is Florida helped me be a good leader and just helped me Good problem solver and it. Kinda sets the path for my day. It does doesn't mean every day goes right. Somedays learned later is also learning the hard stuff you know. I get blessed. Were really difficulty. I get to navigate through but you know I always ask that I get set on the right right path for that day in that studying your day with an attention I think is is the key to just every getting started on the right foot. Every day is a much better shot at things going. Well these responding well when things don't go exactly great. Thanks for sharing that Leslie if you wanted to follow up. What's the best way for them to get in touch with you? All social media so at Leslie. Marshall is my twitter. Handle the as important Leslie Marshall is a broadcaster on Fox. A little different will different than me But sometimes you get each other we get tagged in each other's tweets mersal. I also am always open to messages through Lincoln and again my my accountant like Dennis. Leslie Marshall People through social awesome. And we'll make sure we put all those links in the show as well Leslie. Thanks for joining me. And while we've been talking I've enjoyed my snowy owl from sketchbook brewing. The IT really there they make fantastic beer and more importantly they are fantastic people but you can find them throughout the Chicago land area. They've started to branch out and what I'm saying is if you are not listening to this in the Chicago land area toy. Okay go find one of your local breweries Or local distilleries even local wineries. If you're in the right part of the country and help support them either small businesses and for awhile. It will be hard to be a small business in this economy but we can take care of each other as Lesley. So eloquently pointed out in that can be valuable so go buy a six pack from them. from sketchbook and thank you so much for joining us on this episode. If you WANNA give me some feedback WanNa Chat Find Lincoln at Defense Rockstar. And we'll talk to you on the next conversation here on beer. Beats Cam business by? Thanks for stopping by. You can find show notes and links in this episode at fear beads and business dot com. We all know the best way to find out about a new. Podcast is through our friends so please help us out and share what we're doing through social media or just tell someone and if you could do us a favor and leave us a review on your favorite podcast platform like itunes or stitcher. That would be great. Want to get in on. The conversation sent deficient message on twitter at deep dish Rockstar and will save a spot for you at the bar for the next beer. Feats and business.

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BONUS EPISODE: Juneteenth! w/Lauren Burke

Well Spoken Tokens

53:21 min | 3 months ago

BONUS EPISODE: Juneteenth! w/Lauren Burke

"Well-spoken Tokens this podcast tries to fix the cultural sector and try and make it a bit more inclusive everyone. Today we have a very special guest, she is a writer and podcast the Lauren. and. She's here with us today to discuss the subject of June teams, so they thought episode is going to go out or June. so you'll have the opportunity to celebrate it as well so welcome Lauren. Please tell us a bit about your so. Hello, everyone, well as you can tell American here you've already told the good people that I am a writer and podcast. I am also from Chicago Illinois and I'm actually a former museum employees, so I've been really digging this podcast. I worked at the Art Institute of Chicago for seven years just. Really about you. Know. And then I moved into publishing, and now I- podcast and writes about women from history and things like a literary tourism as well. Yeah guess and we we met when I was working a literary house, and I was looking to be a guest on your fabulous podcast will have a little bit later, but we gotta to talk about June team on. This, little explanation for those who don't know about June say what it is and what about? Kentucky here. I got out. So June team is a national holiday America. It's. Also is Freedom Day or June teats Independence Day. says on the Nineteenth Jane. It started in eighteen, sixty five. It was the announcement of the abolition of slavery in Texas on will generally the. A EMANCIPATION OF ENSLAVED AFRICAN AMERICANS DROUGHT The fulmer confederate states of America. Outside the native American. Texas was the most remote of the slave states on the money station mation of January I eighteen, sixty three was not enforced that until off, the confederacy collapsed. The NAME OF OBSERVANCE IS A. Hutu Menu I. Don't even know what that. Means I'm assuming it means to put together 'cause I. Put one. Yeah, June and nineteen. Date of its celebration. I'm just GONNA put bit of a liberal I, as about June teams foam, blackish and And, that's what the. Senate. Al Alpo coach can change lives. Fast celebration involved Senate community gatherings in Texas is spread across the south became more commercialized between nineteen twenties. that I t's often. The centerpiece was a food festival. Stage was aside. Stage was reached in the civil rights movement of the nineteen sixties when the focus became the story of Struggle Flap post-world. Civil Rights. While the nineteen seventies is our full stage which return the focus to African American freedom and up. By the twenty century JT to celebrate the most major cities across the United States. Activists Pushing. Congress to recognize Jane Teams a National Holiday. June teams is recognized as a state holiday special day observance a forty-six of the fifty states. Observances primarily local celebrations. Traditions include public readings of the months. Patient proclamation, same tradition will solve. Hitches swing-low-sweet-chariot, and lift every voice and sing, and reading works by noted African American writers, such as Ralph. Ellison and my Angelie celebrations include Rodeo. Is Street Fairs cookouts? Family reunions, paukphaw cheese is stark reenactments ole Miss June. Contested contests. The mess. Mass cogos. Descendents. I am GONNA. Offend so many people try and say these words. The basically Griffin Mexico who also the GIN team, because the descendants of a particular group I think the black. seminoles apologies again for any mispronunciation. It's not just like coaches, the coaches, the Norwegian well by the twenty, first century Jin teens celebrate most major. Save costs. The United States activists pushing Congress to recognize genius enough your. Holiday. Of It, but I think it's a poet, say hey, yes, I I have no power that recognizes national holiday. Cool so as in American Lauren. Please help us. But US as the way too important to be celebrating things mocking them as puff heritage. Oh Gosh that's a big. It's a big one. So I was really interested to learn that you guys actually learned about this from blackish. That was going to be my big question to you guys like. How do you guys know about June team? Does this this? This is the thing literally just watching black black again i. I'm also an emotional cutter, elected three things and get angry about them so. For me. Definitely one of those things because I would say most. A good portion of Americans do not know what. Does! So, you know especially white. We can. We can definitely get into conversation here about The way that we are educated about African American history in this country it's. Three Tally curriculum based history. What's missing? We definitely skim over. Those parts here in the United. States I think it's very much Be Mission of the family and the church to sort of educate. Black youth about our. I think that's really where we get it. So when I was growing up, so my dad is an Alpha. Phi, Alpha, I don't know if that means anything to you guys. That is a I. Like Black Fraternity Okay Wow So Alpha's are very serious. There is like a handshake. We my dad night last summer. We were at this. Harlem Renaissance Exhibit at the Columbus Museum, and he was just like saying hey to people handshaking people like team. People No, they're. Alpha's I got I had a pin. I saw I saw a licensed play out in the parking. Lot I was like I. Think this is an Alpha. I was like okay so. It is a very serious network and heart of. Day as well Alpha. He's Alpha. Alpha Phi Alpha very serious. And like so serious that a lot of my friends to growing up, he's like okay well. Her mother was in our sister. Sorority, so you guys can hang and I'm like what? It was like Dad. This is ridiculous. But. I understand it now. More I think as an adult like just the networking, and like the power of a black turnkey. Like in a space way you went going to be discriminated against and yes I definitely didn't do that to you. Like my first internship, it was like through one of his connects. Zeal. Really interesting we could have a whole thing. Just talking the Alphabet Alpha Phi Alvis. With one of my best friends Ashley Her mom was a sister sorority and she was like Oh your dad's Alpha. We can hang and I was like Oh you had the same experience. So When I was a kid. I was just like dad like stop. This is embarrassing. Because you out making handshakes, hand signals to people out in public, and I was like this is embarrassing I can't. But now I'm like okay. Yes, this was his whole Michigan. An Alpha's mission is definitely to educate. My father's really involved with the end up. Lacey pe- as well and voter suppression in the big issue. So June eighteenth when I was a kid that meant going to some sort of like Alfalfa sponsored lecture or An Indoor Lacey Pe- like luncheon and there'd be a speaker and. We'd go over the history and there'd be like you know some food. Everyone would be waiting for the food. And that was my experience growing up, and never was it touched in school in any way, shape or form. And then moving to Chicago I'm born in Chicago lived in Ohio for a little bit moved back to Chicago for college. Now this had sort of a different meaning I was no longer going to those lectures instead I would go to lake. Street festival and we also have two black museums here and they also put on like. Like it's a programming and again it's kind of segregated right like the other museums will not really touch June eighteen, but. It's like it's the responsibility of the black community. Entrusting it similar with blockage she and at least now that's getting a little bit more integrated, but yet again you don't really see it as being so of something. The F one necessarily that responsibility is very much a low of black history month programs and activities all led by communities and not like just institutionally done so I think it's interesting that you go about out. Similar thing with gene taints where it's like. Yeah, you have the buck museums. They celebrate June team. You have fe. I've been to everyone is. Let's say but they don't actually. This really quite significant. American history. It's very uncomfortable. I think a lot of people In this country, they think there was the emancipation proclamation, and then there was like a wand that was waived. And then when we get to now like we. Skip over some large chunks. We skip over Jim Crow. Quite a bit in this country we sort of will talk a little bit about Rosa. Parks in Mlk in very specific ways, and then it's sort of like yeah, and then everything was fine and I I'm a big proponent of like having June eighteenth. Be a bigger holiday. Be More integrated. Be More talked about in our schools because. I really think it's important. Especially this is. Me On my soapbox to as a black woman who's the mother by a biracial child of like? We need everyone to know that this is all of our history. Yeah, so. Yeah I. Agree it's. In the same way that the. Responsibility is home, but people for discussing GT in America. Like what s saying about black history month. Also would have the rest of. Any of the histories for people of color will modernize grapes such as I l G. B people, people disabled people. It's a ways. Those communities that have to together to Olmos connected places that they need to be celebrated. Also we just for one day or one week. Maybe if you look were none, but it's actually you know having those ongoing conversations for the north of the story. If that's significant parts of the stories, you're telling on etling up story. Because I- environment in the belief that along a underrepresented groups. All within history, they just having been catalogued as such because so many people have to live. In coded through coded language accredited behavior that makes people who out pause community would never have been able to pick up on it anyway, so it's not gonna be. As obvious to everybody else in the sector creating those using those archives to create those exhibitions. It's just not that way, so you need to work with the communities that need representations in order to do. And I think one of the big parts of God is. Accepting of other. Like, even though I am. Quite few underrepresented communities makeup of my personality and my knees positive the my individual. I call go on speak to. A Like speak to some people from the community and be like Oh gonna a song and it's GonNa. Be Great on equal footing because to them. I am this person who's just come from? They stay of privilege as what can in this museum. and rather than uttering people who aren't represented, we need to kind of bring that back onto us and be like no, the other like they see us as the other way. I like the widows like coming in saying that we're going to fix everything and they don't trust us. Why should they trust us? I feel like if we flip over then sometimes becomes very easier to understand. How To, what would people? That was my suboxone. Folks note anyway. It's a very good soapbox. I am enjoying ish. Yeah I this big because it's like. Yes, we spend a lotta time complaining about all of this stuff, but they're all fixes that there are solutions in. They're always throw at you know, but even if it is just A. Day is significant in the college. The bachelor be something every museum celebrates. Why isn't every museum just doing a June team activity you know. People talk about to leave. The must not as wide live. An extra money making scheme is well. Let's. More imperative, actually be a decent human being. If all you care about is your bottom line. More of a variety of like events creates an informative people come in a variety of people coming in increases your profits. I mean that has been my argument as you know one of the only black women, the room in museums and in publishing as well. That's that's always had be my argument. Like. Why are we not diversifying just even if for the money, guys? Audiences brigand some cash. Yeah it works come on fast and furious. They have a Chinese cast member. Just they can really sell it in the Chinese market, I didn't jaws fails. The Chinese market specifically because they've put some of that, they can do with a little side company. Expert Films. attacked. Insane NECE I. I, will just I know the listeners cannot see, and maybe you guys cannot see. It's so bright where I'm at right now, but I do have a mug that is a mash up of Shakespeare in fast and furious films yeah here. I. Something that I would on. Wall okay you send me about. We're going to tweet that out with the show I. Mean Yeah. It's quite beautiful to behold. Throwing me completely. Wow Yeah, but. The same principle you upbringing multiple geocultural bay, your geocultural sector new learning history. This is the whole point of museum. People are embracing leading real history. I think too I. Mean You have people? First of all just uncomfortable talking about slavery in this country, right? Now? Our space where people are like Oh okay. We need to get someone. In the room we need diversity higher, or we need a person of color to come in here and like. Talk about it, but we haven't done that Oh. We haven't hired a person of color like how do we? We need to fix that, so they? They just like push that off until they have someone. In the room, essentially there was one publisher I was hired at where I was the only person of any. Any color. Small publisher? And when I was hired on board and I wasn't even actually in the editorial department of this particular company. They were like Oh. It's great that we now have a person of color here because we want to do some books, some diverse books, and like what do you think of all of these and I'm like wow. I cannot speak to all of these experiences. This is wild. Wow Yeah, yeah, so I think that's a big issue. I think it's just Americans understanding their history in general. Is An issue. It's one that we haven't tackled I mean for example. When I was in high school for Black History Month one year. our teachers I did not have a black teacher, until I went to college for shore or a teacher of any of color at all. Until I was probably nineteen. So. So. People are, Aga. No, I went. In Ohio but I was in Columbus Ohio, which is like the capital? It's like so it's not like there are. There are people of color there, but this isn't. Chicago quite segregated anyway. It is yes yeah, and that's. That is a big conversation as well. Audience, but I will say like. When I got to Chicago for college, and I went to depaul which is in Lincoln Park, which is on the north side which is. A very particular way I did have immediately a really diverse group of friends. which was like? I felt like I could breathe for the first time in years. just because also. As you'll notice very light, skinned black person. Both. My parents are black. Both of their parents are black. They're all very. Very, lights or Mulatto as which on many of their birth certificates. Wow, and that is something to that like. Americans don't really know that lapper. Come in all shades. They really struggle said something really raises you. Not, realizing that you will block yes. Oh absolutely! Absolutely, Oh, yeah, I have lots of experiences with that especially in Ohio and especially growing up I had quite a few of those experiences and low. Yeah is mixed race and he's very white. Presenting is stuck inside that one of the first things I. Full was. He's GonNa be like what are these race racism? Ninjas like someone's GonNa say. A No Indians, and then he's GonNa bust out his job and they can be like Oh, yeah. Yeah totally I mean. That's something I'm. Of trying to prepare my daughter for as well. I think in a big way like because it started when I was five. As, well people like I remember someone on the bus like grab my arm and they were like your skin is darker than mine. Why is your skin darker than mine and just was? At me for that, so yeah I mean there's a lot of. America has not fix their race problem I think there's this point during the Obama, administration, where people really. Got Very confident and felt like we were post. Racial and I'm like guys. This is awfully yeah. Come on! I May I remember having an experience in that twenty years ago. Whatever to America just going on a tour bus to the Grand Canyon and It was an African woman on the bus and she was white and I was ask from England, and we were all talking about where we're from and this league. Woman literally couldn't stop repeating. Beverage white people in Africa and that black people in England it literally did not occur with that. These things could have that it was like. How could you not know the divest? Like eight like the idea, the yet you got an education system that doesn't allow you to actually understand something fundamental about service in the will just terrified. I'm like DOC is my family I'm people think that my sister is like Italian will mixed? Like, it's just. It's just so weird. Dislike it a lot of people asking her doing those sort of interrogation. Like what are you I get that question a lot. Yeah! I get that question all the time and I think it's obvious, but apparently not. People I mean we can have a conversation about hair. Yeah, yes. Yes, thing is I. Don't particularly mind when other people got off even from his I find that flowering on saying to astor Elliot's. It's a few people I've met. Lost Yay. Like one friend that I made whose families Ghana and she was like come big had gone in me somewhere. And so what else he was from, Jamaica had Jamaican heritage like no. You've got some Jamaican and Youtube Alex resort ranks of like what me to be. Like you. Enough that you want to be. Like Yo People But when? I get that a lot from Puerto. Ricans. Husky Puerto Rican. This is the although in your life. Well, actually I 'cause you. People have invaded countries I. Don't know what what will happen. Right. So I think that's the thing that you often get into with people I feel like there's often this slack Pu- public education SORTA. It because you know like I, said growing up at high school. We didn't have any. Teachers of color to sort of help us along so when black history month would roll around? Terribly like our school actually put it on like the five black students to put up programming. which is very yeah. Extreme on you know us to sort of educate people and then. Just just as terrible you're also like. I was also like sort of an awkward. You know fourteen year old trying to figure this all out on my own right. Not a lot of Complicated Racial Dynamics in my family, and like so I'd have to go into the reasons like okay. Yes, here's the reasons why there are so many like. Light skinned black people in this country and are not comfortable FYI. I like my. Dog. It's not fun and a Mike here late. Here's where we're going to talk about rape like by the way, yeah. That, be in. A. Pop or why just information from the policeman's yesterday? OPAQUED! Yeah. She has in the quotations yet skin. Yeah right and so it's likely to be able to get information. It's true, so we get into color as we get into sexual assault, and these are like complicated things for a young woman. Digest? Taking your teacher, because clearly they don't know anything about it which they put Yukos to do it, trans. You're just like okay. This is not actually thinking about how comfortable you would be today this liberties. Tweet the history complex. Also the idea that we just called welcome to academic curriculum a little bit of extra work so that we have bit. About subjects we've. Over but And then every year they. Used the same history. History doesn't. Yeah. Wildest. I hope things have changed. High School I am a woman in my thirties. I hope things are better now but I. I am preparing for them not to be better in terms. Yeah, educating my smiles Yeah Oh. Really, like note I. Say Psyche La- becoming on the emotional journey. To this great great, thank you. Back. Today! We were talking about June teen when Obama Tiger before the break. Dude skies. Faith into this thing if we're not learning about these things. I history that we do get into these situations. A Superhero quit because people don't know that this is a really horrific question to ask. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely like I mean as we were talking during the break how you know. I have just had people scream at me on the bus. Like Hey, where are you from? Where are you from? What's your history? What's your ethnicity who you know? What's going on with you? Are you black? Are you white or remixed? And I'm like Oh do I have to get into like right here on the one 147 like before work like I have to give you an education on American, history and slavery and color is and. It's a lot. I'm I'm like feeling about national right now. It might be quarantine about because I'm tired. All who knows what is? Giving him out like. We will say discussing like how people in different families can be different shades in the break. I'm. Because? It's kind of like well I don't actually know the answer to that question. Is that I can give you an approximation of where my family will from right, but I don't know why. My hair is completely different to the rest of my family I. Don't know why Melanin is so much darker. Like. No one in even my like. My kind of extended family can like. Tell me what to do with my have. It's so it's a journey of to learn like on my own to my whole life, and that might sound Blake Radi. Law, probably like really not problem all. But when you can't even do something simple like figure out. Like what is going to work for you in a professional setting or whatever? and. You don't fit in anywhere and no headdresses can. Can Get, do anything and all they try to relax it and straighten it and make it more and more Western than warm white. It. It does like really mess you up because. It's like well. If you really want me to get into it I don't fucking know. You. Know is because you've been raised. Yeah, then. It's like I've raised for myself like I. don't even know so. How am I supposed to explain it to you, yeah. And it's interesting because I think that I can't really do. Particularly extended family trae the my family's from Freetown in Sierra Leone, which is where I free flights went. So you go back? Way And people ask me about my name is a pastor faces it from that is not an career is actually because they were crew on the ship they were apparently paid presuming very well, but they went actually five. Still you get to a certain point in certain people's histories, and you don't know where the records because they would not. They were either Chattel or they. were. You Know Pasta around, also you know. It's a thing that we might actually not be able to do because of the history of oppression, and so it is really important to recognize the impact. Still House you know you. Find out where you'll from. Kate came from. You know then. Mind, I search not that far back. Yeah, that's why these like twenty three and me. Things really pissed me off. Because I'm like it's only for white people. Note like I can't do that. Will will government's not having idea that's not being. But. It's just not gonNA happen. Like, yeah, it's. It's they don't have inflammation. because. How could they? Yeah. I actually In a way like so my family is. Very lucky, and then also we have several people in my family who are historians might like cousin. This is what her dissertation with on Actually and on my family, and for four dissertation. She was like I'm actually try to do as much of our family. Tree is I can. Very very lucky to get a good portion other. And like my family has been or that side of my family has been in the United States for many many years for hundreds of years, and it's a mix of all different people and. And it's it's amazing. It's actually she put together in a book called like almost white. Which I think is maybe possibly available, but anyway. I remember this time in high school literature class and I was like I. Mean we're only reading white dudes? has now become like my mission in life, right is to. Read read other people and. My teacher was like Oh is that basically? It was like Oh. Gosh, is this important that we read other people and I was like well. You know like as a black woman would like to explore other types of literature. I feel like I've read so many books about like upper. Class dudes at boarding school and I would like a different experience than that and. He was like Oh. You're black I, didn't I didn't know and then came into school with like a book of. Like African history. Entails and folklore. This is sounding was terrible. Terrible, right? But. It's just like what that does is like erase my I'm like I'm like I'm American like I'm Berry American. It's just that ugly part of American. History that no one wants to acknowledge. We WanNA skip back. To Africa I can't tell you where my family's from an Africa I can't tell you like what percentage which people often want to know. People very much. Get down to it of like. Which one of your grandparents is white, or which one who is white, and they really need to know lake zillow's numbers. Exhausted brain about lake. I don't know. I think it just would make them feel more. Comfortable. I. Yeah, but I'm like as I've gotten older, I Mike Oh. You don't need to feel comfortable. Think. That's the place I'm slowly getting to whereas when I was younger and I was you know the one of the few black kids in an all white school? I was just trying to figure out ways. To tell the story and make people feel comfortable and it just. Wasn't working out for me. That's why bringing it back around June teams like if we could have more national holidays if we can have more celebrations or more just even like people talking about this. It would do us a world of good. Also give every black passed in the day off work great. Why do people have to go? I think. That'd be amazing. So? Yeah, I believe. So I do we explored our coach? Reference given that we basically have the one. I was really. Because I have been wanting to reference still I rise and I'm very excited about the fact that people talk about my Angela and actually even referenced by engine loons still I rise. It's kind of reference. The thing that most people know about my Angela to the of quite low of writing. Essays but yeah. Lauren talked to a spot your coat. Is for our culture the week. Section Flea. Will one is related to blackish which I've been watching black AF on net flicks, which could do a whole breakdown of its have a lot of thoughts about it. Really with this I've got to watch I. It. And then they had skewed aboard minute and then. I I know how I feel about this 'cause. Like really want to watch. Content cut. It's easy to play for like. A, moral. Tyler Perry also makes a cameo as well. Oh Wichita. and. Blockage is very yet anyway. Yeah, so it's it's Kenya. Perez and I don't think it's a perfect show, but it's. It's asking a lot of interesting questions I think that it's very similar to blackish. Actually think that show could drop sort of the. Also has a family Sitcom -I angle and I feel like they could just drop that because I think it's actually very interesting, just him being. A black. Filmmaker or just like almost like he's almost like Larry. David, type I would almost carrier. Curb your enthusiasm for black people, but oh cool in some of the questions that he's asking about like educating children and like. They're his children growing up with privilege and like kind of negotiating. His blackness and like where we're from where he's com- to where he is today, like in this position of Success I. Think are very interesting thing. There's some some points. The show does miss the mark but I. There's a lot of interesting stuff in there, but there is a June team episode, and they don't lean into June teen as much as black ish does, but I feel like that episode at like. Yeah, that's Kinda like what June eighteenth was. In our house like if we were having a barbecue like the family reunion, the Barbecue Angle around June teens. That's pretty much like the I. Think maybe the standard experience. Yeah, it's like everybody and especially the elders of the family really. Getting on a soapbox and letting everybody know. And, then that sometimes develops into like an argument based on my, where everyone's at professionally and their level of privileged within the family, because there is a lot of diversity in black families, which I think is another thing that I I appreciate about black ish and lack af that people aren't seeing in the media, but like you know black is not a monolith like this is a range of experiences. And so I Yeah I recommend the show, but it's like it's not perfect, but there are certain experiences that like I appreciate that bats. On I'm a I'm appreciating that that's being discussed. And I think. About, black ish I don't think blackish is a perfect show. I liked. It with Coma Day of like for did they give by I? Don't watch it I, won't. Watch it religiously, but I'll catch up with it when I. Kind of remember that it's on. But then they have an episode like lemonade or June teams episode and I'm like this is absolutely essential because. Educating me in ways. I had not thought about and I am. Doing that for me what it can do for what I think is really amazing and what seven four? C. You said you had Modem Wadden, the lighter I have another one I feel like. I feel like my brother should be on the show. My brother is also my is very serious My brother is I mean talking about people who have different skin colors his family. He's much darker than me. He's very righteous fro. Whereas a lot of leg. Political, t shirts. He has been harassed by the police. He's got a lot to say My brother Love's Ralph Ellison and who's the writer of invisible man, which won the national book. Award Ralph Ellison also wrote a book called June. Eighteenth. Which I have not read, my brother has he loves it but I. DO think about June eighteenth every once in a while because Ralph Ellison wrote it pretty much over the course of forty years. And then it was about two thousand pages by the time I think his publisher finally got it. He didn't finish it. The executor of his will actually is the one that gathered up, and then took it to the publisher and It was just in pieces like it was like some are like some bits were like on handwritten sheets, and some bits were in binders, and some bits run various floppy disks, and so just as an editor and like Oh. What a what a nightmare! The other teens but It's like messy and complicated and I feel like it's sort of like. Fits. I definitely think at some point. We're going to have to come up with a well-spoken Tokens reading list because we have really great recommendation. And actually we were discussing Renny Lodge while note on the. White people about race. And Yeah I always think it's really interesting. Because I did not know about this book and I feel like about the need to go away and read right Nah Yeah Bat. Ralph Ellison. Interesting writer. Very interesting writer. I think Zora Neale Hurston actually has some bits about. June teams. She was an anthropologist. If people don't know and she Also may be considered the first female black filmmaker because she was also like doing all of these small anthropology. Films, but she was also interviewing. A lot of. People. Who? Were early early. People who are celebrating June eighteenth or at the jubilee are slaves had been freed so I think her work is absolutely something. You should put on that about reading list. I, actually have I. talked. With his sometimes I feel discriminated against, but it does not make me angry. It merely astonishes me. How can any buddy denied themselves to play with my company beyond me? And Yeah that power and being so so the wear of who you are an yeah. He's quite as well. Oh Yeah Oh. Yeah that's all. I got for pop culture references I, wish I. Had I mean strawberry. SODA IS PART OF A. COOKOUT as part of June teams cookout. Strawberry Soda over there, but If you didn't know that one. What's that? We'll just like any kind of strawberry soda any kind of the. Generic Soda. Okay? I mean we would do like a purple crush. It's yeah, if you guys are setting up a June eighteenth barbecue. I'm just. Probably try to. How Fun, you guys! Should you need to do ribs? Some potato. Jin Team. Just. If we all do one in our. Yeah. Yeah. I mean I will for sure. because. Will you be celebrating with your family this year. Just as my husband and daughter, sadly, and it's it's sucks because June around June teen fits. We've a lot of summer. Birthdays and graduation staff, so we'd usually get together have like a huge celebration, and my stepdad would take like three days preparing ribs, and he gets very stressed out about it, but he does it anyway. Parent thing. They get stressed out about, but they weren't anywhere else. Do it because if anybody. Wrong. But they gonNA. Complain and Bitch and Moan. What they make at the end of it is just so was playing around. It's it's amazing, and he just every time I mean he doesn't. Very regularly. Work for family like I, mean and he every time it's like oh! I don't think these are GONNA turn out. This isn't going to work I'm like you've been doing this. For me for twenty five years. Yeah. Have you. I think you have I. Think it's fine. Everyone loves it. It's fine, but it's like a whole process. Unfortunately, you're going to have to say like video and images and he's got y'all have to get some smell-a-vision going on even. Career I. Probably I'll give it a shot I will give it a shot. I have not as dedicated you. Special Place I mean soaked for days, it's the whole thing. Except like that would be hilarious crazy. Insane, so you've goals. Absolute goals. So I'm going to miss that this year because it is like it's just a good time to get together and you know it's funny just how I've changed my feelings towards. My parents sort of sermonizing at me. At those those events now I'm like oh I'm looking forward to having sort of these discussions with my family and. Ultimately. The elder. Thank. You and you were. Yeah, my brother might handle most of it. So, we also have another segment, which is I'm mighty white segment now justice looking. Save, so we might suckle run I just have one day. We're going to say. I. Will just go. I'm GONNA give you shout out to. What Clinton someone whose? Name is angel. And in her own words, she's a horrible. We got won't. Surprisingly! She's great. She's really interested in what I'm doing his wish trying to. His exceptional human being and very much. So I was GONNA show out Shana Lennon from the volunteers and two marriages. Name. She's a fantastic human, being and I feel. Like lots of friends and colleagues and but lately like just not giving me work well. I feel like. Impact. Has Been released for again. collaborate with Do the museum on Women's lightweight. And She's been rating fabulous, and she actually invite me speak at the. To northwest wide alter manages meeting and talk about the power of networks, and we coaches Silvis session together She's just berry battery supposed professionally as finding booed as a human being in terms of pushing fullwood anything. She was doing her organization in terms of bringing more into Civetta a Mike Jehovah. You know they're all processes in place to make sure that people feel welcomed. I think She says she's doing good work. She's doing radio amazing where the kind of what but you know I want to be doing I like doing and yeah. Very inspirational make the Shana and she's also been released for Museum Pico me. Does the putting money way says She's helped. Meetings that we've been having any northwest with zoom in the crisis, and she's been really really helpful, spreading wet, and in that operationally as well and she didn't like credit and I like the. Dating ignore doing amazing thing no. I'm shouting out. So Lauren I. Think you said you've got someone that you want to? Proclaim will being an extreme, allied or Africa or Sorry before you do, interrupt and say I should specify. The Angel is actually mixed race. She's only fifty percents. fifty seven might. Fifty percent. And the other fifty said. I think. We decided that the time might encompasses you know an active as much as a racial. Boundary to that. I didn't think the web wife should be. used to describe anyone of color in any way shape. You wanted to give angel shout though that's good yeah yeah great. I was just. Editing. We just did a Lord Byron episode and Simon, Brown. Who is curator of new? Sit Abby. Love, Simon. Just great guy and one of the really interesting things we talked about with Newstead Abbey was It's complicated. History with regards to money and getting money from slave plantations, and just the work that he's doing acknowledging that making sure people know about that complicated history just reaching out to people about like how this is presented like how you know. How what can we do better? You know that sort of thing so I'm going to give a shot up to Simon. I think he's doing a good job over there. Fabulous. And the. The Po- costs before we do. The probe's with a quote. I love. From. would. Exchange was dressed up like my internally. What a drag race! By enter, this came to mind. If those tried to come from me, I will show cut the. I will not hesitate. Put to put back in a ditch because I actually eight no POLKA stitch. That was. He would definitely of approve of that message. So, yes, Do you want to do a shout out Florence? Thank you so much. Coming in talking to us by teammates isn't being amazing. I felt like I've lent. I've got away with more lead and. before we go absolutely want us to talk about oil amazing projects on so excited of the big front of your podcast for a while but yeah talk about. Let's see got the podcast called Bonnets at dawn. You can find that and Stitcher soundcloud I tunes wherever you get your podcast from. That is about eighteenth, nineteenth and twentieth century. Women Writers I try to be. I want to be as diverse as possible I also want to look for more hidden histories as we have some really exciting. Author's coming up that no one talks about. So Episode on W. Hoffa was amazing and here you, you have covered. Some really interesting takes on, you know destroy women. Writers have for also yeah, the struggles about acknowledging the stories that talking about you know the Mansfield story again talking about the complicated history of slavery within Austin's work, so I definitely recommend listening to all any wide reading of some of those novels, avalon of raving Rivera's, but actually not necessarily talking about all of the bits of yeah, thank you. I think the big thing that we talk about a lot is that there's a perception that sort of classic literature or these women existed in a bubble, and so we tried to broaden. The conversation and talk about systemic racism. You know slavery. Just an all the stories that have just been. Covered over I, think you know the Harper episode was really interesting because we were talking to a scholar who found one of her missing manuscripts, and it was just hidden in plain sight. You know that that's kind of the sad thing. Is that it that stuff is? You do have to do a little bit more digging, but also you have to acknowledge that we haven't done a great job of preserving our history especially for women and women of Color so Yup. We do a lot of stuff like that on the show and right now we're talking about literary tourism. and talking with curator's which has been really really fun, and then on top of that. I think we can. I can actually talk about this because this will come out in June. have a book coming out with Chronicle and my co host in. It's called why she wrote. That will be out in March of twenty twenty one. So that's exciting and then have another book that's coming out in September, and it's Rosa Parks Book. It is for ages six to nine. So I didn't get to get in like all of Rosa. Parks really bad ass history so I highly recommend people go out there and read up on her specially her work as I mean sound so depressing as a rape investigator woman with a bad ass She doesn't pay the credit that she deserves but yeah I. Just wrote this book I six to nine year. Olds explain voter, suppression and Systemic Racism. Best I could cause. Yeah, gotTa get that in. MIAMI, saying, thank you very much looking forward to this that I will obviously continue just even Hannah on. Thank you so much becoming. We really don't have you. Ever having me. Thank you so. You're welcome.

Chicago writer America Alpha Africa United States Ralph Ellison Lauren I. publisher Ohio Texas Mike Oh High School Senate Obama Art Institute of Chicago Rosa Congress I rape
Which is cooler, zero or infinity?

Tai Asks Why

19:27 min | 2 years ago

Which is cooler, zero or infinity?

"This is a CBC podcast. Hi, I'm Jamie for the last decade. I've been a newspaper reporter and lately just finding it hard to keep up with the news today. Simple possession of marijuana is no longer illegal. It can be hard to make sensing investigators spent nine hours in the consulates appearance. I want to change that at least a little I hope you'll join me for front burner daily podcast from CBC news. Subscribe now wherever you get your podcast. From the ear. Wolf network comes Dr game show, a comedy podcast that takes listener suggestions. And turn them into outrageous games. In each episode, hosts Joe Firestone and Manila Merano, play listener created games with comedian guests and live callers checkout episodes of doctor game show every Wednesday wherever you get your podcasts. I want you to try to magin a box of nothing. You can't really write because a box would be containing something. What containing something there's not containing nothing. Okay. Now, try to magin a box of Infinity like everything. And you also can't really because it just kinda goes on and on and you can't contain it. If it keeps going, right? What's up with that? Hi there. I'm tired. This my podcast Tosks. Why there are so very many great questions short to get answers questions. Like could you trust your doctor for happened? If do you die when we dream was long harbour, we're gonna fix climate change, and which one is cooler zero or infinite. Numbers of always meant a lot to me. My first language might have actress been math. When I was young. And I still really didn't understand English that while I knew what a talk but still try to grasp ahold of the many concepts of English but masses just like. Is there? Although I could understand the math at a raw level. I couldn't really express it. And apparently, it always came out his jumbling confusing, and I don't really fully remember how I would express myself. But my dad does mom, and I called it made up math because what you would do is that you would quiz me or mom with a math question that you'd come up with. But since he didn't know add or multiply divide that well yet, you would just make up words, you'd say something like, hey, dad, what's eleven tiddly fifty nine, and I would have no idea because you're the only person who would know what the answer was you remember that. Yeah. I remember asking about some sort of like pancake. Sure. And you like Thai have no idea. How to do a pancake in explain it to you? Yeah. I think even explaining math to me for a long time. Since the simpler times of the pancake functions. Spent a lot of time reading old second hand textbooks from this old bookseller in our neighborhood note absorb more knowledge be like a sponge sooking up the math. There are numbers that can be put into fractions numbers that can't be put into fractions. Just go on forever. You guys know finan trait wobbles won't be two to three five three two length of your belly button to your feet to your head the ratio of that equals, the golden ratio. And then they're just numbers that we just can't comprehend like zero and Infinity. They're both kinda just like the ultimate mind boggling what happens if I pit their coolness against each other, which was more important more expensive the mind blow up factor. Best in kind of only people that I would really talk to about it would be none other than mathematicians. Hi do. I have both of you. You have me. Hi, okay. So. So on the phone right now, I was able to call up James grind and Jana chin. There are both super awesome math people who do a a lot of thinking about the importance of these numbers. I give lots of talks around the world. And people might see me on each channel. Could number file now Gina is the scientist in residence at the school of the Art Institute of Chicago, which is pretty cool. And I've written several books on the second one was cooled beyond Infinity. I have that book. Actually, oh, I'm glad to hear. This is the crazy super debate about coolness of zero versus affinity. James? Can you explain to me what zero even is as a mathematical concept? Okay. So on one hand zero is a number as like the numbers one two three four five two nine zero times. One is e zero times two is era. But also that means that to come come sit out zeros, I'm have to well now, we can't. So we do have to treat zero slightly differently. From the other numbers. It's a number that represents nothing both of them, abstract ideas in any ways. But that's what matters about math is about going to the abstract to solve problems. Because like, even if we just have the drawing of the number one that doesn't mean it's one. That's our interpretation are symbol to represent the concept. You could point at one sheep one cow one coin. But one of those things have in common is this idea of oneness. They have in common, which is not something you can point at. But is something they will share when you try and teach small child how to count you keep showing them objects and going one-two-three one-two-three, but they have to make a leap inside the head from the objects in front of them to this concept of as James says one nece. And you can't do it full them. You can't point. That's it. You can't see it. You can't touch it. You can't feel it. You can't eat it. And so you just have to do it in your head. It's weird because it's it's there, but at the same time, it's not there. That's how I think of maths. It's kind of it's definitely there in my head. But it's also not there because it's just in my head the same applies to tier you can't really point. At nothing zero is the hawed idea is harder than one two three one sheep and one cow have something in common, but zero sheep zero cows almost have more in common somehow, at least to me it's much easier to get zero sheep and zero cows. I've got them right in front of me. Now, what about INFINITI you can't go up to your kid? Will look this is one cow. This is no cows. This is everything. Infinite on. Fortunately, we don't even have infinite cows on the entire planet. So we couldn't even try to assemble infinite cows. And it's so it's really something that happens inside your brain. But something that you can show to any child, and they've probably understood it themselves, if you eat off of your chocolate cake, then you have Hof left, and then if you eat Hof of what's lift, then there's still some left, and if you eat of what's left, the still left keep eating Hof of your remaining chocolate cake, you can take an infinite number of bites of chocolate cake, and there will still be some left. Aveeno? I have the best producers in the world. And they actually brought me a cake. God, this is so awesome. On the try to cut it infinitely and see if it goes to zero. Okay, here we go. Proper. So I've cutting the kick. At times. Yup. We'll just keep eating whatever you give half. Again. We make the third eight nine sixteen working through good. Keep calling it forever and ever and ever forever. Never never. Anyway, back to the question. Zero is a lot less flashier than Infinity is something that you would use everyday life actually came from merchants and traders and accountant RAV then the sort of intellectuals studying Matt's, but then again Infinity turns out to be practical as well. And it also turns out to be everywhere through the field of calculus, which is a piece of mathematics that really governs everything that changes continuously. And that means practically everything in the modern world, including things like well eletricity, and that's how Infinity Camby photo of as very practical as well as having mind-bending and with properties where you can play around and create strange beasts and strange universes in which peculiar and amazing things happen. Yeah. Infinity is the one that's the strangest. I mean strange. Paradoxes the icon understand one example of those paradoxes that cake conundrum, which I explained in the cake break and another one is Hilbert hotel that was proposed by the mathematician, Hilbert's where he said, let's imagine we have a hotel with an infinite number of rooms now who are toes confusing bear with me matchy of really big hotel. Now, this hotel, infinite roofs, and let's say that one man walks in one night and says, hey on group, you know, you can't just send them to the infinite floor that doesn't really seem fair. You does to walk all that way. So you sent him to room one and send the person on one term to send the person on two to three and keep going. So instead of this one guy to travel so incredibly infinitely far everyone just travels want which works out such as small number. Eventually converges into Infinity. And that's quite odd. Because in a normal finite hotel, if it's full you can't just fit another guest in without asking them to share a room, which they probably went want to do. Yeah. My head hurts. Where will get and clever now James, what do you think of what you genius saying? And what do you think zeros cooler? Oh, I think we're going to find that these two ideas, we're going to be very connected because they all related ideas, one being nothing won't being everything. But without you wouldn't have any of modern mathematics today. The reason zero potent is because without it, you have a place value system. So in the old times when you wanted to count the teen sheep or something like that you would have to make a Mark for each sheep. So you have to make thirteen Mark. So you can count them what the gyp shins, and the Babylonians did is they started using new moves to represent larger numbers. So now, if you wanna count thirteen you can just use a one and three so now you need zero in here because what is the difference between thirty two and three hundred. Into. Well, you need that space in the middle in the old times. That would be actually a space any later that zero was recognized as a number, but with place value system, you can now do the whole of mathematics. We know today. Oh, man. If it wasn't for the concept of the number zero. We would still have to use the talent beetle. The one words like one two three four and then five is horizontal line. That would be pretty bad. It's like that boat will cost thirteen thousand dollars one two three four. I agree with James zero is really important and possibly even more important than Infinity cause more maths depends on zero really but just because something's important. I personally don't necessarily think it's cool. There are plenty of things in life that are really important without being cool to me a tool like for example, sleep which I find pretty boring, but I recognize that it's very important. Hey, if you wanna learn more about the importance of sleep to check on my upset about dreams. Not everybody has to understand it in order to do its thing in the world around us. If we didn't have access to an infinite number of numbers, then we get into trouble because we'd have to stop somewhere. And if you stop somewhere, then everything would implode backwards. Oh, no. Oh, no. Dear. At his time was a weird idea, but it turned out to be the mall, practical, I'll computers the internet. I'm with just using zero-some. Once you can send any number any message around the world. It's still is a pretty weird idea things that seem with I get to seem less would the more time you spend with them. I like things when they make my mind bend. If I feel like my brain is kind of exploding out of my skull. Then I feel like I'm making some progress. And that's why I really personally find Infinity cool because they're mind-bending things like that maybe one plus Infinity is actually different from Infinity plus one a maybe they're actually different sizes of Infinity. So that there's the smallest indeffinitely, but then there's a big Infinity and then as an even bigger Infinity, and you can keep going infinitely. So that there are infinitely many bigger and bigger Infinity's bar. The my brench, boating. Those of weird things all why I really love maths because it's a place where I can explore things, but don't really happen in the real world. The real world is very important. And it's why we live our lives. I really like the world of ideas. It doesn't matter which ones cooler they're both so interesting so elaborate, they're different and they're beautiful math is messy. But yet in its meshing is a beautiful elegance mass really is able to take you away. That's what I love about it. Dr Dez it. How way? Walks in. Head. From the Senate. Stretching of the class. Has finished bosses. Through the sliding gloves stove. Get my in finit key car. It's four. Flow. I'm must be. What's thirteen Penn? Kick five with the flip over of six eighty four Thai. Yeah. To take the question. My share. Sure. Thank you so much listening. I'm type the show was produced by Veronica Simmons, and has matern our digital producer is Livia Pasquarelli guests were Dr James grime, and Dr Cina Chang guys are also thanks to crystal Doohan for the editors the theme music is by the legendary Johnny spent and also thanks to dry throat me writer for the Finnity. So next time on tire Twi climate chain. Do you ever lose hope? Yes. Till next. I'm tie keep asking why? For more CBC podcasts. Goto CBC dot CA slash podcasts.

Dr James grime James zero Infinity Camby Hof CBC news marijuana Jamie reporter Joe Firestone Manila Merano INFINITI Hilbert hotel Art Institute of Chicago James grind Gina accountant Dr Dez Veronica Simmons
FAQs & Merry Christmas!

The Essential Oil Revolution

12:58 min | 1 year ago

FAQs & Merry Christmas!

"He everyone Samantha Leigh right here. Just wanted to pop on this week and let you all know that we are not going to be releasing a new episode this week. I'm gonna take a little bit of time off this holiday season to just be with my family, but I did want to pop on and take this opportunity instead of releasing a new episode. I thought I'd pop on here and simply say merry Christmas. Happy holidays and answer. A few frequently asked listener questions, I have five questions here that are most frequently asked to me via Email or on our Facebook page. So if you have any of these questions now, you'll know the answer the first question is this is sort of a young living question. What is the difference between young living vitality oils and young living non vitality oils or just regular oils? So if you are a young living member, you know, what I'm talking about. If you're not you might be a little confused but young living essential oils. They label a central. Oils, either as us internally like you can consume this oil as a, you know, supplement like lavender vitality, for example, or as a cosmetic as in. You can use this oil topically as in regular, lavender. Now this came about a couple years ago because the FDA had a huge sort of crackdown as they call it on young living central oils, and the FDA basically said, hey, young living youth been labeling this one product as a consumable and as a cosmetic. So essentially, you're calling something a food or supplement and a topical cosmetic thing. And hey, we don't really have anything like that in our category. Check box thing. So you can't do that. We need you to choose whether your product is either consumable or topical or cosmetic. So young living was like well darn I mean, so many of our oils can be used internally AMT topically. What do we do? Well, how about we create a vitality line? So this lets people know that if something is labeled as a vitality oil is totally cool to use it as a consumable use it internally. But then if that same oil can also be used topically, let's just put that in another bottle in don't put the word vitality on it. So if you look at Limon vitality, for example, on the back, it'll sate us internally, you know, put in a capsule or put it in your TV when I talk on the show here because I am a young living distributor. I'm supposed to follow those same FDA guidelines. So if I talk about using peppermint in my brownies, I am supposed to say, peppermint vitality. Because if I talk about just regular peppermint. I'm only supposed to talk about how you can use that topically. So they are identical oils in the bottle so back to the limit as an example, limit vitality. Essential oil. You can use it internally. You can put it in your cookies, you can put it in your tea. You can put it in your water, lemon not vitality or just regular lemon oil. You can put it over your liver for liver support just mix it with some coconut oil slap it on your belly. Whatever you wanna do topically both are identical oils. So you are happy to use them. However, you want young living's only allowed to tell you to use them in one of those ways. So all the vitality oils, it's kind of cool. Because now if you wanna see if an oil is safe to use internally just go on the young will be website. See if it has a vitality version, if it has a vitality version than absolutely totally safe to take internally in small quantities. Of course, he's common sense. If there's not a tally option that doesn't necessarily mean it's not safe to take internally. It just might probably mean that it's not very commonly taken internally or that it is unsafe. But you can do some further research from there if you wanna. Kind of understand the safety of using oils internally if they're not labeled by Taliban. So I hope that answers that question. I hope that makes sense next question. Okay. I get this one a lot. And I I love you guys so much for asking this question. But it's it kind of puts me in a tricky spot. So the question is basically, I have a lot of you listeners writing in saying, basically, hey Sam I signed up with young living through a friend of mine who introduced me to young Levin. So I bought my starter kit. But my friend is not really into the business side. She's not a business builder. She's not a business coach, I have no resources to help me start my young living business. Can I switch to your team? Can I switch and make you my sponsor? So the short answer here is no when you sign up for young living when you create your account you are asked for a sponsor number. That is whoever introduced to you too young living. You put that sponsor number in. And that is who your sponsor is for life. If you don't put a sponsor number in young, your what's called, a an orphan and young living will assign you a sponsor usually based on your location. So if you're in young living, you use, you know, a friend's member number to sign up you just need to stay where you're at n less your account has been inactive for over a year. If you have been inactive, you haven't ordered anything for over a year. Then you're welcome to switch to you know, wherever you want to be if you haven't ordered anything for six months or more like between that six and twelve month. Mark, I believe there is a way that you can change your sponsor, but you have to like pay processing fee or something like that. So and then other than that you have to get like this up line approval document sign and. Pay thirty five dollars to switch. And it's just kind of it's it's not very easy. And it's also frowned upon. You know, whoever introduced you to young living young living wants you to stay there. And they want you to reach reach out to your up line who, you know, there's probably someone above your friend, whoever they signed up with that is doing the business. So you can call young living and say, hey, can you just tell me who my closest silver is or my closest diamond is and because I want to get some extra support there. So I hope that that makes sense. Now, if you are not a young living member yet, and you do want to join my team, whether you want to build a business with young living or you just want like some really great support using your oils. Of course, love to have you on our team. We have so much fun. I often have people write me later that. And they say, oh, I've been listening to your podcast, and I signed up with, you know, young living. But I didn't even know you could be my sponsor or they'll say and this one breaks my. Art. They're like I thought you were too busy to be sponsor, which is so sweet. But no, I'm not too busy. This is what I do. This is my job. This is what I do full time. I have a team a huge team that I work with and I often will buddy up new members with one of my established leaders. So that you have even more support on your journey. So if you want to join our team go for it, you can find out how to sign up with me through the podcast website revolution oils, podcast dot com. You just need my member number which is one nine nine three two three. Oh, so if you're not a young living member yet wanting to get started. Absolutely, join the tribe. We have so much fun. If you're not on my team, and you're trying to build your business, and you need extra resources for that. That's why I've created the revolution oils business boot camp. It's a free thirty day boot camp out there for anyone. You can also purchase my classroom in a box file folder. If you're on my team, you get this for free. But if you're not and you wanna see what scripts I use on what tips I give to my new builders. It's all in that digital file folder. You can find that at your classroom in a box dot com. And I know I've said this recently, but I promise you guys I am going to start making the revolution oils. Business coaching podcasts and more on my priority list. I want to start putting more episodes out there on the coaching podcast. So that's sort of an ongoing coaching podcast. Sophie, don't have great up line support. Tune in there hoping to get more episodes out there soon after the new year, especially when things settle back down. All right. The third frequently asked question, I get from people is hey Sam where do I find the old show notes? So starting around episode of would I think seventy six or eighty something like that? We changed our website to revolution oils, podcast dot com. And that's where you can find the show notes, which are like. The episode notes. It has the little media player on there where you can actually listen to the episode through the website, look at all the links and the resources that were talked about in that episode. You can find that days. DIY dugout recipe all that jazz. So that new website is revolution oils, podcast dot com. The old website was revolution oils dot com slash podcast. So a little difference there. So if you're looking for the older show notes, I believe about episodes zero through like seventy are on the old website revolution, oils dot com slash podcast, looking for anything further than that. Find it at revolution oils, podcasts dot com. I do have an intern working with us in the office now, and that's one of her jobs right now is to actually transfer some of those old episodes over to the new website. So hopefully one day all of the show notes will live just under the new website. But for now, you can find them on the old site there. The fourth question is a super easy one in. That's just people asking. Hey, how do I support your show? And how do I find a list of all your old sponsor like if you heard a commercial on I show, and you're like, oh, yeah. That broadcom buzney that SAM's always talking about what are they called? Well, you can find all of our sponsors listed out on our website. And that's just at revolution oils, podcasts dot com slash sponsors. So find it there. If you can't remember that just go to the podcast a homepage in there's a tab that says sponsors or support something like that. So you can find it all there. And then the last question, I get is usually just personal questions. Like, hey Sam where are you from how long have you been doing oils that kind of thing? So there's not too much to know about me that I haven't already shared on the show, but I do live in Boone North Carolina. It's a very small mountain town in the Appalachian mountains of North Carolina. If anyone's a big college football. Fan. I live near Appalachian state university where we were the three time. State champion. No, not state, the big one, national champions. I'm not a football person. Sorry, guys. And that's where I live. I've lived here for almost ten years. But it grew up on the beach of Wilmington, North Carolina. And I went to college in Chicago at the school of the Art Institute of Chicago for a while where I went to college for about three months dropped out. How to midlife me mid teen crisis met my future husband, moved to New York moved back to Chicago went out west drug my now husband back to or to Boone North Carolina. Where our truck broke down. And we've lived here ten years since. So that's basically my story in a nutshell. We have two amazing beautiful kids August and Layla August is six Leila's four. And what else I've been doing essential oils for about four years? Now, the podcast is actually this is art. Three year anniversary right around right around today. You guys it's pretty exciting. We've been doing the podcast for three years. We release a new episode every week and it's a blast. I just love it. I love doing this. I love being here every week and sharing information with you guys being on this health journey you all inspire me to be a better person every day. So I love you guys. Thank you so much for tuning in. I hope that this helped answer some of your frequently asked questions if you have any other questions, I didn't answer on today's show. Just Email us at info at revolution oils, podcasts dot com. All right, guys. Merry christmas. We will see you in the new year.

Sam I FDA Facebook North Carolina Samantha Leigh football Boone North Carolina Chicago broadcom Appalachian state university intern Mark Art Institute of Chicago Wilmington Layla August Sophie Levin New York
A Mathematician's Manifesto For Rethinking Gender

Short Wave

15:08 min | Last week

A Mathematician's Manifesto For Rethinking Gender

"Hey everybody matty Safai here and Emily Kwong. Alright Kwong, are you ready for some real talk right now a little little heart heart it's my favorite kind of talk. Yes. So, just like all of you, the short team is figuring out how to make our way through this pandemic and making a daily science podcast is hard making one in the middle of a pandemic from our home closets and blanket forts is even harder. So in order to continue bringing you the best possible show, we're making a few changes over here starting this week. We'll. Be dropping episodes in your feeds four times a week. Instead of five, we plan to be back to five days a week. Soon, you'll still get the pandemic coverage you need and we promise. We'll still get weird and silly with you on a regular basis in the name of science of course, because we don't know any other way of where we can't really help it. Is. True. This will allow us to take care of ourselves a little bit better and keep doing what we love most bringing you this show. Thank you all for understanding. We knew you would. Okay ready for the show Oh. Yeah it's a good one. You're listening to shortwave. From NPR. So, one of the things I most remember from elementary school is all of the math word problems. You know what? I'm talking about the ones that say things like, okay. If Alex has seven cookies and Sam has read cookies, how many cookies do we need to give some to make sure they have the same number of cookies? I would get so excited every time I got the right answer to one of these problems. Anyway. One is actually pretty easy. Well, we could give four more cookies to Sam all we could take four cookies from Alex. We could make Alex give to cookies to Sam in any of these four Eugenia Chang, a mathematician. The better answer is actually to ask a different question. What if some doesn't even like cookies and would rob have pools? See Eugeniusz Studies. This kind of high level math never heard of to be honest called category theory. Category Theory is very abstract pods of math and so abstract that sometimes even all the pure mathematicians think it's too abstract. But for me, it's about the core of what makes math tick and because math for me is about the core of what makes the tick cats theories like the cool coal of what makes the wilted because category theory is about understanding why things work the way they do intrinsic characteristics don't really matter what matters is how things relate to one another it started in around the middle of the twentieth century and in A. Way It's only very small small new idea but like great ideas, a small shift in perspective opens up an absolutely vast array of possibilities because it's like turning on a light, which is why in her most recent book x Plus Y, Eugenia uses category to turn the light on something that I might seem surprising for a mathematician something deeply ingrained in many of us gender it suddenly eliminates everything and you can see all sorts of things you didn't see before and so in the same way that we stop focusing on cookies which not everyone wants. What happens if we also stop focusing on gender constructs which might not be relevant. Category theory invites us to stop asking if men women and non binary people are equal and to look beyond the single dimension, of gender. Today on the show in abstract. Mathematicians approach to rethinking gender. I'm Emily Quang and you're listening to shortwave from NPR. Okay. So back to Alex Sam and their cookie dilemma, the Metaphor serves a larger point that are thinking about gender is one dimensional and doesn't characterize how people really are. Even when we think about gender as a spectrum between masculine and feminine behavior that's already a problem because it makes it sound wrong. So it makes it sound like menace supposed masculine and if a woman is masculine, then she somehow going against her nature and then if men are seen as being feminine, that sounds like that's something wrong with them as well. Whereas in fact, there's no reason to associate. Gender with character and everyone can be all sorts of things if type of character and behavior is something we valley. Then why wouldn't we value it from everybody of all genders? So Eugenia started to think about character as a dimension separate from gender asking how much our society value certain character traits over others, and she came up with her own way of categorizing behavior. One that deals with two new traits. She invented ingress give and Congress have, and the idea is that ingress of traits are more about individualism and single track been king and. Congress is about bringing things together, bringing people together, bringing ideas together and thinking about broader communities and society as a whole rather than individuals, and it's not trying to be a new dichotomy. It's trying to be a wave thinking about behavior and having woods because if you don't have woods to think about things, then it's much harder to think about them reflecting on her own career Eugenia realized early on that, she forced herself to be engrossing. That is individualistic and single-minded and she did land prestigious jobs in academia I'm ashamed of it now. Because I don't like that kind of behavior but I definitely. Latched onto the idea that in academia, it's important to make kind of aggressive arguments and show how clever you are and be able to talk yourself up because ultimately she says, the academic environment was inconclusive and relentless. It was such a kind of ongoing treadmill in my tenure job because it was a very all year thing and I remember one August getting ready for the new academic year and feel like had been about one minute since the previous academic year and I thought Oh just going to be like this until I retire now and then. Honestly, what happened was I started looking around at the people around me who were close to retirement. and. I thought. Oh. No, I'm becoming like them. And I didn't want to. And I thought I have to get out of this before I become sort of fossilized into this kind of behavior that I don't like. So she left the traditional tenure track and became a professor at the School of the Art Institute of Chicago as their scientists in residence. That's right. Eugenia began to teach math to art students. She wanted to make math more relevant to them, and then came the two thousand sixteen election a moment that brought issues of gender and race into focus and it was like I flipped a switch in my mind and I thought you know silence is complicity if I don't talk about these things and. Am I complicit with these things it's too important not to talk about it and I thought actually every academic discipline is there to help us understand the world and what is the most important thing in the world that we need to understand right now it is this social and political situation that we're getting ourselves into, and so then I felt like I really had to talk about it all the time. So the question for her became, how do I get my students to unlearn all of the aggressive competitive answered driven math they've taught for so many years especially when there are so many concepts to learn and so little time. And Eugenia. kind of figured it out by making sure that everyone in the class learns together AK congressionally take for example, this hands on activities she does to teach them about platonic solids. Am I don't tell them what the platonic solids all, and so in case you can't remember or never knew the platonic solids are the three dimensional shapes that have maximally symmetric and some of. Them are built out two triangles, and so they sit down and they build things together and they talk to each other while they're doing it and it's therapeutic because it's cutting and sticking visa, and some of them build platonic solids and some of them build things that are almost platonic solids but have a lot of symmetry on quite Tony solids and then someone will build a dinosaur. Is that You build a down right field a dinosaur. then. What you discover is that Pentagon's are really terrible shape for building a dinosaur off whereas triangles are fantastic shape for building a dinosaur you can build practically anything with triangles and that's profound mathematical fat try and relations are really really important tool in high level research and so whatever they do they will learn something and when we pool everything we've built as close. We will get all of these things even if not every. Individual person built every individual platonic solid, and so that is one way that we can do congressional explorations than sitting down and sort of memorizing. These are the platonic solids visa, the properties they have. This one is called this and it has many faces many this many edges and her villainous classes. Yeah. In this way, like you're holding the dinosaur and you're discovering something together about platonic solids through this joint exercise right and. In her class, she uses concepts from math to probe the relationships between people and the thing about aggressive classroom that students are able to probe back ask how all of this applies to say different types of privilege in society, and that moment was something that my i would never have come up with that idea about privilege and factors of numbers and the geometry. If my student had asked me these questions push things further. And further because when you teach in Congress I think it's important to find what motivates the students and tap into that. When you're teaching Ingram you try and bend their will to yours to try and show them. This is the right way of thinking. This is the way instead of meeting them somewhere, which is Congress if way the Keever Eugenia is to make Matha process of mutual discovery one that's truly inclusive and not competitive. Her classroom is a place where in the same breath that students are learning math they can have frank conversations about the role of race and gender in society if you ask them to stop thinking about it when they come into the math classroom, then they won't be interested in anything I say, and the people who think that we should stop talking about in math for them. It's not part of their life all the time because they're part of a group that doesn't have to think about it all. The time and so that's the reaction I get mostly it's amazement from people who really really resonate with these issues but you might be wondering what about people who are more aggressive? Aren't they getting lost in the shuffle some people worry the I'm now making it known inclusive towards ingress if people and I've had this query sometimes it's an interesting one because the thing is I do think I do value Congress behavior more than ingress behavior but if you think of it as for example in aggressive people. obstructive towards others in the classroom. So then what we're saying is that I am not going to be inclusive towards obstructive behaviour in the classroom and I think that's okay. I don't feel any reason to include obstructive behaviour in my classroom and so inclusivity is subtle. I don't think it means that we need to include all things. I don't need to include violence in my classroom I don't need to include. Intellectual violence and I don't need to include behavior that obstructs squashes of either and I don't think that means I'm not being inclusive I think it means that I'm valuing things are helpful to our community and I am not valuing things are obstructive to our community Eugenia. We have talked about everything this conversation I'm just I'm just I showed up. We're GONNA talk about math and we're talking about. We're talking about relationships are talking about how we learn we teach. How communities work I mean it's just it kind of encompasses. So much of actually what's really going on right now in society around recent gender too so I guess the only other thing I want to ask you is. What is like the single? Most Powerful thing that listeners can take to become more aggressive in their lives and create congressional situations at home. In Yeah. I think. To notice when we're fabricating competition that doesn't have to be a competition. Competition comes from scarcity of resources and we do not live in a world of scarcity of resources. At the moment it has been fabricated to have guessed resources, and then we fabricate competitions like music competitions. Music of all things is a thing that doesn't need to be a competition education doesn't need to be a competition because what we're learning is understanding knowledge and wisdom, and there isn't a limit on that resource. We can all have it. We don't have to prevent somebody else from having to have ourselves and conversations end up being competitive where the idea seems to be to win an argument was why we trying to win an argument and if we try and iron out. Contrived Ingram of situations in individual personal interruptions. Then we can build up from that because the world is made of little interactions that build up into big ones and I really think that even if we start small, we can build up to change the whole wall to be a better place for everybody of all genders. Eugenie as latest book plus why Mathematicians Manifesto for rethinking gender is out now. Today's episode was produced by Rebecca, Ramirez she and I fact checked it and lay gave it a masterful at it. I'm Emily Quang and this is short wave from NPR.

Eugenia Chang Alex Sam NPR Congress Emily Quang Emily Kwong Ingram A. Way matty Safai Keever Eugenia woods professor Eugenie School of the Art Institute of Congress Pentagon Tony AK Eugenia. Rebecca
10 Trivia Questions on Art History

Trivia With Budds

09:39 min | 1 year ago

10 Trivia Questions on Art History

"It's eleven questions on art history. Let's see how many of these paintings and painters. You know, this is trivia with buds. Be and welcome to another episode of the trivia with buds podcast. I'm your host. Ryan buds. Thanks so much for checking out my show. You like trivia, you're in the right place. We do this every single day, and you can hit subscribe on your device to get new episodes delivered to that device daily. There's over four hundred other episodes of the show, you can check out. So I'd love to go back and check out some great random episodes like one on US presidents when I'm back to the future. One on weird. Alan parody songs and artists one on exercising and exercise equipment one on architecture one on conspiracy theories and one on Super Mario brothers. Those are just some off the top of my head that might tickle your fancy. That's a weird phrase. Right. Tickle your fancy sends a little invasive, but today's episode art history. I remember we used to have an art history class in grade school. I think it was called art appreciation and a really really short lady with curly hair and glasses used to come. And she would set up. Laminated posters of different paintings. And she would tell us about these different styles like pointillism and. Impressionism and all these different things. And I remember a little bit of it. And I remember learning some famous paintings and artists names and other than that like it was like fourth and fifth grade. I think I don't think I had one exposure to anything art history related and that was like a bonus program that I'm sure they had to pay this lady to come in and do this like sixty bucks or something to do that at different schools. I imagine and it was probably poorly funded, and it probably doesn't exist anymore. But it was that was my only exposure to it even in college. I don't remember any art history of any kind that was thrown at you unless you were like an art history major, but it's kind of sad because I didn't I don't know a lot of the questions that I'm asking on this episode, and I feel like I should know more than I do. But maybe you do you grew up in a different part of time or geography, and you had a lot of art history where you grew up. So that would be a fun one for you. Today's episode. And if you don't know this stuff, it's always fun to kind of learn it, and then repeat those facts to people. So it sounds like, you know, some stuff, right? That's what I did my whole life, just repeating facts. Here's a fun episode on art history. It wasn't recorded live. It's just me asking you the questions, and we're going to jump into those eleven questions on art history right now. Here we go. Question. Number one who painted the famous painting called the Nightwatch are Pistilli number one who painted the famous painting the night watch. Question. Number two, what art movement was Pablo Picasso. A pioneer of question for to what? Art movement was Pablo Picasso. A pioneer of. Question. Number three in November two thousand thirteen artist. Jeff Koons sold a painting for fifty eight point four million dollars was it called balloon dog balloon cat balloon sheep or balloon bear number three and of ever twenty thirteen Jeff Koons sold a painting for fifty eight million was called balloon dog, cat, sheep or bear. Question number four Edward munch painted. What piece that Wes craven would approve of a fun question. Number four advert munch painted. What piece that west craven would approve of number four. Question number five ferris bueller and his pales. Visit the Art Institute in what city in the hit eighties movie number five and eighties movie. Ferris Buehler's day off him and his pals. Visit the Art Institute in what city number five. Number six. Jasper Johns is an American artist known for painting what wave -able items number six. Jasper Johns is an American artist known for painting what wave -able items. Number seven, James McNeill, Whistler's arrangement in grey and black number one is better known by what other name number seven, James McNeill. Whistler arrangement in grey and black number one is better known by what other name. Question. Number eight, what nineteen forty two oil on canvas painting by Edward hopper portrays people in downtown diner late at night as viewed through the diners large glass window, number eight. What's the name of that famous diner painting from nineteen forty two. Question number nine any color. Plus gray is known as what four letter result number nine any color. Plus gray is known as what four letter result. Question number ten Claude Monet's father wanted him to be a what was it? A postmaster a singer a grocer for a banker was it a singer postmaster grocer or banker what do you think for Claude Monet's father's aspirations for his son? And the bonus question this episode was to draw the happiest face that you can imagine in my life, trivia nights, my favorite, one got two points. If you send me a doodle of the happiest face, you can imagine I will pick my favorite and send you something very cool in the mail. So Email me or tag me in a picture on social media at Ryan buds or Email. Ryan buds gmaiLcom with your happiest face. You can imagine. And I might send you something cool. All right. Those are your questions for the art history round for today's episode. We'll be right back in a second with the answers. We're back with the answers to art history. Let's see how you did on this artsy. Fartsy episode number one who painted the famous painting the night watch. That was Rembrandt Rembrandt was the answer. Number two, what art movement was Pablo Picasso pioneer of cubism. That's what I'm looking for cubism number two number three in November twenty thirteen Jeff Koons sold that fifty eight million dollar painting called balloon dog. Can you imagine anything being worth sixty million dollars that somebody painted? I can't but somebody paid it balloon dog number four advert munch painted. What piece that Wes craven would approve of the late. Great west graven. I was looking for the scream it's the guy like down by the dock with the cool colors holding his face, screaming, number five fairus. Bueller and his pales. Visit the Art Institute of Chicago. That's right. The Art Institute of Chicago, that's a fun scene and a fun place to go. Visit number six. Jasper Johns is an American artist known for painting what wave -able. Dems the answer was flags you could wave a flag in the air rights and Jasper Johns he paints those number seven, James McNeill, Whistler's arrangement in grey and black number one is better known as Whistler's mother sitting in a chair. I believe Whistler's mother number eight nineteen forty two Edward hopper. Oil on canvas painting. It's the downtown diner through the glass window. It's called Nighthawks Nighthawks, which I think is an eighties movie number nine any color. Plus gray is known as what four letter result, the answer was tone to yo. And e that was the definition on an art website. I saw said any color, plus gray. We're talking about tone number ten Claude Monet's father one team to be a postmaster singer grosser or banker he want him to be a grocer. That's a very specific thing where you like I want you to work at Ralph's or jewel or where ever you get groceries. Publix trying to think of the different regional grocery stores wherever you're listening. Luke McKay, I needed to tell me what grocery stores, they have in Australia because I have no idea and the bonus for two points on the back of your answer sheet or at home, you could draw your happiest face. And again that one is subjective. So you can just send it to me. I will pick my favorite one send you something cool in the mail. You can tag me in your little doodle the happiest face. You can imagine Ryan buds on all social media or you can Email. Ryan buds g mail dot com. All right, guys. That was today's episode on art history. There's a ton of other episodes, really go back and check out and I'd love for you to leave me, and I tunes review. Always looking for more of those. I think we have one hundred seven of those right now if you play live tributes may love yelp review like ninety six of those so anything get me over one hundred on yelp would be awesome in the more details. The better if you haven't event coming up you need to host for trivial buds dot com. Click on contact hit hit me up in the little box and say what you need. I'll make sure I'm there, and we could do it. And it's tons of fun. Thank you so much for listening. Thanks for telling a friend. We'll see. You tomorrow for more trivia with me. Cheers.

Ryan buds Jasper Johns Pablo Picasso Jeff Koons Claude Monet west craven James McNeill Art Institute of Chicago Art Institute Edward hopper Whistler bueller Edward munch US yelp Whistler Alan Ferris Buehler