39 Burst results for "Whatsapp"
Fresh update on "whatsapp" discussed on PR & Law
"I understand there's been some significant attrition but the reality is and we know how tech works right. It's that people want to be on the platform that most people are on so if the majority of individuals stick with. What's app i mean. Isn't that just going to remain the defacto app. That people are going to use. I you know. I was actually thinking about this practically as well right. I mean my family. We have what's whatsapp channel that we share photos and communication with and i was thinking to myself. Well i've migrated over to signal. I'd love to get them over to signal as well. But then i've got it now. Try and effectively be a spokesperson for this app of una. No hey it does all the things that whatsapp does on get it. You know none of your other friends are on it. All but blah blah blah but just just do it because of data and i think sadly the reality is at the end of the day that people will continue to go where everybody else is even if it's to their detriment from a privacy perspective i mean. The only generally agree with that. I think facebook's entire business rests on that premise. In fact because right fair point they yeah. They're counting on people not doing it. I mean they know that it's difficult to switch and to move people to another social network because the more people that are are brought into a social network the harder it is to leave right like once. Everyone's there and there's almost two billion people on. I mean it's a third of the world almost so yeah it's it's not going to be easy to switch. I guess i mean what. I'm hoping for is sort of a consumer advocate would be that people do care. Now i think in the past it was sort of just something. They accepted in order to to communicate via tely with their friends and family and colleagues. But i think. I hope now that this does matter to people and this little effort to download another app and sign in is worthwhile to people. And i think you and you're probably right. I think a lot of people that won't be worthwhile. And i i want to know though too. Like like whatsapp isn't and everywhere First of all there's two billion accounts according to the latest figures. They're not being used. So i would like to know sort of once apps what. We call emmy monthly active users because different parts of the world have different apps. That are strong. So what's that for. Instance is not particularly strong in the united states. So it means a lot less there. But it's very strong in asia and it's quite in canada as well so there are different it strong in different markets. It's strong all of them so for some people..
WhatsApp extends 'confusing' update deadline
"Saying it's going to delay a controversial plan Privacy update as users threatened to stop using the Facebook own messaging service, The New York Times reports WHATS APP had notified users of the minor changes, but misinformation led some to believe that the company would be able to read people's conversations and other personal data. Privacy Update has been pushed back from February, 82 may 15th to give users more time to review what it planned to do.
Fresh update on "whatsapp" discussed on PR & Law
"Facebook runs. What's up Because if you if you look at the way that the app itself is sort of you know the logo the way that it functions. There's no. there's no facebook logo. there's no facebook coloring. There's there's nothing there that unless you're sort of poke around Or were inclined to sort of research these things that would lead you to believe that. This was a facebook product that you were using and obviously people feel very strongly about facebook one way or the other and i suspect that for the first time had inadvertently What's app has brought to the attention of its users that this is a facebook product. And i imagine that the attrition has a lot to do with that as well. Yeah i think so. And i can't wait to see numbers on that. I think we will get numbers on that At some point when when the surveys are done about why this change was made or why they moved to a different platform. But you and i mean you make a good point here because instagram is in the same boat right like it's also owned by facebook and a lot of people are not aware of that. And i think aside from this subject in terms of you know facebook's ownership there's something else that is different now which is just public is a lot more aware of the importance of this data like if you go back a few years even before two thousand sixteen which i kind of market the turning point. Because that's when cambridge politica you know the the big Election scandal happens where they were harvesting data from facebook before then there wasn't really widespread recognition of what data collection means. And what it's being used for. And now now there is like you're right people see facebook as untrustworthy by and large. But they're also aware of their own data. Because there's been a number of hacks you know a very high profile organizations including government ones in where their data has been leaked and they've had to go in and changed eight or change passwords or or update things and so this matters and so we're in this time where when what's absence this out..
Brooklyn Site Mobbed After Fake Post Claims Vaccines Up For Grabs in New York
"Facebook and WhatsApp alleged that more than 410 soon to expire. Covert 19 vaccines were up for grabs last night for anyone over 18 at the Brooklyn Army Terminal. Problem was, it wasn't true. Rush led City Hall to dispatch workers to disperse the crowd that showed up, according to a spokesman for Mayor De Blasio, who added that the notification did not come from NYC dot Gove At this time, only frontline workers and those over 65 are eligible to get the vaccine in New York state. Meanwhile, New York
Fresh update on "whatsapp" discussed on PR & Law
"People began looking around for an alternative There's a lot of negative posts on reddit and across the internet about this and people were angry at what's out for changing these terms and working more closely with facebook and then be trying to find something to replace it and i think it's fair to say you and you kinda fell into this boat. It's correct i mean. What did you go about doing besides reading all the legal jargon in light of this message well i suppose this is probably the simplest answer to your question and that is that i am one of the newest members of the signal app So so that. That was what i did. And i knew i can tell you I knew i had never even heard of signal prior to To last week. So i'm hey i guess that's great for for their company. But yeah i immediately did what i guess. A lot of other people were doing was. I started looking for an alternative. Yeah and you know. This fascinates me. Actually 'cause i always wonder how do people settle like. How does the group settled on this app. Or this service. I i think it happened. At the beginning of the pandemic zoom became the de facto videoconferencing app. Actually there's many out there. I'm not sure why zoom was the one that is now used by everyone went across the social networks and late night television and became the the one and i feel like signal is kind of in that position right now as people leave. What's up and there are other solutions out. There i know telegram was one that people are moving to Telegram also was big in hong kong. I mean after the protest took a turn in two thousand nineteen people were worried about using facebook products then and telegram just exploded because you get an alert any anytime. One of your contacts joins telegram and my phone was popping every day with people. I know adding telegram so a telegram and signal or both are both good signal is really the most i would say. It's that got the strongest encryption insecurity around it it is. It is a very good app to use. If you're are concerned about security and privacy and things like that but anyway i mean back to the situation. I mean people really did leave. What's up in droves. At least that's what the data is showing so many people signed up for signal. Un it crashed on friday. It couldn't support them for a time. So it's a it's a big change and facebook finally came out or sorry. What's app came out on saturday and they posted a blog post. That was was. I want us term conciliatory. It was very polite. Basically saying that its previous message. Caused some confusion and that nothing is changing in terms of how it manages chat data and that is what people were most concerned about is that what's app is going to be looking at your at your data and keeping that information and then using that to to to market to and they reiterated again that this is really around whatsapp business and facebook business. And that's what the changes a four and so..
Out With The Old - SolarWinds Smoking Gun, Signal Influx of WhatsApp Users, Male Chastity Cage
"It's time for security now the show we cover your security online your privacy. How things work out bad. It's getting how good it's getting all that stuff with this guy right here. Live long and prosper steve gibson. I got put the thumb outright. That's the key bomb out can't do do i have a show for today. What's the topic This well the title is with the old which was inspired after i got back into spin. Right sixes source code and realized how much crap was in there to deal with that the things that we were having to deal with back in the nineteen eighties and nineties at the beginning of the pc era. And so i. It was just going to be kind of like you know. I've just mentioned it. But i just think our listeners will really find that interesting. Old-timers will be going on. I remember when dos had a thirty three and a half megabyte partition size limit. Believe it or not and and you know younger viewers are gonna be like what so anyway. We've got so much talk about. We have critical updates for fire. Fox and all of the chromium based browsers and a potentially unwelcome but reversible. Change coming to fire fox We're going to look at an another new tactic. Being employed by the ransomware gangs or at least one of them an update on ransomware profitability. A bogus seeming announcement from intel. The which was made yesterday during their cas announcement of the eleventh gen. core processors. I i well. I did dig in to see if there is anything to it and bow. Oh i gotta be left with no question about how i feel and we have the i use on this. Podcast of the term tele dildo onyx. Tell donna deal. Get it right until donald bill tell anybody knows ask that we have some residual solar wins news the formation of a security screw up crisis management group news of the inevitable attacks on zych sell users the mass exodus from what's app following their plans to force all meta data sharing for users of their platform at quick sifi note about the expanse and then as i said inspired by the amazing amount of old code. I have rediscovered inside spin right. I'm gonna take our listeners back to the roaring eighties with a look. At how far we've come from dos. Three point three. So oh and we do have a picture of the week for the ages so good it came without caption cheeto.
Fresh update on "whatsapp" discussed on The Guilty Feminist
"A feminist. But i'm having my fuck. He goes for a disruptive that done on and on and on and now i can hear the steam gene coming in now. I know we're just gonna from a variety of kitchens and bedrooms via zoom. The spontaneity shop presents the guilty with me. I'd guess co host with a very special guests francis lumbergh merry mentioned justin taylor sales talking about defending the environment old. This custom which weeks for our noble goals is twenty percent. Feminist postseason insecurities with john the mine. I'm differences white with ms felicity boredom talking about environmental defend swoon ward co-pilot oh mine anew lovely itself now i hit hell online that you have got covid. Nineteen i have the rona milord on day. Nine i think do you know how to do. I got it from my son's nursery hub of which a staying open in the hard lockdown so that same unusual. We've basically been living a hard lockdown since march We have honorable family members so we have seen in the year in the uk. We have pain to three people's houses back in september three different people's houses one of them family on my fortieth birthday. I went to an outdoor cafe. We will masks and freaked out the whole time so it's been very upsetting that out. Necessary closed a week earlier. Things i said one of the boys is got an easing your son's class so he has to isolate then we found out some of the staff had it and then we found out the kids headed and other parents so we got tested before christmas. Got a negative test. Had christmas in two days. After christmas like really fluey. But because i had the test and like isn't a covid though sister called window buddies wake awake and then my husband's back went and leg went and he's in spasm awake and no painkillers worked. So i have been looking after my husband and my baby when my husband is being like sleeping on the floor. He's in so much pain he was going to get an mri scan and thought just to be on the science side. I'll go and get a cova test was like i would love to get out of the house so we did a dry throat at. It's like magazine instead of just in your mouth. And the knicks we got the wheel positive so we just We've had a week from hell. Dave and how delightful it is to be. It's a hard luck. Life folding hub. For me now my knees popping. Sorry you kind hear that listeners. But it wasn't very good. I hear you grace patriot. You're in lockdown in leicester alive unlocked whatsoever do in leicester. We barely come out of looked analyst. Yang come out. how are you has world. has it a figures. It's pretty bad up even resolving time. What well not the whole time because identify head about this deb but we it was. It was right have christmas. Everything counseled on christmas day because the current ours is christian. Now you can still get community question. did you. Not even just flawed groups that can make up to fifteen people and one of them. I involved with and i'm just like a not going guys. No i'm not. I mean i can. Now i have covid bodies nine. the night deserve it. I'm taking out. I think. I'm just. I'm just looking down until in fact say too because the strain on the nfl. This is so appalling that we can't afford it. We just can't afford it so anyone who comes near to stay home and that's muslims. Nets may on many many moons. I am lucky one. That can stay home. Frankly people that yeah well. My sister had it just before christmas in them. She had child voted him from school. She's a teacher you know. I think the the teachers have just. You can cut this if you want. But i think it's crazy. And i think scandal a scandal that the no even even now than not talking about making teachers and school stuff one of the first groups vaccinated. I just think these used is basically counting photo. it's scandal why i'm learning here is don't have a child. I'm learning that we thought that's a good lesson. Because what is it in this flat but nor have we had a small person in and out and all about it's hard. It's hard with children. I absolutely see it. I see the strain on families as well having to have children. When you have a child to deal is the state will take it for most of its life man's day we've decided it was a mistake but he won't go back east doesn't treat me more head. Grow has grown much too much. My belly is grind. It looks like there's probably ruined but the doors very much shrunk. You've pulled up the drawbridge breaks it. That's right. I mean most newborn babies about size of a loaf of bread and getting out of a hole size. Tampon i mentioned is a challenge yet. And it's it's foam bread to. It's all breast bread than than it's it's a salad to croft. Christiane creates on consistent. It's tough on the soft palate. That guy yeah. I don't know my vaginal region was made for africa. Departure spot the prisons in host. Not this one is my rhyming. Yea i'll be with one i want. Can we bought her on a musical for cat for culture departure nice an eyesafe for catcher. Let's go the whole thing helping authority. This is writing itself. Don't think there's much more work to do. This is the most creative weeks among thing. It's the lockdown but a week genius high being in lockdown. Isn't that where you think everything you come up with amazing and should be musical then. The next day you go none of the next year. God stay away for stinky. I did i mean. Yeah i m of a whatsapp group that you're part of chief. Leg that was called at the end of last year was called roller on twenty twenty one. I renamed it today to roll on twenty twenty two twenty twenty. One doesn't seem to be offering any of the goods that he promised us which is a complete relief from the horror. Twenty twenty almost worst into almost sue worse the wake of my husband being in such agonizing pain that he couldn't sit down or stand up or lie down full really any more than twenty minutes for a couple of days that was very hard to watch him but then also look after him and the baby was also very tricky. We've covered. It's easy to be at first sympathetic to such an injury and then after while just annoyed y you know better trying to mind baby here and now i'm gonna get up and look after me and pain. Did you find him irritating. Look my husband. And i have long had chats where he is very enthusiastic about telling me what is going on him physically at all times just in case something and i am very much of the opposite where i'm like. I think i need to go to hospital. I when my water broke all action. Probably white chris up but then he thought oh am i. Big nuisance was just like whoa. I don't live said we'll just go back to sleep. What do i do. I woke him up. But yeah very much the opposite of that. And so we've had a couple of times where.
India 2020 Voice AI Year in Review with Haptik, Slang Labs, Klove Chef, and Women in Voice
"Aggravates. Welcome to the voice spot. Podcast thanks for having me. I'm excited i'm excited to so the topic. Today is the year in review and we really focus on what's going on in india. You have a very interesting. Let's say a front row seat to what's going on with conversational a more. Broadly you deal with chat and with voice as you look back on twenty twenty and you look back in india and the conversational space. What was the biggest story of the year. What stands out. I think the biggest of the if you look at everything in addition i Chad boys todd bobby platforms use cases gov support if you just look at the broader space end for us like you mentioned right. Rear look on the internet of things over. The biggest breakout story has been whatsapp By that what What i mean is that if you think about the decio. Facebook has genuinely taken a number of steps. do enable what's up to become a platform for businesses to do a lot more with it right the genuinely thinking about this was the first yard where they would enough actions that facebook is accompanied to basically say that look deadened mission with what chapters to become like. Ob chat by web businesses and branch can come on and a conversation experiences to enable commerce engagement. Ben support So far for for us. And for me specifically as i think about the landscape i actually you know. I want to go to the extent and say as far as i think in domes of build adoption of conversation in the seven yards that i've been doing this which is like a lifetime in this business. this is probably the biggest route moment that that's happened because of the simple fact that You know if you if you provide in platform read a hundreds of millions of users can genuinely use. Nlp conversational interfaces dude to businesses to get things done for commerce far support it it probably will be can be a genuine battered. I'm shift that. You know people like you and i have been talking about for many rs. Okay so you work with a lot of big brands. Yeah so when you look at when you look at what's app or these brands interested in what's happ before the new features came along. Yes so there is always been a great Interest from start dating back to two thousand seventeen on more street because of the simple logic that you know most of these bands and more of the bland managers or the c. Suite dr day us. What's up like five hundred times a day for everything right. so then i'd choose expansion. What product on my band on this bag form so the interest is always been dead. It's been it's been the case for like i said the red bottle to your four yards. You know it was just a matter of the features being available the platforming available and more broadly in honesty the features started begging big. Started becoming available about a couple of ers by but really your until the earlier question is whether it was the first show. Facebook obliquely came out multiple times in. I talk about the fact that whatsapp is going to be a platform for engagement with businesses. Right unlimited a lot of things down features actions announcements which gave ams especially large brands a lot of confidence that look this is a good platform for businesses to stay and not just something that was been for like monetization got and so we've seen other moves along these lines as well with google also have business messaging feature. What is the general reaction about those. Are those going to be supported as tier two. Are they going to be supported as enthusiastically. Or is it going to be more Something that if if i have to do it i'm going to do it. But what's abbas where i want to invest. I mean i think you do have a but not like a must have sort of need. I mean it's the classic Vitamin was painkiller sort of analogy read. whatsapp is like is like dope. Incommoded solids of very big problem in terms of engagement. Outreach was Assured the good to have that a check box i need to be on those channels honestly similar a little bit with alexa and google has read what we've seen play out over the last two yards. Which is yeah great. I'd love to. I'd love to be on alexa of beyond will so that we can check it off that a band present debt. But it's not. It's not solving the problem of engagement.
"Encrypted messaging apps signal has seen a surge in popularity following the. What's at privacy. Update that indicated whatsapp user data was going to be shared with facebook. Proper quoting macrumors encrypted messaging apps signal faced big delays in verifying the phone numbers of new accounts on thursday because of a sudden surge in people trying to join the platform in messages posted from its official twitter account. The nonprofit signal foundation said verification codes were delayed across several cellular networks and that it was working through the backlog as quickly as it could signals uptick in users was linked to the user policy changes at whatsapp and also linked to tweet posted by tesla. Ceo elon musk. Who recently became the world's richest person as noted by the verge. Musk continued a trend of criticizing facebook with a twitter post on wednesday evening following the attack on the us capitol
Telegram channels will start getting ads next year
"Telegram is debut in group voice chat while at the same time. Ceo pavlov announced. That telegram is nearing five hundred million monthly active users to serve. This audience. Telegram is going to start monetize ing finally with a soon to be launched at platform next year quoting tech crunch the new voice chat feature which is similar to discords always on room supports a few thousand participants the service which topped four hundred million active users in april this year will introduce its own ad platform for public one too many channels one that is user friendly respects privacy and allows us to cover. The cost of servers and traffic derive wrote his telegram channel. All existing features will remain free center of who is one of the biggest critics of facebook owned whatsapp. Adding that telegram is committed to not introduce ads in private one to one chats or group chats because they are quote a bad idea quote. We are not going to sell the company. Like the founders of what's up the world needs telegram to stay independent as a place where users are respected and high quality. Service is insured. He wrote telegram will begin to generate revenue. Starting next year we will do it in accordance with our values and the pledges we have made over the last seven years. Thanks to our current scale. We will be able to do it. In a non intrusive way. Most users will hardly notice any change and quote.
FTC and states sue Facebook, could force it to divest Instagram and WhatsApp
"Ftc is suing facebook along with forty six states attorneys general. This is a huge lawsuit. They contend that. Google or sorry. Facebook made things anti-competitive when they purchased instagram and whatsapp promising to maintain privacy standards but knowingly rooting them over time of obviously facebook purchase instagram and twenty twelve for a billion dollars spent. I think nineteen billion dollars on whatsapp two years later. This is been a longtime coming. There have been whispers of this lawsuit coming for for a long time. In fact facebook has been unifying services. They've unified the back end messaging. Api's for facebook messenger. Instagram and whatsapp. They've launched Both end to end encryption and more robust two factor authentication across all of its services but that was probably to prepare themselves for this exact thing so jerry this is not this is not news to anybody of they have to see Started looking into facebook a year and a half ago there have been finds that the company have had to pay But this is a massive salvo against facebook One of the biggest ad suppliers in the world one of the biggest tech companies in the world one of the big employers in the world. At this point what do you think it says that all of these states are on the same page as the ftc regardless of what side of the aisle they're on. And what does it mean for facebook. Will they actually have to break up from instagram and whatsapp. I think that the states and it's it's great to see that. This is mostly bipartisan. Because you know our government should look out for all of us regardless of what political party we you know. Look too but they they. They've seen enough evidence to convince them that. This really needs investigated. A you know a lot of little things. Add up when the house judiciary was interviewing all. The ceo's a lot of what they had to say zuckerberg was about the instagram acquisition. And how from the outside. It looked like you know facebook. Strong-armed instagram into finally saying yes. That was like a. You know an advertisement for the ftc to look into it and it's good it. It needs to be checked and made sure that facebook is doing the right thing for its customer and even though we don't pay where the customer on the facebook side i don't think they're gonna have to sell off any of these services but if you remember there was google before there was an alphabet and the way they did that was alphabet is a corporation and it has subsidiaries and other corporations under its umbrella so i could see you know a facebook corporation that also has a facebook side and instagram side whatsapp oculus etc. That operate mostly independently. But they're still under the same basic group you know. I don't know what that's called. I'm not a business man. But you know some master that controls all the other groups right umbrella okay. That was right the first time then. Yeah yeah that makes sense. So i guess the question here that that people wanna know is i think we talk about facebook as a direct to consumer company right. They make products that you and i interact with either willingly. Begrudgingly refusing lee. Whatever they also hardware right and they have the portal of the portal smart displays and webcam they make oculus which has become an increasingly vital part of the vr community and facts. The oculus quest to is one of the most popular products. That people are buying this christmas. We know this because we wrote a lot about it over black friday and prime day. We know that it's been sold out for months or it was sold out for months. They got their their their production line up to speed so facebook has a lot of tendrils and a lot of areas of our lives. And as much as i may dislike the core products. I still use instagram. i still use. What's whatsapp and what the fcc. Maintaining here is that facebook bought both of those companies knowing that it would suppress competition in fact. It bought instagram instead of with instagram. And then right after its acquisition. It recognized in whatsapp a rise in user in user stats it. Bought of a vpn called onalfo that would give people basically asked users to install own apple. Gave them free vpn access in exchange for data about what apps they were using. They found out that people were using whatsapp. They then decided to spend a lot of money. Nineteen billion dollars in twenty thousand. Fourteen on whatsapp again. To quash the competition that whatsapp would have been been giving facebook messenger which was a product that facebook was investing a lot in at the time and then over the years. The ftc contends that facebook shutdown api access for companies that had direct comp competitor's products with facebook so they had to sign agreements saying that they would not build directly competitive products if they were integrating into facebook's various. Api's all of that brings us to today where the company is being sued by basically every state in the us and the federal trade commission. This is a bigger deal than google's lawsuit That that the justice department filed against them around search. Explain why that is. They're going after the big guy. The nobody's suing alphabet just because they're alphabet. They're suing the alphabet corporation over. How google handles search. That's one small part that does make a lot of money. It's a big part of the business but it's just one division among many where facebook. It looks like they're just going right at the throat but also what facebook did is more integral to its business and impacts more of his business because since facebook has acquired instagram. And what's up. It's just been pushing and pushing to get all of it together. They want to. They want instagram to become facebook. Which is why they started emerging messaging between all of them and and we want to see. Oh we we hope that they really cook facebook's goose and make him the line that's what we want but you can't really blame facebook. They didn't do anything illegal. What they did may have been unethical. But there are corporation. They did it to make more money and they got away with it because they didn't really break any laws yet now. The ftc is gonna decide if what if they went too far. It was worth the gamble. They probably made a lot of money. Even if they're forced to sell off an asset or diversify and one of the things that. I think a lot of people are not really thinking about from a business perspective. I mean i. I would love to have an instagram without facebook. Integration but one of facebook's i strongest advantages as a as a content platform is even though it's it's had some Some problems with in the past. They have a really really strong team of of content. Moderation you know making sure things that aren't illegal aren't ending up on their services and an just keeping anything that that doesn't follow their guidelines off of their platforms if if instagram twitter from facebook again. They're going to have to basically rebuild their own moderation system from scratch like they're gonna lose everything that facebook has already invested. So much money into right. I that the question though is has facebook even done. it's due diligence. In that area we've had many reports saying that. The companies hired out to third party contractors. Those people have been inundated with horrible and and just traumatic imagery. It had to quit. The companies have had to apologize. They've they've facebook a severed ties with many of these third party. Contractors as results. The the circumstances that you know this is not only facebook's issue we'll talk about google and moderation in a bit but facebook has had to hire thousands of condom moderators because of the scale of its business and the argument here is that would facebook have. It's with the scale of facebook. Be what it is if it hadn't purchase instagram and whatsapp if it had had to develop all these features on their own instead of acquiring these two companies and then really spending as much effort as possible integrating them. So if you're a whatsapp user your inevitably a facebook user if you're an instagram user. Your inevitably a facebook user.
Facebook Pursued A 'Buy or Bury' Strategy with Its Monopoly Power
"For years. The media joan facebook has had a policy of bio berry when it came to its competitors. Either bring them on board or kill them off. It's what led facebook to getting hold of instagram and whatsapp but now lawsuit brought by the us. Federal regulators are more than forty five state. Prosecutors has accused facebook of behaving illegally to stifle the competition. I'm joined now by josh. Kohl's research with the university of oxford internet institute to tell us more josh. Welcome you're just explains is what the lawsuit involves then. Yes this is is claiming brought by. Us attorneys general and federal agencies in the us against facebook Full amongst other things is Is that the way in which it acquired. What's up an instagram in the decade. I'm ready it's toughest full doing site so there is a statute in the us against to Anti competitive practices and against fundamental set of against monopolies in certain context. And this case will return on. What was facebook's medidation intention for acquiring these companies and has been the net result full consumers and uses a facebook in these other platforms as a result of these acquisitions. Just explain to us. I mean how this has become the how the rules have changed a little bit because facebook will say this is why the big business is always works and in twenty two hundred twenty fourteen. The regulator waved through the takeovers of instagram and whatsapp. But now things are different. That's right yeah. Facebook general counsel responded to the news by saying that this is an attempt to revisionist history on the pot of the government because it supposedly kind of waves through these in in the last decades under the obama administration. Now it goes that was More cases the state nelson demeaning at the time to to stop the Acquisitions from happening. Rather than truly approving them But nonetheless it does raise the question. What's changed. I think as in contrast to the perhaps the rules changing actually i think the situation on the ground is what has changed. And what has become clear to. Policymakers wraps later than Than some of the rest of us all these abuses really can see us. Data use a choice and competition have emerged from facebook's Moose in the space. I think that's really what change in the wider context say. Is the broad tech clash against big tech. You know we still need The us government announced plans to go to google in october For a slightly smaller. A range of issues really. I maybe less as existential. The google that what to be pressed but nonetheless part of a much wider a an assigned. I think that the tide is starting to turn against big tech. The big tech companies are saying this is going to stifle innovation it. Is that true or is it going to be the absolute opposite. I think he's gonna the absolute opposite right out of my mouth. I mean if you look at what. Instagram and whatsapp were able to do prior to being quiet was really to shake up. perspective markets in various ways in a very different Vibe if you'd like to to the social media landscape By the on quite positive centric social networking strategy which causes blown-up sleep fruits. Since it's been acquired by facebook what's up on the other hand has before it was acquired was was very big on encryption and privacy for the that not serving uses things like that and i think the fact that the co founders of these companies have since the politics facebook Having been acquired a very very large paycheck out of it is a sign that they might be suggestions in the duration of these products are taken both the house passing a bit from the original visions and finally. This is a case where we will hear the private emails on the likes of mark zuckerberg. How will it change people's perception of facebook. Once we works out what actually happens underneath the lid. When i think it made it may change a bit. I mean certainly Zach's emails have been the basis for fa drummer and the positive cases the social Which which Dramatizes early moves in setting up facebook said. I think there's already an image about sandwiches that he's certainly competitive guy and wants to eliminate rivals and i suspect his his usual move fast and break things. Philosophy will extend to festive trade practices as these muslim edge from From the tros that might be unveiled. So tech tech companies taking a beating but it may not be just.
Section 230: A Key Legal Shield For Facebook
"I can't have all three of you on without talking about two thirty. Which i've been instructed by producers to always explain what is two thirty a lot it says in it platforms are not liable for three users. Publish is very simple. You can just go read it yourself. Please god gracia employees. There's a lot of noise about two thirty in the world right now. there's a defense authorization act. That trump is. Insistent includes a repeal of two thirty. if or he's going to veto it. It appears that congress pass it with veto. proof majority is. It's a big deal at the same time. I mentioned this every time you're on. Joe biden stated position onto thirty as we should repeal it and he actually said it again last week in an interview. How does that play into these actions against face because of the conservative bias argument really ladders into. We're gonna take thirty away from you unless you change your moderation system into the way that we want it to. It's not really about taking thirty away but if you think that the game is to punish facebook or it's too big. It's hard to see how you would both revolt. You would take away because face to powerful and you'd go break them up like i don't. I don't quite see how those connect with adam curious. If you have a point of view. I mean biden. James argument is interesting. Because it's basically the opposite of trump's which is the problem with two thirty is that it means facebook doesn't have an incentive to moderate and dot actually feels like it plays in kind of okay like one of his tech advisers. Wrote this piece earlier this week that was section to thirty harms our kids because it means these giant platforms are allowing horrible stuff. I mean there were a lot of problems with it. But if the argument is section two thirty. Let's facebook do bad things and also they're powerful and they're doing bad things because of that. Those two things don't necessarily feel like they're in conflict. It's we need to take thirty away from facebook so that platforms will have an incentive to not let our kids see terrible things online and also facebook's too big and we break them up because they're also hurting our kids through dark patterns or advertising or whatever what do you think i mean the the two issues of run in parallel. If i didn't give you the two big tech policy issues of the year it's moderation in its scale and size and competition and trust and it seems like there's a convergence right inside of facebook. Yeah charlie wars a really good piece. Thursday in the new york times about the biden administration's relationship with facebook during the campaign. And this is a time when you would have assumed like maybe it would have gotten a little better because they were just talking all the time and instead it seems it just got much worse and a lot of his top. Staffers just became convinced that facebook was so tied to this posture of neutrality. That it was always going to have a disproportionate advantage for republicans who are gonna use it to spread and then you know various awful things and so on one hand. It isn't as if we've got a real policy proposal from joe biden on how to build a better internet right like most of what he has said has just repeal it but on the other hand Do i think it will be a priority for him. Well it sort of seems like it will be right lake with the. There's there is a political desire to see this happen. I think on both sides. The question is whether he can find any common ground with republicans. I just wonder if you break up the companies and you have multiple social platforms and they have different. Moderation standards doesn't that solve your two-thirty problem. Right that you're matt. How they moderate because you could just leave and go to another one that there's more to your liking it solve the conservative version of it. Which is these companies are censoring us. It doesn't solve the liberal version of it which is these companies are allowing bad actors to put up horrible misinformation or two again. I keep coming back to this op-ed about two thirty because it was so so bad. It was like the problem with this. Is that youtube allows videos of pepe pig with knives and like i can't convey. How bizarre was suggesting the should be able to sue you too because it has child inappropriate videos but that aside the argument is more that there are these shadowy networks of people who are trading horrible stuff. And letting your kids see horrible stuff and those things. They're not quite tied to like the size of a platform like a lot of the to thirty arguments. That come from. The left are based on really small sites like revenge porn sites. So i think it's much less of an issue. I do think there is. This is a place. We sort of see a combat like an overlap from the antitrust case and the two thirty eight where like so you were talking about the conservative case against two thirty but i think i don't think having different platforms really solves it like you can't just go to parlor and say it's fine now because i'm on parlor because what you immediately see is parlors a much smaller audience and so the fact that you've had to leave facebook and go to parlor means fewer people are hearing your ideas like it's just it's just straightforwardly true and this goes back to what we see in the in the antitrust cases which is that they say. Look anyone who's offering directly competitive service to facebook. Facebook doesn't let them have this. Api access it can't spread as well through the platform and then eventually it can't gain users dies and so if i'm out here trying to share my pepe pig knife artwork. The you know suddenly having if i if i have to go to some weird forum and everyone is literally like literally everyone in the world is on facebook because that's where human beings go now like i. I don't know there is something weird about it. I don't know of making the like having the government mandates standards or doing it through whatever we are process were using to change to thirty. Makes it better. But there is like a real algorithm Speech control issue kind of at the heart of it and there's something that none of these platforms have really try which is giving the users more control right like in chris. This is the thing that i want to see. People try is like let. Let me decide if i wanna see politics and my feet if i want to see nudity in feet if i wanna see curse words maybe i wanna see hate speech at my feed. Give it all to me. That is what parliament. You're just you're know there's a difference between not moderating at all and allowing me to choose what i want from a platform and that's you would you'd build this kind of goes to api's interoperability you. Would you would allow a variety of clients to flourish. This clients would have all kinds of different tools and they would all come back to some central system. Although that's pretty at odds with how people have been pressuring facebook to moderate. Which is the problem is that people are seeking out antitax groups or they're seeking out q. And on groups and the thing we have to do is get those things off the platform altogether. I think i. I do think there's just a real. I connect us that we talk about all the time which hilariously in this context is much more straightforward. Which isn't that neutrality. Which either we're going to tell the. Isp's exactly what to do. We're going to regulate them tightly. And say this is how you treat the bits or we're gonna find a way to make much more broadband competition happen so that people can leave and soon as there's a little competition all the espy's do the right thing. We see that pattern over and over again. It's a little trickier with free speech on social platforms network effects. But i just come back to that framework all the time of if we add more competition into the system. Isn't it natural that all the people who work at instagram at an independent instagram will say well. We're not gonna make the same mistakes twice. We're going to build a user facing moderation tool or we're going to build client access allows third parties to build kid-friendly instagram. So we don't have to do it and it's also not our sponsors ability. I have no idea but is like a hypothetical that is much more interesting to me than ted cruz. writing facebook's content moderation policies. Okay last question. Casey what what happens next well there. Some of us were asking yesterday. Is facebook gonna try to file a motion to dismiss this case and that is apparently still being discussed as a recording. This the suit has been live for barely twenty four hours so i think facebook is still considering its options but also laid out their case. So you know there's already been some discovery that has happened. And i imagine this will now move into a secondary phase when i talked to the google folks about what they were expecting from their antitrust lawsuit. They said it'll take like maybe twelve months to twelve twelve to eighteen months to play out And i'm expecting it'll be at least that long hair. Well it's going to be a fun year.
Facebook Accused of Breaking Antitrust Laws
"Six states have filed two separate antitrust lawsuits against facebook. Both are alleging anticompetitive conduct that could result in facebook having to spin off instagram and whatsapp but based on the fact that shares of facebook are basically flat right now. It kind of seems like nobody thinks that's actually going to happen. Well the market as a whole doesn't think that's going to happen. You've got the Individual attorney general state attorneys general. Ftc thinking it might happen hoping That they're not wasting their time here. We've got people who are probably Involved in this for the right reasons and some who are involved in it for publicity or or. I'm not sure what but i don't know that a lawsuit that has Forty seven leaders is the one that i would bet on being more successful than something more targeted And as you say correctly The most important Observer of this i would say the collective market sees it as a non event so far and part of facebook's initial response is to say and they're right to say this Hey federal trade commission you cleared these acquisitions of instagram and whatsapp. You already had a shot when we came and said. Hey we're thinking about buying this company. Are you okay with that. And you're like yeah now. That's good yeah. Well that's a. That is a fact in their favor. And i guess that as things stand now the monopoly power that is alleged by the ftc and The states is greater For facebook today than at the time of the acquisitions and so that would be wanted their responses A you're more of a monopoly. Then we understood you to be You've grown in part because of these acquisitions and you're abusing your power. I mean ultimately. That's where the ftc or any plan. If an antitrust case like this has to get is a or monopoly be you're using the monopoly power illegally It is possible To be illegal monopoly and to operate as a legal monopoly And that is where facebook would like to behind closed doors. Imagine itself to be yes. We're a monopoly. This is fun. Be monopoly. you get to have all the money. And but we're but we're not the illegal of. Oh yeah i mean. Let's be clear if you're an investor and you can find a legal monopoly to buy shares of. Oh yeah that's that's usually that usually works out for you as an investor Yeah and so if you're evaluating here's the downside of downside is this is a case which ultimately goes against facebook and then i guess the sort of data that you would look at is how did. At and t. And its shareholders do. After the break-up how did standard oil's shareholders do after that was was brought up because And how did microsoft ultimately do in The aftermath of the government is tempting to break up microsoft. Twenty years ago. And that didn't to come to fruition The market moved Much faster than anybody. could have anticipated and microsoft's monopoly power Was revealed over the like the time to not be as potent as as was alleged And you know administrations changed and priorities changed so the amount of time that it will take to actually see litigation like this all the way to the end if if in fact that happens so much will change that I don't think that again. The market is giving us a lot of concern. Today on wednesday at
Zuckerberg's Deals Are Central to Antitrust Cases
"Well it did happen. The ftc in coalition with forty six state attorneys general plus guam and the district of columbia have sued facebook instagram and whatsapp. Acquisitions were used to stifle competition in the marketplace. I'm going to point out that. The ftc suit and the state's suit are two different cases. These are not combined which i think could be important because number one facebook argue that. The ftc is being disingenuous. It signed off on these acquisitions years ago so they can be like no take backseat on this whereas the states never signed off on anything so they can claim harm more directly and second the ftc's lawsuit at least to my reading is more you know. Throw everything and the kitchen sink in. Their people are reading everything they want to. Intuit consumers have seen their privacy harmed. Advertisers have choice limited. The marketplace has been distorted. Whereas i think the state's case is more directly about the marketplace being distorted conversely though the ftc's suit explicitly seeks to unwind the instagram and whatsapp acquisitions to make those spun out as independent companies whereas the states cases in my opinion more vague. About what they're looking for in terms of dress. But i'm not a lawyer so feel free to correct those takes but quoting the verge for nearly a decade facebook has used its dominates and monopoly power to crush smaller rivals and snuff out. Competition new york state attorney general letitia. James said in a press conference today. James is leading the group of attorneys general quote. Facebook used vast amounts of money to acquire potential rivals before they could threaten the company's dominance and quote the federal trade commission brought a separate lawsuit against facebook on similar grounds announced at the same time as the state's lawsuit. The ftc case goes further than the state case explicitly calling on the court unwind the acquisitions of instagram and whatsapp spinning off both into independent companies quote. Our aim is to rollback facebook's anticompetitive conduct and restore competition so that innovation and free competition can thrive said ian connor director of the ftc's bureau of competition in a statement. The ftc case also echoes the state attorney. General's claim about anticompetitive use of platform power particularly facebook's practice of quote cutting off access to blunt perceived competitive threats and quote the ftc case sites facebook's decision to block vines friend finding feature after the twitter acquisition as a particularly flagrant instance of this behavior and quote facebook of course had a response to the lawsuit saying they are revisionist history and that this whole case is unprecedented. Jennifer newstead facebook's general counsel wrote quote the federal trade commission and state attorneys general today attack to acquisitions that we made instagram in two thousand twelve. And what's happened. Two thousand fourteen. These transactions were intended to provide better products for the people who use them and they unquestionably did both of these acquisitions were reviewed by relevant antitrust regulators at the time the ftc conducted an in-depth second request of the instagram transaction in two thousand twelve before voting unanimously to clear it. The european commission reviewed the what's app transaction in two thousand fourteen and found no risk of harm to competition in any potential market regulators. Correctly allow these deals to move forward because they did not threaten competition now many years later with seemingly no regard for settled law or the consequences to innovation and investment. The agency is saying it. Got it wrong and wants a do over in addition to being revisionist history. This is simply not how the antitrust laws are supposed to work. No american antitrust enforcer has ever brought a case like this before and for good reason. The ftc states stood by for years while facebook invested billions of dollars and millions of hours to make instagram and whatsapp into the apps that users enjoy today and notably to ftc voted against the action that the ftc has taken today now. The agency has announced that no sale will ever be final no matter the resulting harm to consumers or the chilling effect on innovation when we acquired instagram and whatsapp. We believe these companies would be a great benefit to our facebook users and that we could help transform them into something even better and we did this lawsuit. Risks sowing doubt and uncertainty about the us government's own merger review process and weather acquiring businesses can actually rely on the outcomes of the legal process and quote.
AGs' Lawsuit Accuses Facebook Of Gobbling Up Competitive Threats
"Facebook crushes the competition. That's one of those cliches. We used to talk about. Big successful. Companies is facebook crushing the competition. Legally or illegally. That's something the courts will decide. The federal trade commission and attorneys general from across the country are suing facebook. They say the company eliminated competition by either buying other companies or making it impossible for them to succeed connecticut. Attorney general william. Tong is one of the forty eight eight involved in the suit. Thank you sir for being here. Good morning oil. Facebook has been a dominant company. Four years now. Why filing this lawsuit right now. you don't facebook has expensive and power and what is done without our and its market dominance is. It's it's engaged in a program of what we call by in berry where they either by their competitors or if they don't play ball and sell they crushed their competitors and what they've done is they've crushed any threat to their business and their market domination. They've eliminated choice for consumers and they beat third party app developers and software developers into submission. And your argument is that's illegal. That's not just being smart competitive business. No it's not just being smart when you're a business like facebook and you essentially dominate an entire field that means so much to people today particularly in a global pandemic in public health when we rely so much on technology to stay in touch with our friends. Our family to do business to sell products to advertise Social media's become central really in our lives and when you're the dominant market player You have an obligation not to abuse that power and what a facebook has done. It's it has abused. Its market power to keep competitors out of the marketplace and the leverage that market power to prejudice. Anybody who doesn't play by facebook's rules okay but how have users been hurt by what you're alleging. Facebook has done the ordinary people of connecticut. How are they getting hurt here. So they really don't have any choice. They because facebook not only is the dominant player in its own right through facebook but because they bought instagram Which targets a younger generation including my kids and whatsapp. Widely globally used social messaging And also a direct peer to peer messaging app. Because they've done that. You really have very limited options and so you don't have a choice on where you go to For social media number one or two by products for example on on facebook facebook marketplace. And if you're a small business in connecticut Or even a bigger business and you want advertisers sell products. You really have to use facebook or one of its companion products so you don't have any choice because of their facebook argues that there is competition and i will tell you the young people in my life that the teens the tweens. They don't care about facebook at all. They're all on tiktok. Is it possible that in five ten years facebook will be kind of irrelevant or at least not the behemoth is now and that this is just sort of panicking over something that companies become dominant for a few years and they tend to fade know. Our view is Unless we do something. That won't be the case because facebook has frankly so much money and so much market power and that's why they're buyer berry strategy so successful because they can go and pay outside prices for instagram and whatsapp and essentially stifled competition. That way so no. We think that Unless the court takes action and unless the forty eight states plus the ftc are successful. Facebook will continue to dominate. The space facebook's general counsel makes an interesting argument noting that facebook bought instagram in two thousand and twelve and bought whatsapp a few years later and federal regulators said that was fine and now basically. They're going back on what they said. What do you think about that argument. Well we certainly weren't part of that determination and we look forward over the next two years to more robust antitrust enforcement enforcement of our nations and our states antitrust laws and the states the forty eight of us have done our own investigation and now in concert with the federal trade commission have determined that facebook is acting illegally. Okay connecticut attorney general william tom. Thanks so much for your time today. We appreciate it. Thank you well.
US government sues Facebook for predatory conduct
"For abusing. Its dominance in online search and advertising. The government's most significant attempts to betray competition since its historic case against microsoft two decades ago. James noted at a press conference that it's really critically important that we block this predatory acquisition of companies and that we restore confidence to the market. The ftc said facebook had engaged in a systematic strategy to eliminate its competition including by purchasing smaller up and coming rivals like instagram. In two thousand twelve and whatsapp. In twenty fourteen. James echoed that in her press conference saying facebook used its monopoly power to crush smaller rivals and snuff out competition. All at the expense of everyday uses the ftc. Find facebook five billion dollars in two thousand nineteen for privacy violations and instituted new oversight and restrictions on its business. the fine was the largest. The agency has ever levied on tech company or the had no visible impact on facebook's business facebook cold government's actions revisionist history that punishes successful businesses and noted that. The ftc cleared the instagram and whatsapp acquisitions years ago. The government now wants a do over sending a chilling warning to american business that no sale is ever final. Facebook general counsel jennifer newstead said in a statement that echoed the company's response to a recent congressional antitrust probe. Facebook is the world's biggest social network with two point. Seven billion uses an accompany with a market value of nearly eight hundred billion dollars who. Ceo mark zuckerberg is the world's fifth richest individual and the most public face of big tech swagger. Donald trump's high tech weapons deals with the united arab emirates fell short on wednesday in the us senate as trump's fellow republicans opposed resolutions of disapproval seeking to block the sale of drones and advanced f. Thirty five fighter jets. The senate voted fifty forty six and forty nine forty seven mostly along party lines to stop consideration of the resolutions killing them. At least until president-elect. Joe biden takes office on january. Twentieth biden is
FTC and states sue Facebook, could force it to divest Instagram and WhatsApp
"States, antitrust officials and a coalition of states Are suing Facebook for illegally crushing competition. Now, if the FTC does prove Facebook violated antitrust law, a federal judge could break up the company. Here's Bloomberg's Kurt Wagner on how significant all of this could be. This is threatening to take away two of the real pillars of what Facebook has become in not being, of course, Instagram and WhatsApp, which, while it does not yet generate much revenue, hardly any revenue Facebook sees this is a really important part of it. Future at the end of the New York session. We had chairs in Facebook down just about 2% of all.
Antitrust lawsuit accuses Facebook of squashing competition
"For Facebook and kick tech stocks in the form of a lawsuit that sent the NASDAQ lower by 2% 244 points. The Dow fell 105, the S and P 29 losses of a third to 8/10 of a percent. The Federal Trade Commission and a group of states filed the antitrust suit that's aimed at breaking up Facebook. Forcing it to sell Instagram and WhatsApp. The suit charges the company bought the properties to absorb competition. The
FTC and states sue Facebook, could force it to divest Instagram and WhatsApp
"Its monopoly power. Federal antitrust officials, along with a coalition of states want the social media giant to be broken up here is Bloomberg's Naomi Nix. This is the Federal Trade Commission specifically highlighted. Facebook's purchase of what that instagram and in the lawsuit said it filed and part of what it's calling for is a potential unwinding or director of those companies by Facebook. That would be a significant Alteration of Facebook's business model on one of the growing parts of its company. And so that's really interesting. And what they're saying is these, which essentially looked around for the potential competitors rivals. And then just instead of competing against them, bought them off. So if Facebook were to be found by the FTC to a violated antitrust laws, the federal judge could order a break up Now that obviously is, Naomi just said would include the forced sale of both Instagram. And WhatsApp, Jules. Well. House Speaker Nancy
FTC sues to break up Facebook, sell off assets like Instagram and WhatsApp
"Let's talk a little more about this. Big lawsuits got all right. The us federal trade commission filed a lawsuit on wednesday allegedly that facebook illegally maintains quote. It's personal social networking monopoly though Excuse me through a years long course of competitive conduct. That's a direct quote. Evidence was gathered in cooperation with the attorneys general of forty six states. The district of columbia and guam specifically called out as anticompetitive practices or as those practices are the acquisition of instagram and whatsapp an api restrictions on software developers Ftc is asking the court to order facebook to sell off. What's app and instagram. Cheese prohibit anti-competitive conditions envelope burs and require notice and prior approval of future mergers and acquisitions similar lawsuit was filed by new york attorney. General lati- let Excuse me latifah james. I believe i said joined by the same states and territories. That is a hardcore lawsuit. Tom merritt gigantic. Yes it is i. Let's just say up front. The chances of them actually getting a court even if this went all the way to the supreme court to agree to make facebook divest itself of instagram. And what's up very low not impossible but it's low so you know. Don't don't get too excited if you if you want instagram and whatsapp to be spun out. It's doubtful that will happen What they'll probably is some kind of reparations. Kind of fine. Maybe a change in business practices. I imagine they could have a good chance of getting facebook to have to agree to the notice and approval of future mergers and acquisitions. That part does seem likely but it will be interesting to follow this case and see where it goes because it was. It's a long shot to get this and so a lot of people weren't sure if the ftc would even bring this kind of charge that they might go after a smaller remedy but they're basically accusing facebook of buying instagram to neutralize a direct threat in instagram and make it more difficult for other social networks to compete. Kind of the same thing with what's up. They they wanted to neutralize. Whatsapp is a threat to facebook and make it harder for other messaging apps to get in there that was gonna be real hard to to prove though because we have a lot of competitive messaging apps out there so it doesn't seem like they've really suppressed the the market for that and then the the i think where i think you have the most fertile ground to get a court to agree which is the restrictions they put on third party developers on on what they can and can't do not only on facebook but if they use the api for example. The ftc uses this in their press. Release in two thousand thirteen twitter launched vine which let users shooting share short video segments and in response facebook shutdown the api that would have allowed vine to access friends through facebook. That is an anticompetitive practice whether they're abusing their monopoly to do it or not. We'll be the question. The court will decide the big story and the kind of happen mid day today. We were all sort of scrambling around like okay. This this is actually a big story. You know a lot of people are like this is a really big deal because look the. Us is going to dismantle facebook. Instagram and whatsapp arguably being. You know the you know the the prized possessions facebook. Besides its own news feed itself and like you said tom. It's highly unlikely that that's going to happen. Is going to be tied up in court for another few years probably But does it set a standard for how facebook and any company that would dare to get his anywhere as big as facebook in the future to not be able to gobble up. you know. i don't know. What did they pay one billion for instagram back in the day when thirteen people working at instagram. Kind of thing because instagram was big and facebook has a history of replicating kinda cool trendy stuff that that works. I mean look at real on instagram right. Now it's tiktok competitors you know it's all it's all kind of the same thing just to see what sticks and has had a oftentimes not a lot of success. Buying the company works for facebook a lot better than trying to replicate some sort of cool feature that then people have to learn to use now. You could argue. That is why the big weather big targets on this because what's app and instagram are notably gigantic runaway successes than. They were already heading that way when they were acquired. And you could also argue that. Got him at a bargain basement price. But maybe that's why they're being targeted decide with facebook. And i'm not really doing that. But for devil. Devil's advocate reasons. I would say yeah. This is a huge target. They have billions of users on their main service and then these secondary products are huge for them and they would be standalone gigantic companies on their own. That we would talk about individually if there weren't already owned by them so it makes sense that they're the target but the idea of buying up your competition to limit their impact on your business and grow it out. Separately isn't new and they're not the only ones doing this but maybe they're doing it. The most successfully and the question isn't just as a monopoly. It's not enough to save face because of anomaly you have to say it is a monopoly and it abused its position as a monopoly to reduce competition. Sometimes of an -opoly is perfectly legal. It's not illegal in the united states and most countries to be a monopoly. It's usually illegal to cause harm because you are a monopoly. And that's where. I think they're gonna have a problem showing harm yes. There isn't another few. No flicker is not doing well. And when they bought instagram that sort of dominated the image market. But to your point. Sarah the reason they keep adding stories and then reels is instagram is trying to fend off competition from snapchat and tick tick tock so there is competition. There is competition pushing instagram to change. And i think facebook can demonstrate that. Yeah maybe maybe zuckerberg said something unwise in an email once but there is competition out there. Same what's up there's telegram and signal and we chat and and how many other messaging services out there so i think it's hard to show that they are reducing competition in the marketplaces for those two. That's why i'm less bullish on the idea of them winning over a court to make them get rid of them on the other hand the developers stuff like they essentially killed vine. And i think they're they might have a better chance of getting facebook on that one do you do you think the Slack is worth twenty. Seven instagram's just to put it in numbers slack. Yes this lack. Twenty seven billion dollars as opposed to a billion. That's what i'm saying. Everything's billions and billions of dollars now. Yeah five star wars. Anyway i would love for there to be some sort of okay. Let's say we go forward and maybe facebook is find which is likely And is it sort of said going forward. He can't just gobble up companies that That you deem as a future competitor mall and then make it your own and then you reap the reward. So what what do we get to is if you have this x. amount of users you can't buy a company that has x. amount of users that is on the up and up or it has to be for not too much of a certain price so that the company doesn't willingly to you there so many factors in play i i i do wonder how this goes. There are laws. These laws will be tested in court. Now which is you can't buy a thing when the only reason you're buying it is to put the competitor out of business. It you there has to be a valid business reason for buying it and i think facebook can show that i you know. I look back at the microsoft case where they wanted to break up microsoft. They never broke up microsoft. They just put in some remedies. And i think yeah. That's courts are very reluctant to break up a company. You have to really show that it caused harm. And i just don't see it there
Facebook braces for high-stakes antitrust lawsuits from federal government and states
"About to face antitrust lawsuits filed by more than 40, state attorneys general and the federal government. Litigation accuses the social media giant of engaging an unlawful anti competitive tactics to buy or kill off its rivals, solidifying its dominance and social networking. Facebook's purchase of Instagram and the messaging service. WhatsApp was cited as examples of a pattern to neutralize competitive threats. The lawsuit could ask a judge to consider a wide range of options, including forcing Facebook to sell off some of its businesses to add to address competition concerns as the Trump Administration
"whatsapp" Discussed on Why It Matters
"Who's in charge? Legislators visit the platforms themselves in the US. The answers to those questions are unclear but in India a potentially decisive moment in digital freedom is going down right now. India's ruling party has put forward new rules that would allow it to trace and censor private communication. Standing in. Its way is what's up. An American made encrypted Messaging Platform. That's used by hundreds of millions of Indians and the outcome could have ripple effects across the globe. I'm Gabrielle Sierra. And this is why it matters today. India's government versus what's up and the looming threat of digital authoritarianism. India is the world's largest democracy if you can imagine nine hundred. Million PEOPLE VOTED. Alas national election last year out of a population of one point. Three billion people. It's just it's it's a massive exercise election. Yeah it's huge it's populace and that's what also makes it really fun and exciting to be on the ground. You certainly feel the energy especially in the city like Mumbai. Politicians routinely insult each other on the campaign trail criminals of every flavor. Run for office and win so do Bollywood movie. Stars Cricket Stars it just never ends has always been a fairly Jackie democracy. We talk a lot. We argue a lot that our culture. Okay so help me understand why. What's APP is such a big deal in India? How many people are actually using it? They're awfully four hundred million people. It is indeed this is Chinmaya ruined. She's a resident fellow at Yale. University and the founder of a research center at National Law University Delhi. She's also a leading legal expert on the intersection between freedom of speech and technology. And so why WHATSAPP wine? Not you know instagram or snapchat. The elite platforms are used by everyone. But what's happened? The one that really appeals to people if you have a phone that's not too fancy. If you don't speak English you don't read or you don't have access to inexpensive data connection. You can still use. What's APP so it started with? Hey you don't have to spend one rupee or two rupees per tax. You just save them up and then they send whenever you're in Wifi and saw a lot of people with not lot of money. Which is many many Indians decided that this works for them. And then what's up had these multimedia features which people started using it started liking and? I have mixed feelings about this because the good thing is that I get to talk to my grandma. And she finally has forgiven me for moving across cushy can look at my home and you know say things about my plants or whatever course but if you're sitting in an Indian airport and watching the number of people who do video calls subject you to their conversations mixed feelings what's up is really a messaging platform and that can be one messages like me sending a message to you. But it's also very commonly used in India for groups. I am do oil and I am a technology reporter for the New York Times based in Mumbai. India vindaloo also covers Indian economics and culture and has written extensively about free speech and misinformation under India's ruling party. We called him at his home in Mumbai on. What's up what's has become so embedded in life in India that people use it in their business transactions so you can order groceries from your corner grocery store over what's APP. I buy airline ticket from make trip. Which is one of the big online travel agencies? They send me a confirmation message on what's up with by e ticket details so for those of US based outside of India handling a basic transaction may require a few different platforms. You find out about a concert on instagram. Rsvp FOR IT ON FACEBOOK. Maybe share the notification on twitter buyer ticket on ticketmaster and received the confirmation on g mail but for Indians. What's APP is often the one stop shop for everything? In other words an application from Silicon Valley has become basic infrastructure for the second most populous nation honors. That's a pretty big deal and it helps. Illuminate why the government is pushing for greater control. What's up was founded in two thousand nine by two former employees of Yahoo? It's an American company. It was founded in Silicon Valley and they basically built a very simple messaging service became very popular. It caught the attention of Mark Zuckerberg the chief executive and founder of Facebook Zuckerberg beside it in two thousand fourteen to by what's APP and pay the still stock price of twenty two billion dollars for this message company so facebook is making a mobile push with steal the buy real time messaging service. What's APP? It's still a pretty incredible price to pay for a company that stress a few years old. It also makes tiny what's APP more valuable than some of the most established companies in the country including American Airlines Marriott hotels and Xerox and it came at a crucial moment for facebook when it really was trying to find ways to diversify its revenue base and also get in touch with more mobile users. I'm Seema mody global markets correspondent with CNBC business news and suddenly came this messaging platform. That was not only gaining prominence here in the US but around the world in fact I believe the average daily use a rate on WHATSAPP was much higher than Facebook Messenger. Facebook saw that and said this is such a strategic bet for us. Let's acquire it and find a way to really incorporated into our user base platform. But what's APP is free right. What's APP is free? And I think this is still a developing story to see how facebook is really trying to incorporate what's up into its business and you know will you one day see ads on what's that that's certainly been one of the big questions sucker. Berg was pressure in that. This technology of very simple messaging APP was going to become very popular today. Whatsapp has more than two billion users. Around the world it is by far the most popular messaging APP in the world and one of its biggest claims to fame. Is it emphasizes privacy. All messages on the service use. Something called end to end encryption. Okay so in most cases when you send an email or a text message it gets encrypted that means that the information inside is locked up in a code so that outsiders can't read it however the service providers that pass your message along can read it whether that's apple or G. Mail or facebook whoever they all have the keys to that code and that makes your message vulnerable enter end to end encryption with this technology none of the men have the keys. Only you and the person you're sending it to break the code. What's up can't read. Even if the government came knocking at the door of what's up what's up. What have nothing really to give up. And so your information is private and that makes it unique to other services messaging services like whether you're sending a text message or even facebook Messenger where that information does live somewhere. Yeah most other. Messaging Services in the world are not and encrypted and certainly none of the popular ones. But what's up has made it really easy. You don't think about corruption it just is encrypted Because so much of India's communication happens on WHATSAPP end to end. Encryption has made it very difficult for the government to investigate messages in the name of national security. People are not making phone calls anymore. They're not even walking over to their neighbor. Say This texting and where the speech there is harmful speech. It's not news that social media can bring out the worst in people the platforms. We use everyday are teeming with sexism. Racism misinformation and violent ideologies. It's the same. In India or social media has amplified problems that are a lot older than the internet rumors and lies spread like wildfire across the Internet including across chat and applications. Like WHATSAPP Many I. I'm used US India or live. Whatever comes in the woods his true the one that's really made the headlines is there was a lot of fishers. He'd speed circulating on what's APP so for example. The Muslim community is under quite a lot of pressure in India. Right now and it's really sad one of the ways in which they're discriminated against is that some upper caste. Hindus don't eat beef and so the rumors circulating on what's apple say things like X. has beef in his fridge are why is transporting COW CARCASS. And since it's already been sold to people as it stretched to their religion when a rumor like that reaches people that already feel threatened and feel like these people are out to get all the Hindus and they're trying to destroy religion by eating beef and Lynch mobs attacked them and their popularly called. What's APP lynchings? Early twenty eighteen. There was a wave of false messages. On whatsapp about child kidnappers prowling parts of India. Trying to steal people's children and this panicked a lot of people and mobs attacked strangers in various parts of India and killed them. Beat the Tied the mob hung them all kinds of terrible things. More than twenty people died in just the span of a few months because of these rumors and after these rumors started appearing the central government. When after what's happened said you need to find a way to trace these messages and stop these messages. And this set off a feud with what's out that has still not been resolved. The government says it doesn't WanNa read your messages. The government says they don't want to spy on the content of messages. They're not asking what's up to break the encryption of messages and show them what's in the messages but they are saying. Is You need to be able to trace back the pathway of a message. And you have to find a way to do that because if you have some message goes viral we WANNA find out who sent it and we'll see what happens. I mean what's up has said that to that would require significant changes to their service and they haven't said whether they'd be willing to make such changes.
"whatsapp" Discussed on TechStuff
"Two Thousand Seventeen Brian. Acton had had enough he chose to leave facebook and this wasn't expensive decision. He was six months away from having his shoulders. Vest with the company. Those shares were worth around eight hundred fifty million dollars but the agreement also hinged upon facebook holding up their end of the deal which included an agreement not to implement quote monetization initiatives into quote without the founders agreement but then a lawyer for facebook argued that the company was. Just you know exploring the possibility of monetization. They weren't actually implementing anything yet so acted couldn't just grab his shares because they hadn't done anything they're just talking about. It's just talk and rather than fight act and walked away. He left behind almost a billion dollars. Yon coon stuck with facebook for six more months and he left after his shares invested. But he did leave in two thousand eighteen. He also resigned his seat. From the board of directors for facebook between actions departure and combs the Cambridge analytica scandal also had become world news. Acton gained even more attention because he called people to their facebook accounts hashtag delete facebook comb kept quiet and when he left. He said he would be pursuing his other interests which include collecting very expensive very fast cars since then other whatsapp executives who were either with the company pre facebook acquisition or post have left and combs replacement. A man named Chris. Daniels would leave in two thousand nineteen along with his boss. A facebook named Chris Cox who at one time was thought of as a possible replacement. Ceo If Zuckerberg were to ever step down. This was after Zuckerberg had announced plans to realign facebook. A focus on private messaging and it did little to make people feel better about what was going on over. There will. Cathcart would take over as the head of WHATSAPP APP and he remains that to this day. More than a billion people use. What's APP Today? As a messenger service FACEBOOK's intent to monetize the service hasn't led to a massive drop in users but for many people. It was a bridge too far. It certainly was a bridge too. Far for Co founder Brian acton who has since invested in an encrypted messaging service called signal that uses the same encryption technology. That whatsapp uses so you could argue. He's effectively backing a semi competitor to the company. He Co founded back in two thousand nine. And that's the story of what's up so far from what I've read. Act has held himself accountable for his decisions. Perhaps to the point of self-flagellation saying I sold out. I'm sure yawn is also frustrated with how things turned out though. I guess you can feel somewhat comforted if you happen to be sailing around the world on a yacht still..
"whatsapp" Discussed on TechStuff
"Advertising and one that wouldn't hold onto user data like messages and then turn it into a money generating Ad Platform. This is part of why facebook tacked on that additional three billion dollars to the sixteen billion dollar asking price that yawn and Bryan had demanded. This was all in an effort to convince the staff of what's up to stay on to come over to facebook and continued to work on the WHATSAPP service so it pushed up the price up to nineteen billion dollars and this deal was based largely on facebook stock shares and those stocks actually increased in value before the deal was finally closed. So really when you look at it to twenty two billion dollars when it was all said and done in an amazing symbolic move. The founders would sign the agreement for this acquisition outside the building where combs mother would stand in line to get her allotment of food stamps. Which is a heck of a rags to riches Jeremy Food Stamps to billionaire in addition Zuckerberg promised Yawn and Brian? That facebook wouldn't make any move to incorporate advertising and watts up for five years and that they would run. Everything by the founders. I and that the company would be able to operate pretty independently from the rest of facebook. Whatsapp should be able to do. Its own thing now. If this sounds familiar to you it might be because they said the same thing to instagram. When facebook acquired instagram that was the same messaging and like instagram. The founders of WHATSAPP would become increasingly disenchanted with facebook's moves over time around the same time that they were getting acquired. The WHATSAPP founders. Were also looking to incorporate. End To end. Encryption in WHATSAPP messaging provides a level of security in though. It's by no means perfect. So let me explain what I mean by that. So within to end encryption you have someone typing in a message into watts. Up and that message gets scrambled or encrypted in a predetermined way. It's encoded the person on the other end can only de Scramble that message if they hold the appropriate key the decoder and in this case only the recipient would possess that particular decoder. The process itself establishes the keys. And it's a bit complicated but you should just know that the process allows both the parties to hold an encoder and decoder. That's unique to their communication. No one else has that that Decoder so it means that if anyone were to intercept a message in transit that person would only be able to see the encrypted scrambled version it would be meaningless. They might know the origin of the message and they might know the destination that message but they wouldn't know what was actually in the message itself which is good. This is an important component insecure communications. However it is not a bulletproof vest against eavesdroppers and spies and hackers. That's because someone could target the end devices in other words the phones or you know the phone of the person making the message of the phone of the person receiving the message. If the hacker does that if they can exploit of vulnerability in that device then they can potentially read messages once they get unencrypted on the other side so the message in transit would be difficult to suss out but the hackers have bypass that they're going straight to an end point. They're getting the information through the phone. Not Pulling the communication out of the air. Here's what makes matters worse in the old days you could follow good browsing protocol and avoid most of these traps. You know things like don't go to websites you don't know don't open links from strange sources that kind of thing but in the world of APPs with push notifications. It's possible to either sneak an APP into an APP store that pushes out malware automatically if you've enabled push notifications for that APP. Then your phone would just take care of all that on its own or maybe you could even find a vulnerability in an existing APP and hide some malware that way and then you have a big install base that could receive a push notification that could potentially make their phones more vulnerable. This isn't great now. My point is that end to end. Encryption is not the ultimate insecurity but frequently gets presented that way so if the messages hey we can read your messages. Because they're encrypted. That's not necessarily true on top of that you have governments around the world including the United States pushing companies that run encryption communication services to include a back door method of access for official government agents and investigators government agencies argue that this is necessary so that intelligence officers can detect potential threats. But there's a general rule of thumb that we should all keep in mind and that is security. Vulnerabilities are a bad thing. Intentional or otherwise because a back door is a security just by its very nature it allows someone to bypass the security measures that are in place to protect users. That's the same thing that hackers look for. When they're probing systems for vulnerabilities except in this case the vulnerability is purposefully created an implemented by the service provider. And you can bet that if such back doors are created armies of hackers will be seeking out ways to exploit those back doors so even if you have a deep trust of intelligence agencies doing the right thing and if you do have a trust and intelligence agencies doing the right thing you might want to rethink that you should keep in mind. It's not just the quote unquote good guys. Who will want to use these back doors? So anyway I'll get off the high horse. Moreover around the same time that WHATSAPP was incorporating into end encryption as be around two thousand sixteen facebook was making another big change. Watts APP would be sharing some user data with facebook which in turn would be using that data in an effort to serve up targeted ads to facebook users. This was a big shift. One that was controversial among whatsapp users. And the tech world in general really as well as within WHATSAPP that being said. According to the press release the data being shared would be limited it would include the phone number which for WHATSAPP is equivalent to a username and the last time the APP had been used. The information was spelled out in the updated terms and conditions for what's up but then the average person and I include myself.
"whatsapp" Discussed on Acquired
"Roughly every decade in tech and who knows what the next one's going to be but these windows that open up where they're not obvious in the beginning again again. Remember John was. He wanted this to be away messages. But like if you can get in there and figure out the right product there's an opportunity to just serve such a clear need that a new platform enables and turn over The KINDA be they'll guard of of technology and and networks that if there is one of those and you think you have one of those opportunities and you see like good God take. Brian's ends advice and do not give up go a couple more months so funny. That was exactly exactly the point that I wanted to make here. And specifically around both push notifications Asians becoming available and also the wide widely available data networks. That lived on top of telephony on top of SMS completely obsolete. In the way that all the carriers were billing for messaging at that time. Yeah we didn't talk as much about that. We don't we'll be in the beginning of the episode by the way. Yes that's just such a disruptive business model of like I could pay ten thousand dollars a month for my. You know child's sixteen thousand isn't text messages or it could pay a dollar a year. Yeah Yeah it's actually it's funny so sometimes we section I'd like to do it today On value creation versus value capture. Because a lot of companies can create a ton of value in the world. But one of the sort of things to do is make sure that you're able to capture some that value create. What didn't didn't really try like what created so much value I mean and frankly they destroyed tons of value for carriers But until bliss slightly debatable. I think okay. I think you're probably right but Yang. I'm Brian got this question all the time. And they're Kinda can I answered that they came up with was no no no. We're actually helping carrots because we're encouraging people to adopt smartphones and move over to data plans which do plans are more expensive than tech plants. And I think it's fair it's a it's a it's a fair argument but it's flawed in that that was going to happen anyway so it is worth noting into the carriers just figured out a way to bill everyone like they just repackaged all of their their their pricing. It's not like they actually materials lost money on this. Yeah AH BUT LIKE I. Don't I don't consider what's happened. Effective value capture machine and still is not clearly capturing basically zero zero value but massive valuation for the world and also again. We talk about this as much but the end end encryption and being the first platform to implement that platform Wii across everything You know nobody saw that coming in two thousand fourteen but in the world we live in today like and it gets really important and like really really good for the world that they did that totally agree and to get into some of the nitty gritty of that They actually then what's later implemented the signal protocol. which which is I believe? Also and encryption and Finns is the same thing as the foundation. The Brian and the an open YEP facebook. Ken read something. Like An. And we're not privacy experts but From sort of a cursory read over it what really people that are really into. Privacy would want facebook to not be able to read of course the contents of your message But also be able to read like who sent. What when David if I sent you a message on what's up right now? FACEBOOK would have it in their server logs. I believe listeners please. Email US acquired. FM ITCHY MEL DOT COM or or tweet at US I believe they would know that I just sent you a message. interesting which is kind of what they one of the things they really wanted out of this. Anyway there is more data they could get out of. What's at but I I do? Think they get a a good amount of data as it is today interesting now before we grade. This one David I would like to thank. Wilson's Sensini the official legal sponsor of season six of acquired Wilson's Houdini or ws Gr. Is the premier legal adviser to technology life sciences and growth companies worldwide as well as venture firms private equity firms an investment banks. That finance them. So thank.
"whatsapp" Discussed on Acquired
"In the meantime Johnson and Jim and Brian. They're trying to figure out like well. What's our number? What's this what? What do we think we're worth and twitter gone? Public recently and twitter had a thirty billion dollar market cap and had fewer emmy us than what's tap and of course twitter had a very robust advertising business model at this point in what's very little business model but they kind of look at each other and they're like well twitter's worth thirty billion. We're bigger than they are. We gotTa be worth at least twenty billion and so they put this out to all the parties and suck bites I and so the next day downs just dropped a billion on instagram. So Yeah let's twenty of that. What's twenty of that and the week goes on and and then by the end of the week Friday February Fourteenth Valentine's Day that evening John goes back on Valentine's also jenny birthday by the way attend wonderful wife? Penny's birthday dude. You're ruining her her. Like two factor Roth security answers. John's is hose. Like yeah totally. Yeah everybody's birthday. We just all about birthdays here on acquired so Valentine's Day John. Martin Jahn have a romantic doc dinner at sucked house. I believe it was during that dinner. That the hammer out the details and Zach puts nineteen billion on the table. And I don't know if he literally really put nineteen billion on the table but I think it was sixteen billion and then the next day they negotiated up till nineteen point four or something like there was something where there it was an initial offer and then and then it was sixteen billion dollar acquisition. Plus Three Billion Dollars in Stock Doc Awards and Retention Grants for Yon and Brian so that might have been what brought it up the agree They see cans. They hug supposedly Zach says that this was f-bomb exciting and take a bottle of Johnny Walker Blue which he knew yon loved loved they have a shot and then they handed off to the lawyers and so over the weekend. Remember this Friday now Mobile World Congress is coming up next week they want to announce this and get it done before Mobile Congress. They handed off to the lawyers over the weekend. The lawyers put everything together. Now it's Super Important Zach. This wants this done. It's super super important neon and Brian that like they don't want advertising on WHATSAPP. These books an advertising company and so they get their lawyers to put a clause in the documents documents that says if facebook ever implements advertising on. What's APP that the two of them and this is where this the three billion dollars in retention mentioned in stock grants for them become super important that they will get full acceleration of any vesting on that stock and that they could walk away with all the money which may have kept facebook from doing putting out on the road map until Ashley exactly and so? I don't know if this was something that because the came came together so quickly facebook and think hard enough about this or they agreed to it and thought you know whatever. We'll do it anyway. This is in the final documents. The Wall Street Journal did a big Willing to in our sources did a big article about this that it actually made it into the final ducks and so it was part of the deal the next week they announced the deal. He'll nineteen billion dollar total consideration by the time the deal actually closed facebook stock and run up and it was twenty two billion in when he told the value. Twenty two. What another three billion between friends at Memorial Congress mark? Dekker gives a keynote speech. He talks about the acquisition acquisition. He says that it's it's what's happening to be independent. It's not GONNA be advertising. It's really the vision is related to Internet Dot Org. It's that they're building this suite of utility services for the Internet particularly in developing areas outside the US where their monetization currently isn't working at all. It's all going to be great and for a while. Things are great no pressure to monetize and before we move on we should talk a little bit about the way. The financial terms of the deal broke down. So sure it's this Sixteen Sixteen Gone Nineteen gone twenty two billion dollar all in package four and a half billion of that is in cash close to fourteen billion of that is stock facebook doc. Consideration for what's absent that goes to all shareholders including their existing investors. You gotta remember the old. That's exactly settlers seven bucks. Oh seventy seven bucks a share. So today there'd be an an additional twenty five billion for the combined total of those shares would be up another other twenty five billion you then go and look at the shares that were are issues given to the founders when they when they came over to facebook that would be an additional seven billion billion dollars today if they had held onto that stock. I don't think they did for philosophical reasons when we'RE GONNA get into that came out facebook but oh my gosh what. FACEBOOK was giving up here era. And we'll talk about this in the grading. I don't think you should think about is the cash value I think you should think about as the percentage of equity value which is about ten percent. Don't like their a two hundred something billion market cap company. At this point they basically sold ten percent of the company in order to go and get this asset asset and for reference. We'll talk about this analysis later but these book is a six hundred thirty billion dollar market CAP company today. Pretty Wild Al totally wild well. We'll bring things on home here on the history and facts couple things that will go through quickly first. Things do go great. There's no pressure monetize. Growth massively accelerates. There were four hundred ish million Emmett us at the time of the acquisition by August of that year in twenty fourteen. They hit six hundred hundred. Also that fallen twenty fourteen importantly they implement full end to.
"whatsapp" Discussed on Acquired
"So they say you know we have enough savings. We got into Yahoo especially Bryant early enough that they can afford to just really take extended time often travel and end at one point after they get pretty bored they both. This is famously of applying for jobs at facebook which is of course on the rise. Now now we're in two thousand eight and they're both rejected for jobs at facebook Bryan even tweets about it face but clearly does not need their talents audience which is so funny because they are especially Brian but both of them especially Brian. Lee Truly world-class engineers. There's a thing though that was going on at facebook. Look at that time that I think a lot of people forget about not that the company's benevolent now but whereas Google was hiring a lot of the smartest people who were academic work and sort of obsessed with really like pedigree right and really like deep nerdy academic sort of learning. FACEBOOK was obsessed with hiring a lot of people who were well known in the communities of the languages that they wrote in and so they had you know many of the early sort of python people they had a lot of sort of open source leaders and frankly there was a lot of like the result of not invented here syndrome and there was a lot of. You're not good enough for us and we are sort sort of There was a cockiness that permeated I think the Development Organization at that company early on that. It's not surprising that someone really accomplished. But who may have been of a different stripe or tribe was was you know not not welcomed and not revered. It's really interesting. I wasn't going to get into this in the hitching fact. But it's worth a worth pause. Most most of the back end of what's up getting written in erling which is like this super obscure programming language. That was actually developed by Ericsson. Listen in like the eighties maybe Erickson the big telecom telecom to an as lake just purely for telecom use cases for like you know rapid messaging but leg was super looked at his business. Backwater outdated old school. Like you know this is about as far away from go as it gets and of course now if you start your company and write it in Erling like now. You have two problems. The problem that you're trying to sell for your company and the problem that you can't recruiting engineers exactly there's tons of engineers that are specifically obsessed with things like or laying and rust and very like more of up and coming and fringe programming languages. But Gosh you have to get specific than when you're hiring when you make a decision like that okay. Back to picking up the story yawn. He's single he's traveled around. I remember he's got this history of he was. There's a hacker he was you know a woo member and it started as a as a pen test here. He is traveling around the lots of countries and he had a Nokia Candy Bar phone that he loves he really loved Bill. Diesel talks about how he loves the old Nokia phones. You can play snake it was great it was great eight and he had of course jail broken this phone and installed all sorts of like super hacker tools on it. You can monitor everything. That's going on the network Eric and all this stuff so easily obsessively learning about all of these different telecom networks and the country's travelling to and he would buy different SIM cards. You know all the all the country entries and slop him but even like Jahn is techy and competent as it gets he's basically a walking. It department he still is having a nightmare. Trying to communicate communicate with his friends back home in all around the world yes. MSN and phone to like all these country codes. You've got a dial You send off an SMS. I have no idea if it was delivered. Even if you did everything right it might trap and fall through. And so he's especially when he talks a lot about Argentina he does a trip to Argentina happened and for some reason that he thinks that the country code in Argentina's dislike so ridiculous that he's like dropping all these messages and he starts getting really fed up in like he wants his friends to know back. Conway's doing that. He's okay and everything so he finally comes back in January of two thousand and his birthday is in February. But he's just just hanging out he says you know what I'm GonNa buy myself an early birthday present. I'm going to buy an IPHONE. Just to like hacker around with of course the iconic come out in two thousand seven but two two thousand nine. This would have been the iphone three g either. The three the three D. S.. I think probably the three D. S. at this point I think in July is when the three GS came out memory so maybe it was the three d. but yeah apple had just I believe it was in January of two thousand and they had just announced just the SDK to allow developers to make APPs. And I think it wasn't even like APPs on the APP store wasn't GonNa ship until the summer but SDK was out. Yeah Yeah I think that's right I I it may have been earlier may have been been at www C. O.. Eight they announced it but yeah I don't think it had shipped yet or it was shipping right around that time but they came out with I fono us to and so- yonkers is like okay. Great I'm GonNa Hack around on this so he's got all this stuff swirling and he has an idea and he tells a friend of his who's also a I believe it's Russian emigrant in Santa's named Alex Fishman. Who is a good nobody of yawns? Hey No had this problem. I have an idea remember lake you know Ayman. ICQ and all these messaging services on desktop. They all have these. The way message is what I really want and what I would love when I was in Argentina and all these other countries is that I could just throw up the equivalent of an away message and all. My friends could know what I was doing in that I was okay. I'm just going to build this out on the new this new iphone that I got and I said yeah that seems like a good idea and so John starts packing on it he starts thinking about what to do and he says you know really like what I want. This to solve is year. But asking what's up I just want this this to be like the answer to what's up so I'm just GonNa call it what's APP and he's like. Yeah great idea and yawns thinking some more and he says you know home okay. Well two things one aim and ICQ and all these messaging services on the desktop. There's kind of this issue with them. which is is you have a cold start problem with the network you join but none of your friends are on there and so you got to convince people to go to all their friends join but with phones? You know I'm really. I'm digging into the this new iphone. What was even called Iowa's at this point right? It was like I forget what apple's iphone Fono S S decay and it's pretty locked down but there's one feature that apple lets developers access and that's the address book the the context. What if instead of at the time there was no special permission prompting for that does try to reach your hand into cookie jar? And he's like man. What do you think if instead of having screen names and user names which is these phone numbers because all of the phone numbers of people you have your only GonNa give your phone number to somebody? You Really WanNA communicate with it. You'd want them to know what your status is so this might solve that cold start problem and so it's like yeah. That seems good but you know your there's one thing you're GonNa need like John Developer. You ain't work to Yahoo and everything but you don't really we know how to code for IOS but it just so happens through an you don't know this A. R. K. thing called Objective C was written at next into that apple has decided to carry forward into all their products to date so ridiculous. That like next is the core of objective. Sweden and sweat still bill still one of the greatest acquisitions of all time still. They'll have to go on her forthcoming accord top. Ten list Yeah wait so before you get into hiring the west of did they eight grow by texting all of your friends like did they. Did they reach in grab the phone. Number's eight of your address book and then like carpet bomb. or how did our question. I don't believe the leap so I didn't find anything that they did. Like the linked in playbook of actually go the step further in carpet bomb but they did reach in and get all the contact information and so they they were checking they would grab your address book and check everybody on there and I remember when I on boarded onto what Hap- years ago it checks and then they surfaced for are you like. Oh Hey I think even shows you your whole address book and then like checks like here's another on tap who are in your address book exactly gotten it anyway. Alex is like Oh yeah I was working on another project and Found this awesome dude in it back in Russia on rent a CODER DOT COM. WHO's really.
"whatsapp" Discussed on Acquired
"APPs Just thinking looking at our script here and where we're going to start and how we started the slack episode with Dharma butterfield soon to become Stewart Butterfield. Economy growing up in a commune in British Columbia. There's something about Communism and messing APPs. I don't know what it is but it just makes per it's a really good breeding ground for founders messaging APPS and of course strong community unity. Is that strong. So of course I'm referring to we are going to start in the mid nineteen seventy s in the Soviet Union you in Ukraine in a little village just outside of Kiev where a boy named Yana. Coom his born. Eh Jewish family in nineteen seventy six in this village in the then Soviet Union and this is pretty not great time to be all of those things a Jewish child in Ukraine in the Soviet Union under communism in the mid nineteen seventies and Yan actually can a leader talks about this. He says he says of his time the school he attended there. It was so run down that our school didn't even have an inside bathroom. Imagine the Ukrainian winter negative twenty degrees Celsius or little kids have to stroll across the parking lot to use the bathroom. Society was extremely close. Close off you can read in Nineteen eighty-four of course the book nineteen eighty four but living there was experiencing it. I didn't own my own computer until I was nineteen but but I did have an abacus. That was the reality that this young man Yang Kun was growing up in and he would stay in Ukraine until he was sixteen eighteen years old and and his have such an impact on everything. That's come this entire story. His Dad worked for a state run construction company in the village. It was really hard and it was very antisemitic. Environment finally by the time he was sixteen his mother and his grandmother mother and he were able to escape. This is nineteen ninety two. The Berlin Wall had fallen at this point. They were able to get out of the country and come into America so the three of them moved to Mountain View California. Yana sixteen years old. He barely speaks any English and when they arrive his mom mm starts working as a nanny to support the family. But it's not enough. They live in government assisted housing in mountain. View there on food stamps. Yawns Dad never able to leave the Ukraine. He praised badly. Passes away at nineteen ninety-seven never comes to America and then even more tragically a few years after that in two thousand. We're GONNA talk much more about what happens before the year. Two thousand yawns mom is diagnosed with cancer and passes away in two thousand. So here's this this this guy you know now at the end of the day and the end of this story yawn walks away with nearly seven billion dollars after taxes. From the. What's up stale? His life was is. This man had been through a lot. Yeah no kidding and I think you open that chapter with saying it was a great time. That is a very soft way to describe very hard hard existence so when it comes to America because he doesn't speak English roles American High School in California. He he doesn't get along with the other kids there. You said a lot of traumatised life. He's out this kind of one thing that sort of ends up becoming late in his life and that he gets his is that he's in. Silicon Valley says the mid nineties he gets really into computers He actually teaches himself programming and like computer networking by purchasing manuals from a used bookstore. A local used bookstore and reading through them teaching himself Probably working on the school computers learning how to the program and then returning them to the store and getting the money back after he's done he ends up through this. He joins while he's still in high school. A hacker group online uncalled wou-wou W zero zero w zero zero speak elites me blue and he ends up meeting after co founder Shawn Fanning being through that. And he's like can find his community on the Internet after high school and through this he enrolls in San Jose State University in college but colleges kind of not for him and he ends up dropping out. I takes job bagging groceries. Then he ends up working at FRY's electronics exit. You've hung out in Silicon Valley. I remember when I was a I was at ESPN staffer. There's still like well now. Twenty twenty I don't know but what I was A. DSP there is still a FRY's electronics. onyx on El Camino real and in Palo Alto. Yon Works there then from there he ends up working at a early Internet service provider local ASP and through that then he ends up actually joining Ernst and young as like computer security like penetration tester. So he's he's putting all of his like hacker credit use even though he's a college dropout white hat unclear. Wade have a day unclear what John was doing at night. This is where kind of everything changes. So he goes to a conference while he's with Ernst John Young and at the conference this is now Kinda mid-nineties he meets. Yahoo Co founder David Filo. He's at an Apache security conference France. They kind of hit it off and David's like pay you know when we get back to California. Why don't why don't you come into Yahoo interview for a job? So John Does He. The ends up joining Yahoo has an infrastructure engineer becomes a real engineer and he meets in his group when he joins a man who ends up. uh-huh I think I kind of becoming a mentor figure And then the friend Manning Brian Acton now who is Ryan. Brian has kind of Not Quite as dramatic but equally really interesting story. Brian was born in Michigan. In nineteen seventy two. I believe his parents divorced when he was quite young mostly raised by his mom who ran her own. Freight forwarding business. Kind Kinda incredible. Like woman with a child's running reporting business. I would imagine not a superior female friendly business in in those days not the venture capital Darling that freight forwarding is today. This is a pre convoy and in pre export. Ah What's the flex port. She then moves him to Florida and he spends most of his growing up years in central Florida. I believe she instills in him kind of this. Ethos of like both entrepreneurship and like small business entrepreneurship but also like huge responsibility. The lake beating payroll roll and like scraping by and getting you know. Getting through month to month he ends up. He's super bright. He ends going to Penn on a full scholarship to study eh engineering. While he's there and he's learning about engineering and his freshman year he first hears about Silicon Valley and about this university called Stanford and he probably heard of you of Stanford before but like him and his background and nobody in Florida was thinking about going to Stanford he ends up applying to transfer and is accepted into Stanford transfers out to California his sophomore year and majors ends of majoring in computer science. Stafford this ends up being huge for him. He interns at apple his junior year and then after graduation he joins Yahu as employee number. Forty four in the really early early days and he worked super closely with David Filo He works with Chey Lou and like all these like super legendary engineering leaders. That end up coming. got a yahoo ways you know. Yahoo was the first. We haven't really covered it enough on this show yet but it was the first lake successful successful company. Yeah Yeah Right Internet directory basically. It's funny yeah. You mentioned Chia Liu so she. Obviously Veasley is very notable for his work at Yahoo. I know him as like my mega skip. Level boss from Microsoft ran being 'cause Microsoft recruited him over and he ran search for Microsoft and then ultimately actually took over all of office as well. And of course you know the relationship between Yahoo and Microsoft many of our listeners. Probably know is really a a long and complicated a topic for another day but Brian and young become kindred spirits when yon joins joins Yahoo and Brian really rises through the ranks. He ends up becoming the chief architect of Project Panama Within Yahoo which was super. You know they would talk about it on their earnings calls. I remember Carol Bartz talking about it all the time and Some air after she became. CEO and that was a massive passive project to re architect. All of the back end of how Yahoo searched work and how ads worked on Yahoo Search. So the two of them with Brian Kinda Kinda leaning on the technical side go through this experience of re architect get massive scale this original Internet company but doing it for like while this company is going from over one hundred billion dollar market cap darling of Silicon Valley all the way down to below ten and then just plummeted plumbing. What did they would've prize ultimately by hoop for? I think it was like three billion dollars or something. I don't know but the if if your final resting places at Verizon then it's sort of irrelevant their final market cap wise so they get this incredible technical experience but they also see not like this business model of a portal. Yahu is like. It's so fickle and it's so dependent on user user attention and it's so dependent on advertising and they start to believe the yahoo makes a ton of product compromises promising-looking in service of their ad partners and hours. A big reason. You know the They simultaneously through these years. See the rise of Google and you. Google famously famously is just like these. Just one white page with a search box. Meanwhile Yahoos throwing up all of these display ads and doing all this stuff officially become super super disillusion with it and you bring up an important point there. Yahoo was the very first Internet company. That business model was to monetize attention. I don't need to paint the picture of our listeners that the most successful company to ever be on the Internet and monetize attention is facebook. And so I think there's this This sort of incredible book ending of the story stories one. That's why I was. I was going to be going with it. And it's also during this time famously. Yahu tries to acquire facebook for a billion dollars. I just want to mark cried in the bathroom rejecting it. I think so I think so. And you know this is going to be a Meta theme of this episode but like this idea of monitoring attention through advertising is in many ways as old as the Internet itself. Yahoo was the first big company that was built to do that. And facebook is the new Yahoo in ceremony ways so they get so disillusioned. I don't know if this is still the case on on on's linked in But when he was leaving out who it and the first a couple of years of what's up he described his last three years at Yahoo description of your role boy did did some work period read. Of course they were working on project Panama in November of two thousand seven. Brian and Yana finally kind of had enough and they both leave the same. I think even been the same day that they leave Yahoo and their dislike completely burned out. They both decide. They're you're gonNA take a bunch of time off. Brian had recently been through a divorce on it at such a hard life up into that point lost his parents in the past few years ears..
"whatsapp" Discussed on Slate's If Then
"Talk about the what's at pack they were hacked in May of this year. And they're saying that fourteen hundred devices were affected by the hack. So if you're one of these people and someone who was using what's up. What did you see when someone was trying to get into your phone so you would have just gotten a call from someone on what's APP probably from an unknown number now? I get calls all the time on. WHATSAPP happen on my phone and I don't really think twice about them unless they're really strange for a number so in this case? A lot of the targets received a call and even if they didn't pick up the phone and this is probably the scariest part even if they didn't pick up the phone just the fact that they had received miscall was the exact way hey that NSF. SPYWARE was exploiting. What's up software to download itself onto your phone? It's a really all you needed to get was miscall and NSO had successfully accessibly embedded into your phone and most of these cases. I think that's so shocking to hear because it seems like something that that almost wouldn't be possible. How did it work work? So they exploited a vulnerability in whatsapp software and couldn't tell you the exact mechanics of how it worked but once it was on the phone it could basically capture every keystroke every password every phone call every message it could even turn your phone into a recording device and record noises and everything your camera caught and send it back to their client servers which are usually government. So this is all of your communications. Even your grocery list to your spouse I mean everything is accessible. Everything was accessible after the hacks. What's up and a group out of the University of Toronto? Called citizen. Lab took a closer look at what happened. They wanted to know if any one group in particular was affected among fourteen. Thirteen hundred people that what's up. In citizen lab discovered had been targeted. They found this subset of about one hundred people which included journalists dissidents sit in religious leaders prominent female leaders activists. And that's where we've started playing the onion back further to you. Learned that once again an associate by where is being abused by governments all over the world to basically monitor their critics and journalists.
"whatsapp" Discussed on The Journal.
"Others like governments and hackers have been trying to figure out ways to get around it and this spring someone figured out a new way to hack into a phone by exploiting what's supposed to be one of the most secure your messaging platforms out there. What's up and all it took was a single call today on the show how fourteen hundred people got their phones attacked and how one company may have been behind it? Welcome to the Journal. Our show about money business and power. I'm I'm Kate Linebaugh in. I'm Ryan Knutson. It's Friday November eighth last year. I was at this conference for forensic investigators people who are trying to get information off of Computer devices in pursuit of law law enforcement investigations. Bob mcmillen covers cyber security. And they were telling me about how until around twenty fourteen twenty thirteen and if there was an investigation going on there is suspected criminal activity and people were communicating had away. In the best known way wiretaps they would get a court order and go go to the phone. Company in the phone. Company would allow them to listen in on phone conversations between suspected criminals. But these forensic investigators told Bob that wiretaps were becoming much less effective because fewer people were using traditional phone calls and text messages to communicate instead. People were using new technology made made by tech companies that enabled encrypted communications tech companies were making encrypted messaging apps so they market themselves to consumers as being privacy. I I am one of the companies leading the way on encrypted messages was what's up what's up built a very strong Indian encrypted messaging product that if a law enforcement agency goes to facebook and says we want to get access to data from a phone. That's communicating via WHATSAPP because facebook owns. What's APP? Yeah that's right what's up would say. Listen we can give you a very limited amount of what they call Meta data data about the data. That's going on there but we can't tell you what the text messages where we can tap into to voice conversations that are happening. That's just not possible with this. Encryption technology and the people who care about privacy and security they know this they know that that's sort of the go to software that you WANNA use if you don't want anyone to be able to listen in but in May what's up users found out that something they hoped would never happen happened. What's APP said? There was an opening in their software. That had been leading getting hackers in often when you see attacks in the computer well. There's like there's often like you have to click on something or there's some action that the user has takes there's like one final line of protection right if you get a message from somebody you don't know and it says Click on this right now. Like most people know not to do that. But this attack didn't didn't work that way. It was better than that the way the Hackworth was all they had to do was get your phone number you using for what's up and call you using. What's you would see a strange number on your phone whether you answered it or not? You're hacked from the point. You were called from your phones perspective. It was like. Hey there's a call coming in that means you should pop up an alert that means there should be a little ringing sound. That means and you should get ready for You know the Mike Tour in for a voice conversation. Oh and by the way you should also install the secret spy software. That's how it worked you in all that orchestration of what would happen in your phone when it started. They found a bug a mistake that allowed them to get a foothold in your phone which Stan allowed them to install software. That wasn't supposed to be installed on your phone. And what could software that that's spyware. That just got installed. What could it actually do? What could I give? You've the hacker access to it was game over. It could see the contents of your chats. Could screen shot browsing pages pages that you went to. It could see who you're calling this software could also turn on your camera and microphone and record audio collect location data in even survive a factory reset of your phone. It wasn't clear who'd hacked into the phones. But when what's APP discover discover the vulnerability. It rushed to figure out how the hack worked and how to fix it and as they started pulling at the technical string on this they realized that a lot of people had been targeted. Do you know how many people had been targeted. WHATSAPP says that fourteen hundred people in total have been targeted and and they made the decision to start notifying everybody the way what's at works is what's at might not know much more than the number of the person that they're dealing with? They just sent messages passages via whatsapp to all the targets. Saying like. Hey you know there's been an security incident. This is what we know. The integrity of your device has been compromised and they did this for fourteen hundred people. That's right yeah. There are a lot of possible motivations for this hack. It could have been rogue actors who wanted to Steal People's information it could have been law enforcement officers like those people. Bob had talked to WHO wanted to look into criminal activity or it could have been autocratic governments who wanted to spy on political dissidents either way it basically burned all of these Intel operations right if you let all all these people know that. They're the targets of surveillance and that there's software on their phone. That spying on what they do. They're going to get new phones right and so suddenly. Whoever's doing the surveillance valence is going to have to start all over again to try and find out who they're talking to and what they're saying in what they're browsing on the Internet you talk to one of those people all right right after they found out? Yeah that's right. I talked to a Moroccan national. A man in epsom Havana's who is a an administrator college there now he. He had been journalist in Morocco and he was surprised to get the message. He wasn't involved in journalism anymore and and he didn't really think he was of interest to anyone. We had a conversation. The a what's up and one of the first things he said was. I hope you're comfortable with this call being recorded needed because I still using the same phone and it's been compromised. And what did you say. I said. Let's go you know I'll just good to yeah. No that's the that's the case but I'm on deadline and I've got a story man. I just hope I don't get scooped by like a national agency. How did this man feel about what happened to him? Well he was a little cynical and had done some journalism. That governor Bronco didn't like and he'd been the target of surveillance before and so he said he just assumed that this was always the case with his phone It was interesting to get the confirmation but he basically if he had something really really secret to talk about. He wouldn't be doing that via telephone or text message. You just entrust stuff. According to the Human Rights Research Search Group citizen lab more than one hundred of the targets were like this man a journalist or a political dissident and they were from all over the world the U. K.. India South Africa Belgium France. Uganda and more which suggested that some governments might have been involved. WHATSAPP decided to respond to the hack? But how the company responded was unusual instead of going after the people orchestrating the attacks it decided it was going to go after the creator of the software that made the attacks possible. That's after the break..
"whatsapp" Discussed on Business Daily
"What's that has one point, five billion users worldwide, two hundred million of them a here in India, and that number is increasing every day. I've come to meet the economists us what each who believes that WhatsApp is having a huge impact in rural India. Maybe something they were doing wrong, maybe they get from what have certain messages that, okay, you do farming in this way. Maybe it's going to help you are productivity might increase. I mean, the digitalization has made people more aware of things we never knew before and when you go to rural India, now you see lots of people just about everybody with a small. They have access to the internet. I've seen them, they using WhatsApp solve. It's catching up and then you have your own smartphone in your hand, and you have the, I mean the information coming to you on WhatsApp and you're reading it. I mean, the farmers themselves getting involved in this process. And in that, I mean you have a social capital being formed because of this type of social networking. Message is warning of child, kidnapping gangs have been going viral over what's that consensus over the speed in which one Sam can spread information. That'd been many headlines like this over the past few weeks in India, fake stories of groups. Targeting children for kidnappings have led to lynchings in different parts of this country. That's led to calls for the thirties to clamp down on what's app Sunday pros, one of India's leading columnists the receiver of the message. You have a responsibility and Indians have been very light about abdicating responsibility saying that, oh, this is just four voted as received as if they have no role in deciding whether this is true or not. In Bengal. There have been some instances where people accused of Morphing photographs and sending them out on what's up have been pulled up by the police, but I don't see it happening in a larger scale around the country. The truth is that in spite of those can sense, WhatsApp is getting more and more popular. I've come to a t. stole full of young business men and women. What do they make it is our Goto communication tool. We don't use anything else, writing people who are not educated and they can handle meals, but with what they can take pictures and send it. I employ a lot of people who use what's happening to do lot of work, which probably they Kuntar John too. Very good way to connect and it's deep. It's really. How much do you use it? Almost all the time. And that's why what's app is so popular, the young head love it. So if he coming to do business in this country, make sure you download that app on your phone. Rojo standing there on India's WhatsApp, boom. So consumers picking up on how cheap the platform is. If you've some kind of data connection, it's instant and there is no charge for messaging. Plus you can form large chat groups on it, but not everyone's happy about this new form of communication. Uganda's government alarmed by what it describes as the spread of false gossip has introduced a new tax on all social media platforms. The executive director of the Uganda Communications Commission. Jeffrey Mattew Bazi says, it's only right that this American based platform should be taxed in countries like you Ganda, whereas generating its prophets. That we must also been using new technology with connote weighed on invited does that Jeffrey metropolitan that for the cannon government while on a trip to the country's capital Kampala last week, I for myself had some of the reaction to this social media tax introduced the start of July. It also affects Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter uses by the way. I'm in the middle of Kampala. Now playschool we market is one of the biggest markets in the city food markets, all kinds of vegetables, tomatoes, onions, cassava, melons. I can see Aram massive pile bananas ripening in the sun. The government is introducing new taxes on the use of social media. Things like Facebook and what's up basic communication tools for many ordinary Ugandans. You'd have to pay two hundred shillings. She's about five US sense for every single day that you use these social media so you, what are you selling here?.
"whatsapp" Discussed on The Inquiry
"Intimate, she says, more importantly, exclusive in two dumb when lives WhatsApp, logos on street corners, warn people to there being monitored police in the city or even encouraging people to join these groups. Neighborhood, watch groups now springing up all over the world connected by what's up hooked up to security firms or even the police often they take on a strong sense of group identity. And as we've seen in India, it's easy then to make quick judgments about who belongs and who doesn't. Do you think that it fuels vigilantism? It can do, but I think vigilantism has been around since the dawn of time. So the idea of neighbors watching neighbors is definitely not new, but what's new about it is that we have a very viral aspect to what's so it has to do with the more emotional dimension of how paranoia fear can be circulated amongst group of people and how they get to react to that, whether it be to expel somebody. And that part has very important in new. WhatsApp is not just another platform. She says it's features, give it a unique power when that creates a sense of belonging most of the time, it's a very good thing. But the flip side is that this can all too easily into vigilantism. The lynchings in India were awake up call for what's up. And now it's had one, what's it doing about it..
"whatsapp" Discussed on Z100
"Whatsapp Now That all that is. It you No Is it Z one hundred. Tanner swept she's in town. This weekend Yes In the morning? Show We need more things that make us laugh and make us happy Great I've learned that engagement make people happy I've learned that via..
"whatsapp" Discussed on WiLD 94.9
"Whatsapp many no now forever suffolk kenny diavolo the went up two days law.
"whatsapp" Discussed on VIBES-LIVE
"Whatsapp lebanon within a day and was when young man with up to that whatsapp and we cover in custody i will make up so much we're not me no no no among letter i'm not in other leading on that'd be online than thou my mother my amid wrong america online wherever i go on an of what oh my god well ronda rousey whatsapp when young man from monday night and this way ronda rousey what's whatsapp so what that is sent on what the muslims man hold known to his last breath uh.
"whatsapp" Discussed on RobinLynne
"Whatsapp lebanon within a day and was when young man with up to that whatsapp and we cover in custody i will make up so much we're not me no no no among letter i'm not in other leading on that'd be online than thou my mother my amid wrong america online wherever i go on an of what oh my god well ronda rousey whatsapp when young man from monday night and this way ronda rousey what's whatsapp so what that is sent on what the muslims man hold known to his last breath uh.
"whatsapp" Discussed on VIBES-LIVE
"Whatsapp grew them latin who met with i shall in a thing him oh god no emme no england in the bay field jp mangalindan the immobile dinner in london at that time she linnea in new and in late three.
"whatsapp" Discussed on RobinLynne
"Whatsapp grew them latin who met with i shall in a thing him oh god no emme no england in the bay field jp mangalindan the immobile dinner in london at that time she linnea in new and in late three.