18 Episode results for "University Of South Florida"
USF President Judy Genshaft Retires
"This is Florida matters. I'm Robin Sesing ham. It's the end of an era at the university of south Florida after nineteen years as the president of USF, Judy Genshaft is stepping down today on Florida matters. We're talking about the highs and lows of president gin Chaffetz long tenure. I'm going to say at the outset that Florida matters and USF public media is based at the university of south Florida and received support from USF but is editorially independent with me in the studio is Mark Schreiner assistant news director at W, USF, and longtime, producer of university vit. He's been reporting on the university of south Florida for many years, highmark. I Robin, thanks for having me, and Steve newborn WS assistant news director and reporter, Steve attended USF as a student in the eighties. So he seen a lot of changes to the university over the years. Hey Steve glad to be here. Well, nineteen years that is an unusually long time for one person to remain a college president, isn't it? I mean, what's been her secret to her staying power, do you think Mark thinks this thing is Robin nineteen years? I think she passed Jon Allen is the longest tenured president of USF about five years ago, Jon Allen, the first president of the university. And what I think, really worked well, for president Genshaft is that she was always a cheerleader for the university, the joke that has been going around particularly for the last year, but it was very noticeable every speech she ever gives and I mean, you probably wouldn't like someone asks her, you know, paper or plastic. She probably says paper and then she throws in a go bulls at the end. Making that the bowl logo. Yes. Which should I'm surprised one of her hands isn't, you know, posed. An but, but she's, she's a huge like I said, a huge cheerleader for the university while at the same extent a job like that you need to be politically, astute, you need to work with not just a board of trustees who you answer to, but you work well, with city legislators, and of course, with the US F system. You're not just talking Tampa. You're talking Saint Petersburg, you're talking Sarasota manatee. You're talking Polk County with lakeland in polytechnic for a while there. And then state lawmakers because of course it's a state university. It gets funding from the state, and she was very much into a strengthening those relationships and keeping strong bonds with those lawmakers and powers that be in the community constituency. It's a big university. Do you know how many people it's actually? And that's the other thing that that is really being trumpeted now is the idea. Of the growth that took place in the two decades under, again shaft, you know enrollment growing by forty percents. Oh my God. Yeah. Yeah. Right now, I want to say realize that yeah, that's the thing is that just the growth in terms of students. I want to say between the US F system. It's in the neighborhood of now, fifty thousand students on the three campuses of USF Tampa, Saint Pete, and Sarasota manatee, and then another thirty thousand staff and faculty, Mark talk a little bit about her background. She was a professor, I guess she started out, yet, she actually went to university of Wisconsin Madison, social work and psychology. And then she really focused in on school counseling when she got her graduates, and doctorate at Kent state university, and the, the focus, there was how schools reached out to students and you saw that more and more throughout her tenure with the honors college back when she started in two thousand USF's honors college wasn't even a college. It was an honors program at the time. Quickly. She wanted to set it up as a college brought in directors to run it as a college, and now the last probably the last thing that she's going to be best known for is this twenty million dollar gift to create an honors college that will bear her name, twenty million dollar gift from her and her husband. Stephen Greenbaum for this college, that's going to expand to about five thousand students, and at that ceremony in may, when she talked about the gift, one of the things she stressed was the idea that this was something that she has always been about from her education days from her days in college of focusing in add student achievement. All right. So you mentioned Mark that she came on board as president of university of south, Florida and the year two thousand and Steve, she got kind of off to a rocky start. She became president in July two thousand the next year. We had nine eleven and then soon after that the admit. Station suspended a professor by the name of Sami Al Aryan, and this was a national brouhaha and you were were reporting on that at the time, right Semioli, Iran was a professor. He started a group called wise the world in Islam institute at USF L on came under investigation by an independent documentarian by the name of Steve Emerson, who basically accused wise of being a front for a group called Palestinian Islamic Jihad, which was later declared a terrorist group, by the United States government, the month after nine eleven you gotta remember emotions were running really, really high and Ari on when on the Bill O'Reilly show, the O'Reilly factor on FOX and a Riley, basically ambushed him. And people were phoning in death threats bombing threats against USF so Genshaft and the new university board of trustees. You gotta remember the board of trustees had just been established. Replacing the longtime board of regents here, and it was a group of basically business people who are running the university. Just a lot of disruption at this time disruption they came to an agreement that they were going to fire him. They didn't actually do it at the time. And this created a firestorm of controversy from professors, who believe that the university should be a beacon of academic freedom. This became a national even international issue, and it really didn't come to a head until L Aryan wasn't died about the federal government about a year later, and they quieted down a lot of people who were defending him became silent at that point, because it looked like okay. They had reasons beside freedom of speech. They had reasons to suspend him. And you've got to remember back then the image of the university took a really big hit of we, we were being called jihad. You really a nationally. We're getting getting to be embarrassing. Yeah. Rodney plot of bad press. So Steve, you're. Reporting on this story of Al Arian and the university of south Florida, at the time and we have some archival tape of Judy Genshaft at the time. This university has been through a great deal and it's, it's hurt the university, and it's been very difficult for us. And I believe that, that severing all ties of this misuse of our university is a very important step. This university is larger than this particular case. So she did, so she survived that she went on, but then Mark, she did have some run ends after that with faculty. And again, you're going to have that, that, that push and pull at any university, where faculty and administration bump heads. Whether you're talking a pay issues or tenure or things like that, one of the big arguments at USF, which is a big argument in higher education in general, right now is the use of adjunct faculty, which are. Professors and instructors who, don't get a tenure don't get benefits in many cases are poorly paid are working basically part time jobs, as a full-time basis. So that has long been an argument anytime that's Genshaft salary came up the idea that she was at one point in time, the seventh highest paid public university presidents in the country as of two thousand sixteen seventeen academic year, that argument always was, you know what about the faculty. What about the adjuncts how you paying them? But again, it's an industry wide issue right now recently, the university decided to consolidate all of its branch campuses, and this caused quite a bit of concern among people in Saint Petersburg, especially where USF Saint Petersburg, is located. I'm going to put the disclaimer on that of the university may have decided it, it may have been decided outside the university that USF was going to consolidate. There's a lot of. Speculation on who really came up with this idea was it Representative crisp rolls, a USF alum based out of palm harbor. Was it president shafter self? She has been quoted multiple times as saying that she had heard talk about consolidation being an idea, but she was surprised when the state legislature put it in a proposal. But again, you know that there's never really been a definitive answer of whose idea it was as far as I know. But the concern was for years. And this again, predates president Genshaft, the idea of Saint Petersburg, and Sarasota manatee wanting more autonomy, maybe even at some point, separating and becoming their own colleges, while again, the state's nest necessarily was going to allow that, but the campus is ended up with a lot more atonomy under consolidation. Some of that on Tommy is going to be taken back some of that's going to. End up in the hands of Tampa. What comes with consolidation though is more money for those regional campuses. And what a lot of university officials are praising is the idea that a student now can enroll at Sarasota manatee can enroll at Saint Petersburg, and end up taking the same classes that they can take on the Tampa campus. So kind of keeping them as as strong branch campuses with their own identity. But at the same idea, making those programs cross borders across the three, I think one thing that probably in the back of president in Chaffetz mind. This whole thing was the, the lesson of what happened to the USF lakeland campus USF had a joint campus with Polk munity college for many years, and after the started bursting at the seams, literally, they USF wanted to build a branch campus. USF polytechnic is what it was called and somewhere along the line a very. Powerful politician by the name of GD, Alexander who was speaker of the house at the time is very big landowner a Polk County as well. He decided that he wanted to make this a separate campus and he used his considerable political will to basically cleave this off of the us system. And it became Florida polytechnic. It's now this beautiful building with, well, it's university state university. Right. The, the beautiful building this right on I four. But that had to be in the back of her mind. The lesson there of how to keep these branch campuses in Sarasota and Saint Petersburg in the USF or breaking off. And I thought, you know, people who are involved in that very bitter, fight must have also been thinking, well look what happened to the branch campuses. After all good thing, we went ahead and became an independent university that was one big fight that Judy Genshaft ended up losing, when USF lakeland, which became USF polytechnic. It's split that was in two thousand twelve that was that. Must have been quite a rough time. I'm not going to necessarily say that they lost because what ended up happening after, you know, USF losing. Yes, the polytechnic campus which I'm sure was a loss for the university. What happened then was the budget deal? The budget battle that immediately followed that in early. Twenty twelve where JD Alexander basically is the guy who controlled the pen and control the money was going to say, you know, what USF you fought me on this. I'm gonna punish you and he was looking at cutting funding for the university somewhere in the neighborhood of one hundred and twenty eight million dollars. I mean that is like taking a blow torch to a university. That's almost a fifty percent budget cut at the time. And I remember there was a lot of talk about salaries being cut. So it was affecting people in personal level, a lot of angst around, there was and again, that, that goes all the way from faculty down to, how's it going affect students classes. We're talking about being caught, and you saw something similar when? Then preeminence happened with the university preeminence being a mercury get into that. But just as an explanation, a metric system that the state sets up that allows for extra funding for schools that reach these levels at a point in time when USF looked like it was going to attain preeminence, in join Florida and Florida state's the goalposts got moved, and I had the opportunity to watch the board of trustees and president Genshaft at that time rally the troops, and they did something similar with this budget battle back in two thousand twelve and this is again, that political animal that political power that a president needs to use is to reach out to the community to reach out to not just your board of trustees, but businesses around the community to reach out to lawmakers in the community to reach out to power brokers and say, we need a hand. We need your voice and reach out to your alumni, and your other constituency to say, call your Representative make your voice heard. Heard and president Genshaft has been really good at doing that. An anti a strong president in terms of someone who can be that spokesperson for the university to get out in front of the cameras and say, hey public, we need help. Help us out here and people reacted. This is Florida matters. I'm Robin Sesing ham, and we're talking about university of south Florida. President Judy Genshaft who's retiring after nineteen years, I'm here in the studio with USF assistant news directors Steve newborn, and Mark Schreiner and you probably also know, Mark from the long running university beat which has been covering US f people and events for ever. For many years. So Mark, you recently interviewed president, gin shafir university beat about her retirement. Let's hear a portion of that conversation. Now it's time to leave when you're on the top I was reviewing all that had occurred during this year, but it was from the work from years before, from a billion dollar campaign for a young university like ours to preeminence, which was phenomenal to five beta Kappa to what we received from the American Council, and education, which was the transformational award. You mentioned a lot of the successes. Are there other things that you feel maybe in terms of community presence, that has been increased the economic engine? That is USF that have been on that list of accomplishments for you as well. Absolutely. We have increased our affects in terms of. Economic development and impact that we make well over four point four billion dollars every year, we know that the patents that we produce this one of the largest in Florida and in the United States is well, we know that the students setting up corporations and the faculty that setup corporations is huge every year starting the National Academy of inventors was brilliant, because this now attracts people from all over the world who didn't have a place to talk to one another about invention. What are the things that you wish you had accomplished or you would've liked to have done if you had another year or two, well, they're always more accomplishments to achieve. It's like being on a ladder and you hit a certain rung, and you say okay, now it's time for the next, but we've hit such a point that we're now. And in new era the competition that we have nationally is at a different level. So it means we have to work even harder. They're always new markers that we need to achieve, whether it's the American research library association. We still are nine in that, but we will be this year. We did get five beta Kappa, all American Association of universities. Have a five beta Kappa chapter. Now, we do is well, if you had to pick one specific achievement that really was the pinnacle for the work that you did hear what do you think it would be? I truly believe that having the title of preeminence shed that we are among the top three universities in the state, and our students success is superlative. Our research is number two in the state public or private our economic development where in a great location and just be a part. Of all the good work that has been done move. It for what are you going to miss the most about the university? A lot oh, I'm passionate about the university, and I will always want to maintain the good relationships and friendships, that I've developed, but more than that. I really and truly want to see the university of south Florida become more and more prestigious more and more open to our community in make a difference. I'll flip the coin. What are you going to miss, the least? There are times when it's extraordinarily stressful. And not having that high of a level of stress will be nice. What's next, we love this area. So we're staying in Tampa Bay. There's no question about it. You have to stay tuned is to what's next. I don't think that I'll just sit at home at all. That's not who I am. But it's a crew change in a look and see what kind of opportunities become available. And if not, I'll make some happen, are there things that you regret or decisions that you wish you would have made differently that now you have the opportunity to just kind of look back at and go, maybe I could have done that differently. Well, you know, the presidency and leadership positions are filled with highs and lows. I often say presidency is like a roller coaster ride. Tremendous highs and there there are some pretty definite lows as well. And you just have to ride that through and make sure that you never lose focus on. Your goals, I've seen you mainly that first day of class, greeting students at the Marshall center, greeting students at the other campus is making them. Feel welcome at the university. What do you think that first day of school in August of twenty nineteen is going to be like for you? I'll be una cruise ship. I'll be having fun. Good answer. What advice do you have for your successor? Stephen Krell, be yourself, do what you believe to be right. Make sure you keep preeminence, in all the metrics in front of you, and keep the university of south Florida on the positive trajectory, and go forth and be strong. What message would you have for the students the faculty, the staff, the alumni of the university of south Florida continued to show your bowl pride, and always look at the future stay focused on your goals? Last question when you took this job in two thousand did you envision yourself? Eighteen years later at a preeminent university, still leading it and getting ready to step down. If you look at my inaugural speech, I used the word preeminent institution. I'm not sure I envisioned it quite the way it is right now. But I. I had that vision that we could really make a difference here. And we could really actualize the potential that I saw at the university. We've come a long way. Do you think it's a coincidence, Mark that she waited until the university achieved preeminence a preeminent ranking from the state before she resigned that was a big deal? I can definitely see why preeminence was something that she had pushed foreign, she when I asked her it's, it's definitely one of the top three or four things that you checks off our list in terms of greatest accomplishments at USF, I was personally surprised the timing of her retirement, the announcement, its up timber of last year, only because of the idea that consolidation was still in the works consolidation needs to be attained by July of twenty twenty so the new president even during the interview process for a new president. But how we now know Stephen corral, but at the time everyone who was interviewed for that job said my number one priority coming in is making sure that one consolidation goes well to that pre. Eminence is maintained after consolidation and that was what president Genshaft said as well should be the number one priority of corral, so she's leaving a little bit undone. She is a little bit one thing that she wanted to get done that she never was able to get done, and it's based more along the lines of the, the, the factors of how to become a member of the American Association of universities. It's a small club only sixty two universities around the US and Canada are members and it shows that you are a research university, the goal for a long time as USF joining that one of the things that she kind of feels that she left on the table that she couldn't get done. So what about Judy Genshaft s- role in the greater community? I mean, university of south Florida is a big university. She's had a big impact. Obviously, she's been really busy. But can either have you comment on what her role has been to the greater Tampa Bay community? I think it, it talks about the role of how USF grew in the community. The idea now that it's has a four almost a four and a half billion dollar annual economic impact on Tampa Bay in the region. It's unbelievable. You see the growth of all, three campuses, Sarasota, manatee is looking at adding residence halls as well as other buildings USF, Saint Petersburg, continues to make that transition from being a commuter school to a resident hall school, where students, live and study, Tampa, probably in Steve, you can attest to this someone who went here in the nineteen eighties that it was. A commuter school at the time and now ten thousand students living on campus. Yeah. Steve talk about talk about the changes that you've seen since you were a young boy. I'm going to give away my age here by going back that far. But when I started in the, the early eighties, this was a I think we have maybe a third of the students that are here now it was rather laconic place, where people came to, you know lounge by the pool. They called it the university of sun and fon bottle, cap you because there is a brewery, right down the street that was really the only business here at the time. I mean you risk getting sand, Spurs walking across campus because there was nothing there, but, you know, dirt and sand and many palm trees like they have now and it was really a place where people who warrant so academically inclined came to school here, I'm probably giving myself away. Unlike today, where you have to have a, you know, four point plus GPA to get in. And when I came back to. Work here came back in two thousand one a few years later, and I didn't recognize the place. It was like my school had gone on steroids amazing growth, and even since then I mean I came a few months after president Genshaft assume the presidency and since then you can't even recognize it from from that period. I mean we've probably grown by four times the number of buildings here is incredible. You ge- and that coincides with not only president in Chaffetz rain for lack of a better word, but also the board of trustees taking affect the border. Trustees was established just before she came, and they're really put a focus as Mark can tell you on fundraising, and reaching out to the community as opposed to the old board of regents, which was more of an academically inclined board. And so, you know, we have become so focused on fundraising since. The board of trustees was established here and president gen chap really has fit that Bill quite well. And one of the things that was a goal of hers, that was attained probably about two and a half years ago or so was the idea of the unstoppable campaign, which was to raise a billion dollars in fundraising for the university. USF is one of only three schools ever to attain that one billion dollar fundraising Mark for university that's under I believe a hundred years old, and the other two are out in the university of California system. So it's, it's that idea that the growth came with this need for funding. And that funding has come in and she brought in some big gifts. The names Moumouh Moumouh or Sanni Sita Peterman, ital- Patel. And this also one of the things that she has been very good about is giving credit to her staff, and the people that around her and the people that they brought in one of the people who doesn't who doesn't get the credit at least publicly that he should is Joel Momberg, who's the head of the US foundation, who's in charge of fundraising, and I will make the argument because Joel retires later this year as well. Is that the loss of Joel Momberg? Is going to mean as much to the university of south Florida as the loss of Judy Genshaft? That is Mark Schreiner assistant news director at WSF and longtime producer of university beat, and Steve, newborn is here. Also, WSF assistant news, director and reporter. Thank you guys very much for being here. That's it for today's show you can tweet us at Florida matters. Florida matters is a production of WSF public media. The engineer is George goven. The show is produced by Stephanie Columbanus. I'm Robin sussing ham. Thanks for listening.
Uncertainty Remains As K-12 Schools and Colleges Open For Class
"Welcome to Florida matters. I'm Bradley George Students from kindergarten to college are headed back to class this week schools and universities are taking steps to prevent the spread of Corona virus but is it enough? University of North Carolina and Notre Dame have suspended in person classes due to cove nineteen outbreaks. What our universities in Florida doing to prevent that from happening and just to know we recorded this episode Monday morning in a few hours. Later, there was a major ruling that change states border. K. Through twelve schools must offer face to face instruction and in order to provide you the listener with the most up-to-date information I followed up with one of our guests WSF Education reporter Kerry Sheridan about what the ruling means. Sue carry a couple of teachers. Unions had sued over the states order to provide face to face instruction at the start of the school year and a judge ruled yesterday in favor of the unions. What is that ruling actually mean for the start of school and students actually returning to classrooms. while. It doesn't mean anything right now because the State Department of Education filed an appeal on late last night as well. So what that means is the appeal puts on hold any decision that the judge has made until the appeals process plays out. So this morning Hillsborough County held a workshop they discussed it briefly the lawyer for Hillsborough County said what? This means is since the First District Court of Appeals now has the case lawyers for the Florida education. Association have two weeks to file their briefs that appeals case then depending on the outcome of that, it could even make its way to the Florida Supreme Court. So the timing of all this is really going to be the next big question. So, while this legal process is playing out those the school year on. What does it mean for for students and for parents while this case plays out? Well, it means that whatever the local school board has decided has to go ahead. So for example, in Hillsborough County, they're doing remote learning for the first week, and then they reopened their doors for brick and mortar next week that is all going to stay. The same everything that's already been decided basically stays the same and Hillsborough Superintendent of schools. Addison Davis said this morning that that's important to him because he wants parents to have some measure of. Knowledge. That things will go ahead as planned at, it also prevents them from losing any money from the state if they were to divert from that plan. So for right now it's everything goes ahead. It's almost as if this decision didn't happen. And now let's get to the rest of the episode from Monday here with maybe a assume aren't care Sheridan whose WSF's Education reporter Jay Wolfson a University of South Florida Public Health, professor, and Anna Lynne, Winfrey a new college of Florida student and Editor in Chief of the student newspaper the catalyst. Welcome to all of you. Carry I'll start with you in terms of your reporting looking at K. through twelve schools at school district at colleges. What have you learned about some of the some of the steps and precautions are being taken as as schools and universities start their fall semesters. Or there's been a big emphasis on things like separating desks trying to keep students apart social distancing wearing masks, things like that. That are just kind of protective measures against the spread of coronavirus. But. School boards have been hearing from medical experts that really the atmosphere. The air in a room is just as important as some of these measures, and that's less clear that there are measures in place that can protect against the aerosol spread of Corona virus. So certainly, schools are doing what they can. But. It's not clear that they are able to do everything that they can. Beyond things like that what are what are some of the other preparations that have been going on leading up to the start of the fall semester? Recently got some information from Sarasota County schools, which opens next week they have a flow chart that they've put out about what kinds of situations would require a student to stay hall and it's pretty interesting I'm not sure that it's really been communicated to all parents yet as a as a parent of students in Sarasota County. I haven't heard this but as a reporter, I have seen it and. Basically, it asks the students to stay home if they have a temperature of one, hundred point four or greater if they have a sore throat, any kind of new cough or difficulty breathing derail vomiting, or abdominal pain or the new onset of severe headache. So those are the symptoms that schools are asking students to stay home with because the fact is we have no reliable test we have no fast test for. who may have corona virus and that is the biggest danger is that students or staff will come into school building with it and possibly spread it. Yeah I. Know You talked with a university Florida researcher? WHO said you know that's really Kinda. The sticking point is that we don't have rapid testing and that's going to be a concern as more schools and universities reopened and there's there's possibly more risk for for the virus spread. We've heard the term hygiene theater on that. Some places are just taking a lot of steps to make it look as if they're something which you know it's it's admirable that they are trying certainly we all WanNa try our best, but we have to be realistic about the facts and the fact is we had no fast turnaround tests for buyers. So what we are doing is opening the schools for children and staff to go in and we. have. No Way of knowing in anything less than forty eight to seventy, two hours on average if a person is positive for coronavirus. So that's why these sorts of symptoms checks arms symptom lists are important for parents to know that if your kid has a sore throat or if you're a college student and you have a sore throat, you should stay home because that's the only protection we have is trying to keep infected people home from school. Let's turn to colleges because you did some reporting on Eckerd College in Saint Petersburg they're doing some experimentation with with outdoor classes to of maximize social distancing took. Can you kind of explain what what they're doing they're? Pretty Innovative Idea they actually mapped out the campus to see what kinds of spaces were available were students could camp out in a class could be held. So that included parking lots, picnic tables, even just shaded areas on a green under trees and they found that they were quite a quite a number of places that they hadn't thought of before where they could hold classes outdoors course rain and. Season is going to be concerned mostly through September and October, but they have a online reservation system where professors can look for a spot reserved that spot and then communicate to their students like bring a chair, bring your laptop and will meet their unless it rains in which case will be remote. And Elaine I wanNA turn to you. Now, your students at New College in Sarasota. Let's go back to the spring semester when when the pandemic started, how did the remainder of that semester play out for you? Will. As with everybody else the news struck us all by surprise and so but we also were expecting for things to be shifted remotely so. There were some minor hiccups in the technology with some professors figuring out how to use doom and stuff like that. But I would say it worked out pretty well. But for me at least it, it kind of started about two weeks after getting home I really started feeling isolated and really missing my friends all those spontaneous social interactions that I was used to around campus. So. For the catalyst while we did is we transitioned to have only production. Because obviously nobody was on campus in nobody could read a printed paper too. But yeah, it was abrupt but expected. So you're back on campus. Now in Sarasota, what does it? What does it look like what steps are being taken, and also what do your peers? What are they are they nervous or anxious about what's that enough's being done to stop the spread of the virus? Actually living at a house near campus off campus because I personally didn't feel wouldn't have felt safe being on campus just because of all the other students around they're expecting or they I think they have back now. Already about four students, which is about half the student body but the everybody had to get a Kobe test before coming to campus. But still only at a point in time, there is of course weeks or a couple of weeks before everyone got back that there was out window and they're also doing ten percent random testing of. The student body to see if there's any hot spots that like you were saying earlier there still isn't that rapid testing. So there's only so much we can do and I mean yet our math mandates anytime you lose your dorm and of course, for the few in person classes that are happening everybody in classes task to wear masks. But I'd say people are most people that I've talked to are are still a little wary and cautious. About the spread of the martyrs. Jay. Wolfson alternative you now What's what's the contingency plan? What what happens if we start to see clusters and spread on an Allen Campuses here in Florida as we've seen and as I mentioned at the top of the show at UNC, purdue at other places what's the plan here in Florida if that were to happen. I think the plan is to learn continuously from the experiences of those who are ahead of us like Chapel Hill and other universities. Dr Donna Peterson is leading our campus wide effort to coordinate across all of our colleges, all of our divisions. In both the classroom sessions and on the virtual side and I think the bottom line of this is Bradley that we have to continue to monitor very carefully until we do get rapid tests and we might get them by late fall in quantities we have to watch for those hot spots. So if we begin to see groups of students in someplace displaying those symptoms we Russian, we cloistered, we contain it we do the case tracing we make sure their families are protected and we're GONNA learn as we go with this, which is part of it. We've had to do with Kelvin and every day what we learn is how much we don't know. And we should also mention for USF as well. Some of the steps that Anna Lynne mentioned at new college are also affected USF. Random testing. There's for for everybody students, employees, faculty. There's a little checklist that you have to fill out every day. If you you're feeling sick and there's a pass that you're supposed to McHugh Arco. Case, Campus Police I guess guests have any questions as well, and you said we've kind of had to the public health response for this. We just kind of had to develop it as go as we learn more about this virus. Yeah that's good news and bad news because the quality of the data are based on our ability to test process those tests quickly. And then use those data to. To get into a risky environment and then the other part of it is policing it rallying. Any campus, even even a small small campus like new college. You have to be able to police it. So if somebody walks into a classroom and they're not wearing a mask and the professor says, excuse me, we need to wear the mask and students says I don't WanNa wear a mask or my parents told me I don't have to wear a mask. we've already have protocols in place how to how to address that but these are are challenging issues for our faculty members and for other students. That we're GONNA work through, it went learn again as we go. We expect that we will see those circumstances. aniline your your classmates, and your peers feel about wearing masks. Well really all of my friends are. You'll find about it. I mean it's it's a small inconvenience for yourself in that it's mildly uncomfortable around your mouth nose area but I feel like most people know that it's just a small stuff that each of us has to do in order to protect everybody else rate because without rabid testing public mask wearing. One of the best ways to contain the spread of the virus and nature that everybody's Okay You're listening to Florida matters I'm Bradley. George. Were talking about students returning to class at schools and universities in the Tampa Bay region and we're talking with my WSF colleague Kerry Sheridan. Also Jay Wolfson a public health professor at the University of South Florida and Anna Lynne Winfrey who is Editor of the Student newspaper at College, of Florida to take a short break here, and we'll resume our conversation in just a moment. This is Florida matters WSF eighty, nine point seven I'm probably George. We're talking about returning to class in the middle of pandemic with Kerry, Sheridan from W. USF Jay Wolfson a public health professor at the University of South Florida and New College of Florida Student Anna Lynne Winfrey J. Ken can school districts and universities be held liable for covert outbreaks on campus. Can any legal action be taken? We're seeing some of that happened right now. And in North Carolina with UNC students. Yeah. I expected. We will see some of that these standards about this have not been developed generally It would be considered a work related or an environmentally related injury. We saw a lot of this after nine eleven where firefighters and police officers experienced trauma and illness and disease after their exposure and it took years before the federal government and local governments were able to respond because initially those claims were denied. For Workers Compensation we're actually seeing the same thing in local fire departments and police departments, throughout Florida, where those exposure claims are being denied. So the challenge is for. The the government and the Senate of the United States is trying to put in place a new set of laws that would increase the standard to raise the bar so that a an injured party would have to show gross negligence or intentional misconduct in order to be potentially liable and that they would also increase the bar by showing that. They have to have clear and convincing evidence, which is like seventy or eighty percent as opposed to a preponderance of the evidence, which is legal standard of just over fifty percent. There are a lot of teachers, a lot of parents, a lot of students who are expressing concern about changing the standard at the same time universities and school districts have to be able to demonstrate I think to the public as a matter of public trust that they're doing everything. They can to act reasonably rationally and responsibly, and if they do that and there are set guidelines that we can all agree on then the likelihood of a successful lawsuit would be diminished but my legal colleagues especially those who appear on the sides of buses and a large poster boards and on every page and yellow pages. This is this is part of the business tactic for a lot of attorneys they will go after cases that give them some publicity, and this is certainly going to attract some of those. So the best thing that the universities and the school systems can do is document everything they do follow guidelines and standards that are developed by their associations or by their local legislative bodies and act reasonably responsibly. The same way we expect our students and faculty to do. Kerry you've been watching a lot of the local school boards as they talk about reopening plans and talk about some of the issues what have been some of the concerns among school board members, school administrators about re-opening school right now. Made Well Hillsborough County had brought a panel of medical experts in front of them to speak about some of the real indicators that they need to be looking at the community, the metrics in what what does a save reopening. Really. And what they heard was It depends a lot on the level of virus in the community. So if you have a high level of transmission that's always going to be a concern. We do know that our our numbers in Florida are trending downward but there's still a lot of question about whether they're low enough and what if we can do enough to keep them low? But at the school board meetings, also there's been public comment where we have quite a number of parents who are very vocal about the choice that they want to be able to make to send their children back to school. They believe it's a choice that they should be allowed to exercise. So you have these concerns about health and safety versus rental choice. You also have the argument that. Students need to be in school. There are a number of reasons why it's danger to children when they're not in school. So there's a lot to balance out there and it was very interesting in Hillsborough, county at one point or at Member Camera Schamberger asked the whole panel. Is it safe to reopen right now? Would you say yes or no, and the whole panel said no except for Douglas Holt who's the health department officer and he said he didn't believe it was his role to provide that kind of advice. I WANNA. Pick your journalists brain a little bit I'm curious to know what sort of stories have you reported already about how new new college has handled the virus response. Oh Yeah. So there is a big deal at the start of it when all students had to leave campus and everybody was really confused because initially there was a petitioning period where you could go back. Where we could ask to stay on campus and one, hundred, two, hundred people applied for that and so they realized what his second we can't let everybody stay on campus who asked you so There was a kind of a big deal because then it was had had narrowed down. On campus who couldn't and that criteria was a little bit unclear free time I'm so that was a little bit issue at the very beginning of the pandemic back in March and It was. Also the there were a couple issues the switching over to online learning I would say for the most part. We all kind of understood how this crisis was. We also had to do our small part and go home and. It was really frustrating at the beginning but. I think that shock value kind of faded. And everything. Kinda sunk in it was just like, okay. Well, this is out of our control in. All we can do is just. Keep at it and keeps stealing. So. Now. The the semesters resumed again in your back in Sarasota. What what stories are you interested in pursuing now about about how new college is handling coronavirus? I'm really curious to see if if there's any students who test positive I'd love to talk with them get their experiences about what it's been like being in having to go into mandatory quarantine they set aside dorms for that. So I'm curious what that will be like her students who eventually test positive and I'm also very curious you how the school will respond to that to. What like I'm I'm still I still don't know what the threshold is right like how many cases will. Need what we need to hit before students are have to evacuate the dorms again, how many cases before I'll classes are resumed Remotely so Just what's going to happen next and how the new COLLAGEN stations can responders. I'm really curious about an individual student experience. How important is it to have student media right now because you've got, you've got the university and they have official statements and things but. What's kind of what you see your role in your publications role is at at a time. I think it's really important for us to cover. All said the story as usual because the college puts out all of its PR in all that. And of course, we use that to as informational sources but of course they can. They can decide what to include in this stores versus what not to include an stories based off of whether it'll make the college look good or not and It's not like I want to make the college look bad. I. Just want to make sure that the entire story is told. Kerry. You talked a little bit about some of the feedback that parents had in some of the school board meetings. What are some of the other questions concerns that have come up for you and your reporting as you've talked to folks about the virus about reopening schools right now Really, just don't know what this is going to look like They don't know how many students be in their child's class if elected to send their child back into a classroom. They don't know how if they decided to stay remote how is a kindergartener first grader going to stay in front of a screen all day and working parents, working mothers and fathers how are they going to work and lead their children through school all day. These are huge questions that were really right up against the day going back to school, and we have no idea how these are going to play out. Another huge question is really what is going to happen when there are cases on campus? When will they close? We've heard the governor talk about how he wants to take a more surgical approach. He's calling it if there's a exposure in a classroom to only quarantine those who are really within six feet of that person for more than fifteen minutes but I think anyone who's really been in school knows that those kinds of decisions are incredibly to come across a scientific late children are mingling all the time masks on masks off whether they're supposed to be on all the time we're not. So. There are a lot of concerns about who should quarantine for how long and how are we going to manage this opening and closing of schools whether it's the school that opens and closes or the individual child has to stay home for two weeks and maybe go back after two weeks. J What are what are some of your concerns of the concerns of your faculty colleagues at? About about restarting. Many of them are the same and that is how they will address violations of the rules. How the system will address an outbreak on campus and being able to trace it back and determine at what point they will either isolated classroom or close the entire place down and how much information is being routinely shared with everybody. Transparency is vitally important in this process, and that means that the university has to be able to. Broadcast information effectively of through our radio stations through our newspapers and also through the local. And radio stations and television stations. So, that people know that they feel that they're being told the truth that's been a tremendous issue for much of the public throughout these last seven or eight months of covid because of the quality of the data in the questions about what's true. So I think if if we ensure that much information is shared as quickly as possible than those of us, who in positions of making policy decisions can make them in the most informed way and the people who are affected by. It will know that we're doing our best everybody realizes that we're still kind of flying blind here we're GONNA learn as we go. The governor can say that he wants to have a dimmer switch instead of a an on-off switch I think is fair. But I think we all have to be prepared in the worst case scenario to UNC did. But then how long do we do that? We say we're GONNA closed classes down throughout the entire semester. Yale at the beginning of this entire thing in March said, we're not starting classes again until may twenty twenty one. which is a a huge leap forward. So again, it's it's the responsible respectable decisions being conscious of what we're doing who are affecting sharing that information and learning as we go Bradley. This is this is still something we just don't know a lot about flu season's coming up hurricane season is here. There's a lot of balls in the air here that's going to be very. Challenging for policymakers for police officers for firefighters were administrators of the institutions at the secondary level at the education at the university level at the primary level to figure out how they can best manage the essential role of teaching students, protecting faculty and providing parents with the assurances they need to either go back to work or decide take their kids and teach them at home. Analyn what to your classes look at look like right now or are they mostly remote? Are you going to campus at all as a hybrid? What? What's the deal? Yeah. So I'm taking four classes this flaw. And three of them are going to be fully remote because the professor has chosen to stay at home and not go on campus, and then one of them is a hybrid class. So the teacher a professor will be holding in Khorasan sessions on campus, but I'm opting to continue to take the classroom just because I. even when people are everybody's wearing masks, I still don't quite want to return to campus in that info capacity yet I might catch my mind later. I I. Don't think I will. How important? How how much of a difference does it make for you to be back on campus versus doing this all from your from your parents home in Colorado Well funny that you ask that because. Yeah like what I was missing was was being around people. So I'm in a in an off campus house with three other people and it's just nice to be living with people my age I mean I, love my family of my sister but it's just nice to to people my own age again and also our campus is beautiful and I'm looking forward to going on some masks walk since staying clear from others as I go down to the Bay Chris Onset but yet. It's different to be in an actual environment instead of doing a whole other semester Meighan people. That is Anna Lynn Winfrey, a student at New College of Florida and editor of New College. Student newspaper we also heard from Jay Wolfson University of South Florida Public Health Professor, and W. Education reporter Kerry Sheridan thanks to all of you for joining us today. Here. Today's show was produced by Dinara previous, and if you missed part of the conversation or one listen again, you can find it at w you asked half news dot work. I'm Bradley George. Thank you for listening to Florida matters and join us again next week.
Special Edition: Dr. Jason Salemi and Dr. Charlene Flash (July 20, 2020)
"And. This is Houston matters special edition I'm earning news on today. Show Dr Charlene. FLASH WILL BE WITH US infectious disease expert at college, medicine and Presidency Yoga Avenue three sixty health and wellness. Why is she here plus? We're going to be taking your questions on everything from vaccines to masks, and we're also going to do a segment on nifty busting all. That's coming up in just a little bit the phone number. Number here, seven, one, three, four, four, zero, eight, eight, seven, zero, seven, three, four, four, zero, eight seventy, but we start the show trying to dig a little deeper in what we understand in how we know it. Dr! Jason Soleil is a specialist epidemiology as well as public health, surveillance and data systems, he joins us from the University of South Florida and we're thrilled to have him on the show Hello Dr Seleny. Thanks for having me. Thank you I saw you the other day on. CNN and I was fascinated at how quickly and easily you summed up things that we have in topics. We have been dealing with for weeks here and people are extremely. I'll start right here. At the top. People are extremely concerned about the tests. They're taking what tests they're taking and how to understand if these results are accurate enough. Why are some people getting results immediately? Why do some after wait? Seven fourteen days for results? help us understand these tests. Yeah I think it's an excellent question, and so I'll start with two different heights of tests that we talk about so one of them is a viral something that detects whether or not you have an active infection to the novel corona various. The other type of test is the antibody or serology tests, so let's break these down separately, so let's start with the viral. Viral test, there are two different kinds of viral tests and it goes back to the type of question you were asking about. Why do we get some quick results? Wire their big delays. So the two types of viral tests one is called real time PTR, which stands for polymerase chain reaction, and essentially that's when you get a swab of your nose or throat and. And what we're looking for is the genetic material that's on the virus, and so because when they do that. Swab the amount of virus that they're actually able to obtain is is relatively small. The process involves amplification of that genetic material that we're looking for, and so you know what the result is a really good ability to detect that genetic material if you indeed. Indeed have the virus, and so the result of the real time. PTR is that it's extraordinarily accurate. It's actually really near one hundred percent, so whether or not you get a positive or negative test results. You can trust that. That's all great information, but the problem with this test is there are lags in the ability to get it back in a timely fashion now. I've heard that the text itself can be done in six to eight hours, but the time it takes to transport the samples. The quantity of tests that are being run especially in states like Texas and Florida. It can take up to a week. We've been hearing again. There are a lot of reasons that underlie that, so that's the beauty of this second type of viral test called the. The second one. Let me just. Quick question that we had a couple of times from listeners already as the delay in getting the test samples to be tested. Could that change the the makeup of the sampling they're looking at and so the delay in testing the virus dies off or something in the amount of time. My my understanding and to be very clear as an epidemiologist I am not a by Raji, expert or an expert in the underpinnings of these types I think that's why maybe I can explain it. Simply because my understanding is very superficial but you know again. I don't think I've read anything that suggests that the longer these materials are in solution and waiting to be tested that the accuracy goes down. My understanding is that the accuracy is again near one hundred percent regardless of how long it takes because of the solution that they put it in the way that they're able to preserve the sample. Okay so moving on that? You're about to take me to the Antigen test absolutely so again. The second one is the Antigen test, and the beauty of this is. We don't have to wait very long. You can get your results back in fifteen to thirty minutes and again just to explain a little bit of what this is doing. It's also a nasal swab so very similar in terms of the sample that it's taking instead of looking for the genetic material of the virus were looking for proteins. Proteins on the surface of the virus, and so because this process the way that they actually do this test in the fact that they can get back very quickly. There's not an amplification like there is in the real time. PTR and so all that means is even if you have the virus, and you have these pro teams that are sitting the surface of the virus, we may fail to detect it with this test, the sensitivity or the ability to detect the virus in people who actually. Actually have the virus can be as low as eighty percent, which means that twenty out of every one hundred people who received this test may come back as a false negative so again two different types of tests and again there are benefits and drawbacks of both, but one thing that I'll say about the antigen you I just read a paper recently from nature medicine, and what they were suggesting and I agree with him wholeheartedly. Is that despite the problems with accuracy I? Think the ability to get. Get results quickly and not have to wait for a week with people now who have been tested and they're in limbo and who knows that they're interacting with others and spreading the virus before they know the results I think the speed is something that should be prioritized over perfect accuracy, and all of this. The problem emerged when I found out that you know when we start to mix the results of these tests as we try and understand the proportion of the population that is testing positive. And I know we'll get to this unjust moment, but I'm curious if you have taken one of the Antigen tests, and you take it a second or third time. Are you going to keep getting the same sort of response because of what they're gathering from you, or could you get different results from it? Absolutely I think you could get different results. This is all about the material that flobbed how much protein ends up in there? There are a lot of factors that that certainly go into it and I think what the recommendations are now is that because of those inaccuracies and the potential for false negatives with the Antigen? Test is if you take the antigen test, you get the result back immediately if it comes back negative, the next step is to take that real time. Pr Tested. Even though there's GonNa be a delay. At least you'll then have a very high accuracy test to tell you the true result. And I know people are getting confused between Antigen and antibody tests. Those are vastly different also. Badly different again because the antigen test is all about determining, do you have an active infection right now? The antibody test so when you're exposed to this virus. One of the things that your immune system is going to do is build up antibodies something that is going to be able to help you to fight the virus. Those take a while to build up. So what the beauty of the? The antibody test is you can take antibody test, and if they detect antibodies that are specific to this novel Corona Virus, it means that you have been infected because we know that a high proportion of people may be infected and not develop any signs or symptoms, so this can help you to know whether or not you were infected any point in time the problem with the antibody test. As we try and plan for a pandemic, and is there. An outbreak is again. It's just a look in the rear view mirror, so you maintain an antibody test tomorrow test positive, but you could have actually gotten the virus back in March so again it's it's good at the individual level. It's good because you heard the governor of my state you know in his press conference today calling for people to donate their plasma, certainly if they have antibodies, because that can those antibodies in the plasma, the donate can help. treat people who are currently experiencing an active infection. But again in terms of you really shouldn't mix the results of any of these types of tests together. Because again they can say very different things. Okay, now there's two different routes I want to go, and I'm trying to think which one I can segue out of when we're done, but we're going to start with right here in taking the test multiple times and something you've seen that's happening in. Florida I? Don't know if it's happening here in Texas or not, but it's the way they count number of tests to positives as opposed to people to positives. Can you explain? Yeah absolutely, and again you know this all emerged as I started to build a dashboard. 'cause you know just to take a quick step back how I got involved in all of this. Because this is not what I really want. A daily basis epidemiology is but certainly not this deep level of tracking was the lack of granularity and the data that was available on the State Department of Health's webpage. You know when they published on the number of cases I wanted to drill down deeper as a maternal and child health epidemiologist I wanted to know what was happening in the pediatric population, and so you know one thing I will give a lot of credit to Florida is. Is a lot of these data at a granular level or available for download? They're just kind of behind the scenes, so I started to pull that information together in an effort to try and drill down deeper and so I started to chat with the people who track this information nationally, the national, Cova, tracking project, and so we started to talk a lot about case positively. It's something that's immensely important in you know not only looking at the number of new cases on a daily basis, because there is some validity to. If you test more, you will find more cases, but an associated thing. Is this case positivity rate so again? Our understanding currently has the following. What I think we WANNA know intuitively as population is of all of the people who are being tested for the novel Corona Virus. What percentage of them are testing positive? It's a very simple thing very intuitive to understand. Florida instead reports what's called the test positivity rate, and so as you alluded to this kind of multiple cats. In the numerator of the positivity rate are all people who test positive for the first time in the denominator. Is All tests performed? But here's the catch with that, so if a person tests positive multiple times, so you acquire the virus, you test positive for the first time you're supposed to continue to get tested, so you can know when you actually start testing negative. So in the you know in the process of getting those multiple test, you'll have a positive a positive positive. Only one of those positives discounted the first time. You have positive, but it's a little different for the negative results and again people who are tested multiple times might be people who work for department of Health or firefighters. You know they might get tested weekly or even more frequently, and so they might return back negative actor negative. All of those negative results are included in the denominator, and so because right now in Florida one in every four test is a repeat test this can. Can, have a big impact on what the tech positivity rate is, and so the one thing I want to say before I give the same example. I gave over the air that I think really understand this, 'cause it is some dense material is this is a valid measure test positively is a valid measure to understand what's going on I said on the air. It's misleading and here's why so if we have ten people and those ten people are tested weekly for five weeks. At the end of five weeks, let's say on that last week. Five of the ten people and the testing positive. What Florida would report is that five out of fifty test came back positive. That's a ten percent tech positivity rate. But I just told you that. Five out of ten people in the span of five weeks tested positive. It's fifty percent of people so when I've been arguing that would really help you know understand what's going on between repeat tests versus the proportion of people who are tapping positive, give us the numbers that the level of the test and also give us the numbers at the level of the person. Do. We have any idea why there isn't a national standard for this. I don't know. A lot of the a lot of emerges all of these things that I've been tackling in trying to understand the data and help other people to understand the data whether it's death or current hospitalization data, or this positivity rate is the lack of a national recommendation for what should be done and guidance documents that come out that clearly define all of these things I I think that would preclude people like me from having to ask so many questions I am constantly including this morning emailing people at the Department of Health again to try and better. The information that they're providing and so I can't answer that question I I really do wish there was a national standard because it would make all of our lives a lot easier. I WANNA go on to some other things, but I did get an email. Question came in, and the person wrote I got a positive result in a thirty minute antigen test, and a negative result in a five day PR test, which should I trust. Excellent question so again there might be other people who have the specifics because there are different types of engine custom, fortunately different manufacturers, I would say in general, because all of these tests have a sensitivity and specificity metric that says how good is this test? The sensitivity is all about how good is it at detecting the virus and people who have it? The specificity is all about you know reporting negative. A person is indeed negative and so I think on both of those metrics regardless. Regardless the real time. PCR is the more accurate tests so I would put more stock in the real time PTR but I would also talk to your physician about this because again it would always concern me even though it might be a really small chance that the real time. PTR reports a false negative. The positive test you know I would maybe want to be cautious about how I'm starting to interact with other people so again, certainly talking to your healthcare provider as smart thing to. Okay, we're GONNA take a quick break here in Dr Hope. You'll stay with me just a little bit longer, but you are listening to Houston matters special edition I'm Ernie Moose and we're taking calls. If you'd like seven, one, three, four, four, zero, eight, seven, zero. Remember coming up in just a little bit. We will be talking with Dr Charlene. Flash so call it. We'll be right back. Houston public media is a service of the University of Houston and supported with your gifts to the Houston Public Media Foundation more information at Houston, public media dot org slash donate a big problem right now. On the freeways heading in southwest freeway northbound sixty nine right before the downtown spur we see on Houston Trans Star Camera Right now. All mainline shutdown for high water, even though we haven't had a whole lot of widespread rain, what has fallen here near downtown has been especially heavy over the last hour, so so again we have high water shutting down the freeway northbound sixty-nine, an the downtown spur. Support for Houston that comes from members like you in from Chevron. In supporting Houston by sharing ideas and information to make this community stronger Chevron investing in human energy from Texas. Children's hospital nationally ranked US news and world. Report, Texas Children's is dedicated to providing pediatric care close to home more Texas children's dot org slash best and from Medico, featuring a short term care insurance plan designed to help protect personal finances and provide peace of mind when planning for future care details at AARP or p short dash term care dot com. This special edition I'm Ernie. Moose my guest right now is Dr Jason Salami. He is an epidemiologist with a unique interest in reporting the data and the information surrounding covid nineteen. He comes to us from the University of South Florida where he's been putting together his own dashboard of all the information they need to know, and we're talking about all these little bits of tests and information I WANNA go back and go back to one thing you said before we move on. Is You talked about testing and identifying more cases of late there has been a lot of talk coming from the top of the government about testing, causing cases, not true correct I. Let first math books thing. That's an easy one absolutely big rubber-stamped, not true at all. Yeah, what we're doing is we're identifying cases. It doesn't create them. There aren't more or less because you get tested. They're the same number of positives out there. We just don't know it. That's the difference, absolutely correct and the big thing to dispel about that is. Testing is an important component to all of this. It doesn't change the reality. Even if we didn't do any testing, the cases would still be there. The problem is we wouldn't know about him. We wouldn't have the evidence that we need to open up schools to open up businesses or pull the dial back on it so trusting, just help us to understand what the truth is. It does not actually create any cases. Thank you for that one now. Another point that you had brought up earlier than I wanted to circle back to as we move forward in this. Is You know you think testing? Okay? I can see why there's complications and testing, but one thing you can't refute is the number of hospitalizations. But as it turns out, they're categorizing people differently, too, so it's not as claim, clear and simple as it seems. I'll let you take that one. It's not at all so unfortunately. I was disappointed that Florida up until about a week and a half ago, one of only three states that failed to report couric hospitalizations due to covid nineteen, the other two states were Kansas in Hawaii, and obviously the difference in what the the surge in the pandemic is in those states is very different from Florida or Texas, so I was happy to see a week and a half ago that they did start to report current hospitalizations by county, and so as you alluded to. You know the problem with tracking. Is People will say well the cases it doesn't mean anything cases, cases cases, but how much severe illness is going on, obviously, if you need to be hospitalized for something that is a severe circumstance, and so the problem with the current. As they data although I'm happy that it's available is what they're choosing to provide information on so first of all. There's not a lot of guidance. It's a very simple site, and it's literally got the county and a number of current hospitalizations out much guidance so I'm going by what the title of this says, and it says current life patients with a primary diagnosis. Diagnosis of covid nineteen metres the problem. The when you're hospitalized, you may be hospitalized. Let's say for a heart attack, but you may have diabetes and number of other conditions, and each of those conditions when you're hospitalized, received the diagnosis code. One of those is the primary, but you have a lot of other things that are contributing to the reason that you're hospitalized. By focusing on current hospitalizations with a primary Kobe nineteen diagnosis, I think you're missing a big piece of the Pie. Here's one egregious example of where you're actually missing people, so if you look at what the CDC recommends for pregnant women who are hospitalized due to Cova nineteenth cove in nineteen is the actual reason that they're hospitalized. The coating guidance says don't assign cove nineteen at their principal diagnosis assign a pregnancy related code that reflects a virus is impacting pregnancy, and then put the Kobe nineteen diagnosis second. So what that means in Florida is the. The way that they choose to report this information. Those pregnant women who were hospitalized due to Cova nineteen are not included in our current hospitalization numbers, and so there may be other examples again I don't know the coding guidelines for everything I'm a maternal and child health up in me. Just so I know it pretty well for mothers and babies, but they're missing a big piece of the Pie and even a bigger issue is as I tried to educate myself on this I talked to a lot of clinicians, and they all tell me the same thing. Whether. A patient has a primary diagnosis cove in nineteen or a secondary diagnosis of covid nineteen. It complicates the hospitalization that much more we still have to use personal protective equipment. We're still utilizing hospital resources to a higher degree. It's taking more staff so again. What I'd like to see is just comprehensiveness in reporting. It's not that the information provided isn't important I think it's just incomplete so I'd like to see all departments of health, either just give us the total number of people who have covid nineteen hospitals, or if you want to report it separately, give me all of the ones where the primary diagnosis, but then also give me everybody else. WHO's currently hospitalized with Kobe. Nineteen All of that said there are still some determine its we should be looking at, and I'm curious your thoughts on which ones we should be considering when dealing with planning healthcare. Thinking about community reopening or what's on everyone's mind right now? Returning to school, what do we need to be looking at? And what are your thoughts on this? Well, you know I think the decision to return to school is certainly not a one size fits all answer. I'm not GONNA say universally. It's a good or bad decision. I think it depends on community transmission in your area for. Areas in Florida and a lot of areas in Texas. When you have a surging pandemic I think it's a bad idea so going back quickly to when you said. What should we be monitoring again? We receive a lot of criticism. If we focus too much on the just the cases cases cases, so let's pay attention I think the biggest metric right now is the hospitalization data you know we look at mortality from covid nineteen I think that's a hugely important piece of the Pie, but because it takes so long, you know after somebody gets exposed to when they develop signs and symptoms to one, they get hospitalized. Hospitalized if they do die when they die, and then the lagging reporting of that death by the time we actually hear about a covid nineteen death. That person was probably exposed four or five weeks ago, so it doesn't help us to know, are we experiencing a surge? Hospitalizations have less of a lag, which is why that information was so important in Florida, and so you know again I think if we have a surging pandemic, it's irresponsible and here's just a few of the reasons. Why so we think about the I? Think there's pretty clear evidence so far. The jury is still out things related to Kobe. We think about child to child transmission if I send my child into school, are they likely to pass it to one another well there? There's a lot of evidence. The child child, transmission and child to adult transmission is less than adult to adult transmission right, but still occurs, and if you have a lot of community, outbreak of the virus and a lot of people circulating with it, there will be enough children who come into schools with the virus, and they're not only you know it's not just about. Everybody likes to point to the fact that thank God. You know the likelihood of severe illness. you know occurs in children. It's a lot less likely than. Than it is in other age groups, but I'm part of a national tracking project called the Code Kid Project and are over seven hundred eighty children that have been admitted to a pediatric intensive care unit. These are not hospitalizations. These are severe enough for intensive care and you know there there are nearly one hundred that have died and so again the serious, if enough kids are getting it, even though the likelihood of a bad outcome is rare, if too many catches than you're still getting a lot of kids who experience severe illness, it's not only got its who else is in schools, teachers, staff, and a lot of these teachers, the old guard who have the grit. To stay in this profession, they are high risk. I've talked to a number of them. you know first and second graders and they're like you know I'm GonNa High Risk Category. What happens when the these kids are not going to be able to wear their math or consequently? You're going to be digging under what happens if several of get it at the same time. Are they going to pull us out? We're going to have to. To be isolated. What are they then do? What the students are they going to send the students home? Are they gonna add them now to other classrooms were now the density of students gets more and other classrooms so again. I I I'm not saying that it shouldn't be D- Top priority, or among the top priorities of to get kids back to school safely, but the important thing is the safely piece of all of that to protect. Protect students and teachers, and so again I think we have to do the work as adults right now I heard the CDC director say that if we actually wear face coverings, practice, social distancing in places like Texas and Houston and and I'm sorry and Florida, we can actually stem the tide. Get the curves going back downwards stop the constant increases because again I think we're going to both continue to see increases in hospitalizations and death. Death, but if we put in the hard work now and get control of the epidemic in our respective states, I think then we can start talking about getting children into schools because we know how detrimental it is to them to keep them outside of schools, and that that those children unfortunately who are socio economically disadvantaged fall even further behind so again I I WANNA. Get children back in the schools, but it's got to be done responsibly. And once again we keep harping on here. Social Distance Mass Square wash your hands, and all of these other issues were facing will greatly reduce, and we'll be able to move forward. Dr Celaya me thank you so much for joining US I hope you'll consider coming back and joining us again. Journey, thank you so much. Thank, you Dr Jason. Seleny is with the University of South Florida where he's an epidemiologist, but also has got a unique interest in the data and figuring out what's going out and what we're reporting, so thank him for joining us and when we come back. We're going to shift gears. Dr Flashes with us again. We're going to be taking your calls, questions, comments and thoughts all about in the world living in a world with corona virus, but also we're GonNa do some myth busting and we're GONNA. Talk about the right way to wear masks. We kind of stumbled through that last Thursday. We're going to set the record straight. This is Houston matter. Special Edition. The phone number here is seven, one, three, four, four, zero, eight, seven, zero were ready for your calls I'm reading news. We'll be right back. In. The before times working for tips was already unreliable and tough. Now for a lot of workers, it has become unsustainable restaurants rethinking staff pay next time on marketplace, and it's coming your way half past six. This evening followed by fresh air at seven. Here on your NPR station. News eighty seven. Support comes from members like Hyun from Paul declawed, providing mediation and arbitration services in person or by video conference for complex business, and commercial disputes and Houston and central Texas all declawed more McGinnis law dot com from raise your hand Texas working to strengthen public education for all students more information and raise your hand Texas Dot Org. The Future of Texas is in our public schools, and from the Excess Insurance Division Bancorp South, celebrating over six years of insurance services in Houston for households, highrise homes, art, and jewelry, proudly, representing central mutual insurance and other fine companies. Still have the mess on the southwest freeway heading out southbound sixty nine ride after the with five twenty seven. You're trying to make your way downtown. All mainland covered up with water. They aren't letting traffic by on the left shoulder. But unless you're an Abreau, does here. That's all jacked up I'd probably advised against it because you're call can stall allowed in as little as four to six inches of water, and of course, this is creating pretty big backup on southbound sixty nine all the way from the Gr be elevated. I do believe David Pinton was playing. She works hard for the money under that last break, which is really a perfect piece of music for our next guest you listen to Houston matters special edition. I'm Ernie Moose and we are being joined by Dr. Charlene Flash Clinical Assistant Professor Assistant Professor of medicine in Infectious Disease at Baylor College of Medicine, but more importantly president CEO of Avenue Three Sixty, health and wellness, and she's joining us again to take your questions calls, thoughts and comments. Welcome back to the show Dr Flash. Thank you Ernie great to be here. And I know you work hard for the money I know. There's a lot of work out there these days, so thank you for taking the time to join us. I WANNA. Remind everyone the phone number here to give a call and join us in our conversation is seven, three, four, four, zero, eight, eight, seven zero before we get into everything. We wanted to talk about today last Thursday we got kind of tongue tied talking about masks and wearing them and the problem that came up. A lot of people were concerned two issues. Actually one was when you have those little surgical masks that you buy. That are blue or colored paper on one side and white on the other side. Which side are you supposed to be wearing against your face and which side out? The whiteside would be against your face. The blue side should be out, and it should cover your mouth your mouth and nose, and you should pinch it on your nasal bridge so that it has a nice seal their. Okay there it is. We have the definitive word now. Put the color out. Keep the white toward you. The other question we have is the different types of masks that are out there. We've heard about and ninety five, but there's also Cayenne ninety five's. Do you know the difference between those? The and ninety five is the classic mask that's used for diseases that are transmitted do an and born route Ken. Ninety five is not as usually used, but we're having to use them now because there are shortages and personal protective equipment, so the and ninety five is the gold standard, but can ninety five mass can be used the important thing and ninety five mask is that people should be fitted so there's extra small, small and normal sized, and so you should be fitted to see. Make sure you're wearing the right size mask. Okay. We got our mass questions out there so now the things we wanted to talk with you about today one thing that we just kind of touched on at the end of our last interview was school reopenings, and from your of view from a health professional in today's Day and age in this innocent community. We all live in what are your thoughts on school reopenings? And what should parents be looking very soon? They're going to have to be deciding in some districts whether or not. They send their children to face to face schooler if they stay remote. It's a really challenging space for us to be and I think that we have to be patient and prayerful for our school leaders, because he's a really challenging decisions that we all need to make a mom of three. Two of my children are school aged, and so my husband, and I are wrestling with this right now as well for each individual family you need to I think about your child and what your child's health is so people that have a child that's has a. Product medical illness. like asthma or diabetes those are parents will want to be more cautious with their child. You also want to think about your child the way they learn best some children will not do as well as other than a virtual setting and need that real time oversight by a season teacher, and so you have to think about what your child's educational needs are to and make sure that supported. What's happening in our schools complicated? I see that different school districts around Houston are doing different things. Some have pushed back the opening date, and some are China Open right away and somewhere thing part, virtual and part in real time, and it seems like the recommendations from the state from the Ta are changing almost on a daily basis, so that does make it challenging. We always liked to let our show be led by our callers that number, seven, one, three, four, four, zero, eight, seven, zero, and we have Brenda Online Brenda. Today. I have a question so I my boyfriend. Is over driver. So HE I. Sure that he picked up international patient in February and 'cause five days he takes his I. He was sick and coughing and all his car being ended up very very ill, so he got over. It took about two weeks. He got it. So. He was tested in in He tested in May. And and then tested again in here. Both of those tests were negative. Of course I already knew that he probably had out of body, so we tested him a week ago and he came back positive for antibody. So. I'm on my question is I want him to be able to come and visit with me. So. I'm just. Dot is you're wondering if he's safe to come and visit you. Okay Dr Flash. What are your thoughts? This is a great question so i. it sounds like you think he had an exposure back. In February from an international person this car, and of course he could have been exposed by an international person or nowadays by any person, because there's lots of covert in our own community. And notice that in May and June he didn't have a positive test and really member. There are different kinds of tests stumped some tests for parts of the disease itself through a something called a PR and the other test for your body's response. Which is the antibody test? Now the challenge with our antibody test is. We don't really know whether the antibody pro provides protective immunity. So that means just because he has a positive antibody doesn't mean that he can no longer get infected again so in terms of whether or not to hang out with your boyfriend Brenda. You really have to see. Does he have symptoms and when he's out in the world, has he been practicing social distancing and wearing a mask? Even though he's an ever, he can still wear a mask and encourage the people that he drives around to also wear a mask and gloves that he can protect himself that you can be able to Socialize with him. Okay thank you very much for that call. I want to remind everyone. The number here is seven, one, three, four, four, zero, eight, eight, seven, zero, another issue that comes up a bit now is the questions of gyms, and whether or not Florida got a of heat on that this morning they were having a press conference about it. If gyms should they be open or not open your thoughts on that. Know as with everything, there are ways to do things in a thoughtful way. gyms the way we're used to them, which is a room full of treadmills and bikes That's not a good idea. build with people that are sweating and breathing hard on each other. That's not going to work to keep Cova D- from circulating in our community. However I have noted some gyms where people are able to register before they come, so they maintain a small. Small number of people at any given time, and then after each set of people leave. They do terminal cleaning of the gym so that it's a The environment is cleaned before the next set of people come in, and so that's a way that you could actually be able to go to the gym while maintaining safety, so you have to really look ahead and see what your Jim. Safety practices are to see if that's something that you're able to engaging. Interesting that we talk about Jim's because it kind of merges into our earlier question about school reopenings, there's an interesting cross section of the two, because I know, you've talked a little bit about students who depend on Sports, scholarships and this could be doing. You know as we think about all of the inequities in medicine, we have to make sure that even as we're trying to protect people that we don't accidentally force people to make decisions that are going to have to have them balanced their finances and their health, and so when schools do things like say. I'll either come to school virtually or come in person, but if you come virtually then you can't do any extra curricular activities for some students. Particularly lower income students where scholarships are the way they're going to get the college. You're forcing the parents and the child to decide listen if the hope for my kids, future is college and the only way they're going to get. There is a sports scholarship or to a band or choir, scholarship or Or whatever it is, and the only way my child can participate is by coming on campus. You may have people sending their kids to campus. When really that's causing too many people to be on the campus at any given time, so we really do need our leaders in our schools to be thoughtful in their approach, one size doesn't fit all, and they have to think about what extracurricular activity is it and can it be done safely? Choice Comics Parity. Yes a hard choice for a lot of families to make right now as they as they way all this which goes back to our first segment why it's so important to have accurate information out there so that parents families and communities in general can make the right choices and do what is right I have a list of myths in front of me and we keep teasing that we're gonNA. GonNa. Do This myth busting segment? We never really get to it so I've got you and I've got my list, but also got Louis on the phone. And Louis was here a little bit ago. We lost his colonies back. I'm going to go to him first then we'll do some myths. Lewis is called the Senate seven, three, four, four, zero, eight, eight, seven, Zero Louis. What's on your mind? Higra film Yeah, when I think that was young children or is mostly. Graham like looks like as they have to let listening sector. So perhaps. There may be some Fenian in India at the the. Typical things that junk. Get. And Mike what's? But have these has been consider. To check on. US most teams during. That's I these fighters can wrong with bats. Also, there may be something in the some immune system. And what? Question. Okay. Thank you Louis for that, and it's a perfect segue into my myth busting segment because we do have on our myth busting segment do other vaccines. The children take actually help prevent covid nineteen from them and kind of think. That's what you're asking because there's such a low rate of at least pursue presumed low rate of infection and children. Could it be something else that we're doing with children that helps them Dr Flesh. Great. Question Louise and terms of whether young children. There are less young children than get infected as compared to adults, but one thing that is somewhat concerning, is that some young children and having long term side effects from having? been infected with coronavirus so even though fewer get infected, there is a small subset that get a very serious long term illness related to it, so that's concerning all the more reason for us to be cautious about what we do with schools. we don't know whether other vaccines protect people from Covid, but what we do know is that there are a number of new vaccine candidates that are being examined right now to see if we can develop something that can be specifically targeted to this particular disease so that we can try to get ahead of the curve. Okay, we're going to my mythbusters ready. Yes I am here. Okay? I one five g mobile networks spread Cova dignty, and all these new towers going up. That's why we have cove it. I would say that that is false. that there are many things that can cause the spread of Kobe but all of those are related to person to person interaction in the spreading of our droplets to one another. So that one is false. Our next one is that stare, steroid, inhalers, or things for asthma are the civil silver bullet that can end covid nineteen. So steroid inhalers are a useful treatment for symptoms of people who when they get Kovic have problems with their breathing, and we have seen that people who have challenges breathing horror treated with steroid, inhalers or steroids in general when they're really sick and in the hospital that they do better. However, steroid inhalers are not a cure there to some management of one element of the symptoms that people have. Okay. We're GONNA do one more then. We'll take our break. To more of them. Our number here is seven, three, four, four, zero, eight, eight, seven, zero. This was a new one for me, but I'm sure. A lot of people are hoping it's true. Drinking alcohol will protect you from infection. I this however that one is. Fault I wish that the solution where that simple I think what people. Need to recognize that in many ways, prevention is better than cure, and so it's better not to get it at all, and that it is important for people to partner with their community health systems, and with their doctors to get tested if they think they've been exposed if they're having symptoms or if they need help managing those symptoms so that we can keep as many people. People out of the emergency room, and out of our hospitals as possible, because unfortunately even at are renowned Texas Medical Center. They are getting a lot of business these days, and not the good kind of business, so partners like ours avenue, three sixty health and wellness, where we really partner with the community to keep people as healthy as possible are important supports in our community. Okay, WE'RE GONNA. Take our last break here Dr Flash if you'll stay with us, this is Houston matters special edition, our number here seven, three, four, four, zero, eight, seven zero. Do you have a myth? You've been wondering if a true or false, you can give us a call and share that with us right now. Seven, three, four, four, zero, eight, eight, seven, zero. I'm Ernie Moose when we come back. We're GONNA. Find out does prolong wearing masks, 'cause co, two intoxication, and also what about eating spicy food? Can that help? We'll find those answers and more right after this. Of the next fresh air, our interview with civil rights, leader and Congressman John Lewis. He died Friday. He talked about working with Martin Luther. King and the MARCI help lead in nineteen, sixty, five across the Edmund Pettus Bridge in Selma Alabama, and when she was beaten by state troopers that mark helped lead to the passage of the Voting Rights Act. Join us. fresh air seven o'clock this evening phone by thinking here on your NPR station news hitting some. Still have water covering lanes heading out on southwest freeway southbound sixty nine. We see it on the Houston Trans Star Camera John Staff. After the five twenty seven downtown spur, there were that comes together had a couple of left lanes open now so it is beginning to subside. However, you're going to be in for at least twenty minutes or so delays southbound sixty nine, coming off the east tax through downtown elevated. Support comes from members like you and from advocates, plumbing, air, conditioning, and electrical, where the health and safety of customers and employees is their top priority and thanks to partners like Lennox Abacus is still available. Twenty four seven scheduling, an abacus plumbing Donna Hi I'm Josh Adam Station Manager, and your support has helped us invest in remote cellular technology Surrou-. Reporters and announcers can continue to bring you critical news and information safely from their homes. Thank you for helping Houston. Public Media Keep our community safe and informed. Matters Special Edition, I'm earning news. My guess for this part of the show is docked charlene flash. WHO IS THE PRESIDENT? CEO of Avenue Three Sixty health and wellness and also comes to us from Baylor College of Medicine, she's answering your questions and thoughts and concerns at seven, one, three, four, four, zero, eight, seven, zero, and right now we're in the middle of our mythbusters segment. Okay, right before we went to the break. I teased with how bad wearing a mask is for. You can cause co two inhaling. What's the truth there? So that would be fall that the types of mass that we all are using whether it's a surgical mask and then ninety five or cloth masks. Those were not well not cost the OT intoxication because air is still able to go back and forth especially, so Cotr is able to leave, so you won't get intoxicated, you know. I want to remind people to not let these myths prevent them from protecting themselves, and because the mass won't cost co two intoxication corona virus can make you sick. We'll see. That's the important reason why we WANNA do. This segment was just to let everyone know a lot of the stuff. You're hearing out there. Just because you see it and read it. Maybe in social media isn't accurate. Always make sure you know your source. You're getting things from. Here's another one I really like and boy. It'd be great if it were true. Eating hot peppers spicy food, or even garlic can help prevent or cure covid nineteen. Now I sure with that one where true of Jamaican descent and so spicy food is the name of the game but unfortunately I know plenty of members of my community despite their spicy food and garlic and jerk seasoning, and all of that excellent cuisine still unfortunately have become infected with corona virus, and so you know I think that we all trying to. To Find Solutions Right, so people are trying all of these different things to try to help. Keep themselves safe and to try to get themselves better and I don't blame them, but while they're doing that. I WANNA make sure that they're also using the evidence of the things that we know work, which is Earth China to get it and to partner with your healthcare. Provider to make sure that you're being monitored so that. If you get really sick, you can get the care you need and that you're early. Symptoms can be managed, so people can do well. Our goal is to keep our community as healthy as possible, and I don't want squelch people's creativity, but I don't want them to depend on things that don't have evidence and They use those and avoid things that we know can't help them. And with that being said, let's go back to the phones. We have tracy who called in at seven one three. Four zero, eight, seven, zero with a question for us Tracy. What's on your mind? Well if we could for a second, I'd like to go back to your conversation about the U I L event. In while I completely and fully understand as an educator, the importance of scholarships, a lot of students get through the aisle event, not just sports, but all of it has to offer. Right after that comment was made, the comment was also made about being in in the DEM. Where you're participating, you're hot sweaty. You're reading on each other that that's problematic. So I'm wondering how you reconcile being a participant in a U I L event? With the same kind of results for example, if you're ambandoned, you're blowing your horn and you're turning from side to side because. That's the projection that you're supposed to perform. Year still hot and sweaty in your uniform. You're still breathing hard and heavy The same thing could be applied to the costumes that you wear when you're on stage in your, you know performing your acts in your place and then, of course, the obvious is with with forces well, but I'm just wondering how the doctor suggests reconciling the two so that everybody can stay safe How do you do that? Tracy Great Question Dr Flesh? Yeah thank you, Tracy, that is a great question. I think for each event. We need to think carefully about how to go about it, so we're not going to be able to have one. Hundred students piled into the band room and pouring out there spit valves all at the same time as we have now, things will need to look different. You may need to have band choir room that has four students or five students, and so instead of doing a huge ban. You haven't ensemble. Those are ways that you'll be able to have children in a room that usually has one hundred people, but now has ten and are able to space them out and allow them to. Be Able to do some of these extracurricular things that actually give color to what children experience and for many kids. This is why why they go to school and keep them focus on their academics, because they're trying not to fail their classes, so they can get to do these extracurricular activities. Now there's some sports where it's really challenging the social distance like wrestling for one love wrestlers, but I can't figure out a solution to how you can wrestle and socially distance, however, for example, my oldest daughter is a shot, putter and discus thrower so by definition. That's a sport where you're at a distance. You don't WanNa get too close because you don't want to get hit by the disks. And so I think that there isn't going to be a one-size-fits-all, and it also is not going to look exactly the same as it did before so again I really am prayerful for our leaders in schools, as they're thoughtful about thinking through each of these opportunities and you I l events and thinking about how can I offer the richest education to our students possible while keeping them safe, there is a way to do it. It won't be easy. China figure it out, but it can be done. Okay and quickly. We're going to try and get Robert in here before we run out of time, Robert. What's your question today? one quick question was I saw that article about eighty five infants in Corpus are tested positive as wondering. Do we know anything about if delivery houses delivered impacts whether the Infants Developed Kovin? Thank you very much and over to Dr Flesh. Yeah. I, don't know of any evidence. At present that talks about mother to child transmission It is likely that transmission happened in the space that they were in after. I don't have data that tells us that you know. MOMS are able to transmit it to their babies during the period when the child is still a fetus. And with that last bit of Information Dr Flash Thank you so much for taking the time to join us today with wonderful information, the last thing I'll point out which I also pointed out in the first interview today. Just because there's more testing does not create more tests. That's probably the biggest myth that's out there right now. All testing does is identify cases. It's very different. Correct Dr Flush. Absolutely, we've gone from about seven tests a day. Two hundred tests a day and twenty to twenty five percent of those are positive, so we have a much higher rate of positive, even though we're testing much much more covert out there I'm seeing patients that are sicker than they were before I'm blessed to be partnered with Baylor College of Medicine and the Houston Health Department to provide testing in some of our ZIP codes where there isn't a lot of other opportunities protesting so please everyone, be safe and be careful. Thank you very much. That's Charlene. Flash joins US FROM AVENUE, three sixty health and wellness, a community health system of clinics in Houston and they testing there, too, so we thank you for joining us, and we thank you before we wrap up the show today. We get to chat with quickly Matt Hair Matt. What have you seen while? We've been on the Air Hey Ernie Dr? David purse with the Houston health. Health Department just confirmed what the doctor was just referring to there. He says the positivity rate at city testing sites right now is still hovering at around twenty four to twenty five percent. That number's been consistent over the past few weeks. The department is reporting eight hundred and eighty four new covid cases, today and seven new deaths. Six of those seven deaths are members of the Latino community a population that. That has been hit hard by this virus Ernie, they represent just under forty percent of the total reported Cova cases in the city. In one thing, the mayor said it has press conference today as that they definitely are asking Congress to include rental assistance in this next financial aid package and talked with the Reverend in that Latino community this weekend. Ernie, who has already provided nearly eighty thousand dollars in rental relief. Relief in his community forest community up to this point thanks to generous donations. He said that is without a doubt. The number one need right now. especially as the moratorium on victims is set to be lifted of this Saturday in the city as for that death count though Ernie, Dr David Person says he does feel that. The count in Harris County is accurate. There's been speculation that it's higher. than. What's being reported Dr Person Today that he does not believe that is the case ask for the hospitals? If you look at the Texas Medical Center data there does seem to be a slight flattening of the curve when it comes to Cova. Nineteen patients admitted to the Texas Medical Center Dr Person that he's not ready to celebrate this minor achievement just yet, but the graph is A. A showing some good signs, one reason per said this is happening. He says treatments are getting better, and he says healthcare workers just in general are getting more knowledgeable on this virus and how to treat it. And he said that the average stay for people admitted to the hospital. Now is a lower state than it was at the beginning of the pandemic, which is obviously a good signer. Okay, Matt thank you very much, and we can hear your full reports right here on news eighty seven, as you continue to cover the world around us matter, thank you. We'll be back tomorrow with another episode of USA. Matter Special Edition. My guests tomorrow Dr Stacey Rose another infectious disease expert in another regular guest on our program. We hope you'll join us at three o'clock tomorrow until then I'm Ernie MNUCHIN. Stay tuned right here news. The opinions expressed by the callers and guests on. Houston matters special edition are solely their own, and do not necessarily reflect the views of the staff, management or underwriters Acoustic Public These are often generalized medical advice and should not be seen as a replacement for consulting your own medical doctor.
Monitor Show 13:00 01-02-2021 13:00
"Slack is a new way to communicate with your team. It replaces email with something faster. Better organized and more secure in a world where people could be anywhere. It becomes your office. Try it for free at slack. Dot com slack. Where work happens. How long how. Much how many financial policy and medical experts are working on answers. Twenty four seven. What about public debts. We are listening to those experts. Twenty four seven that effectively widening. This walked up with its programs. Because you want answers to what's the most important and trillions in stimulus economies reopening or the infections curved ending bloomberg radio the bloomberg business app and bloombergradio dot com bloomberg. The world is listening four hours a day at bloomberg dot com on the bloomberg business app and bloomberg quick take. This is bloomberg radio now. A global news update the united states has more than twenty million confirmed cases of corona virus since the outbreak began johns hopkins university puts the us death toll above three hundred. Forty six thousand. This as nearly three million americans received either the pfizer or moderna. Vaccines against covid. Nineteen a doctor in florida says a variant kobe. Nineteen strain should not be cause for alarm university of south florida public health. Dr jill roberts says there's no need to get super worried she tells ten tampa bay while the variant strain. Ease more contagious. There are no signs that its debut earlier. The florida department of health announced that martin county man is the first in the state test positive for the variant strain that was first detected in great britain a hybrid show.
Chooki and Pleep - Oct 29, 2020 - Tom Brady, fossil feathers, Archaeopteryx, Awe Walks, Precession
"Shuja bleep is in sports. Oh juki i love science and on bleep a cover sports. And i'm here to give you the kid lines about science. This is the news from late october. Twenty two thousand eighteen. And this what we've got for science time to take an hour walk. What the heck is all walk. It's a walk. You try to take a fresh look at the things around. You is a feeling. It's a bit like wonder though what the word awesome comes from. Probably here's the thing. Scientists at the aging central university of california san francisco the the people in their sixties seventies eighties. Who take all walks. Feel happier immortal so you should probably ask an older person that you know like grandpa grandma to go on. Oh sports right now in the nfl. According to cbs sports tom brady is ranked as the tenth. Best quarterback in the nfl. Tom brady as we know. Spent twenty years with the new england patriots and one six super bowls with the patriots. A dj forty three joined a new team the tampa bay box. The buccaneers would no preseason games for tom to bear and with limited practice due to covid. The buccaneers aren't first place and their division rate. Now science the first fossil feather must just connected to dinosaur paleontologists led by ryan carney at the university of south florida or saying that a fossil feather which shed for men are copy trix although the feather falls discovered in the eighteen hundreds sunny. This have only settled the debate. But we're came from last month the dinosaur head wings and sharp teeth science. I think like this last item bleep. Physics this is study of motion right. How things move well. three physicists. just published a paper. That explains why thrown football's like the ones in nfl games scoot downward towards the earth. One quarterback throws the ball and upward. Well it's complicated. But a thrown football basically works like what scientists call position which creates a kind of aero-dynamics twisting. That's why the nose of the bulk goes down just blows my mind. What is the effect that makes ball. Would it does not just said it. Session pre-session session omission. What's the answer be procession. Thanks for listening to science and sports kid lines with bleed. There is a lot more news for kids at little news. Years dot com or on youtube in major pod casting platforms may your sweetness shine and your callers glow sources for today's kid lines. Include the new york times the new york times and cnn.
Why Pedestrian Deaths Are At A 30-Year High
"Support for NPR and the following message come from Dulles International Airport with the highest on time takeoff percentage of any airport on the east coast. I a d means I'm already departing more at fly, Dallas dot com slash fast. I we're trying to figure out what's behind a really alarming statistic. More than six thousand pedestrians died in traffic accidents last year across the United States. That's the highest number in nearly thirty years. Many of these deaths occurred in big cities like Houston, and Miami, but pedestrian deaths have also gone way up in some smaller towns cease to Chiro reports for making Georgia making his home to about one hundred thousand people, and it's all too easy to find someone who's friend or relative died while crossing one of its streets. Violet posed friend. Amos Harris was one of them. I would person you really can't horde see this street Hudson street in leeza tuten. Wow. New. Where his house where he Lille with his mother who and I are edging our way between the traffic cones and the curb of the street he died on he had been out after dark searching for his nephew. He came then across tier? Was hit Georgia is one of five states that make up nearly half of all the nations pedestrian fatalities. The others are Texas, Arizona, Florida and California. Tom Ellington heads the Macon pedestrian safety review board. He says, well, it's easy to point to jaywalking. As the key source of the problem, that's misplaced blame. We've spent decades building a transportation system this designed for cars and not for people, and we have an awful lot of people in this community who don't have their own vehicles who are dependent either on transit or on their own put power to get around like many cities around the country. Makings roads were designed to get vehicles. From point a to point b fast often, that means big roads with few stoplights. I could point you to places that have had as much as a two mile gap between Crosswalks, and it's great advice. Tell people to use a crosswalk, but that's not very useful. If the crosswalk doesn't exist. Richard reading wrote the pedestrian fatality report for the governors highway safety association. He says you can't blame the spike in deaths only on the lack of sidewalks not seeing reduction sidewalks. But there was a thirty percent jump in pedestrian deaths in just the last ten years. So what's to blame? We tried to identify other metrics that were consistent with it that he increased and the ones confined distraction related to smart views and the market share is vs both of which will significantly over the same period of time. Most of our new car shopping has been for SUV's, which are bigger heavier and deadlier for pedestrians and both walkers and drivers are increasingly distracted by their phones. One solution could be adding pedestrian sensors to cars transportation researcher. Achilles core. Tellas at the university of south Florida says that will eventually be very useful. Percent of crashes are because of a human editor. So somebody's not paying attention. They commend gonna crash with us that never sleeps. I told was them since picking up things, and you can always at least notify the driver. That's something is in your way, or clientele says distracted driving laws are also effective because people need help to stay off their phones the average time to somebody spends looking at their phone four segments. If you're driving a highway speeds four segments, you're just traveled full feels without looking Florida is considering legislation that would allow police to ticket drivers for any type of distracted driving, including petting your dog. Most New England states already have similar laws and last year. Those six states saw an average decrease of thirty six percent in pedestrian deaths for NPR news. I'm ceased Giora.
Florida menus will soon offer python. Custodian brings a rifle to school. Pinch a students nipples?
"A drunk college student in handcuffs asks the florida police to pinches nipples. Walt disneyworld will digitally add masks onto guests. Not wearing them in the photos. Snake and eggs. Anyone floridians could soon be eating python in a custodian brought a rifle to an elementary school. These are the weird stories for friday on weird af news the only daily weird news podcast by a comedian and the only daily weird news. Podcasts that has florida friday. This is the degenerate news from only the state of florida for the week. A lot of you sent me these articles. And i appreciate that. Let's get into the stories from florida. Those bizarre stories. You hear about all the time that seemed to only happen here in florida right. Make this stuff up. It is just one of the many wacky news stories out of sunshine state consistently produce such strange news. What accounts for all this bizarre news is. The weather is it. The report is for the crazy story. A drunk college student in handcuffs asks the florida police to pinch his nipples. You know. sometimes you find yourself at the bar at the end of the night and you don't feel like paying your bar tab right. We've all been there sometimes. It's not really your fault. You realize the bar tabs way too big. You didn't expect it to be that big. You told a couple of your buddies. Hey you can put a few drinks on there. You didn't say put all your drinks on there. You didn't say put the drinks of anybody you want on there. You certainly didn't approve of the strangers. Walking up putting drinks on your tab as well next thing. You know the end of the night comes. It's closing time. You get a big surprise with your bill way bigger than you thought. Joseph lancaster a twenty two year old university of south florida student had the police called after he refused an eight hundred. And twenty dollars tab at a saint petersburg after arguing with security. His friends stepped in and paid the tab. What good friends. joseph lancaster. Twenty two year old university of south florida student has good florida friends. Hard to find florida guys. That'll just step up. And have your back. I'd imagine there's not too many of those stumbling around slurring. His words joseph. Lancaster began shouting shouting at the bar. I am sorry none of you graduated high school but if you if you did he say that to the police or was it. The bar doesn't say the officers arrived. Joseph started berating them when they put him in restraints aka handcuffs. He told the officers that being in handcuffs quote gets me off. Oh boy this took a turn. This story took a turn. He went from being arrested too thinking. He's in the middle of a porn. That's what happened. He then asked somebody to please pinches nipples pinch my nipples said nipples. Did he tell the police. Debentures nepal's at the bar was assured offer on it doesn't say is a strange thing to request when you're in handcuffs being arrested is for somebody to pinch your nipples Most people when they're arrested they feel a sense of of doom nervous. This guy's like nope it's on. He heard in his head that porn music playing on checkup bound man. And i mean. I don't think poor music is like that anymore but it used to be like that. All music used to be proud took account. Now i'm just letting all the kids know that that's porn music used to be. You're very lucky. Now you have a whole porn soundtrack. It's all great. The music's very acceptable nap back in back in the day was just brown ketchup brown every song. Same thing in every point anyways this guy. Joseph was being arrested he heard a soundtrack of porn and his brain apparently because he asked the police or somebody to pinches nipples joseph. I enjoy my nipples pinched. When i'm being arrested. Lancaster was charged with some things disorderly intoxication. Which is a misdemeanor. He was booked in the jail. It says he's now out on bond but it doesn't say if any of the police actually adhere to his request to pinch nipples so we'll have to wait. I'm sure there'll be a A court case. And maybe the judge will pinches nipples. Maybe someone in the jury will pinches. Nipples someone's gotta pinchas nipples. He's asking for it. Disney world will digitally add masks onto the guests. That aren't wearing them in the ride photos. If you visit well disneyworld in florida. You'll be wearing a mask whether you it or not because disneyworld has allegedly updated how it handles people not wearing masks on their rides. What they're gonna do is digitally. Add the facial covering to the guests in those photos that can be purchased after you ride on a ride so instead of requiring guests to ride a mask on the ride which is what you should do while disneyworld florida or even wear a mask to enter the park which is probably what you should do while disneyworld florida. Wait a minute your walt disney world. Florida not california. Yeah never mind. Never mind you just photoshop masks on people and just hope that the world is a safe place that okay and why don't you. Why don't you offer a digital vaccine while you're at it or cast a spell on your guests for some other you're living in a fantasy world while disneyworld is what i'm saying now. This all came to light this week. When there was a photo posted in the facebook group called disneyworld junkies. The photo showed a woman who was writing an animal kingdom ride and it appears that she has a mask photoshop onto her face. Disneyworld did not respond to a request for comment to confirm this practice of digitally adding masks to people's faces previously. Disneyworld would not allow those without masks to see the photos that were taken during the rides or purchase their own photos taken during the rides. Now the park is allegedly allowing the guests to have their photos but with an added piece of digital magic to make everybody feel better. The florida theme park which remains open while its california counterpart has not been able to reopen due to corona virus restrictions. And the fact that california actually gives a damn about its citizens They have not provided official comment on this mask photo protocol on the rides though according to the website face coverings are required in those who do not adhere to the mask guidelines will not be allowed to have their photo taken by the photo pass photographers. Oh you're so. Strict disney world florida people. That don't wear masks. Oh yeah we're not gonna take your photo. How about that. We're going to pretend that you don't even have a phone. That takes a million photos in your pocket right now and that everybody in your family also has a smart device that can take unlimited photos and video of you having a great time at disney. We're not gonna let you have one of those old school photos that we take. That are actually more special than your photos. Okay okay you better wear your masks. We give a shit and and we're so strict. Okay if you actually coming park and you're coughing. Covert all over the guests. We are not going to let you in. Pirates of the caribbean. Okay because that's an indoor ride and they'll be no coughing in there. It actually disturbs the music. And the other guests. Okay so you can call you on the other ads but not on that one. We're very strict at the florida disneyworld. Okay we give a shit about people's lives you should know it's florida friday only on weird af news. What would you like for breakfast. How about snake and eggs. Yeah floridians could soon eat pythons. fort lauderdale florida donna. Khalil estimates that. She's eaten a dozen pythons in the last three years or so that's not including the python jerky she says. She's a python for the south florida water management district. Here's a quote from her. I like the. I eat that like. I eat that python several times a week. Because i take it out with me on python hunts. I eat the phone jerky all day out. There i do. State officials would like to see more people like khalil pudding pythons on their menu not because of their nutritional value or anything like that. But it's another way to encourage hunting to control the python population. If you didn't know burmese pythons are considered an invasive species in florida. The voracious appetite of these apex predators disrupts the entire food chain in environmentally fragile areas. Such as the florida everglades believed to have begun their florida invasion. After owners released them into the wild python numbers have boomed and the state has struggled to rein them in. We would like to use consumption as another way to encourage folks to remove pathogens in florida. You know of course if the meat is safe to eat. That was carly siegel sent a spokesperson for the florida. Fish and wildlife conservation commission. The study that we're undertaking. We'll help ensure that the path on meat is safe to be eaten other. Invasive species are also consumed most notably the lion fish. It's a way to control their populations. Some people in florida as you know even eat a guavas but there's a concern about eating the pythons and it's one that the state has started to research. These massive snakes like some fish could be full of mercury. which is a neurotoxin. That is dangerous to human beings. That's why the florida department of health is working with the florida fish and wildlife conservation commission to conduct tissue samples on pythons to determine whether they contain too much mercury for human consumption if the levels are deemed safe enough. Get ready to make new entries in your florida. Invasive species cookbook khalil says are really lack python chilly. it's so good in chile. And i also lock it in a stir fry but her favorite way to eat python is to pressure. Cook it for ten or fifteen minutes sauteed with onion garlic and added to the pasta sauce. I can't believe this lady eaton. All the python. Khalil is a miami native who gave up her real estate job. Hunt pythons fulltime. And i'm sure her husband is pleased. She said the meat is very rubbery. Tough if you don't prepare it properly. The pressure cooker makes it much more tender. She said and how about the taste khalil. Tell us about the taste. We all wanna know. We're on the edge of our seat. We want to know what python tastes like. I don't i don't really want to say like it. Tastes like fish because it is more the texture of the fish but it definitely does not taste anything like fish tastes. We'll if i was to say i'd say it tastes more like chicken. Or maybe when maybe i'm gonna say pork more like a pork chop maybe yeah pork and now for some alarming numbers. It is estimated that one hundred to three hundred thousand pythons are living in the fragile florida ecosystem devouring native mammals and birds. Perhaps even small babies or puppies. They've been successful at reproducing in the swampy everglades because they have no predators whatsoever and get this female can lay up to one hundred eggs out of control but it's very difficult to hunters snake hunters hired by the state captured. Only about six thousand pythons over the last four years That's terrible and out of desperation. The state does such things as create the florida python challenge the state's annual hunt that awards cash prizes for the most. The largest in the heaviest pythons caught. Well hopefully python jerky will also catch hold. I don't see how that's possible but you may i. I gotta tell you. Though i i would try python jerky but i know about these other python dishes python chilly really garlic infused python you can have that khalil. You can have that. This is another reason not to live in florida. A two hundred thousand pythons you crazy. Wow you can't eat enough of these thanks to even curtail the population curb. The population corral the population. What's the word i'm looking for. I don't know who cares about words. You like podcast. You're listening to my podcast. Maybe thought yourself. I'd like to make a podcast too difficult. No not with anchor. Anchor has free creation tools. That allow you to record. Edit your podcast from your phone your computer anchor distributor podcast to apple spotify stitcher in more. They have advertising integration. So you can even make a little money off your podcast everything you need to make a podcast in one place. Download the free anchor app or go to anchor dot fm to get started and good luck with your podcast. Good luck with your creation. Good luck with your life man. A custodian brought a rifle to an elementary school in florida. Yeah of course. Those kids are dangerous in florida. Wow you never know what they're gonna do always walking over your freshly mopped floor you. Try and tell them you say hey kids i just mopped their next thing you know they whip out an alligator pull it right out of their pants and throw it your face. You got to be very very careful with these kids. Of course you need a gun at an elementary school. It's florida hello. Those kids are trying to sell your meth to custodians at the jc. Mitchell elementary school in boca raton on our in the county jail after one alleged the broader rifle to school and another one was photographed with the rifle and then they posted it on social media because they are so intelligent. You guys know how you do it. When you're breaking the law. Okay what you wanna do. Not only when you're breaking the law when you're also endangering your job and your livelihood you wanna put it all on social media right guys you know how it goes custodians domingo your ian reynosa and hoover maura were taken into custody by the palm. Beach school board police. They're both charged with possession of a firearm at school. At least one of the custodians works the overnight shift. It was not immediately clear if the other is present during hours when students are on campus. The gun was allegedly uranian renault. Silas mora actually just posed for the photograph. There's a police report below. Do you want me to read it. You guys want me to read it. Do you vote for jones. Read the report. Oh i'll read. I'll read it within the photo. An unknown male had imposition an unknown. Max model black rifle. The rifle was in a downward position slung across his upper body. The mail was holding the buttocks of the rifle with his right on the but talk. I didn't know rifles. Had a buttock while. I'm learning something in this police. Report rifles have body parts additionally the mail was wearing a school district of palm beach county polo shirt and appeared to be standing in what looked like a school campus a ladder and a metal and metal coverings on the frame of the wall. We're seen in the background. The mail was later identified as hoover. Mora a custodian at jc mitchell. Elementary school read the complete arrest report below. If you'd like to know i don't want to. I don't wanna read anymore. I don't want to learn anymore. Body parts of the guns or learn about anymore stupidity for the day. This is my fourth story for friday. And i'm just. I've had enough of it. Have you guys had enough of it. Of course you have it. You can't get enough of florida degeneracy. i know you. I know who my listeners. Are you guys love it. You love stories about florida custodians because you know the kind of people. they are. Look if if they're hiring. Florida teachers that have ad you is and sex assaults in their past. Can you imagine the quality of custodians that are being hired. I mean i can't even imagine they could. They could have bodies in their basements. It doesn't matter they're just like please come in and clean please. No one will come and be around these kids. No one will do. It will pay you handsomely. We'll pay you in python jerky. Hey man i brought the rifle. You're ready for the photo. Shoot all dude. You brought the rifle. Yeah i've been dying to have that photo shoot. Hey let's go around the corner so you can't really hear the kids okay. Let's go around here. we go all right. Yeah feeling good man. I want my shirt. The polo oh the polo. Yeah with the school logo. Good one good mom. yeah man. i couldn't wait to take a photo with his rifle. Oh man don't you love rifle photo shoots or so do men are. I can't get enough pictures of me holding a gun right. what do i do. I look good near the locker right here. What do you think. Yeah man the locker. That's a good place given you the lock. Lean on the locker. Yeah maybe take a book. Hold a book in your hand written. Oh yeah that looks good. Looks good point the gun up. Yeah pretend like you're shooting right the basketball. Oh that looks good right there. Yeah oh that's nice. Now look at me like mean like a like you caught me. I'm late for class. Good that's good okay. Yes yes now. Now put the going to me and pretend you just caught me fighting in the school yard or what you're gonna do all. Yeah you're gonna shoot me right. Yeah because no fighting in the school yard you get shot right good good. All these photos are going to be great. Yeah put on social media. Maybe put him on your dating profile or you think a little handsome. You look so handsome bro. Next week come here bring machetes. We'll do a machete photo shoot. Yeah you look real. Good news is in flight afternoon. Delight eight you ever listened to where news in the afternoon is an afternoon delight for you know some of you listening to morning somebody listening in the afternoon some you listen at night whenever you listen. I just want you to know. I'm grateful i'm grateful that you press play on the weird of news episode so I also hope that you having a lovely weekend. It's the is the last weekend before christmas. So you're probably spending the we can do some shopping. Maybe not so much in actual stores although. I'm sure that is a possibility. A lot of you probably buying gifts online. Which is what. I did this year. I i mailed. People made a mailed a lot of coffee. This year is what i did My relatives love coffee. So people to get some some dope coffee this year from me It's so easy to just a man. I just love shopping online. Don't have to leave your bed. You can just be like oh. I'm christmas shopping right in my mom bed with my sniff test of whiskey chest kidding. Keep it real okay. Okay what did. I want to say announcements. That's right jones and get your head together. Get it together. Jones e you've got announcements to make. What are the announcements. Well i just hope you have a nice weekend really. That's my announcement. Oh yeah. I should mention the patriot. Because there's the patriot. Challenge is still going on where michael from iowa city will match a five dollars donation to anyone who joins the patriots at any level in this various levels regardless of the level of patriots. That you join. You will get access to some pretty cool weird af extra content. I hope you enjoy that stuff. I'm i'm going to be putting up another article. This evening. Something weird that i came across red at put a lot of weird stuff that i read and see and hear on there. So that's what you get not to mention some bonus episodes which i will have to record another one with my buddy dave at some point or another comedian. Perhaps it's just hard to get comedians to come over my house these days. they're scared. What are you scared of man. Just come on over all right. We're masks. We'll do whatever we gotta do. We'll record like twenty feet apart if we have to. I'll take. I'll take the risks. And i'll buy you a by subway sub. What about that. These are the things that i offer people. But they don't they don't want my company men they don't want to struggle these days What else did i want to say. Oh yeah thanks to everybody. Who sent me stories. That was pretty sweet of you. I got stories sent to me Via email funny jones. G mail dot com. Of course i also got some stories sent to me on instagram at funny jones Also someone sent me a story on facebook. My facebook is comedian jones or weird af news. There's a weird af news facebook page. You can submit stories as well through my website. Weird af news dot com. That's pretty cool. Check that out. You can also find the patriot in there too. Weird news dot com. Check it out and Have a great weekend. Hope you enjoyed the stories and we'll see you on on monday.
Being Ready for Your Moment
"The best goalies in the world. Let bad goals right. I mean we've seen for manchester. United david hale like considered one of the best goalies in the entire world at a rough end of the year doesn't mean he's not a goalies. Maybe going through some tough times. How you rebound from that. There was a situation last year. And this is a this is a middle school game right. So he's got middle. School is out the club soccer in middle school as you talk high school now that he's in now the games are different but anyway he made a mistake and the first mistake he made was some confusion and it probably could have been made by multiple people but got it his head so it was interesting to watch that a few minutes later. He made a second mistake. This mistake was one hundred percent mental. It was just a complete breakdown and it was interesting because at one point i was like kind of over. There just felt bad for him in a way but on the other side. It's like this is good. This is the learning experience. Let's see how he's going to respond to the situation. He responded very well at that point. But you see that in games right you could be on the road and you let an goal. Maybe a goal. You shoulda shoulda. Maybe you're in a bad position. How do you then maybe the crowds talking to you. Maybe you're as you get older. You start respecting one another. Because i think for younger people. That's harder because kids talk. They're also gonna look at the goal and they're gonna say that's his fault. It's easiest person on the field of blame. They don't realize that the midfielder he would have made possession at midfiel that everything would have been fine the ball on the other side field. Next thing you know he makes an error in the ball coming back to you. How do you deal with all of those moving pieces. I mean yeah you gotta get back to your mind is it. is it like the cornerback mentality. Hey you got beat for a long one. But you've got a short term memory move forward. What are you doing goalie to get to where you are today doing this for many years. Yeah i mean it. It's what you said it's It's that short term memory right so if you give goal there's no if you go back gore and if you make a mistake on and there's no getting back you know you could stand there and you could dwell on it and you know. I think that that's something that that even goalkeepers at the highest level you know if you talk about. You're talking about david day. Hey you tell that you know. The mistakes that he was meant is that he was making was he was fighting off. He was starting off some mental challenges and he was fighting off. Some you know whether his confidence was high. Whether it's confidence is low. it's you know. Even at the highest level you grow keepers that that go through confidence issues and deal with you know those mental mistakes and that mental side of the game. So you know the best advice that you can give her. The best advice that i've gotten is pretty much. Just you know short term memory. Forget about forget about the mistake you made and think about the next day even thinking about the next moment because you know there's there's going to be plenty of opportunities where if you give other that goal is going to be. You're going to have that chance to make up for. You're going to have that moment where you know you need to be called upon to make a big saves to keep your team in the game and if you're able to make that say if then that means that you've moved on mentally and that you were able to put that mistake behind you and it is tough you know when you're younger it's you know it's it's tough not to dwell on those moments because it is it's a moment where the negative spotlight is on you but at the same time like i think that goalkeeping along the way has taught me a lot of life lessons. You know it's life Life isn't exactly either easy either. So when you're dealing with when you're dealing with the tough moment and sports all the the negative spotlight is on you and you're able to respond and through it and you know come out the other end and notice that it wasn't the end of the world and it was just one moment and you're able to kind of shake. It often fight off those mental demons as we like to call them. You know. it's a good life learning lesson as well because you're going to deal with those types of things in life and and for me personally. That's one of the things. I love about the goalkeeper position. Is you know you can learn so much about life by being a goalie and you know for me. It's the mistakes that i've made on the field are lessons that i've learned That i've learned on the field but it's also helped me learn lessons off-the-field so for me that's one of the. That's one of the best things about being a goal is if you can if you can overcome those those tough moments those really tough mental struggles than you know. I think in the grand scheme of life. You're gonna be r. I i completely agree and i think it applies to so many things right like in business. You can say if you've played sports you've been in these situations no matter what level you've played it on. You could have made a mistake. You could have lost the game that she thought you're going to win or whatever happened. Are you had this incredible process journey. And then you end up winning so many parallels you can draw to it but it's like what happens when things aren't going. Well can you block it out and move forward. Can you get back to what it is that you're doing with the little things that you know. You need to do to get to that point right. You've had a wild ride. As i understand it you know playing high school soccer and then kind of moving your way up. They don't wanna touch on that a little bit. But one of the things that i've seen is that you've been a backup. And and there's there's certain positions. I think in sports where you see this right. We see it a lot of college football for example You know. I'm a huge ohio state. Fan right and Just feels georgia. And he makes a transfer and he's not the only one. There's many kids that do it because you wanna play. You wanna start in soccer's obviously hockey goalie another one. There's only one of those positions that can play and it's not easy to just take those guys out right. You don't see lot to quarterback you don't see a lot of two goalie systems as as you go on so you become a backup or a third string goalie and there could be situations where you're behind someone who's absolutely more experience possibly better a better prime minister career and you're still young and learning. But what about the situations when you feel like you're doing all the right things but there's so much going on behind the scenes perhaps political percent perhaps because the coach or general manager just likes that player better or because of the contractor. Who knows what those external circumstances are that really. You don't have any control over and you're not playing as a result. Does that relate to the mental stuff that you're dealing with on the field. But how do you handle being perhaps a backup or third string on you know and you have the confidence that perhaps you should be out there or at least getting your fair share of having the opportunity to be out there. I mean. I think that if you if you didn't believe that you should be out there then you wouldn't you wouldn't make it very far you know. I think that's the that's the type of mentality that you have to have. And that's kind of the fire that that keeps you keeps you going and keeps you pushing when you're in those tough situations if you are a second third string or you know you're not playing games and you wanna be plane. It's an internal that internal belief that you should be out there and you know that kind of drive that keeps you going but as far as you know the situation where you feel like you're getting shortchanged or you know you should be out there but you feel like something's political or or whatever you know that's just not the case but you don't do yourself any favors by dwelling on that you know. A few sports are crazy. You see all the time and like you talk about Ohio state and justice field right like who would have thought that like he would have never guessed in a million years that he would be transferring to ohio state and that he'd be starting for a you know from this season. He probably went to georgia thinking he was gonna be the man and you know a situation where his circumstances changed and you know hopefully for his sake. Hopefully he's ready for the moment and he's been preparing the right way and he's ready for the opportunity so when you're in a position where you're not playing you're not getting the reps about training hard keeping fire burning where you feel like you deserve to be out on the field but you know if it's not going your way at that time it's about preparing to making sure that you're ready because sports has a funny way of of giving people their moment to shine. Sports always sports kind of comes full circle for people. So it's it's about being ready in trying to make the most that opportunity that you get because there's only so many opportunities that come come about you know and if you're if you're dwelling on you know all the games that you didn't play all the moments that you felt like you were kinda getting screwed for lack of a better term but if you're drawing on those instead of the moment that you're going to get you're not going to do yourself any favors. It's just about being ready for your moment and you know it's it's good to be pissed off. It's good to be good to keep that fire burning because ultimately that's what's gonna keep you going and keep you pushing for more. Yeah you hear that a lot right that we all have those little things. Perhaps a teacher doubted you or someone or a friend or someone on the crowd on the other team was kinda calling. Whatever that might bannered could have been in any situation in your life and you know. I think there's there's a lot to be said about the person that can use that more as fuel but not as in like i'm gonna prove them wrong but just like you said the burnt the inner desire to wanna do something so you go back to work. And it's like the the opposite of the ryan the ryan holiday book. The obstacle is the way. Hey yeah you wanna be. You feel like you should be starting but you're not you're second year third string you give this opportunity and this happened to right so going backwards from what i understand. You went to University of south florida and they found you by playing high school soccer. So there's all sorts of conversation as you. Well know in this country right now of soccer where we go. Where are we going with this one in the world cup. Why did that happen. How are we going to train the young players and in not just for the the ultimate level but just as a country in general that. There's a lot of talk that high school soccer is not the answer. No doubt when you go to a lot of high school games. It's very different. It's almost like ping pong right or boom ball whereas in a club it's it's very much more controlling the game. A lot. more training and short-sighted games and all that but you played high school ball. Did you also play Academy or club soccer at the same time. How how how did that work out for you. Why are you playing high school soccer. So the academy system didn't exist When i was going through the high school when i was going through high school or if it did it was it was very. Maybe there's one or two academy systems in the entire country so for me it was just. That's kind of what everybody was doing unless you were called into the national team and Taking part in that so for me it was playing club. You would play club up until the high school season and then you would transition to high school soccer and then once high school soccer was over your transition back to club and but nowadays you know you talk about the world cup and you talk about you know where we're at on the world scale and and that whole process and i think if you look around the world there's kids that are playing if you're good enough to play. There's there's professionals that are playing fifteen sixteen years old all around the world. And if you're in the united states and you're playing high school soccer at they don't even compare so when you're talking about development and trying to get. Us soccer to be recognized on a world scale competitive and having type of types of players that that are able to go to a world cup and and do well and you know who knows maybe even with the trophy. one day. When you're talking about that you know. I think the academy system and starting these starting these kids and starting these players at a young age in that professional environment. You know it's it's a step in the right direction and for me you know. I love high school soccer. I love. I love high school sports. And you know i'm the type of guy that was growing in high school football games on friday night and cheering on your school and all that good stuff but if you really talking about region that next level of soccer in the united states then you know the academy system is is the way to go and hopefully you know. We're trying in the right direction. Yeah i think your teammate. That's under the gdp podcasts. It said that if you're trying to achieve something with soccer and your personal life whether you're trying to cover not right like just go to the next level get to a higher league that you have to go to the academy soccer right. You have to get to that level to be found because that's where people are looking for you and that's where you can at least try to make a name for yourself but all the way you know having fun with it. Whatever that is and if it's true passion obviously go find something different so you go you. You get recruited highschool soccer. Usf have a great career there. And i think you found out your junior year. You're if i'm not mistaken you made all american and Her joanna podcast walli. Maybe i'm pretty good at the sport. And i can do more with this. I could finish college and continued to play the sport and then the mls draft comes around and you would assume that things were going to go your way. This is so amazing to watch someone like yourself as dealing with mentally and just one game right you you put it in a vacuum and let's just play that one game and you have to deal with the mental side of just playing goalie now. You all the other things that are happening. Where am i going to go. How am i gonna play. What city my going to live tomorrow. Team i gonna be on and you're having to deal with that and you had the situation where you thought you got drafted but it was. One of your teammates have got drafted from south florida cracks. And then you move on and so you're dealing with all this. Tell us about that story about when you thought you got drafted than you realize. That wasn't the case. Yeah so like like you said you know i was expected and you know you go through all those mock drafts and and you know in your name there. Lots of you're expecting. You're expecting the day to go your way and so i'm just sitting in. I'm just sitting watching the computer and watching it by and waiting for my name and get called and you know just as it's slipping at each round goes by. You're getting a little bit more nervous than there's that feeling of you know. I can't like almost like disbelief. You can't believe what's going on. And like how could this be happening to you and you know all that all those good feelings that you get when it's not going your way but yeah so i'm sitting there with my girlfriend. Who is my wife now at the time. And we're just watching it and you see from the university of south florida so immediately it's all right. Yes like it's finally happened and you get that joy that excitement and it was one of my teammates. His name was bernardo ignore and they called his name and and it was just from there. I just shut the computer off. I i think. I think my wife and i to aaa or something. And you know just tried to just try to regroup but it is you know that you. It's it's at a patient and you're excited and you're and then think it's finally your moment and everything you've worked towards is is coming true and then having not the name was obviously A nice little nice little punching the again. But as i said man. It's just like it's just like with everything in life you know. Professional sports is professional. Sports is a little bit tough and it's it can be ruthless at times. And you know it's it's just something that you know if you can if you can deal with that type of that type of adversity and you can come out the other side. Then we're going to be better for america's mauve and for all of us here at soares. Thank you for listening to content matters if you'd like to connect you can find me on link dinner twitter. That's it for now.
Professional Soccer Goalkeeper Talks Readiness
"The best goalies in the world. Let bad goals right. I mean we've seen for manchester. United david hale like considered one of the best goalies in the entire world at a rough end of the year doesn't mean he's not a goalies. Maybe going through some tough times. How you rebound from that. There was a situation last year. And this is a this is a middle school game right. So he's got middle. School is out the club soccer in middle school as you talk high school now that he's in now the games are different but anyway he made a mistake and the first mistake he made was some confusion and it probably could have been made by multiple people but got it his head so it was interesting to watch that a few minutes later. He made a second mistake. This mistake was one hundred percent mental. It was just a complete breakdown and it was interesting because at one point i was like kind of over. There just felt bad for him in a way but on the other side. It's like this is good. This is the learning experience. Let's see how he's going to respond to the situation. He responded very well at that point. But you see that in games right you could be on the road and you let an goal. Maybe a goal. You shoulda shoulda. Maybe you're in a bad position. How do you then maybe the crowds talking to you. Maybe you're as you get older. You start respecting one another. Because i think for younger people. That's harder because kids talk. They're also gonna look at the goal and they're gonna say that's his fault. It's easiest person on the field of blame. They don't realize that the midfielder he would have made possession at midfiel that everything would have been fine the ball on the other side field. Next thing you know he makes an error in the ball coming back to you. How do you deal with all of those moving pieces. I mean yeah you gotta get back to your mind is it. is it like the cornerback mentality. Hey you got beat for a long one. But you've got a short term memory move forward. What are you doing goalie to get to where you are today doing this for many years. Yeah i mean it. It's what you said it's It's that short term memory right so if you give goal there's no if you go back gore and if you make a mistake on and there's no getting back you know you could stand there and you could dwell on it and you know. I think that that's something that that even goalkeepers at the highest level you know if you talk about. You're talking about david day. Hey you tell that you know. The mistakes that he was meant is that he was making was he was fighting off. He was starting off some mental challenges and he was fighting off. Some you know whether his confidence was high. Whether it's confidence is low. it's you know. Even at the highest level you grow keepers that that go through confidence issues and deal with you know those mental mistakes and that mental side of the game. So you know the best advice that you can give her. The best advice that i've gotten is pretty much. Just you know short term memory. Forget about forget about the mistake you made and think about the next day even thinking about the next moment because you know there's there's going to be plenty of opportunities where if you give other that goal is going to be have that chance to make up for. You're going to have that moment where you know you need to be called upon to make a big saves to keep your team in the game and if you're able to make that say if then that means that you've moved on mentally and that you were able to put that mistake behind you and it is tough you know when you're younger it's you know it's it's tough not to dwell on those moments because it is it's a moment where the negative spotlight is on you but at the same time like i think that goalkeeping along the way has taught me a lot of life lessons. You know it's life Life isn't exactly either easy either. So when you're dealing with when you're dealing with the tough moment and sports all the the negative spotlight is on you and you're able to respond and through it and you know come out the other end and notice that it wasn't the end of the world and it was just one moment and you're able to kind of shake. It often fight off those mental demons as we like to call them. You know. it's a good life learning lesson as well because you're going to deal with those types of things in life and and for me personally. That's one of the things. I love about the goalkeeper position. Is you know you can learn so much about life by being a goalie and you know for me. It's the mistakes that i've made on the field are lessons that i've learned That i've learned on the field but it's also helped me lay my sins the so for me. That's one of the. That's one of the best things about being a goal is if you can if you can overcome those those tough moments those really tough mental struggles than you know. I think in the grand scheme of life. You're gonna be alright. I completely agree. And i think it applies to so many things right like in business. You can say if you've played sports you've been in these situations no matter what level you've played it on. You could have made a mistake. You could have lost the game that she thought you're going to win or whatever happened. Are you had this incredible process journey. And then you end up winning so many parallels you can draw to it but it's like what happens when things aren't going. Well can you block it out and move forward. Can you get back to what it is that you're doing with the little things that you know. You need to do to get to that point right. You've had a wild ride. As i understand it you know playing high school soccer and then kind of moving your way up. They don't wanna touch on that a little bit. But one of the things that i've seen is that you've been a backup. And and there's there's certain positions. I think in sports where you see this right. We see it a lot of college football for example You know. I'm a huge ohio state. Fan right and Just feels georgia. And he makes a transfer and he's not the only one. There's many kids that do it because you wanna play. You wanna start in soccer's obviously hockey goalie another one. There's only one of those positions that can play and it's not easy to just take those guys out right. You don't see lot to quarterback you don't see a lot of two goalie systems as as you go on so you become a backup or a third string goalie and there could be situations where you're behind someone who's absolutely more experience possibly better a better prime minister career and you're still young and learning. But what about the situations when you feel like you're doing all the right things but there's so much going on behind the scenes perhaps political percent perhaps because the coach or general manager just likes that player better or because of the contractor. Who knows what those external circumstances are that really. You don't have any control over and you're not playing as a result. Does that relate to the mental stuff that you're dealing with the field. But how do you handle being perhaps a backup researching on you know and you have the confidence that perhaps you should be out there or at least getting your fair share of having the opportunity to be out there. I mean. I think that if you if you didn't believe that you should be out there then you wouldn't you wouldn't make it very far you know. I think that's the that's the type of mentality that you have to have. And that's kind of the fire that that keeps you keeps you going and keeps you pushing when you're in those tough situations if you are a second third string or you know you're not playing games and you wanna be plane. It's an internal that internal belief that you should be out there and you know that kind of drive that keeps you going but as far as you know the situation where you feel like you're getting shortchanged or you know you should be out there but you feel like something's political or or whatever you know that's just not the case but you don't do yourself any favors by dwelling on that you know. A few sports are crazy. You see all the time and like you talk about Ohio state and justice field right like who would have thought that like he would have never guessed in a million years that he would be transferring to ohio state and that he'd be starting for a you know from this season. He probably went to georgia thinking he was gonna be the man and you know it's a situation where his circumstances changed and you know hopefully for his sake hopefully he's ready for the moment and he's been preparing the right way and he's ready for the opportunity so when you're in a position where you're not playing you're not getting the reps. It's about training hard keeping fire burning where you feel like you deserve to be out on the field but you know if it's not going your way at that time it's about preparing to making sure that you're ready because sports has a funny way of of giving people their moment to shine. Sports always sports kind of comes full circle for people. So it's it's about being ready in trying to make the most that opportunity that you get because there's only so many opportunities that come come about you know and if you're if you're dwelling on you know all the games that you didn't play all the moments that you felt like you were kinda getting screwed for lack of a better term but if you're drawing on those instead of the moment that you're going to get you're not going to do yourself any favors. It's just about being ready for your moment and you know it's it's good to be pissed off. It's good to be good to keep that fire burning because ultimately that's what's gonna keep you going and keep you pushing for more. Yeah you hear that a lot right that we all have those little things. Perhaps a teacher doubted you or someone or a friend or someone on the crowd on the other team was kinda calling. Whatever that might bannered could have been in any situation in your life and you know. I think there's there's a lot to be said about the person that can use that more as fuel but not as in like i'm gonna prove them wrong but just like you said the burnt the inner desire to wanna do something so you go back to work. And it's like the the opposite of the ryan the ryan holiday book. The obstacle is the way. Hey yeah you wanna be. You feel like you should be starting but you're not you're second year third string. You didn't give this opportunity and this happened to right so going backwards from what i understand. You went to University of south florida and they found you by playing high school soccer. So there's all sorts of conversation as you. Well know in this country right now of soccer where we go. Where are we going with this one in the world cup. Why did that happen. How are we going to train The young players and in not just for the the ultimate level but just as a country in general that. There's a lot of talk that high school soccer is not the answer. No doubt when you go to a lot of high school games. It's very different. It's almost like ping pong right or boom ball whereas in a club it's it's very much more controlling the game. A lot. more training and short-sighted games and all that but you played high school ball. Did you also play Academy or club soccer at the same time. How how how did that work out for you. Why are you playing high school soccer. So the academy system didn't exist When i was going through the high school when i was going through high school or if it did it was it was very. Maybe there's one or two academy systems in the entire country so for me it was just. That's kind of what everybody was doing unless you were called into the national team and Taking part in that so for me it was playing club. You would play club up until the high school season and then you would transition to high school soccer and then once high school soccer was over your transition back to club and but nowadays you know you talk about the world cup and you talk about you know where we're at on the world scale and and that whole process and i think if you look around the world there's kids that are playing if you're good enough to play. There's there's professionals that are playing fifteen sixteen years old all around the world. And if you're in the united states and you're playing high school soccer at they don't even compare so when you're talking about development and trying to get. Us soccer to be recognized on a world scale competitive and having type of types of players that that are able to go to a world cup and and do well and you know who knows maybe even with the trophy. one day. When you're talking about that you know. I think the academy system and starting these starting these kids and starting these players at a young age in that professional environment. You know it's it's a step in the right direction and for me you know. I love high school soccer. I love. I love high school sports. And you know i'm the type of guy that was growing in high school football games on friday night and cheering on your school and all that good stuff but if you really talking about region that next level of soccer in the united states then you know the academy system is is the way to go and hopefully you know. We're trying in the right direction. Yeah i think your teammate. That's under the gdp podcasts. It said that if you're trying to achieve something with soccer and your personal life whether you're trying to cover not right like just go to the next level get to a higher league that you have to go to the academy soccer right. You have to get to that level to be found because that's where people are looking for you and that's where you can at least try to make a name for yourself but all the way you know having fun with it whatever that is and if it's true passion obviously go find something different so you go you. You get recruited high school soccer. Usf have a great career there. And i think you found out your junior year. You're if i'm not mistaken you made all american and Her joanna podcast walli. Maybe i'm pretty good at the sport. And i can do more with this. I could finish college and continued to play the sport and then the mls draft comes around and you would assume that things were going to go your way. This is so amazing to watch someone like yourself as dealing with mentally and just one game right you you put it in a vacuum and let's just play that one game and you have to deal with the mental side of just playing goalie now. You all the other things that are happening. Where am i going to go. How am i gonna play. What city my going to live tomorrow. Team i gonna be on and you're having to deal with that and you had the situation where you thought you got drafted but it was. One of your teammates have got drafted from south florida cracks. And then you move on and so you're dealing with all this. Tell us about that story about when you thought you got drafted than you realize. That wasn't the case. Yeah so like like you said you know i was expected and you know you go through all those mock drafts and and you know in your name there. Lots of you're expecting. You're expecting the day to go your way and so i'm just sitting in. I'm just sitting watching the computer and watching it tick by and waiting for my name and get called and you know just as it's slipping as each round goes by. You're getting a little bit more nervous than there's that feeling of you know. I can't almost like disbelief. You can't believe what's going on. And like how could this be happening to you and you know all that all those good feelings that you get when it's not going your way but yeah so i'm sitting there with my girlfriend. Who is my wife now at the time. And we're just watching it and you see from the university of south florida so immediately it's all right. Yes like it's finally happened and you get that joy that excitement and it was one of my teammates. His name was bernardo ignore and they called his name and and it was just from there. I just shut the computer off. I i think. I think my wife and i to aaa or something. And you know just tried to just try to regroup but it is you know it's that it's that patient and you're excited and you're and then think it's finally your moment and everything you've worked towards is is coming true and then having not the name was obviously A nice little nice little punching the again. But as i said man it's just like it's just like with everything in life you know. Professional sports is professional. Sports is a little bit tough. They can be ruthless at times. And you know it's it's just something that you know if you can if you can deal with that type of that type of adversity and you can come out the other side. Then we're going to be better for america's mauve and for all of us here at soares. Thank you for listening to content matters if you'd like to connect you can find me on link dinner twitter. That's it for now.
Crypto Kenzie from Crypto Culture
"Welcome to the to list and this podcast with your host Mister to Rich your Southern Urban voice a place where relevant Rich conversation I had with professionals providing insights innovative solutions that will help you move your business career and life for the next level. Here's your host. All right, Sal welcome to the to risk in this podcast this week. We have an amazing guest bath a great conversation crypto culture the one and only crypto Kenzie is in the building that the tourist in this podcast definitely grateful and thankful to have met with us great phenomena conversation with a young man. That's an accountant. And then crypto let's get it. The the midst podcast my guest today. a haitian-american 20-something grew up in Florida college degree in accounting graduated from the University of South Florida and also work that one of the top four accounting firms in the world. Yeah. Yeah before diving into this wonderful world of crypto. So no currency. So other than yeah, so other than asking you how you doing, the one thing that I did want to start instead of you off asking about cuz I saw this and want a previous videos and I said I wanted to see girl remember this. Are you fucking set up yet? Wait a second. How how how old is that video? Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. I'm I'm cuz I know I say some crazy. I say some outlandish things sometimes but I try to keep it like off camera, but how I'm trying to remember what video that it's just I feel like everything you said came from my very first video that I put out it did. All right, cool. Yeah. I know. Yeah. Yeah. McKenzie. Good job. Good job. Yes. Yes. I'm I'm fucking it up as long as my eye. Wow, thank you for pulling that up. Like for real for real. I I I really gotta go back to that video either delete it or keep it off. I'm clearly going to keep it up. But yeah, I didn't I I honestly didn't expect to still be here. When I first made that video I was that was my very first video. I was like, you know, what about you know, it wasn't my first video on YouTube. I actually looked up like my very first video on YouTube and I was I was in high school my sophomore year of high school was the first time I put a video up on YouTube and I net then the second time I put my video up on YouTube was a sophomore year of college. No, no, no, no, no. Freshman year of Community College and then after that I never put up a video again and I'm like, oh my god. What have I been doing this whole time? And so I'm yeah, I'm I'm plugging it up. Like I I'm so happy I stuck around. I'm so happy I stuck around but thank you so much everything you said about me was true. Yes. I am that I am that guy Joe. How am I going to call you back? Cuz I see you got your name on here is to what? Is it too? Rich to Rich to miss or two minutes to Rich. Yeah to Rich talk to Residents and basically what that is this what that is is I started that it originally came from it comes from two things actually and this the first let's have somebody kind of taught me about that wage is comes with two rich is actually a spin on my name. I'm actually the second so oh you're Richard II, right? Yeah. Yep. That's Richard the Second and two myths is actually a it's it's more of a I don't want to use wrong word. But it's more of a dedication to my to change me and my wife lost in the yeah, cuz we've had two miscarriages and now so we have to but she has to that obviously mine now, but yeah, but we offer but we have to that that that we would have had that didn't make it. So so the two myths is actually for the kids. So two rents to miss is actually where that when it all comes from Wow thoughts on the soul. So your main come from the soul. Hey, I can't even be like, I'm already crying. I'm not This bad. Look I'm over here thinking about about to talk about money crypto. You got me over here feeling myself like Dane. Yeah. He reached a missed that that night. I know you're going to page. Like you got it in your soul. I do my best man because it's and we are going to talk about money and the whole point of of kind of want to talk about this and doing things with this man, especially easy though, but with overall, I like to talk to real people doing real things and you fall into that category because in out here going and doing doing this online thing, you know and doing it with me and I I do voice-over and I've been trying to dig off into that in for a while and as you and as I'm sure they, you know, you run into everybody with a six-figure following is not putting out quality content and and a lot of people aren't even wage. A lot of seals are out here and a lot of people I have their own agenda and they're not even really pushing real pushing things that ass going to help people and from the standpoint of crypto wage. I know in my limited experience cuz I got into this market May of eighteen. Okay, so may of eighteen things were, you know, we were starting to kind of oh no. Oh, you know what time it was I knew what time it was man. It was that time to look I guess. I was just sharing like my little story real quick on like how I got in. Yeah, you actually gotten out of Better Price than me. Just I'm being 100% honest with you so long this going back to the story tax accountant at the time in 2017. I was just like working out. I was reaching the point cuz I was working for PWC at the time and I log Kitchen the point where I was like is this what I really want to do for the rest of my life. Like I was working ridiculous amounts of overtime this this and that and it just like it just and I was doing it for the past like three years before that and I was just getting into that cycle of. Oh my God, is this it is this all and I just and I was looking at my bank account and I'm like is this it is this off like I'm looking at the bank account and then I'm looking at this college each day, and I'm like, they're saying this ain't working out. You know what I'm saying? So I was looking for a different ways to make money. I was like, you know, I'm the account in the group and you know, I didn't want to go past. I didn't want to go to get my CPA because I realized that I was truly in love with what I was doing and I was looking at it saying oh my God, I'm going to have to put myself in more debt to get this next level of income that I probably may not ever pay off nose off. So I had to find other ways of income because I've got friends that you know, they've been multiple businesses and whatnot. And I'm like what am I doing? So I got into like, you know, the very first thing that you know, when people they put you on pyramid schemes they put you on multi-level marketing and you know, it works for some people and it just doesn't work for other people, you know what I'm saying? But while I was during well while I was learning in a multi-level marketing somebody when there was like yo guys, let's just put all this stuff down real quick this Bitcoin thing. It's it's running broke brought double my money yesterday. I was like say less, you know, Say less and so hold on real quick. Aren't part. Yeah, cuz cuz for some reason I just felt like I was getting a lot of game and I don't know when I was talking into the mic it was getting like or maybe that's just my headphones off. Well, you do it. All right good. So going back to the story. So this guy said hey, man, I double my money yesterday. I'm like, you know what say less and so I got into it granted at that time when he took us to make coin and we were making coin basic ounces make it financed accounts it like all in one night and literally like the next day coinbase shut down all account new accounts Finance shut down all new account. But this was December 16th 2017. If you go back and look at December 16th, 2017 was literally the top of the market off Bitcoin was hitting 20K. That was when I was buying Bitcoin. Oh my God, so I I felt it all the way all the way down, but I stuck Iraq. With it, so that's why I'm here now because I told myself because you just lost a lot of money a lot of money cuz I was at the time they they allowed you to use your credit cards while swiping the credit card there like like anything that double up this money cuz I didn't like whoa this money moving fast cuz I'm immediately getting into crypto. I went right into altcoins home. Cuz that was the first thing I had was just go right into all coins, bro. You got it was whatever. I'm like, all right bet and money started popping off cuz that was all season at that time. So I got into old coins at the right time. I had no clue. Like what is this? Look at the end of the day, I'll held everything and I lost a lot of money so I had to teach myself or something really quickly. I was like, you know what I've lost a lot of money. I'm sitting over here with egg on my face. I bought the top of the market but I'm Gonna Learn why I lost all this money. I'm I'm going to put down. Down in like I'm put my you know, just like a dog, you know a dog, you know puts his tail between his legs and walk off. I'm like I'm gonna do this walk off for a quick but that doesn't mean I'm not paying attention. So throughout the entire year. I stuck with a couple of influence just that we're continuing to continue to talk about cryptocurrency. And you know, I've attached to some of the ones that I actually felt that, you know were being honest and true to me and long story short met this one guy computer side engine. He encouraged me to start a YouTube channel because he was on YouTube talking about Bitcoin and you'll say it's really easy. All you do is just talk about everything you see like talk about our experiences and your story because no one can ever do your story only you can do your story. That's true. And so once you see that people are going to latch onto you attached because you have you know me, I've got very good personality. I hate to brag about it, but I really good personality and especially on camera cuz you know off But that was that was my that was my Kicker. That was my starter. And ever since I made that first video. It's been a long steady grind to the so today but I'm here today on the podcast too. Rich to miss with Richard. So what's going on? Yo, oh man at phenomenal Story. I mean when I got in here, I got off and on the mining side cuz I like Hardware. So I said, you know what so actually, you know, if I can cuz I didn't have a lot of extra cash at the time to you know to float around with that cuz the other kids that have here children now one where we were home. We're home schooling both of them one. We ended up putting in the private school. So it was a lot financially going on and off I didn't have that. So I said but I saw the mining part of it and I said, well, okay. Well I can you know, I got some computers around here, you know, let me strip some things out and throw off. Some things together not realizing you know what it really really took. Friends from that initial YouTuber that got us all together. I got a group of friends. They have their own Discord and everything then every time one of my friends like men, are you in the mining and everything? I'm like go to that group going to there cuz what they talk about in there is is is another language to me, but they they talk about some other language down now, but they ended up and and they're just, you know, building their minds building their GPU Minds building there a sick minds and everything. You'll trying to get a basic mind. I wanted to get into that and like I said, I kind of as I dug off into it, I realize from the electricity standpoint, you know for the light bill and logistically speaking it was not going to work out. So I kind of thought I had to kind of fall back for a minute and and I just kind of watched and watched and watched I watched this thing go all the way down to 35 and actually you know, what, And at the time when the 35 I remember because I had an extra 3500 that the wife didn't know about it the time I said I should just go on and buy Bitcoin right off his way to suspect just to just get one, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and I was like I should just going to just get it and I was in paralysis analysis analysis paralysis a better way to put it analysis paralysis kicked in man and as his waited away then do not with it and then it got the 7,000 then I finally got back in and and I was like I said, you know what I know this thing is going let's really dig in a LS really go off all crypto because even though I'm not an accountant or anything. I've I've always dug a lot off in the finances and off I've done enough that I've done enough to mess it up. Don't we all you know, so, you know, so yeah shout out that I arrest you know, but life is Lord, so I did enough to mess it up, but I've always wanted I've always known the importance of investing, you know, cuz I've done Some good things in the stock market early. I did a lot of good things with 401ks and all of that and you know, so I understand so I say, you know what I'm going to get in here. I'm going to really invest in this stuff and I'm a real I'm a really fuck with so I really thought of the fuk with it and up to now even not knowing what I should know. I still manage the Forex what I've done wrong. Yes, you know. Yes, so I'm Forex up bills so far and I don't trade and that was one of the things I was going to have to you don't have to you real. We don't just you're not a Trader. No. No, I'm not. I promise when I I talked about trading but I'm not trading all I'm doing and this is I want people to really understand that's when I say cuz it may look like I'm trading but it's not I'm researching projects. I'm researching projects and I'm looking at does this token actually have values like what how does this token make me money other than just holding onto doing it holding on to it holding on to it and hoping somebody else buys it and it pops up in price home and there's a lot of innovation happening in this space right now. A lot of it's really confusing and a lot of it's really just a bunch of games. And and when I say bunch of games, I mean these these developers people who build apps and and all these other things they playing games with a lot of these a lot of these cryptocurrencies and you you probably might get caught up in it. But if God You're just holding Bitcoin and holding it for all its fundamental values. It's unable to be confiscated by the feds. It's you know decentralized money. It's all money. That's not controlled by any government. Each government can come in and say, oh we create a Bitcoin but we all know the truth like you can't stop you. They can't control it. They honestly every time the US even ceases Bitcoin they auction it off. That's how Mike novogratz got a lot of his Bitcoin cuz they auction it off from the Silk Road Carfax from all that stuff know that's what people don't really understand. All you have to do is just hold on, especially if you don't want to get into the craziness of what these folks doing, if you just hold on a bit cocky 4X your return look filling good good. Yeah. This is true. I mean and and granted and full disclosure for the folks out there dead. Mess around with all coins as well, you know and all coins was a part of that and which and and that's just because I need the capital and I mean I need to build up the capital and because I I look at this whole and this is something that's want to dig into especially from your standpoint because you're at you're you're an accountant. So you actually know modern monetary Theory wage. Yeah, you know, here's the crazy thing about it. Yeah a county doesn't teach you that stuff, especially not especially not in the college's accounting doesn't teach you that stuff off all that monetary policy all these things. I learned through being in Bitcoin because the original OG's and Bitcoin they they they're all about Keynesian economics. They're all about hard money. It's all about gold. Like there are all these kind of do the cypherpunks and what not and they're they literally just sit there and post and sweet about Look back when the US took everybody's gold and scold skyrocketed right after they took everybody's goal. You want them to take your Bitcoin? Watch what happens when they do, you know things like wage all look how the Federal Reserve is printing money. Do you think printing money is a good thing? Here's what it causes and it connects, you know, I'm going through all the history of inflation wage and how all these countries died off because they kept printing money and I'm like wait and we're still doing it. This is still happening today. Like we didn't learn from our past month. And so all of that. Sorry, all of that just came up to. Okay now I'm learning real economics. Now, I'm learning how the system actually works cuz they don't teach this in the schools. Like they didn't teach you like where money comes from why like how why inflation is so bad things like that. This is true. I totally agree with you dead. And I realize that I mean I thought from an accounting standpoint that it would be some of the things they talked about s that's good to know know they teach you how to look at books States. I'm debits and credits and what not. And then they push you through. That's it. I'm granted. I did have to take Finance classes, but tell me I learn tell me I can remember anything from what they taught me wrong. I remember anything from what they taught me in college and I'd be I'd be lying to you so it but me learning Bitcoin and me learning like true economics. It's like, oh I can regurge this all the time cuz I actually know it. I actually like it's stuck in my memory now, so that's that's the main difference but when it comes to like just a whole accounting side background is in accounting, but what really attached me to bitcoin was the back end of the blockchain part in the sense of oh, this is just a ledger because every company has their own Ledger, you know what I'm saying? They and they do their own debits and credits and if they're public they gotta report to someone if they not, you know, they gotta get audited and whatnot. And when somebody said on the accounting aspect This is what Bitcoin is. It's just a digital Ledger that everybody can audit that it's open to the world that anybody can see if you understand how to read it. And I'm like, oh this house fire. Y'all got my money. I got my shock it up my money by Miles y'all got my money granted. I was putting too much money to her too early. But I remember at down at the 3K down at 3 K. I was I was $10 here $10 like anything I can get at that point. But at that time, I was five hundred thousand. Let's go let's let's but that's that's pretty much how it came back from like my accounting background and what made me stick to it. Oh, okay. All right that makes this wage is you were in that DCA and DCA was not nice. Guarantee when I started out was not I was gambling broke. I was gambling like I was just I have no clue. I thought I was investing had no clue what I was doing. You know, the one thing that I do see in this in this in this sector is we don't do enough research on our own and and it opens up a lot of it opens up a lot of us to the Shields. And so the people that are selling coins I mean and and I even went and I fell into it and nationally as well because especially from an older person cuz you're you're twenty something I'm pushing fifty and you still want this big you still want it you want may get dad, you know, and it's kind of the interesting thing. I was talking to one of my older Partners right educator brother and and do you know that he still thinks that off. Financial system is backed by gold. He's on something just tell me he's on something because he knows that that we've been we've been off the gold standard wage. And I know that and this is the thing and I was like and I said what you said, you know, and he was just like no I'm like no and I went and pulled up short. And so that's cool. What are you talking about? The next like you don't remember like here there's documented proof. Right? Right, you know, and I said that they're saying that granted thankfully this individual is very frugal. So since he's very frugal he's all right, but most of us are not Frugal like this individual is down. Most of us are consumers versus have a consumer mindset versus a investor mindset. So we do it wrong from the top from the start and and then we have birth. expectations and especially in this doggone crazy Market, they'll listen to not to put anybody on blast but they'll listen to somebody like bit boy and you know, and they'll I mean I don't do it but he's known as people will knowingly just put in our day and say he's a pump-and-dump and now see. So now this is the crazy thing right now that I'm in like the consecration space and now that I'm growing a little bit it scares me to talk about any any project because it's really a good business model for a content creator to just talk about every everything every coin every this I tested this out. I tested that out and I remember in my last video that I just put out I was talking about how when I first got into the space, I just saw people yelling at people especially on crypto Twitter yelling at different influences, cuz you know, I'm looking at different YouTube videos. I'm going today Twitter cuz I'm trying to learn about it and just seeing them argue with other people you promoted this you promoted that whatever whatever this that you're asking. Are your shuttler but at the end of the day that boy he's taking care of his family. Yeah, you take care of his kids. I remember a video where he showed. Yeah. I'm making 15K just off of YouTube alone and then taking that 15 a month a month on YouTube just by talking about whatever coin that comes up and it doesn't matter and the thing is he could sit there and say don't buy this thing do your research what and I could repeat that over and over again and people will not do it. They think oh he's just saying that that's just to protect him. I'm a throw my money in it and then boom now you're a scammer. Now, you're sure now granted some people they push it to the extreme. They they it doesn't matter give the audience what they want but it reaches a point where people don't respect you anymore. You're like, oh God. Well, I can't trust what he says cuz he just don't talk about everything. So it really comes out to that balance of do you want to do want to be known in the bank for that big bank account or do you want to be known by the people and be respected and you have to you know be able to manage that so granted. I've I've learned I've softened up to the the Schiller's cuz I've realized that exact same things going to happen to me the bigger I get in the more I talk about stuff that interests me, but this is true and I understand that I agree and because I mean and once again, I can't sit there at the very low end of content creation and don't even say it that way just you start it now. No low-end you start now, that's all it is cracked. But yeah, but I was going to say but in the midst of starting now and and so your point about the shelter's I don't I mean I can't honestly say what I can't say Thursday. I wouldn't quote unquote Shield or promote a coin if a project didn't come came to me and said okay, here's $5,000 talk about my project. I mean, I mean, you know what I'm saying? I can't say that. It's like I gave say that you know, I mean, how can I go back to my wife and I was somebody told me five grand to talk about the project and I said no. Well, you know honey, I want to be respectful of the community and I do not want to be known as a shield. We got we got Win $5,000 for a five minute video off the internet at all to go put you in respect bank account exactly, you know birthday. I can't so I'm I definitely don't fought him and and I guess and I only said that because I was at him and not the necessarily put the guy on blast because I don't like to do that. You know, I would prefer honestly, I want my platform to be built on talking to people like yourself that's really doing stuff versus shedding light on people that are actual that I can't seem to be bullshitters end up because I came front cheers. I have actually made some money out some his picks. Yep. Yeah at home, especially in a bull market, especially when everything's going up you you could put your money in anything now, but but the one thing that I do want people to know though that you mentioned that a lot of people skate over is the research part. Yeah in a lot of us don't take the time to do the research part and speaking of research. I know kind of kind of bouncing around I got a whole The questions that I wanted that I wanted to ask you about cuz you're good granted. I do have to go live at 8:30. So you have a whole nother hour. All right, cool Nelson's up. But I got all my stuff ready for that live stream. So we're good. Okay, cool deal. Yeah, cuz like I said and once and in the midst of it all I I like talking to smart people in and then when I when I said I said this dude is on it, you know, and once again just looking at your earliest video and then I caught the video that you did with mayonnaise. Oh God, I can't think of his got can blood it's I have a I got a couple of good interviews recently. Yeah. Yeah cuz you did can and that was a good one and and y'all went through and talked about some very intriguing things that some stuff about the market that I had that I'm still like whoa. Okay, I mean in crypto blood was on his channel talking to him and and they were talking about Bitcoin mixers and off I go ahead. Go ahead. I'm sorry. I'm going to cut off there but not cuz I heard that and I'm like I had this is one of those things that I kind of seen the floating around and I honestly ignored it sucks, you know, because Coming from the older crowd, you know, I'm on a capital preservation stats slash build up, right so having so if if it looks alert, you know, I kind of I kind of the space is very experimental, you know what I'm saying? So I understand exactly how you feel, you know, but but they were talking about mixers and I'm like, oh, okay. So this is a thing, you know, I mean and I'm always learning something new about it and and July said it's very experimental. But what are your thoughts on D V Okay, so We going to go so for people who don't know what D fight is first boo just to kind of worms. Hm first thing. I always tell people understand Bitcoin is First Once you understand that core of what Bitcoin is and what it provides then you can go into decentralized Finance. So right now in the cryptosporidium decentralized Finance or open finance is essentially you taking your cryptocurrency what people used to do was just hold onto a crypto-currency and wait for people to just buy it and go up now, you know, what developers came up and say, you know, what here's some code here's some stuff. Here's the logic we can create exactly off in the regular Financial system without people or a very very very minimal amount of people to operate this thing. And so now they've Built lending platforms think derivatives platforms all these different things where you don't have to go through like an investment banker or a or a Schwab or something. You can literally take the coins out of your wallet put into a program cuz that's what you're doing or a protocol or an app and just letting the app do what it's supposed to change and his apps are quoted to do, you know trade it this way. I'm not really training it but it accrues interest by lending it here or borrowing it there for these kinds of different things. That is what Defy is it's essentially any Financial product that you can find in traditional Finance. You're going to find in defy eventually right now is all the experimental phases of well. Can we recreate this? Can we recreate that does it work but and the reason why they do it is because we need a wage. Be able to invest and do more with our crypto without having a central party controlling us or like a coinbase or like any any of the others like regular birth is stopping us from doing it. So that's what the right now my thoughts on it. It's it's mind-blowing what's happening at home. Personally me. I've never seen anything like it. It's actually taught me a whole plethora of different financial instruments that are in the traditional school system that I never knew about. I'm like, oh so this defy product is supposed to replicate in interest-bearing loans and this this and that and I'm like, oh and this deal product now you can tokenize your house and then you can have owned shares of your house and this and it's and some things are like completely brand new like think wage. That people owning shares of your home and they get the revenue from that share of your home. I'm like, whoa, something like that's never happened. There's no Financial product in the main world that is in this world. So not only do we already copying old Financial products, but now we're building brand new ones in this whole new world and the good part about that as well. Once this part once defy really expands agree with everything. They said as a great explanation, by the way. Yeah, and the thing that I like about it man is it's going to open up the door for a lot of well, I'm just a lot of us black people to be to go in and get money and Loans off and it also gives us the benefit of being able to take advantage of the fees that we can get for Lending out our crypto versus now in traditional Finance well, we put our money in the bank and Banks the door fractionalized fractionalized lending we get no parts of that. I mean all we get is a point zero something off a savings account rate, you know, so let's get you to the bigger account rate that gets you 3% more. Yeah, but 10K in at minimum. Yeah, right, right, right and d v puts all of that on his head and it's like it with you. I'm especially coming from somebody who your service mortgages and know and who was working in the bankruptcy part of mortgages and who kind of seeing how that all fell apart and no and working with, you know, all of them as the default and the real estate owned and seeing how this whole process work then owning a home myself and I'm like this whole deep-fried thing is is huge. It can be very huge. But I always caution people when I'm talking about it on my when I talk about it. Be careful because it's it's great. And these apy numbers will make you think oh why have I not been doing this but then if you get the wrong if you get into dial going into a food coin hotdogs or yeah more often. Yeah. Then it goes back to our saying it's a playground for developers. It is it's a playground if you know how to bold aetherium and I actually have a co-worker. He's like my appearance like I go to him like what is this contract saying, you know, I don't really I don't under I can't read this. Oh, so this is what this is supposed to do what I'm like. Oh thank God bro. I'm not putting my money in there, but they they this is what they're doing and to just to just to give the word of caution. Like for real do do everybody. Remember all the websites that came out back into like the 1990s all the different websites like this website that lips see a lot of people my age cuz I'm in my late twenties now, but I don't remember all of the websites, but I remember some of them because we were really just felt like my age is really focused on the social media, but we had most like do it, Yep. Next to you know, do it. Com IP owed on the stock market because they had a website that's it. And that's it. And so what's happening right now in the crypto space is the same thing. I'm glad you said that I'm glad you're saying that because I I compare this market to I compare the crypto market now to the way the internet was back in the dialogue days. Just what you're talking about. It was a lot of times. It's multiple click To get to do something when regular websites. All you need to do is one-click or two clicks. You got you have to know what you're doing. You gotta have a Madam ask you gotta have this. You gotta have that you gotta pack like it's going to reach a point where all that Stood Still phase out. All you're going to need is to have one wallet one thing one that but for the US for the for the four people who been off for a while now, we're going to keep using the original ways cuz we're going to understand all that one click stuff. You're giving up a lot of power to get that convenience wage. That's been the people don't understand that when something gets very easy to use. Just remember what you're giving up foreign. Exactly and that is also another game Oh, how about to say the camera even agrees? I'm like don't don't fall a bit too. It kind of go through all figure it out. Yeah. No, right. I was like, whoa, the cameras even an agreement. That was a real situation. I knew I knew all supposed to be talking about this I do it. Yeah, but yeah, and I love them but but but no, but I definitely it's amazing what could really happen right now and oh, yeah, this has in the market because it's home is slow and clunky right now as far as the industry overall, but it's just like you said by the time people by the time it gets to what you're speaking about. A lot of the value was going to already be sucked out to oh, yeah, you know, so I tell people now, you know, the only real color that matters is green. The reason why I say it is because think about this how many people that you know? That are financially secure for real are they really worried about who hates them? Because they're black or white. Well, let's talk about black people. How many well on black people, you know thinking about the white man holding them down and and and Trump did this and and we need guidance for their thoughts are yes. X-rays drunk is putting down for these llc's and companies and whatnot completes. The rich you are the better it is right now for you. That's a fact of life you are it is amazing for this is why Republicans are usually more wealthy people because the I guess the Republican mindset, that's all that just throw all that racism out the way and just look at like the fundamentals of like what the Republican party wants. It's to empower the economy home specifically the US economy and Empower us first then do all that while the more democratic party. It's not really about that. It's more like money for everybody and bring an end. Looks like it's almost like contrast in a sense, but I'm just going back to that the home wealthy person know I think person thinks they're not looking at what they're not even paying attention to age. This stuff cuz they understand all this like and this is me just being conspiracy theory. All this stuff is just the the whole election blah. All that stuff is whatever all that matters is. What's the FED doing? Yeah. That's that's all that matters like and every time what's the FED doing and this is the explanation I give every time and I sometimes I feel like I'm wrong when I say it when you're in a household and you know, usually I get the I get a certain man, sir. I'm talking to married men. So I already know what's going to come in our household who makes decisions the person that makes more money or the person that you know is in the house and usually decisions are supposed to be made together. But if you make all the money essentially you have more power and so if we look at the people who have the money and the government they're the ones that are really control. Everything that's going on but this is like a solicitous mean being conspiracy and trying to relate money to marriage which never works out. That's why I'm single now. Yeah, I mean this is true, but it but it is it's not necessarily a conspiracy theory though, if you really think about it because lobbyists are essentially people that are paid to be in Washington to help to incorporate and convince people of their ideas and thoughts kind of like for example, you know, and just to go along with this point. Let's look at coinbase the coinbase CEO. He's real cool with which c e I know you know, but but he's cool. See the thing is he's cool with a lot of people but he's been going through some stuff right now. All I remember is with the coinbase CEO off. His CFO, it's part of is on the board of the FED. Now, you know, yeah, Brian Brooks. So Brian Brooks used to be the CFO of coinbase and now he's head his head attorney something general at the fed. He's like the number to seeing. He's the number to seat down whoever best deep cuz I was thinking cuz I was going to talk about he's cold with Jamie dimon. Oh, man. Jamie Jamie the dino Diamond yet. They already knew what time it was. They realized coinbase is the new way. It's the new like they already realized that all these internet Banks and I was just talking about this with my coworker. She'll she'll just like are these Banks even here? Like, I don't know the last time I had to go to a bank and I'm like, oh, it's just for old people. You know that right? Like it just for old people's all the rest of us. We had apps. Like all our stuff is on apps like I don't ever have to go inside a bank only like Mississippi only time I get cash cuz no one really has cash only time I get cashed is if I want to buy, you know, yeah. No, that's it. That's it. Like the only time I would ever have cash but everything else is digital all across all digital. Sorry. I completely lost track of where I was going back Banks back Jamie Dino diamond. Yeah, is it off? No, not Goldman Sachs was the Goldman Sachs guy. I'm I'm not forget that but Jamie dimon, he's JP Morgan JP Morgan and the JPMorgan Quorum and their whole corn stalks him that they were trying to push that they realized was going to fail because etherians here and there's nothing they can do about it. Yeah. They're they're they're in they're they're all of them know each other all along the laughing with each other. I believe Jamie's using easy. What is it custodianship? That's what it is. Jamie's doing the custodianship for coinbase has custodian of services. So now they're mixing the old with the new laptop is cuz the old still need a hand in this space because they realize that this space isn't really built for a conglomerate thing. It's built to be decentralized just like how you're saying right now, you know swap in coinbase, you know swaps doing more volume than the coin beige. Right now it is Eunice, Miss. You know swaps only. Yeah, and it's doing more of a the coinbase that's been around since like what 2014? Yep, and you know, man and here's the thing with that and almost I like you to swap. I'm a fan and but a lot of people aren't going to use and I know especially with newer people because it's all of those parts. You gotta go through some cliques you gotta set of your metamask. And and if you had it off and then when you show somebody you flip $10,000 to $20,000 a day they going to get the metamask. They they don't do like I guarantee that's what's going to happen. Like I'm already predicting image think about it like that is what people like I know people that are in crypto right now that have been in crypto with me and that recently just got a metamask. Well mask just started using what in the world. Yeah, that's what I was about to say. They they watch it you watch em. We said they try to we said they are we sitting there getting Revelations about what's going on and and they're like, hold on a minute know y'all put too much too much. Holy cow weigh. They notice a don't know if you've seen that Meme dump it bro. Hey Ash black people know. Oh na lie na sell it telling we can't let the black people win. But you know, it's a trip know but I think about that because in the reason why I was making that contrast is because the co co and Jamie dimon report cited. They been having private meetings before the public even knew about it. And this is also just so happened to be the same, that on that page. It had all that cocaine, of course, you know it and then they were also a part of that a part of the banks that were that were noted in that money laundering thing. Oh, yeah comes And you know what happened to them not and that's what and I said that cuz it's part of business. Yep part of their they are like drug awards are laundering money and they not come at like, you know, all these like these Investment Bank. Oh, yeah workout Wells Fargo. I'm an investment. How do you own a Porsche off? What kind of investment banking do you do every time I see that I'm like, oh you just you just bought a house in the islands. Oh, yeah, you you running that you running that money for Wells Fargo you run it off. That's what it is. And then they're not told to look the Blind Eye but to them it's just someone's account. And this is how it's just done. Yeah. That's what's happening Brew Pub. And the thing that true I'm with you ended and I and in the add on to that. This is why right now, I definitely commend what basis was doing now granted. I'm not a coinbase fan don't use coinbase and all of that but I understand the game going base is going to be one of the major place. Is going forward in this old space coin Bank new Bank of America. But yeah, exactly. Now if now with our real talk what some of the some of these other people in a major exchanges what it should be doing if they should be having a lobbying group of their home and watch them right now. They gotta be there. They've I hope so Thursday. Oh, no, they're they're already there. You have to think about recently cracking just got a banking Charter their Bank not make now you you you think this happened they had to agree some Pockets. God had to grease some Pockets get some lobbyists to go through make pushing things through but do we vote on these things like voted on that cracking could be a bang bang like this must be all different department my fault my fault this this must be a whole different thing. What what happened with these backdoor meetings. Oh non-disclosure agreements job. But technically it was insider trading non-disclosure agreements. This is legal over here. And I don't now being in crypto. It shows you the truth of everything else and it's frightening to see because when you get into Bitcoin, you understand what money is and then once you understand what money is then you understand what banking is off and then you start seeing the people. Look what this is doing. Look what that is doing. Look what this company is doing is like well, no one asked me that they could do this known. No, I never knew nothing about this. That's what's going on in right now, and and I love seeing it because when you're in crypto the you you're you're open to everything you see everything else and it's beautiful. It definitely is and I'm definitely going to be on the side of it. I enjoy what you do man, you know, I mean, I do enjoy the channel and I like what all of us are doing out here with the brothers and crypto is as I like to call us home. You know between you crypto blood Bitcoins a the gentleman at crypto them cats Bitcoin vegan food do talk to him in a real people doing real things and I just don't want it to be a space where a lot of us fall short and come late to the party and that's going to happen that way. Yeah. Yeah. That's the thing about this. Look how easy it was for you to find me. We talked about. Set up the same names. I know yeah. Yeah, it's just it's going to unfortunately, I can't just be a black guy in crypto. I have to be a symbol. I have to I have to show people like this is how it's done because it's just like I now I've realized I'm going to have a responsibility to share this with my people like cuz I don't see no other black people like that. It's just only a handful of just like every other industry. There's only a handful of black people and so I'm like, you know, what now? I'm trying to get my foot in I'm from in here. I'm going to get dirty. I'm gonna lose some money up for the make some money. But all these experiences check down the list shut down a little check. Look how long I've been here. Look how long I've been doing this. Look how money off look how much money I've lost and I was like, you know what we don't keep going we going to keep going and we don't keep going and I remember I remember last year off. Last year, I was looking at it. I was looking at like, you know, the numbers and the balances and I was telling myself man. I'll never get the one Bitcoin. I'll never make back what I mean looking back this year. I'm like, wow. Well, I had a I've never expected this kind of return like never broke and it just made me like, yeah, but you've been you've been you've been taking slow for too long and it's time to take his time to kick it up a notch, but you know a little bit of money makes you a little bit more confident in what you're talking about maybe a bang but go ahead and page. I mean, I'm in total agreement with everything that you're talking about because you're right. You're right, but let me kind of let me go through a couple other things here with something else. She said I thought you said I was a lot of cool things in the midst of your videos and I'm a I'm a put a pause in front of this up front before I even asked this question, but I'm quoting you here dead. Oh, hey, how do you make crypto sexy as fuck? Now but how do you how do you make crypto sexiest but it was it was the girls favorite man? Cuz when you said I was like, you know what this dude is off and you still out here still out here dude, but you have to understand especially for our culture our culture. We're we're we're soul pop culture where it's all about. Anything that we do is hot. You know what I'm saying? We're plastered on the Billboards, you know, we come up with the trends. How do we make big joining? Cryptocurrency a trend a sexy thing? How do we make this sexy to black people? Like who and I got only some of this crypto like we we got all these rap you got all these dudes talk about how much Brad I got. I'm Flexin. I'm buying this. I'm buying that I'm I'm this I'm debt. How do we get them to say? Yeah, man looking for all this crap. I got not only you to swap. How do we do that? How do we flip the narrative? Cuz I know for a fact they I know for a fact we got a lot of I would say influential people in the in the black space that are here. They're in the crypto space but like like Jay-Z and them like speaking of 50/50. What was what album was that heels heels? You could buy a whole album with Bitcoin at one time. Yeah. That was the Chicago God man. I just did a I just did some on that doggone thing Grace's I can't think of it right now, but he sold the album. He was taking Bitcoin for the album and then the Bitcoin that he had wage and there we go. Again, then the Bitcoin that he had then is equal like five million dollars now something like that, you know, and I'm sitting there like sneak talk about that. How long how long he's been in the game? You know what I'm saying? Like all these dudes are in the game, but they hush-hush about it. They'll talk about it once but they hush they cool that whatever they whatever and you know, and that's that's the thing too. And that's that's one of our problems, you know, cuz I was being too hush-hush about stuff that we really can be to speak to each other get each other game on and I was talking to a brother-in-law educator brother with a college degree, right? He went the Highlight some of his other partners who were educated with degrees in big companies. And without nice, nice cuz then the one talking about so one guy who already has a degree and has been working in this field for up to umpteen years. How is that another guy? Because he's in a high position that said company just say hey, I want to come over there and work for y'all doing what I do. Why these people can't have a conversation he reaches out to one and they suddenly don't respond to the phone call. And I mean, you know what I'm saying, and it's like I'm currently doing this over here for a well-known company that if I named you with all know you're working for another company wage. I'm trying to do the same thing. Just you know, I ain't trying to get you to bring me in just you know, bring my residents. Yeah, you know how this works. It's about who you know, I'm not about what you know, and you have to know, you know, you got the resume you look good, whatever but it's all about the networking that you've done. It's exactly and granted and often this happens in other companies all the time, even the country on that, you know family higher family friends like this. So when you see another black person say, hey man, I'm trying to come in over to y'all saw look like y'all paying I'm trying I'm not trying to take your old job. I got a whole department I can get to why why can't we do it? Why do we feel like we we shouldn't help each other that way cuz that's what every other culture does true dead. Sherlock and so yeah, so I don't understand why why the situation I don't understand why we we don't want to pick each other up. It's almost like crab mentality. You see somebody increasing you're in Chrome. And so what you do is you grab onto him, but you don't realize you're pulling him down. You're not pulling him up, you know helping him up and I just don't understand why as us as a community we do that to each other and you you know, you see your friend out there you trying to reach out to you to help and you won't help them but you already in a position to help them. That's that's that's stuff like that. Almost home. I try to put out as much good content as I can. So make sure that you know, you can absorb it the way you can and if you if you make money off of it that's amazing if you don't do some more research, but at least I'm trying to help you know, I'm making some money in the back and you know, this is like this whole YouTube thing. It's a business. Let's just be real. Oh, yeah, but dead. All right, you know I'm going to change it already feel like I'm about to run out a whole tangent, but I don't understand why our cultures like that at all. It doesn't make sense now absolutely and and thoughts and in the midst of all of that we're running up on the highway here and I definitely appreciate all your time and and I'm a definitely I got up all you could ask anything up to eight thirty years was up issue cuz I'm sitting here thinking about it and and just kind of going over everything is really interesting. I have like 15 questions over here, you know, we didn't talk about everything off but no just just all right, so we can I want to talk to you about something then. Oh, yeah, go ahead. Yeah. So Serena really pursuing their arrest Serena Williams name her Investment Company her her Venture Capital fund was invested in coinbase. And yeah, her her Venture Capital funding was invested in coinbase and recently she just bought Cuz you know when you when you have those funds they have to openly report when they invest in what not. They recently just reported that they're no longer invested in coinbase. How do you feel about that? And what what makes you think that it had why she did that? Well, I guess not if okay. Well I'm going to do the politically correctness and then I'll go down to conspiracy route. Okay? Okay, the politically correct thing that I would say is is perhaps you know, she's managing her risk and she you know, and there was some fiduciary reason why she wanted to get out of that particular position. Okay. Now the the now the conspiracy side of me would say, you know, I'm not really a big fan of coinbase. You know, I personally think that they're that the government that they're in the government's pocket. Of course, they have to be in you know, I mean, so I definitely think that there's a lot going on there that us regular people might not find out about until after something actually happens and people that are that have big amounts of money and then she Is married to listed God Reddit? Yes, you know. Yeah, so she's married to somebody who I'm sure know some people that know some people to know some people off the conspiracy side of me says her husband wanted her husband's friends kept him to some game and and he went to his wife as we do for the women. We love and say no baby. You know that that coinbase thing. You know. Scratch that yeah. Yeah, that's that's my plan. And obviously once again conspiracy side of it, nobody can prove that another like that, but honestly, that's kind of my thought man because wage and the only reason I tell people to use coinbase is is just as an off-ramp in That's it. That's if you want to go in and out once you realize you can get in and you don't have to leave that's when things get crazy when you start realizing. Oh, there's these these stablecoins. So they just act like real US Dollars. They're just not and I can still use them on the internet, but I just can't use them in real life yet because we just wrong as China just did their whole their their digital currency test and all these cdc's like I personally believe USBC is the fedcoin. It's already here. They're going to reveal it and they're going to be like no this is the US digital dollar. It's already here, but I really believe we going to happen, but go to answer my question and I'm a political and and the conspiracy. Yeah political. I think the whole defy movement is really open Thurs. Bulls eyes to what a centralized exchange what what value can really come out of that cuz once people realize cuz just like how we just said, you know swaps doing more value than in coinbase. If coinbase is supposed to be this new D Central like, you know, it's not supposed to be centralized the banking system, but it's supposed to bring cryptocurrency in this new aspect to the banking system. Don't you think the decentralized exchanges are going to disrupt their whole process immediately already there that like to combine md5 supposed to be like this whole new thing and the next month's financial future. Don't you think the very first thing it's going to destroy are the on ramps that mimic the old Financial system. So that's that's my you know, how long will answer that their team is getting wise and they're realizing they don't need the coin. They need to they need to fundraise and and and you know swap they need a piece of humor swap. They need a piece of birth. You don't need a piece of coinbase. They need a pizza that that's where the political answering. My conspiracy answer now is everything that went down with coinbase about a week and a half ago black two weeks ago where they came out with a statement saying oh playing bass is a place for people to work building the money of the future, but we don't want to get caught up in the politics of everything that's happening right now. And you know, they brought up the whole George Floyd and this this and that and you know, like we are not going to take a stance on these things. And if anybody who wants to you know, who doesn't agree we we definitely can get you in a place where you can sit feel right or in a sense cause we're going to let you go and find you go work for somebody else. If you don't mess with our stance of not getting into this and everyone just looked at them what you're supposed to be dead. Here's your mission statement is to build this new Financial system for everyone and yet you guys are saying, oh, we're not going to take a stance for what all this stuff that's going on with this, you know, the money of this doesn't mix with politics, right but you but wait you have to get through the politics to get all the stuff that you get done. Your your faith former. CFO is now in politics all you how do you think all the licenses you get? It's all politics but the moment when it's time to stand up for people or certain class of people. Well, we don't want to get into the politics. I think that is my conspiracy like, oh that's how this company feels and I think see her. She knows like she got money. I don't need your money if that's how you feel. That's that's the kind of money. She got. Oh, that's how your business operates. We don't need that kind of money. Trust me. We're good. We're going to put this to somewhere else. That's my conspiracy version. Well, you know, I'm definitely down. I hope that that's the right one. But no, but I really because credit I don't know if you've realized the app, but the credit app it's supposed to be like this red light kind of orange looking thing and the Reddit app. It's it's gone black ever since this all started. It's just been like they've changed. Yeah, it's been black this whole time, you know, I noticed that but I never put two and two together, you know, right? Yeah, Why would it be black like like think about it that color is a specific like that like and it's always been that the moment all this started black and I'm like see I'm not even an interracial couples no mold. Go ahead. Cuz now you gotta you got this white man. I mean granted we don't need it. We don't you know what I'm saying? We don't need the white man to defend this but now we got. Swagman schools like nah. Nah, I got black children. What you talking about? Cuz now they're looking at it like no no no, no. No, they take basic light skin boys. They take this they take off their lives. As long as there is a black light skinned black dark skinned, black Hispanic black doesn't matter. They see them all the same way. Now, you're like, oh my God, like children. I got this whole app na Pura we making a stance we're making a stance. And so that's what that's what I like. So that's why I'd be like aren't even matter the interracial couples and put black queens go get you one cuz black men been doing it forever. This is true. This may be doing it for us a black queens. We'll get you can go get you a white man. Follow mean. Yeah. Yeah, this is true. I mean and because at the end of the day, is that the race thing the more I think about it, I think it matters because we have to deal with it. But I really just don't feel like it's the ultimate issue that we're the biggest issue that we should be dealing with the money the absolute the money. So always it's always been the money absolute man, you know, and and when I think about this coinbase thing and and just walk in general if you look at it, I believe and and just kind of looking at what the micro strategy guide there. Do. You know, how did you see the interview where he said he was trading and he had so many people trading in the market side by side with us normal people so tonight. Push the price up and bought almost half a billion dollars almost half a million dollars almost in Bitcoin. Now when I heard that that's a blessing that wait a minute. He was in the market for god-knows-how-long and then after he got it all day and he said, oh I got it. I'm thinking how many other CEOs wage. Doing that, you know what I'm saying? He just he just I think he he paid he showed people how it can be done. Right? This is how and now because here's the thing off a, a big company like that. They don't have to go to know exchange and what they don't have to do that they can go to over-the-counter. Not on the books completely in the back. That's why they can get it from and they can get it for their for cheaper and whatnot. He couldn't easily did that but he didn't there's a reason either that well is drying up and he just doesn't got the pool to do it no more cuz it's like nah, bro, how much you trying to get we can't find nobody that can give you to home right now not right now. That's what I'm like, oh cuz usually companies like that then and you know, he said, oh I didn't want to incur the slippage so I had so many people do it for you. This is the only plan you could come up with because you couldn't get it off of OTC. That's what I think actually happened. And that's where it's like, that's why people are saying we're at the bottom guys. Cuz if they have for years to do that, then that means more company is going to have to be forced to do that cuz a billion dollars and Big Horn, you know, what that would do to the price jump. Yep and hit yeah, and here's the thing that I that I want to tell you about that too. I'm with you cuz the two there's two words Supply shocks. Yep, supply-side. I don't think so. I just kicked happening bro. I was over here man. Just happened to the price. I keep forgetting how long Small the space really is cuz it's like everyone's like oh they have I been listening. I've been talking about The Happening since I got into the space. I'm like, oh this is the happening when it happened and that's a long way from now twenty-twenty. That's like two years. I gotta wait two years for the habit of mine to talk about now then but then people like, oh no people are going to run by a year and they're not going to do that record of having a price Skyrocket though, they weren't playing but then it drops and it drops and then drops there right before they finally we get that that that firmed up to almost three K and it's like man, it's having any fun to do nothing and the next thing you know, boom Supply shock. Yeah. I'm like, oh, oh, they weren't playing I bet bet say less cuz that was my first happening the recently. I'm sure it was your man through. Yep as like, oh I bet say less. Can't wait for the next song. Cuz now cuz we have our own economic system Bitcoin this does what it's supposed to do with that's it. Look every four years or really every certain amount of blocks, which is usually every four years. Just you try to keep a technical. Look. This is how it happens. The inflation schedule gets cut in half this this and that and that's only going to be so much left. So enjoy life and sometimes I be some people can drink. Oh so as to having like a stock split know it's the exact opposite of what a stock split is, it gets even harder off. So Earnest getting all bro, all we could go on for days. Yep. Yep. And here's what I think man. And and I guess we'll end it on this one what this is going to do Thursday. We going to have another supply shop that us regular retail investors. Ain't aren't when we realize it. It's going to be articles coming out exchanges are going to be running short poem. Are you really? Oh, no, you haven't seen the art. You haven't seen them that I love glass knowing analytics. Yeah, but like people are taking their coins off of coinbase. Like people are taking Bitcoin like the amount of Bitcoin on exchanges is sharply going down like that's maybe another reason cuz even her series investors are probably seeing the same thing own people aren't keeping the coins on these things. No more granted. There's going to be the news that are going to do that button for us who've been here for a while. We we know what Defy is we know we know all I got to do is have something on my wallet and I can interact with decentralized find that he'll I can interact with decentralized Finance. What Bitcoin I can put Bitcoin on a c ROM. Yeah. Yeah. So Supply shock. Yeah. I'm ready for it. I mean, I ain't going nowhere. Oh, yes Lord. I Thank you. I think God first call to 20 21 Club. I'll be really great man. I think you're going to start. I mean everybody's talking about Q4. I honestly think we're going to just be in a lot of consolidation from there to the end of the year. I mean, yeah, we're going to get some pumps and all of that down there, but I don't think it's going to really kill it. J We're next year. It's I think it's really when it's going to start to go down, right? Yeah, I believe that too. Just because and I think maybe maybe like December that's when things are really going to start kicking up again, but the only thing I'm worried about with the first quarter is first quarter got some people are usually liquidating cuz they gotta pay taxes. Yeah, that's true. They got so like right after taxes right after taxes off Dawn's time time time to get greedy again. That's was a belligerent man. I appreciate you taking the time out to holler at me today and it's been wonderful. I'm going to cut up and do some clips and have some clips come out on the channel throughout the week and the whole episode of beyond the podcast this this Saturday off. So I greatly appreciate a man. I love to be the company will chat with you again sometime. I wanted to try to do this live on the channel, but man my Wi-Fi and it's okay. Hey look, yo, you saw me with the camera to be getting them like. What's going on? Why you not working? Like right before I go a lot, right? I figure out whatever that thing was like, I don't need people. Russian letters like nah, bro. I gotta fix that right before I start. I know that's right. But but before we go into the office is anything you got going on you want to plug or whether you got any courses that you do or consultations? Oh, yeah, so I don't do courses. I don't do consultations just mainly because you know so many other people do that and it's great. They can do that. But me I just try to focus on making content and doing that because I've seen other people they once you start getting into golf courses and what not a lot of the cryptocurrency space they stay they get really ugly towards you for that even though that's just a generic and I'm like, I don't need that. I I just I don't need to pay me for this free info cuz everything I've learned in crypto was free know I'm saying, so just the only thing I have to plug follow me on Twitter at crypto Kenzie. Follow me on Instagram. Cryptocurrency I'll be dropping I would just be dropping James. I'll be dropping knowledge. And of course followed a YouTube channel crypto culture. That's where I make all my long videos all my things and on my live streams that should be on right after this. So you're probably by the time you guys here is I would have already recorded it and you guys would have been on it. So go ahead that's was a appreciate your crypto Kenzie crypto culture. I took it in my notes the crypto accountant. Let's go taking tax. That's right. See what yeah. I appreciate your man. I'm going and end up something off and start recording on the stream, and I would definitely catch over there would be to catch up and I and speak again on some other things. Thank you much, man. All right, but you have a great day. Thank you. Well.
20210217 Nicole Sandler Show - Radio's Day of Reckoning and Other Issues
"The following program contains graphic material including offensive language. Viewer this question except vice. Jeez got the news. She talks with newsmakers encourages us to laugh and she cries with us speaking truth to power and questioning authority daily. It's the nicole sandler show all right and it's a welcome to it. It's not just any wednesday. It's the seventeenth of february and we got a bunch of stuff to talk about today. The big news. Of course you couldn't have a avoid. Even if he wanted to is rush. Limbaugh is dead now. We knew it was coming because rush. Limbaugh was diagnosed a year or more ago with advanced lung cancer. I do have sympathy for anybody with lung cancer. Because i am a lung cancer survivor. Excuse me if she says she coughs up a lung. My name is nicole sandler. And i'm a lung cancer survivor. In fact this august thirtieth will be five years. Since i was under the knife i had surgery. They removed the lower lobe of my left lung. Because there was a tumor there and they did what's called a wedge re section of the upper lobe of my left lung because there was another stepper and distinct tumor there. yes. I had to count him. Two separate instances of lung cancer in my left long. So i'm now down to about a lung and a quarter or something like that and you know thankfully we caught it early. It's a long story. i've been through it before. I'm sure all go through it again. But it's not important to the subject today. So when i heard he was diagnosed with lung cancer. Honestly my first thought was couldn't happen to a nicer guy because rush limbaugh was anything but a nice guy so we are going to get into rush limbaugh a little later on. And here's the thing you know. I'm a radio. Lifer i have although these days. Obviously i'm here on the interwebs with you. I started in radio in college at the university of south florida in nineteen seventy eight at w. Usf the radio station from the university of south florida. So i again. We will visit this topic a little later on this this hour. I promise you have got a lot to say about rush limbaugh about radio about my total disgust and and just a feeling when his name is brought up and honestly it doesn't have anything to do with politics and i'll prove it to you but in a little while you can have to stick around for that. First though. joe biden did a A town hall last night his first trip as the president his first town hall. It was on cnn. And i let me say that. I'm really glad that that he did it. Because we got to hear a president not perfect by any means but then again i don't know of any president who was perfect but the fact that he answered questions in detail sometimes way too much detail as he apologized over and over for because he kept going on and on. Because that's well. That's typical for joe biden. He never knows when to stop but he answered questions. And i believe for the most part he was honest about it but i got myself in a little bit of hot water this morning because you know me. I'm honest. I say what i think. And it's not always what you would expect from a fire breathing liberal and no. I wouldn't use rush limbaugh language to describe me or any other woman so they're not going to go there but i am a liberal liberal progressive. Comey whatever you want. I believe in helping one another. I believe in up for human rights. I believe in taking care of your neighbor and all that stuff but anyway i well let me play for you one question and answer from last night. So here's joe. Biden was in wisconsin. It was in milwaukee and the first question wasn't the question. I'm sorry but this question. Well y- be here. Let me just let me just share it with you. It was about a student loan debt. So here's here's the question in some of the answer can evening. A student loans are crushing. My family friends and fellow americans to come to the american dream is to succeed. But how can we fulfill that dream. When debt is many people's only option for a degree. We need student loan forgiveness beyond the potential. Ten thousand dollars administration has proposed. We need at least a fifty thousand dollar minimum. What will you do to make that happen or not happen. It depends on whether or not make that happen university of public university. It depends on the idea that i say to a community. I'm going to forgive the debt. The billions of dollars debt for people who have gone to harvard and yale and penn and schools. My children i went to a great spot went to a state school but that can be forgiven rather than used money to provide for early education for young children who are disadvantaged circumstances. But here's what i think. I think everyone. I've been proposing this for four years. Everyone should be able to go to community college for free. Okay for free gown. That's cost nine dollars and we should pay for it in the tax policies. We have now. We should be able to pay for you almost avenue money as a break for people racehorses family making under one hundred and twenty five thousand dollars whose kids go to a state university and do that should be free as well and the thing i do in terms of student debt. That's accumulated as provide for changing the existing system now for debt forgiveness if you engage in volunteer activity okay example if you were teaching school after five years you lose you have fifty thousand dollars of your debt forgiven if you worked in a battered women. You worked and so on so you'll be able to forgive debt. Thirdly i going to change the position that we have now to allow for debt forgiveness business so hard to calculate whereby you can now depending on how much you make. And what tro graham you saw. You can work off that debt by the activity you have and you cannot be charged more than x. percent of your take home pay doesn't affect your ability to buy a car home and cetera. Each of my children graduated from a school. I'm mortgage the house. I was listed as the poorest man in congress for not a job for over thirty years. And but i was able to borrow. I bought a home. I spent a lot of time working on. Here's where scylla all right. Thank you joe. Here's where joe biden. You don't start veering off. And he goes and then after a while he says. I'm sorry but it's important. I got to say so anyway. You got the gist of it. He said no. I'm not going to give fifty thousand dollars in a write off student loans across the board. I'm i'm not gonna do that. And but what he sat is i want to make public colleges community college state universities a number of other schools free tuition and i do want to erase ten thousand dollars in debt and then he talked about other ways to work off the debt. Now i still think there's a problem there but this morning on the twitter i saw people tweeting about it including melissa byrne who joins us now. Hey melissa thank you for being here. I am really thought to be here. I'm glad to have year melissa. Burn is democratic strategist. She's an activist and she's also a oh hold on what oh hold on. What did i just do what we lost. Melissa her line went dead. Melissa come back in the in the room. I thought i did something. But i didn't know so while melissa burn hopefully reconnects with us in the zoom. Let me tell you a little bit of the back and forth. We had on twitter this morning. Now i got. I got to go back and find it. Let me bring me up. I hate when things happen like that. I don't know what happened so this morning row. Melissa tweeted something. I'm still just watching for her to return. Of course i didn't pull it out. I'm so silly for not doing this. All right i'm going back way too many hours now the okay. That's the news about rush limbaugh so that came after anyway. What happened is she tweeted. Something about okay. i'm still. I'm still scrolling back checking zoom to see if she's back outright she okay here it is all right so i said and it's not going back far enough man something about wiping out student debt and i said wiping out the debt of millions. Who overextended isn't the answer. I do fully support changing those loans. Two zero interest but not wiping out their entire debt. In fact i want to go back to the beginning to this whole conversation so you can hear it from the start. Because that's not good enough touched and she's still not back. I hope i don't know what happened to her. She just dropped off of of the of the zoom okay. I'm going all the way back. I started tweeting. Early in a lot of people came at me. All right. let's a okay. Somebody said why is biden so hostile towards students in debt. Who was he protecting very wrong. On this issue to which i said i don't think he's hostile at all. Did you listen to his answer. I actually agree with him. Will explain on today's show and then somebody else said. Let's see god. I hate twitter when it does this anyway. Back and forth. And i'm trying to figure out. Let me see if i can't pull up melissa on twitter and find out where she is because she's missing now she's back. Okay let me bring her back into the shot. I hate it when that. It's live radio after all live. Whatever this is that we're doing all right. I think melissa's back with us now. What happened my technology decides to pandemic no worries at all shit happens all right so i was trying to this this whole time. I was trying to go back through twitter to recount our back and forth this morning and the bottom line is you said you were very disappointed in my tweet saying that i really don't i. Don't think that every student loan debt should be completely wiped out. And here's my thinking and then you can tell me why. Think i'm wrong and qualified are said. My kid did not go to college because first of all. She's not a good a good student and hated school so it wasn't something she had a burning desire to do. She didn't know have anything in particular she wanted to study. And i wasn't going to put myself in debt or let her get into lifelong debt to to to go to school when it wasn't something that she was dead set on so many people think as i did when i was a kid that colleges just where you go when you graduate high school that's the continuation and when i was a kid i grew up here in florida and in-state tuition at a state university which i went to university of south florida was about five hundred and eighteen dollars a semester. Now it is for an in state tuition. It's about sixty eight hundred dollars a semester. So big difference there and if you're out of state obviously it's more than that. The cost of higher education is insane. And i don't know that it's worth it. But i would rather see if the government's going to spend fifty thousand dollars a person give it to everybody in the form of healthcare because we really need medicare for all i think healthcare is more life and death then a college education no in an ideal world. If we lived in denmark or finland or germany or so many other countries it would be included in the taxes. We pay but we're not. We're not there and this is not that so melissa burn. Why y were you disappointed in what i said I use this appointed. Because i think what challenge that the president is doing is that when he came up with his land during the summer around student loan debt as he was trying to make the remedy of cancelling debt matched the policy going forward and that by limiting it to public colleges. Okay and what that does is it. Misses out what's happening. In higher education over. The last thirty years is that private schools have actually play a really important role and getting birsh. Ration- college students Low income college students and college students of color in the door to college. Okay so what so. Let me ask you. I'm i'm gonna give you all the time you want to answer. But you're saying that the free college tuition should be extended to private schools as well. I'm remedy people currently have okay all right the reason he's talking about. Not cancelling the debt of people with private. You went to private colleges is. They made a mistake of wanting to have it match the free college going forward and you don't need to have the same parallels because what what's happened the last thirty years because thanks to the republicans there's been a big defending a public higher education And so at higher education and being to funded Low income students actually were able to sometimes graduate with less debt by going to a private college. Okay private college would drop the drop the sticker price down. Oh sort of like on a curve. They would price it on a on a curve. The idea that you would penalize somebody for making a responsible financial decision. When they would've went to the university of virginia they might have had more debt than if they went to the Went to william and mary where they got a bit of a discount because they were first generation because of their family income and so. I think it's really important that we don't box are south into sobbing. One problem by boxing us into the how we're going to solve the problem going forward and so if we're able to make college public colleges and universities free than what we can do is if students still Some first generation students and lower income students matched with a private college. And that's where they will excel the best then going forward. The the loans that you would use for those schools could then be given zero interest point interest rate. Okay what writing go. I'm sorry need to do is like white it's Wipe the slate claire. Because kids shouldn't be punished for republicans being evil humans. Well now we're situation where students have been punished. People in their sixties and seventies debt people in their fifties and we have the ability right now through executive action to just wipe the slate clean. It doesn't cost any money. Okay now well. It does cost money because somebody's got to pay back. It's already been appropriate. It's there's no additional cost. Okay so now. He said that he doesn't at the end of that long question. I didn't play the whole thing because it was long. He said that he can't do that. Fifty thousand through executive order. He can do. Ten is is the what i got from him. He doesn't nikki has the authority he's still saying in jen. Psaki clarified his today at the press briefing that he still wants congress to act but when when it hits the fan in september when the current pause expires he. I mean. Many lawyers have looked at it. Appellate lawyers of look at it. he does have Such authority to eliminate the debt of They're only these are the drug federal lunch. There's like many long products so the ones that are eligible via higher at author at higher ed. Act for him to be able to do this. Compromise in settlement are the direct federal loans. The ones that are directly originated from the government. That's thirty people with just one signature on a piece of paper. He can help. Thirty three million people be able to be in a position to buy a home to get married to start a business just to be able to save for retirement to have dignity. Then we need congress to deal with the f. f. f. loans and the the private loans okay but let me. Let me play devil's advocate for a second here. All right i am somebody. My college debt is paid off number one old so that when is i mentioned earlier when i went to college in nineteen seventy eight through eighty one. My tuition was under a thousand dollars for an in-state state university. The university of south florida. Which right now. Even florida residents can't get into and it's exorbitantly expensive. There's a problem there a big problem. There thankfully i had parents who put me through school again. It wasn't that expensive so i don't have student debt. I'm one of the lucky ones. I'm really lucky again. My daughter is now twenty. One almost twenty two. She didn't go to college. Because of all the things that you're talking about i couldn't afford to put her through college and i certainly wasn't gonna make her go into debt for an education that she wasn't sure she wanted in the first place so it sort of made the decision easier for us. Although i still think this is so wrong. But so they wipe out the debt of millions of people. Good for them. I'm not saying well. What about me as so many republicans do but what about my kid. What about what about. How about something in the middle. How about changing it so that the interest rates are not usury fees so that they're reasonable so that actually there should be no interest on these college loans if you have to pay for college. Education art problem is the last decade when obama switch to the mostly. Rdr plan and come to find payment. People started paying ten percent of their income for twenty years. But the interest rates seems people's balances of actually gone up to growing equal but have been paying on their loans for ten years that started with fifty grand balance. Now have seventy grand down right and they've been paying all these years. So here's my my issue with this you wipe out all the debt if you don't fix the problem in at the beginning it's just gonna keep going. It's money that you're throwing away without what's great about it is bad and there's going to be so much attention to it. It's going to be like an earthquake will be so much coverage and they'll be so much people talking about it and such an art war that that'll give us the political leverage. That's like saying you know. Hey if they stormed the capitol people will realize that these donald trump is fucking insane. I'm sorry if you don't have if you don't if you don't go into it say if you don't buy this about preventing bounces if you don't go into it saying we're gonna fix the problem at the root cause then you're just putting a band aid on a hemorrhage what you're saying broken soccer and get up their lives in the process. No i'm saying i we. We have an ability through executive action to do this. We have the ability to fix the problem and to fix people that are currently suffering and solve that problem and in the meantime we can be work as we do that. We can fix it so then we get free college going forwards or are you saying that people should suffer because other kids can't get free college or should you say we can solve this problem. We can help thirty. Three million people live in dignity. We can take senior to prevent seniors from having security benefits garnished. We can take people that should be saving for retirement. Because they're fifty and sixty five plus loans for their kids and have them have dignity and hob justice. And we can do that ethics. They're still gonna make these same loans to kids who graduate high school today and go to college tomorrow. Yes that's what. I'm saying because unless you fix it at the root cause can i finish unless you fix it at the root cause this is just gonna keep going on and meanwhile you've wiped out the debt of a lot of people and guess what my house is in foreclosure who's gonna come and help me. So what we all. I actually my body on the line on foreclosure and got dragged headfirst by federal marshals down stopping foreclosure for somebody actually people who like me so And if your house is in foreclosure there's actually work that we can do with banks and we're hoping i'm hoping that we can actually get banks to do so. I'm just saying like everybody. We've all got our shit. Our what i said earlier. I really believe it during this pandemic. what we need is a giant global reset button. Wipe out everybody's de debt jubilee. Let's start from scratch monopoly money anyway so wipe it all out and let's all start from square one and see where we go. Which is what we need to do. So by doesn't forty it to wipe out your mortgage but he has a sorority to wipe out federal seal known that and that's like one thing that we can do like the starfish. Now that i'm thinking about you have all these starfish and you have time for one back end in some they. Well what about everybody else. What matters to that one and sometimes it starts one. You can solve this one problem today and then we fix the other problems As you don't say like you don't throw up your hands and say like well. I can't do everything don't have to be like. For example in two thousand and nine you know with the aca was ideal now far from it but it saved my life right. But here's the thing they should say. Well we're gonna get medicare fraud mission and have gotten aca. No and. i'm saying that if you can't help what you're doing now i'm not the that is the same as saying no to the aca. No i disagree with you on that one. I'm saying you need to come up with a solution so that these fees so that people are not put into a lifelong debt of servitude immediately. What you can do the same time. As cancelling the debt he can permanently make the future interest rate zero. So you can cancel this debt. Get this cohort of people. Having dignity and debt going forward can be zero. Okay so then. It's who you said. It's not going to cost anybody anything. That's like the homeowners thing they said it's it's free money for something. They wanted to appropriate in and spent. It's already been appropriated and spent so all those millions and millions of dollars of outstanding loans. That people have that those deaths have already been settled. Know what. I'm saying that the money that congress had already appropriated ads. Just they're just waiting for that money to be really wear that because i. I don't see that that's already. It was appropriated when it was it was went out and dispersed so schools for payment. Like over the last you know and so somebody who just graduated last year. That's too soon. Somebody graduated ten years ago from penn state who now sees. They can't get a decent job. They can't make the loan payments and their payment has ballooned because of that. They can't afford it. You're saying their debt has already been paid. No i'm saying that the money in the government's fence in terms of when the loan was originated. That money was already appropriated and sent out this out all collections and the government making a profit data. Okay well the government should give up their prophet right now because the government is not a business government and they don't need to make a profit. They need to revamp the entire student. Loan program once they do that and then wipe out the student debt. So you can just use start by the executive with executive action eliminating the data. Everybody currently has a direct loans circa pen drop interest rates down to zero for future lending and get congress to pass the bill for college. Have you met congress. I have have you seen our congress so you really think that that's going to happen. You get that done you get you either. Get the filibuster killed or find me sixty votes and then i'm then i'm right. I'm right there with you. You can talk the free college on reconciliation because it affects the budget. Okay all right well. Most of the burn. You made your case. I i still disagree with you. It's something i would like to see. And when i win a buy you a drink to celebrate. Sounds great and hopefully you know cove it'll be gone by then and we don't need to wear masks but the the the the question though is and you say tuition free for all school so if i want to go to yale i have no tuition. It's tuition-free public okay. Following student got it. Well now i just threw that out there. I'm saying public craps or private public. What about private private would be. You know you. You can still use your pell grants private schools. You can use your ideally zero interest rate federal loans for private schools. Okay slow and can end should be able to go to the school. It's best for them. We shouldn't tell poor kids. They had less options. Well sure but if you're providing them here's where you can go or you can take out a loan and have confidence in yourself that you'll be able to pay it back one day. That's how it's always been well how it's always been terrible. Well the because of the way that they bilk you on the other end but if you take out a loan i've taken out many loans in my life that for the most part i've paid back over time except where i lost my home. Go figure so it's just there. There is some personal responsibility. here isn't there are. We should move to germany. That sounds like rush. Limbaugh no does not sound like rush. Limbaugh and i really resent that. There's little responsibility as a rush. I'll fuck you all right. Thank you for call. Thank you for joining in. But you know what that's the problem. That was unnecessary because rush. Limbaugh is a piece of fucking shit and for you to dare compare what i said to rush. Limbaugh thank you thank you. Melissa was nice talking to you. I'm done i'm done. That's bullshit. I tried to have a nice conversation with somebody with whom i disagree on an important issue. We can do that without being assholes. She couldn't wow. Wow so she calls me rush limbaugh she says because i talk about personal responsibility what do you think. Nobody has personal responsibility. I'm sorry somebody in the chat room said what new coal not agree with bernie. I usually do agree with bernie. But do i think they should wipe out everybody student debt and get nothing in return. No work for a few years in a in a work programme. If you're a doctor you have medical school bills to pay off. Then then yeah work for in a ten year program and pay back. And then you're free to make zillions of dollars as a doctor. I'm sorry this is how it works in this country. If you don't like it. Move to denmark or finland or germany or any one of a number of other countries where you pay a higher tax rate and you get your your college included. I would do that if it were up to me. If i was young again. And i could i would. Who's telling me i suck. Who's who's telling me. I suck joshua joshua fuck you too all right. This is not the way expected this to go. But hi. who's this nicole. Johnson colorado springs. Hey justin i just wanted to kind of i guess kind of china and maybe in my perspective in you know guess i i do disagree with you too about the the student loan Right now i'm sitting on one hundred seventy nine thousand dollars in student loan debt. What was your original. What was your original loan for. I'm sorry do you mean amount of your original loan was it like eighty thousand and now it's one hundred and something. That's the principal okay. That's the principal hundred. And what seventy one hundred seventy thousand. Okay that's a lot of money. What what is your degree in. I live three. I i have masters had just finished in two thousand nineteen i are and then i've got to undergrads which finished in two thousand twelve okay I actually graduated high school in two thousand one. And i didn't go to college right away because my parents were kind of in that that really weird bubble at a time where we were. We were making too much money to Basically get wounds and pell grants but they were not making enough money to basically cover my expenses because you know college is expensive. And they're raising four kids ray I you know. I i i think what it comes down to is. Is that you know. I went to school because i spent a lot of time. In the workforce and basically all the jobs that were available in colorado were entry level customer service jobs and it was pretty clear that it was not going to go to college and gets three degrees. And now you're you're one hundred seventy nine thousand dollars in debt. That's the principal. That's not after the bullshit fees that they tacked on because you can't make the payment and you're saying you want me to pay for that would again. I think she was correcting that point that that money was paid at that point appropriately by who governed by the gut know. That's our money. That's taxpayer dollars. And they didn't pay off your college debt you. That's your the tuition that you agree to pay when you signed on to get these three degrees. I don't have three degrees but at the same time nicole. The most money i've ever made in a years. Thirty three thousand dollars. Sorry maybe you studied the wrong subject that but see. That's not a it. It's you know have friends who are engineers have just as much debt we need engineers and they don't. They don't work in the fields. The wages haven't gone up to cover that and the fact of the matter is is is that there's a ton of us in my generation that are just buried under this day. I know it's real. It really sucks and you know what my generation let you down. I didn't have anything to do with it. Because i was playing music on the radio. The here's the problem. This is a problem at the root. The the are as i mentioned since one thousand nine hundred seventy nine. When i started college. Tuition rates have increased more than tenfold for an in-state tuition out of state. It's even worse than that. We need to fix that problem before. We talk about ripping out individual debt. I'm sorry you're suffering. It shouldn't be this way. None of us should be suffering but most of us are. Let's talk about taxing the billionaires who get away without paying any taxes. Let's talk about taxing. The people who trump cut those rates for for so many of them but now they're worried about maybe somebody who's a little over the seventy five thousand dollars that they think is acceptable to get fourteen hundred dollars from the government. This is the kind of shit we're talking about. And you think the government should just pay off your hundred seventy nine thousand college debt. I wish i would love to be able to be what. But here's the other thing that you what you're talking about a generation worth of changes to a higher education as a tuition on top of the fact that right now we've wages are so depressed so low that there's really no way for people to be able to make enough money to continue to pay these loans you. I can tell you that jobs. That i'm applying to now for masters pay forty thousand dollars a year in colorado cost of living as a two thousand eighteen was like twenty four dollars an hour. I hear you. We need to do something for paid out but then at the same time figure out four or five hundred dollars a month because income repay jason. Did you really need three degrees. Did you need one hundred seventy nine thousand dollars worth of schooling to get where you are now because the first two jobs the first two degrees didn't help me gain anything. Wow bannon so. I was kind of the same logic you go. You go back to school to see if the masters will help you push real. Well that's a scam. That sounds like trump university. This is a scam being pushed on the american people. And like i said to my kid. You know what you don't have to go to college a because you'd be in better shape now if you hadn't we need to fix this system from the ground floor and we're not we're talking about wiping out everyone's dead. I'm sorry there's no such thing as free money until we start taxing people for what they actually. Oh and not expecting. The you know the working schmaltz like me and you to pay the bills when the billionaires get away with paying no taxes until they fix that and we have equity in this country we have equal equal pain for. And that's the wrong way to put it until the people who have are hoarding. All the money start turning loose with some of it. It comes out of our pockets. The other working schmucks out here. So that's the problem. I have with it. I want medicare for all. guess what. I'm still struggling to pay for health insurance every month. You know we all have our shitsu cole. I'm a type two diabetic you know. That's that's the you know. I i understand that that will very much i. Maybe the thing i can we with here is that you know you say this is almost like monopoly money for getting rid of that money. I think would just allow us to put more money in your debt from and i've been struggling since the two thousand eight meltdown. When that happened. I lost my job. Thank you clear channel and this goes directly to rush. Limbaugh two thousand eight. I was fired from my job hosting the morning. Show on winz in miami which was at the time. A progressive talk station owned by clear channel but they had just negotiated a new four hundred million dollar contract with rush limbaugh and they needed to be able to pay his exorbitant obscene salary so they cut hundreds of jobs across the company. I was one of them. They decided at that time. They were going to change the format of miami's progressive. Talk station to be the fourth sports talk station in florida. They fired me in preparation for that. They put they put don imus on the air because they could get his show for free to run that until fox sports contract ran out across town in the could flip the whole station to sports. This is all related. I have been hurting financially since then. I've been unable to dig out of that hole. That's the problem. We all need to be made whole. We all have our own shit. I feel horrible for you. Nobody should be saddled with one hundred. Seventy nine thousand dollars in debt simply because they wanted to get an education and have a good job. Maybe maybe these colleges that take those kinds of tuitions should have a a placement program so that if you graduate with a degree from that hall of higher learning they help you find a job and until you find that job. You're not responsible to pay the tuition. Something's got to change but to just write a check in a race. Everybody's a small portion of the population debt. I don't see how you're ever going to get congress to go along with the. And i don't think joe biden can do it and there's no such thing as free money certainly not the only thing i might bring up in the finally says that i from what i understand. A lot of people are trying to make the argument that the secretary of education can actually make the move to the white out. Wipe out at least all public debt. You know the the pride loans there are obviously a whole nother mess. But yeah okay. Well i wish you the best. And i'm sorry you have to go through that it sucks. It really sucks. And i don't know what the answer is. But if they waved a magic wand for you and the millions of other people who've got hundreds of thousands of dollars of student debt hanging over their head. What do you say to take me out of the question. What do you say to the millions of people who are have their homes in foreclosure. Who through no fault of their own own lost their jobs. Thanks the pandemic and can't pay rent and can't pay mortgage and now it's it's a year later. They're that much in arrears. They've gotten a waiver this far but they're still going to have to pay it all off once things come back. How what are you gonna do those you can tell them. Sorry you're shit outta luck but this person has no more college debt. We have a major problem. It's bigger than just the student. Debt problem tarp program would really help but instead of giving it to the bank actually give it to the people home. Which is what i said years ago but nobody listened to me. We bail out companies a million millionaires and billionaires all the time you know. I don't see why it doesn't count now for anyone else i hear you. I hear you know they built. They do thank you for calling jason. And i'm really sorry. You're going through this and my sympathies with you. I have no ill will towards you. I think nobody should have that kind of student debt. Nobody wipe it all out. Now is the time if there ever was a time to do it. And hey stephanie. Kelton on the show so many times talking about modern monetary theory. They can just print the money. We don't know anything. We don't borrow from china. I guess they say we do but the government has the power to meant the money. So it's there this whole idea of this of these student loans being blowing up like this because people can't afford the payment they had so now they get hit with penalties and more money added onto the principle is criminal criminal other nations. Look at what we do. How this country quote works. And i was gonna say laugh but on think they find anything funny about it all right. I know some of you agree with me and many of you don't and that's okay. We are allowed to disagree and we can do it animatedly. We can do it passionately. What you can't do is what melissa burn did and say because i talked about personal responsibility that i sound like rush limbaugh really now. No you want to hear what rush limbaugh sounds like. And the reason that. I'm so disgusted with rush limbaugh aside from the fact that yes. He did cost me a number of jobs because clear channel now known as i hurt media. Oh i'm sorry. I hate me. No it's i media. Because they had to pay him four hundred million dollars a year and they had to get that by firing working hard. Working people like me. Now i'll tell you my hatred for rush. Limbaugh did not stem from his politics. In fact when i was a wee little radio person. I graduated college university of south florida where i paid five hundred and some odd dollars a semester. Hello and my first job out of college. Well in college. I worked in tampa then. I moved to new york because i wanted to. I was born in new york. I'm like i want to go back to new york. And i got a job at w. Mca big talk station in new york city and back then this was nineteen eighty two. Yeah talk radio was left right. Financial guy radio psychologist and everything in between and guess what. After i worked there weekends for a few weeks i was promoted and i produced the bob grant show. Do you know. Bob grant is bob. Grant was the the the the precursor. I hate to say it but was to rush. Limbaugh i pull up his co. pedia page here says bob grant was an american radio host. A veteran of broadcast in new york city grant is considered a pioneer of the conservative talk radio format and it's one of the early adopters of the quote comeback combat talk format in fact. He was known for when he take a call on someone who disagreed with. He'd go get off my air and he'd hang up on them. Well all of a sudden. Here i am twenty two years old. I'm bob grants producer. Let me play for you. Something i pulled out. See the difference between a bob grant and a rush limbaugh is that bob grant was an asshole on the air but he was a pussy cat in person and a decent human being. I agreed with nothing. You said politically but then this happened. A year on the one year anniversary of me producing his show. Life is full of coincidences by full of all kinds of A little bit of minutiae. I don't know whether this would be in the category of new coincidence or something very profound. I like to think it was something very profound told you that it was september twentieth. Nineteen seventy that. I began saying first words getting myself in all kinds of hot water on wnyc. It was on september twentieth. Nineteen eighty two that this program was guided by producer. And it just so happens. That another coincidence and i and i say this not because she here but because it's true just so happens that the latest one is also the best one a a flaming liberal. Not only about her but to her. Thank you bob. i was much younger. Who came up here from tampa florida And what brought you up here. Why did you come up here because you you felt. This was the mecca the communications industry. So this guy. I won't bore you if you want to hear it. All post the whole thing but he went on to sing my praises a twenty two year. Old woman liberal and he talked about me the best producer he'd ever had and that was our one year anniversary of me working on his show. Cut to rush limbaugh. You wanna hear rush limbaugh this it. This is who rush. limbaugh is key. Defended the traditions of this country. This is a tribute to him on. The system dominion tabulates. There's and that they did. They fed an equal number of votes for both trump and biden out of the machine. It's a lie he's lying to you. Sent lead for biden. Okay what el- sharpton goes out to front. Oh excuse me spoke little negro dialect there. I can do that when i when i want to. The frontal beaten tucker decent nice kid in the white house. No no no no. That's not that. He's looking at a dog chelsea clinton. He's comparing the point. I'm making is fluke. Sandra fluck goes before switch. Lovely essentially says that she must be paid to have sex. What does that maker prostitute. She wants to be paid to have sex. Okay see i can't and you want to say that's the kind of show i'm doing because i- i- facetiously said move to denmark. I wish we were more like denmark. What i'm saying is we need to change this system here. And if you expect. Joe biden to be the person to do it. Well i did away with my laughter on my button. That's hysterical. sorry you shoulda done like. I didn't vote for bernie sanders period. But we have joe biden. You think this is gonna have waging war with me is not going to change that but you call me. You compare what. I do too rush limbaugh if you think that. Please turn off this show and don't come back. I'm going to go to the phones. Hi hello you there. Is this mike. Stark mike stark. Mike start you little worked up today because some somebody you probably know melissa burn i let her run into god so bring her on. I disagree with her about the wiping out all student debt. I think we need to fix the problem at the source before you just wipe out billions of dollars of debt. Because she thinks that it's free money. Sorry free money doesn't exist. And so she said you. And i said you know we all have personal responsibility. And so she told me. I sound like rush. Limbaugh mike stark. I know personally. I know that you back in the day used to call rush limbaugh all the time to fuck with him a do. I sound like rush limbaugh. You've never sounded at all like rush limbaugh. nothing could be further rush limbaugh than you nicole. So mike stark. You're a guy you're the guy who was always up on capitol hill with a camera before youtube before. Video was everywhere. You were there with the camera pudding members of congress on the spot trying to get them to talk to you and you would also call in to radio shows most notably rush limbaugh. In fact you probably called in more than any other caller and knew how to work the screeners. Yeah i don't think anybody had been on his so more than me. I think my voice is probably the one that aside drum any cuts he may have done from the presidents and stuff like that news but my voice is probably broadcast. Live more on his than anyone else on the planet He took more calls for me than anyone else because Because i the code then i figured out to get past the screener and went to call in and You know drove him around the bend. Yes you know. What's funny is the way to get through on some like progressive shows. Not that there are many of them left anymore but say you wanna call thom hartmann. Best way to get put right to. The top of the stack is to disagree with him. Because thom hartmann loves to have a spirited debate with someone but with rush you had to be like stick a fan to get through. Didn't you know. look now. I wouldn't say that at all. In fact a lot of times. I call up the the only thing i ever had to do to continue getting on is to pretend that i've never been on before so i'll call off in his screener both in early dancer and i'd be like oh i'm i'm kinda nervous but i i love to talk to us. I'm liberal though you put liberals on the air and everything and what do you have to say. And then i drawn into whatever it was that i wanted to disagree on and they put me on and then i say what i really wanted to say once i got on i didn't want to come to smart or to Incompetent to speak on the phone wanted to keep that happy medium or Have some kind of dumb liberal he'd be able to trounce or educate And then i'd get on and just turn the tables on them. So do you have a favorite call that you made to rush like where you really got him going on. Something then pulled the rug out from under him. So i think my favorite call was one that i didn't make it all knew this was probably six months into me calling him two or three times a week and he doesn't want you on his show more than once in a year once a year the air so i was calling them two or three times a week which was a and of course. He's getting messages from his producers or from other people. I i don't know he had somebody that could really pick out my voice even when disguised it because i'd eventually get through and he realized that was man you can feel it any end. The conversation very very quickly but one time another guy called and he was obviously reading from a script and he wasn't me and this who were just after russia gone death But he caught the guy reading from the script. And what's your what's your real name. Jack where you really do. You wanna tell. He's pointed to you. Know some kind of inspector exclusive trip Me where where he was pretending to know who i was. But it wasn't me some other guy and this other guys like ross. You've lost your marbles sir. And you know he was so angry. And that's what made me kind of happy. I i knew. I was getting under his skin at that point when he's picking on callers that aren't even me because They disagree with him. That was a good one and you can find out one on youtube. In fact. I just tweeted it out on my account. I'm at at mike underscore stark. It's like the third or fourth one but there's been some other good ones. I asked him about reagan reading giving misty and sending arms to iran. You know with terrorists and then in running from lebanon marine barracks was bombed there. And you know you got the end giving tax raise and cut and running President why is he your hero and he just tend in hard and Smack lips for awhile and really never came up with a good answer and he just really look foolish. So that's another one of my favorite ones. But i've posted a bunch of them on my twitter trophies looking. I'm looking right now. But i wanna see one and see if i can play one okay. Here's one this is Difficult because using feeders. Whenever i got. I know you were unsound. Majority report a lot talking about your calls. You came on my show a few times. But sam had you on all the time and he would break up the calls he would stop it and say okay. Tell me what happened there. So yeah like here's a little perkier career so okay well. We'll just play. Here's a little bit of one if this will work let's see. Uh nana's can play a commercial. I but this one's called liberal caller. Punks rush. Rush limbaugh regarding ronald reagan's conservatism so go to at mike underscore stark on twitter and go through some of the videos or go to youtube and just pull up. Liberal caller pranks rush limbaugh because most of them will be mike stark. Mike gives you so much credit for doing it. I'm do you do this to anybody else or did you only do it to limbaugh. Oh shit i putted you down there. You gave up his radio so because of what. I was doing recruiting people to call in to bill. O'riley so how much we like keith. Over man and we ended up making a trip to a pilgrimage to his house after they enter a mattress. Oh of course i do. That was the she worked on his show and he made a call. And he's like things i wanna do to you with my philophical when he was talking about the loofah. Is that the enter. Chris you're talking about talked about using a dildo on himself. You anyway yes. That's exactly what i'm talking about. So i went to his house for the big sign up across the street from his house. In andhra macro side has your cash and to all his neighbors i Delivered the court documents of andrew. Which all that stuff and. I put in like yellow manila envelopes. And you know. I didn't look too official but i wanted to be a little cheeky about it. So i stamped with an official looking stanford said sexual pervert alert neighborhood neighborhood and delivered them tall neighbors and feinstein andrew bill. Riley can't be trusted with your daughters up and down the street who leading into and out of his neighbor He look he These these liars these rush. Limbaugh abc's bill o'reilly saw on hannidy. They've destroyed this country over the last thirty or forty years and took it upon myself to hold them accountable and they had a lot of fun. Doing and i'm not unhappy. That i get And you know. I'm glad russia's gone. I think he's a great day for america and i agree with you and i don't wish death on anyone but he is not a human being. He was walking talking piece of shit. Human excrement is what i call him. And we're better off without him. And plus he destroyed my in my industry. I worked in radio starting in college. Nineteen seventy eight destroyed. Clear channel. is the house that rush built. And he built it now. Sorry i hurt. Radio built it by taking exorbitant amounts of money so that they had to fire thousands and thousands of employees over the years and that went on until he died and in syndication model the ownership limits. And that that entire industry has been fit to You know huge corporate ownership because really. That's what the problem is as corporate. Honestly it was invisible stations. He'd still have a job. I'm arse but he. He was like a su- horn Into facilitating the consolidation in corporate ownership. That we've seen and it's a real problem. Because i mean you know you hear these What do you call Emergency alerts announcements and stuff like that. But you can't get any local radio. No when when something happens in community acre exactly and that is also rush because he was one of the first major syndicated talk shows and they offered his show to free for free to stations. All you have to give up a few commercial slots per hour and so it killed off thousands of local personalities. That's why there's no bench now it's starting again because people are going online but the radio industry itself is dead. Radio is dead. And it's really sad. And i push back to rush that disarray. Ration- of radio is. I'm kind of glad that stay. And i'm happy for the of podcasts. All the rest of the other Let's people can finally hear some voices again but you're right The the idea of local radio being gone that that is a shame it really get a local life podcast or yeah i hear you well. I'm live every day. Five eastern two pacific. Thank you so much mike stark. Thanks for the work you doing. What are you still doing that kind of work. Are you still confronting politicians on capitol hill. What are you doing right now. Actually i can tell you story about melissa before i go to capitol hill. I was up there confronting politicians and this is how i met her. It was during the cavenaugh hearings. Yeah and she's running through the halls. Just absolutely bird dogging Senators police doing it. The wrong way She's screaming at the top of her lungs. The same sentence over and over and over again. Don't vote for the rapist dove for the racist or whatever it was she was saying i was up there. I was working for american bridge american bridge. It's one of the larger democratic super taxing. You know they're controlled by david. Brock and brock. You know agree with them or not. They were on the right side of the cabinet. Fight right up there. Trying to get video of these senators answering questions that we can take turn into adds to get rid of some republican senators In the next cycle. And i had some success doing that. I made quite a few things that ended up on how i had one that ended up on Stephen co-players late night so nine. I can't do it. See screaming at these senators right so so i turned to her and i say melissa. Because i didn't know her name. I said hey. Look my name's mike we're on the same side. I'm up here for american bridge. I'm trying to get video that we can use an ads. But i can't do it if you're just gonna run around screaming at these guys and you don't let me get a word it and she's she goes and she says. Oh that's what i be. Somebody from an american bridge told me manche planning man's waning. The ends up. She ends up tagging bosses at american bridge. That i've been met nancy into her and all the rest. he's got a little bit of karen. Inner believe me. I'm not. I've known her sort of you know through the through. The blog is fear for years. And yeah it's fine. You call me rush limbaugh. You'll like meet a rush limbaugh but if you like me to rush limbaugh i have no use for you anymore. Obviously you don't anyway mike stark. Thank you so much. It's good to talk to you. We need to catch up again one of these days. I thank you for calling in today and good luck to all. It's it's a good day. It's a good day for radio. sorry again. I don't usually wish death on anyone but i'm feeling okay today tomorrow on the program. It's thursday howie klein. i'll be back. We've got a lot to talk about until then thanks for listening. Everyone sorry for the fireworks. Or i hope you enjoyed them. It's okay to disagree by
In Love with Science: Stories about Loving Science
"Science story. NYU scientists the. Well, it was that golden moment because science was on my side. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the story collider where we bring you true personal stories about science. I'm your host Aaron Bargar and this week in honor Valentine's Day were presenting stories about our greatest passion science. Of course. As business. Richard Feynman said physics is like sex share may give some practical results. But that's not why we do it. Just like all great loves science can be frustrating. A Ken disappoint us. It can even break our hearts and to be completely Frank it rarely does the dishes really does not pull its weight around the house. But when we really need it. It's there for us. Our first story today is from palm your by is recorded in October twenty eight teen at caveat in New York at our show in partnership with the Cy out conference, which is produced by rocky you and SPN b. It's a lovely day in England by I mean, it's not raining. I'm eight years old and at my uncle's wedding. I'm dressed up to the nines. Don't sit around. I think I'm awesome. Because I have no reason to assume otherwise. Aranda Monte comes over to speak to my mum on the subject turns to that of children. Points out my two sisters, and I and the says, oh, no sons, no says mom, that's okay. She says on convincingly, boys. All right to all right too. And that's when I realized that the boy child is king and his birth is to be celebrated and the goals reduced to what kind of marriage material, we all and become a lifelong kind of damage control exercise. She's too fat too thin to toll to dock. She can't cook. She goes out too much. I've seen how with boys. And even aged eight I'm getting super frustration sake. What what is it that? They can do the I cannot like okay, you can pee standing up pregnancy. Anyone winning woods for that? So my parents, and I this is the beginning of a struggle between what I can I should do. So my dad on the one hand is teaching daughters. How to use power tools have to change a lightbulb how to rewire plug a my mom in. The meanwhile is telling me how before I was born she expected me to be a boy. Kind of stings. She thought I'd be clever engineer or something as if that's something. That's no possible for ago. She goes ahead though. And she names me bottom bead. So for those of you that don't know seek names are unisex, but bombie tends to go to boys because it means the greatest all the one true warrior. This does mean though, mind taken with my middle. Name means I am warrior Princess. Admittedly. It'd be much easier to be cooled Xena warrior Princess. Put them Cole. The funding that. So names aside my sisters, and I being girls hot to be protected even on the mean, leafy suburban streets of London and that meant no going out. No after school activities and definitely not friends. We would go from our parents house to our husbands. So in the absence of any kind of social life, it meant I put my head down studied. I realized that I love science and excelled at it. And that's something that my parents were proud of. As some stages and undergraduate I realized that somebody would pay me to experiments for living like how awesome is that? I love the idea of being at the forefront of something new being able to you super cool new techniques when I first heard of some proteins will sort an action potential from a nerve. See my little face. I was a nerd heaven. As an idealistic twenty year old. I realized that some states to get ahead. I should probably get PHD. No mums this. You're going to be too old by the time. You're done you realize she's insinuating. I'm gonna end up an old mate. And so I tell my Amazon a-. I stand up for myself. And I remind her that she also had to buffalo with her family and India in order to get a masters and she getting married until she got married to my dad at the ripe old age of twenty six. Yeah. And I wanted show with this was my dream. I knew that she hadn't been able to live hers because when she moved to the UK she wasn't confident enough with her English to carry on teaching. So that meant she ended up working factories for the rest of her life fine sherline Christie's, but no one wants to marry over educate to go. But I complete my PHD in foam ecology, and I go on to do my first post doc, the while my family's rushing meat's meat, suitable boys fending them off while stating decidedly unsuitable, boys. I have a thing you see for tools skinny dog head white men, and I was staying very true to type. And of course, because I'm not meant to have a boyfriend as far as consent. I don't have one. Now, the time comes to find a new job. And I'm offered in your post doc at the university of south Florida aged thirty the desire to marry me off is ramping up to fever pitch. And so I'm ready to cross the Atlantic for that reason alone. Even to Florida. So best scientists I get to Russian lies. It would look good on my CV to have stint in the US. So I popped my bags and I moved to Tampa. There in new city with no friends, I sign up to running club. And that's where I meet a cute and funny Spaniard cold, David who also turns out to be a scientist. We share in the scientific highs. We commiserate when another gronk goes down the pan. He's also big fan of outreach and science communication. If it wasn't for him. I probably wouldn't be hit today. We go from being acquaintances to friends friends to a couple whether it was because I realize I trusted him with all of my passwords all. Like that. He makes me laugh until I cry. Or whether it's just his tolerance of this foul. Mouth short, tempered, crazy woman. But he tolerates with this superhuman patients. But I realized that I don't want to be with anybody else. So when my mom said, no one wants to marry an over Kate to go replace the new one with no nice. Seek boys. Yeah. So. Like, get it. They wanted me to marry someone of my own culture because the England lakes -perienced immigrants in the seventies was not being I experienced a first generation growing up. Then. And so they had these ideas about kind of ONA and continuing that culture. David in the meanwhile, he's probably not fun. It's very easy to understand. But he takes us all with amazingly. Good grace. You may be wondering why maybe I should have spoken to my parents. I'm sure everything would have been fine. Happen. So I'd heard the horror stories about for example, a sequel sequin neighbor of ours who'd married, Jamaican guy. Parents disowned her and so they've never met awesome. Grandchildren. All the girl who had a boyfriend of a different religion who new parents didn't approve who's trying to run away except the parents found out that killed her and they buried her in a concrete floor. And while this no universe in which match. My parents trying to hurt me. There was possibility they wouldn't speak to me again. So wanting to confront this David agreed stay my not so low secret. Until when random Sunday morning. He's oblong on about applying for green card, and how this would be so much easier. If we were couple. What we're talking about? You mean like a married couple? And that's how he proposes. Awkwardly is only a computer scientists can. Space. So obviously the time came to kind of out myself from the secret. As he may have realized I'm not exactly shy and retiring type, I have as we say in the UK a mouthful me. The time. Such three is old. I had a PHD, and I travel the world I've given conference talks at big conferences. And yet the idea of raising the subject of David with my parents house me shitting, bricks try and convince myself that the stage they'll be happy on marrying. Anybody? But it's not helping to calm. The nerves will. So the time comes and cut insides with a trip to the UK for my sister's big fat three day Indian wedding. With all the food the clothes drunken don't sing. This is just the icing on my shit cake. So off to the festivities Arrojo. Everybody else is going to bed. It's just my mom and I left on sofa. She turns to me in the subject to the inevitable. So when you gonna find a nice sports Murray. Actually, do you. Remember David who got stranded in London for Christmas last year? Yes. She says. Funny. Explain who he is where he's from what he does all the ship. They should have heard from me is ago. Then she says with the face of a lifelong vegetarian who's just been offered a ham sandwich. You get married, right? You not just going to live together. Yes, ma'am. That's the plan. Okay. She says. I'm not sure I have the exact words to share with you. How relieved I was. But that one little phrase meant that decades of pressure and expectation guilt with finally lifted from my shoulders. She looks kinda sat trying not to kind of jump up and down on the sofa with joy. Happy endings. She called him in that sudden she turns to me at the end of. Indians in Tampa. All right. In the meanwhile is too excited at the prospect of going to Spain for a wedding. He seems to be overlooking. The whiteness of his features on. So I'd love to tell you. I love to tell you that my parents everything that they did was out benefit. They only thought they were doing the best for us, and my mom in this story will have come across his complete Horace, which she is. But at the same time, she is quirky. She is funding. She's the most forgiving personally. No. She loves her kids with all of her heart. And now David is one of them. In fact, actually, both my parents are dole him he's free tech support far as concerned. Well, some cultural changes very very slow and painful, I'm now forty and my mom will still me if I've made David's Dinna. Actually while. I'm here she's worried he's not eating properly. But it feels like as culture family is starting to come round. So I now have cousins married to Robbie one married to Steve. David has met the clans both in the UK and in India so has been accepted, but there's more than one kind of acceptance on this one that we have to have other. Academics. Because that's we it. Frankly, like, it's a weird situation to be in. Our relationship works because of shed law for science. And the fact that we tolerate all the crap that comes with being a scientist. It works because he sees me as equal and it works because I am overeducated go. Thank you. Partier Bhatia bear is a neuroscience PHD working at the university of south Florida. She studies the role of nerves in the respiratory system. And how they might hold the key to understanding diseases like, asthma and COPD. We're not researching she runs taste of science science festival for adults and a podcast called to scientists. Hey, Washington DC story fans. I have great news you we're going to be coming your way again on February thirteenth with another show at beer baron. This time the theme is curses as in. Curses foiled again. Tickets are on sale now at story quieter dot org. Our next door today was recorded at story lighters. I ever show in a non English speaking country Germany, but if you don't know German don't panic this show, and therefore the story were in English live events in Berlin or sometimes in English or a mixture of English German like with our friends at the deadly show, which if you haven't heard of it, please do check out the dead lady show and their podcast, which highlights fabulous ladies of history such as ADA Lovelace, for example, or mercury I feel like you would be into it. But our first ever show in Germany was an interesting experience, especially when it came to hosting which I did with our Toronto producer Michigan Eski because it was the first time we'd ever been in front of an audience that was translating things in their heads as we spoke. So I would think a joke with and then ten seconds later when I was moving onto something else. Suddenly, they would laugh or you know, maybe they were just humoring me who knows? But if you've been to one of our live shows, you know that there's a line we often say right at the start, which is the first rule story quieter is there is no learning at the story collider science and our stories for entertainment purposes, only so for this show, I used all four years of high school German that I have in my brain to translate this message for Berlin audience. So that there would be no confusion no risk of learning whatsoever. So for all of our German listeners of whom I'm sure there are many Laron is by story clutter Nikolaou Davis shaft, dean Nores or under hall, tone bitte. Our next story today is for Monica Dunford is recorded in November twenty eighteen at Proctor in Berlin at our show in partnership with Springer nature and as part of Berlin science week. I was in crisis. It was my freshman year of college. And I discovered that I hated chemistry. Well, actually, let's be honest. I was bad at chemistry. Every single one of my chemistry experiments was ending explosion. If the purpose of the course had been to create the perfect mushroom cloud than it would have been acing the class. To make matters worse. My backup plan which had been to major in creative. Writing was going even worse. I had never seen. Great. So low. Suddenly that year which had started off with such youthful. Optimism was literally going up in smoke. So one day after one of my physics classes. The professor was announcing that they were looking for help in the summer in the labs. I wasn't interested physics to me was everything that was boring. It was cold. It was passionless. I mean, honestly anyone like boxes on an incline. I mean does anyone here? Get excited about about friction. So they would be paying six bucks an hour. He continued, and I suddenly stopped and looked up six bucks an hour. Now that was a raid girl could sell sold to the devil for. And so I applied and much to my surprise. I basically met none of their requirements was accepted. On the first day on the job was one of those typical southern California days. Beautiful blue sky, not cloud to be seen perfect temperature. And the professor of the lab took me downstairs into the basement, and it was cold Dr and loud, and he swung opened the door. One gesture and says this is my lab. And I am greeted with what looks like a pile of junk. I mean off to one side there was this tank water tank made out of plywood and trash bags and in the middle of the room was a table that was full of scraps and other bits of wire and off to one side there was this freezer that look just like the one might dad got at a garage sale for like fifteen bucks. And my mother was so pissed. I thought to myself this this truly can't be cutting edge research, this this junk pile here. Cannot be cutting edge research. There must be some steak. Right. I mean, the real lab must be must be behind some door somewhere. This can't be hit. But he was in was in another world he gazed around the room like like a man in love. This is my land. I whispered. Now, my nineteen year old self booked up at him in. What those are. What loser? Am I really going to spend my summer in this cold dark place? But you know, six bucks an hour is six bucks an hour. And so that's how I spent my summer in that cold dark place, and it was assembly line work. I was basically working on putting together light sensitive light detectors Culp EMT's. I would take one out of the box would put it on the table. I would test it. I would put it into the tank of water with tested put it into the freezer tested. Who end all this data to some graduate student upstairs. Never saw and I did this hundreds of times. And there was no moment of piffle and that summer. There was no moment of revelation. There was no moment of even real fun. But it was in that junkyard that I discovered and learned how to do cutting edge research. I remember once I was sitting at the table trying to fix something. And I went through a bunch of papers looking for the instruction manual, and I had to break out in laughter because I've fluffed instruction manual territory long ago. This is cutting edge when something arrives to you sleek and fancy like your iphone. That's no longer cutting edge. That's production research is a long and winding road full of twists and turns and sharp jab sometimes, and it is therefore by definition just messy. So one cold dark lab led to another. I found myself working in labs working in mines underneath mountains. In minds that were two thousand meters underground in going dark and deep I discovered a love for the vast and the infinite now, I'm a particle physicist, which means that I studied the tiniest particles. We know of the we're tiny tiny than any atom. And yet these particles hold the key to a lot of things about the universe. So for example, why is there? No, antimatter me. Why why do we have galaxies? Why are we even here? These were the questions that I wanted to find the answer to this was part of that long winding road that I wanted to be on. And besides I realized that kind of like the junkyard feel actually as a matter of fact, my grandfather actually owned a drunk yard. So it was in a sense sort of like coming home. After I finished my PHD. I couldn't get on a plane to Geneva fast enough in Geneva, Switzerland, they were building the large Hadron collider the biggest machine built by man. So it's marketed. And it was about to turn on. It was about to start in. I in my timing was going to be perfect. I wanted to be right there in the middle of it. When it started. We were working nights and days and weekends to get this machine. Working to get the detector working, I work on the atlas experiment, and is one of the experiments at the large Hadron collider. And it's big in every dimension. It's five stories toll. It's seven thousand tonnes has more than three thousand kilometers of cable. And most importantly, it has a fifteen page author list. So I was working on the electron IX. And I was doing everything from testing the tricks to making sure they working correctly to literally on my hands and knees crawling under the floor to run cable. We were running into problems everywhere. This is the detector that took fifteen years to build and we were getting cables coming from the US that weren't fitting to electron exports that were coming from Brazil that weren't interfacing with other boards that were coming from Germany. And so there we were working has set nights and weekends just to get this thing running now at the same time. There were fifteen pages of other physicists technicians who are working on getting the accelerator working the L. H now, the sea is basically the easiest thing you could design you take two things in our case protons and smash them together. And out of that collision comes a lot of stuff and the atlas detector. Is like a gigantic camera taking a picture of all of that stuff. So we were like working like mad to get the detector working and the team was working like mad to get the accelerator working. And it was all coming to the day of I b. And finally the day of I beam arrived, and it was a big event. Hundreds of news agencies to send it on Sern like some sort of swarm of locusts that would just flowing everywhere. We were it was so big that we actually Google emblem for the day so to fail on this day would be to fail in front of every Google user on the planet. So it was pretty tough the pressure was high. I kept telling myself that I was excited, but the truth was I couldn't sleep. I kept ways saying awake at night thinking to myself, please God, if it fails don't let it be my cable. So just up the ante a little bit. We were going to do this. We were going to run the beam literally for the first time in front of the press. We weren't going to do a single test run beforehand. We were just going to do it right in front of them. Now at the time that sounded like a good idea. But in retrospect, it was probably pretty stupid. So the only see therefore was going to throw us a little bit of softball. No. Usually, we take two beams collide them together. But it's pretty hard to do. The beams are microscopic. And our detector has to be time to the nanosecond. So if we if our detectors don't functioning correctly, what it means is essentially, we take the picture at the wrong time. And we missed the event we were very afraid that this would happen. So the was going to send a single beam around, and it was going to smash that beam into a metal plate, and that was going to be the equivalent of a floodlight of particles and the logic behind. This was basically. Well, we've got one hundred million channels. Let's just hit them all one has to be working. And so that's what we did. We send around a single beam, and we tried to hit every single one of our electron IX simultaneously now on the day for speed. I remember walking into control room. I was passing news truck after news truck after news truck, and my heart just saying that each one I mean, it's not that I was afraid of failure. I mean research is all about failure about failing tweaking failing tweaking tweaking again failing again, it was failure going viral. You know, it's one thing if your experiment doesn't work as planned, so totally different thing. When grandmother calls you to tell you experiment in orcas plant. So on the day of I beam when the cold the good, the atlas control room to tell us that they were sending beam the entire room, just stopped breathing. Now, the control room is the absolute tip assists of that. Physics. Junkyard feel. It has very sleek modern desks. It has an almost apologetic number of flat screen computers. It has huge projected monitors across the front showing variety of diagnostics and screens. There's not a single piece of trash, it's immaculately clean. So if you leave anything like a little scrap of papers just gone like a ferry just took it away. I think the press must have been a little misled when they were standing in the control room because I think they must have been expecting production. They must have been expecting something sleek and cool and fancy, but despite the look of the control room, this was still cutting edge. And so when beam arrived at the detector there were no lights. There was no flashing anything. There was no immediate indication that beam had even arrived or that we had recorded all there was was bunch of physicists hunched over their computers desperately looking for that being data. And finally, somebody found it, and they brought it onto one of the monitors in front of the room and one head looked up to heads looked up and suddenly everybody looked up and there it was data. For the first time in fifteen years data after so, much, sweat and toil and pain. Data. And for me, it was as if this room full of Taga Fers and full of cheering physicist just fell away, and I stood there. And I found myself a woman in love. Thank you. That was Monica Dunford Monaco's and experimental high energy particle physicist working on the atlas detector at the large Hadron collider at Sern. She is currently at the university of Heidelberg in Germany, her research ranges from combing through pito bytes of data and search of new allusive particles to crawling in small dusty places, connecting thousands of kilometers of cables. Story CLYDE or is grateful for the support of the Tiffany and co foundation in of science sandbox Simon's foundation initiative dedicated to engaging everyone with the process of science story quieter is led by me artistic director. Aaron Barker is well as executive director, Liz nearly with help from deputy director Nisa Greenberg operation support manager, Lindsay Cooper and the rest of our amazing team stories featured into these podcasts from shows produced by Katie. Woo me, Aaron burger and Michigan. The podcast is produced by senior podcast editors Saunders with help from Gwen HOGAN C music is by ghost special. Thanks to caveat imprac fair for hosting shows. And to our Termine fans where humoring me do appreciate it. Thanks for listening and have you dines day everyone.
How to Scientifically Make Your Brain Perform Noticeably Better & How to Effectively Hold a Grudge
"Today on something, you should know. You know, you should be grateful for what you have. And when you actually are grateful amazing things can happen. I'll explain that. Then there's a good chance your brain is not performing at its best. And there are five reasons why when you think about what are the five things that caused memory loss. No mortar the five things there would clearly improve brain performance. It shouldn't be surprising. It's worse today than ever been before. And it's happening to younger and younger people. Plus, why is it that some people never seen began sick? I'll reveal what those people do differently and how to hold a grudge a real grudge in a positive way. Trust to think, you know, I'm not holding onto any bitterness. I forgive emotionally. But I'm going to remember this person is liable to behave in this way. So that if they do it again, I'm not going to be nearly shocked by all this today on something, you should know. Somethingyoushouldknow fascinating Intel, the world's top experts and practically and find you can use in your life today. Something should now. Mike carruthers? I welcome. Or one of the things I've learned from doing this podcast over the last. Couple of years is how listening habits can change particularly around the holidays each time for the last few years between thanksgiving and New Year's listening dips a little bit presumably because people are busy their their routine is disrupted. They have a lot of things to do Christmas shopping and all and then right after new years it goes back up and in the case of this year. It's going back up not only do wear it was before but even higher, but the point of all this is if during the holidays, you were unable to hear all the shows that we continue to produce as we do every week two episodes a week, you might want to go back in two or three ago and listen because we did have some really good episodes in December first up today. You know, a lot of pop psychology tells you to look on the bright side, keep a positive attitude or be thankful for what you. Have. And while there may be wisdom in there somewhere that last one be thankful for what you have seems to have some real power to it time and time again studies have shown that performing simple gratitude exercises, like keeping a gratitude diary or writing letters of thanks or acts of generosity can bring a range of benefits such as feelings of increased well-being, reduced depression, and these feelings will linger well after the exercises are finished. Now. A brain scanning study is helping scientists understand why these exercises have these profound effects the results suggest that even months after a simple short gratitude. Writing task people's brains are still wired to feel extra thankful the -plication is that gratitude tasks work at least in part because they have this self perpetuating nature. The more you practice. Gratitude. The more attuned you are to it and the more you enjoy the. The benefits from it. The results of the study suggests that the more practice, you give your brain at feeling and expressing gratitude, the more it adapts to this mindset. You can even think of it as your brain having sort of a gratitude muscle when you exercise it makes you feel better for a long time. And that is something you should know. When you hear terms like cognitive function or brain health. Maybe you think that's something you worry about when you get older memory loss mental decline, those are problems for older people. Well, no, it turns out those are problems for all of us. There are a lot of younger people today walking around in kind of a brain fog more today than ever before. And for the most part it is preventable and fixable. Dr Stephen Mosley is an MD and fellow of the American Heart Association and the American Academy of family physicians. He's an affiliate clinical associate professor at the university of south Florida. And he's author of a book called the better brain solution. Dr Mosley is about to explain the fascinating science of how your brain works, and what you can do to make it work better at any age by Dr Mosley. Welcome. I'm delighted to be with you. So let's start by addressing this issue of mental decline and poor mental performance as it relates to young people because I think that people think this is an older person problem, and you say, no more and more often today. Young adults even are having brain fog. They're not as sharp. They're not as productive. They don't focus as well. They forget names have to reread passages in books they walk into a room. And they forget why they're there. I mean, brain fog is increasingly common, and it's really strongly related to our lifestyle choices, especially the food we eat. And so what's different is is it because we've changed our diet is it because why why would now younger people beginning brain fog, when they didn't forty fifty years ago well fruits, as you know, it's a lot more processed. There's more sugar. There's more refined carbs than ever. Before and we're also less active. So I mean, if I think about the five steps in the better brain solution that help improve brain performance one is food. We're not getting the same quality food or eating the wrong foods to would be nutrients because we're not getting the food more people are nutrient deficient today. Number three is activity. We're not as active as we used to be four stress. And I think we're more stress today than we've ever been before. And last step five is toxins, and there's more toxins in our environment. So it should when you think about what are the five things that cause memory loss. And what are the five things? They would clearly improve brain performance. It shouldn't be surprising. It's worse today than it's ever been before. And it's happening to younger and younger people. So help me understand what it is about those things. Hopefully, there's a kind of a general answer rather than have to go through all of them. But what is it because of the toxins in the food and the whatever. For the stress. What is that do specifically to your brain to cause the problem? What's going on the probably the number one causes we call insulin resistance. It sounds complicated. But let me explain it. So it's simple insulin's, the hormone that pushes energy into yourself. So when you eat a meal, insulin goes up, and it pushes the energy way in stores it for later. So like, you don't have a famine, and that's when we eat healthy that works beautifully. But what if you had cereal or toast for breakfast? Even Hawaii toast, a sandwich or wrap a whole a whole grain wrap for lunch and you had a granola bar for a snack. And then you had rice potatoes or corn for dinner. You've overloaded your storage capacity. You can't store. We can't store that much refined carbs and your body becomes insulin resistant and the. For your brain. Here's the irony member in one hundred thousand years, humans have never really had an excess amount of process sugar in their lives that never happened till recently. But today with all the processed food, it's really common. So when the brain becomes resistant. It literally turns off it's like a power surge, and you blow the switch, you know to your light. So the brain turns off your foggy you don't function. Well, you're less productive. And they've actually showed that like if a young adult goes out, and has, you know, pancakes with syrup or, you know, a breakfast, cereal and drinks, orange juice for breakfast. They have less productivity less brain speed for the next six to eight hours. So that's clearly documented, but that's really common. And if it's just a choice then. Okay. You're let's say just your birthday. We'll who cares. You're less productivity. You're more forgetful. But if it's every day. Your brain doesn't function. You're not reaching your potential, you might lose your job for being, you know, kind of brain foggy. And you're shrinking your brain. You're killing your rain cells in your brain shrinking, and you're going to be at risk for memory loss earlier in life than ever should have been. But I like to think that in my experience is sometimes that even if I'm not feeling particularly on my game, I can override it with a lot of concentration and get closer to what I need to do and breakthrough that fog with sheer determination some degree. But eventually you're just stressing yourself out, and you can't keep up. And that's why the other parts come into it. That's a Suming you're physically fit, and you have that physical stamina, and you work out. That's assuming you manage your stress and your cortisol levels aren't high all the time and you're stressed out. Because then you won't have that reserve, and you won't have that Dr. And that assumes you meet your nutrient needs, and that you have some reserve to handle it there. And it also means you're not being poisoned. So that's how the five steps of this program all come into play. 'cause if you're you might be able to do one of those steps not so well and recover on the others. But there's really there's five pillars that hold you up. And when you when in most people today are falling apart on all five. So this insulin resistance that people have this is strictly a result of what they're eating. Yes. Yes. Well, no, it's the number one causes too much sugar and refined carbs, you know. But it also it's worse, if you don't exercise it's worse, if you're stressed, and it's worse, if you have toxins, so all of those factors and nutrient deficiencies caused it to so all five pillars impact, insulin resistance and insulin resistance is the number one cause for decrease brain productivity for memory loss and for heart disease. So what are the foods? We should be eating, and what are the foods, and you mentioned a couple, but what are the other foods? We should not be eating. There's twelve foods. You could irregularly they're really helping support your brain. And we shouldn't be eating so much sugar and flour and those two foodball and those twelve foods are. Well, like vegetables in particular, green Lisi's somebody you eat one Cup of green leafy today. Like broccoli, you know, kale spinach their brains eleven years younger than someone who doesn't eat them just one Cup, berries and cherries, those colorful pigments, and these fruits they're low in sugar and the those pigments protect brain cells in your arteries. There's super important that nuts. People go on low fat diets for weight loss, but a low fat diet and studies has been shown to deprive your brain of fat. You have decreased brain performance increase memory loss. I want people to Eat Smart, much more junk fat, but healthy fat things. I want them to eat more nuts olive oil, avocado cook with you know, extra virgin olive oil and avocado oil eats wild salmon have dark chocolate smart Fettes. You know, another category would be spices herbs. I'm a physician nutritionist. And chef I take food really seriously. I like food, and I think spices and herbs taste grade. And they improve the flavor food, but they're also any inflammatory and they protect their brain. Especially two of them Italian herbs like Rosemary. They will improve your brain functioning actually help you study and curcumin that's in to Merrick or curry spices curry spices. You can improve your brain function within just three hours of having curcumin and it lasts for a month. You mentioned earlier that you gave the example of, you know, if you had toast and a sandwich and all that people have been eating bread for thousands of years without a whole lot of problems. Why is bread so bad? Well, we actually have only had bred for like what three to four thousand years kind of tops and for and Abbas four thousand years except for maybe thirty or forty of them. We were farmers. We were out we were physically active six to eight hours a day. So the truth be told is if you're physically, you're you're like, a, you know, you have a physical job and you're out carrying heavy loads. You're a farmer and you work not with a tractor. But I shovel you need a lot more calories, and you can handle this stuff a lot better. But I don't know anybody, you know, maybe a few professional athletes. I've got a couple of athletes who are patients but short of bam. I don't have any patients. I mean, most people struggled to get an hour a day, and that's just not enough anymore. So we can't get by with not exercising all day and trying to eat. Bred three times a day like we could a hundred years ago. So let's talk about what is normal everyone. I think assumes that as you get older, your brain changes in ways that make you more forgetful. Is is that a safe assumption that you can say that shouldn't that's that's average? There's a difference. That's a really good point. And I'm so happy you're bringing it up. There's a difference between average aging your brain shrinks. And you're you lose your memory and your brain processing speed drops and normal aging with normal aging. You would lose a little bit of speed. It's like someone gives you a very slightly slower computer every couple years, but you're smarter. You have more experienced nobody notices, but you shouldn't be losing your memory your hip campus, the memory center shouldn't be shrinking the way it is today in an average person. And my seventy year olds are sharper now than they were when I met him at fifty five my forty five year olds are sharper now than when I met him at thirty. Well, why are you meeting them? Why are they coming to you in the first place? I mean, I have a clinic. I have an optimal health center. People come to see me to assess how their agent optimize their health and probably one of the more important things, we do is measure, brain processing, speed and memory. And when we realize, wow, your brain's kinda sluggish and to be honest half of them. Don't even notice it, it's, but you know, it's kind of been a slow insidious drop just gradually over time. They're more and more sluggish. They don't really notice in Whipple say to me is after they follow the better brain solution for a month. They'll go. Wow. I forgot how great I could feel. I forgot how sharp I could be thanks for giving my life back. I wanna ask you. What is a sluggish brain? I mean, what what does that look like what does that feel like to have a sluggish brain? But first here is a New Year's resolution. That's easy and pays big dividends. Better oral health by brushing, your teeth better and with a quick electric toothbrush. This is a resolution. In you'll stick with. I've been using quip for a long time every single day, and this is a very different electric toothbrush. It has sensitive sonic vibrations for ineffective clean that's gentle on your gums. Because the fact is a lot of people brush too, hard and some electric toothbrushes are too abrasive. But quip has a built in two minute timer that pulses every thirty seconds to remind you when to switch sides. So you clean your whole mouth evenly brush heads are automatically delivered to you on a dentist recommended schedule. Every three months for just five dollars because seventy five percent of people use old worn out bristles that are ineffective. Those are just a few reasons why I love quip and why over a million other happy healthy mouths due to quip starts at just twenty five dollars. And if you go to get quip dot com slash something right now, you can get your first refill pack for free that your I refill pack free at GE. T Q U I IP, get quip dot com slash something. So so doctor what does it mean to have a sluggish brain? I mean, would I know it can I see it can I can I sense it. What what is what's a sluggish brain? Well, someone calls out you attended phone number. Can you remember it or do you have trouble? And you have to write down part of that is we're so user these smartphones. We don't have friends remember phone numbers. So that's com. I'll admit that one's complicated. But you have to read a repass agenda book when you go to a meeting and someone assigns you for things to do. Do you walk out meeting? Go. Oh my gosh. I don't remember two of the four. I mean when you're doing work, can you just and people keep interrupting you can you just power through in despite you know, fifty interruptions day, you keep working at high speed and get it all done or I would say the average person needs an extra hour and an hour and a half every day just to get their work done because their brains processing speed is reduced. But there is an I guess I don't really know why there is. But there is a general acceptance that as you get older you're mental function will decline and that. That is normal. But I think we're too you're right. That's a really good point. We're too accepting of. Okay. I'm average. That's okay. But remember the average person today is overweight almost obese if you're normal weight, you're almost abnormal. So if you're mentally sharp. You're almost have normal so way too, many people are having decreased brain speed. So I don't want people to accept full. I'm average. That's okay. 'cause average isn't very good anymore. So help me understand though, that we'll hear that, you know, people get older and they become forgetful. But then there are some people who actually get a disease or a condition called dementia from which there is seldom I think any kind of big recovery. What's what's the difference between a sluggish brain and a demented brain? Okay. That's a good question. And it's so essentially you could be good brain performing speed. You can imagine you're sharp your quick you're alert or you can have some subject in say someone's going to get dementia in twenty years. We can actually kind of if we could go back twenty years for the guy diagnosed say you're gonna get diagnosed at sixty in your forty at forty you made probably don't notice yet. But if we were to do cognitive testing, we would see your testings dropped a bit for the first five years fifteen years before you get diagnosed with dementia. You're aware. Air that you're more forgetful than you were ten years ago, you're thinking I'm not as sharp. Okay. But this is just average aging, right? It's okay. But you're actually losing brain cells in your brain speeds, dropping down and over ten years, your, friends and coworkers notice it too, but they might accept that. Okay. Now instead of forty he's almost fifty or she's almost fifty. So it's okay. And then and then so that's subject of cog, you're aware of it. But you're still functioning the next they call it mild cognitive impairment. It's not a good description. It means you're mildly disabled, you can probably still do your job. Maybe not if it requires complex thinking, and you can still live on your own. You're not disabled that's a really bad sign net. Now, you're on the cusp the verge of dementia, and the definition of dementia is you're disabled from memory loss. You can no longer live on your own pay your Bill. Function you need request systems. And that's scary. And you can kind of reverse that a bit. But you're absolutely right by that point, your brain is basically shrunk from grape to a raisin, you've waited way too long. So my goal is if you do have mild cognitive impairment, you, you know, really your nearly disabled you could still get twenty to twenty five percent better in stop losing your brain function. Don't wait till you have dementia. I totally agree with you. But most important would be for the younger, folks. Go for optimal, brain performance, push. You know, why not be excellent? Let's stop accepting. I'm average 'cause that's not very good. Let's go for better brain performance in preventing memory loss. And then it's not just your rain the same things. Help your your brains like the canary in the coal mine. It's the first symptom for the whole body. But if you're hurting your memory, your probably, you know, hurting, your arteries. Is your worsening your romantic sexual function all that stuff falls apart? When you're hurting your memory. So why not feel fantastic and be more productive at the same time? So you're saying if I get you correctly in if I do I think this is a surprise to a lot of people that just because you're older doesn't necessarily mean you should forget things and and have a noticeable memory loss or cognitive decline. I well, mostly. Yes, I agree with most of that. I think you will have some drop in processing speed with normal aging. But but no one's gonna notice because we have life experience, and we can compensate for it. So it should be unnoticed. I really agree that there's no reason you can't be sharp alert and fully functional at seventy five eighty. I mean by a hundred okay, I'm getting I'm Marie listed. Sweet. We're not gonna be able to keep going. But I don't see any reason that someone should. Could be dwindling before eighty years of age. So just to be clear. Are you saying if someone were to do the things that you're talking about is it just to clear up, the brain fog and get you back to ground level? Or are you saying that doing these things will actually improve your mental function right now? So are in other words, are we preventing a negative or are we promoting a positive or both? Well, our average pitch I've had some exceptional responses. You know, like people who are on the verge of losing their jobs, and instead they got a raise 'cause their performance improved so much, but let me let's talk about average. I think that's more real. Let's be realistic. Let's be realistic. We've done randomized clinical trials where we randomized groups. We pick Jim members who didn't come to the gym. I did that because they were somewhat motivated, but they weren't doing anything about it. They didn't eat. Well, they didn't work out. But at least they were Jim members though. No in that group, and you can probably imagine many of them. We offer them to eat better. Eat healthy food made their nutrient needs at activity do ten minutes a day of stress management. Here's some toxins to avoid and we just tested them before. And afterwards the control group made no change. I mean, we said do the same and they obliged. They didn't change anything. They had no improvement and the average person in our intervention group who followed the better bring program improve their brain processing speed twenty five percent. That means their ability to process information went up twenty five dollars. They could finish eight hours of work in six hours of time. And their attention span there billion to focus when a forty percent briefly, you mentioned toxin, so what toxins am I getting that? I need to avoid three quick examples. Mercury. If you eat a lot of big mouth fish group or. Tuna. I'm swordfish grouper. You can have mercury. Toxicity ten percent of my patients have elevated mercury. And it's hurting their brain pesticides is the second. If your pesticide levels are high your three hundred and fifty percent more likely to get dementia than if they're low and there's a ton of pesticides. We need to be eating and most of it surprisingly doesn't come from fruit and vegetables that comes from animal products, dairy, meat and poultry. So when you're eating the dirty dozen fruit and vegetables, like, you know, apples, and strawberries and peppers and spinach. They should be organic you don't have to buy everything organic, and you're meeting dairy and poultry should be organic. Because that's where most pesticides and the last one briefly nitrosamines, those are nitrates in sandwich meats and hot dogs and bacon. We used to just think they cause cancer. But now, we know their neuro toxic. They've done studies on rats just really recently and showed that when we give them. Indeed them bacon and deli meats, they get Alzheimer's quickly. So if you eat meat or eat bacon, please make sure they're not they're organic, and I chose him in free. They don't have these toxins in them that are really common. We'll great. And and Dr Mosley also has more information and buying guide. The you can have for free at his website, which is Dr Mosley dot com. D R M A S L E Y dot com. Which is also in the show notes as his his book, the better brain solution. Thanks for joining me documentary. Thank you for having me for a long time. Now, I've been talking about and taking care of vitamins care of is a monthly subscription vitamin service that delivers completely personalized vitamin supplement packs right to your door. Look ninety percent of people fall short of the FDA recommended guidelines for at least one vitamin or nutrient. And the fact is it can be really hard to know what vitamins are sup. Laments. You should be taking but care of makes it really easy to find out. What you specifically need when you take their quick and easy online quiz. Then you're customized vitamins are shipped to you in these very convenient daily packets. So there's no more keeping track of all the bottles of supplements. And when are they going to run out, you just grab the daily packet and off you go take advantage of this month's special New Year's offer for fifty percent off your first month of personalized care of vitamins. Go to take care of dot com and enter the promo code something. Fifty that's this month special New Year's offer fifty percent off your first month of personalized care of vitamins to take care of dot com and enter the promo code something fifty that's something five zero and that Lincoln promo code are also in the show notes. I'm sure if you stop and think about it you've held a grudge or two in your lifetime. And how many times have you been told that holding a grudge is not good forgive? And forget is what you should do holding grudges. Does you know good? Well, wait a second. Maybe that assumption is wrong. Maybe grudges can serve a valuable purpose. That's the claim of Sophie Hannah. Sophie is a writer mostly she's written crime fiction, but she's tackled. The topic of grudges in her new book how to hold a grudge from resentment to contentment the power of grudges to transform your life. And she thinks we need to take a closer look at grudges since we've all held one. Maybe we can put them to better use. Hi, Sophie, welcome. Thank you. Thanks for having nail. You bet. So first of all let's define what a grudge is. How do you? Fine it. Well, the crucial thing is I define it differently from how all the dictionaries define it. So the dictionaries all say, the grudges a feeling a dislike or resentment will bitterness some kind of negative feeling my new in different definition of grudge is the grudges no to feeling, but a story that still has relevance in your life. So give me an example. So the story will usually be about a negative experience that happened to you somebody did something that hit you all made you angry. And at the time, you might have felt upset or annoyed about it. But the grudge self is not lot feeling because that feeling whatever negative feeling you have it compacts, the grudge is the story about what happened that you remember, and you can remember that for years and even decades after the feelings from the incident have Pat on the crucial thing is that the the grudge story you can then use. To inspire you to motivate you to do all sorts of good things in your life. Now. So the prevailing wisdom is that. It's not a good idea to hold grudges that you should let them go that you're only hurting yourself that holding grudges hold you back and the person you're holding the grudge against couldn't care less. And so it does no one any harm except you exactly that is the prevailing wisdom, and that is what we've all been told to believe about grudge it. And if you think about the dictionary definitions of grudges, which most people just unquestioningly accept then that would be true, wouldn't it? So if we accept that a grudge is a negative bitter, unpleasant failing. Then of course, we don't want to hang onto those. Of course, those would us home if we kept them in clung onto them. But if I'm saying is true. And I know that it is from my own experience. Then we can remember grudge story and get only good things. From it. So when I think about some of migration stories that date back, maybe even ten years, I have no residue of negative feelings actual because those past long ago, what I do have though is a grudge story that has will I call a live relevance charge. The story still feels relevant an impulse because something about it makes me live and behave and think in a different way, which is good for me and good for the world. So let's say I have a grudge about somebody who was once very rude to me. I might still keep that grudge story now because it will always inspire me never to be rude to anybody, for example. But the feelings you have for the person who was rude to you have come and gone, the feelings have gone. So this is where it's important to draw distinction between thoughts on judgment, which is in one category. And feelings. Which is in another category. So I am absolutely willing emotionally to forgive anybody. I will happily go full would in my relationship with anybody. You know, give them any number of chances to behave. Well, and still like them and still love them. Even if I have a grudge about them what the grudge means is just the they did something or behaved in a way. The I won't to remember now because it has changed how I think about them. And the reason I called it a grudge because a lot of people have said to me, hang on a minute. What you're saying is all very is true. But I wouldn't call it a grudge. I'd just call it. You've learned a lesson from something that happened to you reason. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's the most common criticism. I've had so fo but I have an answer for that criticism. Which is that the reason I call these things grudges is the if I have a grudge about somebody, then I might emotionally forgive them. An indeed I I always do emotionally forgive people. I don't dislike them, I don't resent them. But those people my grudge, jeez. As I call them. They do not have a completely clean slate in my mind. So, you know, most people I like love to have a completely clean slate. That's nothing. That's no kind of mock against them. There's nothing I think will I need to be this in mind. I'm protect myself from them in that way. All I need to have lower expectations of them. Because I know they have a tendency to behave in this not ideal way. So that's why I would call these things grudges because it's the it's the lack of a clean slate aspect that for me makes. Grudge? But you know, in a way all that means is that we don't, you know, when obliged to think about everybody in exactly the same way when when obliged to trust everybody in exactly the same way. So if somebody is homed us in a way that was really painful or really damaging then I think so K for that person not to have a clean slate in all minds, and for us to think, you know, I'm not holding onto any bitterness. I forgive emotionally, but I'm going to remember this person is liable to behave in this way. So that if they do it again, I'm not going to be nearly shocked and upset by that. Well, that's interesting because I think people do that we like to think that we forgive people, and we don't hold a grudge meaning that the person does have a clean slate. But in fact, they never do they you never think about the person the same way again after you've been upset by them. Because even even though you say. You forgive them. You always remember. Well, this is what's really interesting. So as well as having different definitions of grudges people also mean different things when they use the would forgive and we don't talk about this often enough. What does the word? Forgive main. Does it mean forgive emotionally amd forget and carry on as if the thing happened happened if that's what forgive means then yes, it's very hard to do. Because exactly as you say, none of us can forget anything that wounded us emotionally in a very deep way. If however we think of the would forgive a slightly different way. So, you know, maybe forgive can mean, we don't have any continuing Anga array JR. Or pain in relation to this person where willing to see them and give them every chance to behave well in future, and if they were to behave while in future, we would up -solutely appreciate that. You know, that is what forgive means to me. It doesn't mean that I'm going to forget those grudge stories I've got about people which still seemed to have a live relevance charge. And so to me the way I advocate holding grudges, which I have to say really works brilliantly in my life. What's good about that? Is it doesn't able you to forgive him ocean? Give that person every chance an even allow that. When they did the thing they did that hurt you. They might have been doing the best. They could you know, you you can even say, I don't blame them. They were in about place. They didn't realize what they do all of those things you can allow and you can forgive them, you know, in a in a sort of whole halted way, but you can still think, but they did do those things and that was not okay. And this is another big part of why I'm advocating holding grudges in the way, I am because human beings off Justice seeking creatures. We just we never won't be from the age of. To a child consi- note, fair his things bigger than mine. I won't Choi. He's had it for an hour. We get these instincts. We've got them from birth. And a lot of the reason why people have destructive grudges where they hate and they seek revenge, and it does leads of damage in the world. Is because we all have this idea that holding a grudge is bad, and we should all forgive. And what not often means is we end up trying to invalidate or repress our own perfectly natural and justifiable negative emotions. So what I'm saying is allow yourself create an hold a healthy grudge, which is then assaultive symbolic commemorative Justice object, and that's constitutes that person. Not having a clean slate. You remember what they did? You don't think it was? Okay. You'll learn from it. You'll protect yourself with it. But you can also at the same time move on emotionally and continue the relationship in a positive way. Or not only not exactly so you know, you you can hold you a grudge without hatred without bitterness. Just it's a thing you won't to remember because it has a live relevance charge, and you can forgive emotionally, and you can decide you don't want that. Person in your life anymore. That's absolutely fine. The nothing on healthy. Oh, damaging about thinking. I've got a grudge about Bob. And I don't think I won't to spend time with bulb anymore. You can do that -solutely. The only thing I say people shouldn't do is allow bitterness and rage and really unpleasant feelings to consume them because that isn't a healthy over necessary Paul of holding a grudge there are times though in life where things happen people do things that are horrendous that are just horrible and impossible to forgive or or maybe people don't wanna forgive. They they need to hold onto that anger because they've been so hurt and betrayed or or whatever. Absolutely. So, you know, yes there I'm not by any means suggesting that forgiveness is always the desirable outcome it in many situations. It is if it's a petty or trivial slight than than often forgiveness can be the best outcome. But sometimes it isn't an in that case, there's no need to try and forgive anybody. If that doesn't feel right. I would say the even if you even if you choose not to forgive someone. If you consumed by bitter and hateful feelings that's never going to be good for you. So however, horrendous the thing is that's happened. I mean, we know that many people go through truly awful life experiences on somehow find a way not to let bitterness consume them. And that has to be the best possible way to proceed a few can manage it. I know people I can think of a couple of people who. Have have been hurt too or had disagreements with people. And it it ran so deep that. Years later. It's all they can talk about in. That mean, it's just like it it it is become part of their identity to to relive and talk about how horrible this other person is. And I wonder if it must serve a purpose. But I can't imagine what that is. And it's awfully hard to be around people like that who sing that one note over and over and over again in and cannot let it go. Yeah. Yeah. I I know exactly what you mean. And I think the reason people become like that is because of all unhealthy attitude to grudges. I think will often happens is this something wrong. Only hit full is done to somebody the person than is angry and upset and immediately people around them try to minimize that. They try to shook a coat they say, oh, well, you know, come on. Don't let it bovi. Don't let it get to you. There are two sides to the story you should move on you should forgive. Don't hold a grudge and the response from the wo- build lodge seems to be in some way negating the importance of the original transgression if on the other hand somebody what to say, oh, someone's just on a terrible thing to me on the willed which respond differently if the world richer respond by saying that's terrible that that happened that's grudge worthy. I don't blame you for being angry. I be really angry. If that happened to me, then the person on the receiving end of the transgression would feel validated and undestood, and it's amazing. How often well meaning people in that desire to sort of make things okay? Will basically tell you that you shouldn't be upset about what you're upset about. And that you shouldn't be angry about what you're angry about. And that whoever attacked you probably didn't mean it on their lovely chap really hit. We. These reactions all the time because people won't let to be no problem. And what not does is it makes you dig in and become more entrenched with those negative feelings. Now, my reactions to people who've been hurt or upset produced the opposite effect if somebody comes and rents may about someone who's done the metabol- wrong. I say that sounds highly grudge worthy. His how you can create a brilliant grudge. Let's create. Let's then classify it and great it, and we'll get to grudge cabinet, and we'll put in an unjust reacting in that way makes the person think. Oh, okay. Finally, someone someone gets that this thing that happened to me matters. So I genuinely believe that the reason so many people are still going round renting about tiny things that would done to them fifty years ago is because we in general is human beings have a tendency to try and gloss over and minimize home to other people. In many ways what you're saying. I think gives voice to something people do anyway in in a lot of cases where they hear that to to to be a good person you need to forgive and forget, and but people don't forget people don't have a clean slate anymore and those of us who don't forget think. Well, how do those other people forgive and forget 'cause I can't do it. But I don't think anybody really doesn't. And then you fail. It. You must not be a good person. Right. I want to be one. So you try and full yourself to forget and to completely forgive. When either you're not ready, all you just can't do it. Absolutely. I mean, I think if we could all adopt, a different mindset, if we could all think, you know, what a good person is a good person is somebody who Nola ges that when somebody homes them they're gonna fail upset and angry. And there's nothing wrong with that. And there's a wet kind of paradox about negative feelings if we can be pulse. Tiv- about all negative feelings, then they will stop being that they will still being negative, much sooner. So in other words, if I'm walking down the street someone hits me over the head with a hammer and said something very rude to me if the natural surge of Anga that rises up in may as a result of that. If I tried to repress them think no, no. I mustn't think Bob full. He was probably having a bad day. I must forgive him. Then my anger gets much more corrosive because it's repressed, and it knows it has a right to be there. But I'm trying to deny it. Now, if on the other hand, I think to myself, welcome anger. I know why your hair it's completely fine. Use STA as long as you won't all these negative feelings. You're welcome to stay as long as you feel. It's necessary to be the than actually what happens is those feelings don't need to dig in defensively, and they move along a lot more quickly. Well, I like your message because as we said at the start of this the, you know, holding a grudge in the tradit-. Away. Really does do. No one. No good. It doesn't do you any good to hold a grudge against someone who doesn't know you're holding a grudge against them. And so no good. It comes from that. But your way is a bit different. And and does serve a purpose. So I appreciate that. My guest has been Sophie Hannah, her book is called how to hold a grudge from resentment to contentment the power of grudges to transform your life. Thank you for being here. So V. He'll welcome. Thanks for having now. You probably know someone who never seems to get sick. Why is that? Well, research has found that people who rarely get sick tend to have some things in common. They have a set bedtime research shows that those. Somethingyoushouldknow fascinating Intel, the world's Tomek. I and practical advice you can use in your life today. Something you should know it, Mike Carruthers. Hi, welcome. For one of the things. I've learned from doing this podcast over the last. Couple of years is how listening habits can change particularly around the holidays each time for the last few years between thanksgiving and New Year's listening dips a little bit presumably because people are busy their their routine is disrupted. They have a lot of things to do Christmas shopping and all and then right after new years it goes back up and in the case of this year. It's going back up not only do wear it was before but even higher, but the point of all this is if during the holidays, you were unable to hear all the shows that we continue to produce as we do every week two episodes a week, you might want to go back in episode or two or three ago and listen because we did have some really good episodes in December first up today. You know, a lot of pop psychology tells you to look on the bright side, keep a positive attitude or be thankful for what you. Have. And while there may be wisdom in there somewhere that last one be thankful for what you have seems to have some real power to it time and time again studies have shown that performing simple gratitude exercises, like keeping a gratitude diary or writing letters of thanks or acts of generosity can bring a range of benefits such as feelings of increased well-being, reduced depression, and these feelings will linger well after the exercises are finished. Now. A brain scanning study is helping scientists understand why these exercises have these profound effects the results suggest that even months after a simple short gratitude. Writing task people's brains are still wired to feel extra thankful the location is that gratitude tasks work at least in part because they have this self perpetuating nature. The more you practice. Gratitude. The more attuned you are to it and the more you enjoy. The benefits from it. The results of the study suggests that the more practice, you give your brain at feeling and expressing gratitude, the more it adapts to this mindset. You can even think of it as your brain having sort of a gratitude muscle when you exercise it makes you feel better for a long time. And that is something you should know who sleep eight hours or more per night are three times less likely to develop a cold compared to people who sleep for less than seven hours. When reason why is that at night, your body repairs itself and regulate stress hormones that can make you more susceptible to infection. They also eat right filling up on antioxidant, rich foods, like sweet potatoes. Citrus and bell peppers, almonds and red grapes or red wine replenish cells that are damaged in the fight against germs and bacteria. They take a probiotic good bacteria in your gut can. Enhance your immune system. So you may want to consider taking a probiotic supplement, which contains helpful bacteria. They wash up you don't have to go crazy with handwashing, but you can reduce illness by fifteen to fifty percent. If you remember to wash your hands before eating before and after prepping food after the bathroom, and after you, sneeze or cough. Soap and water is the preferred method for handwashing although hand sanitizer is good too. And when you do wash your hands, you should scrub for twenty seconds or longer and people who rarely get sick. Also have close relationships in studies people with the most social support when faced with a stressful situation where less likely to get ill. If exposed to a cold virus and hugging enhance that immunity benefit. And that is something you should know questions. Comments or suggestions are always welcome. You can reach me directly at my Email address. Mike at somethingyoushouldknow dot net. I'm Mike Carruthers. Thanks for listening today to something you should know.
Monitor Show 15:00 01-01-2021 15:00
"The best of bloomberg business week every business day market sell up at spreading around the globe. Bloomberg businessweek podcast with carol. Massar talk about the volatility trade. That tripped out many as breaking global business finance intech news along with smart analysis. We know that that is going to be sure and steady a bloomberg businessweek. Podcast talk about the mark to gotta talk about. The fed news loosened today on bloombergradio dot com the bloomberg business app or subscribe on apple podcasts. Before hours a day at bloomberg dot com on the bloomberg business app and bloomberg take. This is bloomberg radio now. A global news. Update senators overriding a veto by president trump. For the first time that means a massive defense spending bill will become law among other things trump objected to a provision to rename military basis. That carry the names of heroes. Democrats are being stopped in their tracks for a fourth straight day as they tried to bring to the senate floor. The house passed bill which increases stimulus checks to two thousand dollars. Majority whip john thune was in the way today. I think many of us on this side of the aisle are willing to look at other ideas and things that we can do. That would help those people more but this certainly is not so object. Senate majority leader mitch. Mcconnell has called the proposal socialism for rich people a new year new grim milestone in the coronavirus crisis. Johns hopkins researchers say there have been more than twenty million confirmed cases in the us and there are fears about a new variant strain although report rick. -ocial says one tampa doctor says folks should not be alarmed university of south florida. Public health. dr. Jill roberts says there's no need to get super worried. She tells ten tampa bay while the variant strain as more contagious.
Zoning and Property Rights: Tampa Bay's Balancing Act
"Florida matters. I'm Robin sussing ham with Florida's population on the rise. We're taking a look at how we're adapting zoning. It sounds mundane. But in reality, it is anything but zoning and building regulations affect us intimately because they hit us where we live. Joining us today to discuss this topic. Peter Belmont is vice president of preserve the Burgh the nonprofit that promotes historic preservation in Saint Petersburg. Tyler Hudson is a land use, and real estate attorney. He's a member of the urban land institute and last year served as the chairman of all for transportation, the referendum to raise the sales tax in order to fund county transportation and van Lincoln's is year. She's the assistant professor of urban and regional planning at the university of south Florida. Thank you, all for being here. Thank you for having us. So zoning is a balancing act between preservation growth controlling growth housing costs private property rights. Everybody has their priorities. What I'm curious about, as how we rank those priorities Tyler. What's your idea on that, that's tough? It'd be I think that zoning is sometimes a bit static. Whereas the things that affect zoning population growth, three inspiration, I really fundamental principles of equity that there's a really dynamic, and they change a lot, especially in a place, like Hillsborough county Tampa, I think sometimes the discussion at affordability, we talked about zoning is, is we sometimes narrow and nothing's T specifically when it's really a broad more holistic conversation means zoning is tied to transportation, we talked about affordable housing, well, that's tied to workforce development so you really need to look at them altogether. But what you can't talking about there was affordability. So it was sort of, like that's maybe the Asia, that's the dust lens to really wrap things. Round four. Ability to look at but sources have your income and your uses. I mean we talk about workforce development. We wanna raise the incomes of people here. But then look at the uses of what people spend their, their income on for too many people too much of that money, I think, is spent on transportation spent on housing costs, and I think that has a disincentive on our growth year on our ability to, to retain people, it's things that we're working on. I think offer transportation's passage was a, a really a resounding vote of confidence in the future. Thank you. Let's thanks to the two hundred thousand people who voted for it. I think that was a resounding vote of confidence in the future. There's still a lot of well a lot of work to be done. I think especially on the land of element and zoning side. Peter would I be wrong to guess what your priority is as vice president of preserve the Berg? I don't think you would be wrong. And I think preservation is a very important component of our growth management of our zoning. And oftentimes forgotten historic districts can be very important, and I think we should be encouraging the creation of more historic districts in our bay area. There are many studies now from variety of communities, that show a stark districts are productive areas of our community, the resilient. And when I mean, resilient I talk about during downturns in the economy, they often times do better, and they are very liveable. And I think that's a very important point for today's discussion. There's a great deal of what we refer to as hidden density, within historic districts, or older portions of our. Immunity and historic districts are not just for the well off. Most distort districts are home to very wide range of members of our community there diverse from income to race to ethnicity. So I think it's important to look at the historic district question, the historic districts, a lot of times they were built up before we had some modern zoning regulations for single family housing, so a lot of times, you will find more affordable housing and historic districts. This is my impression because you've got multifamily units and duplexes and try plexus things like that van. What about that? Do we need more historic districts? A lot of people would say no because they're very restrictive and what you can do. Once you buy a house, there, historic districts offer choice, and that's I think, one of the things that planning conceptualize zoning, as really doing historic districts usually offer something that's really different. And something that can offer affordability culture. I think one of the really important things about them as they. Offer an authentic place. And I think a lot of people are looking around Florida and saying, what's Fenwick here, and that really matters as people move in as people stay longer. So historic districts offer something really unique that nowhere else can offer. But a historic district means restrictions. It means that it's historic district is a whole reason you want to designate it that is because you can't tear your house down and build a mid century Mateo copy of a mid century, modern home. You can't just add things willy nilly. You can't paint it. The color that you might you might love bright purple, but you've got restrictions in that neighborhood. Doesn't this trample on private property rights? Tyler you're an attorney depends. I live in one of these district. I live in Tampa heights in the portion, that's actually in a federal historic district and, you know, we need to honor history, but I don't think we need to become prisoners to it. I think there's a way to be to be flexible to ensure that you honored the documented history of a district without really prevent. Development. I mean, I think Tampa heights is one of the more interesting neighborhood, I'm biased obviously. But mean it's one of the more interesting neighborhoods in the Tampa area right now because it is a historic very diverse neighborhood, that's really being buffeted by a lot of the changes that are happening in Tampa. Downtown is creeping north and we're seeing some urban infil projects that some folks in historic preservation community are not thrilled with. So it's like with anything. It's, it's certainly a balancing act. But if you're in a federal historic district, the city Tampa, for example, has an architectural review commission that reviews projects and ensures that they meet certain design standards. And so, you know, I it's about I don't think it's necessarily a deprivation of property, right? But the interesting thing you have at neighborhood, like Tampa heights, where a portion is in some type of recognize historical district other portions are not how you harmonize their growth together. So it doesn't look you know, something antiquated on one side and into modern on the other you need to really kind of blend it. And that's subjective blending is subjective. Architectural standards. Subjective. You know, Peter people want the charm of a neighborhood preserve. They want. They don't want to destroy the characteristics that made them fall in love with an area in the first place, that's easy to understand. But, you know that presents its own hardships, this was from a recent w USF story, this is Matt Widener, an attorney who represents a resident trying to demolish and rebuild his home, in the historic, driftwood neighborhood. He said, Preservationists don't take individual rights into consideration. Quote, one of the most frustrating things about the preservation argument. And debate is that the proponents of preservation have no concern whatsoever for the financial consequences of individuals. He said, how do you answer that are personally doodo mad? I mean, I think Matt has a wonderful office and in a store building in downtown Saint Pete. I think there's a misperception oftentimes about what historic designation means. What I typically say is his. Designation means that we're going to encourage the reuse of the older buildings and discourage their demolition regulations differ from community to community. So most local governments have their own individual historic preservation program. You mentioned Neto, purple and paint color. For example, Saint Petersburg, will not regulate your paint color and your historic district. There are some local governments that look at that many do not, but it's a process that will provide a review that does not otherwise happen. And I think the goal is to have a neighborhood that remains special argue that there are community rights, that have been carefully thought out when these districts are adopted and the, the community, those who live there, and this will be directly affected as well as this who, who may work there. Visit their play. There are part of the adoption of these and think, through the parameters that's that are involved. So these are really unique attributes in the community has decided that. They want to protect them. So there, there are community rights that are at stake here as well. Yeah, I think that's fair. And I also think that I've been through the architecture review commission process myself. And so I, I sympathize with people who find it frustrating, because it can be. So it is important to create an safe harbors that there are certain things that you can do in community that do not require extensive regulation or approval. And one of the most important things that I think, for example, the city of Tampa could do is, is better document what has been permitted in the past, so that there is some measure of equal enforcement in equal protection of these design standards because it can happen that you'll have somewhat varying interpretations really in a matter of months for very similar projects. I think wouldn't wouldn't, but things like that happen, that allows of frustration to get ill give it worse than fester. And frankly, can pose a bit of a threat to preservation efforts. So we're recording this right before the legislative session ends are, are you following the bills in the state legislature right now that would prohibit cities from imposing manned? Tori affordable housing requirements. I think what you're seeing from Tallahassee is a very constant yo, yo effect of preemption, if there's something going on in the local government that doesn't meet with the expectations of the party in power, then there's a big to preempt all that power to local government you see with vegetable gardens you see with the forcible housing. So I guess one of the things that they're trying to keep from happening is something called inclusionary zoning inclusionary zoning means if you wanna develop somewhere, you have to set aside ten or fifteen percent, or some percentage of that development to quote, affordable housing. This is from marketplace story about Atlanta, quote, developers, like Tim Schrager say it's hard to get any project financed, especially where developers have to tell investors, they'll need to give up revenue on his many as fifteen percent of units built, quote. I don't think that the electricity and the framers are going to start. Reducing the cost of their labor, because of inclusionary zoning Schrager said, so can we see a downside of that kind of zoning band, is there are there, you know, cons to that? We'll be know as planners, we know that New Jersey has had inclusionary zoning standards for quite some time that they are very strict in enforcing statewide and growth hasn't slowed down there, and they're able to build housing, the issues that they're better able to address than our workforce housing housing for teachers housing for the police force. So this is something that that has worked. Yeah, that's exactly right in talking about it. In terms of cost is isn't something that should be shied away from me? We I see this frequently that uncertainty governmental uncertainty in delay that can kill deals. And so to the point about this costing developers more like when you talk about. Well, how, how do you offset that because sometimes the transactional costs of excessively long permitting, periods and review periods, fixing some of those things can make it easier. Four developers to comply with his type of set aside requirements. But I think there's, there's no question. That's generally, where things are going. Yeah. So I'm just point out that sometimes when you look at, at balancing, if you want to call it the added cost that the developer may also be getting a bonus for providing that affordable housing, so perhaps there will be some greater density allowed than would otherwise be permitted for that development site. Yeah. So but looking at it from the other way I'm new to this game, right? I'm not a developer. I'm not in planning. I'm not zoning. So I just look at this and say it's sounds like extortion to me. I mean I don't wanna use hyperbole but it's kind of like the mob. I mean, if you want to build here, you'd better set aside ten percent for housing or if you want to build this condo. That's great. But now you need to renovate this other building over here. I mean, if you look at it in one way it saying, if you want a certain density, you've gotta pay up, and that's gotta hit certain. Bure's as unfair. There's there's, there's no question at those, I think we need to work backwards from what, what, what is the goal? I mean, if the goal is to create for example, in Tampa, a place where not just folks ordering thirty dollar Andres can live, but the folks who are cleaning dishes, later in the night, then you're going to have to make incentives to create affordable housing near, for example, the downtown core that, that's the incentive. But to Peter's point there are certainly incentives that cities can can give that can offset that or make it more attractive. I mean, the bonus density is definitely one thing being able to go go higher, for example, an inability to put more units in, which are we able to finance and pay for your project? That's a huge thing parking minimums, I think that's something that the city is going to have to look out in a big way, for example, in Tampa heights. My house happens to have a to garage, and we're trying to turn it into a family room. We don't really wanna room for our, our cars in for new construction in Tampa heights, you need to have a place for two cars. That's a, that's a huge. That the city's going have to address. Why definitely want to get into that in just a moment. I wanted to just go back to that inclusionary zoning for one second because in that marketplace story that I was quoting before I said, stop development. They had explosive growth along this park. And there was a lot of very desirable area for development and then they created the inclusionary zones, and that put a stop to it, but van you're saying you don't think that that happens. Well, like Tyler, I think that inclusionary zoning policies and provisions to include affordable. Housing projects are usually accompanied by some sort of incentives, or ways to, to help make the development project. Get off the ground from a development perspective, but these things are policy, and they are put in place to make sure that the market helps communities achieve their long term quality of life goals. So we've seen in Florida, what highly speculative markets that are based on, on the development push yield, and it's not a good outcome for the citizens of Florida. So I think these regulations are really intended. That providing a balancing act and making sure that people will have housing that will work in the long term for a wide variety of Florida, and I was looking at some recent information by twenty twenty five up to eighty five percent of household, we'll be childless by twenty twenty thirty four percent of households will consist of a single person. And we know in Florida that a lot of those folks will be older. We also are making way for millennials who are going to shape, our economic development. So these people need the housing choices and early career or fixed income retirees are not necessarily going to be able to afford some of the kinds of speculative investments. So I think it's good good policy when provisions are made to allow a broader spectrum of the population to have choices. Well, it's interesting because it's either top down, or bottom up. So, so you're saying it's, you know, we're going to have all these different kinds of families. So the government is to think about that, and sort of like pushed developers into making those housing. But why not if we're going to have those different kinds of people, that's what they're going to demand? Right. So that's bottom up if they want, you know, people want multi family housing. They want tiny housing. If the market, demands it, why does the government have to come in and say, this is what you have to build? And I think the development community is recognizing this need. We're seeing the tone centers with some of the, the mixed use the, the multifamily housing, a big topic today is the missing middle, which is sort of the bungalow style housing, the quad flexes, the duplexes, that don't really are on the scale of walkable single family housing and can be intermixed in community, so you can live next to your aging parents or, or these kinds of flexible, the tiny house, in the backyard. Absolutely. So I think the, the market is, is catching up and good planning policies can support that quote flexes the grid example, Minneapolis just up soon the entire city, and there is no longer zoning district in Minneapolis, for which single family is the most you can do you can do Claude flexes as, as a matter of. Right. And and those are littered throughout my neighborhood. I'm great. I wish we had more of them. Yeah. Well, let's talk about that. I mean, Peter, you might know something about this, but it does seem like cities or try. To get away from this single family home zoning regulations, because those laws may be discouraged, infill, and they discourage the multifamily units that would provide more housing and bring some housing costs down. But how do you balance that with preservation, well, I think in many ways, when we're talking about doing those things we're looking at how we did develop in the past. And so when we look at older neighborhoods, as I mentioned earlier, they do have that mix of housing. They will have some single family. They will have multifamily. Yeah. So it's not it's not really a problem in historic neighborhoods, I guess, but in new suburbs, or new neighborhoods. You're still very strongly sticking to that single family zoning, right? Thailand. You're that you're seeing sort of a Roach, retrenchment from that cheap energy prices about it a very suburban land development pattern in Hillsborough county that, that went on for multiple generations, and now you're seeing people wanna move back into a city environmental walkable environment. And that's not to say that downtown Tampa, the only place you can have a vibrant walkable community. You can have that anywhere. And as you're seeing some efforts at sprawl repair that are notable. But we talk about in terms of values in equity and things like that. And that's an important conversation to have. I think you can also talk about this in just the cold hard reality of the fact that seven hundred thousand people are going to move to Hillsborough county in the next thirty years. They're not all going to want to live in large tracts, single family homes. We need to find somewhere to put them. So that means the further you get out from the downtown core. Maybe it's a little bit harder to go vertical. But in the end the proximate neighborhoods to Tampa's downtown and other economic centers, you need to be able to put meaningful density, in place. Right. So we're hearing that a lot. So what's the obstacle to changing that single family zoning law ban actually in this area? City of Tampa has has really led the charge allowing a lot of development and increased density, downtown a lot of this area is zone for much more than it's currently accommodated. So it's up to the development community to make this happen. And for community. It's to be willing to accept, I think some new density, which is talent. I think that's it. I think it's more of the mindset of people, they want, you know, the house and the yard, and they don't want to maybe see a big apartment building going up next door or even a duplex because, you know changes the character of their neighborhood they bought into. And I think that's changing, I think one place where I'm seeing a lot of changes seminal heights, it locally where you're seeing increased density. And I think the community is generally accepting that they want to figure out how transportation works in that context parking works in that context. But this community recognizes that they're on the boundary of growth, and that's going to happen and other communities are going to say, no, we want to be single family. And that's okay. And I think that's one of the great things about zoning, let's community kind of define where it wants to go and what it wants to be what I'm hearing, you say, is that communities need to pay attention. I mean, you know, maybe they do have more power than they think over. There's owning regulations. But when things come up at the zoning regulation commission. And they may not may not know about it. So they need to make their voice heard. There's no question that the most powerful title, you can have as a citizen because I I've seen it city council hearings projects that, you know, some, some good, maybe unless good can be made or broken by by who shows up. And if you don't show up, I think you have really less of right to complain. I would just like to come back to whether you want to call choice, a little bit or not. But I mean, I think there have been a variety of studies now in the number of communities. Raleigh, North Carolina is one that comes to my mind and one of those conclusions about the mix for the community. Is that younger people are turning more and more to those older buildings in older neighborhoods, and for a variety of reasons, again, the diversity the economics being close to transportation, so we can encourage some of those values. The more you'll find that those areas are attractive, so architect, Mickey Jacob has said on this show that parking regulations. Are the biggest problem and housing solutions, like micro housing can't get built and because of these darn parking regulations. And I, I think I heard you mention that Tyler, I think there needs to be a war on partially regulations there. I think that this is a dynamic place right now. I think is the most exciting time you could possibly deliver Tampa but are. Zoning code is fairly static, and it can be a little bit difficult to change in. So, for example, if you're building an apartment complex, you need to have one visitor parking space for every four units. I mean, that's generally based on a town home concept. So you're over your cooking, these complexes that are an island in a sea of parking downtown recently made a change. There was a good change with very specific change, saying that if you're a quote, micro apartment, so he gets five hundred and thirty year five hundred eighty square feet or less. You only have to have a point five hats. That's right. And you have any calling micro parts are funny, and in most other places you'd call that an apartment at five hundred thirty square feet. That's a good very specific change to make. But we, we need to look at it. I think a lot more broadly. But the key to that is having transportation options, I think you can't just yank parking minimums, you know, citywide or, or countywide until some of the transportation starts to come in, but thanks to the voters that is going to start to change. And so along corridors Florida Nebraska Tampa in Columbus. A lot of different commercial corridors that are going to see more public transit options, I think for development that are within a certain proximity to transit stops. You can look at certainly reducing or even eliminating parking minimums, you think that'll happen. Yes, it has to there are some communities that are starting to look at that. So traditionally, we've had zoning code require the minimum number parking spaces per type of us some of begun to say, maybe it shouldn't be a minimum, but a maximum that the codes should provide and parking indeed is very expensive infrastructure to provide Saint Petersburg right now for its central avenue, Carter's, looking at reducing parking requirements as being one of the incentives to bring about the form development that they prefer. If I always a restaurant downtown and in the evening, people that wanted to come to my restaurant couldn't find a parking spot because the people that lived in the apartment buildings didn't have parking spaces. So they. They were taking all the available parking mail. My around my restaurant, I would be upset. Well, we're seeing that the alternatives are taking the place in our more convenient. And I think that's the key the, the parking and the transportation situation to get people out of their cars has to be convenient and desirable. But we're seeing options like Uber the cross bay ferry that just went permanent that loves folks to enjoy it, actively and culture, either on the Tampa side or the scene. Pete side. These are becoming more and more attractive, and it's, it's nicer to let someone else drive or take a boat ride, though, as think that's the question that we're dealing with in Florida. We're too big to continue the traditional mix of land use and transportation options, and we're going to keep facing this dilemma and some hard decisions are going to have to be made both in the urban context and in the more rural context, I've been watching a little bit more closely the toll road extension Bill that's working its way through the legislature at the moment, and this is another place. Where are we going to grow through expanding highway capacity? Or are we going to look at some other meaningful? The alternatives. Yeah. I think Robin does the hypothetical restaurant under you mentioned. I mean, that, that type of frustration I think is somewhat pervasive and understandable, in a place like tampo that I think is learning how to grow into being a big city and because so many people in live here, in Tampa are, are not from here. The spent some time elsewhere, or they came from away people know that it can be better, people know that you can have vibrant walkable communities, and that there is no right to free parking. There's no right to having the meters turned off on Sunday. There's our old habits that I think our population growth is going to demand. We move away from fan, you know, with citrus being so much less than it was. We see our rural areas endanger of some willy nilly sprawl. I think you were just kind of referring to that fear with the toll roads going through, and people don't like the idea of losing their Greenspace. But you wrote about sarasota's award-winning growth plan, which you've studied in depth that sounded perfect it talked about clustered population and green spaces it sounded great. It passed and. Then what happened came to a standstill. Yeah. The I think incrementally development kept pushing further and further into areas that people had said they wanted to be protected, so once again, it's about community saying, these are the resources that we wanted to protect the case study that I wrote about, is about Sarasota, twenty fifty which is their plan for how they're going to deal with the rural area outside of their urban service area. I know Hillsborough is dealing with some similar questions. Now, how do you do this? And how do you do it? Well, it's, it's a difficult question. And there's a lot of different issues here. So we know that climate change may limit the viability for folks to live in our urban areas, which are primarily coastal, so thinking hard about whether development in rural areas is appropriate at this point in time in Florida is absolutely this is the time to start doing that. I'm conservationists by trading land conservation by training, which actually has a lot of similarities to preservation or in the historic preservation context, that we really need to think Howard about what are the sensitive, environmental areas. What are the agricultural resources that we really want to protect? Checked? And then think about whether there are good ways to accommodate some forms of development. We talked about this questions mentioned action with urban land institute. They don't some great work. We're not the first people to encounter these problems. I mean, mention agriculture the ULI did a great report on, whether he'll Agra hoods using some in Virginia, for example, we don't this in the transportation campaign, sometime this going against this belief that Tampa and Hillsborough, smell so unique that what works elsewhere can't work here. That is not true. We, we are not the first community to struggle with balancing urban-rural divides, or providing better affordable options. There are other places that do it Tyler Hudson is a land use, and real estate attorney, a member of the urban land institute. And last year served as chairman of all for transportation. Peter Belmont is vice president of preserved the Burgh the nonprofit that promotes historic preservation in Saint Petersburg, van Lincoln's, is an assistant professor of urban and regional planning at the university of south Florida. Thank you so much for being here. Thank. You on this. Thanks. You can find us on Twitter at Florida matters. And Florida matters is available as a podcast. It's another great way to listen, whenever it's convenient for you search for wherever you get your podcasts or go to our website, WSF dot org, and click the listen tab, Florida matters is a production of w USF public media. The engineer is Richard, he Menez this week's producer is Mary, Sheldon. I'm Robin sussing ham. Thanks for listening.
The Keto Diet Is Super Hot Right Now
"This is Florida matters. I'm Robin Sesing ham, and we're talking about the popular Kito diet. Take a look at some of the plethora of Kito cookbooks on Amazon, quicken easy Kito, genyk cooking, southern Kito, Kito restaurant favorites, Kito, crock, pot Kito instant pot. Kito genyk cleanse Kito comfort foods. It's fair to say this is diet craze, but does it really work? We're talking to Dom Dagestan oh, associate professor of molecular pharmacology and physiology at the university of south Florida and widely known Kito expert, his colleague, Angela poff also with US Fs department of molecular pharmacology. She's a research associate studying nontoxic metabolic targeted therapies for cancer, and neurological diseases and Jenna, bell, registered dietitian triathlete nutrition adviser senior vice president at Pollick communications, thanks so much y'all for being here. Reever shaping here. So I have two full disclosure. I started Akito genetic diet about a month ago. What I call a Kito genyk ish diet. I'm trying. And I'll tell you a story I went to the grocery store, the first day to buy coconut cream and natural unsweetened peanut butter and all this weird stuff that I do not have at home. And I was putting it up on the thing. And I see the woman behind me putting up Kito genetic bars. And she said, oh, you know, I said, are you on the Kito diet? She said, yes, I lost thirty pounds in three months, and then the cashier the probably an eighteen year old guy says, I'm on the Kito died. I've lost eleven pounds in two weeks. I was like, oh my gosh. This is crazy. You know, in my in my little line. All three of us are starting this. So I just wanna know Dom. I just describe a little bit of the theory behind it briefly, if you can. Sure. Well, I approach it more from a clinical perspective, our main focus of the research that we do is preventing seizures. So developing mitigation strategies for oxygen toxicity seizures, which is a type of seizure that limits navy seal diving. Let just let me, let me stop you right now. Because I know you a very specific research that you're doing, but just if you could give me what is a key Dodi like what's happening to your body. What does it mean? Yeah. Kita kita. Jank die is essentially shifting your body's metabolism from a carbohydrate burning metabolism. So glucose would be your primary fuel to a fatty, acid and Kitone metabolism. So, and you do that by shifting the macro nutrient ratio of the foods, the fats carbohydrates and proteins. So if you shift, those ratios to specific ratios that can shift your body to burn. Earning primarily fat and key tones as opposed to primarily glucose, your body, always still burns glucose, but you burn preferentially more fat and Kitone bodies as energy sources. So you are trying to limit your sugar intake drastically your carbohydrate intake drastically compared to what your normal diet is so that your body starts burning, your fat instead of glucose for energy. You start eating yourself, instead of, you know, so you, you always have a baseline glue. There's very powerful homeo- static mechanisms that maintain your blood glucose, and that doesn't go down much. But what does go down as the big spikes in glucose, the you get postprandial Ellie? They are virtually abolished or significantly attenuated. So the suppression of the hormone insulin is what happens when you follow the diet and by suppressing that moments on that liberates more fat for fuel for your body, and fat fat burning in the liver produces the things called ketone bodies. And they can largely replace glucose as a primary energy source for your brain. So over time you have what's called ky-ko adaptation, and your brain adapts to using this fuel in place of glucose, and you are essentially resilient against hypoglycemic dips during the day, which would trigger cravings. So that's why it has an appetite suppressing effect. So producing a calorie deficit and maintaining that deficit is a bit easier on low carb, just because you are more resilient to periodic episodes of hypoglycemia. So just putting it in lay terms. This thing that would happen to me where if I would get panicky like if I don't eat, I mean read is really almost a panicky feeling. I think your blood sugar must be very low crisis situation. It is. And if you if I didn't have some kind of granola bar, or something in my purse, or my glove compartment you feel like I don't think I'm gonna make it to the McDonald's wherever wherever you're going. But is that what you're talking about? You don't get those kind of spikes, you feel like you have to eat something right? Yes, it doesn't completely abolish that. But by shifting by making key tones available to your brain that basically attenuates that crisis situation. If you didn't make tones and there is a disorder where you can't make tones. You actually fall down go into a seizure because your brain starved of energy, but it basically ensures that you have steady fuel flow to the brain, I would argue that that's almost a natural state. We would we would ease in and out of Kito. Depending on food availability, like our ancestors did so to completely silence that through eating carbohydrate meals throughout the day. That is a bit unnatural so periodically limiting glucose availability, and making your body more metabolically flexible. That's actually something. That's it's actually pretty natural that we largely don't do today. So, so that's the theory behind the idea of this. Kito genyk diet. But Angela have you haven't you seen this just take off in recent years? I'm one what do you think caused that sparked this craze now? Oh, that's a really great question. It's been interesting. Kind of watching it. I think from our perspective. I've been working with Dom here at USF for cl- going on decade, a decade kinda crazy and it's funny because, you know, when we started it was something that really wasn't a mainstream word. I mean no one really knew about it, and now like you mentioned it's. Literally everywhere. Everyone's Keeler celebrity that started maybe science Friday this. I mean, talked about David Ludwig, who basically is at Harvard and does carb key to genyk diet, but that's not Taylor swift. No, honestly, you know, actually, Dr Doug casino, Dom, here actually was one of the really early scientists in the kid genetic space that started kind of speaking on a more mainstream platform to talk about the science that we're doing and the work that has been done, and people are interested. I think I think a lot of the interest has come from unfortunately, a lot of individuals have tried perpetually to alter their diet and lose weight, and get healthier and see themselves failing at that endeavor every year and maybe are interested in just learning about a different option that could could work for them. You were on the Joe Rogan podcast and that has millions of listeners. So that really would have helped to get that going, and the Tim Ferriss. And that was years ago, and I the Google trends, kind of shot up because his followers tend to be very you know, they they're kind of like, a, a group of people who really share this information. So it started taking off around that time. And I don't think it will be a fad because it works, so whenever you have something that really works and their science behind it. So not only is Google trends going up, but the PubMed articles are skyrocketing, probably edited for. Research published peer review research is going on a trajectory. That's probably a sharper inclined than the puppets, or so. So it'll be that science that will basically help to promote the diet, and but the influencers were doing it probably before the science. Bell. So you're a dietitian. So talk to me about this as a lifestyle, when you glance through the reviews of the Kito diet, cookbooks, hito dight books and you see referred to as a lifestyle more than a diet. What does that what are they talking about? You know, I think it does become a diet. I mean a lifestyle like Don was saying, because you have to be conscious of it, and I think I'm really sparked by what you said that, you know, feeling like you need to eat feeling like you had the short amount of time. Well prior to being doing Kito diet. I think that what you also learn you're actually we're not going to so the number of restaurants that we have are not separating us from starvation. They're just feeding us when we probably don't need to be fed. It's like when I was growing up, and we would be out and about. And I would say, oh, I'm thirsty. My mom would say close your mouth and mixed bit. Don't say that's where kids anymore. We give them a water bottle. It's probably not necessary. But I think that it becomes a lifestyle in. It's something that we've seen to as your. Watching the growth from the scientific community. Pollock communications, we work with today's dietitian to do a survey of dieticians every year. And the ketogenic diet was not even on the trends list seven years ago. So we asked them what's trending in nutrition. What are you hearing from your from consumers, and patients seven years ago, it didn't even make the list a couple years ago it appeared and this year, it's number one. So we've got Keough genyk diet still plant based in the third is now intermittent fasting, which is similar to what you were talking about as well. And I think that we've learned that cell turnover might not be what we want to have aggressive be so aggressive about we don't want to be feeding all of the time. And I think it will be a lifestyle change, because we do have this people might breakfast and brunch. And we have the five you know, square three square meals. That is that's gone surveys showed that snacks are what people are doing. And a lot of that. Driven by millennials. Some lentils are choosing health wanting to get healthier. Owning it more than previous generations and then also snacking throughout the day. So maybe paying more attention to their hunger. But then also, enjoying like smaller bouts of food throughout the day. Let me ask you something about that survey. So number one trend and they surveyed hundreds and hundreds of people over a thousand people this year, we had close to two thousand Titians respond number one trend is the Kito diet number two is is plant based eating and three was intermittent fasting. What I wanted to ask you was, how does the plant based eating fit in with key dough? Now Kito is all about meat and fat. So is it harder for vegetarians to be on the Kito diet? Isn't it interesting? Because it while the Kito -tarian diet, that's interesting. So the Kito -tarian diet is looking. How can we achieve Kito service, but emphasize, our fats from plant based sources in a void? I think that early on Kito diet for weight loss was a salami-and-cheese diet. But now it's not necessarily that so there's books written now and cookbooks to go with them that talk more about how do you get more, all is how you find how do include avocado in different recipes rather than just emphasizing a high-fat animal fat source or choosing to, to have meat so plant based in clean eating or the two things that kind of like intersect this intermittent, fasting and Kito craze. And this, you know, the, the excitement for Kito genyk eating, and you'll see that in the supermarket. You see it in restaurants that and actually Forbes magazine this week, said that the is the diet of the year, like two thousand nineteen will be the year of Egan offer me, and that's well. Well, and it's interesting, right. Because a lot of foods even still don't wanna talk about. When you know that there are that a recipe is beginner vegetarian. I have a client, that's a plant based food, a commodity food. And they said that you we are going to have lots of recipes that are vegetarian, but please don't call them that it's interesting. How we are contradicting ourselves? Well, another thing I wanted to bring up from that survey was that in the survey of the food, purchase drivers taste came in at number four food, taste was number four number one was convenience than healthfulness, then cost, then finally taste this is phenomenal. And maybe it's just in the world of nutrition trends, but we think it's, it's that's never dietitians are hearing from consumers now that healthy is more important to them than how something tastes. I think that it's hard to know what, what drove that. Certainly, it's the recognition that food is not just functional. Food is not just medicine. Food is like the solution to wellness. I think that's where we're moving now more towards thinking of it is whole body health rather than just I have this, I will treat it with this, and it is. Yeah. It's, it's, it's very interesting that the changes that were going through with how we've you food. So we posted on WSF's Facebook page, saying we were doing this show on dieting, and asking for people's experiences, and Chris cowl wrote, here's a radical idea, exercise and eating a well-balanced diet. That includes plenty of vegetables. So thank you, Chris for writing, and that makes sense. Of course, you know, Dom, why can't it just be that simple yet and it can be I think people make diet little more complicated than it needs to be from a medical standpoint. It's unfortunate that in a at a med school that they get. Very little nutrition education, doctors do. And that's that's shoot nutrition is the foundation of wellness. So the information that we're putting out there is probably not, not very good that, that people are looking and reading, so I it really depends on the demographic. So we talked about taste being driver in number four, but I think taste may be a number one driver for a fairly large demographic of people who just reach for things that look good. So I don't know where those numbers came from, but that kind of popped in to my mind, but there is definitely a shift towards using nutrition for wellness, and that is not reached the medical schools yet, but people are taking sort of their, their health in their own hands and learning about nutrition, and what would be ideal to eat. And when it comes to, I guess, weight Loss' too big thing you know, many people can lose weight. The problem is. Keeping the weight off and sustaining that weight loss over time. So for my perspective, just shifting from a western diet to a whole foods based diet, that does have, you know, veggies, and fruits and veggies, and whole foods, instead of processed foods is a step in that direction if you are impatient and wanna lose fat as fast as possible, and get your body weight under control and maintained, I think a low carbohydrate diet. That's devoid of processed grains, and sugars is a step in the right direction. And Kita genyk diet is an extreme version of low carb that could also be a it's more of a medical diet, that was based for seizure control. But is also a version of the diet that worked remarkably well for weight loss and also blood glucose management. So there's different versions of, of different diets. So there's many forms of Kita genyk diets, there's many form, you could do a plant based Kita genyk diet, those one of our first blog articles in Cuba. Nutrition website that I have. So really, I think the, the guy has a very good good suggestion there. But it may not be feasible for everyone in the population certain demographics to base, their diet off fresh vegetables, and fruits, they just may not have access to it. You know couple points there, so the Keno diet discourages fruit and a lot of vegetables, because they have carbs banana, I realized a banana every day. Really, what is it up? Thirty five carbs or something. And that's what you're supposed to eat in a whole day, like thirty five carbs. So that was disappointing and apples, and lots of things have high carbs, sweet potatoes, which are so good for you. Or high carb, so parsnips which I love. So a lot of the things that are healthy. If you're on Akito genetic diet, those are also high carbs at that's a little difficult. And also, you mentioned demographics and you know. I'm a little frustrated because my husband and I went on this died at the same time, and he immediately lost twelve pounds and I am female and lost if I squint at the scale. And look at it just right. I might have lost pound. So I think that men and women are definitely different when it comes to this diet. Angela have you found that, you know, I think that's probably true. I think more than anything, there's just a unique response that any individual, we'll have some people do seem to respond very well to the ketogenic diet. But it's not always the case, it's not a blanket, I think one size fiddle, it's all thing. And I think, you know, to what dome was talking about customizing the diet to something that is doable, sustainable for you individually and does that mean setting your carbohydrate intake at fifteen grams of carbohydrate. Are you able to do that and maintain the benefits that you want is your, you know, your health markers that you're looking at or those improving like you want them to be or may meeting your goals because some people can have higher carbohydrate intake, especially if you're young. Or you're an athlete, a lot of individuals actually that are athletes in doing Kito are still actually consuming a fair amount of carbohydrates, especially timed around their their exercises. So I think that, you know, thinking about the ketogenic diet, as kind of this very, very strict. It is, but you can incorporate a fair amount of vegetables. They might it might not be the whole plethora vegetables that you're choosing from you might be doing a lot of, you know, leafy green high fiber vegetables and less of many other colored vegetables, you might have more berries, as opposed to, you know, bananas. But I think it's, it's something that is quite customizable, and people can find what works for them. Just a new thing to think about. Yeah, I guess once you get used to it, it gets easier and angelie you've done research on breast cancer. Right. And the Kito genyk noise. So actually most of the work that we've done with cancer is with brain cancer. So. Brain cancer. Yes, we are doing a study currently on breast cancer model, but ketogenic diet, as a potential advent for cancer therapy is actually a really hot topic in cancer metabolism research, right now, there's a history, going back at least fifteen years of preclinical studies, and now we're seeing small case case reports and small clinical trials looking at this intervention. And we there's definitely a lot of really encouraging preliminary work sh-, suggesting that there might be a nice place for this. So promising work on humans or just lab. So in lab rats and mice primarily we are now probably have about twenty five when clinical trials clinical trials like throughout the United States, like registered clinical trials right now using the ketogenic diet, either as a standalone, when chemotherapy has failed or most likely as an agile. Event to existing forms of therapy for everything from endometrial to, you know, lung cancer to a lot of brain cancer studies. So, yeah, when I got into this maybe one or two registered clinical trials and now about twenty to thirty registered clinical trials and it takes a long time for these trials to be completed for the day to be written up. So over the next five to ten years, you'll see the all these dozens of studies that are currently going on, you'll see the data sort of hitting PubMed, and we'll get a general consensus as to as to the efficacy of and what types of cancer, it can be efficacious for. Okay. So the idea is that glucose feeds tumors. Is that it and then cutting back on, does that simple that insulin's a major driver? So if our insulin levels are high pretty much all the major drivers of cancer growth, and proliferation or linked to insulin signaling, like the PI three kind as studies that were published like New York Times published an article about a particular drug class. It's very promising, and that drug actually does not work without the presence of Akita genyk diet therapy, along with it. So, so that's very interesting. So there's a there's therapies that are out there that may not be working that in this case very promising therapy by a Louis Canley, that is actually much more. Efficacious efficacious. You know, it's not at all until its utilized with Kita genyk diet. So that's a very promising area of research is using this diet to sensitize tumors. So that other forms of therapy can work so to further augment that their efficacy of existing therapies, okay. But we really haven't seen the clinical studies come back, yet, you're just saying he's promising the animal work. The pilot studies in a few clinical trials that have been published. Jen up people often fail to keep their resolutions be. Because they create a goal of weight loss, but they don't create an action plan to get there is that one reason that people don't lose weight. I think that, that's that is part of it is having I think if you want to build a house, you wanna make sure that you have the tools to do so. And actually there's a lot of things available to us now. So registered dieticians throughout the years of always recommended a food journal, it's still considered a great tool to have a diary that, where you can actually like observe what you're what you're consuming. Now, we have apps so we have apps that you can use to set your goals and track, what you're eating, and, you know, all over the place, whether sinking with your watchers independence. I track bites or something online that you can use these tools are simple, but it is really helpful to have something prepared. So I think recipe books are still valuable I think a lot, a lot of people are also using Pinterest to get recipes you think recipe, that's on a tool it. Absolutely is because when you're. Faced with a grocery store purchase, and you're not you're sure what you're going to eat. You know, go back to, you know, we're progressing in the science, what we go school when we want to apply it. So we want to look at meal plans. We want to create a grocery lists. We wanna look at how do we journal what we consume so we can kind of be like be visual about what it is that we're consuming and see where we might have some differences in what we eat. So there's a lot of there's a lot of things accessible now. And I think that that's part of it. I think the other pardon in setting a goal. However, is we so often set a goal to quit something and without proper replacement quitting is awful it when it could be awesome. Actually, I've, I've actually I signed up for an iron man that I didn't do, and I felt awesome not doing it. You know. So. Really? I have done a couple, but I would I didn't show up for this one race. However, I understand. Sure. But having positive behavior so instead of saying, what do I wanna cut out? Or what do I not want? I wanna lose we say, this is what I want to add to my life. It's like when people are looking at smoking, cessation, pick something that you add cause disease prevention is drilling not going to get you there. I'm adding more time I have less of this to worry about, I have, you know, so looking at how can we make this an improvement rather than a a punishment? And I think being specific also helps if you think, well, not, I'm just gonna lose weight this year. But by March fourteenth. When I go on vacation, I want to lose ten pounds. So you, you know, your specific about what the goal is when it is, it doesn't maybe that also can help so we really haven't had the Kito giant Kito genyk diet around. You said seven years ago, it wasn't even on this list of high. Weren't hearing their consumers talk about it. So what I'm wondering Dom is has it been around long enough to look at long-term effects, especially a strict ketogenic diet, where you're not eating a lot of freidan vegetables? So good question, and I think it needs to be carefully examined the long term effects of the diet. I mean, we do know the, the mayo clinic sort of worked in a stylish this diet in the early nineteen twenty s and it was the standard of care for epilepsy until drugs came along, and then it was revived by Jim Abrams. Charlie foundation, Hollywood producer. And then Meryl Streep did a movie about the Keita genyk diet, who's called first do no harm. Many people know that Meryl Streep was advocate of the diet and did a movie about it, and then people started following it. John's Hopkins started putting a lot of patience on. And we have records of those patients over decades of time and followed them after a genetic profile or lipid profiles, things like. That over time. And generally speaking, all biomarkers go in the right direction, so paradoxically triglycerides go down. When you do Akita genyk diet, especially in adults because your body in a normal diet, you're eating carbohydrates. So if you eat fat your blood fat, stay elevated over time. But by suppressing the hormone insulin if you eat fat your cells become hungry for fat, so we pulled it out of the blood. So triglycerides tend to go down. You tend to have a mild calorie restriction that helps the silicate that he mclovin. Onc- goes down h s c reactive protein or inflammatory markers, go down, which is a good thing and insulin to goes down in HDL or bad cholesterol, or good cholesterol, rather tends to go up a little bit. What one biomarker that is of concern to a lot of people is LDL cholesterol. And they're the sub fraction of LDL, the larger more fluffy molecule tends to be the one. That's. Dominant. The elevated in people who are on these high fat, low, carb diets, and, and it tends to go up and doctors tend to worry about the elevations of l the L, but in the context of other biomarkers going in the right direction. I don't think there's a concern for that as much of a concern that there that there needs to be. But in some people, it goes up really high, and we don't know what the elevated LDL means in the context of a low carb diet, because the studies have not been done yet. So they have that looked at the rate of heart attack, or stroke in that population as it been any different or anything. It was has there been any alarm bells gone off, not with the clinically implemented ketogenic diet, which is, you know, has helps a lot of patience. There is data by several groups looking at people who were obese and type two diabetic to begin with, and because the key to genyk dialled them to lose weight and maintain that. We lost our regulate their. Glucose, their outcomes are more positive. But if you take an everyday healthy person, who's Atlantic, and then follows a Kita genyk diet. That's a new scenario that really didn't exist before. And I could say, I'm generally always a healthy weight, although my weight's kind of higher, but my biomarkers for health have improved over time, and a lot of people dozens, if not hundreds of people that I communicate with that are not using the Kito diet for the metal coal management of something just for, you know, athletic or just to have more energy, their general, you know, biomarkers of health looked to be good over time. But I do think we need to fund to study for things that are not necessarily medical management of something. But I think the weight loss data and also the work that is published on verte health website. They are using a low carb diet for carbohydrate intolerance, essentially type two diabetes, which they. Have demonstrated you can control blood glucose in type two diabetic patients in about eighty five to eighty seven percent of the, the cases either. Get them completely off insulin or drugs, or significantly, reduce it over time using an at base system. So essentially tracking which is super if you don't examine your diet, it's really hard to make improvements. If you don't know you know what you're eating to begin with. So you really need to examine what you're eating and track it, and then I think that gives people sense of control and I think that goes a long way, independent of Kito or any kind of specific die, if they just track their food, and they have an idea of what they're eating. They tend to be more successful for their goals. But if you do that combined with Kito, then I think you can really make a lot of weight loss. And I think that's part of the popularity. I think that millennials and younger are really liking this mindfulness side of things. And that's part of this diet. It. You're actually because when you said, you have to track, what you're reading your actually sort of paying attention to what, what you're eating sort of like on a kosher diet, or something, which people who were on at feel that it's a form of mindfulness and appreciation of, of what you're what you're eating Jenna as a dietitian. What do you think people should be cautious about going into something like this? Well, I think it's always important, too. I mean, obviously talk to your, your healthcare professionals. You know, it's always important to keep your doctor up to date, even if he or she isn't really up to date on their nutrition knowledge. I think that seeking guidance from a registered dietitian is extremely helpful. I think that doing, you know, self study makes a lot of sense, too. Because again, it gives you that sense of control, but we can all be expected to become experts is interesting right that we expect for everyone to be experts in nutrition. But yet, if something goes wrong with my plumbing. Nobody expects me to know what to do with it. And I mean in my house that was a dietitian joke there. But anyhow. It was a good one. It was a good one. It was very it was organic as well. You know, I think that I think we have to look at what we're eating I we need to figure out what our goals are. And I think of the Kito genyk diet or any extreme weight loss diet is a huge shift in what you're currently doing is you have an issue of harm reduction where you are that you're, you're trying to address. So is your blood glucose been diagnosed his high at rest? Do you have a blood pressure issue? Is it a lipid profile imbalanced that you're dealing with are you, overweight in a way that's actually going to affect your health? That actually is going to contribute to metabolic syndrome, in some way, and then looking at which diets or lowering your, you know, your intake, and then you can look at the macro nutrients you can, you know, I people always ask me that there's gotta be a right and wrong. And whether you like it or not, there are million different diets to be healthy on. So people are like, oh, God. The paleo that's bad, right? No probably not. And for. For someone else, you know, Mediterranean with the emphasis with some grains are going to also be healthy, a dash diet, that helps you reduce your blood pressure that has a diverse number of foods in it, too. So it's kind of like what dominee Angeleri saying you do have to have some individuality here. And so if you decide to take on Akito diet, you want to make sure that you're eating, you know, sufficient calories, you wanna make sure you have sufficient food intake. So the, you are meeting your your nutrient needs. That's where a dietitian can be very helpful. You don't want to slip into that fear of eating so that you don't eat enough. And then you do find yourself with Teague door suffering from what happens if you have insufficient protein intake, and, you know, all of a sudden your hair's looking ratty, and you just you can't maintain muscle and you keep falling asleep. So you have to be it sounds exhausting, all of the individual factors that you have to consider. But think of it as like a new your next step in understanding, you know how your body functions. Don't go crazy. So, but when you see the weight falling off, it is really encouraging. And I, I don't understand the difference. Like, Dom talk about how you eat because it's not just the Kito genyk diet. It is this intermittent fasting. That's also popular now in other words, don't feel like you have to eat breakfast, because it's breakfast time. Think about whether you really are hungry. Yes. So on the weekends I pretty much eat, whatever I want when I'm hungry. And yesterday was a weekend and I didn't have my first meal until one PM, and I had a salad, I tend to eat more vegetables on Akita genyk diet than I did on a regular western kind of diet in, in the form of salads, and I had grass fed beef. I buy from company called butcher box. And as I tend to be a little more mindful about the types of foods that putting into my body, as far as the types of meat and the types of fish and the types of vegetables to. And I feel that if the nutrition content of the food that I'm eating is high that tends to signal my body that it's actually in a fed state that the nutritional status, I think if our nutritional status is high, and we're getting the nutrition that we need we tend to get less hungry. And, and I also feel no. No doubt that a higher fat meal has satiated effect so you can decrease meal frequency, and that becomes very liberating. So I'm not I'm not hungry. So if I'm doing something working on a paper or grant or I don't wanna take my mental focus off of that particular task. I don't have to take time out of my day to prepare food to eat the food to clean up after that's a good hour of time. So I tend to save a lot of time and I also feel like I'm a little bit. I have an edge if I'm a little bit hungry going throughout the day, not, not starving or not, not nutrient or calorie depleted. But if I'm just in a fed state from the day before, and I'm using sort of that nutrition. I feel like my body is being fueled off the food. I ate yesterday. Right. So if I have a big day coming up where I know going to be busy. I'll eat a little bit more the day before and I can fast throughout the day, and I feel more sharper, and I get things done better. So. Disciplined. One thing I wanted to ask you the whole point of the Kito genyk diet is to put your body into Kito SIS where you're producing key tones. Right. And these can be measured. They, they sell he strips that you can, I guess you in your urine. You'll blood so. Easy. We like blood. But, but what about just taking Kitone supplements? What about and then not worrying so much about cutting your carbs and doing all that hard part. What about just taking more key tones? And getting can you get there that way? Yeah. So that's actually something that we study. And the lab, we call them exhaustiveness Kitone. So the word exhaustiveness means from outside and dodging us would mean the key tones that you're producing yourself if you're eating Akita, genyk diet, and your body is making its own key tones and the liver from the fat stores on your body, but also the fact that you're consuming that would be in dodge, Annesley produce keystones and then exodus would be what you're asking about, you know, taking a drink, and, you know, the reason that these actually were developed is because over the past decade or so we've begun to realize that these Kitone molecules themselves actually have many benefits associated with them. So they're definitely a lot more. Than just a energy molecule that provides energy. They actually have signaling properties. So they for example, interact directly with our DNA to alter, gene expression. This is actually an aspect of something that's being studied as why they may impact Kito sus may impact cancer, for example, because you can literally alter the genes that are being expressed, and as we know, gene expression changes is a big issue in cancer. They also directly interact with other proteins within ourselves, and in our blood to suppress inflammation. So there's something called the inflammatory home that gets activated. It's part of our immune system. It gets activated and insights inflammation, and it's a normal part of our immune system. But in a state of hyperglycemia, so chronically elevated blood glucose, obesity. Many diseases aging, this inflame assume, is overactive and starts damaging our healthy shoes as well. And we just over the past few years have learned that the. The primary Kitone can't actually block assembly of that inflames though. Independent of diet like to add eating a standard diet, adding key tones as a supplement does. Oh, sorry. Up good. No. You're totally fine joint. So you're talking about disease. But that's even that happens in aging that happens. If you're, you know, obese or overweight, and you, you have these chronic inflammatory conditions always going on. Viral, you could have some kind of virus, whether it be, you know, HSBC or something like that, causing chronic, chronic inflammation, and yeah, HSEN, an activating these pathway or herpes, simplex virus, or Epstein Barr or, you know, various viruses, cause systemic inflammation, and environmental things caused stomach inflammation. High blood glucose causes them again, formation and activates, the hub this inflammatory, the NL our p three and that is suppressed with this natural metabolite that we make beta hydroxybutyrate. We could take it in supplement form much like we could take creatine monohydrate, a supplement form that is everyone would agree. That's the most effective nutrition supplement on the market right now for strength. Performance is creative monohydrate so key tones are a natural metabolite. So our body makes creatine. Right. And we could take it and supplemental form. Our body can make Kitone 's and we. Can take that and supplemental form in many of the benefits that we get from fasting actually may be from Kitone so yielded some research on that. And we collaborated with them and published a paper nature medicine showing that elevating that beta hydroxybutyrate suppresses those implant Matori pathways, and in many ways, mimics a calorie restriction, or fasting state, independent of that calorie, restriction and fasting. So that's a pretty profound effect. It was an animal models. We study supplemental key tones in the context of anti-seizure effect. So development developing them for warfighter applications, for example, preventing oxygen toxicity seizures. So most of the research that we do is funded by the navy. The, the office of navy research to develop these what I call the fourth macro nutrient. So you're macronutrients Ray are fats proteins. And carbohydrates key tones are calorie containing energetic molecules with very powerful signaling effects that. That can be used as a fuel in alternative fuel for the body and the brain, your brain has incredible metabolic flexibility, and can run off glucose or key tones, as it does fasting state, but we can give exoti- key tones as an alternative energies, substrate much like a hybrid engine of a car to fuel our bodies. And I would say, importantly, as we age research shows that our brains become less efficient at burning glucose for energy. So there's actually a lot of research in humans done by a colleague of ours. Dr Steven Cunene, and he has shown that in the aging brain, and this is true to an even greater extent in early stage dementia. Or for example, Alzheimer's disease, the brain becomes less and less capable of normal, glucose uptake, and metabolism, but seems to retain its capabilities of normally metabolising key tones. They are processed differently. It's a little bit of a simpler process for this for the neurons and the supporting cells in the brain to you. Utilize those key tones. And that might be part of why that's the case. But there's a lot of active research, showing investigating if provision of key tones may be an exhaustion, his form or through a diet induced ketosis to the brain as we age, and in those conditions would it help just supply energy to the are most energetically demanding Oregon in our bodies, which is our brain. So let me ask you can we take it as a supplement right now. Can we go into the drugstore and get he owns? What's it called? Yeah. There's a couple on the market key. Genyk says one Kito logic. There's a company called prove it, and they make a key don't supplements, the most effective would be a key tone, exoti- Kitone supplement in the form of assault combined with a Kita genyk fat like medium chain, triglycerides. If you take a Kitone salt by itself, it may not be as affective. But if you deliver it with a natural form of fat like MCAT's, you are naturally. Stimulating your own Kitone production with Kita genyk fats MC, teas derived from coconut oil, while delivering exoti- keystones at the same time. So it delays gastric absorption, sort of an prolongs the elevations and sustains the elevations of keystones in the blood. So from therapeutic perspective from appetite suppressing perspective from an energy perspective. They can be utilized in the middle of the day, they do not. They tend to actually lower blood glucose, so that many fifty percent of. The population above fifty or sixty have elevated blood glucose. So these are supplements that could actually be used to help regulate your blood glucose, too. So that's one of the more powerful facts of these. So would you lose weight? I believe that you would can you how, how can consumers? No. It's working. Oh, okay. So that's what Gary, okay? Yes. So consumers there Kitone supplements on the market. And the good thing about the Kitone supplements on the market is that there are commercially available blood Kitone meters that you can get any Walgreens or CVS that measure beta hydroxybutyrate, and you can consume the supplement and then measure the blood levels of beta hydroxybutyrate to confirm that you are indeed getting a product that, that has the active ingredient in it. So beta hydroxybutyrate there's a lot of science behind it showing that, that particular molecule has remarkable, signaling properties and can. Also energize the brain in ways can be a fuel for the brain. So it's, it's nice because I don't know of any supplements on the market right now where you can get a commercially available kit in for a few bucks, actually measure your blood to determine the levels in it. I think that's a very unique supplement in that way. Sounds like something that people wouldn't want to do, but you do surpri a fingerprint like a blood glucose. All about it. So people are they don't mind getting their fingers all over the place. Yes. So you don't feel it's a very small fingerprint and one drop of blood, and you put it on a on a little stick that goes into the meter the same meter that measures glucose Commissioner key tones, and Abbott precision Xtra meter and they're pretty much everywhere, and you can validate whether or not you're doing supplement is legitimate, but we have ones that we tested on Keough nutrition dot ORG, and this, you know, not all of them are created equal, so we only like to promote we don't sell any Kitone supplements. But we like to promote the ones that we think are efficacious. Let me ask you about that. So you have that website, Kito nutrition dot ORG. And when I clicked on it, I did see ads. So are you selling different things different products? And, and how does that work because he could be a conflict of interest in research? And then yeah, so we our universe. I work with a team almost weekly if not daily sometimes on conflict of interest up because the university of south Florida has various patents on Kito technologies. And although I do not own the patents. The university owns them. I am an inventor on them. And when someone purchases a product lake, he jenex, a portion of that the sales, actually go to the university, and the inventor, get some, too. So that is a conflict of interest. I like to donate the funds back to the university. So we can use the funds from those products to drive research. It's a relatively small amount and not all most of the products on there are not linked to any of the patents. Some some maybe. But we what we try to promote on that website is mostly sort of educational purposes, but the products on that website are things that we believe in the things that I personally use myself and a few of the products may be related to patents that are at the university of south Florida. All right. So I think we do have a disclaimer on there. But yeah, we should probably get that for for clearing that up. And I I'm getting the signal that it's about time to wrap up. But I have to ask when we're talking, I'm a food lover. We're going to be having a new food podcast coming out of WSF pretty soon. But when we're talking about food almost as medicine like we're doing doesn't it kinda take some of the romance out of eating, I mean, it's almost like having sex because you didn't get to the gym that day. I mean it's sort of a little bit. What do you think about that? You know, I don't think it takes all the romance out. I think it makes it part of your lifestyle. You know, I've done a lot of work with fitness professionals and presenting to personal trainers, and working with professional athletes, and they genuinely have a good time with it. And so while we might they used to be member. It was like the boiled chicken, the box of boiled chicken with them. So now there's a little bit more creativity. But it was something that they genuinely enjoyed they saw the difference in their workout like their own personal measurements. You know made a difference. You know, we do whether it's your workout like having these small changes in these small goals. And I think that are the population, even the, you know, gen Xers like me, we're working out at a different kind of level. Now, we're athletes in sports that we may have never even tried. I work out with a whole bunch of really fit people at the body shop and Saint. Petersburg, and they look for small changes. And so it doesn't it doesn't take it. All of the Julia child's out of it necessarily, and the, you know, sparks fun conversation. Oh, did you try this new kind of this new breakfast, or you know what are you eating? And so it's actually something that we've turned into something that might bring us together. They of it a different kind of enjoyment. I think the mindful wholefood eating can be and should be pleasurable. I mean, eating should be source of pleasure. And I think for me, the ketogenic diet is very indulgent, because I'm eating things that I avoided for many years like butter and fats, and things like that. Like, you know, the skin on the chicken fatty cuts me. So for me, it's quite an indulgent diet. And I think that actually for a lot of people switching to a more whole food based diet, or perhaps a kid genetic diet, what actually increase the amount of time that they spend probably cooking, preparing whole foods in that I feel like has Lada romance to it. It to and just being able to spend that time with your family your loved ones. Actually caring about what you are preparing and consuming yourself thinking of it as an investment for your long term health, rather than running by McDonalds after work. Angela poff is a research associate with US department of molecular pharmacology. We've also been with Dom Dagestan on a an associate professor of molecular pharmacology physiology at USF and a Kito expert and Jinnah Bill, a registered dietitian triathlete and a nutrition adviser. Thank you all so much for being with me. Think. Florida matters is a production of WSF public media. The engineer is Craig George. The producer is Stephanie column beanie. I'm Robin sussing ham. Thanks for listening. That was a long one.
Vaping- Lung Related Issues On the Rise
"This is Florida matters. I'm Robin Sesing. Ham for years using e cigarettes or vaping has been seen as a good way to quit with smoking but lately there have been a spate nationally of serious lung injuries related to vaping and at least thirty seven. People have died in Florida. There've been eighty-seven cases with one death. How do we measure the risks from vaping against the benefit here in the studio duty to help walk us through it? We have Kevin Sneed the dean of the University of South Florida's College of Pharmacy and Jackie Toledo Republican State representative for district strict sixty in Tampa. Thank you both for being here. Thank you for having thank you very much so Kevin. Can you describe for me. Exactly what vaping is says for people who might not know and what kind of injuries are we starting to see from it. You know we've gotten away from tobacco smoking and now we have a liquid that in put into a cartridge and when you heat the cartridge up in inhale it turns the liquid solvent into a vape is inhaled and exhaled in the same way. The the we have traditionally seen people do without tobacco smoking but now we had that cartridge full of solvent liquid is inhale the producer. Very heavy. Smoke is flavored and so over time people thought it might be a good alternative to smoking. But now we're seeing much more lung injury What kind of lung injury? Well tell you what that's all over the map right now in terms of the types of lung injury Right now the most injurious one is called Popcorn along we're really going and you kinda almost obliterate the tissue right there in the longest irreversible and we think that may be what is causing many of along injury around the around the country however there have been a number of other chemicals identify Formaldehyde has been identified in vaping a chemical called ACURA. Cleanest been identified So they're seeing some. It's almost like chemical burns in alongs absolutely to an extent prayer. We we can look at it. Maybe chemical injury injury might be a good way to put it. Yeah and even even getting to the point of DNA changes in the Oromia coast of the mouth. Now these there there have been around nineteen eighteen hundred cases across the country and this started around March this year Jackie you've introduced legislation That's related to vaping. Explain the bill that you're introducing legislature pink. You actually filed the bill last year and almost got passed it passed through the Senate so you follow this this bill last year before all of these lung injuries. Yes because I could tell there was writing on the wall that this is a dangerous product. And it's being unregulated. There's no education on it and parents thought it was just vapor kids thought it was just vapor and I knew that if we didn't act that it would become I'm an epidemic and it has become an epidemic and I just don't want to be I don't want Florida to be less than trying to solve and prevent these deaths and injuries from happening. So what is your bill do. You're not making e cigarettes illegal for adults. Are you know what the bill would do would increase the age of smoking and Vaping to twenty one it would make these nicotine dispensing devices part of the tobacco products so that we can regulate them like we do tobacco products and We added this year. We added the ban on the flavor of apes and we also including the smoking of medical marijuana as well to twenty one. I know that Kevin a big concern with a dating and with e cigarettes. I'M GONNA use that interchangeably Spin the children using it down to middle schoolers. Even it's gotten so popular. I think I saw a statistic. Maybe one in in you know twenty five percent of high school students now are saying that they've tried it or or they're doing it absolutely. Let me go back just for a moment in the we knew years ago they even nicotine nicotine in a very young age could lead to some type of All the way called brain injury but but what we call the prefrontal Cortex of the brain and so now. We didn't have a lot of people smoking at that time. Now that we've had a lot more middle school and high school people smoking now. The interest in terms of what the nicotine I'm doing to the brain What is happening in terms of development of the brain and what would that lead to later on in life That's becoming more of an issue. And so I I agree completely. We are having young people period whether it be a eighteen or below Just shouldn't be smoking at all. Okay so you're interchangeably saying thank smoking. Let's keep it to smoking. Well I'm but I'm actually think smoking is well because you know the initial studies that were done actually did indicate indicate that just smoking the nicotine in a cigarette. Smoke could have An effect on the brain and the developing brain of of an adolescent. But we didn't have a lot of people smoking now. We've had many more people doing vaping and now we're going back and having to re studying re kind of reevaluate where we are with nicotine in the developing brain of adolescence. All the way up through eighteen. So I'm I'm putting smoking and bathing in the very same category for young people. Okay Okay and this is where it gets kind of complicated because there were a lot more kids in high school who were smoking cigarettes Now Teen Smoking working levels are at an all time low and some people say. Hey you know maybe you know. VAPING is a lot safer than smoking cigarettes Some studies say ninety five percent safer. And that's we're talking about adults So maybe it's helping the teen. Smoking cigarette smoking looking levels. Come down because they're trying you know vaping well let me give an alternative thought to that. Even you know several years back back in maybe twenty twelve. I went to China and I saw a factory where they manufacture the e cigarette juice and I became very concerned even back then about the solvent. No we forget that we're dissolving nicotine into a liquid that we have to be able to heat up and not have it exploded in your face and not have it burn your mouth and then the volume mm-hmm of of of inhaling far more than what we were doing even with a single cigarette and so even though we may have seen more smoking a cigarette. Smoking with children holdren earlier many about a decade ago. I'm really concerned about not just only the chemical but the volume of chemicals that were pushing across the long. Because if you walk around you can see people know they have a very very big vape machine and it has a Lotta juice. And they're inhaling in just an enormous amount is this regulated at all well it's not regulated and that's part of the problem right now. The FDA has not come in and put any stipulation on on identification of the chemicals that go into the vaping the cartridges. Let me just go with you Jackie for a second because one of the things. I think that we want to talk about is selling to adults versus kids vaping. which is what you're wanting to do with your with your legislation? The question I have is right. Now it's illegal for minors under eighteen right to be sold. vaping products e cigarettes is that right. That's correct okay so eighteen and under shouldn't be vaping right now at all You're changing but they are. They are they are in big numbers. So how is changing the the age limit Mitt from eighteen to twenty one going to stop them from vaping when they're vaping now at age at a cutoff age of eighteen so Right now does a great question right now. We have about one hundred and sixty thousand eighteen year olds in our high schools so this bill is about access and they. These kids are getting these products from their peers. People that they're in school with their brothers and sisters So if if we just re Increase the to twenty one will result in a fifty five percent reduction in tobacco use between eighteen and twenty and about a sixty one percent reduction in children fourteen to seventeen tobacco. Use Your meaning us both And you had mentioned earlier the trends of People Smoking Kids Smoking and You had mentioned that it was increasing. It was actually decreasing. If you look now I said Said we're at I said we're at historic lows for teen smoking. Yeah and it has been Trending that way for many years we were at a all-time low of eight point eight percent of of Kids highschoolers Smoking and that's when I believe and I think it's because it wasn't cool to smoke. People had that so it wasn't socially acceptable to smoke so now they came up with a new product. The same companies as big tobacco companies came up with a new product. That's cool they they targeted young people with the flavors of Cotton Candy. They started creating these ads that had younger people in it so it made it look like it was cool. It's on snapchat. I mean I. I know they've pulled a lot of this marketing and advertising to young people but they have they pulled they'd be able to because we started to want to regulate it. We started pushing for bills So it goes hand in hand. They May self-regulate but we also need to have some sort of legislation to protect our youth. And that's what this bill will do And I I truly believe that increasing see the age of smoking and vaping In anything putting into your lungs will help decrease the access that they have I worry arena. Let me let me add a quick point. Well because you know when when electronic cigarettes I came out. We weren't having all the flavoring that we have right now but as time went on we saw much more flavoring. Now we really questioning whether or not the flavoring leading to some of the lung injury and so I know the FDA has paid particular attention to that you were asking the earlier you know right now and the adulterated cartridge of the pupil just injecting their own or making their own getting. You're getting off the streets. We're finding a UH of vitamin E. Samples for example in these conscious that about. I rented all that vitamin E. Tape. Acetate what wildwood someone be would buy that like. What's the what's the attraction putting vitamin E.? And your vaping healthy or I'm not really sure what the attraction for that has been finally. Yeah they're finding in a lot more of the adulterated products and as a result of that We're finding a lot more injury and it hasn't always been that way so there has been a mark transition and wherever we started maybe ten years ago to now but we are here now. I'm very very much in favor of everything represented the Toledo was doing. I WanNa talk about the flavors favors. You said that they've started flavoring more and The thing is the flavors are popular with adults too. I mean you say Cotton Candy whatever you know is marketed marketed towards kids and it does sound like it. But as a matter of fact those are the popular flavors And so some critics say will banning the flavors that are popular for adults for the fruit flavors. And saying. Hey we're going to ban those flavors first of all who decides which flavors are acceptable which flavors art and then second of all If adults can't have the flavors they like and they're told well you can only have nicotine flavored tobacco flavored vaping. They might say well. You know what I'll just smoke cigarette then and that's really what doctors are trying to get the patients away from. I mean I understand that There's a lot of concerns with minors liners and children doing this. They shouldn't be smoking cigarettes either. But this has been a godsend to a lot of adults who had very hard time giving up cigarettes and and we're able to ingest the nicotine through vaping and get off the cigarettes so you make a good point it was meant to be a cessation device. But it's not acting like that because kids are starting to vape because of the flavors if you are a cigarette smoker then you like the smell of tobacco Baco you like that. So fruit flavors are actually the most popular across the board. It is I. Would I mean if I was a smoker. I'd rather smoke mango flavored than I would tobacco flavored flavor. But if you're used to tobacco flavor and that's all they had then it wouldn't be a problem to go to a tobacco flavored vape. But now you have a as you said Ed about fifty percent of high schoolers have tried vaping because of these flavors. Not because I mean you can't show a child here's taste this and it's tobacco no one's GonNa try it right but adults might not like it either and there's also the concern that banning the flavors will make the black market. What we were just talking talking about these adulterated substances more attractive because that's where they'll be able to get what they want So if you don't have the regulated flavors that are popular that that people want US vape including adults than they will be driven to. That's just another concern. They'll be driven back to the black market. I know there may be a possibility but right now now we're dealing with a potential public health crisis and so therefore regulation must take hold When you know that you have a looming problem you act? I'm glad that we have people in our state that are doing that and more importantly I think along with that would go enormous amount public health education. We need to re educate people about that and then we need to encourage the FDA to potentially go in and actually regulating and know exactly what chemicals are going in there is no standardization of the types of chemicals and solvents that are going going into the cartridges. Maybe we need to start there and maybe we need to make people aware that if you don't have something that's been approved and we can identify exactly what's in there because we do have regulation and maybe you put yourself at risk if you do go to the black market and so I think we're headed in the right in the right direction. I think public health issues should always rise up and I think regulation solution is needed. We're going to take a short break right now. You're listening to Florida. Matters will be right back. This is Florida matters. I'm Robin says in Kaman today. We're talking about e cigarettes it's an vaping. My guest in the studio are Kevin Snee- Dean of the University of South Florida College of Pharmacy and Jackie Toledo Republican State Representative representative for district sixty in Tampa. They want to read you. Something Michael Seagull. I don't know if you've heard of him. He's a professor in the Department of Community Health Sciences at Boston University University School of Public Health. He's tobacco researcher and he's been Anti Tobacco advocate for for many decades and he's frustrated with this anti vaping vaping movement and he says that in and with the cease frustrated with the CDC because he feels like the Centers for Disease Control is sending muddled messages ages. He says instead of fearmongering the CDC's should be giving useful advice at a minimum. It should warn the public not to vape. THC oils second. And it should cost and caution against using any oil-based illiquid product third should advise people not to use any e liquid. Unless they know what is in it that is do not buy products on the street stick to products being sold at retail stores especially closed cartridges. Where there's no risk of contamination He says unfortunately there's there is such an anti vaping prejudice and growing bias against the use of e cigarettes for smoking cessation. That many are hoping to to be able to attribute these cases traditional nicotine vaping so he's frustrated with the muddled messages that that he says the. CDC is sending. What do you say to that well until we can figure out what's causing these illnesses? We should send a clear message. You mentioned a muddled message and that's what's happening is is children. Parents of these children. Don't know if these products are bad. They can't tell whether something was store bought or bought at off the Off The street so if we Santa Clear message either banning the flavored vapes because maybe there are flavors that are non harmful but there are flavors with the chemical combination that is causing these injuries. But until we identify them we should protect the public. And that's what we're trying to do and maybe reintroduce reduce them back to when we can Say they're safe product protecting the public. Smoking is the biggest killer. The biggest preventable killer of people in the United States but it takes decades before you get cancer and then you have cancer which can be treated. I now L. People are smoking. I'm vaping for two years and dying after two years of Okay we're able were vaping for How many years before this this crisis came up this started in March and it's been linked to THC adulterated THC product? So what what about going after these street products rather than going after the industry and Jackie another thing I wanted to ask you because You know you are you're a business owner What about the businesses? What about all these independent small vape shops that would be hurt by in your legislation? Will I think there's parts of the legislation that could help these vape shops for example. I think it's best to have The vapes sold only in vape shops. Not at the convenience store where you are mixing children and no one's asking what age you are but if you're only going like a liquor the store you have to be twenty one to inter liquor store or be accompanied by parents but the the clerks are notified that look at the age of the person buying you know be more aware whereas in the convenience stores at the CVS at the at all stores that sell these vapes. They're not looking at. That'd be checking idea checking. I I believe that part of your bill. That is a consideration that we're having but I'm speaking to all the stakeholders because no I'm a small business owner you know. I believe that there is a an audience for these products and and it can help some people but it's being targeted to our youth and that's what. This bill targets is eighteen to twenty one and the banning of flavored vapes. which I think is what attracts young people to these products? But like I've I've told vape shop owners I've told Different coalitions have come to see me. I'm open to suggestions but we have to do something you know. You can't walk into any grocery store and pick up any product and without seeing everything in every T- every known chemical that's in our food supply but right now we have no a`regulation we have no idea. We have no identification of the chemicals that are actually in in the vapes because they haven't been regulated and so I agree with Representative Toledo that we should get to a point of once we begin to identify with a safe where does not safe when we can have regulation that will make everybody identify exactly. What's in all the vape cartridges? Maybe we can again process of thinking about trying to reintroduce it but right now without that level of control we have our is a public health crisis so so Kevin. You travel a lot and I know you speak to people Your colleagues overseas that are in pharmacy academia as you are in the UK. They have very different ideas about this than we do. They they The medical associations in Britain feel that vaping thing is far safer than smoking They feel that the actions and these warnings in the US are overblown. Why do you think they're so such a cultural difference between the way they're looking at it? They think we're in sort of panic here about vaping. I don't know the overall statistics if what we have going on in the UK or or anywhere else in Europe up where I can tell you that Very often culturally the way that they are approaching it the way that they may be approaching adulterated products and black market product. Probably far far different than what we have here they have you know generally find much more open market over there. You have a much more open healthcare system over there and so you know I think driving having things underground probably has a lot more injury. We've identified that That thc laced products probably have caused the majority of the injuries. But but we don't know that for certain Whether or not that will be the case in the UK European anywhere else around the world. One thing that we do know is we have a public health crisis here in our country and we need take every measure that we can Put out there to protect our citizens and especially protect our young people. I think the difference we have there is is that they're taking. Maybe maybe there are more smokers in Europe. I think there are always been more smokers than you're interested in the other country and filters I mean and they're looking at smoking as much. We talk about a public health crisis. I mean some of the some of the CDC numbers that I was just reading before was that smoking. Smoking has killed more Americans than all of our the wars combined. They also say that more than ten times as many. US citizens have died prematurely from cigarette here at smoking than have died in all the wars fought by the United States. So when you're looking at at smoking four hundred eighty thousand deaths deaths per year they're linking to smoking You know people have differing views on this well again we talk about the acuity the acuity of the situation. Asian right now Ten years ago we didn't have people waking up with popcorn long ten years ago. We didn't have people dying. We weren't identifying the fact that flavored vaping and was an issue but now we wake up in a very short amount of time. The acceleration of the desk is really what we should be looking at. Not just the raw number as representative Toledo mentioned earlier in Can take you ten twenty. Maybe thirty forty years before you develop lung cancer from smoking a cigarette but all of a sudden people who have been vaping raping for a very short amount of time are going into the hospital. They're going into the ER and they're dying and so once you identify problem. I think you know you don't stand back and wait for more more of a problem to develop. I think you take action especially when you began thinking about the long term ramifications of what it may mean for child you know a fifteen year old right now we. We don't want them having a public health induced problem at age thirty that we could have taken care of today and I think that's why I'm very much in favor of what we're doing. We have to of course from an academic standpoint. We need to do far more research in this area. CDC does not have all the answers right now they don't know what you're chasing down But every day hey we wake up or getting more information I can tell you right now. My biggest issues the fact that the chemicals and the vaping alter the DNA in the the mouth. And that's telling me potentially ten fifteen years down the road. We may have a whole litany of people that have oral cancer and nobody may remember member that it began fifteen years earlier because they were vaping so I think we need much more research in the area to make sure we're identifying the problems and if we identify safe areas and maybe we can be going to reintroduction campaign so Jackie Your legislation is catching on the hillsborough. County Commissioners just approved a new ordinance That raises the legal vaping age from eighteen to twenty one years old makes it illegal for stores to sell products to underage customers And prohibits anyone under the age of twenty one from even possessing vaping device or other paraphernalia. So I think a lot of parents might look at this and go you know this is just another away from my child to get in trouble. you know what is he. He's gotTa vaping device and now he's going to have a record for the rest of his life because you know a Half the people in his high school or doing it and now he's GonNa now it's going to go on his record and now what Are these too heavy handed. I mean if I'm a parent CARAT and I have five children. And if this could save their life then yes I'd rather them have and you don't know what kind of penalties this would have have on it so I think right now. We're just wanting to send a clear message from what I understand. I'm you really concentrating on underage underage but You're also feeling that this is just unsafe devices. So I mean would you just like to see this whole thing taken off the market and done with in a very dangerous question to ask a healthcare care clinician. I mean there. There's a whole host of things that we have out there that we from a public health standpoint. We see its potential being jurist who a lot of people however I will say that We can start with children and we can protect our children if we can start there Then we can begin in a continuing education program program for adults. I mean we have no. There's no different than than a heart disease you know. We know that there's a lot of things out there that can contribute to heart disease. But we're not going Out and telling people you can't eat red meat and you can't you know we're not trying to regulate you know people from going on themselves. I mean but we but we do understand however however that that that there's a lot of things that can contribute to to heart disease But here we have an opportunity to actually you re educate people about what what should be safe. We have an opportunity to protect our young and we have an opportunity to really go in and do research early on before it becomes uh-huh numbers very similar to what you quoted around so you're smoking do think vaping can be made safer. You know I can tell you right now. Back in two thousand twelve when I when I saw the device zone I held great hope for the actual device itself but I had concerns even back. Then I have concerns almost eight years ago now and I still have the concerns. And I think we're waking up in those concerns are being realized and I think there can be a good thing that can come from uh-huh understanding the technology better but we must do the research in order to get there so that we can have a safe product on the market for people that's Kevin and Snee- dean of the University of South Florida College of pharmacy were also talking with Jackie Toledo republican state representative for district sixty in Tampa. Thank you both so much for being with me. Thank you very. There are lots of ways to connect with us. You can tweet us at Florida matters or find us on the W. USF facebook page. You can listen to Florida matters whenever it's convenient for you as podcast. Search for it and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts Florida matters. This is a production of w U._S._F.. Public Media the engineer is George Goblin. The show is produced by Christie. Oshana I robin sussing Ham. Thanks for listening.
How They Got There: Shannon Bream
"I walked in and head of HR was in there, which is not really ever good sign when you're the boss's office, and he said, listen your the worst person I've ever seen in. You're not ever gonna make it. Everybody can Coleman here and it's a special episode of the show, very excited about this. We're gonna bring this to you every once in a while on Sundays and see how you like it now. Why are we doing this? Well, the answer lies in the what are we going to be doing on this Sunday, episode of the podcast? What we're going to do is do something that I love to do, which is give you great conversations deep conversations for years at Ramsey solutions. I've had the opportunity to host the entree leadership program where I do deep dive conversations with some of the best men and women in all walks of life that our leaders high performers at. So we want to bring that element to you. But with the specific filter of people who started out. And they had to face fear doubt failure rejection Unum. It the things that you're facing or the things that you have, they face it, and yet they stayed the course because what we are about here is encouraging you and equipping you to be everything you were created to be you were created to fill unique role. It is needed, and you must do it. So here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna bring you some deep. Dive conversations, are I is with none other than Fox News channel's. Shannon bream, the host of Fox News at night, with Shannon bream, weekdays eleven pm, the twelve eastern time, she's also the chief legal correspondent on Fox News channel, and her story is eerily similar to mine. You're going to hear her story more important. You're going to hear some things that will really encourage you any quick you on your journey, if Shannon could do it. So can you. Here's my conversation, wishing bring well, Shannon's good to have you with us excited about the new book, finding the bright side, the art of. Chasing. What matters that certainly is a big part of our discussion day-to-day with callers here on the Ken Coleman show, I wanna get into the book, but I also wanna unpack your story for our listeners to be able to see the path is possible, because you made some real changes, and I want to have you take us back to your successful, lawyer, and things are going great. You're doing something that you're good at in that you enjoy. But you decide to make a change take us to the beginning of that transition before it ever happens. How did it begin to reveal itself that there was a change coming gonna lie? Even when I was in law school, I had serious, gal spend the next forty fifty years of my life practicing. I thought it was good bait for any number of different things, I might do, but even that I I'm not sure this is my calling to be a traditional in the courtroom for the rest of my life at that time. I already had all of these feeds of this passion that I have for telling and current events. The news and it wasn't sure how that would ever all come together. But as I was practicing law and say, yeah, you know, this is a great career. I love the people. I work with. I don't really love what I'm doing. I think there's got to be something else for me. And I really my husband and I talked about it, and I prayed about it, and I always have been this current events junkie love the idea of working in news. But I had no idea how to get started because I wasn't a communications major in college at a business degree in a lot of gory. Though, I just started looking around to talk to people who already in the business, who are already successful to see what can I learn from them do they the crazy idea will they gave me a little bit of their time. Can I take him to lunch and just kinda pick their brain? And it sort of started that way. This is the audiences laughing with me, this is what we talk about every day this idea of coffee or lunch just to begin the process of running. What it's like, now I let's go there. So you begin to have these conversations and as you begin to learn more about the industry from people who were in the industry. What happened to your head and heart? Funny thing was I wondered if I needed to go back to school to get a whole new degree to start from scratch, and they talked to people in the business. They were nearly unanimous in telling me, no and your case you're already a professional. You're almost thirty years old. At this point, you've got experience under your belt, I think for you to, to take two three four year. Step back to go to school, pay off as much in your scenario as if you just found a way to get in the business now and learn from the ground up. So that was pretty consistently, what I was told into that set me on the next step of this journey, which was finding a local station, where was practicing law. Tampa, Florida, that would allow me to come over and shadows, and people are intern and everywhere that I went people said, you can only do it for college credit. So I thought, okay here I am back at the square one issue again, I started calling number of schools in the area and saying, can I come through your program, take college credit for this class? So I can go working newsroom, and I heard no over and over again. And I just was convinced that there was a way around this problem. So I went to the university of south Florida. I finally got through to the dean of the communication school there. And back when faxes worth thing, which is saying, how old I am I faxed over all my transcripts for my undergrad for my law school. So they would see listen. This is serious students persons the professional, and I finally got a meeting, and I just was not gonna take no for an answer. The dean was wonderful. And I said, listen, I will do whatever you need to do to come through this avenue. I can't go back to school for two or three or four years. Not practical for me, this point. So we made a deal, he said, you need to take, at least in news writing class, let you do that, remotely the online. And with your professor directly, you can work that out, but you got to commit to that. And then I will authorize these three credit three to go an internet at TV station at night. And that's what I did. So I just kept going until I found the one person who said, yes and so. Now, you're in the building, and you're interning, how quickly did it confirm for you that your heart was, in fact, absolutely on the bullseye. This wasn't some fantasy. This was something you really were enjoying. I knew pretty quickly. I'd say within a week or two. I know this is what I'm gonna do with my life. Now, everyone around me the bosses and the other real reporters, and people who work there who actually knew what they were doing. I'm not saying they knew they were convinced had a lot of convincing to do, but in my gut, and in my heart, I said, now, this is what I feel passionate about this is what I wanna do. I don't know exactly how I'm getting get there. But I'm just going to keep fighting to get those yeses along the way 'cause there are plenty of knows along the way. Most of the reporters, and people they're kind of, like, what are you doing here? Who's this grown woman, who's coming here, I would grandma intern because everyone else is like twenty years younger than needed in their interning, but I would go to any reporter or for takaful or any producer who would give me a few minutes of time, or let me go out and shadow them and say, can I come with you, and take note, and a lot of people didn't want to babysit, you know, thirty year old who's trying to break into the business. But there were handful of people who said, yes come with me, I'll show you how I find a story how I interview someone how we should stand up, what we do. And one of them is a great friend still out there. Elaine Keno, who actually moderated the vice presidential debate last time around the election. I mean she is somebody who helps people along the way and his risen to the top, or solve. And she was somebody who literally looked at me and thought this woman does not doing, but I'm gonna help her and she was very kind to do that. And one of the photographers I remember who helped quite a bit. I said to him. One night. Let me buy you dinner while we're out doing this thing. And he said, no, I don't want you to do anything for me. All I want you to do is promise me that when someone comes to you for help, you'll open the door and give them time and do the same thing. And I've always remembered that, that's really good. So what was the timeline from the moment that you get in there? And you're doing all this learning and shadowing learning learning learning, and you get a moment to practice or to perform where you get a chance to get on air. How did that come about? Well, I was doing the internship kind of sneakily at night, while I was still working at my law firm during the day, trying to figure out how did you this transition? There wasn't a lot of sleep during that time. But you know what? It's like when you're excited and you know, you're on the right path, you really don't flip a lot. 'cause you're, you know, you're willing to invest everything and making this move and it's it's not easy. I don't wanna sugar coat it for anybody and people out there who may transitions or started their own businesses. They know how much it takes out of you. But when you love it, it's worth it this Akra Feis, and that's kind of the place. I was. For several months at eventually at the end of my internship, went to my boss, there TV station. Instead, I'm going to tell my firm leaving and I can't wait. I'm going into the world of broadcasting and do's. And he said, no one offered you a job here. And I guess, but just attend to Kelly, I'm stepping out on faith, and I know this is where I've been end up and within a few weeks. He did have an opening for a glamorous overnight to AM to eleven AM job answering phones, making coffee writing scripts for the morning show. And it was a, you know, big pay cut from where I was at the law firm. But I said, I'll take it. And so that was my ground level in the door. And as I got to work there, I continue to say to people who would let me go out with them on weekends or anything else. Let me learn from you, and I would take my work to the boss and say, I know that this is very beginner level work, but I want your input on my writing. When I got a chance to shoot some of the stand ups things on camera. I would take it to him and give me your feedback and. I had a couple of people the station that would do that for me quite a bit. And they knew that I wanted to eventually worked to a place where I could be on air. So I've been there few months as an actual employee, after my internship when I came in one day, and there was a note in my box. It said, if there's breaking news and there are no other reporters, everyone else is, you know, there's no way for them humanly possible to get to the scene, and you happen to be working or going to let you try this, and I said, I'll take it. And that was that was my first shot you are in the right place. You stayed there. And in the right time found you debts. What we preach all the time. That is so good. You're joining the conversation with Shannon bream of Fox News at night with Shannon bream and the new book, finding the bright side, the art of chasing what matters here on the Ken Coleman show and siriusxm Sheehan. So now the opportunity presents itself. I just I wanna hear the emotion because you have really paid your dues that I. Opportunity. Get on camera happens. Do you remember the emotions before and after I do, I was super nervous but I think I also didn't realize how much I didn't know which is a good thing. Folks ahead, still excited about something you're pursuing in life when you're going on sheer determination and excitement. That's a good thing that you don't know everything that you're going to have to figure out or that you don't know on the way. So it was a good mix of feeling. Like, yes, I this is gonna happen. I've got my shot being a little nervous just because of the unknown, but also just blissfully unaware of how much I didn't know and I remember the very first report, they let me go out and do about something that was going on in Florida with standard standardized testing in high schools, and some disputes over how the testing was going, and parents upset, and teachers upset, and that kind of thing, so I learned everything I could put together all my information, and that I hit, I think within the five AM our, the local show somewhere around five thirty, and I remember my husband said he would be up to watch me. And I was so excited, and I got there and I spit out all the information, of course immediately call him afterwards. How did I do what you think? And he's very diplomatic but he's. A terrible liar. So that's good quality and a husband because I could tell you trying to be very positive, but I definitely had moved from it. So, you know, I got all the content the information out, but I didn't know yet how to be conversational on camera to, you don't have a conversation with the viewers, I think it was a little stilted and a little robotic. But I knew the feedback. And so when I first started getting those opportunities every Friday, I would go to remember my shift was over and pull all the tapes from that weak. If I'd had any chance to reports, and I would watch them and take. No. When you see yourself. It's painfully clear. How much work you might need. Yes. But it was the worst you've ever done the first time is the worst time if you're going to be committed to learning like you were I won't people understand that it's going to be the ugly duckling situation when you go back and look at my first radio show she and I gotta tell you, I don't want anybody to hear it. What I mean they vote like. Don't ever find my old. Nobody wants to see that. However, here's what I want people to hear you went and kept working on it. And yet, even though it wasn't great and you had so much to learn, they didn't say, all right. Shannon, we gave it your shot, you're done. They kept giving you more shots. They understood that you needed to get better. And they saw you getting better, and it was just Knesset. And like I said, just sheer passionate about being excited about the opportunity and knowing that, you know, sometimes you get it wrong. But you keep fighting and you go to people around you who are succeeding, and you drink in their constructive criticism. And you take that for what it's worth, and you've got to be willing to work on yourself because sure I mean everybody thinks the one I should be at the best opportunity. I should be at the top of the by should be network, Dr, you know, you're just a little bit deluge delusional about the whole thing. But being honest enough to say, you know, an humble enough to say, I've got a lot to learn how can I get better and just to be committed to working on it? Even now I mean, I'll see things and things I could have done a better job with that. Here's a note for myself next time around. You know how long did it take you from this moment where we've been hanging out that I operate in Tampa to actually get the gig at Fox News? Gosh. I mean, let me think it was well over ten years trenches. There was a lot of opportunity to grow and to learn, and he was a thing that was the toughest some of the toughest part was right in the beginning because a few months after starting at that station at Tampa, my boss, and his boss left. There was a huge management thing with happens in the world of broadcasting. Sometimes everybody is cleaned out in one day. So the mandate in my missile chance at this Jeff, godless was the news director there. Well, he and the general manager of the station left and you don't get a lot of explanation. What happens that there's been a change in management? And so everybody in the place freaked out all of the experienced reporters acres, because they've been through this before, whether it was at that station or another. One. They were experienced. And they said when a new person comes in, it's really bad. And I thought, well, I'm still doing the initial original salary I was offered for this to eleven AM position. I've taken on two or three additional duty producing them doing some reporting when they will for no money and I love it. I'm the happiest person here with these horrible hours. No pay. So I thought, I'm not I'm not worried. I'm safe. That was a mistake because within a couple of weeks guy came in and GERD having meetings with everyone. And so I got called in on a Friday afternoon. And I thought you know what he's probably gonna promote me seeing like bring your pay up to, you know, the place where you are now. And all these new duties you take on. And I walked in and head of HR was in there, which is not really ever good sign when you're called the boss's office, and he called me, and he said, listen, I don't know who it was a good idea to put you on TV. You're terrible. You're the worst person I've ever seen, and you're not ever gonna make it. So as long as long as I'm here. You're not going to be on screen ever again. And I really hope that you're a better lawyer than you are reporter because you need to go back to that. See now that's that's not even feedback now. We've gone into Napa know Phil very putative show. Like, wow. You're just trying to completely destroy my spirit at this point. This is don't let the door hit you on the way out. So I, I had a guy tell me in Atlanta. When I was just getting started that I didn't have the talent to be on air a number seven market. I mean just destroyed me. Roy. Dis thing. That's good about radio and TV stations is that they're edit bays, that are soundproof 'cause you gotta go in there and do your work on the material. And I found one that was open. And I went in there and cried for an hour, maybe two and I thought I, I thought maybe I flown up my entire legal career and made a massive mistake here. And there were people in the news room, who had said to me, you don't belong here. I worked ten or fifteen years to get here. And those people were sort of now laughing as I had to gather my things, and we've it was humiliating, but taught me so many things because it made me do a gut check and say, am I gonna try to prove them all, and I gonna be honest about how much I need to improve or am I gonna let him be right? And give up on what I believe is my passion and my dream from the Lord and kind of pack up and say we're done and I was determined that I needed to. To get better than I needed to be honest with myself, and that I needed to use that as fuel to propel me to the next thing. So and also to not hold the job, so tightly and find all of my identity, and that's a huge issue in a problem. And when you have a job that can be consuming twenty four hours a day, seven days a week to really hard and it's a constant experience of reminding yourself at this is not yourself worth, this isn't who you are. This isn't your identity. And so this is not something I still struggle with all the time. But from there took a month before anybody would even talk to me about another job. I mean I send out resumes, and DVD's, and I mean to market, two hundred market one, I mean, nothing was too big or small willing to tackle it, and nothing crickets chirping and a whole time. I'm saying to myself, okay. I may have to go back to practice law. I mean, you know, there are build the pay and my husband was incr-. Credibly supportive and said, no, we're going to give this time. And I believe that this is the path of guns, but you on and let's keep going with us. So for months, I would pray Lord. I know. And these experiences there is something I'm supposed to learn. So if you could just reveal that we can learn it to move on not exactly how it works. And so it wasn't until months later, I got two job offers at the same time one in West Palm Beach, which I loved and native Floridian. I wanted to stay there in the sunshine and one in North Carolina, which was an amazing opportunity much bigger TD market. And I went there had opportunities to move up there that were just doors that kept opening. And from there, I got a call from Washington DC to come work at the NBC affiliate here where I live now got that job. And while I was there, a very fateful meeting, which I believe is divine intervention. With Brit Hume, who has been anchoring special report, a Fox News and that was my step. My first initial step to getting into FOX, which was not an easy. Showed there were lots of fits and starts, but Brit was at initial contact for me to get their seek him out or was that a situation where somebody else said, hey, I'd like to introduce you to Brit. How did that happen? We know what had an agent, and she had been trying to get me into FOX for an interview for years at that point. And my husband who handles professional speakers had been involved with booking Brit for a speech, and it was a breakfast event and only morning than I the legal local late night news than night before. And because of a sporting event, as will often push back local news on Sunday night kept getting pushed back. So I didn't get home until between one or two in the morning. This breakfast thing. My husband Sheldon said you guys get up. You'll have a chance to meet Brit, you can make your case to him directly and no exhausted. And I don't you know, I'm not a morning person. I'm not gonna lie about that. I don't think this is a great idea. Well the next morning. Sure. Enough got me up to come on. Jane, you gotta go. Great opportunity on a couple of hours of sleep. I got all dressed up and fancy and went over to the sing and move program was running behind a little bit. So Brent was in the green room bit of a captive audience, because, you know where to go we go and there start talking to him. And my husband says, number I don't know if you would recognize my wife. She's a local news anchor here in Washington. And Brit, looked at me. Indirectly said, well, what do you wanna do? And it was just that gut check moment where I just I saw her and I said, I would love to come work with you at Fox News, and he sort of had a polite chuckle. You know, I get that every day, I don't think people understand exactly. You know, the level of what we do. But that's very sweet. Why don't you send he knows some of your work, and he told me about one of, you know, particularly unflattering resume tapes that he'd gotten and just sort of, you know, here's my address, and good luck to you. So I said, okay. This might be time for me to go for lock. So I did. And while I was gone, there was a conversation. That happened between my husband and Brit, which I had no cool about what it was. But when I watched back room, ten fifteen minutes later Brit, said to me when can you start and I it was such a big about face. I thought, what is the world happened? So I get the back story for my husband who says Brit is making conversation with him and says, well, does she like politics, she into that? And Sheldon said him well when she was in the Florida or would she was in law school in Florida? She worked in the Florida legislature on sort of a scholarship program in Britain. Wait a minute. She went to law school. Did you finish? And my husband said, yeah, she graduated with honors and actually, you know practice law. And he said, well, we'll go do you think she would wanna come to FOX to cover the supreme court for us? Speak for her. But I think probably she would say, yes, hot to talk about this and making Kelly had just left the supreme court beat to go to New York to do the morning show with Bill Hemmer and then, of course, worked her way through so they needed someone to cover the court and Brit, only wanted to interview people who were lawyers. So all of that was discovered while I was gone isn't the come back with a complete change. I know. But a kid, I hate I hate to keep talking about it. But that's why one of the reasons wanted to have you on the show is because I'm gonna people here. The proximity principle come in the life. And again, here you are continuing to stay the course you're in the right place in the business, and through a chance, conversation, not even a chance. We know that there was so much more going on Providence's moving on your behalf and Sheldon. Your husband has a conversation with one of his clients, who happens to be a mover and shaker Fox News. It just isn't amazing story. I love it. I love to love it. I want you to talk about the book. I love the title finding the bright side art of chasing. What matters what a rich title give us a summary of what you have sought to do in this book, and what you want readers to get from it. Approach out doing the book. I I don't I'm not an author. I don't know anything about this, so there were other people who really believe there was a book in there somewhere and had to kind of convince me and we believe at clearly that idea taking on things that are a little bit crowning because you don't know if you're fully equipped but being willing to kind of walk through the opportunity and have some faith that it's going to come together. And so I said to the folks, listen I would love to write a book, but I need to make sure that I can include a lot about my faith. It's driven, I think it would be something I'm willing to tackle and they were absolutely whatever stories you wanna tell, and however you wanna do that. So I include things about how I got to wear them at FOX and setbacks along the way, and I really tough parts of my life that darkest hardest moments in my life. And I do that because I, I know that every one of us will go through those, and I want somebody who picks up this book, who may be in that moment. Whether it's physical or financial, or just discouragment, or wheel lawf- in their life. To review stories and see how my faith and other people around me and just, you know, those things held me and sustain me through and got me through. And there is light at the end of the tunnel. And so I really hope it will be an encouragement to people. They're funny things. I'm not afraid to laugh at myself. So there's plenty of that, too. But there are some tidbits and things along the way that our stories from behind the scenes from the first time I interviewed the president and things that have happened at this your pre court. So if your news donkey, there's something for you. If you're struggling, there's something for you, if you just want to laugh and have a good time, there's something for us. So I hope I hope it will just encourage people, folks. I want you to get it because they need to hear it and see it. There needs to be a bunch of people that you are looking to ladies men that you can draw from say, hey Shannon did it. I can do it. I'm supposed to do it. The book is finding the right side, the art of chasing what matters. At Shannon bream on Instagram and Twitter. Facebook dot com slash Shannon bream TV she's got a live in the brain podcast for you supreme court legal junkies. That's, that's kind of fun. And of course, you can see her weekdays from eleven pm to twelve AM. I must tell you what three kids, I am long gone at eleven PM, but I do see from time to time on other things. The show is Fox News at night, with Shannon bream before I let you go quick word because you faced fear in, you face doubt, I think, at times, people think that when you get to a position like a national nightly show on FOX, those that you have mastered, the fear in doubt, I know that's not true. A final word from you to encourage people who are a little bit gripped, maybe a lot gripped by fear and doubt. You're absolutely right. And I the younger person with look at somebody in my position now and they've got the world at their feet. They have no worries arrived. But I think everybody will tell you that even when you get to what you think is your dream job, or g dream life. There are still challenges. There are still those moments as you said, a fear of doubt. But you fight through them for me. I can't my blessings I thank the Lord remember the verse. He's not giving me the spirit of fear, but power in love and sound mine, and it no life is ever perfect. I don't care who you're looking out that out there in the world and what they've achieved everybody struggles and you will struggle, even if you get to where you wanna be, but they're such joy in the journey, and there as power to keep moving forward, confronting those fears working through them in one step at a time. Just keep at it, you'll get there. She said it will nothing to add there, she is seeing bream again. The book is finding the bright side, the art of chasing. What matters what a great great title and even better book that will encourage your heart, Andy quip you to make your own journey Shannon. We are so grateful for you. We know you got a lot going on. We're cheering for you here at the Ken Coleman show. We're grateful for your time. Candidate, a pleasure to be with you big. Thanks, Shannon bream for joining us here on the program. I love her story, and I want to make sure that you get her book. What a great encouragement, her story will be for you, as you read it in the pages of her book called finding the bright side, the art of chasing what matters finding the bright side, the art of chasing what matters it's in a line with everything I teach her on the show, and I want you to support her. Go grab the book at a really encourage you. Thank you so much for joining us on this special edition of the Ken Coleman show, if you like it, and you want more of this, let us know because we're here to serve you. Thanks for listening. We'll talk with you, real soon.