35 Burst results for "Tunisia"
You're Probably Not on the Side of the Good Guys When...
"I saw a tweet last night that got my attention. Yesterday we spent some time conservative amount of time, and we won't let this go the reporting from a freedom of information act request that suggests that American taxpayer dollars helped fund research that tortured beagle puppies in Tunisia with perhaps the NIH fingerprints all over that. And this tweet summed up the way many of us are feeling. The tweet says, when you're on the same side as the dude talking about Anthony Fauci, who approved beagle pups be locked in cages so their faces can be eaten alive by giant sand flies with the dogs having had their vocal cords severed, so they can not cry out in pain, you're probably not on the side of the good guys. And that line is sticking with me. You're probably not on the side of the good guys. If you're attacking police officers, who don't want to be ordered to get a vaccine. You're probably not on the side of the good guys who believe that parents have no right to have any say in what their kids curriculum
White Coat Waste Discovered Fauci’s NIH Division Funded Dog-Killing Experiments
"But this is sickening This is sickening and the fact that the buck never stops with Fauci is unacceptable It's unacceptable from the Wuhan lob You know the excuse always is that he can't be directly connected It doesn't matter Bipartisan legislators demand answers from Fauci on cruel puppy experiments The white coat waste group are investigators show that Fauci's NIH division Fauci's NIH division should part of a $375,800 grant to a lab in Tunisia To drug beetles excuse me To drug beagles lock their heads in mesh cages filled with hungry sand flies so that the insects could eat them alive Now most of the members who sign this letter to Fauci Republicans was a few Democrats so they all look at this it's bipartisan but mostly it's not A bipartisan letter demands answers from the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases That would be Anthony Fauci The white coat waste project the nonprofit group that first pointed out the U.S. taxpayers were being used to fund the controversial Wuhan institute of virology Now that should have got his ass kicked all the way across the country Have now turned its sights on Anthony Fauci and another animal testing related matter infecting dozens of beagles These are puppies With disease causing parasites to test an experimental drug on
Fauci Under Fire for Sick and Twisted Beagle Puppy Experiments
"According to documents obtained by a freedom of information request, white coat waste project and subsequent media coverage, from October 2018 to February 2019, NIA spent $1.86 million of taxpayer funds on drug tests involving 48 beagle puppies. The dogs were all between 6th and 8 months old the commission test involved injecting and force feeding the puppies and experimental drug for several weeks before killing them and dissecting them. Fauci funding experiment again in Tunisia, as we mentioned where they had to have starved, sandflies, beast on them alive. The invoice to the naid for the actual work was four or dect. Known as devocalization involves slitting a dog's vocal cords in order to prevent them from barking, howling or crying. Approximately 30% of all the promising medication have failed in human clinical trials because they are found to be toxic, despite promising preclinical preclinical trials and animal models. But 60% of the candidate drug fails due to lack of efficacy. The people who fund the torture of dogs should not be able to make medical decisions about your children. The people that have time and time again said that we want beagles heads to be eaten alive by sandflies in Tunisia, which again is something out of some sort of James Bond movie. What does that say for the type of leader that we actually have in the federal health bureaucracy? What does that say actually for Fauci and for Francis Collins themselves and now Fauci comes out and he says that he wants to have vaccines available for children than the first week or two in November. Some people are gonna say these two things are unrelated. I won't. Anyone who tortures beagles, I'm gonna stop listening to you about anything. Like you're a sick person. You need
How Dr. Fauci Funded Dog Killers
"Breaking of the weekend was a series of documents that were obtained through a freedom of information request. It was obtained through an effort to try and get to the bottom of the medical experiments or the medical experiments that Fauci has been conducting over the last couple of years. These documents came out and we learned that Fauci, personally directed the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, a division of the National Institute of health to repeatedly fund research where he placed sedated beagles heads while they were still alive in mesh cages and allowed starved sandflies to feast on them and eat them alive. Beagles they then repeated the test outdoors with the beagles placed in cages in the desert overnight for 9 consecutive nights. In an area of Tunisia where sand flies were abundant. Now before we go any further, this is something like a James Bond villain would do. This is something that in a halfway through the movie of goldfinger where they kind of come in and they zoom in kind of panoramic. All of a sudden the Bond villain is like torturing beagles in Tunisia. Like that's not that's not normal, okay? For the public health official. The guy that's supposed to be in charge of epidemiological spread, like, okay, we're gonna go torture dogs and Tunisia. They repeated the test outdoors with the beagles placed in cages. In the desert overnight for 9 consecutive nights the experiment was just one of countless tests. Done on animals with your taxpayer dollars, but when you go to work and you work hard and you go write that check to the Internal Revenue Service, you are funding dog torture.
As Tunisia’s President Cements One-Man Rule, Opposition Grows
"Two thousand and eleven revolution in tunisia triggered the arab spring and the country was hailed as a beacon of democracy. But now after the president's qeisi edge gave himself polit rule by decree two months after he sucked. The prime minister suspended parliament and assumed executive authority. Several thousand people have demonstrated against him in the biggest show of public anger since his coup. Well joining me. Eliza volkmann a freelance journalist based in tunis elizabeth. Thanks for coming on. How has tunisia reach this point. Since the heady days of two thousand eleven what happened to the democratic gains the the big problem in tunisia has been a downward spiral intensive While it's been negative economic development unfortunately The there's been a lot of problems within parliament's because the complicated list system has meant that this never been a majority policy. So one of the big problems politically is that you've just had this very kind of rambunctious politics point-scoring within the assembly and not the type of results that would have liked to
Nigeria Beat Liberia in World Cup Qualifiers
"News down African qualifying for the 2022 World Cup where the Leicester City striker Colecchia Natural scored twice for Nigeria, who kicked off their Group C campaign with a comfortable two nil victory of a Liberia well, Nigeria will be with that natural and other top players for their next game, however. As Cape Verde drew 11 with the Central African Republic is on the UK government's covid red list. It means that anyone entering such a country would need to quarantine for 10 days upon their return to their English Premier League club. The two time African champions Every coast were held to a goalless draw in Mozambique, sides kicking off their in Group D Cameroon had a decisive two nil win over Malawi. Also on Friday, Tunisia went top of Group B, They beat Equatorial Guinea three nil. Zambia defeated Mauritania and in the group G Open in South Africa were held nail nail in Zimbabwe, Ghana beat Ethiopia one
"tunisia" Discussed on Monocle 24: The Foreign Desk
"Even if they were happy to see the back of the parliament the question now is kind of where is this going and how with one person having so much power. What is he going to do without power if he's gonna come under different pressure pressure weather. That's because who's he's relying on for money or because he's faced with big problems and into satisfy people's expectations in terms of improving the economy which might mean that he starts to put up marrying protections around him needing to more authoritarian way of governing. Another worry that people have is the high side isolated. So he's he doesn't have a political posse. He doesn't have political allies. He founded ally in the military but since he's weak in that sense i think that is also a worry for people one in a volatile in terms of decisions to make but then also other people are worried that maybe even though who someone else will swoop in and then we'll be sort of coup on the coup. Let's talk about the party who have been abruptly ejected from power. This would be nada. How have they responded of putting together any kind of unified response to their removal from office or of a turning on each other in the grand tradition of recently ousted political parties response to this has seen niba lucien since the twenty fifth july. At first they much more confrontational the leader of the party. Who's also the speaker of parliament's rushed of new she. He went to the parliaments to demand to be latin and he was not allowed in by the army and then he called on supporters. Another piece to stage sit-in in front of the parliament officer during that the next day. The party called on that sports is to go home. And for memphis. Parsons taken a much more conciliatory approach and has called for dialogue. I mean speaking to within the posse is having its own internal problems which is not new in particular. There is opposition opposition to south. some members. feel that he's clinging to power that there's lack of internal democracy within the party and lost week. The posse had a meeting in which members even walked out and said that they weren't going to be bound by the decisions of that meeting and some members of also publicly asked for the party's executive bureau to be dissolved. So it's kind of interesting to see the these divisions which already existed instead. It's kind of being united against a common enemy. If you like. It seems to have really deep in those divisions and exacerbated the crisis luckily for rudy. Thank for joining us. You're.
"tunisia" Discussed on Venture Stories
"And so if it's real estate if it's actually going after engineers more specifically if it's kind of these other vertical labor pools like it just seems like there's a rig up is a great example like there's there's so much opportunity to create a type of network and that type of marketplace so that's an area that i continue to be excited to speak to entrepreneurs about have you looked at labor marketplaces. Or what's what's what's your take on what's going to work in you know in labor markets for this tunisia or not. I think there's a reason we're seeing a trend towards labor marketplaces in service marketplaces. And i think it is this arc of getting into closer and closer to the the transactions and closer and closer to the meat of what's happening at the end of the day it is about a human going and doing a thing and instead of saying connecting companies to like a restaurant to that in consumer eventually gets down to the actual labor itself. So i think it's an interesting category. We've invested in a company. Actually with benchmark called insta- work which is looking at labor market place in the hospitality industry. Feel very positive about but i'd say broader struggle with the where the exciting places thing because there are there are a lot of most vc's prognosticate quite a bit and are rarely three driven in some of them. You can read those pieces on their website. And so on. And i'm not saying that's the wrong or right for those firms. It seems to be the right thing. For at spark part of the ethos led to lead to a lot of new market creation. Companies is that we actually try to keep a beginner's mind about these kinds of things..
"tunisia" Discussed on The Daily
"Do gone he quoted charles de gaulle. And it wasn't for a while that i had a chance to break in and ask him some questions. And how did that go. Not so well. I tried to break in and say well. Can you explain what happened to us. The other day in terms of having our reporting interfered with. Can you explain what your vision is for the country and you explain how dissolving parliament and firing your prime minister. How does that fit into your view of the constitution. And are you sure that what you're doing isn't authoritarian. And he just wouldn't answer. He and his advisors kept telling me no. This is not an interview. this was just a meeting. If you'd like to arrange an interview we can do that later. On you can apply for that but this meeting is over. Wow so this meeting. In which the president summons you to insist that. He's not becoming authoritarian and that he celebrates democracy and yet he never lets you ask a single question ends up in a way reinforcing. The idea that actually he is tilting into authoritarianism. Well it's not totally for me to judge but as a friend said to me later on there's nothing like a monologue on free speech where the person you're talking to doesn't get to ask a single question. I think it definitely reinforced the idea that this president wants to do things his way and not be held accountable for what he was doing. As you said it may not be for you to judge as a journalist but it is of course for the people of tunisia. And i'm curious after all this time you spend in the country. What your sense is that. They have to say about the president's actions and whether they are democratic or democratic enough. So what do you think of president translated. I found that pretty much. Every tunisian i talked to we had to get the day to was pretty happy with what the president was doing waiting for. Defer these days you know people said great. Somebody needed to step up and come up with a plan. Nothing such an easy and somebody needed to bring these corrupt politicians to justice.
"tunisia" Discussed on The Daily
"This episode is supported by the lead. A podcast from wondering in the athletic that dives into the biggest sports updates of the day as told by one of the athletics reporters. The lead also goes beyond last night's scores to bring you the most interesting stories that take place at the intersection of sports and culture. All in about fifteen minutes for the next few weeks. The lead is turning his attention to the race for gold. in japan. follow the lead on amazon music. Spotify or apple podcasts. If you find yourself bewildered by this moment where there's so much reason for despair and so much recent to hope all at the same time. Let me say i hear you. I'm ezra klein. From new york times opinion host of the zircon show and for me the best way to beat back. The wilder feeling is to talk it out with the people who have ideas and frameworks for making sense of it from a days at the washington. Post to my time is editor in chief at vox and now as an opinion columnist the new york times. I've tried to ask the questions that matter to the people at the heart of those matters like how do we address climate change. The political system fails to act has the logic of markets infiltrated too many aspects of our lives. What do psychedelics teach us about consciousness. And what a sifi understand about our present that we miss. This is as ripon show. And there's going to be plenty to talk about. You can find new episodes every tuesday and friday. Wherever you get your podcasts. So vivian what exactly happened to you. What are these firsthand experiences. Well there were a couple of things and one led into the other. But i'll start with the first on wednesday. We were reporting in a pretty poor area of tunis talking to people about how their lives were going and how difficult it was for them to make ends meet. And i was sitting in a cafe doing an interview when the photographer i was working with taps my shoulder and said the police are on their way and pretty soon. These plainclothes cops showed up and asked if we were journalists and we said yes and they said that they would have to take us back to the local police station to make sure we were who we said we were and it didn't feel exactly threatening but i did know that before. I had even gotten to tunis. The local office of aljazeera. Which is the pan. Arabic tv channel had gotten shut down by the authorities. So we go down to the police station and we got a very strong sense that they were checking to see that we were journalists and not spies. You're being harassed. Basically it didn't feel menacing or scary in the moment in some ways it felt like a normal document check and they were nice to us by. They told us that we couldn't report in that neighborhood anymore. So they kept us from doing journalism right. And if you're evaluating evidence that tunisia maybe tilting towards authoritarianism. This is not a very good sign. It wasn't great. No but all the same. I didn't think too much of it and i wanted to. Just keep reporting but a few hours later i start noticing all these notifications from social media and people reaching out to ask me if i had been arrested and i think that's why i got the call that i got friday morning which was what so i got this call from the mysterious number and i picked up and a voice on the other end of the line. Said this is the chief of protocol for president k assayed. We would like you to please be at the presidential palace in an hour. Please dress formerly. The president would like to meet you. You being summoned by the president of tunisia. Yeah i was summoned by the president of tunisia and i wasn't appropriately dressed. What do you mean well. Let's just say it's very hot in tunis right now. And when i packed i was not expecting to meet the president i was expecting to cover protests so i get into a taxi and rush over to the presidential palace and luckily i had brought a button down with me that i could throw over my tank tops and after waiting a bit we meet the chief of protocol for the president. Who tells us this is how you will enter. This is where you'll will stand. This is where you'll sit. Please don't sit until you're told to. And then he looks down at my shoes which are practical sandals and i see this look across. His face of this is unacceptable and so before we go in. He brings out a pair of high heels for me to wear which are two sizes too big. What are you thinking at this point. What do you imagine. Your head is happening here. Well we had been asking for an interview and hadn't gotten anywhere. And so of course. I wanted to steer it into an interview and ask a few questions. But that's not what it turned out to be at all. What did it turn out to be. Well so i- clumped in and my two big heels and it's this very formal audience room where all the chairs are edged in gold and their chandeliers and it looks like a stage set and as it turned out. That's kind of what it was. Yeah there was a camera crew there and this meeting was hosted as a video on his official facebook. Page out of the cupboard mark and it turned out to be a lecture a lecture on the us constitution of all things dominate so. We sat down and the president starts talking and he doesn't stop these food. She's sitting very straight and or rating in this very resonant formal arabic student and he had this chief of papers to the right of him and one of them was this copy of the. Us constitution visit as for me and he even read some of it to me and french. Who sees the ferry lapeer and basically his point was. I'm not going to be a dictator. I respect the constitution. In fact. I taught the us constitution for more than three decades. I understand freedom of speech. I understand freedom of the press. And therefore i respect it in the tunisian constitution as well and the only reason i'm doing this now is because tunisia is in a desperate state mall about one hundred and just as abraham lincoln had to take extraordinary measures to save the united states of america so i have to take extraordinary measures to save tunisia during this moment of crisis. So almost compares. What he's doing to the civil war era in the united states exactly and at some point he quoted tocqueville alexis de tocqueville.
"tunisia" Discussed on The Daily
"In the sofia tunisia usually the herbal beta. I talked to women who who said that they saw neighbors. Eating from the trash told us my shit is gone or his garbage virtually gone because people eat independently and a lot of less dramatic examples of people who just said i need to leave. It's.
"tunisia" Discussed on The Lawfare Podcast
"He was detained. You know things like that that to me are not a good sign that he is heading towards a return to democracy again. It's still very early. So you know i think again. The west is probably waiting things out a little bit. I mean there are various things they could do. You have a lot of leverage from europe in particular where they can try to pressure a to stay the path of democracy to maybe allow parliament to operate while he's undertakings emergency measures. That would be a good start or to announce his roadmap tomorrow to appoint a prime minister. Tomorrow you know things that would be clear indications that he is planning to return tunisia to democracy gone. I think that would be very much in the interest of of tunisians and would help tunisia to keep moving forward and to address the challenges that it has right now in your view as an expert in this issue set. Somebody's worked for the united states government. What approach should the biden administration. Be taking to this challenge. Wait and see might might work for now. But what are the warning signs it needs to be looking for and what should its objectives be in managing its relationship tunisia through the course of this crisis. Is it necessary to end this action restrict this action. The focus need to be on preventing accesses by saieed like crackdown on the media or or major steps back in regards the civil liberties which the priority be. And how do you balance the different interests that are at stake here. So i certainly think that the us government is and should be paying really close attention to some of the warning signs of other red flags. The approach the media that i mentioned before the potential for the military to become politicized. That's another big one You know we've seen a lot of statements by human rights organizations on that you know this is just none of these are good signs that the path the signals that were seen so far do not point towards democracy or frankly to stability and i think this is a really important point that you know a lot of the people who are supporting sayyed believe that by taking on these extraordinary measures these anti-democratic measures that this is going to be what's best for governance in tunisia but the fact of the matter is that good governance comes about from good governance. It doesn't come about from hijacking. The political in from adopting anti-democratic measures cracking down against opposition. You know so. I think from the united states perspectives. They are certainly paying attention to. What are these measures. That site is taking you know and then practically when you look it against. The leverage of the united states has one of the biggest things right now is the millennium challenge corporation compact that was just signed into just about a five hundred million dollars compact that helps with development assistance to help improve the economy. Now that the morning challenge the whole premise of this is reward kind of the more for more principle that if you meet certain criteria including economic criteria but also political democratic criteria. You become eligible to receive one of these very large compacts. Now if you look at the language of the criteria that tunisia and every other country has to meet in order to receive this that includes very clear rule of law characteristics including an independent judiciary which if the president saying he is the public prosecutor. that doesn't exist. There's other factors that go into that. That would make tunisia ineligible to receive this money. So it's not just about punitive action. It's about legal action of what could actually happen if if president site doesn't return tunisia to democracy after this thirty day period. And the other piece of this. That i think is important to mention his idea. The term coup which you know is getting hotly debated. I don't think we should expect the united states to determine at this coup. This does not fall under the definition of us legislation regarding whether or not a coup occurred that that legislation really refers to a military coup. Which clearly this is. Not so i think the discussions about is this aku isn't as a coup. It's important to look at the law into the tunisian lawn to see you know if he's taking extra legal action..
"tunisia" Discussed on The Lawfare Podcast
"In the other part because it's led by a party at reflects political islam in corporate in. It's kind of party. Ideology how they reacted to this. How has this been played into the debate. Between those two sides and to what extent have they been involved in any of these developments to the extent were aware of certainly seen some allegations that the u. e. in other states were somehow involved with president. Besides move is there any evidence of that or reason to believe that might be the case. The role of the other arab states is really important in what's happening now and what may happen in the future in tunisia up until maybe a year ago to actually was pretty much exempt from most of the interference that we've seen by various gulf states by turkey and egypt as well. We've seen this obviously play a lot of other places including next door. Libya to the extreme but to for the most part had been able to largely avoid that sort of interference. Although certainly eric states were interested in either the successor failure of tunisia's democratic experiment. But what we're seeing now. I mean there's all sorts of rumors as you alluded to that. Perhaps the side against political islam that uae egypt saudi potentially were in consultation with present site. I mean he's there's certainly question he's been engaged with those countries and has close relationships with those countries. The question is did they. Did he consult with them about his potential moves are not. We don't know that's all at this point. We don't have any sort of real data on the other side you know not. Surprisingly the strongest voice against sites moves globally has been turkey who has really has called his aku and said that its anti-democratic and that was sides. Actions are are unlawful. So we're certainly seeing rhetorically the to this kind of proxy battle play out over the role political islam in tunisia but again it's the started a little bit before this conflict. I think the big question is going to be depending on which sarah ford which path side takes is he providing an opening for more influence by the saudi arabia and egypt in tunisia to the detriment of tunisia's democratic transition. Or is he going to be able to kind of keep those interests at bay one of the things. One of the allegations of corruption that he's really forward is foreign influence in foreign funding of political parties. What this means is is qatar funding nasa among other allegations. So he's clearly going to be very careful about any appearance of influence by these other countries. And i don't think he's sitting there waiting for pots of money at this point from you or saudi arabia but should things go south and and he being desperate situation. I wouldn't be surprised if we did start to see an influx of cash from the gulf. Of course the goal states the other states in the region aren't the only ones that have a vested interest in tunisia and the direction it goes politically. The united states has provided a substantial amount of foreign assistance to geneva over. The years has provided at least rhetorical support and beyond rhetorical support as well for tunisian democracy at various stages as have european allies and a brother states how they responded to this latest action and what sort of policy responses seem to be much like they might be headed down the pike. Now there are few days in so far. The west united states in europe have largely been pretty benign in their response to this. I think it's fair to say that the west is in a kind of wait and see mode they wanna see where site is going We've heard from the us for example that they don't wanna alienate their relationship with president side which is understandable..
"tunisia" Discussed on The Lawfare Podcast
"Of the military as you one of the things that's that's enabling him to keep going forward but so far i think they've relatively maintain their position as a political although again that's kind of the canary in the coalmine. If if the military turns of either direction. I think that'll be a really important signal to watch out for. I wanna come back to one of the other groups involved in this political debate that you've already mentioned but that plays a pretty prominent role in recent tunisian history and tunisian political scene. And that's not a party. That has kind of. I think it's fair to say been at the gram in of tunisian political discourse dialect for a lot of the post revolution period in particular russia ghannouchi. Who is the head of the party speaker of the parliament as you mentioned but as i understand it is also a leading. Kind of political theorist and islamic thinker. That has kind of tried to reconcile in not does islamic beliefs religious beliefs with a model of popular democracy In a way that is both palpable dinner national audiences that reinforces democratic norms and values and has done so by by many cops with some success. But this seems like a pretty major rebuke of nada and the role that they've played in the post revolution period. Not just in perhaps a nucci himself. How do they fit into this picture. How are they responding. And what does this mean for their. They're sort of legacy. Is clearly the main opposition forced to what site is. Do we think in part. Because they truly believe that what he's doing is is anti-democratic but also because they've become the main target of of the popular dissatisfaction being Has been a major part of all of the post revolutionary governments and in this past government in as i mentioned before they only hold about twenty five percent of the seats in parliament. But they're still the largest party in so the speaker of the parliament is honey. She from nasa. They are the most visible party when it comes to the current government and they've been at odds with president side from the beginning. There's been a lot of clashes over a variety of issues so here has a tremendous amount to lose and not frankly a lot to gain what we've seen it's been. i think. A little bit surprising is kind of the level of public vitriol. Against autho once all of this started to play out now. Certainly a lot of the in public wasn't really happy with before but it's as if sites moog's made it publicly acceptable for people to just go after enough to have primarily on social media. There's been a lot of just really angry. People who you know before may have felt that they weren't happy with them but didn't have the maybe the confidence to go out and express unin such a public and angry and kind of ugly manner. I would say so for nas. The big question is yeah. What's a teacher. What does the next government look like. Well enough to be a part of it at all. And i do think it's an important moment for a master to step back and say what did we do wrong. How can we make ourselves more appealing to the tunisian public each subsequent election. They lost a pretty dramatic number of seats. They came in the first election. Twenty eleven. with definitely the plurality of seats in and really by far the largest number so the question is you know. Do they change their tactics. There's been calls to remove from the head of the you know. He's in his eighties. People think he should retire. Let some younger folks take charge. And i don't know how that's going to play out. I mean they are certainly right now trying to figure out their next steps but the question goes back to you. Know will they be blamed for all of this for all the trouble for the ineffectiveness of the government. When again they were just one small party. In government certainly. They are to blame for some things. But it's not just an fault. There's a lot all the other political parties that were in there weren't able to accomplish anything either. And no tunisian government has been able to root out corruption has been able to tackle the economic crisis challenges that country faced since the revolution..
"tunisia" Discussed on The Lawfare Podcast
"Tunisia has suffered from endemic corruption under the bonaly era but that corruption really has not been addressed in the decade since the revolution. And so you know the one thing that we really knew about him when he came to power that he wanted to tackle corruption and that was his main campaign issue. That's obviously not easy to do. He has not so far had a lot of success. But what we've seen as we've seen the situation unfold engineer. This is one of the pinnacles of what he's trying to do. He has said he wants to personally presided over. The trials of many members of parliament who believes are corrupt. He wants to really kind of move forward in prosecuting. Some of the business community who thinks her corrupt into the corruption is the main thing that we know about him. What we also know about him is that he is very much against the current division of power and so again when he decided to consolidate power into his own hands was not really a surprise. He's kind of been forecasting this for some time that he believes that. The parliamentary system doesn't work for tunisia. He wants to use to return to a presidential system. He's floated the idea of returning to the original nineteen fifty-six constitution and so we've seen that he has you know he approaches politics differently than tunisia's previous presidents describe for us a little bit. What is exactly he has done to precipitate this most recent crisis and i'm curious particularly and particularly because this these sorts of issues tend to be of interest to law audience. What his legal argument is because he's got an argument about why what he's doing is consistent with tunisia constitution. Isn't that correct. Yes so what he has done is he has said under article eighty of the constitution. Which is one of the constitutional articles that he has the power as the president to an act of emergency measures and the article is actually quite vague. Mean it does say that the president in exceptional circumstances under imminent threat to the country can take any necessary measures so that leaves it pretty wide open of what he is allowed to do. However when you look at the full text of the article there's a couple of things that he is required to do as part of that first of all before issue before invoking article eighty. He is supposed to consult with the prime minister and the speaker of parliament. Now they are saying that he has not done that. He says he did. Before he made his declaration they say he has not the other piece of this is really important is that he is supposed to then at when he makes us declaration parliament is considered to be a continuous session. And the idea here. Is you know balance of power. Division of power that while the president is undertaking Emergency measures the parliament is acting in a still able to be a check on power. What presidents i did was the opposite where he decided to freeze parliament for thirty days in said that while these emergency measures are in place. Parliament is not going to operate and this was directly tested when after he announced this speaker of parliament. Russia ghanouchi is well. Some other members of parliament tried to enter the parliament building to kind of test whether or not this was actually happening and they were held back by the military who refused to let them enter the parliament building. So i think it's pretty clear that while saieed is saying that he is. His actions are backed up by law at the very least idea to. Parliament is in a continuous session. That's not happening now. The big kicker to all of this is that the body that determines whether any of this is constitutional would be the constitutional court. It's kind of the equivalent of the united states supreme court who decides whether or not actions that are taken our constitutional. That body doesn't exist in tunisia. There's been over the years since the constitution was written in two thousand fourteen all sorts of political infighting. That's prevented the constitutional court from being formed prevented parliament from green on the nominees. That they wanna put forward for the court and in the end just a few months ago. Parliament did finally come to agreement on their nominees and present site..
"tunisia" Discussed on The Lawfare Podcast
"Your keys on tunisia's democracy in crisis sir. Tunisia is a unique historical case. In a lot of ways it is really the one st that emerged from the arab spring of early in the last decade into what has thus far looked to be a fairly functional democracy with competitive politics political parties. Things along those lines but nonetheless it has faced more than its fair share of challenges and particularly in recent years. Give us a sense of the state of the tunisian body politic in the months and weeks leading up to this most recent crisis sure. Well i think this is a really important question because the idea that this political crisis started with president sides moves is just not accurate. You know the the political challenges the issues that brought about this the need according to the president to take emergency measures have been boiling four pretty much since the twenty nineteen elections that brought in this government in the first place and so what we saw was these elections brought in the most fractured parliament. In just history. Where the largest party. Which is the party at. Nasa only held about a quarter of the seats in the parliament and the rest of the seats were split up between a variety of parties including the introduction for the first time of two kind of extremist parties on either end on the one hand. You have the kerama coalition. Who is a salafist party. Who is to the right of nafta and then on the other side you have. The party led by nbc. Which is the free distortion party. That's calling for the return of the lira. Making argument that democracy is not worked for teasha. So you start off right away in two thousand. Nineteen when parliament takes it seat with this really polarized environment. Then you throw on top of that. The president present side who himself was an outsider. He was elected without a political party without any sort of real political experience in came in as a disruptor he kind of came in. Tunisia came to the populist wave that swept the globe a little bit late but he really represented what we've seen across the globe including you know. President trump united states and others in europe as someone that the people want they want change. They wanted an outsider. He was elected with overwhelming support. And then finally you add in the prime minister prime minister machichi who's actually handpicked by the president to kind of be his lackey. In a way us also technocrat was not supposed to be politically affiliated but right from the start when he was brought in in september. Twenty twenty machichi in present side just clashed even actively undermining each other left. And right really making it very difficult for anything to get accomplished. So this is just kind of this scene setter of what the situation was like as we came on to the situation. That's our on. Fold over the weekend. The person really at the center of this crisis is the president case. Sade who you mentioned before is it is a pretty unique political figure. Coming in to the scene as president without a political background without clear political support yet winning and overwhelming i think in the seventy percentile. Some are electoral win in two thousand nineteen elections tells about him. Who is he. Where did he come from. How does he fit into this political picture. Yes arizona's side was a political outsider. He was not someone for which a lot was known about because he is not a traditionally from the political system. He's a constitutional law professor. His nickname robocop. So what this means that. He is someone who was seen as a very stiff. He has this very kind of strict manner of when he speaks arabic. He comes off not as warm and fuzzy but was really respected by the people who elected him as someone who was going to tackle corruption. Tunisia has suffered from endemic corruption under the bonaly era but that corruption really has not been addressed in the decade since the revolution. And so you.
"tunisia" Discussed on Worldly
"To that by saying you know we want democracy to flourish in tunisia and we support it but like not really kind of coming down or condemning either side and you see this sort of almost frozen position from the rest of the world to be like We don't really know what to do and like fingers crossed. Hope everything works out. Yeah and i think you know. Honestly admit some ways. I think that is a good response. If the hesitance is about hoping that tunisia has to work this out for itself and that these are the kinds of growing pains that you need to go through in order to build democracy a having you know foreign powers like the us or france you know change the former colonial power france the obviously the other big player here in terms of weighing in or taking action having them like commend enforced. Something or you know. Try to force democracy like. That's not a good way. I think we've seen historically to get people to buy into democracy or to get democracy to hold together right like you need the people themselves. The parties play. You know the ones with power to be themselves bought in. You can't impose democracy from the outside again as we've seen historically and so i think in some ways it's it's responsible for foreign powers to maybe kind of take a back seat and go like let's just see what happens. There have been calls for. You know more forceful statements from the us. But again you know for me. I think one like i said it's it's too early to even know what's really going to happen. And the initial statement saying we support democratic principles. We hope that tunisia holds to those. There could potentially be a role if things started. Turn poorly of like helping maybe foster dialogues. I think there there are some ways. I don't think for an intervention or interferences always like horrible negative. There are ways that that foreign groups from countries or or international organizations that are not tied to foreign countries ngos to play a positive role here. But i think like civil society in tunisia needs to be the one to take action here. And i think it's probably a good thing that the us in france aren't trying to impose some kind of really strict ultimatum. We do this xyz policy or else it seems like allowing another country to handle some business seems like a positive development. So far we'll see. I think it's worth dividing the possible international responses and this picks up on on some of the things you just said jan but i wanna systematize it. A little mets. Do i liked the three three three different buckets right like the first one is some kind of coercion aimed at changing the politics on the ground by forcing one side in this case it would be the president to give powers through sanctions or something some kind of course mechanism and then that's it has a pretty poor track record rate in part because what you're doing not just dislike forcible regime change alah iraq but you're trying to use something short of military force to convince the government to give up on something that's like a fundamental objective to their survival and their willingness to stay in power or like you've the us has been spectacularly unsuccessful at trying to sanction iran into giving up on being an islamic republic rate. It's like it's not going to work. Like incentives bright the incentives though that appeared to at times be the aims of us sanctions. Policy it's debatable. Whether that's what the goal was but that wasn't part the thing right and so so cursing like a real major shifts when the stakes are so is seems unlikely to me. But then there's sort of a sort of second way to think about coercion and something like sanctions or statements of frustration or anger short of sanctions shows. That the west is real mad at you. Right and part of that is that can be used for more limited objectives. Really like you want to release somebody from prison or stop a specific act of repression and that seems more doable. And so does using those as a as a signalling mechanism. Right if saying we don't like this behavior. We do not tolerate it. We do not condone it and other people in other countries should take note that this will meet with some kind of punishment Those have there's value to using course of tools along those lines whether or not they're called for yet in tunisia. I think is not clear. Like i'm not willing to say we need to do x. Policy to prevent side from doing why thing. Because i'm not clear exactly what the weifeng could be like what he's going to do next. We've talked about this at life to jump in quickly before we get to the c. bucket. Yes see buckets. Just to kind of put a little finer point on it when i was talking earlier about you. Want the person in power to be willing to potentially give up power rather than choosing to amass said power and the potential financial windfall. That comes from being in power. And i think that's where threats of not sanctions withdrawing. Us financial support and western financial support. Which has been significant in part to encourage democracy like okay. We're gonna help you that like. Yeah this is great Let's hear some you know financial assistance to try to make sure that this thing happens threatening to pull that could actually just raise the stakes like personally for of pursuing that path. So i think there are very specific ways that you're right that that that could be effective down the line anyway. See bucket you know. The last thing i wanted to talk about is a point that you made about the less coercive and more constructive role that international actress can play which is in fostering dialogue for and. It's not just getting people to chat. It's helping overcome the problem. That i was talking about at the beginning of this segment of lack of trust between different groups or the reason that we do international relations rate sponsored negotiations like you have the us. Brokering talks between israelis and palestinians for example or un held lead summits or five-party talks in various different circumstances. Is that the two principal actors who you're trying to get to come to an agreement. Don't trust each other enough to negotiate on their own and if they do talks will fail right. They will air irreconcilable grievances go down rabbit holes that be to know constructive solution. Try to litigated. Five hundred years of history or whatever depending on circumstance where it's you need some kind of international broker who both sides trust to help overcome the deficit in trust between the two sides and that rules harder to play when you're also trying to coerce one side into doing something so it makes sense to me that some foreign powers are keeping sort of wait and see stance because it may be valuable for them to be able to broker these talks if that's necessary between different domestic factions inside tunisia to get them to be like look you all can coexist inside a democratic framework. You can talk about this. I'm not saying we're close to a a situation where a conflict that requires. International mediation is happening. Just that i imagine that. This is the kind of thing that people in paris and washington are thinking about right now and are taking very seriously as a potential area in which they can assist in preserving and protecting tunisian democracy and i think it's a as both of you said i mean. Tunisia has a pretty strong civil society. It got to this point because of its civil society so we don't necessarily need the united states which i don't know how it's civil society is doing these days but i don't think it's still better. Yeah we've seen better days to intercede and say this is how it's done and i think the wait-and-see mode can be frustrating because it does not really sit quite right in sort of the larger biden foreign policy pro democracy agenda because you know president firing people taking power. It's it's a little uncomfortable. But at the same time. Ed you think there is the value in sort of trying to maybe. What sounds like a little bit of Say platitudes because obviously we do want to support political dialogue and those are values but not coming out. The side can feel a little bit uncomfortable in this context. But i think if we look at tunisia specifically makes sense a little bit of why. There's been some hesitancy on the part of some foreign powers to to get involved so we're going to leave it there. I want to thank our producers so if he longed for all of hard work as usual and you know go rate subscribe.
"tunisia" Discussed on Worldly
"And we are back. I hope you enjoyed my Dawson advertising tones listeners. But we're talking in our actual episode about what's going on in tunisia and the recent move by the president to consolidate power in own hands at the expense of parliament to me. This isn't just you know. Reminiscent of other arab. Spring countries most notably egypt. Which is the parallel often. Drawn these conversations but sort of more generally patterns and young democracies there are lots of difference factors and in the academic literature that have been identified as predictive of democracy success after a transition or revolution. What are these other. So many one of the big ones is income Which you know is is not sort of what. I'm i'm thinking about in the immediate context in tunisia so much as a sort of broader structural problem you have in these conditions which is that. The war mechanisms first apple shing trust between the different factions because when history of authoritarianism in a country you've a history of political disputes being held by force right and one side winning meaning. The other side gets us as jen was talking about before the break arrested and tortured and thrown in jail. Like the stakes of politics are essential. Part of the point and the purpose of democracy is to de escalate these kinds of conflicts to make it seem like losing does not mean that you die or go to jail or lose your livelihood and in tunisia right now. My concern is that you spiral into the mistrust that people had and the sense of existential steaks and politics that existed ten years ago under the dictatorship. And you lose the fragile sense that it's okay if the other guy wins sometimes you need for democracy to function and what sort of the long term ramifications of. This could be right an undermining. Even if there's some kind of like handover back parliament power. You could end up seeing a situation where different factions no longer trust each other to wheel the power of the presidency with restraint and that can create long-term trust problems that undermine the foundations of the democratic system. This is not an uncommon phenomenon. Yeah absolutely i think the issue of you have to make it be okay with the other party. The other side or another side in a multi-party democracy like tunisia is being power. Sometimes in that also kind of on the flip side requires the person or party in power to agree to handover said power when it's time to give it up or to resist the urge you know especially when you've been authoritarian system for so long to resist there to go. Well that guy. That last guy. I had pretty sweet gig amassing this power and money and and all of that would have. I just did that. You have to have leaders who actually literally put pluralism and democracy over their own interests and that can be difficult for especially for people who have been in political system for a long time and who have seen that system and that's how politics works in in the system. Is you just amass power. And that's how it goes and so in tunisia. We saw that like we. We said with with initi- But also with another leader literally d- shoes to put democracy pluralism ahead of their own political interests. And actually say okay. We're going to step back and we're going to allow us to not be in power for a little while because we're going to put our faith in this pluralism in this consensus democracy. We're gonna have this. You know this. This is a system. We're gonna try and the question is whether saieed is going to be committed to that now is well or whether you know again. I just want to be clear. We don't know yet. It's still happening right now and like even experts and you asked under like we don't know we're just gonna watch the president and see what he does like. He is kind of old down to him right now. He could choose to just keep amassing power and rely on the military which seems to have the support of. He sent them to surround parliament or he could do what previous leaders in tunisia have done it. And go okay. I'm stepping back. I did this for a temporary thing. And you know. Maybe he's trudeau's word. We don't know and so i think that's what really matters. And that's what's really frustrating and scary in young democracies as you have to have faith in individual politicians which having faith in any politician to be fair difficult difficult to do. I would say especially if you lived in authoritarian system. And just everybody's gonna holding their breath going hope. This guy supports democracy. I don't know and it's really scary. And then you also have the the uncertainty of what comes next. I think is part of why you're seeing kind of stilted reaction internationally to the events on the ground because nobody really knows. And i think particularly the united states and some of our partners are reluctant to tip the scales one way or another because a the hope is that tunisia can work this out that in the transition to become a democracy in the democrat ization process. This is something the growing pains if they're gonna have to go through and if they can get it together then that would be great but tunisia is also a really important partner geographically for security reasons particularly to the united states and if they were to come out and call this aku that has some pretty serious implications for us foreign policy for tunisia's foreign policy for any potential financial aid that we might give it secretary of state blinken basically had a little bit of a. It was a faux pas quite that but he basically tweeted that he had a good conversation with president saieed and you know he supports democracy and then he sort of had to walk back or add more.
"tunisia" Discussed on Worldly
"Clean them often. So it's that's the in the middle so anyway that's actually helpful given the amount of times that have had a fog out my glasses and the concerns that you probably have to pronounce arabic words on this show so no that's true that's helpful tip from your from your local arabic speaker so got you know like i said there's this announcement just recently in the last couple of days that there was going to be a investigation or there was an investigation under under under way into corruption against By the end and another party in parliament and so there was kind of just thought. Like oh is this. You know this. Crackdown on corruption. That was talking about and then judiciary which you know. The constitutional court like we said is not fully kind of constituted but the judiciary general is thought to be fairly independent in tunisia generally speaking and so they actually came out and said no. This was going on for a while you know. We started a few days ago before all of this happened. And their allegations unproven. I don't know the details yet. They're looking into it but allegations that an end the other party maybe be took foreign donations during the most recent election. So i think when when you studied has this point about corruption and about popular anger like john sadly there were massive protests on the streets calling for the prime minister to step down and calling on the president to get rid of them so when case they did this with the thought at least that he had a popular mandate and then and not a and its supporters at another opposition can have come out and sent their supporters into the street to counter protest to their kind of credit. I guess in the has since could have pulled back and said we want to have dialogue. Call for calm. I do think so far. It seems that everyone is really trying to like hope that you know democracy goes forward and really try to figure out a way through this crisis. But i think what's really interesting. Janai buffy to talk more about this because this is something that came up in your interview that people in tunisia many people especially the supporters of the president are maybe not super one hundred percent sold on democracy as the end all be all answer. The thing worth fighting for egner maybe more interested in you know understandably like having a government that's functional and that provides economic opportunity in healthcare deals with cove. Ed you're gonna talk more about that. Yeah and i think this kind of combines What you are saying. And what zach was saying about these underlying tensions between islamists islamists and the secular side of government and sort of tunisia's attempt to sort of figure out it's democracy on its own terms so to sort of like fast forward to how we kinda got here of course we know. The arab spring started in tunisia with fruit-seller setting himself on fire protesting corruption in sort of spread but in tunisia itself. The jasmine revolution created this sort of opening to democracy by basically taking down the authoritarian leader at the time president ben ali and so as i had said tunisia had really prided itself despite maybe having a authoritarian government on sort of the secular type of government that even though people in tunisia identified as muslim it was in part of the government and in the kind of transition to democracy that change with the and not the party and others sort of taking a role in government that they necessarily have before so this tension is very much still existing. So that's sort of one there and so with that tension you've had increased polarization between those who've really wanna see a secular government and all the kinds of scales on that and those who wanna see a more role for the islamic government so Is that said in hot. Is more of a moderate party. But then you also have more extreme groups kind of coming on the other side who wanna see an even greater role for political azzam and on the other side the more secular side. Of course you have. The president cited who is an independent. He was an outsider. Bit of a populous. You also have these parties. Who are kind of in parliament. An openly trying to call for the return of some sort of authoritarian rule. Basically saying like. Yeah we don't want democracy anymore because it's not working out for us. It hasn't delivered on the economic promise. The promise of bertie. And it's sort of you know kind of arguing that democracy is failing the the system of government in places failing and that is sort of the underpinnings of some of these protests. In why you've seen people who are cheering the president because they want someone to act and take control and there is a sense of we've been having national dialogues and we've been having parties change power. Nobody has really figured it out. So maybe there's somebody who can make it. So that i can afford my food and who i can go back to work and so i can get a corona virus vaccine and so that tension which again plays out on sort of not perfectly but sort of islamist and secular section is also paying out in tour of the vision of the government that tunisia might want to. We want more of strongman type government. That at least will purportedly or at least say they're gonna take our concerns into consideration deliver or do we want to go through this kind of messy divided government process. That seems to sort of be stuck in a stalemate. Yeah and i think for for americans who we live in a very offensively stable consolidated democracy right like we have had democracy for a couple of hundred and i think i as an american can relate to the frustration of divided government of congress not being able to act on like all sorts of things. Could you just please lake. Can you guys fix immigration and healthcare. Care all these other issues and even you know fighting about infrastructure and there's that frustration that like this divided government yes we we love democracy and yes we want people to have a say in their own government but at the same time i get it right like it's frustrating when the government doesn't do anything because they're just they're so much infighting so many sides have power that you can't nobody can move right and so i get that i think americans can kind of understand that it kind of visceral level and at the same time you know. It's just fault right but there. Democracy is very new and so it's not like it has that kind of built in. you know. This is the one thing that you need to fight for. Always this is like the founding of our country right like it's very new there because they had an authoritarian leader for very long time and it's understandable to have that frustration..
Team USA Beats Tunisia 3-1 in Men's Volleyball
"But the United States woman captured another four medals in the pool on Wednesday Katie Ledecky widely respected as the world's best long distance swimmer earned the gold in the women's fifteen hundred meter freestyle which made its Olympic debut this year the crime might not be my best times but I'm still really really happy to have a gold medal around my neck right now her teammate Erica Sullivan finished just behind her to grab the silver and Americans Alex Wilson Kate Douglas finished two three earned the silver and bronze in the two hundred meter individual medley the men didn't have the same like finishing off the podium and fourth in the four by two hundred freestyle relay Caleb Dressel was not picked to swim on that relay team I'm Danny cap
"tunisia" Discussed on The Economist: The Intelligence
"But i from tunisia. Streets were filled with angry citizens calling for the government's downfall then on sunday their demands were met and the celebrations began. The president kai siad had decided to take matters into his own hands. He dismissed the prime minister and suspended parliament for thirty days. But it's not clear where. Tunisia will go next. World leaders expressed concern. About what many are calling a coup including a white house. Statement by press secretary jen psaki. We are in touch at a senior level from both the white house and the state department with tunisian leaders to learn more about the situation urged calm and support tunisian efforts to move forward in line with democratic principles. The unrest casts doubt on hard one democratic hopes just in tunisia but throughout the region. We often think of geneva as the only success story to come out of the arab spring. Assist the only true democracy really in the arab world roger. Mcshane is the economists middle east editor but ten governments in ten years have failed to kick start the economy or stem corruption or improve services and. This has led many tunisians to lose faith in democracy. But how did we get here specifically. How did we get to a stage. Where the president essentially sacks the prime minister in suspense parliament. I mean it's a crisis that's been brewing for a while. You've had rising public anger over lack of jobs over terrible services over corruption. It's been rising for ten years. Essentially but in two thousand nineteen tunisians elected case sayyed as president and it was really a protest against the political class. This is a man who had no previous political experience. But you've seen as incorruptible someone who clean up tunisia's dirty political system and he was given an enormous mandy winning seventy three percent of the vote in even before this latest move he had been challenging parliament even challenging the political parties which he despises and recently covert added to this tension..
Tunisian President Fires Prime Minister After Violent Protests
"To speed with what's happening in Tunisia major unrest over the last few days, the country's president has now announced the suspension of parliament. And the dismissal of the prime minister after violent protests broke out in several cities over the government's handling of the covid pandemic and the ongoing problems with unemployment and the economy. President Chi Saeed said on Sunday he would assume executive authority with the assistance of a new prime minister. However, the Tunisian parliament speaker has accused the president of launching a coup against the Constitution. Well for more. I've been speaking to Huda Was Yodit research in Tunisian affairs from the University of Toronto in Canada. Have to say I wasn't surprised because this has been like an open secret in Tunisia with a lot of people talking about the possibility of what President I say it. Maybe stage in some kind of what they call a constitutional cool, according to some constitutional experts, even though some others who know that would disagree with the label, But I think this is a moment that opportunity that is very critical when a lot of people They seem to be extremely worried and concerned that what side has done might lead to a part of some kind of dictatorship or some kind of could similar to what happened in Egypt. Others are quite you know, happy because especially the ones are very until mother Because of the way that the political class has been dealing with them. How economic situation but also the health places with carpet so in a way, because it's very popular with a lot of them so They felt that he, in some ways, you know, reigned in all the ills that has been generated by by the change in Parliament, in particular how it is run by the Islamist party. Another and this is
A New Approach to Defending the Human Rights of Migrants
"A decade ago after peaceful revolution toppled longtime tunisia dictator bin. Ali i was sitting in an orange grove outside athens. Greece documented migrants. Were hiding there. I came to interview them about human rights abuses suffered while enter europe one of them. Tunisian fellow in a leather jacket explained the people who overthrew ben ali they want democracy and identified life. We across the mediterranean want. Democracy didn't life. What is the difference. The migrant is a kind of revolutionary is idea stuck with me and informed might work as a lawyer and a scholar ever since as middle eastern revolutions turned into civil wars. The refugee crisis unfolded in the measuring. This exacerbated political pressures against asylum-seekers. Initially the european court of human rights took a strong stand against sport or violence in two thousand twelve court decided that the cannot turn asylum seekers back from the mediterranean dangerous libyan territory that first hearing them the human rights community cheer. I was not one of those who cheered in my scholarship. I predicted that this kind of decision could also generate bad results states determined to enforce their own return back asylum seekers even before the entered the supervision of their own courts. I was regretfully correct in recent years. The italians have relied on living to do their dirty work. So eager are some european governments deduction on human rights obligations if an armed libyan militia ignoring the rampant use of torture. This is also why since january. Twenty fourteen more than thirty. Four thousand migrants died by grounding in the mediterranean and since covid nineteen again the militarized border into. Mentoring has come in some ways. Even more extreme but has the militarized quarter caused deaths by drowning.
Three Nations Urge US to Join UN Statement on Gaza
"Un security council nations trying to get the un's most powerful body to take action on the escalating violence between israel and gaza's hamas rulers say they are still trying to get the us to support a statement including a coal to end the fighting china norway. Tunisia tried unsuccessfully at closed meetings on monday and wednesday to get agreement on a council statement diplomats. Say the us argued. Such a statement could interfere with diplomatic efforts to de escalate the situation. Meanwhile israeli airstrikes on gaza city flattened three buildings and killed at least forty two people on sunday palestinian medics said in the deadliest single attack in the latest round of violence
New Mediterranean Shipwreck Reopens Debate Over Tragic Migrant Journeys
"In the mediterranean sea. That claimed the lives of one hundred and thirty migrants last week. Three ignited the debate about why more companies don't protect these vulnerable. People risked everything with the details about this latest tragedy. Which happened just off the libyan coast his sophomore sailly from the un migration agency. I m speaking to you and uses daniel johnson. Well it is an officer tragedy. That one hundred thirty people died again leading and sending distress goals for two days in international waters in the central mediterranean. Mrc's maritime rescue centers have been informed of the existence of this boat for at least two days. The ngo vessel ocean viking found remains of the boat and dozens of bodies floating nearby the signaling that at least one hundred and seventy people harish last week. This is an utter tragedy that people continue to die. On europe's store step. There were three boats out there last week. When this was an alert from the international organization for migration working you tell us about the other two boats so there were three boats last week in the central mediterranean. One of these boats were in was intercepted and returned to libya by the libyan coast guard board. The boat was a mother and her child who were found dead and one hundred other people who were taken to arbitrary detention at the ngo alarm phone alerted to the existence of two more boats. One carry in roughly one hundred thirty people and the third one carrying forty people. It's very sad that the one carrying one hundred and thirty people was found shipwrecked and the third boat. We hit yesterday From the ngos consummation that the boat arrived in tunisia autonomously we are happy and thankful that people are alive that we continue to reiterate that the situation in the central mediterranean cannot continue as such
The History of Spanish Africa
"I say that there are parts of spain and africa. I'm not trying to be tricky and play with words. I'm not saying that. Spain used to have colonies in africa. Although that's true. I'm also not trying to define the canary islands. Which are part of spain off the coast of africa as being in africa. I mean in the most literal sense possible. That part of spain is in africa. There are two very small spanish cities located on the peninsula which are on the african mainland ordering morocco and malia and their very existence as you probably would expect are due to historical quirks happenstance due to geography. Spain has always had a close relationship with africa finishes based in carthage in. What is today. Tunisia established settlements on the spanish coast. The roman province of hispania was part of a greater empire that included all of north africa. Which bordered the mediterranean after the roman empire fell islamic moors from north africa conquered and controlled spain for over seven hundred years. So there's always been a back and forth between north africa in the peninsula and malia both spanish territories in africa have different yet similar histories despite being about one hundred and thirty miles apart from each other. Sita is located directly across the sea from gibraltar. So if you ever want stump someone asks them. What country lies. Directly south of gibraltar and what country lies. North of gibraltar. answer is the same. Spain is on both ends. Sierra makes the counterpart to gibraltar for the pillars of hercules which the ancient names of the two promontories which guarded the strait of gibraltar. As with most everything in the region it has an ancient history. Carthage martina and numidians all control the area. Before the romans the you me add caliphate controlled it for centuries when the caliphate of cordoba fell in ten thirty one it was then passed between various north african kingdoms with support from various kingdoms in the iberian peninsula.
Is Tunisia an Arab Spring Success Story?
"When we talk about cooed unquote the arab spring. We tend to refer to tunisia as the one success to come out of it. Be you've been reporting from tunis for quite some time now do. Do the people think it was a success. You get really mixed answers when it. When i've asked that question and i think many people these days say no just looking at sort of day to day living situation the lack of jobs the high prices just the inability to satisfy basic needs and to see opportunity in the future. Those were the main buckets of complaints and where people say that the revolution democracy really fell short clear. Parker is a freelance journalist based in tunis tunisia. But people at the same time are proud of the freedoms that they've acquired specifically civil society is flourishing. There's freedom of expression although it faces some threats but you know a lot of civil liberties especially compared to other countries in the region and a lot of protest movement and right to protest. So there's a sense that at least they have this freedom and that's kind of the main gain of the revolution
The Hitler Haggadah with Jonnie Schnytzer
"Joined today by johnny schnitzer to talk about the hitler. Haga a nineteen forty-three judeo arabic haggadah. Which tells the story of the holocaust the second world war and the allied landing in north africa through the passover seder. Johnny schnitzer is a phd candidate at bar. Ilan university with a focus on medieval kabbalah. His dissertation is focused on the fourteenth century. Kabul list rabbi. Joseph ben shallow ashkenazi and johnny is also preparing a critical edition of ashkenazis. Commentary on sefer itsy raw. Johnny also edited an english edition of the etc. Which we're going to be talking about today. The hitler etc is such a fascinating text in many ways even just the title is jarring. And you might think how can you use. Hitler's name in the title of this traditional jewish text and it draws you in to a tremendous piece of moroccan jewish history that reworked the traditional passover story to tell us about the experience of north african jews in the holocaust. I hope you enjoyed our conversation. Where we're going to dive into this text and think about how it can broaden our understanding of the holocaust to include the middle east and north africa in that story and also where we think through the important relationship between jewish roots and holidays with history and historical memory. Thanks for tuning in high johnny. Welcome to the podcast. Thanks so much for joining us to talk about your book that you added. Thank you for inviting me. Lovely to be here. Absolute think this is such a fascinating text. Can you maybe tell us a little bit about it in other words like what is it that makes this different from all other hug adults. I think there are sort of two bombs that this text drops upon any re- debt guest that sort of feast there is on the hit laga and the first one of course is the title and this is what got me interested in this from the outset and that is this sort of sporadic this who has the chutzpah to do this at taking a jewish texts calling it the hit laga. That's the sort of bomb number one. Because you're not even sure what this is about. Who wrote this. But you know one thing you know that the author who is anonymous and we'll touch upon them in a moment takes to keywords. That every juneau's today every jew does not need to google almost haggadah writer passover passover eve where we read the haggadah we all come and we eat together and he takes haggadah and he connects to the other. Keyword that we all know about for a very separate horrific connotation. That's hitler and he puts it together. The first bomb is who has the chutzpah to perpetrate a text. And give it the title. Hit laga taking one of the most sacred texts and connecting it to one of the biggest mom's area if you like in jewish history and then you open the text and you realize that author has done something absolutely fascinating he is done with. The sages have asked us to do generation after generation and that is to see ourselves as if we left egypt red. It's to reenact. Redemptions to reenact. God saving the jewish people taking us out. And what does he do. He takes the structure of the storytelling bit of the haggadah. Right on passover. Eve we have the ceremony we have the blessings and then we reached the mortgage section the mugged section to section where we meant to mcgee. We meant to tell the story. That's what is about right. We tell story we tell the story of redemption. This also explains why passovers become right. This trend of everyone bringing own hug dot. Everyone bringing their own stories. Because it's all about bringing together different pieces of the puzzle. Creating this beautifully rich mosaic. So he takes the traditional structure of the haggadah which tells us about how we were taken out of egypt and it tells us about these different characters. Rabbinic figures leaving two thousand years ago. The told us to do this and told us to do that. And he takes out the content and fills it with a new content whereby he tells the story of the holocaust of world war two of the allied victory of the ex pows over nazi germany. And hitler and mussolini's italy he tells us the story of his generation rights yossi who has something to tell us in the traditional said. There's something about how. How would you meant to do something. All of a sudden becomes the speech of the dictator iosif stalin when we told them the haggadah that i god and not an angel. Not anyone else is going to take you. The jewish people out of egypt suddenly becomes. I shall the goal. I not level not the right none of none of the other vichy high commanding general's. I shall the goal which already tells us right. This is what's fascinating in the hitler etc and this is the second bomb if the first bomb is the title. We still don't know what it's about. The second bomb is when you discover that this was written by an anonymous jew living in robots morocco probably towards the end of nineteen forty-three as a result possibly inspired by operation torch. The allied operation led by the us on the shores of casablanca and algiers. And everything changes all of a sudden this jew living in morocco. Who's lived under a regime whether anti jewish laws jews around him have lost their jobs. Jews around you can't get a jewish education you become by night a second-grade citizen and so out author. It almost seems as if he's taking a text which it's time to write it when we don't yet know the ending. He doesn't yet know about the horrific six million who are being murdered. He doesn't know about concentration camps in poland. But he knows he wants to do something horrific any also is living in a time where his life has changed for some years and as a result of the allied victory he suddenly possibly is inspired and sees. I get the exodus. The story i meant to be telling i meant to take the passover haggadah until the story that i see and that's how the allies beat the excess power. And how in fact you know retelling the story of exodus mine new-fangled version. I think that the text itself is amazing in the ways in which it on. The one hand utilizes the story of passover very explicitly very specifically in when he talks. About how hitler. Enslaved the jews but also like you mentioned the way in which some of the characteristic aspects of the traditional aspects are transfigured and transformed new. Whether we're talking about the parable of the four sons the for children or the different rabbis plagues. What are some of the really interesting things that are happening in this text that really are utilizing the passover story itself and also the the characteristic aspects of the passover seder that people who read attritional seder would be familiar with but they give it new meaning in this context. If we take right this this idea of the four sons four daughters any jewish figure that we look at it and we want to understand. What is it the sort of a heart of their teachings you know. One of the tricks is to see if they wrote a commentary on the haggadah. What do they do with these. Four boys of for doors. What do they symbolize. And in the case of the hit da it takes us back in time to a sort of moroccan viewpoint of the the north african campaign. And so who is the wise son now. You know it's going to be an allied power. But you're not sure that england or is it america and you'll told the the wise son is england right. The royal air force acts cleverly. He's clearly impressed he he is probably the razzie stance radio. He knows about the bombings. He knows about montgomery and then we move onto the russia. The russia we know can only be one person. That's clearly hitler. Hitler the evil one. He knows that he's a know he. He's torturing the jewish people and yet it's interesting that if you read through the at that we're not quite sure what's going on in europe right off a thinks that there is a concentration camp in berlin so we're not yet show what's going on in the world and our author doesn't yet. Nobody knows that he clearly is evil that he's plotting against the jews there wearing yellow badges which also is interesting. Because we're not sure. If he's referring to the yellow badges of jews in europe or the yellow badges of jews in certain places in north africa and then who is the tam. The time is interesting. Because tom can both mean in hebrew complete simpleton the thomas america and then shane no. You're dillashaw and who doesn't know how to ask questions. The classic version says the fourth son is the son who doesn't know how to ask questions. The newfangled version is and mussalini. Who isn't with the avowed woods and this is very interesting because when i was speaking to holocaust survivors. Oh you know this. Sort of all degeneration and i spoke to people from algeria from tunisia morocco across the board there was a nickname from cellini mar. He was the donkey he was the s. This resonates with this passage whims lead author decides to change it. And say it's not. He doesn't ask question it's that we don't even wanna talk about
The Xunantunich Account
"Tucked away. Inside the countryside of modern day belize lies one of the greatest standing ruins of the maya civilization shuna on tunisia's ancient name is unknown but historians estimate that the structures of tune each were built beginning in the seventh century. C e however the land had been occupied by the maya for much longer as early as one thousand bc in those first centuries it was just a small village but at some point in the seventh century it began to grow in size and power. The lords of the ancient maya city built ball courts palaces and temples but the city's crown jewel was the structure known as el custodio. A one hundred thirty foot pyramid topped with shrines offices and a royal palace hsun each was a thriving metropolis the center of a powerful kingdom. Then all of a sudden it wasn't the collapse of the my empire was one of the most devastating and dramatic catastrophes in human history. But it didn't happen all at once. The collapse of the classic my civilization occurred not long after shoot onto each was built around eight hundred ce. By the end of the ninth century the region and its majestic monuments almost totally deserted in less than two hundred years. The city's population had nearly vanished. Royal dynasties disappeared. Cities fell to ruin the great pyramids of the maya sat untouched for and were reclaimed by the jungle. But over the next millennium the region was colonized by european settlers by the eighteen. Hundreds of colonists. An interest in the ancient cities and their expeditions uncovered a wealth of artifacts that were shipped away to european museums and auction houses. However these pieces of history provided few clues as to what cataclysm destroyed the maya cities something had caused the empire to crumble yet to this day. We still don't know why but for a lucky few their spirits and shown on tune each who will show them the keys to this ancient mystery. If only they would listen how. To- felt uneasy as he walked through the ancient temples. There were no real dangerous here. No musket wielding british soldiers on horseback but there was a dense fog shrouded. Everything missed but hocine 'to could still see the dark stones covered in moss and the snake like lines that crept up the temple walls most days to walk the extra two and a half miles just to avoid the sight of it but today be didn't have the energy. He hadn't slept much last night or any night in the past three months. Not since his father died a scene to had borrowed money for a decent burial. He thought he'd be able to pay back but then the storm came. It devastated his crop of bananas now. He barely had enough to pay the englishman who owned his land and not a single schilling left for his wife and son. His wife was getting sicker every day. It was the same sickness that had taken his father the same fever and bloody cough and recently his son. Miguel had become to cough to how cintos didn't know why he'd been spared. His wife said it was a spanish applied. Maria said europeans were immune to the diseases. They brought to the maya and the husino often considered himself native. He'd been born on the peninsula. He was european after all had tried everything to raise money for a doctor. He begged from neighbors tried fishing and hunting but his neighbors were just as poor as he was and even if he caught a fish or a deer there was no one to sell it to how seen was watching his wife and son die he felt as if the world was falling apart which might be. Why the temples made him feel so uneasy because that hopelessness must have been how. The maya felt long ago that there was nothing they could do. Cinco continued walking toward the center of the ancient city in front of him. One moss covered building towered above the others a narrow strip of stone steps visible at its front. Something white flashed at the bottom of the steps at first husino fodder was a bird but as he came closer he saw it was a woman. She wore long white repeal and a belt of turquoise beads tight around your waist her arms were piled high with gold and silver bracelets and the skin above her nose had been painted a vibrant red.
Italian Coast Guard Rescues 47 Migrants after Small Boat Capsizes
"Nearly fifty migrants a small wooden boat were rescued off. Italy's coast by the coast guard today as the craft capsized in the mediterranean. Italian coastguards has the migrants were being transferred to the italian vessels when the boat overturned about fifteen miles south of lampedusa island human traffickers in libya and tunisia often lodge overcrowded unseaworthy rubber dinghies and aging fishing boats toward european shores for migrants. Who are hoping to find family or jobs.
Egypt and the Arab Winter
"Arab spring. Well who doesn't love a democratic revolution. Who's not moved by. Brave protests is calling for the downfall of a brutal regime well a decade ago. That's precisely what happened in the streets of cairo and alexandria a wall of sound as egypt's vice president. I'm sulaiman announces that president hosni mubarak will step down the merciful. The compassionate seasons mahamat house entrusting mubarak has decided a month as president of the republic might have seconds after the announcement. Cairo erupted in celebrations. We are extremely happy. We are all aspiring future for egypt. We are not depending on the government anymore. This is the egyptian people. And this is the base of the new constitution now. The worldwide far the greater the egyptian uprising that culminated in the downfall of mubarak. This is ten years ago so february. Twenty eleven all. That was entirely understandable. Wasn't it after all all revolutions at least in the first few days they blissful and remember every tarn across the water arab world trembled. We already had president ali. Fleeing tunisia albany mubarak of course was toppled. Gaddafi was killed by fellow libyans. Assad of course. Vice the syrian sunni rebellion however. The egyptian uprising did not deliver a democratic outcome. Nor did the cycled arab spring really amount to a more liberal future for the region. Why noah feldman is professor of law at harvard law school. He's author of the arab winter. Tragedy noah welcome to. Abc's radio national. Thank you for having me take us back a decade ago so to the wave of popular protests that swept the middle east. There was something profoundly moving for anybody who cares about freedom in watching large numbers of people say enough is enough. We want to have a say in how things are done in our country and we want dignity and we want social justice and we want freedom. And that i think was the reason that all over the world people responded so positively to the arab spring. It's also the reason that the impulse to have these kinds of protests and change spread across the arabic speaking world to so many countries and so there was a sense of optimism but also a sense of gee what will come next and i think in some countries more than others a worry that what might come next might not be as positive as the protesters hoped what comes next. I mean for generations. It was widely believed that arabs. As opposed to site asians europeans africans latin americans. The widespread view was that arabs. Were uniquely allergic to democracy and of course the arab spring challenged narrative yet use site new book quote. It brought little good. The arab spring ultimately made many people's lives worse than they were before house are. That's a painful realization to reach especially for someone like me who believes very fundamentally that there is no country no culture no group of people organized by region or religion or language who have less in the way of aspiration to self government and freedom than any other but ultimately the reason i can conclude that it brought more harm than good. Is that in egypt. The process that began with democratization and experiment ended in a new dictatorship is bad and in many ways worse than the one that came before in syria the process of arab spring ultimate gave way to a vicious improve civil war. The gun to be sure by the syrian regime in its own defense that left almost half the population displaced either internally or externally and killed hundreds of thousands of people and pretty much the place in the arab world where things are measurably better as a result of the arab. Spring is the tiny country of tunisia. Which has actually the odds to build a functioning constitutional democracy. They still a lot of other problems. But that's just a tiny tiny piece of the much bigger picture in which things are either no better or in some cases much worse
"tunisia" Discussed on KQED Radio
"Ain't That's news thing. Let's take you to the museum. Now, though, there's been fresh clashes between protesters and police and the Tunisian town off CB KLA after reports of the death of a demonstrator who was injured last week. Hotel. It rushed. Rusty's family say he was hit by a tear gas canister during protests Commemorating the start of the Arab Spring revolution in Tunisia 10 years ago, many of the people taking part I just in franchise young people, a third of whom Currently unemployed in Tunisia. Let's speak to narrows Juicy, who is 24 live in Tunisia. Your reaction. Then first of all, to the death off this young man, Harris. Well, well, it Zaveri sad. I'm were very angry because we we re actually knew that he died like four days ago. And I think that today the demonstration in front of the parliament things or not, will not go very well. Right. So there is a demonstration planned and clearly the violence has been building for a while. You know, we were on the anniversary of the Arab spring. There was a lot of promise. Ah, lot of people thinking that life might be different. It hasn't turned out to be So has it. Is that what's feeding into this? Do you think? Yes, Yes, it is. It's all due to this is economic situation that would living we're currently living. You know, by the time by the 14th off January, we were not allowed. You come down to the streets in protest because the chief of the government had had announced a quarantine just only for four days. Um all of the electoral promises will not made the violence is everywhere. Poverty is everywhere. So I'm going to town in which, Yeah, exactly. And that's it. That's just a lethal cocktail, isn't it? Really things will give it some point speaker that the town where he was killed, where he was from. Is it pretty run down our people having a hard time there would talk me through what it's like for young people in that town. It's well when when we talk about them go screen, which is the region from when from where this man is, Um, we are talking about 60% of unemployment. Most most of the most of the young people that evil are in prison, or we are and all the allies they migrated. Um it z not it Z So sometimes when I talk when I talk to people that or when I talk to young men and women they're all like in here about is how they are planning to Theo. Leave the country or do you just, um or to just, you know, use drugs. All of them are against the police establishment. And just try. They're not really trying to find the loose solutions for them. And of course, things have clearly got worse with the covert pandemic. As well. What What can I mean? Once we're through this on, but some point there will be attorney point. What could change to make life better? What kind of investment is needed? To give young people hope to keep them inside Tunisia. Well, I do believe that, starting with associate economical program in which they includes young Tunisians to be part of it. And two primarily subject shit for them. That can bake who I A D A is taught to do to convince them to just stay in Peapod and be part of the of the country's decisions, the country's aspirations on the country's dreams. It's good to talk to you narrows. Thank you so much for joining us on used a now Whereas Jussie there she's 24. She lives in Tunisia talking through the unrest and there will be demonstrations later outside the parliament. There will bring you those events here on the BBC World Service. Used a 22 minutes to the hour. Somalia is marking, if that's the right phrase, 30 years of conflict specifically The moment that the government of president said body collapsed in January 1991..
Clashes break out in Tunisia after death of protester
"Let's take you to the museum. Now, though, there's been fresh clashes between protesters and police and the Tunisian town off CB KLA after reports of the death of a demonstrator who was injured last week. Hotel. It rushed. Rusty's family say he was hit by a tear gas canister during protests Commemorating the start of the Arab Spring revolution in Tunisia 10 years ago, many of the people taking part I just in franchise young people, a third of whom Currently unemployed in Tunisia. Let's
"tunisia" Discussed on 90.3 KAZU
"To begin the story of his cell I mean these values today as a stage name the this phone was created in February two thousand eleven it was during the Arab spring so the revolution started in Tunisia and in Egypt we were kind of short music and short on people so we were a few people trying to show them how the music that will bring people together that will call for action to hold people to come down from there mmhm come with us on the screen and I was also concerned about creating music that will give energy to the fee for energy and push out and G. two world news to stand for hours and hours many.
"tunisia" Discussed on WCPT 820
"That. Kamal from Tunisia. Ohi all. Stephanie. How are you? Good. What could be better? Things are going. Well. One of the things that I am at about from over four thousand miles away. Obvious. In the White House is actually trying to start from slow motion. Cu oh, I got news for you. It's not so slow motion anymore started before the election. And my question is why why are people out on Greek potency? Well, I I know I I I have to say like Martina Navratilova tweeted about like, you know, the the lies. We were told in Czechoslovakia like MRs that was nothing like literally, outdoing communists. I mean, and I get that the people from around the world, and I'm like what maybe when this shutdown. I mean, what people are literally going to let him starve them to death and make them homeless. We yeah. When you said, they're the ones that are upset are Democrats. They might not have been before. But they sure are now. WTO fatigue. That woman was quoted that I just that's the thing is a lot of Trumpers because we're liberals we cannot. We do feel bad for them. I mean, my mom I love more than anything in the world. Again. What's Fox News is part in this? Where people stay there the recipients. They're not the perpetrators of lies. They're like the recipients of this whole pro-trump commercial. That's been going on. Right. But it just but anyway, one of the women though was saying well I voted for him. But I I thought he was going to do good things. But he's not he's not hurting. You're right people is she. I'm really is that what you've. Then you deserve. What you get. Because you're you're awful. Yeah. Yeah. I thought he I thought he would do good things. He's not hurting. I'm like you vote for somebody to hurt your fellow Americans because. Yeah, I mean, I would like the rich to pay their fair share. I would like regulation air we all breathe in the water. We all drink. I mean, not at my house because we don't have one right now. We're out of water because my pipe bursts to give me to the show. Yeah. Good. Water is fine. We'll go next door. Yeah. But I don't wish ill on people. That's another part of this that we're going to have to get to when Trump is gone is what really he people enough that you really want to wish them will. It's the, gene. We saw the other day. There was a guy was talking about like the government shutdown. Like, I didn't think it was a big deal. But then I just realized that this acting meanness affected my family. I mean, don't soybean farmers go. I'm going out of business are sales are zero. And I see that Putin just announced. According to be selling soybeans to China. I mean, so and then this latest more coal plants have closed under Trump than Obama's entire term. Just wears this from CNN many in this corner, coal country blamed Obama era regulations on their demise. So when a candidate named Donald Trump promised to end, the so-called war on coal. They were ready to believe we are putting our great coal miners back to work. He repeated to what rally crowds waving Trump dig cold, digs coal signs. I'm Kohl's last shot. But thanks to largely a free market forces who talked about that. Oh, Hillary Clinton did. And automation all sorts. Yes. Yes. More more coal fired power plants have been deactivated and Trump's first two years in office than an Obama's entire first year. One veteran miner said he's trying to get their votes. He's lying to them. This is the problem with the media what they're doing tonight. And the Gotcha coverage they did of Hillary Clinton. She she did a whole chapter in a book on this that you know, she misspoke. She misspoke when she said, we're going to put a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business because what she was doing was going out to promote her greed, her thirty billion dollar aid package to call just think how much better we all would be doing including coal miners and soybean farmers if Hillary Clinton were president I mean, but but because the media what ha she misspoke. Oh, look coalminers hater now. That she misspoke. They just didn't let her finish the sentence. Exactly. They didn't put it in the contact. She was saying exactly what they know. Now, we need to get them cleaner healthier job zip right anyway. One of the miners said they wanted hope if someone has a sickness or cancer, the doctor says I can cure that they believe I can't blame them or question them for trusting Trump. I mean, it's just before the rest of us. We see what a cheap scam artist. He's been his whole life's in just a con, man. It's. Plus, I'm just mad at television. I think I'm going to break several of my television today. Two things are fine. Yes. And CBS have all agreed to carry the democratic tonight. You're back from Fox News and ABC. And also the producers over at MSNBC is tweeting that Senator Graham coons Tillis Booker have reintroduced the special, counsel independence, and integrity. Which is Graham being on that list. That's good. Could we know that something big is coming down the pike that he might be trying to distract from tonight. We'll there's also this story about Manafort filing deadline last night. Okay. This is about what for their explanation of why he lied or if you lied or what the lies whereabouts. So the plot thickens tweets about that two people saying either really really good or really really bad. Okay. Well, great. That's just the Lord for whom. Side, you're on a thing. No. But anyway, this is I just. Oh, I was talking about television. Just what they're doing tonight. But a lot of people been talking about apprentice how? How much to blame? They are NBC Mark Burnett. Like, they all knew what they were doing. They were saying hit. None of his decisions made any sense. It's we literally are seeing the apprentice payout. Yes without? But without like, Kramer, editors and producers and writers. I mean, this is what they said he made nothing. He he is a crappy businessman. He has no idea. We do. It's everything we're seeing now. Right. And they were saying they had they had to do so much editing to make any of his decisions even lick coherent. So they created this myth of this. Great. You know that I guess a lot of people got conned by. But it just anyway. All right. What was I saying? That was all it was an enormous setup. For saying we tried to warn you..