20 Episode results for "Truman Administration"

Sen. Chuck Schumer On New York, The Response So Far And A Possible Fourth Relief Bill

NPR's Story of the Day

07:33 min | 1 year ago

Sen. Chuck Schumer On New York, The Response So Far And A Possible Fourth Relief Bill

"Former FDA head Scott GOTTLIEB issued this warning to Americans last month March eighth. The next two weeks are really going to change the complexion this country. We'll get through this but it's going to be a hard period. We'RE LOOKING AT TWO MONTHS. Probably have difficulty as has become painfully clear. Gottlieb was right that the complexion of daily life in America has changed dramatically. Tens of thousands of people have been sickened by the corona virus. Millions of lost their jobs and doctors and governors are warning about American hospitals at a breaking point last night in the White House briefing room. President trump warned about another critical two week period. I want every American to be prepared for the hard days that lie ahead. We'RE GONNA go to a very tough two weeks. The president flanked thereby his public health advisors. Dr Deb IRKS. Dr Anthony said one hundred thousand to two hundred forty thousand could die from the corona virus. And that's the best case scenario. So how will? America's leaders help Americans navigate this period and beyond well. Let's bring in one of those leaders. Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer Democrat of New York. Senator Schumer welcome good afternoon. Mary Louise I know you are joining us on the line from your home in Brooklyn would you start there? What what does it look to New York right now? The epicenter as it were it's eerie because the streets are empty We I only seen four people in since I got back from Washington a week ago Wednesday and got in my car midnight. I wanted to get out of Washington. Get Home Quick. Got Home at four thirty and I've seen four people my wife my daughter and son-in-law because their apartment smaller living with us in my one and a half year old grandson I do get to 'em on for two hours a day and chasing him around is as exhausting as anything but is in there. Yeah social thing like not that Yes yes I do go out for a walk in. My doctor said just a six feet away from anyone. I probably make it twelve feet so I'm walking the street a lot of the time and I hope people don't think I'm upset with them when they see people I know and I just crossed the street now rather quickly remarkable at the isolation for New York is particularly confounding. Because we're people who like to be together after nine eleven. We hugged each other and clung to each other. We ride the subways and we're in close contact with people of different backgrounds and every different type and here. We are were isolated. We don't know how long this is going to last. We know where the center but there are a few things that you know. I'm on the phone. Almost twenty four seven today. I asked the president to give us a hundred percent of the FEMA aid. He said he'd look at it I'm calling on the president also to have as czar for distribution of these hospital Of THE SUPPLIES. We need the. Ppe's and the masks and the ventilators they have pointed someone under the defense production. Act The act that allowed during the Truman administration the government to take over factories and produce. And they're starting to do that but they're not distributing it well so our mayor had a call. Sweden to try and get ventilators. The governor had a call to someone in California. They said well. We're sending them overseas. The president should appoint probably a general. Who's an expert at quarter mastering getting supplies from one place to the other to take over the supplying and giving the places that need The ventilators in the mass the preference of everybody just catches catch Kellyanne. Let me I think the other thing. The one other thing I've asked for is that the federal government today I asked the president to Pay Hazard pay to all of those on the front linus lines. These nurses these doctors The healthcare workers they're risking their lives. I'm sure when they walk to work or take the subway to work. They still have to get there. They're wondering will I catch this virus? They're like the firefighters and police officers and construction workers where heroes of nine eleven. These are our heroes today and they should get hazard. Pay The federal government every federal worker as it paying. I think in the next co Bill. We should require it for everyone. Shifts your senator to the news of the day and the possibility of a fourth rescue package speaker. Pelosi's been talking about this all week Over in the Senate though Senate Majority Leader Mitch. Mcconnell says hey. It's way too early to talk about another package. We haven't even got the programs we funded in the one. We signed last week up and running the land on that. I think they're both right. We should be focusing right away. We passed to use package. We Democrats played the major role in shaping at the Republican. Bill did not help average folks and did not have a Marshall Plan for hospitals. We did and so getting those unemployment checks you know. The Federal Government under are unemployed on. Steroids has said that we will pay every worker. Their full salary for four months and the company doesn't have to fire them they can follow them. Stay on the payroll so when God willingness crisis is over these companies restaurants manufacturing places can reassemble having not lost their workers right because they're getting paid and getting followed. Well we need those unemployment checks to be out in two weeks and I've asked the president to make sure that happens. The President President. Yeah the the the president calling in this next package for another two trillion dollars. Yeah aimed at and don't let me just put a question which is do we have another two two trillion minutes two trillion here two trillion. There can we afford this already opposite. Look I think we'll do a covert for we have to and there are certain things we must. We have to look at election reform. How are people going to vote and we need to lay out? How and we may have to look lay out. How Congress is GonNa vote if we can't you know the Senate? They have to fly the house from all over the country. I think we have do things with paid leave. Paid sick leave. Paid family leave as for an infrastructure package. When you start looking down the road and you say how do we get our economy going? And how deep is the hit to our economy. There is no better thing than infrastructure. But I think that that the first job is to beat this healthcare crisis and deal with people who have their immediate problems and I would not at all be adverse to infrastructure package. I wanted to be quite green looking at the future. As well as the traditional infrastructure it does from the question of how infrastructure work would even get done. When when much of the country's on lockdown exactly so it's a it's a longer-range view of getting the economy back but job number one get that those materials to our hospitals into our healthcare workers. Get the unemployment checks out to people who need it. Make sure that thousand dollar payment. I talked to the president today and I said you know not the President Mnuchin. Rather getting treasury secretary moved into each other. Yeah make sure that people who don't have Who Haven't paid taxes or don't have some kind of job pay. Everyone on social security should get one of these checks just in the moments we have left. Senator Can Congress do anything about that about getting those checks to people who need to pay their bills to pay rent. I think we did a very good job. Not Perfect meet. Occulted for On on on laying out what has to happen now. It's up to the administration to get it done but we have to watch them like a hawk because this administration is not good at administering senator. Thank you nice to talk to you Mary. Louise Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer tacking to us there from his home in Brooklyn.

president President Chuck Schumer senator federal government New York Senate America Senator Schumer Scott GOTTLIEB White House Bill Congress Brooklyn Washington Louise Senate Minority Truman administration FDA
20: The Power of the Universe Part II (Harry S. Truman)

This American President

1:45:39 hr | 1 year ago

20: The Power of the Universe Part II (Harry S. Truman)

"So in our last episode we mentioned our kickstarter campaign where raising money so that we essentially can have a permanent studio with upgraded equipment like acoustic panels and new microphone. Basically so he could produce more episodes and higher quality content, and for the campaign we gave ourselves the goal of one thousand eight hundred dollars, meaning that we had to raise a minimum of that much one thousand eight hundred dollars to actually get any of the money in all. Well, thanks to you our listeners. We raised as of February seventeenth. We Race Two thousand two hundred twenty dollars, so we're definitely going to get the money that you contributed. And I just wanted to say that. We at this American President are honored and quite frankly thrilled by all of your support, and we just wanted to let you all know that we appreciate everyone who donate. And we also asked that. If you haven't donated, please consider donating to us and if you have, we just want to thank you all for your generous donations stretch goals beyond one thousand eight hundred dollars, the more money we have, the better equipment we can buy and the higher quality content we could produce. and. We need your donations by noon on March fifth. We're also offering you rewards. For your contributions. If you donate five hundred dollars or more, you can co produce an episode of this American presidents of. There's a topic that you've always wanted to learn about. Will be happy to meet with you and basically talk about an that. You have and will make a short episode about the topic. Now, four hundred dollars or more, we add this American president meaning and Michael We'll take you on a private tour of Mount. Vernon George Washington's private home. And we also offer group tours of Mount Vernon at one hundred fifty dollars or more, if give one hundred dollars or more, you can become a sponsor of an episode, and have your name or the name of someone you know read as a sponsor during an episode, so you'll be immortalized in this American President History, and if you donate less than that, you can have the option I. Think the minimum twenty five dollars. You can have the option of getting a Mug a shirt or both. And if you like swag, if you know someone that does, this is the perfect item the perfect gift so just make sure you go to kickstarter and look up this American President podcasts studio and again just behalf of me and Michael. We just want to thank you all for your generous donations, and we look forward to giving you more quality historical content in the future. In our previous episode, we covered President Harry. S Truman's likely rise to power and his first few months in office, he had made the momentous decision to drop the atomic bomb. World. War is over in America and the world now look to an era of peace. But, new problems were on the horizon. The victorious allies were now forging a new world order, but couldn't agree on what that order should look like. The world had suffered through two world wars and desperately feared. Especially now that the atomic genie was out of the bottle. HOW President Truman handled? These challenges is the subject of this episode of this American President. Own. As. We covered in our previous episode. Truman succeeded to the presidency upon the death of Franklin D, Roosevelt, the longest serving president and one of the most consequential chief executives in American history. It was not easy to follow president as popular as FDR and Truman would spend much of his presidency trying to measure up. But for those who neutral and worked with him. There was something about him that people admired. In a previous episode about FDR I noted that he was a bit devious. He was a true politician who often gave his staffers contradictory information and manipulated them. Roosevelt's secretary of war. Henry, Stimson who served as a cabinet member for two previous presidents described him as quote, the poorest administrator I've ever worked under. Not so with trim. This midwestern Haberdasher was refreshingly straightforward even with the media. Journalists cable. Phillips wrote quote he used the press. Occasionally as most presidents have done to test the wind, but he never tried to condom with flattery and devious favouritism, Harry Truman worked less to ingratiate himself with people, but succeeded better at it than any important public figure I've ever known he did it. I think because he was so utterly honest with and about himself. There was something people found endearing about the feisty midwesterner. He also had these huge pair of bottle cap glasses that magnified his is White House usher B. West said quote I had the feeling he was looking at me all around me straight through me. Truman's advisers and his staff came to really love the man. They admired his integrity and the way he managed his administration. His Labor Secretary of State. Dean Aitchison, wrote quote. He was so fair he didn't make different decisions with different people. He called everyone together. You were all heard, and you got the answer together. He was a square dealer all the way through. atchison found that Truman was confident insecure in his own abilities, even while being surrounded by brilliant men observing that quote, he was not afraid of the competition of other ideas, but atchison added that Truman was grounded and humble quote, free of the greatest vice in a leader, his ego never came between him and his job, and they loved his unpretentious manner. A secret service agent Floyd Boring wrote quote. He never came on as being superior, he would talk to anyone he could talk to the lowly peasant also talk to the King of England. Agent. Boring later called one of my favorite Harry. Truman stories, which made clear his devotion to his wife Bess. Now Best Truman hated the limelight and hated being first lady and Truman remained, totally devoted to her. When Truman was in Berlin during the Potsdam conference he was in a car with a young military officer and agent boring. During the ride, the officer hinted to him he could get him anything. He wanted including a Harem of women. In Response Truman gave him the reprimand of a lifetime. He said quote listened son. I'm married my sweetheart. She doesn't run around on me and I. Don't run around on her I. Want that understood. Don't ever mention that kind of stuff to me again. When Truman got out, he didn't bother saying goodbye to the young officer. In the few months after the Japanese surrender, the world remained euphoric from the end of the war. But many feared that a new conflict was on the horizon. The Soviets continued to ignore the y'all to address negotiated by FDR Churchill and Stalin earlier in nineteen, forty. The Soviets promised democratic elections in Eastern Europe, but they were reneging on that commitment. The Soviet Union was imposing communist puppet governments there and in other places like Azerbaijan. The Soviets believed that they were entitled to create a buffer zone in eastern Europe something they wanted to do after being invaded twice by Germany during the world wars, but that buffer zone meant totalitarian rule over the populations in those countries, the Americans and the Soviets grew more and more suspicious of each other's intentions. At the same time Communist parties were rising and France. In Italy and in China. The most populous nation on the planet, the Communists under Mao Zedong were gaining ground in the civil war against Chiang's nationalist government. Many Americans felt that Communism was spreading across the world and feared that it was just as aggressive a totalitarian government as the Nazi regime was. In just a few weeks in February and March of Nineteen forty-six, a series of events occurred. That would solidify. What would be known as the Cold War? On February Ninth Soviet leader. Joseph Stalin delivered a speech in Moscow where he recapped what happened during World War. Two and how the victory over the Nazis supposedly was proof of the superiority of the Communist system. It's interesting because I've read the speech and he doesn't directly say much about the United States or the West or about boosting military production, but given the tensions of the time it was interpreted as an aggressive speech. Stalin said that capitalism inevitably leads to war, which is what happened in World War Two and seemed to imply that a future war was also inevitable quote. Perhaps catastrophic wars could be avoided if it were possible periodically to redistribute raw materials and market among the respective countries in conformity with their economic weight by means of concerted and peaceful decisions. But this is impossible under the president capitalists conditions of the World Economic Development. Stolen then called for a massive increase in steel, iron, coal and oil production, saying quote only when we succeed in doing that. Can we be sure that our motherland will be insured against all contingencies? Americans were alarmed. Supreme Court Justice William Douglas said it was a quote declaration of world. War Three. It's easy to think that this may have been an overreaction on the part of Americans. Be after a member. They had the memory of arms races in the early twentieth century when Europe especially Britain and Germany engaged in an endless competition to build stronger ships and other weapons of war. Arms racists that ended turning into war to them arms. Racists seemed to make a war inevitable. And, then came disturbing news from the north from Canada. A clerk named Eager Zenko who worked in the Soviet embassy defected and exposed a high level spiring, which was passing nuclear secrets to the Soviet Union about the Manhattan project the project to build the atomic bomb. Eventually thirty nine people were arrested in eighteen were convicted. One of them was an actual member of the Canadian parliament. A man named Fred rose. I remember taking American history classes in college and learning about the paranoia that people felt during the Cold War and I got the sense that my professors and classmates thought that it was silly for Americans to have been so concerned. And there were times when in a country of hundreds of millions that paranoia might have gone too far and have led to excesses, but I think it's easy to forget why Americans felt the fear of communism that they did they had lived through the world wars where they had fought against authoritarian regimes, and had a genuine and understandable concern. The Soviets were the next great enemy. They had the memory of Hitler in the Nineteen Thirties how he rose to power, and how Europeans tried to placate him by bargaining with him. They're remember that appeasement only invited further aggression. They remembered how isolationist America had been in the nineteen thirties, and how the world fell apart without their leadership. Many Americans felt had they been more involved in the world, they might have prevented things from exploding into global conflict. Far fewer lies would have been lost. And now that the Soviets were expanding aggressively into Europe. They wondered if they had to do something now that if they didn't, they'd have to face stronger. Soviet Union later on. After all the Soviets were the only true power left in Europe. And looming over all of this was the fact that the nuclear genie was out of the bottle America had a monopoly on the bomb as far as they knew, but there was a sense that inevitably other nations would soon attain. Ability. And just north above the United States, Americans were learning that there were people living in Canada actively spying on the Manhattan project on behalf of the Soviets. Of course, multiple nations were engaged in espionage America included. But the steak seemed higher than ever before with the fear that world war three might be around the corner where the weapons could now threaten the existence of civilization. Everything even the smallest incidents had geopolitical implications in a time of tension, the knowledge that spies were on the continent made it hard to not be at least a little paranoid. But, these factors in mind it's easy to see why people were alarmed. It was on February. Twenty Second Nineteen forty-six that a State Department official stationed in Moscow named George Kennan sent a message to Washington. That would change the course of American foreign policy. It would be known as the long telegram. It was an analysis of the Soviet Union. But it was really a kind of psychoanalysis of the Russian mind, a mind that predated the communist regime. In it Kenan essentially argued that for years American policy towards the Soviet Union was one big long mistake. According to Canon America under Roosevelt, and now under, Truman, naively believed that it could use diplomacy to cooperate with the Soviets, he described Russian leaders as inherently insecure and suspicious of the rest of the world, a kind of deeply embedded paranoia, even xenophobia. The. Telegram reads like a rough draft. It's missing a few articles, but bear with me quote at bottom of Kremlin's neurotic view of world affairs is traditional and instinctive, Russian sense of insecurity. Ironically can allowed that. This was just a reflection of Russian leadership, not the people. He said that the people were quote by and large friendly to the outside world eager for experience of it. But also that Russian leaders historically were paranoid of outside influence because of their own rule, which was fragile and easily threatened by outsiders especially Western nations and that threat wasn't just a military threat, but also because the outside world exposed the Russian people to new ideas quote. Russian rulers have invariably sensed that their rule was relatively archaic, inform fragile and artificial in its psychological foundation, unable to stand comparison or contact with political systems of Western countries. For this reason they have always feared foreign penetration feared direct contact between Western world and their own fear. What would happen if Russians learned truth about world without if foreigners learn truth about world within? Part of this fear of neighbors was understandable since they had experienced brutal German invasion and bore the brunt of Hitler's war machine, but nonetheless it was used as an excuse to impose totalitarianism on their own people and on nearby states. Can impress upon his readers that there was nothing America could do to change the Russians sense of insecurity. It was too much part of their character. Russian leaders, including stolen US suspicion and paranoia of the outside world for political control as a justification for imposing dictatorship on the people of the Soviet Union. Communism was the perfect ideology for this because it allowed him to claim that the outside world run by capitalists were an ever-present threat to the Soviet Union. Kennan wrote quote. Marxist dogma rendered even more truculent and intolerant by Lennon's interpretation became the perfect vehicle for sense of insecurity, with which Bolsheviks even more than previous Russian rulers were afflicted. In, this dogma with its basic altruism of purpose, they found justification for their instinctive fear of outside world for the dictatorship without which they did not know how to rule. But Marxism wasn't just about maintaining Soviet rule, it was also about fueling Russian nationalism of Russian, in now Soviet greatness. Paranoia breeds a bunker mentality of us the world quote. This is only the steady advance of uneasy Russian nationalism, a centuries old movement in which conceptions of. And Defense are inextricably confused, but in the new guys of International Marxism with its honey promises to a desperate and war-torn outside world, it is more dangerous and insidious than ever before. Can also said that this type of mindset precluded any normal type of relationship between the United States and the Soviets quote, we are thus up against the fact that suspicion in one degree, or another is an integral part of the Soviet system, and will not yield entirely to any form of rational persuasion or assurance. This mattered because the Soviet Union dead believe quote in the long run, there can be no permanent peaceful coexistence. As a result, the Soviets would work quote to undermine General Political and strategic potential of major Western powers. In essence Ken was saying that the Russians were simply wired to be at odds with America that there was nothing that could be done to change that for the time being, and that the Soviet Union was working to destroy the world America and the West were trying to build quote. Soviet policy will be directed toward weakening of power and influence and contacts of advanced Western nations. Kenan didn't spell out a clear strategy admitting that he didn't have all the answers. He didn't believe that the US should intervene militarily to stop the Soviets calling it quote sheerest nonsense. He also noted that the United States had many advantages especially since the Soviet Union was between the two quote by far the weaker, force. He was also careful to distinguish between the totalitarianism represented by Hitler, and that represented by Stalin seeing quote. Soviet power unlike that of Hitlerite. Germany is neither schematic nor adventuristic. It does not work by fixed plans. It does not take unnecessary risks. In other words, the Soviets weren't the same, impulsive and immediate threat that the Nazis were. Still ten in was vaguely recommending a sort of patient long-term strategy of strength. He said that the Soviets were highly sensitive to logic of force. If the adversary has sufficient force and makes clear his readiness to use it, he rarely has to do so. According to Kenan America had a real threat to face when it came to remaking the global order and had to build up the strength to confront it. It was a subtle more mysterious threat than Nazi Germany one that we would have to dedicate resources to learn more about into think carefully. It would be a new type of conflict, not one out in the open, but an ambiguous competition of sorts that could be of indefinite duration. The document was widely circulated in Washington, DC, and got people at the highest levels of American power, thinking about just how to deal with the Soviets. President Truman read the telegram, but we don't know exactly how he reacted. Kenan's paper was sobering, but not everyone was convinced that the Soviets were adversaries. The United States and the Soviet Union had been allies for years. Many Americans at the highest levels had worked closely with Soviet officials. They still believe that cooperation was possible and feared that applying cannons ideas. Could itself bring about the conflict between the two superpowers? It could be a self fulfilling prophecy. Kenan on the other hand seem to argue the conflict had already started. Just a couple of weeks later on March Fifth President Truman was with Winston Churchill in Fulton Missouri. There Churchill could recently lost his position as prime minister of Great. Britain gave a speech in Westminster College. It was a speech. They would echo throughout the rest of the twentieth century. Steady in. In the. In the Adriatic. An Ion gooden has descended across the continent. Behind that line. All the capitals of the ancient states of central and eastern the. Wausau value in. Prague. Vienna. This! belegrade. UPS and software. All these famous. And the population around them lie. Locked I must go. And all up. In one form or another? The Soviet influence. But the day high, and in some cases increasing. Often travel from from Moscow. I. Am not believe the show. Get record aisles will. Well. It's fruit. And the indefinite extension of how and doctrines. What what I have seen Russia and France and allied building the wall. I am convinced that there's nothing they admire as much as strict. And nothing which they have less respect than weakness. Effectively military we. George Kennan had called for facing the Soviets with strengh. Now Winston Churchill, perhaps the most admired man in the world, was putting the weight of his prestige behind that argument. Those. Who Feared Soviet? Expansionism were pleased by Churchill's speech. But others especially those on the left felt that Churchill's words were provocative that they would inflame the situation and pushed the Soviets away from us. Journalist Walter. Lippmann said that the speech was in quote. Almost catastrophic blunder more ominously stolen said that it was a quote call to war. Harry Truman's opinions during this time are bit ambiguous on one hand. He had no illusions about the type of regime. The Soviets Ran. In our previous episode we saw that he had given the Soviet Foreign Minister Molotov some tough talk, chastising him for Soviet violations of the Alta agreements. Truman had promised to be firm on the Russians. But. He also admitted to being charmed by stolen during their meeting at Potsdam and had said quote. I like stone. He straightforward to his close friend Charlie Ross. Truman said that he found the worries about Russia a bit excessive. Many of Truman's opponents on the right believe that his administration was failing to act against the Soviets allowing them to impose their rule on eastern Europe. They believed that this inaction was just as bad or even worse than what Neville Chamberlain had done with Hitler in late thirties that allowing Stalin to impose his will would only invite further aggression and make a future war inevitable Republican senator. Robert Taft said that the Democrats were quote so divided between Communism and Americanism that it's foreign policy can only be futile and contradictory and make the United States the laughing stock of the world. A young Republican congressman from California Richard, Nixon claimed that the trump administration was a quote front for un-american elements, wittingly or otherwise. Either way more officials in the Truman Administration. We're seeing the Soviets as a long term threat. Even, so it's one thing to recognize the Communist threat. It's a whole other thing to develop a strategy to deal with it. Now one thing I want to emphasize here is just how new everything was. There had never been anything like the Cold War. When you consider its scale and complexity how it turned conventional wisdom on its head. It was the first time you can really say that. The entire world was largely divided between two camps, the Americans and the Soviets. It was an ideological conflict, not just WANNA pure power. On one side you had the Americans leader, the capitalists and democratic world. On the other hand you had the Soviets the leader of the Communist, world. It was also different because it involved a weapon of unprecedented destructive power. Although the Americans alone had the bomb, the Soviets were undoubtedly racing to master as well. For the first time a conflict was developing which involved a weapon that could one day destroy all of humanity. This is where you really have to put yourself in the shoes of the people. At the time. We know history turns out. We know that in one thousand, nine, hundred, nine, the Berlin. Wall fell in Nineteen, ninety, one, the Soviet Union fell. But as I like to remind people. One at the time knew that that would happen. They felt just uncertain about their future as we do about ours. Now the Truman administration faced the challenge of developing policy to deal with this situation. I think it's easy to think of that strategy. simplistically as one of quote, screw the Communists. It's also easy to assume that American foreign policy at this time was a very simple thing or that everyone in the trump administration agreed with each other that it was a monolithic entity. I remember in college reading history books that portrayed members of the Truman. Administration as one giant unit of people who saw the Soviet Union in simplistic or unsophisticated terms, just as some form of unmitigated evil without any understanding the nuances of Communist ideology. But the evidence seems to show a much more complex response. The first question was. How does one even define success? There wasn't an actual hot war going on. We're there would be battles with a clear cut, winner and loser. This was a far more ambiguous conflict after all. How would the United States win this Cold War. Did victory mean the total collapse of the Soviet Union was at forcing the Soviets out of Europe, was it a world where both sides coexisted peacefully? And, what about the cost? Addressing security threats is expensive? It usually involves building up ones military, but arms races are expensive. America had just spent billions in. World War Two to defeat the Nazis and the Japanese not to mention the money it spent before that for the new deal. During the depression confronting a huge powerful nation like the Soviet Union was something that was likely to be very expensive. Where we willing to spend even more money in a conflict of indefinite duration. And what if in trying to confront the Soviets? We actually bankrupted ourselves. What would be the consequences of that? Would we defeating ourselves in trying to defeat the Soviets? And there is yet another dilemma. How do you protect yourself from a potential adversary, but do it in a way without provoking war? As the world learned in world, war one arms. Racists are inherently dangerous. Nations build up their weapons to defend themselves, and in the hopes of keeping the peace, but in doing so provoked their competitors to do the same thing. The result is usually increased tensions. If these tensions increased too much, they lead to war. American policymakers had to walk a tightrope. I mentioned George Kennan earlier, the man who wrote the long telegram. Well in the summer of nineteen, forty seven, he wrote another article that appeared in foreign. Affairs magazine. It was titled Quote. The sources of Soviet CONDUCT UNDER THE PSEUDONYM MR X. Will documents like these help us understand the kind of strategy. The Truman Administration undertook to deal with the Soviets. The most famous line from this article is quote the main element of any United States policy toward the Soviet. Union must be that of long term patient, but firm and vigilant containment of Russian expansive tendencies. That word containment became the one word summary of American foreign policy. The idea was that the Soviets were intent on expanding their control and influence in the world, and this expansion would happen in two different ways over at military means or covert means such as those through espionage or by developing economic and cultural influence over its neighbors. The United. States would try to contain that expansion to limit or halted. US policy makers. Different alternatives, but they believed that there is no quick fix. They even considered some sort of nuclear attack or military action against Moscow, but the former might require killing thousands or millions of people, and would provoke anger and revulsion around the world. The latter would likely start another war anyways a war that the American people didn't want. Some also believe that we should use our monopoly on the bond of force the Russians to change to blackmail them into changing their behavior by threatening to attack them with the atomic bomb. But of America threatening to use nuclear weapons at all was just so unsavory. It also brought up the question where we really willing to use the bomb to at our way. That alone could. Are Allies allies that could be critical in containing the Soviets. Policy makers in Washington felt that there was no chance to change things quickly. They felt at the Soviets were here to stay containing them would be a long-term effort. For containment to work, we needed to be patient. It might have to last year's maybe even several decades. It was a tall order to call a war weary country to a along struggle with no clear picture of victory, but that's what would happen. But American strategists like Kenan face the prospect of how to contain the Russians. Did that mean responding with force whenever the Russians tried to expand? And how do you establish credibility so that the Soviets took our threats seriously? That usually involves showing a willingness to use force. After all didn't Churchill say that there. There's nothing the Russians admire so much a strength and there's nothing for which they have less respect than for weakness. But again the use of force was a dangerous thing. Responding militarily to the Soviets could mean war, and that reality was something that no one really wanted. Having fought the World War Two. No one was looking forward to fighting another war among superpowers. One thing I think is interesting is just how concern American planners at the time we're worried about the cost of containment. As I said earlier arms, races and wars were expensive. It costs billions of dollars to try to counter the other side's move and this tit for tat arms race could spiral out of control. There was this fear that the very effort to stop. The Soviets would bankrupt America. If that happened, we would be defeating ourselves. What if that was part of the Soviets plan would if they were trying to force us into bankrupting ourselves? So the Cold War became this paradoxical race, not just to outdo the other side incapability, but to do so in a way that didn't cause one's own treasury to collapse. But how do you do that? Given the simple fact that building up military strength costs money. The, Truman administration feared that trying to match the Soviets might be self-defeating, and that was related to the question of where to contain communism. The communists according to historian John Lewis Gaddis expanded its influence by installing friendly governments, mainly in eastern Europe and by promoting communist political parties in various countries throughout the world. The Communist forces in China, regaining the upper hand against the Western supported nationalist government. As the communist expanded in Europe and it was gaining ground in China. The question became. Where should the United States concentrate its efforts to contain the red menace. Some suggested what was called A. Defense basically to create an entire perimeter around the communist world. The idea was that wherever the Soviets expanded the United States should intervene somehow to stop it to contain it, but there were obvious drawbacks I, trying to defend a massive global perimeter was a very expensive project. Second, it would essentially give the Soviets the initiative they would be able to dictate where the confrontations what happened, and if it could do that, it could choose areas that would play to their strengths. So Kenan sought to address this I by process of building up a select group of nations in the world at key strategic locations, certain strong points, a strategy called strongpoint defense as opposed to the perimeter defense. Part of this was to get American allies strong enough so that they could stand up on their own two feet so that the United States wouldn't have to bear the burden the cost of containing communism. Merrick couldn't do this everywhere, but it could concentrate on high priority. Areas Kennan believed that the United States should focus specifically on building up. Europe especially Germany in Asia specifically Japan ironic considering that just a few years earlier, World War was fought to destroy those nations, capabilities and the way the US would build them up wouldn't necessarily come primarily from military means, but through economic and technological assistance, basically through loans and grants of aid with the specific goal of modernizing their economies, a stronger economy would help fund those countries, militaries and reduce the appeal of Communist parties. Second. Kenan recommended basically divide and conquer strategy. The Soviet Union was the leader of international communism and tentacles in different parts of the world. It was inevitable that managing the interest amongst so many entities would become difficult and unwieldy. Some people today believe that American policymakers of this time viewed the world in simplistic ways that they saw different communist groups, as just one monolithic block, and that the Russian reds were no different from Chinese reds. Historian John Lewis. Gaddis writes that quote. Closer examination reveals more complex patterns. Part of the strategy of dividing up the communist world involve learning nations away from the Soviet bloc. This might be accomplished in part by the power of example, if the West could display a way of life that showcase the prosperity of democracy and capitalism so get, states might be tempted to leave Moscow orbit. Another way would be to provide aid. If the United States offered Soviet nations financial incentives that were better than what the Soviets could offer. They would have even more reason to leave Moscow's influence. As. Kennan wrote quote. There's a possibility that Russian. Communism may someday be destroyed by its own children in the form of the rebellious communist parties of other nations. But. What was the end game? What was the administration aiming for through containment? Will Kenan was a realist, there wasn't some Utopian believed that the Soviet Union would change or that it would collapse and become democratic overnight. He had a farmer realistic goal of what was called behavior modification. Idea was that long-term pressure by the United States and its allies could convince Soviet leaders that they couldn't remain aggressive or interfere in the affairs of other nations abroad that it's best interests or adhering to the principles underpinning the international system. This meant that? The United States would resist aggressive actions by the Soviets, but also reward them. When they reacted cooperatively constructively, this opened the possibility of having high level talks or summits between the United States president and the Soviet leaders using a punishment reward system. The Soviets might come to see that adhering to Western values might be in their best interest. So these were the guiding principles that informed a lot of America's Cold War strategy. It was one based on an awareness that the United States had limited resources that its population was not for war that there was diversity in the communist world, and that change would likely come over time. And it was one that relied less on military power in more on the economic power of the United States. In one, thousand, nine, forty, seven. You see the Truman administration implementing the first elements of the strategy. Truman appointed George Marshall the, architect of American victory in world, War Two as his secretary of state. Truman and Marshall both formulated. What would become the Marshall Plan? It was done in response to the fact that Europe's economy especially, Germany was an utter ruins in the aftermath of World War Two. German weakness made it vulnerable to the Soviets from the outside. The desperate conditions suffered by its people, mates, socialism, or communism, more appealing internally so in June of nineteen, forty, seven, the Truman Administration implemented the Marshall Plan Truman knew that Marshall was one of the most respected men in the world, so he insisted that it be named after him. That if it were the Truman plan, it would incur a lot more opposition. The Marshall Plan, did leave open the possibility for aid to Soviet nations again as a way to encourage them to leave the Soviet Union, but Moscow ensured that they refused. and. Part of the reason was that the plan required a certain level of transparency in how the money was used. Something stolen could not tolerate. The United. States ended up providing about seventeen billion dollars to seventeen countries, which today's numbers is about one hundred, eighty, seven, billion, an investment in the strength of its allies something that would contribute to America's own security. For those who believe that this would be expensive. Truman ask quote which is better for the country to spend twenty or thirty billion dollars over the next four years to keep the peace or to do so as we did in nineteen twenty, and then have to spend one hundred billion dollars for four years to fight a war. In March. Nineteen, forty, seven, an unexpected opportunity, came up to implement the strong point defense concept at very specific locations. At the beginning of the year Great Britain announced that it would be leaving Greece. And Turkey it had been supporting both nations against communist take. There's the Greeks were fighting a civil war against communist, and the Turks were facing pressure from Stalin to allow the Soviets naval access to the Turkish Straits. The Truman administration feared that Britain's departure could mean expansion of Soviet military influence into Europe one of Ken and strong points. So with the help of his close advisor Dean Atchison. Truman developed a plan to the two nations on March Twelfth Nineteen. Forty seven. The president went to Congress and requested four million dollars for Greece and Turkey. But more importantly trim made a declaration that would come to define his presidency. States has received from the Greek government. And Urgent Appeal for financial and economic assistance. Greece must have assistance if it is become a self supporting and self respecting democracy. The very existence of the great state is today threatened by the terrorist activities of several thousand armed men led by Communists. The British government. which has been helping Greece can give no further, financial or economic aid after March thirty first. The British government has informed us that. Owing to its own difficulties, it can no longer extend financial or economic aid to Turkey. As in the case of Greece. If Turkey is to have the assistant it needs. The United States must supply it. We are the only country able to provide that help. We shall not realize our objectives, however, unless we are willing to help free peoples to maintain their free institutions and their national integrity against aggressive movements that seek to impose upon them totalitarian regimes. This is no more than a frank recognition that totalitarian regimes imposed upon free people's by direct or indirect aggression undermined the foundations of international peace. And hence the security of the United States. Those words would be known as the Truman Doctrine. The idea that the United States had an obligation to act in defense of other nations to prevent the expansion of communism. In Truman's is he was merely implementing Kenan containment policies, but others feared that the administration was departing from those policies that it's limited. Strong strategy was being expanded to a larger scale in Kenan had ever intended. They feared that Truman might be extending the United States involvement in the world beyond its capacity. Ever since the Soviet Union collapsed in Nineteen ninety-one, leaving America as the sole superpower, there's been this misperception the idea that the goal of American foreign policy during the Cold War was to destroy the Soviet Union. At the start of the Cold War. This wasn't the ultimate strategy. Instead it was to create the conditions so that it would change its behavior or reform itself. That was can strategy to convince the Soviets that it was in their interest. Follow Western norms. There was a sense of realism in Kenan's plan. A wariness of being too am vicious, the idea of taking down the entire Soviet regime with all its tanks and ships, the country, so large struck many in the west who were already war, weary as a fantasy and many felt we would defeat ourselves trying. Can really fear that we could defeat ourselves by overspending, so he worried about American extension. Strategies are Nice on paper. Having a strategy, a plan is indispensable, but the reality is that things are different in practice especially when they are fused with a sense of urgency, the urgency. Let's say that comes with having nuclear bomb. In, a series of events would lead the Truman administration to modify Kenan plan beyond what its author intended. June of Nineteen, forty eight Joseph Stalin decided to test Western resolve. He ordered that all traffic in and out of Berlin blockade. That meant all rail and highway traffic anything that came in and out. Now as I said earlier, Germany was divided into different zooms with the United States, Britain and France occupying the western part of Germany than Soviet Union occupying the eastern part. Berlin was the capital and was also divided into sectors among the great powers the Americans. The British and the French and the Soviets had sectors in capital, but the problem for the West was that the entire city of Berlin was in the Soviet sector of the whole country. Westerners in Berlin, were basically in an island surrounded by Soviet controlled territory. This gave stolen an opportunity. He knew that Berlin 's position in the Soviet sector gave him leverage over the West, and he and his advisors also believed that Berlin was a crucial test. I Soviet strength. His foreign minister said quote. What happens to Berlin happens to Germany what happens to Germany happens to Europe. The! Soviets felt that they had reason for. The residents of Berlin had recently elected city officials were anti communists. Also? The West began to combine their occupation zones and created the beginnings of a West German government won aligned with the Western powers. The Soviets believed that these were hostile. Actions designed to create pro-american Trojan Horse in the middle of the Communist bloc. Stalin? decided to cut off Berlin from the West with its two point, five million people preventing anything from coming in or out. Western officials in Berlin would be stranded and left to starve for food and supplies. It represented a daunting challenge to western powers especially since Soviet forces in Berlin outnumbered American British and French forces almost three to one. Some critics of Western policy are you at the establishment of a pro American government in West? Germany was too aggressive and forced the Soviets to blockade breath. At the same time, the western part of Germany needed a government some kind, even if it meant that the country is, a whole would be divided. And the Soviets had little room to talk since they had set up friendly governments all over eastern Europe, not to mention their heavy handed rule resulted in many native berliners supporting anti communists. Either way these events served as a pretext for the Soviets to make moves on Berlin. This immediately. Put Truman in fine. What do you do in this situation? If he backed down and pulled American forces out or left them there without aid America would appear weak so weak that it couldn't protect itself and its allies. Our friends would question our resolve. Remember the lesson of appeasement. People felt our adversary would be emboldened. But if Truman acted, he ran the risk of escalation. Provoking Soviets into more aggressive action isn't hard to imagine war potentially breaking out. Remember events can spiral out of control that was the lesson of World War One rational decisions can lead to unintended consequences and potentially total disaster. But? Truman didn't flinch and he countered the Soviets with a combination of both resolve and creativity. Truman rejected any ideas of pullout. Saying quote, we stay in Berlin period. Just four days later after the blockade began Truman ordered a full-scale airlift operation to supply berliners with food water and supplies. It was a risky move because attempted the Soviets to shoot the planes down. If that happened. Fighting may ensue. and. It was also happening during the stress of a presidential election year were Truman, was running his own term, and where the political stakes were high. But Truman was willing to dare Stalin. Soon American aircraft were flying in thousands of tons of food and supplies every day. After, about a year by the spring of one, thousand, nine, hundred, forty, nine, two, hundred, seventy, seven thousand flights delivered two point three million tons of food. The whole operation was an unprecedented logistical success. Stalin finally realized the futility of the blockade in order that it's cease Harry. Truman had stood toe to toe with Joseph Stalin the most ruthless despot in the world and got him back down. Although the Berlin airlift was a triumph for the United States the world remained as dangerous as ever, and things would get even more dangerous. In nineteen forty eight Harry, Truman had won a presidential term his own right. It was one of the greatest upsets in American history. One of those supporting Harry Truman was an actor in Hollywood Ronald Reagan. who also happened to be the head of the screen actors guild? Reagan was an avowed FDR new deal Democrat having voted for him four times, and also supported President Truman appearing with him at a campaign event and recording an ad supporting him Ronald. Reagan would eventually abandoned. The Democratic Party believing. It was failing to respond to Soviet communism. In Truman's inaugural address in January twentieth, nineteen forty nine. He portrayed the Cold War in terms of an epic confrontation between two ideologies, two ways of life. In pursuit of these aims, the United States and other like minded nations. Find, themselves directly opposed. By a regime and contrary aims and a totally different concept of life. That regime adheres to a false philosophy. which purports to offer freedom, security and Greater? Mankind. Misled by that lots of. Many people's have sacrificed their liberties. Only to learn. That deceit and mockery. Poverty and Are there hard. That false philosophy is communism. Communism is based on the belief. That man is so weak and inadequate. That he has unable to govern himself and therefore requires the rule of strong masters. Democracy is based on the conviction. That man has the moral and intellectual capacity as well as the inevitable right. To govern himself with Raisin and justice. Communism suggest subjects to individual. You Arrest Without Lawful Cau-. Punishment without trial. And forced labor as a channel of the state. It degrades what information he shall receive. What are t show produce? What leaders he shall follow and what thoughts he shelf think. Democracy maintains that government is established for the benefit of the individual. And is charged with the responsibility. Of protecting the rights of the individual. And his freedom, and the exercise of those abilities of his. Maintains that social wrongs can be corrected only by violence. Democracy has proved that social justice can be achieved through peaceful change. Communism hold the world is so widely divided into opposing classes. Not War is inevitable. Democracy holds that free nations can settle differences just me and maintain a lasting peace. The difference the differences between Communism and democracy. Do, not concern. The United States alone. People everywhere are coming to realize that what is involved is material well-being. Human Dignity and the right to believe in and worship Dob. I state these differences not go issues. Out believe as such. But because the actions resulting from the Communist, lots of it. are a threat to the efforts of three nations. To bring, Bob, world recovery and lasting fees. Clearly. The Cold War was in full swing. The stakes of that conflict suddenly increased on August twenty, ninth nineteen, forty nine on that date. The Soviet Union tested their first atomic bomb. It was stunning news with that. The United States lost its monopoly on atomic weapons. The News sent shockwaves around the world literally and figuratively. Experts had estimated that the Soviets would attain the bomb for another four years or so, but they were wrong. Americans came to grips with the fact that Joseph Stalin, the butcher of millions now had the most powerful weapon in history. It's impossible to understand how terrifying this was. We live in an era where countries like Pakistan North Korea have some measure of nuclear capability, and we're used to living with that reality. People back then weren't used to that yet. The seen the pictures of her Oshima and Gue- sake after the bombings, and they felt some measure of security that the bomb was only in American hands. Now they were in the hands of a man. They considered a mass murder. The next major shock was just about a month later on. October First Nineteen Forty Nine Mao Tse Tung. Officially proclaimed the People's Republic of China. Mouse Communist forces had conclusively defeated Changcai Checks Nationalist Government and taken power five hundred eighty million Chinese citizens in the most populous country in the world, a fifth of the world's population amount four times larger than the entire population of the United States was now under communism. I remember in high school and college learning about the much criticised Donald Theory, the idea that if one country fell to communism, in might spread to other countries. Of course now it's easy to criticise ideas simplistic. But what if you live during that time? What if you saw what happened? When the West appeased Hitler, which only encouraged him further, and what if he saw within a month the Soviets get the bomb. Almost six hundred million people fall under a communist regime not to mention the cases of Soviet espionage in the United States back home. Truman's opponents blamed him for these developments for insufficiently supporting the nationalists against the Communists in China for failing to prevent the Soviet espionage of US nuclear technology. They continue to accuse his government being infested with communists. The most prominent official to be accused was Alger hiss a high level official who had served in the State Department and even been with FDR at the Yalta Conference. This was the environment that produced the rise of Joseph McCarthy the infamous US senator who produced list after? Of government officials, he claimed communists. McCarthy and supporters field a sense of paranoia across the nation. There was this real sense that the enemy wasn't just out there, but here at home. The Wisconsin senator spoke to those fears and began making audacious claims about the number of communists in the government in the united. And it resonated at one point, a Gallup poll showed that forty percent of Americans had a favorable opinion on McCarthy while only thirty six percent had an unfavorable opinion. Pretty soon the House Committee on un-american activities rose to prominence. It had been around since the late thirties, but now it became a force as it investigated Communist influence these were the years of the Hollywood blacklist McCarthy. Attacked Truman and the Democrats he said that the Roosevelt and Sherman administrations constituted quote twenty years of treason. It was at this time that Americans began to look back. Interpret events from this Lens. They now saw Yalta as a massive giveaway to the Soviets as the moment when FDR betrayed millions behind the Iron Curtain Truman dismissed McCarthy as a crank sing. He was quote the best asset the Kremlin has. McCarthy had widespread support. Many shared his fear of communism, but more and more people began to question his tactics. Perhaps his biggest mistake was going after America's most respected figure George. Marshall Marshall had spent some time in China where he tried to bring together the warring factions when it fell to communism. McCarthy accused Marshall being responsible, he accused them of being involved in a conspiracy so immense and so infamous so black as to dwarf any previous venture in the history of Man. Is probably the dumbest thing McCarthy could have done? No one could credibly criticize a man of Marshall Stature, more and more Americans came to see McCarthy's tactics excessive as pure demagoguery, regardless of how real the Communist threat was. As the national debate raged on the events of thousand, nine, hundred, thousand nine caused the truth administration to shift too far more aggressive posture than that recommended by George Kennan by then the United States had initiated a massive series of bureaucratic reforms. This was the era when the National Security Council the Department of Defense the. The Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Air Force were all formerly created the major components of the modern national security state. We live in a world where we take it for granted that we have a permanent military intelligence establishment. But this was the first time these institutions were created on a permanent basis especially in a time where there wasn't a hot work going on. These are massive changes to the American landscape, and they started under President Truman. These institutional changes extended internationally as well in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, nine Truman's new secretary of State, the brilliant. Dean atchison negotiated the establishment of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization America's first peacetime military alliance. Ever twelve countries signed up America Canada and many Western European nations to Kenan. These actions constituted a possible over extension of America's capability and could be interpreted as aggression by the Soviet Union. But in President Truman's is, they were necessary to securing Western civilization. By this time Harry Truman was no stranger to hard decisions, and he had one sitting on his desk. It was on whether or not the United States should initiate development of the hydrogen bomb. Code named the super in top secret meetings. Harry Truman will always be known as the president who dropped the bomb her Shema. But in many ways, the debate over whether to build a hydrogen bomb was even more heated and more controversial at the highest levels of government. Now I'm physicist I. Do know that the H. Bomb is based on fusion as the A-BOMB which uses vision I also know that the hydrogen bomb representative, an exponential leap, destructive capability whereas atomic bomb explosions were measured in kilotons, thousands of pounds of TNT. Hydrogen bombs were measured in megatons or millions of times. If one felt that the atomic bomb gave us the potential to wipe out civilization, the H. bomb all but confirmed it. Too many. The H. Bomb was a leap closer to the end of civilization. It's no coincidence that this debate raged on soon after the Russians surprised the world by detonating its own atomic bomb for those who supported developing the hydrogen bomb. Their most compelling argument was that the Soviets would attain at one day probably sooner than we were thinking. After. All the Soviets had beaten expectations by developing their own atomic bomb. The H bomb supporters argue that the only way to deter the Soviets from future aggression was to beat them to the super. For those who oppose developing the bomb there, most compelling argument was that by developing. We were releasing a far more dangerous genie out of a bottle. They argued that developing the hydrogen bomb would only encourage other nations to do so leading to an even more dangerous world and the less secure America. After all, isn't that what happened when we developed the atomic bomb? They ask why not try to work with the Soviets to end the arms race and reduce the threat to the world by abolishing nuclear weapons. Truman's top advisors were split on the issue, and it wasn't just an issue of right versus left. ATCHISON supported building the hydrogen bomb. Physicist Edward Teller. Even Eleanor Roosevelt prominent supporter of the United Nations was for it, but George Kennan was against it. As was the father of the Tomich Bomb Robert Oppenheimer. Truman named several of his advisers, including Secretary of State Atchison on a committee known as the Z. Committee to advise him on whether or not to develop the hydrogen bomb. In January nineteen fifty, the committee recommended that Truman go forward with the super on January. Thirty First Nineteen Fifty Truman announced. The development would forward if you read about the meetings that took place. What convinced? Sherman was the intelligence, the Soviets were likely to be developing their own hydrogen bomb. He recalled people predicted World War. Three would start when he sent funds to Greece, and Turkey to fight communism, and that hasn't happened, so he felt that the danger of such a war was not imminent. Ultimately chairman believe that America had no choice but to build the bomb in his words quote, it is part of my responsibility as commander in chief of the Armed Forces to see to it that our country is able to defend itself against any possible aggressor accordingly I've directed the Atomic Energy Commission to continue its work on all forms of atomic weapons, including the so-called. Or super bomb. Like all other work in the field of atomic weapons, it is being and will be carried forward on a basis consistent with the overall objectives of our program for peace and security. With that decision. The world entered a new threshold in nuclear firepower. It was now the thermonuclear age in Kenan's is. It was yet another departure from his more modest vision of containment. The Truman administration continued to expand the scope of its strategy as we highlighted earlier Kenan focused primarily on building up our allies economic capacity as an alternative to costly militarization. But now that communism seemed to be on the March officials in Washington began considering boosting the defense budget. Some felt that this wasn't necessary. America's economy was after all by far the strongest in the world at this time, and it had a four year advantage on the Soviets in nuclear technology. It was easy to assume that the United States had sufficient strength especially when it came to military technology. But in reality, this wasn't all that clear. After World War Two America had demobilized rapidly. The American people were anxious to go back to civilian life. The number of military personnel had gone down from about twelve million people in one, thousand, nine, forty, five to one point, five million in nineteen, fifty by then life magazine reported that the Soviet Union was far ahead of the United States in total conventional military strength. United States army totaled six hundred forty thousand men. The Soviet Union's was at two point six million. America had one armored division. The Soviets had thirty America may twelve hundred planes per year. The Soviets made seven thousand America spent six percent of its national income on defense. The Soviets spent twenty five percent. The Truman administration sought to balance this equation. In April Nineteen Fifty State Department official Paul Nitze released the document that would change the direction of American Defense Policy, a repudiated Kenan strongpoint defense strategy and moved in the direction of a perimeter defense, designating a large area around the Soviet Union and declaring it close to Soviet expansion. This would be achieved by increasing America's military strength to deter and potentially defeats of yet forces it called for a truly unprecedented increase in the Defense Budget Truman, had been spinning around thirteen billion dollars for defense per year. KNITS document also known as NFC sixty eight would use that to about forty or fifty billion dollars, a tripling or quadrupling of the defense budget that money would go not only into nuclear weapons, but building up America's conventional forces well closing the numerical gap between U S and Soviet military capabilities and sixty eight called for speeding up American, technological innovation, it also called for increased taxes on the American people to fund the effort. Heated debate broke out among American policymakers again for people like Kennan. This was exactly what he feared the over extension and potential bankrupting of the United States. Do we really want to militarize the entire effort? Paul Taxes on the American people? They felt that shifting from strong point to perimeter defense was a fool's errand for the reasons I mentioned earlier. Some feared that militarization could remake American society from a free peaceful one into an aggressive police state. For others especially those on the left. It was a needless escalation of the Cold War perhaps making war inevitable. Initially Truman had agreed with Kenan's fears that the US might spend itself to death. So instead of implementing NFC sixty eight. He decided to keep it on the shelf for now. He didn't WANNA. Make a rash decision, but events would conspire to change his opinion. On June twenty-fourth Nineteen Fifty Harry Truman was in his hometown independence Missouri on a short vacation. That night. He received a call from Secretary of State Atchison? that. North Korea had invaded South Korea. Truman's heart sing. According to his daughter. Margaret Truman quote feared that this was the opening of World War Three. He left to fly back to Washington. Create had been part of Japan for one thousand, nine, hundred, nineteen, forty-five. When the war ended, the country was split in half at the thirty eighth parallel. The northern half was occupied by the Soviets in the southern by the Americans. The Soviets installed a communist government under Kim. Il Sung while the Americans installed an anti communist government under syngman Rhee. Both leaders created dictatorships in hope to unify the entire peninsula under their system. The? US, had left South Korea, but the Soviets continued to support Kim's government. The Communist invasion of south, Korea was the first hot war of the nuclear age. American credibility seemed to be on the line. People around the world began. Ask would Washington. Allow Communist aggression to stand. Again, the ghost of appeasement before World War Two hovered over the West Truman later wrote quote I remembered how each time that the democracies failed to act encouraged the aggressors to keep going ahead. If this was allowed to go. Unchallenged would mean a Third World War. Just a similar incidents had brought on the Second World War. Some blamed Secretary of State Atchison. In a speech earlier that year at described a perimeter defense in Asia that the US would hold and not allowed to be breached. He had neglected to mention Korea and Taiwan as part of that perimeter, some believed that this signal to the communist that the United States would not intervene in the event of aggression in those places. It's hard to know if this was a factor either way. The Truman administration had a full blown crisis on its hands. As Truman met with his advisers, the consensus was that the Communists had to be stopped in Korea. In Cannon's original Strategy Korea was not specifically a strong point although Asia in general was, but that was out the window whether you supported strong point defense perimeter defense, it seems that the great conflict between freedom and tyranny were at stake in this one particular country. The question was. How would the United States respond? Should it send in ground troops? Should it just rely on air and naval? Power? Or should it just arm the South Koreans without getting too involved, or should it escalate to the highest level and threatened to use nuclear weapons? Truman wasn't ready to commit trips just five years earlier. American troops arrived home. He wasn't sure if they are ready to fight another war. especially in a region of the world that most Americans knew little about. But, he did order American air and sea forces to provide the Koreans with cover and support with General Douglas Macarthur America's supreme commander in Japan leading the effort. Then Truman decided to go to the United Nations for a resolution to intervene June twenty. The UN complied UN resolution eighty-three called for member states to furnish such assistance to the Republic of Korea, as may be necessary to repel the armed attack and restore international peace and security in the area. At this point with American naval and air forces on the way, the logical step would seem to be for Truman to ask Congress for a declaration of war against North Korea, but for some reason truman and Ms. Advisors hadn't really considered this. Talking about a Congressional Declaration Truman aide George Elsey. said quote. Nobody thought of it at the time. And he added that they were quote too busy. Thinking of military action and United Nations action to try to cover up their tracks with congressional resolutions. Truman seem to believe that getting a UN authorization was sufficient to take action and superseded a congressional declaration of war. This was despite the fact that the US Constitution explicitly granted the power to declare war to Congress. But for Truman, going to Congress would be too much trouble. It may also have been the sense of urgency. The exigencies of the time when the presence of nuclear weapons meant that the president had to take action within minutes or seconds of the start of crisis to him. Congress was more of a stumbling block to defending America's national security. Truman was also careful in how he framed conflict, even though it seemed that America was about to engage in hostilities abroad. Truman was soon explaining to Congress that quote. We are not at war instead. He used the term police action. This signaled a new era in American Military History United States military, was engaging in hostilities abroad as part of an international coalition hostilities, but was not technically in a war. Although terminent I hope to avoid the introduction of ground troops. That changed very quickly. Macarthur was now convinced that air and naval power wouldn't be enough to repel the North Koreans on June thirtieth. He requested to divisions of combat. Forces for a Moment Truman agonized over the decision. He knew what this meant. It meant that just five years after the end of World War Two, he would be sending American men into combat once again. America would be at war whether or not it would be called a police action. You have to imagine what this meant. The country was war-weary and now the president was asking them to bear the burden of another conflict this time in a place where they weren't directly attacked where it wasn't clear that America had a direct stake. Most Americans had had very little knowledge of Korea or new any Koreans now they were being asked to go to war again for their sons to fight and die there. In one letter, an American citizen wrote to Truman quote in Heaven's name. What are you doing? The blood hasn't dried from World War Two. Truman later, said that approving MacArthur's request was the hardest decision of his presidency pretty amazing, considering that he decided to drop the bomb in Japan to develop the hydrogen bomb into confront stolen in Berlin, but he did approve the request. AUREA is a small country. Thousands of miles away. But what is happening, there is important to every American. On Sunday June twenty fifth. Communist, forces attacked the Republic of Korea. Free nations must be on. Their guard. More than ever before against this kind of sneak attack, we are united into testing. Communist slavery. We know that the cost of freedom is high. But we are determined to preserve our freedom, no matter what the calls. The seriousness of the situation unified the country Democrats and Republicans in general closed ranks behind Truman. Even, his strategy was being abandoned. Kenan also fell into line. Despite this not everyone was thrilled with the way Truman entered the conflict. Senator Taft criticized Truman's refusal to ask for a declaration of war, saying the president had quote no legal authority for what he has done. Subsequent presidents have fallen from example Lyndon Johnson did not request a declaration of war when he intervened Vietnam, nor did both bushes in their respective invasions of Iraq to some. This is the reality of the Cold War were international crises in the Nuclear Age cannot wait for the slow deliberation of Congress to others. This is a presidential usurpation of Congress's constitutional powers. That debate continues to this day. I'm not going to get too much into the specifics of the war except for a few points. The first few months were devastating for the American lead. You enforces the South Koreans. It was a hot humid summer. Americans were unfamiliar with the climate and the terrain. They were literally stuck in the mud, drenched by the monsoons. They're also outnumbered the North Koreans were ninety thousand strong while the South Koreans had twenty five thousand men, and the Americans had ten thousand. Macarthur was forced into a massive retreat and began desperately requesting for a massive increase of troops. Truman and his advisors faced an agonizing choice here they were in charge of the most powerful nation on earth. They of the atomic bomb at their disposal Korea was just a relatively small peninsula. They defeated the Nazis and the Japanese just a few years earlier. Surely the North Koreans wouldn't be a problem. But America's rapid demobilization after World War Two had left the military unprepared. There was a reason why NFC sixty eight requested. A tripling of the defense budget demobilization had decimated America's defense. By July, one, thousand, nine, hundred, Fifty Truman had decided to implement NFC sixty eight. The defense budget would increase dramatically originally. The Truman Administration had requested thirteen billion dollars in defense for nineteen fifty. By nineteen fifty two, it would reach sixty billion strong point. Defense was dead perimeter defense was in economic aid wasn't enough America's cold. War Policy had to be militarized. And here's where you see Truman shift to a new viewpoint, rather than fearing bankrupting the US Treasury with a defense buildup. He now believed that the American economy could sustain it. When he was a senator, he was a loyal new dealer and believed that government's spending could stimulate the economy classic Keynesian Economics, but instead of domestic spending as a stimulus. It would now be defense spending. Many had argued that the economic growth in World War Two was proof of this theory since it had resulted in full employment and growth for the country. In addition, Truman believed that spinning to prevent Soviet expansion now would be less expensive than fighting a war with the Soviets after they expanded when it was in a stronger position, it flipped Kenan's logic. His fear bankruptcy on its head, as Truman said in nineteen fifty to. The real threat to our security isn't the danger of bankruptcy. Is the danger of communist aggression. If Communism is allowed to absorb the free nations one by one. Then we would be isolated from our sources of supply and attached from our friends. Then we would have to take defense measures. That might really bankrupt our economy. And change our way of life so that we couldn't recognize it as American any longer. Let's the very thing we're trying to keep from happening. Meanwhile. America had warrants hands in Korea even if it didn't want to call it a war and many felt now that we were in a war in Korea that we should go all out for victory at the same time. The US had the atomic bomb. Many asked if we wanted to win. Why not use it? If we relied on conventional forces alone, we would end up losing more American lives today. Some people might recoil in horror at this thought, but it's a hard thought to avoid now that we were in war, and we're sending our finest overseas once again. Many asked why not use every weapon in our arsenal? There were obvious complications. The Soviets had the bomb as well and the Korean conflict wasn't just about Korea, or even the United States the North Koreans were propped up by the Soviets Stalin had actually signed off on their invasion. They were using soviet-built tanks if the US use nuclear weapons against them, with that causes Soviets responding kind. Would they be tempted to support their ally? The way that we were supporting South Korea could all this quickly escalate into a conflict between the United States and the Soviet Union might it lead to world war three and a nuclear exchange. This was a fear even if we didn't use the bomb, would a massive conventional invasion of North Korea trigger Soviet. Response with the Soviets still come to the aid of the Koreans, and then there were the Chinese, and it's brand new communist regime under mousy Don. They shared a border with North Korea. Would they feel threatened by an American invasion? Right at their border with they join in with their fellow communists in Moscow in response. It quickly became clear that the conflict in Korea had broader geopolitical implications. Now that American. The Soviets had the bomb. Every decision was somehow related to that broader context. Could a conflict in a random region of the world lead to a world, war? Now there were a lot of steps between a military action that involves conventional forces and a nuclear war. Some argue that this was oversimplifying situation that you just can't use the specter of world war three in every decision you make as commander in chief to justify whatever you want including going to war without congressional offices Asian. This was a fair point. But I also think it's important to know that. Many of these policymakers had lived through World War One, which began by the assassination of one person, and it spread to a global war. There was a fear that one small spark could spiral out of control and in those situations it's not a shock to see people fearful of consequences and grasping at ways to control events before they got worse. The North Korean forces had momentum on their side. They push macarthur and his men all the way down to the southernmost part of the Korean. Peninsula in the city of Pusan. It was was in the situation that MacArthur hatched a daring plan to break out of Pusan by leading an amphibious landing in Inchon behind enemy lines. In was risky. It had high tides and a sea wall. In fact, mccarthur even said that the odds of success where five thousand to one, but he went for it on September Fifteenth Nineteen Forty, nine Macarthur began his invasion. He landed on. Inchon, completely surprising North Koreans within a couple of days in Sean, fell to you and forces in less than two weeks. Soul fell by October. All of South Korea was liberated is one of the most brilliant and heroic turnarounds in military history. Macarthur was a national hero. It looked like Truman's containment policy had new life. But the question remained. How hard should America Push? MacArthur was itching to invade the northern half of the peninsula and liberate it from the yoke of communism, but many feared that this would provoke either Soviets or the communist Chinese respond Truman decided to risk it. He ordered MacArthur to continue past the thirty eighth parallel into North Korea so long as he didn't enter Chinese. Territory on October nine, thousand, nine, hundred fifty macarthur crossed the thirty eighth. It was a fateful decision on October. Twenty fifth over two hundred thousand Chinese troops entered North Korea Truman's nightmare had begun the police action in Korea had now expanded what had first begun as a civil war between North and South Korea now saw combat between the United States and communist China. The most powerful nation in the world was fighting the most populous nation in the world. The winner set in American forces were now stuck in sub temperatures. MacArthur's daring offensive grounded to a halt Truman was shocked and despondent at the turn of events. He was under more stress than at any point in his presidency. One eight described his state in the following terms quote. His mouth drew tight. His cheeks flushed for a moment. It almost seemed as if he would sob. Then a voice that was incredibly calm and quiet, considering what could be read on his face, Voice of absolute personal courage, he said this is the worst situation we've had yet. We'll just have to meet it as we've met all the rest. The Truth Administration had two big worries. The first was that it would get bogged down in Korea in a stalemate. Truman and his advisors feared that this was all a Soviet trap to get the US into an unwinnable war, but to pull out would be to risk American credibility so early in the Cold War if the US left and let South Korea fall to the Communists. Containment might receive a heavy blow. The second was that if the US tried to fight back, it might causing major escalation. That could provoke the Soviet Union. And this is where you see. The American people turn on Harry. Truman had supported him at the start of the Korean War, but military stalemates in far off. Lands are never popular, and that's exactly what this look like a stalemate. Truman's approval ratings wants above eighty percent at the end of World War. Two Were falling down to thirty percent even twenty percent. General. Macarthur could not accept the state of affairs. Chinese invasion forced him into a humiliating retreat. The gains of his daring offensive at Inchon were being raised while Truman feared a widening of the war, macarthur had no such concerns. He wanted victory, and he felt humiliated when commentators in the American media began questioning his leadership, macarthur began lashing out in the press and began to threaten to unilaterally expand the war into China. Maybe even toppling mouth government. Even hinted that nuclear weapons might be used in China. In hindsight it seems incredibly alarming. There's some people to threaten to use nuclear weapons, but again if you think about what they were experiencing, it's a hard question to avoid. The Americans were getting bogged down in a bloody war in a relatively small country. They are a proud superpower, the proud victor of world. War Two in yet here. They were unable to accomplish their objective as the body count piled up. Some Americans felt well. We have the atomic bomb the most powerful bomb in history why not use it? It's hard to imagine not being at least tempted by thought. But Harry Truman kept reminding himself of what this meant as the first and only man to ever order a nuclear attack against another country. He didn't WANNA use nuclear weapons again. He knew not only the destruction. It would unleash, but also the impact it would have on American prestige then and throughout all of history, and he wasn't going to do anything to provoke conflict with the leader of the communist world the Soviet Union. Truman determined to walk a fine line. He decided to keep the Korean war limited conflict. It was a new type of war one that would be repeated several times throughout American history. When tested the patience of the American people, it was a frustrating war in that the United States was fighting where it sons were willing to make the ultimate sacrifice, but its leaders didn't appear willing to use the full range of capabilities to achieve victory. While Truman was walking a tightrope prosecuting a war, but limiting its scope, macarthur was making provocative comments that threatens to undermine the administration's careful strategy and risk a broader war. It was not only danger to Truman's war plans, but also to his control over the military in April of Nineteen, fifty one Harry Truman fired Douglas mccarthur General Matthew Ridgway would take his place. What would suit the ambitions of the Kremlin better than for our military forces to be committed to a full-scale war with red? It may well be that. In spite of our best efforts, communists may spread the war. But it would be wrong. Tragically role for us to take initiative in extending the wall. I've thought long and hard about this question of extending the war in Asia. I have discussed it many times or the ablest military advisors in the country. I believe with all my heart that the course we are following is the best. Number of events of made it evident that General McArthur did not agree with that policy. I have therefore considered it essential to relieve General Macarthur. So that there would be no daughter confusion as to the real purpose and aim of our policy. It was the deepest personal regret that I find myself compelled to take this action. Gentle MacArthur is one of our greatest military commanders. But the cause of world peace is much more important than any individual. Truman paid a price for the firing for many macarthur was the only hope the US had in winning the war. President Shri seem to be content with a bloody stalemate. His popularity was down to twenty six percent to this day one of the lowest in American history. General Ridgway manage to salvage the war effort, but the stalemate resume and the fighting continued by the end of nineteen, fifty, one thirteen thousand American soldiers had died long with eighty thousand total American casualties. Although, he had initiated peace talks with North Koreans those talks had broken down. Polls were indicating that more and more Americans felt intervening in. Korea had been a mistake. Truman however continued to believe that he had made the right choice intervene, and to keep the conflict limited for him. It was a thankless task to stop the Communists, and in Asia and the wars limited nature was due to the unique circumstances of the new code war era in his typical feisty. Way Truman said quote I wonder how far Moses would have gone if he had taken a poll in Egypt, what would Jesus Christ preached if he had taken a poll in Israel it isn't polls or public opinion of the moment that counts, it's right and wrong. By this time Truman's domestic policies had long-stalled. He hoped his administration would be the continuation and fulfillment of the new deal. He called it the fair deal, and he had proposed it back in nineteen, forty nine. It would include a number of progressive pieces of legislation like universal healthcare, but by then with Truman's popularity in the dumps he no longer had the political capital to push his proposals through Congress. It was so ironic under Truman. The power of the presidency had reached its zenith now that America was a world power and had the atomic bomb in its inventory. Domestically. It seemed that Truman was powerless. With his approval ratings in the dumps, Harry Truman decided not to stand for reelection in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty two. That year Dwight D Eisenhower hero of World War Two ran as a Republican and defeated the Democratic candidate Ashley Stevenson. Eisenhower ran largely against Truman's policies in Korea and promised that he would negotiate a peace to end the war. He ended up winning a landslide in the fall of nineteen, fifty two. He took thirty nine out of forty eight states. Although Truman's second term ended in a military stalemate, the country as a whole was prospering I. The economy was growing in record numbers in the aftermath of world. War Two unemployment had been virtually eliminated eleven. Million jobs have been gained in seven years and eight million. Veterans Renowned College. But for Truman his biggest legacy had been creating the institutions needed to continue the effort against the Communists, this included a newly organized defense. Department Central Intelligence Agency in the Air Force, it also included international institutions like NATO. Actions including the Marshall Plan aid decrease in Turkey and the Berlin airlift demonstrated American resolve the resolve Americans needed to sustain its effort to contain communism for decades. And, although the Korean War was unpopular, it did at least liberate the southern half of the peninsula, preventing it from falling to the Kim Dynasty in doing so truman help save generations of Koreans from decades of suffering, and whatever one can say about his policies. He succeeded in standing up to the Soviets without going to nuclear war. History put Truman in the White House at the end of one era, and at the beginning of another the defense institutions. He signed into law still with us today. This most common of men, this accidental president ended up becoming the architect of a new. American, age. Five days before Harry Truman's presidency ended. He went before the American people to deliver his. Farewell. Address. Truman knew that his legacy would largely be defined by his decisions relating to the Cold War that confronting Soviet communism would require a long-term effort that would outlast his time in the White House. I suppose that history. Would remember my term in office as the years when the cold. War began to overshadow our lives. I have had hardly a day in office that has not been dominated by this all embracing struggle. This conflict between those who love freedom. And those who would lead the world back into slavery and darkness. And always in the background that has been the comic bomb. But went history says that my term of office saw the beginning of the cold world war. It will also say that in those eight years. We have set the course that can win it. We have succeeded in carving out a new set of policies to fame. Positive Policies of were leadership. Policies that express faith in other through people. We have averted. World War three up to now. And we may already have succeeded in establishing conditions which can keep that from happening as far ahead as men can see. Truman turned his attention to those who believe that he should have used nuclear weapons in Korea. Once, in a while, I got a letter from some impatient person asking. Why don't we get it over with? Why don't we issue nothing item? Mac All out raw dropped the atomic bomb. Most Americans. The answer is quite simple. We not made that way. We are a moral people. Tease. Is Argo with justice and freedom? We cannot of our own free will violates the very principles that we are striving to defend. The. Whole purpose of what we're doing is to prevent world. War Three. Starting a war is no way to make these. But if anyone still thinks that just this once that means can bring good hands. Then let me remind you of this. We are living in the eighth year of the atomic as we are not own the nation. That is learning to unleash the power of the atom. A third raw law, my dig, the grave, not only of our communist opponents, but also of our own society. I world as well as airs. Starting atomic war is totally unthinkable. Rational man. Then Truman made a prediction about how the Cold War might turn out. then. Some of you may ask. Women how the cold and I think I can answer that simply. The communist world has great resources, and it looks strong. But there is a fatal flaw in their society. There's is a godless system a system slavery. There is no freedom in it. No consent. I'm cutting secret police that constant purchase all these symptoms of great basic weakness. Their rulers! Fear of their own people. In the long run that strength of our free society and our ideals rope Availa over a system that has respect for neither God nor man. Last week in my state of the Union message to Congress and I hope you'll always take time to read it. I explain how I think we will finally wind through. As, the free world goes stronger. More united more attracted to men on both sides of the anchor. And as a Soviet hopes for easy expansion blah. Then, there will have to a time of change in the Soviet world. Nobody can say for sure when that is going to be or exactly how it'll come about. Whether by revolution or trouble in the satellite, states are by change inside the Kremlin. Whether the communist rulership, their policies of their own free will of other. The change comes about some other way. I have not a doubt in the world that the change will occur. Truman may have departed from Kenan's vision of containment, but his prediction for how the Cold War might end aligned with Kenan's hopes. He believed that long-term pressure would expose the failures of the Communist system, and that once those failures would be made clear to its own people and its leaders. The Soviet Union would have to change. In Essence Truman was saying that. The Soviet Union had an expiration date. He didn't know exactly when that date would be, but he knew that it existed. Thirty two years after President Truman uttered these words. Mikhail Gorbachev became the Supreme Leader of the Soviet Union. By then the Soviet Empire was faltering. Extended, and it's expansion had been blocked by freedom fighters in places like Afghanistan. Uprisings were breaking out in satellite states. Even worse, it had been left behind by the technological revolution in the Western world. The Soviet across the empire were disillusioned by decades of false promises. Gorbachev initiated a series of reforms to revitalize the empire, but this open the floodgates of change. Eventually, Gorbachev Lost Control of reform by one, thousand, nine, hundred and nine, the Berlin Wall fell on December, twenty, fifth, nineteen, ninety, one. The Soviet Union collapsed the Cold War was over. It may be too much to call Harry Truman, a profit and one can also question whether he was initially naive about cooperation with Stalin, but it can't be denied that after spending much of his presidency, thinking of ways to contain communism. He understood its nature as well as any American statesman. On July Twentieth Nineteen, Fifty Three Harry Truman left office at the age of sixty eight. He moved back to his hometown of Independence Missouri. He wrote his memoirs and raise money to build his presidential library. Truman lived long enough to see Eisenhower served two terms and leave office, and to see JFK win Johnson and Richard Nixon become president peeve and saw man walk on the moon. He died on December twenty, six thousand, nine, hundred, seventy, two at the age of eighty eight. At the urging of his widow Bess, he did not line state, but a simple private funeral on the grounds of his presidential library. Near the end of his presidency Truman had a chat with Winston Churchill the British prime minister reflected back on when Truman took office in one, thousand, nine, eighty five, and said quote I must confess Sir I, held you in very low regard Ben Islode. You're taking the place of Franklin Roosevelt I. Misjudged you badly. Since, that time you more than any other man have saved Western civilization. That quote in a sense summarizes Harry Truman's presidency. When FDR died, Americans feared what the future hadn't store. It was a world in ruins from the war with a rising communist threat, and the atomic genie released from the bottle during Sherman's. The. American people face crises of global proportions. Harry Truman had to make decisions that I would never wish on another person. Different presidents are dealt. Different hands and Sherman was dealt one of the toughest. No matter what he did, he would forever be remembered as the president who ordered the first and so far only two atomic attacks in history. He initiated the development of the hydrogen bomb. He committed American troops in a controversial war that ruined his popularity all without a congressional declaration of war. Whatever else he did, those decisions will forever influence. How most people see him? I, remember in college in Grad. School hearing. My fellow students criticized Truman's decision to drop the bomb. To them, it seemed that Truman was reckless and had little understanding of the decisions he was making. But to me, this kind of evaluation seems a bit hasty. I've already talked about how the real choice wasn't between using the bomb or not using it, but between using the bomb or invading Japan both of which were terrible choices. But the evidence also seems to indicate that Truman and his men. His advisors did know the significance of what they were doing. They did know that the atomic age represented something new and dangerous world history. Also remember my grandfather while I was growing up. He would sometimes talk about Truman and he didn't really liked him very much. He was from China. He's passed away since, but he a lifelong hatred of the Communist. Chinese. Government and he faulted Truman for firing macarthur in not allowing him to liberate North Korea and invade Japan. In. His is the last chance to topple. The communist regime was lost under Truman. From Truman's perspective, he had limited MacArthur's mission for fear of provoking a World War. He feared that the Soviet Union. Newly armed with nuclear technology would respond or full blown. War would erupt with China for Truman. Limiting the war meant preventing a Third World War. But in doing so he was essentially sacrificing millions North Korea to the yoke of communism. These were the agonizing dilemmas Truman had to face. There is a fair debate about the wisdom of these policies I've heard. Many say that America should have gone all out to win the Korean. War and others who say we shouldn't have been Korean the first place. Others criticize how Truman wage the war. They cite the fact that he committed troops to a war without actually declaring a war. They say that this action paved the way for future interventions that ended up being clogged Myers like in Vietnam and Afghanistan, and they strengthen executive power to make war a- power that the constitution granted to Congress. There may be validity to this argument depending on where you sit. If there's one thing that I can say, it's at these decisions seem easier to make when you don't have the specter of World War three hanging over your head or aren't trying to prevent the advance of a totalitarian state or trying to secure freedom for millions of people. All of this ties into another criticism when that ten expressed the idea that Truman expanded America's containment policy beyond what was feasible that he took the original strategy based on managing costs on picking and choosing your battles, and expanded it to the point of American over-extension militarizing the nation's foreign policy successor president. Eisenhower would seek to reduce the costs and warned against over extension and. The military industrial complex. Again there may be validity to these arguments depending on what you believe. But whatever the means were Truman, leave was sincere in his determination to defend the free world against the communist world, all without provoking a direct conflict between the superpowers. It was a fine line to walk, but he did it as well as anyone could expect from a man with little preparation for the job. It's often said that Truman represented the common man. One critic even said that he was a common man's common man deathly not a compliment. He seemed to many to be remarkable. He was far from perfect Pieta quick temper and was prone to salty language. When he left office, he was one of the least popular presidents in history, but in a recent C-SPAN survey of Historians Truman was ranked the sixth grade as president of all time. Although, his decision still provoked controversy historians have come to respect Truman sense of history, his integrity, his determination and his willingness to make difficult decisions. Historians realized that though common he was, he had the gift of something that was often lacking in politics, common sense. I've mentioned how much Truman's advisers admired him. These are brilliant men, and they were serving a man who had no college education who wants had been a farmer and had salesman. But they knew what he was made of. They knew that he was a leader. Truman had earned the respect. I also mentioned Truman's love for his wife Bess yes. Truman was feisty with a sharp tongue, but he also had a strong moral compass that could never be shaken. One story illustrates is character. When the nineteen forty eight presidential election was approaching true, and was expected to run for his own terms, president, which eventually ended up doing. But before the campaign, he actually offered the top spot on the ticket to General Eisenhower was enormously popular, telling him that he'd be happy to run as his vice president, Mike was rather taken aback by this and swore off any political ambitions. Illustrated who Harry Truman was, he was still the man he was when he left Missouri. Practical Homespun unawed by power. It's hard to imagine any president willing to subordinate himself as Truman was willing to do. Its sometimes easy to look at Truman as a historical accident in some ways he was. It's a bit unsettling to remember that his elevation to the presidency during such a critical time was not the product of a well thought out process, but more due to political convenience, he was the first president of the Nuclear Age the first US chief executive to unambiguously be the most powerful man in the world who could alter the destiny of mankind with a single order. At the same time he is likely the last president of his kind. It's hard to imagine another President One without a college degree, not really looking to seek the office someone who looks like a statesman and more like your next door neighbor someone like him. It's hard to see rising to the White House anytime soon then again. Human events have a way of surprising us even today. Regardless Americans now seem grateful that such a decisive leader rose during such a decisive time. Harry Truman is the American story. A former Haberdasher who became president and made decisions that still echo throughout history. It proves once again that the unlikeliest and least the steamed of men can rise to the heights of power and leave a profound imprint on the world. This American President is produced by myself. Richard Lim and Michael Neale. Thanks to my dad burt chew. The music in this episode is by blue. Dot Sessions. If, you like what you've been hearing. You can also help us by sharing episode on twitter or facebook. Richard Lamm. We're back next time with more this American press.

Soviet Union President Truman United States America Truman Administration Joseph Stalin Kenan America Europe Germany president Moscow George Kennan Berlin Hitler President Harry Winston Churchill Washington
Ep. 20: The Power of the Universe Part II (Harry S. Truman)

This American President

1:45:39 hr | 1 year ago

Ep. 20: The Power of the Universe Part II (Harry S. Truman)

"So in our last episode we mentioned our kickstarter campaign where raising money so that we essentially can have a permanent studio with upgraded equipment like acoustic panels and new microphone basically so he could produce more episodes and higher quality content and for the campaign we gave ourselves the goal of One thousand eight hundred dollars meaning that we had to raise a minimum of that much one thousand eight hundred dollars to actually get any of the money at all. Well thanks to you our listeners. We raised as of February seventeenth. We raised two thousand two hundred twenty dollars. So we're definitely going to get the money that you contributed and I just wanted to say that we at this American President are honored and quite frankly thrilled by all of your support and we just wanted to let you all know that we appreciate everyone who donate and we also asked that if you haven't donated please consider donating to us and if you have we just want to thank you all for your generous donations We have stretch goals beyond one thousand eight hundred dollars the more money we have the better equipment we can buy and the higher quality content we could produce and we need your donations by noon on March fifth. We're also offering you rewards for your contributions if you donate five hundred dollars or more. You can co produce an episode of this American presidents of those a topic that you've always wanted to learn about we'll be happy to meet with you and basically talk about an that you have and will make a short episode about that topic now. 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So just make sure you go to kickstarter and look up this American President podcasts studio and again just behalf of me and Michael we just want to thank you all for your generous donations and we look forward to giving you more quality historical content in the future in our previous episode we covered President Harry S Truman's unlikely rise to power and his first few months in office he had made the momentous decision to drop the atomic bomb world. War Two is over in America and the world. Now look to an era of peace but new problems were on the horizon the victorious allies were now forging a new world order but couldn't agree on what that order should look like the world had suffered through two world wars and desperately feared a third one especially now that the atomic genie was out of the bottle how President Truman handled. These challenges is the subject of this episode of this American President. As we covered in our previous episode Truman succeeded to the presidency. Upon the death of Franklin D Roosevelt the longest serving president and one of the most consequential chief executives in American history. It was not easy to follow president as popular as FDR and Truman would spend much of his presidency trying to measure up but for those who neutral and worked with him. There was something about him that people admired in a previous episode about FDR. I noted that he was a bit devious. He was a true politician who often gave his staffers contradictory information and manipulated them. Roosevelt's secretary of war Henry Stimson who served as a cabinet member for two previous presidents described him as quote the poorest administrator. I've ever worked under not so with Truman. This midwestern Haberdasher was refreshingly straightforward even with the media journalists Cable Phillips wrote quote. He used the press. Occasionally as most presidents have done to test the wind but he never tried to condom with flattery and devious favouritism Harry. Truman worked less to ingratiate himself with people but succeeded better at it than any important public figure. I've ever known he did it. I think because he was so utterly honest with and about himself there was something. People found endearing about the feisty. Midwesterner he also had these huge pair of bottle cap glasses that magnified his is White House. Usher J. B. West said quote. I had the feeling he was looking at me. All around me straight through me. Truman's advisers and his staff came to really love the man they admired his integrity and the way he managed his administration his Labor Secretary of State Dean Aitchison wrote quote. He was so fair he didn't make different decisions with different people. He called everyone together. You were all heard and you got the answer together. He was a square dealer. All the way through atchison found that Truman was confident insecure in his own abilities. Even while being surrounded by brilliant men observing that quote he was not afraid of the competition of other ideas but atchison added that Truman was grounded and humble quote free of the greatest vice in a leader. His Ego never came between him and his job and they loved his unpretentious manner. A secret service agent Floyd Boring wrote quote. He never came on as being superior he would talk to anyone. He could talk to the lowly peasant he could also talk to the King of England agent boring later called one of my favourite Harry Truman stories which made clear his devotion to his wife. Bess now best. Truman hated the limelight and hated being first lady and Truman remained totally devoted to her. When Truman was in Berlin during the Potsdam conference he was in a car with a young military officer and agent boring during the ride the officer hinted to him he could get him anything he wanted including a Harem of women in response. Truman gave him the reprimand of a lifetime. He said quote listened son. I'm married my sweetheart. She doesn't run around on me and I don't run around on her. I want that understood. Don't ever mention that kind of stuff to me again when Truman got out he didn't bother saying goodbye to the young officer. In the few months after the Japanese surrender. The world remained euphoric from the end of the war but many feared that a new conflict was on the horizon the Soviets continued to ignore the Yalta agreements negotiated by FDR Churchill and Stalin earlier in nineteen forty. The Soviets promised democratic elections in Eastern Europe. But they were reneging on that commitment. The Soviet Union was imposing Communist. Puppet governments there and in other places like Azerbaijan. The Soviets believed that they were entitled to create a buffer zone in eastern Europe. Something they wanted to do after being invaded twice by Germany during the world wars but that buffer zone meant totalitarian rule over the populations in those countries. The Americans and the Soviets grew more and more suspicious of each other's intentions at the same time. Communist parties were rising and France in Italy and in China the most populous nation on the planet the Communists under Mao Zedong were gaining ground in the civil war. Against Chiang's nationalist government. Many Americans felt that Communism was spreading across the world and feared that it was just as aggressive. A totalitarian government as the Nazi regime was in just a few weeks in February and March of Nineteen forty-six a series of events occurred that would solidify. What would be known as the Cold War on February Ninth Soviet leader? Joseph Stalin delivered a speech in Moscow where he recapped what happened during World War. Two and how the victory over the Nazis supposedly was proof of the superiority of the Communist system. It's interesting because I read the speech. And he doesn't directly say much about the United States or the West or about boosting military production but given the tensions of the time it was interpreted as an aggressive speech Stalin said that capitalism inevitably leads to war which is what happened in World War Two and seemed to imply that a future war was also inevitable quote perhaps catastrophic wars could be avoided if it were possible periodically to redistribute raw materials and market among the respective countries in conformity with their economic weight. By means of concerted and peaceful decisions. But this is impossible. Under the President. Capitalists conditions of the world economic development stolen then called for a massive increase in steel iron coal and oil production saying quote. Only when we succeed in doing that can we be sure that our motherland will be insured against all contingencies. Americans were alarmed Supreme Court Justice William. Douglas said it was a quote declaration of World War Three. It's easy to think that this may have been an overreaction on the part of Americans be after a member. They had the memory of arms races in the early twentieth century when Europe especially Britain and Germany engaged in an endless competition to build stronger ships and other weapons of war arms racists that ended turning into war to them arms. Racists seemed to make a war inevitable and then came disturbing news from the north from Canada. A clerk named Eager Zenko who worked in the Soviet embassy defected and exposed a high level. Spiring which was passing nuclear secrets to the Soviet Union about the Manhattan project. The project to build the atomic bomb eventually thirty nine people were arrested in eighteen. Were convicted one of them was an actual member of the Canadian parliament. A man named Fred rose. I remember taking American history classes in college and learning about the paranoia that people felt during the Cold War and I got the sense that my professors and classmates thought that it was silly for Americans to have been so concerned and there were times when in a country of hundreds of millions that paranoia might have gone too far and have led to excesses. But I think it's easy to forget why Americans felt the fear of communism that they did. They had lived through the world wars where they had fought against authoritarian regimes and had a genuine and understandable concern. The Soviets. Were the next great enemy. They had the memory of Hitler in the Nineteen Thirties. How he rose to power and how. Europeans tried to placate him by bargaining with him. They're remember that appeasement only invited further aggression. They remembered how isolationist America had been in the nineteen thirties and how the world fell. Apart without their leadership many Americans felt had they been more involved in the world. They might have prevented things from exploding into global conflict. Far fewer lies would have been lost and now that the Soviets were expanding aggressively into Europe. They wondered if they had to do something now. That if they didn't they'd have to face stronger. Soviet Union later on after all the Soviets were the only true power left in Europe and looming over. All of. This was the fact that the nuclear genie was out of the bottle. America had a monopoly on the bomb as far as they knew but there was a sense that inevitably other nations would soon attain nuclear capability and just north above the United States. Americans were learning that there were people living in Canada actively spying on the Manhattan project on behalf of the Soviets of course. Multiple nations were engaged in espionage America included but the steak seemed higher than ever before with the fear that world war three might be around the corner where the weapons could now threaten the existence of civilization everything even the smallest incidents had geopolitical implications in a time of tension the knowledge that spies were on the continent made it hard to not be at least a little paranoid but these factors in mind. It's easy to see why people were alarmed. It was on February. Twenty Second Nineteen forty-six that a State Department official stationed in Moscow named George. Kennan sent a message to Washington. That would change the course of American Foreign Policy. It would be known as the long telegram. It was an analysis of the Soviet Union. But it was really a kind of psycho analysis of the Russian mind. A mind that predated the communist regime in it. Kenan essentially argued that for years American policy towards the Soviet Union was one big long mistake. According to Canon America under Roosevelt and now under Truman naively believed that it could use diplomacy to cooperate with the Soviets he described Russian leaders as inherently insecure and suspicious of the rest of the world. A kind of deeply embedded paranoia even xenophobia. The telegram reads like a rough draft. It's missing a few articles but bear with me. Quote at bottom of Kremlin's neurotic view of world affairs is traditional and instinctive Russian sense of insecurity. Ironically can allowed that this was just a reflection of Russian leadership not the People. He said that the people were quote by and large friendly to the outside world eager for experience of it but also that Russian leaders historically were paranoid of outside influence because of their own rule which was fragile and easily threatened by outsiders especially Western nations and that threat wasn't just a military threat but also because the outside world exposed the Russian people to new ideas quote Russian rulers have invariably sensed that their rule was relatively archaic inform fragile and artificial in its psychological foundation unable to stand comparison or contact with political systems of Western countries. For this reason they have always feared foreign penetration feared direct contact between Western world and their own fear. What would happen if Russians learned truth about world without if foreigners learn truth about world within part of this fear of neighbors was understandable since they had experienced brutal German invasions and bore the brunt of Hitler's war machine but nonetheless it was used as an excuse to impose totalitarianism on their own? People and on nearby states can impress upon his readers that there was nothing. America could do to change the Russians sense of insecurity. It was too much part of their character. Russian leaders including stolen US suspicion and paranoia of the outside world for political control as a justification for imposing dictatorship on the people of the Soviet Union. Communism was the perfect ideology for this. Because it allowed him to claim that the outside world run by capitalists were an ever-present threat to the Soviet Union. Kennan wrote quote Marxist Dogma rendered even more truculent and intolerant by Lennon's interpretation became the perfect vehicle for sense of insecurity with which Bolsheviks even more than previous Russian rulers were afflicted in this dogma with its basic altruism of purpose they found justification for their instinctive fear of outside world for the dictatorship without which they did not know how to rule but Marxism wasn't just about maintaining Soviet rule it was also about fueling Russian nationalism of Russian in now Soviet greatness paranoia breeds a bunker mentality of us against the world quote. This is only the steady advance of uneasy Russian. Nationalism a centuries old movement in which conceptions of offense and defense are inextricably confused. But in the new guys of International Marxism with its honey promises to a desperate and war-torn outside world it is more dangerous and insidious than ever before can also said that this type of mindset precluded any normal type of relationship between the United States and the Soviets quote we are thus up against the fact that suspicion in one degree or another is an integral part of the Soviet system and will not yield entirely to any form of rational persuasion or assurance. This mattered because the Soviet Union dead. Believe quote in the long run. There can be no permanent peaceful coexistence as a result the Soviets would work quote to undermine general political and strategic potential of major Western powers in essence. Ken was saying that the Russians were simply wired to be at odds with America. That there was nothing that could be done to change that for the time. Being and that the Soviet Union was working to destroy the world America and the West. Were trying to build quote. Soviet policy will be directed toward weakening of power and influence and contacts of advanced. Western nations. Kenan didn't spell out a clear strategy. Admitting that he didn't have all the answers he didn't believe that the US should intervene. Militarily to stop the Soviets calling it quote sheerest nonsense. He also noted that the United States had many advantages. Especially since the Soviet Union was between the two quote by far the weaker force he was also careful to distinguish between the totalitarianism represented by Hitler and that represented by Stalin seeing quote Soviet power unlike that of Hitlerite. Germany is neither schematic nor adventuristic. It does not work by fixed plans. It does not take unnecessary risks. In other words the Soviets weren't the same impulsive and immediate threat that the Nazis were still ten and was vaguely recommending. A sort of patient long-term strategy of strength. He said that the Soviets were highly sensitive to logic of force if the adversary has sufficient force and makes clear his readiness to use it. He rarely has to do so. According to Kenan America had a real threat to face when it came to remaking the global order and had to build up the strength to confront it it was a subtle more mysterious threat than Nazi Germany. One that we would have to dedicate resources to learn more about and to think carefully it would be a new type of conflict not one out in the open but an ambiguous competition of sorts. That could be of indefinite duration. The document was widely circulated in Washington. Dc and got people at the highest levels of American power thinking about just how to deal with the Soviets President. Truman read the telegram. But we don't know exactly how he reacted. Kenan's paper was sobering but not everyone was convinced that the Soviets were adversaries. The United States and the Soviet Union had been allies for years many Americans at the highest levels had worked closely with Soviet officials. They still believe that. Cooperation was possible and feared that applying cannons ideas could itself bring about the conflict between the two superpowers. It could be a self fulfilling prophecy. Kenan on the other hand seem to argue. The conflict had already started just a couple of weeks. Later on March Fifth President Truman was with Winston Churchill in Fulton Missouri there. Churchill could recently lost his position. As Prime Minister of Great. Britain gave a speech in Westminster College. It was a speech. They would echo throughout the rest of the twentieth century. Steady in in the in the Adriatic. An Ion gooden has descended across the continent behind that line. All the capitals of the ancient states of central and eastern the Warsaw value in Prague Vienna. Duck this belegrade ups and software all these famous and the population around them lie unlocked. I must go and all up in one form or another so get influenced by the day. High and in some cases increasing often travel from From Moscow I am not believe the show get record is will well. It's fruit of the war and the indefinite extension of that. How and doctrines what what I have seen of Russia and France and allied building the wall. I am convinced that there's nothing. They admire so much as strict and nothing which they have less respect than weakness is we George. Kennan had called for facing the Soviets with strengh now Winston Churchill. Perhaps the most admired man in the world was putting the weight of his prestige behind that argument. Those who feared Soviet expansionism were pleased by Churchill's speech but others especially those on the left. Felt that Churchill's words were provocative that they would inflame the situation and pushed the Soviets away from US journalist. Walter Lippmann said that the speech was in quote almost catastrophic blunder. More ominously stolen said that it was a quote call to War Harry. Truman's opinions during this time are bit ambiguous on one hand. He had no illusions about the type of regime. The Soviets ran in our previous episode. We saw that he had given the Soviet Foreign Minister. Molotov some tough talk. Chastising him for Soviet violations of the Alta agreements. Truman had promised to be firm on the Russians but he also admitted to being charmed by stolen during their meeting at Potsdam and had said quote. I like stone. He straightforward to his close friend. Charlie Ross. Truman said that he found the worries about Russia. A bit excessive many of Sherman's opponents on the right believe that his administration was failing to act against the Soviets allowing them to impose their rule on eastern Europe. They believed that. This inaction was just as bad or even worse than what Neville Chamberlain had done with Hitler in late thirties that allowing Stalin to impose his will would only invite further aggression and make a future war inevitable. Republican Senator Robert. Taft said that the Democrats were quote so divided between Communism and Americanism. That it's foreign policy can only be futile and contradictory and make the United States the laughing stock of the world a young Republican Congressman from California Richard. Nixon claimed that the trump administration was a quote front for un-american elements wittingly or otherwise either way more officials in the Truman Administration. We're seeing the Soviets as a long term threat even so it's one thing to recognize the communist threat. It's a whole other thing to develop a strategy to deal with it now one thing. I want to emphasize here is just how new everything was. There had never been anything like the Cold War when you consider its scale and complexity how it turned conventional wisdom on its head. It was the first time you can really say that. The entire world was largely divided between two camps. The Americans and the Soviets. It was an ideological conflict. Not JUST WANNA pure power on one side you had the Americans leader the capitalists and democratic world on the other hand you had the Soviets the leader of the communist world. It was also different because it involved a weapon of unprecedented destructive power. Although the Americans alone had the bomb the Soviets were undoubtedly racing to master as well for the First Time. A conflict was developing which involved a weapon that could one day. Destroy all of humanity. This is where you really have to put yourself in the shoes of the people at the time we know history turns out. We know that in one thousand nine hundred nine. The Berlin Wall fell in nineteen ninety one. The Soviet Union fell but as I like to remind people. No one at the time knew that that would happen. They felt just uncertain about their future. As we do about ours. Now the Truman administration faced the challenge of developing policy to deal with this situation. I think it's easy to think of that strategy simplistically as one of quote screw the Communists. It's also easy to assume that American foreign policy at this time was a very simple thing or that everyone in the trump administration agreed with each other that it was a monolithic entity. I remember in college reading history books that portrayed members of the Truman administration as one giant unit of people who saw the Soviet Union in simplistic or unsophisticated terms. Just as some form of unmitigated evil without any understanding the nuances of Communist ideology but the evidence seems to show a much more complex response. The first question was how does one even define success? There wasn't an actual hot war. Going on we're there would be battles with a clear cut winner and loser. This was a far more ambiguous conflict after all. How would the United States win? This cold. War Did victory mean the total collapse of the Soviet Union was at forcing the Soviets out of Europe. Was it a world? Where both sides coexisted peacefully. And what about the cost addressing security threats is expensive it usually involves building up ones military but arms races are expensive. America had just spent billions in World War Two to defeat the Nazis and the Japanese not to mention the money it spent before that for the new deal during the depression confronting a huge powerful nation like the Soviet Union was something that was likely to be very expensive where we willing to spend even more money in a conflict of indefinite duration. And what if in trying to confront the Soviets we actually bankrupted ourselves? What would be the consequences of that? Would we defeating ourselves in trying to defeat the Soviets and there is yet another dilemma? How do you protect yourself from a potential adversary? But do it. In a way without provoking war as the world learned in World War One arms racists are inherently dangerous nations build up their weapons to defend themselves and in the hopes of keeping the peace but in doing so provoked their competitors to do the same thing. The result is usually increased tensions if these tensions increased too much they lead to war. American policymakers had to walk a tightrope. I mentioned George Kennan earlier. The man who wrote the long telegram well in the summer of nineteen forty seven. He wrote another article that appeared in Foreign Affairs magazine. It was titled Quote. The sources of Soviet conduct under the pseudonym. Mister X will documents like these help us understand the kind of strategy. The Truman Administration undertook to deal with the Soviets. The most famous line from this article is quote. The main element of any United States policy toward the Soviet Union must be that of long term patient but firm and vigilant containment of Russian expansive tendencies. That word containment became the one word summary of American foreign policy. The idea was that the Soviets were intent on expanding their control and influence in the world and this expansion would happen in two different ways over at military means or covert means such as those through espionage or by developing economic and cultural influence over. Its neighbors the United States. Would try to contain that expansion to limit or halted. Us policy makers different alternatives. But they believe that there is no quick fix they even considered some sort of nuclear attack or military action against Moscow but the former might require killing thousands or millions of people and would provoke anger and revulsion around the world. The latter would likely start another war anyways. A war that the American people didn't want some also believe that we should use our monopoly on the bond of force the Russians to change to blackmail them into changing their behavior by threatening to attack them with the atomic bomb. The idea of America threatening to use nuclear weapons at all was just so unsavory. It also brought up the question where we really willing to use the bomb to get our way. That alone could alienate our allies allies. That could be critical in containing the Soviets policy makers in Washington felt that there was no chance to change things quickly. They felt at the Soviets. Were here to stay containing them would be a long-term effort for containment to work. We needed to be patient. It might have to. Last year's maybe even several decades it was a tall order to call a war weary country to a long struggle with no clear picture of victory. But that's what would happen. But American strategists like Kenan face the prospect of how to contain the Russians did that mean responding with force whenever the Russians tried to expand. And how do you establish credibility so that the Soviets took our threats seriously that usually involves showing a willingness to use force after all didn't Churchill say that there is nothing the Russians admire so much a strength and there's nothing for which they have less respect than for weakness but again the use of force was a dangerous thing responding militarily to the Soviets could mean war and that reality was something that no one really wanted? Having fought the World War Two? No one was looking forward to fighting another war. Among superpowers. One thing I think is interesting is just how concern American planners at the time. We're worried about the cost of containment. As I said earlier arms races and wars were expensive. It costs billions of dollars to try to counter. The other side's move and this tit for tat arms race could spiral out of control. There was this fear that the very effort to stop the Soviets would bankrupt America. If that happened we would be defeating ourselves. What if that was part of the Soviets plan would if they were trying to force us into bankrupting ourselves so the Cold War? Became this paradoxical race. Not just to outdo the other side in capability but to do so in a way. That didn't cause one's own treasury to collapse. But how do you do that? Given the simple fact that building up military strength costs money. The Truman administration feared that trying to match the Soviets might be self-defeating and that was related to the question of where to contain communism the Communists according to historian John Lewis Gaddis expanded its influence by installing friendly governments mainly in eastern Europe and by promoting communist political parties in various countries throughout the world the communist forces in China gaining the upper hand against the Western supported nationalist government as the communist expanded in Europe and it was gaining ground in China. The question became. Where should the United States concentrate its efforts to contain the red menace? Some suggested what was called a perimeter defense basically to create an entire perimeter around the communist world. The idea was that wherever the Soviets expanded the United States should intervene somehow to stop it to contain it but there were obvious drawbacks. I trying to defend a massive global perimeter was a very expensive project second. It would essentially give the Soviets the initiative they would be able to dictate where the confrontations what happened. And if it could do that it could choose areas that would play to their strengths. So Kenan sought to address this. I by a process of building up a select group of nations in the world at key strategic locations certain strong points a strategy called strongpoint defense as opposed to the perimeter. Defense part of this was to get American allies strong enough so that they could stand up on their own two feet so that the United States wouldn't have to bear the burden the cost of containing communism alone merrick. Couldn't do this everywhere but it could concentrate on high priority areas. Kennan believed that the United States should focus specifically on building up Europe especially Germany in Asia specifically Japan Ironic. Considering that just a few years earlier world war was fought to destroy those nations capabilities and the way the US would build them up. Wouldn't necessarily come primarily from military means but through economic and technological assistance basically through loans and grants of aid with the specific goal of modernizing their economies a stronger economy would help fund those countries militaries and reduce the appeal of Communist parties. Second Kenan recommended. Basically divide and conquer strategy. The Soviet Union was the leader of international communism and tentacles in different parts of the world. It was inevitable that managing the interest amongst so many entities would become difficult and unwieldy some people today believe that American policymakers of this time viewed the world in simplistic ways that they saw different communist groups as just one monolithic block and that the Russian reds were no different from Chinese reds historian. John Lewis Gaddis writes that quote closer examination reveals more complex. Patterns part of the strategy of dividing up the communist world involve learning nations away from the Soviet bloc. This might be accomplished in part by the power of example. If the West could display a way of life that showcase the prosperity of democracy and capitalism so get states might be tempted to leave Moscow orbit another way would be to provide aid if the United States offered Soviet nations financial incentives. That were better than what the Soviets could offer. They would have even more reason to leave. Moscow's influence as Kennan wrote quote. There's a possibility that Russian communism may someday be destroyed by its own children in the form of the rebellious parties of other nations. But what was the end game? What was the administration? Aiming FOR THROUGH CONTAINMENT WILL. Kenan was a realist. There wasn't some Utopian believed that the Soviet Union would change or that it would collapse and become democratic overnight. He had a farmer realistic goal of what was called behavior modification. The idea was that long-term pressure by the United States and its allies could convince Soviet leaders that they couldn't remain aggressive or interfere in the affairs of other nations abroad. That it's best interests were adhering to the principles underpinning the international system. This meant that the United States would resist aggressive actions by the Soviets but also reward them when they reacted cooperatively constructively. This opened the possibility of having high level talks or summits between the United States president and the Soviet leaders using a punishment reward system. The Soviets might come to see that adhering to Western values might be in their best interest so these were the guiding principles that informed a lot of America's Cold War Strategy. It was one based on an awareness that the United States had limited resources that its population was not for war that there was diversity in the communist world and that change would likely come over time and it was one that relied less on military power in more on the economic power of the United States in one thousand nine forty seven you see the Truman administration implementing the first elements of the strategy. Truman appointed George Marshall The architect of American victory in World War Two as his secretary of state. Truman and Marshall both formulated. What would become the Marshall Plan? It was done in response to the fact that Europe's economy especially Germany was an utter ruins in the aftermath of World War. Two German weakness made it vulnerable to the Soviets from the outside. The desperate conditions suffered by. Its people mates socialism or communism more appealing internally so in June of nineteen forty seven the Truman Administration implemented the Marshall Plan. Truman knew that Marshall was one of the most respected men in the world so he insisted that it be named after him. Knowing that if it were the Truman plan it would incur a lot more opposition. The Marshall Plan did leave open the possibility for aid to Soviet nations again as a way to encourage them to leave the Soviet Union but Moscow ensured that they refused and part of the reason. Was that the plan. Required a certain level of transparency. In how the money was used something stolen could not tolerate. The United States ended up providing about seventeen billion dollars to seventeen countries which today's numbers is about one hundred eighty seven billion an investment in the strength of its allies. Something that would contribute to America's own security for those who believe that this would be expensive. Truman ask quote which is better for the country to spend twenty or thirty billion dollars over the next four years to keep the peace or to do so as we did in nineteen twenty and then have to spend one hundred billion dollars for four years to fight a war in March nineteen forty seven. An unexpected opportunity came up to implement the strong point defense concept at very specific locations at the beginning of the year. Great Britain announced that it would be leaving Greece and Turkey it had been supporting both nations against communist takeovers. The Greeks were fighting a civil war against communists and the Turks were facing pressure from Stalin to allow the Soviets naval access to the Turkish Straits. The Truman administration feared that Britain's departure could mean expansion of Soviet military influence into Europe. One of Ken and strong points so with the help of his close advisor Dean Atchison. Truman developed a plan to aid the two nations on March Twelfth Nineteen forty seven. The president went to Congress and requested four million dollars for Greece and Turkey. But more importantly trim made a declaration. That would come to define his presidency. United States has received from the Greek government and urgent appeal for financial and economic assistance. Greece must have assistance if it is a become a self supporting and self respecting democracy. The very existence of the great state is today threatened by the terrorist activities of several thousand armed men led by Communists the British government which has been helping. Greece can give no further financial or economic aid after March thirty first the British government has informed us that owing to its own difficulties. It can no longer extend financial or economic aid to Turkey as in the case of Greece. If Turkey is to have the assistant it needs the United States must supply it. We are the only country able to provide that help. We shall not realize our objectives however unless we are willing to help free peoples to maintain their free institutions and their national integrity against aggressive movements that seek to impose upon them totalitarian regimes. This is no more than a freak recognition that totalitarian regimes imposed upon free peoples by direct or indirect aggression undermined the foundations of international peace and hence the security of the United States. Those words would be known as the Truman Doctrine. The idea that the United States had an obligation to act in defense of other nations to prevent the expansion of communism in Truman's is he was merely implementing Kenan containment policies but others feared that the administration was departing from those policies that it's limited strongpoint strategy was being expanded to a larger scale in. Kenan had ever intended. They feared that Truman might be extending. The United States involvement in the world beyond its capacity ever since the Soviet Union collapsed in. Nineteen ninety-one leaving America as the sole superpower. There has been this misperception. The idea that the goal of American foreign policy during the Cold War was to destroy the Soviet Union at the start of the Cold War. This wasn't the ultimate strategy instead it was to create the conditions so that it would change its behavior or reform itself can strategy to convince the Soviets that it was in their interest follow western norms. There was a sense of realism. In Kenan's plan a wariness of being too ambitious the idea of taking down the entire Soviet regime with all its tanks and ships in the country so large struck many in the west who were already war weary as a fantasy and many felt we would defeat ourselves trying can really fear that we could defeat ourselves by overspending so he worried about American over-extension strategies are Nice on paper. Having a strategy a plan is indispensable but the reality is that things are different in practice especially when they are fused with a sense of urgency the urgency. Let's say that comes with. Having nuclear bomb in a series of events would lead the Truman administration to modify Kenan plan beyond what its author intended June of nineteen forty eight. Joseph Stalin decided to test Western resolve. He ordered that all traffic in and out of Berlin blockade that meant all rail and highway traffic. Anything that came in and out now as I said earlier. Germany was divided into different zones with the United States Britain and France occupying the western part of Germany than Soviet Union occupying the eastern part Berlin was the capital and was also divided into sectors among the great powers the Americans the British and the French and the Soviets had sectors in capital. But the problem for the West. Was that the entire city of Berlin was in the Soviet sector of the whole country. Westerners in Berlin were basically in an island surrounded by Soviet controlled territory. This gave stolen an opportunity. He knew that Berlin 's position in the Soviet sector gave him leverage over the West and he and his advisors also believed that Berlin was a crucial test. I Soviet strength. His foreign minister said quote. What happens to Berlin happens to Germany? What happens to Germany happens to Europe? The Soviets felt that they had reason for the residents of Berlin had. Recently elected city officials were anti communists. Also the west began to combine their occupation zones and created the beginnings of a West German government won aligned with the Western powers. The Soviets believed that these were hostile. Actions designed to create pro-american. Trojan horse in the middle of the Communist bloc. Stalin decided to cut off Berlin from the West with its two point. Five million people preventing anything from coming in or out. Western officials in Berlin would be stranded and left to starve for food and supplies. It represented a daunting challenge to western powers especially since Soviet forces in Berlin outnumbered American British and French forces. Almost three to one. Some critics of Western policy are you at the establishment of a pro American government in West. Germany was too aggressive and forced the Soviets to blockade Berlin at the same time the western part of Germany needed a government. Some kind even if it meant that the country is a whole would be divided and the Soviets had little room to talk since they had set up friendly governments all over eastern Europe not to mention their heavy handed rule resulted in many native berliners supporting anti communists either way. These events served as a pretext for the Soviets to make moves on Berlin. This immediately put Truman in fine. What do you do in this situation if he backed down and pulled American forces out or left them there without aid? America would appear weak so weak that it couldn't protect itself and its allies. Our friends would question our resolve. Remember the lesson of appeasement people felt our adversary would be emboldened but if Truman acted he ran the risk of escalation provoking Soviets into more aggressive. Action isn't hard to imagine war. Potentially breaking out remember events can spiral out of control. That was the lesson of World War. One rational decisions can lead to unintended consequences and potentially total disaster. But Truman didn't flinch and he countered the Soviets with a combination of both resolve and creativity. Truman rejected any ideas of a pullout saying quote. We stay in Berlin period. Just four days later after the blockade began Truman ordered a full-scale airlift operation to supply berliners with food water and supplies. It was a risky move because attempted the Soviets to shoot the planes down. If that happened fighting may ensue and it was also happening during the stress of presidential election year were Truman was running his own term. And where the political stakes were high but truman was willing to dare Stalin soon. American aircraft were flying in thousands of tons of food and supplies every day after about a year by the spring of one thousand nine hundred eighty nine two hundred seventy seven thousand. Flights delivered two point three million tons of food. The whole operation was an unprecedented logistical success. Stalin finally realized the futility of the blockade in order that it's cease Harry. Truman had stood toe to toe with Joseph Stalin the most ruthless despot in the world and got him back down. Although the Berlin airlift was a triumph for the United States? The world remained as dangerous as ever and things would get even more dangerous in nineteen forty eight Harry. Truman had won a presidential term his own right. It was one of the greatest upsets in American history. One of those supporting Harry. Truman was an actor in Hollywood Ronald Reagan. Who also happened to be the head of the screen actors guild. Reagan was an avowed. Fdr NEW DEAL DEMOCRAT. Having voted for him four times and also supported. President Truman appearing with him at a campaign event and recording an ad supporting him Ronald Reagan would eventually abandoned the Democratic Party believing it was failing to respond to Soviet communism in Truman's inaugural address in January twentieth nineteen forty nine. He portrayed the Cold War in terms of an epic confrontation between two ideologies. Two ways of life in pursuit of these aims the United States and other like minded nations find themselves directly opposed by a regime and contrary aims Anna totally different concept of life. That regime adheres to a false philosophy which purports to offer freedom security and greater opportunity to mankind misled by that philosophy. Many peoples have sacrificed their liberties only to learn that deceit and mockery poverty end tyranny. Are they're hard? That false philosophy is communism. Communism is based on the belief. That man is so weak and inadequate that he has gone able to govern himself and therefore requires the rule of strong masters. Democracy is based on the conviction that man has the moral and intellectual capacity as well as the engine of a right to govern himself with Raisin and justice. Communism suggest subjects to individual you arrest without lawful cau- punishment without trial and forced labor as a channel of the state. It degrades what information he shall receive. What are Teasha show produce what leaders he shall follow and what thoughts he shelf? Inc? Democracy maintains that government is established for the benefit of the individual and is charged with the responsibility of protecting the rights of the individual and his freedom and the exercise of those abilities of his maintains that social wrongs can be corrected only by violence. Democracy has proved that social justice can be achieved through peaceful change Communism Hold. The world is so widely divided into opposing classes. Not War is inevitable. Democracy holds that free nations can settle differences just me and maintain a lasting peace the difference the differences between Communism and Democracy. Do not concern the United States alone. People everywhere are coming to realize that what is involved is material well-being human dignity and the right to believe in and worship Dob. I state these differences not go issues out believe as such but because the actions resulting from the communist lots of it are a threat to the efforts of three nations to bring about world recovery and lasting fees. Clearly the Cold War was in full swing. The stakes of that conflict suddenly increased on August. Twenty Ninth Nineteen Forty Nine on that date. The Soviet Union tested their first atomic bomb. It was stunning news with that. The United States lost its monopoly on atomic weapons. The News sent shockwaves around the world. Literally and figuratively experts had estimated that the Soviets would attain the bomb for another four years or so but they were wrong. Americans came to grips with the fact that Joseph Stalin. The butcher of millions now had the most powerful weapon in history. It's impossible to understand how terrifying this was. We live in an era where countries like Pakistan. North Korea. Have some measure of nuclear capability. And we're used to living with that reality people back then weren't used to that yet. The seen the pictures of her Oshima and I gue- sake after the bombings and they felt some measure of security that the bomb was only in American hands. Now they were in the hands of a man. They considered a mass murder. The next major shock was just about a month later on October. First Nineteen Forty Nine Mao tse. Tung officially proclaimed the People's Republic of China Mouse Communist forces had conclusively defeated Chiang Kai Checks Nationalist government and taken power five hundred eighty million Chinese citizens in the most populous country in the world. A fifth of the world's population amount four times larger than the entire population of the United States was now under communism. I remember in high school and College. Learning about the much criticised domino theory the idea that if one country fell to communism in might spread to other countries. Of course now. It's easy to criticise ideas. Simplistic but what if you live during that time? What if you saw what happened? When the West appeased Hitler which only encouraged him further and what if he saw within a month the Soviets? Get the bomb. Almost six hundred million people fall under a communist regime not to mention the cases of Soviet espionage in the United States back home. Truman's opponents blamed him for these developments for insufficiently supporting the nationalists against the Communists in China for failing to prevent the Soviet espionage of US nuclear technology. They continue to accuse his government being infested with communists. The most prominent official to be accused was Alger Hiss. A high level official who had served in the State Department and even been with FDR at the Yalta Conference. This was the environment that produced the rise of Joseph McCarthy the infamous US senator who produced list after of government officials. He claimed we'RE COMMUNISTS MCCARTHY AND SUPPORTERS FIELD. A sense of paranoia across the nation. There was this real sense that the enemy wasn't just out there but here at home the Wisconsin. Senator spoke to those fears and began making audacious claims about the number of communists in the government in the united and it resonated at one point. A Gallup poll showed that forty percent of Americans had a favorable opinion on McCarthy while only thirty six percent had an unfavorable opinion. Pretty soon the House Committee on un-american activities rose to prominence. It had been around since the late thirties but now it became a force as it investigated communist influence. These were the years of the Hollywood blacklist McCarthy Attack Truman and the Democrats he said that the Roosevelt and Sherman administrations constituted quote. Twenty years of treason. It was at this time that Americans began to look back interpret events from this Lens. They now saw Yalta as a massive giveaway to the Soviets as the moment when FDR betrayed millions behind the Iron Curtain. Truman dismissed McCarthy. As a crank sing he was the best asset. The Kremlin has McCarthy had widespread support many shared his fear of communism but more and more people began to question his tactics. Perhaps his biggest mistake was going after. America's most respected figure. George Marshall Marshall had spent some time in China where he tried to bring together the warring factions when it fell to Communism McCarthy accused Marshall being responsible he accused them of being involved in a conspiracy so immense and so- infamous so black as to dwarf any previous venture in the history of man is probably the dumbest thing McCarthy could have done. No one could credibly criticize a man of Marshall Stature. More and more Americans came to see McCarthy's tactics excessive as pure demagoguery regardless of how real the Communist threat was as the national debate raged on the events of Nineteen forty-nine caused the truth administration to shift too far more aggressive posture than that recommended by George Kennan by then the United States had initiated a massive series of bureaucratic reforms. This was the era when the National Security Council the Department of Defense the the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Air Force were all formerly created the major components of the modern national security state. We live in a world where we take it for granted that we have a permanent military intelligence establishment but this was the first time these institutions were created on a permanent basis. Especially in a time where there wasn't a hot work going on. These are massive changes to the American landscape and they started under President Truman. These institutional changes extended internationally as well in one thousand nine hundred eighty nine. Truman's new secretary of state the brilliant dean. Addison negotiated the establishment of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization. America's first peacetime military alliance ever twelve countries signed up America Canada and many Western European nations to Kenan these actions constituted a possible over extension of America's capability and could be interpreted as aggression by the Soviet Union but in President. Truman's is they were necessary to securing Western civilization. By this time Harry. Truman was no stranger to hard decisions and he had one sitting on his desk. It was on whether or not the United States should initiate development of the hydrogen bomb code named the super in top secret meetings. Harry Truman will always be known as the president who dropped the bomb her Shema but in many ways the debate over whether to build a hydrogen bomb was even more heated and more controversial at the highest levels of government. Now I'm no physicist. I do know that the H. Bomb is based on fusion as opposed to the A-BOMB which uses vision. I also know that the hydrogen bomb representative an exponential leap destructive capability whereas atomic bomb explosions were measured in kilotons thousands of pounds of TNT. Hydrogen bombs were measured in. Megatons or millions of times. If one felt that the atomic bomb gave us the potential to wipe out civilization the H. bomb all but confirmed it too many the H. bomb was a leap closer to the end of civilization. It's no coincidence that this debate raged on soon. After the Russians surprised the world by detonating its own atomic bomb for those who supported developing the hydrogen bomb their most compelling argument was that the Soviets would attain at one day. Probably sooner than we were thinking after all the Soviets had beaten expectations by developing their own atomic bomb. The H bomb supporters argue that the only way to deter the Soviets from future aggression was to beat them to the super for those who oppose developing the bomb there. Most compelling argument was that by developing we were releasing a far more dangerous genie out of a bottle. They argued that developing the hydrogen bomb would only encourage other nations to do so leading to an even more dangerous world and the less secure. America after all. Isn't that what happened? When we developed the atomic bomb they ask. Why not try to work with the Soviets to end the arms race and reduce the threat to the world by abolishing nuclear weapons. Truman's top advisors were split on the issue and it wasn't just an issue of right versus left atchison supported building the hydrogen bomb as did a number of physicist Edward Teller even Eleanor Roosevelt. Prominent supporter of the United Nations was for it but George Kennan was against it as was the father of the Tomich. Bomb Robert Oppenheimer. Truman named several of his advisers including Secretary of State Atchison on a committee known as the Z. Committee to advise him on whether or not to develop the hydrogen bomb in January nineteen fifty. The committee recommended that Truman go forward with the super on January. Thirty First Nineteen fifty. Truman announced the development would forward. If you read about the meetings took place what convinced. Sherman was the intelligence the Soviets were likely to be developing their own hydrogen bomb. He recalled people predicted World War. Three would start when he sent funds to Greece and Turkey to fight communism and that hasn't happened so he felt that the danger of such a war was not imminent ultimately. Truman believe that America had no choice but to build the bomb in his words quote. It is part of my responsibility. As commander in chief of the Armed Forces to see to it that our country is able to defend itself against any possible aggressor accordingly. I've directed the Atomic Energy Commission to continue. Its work on all forms of atomic weapons including the so-called hydrogen or super bomb like all other work in the field of atomic weapons. It is being and will be carried forward. On a basis consistent with the overall objectives of our program for Peace and security with that decision the world entered a new threshold in nuclear firepower it was now the thermonuclear age. In Kenan's is it was yet another departure from his more modest vision of containment. The Truman administration continued to expand the scope of its strategy as we highlighted earlier. Kenan focused primarily on building up our allies economic capacity as an alternative to costly militarization but now that communism seemed to be on the March officials in Washington began considering boosting the defense budget. Some felt that this wasn't necessary. America's economy was after all by far the strongest in the world at this time and it had a four year advantage on the Soviets in nuclear technology. It was easy to assume that the United States had sufficient strength especially when it came to military technology but in reality. This wasn't all that clear after World War. Two America had demobilized rapidly. The American people were anxious to go back to civilian life. The number of military personnel had gone down from about twelve million people in one thousand nine forty five to one point. Five million in nineteen fifty by then life magazine reported that the Soviet Union was far ahead of the United States in total conventional military strength. United States army totaled six hundred. Forty thousand men. The Soviet Union's was at two point. Six million America had one. Armored Division. The Soviets had thirty America may twelve hundred planes per year. The Soviets made seven thousand. America spent six percent of its national income on defense the Soviets spent twenty five percent. The Truman administration sought to balance this equation. In April Nineteen Fifty State Department official. Paul Nitze released a document that would change the direction of American Defense Policy. A repudiated Kenan strongpoint defense strategy and moved in the direction of a perimeter defense designating a large area around the Soviet Union and declaring it close to Soviet expansion. This would be achieved by increasing America's military strength to deter and potentially defeats of yet forces. It called for a truly unprecedented increase in the defense budget. Truman had been spinning around thirteen. Billion Dollars for defense per year knits document also known as NFC sixty eight would increase that to about forty or fifty billion dollars a tripling or quadrupling of the defense budget. That money would go. Not only into nuclear weapons but building up America's conventional forces. Well closing the numerical gap between U S and Soviet military capabilities. Nfc Sixty eight called for speeding up American technological innovation it also called for increased taxes on the American people to fund. The effort heated debate broke out. Among American policymakers again. For people like Kennan. This was exactly what he feared the over extension and potential bankrupting of the United States. Do we really want to militarize the entire effort? Paul taxes on the American people. They felt that shifting from strong point to perimeter defense was a fool's errand for the reasons I mentioned earlier. Some feared that militarization could remake American society from a free peaceful one into an aggressive police state for others especially those on the left. It was a needless escalation of the Cold War. Perhaps making war inevitable. Initially Truman had agreed with Kenan's fears that the US might spend itself to death so instead of implementing NFC sixty eight. He decided to keep it on the shelf for now. He didn't WanNa make a rash decision but events would conspire to change his opinion on June twenty-fourth Nineteen Fifty Harry. Truman was in his hometown. Independence Missouri on a short vacation that night he received a call from Secretary of State Atchison. Who notified him? That North Korea had invaded South Korea. Truman's heart sing according to his daughter. Margaret Truman quote feared that this was the opening of World War Three. He left to fly back to Washington. Create have been part of Japan from nineteen ten nineteen forty-five when the war ended. The country was split in half at the thirty eighth parallel. The northern half was occupied by the Soviets in the southern by the Americans. The Soviets installed a communist government under kimmel sunk. While the Americans installed an anti communist government under syngman Rhee both leaders created dictatorships in hope to unify the entire peninsula under their system. The US had left South Korea but the Soviets continued to support Kim's government. The Communist invasion of South Korea was the first hot war of the nuclear age. American credibility seemed to be on the line people around the world began. Ask would Washington allow communist aggression to stand again? The ghost of appeasement before World War. Two hovered over the West. Truman later wrote quote. I remembered how each time that the democracies failed to act encouraged. The aggressors to keep going ahead if this was allowed to go unchallenged would mean a third World War just a similar incidents had brought on the Second World War some blame secretary of State Atchison in a speech earlier that year atchison described a perimeter defense in Asia that the US would hold and not allowed to be breached. He had neglected to mention Korea and Taiwan as part of that perimeter some believed that this signal to the communist that the United States would not intervene in the event of aggression. In those places. It's hard to know if this was a factor either way the Truman administration had a full blown crisis on its hands as Truman met with his advisers. The consensus was that the Communists had to be stopped in Korea. In Cannon's original Strategy Korea was not specifically a strong point although Asia in general was but that was out the window whether you supported strong point defense perimeter defense. It seems that the great conflict between freedom and tyranny were at stake in this one particular country. The question was how would the United States respond? Should it sending ground troops? Should it just rely on air and naval power or should it just arm the South Koreans without getting too involved or should it escalate to the highest level and threatened to use nuclear weapons? Truman wasn't ready to commit trips just five years earlier. American troops arrived home. He wasn't sure if they are ready to fight another war especially in a region of the world that most Americans knew little about but he did order American air and sea forces to provide the Koreans with cover and support with general. Douglas Macarthur America's supreme commander in Japan leading the effort then Truman decided to go to the United Nations for a resolution to intervene June twenty seven the UN complied UN resolution eighty-three called for member states to furnish such assistance to the Republic of Korea as may be necessary to repel the armed attack and restore international peace and security in the area at this point with American naval and air forces on the way the logical step would seem to be for Truman to ask Congress for a declaration of war against North Korea. But for some reason Truman and MS advisors hadn't really considered this talking about a congressional declaration. Truman aide George Elsey said quote. Nobody thought of it at the time and he added that they were quote too busy thinking of military action and United Nations action to try to cover up their tracks with congressional resolutions. Truman seemed to believe that getting a UN authorization was sufficient to take action and superseded Congressional Declaration of war. This was despite the fact that the US Constitution explicitly granted the power to declare war to Congress. But for Truman going to Congress would be too much trouble. It may also have been the sense of urgency the exigencies of the time when the presence of nuclear weapons meant that the president had to take action within minutes or seconds of the start of crisis to him. Congress was more of a stumbling block to defending America's national security. Truman was also careful in how he framed conflict. Even though it seemed that America was about to engage in hostilities abroad. Truman was soon explaining to Congress that quote. We are not at war instead. He used the term police action. This signaled a new era. In American Military History United States military was engaging in hostilities abroad. As part of an international coalition hostilities but was not technically in a war. Although terminent I hope to avoid the introduction of ground troops that changed very quickly. Macarthur was now convinced that air and naval power wouldn't be enough to repel the North Koreans on June thirtieth he requested to divisions of Combat Forces for a moment. Truman agonized over the decision. He knew what this meant. It meant that just five years after the end of World War. Two he would be sending American men into combat. Once again America would be at war whether or not it would be called a police action. You have to imagine what this meant. The country was war-weary and now the president was asking them to bear the burden of another conflict. This time in a place where they weren't directly attacked where it wasn't clear that America had a direct stake. Most Americans had had very little knowledge of Korea or new any Koreans. Now they were being asked to go to war again for their sons to fight and die there in one letter. An American citizen wrote to Truman. Quote in Heaven's name. What are you doing? The blood hasn't dried from world war. Two Truman later said that approving MacArthur's request was the hardest decision of his presidency. Pretty amazing considering that he decided to drop the bomb in Japan to develop the hydrogen bomb into confront stolen in Berlin. But he did approve. The request AUREA is a small country thousands of miles away. But what is happening? There is important to every American on Sunday. June twenty fifth Communist forces attacked the Republic of Korea. Free nations must be on their guard more than ever before against this kind of sneak attack. We are united into testing communist slavery. We know that the cost of freedom is high but we are determined to preserve our freedom no matter what the calls. The seriousness of the situation unified the country. Democrats and Republicans in general closed ranks behind Truman. Even his strategy was being abandoned. Kenan also fell into line despite this not. Everyone was thrilled with the way. Truman entered the conflict. Senator Taft criticized Truman's refusal to ask for a declaration of war saying the president had quote no legal authority for what he has done. Subsequent presidents have followed from example Lyndon Johnson did not request a declaration of war when he intervened Vietnam nor did both bushes in their respective invasions of Iraq to some. This is a reality of the cold. War Were International. Crises in the Nuclear Age cannot wait for the slow deliberation of Congress to others. This is a presidential usurpation of Congress's constitutional powers. That debate continues to this day. I'm not going to get too much into the specifics of the war. Except for a few points. The first few months were devastating for the American lead. You enforces the South Koreans. It was a hot humid summer. Americans were unfamiliar with the climate and the terrain. They were literally stuck in the mud. Drenched by the monsoons. They're also outnumbered. The North Koreans were ninety thousand strong while the South Koreans had twenty five thousand men and the Americans had ten thousand macarthur was forced into a massive retreat and began desperately requesting for a massive increase of troops truman and his advisors faced an agonizing choice. Here they were in charge of the most powerful nation on earth. They have the atomic bomb at their disposal. Korea was just a relatively small peninsula. They defeated the Nazis and the Japanese. Just a few years earlier. Surely the North Koreans wouldn't be a problem but America's rapid demobilization after World War. Two had left the military unprepared. There was a reason why. Nfc Sixty eight requested a tripling of the defense budget. Demobilization had decimated America's defense by July one thousand nine hundred fifty. Truman had decided to implement. Nfc Sixty eight. The defense budget would increase dramatically. Originally the Truman Administration had requested thirteen billion dollars in defense for nineteen fifty by nineteen fifty. Two it would reach sixty billion. Strong point defense was dead. Perimeter defense was in economic aid. Wasn't enough America's Cold War policy had to be militarized? And here's where you see Truman shift to a new viewpoint rather than fearing bankrupting the US Treasury with a defense buildup. He now believed that the American economy could sustain it when he was a senator. He was a loyal new dealer and believed that government's spending could stimulate the economy classic Keynesian economics but instead of domestic spending as a stimulus it would now be defense. Spending many had argued that the economic growth in World War. Two was proof of this theory since it had resulted in full employment and growth for the country. In addition Truman believed that spinning to prevent Soviet expansion. Now would be less expensive than fighting a war with the Soviets after they expanded when it was in a stronger position. It flipped Kenan's logic his fear bankruptcy on its head as Truman said in. Nineteen fifty two. The real threat to our security isn't the danger of bankruptcy. It is the danger of communist aggression if communism is allowed to absorb the free nations one by one. Then we would be isolated from our sources of supply and attached from our friends. Then we would have to take defense measures that might really bankrupt our economy and change our way of life so that we couldn't recognize it as American any longer. Let's the very thing we're trying to keep from happening. Meanwhile America had warrants hands in Korea. Even if it didn't want to call it a war and many felt now that we were in a war in Korea that we should go all out for victory at the same time the. Us had the atomic bomb. Many asked if we wanted to win. Why not use it? If we relied on conventional forces alone we would end up losing more American lives today. Some people might recoil in horror at this thought. But it's a hard thought to avoid now that we were in war and we're sending our finest overseas once again many asked why not use every weapon in our arsenal. There were obvious complications. The Soviets had the bomb as well and the Korean conflict wasn't just about Korea or even the United States the North Koreans were propped up by the Soviets Stalin had actually signed off on their invasion. They were using soviet-built tanks if the US use nuclear weapons against them with that causes Soviets responding kind. Would they be tempted to support their ally? The way that we were supporting South Korea could all this quickly escalate into a conflict between the United States and the Soviet Union. Might it lead to world war three and a nuclear exchange. This was a fear. Even if we didn't use the bomb would a massive conventional invasion of North Korea trigger Soviet response with the Soviets still come to the aid of the Koreans and then there were the Chinese? And it's brand new communist regime under mousy Dong. They shared a border with North Korea. Would they feel threatened by an American invasion right at their border with? They join in with their fellow. Communists in Moscow in response. It quickly became clear that the conflict in Korea had broader geopolitical implications. Now that American the Soviets had the bomb. Every decision was somehow related to that. Broader context could a conflict in a random region of the world lead to a world war. Now there were a lot of steps between a military action that involves conventional forces and a nuclear war. Some argue that this was oversimplifying situation. That you just can't use the specter of World War three in every decision. You make as commander in chief to justify whatever you want including going to war without congressional authorization. This was a fair point. But I also think it's important to know that many of these policymakers had lived through World War One which began by the assassination of one person and it spread to a global war. There was a fear that one small spark could spiral out of control and in those situations. It's not a shock to see people fearful of consequences and grasping at ways to control events before they got worse. The North Korean forces had momentum on their side they push macarthur and his men all the way down to the southernmost part of the Korean Peninsula in the city of Pusan. It was desperation time. It was in the situation. That MacArthur hatched a daring plan to break out of Pusan by leading an amphibious landing in. Inchon behind enemy lines. Inchon was risky. It had high tides and a sea wall. In fact mccarthur even said that the odds of success where five thousand to one but he went for it on September Fifteenth Nineteen Forty Nine Macarthur began his invasion. He landed on Inchon completely surprising. North Koreans within a couple of days in Sean fell to you and forces in less than two weeks soul fell by October. All of South Korea was liberated is one of the most brilliant and heroic turnarounds in military history. Macarthur was a national hero. It looked like Truman's containment policy had new life but the question remained. How hard should America Push? Macarthur was itching to invade the northern half of the peninsula and liberate it from the yoke of communism but many feared that this would provoke either the Soviets or the communist Chinese respond. Truman decided to risk it. He ordered MacArthur to continue past the thirty eighth parallel into North Korea. So long as he didn't enter Chinese territory on October. Nine thousand nine hundred fifty macarthur crossed the thirty eighth. It was a fateful decision on October. Twenty fifth over two hundred thousand Chinese troops entered North Korea. Truman's nightmare had begun. The police action in Korea had now expanded what had first begun as a civil war. Between North and South Korea now saw combat between the United States and Communist China. The most powerful nation in the world was fighting the most populous nation in the world. Soon the winner set in American forces were now stuck in Subzero temperatures MacArthur's daring offensive grounded to a halt. Truman was shocked and despondent at the turn of events. He was under more stress than at any point in his presidency. One eight described his state in the following terms quote. His mouth drew tight. His cheeks flushed for a moment. It almost seemed as if he would sob then. A voice that was incredibly calm and quiet considering what could be read on his face. Voice of absolute personal courage. He said this is the worst situation we've had yet. We'll just have to meet it as we've met all the rest. The Truth Administration had two big worries. The first was that it would get bogged down in Korea in a stalemate Truman and his advisors feared that this was all a Soviet trap to get the US into an unwinnable war but to pull out would be to risk American credibility so early in the Cold War if the US left and let South Korea fall to the communists containment might receive a heavy blow. The second was that if the US tried to fight back it might cause a major escalation that could provoke the Soviet Union. And this is where you see the American people turn on Harry. Truman had supported him at the start of the Korean War but military stalemates in far off. Lands are never popular. And that's exactly what this look like a stalemate. Truman's approval ratings wants above eighty percent at the end of World War. Two were falling down to thirty percent. Even twenty percent General Macarthur could not accept the state of affairs. Chinese invasion forced him into a humiliating retreat. The gains of his daring offensive at Inchon were being raised. While Truman feared a widening of the war macarthur had no such concerns. He wanted victory and he felt humiliated. When commentators in the American media began questioning his leadership macarthur began lashing out in the press and began to threaten to unilaterally expand the war into China maybe even toppling mouth government even hinted that nuclear weapons might be used in China in hindsight. It seems incredibly alarming. There's some people to threaten to use nuclear weapons but again if you think about what? They were experiencing. It's a hard question to avoid. The Americans were getting bogged down in a bloody war in a relatively small country. They are a proud superpower. The proud victor of World War. Two in yet here. They were unable to accomplish their objective. As the body count piled up some Americans felt. Well we have the atomic bomb the most powerful bomb in history. Why not use it? It's hard to imagine not being at least tempted by thought but Harry. Truman kept reminding himself of what this meant. As the first and only man to ever order a nuclear attack against another country. He didn't WANNA use nuclear weapons again. He knew not only the destruction it would unleash. But also the impact it would have on American prestige then and throughout all of history. And he wasn't going to do anything to provoke conflict with the leader of the Communist world the Soviet Union. Truman determined to walk a fine line. He decided to keep the Korean war limited conflict. It was a new type of war. One that would be repeated several times throughout American history. When tested the patience of the American people. It was a frustrating war in that the United States was fighting where it sons were willing to make the ultimate sacrifice but its leaders didn't appear willing to use the full range of capabilities to achieve victory while Truman was walking a tightrope prosecuting a war. But limiting its scope macarthur was making provocative comments that threatened to undermine the administration's careful strategy and risk a broader war. It was not only danger to Truman's war plans but also to his control over the military in April of Nineteen fifty one. Harry Truman fired. Douglas mccarthur General Matthew. Ridgway would take his place. What would suit? The ambitions of the Kremlin better than for our military forces to be committed to a full-scale war with red. It may well be that. In spite of our best efforts communists may spread the war but it would be wrong tragically role for us to take initiative in extending the wall. I've thought long and hard about this question of extending the war in Asia. I have discussed it many times. Or The ablest military advisors in the country I believe with all my heart that the course we are following is the best course a number of events of made it evident that General McArthur did not agree with that policy. I have therefore considered it. Essential to relieve General Macarthur. So that there would be no daughter confusion as to the real purpose and aim of our policy. It was the deepest personal regret that I find myself compelled to take this action. Gentle MacArthur is one of our greatest military commanders but the cause of world peace is much more important than any individual. Truman paid a price for the firing for many macarthur was the only hope the US had in winning the war. President Shri seem to be content with a bloody stalemate. His popularity was down to twenty six percent to this day. One of the lowest in American history general ridgway manage to salvage the war effort but the stalemate resumed and the fighting continued by the end of nineteen fifty one thirteen thousand American soldiers who died long with eighty thousand total American casualties. Although he had initiated peace talks with North Koreans those talks had broken down polls were indicating that more and more Americans felt intervening in Korea. Had been a mistake. Truman however continued to believe that he had made the right choice. Intervene and to keep the conflict limited for him. It was a thankless task to stop the Communist advance in Asia and the wars limited nature was due to the unique circumstances of the new Cold War era in his typical feisty way Truman said quote. I wonder how far Moses would have gone if he had taken a poll in Egypt. What would Jesus Christ preached? If he had taken a poll in Israel it isn't polls or public opinion of the moment that counts. It's right and wrong by this time. Truman's domestic policies long-stalled. He hoped his administration would be the continuation and fulfillment of the new deal. He called it the fair deal and he had proposed it back in nineteen forty nine. It would include a number of progressive pieces of legislation like universal healthcare but by then with Truman's popularity in the dumps. He no longer had the political capital to push his proposals through. Congress it was so ironic under Truman. The power of the presidency had reached its zenith now that America was a world power and had the atomic bomb in its inventory. Domestically it seemed that Truman was powerless with his approval. Ratings in the dumps Harry. Truman decided not to stand for reelection in one thousand nine hundred eighty two that year. Dwight D EISENHOWER HERO OF WORLD WAR. Two ran as a Republican and defeated the Democratic candidate Ashley. Stevenson Eisenhower ran largely against Truman's policies in Korea and promised that he would negotiate a peace to end the war. He ended up winning a landslide. In the fall of Nineteen fifty-two. He took thirty nine out of forty eight states. Although Truman's second term ended in a military stalemate the country as a whole was prospering. I the economy was growing in record numbers in the aftermath of World War. Two unemployment had been virtually eliminated. Eleven million jobs have been gained in seven years and eight million veterans renowned college but for Truman his biggest legacy had been creating the institutions needed to continue the effort against the Communists. This included a newly organized. Defense Department Central Intelligence Agency and the Air Force it also included international institutions like NATO actions including the Marshall Plan aid decrease in Turkey and the Berlin airlift demonstrated American resolve the resolve Americans needed to sustain its effort to contain communism for decades and although the Korean War was unpopular it did at least liberate the southern half of the peninsula preventing it from falling to the Kim Dynasty in doing so truman help save generations of Koreans from decades of suffering. And whatever one can say about his policies. He succeeded in standing up to the Soviets without going to nuclear war history. Put Truman in the White House. At the end of one era and at the beginning of another the defense institutions. He signed into law. Still with us today this most common of men. This accidental president ended up becoming the architect of a new American age five days before Harry. Truman's presidency ended. He went before the American people to deliver his farewell address. Truman knew that his legacy would largely be defined by his decisions relating to the Cold War that confronting Soviet. Communism would require a long-term effort. That would outlast his time in the White House. I suppose that history would remember my term in office as the years when the Cold War began to overshadow our lives. I have had hardly a day in office that has not been dominated by this all embracing struggle this conflict between those who love freedom and those who would lead the world back into slavery and darkness and always in the background. There has been the atomic bomb but von history says that my term about a saw the beginning of the Cold World War. It will also say that in those eight years we have set the course that can win it. We have succeeded in carving out. A new set of policies to fame positive policies have were leadership policies that express faith in other through people. We have averted World War three up to now and we may already have succeeded in establishing conditions. Which can keep that from happening as far ahead as men can see. Truman turned his attention to those. Who BELIEVE THAT. He should have used nuclear weapons in Korea once in a while. I got a letter from some impatient person asking. Why don't we get it over with? Why don't we issue another item MAC? All raw dropped the atomic bomb. Most Americans the answer is quite simple. We're not made that way. We are a moral people. Tease is ARGO. With justice and freedom we cannot of our own free will violates the very principles that we are striving to defend the whole purpose of what we're doing is to prevent world war three. Starting a war is no way to make these but if anyone still thinks that just this once that means can bring good hands then. Let me remind you of this. We are living in the eighth year of the atomic age. We are not only nation that is learning to unleash the power of the atom a third raw law my dig the grave not only of our communist opponents but also of our own society. I rolled as RELA SHARES. Starting atomic war is totally unthinkable. Rational man then. Truman made a prediction. About how the Cold War might turn out then. Some of you may ask women how the cold and I think I can answer that simply. The communist world has great resources and it looks strong but there is a fatal flaw in their society. There's is a godless system. A system of slavery. There is no freedom in it no consent. I'm cutting secret. Police that constant purchase all these symptoms of great basic weakness their rulers fear of their own people in the long run. That's strength of our free society and our ideals will prevail over a system that has respect for neither God nor man last week in my state of the Union message to Congress and I hope you'll always take time to read it. I explain how I think we will. Finally wind through as the free world goes stronger. More united more attracted to men on both sides of the anchor and as a Soviet hopes for easy expansion blah. Then there will have to a time of change in the Soviet world. Nobody can say for sure when that is going to be or exactly how it'll come about. Whether by revolution or trouble in the satellite states are by change inside the Kremlin whether the communist rulership their policies of their own free will of other. The change comes about some other way. I have not a doubt in the world that the change will occur. Truman may have departed from Kenan's vision of containment but his prediction for how the Cold War might end aligned with Kenan's hopes he believed that long-term pressure would expose the failures of the Communist system. And that once those failures would be made clear to its own people and its leaders. The Soviet Union would have to change in essence. Truman was saying that the Soviet Union had an expiration date. He didn't know exactly when that date would be but he knew that it existed thirty two years after president. Truman uttered these words. Mikhail Gorbachev became the Supreme Leader of the Soviet Union by then the Soviet Empire was faltering overextended and its expansion had been blocked by freedom fighters in places like Afghanistan. Uprisings were breaking out in satellite states. Even worse it had been left behind by the technological revolution in the Western world the Soviet people across the empire were disillusioned by decades of false promises. Gorbachev initiated a series of reforms to revitalize the empire but this opened the floodgates of change eventually Gorbachev Lost Control of reform by one thousand nine hundred and nine. The Berlin Wall fell on December twenty fifth nineteen ninety one. The Soviet Union collapsed. The Cold War was over. It may be too much to call Harry Truman. A profit and one can also question whether he was initially naive about cooperation with Stalin. But it can't be denied that after spending much of his presidency thinking of ways to contain communism he understood its nature as well as any American statesman on July twentieth. Nineteen fifty three Harry. Truman left office at the age of sixty eight. He moved back to his hometown of Independence Missouri. He wrote his memoirs and raise money to build his presidential library. Truman lived long enough to see. Eisenhower served two terms and leave office and to see. Jfk Win Johnson. And Richard Nixon become president peeve and saw man walk on the Moon he died on December twenty six thousand nine hundred seventy two at the age of eighty eight at the urging of his widow best. He did not line state but a simple private funeral on the grounds of his presidential library. Near the end of his presidency Truman had a chat with Winston Churchill. The British prime minister reflected back on when Truman took office in one thousand nine forty-five and said quote. I must confess sir. I held you in very low regard. Ben I load. You're taking the place of Franklin Roosevelt. I misjudged you badly since that time. You more than any other man has saved Western civilization that quote in a sense summarizes Harry Truman's presidency when FDR died Americans feared what the future hadn't store. It was a world in ruins from the war with a rising communist threat and the atomic genie released from the bottle. During Truman's term the American people face crises of global proportions Harry. Truman had to make decisions that I would never wish on another person. Different presidents are dealt different hands and Sherman was dealt one of the toughest. No matter what he did he would forever be remembered as the president who ordered the first and so far only two atomic attacks in history he initiated the development of the hydrogen bomb. He committed American troops in a controversial war that ruined his popularity all without a congressional declaration of war. Whatever else he did those decisions will forever influence. How most people see him? I remember in college in Grad School. Hearing my fellow students criticized Truman's decision to drop the bomb to them. It seemed that Truman was reckless and had little understanding of the decisions he was making but to me. This kind of evaluation seems a bit hasty. I've already talked about how the real choice wasn't between using the bomb or not using it but between using the bomb or invading Japan. Both of which were terrible choices but the evidence also seems to indicate that. Truman and his men his advisors did know the significance of what they were doing. They did know that. The atomic age represented something new and dangerous enrolled history. I also remember my grandfather while I was growing up. He would sometimes talk about Truman and he didn't really liked him very much. He was from China. He's passed away since but he a lifelong hatred of the communist Chinese government and he faulted Truman for firing macarthur in not allowing him to liberate North Korea and invade Japan. In his is the last chance to topple. The communist regime was lost under Truman from Truman's perspective he had limited MacArthur's mission for fear of provoking a World War. He feared that the Soviet Union newly armed with nuclear technology would respond or full blown. War would erupt with China for Truman limiting the war meant preventing a Third World War but in doing so he was essentially sacrificing millions North Korea to the yoke of communism these were the agonizing dilemmas. Truman had to face. There is a fair debate about the wisdom of these policies. I've heard many say that America should have gone all out to win the Korean War and others who say we shouldn't have been Korean. The first place others criticize how Truman wage the war they cite the fact that he committed troops to a war without actually declaring a war. They say that this action paved the way for future interventions that ended up being clogged Myers like in Vietnam and Afghanistan and they strengthen executive power to make war a- power that the constitution granted to Congress. There may be validity to this argument depending on where you sit. If there's one thing that I can say it's at these decisions seem easier to make when you don't have the specter of World War three hanging over your head or aren't trying to prevent the advance of a totalitarian state or trying to secure freedom for millions of people all of this ties into another criticism when the ten expressed the idea that Truman expanded America's containment policy beyond what was feasible that he took the original strategy based on managing costs on picking and choosing your battles and expanded it to the point of American over-extension militarizing the nation's foreign policy successor. President Eisenhower would seek to reduce the costs and warned against over extension and ultimately the military industrial complex again. There may be validity to these arguments depending on what you believe but whatever the means were Truman. I believe was sincere in his determination to defend the free world against the communist world all without provoking direct conflict between the superpowers. It was a fine line to walk but he did it as well as anyone could expect from a man with little preparation for the job. It's often said that Truman represented the common man. One critic even said that he was a common man's common man deathly not a compliment. He seemed to many to be remarkable. He was far from perfect. P had a quick temper and was prone to salty language when he left office he was one of the least popular presidents in history but in a recent C-SPAN survey of historians. Truman was ranked the sixth grade as president of all time. Although his decision still provoked controversy. Historians have come to respect Truman sense of history his integrity his determination and his willingness to make difficult decisions historians realized that though common he was he had the gift of something that was often lacking in politics common sense. I've mentioned how much Truman's advisers admired him. These are brilliant men and they were serving a man who had no college education who wants had been a farmer and had salesman but they knew what he was made of. They knew that he was a leader. Truman had earned the respect. I also mentioned Truman's love for his wife Bess. Yes Truman was feisty with a sharp tongue but he also had a strong moral compass. That could never be shaken. One story illustrates is character when the nineteen forty. Eight presidential election was approaching true and was expected to run for his own terms president which eventually ended up doing but before the campaign. He actually offered the top spot on the ticket. To General Eisenhower was enormously popular telling him that he'd be happy to run as his vice president. Mike was rather taken aback by this and swore off any political ambitions illustrated who Harry Truman was. He was still the man he was when he left. Missouri practical home spun and unawed by power. It's hard to imagine any president willing to subordinate himself as Truman was willing to do. Its sometimes easy to look at Truman as a historical accident in some ways he was. It's a bit unsettling to remember that. His elevation to the presidency during such a critical time was not the product of a well thought out process but more due to political convenience he was the first president of the Nuclear Age the first US chief executive to unambiguously be the most powerful man in the world who could alter the destiny of mankind with a single order at the same time. He is likely the last president of his kind. It's hard to imagine another President One without a college degree. Not really looking to seek the office. Someone who looks like a statesman and more like your next door neighbor. Someone like him. It's hard to see rising to the White House anytime soon. Then again. Human events have a way of surprising us even today regardless Americans now seem grateful that such a decisive leader rose during such a decisive time. Harry Truman story is the American story. A former Haberdasher who became president and made decisions that still echo throughout history. It proves once again that the unlikeliest and lease the steamed of men can rise to the heights of power and leave a profound imprint on. The world This American President is produced by myself. Richard Lim and Michael Neale. Thanks to my dad. Burt shoe the music in this episode is by Blue Dot sessions. If you like what you've been hearing you can also help us by sharing episode on twitter or facebook Richard Lamm. We're back next time with more this American press.

Soviet Union President Harry S Truman United States Truman Administration Joseph Stalin Kenan America America Europe president Moscow Germany Hitler George Kennan Berlin Winston Churchill Soviet Foreign Minister
Hidden in Ice - Best of Coast to Coast AM - 1/21/21

The Best of Coast to Coast AM

18:22 min | Last month

Hidden in Ice - Best of Coast to Coast AM - 1/21/21

"The the demand for telemedicine grows so does the need for connectivity. five g. meets that need qualcomm remains focused on giving doctors and patients superior security rich five g. Connectivity learn more at qualcomm dot com slash invention age. I'm alec baldwin listened to my podcast. Here's the thing on iheartradio. It's my chance to talk with artists policy makers and performers. I always like to say. I like being an actress but i love being kristen. So i've prioritized that a little bit more than my like desire to spread my wings or prove to people that i can be some dramatic actress. If you like listening as much as i liked talking with interesting people go to. Here's the thing dot. Org and subscribe now on the iheart app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts. Now here's a highlight from coast to coast. Am on iheartradio and welcome back to coast to coast. George noory with you. Along with stephen quayle will take calls with stephen next hour. Stephen i wanna get back to admiral byrd for moment and then get into somebody. Bill your work at the an art deco but He he goes to the north pole then. He sees some incredible things. When does he go to the south pole. Oh he goes to the south pole in one thousand nine hundred forty seven okay and obviously for people unaware of you know the diary said. He was flying over vast fields of ice. When all of a sudden you started seeing tropical forest and the temperature in his cockpit which warmed up dramatically in other words there was an area that changed radically from something that was the frozen wasteland to An over What would you say on over. Lush almost like a prime primal forest or jungle environment. Even said he claimed he saw with his benign. Lers living. Woolly mammoths okay. This was in nineteen forty seven so when he did have the encounter with everything in How do i say this is. His diary was based around within in the year. Nineteen forty seven which was actually after. You know the operation. High jump. So i think george what was interesting too. Is that everything that he encountered was classified. It was classified as everything is an only make the statement. There are some things that need to be classified. But i'm believing that we're going to see basically the roof blowing off of the classification of all the ancient history and all the miseries. Now getting back to who. Admiral burden matt. He said point blank he met lord lucifer the king of the world. Okay the bible calls. You know that when jesus and satan got into it over who was the ruler of the world. Well because of a mankind's fall you will rebellion against god that devil gain control. And look the devil satan lucifer looser means light bringer and i think that one of the things that's getting and it's really important is that there are so many records that are hidden that are now being brought forth for instance the very term lucifer dealing with some of the genetically altered up Let's see proteins and catalyst one of them's called lucifer. Lucifer's we're dealing with the binocular telescope amount. Graham that's run by the catholic church that's called the lucifer telescope. We're dealing with the Amazing if you will signatures of something. That's other worldwide and now why is this important because we're talking. We're hearing all this news about new world order. Global government global a monetary system global religion. The pope is pushing it. And what's interesting is that a man named spangler stated a u. n. religious Expert years ago that the new world order would only be entered into by those who took an allegiance or pledge their allegiance to lose the firm and it was called the lusa ferrick initiation now. The bird though. Endorse this lucifer down there. He didn't endorse it. He basically carried the message that lucifer had given to him to the us government and he was told to shut up. Never speak of again. And you just don't hear from one of the most famous both bipolar meaning. He you know what i'm saying that ended but The bottom line is they pretty much locked him up and locked him away. When the first secretary of defense james forrestal was appointed Under the truman administration. That's when Forestall started attacking to people. He wanted to bring forth all this information and that's when he got throwing out he was murdered. He got thrown out the third floor window but before listen. How does this sound. Like i episode of the x files. They did everything they could do to keep. The guy drugged up. I'm talking about the first secretary of defense. James would massive amounts of drugs claiming he was hallucinating. And everything. and you know. I really believe so much of our quote. History is the basis for a lot of the writings of hollywood. That is a if you will almost a fourth foreshadowing of things that are going to be coming on the horizon for instance in nineteen fifty three. This is really critical. This has everything to do with what bird saw and everything to do with What is the whole if you will. The deleon Presence and the alien cover up that's going to be revealed. Wunder von braun. Everybody knows him was the first head of nasa. He was also a very brilliant. Probably the most brilliant rocket scientists in the history of the world up until that time was part of the nazi regime and he was a member of the he came to the united states along with herman over others under operation paper clip. But what most people don't understand is in nineteen fifty three actually wrote it but it got published in english and nineteen fifty three he. He basically wrote the book the mars project. And here's where it gets interesting. And here's how. I'm going to tie it all together. Believe it or not. The mars project was about the colonization of mars and it was about the way. Mars would be administered by the body of scientists who would be some of the most brilliant men on earth it would not have any relationship to how any government on earth was run. It would be basically a scientific utopia and what was interesting. The name that he chose for that body of the martian a rule if you will was called the ilan the e. l. o. n. u. c. Elon musk obviously. I don't know how his parents shows that name. Very fascinating that the ruling body of mars would be called the e lon or lon so the thing that is tying. His altogether is simply this. You know one of the things. That's really You get a lot of heat. We had a conference one of our true legends conference a couple of years ago and you have foes and the alien question answering the alien question and i was told by people who are there who are favourable in the intelligence community that there was a whole lot of talk going on when i was talking about the mars bases man mars bases manned Moon bases and all of the advanced technology and people said well. That's just crazy stuff. I personally george no five people six Even i don't know mr aldrin. But he's even Made statements. so that's the problem is is that there's space a secret space program and then you have the obviously the saturn program etcetera. But dr warner von braun was a friend of My friend and basically they talked about stuff faster than light. Speed and supposedly and then even. Hi dave hodges has a friend who's a friend of his ex secretary and she verified that. Dr warner von braun had been taken to other places but even even out there for now just to put that into perspective you guys. This is the most respective a respected and the most amazing scientists but the von braun and hermann ober made a statement. It wasn't that they were smarter than the scientists in the west but that they had help from the spirit world and people don't understand that the german advance whether it was the han about that flying saucers even even the the first stargate that Germany found the power it up. I had a four star general. Tommy steve go watch hell boy the opening scene. And he's and by the way in the special operations not retired and he said. That's exactly what the nazis were playing with the whole theme of. Hell boy that's not what i'm talking about but what i'm trying to get people to understand. Is this that the pyramids that all of these earth changes that are taking place. We're seeing triple quakes happening stacking quakes. Meaning they the Usgs and others fifty thousand quakes down there having their lay the if he thousand quakes and three months. So what's happening down argo and you know because i film Yellowstone we did our cascadia film. And you know. I have a lot of syrian yellowstone park. There is a magma pool under antarctica. George that is ten times. The size of the one that's under yellowstone yellowstone erupts. Every what six hundred thousand years. Yeah six hundred and fifty two or something but give or take you know six thousand years but again the thing that is as active and by the way the not only is the temperature rising you know in the arctic but the power surges. That are coming. You can go on the mimic program which shows you the amount of precipitation the atmosphere but there are like astonishing amounts of power. You know some guy said it's a science friend of mine said steve. It's more than one hundred fifty times all the power that the whole Civilized world can generate all that faa power fallen angel power and again. This is something that people have got to understand and it's critical. Not everybody wants to believe in god. Not everybody wants to you know I believe that there is a spiritual conflict going on. But i do and i believe that we're seeing it right now playing out because one world government one world religion and one world economic system is in the Making and that would be interesting. I think i sent you the list of the treaties that have been given to me by those in the world to understand these and other words you know pretty much deep deep deep state people And i'm talking to the secret. Government that for instance egyptian records indicate that there was an actual treaty between egypt. Three thousand bc in the sky gods and they end at the the indian The continent of india. They had one four hundred bc so all of these agreements. And then you get into our contemporary times. And you know what i would call post for roswell. Before roswell the nazis had agreement and these agreements were signed between the heads of the government and the islands. A famous eisenhower meetings that cetera. But what most people are not understanding is this that the realm of i would say and the release of this information. It's going cause men's hearts to fail. Jesus admits gonna fail them for looking after those things coming upon the earth. And so when you're talking about what some people say. oh that's superstition. When the things of men's nightmare start to materialize on earth. it's a whole different world than just. Oh that's science fiction. The tie in between the intelligence agencies and hollywood is a given us a fact. I mean even even Gene roddenberry and we all know who he was. Obviously they author and writer of star trek. The thing is they were all given inside information where they were all given by the way all of their stuff was asked to be checked but that was the way the intelligence agencies could offset the real discoveries. Oh yeah. I saw that. That's just a that's just the sci-fi movie and it's interesting because again now we're seeing. We're seeing that the release of the information. The famous navy fighter photos. We're seeing all of the strange stuff that's coming out. You know the lights beneath the water. And for the record and people can look this up both the nazis and the japanese had submarines that were doubling as aircraft carriers. These things were huge. Okay and The japanese had even more developed. And and since the nazis made a secret deal. And i maintain you know in my book is called empire beneath the is Which is sold around the world and people go. I didn't know this. That's the thing that i guess. I'm trying to overcome when you know what's going on. In the history of a thing you can obviously understand that there seems to be a coke attempt to subjugate humanity and to get rid of a whole lot of us humans and as human. I'm not really happy with a post human future. Because we're seeing it in every by the way i you know. The very first alien implant movie was Invaders from mars and all black and white one. It was a remake by i. Think cannon films in the in the seventies but they had an alien implant from mars going into a person's back of their neck so m plant artificial intelligence. Ai maintain this. I maintain that the basis of artificial intelligence is based on alien implants the coordinated integration between an organic and inorganic substance and we remember all the cattle mutilations remember all the strange stuff going on and it's accelerated the amount of manipulation the human genome. And it's getting to the point. George where somebody and something wants to totally annihilate the humanity and everything in my opinion that was Obviously created with such divine amazing god genius level stuff and the extinction of the human race and the insertion of what you know. You call the guberman. What's what overmatched what Hitler wanted the superman breathing creatures. That basically doesn't have any of the restraints of humans. Basically live forever. Be strong forever and be able to do everything you wanna do forever. And that's what zoltan each fund one of the most famous transhumance humanist said he basically all transhumance don't wanna die. I wanna live forever. So whether you're dealing with ray kurzweil and singularity and trying to be a name dropper what i'm saying it all gets back to this. There is a massive amount of revelation coming and the revelation that's going to come on ancient history the the hidden if you will Legendary and a logical Places of renown the golden age. That's all spoken about whether it's covered by the desert sands the horrific. Expose them whether it's covered by ice. And and here's something most people don't know. I think. I sent you a copy. And i know i sent lexa copy of the article that with the volcanoes that they've found ninety three which brings the total under an arctic. I think two hundred and thirty two that the ice if the ice to melt over antarctica the entire you know miles of ice thick. It would raise up to two hundred and thirty geez. Now you've always said it's not what's on top of the ice that you're interested in. It's what's on dir neath absolutely. It's the same story. it's never what you see remember. Ancient civilizations always seemed to build in an area or a pond a previously Area that was built up a good example that is the giza plateau in egypt. The giza plateau. What's above ground. We see space. We see the three great pyramids and now they're just releasing some more fines of the car. The step pyramid nesia but unknown to most people is the real antiquity what i would call the pre flood before the flood of noah that whole civilization is built beneath the Planes of diese. And they're finding this stuff and so you know the whole basis of our true legends film series was there's truth in legends and and what's fascinating is a special operations forces. This was explained to me by these guys they go out. And they're looking for ancient ancient If you will Technological developments communication devices and the big p. word power and. I don't mean like you know political power. They're looking for power sources and they're looking for Substances that they know exist in theory but they have not yet or found them. So it basically. It's a treasure hunt and history and that treasures when they start being released are gonna paint a whole different picture than classic history casts classic histories a joke in my opinion. Listen to more coast to coast. Am every weeknight at one am eastern and go to toast to coast am dot com for more at acuity insurance. We believe the things you do for your business are heroic and you deserve someone equally heroic to protect them. We put our all into covering your business so you can focus on the things you love. Most that's the power of heart acuity insurance wholeheartedly for you. I'm alec baldwin. Listen to my podcast. Here's the thing on iheartradio. It's my chance to talk with artists policy makers and performers. I always like to say. I like being an actress but i love being kristen. So i've prioritized that a little bit more than my like desire to spread my wings proved to people that i can be some dramatic actress. If you like listening as much as i liked talking interesting people go to. Here's the thing dot. Org and subscribe now on the. I heart app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts.

qualcomm stephen quayle admiral byrd james forrestal Wunder von braun Stephen George noory mr aldrin dr warner von braun alec baldwin dave hodges Dr warner von braun hermann ober Tommy steve truman administration Global government george spangler kristen Elon musk
What is Presidential Succession and Why Was It Formed?

Mason Vera Paine

20:34 min | 4 months ago

What is Presidential Succession and Why Was It Formed?

"This is the Mason very clean show your go-to lifestyle program covering everything from technology in gaming to movies T shows and podcasts to the Supernatural and Beyond Forty Year from Chicago USA. Would you host the unabridged Millennial Mason Mera pain? There's so much uncertainty involving the approaching elections from concerns about mail-in voting talks of voter fraud and even the commitment of a peaceful transfer of power author of Living Dangerously, the uncertainties of presidential disability and successful doctor Jim Ronin breaks down America's political institutions and the presidency line of succession. Thanks for joining me doctor Ronan. Thank you for helping me. So tell me about your book. How does come along so really just jumbled up on the issue of presidential disability succession. I was kind of surprised when it's a reading about the 25th Amendment about the guidelines that were in place, but what really surprised me is in the research the the number of times a month. The nation we really had close calls with this and it began with George Washington and we could really go right on through the modern-day and so I was I was surprised to see how frequently it had occurred and almost as surprised as how long it almost occurred. How long does it take you to do the research for this book? I'd say all told about three years that's not constant. I kind of looked at the disability issue at first and then when I took the things that came back or 25th amendment and so all told about three years kind of cold everything together and go to get it organized. I read some of your book and it's pretty amazing that you have thought you meant ation of some of the things that you were able to find like Diaries and letters how hard was it to find those fortunately, there's been a great deal that's been scanned and placed on life in particular the the Woodrow Wilson Library didn't excellent has done an excellent job with that and I was very fortunate in that regard because a lot of the material did prove if it's not embarrass wage. Into the president certainly embarrassing to those around and so that's the kind of information you would expect people who would written it that may have been culpable. They wouldn't just leave lying around Prestige, but fortunately a great deal that is available out there. So what is the presidential succession act? So there's been a few of them. The first was in 1792 and the 1792 act realized that okay. We have a vice president but there needs to be someone behind the vice president 1792 Act created the Congressional line of succession to place the senate pro-temp in the speaker in the line and then the cabinet after them, but the reason the 1792. Did that is not for real constitutional reasons, but because the Federalist who controlled Congress in 1792, openly despise Thomas Jefferson and Thomas Jefferson was the Secretary of State and he would have been just behind the Vice President in the line off. You said well, we can't have that. So they place the Senate pro-temp and speaker ahead of the cabinet. Of course that didn't stop everything from later becoming president, but that remained at line until 1886 and in 1886 Congress that all right, we shouldn't be involved in this they removed themselves and push the cabin up and the last one was in nineteen forty-seven which brought Congress back into it, but it flipped the positions and put place the speaker Senate pro-temp just in front of the cabinet. Why did they do that? I would think that it should be the other way, right somebody who's kind of outside, but I guess it didn't make sense. And that's the part. I didn't understand. I thought it was good the way it was no option. I'm right there with you most of us who study this agree that the Congressional line of succession is formed and that's really the the impetus behind the 1947 change the Truman Administration made the argument that they wanted some type of elected official in there. They argued that members of the cabinet weren't elected wage. But really as we look back we we think a great deal of it had to do with the close relationship that pirate Truman had with the speaker. And so as you said they're really did not make any sense to include Congress and really was fine the way it was but unfortunately that change was made and that is the line of succession that is in place right now. It's worth 20 and so it's not we don't just look back in nineteen forty-seven and say oh that was a mistake. It's unfortunately a mistake that we were living with right now. I was kind of confused about this part 2. So let's say we get all the way down to Speaker of the House does that mean the speaker is the new president and the pro temperature is now the vice president. Then who's the new speaker of the house or doesn't work like that it does and it doesn't and so this is what they said. The Congressional line is called. This is one of the major reasons that the constitution has no stability calls and says, well you can only serve in one branch time. And so if the speaker wage To ever become president they would have to resign as speaker. Now we would say. Okay. Well let speaker would do that but there's also a question of how long they would serve and so the speakers in a pro camera in this sort of gray area where they're in the line of succession, but it would only fall to them if both the President and Vice President weren't disabled. Where is that to occur off the speaker would become president. The speaker after was Eiffel Congress become president. We would guess the house would then select a new speaker. And so we could have a very odd situation where the speaker has become president. We're not sure for how long but now there's a new speaker. They wouldn't be able to just revert to their old job and the Senate pro-temp would still be there as if needed was there ever a consensus of what disability month and when it comes to president know John Dickinson was a delegate to the Constitutional Convention in the constitution does contain the word disability. He raised the question. He said essentially will what is disability wage? And who is to be the judge of it? And he was kind of met with the proverbial crickets chirping that no one could really give him a good answer and we can make the argument we should be able to provide an answer until the 25th Amendment which was ratified till 1967. But that was a question throughout history and really in creating the 25th amendment was one of the drafters of the dealt with which was look, how could you it's one thing. If a person says I'm disabled that's fairly simple what happens if a president two big questions arose what happens when President Bush on willing to say they're disabled or perhaps unable if they had suffered a stroke as we saw in Eisenhower's case. So yeah, the question of who gets to determine disability really became problematic throughout history the 25th Amendment does create the mechanism by which the vice president cabinet can now demon I can actually see why presidents would want to hide their home. Ability because they're also our commander in chief by saying they're ill or they're sick or their week would actually tell other countries that hey we're primed to attack Iraq, I could see in the past why they would do that but currently in modern times attacks like that don't happen or do they absolutely going back in history 1,000 of your to keep things secret. We have Woodrow Wilson and Grover Cleveland a few examples of really just an unbelievable series of tasks for undertaking to conceal the prep true condition. But yeah, the the other issue that requires 25th amendment is there was no mechanism until president's were afraid that hey if I say, I'm disabled and even if it's only for a short time, I may be impeached or forced to resign but yet in modern times, it really becomes a question of that and I think the big thing we see with disability is that wage? It's not even so much invoking it. We we kind of compare the the President Trump may be transferring power earlier this month that if a president admits, they're disabled wage question immediately becomes what when are they recovered? And that's really something that I think a number of presidents are faced that okay if I come out to say this and if I admit to a disability am I going to be definitively show look I'm better now, I've clearly recovered and if not, does that kind of Hangover me and and raised questions moving forward and family thing. I thought that was really clever in this book that you had put in was that in 1790 and I'm not going to read the whole thing through but there was a representative of Maryland he voiced that you know, hey, we need to keep pushing past the issue of what disability means and the rest of the house is like, yeah, but let's abandon the issue and just forget about this and we're going to talk about other dog. Things and back then I could understand why they would do that. I mean they're coming from all their respective states by horse. So it would take them months to be able to convene and have a meeting so they have a limited amount of time to get things done. I get that but now what's the holdup I would think that we were get things done faster, but we kind of don't you arrange a great point there with well, what about the disability and what we saw the draft in the 25th Amendment and anytime this guide attention was just that the scenarios would come into place and it was okay. Well this model would work. All right, but what if if well what if that happened and finally we got the consensus in the 1950s and a lot of mercury after the Kennedy assassination that we cannot create a perfect model. So there is always going to be and what about this? What about that? And so let's try to you know make it as Broad and all-encompassing as possible. But yeah, that was really something that we had seen is throughout home. We have just well, okay, let's focus on this. Wow. This is problematic. Let's move on to other things. Did you submit a a shorter window? I think the big thing we encounter in modern-day is that some of the the succession like is really a tension and we mentioned the President Trump going to the hospital or earlier this month. We saw huge spikes in Google searches for the 25th Amendment and press attention and really almost as quickly as it came and it disappeared and so that's really what we face in the modern-day is just it doesn't get that much attention until something happens and that kind of Life page very quickly. Now what happens if you know something happens to the president early in his term like within his first year what happens then would there be another election or it just everybody moves and we wait until next election year and so really what is interesting is the line of succession is that it doesn't come into play unless both the president vice president were disabled. And so what would occur in that case in this club? Her the day after the inauguration for example in the nineteen. Eighty one when President Reagan was shot, which is 69 days into his presidency. If a president were to die or resigned the vice president takes over and serves rest of the term where that to happen. The vice president becomes president would then nominate someone to fill the vacancy in the device presence is it were a temporary disability like you would see wage and three or four of the 25th Amendment the vice president would serve until the president was able to serve again and then the vice president just returned to the vice presidency and it's like nothing happened. And so the speaker and Senate pro-temp or there. But again they they only come into play if the president vice president are simultaneously unable to serve as vice president can do it. They don't factor in now. Are there any rules that you know the song elifi a presidential election if they felt that he was or she was disabled in terms of notification that would be difficult. It would all revolve around Congress. And so the Constitution create wage. Guidelines for counting the Electoral College votes and that's something Congress has to do with the beginning of January but short of that. It doesn't provide all that much information. And so in terms of flat-out nullifying election, it would be unlikely if something happened where a president elect couldn't serve it all becomes a question of fact, when does it occur if it is prior to the electors counting casting their votes in each state that occurs on December 14th of this year is then up to the parties and what we would expect would happen with the vice president. Elect what just move up if it is after the Electoral College votes January 3rd, and before the inauguration the 20th Amendment governs that and says device off selected becomes president, but there is a gray area and that is between that's what would occur between December 14th and January 6th when the electors of voted but Congress has encountered accounted them yet dead. If that were to happen, I I wish I had a better answer but it would really touch off a constitutional chaos. We would expect the vice presidential could just serve but there could be a number of legal challenges because the electoral votes had already been cast now, how come they didn't use States as a model as to what to do because I imagine this wasn't just something that happened to the president. I'm sure it happens Governors Mayors even other countries, why didn't they use examples of that to be able to to make a rule? I did a lot of it has to do with like you said there were various guidelines in place. And when this first began and 1790s a lot of times there weren't guidelines in place. A lot of times it would just be well, we'll hold another election and the 1796 succession act did include it was some convoluted language but allowed for a special election if it was within the first two years of the term and then it was well if it was before birth, I believe it was March the election could be in November and it was it really is a segment presented the problem, but I think they did look at some State guidelines but a lot of them differ and similar to the the presidential issue in a way isn't even at the state level it gets attention, but it doesn't get all that much attention until it's a problem found. So what we see at the state level is most States like I'm here in Pennsylvania. We have a governor and lieutenant governor. We elect them differently. They are elected separately. But the lieutenant governor acts as a vice president would there there should anything happen so they did take a bit of the state model but I think was also a case where you know, some states hadn't paid attention just like the the nation has the early yet. Now when in grammar school and I'm thinking back in grammar school in high school how our founding fathers were considered leaders and natural born leaders and they were Generals and they were lawyers and philosophers and deep thinkers and reading your book. It really humanize the whole process that they were really winging ended. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And I think there was just so much that you you're tempted to create a problem and it was almost kind of like pulling in a string that you attempted to fix the problem and she created two or three more. I think a lot of that occurred with this issue of each time. They would try to address something it created a problem elsewhere. And so you really saw a repeat of history from the 1790s right up through 1967. We're talking almost hundred seventy years give or take of like we had said Congress looking at this and saying wow this month. Big problem we need to address it. They start and very quickly go. Wow. This is still a big problem. There are a lot of issues. How about we save this for another day and it's fine. Let's look up where else unfortunately. That's what the current now at what point do they think that it's going to get fixed? Because I don't imagine I mean, I can't imagine why they would want broad laws. I mean to specify things and pigeon-holed and to be so rigid it would actually make more problems than trying to correct. So when they're trying to make it broader wage, would that be like the only route to take in terms of the succession line? It's a very easy fix because the suspension line isn't mandated by the Constitution. And so the success of line could be repaired by a simple majority vote of Congress. They could say hey, let's remove ourselves from the line. Now, I've certainly over simplified that because it just said that would mean Congress would have to say we're crazy. Ourselves on the line access and they might be unwilling to do that. But yeah, I we kind of get into that question of broad versus specific. We see so much in the constitution of you want it to be this is just it with the framers attempting to to craft a document. They wanted it to be specific enough that we could look at it and say okay. Here's what we do. But you also of course had to leave it long enough so that it didn't have a ten or twenty year shelf life and and actually speaking the the vice presidency. That's what occurred. The the Constitution had talked about life. And then the Constitution said in the case of disability or inability death or resignation quote the same shall devolve on the vice president and no one really knew what that meant and really didn't match up until 1841 and William Henry Harrison died just 30 days into his term and everyone kind of looked at each other and said, well, what does this need? And it was John Tyler the vice president who said No, it means I take over and everyone kind of looked and said I guess okay. No one no one was really short just cuz he said it was it was much more money. It kind of balance abroad specific, you know, and this is what I meant that it really looks like they were winging it because if they didn't know what it meant, why did they put it in there in the first place? Yeah, no question. And I think it comes back in the end to how much do we want to get how deep in the weeds do we want to get this I guess would be that if we start down the line of attempting to label or quantify what constitutes a disability Do does it become too problematic do we leave things out and you know in talking about this with students whenever we look at something like the Bill of Rights they sit there there was an argument against the Bill of Rights and it was off too much of the ferris were saying we don't want the people to have rights, but they raised the question of well, if we start listing rights what happens if there isn't one there does that mean, you know, do we look back two hundred years and say, oh they had left it out. It was a mistake or they need to put it in there and the same thing of well, why would they leave this question in there? Why would they leave it so vague and on the one hand if they may maybe they left it for future generations to figure out or you said with the winging it maybe they looked at it and said for this is going to be very complicated to resolve. You know, what let's say let somebody else do that. Let's move on to the next section cuz that's that's something that resonates with myself. I can see meat myself doing that situation with like, hey, I wrote it you didn't ask me to do anything else. I wrote this one. I think we're all guilty of wow. That's that's a problem. But I'm really busy today. I'll do that tomorrow. I promise myself. I'm going to take care of that tomorrow and very cloudy tomorrow becomes the six months. Well, dr. Cronin. Thank you so much for joining me. I really appreciate you being here. And for those listening where can I find find out more information about you and your book so I currently teach at Villanova University and I'm up there in the faculty website, but the book is available through Roman and Littlefield and their website and also on Amazon. This has been the mix and Vera Paine show. Thanks for listening can wait to hear more pets are wgnradio.com for exclusive content by Mason. Also, Mason. Nice book and Twitter at least and fear of pain. That's all one word and don't forget to share the show with your friends.

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1948, Dewey vs. Truman: The Gangbuster

American Elections: Wicked Game

40:37 min | 8 months ago

1948, Dewey vs. Truman: The Gangbuster

"September nineteen thirty one at a restaurant on West. Twenty Second Street on Coney Island in Brooklyn New York. A man in his late fifties is on the restaurant payphone. US Irate the woman on the other end of the line. His employees sue tries her best to sweet. Talk You. Dear never mind that deer stuff. cockeyed Lou isn't in the mood for Games today. Sue was late for a meeting and in lose line of work. Tardiness is not tolerant. Look here soon. When you were sent over there, you were told to be there at twelve noon. I know Lou but I well noon. Not One not one thirty I. Don't give a good goddamn. That Cocker Joe Faster I don't care if he's your sweetheart. That's son of a bitch doesn't know nothing about this business and you can tell him I don't give a damn for him or his six girls. I've more girls than he ever thought of. Sutras her best to defuse the situation now. Is that anyway to talk to a lady? Maybe you don't want to work for you. Know more lose. Patience is wearing thin, but he tries his best to keep his anger under control and to articulate to sue that if she doesn't get her act together, there will be consequences, so you are a very nice girl and I sure do like you. What I don't like trouble. Arguments and fights pain this game well. I'm not going to work for you anymore then. And I don't give a damn. Lose at the end of his rope and soon knows it. She also knows this isn't the sort of job. A girl can just walk away from so immediately. She walks bachelor length threat now. Lou Honey I'm only fooling. Everything will be alright. You'll see we come as soon. Lewis Winer also known as cockeyed Lou, was part of a vast network of pimps, madames and prostitutes. On that day in September, nineteen, thirty-one Lou had no idea that the police were listening to his conversation on a wiretap in July nineteen thirty one. The cops received an anonymous letter, pointing them in the direction of a prostitution ring. Within weeks, the police were surveilling cockeyed. and. By September, they had wiretap up at one of his regular haunts a restaurant in coney island. Didn't take long for cockeyed Lou to lead the cops to the real boss of his criminal enterprise Charles Lucky Luciano. Eventually transcript of one of the TAP conversations made its way to the desk of young intrepid New York prosecutor, named Thomas Doing. Do is fight against organized crime. In new. York would catapult him to national stardom and position him as de facto leader of the Republican Party. Election, nineteen forty eight. I'm Lindsey Graham and this is American elections wicked game. In the Nineteen Thirties organized crime was rampant and taking on the mob in New York was a dangerous proposition but New York. Prosecutor Thomas do was not one to run from a fight. DEWEES investigation and subsequent prosecution of mobster. Lucky Luciano helped launch his political career. Dewey's rise in Republican politics was meteoric. Do we would serve as US attorney in the southern district of New, York District Attorney For New York County, the governor of New, York and finally the Republican nominee for president in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty four. Though. Do we lost that election to FDR? He did not lose his status inside his party. In the nineteen forty eight contest do he would again try for the White House. But to take back the presidency for the Republicans, do with I have to rise to the top of a crowded field of potential nominees and challenging incumbent president, fighting through a barrage of opposition. This is episode forty, one, nineteen, forty eight. Do we versus Truman Purses Thurmond versus Wallace Gang Buster? Four Time Harry Truman was a popular president in large part because of his leadership during the latter part of World War, two by May of Nineteen forty-five Hitler was dead, Germany had surrendered, and the Axis powers had crumbled safe for Japan which fought on alone worried that an invasion of Japan would be too costly in American lives. Truman resorted to other methods. On, August sixth nineteen forty-five, the United States dropped the newly developed atomic bomb on Hiroshima Japan days later, a second bomb was dropped on Nagasaki Truman's faithful decision brought a swift end to the war, but it also had unintended consequences. The American economy struggled to adjust to the abrupt peacetime inflation. Spite taxes remained high prices soared even as wages, stagnated and labor unrest grew. Grew more ubiquitous overseas. The wartime coalition between the United States, and the USSR broke apart as Eastern Europe fell under the control of the Soviets. The ensuing Cold War between the free, West and the Communist East left many Americans fearful that America's enemies might develop an atomic bomb of their own and many Americans laid the blame for all of this at Truman's feet. Going into the nineteen forty-six midterms Republicans across the country ran on a simple but effective campaign slogan in the form of a question. Had, enough. Another pond to err, is Truman and the Republicans Anti Truman campaign worked in the nineteen forty-six midterms. Republicans trounced the Democrats, the GOP, one back the house, and the Senate to further check the Democrats the Republican controlled Congress pushed through the Twenty Second Amendment which limited a president to two terms, a direct shot at the late Franklin Delano Roosevelt and going into the nineteen forty eight contest Republican saw, further opportunity and a means to put an end to the Democrats longstanding presidential streak. The man many hoped would lead the charge against Harry. Truman was New York Governor Thomas Dewey. Dewey we announce his candidacy in January of nineteen forty-eight in the minds of many dewey political moderate, was a perfect foil to Truman, though Truman and dewey largely agreed on foreign policy. Do we was much more conservative in his approach to domestic affairs? By though do he was the front runner in the minds of many he was not the first candidate in the race to measure Republicans had already declared senator. Robert Taft the son of America's Twenty-seventh, President William Howard Taft and Harold Stassen. The former governor of Minnesota and both men gave Dewi plenty of cause for concern. Taft had sharp intellect, a famous last name and a nickname that matched his classically conservative Persona Mr Republican. Taft was a tried and true conservative, and with the rising tension of the Cold War looming taft ran his campaign on an isolationist platform which drew sharper contrast with Truman. But Harold Stassen was the more immediate threat in the arena of Republican. Politics do was accustomed to being the young fresh face candidate going up against men decades his senior Harold Stassen, though was five years his junior statins youthful energy earned him the nickname board governor, and because do we in staff, and we're not far apart politically to win the nomination do we would have more women vigour than Stan in the Republican primary? The primary system in the nineteen forties look very different from the one us today now to win delegates in the various state primaries, those delegates are bound to vote for that candidate at the party convention. In the nineteen forties, most delegates were not chosen by popular vote. They were chosen by party leaders in the individual states, only a small portion of delegate votes were actually decided by the primary contests, so the nomination was still won or lost at conventions, but in nineteen forty eight, the primary contests still held significance, they were way for candidates to test the viability of their message with the people. If a candidate performed well, it could create momentum going into the summer convention. They fell flat. Often their candidacy would fizzle. Do we ran adapt primary campaign while ingratiating himself to party leaders in the various states. Do we was the Polish face of a well orchestrated PR campaign? His time fighting the mob in New York had taught him what he believed was a valuable lesson about being in the public eye. Restraint is better than passion. Passion might put people off calm. Restraint would give them confidence and do. His manner gave party leaders, the confidence to line his pockets with campaign funds. which do we used on carefully crafted ads in newspapers, magazines and the radio do we was always careful with his words fully aware that saying the wrong thing might cost him the nomination. Stassen on the other hand was never shy about speaking his mind. He had a natural charm and charisma, and he was not afraid to break. The mold status had announced his candidacy back in nineteen forty six two years before the election extremely early in this time Stassen was arguably the first ever presidential candidate to launch a door to door canvassing campaign, according to life magazine in the early part of nineteen forty eight staff, and traveled six thousand miles knocking on doors, talking directly to the people. He recruited a staff of eager college students to help him campus. He raised. Raised loads of money. He articulated his opinions to the press, and he was on the rise, and though do we won the first primary contest in New Hampshire Stassen, won a handful of delegates, and for many was gaining momentum stassen won the next two primaries in Wisconsin and Nebraska, and not long after the Nebraska primary a Gallup poll, showed status, and well ahead of Thomas Dewey nationwide for the dewey campaign. The True Primary Test was in Oregon on May Twenty First Nineteen, Forty eight for Dui. It was do or Die Stan. One do we might have to withdraw? Politically Stassen and dewey. We're not too differentiated on domestic issues both to moderate approach, but they differed on at least one question, though how best to fight the rise of communism at home. Largely derived from the thinking of Karl Marx Communism is a political ideology based on common ownership, were rather state ownership of the means of production and absence of social classes for most Americans. In the late nineteen forties, the term communism was synonymous with the Soviet Union that meant a stifling centrally planned state economy and government controlled society, absent, many personal liberties that Americans held dear as such communism was largely considered anti-american, and as with USSR's growing influence on other nations Americans came to view the Communist Party of the United. States with scepticism, fear and often hysteria. So for many primary voters in one, thousand, nine, forty, eight, both Republicans and Democrats Communism was a major campaign issue, perhaps the issue. For weeks tasks and had been pressing dewey to meet him in a debate. Do had done his best to avoid it. Worrying statins charm when easily overcome his taciturn nature, but with the nomination on the line. Do we finally accepted days before the Oregon primary the restrained do we lucent his lips? He took on the subject of communism and use it as a weapon to try Knox task them out of the race. It's May seventeenth nineteen, forty eight at a radio station in Portland Oregon on one side of a glass wall over fifty reporters cram inside a small studio on the other side to candidates. Sit in front of a microphone, preparing to spar you all about to hear a debate between governor Thomas, e Dewey A and Herald East Essen candidates for the Republican nomination to the presidency of the United States. The question on the table is this. Should the Communist Party be outlawed in the United States governor staff and leads off and argues the affirmative, but free countries must take action to protect themselves against this fifth column in this unsettled period, which has been called a code who are? Stassen emphasizes the point that the Communist Party. If unchecked might be used as a weapon by the Soviet government, there's no on America to prevent these communist organizations from secretly developing organizations of hidden members from carrying on secret conspiracies to promote strikes. Stir up hatred between races and religions in America and from following their directions from Moscow. As staff and wraps up his affirmative argument. He's confident. He's made his case and Thomas Dewey's nervous statins campaign has been picking up steam and winning primaries. If do, he loses this debate, he may very well lose the Republican nomination as he lays out his negative argument do he emphasizes that suppressing communism is not the answer why Andrew? is in preserving this country. From being destroyed. By, the development of an underground organization. Which would? Grow so colossally in strength where it outlawed. that it might easily destroy our country and causes to draft all of the young men in the nation. Do, we believe that the best way to kill communism is to force communist out into the open and win the war of ideas as he wraps up his argument against outlawing communism. Do we appeal to the constitutional conservatives in his party? I'm against it because it's a violation of the constitution of the United States into the bill of rights and clearly so. I'm against it because it's immoral and nothing totalitarianism itself. I'm against it because I know from a great many years experience as a in the enforcement of the law that the proposal wouldn't work. And instead it would rapidly advance the cause of communism in the United, states and all over the world. And then in his final rebuttal staff and makes a mistake, the plays right into his hands. Bernie. We've narrowed this question down very much. At hinges now primarily on the month Nixon Bill. The Munt Nixon Bill sponsored by Representative Richard Nixon of California Representative Karl Months of South Dakota is currently before Congress. stassen supports it. We might make them bill. Shall be unlawful for any person to attempt in any manner. Established in the United States. Totalitarian dictators you. I hope that that directly fits and obliged to the Communist Party organization in the United States and in the world. Today. Staff has just made a colossal error. The Mont Nixon built does not ban the communist by name in his response to use his staff ignorance to his advantage that the author of the Bill Mr Mont.. The committee which sponsored it both say in the official records of the Congress of the United States that the bill does not outlaw the communist party now if Mister Status and says that that is all he wants. Then, he has completely surrendered. Because? He's admits that he didn't mean it when he's been demanding from one end to this country to the other that the Communist Party outlawed. And, he's willing to settle now. When confronted with the facts for a law, which the author and the committee say does not outlaw the party, which of course it doesn't do. We then points out that he agrees Mont Nixon Bill should pass, but only if it's constitutional the month bill, if perfectly harmless, probably it may have the virtue of helping. Keep them out in the open. That is a very good provisions of law. The other parts of if their constitutional, there's well. The dewey staff and debate was the first nationally broadcast debate of presidential hopefuls in American history. Forty million Americans listened over the radio as Thomas Dewey unraveled staff argument immediately following the Bay, many commentators declared that the tide of the Republican primary was turning into his favor four days later. Thomas Dewey won the Oregon primary his paths denomination was wide open, but in the lead up to the convention do his rivals would form an alliance. was set their differences aside come together in a common purpose, nine Dewey Republican nomination. Wicked game is sponsored by keeps. Americans have voted a bald president into office since the advent of TV, not since Eisenhower. A quick look back at our other follicly-challenged presidents will assure you that there's no correlation between baldness and incompetency John Adams John. Quincy Adams Martin Van Buren, James, Garfield were all men of accomplishment, but there's something about a full head of hair telegraphs presidential regardless of your own aspirations for office. If you're one of the two out of three men that experience hair loss by age thirty five. You need to know hair loss. Loss is preventable. If you get started early with keeps keeps is one hundred percent online sign up and five minutes answer a few questions and snap some photos keeps. We'll have a licensed doctor. Provide the right prescription then pack and ship your treatment starting at just ten dollars a month, no trips to the doctor, no waiting for a pharmacy, no hassle. If you're ready to take action and prevent hair loss, go to keep dot com slash elections to receive your first month treatment for free. That's K. E. E.. P. S. dot com slash. The Republican National Convention began in June of Nineteen. Forty eight at Philadelphia's municipal auditorium. The Dewey can't paint team went all out. They printed a pamphlet titled The Philadelphia Story which laid out dewey's resume and his position on the issues. There was a Dui sketchbook doing neckties, do we cigarette lighters, dewey buttons and thousands of Dewey balloons with the candidates face on them. Despite the fact that most party insiders considered dewey the front runner, he still faced serious opposition at the Convention with Herald Staff, and no longer a serious threat Robert? Taft was perhaps his biggest competitor and on June twentieth one day before the Convention. Taft made a big announcement. He told the press that he and Harold Stassen had formed an alliance and that together they were going to block dewey from winning the nomination after the Dewey Stassen. Debates stands, candidacy was all, but over he could not Garner enough delegates to win the nomination, but he still had a swath of delegates pledged to his side, and he might be able to use them to help. Taft Eke out a victory. Republican Party leaders wanted a peaceful convention, and for good reason, the nineteen forty eight Republican convention was broadcast over a new medium that was changing the face of communication television. Though the new technological wonder was gaining popularity throughout the nation. It's reach was regional and not yet national, but that didn't stop convention attendees awareness of the cameras. They knew very well. That television changed appearances as Time magazine observed good looking women turn into witches and Dapper men, become unshaven bums, and with television broadcasts of the nineteen forty eight Republican National Convention, having the potential to reach a half million screens and the surrounding area convention. Ten Dis were conscious of their looks. Thomas. Dewey was fully aware of the potential impact of television for decades party leaders engaged in negotiations with delegates sometimes out in the open right on the convention floor. Do we wisely instructed his managers to conduct all official campaign business away from the eyes of the cameras? Some of these out of sight negotiations to. And Taft by surprise in order for staff into block his path and helped half take the nomination. The state, of Pennsylvania was a must win going into the convention, Pennsylvania was already firmly in the taff column, but Stassen Taft didn't anticipate Thomas Dewey's deft political maneuvering. On June, twenty second nineteen, forty eight. The State of Pennsylvania made a sudden announcement that took the convention by surprise. The Keystone State announced that it was switching its votes from taft to doing. Afterwards one delegate call that there goes the ballgame. It's unclear exactly. What do we trade it away to secure Pennsylvania? But the story does reveal important fact about the candidate. Dewey's political skill was not charming, a crowd or shining in front of a camera. It was working the party machinery behind closed doors. At a press conference after the Pennsylvania announcement when reporters asked how he felt, he answered with a smile and a short sentence I feel swell. On this wall called. The delegates to this convention. HAVE CAST. One Thousand Ninety four votes. Thomas e Dewey of New York or President of the United. States an I declare that he is nominated unanimously all the Republican nomination president of the United States. Do, we won the Republican nomination on the third ballot. The party platform was a reflection of his policies, moderate and anti-isolationist. Do we also made a wise pick for vice president, the Popular California Governor Earl Warren a future Supreme Court justice. Do He didn't believe in passion or theatrics. He fought his battles thoughtfully and often through secret negotiation. Skills were enough to win the Republican primary, but would they be enough to overcome incumbent president? Harry Truman. The Dewey campaign was confident that could, especially as they knew, they weren't. The only opposition President Truman was facing in the lead up to their nineteen forty convention, the Democratic Coalition looked ready to splinter to win. The Democratic nomination for President Truman would have to contend with too extreme actions in his own party one from the right and one from the left. In the nineteen forties, the Democratic Party was teetering on the brink in large part, because many Democrats were fed up with Harry Truman. Fear of Communist infiltration into American society was widespread, too many President Truman's Truman doctrine, which sought to use containment to prevent the further spread of communism, internationally was a failed policy, but for many Progressives Truman stance on communism was far too harsh, and for many conservatives Truman's nonstop. The issues of civil rights were a major cause for concern and so in the nineteen forty eight election. Truman would have a fight on his hands. The first round was with his commerce. Secretary Henry Wallace. By the standards of his day Henry, Wallace was extremely liberal. He had served as FDR's first vice president, but eventually walls, pro civil rights, and Pro Labor views had alienated him from many conservative Democrats especially in the south, ultimately FDR had been forced to part ways with Wallace in his place. He had selected Harry Truman as his running mate at the nineteen forty four Democratic convention as a consolation prize Wallace was named FDR's commerce, secretary, For Truman. The first sign of trouble with Wallace had occurred back in nineteen forty six. Truman took a hardline stance against the Soviets leaving. America should compete with the USSR for Global Dominance Wallace believed the two nations should coexist peacefully, and then America should adopt a policy of cooperation. Wallace was far too vocal with these opinions for Truman's liking and so Truman asked for his resignation. But unknowingly by jetting Wallace Truman had set the stage for conflict in the nineteen forty eight election. It wasn't long before Wallace announced his intention to run as a presidential candidate for the newly revived Progressive Party, and throughout the spring and summer of nineteen, forty, eight Wallace's campaign picked up steam. The audiences at his rallies had steadily grown, as had the dollars had managed to race. But going into the Democratic National Convention in July nineteen forty. Eight, Henry Wallace wasn't Truman's biggest obstacle that was overcoming opposition from his own party. Especially Southern Democrats the southern Democrats did not want Harry Truman a man. They saw as being too friendly to the issue of civil rights and many Progressive Democrats who would not join Henry Wallace and the progressive. Party were eager firm alternative as well. For many the answer was obvious. General Dwight, D Eisenhower, whereas he's more commonly known I. I was publicly a political agnostic, neither a committed Republican, nor affirmed Democrat this fact alone made him dangerous because I had the potential to build a bipartisan coalition additionally Ike Saronic, leadership in World War Two had made him a household name. The American people knew him, and they trusted him, so the Anti Truman. Camp made appeal to the general, luckily for Truman Eisenhower did not want the job on July ninth nineteen, Forty eight Ike released a statement, saying in no uncertain terms that he would not accept the Democratic nomination for president leaving Truman's path to the nomination looking clear. But days later at the Democratic National Convention Philadelphia. The forces of opposition would make one last stand. Going into the Convention Truman and the Democratic leadership knew that a fight over civil rights was coming, and so did the southern Democrats prior to the convention. The Alabama delegation had pledged that if the party adopted a civil rights plank in the platform, their delegates would walk out even so the week before the convention, the Committee in charge of the platform powered ahead with Truman's blessing and drafted a civil rights plank. The final version stated that the Democratic Party would work to eradicate all racial religious and economic discrimination. We again state our belief that racial and religious minorities have the right to live the right to work the right to vote the full and equal protection of the law. When the plank was read aloud, the convention, southern delegates immediately pushed back one Mississippi delegate called out, give us the right to govern our own fundamental affairs Minneapolis Mayor Hubert Humphrey and author of the Civil Rights. Plank didn't back down. I say the time has come to walk out of the shadow of state's. And into the sunlight of human rights. Southern delegates argued that the plank was too much change too fast. Humphry responded to those who say that we are rushing the issue of civil rights I. Say to them. We are one hundred seventy two years late. The civil rights plank past six eighty, two to six fifty one Alabama walked out first then Mississippi to the sound of booze, and his the delegates ripped off their badges and toss them aside. The rest of the southern delegation stayed, I'll be begrudgingly. Southerners put forth a protest candidate, but he was a futile resistance Harry Truman won the nomination on the first ballot, but to pacify the embittered southerners, and in an attempt to foster party. Unity Truman Selected Kentucky senator all W Barclay as his running mate, but party unity would be hard to come by on the night of Truman's acceptance speech. All Hell would break loose. July nineteen, forty, eight, the delegates of the Democratic National Convention crammed into Philadelphia's conventional. It's late and the delegates are exhausted to Democrats stand near the front of the stage DNC official Jack Reading in Ohio Congressman Mike Kirwin whose face is dripping with sweat. Oh, it is hot as Hades in here hundred degrees at least up swimming in my own sweat. Well, who isn't? Outside the summer heat is sweltering inside the hall. The only thing more pronounced than the heat is the tension. Harry Truman has won the nomination, but the path to victory was deeply contentious soon. Truman will make his acceptance speech, but before he does party leaders have a special event plan convention chairman. Sam Rayburn takes the stage and speaks into the microphone distinguish Elliott's. It is my pleasure to introduce to you. Mrs Emma Goofy Miller. Miller the sister of a well known Democratic Senator is hoping to lighten the mood. Emma Commission that Pennsylvania Forest Association to make a surprise for President Truman a massive Liberty Bell may not have flowers that weighs nearly one hundred fifty pounds. The bell sits on stage for all the delegates to see. As Miller walks onto the platform. The crowd goes wild. The two men near the front of the stage turn their attention from the heat to the flowers. What's this all? Just waiting to see Mrs Miller has a surprise in store for us. What kind of surprise agents? Herlin seems confused, but on the last break reading saw the pigeons himself hidden away in secret compartments inside the Liberty Bell. Before reading has a chance to explain. Mrs Miller waves her hand and gives a secret signal. The trap door when Lisa's and nearly forty pigeons take flight, but immediately Mrs Miller notices. Something is wrong to of the pigeons are dead in their cages from the heat and the lucky survivors don't make an orderly exit. Most fly to the rafters, but a handful go preserve. One of the pigeons lands on Chairman Ravens head. He swatted away screaming. Other pigeons fly right over the heads of delegates, leaving splatters of droppings in their wake. People scream shout docked to the ground and covered their heads to prevent the pigeon from packing their ISO. Jack Reading shakes his head in disbelief. He's the DNC publicist. He had nothing to do with this preposterous stunt. A turns a congressman current. And what Damn fool could have thought of a thing like this? This heat all be dead. Bad enough having the southerners in the Wallace I`ts actress. Now we gotta have someone arraigned for the SPCA to have as. The unleashing of the pigeons, from Mrs, Millers Liberty Bell was meant to be a celebration. The chaos that ensued was perhaps a portend of what was to come in July the same month. As the Democratic Convention, the Progressive Party met in Philadelphia and officially nominated Henry Wallace days later the Democrats who had walked out held a convention of their own in Birmingham Alabama there the newly-formed state's rights party, commonly known as the dixiecrats nominated the fiery South Carolina Governor J Strom Thurmond, while it progressives called for an end to the cold. War The dixiecrats defended segregation condemned federal encroachment into state's rights. For Truman this month. July was a disaster. His party had splintered into three factions and a much-needed post convention. Bump in the polls never came. So by the end of July Thomas, dewey was well ahead in every national poll, many in the press pronounced troops candidacy dead. Many in the Truman Administration Lost Hope, but Harry Truman did not as the fall campaign got underway in earnest, Truman would try to inject his staff with a shot of optimism. He would attempt to pull off one of the greatest upset victories in history of presidential elections. It's late July nineteen forty eight at sixteen, hundred Pennsylvania Avenue. The mood at the white. House is frantic but SOM- The national polls show Thomas Dewey with a commanding lead most Washington insiders agree. Truman's candidacy is doomed. Truman and his staff gathering the Oval Room to discuss the upcoming presidential contest as staffers go back, and forth strategizing and analyzing his prospects for Victory Truman sits at his desk quietly, taking it all in. He sends his more than discouragement from the group. He sends his defeat. Concern Truman listens intently as one of his staffers talk to his press, secretary and close friend Charlie Ross. Helpless Charlie nothing is hopeless. We have no chance of winning none at all. As we can do go down fighting. Hearing, this Truman suddenly stands. The room falls to a hush all turn to the president. He speaks in a firm and steady voice we. are going to win. Truman is not the sort of man to accept defeat. He slowly walks around to the front of his desk with determination in his eyes and intensity and his voice. He proceeds to rally the troops I expect to travel all across this country. I expect to talk at every whistle-stop. We're going to be on the road from Labor. Day to the end of the campaign chairman stairs, the defeated staffer down. It's going to be tough on everybody, but that's the way it's gotta be I know I can take. Then Truman flashes, a slight grin with a twinkle in his eye. He turns to address the whole room. I'm only afraid. I'll kill some of my staff. And I like you all very much. I don't WanNa do that. Charlie Ross like to say that. As far as he was concerned. The election of nineteen, forty eight was one that day in the Oval Room. Truman's daughter Margaret had a theory about where her father's optimism came from in her book Harry Truman. Martyred recounts a letter. Her father sent to his sister earlier that year in the letter President Truman wrote just three years ago, I was sworn in as president seems an age, and it has been two wars were in progress were supporting both I ordered the atomic bomb to be dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki who was a terrible decision, but I made it, and I'd make it again to save two hundred fifty thousand boys from the United States. I've still a long way to go. It will be a rough road. Can't be any worse than the trail behind. According to his daughter Margaret Truman felt he had to win. The fate of the world hung in the balance earlier in the year Truman had written if it were not for the world situation, my lack of confidence in the presidential candidates I'd throw the whole works out the window. Go home. And stay. At the nineteen forty eight Democratic Convention Truman had vowed to fight hard and give the Republicans. Hell on the campaign trail at sixty four years old. Truman did just that in September and October of nineteen, Forty Eight Truman traveled over twenty thousand miles by train, giving speeches as many as ten per day, his large crowds frequently chanted, give them Hell Harry. On the campaign trail, Truman promised to give to the communist to and he blamed the Republican controlled Congress for forcing him to confront the issue with one hand, tied behind his back to a crowd of thousands in Oklahoma City determined to cried. I charge that the Republicans have impeded and made more difficult our efforts to cope with communism in this country Truman, urged the Oklahoma audience not to sit at home, but go out and vote. Truman attack. The do nothing good for nothing Republicans mercilessly calling them bloodsuckers and Glutton's of privilege to appeal to progressive new. Deal Democrats Truman slammed Republicans for their anti Labor positions as Truman call for instituting fair labor laws and raising the minimum wage. But despite Truman's heroic efforts, Thomas Dewey was still ahead in the polls. A Gallup poll in October show, do we with a comfortable lead? Forty nine point five percent to Truman's forty four point five percent in the final weeks of the campaign, major newspapers across the country declared the dewey's victory was all but certain life magazine ran a picture of Dewey with the caption, the next president of the United States the Chicago Tribune, was so confident of Dewey's victory than on election night. They went to press early in the headline Dewey Defeats Truman. It's become one of the most famous printing errors in American history on election day in nineteen, forty, eight Harry Truman one over twenty, four million popular votes and three hundred and three electoral votes, defeating Dewey, who received just under twenty, two million popular votes and one eighty nine electoral votes. The Democrats fared well across the board, reclaiming the House and the Senate. Two days later one of the one hundred fifty thousand copies of the erroneously headlines Chicago. Tribune made its way into the hands of Harry Truman, who stood on the back of a train car in Saint Louis the Tribune had previously written off Truman calling him a Nincompoop on the back of that train car. Truman had his revenge. He held up a copy the paper and smiled as a slew photographers captured the moment and the Tribune's greed just mistake for history. In the nineteen forty eight election, Progressive Democrats mainly farmers, laborers and union workers largely voted for Truman Truman also received a larger portion of the African American. Vote than FDR and most significantly. Truman's victory proved that a Democrat could win. The White House without a solid south standing behind him. If the DIXIECRATS had not defected from the Democratic Party. Truman's margin of victory would have been even bigger Strom Thurmond, one thirty nine electoral votes that likely would have gone to Truman progressive candidate Henry Wallace received none. In the end it might be said that the nineteen four eight election came down to personality. Truman had the pluck of an underdog, the fight of a man with nothing to lose these qualities endeared him to the American. People do we on the other hand was careful with his words to such an extreme that he often came off as bland, unapproachable and stiff as one contemporary observer noted, do was like the little man on the wedding. In addition Truman's was arguably the better campaign, his fair deal for America, which advocated for universal healthcare and a raise, minimum wage, and delivered the people hope, and his Truman doctrine against communism made. Many Americans feel that they were in safe hands. But during his first elected turn Truman's hardline on communism would be put to the test. The tension of the Cold War would intensify and in a surprise move USSR would successfully detonate their own Tomek, bom. Communist would gain control in China and bloody conflict in Korea would turn into protracted quagmire Truman's popularity would plummet, and as the Democrat search for a new leader. The Republicans would try to rise to power on the back of a famous World War Two general, Dwight, D Eisenhower, but in the nineteen fifty to contest for the Republican. Establishment I would prove difficult to control. On the next episode of the game, the election of Nineteen fifty-two Dwight ICENHOWER. Determine Democratic Party United Behind the Popular Illinois governor had lay Stevenson, but in the run up to the nineteen fifty two contest I speak as cross to bear, is not the Democrats to member of his own party as I- defies the Republican establishment fights for the White House on his own terms, he does his best to rein in his vice presidential, running mate political powerhouse named Richard Nixon. Don't miss a single week of our marsh from Seventeen, eighty nine to twenty twenty hit the subscribe button and your podcast APP. Now this show is supported by you our. Our listeners please give us a rating and leave a review, but the single best way to help the show is to tell others share with your friends and family, and find us on social media at wicked Game Pot, and I'm at Lindsey Graham another way to support this show is to go to wicked game podcast. Dot Com members there get early access to add free episodes as well as long as content only available to members find out more at wicked game podcast dot com about our reenactments in most cases. We can't know exactly what was said. On our show is heavily researched and based on surviving historical documents. Wicked game is an airship production created hosted and executive produced by meet Lindsey Graham on you editing by Molly Bach. Sound design by Derek Barron's CO executive produced by Stephen Walters in association with ritual productions. This episode written and researched by Stephen Walters fact. Checking by Greg Jackson and Seattle Salazar from the PODCAST history. That doesn't sock music by Lindsey Graham distributed by wondering.

President Truman Governor Thomas Dewey Truman US president Truman Eisenhower America Democratic Party Henry Wallace Truman Purses Thurmond Democrats Truman New York Harold Stassen USSR Truman Administration Communist Party dewey campaign FDR governor Thomas President William Howard Taft
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5:03:02 hr | 1 year ago

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"If you want to live CD medic target your pain at its source it's fast acting relief with active OTC ingredients plus the added benefits of THC free hemp oil. It's cutting into your exercise time it stabbing you in the back nine and it's attacking your peace of mind it's pain and it's getting in between you anything else hold on a second they're doing this magic in to build towards Crown Jewel right what the I'm going with lane finish probably going to get a lame finish so that is the lineup for that show they're also tonight let's see who's also in the match which by the way tiffany lamps if they didn't have a brand split he'd have four other three other options while this is true they do have a brand split drew McIntyre so literally because of the brand split their only option is ricochet but why doesn't then drew put on a showcase destroying somebody in front of me danced alongside a more sophisticated you and a straight up old fashioned you they're all in there they're all you the rebel that was inside you didn't go away rebels never do that spirit still kings court slash divorce court segment with Roussev and Alana is Judge Lynn toler going to be there because if she's not going to be lawler so we're stuck with a rematch which by the way okay so here are options drew McIntyre beats rickshaw again which I think it would be stupid ricochet there should be interplay between the two because otherwise what the hell are you selling with that said I mean come on you're telling me that they can't have some more creativity somebody who's not in the mix right now to come up and be that person who gets sacrificed for drew McIntyre why does it have to be because they want drew macadear to face somebody got anything else becky Lynch Kyrie's sane in a non title match or it could be something and also Jerry lawler will host drew match yes yeah that's the ideas here okay so the options for drew McIntyre on Monday it's not going to be all e because he's on Smith of the teams in the main event of crown jewel can't even be there because of the brand split that's ridiculous I understand that and if you're doing co branded events like that flairs ric flair stands there he cuts a promo at the end of it and then something like that I mean why does it have to be because they're afraid of wash matches I don't know drew McIntyre so they just went fifty fifty so who cares or they do like a lame finish it which if that's the case why bother even doing the match there's no way to win here hey but wait a second they also had a substitute which was Zara which is kind of ridiculous said he's going to face Mansoura that they also couldn't find anybody else to take the l down it's not going to be shortage e because he's on smackdown Roman reigns is on smackdown the only other option is Roussev and I don't think they wanna do Reuss we just have to repeat a bunch of matches now because they have to tell that they had before segment on smackdown where you can't even have half granath three hours sucks I know that but still that's why we get repeat of matches over and over again it's not a matter of you can't do anything else it's because they're not doing it but he was the one who took the L. why can't you have somebody else even if they're on smackdown come out who's not in the match be representative or come up from St there's not a zillion and a half people on that roster they can occasionally be brought up to do something from somewhere if you needed him to this is a lack of creativity this is not a lacking benning because there's a show on called paternity court they imagined they could have gotten them on that this here says why hasn't anybody complained about monsoon Moore's contract he wrestles twice a year it's better than Brock's contract no it's not Mansour is not making seven figures now and Abebe and we're looking out for every one of you bbn t all we see is you member FDIC the divorce court he knows about being either a plaintiff or defendant one of those cases but what does he know about being a judge and presiding has a lot of experience thank God they didn't go ahead with the is out there and hits everybody's moves after he gets maybe a little assistance from the horseman on the outside and he hits all the moves gets the pin celebrates it's wonderful it's fantastic and then person says I agree with your drew analysis you could do the flare team have a warm up match squad four or five other dudes maybe he's talking about they either over think everything or they under think everything that's it this week present like they just Arne Andersen cuts a very real promo to sell us on the match afterwards kind of changes the entire mood they could do something like that but we also just have them face each other again as cannot be on smackdown yet raise on smackdown with Kane makes no sense you know the problem well I mean there's thousand problems one of the big problems of this company is awesome things Alexa goes and then nicky goes then they both go back together but Alexis not been seen since like probably end with a crap finish Presi- hated how last week Heyman told Ray that brought cannot be unwrapped because he was drafted to smackdown that on smackdown the raw guy title to time series probably making sixty grand work two times but I tell you what I'll take sixty grand work two times a year although I'm not sure that's what he's making so please don't put that people come on I got this draft we got it all ready to go in advance we know where everybody's going then they do the draft and then it's clear like they didn't think of it well we'll just hope nobody notices that's what we're dealing with here get used to it person says man sewer wrestles you mean there's a lot of things they can do something with the horsemen we're going to fight in wargames jj out there jj just you know forget we face how good are the eighteen to forty nine demo is going to be with divorce court my guess is not well hurt they sold zero shirts so I don't even know if it ever went up and it was pulled weeks ago but he decided on sun needed as far as the snicker goes but I mean is this really working for anybody as Bobby Lashley been the the Thespian that you need something like this I mean I gotta be He's much sweeter than that the shirt the shirt was never released they never sold one single shirt honest to God I don't even know constantly on the Florida loop I don't think Brock's works I don't think brock routes that no he doesn't work those shells brock is a much better contract let me tell you we all the story line is completely ridiculous it is still never been explained on what exactly other than he's not much of a man suddenly all you know that's why the story taking place I mean I know that Paul Heyman gets all the credit in the world for all sorts of stuff but this is one of his fingerprints that frankly sucks I here says regarding ach this coming across like he was internally silent only spoke about his disapproval of the t shirt after it was released the situation is a mess oh man what a tired ass idea we'll see how it will try to make it entertaining is just this is not that there hasn't been some little values this shirt ever even went up on any website because given the traffic for like w e shop I would think that it went up for even like five minutes they would've sold a shirt this is a work I think the shirt was a real mistake but now they're using it for story one hundred percent absolutely certain that's not the case so what I think is going to happen this is just my my prediction I have no inside knowledge on this I think he's GonNa Win Brandin Show brand versus brand and rock and win the title back survivor series now I don't know if they're going to do that I wouldn't do that because you'll if not how do they get out of this one well they've already announced on smackdown this Friday there's going to be a special interview with Bray Wyatt stupid things and crazy things that happened no this is absolutely positively not a work person year says does bray when the title of crown I even though I don't think he is and then actually hasn't been drafted so you could do a deal where seth loses the title to Bray Bray he goes to smackdown Kane Beats Brock for the WWe tyler universal title or whatever and then he signs with raw this is a classic example of because so many aspects of the story don't make sense people presume conspiracy when the reality is is just a lot of and I think he's GonNa steal the title from raw and taken to smackdown because it just so happens that survivor series appears to be a code series I mean I don't know how they get out of this I absolutely no idea so unless like Cain Beats Brock and canes actually Arago and so he just switched the belts from one company to the other for one one brand to the other they could do that and before anybody on smackdown complains about well hey in theory since Cain wasn't drafted he can sign with any brand that he wants so you don't even know you they could use that and presume that you're stupid and don't remember things but Israel he doesn't have to be on Roth Canes on smackdown then Ray can be on smackdown but no we gotta draft rate of Raw oh no well we need a with with Kane like the fans clearly wanna see bray white as champion so your plan is to give them the championship for three weeks and then take it away from him you know how that's going to get over it survivor a October twenty seven th there I guess it was Saturday night that's the night that he all of a sudden went crazy on twitter I don't even know why he waited three or four weeks or whatever I don't know what's going this is an urgent health notice for all residents wha how does this make any sense than they can just save member you were owed something because of the whole of Alexa Trade Right AS Roma's while you can on I wish I could tell you know and that's I don't I would have stuck out I think if I just remember the initial thing with shirts went up for sale and every on his Roussev is playing his role in some ways perfectly with the Dad Mustache and the Dad Shrug of the shoulders and everything that but like I mean the whole point nine five seven one that's eight hundred four three Oh ninety five seventy one attention business owners now is the perfect time health alert hotline is your brace company these specialized races have been tested for pain relief call us toll free right now to determine your eligibility and to learn how to use your all right now you can learn how to get free equipment and free installation now you have choices it's time to start saving money on your cable TV bill for Your Business and call today and get ninety channels plus free equipment and free installation smart business owners like you all across the country are consolidating and saving money on cable TV Internet and phone service for the business so now's the perfect time this may be a limited time offer to the first one hundred people that call right now so please listening or let others watch TV with you order in the next ten minutes and take us up on our thirty day home trial and very special price TV ears is a brand hearing if the volume so loud your family screaming at you then put on your TV ears TV ears has helped millions of people just like you hear TV loud and clear what about Paul Heyman I don't know this double life we're not supposed to know it I guess he's also which you know it's kind of funny it's the rules are because Cain wasn't drafted he's free to sign anywhere he wants right now he's a free agent which begs the question why he can't just show up on raw it's another matter entirely save money and call now eight hundred four seven seven one one three eight hundred four seven seven one one three eight hundred green from back neck knee and wrist pain you may qualify for our pain relieving brace at little or no cost to you but the deadline is fast approaching simply called the health alert if he had a shirt even at that time so I know if somebody can go back and find those mean I don't know but I don't even think it went up then it was I who knows there are so again you're listening to wrestling observer live with Bryan Alvarez and Mike Zimmer v on the sports byline broadcasting network hey that you're making up your own rules because right now the rules figures making up your pain is a free agent Cain isn't smackdown so it wouldn't even be a trade like questions that need to be answered about this okay so listen I gotta address this one because this person says only because miles waited so long and W is still letting him talk makes me think that nine eight four four two zero seven that's eight hundred nine eight four forty two oh seven four seven seven one one three that's eight hundred four seven Oh seventy one thirteen do you have a problem hearing the television do you need your TV ears and make everyone happy eight hundred nine eight four four two zero seven eight hundred nine eight four four two zero seven eight hundred nationals have trusted for more than twenty years and through this special radio offer you can get your very own for just sixty dollars just mention Promo Code Radio SA- put on the show Brian Elber is here Wrestling Observer Live Mike Zimmer via also wrestling observer dot com so this person here texted his say the color and he in fact included a screen shot of all of the shirts and in fact the Jordan miles shirt is on a gray shirt smiles shirt was on there but it was the only one not black it was gray also they're all custom so the fans can pick and not a black shirt so there's another piece of this puzzle hotline now you heard right you may qualify for a pain relieving back neck or wrist brace these items may even be covered by Medicare or your private insurance the and I'll be back tomorrow with VIN Craig Retro Raw Nature From Nineteen years ago this week as well as last night's show where we the full sail show three weeks or four weeks ago now whatever it was so it would have been a couple days before that or or that that Wednesday when those shirts were up in Adams newsfeed dot com this stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by you follow us on facebook twitter and for no cost to you eight hundred four three zero nine five seven one eight hundred four zero nine five seven one eight hundred four three Oh I'm Mike Clifford a fast moving wildfire spurred by powerful winds burned through northern California on Thursday the Washington Post Insurance or Medicare to minimize your out of pocket cost don't wait if the deadline passes you may lose your opportunity to get a pain relieving back neck knee or wrist brace at Little Oh here's your time stamp Hugo everybody and we're at a time to wrap it up here for today obviously we'll talk more about the snyder and wrestling observer radio only four subscribe art saving money on your cable TV bill for Your Business we can give you packages with up to ninety great channels and save your business a ton of cash and neighbors with Dave Meltzer we'll recap the raw show as well talk all of the news as noted no filthy Tom Show here today we're moving the show to Friday so we can review the crown jewel shell it's all at once we talked about this yesterday rushed thirty shirts to market so they would be available when annex t debuted on USA which was also a rush job when they released over thirty annex t shirts that Jordan miles t shirt was available at least for a short time I remember seeing it and they add when w we released over thirty annex t shirt ports it forced thousands of people to evacuate parts of cinema county that Ezekiel wine region north of San Francisco Pacific Gas Electric dog shirts and even their own talents exterior just kind of laughed at the shirts it went up there that wouldn't that was not one of them I don't believe I don't even a week before the first annexed maybe it was that same day remember again that was they were rushing those shirts out so people could have them on for the full sail the first fooling by June of next year I'm Andrea Sears. Reporting Lower Federal Courts have ruled the termination of Daca is a lawful and of issued injunction where the fire broke out that's also according to a statement from the utility undocumented immigrants who have arrived in the US as children will be joined by community reviewed NWEA roach wrestling from November of nineteen eighty-eight listen to the review and then go watch that show on the W network because the program was instituted in two thousand twelve and allows immigrants who were sixteen or younger when they were brought to the United States to go to school and to work without fear of D vow cranking up the volume for about sixty bucks for the Thirty Day free trial you can get your own set of TV ears when you wear TV ears you can mute the TV volume for privacy. Stay Governor Gretchen Whitmer announced a proposal to increase the threshold for overtime pay two salaried workers who earn less than roughly fifty one thousand dollars an hour the current overtime pay threshold is offers listeners everybody the studio next time wrestling observer live blocked by the Courts California Massachusetts New York Pennsylvania and Washington also are working on similar increases Mary Sherman Reporting About Twenty Three Thousand Dollars San England with Progress Michigan explains that nearly two hundred thousand more michiganders' would qualify for overtime pay tation Antonio aller cone is a plaintiff in the case he points out that for many Dhaka recipients this country has been their home since they were very a two year old son who was born addicted to drugs and has special needs a new survey being sponsored by the West Virginia foster adoptive kinship parents network whatever Julia Hamilton is a foster parent of two in morgantown she says she wishes case workers were able to touch base more often with her especially to help her although peachy any cut power in the area on Wednesday the post ads stretches of the company's high voltage power transmission lines were still operating in the area like so if you don't get drafted your free agent like why would you bother signing anywhere just work both shows with more wrestling observer live you're listening to the heartland newsfeed radio network Arc man editors but when it comes to the rubber hit the road and actually getting it done despite those promises Congress hasn't acted on this critical funds Congress permanently reauthorize there is the greatest Jim Cornet Promo like of all time and a really great ric flair match you Musi shell and that's everybody interrupted up thanks Mike always instagram's owned service Jelly Newscast for October the Twenty Fifth Twenty nineteen shift traditional food culture and improve health by giving students nutritious options in the San Antonio idea schools campus they Texas schools are using refrigerated freight containers converted into hydroponic Forbes as an extension of the classroom at idea charter school students learn how I don't use salt or pepper in their cafeteria and they're growing herbs specifically in their farm to make seasoning the University of North Texas because right now it truly feels as like it doesn't matter what we have to say it's not taken into consideration when making decisions for that child depends network is partnering also using the Container Farms as a lab for a wide range of hands on learning opportunities in biology organic chemistry nutrition and culinary arts as well as business I grew leafy Greens and other vegetables and deliver their harvest directly to the school cafeteria Carolina Cats Rubik's with freight farms says schools are using the farms in part tres analyzes weekend that began a two hundred thirty mile home is here march to Washington DC The march is being time to arrive in the nation's capital with the Western values project he says Wyoming's national parks and public lands are stuck in limbo we've seen a lot of promises made by Western Center Dot Org I'm Diane Bernard Reporting Conservation Moves Pressing Congress Oughta make good on promises to fully on the land and Water Conservation Fund Jason O.`Neil as computer science and marketing many schools have developed certificate programs and majors around sustainable food production which gives graduates a leg up on joining the growing region's member FDIC as largest utility told state regulators Thursday than a jumper a one of its transmission towers broke close to where the officials say the fire started Ammann's imagination the theater of the mind this is classic Radio Theatre WanNa get away from it all the President Donald Trump recently released a final rule to extend the overtime pay threshold to about thirty five thousand dollars Wimmer's plan is in line with an Obama administration level that was radio programs of all time radio workshop dedicated is looking for input from foster parents such as Hamilton to get lawmakers to give them more support to just get the voice at the table would be life changing a great team enjoy convenient banking with innovative technology and award winning service start banking on your own terms with the region's life green checking account and enjoy all the personalized service on the day the Supreme Court hears arguments and a lawsuit challenging the trump administration's termination of the deferred action for childhood arrivals program or Daca with Marshall University and the State's Department of Health and human resources to develop the survey foster parents can participate at WBZ foster parents as pianists with the opioid crisis pushing more children into foster care and West Virginia supporting foster parents more crucial is allowing the DACA recipients to renew their status the state of Michigan joining the list of states now making moves to expand overtime pay on act tech field or starting their own farm by the way those container farms are also helping Laura's schools overall carbon footprint harvests happened just steps away for the Dining Hall Book News Service Dot Org regions wants to know what's a financial tip you give your younger self sitting behind home plate is worth all the island regions in Saint Louis and listen to man is about to say yeah let everybody listen the USA radio network presents the greatest nineteen forty seven I I don't believe it's a political party I believe it's an un-american fame and the thing that that I resent the most is that they are able to get into the all which all butts eliminates transportation emissions i Mike Clifford and thanks for wrapping up your week with Public News Service we are member enlisted supported and you'll find us online at get back to your life with CBD medic available online and that CBS these statements have not been evaluated by the FDA this product is not intended to diagnose treat cure or prevent any disease pounds starring Jeff Chandler the poison waterhole from October twenty fourth nine thousand nine hundred fifty two we faked you tuning in on the now here's your host what cards evening friend handle this thirsty go back sixty seven years for an episode the frontier I have mine across the US completed in eighteen sixty one spelling the end where the mental Pony Express Black Thursday stock market crash on the New York Stock Exchange is the come with it Rosaiah all day memes Rahman all we get it something are bigger than banking switch for goods Saint Louis at redes- dot com slash Saint Louis Liberalism's at really are American can go out without this Tina Communists on Disney named employees he believed to be Communist in one thousand nine hundred ninety as unions and take them over and I feel it the that they really ought to be smoked out shown up for what they are so that all the good free causes in this country Shen the number of people that are eligible for overtime pay has actually decreased quite a bit over the last decade so she's basically trying to right the ship in that young is the place that we glob stuff place we have friends that place where we work there are approximately seven hundred thousand people rolled Daca the Supreme Court is expected to this sure happy it's Thursday it is the twenty four th day of October the two hundred ninety seventh day of twenty one thousand nine hundred sixty eight days remaining in the year the first transcontinental is the fun back in March but the trump administration proposed budget has zeroed out the money for the parks and public lands fought finally are Eric Lavas tells US engine one thousand nine hundred twenty nine it was on this date in one thousand nine hundred ninety five the UN charter took effect Walt Disney testified for the House UNAMERICAN activities committee on this date in hey in peace and war McGee the unexpected the unexpected unexpected general eisenhower then still a presidential candidate pledged to resolve the war in Korea by going there where will a new administration begin we'll begin with its president taking a firm simple resolution that resolution will be to Fargo the diversions of the only way good I learn how best to serve the security a very young Queen Elizabeth the second of England she would return to the UN in two thousand ten fifty three years later the US blockade claimed she had only acted in self defense because Kramer used excessive force interesting her she said her treatment by the police was like Nazi Germany Gabor convicted trial for slapping a police officers stormed out of the courtroom in the middle of the district attorney's closing arguments she ran straight to reporters claiming she'd been abused in the process before and in one thousand nine fifty seven Queen Elizabeth the second of England visited the US to make a state speech before the United Nations. This assembly Cuba during the missile crisis began on this date in nineteen sixty two under a POC lemay signed by President Kennedy The Yom Kippur War the American people in the cause of I shall go to Korea the Korean War ended in Nineteen fifty-three it was born of the endeavors conscious men and women from different nations who over the centuries ended on this date in one thousand nine hundred seventy three and in one thousand nine hundred seventy seven one of the failed for three day holidays Veterans Day it was Siping Officer Paul Cramer during July June fourteenth traffic stop she'd been pulled over for expired tags on the Rolls Royce as Kramer check for other violations sentenced to seventy two hours in jail one hundred twenty hours of community service and thirteen thousand dollars in fines and restitution in two thousand and two police arrested spree killer John Allen Muhammad and Leroy Malveaux ending the beltway sniper attacks in the area around Washington DC Concord made its last commercial flight on the truce negotiations with Communist China country that we at the time did not recognize president and Eisenhower pledged US support to South Vietnam on this date in nineteen pursued the aims of the preservation of peace between nations equality of justice the Nascar Hendrick motorsports team crashed in route to the race held at Martinsville speedway our team was really Hawk really out of money and Rick Hendrick stepped up stayed in twenty three a two thousand three bringing to the end of airline supersonic transport at least for the time being and in two thousand four a plane carrying ten members having having an open container of alcohol in the vehicle and an expired license Gabor drove off when the officers chased her down and pulled her over again Gabor slapped him although she observed on the fourth Monday in October for the seventh and last time in nineteen seventy seven it holiday moved back to November eleventh beginning the following year Josh Gaborone Drivers Rusty Wallace Jeff Gordon All ten men on board were killed among the members of the Hendrick family including President of Hendrick motorsports John Hendrick and the loves his family loves his friends and has had extreme success can sit down with you and talk about over Busch series driver and owner Ricky Hendrick and other members of the Hendricks family there were no survivors Hurricane Wilma made landfall in south Florida eighty four four years ago today passing away on this date in history voice actor and singer donmestic Rosa Parks Maureen O'Hara Google Bloody Friday on this date in two thousand eight many of the world's stock exchanges experienced the worst declines in their history with drops around ten percent in most the smallest thing and I think that's kind of person we all want to be and he's certainly been somebody that I've looked up to stayed in two thousand five facebook sold one point six percent state to Microsoft for two hundred forty million dollars in two thousand seven spurning a competing offer from Fool the law and the right of the peoples of the world to live lives in freedom singer Bobby V. Fats Domino and Robert Keel Benson this birthdate of the big bopper J P Richardson pillows pick up a my pillow right now and yourself in a loved one best way to do it and guess what we've talked about the ten year warranty sixty writer editor Dave meltzer sixty today R. and B. Singer Monica thirty nine and Rapper Drake is thirty three though some of the people money-back guarantee but orders placed between October Fifteenth and December twenty fifth had their sixty day money back guarantee extended through March first sees and a driver arrested on suspicion of driving under the influence crashed into the Oklahoma state homecoming parade in Stillwater Oklahoma killing four people and injuring so many Medicare members feel this is not health insurance it's different you don't have to pay for things you don't believe in and like Dennis found out it just works so if you join Meta share family I've been telling you for quite some time how my pillow is giving me the best sleep I've ever had with my my pillow deluxe pillow while now through the radio listeners praying for you so yes it's different and more than four hundred thousand people now know when it comes to healthcare costs difference is beautiful find out more call eight hundred official and there's a lot of things you can say to the my pillow radio listener special but the best deal now is buy one get one free offer on the deluxe mypillow premium the three thirty four Bible that's eight three three thirty four Bible eight three three thirty four Bible thanks for Tuning in on this Thursday edition and David Nelson sound the Bosnian Harriet Kevin Kline turns seventy two today wrestling observer bounder Oh but it happens Dennis writes about his wife she was diagnosed with leukemia in fact she's a two time survivor and in the midst of all that they've ran up over a million wadi twenty go to mypillow dot com click on the radio listener special enter Promo Code USA or call one eight hundred nine five one eight one seven five tall Frontier town the Saga of the Roaring Wis Frontier town the buy one get one free special two my pillow premium pillows for the price of one with that extended warranty do it now it is a horrible scenario Classic Radio Theatre October Twenty Fourth Nineteen fifty two It is frontier town starring Tex Chandler Actually Jeff Chandler better time to order and be on your way to looking and feeling better just visit top loss dot com that's top loss dot com or call eighty three top boss doctors recommend it nutritious recommended and customers love it caliber unhealthy weight loss just listen to what everybody is saying I'm Marie for Pennsylvania from sixty seven years ago October twenty four thousand nine hundred fifty two frontier town at comes up in three minutes on Classic Radio Theater in front of the last half of my championship one thousand nine hundred ninety I really rick has more he always jokes with me he's got a half a championship in me I'd give anything that man he's just wonder dollars in medical bills thankfully there medishare members and Dana says they are so thankful for that how others came together to meet their needs and that's not only do you save a lot of money typical family's saves about five hundred bucks a month but you know where your money's going each month you're helping people in if the time should come they'll be helping and even Amos just because he's cattle well it gives some men ideas that makes plenty of business and trouble for a saddle stop lawyer you must have bats and you're looking at a bunch of cows like that of course change what am I done to offend your distant integrity you celebrate the twenty four th October's birthday if this happens to be your birthday hi we're the four freshmen and we just wanted to say let's say enough about this Lynn I've been on Calla Trans and love it took former block thirty five and three quarter inches and I've lost forty five pounds we need to give it a try it see Calverton is America's number one choice for healthy way off and with their huge by three get three free sale going on right now there's never been thing is genuine Indian rattlesnake oil Jarecki's was riding with me as we cut across some open range trying to get to those really before sundown hey hey look those efforts Cherokee some day with a few more ahead I might even be able to burn up my love books and retired and I use the term the twinge of conscience INFO one hundred zero don't you go biblical on Y'all reprobate and something else less a man has a few head of good beefy can't afford I don't know not only four wait locks but for arthritis pain I just love it I've caught my both my daughter on it now and my son in law for is this can ah we said boy you've been casting sultry longing looks at a bunch of blank face cows one half that emotion spent on the proper female woman would return to you Mike is appointed I can't believe in a country that's great as our six foot four can beat the Palladio pipe with us me I'm Chad Remington the town's only lawyer but like everyone else I've got my own ranch with the typical well-fed slab-sided hurt a cattle for which our values pasta powder river dodge city poker flat these are the towns they fought to live in and live to fight four teeming crucibles of pioneer freedom problem a lotta dumb defenseless cow and but with their stock poisoning north how many ranchers around here could pay their debts you mean say someone deliberately by the great other with distaff side he can go out who John Varley Karn Cherokee the older you get the more UNRA generous you become your total lack of the here's the adventurous story of the early West the tamed and the Untamed Doc L. Paso Calgary Tombstone Town God paying Chad this is the most various bitchy cannery I've ever heard certainly is just a minute I heard you say just the other day bad to happen it's just one of those frontier towns roistering and noisy perched one of the largest and richest valleys below the continental divide and I just lost one hundred seventeen pounds child turns this is Ron from Texas I've lost a fan cal trans firm believer of Callahan eye on it for quite a while the cast long linger and looks at a woman Chad my boy your total lack of sophistication inexperienced hurts me deeply Amana has some money in his jeans doesn't need to be ahead over yes sir had a tin can lion next with lying on its side optics deceive me that's an empty five gallon can what pleasant I got an awful feeling did contain five gallons of enough stuff to poison every Steve Drank out of that water hall I if I ever gets the pussyfooting polecat at that the pieces together another stranger right in town the stranger the stranger who wasn't too strange to the handful of conflicts have been hanging around town hey that's he could go to court get judgment and take them all over lock stock and barrel liquidation of his claims but if you say mixed up in it shocks Chad I think you're it wasn't too long ago that I was writing into those reels from spread Cherokee o'bannon he runs the town livery stable now that we've talked him out of it before the Sun sets today if I sounded like a boastful kid put your money on the nose or the wrong horse and making any bets on this race got a notion it's been fixed and blame we're going to find out if I can and what a hose continued to be poisoned strangers drifted in and out of town even the sheriff couldn't find out a thing that had helped then best I can mm-hmm so what lanny ever since Ripley shut off most of the credit which absorbed most of the cash folks had on hand everyone's been buying pocket store because slasher park has been willing to let his bills run why should parker if you mean to insinuate license Parker's mixed up in this cattle poisoning you and I are coming to fisticuffs why that all gentlemen is so honest makes me blast yes calm down Cherokee calmed down this has nothing to do with Russia but legally if the ranchers can't it's just the way it turned out after Talking Aleisha I'm Sarah Park not only didn't find anything before sundown but I didn't find out anything for the best part of a week Abreu is get so and grabs for his gun that's all they stood a grabs for his gun only you outdrawing really but not over half a dozen ranchers and this whole valley or mortgage to the Bane I don't our Bowl Ripley who owns the bank most of them do pay up year go last spring I'd like to get my hands on did this putting poison the water hole I must admit it comprehensible even to me why would someone want to was hanging out last year issue I'm not sure that's why shipped you up here ahead of me any trouble shocks didn't take good new customer Audi sugar sugar shirt A kilt on call those wheels adult without anything he wants to go on practicing law because I'll get him just the way I'm GONNA get barcus store local empty never been hearing does yeah I only shot in self defense said the truth recreation for herding cattle is something that Cherokee rain up snow there wasn't billy blue blazes happened to you chat how you see what a hold it lead pipes and she didn't taste contain all spiritus for men's that's liquor to you know a lead pipe cinch didn't contain anything that and they got together but that's another bottle the more you said you were over here oh there's been a jasper in town snooping around a lawyer named Chan remained but he ain't out of left he believe me better nuts plus it down to the sheriff it was a foregone conclusion that the sheriff had released crew two seconds earlier that our own just saying how sorry Rios before me and the boys have been here for more than a week I'm telling you that their lives apart hers a stubborn old gold he'll never sail no the nasty temper has me you're going over to that store and talk pago into an argument understand poor park it shit I wanted a pound with your I heard you you even on calling me a liar no chemistry before we found out that he had something to do with this stranger who had arrived in town lefty slava not non-slaughter decided to go down to the saloon Larry was hanging out in size emma no isn't going to bring your husband bag but there's still an account to be squared up and I'm hoping you'll let me square it come on Cherokee escort he was a friend of yours I can't see them exactly sorry you may be sorry next time you or any gun hand try to finish off what you've started asking for an apology and get one two different things maybe I've been lucky generally get what I asked for and maybe that's because you make it your business to ask the wrong people but you away from that door Cherokee died he shooting Mrs Pocket I think you've started legally or otherwise I'm GonNa help see that you enjoy the next fifty years of your life rotten away and Jane uh-huh we'll return Eh rescue frame group work mostly dared rig another glass without buttle I got my work done all right language beats out the other day spend the knicks so scared and on your still I'm getting more was accused uh-huh well let's just suppose Pago won't is widow will last what I said with the bug I thought you'd want to know I'm making my business to find out why I never had the pleasure of meeting dismissed a balk I guess a sheriff on hold Jane face that evidence it what did you do it can't tell you how sorry I am I didn't get here I know you're through I'm sure you'll excuse me so I can start enjoy myself I sure Mr Sloane enjoy everything while you can because if you keep okkas store because once he's out of the way it's still going to take time for I am the owner of all the choices ranches and the Dose Valley I'm getting so I just my tongue I should draw well now are you satisfied can't say that I'm satisfied thirty percent of Americans who are planning home improvements of five thousand dollars or more we'll pay for those renovations with a high interest credit card that may not be a great idea a better idea may be cash out of your home with a quicken loans thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today on our thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point nine nine percents apr four point zero eight percent call us today at eight is is crusty an old goat as you say is it shouldn't be too Hud lefty I'm sorry I just do get you just like you said I paying off a lot of that high interest credit card debt a great way to take cash out is with our thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today are thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point nine nine owns America's largest mortgage lender let's talk credit card debt for a minute if you feel you're carrying too much of it you're not alone the average household in the US carries over eight one thousand dollars in credit card debt ready for some good news with a cash out refinance from quicken loans you can quickly and easily put some of the equity in your home to good use I'm Wyatt Cox and coming up in just four minutes the news of the day from sixty seven years ago thanks for tuning in hi I'm Jay Farner CEO of quicken loans I didn't ask you to come into my store when I come in and I'm not going to have some even crook like Gimme a half pound and claim it's a pound you get out of here dog gone you turn around and sent Apr Four Point Zero Eight percent call us today at eight hundred quicken to learn how taking cash out with a thirty year fixed mortgage might be the right solution for you and for a record and years in a row J. D. Power has ranked quicken loans highest in the nation in customer satisfaction for primary mortgage origination call today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage dot attorney Mia's lefty smarter something I can do for him Randall fighting have someone else on my mind so right ask you apologize for calling me a friend friends and family you've been hearing me talk about the my pillow radio listener special of course it applies to all you folks listening to us on the podcast as well and to find out all the stuff they've got going on go to mypillow dot com and click on the radio listener's special you've heard me tell you aren't we put that on the show for you would you please last year year at DA. After forty two years we've been together Sarah certainly how much I love my pillow every night it puts me to sleep I sleep hard I sleep through most of the night well except when you gotta get up and you know Tom for Jd Power Award Information Visit JDPOWER DOT com subject to change pay one point two five percent feed received that disintegrate offer cost information and conditions equal housing lender licensed in all fifty states number thirty thirty and maybe I didn't come here to ask you anything I came here W. something you don't sit lie show Parka was just shot down in cold he'll even better because right now when you buy now through October through December twenty fifth here's a great deal your Sixty Code USA friends and family. I'm going to tell you I love my my pillow premium pillows and Mike Lindell puts his name on it that you will be free offer on the mypillow premium pillows sixty nine ninety eight for two my pillow premium pillows will guess what they made the inject Chandler as it was originally broadcast Friday October twenty fourth nineteen fifty two in the newspapers of that price sixty seven years ago these were some of the headlines there's no worry they're gonNA love it and if they don't they can turn around and send it back there's all sorts of great specials look at at the my pillow early imposed grunwald known as detriment and once described as a man who would walk into senator's offices with this hat on was cited for contempt by the house last April jio listener special let's go to mypillow DOT COM use my Promo Code USA that unlocks all the great deals for you my pillow dot com click on the Radio Congress if convicted he would be liable to a maximum sentence of twenty two years in prison or at twenty two thousand dollar fine or both our such maximum penalties are old man thing but anyway here's a great deal the buy one get one free offer we've told you about that buy one get one the money back guarantee goes through March first twenty twenty get it for you get it for somebody for Christmas gift and thanks for joining us on this Thursday edition of Classic Radio Theatre here on your favorite stay listening to an episode of Frontier Town starting a two my pillow premium pillows for the price of one sixty nine ninety eight and you get that extended money back guarantee go to mypillow DOT COM USE MY PROMO dateline Washington Henry W grunwald Washington mystery man and wire puller indicted by a federal grand jury yesterday on twenty two counts of contempt eventual nominee loose scathing attack on Eisenhower his gop opponent and the generals vice presidential running mate Senator Richard M Nixon of California Steven walks up. Don't let nobody tell me left east lottery doug brains instead of wasting your time trying to butter me up you better be getting over the you sure special use my Promo Code USA or call one eight hundred nine five one eight one seven five for the buy one get free special to deliver they will deliver by fair means and fowl the general told his audience in a speech prepared for delivery at the Buffalo Memorial Auditorium Dateline Willful and deliberate refusal to tell tax investing committee anything about his relations with high officials of the Internal Revenue Bureau Dateline Cleveland Arta Tennessee advantage of highway one led by a self-styled killer and maniac who laughed weirdly while he loses his victims spread tariffs Cumberland Hills yesterday to the Exciting Second Act of our frontier town adventure in just about one minute October twenty four th one thousand nine hundred fifty two frontier town on Classic Radio Theater chicks and do concentrate on the job of ending the Korean War that job requires a personal trip to Korea ed La Stevenson last night accused General Dwight d Eisenhower of conducting a campaign which accepts colony and the biggest down as instruments Stevenson the Democratic Island arena and scarcely had opened his mouth when there was a shout from the Crown Adeboye Steve Daytime Buffalo General Dwight D Eisenhower accused Truman administration last night of injecting bigotry and class hatred into the presidential campaign instead of his political opponents speak with the power mad voices of the Able Rousers the Democrats say we'll do anything to win the election November fourth coding every boss of the Administration Party will go all out and down the line him up just in case on honey one more giving more money to lose it phero excuse me but the bartender point aalto Slug Com Republican Senators Joseph McCarthy of Wisconsin and William e Jenner of Indiana Stevenson got a terrific ovation when he walked onto the stage at the Cleveland and I pay for high blackout you hit it old goat nobody's putting me out of trouble eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage dot com rates of exchange pay one point two five percent Peter offer causing permission and conditions equal housing lender licensed in all fifty and unless number thirty thirty hi I'm Jay Farner. CEO of quicken police listed fourteen victims of the band's ride robber Saudis in two states the slide roadblocks thrown up two and three deep across every outlet from this rugged all Tennessee area the bandits alluded capture Dateline Baltimore G Edward Grammar New York businessmen convicted yesterday the first degree murder in the now frontier In some of the boys over the hotel told me about the misfortune you head New York President Truman yesterday it should of at least one job when he leaves the White House if he wants a recording competent company wants to make a few records of his piano playing Roger Brown President of Brown Coal Records Inc. mentioned the Truman renditions of the Missouri Waltz the Blackhawks Waltz and beautiful Ohio is likely bestsellers in a letter to the yes I sounded like a boastful kid all over again I mean going in and deliberately Robin lefty slaughter the wrong way I've found did day Cherokee turned away from the window suddenly can't look at double diet dirty gunslinger who terminated leisa parks mortal existence is walking down the street with trial grammar found guilty fatally meeting his wife Dorothy may mother of his three little girls in a murder plot mass there's an auto rent dateline own piano favorites for national distribution no word at the president's going to sign on the dotted line though some of the day's top news stories President Brown said I understand that you may be temporarily unemployed effective January twentieth one thousand nine hundred fifty three I should like to suggest that you consider recording a number of out of its slaughter was as cold and cocky as they come knowing that there was nothing more I could find out until such time was he chose to make his next move so Cherokee Mrs Bargain I mean about your husband mankind stranger to come over and pays sympathies and believe me sympathies reported in the newspapers of October Twenty Fourth Nineteen fifty two on your radio frontier town which continues now classic Radio Theater seems to be that what are we doing loitering about this legal loggia right Cherokee so grab your hat or your gun or both let's be finding out what business slowdown might have with Mrs Parker he and I sat for four more days in my office above Jarecki's livery stable looking out the window and watching the entire street and late the afternoon of the fifth I'm afraid it really takes a man's mine to run a business isn't that the truth and since I came to those real is looking for a business to go in Oh myself and with you now probably wanting to sell oh I wasn't thinking of selling up Mr Slaughter I know this may sound kind of sudden but I'm willing to pay erupted for you can't tell if the animal you've got a house cat or polecat sometimes it both dangerous but you'd trap them different ways and I found out in shorts be slaughter he was walking with him now crew turned off into the saloon hey a lot is doing he's heading straight for Mrs Parker store that's the case and it certainly I would make me jump in today is he I got to thinking about how difficult it might be for a woman like you try and run a store alone are you of air price okay say two thousand dollars two thousand dollars why we've got more than another bill of sale what if I were a man I dig that shotgun off the wall. La Aim to argue with a woman. I'm a fair man and once I make up my mind I don't let anyone change it now that too bad I'm about your age why didn't you hit me I'm not too gentlemanly the hit you beat the brains help Mr slaughter spend some of that gashes got on him right here since he so all fired anxious to buy something I don't want any of his money not any office Cherokee bad mistake you but at that I guess you wouldn't have hit him if he hadn't been twenty years older than you are who says so I say so now you just listened to the longer you better do the listening I've got three thousand in cash so suppose you sit down and start keep his nose out of your business reached the high heaven you rule out melt your money I thought I'd suggest a Mr Spock that she accommodates you accommodating life what do you mean Chad well since you haven't done much cash business era as maybe I can snake oil applied with begging see both of you again I'm sure you will but you're not leaving yet remember I was going to help you spend some slava what are you doing here but again no since you are determined to stay in those three I'm just being neighborly and seeing as you want to spend for the time being you through with me now so addio slaughter and in consideration of your one hundred dollar purchase morning Mr Obama and we'll be glad to open the door for you the blazer much satisfaction to that Cherokee won't hit back while I'm facing and if I had my way I Christian his thick skull with a few bottles of my Indian twenty thousand dollars just on the books sure books with the cattle dying like flies twenty thousand he took to write it without now who said it was his money I'd hate to think where it came from if you could think at all you'd keep your nose out of lose what do you think they could just smell it a hard earned money here with Mrs Pocket Cherokee load some of those picks shovels your knocked over into Mr Slaughters my all you gotta most imaginative ideas before they they murdered someone else like lash what I'd like to do is create a situation which may force Lord into doing something he hadn't planned on slaughtered bankroll just one just one you're never going to live a life of ease like that Chad it see you can carry a little more just theater nothing is more important than protecting your family and property that's why you should make a free call right now to vent the number one smart home services provider in the US and four shovels will be well in round numbers I say fifty dollars Jarecki's since we always aim to help the customer just peel one of those bills off missed vivid will make your home safer and more secure with a state of the art system that's so simple to use Vivian. Smart Homes Specialists Provide Award winning monitoring of your system twenty four seven three all at your fingertips on your mobile device call now and get a free quote professional installation and full smart home service for as little as two dollars per day equipment purchaser services orch hold out your arms you insult human rate's GonNa pay for this Oh no wrong against Lada Yoga pay for this three picks as you go good bye sure not committed guess Ted just can't think even required conditions apply call now a smart home is a safer home so protect your family and your property home or business with a vivid smart home system call eight friends and family I've told you about the great sleep I get with my pillow every night will right now you can get a great deal and extra safety because if you go to sixty five to respond to any emergency even when you can't and with the four point five star rated given smart home mobile APP control your entire house from anywhere locks cameras security system some crime he hadn't figured in advance then catch him red handed I think we can Lisa Parker if you'll give me your permission to call a meeting of all ranchers all your money right here to store the conclusion of Frontier Town October twenty fourth nineteen fifty two three minutes on this Thursday edition of Classic Reedy what every rancher on the valley owes you money he's decided to cripple them force you to sell out to him and then take over what ranchers wanted for the money they owe the store enjoy now you can fly anywhere in the world and pay discount prices on your airline tickets flight today to London Paris Madrid hi this is Kyle Horvath with the White Pine County Tourism and Recreation Board if you want to get away from the big cities and get back to nature this summer give us a call at seven seven five two eight nine three if you enjoy our classic Radio Theatre broadcasts and WanNa start building a collection of your own go to classic radio dot stream that's hundred six one nine seven nine zero two that's eight hundred six one nine seven nine zero to call now eight hundred six one nine seven nine zero two agreed you theater on demand check our web page available now at Classic Radio Dot Stream that's classic radio DOT stream his hired gun folks do his dirty work until we get them slaughter still in the clear I see but isn't it anything can do to stop them thanks for tuning into Classic Radio Theater on your favorite station now a conclusion of frontier towns starring Jeff Chandler from sixty seven years ago October twenty fourth ah what does he want with picks and shovels from what I've heard he's fixing to dig his own gray three picks and with all the money he's got left it's too bad we can't sell them a headstone. It's going to be needing that soon I think you're gonNA be left on the other Saudi of face before I'm through android two one five five one four one eight hundred two one five five one four one that's eight hundred two one five fifty one forty one pillow dot com click on the radio listener special get their buy one get one free offer on the my pillow premium pillow your sixty day money back guarantee goes all the or anywhere else you WanNa go and pay a lot less guaranteed call the international travel department right now at low cost airlines eighty basic radio dot stream there you'll find links to great classic radio collections on CD along with links to greet reading on classic radioplus classes like net or follow us on facebook or instagram give us a call at seven seven five two eight nine three seven two zero or visit us online at Nevada dot net nineteen fifty two quiet has taken over every range in the valley will will will his nothing crooked than a crooked lawyer down here argue and I'm advising you to get together and start a drive with your herds up to the nearest railhead I'm only giving you five days to be back with cash so if you know what's good for you in two zero or visit US online at Illeana Vada dot net there's so much to do and see I can't mention it in thirty seconds but check out our website and you'll see what Nevada's really all about healing tin why did you let it walk out of here to have him arrested because so far it's been too smart involved himself a through March first twenty twenty that's now through December twenty fifth when you go to mypillow dot com click on the radio listener special and use my Promo Code USA. Aw Don't worry about your store you able to get up Cherokee once I get some of these tests and my hair's slaughter that was a mistake those you stop acting as if you're running this whole show Remington let Sarah Parker do our own talking now there's no talking for me to do I've sold the store and all of its assets enough frazier thank you little premature what do you mean making knows what that group is up to seems to me lefty slaughter found out that almost lois waiting praying for some sign of trouble and finally came a single shot and then in the at smart monkey is playing into our hands what good are them ranges without cantillon no good crew he'll go round up the boys I always a crook all I was sure I was I was taking a long while chance and hoping would pay our next morning justice I told him to the ranchers joined living like this goals row real celebration Moore left he thought I was dumb alright those reas ranchers news read out along the trail almost as far as the could reach I guess we waited more than an hour every man Jack shaded from the morning sun scanning the past next instant it sounded like it must've that Dad Gettysburg we waited for a moment to make sure we will right then the sheriff on hosted his gun intend to show right head funny part is what he's doing is playing right into our hands plan into what happens those ranches start driving their cattle to market you and me it'd be on your way by sunrise tomorrow morning look come on get up and start walking a long trip back to those fears and to jail on about room for a bulletin that Calico and it's just the right color to yellow young it'll make a nice yellow shroud for that grave he's digging for himself money now you can raise money all you gotta do is drive your cattle market and sell it off why it's almost two months they'll ship in time instead of Stanton Lisa trick come on let's go cats eh jed here you had US thinking you're a bigger crooked slaughter and all the time you were doing it for our own good yes sir the rest of the boys are laying for them we get the cattle Remington don't get the money and the ranch's he takes over or with nothing on me one big trail I haven't started for San Antonio where we will perch Cherokee share the posse and I we could see the cattles Chad Remington and from now on you'll have to do business with him Rawson grumble if you want but it isn't going to do any good you oh this take a bath and put on some clean clothes it's not prematurely thank you now ted except I don't know how I have a can enough again five bulldogs Horsey yours your APP to break your neck all right let back with interest attention getter on slowed has got a quarter of a mile head start the further away you ride the further you're gonNA pass on the way back to town I'm not wanted the frontier town starring Tex Chandler is Bruce L. Production supervision by Joel Markup Story and direction by Paul Frank Music written and played by money and I want cash on the barrel head on if I don't get it I'm going to court and take judgments against everyone must be turning over his grave honey expect us to raise I suggest someone by me shop something good so I can propose a toast sides my knees stop shaking in talking to that young spread like vets here and he'll getting us well hidden and don't deserve one no little idea radio theater Oh God another postcard in the mail From October Twenty Fourth Nineteen fifty to sixty seven years ago today Jeff Chandler in frontier town on classical zero one I love getting postcards from your folks and deduce a favor thank this radio station support the advertisers and is always teleprinter great radio shows Remington Mrs Puck store law showers there myself with the whole crowd and he told them to get out and drive their cattle to market and be back with the money in five days or else he tim wrestlers pour out of that king must be a million of them two million hey alright you bus human unhooked slowest forty five let's get to riding down through that Roy now that way we can get between them the cattle and right in front of those wrestlers quilts thank Heaven I got time for my Rattlesnake Oi something you've got time to do great card Richard saying a heard you mentioned the postcards and how much you enjoyed it thought you'd enjoy this one also keep the great radio shows despair the flask and spoil it either way is time for libation right now from the way I look after bulldog and slut or off his voice it's time for me the L. Y. Radio HSE thirty three box three three one five ailing Nevada eight nine three hi I'm Jay Farner COPD from Richard up in her binding Illinois sent me a real nice picture postcard and this one Has You know the slaughter might going to have to break your stop running I quit quit aradio thirty three box three three one five five years Nevada eight nine three zero one more time Tate Back Classic Radio Theatre here on your favorite station and be USA radio network we just like a father with an unreasonable kid has spare the Rod Spoil Child that's Chad's Mojo what's your motto Cherokee well guess you might say follow us on facebook twitter and INSTAGRAM's quicken loans thirty percent of Americans who are planning home improvements of five thousand dollars or more we'll pay for those renovations with a high interest credit card that may not be a great idea a better idea the woman from World War Two the very muscular woman saying we can do it when the war production committee yeah this is bill form telling you the frontier town came to you from Hollywood can loans thirty percent of Americans who are planning home improvements of five thousand dollars or more we'll pay for those renovations with a high interest credit card that may not be a great idea a better idea deferred action for childhood arrivals program or Daca the program was instituted in two thousand twelve and allows immigrants who were sixteen or younger when the as high voltage power transmission lines were still operating in the area where the fire broke out that's also according to a statement from the utility undocumented imagine region north of San Francisco Pacific Gas Electric the state's largest utility told state regulators Thursday than a jumper a one of its transmission tower listening to the heartland newsfeed radio network Hartman newsfeed dot com this stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by Northern California on Thursday the Washington Post reports it forced thousands of people to evacuate parts of Suma county that is a rural winery wars broke close to where the officials say the fire started although peachy need cut power in the area on Wednesday the post ads stretches of the company coming we'd like to send a postcard we would love to have it just mail it to care of our flagship radio station here K. E. L. brought to the United States to go to school and to work without fear of deportation Antonio Alarcon is a plaintiff in the case he points out that for many so mine isn't shaken Cherokee and it's strong enough to turn you over it and beat a little genuine Indian tune on your Tommy as you're making the boys chillier kettle surely squeezed clutter into pulling one crime-infested on all right my dear friends talent service daily newscast for October the twenty fifth twenty nine gene I'm Mike Clifford a fast moving wildfire spurred by powerful winds burn through today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage dot com rick subject to change you pay one point five percent vs Kinda call for cost information and conditions equal housing lender MLS number thirty three Eddie would hide said yellow span skunk slaughter share if you keep after the rest I'm a spot as trying to sneak away I'm going to get him I can't come on don't we Ashton DC the march is being time to arrive in the nation's capital on the day the Supreme Court hears arguments and a lawsuit challenging the trump administration's termination of the winded bonds with us again same time next week or another action adventure story with your favorite young Western star two thousand people enrolled in Dhaka the Supreme Court is expected to issue a ruling by June of next year I'm Andrea Sears. Reporting Lower Federal Courts have ruled on similar increases Mary Sherman reporting this is PMS with the opioid crisis pushing more children into foster care the termination of Daca is unlawful and of issued injunctions allowing the DACA recipients to renew their status the state of Michigan joining the list of Fli fifty one thousand dollars an hour the current overtime pay threshold is about twenty three thousand dollars San England with Progress Michigan explains that nearly two hundred thousand maybe to take cash out of your home with a quick loans thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today on our thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point nine percent APR four point zero eight percent call us here's were able to touch base more often with her especially to help her two year old son who was born addicted to drugs and has special needs a new survey being sponsor maybe to take cash out of your home with a quicken loans thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today are thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point nine percents APR Four Point Zero Eight Percent Loyd that over the last decade so basically trying to right the ship in that way President Donald Trump recently released a final rule to extend the overtime pay threshold to about thirty five thousand dollars Whitmore's plan is in line with an Obama Administration level that was blocked by the Courts California Massachusetts New York Pennsylvania and Washington also or working by the West Virginia foster adoptive kinship parents network is looking for input from foster parents such as Hamilton to get lawmakers to give them more support in West Virginia supporting foster parents is more crucial than ever Julia Hamilton is a foster parent of two in morgantown she says she wishes casework Extension of the classroom at idea charter schools students learn how to grew leafy Greens and other vegetables and deliver their harvest directly to the school cafeteria caroline cats states don't making moves to expand overtime pay on Thursday governor Gretchen Whitmer announced a proposal to increase the threshold for overtime pay two salaried workers who earn less than in limbo we've seen a lot of promises made by Western senators but when it comes to the rubber hit the road and actually getting done despite those promises congress she ganders would qualify for overtime pay according to wavered administration the number of people that are eligible for overtime pay has actually decreased in public lands fought finally are Eric Lavas tells us Texas schools using refrigerated freight containers converted into hydroponic Forbes as today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage dot com rick subject to change you pay one point two five percent thieves disintegrate call for cost information and conditions equal housing lender MLS number thirty thirty hi I'm Jay Farner. CEO grinch who have arrived in the US as children will be joined by community leaders allies weekend data say begin a two hundred thirty mile home is here March two one gracious when making decisions for that child the parents network is partnering with Marshall University and the State's Department of Health and human resources to develop the survey hasn't acted on this critical fund congress permanently reauthorized the fun back in March but the trump administration proposed budget has zeroed out the money for the part services to fully fund the land and Water Conservation Fund Jason O.`Neil is with the Western values project he says Wyoming's national parks and Public Lands Are Star was perfect slaying of his wife term Mosier who must sentenced grammar even hang or to life imprisonment delay pronounce the penalty department the depends to file a motion for just give us a voice at the table would be life changing because right now it truly feels no stays like it doesn't matter what we have to say is not taken into consent recipients this country has been their home since they were very young players that we grew up style place that we have transit place where we work there are approximately seventy foster parents can participate at WB foster parents dot Org I'm Diane Bernard Reporting Conservation Groups Pressing Congress to make good on the Dan now where I can get my arm around the over your knee not only would you break my spirit but you'd bust a flask full of the finest Cherokee Indian rattlesnake win a man's quest I'm going Santon Tonio idea schools campus they don't use salt or pepper in their cafeteria and they're growing herbs specifically Rubik's with freight farms says schools are using the farms in part to shift traditional food culture and improve health by giving students nutritious options in the ladies and Gentlemen Hollywood is the Glamour Capital Miss well close the window Rochester. We can't watch Ronald Colman's party all night the hills mansion everyone organic chemistry nutrition and Culinary Arts as well as business computer science and marketing many schools have developed certificate programs and majors around sustainable this is classic Radio Theater the Great Gildersleeve Bob Hope Show transcribe direct from Hollywood overall carbon footprint harvests happened just steps away from the dining hall which all butts eliminates transportation emissions i Mike Clifford and thanks for wrapping up your week with public news the big show off close the window helped me off this box movements of five thousand dollars or more will pay for those renovations with a high interest credit card that may not be a great idea a better idea maybe to take cash out of your home with a quicken loans thirty the production which gives graduates a leg up on joining the growing act tech field or starting their own farm by the way those container farms are also hoping Laura's schools in the USA Radio Network presents the your fixed rate mortgage the rate today in our thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point nine nine percents APR Four Point Zero Eight percent call today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage Dot Roslyn yours truly non well and molly that one of these greatest radio programs of all time Talk Benny Program look odd I take your money or your life I've taking it all well Jello again in episode of the Jack Many Program or Jack goes to a drive in movie from October Twenty Four Nineteen fifty four sure seems to be having a good time but certainly they're having a good time when you give your guest good food a big orchestra and the champagne flows like water how can the world absent Saturday night is the time your favorite stars get together for those gay parties you read about let's go back to last night and see what's going on Jack Benny's hello from Hollywood jarred burns and Gracie Allen show now here's your host why it Cox Service we are member endless or supported and you'll find us online at public news service DOT ORG hi I'm Jay Farner Co quicken loans thirty percent of Americans who are planning home Loyd never mind just helped me down you know Rochester I just can't watch out for the binoculars they're pretty long I'll say that long three times Butler announced Mr Herald Tom Subject to change you pay one point two five percents call for cost information and conditions equal housing lender license and all that and unless number thirty thirty yes you lucky deal him up again Jack Belly with Mary Livingston Rochester Stay Bob got a pretty good hand this time you'll need it why I got Jim again that's the most unusual hello hello who's this doesn't happen received an invitation to a single one of them what do you suppose it could be maybe lost your address your play Rochester Yeah Yeah Yeah well come on let's finish our game Gin rummy okay it was your turn to throw a card yeah let's see now I you of all night it's only someone I played cards with I wonder remm leave home he cheats the Benny was his sure. What Mr Coleman Butler shower yes yes yes yes yes yes yes a five speed what's so funny it's your health when you've got them written down understand it what boss well the Coleman I our next door neighbors and when Ronnie I moved in I used to go to all his party's but the last few years he's had a dozen big affairs the ten clubs and the three of spades the six of hearts the jacket diamonds the Ada hearts did I read Mr Coleman thought you might like to slip into your Tuxedo and come over what I certainly I would share it bring on that box again such a Democrat how's liquidation some Oh henry bars of good she'll put them in the machine John over sure you're going to be home I'd hate to make the trip or nothing look I'll be home all night come on okay don't go away by Rochester I didn't get an invitation to Coleman's party they must've sent me an invitation and got lost in the mail excuse me a minute tonight off you better get started okay I'm going upstairs and put a tie on everybody wants time off he would like to do with myself no no I can do it you run along okay good night so long Rochester Benny fairness how'd you get here so fast I was next door at the Coleman's party what they look you play your way and I'll play mine I hate to break up my hand but this is the only safe card I can give you here you are the king of speed them well Brad some cold cuts in the refrigerator dennis has such a sweet to have we plenty candy Oh yeah we've got Carlos touchy where's that bottle of aspirin I hear it is I'm glad I bought the large economy size I can hit them over are you why not that's what I had my bandaged what's the difference you didn't get home until three in the morning don't be such a big shot boy it's sure some party you don't know what you're missing you really having fun I'll say Joe Dimaggio was dancing with Marilyn Monroe and I cut in Gee it's nice the dentist want to spend the evening with me we'll sit around he'll talked me discusses problems drive me nuts era nash cheats to I don't know what now they look show I'm not waiting on tables for Ronald call wonder everyone else good bye sore head song we'll take a break October Yeah Cohen is attracting battles tweeden broach the subject to this late hour that we're having a party I know I know one hundred and eighty three guests all I say the head with it anyway I'll be alone so it'll be nice who can that be wall unnerved they can keep their party I'm just as happy here at home with you Roger boss I'm going out tonight going out smart home service for as little as two dollars per day equipment purchaser service agreement required conditions apply call now a smart home is a safer home so protect your family and your the big stars that are there one of them was so snooty what do you mean snooty for three times I talked to Harold Lloyd and he didn't even answer me control your entire house from anywhere locks cameras security system all at your fingertips on your mobile device call now and get a free quote professional installation and all now eight hundred two six one nine seven nine zero to friends and family I've been telling you for quite some time how my pillow is giving me the best sleep by member head yeah but you were going to stay with me I'd like to but I'm glad to take tonight all Rochester you're off last week all boys you're not coming Tuesday night began good and remember you sir from the left and removed from the right go boss but if you really mind stand alone Todd Rochester dentist yes call he's coming over to keep me company well that's Nice it sure is I wonder what I can Sir Home Specialists Provide Award winning monitoring of your system twenty four seven three sixty five to respond to any emergency even when you can't and with the four point five star rated vivid smart home mobile liberty home or business with a vivid smart home system call eight hundred six one nine seven nine zero two that's eight hundred six one nine seven nine zero two best way to do it and guess what we've talked about the ten year warranty sixty day money back guarantee but orders placed between October fifteenth and December Twenty Fifth Nobody knows your parent or loved one better than you and nobody knows senior living better than the experts at A. Place for mom they've helped thousands of families find the right place for their mom or right now to the number one smart home services provider in the US vivid will make your home safer and more secure with a state of the art system? That's so simple to use vivid smart you might not line out even look just because you got invited to the Coleman's and I didn't how's Bhai One get one free offer on the deluxe my pillow premium pillows pick up a my pillow right now and yourself a loved one seven fifteen there's a place for answers A. Place for mom call today call A. Place for mom at one eight hundred three seven zero twenty-seven fifteen that's one eight hundred advice to help find the best senior living communities across the country and it's a free service here's the number call A. Place for mom at one eight hundred three seven zero twenty with that extended warranty do it now are you looking for senior care for your mom or dad but don't know where to start hi I'm Joan Lunden with A. Place for mom the person and was always there whenever I had a question the senior living advisers at a place for mom partner with thousands of families every month listening and offering local knowledge where they're sixty day money back guarantee extended through March first twenty twenty go to mypillow Dot com click on the radio listener special enter Promo Code we seven zero twenty-seven fifteen thanks for tuning into Classic Radio Theatre here on your favorite station October twenty fourth nineteen fifty four Jackson. When did you get the passes I don't have any why in the world would it's GonNa be a boring evening maybe ought to wake up my how'd you make out not so good job too tall for me all hey you wanna see well don't you even want to hear my song for the Marsh Oh no I don't but it'll cheer you up all right all right go ahead and cheer me I've changed my mind thing that song the Dennis look any so peculiar all of a sudden he left through a window look we were having fun why don't you go back to your party aw the Dan is now that you've let me hear your song go back to the Coleman's party before you drive me crazy and you can tell them for me oh well all right let's go maybe Dennis will go with us I noticed where's he he's standing under your stomach I would've got here sooner but I walked I looked no mood for any show not so loud if they find them with you they might let let me back in USA or call one eight hundred nine five one eight one seven five for the buy one get one free special two my pillow premium pillows for the price of one mighty told you she really council I just thought I'd drop by if you'd like to take in a movie with me the movie Gee I'm glad you thought of it that's a wonderful idea didn't have anything to do tonight I've been to a movie and months what are you doing I'm GonNa call a post office I'm going to give them a piece of my mind wire binding lost deliver the gas bill this month either the whole night he wants for that well with my my pillow deluxe pillow while now through the radio listener special and there's a lot of things you can say to the mypillow radio listener special but the best deals let's see Sir Cedric Hardwick Mary I guess who is this Hamas to Benny is Dennis O. Dennis what do you want kid and nothing you're going to be home tonight yes why well I thought I might come over and visit you oh wonderful Dennis recognition show but that's a New York bless you dad I was so glad that I caught a place from my adviser really listened and was truly my partner in finding senior care for my dad she went out of her way to get to know him uh simultaneously I suffer from a STREPTOCOCCI and they've also got a surprise second feature I hear they've had some great ones lately I like that too feature that sounds pretty good I've never been to a drive in let's go your kids you're certainly nice to your brother law pleasure out to get him out of the House also could you get him kits see that come in Jack why Don Z. Come on in what doing here where all dragging the little woman CBS next door to me well it's nice either call Mr Kids how are you currently I'm out of being out of danger what was wrong I'll see what I can do Mr gets good bye bye Mr well come on let's go to the movie okay come on I gotta go now goodbye Mr Loyd Dana's getaway from those binoculars well hold on a second hello no Mr being ever since you left the street I've been biting my name I look I don't want any cracks about my car resented call I thought it was a flying saucer that made a badland never mind in your it low-tech Jack stopped the lights change okay hope we get in at the start of the twenty four thousand nine hundred fifty four the Jack Benny Program on Classic Radio Theatre nothing is more important than protecting your family and property that's why you should make a free call right yeah congratulations you made it come on Fellas my cars in the driveway I'm sorry to hear that Blue Cross you saw I can imagine being you're following the wrong car that other one turn laugh he did not I'm doing the driving I believe I can can you also get him he gets Danny Thomas Boyne Jin Ellen Groucho Marx and he missing bit Mitzi who will be ah the reason I called is my father in Law Brittany as visiting me and I wondered if you could get tickets through your television show next Sunday for your brother in law yes yeah the data you want to go to the movie with us sure what's playing well I was going to the palisades drive in they're showing that you English film their murder and piccadilly all let's go there mm-hmm back from the grandeur AH please don't laugh on I'm too young to die Oh come on Jack drive inside okay sure as crowded here in this drive in theater now let's all settle back and watch the movie she I don't like the angle from here what's wrong with it the actor on the screen has appointed head uh-huh I don't see any empty spaces well why don't you follow that car in front of you you seem to know where he's going okay the pay I think we're getting there the drive in theater is a cowboy pick at the Strand Danny Hugo where we go there only yeah I my rheumatism started acting up then I contacted SCIATICA condition which had any boy sit pick on my Barracuda being I think I see a space in the next role better hurry before somebody else gets it okay a tight squeeze watch your side down here I go accu draw now let me pay for the no no I'm GonNa pay for please let them pay biting my nails Oh hey armistice looking in the mirror I think we're a little too far to the side maybe we could get something more to the center look at enough trouble could arrive in Iraq and a laugh laugh now Herman don't make a scene but you're talking to Queen Mary audie plead talking about we paid you one we'll go get so happy it was fast those money I don't care whose money was picture fellas theaters right in the next block yeah there's a sign turn here Jack after go up the winding driveway to the box office and never been in a drive who Jackie went all the way out on around the theaters nobody listens to me well hang on I'm going back in not so fast they would be how much for the ticket two dollars and forty cents that's ADP here's the money Jack I'll keep it down I'm paying for this I WANNA pay my share silly to split it up I'll paper everyone is credit card that may not be a great idea a better idea maybe to take cash out of your home with a quicken loans thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today on our thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point so you WanNa be friends certainly okay stick your hand out the window all right there you see poge in a bottle was classic Radio Theatre Hi I'm Jay Farner? CEO of quicken loans thirty percent of Americans who are planning home improvements of five thousand dollars or more we'll pay for those renovations with a high interest nine percents APR Four Point Zero Eight percent call us today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage DOT COM reeks of exchange one point two five percent received a call for cost information and conditions. Chris Credit Card that may not be a great idea a better idea maybe to take cash out of your home with quicken loans thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today on our thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three housing lender licensed in all fifty states and unless number three thirty hi I'm Jay Farner. CEO of quicken loans thirty percent of Americans who are planning home improvements of five thousand dollars or more we'll pay for those renovations with a high in instead of being tastic why don't you tell a follower we can bark and see the show section eight goal there in Philly Com and suzy thicky having a light sleeper Anna thing wake up they'll disturbed Katie Alice Melvin Julius and the twins I'm and click on the radio listener special you've heard me tell you how much I love my pillow every night it puts me to sleep I sleep hard I sleep premium pillows will guess what they've made the deal even better because right now when you buy now through October through the five dollar bill all right back to sixty through most of the night well except when you gotta get up and you know go settled man thing but anyway here's a great deal the buy one that applies to all you folks listen to on the podcast as well and to find out all the stuff they've got going on go to mypillow dot com over the mill catch a made it too hot holding holding you told me to be quite hot you there's your look you walk the baby up all right I'm sorry I didn't intend to win I apologize we're all here to see a movie so let's relax enjoy ourselves hello I'm make up your mind hey your five pounds equal housing lender licensed in all fifty states number thirty thirty friends and family you've been hearing me talk about the my pillow radio listener special of course get one free offer we've told you about that buy one get one free offer on the my pillow premium pillows sixty nine ninety eight for two my pillow get it for somebody for a Christmas gift and there's no worry they're gonNA love it and if they don't they can turn around and send it back there's on their farm to make a seasoning the University of North Texas is also using the container farms as a lab for a wide range of hands on learning opportunities in biology short great specials look at at the my pillow radio listener special go to mypillow DOT COM use my Promo Code USA that unlocks number twenty fifth. Here's a great deal your sixty day money back guarantee goes through March first twenty twenty get it for you point nine nine percents. Apr Four Point Zero Eight percent call us today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage DOT COM point two five percent receives disintegrate call for cost information and conditions dot org you'll burn my what are you GonNa do with the other kids the other herald yet getting close I'm getting close but who is it misses you give them you said I was close when I said Barry Fitzgerald Yeah come on over here to the right come on governor you got who knows talking here October twenty four th one thousand nine hundred fifty four the Jack Benny Program here on take off the ticket in conclusion finding this space I'm not moving so forget I in a pipe for goodness sakes the hall down a Little Fellas on your side John Barnes seven five for the buy one get free special Two my pillow premium pillows for the price of one sixty nine ninety eight and you get that extended money the great deals for you my pillow dot com click on the radio listener special use my Promo Code USA or call one eight hundred nine five one eight one so what if your wife catches US impossible Abigail thinks I'm out of town for the weekend pillows and Michael Dell puts his name on it that you will too yeah you're listening to Classic Radio Theater on your favorite station now the whole families rendezvous what if your husband catches us oh that's impossible he's away for the weekend done turn the speaker up a little yeah that's a couple of the next car picture come closer simply your kisses do something to me and yours thrill me too but Robert Hi worry ah call the Automobile Club chant they blackballed me. I'm so embarrassed the murderer is something I'm hitting it won't Husian of the Jack Benny Program October Twenty Ninth Nineteen Fifty Four Jack Denison Don Wilson her at a drive in movie there was an accident of being next to me why don't you move I should move I should move jack there's no sense saying why don't you take that space over the next role all maybe you're right I should tell Abigail now why get involved look look there about startling surprise feature Olgun the second feature heck turn out the pitch killer hey this is exciting yeah I begins kissing him again what's the picture and you'll be astonished did you hear that destroyed comes in everybody anyone's go quick model hold the baby I'm afraid I'll throw or Adam come people just won't let you have a good time cutter going here Jack next to this convertible Oh yeah they're they're now maybe we can enjoy the I I only live when we're together Oh hold me close our love you abigail but these secret eager Don and now ladies and gentlemen the Palestinians driving takes pleasure in presenting a nullah Saturday night series of surprise features Oh oh don now speak Tom if I thought whatever the venue rule is picture what who boy I hope this is a good one brothers presents the horn blows ah I'll just hanging over the window ledge here the gale Abigail night darling these moments with you or like agreement yes the Midnight Baby Daddy Scotch and I go to sleep now we come to a drive in I wanna hear the picture done roll down your window and get the speaker okay third real the projection is committed suicide benign Rochester. I'm going to bed Marley didn't they have a second feature at the drive in yes but most of the people left well that doesn't make any difference opposed to show it anyway I know but in the middle of the hill experience the balance of Nature Difference for yourself received twenty five percent off your first preferred purchase of balance of nature plus get a set of convenience and travel bottles containing a free additional week supply of balance of nature's fruits and veggies with these discounts you will still receive free shipping on every order call eight Bernard turn you stop blowing your horn blowing it must be a short in the wire we I can't hear changing the world one life at a time can I say something about the product yes of course it's changed my life eighty six hundred two four six eight seven five one or go to balance of nature dot com and use Discount Code USA and that is me Rochester Wash your the twenty four to nineteen fifty four the Jack Benny Program here on Classic Radio Theatre balance of nature passionate supporting our Constitution and recognizing that we are blessed to be living in America the greatest country in the world our bill of rights protects US extend my husband has Alzheimer's taking care of him with just killing and then I heard on the radio all about balance of nature and outward in does it mean to be an American just what are our American values working hard to succeed loving God country and family being honest strong and energy -creased my brain. It's just thank you things thank you changed my life and give me hope and I appreciate it they watch it all by myself athlete ratio of independence then read it again and this time share it with your friends are great constitution as the basis of all of our freedoms are inalienable rights bureaucrat telling us what to do most countries don't have these rights WANNA know more it's all there in the book get your free book the US Constitution and the Our freedoms of worship speech privacy a right to own firearms are right to trial by jury are right to be free to live our own lives with outs The hand and you care about your credit call consolidated credit now if the interest rates on your credit cards are so high it will take years to get out of debt call consolidated credit now get your own copy at Free Book Dot Com brought to you by the American Media Council if your credit card bills have gotten out ask the program works call consolidated credit now call eight hundred four zero six zero four six eight hundred four zero six zero four six that's eight hundred here's an episode of Captain Midnight from October Twenty Fourth Nineteen thirty nine now they've helped over six million people with credit card debt without destroying your credit they can consolidate your debts into one lower payment reduce your interest rates and get you out of debt fast after midnight brought to you every day Monday through Friday at the same time by the skeleton that you'll hear about later on this program and what's more none of this will cost you a single penny you don't even need any pops tops or or even a penny for us Dan if you've already called at Your skelly service station joined the blight patrol if you already have your official junior pilots application card then listen closely your very own if you haven't already driven over to your Skelly Service Station with mother or Dad joined the new one thousand nine forty patrol why not do it tonight your skelly man will be individuals payment of debt to finance charges collections activities including legal action now on Classic Radio Theater Four Oh six oh four six eight credit counselling services INC fifty seven hundred one West Sunrise Boulevard Fort Lauderdale Florida three three one three licensed by the New York Department of Financial Services his official badge and your pleasure when you're sure you're among friends then does a spinning pre blade propeller on to spend to decide hundreds of different things burnished bronze medal of membership with three blades spinning propellor on the mysterious secret password is now in the mail if you join the patrol when I I told pilots dolinger who has never uttered a word since he was pulled from the wreck of his plane almost thinking and Ma are guarding the wounded planet zoolander on Tassie Donovan Drake Liew in order to dry out into the hands of expressman waiting outside also in the cabin is another of Ivan Chart Tension and he'll put your name on the list all gifts and presents that are coming later and remember it's all absolutely free those e or skelly man and join up tonight about it several days ago you'll find your metal of membership waiting for you at your service station within the next few days maybe tomorrow or the day after and say we're up the nineteen forty play it entitled you to take part in the thrilling adventure that's coming soon and at entitled you to an unbelievable number of three prizes the winner or the loser in one hundred different games why the Jess no end of fun you can have with and remember this propeller metal is your proof that you're full pledged went into the tail section of the ship this way chuck and Captain Midnight Foil Chart and they sneak up to the front and overpowered shock and his daughter fury and after all at your word they would drop down from the Middle Grizzly how high was he over fifteen thousand seat just before I haven't shock sprung the trap chat found a secret panel which is by the Vermont Department of Financial Regulation Maryland D and fourteen eighty to Oregon D M eight licensed by Virginia State Commissions DC servicemen adversely awesome rough skelly oil April that's done midnight going since we've all been together on this vacation in Mexico I've gotten a no red awfully will order like a second father yes slim that's about it Adam now for sure I am slim did you ever hear about the law of averages no Oregon off well I mean it's too much to expect the captain midnight as always going to get out of these riders Foshan latest you must be forgetting about when this Ivan Shark had him in the rear compartment that they're flying machine he is I'll never forget it was the narrowest escape I ever lookie here you ain't got no reason to think anything happened to him it's almost doc slim and it was early afternoon when they left and you know perfectly well they didn't have enough to stay all this appear to give you your official junior pilots application card right away and he'll send Reich endoscopy headquarters for your very own spinning propellor medal of membership then what happened that's all that we're compartment if I have a shock airplane had a trap door in the floor the whole floor was nothing but a door which was hinged at the side to captain midnight in the last adventure you'll remember that I even shark ordered his chief to drop bombs near the lonely cabin sheltering commend the opposite Corner Slim Patchy are talking in low tones listen Patchy F- where do you think all I can say is can't midnight ADA UC or vary all metal I've members yeah it's a knockout if there ever was one it's a secret metal you know your carry it concealed on your person like a secret serviceman Jerry time shore Passy but they don't they don't land its own worries that's just what I'm afraid of they had to land somewhere that they don't get here pretty soon these spells around us scare Ma what I'm sure that pilots warning us to get out of this cabin before it's too late Bradley you're right patsy even if there are oxide we'll have to take our chances you better go outside and if he starts diving again we'll take a shot and while you're doing that those fellas on the ground outside this cabin might get you just the same it looks like the only thing they do things your they think captain midnight is here too and they're getting desperate I guess you might be right I think I hear that filler again yes he's either off to one side or up pretty high maybe art shooting again all they want neither those and let me give them you notice they fired a shot for the last hour that's true what will happen after he gets mark they could get up real close and we wouldn't see them start worrying about that when the time comes ticket set fire to the outside of the cabin just as they did two major steel and Bud Conley no here life's come on now keep your sure do like at midnight a heat don't you stay I do you know slim well my dad died alone because I can see exactly what happened these men surrounding haven't been able to get us all so I wouldn't shock has sent one of his pilots scares out of here comes back again to hear that baller might be back why don't you go back there and see how thinking that pilot or getting along here maybe the excitement of starting that'd be right back listen slim I didn't awarding you'll see like but it didn't go off it must be awarding a real one would have exploded I think we'd better be actually we'd want to let him do nothing like not wild pinky and me in the steel if the gun show listen it's a plane I'm sure Lori other companies Kelly Jumpers and data what I am exciting method for every one of the problems of new junior pilots and captain midnight new Nineteen Forty Plate Patrol Harda you've had been pinky in the yard loses your would have been cool I still can't figure out how they got out of that Barrique spot gosh didn't you ever hear about that you're not the only one who scared pink is to one what him scared why he hasn't even week denying you mean that pilot scared you're talking about anybody else Donovan Push on come on you were saying now anyway he's not trying for US saving the cabin if you know how to tell the whole abby now march doors open fellow is coming back with a sites preserves I guess we can slow down a little now are you sure absolutely on spanking and turning before coming back far enough in the cabin show why did you scared half to death how can you look into the designed I've looked into people's I was scared to death and Yonhap follow me I guess he must know who's up there it yeah there now you're captain midnight it must be out that she makes you can see the plane okay Ms Donovan House at pilot we bought out of the race did he not kidding Buddy Shaw knows what's going on either playing possum Bourne showroom midnight would aw Donovan Betsy and the others reach safety and Nick of time luckily discovered a cave which afforded them good shelter coach he's starting straight for the cabin fever in Color Mike Gun in the streaming can cover the rear let's go back any old Jay Patio door now there you we mean business I thought he would be backed by this time knew you'd be here pretty quick I worry about Him we wish you're lucky to find this cave that's been playing okay I got back here is a cool I've got a feeling slim I'm sure something must have happened to them over come on now don't be seeing that heavy midnight and chuck being and now you can tap now I'll open the door we're going to use this pilot as a shield painting a good idea passing I'll keep it all right even if he does hit it she said line thinking don't you worry slim got this under control on the head and over this way because I think we she would've Pale here so we'll use this shield and walk him out in front of us as we leave his cabinet swell idea slim plenty we didn't think of it before we didn't need to think of it gives me a great idea what do you mean he's going to save us even if he came talk he won't WanNa save us but he's still our prisoner and it's the saints he's connected with these other owners they wouldn't we are midnight on aid sir the client wants more right this is the last time with there's no answer this time it can't be chuck here goes no wonder the mournful screech of the all had a familiar song to chunk but under the train the moment will he remember usually bence human lives depend upon what happens in the next few minutes Jack up all right we now find them there are some time later wind is whistling through the trees actually said Mouse reporter twelve you've failed to tune in tomorrow to captain midnight I don't remember if you haven't already joined captain midnights new nineteen forty at least follow this diving around up there started dropping hints to get out of here come on let's get it going I had brought this up to speak with dessert do anything to us or are they might hurt one of their own men I'm sure glad we captured him he makes us well prize I wish I was back in black early man that you want to join the new nineteen forty patrol and get that marvelous bending propeller medal of membership you'll give you your official junior pilots application guard right away The heard by friends or enemies shorter listen the model until then this Don Gordon your skelly man saying goodbye and it out there you have in October twenty fourth nineteen thirty nine captain midnight stream are programs on demand learn more about collecting classic radio programs of your own and contact me their classic Radio Dot Stream you can he pulls Eleni WanNa sharks playing once before preschool when we did that chuck is probably forgotten you're speaking out found out thanks thirty or somebody Patchy in short a join this very night remember this is a different kind of secret clouds than any you've ever belong to there's real adventure ahead for every member wonderful so find our programs anywhere they serve a podcast I heart radio The apple podcast Google podcasts spotify spreaker beneath skelly jobbers on dealer and Patchy and her party still escaped from the clutches of I even sharks men will patsy signal resembling the hoot of an hour. Hi I'm Jay Farner. CEO of quicken loans America's largest mortgage lender let's talk credit card debt for a minute if you feel you're carrying radio station support the advertisers and is always tell a friend the great radio shows were back Classic Radio Theatre here on your favorite station and the USA Radio Network all the time doesn't go to sleep while she's watching him she's gone right in her lap I think he was wrong about two fellas right here on Classic Radio Theater Please visit the web page over Classic Radio Dot Stream that's classic radio dot stream over there you can and get some protection among them rooks did you see anybody around one anybody's watching this they're keeping head they don't I guess your Pinky you bet on him there's two of them and they're under a big three down the hill ways who again all right and Sand Reich Andrew Skelly headquarters or your spinning propellor mental so you'll have it within a few days remember it's all absolutely free so don't delay join up George Kelly Service Station Tonight and Oh forget June and again tomorrow same time same station for a Predator transcribed adventures captain midnight brought to you by the skelly oil near the cabin you must have been wrong it wasn't captain midnight and Chuck was we sure didn't get no answer when you had like an eye on her way back and by partners got a finger on the trigger ever say you're going to lead us out here and if someone just make one false move you'll be diff- duct quicker and you've got to say Jack Rabbit and quickly and easily put some of the equity in your home to good use by paying off a lot of that high interest credit card debt a great way to take cash out is with our thirty year fixed wrapped presents to and the most surprising part of it all is that it doesn't cost you a single pen just stop at your skelly service station next time you're in your car thirty year fixed mortgage might be the right solution for you and for a record nine years in a row J. D. Power has ranked quicken loans highest in the nation in customer satisfaction for primary Miss Supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook twitter and instagram's a fast moving wildfire spurred by powerful winds burned through northern California on Thursday the Washington Post reports it forced thousands of people to evacuate in the area on Wednesday the post ads stretches of the company's high voltage power transmission lines were still operating in the area where the fire broke out that's a high interest credit card that may not be a great idea a better idea maybe to take cash out of your home with a quicken loans thirty year fixed rate mortgage the rate today on our thirty year fixed rate mortgage in a lawsuit challenging the trump administration's termination of the deferred action for childhood arrivals program or Daca the program was instituted in in in all yet to do a search for USA Classic Radio Theater. I'm Wyatt Cocks thank you so much for tuning in to favor and thank this back guarantee go to mypillow DOT COM use my Promo Code USA friends and family. I'm going to tell you I love my my pillow premium the housing lender licensed in all fifty states. MLS number thirty hi I'm Jay Farner. CEO of quicken loans thirty percent of Americans who are planning home improvements of five thousand dollars or more will pay for those renovations with intonations equal housing lender licensed in all fifty states number thirty three you're listening to the heartland newsfeed Radio Hartman newsfeed dot com this street much of it you're not alone the average household in the US carries over eight thousand dollars in credit card debt ready for some good news with a cash out refinance from quicken loans we begin a two hundred thirty mile home as here march to Washington DC The march is being timed to arrive in the nation's capital on the day the Supreme Court hears arguments you leaders Thursday that a jumper one of its transmission towers broke close to where the officials say the fire started although peachy Ni cut power origination call us today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage dot com for Jd Power Award Information Visit JD POWER DOT com rates subject to change one point two five percent feed receives disintegrate offer causing formation in condition eight mortgage the rate today on our thirty year fixed rate mortgage is three point nine nine percents apr four Point Zero Eight percent call us today at eight hundred quicken to learn how taking cash out with the and the public service Taylor newscast brought over the Twenty Fifth Twenty nineteen I'm Mike Clifford parts of cinema county that is rural wine region north of San Francisco Pacific Gas Electric the state's largest utility told state run is three point nine nine percents. Apr Four Point Zero Eight percent call us today at eight hundred quicken or go to rocketmortgage DOT COM to pay one point two five percent feed receivers disintegrate call for cost information also according to a statement from the utility undocumented immigrants who have arrived in the US as children will be joined by community leaders and allies this weekend that Donovan you following me and patchy stream of bringing up the rear I'm rich it's coming back again slim we just gotTa get out of here and run morning Magi picky Palo Hurry pitchy speaking of that pilot David Two thousand twelve and allows immigrants who were sixteen or younger when they were brought to the United States to go to school and to work without fear of Deportation Antonia Clone as a plaintiff in the case he points out that for many Dhaka recipients this country has been their home since they were very young plays that we grew up he says Wyoming's national parks public lands are stuck in limbo we've seen a lot of promises made by Western senators but when it comes to the rubber hits who've health by giving students nutritious options in the San Antonio idea schools campus they don't use salt or pepper for a wide range of hands on learning opportunities in biology organic chemistry nutrition and Culinary Arts as well as business computer science and marketing freight containers converted into hydroponic Forbes as an extension of the classroom at idea charter school students learn how to grow leafy Greens and other vegetables drugs and has special needs a new survey being sponsored by the West Virginia foster adoptive kinship parents network is looking for input from foster to increase the threshold for overtime pay salaried workers who earn less than roughly fifty one thousand dollars an hour the current overtime pay threshold is about twenty three thousand dollars I'm Andrea Sears. Reporting Lower Federal Courts have ruled the termination of Daca is a lawful and have issued injunctions allowing the daca recipients to with the OPIOID crisis pushing more children into foster care and West Virginia supporting foster parents is more crucial than ever Julia Hamilton is department of Health and human resources to develop the survey foster parents can participate at WBZ foster parents dot Org I'm Diane Bernard in Massachusetts New York Pennsylvania and Washington also are working on similar increases Mary Sherman reporting this is pms your parent of two in Morgantown she says she wishes case workers were able to touch base more often with her especially to help her two year old son who was born addicted road and actually getting it done despite those promises Congress hasn't acted on this critical funds Congress permanently reauthorized the fun back in March but the trump renew their status the state of Michigan joining the list of states dow making moves to expand overtime pay on Thursday governor Gretchen Whitmer announced a proposal deliver their harvest directly to the school cafeteria Carolina Cats Rufus with freight farms says schools are using the farms in part to shift traditional food culture and San with progress Michigan explains that nearly two hundred thousand more michiganders' would qualify for overtime pay administration the number of people that aren't in their cafeteria and they're growing herbs specifically in their farm to make a seasoning the University of North Texas is also using the container farms as allowed schools have developed certificate programs and majors around sustainable food production which gives graduates a leg up on joining the growing at tech field or starting their own eligible for overtime pay has actually decreased quite a bit over the last decades especially it's basically trying to right the ship in that way President Donald Trump recently released reporting conservation moves pressing Congress to make good on promises to fully fund the Atlanta Water Conservation Fund Jason O.`Neil is with the Western values project vase like it doesn't matter what we have today is not taken into consideration when making decisions for that child the parents network is partnering with Marshall University and the states I know rule to extend the overtime pay threshold to about thirty five thousand dollars Whitmore's plan is in line with an Obama administration level that was blocked by the courts California emissions i Mike Clifford and thanks wrapping up your week with public news service we are member end listener supported and you'll find us online at public news service DOT ORG texting and arm by the way those container farms are also helping Laura's schools overall carbon footprint harvests happened just steps away from the dining hall which all butts eliminates transportation events such as Hamilton to get lawmakers to give them more support to just give us a voice at the table would be life changing because right now it truly is a years and I gotta tell you taking nugenix makes a huge difference for me Nugenix that's the Testosterone booster with TV ads with Frank Thomas the big hurt right Oh yeah this is a legit the key ingredient is testafin which helps boost free testosterone levels and increase lean muscle mass well it's clearly working for you hair they still giving complimentary bottles for under reoccurring automated text message message and data rates may apply come on one more rep you got this Ted there it is nice work you're a beast thanks man I feel better than I have in text body to four two four two four right now for your complimentary bottle of Nugenix the number one selling free testosterone booster at GNC new genyk samples they try for themselves Yeah Nugenix is a great way to increase lean muscle and feel stronger with more energy and endurance and I need to get a complimentary bottle of Nugenix so problem you just got to send him a text astray she proposed budget has zero out the money for the parks and public lands fought finally are Eric Alana's tells us Texas schools using refrigerated Forty eight forty nine season this episode originally broadcast October Twenty Fourth Nineteen forty eight search your money or your life I've thinking it also McGee and Molly Bob Hope show transcribed direct from Hollywood Hollywood George Burns I thought he was a thief and Soda Aren't Skillet hit him on the head that woke up the neighbor's dog and he started chasing him name Kayla we thought it was somebody chicken among the USA radio network presents the greatest radio programs of all time Benny Brown Look Ring Edna Bridget Air Presents New Lau abner show in that one of these this is plastic radio theater the Great Gildersleeve are not available in stores so texts body to four two four two four right now text b o d y Two four two four two four that's body to four two four two four they drink parents Hartsville has been weather's Gloria Blondel the music of Felix Males and starring your old favorites lum and Abner John's core blocking avenues path to the door. Listen now wait a minute abner where do you think you're going I've got the meal this letter for Ed Stoddard now just looking on the little community of Pine Ridge we find lung and the Gracie Allen Show now here's your host why Cox comedy this hour an episode of the half hour mum inamdar episodes it only ran in the night Karaj was empty yell help somebody stole my car and then is warmer and she here aver ain't no use them spending all that money to send a substitute out to Pine Ridge when we got a man right here that can handle the job full of Buckshot I don't mean the avenue that mail is you ask give him an property tampering with it is a federal offense and on top of that if L. Simpson ever caught you reading her post guards she There L. O. I mean me you yes with my brain's I'll run that post office like it ain't never been done before yeah well you just wait you hear this. He drove home last night in the driveway. Got Out Open the garage door and twenty Yeah I'm the new letterhead how about some Nice fresh stamps today thank you say you got any mail for me I would add started wants you to me a letter for him he's the postmaster well not fair Holly Inc see this letter to the post office department telling him to send out a substitute the division of General Motors bring you up brand new kind of visit with all characters down in Pineridge ask fine you cut out reading in postcards you ain't the postmaster IAM is having trouble with George again so you don't know George but he must not be very smart keeps falling off buildings thank you learn how to set in a wagon and hang on after two I'm going to have to throw you right out of the post office he called George keeps falling off the wagon dampener hope he didn't hurt the years Postcard just happen to have it my hand here well I ain't got the least is I either but you better get in touch with Ruby they handle it registered you wouldn't want to just send that spatial deliver no not then about the post office regulations Oh don't I will just stick around and watch how I handle the next customer I'll show you who knows about postal regulatory long in the rain holding his hand out in front of him like he's carrying I'm reeler he told me later he didn't realize he'd forgotten until the rain stopped and he reached up to close all right good but I wanted registered to all right I don't know whether you've got the car back or not great news it sound like you'll be laid up for a while well that's why I read this letter they get a substitute you better get that in I take his place what's wrong with that you know how absent minded he's been getting here late on on just the other day I seen him Sony what's the matter Mr Postmaster having trouble I want that sent delivered so he's taking the shotgun dead now ed is flat in bed only stomach alive laid back George is going to get it he said that's a Gorgeous Bonnet were on the envelope well that's simply sure here we are again soon ben well late you get it got it over to the county seat I only paid a dollar ninety eight Sanford don't look like it long hop adduced Dan they're talking about hats when murder going on listener you ought to be ashamed yourselfer reading somebody else's male that's the Louis sneak in this one thing I can do law group is going to shoot Joel no she ain't all it said was the next time Ruby George he's GonNa shoot him a game of snooker it after all I want to send it and I've got to register it because I'm enclosing quite a sizable amount of k. one dollar and twenty nine cents yes register register APPs collect but just that's a game I even played only trouble now she's captains Bruegel Mount ID inventor of the flat bottom canoe has done it again oh well everything costs twice what to nowadays random luck to you on your new job here thank you sister Sampson come in again I wonder if you could send a registered letter for me lung you bet your life registered can have the left tension all shores your I know where you're at Ben I'm the postmaster here master massacre U Roby says next time she sees George she is going to shoot abner give me that card law group is gone I don't care what wrestling only got you wanted registered Friday you've got a rubber stamp there that says delivered to address the only on just fat she's GonNa do here comes LS Simpson and worse than that to all my goodness Samson Lahmar you run on the post office it's about this registered letter for wait a minute the captain's moved how do you know we'll just look what's stamped on the envelope return insufficient address you're right so lucky thing I found this out before I sent the letter so long well Mr Postmaster you sure plans were underway to dredge for the canoe dredge I never did find the putty knife don't tell us about it a large crowd was on hand as captains broke launched his flat bottom Kalou with nothing the Mayo cricket or wait a minute wait here who don't give me that letter you're going to mail it on going to tear it up don't do that I'm during the give him in longstaff that says return thinking address added where you get Outta here maybe a better let me get back there and fictious letter all that something wonderful lease as I never lost no money on a transaction Ma why don't you give up this it right here and now you've been postmaster for yeah well I know you gotta get into work at van weather so Hello I'm new postmaster Oh get along just fine Ben Calama- I I've just got the greatest one I ever had in my life beginning tomorrow I'm going to put on the first and biggest post office lists countries it blamed forty five minutes later all the water had been pumped out of captains in October twenty four thousand nine hundred forty eight lung abner on Classic Radio Theater there's no Russian to satisfy everyone it's called Krill Omega fifty plus it combines ultra-pure fish oil and joint soothing Krill oil together in just one 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get your generic sildenafil with a one hundred percent money-back guarantee getting your pills in two money orders for the price on the matter with this outfit anyway just old time I reckon get signs printed check make winter display out a money order blanks by punch boards real or Krill oil it's both and now it's free just pay four ninety five for shipping and claim your free bottle call now one eight hundred three nine nine sixty attack wait I forgot to give you any money what did you buy the punch boards with check check check phrase the hatches in full view of spectators and Chop a hole in the bottom of the canoe oh my say the crowd it takes me all night long to cook them for an sakes Hendrick we never worn them cooked cores nods you can't count cook beans and let's get back to Lebanon October twenty four thousand nine hundred forty eight and see how well alum can run the post office How about send airmail I want it registered lung yeah you bet `bout this I'll never said a word no what what you're thinking then you want this letter registered easy to get that impression I don't think it's me I think it system this place is in a Rut Branston take them three calls for a fraction of the cost of the little blue pill so give your wallet a break in call us toll free at eight hundred three six five six zero one seven to get your generic yeah but I was present when the captain personally tested Briggs quit caught in the waters of Lake Silk Well half a day and you ain't sold on nickel's worth stamps or nothing else I know it and I don't understand it bodied thank I didn't know thing about business yes it is what if you could get the exact same results for just a fraction of the price guaranteed well now you can with Sildenafil the active ingredient in the blue pill with twenty milligram three ninety two one eight hundred three nine nine sixty three ninety two that's one eight hundred three nine nine sixty three ninety two friends and family have been telling you are you find him at the post office on no I will go that's where I'm at now who over pity say the main neither central girl and have her ring afar alarms so as I can make a public announcement about to sail over the party gas the captain calmly laid down the hatchet picked up the council spooks coke smile to the audience and step over the side to repair the damage ain't that the down star dry calling him at the post office I don't WanNa go him act by look Mamie I don't think you understood matters you can reach him at the polls after all right let's just dandy great now you get back there and registered yourself I'm leaving I'll be back later where are you going buying don't leave a message for what he comes look naming I just want you to ring the fire alarms Oh that I whose name call I fed ring the fire alarm vicarious hang fire alive well I am spell get over to the store and get a jar of uncooked ones and hurry up oh what kind do you want the navy beans and they're fine and get jar beans for guessing contest was forced to bring ram over last night but he ain't showed up and boy can't recollect nothing and got a brain the answer was less aw oh hello naming law matters and I want you to rank the same Lum Edwards and that's right avenue another half hour we'd be ready to start the big postal sale check over our list and see what we did so per oh wait a minute did you say you were with the US Postal Department pies certainly did well my spires then you must know hilmer growth master yes you must be knucklehead the operator I beg your pardon yeah well Mr Edwards is out right now but boo helmer was in the post office game for a number of years aw turn what can I do for you sir why inspected Burton or the postal department and I want to see the post kidney beans are nice all right get candidates or don't you wanna be wolf mastermind? Id Ever had until they fired him for being conscientious. I've never heard of a man being fired for that that's what happened to Hilmer his wife even divorced I wish you to clear out of here for go stark raving mad crazy both of you go get the beans but hurry back abner goes I'm GonNa need your help quick as stars all I'll call Ridge post office spare stepped off on it when he comes in tell them some doc plays that we have friends that place where we worked there approximately seven hundred thousand people Roldan Daca the Supreme Court is expected to issue a ruling by June of next year mccollum oh come now helmet gruesome loved the post office work so much that he delivered every letter k. personally when Kenneth Baker News head I guess you'd Better Ground Start Hunting Bernie wait a minute wait a minute today comes right now swan met boys Slowest more or less rose moved to Hatfield Helmer stamp please forward on the letter and personally delivered with account of Hatfield I don't think they discharge him for that then the letter came in the advert Kelp who had also moved hell did the same for him. Where'd Redford moved to somewhere in northern Finland Finland we're grown haughty will gut the beans well? It's about time cedric taking you so long you got the beans yesterday but I had to an account of quick calls Oh yes I'm the putting night rolette was very interested in then we'll see you later this defeat from a Shar but Captain Alpine combined love you were wrong the captain hasn't road so I WANNA spend this registered go ahead once what's his name hello buying I'll tell them to call right away Oughta be back shortly the postmaster here while not really the real one of those home in bed so let's drag appointed himself postmaster there's only gone two days he lost the case well tell me more about this Mr Edris on his return a year later Mrs Burleson based Hirsute on desertion helmer put up the defense that he was so far north the days were six months long the price of one sixty nine ninety eight and you get that extended money back guarantee go to mypillow DOT COM use my Promo Code USA friends and family in another episode of yours truly Johnny Dollar Right here on Classic Radio Theater on your favorite station friends and family you've been hearing me now when you buy now through October through December twenty fifth here's a great deal your sixty day money back guarantee goes to pillow premium pillows sixty nine ninety eight for two my pillow premium pillows will guess what they've made the deal even better because right they've got going on go to mypillow dot com and click on the radio listener's special you've heard me tell you how much I love my pillow I pull dot com use my Promo Code USA that unlocks all the great deals for you mypillow Dot com click on the radio listener special use my promo code something but anyway here's a great deal the buy one get one free offer we've told you about that buy one get one free offer on the my essay or call one eight hundred nine five one eight one seven five for the buy one get free special Two my pillow premium pillows Ah tell you I love my my pillow premium pillows and Mike Lindell puts his name on that you will too arch I twenty twenty get it for you get it for somebody for a Christmas gift and there's no worry there talk about the my pillow radio listener special of course it applies to all EU quotes listening to us on the podcast as well and to find out all the every night it puts me to sleep I sleep hard I sleep through most of the night well except when you gotta get up you know go you know sat old man eleven and if they don't they can turn around and send it back there's all sorts of great specials look at at the my pillow radio listener special this later and have a chat with this Mr Edwards but don't chew telling look he certainly Emma country I'll why indeed aluminum October twenty fourth nineteen forty eight also coming up all righty on classic radio trap up this episode of Bombing Abner October Twenty four thousand nine hundred forty eight and see how well Lum's changes in the post office you're right now he's out making final arrangements for these stamps stamps sale fight I am going to drop in l. all postage stamps drastically reduce to half price oh yeah stand that and right up over the ink well there and that reminds me over I just don't understand why the Ol- postmaster never thought of any of these ideas he never even advertise get ready get ready did you bend up the pinpoint me and cedric play the game dark with them we got them or you couldn't tell them from the pins they got an A.. Biggest post offices the comment Mr Tom Reid in my name's Burton but you're just in time for the Big Sale Mr Burton yeah see that sign over there you may be right I helped three senators to San to center one just how many stamps have you sold at this rate well yeah he ain't a local stranger whoever is I've never seen a post office run like I'm running this customer well good making doing big business and that'll help the sale yup who is at I don't know it looks like some of them out of town stranger granny's abner they own let them come in get will wait a minute law mayor is one more sign wink put up in which this and that says fall clearance words just hundreds that's interesting tell me more about this sale sounds even better than I imagined oh you hear about have you are and you might say I'm Revoluton the whole postal system he's almost revolt and postmaster this town good I want that information to wow thank you now let's see now your Mr Edwards aren't you Mr Ed they want to know is which one of you is responsible for all this whale I don't like to Brag on myself but I'm your man can you ain't nothing yes that joyal beans there guess how many beans they are in it Mr Burden three thousand four hundred seventy nine well I don't know what you're kicking about he dropped the charges again you only done was just forbid due to ever set jer in here they'll have me working for him for the Renta my life Mr Ju took the words right out of my mouth like watched I'm GonNa make monkeys out of old fogies Oh yeah would you like to take a chance on the punch forward foot inside that post office again as long as you live and pounded his fist at the leader I don't care so much about that it's just downright humidity I double the interest you can't possibly mean that Oh you don't know me Mr Burton when they give him and finds out what I'm doing doc Read Mr Edwards have you informed Washington of any of those little changes your making well not quite yet I'm going to surprise it on them all engine Al Katrina this is from sued he's the one at Alcatraz Ena toll satisfied until twenty four nine nine dollars West Gate resorts has been a leader in affordable vacation plan since one thousand nine hundred eighty two and now you can choose from over ten beautiful resort destinations across the United States the have him hold that election to find the most reliable man in Pine Ridge to take my place but I can tell you right now I don't care who elect he don't l. mad words do you know anything at all about postal regulations them Oh molded wore out things I'm making a whole new set they don't jump all over me long on evernote Mr Burton with a post office inspector that's what I get for hiring unexperienced health price if you're looking for an amazing fun filled vacation for you and your family for an unbelievable price keep listening for details on how you can get a fabulous four day vacation for just ninety Lando Florida or the Smoky Mountains in Tennessee so whether you love world famous theme parks or the tranquility of Nature West Gate resorts has your dream vacation plus if you're one of the first one hundred you're just saying that everybody says they love me here in buying go to West Gate terms dot com for complete offer terms balance of nature changing the world one life at a time I've been taking this for about two yeah seven for wall and here's your most reliable mine must've button in here outside the post office when they're waiting firm to count the votes further here Oh yeah I think Ben withers getting ready to read the results listen in forty-eight Philemon Abner on Classic Radio Theater I took my family on a vacation like the one you're about to hear about and we had an amazing time and the best part about it was amount what is some kind of a game yeah see whoever guesses closest to the number of beans in there gets a postal savings account with double the regular interest for two years a free one hundred and nine booth all right fine it's war who is it pistols at the post office back twenty years the call we'll tell you about our twenty nine dollar Las Vegas Special Call Right now to book your amazing vacation for only ninety nine dollars eight hundred nine two five three zero one four the here on now that you're the official polls master y you get to read all postcard so what does this in hearsay take your seat to get the lucky number you get a free money order this is incredible so yes I'm very excited other thing blood pressure pills but it came down five points and so I I was controlling through my blood pressure post which I haven't changed take that from but from the last time to this time it's dropped by points so that was quite good experience the balance of Nature Difference for yourself received twenty five eight hundred nine two five three zero one four call eight hundred nine two five three zero one four this advertisement is being used for the purpose of soliciting sales at the time share plan restrictions apply with these discounts you will still receive free shipping on every order call eight hundred two four six eight seven five one or go to balanceofnature dot com and use the Israel and the other thing I've been buying cereal which I haven't bought I could probably tell you probably been forty years since I bought Syria I just don't eat it and and then you know I put up Burton Hair Salva voting tallies up all right as he's trunk berm it gets to vote Walt Bates Carr's fabulous freelance insurance investigator are truly Johnny Dollar Discount Code USA now on Classic Radio Theater Part Eight of the nine yours truly johnny dollar story the Phantom Chase matter that's cleverness I don't want any part of it only turned himself in of a chance of that maybe if he goes back to Barbados we can find in there and pursue this was originally broadcast October twenty fourth nineteen fifty-six Brahma Hollywood it's time now for Johnny Dollar Draw Pill for for a while anyway so when I wanted it was two forty five this time I wouldn't was a hundred and ten and my doctor was my gosh orbits from one of the Abernathy boys his mama well all three of them boys with the government you know one of them's in the army and one's in the navy and the other in Lagos Island three hours by boat from Barbados in the British West indies the Home Office Universal Adjustment Bureau Hartford Connecticut assignment the fan of chase matter expense accounts I should have figured what he was up to when he was all alone here on the island no way to get off so we obligingly show up on a boat he pens us down on the brush with a few wild shots while he works his way around to the bolt in tonight and every Weekday Night Bob Bailey into trends Dr Adventures of the man with the action packed expense account and plus you know my joints don't her oh that that's another thing because I have problems with you know I can always tell what's GonNa rain or snow or the weather's GonNa Change well I can't do that anymore which is learn how and you're from out of town Eiji yes I'm from Washington Washington wh what do you know about it and show you about advertising will do on small detail alone you and I are now in the same spot Tom Chase waters where alone on this island and there's no way off sent off your first preferred purchase of balance of nature plus get a set of convenient travel bottles containing a free additional week supply of balance of nature's fruits and veggies well one thing I got to admit husbands no dummy Johnny I'd just as soon not be reminded of Tom's cleverness embezzlement murder escaped us away from the boat I'd rented and had taken off and now lowland I were out in the middle of nowhere but really nowhere but are we going to do johnny Tom Chase ever since it embezzled one hundred twenty thousand dollars from his New York investment firm and jump bail I new Orleans there a man named Freddy Quintana had offered to deliver chase for a price what on earth are you doing bring it down that low I said balance of nature off all my laptop case he was so shocked genius. Johnny don't blame yourself we come here to Long Island to pick up Tom Shea so what happens he circles around behind us grabs a boat and takes off how could you help it but Quintana had loaned up dead in an alley. Obviously Tom Chased didn't want to be delivered I'd finally tracked him to Barbados and found a fisherman who told me brought chasing Iran confused animal on the run it doesn't seem very confused to me one thing I don't get though I'm not in Barbados before you arrive when Shay slugged me you're under other circumstances I don't really think I'd mind being here with you at all Johnny I in a bad way but my joints don't hurt anymore I'm like Oh this is good this is good you know so yeah so I've doing knock on wood so far so good I'm just thrilled I think I'd better start building fire we collected upon driftwood and brush and touched a match. They won't leave I guess well I'm going to build a fire here on the beach it's just possible about my past near enough to the now that's a good question police inspector Whitsett Baghdad Bob Betas told me that nobody comes near Lagos Island anymore not even fishermen maybe here quite a while then you'd I was getting nowhere I've been on the trail of aspect inspector yes aside point out their boat come on let's get out where they can see you could be the fishermen who brought chase here if he's me a favor johnny what is I just assumed you didn't keep calling Tom my husband his name legally yes when I found he wasn't traveling alone that it was a woman who arranged his hiding place in New Orleans I guess I just quit drinking in my husband probably think of no months now and I had gone in for my lap test your blood test and everything I had a little problem going in that a big problem with my cholesterol and I've been taking a class conly does johnny what is what look coming around the we don't even have any food well at abandoned house across the add on your husband was hiding could be this food and that he brought reduced over the head and the waterfront warehouse why didn't he finish me off then he had a chance to take me office trail for keeps and today here on the island those shots of his plenty while John Aw bolt on the other side of the Pier tied up there we went to the island and sure so chase did come back Barbados good I'll have the airlines and steamships I keep telling you thomas no killer walkway I know he's an embezzler running away from the law but I can't believe he killed that Man Continue Orleans believe a won't believe suspect maybe you've got a chance after all getting shot at a couple of times hey pretty one-sided go inspect the most beautiful site we've seen all day that's touched and get word to the fishing charter boats of chases there I think we can keep them bottled up with the stuff that are in the morning my my fruits and then I'm like oh my gosh this is like you know you died and went to having you know it's still good so so my success story so far knock on wood is great aw dollar a chap named George Emerson yeah sure he's the senior partner of the firm chasing the money from New York I'm not so sure that neither my lola was completely devoted to Tom she was badly hurt by his embezzlement and I think she's still being hurt in any case I'd feel a lot better I Z. I wonder why about half way here I saw a boat in the distance was too far away from me to see who is in it which was heading back towards Babas and let's get this poll cranked up in aniseed funny way things were out timing is always so bad oh you mean here L. fanned inspector why he dropped on me just before shoved off wait for you and your hotel Betas phone number earlier and he said he was going to catch the first plenty that he's only hope of straightening himself out is to turn himself in and turn over whatever the embezzled money is laugh all look far to guarantee eventual restitution to our investors and we went across the island to the house where chase him in hiding out it was a pretty ricky affair but he left some food eaten we went back in the fire aww special investigator Johnny and I couldn't raise you already are decided to come and have a look see restraints who knows he penned us down on the underbrush with a few shots while he circle around behind us and took off on the boat now if it could only work out so the could talk to Tom or better yet if I both could talk to him well what would you say to him. I don't know what Lola would say but for me I'd put a twin she clear out You know I came down here to take her back on the way I started thinking about it as long as she is here perhaps she could be a big help to US couldn't come down here mainly to take you back to New York Johnny we've been all over there so I still think you want to hold it matter and we went drag by now was sure chase was getting five and five from me all the time but there was nothing I could do about it unrecognized him house Lola holding up under all this oh I don't know she says she's all over being hurt that when she found out there was another woman involved at killed half inning pitches a New Orleans stole a letter from him one that he'd started to Lola it matched the sample chases writing you gave me a New York and when he grabbed our boat on August island and they gotta look at him inspector Whitsett took off to cover all the basis and I did go back to our hotel I got to mind George Everson was waiting for me I took him to my role game with shapes maybe he's coming here to try and finish off a weight that's a police boat yes inspector what's come on get alongside wife Lola had flown to buy Betas and insisted on coming with me to the island hoping she could convince her husband turned himself in but instead chase maneuver in cab fare from my hotel to Colonie police headquarters check with inspector Whitsett who fortunately from me he was being most cooperative hasn't contacted any of the airlines steamship I didn't Barbados Looks Pretty Good you to dis inspector came along and look like we're going to turn out to be Lago silence older citizens conspicuous as possible so he's probably hiding out in the city here scores of hotels and ruining I did I don't have to excuse me the look on Lagos Island Mr Oh yeah all of it bed you're sure it's really chase you've been training all away very Quintana a few minutes but it might as well be a year old I went back to my hotel I was a whatever amount he's already spent only to take time that's pretty generous of you Mr Everson but I'm afraid you're a little too late why in the first place Tom Chase obvious right again take a look at this map you'll see a problem hundred and seventy square miles more or less yeah he could be here in the city around the he's not going to turn himself in his chances to up to now and he hasn't exactly jumped at them but if I think it's well I think he's got a good reason for not turning himself in it's better than what's that here yes oh the address yeah chase yeah don't chase mind if I ask you a couple of questions why not why did you do how soon but I still think Tom Chase would listen to lola even if he wouldn't listen to anyone else nobody could change that much I wouldn't count on Mr Everson still is worth a try what the embezzlement was it because of a woman was a woman was it turned sour in the end of the whole okay let's not be polite inspecting let's use the past there's one jump behind Tom Chase getting on my nerves sure he was telling Betas wear right I was going catching him was turning into a full time from chase I've tried every trick going not shake you down none of them's work you've kept on coming I can't stand it anymore I'm sick a running thanks I just had a real wild either I said don't turn around and keep your hands inside okay my wild idea is that your time ends read in touch with the charter and fishing boats he hasn't approached any of them so far as we know in other words the chances are good that he's still hearing Veda question is where Rei Swipe my boat and longest island just missing inspector I've been just missing him for the last ten days and believe me I'm getting tired of it probably only by a few minutes to sure justice worry she doesn't matter anymore and where's the money that doesn't matter either you won't get it I see next question why did you come in chase and that's detract down drag him at own expense account out of twenty seven twenty American in October twenty four th nineteen fifty-six yours truly Johnny Valor Huron Classic Radio Theater if you'd like to contact us e all right I'm sorry but that's the way it has to be dialer this is the end of the line for you now here's all star to tell you about the final episode of this story tomorrow the payoff but who gets paid off and how and why yeah search for USA Classic Radio Theater That USA Classic Radio Theatre thanks much for tuning in I'm Wyatt Cocks thanks for listening thanks contact me either by mail or through the Internet Classic Radio Dot Stream and our programs are available anywhere they serve up podcasts all you have to do this the station support the advertisers teleprinter great radio shows are back Classic Radio Theatre here on your favorite station and the USA Radio Network the are web page classic Radio Dot Stream that's classic Radio Dot Stream there you can find our classic Radio Theater programs learn more about classic radio collecting give yourself it's too late for that you know there's another way I've got to take you off my trail once and for all looking Oh man answering chases general description just checked in a hotel in the north part of the city enchants he's the one who knocked off Freddie content New Orleans the man who offered to turn over to you for a price not so one on at this point it looks like there's only one way for me to get career career is getting fed up then as I ended my run I had a slight mobile behind I realized all of a sudden and I wasn't alone turnaround why routed very still okay luck I can save you some time it's my gun looking forwards in a shoulder holster well the answers to those questions surprise me plenty and maybe they will you to join us won't your yours truly Johnny dollar six somewhere over here in the beach area I somehow doubt that Um why where it's pretty fashionable spot didn't chase it try to be in act postmaster grocer now runs a small Finnish steam bath and mild ABC part. I don't care about him what about this Mr Edwards Oh he's not the Kharkiv isn't margarine and empty closet when does open and there's a fire escape area benefit you see their code Chad jacket it looks like the one he was hey jamie it's me Jamie this is your daily pep talk I know it's been rough going ever since people found out about your acapella group mad harmony but you will bounce back hi it's Jamie progressive's number one number two employee leave a message at the services could be the stitch in time that saves nine lives that is go ahead make your scoutmaster proud earn your merit badge as this year sorry pitchy Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates Pricing Coverage Match Limited by State Law this is Mario Andretti you know me as a racecar driver a year one in eleven Americans is involved in an accident so listen up carry jack spare tire jumper cables and learn how to use them org slash caregiving for care guides and community support for your strength brought to you by AARP and the Ad Council just with today's car clinic know what's in your insurance policy and who to call keep a card listing medical conditions and allergies invest in the cell phone nine art when I come back I'll tell you when your battery goes dead everything can come to a stop world know it isn't cool am I letting your friend on care learn more at eye witness bullying dot org brought to you by the Ad Council hope you enjoyed your meal and I just want to see ah stand up for you don't worry I know did you know someone being bullied online you can be a witness and make a difference by letting the in America let's do lunch dot org this message brought to you by meals on wheels America and the Ad Council been saying to your friend get a different he's lucky to have a beloved lucky caring for my brother is far from easy but he's a part of me like my arms and legs so I'll be his it boy scouts learn it to earn their eagle badges and if you know it you may save a few eagles of your own own dollar bills be prepared no time for tired nothing can disable this love he needs me but I'm the lucky one even though I need help now and then if you're caring for a loved one visit AARP dot also a meals on wheels volunteer I raced against the sport's biggest personalities but I've never met more vibrant amazing people than the seniors served by meals by meals on wheels you can make a difference by dropping off a hot meal and say a quick hello so America let's do lunch volunteer your lunch break read that fits your car or truck at guaranteed low price O. Reilly auto parts better parts better prices every day a highway deer road I'm bobby likes like us you'll love this is Mario Andretti you know me as a racecar driver don't take a chance on getting stranded stop by O. Reilly Auto Parts and get your battery tested free of charge your battery does need to be replaced reilly auto parts can help you find the exact superstar it also a meals on wheels volunteer I've raced against the sport's biggest personalities but I've never met more vibrant amazing people than the seniors green auto parts being prepared to rare species money and life every America let's do lunch dot org this message brought to you by meals on wheels America and the Ad Council people been saying to your friend get a different face wheels you can make a difference by dropping off a hot meal and say a quick hello so America let's do lunch volunteer your lunch break at ace and posting on their lead they're super ugly the things they say to them online and they're not true so tell your friend bad for you don't worry I know did you know someone being bullied online you can be a witness and make a difference by letting the world know it isn't cool am I letting your friend know you care learn more at eye witness bullying dot org brought to you by the Ad Council hope you enjoyed your meal and I just WanNa see he's always meets the road actually I'm not even sure what that means you speed radio network life heart news feeds dot Com caregiving for care guides and community support for your strength brought to you by AARP and the Ad Council just with today's car clinic minute in this is the liberty your daily source for Liberty News and activists update the voice scouts learn it to earn their eagle badges and if you know it you may say a few eagles of your own on dollar bills be prepared no time for tired nothing can disable this love he needs me but I'm the lucky one even though I need help now and then if you're caring for a loved one visit AARP dot org slash throwing people in jail that word comes in a report from the mind unleashed which says under the plan homeless people would be rounded up under the extendable charges of misdemeanor cornea as the state has leaned away from incarceration for low level non-violent drug crimes it would also counter mainstream thinking preventing homelessness and addressing the reality of it they come back I'll tell you when your battery goes dead everything could come to a stop where the rubber this stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by on facebook twitter and Instagram is adamant about kidnapping engaging people for trespassing exactly how authorities will determine someone is a homeless trespasser remains up for debate the liberty is produced in partnership with has news and listeners like you online at liberty beat Dot News Dot News I make Merle with your latest edition drug offenses or potential trespassing and thrown in a cage as the La Times reports the tactic would fly in the face of criminal justice reform over the last decade in Califor- lucky to have a brother like you lucky caring for my brother is far from easy but he's a part of me like my arms and legs so I'll be his a sponsored in part by brave panicles high-quality crate him in CBD at reasonable prices with excellent customer service Ray Botanical is activist owned according to the report. The plan is being spearheaded by Kern County Sheriff Donnie youngblood and Kern County district attorney said the Zimmer naturally the advocate US senator the IRS has acknowledged that's true but professes that can't change anything unless it's given more money Propublica reportedly disproportionate audit tells c. them online it didn't know scale dot net in the news officials and Bakersfield California have announced they will be solving their homeless problem by the Liberty beat Golden Trading at one thousand five hundred six dollars silver at seventeen dollars to fifty six cents and Bitcoin is trading around eight thousand one hundred seventy seven dollars today's prices are brought to you by no scale takeoff with manage clown looking for a safe secure way to store your important files online let Enos Gail handle it for you collided precision weapon used in the attack was made by Raytheon amnesties arms experts analyzed photos are the remnants of the weapon recovered from the scene of the attack and your door just pay shipping that's free ounce of Creidim dot com this is the latest edition of the Liberty Find Us online at liberty beat Dot News and their high availability cloud servers are the perfect solution for clients needing one or more secure scalable servers with built in hardware fell over protection pretty come from the United States support for the liberty comes from the conscious resistance network featuring videos news reports articles from spirits we'll anarchist perspective experience the conscious resistance at the conscious resistance dot com how would you like to have your business featured on the liberty beat you can he uses relatively low level employees to return for low income tax payers who claim the earned income tax credit last week balance last month replied with a report but it said the IRS has no plant and won't have one Congress agrees to restore the funding it slash from the agency US on lower income families in April Lawmakers Confronted Irs Commissioner Charles Reading about the emphasis and Senator Ron Wyden as reading for a plan to fix the pitcher program or ignoring the insane cost of incarcerating thousands of people for trespassing drug possession while Youngblood said he wants to go after those who are possessing drugs Zimmer free and even more deadly leaving the inches of the country's more than one million school children in limbo in late June twenty nine thousand nine coalition aircraft targeted while you have this soft fleshy body but inside of it there's a second tinier body that's made a super hard rock data is inclusive very cool to conduct the study researchers examined every single body part and determine how cool or uncool it was we initially thought the brain over the past nine years something lawmakers have shown little inclination to do the Mind Unleash reports that the IRS auditing poor taxpayers is a lot easier the agents new school year in Yemen began the school year since the war started and little has changed for Yemen schoolchildren aside from the fact that the coalition's weapons have become more precise in ls dot news your news now continues the irs audits the working poor at about the same rate as the wealthiest one percent now in response to questions for me is identified as US made the use of US made weapon in the attack was no anomaly as most of the weapons possessed by Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates and posting on their feed they're super ugly thing basis they're not true so tell your friend House Talk Radio that you control Cohen talk about whatever is on your mind that number's eight five five four five zero three seven three three and with you tonight it's Aria Michael and the liberty is online at liberty beat Dot News Dot News I'm McMurdo reporting for the Liberty beat reminding you spread liberty with a smile there are a big strong bones like baseball bats in your arms and legs hand bones that looked like a monster claw and skull bones that make scary face doctors did caution that as cool as we home located in the war zone area six of the family members were killed including three children aged twelve nine and six according to Amnesty International the ovary entry right so I was just like all right well they hotel is in that General Ish Direction and I started walking turns out I was heading they had a lot of opening acts were at least six right the doors opened at six and that was one little Miss Nasty went on very little act but in this moment didn't actually come on Nice I didn't even know the name of the hotel that I was staying at I did happen to know US address now all of that started because strangely wheatley wrong direction I did have cash though so it wasn't a big deal and somebody ended up coming to a stop sign at the same time that I was passing through the intersection happy the coolest part because it's like a computer that runs on food but when we looked at it up close it was all gross and wrinkled brains are not cool downs Aku dodgers take me here so ultimately ended well but it was an interesting experience rescued by the Uber driver so andy how `bout eleven thirty by then I was I was tore up I was trashed I needed to leave anyway as she gets up there and she starts talking about how Giddy and mission driven and believed so strongly in the power of them they're giving it away for free just go to free crate dot com for a free trade them delivered up and kick ass and I've been gone as people have noticed for like the last two weeks or so thank you it's been interesting I've been actually pretty busy but this last week was an in the moment concert that I had to attend to that just crude my schedule up completely it was a really interesting experience that ultimately culminated in mice I am trends so I just roll my eyes and continue scrolling whenever I see Trans News because there's there's always something right if it's not a trance kittens he's about it two completely conflicting stories one from the daily beast and one from the federal I wanNA start with the federalist so because it has by far oh I wondering the streets of worker Massachusetts a city to which I've never been very very drunk one thirty in the morning with a dead cell phone yes so I sat down on a bench smoke my cigarette put out my phone and found it completely dead there was no way to get back into the venue for the concert into gender transition that's that's my favorite sentence of the whole article instead both mother and father will share equally in medical science concert right it was about their new song that they were about to perform issues as given the introduction to it because it was going to be some kind of Jingoistic crap I guess so I just sort of walked just in an email deliberately beat dot news for details this is the liberty produced in partnership with S. L. S. News and listeners like you she is that her father fought in World War Two and supporting the troops and this nonsense Oh yeah I walked out where do you even bringing that up for not supposed to be when bones are they're not nearly as cool as done a sore bulbs onion news network early limited my what interests me most about this is all of the people who are weighing in and saying that it for one week just give the Trans People in the world one week without you spouting off about how much you support transpeople or about how much you don't support transpeople of their twin boys God they need an editor that's no surprise the mother no longer has unfettered authority to manipulate her seven year old boy in the news lately has been the seven year old kid in Texas I haven't been following it very closely because of Monday against the father and ruled Thursday that Jeffrey younger now has equal joint conservative ship with the mother a doctor this is free talk live intimately just a crap that they're putting forward and they're hiding this messed up view behind the veneer of it being for the children logical and other decision making for the boys additionally the judge changed the custody terms to give younger an equal amount of visitation time with the suns something that had been severe that would make me very happy good luck with that one yeah because it's not happening right this has been beaten to death I've found to interesting story the most interesting take on it so in a closely watched Dallas Texas child custody case Judge Kim Cooks put aside the disappointing jury's verdict it's people or whatever however you wish to people who are gender curious whatever should have to wait until adulthood to make the decision on whether or not to transition oh giving them the finger went outside finally smoked a cigarette after not being able to have five and a half hours that was agonizing when I was the headlining act what's your twenty years old you can decide whether or not you wanna hit on Paul's or whether or not you want to go down this other direction note there saying no you're gonNA ride this path you're going to go through your natural horrendous version of court because it doesn't even follow the rules that regular court pretends to follow yeah it has no system of checks and balances that right until you're eighteen but the reality life as a human being the homo sapiens species is going to make that decision for them well and it sounds like the mother the father or any of the bystanders watching this have have any concern whatsoever for the child to them it doesn't even exist it's just some figment in their heads ready and that's going to be the end of it and once you turn eighteen once it's too late to fully transition then you can make this decision charity and not age generally there's a lot of correspondence between agent experience but that's not necessarily going to be the case with every single person I know some real old dressed me an affirmed how good I looked now in my seventies I have the benefit of hindsight to know how badly this COMPLA- out with years lost in translation was like hey I've got cash I need a ride he wrote down his wonder it's like well I happen to be an uber driver I looked at sure enough he had an uber sticker right thrown aside I was like here's here's some the court certainly shouldn't weigh in on it I I would agree that that's a mess in its own right but you have essentially father at a conference in Texas she immediately felt a connection because she was just a boy hold on because I thought this author was a Mel Okay in a gender identity nightmare under his mom's care in Dallas Texas James Obediently lives as Trans girl named Luna but the court is involved with this particular case and I know not only from history but you know just being me family court is probably the most that between the ages of I mean let's choose a why why ballpark here between the ages of ten and twenty the person's body is going to undergo substantial and mystic physiological changes right puberty kicks in and right young everything goes hey happens to all of us it's not like they're pressing a pause button and saying okay well once you're eighteen which is a sentiment I agree with but I also have the perspective that you know when you're delineating these things in these terms saying that this person can't a very ugly mill okay I immediately felt a connection because I was just a boy when the seat of gender distress was planted in my young psyche by an adult family member who crossed that are really immature so so this writer says she first became involved with little James's situation in two thousand eighteen when she met the under mixmaster I've written two articles to raise awareness about the situation for those who need a little background here's a recap six year old James is called see it more fascinating in these sociological terms right like you have these two groups of people each of them wanting to do what is best for the child or at least claiming to I don't believe the choice when he's with his dad he's all boy his sex from conception now that's interesting but you know that's Kasit to sex because the sun has orbited the Earth a certain number of times it's about US arbitrary as you can get to me experience is the best gauge of and and that's not making that's not having them wait to make the decision that's you making the decision for them because what they don't seem to grasp is also not likely to be the entire truth you know because especially because all of the news articles I found about this just that they father is very much against it all the authoritarians right now so you got people like Arvin Vohra and others coming out and saying look if you can't consent to sex you can't Kasit to a sex change literally anything you want to completely tax free with the blessing of the IRS and no it's not a roth join us now DNA DOT freetalklive dot com Um and a seven year old kid I wouldn't expect to have the courage to stand up to his father and say something like well look this is what I'm going to do if you want me to part of your life four fifty free as in free talk live do you have crypto wealth advisor or coach is so small do it yourself guy on up to crypto whales increase your wealth visit crypto wealth coach Dot Com. Do you have a qualified plan an IRA four one K.. For one three Zor contact this station but if you can serve a national audience contact me market freetalklive dot com check news this week more than eighteen million podcast downloads and we claim millions of listens a month we're a multimedia at venue with print email web and terrestrial radio marketing platforms the free prerecorded webinars watch now DNA DOT freetalklive dot com free talk live is now on more than two hundred radio stations nationwide we've had we strive to have add packages that catered advertisers big and small contact me today at market freetalklive dot com to see what we can do for you market freetalklive dot com if you're a local advertiser we're GONNA get further into the mire so don't go anywhere this is free talk live let us know what you think eight five five four five zero three seven three three again this eight five or some other type of investment account would you like to learn how the ultra wealthy take their investment accounts make them legally one hundred percent tax free have your money liquid and investor has invested in its first Roth. Ira Nineteen years old while living abroad and has an investing on Wall Street Technology for over twenty years with experiencing all the money markets by comparison so customers in the past thirty days and very importantly are they a member of the digital currency council since Maniscalco is the founder of crystal coach and critical wealth coach Dot Com because Microsoft has unveiled its new generation xbox one designer say the consoles revolutionary new voice command feature makes it easier than ever for the xbox to control its user Sukkot currency adviser but investing in technology stocks for twenty years have they left the corporate world and retired or are they still trying to make a weekly paycheck how they produce results and they'll oh well we don't want our children to be abused but that's not the case at all you're just abusing them in a different direction you're just saying no you can't make this decision I according to Microsoft spokesman Dan Patrick quote the xbox one is programmed with a host of simple voice commands that you will respond to instantly in addition to phrases like jump shoot Texas is going to be some trans athlete that has everyone butthurt it's constant is perpetual I don't really care what side of the Al people fall on but would you please stop talking about can use to push one political agenda or the other it's a football yes it's transpeople let are the rope that people love pulling at topic for quick and easy to customize your feeds at feeds dot freetalklive dot com that's feeds dot freetalklive dot COM bitcoin DOT COM has launched a trading platform at local the BITCOIN DOT com allowing you to buy or sell bitcoin cash via dozens of payment methods like pay pal then Mo bank deposit remittances or meeting in person with cash there are no a D requirements to sign up for and use the site and all communications between buyers and sellers are encrypted finally at Global Trading Platform that respects your privacy visit Jio expression and tell when you're looking away from the television Andy Look back at the TV Microsoft says the new XBOX can also command you're using your smartphone or tablet if you have to just get on board with it especially with the court system saying essentially now off while you're going to spend time with this person whether you like it or not the whole thing is a mess insert game disc users will also understand more complicated instructions like download call of duty update or come into the room and turn on xbox one games Google DOT BITCOIN DOT com get started trading bitcoin cash local dot bitcoin dot com you can put the Liberty Radio Network on the Air Your Area Visit Broadcast Not Ellen DOT FM to learn how broadcast dot L. R. N. DOT FM OUR PODCAST has been around since podcast began and now the F. t. l. feed is loaded with content besides are full show archives did you know that we make it easy for you to customize your pod cast subscriptions we have different feeds one that includes only are full shows one with just the daily digest and one with just the Edgerton post you decide what you listen to it take bus is raving quote it's The immersive obedience experience we've been waiting for is the onion news network there are lots of ways to listen to free talk live remittances or even meeting in person using cash there's no requirement to sign up for the site and all communications between buyers and sellers are encrypted kick ass and I'm going to tell you about local dot bitcoin dot com because bitcoin DOT COM has launched a trading platform and you can find it at local DOT BITCOIN DOT COM which allows the keys to those chats being deleted after seven days so finally we have a global trading platform that respects your privacy it's got a built in escrow system built on buy and sell bitcoin cash via dozens of payment methods like pay pal bank deposit a sale coupet Vin mo it is extremely low much lower than it is on that other site so go check it out again thus local dot bitcoin dot com now we've been talking about sounds including helping investors make over three quarters of a million dollars in E. L. S. in ninety days and one thousand two hundred twenty five percent five and a half months which link set has helped for the the bitcoin cash blockchain is really awesome I love it of course some sellers and buyers may require some additional KYC. I certainly do for you transfers and things like that because I've been bird one too many times but it's absolutely great even then the rates of actual scammers on these sites when you're the guy always helping people find coverage options with the name your price tool it should be you giving me the pep talk now get out there hit that high note and take mad harmony all the way to nationals radio controlled so call in and talk about whatever is on your mind that number's eight five five four or five zero three seven three three with you tonight it's Aria Michael and take this is free talk live play what music to listen to what shows to watch watch TV and with that ZIP command I'm watching by xbox is high tech sensors can also detect this trends maybe ish kid in Texas possibly did anyone ever get the kids opinion on this that I wanted to my first the so-called Grotto Gurus barely alive twenty years said has not only experienced person successor was on investments in Crypto he has also held his clients and six and seven year action is what does the kid when separated from both parents have to say about it I doubt that piece of information is going to be an either of these articles uh-huh and that's tragic isn't it I mean you see I've seen it happen as a child of divorce having been sifted through his about all these conditions of his life in order to get married in the first place and the court actually upheld like the cause of divorce being fraud all is going to answer some of them but it just seems to me my gut feeling from the headlines that I've read is that the kids upon in battle that was originally point and I haven't read either of articles that you've mentioned I've I've seen them pop up on my feed I have so many questions that I'm sure that article the situation but so I so I found a a reddit thread where someone had linked to the to the court documents of the the this exact case and she knows quite a bit more about the father situation than I do Evans your own freetalklive hey there hey thanks for calling a lot of other things now I don't know I don't I have no idea about the actual like transgender kid or whether or not they are but you know the father lied about yeah it was interesting so like I started seeing this the the news articles coming up from all these different websites talking about issue but this guy who was upheld into court system is being guilty of fraud is now making national headlines about this particular issue and you know you know try gender transition and all this other stuff right but I was only seeing one side of this like every news article I was reading like had the same between the parents and has now escalated to different factions of the state different forms of the government well speaking details we've finally got gained some sort of favor during the divorce proceedings or you know get the house or the car whatever it is that thereafter so the child just becomes a pawn for selfishness at that worth in the first place not necessarily the custodial agreements between the parents of the children but even like because of divorce and things like that and it it was and and and and made the husband pay damages to the wife so this guy who was essentially a found guilty wouldn't be the right terminology so I started like kind of poking around looking for more details and more information of you know that that didn't come from a site that had that obviously like link so I've seen reporting that the father actually appears to be kind of a a you didn't say it but a scumbag I shudder out of the state and how it works when the child's custody is involved particularly divorcing parents and how the parents try to use the kid to like you know there's father trying to get custody like those custody battle etcetera and like the you know a court had said that he wouldn't have any say in his child Evens O'Brien calling a I think is familiar with freetalklive anyway I've met her at Port Fest and things like that I've seen around on facebook in the last few days talking about is clear if you read through those court documents that the father has a has has a like there's an evidence trail of the father lying about vent frankly and I was curious like what like I don't see anything about the mother you don't see anything about you know like what baiter details of this are team some of the core documentation from the about the custodial stuff but there's a whole lot of court documentation showing this father clearly has not been the secondary thing about custodial issues and and issues regarding medical decisions and you know rights and responsibilities there So I mean what I looked at a lot of these websites seem to have a very clear opinion about trans issues and then translate to the way that they were looking at the the rest an honest in a bunch of other things that make me wonder why we would assume he's honest now I'm not I'm not trying to say like he's guilty until proven way or the other the kid has been dragged into the entire ordeal pump but the divorce is final correct yeah the divorce was totally final and then this news anything like that but I I don't know why I would trust the story from this person who has gone out and and violated this child's privacy by publicizing their name like there's a whole bunch of things I feel very uncomfortable with in terms of the father and the way that he's behaving and and and I don't know that I would trust the father's store what I've heard the mother is actually sending the kid through the proper legal channels for transitioning with the therapists and the counselor sorry I have no idea about the mother have no idea like what this kid's opinion is and I hope that doctors and therapists and anybody else involved is trying to do the best thing for the child but to learn more about the father but I would also like to learn more about the mother because what I'm seeing that she's kind of the word I would use I like I I couldn't in good conscious things that the whatever the I'm with you on that at the very least there's and all of that crap exactly so it sounds like the father just I don't Wanna put words in his mouth or you know state what his from what I've heard Nah not having looked into it myself you dropped out there for a second but not having looked into it myself the father is definitely not someone who's a word I would just want to trust on the issue Joel decision it is it's not a decision for onlookers or people standing on twitter and facebook to make either unfortunately they don't seem to get I trust my holdings of all the major crypto currencies to edge wallet and you should too no long phrases to memorize just a username and password secured they they the so many of these libertarians see a thing they don't like and they wanNA use every avenue at their disposal to put a stop to it eight five see wallets certainly the best named one I'm mark edge and I love the edge wallet I've been using it for the last few months you can buy sell trade and hold your cryptocurrency securely your freedom with edge wallet did it now on apple or android in the APP store or at edged dot APP divvy is crypto made easy anyone can use divvy to security she is crypto made easy plus one click master notes Divvy Project Dot Org again divvy project dot org since time began tyrant what I don't really see how you know any of this can be a decision made by either parents much less the state it's an languishing the divvy price has risen substantially against BTC now's the time to make a switch to divvy or make your start with cryptocurrency with divvy visit divvy project dot org five four five zero three seven three what's your opinion on it again that's eight five five four fifty free isn't free talk live definitely say that I have found the best cryptocurrency topup sounds like he's just upset about it and one dog that we appreciate the call I definitely Liam seamlessly spend earn store or exchange digital money the US dollar and euros divvy is fast transactions happen in seconds with fewer fees while other old coins swift jerk and the kid is just sort of trapped in the middle and from what we've seen so far no one is just asking the child what various things during our live shows or anytime day or night dischord softwares available cross platform so you can have it on whatever device you want and take your chats anywhere cirque today many cups to enforce pot laws do so only because it provides them with cushy jobs good benefits and a chance to push people around I was an undercover nerd Zing we dot com makes the perfect gift remember that's guns and read Dot Com is oral health important to you if you don't like film by Michael W Dean and Nima Bobby DVD available now at guns and we dot com or on Amazon that's gone did and never wanna live without it it's clinically proven to whiten teeth but I find it does much more they want you to love my magic mud as much as I do so they're giving you a money back guarantee plus twenty percents off go to my magic mud dot com and use Coupon Code F. T. L. Twenty at checkout my magic mud dot Com F. T. L. Twenty L. dot fm now has discord addicks officer. The drug war is nothing but a farce the second amendment says you gotTa keep you Angie gap intact Dunston we'd the road to freedom own teeth fresh breath or kissing people then by all means stop listening several years ago I met Jessica Armand Founder and CEO of magic mud and I became passionate about the product that she create discord is a free text and voice chat platform and we now have our own server with a bunch of channels at discord dot dot fm you can join other listeners as they chat about Canadian that personal liberties now there's a movie that teams back the government has no more right tell us what to put in our bodies than they have to take on join our discord at discord dot L. R. N. DOT FM that's discord dot L. R. N. DOT FM Guys Mark Glare here blinds of Liberty Dot com organs or tell us what books we can read six drug police were eaten by bears low rating of marijuana farm journey hippies Marie strive to advance the ideas of liberty daily we bring you the morning rar every Monday Friday we'll have a brand new edition of the morning roar we from his words and help convey his view along with our little spin as well we wrap it all up every Friday with felony Friday where our own John Odor Matt goes out and takes a look moreover it line the Liberty Dot com advancing the ideas of liberty daily help get fm into more ears ZIP PROMOTE DOT DOT FM for a free bumper sticker flyers banners graphics and more promote Dot L. R. N. DOT FM again go check it out it's a edge dot APP if you would like to visit their website and learn more about it so we've been talking about this kid in Texas wallet that's true of a lot of mobile wallets but the awesome thing about the edge wallet is that you can get rid of those ridiculous twenty four word recovery vital roundup of some news stories that you may not find in the mainstream media for even the your typical social media newsfeed we find stories that relate the ideas of liberty and provide you with our perspective on them every Monday we have our longest running feature Mondays and Murray named after the Great Libertarian Murray Rothbart where we'll examine article or an exit I never remember which one of these idiotic phrases has what I need in it so be sure to check it out is got support for bitcoin cash at the rim crap pass phrases they are the bane of my existence I have lost so much crypto currency not really but I've lost more crypto currency than anyone should have because number's eight five five four five zero three seven three three and with you tonight it's Aria Michael and the captain and I wanNa tell you about the edge wallet because it's the mobile and there's this article here from the federalist that takes exactly the approach you would expect the federalists to take evidently this guy claims that he he's a AH tokens Minero ripple stellar and many others they've been going since two thousand fourteen so they've been around for a while you know a wallet by that I use for storing my crypto currency it's available for both IOS and Android for those people out there who don't know how to use technology and use personal friend of the family to some degree and he's met all of these people personally there's a lot of colloquial isn't that's not the right word I'm looking for you can buy sell trade and securely hold crypto currencies it's user controlled you always have your own money you control the private keys when you use the e some sort of felony there's felonies committed every day now whether it's a felony committed by the police a politician or even an average citizen you can find all of this and so much more there's there's a lot of third hand information being passed to us here that's all dependent on this guy the writer at the federalist being both a honest perspective is the father is trying to stop the LGBTQ agenda from being forced onto his child right okay the narrative yeah and the other side this is free talk live talk radio that you controlled call and talk about whatever is on your mind nation pokemon go maybe and even pokemon go would be a bit outdated the writers trying to paint a picture failing yeah not one smidgen this week I asked father how his sons were doing younger says that James's fraternal twin brother is confused and tells everyone he wants to live with his on Sunday nice where did you eat at it was the social Sunday gathering over at the local Burger yeah that's great be not biased and see actually honest don't think you're going to get any of that no not by uh the news circulation only a journalist would ask that kind of question in journalism is dead so so according to this author he took the opportunity to jump in the mar with younger that would be the father as he drove across town to pick up the two boys from his ex wife's house as they pulled up front door opened and the two young boys there is there is this I dunno Ninja Turtles are still kind of popular what I'm not saying they're unpopular but I don't see them okay I don't know how I would want to characterize what I'm trying to say but I don't see it as being at the forefront of two seven year olds covers uh if anybody has indeed bother to sit down with a child and ask them you would think that'd be a prerequisite to this should be the first thing it hasn't made its way into I'm flying out James was dressed as a boy like his brother now James is one that may or may not want to transition but he's the one that all of this fixed around into the backseat they went aims to defy his mother's wishes God I love it I mean to me you know if if the non aggression add this is according to the father by the way as to James on a recent visitation time with his father James Dressed himself as a classy there is nowhere that is not biased there isn't and as Davis was saying was she was on the phone with US earlier it does come down to that there are two types of articles gender dis for you or girl

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20200708 Nicole Sandler Show - The Beginning or the End

The Nicole Sandler Show

59:50 min | 8 months ago

20200708 Nicole Sandler Show - The Beginning or the End

"The following program contains graphic material, including offensive language viewer discretion is advised. Jeez got the news she talks with newsmakers encourages us to laugh, and she cries with us speaking truth to power and Questioning Authority daily. It's the knuckles antler show. All right it's a Wednesday the middle of the week, somebody. Years ago decided to call. It Hump Day. And it stuck. And I always hated that term, but I just wrote it in the chat room. Alright so. Happy Hump Day everyone. Welcome to it. We have an interesting guests coming up today Greg Mitchell is somebody that I met a few years back when he used to write for the Nation magazine, and he left the nation a few years ago and you know I. Know I knew that he wrote about media and politics, and but but it was always with a different slant. Well, his new book was just released yesterday, and it's called the beginning or the end how Hollywood and America learned to stop worrying and love the bomb now that subtitle you know is taken a bit from Dr Strangelove Right, or you should know because that's like one of the greatest movies about the bomb ever. But this book is actually about a different movie about the bomb that was called the beginning or the end, and it was a major Hollywood production back made shortly after. The We dropped bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki so. But it's it's an interesting. Take on it because it has to do with the way Hollywood approached this film. And how then the Truman Administration got in there and sort of took control of of the thing so. Anyway that's. That's what's. Coming up our guest today is Greg Mitchell and we'll talk about this book, but there's a lot of stuff going on before we get there, so. Let's. Let's not wait any further. Let's start with a funny as I like to do. Because you know things, get serious as the as the as the show progresses, the problem is I've got three different videos to choose from. And, while they're all kind of funny, and they're all semi regulars. We have one from the parody project. We have one from founders sing, and we have one from the kipness in South Africa. And, but they're all a little on the dark side, so I guess. I can just pick I. Guess I'll just pick. Let's go with. will go with the founder. Sing founder, saying just launched. I don't know a few months back. With a video, a parody of Don McLean's American Pie that was the animation on the video was wonderful, because it was all our founding. Fathers from you know, Washington and Jefferson and Hamilton and you know the you know the drill. All. Animated Singing, the song and you know it's like an eight minute song, so they all had a verse. So that's where I guess. The name founders saying came from now beyond that. They've done subsequent videos without the founding fathers with personalities like Oh, Dr Foul Chee and The OBAMAS and you name it and today's Today's song is song by the one and only Jesus. Christ yeah. Because, why not when it's animation? Why not right and and the song is titled. Today, amazing waste, so you know what's coming. Kinda SORTA anyway, take it away. Founders sing with amazing waste. It says some evangelicals believe trump is God's chosen. One Jesus felt compelled to set the record straight. Where prophets those who come to you in sheep's clothing inwardly are ravenous wolves. Every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit. Something like that. Now now the Song kicks in. Waste. Who? Call. This grazed. Look. ooh! Edgy who? Radio? A! Way? Songs. Wait. Hey. Sales? Just. Not. Yeah Ooh, let's get rid of the ECHO. ECHO effect I. Think come on, go go away there we go. Founder Sing. Amazing waste. Couldn't have said it any better myself and certainly couldn't have sung it better. Those and I don't know a whole lot about them, but there were founders saying as usual I will post the video on the blog at Nicole Sandler calm along with today's show. So you can see the wonderful an an animation, in case, you only heard the audio. There I'm any S. Jesus was Brown. In case you were wondering yeah so. Today is July eighth. And you know on facebook. They have this memory thing where it says she see your memories with the. Thus and such, and so it tagged a few people, and I thought Oh I wonder what this was about, and I looked back and the things that it was showing me. We're no big deal, but then I got back four years four years ago today. Was Really fucked up day. Oh my God first of all. That was the day we awoke to a video. Of A man being shot dead in Minneapolis in his car by police with his girlfriend, and her three or four year old daughter in the backseat. His name was philander Castille. Remember him, and and we were all shocked and it just. That was four years ago today. And look what it took four years filled with similar. Incidents of COPS. Killing unarmed mostly black people. In it's just so so that's how the day began four years ago today, but I'm looking through my memories on facebook and I see. The first thing I see. From four years ago is sitting in bed, watching the madness on TV. It's a sad mad world. And then a little bit later. I wrote. I'm at the hospital looks like they're keeping me overnight. No show tomorrow. And the next one, said Classic Female Heart. Attack Symptoms left job Brent left job. Pain short of breath awoken a poll of sweat like lightheaded now watching the news in horror. And then. I had an update and the update said I may have had a minor heart attack last night, being transferred to another hospital for Angiogram, needless to say no show today. And what happened was so the next morning I guess today it's so the thing happened on the seventh. So now it's the eighth. Posted at about midnight on July eighth so four years ago. From the from the hospital, and they kept me overnight. Because the enzymes whatever enzymes shows up, looked like I had a heart attack, so they wanted to transfer me the next morning to another hospital to get an angiogram. which they wound up doing so I transferred. Long story was much longer story than that had to fight with the United Healthcare for the ambulance to take me to the right hospital the hospital where the my cardiologists was at. So we fought and got it all taken care of but one thing. This hospital didn't tell me is when they did the x ray of my chest that they noticed a mass on my left lung. And it wasn't until the next day the next day when I was at the other hospital and and They are to have the. Angiogram you know the calf? To See if my order is were blocked that my cardiologists said. Did they tell you anything else at the hospital. I said no, just that. You know just just that. The my enzymes were elevated and he said. So. They didn't tell you. They found a mass on your long. no. So, that began my journey into learning that I had lung cancer, although it was still another couple of weeks away to get the diagnosis, but it was four years ago today that I learned from the other doctor from the cardiologists, not the not the doctor at the original hospital that I went to that. I had a mouse on my lung. It was also the day. You know I joke I kidd. The way that we discovered I had lung cancer was the. because. We thought I had a heart attack and I went to the hospital, and they did this chest X. Ray to see if my heart was enlarged and it showed. A mass on my left lung. Which started the ball rolling, but What happened with rent back? Then I had just a couple of months earlier started working with Randy Rhoads at the studio. She built up in Delray Beach. We were going to work together. And we started on the progressive voices network, and all that and we had I massive blow out of fight that day it was the seventh of July, so it would have been four years ago yesterday, and that's when I realized this relationship was not going to work. And I got home and I felt really bad, and I told David said I'M GONNA. Lie Down I. Just don't feel well all the way driving home something was wrong. And lay down. I took a nap and I woke up drenched in sweat. And that's when you know. We decided that I was going to go to the hospital, but it was also. The joke was afterwards. Randy Rhoads Made me. Have a heart attack, so she almost killed me, but she saved my life. So that's our little joke. If you ever hear me, say Randy almost killed me but save my life. That's why. So anyway. Yeah I'm coming up next a in the next couple of weeks. I'm supposed to go in for my. Quarterly or now it's twice a year cat. Scan to make sure I'm okay. What they tell you is when you make it through five years. Post Surgery, or once you go into remission then. You're cured and the only time they ever use the cured word with cancer so long story short for those of you who are Neil here? It was August thirtieth. That I wound up having surgery and they removed. To. To tumors from left long they removed the entirety of the lower left lobe that had the bigger mass, and then there was a smaller mass and the upper left. Lobe so they did a wedge recession and no gene. Just ask so. Was it also a heart attack? No, and that's the weird thing. My the cardiologists did the angiogram. You said your hearts beautiful. There is no problem there so something. Something intervened to say you know. Go get checked out. Because frankly we caught the cancer so early, even though it was to two separate and distinct tumors that were not related. Otherwise, it would have been a mistake metastasized. The second one would have been a metastasized tumor coming off the first one in would have been a lot worse off, but no two separate and distinct. Instances of lung cancer. They were not genetically related, which is the weird. But so. August thirtieth they'll be four years since the surgery and knock on laminate here I am. So. facebook. fucked up as it is. has some good reminders every now and then and especially you know Y- being this week the way it was losing to friends in the past week I realized just how precious life is and how everything changes in the you know flip of a switch in a New York second so. Now Anyway I'll keep you posted I'm I'm supposed to go to the The oncologist again next week, but you gotTA deal with insurance and getting the the referral in the approval for the cat scan, and so who knows because I? I've been putting it off because of the cove head because I don't really want to go to. Anywhere I don't want to go to Any doctor's office. Don't want to go. Have the cat scan? Don't want to go to the. Office, but you know we do what we do. You do what you have to do. All right so. Moving right along. I'll tell you what I've got news for you. We had the Supreme Court today with five count them. Five opinions left to deliver. gave us to. But they did tell us tomorrow will be the final day for the term that that well that that technically ended on June thirtieth. Tomorrow, we'll get the last three decisions I'll fill you in on all of that in just a moment, but let's try to take a break and I. Always say try because it doesn't always work, so we'll give it a shot because we need to try to get in some commercials on the progressive. Voices Network, we'll be right back so progressive voices is an ads while they're in commercials We'll do this. A little bit of Jim Hightower K.. Once again, my state of Texas is saddled with a Republican Gubernatorial Guber Greg Abbott is this guy's name and he's another incompetent. Right wing ideologue, whose botched handling of our states covid nineteen crisis makes Donald Trump look like a master administrator of public health I as a small minded small government zealot habit obsequious followed trump's lead of do nothing ISM pretending the bad thing will just drift away as a result, droves of Texans were dying so. So he rushed out to express astonishment and concern yet he cravenly refused to offend his corporate and far-right backers by putting such life, saving measures as business closures, requiring mess in public and stay at home orders worse, the Little Petty potentate infuriated local officials by banning them from taking protective actions in their communities. Bizarrely habit declared he was focused not on preventing infections, but on making sure there were enough hospital beds for those who get infected. Well have bragged that providing an adequate number of graves was his priority for sure enough thousands more Texans were soon dying because of his incompetence finally Abbott the absent, was forced to enact a stay at home mandate, but he declared it was not a stay at home order. Instead it was essential services and activities protocols. Then he got really strange after banning local officials from requiring mask-wearing, he declared. declared it hidden a trick door in that executive order. If they could divine the riddle, the trick was that while mayors and others could not require face mass, they could require stores, bars, offices, factories, and other businesses to require mass. This is Jim. hightower saying isn't that fun playing pandemic. Word Games with people's lives. Critics who save Republican leaders have no sense of humor. Haven't met Greg Abbott. HIGHTOWER's commentaries are brought to you by the hightower lowdown, the monthly newsletter with hightower's take on what Wall Street and Washington to for information visit hightower lowdown dot, Org. Every long for the lawlessness of the old. West! Now's your chance to rise above the law for a fistful of only sixty dollars new incorporate incorporate. You sorry. I'm inc.. Thanks to your apathy, the force amendment and your civil rights of been abolished corporations now have the rights of individual. Or this mule must die. Excuse me. Invasion of privacy such as reading private email tapping someone's phone, Grand Larceny, false imprisonment, child, rape and murder Europe of it all. If Iran cooperated be on accountable and incorporate now I'll one eight hundred. Do you like my new suit and tie? Well do you punk. This is a huge huge issue. and. We're talking about it. Nicole Sandler show on Nicole Sandler DOT com. Would help if I turn the microphone back on Yes that is book. Brittany Summers, and in case you're wondering on O'Brien was here with me on Monday we were both sort of out of our minds, a little bit having learned of the death of George Rodriguez with whom Brit. For years on the Neil Rogers show in fact, Georgia's who introduced me to Brit. And, and so he died on. Friday afternoon. And Yeah found out over the weekend. Brittany Summers is pretty putting together a massive memorial. We're GONNA do a broadcast on a weekend. It'll be pro, not this weekend, but next weekend. Either Saturday or Sunday do it here on my streams on my youtube channel on my audio stream at Nicole, Sandler Stream, dot, com, and and we'll let you know where else it'll be so yeah I know Phil Hendrie. who was worked with George. W IOT in Miami and others will be. Participating throughout the day so posted on that all right I guess I guess we should get to some of the news. All right, let's let's do it. Boy Short all right all right. Thank you, Bill, yeah! Okay. There's a lot of stuff all right all right all right bill. Thank you. Let me. Start with the Supreme Court because we got two more decisions today, there were five left the so that gives us three for tomorrow so. The first one. They gave us today what they were both having to do with religion in the Religion in the in the. Public Square something on the first one. The Supreme Court let's employers opt out of birth control coverage lovely and it was a seven two decision. The Supreme Court today upheld a trump administration regulation that let's employers with religious or moral objections limit women's access to birth control coverage under the affordable care act lovely, so as a consequence of this ruling about seventy to one hundred twenty six thousand women could lose contraceptive coverage from their employers. The vote was seventy two with of course justices. Ruth Bader GINSBURG and Sonia Sotomayor. Dissenting hold on I do have other I. my notes are all over the place on this one. Let me see. What I could find your the. Let's see it was this was. Actually, this was the second one they announced today. It, says the let's see the the case was a challenge to the two thousand seventeen rules issued by the trump administration that expanded the exemption from the affordable Care Act's breath control mandate. And the court let it hold on. I'm just blown away. The Supreme Court Lamar Retail. The in its seventy-two ruling sought to resolve a long-running legal battled previously vexed the justices how to strike the right balance between ensuring access to birth control and safeguarding religious freedom protections. But this explanation from Scotus blog, which is where I got this says the court's decision appears likely to revive debate over the culture war issue as the presidential election kicks into gear. Lovely? The other decision was. In a our lady of Guadalupe school versus Morrissey Baru and this decision was written by Alito. It was a seven to this time with Soda Myron Ginsburg, dissenting other just in backwards order. This was a case about whether courts could hear employment discrimination claims brought by teachers to teachers in Catholic elementary schools in California. or whether the teachers lawsuits are instead barred by the quote, ministerial exception, which bars ministers from suing churches and other institutions for employment discrimination, and the judges by a seven two vote decided that the answer is that the lawsuits are Bart. Here's the explanation it says although these teachers were not given the title of Minister, and have less religious training than the teacher. In another case in earlier case, involving the ministerial exception quote, we hold it there. Cases Fall within the same rule that dictated our decision in that other case Hosanna. Tabor the religious education and formation of students is the very reason for the existence of most private religious schools, and therefore the selection and supervision of the teachers upon whom the schools relied to do this work lie at the core of their mission. The sweeping result is. This this from the descent by. Sonia Sotomayor quote. This sweeping result is profoundly unfair. The court is not only wrong on the facts, but it's era also risks up ending anti discrimination protections for many employees of religious entities. She said one must hope that a decision deft enough to remold HOSANNA TABOR to fit. The result reached. Today reflects the courts capacity to cabin the consequences tomorrow, and she ends it by saying. I respectfully dissent. And that leaves three cases which we are told, they will hand down tomorrow morning at ten am so. It is. Yeah it's. Tomorrow we find out if Congress has a right and if the Manhattan District Attorney has a right to Donald Trump's financial records, including his tax returns. That's the one they're saving. Till the end there was another case still outstanding having to do with an forgive me for not having all the particular yet, but it has to do with. Indigenous Rights with with with an Indian reservation. And I promise by tomorrow I'll be up to date on it. But boy talk about. You know. Stretching out the ending and it certainly is all right. The other news story that I wanted to tell you about, and there's tons of news you can just go to. Nicole Sandler Dot Com and click on what's news to find out you know the rest of the news for today, but there was another story that broke since I. since I recorded. What's news this morning? And it has to do with Lieutenant Colonel Shandor Vin men remember him. He testified in the impeachment trial of Donald Trump, or was it during the inquiry think it was during the inquiry. An Alexander van men born in the Soviet Union. His parents brought he and his twin brother over from I. WanNa say Ukraine, but I could be. The former Soviet Union when they were just like three years old and Vin men worked in the NFC and well. Here's a little bit of his testimony while he was saying. He was reassuring his father. He was going to be okay. Here's here's He he said some of these words in his opening statement. This was He was asked by Congressman Maloney to repeat that part that ending of his opening statement and here's how it went. You still have your opening statement handy. I do. Read, the last paragraph for me again, not the one the very last one second last one. You read that one again for me. Accepting the American public deserves to hear it again. Star that's the one I think. My Dad would appreciate this one, too yeah. Dad. My sitting here today in the US capital and talking to our elected officials is proof that you made the right decision forty years ago to leave the Soviet Union come here to the United States of America in search of a better life for our family. Do not worry I'll be fine for the truth. Wow! You realize when you came forward out of sense of duty that you were putting yourself in direct opposition to the most powerful person. In the world. Do you realize that sir? I knew I was assuming a lot of risk and I'm short by their word. Don't war that phrase do not worry you dress to your dad. Was your data warrior? I did serve. It was a different military though. and. He would award eight if you were putting yourself up against the United States is that right? He deeply worried about it because in his context there was. It was the ultimate risk. And why do you have confidence that you can do that? And you tell your dad not to worry congressman because this is America. This is the country I've served defended. That all my brothers have served and here right matters here right matters here right matters. He said that was lieutenant. Colonel Alexander Vin. Men who today announced that he's retiring. He said all right. Citing a campaign of quote, bogeying intimidation and retaliation by Donald Trump after his impeachment testimony. Just reading from the New, York Times. The army officer, who had been attached to the National Security Council testified in the impeachment hearing that he was disturbed by trump's call with Ukrainian president volant Valetta. Mirror the Linski in which trump ask for an investigation of former vice president, Joe Biden and their son. Some government officials had recently expressed concern that the White House plan to veto vin promotion to colonel in retaliation for his role in the impeachment hearing, and actually we heard Tammy Duckworth put forth an amendment saying she's going to or put made a statement and said she's going to hold up every military promotion unless she gets into. That vin men's promotion will not be a flagged will not be held up and today. We learn that vitamin is retiring. Retiring we should all be ashamed. I just hope that when a new administration comes in that. They will reinstate vitamin and promote him as he should be promoted. This is sickening, but it just goes along with everything else from this administration. It's all sickening. It's all just sickening. All right one more very quick time out for our friends at the progressive voices network, and we'll be right back with Greg Mitchell and the beginning or the end question. I asked myself all the time. It sounds like a song lyric to, doesn't it? We'll be right back. All right so yla progressive voices in commercials will a little labor history in two and we'll be right back. I'm Rick Smith and this is Labor history and to. This Day in Labor history, the year was nineteen, thirty nine. That was the day. AFL President William Green called all affiliates to meet in Chicago, green sought to mobilize union leaders in a fight to restore prevailing wages on federal relief. Projects Building Tradesmen. Construction sites had started walking off the job in spontaneous strikes across the country three days earlier, the strike spread rapidly thirty six days quickly, turning into a nationwide walkout of over one hundred fifty thousand workers were outraged by provision in the latest Federal Relief Bill titled The would dramatic new terms established the one hundred and thirty hour rule essentially slashing wages by more than half it also called for a thirty day dismissal of all workers who had been on WPA rolls for eighteen months the AFL building trades. Department stated the act would quote destroy national wage standards established through fifty years of collective bargaining IB. W leader Daniel tracey added that forcing. Rage on federal relief. Workers would only a building contractors in private industry to do the same from Saint Louis to Rochester from Minneapolis to on picket lines were solid. Organizers work to build solidarity among unskilled WPA. Workers affected by the new starvation bill. Tens of thousands of strikers were fired in WPA ordered dismissals president. Roosevelt declared there could be no strikes against the federal. Federal Government Attorney General. Frank Murphy Former Michigan Governor during the flint. Sit down. Strike declared that striking against the government would build a fascist psychology. WPA administrators also threatened organizers with federal prosecution fines and jail time, but New York's building and Construction Trades Council leader Thomas Murray authorized a strike of thirty, two thousand. He avowed. This will be a strike to the finish. This is a huge huge issue. And we're talking about it. Though Nicole Sandler show Nicole Sandler DOT com. And we are back and I'm thrilled to be joined by our guest today. It's Greg Mitchell who's got a brand new book out called the beginning or the end. How Hollywood in America learned to stop worrying and love the bomb. There's a picture of it right up on the screen, so I don't have to actually hold up. Hey, greg thanks so much for joining us today very happy to be here. Thank you very much. It's my pleasure, so congratulations on the book I know it just released officially yesterday. And you had some really nice press including a lovely piece on at mother. Jones and Let's back up a second. The book is about a movie that frankly I had never heard of before and I was a little confused by the title before I opened the Book and started reading it 'cause the beginning or the end how Hollywood! America learned to stop worrying and love the bomb now. I'm a big fan of Dr. Strangelove and and that sort of. Well it it. It borrows a little bit from Dr Strangelove, or was it or how I learned to stop worrying and love the bomb. But this? This book is not about the strange love, which was a brilliant movie, but about a movie called the beginning or the end that was A. Big Budget Hollywood production. That was a major. Pardon the PUN bomb right. That's right, yes. Yes. Came from MGM in early, Nineteen. Forty seven And the book tells the tale of how it came to be and how it started out as a based on warnings from the scientists against the further development of the bomb making more powerful bombs, a nuclear arms race concerns about the use of the bomb against Japan actually in a letter from a Manhattan project. Scientists who was Donna reads. The actress Donna Routes High School Chemistry Teacher. He wrote her out of the blue and Hollywood and said you must. Get a movie made to stop this craziness from going forward and sure enough her. Her husband was a Hollywood agent, so he was able to sit down with the legendary MGM chief Louis B. Mayer. Signed off on the movie said it'd be the most important movie he ever made the first scripts then were. Very, much aligned with the scientist took that warning to heart, and then over the course of the next year after the intervention by the military and President Truman himself. The movie was transformed into pro bomb propaganda. And tried to settle this question forever of. The dangers of nuclear weapons and Of, and of course, we kind of seen what has happened since well. That's a mighty big question and I don't know that. We, we've fully answered the question, but I'm all right the movie I'm. I'm a interested in and it's a fascinating topic. I mean when I got the book. It's like wait. A minute is about. Is this about the the nuclear arms race is? It's about here. She met Nagasaki. Is that about a movie? But it's actually about all three, so the movie after we bombed Japan so horrifically on two occasions. To movie, Studios decided they were GonNa make a movie. The be all and end all movie about the bomb with that organic to the one that got made. It was mgm that you talk about, but you said also I think it was paramount. That was also having another script written that one by of all people Ayn rand that one never got made. Was this just organic that to studio said Ou we dropped two bombs. Let's let's make a movie about it. While this was seen perhaps accurately at the time as the most important development in human history now of years you know. We. We have to understand that the when the bomb was dropped on on Hiroshima, no one knew this even existed so on the same day that the bomb was used. The world also learned about the new energy atomic. Fission splitting the atom, and so on so forth so so the the people afterwards were legitimately concerned and worried about the future of the world as well they should be, but the official narrative of Russia came from the the White House in the military was at the use of the bomb against Japan was absolutely necessary. It ended the war. There were no other options and people. The vast majority of people accepted that they wanted to get on with the you know the post war era, and so this became kind of written in stone, and then here was this movie that threatens. Threatened that narrative, and also in that nineteen forty six that crucial your. Came John. Her sees famous a new. Yorker article about her ocean, which has been called by some people, the most important article in a magazine in the century. That to raise questions about the use of the bomb and future use and radiation something we were pooh-poohing at the time, so nineteen forty-six was a year of great threats to this official narrative, so the the book really follows in following this movie, which as you've said? Few people heard about even though it's shown on Turner Classic. Streaming you can see it. It exists Just in looking at this one movie, we can see how that official narrative was developed. Talent was threatened all the different arguments, and then how it was overcome. Thanks to Truman. In the Pentagon became written in stone and You know seventy five years later. We haven't at least in public opinion gone that far beyond it. No in fact, oh, so so look. Obviously I rarely can say this anymore, but it was a little before my time. So. Yeah, the, but still to this day as horrific as the results were I mean we've all seen the pictures from there. We all know what those what damage those bombs did. There are still people today who say well. We had to do it. We had no choice. Now Greg Mitchell. When when I first met you. We met on twitter some years ago. You were writing for the nation and I didn't realize your background on this subject. You're the former editor of nuclear. Times magazine I did not know that I did yeah, and you have a number of books and projects on this subject. So this is your. Area of expertise or one of them. Anyway, what do you do you think that that was a necessity that we had to? Drop these bombs on Japan back to end World War Two. Great historical debate and you know. Admittedly it's not exactly black and white. Their arguments on all sides tried to be respectful of all the different arguments, and there there are some there are a lot of good ones. A lot of evidence that can be interpreted in different ways, but I came after years of being sort of a little bit decided myself to feel that that the bomb should not have been used at that time. That Truman did have other alternatives. There were other options He could've taken another day another week another month. you know the the main argument is often that. We saved a million lives because of the prevented invasion, but an invasion was not even plans November and you know there was time to try other things rather than leave this legacy, not even putting aside the hundred and fifty, thousand, two hundred thousand Japanese civilians who died mainly women and children. even if you wanted to put those aside and I don't want to you still have this legacy of the use of the bomb that the bomb was used, and so we have sort of the hype, which is these bombs are terrible to be used and yet we use them. Yeah, and it's so important today you know people might say well. Who Do you know why shouldn't care about this movie? Why should we care that? The bomb was used to. We can't change it, but in fact we can care about it because. What's been been passed on to US largely by the media, which every every year now this is the seventy fifth anniversary. That's maybe why we're talking here. the. There will be a flood of of story soon. about the bomb, and if it's usually, you're in the media the vast majority will support you know the endorsed the use of the bomb. And, the danger with AD is at most people don't know is that we have still have a i. use policy as feeling. Wow, it is still official US policy to use. The bomb is a first strike. not in retaliation to a nuclear attack we. Failsafe or one of those things. But as a first strike and Against a conventional attack or even just a threat you know with these headlines today about North Korea again with North Korea. Alleged? Bomb facilities, and so on and so forth so. You know, and of course now we have a president. Trump and people sometimes joke about well. He's got the nuclear codes. y'All. Small thing, but he has the codes, and he has the policy first-strike policy and he has opinion polls. Are Recent opinion polls have shown that the forty to fifty percent of Americans. would endorse a first strike on CHR-, North Korea or Iran. If we are threatened. It's so you come back to the same. Argument that was made with Japan which was to save American lives. which you know, we try to out. Anytime we want. To end a war. End, the threat so. This movie from almost seventy five years ago. And the book I hope. encapsulates all this you know it's Kinda shows how we got there and shows the you know the arguments. Then that were brought to bear by Truman and the Pentagon to revise this movie even to Sri Shooting key scene with Truman. And getting the actor playing him fired interesting Is that You know it's the same thing that drives us today with the Solution Manera, the we, we must toe the line on the other necessity of using the bomb, and making bigger, bigger and more powerful bomb so I'd like to think the book. Kind of captures all that and just you know two hundred and eighty pages. Right but but one of the things. That's so fascinating about this is that? An independent movie studio was making this big budget Hollywood blockbuster as it was built to be. And, the administration gets wind of the story line and says wait a minute. We want to change that and they did. I mean thinking about like today. If anything like that could ever happen and I don well I guess it depends who's making. The movie was MGM sympathetic to Truman was was that they allowed them some creative control over this film. That was already in production. It went down a road over the course of a few months. mean the first crucial decision was made. They sat down with Truman in the Oval Office and pretty much gave him a script approval. Glad they did a con contract with General Leslie Groves, who was the head of the Manhattan project extremely right wing Macho, figure Trumpian, you might say a crate. Mom Contract with them, and gave him ten thousand dollars, which was a small fortune back then and script approval, so he, as I was able to finally after all these decades document by going to the motion, Picture Academy Library going through every script. was able to chart. Win and how these revisions were made. grows at memos with fifty changes. He wanted in one one fell swoop. And then it culminated in. The following October when they finally had to Washington screening and Truman's top aide attended was outraged about how his. Decision to use the bomb was pictured and they truman agreed driven saw the script, and they order to retake so GM. Easiest Pie along with. Word toward the. President and his press secretary rewrote the rewrote the script arts and script and MGM took every word film that exactly as it was dictated by the White House so. Shocking not after all this time. It kind of is, and they even replaced as you said the the actor who was originally originally playing Truman and there was already a directive that they can only shoot him from behind so so I mentioned at the onset that that there was an excerpt published in Mother Jones magazine. They also have a clip from the movie. which is the scene in the Oval Office where you see Truman from behind? I Guess Tha, Tha. I'm GONNA play this clip. It's only two and a half minutes. Hopefully I don't get. That is the scene they rewrote. This. Rewritten the rewritten seen all right so here we go. It's a clip from the beginning or the end. Charlie. I WanNa tell you our nation's top secret. It was remained just that top secret of course. We have developed the most fearful weapon ever forged by a man. And at comic bomb. Even the word is frightening. It's been tested and it works. It's a harnessing of the basic power of the universe in peace time, atomic energy could be used to bring about a golden age, such an age of prosperity, and well being the world has never known. In war. This same energy as destructive power, almost beyond the comprehension of. It's clear now. What the words prompt another destruction mean? Thank God we've got the bomb, not the Japanese. If, they had it, they'd surely use it on us. That's one argument for are using a challenge, but it's not the decisive argument. The whole thing is terrifying. You must spent many sleepless nights over it. I've consulted with Mr. Churchill with all my top military and naval advisers, I've talked for the civilian heads of our war effort, and all these advisers tell me the bomb will shorten the war by at least a year where we going to use it. As another question I had to think about. The army has selected several Japanese cities as prime military targets because of war industries, military installations troop concentrations of fortifications. We are going to shower all these places for ten days with leaflets, telling population to leave telling them what's coming? And we hope these warnings will save lives it should. and. If the bomb shortens the war, it will save many thousands of American lives. A year less of war. Charlie will mean life for three hundred thousand, maybe a half a million of America's finest youth. I don't do that, but it'll mean life for thousands of British of Russians of Chinese of Japanese. These were the decisive considerations in my consent. President of the United States. You could make no other decision. As President I could not. Oh, my so I have told the army to take the bomb to the Marianas and received the green light. To use it. Oh Boy That is. That's some pretty strong propaganda there. And so. I'm guessing that's why the movie didn't do very well at the box office was at all that kind of. Pacing was in that kind of preaching. Partly, but thanks to these revisions. The movie was delayed several months, and so, what was seen what was going to be a? You know a quick hit. A major movie, but get it out quickly after this incredibly Historic event, was delayed. A year and a quarter. So by that time, people were starting to turn the page, but you. The movie itself turned out to be to be pretty bad and even the people who signed with. The, we mentioned the Ayn rand. Sub, sub subplot in the book, which is quite lengthy in in a way about the competing will be, but the another subplot is how mgm had had to get the. Signed releases from all the famous scientists. Oppenheimer lead Baliles Lard. Enrico Fermi and so they made desperate attempts to get these and. Eventually all the scientists went along with it while mocking the movie mocking the scrutiny in private. Yet they went. It went along with it, so there wasn't really a profile of courage anywhere there. You might say but but that's. When the movie was released, it was accepted by the people who didn't see it as well. The fact that's it's considered one of the early examples of the Hollywood. docudrama right and and that was. Then as now I suppose. Seen as a factual, mainly factual presentation I. Mean we don't have time, but I could go through the scene. You just saw with fact by fact. And things that are made in it. but you know that's the way it went, and it turned out to be to be significant, even though it was not the. Not Number one at the box office right so Donna Reed was not in this film her her participation was only in getting her husband involved. Okay, so I was wondering where she came into play, so Greg Mitchell all right so the Ayn rand movie. They shelved that they never did anything with it. This one got made. It wasn't the blockbuster. It should have been, but you do again. Have a nod to. One, the best movies on the subject in my view anyway. Dr? Strangelove, which I haven't got through the whole book yet but I. Don't think you deal with that movie in this book. Do just in the title. In the epilogue. Movies? I mean the the I. Guess the main, and I have to say that maybe I was stated to do this book because. When I was a teenager, my favorite movie was Dr Strangelove I still considered Navy my all time favorite movie, maybe the greatest movie of the Post War era so I kind of feel like I was spaded to do this, but The the main point that they make at the end of the book is that. For some reason and probably pretty clear, what the reason is seventy five years. Hollywood is a made three movies about the actual use of the bomb making use of the bomb. This movie Mgm made another movie five years later by the pilot, Paul Tibbets, and then not until nineteen ninety when. Roland Joffe made that man and little boy. Some people will remember right. Those are the only three movies out of Hollywood, and seventy five years now there have been many movies Dr Strangelove like failed safe, you can go down the list, wargame and so forth. That have touched on or been. You know really kind of brilliant. treatments of nuclear fear. You know of nuclear threat what for some reason Hollywood will not tackle the origin story or the original sin of you if you will. And it's because it's just. It's tough subject for Americans. You know like we did it. You know we did it. We kind of covered it up we defended it to this day seventy five years later, and it's not like the Nazis kind of easy to make movies about the Nazis because they. They weren't us, and actually we. We then defeated them. But you know Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Were our at our hand. Now there's great debate over whether of maybe it was acceptable but you know it was at our hand and raises a all those questions. It's very one of the most revealing things about the movie. Briefly is simply that. They in the scripts. As they were developed, they eliminated every single reference to Nagasaki Real, so you can watch this movie and you'd never know. There was a second bomb, and of course the reason is is that. Even many many people who support the Russian decision feel that Nagasaki was a totally unnecessary. Even a war crime you know in Nagasaki is sometimes referred to as a war crime and I would endorse that after you know my study and. so forth so So it's kind of obvious why they WANNA. CUT It out, but yet there it was. It was the nearly scripts to it was You know a good part of the movie and as the months went on. You know it got jettisoned land I think. You know you could just make that one. Make that one statement and tell a lot about the what the book is about I. Suppose What what the movie ended up being well, it's a it's a fascinating take on a story a subject that we've talked about for seventy five years now to bring cinema into it and how the government? Coerce the filmmakers to try to you know, propagandize it I, think is fascinating, because allegedly. We don't have propaganda here which. Sorry can't say that straight face, but Greg Mitchell. In addition to this the new the new book, of course just out yesterday, the beginning or the end how Hollywood in America learned to stop worrying and love the bomb. You wrote two other books on the subject. You have with Robert Jay Lifton Hiroshima in America and the second book atomic up so as we are in the seventy fifth year. What what do you want people to take away from the experience? What do you want them to think seventy five years later about what? We did this original sin if you will. Well. There's a lot a lot that could be said, but as I said earlier, I think if you WanNa take an activist view. What can we do now and I guess it would be to right talk. Speak out whatever you can there there will be demonstrations coming up for August six and August nine Whatever can be done to? Resend this I use policy? It's debated by the experts year. There's always there sometimes things introduced in Congress. So Make this story about today and this very very dangerous precedent we set. In nineteen forty-five, which as long as we continue to endorse it, it lays the groundwork for use again. Because same arguments can be can be made today absolutely and. You did say. Dr Strangelove one of your favorite films. Would you recommend people then go watch that after reading your book because just to give you a little. I don't know different perspective on things well I. Suppose. Maybe it's not a different perspective. It's sort of what one thing leads to the next. You know and I. Don't know whether trump is more of more, general, Jack, the, ripper or more doctor strange well. It's it's. It's kind of humorous. People find general ripper. You know so over the edge and that could never happen today. When in fact. Jenna ripper had to take over that base and mess with the security codes where we have a president who appears to be just as nutty a WHO has the nuclear codes and the grief case next to him every day. Maybe. It's not so funny now. Is kind of hysterical right dark humor, but we're. We're living in a dark humor UH era that's. Maybe, not so funny. No and I'll repeat what I said so many times that nobody if you wrote the script of what we're going through today, Donald Trump becomes president has the nuclear codes. We have a an addition to everything else. That's gone on in the last three and a half years then we come down with global pandemic of covid nineteen, and we're all walking around wearing face masks and the press except for the president. You couldn't get a movie like that made. Because it was, it would be too far out of the realm of. Conceivable possibilities and yet here we are so I guess they say the truth is stranger than Fiction Anyway Greg Mitchell. The book is now out the beginning or the end, and maybe you'll want to go back and watch this movie I guess with the streaming everything anything is possible. Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to talk with you. We've talked online for years. I don't think we've never done this before so I really appreciate you coming on today very happy to be here. Thanks all right. You take care. Bye. All right and with that we're done. We'll see tomorrow it's. Will be here and the Supreme Court. Who? Keep your fingers crossed.

Hollywood Donald Trump Greg Mitchell president America President Truman MGM Nicole Sandler Supreme Court Nagasaki United States Dr. Strangelove Japan founder heart attack Manhattan Randy Rhoads ECHO lung cancer Angiogram
"Have You No Decency, Sir?"

HISTORY This Week

25:18 min | 9 months ago

"Have You No Decency, Sir?"

"History this week. June ninth nineteen fifty four. I'm sally home. Twenty million Americans are watching a Senate hearing on TV. It's a battle between the United States army. And a man named Joseph McCarthy. They're arguing about communists. Anybody got anything anybody working for McCarthy. You. At this point McCarthy is known as the nation's top communist hunter. And on one of the last days of these hearings, the people watching on TV see him do the things he's famous for. He accuses someone of having ties. To Communism. When he makes this accusation McCarthy looks calm. He's done this a million times. He's holding his glasses in one hand sort of toying with them. Meanwhile, the guy on the other side of these hearings is getting angrier and angrier. His name is Joseph Welsh. He's the lawyer for the army. A pillar of the establishment. He's wearing a bow tie. And as he listens to McCarthy Talk Welsh takes his glasses off. Put them back on puts his hand on his forehead. He's agitated. McCarthy keeps talking. Until finally Welsh cuts him off. Little, did I dream? You could be so reckless. And so cruel. As to do an injury that left McCarthy starts to respond and Welsh kind of loses it. His glasses are now entirely off. and. He utters these words only stamps. These are at long. Abby left no. Eason's. Have you know decency? Senator McCarthy has risen to power during a time of great fear in America his name has become synonymous with anti-communism and with baseless life ruining accusations. This hearing will be the end of him today. What made McCarthy so powerful in the first place? And how did that very same thing eventually bring him down? Hey if you enjoy listening to history this week and want even more great educational content checkout history at. An all new digital initiative from history. With virtual history lessons that roll out every week on Monday Wednesday and Friday. From a diverse group of presenters that include Max Brooks Laurence Fishburne Billie Jean King, Padma, Lakshmi, Dan Abrahams, Brad, meltzer, Kevin Frazier Brian Unger and many many more history at home offers families of fun, free way to experience inspirational, and thought provoking content for students of all ages. History at home videos are easily accessible at history on facebook, igt twitter Youtube and history dot com follow at history on all platforms and stay up to date with history at home. Did I. Tell You that I actually saw it law. Ellen Strecker was in ninth grade during the Army McCarthy hearings, and she happened to turn on the TV when Joseph Welch delivered those famous words. It was totally serendipitous. We turn on the hearings and there was. Have you no decency. Sir Schreker is now one of the historical experts on McCarthyism. She's written three books about it. I sort of view myself as MS McCarthyism, you know when you Google McCarthyism, you usually get me on the first page in the Nineteen Fifties McCarthy Ism meant accusing a person or group of being a communist or a sympathizer. And therefore a supposed- threat to America. says the term is a bit of a misnomer. Because the whole thing started before Senator McCarthy came on the scene. It started in the nineteen forties. You could talk about it as the home front of the Cold War. After World War Two superpowers that come out on top the US and the Soviet Union become each other's number one enemy. There is a kind of Idi Communist. Consensus in the country driven by the Cold War and a belief that may be communist are in some way endangering American security. Communists stealing secrets. A lot of this was unfounded. But to be fair. There were spies. So, there's this rising fear in the country. In response in nineteen forty seven president. Harry Truman Enoch something known as the loyalty order. It, says that federal employees will be investigated to make sure they're loyal to the US. And they can be punished. They're not. In a series of dawn raids, FBI agents swooped down. Communists indicted on judges of advocating the violent overthrow of the government. This gets a little out of control, arguably stepping on people's constitutional rights, and then in nineteen, forty nine American fears of communism hit new heights. People assume we had in monopoly over nuclear power than in nineteen, forty nine. The Russians detonate an atomic bomb. How did the Russians get the atomic bomb spies so anti? Fervor is getting stronger. And it's been leading to overreach and hysteria. People accused of communism were blacklisted, which meant careers lives stopped in their tracks. There were accusations flying against all kinds of people after in. Hollywood musicians elementary school teachers and government officials. The Democrats control the White House and the Republican Party seize an opportunity to win it back, so they pick up an anticommunism crusade as a part of their campaign as early as nineteen forty eight. In the midst of all that in nineteen fifty, Republican Senator Joseph McCarthy enters the fray. He's a junior senator from Wisconsin and he's not an obvious power player, he says. Shali Irishman very folks see a very hard. Working at least initially wants to be liked you once a lot of attention. He knows how to get it. In February of Nineteen Fifty McCarthy, stands up before the Ohio County Women's Republican Club in wheeling. West Virginia And claims that he knows the names of more than two hundred government officials who are part of the Communist Party. And that propelled him into the headlights right away. He's sort of validating explaining to people who are kind of upset about what's going on in the world, and he creates this conspiracy theory. It's Communist in the State Department. Selling out the United States simple. Zach. McCarthy's charges surpass any other accusations to date. and. He's pointing a finger at the Democratic Truman Administration. And the Republican Party which finds it a very politically powerful narrative support said. McCarthy becomes the face of anti-communism. Now Truman is able to fight back. He's well liked popular, but in June of nineteen fifty. With the outbreak of the Korean War McCarthy's charges. All of a sudden have much more power because the United States is enough fighting war shooting war with communists and McCarthy's crusade ignites. He gains notoriety because charges are so wild. He doesn't seem to care whether he's telling. The truth or not. And people become afraid of in. Even fellow senators. In the nineteen fifty, a senatorial elections, several senators who had stood up against him, lost their elections and McCarthy is seen as somehow uniquely powerful. He's still targeting officials in the Truman. Administration and the Republicans hope that they might be able to beat the Democrats in the upcoming presidential election in nineteen fifty two Republican Party presents a united front generalizing Halloween over Senator Taft. Balancing eight hundred and forty five nominee white D Eisenhower a highly respected army veteran after forty years of distinguished army service is nomination is popular detested to buy the plane from the orange is in many ways helping Eisenhower's campaign by painting the Democrats as soft on communism but Eisenhower hates McCarthy. One of McCarthy's main targets is General George Marshall. Who Was Truman Secretary of State and was is. Mentor Eisenhower is an army man and McCarthy's attacks on General Marshall. Feel personal while campaigning in nineteen fifty two is our wants to come to Marshall's defense in speeches, but he is dissuaded from doing that. Powerful figures say no. Don't do that and he pulls FAC. McCarthy was too valuable. Political Miracle Century begins to take fall. Of Americans go to the polls to elect a president in the nineteen fifty two election Eisenhower beats the Democrat Adly Stevenson meaning that after twenty years the GOP is back in the White House. And despite their beef, Eisenhower appoints McCarthy. Chairman of the Senate Committee on government operations. He has his own committee to go looking for spies inside the government and he goes wild. But under this popular Republican, war hero President. The political narrative is different. It becomes harder in some ways for McCarthy to say. The Eisenhower administration is stocked with Communists. There is a growing feeling that may be the witch. Hunters have run out of witches. Are Beginning to realize that McCarthyism is going too far that they're attacking people who are unjustly attacked. There are people journalists opposing politicians who are trying to bring McCarthy down a peg, but it's not their moment. People were afraid of his power, but when he begins to attack the armor. That is the moment at which his career is going to flounder. If, you are enjoying history this week. You check out flashback a new podcast from the iheartradio podcast network and ozzy the creators of the chart topping webby nominated podcast the thread, the law of unintended consequences is a simple, but often misunderstood rule of the universe. Flashback explores the reasons. Some of our best laid plans have gone awry from policy making personal lives from the courtroom to the environment, and it reveals those surprising stories that the history books never told you about Ozzy's. Sean Boswell takes you on a journey through history that will change how you look at the road today. Listen to flashback on the iheartradio, APP Apple, podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. In nineteen, fifty, four, a young lawyer from New York starts to work with McCarthy's Senate, Committee Roy Cohn. He become a notorious communist hunter himself. He had tried Julius and Ethel Rosenberg to famous communist spies, but cone was keeping a secret of his own comb is very gay, and of course concealing being gay in nineteen, fifty four was not socially accepted. In fact, it was legal. And it had been painted as a threat to national security. Theory is a sort of lavender scare against gay people on security grounds. The idea was that if people were a, they could easily be blackmail. Cone himself is notorious for investigating state. Department officials being gay, and at the same time rumours were circulating about his own sexuality. And about his relationship with a young man named G David Shine. David shine was hired by McCarthy's Committee and he and Roy Cohn go overseas to Europe and they engage in things like pillow fights in lobbies of hotels and behave very sophomore. Shall we say? In nineteen fifty four shine gets drafted into the army. And cone gets involved. He didn't want shine to get shipped overseas. Cone has friends in high places, and he has the powerful feared Joseph McCarthy on his side. So he calls up the secretary of the army. The two of them have several charged phone calls with cone, essentially demanding shine, get special treatment to ensure that he can get a cushy job that requires him to spend most of his time in New York City at. He can take off whenever wants to that. He doesn't have to do kitchen work and it works. Shine gets a cushy job, but the army has also secretly recorded. These telephone calls. That will become a big problem. When McCarthy later turns his witch hunt to the army, all the low hanging fruit has been picked. He was really floundering looking for anything he could find. But junior senator from Wisconsin had. Permanent, senatorial, investigating subcommittee leveled and accusing finger at the United States army. He claimed cuddling of Communist within its midst, basing his case on the giving of an honorable discharge to captain who had refused to sign a loyalty recklessly. McCarthy ripped into the reputation of both Brendan Poor like in his attack on the army, and it's James. And this is the moment when Eisenhower says okay. What can we do with this guy and so icenhower turns against him? Eisenhower wants to undermine McCarthy Remember he's an Army Guy Himself, and in general the senators, baseless claims are becoming a political liability plus McCarthy is an increasingly belligerent alcoholic. And on March Eleventh Nineteen fifty four. The army releases their recordings. Accusing McCarthy and Cohn of pressuring them to give preferential treatment to g David. Shine and Eisenhower establishes this special investigation to investigate. What happened to David Shine in the army. was He using undue influence to get special treatment and uses these investigations? David Shine and Roy Cohn as a way to undermine McCarthy's power. McCarthy doesn't back down. He countercharges. He's like we didn't pressure you to give shine this cushy GIG. You did that to try and convince me not to expose people in the army who are communist traders. On April twenty, second nineteen, fifty four. Senator Step Down from his committee championship, so he might defended case against the army in a public hearing before the committee in these hearings, Roy Cohn and McCarthy will represent themselves and a lawyer named Joseph Welsh will represent the army. Joseph Welch was just the quintessential establishment. Out of what we would call a white shoe law firm in Boston well, just been preparing carefully for these hearings. McCarthy's tactics. He has to be ready for the senator to cry Communism. So before the hearings begin welcomes goes out to dinner with two young lawyers on the case. And he asks. Is there anything in your past or in your presence that you should tell me that would disqualify you and this young turning named Fred Fisher Sis, yes, when I was at Harvard law school I, belong to an sation, called the national lawyers guild, which has been attacked as a communist front organization and Welsh says. Thank you very much. Why don't you stay in boss? Fisher is off the case Welt knows. This would be too big a liability in the hearings. And McCarthy does go after him. That could ruin Fisher's career. Invoked before the hearings, Welsh makes a back room deal with Conan McCarthy. They agree not to bring up. This young lawyer Fred Fisher if Welsh won't bring up the fact that Roy Cohn who had been accepted to west point. Failed his physical. In nineteen fifty four America, that would have been a huge embarrassment. And so. On April twenty second. The army McCarthy hearings come to order press and television faithfully recorded the day-by-day clash to adversaries in what soon turned into a monumental mudslinging contest. Twenty million Americans are watching on TV. These hearings in a sense may television as much as television named the hearings, the hearings last week's and go on. The public is seeing McCarthy's. Tactics up close and they don't like what they see. You The bay. He attacked the army's council. Often attorney. Joseph Welch the ISM of McCarthyism was beginning to fade. And then on June ninth nineteen fifty four. McCarthy's image shatters I. Remember seeing this moment. That was just jaw dropping. Here's the backstory. McCarthy had a Martini lunch and after lunch when the hearing start up again. He's a little out of it. Welsh and cone start going at it. Lawyer to lawyer Kona saying he knows the names of one hundred and thirty communist spies in American defense plants and Welsh is taunting him kind of mock, pleading with cone to find those communists before sundown. The You be that must be right. It had to be. What I might like to do and what should be done at thank. God do anything you wish to Europe by found down. and. McCarthy with maybe a few too many Martinis in him. Takes this whole exchange a little personally. When he has the chance to speak. McCarthy says I have something to tell you. Do you know you have young men in your law firm who belongs to a Communist organization? which is incredibly damaging that automatically would blacklists and and. McCarthy is making this charge at a nationally televised hearing that everybody's been watching for weeks. And it's just extraordinary Welsh is incredulous. Comb looks horrified, even tries to lean over and get McCarthy to stop. Talking Nail was prepared. He didn't trust. McCarthy Welsh tries to reason with him. Propane we not rob you know along. I met a call. At. The I did do I know. How could you do this? How could you ruin this young man's life? McCarthy doesn't get it. He just plain doesn't get it. He continues. which is when Welsh delivers the final blow? No sense of decency, Sir at long laugh. Avenue, left no ends of Jesus. and. Everybody gets all of us. Who are watching get? Everybody heard about McCarthy making unfounded accusations against people in ruining their lives, and they're seeing it live. All of a sudden, the emperor has us. The only person who doesn't get it is McCarthy himself. All of a sudden is. McCarthy left alone in this hearing room. Everybody else is sort of leaving and. He doesn't realize what he's done. Strecker told us. Public opinion was ready to turn on McCarthy that had been building for a while, but this moment is powerful political theater. That moment of have you? No decency sort of encapsulates the fact that McCarthy who symbolizes McCarthy is is now no longer legitimate. From that point on he comes under attack, not just from Democrats and liberals, but other members of the Republican Party. In the fall, McCarthy is insured the Senate mainly for his attacks on the army. Once he censured. He pretty much falls apart. He's lost his power. Three years later, McCarthy dies from complications of alcoholism. He was only forty eight. Now, McCarthyism was always bigger than McCarthy. And even after he's discredited by. Have you no decency even after he dies. McCarthyism sputters on into the early sixties. But. There's a reason people were so captivated by McCarthy himself sometimes aber characters gain political power. What made him so powerful? was that kind of lack of self consciousness pressing the envelope twenty had no evidence whatsoever. That kind of thing was something that he was willing to do. He was taking risks. At first this helped him and his political allies. But ultimately it was the very thing that brought him down. That character appearance was useful until he went too far. Thanks for listening to history this week for more moments throughout history that are also worth watching. Check your local TV listings to find out what's on history today. This podcast is produced by mckanie. Lynn limit. Gruber Ben Dickstein and meet Sally home. Our editor and sound designer is Chris. Yellow and our researcher is Emma Fredericks are executive producers are Jesse cats and Ted Butler don't forget to subscribe rate and review history this week wherever you get your podcasts. and. We will see you next week.

Republican Senator Joseph McCa McCarthy Welsh army Eisenhower Roy Cohn United States army Joseph Welch Democrats Republican Party Senate senator United States Republican Party David Shine cone Communist Party Wisconsin White House president
Buried Treasure: Out of the closet 60 years too late

Skullduggery

31:29 min | 2 years ago

Buried Treasure: Out of the closet 60 years too late

"No, it was April nineteen Fifty-three sixty five years ago that one of our most admired presidents signed one of the most shocking edicts in modern American history. It was the height of the Cold War and white Eisenhower and only recently taken office amid fears fuelled by Senator Joseph McCarthy that subversives hiding within the US government were a danger to the national order. It was in that context that Eisenhower signed executive order one. Oh, four five. Oh, declaring that alongside communism sexual perversion. And those were the words that were used were a threat to national security. I have of order became the trigger for a massive purge of the federal workforce. In the years that followed tens of thousands of government employees were investigated and fire for the crime of being gay the full story of executive order one. Oh, four five. Oh. And it's terrible consequences has only started to get the. Attention. It deserves in recent years. But now in new book has cast fascinating new light on the story. It's a biography of the man behind the executive order ice first national security adviser, Robert Bobby Cutler, junior a blue blood progressive Republican from a prominent Boston family a Harvard. Graduate a wealthy banker in US army general during World War Two Cutler was one of the most influential staffers in the Eisenhower White House and oversaw the drafting of the harsh anti-gay executive order. What was not publicly known at the time. But which revealed in the new book is that he was also a closeted gay man tormented by his sexual identity infatuated with a young national security staffer many years his junior. How did a gay man come to help write an edict that caused so much harm to gaze throughout the federal government? We'll talk to the author of the book ice mystery, man. The secret lives of Robert Cutler on today's. Episode of buried treasure. Because people have got to know whether or not their president's while I'm not a crook. I told the American people I did not create arms hostile my heart. And my best intentions still tell me that's true. But the facts and the evidence tell me it is not I did not have sexual relations with that one. There will be no lies. We will honor the American people with the truth and nothing else. I'm Michael Isikoff. Chief investigative correspondent for Yahoo news, and I'm Dan CLYDE, men entered and chief of Yahoo news, and we are joined now by Peter Schinkel, a Saint Louis journalist and the author of this amazing new book. Peter, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for having me. I gotta say only in recent years learned about the story of the executive order when we were doing the uniquely doing uniquely nasty a documentary about the US government's persecution of gays, and it's such it was such a shocking order, especially in today's context. But the idea that there was a guy Robert Cutler behind it who was a closeted gay man himself is kind of a kindle learning that Roger Teini, the author of the infamous dread, Scott decision was a secret African American slave. It's hard to come up with an analogy. But peter. Tell us how you got onto this story. Well, it was back in the summer of two thousand six I was on a family vacation in Rhode Island with my mother and father and one day. I asked my mother and her sister who was there that day. Tell me a little bit about your uncle, Bobby. I'd heard that he had an association with President Eisenhower. But I didn't know the depth of it at all. So Bobby Cutler was your great uncle, correct? Right. And did you know him? I do I never met him. He died in nineteen seventy four right. And he was one of five brothers born and raised in Boston. My grandfather, John Cutler was his eldest, brother. He was the baby of the five to fast forward to that family vacation. That's where my mother and her sister revealed that he was gay and knowing that the nineteen fifties was a time of remarkable strictures in American life. I began to suspect there. Was a significant story there right away. But presumably at this point, you didn't know his role in overseeing the writing of this executive order one zero four five. Oh, correct. I had no idea. How did you find out about that? I found out about that by going through the files at the Eisenhower library where I made a number of trips over the years and going through the files, and that's when it began to come out. And what was your reaction when you saw that given his own personal history. Well, I was amazed. And I immediately began to try to figure out what exactly did he know about the order. Did he understand the impact that it would have was he actually a person of anti-gay animus or was he a victim of the anti-gay attitudes of the day? And I began looking for evidence that where we could try to understand what exactly was going on. What do we know about Ike? What did I feel about gays and the answer? To those questions are difficult to dredge out of the materials because these folks didn't write down this the people who wrote it down would be say McCarthy or Hoover who as you pointed out in your very fine documentary uniquely nasty issued a memo calling for agents around the country to report sexual deviates says he called them the sexual deviates program. Exactly. So that there's put in writing we're going to go after these guys, but Bobby was didn't put a lot in writing about why he wanted this one piece of evidence that came forward was earlier in one thousand nine hundred eighty three almost one of the first scandals that hit the administration was I- nomination of Charles Bohlen, a very experienced diplomat to be the embassador to Russia and McCarthy immediately held this up and began saying that he was a security risk and began. Rumors began going around the capital did he was security risk that was a code. Added term for homosexual. And indeed the files reflect that he had collected from the State Department allegations that he was a homosexual the fact is that he was also at the Alte cords and was a translated for Roosevelt and that he was deemed by McCarthy to be too liberal. And that was really the source of McCarthy's animist Bowen, right? He he viewed bowling as part of the liberal establishment. That was selling out the country the allegations about Boland's private life were completely uncorroborated career completely. Yeah. Completely and he was just using the homosexuality allegations to achieve a political goal. But ultimately, I stood by him and one of haute, which is one of the first defeats of McCarthy in congress by and it was after that grueling experience, however, which was a national drama, by the way, where the word homosexuality, and sexual perversion were never said. Ed or written about publicly, but this entire drama played out in the nation's capital at that time, I said gush in a comment to secretary of state Dulles. We should try to avoid this happening in the future. We should get these things out. And so it seems like I was hoping to have sexual perversion allegations investigated before his nominees came into the public. So he didn't have to face the grief. He God over the bowl in nominate wrecked. That's beneficial interpretation of what I was trying to achieve. So, you know, Peter, your book sheds all of this light on this tragic history and these terrible policies, but it's also an incredibly poignant and painful personal story of your great uncle, Bobby Cutler, first of all tell us about how you learned about his private anguish inside of the White House. The documents that you discovered and then tell us a little bit about that story. Sure. When I went to the Eisenhower presidential library to do my research. They connected me with a man named Stephen Benedict. And Stephen had actually been on the Eisenhower campaign train in the fall of nineteen fifty two and he worked rewriting speeches and performing a broad array of activities in support of the campaign was there on that campaign train. He got to know migrate uncle Robert Cutler who also was working very closely with like writing speeches, crafting policy positions and generally keeping the candidate company telling jokes. He was a very musing entertaining man as well and could cut the tension of political situations and raise the candidates spirits. So Stephen who is then much younger. He was about twenty six years old bedtime had got to know, Bobby. Who was then, of course in his fifties. And they became friends after I won the election. Steve. Even introduced Bobby to Stevens former lover who was a man named skip coon's and skip was a navy intelligence operative. He was a Russian speaker at the time he was working for a CIA front called amp lib and living in Paris helping to launch anti-soviet radio broadcasts. He was as vigorous a patriot. As you as you could imagine in those days after his experience working with the US navy as an intelligence officer in China. He wrote his dissertation at Princeton, basically accusing the Truman administration of turning a blind eye to what the Soviets were doing to advance communist interests in China and to help the communist party of under chairman Mao win in defeat the American ally the nationalists. So anyway, I've gone off track here a little bit. But the point is that Stephen should. Due skip to Bobby Bobby hired skip to work on the national Security Council. Staff and Bobby quickly became passionately attracted to this young, man. He was quite young, right? He was he was about twenty six years old as well himself. And again, Bobby was in his fifties. So you tracked down Stephen Benedict who at this time is got to be in his eighty. That's right right living where he was living in upstate New York. State New York he had been on the national security staff himself Steve had not he was a White House staffer, and he would not been on the national security stuff. Right. So you call him up because the Eisenhower library told you that's who provided all these documents about your great uncle, Bobby Cutler to them you. Call him up. I'm sure he could not have been expecting here. Call in a million years, you tell them what you're doing. And what does he tell? You he says, well, I've got some things you should look at come up and meet me. So I drove to upstate New York. And there he showed me a six volume handwritten diary that migrate uncle had written spelling out his love for this young, man. I mean, you know, it is so rare that people doing historical research could come across a gold mine of material that nobody has ever seen before. But there you had a six volume diary written by the guy who was the principal national security advisor to the president of the United States during the height of the Cold War, and how much of that was about this love affair or his love interest. And how much of it was just about normal goings on in the White House and foreign policy ninety percent. It's basically styled as almost a protracted love letter. I mean, I it. Really is. It's it's all about his the waves of emotion rising from the heights of his passion for this young, man. But as you noted it is also a sad story. It's a tale of unrequited love in many ways because I think they were never able to physically consummate a relationship they extensively from what we know. And skip did not have reciprocate that deep passion for Bobby. He liked Bobby. He called him a one of his best friends or his best friend, even they became very close emotionally. But it was not a passionate thing. Explain I mean, this is so interesting because I mean, Robert Cutler was Lou blood Republican establishment. Cillian at Harvard. I mean, all the credentials of respectability and mid twentieth century, America. And the idea that he would be pouring out his guts in this diary about his infatuation with this young man is. Explain the psychology there. Well, you know, Bobby was a remarkably. Passionate as a person, and he describes himself. He actually published an autobiography in nineteen sixty five and he gave no hint about his personal sexual attraction. He certainly did. Not reveal it. I would say in reading it now. Yeah, they're breadcrumbs. There's actually a picture of skip in the diary. But all these says is we became friends in the diary or excuse me in the autobiography, yes. And he also has a picture of another young man who was another lover of skips named Gail. Huff teaser who Bobby became attracted to as well in one of the down periods. When skip was pushing him away. So Bobby, I'm sorry. I've lost track there. What was your question? No. I'm just trying to understand, you know, get inside Robert Cutler's head into you know, how he would come how a man of such respectability and authority would be. In writing such potentially incriminating stuff in a lengthy diary. Well, you know, I think it's just the way he was wired as a person after he said, he had a passionate romance with a a woman or he he fell in love with a woman in the nineteen twenties. But she rejected him and after that he had only a string of relationships with men for the next thirty years. Let me take us a cost question. One step further because the sort of obvious question is how he could reconcile in his mind, these feelings that he acted on with other men and at the same time oversee the writing of of this executive order that was so harmful to people in his own situation. Is that a case of karma compartmentalization was it because he needed to protect himself. What did you conclude at the end of your research was his motivation? I will say I think it is possible that because he was trailed by rumors of homosexuality that he was homosexual that maybe he didn't stand up and object to the sexual perversion portion of the order because he would be vulnerable to further allegations, and that would jeopardize his, and it would have been professional suicide to do. So. Well, if anything is you reveal in the book when you go through the steps that led to that executive order. Now, the context, of course, it's the McCarthy era Eisenhower has been trying to appease the mccarthyite s- in his party who have been demanding stricter security controls to keep out subversives in the government, and although subversives in the common mind, meant communists, because they actually couldn't find a whole lot of communists in the government. They found if they went after gays as well they could claim. Game. You know, more scalps of kicking out subversives from the government. The first draft of the executive order comes from the Justice department. The attorney general Herbert Brownell at the time, and it doesn't include the language of sexual perversion as one of the grounds for dismissal from the federal workforce. And Robert Cutler, the closeted gay man who was your uncle then put that language in put the words sexual perversion into the executive order. Well to be clear he didn't actually draft create a new draft. What he did was he pointed Herbert Brownell and the president to a draft of the rules draft executive order that had been prepared for president Truman and was sitting in in the Justice department, right? And that draft had the sexual perversion terminology in it. So, but he he definitely steered the drafting in that way. Right. So. He wasn't exactly involved in drafting and inserting the language itself. But it's about as close as you can get right. He wanted them to the language that included a do you think he consciously did that that is really the key question? And I don't I don't know the answer that I can say that Bobby certainly was a person who believed in process and believed in having a dialogue within government to have it function the best way that it can. So when he reformed the national Security Council and enhanced its he believed that national Security Council which had been neglected by president Truman should actually operate as the preeminent national security body of the US government would happen is you'd have a fulsome debate within the national Security Council right to arrive at the best policies. And I think he probably believed that was what had happened in true in the Truman administration development of this policy that he was bringing forward a policy that had been reviewed and studied and hammered out. I want to get to the impact that this executive order hat, and you've got some really eyebrow. Ray? Using stuff in the book about you know, just what this meant for people who were gay, and we're working in the government you quote from a security agent at the State Department. Peter Zauq who boasted of being the quote hatchet, man, and disparaged hearings and due process for government employees who are accused as a waste of time. He would say the son of a bitches queer and out he goes. And then he later expressed some regret about the number of his targets who killed themselves sometimes within minutes after leaving his office. Mrs again, quoting from this guy soak one guy, he barely left my office. And he must have had this thing in his coat pocket and boom right on the corner of twenty first and Virginia, which is right outside the State Department. Yep. It's horrendous. It's outrageous. And you know, I only look at this era and think that our government's capacity to find a vulnerable minority. And persecute that minority for political purposes should be recognized. And you know, it happened then it can happen again. And so right thinking citizens should be aware. Absolutely. Do you think that your great uncle Robert Cutler was aware of the impact of this executive order on gays in the government? I don't know the answer to that. I never found evidence that he commented on it. He may have repressed it. He made not wanted to know about it. In fact, as I described skip the man he fell in love with himself fell under investigation under executive order one. Oh, four five oh as did Steve Benedict. So but in the end, no so he had to have known. They didn't. I have no record that they told him ever. In fact, I what I show is that skip tried to shield him from knowing about the investigation. He was afraid that Bobby was going to be confronted with it and afraid that Bobby would be pulled into it. But in the end, Bobby Cutler was never exposed any evidence that he was protected any evidence that Eisenhower knew because I think when he did leave of his own volition in the sense that he was not publicly exposed Eisenhower said something like I'm losing my my right hand, man. My right arm. So what did I know? We know only that I considered Bobby an indispensable part of his his government. And what he actually knew about Bobby sexual orientation is a cipher. But I think that it's very likely that he had some knowledge without knowing the details, but that's unsure. Let me ask you one follow up question. He was as we just said he was never publicly outed. He was never discovered. And in a sense. He wasn't outed until you wrote this book, how do you think he would have reacted to this book being written, and and his private life being exposed like this, my belief is that his love for this young, man. Skip coons was so deep that if you transpose that to today's era of enlightened perception of homosexuality that he would be happy to have the story told he would think it was a sad story because it was an unrequited love. It was never consummated. But he would think it's a great story. In fact, one of his novels, he wrote two novels early in his life and both of them are about unrequited love and both of them are about in their context about men and women the impossibility or the difficulty of men and women finding happiness together. Which at the time was likely perception of his own about his own fate. But I personally I would like to think that he'd be happy that this story was told a couple of points, you rank in the book, which I think are worth discussing. He was never publicly outed, but J Edgar Hoover was onto him. At one point. In fact, he gets allegations from I think our White House correspondent clerk the FBI. Does that Cutler is gay and this makes its way to Hoover's desk, but Hoover who was so zealous about going after Gatti's elsewhere in the government, doesn't he gives Cutler a pass why my belief is there that there are two theories here, we don't know exactly why. But one thing that we do know is that Hoover, of course, was rumored to be gay a lifelong bachelor life long bachelor with an extremely close association with his. Top assistant, CLYDE Tolson. They had a spousal like relationship, even though we don't know if it was ever consummated. There's so many pieces of evidence that suggests that he was gay and all of them have to be evaluated in appraised in their own, right. A lot of them are considered suspicious or untrustworthy a lot of it is circumstantial, but the one piece that always sticks with me that is so incredible about Hoover is that he took pictures of CLYDE Tolson sleeping is nothing sexual there. Right. But how intimate does that relationship have to be? So my feeling is that Hoover like Bobby was an elderly bachelor with a abiding passion for men who could not afford to have an allegation of homosexuality against him in the public, and he recognized that the Bobby was in the exact same situation. So it kind of kinship. Yes, exactly. The other option is that Hoover recognized that Bobby was his conduit to Ike. Right. And that Bobby was extremely close to Ike. So if he were to go after Bobby on a homosexuality allegation that would really damage his relationship with Eisenhower. I want you to tell the story another anecdote you have in the book about another closeted gay man in one thousand nine hundred fifty s era Washington, Joe sup one of the most powerful influential columnists at the time and Alsop, of course, was very close to chip Bohlen the nominee for to be embassador in Soviet Union who face these allegations. And at one point there's a confrontation among the three of them, also bolan and Cutler tell us what happened. So at this time of Boland's nomination is pending in the Senate for confirmation. The three men are at at tea party in Georgetown, and Boland's house at bullies. How correct Bobby makes. A comment in essence trying to defend the president and John Foster Dulles and they're handling of bowlen's nomination which had come under attack from McCarthy. John Foster Dulles was of course, the secretary of state at the time, correct. At that moment, just as things are getting heated also tells the story later in his memoirs, he sees bowlen's jaw quivering with anger because in fact at this time and brother had been impugned in this as well. So MRs bolan Avis Bohlen comes in and intentionally knocks over a teapot to break up the tension. So and also was kind of threatening Cutler at that point. Right. He's suggesting or about to suggest that what's the phrase that? Incorrect tastes of love that. Yeah. That Cutler has incorrect tastes of love. Well, the real threat was that he wanted color to leak him in for. Nation. He was also a poor salient club from Harvard, and they'd known each other for many years, but also told Bobby that if he didn't release information either confidentially or on the record either way that the administration would suffer adverse political coverage in newspapers. Whether this also included a threat of revelation of his homosexuality. I don't know what's. So fascinating about that the whole premise of purging gaze from the government as a national security threat was that they were susceptible to blackmail. Never the Amer. Yeah. The idea was that the Soviets could blackmail somebody and get national security secrets actually the one documented case, we appear to have it wasn't the Soviets trying to blackmail, Bobby Cutler, it was a journalist and get him to leak and a hand a closeted gay journalist. Then I mean the layers of complexity and ambiguity are. So fascinating you capture them. So well in the book, I want to get to some other portions of the book, which have not gotten a lot of attention, which is that Cutler, regardless of all this was a key figure at some of the most momentous events of the Cold War, nineteen fifties America, confrontations with the Soviet Union the coup in Guatemala the coup in Iran nuclear strategy. Cutler was at the center of all of that. Yes. He was. And the key thing that he did was he managed the national Security Council and made it possible for like to run the governor. Amid all these stressors. I mean, this is an incredibly challenging time for the United States, and it was a period of remarkable growth instability. If you don't count the fact that we overthrew governments that were democratically elected in two countries. So I mean, he was sort of a moderating figure at least compare in comparison to Dulles, for instance, who was much more hawkish. Absolutely, absolutely. And I think that the key thing his key contribution in terms of being a moderating influence is that right after I took office. He made it possible for j Robert Oppenheimer, the physicist who is the father of the nuclear bomb to come into the national Security Council and urge the president and his counselors to be more open with the American public about the threat of nuclear war. And this led to what was called a policy of candor, and it alternately lead to. Mike speech before the United Nations in December of nineteen fifty three called atoms for peace speech, right which in turn led to the creation of the International Atomic Energy agency. Which to this day is the world's foremost agency for controlling the proliferation of nuclear weapons, what's so poignant about this part of the story is that someone like your great uncle who provided all of this public service worked so hard for the country. And yet was not allowed to be who he really was. Yes, right. It's an absolutely fascinating book. I mystery man the secret lives of Robert Cutler, Peter shackled. Thanks for joining us on buried treasure. Thank you very much and good luck with the book. Thank you. Thanks to Peter strangled for joining us on this episode of buried treasure. Don't forget to subscribe to skulduggery on apple podcasts or Revie. Listen to your podcasts and tell us what you think leave a review sure to follow us on. Social media and skulduggery pot. We'll talk to you on Friday. Welcome to A cast picks every week. We pick some of our favorite shows. And this is one we think you're gonna love. This is the vice guide to right now. You're inside look into the best of vice on this podcast. We bring you the best of vice behind the scenes, you'll hear from reporters guests and experts on the most significant news and culture on the planet. 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Robert Bobby Cutler Bobby Bobby President Eisenhower US executive Bobby Robert Cutler president Senator Joseph McCarthy national Security Council Hoover Peter White House Eisenhower library president Truman Stephen Benedict federal government John Cutler Boston
The Forgotten War Remembered

The Lawfare Podcast

50:48 min | 8 months ago

The Forgotten War Remembered

"The Korean conflict often. Wounds in that story as one of presidential unilateralism as the erosion of constitutional checks, said an imbalance in our in our constitution the Korean War also. Avalanches, some other important presses, especially with regard to war powers in the way the constitution operates during. I'm Benjamin witness, and this is the Law Fair podcast July Twentieth, two thousand and twenty. This year marks the seventieth anniversary of the beginning of the Korean War which is. Last I checked still going on the Korean War is often called the forgotten war because we remember Vietnam so well. We remember World War Two so well and wedged in between. Is this conflict that we often overlook and yet much of our contemporary international politics? In East, Asia is highly conditioned by the Korean War, the people of Korea continue to live with its aftermath, both in the north and south, and the shadow of the Korean War looms large over one of the great debates. We often have on l'affaire, which is the subject of war powers, so we thought commemorating the seventieth anniversary of the US entry into the Korean War would be a really interesting little project. We got together quite A. A panel to do it Katharine. Moon is a professor of political science at Wellesley College. She's also a nonresident senior fellow at the Brookings Institution Center. For East, Asia Policy Matt Waxman is a Professor at Columbia University Law School, and is of course, a law, fair long timer, and of course Scott, Anderson Senior editor of l'affaire is a specialist on war powers among other things on the history of which Matt Waxman is also writing. A book recovered a lot of ground in this conversation. What happened on the Korean Peninsula during the war? How did it affect the way we talk about war powers, and what is the international law status of the conflict in Korea it's the law. Fair podcast July twentieth. The forgotten war remembered. So we have breaking news after seventy years. The Korean War is still going on. This is within a margin of error, the seventieth anniversary of the beginning of the international operation on the Korean Peninsula. Catherine get US started. Most people don't have a sense much historical sense of the Korean War anymore. What was it and to what extent is it still unresolved? You started off perfectly because the Korean. War is often. Dubbed the forgotten war it's been going on so long and it still live technically, even though there was an armistice that was signed in July of Nineteen, fifty three, and it was awarded. That was never called. A war technically called the Korean conflict for very long time. What was the Korean War simply the North Koreans the communist forces. They invaded the south. The border south of the thirty eighth parallel which divided the north and the south the north and south became divided in order to get the Japanese out of the Korean Peninsula, during the end of the Pacific portion of World War Two. And Northern, the northern part of the Korean Peninsula was supposed to be managed by the Russians who were our allies at the time in World War Two and the southern part below the thirty eighth. Where the division was drawn was supposed to be managed by the United States or the UN forces. What is really interesting, is that the Korean Peninsula from nineteen forty five toward the end of World War Two? To now has been in a constant and chronic state of dividedness, and I would say a nation state that is unfulfilled, even though South Korea's one of the most prosperous countries in the world, both the north, and the south see the project of Nation Building as incomplete because of the initial division in world, War Two and the Korean War that truly divided the entire society on the peninsula. The northerners had invaded the south by surprise even though there were warnings that such troop movements were going to take place of the Americans didn't take this seriously. They did not take the North Koreans very seriously as serious threat and strangely enough this week power had the ability to drive US forces and South Korean military forces on the southern part of the peninsula way down all the way to the southern tip, the port city of Pusan in a very short span of time. We nearly lost the southern half of the Korean Peninsula to the North Koreans at the initial period of the Korean War. The intervention which we are now at the point of the seventieth anniversary of. As you say was not described does a war, but it was I. think in body count terms. One of the most costly conflicts of the twentieth century I I I I. You know World War Two is far and away. The number one and were one is number two and I think the Korean War is sort of right there after these two there, maybe some others that are more costly, but it goes on for a relatively short period of time, and yet it is hugely hugely. Hugely consequential in the sense that when you know, when Donald Trump and Kim, Jong UN meet today, in Singapore or or the demilitarized zone. They're negotiating the consequences of the Korean War. Is that? Is that fair? I store for sure you're absolutely right. the Korean War had the had one of the highest civilian casualty rates, historically speaking at least in terms of US participation in wars. So the civilian death raid in the Korean War surpassed that of world, War Two and the Vietnam War. It involved millions of People Koreans on the peninsula from votes in north. South Americans Chinese as well as. U N troops meaning about sixteen countries who had contributed their forces to the United Nations Command. When we look at the tally of casualties, we are looking at a North Korean society that lost between twelve to fifteen percent of its entire population. It is considered one of the highest losses ever historically speaking in modern warfare. The North Koreans had about three, hundred, thousand, dead, another two, thirty, thousand wounded, and about ninety one thousand missing. And you know it's an astounding number who participated American soldiers from all of the different branches of the services. We can tally close to one point eight million US troops on the peninsula during the war, and the Chinese lost over a hundred eighty three thousand people battle deaths. And, then of course, there were hundreds thousands more wounded and another twenty five thousand, so who were missing. The South Koreans lost about one hundred, forty, thousand military debts, and another twenty, four, thousand, five, hundred, or so missing. You know when you think about missing soldiers, they are the embodiment of a war that did not end because we are still trying to negotiate the return of the remains of American soldiers. South Koreans would love to see some kind of negotiation with north. Crow seed, so that South Korean families could get back the remains of their loved ones. It was a tremendous loss. And of course, the economic costs were also high If I may I think. The lasting impact of the Korean War on the peninsula, it cannot be underscored enough. When we look at the rise of South Korea's economy, it had anything to do with the Korean War, and they continuing threat of the North Korean military, the fear that the North Koreans could invade again that fear led the South Korean government's on their authoritarian regimes as well as aspirin. Public's to conduct probably one of the most rapid economic rises in global history. The whole idea was we have to be a strong economy in order to protect ourselves and make sure that we cannot be vulnerable to North Korean attack. The North Koreans in impact there we see one of the most hyper militarized societies in the in the world, the continuing reign of the Kim Dynasty that has been able to emphasize to its public over generation. After generation that without the cans, the North would be vulnerable to the United States and to South Korea. All right so with that as background Scott, this podcast came about because you casually mentioned the other day that. The Korean War is important in the history of US war powers. Which of course the moment you set it, it's it's an obvious point and yet I hadn't thought about it. Katherine refers various times to the UN forced to this being a conflict, not a war or a sometimes, it's called a police action why the weird terminology associated with the Korean War. So. It's absolutely true that the Korean War really hangs very large in the imagination of lawyers who deal with war power, and really broader foreign relations questions to some extent, a bit of that reputation about how seminal an event it is a me be a little bit overstated I know Matt and I have talked about in this pass and and I would invite Matt in a second elaborate why that might be? Be But Korean War does usefully bring in a number of factors that have really proven instrumental in decisions about war powers later in complex, they're the kind of factors that for many people think either legal analysis should or does hinge in regards to whether a president can use military force. One of the Korean War, was not authorized by Congress at least not expressly, not initially, there was never a declaration of war. War that there was in world. War Two and had been in many prior other, not all prior conflicts to instead what they had was authorization from the UN Security Council which the Truman administration had been able to pursue insecurity in part because the Soviet Union had been boycotting the Security Council and therefore provided. There's a new treaty based international law based authorization which had a questionable degree of domestic authorization. Authorization as well that brought with it. Many people subsequently say that. In fact, Security Council doesn't automatically authorize anything under US law, but people at the time didn't necessarily feel that way, and the third factor is that in light of those two factors, the Korean War became as Catherine already noted a major conflict major large-scale deployment, and so insofar as there is an effort to say well, the president can pursue. Types of military action, but not others the Korean War as. To. Say that this is anything short of a full on war, a large scale conflict, and therefore in a way, implicates the most serious uses of the president's war powers, and because of those three major considerations, the Korean War is often seen as one of those key case studies, key data, points and tracking how? Were powers. Presidential war powers have evolved over time. Yeah so matt. Let's let's dive into a couple of those points you know. Arthur slesinger in his famous book. The Imperial Presidency Kinda traces the imperial presidency to the Korean War at least in the war powers contacts. Write that you know. Truman doesn't get a declaration of war. It's never directly authorized by Congress and Slesinger regards this as the watershed moment, after which the presidency is never the same to what extent is this good history? And to what extent is this I mean? Slesinger was a historian, not a lawyer, but kind of lawyers has story. Is it as big a watershed in war powers as we as we KINDA, imagine it in common law classes, or is the story more complicated than that? So I'd characterize it as A. Major step in the. Accretion of presidential powers, especially presidential war powers, but I think it's often overstated just how significant delete it was, and what the sort of the lasting precedential impact of the Korean conflict was. So you know this was? The largest instill is the largest foreign war that the United States has fought without. An express congressional. War, declaration or authorization of He's not at the at the front end, and it's a as you say in. War powers lower including in Slesinger is famous imperial presidency book it's it's treated as a watershed event and I do think that the legal argumentation of a justifying Truman's intervention without congressional authorization becomes a template for later executive branch justifications unilateral action there really a few arguments that I think are elaborated by the Truman Administration for unilateral action that hadn't been fully briefed in this way before. One is to elaborate a very broad understanding of the president, self-defense powers that whereas previously sort of unilateral power to use force in self-defence, was defined in terms of mostly in terms of protecting territory or American people. Now we, the president is asserting. That sort of defensive systemic interests, including stability and international legal system soon after that American allies there were elements of this type of legal justification in some previous military interventions, but the Korea memos take them to a new level of there's also a big. Historical argument that the president does the Truman administration argues, and and tries to detail through a long list of that the president has often acted unilaterally to prevent violence and other unlawful acts by other states, and produces a very very long list of of dozens of such interventions, and that again serves as a template for future executive branch administrations to justify later interventions I do think though a few caveats are in order, I at the moment of intervention. Truman certainly didn't expect this to be a three year war with tens of thousands of Americans killed. It's a much bigger war in hindsight that was expected in nineteen fifty and. And it's also important to keep in mind that at that, at that time, the point of reference for what a war is was the world wars and possible war with the Soviet. Union and compared to those as the baseline. The Korean intervention seemed small by comparison second. You know sometimes the emphasis on the Korean War in the story of the growth of the imperial presidency and unilateral war powers obscures just how much power previous presidents had asserted in using limited force, and the degree to which checks on unilateral presidential moves that were envisioned at the founding had already erode in my view. Those checks started eroding almost immediately. In the early republic and you get dramatic sort of uptick in in that erosion with the Korean War and the onset of the Cold War, but that's part of a long trend, not something that's entirely new in one, thousand, nine, hundred fifty, and then I I'd I'd say that looking back since Korea, we haven't had a repeat of of such a dramatic assertion of unilateral powers, even when presidents have asserted the power to start wars or conflicts unilaterally. They've gone to Congress for the big. Big Ones Vietnam is complicated, but you have the Gulf of Tonkin resolution both Iraq wars had authorization from Congress, Afghanistan and the war against Al Qaeda had had an authorization, so career remains these something of of an outlier Louis career produced a precedence or at least a road map for legal argument, but politically I think the lesson that most administrations have learned, was you? If you're going to enter a major conflict, you're much better off going to Congress for authorization at the Front End. All right, so Scott I want to ask you to reflect a little bit on the dichotomy between what Catherine is describing, which is a forgotten war. That's really critical in shaping the Korean Peninsula and yet people don't even remember that it happened, or at least have it only as a sense of the the other conflict than happened involving US troops in Asia and this history that both you and match just described in which this event loom so large in this discrete. Of Lawyers Talking about war powers? Is it the forgotten war except by lawyers? That may be one way to look at it or describe the situation but to some extent there is a little bit despite of the dominant role that Korean work plays in war powers, thinking in some of the its is also one of these issues that's kind of not talked about as frequently or directly as one might expect. An important. That's because it plays weird sort of dual role both as Canon in an anti cannon sort of precedent this idea that it's right on the periphery of what's legally acceptable most subsequent. Opinions about presidential war powers from the executive branch we associate with legal counsel, and most of them approached the Korean War Pretty Cagey. They will occasionally make reference to it particularly if they are saying that you know, the United States can take certain action because they're relying upon the security, council, Resolutions or other international law, or if foreign policy interests tends to weigh a little heavier there for the reasons that Matt noted because it was new in that regards the first case where the president is relies so heavily on that. But when it comes to the idea that this conflict that the president could pursue own constitutional power separate apart from that question, it's always a tricky case. One Thousand Nine hundred seventy opinion that future chief justice William, Rehnquist wrote which is kind of the I. I think of as the first in the line of modern. We'll see opinions about were powers. He really addresses in says this is probably he strongly implied lease. It's kind of a peripheral case. And he says well essentially ultimately Congress more or less acquiesce to what the president was doing, so it became less of A. A problem and that acquiescence was in the form of funding, was in the form of simple awareness without cutting off support or ending others which of activities or installing any statutory prohibitions That may have pose an issue. Ultimately, he's got a implies although it's really just in a sentence that that was just not that big an issue ultimately Congress and therefore Congress did ultimately sign off if not in a conventional. Format Upfront more recent opinions don't really deal with it that squarely. Don't bring it on and look at it directly or rely on it heavily and again. I think it's because a lot of people have that view that this was because it was such. A major conflict doesn't fit very neatly in the framework that's often applied to war. Powers conventionally partake. That's often associated with. With the two thousand eleven Libya opinion that opinion said essentially the president can use force where the actual conflict itself falls below the level of quote, unquote war for constitutional purposes basically means it's a limited conflict. That's not the case here, and then that there's some people say there's an exception to that four cases of self defense where United States and the president can. Can Act more broadly and self defense. That's also a bit of a harder case in the Greek. As it's certainly not conventional self-defense, there's a broader idea. Well, maybe a serving US interests in that's self, its own former self defense that Matt alluded to, but that's like a slightly dodger idea I. Think most people associate that view of interest with a different scale. Scale of presidential authority than an actual threat to the homeland or to US forces, and for that reason, it's just not a comfortable case to work into these arguments, and you don't see lawyers invoking as often as they might. Even though, from a historical perspective was clearly one of these data points that you have to account for in describing the evolution of this thinking. Katherine. Do you have thoughts on this? Yeah I do. I. This is really fascinating and very enriching I'm thinking that when we talk about the forgotten war, there is one state that has not forgotten the war, and that's North Korea live an intact E. N. act. They live out the Korean War. Every single day through various types of propaganda through art posters, propaganda art posters that always hearken back to the Korean War the statues that are all over the country. War that war is a lived experience. It's a daily reminder. Everywhere you go North Korea I, was there in two thousand thirteen and it was astounding. How visually the collective memory of the war lives on, and people are not allowed to forget the war. Why is it so important for North Koreans? We cannot understand North Korea's nuclear development without understanding and accepting that the Korean War lives on. It rages every day in the north. We can't understand the belligerent rhetoric the constant sense of mobilization capacity of the people without understanding what North Korea went through in the war, it was a devastating experience the Korean war their cities were wiped out completely. No building was left. Because of US air power got demolished these places. So many debts so many losses and the North Koreans. Why are why are they also so crowded and so obstinate? Why do they try to go it alone significantly because they take great pride in having rebuilt their society, after the devastation of war and many people don't know this around the world, even on the Kristen Salah, but until the late sixties possibly the early seventies. North Korea had higher GDP rates higher rates of Industralization, higher rates of literacy at as well as other indicators like longevity reduced numbers of infant mortality relative to their arch enemy South Korea. So when you talk about the south, Korean explosion, as sort of one of the world's most explosively growing economies. You're actually not talking about really since the Korean War, but since nineteen seventy. It's faster even than that. Yes South Korea struggled in the in the period after it became established as an independent republic at the end of world, war two in nineteen, forty eight, it became its own nation state, and it really struggled to find an economic pass that was viable stable, and only starting in the early seventies, did the export regime takeoff before the early seventies The North Koreans were doing very well. The North Koreans actually did quite well into the seventies, and then through the eighties, and of course, the nineties and the famine and the end of the Cold War and the Soviet Union's backing of their economy, subsidizing them heavily. That's the stuff that led to the downfall of this very proud So called self sufficient regime, but the the history of the Korean War is absolutely vital to understanding so much of the foreign policy issues that govern north-south relations on the peninsula of course and the US commitment in terms of us. Commitments to South Korea, they stem from the Korean, war and its aftermath show many aspects of today's policy issues, regarding the peninsula and East Asia. We can go right back to the Korean War as having put down the seeds. There's another aspect that I wanNA raise in addition to what my colleagues are saying about the legal aspects of the Korean War. there are two things here one is that the armistice agreement that was signed in July of Nineteen fifty three to end the hostilities, but not end the war that it raises some really interesting legal questions, and I have always hoped that I would get to meet lawyers to talk about these things with the armistice was not signed by south, Korean authorities it was signed by a North Korean general and. The US UN commander and The, North Korean general signed also on behalf of the so-called Chinese volunteers, not the technical people's Army, but the volunteer army even though you had millions involved. So if there is to be a peace treaty, which people talk about from time to time, who signs who becomes a party to the negotiations, who becomes responsible for our enforcing for watching over the peace treaty? The it was a UN action. Even though the UN is no longer considered active player on the peninsula, so it raises a bunch of interesting questions, and then you have the status of forces agreements that govern the rights, duties, obligations, and the limitations of such of for both the US military and the South Korean government, regarding the stationing of. Troops on South Korean soil, the US forces have been there since nineteen fifty seven on a permanent basis. We still have about twenty eight thousand five hundred troops in the nineteen sixties. We had about seventy thousand three divisions of the US military, especially the army place there and they so far, the status of Forces Agreement is a highly politicized document. We have one with just about every country that houses US faces US facilities US troops, and what's interesting. Is that the South Korean Sofa as well as the US Japan Sofa? Stand in as templates. For other countries that want to either improve their status enforces agreements vis-a-vis the United States. Or want to critique some aspect of the status of Forces Agreement so Iraq in two thousand seven when it was trying to negotiate a sofa with the United States, they looked at the Japanese the South Korean the German the US NATO and other such documents, so you've got this legal template in the Sofa that is an outgrowth of the Korean War, the fact that there was never any piece that was settled, and the fact that the US had to promise a US troops and US protection for South Korea's national security because of the constant North Korean threat. So. That's a really interesting, so let's take those issues in sequence. Do you. A view of given who the parties to the armistice are, if the US and North Korea were ever to come to an understanding as Donald Trump and Kim Jong Hoon. Suggested at Singapore that they would they would. Come to an end of the war, understanding, who's a party to that treaty given that? Technically it was not it was. The UN is the belligerent South Korea was not a party to the armistice. Treaty to end the war work. those are great questions. I'll actually I defer to Scott because he dealt with some of these international legal issues I in his own experience on the ground in Iraq, and then I can comment on a Scott Steak. Well sure, let me start with this issue of the end of the war, because that's kind of interesting question, but it's interesting, not just in the Korea context, but also in kind of broader armed conflicts, the traditional international law you and I mean traditional in terms of an eighteenth or nineteenth century, international law practice was always that armed conflicts tended to end in a treaty some sort of agreement that laid out the terms by which the conflict would come to an end, by which the grievances would be addressed and restore some sense of the rights. Rights of the parties that kind of ties to an old idea that when states entered a state of war, they suspended a lot of their mutual international legal obligations. I would apply if they were otherwise states that were not at war with each other. That is really kind of faded into the background right now we see all sorts of armed conflicts that don't have a fixed ending. If you want a great example of this think about which has happened earlier this year in Iraq with the killing of Qassem. Soleimani, in that case we saw. Saw The United States rely upon in authorization for the invasion of Iraq in two thousand and three that what had been lying latent for most of the prior decade, except providing some may be secondary authorization for counter isis operations, but they're resurrected because there was no formal end. Let Alone de Authorisation of kind of what activities the United States could pursue their. So in this case you know what would the party's be to an agreement like this? Probably would I think sensibly will be the united, nations and North Korea again. Probably involving South Korea's well as As, they are kind of the parties, but at this point, the United States is early in South Korea at the invitation of the South Korean government, not under U. N. auspices so far as those are the activities that North Korea wants to address a quote. Unquote peace agreement might not be a peace agreement at all. It might be an agreement about a mutual understanding about their activities, which flows from the Korean War, but probably isn't structured as an end of that war. Although no doubt, it will contain a rhetoric that kind of implies as much. The point about Iraq is a really interesting one and all address there without getting into too many details. Is that the Korea and Japan Sofas and particularly the Korea Sofa really have gone under this evolution because Korea and Japan are now close allies they have very functional rule of law systems, and there've been a number of high profile incidents where you servicemembers a have been caught doing things that are obviously criminal things like sexual assault, sometimes physical assault or an accident that killed Korean and Japanese citizens arising out of the service members that have proven politically controversial, and there has been efforts to accommodate that by giving more opportunities for Korean and Japanese officials to have some say in how some of these matters are handled. A South Korea was actually the very. Very first foreign country I ever visited other than Canada as a kind of starry eyed freshmen in college. and I was there right after one of these incidents, where if I recall correctly I think was a case where some Korean citizens have been run over by a US military vehicle and it was a a degree of tension substantially around the US presence there and to ameliorate that they've entered into these agreements that provide that asked of Rights and that's what kind of Iraq I think was angling at in their negotiations, saying well, we WanNa have a better degree of control over the foreign forces in our borders like Japan have. Yeah I I agree with what Scott said, especially with regard to the international law dimensions of these questions I would just add a comment about the domestic law aspect which is. What happens to the idea of constitutional war powers being turned on by the onset of conflict. What what happens at the back end? When you don't have a formal peace treaty, you know at the time of the founding. that. If you are in a in a major conflict, the way it came to an end was going to be a treaty, and that treaty was going to come to the Senate for advice and consent when that way of ending wars goes away. You have this new kind of constitutional issue of when when do constitutional war powers or domestic war powers up perhaps triggered by wartime statutes. Turn back off. This is an issue that arises in the civil war where the war doesn't really end with the surrender of Lee's Army I've. Goes on for several more years in a in a sort of insurgency, like sense World War. One is probably the one of the most important examples because the Senate rejects the peace treaty that Wilson comes back. In with carrying his hands from from Europe and domestic war, powers continued for several years beyond the armistice So this is an interesting constitutional puzzle that I'm reminded of by the career case. Yet such an interesting point because we think of Korea as in the war, powers context as at the front end, posing this really interesting question of when of when and how legally wars start, but this point, when and how do they end? It also really poses in the sense that seventy years later we could be having this conversation at all Ben I. Agree with that and I'd actually I had. The. Korean War if you think about war powers as being mostly about who gets to decide to initiate conflict, Congress or the president, the Korean conflict often rooms in that story as one of presidential unilateralism as the erosion of constitutional checks, said in balance in our in our constitution, the crane were also establishes some other important precedents, especially with regard to war powers. In the way, the constitution operates during war one of. Of those is of course, the famous Youngstown case there's this deal seizure case which stands out as one of the rare cases I think in which the court rebukes a a sort of a wartime or claimed wartime conflict time emergency power by the president. It's also it's also the conflict in which we have one of our greatest at a crises in civil military relations, where Truman ultimately relieves macarthur of command. And I think there's an important moment I in in emphasizing civilian control of the military, both of those cases both those instances episodes I, the MacArthur, a firing and the steel seizure case are important to consider that in the historical context here. This is early in the Cold War when there is worry that the permanent state of military emergency is going to the to garrison state we're seeing the conflict of the Cold War as a battle between two systems. I'm having defeated. Fascism is democracy going to be able to survive and survive intact against global communism, and so both of these ideas of sort of judicial checks on a presidential emergency powers and presidential supremacy over military commanders, those are those are pretty important parts of our overall bundle of constitutional checks and balances. It's pretty interesting. Now that you mention it, so it's not just the beginning of the war, the end of the war it's also the conduct of the war, although at least the replacement of Macarthur has precedent in Lincoln cereal replacement of the Union General Leadership until he gets his hands on Ulysses. Grant Right. Absolutely? I don't mean to suggest that. This is the first time in which a president asserts that kind of control and and poke. During the Mexican American war exerts a lot of control over officers who are in in various types of command, if not entirely new, but I think it's an issue that really comes to a head in the in the Korean War with a level of of sort of special urgency, because there was real worry that an extremely popular military commander might be sort of unilaterally and against the wishes of civilian leaders. Marching the United States down a path of superpower escalation. Okay so catherine I want to finish with you because you got as far as the North Koreans down at the south of the peninsula, which I think a lot of people forget that at the time of the international intervention you know the South Korean state was basically finished, and so you know kind of the in brief tell us the rest of the story. The UN Security Council passes a resolution with Russia. Kind of having gone to the bathroom and. What happens? For The Korean War is fascinating because there were so many mistakes that were made and assumptions that proved to be so incorrect, especially those made by General Macarthur. And he is lauded as a hero by many in the United States. Who still remember him of course, an indefinitely in South Korea, among the older generation, the Korean War, generation who looked at him as a savior as weirdly do a lot of Japanese at least a. Just going to say that they're in Japan and South Korea. There are clubs that that have been established to commemorate the life end heroic deeds of General Macarthur apparently. There are Shamans in South Korea. Who tried to embody the spirit of General Macarthur to give a wisdom and. An life advice to people who are paying It's very strange, but you know my own readings. Studies have taught me. That Macarthur was such a flawed man. Of course we know that in many ways one of which was his having challenged the civilian power, the commander in chief of the United States Mr Chairman, but more so on a military level that he in many ways embodied. What seems to have gone on during the Iraq war that. He wanted only intelligence that would give him certainty in terms of his own assumptions it his own intentions, so he worked with a very small coterie of people that he trusted in South Korea, he ignored the commands as well as the advice and intelligence from the Pentagon. This is the war office at the time. And he basically was trying to run his own show, which led to huge flaws in judgment, he was not prepared. He also is lauded for the Inchon landing that actually brought the first wave of US troops to South Korea that later pushed the North Koreans northward. Relieving the pressure on the south, but the Inchon landing was completely a matter of luck to tell you the truth. There were so many aspects of decision making regarding the until landing that didn't hold a muster. It just was not rational. Environmental issues climate issues the terrain, all sorts of things. He was hell bent on choosing Inchon the landing venue, so he got really lucky and then there's also the reality that the American troops suffered so much under his watch. The American troops were deprived of uniforms, warm clothing in the horrifically cold weather of. South and North Korea in the wintertime, not enough rations, and the worst part of it in some ways was not enough and not properly outfitted weaponry. This was a time when the US had de mobilized from World War, two, and trying to get all of the supplies to the Korean front proved to be such a challenge, so his men suffered tremendously during the of the war. There are more people who died of frostbite than actual bullet wounds. So it was a horrific experience as far as the legacy of the Korean War, both the North and south still talk about reunification. If you recall the two thousand eighteen winter, Olympics that was held in south, Korea it was the venue of a grand diplomatic effort by the south. Korean, President Moon Jae in who invited a North Korean leader, the sister of Kim jong-un in particular and a small delegation to the Winter Olympics partly to show off South Korea and partly to say look, we can be in on this together. We can be a unified nation in the future if your country can reorient itself. And, so we are always hearing this word reunification out of Koreans mouths from the north and the south. Why is that? It's because of the division of the peninsula. The bloodshed a civil war. It was a civil war. That is the primary importance that we need to keep in mind it. We learned in American at in college as an international police. Action Ben you had referred to that phrase, but for the Koreans on both sides, this was a civil war where millions of people lost lives where millions of people lost families, the division of the peninsula meant that millions and millions of families left behind loved ones on both sides. So I WANNA. Ask You all about one other aspect of the legacy which is. On the American side, which is the imprint that the Korean War created for ten twelve years later when we started to get involved with Vietnam Vietnam that I think the imprint that the Korean War left for many Americans was that you could have an amphibious landing? You cut the peninsula in half. You beat the the communist invaders back, and then you Kinda hold the line, and you get an armistice and the southern half of the state lives. Lives and maybe you don't wipe out the northern half, but at least you protect the southern half and I think that was what was in the minds of a lot of people in the Kennedy and Johnson administrations during the Vietnam war think they were thinking about Korea, and did not realize how bad a model correa was for what they were trying to do. I'm interested for any of your thoughts on that. That might have thoughts on it. I think it's a really really important observation on that's in some ways they were the wrong lessons learned, but the more provided enough of a classroom experience that Americans should have learned in Oh. We always ask why. Why don't we learned lessons of war? So one thing is topography climate as I mentioned before American military forces suffered a lot because of the harsh winter climates in on the Korean Peninsula. And the the terrain, the Korean Peninsula is basically a mountainous terrain, so U. S.. Troops had been trained. They had not been trained rather to fight in such mountainous terrain, and it proved very very difficult for them. You can't move tanks up and down mountain trails. In Vietnam that it's a similar situation where jungle warfare, guerrilla warfare, and of course, the the crazy, hot humid climate. Were situations that American troops had not been used to, and that you just slip into a foreign country that you really know nothing about which is true in both Korea and Vietnam. As far as Americans are concerned at that time, you just can't slip into a foreign country and decide that you're going to be able to whip people up north. Your past the the demarcation line, so I think the these were very. They're very facile assumptions that had been made both in in Korea and Vietnam, and then of course in both cases, they came back to roost. We're GONNA leave it. There Katharine Moon Scott Anderson Matt Waxman. Thank you all for joining us. Thank you. Thanks for having me. The law. Fair podcast is produced in cooperation with the Brookings. Institution this episode of the Law. Fair podcast was recorded by the one the only Zachary Frank of Goat Rodeo you need to do your part to promote warfare podcasts so tweet US share us on facebook up. Vote us on. Read it and pin us on Pinterest. Leave a rating and review wherever you found us, and of course visit the law fair store dot com to buy your l'affaire merch so that you can advertise US wherever you go. The law. Fair podcast is produced an edited by Gen PACI Howell arm. Music is performed by Sophia Yan, and as always. Thanks for listening.

US South Korea North Korea Korean Peninsula president UN Congress Matt Waxman Scott South Korean Sofa Iraq Soviet Union Truman
How China shapes U.S.-India relations

The Brookings Cafeteria

34:35 min | 1 year ago

How China shapes U.S.-India relations

"Welcome to the Brookings Cafeteria the podcast about ideas and the experts who have them. I'm Fred dues in the book. Fateful Triangle how China shaped US India relations during the Cold War published this month by the Brookings Institution Press Author Thandi Madan shows how U. S. India relations have been shaped in the past and present by China on this episode. Madan a senior fellow in foreign policy and director of the India Project at Brookings is interviewed by Brookings Press Director. Bill Fining about her new book also on the program senior fellow. David Wessel offers his economic update with the focus on the strong U. S. economy and the risks facing the global economy. You can follow the Brookings podcast network on twitter at policy podcasts. To get information about and links to Oliver shows including dollar and cents the Brookings Trade podcast the current and our events. Podcast and now. Here's bill fining Mouton de Madan. Thanks Fred and welcome to Avi. Thanks for having me on the podcast bill. Glad to have you so China and India and United States your book bring these three countries together. That in the popular mind or usually diatoms not a triad or a triangle. Us China US India China and India. It also comes at an opportune time to trump administration appears to be making a very clear attempt to bring India into a relationship with the. Us That is more overt than in the past and with China's central reason early on in the book he note that Washington's China policy shaped it's India policy and Delis perception of China affected how dealt with the. Us is still true today. Absolutely the points that the book mixes we actually. It's almost GONNA as Jane Austen says it's a truth universally acknowledged today that China's shapes and influences US India relations that over the last few administration since the Bush administration really that for US policymakers. They've seen India as a potential balance geopolitical balance but also a democratic contrast to China and also an alternative market for American companies for example. So they've seen India from China Lenz. That was the case in the Obama administration as well. We've been seeing the trump administration though in some ways so different from the previous two administrations also follow that same strategic framework that India should be seen as an Asian large Asian country that can show as a democracy the democracy and development aunt mutually exclusive. And that because of its growing economic and military power it could be a geopolitical balance as people become more concern about China's not it's rise per se but it's behavior and the book makes the case that this is not a recent phenomena it's indeed how American and Indian policymakers so each other even as early as the late forty s when India became independent. Both American and Indian policymakers perception of China and their policies towards that country affected how U. S. India relations developed during that period. And they definitely do today as well. I want to go to what I think is the core of the book which is right does not argue that. China has not been the only factor that mattered in the US relationship but it demonstrates China's role in the US. India script was a leading actor not in the form of a cameo or guest appearance. Your book does that by examining a number of stages in that relationship the first from nineteen forty nine nine hundred eighty six shows that the United States and India had different perceptions of China. As you point out can you describe what the predominant perceptions of each were them? So I'll tell you that true a story to start with in nineteen forty nine promised giral. India's first prime minister just two years. After India become independent came to the United States and to he also visited Washington and he was the first Indian Prime Minister to visit the United States president. Truman went to the airport to receive him. He took long three cabinet members and a God given also the US. Congress hosted narrow for each joins a speech to the joint session of Congress. This will not kind of welcome that was given to some country that was considered peripheral as has been traditionally understood when we think about US India relations during the Cold War. It was because just a few days before narrowed arrived in the US the US felt that it had lost China to communism because the People's Republic of China had been established on October. I nine hundred forty nine and the wanted India just like the Bush Obama and trump administration. Stay THE TRUMAN. Administration also thought that since China had gone communist and was aligned with the Soviet Union. The two could find a new known. Asia. This time a democratic India that could play a role in their strategic framework in Asia and could serve contrast and account balance but what they found very quickly joined that visit as Prime Minister Nehru in President. Truman and secretary of State denaturing had these conversations about what they actually thought about China. They found that while Prime Minister Nehru had some concerns about China. India had and still has a long boundary with China that he had some concerns about what China might be doing the future but he argued that the best way to deal with China that had emerged Communist. China was not too isolated all kinds of essentially give it up to the Soviets between gauge it to encourage it to become part of the international community and to be responsible stakeholder. The Truman administration disagreed. Now this could have been an academic difference that the two sides just didn't have the same view of China. Why did it actually matter for us? India relations it's because these two countries actually engage with each other quite a bit on the subject of China and so for example the US actively tried to discourage or at least delay in the in recognition of the People's Republic of China but India did recognize communist China fairly quickly the US and India also had differences on the question of the Chinese takeover of Tibet. And how much to do too I prevent it and then subsequently how to respond to it the. Us wanted India to take a more active stance to resist that day. Korver India could not afford to do so in narrows opinion and then finally what you really saw the differences play out between the US and India on China that caused real problems for the US. India relationship was during the Korean War when India acted as a mediator between the US and China and even in fact one the US the general. Arthur shouldn't cross the blue because the messages they were getting from the Chinese was that they would then into the war the US did not listen but India didn't win any friends. From that case telling the truth it actually caused more problems and specially advocates China Lobby on Capitol Hill which favoured Shanghai shake and a stronger opposition by the trump administration communist China. The in fact advocated against aid to India on the basis that it was had been two pro-chinese during the Korean War so as I said these differences watch US academic had a very real impact on the US relationship as well one thing that jumped out at me reading those. Because I hadn't seen it before as the United States seem to be concerned that India would be a domino that would topple to after China. Become Communist. Very large domino. How valid the concerns of some Americans that China fell to Communism India? Would too well. It's interesting because you're right. The domino theory is usually thought to be about Vietnam. But you always if you actually read and you see this in the documents that I've gone through in various archives and various administrations you see presidents and their officials when they're laying out the domino theory. Always the way it goes is China fell then Southeast Asia would fall and then the big one India would fall. Now it's hard to judge in hindsight about whether counterfactual in terms of would this have actually happened. I can tell you. The one thing I found for the Indian archives which have only recently opened up in the last decade or so is an Indian officials. Too worried about the potential spread of communism sometimes people think of narrow as a communist sympathizer but actually especially in terms of domestic communist groups narrow and I his deputy prime minister but then our patil but then others as well. They were actually very anticommunist. In fact went off to communist groups in India and communist sympathizers but never wasn't just concerned about communism in terms of a homegrown problem. He was very concerned that the Soviet Union was actively encouraging these groups but he was also concerned that if communist China which had just been established in Nineteen forty-nine could grow foster could deliver the goods as he put it to its people faster than democratic India which had also been established around the same time if democratic India could not keep up with Chinese economic rule could not deliver the goods. Then Indians would question whether Communism was actually a better way of life so this idea that only the US was concerned about communism which sometimes it's people in India so it was something that concerned Indian officials to and again the concern about the race with China as it got called. The Economist Bob reward came up with the term the fateful race between China and India. It wasn't just the. Us The thought it was important for to win that race. But the Nehru Government as well. I want to ask about the relationship with the Soviet Union does time to to in India. You know that Stalin believed that he was a stooge of the US in Great Britain. We're that view. Come from the Soviet view the Soviet initial view and it starts changing during the Korean War but initially there really was this view on the part of the Soviet Union that these leaders will usually leaders who were just going to do what London and Washington would say. Bought of the reason was that India was very close to Britain even though it had this very charged colonial experience with it but I think there was this impression in Moscow that particularly would Stalin that India was just do the US UK bidding. Some of this I think was because he saw smaller countries. Not Having too much what we call agency. They couldn't make their own decisions. Some of it was because Indian leaders. It is true did go off to communist groups and I think some of it was just a lack of knowledge about India per se. They hadn't been that much interaction with the kind of leaders and policymakers of independent India. So there was this kind of view but it starts to change when Soviet officials start to see that India's willing to play an independent role during the Korean War and even after that when India was in charge of the neutral nations repatriation committee in charge of repatriating thousands of prisoners of war that both sides held the Soviet Union thought that India was playing a non aligned role and so was willing to change. Its mind about India and of course that view changes very much. When Khrushchev in Begawan? Come into office and they actually go on what people call the Soviet economic offensive to try to win over not just India but other non-aligned countries as well there are two major events tornadoes. Early time period. That you've mentioned the war in Korea and China's annexation of Tibet and how India responded to those but there was also into China beginning of that during the Eisenhower Administration. And that by my reading of yearbook seem to sour relationship with India because of India's stance toward what happened earlier as the French abandoned. It was one more reason in that early period till about the mid fifties. It was another subject of difference between the US and India and again it involved. China India saw what was happening in Indochina from its own lens and ozone presume both colonial country and saw these hotel men in particular as basically nationalists who were conducting independence struggle for independence. Who would you mentioned? Indeed even cited the US example as an independent democratic country but the US obviously saw it through Cold War anticommunist lands and so saw it very much in the context of the spread of communism and the influence of the Soviets and the Chinese in that country and so this was a subject of difference where India actually said that Vietnam could take independent decisions and the US soy essentially as coming under very much and making decisions on the influence of the Soviet Union and China and so once again can of China which the US resisted Chinese participation in Geneva conference India actively encouraged it and again mediated to some extent or at least guards are involved in passing messages between the US China again. That did not win it any favors. At least in the mid fifty s China was going to basically the source of divergence. And that's where the First Section of the book is called divergence because it is these various instances from about nine hundred forty nine thousand nine hundred fifty six where you do see the US in India basically very much disagreeing on the subject of China. But they're still kind of felt that they needed each other enough to continue to engage but not exactly in a very positive or optimistic way. It's interesting to me that in two of the major land wars at US fought in Asia. India made the right call. I in Korea with Macarthur and then second seen Hokey men for what he really was at that time. At least as a nationalist leader and the US didn't want to listen at that time. I think that's definitely what the Indian policy makers would say in hindsight but I think one of the things. The book tries to do is not pass judgment on the decisions in either sides as because `specially doing archival work. It gives people like me who have not served in government a certain amount of insight into the constraints that policymakers are operating under so things. That seem obvious in hindsight policy options. That seem kind of no brainers today. Sometimes yes they got it wrong. They should have known better but at other times. It's something that it's easier to say. In hindsight it was at the time and even though there are times that you know I kind of look back and say wow. Why did they do that one of the things? I have become more humble about her seeing the I could have done it better. Had I been in their shoes but yes. I think the other thing that the book does show is there's been the traditional view that sometimes the US in India didn't get along because they didn't understand each other's views of say China. My book shows that sometimes very understood what the other side's hold about China. They just thought the other side was wrong. So we have divergence and then we moved to what in the late nineteen fifty s and early ninety six? Glad to what you call the convergence of us and Indian views. What happened during that time? So a key thing that happens during one thousand nine hundred ninety six thousand nine hundred fifty seven. My book makes the argument in the section called. Convergence this to chapter section. Call convergence that what happens to cause the change is that the US and Indian views of China as a challenge start converging and part of the Eisenhower Administration in its second term starts to see the Cold War as not just a geopolitical battle but also an economic battle an ideological battle and from this. Let's it was important that democratic India win the race the fateful racist they called it against Soviet ally China which was developing at the time and sued Eisenhower Administration started to see China. Not just at political tract as it had but also as an ideological one in Asia and on the inside you start to see narrow who had had some concerns about China but his administration his government had essentially said either. They had time to deal with those concerns. All that China would also be very busy growing and developing economically and wouldn't be concerned about external problems they find in the narrow government that in nineteen fifty-six around Nineteen fifty-six fifty-seven their view of China needed to be different and they start to take a more concerned view of China and start seeing it as more assertive. They start having concern about Chinese behavior and they start seeing it not just as an ideological challenge as they had in the early fifties but a geopolitical one. This is when you start to see China raise questions about the Sino Indian boundary and said that it wasn't a settled question. You start to see China getting much more involved in India's neighborhood particularly in Nepal which causes deep concern in India and you see China harden its position on things like Tabet and finally you see Indian. Start to question whether some of the commitments China had made in some of the agreements that China and India outside whether China was really living up to. Its promises that it had made and there was a broader concern. That the Chinese were in fact taking more hostile view of global issues as well then even the Soviet Union and so you saw India now actually an Indian the US sports in China very much as a and economic and ideological challenge. And you also see them starting to agreed that what is needed to tackle. That challenge was a partnership with each other. And so that really officers convergence not just on threat perception. It causes convergence in terms of how to deal with the threat and for India. The benefit was bought of what a US thought was needed was for the US to aid India to help its rise and help its development and so that started to mean from the Second Eisenhower Administration through the Kennedy Administration billions of dollars of economic and food aid to India and you talk about thought the development aid food for peace program Peel for eighty which continued for a long time is still on the program itself did end in the are no longer is now food exporter and the US helped it in the sixties as part of this effort to build up a lot of scientific elaboration between Indian and American scientists. Even the strange American Indian program called grow met which I kept reading. His gromit in the archives grow met which was essentially a plan to help seed rain in India to ensure more consistent rainfall all this essentially to help agricultural production economic growth in India. And so you do see the Peo- forty program eventually wind down because India has a green revolution and that helps but you see one of the benefits of the PL of Roy D. program around the country here in the US to this day because one of the ways. India paid for that green that went to India from the. Us was through books and so these void libraries were established in many key universities in the country including where I did my phd at the University of Texas which became a depositry for a lot of South Asia books so it was a quid pro quo of a sword absolutely then. How important was the Sino Indian War of ninety? Sixty two to a deepened India. Us relationship many people still think in some ways at least during the Cold War period. It was the zenith of the relationship. What you had is the Kennedy Administration. Come to India's assistance with very quick delivery and mind you. These are two countries that do not have an alliance the US was not obliged to come to India's assistance but because it could not see. India fall to China and India was in desperate straits at that time because of shortages in military equipment and there was some real setbacks during the war itself which took place in October November. Nineteen sixty two. There was also a certain problem that neither the US India had expected the war even though they had been kind of border incidents between China and India so the US very speedily had to deliver large amounts of military equipment and they will also as the war continued. There was an Indian request by Prime Minister. Who quite controversial to stay for the US to even help it with ED defense and potentially even for the US to have its own pilots help defend India skies had the war continued. It didn't but what the sixty two war really did is. This is very clear. Example of the US without an alliance because of the Cold War framing coming to India's assistance in this war against Soviet ally China the other important part about the nine hundred sixty two war the US. India relationship is that all had been some discussion even before it about military equipment sales to India even military assistance to India. A but you really see after nineteen sixty two is when you see for the next few years in fact almost to the late sixties and even to the early seventies to some extent a military relationship and intelligence sharing relationship that we are only finding out about some aspects of it. Thanks to the newly released papers this included India allowing American. You choose to take off from its base or to fly over. India advocates was from Thailand. You saw the US supply equipment military equipment or India over the sixties and not as much as the Soviet Union but nonetheless. I did supply and in the very crucial agreement at least a largely forgotten. One air defense agreement that was signed in nine hundred sixty three where the US and India agreed that if China attacked India again the two countries would get into mutual consultations to talk about the US coming in to help defend India in the case of another. Sino Indian war now does not quite an alliance but as Kennedy put it. It has the substance of alignment even if not the reality of it. The Johnson and Nixon administration years in the US saw what you term the era disengagement the unraveling of us an Indian convergence on China. What were the central issues? That led to that unraveling in the Johnson Administration. You still see. He's a true believer in terms of this idea that you couldn't have India fall in the face of a communist China that the US might not be able to build India India having lost the Sino Indian wall and also having had some economic setbacks because of some drought conditions in India the US had moved from trying to build India up to just ensuring that didn't fall in language with us today. India's too big to fail but you still saw Johnson as a true believer in this idea that he had to support in the it was able to support itself against China and not just militarily but economically as well but you do see him starting to become really frustrated about Indian performance so this is the period where yes India and the US agree. That China is a major threat but they start disagreeing on what is necessary to do to tackle that threat the US wants to see. India spend far more resources development its development needs not much defense saying the. Us can take care of that whereas India wanted to spend more on defense having been caught out by surprise in the nine hundred sixty two war the US wanted India to reach an agreement with Buxton to then together for Indian Buxton to tackle China. So they they saw Pakistan India China solution. India saw box donnas parts of China problem because there was a budding China Buxton relationship and alliance starting in the sixty s and finally the US and India disagreed on whether the Soviet Union what kind of role it could play against China the US talk that India should essentially ally largely with the US and its allies and partners. India actually thought it should have not an alliance but a diversified portfolio of partners that included the Soviet Union. And so you do see these real divergences come up. In this period of the Johnson administration the Nixon administration. There's a real kind of break. And you see this a real kind of change from that sixty two war period to nineteen seventy-one war which takes place after two years of the Nixon administration and it is between India and Pakistan at that point the US actually was range with box Tan and China. Against in your at least that was how it was seen in India. Which then signed an alignment or treaty with the Soviet Union? And so there's this odd wherein the one thousand nine hundred eighty two war the US had come to India's assistance in a war against China and had told boxed onto back off and not eight China as China was fighting India and now in nineteen seventy one the Indians having launched the defense agreement and other commitments the US had made to it would no longer valid. They found that the US was actually encouraging China to comment on behalf of Pakistan to help them fight. India I'm going to jump forward now to the end of the Cold War and to the current era. And how would you describe the triangle? Today in some ways the triangle is perhaps where it was in what I call that section convergence. We are in many ways in a period of convergence between the US and India that they bought share a view of China. Not It's rise but particularly its behavior as a cause for concern so they do see it as a challenge. I think maybe two different degrees. The trump administration's been far more vocal than the moldy governed. India has but both the Moldy government and the trump administration and frankly there predescessors for since about the mid-2000s have seen China as a challenge and they have seen that one way to deal with that challenge is for the US India strategic partnership to build up and that building up has taken place over the last fifteen or twenty years. An Indian former policymaker. Brookings Press also as well Shivshankar Menon former national. Security Advisor has called convergence in China the strategic glue in the US India relationship having said that The other part of the triangle is that both the US and India maintain relationship with China and India at least actually uses its partnership with the US to try to get some concessions or some stabilizing of the relationship with China and you do see China on. Its bought actually trying to shape the US in relationship often trying to create a wedge between the US and India and Indian spot becoming concerned anytime. There's a sign that they will be. Us China deal or partnership. What India thinks of as g two so the triangle is if anything more fateful today because these are going to be the three largest economies in the world three largest countries definitely in the future and what happens between them will not just have implications for these three countries but arguably all of Asia and globally as well. President trump is on his way to India. What does the book tell us about the relationship with China and India at this time as trump is on his way so I started this conversation with talking about one trip that involved? Usa Nita's that of prime minister narrow. Toby nine hundred forty nine to the United States to meet President Trump China was very much looming in the shadow there even though in public speeches. It wasn't often mentioned an arguably. This is the same thing that we're going to see. Would president trump's trip in India? This trip would not be taking place if the two countries did not share a view of China. And that the idea that that China challenge required. Us India strategic partnership after all their many differences in the US. India relationship many disappointments but it is still a strategic glue. That's keeping the US and India together in a very crucial where it's not the only reason the US in India have partnership but it is a fairly significant one and so while you might not see either side in speeches mentioned China. The perhaps president trump will since he doesn't usually follow the protocols of democracy but he might not mention it he might mention it but we will see us things like talk about a rules based in Asia or the Indo Pacific. It's been called these days. You will see highlighting. Defense Equipment Order. Offense deals that India has bought from the United States which is often either for its maritime concerns as China becomes more involved in the Indian Ocean or at its land boundary. And so you'll see. China can have lurking in the shadow of this trump trip to India very much. So but you wouldn't have seen as I said this trip without China shadow lurking in the background. Though we might even see it in the forefront today depending on how the trip goes Thandi. Thank you for coming by today to talk about your new book. People Triangle how China shaped you as India relations during the Cold War. Thank you bill. It was a pleasure. You can get fateful triangle how China's shaped US relations during the Cold War from our website or wherever he liked to get books. And now. Here's David Wessel. With another wessels economic. Update I'm David Wessel. And this is my economic update the US economy's doing pretty darn well. These days unemployment is at a fifty year. Low wages particularly at the bottom are finally climbing the sheriff Americans who are working part time but who'd prefer full-time jobs is lower than it was back in two thousand and seven before the Great Recession. The stock market is soaring to be sure. The fruits of these good times are not evenly shared. Plenty of places are left behind and lots of middle class. People are struggling but the widespread fears last year that the US might be sliding into a recession about now have dissipated the US is doing markedly better than much of the rest of the world which raises a big question to paraphrase. Something Alan Greenspan. The Fed Chairman's had twenty years ago can the US remain in a waste of prosperity if everyone else is doing poorly. There's plenty to worry about overseas. Europe is barely growing. The European Central Bank doesn't have much room to maneuver in. Germany remains reluctant increase. Spending and cut taxes. Britain is coping with Brexit. Several Latin American economies are in turmoil. Japan is sliding into a recession and trade tensions persist despite the phase one China. Us trade deal which still leaves the US with much higher tariffs in place than bt before trump and then there is the corona virus a human tragedy with significant economic implications is brought parts of the Chinese economy to a halt and disrupted economically important cross-border tourism and disrupted global supply chains. It's quite difficult to estimate economic effect of the virus. Because no one can be sure how soon it'll be contained but one thing we do know. China is a lot bigger factor in the global economy than it was back in two thousand and three at the time of the SARS outbreak back. Then China accounted for less than five percent of world. Gdp today accounts for more than sixteen percent. It's the world's second largest economy now. China's economy will obviously be hit pretty hard by the virus and so we'll surrounding economies that are closely linked to China Hong Kong Singapore Taiwan economists and financial markets though seemed to anticipate the most of the damage to global growth will occur in the first quarter and then things will start to get better. Keep your fingers. Crossed as the International Monetary Fund. Put it recently. Global growth appears to be bottoming out but the projected recovery is fragile and risks remain skewed to the down side in other words the IMF is saying. Look we're giving you our best guess for the world economy and it looks okay but if we're wrong. Things are far more likely to be worse than we are projecting than better even before the corona virus the world economy was suffering disappointingly slow growth in productivity widening inequality in erosion of public trust in institutions and populist fervor so the big question is whether the corona virus will spread in tip the global economy into a recession. And whether that will pull the US economy down with it the US is less vulnerable to other economies than many other countries. We still make most of what we consume and we consume most of what we produce but if the corona virus spreads significantly beyond China in if the disruptions to global commerce extend well beyond the middle of this year even the. Us economy is vulnerable. The Brookings Cafeteria podcast is the product of an amazing team of colleagues starting with audio engineer. Gas On radio and producer Chris Mckenna Bill Fining Director of the Brookings Institution Press. Does the book interviews. And the zette Baylor and Eric Blah and provide design and web support our intern this semester. Is Amelia Hames? Finally my thanks to Camillo Ramirez and Emily Horne for their guidance and support. The Brookings Cafeteria is brought to you by the Brookings podcast network which also produces dollar incense. The current Antar events podcasts. Email your questions and comments to me at B. C. P. at Brookings Dot. Edu If you have a question for a scholar include an audio file an. I'll play it in the answer on the air. Follow us on twitter at policy podcasts. You can listen to the Brookings Cafeteria and all the usual places visit US online at Brookings Dot. Edu until next time. I'm fred dues.

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118 - The Nation's 10th Keeper David Ferriero, Archivist of the United States

The Kitchen Sisters Present

22:12 min | 1 year ago

118 - The Nation's 10th Keeper David Ferriero, Archivist of the United States

"Radio. Welcome to the kitchen sisters present. We're the kitchen sisters, Dave Nelson and Nikki Silva. Let's be clear. The papers don't belong to Brad Kavanagh, George Bush, or Donald Trump. They belong to the American people. That's why we have a national archives. It's a foundation of our democracy, having records of what transpired in the great history of this nation informs us, and it's like a dictatorship to say those records should not be available or only the pieces that we want should be available. That's not the free and open debate. That's not the democracy treasure here in America. At Senate minority leader Chuck Schumer, you might remember the controversy surrounding the nomination of judge. Brett Cavanaugh to the supreme court in July two thousand eighteen I know that was many, many controversies ago. But the Democrats wanted the national archives to release all of their records, relating to Cavanaugh immediately over a million pages over six hundred forty five thousand emails. Here's Senator Schumer again I called the archivist myself yesterday. I made a request of him that even if the Bush library, even if the Republican lawyers, even if chairman Grassley says, don't give up the records that he should have the strength the courage and the fidelity to what an archives is about to give us those records. The person Schumer talked to was David Ferrie, the head of the national archives appointed by President Obama in two thousand ten there's an entire webpage on the national archive site devoted to the back and forth between David Ferrie out, the Democrats, the Republicans to foia lawsuits that were filed and the release of over one hundred thousand documents to date, relating to cabin such is the job of the archivist of the United States who knew in two thousand seventeen when we began our keeper series about activists, archivists rogue librarians, and protectors of the free flow of information. We sat down with David Farrow to talk about his work, and the history and mission of the national archives today, the kitchen sisters present the nation's tenth keeper. David Barrio archivist of the United States. I'm David vario I'm the archivist of the United States. I am responsible for an agency that has the. Ability for ensuring that the records of the US government are created maintained and delivered to us in the manner that the American public can have access to them in perpetuity. How does the word keeper resonate with you? It's an important part of the responsibility. But I'm much more focused on access. There's a reason for keeping its to make records available from the very beginning the intent was, and this is Franklin Roosevelt. The archives was created that the American people needed to be able to access the records in order to hold the government accountable for its actions. And that's keeping means. There has been concerned from the very beginning about the records wonderful letter from Thomas. Jefferson in Paris, and think it's seventeen Eighty-nine where he's talking about we've got to do something about the records because day by day they're they're at risk. In fact, continental congress the last session, there was a wonderful debate about the journalists of the convention, and whether they should burn them or not less. They fall into the wrong hands and left it up to George Washington to make that decision and he said, I think we'd better keep him in. We have them. From the very beginning. They were people who are dead serious about ensuring that the records are kept we have all the oath of allegiance, signed Valley, Forge by George Washington's turps. They had no food they had no uniforms, but they had thousands of pre-printed forms. That they had to sign and witness. And that was the beginning, the beginning of government bureaucracy. My favorite person might hero in all of this is a clerked in the State Department, and Stephen, Pleasanton, who the night before the British burned the town in eighteen twelve or eighteen twelve realized that the chargers were at risk. Can he roll them up stuff them into linen sex commandeer to wagon on the street and took them into the ills of Virginia? Yeah. The only reason that the constitution and the declaration of independence and the Bill of rights have survived his because of Stephen Pleasanton. Do you think there's a certain personality involved here in the keeping and Pleasanton obsessive compulsive? Is that what you're after? Anal retentive now, there's a belief in documentation, there's a belief in ensuring that our history is preserved. And there's I think the from the very beginning a realization that something important is going on recognizing the future. Generations are going to want to know what's going on. Okay. FDR says we've got to keep these things then what happens after are was. I'm convinced was a closet archivist himself. He called the archives his baby designed a box two houses papers, which is the prototype of the boxes that we use. Now, he hired the first archivist Robert de w Connor his papers are at Chapel Hill. I was limited joke in. So when I was going through my confirmation hearing, I called my friends at Chapel Hill in. They sent me copies of everything that caught a wrote about what he was up against what it was like what is interview is like, with FDR was summer. He was wearing a woollen suit and his songwriting bullets and the president asking now it is. It's pronounced archivist. Right. Not archivist. So from the very beginning, though, is this, how do you pronounce it? What is what is it all about? So he puts up a call was everybody running up to him with these collections. Oh my God. That was that was the biggest problem he had. That's just cracks me up. You want me to give up my records about you're talking about nothing changes some of the pictures from Connors early visits shows horrible conditions records, are stored in Addison basements, all over town records of the White House during the Hayes administration, kept in garage on the White House lawn. Fire broke out the president himself was out there in the bucket brigade. Putting the fire out to save the records. It's amazing. What has survived has survived. So it turns out certain agencies weren't willing to cooperate it got to the point, where if DR ahead to kind of lay down the law with the cabinet. He arranged to be wheeled over to the State Department after hours to take a look at the records that were being kept because State Department said, we need all of these records for our active business. We need to have them right here FDR describes this long narrow room with filing cabinets on each side of the room and heals himself up to one of them at random opens a drawer, pulls out a file Mongolian ponies a report on. Mongolian ponies. Okay. So he discovered that report. This is nineteen thirties, was never transferred. Is it didn't by custody? Do I have it? We don't have it at the, the national archives. Some working the State Department deceit juice still have that report. I wanna use it somehow your love of librarian ship, and archiving. Where did that come from? When I was a kid, I grew up in north Beverly Massachusetts. And there was a branch of the public library within walking distance. I was old enough to be able to go to the barber which was across the street by myself. I could go across the street to the branch at the public library, which happened to be in a flora shop conscious florist shop, the head one bookcase with probably five shelves on the bottom shelf for the kids books, and that was my introduction to libraries, sitting on the floor against they're sitting on the floor surrounded by buckets of fresh flowers. It's wonderful, wonderful experience. So how, how do you get picked to be the keeper of the archives? That's a good question because I've been very fortunate. I've had. I've had great jobs. So I met the New York public expecting to retired from the New York public, it was April two thousand nine a check up the phone and this twelve year old was working on appointments for the president says Archer surprised to be getting a call from the White House. I'm like, what is this? And he said, he said, we're looking at you for archivists in the United States. I said, you know, I think you're looking at the wrong guy, I've, I've never contributed. A lot of money to a campaign. You've never hired anyone who knows the business. I mean, the last the governor of Kansas was the archivist of the United States. It's a political appointment, it became clear that they were serious. They wanted someone who knew the business and it was all around. The president's open government initiative, and the belief that the national archives had an important role to play in the oven government initiative. So they wanted someone who knew the business and was experienced in digital technology in all those kinds of things. But what's happening there that you felt you could push in a new direction the shift from paper to electric records, the government had been in a purely paper mode, the guidance from the national archives to the agency was print and save so being able to manage that shift from paper to electron recordkeeping, was huge in, then the whole concept of open government, making records available opening up declassifying the argument that continued to make is you can't have open government. If you don't have good records management, President Obama issued a memory and among managing government records, first time since the Truman. Administration that the White House has gotten involved in records management. The national archives is responsible for fourteen presidential libraries, when I became the archivist admit with the directors of those libraries for the first time they went around the room and introduce themselves and the director of the candidate, and it's me a copy of a letter that a kid wrote to the president asking for information about the proposed peace corps. It's letter for me. Don't remember ever writing the letter. So there was that was my signature more stunning was watching the faces of the other twelve directors. Because they were like, oh my God. How am I going to talk this? So sure enough within two weeks. The director of the Eisenhower called to say they found two letters from me to President Eisenhower. And when I was at the LBJ, they handed me the copy of a letter that I wrote to LBJ congratulating him for signing the Civil Rights Act. A nerd, obviously didn't have a life. I was writing letters to the president. A letter of condolence to Jackie Kennedy, you know, it's they they're still finding stuff. I think we almost have enough for a private exhibit of David Ferriol correspondence with the president's. We'll be right back with David Farrow, and stories of the map thief. And what happens when people can no longer read cursive. The kitchen sisters present is sponsored by myrow a Platt power deodorant made with a blend of one hundred percent natural sense and essential oils that release over time to keep you fresh. My rodeo is vegan gluten free Soifer free and cruelty free with no toxic anything and it works. I like the smell it subtle and natural I tried out cabin. Number five Woody and fresh. But subtle one of my favorite features is my rose refillable case, which reduces plastic waste by approximately fifty percent versus typical drugstore deodorants. He'll receive a three D odorant pod refill every three months delivered straight to your door. You can mix and match sense press. Pause or cancel refills. Anytime get fifty percent off your first order and get started today for just five dollars. Visit my myrow dot com slash kitchen, sisters and use promo code kitchen sisters. That's. M. Y. M. Y. R. Oh dot com slash kitchen, sisters and use promo code kitchen. Sisters. Tension between protection and access. It's the biggest issue. And it's an issue that all of us in these kinds of institutions, whether it's a library archives are museum deal with every day. In every one of my jobs. I've been through horrible situations where stuff is disappeared. Stuff has been destroyed cases like guy who ingratiated himself to several presidential libraries, especially in effect at a career as a presidential historian, still several drafts of FDR speeches from the FDR in library. He had a suit coat that had deep pockets sewn into it. This is how we get stuff out in the evidence. File in the code itself behead. The map thief at the new York Public Library hit seven different institutions. I learned a lot from that one. You got something like thirty two maps from the new York, Public Library. Single sheet maps, but also maps in the backs of books. What he had done is gone to public libraries and stolen maps from circulating books, different sizes, shapes colors age of the paper in his pocket. He would have they samples. He would go to the rare book collection and ask for a book that had a map in it, and then he would take what that'll flaws use it to lifts. The rare map out and replace it with one that looked same size. When he returned the book, they would check to see whether there was a map there, but they would not open at the map, the have become so close to the map folks at the new York Public Library, he helped them form the Mercator society, the betrayal that the staff out when this all broke. But collection sits at about thirteen billion pieces of paper, forty three million photographs miles and miles of film and video and about six billion electron crackers so far, started collecting during the Reagan administration electronic mail. So between Reagan and Bush forty one about two point five million Email messages, twenty million from the Clinton White House, two hundred and ten million from Bush forty three and over three hundred million for Obama President Obama was the first administration to be seriously using Twitter. So we have all the Obama tweets the current president's tweets, we are capturing both the personal account, the real Donald Trump in the potus accounts, and the deleted once, you know, that's part of the capture. My favorite things. There is some documents that just. You know, from history that we bought Alaska is actually a check for seven point two million dollars to run on the Riggs Bank. And you flip it over, and there was the Russian endorsement of they just took this thing to the Riggs Bank and walked out with seven point two million dollars in gold. A wonderful letter from any Oakley to William McKinley, offering to raise a troop of fifty sharp shirt, or women, who would supply their own rifles ammunition to fight the Spanish American war. A letter from in nineteen seventeen. A letter from the president of the national association opposed women's suffrage to her. Congressman petitioning him to not vote for women's fridge, because it would result in the national campaign of nagging. Wonderful letter to FDR from kid in Cuba, is twelve or fourteen years old, asking the president for a ten dollar Bill because there's never seen it ten dollar Bill. And if the president would send him that he would show him where the or deposits are in Cuba, so he could Bill ships. It's a letter from Fidel Castro. I often wonder if, if only Roosevelt, it's sent that kid, ten dollar Bill would that have changed the course of history? That's what's so exciting about this business. Is that every day, there are these discoveries that are being made because there's so much stuff. And because, you know, most of the keepers have high level control over their collections, but not item level control. Every time a researcher concern and uses a set of records, we learned so much about what's in the collection, one of those recently found a letter that he soldier wrote to his mother, and in parentheses says written by Walt Whitman a friend. While Whitman spent time in the hospitals during the civil war. Doing this writing letters home for soldiers who couldn't right? The traditional role of archives has been collecting and protecting I huge shift or emphasis on excess. Social media has been a wonderful tool for all of us to use to get our stuff out there. So everytime one these discoveries is made its Ray out there. Everyone knows about it. Open this transparency. I mean, that's what that's what we're all about engaging, the community in the work that you're doing with the national archives citizen archivist program, where we have people transcribing our records cursive, isn't Todd anymore in the schools. And we've got billions of records in cursive, the kids today can't read, so we have a prescription program, where thousands of folks around the world are transcribing our records. So that kids can even three them forty three million photographs in the national archives. Not all of them have the appropriate level of identification. So we've got tagging projects going on all kinds of things to engage the community in the work that we're doing. We don't collect just the good stuff we collect everything that's a role, and we've got some bad stuff in our history. Indian treaties. Take a look at injuries. All of the things that the US government promised these people in terms of hospitals schools. Money for the land and never delivered on any of them. We have Indian elders and Indian lawyers, visit all the time to read the language of these treaties. Because there are still cases around water rights land rights that are being tried based on these documents. My office is in a right around the corner from the rotunda. So I can every day, see firsthand how those documents are affecting people about a million and a half people the year walking through the rotunda twice a year. We do naturalization ceremonies in the rotunda and new citizens, sworn in front of the constitution and is to see them experiencing the documents outlining the rights that are now there's. It just makes it all the more important that the work that we do as carries on that. Whereas for documenting what's going on the truth? Conversation with the tenth keeper of the United States was produced by the kitchen, sisters, Nikki Silva. N Davey Nelson with Nathan Dalton. And brandy hell special, thanks to David Farrow, in the national archives and to the society of American archivists. The kitchen sisters present is part of radio Tokyo from P, R X, a curated network of extraordinary, cutting edge podcasts created by independent producers. Visit the kitchen, sisters dot org to find out about our events and upcoming workshops, follow us on Facebook, Instagram Twitter. We'd love to hear your thoughts and ideas. Thanks for listening. Radio.

president United States President Obama FDR David Farrow State Department Public Library Nikki Silva Senator Schumer White House Donald Trump Franklin Roosevelt Brett Cavanaugh David Ferrie New York George Bush Dave Nelson George Washington America David vario
21: On the Edge of Armageddon Part I (Dwight D. Eisenhower)

This American President

57:33 min | 11 months ago

21: On the Edge of Armageddon Part I (Dwight D. Eisenhower)

"We just wanted to give you an update on our kickstarter campaign to raise money for podcast studio, and in short it was a great success. We had a minimum goal of eighteen hundred dollars, and we ended up with thirty, three hundred eighty one dollars. And for those who donated? We just wanted to thank you for your generous support. and. You should have also received an email asking for your information so that we can give you your ward, and if you haven't already, please fill it out. Expect to get your merchandise by June of twenty twenty. You have any questions. Please email us and this American. President at G mail, DOT COM or send us a message through the kickstarter. In our previous episode, we covered the first president of the cold. War. Era Harry S Truman. It was under President Truman that America initiated its policy of containment to contain wooded, considered the greatest threat to world. Peace the Soviet Union. This new conflict the Cold War was unlike anything ever before it now two nations dominated the globe, and with the development of thermonuclear weapons have the capacity to destroy civilization itself. History had entrusted Harry Truman with defense of the free world, and he confronted crisis after crisis, always with the specter of nuclear war in the background. But now Truman's presidency was over, and he had left the world's stage. In his place was one of the most capable and experienced leaders in American history, his name was dwight. David Eisenhower the great hero of World War Two. The Supreme Allied Commander, who had invaded Normandy, defeated Hitler and liberated Europe. Now Eisenhower or Ike as his friends called him. Of leading the free world during this dangerous time? Few people today can recall the major events or accomplishments of Eisenhower's presidency. Too many, he is Amir transitional figure, the president who served during the stale and Cookie Cutter Nineteen, fifties between the years of war under FDR and Truman and the social upheaval under Kennedy and Johnson. But Eisenhower was no mere interlude like Truman. His presidency was one of crises when American credibility and nuclear war were constantly at stake. Every decision he made involved delicate balance of terror that could mean either peace or annihilation. HOW EISENHOWER! Piece in avoided. Armageddon is the subject of this episode of this American President. A. Own! White the Eisenhower was a man of humble beginnings? He was born in eighteen ninety in Denison Texas. The third of seven boys his father owned a store when it failed, he later worked on the railroads as mechanic and then at a creamery. His mother was a Mennonite and later a Jehovah's witness she was also an avowed pacifist, Ironic, considering her son Dwight's future career path. The, Eisenhower soon moved to Abilene. Kansas young white had an idyllic childhood. He worked hard at his. But he also enjoyed the outdoors. You'd go hunting and fishing for hours like his predecessor Harry Truman. He became an avid reader especially on military history something that would serve him well throughout his career. Of His. Childhood, Eisenhower would later write quote. I have found out in later years. We were very poor, but the glory of America is that we didn't know it then. Eisenhower's family lived frugally when his father's general store failed, the family was forced to tighten their belts that lesson. The importance of living within ones means stuck eisenhower for his entire career as we will see. This lead Ike to consider going to either the Naval Academy or West Point, since both offered free college degrees. He was beyond the age limit for the Naval Academy. So in nineteen eleven. He became a student at West Point. At West Point Eisenhower was an average student, but he did well in sports, playing for the Varsity football team and taking up fencing and gymnastics. After graduating in Nineteen fifteen, he married a woman. They me doubt. Soon America entered World War One, and like many young men of his day Eisenhower hoped to get in on the action overseas, but he would end up being disappointed. Instead, he was given assignments in the United States. He was stuck training tank crews that never even saw combat. He never got to fight abroad during the war, which left him feeling bitter and depressed. Throughout the next couple of decades, Eisenhower worked, either with or for many of the men who would emerge as the top military figures of World War Two. He collaborated with George Patton on new ideas for tank warfare ideas. That were way ahead of their time. He served under General Fox Connor. Who has an intellectual mentor to him? Through Connor I studied Clausewitz and other military classics. By then Eisenhower was a serious student and had come into his own intellectually. From nineteen, twenty five to twenty six, he attended the command and General Staff College in Fort Leavenworth and graduated first in his class of two hundred forty five officers. Eisenhower later worked as General Douglas Macarthur's military aid in the Philippines that experience taught him two things. First how to handle relations with foreign ally and second how to handle the man with as massive and ego is General Macarthur. When. America entered World War Two in nineteen, forty, one general George Marshall Hired Eisenhower, as a war planner, Marshall had an eye for talent and realize that Eisenhower was one of the best. Many had maybe the best. Thus began Eisenhower's meteoric rise within a year. He was running the allied operation in North Africa, his success. They're impressed president. D Roosevelt. The military began planning for the critical invasion of France to liberate the European continent from Hitler's rule. Many observers believed that Roosevelt would put Marshall. In charge of the invasion, an FDR knew that whoever would lead that invasion if successful would be remembered as the great American military hero of World War Two. He Felt Marshall. Deserve the honor and recognition, but he also wanted Marshall by his side. And Roosevelt knew that Eisenhower had considerable skill in military planning in maintaining coalitions. By December nineteen, forty-three FDR had decided that Eisenhower would command the invasion known as D Day. Eisenhower would now be leading the largest seaborne invasion in world history involving over two million men. The president announced the decision in a fireside chat in December of Nineteen forty-three. The commander selected leave the combined effect. From these points. Is General Dwight, D Eisenhower. Is Performances in Africa. In Sicily and Italy. Been Brilliant. He knows my practical successful experience the way to coordinate. Sea and land power. All, of these, we'll be under his control. The world's hopes for defeating Hitler rested on Eisenhower Shoulders. He's back to his men just before the invasion began on June sixth nineteen, forty four. Soldiers sailors airman of the Allied Expeditionary Force. You are about to embark upon the great crusade. Toward which we have striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The hopes and prayers of liberty. Loving people everywhere March with you. In company with our brave allies and brothers in arms on other fronts, you will bring about the destruction of the German war machine the elimination, of Nazi tyranny over the oppressed peoples of Europe. And security for ourselves in a free world. Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well-trained, well-equipped battle-hardened. He will fight savagely. But this is the year in one, thousand, nine, hundred, forty four. Much has happened since the Nazi triumphs of nineteen forty forty one. The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans. Great defeats in Open Battle man-to-man. Our air offensive has seriously reduced their strength in the air and their capacity to wage war on the ground. Are Home Fronts have given us an overwhelming superiority in weapons and munitions war. And placed at our disposal, great reserves of trained fighting men. The tide has turned. The Freeman of the world are marching together to victory. I have full confidence in your courage devotion to duty and skill in battle. We will accept nothing less than full victory. Good, luck? And let us all be seats. The blessing of Almighty God upon this brave and noble undertaking. At the same time Eisenhower had a statement prepared in the event of a failure. It read quote. Our landings in the Cherbourg Harbour area have failed to gain a satisfactory foothold, and I've withdrawn the troops. My decision to attack at this time and place was based on the best information available. The troops, the air and the Navy did all that bravery and devotion to duty could do. If any blame or fault attached to the attempt, it is mine alone. Thankfully Eisenhower never had to read that statement. The operation was a great success less than a year later may nineteen forty-five, Hitler was dead, and the allies were victorious in Europe. By the end of World War Two Eisenhower was a national hero, and it's not surprising that he was immediately being discussed as a presidential candidate. After all victorious generals going back to George Washington and Andrew Jackson had a good track record for winning the presidency. Eisenhower was so well respected that even the incumbent president. Harry Truman verbally offered him the Presidency Truman told. that he would willingly give up his spot on the top of the ticket and run as Eisenhower's running mate in nineteen, forty eight. Hour was taken aback by the comment. He publicly refused to become a candidate, but his supporters feared that Eisenhower was missing his one chance for the presidency if he didn't run in nineteen, forty, eight, the Republicans were heavily favored to win that year, and it was assumed that new. York governor Thomas Dewey with the nomination. After, winning in nineteen, forty eight do we would likely run for reelection in nineteen, fifty, two, leaving nineteen, fifty, six, as the earliest eisenhower could run. By then he would be sixty five years old, perhaps too old to run. But in the end do he was defeated in nineteen, forty eight by President Truman in one of the greatest upsets in American history. History thus left the door wide open for Eisenhower in nineteen, fifty two throughout the postwar years, Eisenhower, wrote his memoirs and served in other leadership capacities. He became the president. Of Columbia University and then the supreme commander of NATO in that latter position, Eisenhower remained on the world stage. He was the leader of the world's most powerful alliance and basically a head of state in his own right. Few men ever had better preparation to be president, but he had to go through the political process at home if he wanted to be president, he revealed that he considered himself right of center, more aligning with the Republican Party, but he differed with many Republican politicians that identified with the old guard, those Republicans who hoped to rollback FDR's new deal, and who supported a more non interventionist foreign policy, one leery of too much involvement in the world. Eisenhower, the man who had led the allied effort in Europe during the war, and was now head of NATO was internationalist. He believed that in the Cold War Era America had to lead the cause of freedom. Although he was conservative in temperament, he was not a conservative ideologue. He was what one might consider a moderate conservative. In the nineteen fifty two election conservative Robert Taft Son of the former President William. Howard Taft was the front runner for the GOP nomination and an old guard conservative. Eisenhower feared America would reject internationalism if taft won the presidency. Thus Eisenhower became a candidate and won a close and controversial race for the nomination. Aches AIDS recommended that he select the young senator from California Richard Nixon, as his running mate, the thirty eight year old Nixon had made a name for himself as a staunch anti-communist. They made for fascinating pair. Eisenhower was the elder statesmen and military hero while Nixon was the young attack dog. Facing them was the wonky Democratic nominee Ashley Stevenson. The election had its controversy the most famous one being allegations that Nixon had a secret slush fund with donations from rich businessmen. Nixon deflected the allegations with his famous checkers speech. Either Way Eisenhower was the most popular man in America, so Stevenson didn't have a chance. It was a choice between the victorious general of World War Two or a guy, some labeled as an egghead intellectual, so I'm sure you can see where this is going. On Election Night Eisenhower won a landslide victory winning thirty nine out of forty eight states. It was a resurrection for the Republicans they had lost the previous five presidential elections Dwight Eisenhower. A poor boy from Abilene was now the thirty fourth president of the United States. When people what back in the fifties, they generally picture a quiet peaceful time. The era of suburbs, housewives wholesome TV programming like Dobie. Gillis, leave it to beaver my three sons, the Donna Reed show. To an extent, this is true, especially compared with the upheavals in the previous and subsequent decades. But when Eisenhower took office, there was a real sense of fear for about the future. At the eve of the new decade in Nineteen, forty nine, America's great adversary the Soviet! Union attain nuclear capability. United States. No longer had the nuclear monopoly. Joseph. Stalin the butcher of millions now had the power of the atomic bomb. It's kind of like the fear. People have about Kim Jong UN nuclear weapons, but imagine if Kim Jong UN was in charge of the biggest country in the world. And both the Americans and the Soviets racing to build ballistic missiles that could deliver nuclear weapons across the globe in hours even minutes. People felt that World War, three and nuclear holocausts were becoming real possibilities that civilization might actually destroy itself. To Americans. Communism was a very real threat. At almost the same time that the Soviets got the bomb, the most populous nation in the world, China fell to communist leader Mao Zedong. That meant that an additional five hundred million people or a fifth of the world's population. Where now under communist rule? For many Americans it seemed as if communism was destined to spread in the same way, that Fascism did in the nineteen thirties, unless painful sacrifices were made to stop it. That fear wasn't just an external one. There was a genuine threat of Soviet espionage in the United States after all Klaus Fuchs was a German physicist working on the Manhattan project in Los Alamos and was supplying the Soviets with nuclear secrets. The rosenbergs had also been convicted of espionage. Eisenhower's vice, President Richard Nixon had spent his years in Congress. Attacking Communist infiltration in the United States he especially went after Alger Hiss a prominent. State, department official for being a Soviet spy. The man who define this age of paranoia was the infamous. Republican Senator Joseph McCarthy of Wisconsin. McCarthy, who enjoyed high approval ratings from the public claimed several times to have lists of government officials who were communists. He publicly accused officials at the highest levels of government of being Soviet agents, usually with little to no evidence, the most absurd example was his attack on George. Marshall Eisenhower's mentor, and one of the great heroes of World War Two. This era of fear and paranoia defined the early Cold War. But. The war wasn't always cold. There were times when hot wars breakout at by nineteen fifty to America was well into its first hot war of the nuclear age. In nineteen fifty, the communist government of North Korea, invaded anti-communist South Korea. The Truman administration feared that the fall of South Korea so soon after the fall of China would mean the spread of communism all throughout Asia. It viewed the conflict as just one theater in a global struggle between the free world and the Communists world, and it remembered the lessons of appeasement just before world, War Two that appeasing Hitler only invited further aggression too many. Americans the Communist. Invasion of South Korea was further proof that communist bloc led by the Soviet Union and the People's Republic of China was pursuing global domination. And it was true that both the Soviets Ama- Chinese were eating. The North Koreans, so Truman lead an international effort under the United. Nations to repel the invasion. Although General Douglas. Macarthur was able to push North Koreans back. The Chinese intervened invaded the Korean Peninsula. The Chinese succeeded in pushing UN for back south, and resulted in a bloody stalemate in just three years. The United States had over thirty thousand combat deaths less than one decade after World War Two. When American citizen wrote the President Truman quote in Heaven's name. What are you doing? The blood hasn't dried from World War Two. While running in nineteen, fifty two eisenhower announced that he intended to end the war by going to Korea. Those words electrified the nation and gave it hope that peace was around the corner. Less than a month after his election on December. Second Nineteen, fifty two eisenhower arrived in Korea, he inspected the troops and met with American commanders. Some Advice Eisenhower that the war could be won. Generals Mark Clark and James Van. Fleet suggested the use of nuclear weapons in expansion of the war against China, could lead to victory. Now might strike you as alarming that anyone would advise the use of nuclear weapons, but this was the reality of the Cold War. It was something that General Macarthur talked about in Korea just before. President Truman fired him, and it was something that would come up time and time again as we'll see during Eisenhower's presidency, the Cold War was full of unprecedented dilemmas. In, Korea American and Chinese forces engaged in combat, Americans were confident that they could win after all they had defeated both the Nazis, and the Japanese in partnership with the Allies of course. China was a third world country. Surely China would be an easy opponent. But America was unprepared for the Korean War especially since it had demobilized after World War. Two and the Chinese had an enormous number of forces bay virtue of sheer numbers. They pushed back and that's how the stalemate happened. The US now faced a dilemma in order to win. American might have to intensify the war effort sending more forces to fight. But some wondered well, if we have nuclear weapons, why don't we use them? I mean otherwise. What's the point of having them? And as the body bags piled up, more Americans kept wondering. Why are we letting our soldiers get killed if we have a weapon that could end the war once and for all. Nuclear weapons were the most terrifying weapons ever devised by man, but you can see why some people might at least be tempted to think this way to think about using the bomb especially, if you fear the spread of communism, and if you're sick and tired of a bloody stalemate, but of course there were fears for what this would mean if we use nuclear weapons against North Korea or against China, the world could be revolted by their use. America's prestige could be damaged forever. The fallout from nuclear warfare could lead to unprecedented collateral damage, and what if the Soviet responded given their relationship with China in North Korea. They had hundreds of thousands of soldiers in Europe. What if they retaliated by invading our allies in Europe? What if they blockaded and our presence in Berlin and now that they had the bomb? What if they used it against us or our allies? While most people shuddered at the thought of starting a nuclear war with the Soviets. Some felt that this was the time to do. In the Cold War was relatively new Soviets did have the bomb, but they were few years behind the United States in nuclear firepower in the development of the hydrogen bomb in the means to deliver it. Why allow them to catch up? Why not hit them? Now with everything we had so that the Soviets would never get to the point of competing with us. After, all didn't the West wait too long to stop Hitler wouldn't more lives been saved if we had taken on Hiller earlier was stolen. That much different than Hitler. and wasn't Stalin even more dangerous than Hitler now considering he had the bomb. Of course the situation was more complicated than that Hitler and Stalin were both totalitarian tyrants and ruthless killers, but their circumstances weren't exactly the same. Still most people feared what Stalin could do. Especially since he had successfully imposed his grip on Eastern Europe and supported communist movements around the world. They also feared the worst case scenario in all of this that the Soviets would respond in kind to nuclear attack against itself or its allies with a nuclear attack of its own, and then a nuclear war might ensue. The specter of nuclear Holocaust hovered over everything. These were the debates that were raging on in the early. Cold War in Korea would be the first decision for the new president. Despite the advice from Generals Clark and Vanfleet Eisenhower refused to expand the effort in Korea. He rejected their request and move forward with negotiations for now. America's president would not go anywhere near using nukes in Korea, but the temptation to use them or to threaten their use with continued to rise throughout Eisenhower's administration. On. January twentieth. Nineteen fifty-three Dwight D Eisenhower at the age of sixty two took the oath of office in became the thirty fourth president of the United States. Fully aware of the immense burdens he was undertaking. The new president began his inaugural address with a prayer. My friend. Before I begin the expression of those thought. That I deem appropriate. To this moment. Would you permit me the privilege? Of uttering. A little private prayer of my own. And I asked you bow your head. Almighty got. As, we stand here at this moment. My associates in my future associates in the executive branch of government. Join me BESIKCI. The foul will make full and complete. Dedication to the service of the people in this throng. And their fellow citizens everywhere. Give us, we pray. The power to discern clearly right from wrong. And allow all our words and actions to be governed thereby. And by the laws of this land. Especially, we pray that are concerned shall be for all the people. Regardless of station race are. Calling, May cooperation be permitted and be a mutual lane. OF THOSE WHO Under the concepts of our constitution whole to differing political faith. Show that Oh may work for the good of our beloved country. And Glory. I'm in. In the weeks after his election Eisenhower sketched out agenda for his administration. There were two overriding concerns, one immediate and the other long-term. The immediate concern was the Korean War in the plan to negotiate an end to that war. The long term concern was the cold. War and how to contain the Soviet Union. Things are right for change. America wanted to move past the stalemate of the Korean War, but there was also big news out of the Kremlin. Joseph Stalin the totalitarian dictator of the Soviet Union the Godfather of the Communist Movement for almost three decades died of a cerebral hemorrhage on March fifth nineteen fifty-three. There would be a new Soviet leader, although it would take some time to figure out who won the power struggle with new leadership in the White House and the Kremlin. There might be a new way forward in the Cold War. In our previous episodes, we covered President Harry Truman and his containment strategy. It was summed up by George Kennan who said that quote, the main element of any United States policy toward the Soviet Union must be that of long term patient, but firm and vigilant containment of expensive tenancies. It was a middle ground between those who just wanted to negotiate with the Soviets and coexist with them and those who wanted to roll the Soviets. Pushing them from where they were already established. Originally Truman headed here to what was called a strong point defense strategy. He felt that it would be too expensive and difficult to stop the Soviets everywhere as powerful as America was, it cost too much to defend giant swath of international territory, encounter the Soviets wherever they expanded whether it was by military force or aid to communist groups around the world. And it would also give the Soviets the initiative to allow them to bogs down in conflicts around the world. They would be able to decide where the conflicts would start. If we promised to stop them wherever they expanded, they could start them in areas or arenas that played to their strengths and our weaknesses. The strong point defense strategy called for providing economic assistance to allies at certain points around the world, so that those allies could become centers of military and economic strength. That way those allies could stand up on their own feet and share in the burden of containing Soviet expansion. This strategy was made manifest in the Marshall Plan and the Truman doctrine which provided economic aid to Greece and Turkey. It also meant that America wasn't on the hook for defending every country threatened by the Soviets or the Chinese, and it would detract from the Soviets ability to dictate where a conflict or competition would occur. While the Korean War changed all of that. Although Korea was not originally considered a strong. The possibility of millions more falling under the orbit of communism called into question America's commitment to its allies. The Truman Administration now believe that the defeat of South Korea meant a victory for the Communists and decided to commit forces to save it. By then a new strategy document known as NFC sixty eight had been in circulation, it rejected strong point defense and called for a dramatic increase in the defense budget. Truman had originally requested thirteen billion dollars for defense in nineteen fifty. NFC Sixty eight called for increasing that number to forty or fifty billion, almost triple, what was originally requested it called for increasing both conventional and nuclear capabilities and replace strongpoint defense with perimeter defense now America committed defending a large parameter as opposed to merely supporting certain key locations. With the Korean War American. Foreign policy was now guided by NFC sixty eight. By nineteen fifty to the defense budget reached sixty billion dollars. Some feared that America couldn't afford this increase in the defense budget, and might bankrupt itself by overspending betray and believed that the American economy could sustain it. When he was a senator, he was a loyal new dealer and believed that government's spending could stimulate the economy classic, Keynesian Economics. But instead of domestic spending as a stimulus, it would now be defense spending. Many, are you'd that economic growth in world, War Two was proof of this theory. Since government spending had increased to build American tanks ships planes in amunition. Besides Truman believed that spending now to prevent the communist, advance would be less expensive than fighting a war with the communists after they expanded, and we're in a stronger position. As Truman said in nineteen fifty to quote the real threat to our security isn't the danger bankruptcy. It's the danger of communist aggression. If Communism is allowed to absorb the free nations one by one, then we would be isolated from our sources of supply and detached from our friends. Then we would have to take defense measures, which might really bankrupt our economy and change our way of life so that we wouldn't recognize it was American any longer. President Eisenhower sharply disagreed with President, Truman and the premise of NFC sixty eight. I mentioned earlier in the episode about Eisenhower's Frugal background. Well, this would come to define his cold war policy perhaps more than anything else. In the truth episodes, I discussed the paradox of the Cold War. Both sides felt compelled to outdo the other every time. When one side built a tank, the other side built a better tank, same thing for planes and for ships when America built the atomic bomb. The Soviets were compelled to do the same thing when the Soviets got the bomb, the Americans built even more powerful hydrogen bomb, and so on and so forth, but there was a potentially self-defeating logic to all of this did doing the other side necessarily mean superiority or greater security. What, if those weapons had diminishing returns? What if there are cheaper alternatives to achieving safety than matching our ponant S- what if spending all this money potentially bankrupting yourself and destroying your nations credit win that be self-defeating. Would America really win the Cold War if it destroyed its own fiscal health. Eisenhower set as much when he said of the Soviets. Quote, it is more than merely a military threat. It has been coldly calculated by the Soviet leaders for by their military threat. They have hoped to force upon America and the free world, unbearable security burden leading to economic disaster. But, even with all that said to some extent, the United States had to spend money to counter the Soviets, or at least deter them. The US had to be able to defend itself against the communist by some measure. We had to be able to backup containment with some amount of force if containment were to mean anything. But what was the right balance? How do you maintain superiority against the other side without over extending yourself her busting your on budget? Eisenhower saw the Cold War primarily in terms of economics while his Secretary of State John Foster Dulles believed the Cold War was. A moral conflict. Eisenhower wrote quote. We are a product and a representative of the Judeo. Christian civilization and it does teach some concern for your brother and I believe in that. But Eisenhower added quote. The minimum requirement is that we are able to trade freely in spite of anything. Russia may do with those areas from which we obtain the raw materials that are vital for our economy. Dulles summarize view when he said quote. If economic stability goes down the drain, everything goes down the drain. Eisenhower obsessed over the cost of the Cold War. He saw defense spending in terms of what it costs. The American people just three months into his term Eisenhower delivered a speech before the American Society of Newspaper Editors, that outlined that cost. A nations of lasting peace. CanNot be firmly based upon any reason armaments. But rather upon just relations and honest understanding with all other nations. What can the world. or any nation in it. For you know turning is found on this dread road. The worst to be feared. And the. To be expected. Can Be simply statement. The worst is atomic rule. The best would be this. A life of perpetual fear intention. Burden of arms draining the and labor of all people. A wasting of strength that defies the American system on the Soviet system or any to. To achieve true abundance and happiness. For the people of the. Every gun that is made. Every warship launched. Every rocket fire signifies in the final. From those hunger are not fit. Those who are cold and are not. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers. Genius of its science. The hoops of his children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this. A modern brick school in more than thirty said. It is. To Electric power plants. Each serving town of sixty thousand population. It. To find fully equipped hostile. Fifty miles of three. We pay for a single fighter plane with a half million bushels a week. We pay a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than eight thousand people. This is I repeat. The best way of life to be found on the road. The world has been taking. This is not a way of life at all. Then he puts him. Under, the cloud threatening warranted is humanity hanging from across via. Eisenhower did not see defense spending as a stimulus to the economy, he saw it as a burden something that took away from American prosperity and the thriving of American civilization. After all increased defense spending meant higher taxes on the American people, and it could also mean higher national debt. It's fascinating than a military man. A man who spent his career rising in the. was talking about the defense budget in negative terms. Perhaps Eisenhower was the last president who could do this. He wasn't a professional politician. Not was he insa political ideology. He was a national military hero, and therefore he had the clout to espouse policies that contradicted the desires of either party and could combine aspects of both. To this day there are many who agree with Eisenhower's warnings on Defense Meeting and hope to reduce the defense budget. Eisenhower would have counseled us to be wise about what we spend money on, but this didn't mean he didn't recognize the Soviets as a threat. The whole point of his frugality was so that the US could compete with the Soviet Union and more cost effective way. There was no moral ambiguity for Eisenhower. He believed that America was a positive moral force, and the Soviets were an immoral totalitarian government. In Eisenhower's is, it was the Soviets who are responsible for the Cold War starting in the first place. Eisenhower stated. Soviet government yelled at. Different Team of the future. In the world of its design security was to be found. Not In mutual trust and mutual aid. But in force. You Jeremy. Subversion? Rule of neighbor nations. The goal is power superiority. And all costs. Security was to be sought by denying it to all of. The result has been tried to for the world. And for the Soviet Union. It has also been running. The imagining of Soviet power alerted. Free nations to a new danger of aggression. It compel him in self. To spend unprecedented money. And Energy for women's. It force them to develop weapons of war now capable of inflicting incident terrible punishment. Upon any restaurant. In August of nineteen, fifty four Eisenhower would say that quote. The central core of the great world problem is the aggressive intent of international communism. So while Eisenhower feared the cost of the Cold War. He still maintained that the American people had a job to do. He may have disagreed with troms methods of containment, the increase spending the perimeter defense, but not with its goal. The Soviet Union had to be contained, but how? How do you reconcile the paradox of spending in the Cold War with the goal of winning it? To answer that question, Eisenhower decided to explore all possible options while making use of the best minds he could find. To that end he initiated a project. Alarium and it was named that because it was hatched out in the celerion room at the White House, it involved convening a group of brilliant men from the federal government and academia, and it happened in the summer of nineteen, fifty, three as a critical exercise. In that exercise, the men were divided up into three teams with each team exploring three major strategies under consideration. Team was led by George Kennan considered by many to be the father of containment. They were tasked with defending Truman's current policy containment. Team be was tasked with taking a tougher line against the Soviets and focusing more on using US nuclear weapons as a deterrent and team see was also tasked with taking tough line and the Soviets with a focus on an aggressive policy called rollback instead of merely containing Soviet expansion the team would look into whether it would be possible to push them back for more they were. The entire solarium project was so secretive that it remained classified until the mid nineteen eighties. Out of the project came a new strategy that would replace an AC-. Sixty eight. The new document was NFC, one, sixty two, and the new strategy was called the new look. And it was a dramatically different view of containment the goal now the Cold War was to win by not bankrupting ourselves. This meant getting America's fiscal house in order through major cuts in defense spending. This was a time when defense spending took about two thirds of the entire federal budget compare that to now were defense is less than about fifteen percent, which by the way includes both discretionary and non discretionary spending. So, that was the first element of new look. The new strategy also meant staying away from foreign wars as much as possible like the kind. Truman got us into in Korea after all wars are very expensive. It was kind of like a race to frugality where the most cost effective side wins. But how are we to maintain deterrence? Encounter the Soviets if we were reducing defense spending. The answer came into words massive retaliation. NFC One sixty two said that the United States would maintain quote a strong military posture with us on the capability of inflicting massive retaliatory damage by offensive striking power. But if the military budget was slashed were would that power come from? Again an AC- 162 reported that the United States quote will consider nuclear weapons as available for use as other munitions. Essentially the Eisenhower Administration called for greater reliance on nuclear weapons, rather than conventional forces like tanks, ships, planes and personnel as a way to deter communist aggression whether it came from the Soviet Union or the People's Republic of China. Adding to the credibility of this shift Eisenhower early in his presidency had taken control of the nuclear stockpile away from the Civilian Atomic Energy Commission and gave it to the military. Again to some this was terrifying prospect. Did this mean that? The United States threatened to use nuclear weapons whenever Russia China acted aggressively, so if another career happens somewhere? Did this mean that this time we would respond with nuclear weapons. And if we really were using nuclear weapons to deter adversaries, were we actually willing to use them? And what would happen if we did use them? What about the international blowback? What about radiation poisoning and the damage to the environment? And, what if we weren't really willing to use them? What would happen if we threaten to use them in a crisis either against the Soviets of the Chinese, but they were willing to call our bluff. Wouldn't our credibility diminished then? To Eisenhower the policy of massive retaliation was about reducing costs. In fact in nineteen, fifty-five Eisenhower would cut four point eight billion dollars from the defense budget, four point one billion of those cuts came from the army. But it was also more than that again. He feared that the alternative would be to outmatch the Soviets everywhere, countering their every move whether it meant building better tanks or confronting them wherever they acted aggressively. As we said earlier, this was the path to national bankruptcy at least potentially, and it gave the Soviets the initiative to choose where geographically or figuratively fight. But Eisenhower had a different strategy. In the words of Vice President Richard Nixon quote rather than let the Communists Nibble us to death all over the world and little wars we would rely in the future primarily on our massive mobile retaliatory power, which we could use in our discretion against the major source of aggression at times and places we choose. Instead of countering the Soviet strength, we would try to offset those strengths by hitting their weaknesses. This took the initiative away from the Soviets, and gave it back to the United States, but it was risky some claim that it was defense on the cheap. Also it meant that we would be accepting vulnerability in one area while trying to counter them in another area. Many felt eisenhower was playing dice with the security of the country. Others including Eisenhower's own former army colleagues felt that he had betrayed them because he was slashing the defense budget specifically, the army budget in favor of nuclear weapons, but Eisenhower believed the risk outweigh the potential cost. There was another paradox to the Cold War many Americans were disgusted by what they considered the immorality of nuclear weapons. But it seemed that to Eisenhower as evil. Is these weapons were? There is something self-reinforcing about them. The very purpose of nuclear weapons was to deter the. Use he had no illusions about their destructive power. In fact, Eisenhower had opposed their use at the end of World War Two against Japan and lamented that America was the first and only country to use them. But. It appears that he felt that piece was actually more attainable through relying on nuclear weapons. He seemed to feel that relying on a lesser deterrent like conventional weapons or even smaller, tactical nuclear weapons made war more likely. Political leaders would be more tempted to use those weapons because they didn't seem to threaten the destruction of civilization. If the threat of nuclear weapons hovered over every decision. They would be far less likely to use force. He also appeared to believe that those who advocated relying more on lesser weapons were deluding themselves. In this new era, almost every conflict or event had implications for the broader geopolitical situation, anything could spark general war among the powerful nations. That's what had happened in World War One. The killing of one man archduke Franz Ferdinand led to a broader conflict. Eisenhower felt that it was just a reality that in the cold war small could spark bigger ones. If you relied on conventional forces or tactical nukes, you might forget that, and in doing so accidentally provoke a confrontation or crisis between the Americans and the Soviets. If you knew nuclear weapons were always a threat, you no longer had that delusion. You would be deterred from taking hasty action. In Eisenhower's is, it appears the irony was that the most destructive weapon in history might lead to the most stable situation among the superpowers. So the question was how to establish credibility that you were really willing to inflict massive retaliation. And part of this came from tough. Talk President Eisenhower in future crises would issue public statements. That hinted the United. States was willing to use nuclear weapons at least considering it. Sometimes his administration with let it be known through back channels that military plans were being drawn up involving the hydrogen bomb. And remember an a c one sixty two itself, said that in the event of war with the Soviets are the Chinese quote the United States will consider nuclear weapons to be as available for use as other munitions. And some deterrence also involved unpredictability. The American! Nuclear Arsenal was being expanded into what is now known today as the nuclear triad. The US could now deliver nuclear weapons, not just with bombers, but with ballistic missiles from silos and from submarines with multiple nuclear options. The Soviets wouldn't necessarily know where we might hit them. and. The triumph gave America greater sense of security. If the Soviets tried to attack our silos in bombers, we would still have nukes in our subs left. Eisenhower and Dulles were embracing what has been called brinksmanship the willingness to go to the brink of nuclear war as part of National Security Policy. To these cold warriors, brinksmanship was an art. It was a form of dealmaking with the highest stakes possible. There is a certain swagger here a willingness to play a massive geopolitical game of chicken to go to the edge of Armageddon. Eisenhower was willing to go to the brink in part because he had the credibility to do so remember, this was the victorious general from world, war, two, who had taken on vanquished Hitler's forces. He was the most respected man in the world. No one could question whether he was soft. Maybe he was the only one that could have done it. He came into office with far more prestige than most of his predecessors and his successors, those presidents who came after Eisenhower just didn't have the same clout. America's adversaries couldn't take the mysteriously as they would generalize power. In, addition, a massive retaliation new-look highlighted the importance of allies as a means to enhance deterrence alliances would help serve as a trip wire. If the enemy was encircled by American allies, it might know that any form of expansion would risk conflict because Russia would then be encroaching on nations America was obligated to defend. So under Eisenhower. You saw the creation of CTO it's basically NATO, but in Southeast Asia and Santo same thing, but in the Middle East and host of bilateral treaties. This also meant that American. Allies could contribute their own forces in the event of a regional conflict as Eisenhower said, the idea was quote to develop within various areas in regions of the Free World Indigenous Forces for the maintenance of order, the safeguarding of frontiers and the provision of the bulk of ground capability. This would make it less necessary for American forces to police the entire world, and it would achieve cost savings for the United States. The strategy also embrace something more aggressive that containment and that was rollback. Remember containment was a compromise between those who advocated for negotiations with the Soviets and those who advocated for rollback. While Eisenhower supported containment, he also believed that the United States might be able to take an aggressive posture and push back against the communists, perhaps ejecting them from where they were. But. How could he do this? Without sending in ground forces or starting a major conflict? The answer involved covert operations now President Truman deftly dabbled in covert ops, but as we'll see, Eisenhower took it to the next level. Under Eisenhower, the CIA and other US, government agencies employed propaganda gave aid to anticommunist guerrillas and other underground resistance movements and use other methods of deception. Some of the more controversial tactics involved government overthrows and plots to assassinate foreign leaders. while. Many consider these actions, heavy-handed examples of American imperialism of unjust interference in the affairs of other nations. The Eisenhower Administration believe they were justified as part of winning the Cold War and far less costly than over at military action or diplomacy. But even if Eisenhower and Dulles embrace brinksmanship, it didn't mean that he didn't understand the destructive power of nuclear weapons, nor was he opposed to peaceful overtures, our negotiations with the Soviets. In that same speech, he gave to the American Society of Newspaper Editors Eisenhower called for working with the Soviets to reduce the weapons of war quote. As progress all these areas strengthens world trust. We would proceed concurrently with the next great work, the reduction of the burden of armaments now weighing upon the world to this end we would welcome and enter into the most solemn agreements. These could properly include I the limitation by absolute numbers in agreed international ratio of the sizes of the military and security forces of all nations, second a commitment by all nations to set, and agreed limit upon that proportion of total production of certain strategic materials to be devoted to military purposes. Third International Control of atomic energy to promote its use for peaceful purposes only and to ensure the prohibition. Of Atomic, weapons fourth a limitation or prohibition of other categories of weapons of great destructiveness and fifth, the enforcement of all these agreed limitations and prohibitions by adequate safeguards, including a practical system of inspection United Nations. These were lofty words that looked forward to international cooperation and the peaceful use of nuclear energy. They would be echoed by future presidents who sought disarmament and a new understanding in the cold. War, this was not some naive vision of president who believes that arms limitation agreements could end the Cold War or fundamentally changed the nature of the Soviet Union. But Eisenhower believed that such agreements might help stabilize cold-war competition. There was also a real hope that nuclear weapons could be a major source of energy. And if arms agreements could lead to cost reductions, perhaps by warding off inexpensive arms race all the better. Eisenhower made a specific proposal for using nuclear power for peaceful purposes in December of nineteen, fifty three. He gave a speech at the United Nations where he discussed the horrors of nuclear war. Atomic bombs today. Are More than twenty five times as powerful. As the Weapon With which the Atomic Age Dawn. While hydrogen weapons are in the range. Of millions of tons of TNT equivalent. Today. The United States stockpile of atomic weapons. Which of course increases daily. Seeds by many times. The, totally equivalent. Of the total of all bombs and all shells. That came from every plane and every gun in every theater of war in all of the years of World War Two. A single air group. Whether afloat. Or land based. Can now deliver to any reachable target. A destructive cargo. Exceeding in power all the bombs that fell on Britain in all a World War Two. But he added that nuclear weapons could be used peacefully under the auspices of an international, agency. The morning. Responsibility of the Atomic Energy Agency. would be to devise message. whereby this fishing material would be allocated to serve the peaceful pursuits of mankind. Experts would be mobilized. To apply atomic energy to the needs of agriculture, medicine and other people activity. A special. would be to provide abundant electrical energy in the power starved areas of the world. But. The contributing powers would be dedicating some of their strengths. To the need. Rather than the fear of mankind. This speech would lay the foundation of an international body that would regulate nuclear power for peaceful purposes. The International Atomic Energy Agency. It would be one of his major international legacies. Regardless with the new look policy Eisenhower had set forth his vision of containment, essentially, it meant restoring America's fiscal health through massive defense cuts and reliance on the threat of nuclear weapons, a willingness to engage in brinksmanship and lessening of these risks through alliances, covert action and engagement with the Soviet Union. And it also included a little bit of rollback. How this strategy played out in the messy reality of the Cold War will be the subject of the next episode of this. American President! We have a special announcement. We are quite excited to be joining the Evergreen podcast. Family Evergreen is a rapidly growing podcast publisher, and they're working crate network of podcasts. Their network members create original content on a range of subjects from history and philosophy to pop culture and business, and we're really excited about this partnership because Evergreen, love telling stories, and that's what we love doing. We're passionate about stories, and it's perfect thing proud to join evergreens network and look forward to working with them so that we can give you the best content possible. This American President is produced by Myself Richard, Lamm and Michael. Thanks to my dad virtue. The music in this episode is by Blue Dot session. I'm Richard. Back next time with more. Impressive.

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21: On the Edge of Armageddon Part I (Dwight D. Eisenhower)

This American President

57:33 min | 11 months ago

21: On the Edge of Armageddon Part I (Dwight D. Eisenhower)

"We just wanted to give you an update on our kickstarter campaign to raise money for podcast studio and in short it was a great success. We had a minimum goal of eighteen hundred dollars and we ended up with thirty three hundred. Eighty one dollars and for those who donated. We just wanted to thank you for your generous support and you should have also received an email asking for your information so that we can give you your ward and if you haven't already please fill it out expect to get your merchandise by June of twenty twenty and if you have any questions please email us and this American president at G MAIL DOT COM or. Send us a message through the kickstarter in our previous episode. We covered the first president of the cold. War Era Harry S Truman. It was under President Truman. That America initiated its policy of containment to contain wooded considered the greatest threat to world peace the Soviet Union this new conflict. The Cold War was unlike anything ever before it now. Two nations dominated the globe and with the development of thermonuclear weapons had the capacity to destroy civilization itself. History had entrusted Harry Truman with defense of the free world and he confronted crisis after crisis always with the specter of nuclear war in the background but now Truman's presidency was over and he had left the world's stage in his place was one of the most capable and experienced leaders in American history. His name was Dwight. David Eisenhower the great hero of world. War Two the Supreme Allied Commander who had invaded Normandy defeated Hitler and liberated Europe now Eisenhower or Ike. As his friends called him had the responsibility of leading the free world during this dangerous time. Few people today can recall the major events or accomplishments of Eisenhower's presidency too many. He is Amir transitional. Figure the president who served during the Stale and Cookie Cutter Nineteen fifties between the years of war under FDR and Truman and the social upheaval. Under Kennedy and Johnson but Eisenhower was no mere interlude like Truman. His presidency was one of crises. When American credibility and nuclear war were constantly at stake every decision he made involved delicate balance of terror. That could mean either peace or annihilation. How Eisenhower maintained that piece in avoided? Armageddon is the subject of this episode of this American President Around White. The Eisenhower was a man of humble beginnings he was born in eighteen ninety in Denison Texas. The third of seven boys. His father owned a general store when it failed. He later worked on the railroads mechanic and then at a creamery. His mother was a Mennonite and later a Jehovah's witness she was also an avowed pacifist ironic considering her son Dwight's future career path. The Eisenhower soon moved to Abilene Kansas. Young white had an idyllic childhood. He worked hard at his but he also enjoyed the outdoors. You'd go hunting and fishing for hours like his predecessor Harry Truman. He became an avid reader especially on military history. Something that would serve him well. Throughout his career of his childhood. Eisenhower would later write quote. I have found out in later years. We were very poor but the glory of America is that we didn't know it then. Eisenhower's family lived frugally. When his father's general store failed the family was forced to tighten their belts that lesson? The importance of living within ones means stuck eisenhower for his entire career. As we will see this lead Ike to consider going to either the Naval Academy or West Point since both offered free college degrees. He was beyond the age limit for the Naval Academy so in nineteen eleven. He became a student at West Point at West Point. Eisenhower was an average student but he did well in sports playing for the Varsity football team and taking up fencing and gymnastics after graduating in nineteen fifteen. He married a woman they me doubt soon. America entered World War. One and like many young men of his day. Eisenhower hoped to get in on the action overseas but he would end up being disappointed instead. He was given assignments in the United States. He was stuck training tank. Crews that never even saw combat. He never got to fight abroad during the war which left him feeling. Bitter and depressed throughout the next couple of decades. Eisenhower worked either with or for many of the men who would emerge as the top military figures of world war. Two he collaborated with George. Patton on new ideas for tank warfare ideas that were way ahead of their time. He served under General Fox. Connor who has an intellectual mentor to him? Through Connor I studied Clausewitz and other military classics by then. Eisenhower was a serious student and had come into his own intellectually from nineteen twenty five to twenty six. He attended the command and General Staff College in Fort Leavenworth and graduated first in his class of two hundred forty. Five Officers Eisenhower. Later worked as general. Douglas MacArthur's military aid in the Philippines. That experience taught him two things. First how to handle relations with foreign ally and second how to handle the man with as massive and ego is General Macarthur when America entered World War. Two in nineteen forty one general. George Marshall Hired Eisenhower as a war. Planner Marshall had an eye for talent and realize that Eisenhower was one of the best many had maybe the best thus began. Eisenhower's meteoric rise. Within a year. He was running the allied operation in North Africa. His success they're impressed. President D Roosevelt. The military began planning for the critical invasion of France to liberate the European continent. From Hitler's rule many observers believed that Roosevelt would put Marshall in charge of the invasion an FDR knew that whoever would lead that invasion if successful would be remembered as the great American military hero of World War Two. He felt Marshall deserve the honor and recognition but he also wanted Marshall by his side and Roosevelt also knew that Eisenhower had considerable skill in military planning in maintaining coalitions by December nineteen forty-three. Fdr had decided that. Eisenhower would command the invasion known as D Day. Eisenhower would now be leading the largest seaborne invasion in world history involving over two million men. The president announced the decision in a fireside chat in December of Nineteen forty-three. The commander selected. Leave the combined effect from these points is general. Dwight D Eisenhower his performances in Africa in Sicily and Italy been brilliant. He knows my practical successful experience. The Way to coordinate air sea and land power all of these. We'll be under his control. The world's hopes for defeating Hitler rested on Eisenhower Shoulders. He spoke to his men just before. The invasion began on June. Sixth nineteen forty four soldiers. Sailors airman of the Allied Expeditionary Force. You are about to embark upon the great crusade toward which we have striven these many months the eyes of the world are upon you the hopes and prayers of liberty loving people everywhere March with you in company with our brave allies and brothers in arms on other fronts you will bring about the destruction of the German war machine the elimination of Nazi tyranny over the oppressed peoples of Europe and security for ourselves in a free world. Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well-trained well-equipped battle-hardened he will fight savagely. But this is the year in one thousand nine hundred forty four much has happened since the Nazi triumphs of nineteen forty forty one. The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans great defeats in open battle. Man-to-man our air offensive has seriously reduced their strength in the air and their capacity to wage war on the ground are home fronts have given us an overwhelming superiority in weapons and munitions war and placed at our disposal great reserves of trained fighting men. The tide has turned. The Freeman of the world are marching together to victory. I have full confidence in your courage devotion to duty and skill in battle we will accept nothing less than full victory. Good luck and let us all be seats. The blessing of Almighty God upon this brave and noble undertaking at the same time. Eisenhower had a statement prepared in the event of a failure. It read quote our landings in the Cherbourg Harbour area have failed to gain a satisfactory foothold and I've withdrawn the troops. My decision to attack at this time and place was based on the best information available. The troops the air and the Navy did all that bravery and devotion to duty could do if any blame or fault attached to the attempt it is mine alone thankfully. Eisenhower never had to read that statement. The operation was a great success less than a year later. May Nineteen forty-five Hitler was dead and the Allies were victorious in Europe by the end of World War. Two Eisenhower was a national hero. And it's not surprising that he was immediately being discussed as a presidential candidate. After all victorious generals going back to George Washington and Andrew. Jackson had a good track record for winning. The presidency. Eisenhower was so well respected that even the incumbent President Harry Truman verbally offered him the presidency. Truman told that he would willingly give up his spot on the top of the ticket and run as Eisenhower's running mate in nineteen forty. Eight Eisenhower was taken aback by the comment. He publicly refused to become a candidate but his supporters feared that Eisenhower was missing his one chance for the presidency if he didn't run in nineteen forty eight. The Republicans were heavily favored to win that year. And it was assumed. That New York governor Thomas Dewey would get the nomination after winning in nineteen forty eight. Do we would likely run for reelection. In nineteen fifty two leaving nineteen fifty six as the earliest eisenhower could run by then he would be sixty five years old perhaps too old to run but in the end do he was defeated in nineteen forty eight by President Truman. In one of the greatest upsets in American history history thus left the door wide open for Eisenhower in nineteen fifty two throughout the postwar years Eisenhower wrote his memoirs and served in other leadership capacities. He became the President of Columbia University. And then the supreme commander of NATO in that latter position Eisenhower remained on the world stage. He was the leader of the world's most powerful alliance and basically a head of state in his own right. Few men ever had better preparation to be president but he had to go through the political process at home if he wanted to be president. He revealed that he considered himself. Right of center. More aligning with the Republican Party. But he differed with many Republican politicians that identified with the Old Guard. Those Republicans who hoped to rollback. Fdr'S NEW DEAL. And who supported a more non interventionist foreign policy one leery of too much involvement in the World Eisenhower? The man who had led the allied effort in Europe during the war and was now head of NATO was internationalist. He believed that in the Cold War Era America had to lead the cause of freedom. Although he was conservative in temperament he was not a conservative ideologue. He was what one might consider a moderate conservative in the nineteen fifty two election. Conservative Robert Taft Son of the former President William Howard. Taft was the front runner for the GOP nomination and an old guard. Conservative Eisenhower feared. America would reject internationalism if taft won the presidency. Thus Eisenhower became a candidate and won a close and controversial race for the nomination aches AIDS recommended that he select the young senator from California Richard Nixon as his running mate the thirty eight year old Nixon had made a name for himself as a staunch anti-communist they made for a fascinating pair. Eisenhower was the elder statesmen and military hero. While Nixon was the young attack dog facing them was the wonky Democratic nominee Ashley Stevenson. The election had its controversy the most famous one being allegations that Nixon had a secret slush fund with donations from rich businessmen. Nixon deflected the allegations with his famous checkers. Speech either way. Eisenhower was the most popular man in America so Stevenson didn't have a chance. It was a choice between the victorious. General of World War Two or a guy some labeled as an egghead intellectual. So I'm sure you can see where this is going on election night. Eisenhower won a landslide. Victory winning thirty nine out of forty eight states it was a resurrection for the Republicans. They had lost the previous five presidential elections. Dwight Eisenhower a poor boy from Abilene was now the thirty fourth president of the United States. When people what back in the fifties they generally picture a quiet peaceful time the era of suburbs housewives. Wholesome TV programming like Dobie. Gillis leave it to beaver my three sons. The Donna Reed show to extent this is true especially compared with the upheavals in the previous and subsequent decades. But when Eisenhower took office there was a real sense of fear. Forboding about the future at the eve of the new decade in nineteen forty nine. America's great adversary the Soviet Union attain nuclear capability United States. No longer had the nuclear monopoly. Joseph Stalin the butcher of millions now had the power of the atomic bomb. It's kind of like the fear. People have about Kim Jong. Hoon having nuclear weapons but imagine if Kim Jong UN was in charge of the biggest country in the world and both the Americans and the Soviets racing to build ballistic missiles that could deliver nuclear weapons across the globe in hours. Even minutes people felt that world war three and nuclear holocausts were becoming real possibilities that civilization might actually destroy itself to Americans. Communism was a very real threat at almost the same time that the Soviets got the bomb the most populous nation in the world. China fell to communist leader Mao Zedong that meant that an additional five hundred million people or a fifth of the world's population where now under communist rule for many Americans it seemed as if communism was destined to spread in the same way that Fascism did in the nineteen thirties unless painful sacrifices were made to stop it. That fear wasn't just an external one. There was a genuine threat of Soviet espionage in the United States after all Klaus Fuchs was a German physicist working on the Manhattan project in Los Alamos and was supplying the Soviets with nuclear secrets. The rosenbergs had also been convicted of espionage. Eisenhower's Vice President Richard. Nixon had spent his years in Congress attacking communist infiltration in the United States he especially went after Alger Hiss. A prominent State Department official for being a Soviet spy. The man who define this age of paranoia was the infamous Republican Senator Joseph McCarthy of Wisconsin McCarthy who enjoyed high approval ratings from the public claimed several times to have lists of government officials who were communists. He publicly accused officials at the highest levels of government of being Soviet agents usually with little to no evidence. The most absurd example was his attack on George Marshall. Eisenhower's mentor and one of the Great Heroes of World War. Two this era of fear and paranoia defined the early Cold War but the war wasn't always cold. There were times when hot wars breakout at by nineteen fifty. Two America was well into its first hot war of the nuclear age. In nineteen fifty the communist government of North Korea invaded anti-communist South Korea. The Truman administration feared that the fall of South Korea. So soon after the fall of China would mean the spread of communism all throughout Asia. It viewed the conflict as just one theater in a global struggle between the free world and the Communists world and it remembered the lessons of appeasement just before World War. Two that appeasing Hitler only invited further aggression too many Americans. The Communist invasion of South Korea was further proof that communist bloc led by the Soviet Union and the People's Republic of China was pursuing global domination. And it was true. That both the Soviets Ama- Chinese were eating the North Koreans so truman lead an international effort under the United Nations to repel the invasion. Although General Douglas Macarthur was able to push North Koreans back. The Chinese intervened invaded the Korean Peninsula. The Chinese succeeded in pushing UN forces. Back South and resulted in a bloody stalemate in just three years. The United States had over thirty thousand combat deaths less than one decade after World War. Two when American citizen wrote the President Truman. Quote in. Heaven's name what are you doing? The blood hasn't dried from World War. Two while running in nineteen fifty. Two Eisenhower announced that he intended to end the war by going to Korea. Those words electrified the nation and gave it hope that peace was around the corner less than a month after his election on December second nineteen fifty. Two Eisenhower arrived in Korea. He inspected the troops and met with American commanders. Some Advice Eisenhower that the war could be won generals Mark Clark and James Van Fleet suggested the use of nuclear weapons in expansion of the war against China could lead to victory now. Might strike you as alarming that anyone would advise the use of nuclear weapons but this was the reality Cold War. It was something that General Macarthur talked about in Korea just before president. Truman fired him and it was something that would come up time and time again as we'll see during Eisenhower's presidency the Cold War was full of unprecedented dilemmas. In Korea American and Chinese forces engaged in combat Americans were confident that they could win after all they had defeated both the Nazis and the Japanese in partnership with the Allies of course China was a third world country. Surely China would be an easy opponent but America was unprepared for the Korean War. Especially since it had demobilized after World War Two and the Chinese had an enormous number of forces bay virtue of Sheer Numbers. They pushed back. And that's how the stalemate happened the. Us Now faced a dilemma. In order to win American might have to intensify the war effort sending more forces to fight but some wondered well if we have nuclear weapons. Why don't we use them? I mean otherwise. What's the point of having them? And as the body bags piled up more Americans kept wondering. Why are we letting our soldiers get killed if we have a weapon that could end the war once and for all nuclear weapons were the most terrifying weapons ever devised by man? But you can see why some people might at least be tempted to think this way to think about using the bomb especially if you fear the spread of communism and if you're sick and tired of a bloody stalemate but of course there were fears for what this would mean if we use nuclear weapons against North Korea or against China. The world could be revolted by their use. America's prestige could be damaged forever. The fallout from nuclear warfare could lead to unprecedented collateral damage. And what if the Soviet responded given their relationship with China in North Korea they had hundreds of thousands of soldiers in Europe. What if they retaliated by invading our allies in Europe? What if they blockaded and attacked our presence in Berlin and now that they had the bomb what if they used it against us or our allies while most people shuddered at the thought of starting a nuclear war with the Soviets. Some felt that this was the time to do in the cold. War was relatively new. Soviets did have the bomb but they were few years behind the United States in nuclear firepower in the development of the hydrogen bomb in the means to deliver it. Why allow them to catch up. Why not hit them now with everything? We had so that the Soviets would never get to the point of competing with us after all. Didn't the West wait too long to stop? Hitler wouldn't more lives been saved if we had taken on. Hiller earlier was stolen that much different than Hitler and wasn't stolen even more dangerous than Hitler. Now considering he had the bomb of course the situation was more complicated than that. Hitler installing were both totalitarian tyrants ruthless killers but their circumstances weren't exactly the same still. Most people feared what Stalin could do especially since he had successfully imposed his grip on Eastern Europe and supported communist movements around the world. They also feared the worst case scenario in all of this that the Soviets would respond in kind to nuclear attack against itself or its allies with a nuclear attack of its own and then a nuclear war might ensue. The specter of nuclear Holocaust hovered over everything. These were the debates that were raging on in the early cold war in Korea would be the first decision for the new president despite the advice from Generals Clark and Vanfleet. Eisenhower refused to expand the effort in Korea. He rejected their request and move forward with negotiations for now. America's president would not go anywhere near using nukes in Korea but the temptation to use them or to threaten their use with continued to rise throughout. Eisenhower's administration on January Twentieth Nineteen fifty-three Dwight D Eisenhower. At the age of sixty two took the oath of office in became the thirty fourth president of the United States fully aware of the immense burdens. He was undertaking. The new president began his inaugural address with a prayer. My friend before I begin the expression of those thought that I deem appropriate to this moment. Would you permit me the privilege of uttering a little private prayer of my own and I asked you? Bow Your Head Almighty got as we stand here at this moment my associates in my future associates in the executive branch of government. Join me BESIKCI. That foul will make full and complete dedication to the service of the people in this throng and their fellow citizens everywhere give us we pray the power to discern clearly right from wrong and allow all our words and actions to be governed thereby and by the laws of this land especially we pray that are concerned shall be for all the people regardless of station race are calling may cooperation be permitted and be a mutual lane of those who under the concepts of our constitution whole to differing political faith. Show that Oh may work for the good of our beloved country and glory. I'm in in the weeks. After HIS ELECTION EISENHOWER SKETCHED OUT AGENDA FOR HIS ADMINISTRATION. There were two overriding concerns. One immediate and the other long-term the immediate concern was the Korean War in the plan to negotiate an end to that war. The long term concern was the Cold War and how to contain the Soviet Union. Things are right for change. America wanted to move past the stalemate of the Korean War but there was also big news. Out of the Kremlin Joseph Stalin. The totalitarian dictator of the Soviet Union the Godfather of the Communist Movement for almost three decades died of a cerebral hemorrhage on March fifth nineteen fifty-three there would be a new Soviet leader. Although it would take some time to figure out who won the power struggle with new leadership in the White House and the Kremlin. There might be a new way forward in the Cold War in our previous episodes. We covered president. Harry Truman and his containment strategy. It was summed up by George Kennan. Who said that quote? The main element of any United States policy toward the Soviet Union must be that of long term patient but firm and vigilant containment of Russian expansive tenancies. It was a middle ground between those who just wanted to negotiate with the Soviets and coexist with them and those who wanted to roll the Soviets back pushing them from where they were already established. Originally Truman headed here to what was called a strong point defense strategy. He felt that it would be too expensive and difficult to stop the Soviets everywhere as powerful as America was it cost too much to defend giant. Swath of international territory encounter the Soviets wherever they expanded whether it was by military force or aid to communist groups around the world and it would also give the Soviets the initiative to allow them to bogs down in conflicts around the world. They would be able to decide where the conflicts would start if we promised to stop them wherever they expanded they could start them in areas or arenas that played to their strengths and our weaknesses. The strong point defense strategy called for providing economic assistance to allies at certain points around the world so that those allies could become centers of military and economic strength that way those allies could stand up on their own feet and share in the burden of containing Soviet expansion. This strategy was made manifest in the Marshall Plan and the Truman doctrine which provided economic aid to Greece and Turkey. It also meant that. America wasn't on the hook for defending every country threatened by the Soviets or the Chinese and it would detract from the Soviets ability to dictate where a conflict or competition would occur while the Korean War changed all of that although Korea was not originally considered a strong point the possibility of millions more falling under the orbit of communism called into question America's commitment to its allies. The Truman Administration. Now believe that the defeat of South Korea meant a victory for the Communists and decided to commit forces to save it by then a new strategy document known as NFC sixty eight had been in circulation. It rejected strong point defense and called for a dramatic increase in the defense budget. Truman had originally requested thirteen billion dollars for defense in nineteen fifty. Nfc Sixty eight called for increasing that number to forty or fifty billion almost triple what was originally requested. It called for increasing both conventional and nuclear capabilities and replace strongpoint defense with perimeter defense now. America committed defending large parameter as opposed to merely supporting certain key locations with the Korean War. American foreign policy was now guided by NFC sixty eight by nineteen fifty to the defense budget reached sixty billion dollars. Some feared that America couldn't afford this increase in the defense budget and might bankrupt itself by overspending betray and believed that the American economy could sustain it when he was a senator. He was a loyal new dealer and believed that government's spending could stimulate the economy classic Keynesian economics but instead of domestic spending as a stimulus it would now be defense spending many. Are you'd that economic growth in world? War Two was proof of this theory since government spending had increased to build American tanks. Ships planes in ammunition. Besides Truman believed that spending now to prevent the communist advance would be less expensive than fighting a war with the Communists after they expanded. And we're in a stronger position as Truman said in. Nineteen fifty to quote the real threat to our security. Isn't the danger bankruptcy? It's the danger of Communist Aggression. If Communism is allowed to absorb the free nations one by one then we would be isolated from our sources of supply and detached from our friends. Then we would have to take defense measures which might really bankrupt our economy and change our way of life so that we wouldn't recognize it was American any longer. President Eisenhower sharply disagreed with President. Truman and the premise of NFC sixty eight. I mentioned earlier in the episode about. Eisenhower's frugal background. Well this would come to define his cold war policy perhaps more than anything else in the truth episodes. I discussed the paradox of the Cold War. Both sides felt compelled to outdo the other every time when one side built a tank. The other side built a better tank. Same thing for planes and for ships. When America built the atomic bomb the Soviets were compelled to do the same thing when the Soviets got the bomb the Americans built even more powerful hydrogen bomb and so on and so forth but there was a potentially self-defeating logic to all of this did out doing the other side necessarily mean superiority or greater security. What if those weapons had diminishing returns? What if there are cheaper alternatives to achieving safety than matching our ponant? What if spending all this money potentially bankrupting yourself and destroying your nations credit win that be self-defeating would America really win the Cold War if it destroyed its own fiscal health? Eisenhower set as much. When he said of the Soviets quote it is more than merely a military threat it has been coldly calculated by the Soviet leaders for by their military threat. They have hoped to force upon America and the free world an unbearable security burden leading to economic disaster but even with all that said to some extent. The United States had to spend money to counter the Soviets or at least deter them the US had to be able to defend itself against the communist by some measure. We had to be able to backup containment with some amount of force if containment were to mean anything. But what was the right balance? How do you maintain superiority against the other side without overextending yourself? Her busting your on budget. Eisenhower saw the Cold War primarily in terms of economics while his Secretary of State John Foster Dulles believed the Cold War was essentially a moral conflict. Eisenhower wrote quote. We are a product and a representative of the Judeo Christian civilization and it does teach some concern for your brother and I believe in that but Eisenhower added quote. The minimum requirement is that we are able to trade freely in spite of anything. Russia may do with those areas from which we obtain the raw materials that are vital for our economy. Dulles summarized this view when he said quote if economic stability goes down the drain. Everything goes down the drain. Eisenhower obsessed over the cost of the Cold War. He saw defense spending in terms of what it costs. The American people just three months into his term Eisenhower delivered a speech before the American Society of Newspaper Editors that outlined that cost a nation of lasting peace cannot be firmly based upon any reason armaments but rather upon just relations and honest understanding with all other nations. What can the world or any nation in it for you know turning is found on this dread the worst to be feared and the best to be expected can be simply statement. The worst is a comic rule. The best would be this. A life of perpetual fear intention a burden of arms draining the and labor of all people a wasting of strength. That defies the American system on the Soviet system or any to to achieve true abundance and happiness for the people of this earth. Every gun that is made every warship launched every rocket fire signifies in the final from those hunger are not fit those who are cold and are not this world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers. The genius of its violence the hoops of his children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber. Is this a modern brick school? In more than thirty said it is to electric power plants each serving town of sixty thousand population it to find fully equipped hostile fifty miles of three. We pay for a single fighter plane with a half million bushels a week. We pay a single destroyer with new homes. That could have housed more than eight thousand people this is. I repeat the best way of life to be found on the road. The world has been taking. This is not a way of life at all. Then he puts them under. The cloud. Threatening warranted is humanity hanging from across the via. Eisenhower did not see defense spending as a stimulus to the economy. He saw it as a burden. Something that took away from American prosperity and the thriving of American civilization after all increased defense spending meant higher taxes on the American people and it could also mean higher national debt. It's fascinating than a military man. A man who spent his career rising in the army was talking about the defense budget in negative terms. Perhaps Eisenhower was the last president who could do this. He wasn't a professional politician nor was he insa political ideology. He was a national military hero and therefore he had the clout to espouse policies. That contradicted the desires of either party and could combine aspects of both to this day. There are many who agree with. Eisenhower's warnings on Defense Meeting and hope to reduce the defense budget. Eisenhower would have counseled us to be wise about what we spend money on. But this didn't mean. He didn't recognize the Soviets as a threat. The whole point of his frugality was so that the US could compete with the Soviet Union and more cost effective way. There was no moral ambiguity for Eisenhower. He believed that America was a positive. Moral force and the Soviets were an immoral totalitarian government. In Eisenhower's is it was the Soviets who are responsible for the Cold War starting in the first place. Eisenhower stated Soviet government yelled at vastly different vision of the future in the world of its design. Security was to be found not in mutual trust and mutual aid but in force you. Jeremy Subversion Rule of neighbor nations. The goal is power superiority and all costs security was to be sought by denying it to all of the result has been tried to for the world and for the Soviet Union. It has also been running. The imagining of Soviet power alerted free nations to a new danger of aggression. It compel him in Self-defense. To spend unprecedented money and energy for women's it forced them to develop weapons of war now capable of inflicting incident terrible punishment upon any restaurant in August of nineteen fifty. Four Eisenhower would say that quote. The central core of the great world problem is the aggressive intent of international communism. So while Eisenhower feared the cost of the Cold War he still maintained that the American people had a job to do. He may have disagreed with troms methods of containment. The increase spending the perimeter defense but not with its goal the Soviet Union had to be contained. But how how do you reconcile the paradox of spending in the Cold War with the goal of winning it to answer that question? Eisenhower decided to explore all possible options. While making use of the best minds he could find to that end. He initiated a project Alarium and it was named that because it was hatched out in the Celerion Room at the White House. It involved convening a group of brilliant men from the federal government and academia and it happened in the summer of nineteen fifty three as a critical exercise. In that exercise. The men were divided up into three teams with each team. Exploring three major strategies under consideration team was led by George Kennan considered by many to be the father of containment. They were tasked with defending. Truman's current policy. Containment team be was tasked with taking a tougher line against the Soviets and focusing more on using US nuclear weapons as a deterrent and team. C was also tasked with taking tough line and the Soviets with a focus on an aggressive policy called rollback. Instead of merely containing Soviet expansion. The team would look into whether it would be possible to push them back for more. They were the entire. Solarium project was so secretive that it remained classified until the mid nineteen eighties. Out of the project came a new strategy. That would replace an AC- sixty eight. The new document was NFC. One sixty two and the new strategy was called the new look and it was a dramatically different view of containment. The goal now. The Cold War was to win by not bankrupting ourselves. This meant getting America's fiscal house in order through major cuts in defense spending. This was a time when defense spending took about two thirds of the entire federal budget. Compare that to now. Were defense is less than about fifteen percent which by the way includes both discretionary and non discretionary spending so that was the first element of new look. The new strategy also meant staying away from foreign wars as much as possible like the kind truman got us into in Korea. After all are very expensive it was kind of like a race to frugality where the most cost. Effective side wins. But how are we to maintain deterrence encounter the Soviets if we were reducing defense spending? The answer came into words massive retaliation. Nfc One sixty two said that the United States would maintain quote a strong military posture with emphasis on the capability of inflicting massive retaliatory damage by offensive striking power. But if the military budget was slashed. Were would that power come from again? An Se 162 reported that the United States quote will consider nuclear weapons as available for use as other munitions essentially the Eisenhower Administration called for greater reliance on nuclear weapons rather than conventional forces like tanks ships planes and personnel as a way to deter communist aggression whether it came from the Soviet Union or the People's Republic of China adding to the credibility of this shift. Eisenhower early in his presidency had taken control of the nuclear stockpile away from the Civilian Atomic Energy Commission and gave it to the military again to some. This was terrifying prospect. Did this mean that. The United States threatened to use nuclear weapons whenever Russia or China acted aggressively. So if another career happens somewhere. Did this mean that this time we would respond with nuclear weapons and if we really were using nuclear weapons to deter adversaries were we actually willing to use them and what would happen if we did use them. What about the international blowback what about radiation poisoning and the damage to the environment? And what if we weren't really willing to use them? What would happen if we threaten to use them in a crisis? Either against the Soviets of the Chinese but they were willing to call our bluff. Wouldn't our credibility diminished then to Eisenhower. The policy of massive retaliation was about reducing costs in fact in nineteen fifty-five. Eisenhower would cut four point. Eight billion dollars from the defense budget. Four point one billion of those cuts came from the army but it was also more than that again. He feared that the alternative would be to outmatch the Soviets everywhere countering their every move whether it meant building better tanks or confronting them wherever they acted aggressively as we said earlier. This was the path to national bankruptcy at least potentially and it gave the Soviets the initiative to choose where geographically or figuratively fight but eisenhower had a different strategy in the words of Vice President. Richard Nixon quote rather than let the Communists Nibble us to death all over the world and little wars we would rely on the future primarily on our massive mobile retaliatory power which we could use in our discretion against the major source of aggression. At times and places we choose instead of countering the Soviet strength we would try to offset those strengths by hitting their weaknesses. This took the initiative away from the Soviets and gave it back to the United States but it was risky some claim that it was defense on the cheap also. It meant that we would be accepting vulnerability in one area while trying to counter them in another area. Many felt eisenhower was playing dice with the security of the country. Others including Eisenhower's own former army colleagues felt that he had betrayed them because he was slashing the defense budget specifically the army budget in favor of nuclear weapons but Eisenhower believed the risk outweigh the potential cost. There was another paradox to the Cold War. Many Americans were disgusted by what they considered the immorality of nuclear weapons. But it seemed that to Eisenhower as evil as these weapons were. There was something self-reinforcing about them. The very purpose of nuclear weapons was to deter the actual use. He had no illusions about their destructive power. In fact Eisenhower had opposed their use at the end of World War Two against Japan and lamented that America was the first and only country to use them but it appears that he felt that piece was actually more attainable through relying on nuclear weapons. He seemed to feel that relying on a lesser deterrent like conventional weapons or even smaller tactical nuclear weapons made war more likely. Political leaders would be more tempted to use those weapons because they didn't seem to threaten the destruction of civilization. If the threat of nuclear weapons hovered over every decision they would be far less likely to use force he also appeared to believe that those who advocated relying more on lesser weapons. Were deluding themselves. In this new era almost every conflict or event had implications for the broader geopolitical situation. Anything could spark general war among the powerful nations. That's what had happened in World War One. The killing of one man archduke. Franz Ferdinand led to a broader conflict. Eisenhower felt that it was just a reality that in the cold war small could spark bigger ones if you relied on conventional forces or tactical nukes. You might forget that and in doing so accidentally provoke a confrontation or crisis between the Americans and the Soviets. If you knew nuclear weapons were always a threat. You no longer had that delusion. You would be deterred from taking hasty action. In Eisenhower's is it appears the irony was that the most destructive weapon in history might lead to the most stable situation among the superpowers. So the question was how to establish credibility that you were really willing to inflict massive retaliation and part of this came from tough talk. President Eisenhower in future crises would issue public statements that hinted the United States was willing to use nuclear weapons. At least considering it sometimes his administration with let it be known through back channels that military plans were being drawn up involving the hydrogen bomb and remember an a c one sixty two itself said that in the event of war with the Soviets are the Chinese quote the United States will consider nuclear weapons to be as available for use as other munitions and some deterrence also involved unpredictability. The American nuclear arsenal was being expanded into what is now known today as the nuclear triad the US could now deliver nuclear weapons not just with bombers but with ballistic missiles from silos and from submarines with multiple nuclear options. The Soviets wouldn't necessarily know where we might hit them and the triumph also gave America a greater sense of security. If the Soviets tried to attack our silos in bombers. We would still have nukes in. Our subs left Eisenhower. And Dulles were embracing what has been called brinksmanship the willingness to go to the brink of nuclear war as part of National Security Policy. To these cold warriors. Brinksmanship was an art. It was a form of dealmaking with the highest stakes possible there is a certain swagger here a willingness to play a massive geopolitical game of chicken to go to the edge of Armageddon Eisenhower. Was Willing to go to the brink in part because he had the credibility to do so remember. This was the victorious general from World War Two. Who had taken on and vanquished Hitler's forces? He was the most respected man in the world. No one could question whether he was soft. Maybe he was the only one that could have done it. He came into office with far more prestige than most of his predecessors and his successors those presidents who came after Eisenhower. Just didn't have the same clout America's adversaries couldn't take the mysteriously as they would generalize power. In addition a massive retaliation new look highlighted the importance of allies as a means to enhance deterrence. Alliances would help serve as a trip wire. If the enemy was encircled by American allies. It might know that any form of expansion would risk conflict because Russia would then be encroaching on nations. America was obligated to defend so under Eisenhower. You saw the creation of CTO. It's basically NATO but in Southeast Asia and Santo. Same thing but in the Middle East and host of bilateral treaties. This also meant that. American allies could contribute their own forces in the event of a regional conflict as Eisenhower said. The idea was quote to develop within various areas in regions of the Free World Indigenous Forces for the maintenance of order the safeguarding of frontiers and the provision of the bulk of ground capability. This would make it less necessary for American forces to police the entire world and it would achieve cost savings for the United States. The strategy also embrace something more aggressive that containment and that was rollback. Remember containment was a compromise between those who advocated for negotiations with the Soviets and those who advocated for rollback. While Eisenhower supported containment. He also believed that the United States might be able to take an aggressive posture and push back against the communists. Perhaps ejecting them from where they were. But how could he do this without sending in ground forces or starting a major conflict the answer involved covert operations now president? Truman deftly dabbled in covert ops. But as we'll see eisenhower took it to the next level under Eisenhower the CIA and other US. Government agencies employed propaganda gave aid to anticommunist guerrillas and other underground resistance movements and use other methods of deception. Some of the more controversial tactics involved government overthrows and plots to assassinate foreign leaders while many consider these actions heavy-handed examples of American imperialism of unjust interference in the affairs of other nations. The Eisenhower Administration believe they were justified. As part of winning the Cold War and far less costly than over at military action or diplomacy but even if Eisenhower and Dulles embrace brinksmanship it didn't mean that he didn't understand the destructive power of nuclear weapons nor was he opposed to peaceful overtures. Our negotiations with the Soviets in that same speech he gave to the American Society of newspaper. Editors Eisenhower called for working with the Soviets to reduce the weapons of war quote as progress. All these areas strengthens World Trust. We would proceed concurrently with the next great work. The reduction of the burden of armaments now weighing upon the world to this end we would welcome an enter into the most solemn agreements. These could properly include I the limitation by absolute numbers or by agreed international ratio of the sizes of the military and security forces of all nations. Second a commitment by all nations to set and agreed limit upon that proportion of total production of certain strategic materials to be devoted to military purposes third international control of atomic energy to promote its use for peaceful purposes only and to ensure the prohibition of atomic weapons forth a limitation or prohibition of other categories of weapons of great destructiveness and fifth the enforcement of all these agreed limitations and prohibitions by adequate safeguards including a practical system of inspection under the United Nations. These were lofty words that looked forward to international cooperation and the peaceful use of nuclear energy. They would be echoed by future presidents who sought disarmament and a new understanding in the cold. War this was not some naive vision of president who believes that arms limitation agreements could end the Cold War or fundamentally changed the nature of the Soviet Union but Eisenhower believed that such agreements might help stabilize cold-war competition. There was also a real hope that nuclear weapons could be a major source of energy and if arms agreements could lead to cost reductions. Perhaps by warding off inexpensive arms race all the better. Eisenhower made a specific proposal for using nuclear power for peaceful purposes in December of nineteen fifty. Three he gave a speech at the United Nations where he discussed the horrors of nuclear war. Atomic bombs. Today are more than twenty five times as powerful as the weapon with which the Atomic Age dawn while hydrogen weapons are in the range of millions of tons of TNT equivalent. Today the United States stockpile of atomic weapons which of course increases daily seeds by many times the totally equivalent of the total of all bombs and all shells that came from every plane and every gun in every theater of war in all of the years of World War. Two a single air group whether afloat or land based can now deliver to any reachable target a destructive cargo exceeding in power all the bombs that fell on Britain in all a World War. Two but he added that nuclear weapons could be used peacefully under the auspices of an international agency. The morning responsibility of the Atomic Energy Agency would be to devise message whereby this fishing material would be allocated to serve the peaceful pursuits of mankind. Experts would be mobilized to apply atomic energy to the needs of agriculture medicine and other people activity a special would be to provide abundant electrical energy in the power starved areas of the world but the contributing powers would be dedicating some of their strengths to the neath rather than the fear of mankind. This speech would lay the foundation of an international body that would regulate nuclear power for peaceful purposes the International Atomic Energy Agency. It would be one of his major international legacies regardless with the new look policy. Eisenhower had set forth his vision of containment. Essentially it meant restoring. America's fiscal health through massive defense cuts and reliance on the threat of nuclear weapons a willingness to engage in brinksmanship and lessening of these risks through alliances covert action and engagement with the Soviet Union and it also included a little bit of rollback. How this strategy played out in the messy reality of the cold. War will be the subject of the next episode of this American President We have a special announcement. We are quite excited to be joining the Evergreen podcast family. Evergreen is a rapidly. Growing podcast publisher. And they're working crate network of PODCASTS. Their network members create original content on a range of subjects from history and philosophy to pop culture and business. And we're really excited about this partnership because Evergreen love telling stories and that's what we love doing. We're passionate about stories and it's perfect thing proud to join evergreens network and look forward to working with them so that we can give you the best content possible. This American President is produced by myself. Richard Lamm and Michael. Thanks to my dad. Virtue the music in this episode is by Blue Dot session. I'm Richard Back next time with more impressive.

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A Cold War secret weapon

Decomposed with Jade Simmons

37:19 min | 1 year ago

A Cold War secret weapon

"I want to take you to a street in South Carolina. Right on the waterfront. We're looking up at a mansion that used to be a thing of glory. Now it's a rough looking tenement almost falling down, and packed with people who have nowhere else to go. There dockworkers and fishermen and a beggar on the street. A group of men is gathering to throw dice. There are palm fronds. The women are in flouncy skirts, the men in Chino's. And this. This is all on a stage. Because outside, it's twelve degrees. It's winter in Moscow to make things even chillier. This is Cold War Moscow, nineteen fifty-six and an American cast has come to put on Porgy and Bess. I'm Jade Simmons. And this is decomposed. We bring you the stories that have shaped classical music, the heart breaks, the betrayals, and the acts of sheer genius that changed everything. Here we're doing something a little different. We're exploring, not just who composed the music, but who brought it to life, we're going to talk about Porgy and Bess, the opera written by music legend George Gershwin who had a huge impact on American music. But we're also going to talk about the many performers who have sung the music. He wrote the opera Porgy and bass is supposedly a story of real life in the South Carolina slums, but it's been controversial. Since the moment it debuted in nineteen thirty five the opera is set near where I grew up in Charleston, South Carolina. It's a city of contradictions where people are always talking about how beautiful the plantations are or how charming the market is. And sometimes we don't realize that the market is the slave market, or those plantations were once. Places where slaves lived and worked, and so even today, the city of Charleston carries as much controversy as the opera Porgy and best still does today. People have been leveling the same criticisms at the show for more than eighty years, they say the characters are walking racial stereotypes, and they say it's another example of a white composer, getting credit for a score that draws heavily from black music over the decades, directors and cast around the world have had to wrangle with its troubled legacy. But they've also celebrated the creativity of the music and all the opportunities it is held for black performers in this episode we're going to take you from the operas inspiration to the premier and then to a very specific tour that unfolded in the nineteen fifties. It happened. When Europe was still we building after the devastation of World War Two, when it was the height. Of the Cold War. And when the civil rights movement was growing in strength. In the face of all this, the US State Department sent Porgy and Bess on a worldwide run and one government official called it their secret weapon. If you haven't seen Porgy and Bess. This is the super short version. The opera tells the story of Porgy a disabled beggar who's in love with Bess. Bess is struggling with addiction, and she's in a relationship with a violent man Porgy tries to rescue her from both. The opera is ultimately a tragedy by the end Porgy kills best as abusive boyfriend it's an act of defense. But by the time Porgy is released from jail. He finds that best is gone. She's headed north to New York with her drug dealer. The opera is based on the novel Porgy by Dubose Heyward Hayward, also grew up in Charleston. Not far from the docks. He writes about he was inspired. He said by story, he saw in the newspaper about a black beggar and attempted shooting with his wife Dorothy Heyward, adapted his novel into a Broadway. Play a few years later, George Gershwin, and his brother, IRA, joined in, and they worked to turn the whole thing into a full blown opera. Of course Dubose and Dorothy, Heyward, George and IRA Gershwin. They were all white. This was the reality. Of mainstream culture for really the majority of US history, the composers, and writers, and the lira Cest, and the theater producers, they were almost entirely white. There were incredibly talented black composers, Scott Joplin, Florence price, Samuel Coleridge, Taylor, and many others. But they didn't really get opportunities like this to get an opera stage, especially in opera about black light. Gershwin. When he decided to take on the project people got excited, he was already a star when he began composing the music for Porgy best he was famous for popular musicals like girl. Crazy and funny face and for symphonic jazz works like rhapsody in blue. Supposedly. He read Hayward novel, Porgy, all in one sitting staying up late to finish it, it was just what he was looking for a story, he could use as a foundation for something he'd been wanting to do to compose a full length opera. He wanted to leave a legend, bigger than pop music as he sought opera was considered distinguished in a way musicals and radio hits Wirt opera was for the ages. To write the music for Porgy, and bass Gershwin traveled down to South Carolina to visit the Hayward's and see what had inspired the story, they visited black churches nightclubs Gershwin spent five weeks on an island off. Charleston coast listening to spirituals and other folk music from the black community who lives there. Kamal. After soaking all this in George Gershwin went home to compose. He was trying to write an American opera Europe was filled with opera America. Not so much barely at all. You look at the guardians list of the top fifty operas of all time, and you see Italy. Italy, Italy, Italy. Some France, Germany Austria, Italy, Italy. Italy. You can see what Gershwin was up against total European dominance, but he crafted his opera drawing on black spirituals and folk music, and it worked. There is exactly one American opera on that fifty list that entry. It's Porgy and Bess. It's an opera with an actual black cast. This detail is key. It could have gone, another way, when Gershwin was getting ready to stage Porgy and best. He got a very generous offer from the place today. Byu an opera the Metropolitan Opera in New York, but he said, no supposedly, because he didn't think they would let him cast black singers there with no black singers. It would have been a cast in black face and Gershwin. Didn't wanna go along with that he went to Broadway. Instead. There weren't many opportunities like this for black performers at the time starring roles in Broadway shows, or for singing opera, the production could pick from the elite of the elite, the leads Porgy and best were played by Todd Duncan who was the head of Howard university's music department and, and Brown the first black singer ever admitted to Juilliard the rest of the cast had similar impressive resumes. The quote unquote real characters. They were cast portray, however, were very different from them the characters in Porgy, and Bess are illiterate, and poor. They are gamblers and drug dealers. And while white critics mostly praised this as an accurate, portrayal of black life, some black critics and musicians immediately called it out for damaging stereotypes jazz legend Duke Ellington slammed it as. Did others and Brown who played Bess remembered her own father, hating, the opera. She said he told her the show, quote perpetuated, the image of blacks as lazy, people singing hymns and taking dope. This is what the original cash struggled with. They were playing characters complicated by stereotypes, but they were doing it on Broadway. They were on the biggest platform available performing technically difficult. Rich music at the highest level of their professions Brown clearly struggled with this. She came from a prominent family in Baltimore. And now she was playing a sexualize drug addicted, women onstage in a show people were hailing as authentic. But through the material she saw chance at opportunity. She said if it brought. Us forward in American music, and opera roles for black singers. Then we should do it. George Gershwin died in nineteen thirty seven just two years after Porgy and best premiered. And we're going to leave him there for the rest of the story, which is really just getting started. After Gershwin's death. The opera kept going. The music caught summertime became even a bigger hit than the show itself. But even when the music's gorgeous, and even when the audience loves it, every cast member who's taken on these roles. They've continued to the bait how their work fits into American culture, and what messages their role sent Eva Jessye who led the choir for both of the shows early Broadway runs said later, that the cast would drown out the N word in the libretto when they performed it took time, but the word was finally written out of the opera by Georgia's brother IRA considering the baggage and criticism surrounding organ, bests, it's pretty surprising. What happened next? The nineteen fifties were critical moment in international relations World War, Two had revamped. The world order communism was as. Strong as ever in the Soviet Union. The US was pushing its own brand of democracy countries were having to choose sides. Are you with the east or the west propaganda was flying from everywhere? And one thing, the Soviet Union was quick to critique was race relations in the US, their messages, said, just look at how unequal things are there. They weren't wrong. But it wasn't the narrative the US government wanted to spread so here we get to one of the most interesting tactics. The government uses to influence international opinion art in this case opera. After the break the State Department pulls out its secret weapon. And I'll tell you about the one person who wasn't allowed to be a part of it. If you're looking for more fascinating stories and phenomenal music. Go to your classical dot org, you can stream classical music, twenty four seven and find out more about the people bought hind the notes. It's all at your classical dot org. I'm Jay Simmons and this is decomposed. In the nineteen forties and fifties. The US government was facing a lot of international criticism around race relations. So the US responded with a coordinated effort to spread its own cherry picked version of reality. The government sent carefully selected black speakers abroad to counteract stories about the inequality African Americans faced in the US. But the criticism continued to grow Soviet periodical rand stories about lynchings in business conditions for African American laborers. The US government needed to do more in response. Enter Robert greens. Breen was a mover and shaker in the theater world. He knew how to get things done. And he knew how to make people pay attention in nineteen fifty two. He partnered with Blevins Davis producer to launch production of Porgy and best. That is absolutely stacked with talent. Look at this cast, and it's hard to believe they shared a single stage. There's leontyne price arguably, one of the most famous classical American sopranos, there's Cab Calloway, a jazz singer of Cotton Club beim. There's even Maya Angelo, a very young Maya Angelo, who sang and danced before her literary career made her national phenomenon. Breen had planned his production, just right. The Truman administration was looking the sponsor shows to tour Europe as an act of the PLO, Assey and to spread US culture. The government agreed to send the Breen Davis production of Porgy and best on the road. It's important to note here that this was not a universally celebrated the season, some government officials and politicians asked why send out an opera that showed. Terrible. Living conditions for African Americans isn't that the exact wrong message to send black critics had bigger concerned. What if Europeans accepted the offer as documentary what if they believed that catfish row and all of its residents was a real life snapshot? North has been people. Got Mike got on. Oh day long. One of the songs I got plenty of Nuton has Porgy saying he's satisfied, even if he's poor because he's got my gal got my Lord got my song. That didn't line up with African Americans calling for actual ebonic quality. We can't say exactly why the opera was picked, but there was a plan for how it would be presented in hopefully for how would be interpreted, if you put on Porgy invests, but you emphasize to audiences that took place in the past, you can say, yes. Things used to be bad. There was racism, we admit it, but look at our dazzling and talented cast, see how far we've all come. How could they achieve all this? If things were still bad. Of course that was the government's plan but it was the cast who had to carry it out. They began by Toren Porgy and best around the US then they cross the ocean on a mission from the US government, which you couldn't forget because they arrived by air force plane. They played in Austria, Germany, England, and France in their first stretch singing, and wowing. Bream claimed he counted with a stop watch twenty nine minutes of plots over twenty one curtain Coles at the Berlin performance alone. The cast was a huge attraction in country after country and this show didn't stop when the music did the actors were constantly on display, it was an all out PR blitz. They got stopped on the street and in restaurants with photographers snapping away and people wanting autographs, according to Lillian Hayman, who was in the cast people even wanted to touch her face. She said to quote see if the black came off the press also had an obsession with the cast clothes in their fashion when they were out the actors were in evening gowns with firs or sharply tailored, suits and hats. The photographs are. Totally glamorous this fed into the US, government's propaganda push to drown out stories about segregation and prejudice to spread the message African Americans had access to education and culture and wealth, a presidential advisor named CD Jackson, one of the cast out on the streets and foreign cities. He said, quote, their clothes will be visible and touchable and their freedom from fear will be visible. All of this positioning of the cast for propaganda. It worked a columnist wrote in the New York Times that the cast had shown up here as great artists, putting the lied to a good deal of the communist exaggerations about the limitation of negroes opportunities in the United States. In so many ways the cast was in this impossible spot, they were being presented by the US government as proof that the US was full of opportunity for African Americans, which was misleading at best, but they were also getting the opportunity of a lifetime to sing antipathy form around the world. To change people's minds about where black performers could go. They even put on Porgy and Bess at the famous opera house less Scala in Milan, Italy. A young my Angelo told and Isreaeli reporter we have a great responsibility to keep the players success. If it is a hit, and it is our managers are going to put on another negro show and more negro actors will be employed and given a chance to show the world that we can do we are responsible for every negro actor in the world. In all the Breen Davis production of Porgy and bass was kind of unstoppable. It's stretched on over four years. They hit five continents. The US State Department largely kept underwriting their travels the cast changed as the months in years past, but the production kept touring, they hit the US Canada, Spain, Italy, Switzerland Belgium, Yugoslavia and Yugoslavia. So many people wanted to see the show that some of them even split a ticket, one person would watch the first half then swap out at intermission. So the next person could watch the second half it didn't stop there. The cast hit resil- Uruguay Colombia Venezuela, Mexico than back to Europe. Government officials clearly felt they were getting their money's worth air force Brigadier General, Dale, snr. Myth wrote a letter to Breen saying it is through operations such as Porgy, and best that World War. Three can be one without a fight. This means that you are saving lives and keeping our country free with every performance. But for all the government talk about how effective Porgy and best was and building. Goodwill spreading American culture in counteracting negative messages about the US. There was one place that the US State Department said was too far. There was one place. They would not pay to send them the Soviet Union. As I said, before, Robert Breen the tours producer knew how to get things done even if the US government didn't like what he was up to he'd wanted to bring Porgy and bass to the Soviet Union for years, but the US State Department said, no twice. So Breen found someone who would say, yes, someone who would cough up the money the Soviets themselves. This was out of hand, the US had wanted to fight Soviet propaganda spreading another countries, but they didn't want to send the Porgy invest cast to the Soviet Union directly. What if the Soviets used the opera's portrayal of poverty, and prejudice against the US Kenan opera be a double agent? This is ridiculous. But while the US may not have paid for this trip. They did not forbid it in nineteen fifty five plans were made to get the cast of Porgy and best from east. Berlin to Leningrad to cross the iron curtain. American officials gave the cast briefing on the realities of Russia. They were told to be careful about what they said. And if there were political questions, they were told, quote, don't answer them. We are on a cultural mission with that as a send off the cast boarded a train, this trip was a huge deal. No. You. S theater group had ever visited the Soviet Union before American press. Tagged along from everywhere. The New York Times the Associated Press CBS time life, even Truman Capote was there to cover it for the New Yorker. There's footage from the store moment when they arrived, the cast stepping off the rail cars crowds cheering the actors glamorous. And for coats in the cold Russian weather, one actress, even carrying a small dog. They were greeted by huge crowds people throwing flowers and clapping, but during their trip person after person kept asking one question. Where's paul? Robeson. Was an American star. Did everything he was a pro football player a singer and actor and he had his law degree from Columbia, but it's his singing that people knew him most for he had a huge following a US and abroad. He even played Buckingham Palace. If you know, his work, it's likely from his performance of old men river. That. And. But. But he was also outspoken about racial inequality in the United States and his support of communism. He railed against the horrors of lynching and spoke about the power of unions and the need for civil rights in nineteen fifty the United States revoked his passport, all those musicians and speakers that the US across Europe on goodwill, tours, who they didn't send is just as important as who they did Rogerson was kept at home when Porgy and Bess arrived in the Soviet Union. Russians wanted to know where he was the issues. He spoke out about civil rights and inequality were more relevant than ever at this point. And more public, the Montgomery bus boycott was in full swing. Emmett tills funeral had been held just a few months before the. World was watching how the civil rights fight in the US was unfolding. And the Soviet audience was especially curious where is palm. Rogerson. But just because Robeson wasn't physically. There doesn't mean people didn't hear from him. The Breen Davis production was very careful about how they presented Porgy and best to Russian audiences in the program. They stressed that the opera took place in the past, again, as, if they could claim it's not like this anymore. Roberston didn't let that fly in open letter from Paul Robeson appeared in the Soviet state, paper, Pravda sincere. Greetings to the Soviet people. It said. Robeson emphasized, the events in Porgy, and best are not just a thing of the past. He wanted people to know that they were still very much a reality for African Americans struggling against white supremacy. The letter said, I know that they the cast members are proud of the heroic struggle of their people who fight for quality and human dignity in Mississippi and in South Carolina where the events performed in their play on fold. Now it's impossible to know if the cast themselves read this letter someone would have had to translate it for them as it appeared in Russian. But I wonder if they were thinking about just what Rogerson was saying when they were performing there on the stage in Moscow in front of the fishing nets and the poem FRANZ. I wonder if they were thinking about everything that Porgy and best represents of the many angles, you can view it from of the stereotypes of Carey's, but also the opportunities that brought them to that very stage. I wonder if they were thinking about everything happening back at home, people fighting for the right to a bus seat to an equal education. Thinking about how they were there in Moscow to fight for every black performers right to be on stage. The Breen Davis tour played a dozen or so more shows after Moscow, the last performance was an Amsterdam on June. Third nineteen fifty-six in all over four years. Production stopped in seventy cities in twenty nine countries. They performed Porgy invest for audiences that spoke eighteen different languages. The cast which changed over the years dealt with racism with people who miss red Porgy and best documentary with people who still shun them in the face of all of that they still wild. Then when they finally returned home Robert Breen got busy trying to arrange one more thing. He wanted the cast of visit the White House, he pulled all his usual strings, and wrote letters, appealing to the Eisenhower administration. He wanted the actress to be recognized for all the work they done for their service to the country. But the White House refused. There are many things to think about when we listen to Porgy and Bess to admire Gershwin's work to appreciate the beauty of the performances. And also to think about all the stories of all the cast members who've played these parts and Sundays words. Maya Angelo gave an interview in twenty ten almost sixty years after she performed in Porgy and Bess. She was asked why she went on the tour how she felt about the work. She said, I knew that there was art from the poets and from the Gershwin's. I knew there was great art. I also knew that they had been inspired by great art. The great art of the African American. More full? What's the other piece? I think about when I listen about the musicians who inspired the work in the first place, the ones Gershwin may have heard in those weeks. He spent in South Carolina listening and researching the ones in the churches or the nightclubs. The ones who get no credit even to this day. But whose work is praised performed and celebrated all over the world. This is our last episode of decompose for. Now, if you enjoyed the show, please rate and review us on your podcast app and tell us what composer, you'd love to hear about in the future. You can find decomposed on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter at decomposed show. That's at decomposed show. Tell us your favorite composer, and who we should cover next. For a complete listing of the music you heard in this episode go to decomposed show dot org. That's decomposed show dot org. For more about the music you heard this episode you'll see our reading list there for this episode. We definitely recommend the strange career of Porgy and Bess by Ellen Newnan along with work by Michael Cy you and John Harper Taylor. Find the fullest at decomposed show dot org. Decomposed is hosted by me. Jade Simmons, it's produced by Tracy Mumford and Ryan more, Chris Juillan is our editor, this episode was written by Tracy Mumford with me drawing on research, by Leinna Leeson, a doctoral student at the university of Michigan sound design by Aaron Cohen, engineering by Corey Schrapel. Thanks to Ryan cats. Our fact checker, the interim director of podcast for eight APM is Loren, d. Decomposed is made possible by inspired by you NPR's capital campaign, and the generosity of Ruth and John Hus. Before you go. Let's talk about how these stories get told decomposed is a public radio podcasts. That is supported by your donations this show and shows like it only happened with your support donate today to hear more shows like this from APM podcast. Give today at decomposed show dot org slash donate.

Toren Porgy Us George Gershwin Bess Europe Bess US State Department Porgy South Carolina Soviet Union Charleston Robert Breen Maya Angelo government Jade Simmons Breen Davis
deGrom Is Dealing With Back Issues - And Food Or Sex???

Boomer & Gio

23:46 min | 8 months ago

deGrom Is Dealing With Back Issues - And Food Or Sex???

"The first thing I heard was jerry. RECCO say. Murders one thing, but this was to the nth degree. The jury story and I did of course the first thing I did that. I read this story. You are wrong. That is about as bad as story as I. Have and you and you're a UN Al. Channel guys yeah. This one is just I. Mean I was sick reading. It Yeah I, said to my so. This stuff actually happens really this happened. This wasn't something I saw on datelines. Something I saw on a movie in a movie somewhere. This is something that just happened like a couple of days. Yeah, so Monday, so Monday when we're going about our business. This was going on it just a mind blowing. We can't open the show there though it's too depressing. It's too horrific but I did find it funny. I'M GONNA, make a running list of the first sentence that here in the warm-up show, when I log in, and this was one of my particular favorites, which was hey, al murders, one thing but this inquiry. How you doing Jerry I'm good, I'm good. I'm better than Jacob. degrom this morning because I got a bad back to, but I'm doing okay I'm all right. Nice solid. Our with Allen here we go. Yeah, I mean as far as Graham pardon me it same thing with the syndergaard industry injury is of course. It's horrible to hear that these guys are hurt especially now. We don't know the extent of what's going. Going to happen to Jacob, degrom, but another part of me says hey, if this is going to happen, isn't this the best for this? This is during this sixty game crazy season that we don't even know if it's going to happen I, mean I a back. Injury is something that's like the last thing you wanna hear because those things linger, and they could be often. We've seen careers and because of them. Them not the Tommy John, surgery something you want to hear for. Noah syndergaard what we've seen. So many guys come back from it including Jacob degrom himself, but I I'm processing these big injuries from a with the mets didn't than I ever have because it's not, it's not the same it's just. It's a completely different world that we're living in and the impact of that particular player on this season is you could? Could say it's going to be greater because it's a smaller amount of games, you could also say we ever GonNa. Remember this season to be a real season ten fifteen twenty years down the I. Think we will because it's going to be a very unique season, so we will for that, but I'm totally with you. I think two ways you can go here. You can go glass half full glass half empty. And I think in this case because it's July. Fifteenth I guess today now and we're still nine days away from opening day. Maybe doesn't make an opening day start. Who knows but as long as he gets going there on the first week. it's fine. This would have been much much worse. Had this popped up a couple of days before this season was going to start, he'll be able to get treatment now. It's happened to him before in the past has not really hampered him for too much time, and so maybe they were just being extra co I mean look at Aaron judge playing because of a stiff neck. All because of you know being cautious you. You don't WANNA lose them. For the starting on the twenty third against the nationals and you know as they said to Aaron Boone, said yesterday. He would probably play if they were real games now, but it's you know where we are same thing with degrom I think I think degrom fully. This is being cautious. He felt something after throwing. We'll wait and see. You don't want to overreact now six seven hours from now. Could we be talking to be a completely different story and he could be out for three months. Yeah, it's possible. I'm with you. Though let's think positively and just think that the mets you're using caution and nothing crazy. Yeah! I WANNA see. See One of two things happen with this because I think that the middle ground is something that is dangerous, I either WANNA. See that okay. He's completely healthy in. This was just a little bit of something, and it's gone, and he is fine, and let's forget about it. It was just a little bit of a scare that meant nothing or I wanNA see no. We're shutting them down and we'll see you next year. We have regular season because what I don't WanNa. See us to like fight through this for the sixty game season in this corona virus baseball world, and then have him really get her, and then and then next year when hopefully things are. are back up and running. We don't have Jacob degrom. That's the thing I. Don't WanNa. See with this I. Mean if he ends up missing the season along with Noah syndergaard yet, does that absolutely stink? Because one of the great things about being a fan of of the mets right now is the fact that you've got Jacob degrom and seeing him pitch would be a treat especially now because we hannity sports shore. All of that stuff would be great to be the same thing if you know Peter Lonzo couldn't play Aaron judge, couldn't player Garrett. Cole couldn't play or anybody. WHO's your ends up being your favorite player? But I just I don't WanNa. See Him. Fight through something for this. It's just different. This is not like Matt Harvey. In the world, series that I wanted to see continue to pitch or Johan Santana with the no hitter that I wanted to see admittedly continue to pitch in those particular situations here. I don't WanNa see anybody fighting through anything. We Make Fun of Stanton. We got on judge a little bit yesterday, but quite frankly you know even when those guys they shouldn't be fighting through. Through anything right now. The time I WANNA see Stanton fight through something. It was in the playoffs last year when he was nowhere to be found. D. H. One game was gone the next. That's what I wanted to see someone through something you'll not for this totally understood, and that's why you create depth on your team. That's why you go out and you sign Rick Forsillo and Michael Walker and guys like that and you got Marcus Stroman. They have arms. They'll be okay now. This is a CY young award winning arm, so we're talking about something a little bit different here but I know what you're saying I mean. He's got to be one hundred percent to go out there. Don't half ass. It don't go out at eighty percent or ninety percent and kind of fight through what could be a lingering problem that could persist throughout his. His career, because a back is tricky as you know so I'm with you hundred percent now. That doesn't mean I would shut it down for the season but you gotTa make sure that he's okay, and as soon as he's okay. Get Him back out there. We might differ a little bit on that but I I'm with you. I would not want even seventy five percent of Jacob degrom. degrom out there. I need him for the duration of his contract to be what he's been. That's arguably the best pitcher in baseball for the last several years, so it's a tricky one. It's a crappy way to wake up. I saw last night before I went to sleep and thought. You know things have been going well, and you know assess is actually looking good. He feels like he's going. Going to be there opening day, the the news is really been very positive with the mets going into Olbia strange season starting next week. This one was you know it was one like all right well, guess the headline tomorrow. Yeah, you know what we need to stop doing, and we're guilty of it. I think every talk. Show that talks about sports is guilty of this when a team has depth. We always sit around where he's guys. GonNa play. Hi, YOU'RE GONNA fit this guy in. Where's he going to be? What do you do with him? You can't have him on the bench. This guy going to the bullpen. What happens every single time? Somebody gets hurt those guys at then you probably even more guys than you thought you had in the first place anything about the Yankees last year where these guys are gonNA play. What's going to happen and what happens when they come back? People just continue to get hurt and these-these or somebody's in a horrible slump. Situations always work out. They always work out I. Mean even with the mets I mean. We have conversations about that where Brody van wagon you'll. He talked about not having depth, which was so true last year with the starting rotation, no depth there, so we went out and he signed depth, and then we're talking about well your. Your these two guys in Portillo in walking. They think that they're going to start, and there's not enough spots for all these stars. What's going to happen? No, no syndergaards. Tommy John Surgery and Jacob degrom might be out with back end. Yeah, so it always happens, and it's probably won't be the last. Someone else will probably end up getting her. We do this all the time. We make these assumptions that these guys are going to stay healthy for an entire year. Am Baseball lately especially locally? Nobody staying healthy both the mets and the Yankees have been decimated with injuries for the last, the better part of the last five years both teams. Healthy. Healthy healthy. We've seen it more than anybody probably I completely agree with you. So you know what it's thinks it's not the best news of the day, but hopefully it's nothing and we don't overreact until we know exactly what it is, and then away we go and this weekend you've got games. You're going to see the mets and the Yankees a couple of exhibition games, and it's a very real thing right now because you are today's. Wednesday were almost a full week out now from the start of the baseball season with the Yankees and the national, so it's right here. We go I like I actually like. Take the other day with Aaron. Judge was funny for sure about the you know the stiff neck and get them out. He was joking around horsing. Brought them right, but he get lost I think it was the quote that was funny and I totally understand that I think at the end of the day. Though it's probably the smart thing to do, make sure he's right for Thursday. Because you, what you want is him in the opening day lineup as opposed to these nonsensical intra squad games which are important, but not if you've got. got a nagging injury, so let's get right and let's go the two thousand twenty baseball season upon us. How about that? Yeah, in one week from tomorrow? It's unbelievable to think that we're going to see a baseball game that actually counts in the record books one week from tomorrow, speaking injuries and local teams about another Brooklyn Net test, PAS unbelievable. Navarre's announced Michael Beasley who they bring in. To help out this roster that has been plowed through with every injury in the book and a ton of Gerona, virus, and now Michael Beasley is a guy who's got I hate I hate you. It's insanity, everybody they. It seems like anybody on this roster comes down with corona virus, and it also comes on the heels, also telling now we do a warm up show between five and six every morning. MLS released their numbers of fourteen hundred and sixty four tests that they did a couple of days ago, or maybe three days ago, whatever it was zero positive cases, zero and the nets can't go a week without one of their players testing positive. It just doesn't make sense. And so do we know now I read part of the story. Do we think he came into it positive, or is this something that transpired once? He got to Orlando well. It's in a big difference between those things. He had to leave the bubble, so he already made it into the bubble meaning to me. If you go into the bubble had tested negative right. That's the only way I can. I can read that so then my thought, my first thought was as possible. It was a false positive then. Yeah because it just seems from everything I've read and a lot of the videos that I've seen stories that have been put out. It really looks like they at least have a handle on things. I mean hell again if mls did fourteen hundred and sixty four negative tests. Which is tremendous news, they're playing at wide world of sports, too I just wonder how and why that. He came down with this. If in fact, they didn't have it before he got there well also. Don't you need to be there for X. amount of days before? Like a bunch of teams went there, and before they practice. They were there for a number of days, maybe because he signed the late, he was in that period where he was by himself. Possible waiting the results of his. His test and he wasn't around the team I can't. I can't find that answer right now, but if he was around the team, you would imagine especially with how infectious the net seemed to me. It seems like one guy gets in. Another guy gets it then. You would think that if he's around the team. You're going to hear more positive test from the net. The net might be that team that they have to just completely send home. No, they're gonNA eat bringing guys up, I mean. Note, make them the Knicks just take the old nets roster out. Put the Knicks, the nets uniforms and see how that works. Let's to delete eight. Oh my goodness. Yeah, no, it's it's. It's discouraging for sure but you've also got teams doing quite well with the so far. It's just weird that it's happening to this team here. From our area, but yet it's weird man down there in Orlando and you think you're gonNA. Start playing basketball soon and every guy that you bring in nip out out was six now or seven eight. It's eight Cincinnati beginning of this eight eight nets, and that's including Kevin Durant who tested positive a number of months ago, but I think it's what six maybe since all of that happened months ago, just thinking. Is there any other team that even compares to that not really right, not that no, not that I can even think no, not even close. I mean one or two here. They're different teams, but you have eight players total, and all the guys that just tested positive. Spencer Dinwiddie dray Jordan. Taurine Prince Michael Beasley I mean. You knew with Kevin Durant Kyrie, irving not being healthy enough to come back and play in this bubble end of the season that they weren't going to make a lot of noise to begin with. That would have been a shocker, but now it's like what's the point of even having them there well. Fill. Out The schedule. Really, that's all it is because you gotta you. You would have to think at this point. Even as good as carousel avert, is I mean you're not GonNa? You can't put the team completely on your back. You would think at this point. They probably won't even make it to the playoffs. Even though right now. They're in playoff position. They got games to play. And this is no semblance of the team. We've seen all year long. It's just not I mean. There's Jared Allen out there. Okay fine. There's a couple of guys, but it's not. There are no stars. You're missing your your big scores. It's going to be. It's going to be what it is. It's going to be an evaluation period for Sean Marks and whatever players they saw. They signed a point guard for Memphis. From the University of Memphis they, he's going to get minutes. It's going to be a very unrecognizable team for stretches of games. If you're a nets fan, it's just going to be different and so they'll use it for what it is. They'll get film on guys and they don't make the playoffs. It'll be a quick stay for the nets and out. Yeah, and this niche hotline is I love the idea of this niche hotline. Hotline because you've got a group of players, and apparently I don't know people were on twitter. Assuming it was Chris Paul was the source of the snitch hotline I don't even joking around or not but you've got a group of players who want to make sure that this thing gets going and starting and playing, and then you've got another group of players who essentially aren't taking this thing seriously at all and then. One group snitching on the other with this anonymous tip line you go, and then there's now reports of what activity goes on any particular day like. It was snitch hotline quiet, but today. This morning is lots of tips coming in. The snitch hotline. The NARC line as these guys are just rat on one another. They see him. Do something which I don't really understand because. If you see somebody doing something they're not supposed to do. Don't you just tell them directly like? Hey, you're not supposed to do that then you have to report them because they might have been exposed to the virus I. Seven done. something. In, you saw him do it then you're also doing something you're not supposed to do unless you got Benach yours or telescope or something, I mean or surveillance, foot or guys are just doing emergency. MADEL ON A. Imagine. How how? That hotline is GonNa look in about three weeks then these it'd be burning up on fire. If, you think about it. The music you this do if something happens to a team like the nets for instance, or for whoever do they not get paid like? If the season got shut down like they wouldn't get paid, right? I'll get to play games. Yeah, absolutely, so there you go. There's why you've got guys that are probably going to be upset and they're gonNA. Take full advantage of this snitch line if you will. Because it's one thing the risk what you're doing. You're putting a lot of. Faith in what the NBA is put together an for these protocols and safety measures is another thing to be have be a complete waste of time to go through all this and then not get paid, not playing games, so you know what I'm with the SNITCH is, let's go. Do, not mess with another man's money. What's happening is usually. What do you think the biggest lie reason for violating the bubble is? Self Control. Well it's either food or sex. I think that will be the case soon. I would I mean they've been there for a week. A week. A month two months I understand a week me. You're talking about I know what I'm talking about single twenty or lots of testosterone. To certain. It's a week though. They giggle week. Why Room bothering? Where'd you be more likely in that situation to break quarantine in the NBA Pablo, for food or sex? His I'm thinking I end. It would be food for me. That would be the thing that would be the first thing I would like I can't take this. It was seen some of the stuff that they were eating. I'd be like I can't do this. I've got to go and eat something different. I would probably say the other. You would yes, and the guy who mistakenly did it was for food. Right at least one of them. Yeah for for the pickup for the takeout. Because I'll I'll I'll challenge you on this though. I would assume. Yeah. I would assume that you have gone a week. Without. Sex. Have you gone a week out eating something that you that you didn't like? Have you a full week of of not enjoying any food at all you? They're not getting saltines and Jelly I mean Los Nah. It's not that prison. It's not that bad I mean close first of all. They have macaroni and cheese. I could live on that for a week easy. I could. I'm sure they're getting eggs for breakfast. Some of the stuff that we're reading in seeing is slanted in a way that makes it look bad. I don't I really don't think it's that bad now. If you're telling me, can I go a month without you know getting a pizza well? Yeah I. Probably Could Yes I. Even though I've I've dieted and I've eaten a certain way for a number of times. You've spent a use button you spent months eating grass and state now known no a home, but here's the thing. The diets that I choose allow me to at least enjoy certain meals. I could never do some of like mail. You frozen crap diets. It's like Fettuccini Alfredo, but it tastes like bio like that's not the thing that I'm doing what I'll do. Is that that whole thirty which is like eliminates a lot of stuff. Put a salads, meats, and things that I enjoy. So I I never felt like I was really depriving myself during that time I would risk getting kicked out of the bubble for Food I. wouldn't I just wouldn't? A long swath of my life without sex left at someone's the Truman. Administration. I mean I like you know as there's been, there's been chunks. But. There's not the food man that's a three times a day. If not more adding snacking, they're not eating charcoal though I understand, it might not be gourmet food, I yes, a hundred percent I can handle the food. Definitely could here a better man than I? Because you're telling me that that I am being told what to eat like. That's like you know when you have to eat the hospital food half the like this is what you get. That is tough man. You can't even make choices. It's just like this is what you're eating I think that it's a lot more difficult than you think it is. I don't. Because then you're craving things, and also just for the first week when they had to spend in their room I in an isolation when they brought them. The as this goes on. They're going to be able to choose what they're eating. I hope because that's one guy's going to beat snitching on each other. They're gonNA be going out for dinner's I'm telling you right now? You know how many calories these people eat. Eat a day I. DO professional athletes for five thousand calories a day? Absolutely I know there's an offensive lineman in there, but these guys are still there constantly moving and running and right out there eating nonstop, no-doubt tackling no doubt I mean professional athletes. Eat at a rate that I'll bet you normal person to their hotel. Rooms are stocked with crystals and protein bars, and all sorts of good things uncrossable whatever they. On crossing tremendous, yeah, I, know, yeah. The pit- football team love those uncrossable boxes and boxes of boxes of those things those in those little baby bell cheeses yeah. On Rag appeal yeah, those are the those are the two things that were requested when I did the football stuff. Those two things are always on the plane for whatever reason and the players love him as little stupid wax cheeses that you'd rip off the thing, and then in there you have to at least eight three of those. You couldn't have one of those and be satisfied. That was that was a three cheese. Cheese limit those little baby bell circles I always found funny on the charters. When you would get on you first of all, you'd have food after the game, and then you get on the plane, and then there's more food for you and there would be yeah. That'd be a good meal, and you get this big Fruit Cup, and everything's all healthy, and they have this monster chocolate. Dr. How does that make any sense? People pass it around good stuff. That was my first introduction at Chick-fil-a, too, because they used to have the chick-fil-a catering for those flights. The UNCROSSABLE and the cheese on the way back. If people wanted a snack, but you'd get on the way there you'd get the chick-fil-a and I. had never been in New York. We didn't have chick fil. A.'s at that point, so it was just like amazing. It was a it was an eye opening experience, and then I was hooked at that point and I was trying to eat healthy at least the first year I did. Did pit football and I would like save up like calories and stuff to make sure I could go in hard, and have all the Chick-fil-a the sandwich, the nuggets, the fries, the cookie at the end, and then we, the land and I'd be bloated, but boy. Do I love that? There was so good and ally. Ever tell you his chick-fil-a problem growing up. No, no, I. Don't think I know that chick fil takeover out. That for many many years, our family legitimately called it and thought it was called Chick Fila. I was an adult. I think when I heard someone say chick fillet, and I finally put it all together. Fill A. Chick Fila we would say that. As as a family, we'd go war. We're GONNA Chick Fila. And then after they ate. They listen to the song. No role model modell's no role modell's. That's great. Do you think there's somebody right now? Who is listening going? Wait a second. It's Chick-fil-a it's not just. Yes, it's possible I. Say yes, at least one. Dan and Carter at maybe man. That guy you guys still follow him on twitter. Dan and corn read. Well I. Don't follow him on twitter I. DO interact with him on twitter. The only one who actually follows him. My goodness I I I'm going to have to stop I think he's he's just. He's out of his mind to begin with, but then the food things he posts like you really thinks that he is like Scott Conan or one of these like chefs. That's on the food network. He thinks he's bobby flay, and it's just slop. He just throws slop on these plates in his life. This is what I did tonight. Grilled this up through these beans can all over the top of it and it looks beautiful. Dan Get it together all right boomer and Geo on the fan CBS sports network and radio DOT. COM WE'LL GET CEELO's update coming up in just a little bit just getting started on this Wednesday morning.

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Exporting democracy, Brexit and the anniversary of Thatcher

Between The Lines

28:52 min | 2 years ago

Exporting democracy, Brexit and the anniversary of Thatcher

"The. Tom Switzer and welcome to between the lines boys. Great to have your company. We'll today on the program later on we'll be chatting with Ted Galen carpenter from the libertarian Cato Institute. And he's argument is that democracy is not an export commodity stay with us for that. Well, forty years ago. Margaret Thatcher lead her conservative party to victory. Not she's just coming into Downing Street. Now here comes the prime ministerial Rover bearing Mrs Thatcher as prime minister. Huge crowd. Huge chair. Lane close police out of a car behind her. Mrs thatcher. Onto onto the doorstep has that all the on lady. She was lighted dubbed. And she said the scene for a wave of providence is Asian and deregulation across the endless fee from the Keynesian mindset, the delivered economic stagflation and the winter of discontent the UK as well as the US Australia New Zealand, we will move to an era of Santa policy and more durable prosperity today, though, the cause for competitive markets and free enterprise and peas quixotic polls show rising support for socialism, especially among Molyneux's in Australia, the US and Britain. There's widespread anxieties about white stagnation. Paypal being processed out of the housing market, and the vast concentration of wealth now with Britain's ruling conservative party in disarray and against the backdrop of a chaotic British exit from the there's a real danger. Britain is looking to the lift suddenly the prospect of socialist, Jeremy Corbyn in number ten s no longer remarked. So what should today's conservatives? Thatches children. What should I do to Montgomery is founder of conservative home and former editorial page editor of the times, Tim, it's great to have. You in Sydney is great to be here. Thank you. Take us back for decades to thatches election victory. When I really was a fat to child. I was nine is old when she came to power. But I remember my school being closed for two weeks because we'd run out of oil. We were all have to be sent home to work, which I remember, my mom, not being very pleased at but that was just one of the illustrations of a decade where Britain was seen as the sick man of Europe. We had a period in the mid nineteen seventies. When people had to turn the lights off really at ten o'clock at night. There wasn't enough fuel to get the country. There was a three day week factories had to shutter for most of the week simply because of a massive crisis in energy way unions, really were run Scott hill union, thuggery creek and in the motor industry right across manufacturing and what Mrs Thatcher. Most of all I think seeded in doing was that she put the government back in charge of the country. There was a feeling that unions, a militant left wing. Unions really running the show, and Mrs Thatcher restored the idea that Britain was governable that's about what direction Britain should go in. But the idea that someone was in charge. It you've argued that Thatcher today would not identify with many of those people who are known as Thatcherites. What do you mean by that? There is a view of Margaret Thatcher. As the sort of great libertarian reformer who left all parts of UK economy and state untouched. Actually, there was quite a pragmatism to her. I think some of her Monday disciples of forgotten that Britain's national health service, the the welfare state the system of higher education. I could go on she left a lot of that. Untouched. Think she realized that if you wanted to win the battles that really needed to be one probably being taming of the trade unions fighting the Cold War ensuring the survival of western. Civilization against communism. She knew that she had to focus on a few things. So this this idea of the iron lady, this unbending woman, this libertarian reformer was true in some respects. But also there was a pragmatism. Now like, many of fetches children, you are a conservative and supporter of free markets. I think you've written that you've had a treasured photograph of you and fetch on your wall when your child thanks revealing that, Tom. On the people had Popstars stars on that. On that. I had that. And yet you ride not so long ago that you have found yourself agreeing with much of what Jeremy Corbyn, and he's socialist treasury spokesman John McDonnell have said about economic insecurity, homelessness business. What I don't agree with is their recipe for putting it, right? But we are ten a little bit more now than ten years after one of the biggest economic events of modern times, the crash that happened the banks that were rescued when we had those failures on a Wall Street in the city of London. I think there's still a sense across electrodes in the western world that capitalism isn't working is should people. Don't think the next generation is going to be as wealthy as them certainly not wealthier the housing market seems to out priced lot of younger voters. The pay of chief executives in boardrooms seems to no connection with the underlying performance of of the businesses. And if conservatives center right parties do not reform capitalism. I didn't think we can be surprised if voters vote for people who will reform capitalism, but not reform captors way that works with the graying. But against the throws the baby out with the bathwater. Let's get your reaction to something that Kenneth clock. These days known as the father of the UK house of Commons. This is what he told the BBC's. How talk recently I assumed nineteen nineties the great normality, the emerging economies wrenching the system, we had a gruel space globe Lauder in Britain. We had growth with low inflation Konami was marching or capitalism. Work for everybody. Go free markets. So the social conscience to work. Faye? We neglected we failed. And nobody knows how to do it. Now. How to include those people who not to be able to take leading roles who's living standards have stagnated or sometimes Fulham subsequent time those towns communities those regions that old industrial. And that's where the protest is coming from the Trump vote. Yes is very similar to the protest votes. We get here. Clot the veteran. Tory minister it's been in the common since the early seventies. That was on the BBC's talk. I'm talking with Tim Montgomery, British rata who's against the center for independence. Studies this week in Sydney falling on from those remarks team class onto something isn't he this backlash against capitalism helps explain the Trump vote the Brexit vote the Rosza populism across the European continent. Absolutely Brexit, for example, is is a cause I support I support Brexit because I think Britain should be self governing nation, but driving that just as some of those other electoral upsets, you you mentioned was a sense that ten years after the crash the people that caused it the bankers who made huge profits when the curve was upwards, but one punished when the crisis hit the politicians in the central Bank that. Guided over that crash a largely still in power. And I think when the crash I happened. I think there was a sense that my goodness. Is this time when capitalism is in real trouble. But what voters did at that time was actually they voted for people like BRAC Obama, David Cameron, Kevin Rudd who actually were more sort of manages they held onto nurse for fear or something they wanted to ship to be steadied. But actually wants the ship was studied they actually did want the super tanker to move in a different direction. They didn't want to go back to the days when the banks were too big to fail when the CEO's could run their businesses and telephone number salaries without some connection to their underlying performance. And I think complacency has sort of set in amongst the friends of capitalism, we haven't acted upon the need for reform that those events in two thousand seven and two thousand eight made absolutely clear was necessary. A Wall Street Journal had an editorial earlier this week about the last quarter growth. Of three point two percent, which is really quite impressive and their argument is tax cuts. Deregulation? Classic sort of free market principles are responsible for the American bull run. And that's up -solutely hoping lift Wijers something that hasn't happened for quite some time. So cool new then argue that the conventional free market policies, they actually still can work. Look, even though Britain has this Brexit blind at the moment because of the indecision of our parliament Britain actually is growing faster than Germany France, Italy, Spain really because of the fat derived inheritance. So I'm not saying that what Mrs Thatcher. Ronald reagan. John Howard did is irrelevant. But to look at is this sustainable is capitalism reaching enough people. And I think there are plenty of injustices in captains wages may be rising. But house prices are probably rising faster, for example. There are all sorts of long-term dependencies on welfare where people. I just don't feel that this hope around the corner. And if we don't address those things as people who are friends of capitalism, we risk people taking over who have a more revolutionary rather than ever Lucien reappraise complicates matters to is the wife of technological change, you know, artificial intelligence automation, robotics, a what happens to the loses of technological change and globalization team. I think ultimately, you can't be a Luddite and say we to reject technology. We've got to embrace it is inevitable. If we don't embrace it in the west other parts of the world. Most certainly will. We can't say that free trade overall is not a good thing. It's the reason why world hunger. I'm well, poverty is falling. I think it's a question at the pace at which we do these things. Well, I think we have learned is that the welfare and education systems of western democracies have been nimble enough helping workers move from the current industries in which they're employed to get the new skills and the new incentives. To be ready for the new jobs. And so we may just need to take a slightly sort of more gradualist approach, particularly globalization by also to some technologies so that people aren't left behind in these periods. My guess is the British rata team Montgomery, and we're talking about the fortieth anniversary of Margaret Thatcher's election in the mid seventies. Thatch up a supported Britain's entry into the common market. So we'll never know. Of course, would you have supported Brexit? This is a great debates in in Britain. And of course, what you rightly said is that as she supported the entry of Britain into the European Economic Community. That's what it was then called this down called a European Union. And in those two different expressions is really I think the answer to your question, the British people they were joining common market, the ultimate Britain would still be in charge of immigration policy. They didn't think foreign call. It's would be overruling courts in London, and they didn't expect to be sending billions and billions of pounds net into Europe to pay for the privilege of belonging to this this club and Margaret Thatcher. Famously at the end of our time in office as we haven't rolled the frontiers of the state in Britain to only see them being reimposed to European level. I think therefore a while others would disagree. I think she would absolutely been champion of Brexit. Okay. There's not question there's paralysis in Westminster about this issue. How do we end this paralysis? I mean could a general election be the only way to to break the deadlock because we've got this deadline now that goes back to what type of thirty one chaplains to be hallowing. How do we end this paralysis team while it is a mess at the moment. I think long term the dysfunctionality that we see in Britain is a short term necessity or characteristic of a divorce process, but we're divorcing something. That ultimately, I think is a much more dysfunctional institution than the comprises. We see in in Britain, the U has twenty seven members days all on different political and economic cycles getting out of that ultimately will be good for the UK. But how do we get out of our media problem? I think it probably is going to be a general election will be necessary. Probably by the end of this year. We have local elections this week, and we have European parliamentary elections light of this month. And of course, Britain will be participating in those elections because they're still out of the European Union live a bullet poll suggests that with the way things are going Najah Farraj new party. This is the so-called rigs it party together with these old one you keep they will decimate conservative support. You don't have preferential voting its first past the post voting. So could Brexit end up meaning Jeremy Coleman? Well, that I think is the real thing that a lot of conservatives are now frightened that. But the Tory party is in more. Trouble than I can ever. Remember it being in even worse than after the Tony Blair LANCELOT nine ninety seven opposite. Because the Tory party said absolutely clearly after the referendum that they would implement the decision and under Theresa May who's been as band, a prime minister as the first female, prime minister. We had was a was a good one. She's just been unable to do anything else Brexit as absolutely dominated the last few years of parliamentary time, and she hasn't been able to deliver it and the public. I'm particularly the conservative voting public are furious. And if brigadiers reversed how history view this moment, I think it will be humbling for for Britain, if the fifth sixth largest economy in the world a nation with so much prestige in my belief, and so much Rene Sant's enjoyed partly because of Margaret Thatcher. If it cannot extricate itself from this European superstate, I think not only we remain in the European Union. I think we will be a much diminished member of the euro. Opin union as well. I think Kohl's for the UK to have influence in the will be much diminishing. I didn't think our voice will be taken seriously because we will have looked like a something of incompetent nation in. How we tried to exit team. Always great to see when thanks for being in the studio today. My pleasure Montgomery, he's founder of conservative home. And he's a former comment editor at the times in London as well. As a senior advisor to end duncan-smith who was a former Tory later urine are in. Well is democracy and export commodity. Remember after World War Two. The United States was able to turn Japan and west Germany into viable, liberal democratic Steitz or is democracy. Do it yourself in a prize requiring special sick and stances and conditions as Owen Harries pointed out in these boy lectures in two thousand and three you think about those use led wars in the Middle East since September eleven Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, it's fair to say that democracies in short supply in that part of the world, isn't it? Well that skepticism about the use of American power to export democracy. That's the view of my next guest. Ted Guilin capita is senior FILA for defense and foreign policy. Studies at the Cato Institute in Washington, he's author of gullible superpower US support for bogus form democratic movements. And that's just being published by Cato Institute press. Hi there Ted. Hello. Now, you are given is that US leaders especially Ronald Reagan in the nineties. I've all too often preached the virtues of promoting freedom. They've often supported a lot of democratic movements across the world. But the revisionist historians your critics did they might say this is just a cloak for American pursuit of its own security and economic interests even empire. How would you respond to that criticism? Well, certainly understandable criticism because you policymakers over the decades have often portrayed dicta, toil vision as members of the free world, and they had to know that what they were saying really with not true. And it's certainly possible that the rhetorical support for foreign democratic movements during and after the cold that the American leaders felt that some of them were not really democratic on the other hand why bit? It comments from many of those American officials, including breaking including George W Bush. So just about at some level. They really believe the people they were supporting were in fact advocates of democracy and freedom. So I am mixed record. I don't want to say that everybody was taken him by foreign activists. But at least some policymakers work, and you mentioned Bill Casey, the CIA director in the Reagan years in his will he left more than a hundred thousand dollars to support freedom fought at movements around the world. I mean that suggests something more than cynicism, doesn't it? Exactly. That's something that suggests a deeply held personal belief, and while they might have been tempted to exaggerate the democratic credentials of some of the clients that Washington. In was supporting it seems unlikely that they were so cynical that they knew that these clients were thuggish undemocratic individuals and movements but decided to portray them as proponents of democracy, and what about the former Yugoslavia because this. She marks the twentieth anniversary of the Clinton Belay intervention in Kosovo. In fact, I think it was I pro- my non thousand ninety nine so twenty years wasn't that intervention? A success? Did it was eighth except in very narrow sense. That it terminated the fighting the happened both in Bosnia nineteen ninety five and Kosovo in nineteen ninety nine and it achieved eventually independence for coastal. But coastal is run by a stugotz, mafia style regime. With a little more than a very thin democratic saw in Bosnia the situation, maybe even worse that so-called country. I call it. A pretend country is utterly this functional politically and economically. It is in international ward. With no end that status. Incite we're talking now almost a quarter century later in the case of Boston. What about Libya in twenty eleven Hillary Clinton famously said off to that? Brutal thug. Gaddafi was killed and dragged through the streets. She said we came we saw he died wasn't that a success. Well, a lot of other Libyan's have died since then. So no, it definitely was not a success. It was perhaps the most fun necessary military intervention. The United States has launched in the post, Cold War era, even more so. Than the Balkan interventions and Iraq Sadafian, obviously, disreputable disagreeable character. But what the United States in its NATO allies on leached in Libya was utter chaos. That's still is not resolved. We was talking at this moment about fighting going on in and around the capital of triple. What we brought there was to create Libya as some Malia on the Mediterranean. Incredible violent chaos. Multiple parties fighting it out and innocent refugees desperately trying to get across the Mediterranean in small leaky boats, and many of them capsizing with thousands of people drowning in the process. You know, I think in faintest to Defense Secretary Bill Gates at the time he argued that this idea of regime change in Libya was fraught with a diner of all sorts of unintended. Consequences. It sounds like your argument, then is very similar to John Quincy Adams, the former president and secretary of state. This is what he said adding Twenty-one Ted quote, America goes not abroad in search of monsters to destroy. She's the well wishes to the freedom and independence of all. She's the champion and vindicator only of our own that was a wide strategy. Then it is probably in a wiser strategy. Now Adams also emphasize that if the United States ever enlisted under banners other advantage on even they were supposedly the banners of freedom and independence would be caught up in every manner of oil every manner of plot in the world by individuals and organizations that you served the banners of freedom and independence in democracy. That's exactly. What we've discovered over the past several decades, most of the clients and candidates. We support have turned out to be anything, but advocates of freedom and democracy. They range from corrupt pursuers of crony capitalism. I guess that would be about the kind of Trump the us to psychotic thugs to slot extremists. And that is not a very impressive tracker. My guest is Ted Guilin Cavantou to throw of gullible superpower US support for bogus foreign democratic movements. That's just that by Cato Institute press. It was recently reviewed sympathetically in the New York Times today is also contributing to both the national interest and the American conservative magazines now Ted for decades, you've been affiliated with the kinda winced. A this is a leading libertarian classical liberal think tank in Washington. You've spent much of that time criticizing US foreign policy, especially the notion of exporting democracy, but also American global leadership now in the wake of non living Americans adopted, a hawkish interventionist will roll, but it's fate to say that public opinion polls, certainly in recent ease have shown list support for an interventionist foreign policy with Trump's America first agenda in Washington. Do you feel a sense of intellectual vindication? In perhaps the same way that George Kennan felt the little vindicated when the Truman administration ice, I would ministrations adopted the doctrine of containment that he outlined, but that doctrine often, took terribly perverted distorted form. And that's what's happened. With Trump administration from talks a good game from time to time about avoiding regime, change wars, nation, building crusades, and so on and revamping recent sibling, America's alliance, but if you take a look at his actions, they greatly resemble those of previous administrations, not cutting back on unwise commitments, and in fact, when extended least in the Middle East, he seems to adopted even more hawkish strategy than its predecessors. That is not a good development and Frank. It gives the doctrines of nonintervention ISM or realism and restraint. Hey, bad name. I think realist need to really be very cautious about any associations with Donald Trump horse administration. Will is there a dynasty? He that. I mean, ovo Trump clearly defeated Hillary Clinton impact on this campaign to limit America's involvement in the world in twenty twenty could he say the pace issue to a non interventionist democrat. I mean, many Democrats are also fed up with endless wolves. Let's get your reaction to Senator Buni Sanders here at of all places. A Fox News townhall recently you looking at a guy once again, not only voted against the war in Iraq. I helped lead the opposition. And if you go back to you too. And what I said, then is that was have unintended consequences in the last month. Og led the along with Senator Mike Lee was a conservative from Utah, Mike, and I led the effort in the Senate and some really great people in bipartisan way, let it in the house, and what we said, let's get out of Saudi Arabia. That's the bell a bipartisan approach so that we do not continue to be engaged in wars like Afganistan, which is what eighteen years and one. That was Senator Bernie Sanders at a news townhall recently talking about a War Powers Act resolution that would have ended US involvement in Yemen. It's a five civil war. Now, this was in the context of Bernie Sanders vow to stop America's endless wars. Ted Guilin competent, coming courage in comments of there have been comments by some other Democrats who've seen gained an allergy to unnecessary wars. But they're also very much hawkish elements within the democratic leadership and within supporters of the Democratic Party. In fact, many Democrats attacked President Trump for trying to be combination with North Korea's regime to reduce tensions on the Korean peninsula. They criticized him for wanting to withdraw US troops from Syria and Afghan. So the Democratic Party appears to be badly split on the issue of war and peace. So the whole smart live to fight another day. Ted great to have you on the program again. Thank you very much Ted gallon carpenter. He's author all gullible superpower US support for bogus foreign democratic movements. That's published by Kate. Hi press, and we'll put a link on our website. Well, that's it for this week show. Remember if you'd like to hear the episode again, download segments since twenty fourteen just go to ABC dot net. Taught I use slash Aren and follow the prompts to between the lines all you can listen via the IB listen app, or wherever you get your podcast, you can even subscribe. So you never miss an episode on Tom Switzer IB containing next week.

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Francisco Franco Pt. 2: Spain

Dictators

31:53 min | 3 weeks ago

Francisco Franco Pt. 2: Spain

"Waves lapped against the striking cliffs of on die france on october. Twenty third nineteen forty. This sleepy border towns seemed far away from world war that was raging across the continent so the townspeople must have been astonished when a swastika emblazoned train came to a stop at the station. Adolf hitler himself exited one of the cars and checked his watch. The man he had come to meet was late. An ancient train finally chugged into the station. Hitler forced a smile. When the pudgy diminutive francisco franco exited and met him on the platform. As they shook hands cameras flashed hitler expected to dominate the conversation to bully franko into joining the war and to convince him to seize gibraltar from the british. But hitler had misjudged the tiny galician while hitler was known for his long winded. Diatribes franco's were worse. Hitler's suffered through three hours of franco's lectures on spanish history and the generals favorite subject. His own escapades fighting in morocco. The fuhrer later told mussalini that he would rather have three or four teeth pulled than suffer. Another discussion with friends cisco franco to hitler. Franco's seemed like an imbecile who had lucked way into power. But was he really or was he smart as a fox. One who not only managed to keep spain out of world war two but to hold onto power even after the fighting ceased. Welcome to dictators a spotify original from podcast. I'm richard and i'm kate. You can find all episodes of dictators and all other spotify originals from podcast for free on spotify this season we're exploring the reins of twentieth century ideas full. Nco batista cuba one. Perron of argentina and francisco franco of spain. Last week we examined how franko rose to become the most decorated general in spain. And how he leveraged his fame to gain power and guide spain through. It's brutal civil war today. we'll explore. How his regime managed to survive world war and how his government created one of the fastest growing economies in the nineteen sixties. We'll also examine the generalissimo's complex and controversial legacy. All of that is coming up. Stay with us. This episode is brought to you by. Cvs health if someone you love is at risk of a fall. The symphony medical alert system by cvs. Health can help support their safety at home. With twenty four seven emergency response monitoring it helps keep an eye on their wellbeing when you can't be their terms and conditions apply learn more about symphony at cvs dot com slash symphony or. Find it at your nearest cvs. Health hub francisco. Franco had felt he was a tool of divine providence. His whole life and on april first nineteen thirty nine. Bukit argue with him. He had just emerged victorious in spain's nearly three year long civil war under the new postwar government. Franco would be the chief of state who would preside over all factions of the government. He wielded more power than any ruler in spanish history. Franco's parliament's served no official function. He didn't need them to pass any new laws or decrees could do all of that by himself. But even with his iron grip on power patching spain back together would be an uphill battle. The civil war had blown the country's infrastructure to pieces the economy was in shambles. Spain hundreds of millions to fascist allies italy and germany and industrial and agricultural production was down across the board and less than a month after franco's new government was assembled in the summer of nineteen thirty nine the outbreak of world. War two set the continent on a new course. Even though franco was more or less allied with the axis powers. He knew that. Spain was too weak to provide any direct military assistance instead. He plan to wait until the war was nearly over. At which point spain would join nazi germany and strike the decisive blow against the allies. I this was exactly what hitler wanted. He claimed it was important for the axis. War effort that britain and france remained unaware of spain's allegiances do that end franco announced spain's non belligerent status on june twelve nineteen forty. But he couldn't fully commit to neutrality after all just like hitler and mussolini. He was a fascist dictator and he couldn't just leave his friends hanging when the french surrendered on june. Twenty second less than two weeks after franco committed to non belligerence. He began to wonder if he was taking the correct approach. He feared that the war would end sooner than expected and he would miss out on. all the spoils. Fortunately for franco. He soon had an opportunity to join the fight. To cripple britain hitler needed franco to occupy gibraltar close off the mediterranean and limit. Critical shipments of supplies to the british. Hitler and franco arranged a meeting. An on die of french. Coastal town on the atlantic that borders spain but the negotiations didn't go as planned in exchange for joining the war. Franco wanted germany to cede control of french. Morocco northwestern algieria and much of french west africa. This however was too much for hitler to give. Those colonies were critical to germany's war effort. Unable to reach an agreement that talks fell through. Franko missed his last and perhaps only chance to join world war two. It's unclear however if the cowboys ever actually wanted to join the war. Franco certainly collaborated with the nazis. But his military was never prepared to provide any real combat assistance eventually. German leaders came to suspect that franco had been stringing them along from the beginning while he basically sat out the war that ravaged europe franko was able to spend time working with his advisors to solve spain's endless economic problems. He had weekly meetings with his cabinet. Ministers that often lasted from the early morning to late at night. No one was allowed to leave even for bathroom. Breaks without franco's permission. The generalissimo wouldn't even take bathroom breaks himself. There are no reports of him leaving a cabinet meeting to go to the restroom until nineteen sixty eight. When he was seventy six years old perhaps if his advisers had been able to relieve themselves they could have come up with better ideas instead he and his cabinet created the national institute of industry a state owned investment company designed to stimulate production and economic growth. He also enacted fashions of resources all across spain. Unfortunately these efforts were wildly ineffective just like all of franco's economic policies during the war they led to scarcity black markets and starvation among the lower classes. Franko of course had no such issue finding food for his family being award. Dodging dictator held other advantages for franco. He had plenty of time for his favourite leisure activities. One of his favourite diversions was wanting he could often be seen prowling his estate with his attendance searching for game. Franko was also a movie buff. He also enjoyed screening movies in his palace to large crowds of his friends and government officials. He even wrote a film of his own rosa which was produced in nineteen forty two but the leisurely days of hunting and screenwriting couldn't last forever soon changes in the war drew. Franco's focus away from his hobbies on november eighth nineteen forty two british and american troops landed in morocco and algeria. The allies informed franco that they had no intention of invading spain or its territories but franco was nervous about having such large forces close to home for the first time franco began to reconsider his pro axis leanings. The true turning point came in july of nineteen forty three when mussolini was overthrown the allied invasion of italy. Two months later reinforced. Franco's belief that fascism was done matters came to a head in january of nineteen forty four when the united states decided to suspend all petroleum shipments to spain. They hoped it would force spain to stop collaborating with nazi germany. Once and for all franco panicked without petroleum imports. If you're in spain's miserable economy would collapse altogether and his regime along with it. So he finally gave in and he adopted a policy of true neutrality. At i franko explained to the german ambassador that he would still do everything in his power to help the access but he couldn't allow his country to be strangled economically. Eventually though franco's government mostly agreed to stop aiding germany but it was too late to save his reputation when the war finally ended in. September of nineteen forty-five franken was an incredibly difficult position. The victorious at knew that franco had aided and abetted the axis and they were suspicious of franco's regime in general so they excluded spain from the newly formed united nations. On top of that spain's economy was still in shambles. No thanks to the sanctions. The un placed on the country after the war. Franco would need a miracle to stay in power. Fortunately for him. Relations between the united states. And the soviet union were in a tailspin. In the coming years franko would be able to prove his value as a pawn in the cold war. Coming up franko saves the economy with the spanish miracle. Vanessa from podcast. They say there's someone for everyone a soul to share your secrets with a companion to grow old with a conspirator to commit crimes. With starting this february on spotify learn about the lethal legendary lovers who fought the law in the podcast limited series criminal couples. If you've ever referred to your best friend or beloved as your partner in crime this exclusive series is for you beginning february. I join me for a collection of unlawful love. Stories from shows across the podcast network. Discover the extreme beliefs of cult leaders. Tony and susan allama enter. Fred and rose west's real life house of horrors and experience the madness and motives of the san francisco which killers fall for the most famous and feared pairs in history in the spotify original from podcast. Criminal couples. enjoy two part episodes every monday. Starting february i follow criminal couples. Free and exclusively on spotify. This episode is brought to you by manscaping. So it's time for a trim and when you need to cut your grass you need the right equipment to get the job. Done the new and improved lawnmower three point. Oh from manscaping has what you need to make. Sure you're below the waist. Grooming experience is done right powered with a seven thousand rpm motor with white stroke technology. Their third generation trimmer gives you a close precise trim with a cutting edge ceramic blade to reduce grooming accidents and the mower has features that make using it as smooth as you're about to be the battery can last up to ninety minutes. It's waterproof so you can take it in the shower and it comes with a convenient usb charging dock get twenty percent off and free shipping with the code spotify twenty at manscaping dot com. That's twenty percent off with free shipping at manscaping dot com and use code spotify twenty and now back to the story in one thousand nine hundred forty five fifty two year old francisco. Franco had seemingly done the impossible. His fascist regime survived world war two a conflict that toppled nearly every other right wing totalitarian government in europe but he was now the leader of perhaps the most ostracized regime in the world. Western democracies didn't tolerate him because he was a dictator who aided the nazis and the eastern communist states despised him because of his anticommunist policies franko faced an even bleaker predicament than he had. After the end of the spanish civil war again he sought to fix spain's broken economy which was even weaker than when he took power six years earlier. He also wanted to convince the western democracies specifically the united states to accept his regime and allow spain to join the world bank united nations and other international organizations. These two goals went hand in hand if the sanctions. The u n placed on spain at the end of the war were lifted. The economy could improve. Relations would then improve as well. As spain traded with the west. It would be difficult but franco had an ace up his sleeve. He knew the west would never allow regime to fall for fear that whoever replaced him might be pro-communist after north korea invaded south korea. Nineteen fifty the united states was terrified. The communist insurrections would break out in more countries it became very important to the truman administration. That spain didn't go read and the best way to do that. Was to bring spain into the western fold so on november fourth nineteen fifty the un general assembly voted to normalize relations with spain. A new american ambassador arrived in spain. In january of nineteen fifty one ambassadors from other countries would soon follow suit. It was a shocking and sudden one. Eighty in relations and franco was thrilled. The west didn't necessarily like him or his regime but they accepted that he was valuable when it came to containing the communist threat with one of his primary goals accomplished franko was now able to shift his focus toward internal matters running his government and repairing the economy due to the improved relations with the west spain's economic situation steadily improved through the nineteen fifties franco was now able to trade with economic powerhouses like the united states which allowed for a better supply of food and created slow job growth. In fact spain's gdp would grow by fifty percent between nineteen fifty and nineteen fifty eight and it was thanks in part to a massive aid package from the united states. All franko had to give the united states in return was access to three airbases. One submarine base this new relationship with the united states however wasn't without incident in nineteen sixty six a. b. fifty two collided with a refueling aircraft over spain and the united states somehow lost four nuclear bombs after the crash. One of the bombs was recovered intact. Two of the bombs created huge craters near the town where they fell. The final bom remained missing for close to three months. The air force eventually founded at the bottom of the sea. Thanks to a tip from a local fishermen that even that incident paled in comparison to franco's difficulties in spanish morocco. In one thousand nine hundred eighty five. The french reinstated the moroccan sultan to the throne and agreed to grant morocco. its independence the following year. But the salton didn't just want french. Morocco liberated he wanted to free the entire country including the northern strip of land that belonged to spain. a strip of land. Franco was loath to abandon even though all his western allies supported returning the land to the sultan with his back against the wall. Franco's signed a treaty for moroccan independence on april seventh although it pained him immensely. He couldn't afford moroccan conflict without international support. Many of franco's loyal troops were upset over this decision. Some cadets even burned an image of franko franco calm the tensions by giving all officers a pay increase just to be careful aside from giving up his stake in morocco. The second half of the nineteen fifties would be almost universally positive for franco. His regime managed to completely rescue the spanish economy but franko himself had little to do with the so-called spanish miracle it was actually the work of several well-qualified members of his cabinet. Franco hit always thought of himself as an economic expert but even with newfound assistance from the united states and a brief but auspicious beginning. His policies had stalled so in nineteen fifty nine. He turned to his new ministers for help. Some of the most important ministers were businessmen who wanted to relax the government's economic control until this point foreign investment was rarely permitted and exports were few and far between and after a minor recession in nineteen fifty-nine. The minister of finance recommended dramatically loosening. The regulations franco was reluctant to accept the proposal. He worried that if he liberalized the economy it would lead to a liberalization of the people. This could eventually cause a political conflict even another civil war. And perhaps 'cause franco to lose power but the finance minister was a decorated veteran of the civil war and franko trusted him. He was also aware that this was the only way to save spain from bankruptcy or an economic depression so on july twenty second nineteen fifty nine franco announced a new economic stabilization plan. He accepted the majority of the finance minister's proposals including allowing foreign investment and export growth. The economy was soon growing again in the nineteen sixties. Spain's economy registered the highest rate of quote sustained expansion. In all of europe it was also a period of rapid cultural change in spain. As money and tourists board in the general population became wealthier more educated and more liberal for the most part franco allowed these changes as it turned out. Franco's fear of young liberal and politically engaged. College students was well-founded the more the economy grew the more young people could afford to receive an education and the more educated. The population became the more. They began to protest. Franco's repressive government even worse. This new generation wasn't afraid of the generally cmo franco was in his seventies as his mental and physical health began to deteriorate. It was only a matter of time until his reign was over coming up. Franko enters his twilight years and chooses his successor. This episode is brought to you by. Cvs health are you worried about mom or dad. Falling the symphony medical alert system by cvs health is designed to help make them safer at home. Symphony works with both voice activation or a care button users can opt to wear along with smart sensors for coverage around the home with twenty four seven emergency response and a streamlined app. You can monitor your loved ones wellbeing for enhanced peace of mind terms and conditions apply. Learn more about symphony at cvs dot com slash symphony. Or find it at your nearest. Cvs health hub now back to the story. The nineteen sixties francisco. Franco had blundered his way to success as the only pre world war two dictators still in power in europe. He somehow convinced western democracies to accept his regime and he oversaw the biggest economic boom in spain in a very long time but franco wasn't immortal and as he aged he knew he would have to choose a successor to carry on his legacy but he wasn't looking for another general or prime minister. He was on the search a monarch in his quest to return spain to its glory days of the fifteen. Hundreds franco had declared spain a monarchy in nineteen forty seven eight years after he assumed power he planned to rule as a region for the rest of his life and upon his death. A new king chosen by franco would ascend the throne. There was just one problem. Spain's last king. Alfonso the thirteenth had died in nineteen forty one and there was currently no official monarch or royal family there were several contenders with claims to the throne which one was going to be the next king. The obvious air was the former campaign fund. So sun one day bone but don juan as he was called was dyed in wool liberal who champion democracy franco wouldn't tolerate any discussion of democracy. So don one was out. This left one clear candidate. Don juan son juan carlos though it would be highly unusual to circumvent don juan's claim in favor of his son. Franko didn't see this as an issue since he wasn't so much restoring. The spanish monarchy as creating a new monarchy of his own franco was never one to overplay his hand. Naming juan carlos is the air too early might upset members of the government so he delayed his decision for as long as possible. But as spain entered the nineteen sixties the line of succession would be the least of franco's worries. His regime would begin to face. Resistance at home. Franco had been right about liberalizing the economy. It had liberalized the spanish people as wealth expanded so did education. The number of spanish universities would double by the mid nineteen seventies in primary school. Education would be available to children in even the country's most remote regions this rapid increase in education also brought with it a desire for a more liberal government which felt almost powerless to stop. He had allowed the country to change too much conservative. Rural spain was shrinking while the liberal cities grew. Franco was even losing his traditional allies. For the first time in spain's history a catholic left movement formed within the country catholicism had traditionally been a conservative bastion but now even the church was urging for a less repressive government. This new movement was dominated by the catholic trade union groups and the catholic worker youth these groups encouraged and participated in illegal strikes but they were protected by church leaders franko. A devout catholic was reluctant to repress them to shore up support. Franco decided to remind spain about the good. His government had brought the country. The regime's new slogan for nineteen sixty four was twenty five years of peace this coincided with a year long publicity push which included a flattering propaganda film about the cow. Do called franco essay. Hombre these publicity. Stunts were popular with franco's diehard supporters. But they weren't effective. In quelling the unrest across the country protests from university students dissident workers liberal priests and basque nationals began to rise and shockingly franko chose not to launch a campaign of repression. Both the left and right took this moderate response to strikes and protests as a sign of weakness in the regime but franko didn't see it that way he claimed that the leftists namely were mistaking serenity with a weakness but behind the scenes franco knew that his days were numbered as the political turmoil increased. His health also took a sharp turn for the worse in one thousand nine hundred sixty nine. He informed his cabinet ministers that he was selecting one carlos as his successor by nine thousand. Nine hundred seventy two. The eighty year old franco was being ravaged by a laundry list of ailments. Parkinson's disease phlebitis an strange fungal infection. His mouth as a result he barely spoke in cabinet meetings and occasionally fell asleep. His memory began to suffer and it became nearly impossible for him to complete the most basic tasks for the first time in his life. Franko admitted he needed help. Running the government while he's still remained as the official head of state in the summer of nineteen seventy-three. He began the process of selecting a president. He eventually settled on his old friend. Caro- blanco who became president on june eighth. Unfortunately blanco didn't even last year in a moment. That shocked franco to his core. Blanco was assassinated on december twentieth. Franco despaired over the death of his friend. He cried in front of his ministers and broke down in tears on national television. During blanco's memorial service. It was the first time the public has seen the cow deal. Show emotion after blanco's death frank. Ozone health quickly worsened in july of nineteen seventy four. He was hospitalized. The government feared the worst and began the process of transferring powers to the next head of state. Juan carlos franco. Hello on for just over a year until he fell into an irreversible coma in october. Nineteen seventy five. He finally died on november twentieth. Juan-carlos became spain's king. Today's later franko had expected him to run a totalitarian regime. Much like his but others hoped for a turn toward democracy. Initially one carlos decided to maintain the current government even as pro democracy demonstrations and strikes broke out throughout the country. But one carlos was just biding his time he used the current regime's inability to stop the unrest as an excuse to form a new more liberal government. The new interim government began reforms that would transition spain to a constitutional parliamentary monarchy in late. Nineteen seventy six. Legislation was drafted to form democratic system with universal suffrage. These reforms were submitted to the spanish people. In a referendum in december of nineteen seventy-six ninety four percent of voters supported them. One carlos was able to persuade parliament to approve. The new law bringing democracy to spain. The country's first elections in over a quarter century occurred on june fifteenth. Nineteen seventy seven. Spain has remained a democracy to this day decades later francisco. Franco's still remains a controversial figure. Many say he was no better than hitler or pol pot. He helped start a civil war that took the lives of around five hundred thousand spaniards. He launched campaigns of repression that killed thousands more and he arrested thousands of political prisoners. Who didn't see the light of day for years. He styled himself. After benito mussolini and collaborated with the axis powers right up until the end of world war two. He denied his subjects basic freedoms and he prevented the rise of democracy in spain until his death his regime also became more moderate as the years passed and his government oversaw a great period of economic growth which allowed for a more educated public and pave the way for liberalism to spread more on spanish soil. Franko didn't leave any diaries. So it's unclear if the positive outcomes of the so-called spanish miracle where intentional or not did franko really want to liberalize spain's economy or did he just take credit for something beyond his control. It's not clear nevertheless on october. Twenty fourth two thousand and nineteen. Franco's body was exumed from its resting place at the valley of the fallen. A memorial to the civil war franco himself designed and move to a family crypt at a nearby cemetery and with that franco was laid to rest once more Thanks for listening to dictators among the many sources we used. We found franko a personal and political biography by stanley g payne and hey seuss palacios toppy us extremely helpful to our research. You can find all episodes of dictators in all other spotify originals from podcast. Free on spotify. We'll see you next time. Dictators is a spotify original from podcast. It is executive produced by max cutler. Sound design by dick schroeder with production assistance by ron shapiro carly madden and joshua kern. This episode of dictators was written by charles brock with writing assistance. By cake gallagher fact checking by adriana romero and research by chelsea would and brian patriots dictators. Stars kate leonard and richard roster. Hi it's vanessa again before you go. Don't forget to check out the new podcast. Limited series criminal couples from apocalyptic cult leaders to bank robbing bandits to married mafiosos. These couples give new meaning to till death. Do us part enjoy two part episodes every monday. Starting february i follow criminal couples. Free ad exclusively on spotify.

franco spain Franco franko Franko germany united states cabinet Hitler morocco cvs francisco mussalini franko rose gibraltar mussolini northwestern algieria national institute of industry hitler
Ep. 43:  EPL Weekend Preview (ft Spurs vs United)

Puty's World Cup Podcast

35:36 min | 2 years ago

Ep. 43: EPL Weekend Preview (ft Spurs vs United)

"All right, guys. Welcome back to SAM's army episode. I don't know what will call this forty three. Be maybe episode forty three Jerry. I don't know what we'll call this. But welcome back to the pod. Number one. Mike follower. How you doing? Mike. What's going on everybody up Sam? So we as we tease a little bit on the episode. The went out this morning. We have some news on the pod. You wanna take it away? Muggy gets colorful words. You can throw out there. Nothing colorful, nothing flowery. We were going to be taking some time. Hiatus we're gonna we we're not gonna have this pod on the box sports network. Not at least for now. And you know, we gave it a run what we're doing is trying to bring a lot of stuff in house at our Solter difficult to capture the barstool sense being an external podcast, and it's a little difficult to the little tough to talk on because I have two hats, obviously throughout this whole process. It's been difficult, but I love doing this. I love talking to you. We're gonna take a couple of weeks and figure out what the best way to go forward is outside of the barstool network. Whether that's continuing to do it or keeping Sam focused on writing more giving more content or still gonna keep some partnerships with major clubs. We've been working on a lot of stuff still will come from this brand. But the twice a week podcast will not for now. Yes. So it's soccer is not going anywhere. It's not like soccer's leaf barstool or anything like that. It's not like any of us are leaving barstool at the moment. We're taking a hiatus. We'll just sort of leave it at that. We'll we'll Lee think the direction and maybe through new layer paint on revamp rebirth. We'll see we don't know what's going on. We're basically just playing it by ear. But. Can't thank everybody who's been listening, and you know. We're not dying. We're just we're just we're thinking about real in from here. Yeah. And take day by day always been what we're doing. So stay tuned. Just keep falling us on social and stuff will come out. Go. So let's get into the pot now. So we got a we got a big week of gains big week end of games. I should say before we do that though Hicks flying. So if you're running out if you're tuning out now, you got a problem if you're tuning out right now, then you don't think might takes are gonna be flying around here. This is the last one I got nobody accountable. Let's do this. So the first story is not actually preview of the weekend. It is this ridiculousness about leads championship team. So they had they had a, quote, unquote spy who was caught at Darby counties practice. I don't know if it was today or yesterday. But I think it was today. You know? So a spy basically, a scout from Leeds was sent to watch Darby counties practice and Darby county like caught him. And like, I think he was arrested. Like, I it's just this. It became a big thing. It's like, you know, the New England Patriots, obviously got in trouble for for spy gate and all that shit. I do you think this is a big deal. I think it's hilarious. I do not think this is a big deal at all. My first major takeaway that spies terrible at his job. Yeah. It's horrible. Horrible spy what a bad by what bats just supposed to spy on a championships club. And you can't even do that horrible just tear. What a terrible spot. Get it. Why thing in American football? You know, it's basically like, you know, these these they're set plays that are very big. And you can see the setup you can see how what they do. And everything in soccer. I can't imagine why this is such a free-flowing game. It's like reactionary. There's you know, maybe a set piece here and there, but like why is this such a big thing for for soccer? I I don't think it's it's almost stupider to make a big deal of leads guy watching. It's almost stupider to do that than it is how hell restored was to send the spy in the first place like leads just scored. So currently the spy is not working by. Well, this is working. He probably sent the he spent it probably sent the information real time back to like be Elsa who admitted that he sent this by by the way, which is crazy just through. It's a ridiculous situation. Hilarious though. I would like to say Derby County with a four point lead in to get into the playoffs and leads comfortably at the top. Don't see why this was such a big deal. It's it is what it is. Apparently, whatever the spy did works. So far. As ever been something like this other than spy gate. I feel like I feel like number of teams have gotten, you know? Accused of it baseball teams do all the time with you know, stealing signs and everything guys in center field. Looking for things we've been accused and stuff. I can't really remember it and soccer though. I would like to say that they're probably focusing on what like setpiece alignment, I guess. Paul who's healthy who's not who's playing with who. And what what formation? I mean. I just. Yeah. It strikes me as like the value. Add for sending the spy is minimal compared to the risk of. I guess looking like an asshole, which is what feels so on. Sure. I'm sure they let scouts watch young players train. Right. Like, you couldn't just pay an already existing scout to just give you some more info. Let's make more sense to me. Boom. I just fixed. It I can't imagine Scouser getting paid enough that they'd be like, Nah, I don't need that extra scratch like boom fixed. It what's the next problem? So just stupid stupid, but hilarious and leads apparently good bad deed as being unpolished. However that saying goes to beat Derby County, that's a huge game, by the way, leads Darby at the top of championship. Yeah. I mean, that's a. I mean, that's a huge huge, huge huge. So we'll move onto the huge game of the weekend, which is Tottenham hosting United. So, you know, there's actually some pretty sneaky good games on the on the docket here. This is obviously the one that's going to get all the headlines because you know, United and Spurs quote unquote in the title race, which they're definitely not. This is this is this is like the litmus test for Ola gunners. United like has. He actually made a difference. We're about to find out this. This game is is where we're gonna find out. You know, he's one six no five out of five. And if you win six for his first six games winning all six that's the best start for United manager in history. So that's impressive more impressive would be beating. You know? An actually a good team in Tottenham. I'm not sure they can do do you think you think United is a different team. Now, they they think of in this game that neutral field which helps. Yeah. That does play good start. I'm not gonna ever stop that. No matter whether I have a microphone or not. I I don't think it happens. This game screams draw because it's like cooling one team down. And then like catching a team that might have had some favor like some very very favorable results throughout the course of their third season. So far, I could see a draw. I don't think it's going to happen. I think taught him win this game. I just think when you see these two teams you got one that's finding itself in one that's known itself for a long time. And that team usually would set game. I don't disagree. United spent the last week chilling out maximum, relax and Dubai. Reasons, I guess nicer weather, and then a Manchester. I'm sure I can give I give you two big over Eason's whether super number one. Yeah. And then probably the currency rate. Okay. That's not a bad on going to say it was city. They could be doing some some handshake with their their paymasters. But you know, I was thinking more along the lines of like women. But yeah, leave that one out. I'll just I'll just leave that one on said, what are they going do cancel? Just a hate here. United night. It's been out for a week. You know, they sort of been relaxing, pudgy, Tino throughout a very strong eleven against Chelsea in the make believe up. So that's definitely advantage United on that on that front. I think everything else is vanish Todd them. They're strong defense. No question. I mean, that's like the big difference midfield bit of a toss up. Now that bog was playing. We're should still say Spurs a little stronger and then Spurs have carry Kane. Whereas what do United have from Lukaku? Marcus rash informed wrestler, the Marcial. He's just not the really the that number nine though that resent says is healthy again. Well, NIA now that Josie left's Lucille Starr, pleading again, I'm curious to see how they line up here. How you think they're gonna go? I would play Alexis through the middle. Yeah. I don't know if he's actually earned any he starts any minutes at this point. He needs to put some games together before I would again Spurs. I would start. I all I would've start every arsenal player. They're the only ones that get it. By the way, I left one thing out. I would give a United advantage in goal. I'd give it a, you know, a nod over. Yes, inc. Who goalies one of them gets drunk every now and again one doesn't although listen DG's had a couple of howlers the season two. So let's just. I'm in both get drunk. Well, so I think basically, you know, we got all this talk about Oleg owners United are they different or the different. Let's remember that like United just they got their asses kicked by Tottenham the first game in that game was at Old Trafford. I don't think that only gunners had that much of an impact. And I know for a damn fact that he is not fixed defense. So I'm going Spurs to win. I'll say it's close to one. I was gonna go with either two or two one Tottenham. So I'm gonna go with two one. And I don't see any way. You guys lose agree agree. Hope. I mean, every time you say that I'm gonna leave that one alone. So to once. Next week got a quietly competitive, high quality match cities hosting Wolverhampton. So cities looked beatable lately. Wolverhampton have been like just the giant killers. You know, they've been like the kryptonite for the big six. They just beat Liverpool. Granted that was like a b minus squad the Liverpool throughout their for FA Cup. But was great against all the big six teams. In fact, they look really good against city. The first time round, I think they pull out a one one draw and in fact last season, if we're just gonna go wolves and city wolves were the team that you know, pull out a draw against city when city was at the peak their powers last season. I think it was the I think it was the make believe Cup. So obviously, you know said he'd probably had like a C-plus squad out there. But the point being the wolves have have sort of had cities number lately. But then there's a big, but they're city. Now have David Silva back. They know Fernandina back. They have these guys that really make them different team. Would you give wolves a chance and this one I actually don't this is after after beating Liverpool. I'm talking about city beating Liverpool. It's it's going to be an on. I predict five weeks of Oslo. Disagree. They're they're going to be missing Aguayo up top should point that out. But we got we got Mr. hatrick himself Gabby. Hey seuss. No four goals for since. Right. It's right. I lost. That bet you dummy. So I'm gonna I'm with you. I've city I think that you know, wolves will make tough they'll always make tough on everybody. I just don't think that they will have enough to beat city when they're when they got there guys. And there I'm going city two zero. City three one. Goal from who nervous? No. Because he no because Edison doesn't get beat by some twenty. I would say it's it's going to be fucking Jimenez. If anybody your boy, you enroll if this is the last time, you're hearing me for a while grow. As not a good nine suck on it. Sweet me. I don't care you're going to get a few tweets on that one. I don't care. So we both got city winning though wolves will make but we city when I think it's going to be a little I think it's going to be comfortable. I guess I actually had written down a close fought. But ultimately, comfortable two zero win. So I guess we're sort on the same page. Their next game is the other game on Sunday. This is yeah. I almost want. I almost wanted to almost form the safe for one but controls, that's that's a slap in the face or Wolverhampton, boys. Well, I just I just thought of Cody trying to defend three flowing city front three true. True. You're sticking with three one. Yeah. Okay. So next game is the appetizer on Sunday ahead of the main course, which is the Spurs United game. So this is ever ten born with and this should be hell of a game, not necessarily the highest quality. But Warmoth is most watch TV at this point like they they're just thinking score. They can get scored on. It's like Liverpool couple years ago as I said before to their credit cherries have been trying to figure out some solutions in the back. They got on loan. They got in the fatal Klein from Liverpool which I think is a good deal. Great player pickup. But, you know, him alone in turning the tide is like, you know, trying to fix like a gunshot wound with a band-aid like they're they got bigger problems here. So on the other hand, though, we've got Everton. So they haven't been hemorrhage Ingles. Or defense has actually been surprisingly not so badly for the most part, but they have been hemorrhaging points big time. So they've won one game in the last eight in the league Everton is this is a rough it's been sort of quietly poor. But man, this is a bad run for them including losses Brighton in LeicesteR. So, you know. I think this is a game wherever ten is fully healthy at home. Like, they're injured list is zero. There's nobody injured lists. That does like you never see that in January. I think Everton with pull up a solid win against a team still has defensive issues. So I'm gonna say three one. Okay. I like that. This is just a road versus homes, inC, for me. These teams are a coin flip. Like, I really believe that. I think that in terms of like if you look at the players, they're they're right around the same range as a cumulative rating for me. I know we like to do this thing in the Premier League where we branch off teams into these subgroups. And when you look at the group's Everton born mature at the ones trending down wants trending up in terms of the last five years, but I think right now, they're at a very big dirt a crossing point. And I would like to put my money where my mouth is in bed on a draw draw. I think there's a better I think Everton has more town cross I'm gonna go one one straight up one. No, I don't see what I see why you're saying that. But will you say that in two years looking back on these exact rosters? We'll see. I mean, listen them saying that it would team Ryan Fraser's banging goals in classical. Will you be thinking? He's not going to be banging them in for born with. That's for sure. All right. So you draw a comfortable win for Everton. Next week. Lester hosting Southampton. So Lester just shit the bed bad in their fake Cup fourth year team. But surprisingly, they've looked pretty good in the league. So at a really know what to take with that game Southampton. They got the new coach. This is going to be interesting game like a game where it's like a hot potato game or neither one of them want the ball like if there's ever been a game where neither team or basically both teams are less than fifty percent possession. Somehow like the game. They'll figure out a way. That's really funny possessions. That's forty six forty six. I see that even like seventeen to eighteen the balls just like in the air going back and forth. Like the other times. Would you would you bet on the team that has the lowest possession winning this game? Yes. In fact, I think the yes less ball. You have the better chance you have to win this game. This is going to be like high school football game where the the offenses are like so bad that they start like punting on second down hoping that like the guy muffs upon on the other end. I think that's I think both teams wanted. I'm actually going to go. So it sounds like you may go with one of the I'm gonna go withdraw. I'm gonna go with a one one draw. Both teams muff one punt one one draw. I actually am excited for this game to be honest with you, I wanna see what happens in the midfield. I wanna see what the roles given to the midfielders are because I think you're right about the ball being it will bypass amid field plenty of time. Yeah. I wanna see how this is coast between LeicesteR and how they're managed and Southampton with hospital like I wanna see specifically what the roles assigned to the midfield players are. I think it's going to be a lot of second ball. So you'll see the attacking each other. And then one like eight like a box of box kind of running suicides the entire game. But I'm gonna go with this surprise, you Lester is so streaky. Whatever I have against the top six side of pick them. But whatever have them against the bottom side. I'm going to take Hampton. So I'm gonna take Hampton to one right? All right. Interesting. Interesting. You're so hot and all them unless they're a. I go I legitimately hate that team. And I know that I always talk them up because I'm like, I love Lester always have when I when you think about like the way they play. I just don't enjoy watching them play. I don't like the midfield crop. They have. I don't think that they're very good ball. Like, I don't I don't find any beauty in Leicester City. We got a big time. Lester hater, you're you're off the fence on that one. I mean, I was never on it. I just continued to write it as long as possible to next. We got a real live woman Darby so West Ham is hosting your boys arsenal. Both. This is such a bad sober January game. This is an interesting. I don't know if it's interesting or not both teams come in with like an injured. Reserve list the length of like. It's just it's miles long. I don't know if either team is gonna have eleven healthy players to put out there. Let's keep that in mind. But do you think this made it tricky game? Where do you think are still good? You think they got enough for this on the road at West Ham, not necessarily hugely difficult place to play. But you know, last last time we played them out to fix look like Pele, and we were bleeding chances early like bleeding chances and they will waste game when they played early in. This was the first game of the season. No, we opened with less city and house, right? Yeah. As a third game of the season as your first win. Right. And we needed it bad. And we were leaky. And they they went ahead early. Yeah. Yeah. I remember that I was I was human this like this game, especially with our now which just coming back and then having a port like a poor performance, but like a semi involved performance. And then the week off off me. I'm going to tell you. I'm gonna draw in this game. I think it's embedded so much scores. There's going to be goals from both sides. I'm going to draw. I mean, that's very very rude. But it's not it's not rooted in falsehoods. I would say for me out scores. I know that's happening which fucking sucks, but I'm gonna go with two one arsenal win. And let me tell you. If they win this game. It'll be a big win this Goodwin. I don't care how it looks. I don't care how it looks. If you give me three points. And I hate everybody. I'm fine with that. Are you are you rooting for Todd them to be United? No. Okay. Okay. That in mind. So you got arsenal. Close win. I got to draw Chelsea new. I think also I think he'll scores a goal move long shot on that one. I'll bet. All right, there we go next game is going to be the I'm going to come out and say there's going to be ugliest game of the week Chelsea hosting Newcastle. I disagree all this is going to be garbage. This is going to be so ugly. It sucks. This is going to be the the NBC game. So it's on at eleven thirty central twelve thirty eastern on NBC network television. I think is going to be absolutely got awful borderline unwatchable. Newcastle is good defensively. Chelsea we've talked edna's Eum about their their lack of punch up front. I think this is going to be just disgusting soccer. This was one of my favorite games of the year. The first time they played. Rafa Rafeh put a stranglehold on the game, and it was super ugly, and then Newcastle Kennedy was running like a fucking more on the whole game. Stomping guys should have been sent off missing chances. And then he gets a penalty in the ninety minute. Remember that that's true win that game. And he fucked it up. I do. I know where I was. I was on vacation. I was relaxed, and then I was just like I saw red that was like fucking Kennedy like for days, obviously rooting for Newcastle hard. And that I just I just wanted to see like Newcastle in the primp. I liked them up. I hate Chelsea come on. Can we get his so much? Listen, I want actually to spend money or sell the God damn team as much as anybody else. Get new cat. I think Newcastle. Take a lead and lose leading lose. All right. I'm going with Chelsea in one of those patent-pending one zero yawn fest wins that they've been coming up with. And that sounds probably true to form you so far. I've not I've subtly agreed with everything you've said, so far, which is terrifying. Which means there could be sixty five goals in this weekend. Leave. Yes, take my take my picks. Go the opposite. Obviously. You're saying everything that makes sense. So three more games this one. And then I'm going to to together at the end. So this one is Brighton hosting Liverpool. This is a game that Liverpool. Withdraw points ninety nine million times out of one hundred ninety ninety eight point nine nine nine million times out of ninety nine million. What had to be what it'd be always drop points in this game in years past like, the you know, Brighton is a tough team playing at home. They know how to lock it down. Liberal seem to be a different team. And one other thing they sort of took a dive against wolves in the FA Cup and played like a b minus squad. Maybe C plus squad in the FA Cup this week. I think so that's obviously a high risk move by Klopp. I think I think that's the type of thing they gotta do though to win this league. The win the league title this year. So I'm I'm going with Liverpool in this. I think they'll they'll find a way to zero win, and you know, the FA Cup taking dive, I think it will pay off. I think this is going to be a massive overreaction weekend. I think is gonna look great against wolves. I think liberals going to draw at bright and people are gonna forget how hard it is to play there. It is tough. It is tough. I just witnessed it firsthand. Watching those watching arsenal get their asses kicked. I think it's one one I think people are going to act like this is some terrible result. When in fairness out of the thirty eight games people are starting to circle away to Brighton Ovau being. As like get out with your life. Yeah. And brightness tough brightness stuff. I would say one I'm gonna say one. And then of course, people will in start crowning cities the champions start starting on Sunday. I think it's gonna be a big overreaction weekend. All right. All right that part. I would definitely buy on. I think the ripple win. But if they don't yes people are going to just jump off the Liverpool bandwagon so hard especially because we've just analyzed so many games in such a short amount of time. And then we had the week off. Everyone's gonna talk this week following next as if like the sky is falling or their the king of the world for sure for sure. Yeah. Last two games. So battle the bums here. We got two huge six pointers at the bottom of the table Burnley hosting Fulham and Huddersfield visiting Cardiff. So these are fourteen four the bottom five teams, and for all we can pretty much say that they're going to be part of the probably the bottom four or about five probably for the rest of the season. Like, this is really this is a huge weekend at the bottom of the table. So at the end of the day, I just go for like who's inform obviously at the bottom of the table. You're not nobody's in great form. But then who's in horrible for him. Well, number one hundred field. They haven't won a game since the Truman administration. So they're they're out for me Cardiff is going to walk over them. I got Cardiff over Huddersfield. Then the other games were interesting Burnley. You know, they've won two in a row one of one one of them was against Huddersfield. So you can almost throw that out. But they've won to enroll full their defense is still hot garbage. They haven't done anything about it. I don't know. I guess I'm leaning towards Burnley on that one. You got anything, you know to. That stands out among these two games. First of all their way, we could play all of them together at the same time. Get it over with. Just just split the feel that halftime or something twenty times when he there is somebody said though, for the importance of these games, this is he this could be the difference between staying up and going down there huge. And I'll tell you the one thing that I look for in matchups of terrible teams is the same thing. I'd look at what I look at college matchups in America is set fee structure Sepap's disciplined setpiece ability who has that. So with that being said, no, you're not going to agree with this. I think Huddersfield. As a long shot. He get a point. I was gonna say beat Cardiff. And then I think Burnley easily beat full. Okay. Fulham's defense selling Burley's offensively dynamo. Full of Joe and turf more at the end of the day. I'm gonna shit on it. But I would be remiss to not end this, you know, this little pod with Burnley, not holding true to form and winning a game at home. Would you go one zero in their old school quintessential, Burnley or different? Let's do. It was too early. So that is the premiership. So we'll do quick lap around the world. Yeah. So Boone's league teams are still vacationing on the French Riviera at this point. So they're still off. Solicitor certain France. Oh, so PS, gee, just took a shocking loss in the in the coupe make believe I don't know. Actually what the in France. But so they lost to something called wind gamp. And I'm definitely pronouncing that wrong, I get. Okay. Now, they travelled they traveled to little less Omnion. So that if you like bloodbath know that might be your your pick of the week. I would say they're probably going to beat them eighteen nothing or so. But if you want competitive fixtures. So I got two games picked out. The the other one is a competitive fixture in Spain big game rail Madrid is visiting rail tease insa via so Madrid is cleaned to fifth place right now in Liliya, not not so boy, which is way behind little ass. And that nearly talked about enough elevates who's having a fantastic season. And they hate watching them play. They get play. But I love the burly from last year this year. And then you got bettys who's actually in six nipping at Madrid's. He'll so this is actually a big game. It's not going to be high scoring game necessarily unless Madrid find their their form. But it should be an interesting game. So in terms of the games that I would actually watch. This is definitely at the top of the list. We're going outside of England. I'll go rail tease hosting Real Madrid. That is a fantastic. And I know that that you're stealing my nerve game of the week. Wow. That really sad. Well, it's you know, there's there's not a lot of games. There's no Italy. There's no Germany, so we're we're sort of. Rece crashing the bottom of the barrel. Here I'm a big fan of what's happening with a legal this weekend. I think those games are actually really cool. I would say I had my game earlier. So it's in the league as well. So you like bettys in Madrid? I would say athletic club in severe is fantastic game. But I know that that's not true because it's not going to be a fantastic game to watch. So I'm going to go in France. Actually, it's Marseille and Monaco. Okay. So this plan is ready to go. He played. That's the question. Right. So it's Monico who if you haven't checked French table in a while you might wanna go ahead and do that or they still in the zone firmly. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks. Having a hell of a season there. So if yeah, if you look at the table right now, they are there on thirteen points and safety is eighteen points. And granted this is through eighteen games. Played. So that's all right. They've lost sixteen lost eleven games. They've only scored sixteen goals criticized for for putting himself in that situation. He Tyrian he must be good friends with Terry. And I know they play together. He must be good friends to go into that situation. Yeah. I think that's what I'm most excited for for this game though. Because everyone knows when you get a new player, and you get somebody of quality it tends to elevate the rest of your unit. So probably come on as a sub I would fucking love for him to be starting and Marseille. We've we've watched Marseille game together. Sam and it's not too impressive can be beaten seventh in the league Carly. I'm very very excited for this game. I will be watching. I wanna see how tear us Ceska wanna see what form sex in what he has left whether he plays, and I wanna see if Monaco really are going to get fucking relegated. That'd be a hell of a way to go out. I mean at one point you take a snapshot of the roster and look at where they are now in Jesus. What happens when you sell all your players every year and don't buy anybody back comes back to bite, you intially Southampton's feeling the pinch. It happens. There we go. There's lap around the world that is the end of this pod. So I guess number one, you know, just wanna say heartfelt, thanks to everybody for listening. And again to reiterate, you know, this isn't like the end, we're we're rethinking what we're gonna do. You know, I've been writing pods or blogs pods. But I've been rain blogs here for four plus going on five years. It was a long hard road to get the pod just like going in the first place, we hit a couple of snags early on, you know, things of they've been growing growing fast enough. I would say, and we'll we'll we'll figure it out. You know, there's there's there's other options out there. And you know, if you have if you like the pod, if you liked the content, you know, I guess let us know let other people know. I guess that's really the key. Yeah. Spam spam, usually works. Go. So you got any parting words say say, thank you. Good. Bye. I never expected to be on here. Yeah. Yeah. You so. You stepped in at a tough time. Tremendous. Thank you to everybody who tweeted Sam enough to make him sink. I was good at this or following along or listen to or follow me or any of that shit. Love army love soccer, keep watching keep tweeden. We'll keep interacting keep talking shit. Maybe maybe you have put a little thing in your blogging up with the scores every game or something stupid like that. Soccer is not dying. Barstool will sure hit so many hurdles and roadblocks over the years. This is just you know, it's another one we'll deal with it. You know, we'll figure it out. There's there's there's other options out there. And we'll we'll hell you keep moving ahead, and we'll still be right here. So keep following us. Keep phone along. And we'll start putting some stuff out Noten guy. So pre she guys listening, and we'll talk to you on Twitter. Nowhere else. Take care. Let me guess. Let me guess. As you. Receive?

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