10 Episode results for "Thirty Five Hundred Foot"
DLD 244: Records, Slots and Partners
"Uh. You're listening to dots lines and destinations travel podcast with host Stephen Seagraves vase, moon and said, Miller. Hello, and welcome to episode two hundred forty four dots lines and destinations. Stephen is moving to a new house today. So this is hosting. We got on how you doing great. I'm still busy committed to house. Yeah. I what I'm thinking is that we should just like all show up in have a little housewarming party. I like it does anyone know where he is anyone can find him. Let us know and we'll definitely crashes house and shop. We'll bring booze and food and stop, it will definitely be a party really encouraging people to go stalking probably don't do that. They are even. I just hear no Jerry's. Yeah. Well, he's going to say regardless. You shared an interesting story this week that I was just getting around to reading before we got started. And I was I was reading the wrong part of it. So that was fine. It's sort of wide ranging analysis of aviation in the market and around the US, and there's a whole bunch of interesting section. I actually got excited around the eighty s be stuff on air on with satellite navigation. But then you told me I was reading the section of the report, so you're more interested in Newark. Which makes sense. You know, you live there, tell us about Newark what they've done badly. Well, so, you know, sometime last year or two years ago, United sued the port authority in regards to Highland fees that they're redirecting landing fees, and basically, the weight the FAA managers are parts on the policies dictated airport. Authorities cannot redirect fees from landing fees, or fees earned from landing fees to other projects. They're, they're supposed to go back at the airport. And so it kicked off a whole process in the port authority has message getting audited now. Now by the federal government, and it is already come, they've already identified that the Puerto court very did misdirected number funds. But now they're trying to figure out how much of that. Oh, exciting. 'cause there be at some point, I think it was nineteen Eighty-three or something when the laws in tooted, but there was to me was eighty two where there was nine airport sponsors who were exempted from some of these rules, so that they can redirect some fees. But not as much as a port authority has been sounds like a ninety four how much they can divert was restricted even further and yeah. So billions of dollars, I guess, at the end of the day can what's going to happen, though. I mean as gonna earn gonna find newer like, just make them start spending money, better. I don't know. It seems interesting. I think one they would have to give United back the money that they've misdirecting because apparently I didn't realize that and I don't know why they've done this. They've lending fees at Newark are higher than JFK. Yeah. United said in twenty fourteen seventy five percent higher. Fire, which seems agreed is why they wouldn't keep them on the level playing field. And so, I mean that to me, I I've always had the feeling and the into instinct favors delta versus United like they're just penalizing United even more. Yeah. That is interesting. Some interesting numbers. They are. I mean talking through their saying five to eight five airports net over over diversions from Maryland. Massport in Hawaii, exceeded two point three billion over five years last year. There's some number of years Massport being on come on, come on. Shocking, right? I know into city, Chicago notarize their. Yeah. But exempted municipalities are the airport runs systems of Hawaii, Maryland, which is really just Baltimore Massport Chicago. San Francisco, Denver, Saint Louis and the oddball Niagara, buffalo, I guess with their Buffalo's part of the night 'cause Agra falls airport as well. It's already in Agra falls is. The airport that Allegiant uses that for buffalo. Niagara service by, don't even. This group covers multiple counties, and including buffalo, Niagara, anti-agricultural nationally vote and bus but they also do bus service. That's you know, I in many ways sucks that the money being spent as being good to quote unquote, the wrong place that illegal illegal, so certainly the legal value of it matters by, like you need something that's gonna pay for other mass transit services around the country, because God knows our normal government spending doing it as a tough one. But this goes back to the age thing. Right. They continue to penalize travelers because travelers have very little voice in how they get hacks, right into the keypad, and this is across the board. Every municipality when you look at things like contol your rental carpet, Soviet or something, the kills hacksaw that, these are just getting more mercury to fund local projects. But the problem is they're not keeping pace on local projects like the MTA New York is a great example. Right. They have decades and decades of mismanagement, and they keep getting more money to keep extorting more money, but they don't really do anything. The latest the congestion charge. They're talking about instituting a New York and all that money. It's supposed to go to the for script, they haven't done because they refused to manage their organization. Imposed congestion pricing in general. But if they're not that it has to be tied to actually proper spending. Yeah. The problem is, I don't have an issue with the congestion pricing. I have an issue with going straight to the take the MTA has repeatedly shown that mismanages funds if you look at the told on the bridges there, agreed this, yet the tolls on the subways this, somebody pairs don't go up proportionally, and we see the same thing with the port authority. They continue to Jack up all these other fees, and taxes, but they don't adjust the path fair. Yeah. Now it's. That's hard. It's an interesting challenge in part of that is trying to keep path relatively close to the city subway, the subway system, also, but, but they're not the same. So it's always are back. Those are still running separate operations is actually surprising to me. It's your agreed. They really should. But it's a political thing, right? Yeah. Something New Jersey wide EMT on something in New Jersey advice, yada, yada, accepted it runs up sixth avenue, part of it does, but not all of it. The there's more track on the New Jersey side than the reason, Jefferson here, same thing with the commuter rail. Why there's so many studies showing that if you took the trains for Long Island railroad, and New Jersey transit and had them runs through Penn station. Instead of stopping turning around there'd be a dramatic increase in efficiency putting look on forget about all the extra space you needed for the yards. Yeah. And how much just how much better that would be? But, you know, and that's an interesting one because theory like it is sort of governed, by the MTA, but they're still separate organizations within or whatever New Jersey transit is though it was one of the roar. That wasn't it? Mt. Long Island railroad and metro north out here. Fair enough. Speaking of funding for airports, there's been a big push. This is also same store. You shared that. I'm just like scrolling through reading amazing amusing things they airlines for America, which is the lobbying organization for most of the larger US carriers but not delta because they wouldn't take a stand on the Middle Eastern carriers. Delta got mad about Ben's, not paying their dues has been fighting a publicity war, again against PSE increases, so PFC's passenger facility charges. Those are up to four dollars and fifty cents a US airport, and it's money you pay for basically a departure from that airport, and the airports, use that money to find you know, there's landing we talked about this manigault that they charge the airline's value. Take these PFC's and collect that cash use that help fund other projects and not surprisingly, the airlines want the PFC's to be low, or, or nil because anytime those fair PFC's go up that eats into what they consider their profit. Margin. Right, if they either have to raise their prices, which is hard to do as airline or make less money. So airlines generally don't like the reason they keep lobbing casting, and this interesting data in here about what the numbers are in where the numbers go in sort of wear. The federal government is allocating cash. And so just last week, the feds allocated seven hundred plus million dollars to a whole bunch of airports, fifty states to get some projects done in, like one of them is two million dollars for part of the new terminal up here by knee at ease, but it's a twenty million dollar project. And so there's some interesting stats in this story about where the money is not one of the things like a free keeps talking about how airlines airports, have tons of cash available to them, and they don't need this additional cash in the average amount available in all these total numbers. It's interesting just to see this story breaks it down a little bit in terms of what the numbers are for individual airports versus the system is an average right like okay, New York airports, are really big ahead. Lots of money. Evil, but smaller with people have less money. So that's like just 'cause they're seven billion dollars sitting in a pool. Somewhere doesn't mean it's gonna get used or used for individual airports. I thought that was interesting. I mean you know, over the years, we've seen a massive shift in of these little airports, small airports, trying to be big airports, and yeah. Hindi eggs as Zampa because I lived there for so long. It used to be an amazing convenient and easier to get out of whether you're renting a car, whether you were rejecting ending their it no longer, as you know, the in this, this massive dream that had they built, this massive rental car facility center. But so now where you stick three minutes, jump on the shuttle, and get on a Qatar rental car. It's not like more like a fifteen minute process of lease. Because now the, the rental cars are all on the other side. And it's all buses. Of course they invest in any automatic people movers. But the lines to get on some of these buses like you see the stanchions, they're just like you could be waiting forty five minutes to get on a bus whereas before literally walk off. You like you get up there. You'd wait no more than three or four minutes. Your rental car companies bus showed up jumped on and off, you went, and they claim you know, they always pass these projects in the name of efficiency and stuff. But the, the traffic has gotten worse than these buses are just not efficient and it just drives me nuts. It's just like you're making it less appealing to come. Yeah. Yeah. There's something said, for consolidated rental car facilities, and running a single set of shuttles from an efficient or even better, people like you said. But if they don't do it, right. It just goes to shit real. Yeah. Oakland. It there's a number of airports like Vegas, right? The rental car on the other side of the city almost. Yes, is one's annoying. When Boston yet, there, there's some bad ones. There's some terrible ones badminton out there. Anyway. All right enough from the story, also satellite-based navigation school, and that's mentioned in here, and I've talked about that some in other places as need a little bit of an airport kick today, I've been reading a lot of stories couple other airports, that are seeing some challenges Santa Monica, California is a tiny little private airport facility and cities desperately trying to shut it down. Or the people who live there in the city slang along depending on how you wanna blame by that's been an interesting one trying to get through like what weather's legal or not even to shut it down because of how has been funded and where the money is in these things. But one of the things they recently did is shortens the runway and so, two thirty five hundred foot runway a falcon eight ax to disown private jet set the coast to coast. Speed record flying from Santa, Monica to Tita Varo on April twenty fourth late last month, but used the thirty five hundred foot runway for departure and still got to, to Vasan anything else ever has. One of the thing that amazes me about all this Nimby, ISM is people move next the airport, then they get frustrated at the port being there. And I just don't understand the logic or why people even entertain this, right. Like the airport was there when you moved in lies in this you now. Yeah, it's well. And so that goes to the one the other stories that came up is a similar situation on island Nassau County. A new group of something over the calling the Nassau County aviation committee of sixteen people, the goal of fighting for sixteen politicians conspired to be considered a bipartisan group, fighting for quieter communities and complaining that light pass have been compressed recently. And so they're getting there. Oh my God. Planes are flying over homes, every thirty to sixty seconds, sometimes as low as two thousand feet. That's true because that's where the lineup for the runways. Okay, retirement. I slept really every thirty now I think is actually Jeff guy, why. No. Oh, can shift? The timing is right because like okay that was my first response to Islip doesn't have that much traffic set up. I this is from what I can tell it's aircraft lining up, for Jeff Kaye approach, but it's still kind of funny that people are like, you know. Yeah. Those planes are there. But, like, oh my God disciplined under two thousand people has to be under two thousand somewhere. Otherwise, he will never get to the runway. These will be the same people that complain when fares go up because there's not. Yeah, yeah, this is this town is particularly, I think it would be right on the approach for the twenties. Okay. Looking at it says, near Williston park, which is just north of Mineola garden city area. So whatever central Long Island. Yes, the planes should be there. And I, I guess their complaints that these people are making like we have played flying overhead very low in that soil. That's where the runways are. I don't know. And those people don't live that close to the airport. Yeah. Thought you're living in Jamaica bay or anything. Yeah. I mean they're five miles away, so who knows if that's should be considered enough or not, I'm sorry, ten miles away. Who knows if it should be? Close enough or not, Jerry k open nineteen nineteen forty eight presumably, these people did not live there. Nineteen forty eight. That's fair. I'd awhile. Yes. But doesn't it one one other talking random routes? There was a, a business jet made the flight from London City to LAX last week. Nonstop. Online. Right. I mean, I'm very late to be able to have enough fuel to do that. I, I saw the headline didn't read it. So a global seventy five hundred hours of Bardia, somebody queens business jets. Yeah. Man, they're big in the Matt market. They have a commercial having sold that been hit exactly the operative word now. Details. Yeah. The bombard EA global seventy five hundred from London to Los Angeles on that short runway with the seer noise restrictions. So there's some interesting stuff going on in terms of with EBay this week in, in Geneva, which is European business jet event. So there's been a lot of news out about business jet type stuff and try to make all that headlines. So during the conference things happen, you know, Embraer, flew, one of their biz jet across the Atlantic on what's called few renewal way to interesting stuff going on there. Anyway. So I mean what we're on the key. The new w hotel opened. Yes, maybe it shouldn't have well just who need to pool. Actually, this will be the least. My concerns depart where people try to check in. They were told their rooms weren't finished yet. We never should have sold that room. It's not finished yet. His parents, what one of my buddies was told at the check in counter. So he didn't get somewhere to sleep eventually but yeah, you know the food of it look incredible. I've always loved the building. I'm certainly being able to get inside again and seeing it, refinished in refreshed, and sexy is great. I really have to wonder how long they'll be able to maintain the like TWA hype and style with the staff and everything else at that, like at the ball in the restaurants and all those things like I don't know. It seems seems a very expensive proposition me. I mean, it's I, I have not yet been there, and I will get there soon. I was supposed to sweep. I question how long they connect you maintain this, because it's a niche thing. And I mean, I don't know what the rooms are pricing. Unless the rooms are affordable. I if the rooms are affordable. I can't imagine the able to keep up the hype if the rooms are not affordable. I can't imagine them staying alive. Yeah. Now I. Chicken, I got room rates or anywhere to fifty to three fifty a night, which is high, which so it's high, but there's nothing else in that area. And if you wanna stay at JFK this is basically your only option. There's one or two other airport hotels, nearby that aren't very close indefinitely aren't convenient and aren't too, that much cheaper. Either but thinking about right. Someone who gets straight like someone who's planning like fifty bucks hundred bucks. Most most people don't understand the, the airport hotels and airport hotel to most people. Right. So they'll book something where they have taken shuttle with realizing where they're actually staying there. So, you know, that's one thing to keep in mind. Now, the one thing I will say that I do like the stuff is they have various day rates. So if you have an extended layover you can just book a room for part of the day. Yeah. And not have paid for the full experience or like seven to eleven AM ten two four nine eight to eight or something like that there's all different loss, but those are also not g one sixty is the cheapest day rate. I'm looking at one thirty nine. Okay. So seven seven to eleven ten to four noon to six one thirty nine before tax. Now, if you think about ready to of you, and you'll have access Monge actually gonna cost, you, fifty bucks, each right? But this way, you're going to bed. You got a place to go in wind. And put your stuff down. Yeah. So it's not a bad deal in that regard now or just a inbound. Right. I need a shower like there's some expensive shower. But like show us about Red Eye to our finish. Our is not a bad deal. Exactly. I got it. I think that they'll get some money out of some of those things they, if they were smart and or lucky negotiate a contract with someone for arrivals lounge type service, right? Yeah. I'm not sure who but someone who's got a ridiculous early morning arrival from Europe or Asia, come up with a way to do that sort of thing, sorta, like cutting, no used to have in Europe. Yeah. Looked at the their TWA store as great as I think, I need a tracks on Russia. Yeah it. Could be that we should we're that or next. Do our January January chip shop in matching w tracks. It's exactly. So the question is, do we need to bag our listeners for patriot money to buy those force or to make us not do that? Oh. I would fund it for us to where not not or. Yeah, you're probably right. All right. Well, we'll put that on the list of lecture box Stephen, and I will show up dinner somewhere in Europe, wearing matching TWA track sits. We need a sound clip of Stephen singer hit you guys. And this would be the perfect place in check did. Yeah, because there's no way he's actually gonna do this. More airport news macho Pichu, beginning airport might be getting an airport. That'd be kinda crazy. Yeah. I mean I you know, I'm convenience but I also I can see the adverse effective one of the a lot of people stay away from teacher 'cause the so hard to get to, if you make it more accessible than more people. Go to it and us causing it to get overrun more. And we already have seen all sorts of studies where all the visitors are impacting it. Yeah. Yeah. Currently it's you fly Kuske Cisco, and then you take a train or BUSTER drive in, and the one airport that art exhibit in Cousteau is also relatively small, they're going to actually plan for a larger airport that will allow for wide-body aircraft crazy. Yeah. And also, drain the lake of the water supply for crisco, so teams the combated you. Yeah. I would argue that that's probably not good for a lot of things, but they're trying there's been it's actually interesting. You know, it's the UNESCO world, heritage site. And there's some interesting rules that UNESCO has about besides in how they have to be funded and whatnot. I think anchor watt, which also is that whole complex was threatened with having it removed from the list because they had too many people into many visitors. It was getting overwhelmed and destroying the event strike destroying. So he'll be interesting if this plays out how this plays out. All right last airport story, I think for this episode Haneda Tokyo, there was back in February. They announced the US government in Japanese government announced, twelve more daytime slots for US airlines, the four US international carriers that served Okeyo applied for nineteen of those twelve slots and this past week. We got answer on who's getting what and delta picked up five, which just apprise me, but I mean you know, dump dumped on the head wanted the probably the best US-based franchise in Tokyo and they've abandoned altogether. Sure that was this is the northwest connecting hub there mass. Seven forty seven fleet flying in multiple times a day from places continue onward across Asia is doubted, and I don't understand why investors are so hyper excited about the right dope ahead where things don't in northwest had going for it who's not only did have its US passenger vase, but it had a very heavy passenger base in Europe, because of all the particularly another ones, and in Asia because of the north west wind up abandoned all that they've in essence Illini all those passengers and post them somewhere else, which insulated northwest insulated from a lot of US, basic economic challenges, because they hadn't foreign basis and out and says, hyper focused on the US and nothing else. And they've lost allow that lower. Yeah. On the European side. That's offset, I think, because of the prop it went from a strong partnership with Kalem two now the joint venture upset some of the financial challenge. And I won't argue about how much people love hate either the his mitigated some of that financial some of it. Yes. Except it will. Yes. No. Right now, the difference, is that people are buying tickets on air. France for Kalem ending up on delta before people were flying northwest. And so there's because of the JV there's some evenness, but those even if it's I'm not commiserate anything partner neutral, truly on a JV. I think the metal you end up on does get a slight premium one way or another. If nothing else you'll brand recognition. Yeah. And from a passenger perspective, and some of the benefits and I mean, the star line strike venture is notoriously bad for truly met on neutral. But the other ones aren't perfect either. Yeah, that's. There. So, but on the Asia side, I would argue that delta started overflying, Tokyo, and so, yes, they gave up the Japan originating passengers, but they did that because people are flying nonstop to China and didn't stop in Japan any. Think of all this Christmas, southeast Asia. They used to go. They don't seem to Hong Kong anymore period, right? Good. Make it work. Yeah. Right. From Seattle, and so they'll yeah. And how you don't how you can't make Hong Kong work as globally kind of one of the centers globe economy, you have to wonder about what they're doing at the business. Yeah. That's that is an interesting one. But at the same time, I think what happens now is delta almost certainly shuts down its operation. Well, they didn't get report Lindo. Yeah. Did I thought they didn't? I thought they got what they didn't get one. They missed their second Honolulu requests. Okay. So they got all the cities. They requested in Honolulu. Five and six were both on a Lou? And so they got one through five I'm say already had L A and they already had many apples, and then they added Detroit Atlanta Seattle Portland in Honolulu may miss their extra Honolulu's frequency. But this basically is enough. They can shut down Rita. Who are they bribing at? You know, I do think there's some politics involved in this. And I think that the very aggressive very politically favorable statements that they have made has actually helped in this case at the same time the other two carriers or the three have all indicated they want to keep their operations split and delta dozen to maybe Hawaiian doesn't maybe wine doesn't, but United and American absolutely wanna keep their operations split between Rita and Haneda. And if you only gave delta two or three instead of five I feel like it becomes even less economically viable to operate, what they're trying to do. And the DOT's obligation is for the public good. But part of that is making sure that what they're delivering is services that can be operated could part of the speed that a United both have point partners Rita. Yes. Yet, and that was a big part of Delta's application saying, they guys have joint venture. And so, you should also consider the fact that, like Jalen ANA make these flights and Hawaiian is actually a JV partner with JAL as well as we are. One job as an with American, but the counterpoint though is, who is the DOT supposed to be serving the public or the airlines the public. So and to, to that point, most of routes are connecting traffic very few Izzo, windy. Whereas, I would argue particular with United a lot more traffic on the route. Save requested. So United came in second place. They got four they're requested routes. They're going to add service at Newark to her got here. Got here. But Houston Guam is the only truly didn't get right? They're going to add it Newark. They're gonna add at Los Angeles, and they're gonna shift for Dulles in Chicago dropping the Rita services there. And. Yes. Delta's has a lot of connecting flow, Portland. I would argue as all oh, and be all day. Yes, Seattle's a decent amount of connections and then Atlanta's going to be a significant mix of connections and whatnot L A will be interesting. See how much that is originating versus connecting LA is going to have a flood of additional capacity, I expect to see the fares drop out like the bottom out of the bears in that market. The other thing to keep in mind is dunk. Oh for most of their findings are supplying fewer receipts than anyone else proposed. Yeah. They're using smaller jenner's begin their widebody smaller. And so, you know, this quite candidly, I think the DOT's disservice to the travelling public because they reduce the amount of capacity, right? You could have the triple seven or with seven six three and they've opted for the small plane. So, again, they're catering to the airline rather than the public. Yeah. I'm I see I'm, I'm a little torn on that. I see where you're coming from. But I guess if it's if you keep. Delta with a split operation, delta, can't affectively operate services to Tokyo, and that's not good for the public. Most of those verses are connecting they can the Portland was the only one that doesn't have a heavy connecting. They can connect with people anywhere. They need to have the lift to connect that many people, right? So you give them some slots by giving them five spots on. If you only gave them three instead of five you've now created situation that it's actually not financially as financially viable for them versus American, and delta ocean American night, Hawaiian to actually run the operation as allocate compared to DOT come back and say, we'll give you these sore spots. Conditional bigger aircraft. That's happened before. That's fair. I see where you're coming from there. I just I guess, my, my only thing is like putting aside the part where it's gotta be sad for people of the northwest. Heritage to see that hub dismantle a get lie. They've dismantled the hub because no one wants to stop and Tokyo, if they don't have to and be sort of get the, the value proposition of keeping your what amounts to seven daily flights at one airport and split three and four and I obviously, it is good for delta to be all in one place. I think it ends up being helpful to passengers as well to have delta consolidated among place with small number operate. I think it's a disservice. The trumpet public, I think Portland is the exception to that. All the other is most predominate connecting Crafter. Know LA is that'll be an interesting, but already had ily. Yeah. They already have LA allergy all their moving their Nerina play Tony to know actually LA data. Right. I'm sorry. It was American. And United got Elliott new LA slots in American headed eighty-two, American delta, both for thirty five LA NATO, America's gonna go double daily alternating times, United's gonna add an extra one and Rita out there. Anyway, American kicked off at one DFW in one LA slot. Hawaiian pick up one hundred Lewis slide the other way. So I'm not sure I'm surprised that they didn't approve the Vegas Rita. Actually specifically mentioned it like you know, they the DOT in their ruling, and it's a tentative ruling. So the airlines all appeal, it'll be interesting to see if anyone does. But the they mentioned it and they basically said interesting, we understand that it's a relatively large market is like the fifth largest market from Japan to the United States to Vegas for traffic by there's no onward connections in the DOT actually rates onward connections as of plus not a minus that you're describing in terms of who they would approve routes for. And they said it was that, and that it was American fourth choice, which goes back to what we've talked about back in February, which basically American put down there to get a lot of talk about it. But there's no way whatever happens so. All right. I think that covers our airport news for today. Speaking of the delta, and various delta things I wanted to, I feel like we need an extra sound effect. Also, for like shit said that was probably a little off last week, Phnom and not really off. But one of the things we had a. Listener sent me a note talking about the delta union stuff that we talked about last week. Specifically the ridiculous liars adults put up. They continue to receive flat for that. But mentioned there, one some of the complaints that the flight attendants from delta have been pushing, they kind of are hoping union would help them resolve and it's part of it is pay scale, but work rules are pretty crappy with long sits in between flights and potentially up to eighteen hour workdays, which I'm not entirely sure how that works within FAA rules. And I know that the FAA rules are supposed to change to be much closer to pilot work rules at some point very soon by there's the pilots have better health better profit, sharing better retirement plans and the end the flight attendants don't and so getting that is something that went down to keep saying, no you if you have a union affect your profit sharing. I think the flight attendant saying, yeah, we can tell 'cause the pilots, get profit profitsharing than we do. So, yeah, the. The other interesting thing that I saw is that apparently the pay scale for flight attendants taps out at twelve years on, so there's a lot lot of flight attendants bear now with much more seniority than that, who are, you know, would like to see the scalp upwards. So anyway, I'm little flashback last week. I kinda wanna go to the Anna to get a new passport is this because you wanna go to Donald it is. Somebody, we know you always used to joke about McCall's being the American comes never did. I think it would actually happen. Either that or Starbucks, depending on what you can find you know, it's so McDonald's in the Donald's Shane in Austria, that local like national franchise has agreed with the US embassy there to not quite provide consular services but to be sufficiently trained that they can direct people who come in with questions to the proper contact information is could literally be like a laminated sheet of paper behind the register with the phone numbers for the embassy, but there agreed to make themselves available to this sort of thing, and, like, get advice on where they need to go, how to get there, although snow, I guess it's kinda take the train to wherever you need to be in whatnot to get the consular services you need to have a loss asphalt or anything like that. I think is hysterical. Sorry in this day and age of connected. This clearly someone thinks it is. I agree with you. But like, you know, I, I don't know. I'm a different sort of traveler. I agree with you by agreed. We are definitely different than average. So, yeah, you think mostly mostly good ways. But yeah. So I, I actually have a buddy, who lives in Austria. Now, he just moved back actually and have to go visit Morrison more quickly. It's funny. I read that as Australia, not Austria originally. Yeah. Oops. Could be could be either way, I'm not sure if that matters as much. But, you know, sure Austria around Australia has a massive campaign for tourism right now. And their big thing right now is on hashtag. I remember that Mike stop taking pictures on Instagram, actually. Visit joyous. Yes. Yeah. It's a cool, Leonard, my wife hated the food, Indiana. And the architecture you've gotta really be into that style. Because it's, it's, it's a one trick pony in many ways. But if you like it, there's a lot of it. Right. So. All right. Last topic, I've gotten emails from both high at and from American Airlines telling me that I need to match my status link my accounts and earned more points in our in more dollars or something, and I had it by the do any research, on any of it should I be looking my accounts is this, actually the deal. Do you know anything about it? I do you can link accounts right. There's in part of what's happening. Is it didn't show up immediately? Should've a few days later, you're getting. Status Joan just part of it. That's part of the star this, they'll give you up for ninety days and you can earn Putnam, Putnam, pro or executive Putnam with within ninety days. Now the interesting thing is I took a look at this, and you have anything until September thirtieth register so you don't have to go rush out and register immediately. But you do have to it'll show up in your promotions page on the eight on your AM page, when you log in your accounts after you've winter council can link now but not start your until later, correct. That's an important detail. Yes. So, and so part of that, you know, I looked at this and the nice thing is, I realize I could Ernie XP pretty much a single trip, a little more than a single trip with some of these attractive QR fares out there. QR fares count towards the challenge with American, I think it was just I don't think it had to be an American. I would need to go back and double check that. I feel like there's been over the just with historical American challengers, I thought only joint venture partners, the not any issue. And I didn't read it carefully enough. But because I still feel dirty by giving you business. Yeah I can't get over that right now. Fair enough. Do have any details on health goes the other way like X XP right now. Do I get anything from high at for this points? And that's all I really seen that. You'll earn points while, but I forget what the yeah. The distribution was in regard supports. Yes. It's interesting, right? There was there's the United in Mary had a deal delta, and Starwood did have a deal. But with that merger doubt the lost. So it's a little interesting to me to see yet another play on this with airlines and hotels, trying to team up make themselves impelling but. You know, I just question I wonder about I feel like this was not as well thought out as the United Marriott one or the Starwood delta one, it's certainly not as comprehensive. No in American has also I feel like last year. Get a promotion challenge thing with Hilton honors also. So that could be why not quite a number of is much more of a short-term commercial beer than a long term program. Yeah. I who knows so interesting interesting stuff. But you know, not really gonna bother linking. My counts just this. I don't really say it's ever, and I can't I mean, the reality is all these joint partnership things, they're really less about providing convenience for the passenger. It's more about data sharing. Right. Right. That's real really where what America wants to. See is wooder all the highest that highest members are staying at that aren't flying. American. How do you attract him over? Yeah. Absolutely right. This is about getting more data on and Sumer and they're paying for it through these pro points status, challenges, and whatever. But that's the thing. But what's the point where when you keep giving away an increasing the rates? Nothing. I don't know. I don't know. What else you got anything on? Not right. Could travel is coming up this week. No on the ground for a few weeks ago. Go to Sydney nice. Well, you know, after your Newark to Boston via San Diego last week that may be as much. Oh, yeah. That was fun. Not so much. All right. Well, I gotta Berg turn for a day of this week. But other than that, pretty quiet. I think Stevens at home actually see he's back in New York for seventy. He is. Yeah, I'm sorry, miss. You guys for dinner this week. I know we had planned it, but I got to. Bech next for our listeners. Thanks for joining us. Once again, you can find us on Twitter at dots lines, or more docile Orleans dot com. Leaves a note s of questions, send us links stories, you think are interesting. Guess which one of today's stories, you think was actually from listeners opposed to us just talking about things we refer sin, and as mentioned earlier in the show, find us on patriot and help fund, our TWA tracksuit extravaganza for next January do not even I don't go. Find Stevens new home. Bye bye. Bye. Right.
A Long-Shot Bid to Save the Monarch Butterfly
"This episode of the Outside podcast is brought to you by the two thousand twenty four and explore the bailable intelligent four wheel drive the terrain management system. It's built for for life's adventures. Which makes it the ideal vehicle for Modern Day? Explorers like professional ski mountaineer. Hillary Nelson being ski mountaineer is to be having a very NICI small sport. Essentially it involves being out in the mountains for multiple days at a time for me me. It involves going to the Himalayas to Andy's all over the globe you'll ever. He's been on more than forty expeditions around the globe. Two thousand twelve she went to the Himalayas declined both Mount Everest and Lo Tzi fourth highest peak on the planet in a single twenty. Four hour. Push two years ago she went back Luzi and with their expedition partner became the first ski down from the summit. I think one of my favorite trips ever was the Isle of South Georgia which is right on the Antarctic Circle. We took this crazy boat. There and Made a first ski descent of now. Norman which is totally an obscure mountain but it was a pretty a amazing trip with penguins and all kinds of crazy wildlife oliver trips have been successful for Hillary. It's all about the effort. Not The result put put herself at the age of her abilities and see what that container to be. An explorer to me is to push into places is where I am uncomfortable. I really love to go places where there's no maps where nobody's ever been before that's like my sweet spot and by doing being that I'm putting myself physically and mentally in two places where I can learn and that's exploring to me all of life's adventures with the greatest exploration vehicle of all time two thousand twenty four explore more about what it can do for you and meet Modern Day explorers like Hillary Nelson Nelson at outside online dot com slash explorers from outside magazine. NPR X. This is the outside podcast So humpty dumpty on the wall for a second here well. Recently I went to San Francisco. Disco to see the world's largest butterfly in a grab so there's three points of attachment there and at the very end the butterflies a monarch. It's fifty feet tall. And it's the centerpiece of a massive mural that wraps three sides of a thirteen storey building on a busy corner in the tenderloin district euro-bloc if this and you attach your lanyard to the roadblock I see it up close you need to get on the roof of the building. Put on a harness clip into a safety line and climb over the edge under a swing. Stage was narrow platforms window window. washers use and then you climb in Be Gone in the Middle One. The artist who painted the butterfly and it was very kindly guiding me onto the swing stage Jane Kim in this project which is nearing completion. As part of an ongoing series she calls the migrating mural it highlights animals animals and insects along migration routes that they share with humans for the last few years Kim's focused on the monarch which is in a state of crisis. This is especially true for the western monarch a population that spends its winters along the Pacific coast in California and Baja Mexico discouraging news about about California's monarch butterflies. Researchers say that their numbers are disturbingly low and that may be an understatement. Recent census they found an eighty six percent decline in the number of monarch wintering on the California coast compared to two thousand seventeen and more than two zero t society a science based Conservation Group that it focuses on invertebrates there now fewer than thirty thousand monarchs in California down from some four and a half million as recently as the mid nineteen eighties The biggest cause is habitat destruction. Pesticide use and climate change. Make things even worse if the monarch is going to recover my need to protect the remaining winner sites in California and elsewhere and also restore historic breeding migratory habitat which makes me wonder how has a mural supposed to how. And if you're gonna pain ginormous Monarch Butterfly. Why would you do it here? In the tenderloin wrote in San Francisco known for Strip clubs in crime and drug use large in desperate. Homeless population is really easy to get lost. When you're only six inches away from the wall this massive wall doesn't really look like anything when you're looking at it and close it just looks like a splotch of color better? They really understand what Jane Kim is doing. And how peak works public art might actually make a difference for the monarch another another wild creatures. You need to know the story of Willie the bighorn sheep. That was the very first piece in the migrating mural fifteen years ago Kim was a young Artist trying to figure out how she can build a career focused on the natural world. She graduated from the acclaimed Rhode Island School of design where she studied fine. Art proposed a scrape from an interest in nature. Her classmates most moved to New York City became she went to California. She had a series of experiences. That helped her begin to find her way. Included falling in love with outside magazine correspondent. The're walker was chasing ambitious adventures. Oliver the planet. I am going to go strand myself on this island. it's a bit nerve racking Got My dad masks my knife gum and Clothes Mom dad talk to you a month. The man he was exploring areas of the natural world that I wouldn't have even dreamed of and I remember thinking. Oh Oh my gosh. This person is doing this for his livelihood. He's making a career out of this and he's out adventuring and I remember just being blown blown away on a lot of different fronts and recognizing loud. Okay I can do this. Kim decided to enroll in the science illustration program at California California State University and Monterey pop on the program itself offered her a new set of skills. It was the two and a half hour drives back and forth between San Francisco Monterey Array that would have an even bigger influence on homework. I would look at these billboards and I would look at signs. I would look at things that were geared towards towards consumer purposes and thought man. I would much rather learn as I'm driving. I wonder if there's any way that we could start creating billboards boards around the landscape. Or could we have interpretive signs that I don't know that you didn't have to pull over to experience and and I think that's when I really started to develop the idea of the migrating mural and not only this concept series of murals that celebrated the cyclical migrations migrations of wild animals became her singular creative focus after finishing the Monterey program she took a fellowship at the Sierra Nevada research institute spending time in Yosemite National Park where she learned about the Sierra bighorn. Sheep so I did go out and seek the expert. The bighorn sheep expert has famous Amos. Dr John Wayne Housing and he was so kind to take me on one of his adventures and I spent two days days in the field with him collecting bighorn sheep poop. It was fascinating and gratifying. I loved it and they look like little chocolate. I am chips which is interesting but he told me the story of the Sierra Nevada corn sheep and how they almost collapsed in the ninety S. There were only one hundred left in the ninety s We talked a lot about the need to bring attention to them because they are so elusive and most people would never be able to. I see them in the wild even the bighorn sheep biologists use telemetry and radio callers to help them find the herds and collect data and so they're really hard to hard to was a perfect subject for her first meal a beautiful endangered species that migrate back and forth between food sources. At different innovations Sierra bighorn had been decimated by diseases that they picked up from domestic sheep. If they're going to survive need people to pay more attention to them take care. There aren't actually a ton of canvases that you would be able to see directly from highway ninety five. There's a lot of dilapidated buildings and I spent a good majority of time looking for suitable walls and locating the owners of these buildings sometimes proved to be a challenge but more than that I also had to really build a community of supporters. Who would help advocate the project? Check for me. Kim established a company INC dwell to run the migrating bureau and launched a kickstarter campaign setting a funding of twenty thousand dollars. She presented her vision vision for the company in a video pitch. It's easy to forget hard to see wildlife but through a collection of murals painted along migration corridors the transient life of these animals can easily see. She reached her goal. And just a week. Eventually reason closer to thirty thousand dollars campaign had her first migrating mural in the small mole town of independence on the side of the Mountain Williamson Hotel and Mount Williamson is the name one of her units that California Department of fish and wildlife established and this particular heard unit was one that did not succumb to domestic sheep disease that nearly wiped out the entire population so they were still a thriving population so it seemed like a beautiful place to begin the project and the iconic mural role that I think stands out in that series is the one on the wall that Where you can see the peak behind it and there's also silhouette of Mount Williamson in the mirror and just a single male ram standing in front of this The speak the name the Rame Willy and and he made a big impression after the painting was completed came out a fundraiser. To cover the cost of five more bighorn Muros sub to support the Sierra Nevada bighorn. Sheep Foundation on Dacian which was coordinating. The recovery of the animals. Event was an enormous success playing in around thirteen thousand dollars and more importantly demonstrating that there were a lot of people in the area. Dick care about the sheep. School started taking field trips to see willy. Biologists came to give demonstrations and how they tracked big Horn and the visitors. You just never expect the first time I saw Willie. It was two thousand thirteen and I was a medium security prison in upstate. New York I was Lying prison bunk leafing through an old issue of the Nature Conservancy magazine. That's Michael Fisher. He was about a year into his two year sentence when he saw an image of William an article about the mural it had an immediate impact on him it was instant. It was a very visceral moment for me and I I didn't know quite why didn't have all the details yet but I remember seeing that photo and I remember seeing in a willy's image in kind of the colors on the mountaintops behind him and and I thought I'm going to go. Oh here I don't know how many get here I don't know I don't WanNa make it but I'm going to go see this like a lot of prisoners fisher. Had a running list of the things he do when he got got out. He says he knew that most of them probably would never happen. But seeing willy that was something he knew he could do so we held onto the idea and soon after he was released on a broiling summer day he drove alone independence and he stood there on the street staring at the mirror. NFL So really good. It felt like I really had accomplished something. If only doing thing that I said I was going to do. But then he looked around and he noticed something that seemed almost too increase to be true. Because you can't make this up that across the street literally is the county jail and kind of look at the jail and then look across the the street at the mural and feel like like I was kind of bad movie where I'm standing in in the midst of my own crossroads at that moment comment Fisher fell pretty good like he was heading in the right direction. Then he thought about the prisoners right behind him and wondered if maybe they could see willy through a window. mm-hmm yeah I just remember thinking God I really hope you guys can see this because You know it could really can really be the kind of thing that that gets. Somebody go through a day her through a three week or through a year of speaking to the inmates in that jail. In my mind that I was I was saying to them. You know think about all the things that we've suffered through and think about all the things that we've been through and then just remember you know when you look at that mural that all we have to do now is. PS brave as a sheep Fisher later wrote an essay about Willie was published by the Sun. Son Magazine today is living in Chicago workings writer. He sees his experience. Power validation the reach the public art can and you can't do much better than any a mural in California and having someone in prison in upstate New York tennis stumble upon it and have it really become a mental and emotional anchor not only while they were in prison but also after they get out and we'll be right back at the to start the episode we heard about professional ski mountaineer Hillary Nelson and how the two thousand twenty four and explorer is built for her adventurous life. Hillary doc ventured as an only mean expeditions far off places. She's just as active when she's chasing her two sons around their hometown of telluride Colorado. They both love love skiing but it is Kinda funny. They've done it their whole lives and I don't think either of them even really see it as a sport. It's it's a way of Life A. They learned to ski the same time they learn to walk. It's just something they do. It gives them a ton of freedom to pick and choose their runs on the mountain. They they ride the chairlifts on their own and have been since they were six. Seven years old when your mom was named National Geographic's adventurer of the year doc usually gonna go a bit farther than your local ski slopes I have taken. My kids to Kilimanjaro When they were four four and and six and they made it to about fifteen thousand feet which I thought was pretty awesome and then another big adventure? They went on was to hike into base camp for Makalu which is eight thousand meter peak in Nepal just to make it a little harder. We did it during the monsoons. Oh it was raining. Every single day and there are leeches and mud Ed's and high rivers and it was crazy and they they loved. It totally freaked me out and stressed me out but they love it they talk about out of all the time still whether adventure is your life's work or just a weekend pursued gear up with the greatest exploration vehicle of all time the two thousand twenty Ford Ford Explorer has been completely redesigned inside outside in under the hood. More about what it can do for you in meet Modern Day explorers like Henry Nelson and outside outside online dot com slash explorers came at other ideas from Urals. GIRLS BE GUIDE US at one point. She submitted a project concept in National Geographic. which was hosting a reader poll to highlight bold new ideas for saving me oceans? So what I submitted was a along the coastline of California that we highlight the blue whale to scale on wall so I would need definitely no less than one hundred foot wide wall for the blue whale and just drive up the coast and paint these murals murals of of whales in different parts of their seasonal behavior and their migration idea when the poll though listed in Guinea funding it was just an online mind contest but story the National Geographic posted about. It caught the idea of Kim's new boss. The Director of the acclaimed Cornell lab of ornithology in Ithaca New New York where she was completing another internship and the director of the lab John Fitzpatrick key shortly after wrote me an email and said hey so you do large format murals WanNa have a lunch meeting at some point. I said sure and during this meeting he walks out overlooking this blank. SORTA Drab Wall in the visitor center and says I've always wanted a mural on this wall of the evolution of birds with this be something you're we're interested in. The project had covering four story three thousand square foot wall with a bird from every living family plus many of the species from which they devolved over two and a half years. She painted a total of two hundred and seventy birds and spend countless hours on a scaffolding often working at night. The Wall of birds words as it became known ignited her career the National Aquarium in Baltimore Commissioner decree it three murals for permanent exhibit the living seashore. Aw Shalini prestigious residencies. San Francisco's De Young Museum in the Lieke. Woodson Arts Museum in Wisconsin meanwhile given their Walker married and working together inked well. They attracted organizations to support a new series of the migrating mural focused on monarch butterflies in two thousand seventeen gene with support from the Walton Foundation. Combat up a mural of a monarch on an air traffic control tower in Arkansas and Florida. They work with the nature. Conservancy onto who monarch murals including a thirty five hundred foot painting right across from Orlando City Hall. PAT DID ANOTHER ONE IN UTAH. Each of these projects required exhaustive zoster funding efforts lengthy negotiations with building owners and most of all communities who believed that art has a unique ability to connect people with the wildlife. That's all all around us that we're not seeing. Yeah there's so many people involved in but the bottom line is that it has to come with people who believe in what we are doing and I think that's the key ingredient all always. It's always about somebody who believes in this project or me or in the work or all three. Kims art speaks for itself but Walker has proved to be critically important partner. Ask Him what he does for INC dwell. And he'll tell you that he handles all non pink brush fares his most important role though is being inked wells hustler in chief. He's a natural salesman so this works well for everybody so I actually grew up in college. I rented House Painting Business And the way that we would get business this was literally. I'd go knocking pre Internet. We go door to door knocking on people's doors handing out flyers asking people if they wanted their house paint. And so I'm like pretty comfortable kind of cruising down the street and looking at addresses and cold calling people in the spring of two thousand nine hundred ninety eight twelve got its first commission for Mural in San Francisco in the south. The market area came in Walker thrilled to have a project in the city where they lived but with the dire new reports coming in about the western monarch population. I really wanted to do another. They're prominent local peace connection at an arts foundation suggested look around the tenderloin which had lots of big structures could really benefit from a dose of. Inspirations they found nice four storey building and they tracked down the owner company. Called Veritas which has to be one of the largest property owners and San Francisco email lift a long winded voices for the head of marketing. Figured it'd probably in there and unbelievably within forty eight hours. I get a a phone call back from their marketing department. Saying hey we check out your website. This sounds amazing. You know can you come in for a meeting soon walker and Kim resenting the migrating mural to the very top executive team inside a glass conference room downtown skyscraper started explain in their vision for the four story structure. The conversation suddenly went in an unexpected direction. And then all of a sudden they turn turn back around us and they said well about half a block away. Okay we've got this thirteen storey apartment tower What would you think about that? and Jane icon each other without really anyway. Well we'd be pretty excited about that. And and then they said well instead of just one side what would you think about doing the whole. Oh building and we said well we think that would be pretty cool So all of a sudden like they're kind of pitching us on basically taking our project in an and really expanding beyond our wildest dreams for for a canvas like this. Kim began the project like she always does sketching under vision on paper to create what amounts to a map of the mural. She then drew grid lines on the building itself using pencils turning turning it into a massive piece of graph paper with two foot by two foot squares after that it was basically a giant paint by numbers task she. She began painting. The North facing wall. Last October had down Hyde Street from San Francisco's iconic Knob Hill. Can't miss the fifty foot tall monarch poised midflight bova California. Poppy that has stems reaching round the east wall on the South Wall she had four more butterfly species endemic to California -fornia including the Tiger swallowtail which is actually quite happy to make its home in the neighborhood because streets lined with tall buildings resemble. It's Natural Canyon Habitat but only if there are enough plants around as Walker sees it. This underscores the point of this mural and helps us realise allies. What's possible the great news and I cannot over stress? This is that for pollinators monarchs and bees and birds words and other butterflies bugs urban environment. There's so much. Potential Habitat for these creatures gardens. Parks freeway divides right. It's one of those things. Where if we just kinda start thinking about you know? Our urban landscapes in different ways rooftop gardens and parks and mediums and planting the right thing. He's planning native local wildflowers and plants. Then you can make a very significant impact and that's real and so these are the sorts of things where you know. I mean we we would love to do a Migraine Bureau and say like blue whales right but like you and I can't like actually go home and like do something in our backyard or protect the blue whale. Well guess what you can can actually go home in your backyard and do something to protect monarchs and pollinators and you can do it tomorrow. Kim Seconds all of that. Her hope is an artist is to create pieces says that allow us to make an emotional connection with the wild creatures that we've been ignoring. I think one of the biggest reasons why I do what I do. Is that if I can show a really really beautiful rendering of the animal people can start to see it. Takes Blinders off and one of the best things that I hear from. Somebody is after. They've seen one of my works. They say something like Oh my gosh I see monarchs everywhere now and it's not so much that they they are actually seeing monarchs everywhere now. It's that they know that they can look for them now. And that when it's flutters around them they go. That's a monarch mark. Because now they know they've been introduced to that animal and it's like being introduced to your neighbor right on your street and all of a sudden when you are introduced to them and he sees see them face to face and shake their hand the likelihood of using them in your neighborhood again is higher than if you had no idea that they existed right eight at my hope. Is that as more. And more people understand why we made that mural as well which is to bring the plight of the monarch to the forefront. You know that that's going to help people care more and hopefully take action. That's already happening very tasks. The property company that owns the building in the tenderloin is working with the San Francisco Parks Department and the Versi Society to to Landscape Two neighborhood parks with butterfly friendly native plants. Meanwhile tenderloin residents now have an extraordinary piece of art when that's entirely early free to view and then offers reason to look up in a place where people tend to keep their gazes on the ground. What I've been hearing is that it brings some joy into what can feel like a pretty Desperate area are one where you tend to shut in in and be in word and not want to engage with your surroundings and I think fat caring about the buildings and carrying about the urban landscape is just as important in forming a point of pride and Showing that that this isn't just some corner of the city that we should just forget about sure is a nice story beautiful mural the might help help save a butterfly along the way brighten the lives of people in a troubled part of the city but the thing is the odds of a happy ending for the western monarch. They're not very good is well aware of this but it doesn't make her feel any different about what she's doing at least if an when if if I don't know if it's worse to say when or if we lose the western monarch this can serve as a reminder that that when they were still here someone in the community loved it enough for it to be accepted as public artwork and the skyline of San Francisco. That's pretty darn cool And if it does go extinct here in SF driving down Hyde Street and seeing a fifty foot mark so I feel pretty good about At least with the tools that I have leaving and for the people to to know that it was loved Jane Kim and Therre Walker a partner sitting twelve. You can learn more about their work at INC DWELL DOT COM and you can see some fantastic photos of all of Kim's murals goes on their instagram page at inc.. Learn more about what you can do to help. The Western monarch and other insects go to the Nurses Society website. That's X-ers C. E. S. dot. Org this episode was produced by me. Michael Roberts Music by Robbie Carbon this episode is brought to you by two thousand twenty four and explore built for life's adventures. Learn more about what it can do for you and meet. Modern explorers like Hillary Nelson and outside online nine dot com slash explorers. We'll be back next week.
Humbled To Be Interviewed By Cliff Duvernois
"Today's episode is brought to you by pet angel adoption and rescue. Hello everyone and welcome to the call of leadership podcast here. We're GONNA listen to powerful stories and advice from those in our Michigan Community who answered the call of leadership. I am your host cliff do Vin Wa and my guest. Today he is a success and business coach. He's a motivational speaker. He's a Webinar Professional. And he has his own podcast. His mission help people around the world attained more success amid great challenges which is where we find ourselves right now so he has given talks at the United Way. He's talked to Arby's he's presented at the National Restaurant Association. Many other companies and other great organizations. He's the author of not one but two bucks inspired Howard. Differences are change in the workplace and his latest Book Leadership One. Golden Nugget at a time. Ladies and gentlemen please welcome to the show. The host of the draws cast podcast. Geoff draws. Douse Ski Jeff. Horia good you you nailed that last name perfect and I definitely appreciate that. It's with Duvernois as your last name. And Draws Douse is mine. I think that our names have been missed pronounced a few times in our life. I think I've heard just about every way that you could butcher my last name somebody would really have to be creative to surprise me anymore. Same here if you would. Why don't you share with us? You know where you're from. Where did you grow up? Yes I grew up in a northern suburb of Detroit. Royal Oak Michigan. Of course now really since one thousand nine hundred ninety s until current. It is a very trendy city that a Lotta people go to for bars and restaurants and and really to live now too. But I tell people when I was growing up in Royal Oak especially in downtown. There was the police station. There was a theater movie theater. There was a car dealership in a library and then there was tumbleweeds because there really was nothing else in downtown Royal Oak but rule up their great place to grow up very sports oriented city which fit me. Well since I was very sports oriented growing up and that's kind of you know the beginning of it all is right there. After you graduated high school you decided to pursue public communications at Central Michigan. Why did you? Why did you go into public communications so I was fortunate enough in my sports activity was pretty good? Baseball player was highly recruited to go to college and really had an opportunity while at least there was the thought. I had an opportunity to play professional baseball as well. So to be honest with you. The idea of going into communications was really with the idea that after college. When I was playing professional baseball I you know during those college times I could learn how to interview. I could learn how to be interviewed. I could be after my baseball career. I could be a sports broadcaster and that was kind of the plan going into it. Little did I know that really sets baseball. Didn't work out would use my communication skills but it took a little bit later in life but it finally kicked in in now when you were talking before in about you know going into professional baseball in. What was it? The kind of steered you down this other path. Baseball didn't work out and just because of injuries. More than anything else. Central Michigan okay. Yeah Central Michigan was very good at baseball. Especially during the time that I was there. We want our mid American Conference Championship. Three out of the four years I was there and I had a lot of a teammates at one onto play minor league baseball one to play professional baseball and after college. I just kind of knocked around at some jobs and got into the restaurant industry after trying a couple of different things and spent thirty years of my life and the and the restaurant industry and really my career just kind of gravitated to to war. I Matt Now for many years. I was a restaurant manager so I learned a lot about leadership and I learned a lot about how to deal with people during those times of being a manager of people but also dealing with the customer end is well pray so as time went on and my career advanced and I got into more corporate environment people really started to recognize that I may have this talent for training and development of people and from there really. That's kind of the foundation of where I took off from there because they spent a lot of time in front of classes. I spent a lot of time talking to trainers from different industries as well as other people in the restaurant. Industry just about The restaurant industry in general built that foundation to be able to really feel comfortable about speaking in public and that was really the foundation from there. it kind of took off into the leadership realm because at the end of the day what I realized was is that without good leadership everything else within an organization is really destined for failure. Yeah and the company that I worked for primarily was a franchise type of company. I would tell people if you are a good owner. A good manager of people your business will succeed. And if you're not your business destined for failure and I can't tell you how many times I would tell people yet. They would still fail because they were not good leaders. And maybe it's because they weren't equipped to be a good leader but their philosophies were just destined for failure ride. I think people have this this notion and correct me if I'm wrong but I think people really have this notion. That just a leader's somebody that just tells people what to do and they're supposed to do it. No no question. One of the biggest mistakes young leaders make is they think that the title is where the respect comes from but the title is just the beginning and it really means nothing unless you gain the respect of the people that work for you. You bring up a good point because I. I've talked to other restaurant tours for this podcast. The restaurant business is tough. I worked in the restaurant business. I started off as a busboy. Came a host became a server. And I I go. I would never do that again. But there are some people out there that absolutely love it and for you. I mean you said you worked there for thirty years. What was it that you? What was it that that kind of motivated you to get into the restaurant business in the first place really. It was kind of an innocent reason. I had a good friend of mine that had worked for this company and just for transparency sake. They still don't really want me to to mention the name of the company. That's why I'm not but I got into this company. Based on the fact that I would be getting into a position where I would be doing. A lot of traveling as a franchise consultant. I was twenty four twenty five years old young Guy Unlike Hey I get to see the country and get paid for it. This is great. You know so. I jumped at the opportunity and did that for about a couple of years but then met my wife. We decided to settle down and start our family. So the next kind of generation or the next Evolvement of of my restaurant career was getting back to local here in the Michigan area and running a restaurant for For this particular company and from there was a lot of trial and error because like we talked about my background especially my degree colleges communications. It wasn't restaurant management or wasn't hotel management. It was communication so the road to me. Being a successful leader really is strewn with a lot of failure a lot of success but I really learned the hard way learning all about it in the restaurants. And that's with your employees as well as what the customers you so you were talking before you said that you had worked in the restaurant business for For thirty years yes and that point I think most people would say you know what I got my thirty years in. I'm going to punch out work on my back. Swing maybe move down to Florida are spend the winter months become a snowbird instead you decided to found draws talks dot com what what inspired you to go back out there again. What to to help? People help develop leaders all that experience that I had in the Restaurant Business. I feel was just kind of a stepping stone for the next thing in my life and I certainly am. Not the type of person that is ready to work on the backswing. I still have a lot of years. Left to make an impact on people whether that would be as a motivational speaker or speaker on leadership but it really is just the next level. The next thing that I've built this foundation of a career on and I started getting the bug about speaking an authoring by attending conferences in particular restaurant trainer conferences and watching the people up on stage. Speak and the effect that they had on the audience and realizing that. I had a gift that I had Some talent to actually be able to do that myself and I started kind of debt. Really was my jumping off point where I started talking at Trainers conferences positive feedback is always a good thing. When you're in the public eye feedback is huge right. So yes and I and I got feedback not only from fellow trainers but some of the other professional speakers that had watched me speak and said you know. You've got the ability to do this so I jumped into it and honestly in order to really get taking off in this. It took about an intense here of learning and I started attending sir. National Speakers Association meeting started picking the brains of a lot of people about how to create this business of authoring and speaking and it took a good year of doing that as well as getting the podcast off the ground and doing the youtube videos before I really felt like that I had a good place to to advance from and had my feet underneath me. You know it's interesting you talk about that. 'cause you talked about creating a podcast. He talked about creating youtube videos. What I've heard other people say that this is a good idea. If you're going to launch a business you have to think of yourself as a media company I what was it that inspired you to go out and start just creating all this content like I said the podcast the videos while you did mention and you know there's no denying that this is kind of a second career for me so I was starting a little bit later in life and what I needed more than anything to break into. Speaking business was exposure and one of the biggest bits of advice that I got from some other speakers. Was you've gotta create some exposure for yourself? You've got to get out in the public eye so you can do that by podcasting. You can do that by making a video. Creating content really is is the big buzzword and I think you know that to the whole idea is is creating content so through everything up against the wall so to speak and I do the video blogs and I do the podcasting and of course I do the speaking and and then the next item that kind of goes with that is is writing books and writing from really what moves you. The last couple of years has really been about exposure more than anything else and frankly. I'm not afraid to be in front of the camera and I think that giving off the pier that I'm not afraid to talk on a podcast That that this is it's it's going pretty well. It's working pretty well nice. Yeah because I know that that you've gathered you've gathered an audience on those different platforms and producing content in really glad. That's working for you. I would like to go back to something that you said earlier when you were talking about leadership and You know leadership really is something that I believe as some people had this this innate ability for leadership and for other people you've got to learn but I think for anybody on the planet there's always more to be learned you talked about how you you know you learn a lot from some of your failures as a leader is there. One particular instance where You had a setback as leader. That taught you a very powerful lesson. Yes you can change the names to protect the innocent. I fell into the same trap as a restaurant manager. That many young managers do and that's thinking that the title really is where the respect comes from and all you have to do is open the doors. Hire people in and watch others you know. Make the food deal with the customers and whatnot and that is not the case especially in a customer driven business. One of the biggest lessons that I learned and I actually My Leadership Keno has to do with this story and and my keynote is called. Wash your damned dishes and lessons learned other lessons learned on the power of servant leadership and the biggest lesson that I learned was all. Let me backtrack a little bit. My biggest failure early on was having a lot of turnover I was losing people left right. Turnover is huge in the restaurant. Business or holding onto people is huge so I had to sit back and go. I'm losing people as fast as I'm hiring them eventually. I have to stop looking at me or excuse me I have to stop looking in them and start looking at me. So what I started to do was started to be an example for my employees. I started treating my employees differently. I started serving their needs to a certain level where I took into consideration their personal schedules More than I had done the past rather than just saying these hours. I'm giving you. This is what your work and we kind of worked schedules. I started taking the turns are I started taking my turns on the dirty jobs of a restaurant and that was the biggest thing that included sweeping in mopping floors washing dishes. And once I started to do that. People started responding to me very very differently because they thought you know what dries is willing to do exactly the same things that he's asking us to do. So let's get behind him and from there on my success rate as a restaurant manager changed and went from being mediocre to a little below average to being an excellent manager and episode is brought to you by pet angel adoption and rescue. If you're a pet lover like I am you know. Cats can bring all kinds of joy into your life. They're great companions while you read the newspaper even watching your favorite Netflix show now pet angel adoption and rescue is located in Frankenmuth. They're a no kill catch shelter that diligently works to find homeless kitties loving home. Each cat is fixed vaccinated and microchip before going to there forever and while the cats are waiting for you. They're loved and care for by their superb all volunteer staff so if you want to support pending adoption you can visit them at their patron on page at Patriot. Dot Com slash pet- Angel adopt. Or you can join their community of over ten thousand pet lovers on facebook at angel adopt links in the show notes below and all donations to angel adoption are tax deductible because they are five a one C three nonprofit now back to the show. That's awesome because I'm I'm I'm really a big believer in the fact that you know. Two things is that you know. Culture flows downhill. And the second thing is is you really do have to lead by example so by stepping up and showing that. You're not afraid to do those little chores. Those activities taking out the trash sweeping the floor. Mop in the bathrooms whatever's involved with that are really does. Set the tone for your business absolutely and people respect you way more for it when when you do it like that. Rather than standing standing from above and and making people feel like that year You're to worthy to be able to do those things. So and you know what Cliff that is a idea that is pervasive. Even in some places that you wouldn't expect and it may not be that officers in the Marines. Actually do those things. But they set their soldiers up to succeed based on that principle of all of them being in together and succeeding together rather than being. There's the officers and then there's the soldiers so the Marines. One of the big big influences as far as their ideas and attitude that. I've gotten over time as well if the marines can do it. The rest of US can do it. You know it's interesting. You say that because one of my favorite authors and I pat by his. Podcast is Jukka. Willink I don't know if you've heard of him or not I am Yup. Yeah he is. I got his leadership manual. Probably Bouts six or eight weeks ago and devoured it like three or maybe four days. I thought that was absolutely invaluable. And one of the things that he shared in there. What you keyed on earlier. Was you know he had a commanding officer that came in there? They had a mutiny against him because he was so horrible. The next leader that they got it there they were shell shocked that he would actually take the trash out to the TRASHMAN's yeah they've never. They never seen a commanding officer do that before. And if fired them up a motivated them to start taking pride in where they worked in and how they lived and everything else. So you know you're right there. I think there's a lot of lessons that can be drawn from leadership from the military. No question one of the first podcast one of the first interviews I did was With a retired colonel from the United States Marine. Yeah excuse me colonel. Tom and He's a he's a local guy as well. He's a Michigan Guy Actually Grow up with them and went to school with him but we got back together after many years and he said to me you know the biggest one of the biggest things in the marines soldiers. Eat I that we have to take care the soldiers first because they're the ones you know on the front lines doing the dirty work you know. Being the fighting soldiers that they are and they're the ones who need to be sustained and and we can weaken eight after that. But let's take care of them. I Yes exactly. And and this is probably gonNA sound like a redundant question because you've obviously done a lot of research and the leadership. You have a lot of experience in that arena. Who are some of the leaders that have inspired you over the years? So colonel. Tom Domes definitely one of them and Some of it was because of just seeing him go through his advancement and he went into the Naval Academy from there he went into the marines. He served in Desert Storm and in Afghanistan. And you know the lessons that I've learned talking to him have definitely been an influence. I'm also a sports guy so somebody that if you like sports especially baseball Tito Francona FRANCONA IN IN CLEVELAND. Now but Boston Red Sox and Terry Francona abides by that. I'm with you to some degree. I'm still the boss but you know what we're all in this together and you follow me. I'll take care of you and together. We'll all succeed he. He's been a big influence as well As far as leadership and then some people along the way to my area supervisors or district managers. A lot of people call them as I was a manager in the restaurant world. That knew how to treat me the way that I needed to be treated to be successful. I was not they he he or she was not the type of leader where they make a round hole and expect the square peg to go into it. There was that flexibility as well as them being leaders to understand how I respond to direction and we all succeeded together because of that as well one of the questions that I do want to ask is at the time of this recording and going through this whole covert nineteen and the the president Just yesterday expanded his stay at home order until April thirteenth. There's a lot of people out there that are afraid you know the nerves are just shot and I know at some point in time. We are going to emerge from this for those people that are that are staying home or you know having to deal with us in their family and their kids and a little bit of uncertainty. What from your perspective. What are what are some of the the key lessons that we can take away from this ugly mess while I think that one and nobody in my age group and you know I'm not afraid to say I'm in my fifties have gone through anything like this before right. I mean the last time the world went through something like this was the Spanish flu back in nineteen eighteen through one thousand nine hundred nineteen. So we haven't right yeah. We haven't experienced anything like this but something that I've watched People doing and something that I think is going to be. One of the big lessons that comes from this is really what is valuable and life. What's valuable in life? Is Your family your neighbors your community and really taking care of each other. You hear all these stories now about and my local community. The teachers that are not working right now are going and setting up a places at different schools during the week where the kids who don't have any meals go to you know it's a drive thru situation but they are picking up breakfast and lunch from the teachers who are giving back to their students because you know a lot of these kids just because of their background they don't they don't have meal so that's an example of the community outpouring. That's going on and you hear a lot of those stories and you hear about the professional. Athletes drew brees as an example giving five million dollars of of his own money to help the situation down in New Orleans so there are these stories of people that are giving back because the end of the day this is. I think going to be the biggest lessons. That doesn't matter where you're at in life. What status that you have? This affects everybody. We all need to help each other out through these times and I think I'm hoping that it will last well past where we're at right now. I don't think too much about different sides of the aisle when it comes to politics right now or what people's politics right now. It's really irrelevant. You know. It's it's just taking care of each other right now. Yeah I absolutely have to agree that that's the one thing that I've been seeing more and more with post on facebook on Lincoln even the tone of the commercials on TV has changed where a lot of businesses are you know if they're doing it correctly. They're stepping up and saying. Hey this is how we want to help you and you know and I think that that what we're seeing now is even though we're going through this horrible time. We are also seen examples of humanity at its best. Not Everybody's doing it but I think when you're like you were talking before about the baseball player that donated five million dollars just to help out down in down in Louisiana and there's a ton of other examples. There was something on the news about restaurant tour. I'm trying to. I'm trying to get him on the podcast but the restaurant tour who opens up his restaurant and they're making meals exclusively for first responders. So you know there's so many great examples out there of people that are that are doing really good things and I'm with you. I hope that this I hope this attitude is the new normal. I don't WanNa think that staying home and and being scared to go outside is the new normal. I wanted to believe that you know seeing people come together to help others a lot more than what we were doing before I hope that becomes the no normal absolutely and you know what I think. Deep DOWN INSIDE. I think most people do but we all get You know we all have our path but sometimes the path takes us in a different direction. And sometimes it's the better path so let's just hope as we both agree that things will kind of reset bit when we get back to normal speaking of path you liked to refer to mountain climbing quite a bit in your content so the first question. I got for you is why is why is mountain climbing such an interesting activity or sport for you? Being always been active with sports is still work out quite a bit and once I got back to a point where I could devote some of my own personal time into challenging myself. I started looking at these big boulders. That were you know. Eight ten thousand feet in the air and I thought wow you know what I. I wonder if I can do something like that. So what I found out and the first one that really climbed was in Alaska but I made it was only thirty five hundred feet but that was the hardest thirty five hundred feet that I ever climbed my life flattop mountain for for your listeners. These who've ever been to Anchorage Alaska. That was a tough climb. But there's a certain freedom when you get up to altitude. There's a certain Piece there's a certain calm. There's a certain state of mind that occurs. Kinda naturally the when you get up there. That's May may be climbers high. I really don't know but I think a lot more clear when I get up into those altitude so one of the big lessons that I learned was as I just mentioned sometimes. Those lower climbs are harder than than the the higher altitude climbs. That thirty five hundred foot climb was a lot harder than the seventy two hundred feet that I did in South Dakota and a place called Harney peak. It's just like just like life. Even though the climbs significantly different the smaller ones the smaller challenges actually might be harder than the larger ones. So I kind of equate that mountain climbing into people reaching their goals and there are certain things that happened on a mountain climb that reflect people reaching their goals in life. So I've taken my personal experiences with climbing and and kind of applied that to one of the keynotes notes that I do crush the mountain. Crushed climb crushed the climb baby crush decline. That's IT Freudian slip crushed the client. No worries no worries. What am I going to see that on a t shirt interesting that you say that because my second book actually made some T. shirts that have my sight on it and the title of the book. But I haven't done that on a t shirt yet. Maybe it'll be Hashtag. Crushed the climb. I like that idea even better. I'll I'll give you some residuals on that such a sense. We kinda brainstorm that idea well since you offered. I'M NOT GONNA turn you down. Borough Awesome Excellent L. Jeff thank you so much for your time one last question here if our audience wants to connect with you and and follow what it is. You're doing or check out your youtube videos or listen to your podcast. What are what are some of the best ways people can can get in contact with you? Sure so the ultimate clearinghouse is is. The website draws talks Dot Com D. R. O. Z. Talks DRAWS TALKS DOT com. And you'll find all the information that you need there as far as booking me for an event I have my books available on on the site there. You can get both of the books and you mention them. The top on Amazon. So if you just look them up under my name Jeff Drazen Hausky. Then you'll be able to find them both so you can find those there but if you go to the website then it gets routed to me and then I will send you out a signed copy right from From my home here. So the draws cast podcast is on all your favorite platforms as I'm sure yours is so I- tunes to Stitcher to Pandora too. You know you name it. It's out there and then my youtube channel is the draws the and then the second orders draws Dro's e and that's my youtube channel and you can check out all of my little leadership blogs are Jeff. This has been absolute treat. Thank you so much for your time. Appreciate it and thanks again for you. Know for taking time for us today pledged. Good luck on your podcast. Moving forward and I'll get a hold of me anytime great. Thanks everyone real quick before you bounce if you want to join me on. This journey tillered more from these fascinating community leaders. Then hit the subscribe button at the top of your podcast player and I will catch you in the next episode.
E017 - Alternator Failure
"It clear prop taking over two way. Traffic model college problem runway going off on this is behind the prop with united flight systems. Owner and licensed. Pilot bobby dos. And it's co host major airline captain designated pilot examiner. Wally mulhearn. now let's go behind the prop and what's up wally. Hey bobby how are you. I'm great another episode and this week is going to be about a system. It's going to be part of a system. And i'm sure as many check rides with you. You're fan of the electrical system. I remember it electrical conversation happening in my check ride with you today. We're going to let everyone hear us talk about an alternator failure. How many alternator failures have you had in your aviation career. I have had I've had to alternator failures. One was in a multi. engine airplane. you have to so It's not as big of a deal One was in a single engine airplane which resulted in a total electrical failure It can be a big deal Maybe not such a big deal You know the alternator basically is a battery charger so We deal with this on a daily basis in our personal life and we don't even really know it but pretty much every one of us in our pocket has a cell phone and at some point that cell phone gets plugged into the wall and gets charged and then when we leave our house or our office wherever we unplugged that cell phone and we are Walking around with our cell phone without without being charged so in essence we are walking around with our cell phone having experienced alternator failure and we we learned to manage that Using our cell phones. We know if we're gonna be out for let's just say twelve hours using Your phone without the ability to charge it. You might do things with the phone. You may shut apps down. You may turn off Features on the phone. That use a lot of electricity. I know my phone actually even warns me and it pops up when i get the ten percent says would you like to go to low power mode. Yeah absolutely absolutely. It does that and so We kind of deal with this every day. But when i get in a briefing room on a check ride and we talk about this it seems like just such a foreign concept You know if if you and bobby Go to a baseball game and I looked down at my phone at you know we're in the sixth inning and on down to six percent on my phone i'm probably gonna send The people that i care about that. I'm in touch with a message saying hey i'm about to loose Power on my phone If you really need me contact bobby. Here's his number. So i've established kind of an alternate means of of Of contact. We do that all the time. We do that without even thinking about it. It's just part of our day life. I don't wanna take it for granted but but we both have a little bit of experience and a lot of people. I remember when i was a newly student pilot And i was. I've openly said. I was pretty scared of flying. Not afraid afraid but timid and appreciative of what was going on right were a couple thousand feet in the air right. There's a big fan blowing in front of us Man if i thought about then what i felt like if the power went off the if the plug came undone i'm panicking. I'm i'm really freaking. Let's talk about what all is happening to the aircraft until the electoral system when that alternator stops charging what would put this the immediate effect to the end user. The pilot were aircraft as that alternator stops producing energy. Yeah initially the the result is is nothing. Nothing i mean. Everything is still working we we just were not getting charge to the battery so we have started a time. Clock the the clock that most people will will answer me would When we're when we're talking about check rides is they'll say well. We have thirty minutes of battery life. Well the fact is we don't know how much battery life we We might we might have two hours. We may have ten minutes i i. We don't know but we use the cell phone example. We've all had a cell phone with credit battery. The yeah probably needed to be plugged in a lot more each day. There's some trainers out there. That probably need a little bit more juice everyday right right so we don't know but we do know that we are limited and at some point. That battery is to fail and we will then have a total electrical failure. One thing that. I was demonstrated fairly early on in my training Was to go out to the practice area and my instructor Master switch off. And and after i caught my breath I mean you can read all day that that the engine is still gonna run. But you know when when when he reaches over there and reaches across your lap and hits those two little red switches and flips and down You know after. I gas gasp and realize that. Well he's right. The engine does continue to run and we flew around for few minutes just for the heck of it and he actually demonstrated that. Okay look all your flight instruments the ones that you really care about your pedo. Static instruments airspeed altimeter vertical. Speed your gyroscopic instruments. You're heading indicator your attitude indicator are working. Just fine now. You know you're probably going to lose. fuel gauges Most airplanes you can lose your turn coordinator. Obviously you're going to lose your radios all your avionics One thing People always tell me is They're gonna they're gonna squawk seventy seven hundred with an electrical failure and and you know i pointed out. Well okay good. Good luck doing that It's it's pretty obvious on the newer transponders would with a digital readout. Because you won't see anything to read out so you. It's it's pretty obvious that the transponder is not working but as far as airplane flying a day via are you know the emc conditions Really the airplane is flying. Just fine art there. Some plays out there that may be crop dusters. Whatever that don't have a battery and then the you hand problem and they don't have any power. Yeah i mean the the early early airplanes don't even have electrical system battery to to chart right or no alternator right always having an alternator failure right the one thing that that i think i thought about. My instructor did the same thing for me. They went to the syrian. I was nervous in talking about. We're gonna fall out the sky. And he breached over to the same thing and i panicked. I think the most shocking thing to me was how freaking laude got right. We we no longer had our headsets. We weren't talking so he was screaming at me. See nothing happened. Nothing did happen. The plane kept flying as normal. The electrical system and the battery do nothing to create the spark. Once the magneto turning so the planes should keep running without the battery or an alternator for for as long as you have fuel that that's correct and that is That's excellent point about it getting louder. Most airplanes that we fly nowadays have an intercom system and the intercom is an electrical Component and so with a total electrical failure. You are gonna lose the electrical system so you might as well take the headsets off and and as you said scream at each other because you're not gonna have that ability and and. I encourage instructors to do that with students on a flight. Just get out of The practice area in Show them Demonstrate what it sounds. Like with the headsets off and You know most airplanes have a hand. Michael how would we actually Communicate with a t. See if we just had a A failure of the intercom system. You know do. We have the ability to have a speaker in the airplane. How do we turn the speaker on. And i know we're we're getting off on a tangent a little bit and not really talking about alternator failure but that's something to think about what. What is it like in airplane with with an intercom system failure. Yeah that example was a really good example and and quite frankly when the master switches off. That's exactly the the scenario of the alternator failing and then that battery losing all of its power. The aircraft's can act just like it. Would some five to twenty to thirty minutes later. Whatever that timeline would ultimately be for that battery. You're in the same scenario. So i asked before we started recording. Alaskan again are you. Are you having an emergency at that point and the answer is it just depends Dave emc. i would say no. You're not Imc i would say yeah. You probably are Night that's that's debatable You know obviously if you're using a an electronic form navigation. gps. Be or anything like that. You would You lose that with a with a total electrical system failure. But if you're very familiar with where you are which she should be if you're flying via far You should be okay. You really should be okay and and have some contingency plans maybe. Do you want to continue an extra fifty miles. It may take you another thirty minutes. I don't know i can answer that. The one thing. That when. I when i bring this up in In check ride scenarios is The applicants usually pretty good about talking through shedding On unnecessary electoral electrical equipment. If you've got a number two radio a number two navc com shut that off Certainly if you have some sort of ipad or something plugged in To usb port or the cigarette lighter unplug that to prevent a drain on. They're pretty good about mentioning that Sometimes they're not really that good about Saying i'm going to refer to a checklist and that is really Where we wanna go on this because if we have a systems failure in an airplane in we have a checklist. The talks about or addresses a system spell you that that's what we want to do because in most of these airplanes again the the airplanes that i'm most of the time flying in our our four place Pipers warriors archers that sort of things and cessna one seventy. Two's that's mostly what. I'm flying in to check rides The checklists by and large are going to try to troubleshoot. And try to fix the problem. And gonna try to do a reset of of their relay. And it's going to try to get that alternator back for you and that's the ultimate the ultimate goal g. It quit working. Let's try to make it work in. There is a process in place. And it's it's right in the checklists. All you do is read it and be able to follow the checklist and And you know there are. I i know in in our airplane are one seventy two if we pull the power back for doing slow flight or power off stalls Sometimes are alternator. Does drop off line and just following the procedure and the checklist. We can get right back and it turns into a A a non event right. And and i we talked about your failure. I had a failure with devon miller. Who was on the show really early on He can be found online at family. Pilot devon. And i were outshooting. Practice approaches at nighttime Both instrument rated pilots. Making sure we're staying current proficient and on our last approach back into this airport. Devon notice that the alternator light The levels was on and then that we were. The alternator was zero was not producing any charge anymore And we were probably on a long final probably ten miles out from the airport Pre cova the tower was still open. And we were talking. I think to atc. When i noticed it and we were switched over to tower shortly after we alerted aceites. Atc look we're not having any other issue other than we notice our alternators not producing charge. we're having no issues but we may lose communication with you When you talk about the steps that she would take of course we pulled out. The checklist did our checklist. But what other. Actions like alerting. Atc we've talked about turning some things off would you consider In a number of different scenarios and throw a few obvious ones out at to what for have landing gear. What are you thinking about as a professional pilot while he would be your Assuming it's obviously electrically powered landing will be thinking about Flaps we'll be thinking about the flaps and how we would manage our flaps. You know if we're on ten mile final long final into here And we thought the battery was starting to go do we do we go and put them out or not. Let's talk about. i guess. Those two scenarios first flaps than landing gear. Would you be thinking if you were. Obviously we were in an archer so no powered flaps we we have a handle. But let's assume assessment we have powered flaps. What are you gonna do. Yeah and as i thought about this. I've actually had three alternator failures. I i had forgotten about this. This other one's trying to show me up now. He's got three now. yeah one was in a bonanza. I was by myself Vmc conditions Wasn't a cloud in the sky so whether it was not an issue at all as about fifty miles from my death my destination and So about about twenty minutes. Maybe twenty to twenty five minutes out. And i got an indication of an alternator failure So i immediately pulled out the checklist in went through the troubleshooting and i was not able to get the alternator back so here i am working on battery. Power in Did did address shutting off on necessarily electrical equipment and in in this case it was daytime. So i shut off all the lights that i had on. I shut off my number two Nab tom Left my Gps going which in this particular airplane The gps had its own internal backup battery Being charged to the electrical system. But i knew that. If i had a total electrical failure i would still have that available to me But anyway about fifty miles out I called up approach control was going to a airport that had a terse And so i was out of their their Radar coverage. But i but i called them up and told him i was fifty miles out and i was coming in that. I had an electric an alternator failure. And that i may lose my ability to communicate with them so Immediately they cleared to land. I'm fifty miles out. Twenty five minutes out. I was heading northeast. And they cleared me to land straight into runway for. I is going into manure louisiana. A said kay. You're cleared land runway for and So i did a couple of things i also. I asked him what the phone number was for the tower and they gave me the phone number and i it in my phone so i knew okay if i get down low enough and i really need to communicate with them. I can call him up on my telephone. I have a you know bluetooth headset. So i could speak to him through the headset My next thought was all right. What about my gear I've gone electric driven gear I wanna make sure the gear is down. But i knew i have the manual gear extension ability but the thing that i really wanted to get was i wanted to get a green light before i lost my electrical system so i made the determination debt about thirty miles out. I was going to go ahead and lower the gear. My thought process. Was i probably still had enough power at that point and it would give me enough time to Do a manual gear extension and still aimed toward the airport. So about thirty miles out. I went ahead and extended the gear. And i got. I got green lights. So i was happy that that the gear was down And then i. I you know my thought was well. What about flaps well I went ahead and put the flaps down and made a normal landing using the normal flap setting and lo and behold. I never lost anything. I taxi. dune would the Being able to talk to tower and talk to ground it was ended up being a non event. But i had all these things in my back pocket. Had i needed them. The one thing that We we see on check. Rides is You know if we do have total electrical failure. Obviously it's in a electrically flap driven airplane. It's going to be a flaps up landing the older airplanes quite frankly anything before about nine hundred eighty. There is probably no data in the performance. Section that addresses no flaps If you look at the newer one seventy twos. And i say newer. I'm talking eighty one. Eighty one and newer There is if you go to the short field landing distance chart which is the only landing distance chart that is in in there. It's a short field landing this chart There's a note. There are actually four notes on the bottom. If you look the older airplanes there are three notes but about nineteen eighty-one. There's a fourth note. The fourth note says For no flaps at thirty five percent landing distance and between seven and nine knots to your approach speed so you know most people Most of these airplanes call for about sixty one to sixty three not somewhere in there and most people probably fly more like sixty five So according to this book is telling you to come in about seventy knots and at thirty five percent to your distance and few when you look at The landing chart at sea level the landing distance is is usually some six hundred feet so adding another thirty five percent. You're still below thousand feet but it is something to consider Especially you get into multi engine airplanes. You get into a beach barron or something and you have a total electrical failure. And you're going to have to land with no flaps. How much more runway or we're going to need to. I want to go into that. Thirty five hundred foot runway with flaps in this airplane. Well that might be in a situation where you might want to consider the the airport down the road. That's got seventy five hundred feet rather nearly five hundred feet. And let's assume you you're an assessment and there's still far but it is a really short runway and you're concerned about distance. Would you put ten out or would would you would use all of it if you had some battery left. He did in your example. I'm just curious. What would the guidance be for a student or a private pilot if they had a short field that they really get. Would you use ten because you could go round with ten. I honestly wouldn't go ever twenty in. That can scenario because i could be stuck at twenty need. Go round and have a real problem. That that's the thing is that When you when you put the flaps out of the flat mode or is a fairly high draw item on the electrical system. And if you're going to drain a battery it's gonna drain when you're putting a drawn it. So by putting the flaps out you're taking the chance that You may lose the the total electrical system after the flaps her out and now you can't retract them so A consideration especially if you're having to doing an instrument approach a where you think you may have to go around and go to an alternate. I know we're talking about a really bad day. An electrical failure going around having to go to an alternate airport That that definitely classifies as a bad day but you know a consideration may be. I'm just going to do a preemptive strike. And i'm just gonna make this whole flap landing again You know even know flaps a one seventy two for a sea level airport Sort of a a standard just a little bit warmer than a standard day Still looking at less than a thousand feet and most of us aren't flying into airports with less than a thousand foot runway. And i. I've heard it. I've heard in the hallways of her people say to me. The the initial thought process is is land as soon as possible. I gotta get on the ground. This is in a follow sky. We talked about you. Flying another fifty miles. I might not go two hundred miles. I might not go fifty miles There's all kinds of scenarios we could say varies. But the think you need to divert and land right away that the first thing you're gonna be thinking no. It's not the first thing. The first thing i'm going to be thinking about is trying to to get that alternator back and That's what the checklist will probably have. You lead legion to basically a reset process a reboot. I mean we going back to our cell. Phones are cell phones. Start doing weird things. First thing we do is rebooted and start over again and most of the time that fixes the problem. But the checklists most of the checklists will say land as soon as practical. So what does that mean. Well if i've got an airport that's my if my destination is thirty miles away and and my divert airport is twenty five miles away And i'm familiar with my destination airport. And maybe i haven't been there but i've familiar with what runways I've got all the frequencies written down on my flight plan for it I'm familiar as as familiar as i can be with that airport So going to an airport. That's just five miles shorter I you know. Every every situation is different but Don't don't be predisposed to having to divert to the nearest airport. That most checklist do not say land as soon as possible. They say land as soon as practical. So that's a great probably best practice a couple of other best practices. Obviously we think about batteries and other sources when we're probably flying nighttime where we we know. We don't have another another way to see something. We should have flashlights headlamps at nighttime all the time but this is a time where i think we definitely want different data. Extra batteries ever want to be able to take the ipad out of the console and put it into a another source. What other things would we consider. The might be helpful to us in in a in a situation where we're losing the ultimate. Well you know the one thing that that is is is. I think is important is to to keep your stuff charged. I've i. I fly a lot of people and i'll maybe they're using an ipad and i look over there and i see I say you know how's your. What's your battery go. we're good. I'm at i'm it Fifty one percent in I think well why why wouldn't if we have the ability to charge in the airplane. Why wouldn't we be keeping that charge. because a one hundred percent ipad is gonna last longer than a fifty percent ipad. So just be prepared. Keep everything charged. You know as well as you can. I think most of us would rather take off with full rather than half. You'll even though half you'll may get us to our destination and and plenty you know with plenty of fuel plenty of reserves and safely. But i think most of us would say. I prefer full fuel. We'll think of think of the the chargeability of all your devices as as fuel if you can keep it full. Let's keep it full yet. You made me think of a lesson. I learned from one of my searchers which was never never use less than the full runway right. Why would i ever take off with. Fifty one percent of the runway available right when i just go down there and get one hundred percent of it so Good pilots don't use fifty one percent of their batteries and they don't use fifty one percent of the runways right either so hopefully enjoy this episode all about the alternator failure and while he's had three i've had one. It's going to happen to you probably in your flying career if you fly planes with electrical systems at all And there's there's not a reason to panic. There's a reason to use good judgment. There's a reason to have a plan and implement the checklist usage. And then that plan to make sure you make a good decision on whether you divert turn go back. A land of as fast as possible practically possible so Hopefully took something away from today's episode as always fly safe and stay behind the prompt. Thanks for checking out the behind the prop podcast be sure to click. Subscribe at check us out online at behind the prop dot com behind the prop is recorded in houston texas creator and host is bobby dos. Co host is wally maltman. The show is for entertainment purposes only and is not meant to replace actual flight instruction. Thanks for listening and remember fly safe.
OBI: Special interview with Austin Gayle of Pro Football Focus
"I'm Songwriter Charlie. Harding and I'm use ecology made Sloan or the host of switched on Papa podcasts about the making and meaning of popular music every week Charlie and I breakdown. The most interesting hits trends artists to understand what they're doing what they're saying and why the songs are so infectious. We've recently broken down. Billy eyelashes music with her brother and collaborator phileas dissecting chance the rapper with Super Producer. Oak felder and covered everything from Dolly. Parton to Travis. Scott if you love music you're going to discover something ear opening in switched on pop so join US search for switched on pop in your favorite podcast APP and listen to an episode about your favorite artists and subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. Spotify or wherever you're listening to get new music explainers every week and after listening you might want to check out. Our new book switched on Pop. How POPULAR MUSIC. Works and why it matters at your favorite bookseller. Thanks this is the orange black insider bengals podcast. Thanks for listening to this special episode. Where John Sharon is interviewing gail from pro football focus enjoy so just just tell us what what your role is here. Pf affect how long you been here and really is all about to you. Sir. I'm the associate director of content here at PF. So working directly alongside George to Hurry. Who's director of content and Research and development who I think is both of us manage the content European trying to create awesome content for consumers. There's this whole other side to pf that is B. Two B. Business business sales working with the NFL teams NCWA teams agents Metro area. Those guys those you know those consumers clients but there's this other side too. I mean the cyber. You're probably more familiar within the consumer side where we're selling. Subscriptions access towards schools are fantasy tools betting tools alongside you know advanced statistics and things like that in addition to creating content for for free unpaid users non-subscribers and creating that content is very important. There's there's all the way down to. Who's editing at? Who's writing at George collectively managed the team that is writing the content putting videos on Youtube. Putting you know social media strategies together and stuff like that so it's it's a complex role to allow things where hats but it's a lot of fun and in addition to managing it. I do contribute to the continents. Well Mike Grant and I do the podcast to foreign drafts. That is a lot of fun. I also right when I do find time and some social media stuff here and there but again it's a lot of it's on that content side very fun get to the room mean stuff it which teams trooper. Joe Byrne who doesn't want to play for the bengals. I don't think I don't know I'm not buying into this whole he doesn't WanNa play through the bengals. I don't think I my take on. It is and I was having this conversation with George yesterday. You Know Joe Brough to say bengals lock. It feels like lock. Schefter reported multiple times. This is something that we've miserable right in sharpy maybe tattooed on our chest at this point. You're going to Cincinnati bengals. I think the next step is building around him because setting real expectations for job. Were going to sit say mingles with existing offense applying the idea that AJ Green Moon. No longer be their defense. That's going to give up some points knowing that that lack of town will be there to get to set moderate expectations for job row. And to everything in your power as in that in that personnel staff to add around him get John Williams healthy add to the interior offensive line. Bring in receivers that can separate. I didn't put in. I think Zack Taylor. I will say this. We'll do a very good job with jober. I was really impressed how he approached the game last year. I think a lot of data driven decisions and how he structured his personnel randy ran a ton of eleven personnel most of the League it from a percentage standpoint and I think he was effective in limiting time to throw any Dalton was tied for first time to throw Bengals quarterbacks rectify I in lowest time we throw because new liner scrap and him being self aware him. Understanding the strengths and weaknesses of his roster is a great sign for instance. I've angels. There are a ton of other offensive coaches often. Playcallers wouldn't have done. That wouldn't have looked at that offensive line. Seen it as a weakness and done things Zack. Taylor did to try and make that better so I think I'm really happy with what's activists doing. I'm really happy with what you have to be happy with as if you are bengals fan. Happy with what's active bringing to the table on the next step is the people that do make those personnel decisions that do decide whether or not draft sample in the second round need to approach this draft and approach this free agency knowing bring in Joe Bro and they need to build around him. Yes like the narratives about the bengals. I mean the victim. organizational standpoint but in terms of like comparing them to teams. I haven't had a lot success. Like the lions the Redskins the Jaguars. They're they're more prone to spend money which means they're more easier to sell like they want to win now so in terms of Burgoyne the bengals what what makes him so special where he can make the compete immediately. Because you have Tom Roster but like you said. There's a lot more that they can do to build around him. Yeah I think he's arguably the best quarterback prospect we seen in the in the years of grading we've done concept piff started grading every player in the FBI in two thousand fourteen and before it was Baker Mayfield and the best accuracy we have ever seen. We do ball location charting for every college quarterback in in college football. And we've been doing math the past three years now. Baker Mayfield on ten plus yard drove had like over sixty six percent of his throws his accurate- accurately charge something. We'd never seen before. It was a big reason why we had him as the number one overall pick that entire draft. Joe Barreau over seventy percent. I mean this guy is on an accuracy level that we haven't seen in accuracy is one of the few metrics or that do does offer some stability your urine from college to pro something that when you remove other variables like scheme supporting cast opposing defenses. Accuracy shows up regardless of those things for that reason that limited variability limited volatility is very badly. You can predict that job will be one of the more accurate quarterbacks in the NFL would also job row does well is performed performance of high level from a clean pocket part of Edison's maturity his pocket presence ability to see pressure coming and understand to get the ball out and would not sue but a lot of that too is just being very good when the situation is clean. And that's something. When you project to the next level you can feel comfortable about the stability of that play. That's another thing with Baker Mayfield. That we confident about because his clean pocket passing performance so good job rural best citizen. We've ever seen from a clean pocket. I think Joe what separates Joe Barreau from these other. Quarterback prospects is that presence. We had concerns about Baker. Mayfield coming into that dropbox. Pawprints bail out clean pockets. See some Phantom pressure make some poor decisions under pressure. Those things job rose and have that and for that reason you have to be really excited what he can do. Even in those situations that are great. He can create outside of structure. He can add above expectation outside the pocket. And when you have a quarterback like that as your office we see now. I'm not making the comparison of home because quarterbacks like Russell Wilson Patrick mahomes those who can do a lot of great things from the play breaks down or when they need to add above expectation outside structure. Joe Bro not in that level yet. They won't be patched mahomes rookie but you seen that upside at the college level. Right and those penalties Because creates such is so much more important now than it. Was You know five years ago? It's not more of looking at the prototypical pocket for banks for more looking guys. Who can make plays bring down? And you want to catch Russell Wilson to do this structure but in terms of a birth profiles or really that maybe now people know that Points towards the Dirksen. The he can come. Come Yeah I think the thing that points it out. As his grading outside the pocket his grading late in the snap we've look at grades gray differentials in his grade on throws within two point five seconds of the snap versus grades on throws two point six seconds after he does a good job when the play is extended pushing the ball down field and the reason those plays are valuable. I think this gets missed. Sometimes is when the play breaks down the coverage breaks down and big plays or to be had. If you have the arm town you have the vision. You have the ability to get outside Aachen. Push the ball downfield. That's win like you saw on that. Thirteen fifteen or whatever was in the super bowl breaks down a little bit patch. Mahomes able to extend it just enough to get the ball over the top. Two tyreek Hill. Big Place happened when the plane breaks down. And that's why that is important. It's not like you need to create structure to get the dump off. That's not the case or the check down. The thing is when the play breaks down coverage you'll goes into scramble. Drill gives the advantage to the receiver. And if you have a quarterback that's capable of keeping his eyes downfield with enough arm town of All. Downfield Dash when you can steal. Those explosive plays from the defense on the play that otherwise a quarterback sack makes a bad decision offers. Check down throwaway on those plays at given the defense you can steal those plays back and actually still explosive plays. If you're on a switch the conversation more towards more towards visual value you guys just kind of release the place from prosecutors this December. What have you learned the most about positional on both sides of the ball and if you had explained like Woodrow Place Mobile Guard Somebody? Would you go about doing yeah? That's a great question. I think I have to take my cat. I to Dr Eric. Eager data scientists with us here. Who's done a lot of the work behind wins but replacement for PF? Also George to hurry. Who is our director of Research and Development? He is done a massive fantastic job of managing doctor eager and also some other guys on his staff team risque who on twitter's PF underscore move. But he did the german-born mobster. This guy is brilliant. And we've we've added some absolutely fantastic talented members to our research and development team guys. That aren't always writing content always in the public face but what they do behind the scenes in what they do for us to Europe F. Very capture them. But what I've learned really from Wadsworth. Replacement is in front of positional value standpoint affect the passing game. If you positively affect the passing game with any level of consistency you're going to rank high in wins. Buffet placement and for that reason the quarterback position which dictates what happens on eighty sixty eighty percent. Place is obviously going to rank higher compared acquisitions. I don't think that's a newfound thing. I mean how much they matter is. Maybe something that's new. But knowing that they matter the most is not necessarily knew what we found after that is positions that do affect the passing game like wide receiver. Cornerback start to come up closely after quarterback because they have again a very direct relationship with how the passing game warming in another thing that we did learn is pass rush coverage debate and something that we came out with. I think late last year or even early last year talking about what's more important the pass rush or coverage and we found that while pictures more stable. You can predict a good patch better than you can predict a good cornerback year over year. It's not as valuable in the moment quarterback play in specifically coverage. Play is much more bad. The problem is it's more volatile. It's hard to predict a coverage to having similar success. You're you're even game over game because of so many factors that play but if you have coverage unit is more valuable than a good pass rushing unit. That's something I think. Winsborough replacement without it. We couldn't decide to go back to the last part of that. The garnishing wins replacement. Because WH- a big part of Rose's place to understanding replacement lump and replacement level for each positions. Different replacement level for quarterback is much lower than replacement level for guard in terms of getting above replacing level. A guard is very very difficult because we have to. You have to add so much in the passing game holding penalties can destroy false. Starts these things. And it's so hard to recruit recruit that value when you make those penalties knowing like you can have your five yards ten yards loss play but it's so hard for a guard that game that back and I think we've seen that regard and tackle and center all the of Liming like you committing penalties that have direct relationships two losses of ten yards and things like that while to get that back. You're going to need to make several impact blocks in the whole. You're going to need to not allow pressures for one hundred two hundred pass blocking snatch just to recruit your value base up. That's significant negative that you can have in your game and I. It is difficult to explain. But all of it is based on her play by play grading. Which if you're not familiar with we great every player on every play at the NFL college xfl level even the AF. We've done some highschool soft from negative positive every player and every play negritude positive that zero in the middle of that being an expected. Play in negative tubing horsing. You've ever seen something atrocious. Something that you really can't take back into being an example being Eli Manning sorta Mario Super Bowl situationally and all those things very high difficulty throw and that play-by-play grading is really heavily into wins book. Placement let us know value of the player. I think this position Goffin's align put together saw this interesting debate because it really like one bad player on the unit can make the whole to designate. It really comes to interesting perspective of. How do you build a house attacking me free agency at how these guards getting thirteen? You know. Thirteen fourteen million dollars in approaching tackle of money. So in your opinion the best way to build off into line for has multiple holes like the banks for example like would you advise him the Guardian and get one of these branches or maybe more focus on the draft as more cost effective way of doing that. Yeah that's a great question. It's something that we've talked about a ton this off season. I think from a value standpoint. It's outside and tackle guard center because the tackles have more more susceptible allowing pressures. That's a big part and when you're more susceptible allowing pressures you're going to have either a highly positive or negative effect on the passing game as opposed to guards incentives but free agency. If you need to win now is the way to go for off. It's my we see time and time again. People fill need in the draft. I want to fill need. We need off tackle. We need a car. I'll tell you right now. The best rookie guards do not great. Above seventy seventy five in their first first one unless it's unless you have like this generational which we call like hot. You can't miss type of player but like look at this past year or one of the highest grade of tackles. John Taylor. Florida Guide for Florida for Florida. Prospect for your sixty nine grade. And that's how good rookie often tackles usually are the best ones. Eddie's position that's why. Pf says this all time. Don't draft draft draft the best players available because you rarely find that though. You need this position. He's rarely can have a positive enough impact. Like at what? Nick boasted. At edge defender is very after him. Josh Allen Brian Burns clean for all. Do not have come close to the impact that nick boasts adage rare to see rookie heavy impact that Nick Bosa or say like a Quin Nelson had a few years ago and the Cincinnati. Bangles are a young team. That is rebuilding. It's not a team. That's any wind now window. I would say I don't think that's a hot take but with that being said investing in your office line in the draft is never is never a bad thing to do. The problem is is when you force it do not force it at the top around to do not force any position at any of these rounds draft player bill because there are enough holes across the across the board along that roster to where you can afford to go a different positions. However if you're looking for help along the offensive line now whether the bengals should do that is up for debate if you are free agency. Is that option? You more often see positive. Impact high impact players at the offense wine gets signed him the frequency than you do see them come in. It's like Oh man. We just drafted this tackle. And He's already a top fifteen tack. That doesn't happen often and it won't happen a even with the topic last. We have here Tristan. Worse Jesuit Wills Andrew. Thomas Josh Jones of Houston is as law for those guys. Go in the first round and all four of those guys could suck in your water because their inexperience. They're younger players. Outside of Jobs Jones just worse just turned twenty one and underclass. Jack Wills I think is still twenty years old like you do not develop you do not mature at a very tough. Greet -sition off. Its Line until you are play to twenty three. It's a big reason. Why don't riser has had so much success as a rookie guys like twenty four years old commander? Kansas state already mature or physician where he can go toe to toe with. Some of these guys tackled. Kansas state kicked into guard for the Denver broncos in was one of the highest grader. Rookie guards this past season. And even then don't think he'd Crack Crack top twenty among other veterans. Hi I'm Dave Fox. Senior editor vulture and host of the PODCAST. Good one a podcast about jokes. Every week I interview comedian writer performer. About one of their jokes the joke income from their stand up special Saturday night live sketch or song or even a book. We break down the joke and figure out how it works. What inspired it and what it says about their sense of humor for comedy fans. It's a serious discussion about the craft of jokes and for interview fans. It's a really funny conversation between two people who have a lot to say about comedy. Profanities selected vice. Podcasts might not be exactly what you're looking for for. Maybe it's something to talk about. After all that sex. Your habit new episodes a good one come on every Tuesday. Starting February twenty fifth. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. Or in your favorite podcast APP from vulture in the VOX media PODCAST NETWORK. Have a good one charges. More announced novels lines bengals since been linebackers and linebackers. More has been more of a constant problem for the department decade and in in terms of values. Well even for the the Bengals who just cannot seem to hit on is in line bekker's and just neglect entirely even positional value but linebacker. That doesn't match up. A cornerback defense then would you advising desperately needs them to just over invest in that position or about better. I think it's about drastic better. I talked to Dan more recently asked. What's the big need for the Bengals? And he was expecting after quarterback. Expecting ME TO SAY LINEBACKER. I said Corner. Because corners of higher positional value. William Jackson has not been the same guy says twenty seventeen. You don't have a ton of value in draper. Patrick who could be cut this off season. I mean you need cornerback. More than linebacker even has been a constant problem for the bengals. But I'll say this. Not a ton of teams have great off ball linebackers right now look at the Kansas City chiefs. You're not talking about their linebacker. Look San Francisco forty nine ers. Drake green-lighting was former undrafted or day. Three pick and they alexander to high money but he was injured for most of that season. And then you have for Warner who is a freak athlete? I think that gets the one x pointed awful linebacker find athletes at that position. If you are drafting or finding them in free agency go after. Guys that are on the Skinnier side that are two hundred forty two hundred thirty five pounds. A guy that comes to mind is keen Dave state linebacker in this class. It's GONNA probably way into thirty-five Navy. Hey HITS TO FORTY. Said told me at senior bowl. He's trying to eat like six thousand calories a day to get up there but I was talking to drew tranquil former Notre Dame linebacker annapolis with the chargers before he was drafted and he was tagged as under socks and I asked him. You know what to coaches bring up in that regard. He says you honestly their autonomy teams. They want me to lose weight. There are a ton of teams. We play linebackers at two twenty. Because how important coverages and I think for that reason. There aren't a ton of top to your talents awful linebacker in the NFL right now. Look equally one of the best. If not be best just recently retired after that I mean we could argue Bobby Wagner is up there Joe Schober. Soon be a free agent but after that it's hard to find like the lead players at linebacker because the position and its importance and its responsibilities has changed so significantly in the last ten years the need to defend. The Ron is not as important need to play. Coverage is so much more important. I think changing responsibility that change in assignment for up linebackers. He's created this kind of gap in talent in the NFL. It's hard to find a good one. And for that reason. You see some forcing need Pittsburgh. Steelers trading up for Devon Bush and him not playing well out of the gate but they treated him for an African. Ac I ran forth so those are the guys that you invest in and get back to Cincinnati bengals. Linebacker is isn't a particularly great linebacker class. Not One where you really want to force it in this one and you think about Patrick Lena. Lsu Is as soon as we gone after they do take job euro. But that's pretty. Well Issue Kenneth Ray of Oklahoma. Those guys speed. They're still very raw. Keith Davis Gazers Guy on day two you start to feel comfortable with do not that position over better players. Just don't especially in this class an agency. There are some options. Maybe you go for your Sherbert Blake. Martinez you can go off. Linebacker plug in but again prioritized positions of high positional value. Defense gets back so the bengals coach down the senior boom. We solve the Insurance Church of jumping grounded for the south team. Rarely played them more often. Which obviously you didn't have a lot of experience in Florida. But with with their they can't change the scheme. We went into offense. The you know. Try to purchase less linebackers. Chudy must linebackers on the field. So it'll week linebacker class. How do you project what the exact bond like a huge who maybe more size of conflict well in the play multiple fronts as well? I think we're GONNA see a lot. More Zach Bon Josh. Yuki cow boy types these guys that can play off ball linebacker to paint or maybe on passing downs. Primary passing out but also rush the passer at a high level because that position is becoming a ton of value adding athletes to your defense is is has a ton of Diet that Bonn Joshua. Cheer two of those guys. I could see those guys working in creative defense games. Like what Don Wink Martindale rows with the Baltimore Ravens eat you know? He doesn't have a star linebacker but he has guys that can blitz. He has guys that can get down. On the line of scrimmage and do different things. I think that's creative. Defensive coordinators just like creative offensive coordinators are offer a ton of value in today's NFL. If you're willing to get creative and find new ways to get athletes on the football field and use people in different ways from an assignment standpoint. That's where you're going to see a bag. I didn't exactly on Joshu. Don't bring them in. Just play traditional four three play-off linebacker snap. If you're going to bring in a guy like that you need to get creative with his role. That's what the Bangles are at. And they have someone play second manage that process. I think it's a huge huge loss. Sure and I ended on more conceptual question suggests dot the whole process. You know we prioritize on signature stats and you get more context and more the box worse. That's what is one traditional box for stat on. Both really. That does not really predict your success. You kind of wish the public would wait a little bit less. Yeah I I think the offensive side of the ball trying to think of maybe one that I hate the most I I mean I mean we think about for like maybe five years ago snatched played was something offensive Lineman unit was. That was a big thing. Oh yes eight starts over. Six thirty two starts in two years or something. Bat is something that does not predict future success and another thing on office. I've only guards per carry yards per touch some of those metrics kind of outdated especially when you compare yards after contact first yards before contact. I think total receptions total receiving yards can also have filled some fo production depending on alignment How often screens look at a guy up his Brian Edmund South Carolina receiver who a lot of people like for its production breakout rating. Wherever the hell they're coming up with now but forty percent of his. Overflowing percentage targets were screens over. Sixty percent of his production comes on targets. Within five yards. Long scrimmage there there's context to these large wholesale numbers receiving yards receptions that needs to be understood to understand the value of a certain player position. Defensively there's a talk I mean sacks do not predict future success like total pressures or pressure eight parish win percentage and things like that advantix not just pf acts ESPN is looking at Patras win rate football outsiders etc another one tackles tap great ninety three leagues for fantasy but tackles do not predict future outcomes. I mean you can look at a handful. I in addition to not being predictive tackles or not descriptive of successive current players. I mean having over one hundred tackles off ball. Linebacker used to be a feat. Used to be something that was indicative success. Now you know. How often did you play? And how can we beat coverage you look at you look at linebackers? That have a ton of tackles means. You're allowing sessions. I think it's Darius Leonard. His rookie year was highly the tackle number that he had his rookie was absurd. But you also allow receptions in coverage and we do allow receptions and coverage. You're a lot closer. Balling getting tackles tackles is another number that people put too much stock in. Sometimes I think the tackles conversation. That's called a lot because I'm one who who values mortgage a certain extent and so Margaret shares is a thing for linebackers and you look at like the past great middle. Pro Bowl publicity. They tend to have you know high market share in college. Well when he goes to the. Nfl is more about context. Do you think there's going to be like subway to a guy who's constantly run the ball because more targets perimeters more stops and cover stops as well one hundred percent. I think there's definitely there's definitely some that success. I just don't think the overall tackle number something we should pound are found table for. I think market share. I think it's getting closer thing about this guy was around the ball more often than the rest of his team or anything like that. I think there's also I also can get on board with a lot of the marketer receivers you know looking at a receiver that eight hundred yards in an offense that only pass for two thousand as opposed to a fourteen hundred new receiver in an offensive. Pass for five thousand. That is those are. Those are good context. I'm presenting market. Share is one of those ones. They can have some predictive power level and also with taxes to be remissed if I didn't talk about Has Blocking remark ingredient because it seems like for the most part? I think you're gonNA system does a great job of giving us a good. You Know Thirty. Five hundred foot view of our players in terms of workplace. He plays and just seems like the line gets a lot of controversy with numerous more sort of guys so disturbed. Would you say that offense lime get more context in terms of like their traits rather than just production is there more context in their evaluation of their grading than other positions just basically the same production? Honestly honestly I didn't traits are are very important especially when you're valuating from the couch civil pros because you're traits translate that's the thing why traits originally or have been the longest time than scattered at such traits. Translate a guy that's six ecology it guess what is six six in the NFL. There's something to that stability to it that you can feel comfortable with like ten yards splits. Four dash vertical all that stuff translates the next go away. There seems like production at college does not translate to the NFL all the time at a high percentage. If you have a thousand yards receiving in college it doesn't mean you're gonNA have a thousand yards receiving in the NFL. I think that the stability and traits has led to cover ability. However we've got better. Pf specifically has gotten better at production valuing production in grading in doing adding more context box. I asked where production can actually have predictive power at the next level. Our offensive line and defensive line grades are probably by play grades as some of the highest predictive power grids we have your in the NFL and going for college pro because we've done such a great job of turning offensive line plane blind play to kind of this. Binary win-loss type of thing looking at do you lose the block to win the block and obviously it's perfect. I mean none of it is perfect and a lot of mistakes and all data. I mean even tackles gets you know. There's some data but what matters is how predictive is it? And we've seen it have predictive power that a lot of other things on line. Four Yard Dash time all those things and for that reason we start to place confidence in it. We don't play confidence in our grades unless they do offer some former predictive power and if they don't change the process we try to improve. We try and find other data points to collect and I think that's something that gets lost in kind of the controversy with PF and these nerds. That are just watching tape. I mean we're constantly looking at the value of these numbers. Were not throwing out at eighty eight point eight grade unless you feel confident about it having some type of value whether it is descriptive or predictive. Yeah for sure and I think with the comic over a good time to ask in terms of finalizing the Drakkar. Mcrae's how much does that because obviously most of your stuff is production base but how much does athleticism for specific for services. Go into the final grade and help you see them for the NFL. It's massive. I'll say it right now. It's massive our doctor era geared of tip to go back to this guy. This guy right now is working our college to projections that. Were currently working to provide. Nfl teams about you. Know what certain things you know translates the next solo translate to success at the next level and we're putting together a currently an athletic score using the COMBI measures prochet measurable. 's All those things. That has predictive power. We see it a term positions more than others like edge defender receiver like getting athletes. These key positions. You see translating success at the next level. That's why it is very important. It's not necessarily important to scout and have your your stop watch out in the stands but it is important. Take it into account. Because you're you look at it as like a percentile of a percentile of success. That next level. You're drafting players. Hoping he reaches his ninety nine th percentile but a player as ninety nine percentile. Lot Different player vs player as a better athlete. And you can move your window of success higher if you're if you're a better athlete if you have better size better measurable while you're Window Bahir however where the window comes down. This guy has all the tools in the world all the traits in the world but none of the production because he's whatever for whatever reason while this guy doesn't have those traits can reach to where that guy could be because he's better from a production standpoint. I think thinking about players in their evaluations as it's like window of outcomes like this window of outcomes for like let's say like Trista works. The Window of outcomes for attrition works. He has a higher higher ceiling than other players. That don't have his athleticism. Don't have his raw strength the power but he is his floor lower than some of these other guys ceiling. Possibly I mean I think it's important to look at evaluation like that look at player evaluation as hey. There's a window of outcomes or over a box of outcomes with this player. This guy has a higher ceiling. This guy is a lot lower floor. I think there's value in those terms and looking at it in that way. One final question so just plain simple. Three broad stuff's going to follow this off season. Okay I think it is drafting. Borough versus devas draft over. I think it's been over thought because you know in south Sudan. People WanNa talk about something. Should they train for what about her impresses and senior bowl? There's a lot of things that can happen. You know and people want to talk about our people want to create but thanks first steps draft Joe Brough to I think it's approach the next round of the draft by dragging the best player available within. Mind that you're building around your world build around him bit. Add players at talent that is going to create a better situation for this new quarterback and I think and free agency. I think it's don't spend big. Don't you don't to spend big twin? Spend in the right ways and you have to be under understand what you'd be creative with how you develop these contracts be creative with how you use that money so you avoid getting locked into bigger deals locked in the deal that you won't see if I could add a fourth step. It is approached the offseason with you. Know with not super high expectation. Approach Twenty twenty with low expectations compared to like people think job rose taking them the super bowl next year. I think going into this next season with understanding. You know understanding where your current situation is knowing that the expectations should not set sixteen. Ano- I think is important because it also allows you to find wins fines. Find some wins in the schedule. Even if it does become a six eight win of season I think setting proper expectations working on player violation building around job rope making sure journal waves as healthy as porn. We hope you enjoyed this special interview with Austin Gail from pro. Football focus on the orange and black insider bengals podcast. We appreciate you tuning in and keep it to us for other special interviews coming down. The road are thanks to Austin and to Pro Football. Focus for their time.
Yosemite National Park 009
"You're listening to the RV homeschool podcast where we make travel educational and fun. Grab your shades to do some California dreaming as we head to Yosemite Semisi National Park Thank you for listening to the RB. Homeschool podcast I'm your host amber. Stephen we are a family family of four with two elementary age daughters that travel the US and Canada in our Jaco. Seneca so we have a big rig we tow a jeep behind us and we love traveling to the national parks. Were actually trying to bring our girls to all of the national parks before they head off to college And since they're only seven and eight. We have a little bit of time to get that done. We love reporting about the different tips and tricks that we learned from our travels and so hopefully by bringing that to you. It can make your travels much easier so today we are talking about Yosemite National Park. There's so many wonderful things about Yosemite National Park That you're going to to love John Muir said this of the Sierra Nevada's which is the mountain range where it's at what he described the Sierras as clean pure and full of divine bovine lessons which is an excellent way to describe it Yosemite Valley and the Mariposa Grove are also one of the first areas that were protected affected by the federal government for the enjoyment of the people and this actually happened back in eighteen sixty four with the semi grant which was signed into power by Abraham Him Lincoln so this area has actually been protected for a very long time. It's of course not the first national park technically that yellowstone but it still was was one of the first that was protected in terms of a government protected area. That's meant for everyone to enjoy and kept for many years for people to enjoy so that is really cool as well and Yosemite was the place that really I think. Motivated President Theodore Roosevelt to put in place all the protections and the and the laws antiquity act in order to protect federal areas and national parks and kind of make all of that reality galaxy and that was part of a camping trip where he came out to meet with John Muir after reading some of his writings about Yosemite area and the different areas down there and you went out for this four day camping trip and Legend has it. He ditched his Secret Service or protection at the time and just headed with Moore and they camped out under the stars and he loved up to the area he got to see where the groves were they went down into the Mariposa Grove. He got to see where the demolishing of some of that was happening with the redwoods being cut down and This acquaint being cut down so it really was a motivating time for him then to come back and put some different protections into place he also also made Yosemite an official national park at that time too so that was something that Roosevelt actually did. So there's a lot of reasons to see it a lot of cool history behind it and it's absolutely beautiful once when I was on my instagram feed and I just asked people what they thought their favorite park was or what they would recommend. End of a family was only going to go to one national park. Which one should it be and overwhelmingly there? A two parks that came to the top of the list and Yosemite was of of course one of those parks. You can probably guess with the second park is but if you don't know that'll be our next podcast where we talk about that park so it's really a beautiful awful park. It's a place where people just love Being in nature and see all the beautiful scenery so there's plenty of reasons to go enjoy it now now. Let's talk about actually getting there and enjoying it. We like to start with logistics. So let's talk about getting to Yosemite National Park so Yosemite is in the northern Sierra Nevada's and the Sierra Nevada's of course are the mountain range that are pretty much the backbone of California. I guess you can think of him. They had really from the northern part of California kind of where it meets up with the Cascade Mountain Range which of course travels up into Oregon and Washington but so it's all the way in the northern part of California and then it moves its way down almost to Bakersfield so really pretty far down in the southern part of California so so this is a huge stretch of a mountain range. So if you're coming into California from a state that's east of it which will be most of us so from the South side you have I fifteen eighteen coming down from Las Vegas pretty much or I forty coming across from Arizona. They meet together in Barstow. And then you get onto a smaller all our highway fifty eight. That kind of takes you up to Bakersfield. And you're traveling that north kind of near cities like Salia and Fresno those are some of the names going to hear Mir said and then kind of modesto and stuff. So if you're coming from the south side that's the route that you're taking and the major highways if you're coming from the north you'd probably be coming in from. I eighty out of Nevada. So you come into kind of the Reno Tahoe area north Tahoe. And then you can cut across and had down one of the smaller roads like by through Sacramento onto that highway over intimate said and stuff or you can take maybe one of the smaller routes through the mountains. Although you're gonNA WANNA check the weather on that so in the winter months they might not be opened. Those are really the north and south access points for year round and now in the summer months. There's also Thai Yoga road which is open and that's also known as highway one twenty and that will go from three ninety five which is a hi California state highway that goes north to south on the eastern side of the Sierra Nevada's and it will connect you through Yosemite National Park. And then take take you onto the west side of the park so highway one twenty is a great option and will significantly cut down the hours that you need. You're coming over from kind of the middle of the state are anywhere If you're coming over from death valley or you're coming over from Nevada. We were coming from Great Basin National Park. That was our last stop before this so we were coming from the side as well but again Togo road is only open during the summer when the weather is good so you could easily have. GPS that you're checking on Routes and if you're looking at stuff during the summer it's going to tell you you can take that route and then if you're there after the snow L. start falling and they close it which is probably late October or sometime in November. They're going to close the road and then it won't open up again until they're able to fully clear it So sometime in the late spring early summer so be sure that you know if that roads closer not on the Yosemite National Park page as soon as you go to their website they tell you immediately of yoga. Rotas is passed. It's pretty much the highest alert right at the top of the page. So you'll know that it is closed but you Kinda WanNa know before hand while you're trying to plan whether or not you have three to four hour detour of other highways to get across the Sierra Nevada range. If you can't take Taga pass so that's one key thing to know is toga passes a great option to take we took it in our RV. We didn't feel that it was anything that significantly scary. I know it has the it's the highest elevation for any of the passes in California so I guess that makes it a pretty tough passed but it didn't seem like an unusual pass ask for us in We have a super see so We have that big these Jin. It didn't have any troubles trying to climb that and nothing felt really like a Sharp steep drop off where we didn't have any shoulder or We didn't have the ability to pull over and just kind of let the engine cool if we needed to with the brakes or anything. They're are definitely Were plenty places to pull over and we were able to do it slowly so I don't think that taking that road is anything that scary But we also do a lot of mountain driving so Maybe some people would feel a little less comfortable with it. But I don't think it's one of the worst passes out there so I wouldn't be too afraid of it. Just take your time and then the other thing to know is if you are taking that road and then heading over or really if you're taking any of the three routes from the Western decide that come into the park there are significant limitations if you're coming with an RV and this was one of the hardest things that I was trying to navigate because the last thing you want to do is start getting towards Yosemite and then realized there's a tunnel and you're not gonNA fit through and now you're still trying to figure out how you're going to work in your reservations and stuff like that so I just want to take a few minutes to talk about those three Roads that you take on the western side of the park so the three roads that are going to get you into Yosemite valley and what the limitations are so. If you don't have a big rig skip ahead a few minutes you probably don't care about this but if you do please listen. Listen because I don't want you to be stuck thinking you're getting through somewhere and and then you realize that you're not so the for the Yosemite Valley entrance into the main Yosemite Valley and we'll talk about kind of four different main areas to the park but I highly recommend that if you're going to Yosemite make sure you put Yosemite Devali on your to do list of what you're going to see because it's it's phenomenal probably the it is the busiest part of the park. But it's that's for good reason. It's just is absolutely beautiful and it's kind of the the highlight of Yosemite. So be sure you do the valley. Now there's three roads that will take you into the valley so kind of the different entrance prince centers on that side so from if you were to take tiogue a road or you're coming in from further west onto highway one twenty. That's kind of the North West highway that So then it goes south east as it dips down into Yosemite Valley and it's also called big big oak flat road. This is A road it's not terribly wind ear steep or anything crazy but you are probably really not going to want your RV with you on this for a few reasons one. It does have a little bit of kind of Twisting and turning so I think that there are some limitations. I don't think it super tight for here. I think that it says you could be up to like a forty five foot. RV and handle this road but the problem you're going to get into is that there's three tunnels you're going to pass ask as you're coming into Yosemite Valley and if I remember correctly I was driving when we were doing the tunnel so I wasn't able to write the dimensions down but I'm pretty sure the first sign said thirteen thirteen ten for height the minimum height on the tunnel also. Not too big of a deal. I think most of us can fit that think the next one was thirteen six and then the final one I believe was ten six or ten three. So we have a super c JAYCO SENECA THE specs ex- on the sheet. Say that it's thirteen one so we have thirteen feet one inch up to the air conditioning unit on the top we actually have our Internet extenders stuff. That kind of goes above that so we like to see a clearance of thirteen six when we go someplace our garage door at our home. RV Shop is fourteen feet in even that sometimes feels like a bit of a push. So it's really nice to see a fourteen foot clearance but I can guarantee you that even if a tunnel is ten six on the outer edge which of of course means at the center of the tunnel you have more clearance. I'm certainly not fitting a thirteen foot. Our fee through that so I think if you have a smaller Smaller Class B. He or you're in a van or you're pulling a trailer and so you have a lower height. That might be fine for you but be sure you look at the Yosemite Parks website for the tunnel means and all link that in the show notes so you can find it easily. I had a hard time finding this when we were searching for everything Because you so most of your big. RV's are not going to fit through those tunnels so that was the option from big oak flat road. Now we did end up taking this. wrote a number of times in our jeep because because we stayed in Grove land which is just a little further out of the park on highway. One twenty. And I'll talk more about that at the end when I talk about places to stay And going through with the jeep was just fine. And that's always a great way to travel. But if you don't have that option or you're trying to camp in the park just know that if you aren't a big rig you're not going to be able to come in through highway one twenty. Another way to get into the park is highway forty one and this comes up from the south so so you head up from the south and it gets into the Mariposa Grove area and there's a lot of great things to see on the south part of the of the park and we'll talk about some of those things things but the big thing to know about this is also called when we're GonNa road and the big thing about this though is there is the Woah woah tunnel and You may have heard people talk about tunnel view or getting pictures at tunnel view. which is this phenomenal view? You'll definitely WANNA see it while you're in yellowstone And there's this tunnel title and you can stop there. There's a parking lot and you can take this picture where you're seeing Capitan. Half Dome and bridal veil falls all in the same shot. It's really spectacular. You're just getting this high point view of the whole valley and it's phenomenal but that tunnel is I believe ten three or ten two so it is a small tunnel and there's no way RV's flint and through that I think a lot of other people your RV's not fitting through that either so again. That's the south entrance coming up on highway. Forty one there's places camp down there But you'll have to have a different vehicle to actually drive up into the park so then your last option for Yosemite Valley is highway. One forty in this is coming and straight from the West. And it's kind of coming into the arch rock entrance and it's also called. El Portal road is the other name that you might hear for it this this states on the NPS website that this has a height limit of twelve foot ten inches. And I'm not sure where they're deciding that limit because as far as I can tell there's no tunnel on this actual road. We didn't drive this road so I cannot confirm that. There's no tunnel but I can't find anything in the research that says that says there's a tunnel here plus I know people with big. RV's who have camped in Yosemite Valley. So they they had to have gotten there somehow and I think at that is through this highway one forty now having said that technically we don't fit under that limit so if there is something that that's going to be a a an issue for your rv you if you have a taller height might be a problem as well so I still don't have confirmation whether or not we can get our RV into the park and we didn't camp in the park so it wasn't an issue this time but I'd love to know that for the next time we're going so those of you out there who have taken highway one forty if he can let me know if you can get through that or or if there's any tunnels is there that'd be great so there you go. That's a little bit of the details if you're trying to actually get all the way into the park with your rv into Yosemite Valley those are the limitations as you're going to run into You can of course camp outside of the park and then drive in with your vehicle though. And that's what we did so we'll talk about some of the highlights of what what we saw in some of the things that we loved as soon as we come back so I would divide Yosemite national park into four parts so hetch Hetchy Mariposa Grove tiogue. Oh road and Yosemite Valley so we'll talk off for those parts briefly so hetch hetchy is kind of the Upper Reservoir Canyon area. It's on the northwest part of the park. So you'd be accessing it probably easiest if you're coming in from highway when twenty which is that big Goeke flat Area you can actually head a little bit north and get to the Hetch hetchy entrance and take that road now. This road is not suitable for. RV's I think a Limit on it was something like twenty four feet so you can just take a personal vehicle. Apparently they've got a lot of kind of switch backs winding to it so it just ends up not being being suitable for something that's longer in length. It does go through a beautiful a canon area and apparently it's It's one that mere described as almost arrival to Yosemite Valley. So I'm sure it's really beautiful. We didn't have time to make it up here There is a reservoir. That's up there and actually this is a lot of the drinking water. That's it's used for nearby areas in California you Are Not Allowed to swim or boat or anything else on the reservoir. Probably because it's it's also drinking water and of course they usually don't allow that kind of stuff boats and stuff in the national park waters anyway but it would be a beautiful area to see and it would be a quiet quiet place to do hiking. There's a lot fewer people that come here so If if you WanNa go somewhere where you have a little bit more solitude and you can just enjoy the scenery scenery. This is probably the location to visit Or try to stay outside of an at least spend a day at so. That's Hetchy the next place to talk about is is Mariposa Grove. So again like I mentioned on the south entrance so taking highway forty one to come up from the south side of the park on that west side you would get into Mariposa Grove and this is one of the three sequoia groves that they have in the park. And it's the biggest of the three sequoia groves and it's probably the most accessible and easily accessed because you don't necessarily have to have a pretty big hike to get into where the Grove's at they had it closed for a while like in two thousand fifteen eighteen through eighteen. And they were doing some renovations. But it's opened again and if you're not planning to go to any other area where you're going to see sequoias then I would highly recommend at least taking a day to go down to this area so that you can see the sequoia trees because they are just amazing phenomenon I it's so so exciting to see your kids faces light up or your own face light up when you see how giant these amazing trees are so if you have. I've never been to a sequoia forest and you're not planning to head to sequoia. We were heading off to Sequoia National Park the next day or a few days after this so we ended up not going to do the Mariposa Grove but it would be a great place to see and then the Town of Arizona has a hill Pioneer Yosemite History Center and they have different historic buildings so they do a bunch of different things that are tied into teaching about the history and the time period. And how people used to live back here now this this visitor center that they have on this entrance isn't open in the fall and we were at Yosemite. Oh I should've mentioned that. We were at Yosemite the last week of October. So definitely late fall It was a little bit of a risky trip because any moment that road for tiogue road could close in. We knew that coming coming into it and we knew we could have a three to four hour detour but we did it anyway. The weather held out and it was perfect. And we got the fall leaves But visiting in the fall means of course less people and we could park any where we needed throughout the trip. But it also meant that there's fewer resources so different campgrounds are closed different visitors centers Are closed so you just have to kind of accept that condition if you're going to go there during the off season the shoulder season but we always find. It's worth it because you have fewer people. Well they're so that's Mariposa Grove Like I mentioned at the beginning. Mariposa Grove was one of the areas that was protected by Abraham Lincoln as part of that Yosemite grant so so they were trying to prevent these giant trees from being destroyed and this was one of the areas that Teddy Roosevelt went to on his trip and so he got to see the huge Asia. The huge sequoia trees realize how important it was to protect them and see what the destrucitin destruction look like in the nearby areas so Really a cool thing to see specially for not planning to go anywhere else quest. The third thing to talk about is Thai Yoga Road so like I mentioned we did take this. tiogue pass is on the east side right. So that's as you're coming from highway three ninety five which is the north South route along the Sierra on the eastern side you cut across on highway one twenty which is Taio go road in that goes through the park so it's I think once you just get up that pass. There's not anything else on the route. That's really that terrifying refined and like I said we didn't even find Taga Pass to be all that scary as well so We also though were coming westbound on it. I think if if you were heading eastbound and leaving the park from this route it would you might feel that steepness and it might be a little bit scarier but Places to pull over in. It's totally fine as you come in through that entrance one of the first things you say is instead point and there's limited parking here but because there were so few people we were able to pull the RV into one of the RV spots and we were still towing the jeep so you know we're probably fifty fifty five feet in length. At this point we were able to pull into a spot no problem and then we could get out and hike around a little bit. What you're seeing in the distance is the back of half dome? So it's really cool because this was our first view of these the giant Granite Boulders these mountains of granite that are Yosemite National Park so half dome of course is one of the most visible and it's it's it looks like half of dome. It's literally a circle but our sphere more and then cut in half and so you're seeing this huge granite ski mountain and you can see that in the distance so that was super cool if you then keep traveling on Road the next thing you really get to is tonight lake and data beautiful lake. It doesn't have that long of a little hiking trail to kind of walk around. We didn't do the entire hiking trail we just walked for a little while. It was pretty windy that day and we were also trying to get to the other end into our campsite before dark so we didn't spend a ton of time at tonight but it was very beautiful to see and once again we were able to just just pull the RV over on the side of the road and there were a bunch of parking spots open and we were able to just pull into one of those and keep the the toad connected a an and walk around so that worked out well to Allah me is Kind of the next spacey. Get to the twelve meadows so these big beautiful meadows and you can kind the rivers flowing through it Pretty place to see. And then as you're a further going onto Tiga road in kind of nearing where it's going to meet it up with The other roads and kind of head to the Western part of the park. Then you're going to get up to where the Twala me Grove is is and the Mir said Grove so these are the other two sequoia groves that they have in the park. The Mir said Grove has twenty sequoias added. It's about a three three hour hike. So it's like three and a half miles I think that's round trip. But you know you have a hiking to get out to this but if you want to see a grove rove a sequoia grove and you don't want a lot of other people there with you. Then mayor said Grove would be a good option for Twala me grove. You also need to hike into it. I think there's twenty-five sequoias at this grove and It's only about a mile on that hike. But you do have a bit of an elevation drop and so you drop down to do the hike and then so don't forget you gotTa hike that back up on your way out of there But that would be a shorter hike if you wanted it to be an grove. If you didn't have time to travel all the way down to Mariposa Grove which is the largest of the three growth that they have there and when we come back. We're going to talk about Yosemite Valley so Yosemite Valley really as the crown jewel of the park. Be Sure to visit this during your trip It's actually a loop so the road comes in and it does a loop up that goes around and then comes back out. It's thirteen miles in total. There's a few different ways you can do this loop so you're not really going to be able to loop loop it with your RV if you're camping the campground that's fine and you have some other option so you don't need to drive your rv around but you don't want to have to take your RV honest Lupin expect to be able to park and find places to stop and be able to pull it in. Just it's too tight. There's not that many parking spots as it is so don't plan on using senior. RV To do this loop There's other options so there's really three other options One you could bike this. It is only thirteen miles so you know. Our kids are definitely not doing a thirteen mile bike ride but I think for some adults. That wouldn't be too bad and you'd easily be able to stop them and see everything that you want to see and do hikes or whatever it is that you want to do so biking's a nice option second is you can't take personal vehicle as long as it's off season and there's parking if it's the heat of the summer good luck trying to find parking. This is one of the busiest parks. It's in the top ten. I think it's about five million visitors a year and the the summer months are extremely busy so I don't think that a personal vehicle is a great option. If you're there during the summer we were able to use a personal vehicle cold but again we were there in shoulder season really in late fall before the winter weather really came in and Limited a bunch of the access so so personal vehicle you could use but Other than just getting to one spot and then parking your personal vehicle like in the downtown town like the Yosemite village parking you could maybe park your personal vehicle and then take the shuttle system throughout. So that's the third option is the shuttle system so the shuttle. The system in the winter months kind of fall off season goes year round throughout the village area. So you have kind of the lodge and you have the ansel Adams Gallery. There's the museum that's over there. There's the Conservation Center and and then it goes over to where the campgrounds are at. And so that's kind of like the upper pines and lower pines so the whole half Dome village I think is what they call it. where the campsites and stuff are at so year round the shuttle will do that loop and then in the summer months? It also does a larger loop where it'll take you Out By el Capitan and then over to The kind of Cathedral beach area. So that gets you a little bit closer. To where bridal veil falls falls is so those are your three options you can take personal vehicle but probably only on offseason or just park in the main parking areas and then the shuttle's tells the main way that you're getting around the area or biking if you WANNA bike it I guess you could walk to but thirteen miles is a lot of walking so especially if you WANNA do hikes when you get to different replaces. So that's your options for getting around now in terms of what you WANNA see you're driving around. We actually did a little detours. We were first coming in and instead going straight into the village We went and did the little bit of a a shot to the right. That'll take you to the bridal veil falls visitors area where you can park and there's not actually a visitor's center here but there's a parking lot it's not a very large parking lot and you can't back up Here with a total anything and you won't be able to fit in. RV LARGE RV and here anyway so we were in the jeep. But it's a really nice short hike. It's super easy for kids. I don't know exactly but it couldn't be more than a quarter of a mile to get to the base of the falls and then there's a bunch of boulders and rocks and stuff that are down there they don't actually want you hiking on that to try to get closer to the falls so you're really just seen it from the area where they have like a concrete path space that they want you to see it but it's a really cool waterfall to see it's six hundred and twenty feet so this is a huge waterfall and we were there like I said in late fall so the last week of October Ober and at that point in time Yosemite falls is not flowing anymore. Just doesn't have enough water but bridal veil falls was still going so it was really cool to be able to see a waterfall and this was the waterfall that we were able to see. So then as you get back onto the loop and keep heading into the valley you'll come across Al Capitan. which will be on your left? This this is the huge thirty five hundred foot vertical granite wall that just juts out of the ground in and heads up and I if as if that wasn't cool enough to see you usually can see climbers that are on the mountain. If you haven't seen the movie free Solo you definitely want to check that out ahead of time. It's actually a documentary about a professional rock climber. Alex who is The first person ever to free solo climb meaning. He's not using using any ropes or anything to climb El Capitan. So just insane. I think it's amazing. The people that are climbing it with ropes. I mean that's spectacular tacklers. Well and what's really cool is you can see these people on their Either climbing or we were seeing people towards a nighttime or towards the the evening and so they had their little like hammock. Things set up on the sides of the mountain. Because they're going to sleep there that night and then continue climbing up the next day so really cool to see if as if the nature wasn't cool enough on its own. Seeing the climbers was really need as well and I'm pretty sure free. Solo is free right now on Amazon is on prime. Video are yeah through Amazon Prime Video. I remember seeing it somewhere. Free might have been Netflix. But check that out because it will get you excited for the trip in. It'll just make an awe of these people people that are doing these climbs. So that's Al Capitan. As You keep heading forward you can't see half dome in the distance You'd have to drive drive up further up by like the half dome parking and then hike up if you wanted to get closer to that area. We only went as far as the Yosemite Valley parking lot and we parked there And then went around the little village so the village that they have Is Really Cool. I mean they have a bunch of stuff there post office there they also have Some different in places where you can get a bite to eat. They have a Park Ranger Station area visitor center where you can talk with Park Rangers and get recommendations on Hikes and stuff get the junior ranger packets. There's a big interactive area and then there's kind of like Native American specialist area where they have they have a whole all kind of village area. Setup shows you what some of the housing would have been like. There's usually somebody there to answer questions about things. There happened to be a basket display. That was going on while while we were there So we were able to see that and enjoy that. There's also that's the Indian cultural exhibit sand that's correct term so so Really cool to see. There's a lot of different programs that are happening. We actually did not make time to go on. One of the ranger led hikes. But they allow the kids or at least offseason to go through the Indian cultural exhibit. And then meet with the interpretive specialist. They had there and answer different questions and go through. Things is to work on their junior ranger packets so that was a nice feature so then as we kept drive in the loop to head out of there we stopped kind of meadows area at the base by Yosemite falls calls. It's while it's not super close Yosemite falls but you can hike over to where the base of Yosemite falls is at and you could continue hiking up as well We in little kids so we weren't doing any major major hikes but it's just nice to get out your legs and go see that really beautiful and of course you alphabetize not too far in the distance We kept driving then and stopped for while at El Capitan and saw that around the base of it. And that's where really where we could see a bunch of the climbers that were up on the mountain and then we continued up to tunnel view. So this is going towards WANNA so this is heading up until forty one and you can stop there before the tunnel and park your car. There's a small parking not at probably only holds like Twenty cars or so so it's really not very large but In the off season we were fine getting a parking spot. I think it's really worth it to try to be able to stop here and be able to see tunnel view and and get that view of the valley so it's really worth trying to make that work. We were actually there and it was almost sunset so it was was starting to get dark and it meant that the valley was starting to get those pinks purples to it and Like I mentioned before you're able to see kept on half dome and bridal veil falls all the same shot so that was really neat and what we ended up doing is we turn the jeep around and parked on the parking lot. That's it's on the south side of the road. There were fewer people there and then you can easily get onto a small path. Nobody else was on this hike. We only had to go up. Maybe maybe maybe a mile at the most but I think it was even less than a mile to a place called inspiration point and this is actually one of the spots. Were ansel ansel Adams. Has this great shot of the Yosemite Valley so if you want that view that you get from tunnel view You can see that at tunnel view but if you want a nice hike. That isn't isn't terribly difficult. There is a bit of an allegation gain. But it's not that long and you can hike up to inspiration point and really see that same view you that he saw and there's probably going to be nobody around you so this is one hike that I think is a really good one to see because it was the only one that we were able to do where we didn't have other people next to us so within at least the valley so Really a cool hike and a great way to see that beautiful landscape and and Really feel like you're connected with the people that had been there before us so NEAT place to stop and see and when we come back. We're GONNA talk about camping for the park in terms of camping I I wanted to talk about the NPS camping. That's actually within the park. This is by far the best option. If you just WANNA be right there in the action action and see everything because unfortunately all of the places that you can camp at that are outside of the park are really outside of the park. So we're talking about it least a half hour drive to the entrance for Yosemite National Park not to mention the further. Drive that you have to actually get into the valley so it's easily an hour are up to two hours for you to get from your RV place into Yosemite Valley from wherever you're staying if you're staying outside of the park and that's a huge inconvenience When you're talking about maybe having limited days or just being able to try to see as much of the park as you can and then having trouble level so far to get back to your RV but of course being in the park is not always an option for everybody so we were We did this trip with about about four days notice so we were originally supposed to head down to Joshua Tree but there was a big blizzard in Colorado in October and it it closed I I said to the West and it closed. I twenty five heading to the south so we didn't really have a way ahead to the southern part of the USO instead we headed north to Wyoming and then headed over or to Yosemite so great assembly glad. We did it but we didn't have any prior planning for this trip so there were no reservations for US available to get into the park park and they always have some first. Come first serve but when you're in a big RV and when you're traveling to Twenty hours to get to a park. You you don't necessarily want to Rely on the first come first serve so we don't like to do that either. We like to try to book something but in terms of actually stain in the park you you do have a few different options if you are a larger. RV They actually have a few places that are open in the summer that can accommodate up to a forty foot RV RV. But I think it's literally six or eight sites for the whole park that can accommodate up to forty feet now they have a few more places aces that say they can accommodate up to thirty five feet. And I'll tell you. A lot of the national parks have a limit on thirty five feet being the Max and technically are Jayco Senecas. Thirty seven feet but miraculously shrink down to thirty five feet whenever we're going to a national park because we have just found culture bay in Grand Tetons. We've just found that we're able to fit into that So we usually just say yeah okay. We're thirty five feet and we take one of those. We're able to take one of those spots now. The issue with Yosemite Valley is because of the way that the sites are laid out. You literally don't have a turning radius to back in to the actual campsite so they're all back in spots and because because of the limitations with the trees and everything you don't have a turning radius to get into the spot so I don't know if our whole idea that will be fine at a thirty five foot site really will work at this park. They actually go so far to say that. If you're pulling a trailer the trailer cannot be more than is it twenty four or twenty five feet. Wait so you're even more limited with a trailer just because of that Not being able to do the proper backing up and having the turn radius to make it into the spots so I think the motorhome limit on these larger spots are thirty five feet but only twenty four feet. If it's a travel trailer that you have with you so a a lot of limitations with size. So that's a bit of a problem also. Getting reservations for the campgrounds are insane. This is one of the busiest parks and it's usually the kind of place that is booked a longtime in advance specifically in advance. They will tell you on the NPS website that it's five months in advance but don't put that in your head. Think four months in advance. And I'll tell you why so. This is the way that it works. Let's say that you want to go for the fourth of July weekend. Okay so the way it works. Is the reservations will open for four to five months before that date specifically four months before that date but it will open up for a month's worth of reservations for a month time so for example. If you want to derive arrived between June fifteenth and July Life Fourteenth. Your reservation day would be February fifteenth. So that's February. Fifteenth is four months before June fifteenth. That's that's why I'm saying. Put it in your head that it's four months before the date that it opens up. It's just at that point when it opens up at that four months ahead of time. It's opening for an entire hire month so it's opening from June fifteenth dates all the way up to July fourteen dates so if you wanted to go on the fourth of July that's during that time stretch. That's right of June fifteenth to July fourteenth. So you need to book on on February Fifteenth. Don't put it in your head. Oh I can do this five. You know five months in advance or I need to do this. March first. Or second or whatever to correlate with the first part of July it's it's the four months before the earliest date that it opens opens and a link. They have on their website the specific so if you have this arrival date this is the date that you need to make reservations and the reservations opened up at seven. AM MM Pacific Time and this is one of those things you just set your clock and you make sure that you're trying to get those reservation dates as soon as you want them as soon as you can get them. So I'll put a link to that in the show notes so you can get to that and specifically see what are my dates. And what do I need to get in terms of the bigger. RV campsites that are available. So upper pines hindes has stuff. That's up to thirty five feet. The Lower Pines has the forty foot sites. But that's not open in offseason so when we were there it wasn't open and so the upper pints would have been the only option and then won't which is the town that's kind of on the south part they can accommodate up to thirty five feet and and Bridal Veil Creek camp that is an open year round that's just Kind of a summertime. One and then Haagen meadow which I guess is in the northern part. We must have passed by that. But I'm not quite sure where that was at so there's a few different places and of course there's a lot more options if you have a smaller RV or if you're just tent camping. I mean you have a ton of options and you might actually be able to get a first-come-first-serve if you get there early enough in the morning but for the big rigs not that many options. You definitely want to make sure that. Do you have that reservation ahead of time and I think the only option you have for actually getting into the park is highway. One forty so. Don't forget that part okay in terms of private spots. Where can you park so private campgrounds? That are outside of the park From the South side. There's a town called. Oh Kirsten it looks like. It's about an hour more from that south entrance at the Mariposa Grove. That might be an option. It looked like they had a number of while a number meaning. You know three or four different. RV Parks so there might be some different for an options there on that south side in terms of highway. One forty so the El Portal road. There's a Indian flat. RV Park work that shows. It's probably only about twenty minutes from outside of the park so that might be a good option. As one of the closest places you can go to And then the ED next option is highway one twenty. which was that big oak flat road? This is where we went to and this is near the town of Grove Lynn. So most of these. RV sites are are going to have an address in Groveland the closest one to the Yosemite entrance is about twenty five thirty minutes from the entrance. And that's Yosemite Seventy Lakes RV resort. We didn't stay here a it didn't from the campground reviews that I was reading from all stays APP. It didn't look like it was highly rated as Yosemite Ridge which was the next furthest out. So that's where we ended up staying there really aren't any of the. RV parks that have overwhelming glowing. Reviews News so It seems that they all have some things. That people find as issues in Maybe a little bit older and don't necessarily have a ton of amenities so there's not really anyone who's a very clear winner. This place is actually prime for an amazing. Koa are big amazing. RV Re Park something like the on the West Glacier Koa if something like that came in to the west side of Yosemite they would make killing because it is so needed Really really phenomenal. RV Park but Since they don't have it when you're trying to look at your best option the like I said the Yosemite Lakes RV resort is your closest closest. We didn't stay there. We just Kinda thought at the distance. I think that the gone with the winds have a video where they stayed here and so they have a review. So you can see that We ended up staying at Yosemite Ridge resort. which is about forty minutes from the entrance? Free Assembly National Park and You know we liked it. There was It was a little tight to get into. So there's some cabins and then there's only a number of spots I don't remember how many exactly but not that many maybe eleven sure so so so not a ton of spots but we were definitely in the largest of the spots. It was kind of a big pool through area and we had a nice Sitting area area and a big grassy area that was really pretty little tight to get in and out for our thirty seven foot. RV Especially we couldn't even deal with the towing we had Wait until we were in the front of the office in order to hook up our jeep because we couldn't get into the spot or out of it with the G. picked up so little bit tight and then and the other thing that was a huge. Bummer is We booked intentionally at a private campground outside so we could hook up to electrical because we had our dog I with us and when we travel with the dog we don't like to leave her in the RV when it could be too hot or too cold and not have any power to accommodate air conditioning. Or anything anything else. So we don't need the power for the heat but we did We would need some electrical power to run the ACC so we like to stay at a campsite so that it's more comfortable for her as we're doing our daytime travels and so that's part of the reason that we paid to stay at this site and didn't even consider doing a I come for surf. Type deal it within the park and unfortunately fortunately when we got there they didn't have any power now it wasn't their fault California's a Lotta wildfire issues. PG will which is their power company for their utilities. He's will just shut off power if there's too much wind or any sort of risk where there could be a downed power line and cause more fires so they literally cut the power off to all the people pull that are in this area for two days. So the whole Two nights that we stayed there there was never any power So that was a bummer But the resort was nice enough to refund me some money even though it wasn't even their fault but we were paying for this hookup site that we had absolutely no hookups for because even the water pump required water so we had. We had nothing to had no water or electrical or anything now. Fortunately it was plenty Cool so it wasn't an issue to try to keep the air conditioning conditioning. On in fact we ended up running the heat for dog while we were gone. And then the next On Grove land would be Yosemite Pines This is a little bit it closer to the town of Groveland. So you're kind of narrow town if you wanna do town type stuff as well on your trip but it's also about fifty to sixty minutes to get into the park so further drive into the part so none of the options are super close. This is Some big rugged mountainous area and there are some kind of national national forest areas. Where maybe you can just pull over? And if you're going to boondock anyway you can just pull over in stay at one of those sites. You can't do any sort of Boondock and within the park of course But there are some national forest area. That's outside of the park. So that might be an option to if you just want kind of some free boone docking so that's it for camping Just a few kind of last minute notes. One thing is a book recommendation so I always try to prep the kids for our trip ahead of time by checking out. Whatever I can that it tells us about the animals or the ecosystems or geology or whatever we can learn about the parks before we actually had to them and one book that I particularly liked as a picture picture book called the camping trip that changed America and the author's name is Barbara Rosenstock? She actually has a bunch of different books that are about historical people in. She doesn't have it read like A boring nonfiction. Instead she really tells a story about that person in something that happened in their life or something that they're known for so in the camping trip that changed America. She tells the story of Teddy Roosevelt going out to do the camping trip with John Mirror. And kind of what that meant so. It's a picture book. It's I guess you could say it's meant for kids but don't let that full you if you're an adult. This is still a fun book to just check out You can probably get it from your library and read that ahead of time or get your kids excited and have them read that ahead of time so that is a good recommendation That I think alike and then a next thing to know the junior ranger program at Yosemite is a lot like you have at Yellowstone some of the bigger parks where you're paying. I think it's only like three dollars. But you who are paying to get the packet and then once the kids complete the packet. Then they get their badge so That's a little bit different than some of the other places so just so you go ahead of time that you're GONNA have to pay for that and the other thing we didn't realize is they have a different packet for it. must go up to age six. Yeah I must go up to age six. 'cause also still six at the time that we went so I think they have a packet for the the like the cubs or something. It's like three to six and then the next packet is seven seven and up for age so we went with the younger packet. I should have just went with the upper one but I didn't think about it. And so then they turn them in and they went to get their badges and Greta. The older older daughter got a full badge. One of the typical would badges and Elsa ended up getting. I think it was like a sticker or something. So that's what they had for the younger kids and she was really disappointed because she's she's been collecting her badges from all the different places and so she feels like she doesn't really have a badge from Yosemite so next time we go. She'll she'll be she's old enough now she can get the old packet or if you have kids that care about that. Just get the older packet for them from the beginning so that they can actually get the wood badge if if they care about getting those badges and then the last thing I wanted to mention is nearby parks and things that you want to check out so you're only about three hours three or four hours from from death valley as long as Rotas Open you head across that to get from Yosemite over onto highway three fifty nine and highway. Three fifty nine is great. We actually stayed in. Mammoth Lake. Take the night before we came to Yosemite. You can see Devil's Postpone National Monument while you're over there there is a great. RV Park over there in Just fantastic forest I and the huge pine cones and amazing trees. And there's different hot springs natural hot springs that you can walk to and and just soak in that are pretty close to there so a a lot of things to see and that will take you the route that gets you over to death valley as well. So it's about three hours to death valley if Taga Rotas open and he can get across or are from the Yosemite Valley sign. If you head south which is what we ended up doing while we went back to the main highway and then headed south. You can get down to Sequoia National Park which is only about three three hours kings. Canyon's only about two and a half hours so we stayed outside of Sequoia and then just ended up Touring through Sequoia and Kings Canyon Parks from that launching eighteen point. I'll do another podcast about that where we stayed and stuff. But you're really close to those other parks so if it matters to you to see some other national parks this is a great time to to do it Check off a few other ones on your list so hopefully there was some information. Here that's useful for your Yosemite trip and makes it easier for you to planet it in. Let's you have a more enjoyable time because you know about something or You have some ideas so Thank you so much for listening and thank you to the people who have given me reviews news. I just realized how to log in and actually see that so Thank you for everyone. Who's given me a five star review and And thank you to an in Alabama. Who was Nice Nice enough to take the time and share some kind words about the The podcast so you made my December and so thank you so much and thank you for listening. We'll see you at the parks works mm-hmm.
MRN Outloud! - June 3, 2019
"You'll do it right. To grow fest garden. You can lows does it right to savings on miracle grow potting mix with fertilizer to help you get growing in bro? Plants twice as big versus unfed plants pick up a fifty court bag now for just ten dollars. Plus, get two point three to court vegetables, and herbs three ten dollars for garden. That's worthy of showing off do it right for less. Start with Lowe's. Offers valid through six five while supplies last. US, only excludes Alaska, and Hawaii. This is Emma Iran out loud, on M, R, N dot com, presented by bloom, and Mondays at outback steakhouse and also brought to you by Hercules tires ride on our strength. MR in out loud, was by outback steakhouse with you here as Joey Meyer, and when he came back with you getting set to look at what happened at Pocono and what's going to happen. We think at Texas. The trucks will be and Michigan coming up later this weekend as well where the expended series and the Cup series will be little. Joey is back a little sad. Yeah. It's no top ten it was not a not a great day. Not the greatest today's for Kevin Harvick and not the greatest of starts to the season. They've been fast a lot. But this time of year ago, I think I saw stat he had five wins already again. I've said it on the show before Rodney children's having a meeting. And when he asked Kevin Harvick what do you think about your crews execution? He'll say I'm all for it because he was not happy with guys again. And that's a dream. Yeah. And that's the thing about it. You every race team has a problem even if you're winning races. You're always trying to find a way to win the next one. It's a problem. Right. We all have problems to fix. Their problem. Isn't speed? Aid. It's being able to start the race and finish the race without somebody messing up. Yeah. And that includes the drivers. Right. That's whether it's a speeding penalty, whether it's a bad call Rodney, whether it's a mechanical failure. They had a couple issues with a power steering issue this week. Yeah. But it started with the penalty after children's made excellent call to get him out in front. I thought that was gonna be the movie. Exactly. Right. That two tire. Stop put him in front of Kyle Busch were passing was premium very limited option to do that. And then they snafu and made a mistake on pit road and power steering pump. Yes. So little, Joey said you have to go out back get you a balloon. But you gotta go eat anyway. Blooming onion this week ago. It's harder top ten you get a free Ruben. Nothing wrong with that, too. But, you know, we avoided the weather member of the weather nocco. Yeah, it was going to get we're going to have some problems and you never even put an umbrella out. So that was good for Sunday. Well, let's hope next year at Pocono when they have a double header weekend, along with Arka trucks xfinity to be a long week if if something gets wacky with weather there, it's going to be like dominoes falling that's going to be tough. But I'm anxious to see how that comes, but I mean the tricky triangle lived up to its image, and it's a very difficult race very difficult to pass restarts very difficult. It's an endurance race. The only thing we took away from the statistical failure with you will is the shifting wants drivers re-started and got into that was that was a lot of people have the misconception that that was something NASCAR said you can't shift now. It was a gear change to save money for the teams and that meant shifting was obsolete for this particular configuration, something we do in a norm. Streetcar. We take it for granted. Most of us have automatics, but if you have a shifting car, you don't realize the actual strain, that actually puts on the drive train, and whenever you have a race car going one hundred and eighty plus miles an hour, which they were doing through the tunnel turn. Yeah, that's crazy hundred and eighty miles an hour. It's a ninety degree turn, you don't realize the stress you're putting on shifting because they don't lift. They don't let off the gas go into a gear. Get back on the gas. You're pounding him in gears, your shit up, shifting into third or downshifting, and you don't use a clutch to boot like we do in a streetcar. Well in order to do that. You have to add extra cooling equipment different types of transmissions, and you end up increasing your costs, so that when all that's going on to like at road courses many of the teams if not most travel, a transmission specialist, whose, whose job is just to make sure everything is okay with that with all the shifting for the weekend. And unfortunately, at least once a weekend, somebody missed a shift and now the motor guys involved. All right. So we got rid of all of that issue. So once the restarts go on you restart maybe, in, I post most likely second, you get the fourth gear it stays in fourth gear for the duration of the run. And that allows you lower mechanical failures, but reduces the opportunity to out shift or ally if the driver can do himself to make a difference. So that's where the racing became a little long. But again Pocono, it's not it's not surprising that we talk about Pocono being that kind of race because again, it's one of our largest tracks. It gets overlooked two and a half miles. Yeah, there's only a couple of tracks that are longer and no track has a longer front stretch spoken. So I flew this weekend to a little airport went over an eight building twenty six hundred feet long. That's a thousand feet. Short shorter Pocono say 'cause you land on the front stretch at Pocono thousand percent without you no problem. Plenty why over thirty five hundred feet long absolutely. All day long the short the long ever asked if they'd let love to the long punch straight away, is, as long as lake Norman Lear park, and that's three thousand feet. So, yeah, plenty long enough. It's a, it's a uniquely configured designed, you know, if you wanna look into at Trenton, New Jersey, I believe Milwaukee and India, the three tracks that it's designed after yet. But those guys leave turn one. They're going down a long pond. Straightaway, staring at a ninety degree wall at one hundred eighty miles an hour now with this configuration, and that's unusual, but they got rid of the shifting so you only had to do a little lift and men. The we saw a couple of wrecks over there. You had to be loose through there in order to get around the corner, and turn one of very, very challenging track Pocono lived up to its reputation and Kyle Busch after a Wapping what five races where he didn't go to victory lane goes back to victory lane. And you know, Pocono had been attracted had been troublesome for him over the years. But recently, he's gotten the hang of that place and he sure did yesterday. Here's what. He had to say I don't know. I felt like when I was here Dave Rogers the last year or two started to click on something. Get a little bit better. We finish third finished four. It's like we I think we finished better. And then when I got with Adam, it's just kind of clicked we've, we've been really, really good here with Adam. So, you know, Adams, obviously a, a great leader and a great crew chief and does a really good job being able to listen to me and and through practice. When we talk about what things I need help with and worked on the race car to make myself better intern wanna turn to turn three. He's able to give it to me. You know, and, and that's what makes you know, a great crew chief. And so I, I appreciate his leadership in his, his ability, and being able to understand what's in his race car, what springs and shocks in bars and why everything is the way that it is. And what it does and how it affects the car in each different corner with different loads, and such, and that he can go to work and figure out what things on talking about and describing, and that he knows. Okay. Well, that's going to be this right here. If I if I change this, it's gonna make us better here. It's not really going to affect over there or whatever. It is, you know. So he's just he's he's pretty good about that fourth win of the season for Kyle Busch fifty five all time in the Cup series ties in with NASCAR hall of Famer rusty Wallace ninth on the overall list there. He's got it going on. I mean leading the standings. It's it's hard to argue with what he's done. Now. There was a lot of social media about him being asked another question about the package and not wanting to go there. We'll talk a little bit more about that later. But and that's definitely something that may come up in the in the the soapbox. Roundtable, you name whatever you wanna call the discussion, but definitely a Joe Gibbs racing is on fire. Let's just say at nine wins in fourteen races. That's large. That's what I was getting ready to say takeout chase. Elliott's win at a restrictor plate race and Team Penske and Joe Gibbs one every other race dating back to Phoenix of last year. And that's pretty amazing. When to organizations are beating the other organizations that were excluding Stewart Haas racing. Fast cars, have not wanna raise Hendrick motorsports. Excluding the restrictor plate race fast race cards. They're getting faster. But we also see the likes you know we didn't talk about it last week much. But the cars like the thirty two team cars like the front row team. We're seeing these cars, run much better, the JT AT carts running in the top fifteen. And we're seeing that, now the pressure is on for another words if they're running fifteenth. I mean somebody else can't and they're getting better and better pushing them out. So the competition level amongst the guys at Team Penske, and Joe Gibbs racing are winning is amazing. You know, we got a lot to talk about on this edition of out loud. The trucks are back in action. They're headed Texas Motor Speedway. Austin hill is gonna join us. He's with the defending championship team and the winner at Daytona earlier this season to tell us what we can expect when we had to the Lone Star state and the Finnity series and the Cup series had to Michigan International Speedway. We'll talk about all that as well. Stay with us here on out loud. 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It's intoxicating. It's the smell of Kyle Busch's, eight season, win and true Xs comeback Pocono, the sweet smell of Eric Jones's first Cup seems wing take a deep breath. And if you smell it to your family now two thousand eighteen was a great season for the Toyota racing family. Buckle up for twenty nineteen follow us a Toyota racing dot com. Toyota. Let's go places. Nascar rich treatment to the national association for stock. Our auto racing. Out loud. What he Kane and Joey Meyer, along with you enjoyed the studio now by Austin hill driver for historic racing enterprises. And the winner at Daytona earlier this season, the defending championship team. Asta welcome to the program. Didn't have you, thanks for having made this first time on, I think this is only the second time in this place. So, you know, I was kind of peeping around and looking at everything it's pretty cool place. Yeah. Don't don't, don't overlook the, the coffee and soft drinks break. Yeah. Those good start to the season. You guys had a little rough spell in the middle. But since then you've reeled off three straight top tens and you're doing pretty well. How do you feel about where you guys stand right now? I think we're doing okay. I feel like we need to be a little bit better just as a whole to win. Races may in Charlotte. I was actually luckily enough to to finish where we did we finished sixth. I I struggled at that place. You know, you're not alone. That's that was the only that, that was the only second time at that racetrack in, and I just I couldn't wrap my head around it a trout running up against the fence, which I don't have a whole lot of background running up against the wall and stuff. So that's kind of new to me trying to do that. And my, my truck just it wouldn't work. You know where I wanted it to, and I felt like I was kind of giving up a little bit. They are. But Scott man, he's, he's good at what he does. And he makes the right call Fidel your Delhi. And he makes the right calls when it matters. And, you know, we were able to come in, and I think we put on some scuffles and we're able to, you know, come back up through there and charge through there. I, I didn't think we really had a out of shot at a top ten. And then then we made it happen. So yeah, there's some positives take away from the last few races. And, you know, like you said, we, we started, you know, a little bumpy. There for a little while. They told her then have a top of Atlanta, and then that little spot right after that. Yeah. Yeah. You know martinsville we were a little off. We still had about eighth-place struck in kinda got booted out of the way, they're, you know, that's martinsville, we just kind of take it with a grain of salt, but, you know, and then we went to Las Vegas and Texas. And man, I, I thought we had a really good truck there at both of those racetracks. We're running third at both tracks before we started having overheating issues in the engine. So you know, I felt like if we had those two racist back, I think we would have probably finished, you know, I definitely felt like we could finish in the top ten when the wreck or anything of that, and no issues on pit road at. But I thought we could ran top-five easily not saying we could have beat call Bush or anything. But I think we could have challenged for everybody at all levels this year. I think we could ran a solid top five and, you know, we probably would be looking at it as martinsville really being the only bad race force this year. So there's definitely a lot of positive, but. You know there's, there's stuff that we've been looking at where we're just that little bit off. You know, we're, we're a fifth sixth seventh eighth place truck. So we just got to kind of turn the corner on that. And just, you know, make that extra one or two adjustments. The to be that little bit better throughout the race. Austin, you started out in two thousand and nineteen coming over to a championship series team. They'd won the championship in two thousand eighteen you step in. I went out of the truck man you're gonna win Daytona. That's awesome feeling. But we're only eight races in here we are in the first part of June already, but there was a relationship building process that everybody goes through, whether it's your fifth year tenth year. Now at your first year, working with Scott zip Adelie, the Mike reach us, your spot, or your crew, we were talking off camera, people don't realize how much time you spend at the shop on, I'm ask, how much time, do you spend trying to build that relationship and you have to clock in clock out? Yeah, man, I, I spend I spend time at the shop every single day. I'm there Monday through Friday, unless something comes up or you know, have something going on there. Really, my, my first priority is to be in the, the race shop, because I want to show the guys that I wanted, just as bad as they, they do you know they're, they're, they're from seven o'clock in the morning. And man, there's been times, I've lifted or five o'clock and they're still digging, and it doesn't look like they're going to slow down anytime soon. So man, they're just all in and it's actually been a pretty easy transition. I've known might greasy when I race Cayenne in, you know, he was he was a really big competitor for us. And you know, he he was the team that we were racing against the majority of the time in Canaan. So I got to know him pretty well. And you know late last year, we got to talk in a little bit, and, you know, so, so when I moved over the transition was pretty easy, just because I knew Mike, greasy. Scott Zipp Adelie. I didn't really know anything about him very much. And so we've kind of entity. Just want to check. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I knew I knew he was good at what he did. That's for sure. So you know it just it, it took a little bit starting off with a win. Obviously smooth things over a lot easier. But, you know when we when we got into the mall and a half and trying to diagnose the truck a little bit him understanding on a mile lingo versus, you know, Brett's, you know, every drivers going to talk a little differently. They're going gonna explain the truck a little differently on what they're feeling versus another driver. So we're, we're steady just trying to get that kind of lingo, and, and communication down, Pat, and I feel like it's getting better each and every week. And like I said, you know, we're going to Texas this weekend, we've already ran there once so that that's going to be nice going back to a track that we ran earlier in the season. Yeah, we didn't get to run the full the full race. But I felt like we had a really good package that we could work on and improve. And I think we're going to have a really good truck. When we go there, I realized, as Joey said that they told us a different beast altogether. But you go. Oh there as the championship team. And you win Daytona, were you at that point? They can. Wow. This is going to be great. Yeah. Yeah. Right. After the that race me and my dad, you know, sat down and talked a little bit. And I was like, man, I, I know it's I know it's just a tone. Everybody says, man, you know anyone can win Daytona volleyball. But just something about that truck at a tone of just I've never felt before in any other truck, I've ever sat in or drove just just the way it the way it drove the, you know, it wasn't real already or anything, you know, a lot lot of teams they're, they're trying to make a lot of speed. So when you're trying to make a lot of speed at a place like Daytona and trim everything out. And, you know, you're running wide open and draft. And there's a lot of times the trucks will be a little Darty in the steering wheel. And they'll kind of move around a lot man, our truck didn't move at all. I it was just it was still new the race track didn't move didn't art. And I saw trucks, you know throughout the race where they're just moving all over the place. And I was like man, art. Our trucks, had no one good for sure. And we have speed. So if we can get up in the lead. I feel like I can put this thing anywhere. I want to and you know, and protect it. And then when we got to Atlanta I laugh on the race track. I didn't do anything different than what I've done in the past, and we were like second or third on the board. You know, it's just it's just got a lot of raw speed was, like, man. This is going to be a fun year, you know, you know, you know, who says daytonas easy to win. Anybody can win it people that haven't won it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Everybody that wins it says, I one Daytona, anybody can win it the people that say that haven't won. It. Yeah. That's true. Yeah. One of the things in the off season. We talked about building relationships. But now the season in the truck race. We've talked about it is so difficult to get going. You had some time off how you enjoyed this time off. Because now you're going to go through three or four weeks stretch where it's weakened weekend weekend racing. Yeah, I know the guys in the shop, they kind of like it because they can get caught up. But as a driver, you hate it. If it was up to me outrace every single weekend. And, you know, I, I try to stay busy. I'm not the the best golfer or anything. But I try to I try to play some golf. So in play with somebody's. But, you know, me and I have a wife and two kids, so we actually went on a cruise two weeks ago. So that was, you know, really nice having six days of just relaxing on a big cruise ship in the middle of the water nothing to do so. Turn your cell phone off. Yeah. Turn the cellphone. When I got back ahead two or three hundred. You know, it was really nice doing that. So but as soon as I got back started, you know, getting back in the gym and trained in this year has been one of the years that I've really focused a lot on training. You know in the in the past, I've tried to are in the past. I haven't really worked out, necessarily as much as I need to, and, you know, I feel a different. Oh man. It's, it's a total difference today. We did you know, this, this cardio, kind of heart rate, monitor deal. And man, I ran ran further than I've ever had him on tire life. So it's been so nice. I feel so much better. I'm trying to watch what I eat and trying to cut some weight. And you know it it's it's been going good this year. This year's just been a blast the notice in the seat of different Savell. Yeah. 'cause, you know, you see all the time these pictures of hundred and thirty hundred and forty degree temperatures inside the vehicle. You guys are racing. You notice that helping you there last like even last year and the year before. There would be racist that you've out of the truck and have a little bit of a headache and just kind of feel a little dehydrated and this year man, I get out of the truck, and I feel like I can go run a marathon. I just I really do. I just I feel like I have so much energy this year. And I, you know, really I never realized that, you know, if you can stay commit in workout or days or five days a week. And you know, you're drinking all a lot of water and you're watching what you eat. And you're eating a lot of greens and a lot of grilled food. How much that actually helps you know, because in the past, I would I'd eat fraud food and not really care. You know, 'cause that's what you like, you know, so I've really, really tried to watch what I watch what I intake in my body, and I just try to work every morning. Get up every morning and go work out in the gym, and it hard for about two hours and then go over the shop. There you go. That's a good way to make it happen. Got a quick time out here on loud. Austin hill is with us from Tory racing enterprises. The winner at they. This year. They're heading to Texas this weekend. We'll talk a little more about that next. I America, it's the mind that you've all been waiting for. That's right. Outback delivery is here. They can enjoy low your affect fibers anyway, has taken to Senate cut SuAn an armed, it's heat will die potty flooded with cook. Borrow wings cheer. It's Steichen loves to for night time it's here. Dot com. Advice, your oldest because affect livery is that Bax typecast Ozzy rules delivery by liberty varies delivery. Judge my apply. Nascar coast to coast on Emma dot com in motoracing networks, Facebook. Join me Kyle Ricky and Hannah. New house, as we talked with the next generation of NASCAR stars and established local and regional racers each Wednesday at one eastern time or subscribe download in listen on your favorite podcast provider NASCAR Costa, coz grassroots NASCAR racing from the motor racing network. Hi, this is my faculty. Join me in the rest of the crew every Tuesday night for nest par law will get you up to date on the latest news stories and ready for the upcoming race weekend. So many crazy things happen there. You know, it's one of those races, where anything can happen, especially the end here, exclusively interviews, expert analysis, and much more. It's nest par lot this Tuesday night at seven eastern on the motor racing network. Ran out loud, what he can't enjoy Meyer with you, as we review. What happened in Pocono, what's going to happen at Texas, where the trucks and Michigan with a Cup and expanded series? Often hill is our guest here in the studio and talking during the break there. You mentioned that you never got the race on Texas under the old, configuration. So this new one is the only one you've experienced and everybody says, oh well all the mile and a half or cookie cutters. But that's not really the case is they're all the same and all that had they're definitely different. And a place like Texas is a lot different than than most that we go to three and four is kinda cut and dry your, your watt open if you're not wide open your trucks, pretty far off, so three and four you're pretty wide open, the whole race, unless you're really tucked up under somebody and get an arrow push than you might lift one into is man. It's, it's, it's it can be a nightmare. You know, you really got a lift at a at a certain point, you wanna lift kind of early, and then feed the gases earliest possibly because since you're not lifting in three and four the earlier, you pick up the gas in one and two and carry that momentum all the way down the back straightaway all the way through three and four all the way through the front stretch back to turn one, you know, dictates your, your lap time and how fast you're going. So that's something that I've really tried to work on it. That place is not overdrawing the corner in that corner so easy to overdrive is so wide on entry. You can you can enter four wide five lot. If you want to it feels like because it's just so wide on entry, and it's really flat. So you feel like you can drive in really deep. But really, if you, if you back it off two or three truck link sooner and then feed the gas that much sooner it, just it just creates laptop. And you know you keep your momentum a lot better. I love the track I ever since I've been there, we've, we've had speed there last year with, with Yong's. We finish this. Last year in the second race. And like I said, you know earlier that I felt like we were really fast this year, you know, we were running third before we overheated. So I'm man, I'm I'm more than excited to get there. I feel like it's attracted that we really run. Well, at and that I kind of comprehend and I'm excited for you. One of the things you mentioned about your Daytona truck was how differently it. Drove from your previous trucks, and how stable it was. You went to Atlanta run. Really? Well, now when you go to Texas, do you find yourself running very similar setups as the previous driver with, with those guys or are you guys going down your direction or how does that? How does that meshwork? Yes. So, you know, we, we've been trying some different setups when you win early in the season like we did win in the very first rights advocate union. Try stuff, so me and sky and a few other guys in the shot, we sat down and talked and we were like, hey, do do we want to stay with the setups that we ran last year and just kind of? See where it goes and see how Austin likes setups and see how fast we are. Do we want to experiment a little bit and try stuff? So you we've, we've done a little bit of experimenting this year. You know not at all the race tracks. It's kinda worked and we've always had a backup plan. But for the most part, we're, we're kinda we're kinda come in with the same similar setup that, that they had last year with a few little minor tweaks. But, but like I said, we're also trying some, some little little things, you know, nothing big, but we're trying, some little things here and there that, hopefully at the end of the season, you know, will help us only when we get to the final. Layoffs. I'll ask you the same question. We ask a lot of the guys from the truck and extended series who come in here, and I suspect your answer will be similar, but are you, one of the guys who relishes the opportunity to race against the guy like Akabusi or do you want him to stay away and let you guys have all your all your glory? I, I wish ran all twenty three races. Twenty four races, where the I think it's great for us drivers counted come up through the ranks, you know, somebody that, that is, is good. Is, is what he does it may I wanted to be him. So bad no one that he only was your own in five races. Or however, many it was this year I wanted to beat him so bad. And I felt like whilst Vegas and Texas where the two tracks that if it was going to happen, was probably going to happen, those two tracks, and unfortunately, it didn't it didn't, you know, having the issues, and who knows if we could out random anyways, but, you know, I felt like we really good. And I hate that he's not going to be running anymore this year. I really do. You know, I see it on social media all the time that you know Cup drivers should come down the ranks and race and xfinity and rayson trucks and all that. But I, I think you ask any any driver in the truck series or expanding the they, they like the competition. They like race somebody that hopefully one day you're running in Cup. You're going to be racing against some anyway. So why not, you know, gone to go ahead and run against them and see see where you stack up and see where you need to do better. Every guy we've asked us at the same thing. Yeah. Bring them on. We will raise them. Oh man. I, I wish we could keep racing them. I I I wanted to beat him so bad. I know everybody else out on the racetrack did too. But and when, when I was told that, you know, he was running those races, as I. All right. We're, we're going to give it to him, you know, we're going to do all we can to outrun them and it just didn't happen. Instantly takes your bar and raises it right now. Because you, you know, you feel confident you can beat other drivers compete, or when he comes in. He just raises the. Bar and that's from a racing standpoint. That's all you can ask from every other team. It's frustrating and we're going to do a little Karoo gripe session, if we will right here, one of the things we hear about Cup drivers and series is very similar to what my soapbox is weakened. It is very simple. And it's very similar to what we're going to hear after Sunday's rates right? Sunday's race. Everybody's going to clamor about instead of complaining. The Kyle Busch won a expand eraser a truck race. We're going to clamor this week in about how bad the Pocono raceway, and that's frustrating to me because not every single event. Can we watch on TV football hockey baseball boxing? I mean, how many years have we see Mike Tyson on pay per view? Knocked out and twenty seconds, right after you've paid dollars or whatever the pay per view, teen round fight. I got to watch twenty seconds of people got to watch twenty seconds Pocono offers a unique opportunity. It's a unique racetrack. So that therefore means the race. Itself is unique. We've had really good experiences with this configuration of racing with the big spoiler, the tapered, spacer so forth. But remember, the Finnity when they tried this on the extended last year that series there after the all star race. And everyone. Oh, we gotta do this all the time. Right. And it didn't work out so well for the Finnity cars, it's just a matter, as sometimes when you have a new configuration or a old configuration, the race track is still. We talked about it one hundred times on his show. Every racetrack has a personality. You just got done talking about the new Texas with the flat or one and two relatively old Texas which was a standard mile and a half. It now has a new personality doesn't matter whether the trucks, go there. The expanding goes there. The Cup cars. Go there Poconos, the same way the trucks are going to go on a couple of weeks. Back to Pocono with the with the Cup cars and put on a very similar show that we saw on Sunday. It's what that track offers nobody's forcing you to watch this stuff. If you're gonna watch it just accept the fact that it's Polk. Yeah. No. This is a unique racetrack that was built longtime ago inherited of three different race tracks which is really, it's a great environment to go to visit personally, it's a great infield experience. They got one of the best ever dog parks. You've ever seen it a racetrack called dog park. Really? Wow. Create exactly. Talk park. But it's beautiful the playground for the children. I drove into the race track with Paul Menard this weekend. And we talked about how great the playgrounds were, it's a unique opportunity where else can you go see a thirty five hundred foot foot rush straightaway a three thousand foot long pond? Straightaway. Three different corners, just unique. Don't talk about how bad the racing is go in there. Expecting? That's the way that track races that simple. We're not surprised at the type of racing. We saw Pocono, just accept it. Again. The cream rose to the top. We saw Gibbs car win again who finished second, by the way. Oh a Penske car. So again, it doesn't matter what kind of track rat, we're going to see the similar results from these race teams until the other teams pick up their effort and figured out man, we knew going into the season, somebody or a few somebody's would figure it out, and be the rabbit that happens every year in every serious speaking of that Kabul did when the race and he was asked again about the package. What he had to say. I go man. I just do what I'm supposed to do. I try to drive as hard as I can as fast as I can. If there's a car in front of me, I try to pass. So much every way I can do that. I try to do it, and if I can't do it, there's days that I'd get ultimately frustrated because I don't feel like my true talents can show on the racetrack because I'm too limited by the air of everything. That's kind of going around around me that I can't make I can't do anything as a racecar driver when you can't do anything and you can't showcase what your abilities are. And how good you should be. Or you feel like you are then. There's, there's certainly some some tense moments and some high frustrations and today that it was going to be that day early on in the race. We couldn't really pass. But then there towards the end I, I don't know how Boyer got by me. He got a good run off a turn one, I guess, and got in front of me. But then a couple of weeks later, I was able to give back by luckily, so I don't know. There you go. Kyle busch. And that brings me to when I wanted to say about this whole situation, a lot of people have described when he doesn't like the package and says, though, and he's been that way from the beginning of the year. It's not like he's been a like at one week. I don't like it the next week, but he's got four wins thirteen top ten finishes out of fourteen races eight top fives. If anybody in leading the points if anybody has standing to say what they really think about this package good or bad. It's that guy. He's the one who's been racing and winning with it. You can say it sour grapes, but he's winning. That's the difference. That's the difference to me. If another driver, I e the most popular driver in the garage that one most popular driver or a pass, fifteen time most popular driver said the exact same thing. People would have more credibility. They would give it more credibility. Unfortunately, because of who saying that with the race winner four times this year. He's at sour grapes. Which makes no sense because just like you said he won the race. Right. It's not like he's, he's saying that from a thirty fifth place finish or something, right? He won. No. And in his frustration when you drive around a racetrack, you're essentially wide open minimal breaking mostly intern one. We use a little breaks, but you're driving around wide open. You're just like you said he's not able to showcase his talents. But most of the time when we hear people complaining about the new configuration of the guys aren't winning what he's winning the race simple as that he does have credibility and saying it because we all see it. We all get frustrated with this configuration of race car because it does take away a little bit of what the drivers allowed to do. And also, I think a lot of the way the Cup series is now is similar to trucks in that it's much more momentum based, isn't it? Oh, yeah. Yeah. For sure. I don't know where I heard it out. But I heard I heard call Bush say something about, you know the Cup cars. Drove a lot like trucks. And I told my dad when he said that, I said, these boys are in trouble, this year, if it drives, just like the trucks, because I know how good he is in trucks. There's just something about the trucks he can keep the momentum up you. There's just things he does. And I try to watch. Dr phil. I try to watch anything. I can on that guy. To, to do better. It must be doing something. Yeah. He's doing something right? Because he gets around the racetrack. It doesn't matter what track your at he gets around the track. So good. And he in the trucks were Cup or anything. He's just he's just that good. And kind of what I what I took away from from listening to that is he just wants a car that eat? He can pass with Khimik any difference himself to make a difference with because I've seen it time and time again this year and not knocking the package at all. But I've seen time and time again where there's a guy this a lot fashion. The gone the then the guy that's in front of him. And he just can't go nowhere. He stuck and you heard Cal that he's he says he gets stuck and you know, you heard radio in Charlotte him saying that you can't do nothing. But what that means is he's just he's stuck. He can't. He can't make passes. He's getting irritated. He he just wants to have a, a package where when he comes up on a gun. He's that much fashion them. He can move around the racetrack in and get out of the wake a little bit and make ground. And, and he's, he's obviously not seeing that this year. Yeah. Absolutely. I think the me the big the big difference is this was designed this package to help at mile and a half tracks because that was where the racing was viewed as the least competitive or the least, compelling, and it has look at what happened at Kansas and Charlotte. For example. Now granted Kansas was a night race Charlotte finished under the under the lights as well. Maybe it's that it likes those cooler temperatures of the night racing whatever but to me, it's made a significant difference on the mile and a half, which is what the point was. Yeah. Let's do something a little different now. We haven't done this before, but we've got a movie trailer to show you guys this week and don't worry. It's not a rom com or anything like that Ford versus Ferrari. It's got Christian bale Matt Damon in this thing. And it's pretty cool. Take a look. Look out there out, there is the perfect one. She. I think so. Most people can't. Carroll shelby. Maybe the coke Ford mode. Suppose Henry Ford, the second one into Bill the greatest race car. The world's ever seen twin the twenty four hours of Lamont. What's it take? I'll take something money can't buy when he combined speed. What about speed? We need a pure racer behind the wheel, your car S, Ken miles. I don't trust him an inch. We heard he's difficult. No Kenza puppy dog. No. Whatever it is show. No. Trust me. You gonna build a car to beat for our with a fold correct? How long did you tell the inning two to three? You'll new Deitch non today's. This isn't the first time Ford. Motors gone to war. We know how to do more than push paper. Kale. Go to war. Thank you, sir. Do you think you can beat for all? Lider faster. Not don't work for nastier. History. You ready? That was born ready. Mr. Shelby, hit it. Man that, that that trailer, right? There makes who want to go watch it. That's. Yeah. Yeah. I'm gonna I'm definitely going to watch that. As soon as it comes out. That's pretty cool. Yeah. Carroll Shelby one of the most famous car builders of all time, and then Christian bale in his real yours, you will. Yes, British accent. He uses American accent. And a lot of movies we've seen, but that's going to be really cool. I met men. Yeah. No, you're not that bad. You're definitely not Batman. All right. We gotta take a quick break. We'll be right back with more here on Moran out loud after this. Get IN America. It's the mind that you've been waiting for. That's right. Outback delivery is here. They enjoy low affect by anyway, has sticking to Santa Katsuo in on its he will guide. I potty planets with cook them our wings tight fear. It's steichen. Love for Dighton on at high. It's here. Dot com. Advice your oldest because affect liver? Is that back? Stike cast, Ozzy rules delivery. Viability varies delivery, judge might apply. Hey guys, it's Dylan while he's Tyler Burnett, where the coast of the rip the fence podcast if you like traditional non wing dirt track racing, we've got the podcast for Kane meal. Try to drive away. Can't do everything. But I could do anything and everything I'll want him before I got injured. So I'm just like many of the great podcast going, we invite racers in to talk, and they tell us their life story and it's how I feel that matters. It's the rep defense podcast available on M R N dot com and your favorite podcast app. The battle for the twenty thousand nine championship will be filled with twists and turns we gotta kinda calm down for these people are racist because you can use the bumper. But you ended up taking ten other people with you each. Weekday NASCAR today brings you the top stories in the sport. That's totally different experience for me in the garage at the track or behind the scenes. Nascar today keeps you up to speed every weekday go. What are we going to lose? I don't know. Try it, right. All right. Out loud, presented by outback steakhouse, what he came, Joey Meyer and Austin hill with us in the gander outdoors truck series. The winner at Daytona heading back to Texas for the second time you told us a little bit about what you expect personally. But what kind of a race do you expect at Texas, this time, do you think with the the higher temperatures were expecting? It'll be much different. I, I don't think it's going to be a whole lot different. I think you know, I think it might be a little bit to start off. But I think, as you know, as it goes into tonight it's going to be pretty much the same race. You're still going to have, you know, the resource are going to be crazy. They're going to be three wide. Maybe even four wide. That's something this year that, that I've been really trying to be a lot better at as my restart. Some. It's so critical now. Oh man it, you know you restart in six place, I and say you don't get through the gears or good. And you don't get through turns one and two. Very good next thing you know you're running twelve. Really do anything different. So you just got to be really aggressive even on the initial start of the race. I know you have one hundred thirty or forty laps before the end of the race. But even on lap one, you got to be on on kill mode. You got to just go you clean air. Doesn't it plain air so huge? And anytime I've been inside the top five this year, you can tell just such a huge difference on in the way the truck handles rather than being end. Seven eight nine tenth place. The truck handles totally different once you get back in that dirtier air and, you know, you adjust on that when you're in eighth place, and then you get up in, in the top three or four or five and next thing you know it's loose, you know. And it might have been tight, then so it's definitely a, a huge balance. And so, so you don't wanna you don't wanna lose the, the, you know, the clean air. Yeah, you're one of the things you have looked forward to is, we've got a plethora of race Rex coming up. You have to be excited man had no no breaks here. Get. Oh, yeah. And you know, triple truck challenge coming up. Big money on man. I'm stoked. I, I think these races are going to be, you know, that much more crazy these three races. And I hate for somebody to be in front of me on the last laugh and maybe run a second. The live. That's Austin hill, geysers joined us here. They'll be racing at Texas, this coming weekend, motoracing network will be with you for qualifying. That comes your way at five thirty eastern time on Friday, the race itself, eight thirty eastern time at Texas Motor Speedway. Also, don't forget before that. We've got NASCAR live every Tuesday night at seven o'clock eastern time with your host, Mike Bagley. Meanwhile, the expenditure series and the Cup series will be headed to Michigan International Speedway. They qualify at noon on Saturday this weekend. That's a little bit different. The expenditure race right after that, at one o'clock eastern time and the fire keepers casino, four hundred one o'clock eastern time on Sunday. Kim Kun we'll be back with me on the free ratio for Joey Meyer. I'm what he came that's Austin hill. Catch him at Texas this weekend. That's where I'll be Joel Viet Michigan. Thanks for joining us. Again, everyone Joey, and I'll be right back here next Monday for M R N out loud on the motor racing network. You'll do it right. To grow the fest garden. You can't lows does it right to savings on MIR grow potting mix with fertilizer to help you get growing in bro. Plants twice as big versus unfed plants pick up a fifty court bag now for just ten dollars. Plus get Vanni two point three to court vegetables and herbs three for ten dollars for garden. 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Romance & Finances! Should Money Matter In a Relationship?
"David speaks podcast. Is the premier relationship podcast. That explicitly deals with relationship matters from a woman's point of view. No subject is off limits relationship and challenges sex intimacy dating infidelity finances. heartbreak and situation ships are all a part of the discussion. Your relationship nations ship matters welcome. Welcome welcome was sub. BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE WELCOME TO DIVA speaks. podcasts this is your host is the one and only anger gala the diva. I want to welcome you all to this. I don't want to say happy Halloween. This dreary dreary Halloween night on Thursday. Today is October thirty first and I have something special planned for your ears ears tonight so I want you to sit back because I have my trustee side kick my co host my special guests. Yes and one of my dearest friends. Steve from Midwest City is on the line Steve. Go ahead and say hello to our audience alone. Hello and if they could respond. I'm sure they would say no. You know what let's keep it real. There probably are some people in our audience. Who are not doing so well so we hope that this will be entertained? Entertaining informative you've educational and something that you can actually benefit from right. Is that what we're going to do today right. Okay so you guys I always like to start off my podcast by thanking you for your support of divas speaks podcast. Cast I am your average. Well I'm far from average. No I'm not average. I'm your everyday woman okay. Who has been through through some life experiences and I have taken notes and so and one aspect I feel qualified to come on the Mike and deliver some responsible and entertaining content about relationships? My goal is to have conversations on the Mike with you the type of conversations that we generally hold us girlfriends when we're together okay the type of conversations you're gonNA find at House parties okay when you get a mammogram house or grandmum house. Those conversations you know and the type that you find yourself unexpectedly in at at the beauty shop of the barber shop. You know Steve Those kind of conversations right so real some real adult conversation. So if you're not open minded and if those are not the type of conversations that tickle your fancy well get used to it because that's what the diva speaks. PODCAST is all about. And I'm very unapologetic about itself. If you have a disagreement or a grievance will what I say on the Mike I invite you to the email me at Davis speaks official at G. MEAL DOT COM and please took me up on facebook my my little pages just struggling. I only have about twenty six twenty five members. I think one of them left. Maybe twenty four search facebook is David speaks actually two words on facebook and I'm on instagram. David speaks official on instagram. So be sure to look got my pages like follow comment. Whatever you want you can also find divas speaks on any podcast platform as well as YouTube? So with all of that. Out of the way. Steve I wanNA talk about some things. Can we talk. Do you WanNa know what we're going to talk about sir. Let me know ever not no. I tried okay. So how about this. Let's chop it up about how important important our finances in a relationship. How important our finances when you're dating How Moore should finances be factored into when you are about due to enter into a relationship with someone should finances be factored into who? You're going to select as sure children's father because I don't want to be you know ghetto about it. I hate the term Baby Mama Baby Daddy but if you can relate to that the Nacuer then fine should did you factor in finances when you are planning to have a child with someone. So Steve Pick one of my questions unless less chop it up go with dating dating for data yes okay. So how about this. I was in one of my groups. My mini in multiple entertaining groups in a young lady. The asked this question she says. Is it wrong of her to want to date someone who is more financially financially stable than she is and basically who has more money. That was her goal. So let me repeat she asked the question on one on one of the facebook platforms. Was it wrong of her to basically have a dating preference for men who were more financially stable than she had basically had more money. So I responded in the comments and I said well you get your preferences your a preference you can want what you want. No one can fault you for that. Just make sure the gentleman that you're choosing doesn't want the same thing that you do because then you would would be Sol. Sugar honey iced tea out of luck because then he would want someone who's on you know basically his level financially eh or above. But what say you Steve Wrong for it. You think she's what pressures because Um Does does moving. On what would Steve Harvey and the young lady was going for more Cessna. Two six figure guy. Great Smile and everything. The G may have auto criteria. You won't but you might not be the person Tweeden so you might miss the actual person because it is financed now. He may have every job. macdonalds anywhere. Like this sorry. I'm sorry I know it's kind of early for me to be going for the jugular but can we take McDonald's off the table. I mean because my audience mark audience of we've evolved. We're not McDonald's people we're talking to more financially st established people in this particular. Yeah Take Mc Donald's where like I will the mine coming coming to incoming took because you never know what to my our time again. They'd all day so when you get a job up instead of sitting on accounts so you never know what a person come from what you've been through so she's Ralph offer. The for the fact is a per man to head the tribe. He's GonNa work provide wherever whatever a job working at. He's going to be the best pudding day he'd been may not do go get a degree like that young lady did no got a six for your job or close to six hundred job. The fact is he's doing the best she can what he don't you never know God putting your life. Is she better him. Different ways are dead because it goes hand in hand. What wait a minute what? Oh Don Also tired of people like you why I got into your life and teach you something long. Don't retire then please. Oh you're tired of it but you let me finish my guy woman. He don't care where she works. He he sees sees what he won't woman are that she she can be a potential for French. She'd be working at Ross working at the mall. She's been working to contain she. The job don't define heard a what color when it comes to man job because ultimately the way that life has been set up up or we most of us have been taught that men to be providers so so it does matter to a lot of women. What type of job Tom? In earning capacity that you have sir so you Kinda lost me at right out the gate with the whole McDonald's in them only speaking. I'm only speaking to people in our age category. Now for you young people that may be tuning in this is not for you. I'm not I'm not downing your hustle. I'm not downing your ability to try and work your way up through life. But we're talking about people in in our mid forties so if you've got a guy forty okay okay. The fact is the standard is that you just said to God Jose provided but we know the fifty to forty forty two income to exit to making nowadays dating. You said we're gonNA start with dating because that's where it start so if you're working at McDonald's are you in a position today maybe maybe okay eh Like I made that point like I just say Ford Women stand is not there for Webby work. I was still have. I've seen you you want to talk to you for for women you could be ms now. You'll king because he is working at a place that you don't feel what you're the criteria what you were like put it that way. Okay so okay hold on okay okay see. Yeah and maybe she should miss out. Because I think Cadad- if a woman has to set the bar so let's just take for instance the woman this making eighty five thousand to one hundred thousand dollars a year okay and understand as far as being a black woman that there is a shortage of available black men if that's your preference to have a black man. So Oh how low is a woman to set her standards just to have a man so I'm out here making anywhere from eighty five g eighty five thousand thousand to one hundred grand. And you're telling me that God wants me to be with you because you working at McDonald's and that's the best that you can do what I'm saying. 'CAUSE did this is. This is happening to a lot of women out here today. I want you to know that you said that. Why a lot of women Eh? Professional and get the money are bottom to. You'RE GONNA Spanish because the potential that guy so you're going instead. He has a job job. He's not sitting on the couch and drive your car. He has his own plane. And did you Jewish information. I I work at a forty two thousand dollar job. You work at eighty five thousand three or four years five years. Six years. Say McDonalds so McDonald's anymore that's why I say let's change it up and said place I'll for women standards lowest. I'm not looking down Kata but say oh God. It's making forty two. Let's talk about average of upper managers measured a wherever you work. That debt is about the average pay for a hardworking Americans. Forty to fifty if she making eighty but he he's established at his job up he got his own place he has his own call. You'll have you'll have a whole bunch of different things around. She just missed out on a hardworking man because his numbers don't match hers but yet he has. It's all you see them and saying you have a point. I do a pod understand. The average working person in America makes forty two in a semi pro. Yeah Okay so let me ask you this. So let's just go with the scenario that you've just painted with Amanda Making perhaps into in the forties and the woman making twice that much and they're dating okay so is it expected that because does he earns less than she does that she is to pay for the dates or go Dutch with him. Or how does that work. What is the expectation of a man and with the woman is bringing twice twice as much to the table or has more to offer in terms of income? How does that work not GONNA pay everything? Okay so we'll point eight point up until she realized she's not with me for my up to a point that utilized this made he's giving me the world of wedding gangs and issue black. You know what they've been there. I've been at the shore about this because she made more might not need I. I'LL PAM four to six months July. I'm making aww money. She's making good money after everything. I can't pay for some traditional data star when Danish days into relationship push hoping. Okay mom okay but I get that I mean once a woman once it either party in the you know either party that when they're dealing with each other when filling start to change and I start to care about you then of course I mean you know you want a to contribute and invest into the relationship. I totally get that. I totally get the you know fun. Been John Because the guy would make comments. He'll make new best noise standard. He's a good guy. He treated like a Queen Gene. Would he have you have to recognize that. Okay take forty to sixty guy missed out and you no no no why. You know the jury's out on that one sorry beautiful but you know you know what I did want to say is that I'm just kidding. Guys Steve is is a good guy. He's one of my dearest dearest friends so I don't I don't WanNa put that into the atmosphere like I'm questioning the fact that he's a good guy. No He's a good guy any single ladies. He's very very very very single. But here's here's what I what I know. Personally Steve the women that go After or don't have experience with men who have a lot of money. I think I'm I'm trying to be very careful what I say because I want to be responsible. You know as far as the content that I'm delivering on the podcast. The thing about like the the young lady pose the question in the group you know she was wanting. Excuse me a particular caliber of UH of a man bribe with the specific income. You know I was very careful not to really talk about her whole post. Because I don't WanNa be tacky like like that but some women don't understand is the fact that the more money a man has the more income especially the more disposable income man has and if you have substantially less than he does let me tell you something they have far more options. Then just you and when you're dealing with that caliber of a man you're gonNA put up with a lot of crap. There's a lot that they bring to the table. It's not always the good sugar. Honey ICED tea. And I think that you know in this society that we live in today. Everybody's so caught up in who's bringing what and how much you're bringing to the table that they forget the excess baggage that comes with that. Can you back me up with you. Know because he no and when you're speaking you're talking about it a lot of guys that do have a lot of money areas there myself and you knew I might be wrong but the thing is a lot of rich guys are making thank wide still with them. They made that money they want made a six billion of most of them. I know about four or five guys is in my personal data. That wait now. I know a couple of guys that made money with their wives and oil they novel when a cotton. I know some guy this money by themselves in. Yes you have have to really put up with a lot of stuff. 'cause the first thing that guy's gone thank you only want me because my money and sorry to say in society today that it that is a lot of stipulations in his heart. By somebody who Jay. We won't you for you you like you said I'm disagreeing with you as how offer personality down to what kind of entertainment came in you know like You know not not to really talk about anybody's business but you know where I stay right and there are are a lot of extremely wealthy single people. I'm where I live. Men Athletes People in the medical profession. People in you know attorneys in a few entertainers and Dan just from what I see with my own eyes. The single guys I mean they parade the beautiful women in and out of at this place. You know like you know is Tuesday and they. I mean they can do that. You know but you gotta think like for every woman or young lady comes here. She thinking that she's the WanNa she's thinking that she's got something special. That's going to hold his attention and and she's thinking that she has a cat because Oh my God look where he lives. He drives this. He's got this much money and you're just the number so I just think that sometimes we have to be careful with really just wanting I want him to have dishing DAB because you sign enough for you know. Aw Like I said early Essex Excess baggage that you may not be prepared to deal with. Because I think Steve Harvey once said you know the more money a man has counted like dictates his options the more money the more option. Yeah so you know what you think in one of my badge and said sometime men and women are blessed morning again because getting more you'll probably lose they mind mm-hmm parade like you say in and out women in and out women from my parents would deal more the guy who had that money in the same situation with a guy that don't have that much is true. Very true is very true. I I think that Ed because you know as a woman just from the woman aspect of it and let me say this for the dumb answers out there. 'cause I got some people that listened to the podcast and and miss the you know they just get it all wrong. I'm speaking on relationships. I am happily married with my heart. espy okay I I am now. I'm speaking because you know I never ever forget where I come from. I've been a single woman before so inbetween marriage number one and number two. I got some stories but I think what people forget. Ed what was I going with this Steve. Thank you not picking topic out a book right. I just think that men like men that have money have options number one and they just rarely you will find one in today's society just ready to settle down when you meet him especially if you're not operating on his level and we're not gonNA call any names so I'm not going to give a specific city but you know once upon a time a few years ago remember you know such and such with the not very very expensive cars and properties. It was it was just like you know. They had their pick of women all over the globe. And you know you just number so yeah but the going back. Two men have the money to have. Ati women have the money. They're paid bull. Why is it the no? But here's here's what I want to ask. It gets a little tricky with that because of the shortage of good quality men dateable man commitment. Ready men I just see a lot more four successful women who when they have money and they earn substantially more than their saddling because because we opened up the show with Talkin about the gentleman who works at McDonalds versus the chicken was earning eighty five but when a man has more money. So you're seeing what I'm saying. I'm saying that tail warble. Pin just pretty much saying because a lot of men that have money by themselves they have that option so when new gives them a headache they are get four or five hours already there that woman that woman walked at six for God. AH YOU'RE GONNA have to deal with that. You're going to have to deal with day. You know what I'm saying. Steve Uses Eh. Just now that if you're dealing with a man who has you know all of this excess income or disposable income that you're dealing with somebody who has four or five options you you know that goes for broke ass tyrone to broke ass tyrone who has no job and is not willing to do anything for himself himself or the next person has four five options right girl. Women don't have a medium you say some okay. I'm sorry again. My mother used to tell me that you show women majority of them. Don't we'll have needed need them because we discussed it. I'm dating more women that streaming audio other women a lot of money fall into that category. Oy and then meeting in the metal get a little foam is ecology tunein. or You. Don't make money or he. He got he get himself together. Where you don't need me some go down to the other guy I am? Ready for. Commitment commissioned right woman though not just anybody anybody so as you say in your petition gathering because I'm lacking a six figure well and you know what's it was crazy though with you being in the middle and I think I think you're in a dangerous position as we talk. Oh Body because either some women settling for you know below the bar or their reach into some of them are reaching too high. Oh you know what I was thinking that some of the people that are reaching for the you know. That's not just this dog the women but you know if you are that person who seeking someone Juan who has substantially more than you than. We're talking about you too but you know what's crazy is that when you look on social media and you see all of this foolishness going on and I think in an earlier edition of my podcasts. I played a clip of this. This chick right. She was in the passenger and just seat of a car and she was talking about you know she. She don't won't do taking her to a movie going out to e she want to do it if you ain't trying to pay her bills she's not dealing with you so the point. I'm getting it now as I see a lot of women that are looking for a meal ticket you know. They think that all that they have to bring to the table is looks and body some of them not all of them. Because there's a lot of women that are really super successful. restful and really out here grinding. But you're thinking that because you're Yuga bundles and mink lashes. And Your nells Don on and you have your waist trainer. You're wasting snatching. You got designer labels on your back that that's enough to secure sure. The bag with this man may be enough to secure his attention for a Moma. But if that's all you bring into the table I mean what does that word is with. This society does mean that do plan today to death word. Majority of the people fall into that pool guys. They've flashing. I take care of whatever you won't move but it's only for a moment is all in for a moment and so is collect sandwiches. What you call with women thinking brain something table? That's a guy like I'll pay for everything and that's what society is has gotten. It's Douglas I would want them to the local club. I got two thousand three Latin navigator paid off in one guy pulled up an event. You'll get nice all all of this. I won't get one builds a women's they were looking at him and you're looking at me and I saw laughing it is. I know it's like what you laugh. And how you balance of payment I normally I normally enough to where we can talk like. This is as five fifty choosing Nuba myself is paid off that five fifteen in my apartment tonight. Hey that's right 'cause I really don't payment but it is a many that way but we live in a shallow society. I mean that's to be expected but you know the type of woman that would go for that you know versus all the other stuff I mean. Do you really want that type of woman. I mean if she if if the corvette catches her eye versus the guy it versus looking nice you know you look very nice. You cling smelling good swift. Kick you out to have the time you got a pocket full of money you know. If the corvette called her attention she chooses to go with that guy. That says a lot about her. No that's not what society is. It's a lot of me. Okay thank you thank you. That's what caught his attention not love. Not I'm GonNa tell betting you beneath the car which mandatory if she doesn't listen if she doesn't have the Round Brown oh pretty ass. Dick Small way waste hair lake. Faith beats the guards. You're not you're not picking her over the chicken. They may be slightly overweight. You know she may not have all the hair in her hair. She made me wearing her natural hair. You know you guys can be just a shallow as women because you want the bad as one. You want the bad as Ohio so you can follow her to your roomies. Am I right so the woman so we can. No I'm not gonNA say we we. We can't knock the woman that shows does the corvette over the paid off Lincoln navigator. Because you know you've mean do it's us but in a different area except like jets original statement that we don't look at those dead get the beauty beauty. It is important. I think beauty is absolutely important. I mean you know I'm that girl. I'm that chick I love to look beautiful. I love to look good for my man myself when we go out in public. I WANNA turn heads if you ain't looking. I done some right now. I'm just kidding. Just kidding I'm just kidding but if you want to catch up because we don't win is women liquidate hard so we we look. What is who told you that we absolutely looking at not do not? Do you need to clarify the women women heart multiples out of a main not initially getting femme. Not Initially the police. There is no woman out here meeting you at a sporting event or sports bar or at the club out there with her heart. Would you. How you AH packaged and put together what you're looking for and what you're driving? We are looking. We are visible. Yeah all my hat person initial coats your heart. You've lost your magic touch in touch. Yeah Okay but you know things a little bit. I WANNA flip the. I'm GONNA FLIP so okay so we're we've just talked about the woman or the people who want to date above of their status. So if that's you that's your business preference. Hey we just talking about it but let's talk about how dating beneath your status to you know. I think it's unfortunate that it's a lot of and I'm placing the onus on women. I I see a lot of women is Charlotte Day beneath them emmy if they not going in there para span for something then you know what they will never go out because they're dating and in relationships in marriages in having children with bombs like you will never know the see the benefits of having a man take you out on a date you will never know what it feels like having having your man say well you know what baby go. Let's go shopping and you can buy yourself something nice or you know you. You are living with this person person and you have into all of the bills because he brings nothing to the table except maybe a wet one. Let's talk about about that because it seems like you know. Some people are willing to be in relationship minus the finances because they see what they want. This five good they just go for it. And that's why we says women. Having babies with a deadbeat veto would be. This is hard to say. But that's their fault because he he or she gave him all the side before forty gave all the side that they wanted to be there. So what are some of the signs that a guy is just not there financially besides the obvious the obvious being no job no stability and no vehicle so what what what. What are some of the obvious? Ah The assigns that you will bump or you would somebody that does not have the finances. bumming money bills. They build always on me. Who you always having to go in your purse and pay for things us to go somewhere? Well you know I think to can I can I. Can I offer some use. My just not personal. I think That if you're with someone and you're always having to initiate going or doing anything saying that's the problem. The finances are not there. I think if you're with a man or a woman will I'm I'm the woman so so I'm speaking from the woman's perspective. I think that if you're with a man and he's never taken you on a vacation and you've been with him for a while then you're with someone who's not financially stable does not have the finances or maybe just not into you like that option awesome so for me myself. I think that you know some of the some of that. If I was single when I was single some of qualifiers for me would dating and you can let me know what what your checklist was or is because you're currently single you know basic stuff. We're talking about very elementary employment number one. You know a bank account whether it's chicken and or a savings account you know some investments and I'm not talking about Gucci built right I'm talking about some real right. I'm talking about maybe a four one K.. That you know he's invested in or some stock options or some real estate. How about some some home ownership? How maybe a healthy amount of disposable income which is the amount now that you're left after all of the bills are paid and you put some money aside into savings account? Those are the things that you know once upon a time when when I was seeing good that I looked at and you know let's not forget credit but of course when you're dating this is it will become a tacky as what's your credit score but as you get to know someone. I think that they'll should be things that you definitely should consider. If you are a woman that is about your salt. I mean dating bomb. Tom Should we should leave that. Definitely Twenty nineteen but a long time ago. Some people people slow. Some people are definitely slow. Some people don't really pay attention to finances. But what's your experience much. I know why Oh you think. Let me add several streams of income on definitely a man without a hustle and not destroy of not the street poverty hustle. He only had one job. Yes lifted jobs paying well. He's troubling because a real man. Dan always have a host of cans off the road. You'll have a hustle no I. I'm a handyman of mechanic. Do all this stuff. So I've paid out. It always have extra ups so the thing is a woman should realize announcing his quote to deal with if you WANNA welcome everybody to deal with a busy me do everything within his power to extract mean but let's not confuse that the ladies let's not because he just said if you if you don't WanNa on a broke man then you're going to. You're going to have to deal with a busy man but let's not get that confused because you know some people are GonNa take that. Will you know he busy and make aac excuses. For the lack of effort people will make time for what they want into. The time will be. Have you gotTa have up down correct young couple. And she complained about him the Regan when she told me that she loved Pam because he was too busy right. Now he's successful. He had multi mini business online. Had his own business beer garden scene program at all this stuff in his built a brand new thirty five hundred foot square foot awesome. Okay now you have all the time the world that home so therefore some of the struggles that women come out the answers. Obstacles Challenges Launches where. Yeah the challenges you have bestow town this one we talked about last. PODCAST sometimes struggle. But the indy the in good now it's only been two or three years ago so my point is my point. Is that a woman woman. Dead feel cheated title. You're not gonNA kidding. Because they feel I'm not gonNA break my back with somebody that don't appreciate appreciate okay. Okay okay okay. Something just came to mind. Okay so oh I know. I'm going to be contradicted myself because in told you earlier before we started the show I said you know I kind of struggle with this topic because I I can see both sides of it. You know I've never been a woman to settle for any of the mess. That's going on in a ratchet nece in this trash dating society today. I've never been so you know on one hand I see one side of it and on the other one. I'm kind of feel for people that don't have because we have to be real with ourselves. Not Everybody first of all. Has the education earn a substantial amount of money. Not Everybody live in an area Korea that would pay them the type of money that they desire alwar they may not have the skill set to be able took earn this type of money that they want so I do not want to ever appear as if I'm looking down on a certain Income bracket that's why I say it made feel. It may seem like I'm contradicting myself. When I'm going back and forth and you know what I probably am because I know both sides of it you know? Oh so what I wanted to the point. I'm trying to make is. I often see Steve in a lot of different articles. Different Post different conversations that are inhaled a lot of people ask the question should a person or man or the couple themselves be financially stable before they enter into marriage again. The question is ooh. We'll get you with this go. Hey a break it down because I got I got a crazy answer for you. Yes yes yeah. person of forty injured marriage. A person should be financially stable or on the verge of being financial state meaning. They had to get a plan. Whatever the case may be that they don't bring up personal credit down our bring me that they should be via plus they get married but the fact is you should beans table enough to get married That was stopped me. Okay I would definitely want to have that personnel to be to get the credit up not because because what you marry Georgia now okay taking money out of your home and I do understand the point that you are making so again. Let me just put this out there again. I know this is going to sound crazy. I'm contradicting from my cell. Phone what I said earlier but I totally disagree disagree with you to a certain extent. I think there's some of you people in today's society have gotten to Boozy for your Britches and if we was going by your standards that people are having today a lot of Mamas daddies and your Grand Mamas and your Granddad has wouldn't have even been married and you wouldn't even be here because US sometimes you know people if we was to go by that standard that people have to be financially stable before they get married. A lot of people wouldn't get married and so now you're excluding people who live and thrive in our happy in poverty. You are excluding these type of people from the Union of marriage because they're not financially stable. You don't think some of your forefathers will pour when they got together and they made it work. Hello we're talking in is pregnant now. When I was twenty twenty three and I got married we broke credit with jacked up? Okay and how along your marriage last the thank you but the fact is now right now. Right as big forty is should shouldn't be worth your property on purpose. You sound saying wait a minute you say in in two thousand nine hundred poverty should not be on purpose. You sound ridiculous. Yeah I mean come on purpose being that you're not choosing but I come pick you up from sisters. How because you choose not to work but you pay on your cell phone billing in your your Internet actress people but now but let's let's let's expand our thinking a little bit just you know? I'm speaking because of the you know personal knowledge. I'm speaking when I think of when I think of a situation that you know this could happen. I'm thinking of people that live. In rural areas. Were employment employment is low to nothing okay. Low Low too. I mean were there are no jobs. I'm speaking speaking of places I do not want to offend anyone. I really don't I'm just saying I'm speaking on areas like the deep deep South Alabama Mississippi Tennessee Arkansas. There's some parts of those states where jobs are not plentiful in if you do get a job working at the Walmart and McDonalds is probably some of the best jobs you know what I'm saying. So that's not to say that because they work these jobs that they still don't have bills and they have families and children and I'm just saying so if you got imaging does working at the Walmart Walmart making minimum wage. And she's managed to put all of her children. You know through basically high school and they're in college. And you know Willy Willy Roy down there working at Hardee's and he's made it to assistant manager and he's making a little bit above her they're still living in poverty. You know what I'm saying. So what are you saying. They don't qualify for marriage. No say sounds like gave that's why the illustration illustration of somebody just sitting out all now that into areas. That is everything but the thing is I'm trying to say you gotTa have a plan willy being okay. This place is dead and and Willie Roy. Yeah that's why you have different areas of low income and they still get through trump's bomb on the fact is if did you have a man and a woman she has a job and she's doing the best you can and and downplay day. I'll find out what what do you want to do in life intimate something like oh I wanted to go to school. Come in or something like that. But she just didn't have that play Mary the school so basically you WanNa take on the dependent. Is that what you're saying. Though I right we get married. Okay we ain't Gordon. We haven't been married and I tell she had passion passion and our passion in You won't be a nurse and all that kind of stuff away for the make a sacrifice four four years. Go do what you have to do. Degree edition best mic and our marriage in minus. Okay people. Do we have a hard because they did Kim Jong and all that kind of stuff so you can't count but let me ask you plan. What is your? What is your plan you plan on staying there? Are you just going to be a cashier. And you'll become manager trying to do. Are you trying to measure potential word. You I don't think people should potential lost me with that I. I Dunno still on the fact that we're married now and what is your. What did you maximize your potential at the job that you are you? Are you trying to get at a dead. I mean why. Why would you have to ask them that if you I mean wouldn't you already know wouldn't you already? We have that information through the dating. The okay on and I'm saying once you get that dame stage whatever that is ardy to obtain that okay would you date somebody who is okay because you keep giving me these low acid examples I mean and you lost me for real but I'm trying to work with your let me ask you. Let me ask you. So you're telling me that you're okay so there's this woman that you're interested in and she's a cashier okay. I'm setting up the stage based on the information. You the example that you've given so you dating a woman who is who's a cashier. No no shave to the cashiers. I'm just trying to make a point. Okay so okay. So you're dating her and let's just say she's already living from check to check. There is no little to no disposable income. She has no money to play with whatsoever. What are you asking her these questions for like I said I mean you're going to feel the entire void or your expectation for her to WanNa do better? Maybe unrealistic because that may be all all she can do. What do you say that question while we dating while recording the fact is if that's how you want to do to obey cashier make that decision all she can do? What that is all see can do? Ensue tapped out in in her earning earning potential where she does no further. So what what. What the editor's trying to tell you decide? Do I want to take a holiday onto where I wanted to carry them. Buried the obligated Mary and pants everything and I did what you're saying. But that's all she can do. Yeah it might be a problem because I want somebody to want the same job I have. We're asking you maximize your potential if you wanted cashier. That's fine but as a man that works hard. The Gal. I'm just GONNA be harmful to follow which I wanNA speak okay. And A and that is a great example. Steve and I think a lot of women a Lotta people need to hear that because their dad is probably something that happens you know to a lot of women were there in a position. You know. They're earning what they can and they're doing what they can. And and it's unfortunate that the ultimate decision is left up to the guy if he wants to you know take like you said take on that responsibility so let's switch gears a little bit. I WanNa talk about this. So let's just say using the example that you have given us right so we're talking about the woman who is working hard. We're talking about the man who was working hard. Okay okay. So we're going to use your example. We're going to go with my example example. Everybody's working everybody has their own but everybody's spending habit is not what it should be. So we're we're still talking about finances. So what do we say to the person and I'm woman's almost we'll give the woman's example example. I got a woman who earns a good living or whatever she makes. She's able to pay her beal. She's able to pay her bills and and for the most part about that but her spending habits trashy spending money on excessive close does excessive trips. Excessive dinners Partying but she wants you to fill in the gap for what she spent on what of could have been utilized for savings and basically getting ahead. Would you consider dating somebody. Auty who has poor spending habits or poor credit. We're not pulling credit crazy but good word. Good when I say poor judgment of your spending sweetie I don't care you chop it up. Yeah well I'd say spending but you okay two categories again that what you said all your bills or pay poor judgment where you're a building on paper but you spent the money you see what I'm saying. Don't home your your bills in your car. Payment your issues all that. Let your death on. His stuff is all home but yet your two hundred dollars on a person seen Michael Kors because it was on sale all building. You have food in the house get gas gas. Make it to work that that could be fixed but the waters off your literature. They all go out of town deck hard. I I can feel the GEL for that down. Put a two dollar purse because you work hard you pay on your bill so I gave it to one dollars while I'm in love with you Well that's nice. That's quite nice. Thing is dropping. You only pay bill but yeah you're going out of town. Nah Hour okay so okay. Let's let's keep let's keep it going then so all of the bills are paid woman or man right and it and there's nothing lacking I think they're still poor judgment because if you're considering building a life life with this person and you're trying this only for those that are considering and you're trying to take it to the next level and live well and have savings things and have something to retire on than those particular poor spending habits in poor judgment and mismanagement of your money is not going to get you. The goals goals that you're trying to attain spending spending every dime of your disposable income just because there is not smart. I have to disagree with you on disagreement. That can be if mom what am I what am I miss. His is balance because a lot of women down his life. My mom battle eight nine dollars now what she did. So I'm saying you have people have the streep in how people have levers you're going to have to stay strong weakness in St so therefore it out so therefore. I got with somebody who does not doing every week but one Tom. Tom Tries to treat themselves or they do work so hard that can be fixed. Oh No don't do that. People don't do it. I disagree. I disagree with the different marrying a man in thinking that okay. Well you know what. He's he's He has a bad habit of drinking too much. But you know what that can be fixed or is a bad habit of lying all the time for nothing but you know that can be he picks or he has a bad habit of cheating on me but that can be fixed. Asked me what what was I could to mind to me. I think what you said but did nothing to Eh. Do Willy Nilly stuff all the time with that. I told you would what I will do what I will not do drinking and stuff. That's just giving you an example. I I WANNA keep it right here with the finances and dating. I'm just saying that I think you're doc I think don't be offended. I think you're thinking is flawed. I think that if you get what a woman or you get what a man who spends their your money recklessly okay. Then that is what you signed up for. That is what you're GonNa get and just because you entered into a relationship with them. Oh you married. Them does not is not an indicator that they're going to change because if it was me I'll be like this. This is what I was doing when you met me at. There was no doing many but this is what we talked about before we do that. We don't have a family but Santa Ed just to get the rain. I'll say it that. Just bring now what now what. You're GONNA do what you're GonNa do with me what you going on. But this is the family family budget digits outlet you need to dispose into the family budget. Housecall aren't all that kind of stuff. Do you have your allowance or whatever you spend on the phone but do. It's GonNa fix that if that was not addressed or that's not part of that person's every part of the conversation. Why news coordinator in a ten not change Wason Day where they continue to do it back to hit the ring so you have never going to get there? I think commitment I say that because I was in that situation issued David Change. We get married but she did. Change should say you know what I liked the balance part of it. I liked the idea of having a house butch. I'm never had that before you get married but she did change it. Shouldn't this just okay. I guess the point that I really want to drive home is basically. It takes more more than love to build a life together. It takes Finances and you would have to be very irresponsible to Actually not factor in finances when you are considering bringing a person on board in your life you have to look at what they can all for or invest into the relationship. Do you agree with that because finance is the number one reason for divorce all have -delity through it will break you in a heartbeat finances. A Lotta people go into infidelity. Cut The station and everything else so finances even though love is there. You say I'll do a finances like yourself. I will break you. Hit it was stretching. How it will make you a house on unlivable everything? I the been there on business on no ability but the thing is finance is the number one reason for divorce because somebody's fellow. Aw Spinach and all that kind of stuff they they were way better. This welcome to write you know. Lack of resources is living above. Your means a lot of things to consider but may I do. I have permission to share with my personal experience. It's so you know I guess. Sometimes I take issue when I see the people that are looking for for a meal not mill ticket. But you're looking at. Would they have to have material possessions. And a certain the amount of money in their bank account in order for you to consider them as a mate. And I'm so glad Ed that that wasn't me because you know I'm married my husband and if we went by those standards we wouldn't have got married but because of his earning potential and what he makes in what I make his his skill set. You know his work ethic my skill set on along with having several streams of income between us I mean we built a phenomenal live together a phenomenal incredible light together. And I'm so grateful that the sole focus just wasn't on you know he has to have X. amount of money. He needs to drive a foreign car. He needs to have labels on his back. He needs to you know will trust me. I'm a certain caliber of a woman. I do certain things I just won't even entertain but I'm just I'm very I'm very I was very cautious with it. Because I know that there were other areas in my life than needed fulfilling besides or in addition to being able to accommodate my lifestyle. Did you WanNa comment on that side of both. Have the drive both understood where we won't bet just WANNA live. We just want to live video. We won't along better. Oh absolutely right to put that money bank. Not just say this where we stay. We only can afford this. We can't do nothin' nels one. Live here still comfortable right. That's why you have if you if you get a meeting mediocre attitude. You need to take take somebody would say. Hey I'm who being a cashier. I'm cool with being assistant manager and we could just stay where you can't marry somebody else to tab. Drive won't better now the personal with brain them down. You know how you write in. You cannot marry somebody who's GonNa Bring you down or or even be in a committed relationship with someone but I think what's important to I would like to point out. Is that like I said Steve thus strong blog go back and forth between the two points that you know we're making My dating a person or oh being in a relationship with some person who may not have as much or who may earn whatever they earn if a person is willing to give you their last or they're willing to give you what they need for their generous would whatever they have. I think that makes it's an impact or should make an impact on your decision to stay with them and build a relationship or a life with them. That is what I experience experience and I think that is what works for people like me in Hor. Hey is when you have to. People who are generous with each other would generous will what we have and it works and you know what state I think that that the saying that every body body has an even on guilty of it. Br bringing to the table. Sometimes you gotta look at what the other person is bringing in what you're bringing and make sure that it complements one another right. She is a hard subject. You have to dance around stuff because you don't want to put nobody down. Do No no but the thing is that he is one of the criteria that that you look at once you get past beauty once you get past and they're nice looking guy who you live with Mama Mama live so so that is a criteria. What is this person Brandon just at our age meaning the table me? Not as finance spending habits habits come right you know a boy or not lower you. You know there's some part that's part of bringing it to the table to not just finance not because you get a house on again apartment or whatever in fact is is the whole whole nutshell of what they break it down to. Your Personality Spinner Habits Finance. I think too. You just just made me think of something. I think too important. No matter what income level they're on you can have the man that makes six or seven figures and you can have the man like Steve Started out the show with that works at McDonalds. You can have the man that works for the government in manufacturing or in warehousing. Whatever if he is willing to share with you and give you whatever you need or spoil you with some of the things that you want? That's the beautiful thing but I think on the flip side of that. If no matter what he has he's not willing to share or give you anything or shower you with any type of loss of words of what I want to say Eh. But you know it shows where his heart is. Bishop jakes one. Time said in one of the sermons that you can tell where a man's heart is by the way he's where he spends his money saw. You got a man that's been in any type of money on you. Then he's not into you a say that again please Sir. A little bit louder come on agree with it right away but yes I agree with that. Wow we had to take a moment to let that sink and right. Aw I look at it for for women for myself. I'll look at her financial money on me but when I was dating where she did I know she will call for in meant the world to disobey me a simple shirt because I look at her to brain. No pay the bills. I pay my car payment. You know I'm looking to provide for her but what she did something out of generosity for her own money it means new world. It means a lot to me because he's not looking for nothing bed. I think generosity is important as you ask yourself. Uh when you ask the men what do you want for Christmas are taking say. I don't know kids grandkids. Get yourself something bring something it means the world exactly decimal real bad. My husband to the T.. I I can ask him any media any holiday or you know when I'm feeling extremely generous. Baby you know what you want. I don't want anything. Go Get yourself something now now. I'm not doing that because of Nudey giving get appoint right. Oh I just had an idea okay. So so since we still talking about bills and stuff so you know. There's a lot of foolishness going around. Where am seeing women coming because I see it coming from the women you know if a guy is not willing to pay some of their bills or a bill then they don't want to deal with them and I think that it's just says let me just say this so tacky if you can't pay your bills don't WanNa pay your bills? I just don't think it did. You should place that type of obligational somebody who's only only dating you not in a relationship. I can't stipulate the terms of a relationship that you have with another person but as far as the dating stage I think I think this is totally ridiculous and I see this on every freaking group pulsed almost every other day what do you say about that as the thing is they look. They're looking for. They're looking for trick but sugar daddy one put it. They're looking for that guy that's money pinker. I get you anything you want. But that's all how you GONNA get. You never going to get arrangement because goes hand in hand on my opinion bills free. You know what you'll have avenue to get this money and a lot of women do that and then boom that's it. That's that's how you get out of that. Go get nothing else. So uh-huh so much guys fault fellows fault for behaving okay. Okay Okay Okay Okay I have. I have a question for you. So let's let's give a scenario and I'M NOT GONNA call any the name but a new travel back as you know talk. So what if there's a situation where there is a woman that is dealing Ling and I'm saying dealing okay. I didn't say what type of relationship so I'm just going to say. They're dealing with each other right and she. She has entered into an extreme financial hardship situation. And this guy comes in and out of her. Her apartment lays up with her whatever and she has the expectation that because he's sleeping with her that he should be helping her her out of her her financial crisis. I have seen a couple of females here in Charlotte go through that where the guy lied that they're dealing with is actively employed may or may not have a home or to a couple of homes homes while the female is struggling unemployed inbetween John about to lose everything and her expectation. Is You land up with me. Then you need to help me pay some of these bills. What is your position on it because a lot of people said that a man is sorry if he landed up with the woman and he's not helping her answer the questions within the thing you know we want to talk about the if we want to talk about this? Oh you are louder. No I need you to sit in Utah. You what you are. Didn't y'all know Java the down we call you ten thirty at night to come over and boom. I'm not being situation. He's GonNa offer his house he offered offered. Hey what can I do to would need to do to get you out of the situation. Get Convention you. If he's not into new DOC ID twenty. You'll get it won't get built out okay. Well well I'm just saying that those conversations that people are having you know that and you know I remember back in the day. My grandma used to say something along along those lines like I remember when I was a little girl. I don't know who she was on the phone with but I was in her presence. So you know I listen. I'm Nosey. But she would say always say. Don't nobody WANNA help a woman this land with a me if you land up with a man then you need to. You need to ask S.. Count the hill. I so let's say in about About our our our air who have taught this type of thinking right. What what are we saying? What are we saying is is? I'M GONNA saying wait if if what careers of the female always actually help you know. Come come a Grad. And you've got a dupin what's what's the pissing me off. I'm not helping you. You need to call you why we're here doing all the work I did pay for he in the cookie jar. So is it fair to say that a woman allow so I gotta I really be careful with this one. So is it fair to say when a woman is at a disadvantage financially and she allows a man to come in and out of her bid without a commitment that he devalues her and basically he will not take her serious now one bit all you WanNa get that are gonNA gotta get like it goes back I I get a group of single and I told her I told you ladies that and made his accounts they did like Ooh. I didn't know that but if the first time you come over to man's houses at ten thirty at night that is the only time you won't come up with the very first time we hang out. I'm not saying you met me. We're no data to the cloud. We did come did ten o'clock. I'm Debbie very personal. We hung out. You call my out at ten thirty. Oh you WANNA get so going back to that. Situation is income. Let me lay pitcher and you'll be in. I'm not every route into all you're going to get in essence and that is the reality of it in in a lot of women get bitter at her or angry because there are already in dire straits and you know they're dealing with a guy who made the they may be under the impression Russian that is into them and Goss watching you struggle. He could care less if you eat or not. So I think again finances are extremely important and if you you don't have your sugar honey. ICED tea together. That maybe you shouldn't be dealing with anyone. I'm here on the one of saying bodies fault but his your fault men and women if you allow you have that situation and don't get yourself out of what it is. Your parents telling what you're planting but I'm guilty of it. Now they do. You don't like that but everybody saw it around me but it took me a while to actually. I'm not used anything. But just in general on personal show you buy and who said believe believed the first time when he first time that's right so a day in doing toward all believing and what do you say Players will be play. Don't player hate the game and we got a mouthy wait. You know what to do win. Do having doing what the state bid. That's what he's GonNa do. An I gotta give up enough now. Echoes the worst. To let let me know bid to pay into which me and you'll be hoping you get a bag and I think I think is is. It still goes back to what you and I talk about is having you're having in your finances in order or making sure that you are living your best life you know and if you are not in a position to date if you are struggling financially you know that's okay we've all been there and many of us you know the longer you keep living you may go through it again Dan. There's no shame whatsoever however if you know that you are in a bad situation. I don't think it's fair to the next person for you to come into a relationship ship or a potential relationship with the expectations that this person that they're gonNA bill you out that they're going to be your savior because you could be running off a person who really could be into you but who resents the fact that you would have the audacity to place that expectation on them. Am I write in my. I'm gone a run when we take. This is a bad about it. especially if you picked me to do that because my job. 'cause you've all he worked at he worked for the government yet. I for the government. If I'm inching it will come naturally. Okay okay that's it for either. Where go for men and women goes expectation will come naturally person into the force it into you whatsoever and you? We know that that's something to to remember and to be you know very cautious about you. Know we have to be wise. How we Spend our money and we also have to be wise and who we allow into our lives and who we choose to be in relationship with. Because you don't WanNa get yourself in a situation where you're being used because you have money and you definitely don't want to allow yourself to be in a situation where you know you're being mistreated because you don't have money true very true right. I think Steve This has been one of the more spicier episodes. I mean I went here to you know. I was back and forth on this side of the fence on that side of the fence. I'm it is very passionate about finances and I think you know the more that we use our efforts in energy to position and ourselves in a great place financially. I think we'll be able to make better choices in our mates because once you acquired a certain level of success and money in a bank you tend to put up with a lot less. It is not Japan before am also told me that he said be the person who you want to be so that means credit that means finances. Assist me have you together get yourself together and then you be the person who wanna be when you can't be broke and won't a person's already at this stuff together get yourself together and then face what it in so A word and all that stuff you have to be the person we want to criticize upstart credit. Now wait somebody to come in. They have to get your quick. Yeah that's true. You know the type the caliber of men or women that you desire into having your life you have to mirror that within yourself and because you Lina be there but the person was seeing you see what I'm saying they see that you're trying to strive the better they see that you work on your credit and that would be that would be make them. I'm attracted to you. They'd want okay. She might have a credit but she's working on from six hundred. She had a job. Is She going to school the night to get the job. You see what I'm saying right young men and women and I I I definitely want to drive home the point that if you are not in a position to date properly then maybe you shouldn't be in the dating arena. Because I think it's very very very tacky for the entire the entire relationship or dating experience to be placed on one person I think reciprocity is key is okay for a man or woman to go into their pocket and treat the other person because two people in the relationship but if you find yourself in a situation where you're the one that's always paying like you can never be on the receiving end of the generosity or a lavish date or vacation versus a vacation. Then you might want to revisit that situation because it definitely takes takes finance to you know have some romance and they do it. Does you know I'm a woman you want to be. wined signed and dined. And you know you want you know roses here and there are flowers or whatever you know I know you know but I'm just saying that's right. Richard came to help Netflix and chill on every every week. Yes please up simple number PODCASTS. Simply do damned. If I'm just saying you know how over time here and there you know. I'm not about that you. You're not gonNA aluminium death. I'm not about that Netflix. And Chill we're talking about once every blue moon. So but that's that's what people have the income but that's another talk show we'll stay. It has been my pleasure to chop it up with you on Halloween I think this was. This is one of the scary air episodes. But you know people's bedrooms and business and their bank accounts this conversation people need to. Have it barbershop. Stuff like day is very rich kid. I both officers say for you. You WanNa get. You'RE NOT GONNA agree but you're not one side of the spectrum light get both like how does she have to beat a break you right like how many dollars. How many mini Benjamin's of shared out just because she got an hourglass figure in a big ass? How how much does it cost and for the woman I I mean how good is he laying the pipe? You know every night to you know you have to go in your purse every night. Just because he say he can't get a job. Oh boy he's a felon or he just lazy with no ambition. Like how good does it have to be a good. Look I guess oh saying that situation they are but it has been my pleasure Steve Midwest City and you guys you can email us your comments
Episode 144- Jeff Longcor and (mostly) Inexpensive Mistakes
"Either. Everybody welcome to another episode. Cloud-based mayhem my guest. Today's jeff long court. I said count. Jeff when i was out training california in march and i had a lot of requests for jeff especially after we put out that survey that people found it really valuable to talk to lower our pilots. Those that are firmly in cut of intermediate syndrome and getting through that rather than just talking to the legends and the pros and so this is one of those jeff spin chasing really hard a search and rescue professional. And he's you know he's got a good head but he doesn't get the get out that much because of his job and his work and he's made some mistakes some small and some big ones as we all do. that's injuries and gone through that whole god. Do i suck at this. Should i quit. And he's in a very dynamic community out there and santa barbara really supportive communities fantastic and good. It's also can be the could be a lot of pressure. They're not that people are doing to intentionally. But there's just a lot of people chasing it really hard and and you want to be part of that group He's recently put up some. Some great flights also recently broke his ankle and was real recent but in we take through through all this in some detail you know the the the urge to quit and come back to it Questioning yourself doubt how to approach risk when you don't really understand that well yet and Yeah the power of making inexpensive and sometimes expensive mistakes how to deal with relationships. You if with your woods. Somebody who Isn't a pilot that can be tricky for many of us in our in our lives and how to learn how to how the value of acro and a savvy training and yeah just being part of a great community and i think you'll really enjoy this. I really like jaffe. Superfund to talk to and his stoke is incredibly contagious. And i think you'll enjoy it. So further delay. Please enjoy this fun. Conversation with jeff walker jeff. Awesome to have you on the show and really cool that we can do this in person. Mrs kinda fine. We had a nice flight together the other day. That was really cool. Neil and i were in the air a bit for for awhile knows you without fun. There's a lot of gliders round here but so yeah we're in santa barbara were sitting in my trailer and Just about getting ready to go home and when this comes out it'll be a couple months from now so sorry to the listeners. At some of this might have changed by the time. You hear this. But what i thought would be a fun place to start. You put up post recently on the telegram group out here for the santa barbara flying community. The club which. I think there's a hundred something people on the telegram group now in so this is obviously become kind of mecca to fly here. And for those of you who haven't flown it's coastal site in a sense but also a mountain site were right on the ocean here. A big thirty five hundred foot peaks in a big ridge line behind us and then it steps back another thousand fifteen hundred feet behind that and then beyond that you're out in the mojave desert so it's a it's a pretty dynamic very beautiful very cool place to fly. It's often soft in. It's sometimes it's it winds up and it's pretty pretty high pressure pretty sharp and in pretty full on flying so it's a great place for me to come and train and he's also a wonderful place for people to come out in learn literally from the their first flight at one of the best training hills in the world and then also to excel and get better and train as i know you have lost fear so this is a long winded opener. But when i thought we'd start with is your you there's a there was a pilot here in the community. That was having some incidences as we all do. When we're coming up through the game and you posted. What i thought was really good constructive feedback that was non non-judgmental and very welcoming and kind of a asking this pilot to maybe look at things in a way that he had so without reading it. It's a long post. But it really got a lot of attention in some great responses and. I thought you might be able to just summarize that so what what led you writing it. What were the things that that this pilot did that lead to you riding the post and and then take us into your own journey awesome. Thanks so much for having me. I listened to every single episode at saw change. My progression made me a safer pilot and That's the kind of information and thought process. That tried to pass on in what i wrote and i totally agree with you. Santa barbara is a beautiful place to fly with varying conditions throughout the seasons. And one of the best things about it is. There's something five almost every day and that allows us to train in ways that build skill levels incrementally different aspects of flying and then combine them together in mount flights. That like you said can extend into different Terrain and into new places. Different value systems Into the backcountry under the desert many of those. I'm still looking forward to myself I again i. I am fairly intermediate. I've been flying for three years only in those years. Though i've worked really hard to understand how to become a better pilot and to use all of the resources available to me right now while working a fulltime desk job in so in that time i've i've logged about seven hundred hours and i've decided to do about Seven siv's those things. I think have been totally critical. And the reason i felt like i could reach out to this. Pilot is because. I was pilot. When i started i the way i phrased it was that my joy of flying was outpacing. My abilities. I think a lot of people at the time. When i when i started felt that i was competing with them. We're trying to get notoriety or out. Fly others but really. It was like this overwhelming joy. The need to want to launch right. Like the like the need to want to experience what other people were experiencing when they had a big flight when they flew to a new place when they had evening soaring session in a high wind environment but the watch the sunset and that kind of stuff really i think can capture new pilot. And it's it's you've talked about this too it it really that special to embrace it during that time because that's the unique period where like everything's magical new but the same time. I think there's a lot of risk during that face. You know if you see someone in the air you want to be in the and that that's not always appropriate and you might not be aware of conditions changing quickly but oh no we don't sell for a long time and i think that's something i think when you get through that you wrestle with looking back in terms of just how to how to approach people in in a positive way how to try to understand what they're going through. It's it's really tricky. I it's just. I think i wrote on the post this morning. The rest sagas is. We're not playing golf. It's hard to you. Know you can't just go up and help somebody with their grip or with their backswing. It's were were playing with gravity right. Not only that were totally alone. Like i think that's something that me off guard. At first i come from climbing. You know when you have a partner you or multiple partners and you're relying on each other for your life And you have that trust and that bond we can fly together but ultimately no one knows how how on piloting my craft techniques. I'm using What thought process is going on in my head and you can't reach out and save somebody know that you can try to communicate on the radio or or give signals but we're we're kind of out there on around a little and that was that was a bit of a shock for me at first and so i think you're absolutely right. It's not like someone can come in and look over your shoulder. no. I highly encourage people to do attend him. eagle makes up part of their their training and i learned a lot from mitch took a tandem with him but other than that like e. Someone can't step in and improve your technique or your decision. Making in the moment in those moments are high high consequence at times. So what summarize very generally what was this pilot. What what what happened In not not each incident but what was generally happening that you're trying to navigate in the sense. Oh absolutely i thought a lot before. I wrote that response. Because i wanted to make sure it was necessary. I'm not going to judge any pilot. Who has one incident had plenty so one incident You know that's that's one thing If it's a it's a string of incidences if it's a a a series of them the the become a trend. I think in any activity in anything you do in life. If that's happening you need to take a step back and do a bit of more of a root cause analysis and understand why that trend happening. Because if you don't wanna do that if you don't address it it can only badly. I mean look jars interactional right right. You're away with it each time and again if something that you don't know You know you're putting yourself positions that you're you're unaware of the risks involved there you have to take a step back and analyze it in and fill in those gaps in environments that are less consequential and so in this case the pilot had had at the time that i responded i believe to reserve throws an incident of getting lost in the clouds Incident of landing really deep and having to hike out with no plan or equipment for an overnight in a couple of reports of maybe not having great situational awareness in gaggle flying situations scenarios In each one of these. I did monitor the community response and felt compelled to say something but really also felt like it was being handled in the last reserve throw incident. I felt the community started to get split. Where some of the response was great for you for throwing. That's the right thing to do. And the other half being man we should maybe give up like it's not really being heard and i don't think it's ever worth giving up on a pilot I was that pilot i was. I was so excited. I was so charged in and i remember it hurting pretty bad when i got the feedback and i still tried to receive an and listen to it and think about it a lot and made me upset and it took time for to work. Its way into my head you know and took time for you to make those small adjustments or have these epiphanies or slowdown and watch others and read a little bit more. Listen to these podcasts. And really embrace the wider world of knowledge and and the slower states of progression and so i thought it was definitely worthwhile to write something but it how to marry those two perspectives of good job throwing because i would never tell someone not to throw a reserve. Obviously the person walked away in all of these incidences and that was clearly the right decision. If you don't have the wing control to stop what's happening to to recognize configurations and find an exit and safely maneuver in. Then i also to balance like that feeling of you. Better listen you know if it was coming from the side of community of you. We're we're ready to kind of give up ready to to not reach out to this person anymore and be like look. This is just hazardous for everybody. How you combine those two things together and and do it in a non judgmental way that says look. I've been there too certainly have been week. We can talk about some mistakes lynn. But let's go ahead and switch to that in we'll come back to the duck. So what what. What were your own. Because i feel like in some ways maybe your own incidences that were similar. Sense of may have better equipped you to understand where this pilot was. I i agree with you. I think from the wider communities perspective. I mean let's face it. Some people just shouldn't be pilots Some people don't belong in the sport and that's one of the reasons. I think it's it doesn't have the growth you know were were very nearer a metropolitan center of thirty million people wired. They're more pilots. They see people lying in the mountains. It looks incredible. I'm sure to many But not that many people undertake it and that's probably a good thing but you. It sounds like you really equipped to. I mean i think i i'm sympathetic with both sides. You're saying here in terms of the community half the committee or some parts of the community that we gotta keep trying summers commitment this. Maybe this person know. She's take up a different activity right right and it's i think it's hard to care for someone if they're gonna if they're they're not handling themselves appropriately in get hurt and i think we all feel that amongst our friends in the sports. Sometimes it's like if someone's taking risks you're like oh can i. Can i be close with that person. It'd be a friend if if they're putting their life on the line and in some ways that is what binds us out there pushing and we have to understand that we all have days when we need to push but again i think comes back to recognizing that trend. If you're pushing too many times you have to take a step back in and also listened to the feedback. You're getting from people who care about you. Know what i love about santa. Barbara's community is we care about everyone and love. It can be self-serving because if we get a new pilot who comes in who doesn't follow the rules and the website and doesn't do some of their own forecasting and take responsibility for themselves. We can lose a lot of our access here as you said it is a beautiful place to fly. But it's also a busy place and so we've been very diligent about putting up roles that we'd like people to follow There is a wonder fall of and service from eagle. That they'll run when they can and they still will encourage people do their own forecasting or to reach out to a mentor to get that kind of information and so i think the community does want to care for everyone but it does scare them when i see these trent's specifically not just one incident but a pilot having the a series and for me. Yes i think it was that pilot and you know one of the funniest and funny because it worked out right but one of the funnier scenarios Was i think. I was going up for a second run. flying from ej which is a fairly straightforward launch. A at the back ridge that we have here and the wind up quite a bit again. One of those situations with conditions changing fairly quickly to the later stages of the day which is typical hero. A window come in. Southwestern west wind is predictable on most days and there's instructor there and he's gonna look sort of like you know. Do you have this. you know what you're doing. You know he was instructing others and kind of driving the van. I think had gone up and right. It's i believe. I was a p two at the time and i think that's really really critical point here because of someone's development santa barbara because you're on a lower performance wing launches are bit setback. Our power lines there valleys And you need to be thoughtful about. The wind need to be thoughtful about your flight plan as one year on year. Bailout call the snake pit and tell people what is that's got a key key part of the story. Yeah you don't want to be buried back in there. Oh yeah it's a tight titles especially if you're ended up there because it's windy you know and if it is windy it's probably upslope and that means that you're going to be doing a fast downwind uphill landing if you do it properly now. In this scenario. I arrived at one of our forward triggers. It was working okay. And i'd seen A couple of ten pilots bench back. And i thought this is my time. I want to bench back the wins going gonna help me to. It's a south wind in benching back to the north and make the move and of course Don't quite a hook into anything. And start flushing off and i flush off to that side with the snake pit which has fewer exits in his blocked by pilots To to get to a safe. L z other than the snake pit. And so pretty quickly realized. I'm going there going. And and i thought you know other other pilots have pulled this off. I'm going to pull this off and i- angled approach to come and really low over the trees which thinks that's definitely the right move. There hit that spot landing and at the last minute decided to get a little tricky with my landing. I i think i'd recently had a hard landing a few days prior and so in my head. I was thinking i really don't wanna do in uphill john when landing. I'm gonna turn at the last second and landed the you know the upper part of elle's e and get a nice Asymmetric flare something like that. I came in. And i swear my feet touch the ground and i was like i thought i was there. And i got boosted into the air and suddenly i'm flying like tree height down a canyon with no elsie z whatsoever. You overflew let alone down. Essentially made a turn And pointed myself down canyon and it's it's a pretty you can't really tell from the air it's pretty steep Doubt that point so it went from facing north and doing that uphill inning to facing south now in flying downhill and there's You know. I think if i do that now i may have the win. Control skills to kill the wing appropriately. Put that lending it at the time. I certainly didn't and i thought about some advice. A garden and i thought well i'm going to land in a tree and When aim for soft one so dodged a hard looking tree. And i made a turn and and did a full flare into a kind of a glorified bush and the next thing. I think i was hanging by one leg upside down in the tree. But for over the ground and was able to get the homing down. And i and this is really fun. Even though i had a reversible harness. I still carry the huge vehic black backpack at that helped me a few times in my early progression because i could pack the whole wing into it. So to stuff the homing into it and just like walk the beautiful trail down with my tail between my legs and there. There's a tank pilot who is also my ass ivy instructor dome bed daddy and he called me on the phone. I think he was still in. The air is just you know. Are you okay. yeah. I'm already packed up and i remember being pretty surprised. Like oh you're you know it was clear i was trying to get either. Pretty fast. does super embarrassed. And i thought i was totally in the clear like no injuries whatsoever But then i get home and i. I'm from new england and we don't have a lot of poison oak up their. I had no idea before. I know it. Everyone in my myself in my girlfriend were just covered with poison oak. Who's like we did. The clothes got everywhere. Just unbelievable and i thought it would go away and before i know what i'm getting like a shots in the in the but you know get rid of that stuff so there's some things in california. There's not a lot of You know mosquitoes or bugs but man some of the things here can get you bushwack. Whacking can be brutal and the The heat sometimes can be brutal. Poison oak can be insane. Yeah landing out here in. The front range is one thing in but when you when you talk it over the back and getting chiappero country and stuff you know. You're when i look at that stuff. I always think okay. I could put it in. And i'm not going to die but then i slipped my wrists on knocking able to walk out of this crap either. You know you'd have to abandon your gears norway way getting out of one of those trees and then you know dick. I mean the the thick stop on the backside here is it would be torture. God i i had a situation where i landed a got again. I i think one of things that really challenges new pilots in one of the things. I advise this pilot to be more thoughtful about was flying in wind. And i remember falling out of the back of a thermo This is a bit later in my progression and getting kind of pinned against the terrain. And i realize i'm gonna land here. You know as up near where you talk to the other day the award but just to get shallow to the west okay and landed there. And i swear i could throw a stone to the road and two and a half hours later i crawled under. Bush isn't got. it's amazing. It was like a football field away by. That couldn't get there. I had to walk for hours and then crawl underneath This wooded brush so so it is it is pretty real And you know. I can reflect on a few of those situations than the biggest one probably for a new pilot in the mountain passes to be aware of those changing conditions in the wind. Especially right because all the some things happen so much faster Whether it's falling out of thermal we're getting stuck behind terrain or other traps that prevent you from getting to a safe. L z with lower performance glider. And so that in that situation is a great takeaway not listening to that Instructor you know who i greatly respected. And and you know just because i thought i've practiced high wind launches before and i've ridge sword in high wind before that's not the same in the mountains in italy. Less alert there see had a snake bit one way some others. Oh yeah yeah like. I said it's it's always a series and to the communities credit. I know the informed me know after these and and or they were you very respectfully honest. You know and i again it was. It's hard things to here. But if you're if you're mind years aren't open to it. you could Life changing injury. I think in the sport. And so i've tried to challenge you go to be accepting more accepting of hearing everything i can or even beaten learning from others. Sure pick out a couple. Yeah definitely but whatever the what are the what were the ones that had the greatest learning. I'd say of all of them. And we'll just go with this one and i can. I can do more. I can go up there. Unfortunately i think one of the the absolute biggest one was a morning when i was really excited to do a hike and fly. That's barra something really special to me. Because i have this history mountaineering and that is kind of what led to me flying climbing nearing And the legacy of that sport transitioning into some people who fly like the bill. Bell courts you know. In in the legends of of how climbers became paragliders and the magic of fly off amount and not having downhill and destroy your knees. That kind of thing and so i did this. Hike and fly mission I'm gonna start throwing out names so so with andrew byron who is just an amazing Thoughtful pilot and friend. He's he's got incredible when control and and like the foundational skills and so we hiked up together and someone had told me that there'd been a north wind warning which is our mountains face south launching to the south so that'd be common over the back on us and that's typical here in santa barbara and expected that to change in the morning and when we got there it felt like it was blowing in But but only very lightly and inconsistently. And i knew i was nervous about the launch. But i didn't say anything like i didn't earn up to andrew and in fact we were rushing or at least in my head i was rushing to launch land. And then get catch the eagle van for another round. You don't maybe i can do. Two or three and that kind of thing is typical in the summer where conditions are stable. So you're looking at a new pilot for multiple sledders and again. I think that we because the conditions are sort of soft and stable. You don't think they're going to change that much or that the morning. It'll be that different i know. That impacted a pout recently. Here who launched in the afternoon and it was totally different from his morning flight. You gotta you said this before but she got a treat every flight as its own Life changing adventure right. It's its own unique experience in evaluating conditions. Every time at least that was one of my takeaways. But i set up on launch and before i think i'd even had chance to turn around from laying out my wing at at sky. Port which is where we were Andrew had been able to forward off and to to to this day blows my mind having someone for sky port. It is like three steps. And then you're off We recently there was some bushes cleared there and so now it's way better Things that are. I'm about to tell you probably aren't likely to happen to the next pilot. And i'm really grateful for the improvements that have that have occurred But andrew andrew got off and it was he didn't a beautiful way Just really demonstrating his his skill and ability there and again the cycles were greeley light inconsistent and switch sweaty and at that time known as as a pilot and more of like a feeling pilot. Like i think you talked about this. There's analytical minds that look at all the data and then there's more emotional and feeling pilots and there's positive and benefits to both. What are the negatives. I think to my approach at the time being one of those types of pilots at feel like what phallic could go. Well this is. Let's do it because pull up with make it happen. And i've you know since then it's tried to incorporate that survey shin that data component to launching. I think it's the most critical aspect of a flight. Most cases right you gotta get away from terrain safely and so not just viewing the cycles but really looking at the bushes and how they move and you know one person. I talked to a length after this as logan because he you know he logan logan andrew and i in a bunch of others have really come started in the same couple years ballpark and his progressions ban really impressive to watch and a lot of that is because he analyzes sings and he thinks about them in his free time and he visualizes them and so you're talking him he's like you know. I know that bush is moving in. That is moving in this. One is moving like that. That's what that means and piecing those things together and none of that. Was there for me that day. I tend to think curious it. did you have you. You said though when you first got there you had a sensation of you know. Something's not right. Are you nervous. Oh absolutely yeah I knew that. I didn't have great. Light wind launching skills. I was on And we can talk about wings a little bit too. But i i had Recently stepped up to a higher be. And i was hiding a lot with my lower. Be you know. So i hadn't. I think that's really important early in your progression is to Match your or just or just embraced one way you know at least early on so that the when you're cutting all day at the hill and practicing landings with and things is also that wing that you can trust in about launch of any type and so i recently changed wings a little bit so is probably nervous there and then not just. Was it light. But i think once in a while it would blow down a little bit so i think that north was still there and i didn't have at the time. The sense to check wind talkers better. Check the forecast better Understand i remember learning ground school about how could wrote over the top and feel like it was coming in. You know but at the time. I was like you know i. I just figured i was nervous about the launch. But i was going to do it anyway. I think a lot of early policy. The same thing we're launches a foregone conclusion. I came all the way up here. I hiked up here. I wanna make the man. But i'm nervous about it and don't really listen to why but when you look back on the root causes you do that root cause analysis. You're like wow. There's a lot of things like a newer wing Early in the morning so not as settled The north may be hadn't blocked in there was a it was possible. North wind warning Didn't check any windtalkers. Forecasting another really pilot had afford launch off. And i'm not prepared to do that. Usa does all of those things and not talking to someone about them. Were all mistakes. Absolutely so i thought i felt a pretty good cycle I didn't check all the visual indicators. That would be consistent one. I pulled up The wing was probably slow to come up. I didn't really set up as high as i could have. And we had a couple steps by the time of turnaround. In fact i basically just slid off the lip and steep drop off but there are a lot of bushes and rocks and i caught my foot on the first bush and then the next bush and the next bush and i kind of visualize it now like one of those cartoons were like the paragliders flying straight and level above me. But i'm getting dragged to every dish and it's slowing down and finally i hit a rock and with my left foot and a hit so hard that my shoe disappeared forever. I never founded again. Came up and i went back and looked for a couple of hours. It was like a point of personal pride. I'm like i need to own this. Where did that shoe go. You know expensive. Like solomon shoe. And i never never found it again. We'll that was gone up. Here is not an island. I think it's pieces. I've never to that point. Despite all my climbing injuries which racked up like one surgery per limb. This left actually left ankle which broke and in. This accident was like my completed the circle of limb injuries. It all my injuries. I'd never broken something. I i think. I pre strong bones. And i hit that rock really hard. Wow really her yet. This place can bite. I remember. I came here two years ago stranded for the Guests that would have been three years ago. Strand from one of the x alps. And i went in the trees off that launch. You guys have off the road. You know the one where you're kind of you're kind of like running uphill a little bit and And i just. I just didn't. The wing wasn't quite pressurized announcing logo. Few people got off that morning and then for me backwards. Nobody got off that the conditions had switched. It just wasn't really coming up. And so i just tried to do a really really fast running forward and just went right in the trees and then i think a day later i got low back in your mountains where it gets pretty flat back here by casinos. Pass and like you said you. You're not gonna make the glide. If you're low and i landed in another tree and i thought wow this is really interesting. I'm an ex alps pilot. I've landed and trees. I think it was two days in a row. I mean not the kind where you're hanging out of it. It was just you know the the second one the book both of them were the kind of thing where i was on the ground and my wing was in the tree. But it's you know. The extraction was an hour. You're like oh this is going to be a while yet there tangling their tinley bushes draco sacramento bushwack in theory vacuum seabrook ankle. Yeah yeah broke it in ways. That was a blessing. And that's why i say that. Not only did i learn from all you know if i got weird that i wouldn't learn a thing probably right but then you get you have that happen and not only did i learn from all the factors in the accident but i also a was forced to have downtime. And that's something. I still struggle to make myself do right. I i if i look back on my progression. It's like actually fight flown a little bit less like you know the time you get that event you know as you go. But if i'd done a little more of the reading in the research and homework and caused me to sit down and do some of that. At least i think i read fifty ways to fly better and i started to listen to every one of these episodes of kobe's ma'am to start and then i watched youtube videos of greg hammerton and Fail videos of people crashing and a lot of the community less than war more knowledge less excitement. Yeah or more breaks less gas exactly which saw coast for a while I think in this this letter that i the open letter that i wrote on telegram to this other pilot i phrased it to Country effective This this reading. Help me film gops of what i was feeling. We don't know what we don't know. And by reading incorporating other people's experiences we start to fill in those gaps. And then the next time you do get time. It starts to piece together better You turn reserve couple times. Yes good feel getting a lot off my chest. Your yeah aired out. Well one thing. After these accidents that i so greatly appreciate is the community again right so when what i found is if it's if it's a small incident they let's let you know about it and it can be kind of Sometimes i walked away feeling that was intense and maybe a little negative like i had someone scream at me once that i turned the wrong way and thermal pilot boosted into the thermal and We're like best friends now. Shout out to jason lombard. Thanks for the correction on that one. And i think that stemmed from learning experience where you went from orig- soaring you got boost up into a thermal right so a really difficult thing i think for new pilots is to change the rules of the pattern. Right adjusts appropriately and be aware of the situation and so there are moments like that where were minor errors and people were able to catch me on him. In a quote. I was intense but when it was a serious accident i got serious phone calls of people who really cared and Learn those people is again that. Sad instructor dylan batted daddy Who called after my. I broke my ankle and the funny about again about that. Accident was i exploded. The airbag on my harness. And i'd give it eagle. Maybe fix and they they put a tag on it. This airbag quote doesn't hold tire thing was like exploded But that got you know did get fixed a eventually. But he had seen that picture. Don't have seen the picture of the airbag in thought. I'd been seriously injured gaming this meaningful phone call and others did as well you know at any of the The crew here in the community when something really serious does happen like there's no judgment you know and i've i've learned that lesson to and there's no judgment in what they community does look for then in any either the small where the big incidences i think is steps for correction and i want to be the person who i think any pilot should also be the person who steps up and puts the work in so if you had an issue or series of events You should put the work in each other's you're putting the work in and ask for their help and so at that time i decided that Doing more sl was going to be really important and so in. Siv and this is a long way to answer your question but in sap. I had reserve come out accidentally doing a deep stall where i popped it out you know. I grabbed it with my hand by accident trying to hold a bad stall configuration. And it's funny. Because i wanted to blame the zipper on the harness but when logan galen pulled out of the water they're like oh yeah it's totally zipper later. Do that was you. don't do that. You definitely plucked your pens out there. we had a good laugh about it but what it gave me in that unique experience was that's what reserve feels like. That's what it feels like when it comes out. This is how disabled my win quickly. And think having that's another example of being able to practice those things in a low consequence environment and then when you're in the mountains those pieces can come together a really help you in the critical situations that would otherwise be extremely damaging so My real in the wild reserve toss was pretty full on. I went on my first desert mission ever and admittedly was exhausted on the drive in the morning. I think i'd been working really late. I had ankle injury. That was bothering the same broken ankle. I think it was still lingering. I recently moved from the colibri. Which i was really enjoying As as a nice sensitive lightweight harnessed that can do hiking fi with to a bigger harness. that while it had more protection i think was more dampened so all these little factors aren't huge in the story but i think they all add up journal always does so we get there. And there's a lot of debate about do his flight or flight blackhawk I again. i'm tired and a mole. Strasse mrs stretching out more and eventually people are trying to make a decision that wandering away their gear and then coming back and you see the clouds popping. Let's go you know and Before you know what. I volunteered to go to the other site. And we're at orange Here to go to blackhawk and again without really doing a good headcount we all just jump into one car and go. There was an i. Don't think we all had the wherewithal to really planned on just as well and so i ended up in the trunk. Literally on top of oath are didn't know he wasn't the time right. We are on top of each other The car has a lot of trouble getting up there. I think i think credit to the driver had like to run on flats. It's got to hang gliders on in like six paragliding. bmw's no place being there. We have to walk a lot. My ankles killing me. So the time i get there. I'm probably compromise and but still have. Maybe this inflated confidence you know the same thing that got me on that before where i broke my ankle kind of crept in here which is like i got this. I think it's important to have self-assurance when you want to do confidently. But i feel it. Compare anytime you like. Oh i got this. It's sloppy down like that extra bit of arrogance perhaps rate confidence versus arrogance. Then yeah that's important. Yeah hard to be able to differentiate that in the at them in the moment. Though i mean there is. There's a lot of there've been a lot of times in my flying life where you know. I'll have the key. Gb's for some reason you know. Drive an alpine up to something doesn't feel right and you have to decide okay. This gb gb this time is this a real one you know is that the is it the one. That's really trying to help me out or is this just my mind with the weird stuff going on between the years and misses. The is doesn't mean anything. It's just a matter of setting that aside and being confident. I got this. That's hard to sarge sometime differentiate between those two. I think it's that's the sport nut show. Okay podcast again. I think for me it's It's trying to find the balance between those two types of thinking. Like how do i feel and what. What am i observing. What data points to a have no in climbing i was always trying to minimize risk by looking at the factors in limiting exposure. So if risk is the probability of something happening times The consequence of it happening if you can do that math in as much detail as he can. At least you're doing something you're trying to break it down into a pieces that you brain and body to understand you know i said this before but Something that's been really really helpful for me that learned in the backcountry skiing is there's a guy in our in our local community who gives really great talks on decision making and this is rebecca skin Operating although i had in common talked to our club to his epo so good but he talks about. You know fast forward. You're you're thinking about skiing this this mine and you know that what the hazards are or could potentially be if it goes if you screw this up an avalanches and you wrapped roundtree. Imagine what the the accident report would read same as climbing. you know. I just think about that because that in that's a good way to highlight and expose your way blackhawk. You're tired you got a bad ankle. Your little the confident. You got all these things so in an accident report. All that stuff comes out because a good report is like what we've learned from t. m. with airlines. They all the way back. What were the threats. What were the heirs. Made along the way and start looking like an idiot when you think that when you think that when you start thinking about the action report you go. Wow i would not want to be that acts. I would not want to be the victim in that action report. You know you've already made all these bad decisions before you're thinking about dropping in you know so anyway he gone. I i've i've just brought that into flying a lot more because i think it's a helpful way to just think about it because we often are tired dehydrated all those kinds of things and you really do have decided okay. Is this the data. Step off the hill. Yeah yeah in. In what i ended up writing in that letter To come full circle. Little bit is to imagine that. What if you know to to play that game. What's the worst case scenario. What's the backup plan. What is it safe exit. Nell z's to have margin and think about those things. Don't just go for it. Yeah and that's that was kind of the in climbing Like you said skiing. There were good accident reports. And i read those again yet. That voice in your head the next time you're out you know gavin. You know this this age this this experience level put himself in this position and i do think that is super helpful because it causes visuals that digitalization share and It forces you to imagine yourself in the worst case scenario and i found the same with climbing. If you're in a place protection on trad lead you have to visualize what it would look like if you fell in how. What's when you're gonna take what direction of a force is going to be applied to your Earpiece your anchor and so all of that gets you comfortable with the idea of scenarios and then mitigating the risks where you can an accepting someone. You can't in so like when you talk about flying to the past low. I think you're you're doing that. Like i'm gonna win for have to lend pick like the software my feet stolman round but i think in the beginning stages for a pilot. They don't think that far ahead you know they're they're they might land in a much worse scenario they know to know how to. And you don't know okay sheer black hawk back as your your kind of work against you in a sense you probably know that at the time but well so i in this situation i think the where visual indicator well there was the physical ones the exhaustion fatigue and Some pain and Against some new equipment. And a little bit of overconfidence perhaps Or building. Myself up. So i could pull this off It was very strong. And i think against twitchy or launch. It was a i. Visualize win was wrapping around the ridge. A little bit coming back at lunch. And i think it was some pretty strong thermal stress off launch and my first attempt. I think i caught some woody brush up there and so i i packed it up for a second and watch the other pilots with our was amazing. Got off and out of their tim o. Horns yeah he was out in. no he's still doing. It was maybe year and a half or two or three ago two years ago maybe legacy. Yeah oh yeah you know. Just amazing person to watch fly and My friend peter who has more experience than me took off and he flew this flight path. That kind of took him lookers or launchers left if you will and i watched his wing osler in that way you know where pitches way back and then forward again the way back and ford again which i would now correlate with some reuter whether it's mechanical or third or thermic and i remember seeing it and thinking well i can handle that. He no like i you know he handled it. I can handle it. I've had training and and it led him to the thermal he flew flew out and sure enough. I flew basically the same course From watch and the first ten seconds go by and i get a little lift To visualize now. I think the east side of launch. Then come back to more the west side watch and get into that area. Where he'd notice those pitches pitch activity. I start to feel it. You know like like that roller coaster feeling that none of us really enjoy go back in and four and i check it and then back and forth check it and then back and the thing i feel was new to me and it was sort of like the wing. Crumpled are deflated versus going down. You know. I think that. I just had maybe just experienced a bit of sheer or downward force from the backside of of both of the leave the thermal in maybe a lot of break from checking it it. Perhaps because what happened next was It essentially did frontal and my hands fell way back like you said in doing a ton of break to compensate for that falling backwards. Right like Riding the roller coaster viewing the wind. Kind of start to deflate lost the brake pressure and then buried the hands to find it with because i was losing my balance going backwards in because i you're always talked to follow the brake pressure but there's always exceptions to the wasn't in this case right like i i went from a frontal to a stall and new enough to from the air to like put into back fly but my brain was slow to catch up. I just i was holding back fly looking at the wing being like. Why aren't you fly. And you know you didn't have a lot of train cleans. This is twenty seconds into the flight right off launch. Yeah and and i'm like okay. Well then flying. I let my hands up and the right tip was Cravat it or just didn't didn't fly properly and went right into an auto rotation got thrown right into it and least from yesterday experience i could recognize that and rotation the only start to slow down little that tip banged open and it was a spiral now and i knew i could solve that configuration that i could pull out of it but i also knew i drifted back over launch and if i was wrong about what else seeing out of the quarter my like i thought i had the train clearance but if i was wrong or if i didn't perfectly plotted the spiral like i knew i was dead like straight up so Something else in my had took over. And i found that handle and In in it and it opened like a gunshot immediately. Because i think there's a lot of energy and spiral and to d. power the wing and then look down realized. I was about to land landed with elated. Probably within like five seconds of throwing. Yes that was a i fly. I probably at all up. I'm hundred k. G. but i fly with a one forty k. g. reserve can have their choices and we could talk at length about that. I think from my primary reserve knowing have of that size for a softer landing is nice. Oh of jesse in this terrain. Yes in black hawk. Those those loosening don't know this is just a desert mountain site with a lot of rocks blackrock and it's pretty Pretty helter skelter out there raw. Yeah you know it's it's big air and is not. it's not grassy alps. No no yeah. I landed on my feet and that was wonderful. A nice soft landing but my reserve and wing when into these bushes that didn't do any damage but it took forever to get out of the slick like if you think you know if you let your wines dangle while you're collecting them or she dragged him on ground for a second. You're looking at another thirty minutes. And i was really fortunate Right near the road up if you wanna call it a road. Very offroad and fast eddie who is are retrieved driver kind of legend around here came up and he likes to braid all the lines until like daisy chains. So that they wouldn't keep catching and he helped me get out of there and we even got the reserve container because it landed right next to me. That's how close it was so a lot of lessons. Learned leading up to it. And then again. I can't say enough about putting the work in. I knew there might be from your podcasts and mental recovery required and then some physical practice in my instincts needed. And so i did. I think i did too. Siv's after that to to work specifically out what had happened in the first one of them was the most critical one and dylan worked with me on completely reproducing. What happened in that specific scenario so we went up and i pulled huge funnels on bar and even stall it at will from there from the final and then recover this doll you know an or go into extra find ways do extra energized a cement asymmetric collapses into auto rotations and we sort of invented together a few maneuvers debt. Allow me to restore my confidence and rebuild those instincts. I think that configuration mean. It sounds like sound like a. You had had enough training which a lot of people don't to recognize what was going on. And that's a big deal. Don't most people When they're learning or haven't done a ton of siv when you ask them what just happened. There they have no idea will. The wing dist collapsed. Or whatever you know did but the whole process of it is very fast. And they don't notice all the little things whereas someone who's had a ton of training can tell you exactly. This is what happened. this is how i lean. This is where i put my hand and most kind of bad cascades that i've seen are when you have the initial collapse and people instinctively when you fall you. Put your hands down. That's what we do as humans. And then they have no concept at their hands are too low and so what we do. Were heavier than a wing fall underneath lang the wings over our head and we really confused but the hell why isn't it flying was your voyeur ass and when you ask somebody they will say i. The first thing i did was what i was trained by hands up. No it wasn't because you're falling in it's it's it it's very non instinctual thing. It really takes a lot drain. We've talked about quite a bit on the shell but sounds like you know your hands were lower than you thought they were. And you're looking at your wingo. aren't you flying. And there've been several times even for me relatively recently. I was on on really rowdy. Flight with matt be sure last spring in our spring nissim valley can be really really really on very very sharp very strong very cold. So you're you're battling the elements sense and I three times on the flight. I spun the glider and it was just confusing. You know and i was having to just do this. Really dramatic to me. Let the glider fly. Because i just i was in. I was in this kind of okay. My hands are looking at them. Go in my hand definitely high enough for this glider to fly but i trade. I use a lot of different gliders. Move around on gear costly. And you know this is one. I hadn't flown in wild breaks little. They were actually extended. I'm after that because to me that you know i've up in the police in this thing was gone and you know it was. It was very. I think if i hadn't had all this. Iv training in agra training than. I've done it would have been pretty confusing licensing going you know. Oh really i think myself included when you to hire aspect wings. That's been point you on certain wings can be quite soft or quite high and you're trying to also turn tight right to stay in course and side falls. This is almost going the other day. The the turing site falls out of a tight bubble. We have here in santa barbara. You better be ready to to release her or gone into a spin and we've had a few pilots with with issues without that sensitivity comes with the training. I think comes with time and it's great to hear you talk about it. Because i think you've put so much thought into different scenarios different conditions. Different pieces of equipment. Have you in the an another another incidents. but i think we've tapped several. That are great. And they're not you know There is happened to a lot of pilots but if there is there ever been in the last three years four years you started flying In your seven hundred hours. Is there ever been a sitting at home moment. Where maybe this is right for me. This isn't maybe or is it always just been. Yeah yeah is there ever been is urban real doubt because they said the you do have the community here and there is a lot of feedback and some of that hasn't been easy to digest Know where i fly. You're lucky to get any feedback as you're totally along so times you can just run and hide from this stuff. It's it's an incident that's happened to you. you don't have to post it. Nobody asked nobody. You go run run away with your your tail between your legs and process it or not right right I think dance a absolutely not. I never doubted that. I would continue fly which i never would want to put other members of the community at risk or their access at risk. Jer though that's a real. You know a real concern in this area. I would say like we need pilots to be making smart decisions. We have a lot of pilots trying to launch together fly together just because the triggers are thermals are tight and there's very know triggers and so everyone needs to learn together and progress and improve every day and i don't think you can afford to hide your mistakes in a tight knit community and you nor should you like i think it should be open in accepting positive though if there's a series of events right then then it gets hard to handle for me These we can list out these things now but while they do constitute maybe a series of events rocky pick out some extra items that i need to work on like some key themes will that you know that may be true. For each of these instances. Those are the things. I should talk first. And that's what i tried to do. But all that stemmed from really the joy of wanting to be in the air and how these adventures and experiences hopefully with friends hopefully for a long time So there was never a even a doubt because of how much i love doing it that i would ever quit or stop doing. What's your what's your perception now of your skill level after going through all this. Iv's had some pretty fun successful flights this year cross country of a sa- personal bests some extremely high flight. Douglas seventeen nine nine nine something And but what. What's what's your where you are now. Yeah i guess. I would I think the confidence to to stay with a some of the better pilots out there. Or at least the knowledge and skills are available to me to attempt distance on big days in in big conditions but in terms of on a spectrum of progression. I think at the very beginning. So that's an interesting. I guess mental state to be an is that i know the skills are there. I know that. I either have the knowledge orders readily available to me but i still have the sneaking suspicion. I'm i'm not doing nearly enough homework. you know. i'm not doing nearly enough reading learning enough about weather. Conditions forecasting and various sites. That i want to fly out and i I also know that. I have a full time job so i'm not getting to pick necessarily my days as much or or train as much as i would like to and finally i just know that i'll have an ounce of the experience of thousands community in pilots in the wider scope of flying. So i both feel like. I have the potential to to do well in a big day but also know that i'm a long way to go before understand the more complex. The complex factors at work on a day that involves multiple types of terrain. Different changing winds at different levels of the atmosphere and to make The right course decisions to open up a challenging day we talk about the spectrum. A little bit more about a blackhawk flight is good on the uses. An example on the one hand you've got you got to be confident you just have to do. You can't do this work without having confidence the other hand you've got to have a lot of respect for it and fears good thing hat. Can you talk about the balance there between the two you know and on the one hand you know we to fly. Well we've got to charge. Got to make mistakes. Tell we learn and yet were doing it or the sport or there's no rope you can't just stick your neck out all it's pretty nasty lead vol. Yeah yeah good. That's a good comparison. I you talked about that a bit with your post with the the pilot. We've been kind of talk about here. Yeah yeah definitely. I try to break it down a little bit and i guess when it comes to how to gain skills experience without learning the hard way and in my past actually i created a ice climbing club to do mountaineering like iran climbing events. For about ten years where we would instruct teach and within the club itself. We saw educated much as we could to prevent that learning the hard way Can you practice these things In a safer environment and then ill them back together when you need them in the scenarios that require all skills at once like. I don't think it's necessarily easy to learn on a big mountain day because there's so much going on if you're not especially if you're not at that level if you're not if you're over your head you're gonna go way beyond The mental capacity to take it all in process it especially in the moment but even afterwards sometimes like you were saying about someone's wing control incident. They might have been like a car wreck and they don't they can't piece together. What's happening or even afterward have a memory of it. And i think mountain flying community seem especially the high wind environments and in the mountains like i think things can happen just so fast as someone that they're not visualizing processing the way the air can be moving and responding to it so my advice to that pile was to build non-mountain hours and that's something that's special about santa barbara. We can go fly the coast and you can just get airtime under your wit. Watch a moves what it needs. Do pitch control watch other pilots and those powers of observation are really going to keep helping you again and again and so as that need to continue to put the work in practice and do it in a environment. That isn't gonna punish you and we to that point. We also have a training. How here and i think a lot of communities have that so going there frequently. I think. I think i wrote if i don't go there once a week. I don't deserve to fly the bounds right and that. That's maybe a little strong. Sometimes i don't make it to the training. But i think going there especially if it's true or you can watch how you perform your the terrain and watch others and then practice things like sidehill. Top top leanings. I need to go back there. Because i was trying to land with you and willie Two days yesterday. Today's and and i wasn't feeling great. I just said that. Kobe shot and i was on the heavy kit and a lot of excuses. But i didn't really fully commit to in Generally i think that stems from not practising enough like always. You've got to be honest with yourself like there are a i. Don't ever want to commit to a toppling isn't right. I mean that's something. I've heard on this podcast many times but i do want to be fishing at. I want to be able to do it. I think that's the dream. And that's one of those frontiers that i think if i'm on the spectrum rate like maybe that's spectrum applies to each skill set and when it comes to top ill sidehill and tight landings. That's one that you're always gonna have to work on that and it's going to be forever before i'm like ya no problem. You know i got probably got that. In fact i don't ever wanna probably feel that way of something with consequence that like i always want to take them seriously always consider myself a beginner and someone who's learning and and again like i said anytime you just are complacent it's going to slap you down so having having training how the practice out and do things again and again is going to give you the confidence to execute it in a comic elected way and then it's going to allow you to know it's right or wrong and all of that's going to save you from having surgery when you do it for real what little things you love and appreciate about flying. What kind of keeps you fired up. Because we go through go through ruts valleys. No peaks valleys russell and In for you know for for lot of people it becomes kind of a lifetime of flight. Hopefully and you know it never gets dull but it's different if stages if you had any lulls or have you had any keeps you fired up about it now. I just don't know if that's ever been a problem. I'm always fired up. You seem pretty. Well i i think the again the people i get to fly with me and i learned so much from them and then because i work a fulltime job. The only thing that is difficult is when i get when i how much self awareness i have to have. After a long week or a long day you know the there might be a great opportunity to fly. But i might have to make sure that i'm mentally and physically prepared for it now in a way that i didn't really have to. When i first started flying actually i was working part time and that was hugely helpful to have the consistency in the progression. I did find that flying all of the time kind. Did 'cause like little burnout where you're in that. Bruno isn't necessarily. Oh i don't want to fly today but it's sort of like maybe a loss of experimental thought while you're out there like that's that trigger and i know what it's going to. Oh that's that thing. I know it's going to or Pretty much over. I'm going to go land but when you only have a couple days a week and the day is good like you're not like don't don't tell me the land. I want to see what's going to happen. I want to have that adventure. I to take as far as i think it can go and open a more open to. What's right around the corner. You know not calling it early. Not assuming that a trigger is not gonna work. You know that kind of stuff. So it's helped. Motivate me more. But i have to have the self awareness to know them. Ready for the day and borrowing from from others some of those strategies. It's like making sure impact the night before. It's not something how used to do. But doing and giving back to the community by writing letters like i did until ram or working on the board or train protect our access to sites Is all stuff that i try to do in the time amount of desk so that later i hopefully someone helped me out with a ride. Like or overpay for gas for example because god. I'm so happy as someone will drive me up. You know or helped me with logistics. If i can get out at a little bit early and we can go sore the back country in. That's that stuff such relief and so important to me that Try to put that into the same boat as omar the preparation. What can i do to kind of smooth logistics extra support from someone on the team you know and so so all. Those factors have helped me kind of get out more in stay more site. Final question kiss. My girls just showed up here. So this is. This'll this'll be a good Rap you've got a significant other. Kate would she think about all this madness. Well actually just signed up for my tandem. Astle see she's she's been working on her p one p two for a while. Oh i think we both know that. There's a lot of risks involved. A you mentioned a flight where i took off somewhat unaddressed. I think it was. Maybe one of my first flights on big flights on a two liners well and i ended up a soaring the edge of a cloud at a seventeen thousand feet or so and then Which is super rare. I think in the backcountry here was during a heat wave and And ended up gaining a lot more altitude than that as i tried to exit so as flying toward the edge of the cloud being like these clouds there have been benign all day for the most part. Great street ahead of me. I'm going to go out to the sunnyside and get some clearance and And got caught in what my various said was like a thirteen. Plus won't meet her second bubble. Jeez yeah the Had me in the cloud a few seconds And i think in those moments. I focused on three things which was breathing Keep them wing open and maintaining the heading toward that. The line to cloud line for and i felt the wing. Kinda go out in front of me. And that's what thought. I felt in the white house. It's hard to tell it stayed. Totally opened inflated almost like i was slipping off of a bubble and then i came under it and came out of the cloud. Oh my god. It was super beautiful and everything. But i think and then i was up there at Supposed to say altitudes probably say tall really higher than you should. i didn't i didn't actually share that track long publicly either Good and I i was pretty cold up there and it was good point of reflection. You know about being prepared for this but also being prepared with the people you care about. The whole thing isn't something we talk about a lot. But she's always been really supportive. And i imagine eventually they'll come a time when dial it back for sure but i do also encourage everyone to kind of fly the pilot you know you are fly. Fly that way you know when we talked about feedback from the community thing that bothered me in the past was generalized responses. Like sort of like. Oh dial back a bit right. And i don't think that's hugely helpful. Because in pilots might fly with hesitation. They might have. They might fly with someone else's voice in their head doubt their decisions which thinks just as hazardous and so in my letter that That ronan telegram try to very specific ways that pal can put the work in and very specific ways to improve and those things to work on not necessarily just dial back a bit. How every little piece of the process can be more proficient and always like you said the worst case scenario and leaving the margin jeff driven. Thank you so much for sharing all this with all of us. And i wish you great success with all this madness that were embarked on and baseman time. It's been awesome. Thanks if you find. The cloud base may have valuable. You can support it. In a lot of different ways you can give us a rating on itunes or stitcher. However you get your podcast. That goes a long ways. Spread the you can blog about it on your own website or shared on social media. You can talk about it on the way to launch with your pilot friends. I know a lot of interesting. Conversations have happened that way and of course you can support us financially. This show does take a lot of time. A lot of editing lot of storage and music and all kinds of behind the scenes cost. So if you can support financially all we've ever asked for a buck show and you can do that through a one time donation through pay pal or you can set up a subscription service that charges you freak show that comes out. We put a new show out every two weeks so for example if he did a buck show and every two weeks. It'd be about twenty five dollars a year so way cheaper than a magazine subscription and it makes all of this possible. I do not want wanna on this show with advertising or sponsors. We could asked about that pretty frequently but i whole bunch of different reasons which i've said many times on the show. I don't wanna do that. I don't like to have in that stuff at the front of the show and also want you to know that these are authentic conversations with real people and these are just our opinions but our opinions are not being skewed by sponsors or advertising dollars. I think that's a pretty toxic business model. So i hope you dig that You can support us if you go to. Cloud base may dot com. You can find the places to support. You can do it through. Patriot dot com for slash. Cloud-based mayhem if you wanna recurring subscription you can also do that directly through the website. 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166 Instrument Flying Gotchas, Filing IFR Flight Plans, and a Pilot Deviation + GA News
"Hello again and welcomed aviation news talk a weekly show with relevant news and flying tips for pilots and student pilots to help keep you safe. I'm extra up for main topic today. We're gonna be talking about instrument flying gotcha hs those subtle details that are easily forgotten. Couldn't get you in trouble. Plus i'll talk about my recent six day trip teaching the vision yet and we have a listener questions about getting the are rooting. You want and what to do in. Atc dumps you. While you're still in the class. Charlie less we can episode one sixty six. We talked with steve bush owner of lonestar helicopters but how to get a helicopter certificate. So if you didn't hear it you may want to check it out and if aviation newstalk podcast is new to you. Well and whatever app. You're listening to us now. Just click on the subscribe button. So new episodes will download for free each week. I think you'll enjoy your discussion today. About our gotcha. And you won't want to miss future shows this week in the news. The novel report shows a drop in accident rates and there are conflicting stories about how easy it might be. The catch covid on an airline flight in a pilot is sentenced after pleading guilty to attempting to operate an aircraft under the influence of alcohol. All this and more and the news starts now from web dot com. And i'll report shows a drop an accident rates. Ao pa and the air sixty institute have launched a new platform designed to provide two more current accident data in near real time. According to alpa the new platform will allow accident data to be updated on a rolling thirty day cycle it will also let users selecting compare accident analysis graphs for multiple years from two thousand eight through two thousand twenty sl senior. Vp richard mcfadden said. I'm excited that. This major effort has significantly accelerated the accident. Alyssa's process this allows us to release the twenty ninth and thirtieth joseph t reports which provide a snapshot in time for twenty seventeen and twenty eighteen data respectively digging into that data. The twenty ninth nor report found that the total number of accidents in two thousand seventeen decreased from twelve hundred twenty seven in two thousand sixteen to twelve hundred four. The two thousand seventeen analysis also saw an improvement on two thousand sixteen accident rate of four point. Nine eight accidents per one hundred thousand hours coming in at four point eight accidents per hundred thousand hours. The two thousand seventeen likes rates also dropped slightly from point seven hundred thousand hours the previous year. Two point seven six per one hundred thousand hours. The thirtieth edition of the report covering twenty eighteen data noted an increase in total accidents. To twelve hundred twenty four however it found a further drop the total accident rate to four point. Five six per one hundred thousand hours as well as a decrease in the fatal accident rate two point seven four per one hundred thousand hours landing accidents of which there were three hundred and thirty five twenty sixteen dropped to three hundred and fourteen the following year but rose to three hundred twenty two and twenty eighteen whether related accidents spike from twenty three including twelve fatal in two thousand sixteen to forty two including thirty two fatal. Twenty seventeen of there was a decrease in twenty eighteen back down to twenty three accidents and twenty one. Fatal weather related accidents it all three years. The majority of those accidents involved the f. Our flight into imc. The now report analyzes aviation accident data from years were probable causes have been determined for at least eighty percent of the accidents that occurred and make it easier for you to read the novel reports. I've include links to them in our show. Notes in here are several quick stories about co bid on the airlines. And of course. I'm point interest in this having done a three airline trips here in the last five weeks this comes from federal news network dot com. It says dod department of defense study says. It's hard to contract covid nineteen airplane. Dod's in air and ground testing indicate commercial aircraft present low risk for covid transmission in the midst of the pandemic all available evidence shows. It's a very good idea to keep oneself away from large gatherings of other people and to avoid unnecessary travel. But if you really need to go somewhere. It's extraordinarily unlikely contract. The virus during a plane flight. They say that's according to a finnish. Study by the us transportation command and darpa defense advanced research projects agency which officials say is the largest study of airborne particles in the airplanes that have been conducted. Defense officials launched the research to help determine the risk of moving service members and their families aboard contracted commercial aircraft. Most commonly the boeing. Triple seven and seven six seven jets which have been collectively dubbed the patriot. Express the test estimated. You need to be sitting in the same plane with the kobe. Infected passenger for fifty four straight hours before you inhaled enough viral particles to become infected. But there's a flip side to that. Here's a store that comes from. Yahoo dot com says the airlines insist flying and safe but nearly one hundred. Us air marshals have been infected with covid nineteen last week. They say a number of covid. Nineteen cases hit the federal air. Marshals dallas office and shuttered. It's filled office in philadelphia and early october and air marshal based in minneapolis. Died from covid. Nineteen several air marshals told yahoo news. The deceased officer believed he had contracted the virus on a flight. Tsa told yahoo news. Ninety eight federal air marshals have tested positive for the covid nineteen virus though it does not address whether those cases were from flying hit some air marshals who are armed law enforcement officers who protect civil aircraft attacks directly linked to at least some of those infections to their time spent in airports on flights both associations that represent many of the nearly three thousand federal air marshals also believe that at least some of their members contracted the virus from work on flight so they acknowledged some of these cases were from the start of the pandemic prior to the nationwide shutdown or the introduction of mask on flights. The air marshals association knows of one federal air marshall case at the start of the outbreak that is linked with certainty to european flight. Said john kass already president of the association which represents about half the marshals air travel is at a historic low federal air marshals are still flying aircraft protect them from terrorist attacks. Ajab that now comes with a new risk amid a the recent death of an air marshall other cases come at a time when airlines are desperate to convince the public that flying is safe. Emphasizing their ventilation systems disinfectant procedures in mandatory mask requirements. And here's story from cnn. Dot com dallas area woman died due to covid nineteen while on a flight from las vegas. According to county officials the woman was in her thirties and had underlying high risk health conditions. Dallas county said in a news release. That's interesting story. Just came out in october. But it was about a flight that occurred in july specifically on spirit airlines on july twenty fourth. They say that when she became unresponsive that the plane was diverted to albuquerque. The proper authorities responded. It was determined. The individual was deceased on arrival. The news comes with people appear to be getting more comfortable flying through them pandemic. Tsa screen more than one million passengers. According the agency the most since march sixteenth. And i can just tell you from my personal experiences of taking airline flights over the last five weeks three different trips i still feel relatively safe on the airlines by pretty pretty diligent about keeping my mask on at all times where i think i encounter. The greatest risk is one. I have to eat at restaurants. And so i always always always get takeout food when i'm on these trips from my mother load dot com columbia base to a state of the art helicopter still using helicopter from the vietnam era. Cal fire attack base will be one of a dozen basis statewide to get a new tech fire. Hawk cal fire. Spokesperson scott mclean confirmed that statewide. Twelve huey helicopters will be switched out for new lockheed. Martin sikorsky s seventy. I far hawks. Each helicopters cost twenty five million for total price. Tag of three hundred and twenty five million dollars between affirmed we hope to see our first sikorsky in sacramento in about a month or so start training and testing it he added. We'll start seeing the balance of them trickling over the next three three and a half years or so. I don't have a timeframe for when columbia will get. There's the newburgh is a significant improvement. Towns mcclain who details quote these helicopters will come with tanks. Not buckets the buckets on our old hueys would hold about three hundred sixty gallons. The core skis will carry about one. Thousand gallons have more power and fly. Faster explains that tanks being more than double in size it will allow crews to fight the flames longer in those important first minutes on the scene and during the duration of the blaze besides the tank. The actual helicopter is also much larger quote. It gives us better capability some of which will be set up for night flying while the latest technology in these aircraft it enhances our responses to various incidents especially to allah make and calaveras counties considering the topography. Now this both fairly mountainous counties mclean revealed other upgrades being made to cal. Air fleet noting that seven new c. One thirty four prop engine planes with four thousand gallon tanks will start arriving in sacramento about mid year. Twenty twenty one mclean also realize that all of the states airbases are strategically placed with each having no longer than a twenty minute response to any incident a strategy that appears to be working as he boasts. He says we're quote keeping ninety five percent of our wildfires at ten acres or less and that's through a combination of aircraft and ground crews from sf avi b. j. dot com record flight for electric airplane. Camarillo airport a hybrid electric powered aircraft by and lunch from camera. Airport completed their longest flight to date for an airplane. Employing electric propulsion. The recent flight piloted by justin guillen and russell newman who by the way as a patriot supporter of ours took off from camarillo and landed two and a half hours later at hayward airport in the san francisco area after flying up the central valley at eighty five hundred feet. The pair flew the electric eel. A six seat cessna three three seven twin engined aircraft modified with an electric motor in the nose in a combustion engine in the rear the milestone electric aviation took place after four weeks of flight testing and the camarillo area. In that time the aircraft flew more than thirty hours during two thousand three flights in twenty days. According to the hawthorn company aircraft will now be partially disassembled for shipment to hawaii world. We used in a series of demonstration. Flights with an airline there the electric ill can generate fuel emission savings of about thirty percent on longer regional routes such as the camarilla to hayward flight and savings up to fifty percent on shorter. Regional routes with aircraft's electrical propulsion system can be run at high power settings from new atlas dot com an autonomous electric crop duster gets approval for us demos although there are in our few different crops. Spring multicolored drones. Fixed-wing drones were faster and have a longer battery range. That's where the recently. Us certified autonomous electric pelican. Crop duster comes into the picture developed by oakland california startup taika. That's p. y. k. a. The pelicans claim to be much cheaper and easier to use than combustion. Engine fixed-wing crop spraying aircraft. The drone itself has a twenty foot long and thirty eight foot. Wingspan carries a spray payload of up to six hundred and twenty five pounds and can take off and land within the space of just one hundred fifty feet thrust is provided by three twenty kilowatt electric motors to on the wings and one on the back delivering a cruise speed of ninety miles per hour. Those motors are powered by a lithium polymer battery. Pack full charge of which is claimed to be good for flight. Range of seventy miles plans call for the final version of the pelican to utilize. It's three d. Mapping and path planning systems to establish the location and boundaries of the target field and to identify obstacles in and around the area. It not only cruises autonomously but also takes off and lands on its own reportedly never varying from its pre programmed path by more than one meter according to pica the pelicans spray up to one hundred and thirty five acres of land per hour that figures based on a spray rate of two. Us gallons per acre and includes filling time turnarounds and battery swaps. What are the company's earlier prototype aircraft. The egret has already been tested on the crops in new zealand on october. Twenty first though the pelican was granted a special air worthiness certificate by the faa. This will allow to be demonstrated at american farms. Were crews will be training use ultimately pica plans on leasing. The aircraft to aerial spraying companies from argus press dot com carmen announced. It was awarded the twenty twenty and laureate in the business aviation category by aviation week network for its revolutionary garment auto land. The world's first autonomous safety enhancing technology for ge aircraft with the ability to land in aircraft without human intervention in the emergency the pilot passengers on board the aircraft can activate auto land land the aircraft with a simple press of a button auto land can also activate automatically if the system determines. It's necessary once activated. The system calculates a flight plan to the most suitable airport avoiding terrain and adverse weather initiates an approach to the best runway in automatically lands the aircraft without pilot or passenger intervention the first land system for g aircraft the garment auto land as received faa certification and the piper. M six hundred the tb m. Nine forty and serious vision chat as part of the g three thousand integrated flight deck. And if you want to hear more about auto land you'll want to listen to the interviews. I did while visiting garment about a year ago. On the day they announced auto land and you can hear those an episode one twenty eight from generally news dot com an incorrect altimeter setting results in the see fit or controlled flight into terrain. The pilot reported that he entered aleph traffic pattern for runway thirty at the airport in hobbs new mexico during night of emc conditions although he thought he had sufficient altitude during the initial phase of the final approach based on his ultimate indication shortly after turning the final the piper pa are hit terrain. The plane sustained substantial damage to the right wing and fuselage but the three occupants were uninjured post accident examination of the airframe and engine revealed no evidence of pre-accident mechanical failures or malfunctions. That would have precluded normal. Operation examination did reveal that the owner had an incorrect setting which resulted in an indication. Error of plus eight hundred feet mean sea level pilots stated that he must have had the incorrect setting for the destination airport probable cause the pilots incorrect altimeter setting during the night visual approach which resulted in controlled flight into terrain. And i must say this pilot was very lucky. Typically these kinds of accents usually are fatal. Now here's a story about some folks who weren't quite so lucky. This comes from the daily mail dot co dot uk mexican military seizes private jet carrying seventy two million dollars worth of cocaine arrest pilot. That's still amazes me. That people still doing this. But anyway the mexican military detected a private jet illegally entering its airspace and found a ton and a half of cocaine incited when it was forced to land at an airport near the border with belize. President andres manuel lopez obrador announced during his daily press briefing that the military arrested one of the pilots after the abandoned the aircraft at chima international airport in chita the suspect's identity was not revealed to the press. President over doors said that despite the seizure of the jet approximately one pm. Local time to other aircraft were detected mexican airspace. Were out of the armed forces reach. The massive shipman is worth approximately seventy two million dollars in the us. It's unknown where the jet had departed from and it's the second time in three weeks of the mexican military as intercepted a narco jet and finally from teepee dot com which is a tv station. In saint paul minnesota delta pilot who was arrested for intoxication sentenced a delta airlines pilot who was arrested in july two thousand nineteen for being a toxic ated before his scheduled flight out of the minneapolis. Saint paul airport was sentenced according to court records. Gabriel lyle schroeder will serve thirty days jury. Of which will be under home detention. He will also be required to spend one weekend jail. Sugar will then be placed under probation which will include alcohol treatment. He pleaded guilty to attempting to operate an aircraft under the influence of alcohol and by the way thirty days is a pretty light sentence compared to that which was received by the three northwest pilots who were convicted. In nineteen. Ninety a flying boeing seven. Twenty seven while drunk to those pilots received a one year sentence in the third received a sixteen months sentence and i met one of those three piles about ten years ago at arab venture and he had served a sentence in federal prison. Where at one point. He was attacked by cellmate. And i must say he still haunted by the experience when i saw him in. Not getting back to the rest of the story. Cording criminal complaint. On july thirtieth at about ten thirty am airport police in. Tsa were conducting a random joint insider threat screening in terminal one in the known crew member entrance during the detail of detective observed a delta pilot later identified as schroeder approach screening area before he stopped abruptly and appeared surprised. A tsa supervisor schroeder informed him. They were conducting additional screening. He asked her to place his bag on the table. For screening and schroeder woodley told the. Tsa supervisor that he was not ready to be screened left. The area supervisor reported the pilots suspicious activity to the tsa police due to concern. That shorter may had a prohibited item in his bag. After two detectives were s locating the pilot they placed a request with the airline dispatch to have schroeder track down when the detectives return to the screening area. They found the pilot getting screened. An air marshal ask where he had gone and schroder stated he had gone to the delta crew room to retrieve his ipad that he had allegedly forgotten according to the complaint. The air marshall said schroeder appeared to be nervous and deceptive dispatch informed one of the detectives at schroeder had gone to the restrooms located on the tram level for approximately twenty seven seconds. And that he in fact did not enter the delta crew room that attractive and federal air marshals enter the restroom and located unopened. One point seven five liter bottle of phillips fodder in the trash container detectives then made contact with a pilot in the cockpit of airbus. Three twenty one the complaint states. They witnessed the pilot and questions senior. The officers chair and operating console the aircraft while conversing with the captain the aircraft who was seated schroeder's left detectives noted that there were already two passengers on board at are asking the pilot to speak with him. One of the detectives noticed schroeder started sweating and shaking when asked the pilot said he hit last consume alcohol three days prior detective reported. He smelled the light over a consume alcoholic beverage. On schroeder's breath breath sample was taken in schroeder's reading was point. Six five blood alcohol level. He was in place under arrest and transported. Shuna the more to this story which is for god's sake don't mix drinking and flying unless you really want to screw up your life anyway Having grown up in a family with an alcoholic parent. I hope that Mr schroder gets the treatment that he needs and is able to continue his career successfully. Well that's the news for this week coming up my weekly updates and then onto our main topic which is talking about some far flying gushes in a pilot deviation all right here on the aviation news talk podcast. Let's start things off with another fun flying destination. This is brad wrath fun flying destination fun. Playing destination is kern valley airport. A fire lima zero five. It's a airport in the southern sierra mountains in california it said thirty five hundred foot runway in about a twenty five hundred foot altitude report. The pattern is a lot of fun to fly because it's a mountainous area so you'll have mountains around you though you got to be a little careful that it is really a nice view. Once landed at the airport you can you can eat at. The restaurant cost so camp at airport as well underneath the airplane. If you want to tribes out three miles south with a rental car you can camp at a lake khaliq isabela. It's pretty big lake. An we can also go fishing there as well. Also kern valley serves current. Bill and kernville is home to a lot of rivers and outdoor adventures. And if you're feeling adventurous you can go whitewater rafting there her my run flying destination. Thanks brett thank you. so much. For sunday gazette fund flying destination years ago. I flew my old seaplane down to lake isabella. Sino the area they're pretty mountainous and also very pretty and guess what that is the last one we have in the queue so no more fun flying destinations unless you take some initiative to send me one so it doesn't matter where you are. What state what country you're in if there's an airport near you that you like and you want to tell people about it please do that. It's easy to do. Just pull out your smartphone. Look for the voice. Memos app you can record up to say about ninety seconds tells all about your favorite airport and then e mail that file to me at aviation news talk at gmail.com or if you'd like just go out to our website of aviation news. Talk dot com. Click on listener question that the top of the page which will lead you to our speak pipe app. You can always record anything like but that's a great way to record a fund flying destination. Now here's an update on some of my flying couple of weeks ago. I flew commercially to knoxville. For the third time in five weeks to some teaching in the series vision jet that was essentially a six day trip as it takes a full to get out there via the airlines and then spent five days flying around the western. Us to give the pilot twenty five hours of sos or supervised operating experience. He had just completed the two weeks of training for his vision type rating at it passed his check ride but since that training is all done at apart one forty two which means that nearly all the training is done in a simulator. It by the way these simulators are multi-million dollar full motion simulators since it's done under that type of training. The faa requires that after the check right. A pilot needs to fly in the airplane for twenty five hours while being supervised by a pilot who has a type rating for that aircraft and there is also a long list of task which serious requires us to fit in fights. We spent most of that time of the western. Us as there are plenty of challenging airports and because it was closer to our ultimate destination of watsonville california which is a nice little town right next to the monterey bay where the owner is based in where i often hang out on weekends. That let me tell you all the airports we landed at. And then i'll tell you about an interesting challenge. We encountered it one of those airports from knoxville. We flew to olathe kansas home of garmon and from there. We went to centennial airport in denver where we spent the night the next morning. We flew to santa fe new mexico from there. We were planning to eagle county airport. Which is in the rocky mountains of colorado. It has a rather challenging departure procedure that we were looking forward to try. But the xm weather was showing possible. Icing and sld's supercooled large droplets. Which are the worst form of icing right over the airport and since our syllabus called us do at least one diversion. I diverted us to grand junction colorado. Which had much better weather from there. We went to jackson hole wyoming. Which i'll talk about in more detail. In a moment there we went to tacoma narrows in washington and then directly to montgomery field and san diego. Now that's like a little over three hours and was great fun as i had never flown the entire length of the west coast in a single flight While we were at montgomery field spotted. Robert diller antithesis citizen of the world airplane which has now completed a polar circumnavigation. Then you may recall that. We had robert on this show about a year ago and episode one hundred and nineteen from san diego. We then flew to watsonville but ended up. Diverting to salinas california. I'll talk more about that during our main topic when we talk about several related encounters. I've had over the last couple of weeks. The next day we flew from salinas to the grand canyon airport in northern arizona and back and on the fifth day we did a night flight pasa robles california and back so it was all refunds. I just love flying the vision yet. But since i was gone for almost a week i wasn't able to create as many episodes of this podcast as i usually do. I really thank you for your patience in waiting for this episode. Now let me. Tell you about our departure. Out of jackson hole wyoming jackson hole is a beautiful little town. Steepen a valley in the mountains of north western wyoming and it's just south of one of the entrances to yellowstone national park and boy about twelve years ago. I got stuck there for several days waiting for an aircraft to be repaired. And i just love spending time in that area. When we arrived it was overcast. So we flew the. I'll s zulu runway nineteen approach. There's also an i l. s. e. yankee runway nineteen approach and the differences that the minimums on the zulu approach are lower but to fly the missed approach. You need to have a minimum climb capability of two hundred and thirty five feet per nautical mile to ten thousand six hundred feet now. Let's two hundred thirty five feet per nautical mile not two hundred and thirty five feet per minute so to figure out if you can make that climb gradient you have to use your aircraft's climb speed to convert from feet per nautical mile two feet per minute. We had picked up a little ice on the wings as we were coming in on the aia less the airport field. Elevation is six thousand four hundred fifty one feet and when we landed it was ninety re celsius or about forty eight fahrenheit and it was raining lightly. We originally planned to go to the eagle county airport because they have that challenging departure procedure but jackson hole has a somewhat less challenging departure procedure and we spent probably about forty minutes discussing it and the climb capabilities of the serious vision chat. I i should mention if you don't already know serious. Vision jet has just one jet engine and while that makes it very economical to operate as you're burning only half as much fuel. The downside is that its climate is not as good as other jets. Which is what you'd expect. Most of the time that doesn't matter. I have a few hundred hours of experience. The vision jet. This literally was the first time. I've encountered a situation where we had to closely look at the climb rate in our case we were looking at the alpin departure procedure to requires a climate of three hundred forty one feet per nautical mile up to fifteen thousand feet and when we later got a clearance to cross kick nikkei i see any at sixteen thousand feet instead of fifteen thousand feet so we would have required an even climb rate. Fortunately the vision jet. Fm war php will has many tables in it. So you can figure out what kind of climb gradient you can achieve over a wide range of temperatures and altitudes. Unfortunately the normal table confirmed that we wouldn't be able to achieve the required three hundred forty one feet per nautical mile all the whip. Fifteen thousand feet and certainly not to sixteen thousand feet however there is a sippy. Climb table that achieves a steeper. Climb gradient if you climb with full power. Flap set for fifty percent and at the vx. Climb speed of ninety one nuts. Now that's remarkable is ninety one is slower than the climb speed. We people use in a serious. Sr twenty sr twenty two will give you a much steeper. Climb gradient than the normal climate with flaps and climbing at one hundred sixty knots division jet but there are a couple of gushes i that table only goes up to ten thousand feet so we didn't have any performance data as to. What would happen if we tried to continue climbing that way. From ten thousand feet up to fifteen thousand feet and the table is based upon remaining at full takeoff power for the entire time yet. There's a five minute limitation using the takeoff partner. So this is where the pilot needed to do. A lot of work to calculate our climb rate using one table for climate full power and flaps fifty percent up to ten thousand feet and then using a separate table for the climb from ten thousand feet. Fifteen thousand feet with flaps up and maximum continuous thrust which is less than full takeoff power. Who the pilot did a great job of constructing a graph showing how much are climate would be for every mile. We proceeded along departure procedure. Interestingly through ten thousand feet we would greatly exceed the required climb rate which is good but then from ten thousand feet through fifteen thousand feet. We didn't meet the required. Climb rate whoever. Since we had exceeded the climb needed in the first half the climb we would still reach the required altitude and time as we would be eating into the altitude margin that we had built up during the first half of the climb so the pilot made a very strong and convincing argument that by the numbers. Everything should work. I ask him how the rain might affect our climb and more importantly since we had picked up ice in the decent. We should expect to pick up ice in the climate. How would that affect our climate. The of course there was no way to factor that into the numbers. Clearly icing would affect our climb but by on a note amount now if we had had lots of surplus climb capability. I wouldn't have been concerned but we didn't die. Like to have huge safety margins built into everything i do when i fly and while this pilot made a convincing argument that probably everything would work out. Fine i never wanted to be in the position where two pilots. Either say well. I guess that didn't work out the way we thought it would. So i asked the pilot if we had any other options and he immediately came up with the one i was looking for. Which was that. We could stay overnight because the forecast looked better for the next day. So i spent a lovely evening walking around jackson hole and got some nice thai food and in the morning rain had stopped and there was a large sliver of sky that was completely blue so our plan was to climb up in it rather than fly through the clouds on the departure procedure and pick up our our clearance after we reach the minimum victory altitude. Interestingly the power kept offering other options that i think they were getting from salt lake city. One i recall was that instead of crossing a kimchi at sixteen thousand feet. They could give us fifteen thousand feet. I forget what the other option was but climbing up in the blue sky was clearly going to be a better option for us so after takeoff we did climatic full power flaps fifty percent at Maximum takeoff power for about three minutes. We climbed one knots. Instead of ninety. Nuts says we're gonna be in clear skies and didn't need the absolute best climate and because that extra ten minutes added a little safety margin if we were to encounter any wind shear in the mountains we turn to the north and climbed up the same valley through which the irs is aligned at some point. We contacted salt lake center and they told us that we needed to reach their sixteen thousand foot. Minimal victory altitude. Once we did they cleared us from our present position which saves us time versus following the departure procedure which would have taken this to the south and out of our way during the initial climb so all good experience and getting them maximum performance out of aircraft while building an extra safety margin. Every step along the way. And i wanna thank Number of listeners. Who've contacted me and told me how much the show helps them with their flying. For example. i just got this message. From richard benson and bend oregon. Who wrote greetings. max. I've trillion enjoyed your podcast. These last few weeks and in addition to saying thanks am sending a paypal donation. I've been flying since nineteen seventy eight and continue to be impressed by the amount of passion that exists. Ge and how freely folks like you and tom turner who also supporter and many others give of their time for aviation safety in the greater good of all. I also appreciate your sense of humor episode. One forty two in which you did aviation news of the weird with rob mark was over the top. Keep up the great work max. Your new fan. Richard in bend oregon. Thanks so much. Richard and is just a lovely town. I have enjoyed by many visits there in the past visiting what was then the columbia factory when the columbia four hundred was being built up there. And of course if you'd like to set up a support the show just as richard has. This would be a great time to do it. You could make a one time. Donation like richard by going out to aviation news talk dot com slash pay pal. He also sign up to do a monthly donation that way. Or you can go to aviation news. Talk dot com slash. Awesome to sign up via patriotic. When you sign up via patriot we have all kinds of goodies. She'll get at different levels of the show for example at the four dollar month level. You'll get transcripts for each show that the dollar month level you'll also get links to the many news stories. We had to cut out of the show because we didn't have enough time this week. There were twelve stories that we had to cut from the news at the twenty dollar month level. You'll actually get access to some of these shows early for example patriot members. Got this particular show about a day early and the thirty five dollars. A month level and higher. You'll get access to my online courses on the g. One thousand on that i sell at to pilot looking in dot com. And when you sign up. Paul region name which will literally get hurt by thousands of listeners and over one hundred forty countries including luxembourg singapore in uruguay down. Tell you about some of the great people who have just signed up to support the show. We have to mega supporters. One is greg van. Who signed up at the fifty dollars month level. He's a senior aviation medical examiner at the mayo clinic in rochester minnesota. He also hosts a podcast focused on aerospace medical issues for pilots which is called mayo clinic. Clear approach which you can find where ever you get your podcast. I've listened to the show. And i recommend it. And also we have james kerr as another fifty dollars a month mega supporter james interested in buying sr twenty two for business travel. And i'll tell you more about james next time other new patriots include david dismore bread. Daehnhardt nick reinhart. J b wagner mark finkelstein and greg williams. We also had one time paypal. Donations from don part for twenty dollars in richard benson. Fifty dollars in here are the mega supporters. We mentioned on every show. Brian deer lives here in northern california and recently acquired a turbo to a six tyson. Weiss co founder and ceo of four flight. And i'll be mentioning them briefly In the main topic of our show bruce dickerson. He's a financial planner living in georgia. And he flies at k. Thirty five. bonanza. Victor vogel lives in central. Pa flies a cirrus looking. Start flight school tim delaney. He's out of santa rosa california where he flies an sr twenty two and he is a wealth manager. Steven lop turbo. One eighty two and a cessna citation. Cj three plus. He's now the ceo of api jet mike williams. He's the president of keo. Mac and of tcp composites maker of composite spinners in bulkheads for g. a. aircraft. And he flies a cessna. One seventy two seth lake. We've had him on the show. He's dpa giving check rides in arkansas. Where he also specializes in teaching the multi engine rating in his beechcraft. Travel airs so if you wanna get your multi engine rating would like to do a check ride checkout vs dot ero rick miller. He's the cfi. He teaches in the cincinnati area at both the lumpkin flight training center and with private owners of piper's cessnas beechcraft and. cicadas says. He would still love to teach full time but has that day job for a few more years justin winner who sells real estate on lake yoi in south carolina any flies twenty nineteen sr twenty two carlin an rossi of maine coon cat aviation now. They've just changed their fleet lineup. Used to have three cessna. T to forty is an. I'll tell you the next time about what they currently have. Johnny mcdaid who i've met. He's a singer. Songwriter and musician and record producer. Jim goldfarb was flying out of the republican report on long island. He's training for his cfi. And see if double i and meanwhile teaching ground instruction at the pilot proficiency international flight school you can reach him through his facebook page. Ground point nine as he's available for individual instruction in person or online. Charlie mason flies out of austin texas. And he's working on his instrument rating and the cessna. One seventy two. Vincent sally me. He is council councilmember for the city of panel here in northern california. He also owns sally me. Construction management in san francisco. Jim hop is a cfi. Who i've flown with. He teaches at at aviation at my home. Airport palo alto lars listens. He's our youngest supporter. He flies a redbird simulator and someday he hopes he can fly his dad's cessna two. Oh five dad. By the way cells boats at boulder boats dot com chose of. She flew in the navy for eight years and now has a couple of hundred hours in his new vision. Jet josie freeman were on his instrument rating in arizona dylan caldwell he is a relatively new ame. So he gives flight physicals at the naples municipal airport in florida. So if you need a basic med second or third class physical contact him through aviators clinic dot com and william birch donates to the show and the memory of his son lieutenant j g wallace birch. Who was a navy pilot don. Hey cala his. With professional instrument courses they conduct instrument courses. I finish up. Nif are refresher courses at i fly dot com steve bush. We just had him on the show in episode one sixty five. He owns a lone star helicopters lago vista texas. He does a lot of add on ratings as well as helicopter ratings at lonestar halley dot com don domain is a professional pilot. Who runs an airline flight department. He's also cfi. Flies a bonanza and we've been exchanging email recently rick madison owner of point. Wise which makes cfd that's computational fluid dynamics simulation software used by aerospace companies. You can find them at point. Wise dot com. John stow of flint michigan. He rents planes out of the greater flint. Pilots association also conesa cherokee six. That's just been updated with garmin powell and the gts six fifty gps navigators vic judge who lives here in the san francisco bay area and flies a cirrus rick love. He's a knoxville tennessee. Based syra cicip former factory instructors specializes in finish up courses for instrument and commercial ratings and also available for serious transition training recurrent training and ferry flights. You can find him at rick love. Cfi gmail.com mark holes. Bocci lives in south western. Pa is a longtime aviation enthusiast. Who wants to get his private when he retires. He runs baden still dot com which manufacturers industrial fasteners. Tim crawford he's flying. Da forty at crosswinds aviation at the oakland county airport north of detroit. He runs a company called brain spring. That helps kids with dyslexia. and greg. Van james kerr who we just talked about and i really want to thank all of you for your contributions and thank everyone who helps support the show in any way down a mobile. We're going to talk about some i-if are got shows rate here on the aviation news. Talk about cast. And let's talk about some afar. Gotcha all of these were experienced over the last week or so this first one might change the way you choose to file an iof. Our flight plan. It happened near the end of my five days of flying around the western. Us teaching division jet. We were happy to be landing back at the home base of watsonville airport which is on the coast south of san francisco however the pacific ocean is cold and often has a lower level of clouds at sometimes move in over coastal airports at night and then burns off in the morning when we arrived about five pm and a low level clouds had already started to cover the airport so we flew the arnhem. Gps run wait to approach. It has the lowest minimums at the airport. Which are four hundred and forty eight feet which is two hundred ninety six feet ag l. We flew the approach. But at minimums couldn't see a thing and we had to go missed so we diverted to salinas one thousand miles south southeast and landed there in via far conditions. Then we took an uber back to watsonville during the drive. The clouds were often down to the road so it was particularly bad night. A couple of hours later. I got a message from nor cal asking if i knew the pilot of a serious aircraft that had landed are at salinas after us but hadn't closed. Its iof our flight plan. The reason they called me. Is that some of the people there. No. i'm very active serious. Pilot in one of the people do just tap into. No i'd been at the salinas airport. So they wondered. If i was still at salinas and could look for the aircraft or if i had a way to get in touch with pilot this was around nine pm after the tower had closed and at that point nor calvin searching for the plane and pilot for over an hour i was here at home and i started googling the tail number but only a corporation name and couldn't figure out the name of the pilot so i contacted someone that serious who i thought might know and even though it was late he got right back to me with a name but no contact information. I then found a website for the person which gave me a phone number and email address about this time. I heard from nor cal that they had sent the police out to the airport. They had searched the ramp and found the aircraft but nobody with the airplanes so at least now they knew the aircraft hadn't crashed which is of course. The biggest concern wanna pilot forgets to cancel the our flight plan. I tried the phone number. I found the website for the pilot and left a voicemail. I sent an email with the subject in all caps. Need to cancel your eye. Afar salinas in email said. Just left you a voicemail division jet pilot galina to salinas an hour or two before you this evening dark out. Contacted me to see if i knew you as they never received an cancellation from you. Eh left voicemail subsequently have heard back from nor cal that the police were called out located your crafts safely on the ground. You'll probably still wanna call nor cow on number is blah blah blah moments later nor cal. We know that they had heard from the pilot. And you might think that's the end of the story. Put through a few twists one of which may change how you file your afar flight plans in the future when the pilot called he was given. What's called a brasher warning which advises pilot of a possible pilot deviation and of course that means most likely he's going to have to talk with an faa inspector in the future about what happened if you're wondering. Wow what's the big deal. Why violet a pilot over forgetting to close a flight plan. Here's what the big deal is. At least this is how it works. Northern california the first concern. Of course is that you might have crashed. And if it's a non towered airport or airport with towers closed and they're know airport operations people on duty. It's not going to be easy for approach control to determine if you landed safely. They may have to do at nortel. Did in this case which is to call the police. The sheriff to search the airport for your tail number the trick on will also be around other neighboring airports and see few diverted to one of those. But it's also possible that you're still in the air and that you're circling around trying to get into the airport or diverting to another nearby airport and in many areas radar coverage does not go all the way down to the ground so the trae connor center can't see you after you dissemble. Oh particular altitude. So it's not safer. Atc to send other iof our aircraft into the airport after you when you fill closing off our flight plan. Atc essentially sanitises the airport meaning that the airport is now closed. All i f our traffic no planes in no planes out at nortel. Bill do that for the first half hour after pilot fills cancel far and then for the next half hour. They'll notify other aircraft to the situation in let those pilots choose whether to proceed inbound to land on an approach or depart the airport on an eye for clearance and think about the worst possible case. Which is the first aircraft crashed not near the airport but on the runway and then more than a half hour later another aircraft assigned to fly the approach lands on the runway and hits the wreckage of the first aircraft. Now that's unlikely to happen in daytime in low visibility but imagine you're landing at salinas at night when the field is overcast at three hundred feet as it was when we were trying to contact this pilot though second aircraft then is at significant risk. If there's on the runway about a half hour after pilot fills to cancel iof farro. The stakes are raised on. This comes from the controller. Handbook section ten dash three dash one a considering aircraft to be overdue and initiate the procedure stated in the section to issue an all not that's ail ot which stands were alert notice when neither communications nor radar contact can be established and thirty minutes have passed since one. It's not a over a specified or compulsory reporting point or a clearance limit in your area to its clearance void time three of the of our orion aircraft arrive in an airport not serve by. Atc tower or flight service station fails to cancel flight plan after receiving instructions on how to cancel. And it says here. There's a note if you have reason to believe that. An aircraft is overdue prior to thirty minutes. Take appropriate action immediately and that continues on here be considered an aircraft to be in an emergency status and initiate all not procedures in the section immediately when there is an abnormal simultaneous loss of radar and communications with an eye af our aircraft or via far. Spf our aircraft receiving flight following services. This situation may be applicable to an aircraft operating in a non radar environment. An unexpected abnormal loss communication occurs see the artsy which would be center the artsy and whose area the aircraft has reported overdue. Missing or lost will make these determinations and take any subsequent action required d if you have reasonably than aircraft is overdue prior to thirty minutes. Take the appropriate action immediately. An e the center and whose area the aircraft first unreported or overdue. We'll make these determinations and make any subsequent action required and then there's a whole lot more detail in the controller. Handbook about what happens. What information has to be provided center. Which in this case will be oakland center. The center is then responsible for a lot of notifications in the beginning of search and rescue so once a half hour goes by a lot of people become involved in. There's a lot of unnecessary work generated. All because a pilot forgot to close our flight plan in this case. I heard that if the pilot had called within the first thirty minutes that would have been the end of it but he didn't call for over an hour and a half after we landed in. That's why he was advised possible pilot deviation by the way the pilot set in one email to me that he was seriously annoyed with himself. For letting this happen. But which is the right attitude as we should all trying to follow all of the rs all of the time he later wrote that. This is the first time i've ever been required. Cancel on the ground. I've either flown into a tower to or have been able to cancel during the approach so we tend to remember the things that we do all the time and it's much harder to remember rules about situations we've never encountered before though. I have no doubt that the last thing nor cal said it. Vies cancelling far or on the ground as that's the last thing they always tell me when i'm fly into a non towered airport but there's one more twist to the story probably affects you and how you file your eye afar flight plans one of the people. I contacted while trying to figure out who the pilot was. They were surprised. The pilot didn't include his contact information. The iof our flight plan in the next day when i followed up with pilot. He wrote something that intrigued me. He wrote. I'm just not sure why they didn't call my cell phone or email me. I filed with. Both quail looked at the flight plan section of the four flight to app and sure enough at the bottom. It should my contact information. But i wanted does that information. Make it all the way to. The controller is working in flight. Because i can see how pilots might assume that since everything else on the pages flight plan related that the contact information shown is also transmitted to the faa so decided to do a test. I emailed nor cal and told them about a flight ahead. Coming up that day in vision jet from watsonville to the grand canyon airport in arizona. And i asked him to look the strip when they received it to see if it contained my name and phone information when i landed at g. c. n. I had an email from nor cal that they checked the flight. Plan senator check with another group and none of them had my contact information that was also copied on an email from nor cal to four flight which produce some interesting information. Apparently the past four flight used to drop the phone number into the remarks section and both pilots and controllers got upset now. The pilots were upset for privacy reasons in the controllers for what they thought was garbage using up space in the remarks section so essentially four flight is caught in the middle and really could use the faa to make some recommendations and set a standard as to what happens with that contact information. So here's what you may want to do in the future when you file an eye af our flight plan at a minimum. I suggest that you put your phone number in the remarks section that way if you forget the closure flight plan after fly into a non towered airport or into a towered airport after the tower closes. The faa can easily find your phone number. And then call you to verify that you've landed safely. This is a simple way that might help you. Avoid getting a pilot deviation if you forget close off our flight plan and here's a simple trick pilot told me. He uses to remember to cancel a flight plan. He said he always keeps his watch on his left arm but he moves it to his right arm when he's either filling a swimming pool or when he has an eye of our flight plan that he needs to remember to cancel. And if you've ever move your watch two different arm you'll notice when you start walking around that something feels different and that's a good reminder to close your flight plan after you climb out of the plane and start walking around and here's an entirely different. I f are gotcha. A few nights ago while teaching iof are in actual conditions. I invoked my rule of to if you're unfamiliar with the rule of two for flying. Well that's because i made it up actually. There are multiple versions of it. One of which i learned teaching safety seminar. My personal version. Is that when i get to the second factor which is not quite right. I scrub a potential flight or terminate Actual flight generally accidents are caused by a series of bad decisions. So by stopping at the second factor. That's not quite right. I'm trying to break a link in the chain and avoid having an accident while talking about this at a safety seminar was teaching pilot in the audience described his own version of the rule of to for him. It means that he never attempts flight. With two risk factors for example he will fly over the mountains but not at night or when i f are or if he flies afar he won't do it at night now. I wrote an article awhile back for. Faa aviation news. I mentioned that. There's a great disparity between the commercial in the g. a. accident rates which is partially explained by the airlines use of to pilot crews and over the years. I've noticed when i fly with two pilots am less fatigue. Y arrive and i attribute that to one lower stress of sharing the workload with another pilot but to knowing that. There's a second pilot to alert me to mistakes. I might make and when taking a long trip or when needing to fly. After a long day of business you might consider taking a second pilot. Perhaps along with you so all of these are different versions of my rule of two and this particular case of the rule of too. I was teaching. Iof aren an older avidan. Sr twenty two at have been upgraded with a pair of gts six fifty gps navigators and avidan. Dmc ninety autopilot. We had just flown. Gps approaching san luis obispo at night and the dnc. Ninety autopilot didn't couple the glide path. So i had the pilot disconnect. The autopilot in hand fly approach next week. Flu the islas. Ten right into monterey and again. The autopilot didn't couple approach so again. I had the pilot disconnect in hand fly the approach. Well shortly after that we entered really thick clouds on our strobe lights began harshly reflecting off the clouds. Nearly blinding us in the cockpit. And about that time. I noticed that are airspeed had decayed eighty two nuts. Whereas we fly approaches in the cirrus at one hundred knots so i immediately called for go round even though we had just barely started the approach so yes we could have turned off the strobe lights. But we had all of the cockpit. Lighting turned down very low so that our is would adapt to the darkness and help us see better outside. And when i looked toward the strub switch my couldn't see it or any of the other switches next to it. So rather than have the pilot fumble for the switch in the darkness and possibly airspeed decay even further. I called for mr approach and we quickly climbed back up out of the class so in this case you could argue that. I didn't react until three. Things occurred the autopilot failing to couple of the glide slope the blinding strobes and the very slow speed but it was really the blinding strobes. That were the issue in just a few seconds. I found them to be painful. Very distracting and. I can only imagine for some pilots. That could eventually do seizure. But what kicked off. The entire sequence of events was the dnc ninety autopilot not coupling to the glide slope. If it had we wouldn't have been slow in our hands would have been free to hunt for the strobe switch so i resolved to figure out what it was about the autopilot that we didn't know now. The dmc was designed as a drop in replacement for the older s tech fifty five exit originally ship with most older abidine cirrus aircraft in the fifty five x was a great autopilots for its time but that design is now well over twenty years old and the dnc ninety is a popular digital replacement autopilot for these older aircraft. I've used the dnc ninety autopilot a number of times but not on a lot of instrument approach is so afterwards. I went through the manual in detail to try and figure out the issue and after researching i came up with one more clue to the crash of an sr twenty two an aug that we talked about in detail episode one sixty two. You might recall that accident. There were many risk factors including a pilot who had relatively low total flying time little experience in the twenty two and was flying in the wee hours of the morning and after a five hour flight. He flew past his destination. Buy cheap fueled another airport close to his home. And during that time has homefield went below minimums but he appeared to be unaware on the final perch that he was flying parallel but offset by point six miles laterally from the entire instrument approach and he ended up crashing a mile short of the runway in the pilot had made a similar mistake during the instrument protein flu. Tonight's before which led me to clue that he was using his moving map for primary guidance. Which is a big no no because depending upon the map rains. You've set. it may appear from the map that you're on course when you're actually flying parallel to the course instead always always always use your cir. Hsi for primary course. Guidance and only use the moving map for supplemental guidance. Well when i read the manual for the dnc ninety. I found that it was confusing. Especially with regard to the nerve and gps s buttons and apparently the behavior of these buttons varies depending upon which s navigator. You're using it with. And i'm guessing the pilot who crashed the sr twenty two was unware the differences between these two buttons. Here's what i discovered in the dc ninety the use of navin gps s buttons art generally identical meaning. You could use either one if you want the autopilot to follow an abrogation source. However when flying i'll s approach or gps approach with glide path the glide slope or glide path modes are only armed. If the nafta button is used if the gps button was pushed the glide slope berg light path modes won't arm and the dnc ninety won't couple to glide slope or glide path and. That may help explain the aug accident. As it's obvious from the high descent rate the pilot had on this fiddle approach that he was not coupled to the glide path. So i can't help but wonder if he used the cheap e. s button instead of a now but now there is one problem i've seen with. Dmc ninety manual. It says quote approaches with curve pass must use gps certain gps approaches involving curve. Paz's cannot be flown in an nab mode example. Holds dm arc's etcetera. Gps mode must be used for procedures. Well we have subsequently discovered that is not true. My clients aircraft using the gt and six fifty with the f. c. Ninety we were able to use nab mode for curved paths and ultimately discover that we should always use now mode and never use. Gps s motives. We wouldn't be able to couple glide slopes and pass. I also found an avid online forum. That discusses the use of navin. Gps s buttons one of the people posting wrote that the section of the manual i quoted a moment ago is incorrect which was also experienced in my clients aircraft he wrote if you fly nile s with d arc with dmc ninety and gps mode. The islas portion of the approach will not arm. And i would take that even further and say that in our experience the glide slope never arms when using gps regardless of the type of leg used on an. I'll s so as you probably figured out the reason we had trouble coupling the glide slope was my client was pushing the gps button subsequently anytime he used the nath button instead he was always able to couple of the glide slopes in light pass. Now there is one corner case. I'm aware of where you might wanna use. Gps as button in combination with a carbon t and six fifty or seven fifty. And that's when flying a viewer approach. You're now permitted to flying. Entire viewer. Approach using your. Gps primary guidance provided you're monitoring underlying vr signal so in an aberdeen equipped sr twenty sr twenty two which would have been built before about two thousand eight or two thousand nine. You could select the vr needle for display the hsi but use the dnc ninety autopilot detract. The overlying cheap es course which is probably what i would do and you would do that by using the gps s-mode by the way everything. I've said here only applies to us in the nfc. Ninety with gt and six fifty. Please don't generalize what i've said to other combinations using the difc ninety with for example the government s for thirty as i haven't thoroughly tested other combinations in the behavior might be different from what i've seen with. Gt n six fifty. In by the way. I think the tfc ninety is a great autopilot. So please don't construe anything. I'm saying here To say that there's anything wrong with the the autopilot. I think it really is great. But the moral of the story here is no in great detail. How the avionics in your specific aircraft work because there are many different combinations of avionics founded aircraft in some equipment works really depending upon one. It's connected to and of course remember the rule of two anytime. You hit that second issue. That's not quite right. Don't take off go. Missed or land early depending upon the phase of flight. you're in when the second issue occurs. You don't wanna encounter a third issue that might possibly lead to an accident and finally. Here's one more gotcha. And that has to do with two. Iaf's in an arnav equipped aircraft. I was surprised recently to learn that if you're in an are have such as a. Gps equipped aircraft that. It's more restrictive when you start at an eye af instrument approach which doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me but let me tell you how that came about as you probably know you can usually approach an eye af the initial approach fix from any direction and once you reach the eye af you can turn directly onto the initial segment regardless of how big a turn is involved. And that's the way it smith flying has been done for the thirty plus years that i've had an instrument rating the exception is if the eye af is combined with another fix such as the ifp intermediate fix or even the f. af the final approach fix in those cases. You'll see it written as an eye af slash. I f an offer and there's a whole depicted there in these cases. You either have to do a course reversal in the hold. Or you're allowed to proceed directly inbound. If you arrive at the af slash i f from of course that allows you to turn inbound with a turn of less than ninety degrees. You can also start at the i f of any approach provided the turn onto the approaches less than ninety degrees. So here's what happened. I was giving some new -struction in a serious sr twenty and we asked to fly the gps zulu three one approach into salinas california. We asked to get cleared directly to f- gone that's efg o. N. with an eye af for the approach and by the way there is no hold depicted afghan and it's not combined with the i f or the final approach fix which are separate fixes further down the approach. So it's a clean. I a f- which you should be able to approach from any direction when asked to be cleared direct to afghan. I was told that i would. I have to be vectored to a point where the turn to this af would be less than ninety degrees. I reply that was the case for starting approach at an intermediate fixed but this was an eye af the control replied that this applied to an eye af at the time i was sure the controller was wrong but to discuss it any further as it just wasn't worth. Are you about it on the radio in this case getting infected would only take a few extra seconds so from a practical standpoint. It didn't matter after we landed. I did some research and discovered that there's a big discrepancy about this point between the seventy one ten dot six one five which is the. Faa's control handbook in every other piece of documentation. I could find from the faa on the subject. So frankly i think that whomever wrote the section of the controller handbook misinterpreted the rules. Though i think i know why they may have been confused. Here's what the controller handbook says is comes from section four dash eight dash one approach clearance intersection d. It says for our navid quipped aircraft so planes flying with gps operated on unpublished routes issue approach clearances for conventional which means any type of approach or are natve sl ap's which would be gps standard instrument approach procedures only after the aircraft is one established heading direct to the eye af at an intercept angle not greater than ninety degrees and is signed an altitude coordi- with be two raider monitoring is required for arnav aren p. approaches when no procedure. Turn hold in lieu pursued. Return will be executed to established on a heading of course direct to the i f at an angle not greater than ninety degrees provided the following conditions are met a sign an altitude accordance with be two. That's a different section that will permit normal sent to the f. af note controller should expect aircraft descended approximately one hundred fifty to three hundred feet per nautical mile when applying guidance in sub paragraph d to hey be raider monitoring is provided. The imf see the p. Must identify the intermediate fix with the letters is f. d. for procedures were an eye af is published. The pilot is advised to expect clearance to the i f at least five miles from the fix all right. So that's what it says in the controller. Handbook let's look at some other. Faa sources that contradict this. Let's start with the aim. The nautical information manual section. Five dash four dash six approach clearance e one maintain the last altitude assigned by a t c until the aircraft is established in published segment or transition route or approach procedure segment or other published root. For which a lower altitudes published on the chart if already established route or approach arrival segment. You may descend to whatever. Minimum altitude is listed for that route or segment to continue on the vector heading until intercepting the next published ground track applicable to the approach clearance three once reaching the final approach. Fix the public segments. The pilot may continue on approach to a landing four if proceeding to an af with published course reversal except when cleared for australian approach by atc. The pilot must execute the procedure. Turn or holding lua procedure. Turn and complete the approach five. If clear to and this is critical. And i a f- slash. I f the no procedure. Turn route or no procedure. Turn hold in lieu of procedure. Turn his published continue with published approach. Six in addition to the above our neff aircraft may be issued clearance directly to the high a. f. slash eye af by the way that doesn't say to the eye af door to the af slash i f at intercept angles not great. The ninety degrees for both conventional are have instrument approaches and then further down at says when clearing direct to the af. Atc will monitor the aircraft until the imf and advise politics pet clearance direct to the i f at least five miles from fix. Atc bus issue a straight in approach clearance when clearing an aircraft direct to an eye af slash af with a procedure. Turn or holding of procedure. Turn and atc not want the aircraft to execute the course reversal. So essentially what this is saying. Is that ninety. Return is required if you have an eye af or if you started in high af slash i f. Nowhere in the aim. Does it say that if you're at an eye af that you require a ninety return now if you go to the faa's instrument procedures handbook page for that forty nine. It says essentially the same thing. There are no references anywhere to making. Turn a less than ninety degrees at the i f except in the controller handbook. Now how could this happen. Frankly my guess. Is that when people writing the sexually controller handbook. They misinterpreted the meaning of eye af slash. I f the correct. Meaning of that is a fixed which serves as both an eye af end and i f but one could misinterpret i f. slash af to mean that. The following applies to a apps and apps in. That's how you interpreted it. You would come up with this. Additional requirement now found in the controller handbook to limit turns at the f. to no more than ninety degrees but only for arnav equipped aircraft which makes absolutely no sense at all. So if anyone from the faa is listening. You might want to resolve this discrepancy coming up nex listener questions are right here on the aviation newstalk. Podcast the l. Let's go listener questions. This one is about how to get the route. That you want comes from patriot supporter. Russ irwin he says. Yesterday i flew from my home. Airport petaluma to watsonville. It was very smoky with marginal via far visibility. But lots of if our planes were flying there were enough airplanes in the air without a dsp. That i wanted to file. Ifrc atc would keep an eye on the primary targets that i couldn't see no matter what i filed or how far east. I tried to force the route including entirely east of the class. Bravo the atc. Computer kept giving me py. Victor twenty-seven showy this is a route which is a good ten to fifteen miles offshore over the ocean. I'm in a piston single. I don't like flying ten. Fifty nautical miles offshore. I filed four t to fifty seven. Which would be. Gps t route which is mostly along the coast and got the same py. Victor twenty-seven showy route i even filed t to fifty seven at eleven thousand feet over the top of the bravo and still got the same route. I considered the following options. And you might wanna think you're listening here to which option you choose. He said option a. was call from the ground and try to negotiate a better route with center. Be pick up the expected route in the air and try to negotiate a better route in the air. He said that's problematic. Because my departures about seven to ten minutes away from entering the bravo not much time with the busy center controller handling commercial flights in sfo or see pick a more easterly location which would force the route to the east then divert in the air. He said i picked c. And file to echoes sixteen. Which is the san martino airport and my clearance was s. gd and picked it up in the air. Atc ignored the clearances me on vectors out toward tracy. In the night diverted to watsonville they ask why i diverted and i said the weather had improved. This wasn't optimal. But it kept me overland it all worked out and i got a reroute in the air to watsonville but seemed like it was too difficult for everyone involved. Busy nor cal control. Basically had to give me a pop-up clearance. I had to do something somewhere on the return. But i'll spare you the details. So what's pilot to do with the atc. Computer insists on route. Which is unacceptable. And what. I got that email from russ. I wasn't really able to sort out. Which of those options would be the best. So i contacted approach there. I was referred to jason bush. Who's an operations supervisor. At cal he replied i like a in this case and review a is call from the ground and trying to negotiate a better route with center. You said we get this pretty often. Departing watsonville monterey salinas for points north west of san francisco. The problem is that the iran computers program to modify certain routes once see certain fixed peres. The pilot can do little to keep the computer from amending his or her original route. This is also done before. Atc sees the flight strip. The strip will however show. Atc the original route right along with the amended route. It may be a little more work ahead of time but if a pilot gets a human in the loop before departure it can usually be quickly once. Atc as a worthy amended. Route is bad for that flight. They can do a couple of things. Send a command. That suppresses the preferential routing at the pilot fly has filed or amend the flight plan. Outright be is my least favorite leaves options which just review was pick up the expected route in the air and try to negotiate a better route in the air continue on. He says correcting a route takes some attention off the scope. If you call airborne you have no idea controller will be in a good position to correct route if you're calling before departure however you're typically dealing with someone who isn't working radarscope in our case that could be a flight data specialist a cic which is a controller in charge or an operations supervisor who can amend the route if you're working with the ground controller or clearance delivery. They're usually on the line with the before mentioned people working the problem if you're calling via phone from a smaller airport you're typically talking to these people directly it's best to call the trae connor center directly rather than go through flight service at least in northern california. So be familiar with those clearance delivery. Phone numbers he finishes at me says see has some problems to we're required to ask for a reason. What an iof are craft changes their destination if we deem those reasons suspicious. More action may be required. Well there you go rusk. Great answer to your question. The by the way is patriots support. Here's another question from another patriots supporter. Joseph smith stewart. He says hi. Max wanted to run a question by you. And he describes a flight that he took To do some practice in some landings and then on the return he was coming through the class charlie and he got terminated when he was in the class still. And here's he says shortly. After i announced that i was near downtown. He terminated flight following squawk via far frequency change approved. At this point. I was still at twenty five hundred feet the class the outer shelf but no longer in communication with markelle approach. I immediately started descent to get below the class. Shirley shelf to fourteen hundred feet. I then contact the mcclellan tower. Let them know. I was inbound for landing. They said no traffic in the area and to contact The l. thirty six. Which is another airport seatac for landing which i acknowledged and switched over question did i need to get below the class. C shelf immediately to remain legal when the controller terminator flight following while i was still in the class charlie and again this is one where i thought You know. I think you're probably fine. But i wanted to get an answer So i shot a note off again to this time to norcal and someone replied. I wouldn't fly any differently. If terminated prior to exiting the charlie. If i was going to naturally exit then reenter however. I'd be sure not to re enter. The charley says i looked at the chart on this one. It appears to me the controller just wanted to give the aircraft time to check in on the c. Taff which pretty much fit with what. I was thinking. If you're in the charlie and you're headed to an airport and the controller terminates you so you can contact that airport. You're probably perfectly fine to be in the charlie and not talking with them any longer. And here's some listener feedback. That just came in episode one sixty five which was about helicopter certification. Max my name is jay. This is response to episode one sixty five. I agree with ninety five percent. Of what steve is saying about the us heading coke industry. But i think it was only accurate. Pre covid what i think. Steve didn't mentioned the huge effects of covid nineteen on those first few jobs for example the messy production in demand in business for example sundowns in vegas with one of the largest companies in. Us says just gonna have business. Also the gulf of mexico oil support businesses been heavily. Hit this demand for oil has been produced by the reduction in the economy also tentatives becoming more suitable so those initial two time jobs not much of an option right now because that flies down to step before which is the fleiss constructors. They can't move on and then leaving the flight. Schools which means hiring instructors is down and the flight schools are not flying so much anyway with the effects of covid which affects a demand for new instructors on top of that the current airline philo ponant layoffs like express jan translate. Gung business will mean. Steve mentioned that some of those heading up the pilots the taken advantage of the rota transition programs and now back to headquarters increasing the pilot pool for those few jobs. Are there so that. I still had go up to jobs out there especially air ambulance and firework. Maybe some time before the demand for those jobs at the bomb the food chain. He struck this topaz on oil and gas really picks up. I'm wrong jay. Thanks so much. Referred back and j used our speak pipe app which i mentioned before if you have anything. You'd like to send the show whether it's feedback a listener question or especially if you'd like to record a fun flying destination. That's an easy way to do it. Just to ajay did go to aviation news. Talk dot com. Click on listener question at the top. And you'll have ninety seconds to record and just a quick reminder. This is a listener supported. Show we've got to easy ways that you can donate one is go to aviation news talk dot com slash pay pal the other aviation news talk dot com slash awesome in the former case. You can make either a one time. Donation or a monthly donation in the latter case. Aviation news talk dot com slash awesome. Takes you to patriotic where you can make a monthly donation and you get all kinds of goodies at the different support levels. And of course everyone who donates gets their name read on the show regardless of what level you might sign up at and finally please tell all of your friends about the aviation is talked podcast. If they don't know what a podcast is. Send them out the apple app store or the google play store for android where they can download our dedicated app for free. Just search either store for aviation canoes talk so until next time fly safely how fun and keep the blue side up.