20 Episode results for "Ted Thompson"

Favre vs. Rogers - Hero To Villain | 5

Sports Wars

31:50 min | 1 year ago

Favre vs. Rogers - Hero To Villain | 5

"It's March six two thousand eight in Green Bay Wisconsin Brett farve, slowly walks into the legends club and the lambofield atrium to make it official. He's hanging it up. It's a fitting place for his retirement the legends club. He's finishing his career. As arguably the most beloved player in Packers history for the last twenty four hours ESPN has turned into the all far of never inside every bar in Wisconsin. Everyone's sharing their personal stories about meeting or coming across far with many of those farve stories taking place in the very bar there in. As far as sits down at a long table. You takes deep breath front of green curtain decorated with the Packers logo about one hundred members of the media have been waiting for his closing words. These wearing a collared shirt and grey jeans much nicer than his usual tire back home in Mississippi. He leans into the silver microphone like we all know why I'm here. First of all sorry, I'm late. But I am officially retiring from the NFL and rain Bay Packers in as much as I thought about what I would say and. How? Promised over and get a motion. He's obviously publicly flirted with retirement for the last six years. He started the Packers last two hundred seventy five games including the playoffs and NFL record. That will probably never be broken two months ago. They fell only one game short of the Super Bowl. But now he's thirty eight and exhausted. It's just time and he's cried retirement before. But this time it feels like the retirement. It's never easy and somewhere. Aaron Rodgers is watching and thinking to himself the QB drama of the past three seasons is finally Mercifully done of giving everything I possibly can give this organization the game football. And I don't think I got anything left to give. Hold on just a minute. I don't think I've got anything left a and play. But I don't think I want to. And that's really what it comes down to. Again. Thank by the end of his weirdly, hedging ten minute press conference. What he's clearly really thinking is what the hell am I doing here? I don't believe any of what I'm saying right now. Now that I hear it out loud. So later that day he flies home to Mississippi with his wife. Deanna back to their four hundred sixty five acre estate for a life surrounded by wild turkeys and deer to ponds in swimming pool. He's going back to another forty fifty years, if he's lucky of all the leisure and creature comforts one man could ever ask for and then it really truly hits him. Ready for retirement? Not yet. From wondering I'm Dan Rubenstein in vis is sports warts. In our last episode. We examined the dynamics of Brett farve an aging legend appearing to hang it up and give way to the up and coming quarterback in Aaron Rodgers only for far too. Not only come back, but to thrive intil he has a backbreaking mistake to end the season just short of making the Super Bowl all the while Rogers sat and sat and sat showed promise when given a brief window, and then again, sat and waited. But now it's officially Aaron Rodgers time in Green Bay. But what does that mean for the always indecisive farve? That's the story of episode five hero to villain. It's spring two thousand eight Green Bay thaws out from its long winter twenty four year old Aaron Rodgers can feel it in the air. Titletown is ready for a new beginning. He's feeling good refreshed. You see it's been a few months since far retirement press conference. Why wouldn't he feel great? We're now well into spring free agency has come and gone draft is in the rear view mirror and Green Bay. We'll finally see what it has an Aaron Rodgers Rogers has the support of both the Packers general manager Ted Thompson and head coach Mike McCarthy as for far he's a part of the Packers pass. Now, it's proud past. And Rogers is relieved twelve days after farts tearful retirement press conference the Packers announced they're gonna retire farve number four jersey during a game in the upcoming season. Make that early in the season, the worry is if they wait too long. He might still come back again. See the team had placed far on what's called the reserve retired list. Really? It's a formality it ensures that if our reconsiders his retirement, which of course, he'd never will write he'd still be a Packer, which means they'd still control his football rights. In other words, he can't fake retirement and then come back to play for a competitor. But after the last couple years of farther will he won't he Rogers can't quite shake the nagging feeling that there's not a neat little bow on farms career just yet. Even as the Packers prepare to hang his jersey next to past greats, like, Vince, Lombardi and Bart. Starr Rogers starts to hear rumors farve agent is putting out feelers to see if the Packers will take him back yet again for Rogers. It's starting to feel like a horror movie where no matter what you throw at him. The bad guy will not die. A few weeks later Rogers is dozing off on his couch at home when he catches farve as a guest on Letterman. He's got to admit under. The TV lights are shirt can be charismatic playing up his southern charm Letterman and the audience are eating up. Now, are you are you you have retired. You have no retired. I ever time retired somebody TV alive. That's just typical Brett BS things Rogers. But whatever he's enjoying the crowd. Then Letterman keeps going told me that the form the retirement form had not been signed and mailed in is is there a retirement form that needs to be signed in Milton. That's what I've heard have you signed it there. There you go Rogers sits up a bit and wonders what the hell is he actually serious right now. Letterman seems interested in even more detail and ask Brett about missing football. We're getting close to minicamps. Start feeling like, you know, what? Not not with minicamps. Okay. Forget many. Did. I say minicamps do here. I think when training camp gets close will. Something's bound to happen. Yeah. What does it mean? Something's bound to happen as as you get close to training camp. Now. Wait a minute. Something's bound to happen. What does that mean? I don't know. Say that you just happen. What hell thinks Rogers who's going to be the quarterback for Green Bay Aaron Rogers. I think is is. The guy I think he'll do. Well, played a little bit. Yeah. When Aaron Rodgers walks into the locker room for off season drills at the end of may he finds farve old locker unchanged from the end of last season. His name plate rates are number four in the shoulder pads right there hanging up Donald driver, the Packers longtime wide receiver and farve. Friend says number four he's not here. But he's here in spirit. He's not dead thinks Rogers, he's probably fishing or hunting or counting his millions. What else do I have to do to show? These guys I'm better than he was that this is my team now. And that I give us a better shot to win than he does. It's like everyone in the world is trying to drum up the soap opera, even the website Packers, news dot com. Says Rogers had his worst practice of the off season in June minicamp, we're talking about mini camp there following his every move looking for flaws. So the new starter agrees to give an interview to Sports Illustrated. For a preseason profile. Everyone is wondering how he's going to step out of the shadow of a legend in typical form Rogers is as confident and defiant as ever Aaron you worried that fans will always compare you too far. I don't feel I need to sell myself to fans they need to get on board or keep their mouths shut. Honestly, it's a gutsy move on Rogers part to say that the fans will only get on board if he wins as in winning the division and going to the Super Bowl because nothing less than that is going to ever shut them up. It's now early June two thousand eight it's a humid day in Mississippi farve gets up early works out Armfield good staying fit. You know, just in case then farve takes us chocolate lab. Sam out for a walk around his vast property. It's now been three months since that press conference and far feels he feel scorned. He's grown pissed off at the Packers for moving on from him. And he wants to stick it to the general manager Ted Thompson Thomson never made the traits that far vast for never bow down to them. Never offered him. Extra perks on top of the ones. He already had where was the special treatment that far felt he deserved. Now. He's got revenge on his mind far now decides he's going to make life very uncomfortable for Thomson in the Packers. That's for Rogers. It'll be fun to be that get one day. So far pulls out his phone and calls up. Peter King sports Illustrated's head NFL writer. Everyone reads Peter King over the years farve and king became friends sometimes met for dinner on the road. Peter. Can I ask you a question off the record one course? Well, what would you think if I came back really are you sure you want to pretty sure? Yeah. Well, I I guess it depends on where you'd be coming back to well preferences to stay in the division. No, the teams my first choice would be Minnesota Chicago king is shocked. Not Green Bay Brennan. If you wanna play somewhere else a few Packers fans will be pissed off. Michigan or Minnesota little kids will tear down there. Brett Farr posters and burn them. It's clear that far wants to make a comeback at this point. And specifically join a hated rival so he can play against the Packers next season. And twist that dagger his agent has already been making off the wreck. Heard calls of his own to their division rivals. The Minnesota Vikings the Packers and Vikings play against each other twice a year without fail. And after a few weeks farve lights the fuse. He's got a contract. He signed with the Packers. That says he's a quote Packer for life. And he needs to work through that. He calls Packers head coach Mike McCarthy. I wanna come back. Mccarthy drops the phone. Oh god. Brag. You're putting us in a tight spot bread playing. Here is not an option. Okay. My I guess I'll see you on the other side line. Then. Mccarthy hangs up incredulous. What does that mean? So to be clear the Packers are now being quasi threatened by arguably their best player ever who has annually made them. Wait by the phone four months throwing yearly wrenches into their ability to run a franchise. And now after he's retired officially he's threatening them because they had the audacity to move on from a retired guy. Just superb far then calls general manager. Ted Thompson farve says he wants to return again Thompson says they prefer if he stays retired. Then the bomb goes off farther agent sends the team a letter asking the Packers to release far from his contract. No strings attached, the GM Thomson the coach and the Packers executives are blown away. Just let our I Kana quarterback. Go play for any team. He wants come on. They tell farve and his agents, absolutely nuts. So far takes the battle to the press. Quote, anonymous, sources close to farve and quote also known as his agent say he feels jilted that the Packers won't let him return far appears on Fox News and treasures up every grievance. He's ever had against general manager, Ted Thompson, there are small pro farve rallies held outside of Lambeau Field, and at the Wisconsin state fair Milwaukee, but the Packers stick to their guns and stick with Rogers finally Brezza legend, but they're tired of his years of holding the team hostage. If are really does want to come back GM Ted Thompson says he can come compete with Rogers for the starting job enough enough. When farve here's that he quote can compete with Rogers for the starting job end quote. His starting job for two hundred seventy five straight games mind. You he blows his top compete for the job. On august. Third two thousand eight the Packers host family night fund. Scrimmage for fans to watch. Aaron Rodgers is warming up on the sideline. He looks around to see fans taking their seats must be at least fifty thousand of them. That's for a meaningless interest squad scrimmage for loyal fans family night. He laughs to himself only in Green Bay. Yes. Some of his teammates find these preseason traditions a little silly. But he's from a small town. He played at a junior college. He gets community matters. But these fans are looking for more than just a nice night out with the family. See that morning read far boarded a plane for Green Bay with his wife. Deanna and his agent he'll be at family night. But not as a player just as a Packer legend go on the field and wave to fans who adored and supported him for all those years, but then midway through the flight the Packers president calls him. I know we told you go on the field. But that's not gonna happen now. Excuse me. You can watch from a luxury box. Coach wants to talk to you after the scrimmage. Yeah. But I'm still a Packer far is furious. But he follows directions when the plane lands far gets off descending onto the tarmac and rainy Green Bay predictably. He's greeted by TV cameras and adoring fans, but it's all premeditated PR ruse by the farve camp. Put more pressure on the Packers Farr of makes his way to the stadium goes in and watches the family night scrimmage from a luxury box high above the field. The quote family night scrimmage is about to kick off Aaron Rodgers is caught in the middle of a storm. Literally, the scrimmage has been delayed for few hours after thunderstorm. Forced the stadium bowl to be evacuated tonight, though Rogers knows nothing would stop the community from coming. No matter the weather, and even though it's being televised. All over the state Packers fans. Don't just stay at home because of a storm especially when there's a new quarterback to see indefinitely not this storm because tonight, they all have the same question on their minds. And Rogers does too is far really coming back. One more time or will the Packers. Finally, cut ties trade him move on. Nobody knows how it's going to end not even Rodgers. And and now it feels like groundhog's day same story different year after three weeks of round the clock media coverage. Rogers is waiting out tonight storm and still doesn't. No if he's competing with farve or the sixteen teams on this season's Packer scheduled. So. Yeah. Make that two storms hitting Green Bay tonight. Aaron Rodgers goes into the family night scrimmage with something to prove. He's taking nothing for granted. It's a scrimmage sure. But with the sheer number of eyeballs on him in Green Bay, there's a lot at stake. It's full pads full-contact it's a football game. And at this point Rogers is about to enter his fourth season in Green Bay, and he almost has his arms around the starting job. He's wanted so badly to be the guy just like he was the guy at Cal where students chanted more more years pleading with him to stay for a senior season. And he didn't the Packers drafted him in two thousand five first round. But he's been playing second fiddle to far ever since going into this fourth year. He's still yet to start a single game. When his name is finally announced here's mostly cheers, the fans get behind him as he leads an early. Touchdown drive. Keep it simple things. But in his next two series. He forces a few incomplete passes, and they go three now them on fourth down during a two minute drill. Throws an interception in the end zone as he walks towards the sideline he takes off his helmet as booze rain down from the stands but wing him during a scrimmage their own quarterback. Then here's something else. Want? Want? Rogers can't believe it. It's crazy the whole situation. Crazy he didn't even play that badly. Plus, it's a scrimmage a practice at this point on the field. Rogers isn't even aware that high above him Packers luxury box. Brett farve is in the building. He's watching all of this unfold. After the scrimmage Rogers, reluctantly meets reporters at his locker. It's the last place. He wants to be it's not the first time I've been booed, and it probably won't be the last time. He tells them if there's a competition between him and fire for the top spot. He thinks they'll be just fine. Nobody around there believes him. Meanwhile, far finally sits down with coach McCarthy after the game. He very clearly heard the crowd chanting his name, and he laces into his former coach there's no way I'm competing against Rogers. I've given sixteen years to this franchise we were thirteen and three last season having earned the right to call time on my career. I really don't think you're in the right state of mind to play for this team. And then McCarthy gets up and walks out. And it finally dawns on farve. He's always played the game like a riverboat gambler. But now he realizes that. The Packers calling his bluff they've told him. He can come back and compete with Rogers for the starting job, but that'll have to take it from Rogers. He's officially retired. And he can't just force his way back onto the team. He's got a play by their rules. It's the next morning August fourth in the Packers brain trust, the GM Thomson team president and a few others wait in the living room of farve. Green Bay home. And wakes. Far keeps them waiting a power move. Far finally walks in wearing a threadbare t shirt shorts. He doesn't offer anyone a drink farm agent is also there joins the group and looks like he hasn't slept in weeks. And no, it's not an easy conversation for anyone so far shoot straight. I'm not to back up Aaron Rodgers here or compete for the job, then far faces general manager Ted Thompson, I wanna go to Minnesota Thomson than shifts uncomfortably in his chair. Look, brad. We have a lot of respect for you. But we have to do what's best for the Green Bay Packers. You playing for Minnesota that won't happen a C. So I'm not good enough to play here. But I'm too good to play there. No one has a good answer for that one. So far plows forward. Well, how about Detroit I could play their Brent no what about Tampa Bay? Now. My first choice. The meeting ends our later without an agreement far Rogers and the whole organization remain in limbo at this. The situation has gotten so ugly that even the NFL Commissioner is stepping in demanding that far and the Packers come to some sort of green. But the Packers hold firm. They don't want farve on the squad. And they don't want implying a division rival after a few days, though, farve starts to come around to the idea of playing for Tampa Bay. Hey, it's closer to Mississippi. But then the New York Jets jump into the fray now Vale consider a trade for far. And then the jets cut a good deal with the Packers offering a draft pick for the agent quarterback. But that's not the end per his contract. Farve needs to agree to the move and farve is in love with the idea. His wife. Deanna even calls a Packers director and pleads with him to not trade Brett to the jets. She has zero desire to move to New York and things Brett will be a fish out of water. They're they're small town people not big city types, the GM of the jets, Mike Tannenbaum. Senses the hesitation and makes a call to farve it quickly shifts to a topic. The jets GM didn't quite predict. Hey, mike. What's the dress code when we travel? What do you want it to be? Well, I don't like were in coats and ties way. You Brett thirty eight you tell me you're coming, and I'll have a custom made pair of size thirty eight camouflage hunting pants that I'm gonna make mandatory on every one of our way trips. And with that the deal is done. He's no big city type, but these headed there anyway, Aaron Rodgers meanwhile is finally taking over in Green Bay five months earlier far road out of Green Bay, Wisconsin. As a hero now, he's on his way to becoming a big city villain. It's Monday night September eighth two thousand eight inside the bowels of lambofield about an hour before kick-off Aaron Rodgers sits quietly at his locker. It's the season opener one of his teammates leans over to him. It's finally here. Rogers knows what he means. Twenty four years old. He's about to become the new Packers starting quarterback Brett farve with the jets. Now. Thank god. The jets won their first game yesterday. But whatever thinks Rogers the man standing in his way for literal years is finally gone. And Rogers hasn't exactly been welcomed with open arms since farve left three weeks ago. Angry letters have arrived at the stadium specifically addressed to him. He's found anonymous notes that his locker room from few teammates telling him it's still Brett's team. Cool. Thanks, but he's also, obviously relieved relieved farve gone relieved. He'll finally get to prove a point to the Packers fans wearing New York. Jets far t-shirts out in the parking lot to the fans out there waving farve signs to the stadium. Shop still selling jerseys. Farve pens farve, bobbleheads far books. Farve DVD's back in the locker room. Rodgers can feel the nerves his. Butterflies are real. It's a Monday night football game against the Vikings. The hated division rival it's on national TV. Plus, here's it's going to be the largest regular season crowd in lambo history who wouldn't want to watch this leaving the locker room Rogers, walks out of the double steel doors hangs left and trots by a huge life-size photo of far from his regular season debut in nineteen ninety two with the headline new beginning. Well, he thinks tonight's I knew new beginning. So as he waits in the tunnel to run out with his teammates. He feels a surge of electrically unlike anything he's ever experienced before. ESPN welcomes you to the following presentation of the National Football League. Overcast skies lights on here. The early evening at Lambeau Field in Green Bay our set to go. It's the first game of the season. And the first quarter is sloppy. Rogers, isn't like far doesn't take unnecessary chances to shake things up. He stays disciplined and they keep the game close. They trail three nothing in the second quarter. Then the Packers get the ball after Vikings field goal on the first play of the drive Rogers launches a bomb to Greg Jennings for fifty six yards Aaron Rodgers under center takes the handoff. Like right now. Rainbow down the middle doing. Then with third and goal on the one yard line. Rogers shows his ability to make a big play once again as he's falling backwards with defender, wrapped around his leg. He slings the ball past three other defenders into the hands of fullback, Cory hall. Touchdown packers. That night Rogers throws only four incompletions the actually runs the ball rushing for thirty six yards. Something farve couldn't dream of doing at his age and late in the game. With the Packers up five Rogers ICES the victory with a quarterback sneak into the end zone for another touchdown. Runs towards the back of the end zone and leaps into the green and gold crowd. His first famed Lambeau leap. The hallowed tradition of throwing yourself into the stands after you reach the end zone entitled he's been reading this moment for years. But with all the excitement, he just how reaches the fans who help him finish the jump and pull him into celebrate. All right. Thanks. I'd might need more practice at that. On the other side of the country far his also having a ball and proving that well he was right? He wasn't done yet through his first four games and the jets green and white. He throws twelve touchdowns fest in the league. And that includes six in one of those games. The jets start to into an after their by week. Barb becomes the new king of New York. On the field. He's all action all energy away from the games, though. He loafs through practices goofs off in meetings and in the locker room he really rarely mingles with his teammates, but he's thirty nine. Now. He knows what it takes to win games. Which is something you can't really say about the jets organization in a great unexpected way. Farve looseness carries over to the rest of the young squad. They rip off six wins out of their next seven. They knock off the patriots the reigning Super Bowl champs in thrilling overtime game mind. You the jets almost never beat the patriots. So after breezing past the undefeated, Tennessee, titans farve jets are now eight and three and football's hottest team. He's got a real thing going in New York, but he can't help himself occasionally he checks on Rodgers and the Packers Scott admit, though, kid's got talent. And kinda stinks. In Green Bay Rogers is putting up some pretty big numbers. But the Packers record isn't as good as the jets this year. So even with his old backup looking pretty good farve, does take some pleasure in the fact that he's missed in Green Bay the newspapers in Wisconsin are filled with articles. Lamenting the fact that the Packers could have been in the jets position. If far had just stayed in Green Bay. But after getting two eight and three the jets lose their next game. And then the one after that one of the main reasons farve playing hurt and it's clear to everyone. So in the last two games of the season with their playoff hopes in the balance far plays miserably, his heart's clearly already. Elsewhere the jets again, the same old jets lose both and miss out on the playoffs as for far he finishes the season with twenty two touchdowns and twenty two interceptions. Rogers on the other hand ends the season with a clearly better stat line. He throws twenty eight touchdowns to just thirteen interceptions. Now, the Packers have an uneven season themselves and finished six and ten but quarterback is not the issue in fewer fans than ever are chanting for far. So Rogers finally has the starting job on lock and his even winning over the adoration of fans looking ahead Rogers things to. Two thousand nine will be the year of his new beginning. But there's a thing. Farther still active. He's still playing and they're still one more chapter left to one fold in their rivalry. That's on the next and final episode of far verse Rogers. In our next episode. Just when it looks like farve has cleared the way for Rogers their rivalry gets even more personal from wondering, this is sports wars far. Verse Rogers, episode, five new episodes of sports wars, come out every Wednesday and Friday, please subscribe on apple podcasts Spotify Pandora or ever. You. Listen to podcasts, you'll find a link to subscribe on the episode notes, simply tapper swipe over the cover art. You'll also see some offers from our sponsors. Please support our show by supporting them. If you like what you've heard we'd love for you to give us a five star rating and tell your friends how to subscribe another way to support us is to answer a short survey at wondering dot com slash serving. And a quick note about the conversations you've been hearing. We can't know exactly what was said. But this dialogue is based on our best research, and we use many sources for our stories one. We found especially helpful for this episode was Jeff Perlman's gunslinger the remarkable. Improbable conic life of Brett Farr. I'm your host. Dan, Rubenstein Ryan Goldberg wrote this story produced by your own discolor and gave Goodwin with Matt for sound design. By spoke media are executive producers are Stephanie jen's marshal Louis and our non Lopez for wondering.

Green Bay Packers Aaron Rodgers Rogers Brett farve Aaron Rodgers Green Bay Rogers jets National Football League football Wisconsin Green Bay Rogers Mississippi general manager Green Bay rain Bay Packers Ted Thompson Mike McCarthy Deanna Starr Rogers
Favre vs. Rodgers - Good Morning, Grandpa | 1

Sports Wars

28:21 min | 1 year ago

Favre vs. Rodgers - Good Morning, Grandpa | 1

"It's the morning of June. Second two thousand five and the Green Bay Packers cafeteria teammates who haven't seen each other all spring are cracking jokes and telling stories about their off-season vacations. It's like the first day of school only the kids are three hundred pound men and school is Lambeau Field. The Packers longtime home the returning Packers won their division but lost in the playoffs. Last season for this team. Winning the division has become second nature. The main reason they're icon at quarterback Brett farve. He's been the leader of this team for thirteen seasons. Starting two hundred twenty five straight games. Let that sink in for a second as the NFL's clear iron, man. He's played through injury and illness each year, he's also thirty five at least two years older than all. But one other guy on the squad and closer. In age to some of the coaches than some of his teammates today. Brett farve, sits alone at the far. And of the cafeteria reading the local paper some grace. Stubble covers his strong jaw loose fitting blend of Cam and cargo shorts make up his wardrobe. He's well, he's weathered. He's definitely not giving off a stop by for some small kind of vibe. So nobody really notices when the rookie Aaron Rodgers walks into the cafeteria if Rogers has any butterflies, the dark-haired twenty one year old isn't showing it. He feels confident for a reason he's a big deal rookie quarterback from California a couple months ago. The Packers took him in the first round of the NFL draft a big deal because you don't waste a first round pick on guy. You don't expect to play. Rogers has never seen farve in person. He hasn't even heard from him since the draft, which is a little surprising. The rookie wasn't expect. To instantly become the legends best friend, but he figured a quick. Hey, kid. Welcome to the big time sort of call might have come this spring. Nope Rogers, once again, the new guy walks the length of the room towards far to make the overdue introduction for a moment. He pauses tries to figure out the quote right way to play come on. This is Brent freaking far it feels surreal to meet a living legend who does what you do. This is Eddie Murphy meeting, Richard Pryor, Eminem meeting, Dr dre. He's been a fan for years. And now he's supposed to be a teammate. It's awesome. But also, we're so yeah, the rookie QB's a little nervous. But there's no way he's going to show. It can't be a punk on day one. He's gotta be himself show. He's not intimidated show. He's already one of the guys. So Rogers makes eye contact and says in a booming jovial tone. Good morning grandpa. Yeah. So the moment the words leave his mouth Rogers noses attempt at humor doesn't go over. Well. And so does everyone else around even farve is at a loss for words. He's not sure if he should laugh it off or just knock him out grandpa in his sleep. He could outdo this kid from Berkeley and grandpa, hell, he's forgotten more football games. And this kid is even played grandpa. Sorry Brett farve who had been slowly flipping his way through the local paper just a minute ago. Could suddenly feel that old competitive fire burning again, usually he saves that for the other team, but he is a new challenge. Now make that a new challenger and the guy who's challenging him that guys wearing the same uniform. He is. If you're looking to build a website, but you've been putting it off. Maybe you don't know where to start or think it's going to be outrageously expensive. It's time. You got to know wicks dot com with wicks you can create a stunning professional website, all by yourself. Just ask the over one hundred and forty million people who've already done it, you can build your website from scratch or choose from over five hundred templates that are built to look beautiful and intuitive to us from there. It's quick and easy to change customize or add anything you want. Plus everything is optimized for desktop and mobile, so you look great on any device. Build a website of your own with wicks today for free. And if you go to wicks dot com and use the coupon code sports wars. You'll get ten percent off any premium plan with wicks premium plans, you get more storage free domain for a year and much much more. That's w I x dot com code s. SP ORT S W A R S for ten percent off any premium plan. From wondering, I'm Dan Rubenstein. And this is sports wars. In our new series. We'll be exploring some of the most iconic and fascinating rivalries in sports history between south the greatest players and teams of all time like the fiery on and off court battles of Michael Jordan is a Thomas the decades long tennis battle between Roger Federer and Rafael Nidal, and the rivalry that evolved as Alex Rodriguez and Derek Jeter for forced to coexist in the Big Apple we take you inside the locker room and onto the field to see how fierce competition can bring out a player's best. And worst, I've covered sports for a number of years at places like Sports Illustrated, Espy nation and something that I've learned is that it's easy for any nerdy sports fan to pick a side of an argument, but it's much more interesting to dig deeper to try and reexamine a rivalry with the benefit of time. This is our first six part series on sports wars. It's a story of old school versus new school. Brett farr. Verse Aaron Rodgers. It was the mid two thousand if you're an NFL fan and not listening to who stank on Zun tucked into your low rise jeans. There's a good chance you're paying attention to what was happening or really not happening with the quarterbacks plural in Green Bay would appear to be a team preparing for their future without an aging legend turned into an uncomfortable, Cold War and rivalry Aaron Rodgers the up and comer from California who played things by the book was drafted to replace a grain Brett farve, a wildcard future hall of Famer who liked to do things his way and only his way which meant Green Bay had a pretty big problem on their hands. Let the beloved veteran keep doing his thing or move on from the old guy before it goes downhill and see what you have in your young. Upstart this episode one good morning grandpa. All right. Let's go back to April twenty third two thousand five it's almost noon at the Jacob Javits center on the west side of Manhattan and the annual NFL draft is about to begin. There are thousands of fans here dressed in their favorite teams jerseys. And in some cases, they're even more excited about today than anything. They saw on the field last season. That's because the draft is about hope it's about potential sure your team stunk last year, but you've got a top pick this year. And if they pick the right guy today, your Sundays could be blessed for years to come. Obviously, this is about more than pleasing just the most passionate fans this room is the focus for executives and coaches from all thirty two NFL teams their careers. Depend on picking and developing the right guys in short. Don't screw it up. Today. He'll be looking for a new job this time next year. So in the green room behind the draft stage, the country's best college football players slide into cushioned seats surrounded by their families and soon to be minted agents at one of the tables close to the wall sits Twenty-one year old Aaron Rodgers wearing a Chris blue. Pinstripe suit and confidence smile, he leans over to talk to his agent. We're still thinking number one. Right. It's either you or Alex Smith. My money's on you. You got the arm. You've got the look you've got the hometown kid thing going on. It's an easy choice while they want some guy from Utah when they can have the local legend Rogers tips back in his chair satisfied he thinks so too for the last few months of two thousand five Rogers has been analyzed and critiqued more than the latest ipod release after two seasons at Cal. He decided to skip his senior year and enter the draft experts. Now see him as one of the top two quarterbacks in the draft. And there's one team that desperately needs a QB the San Francisco forty Niners. It's obvious. They've gone from dominant with Joe Montana and Steve Young quarterback in the eighties nineties to the littoral worst by two thousand five they need a cornerstone QB things won't change. So Rogers is sure he'll be a forty Niner which would be his dream. He said. Records at Cal just across the bay from the Niner stadium Candlestick Park. He's been a lifelong Niners fan Rogers has dreamed of playing for them since he was an infant now. He's holding his breath and his flip phone hoping to feel a buzz the first selection and the two thousand five NFL draft belongs to the San Francisco forty Niners who are now on the clock. But as ESPN's Chris Berman and the gang of experts the big TV desk talk about the pick the phone still isn't ringing. That's weird because the Niners seemed to imply that Aaron was their guy was this flip phone even working maybe extended the Tanna just a little bit and case. With the first selection in the two thousand five NFL draft the San Francisco forty Niners select Alex Smith quarterback Utah. Alex smith. Rogers can't help but roll his eyes a little and the cameras catch it. It's clear he thinks the forty Niners made a mistake. It should be him smiling on stage right now holding up that number one forty Niners jersey, and then he sighs visibly disappointed. Anyone watching conc- all over his face. But he's got other chances. His phone will ring before long, right? The draft moves on and over the course of the next hour. Three more teams pass on Rogers. He's not shot. They already had cubeys Tampa Bay needs. A quarterback may have the fifth pick their head coach watch Rogers practice just a few weeks ago and loved him loved him. And the bucks opt for a running back auburn's Cadillac Williams. Strolls across the stage with a smile on his face Rogers can't believe it and it shows ESPN's cameras hover around him like mosquitoes. Hoping to suck a little more emotion out of him for the millions and millions watching at home where ask you guys where does earn Rogers get fit. We don't in this particular. I one team after another picks running backs linebackers wide receivers. But no quarterbacks and not Rogers earlier there were five other prospects in the green room with him. Now, it's just him and one other guy, but the cameras are now all locked on Rogers as if to ask what the heck must be thinking. At least it seems that way especially when ESPN Suzy kolber makes I contact and quickly motions to our cameraman for a tight shot of Rogers a couple of weeks ago. I knew the clear cut number one. What's chain? That time. I wish I could tell you Rogers forces a smile, but inside he is dying of embarrassment and questioning everything. His phone buzzes. Maybe this is it a coach from one of the teams about to pick. But no, it's just his friends from back home cracking jokes. But he doesn't laugh he tells them. Yeah. It's not real funny. When you're the last one in the green room, so now three hours pass and as the picks move by number five number nine number eleven number fifteen Rogers is in free phone. Every time. Another name is called out the cameras single in on him, and his parents and his brother Rogers trying his best to look both hopeful and unaffected like he's playing it cool at the three hour, Mark Rogers looks absolutely shellshocked. Keep it together. He tells himself keep smiling. All the while a thousand miles away in Green Bay, Wisconsin Packers general manager, Ted Thompson can't believe what he's seeing sitting inside the war room at Lambeau Field where the teams draft decisions are finalized. He's stunned sixteen picks in and no one has scooped up v. Most promising quarterback in the draft when the day started Thompson assume there was no way Rogers would be available by the time. It was their turn. They had the twenty four th pick for Christ's sake as the Commissioner announces the eighteenth pick. Ted Thompson starts getting really excited only six picks to go. He then motions to his boss. The Packers president that he needs a word with him. If Rogers still there I'm going to take he's the top guy on our board. I never thought we'd get them. And very sits the only downside. We've still got farve. Ted. What is your gut say to catch some heat because Brett's playing so well, and people are going to say you have so many needs and other positions. Why are you going to take a guy who's gonna just sit on the bench? Ted Brett is thirty five. It's your club. You do what you wanna do and make the choice. You wanna make? We'll stand by. And yes, it's Thompsons job to build a team not just for today. But for coming day when he knows far won't be the guy and he knows quarterback like Rogers falls into your lap. Maybe once in a career they've returned to the draft war rejoining the coaches waiting on his decision now. It's a waiting game sixteen still pick in front of them and any other quarterback hungry tame contrite up take Rogers right out from under them another hour passes. And Roger still hasn't budged excited. Thompson stands up tells the coaches your he's going to take Rogers. There's definitely some rumbling in the room. And it comes from the coaches Thompson knows what's on their mind. We've got Brett farve Brett farve. The most durable quarterback in football. We really going to do this. We're gonna take a player that can help us this year. Maybe not next year. Maybe not the air after help. Maybe never. Trust the board Thompson reminds himself. Get the best player available. Back at the Javits center. New York Roger stares at the broadcast scream trying to maintain his poker face. And then finally his cell phone rings. It's Ted Thompson the GM of Green Bay. How do you feel about comedy Green Bay? Almost five hours have passed since the draft began Green Bay is a lot colder than San Francisco. But at least the guys in Green Bay want him. Okay. This is good. He can take time learning the robes with one of the best franchises in the league. And from one of the best quarterbacks ever Brent far. The man is a living legend Rogers X hails deeply his public. Misery is finally over with the twenty fourth selection in the two thousand five NFL draft. Green Bay Packers select Aaron Rodgers. So it's number twenty four not number one. But still in the first round. So he gets up before Rogers reaches the stage Merton Hanks, grabs him Hanks's retired all pro defensive back now works for the league fifteen years earlier on a night, just like this. It was predicted. He would be a first rounder. Instead, he dropped all the way down to the fifth round before being selected, and he became an all pro. Anyway, he whispers to Rogers play my whole career with chip on my shoulder should do the same. For Aaron Rodgers draft day will be a defining moment. The day two thirds of the league passed on him enough to give him his own chip. And it'll come in handy for his next challenge. Winning the starting quarterback job in Green Bay. Robin Hood is an investing app that lets you buy and sell stocks ETF's options in cryptos all commission free. While other brokerages charge up to ten dollars for every trade, Robin Hood doesn't charge any commission fees. So you can trade stocks and keep all of your profits. Plus, there's no account minimum deposit needed to get started. So you can start investing at any level. The simple intuitive design of robinhood makes investing easy for newcomers. Experts alike view, easy to understand charts and market data and place a trade and just four taps on your smartphone. You can also view stock collections such as one hundred most popular with Robin Hood, you can learn how to invest in the market as you build your portfolio. Discover new stocks track your favorite companies and get custom notifications for price movements. So you never miss the right moment to invest Robin Hood is giving listeners of sports wars a free stock like apple Ford or sprint to help. Build your portfolio side. Lineup at sports, wars dot, Robin, Hood dot com. It's now July twenty six two thousand five two months after Aaron Rodgers botched his first meeting with his idol by calling him grandpa. When Rogers finally shows up in Green Bay that summer far hasn't exactly thrown him, a welcoming party, the rookie can't help. But notice farve hasn't invited him out for a drink or bottom meal at Brett farve steakhouse Rogers hears whispers that it used to be different with farve. He used to get drinks eat dinners, go hunting and pull some pranks with his backups. Okay. So this sounds kind of dumb because we're talking about grownups, but pranks are a thing in professional sports cars get filled with popcorn cleats. Wilding? Warn are set on fire guys will get a shaving cream pie to the face while being interviewed post game. And it goes on and on these guys spent so much time with each other all year long that they need to figure out new weird ways to have fun to beat the boredom. So yeah, weirdly, not unusual one of those backups. Matt Hasselbeck even had the guts to put worms and fives chewing tobacco and far thought. It was hilarious. But too far Rogers is different. The rookie doesn't seem like a summer. Intern learning on the job to eventually go play somewhere else. All the talk around Rogers is he's the next franchise QB, and that makes things different. Also, something about Rogers seems almost robotic too far all head and analysis. No, heart farve on the other hand won a Super Bowl and VP trophies with nothing, but his heart and his arm. He's called a gunslinger for a reason. He's improvisational. He goes with his gut shirt. There's a play drawn. But they'll figure it out on the fly. He's famous for what coaches call the. No, no, yes. Play the type of plays that only look good when they end in touchdowns. Which often do? For now, the head coach makes it very clear. The Packers are farve team. But for how long at training camp. The Packers beat reporters want to spin up. The story of the veteran taking the parent under his wing and mentoring him they asked about it. And he gives them quote, but it's not the one they were hoping for contract doesn't say Africa there and Rogers rate apply now, hopefully watches million and get something from that rough, of course, winning cures everything. So when the season starts in September, the Packers won't have to worry about tension between Rogers and farve if they can just get hot. Yeah. Foam. Julia arena, rain Green Bay Wisconsin in their season opener though far throws to interceptions and their best wide receiver. Giovane? Walker leaves the game with a terrible season ending injury. They lose to the always miserable Detroit Lions seventeen to three the following week. They lose to the league's other laughing stock the Cleveland Browns soon their own four halfway through the season. They're one and seven. At this point Sundays have become a grind for these Packers. It's hard to play through pain. When you never win the injuries are stacking up. And yes, far keeps his consecutive game streak going, but the seasons awash really the only bright spot to the Packers two thousand five season is that they're so bad Aaron Rodgers mega chance to play in those meaningless games at the end of the season. Sure. He'd rather the team win while sitting behind farve. But if a one in seven start to the season means he gets to play a little bit. They'll take it. But for now Rogers job as the backup is to run. The scouting a squad whose job it is to mimic the Packers next opponent for the benefit of the stars. The defenders expect a slow pace from the scout team. So they can learn and practice standard operating procedure with NFL backups Barajas has another goal beyond giving his teammates. A look at next week's offense. He wants to impress the coach. So lets it fly. He throws deep balls. No look passes when the whistle blows. Stop play finishes it. Anyway, when his scout team scores he pulls out choreographed celebrations. He spikes the ball rolls imaginary dice he really goes for it and predictably those antics. Don't go over well with the older players come on rock act. Like you've been there before they tell him complaints about Rogers behavior reach the coaches and work comes down from up top the order ease up, but the other young players they like Roger swagger, they can sense a changing the guard. They want to be a part of it. Meanwhile, far isn't ready to let go anytime soon. He'll keep doing what made him an MVP and champion with this team which is sticking with the teammates. No how to get open on the field and keep quiet away from hell he doesn't even remember the names of some of the newcomers thirty six now, he's not trying to learn them two factions form in the locker room team far verse team Rogers MacQuarie back division. Never bodes well. For teams morale. Fast forward to the end of his rookie season Rogers officially and farms crosshairs it plays itself out in pranks, not punches but farther intent is clear put Rogers in his place far may not be winning games. But he's winning in the locker room and showing the rookie who's boss. Now in the final month of the season. The Packers are slated to play. The also struggling ravens in freezing Baltimore on Monday night football, a matchup. Nobody beyond diehards cares. From the beginning. The Packers looked like they want to be anywhere else like a woolly mammoth struggling in tarp. It far is a terrible combination of lost and desperate failing to figure out. The ravens defense the harder. He tries to fight forward and throw into passing lanes. At are. They're the worst seems to get by the end of the quarter. The ravens are ahead fourteen to three and it only gets uglier from there for five in Green Bay in the second quarter farve throws desperately into triple coverage. Three ravens defenders are draped over his intended target. It's the type of past practically screams. I'm going deep. I don't care. What happens take me out? If you don't like it. It's at this point that Rogers peaks over at the coaches wondering if maybe they wanna give the old guy break, and let them take over which is just what they do after three quarters with two interceptions and only fourteen completed passes, the coaches decide to take mercy on far it's just not his night as for far he doesn't mind getting out of the cold a game. The team has no hope of winning let the rookie freeze. So now in the final quarter. Rodgers has given the go-ahead. It's only his second appearance of the season in on his first play. The ravens dailies Thomas crushes Rogers enforces a fumble later ravens linebacker, Terrell. Suggs gets a piece of him with another sack with thirty seconds left. They continued to show the rookie. No mercy. Another sack fumble this one returned for a touchdown. And it's a fishery beatdown. The ravens win forty eight to three it's the biggest blowout ever on Monday night football. And Brett farve is leading Aaron Rodgers own. It. As Rogers runs in from the field. Farve doesn't even look at him much less. Give him advice or even criticism is Rogers surprise, not really. This guy has been an asshole the entire time has been in Green Bay the Packers. Then finished the season with a dismal record of four and twelve it's their worst record since nineteen ninety one the season before Brett farve arrived in Green Bay. This would typically be when a team with an agent quarterback would start rebuilding or at least being reimagined. Big changes always start with two key people coach and quarterback and like clockwork. There are rumors that the head coach is as good as fire as far reporters are no longer afraid to ask is the icon done is it time. He retires farthest not saying just yet. He's thirty six just led the league in interceptions and posted the first losing season of his entire career. No. Yeah. There's this kid named Aaron Rodgers dying to take over the tyrant. Suddenly makes a lot of sense. So is this the year he walks away? If you think so then you don't know the first thing about Brett Lorenzo far. On the next episode. Brett farve returns to form and returns. The Packers to the summit of football all taking on the NFL's nasty fences and his own demons help you enjoyed the episode police subscribe on apple podcasts. Spotify Google podcast, Stitcher. I heart radio or wherever you listen to podcasts. You'll find a link on the episode notes, simply tap or swipe over the cover art. You'll also notice some offers from our sponsors, please support our show by supporting them. Also, if you like what you've heard love you to give us a five star rating. Tell your friends how to subscribe another way to support us stance are short survey at wonder dot com slash survey. That's w o n d e r y dot com slash survey. And a quick note about the conversations you've been hearing. We can't know exactly what was said. But this dialogue is based on our best research. We use many sources for our stories ones we found especially helpful for this episode were gunslinger, the New York Times. Bestseller by Jeff Pearlman, as well as the work of a claimed NFL reporters like rob democracy, and Gregg Bishop, I'm your host, Dan Rubenstein Ryan Goldberg wrote this story produced by your own discoloured and gape Goodwin with Matt Ford sound design by sound snipers are executive producers are Stephanie jen's marshal Louis and air non Lopez for one.

Mark Rogers Brett farve Green Bay Packers Aaron Rodgers NFL Green Bay Roger football San Francisco Green Bay Wisconsin Ted Thompson Lambeau Field Alex Smith Rogers MacQuarie Brent ravens California Tampa Bay Brett farr Cal
All 32 - Green Bay Packers: Dissecting the Jordan Love pick and Aaron Rodgers future with Aaron Nagler (Football 6/11)

Pick Six NFL Podcast

21:07 min | Last month

All 32 - Green Bay Packers: Dissecting the Jordan Love pick and Aaron Rodgers future with Aaron Nagler (Football 6/11)

"The. What's. From the six podcast your sports daily, NFL podcasts Brinson your host. It's Thursday shooting eleven second time we. podcast of the Gillette because we're doing the all thirty two craftily named by producer. We went through all thirty two NFL teams and we were chatting packers with good for negligence aired. What's up? Buddy now? Much will thanks love for having me honored to be here talking packers with you on the all thirty two, so these on the all thirty two. We have today on June eleventh. We have both the Vikings in the packers. I can't believe it's June eleventh. I can't believe we're look almost a mid June to. Camp before you know, it's crazy. Well, knock on wood. We get training camp I mean I'm I'm proceeding with hope will nothing but hope right in front of me so I. I like to things with a backup plan, which seems to be with the packers did this offseason? Thank you thank you professional. So I was excited to have you on. Because now you've been on this program I think he'd be on the show a couple of times right at least at least once or twice. We're good pals. We've hung out in real life. We have wasted the combine. And you've have been a persistent tweeter. Of Me get rope. Packers Propaganda Which? Somewhat sitting somewhere. I there are not many people out there. Who defended the Jordan? Love pick as well as the Jila pick. You did it so I would say I would ask you this why? Here's the thing it's not so much a defense of the picks right just trying to acknowledge the fact that we have no idea we have zero clue. Fix are GONNA work out. I understand that the draft industrial complex works itself up into a lather when teams go against the grain or don't do what is expected. Fans especially spend months consuming this content and finding these names and creating their lists etcetera, and then when teens especially the packers do something that flies in the face of that people get all up in arms. The grades come out and be able to fail their draft and Blah Blah, blah, and all I want is a little acknowledgment that look. We all know draft. Grades aren't worth the pixels of printed with. Let's let things play out and see how things develop, and maybe the reasoning behind the Jordan love, pick and the AG Dillon. Beck and whoever knows whatever? Maybe they had some reasonings. Maybe let's watch and see how they develop. See how the team actually utilizes that talent. Maybe, they have a plan I don't know. Call Me Crazy I. Know it's No. Backers, of one a boatload of gains, it's not like they're just like sitting back like flying blind. And I would say to that and I tried to do this. throughout throughout the process of discussing because it's easy, right, it is easy to sit back and just a hot. In this draft, which is a deep draft and a good first round with a lot of wide receivers. Talent no de like. A lot of times in over the past three or four years, just because for whatever reason college classes have been a little bit deeper. It's hard to find. Everybody has to find a winner loser. Everybody's a bad grade. It's hard to find losers in the deep draft and the packers and Aaron. Rodgers were an easy. Cherry pick for easy target, and especially when look. You know the narrative that's out there now about running backs when you talk about the value of the position, and then the packers turn around and pick a bigger running back in the second round. You knew the Internet was going to have a field day with that You know it's this whole idea of what's really odd about that. Pick to me. This is where I'm on board with kind of scratching my head, because if you look at the packers, mo whether it's with. Ted Thompson or whoever's been in charge, basically, their personnel group as a whole has seen to operate in that regard meaning. They picked up a bunch. They pick three backs in a row a couple years ago and they obviously found Gemini Aaron Jones on a really productive Guy Jamaal Williams. You go back to when Ted. Thompson was in charge, and when they didn't make the trade for Marshawn Lynch, what they did do that. Year was turnaround and snag somebody off of Atlanta's practice squad. That's been traditionally their approach to that position so to see them turn around and then use a premium. Pick on running back a yeah. I got to admit. I was surprised, but then again they love that player. They wanted to make sure he was on their team. They certainly did that, so let me ask you this if AJ Dylan. I think here's the thing that worked against the packers as well. Is that where they were in the first round? They missed out on a run of wide receivers like A. Bunch more wide receivers went the first round, and they thought that they would I mean Jalen. Reagan goes earlier than people probably thought to to the eagles then. The Vikings grabbed Justin Jefferson then it goes to the forty niners, and all the sudden, who by the way traded up to make sure they got I got all sudden. If you're if you're the packers, you're like okay if we don't love t higgins and Michael Pittman. We don't WanNa take a a wide receiver with a first-round pick, but Here's. You have to think they had the plan had to be going into this trap that they were going to get Jordan love. There's no way they're sitting there at thirty was. Up they use a with round pick to go up and get him, it's clear that that was the plan I mean that's that's why. I again tried to play Devil's devil's advocate if you will. At my house. In since it's sort of like the Aaron Rodgers, staying in the sense that. Hey look. We haven't we have a hall of fame quarterback on the roster? Thirty five years old play a great MVP. Cal Football and we drafted somebody the I. What are we doing at the same time? It's not like the Aaron Rodgers thing because Aaron, rodgers could have been the first overall pick, it was between him and Alex. PUSHBACK you've heard. In the unexpected fall and I agree with you like the plan couldn't have been. Oh, if Jordan Roger Jordan Jordan Jordan. Of course at the Rogers. Falls far and then you're like Oh, my God I can't believe he's there. He's there twenty six is like he was always going to be there twenty six. Most Likely I. Think that in their evaluation now I could be wrong. It could be right. We'll find out. That's the joy of this, and that's what is going to make it so difficult for the next couple of years. Because you know, they're not going to force them out of the field they don't need to. They've got into Rogers locked up for another three or four years, so we're going to have to sit here and wait and watch the little snippets of training camp preseason action, etc.. But you look at his athletic upside. You look at his ceiling. I understand it I get you special at that two thousand eighteen tape and you. Kid He has some incredible incredible stuff on tape now. He goes if he comes out of. This point a couple of months, but like if he. If if you took his two thousand, eighteen to twenty, one, thousand, nine hundred. And Joe Boroughs. Two, thousand, eighteen and twenty, nineteen and Flip Botha lift Amal. Boroughs like if boroughs like winter title in two thousand eighteen, and then lays an egg and twenty nine hundred like Whoa Whoa I. Didn't follow that up with that. Whereas if logged takes a step from this year to twenty-eight, this kid, this kid can be the first overall pick I mean like that, and that's another thing too is there's so many kind of external things that he couldn't control in two thousand. Thousand Nineteen I mean obviously the turnovers on way up, but he lost a ton of his supporting cast had a new coaching staff. Those are all factors you know. Those are all things that the coaching staff and especially the personnel group. We're going to look at again. In their determination, they see a really talented kid who could turn into something special, and that's why they felt it necessary to go get him. Again, they could be wrong. They could be right, but it's clear that that is the plan that he is the guy I mean. Ron woolfe had far ted Thompson Rogers Brian Goudie has laid. His claim planted his flag on Jordan love and look again it's. Hypocritical thing. Backers Idiots. It's like listen every time. Somebody doesn't have a transition at quarterback. They called an idiot. So there's a thing because it's the worst time to look for a quarterback. We don't have one right. Yeah I, mean absolutely is the problem. Then the counter to that is why do they give? Aaron Rodgers to contract and I think that's sort of that sort of the question like if. You. Love option. You're trying to decide if you want to sign him. You WANNA move. That's that is a the face of the modern NFL. In the sense of we've seen a lot of team new teams we've seen several teams have success building a BA- roster around a rookie quarterback contract right and that's that's kind of the new way. and the packers certainly don't seem to be in a position to take advantage of that. If they're going to be setting love for at least two years now, there are all sorts of new fangled ways they can work. Basically jettisoned Rogers out after one year. If they want Sir I don't think that's going to happen. I think he's there for at least two more years. But I hear you on the contract. The only thing I would say is. It's the thing that never gets talked about when it comes to that. Extension Nolan mentions the fact that Rogers when they signed him to that extension, he was heading into a year where the rest of his. Past contract had zero guaranteed money in it left. He was gonNA take the basically take the field that year with zero guarantee Dan and how do you think that sits with a hall of fame? quarterback I just never you know, and that's the thing I just don't. There was no no rumblings of it. Nothing reported, but I have to think that if pushed had come to shove, Aaron may not throwing a stink, but. Things could have gotten dicey between him and the packers so especially for a guy who played way below market value for a number of years. I remember. Years past when Mark Sanchez was making more than Aaron Rodgers, you know. Let's say that out loud. He he did, and he did that for years so I think that. By the way the credit that Tom Brady. All the time exactly yeah, so I think the the franchise. Probably moved, you know in deference to what he had done. The fact that there were so many people in that building who have jobs because of him? I think they did. Make a little bit of the Cardinal Sin where you pay for what they've done. Rather than what you project them to do a hell. If there's a guy in the NFL, who's earned? It's sure I mean look. He brought him. The Super Bowl and came pretty close to doing it last year. I think the one thing and again this is not something Aaron Rodgers did but I and I I don't know how they could have done it to structure it better but like. Take a bigger cap it early on in the contract. Structure to and look Rogers is not gonNA. Sign a deal where there's no guaranteed money and twenty twenty, two, twenty, twenty, three in the packers can just walk away from it, I mean they seventeen million dollar dead. cafet- in twenty twenty. Two is not crazy, so I think you're right. Two years is probably the minimum is the first realistic exit point. It really is and look. He's obviously. I mean he already did one adjustment a couple months ago prior to the start of the off season where he He switched up some bonus money to free up about eleven million dollars cap space for this year, so it's not like he's you know completely goes off the idea of reworking things and giving them a little help, etcetera, but yeah I think. It's going to be interesting to see how they navigate those waters. There's no doubt that is so funny. I was doing a twitter community of night, and someone said you know over under two point five years until. I start like. How do you not take the under on that? We think they're gonNA. Let him sit for two and a half years right also shot. If like Aaron Rodgers if the packers are three and thirteen or thirteen. Or two or three and Six and six six. They're out of the playoff hunt. And Week seven hundred. They're gonNA. They're gonNA. Try and get him on the field at least a timeshare or gets hurt exactly I. Mean here's the other thing that. Doesn't get addressed a whole lot, but eh Rogers is not you know the Superman we got used to for so long. You know he's definitely not the run. The table version that we saw in two sixteen. He had a decent year last year for him. A decent year is better than most quarterbacks, especially numbers wise, but you don't have to look much further than you know tape against some of the better defenses to see that he's not the guy who carried this team for a decade, plus and there's nothing wrong with saying that, but it's clear that. He's on. He's on the back nine of his career as he had. That is those are his words. I just. Think. It's crazy for the packers to be looking to the future for trash. Listen quick break. When we come back. We'll talk. Packers defeats. The PGA tour is finally back the first cut on the sports sports podcast network. has you covered weekend and week out with previews picks interviews, news and analysis join mark given Kyle Porter Greg Ducharme and myself. Rick, gaming, as we come at US throughout the week with daily fantasy analysis, winning bets, and the hottest takes about Rory Phil, and tiger, so what are you waiting for? Come join our group and let's talk golf download and subscribe on Apple Podcast spotify stitcher and anywhere else podcast are found. So Green Bay this is. Brian Good came in and. And Aaron. This feels like a four hundred years ago when He. But like he comes in, and does the thing that Ted Thompson had steadfastly refused to do for ever outside of the Charles Woodson signing, and he makes a splash in free agency and he brings in the. Area Smith impressed him. Smith and the packers defense. I think took a big leap forward. That's the question right, is it? Did I mean in the sense of the they improve got off the quarterback in a way. They had the last couple years, but look. Brian took advantage of the fact just took advantage of the moment, right? It was clear I mean even before they suffered a ton of injuries on the defensive side of the ball in two thousand eighteen. It was very clear that they were not up to snuff talent lies. The talent level had completely eroded. A lot of that was due to the fact that ten Thomson had been deteriorating himself at the last few years in charge Russ. Ball, who is very a a cap wizard, who has no business making personnel decisions was making some personnel, decisions and Murphy finally made the transition to Brian, const and Brian. An opportunity where they had a ton of cap space, he knew they needed a complete overhaul on defense, and that's what he did between the Smith signings. The Adrian Amos signing, and then two first round picks both on the defensive side of the ball. Clearly, he saw what needed to be done. Now you could argue kind of let things go as far as wide receiver group etcetera like their weapons on offense. I think the signing of Jimmy Grams one of the moves he's made, but you cannot argue with the fact that the defense did turn around, and it's definitely struggled against the run. We also that in the NFC championship game I think it was a theme all year long, although the they did a better job of clamping down. Second half of the season, but you cannot deny. They got off. The quarterback their pass. Defense was much improved and again they they forced a ton of turnovers. They were great in the Red Zone and you're going to win a lot of football games with that kind of mix of components and I. Think you know I don't expect them to take much of a drop this year, but the big question is. Can they stop the run because they really struggled there last year? Right and you have a bunch of teams in the division to the bears. Vikings. Lions all whom want an packers played those teams pretty well I should they all want to run the football, but we've been asking everybody. What is a successful season for the team and I mean I like I'm going to I've said it all off. Season will continue to say it through cam barring injury because that's always the caveat, right? I very much expect them to have not as many wins probably hovering around ten eleven wins. Maybe not even win the division, but I do think they'll make the playoffs, and after that anything can happen. We've seen it a million times in the NFL especially in recent vintage. Will be interesting to see how much this really odd off season plays into. Not just in general, but especially the start of the season I think. More continuity going to be in a better position, and obviously the packers have a ton of it because they didn't make a ton of moves, they didn't upset their apple cards so to speak when it comes to personnel, so I think especially on offense that really helps them going into a second year. Most of the pieces they had last year are back. They've added a few, so yeah. I think ten eleven wins is probably. Where I expect them to be now. Could they win thirteen games again? Yeah, absolutely because they become a real force. I, don't you know the NFC? It's pretty wide open I think you see the top teams I. The packers could beat any one of them other than the forty niners. Who I think is the. Kind of bug the Bugaboo. The monster under the bed so to speak when it comes to packers fans at least when they look at this forty niners team well look twice last year. It's like wow, how have we improved? It almost felt a little bit like. Baker Mayfield kick the crap out of Hugh Jackson. House handed Mike Pal and yeah a little bit. I feel that I definitely feel that to me, not even talking about the relationships between the staff and the players or anything, but to me it really hearken back to when the packers were knocking on the door for years in the ninety s when far and the packers could never get past the Dallas cowboys, yeah, cowboys were just bigger stronger faster. I mean both of those games you gotta look at that tape and say up forty niners bigger stronger faster. Bozo ask kickings get. See if they run into that buzzsaw again I mean they do play them in the regular season again. God, help us on a short week prime time. I don't expect things to change significantly. I think they need better plans on both side of the ball, but for the most part otherwise I. don't see a team that they should fear. I don't see a team that you go in there thinking. Oh, they're going to lose this one. You know so. That's all you can ask is getting a dance I try. I think they will then anything can happen. I would agree with that. I think expanded playoffs makes it very likely that the packers get in. I would not take the over on their winter. Ten. Right I. Don't that that I don't know that I would take the under nine to either like I don't I, wouldn't I'm not banking on this team? Being Eight win team this. It's like it's it's. Highly possible the thing you can't. You cannot possibly be. An even kind of. passer-by observer of the. But you shouldn't. But you know and not think okay. Yeah, I could see how that would be things go. They don't win the close ones like they did last year. Maybe the offense is just continues to come stub. It's to- at times. Blah Blah Blah and then all of a sudden. They're nine seven eight. Air Nigger Cheesehead TV confront of the program always fun to talk to you buddy. Vacuums could be a big season coming up. We'll I can't wait to find out. It's okay we're so close these. Football just give US football I. don't care if there's fans I. don't care I'll I'll I'll wear your muscle my head. I don't care. Thanks Buddy. Thanks! I don't we all have been craving. The return of sports well football season is getting closer and closer so fantasy drafts are getting closer and closer. Do you need your prep? Do you need your breakouts? Do you want your daily fantasy football? Talk from the best analysts in the business. Check out our fantasy football today podcast fantasy football. Today is in its eleventh year. We've been helping listeners dominate their leagues for more than a decade. You'll laugh you'll learn. You'll have fun and you'll win your leaks. Check it out the fantasy football today podcast anywhere you listen.

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Tyler Dunne of Bleacher Report and longtime NFL scout and executive Michael Lombardi

The MMQB Podcast with Peter King

1:08:36 hr | 1 year ago

Tyler Dunne of Bleacher Report and longtime NFL scout and executive Michael Lombardi

"Yeah. Welcome to the Peter King podcast. Right. Tried to tell you a little bit about football, and maybe a little bit about life. But this week. It's all football all the time. I've got two very interesting guests Tyler done of Bleacher report wrote an explosive story about the divorce between Aaron Rodgers Mike McCarthy with some tentacles of the old Ted Thompson regime and all have Tyler Don on to discuss that story. And also the future of Aaron Rodgers in Green Bay also Mike Lombardi now, Mike has been a longtime acquaintance of mine known them going back to the days when he worked for the San Francisco forty Niners in the eighties longtime NFL employees thirty five year NFL career now he's got a podcast cadence thirteen that we're going. Talk about an we're going to talk about a lot entering the NFL draft, which as he listened to this is just two weeks away. But first quick thoughts on three matters around the National Football League number one Cuyler Murray getting ready to visit the Arizona Cardinals. And I don't know if this is the worst kept secret. I don't think it's a secret anymore. How much the Zona cardinals alike? Cuyler marie. I think most people in the free world want believe that Keiler Marie is going to be taken in the first round with the first pick in the NFL draft on Thursday evening, April twenty fifth, and I think what's really interesting about the way. This is this is happening is that Josh Rosen. The incumbent quarterback is basically being hidden during early drills for the Arizona Cardinals. And look the. Cardinals arena, very tough spot. Josh Rosen is in a very tough spot. He's an adult he understands that what might happen. And to me it's hard to kill the cardinals for not wanting Josh Rosen to come out and to serve play the star in the melodrama. Between the Arizona Cardinals. And not only with Josh Rosen. But also, obviously with Cuyler Murray, I think the cardinals have probably decided what they wanna do. I wrote this week that there's a good chance that the two teams that are most interested in will be most interested in Josh Rosen, our Washington and the New York Giants. And so we'll see what happens, but the cardinals have to be very very careful in this number one the NFL wants to keep a lid on all this until draft night. You've got ABC got ESPN. You've got NFL network all going live with different telecasts. And the last thing they want is to have zero drama going into that evening. So I think it's going to be very very interesting to watch this over the next couple of weeks. But the next chapter is going to be. With the visit of Cuyler Murray to the Zona cardinals. Where I think we all believe that hill end up being United with guy recruited them out of high school cliff Kingsbury when he was a college coach in the state of Texas number two Antonio Brown. You know, I think there are some people who probably should just take a longtime out from social media. Antonio Brown's said this week. Okay. You know, I'm outta here. Basically because all I get is grief on social media. And I think everybody would view the latest tempest when Antonio Brown criticized his former teammate juju Smith Schuster for costing the Steelers a playoff spot by fumbling. It New Orleans in a brutal loss in December. I mean, the bottom line is why in the world. Would you bring that up three months after the season? It's one of the silliest things that I've ever seen you know, to bring that up three months after the end of the regular season for no good reason whatsoever except apparently for vengeance. So Antonio Brown now going off social media. And I think a lot of people will look at Antonio Brown and wave and say do this is for your own good. You need to get away for a while. And maybe forever. And look I think Antonio Brown is going to be a good impact player in Oakland for the raiders, but he's not doing himself or his image any favors with ripping a guy like juju Smith Schuster who was only good to him in the time that they were together in Pittsburgh number three the NFL in the NFL PA issues statement late Tuesday of this week, which basically said essentially that we have been negotiating we had a good negotiating session. Shen today, meaning on Tuesday, as you listen to this, you know, early in this week, it'd be Tuesday remind they had negotiating session, and they expect to have more negotiating sessions. I think the interesting thing about what I'm hearing about both sides. I don't think it's going to stay all nice and friendly and pleasant at all. But I do think that it's a good sign that they're sitting down now with a full two years left in the collective bargaining agreement to really try to lay the groundwork for some quality discussions now. I believe they're going to be two elements that are going to be really important sticking points that we'll see whether there's any movement at all I think that the players association with love to get rid of the franchise tag because it really limits. The ability especially of. Big big time players to get what they really worth on the open market. And then I think it's going to be very interesting to see how much the NFL pushes. And this is not a huge thing in negotiations. But I do think it'll be an interesting little sticking point. I've been told all along that the NFL is very interested in placing a franchise inland and sometime after the expiration of the collective bargaining agreement and the signing of new one which clearly would be sometime in two thousand twenty one. So if the NFL wants to put a free inch is over in Europe, they're gonna have to get the sign off from the NFL PA, and what will the work rules be like will players who agree to play for a franchise in London. Get paid automatically. Fifteen percent. More will the salary cap be a little bit higher twenty or thirty million dollars higher. So that players can earn more money because honestly, you know, everybody say, well, jeez. Why why would that be a factor because it is going to be a hardship for some guys to live five thousand miles away from home and guys are not gonna wanna do it. But if a franchise moves, and you go over there. I think you're going to have to give a carrot to some players. I know that this is not on the front burner of anybody's agenda. But I do believe it's going to be a very interesting negotiating point for the players. And for the owners in the next couple of years as the collective bargaining agreement is negotiated but I will say this a very good sign. The only thing I'm hearing is you don't hear anybody. Oh. Pouting or or being really disagreeable early on in these negotiations. You don't hear anything at all? But I can tell you that. If there were some angry people in here, you would see here's some leaks right now. You don't hear that? And hey for people love football. I think everybody is rooting for a CBA that gets done on time. So that no games. No training camp is missed in two thousand and twenty one. And now my conversation with Tyler done of Bleacher report. Happy to be joined on the Peter King podcast by Tyler done writer for Bleacher report who basically has written a bombshell story, which if you're listening to this podcast, you have read this perhaps you've read it seven times if you're a Green Bay Packers fan because you just wanna make sure that that you have basically gotten all of it because there was so much in it about what went wrong between Mike McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers and Ted Thompson and really why what should have been a great Green Bay. Packers franchise, basically went astray, and Tyler I also really fascinated. When you write a story like this. I want you to explain if you can a little bit about kind of what it takes to write a story like this. Because clearly, you you formerly covered the Packers in Wisconsin, and you had to have some institutional knowledge and institutional contexts so take a minute if you can and and tell people what exactly goes into writing a story like this. You got Peter emancipate. You so much for Hemion to get into all this. You know, I covered the team for four years at the Milwaukee journal sentinel and a couple of off seasons before that as a as an intern for a couple of different outlets when I was in college out there, so bits and pieces kinda was there throughout this. Arranged marriage was doomed I guess all along what goes into it? I guess is how did it get from point to point B? I remember being out there for the fifteen in one season being out there for contending near after year. When it was like, Ryan grant said everything was automatic. They're they're in meetings. Almost chuckling when preparing for an opponent because they know exactly which players are gonna work, and they're gonna dominate offensively. How did it get from there to what we saw that day against the cardinals when they inexplicably lose a terrible era Zona team at home at the game or just kind of following for a far. And I'm like man, it got bad fast at what happens of, and that's kind of Genesis Ford. It's curiosity you like, no, you're just kinda want to follow your intuition and your curiosity, and I just picked up my phone and started going through my contacts and seeing you know, which which players scouts personnel. Guys coaches were in. They're made a list of a bunch of numbers started texting started calling. There was one conversation specifically with how long ago, so when did you win? Did you start doing this yet definitely feel free to cut me off? I don't want to ramble too much here. It was around. Yeah. Right around that game. Really? So, you know, mid December. Yeah. And it was a, you know, a personnel guy who was there for a while. And isn't there anymore reached out to him, and we talked for probably hour and a half. At least, you know. And it just shocked me. I mean, the things he was he was saying about about Mike McCarthy about Aaron Rodgers some really skating stuff. And I I didn't really know that Mike McCarthy's offense what his stale as it did. I mean, I'm not really an Xs and os guy stuff on Twitter. But this guy really laid out exactly how things devolved in. How Cornerbacks division are literally calling out plays before the snap. And. And here's why the plant route died, and here's why this died and. And that they went through all of that. So, you know, it kinda started there, and then you start talking to many players as possible as many coaches as possible and probably got forty five to fifty guys all and you know transcribed. It all work for printed. It out read it reread every reread it and try to get a sense for where people were coming from. And then at the last part is writing, you know, and getting into it that way, but big picture, I thought it would be big to get as many voices as possible to really get that the big picture like I didn't really want it to be a Aaron Rodgers center story or a Mike McCarthy McCarthy center store, and I reached out took both kind of later in the game. I didn't wanna be kind of swayed. I I there way wanted to be more. So the bulk of as many people's like to talk to that were around. You know, originally what's going gonna be a Packer story that became? A Rogers McCarthy dominant story. And during the course of this. It sounds like he worked on it for about four months. Was there a Eureka moment in those four months a Eureka interview where he just said holy cow. This is this is gonna be pretty big. See probably, you know, that first one definitely opened my eyes things. And then getting guys on the record was dig probably Greg Jennings that conversation, and you know, we we talked on the phone that he was he wanted to talk about this. You know, it was like at an airport. I think is literally going through don't gate the gate and getting on the plane, and the only reason he hung up because his plane was taken off whatever members. It was amazing about what was amazing about Greg Jennings. And you know, how I always I always think of stories in this way. And you know, when I think of this story your story on the Packers. I don't the first thing. I think of in retrospect after reading it. I don't think of Mike McCarthy getting a massage or anything like that. I think of the more the football parts of this story, the amazing thing and probably this might not even be people's top five of things that they learned from it are things they'll remember I will remember Greg Jennings. Basically telling the story of Aaron Rodgers saying to a member of the San Francisco forty Niners before they played a game after Greg Jennings was in I believe is fourth season of being the most reliable target or the most productive target for Aaron Rodgers. According to Jennings Rogers, Saint hey, you should come and get this guy next year. What? That was that was an amazing. That's an amazing story to me. It just is. Yeah. Words right out of my mouth. I mean that was the moment. I mean because you know, write a story. It's one thing. It's one thing to tell. It's one thing for players to tell you what they think they're paying their thing to show it had these examples in Greg Jennings's he brought the heat on both. You know, it's and I think the Packer fans become after this guy, and he knows that he self aware about it. You know, they're going to span is Twitter and everything, but he's like this is my relationship, and he'll detailed it blow for blow. You know, all the way to being a eight a threat far being Viking in him talking to Brett farve and air riders being ticked off about that. But coming Viking himself and seeing that, you know, some of the Packer receivers were looking over their shoulder for Rogers and say, look, okay. I mean, he really brought that to life. I feel like Andy said his number one. I mean, the moments they shared that Super Bowl threat of the needle. That's the that's the best of Aaron Rodgers life. Well, no, John Cook is throw of his life. But this probably in in a Super Bowl was the most significant throw of his life. One hundred percent, and it's just wild to think that if it could get so bad so fast when they had so many amazing moments together, and you know, people can dismiss him they want they can just Mr Michael female. They weren't look ex players that were around, you know, the I don't call it acts to grand call it a guy being honest, you know, his livelihood isn't tied to Aaron Rodgers anymore. You know, I mean, he can they can speak candidly, speak refreshing. And look I tried to get ahold of James Jones, and didn't you know, declined to talk to run a phone network. However, you wanna word it just never heard that. And I know he's upset with what was the story. Look these people put their name to it. They brought examples Ryan grant was excellent engage engaging in really painted a great picture. So I think that was the having you know, what the what really made the story powerful is that it would have been very very easy for people to dismiss the story. If you couldn't name if you were just able to say, one, former Packers receivers said or one longtime target of Rogers or one former running back or whatever, but you're able to name them. And I think most people's biggest problem with stories that really go behind the curtain and really go underneath the surface of of somebody who's huge in the NFL and huge in sports. You know, the fact that you're able to have multiple teammates who were willing to speak on the record that really that goes to. I think quite honestly, I think it goes to your diligence with this story, you're relationship with some of these guys. And just the fact that that is an important part of this story that names were named. I totally agree. And then I appreciate that yet. That that credibility is is big. And you hope that people respect, you know, your reporting, and what you've done in the past when they do read on anonymous, quote, and they know that we aren't just throwing this out there that this comes from a place that that we trust. And we don't take that trust. For granted. We don't take that lightly. I think that combination was big here. Because as you know, I mean, there are things that players coach whoever they that. They wanna say they want out there. They they want to bring the story to life, but they don't want to take the risk maybe deta Jennings or a Finley, you know, they're thinking about maybe being in the NFL in the future. And they just don't want that to pop up on Google when you search their name is some simple as that. And it's gonna shoot from the hip, but it's they still they still want to let people know. And that was that was the case all over the place here. What what happened when you reached out to Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy and Ted Thompson? Yep. So like I said that was a little later in the game. I really wanted to get a full picture of the situation from dozens and dozens of people here, but want wanted to give them a chance obviously to address any, you know, handle claims by others and Mike McCarthy left message on the phone messages on the phone didn't hear back and Aaron Rodgers. It was just not around the Philipe wasn't able to reach him. And Ted Thompson, you know. I didn't have a contact for try to numbers that. I thought might if it his didn't have any luck. So, you know, obviously, the people would want to hear what they have to say Mike McCarthy did a really good QNA with robbed a mosque ran the day before our story. So kind of explain things and his voice, their routers. Maybe asked about whatever and he can address if you'd like he might even try to drive it forward. Think about the offense with Matt with low who knows you know with. But yeah, I mean, I get it. You wanna hear their voices? And maybe that is lacking here. Maybe you know, people reading this. I wanna hear Raja say, I still really value. Getting the bulk the high volume several different interviews with several different sources, you know, not multiple different agendas. It's if they even have an agenda, he's getting want one singular agenda dominate the story that you see some time. He starts like, oh my gosh. Well, obviously, you know, this coach was the big source behind the story. I didn't want that. You know, it's it's interesting when you do a story like this that is that so deep and has so many tentacles into so many things I'm left thinking at the end of its sort of looking forward is the Packers pick up the pieces. You know, a couple of thoughts came to mind one. You know, Mike McCarthy is going to have a difficult time. I think coming back from how it ended in Green Bay coming back from the fact that he didn't get the jets job. And although there was some interest between him in Cleveland. You know, he didn't end up interviewing in Cleveland. He decided to you know, basically, enter the off-season get his health, right? He had a knee surgery at the end of his tenure in Green Bay. And also to just get every always ducks in a row, but the one thing. I kept thinking about is. I wonder if Mike McCarthy has a chance now to be Brian Billick a Super Bowl winning coach. And now will he ever get a chance after the way it ended in Green Bay? And I have to think that if he does interview for jobs in two thousand twenty and beyond people are going to be asking about stuff in this story. Yeah. And you know, what is shocking and surprising in the revelations. Whatever you wanna call it may may seem to readers. I don't think a lot of this is the prize to people in mono. I mean think about when he started there in Green Bay six two to eighteen you've got a lot of people on different teams. Now, that know a lot of this stuff. I mean, they they know that it was a talent based scheme a matchup base scheme, which was which works great. If you've got that talent. But in today's NFL, I mean, you've got to be able to ski if you have it, and he just didn't really have in the words of many others that were around him. I think the people know that so you know, as much as the other stuff, you know, whether whether or not he got our how I should say. How miss massages you got in the office. We'll never know. I mean, you know, I don't think that. That's something. That's a -sarily that would prevent him from getting a job. But the fact that he did take this more. You'll like approach wasn't in the offense of meetings that roped some guys the wrong way in Enron other guys around way, but that's something he'll have to dress. What why did he take that approach when as one guy said your quote unquote, chilling during the week and call on plays, and then what's up with the scheme. Where are you gonna take? This. Those definitely are things to answer for and maybe is Brian. I I don't know. I like to think he gets another shock if he built something great and Green Bay when he had the talent the talent to do it again. Where does Aaron Rodgers go from here, obviously out of this story, which I'm sure Rodgers will dispute at some point he comes across as a major prima Donna, and almost like a, you know, a Don, you know, a mafia Don, I'm deciding to throw this guy the ball more. And at least that was the impression that if you didn't do what Aaron said, he probably wasn't gonna throw the ball. That's the impression that was left with some of his receivers, especially young receiver. So there seems to be going into two thousand nineteen the new coach Matt leflore a lot of pressure on Rogers, and I don't want to oversimplify this. But basically to take coaching. Which is thirty five years whole. I'm spending the NFL since you know, two thousand five he's been around awhile crazy that we're asking that question. I mean DRA Michael Finley way put it is expect an attic, the change is an attic, and the changes ways, you got the contract. Now, he's got the leverage might Carthy knew. We didn't stand a chance last year after that, you know, at least as wants to season guy role. And I think that if he if he wants to win air riders said this a lot, you know, like these are made of the postseason. He gets all of that these small sacrifices need to be made in Jennings. Put it really well. It's not like you have to change a ton. I mean, you're still has debased arm in football incredible athleticism for his age in critical physical talent now with the new scheme that will be more innovative and and use Shen in this direction and outcomes nations and an office coordinator, Nate Hackett who's gonna push him. Just got all the energy in the world. Isn't an embrace that and within that scheme a little bit more Mike McCarthy gave that freedom to break from the offense. And he needed to rather Sultan, you too can you kinda pull that back look in the mirror and make all Aker ffices? If he does I think that. Yeah. The Packers could contend because he is still unbelievably talented, but he's got to do it. Because they don't have the talent that they had in twenty ten twenty seven will Aaron Rodgers respect. Matt leflore? I don't know. I I really don't know the s the Jennings's and the finley's, and and some other folks around the organization some ex players, they they're very very skeptical. They think that the veterans in the locker room, maybe help keep them accountable early on you lost those veterans, and you kind of started more so doing what he wanted. I I really don't know. I think it's gonna take that. So perplexing. You know, there's two other sort of. There's two other people who come across damaged collaterally fats correct way to put it one of them's Ted Thompson, the former general manager who basically comes across as a guy who just simply couldn't adjust to building a modern football team. And you know, it's interesting Ted Thompson is one of the most. One of the most interesting people I've met covering the NFL because I can I can tell you that I stood with him in the locker room maybe for a half hour after the Packers Super Bowl victory over the Pittsburgh Steelers, whatever now, I guess it's eight or nine years ago and Ted Thomson had wave after wave of people come into him and said what about all these people who didn't trust you to build a team. What about all these people who said this who said that there wasn't one moment where Ted Thompson, basically lit into anybody or said anything negative about anybody. He's just a he's almost a immune to all of it. He just doesn't really get upset seemingly about anything. But he comes across really damaged. I think in this story as a guy who refused to change and not that he's going to work in the NFL again. But is that a fair portrait of basically, Ted Thompson lion in winter? Very very fair. I think nailed it. Look. I mean, he inherited a team with a lot of bad contracts and really bad salary cap situation. You know, early oh five an aging Brett Farr and decided to draft and develop made some really tough decisions. I mean, you can remember him drafting Aaron Rodgers that call criticism remember him, not acquiring. Randy moss and trading for him. That's a lot of criticism. He's made the tough decisions. He's been very very methodical and building through the draft made helps make the Packers that perennial contender. They became making the playoffs that years in a row, but you know, as the salary cap rose as the team became. Close to powerhouse close with honesty, whatever you wanna call it. He just never signed those betters that they needed every March just this didn't do it for one, you know, and let a lot of veterans. Go leaders go in and that came up a ton with ex players that believe he if let some really good players go a couple years too soon and underestimated the impact of those players had in the locker room, and I think that a TJ laying adjusting on the offensive line helped how cold Aaron Rodgers accountable, and they'd call them out, and he respected that I think it was a good to relationship there and defensively Beechy Rajhi's named came up of bunch for one as somebody who was a really strong leader. If you're a member Cincinnati game at twenty thirteen when Rogers McCarthy close close to blows. It's Rogers steps in of plays mind Mills Lane there. So there's that factor. And I think he didn't see the forest from the trees. He such a scout. Scout he loves football loves going to pro days loves all of that. Which is which is great, which is the reason the Packers able uncover a lot of late round jams. Undrafted guys, you're missing the relationship between Mike McCarthy and Rogers or not seeing the red flags you're never stepping in. And forcing that moment of reckoning that was needed. You just never did that. And then nobody above Ted Thompson stepped in when his health deteriorated toward the end. And and he's falling asleep in meetings, and this speech is slurred, and it's obvious to people around him. He shouldn't be the general manager. It was it was a problem just persistent, and you know, this better than me, Peter. But I know a lot of owners get criticized for harsh decisions and rash decisions. The the Packers probably needed that singular heavy-handed owner at some point to step in and clean this up and the defacto owner Mark Murphy's finally doing that. Now, what's really, really interesting? You know, I think Rogers. Was was really really ticked off at Mike Florio last fall because Florio was writing things like, you know, Rogers is you know, you can feel his passive aggressive nature when he's dealing with Mike McCarthy, you can tell he really doesn't have that much respect for them by this this and this and how incredibly ironic in the twenty four hours after your story appeared one thing appeared on social media from Aaron Rodgers, and that is this tweet. I'm proud to say I got to play and be and be protected by these two warriors TJ Lang and Josh Sitton. No, one had more fun or made these longest days more fun than these two, blah, blah, blah anyone on and that to me he didn't write a tweet where he says this story. By Tyler Dunn's, a piece of crap or this this story by Tyler done. My god. He, you know, took this out of context took that what he did was he did the passive aggressive thing. He basically said here's these two great players who we chose not to resign. And I chose today to recognize what a privilege it was to play with these guys. I mean that was the most I maybe Aaron Rodgers it's the most innocent thing in the world. I think there's a zero zero point zero zero one chance that that was not intended as a response to your story. And I just want to know, what did you think when you saw that? You know, what I haven't even thought of it like that either. But a lot of sense it really does if passive aggressive is a term that does come up when you talk to people about Aaron Rodgers. And that I it wouldn't surprise me. And you know, I it's it's kind of funny, and we're laughing and stuff, but it has been a problem. It seems like if something is bothering him or festering and kicked off at McCarthy or ticked off about something, you know, in his professional wide personal life people close to him say he would just kind of stuff it deep down inside of them and wouldn't wouldn't attack a problem head on and avoided confrontation. And I think that personality trait hurt him here with Mike McCarthy. And I do think that Mike McCarthy tried. I mean, it sounds like he reached out and wanted to have him over it talk here. And there he kind of gave him the advice once pick up the phone and call your mom, and in so many words. He told us coach to mind your own business. So they just never really addressed the problems of simmer for years. Yeah. That was that was one of the things you need story. That was so interesting that it sounded like McCarthy at some point really tried to. Intervene in a friendly slash positive way in Aaron Rodgers life. And he wanted to have none of it. We'll end with this. Tyler Tyler done Bleacher report is is fantastic story illuminating story on the Green Bay Packers and the relationship between Rogers and McCarthy and how it ended in such ugly divorce. Is there any way that Aaron Rodgers does not finish his career is the quarterback of the Green Bay Packers? Never thought that Brett Farr would put on another uniform for different reasons. I guess I wouldn't anything not at all. I mean, it's one thing. I couldn't really confirm. I couldn't really report here kinda grumbling here and there, but nothing nothing worth writing. But it's something we're talking about. I I think that the Packers aren't necessarily terrified of life after Aaron Rodgers. I think that they you met flora as a young energetic. Innovative perfect coach for the perfect time poach long-term that can run a team more. So than just get the best out of Aaron Rodgers, I and just handed this contract. So it's silly to even you know, think about life after riders, but he's thirty five. I mean, Tom Brady's gonna reality there. And I just think that they're not they're just not necessarily afraid of it only going to draft a quarterback anytime soon of the first around, but just keep that in mind that there. Thinking pitcher, they don't have the drama, and they made that clear to them Tyler done. Congratulations on the story once again and. I just got a lot of respect for you for having been able to form the kind of relationships that writing a story like this truly does entail. So congratulations and all the best to you. I can't tell you how about heaviness coming from you, Peter. So thank you so much. Really appreciate you had me on to talk about it at length here. Support. For the Peter King podcast comes from wicks dot com. Wicks you can create your very own professional website. Choose a template you love and customize it by adding your own text images and videos with hundreds of intuitive design features. You can tell your story exactly the way you want you want even more for your website. You can easily start a blog launch an online store or create an event share everything in click on social media and drive even more traffic to your site with SEO tools to get found on Google wicks has all the tools, you need to create the exact website you want you can even create a beautiful website while listening to this podcast over one hundred and forty million people choose wicks to create their website. So please, I'm begging you create yours today. It is so. So easy. Get started now by going to wicks dot com. That's W X dot com slash Peter King to get ten percent off wicks dot com slash Peter King. You'll be glad you did. And now my conversation with Mike Lombardi. Back the Peter King podcast. So happy to be joined by Mike Lombardi who is starting of a brand new podcast, Mike as you probably know worked in the NFL for over three decades for several teams. I I've always we're gonna get into this a little bit. But I've always thought it was cool. There aren't many people who can say they worked for Bill Walsh, Al Davis and Bill Belichick, but Mike Lombardi is done that. I mean can anybody else say that Mike that you that that that they worked for Bill Walsh, Al Davis and Bill Belichick? I don't think. So, but I'll add a little I'll put another ante into the pot and gone to a Super Bowl with author. Yeah. That's. When you look at that, you know Bill in our work together at one time. So, you know, Bill actually the reason I ended up working for our was because Bill I was driving Bill Walsh around one day. He said, you know, the most football ever learned was working for the raiders from Davis. So that's what prompted me to work for them. So I don't know. I mean, but remember I'll never forget this story that you told me this is one of the first times I ever met you talk to you this a long time ago when we were talking about the incredible drafting prowess of Bill wall, right? And we're talking about Charles Haley, and you said that Bill Walsh watched a few snaps of Charles Haley, James Madison, and you or somebody said to him. Jeez. Don't you wanna watch a few games? He goes, hey, I've watched five or eight snaps of this guy. I've seen what he can do if he can do that in five or eight snaps. We can teach him we can coach him to do it for a full game. Member that, oh, I remember I can still remember when when when when he should off the projector. He said men do we need a really see anymore. And then he asked the great, Bill McPherson. He said MAC where would you draft this guy and MAC made this painful face like, he had the worst gas of all time, you know? You know, I may be in the in the tenth round. And coach wall said MAC, if we want the guy we're going to pick the guy not wait until the tenth around. But yeah. Those those drafts in San Francisco. You know, have an indelible like I can still remember Bradford Dilmun. Yeah. We gotta tell the story of Brad for Dylan. Because just remember this the drafts were longer in those days. Right. They were heavily on twelve rounds or whatever that was a twelve round draft. Yeah. But you were there in San Francisco for three years, right? Eighty four eighty five eighty six and eighty seven grass see you were there for four drafts. And just to preface the story. Bradford Dilmun was a character actor correct in Hollywood, and he was a huge forty Niners fan and a draft Nick and a draft nut. He was like he was like Mel kiper junior junior. Right. And he would end so Walsh would let them come to the draft. Right. Let them, you know. It's funny. Dr Darren Roselle reported nine or sold to tickets to the draft room for twenty two thousand dollars each or whatever it was. Brad Dilmun got gotta complimentary. He said in their came in with his little briefcase he sat down, and this was we were at seven eleven of street. We weren't in the new where they are. Now, you're in Redwood City, California would City California and kind of a dumpy little facility not kind of. Little Savary NFL team in nineteen eighty five at a dumpy facility and the team meeting room was separated by one of those accordion, kind of wall that you go back. So we took the accordion wall back. We opened it up. We set it up as a draft room put the boards on the wall. The the guy would come in. We put the boards on the wall brat and the front of the room the back, which was the back of the room became coach Walsh's like he had a desk there. And then the other opposite end is where Brad Dilmun set. So in nineteen eighty six we start off. And he tells me write these three names on the draft board, and I write Gerald Robinson defensive end Auburn. I right John L Williams running back, Florida. I write Ronnie Harmon running back Iowa. And I sit down I read them on a chalkboard keyword here chalkboard because there wasn't a greaseboard back then. And then the next pit comes up. It's the Minnesota Vikings. There goes Robinson the next pick comes up. There's a Seattle Seahawks. There goes Williams. The next pick comes up. There goes is buffalo. There goes Ronnie Harmon we have nothing to pick not. Nothing to pick. So coach walls patiently calmly the sides. Let's by half hour by buying a half hour. We just moved to spots down at Dallas come up and we buy a half hour. Well that led to this avalanche of trading down. So by the end of the day, we accumulate we have a second round pick. We have one next year we have three three three fours and some other pick. So we end up picking Larry Roberts. We're gonna pick in the first round. Anyway, got rest of soul. And then we pick them up at the top of the round pick Tom rathman, which has its own story without Davis involved in it. And then we pick Tim Kerr John Taylor. And then at the top of the fourth we pick Steve Wallace Kevin Fagan and Charles Haley, and then in the fifth round the personnel director at the time. Tony, regina. So this is the worst draft of all time. If we don't pick Patrick Miller from Florida, we are going to go. This is the only thing that can salvage this draft. And so we go over and coach wash looks at me. And I said. Well, coachee tested positive for marijuana at the combine which eighty six was like the big deal that was a huge deal. Right, right. So walls is kind of pissed off and says. All right. So just to make to shut Toni up picks them. And then he walks over the board. And he calls me over says Michael who's this kit here and he points to Don Griffin from middle, Tennessee. I said, well, that's the high value player of the year. He played he played free safety at a middle, Tennessee. So we'll draft him in the six round when it comes time. So I race to the telephone in the other room to call Don Griffin because it's eighty six and and to see if he's alive because there's no internet. There's no way to check. He's alive we draft him. So now, we've picked all these picks. We're we're kind of waiting to the draft end so walls announces after we picked on Griffin. He says Brad in the ninth round. You get the pick. So like, it was a guy who's been on Colombo and get your she wrote. Yeah. Right. And so I mean like it was like it was staged. He flips open his briefcase, and he's got a tight written note that he has that's going to announce the pick. So he gives it to coach walls, and I can still remember when coach Walsh read this. He says he wants to draft herald home in a defensive end from Auburn because home and gets more penetration than Warren Beatty at a sorority party. Description. We draft howled home and he lasts ten minutes in training camp. He goes he doesn't even get the goes right to Canada. He makes like all Canadian eight years in a row over hilly. He was undersized defensive tackle Grizz. That's fantastic. With with Mike Lombardi, Mike before we go any further. You've got a new podcast. I wanna hear about it. And I want to hear to me. I think you'll be great at podcasting because running your own podcast because you can talk for a long time. Yeah. And you've been a lot of places. There's anyway, let's hear about your pod. Well, I'm really excited for I mean, it's it's an opportunity to talk about during the off season. We'll do it once a week during the season. We'll do it twice a week. But the first one will be kind of a review of what happened what we saw kind of a little bit of the stories that not everybody kind of your column taking the stories a little deeper. How teams one why teams loss? I think the hardest thing Davies used to do this to me all the time. You get on the team plane after a game. He would say. Do you know what we want or do? You know, why the F we lost? And I'd have to answer them. And I couldn't say, well, we got a bad call today. You know, Mr. Davis. I I'd have to give them a real answer. And I think that that those two questions are fundamentally never answered in the NFL. They're always answered in some way. That's not accurate. I mean Andy Reed says we lost to the because we didn't get the ball at in overtime. But they allowed thirteen for nineteen third downs to be converted. They allowed three third downs on that last drive. They couldn't stop them at any point in the game. They had ample opportunity to run the clock with three minutes to go in the game. They were down by three. They could've run the clock down not allow Brady to get the game. But yet the reason they lost because they didn't get the bone overtime. It's so those are the kind of things we really wanna talk about on the podcast and then at the end of the week. We're gonna talk about the games and see how they measure up and football is a game of ups, you know, and. I don't bet games. But I love matchups about games. And so I talk about that. And who has the favorable matchup who's going to win it who who could win it and why they should win. Mike. I want to ask you about your years without Davis. You had to ten years, right? Yeah. With davis. So tell me the years of each no just one I was with them from well when you're without for for as long as I was it was like two lives have. I'm reading a book right now about JD Salinger, which is the most fascinating book I've ever read. It's an I didn't know JD Salinger survive, the Normandy, invasion. I did not know that he went to a German prison war camp. And was so devastated. That's why you know, and the aftershock of what he went through in the war, baby. Led to the reason he became such a reclusive credible book by Shane Salerno. But anyway after spending all that time with Al I can't understand Hayao, still married. Be you know, a how I've my family stayed in. Tag be because those years were never easy. All right. So how what what was your what were your years went to ninety nine to two thousand and seven although all those people that blame me for jamarcus Russell, I was sent to Elba in two thousand seven. So when you get sent to Elba in the Polian was sent to Elba after he was overthrown in France twice. It's why the town of Luca in Italy is is basically dominated by the French because that was where the Polian sister lift. And so he gave her that town. So our always say to me kid if you'd like that you're going to Elba. Yeah. So officially I went to Elba in two thousand and seven, but what what did you do in two thousand seven I sat in my office. I watch tape on the draft. I went for a walk every single day for at least an hour. I answered whenever he called me to ask me about something link. Kiffin was the head coach he came come into my office and beg me to tell Al not the draft jamarcus Russell. And I said lane, look, I'm gonna get fired after. A draft. So I don't think I got any say with them you go talk to John kingdom down the hall and might want to talk to him. But talk to me. I'll never forget the first time. And I and we'll get back to Al say. But I never forget the first time I met lane kiffin it was in raiders training camp. He's like he looks like he's sixteen years old for crying out loud. It's like thirty three years old. And I said I said to him man what motivated you to take this job? And he said, hey, you know, three year contract, whatever the money was he said some dollar figure. He goes, what's the worst? That can happen. Fires me. And I thought that was that's lane kiffin. Yeah. Okay. But I thought I would not want to enter a job thinking. Oh, what's the worst thing? That can happen. They fire me. I mean, I'd wanna say oh my God. I get to sit at the right hand of Al Davis. I get to learn this. I get to be a head coach in the NFL. I don't know. I don't think he was thinking that way. I think he almost got the job like US grant became the head of the army. He just was the next guy. Yeah. Like, he you know, he comes. In with Steve Sarkisian, so Sarkozy's back and forth to Oakland interview with Al for the head coaching job. And every time he comes. This is a Cording to Sarkissian. He claims house lies on. Okay. So the last time he comes up. I'll tell them. I wanna meet who's you're going to be offense coordinator, and so brings lane with them. Yeah. So then lane comes up, and he puts on the blackboard, and they go through their the gymnastics. And then when Sarkisian lands back in LA, he basically has been lied to enough, and he leaks that he's pulled out of the job at comes across the ticker me. While also sense is trusted aide. John Harare down to LA to try to figure it out. I mean like like seriously there that was that was the comedy of all comedy. Do you remember in two thousand four when I wanted to come and cover the draft in Oakland. But at the time, I was really on the outs with Al Al did not like some of the stuff that I had written. And you said to me, well, I'll see what I can do. Whatever I'll talk to Al, you know, it'd be great to have you in for the draft. All that. So you talk to ally. I don't know why. I don't know. How I don't know what you said. But then Mike Taylor PR guy said, yeah, you know, you can you can come in. And and I'll talk to you and everything and I will never ever forget the draft was on a Saturday. Okay. Now, Mike on Friday. No earlier that week. Align manning, Robert, gallery, the tackle from Iowa and one other guy had come in to visit the raiders, right? You know because L you guys had I think the fourth pick in the draft third or fourth second second pick. Okay. Sorry. So Alice trying to figure out who is gonna draft, and you're going to have to tell me the real story. But the thing there's two things I will never ever forget. I was going to see how that Friday the day before the draft. I was going to have an hour with Al at one o'clock in the afternoon. So I come in, and I go into AL's office and in office are for televisions, and they're in a diamond shape. There's one TV up on top. And then lowered left. There's another one lower. Right. There's another one and at the bottom. There's another one it's like an diamond formation, and we started talking in Al started talking about women's basketball. And he started talking about how much he loved Diana Terachi in the Yukon huskies. And so I said, well, jeez. My my brother my sister, and my brother in law live about ten minutes from stores and they have season tickets the uconn women's basketball. So then we talk I'm in there to talk about who they're going to draft and all he. Wants to do is talk about how much he loves uconn basketball, e loves Gino, Auriemma, all this. It was it was an amazing conversation. But you know, what else? I remember about that day, Mike, I leave your your facility, and I go back to my hotel. And I'm sitting in my hotel and news comes over. The Pat Tillman is dead. That was the day that Pat Tillman died the day before the draft in two thousand they we learned that he died that. Yeah. The day. You'll learn that he died. I don't know might have been a day or two before. But anyway, so it was I don't know why that just all hit me, but that was an incredible day. But I would just ask you two thousand four draught Al Davis. Why Robert gallery instead of ally? Manning, Philip rivers, Ben Rothlisberger. Well, I think two things remember that line said about evaluate your own team. Yeah. We did a we had rich Gannon. Yeah. Ours never about rebuild. He was always about repair. And hours never about trying to draft a young quarterback. Angela Angela Koya the the scout who he brought with him from the citadel to USC had been in one of his players forever was jumping up and down on the table for a Ben Rothlisberger up and down on the table. I mean he wanted him badly. Now, we were not gonna we were not didn't have a chance to pick enough at the end of the day. Mike, you know, what how great a raider would Ben routh? That's exactly where Angie's words, how great a raider would he'd been. And so he was never going to go into that. And so- gallery was supposedly quote, unquote, the cleanest player. I remember everybody. It was a can't miss left. Let's he was an eagle scout quite literally. Yeah. He was an eagles. He was literally that you can't miss what the sky was perfect. And again, you know, and we missed I mean, we took everybody in the room was yes, he's a great player. Plays left tackle and any turned out. Be nice guard turn out and actually Aaron Kromer the offense of line. Coach of the Rams today. Put him at right tackle because we had Barry SIMS at left tackle. Who was a really good left tackle? And so we draft gallery he wasn't going to beat out SIMS. And so which made the pick even more perplexing. We could put we put them at right tackle and Cromer got him to play the best he ever played in his career. Yeah. So, but but for me walking into the raider draft room was literally a twilight zone episode. I know they brought the twilight zone back now. I wish I could because it was literally you would leave two thousand four and when you would cross that doorway you entered nineteen sixty. There were no phones in the room. There were there was a phone for him. There was no TV's in the room. I mean, no TV's TV's. You couldn't listen to Alloa Casella was the only person who was on the phone to the league office. So you had a listen to low ca- sell tell you who the pick was well that was my first year was ninety nine right by two thousand I got the internet put into the room. So I didn't have to listen to LOKI because he would say day just drafted. They just drafted and he would mispronounce the guy's name. And I would say who and he would just screw up the name, and you would have to there and deal with it. Why did not want technology and it's draft room because he's done a thousand because ole line we've always done it with technology. We're gonna keep doing it without because Sinai held him my office above my desk that when he would sit there after he worked out that said if you don't like change relevance, even less by arch since get United States army. I tried to get him to read that subliminally through that. He. Could. So that's why we never changed. Yeah. Let me just get back to that draft year. So he never really wanted rothlisburger. And he certainly never really was not his type because he wasn't a big strong, arm guy. There was really only one player that that really was in the discussion. It was Ben Rothlisberger. He was big he dominated his conference. He powerful arm. You know? And then that first game of the year we go back and play. Now north Turner just comes into the coach. So we go back and play Pittsburgh opening game. And Tommy Maddox is the starting quarterback for the Steelers that year, and we come back and make a rally in that game. Come back Maddox mix throw and we lose opening day that week, but then two weeks later Big Ben comes in and starts and leads them to the playoffs. Yeah. Imagine. How history would have been changed? If Ben Rothlisberger was the pig in that draft over Robert gallery. It's just there's so many of that conversation. Yeah. I mean, you could do that. And and and really the root of that conversation comes back to miss evaluating your own team. It isn't that you miss valuated Rosberg because we didn't he really liked. We thought rich. We we thought rich Gannon Allah. The giants think Eli manning can keep going. Yeah. And when you start having that debate when you're in that when you're in that zone of I'm not sure you're wrong. You probably should go ahead. When you think of Davis now? The late Al Davis. What do you think of an is there a classic Alston? Worry that has stuck in your brain. All these years about what it was like to work for him. You know, there's two Davis's for me in my life. The one the later years of his life were very part was he was suffering with whatever elements. He was suffering with that pain. He inflicted on other people it became very difficult to work for the early. Al davis. I learned a lot of football from that's the Davis. I remember the Davis that was. Able to have a conversation with was more giving. I think the what I remember most about Al was his unbelievable passion and his drive to. To really study as craft. I mean, it's remarkable how he would s- the discipline that he took to study his craft and the ideas that he have that he could never implement. He had some brilliant ideas. And I think the the hardest part for him was changed. And I think that that would be the one thing that I would remember is don't be afraid to change. Let me ask you about Bill Belichick and your time working with him, and what really sticks out to you about why he basically has lapped the field while they it's easy because he gets culture more than anybody. He understands how to build a culture he understands how to maintain a culture he understands how to build a team not just pick players and his work ethic is truly remarkable his ability to concentrate is truly remarkable. You know, what I tell people all the time is when he comes in when he works on something he works on that. That's what he works on. And there's no check the internet. Check the scores. His focus is remarkably concentrated on the subject at hand and his ability to to get people to follow him and to get people to do what he needs to do is remarkable. And he communicates for some. Somebody that people in the media wouldn't think he communicates very well. He's an excellent communicator. I sat on the NFL's one hundredth year all time team committee. There's about thirty people on the committee, and I was one of them and Bill was on the committee to and Bill was on the committee on the meetings. He was on the abundant us were in New York. And they were people Don shoe was on the phone Bella trick was on the phone. But what was so interesting is that? I would I would venture to guess that in a, and I I don't know how long the meeting was may be five or six hours one day. He spoke more than anybody else. He was so involved. And so interested, particularly when it came to the bulldog Turner's of the world, he was so interested in the old players from the twenties and thirties and forties. Getting the do that is a scape. Most ancient players over the years. I really thought I thought to myself listening to this. I really wish that people could hear this because he has a love of football. You know, he has a love of football, obviously. But he has such a love of football. And it really came across in that. And I think the parallels between Walsham ballot. Check are similar in that area. I mean Walsh when you get on a team bus with Bill Walsh if you had enough. Urge to get on team bus one. And he would be in seat one there to the right? And he was doodling. He was doodling wing see place or Clark Shaughnessy offense place. He had the sense of history about him. That was remarkable. And that's why today if he were alive he would look at this game today, and he would see so much of the single wing and some of these teams with the running. I mean, Baltimore really would do themselves. If you're Greg Roman and you're running the offense at Baltimore. You do yourself a favor to go back and study a lot of the single wing stuff that they ran back in the thirties and forties because it's good stuff. Just because it happened. Then it doesn't mean, you know, it's good stuff. And I think the sense of history wall, she's to say all the time. The way he created culture was marines fight for marines. And if you don't honor the past marines, how do you get the present marines to fight for you? Right. And that's Bella checks modus when you go you've been in the dining hall. There's a reason why the dining halls line with former patriot greats because when you're sitting there eating he wants you to see Choi Brown. He wants you to see Andre Tippett. He wants you to see John Hannah. He wants you to remember the wall. You know, what the air force academy when you walk to school every day. There's the giant wall of great air force cadets, you go by there and some days class, though, ask you who's on the wall, they want you to know who's on the wall and part of the creating culture is about understanding your history. And that's what Walsh and Bella check were so good at doing will finish this with Mike Lombardi, Mike as we now sit here two weeks before the draft over the years you've been in a lot of draft rooms you've prepared for a lot of. Draughts what is happening right now two weeks before the draft in draft rooms that we don't know the cleanup the the cleanup of there's two things going on. There's the top and the bottom there's the cleanup of all the medical that has to get handled to get the doctors to commit to where you really are. Where can I take this player? Where can I can't Josh sweat the defensive end from Mississippi State has that heart murmur, whatever Montas sweat Montesquieu. I'm sorry has at heart murmur. You've got to be able to handle that. And then you've got to be able to do the last workouts. Where are you going to work out who you have to work out? What coaches you need to see because and then the other factor is you got a bunch of guys coming in on visits in what you wanna do. So those three things you're really working on the top of your draft. Because look let's face it. Anybody who's picking pass ten has no idea who's going to be there? So you're still making sure you can collect the right data. And that's what you're really working on. And then you work on your free agent board like who's who could we get? That's not going to get. Rafted, and we wanna make sure we have them in the right order. Mike Lombardi, it's really been fun. I wish you well with GM shuffle. Your new podcast it. Cadence thirteen it's going to be a winner. And I also am negligent in saying, and I just brought this with me on a trip to the west coast. Recently, your book greed iron genius really has a lot of good informative stuff in there. And the one reason that I think people would really enjoy it is I think a lot of people who have been in your job. Let's say former front office guys in the NFL GM types, and then gone onto either do the meteor something else if they ever write a book or if they ever do this. I remember telling Ross Tucker when he left the NFL played with six or seven teams had a short, you know, at a Cup of coffee a couple of places, but I remember saying. Listen you were behind the curtain. You know, things you've been with great people in football. When you write about it. If you do end up doing that take us there. And that is the thing about gridiron genius. That I think you did that probably you didn't get enough credit for because in that book, you take people to meet Bill Walsh. And and all the people you've worked with in your life. So I've really I'm two thirds of the way through it now, and I've really learned a lot. Thank you. I appreciate it. And let me say this. You're you were instrumental in starting my writing career, and I appreciate that. I can still remember writing for the sl and sending you something and it had more red lines in it than than than hall Castellano over here at sparks, so. Punctuate all your help. Well, I don't know about that analogy might but we've had some good times together. But anyway, Mike Lombardi appreciate you being on the podcast and good luck with GM shuffle here at cadence thirteen. Thanks to my guest Tyler done, and Mike Lombardi if you enjoy these conversations be sure to listen and subscribe to other great episodes in my podcast series such as my conversations with Tony Romo. Chris Collins worth and Kirk cousins, you can find these on apple podcast, Google play or anywhere. You get your podcasts. And don't forget to leave a review while you're there. You can also hear the Peter King podcast on Sirius XM radio every Saturday morning at seven eastern on mad dog sports radio Sirius XM channel eighty two. Thanks to the folks that cadence thirteen for their production work, and thanks, of course, to my sponsor wicks. Please support wicks the way they support this podcast. And I'll see you next week.

Aaron Rodgers Mike McCarthy NFL Aaron Rodgers Green Bay Packers football Ted Thompson Mr. Davis Jennings Rogers Peter King Tyler Tyler raiders Greg Jennings San Francisco coach Walsh Mike Lombardi cardinals Antonio Brown Ryan grant
Full Show - Rodgers/Packers, Bucks/76ers, Magic/LeBron, Triple H interview

First Things First

1:35:16 hr | 1 year ago

Full Show - Rodgers/Packers, Bucks/76ers, Magic/LeBron, Triple H interview

"Hi, everyone. Welcome. I things worse. We have made a two day. I'm general. That's the hall of Famer Chris Carter. This is Nick right being show today. It's been a big show all week. In fact, spoiler alert. I'm always gonna start the show by telling you that. But this one really is Janas in the books. Locked up the best record in the NBA LeBron future with the Lakers now in turmoil. And apparently what happens in Green Bay doesn't always stay in Green Bay green dress. Thank you remind. He's got some stuff all around. Going up top hair. We go. A recent report says the dysfunctional relationship between Aaron Rodgers and now former head coach Mike McCarthy held the Green Bay Packers franchise back from what could have been a Brady Bella check level of success in the report stories of McCarthy's failure to update his offense of game plan, his lack of creative play calling and his lack of accountability, including reports of missing team meetings to get massages now Aaron Rodgers reportedly undercut McCarthy on the field and in public and seemingly hasn't gotten over McCarthy passing him over in the two thousand five NFL draft when he was the Niners offensive coordinator. There was a lot in this article Chris Carter some of it. I'm sure you have heard stories of. But what was your reaction to the bulk of the report that came out about these two will first of all we know that Aaron Rodgers has been a lot of things said about him and his personality is far. Is being sensitive so many other things that came out in article now as far as Mike McCarthy, we didn't hear is many things before this article came out my own personal experience with coach McCarthy is that in two thousand two at the two thousand and two season. I was leaving Minnesota, and I was a potential free agent. So I was at the Super Bowl in New Orleans. Jim hasn't was a head coach in New Orleans. Mike McCarthy was offense coordinator Hubbard Alexander who was my wife receiver coach for several years in Minnesota was the white receiver coat, and he was trying to entice me to plane one or two more years and playing with the saints at that time. So what we did was we did a little I it's not legal. But during the Super Bowl they opened up their facility, I happen to be in the neighborhood end up going meeting with the coaching staff, and I sat down with Mike McCarthy for a longtime watch film, and he 'cause I know in that situation because coz has. Has it was the head coach there him, and I had gone was we have play practice against each other in the summer. So has lit noone was impressed with my football IQ. And they wanted to see if I wanted to come play there. I was very impressed with who he was as offense of coordinator at that time McCarthy on the hottest coordinators in pro football. And it made me think about even though New Orleans didn't have the situation for me as far as the chance to win a Super Bowl, which I was looking for in that last year or two I was very impressed with what he knew football wise, and eratures has been tough on the coaches but in Green Bay, it's hard because of their structure with their their own by the by the community owns it. So is there really a voice outside of the president of the team that can really come down. So for me the dysfunction is led by the way its own. And it starts from the top with me. So I'm not gonna blame Aaron Rodgers more. Than organization now, the organization, we don't mention Newman there, but they're at fault because they didn't empower Mike McCarthy that he could be able to force Aaron to Bill learn different things. So when you don't have that power behind you, you are a coast at ultimately, the players going to have more power than you. So I don't like the structure, so I'm not going to blame Aaron Rodgers more. So than I'm ever gonna blame the organization because they drafted Aaron Rodgers, and they, cultivate, this community where they allowed Aaron Rodgers to be able to continue his behavior and not putting not not really put any pressure on him to grow into grow offense. This was a remarkable story and credit to Tyler Donna Bleacher report forgetting people on the record were on background to talk honestly about a decade of dysfunction to I didn't know that. I knew Aaron Rodgers held grudges. I didn't know he'll grudges back to in two thousand five when McCarthy was the coordinator for the Niners. He said, yeah, I think Alex Smith better than Aaron Rodgers. He'd been mad since then like, so nobody comes out of this story looking good Ted. Thompson catches some bullets Mike McCarthy, certainly doesn't look good. And Aaron Rodgers does not look good either. The reason that to me it is very easy, though, two point one bigger finger than others at the GM and the coach is because the GM and the coach are not one of one in the world at what they do. And if you are blessed enough in your organization to have someone who is in the argument for most talented or best in the world of what they do you bend over backwards to make them happy. Our boss Kette has a lot of actual technical responsibilities. A lot of things on his daily list. You know, what his number one responsibility. Every single day is make sure Chris Carter's in a good place to succeed. Because even if that's not technically on his list of things it all falls apart. If Chris is not in a good place to succeed. I am magin beyond say is a pain. To go on tour with is a pain to set things up. But when he gets out there, she performs the stories about Christian bale are legend about onset what a terror he can be. But he might be the best actor alive. So you Dan gonna make any of that? Okay. Though. Nobody it's reality. Would it be better? If everyone was Tom Brady, I might be the best in the world. And I'm a great team that much and older for the coach sure. But more often guys like that or more like LeBron I'm going to be a little bit of a pain, and I'm gonna be needy, and I'm going to be passive aggressive. But you get me eighty two games here this year fifty five, but you get me. And so we're going to deal like that is the number one job of the Packers were to make sure Aaron Rodgers was happy with the Packers and they failed at that. Well, I'm gonna totally disagree with you in the reason, why is because you came with things that the people they might be the best that their business individuals incorporate. Themselves. Now, if you decide to travel with beyond say because beyond say is the show, but we got the NFL. This is a league. We've got a team you gotta locker room, you have no locker room in those other instances, and as far as the NBA LeBron you only got eleven other guys so that personality contaminate, but an NFL locker room it we're going to continue to function of the football team. We came run our business like them. We can't coddle the quarterback just because he's good word about the left guard. He might be the best all time. What do we do? We run the ball. Now sixty times because the left guard is dominant. Like, we could go through player after player that men we got to create this system. No, it is a team in everyone's got to build a by the team to build get the best functionality out of the team. So no, I totally disagree with you. And he's not beyond say. All right. Like we've had other Aaron Rodgers before. And the thing about Beyonce's. She makes a hit hit. It's not a Super Bowl trophy. Like if you get if you. Win. I mean, whatever if you had a gold album, it's totally not the same. You can't make those comparisons. Because you have other personalities that the coach on every team saying, you know, something we're going to treat guys the light. We're going to try to treat you like grown men. We'll even like not treating him like no grown man, you're babysitting me, but you allow him to do whatever you want. It will never ever work in that would be one of the problems why they only made one Super Bowl and why they didn't have a lot of success success success success. That's why you see the peaks and valleys in what they did there in green bears little chicken and egg when it comes to who's to blame. Here is it more the lack of creative Blake on or the lack of sort of executing that lack of creative play Cousy as far as the play call into. I can only call people know. So if you restrict me which Aaron Rodgers did he said, I don't want bunch formations that mean, I don't want the wide receivers clustered in close to the quarterback because I can't see the blitz as if they're coming so errands admitting. I can't see the blitz unless their way out wide that hurts you as a quarterback because when the wide receivers out wide. There's only so many combinations of routes in teams can book you and you become far more predictable not to cut you off. But that's very important, and we're gonna dive into much more of this. But just as a step back one of the things that was mentioned in this article that is if two gotten along a little bit better had less a dysfunctional relationship. They could have had the success the patriots. Do you see like was there panel trending that way? This is where the Ted Thompson part comes in. They haven't the year. They went fifteen and one they had the thirty second ranked defense in football. That's remarkable. I saw that last night. Couldn't believe it double checked it. They they have never built the team the right way. They have the one year. They've had a great defense. They won the Super Bowl since. Then defense have been ranked thirty second eleven twenty five fifteen fifteen twenty two twenty two eighteen in playoff losses for Aaron Rodgers the divas loud. Fifty one thirty seven forty five forty four like there's they had a double digit lead in Seattle with five minutes left the team blows it multiple times. Like there's his frustration to me is warranted. Now, maybe doesn't deal with it the right way. But they were never going to be the patriots. They never belch it. They never had a full of full team. They never had Tom Brady either ashore as the would you not agree that it would. It's a little I know how the patriots run their offense into means. I know Tom Brady runs. Most of those means the reason why Tom Brady has been empowered to run those means because Tom Brady knows as much football. Is anyone in the build? You know reason why becomes Tom Brady submitted himself to learn more football, Tom Brady didn't know that. When he got there. He didn't run that system when he was at Michigan. He wasn't even successful when he was at Michigan. But since he's been in the building you say, you know, what you guys can teach me about football. So which in turn they've turned the responsibility over to him that now that key can Aaron Rodgers teaching classes in Greece. Bay because it's football. Knowledge is limited. All right. We're going to talk much more about this coming up. But on the other side, talk, some basketball Jaanus and the bucks have enough talent to make a run into title. It's next on fest one. You can always check us out on the FOX channel on Sirius XM right after this. First things I in just a few hours live in-studio WWE superstar and executive VP of talent live events and creative. Paul triple h Leveque will be with us nine AM wrestlemanias on Sunday. We got plenty to discuss with him. Not gonna wanna miss it. Stay tuned. All right. We'll get to Jaanus in the box and just a second. But first highlights presented by Hilton warriors Lakers. Steph curry gets the steel behind the back full core pass to Katie for the easy slam Chilton's back in late. Go magic man winning heart. Magic bring back Showtime magic. Okay. No problem is on his way, the degree of difficulty on that pass. And it was pinpoint. Alex Caruso rises above everyone for the put back jam that has everyone in shock, including LeBron read his lips GD. Athlete now or sets dust even trying to tell us about him ever since it was at am. I dismissed him at first he's right Caruso, fly look at him. Don't let the bold Ed fool you. To the NCWA dunk contest. Five foot eight southeastern Louisiana guard Marlin veal gets thrown off the ground over three people for the slam into these. That's the only way we can get you above the room though. We've do who's you play. Why don't you like me and someone else over me? Yes. The UK more than I'm bringing the highlights now. To highlight basketball career, but I'm gonna bring the lights. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. All right. You have one highlight you have one in game one and game dunk in my life. Let's check it out. Let's let's let's see I. I didn't get picked up like that guy. We haven't seen them lower body explosive string moving onto the biggest game of the night. Thank you box taken on the Sixers Jaanus making a strong last push for N VP, the Greek freak going off, forty five points, thirteen rebounds, six assists. Not to mention four blocks on the most unstoppable player, Joel and Embiid Milwaukee. One one twenty one twenty two to lock up the top seed in the east, Nick. Woody Johnson the bucks show us and their win over 'em in Sixers, and they did it without their second or third best player, depending on how you rank Middleton blood. So with blood still being kicked out minutes into the game. What what they showed us is what the data has shown us all year. This is the exact profile of not just a championship contender. But an elite championship team. They check every box sixty plus wins. Check the overall number one seat. Check the probable league MVP. Check. Super League on both ends of the court top three offense number one defense and also shooting three and defending the three they are as good as any team in the league at that. And they have a legitimate home court and a veteran coach that is for all of MBA history. You need about five of those seven they have all seven of them, Catherine doar health. Well, they so the health is a question, Mark. But the guys they've had the injuries to aside from brogden aren't what I would call the key contributors. Now, I know mirror Tich was a guy they were happy. They got it the deadline, but they were killing people before they added miratec and site and even chins, oh, they think any or all of those guys potentially could be back come the conference. I think because the roles they play Jinnah those injuries become the most important issue because that's one of the other things that makes this team special. If we wanna project all the way through the Eastern Conference and into the finals, the re. Reason why they would have a chance not just because of those stats is because the players that they have. It's just not, oh, they got one of the guys Mira church. We believe and has proven himself in playoff series to be an effective shooter and build a space to court. And when you look at who their star is and what those other guys bring to Bill open up the court for him. That's why those injuries you have to. They're not on that list as far as positives. But it is the most important thing if you asked a question about the Milwaukee Bucks now is how healthy will they be? Because after healthy, they are definitely the best team in the east and they've got a winning record against everybody winning record against Indiana. Boston Philly Toronto all those teams. Those those are the teams that will play in the second and third round two of those three teams zero against Houston two zero against Denver. They split the season series with Golden State. So there's not any team that they could play in a playoff series that where they could be tested because in the first round they won't be tested. They already have. Winning record against those teams. They I you if it were not the Kevin Durant. Boogie cousins. Steph Klay warriors. We would say the bucks are the big favorites. They would be the big favorites. They are they have the profile of the rockets team last year, but with more depth and with a player less reliant on the whistle now. That's not shade on James harden. But James harden, one of the yeah. Buts about him going into postseason is will the whistle change Janas and last night Janas hit some threes. And if he hits threes, there's no guarding him not so ever now. I don't think he's typically gonna hit threes. His around twenty two percent on the year. Let's nineties shot seven of a made three which makes him totally unguarded. Yeah. The one thing though, too is it's not only making the threes but shooting threes because there were times Philadelphia backed off of him play them dared him to shoot. Now for me. It's not a percentage thing with me. It's how many attempts because if he shooting because he's so different than any. Other superstar we have he can get to the bucket his mid rain game mid range game too strong, but his post up. That's the most surprising part of his game to me like I thought of insa Bill to shoot affectively which he's doing, but his post up in how strong he is like they had to put Jolan beat to try to quiet him down. So it's it's amazing to watch overall development. And I'm surprised by how much game is he bullied Ben Simmons again member when they played the last time, he call Ben Simmons a baby or something. Yeah. Him down on the block. We're talking about it this morning in the fourth quarter about midway through the fourth. He takes him down on the baseline. And Ben Simmons is a big guy that criticism been Simmons Brown's body or strength and yon is just three separate times drops shoulder. Elbow into him to get space to then dunk on Janas is development of his strength has made him into. He was a fringe MVP. Candidate last year. It's the body that has made him now the MVP favourite after night like last negative Nellie. But I am worried about that ankle. It has now flared up twice already just wanna make sure that he's strong, and he's good as they hit the play of you won't have to play again this year, if you don't want to because they locked up the one seed, so in that regard that helps them, okay? But let's talk about the other side with the Sixers are you concerned after what you saw last night that this team isn't playoff ready not concerned last night's game. They were shorthanded Jimmy Butler wasn't in the game. And this game coming down it's possession here or there. You know, they get a couple of stops late in the game. Make a couple threes late in the game. Philadelphia can win this game. So no, I'm not going to overreact to last night's game. But to me, they have some obvious problems JJ Riddick. I thought was sensational last night the offense that they're starting to try to run for him to get him some open looks because it's going to help Joel the but still I'm gonna be consistent Benson's. He's a problem when you have more turnovers in your point guard you have. More turnovers than you have field goals. It's going to be a problem. Only took five sacks last night. After playing what thirty minutes thirty six minutes five shots. So now, what type of confidence is he going to have coming into playoffs shooting a basketball? So to me ongoing thing their point guard. I believe that he hinders them as far as being one the league team. So I'm the obviously, I'm not as concerned about the Ben Simmons part of this. Because to me last night was not about a lack of offense scored one hundred twenty two points last night was they allowed seventy two second half points and forty six in the fourth quarter sees point that also they didn't have one of their best players in Jimmy Butler. They've only played ten games with their starting five. This starting by the chills to be one of the best in the league Tobias Harris, Jimmy Butler, Ben Simmons, Joel and beaten JJ, right? Ken games? They've only now they're eight and two in those ten but they're going to go into the playoffs. Not really having a feel for each other where the playoffs will help them. I believe is the if you don't. A ton of depth. That is not as big of a deal come the postseason because playoffs in beads not playing thirty six he's going to be playing forty and device hairs gonna be playing thirty. He's playing thirty six. So you're everybody's been shrinks you need. Mike Scott coming off the bench, and you need one other guy. They got Zaire Smith the rookie who hadn't played most of the year. He's getting back into the rotation. But the east is very very strong. And in the second round there's going to be to good teams that go home Philly right now would be an underdog against Tronto who they play in the second round. They would need been SIMS on wheel. But Embiid and Butler to be one the big issues when you don't have a bench is you can't sustain any injury. Right. All right. So there's very few teams going to go through the playoffs because it's too intense. You do sustain injuries, but I've much rather Jolan BB playing thirty six thirty four minutes like Janas been playing compared to push him to forty minutes in the playoffs. And the reason why you do is like short guy, you know, some heights over rate. Oh a good benches overrated. Because you don't have one, and that's Phillies excuse they gotta take a break outs. Making it form on out west has Magic Johnson derailed. Lebron's west another title. That's next. On sunday. We're soul for some bumping and grinding on the short-track the Coliseum. The green flag drops Jewish turn on one. And the Fox Sports at time for us to go viral. So last night Jaanus in the bucks got the best of the seventy Sixers. However, there was a special guest in the house for Philly. Check this out the three hundred thirty million dollar man, new Phillies outfielder rice Harper did not get booed had the honour a ringing the bell before the game. Let me here come on. How you gonna do Bryce? Come on. Bell ring. You're putting the great on it. I'm just letting I wanted to see it. I saw when the you said there was special guests in the building. And I saw that picture there. I was like, oh, hey, I was there. But no it's Bryce Harper stepping up right there. Yes. And Bryce Harper wearing number three in Philadelphia. That's a big deal. I resent. Of course, then also Carson Winston him sat in the box watching the Sixers play. So thick night in Philadelphia staff show will be in Philadelphia for some weakened playoff games. Chris making some plans Jenner you be Philly men last time you there. God he'd up. I'm popular in Philly with the basketball fans the football fans. Don't like me as much basketball fans. I'm good with. No, you he believes bin Simmons has a beautiful. I did that AT and T wake of final four tips off tomorrow Auber taking Virginia and then Texas Tech battles. Michigan state. See who do you like to make the final? Okay, right. From the top coach Izzo. He's got me a little slim at towards him. Now, the it. They're going to face is going to be second to none in Texas Tech. I look for the Spartans to Bill to get through and Virginia last several years on the most talented teams in college basketball haven't reached their potential. I really liked their coach believe he's underrated gets a lot of criticism. So I'd like Virginia to build get. I liked Virginia. You get through as well. Sports, very often, works and storylines. The Spurs lose a championship on the reality shot and then lose game seven the next year. Come back and win at Virginia. I one seed ever lose to a sixteen the following year. Make it all the way to the championship game. I think they will the other game to me is as close as it can get Jarrett. Colder will be the best player on the court in the Michigan state Texas Tech game. But Zion was the best player in the court and Michigan state one. I liked the same. Finals you the two favorites. Michigan state in Virginia matching up Monday night moving onto Zay on as you mentioned who won't be playing in the final four this weekend. His focus shifted to counting money. A former Nike and Adidas executive said, he expects Zion to Landay one hundred million dollar shoe. See Zion worth all that money before ever playing single game in the NBA if you look at the hype surrounding him, if you're a shoe company, and you're in the business of signing stars. Let's just you can't predict what's going to becoming a college basketball. The next two three ten years. You gotta get him sign based on the competition. Now, I don't believe he's as marketable as LeBron was and our Jordan the best ever merchandise in ever in the history of anything. He will never rival that. But man, you got to get him in your shoes. Specially after the blowout, man. He blew out the shoot with the Nike man, if you are another company, and you can you can snatch him away from Nike. It would be a huge. You laughed at me when I said he's gonna pass. Lebron? But not when you adjust for inflation. That's exactly what's going to happen. Lebron was seven years eighty seven million from Nike comes straight out of high school. I think zion's going to be eight years one hundred million. And I think it's going to be Nike. I know there are some rumors. There's going to be the Chinese shoe company that gets in Japan zion's, not clear Thompson, he's going Nike or is going to deduce. My guess is that Nike pays a premium to get him after that shoe got blown out which was a Nike, but he's going to get a hundred million. Let's move on from the Boston Celtics. Now, Boston season has been tumultuous at times. But Kyrie Irving says there is nothing to worry about commenting that his relationship with Brad. Stevens has grown tremendously. So neck are the Celtics real threaten the east. I don't think they're real threat. And we'll see how he feels after tonight tonight the four seeds on the line Boston, Indiana play other that they're right now tied in the standings, Indiana wins they base lock up that four seed which would mean Boston would start this playoffs on the road. Could they win a first round series? Yes. Do I? Think Boston's a threat to beat Milwaukee in the second round, absolutely not. And if this Boston teams one and done or even to done in the playoffs. Then all those good feelings go away. Immediately kyri said I'm just waiting for the playoffs. Let for his sake. You hope that playoff experiences along one. I don't think it will. I it's nice to hear that the relationship is growing just like any other relationship in the second year in the first year, really what kind of sample that we have with kyri being hurt. Now they face some real adversity. And even if the relationships not improving men, I'm glad he's saying that that's what you should. Yeah. Lie to the people absolute I big fan of that. If you need to lie lie to the people to true sandwich. James harden beard is averaging over thirty six points a game to go along with six and a half rebounds, seven and a half assists, not about resume for what could be back to back MVP seasons. But with his crafty step ax has never ending foul shots many wondering if it's how the game should be played case in points. Announcer. Don mclean. Just feel like rob this style. Were harden does is manipulating the game somehow like almost like cheating it somehow. I don't really have a thought beyond that other than I'm watching something that isn't basketball like to me basketball player movement all new design plays not to walk it up and ice late. And every time I just feel like did then that's what brought up that point earlier that who else could do this. It's not like he's. It's not like within the system. He's getting all these numbers consistent of good for him. All right, Nick, we make what clean said, Don McLean. If he knows about cheating the game in basketball. He he is one of the experts the first player in NBA history was suspended for steroids. But that's neither here nor there. Let's talk about what he actually is saying there, which is just don't like it. It doesn't fit my sensibilities. We'll basketball should be. I don't have much else to say. I just don't like it. That is the honest opinion of most James harden, critics just don't like it. I'll tell you this. I like watching Russell Westbrook more than I like watching Steph curry Ivein, Russell style for more, entertaining and exciting, but then doesn't make me come on television. Like man, Steph curry is kind of cheating like shoot from thirty five feet. And that's not what I grew up watching basketball that you have to respect this skill. That harden has perfected Darrow Maury came on this show over a year ago and said, I believe James harden is the best one on one isolation player ever. That's no longer even. Controversial opinion. I think a lot of people believe James Harden's, the best isolation player ever the team wins. When he plays this style. Their season was on the brink of disaster until they went with a harden exclusive offense, but the real criticism of harden is exactly that it's an aesthetic one. It's not an effective criticism. It's not it's a sell. It is just to my I don't like it. And Don McLean said it said made the subtext text there in acknowledging that's the only real criticism of Hardin right now. Yeah. He really couldn't go deepen explain it. Now, he's accomplished basketball player. You mentioned the time. He was suspended. I player suspended for taking steroids. Now. He was a movement player. He was a jump shout player. So he wasn't very very athletic. Even though he played a thing double digit years in 'em BA. So first of all explain his game. And the reason why aesthetically it might not be pleased to to him is because he's about movement. He's always he's going to be more effective playing on a team. That's going to move the ball people pick and for him. So he can get shot shadow. So I understand that. And he's got a right to opinion. So it's not a matter of being right or wrong. Now, he said, this is just my opinion. I can't give you a deep dive on examples. Typically, if I have a strong opinion, I try to give you some examples of the reason why I believe that. Now, the reason why I believe opposite a him is because the game of basketball is about scoring the basketball in stopping them from scoring a basketball. No matter how you can do it. The reason why they put the three point line on the basketball court was so that you could open up the court and Bill to take advantage of the skill set that we see people now I'm not from the camp of Nick, there's no way if I'm paying money I'm going to see Steph curry play compared to Russell. So it is a style preference thing to both of change harden is one of the great SCO. Cores that we've ever seen in all the great scores for the most part. You know, what they were isolation players now, this is the first time they have allowed someone to dominate the ball as much as him and still be an isolation, but the greatest player ever, Michael Jordan up and down up and down. Yes. But I suppose it at the end today. That's how Michael Jordan really got his name Coby being Bryant isolation player. James harden is just an extension of them. And where he was wrong about the system. No this system wasn't create it for him. He was put in to to to Dan Tony system. That was very effective. Nash was MVP. They put up great numbers. But harden in the system, they said, you know, we're gonna change the system little bit. This guy is so special. So the system has evolved around hardens ability to, you know, some I'm going to lift weights to make sure that I can still have the endurance leading games. I'm at work. My ball handling. I'm a work on finishing at the rim. All those things that you know, the the nounce should give him credit for because he has mastered those skills, what makes it more impressive to me is that he hasn't had an entire system built around him. But they have changed the system that Dan Tony system to perfectly show his individual skill set. You know, what other team did that this year the Milwaukee Bucks on defense? The Milwaukee Bucks built an entire defensive system. Took bud system. Tweaked it entirely built around a singular talent Jaanus his skills defensively with the way he can move on the court his length what he can do when you been system to your abilities. That shows how great of a player, you are and the effectiveness of isolation basketball. If you have a great isolation player and four shooters about as officially of a way you can play off into basketball now. It's not as pretty as the warriors ball movement passing system. I understand that. But the reason that this irked me, and I think other people it's because he used the word. It's like he's cheating the game. He's not cheating the game. He has hacked the system to a degree. He has figured out a way to exploit freedom of movement three being worth more than two modern NBA basketball more than anyone else and of other people could do it. They would do it. No one in the league's average more than twenty eight except for him was averaging thirty six and his team right now could be the two seat in the west. Like, there's no argument against the effectiveness of it. All right. Let's move on to the Lakers tumultuous year that has been their season with LeBron missing the playoffs for the first time in fourteen years. Focus shifted to the future who will be the next head coach which big name will free agent pair with the king. And are the beaches in L A really that nice. Lot of probing questions. One NBA scout has ripped the Lakers future. Saying magic has destroyed that place. Ace see agree. Magic johnson. You trust him rather to restore the Lakers. This is the thing. And I've been Noah magic long time since since I was a kid got a lot of respect for him. He's had tremendous amount of success. But I question the Billy to build what we would call success in Los Angeles with magic. Now if there was other supporting cast around magic Ginny bus, she capable being owner. Well, I mean, what do you have to be capable of doing because she's the one that hired magic. So she's the one hired them. She can't make the basketball decisions. So magic to make all the basketball ball decision. So do I think him, and rob Pelinka are out there pounding the pavement looking for that little bit of an edge that, you know, something this is going to get us over. No, do I think that they're basketball philosophy is transcendent to the NBA. Am I concerned hail? Yeah. I'm a Lakers fan. I I would be concerned because it's not just the big time free agents. It's the glue. It's though no-one the salary cap little intricacies that you know, we can get this player for this. You know that we can put this guy on this type of contract. Those type of things win you a championship. Now, he's going to be under the microscope. But they're nothing has happened. And I knew LeBron was coming to LA no matter who was there. Okay. Lebron was coming to Laker. So no one can take credit for that. I've been concerned from the beginning that all these little small things that LeBron in both places that being the second trip to Cleveland and his first trip to Miami. He had people take care of those things for him and people wanted to join LeBron because the system and how they were playing right now. Now there you know by taking no reduce salary. Join the Lakers LeBron. But that was critical in Cleveland in that championship those players at the end, you know, some men I will go there. The rate Allerton critical in Miami. All the man in the chemistry that they had their the faith. They had in the front office. No Jenna, I'm so I hate to do it. But I'm concerned as the Lakers fan. I'm concerned as someone is watching the NBA. And and know that those little things are very very important or issue. Chris was concerned before LeBron and the Lakers wherever attached the day. The Lakers hired Magic Johnson, Chris. And I were both living in L A at the time. Didn't even know you yet gentlemen, not living together living. Not living together. It's been a lot of time. It is place a little nights in the months, but a lot of time it is place. But I remember when it happened. And Chris said man, magic ease a great face of the business. But that doesn't mean he's in the weeds on these businesses that doesn't mean, he's the detail guy. And so when you hire magic, it's one thing, I think he could be Pat Riley, a really sharp guy, but let me take Miami for Pat Riley edition, meaning sharp guy is the face then they got a guy named Andy Ellsberg who's the brains of that operation there cap guy. They also have people that came up like SPO did the brand. The brand. Another basketball. You know, big time guy that understands the ins and outs of the NBA that they have his ear. Your guy Danny age is the face of the operation in Boston. You know, the brains are to Mike Zahren nano. It's it's Meigs. Erin it. It's rare that the my pal in Houston, Darryl. He's he's maybe not always the best public face of the operation. But he's the face and the brains of the operation, but even he has a guy named garrison roses who might go become a GM somewhere this year. So the magic not gonna be on the hot seat, but maybe rob Linke's because you have redundancy there you have two guys who would be very good forward faces. And nobody in the weeds doing the work could the Lakers this off season. Go say, hey, Mike, Zahren, you wanna be our GM? Hey Carson roses. You wanna be our GM magic soobee team president because rob Lincoln magic filled the same role relationship guy. Good looking guy charming guy. Guy that can get you in the room with anybody, rob because of his relationships being agent being Kobe's former agent and magic because he's magic. Leaping johnson. Like all that makes sense. But who is doing the work because even if the Lakers trade, let's say they trade for Anthony Davis. Well, they're gonna have a whole roster to Bill they're going to be trading away. All their young guys bright, and I'm just saying to the latest evidence the trade of the big man of the Lakers did that the zoo criminal it e the just real quick, this is an anecdote. Oh, but it's important. It was after they had already been criticized for all these bad off season moves thirty two million dollars combined for Rondo, Casey, Beasley in jail that disaster that that was at the deadline. They think we're gonna make a playoff push. We need an open roster spot. They could just wave, Michael Beasley. He and tried to fight the coach. Yes. So you could just wave him. Instead, they call the clippers unprompted and say, we'll give you zoo Botts, if you'll take Beasley along with him. And we want must Mike Mus Scala because we're going to end shooting. It was essentially zoo box from scholar trade. Are you kidding me, the clippers Jerry was talked about it? I guess what was reported. He talked about it that he went to dinner next said, you won't believe it. I didn't even call the Lakers. They called me over me, some I said, yes and hung up the phone like those types of things who is the smart guy there. Right. And so I'm not saying those guys aren't smart. But who's the smart guy? I don't know. I we're gonna break they're coming up to Jonah's lockup Hamby last night. That's still ahead on person. Back here. First things first, we're joined by former all pro running back, Brian Westbrook. Good morning, Brian happy Friday to you. Good to have you here today. Yeah. Needed it. Okay. All right time to get fresh trying to be like UCLA China for the week. That weekend. Ryan the Rams had one of the most high powered offenses in the league last year. We probably mentioned that at least three hundred times all season long putting up just three points in the Super Bowl fifty three and handing the patriots their six Super Bowl title has left a bad taste in their mouths. Rams. All pro offense. Tackle Andrew Whitworth. Coming back for his fourteenth season to answer the teams biggest question, how can we respond? I've rhyme. What's going to be the biggest challenge facing the Rams usually we talk about hangovers from a winning team coming back the next season. You know about a losing team trying to come back the next season and compete and do it better. You're laughing. I do know about. Gonna be able to talk about it. Let me just wear my ego. Green. And then ask you. Talking about being tough. Here's the thing. I mean to play at that levels championship level to get to the Super Bowl. It's hard to do repeatedly. Especially if you're not rewarded if you're not rewarded you didn't win that game. And I think the Rams have to take their play to the next level. They have to go to the next level. If they want to even give that teams in their division are getting better San frans- getting better. I think Seattle will come back even stronger next year. So they're going to have a harder road to get to that same point. I think the Rams have a couple issues they lost a couple offense alignment in the off season. And the health of tog early is probably the biggest concern. How do they keep him healthy? We talk about with top was able to do all season long. Obviously one of the best running backs in the league all season playoff the most important time with the season. He wasn't available. He just didn't get it done in the last two games of the season. And that's why they ended up losing. They did Todd Gurley is the engine that makes. Offense work. Sean McVay does a lot of window-dressing does a lot of fancy stuff. Pre snap talks whose quarterback longer than any other. Okay. Great. What you have is the best running back in football. And I saw video of him courtesy of our friends at TMZ last night limping to his car a guy who we are now in the April fifth and his knee does not appear. He doesn't appear healthy just walking around the reports that he is arthritis condition in his knee. That ain't great like that is as concerning to me as any offseason storyline. There is this is a great young player worthy of his draft. Right. I mean worthy of his draft status worthy of that contract worthy to be considered as a running back league MVP, and we're three months removing last football game. And he's limping around. That's to me the biggest concern bigger concern than golfing year, four bigger concern than replacing the talent that's going to leave on defense is what about Todd girl. Lease knee. And would we've had a different Super Bowl. If Todd Gurley was Todd Gurley. The reason why the Rams are so explosive down the field and just put it on teams offensively because they average one hundred and thirty now yards rushing and every single game able to run the ball that we'll talk early able to get the catch the ball out of the backfield. Then that user play action pass to get down the field to the receivers, and they continue to beat up on teams that way because teams had respect Todd Gurley. You're talking to the last two games. C J Anderson Todd Gurley combined for one hundred eleven yards rushing in the last two. This is a team that average one hundred thirty nine yards per game. They just weren't able to do it physically in the run game. The other thing is this when you're talking about a team that that that throws the ball the way that they did team said, okay? Listen this where we're going to do we're going to allow you to run the ball a little bit. We're not going to suck up when the play action pass it. We're gonna make you nickel and dime. All the way down the field, Jared Goff ta and McVeigh. They were not willing to do that. They were impatient at times and they're often suffer because of that. Let's talk about the last game. We saw you talked about the last couple of games inability to build a run the football. That's the patriots in suppo fifty three. And then a NFC championship game against the saints. It seemed like later in the season teams had them booked offense of Lii and defensively and we're ready for the Rams attack. So huge concerns about Todd Gurley. My concern is with with McVeigh in what type of adjustments will they make defensively because in the Super Bowl didn't have a linebacker started that way, more in two hundred and thirty pounds, and Sean McVay everyone likes him and everything. Nice young Cote. He got out coaching that Super Bowl Bill Bill. Check looked at his roster and sit Corey Lewellen two hundred twenty eight pounds. We're going to run at him. Mark, barron. Oh, he was a safety at Alabama. And with the Rams earlier we're going to run the ball right down their throat right over in Don, Mcgann, sue and Aaron Donald Aaron Donald twenty-six during. Regular season. No sacks in the playoffs. So those are adjustments that I'm looking for the Rams to try to build a half to make in. Now, they got that first place scheduled. They got a lot of eyeballs on them. How will they react last year? They reacted free agency people. It was like oh man this locker room they did. Well, it's far as that. But they have to build a make some jesmyn. If Todd Gurley is not one hundred percent. And I doubt that we're ever going to see the Todd Gurley that we did. That's why you see him limping at this point. I do believe that he has a arthritic, knee and guys don't recover from that. So Now, Sean McVeigh do with Jared golf. But that defense you gotta get bigger. Because in the biggest game that you play Bella check out coach shoot out scheme. You by simplifying the game is I'm bigger I'm stronger new we're going to fight this game in a phone booth. And that's how the patriots won to win in the playoffs. You have to be able to run the football and stop the run. They weren't able to do. Either at battled a bad knee my entire career to eighteen ninety six. And I know it doesn't get better as you get older it gets harder and harder every single week to get out there and play it gets harder and harder to participate and help your team. I'm concerned about tiger. This you we know how competitive the divisions gonna be yes, they're gonna have a first place schedule this year. But there's gotta be an emotional toll. He's got to be an emotional toll. It takes on you. When you worked so hard to get to the Super Bowl you came up short. And now, you gotta all go back to the starting point and try to all over again. And you have really nothing to show for it. Except that you got there. I mean, how hard is that what you were talking about it? It's one it's hard to start a new season over no matter what. But when you have as long season as you can have work as hard as you can work, and it doesn't get paid off. In fact, instead of it being paid off you deal with the most crushing loss of your athletic life to then come in. Okay. It's all his first training camp with you're right? That's the absolute harp part. Because you saying, hey, my body's already tired of loss of month of extra time that I could rest, and then I have to work Justice are probably a little bit harder. Because just like you mentioned they're going to get the one of the hardest schedules in the league this season is going to be a tough task form. It's going to depend on Sean McVay get this team ready jerk off is going to have to carry them. Just a little bit more than he did. I Bill back to because look on the other side of the story glasses more than half full. There's only one. Team had a better season to those. And that's the team that would world champions the season before they've made great progress getting into the playoffs when playoff game going on the road beating the saints huge go and most of their core players are younger players. So they got a lot to look forward to so expect the Rams the be there. They just have to make the Justice that are need to be made when you lose the Super Bowl which other teams haven't responded great to in years past. All right. Final say a little later on on the show. Take a break. Coming up did Jaanus in the box purvey can make a title Ron with a win over the Sixers last night that his next this person. Welcome back to first things. First triple h one of the biggest stars in the history of professional wrestling from his Ron is a co founder of degeneration next to his epic battles with the likes of the rock. Stone cold Steve Austin, the undertaker John CENA, the four-time fourteen time world champion has been synonymous with WWE for nearly three decades where lucky to be joined by Paul triple h Leveque now Paul thanks so much. Doodo some three decades. That's why kind of mumbled over that part. Three decades is a long time. How much worse. Emphasize the point out. How much has changed since you broke onto the scene everything? Yeah. Just everything from from from the start of it to the wave fans interact. You know, the internet has changed all of that. It's really twenty four seven now they're into your lives and everything, but just the business it sell from where we are as a company from how we relate and take care of our talent to our wellness policies to are just every component of it. The performers are professionals the every aspect of what they do has been raised to another level of professionalism. And and you see that across the board. And it's carried over in everything we do with our partners and be C. You Fox Sports. You know, it's it's it's now just it's where it should be not Paul. You have a unique perspective because being involved in three different decades. Like you seen it evolve. Not only from being right there. As one of the stars won the found their founding on you and your ability. But now you're on the business is so give me a little bit. What's changed from the athletic side of things? And now you're trying to transfer. You're putting on a total different hat on the business side in that typically with athletes, which struggle trying to manage that transitioning over I always had a fascination with a bind the scenes of the business, even when I was a performer, and what it took can what it would take you to to do to get to that next level. For me. I've watched that transition as you said from starting out at wrestlemainia, I wasn't there. But as a fan watching wrestlemainia one closed, circuit television, Madison Square Garden to where we are. Now, you know stadium shows, you know, it transitioned from close circuit to pay per view doing stadium shows on our own OTT network, the WWE network, and you can watch wrestlemainia this Sunday or or takeover an takeover tonight from the Barclay center on our W W network on any device, you have a phone computer, you television. It doesn't matter. You can stream it to anywhere. You know, that that transition has been amazing. But for me to be on the business side of it. Now trying to find that next level of athlete when I started in the business, you really there was no path to get to the WWE. It was like saying I wanna be a trapeze or do you start my job? Now, a big part of it is trying to give that path to people to to go to every country around the world and look for athletes, whether they come from Kabbadi or cushy or or something in India to whether they're martial arts around the world or Olympic athletes are strowman. It doesn't matter. We're looking everywhere for them and giving them that pathway an opportunity to come to the WWE training them out of our performance center in Orlando and turning them into the superstars tomorrow. And that systematic plan has been the biggest change probably fundamentally in our business. And we're gonna talk more about the next part of your business and a moment, but I want to I don't want people to be full now that picture that we have right there. I don't know win that. Picture was taken. But they're going to be taking a similar picture here at wrestlemainia like we were talking off the air. In addition to being the business side of things. I mean, you're fighting Batista on at wrestlemanias. So you have to also be training twice a day. You said to get ready for that tell us about what you expect in that match while you I mean, you're kind of his boss, but I don't think he's going to care in the moment in the no holds barred match wrestlemainia. Oh, yeah. It might make it worse. You know, how do you really prepare to step into the ring with drags the destroyer from guardians of the galaxy? Right. It's it's a it's a difficult thing. But Thiessen I have a long history. He's one of the most physical guys in the business and. To your point. I I wear a suit on a daily basis now stay in shape, but to get ready for something like getting in the ring with Dave in front of seventy five thousand people at MetLife stadium. This sunday. It's a whole different level of preparation, and I'm coming off of an injury at the end of last year where I tore my back in in the Middle East and trying to come back from that when you closing in on fifty in at the tail end of it, and this point the opportunity for for me to step in front of our fans on that level. There's no experience legged in the world. I don't care. What else you do the the energy excitement? The if you step into that to MetLife stadium on Sunday, you can cut that tension with a knife that feel that probable energy that just there's nothing else like our fan base in the world excited. I got one in the commercial break. He did say you work out. You did. I thought you Burke's on the floor. It's in my contract that I'm no longer allowed to win you're in the room, but I will tell you. It is exciting to know that for the first time a a women's match will be the main event wrestlemainia, Ronda Rousey of Charlotte, flare. Becky Lynch will all be competing to take him to championship belts. How important how important are women to the future now of the WWE? Tim stated enough, you know, they they are every bit as important as everybody else. And that's the thing to me. I think to even say the women versus the men now, I just I wish we just say superstars because they're all equal. It's it's what the biggest event is. What's the biggest match? What's the biggest promotional element because the athletes ISM, the heart, the desire, everything they put into it is the same, you know, and as the world has become more accepting of of female athletes, and their place in the world WWE has been able to step into that? Because we've had the athletes they're ready to go, and our male talent are supportive of them. Right. The ki they've embraced it as much as they want to be the main event this Sunday at wrestlemainia, you see these guys saying, well, I want to be the main event, but they deserve to be the main event just as a quick follow up. How important is it for you? Because you're out there recruiting talent. Yeah. I mean, you're picking the groceries. So you're out there. You're in control of the how important is it for you that we see some type of Bali. As far as the mail in the female. It's it's massive. When when I first started that process with our developmental system. Even NFL I didn't understand it just was foreign to me the difference. Why are we training women differently? Why are we doing this differently? I wanna recruit athletes that can do this better than anybody else. I want the same charisma the same dedication the same professionalism. The men have we're going to train them the exact same way. And then we'll just going to give him a platform. And when we've given them that platform, they've knocked it out of the park every single time. I'm more often than not watch in annexed t-, raw smackdown. Wrestlemainia more often than not watch the guys watching the women's match going. I'm gonna have to step it up. You know what I mean? Let's talk more about inex- t takeover of people aren't familiar or as familiar with their seven tonight seven eastern, I should say on WW network. It's become I would say right there on the business side of things for you, a huge part of your legacy. Some people always know you as triple h in the pedigree and all of that. But on the business side. This is first paragraph type of stuff when they're describing who you've been what you've explained a little bit. Why it's so important, but tell us a little bit more about not only the importance, but the process for you in finding these next generation of superstars as you. As you go through the world, and you recruit you find this next level of of athlete, and and you tried to train them and give them go. The thing you have to do is then give them the platform to succeed on and it'll make them stars. And exte- does that. And as we start in the brand very quickly became massively popular became our third touring brand we do two hundred live events in year our takeover events sell out the trend globally worldwide. It's. Let us to starting a UK version of the annex t brand that's based there. And and we'll do that around the world, but it has become in essence for me. It was going out in creating the college football feeder system to the NFL. And that is exactly what we did with this. And you see that right now on Ron smackdown. Eighty percent of that roster. Lebron's smackdown came directly out of annex t they were already stars to a large portion of our fan base that got moved up into rawal smackdown. You'll see almost all the magic set except I think one or two that happened to have thirty year veterans in them. They came out of that system all these matches. This the superstars that you. See of today came from there the superstar of tomorrow, you will watch tonight on takeover and much like in college football or anything else you can feel their hunger. They are here, and they're trying to get to here, and there hunger and their passion, and they're driving desire to get to that next level. It's it really shows in the in the product on because I came up in your ear in that a two-tier and when I came up there was the Monday night wars. There was raw was the biggest thing going, and then smackdown came along was I was at I don't know. What was the first ever one of the first number smackdown? Vince was in Kansas City. I remember being there in my teenage years beat up the raw. And then I'm sure you do. And so, but but I I remember being I might have been the first, but regardless now smackdown coming to FOX. Starting. I think it's Tober fourth Friday October fourth. It is become any norm. As part of your guys success. Can you tell the a little bit about the growth of smackdown in the importance of it? It's been huge. You know, the one thing with Debbie fan base, Debbie universe. Seemingly the more. We give them the more they want, and when we gave them smackdown was debate internally. Do we really need another show, and we gave them smackdown? They gravitated towards it. The shows inherently have a slightly different field. But I can tell you as important as it has been this opportunity for us with FOX and step to another ole mother level, and what FOX brings to the table as the the kind of permanent brand for for sports out there and putting sports out there. They are the leaders. And when it comes to that us to be on there and have that backing and the partnership of, you know, the NFL games and NC double A and major league baseball and everything that sits within that world for us to be a part of that. And to connect to that is massive for us in vice versa. We'll bring an entertainment component. And that you see often copied in sport. We'll bring that to the table as well. So while I think smackdown has been massively important wait until October fourth October fourth on FOX singles your whole 'nother level. This thing. Smackdown will become bigger than anybody could have ever imagined it because of this partnership it's going to it's going to be incredible do now get to break a little news that should get the WWE universe buzzing beginning this fall right here on one. We'll be launching a new weekly WWE studio show on Tuesday nights completely separate from smackdown. We're just talking about the shows gonna discuss everything going on in WWE universe, including smackdown. Monday night raw. Yes. Triple h your baby and exte- more details to call. We don't wanna spill all the beans, but the show will feature some faces very familiar to the WWE universe spoke from the past and the present there you have it AAA ch-. What do you think? This is something we wanted to happen for a long time. I think this is the perfect opportunity for a studio show for us. You know, it kind of because of the sports entertainment as of it. It's an endless show where you're talking about the athlete component of it. It's also an entertainment, right where you talking about where things are going and the story lines in the characters and all of it. This is going to be one of those shows that if you are a WWE fan across the board. This is the show that will be can't miss because it's going to talk about everything you love in a way that you can't get any place else existed anywhere. Boards and things people discussing this type of thing, but someone recognizing there's the leading part of it. But then there's the storyline aspect which is really what brings people back every week. They've never had this type of professional official analysis weekly basis. Take people deeper into the personal lives and the data days of what goes on behind the scenes to being WWE superstar and all everything that goes with that success that failure that heartbreak that's all that that elation of wrestlemainia moments all of it to see that all take place here. But in a way, this never been shown before I I can't wait. Back here for things I were joined by f s one NBA analysts, Chris Broussard, good morning. Chris. Would you death of people? Now, what do you guys I sneeze earlier? And so I would feel badly. Shaken his HALE, we hadn't get you a tissue. It wouldn't be for curtain. Those joe. I. In last night show box taken on the Sixers yon is making a strong last push for MVP, non the Greek freak went off, forty five points, thirteen boards, six assists. Not to mention four blocks on the most unstoppable player. Joel Embiid, so Milwaukee one one twenty one twenty two they lock up the top seed in the east Broussard Woody Jaanus in the buck show us in their win over the Sixers last night Yaman showed us that. He is definitely the MVP. A and not only that I usually don't give this award away or this title away official. Here we go until the layoffs because you got to get it done in the postseason. He's the best player in the world. He did it every single way. It could be done last night. He drove to the bucket. He posted up. He hit me rain shots. He hit three point shots. He blocked the best big man in the league four times. He led the fast break he had eleven points in the fourth quarter. He had a latest sit. I mean what else could he do and his his guy. Eric bledsoe. Went out with remain is left critic Middleton was limited to twenty five minutes. So we hear all the talk about harden and what he did without three. And Clint Capella I mean, clearly yon is if he had to I'm not saying he put up hard and thirty six points the game, but he could do more. And so this guy is in. We never seen anything like it. We talk about Kevin Durant. We've never seen anything like him. We talk about. He's talked about Porzingis a unicorn this guy, and he hit three three pointers last night. I mean once he gets that down to what thirty five percent in a few years. I mean, this is unbelievable. What we're watching? So I'm not ready to say either of the things that you said, but damn it's close. Like, I think harden harden has such strong MVP k still to me and he's still vote for Yannis. I what's gonna happen in what three or four game. Correct. It's probably there's probably not going to be a paradigm shift. I just don't know of Janas actually is a head hardened to me has been drastically more effective ofensive -ly. But but Yana sees might be the defensive player of the year. So it is so hard to way I think this is the closest VP race. We've had certainly since Nashes second, and maybe we can go back further and as far as best player alive to me. That's an interim belt right now. He's playing like it though. And I listen Janas. My this is not me on you on John's might preseason big been Johnston's year three I think he is going to be the best player alive for a long time. If he isn't already. To your point to me, though. Last night was not just about Jaanus. It was about the bucks continuing to check every box championship contender has to check gonna win sixty games. They probably have been BP super lead on offense. Number one defense. They very good coach deep rotation can hit the three like everything you need from a championship contender. And by the way, not just championship contender they profile as an elite level championship team is far as teams that won titles in history. And they did it last night coming back. So you were talking about it before Philly could've won this game. Generally was up six with four and a half, five minutes left and yon is propelled them without his point guard. It's I love what you're saying. Because because now April fifth two thousand nineteen we know Nick now, he's hard charging. Now. He's gonna hold onto LeBron thing forever. He was saying LeBron was the greatest even though he's not the greatest loan before. And then he'll be still yelling after. 'word the echo of will be long after. So we understand that right now we could say if John was on the Lakers. The Lakers would be in the playoffs. If harden was on the Lakers, they would be in the playoffs like we can say those things so he might say that all one of them might be holding the belt interim until next season. But when you're the greatest player, there's no one saying you're gonna hold it for five years. It starts with getting it right in right now. One of those two players Ghana's did last night. That's why he should be in the conversation. Only play thirty four minutes, and it's much. He handles the ball is much see backs people down as much out on transition zero turnovers. So for me if he can hit one or two of those straight on three pointers, it makes him unguarded. He backed Jolan beat into the post had gave them three different moves gave a right hook game, a left layup, and then turn around jumps out on a seven footer. Now, you're going to talk about what he did have been sim. Excuse me. Me one more and then banged on him. We should be talking about John and give it him the type of credit. Yeah. We can talk about Milwaukee what they're going to do in the playoff. But what this is doing is special on both ends of the basketball court something else. What was even more telling me than Milwaukee with Philly because what you said just a few minutes ago. Philly could've won this game. They were up six. How often do we say that against a team? We had that in all four losses against Boston. Lash three of this. This is their problem. They don't execute down the draft why they got Jimmy Butler. And he wasn't there Las. Okay, fine. But these not the answer. Everything. Wins are Janas. No, they had no answer. But they had been Simmons. And I've been a fan of been Simmons since he got in the league even before that like, I think the guy can be a great player in all time. Great player. He he has got to get jumped like he is a liability right now. Because the reason Joel Embiid is taking so many threes and out on the post they gotta put what's his name Simmons in the post, so they'll guarding and then you have to put 'em beat out on the three they had to bias hairs bringing the ball up in the fourth quarter because I need somebody to be a threat on that picket role. Like, Ben is becoming a problem is great as he is he's becoming a huge, and this has been Chris's point for a year and a half. And so I will give you credit the problem. The last night was Phillies often the problem is the Indy was they had to turn over the last two minute. Yes. But what predicated that was they allowed forty six fourth quarter points. And this is where to meet Phillies, the most disappointing because we knew what the all star break that that been Simmons didn't have. Jump shot. We knew we maybe a month into the season that whatever he did this summer. He didn't spend time lively they should be. They shouldn't be a top ten defense with this personnel. They should be top three or four defense. And that to me is this point thing about Philly. I want to respond to the one thing you said about the LeBron thing quickly for a moment versus Jaanus. I believe you honest is going to be the best player in the world. I also agree with what Chris said in the beginning. That is a title that is typically earned in the postseason Steph. If it was earned in the regular season step would have been the best player in the world for couple years view was close people wouldn't give him the best or just because the defense. But he he he became to face the believes league. And if they had finished off the up three one seventy three one seventy Seventy-three when team he would've been considered the best player in the world. So it is tough for me to get a title that guys had for over a decade to give it to somebody in April rather than June. But LeBron's not going to go into next season as. The consensus best player in the league for the first time in a decade. He's going to have to earn that back. So I it's not quite the echo of it the way you phrased it see. But I don't think you can officially earn that title in April can be league in BP. But you can't take that. We've got our own show. Wouldn't do it? Able to fill two thousand nineteen make it a declaration. Okay. Do you agree? I guy. Coming up is already worth one hundred million dollars. That's next. Oh, yes. I'm so. Yes. Back to Janas. He went off last night. Forty five points, thirteen rebounds and six assists in a win over the Sixers bucks locking up the top seed in the east Chris Carter. You win. You're out on yon seven enough talent around him to contend with the Golden State Warriors is a great story. So I got the in because coach bud and the system that they play they shoot a three spread to court. Why enough they have a number of different things. They do often say the Bill the tax you and on the defensive in their own. Both ends is Nick pointed out, they are the type of team if the warriors weren't the warriors. It'd be a heavy favourite to be NBA champion. Yeah. Absolutely. And this when you are playing at the level that Jaanus is playing you don't have to have another superstar next you you just need. Good coaching and good complimentary pieces. You have a fringe all star and Eric blood. So a fringe all starring Chris Middleton. They didn't even have bloods last night. And it was still enough yawn it and when Janas hits threes, which is rare. But he did last night. He is. Absolutely on guard -able if he forget been Simmons if he adds a thirty percent three point shot to his game over the off season. He will he will be far and away the best player in the league right now to the only weakness he has moving onto the final four Auburn taken on for. Jan then you have Texas Tech battling Michigan state tomorrow night. Nick, you interrupt on Michigan state being the most talented team left in the final roll all on in. They're not going to have the best player in any in the game on Saturday 'cause Jarrett Culver will be the best player. But caches Winston no is no slouch himself and overall they go seven guys deep. I think they have the most overall talent those talent of the coaching staff is well, so I am in Nick makes good point as far as the top seven players. But when you look at a like coach Izzo overall talent NBA talent, I went with my NBA scouts and everything. They would say Virginia far as NBA players in the next couple years in this year's far as prospects. Virginia is the most talented now totally. Contrast in styles them playing against Auburn. But as far as prospects are concerned had to do a little research. I don't have much money on my research department. But I was they were able to find a couple of nuggets in there. Virginia has the most Imbi a talent I'll write women onto Zion. Williamson. Talent Zion won't be playing in the final four this weekend. His focus has shifted to counting the Monet. A former Nike executive said, he expects Zion to land a one hundred million dollar shoe deal. So C C winner out on Zion being worth one hundred million dollars. The thing about worth, okay, I believe for the shoe company. It's worth it to them. Now. Are you going to get a marketing sensation and all that? No. But if you care, you gotta be I don't believe he's careers. Matic is the other greats that we've seen now he's gonna build sill some shoes. But now when he gets forty years old or women going to be walking around with Zion sues around, like, Jordan, no shoe deal. You've got to build a sign him right now. 'cause he is the biggest thing that come to the NBA. Lebron Jordan is in a separate category. From every other athlete ever is a basketball player too. But. Comes to marketing James harden, got a two hundred million dollar shoot. He'll from Dita's. Lebron has a lifetime billion dollar deal from Nike, and I only people going to be walking around wearing LeBron's women in their forties. As you mentioned like James harden. It's you don't have to be Jordan to be worth one hundred million bucks to shoe company Zion on in not another Zion coming along anytime soon that if you miss him, a we'll get that guy. So absolutely zion's worth under million eight years hundred million. That's what I'm pegging at. And I think he goes with Nike beyond say gotta shoe deal with datus. She in the Davis is good for her hardens neck, well part once yes, we got football. The Rams had one of the most powered offenses in the league last year. I do need to thinking about beyond say, then you made me look at your feet through the hole. Right. That's greats putting up just three points in Super Bowl. Fifty three left a bad taste in the mountain. The Rams so Nick you in around on the Rams still being the team to beat any hints. Literally, the what I have to be very nice shy. I'm sure I have to be out the because I mean, I saw Girling limp into his car. Yes. That concerns me, man. I feel bad the teams E cameras caught him I feel badly for meat and ask for us to know about this come out nice restaurant in LA can't even go to his car and peace but not without him. They become a regular offense. I don't care what it was kids showing McVeigh's. And so I'm concerned. So I'm out. I'm concerned. I'm concerned at the bears might be better this year. They're going to be a problem. And I'm concerned about the saints now, my partner, Nick, he's no Saint sitting here thinking about beyond say looking genus feet and everything but the saints to be I mean, they the best team in. I mean, that's only we can get him in the show. This do not know same here. Just thinking. John Saint fee. I know how. Now, the reason why you said that 'cause you know, your wife in the car with the kids and stuff you scare, you know, seeing here that and everything about Mattel knows how. Coming up has Magic Johnson derailed. Laurent winning recall next on. Things. I just under our guest in studio WWE superstar in executive VP of talent live events and creative. Paul triple h Levesque will be with us at nine AM wrestlemainia is on Sunday got plenty to discuss within you will not want to miss it. All right back here with Brian Westbrook. And we are going viral yesterday. The jets debuted their new uniforms first time in twenty years. The team is updated their jerseys when you think of the new look the helmets are different. So we everyone always instantly hates everything that's new. So of course, Twitter hated this. And they they made fun of it. And they said jerseys are fine wrong. These jerseys now like the jets some last year's look with some icon IQ, look, it all what are you doing change in it? I had no problem with it. Don't have a problem with the now with digest needs to do is go find a way to win some games. They do that the jersey will look great. I liked the way they. Changed a green? They accent a little different green than a typical green. They have. And I'll always like when you can have the black option it's hard to pull off, but when you can insert that in their gives you opportunity merchandise. So jets fans a fresh new look fresh new team. Maybe maybe they'll start planning some fresh New Relic of all real quick. Why was Levy on bell? Not there. That's a good question. Same darnold there Jamal Adams. They're all the White House LL got into studio. Let's get on studio. Gotta show up lady on come on. Man. I Brian we're talking Packers. A recent report says the dysfunctional relationship between Aaron Rodgers now. Former head coach Mike McCarthy held the franchise back from what could have been Brady Bella check level of success stories of McCarthy's failure to update his offense of game plan lack of Pleat creative play calling and a lack of accountability, including missing team meetings to get massages Aaron Rodgers reportedly undercut McCoy. Arthy on the field and in public and seemingly hasn't gotten over McCarthy passing over him in the two thousand five draft when McCarthy was the Niners offense of coordinator vinyl start with you who's more to blame for the Packers dysfunction. Would it be Mike McCarthy or Aaron Rodgers always start at the top? I have to go even higher than Mike McCarthy, I'm talking about Ted Thompson, listen, you understand that you're coaching your quarterback to the most important people in the business are having problems with each other. You gotta nip it into but one way or the other. Meaning the quarterback has go was rarely as ever going to happen or the coach has to go. You can't allow the relationship to continue to fester to the point where you're not getting any productivity from either one. Then you look at the other side. Let's move down to McCarthy. Their thirteen years. I understand how messages get stale. A with Andy Reid a very good football coach in Philadelphia over over time. You there thirteen fourteen years. People get tired of hearing the same thing. They keep tired of saying here in the same place teams in your division happened to us. They're calling plays at the line. Scrimmage now all chance accusing execute can you out game plan, and I think air Rogers wholesome responsibility to issue responsibility to go out there run the place as diagram run them as called. And of course, you had some ability to audible, but it's been everyone's rallying cry about Green Bay for years. They don't run the football enough. If Aaron Rodgers is audibly out of run plays in the throw the ball more than they already thought about a lot. Then that's a big problem. You need a running game to help depend game. Aaron Rodgers didn't allow that to happen. So I I think that Aaron Rodgers obviously could be better with people from all reports from whether it's family teammates coaches, who he could be better in the relationship aspect of his life and people that hold grudges typically hurt you more than hurts other people. I think all that is a legitimate criticism. But if I were in Rogers, I'd be frustrated too man, like I get there, and I'm instantly by year two. I'm one of the best quarterbacks in football after sitting for three years, and how does your to in? We score forty five points in a playoff game, and we lose and then you're three we win a Super Bowl and your four were fifteen in one. I have one of the greatest seasons any quarterbacks ever had. We're fifteen one despite having the thirty second ranked defense, and how's that year end aren't even sloughs thirty seven points in first playoff game at home, and we lose and the next couple years. Can't solve Colin Kaepernick any runs roughshod over us back toback playoffs. And then what I think was the breaking point where Ted Thompson should have seen it. Because a lot of salt from afar was five years ago that conference championship game against Seattle. Where early in the game. The Packers kicked two field goals from the one yard line against the defending champs. He could knock them out your kicking field goals late in the game. With a to score lead. Run the ball run the ball run the ball to where the games out of Aaron Rodgers hands. He never gets e touches at one more time to to save them to force overtime. They don't win the coin toss. And they lose a game. They never should've lost this story talks about how the guy that messed up the onside kick he a lot of players thought he should have been caught earlier in the season. But wasn't McCarthy style from that moment forward the coach lost the quarterback, and whether rightly or wrongly if you're gonna move forward with the quarterback Ted Thompson could have made this change that off season or the following off season. Instead we had wasted years in Green Bay. That's not to say Aaron Rodgers isn't culpable. But he's not culpable for the bad defense. He's not culpable for Mike McCarthy, not evolving, and he certainly not culpable for a list of those playoff loss. No. But I'm going to give you some balance because everyone is responsible starting at the top Brian's right in starts with Ted Thompson. Because this is the thing who hired both of them. Mark murphy. Okay. So in doing that, they empowered they Aaron's been sitting there for three years. It's not like they don't know his personality when they decide to move on from Brett Farr. They've hired McCarthy as the code. So they're expecting his personnel. So they know this. So they allow it to go on is McCarthy guilty. He is guilty of not evolving. All right. He's guilty of that, do you? If you're in one place for long periods of time. Can you message get stale? Absolutely. But Aaron Rodgers he's got a prickly personality. You mentioned it at every level that being high-school college family and in the pros he has had a hard time with relationship. So we shouldn't think that he would struggle in this one now just because he's talented, you shouldn't run the whole organization around this guy. Another thing that Aaron is guilty of Aaron's guilty at not learning more football. Because one thing I used to learn from Brian Billick, and Tom Moore and other great coaches, I had if you want some input on what we're doing for one. I want you to come in here on your off day. I want you sit in the meeting, and I want you to come up with some concepts. Not only how to get you to ball. What's the protection, what is some play actions off of those things? So that we can install them the way football plays are install. So Aaron Rodgers is guilty of not learning anymore football. 'cause you don't go to coach and say, I don't like that you go to coach and say, I don't like that. I prefer something different in Aaron didn't have that Aaron wants to act as he's the smartest football guy football guy around and he's not he's got some limitations as far as the amount of football that he wants to learn that's why he doesn't want a lot of bunch for Macy's because I can't see if they're blitzing off the edges that's a limitation that he has to be able to get over and it puts their quarterback. I mean, the coach in a very very tough spot. So be I'm with you. Let's spread this around. All of them. Are blamed the front office McCarthy's plane and definitely Aaron Rodgers is is part of the problem. I wanna make it very clear, I think they are all to blame. I just think win. Let's just pretend for a moment. It's thirty three thirty three thirty three that they all are equal shares of it. We'll have one guy is the best in the world at what he does or one of the best in the world. What he does I can deal with more problems from him. If this were it, Bill Belichick had some of these complaints. We have these complaints Mike McCarthy's getting massages and he's doing this. It's like well. Okay. But he's the best coach in the world, wait till Aaron Rodgers retires. And then you're going to get a full briefing on everything that Aaron Rodgers did. Now, you're making all these concessions because somehow you think Aaron Rodgers playing golf by himself like he's responsible for all the score. But we're trying to run a lack of room which around a team, and we're trying to run a business. How talented you are is second third fourth and stuff in charge because we can't run a system that says, hey, you know, something guys the rules are based on how talented you are. So the guy Fifty-three, you ain't got no, right. Because the guy who's got all the talent. He's got all the rights. It's impossible to run a locker room and football team that way. So do you look back at the time these two? Spent together and said that was wasted time in Green Bay, and how much more could they have done to had there not been a dysfunctional relationship. You talked about one Super Bowl you have a transcendent talent at the quarterback you spec. Those types of players to win multiple Super Bowl. They're good enough to win. And I think we go back to Mike McCarthy, you have to be able to say, listen, you know, you how special this guy under center is you have to find a way to get him to buy in about buying on every platform basketball football baseball, find a way to get this guy to buy it. Whether that's included him in some of the game planning whether that's getting him in all season. Saying would you like what do you wanna do? You have to find a way to get this guy because Aaron Rodgers special enough to buy into the city definitely have to do that. You definitely have to be creative. And that's what sets the good poach coaches apart because they're able to find out what is that right button to push to make this person more learning or to make this person. Maybe think that they're in control. But I'm actually getting what I want mine McCarthy has this. Enrichment, he's from western Pennsylvania. He wants people to think he's a tough guy the most criminal. He did was not putting a physical football team. And being that guy that could stop all this mess. So he became more of a pushover. He used to not find guys used to tell guys, you know, something I'm a treat you like a man where everyone locker rooms not a man, and you need to take their money from them you need to find him. Because that's a lot of times pro players, they respect that. So when you don't crack, correct the bad behavior it repeats itself repeats itself. But for me, I know through talking to people when might McCarthy interview for the Cleveland job, they were concerned about his lack of a tough attitude lack of a formidable defense and a lack of that type of football team that they wanted to try to create they thought that that was to the detriment. And the reason part of the reason why he got fired. I know that do a couple of good sources that was the reason why he didn't get the Cleveland job. They. That Freddie kitchens was more tough minded in what they saw a half a season than what we have seen with McCarthy in those thirteen years in green is interesting because a lot of people thought he was a lock for that Cleveland job. And I think they were surprised when he didn't get it. So that's great information. Brian thanks so much for joining us today. Gotta take a break coming up has Magic Johnson sabotage lebrons chances that next on first thing. Crisper cerebral in viral last night. This moment broke the internet K D LeBron docu, but covering their mouth was the Brown. Asking K DVD Space Jam to this summer. I don't know come join me next. Are you going to be space Shammar? Sorry. Do you make a cameo? I wouldn't mind putting it out there. I'm available. I feel like you should have been asked by now. I have oh come on, man. But not at the moment. Listen come on everybody in this game. A lot longer than me. I got a problem with magic maverick an lavar LeBron within why they put Tibo in bent show game show. And I got what I. I tax about that exact thing people people a little stiff on that stage. Now, listen, let's do this. Tell him Chris Carter said so maybe that might hold a little more weight. Now, first of all that. You don't know their second of all you need to be in Space Jam Broussard, put in a good work for me. Sticking with LeBron. But you gotta do that missing the playoffs for the first time in fourteen years. Focus has now shifted to the future who will be the next head coach which big name free agent. Will they pair with the king are the beaches in LA really that nice? Lot of questions. One NBA scout has ripped the Lakers futures. Ain't magic has destroyed that place Broussard you trust Magic Johnson to restore the late address. The quote, I disagree with the quote, just because the Lakers have been a mess long before it was it was Beirut. When he. That's like. Doctor dr. Thirteen. They have been a mess. Jim bus had him. They were a mess genie. God bless her. But they run like a mom and pop operation right now that in a state of the art. Howdy mean, they're just they're not. They're not where they need to be in terms of you know, the analytics and the front office, and they're kinda run old school and look magic. So magic has destroyed the place, obviously, he's made some mistakes Bajic needs to be the face of the Lakers, but you have to get people in. And I'm sure he thought he did it with rob Pelinka from that Pelinka may not be that that guy that nuts and bolts guy is of course, he's not, you know, he was an agent, and he made a lotta enemies, but still money talk. So he should be to get guys. But they're guys around the league that never liked rob Pelinka when he was in age, a tough hard nose agent, but magic and rod they need to get other people to do the nuts and bolts day to day stuff that it takes to run an NBA team, Pat Riley has Andy Ellsberg, right? Danny Ainge has Mike Zerrin like e Darryl is the math guy as well. But he also has Gerson Rosas and other in. Mitee folks that he knows that he brings in like you who magic Pelinka fill the same role there both relationship. Well, Pelinka can't fill it. Like it was like magic is a great face. Of course. No, obviously, much pulling my point is if you didn't have magic and he brought him blinking and be the face of a good looking guy. He has relationships. He knows the it would make sense. But the Lakers this offseason Navistar superstar? They obviously need a coach or they will ensure order. I would argue they need a smart guy. Curson Rosa is going to interview for the Charlotte. GM position already has I would try to talk to him. I from my Zahren. I try to talk to those two smart guys that aren't going to be able to go higher in their own organizations anytime soon and say, you know, rob Pincus job could be available because what has he done? What is what is his value added to the situation? I will tell you what what magic and Pelinka. Have done is this LeBron obviously wanna go to the Lakers, regardless. Right. But I don't know that he would have Jim bus was still in charge. I don't know that LeBron with a winter because LeBron does value what he perceives to be a stable strong front office and organization and magic and Pelinka coming in the perception, whether it's true or not the perception was that they bought the -bility and credibility to that that franchise or that front office and that enabled the Brian and say, okay, I can trust magic, and I will go. So at the very least they did we'll give them credit for that. And the next thing that they did was they got him financially in a situation where they could go after after sign on the Bron if they didn't blow it this season clear the book, they got the books. Right. All right. So let's give them credit for that. But as far as bringing someone in between Pelinka and magic are they going to be able to tell us. Okay, shooting percentages from the. Corners. How important it is to build a run an overall strategy. I don't think they're going to be able to get that. So if I was Magic Johnson, I would be trying to make adjustments because he talked about last year the type of team he wanted to put on guys playmakers guys can make plays off the dribble with that was an ideology plane. So now, I mean, it was no it really was based on the three point line. The analytics that are clearly in front of you as far as how you have to play an NBA. So for me, I would change my style this summer. This is the most important summer in Lakers history more important than getting LeBron last year because you getting ready to waste your to the Bronx. If you don't capitalize on magic goes on thirty day cruise on a big yacht in Italy all around the world, I would counsel that this summer people like all wise that import because there is no other general manager that is doing that and running an operation. So from the optic standpoint, I would try to secure I would potentially look at bringing someone else own staff to build a. Give us the edge that these other organizations have and they have to reconstruct this roster. But I don't believe that Jenny bus is going to go to magic because she got no more basketball right than magic. So she says I defer all basketball decisions to Magic Johnson. And to me if magic is the smartest basketball guy in the organization, you're unconcerned. What's the most important thing that the Lakers have to do this summer's focus themselves on getting a free agent? They missed out on Anthony Davis. Maybe it'll come back around again. But don't they need? Magic johnson. Okay point is to go out and recruit is to go out and send Magic Johnson out to do what he does best now to do the stuff that we're talking about. He doesn't do best. But to go out and recruit, and there's a number of guys need gonna have to try to figure out a way to recruit all these guys sort of at the same time. Once you do that you still to seize point have to you've got to fill out the roster when it comes to the recruiting part. The other difficulty is how do you recruit Colli inquiry and Kimba simultaneously like it's not a free agent. It's not a one summer one free agent summer. So quite as your first choice. Kyrie's your second choice. Kimble's your third choice. Right. Let's just say how do you? How do you go? Does magic go to buy while LeBron's talking to Kyrie and is like we've got one contract who signs it. I that's that's a lot of balls Alicia data link. I look I think their chances. Get those top four free ages are basically null and void. They have any chance at qui-, very miniscule. A while. So miniscule, I think if he goes LA he's going to the clippers. Now, he I'm not gonna say no chance, but miniscule, I think the the kyri miniscule chance of Durant don't exam, you know. So at think it's all about getting Athen Davis. Here's one thing that could help them with free agents guys have always complained or observe when you're on the Brian team. If you win if you win he gets auto credit if you lose all he doesn't have any help. Everybody gets the blame. I don't think that'll be the case next year. Psychiatry Irving went there. It wouldn't be all just LeBron delivered us if they get to the conference finals next year. It was all the Brown know, whoever comes in and helps them get that far in the playoffs would get a lot of red. And you've made that point four I think it's really smart one. But to your point just quickly see about filling out the roster if their number one goal is Anthony Davis to get Anthony Davis. You're going to be gutting. Everyone's on a one year deal except for the guys who could be traded brand thing Davis. It will be an expert. It will be LeBron LeBron the Davis cap space and an expansion team. So you have to have smart people figure out. Okay. Do we want to try to target? One other fringe all-star with our cap space to we want to spend have three mid level guys. That's hard work. That's why I believe they're better off recruiting the one free agent because then keep young. Yes. I mean, it makes the roster building a lot easier because Lonzo Ingram who's MMA. Just stay and you slot in the the free agent. But who's that guy going be recited? Thanks a lot job coming up about fifteen minutes. WWE superstar triple h will be joining us live today. That's a head on first things. First. Thank you for listening to the first things first podcast. Remember, leave us a review and tell us what you think subscribe to the podcast on apple podcasts and catch us on f s one Monday through Friday, six thirty AM Easter for Chris Carter, Nick, right, Geno, wolf so long. Everybody.

basketball LeBron Lakers football NBA Aaron Rodgers Bill patriots Boston James harden Sixers Chris Carter Rams Tom Brady Ted Thompson Mike McCarthy Nick MVP Philly
Aaron Rodgers drama, Magic/LeBron, WWE superstar Triple H in-studio

First Things First

1:00:36 hr | 1 year ago

Aaron Rodgers drama, Magic/LeBron, WWE superstar Triple H in-studio

"Hiber one. Welcome first things worse. We have made to Friday. I'm general. That's the hall of Famer Chris Carter. This is Nick right being show today. Spent a big show all week. In fact, spoiler alert always going to start the show by telling you that. But this one really is est in the bucks locked up the best record in the NBA. Lebron future with the Lakers now in turmoil. And apparently what happens in Green Bay doesn't always stay in Green Bay green dress. Thank you remind. He's got some stuff all around. Going up top hair. We go. A recent report says the dysfunctional relationship between Aaron Rodgers and now former head coach Mike McCarthy held the Green Bay Packers franchise back from what could have been a Brady Bella check level of success in the report stories of McCarthy's failure to update his offense of game plan, his lack of creative play calling and his lack of accountability, including reports of missing team meetings to get massages now Aaron Rodgers reportedly undercut McCarthy on the field and in public and seemingly hasn't gotten over McCarthy passing him over in the two thousand five NFL draft when he was the Niners offensive coordinator. There was a lot in this article Chris Carter some of it. I'm sure you have heard stories of. But what was your reaction to the bulk of the report that came out about these two will first of all we know that Rogers has been a lot of things said about him and his personality is far. Or is being sensitive so many other things that came out in article now as far as Mike McCarthy, we didn't hear is many things before this article came out my own personal experience with coach McCarthy is that in two thousand two at the two thousand and two season. I was leaving Minnesota, and I was a potential free agent. So I was at the Super Bowl in New Orleans. Jim hasn't was a head coach in New Orleans. Mike McCarthy was offense coordinator Hubbard Alexander who was my wife receiver coach for several years in Minnesota was the white receiver coat, and he was trying to entice me to plane one or two more years and playing with the saints at that time. So what we did was we did a little I it's not legal. But during the Super Bowl they opened up their facility, I happen to be in the neighborhood end up going meeting with the coaching staff and sat down with Mike McCarthy for a longtime watch film, and he 'cause I know in that situation because coz has. Has it was the head coach there him, and I had gone was we have play practice against each other in the summer. So has let noone was impressed with my football IQ. And they wanted to see if I wanted to come play there. I was very impressed with who he was as offense of coordinator at that time McCarthy part on the hottest coordinators in pro football. And it made me think about even though New Orleans didn't have the situation for me as far as the chance to win a Super Bowl, which I was looking for in that last year or two I was very impressed with what he knew football wise and Aaron Rodgers has been tough on the coaches but in Green Bay, it's hard because of their structure with their their own by the by the community owns it. So is there really a voice outside of the president of the team that can really come down. So for me, the dysfunction is led by the way, it's own. And it starts from the top with me. So I'm not gonna blame Aaron Rodgers more than. The organization now the organization we don't mention Newman there, but they're at fault because they didn't empower Mike McCarthy that he could be able to force Aaron to Bill learn different things. So when you don't have that power behind you, you are a coast at ultimately, the players going to have more power than you. So I don't like the structure, so I'm not gonna blame Aaron Rodgers more. So than I'm ever gonna blame the organization because they drafted Aaron Rodgers, and they, cultivate, this community where they allowed Aaron Rodgers to be able to continue his behavior and not putting not not really put any pressure on him to grow into grow offense. This was a remarkable story and credit to Tyler Donna Bleacher report for getting people on the record were on background to talk honestly about a decade of dysfunction to I didn't know that. I knew Aaron Rodgers held grudges. I didn't know he'll grudges back to in two thousand five when McCarthy was the coordinator for the Niners. He said, yeah, I think Alex Smith better than Aaron Rodgers. He'd been mad since then like, so nobody comes out of this story looking good Ted. Thompson catches some bullets Mike McCarthy, certainly doesn't look good. And Aaron Rodgers does not look good either. The reason that to me it is very easy, though, two point one bigger finger than others at the GM and the coach is because the GM and the coach are not one of one in the world at what they do. And if you are blessed enough in your organization to have someone who is in the argument for most talented or best in the world. What they do you bend over backwards to make them happy. Our boss Kette has a lot of actual technical responsibilities. A lot of things on his daily list. You know, what his number one responsibility. Every single day is make sure Chris Carter's in a good place to succeed. Because even if that's not technically on his list of things it all falls apart. If Chris is not in a good place to succeed. I am magin beyond say is a pain too. Go on tour with is a pain to set things up. But when he gets out there, she performs the stories about Christian bale are legend about onset what a terror he can be. But he might be the best actor alive. So you Dan gonna make any of that? Okay. Though. Nobody's reality. Would it be better? If everyone was Tom Brady, I might be the best in the world. And I'm a great team that much and older for the coach sure. But more often guys like that or more like LeBron I'm going to be a little bit of a pain, and I'm gonna be needy, and I'm gonna be passive aggressive. But you get me eighty two games here this year fifty five, but you get me. And so we're going to deal like that is the number one job of the Packers were to make sure Aaron Rodgers was happy with the Packers and they failed at that. Well, I'm gonna totally disagree with you in the reason, why is because you came up with things that the people they might be the best that their business, but they're individuals. They're incorporating them. Self now, if you decide to travel with beyond say because beyond say is the show, but we got the NFL. This is a league. We've got a team you gotta locker room, you have no locker room in those other instances, and as far as the NBA, LeBron you only got eleven other guys so that personality can dominate but an NFL locker room it. We're going to continue to function of the football team. We came run our business like them. We can't coddle the quarterback just because he's good word about the left guard. He might be the best all time. What do we do? We run the ball. Now sixty times because the left guard is dominant. Like, we could go through player after player that oh, man. We gotta create this system. No, it is a team in everyone's got to build a by the team to build get the best functionality out of the team. So no, I totally disagree with you. And he's not beyond say. All right. Like we've had other Aaron Rodgers before. And the thing about Beyonce's. She makes a hit hit. It's not a Super Bowl trophy. Like if you get if you win. I mean, whatever if you had a gold album, it's totally not the same. You can't make those comparisons. Because you have other personalities that the coach on every team saying, you know, something we're going to treat guys the light. We're going to try to treat you like grown men. We even like not treating him like, no grown, man, you're babysitting me, but you allow him to do whatever you want. It will never ever work in that would be one of the problems why they only made one Super Bowl and why they didn't have a lot of success success success success. That's why you see the peace and valleys in what they did there in green bears little chicken and egg when it comes to who's to blame. Here is it more the lack of creative Blake on or the lack of sort of executing that lack of creative play as far as the play. Call into. I can only coal what people know. So if you restrict me which Aaron Rodgers did he said, I don't want bunch formations that mean, I don't want the wide receivers clustered in close to the quarterback because I can't see the blitz if they're coming so errands admitting I can't see the blitz unless their way out wide that hurts you as a quarterback because when the wide receivers out wide. There's only so many combinations of routes in teams can book you and you become far more predictable not to cut you off. But that's very important, and we're gonna dive into much more of this. But just as a step back one of the things that was mentioned in this article that is if two gotten along a little bit better had less a dysfunctional relationship. They could have had the success. The patriots had do you see like was there pal? Trending that way. This is where the Ted Thompson part comes in the they haven't the year they went fifteen and one they had the thirty second ranked defense in football. That's remarkable. I saw that last night. Couldn't believe it double checked it. They they have never built the. Team the right way. They have the one year. They've had a great defense. They won the Super Bowl since. Then defense have been ranked thirty second eleven twenty five fifteen fifteen twenty two twenty two eighteen and playoff losses for Aaron Rodgers the divas loud, fifty one thirty seven forty five forty four like there's they had a double digit lead in Seattle with five minutes left the team blows it multiple times. Like there's his frustration to me is warranted. Now, maybe doesn't deal with it the right way. But they were never going to be the patriots. They never belch it. They never had a full of full team. They never had Tom Brady either ashore as the would you not agree that it would. It's a little I know how the patriots run their off into means. I know Tom Brady runs. Most of those means the reason why Tom Brady's been empowered to run those means because Tom Brady knows as much football. Is anyone in the build? You know reason why because Tom Brady submitted himself to learn more football, Tom Brady didn't know that. When he got there. He didn't run that system. When he was at Michigan. He wasn't even successful when he was at Michigan. But since he's been in the building they say, you know, what you guys can teach me about football. So which in turn they've turned a responsibility over to him that now that key can teach Aaron Rodgers teaching classes in Green Bay because it's football knowledge is limited. All right. We're gonna talk much more about this coming out. But on the other side talk some basketball Jaanus in the bucks have enough talent to make a run into title next on fest one. You can always check us out on the FOX channel on Sirius XM, we're back right after this. First things first in just a few hours live in-studio WWE superstar and executive VP of talent live events and creative. Paul triple h Leveque will be with us nine AM wrestlemanias on Sunday. We got plenty to discuss with him. Not gonna wanna miss it. Stay tuned. All right. We'll get to Jaanus in the box and just a second. But first highlights presented by Hilton warriors Laker Steph curry gets the steel behind the back full core pass to Katie for the easy slam. Chilton's back in. Go magic man winning heart. Magic bring back Showtime magic. Okay. No problem is on his way, the degree of difficulty on that pass. And it was pinpoint. Alex Caruso rises above everyone for the put back jam that has everyone in shock, including LeBron lips GD. Athlete now or sets guy dust even trying to tell us about him ever since it was at am. I dismissed him at first he's right Caruso, fly look at him. Don't let the bold Ed fool you. To the NCWA dunk contest. Five foot eight southeastern Louisiana guard. Marlin veal gets thrown off the ground over three people for the slam. That's the only way we can get you above the room though. We've do who's you? Why don't you like me and someone else to me? Yes. Lord. And I'm bringing in the highlights now to love. Highlight basketball career, but I'm gonna bring the lights. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. You have one highlight you have one in game one and game dunk in my life. Let's check it out. Let's let's let's see I. I didn't get picked up like that guy. We haven't seen them lower body explosive string moving onto the biggest game of the night. Thank you box taken on the Sixers Jaanus make an strong last push for MVP, the Greek freak going off, forty five points, thirteen rebounds, six assists. Not to mention four blocks on the most unstoppable player. Joel Embiid Milwaukee. One one twenty one twenty two to lock up the top seed in the east, Nick, what Johnson the bucks show us and their win over 'em beaten, the Sixers, and they did it without their second or third best player, depending on how you rank Middleton blood. So with blood still being kicked out minutes into the game. What what they showed us is what the data has shown us all year. This is the exact profile of not just a championship contender. But an elite championship team. They check every box sixty plus wins. Check the overall number one seat. Check the probable league MVP. Check. Super League on both ends of the court top three offense number one defense and also shooting three and defending the three day. They are as good as any team in the league at that. And they have a legitimate home court and a veteran coach that is for all of MBA history. You need about five of those seven they have all seven of them, Catherine doar health. Well, they so the health is a question, Mark. But the the guys they've had the injuries to aside from brogden aren't what I would call the key contributors. Now, I know mirror Tich was a guy they were happy. They got it the deadline, but they were killing people before they added miratec and site and even chins, oh, they think any or all of those guys potentially could be back come the conference. I think because the roles they play Jinnah those injuries become the most important issue because that's one of the other things that makes this team special. If we wanna project all the way through the Eastern Conference and into the finals, the re. Reason why they would have a chance not just because of those stats is because the players that they have. It's just not, oh, they got one of the guys mirror church. We believe and has proven himself in playoff series to be an effective shooter Bill space to court, and when you look at who their star is and what those other guys bring to Bill open up the court for him. That's why those injuries you have to look they're not on that list as far as positives. But it is the most important thing if you asked a question about the Milwaukee Bucks now is how healthy will they be? Because after healthy, they are definitely the best team in the east and they've got a winning record against everybody winning record against Indiana. Boston Philly Toronto all those teams. Those those are the teams that will play in the second and third round two of those three teams to Houston two zero against Denver. They split the season series with Golden State. So there's not any team that they could play in a playoff series that where they could be tested because in the first round they won't be tested. They already have. Winning record against those teams. They I you if it were not the Kevin Durant. Boogie cousins. Steph Klay warriors. We would say the bucks are the big favorites. They would be the big favorites. They are they have the profile of the rockets team last year, but with more depth and with a player less reliant on the whistle now. That's not shade on James harden. But James harden, one of the yeah. Buts about him going into postseason is will the whistle change Janas and last night Janas hit some threes. And if he hits threes, there's no guarding him not so ever now. I don't think he's typically gonna hit threes. His around twenty two percent on the year. Let's nineties shot seven of a made three which makes him totally unguarded. Yeah. The one thing though, too is it's not only making the threes but shooting threes because there were times Philadelphia backed off of him play them dared him to shoot. Now for me. It's not a percentage thing with me. It's how many attempts because if he shooting because he's so different than any. Other superstar we have he can get to the bucket his mid rain game mid range game too strong, but his post up. That's the most surprising part of his game to me like I thought of insa Bill to shoot effectively which he's doing but his post up, and how strong he is like they had to put Jolan beat to try to quiet him down. So it's it's amazing to watch his all development, and I'm surprised by how much game is he bullied Ben Simmons again member when they played the last time, he call Ben Simmons a baby or something. Yeah. With him down on the block. We're talking about it this morning in the fourth quarter about midway through the fourth. He takes him down on the baseline. And Ben Simmons is a big guy that criticism been Simmons rods body or strength and yon is just three separate times. Drops a shoulder. Elbow into him to get space to then dunk on like Janas is development of his strength has made him into. He was a fringe MVP. Candidate last year. It's the body that has made him now the MVP favourite after night like last negative Nellie. But I am worried about that ankle it is now flared up twice already just wanna make sure that he's strong, and he's good as they hit the play of you won't have to play again this year, if you don't want to because now they locked up the one seed, so in that regard that helps them, okay? But let's talk about the other side with the Sixers are you concerned after what you saw last night that this team isn't playoff ready. No, I'm not concerned last night's game. They were shorthand Jimmy Butler wasn't in the game. And this game coming down possession here or there. You know, they get a couple of stops late in the game. Make a couple threes late in the game. Philadelphia can win this game. So no, I'm not going to overreact to last night's game. But to me, they have some obvious problems JJ Riddick. I thought was sensational last night the offense that they're starting to try to run for him to get him some open looks because it's going to help JOL the but still I'm gonna be consistent Benson's. He's a problem when you have more turnovers in your point guard you have. Turnovers than you have field goals. It's going to be a problem. Only took five sacks last night. After playing what thirty minutes thirty six minutes five shots. So now, what type of confidence is he going to have coming into playoffs shooting a basketball? So to me ongoing thing their point guard. I believe that he hinders them as far as being one the league team. So I'm the obviously, I'm not as concerned about the Ben Simmons part of this. Because to me last night was not about a lack of offense scored one hundred twenty two points last night was they allowed seventy two second half points and forty six in the fourth quarter sees point that also they didn't have one of their best players in Jimmy Butler. They've only played ten games with their starting five. This starting by the chills to be one of the best in the league Tobias Harris, Jimmy Butler, Ben Simmons, Joel and beaten JJ, right? Ken games? They've only now they're eight and two in those ten but they're going to go into the playoffs. Not really having a feel for each other where the playoffs will help them. I believe is the if you don't have. A ton of depth. That is not as big of a deal come the postseason because I'm playoffs in beads. Not playing thirty six he's going to be playing forty and device hairs gonna be playing thirty. He's playing thirty six. So you're everybody's been shrinks you need. Mike Scott coming off the bench, and you need one other guy. They got Zaire Smith the rookie who hadn't played most of the year. He's getting back into the rotation. But the east is very very strong. And in the second round there's going to be to good teams that go home Philly right now would be an underdog against Tronto who they play in the second round. They would need been SIMS on wheel. But Embiid and Butler to be one the big issues when you don't have a bench is you can't sustain any injury. Right. All right. So there's very few teams going to go through the playoffs because it's too intense. You do sustain injuries, but I've much rather Jolan BB playing thirty six thirty four minutes like Janas been playing compared to push him to forty minutes in the playoffs. And the reason why you do is like short guy, you know, some heights over eight oh a good bench is overrated. Because you don't have one, and that's Phillies excuse they gotta take a break outs. Making it form. On out west has Magic Johnson derailed. Lebron's west another title. That's next. On sunday. We're soul for some bumping and grinding on the short-track the Coliseum. The green flag drops Jewish turn on one. And the Fox Sports at time for us to go viral. So last night Jaanus in the bucks got the best of the seventy Sixers. However, there was a special guest in the house for Philly. Check this out the three hundred thirty million dollar man, new Phillies outfielder rice Harper did not get booed had the honour a ringing the bell before the game. Let me here come on. How you gonna do Bryce? Come on. Bell ring. You're putting the great on it. I'm just letting I wanted to see it. I saw when the you said there was special guests in the building. And I saw that picture there. I was like, oh, hey, I was there. But no it's Bryce Harper stepping up right there. Yes. And Bryce Harper wearing number three in Philadelphia. That's a big deal. I resent. Of course, then also Carson Winston him sat in the box watching the Sixers play. So thick night in Philadelphia staff show will be in Philadelphia for some weakened playoff games. Chris making some plans Jenner you should be Philly men last time you there. We'll God he'd up. I'm popular in Philly with the basketball fans the football fans. Don't like me as much basketball fans. I'm good with. No, you he believes bin Simmons has a beautiful. I did that AT T wakeup call. Final four tips off tomorrow, Auburn taken Virginia and then Texas Tech battles. Michigan state. See what do you like to make the final? Okay. Right. From the top coach Izzo. He's got me a little slant at towards him. Now, the defensive are going to face going to be second to none in Texas Tech. I look for the Spartans to Bill to get through and Virginia last several years on the most talented teams in college basketball haven't reached their potential. I really like their coach believe he's underrated gets a lot of criticism. So I like Virginia to Bill to get through. I liked Virginia. You get through as well. Sports, very often works in storylines. The Spurs lose a championship on the Ray Allen shot and then lose game seven the next year. Come back and win at Virginia. I one seed ever lose to a sixteen the following year. Make it all the way to the championship game. I think they will the other game to me is as close as it can get Jarrett. Colder will be the best player on the court in the Michigan state Texas Tech game. But Zion was the best player in the court and Michigan state one. I liked the same finals you the two favorites. Michigan state Virginia matching up Monday night moving onto Zion. As you mentioned who won't be playing in the final four this weekend. His focus has shifted to counting money. A former Nike and Adidas executive said, he expects Zion to Landay one hundred million dollar shoe deal. See Zion worth all that money before ever playing single game in the NBA the hype surrounding him shoe company, and you're in the business of signing stars. Let's just you can't predict what's going to become an college basketball. The next two three ten years. You gotta get him sign based on the competition. Now, I don't believe he's as marketable as LeBron was and our Jordan the best ever merchandise in ever in the history of anything. He will never rival that. But man, you got to get him in your shoes. Specially after the blowout, man. He blew out the shoot with the Nike man, if you are another company, and you can you can snatch him away from Nike. It would be a huge hit you laugh to be when I said he's gonna pass LeBron. But not when you adjust for inflation. That's exactly what's going to happen. Lebron was seven years eighty seven million from Nike comes straight out of high school. I think zion's going to be eight years one hundred million and I. Think it's going to be Nike. I know there are some rumors. There's going to be the Chinese shoe company that gets in Japan zion's, not clear Thompson, he's going Nike or is going to deduce. My guess is that Nike pays a premium to get him after that shoe got blown out which was a Nike, but he's going to get hundred million. Let's move on the Boston Celtics. Now, Boston season has been tumultuous at times. But Kyrie Irving says there is nothing to worry about commenting that his relationship with Brad Stevens has grown tremendously. So Nick are the Celtics real threaten the east. I don't think they're real threat. And we'll see how he feels after tonight tonight the four seeds on the line Boston, Indiana play other that they're right now tied in the standings, Indiana wins they base lock up that four seed which would mean Boston would start this playoffs on the road could win a first-round series. Yes. Do I think Boston's a threat to beat Milwaukee in the second round, absolutely not? And if this Boston teams one and done or even to done in the playoffs. Then all those good feelings go away immediately kyri. Said I'm just waiting for the playoffs. Let for his sake. You hope that playoff experiences along one. I don't think it will. I it's nice to hear that the relationship is growing just like any other relationship in the second year in the first year, really what kind of sample that we have with kyri being hurt. Now they face some real adversity. And even if the relationships not improving men, I'm glad he's saying that that's what you should says. Yeah. Lie to the people absolute I big fan of that. If you need to lie lie to the people in the true sandwich. James harden beard is averaging over thirty six points game to go along with six and a half rebounds, seven and a half. Assists, not about resume for what could be back to back MVP seasons. But with his crafty step ax has never ending foul shots many wondering if it's how the game should be played case in points announcer. Don mclean. Feel like rob this style hard does manipulating the game somehow like almost like cheating it somehow. I don't really have a thought beyond that other than I'm watching something that isn't basketball like to me basketball player movement, bald new design plays not to walk it up and isolate and every time I just feel like did then that's what brought up that point earlier that who else could do this. It's not like. It's not like within the system. He's getting all these numbers consistent of going for him. Hi, Nick, we make what Tom clean said. Don mclean. If he knows about cheating the game in basketball. He he is one of the experts the first player in NBA history was suspended for steroids. But that's neither here nor there. Let's talk about what he actually is saying there, which is just don't like it. It doesn't fit my sensibilities. We'll basketball should be. I don't have much else to say. I just don't like it. That is the honest opinion of most James harden, critics just don't like it. I'll tell you this. I like watching Russell Westbrook more than I like watching Steph curry Ivein, Russell style for more, entertaining and exciting, but then doesn't make me come on television. Like man, Steph curry is kind of cheating like shoot from thirty five feet. And that's not what I grew up watching basketball that you have to respect this skill. That harden has perfected Darrow Maury came on this show over a year ago and said, I believe James harden is the best one on one isolation player ever. That's no longer even a. Controversial opinion. I think a lot of people believe James Harden's, the best isolation player ever the team wins. When he plays this style. Their season was on the brink of disaster until they went with a harden exclusive offense, but the real criticism of harden is exactly that it's an aesthetic one. It's not an effective criticism. It's not it's a sell. It is just to my I I don't like it. And Don McLean said it said made the subtext text there in acknowledging that's the only real criticism of Hardin right now. Yeah. He really couldn't go deepen explain it. Now, he's accomplished basketball player. You mentioned the time. He was suspended. I player suspended for taking steroids. Now. He was a movement player. He was a jump shot player. So he wasn't very very athletic. Even though he played thing double digit years in MBA. So first of all the makes plain his game. And the reason why aesthetically it might not be pleased to to him is because he's about movement. He's always he's going to be more effective playing on a team. That's going to move the ball people pick and form. So he can get his shot. So I understand that. And he's got a right to opinion. So it's not a matter of being right or wrong. Now, he said, this is just my opinion. I can't give you a deep dive on examples. Typically, if I have a strong opinion, I try to give you some examples of the reason why I believe that. Now, the reason why I believe opposite of him is because the game of basketball is about scoring the basketball in stopping them from scoring a basketball. No matter how you can do it. The reason why they put the three point line on the basketball court was so that you could open up the court and Bill to take advantage of the skill set that we see people now I'm not from the camp of Nick, there's no way if I'm paying money I'm going to see Steph curry play compared to Russell. So it is a style preference thing to both of James harden is one of the great. Cores that we've ever seen in all the great scores for the most part. You know, what they were 'isolation players. Now. This is the first time they have allowed someone to dominate the ball as much as him and still be an isolation, but the greatest player ever, Michael Jordan up and down up and down. Yes. But at the end of the day, that's how Michael Jordan really got his name Kobe bean. Bryant isolation player James harden is just an extension of them. And where he was wrong about the system. No this system wasn't create it for him. He was put in to to Dan Tony system. That was very effective. Nash was MVP. They put up great numbers. But harden in the system, they said, you know, we don't change the system little bit. This guy is so special. So the system has evolved around hardens ability to, you know, some I'm gonna lift weights to make sure that I can still have the endurance lading games. I'm at work. My ball. Helen, I'm a work on finishing at the rim. All those things that you know, the the nounce should give him credit for because he has mastered those skills, what makes it more impressive to me is that he hasn't had an entire system built around him. But they have changed the system that Dan Tony system to perfectly show his individual skill set. You know, what other team did that this year the Milwaukee Bucks on defense? The Milwaukee Bucks built an entire defensive system. Took bud system. Tweaked it entirely built around a singular talent Jaanus his skills defensively with the way he can move on the court his length what he can do when you been system to your abilities. That shows how great of a player, you are and the effectiveness of isolation basketball. If you have a great isolation player and four shooters about as officially of a way you can play off into basketball now. It's not as pretty as the warriors ball movement passing system. I understand that. But the reason that this irked me, and I think other people it's because he used the word. It's like he's cheating the game. He's not cheating the game. He has hacked the system to a degree. He has figured out a way to exploit freedom of movement three being worth more than two modern NBA basketball more than anyone else and of other people could do it. They would do it. No one in the league's average more than twenty eight except for him was averaging thirty six and his team right now could be the two seat in the west. Like, there's no argument against the effectiveness of all right? Let's move on to the Lakers and the tumultuous year that has been their season with LeBron missing the playoffs for the first time in fourteen years. Focus shifted to the future who will be the next head coach, which big name will free agent pair with the king are the beaches in L A, really that nice. Lot of probing questions. One NBA scout has ripped the Lakers future. Saying magic has destroyed that place. Ace see agree. Magic johnson. You trust him rather to restore the Lakers. This is the thing. And I've been Noah magic long time since since I was a kid got a lot of respect for him. He's had tremendous amount of success. But I question the Billy to build what we would call success in Los Angeles with magic. Now if there was other supporting cast around magic Ginny bus, she capable being owner. Well, I mean, what do you have to be capable of doing because she's the one that hired magic. So she's the one hire them. She can't make the basketball decisions so magical to make all the basketball ball decision. So do I think him, and rob Pelinka are out there pounding the pavement looking for that little bit of an edge that, you know, something this is going to get us over. No, do I think that they're basketball philosophy is transcendent to the NBA. Am I concerned hail? Yeah. I'm a Lakers fan. I I would be concerned because it's not just the big time free agents. It's the glue. It's though no-one the salary cap little intricacies that you know, we can get this player for this. You know that we can put this guy on this type of contract. Those type of things win you a championship. Now, he's going to be under the microscope. But they're nothing has happened. And I knew LeBron was coming to LA no matter who was there. Okay. Lebron was coming to Laker. So no one can take credit for that. I've been concerned from the beginning that all these little small things that LeBron in both places that being the second trip to Cleveland and his first trip to Miami. He had people take care of those things for him and people wanted to join LeBron because the system and how they were playing right now. Now there, you know by taking no reduce salary to join the Lakers. Lebron, but that was critical in Cleveland in that championship those players at the end, you know, some men I will go there. The rate Allerton critical in Miami. All the man in the chemistry that they had their the faith. They had in the front office. No Jenna, I'm so I hate to do it. But I'm concerned as the Lakers fan. I'm concerned as someone is watching the NBA. And and know that those little things are very very important or issue. Chris was concerned before LeBron and the Lakers wherever attached the day. The Lakers hired Magic Johnson, Chris. And I were both living in L A at the time. Didn't even know yet gentlemen, not living together we live in right now. Crack not living together. It's been a lot of time. It is place a little nights in the months. A lot of time it is place. But I remember when it happened. And Chris said man, magic ease a great face of the business. But that doesn't mean he's in the weeds on these businesses that doesn't mean, he's the detail guy. And so when you hire magic, it's one thing, I think he could be Pat Riley a really sharp guy. But let me take Miami firmament, Pat Riley edition, meaning sharp guy is the face. Then they got a guy named Andy Ellsberg who's the brains of that operation there cap guy. They also have people that came up like spo- did the brand. Absa another basketball. You know, big time guy that understands the ins and outs of the NBA that they have his ear your guy. Danny aines is the face of the operation in Boston. You know, the brains are to Mike Zahren. None of it's Meigs. Erin. It's rare that the my pal in Houston, Darryl. He's maybe not always the best public face of the operation. But he's the face and the brains of the operation, but even he has a guy named garrison roses who might go become a GM somewhere this year. So the magic not going to be on the hot seat, but maybe rob Linke's because you have redundancy there, you have two guys who would be very good forward faces and nobody in the weeds doing the work could the Lakers this off season. Go say, hey, Mike, Zahren, you wanna be our GM? Hey Carson roses. You wanna be our GM magic soobee team president because rob Lincoln magic filled the same role relationship guy. Good. Looking guy charming guy guy that can get you in the room with anybody, rob because of his relationships being agent being Kobe's former agent and magic because he's magic. Leaping johnson. Like all that makes sense. But who is doing the work because even if the Lakers trade, let's say they trade for Anthony Davis. Well, they're gonna have a whole roster to Bill they're going to be trading away. All their young guys bright, and I'm just saying to the latest evidence the trade of the big man of the Lakers did that the zoo criminal it e the just real quick, this is an total. But it's important. It was after they had already been criticized for all these bad off season moves thirty two million dollars combined for Rondo Casey, KCPT, Beasley in jail that disaster that that was at the deadline. They think we're gonna make a playoff push. We need an open roster spot. They could just wave, Michael Beasley. He had tried to fight the coach. Yes. So you could just wave. Instead, they call the clippers unprompted and say, we'll give you zoo Botts, if you'll take Beasley along with him. And we want must Mike Mus Scala because we're going to end shooting. It was essentially zoo box from scholar trade. Are you kidding me, the clippers Jerry was talked about it? I guess what was reported. He talked about it. Then he went to dinner next said, you won't believe it. I didn't even call the Lakers. They called me over me, some I said, yes and hung up the phone like those types of things who is the smart guy there. Right. And so I'm not saying those guys aren't smart. But who's the smart guy? I don't know. I we're gonna break they're coming up to Jonah's lockup Hamby last night. That's still ahead on person. Back here. First things first were joined by former all pro running back, Brian Westbrook. Good morning, Brian happy Friday to you. Good to have you here today. Yeah. Needed it. Okay. All right to get fresh trying to be like UCLA China for the week. That weekend. Brian the Rams had one of the most high powered offenses in the league last year. We probably mentioned that at least three hundred times all season long putting up just three points in the Super Bowl fifty three and handing the patriots. They're six Super Bowl title has left a bad taste in their mouths. Rams. All pro offense. Tackle Andrew Whitworth. Coming back for his fourteenth season to answer the teams biggest question, how can we respond? I've rhyme. What's going to be the biggest challenge facing the Rams usually we talk about hangovers from a winning team coming back the next season. You know about a losing team trying to come back the next season and compete and do it better. You're laughing. I do know about. Going to be able to talk about it. Let me just wear my eagle green. And then ask you, just right? All about being tough. Here's the thing. I mean to play at that levels championship level to get to the Super Bowl. It's just hard to do repeatedly. Especially if you're not rewarded if you're not rewarded you didn't win that game. And I think the Rams have to take their play to the next level. They have to go to the next level. If they want to even give that teams in their division are getting better San frans- getting better. I think Seattle will come back even stronger next year. So they're going to have a harder road to get to that same point. I think the Rams have a couple issues they lost a couple offense alignment in the off season. And the health of Todd Gurley is probably the biggest concern. How do they keep him healthy? We talk about with top was able to do all season long. Obviously one of the best running backs in the league all season playoff the most important time with the season. He wasn't available. He just didn't get it done in the last two games of the season. And that's why they ended up losing. They did Todd Gurley is the engine that makes that offense worth. Sean McVay does a lot of window-dressing does a lot of fancy stuff. Pre snap talks whose quarterback longer than any other. Okay. Great. Well, you have is the best running back in football. And I saw video of him courtesy of our friends at TMZ last night limping to his car a guy who we are now in the April fifth and his knee does not appear. He doesn't appear healthy just walking around the reports that he is north Riddick condition. His knee that ain't great like that is as concerning to me as any offseason storyline. There is this is a great young player worthy of his draft. Right. I mean worthy of his draft status worthy of that contract worthy to be considered as a running back league MVP, and we're three months removing less football game. And he's limping around. That's to me the biggest concern bigger concern than golfing year, four bigger concern than replacing the talent that's going to leave on defense is what about Todd girlies knee. And would we've had a different Super Bowl. If Todd Gurley was Todd Gurley. The reason why the Rams are so explosive down the field and just put it on teams authencity because they average one hundred and thirty nine yards rushing n- every single gang able to run the ball that we'll talk early able to get the catch the ball out of the backfield. Then that user play action pass to get down the field to the receivers. And they continue to beat up on teams that way because teams had some respect tog early. You're talking to the last two games. C J Anderson Todd Gurley combined for one hundred eleven yards rushing in the last two. This is a team that average one hundred thirty nine yards per game. They just weren't able to do it physically in the run game. The other thing is this when you're talking about a team that that that throws the ball the way that they did team said, okay? Listen this where we're going to do we're going to allow you to run the ball a little bit. We're not going to suck up when the play action pass it. We're gonna make you nickel and dime. All the way down the field, Jared Goff ta and McVeigh. They were not willing to do that. They were impatient at times and they're often suffer because of that. Well, let's talk about. The last game. We saw you talked about the last couple of games inability to build a run the football. That's the patriots in Super Bowl fifty three. And then a NFC championship game against the saints. It seemed like later in the season teams had them booked offensively and defensively and we're ready for the Rams attack. So huge concerns about Todd Gurley. My concern is with with McVeigh in what type of adjustments will they make defensively because in the Super Bowl didn't have a linebacker started that way, more in two hundred and thirty pounds and Shaam McVay. Everyone likes him and everything. Nice young Cote. He got out Kotida Super Bowl because Bill Bill. Check looked at his roster and sit Corey Lewellen two hundred twenty eight pounds. We're going to run at him, Mark, Barron. He was a safety at Alabama. And with the Rams earlier. We're going to run the ball right down their throat right over in Dhamma consume and Aaron Donald Aaron Donald twenty-six during the regular season. No sacks in the playoffs. So those are adjustments that I'm looking for the Rams to try to build a half to make in. Now, they got that first place scheduled. They got a lot of eyeballs on them. How will they react last year? They reacted free agency people. It was like oh man this locker room they did. Well as far as that. But they have to build a make some judgments if Todd Gurley is not one hundred percent. And I doubt that we're ever going to see the Todd Gurley that we did. That's why you see him limping at this point. I do believe that he has a arthritic, knee and guys don't recover from that. So Now, Sean McVeigh do with Jared golf, but the defense you gotta get bigger. Because in the biggest game that you play Bella check out coach out scheme you by simplifying the game is I'm bigger I'm stronger new we're going to fight this game in a phone booth. And that's how the patriots won to win in the playoffs. You have to be able to run the football and stop the run. They weren't able to do. Either at battled a bad knee. My entire crew tore my ACL in ninety six and I. No, it doesn't get better as you get older it gets harder and harder every single week to get out there and play it gets harder and harder to participate and help your team. I'm concerned about tiger. This you we know how competitive the divisions gonna be. Yes, they're gonna have a first place schedule this year. But there's gotta be an emotional toll. It's got to be an emotional toll. It takes on you. When you worked so hard to get to the Super Bowl you came up short. And now, you gotta all go back to the starting point. And try to all get and you have really nothing to show for except that you got there. I mean, how hard is that what you were talking about it? It's one it's hard to start a new season over no matter what. But when you have as long season as you can have work as hard as you can work, and it doesn't get paid off. In fact, instead of it being paid off you deal with the most crushing loss of your athletic life to then come in. Okay. It's all his first training camp with you're right? That's the absolute harp part. Because you saying, hey, my body's already tired of loss of month of extra time that I could rest, and then I have to work Justice. Probably a little bit harder. Because just like you mentioned they're going to get the one of the hardest schedules in the league this season is going to be a tough task form. It's going to depend on Shamanee. Get this team ready jerk off is going to have to carry them. Just a little bit more than he did. I feel back to because look on the other side of the story to glasses more than half full. There's only one team had a better season to those. And that's the team that would world champions the season before they've made great progress getting into the playoffs when playoff game going on the road beating the saints huge. And most of their core players are younger players. So they got a lot to look forward to so expect the Rams the be there. They just have to make the judgements that need to be made when you lose the Super Bowl which other teams haven't responded great to in years past. All right, final see a little later on on the show. Take a break. Coming up did Jaanus in the box purvey can make a title Ron with a win over the Sixers last night that is next this Percy. I. Welcome back to first things. First triple h one of the biggest stars in the history of professional wrestling from his run as a co founder of degeneration next to his epic battles with the likes of the rock. Stone cold Steve Austin, the undertaker John CENA, the four-time fourteen time world champion has been synonymous with WWE for nearly three decades where lucky to be joined by Paul triple h Leveque now Paul thanks so much. Doodo some three decades. That's why kind of mumbled over that part. Three decades is a long time. How much worse. I. Emphasize the point out. How much has changed since you broke onto the scene everything? Yeah. Just everything from from from the start of it to the wave fans interact. The internet has changed all of that. It's really twenty four seven. Now, they're into your lives and everything, but just the business it sell from where we are as a company from how we relate and take care of our talent to our wellness policies to are just every component of it. The performers are professionals the the every aspect of what they do has been raised to another level of professionalism. And and you see that across the board. And it's carried over in everything we do with our partners and BC new Fox Sports. It's it's it's now just it's where it should be not Paul. You have a unique perspective because being involved in three different decades. Like you seen it evolve. Not only from being right there. As one of the stars won the founding. They're found in on you and your ability. But now you're on the business is so give me a little bit. What's changed from the athletic side of things? And now you're trying to transfer. You're putting on a total different hat on the business side in that typically with athletes, which struggle trying to manage that transitioning over I always had a fascination with the bind the scenes of the business, even when I was a performer, and what it took and what it would take you to to do to get to that next level. For me. I've watched that transition as you said from starting out at wrestlemainia, I wasn't there. But as a fan watching wrestlemainia one closed, circuit television, Madison Square Garden to where we are. Now, you know stadium shows, you know, it transitioned from close circuit to pay per view. To doing stadium shows on our own OT network, the WWE network, and you can watch wrestlemainia this Sunday or or takeover an takeover tonight from the Barclay center on our W W network on any device, you have a phone computer, you television. It doesn't matter. You can stream it to anywhere. You know, that that transition has been amazing. But for me to be on the business side of it. Now trying to find that next level of athlete when I started in the business, you really there was no path to get to the WWE. It was like saying I wanna be a trapeze artist. Would you start? My job. Now, a big part of it is trying to give that path to people to to go to every country around the world and look for athletes, whether they come from Kabbadi or cushy or or something in India to whether they're martial arts around the world or Olympic athletes are strowman. It doesn't matter. We're looking everywhere for them and giving them that pathway an opportunity to come to the WWE training them out of our performance center in Orlando and turning them into the superstars tomorrow. And that systematic plan has been the biggest change probably fundamentally in our business. And we're gonna talk more about the next part of your business and a moment, but I want to I don't want people to be full now that picture that we have right there. I don't know when that picture was taken, but they're going to be taking a similar picture here at wrestlemainia like we were talking off the air. In addition to being the business side of things. I mean, you're fighting Batista on at wrestlemanias. So you have to also be training twice a day. You said to get ready for that tell. Tell us about what you expect in that match while you I mean, you're kind of his boss, but I don't think he's going to care in the moment in the no holds barred match wrestlemainia. Oh, yeah. It might make it worse. You know, how do you really prepare to step into the ring with drags the destroyer from guardians of the galaxy? Right. It's it's a it's a difficult thing. But Thiessen I have a long history. He's one of the most physical guys in the business and. To you point. I I wear a suit on a daily basis now stay in shape, but to get ready for something like getting in the ring with Dave in front of seventy five thousand people at MetLife stadium. This sunday. It's a whole different level of preparation, and I'm coming off of an injury at the end of last year where I tore my back in in the Middle East and trying to come back from that when you closing in on fifty at the tail end of it, and this point the opportunity for for me to step in front of our fans on that level. There's no experience legged in the world. I don't care. What else you do the the energy the excitement, the if you step into that to MetLife stadium on Sunday, you can cut that tension with a knife that feel that probable energy that just there's nothing else like our fan base in the world excited. I got one in the commercial break. He did say you work out. You did. I thought you Burke's on the floor. It's in my contract that I'm no longer allowed to win you're in the room, but I will tell you. It is exciting to know that for the first time a a women's match will be the main event wrestlemainia, Ronda Rousey of Charlotte, flare. Becky Lynch will all be competing to take him to championship belts. How important how important are women to the future now of the WWE? Kim stated enough, you know, they they are every bit as important as everybody else. And that's the thing to me. I think to even say the women versus the men now, I just I wish we just say superstars because they're all equal. It's it's what the biggest event is. What's the biggest match? What's the biggest promotional element because the athlete a schism the heart the desire, everything they put into it is the same, you know, and as the world has become more accepting of of female athletes, and their place in the world WWE has been able to step into that. Because we've had the athletes they're ready to go, and our male talent are supportive of them. Right. The ki they've embraced it as much as they want to be the main event this Sunday at wrestlemainia, you see these guys saying, well, I want to be the main event, but they deserve to be the main event just as a quick follow up. How important is it for you? Because you're out there recruiting talent. Yeah. I mean, you're picking the groceries. So you're out there. You're in control of the how important is it for you that we see some type of Bali. As far as the male and the female. It's it's massive. When when I first started that process with our developmental system. Even annex t I didn't understand it just was foreign to me the difference. Why are we training women differently? Why are we doing this differently? I wanna recruit athletes that can do this better than anybody else. I want the same charisma. Same dedication the same professionalism. The men have we're going to train them the exact same way. And then we're just going to give him a platform. And when we've given them that platform, they've knocked it out of the park every single time. I'm more often than not watch in annexed t-, raw smackdown. Wrestlemainia more often than not watch the guys watching the women's match going. I'm gonna have to step it up. You know what I mean? Let's talk more about inex- t takeover. People aren't familiar or as familiar with their seven tonight seven eastern, I should say on WW network. It's become I would say right there on the business side of things for you, a huge part of your legacy like people always know you as triple h in the pedigree and all of that. But on the business side. This is first paragraph type of stuff when they're describing who you've been what you've explained a little bit. Why it's so important, but tell us a little bit more about not only the importance, but the process for you in finding these next generation of superstars as you. As you go through the world, and you recruit you find this next level of athlete, and and you tried to train them and give them go in the thing. You have to do is then give them the platform to succeed on and it'll make them stars. And he does that. And as we started the brand very quickly became massively popular became our third touring brand we do two hundred live events in year our takeover events sell out, they trend globally worldwide. It's. Let us to starting a UK version of the annex t brand that's based there. And and we'll do that around the world, but it has become in essence for me. It was going out in creating the college football feeder system to the NFL. And that is exactly what we did with this. And you see that right now on Ron smackdown. Eighty percent of that roster. Lebron's smackdown came directly out of annex t they were already stars to a large portion of our fan base that got moved up into rawal smackdown. You'll see almost all the matches. I set except I think one or two that happened to have thirty year veterans in them. They came out of that system. All these matches the superstars that you. See of today came from there. The superstars of tomorrow, you will watch tonight on takeover, and, you know, much like in college football or anything else you can feel their hunger. They are here, and they're trying to get to here, and there hunger and their passion, and they're driving desire to get to that next level. It's it really shows in the in the product on because I came up in your ear in that a two-tier, and when I came up there was the Monday night wars was rall was the biggest thing going, and then smackdown came along was I was at I don't know. What was the first ever one of the first number smackdown? Vince was in Kansas City. I remember being there in my teenage years beat up the raw. And then I'm sure you do. And so, but but I I remember being I might have been the first, but regardless now smackdown coming to FOX. Starting. I think it's Tober fourth Friday October fourth. It is become any norm. As part of your guys success. Can you tell the a little bit about the growth of smackdown in the importance of it? It's been huge. You know, the one thing with Debbie fan base, Debbie universe. Seemingly the more. We give them the more they want, and when we gave them smackdown was debate internally. Do we really need to show, and we gave them smackdown? They gravitated towards it. The shows inherently have a slightly different field. But I can tell you as important as it has been this opportunity for us with FOX and step to another ole mother level, and what FOX brings to the table as the the kind of permanent brand for for sports out there and putting sports out there. They are the leaders. And when it comes to that us to be on there and have that backing and the partnership of, you know, the NFL games and NC double A and major league baseball and everything that sits within that world for us to be a part of that. And to connect to that is massive for US Vice versa. We'll bring an entertainment component. And that you see often copied in sport. We'll bring that to the table as well. So while I think smackdown has been massively important wait until October fourth October fourth on FOX singles your whole 'nother level. This thing. Smackdown will become bigger than anybody could have ever imagined it because of this partnership it's going to it's going to be incredible do now get to break a little news that should get the WWE universe buzzing beginning this fall right here on one. We'll be launching a new weekly WWE studio show on Tuesday nights completely separate from smackdown. We're just talking about the show's gonna discuss everything going on in WWE universe, including smackdown. Monday night raw. Yes. Triple eight your baby and exte- more details to calm. We don't wanna spill all the beans, but the show will feature some faces very familiar to the WWE universe spoke from the past and the present there you have it AAA ch-. What do you think? This is something we wanted to happen for a long time. I think this is the perfect. Opportunity for a studio show for us. You know, it kind of because of the sports entertainment aspect of it. It's an analyst show where you're talking about the athlete component of it. It's also an entertainment talking about where things are going and the story lines in the characters and all of it. This is going to be one of those shows that if you are a WWE fan across the board. This is the show that will be can't miss because it's going to talk about everything you love in a way that you can't get any place else existed anywhere. Boards and things people discussing this type of thing, but someone recognizing there's the leading part of it. But then there's the storyline aspect which is really what brings people back every week. They've never had this type of professional official analysis weekly basis. Take people deeper into the personal lives and the data days of what goes on behind the scenes to being a WWE superstar and all everything that goes with that success that failure that heartbreak. That's all that that elation of wrestlemainia moments all of it. Thank you for listening to the first things first podcast. Remember, leave us a review and tell us what you think subscribe to the podcast on apple podcasts and catch us on f s one Monday through Friday, six thirty AM Easter for Chris Carter, Nick Reich. I'm Jenna Wolfe so long everybody.

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Oscar nominated filmmaker Nicole Holofcener

Bullseye with Jesse Thorn

35:45 min | 1 year ago

Oscar nominated filmmaker Nicole Holofcener

"Support for this NPR podcast and the following message. Come from NBC's new drummer the enemy within Erica shepherd betrayed her country. Now, she's the F B is only hope in stopping America's greatest enemy. But can she trusted Mondays beginning February twenty fifth on NBC? Bullseye with Jesse thorn is a production of maximum fun dot org and is distributed by NPR. Jesse thorn, it's bowls. I. My guest is Nicole hall of center, and I talked last year, he's a writer director. She makes quiet films. Sometimes sad melancholic her protagonists are usually female almost always complex and flawed. And if you haven't seen her work before he is brilliant. She was profiled recently in the New Yorker, and I think this line sums up her work. Pretty well. Often movies are about people confronting extraordinary problems, and overcoming them hall of centers films tend to be about people confronting ordinary circumstances and falling short because they're afraid of getting hurt or getting old or simply of changing she's worked with some truly great actors. Julia Louis Dreyfuss and James Gandolfini in enough said, Catherine keener and Francis McDormand in friends with money. Her latest film is called the land of steady habits. It's based on the novel by Ted Thompson it centers on a guy named Anders. He's middle aged. Retired from finance. It's played by the actor. Ben Mendelsohn Anders is going through kind of late midlife crisis. He just left his wife played by ED Falco, but they still live in the same fancy part of Connecticut. He's worried about his adult, son. He's doing drugs, and he's just having trouble figuring out where he fits in these days like in this scene from early on in the film. Anders is getting a drink with his friend. Larry another divorce Anders is having regrets. His family has moved on a lot easier than he thought they would after he left, and as we're about to hear Larry is trying to comfort him I used to have this vision. My life was like a web Andy's threats the connected me, you know, and the more webs could have coming from you that then the more important were like, so if you're a doctor, you cure, a bunch of patients, then or a teacher, you got million threads, you know. And and you would be basically irreplaceable right because so many people dependent on you. You wanted to stay on this. Webs and. Yup. But it's really not the case. No, it's the where the web is is is remaking itself revising itself every second of every day. So if you vanish then the people that were in your life, they learned to rely on someone else, and you're gone, and then the web just remakes itself and moved on without you. Nicole haw center. I'm so glad to have you back on bullseye. Thank you for coming back on the show. Thanks for having me is this movie is kind of about dudes. Yeah. I guess they they're male. I mean, there's look they're central female characters in the story as well. But there's a father in two sons who are really the the heart of this movie. And I wonder if you had to like choose that, you could make a movie about dudes because I don't know if you know, this there are a lot of movies about dudes already know. I thought we needed one more is there is such a shortage dudes having a midlife crisis to right. Finally, how original, but I love this story so much and the fact that it has dudes was nice. I like men, and I know they have feelings too. And. Have legitimate problems? And I loved the characters in the problems they had. So there you go guys was it something where? Like, I sincerely don't believe you have a special responsibility to chronicle the lives of women. Thank you do. I. Okay. So let's stipulate to that. But did you have to think about it for a second and say, okay, this is this is going to be about dudes, all my all my other movies were mostly not exclusively. But mostly about women. And it's okay for me to make a movie about dudes. I've made a lot of movies, and it's not my job to fix Hollywood. Now, nor can I unfortunately now, I mean, he was wondering why you hadn't so. Yeah, I'm tr-. I I was trying I up I just go where my heart follows item, not making political statements with my movies, certainly not with this one, you know, in political climate that is right now, this is not the movie that you know, someone's should be making yet why not. This is a beautiful story. I think and there's room for that. No matter the gender. How is it different for you to direct you director lot of television, including some of my favorite television. You directed some of my favorite bored to death's, for example, which is one of my favorite shows ever, the case of the stolen sperm. Yeah. That's a good one. How's it different for you? As someone who has for the most part written the movies that you direct like it's this big intense five year process for you to get a movie into theaters because you know, you're making small to medium scale movies writing them yourself, you know, presumably working on producing them as well. And so on and so forth. Like, it's this big deal. Whereas when you directing television, you're you're just like there for a little while on where everyone else knows. Yeah. It can be really uncomfortable. Like being the new kid at school each time. But the new kid at school isn't in charge. Oh, yeah. That's true. That's true. You have to listen to me. And you don't know me, and I'm on your turf, there's only been a couple of times where I felt really uncomfortable. And that played out exactly as you said like, it just was kind of tortuous where I think the actors were sick of visiting directors sick of being directed by people who didn't you know, aren't there all the time or it's an unhappy set? But generally, I felt really welcomed and actors wanted to be directed by me so few. Do you think that your skill set is suited to? What a television director does. I think a certain kind of television director certainly certain kind of shows, I wouldn't know what to do with a three cameras show, you know, in that like a sitcom or anything I'd be lost. But the shows that I direct feel like little movies, or if they don't, you know, I just direct them as if I was directing a movie, I don't see any difference, except that I have to please the writer and the producer and since I work on shows that I really like or love than I feel honored to do that. So does it come easily to you? I mean as someone who has successfully directed many films where you are. You know, in a film that director is the be all end all at least, you know. I am. Okay. Yeah. For sure is that what you're you're. You're doing this job. And you're doing it for to please someone else. Ultimately, right. Like you have artistic input as well. But you have to do it the way that they like it and some ways you have to you have to match the way other people have done it to some extent. So yeah. In fact, I try to you know, I don't feel like I have to reinvent this show with my vision, I feel respectful of what's already come before. And I do want to have my voice in there a little stamp in there. But yeah, I wanted to be kind of seamless not notice like oh that actors finally good or that actors finally bad people compliment me on my specific episodes, and I don't feel really right to take credit. I feel like I can I curse on this show. Believe it out. I didn't get up. You know, if I don't screw it up. Then I've done my job. You know? I if I did a good job, that's even better. But yeah, it's you know, it's different one a police somebody else. Yes. But and so it's more like a job in that respect. Like, I can't overrule anybody's taste. I can't always rely on my own taste. But so far people have wanted my tastes they've wanted. They've trusted me enough mostly to do it. And you know, it's a it's a great job. I make good money in residuals and meet actors. I would never meet or DP's that I might wanna work with, you know, it's it's better than sitting, you know, in my house writing forever. Do you find yourself when you're working on television, doing more asking rather than telling I mean, I think I presume that when you're on a movie, especially when you've written it and someone says I own I'm not sure what this is. You're the one who knows? Should. Sometimes they don't but right on a TV show. Yeah. I might say so how would you react in this? You know, and what come what came right before this or what about this character? Should I be aware of? Yeah. And then I tell them. After tell at some point. I think there are a lot of directors who. You know, one of the reasons that they became directors other than you know, our? Well, they yeah, it's not not necessarily because they desired power. But because they were comfortable wielding it. Like, I think that one of the reasons that people with social privilege are disproportionately represented in the ranks of directors is because they don't question their entitlement, basically. Yeah. Totally is that what you're going to say totally. I mean, I was going to say go back to privilege, maybe but privilege and entitlement often go hand in hand. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Hey, said the straightway to to the straight might woman. I think I think that. Yeah. I didn't I'm more comfortable directing. Then I am sitting right here. Not right now talking to you. I'm more nervous right now imagining that this is going to be on the airwaves, and the sound of my voice and all that crap. But when I'm directing, of course, I get nervous. And of course, I make mistakes. But it really feels like I'm in the right place. I'm utilizing all of the creativity that I have that I want to express sounds corny. But it's true. Did you feel that way when you were young? I mean, you spend time on movie sets as a kid because you're stepfather was and legendary producer. Did you look at that? And think this is something I want or something I could do when you were a teenager or whatever. No on the film sets that I was on as a little kid and then later as a production assistant. I was nowhere near the director or the action. And I didn't know what was going on. You know, I'd see some the director whisper into an actor's ear, and I couldn't imagine. What brilliant advice he was giving her ha now, I know it's like sit to the left sit up straight. So I didn't know what really directing was or it didn't occur to me that I could do that at all. How did you come to believe that you could? Because I think at some point you have to believe that you could in order to actually do it. Right. Yeah. Isn't that? Crazy. I wonder what made me think I could do it. I directed a short at NYU that was probably one of the worst times in my life. I I mean making the movie I was so in over my head that I literally wished I would get hit by a car. I was so anxious. I was really like one of the first times I felt serious anxiety. And then my producer was in over his head was throwing up in the bathroom, and the movie cost too much money and took forever. And then I thought okay, I'll be a writer, and then I started writing a bunch and went to Columbia grad school for writing. See, but they make you direct videos, and so when I was directing the videos, I thought okay, I'm better at this. Now, I like this and they turned out. Well, so I thought okay, I'm going to try directing again, we'll continue my conversation with Nicole hall of center after a quick break. She'll tell me why she isn't really interested in making movies about people who are likable. It's bullseye for maximum fun dot org. An NPR. Support for this podcast. And the following message comes from Babbel, have you always wanted to speak a new language whether it's for travel work for brain training. Babbel's ten to fifteen minute lessons will get you. Speaking confidently in your new language, choose from Spanish, French and more you'll learn through real life dialogue, speech, recognition and interactive trainers. And Babbel's spaced repetition method actually makes you remember what you've learned download the app or go to Babbel, B A B E L dot com to try babble for free. Amazon Google Facebook big companies are getting relief being is that a problem listened to planet. Money's new series on big business competition and antitrust law in America, that's on planet money. There's nothing quite like sailing in the calm international waters on my ship. The s s biopic. It's actually pronounced bio pic dangerous. It's by opera. It's by OPEC because this was a word biography picture. All right. That is enough a Hawaii. I'm Dave Holmes? I'm the host of the newly rebooted podcast, formerly known as international waters designed to resolve petty. But persistent arguments like this how by pitting two teams of opinionated comedians against each other with trivia, and improv games, of course, winner takes home the right to be right. What podcasts be this troubled waters where we disagree two disagree? Welcome back to bullseye. I'm Jesse thorn right now, we're listening to my twenty eighteen conversation with Nicole hall of center. She's a writer and director some of her films include friends with money and enough said she's also worked on TV shows like parks and recreation, orange is the new black and sex in the city. Her latest work is a film called the land of steady habits out now on net. Flicks. You grew apart in New York and partly in Los Angeles. Yes. And you move from one to the other when you were like twelve exactly I cannot imagine a time in my life when I would less liked to have a disjuncture that big. Yeah. That was rough was my choice. Although at the time, I was in with a bunch of mean girls when I was twelve in New York City, and I seem to be drawn to mean girls. I was when I was younger cool. No, I think you're with. Viewer with the meager little cool. And then they realized how vulnerable I was then they realize what a target. I was. And and so they were funny. You know, mean girls are funny and smart, and I was drawn to that. And then until they turn on me, then they're not. And when I was leaving New York that was sort of happening, and I was looking forward to getting away from these girls but moving away from my dad at the time was really hard. He lived in you know, near the city. And of course, I, you know, was drawn to more mean girls, and then I got bullied in my new school. Then eventually, I found some real good friends, but I had long hair down to here. I had zits. You know, I didn't were brought was like New York in the in the sixties or seven seventies completely different than the Los Angeles girls. And I tried to be one. What was it like when you get those? I had to take the bus which was really weird. I was used to the subway and walk to a bus, which was very strange, and I didn't I felt like I didn't fit in until I started buying the clothes. Everybody else was. And then before I knew it. I was I was I fit in. I don't know. I just did. And I like we got to have a dog and a completely different lifestyle. You know, New York was pretty rough in the early seventies sixties, and I was exposed to a lot of stuff. I got you know, flashed bunch times when I was a kid in New York, and then I came to L A, and I was on the bus and some guy was doing it. And I'm like, but I'm in LA. What are they follow me here? Exactly I thought. Yeah. I thought only the perverts only lived in New York, but alas they're everywhere that sucks it does. And all of us, all my friends. We are all aware of it. So we joke about it and be try to act tough about it. But it was scarring. Did you have to be tough about stuff in general? Did you have to have that kind of toughness fits walk around like is up. You know, what I'm talking about -solutely, especially in New York. I mean, I took the subway when I was like eight with my my sister. And so we were hyper aware and vigilant and acted tough until you know, we got threatened, and then you know, we were puddles of tears, but I I think I still act tough. I think people think I'm tough, and I'm so not tough. I my feelings get hurt just like everyone else's or more. I like to think or it feels like I do. But then I have a kind of gruff blunt exterior that doesn't really well, you know, it is a part of me. But so is the other do you think that's partly because show business was very unforgiving. If you are a sensitive person, you'd better have a graph blunt exterior because otherwise the you've going to die from all the people telling you exactly what's wrong with the things that you created that are most important now. That's where I turned into a puddle of tears. But yeah, this is a very tough competitive business. I've had you know, been destroyed emotionally a million times. And and I'm one of the lucky ones. So just imagine. And also, it's just part of my personality. I think it's part of my humor is that. I can be kind of blunt and outspoken, and it makes me seem like I'm tough girl. And then I find out I'm hurting someone's feelings, I'm not so tough. I'm just an idiot. Is there a time that you can tell me over time at you. Regretted something that you were being having a tough girl blunt outspoken ex Pat, I was probably telling somebody that I didn't know that they had bad breath. Because I want someone to tell me or, you know, I've accused someone I barely know like did you fart, and because I just I like I like talking about things that we all know about. But don't talk about. I have that kind of thrill, and I'm sure I've offended people, especially with the breath thing. I mean, that's like a big part of your movies, not bad breath, specifically, although there is some chewing sounds talking in a new movie there isn't bad breath in friends with money. There. I go. Yeah. But it's obvious that you get such a kick out of airing something that is supposed to be an intimate secret. Right. Yeah. I mean, so much a friends with money was about that for me. It was it was exciting in that way. I like to ask if I'm sitting with a close friend and they're talking about a good job. They just got. I might say, oh how much are you making and to see the look on their face. Like is it safe to tell you what we think of me? And I often just tell someone what I'm making. 'cause I know they want to know, and I'm either thrilled or ashamed or embarrassed. But that's what it is. Yeah. I I don't think I think people have too many secrets people are too ashamed in general, including myself, this movie the land of study habits is about substantially parents relationships with their children, I found that it terrified me as it should. I understand terrifies me too. Was that part of what resonated with you? When you read the novel, the kind of tower of not knowing what your children would be in not being able to control it. I think so. Yeah. Consciously or unconsciously? That's I mean, I worry about my twenty year old twin boys all the time. And it's a real lesson to let them be who they are. And to try not to worry and to stay out of their hair. You know, the drug years are really scary. Whether they did drugs or not, you know, you're just in terror, and they lie and do all the normal things. But these characters I guess were kind of a mother's worst fear one more than another. But you know, Preston's characters really like he goes to north western and then he lays on the couch. I mean, that's that's a really scary prospect. Let's hear another clip from my guests, Nicole hall of centers new film, which is called the land of steady habits Andrews is the protagonist of the film and in this scene. He hanging out with Charlie who's the teenage son of some family friends. They're both getting high and Charlie just talked about how he doesn't understand his dad. Anders starts talking about his own son. Preston, you know, why is when he was a kid. He had big floppy bear was like a big saggy. Air and he carried it everywhere. And I mean everywhere, and he held onto that name on it that way too long way past time when in was supposed to be hanging onto a bear. You know, so we took it out, and we hit it, and we pretended that it was a lost. Because we were we were worried about in being paid or. That he wouldn't grow up or some bull. I don't know. Oh god. He was so betrayed. We trade him. He was devastated. He was heartbroken. West inactivate baron. Sad. Yeah. That Ted Thompson. He's a good novelist and Ben Mendelsohn good actor. We were actually very good writer director. Thank you. Thanks. Have you ever retrospectively thought? Wow. I failed my child in a way that. Did not realize at the time. Anyone feels that our children on purpose? No. Of course, not I'm sure and I'll find out more. They get older and angrier. And we start having therapy sessions together, certainly I will learn more, and I have to accept that. You know, I want to be a perfect parent. I never wanna hurt my kids and to find out, you know, you were supposed to protect your child is hurt. Hurt them is just really horrible feeling, but we all make steaks, and that you know, I've made some I'm sure do you worry about whether you're doing the right thing as much as the characters in your movies too. Oh, gee. Yeah. I suppose I I am aware. I worry if I'm doing the right thing. Yeah. Right. Not not as much. I mean, you know, the character that Ben Mendelsohn plays. You know, he makes a lot of mistakes. He's not doing the right thing. I'm not drawn to those kind of mistakes. Thankfully, I think I have a better head on my shoulders. But that doesn't keep me from, you know, being insecure about how I behaved somewhere what I said. Or what I'm saying right now. Who's feelings of my gonna hurt or whatever? Yeah. Your movies have such sympathy for people who are making mistakes. There isn't anybody in your movies who isn't making mistakes for the most part. Like, there's no, you know, there's a lot of Hercules is in your. Now, there aren't I can think of Simon McBurney in friends with money. He was a pretty good guy and being torn apart by his wife who had a lot of problems, but he kind of shows himself. I think to be well rounded, healthy person. Are you like constantly making a list in your head of Catherine keener 's and Hiti Falco's and James Gandolfini as Julia Louis Dreyfuss, these people that can do can do jerky mean little things, and you still just want to give them. Yeah. And a lead in a movie. Yeah. I mean, that's what land the land of study habits. You know, Ben Mendelsohn plays. This kind of somewhat reprehensible person, really, selfish, narcissistic. Insecure ashamed lonely person who makes bad mistakes. And you know, when I was casting the movie or thinking about who I wanted. I felt like he had all of that in his face. He could have all of that and his face. He's such a good actor. And and also, it's you know, sometimes it's the way someone talks are it's literally the shape of their face. You know, like, Catherine. I don't know everything she says, and does makes it more interesting to me then most actors, so she's really funny really now joke she kind of has a little bit of sad is. Yes. Absolutely. And so everything is colored little bit by this ad is which I love, you know. I mean, if you cast her in the proper thing, that's fantastic. But that's what makes her deep and same with Ben Ben has sad eyes. Those is I mean, he he just draws you in, and I hope that you know. People. They don't have to love him or like him. But as long as you're immersed in his growth are his story and entertained by great. I was thinking when I watched the movie mission impossible. Yes. That Tom Cruise, and I may be about mess up my chances of ever having type Tom Cruise. If you're listening to this right now, you're more than welcome to come on this program. I'd be fascinated to talk with you. He's not listening. You don't seem like a real human being? But I know you are no you must be because I believe all people are. But like it Tom Cruise in that movie like he's super human. Right your I've met him. So so it's totally great movie. Yeah. But he's super human in it, and he's absolutely credible as superhuman because of his. Astonishing and a parent certitude like the conviction, and he must just be like this because it like he must know how to enhance it for the screen. But like he must have some this must be a real quality of it. Well, we've seen it. I think in interviews. Yeah. When when people have laughed at him for seeming unhinged. It is for that. Exact same reason. Right. The couch. Yeah. Yeah. And. That is like one quality of movie stardom, which is you can credibly be anything like beyond the world like anything in the world. I feel like the other quality of movie stardom is if you can be a jerk, and we believe that you are doing your best. Yeah. I'm like like you for that. Right. Doing your best. That's that counts for a lot. Does. I I don't have any elaboration. Have you ever seen those show? Always it's always sunny in Philadelphia. Shout. So it's yeah. I love it too. I'm amazed that it's still so great thirteen years overlying making it I really wanna work with Caitlin Olsen. So she sells a really brilliant. Larry's in that. Joe? And. I was thinking why do I like these characters who are monsters in f-, literally every way and idiots both idiots and monsters. They're not just a moral. Their immoral almost always think they're terrific people. And they think they're terrific people. They're completely looted lake. And I was like, okay. Well, number one, their friends, and I like things about friends and number two. They're doing their best. Right. Actually, they don't think they're good people. They know they're bad people, but they're doing their best at being themselves something what they want. No, it's relentlessly funny. And they're all. Yeah. Reprehensible. Yeah, love it. Like when I remember watching friends with money being mad at every character in the movie. Really? In a bad way. No, no, no, not in a bad way. I actually really like your movies as I said a bunch of times, so far you're one of my all time phase. But like watching and being mad at this jerks at all these jerks, right, but still really caring about them wanting happiness for them and like believing in them in a weird way. You know what I mean? And that is not a common thing in film. Maybe one person like that in a movie, you know, you get one Catherine keener, you tend to make comp- construct movies out of those people. Yeah. I guess they're all you know, people inside of me and my life, you know, people in my life, and it's just not interesting to make easy going people. I mean, even the dude, you know, easygoing likeable person. But boy does he but he's but he's doing his best. Yeah. That's just what's interesting to me. I like to see movies about, you know, if it's not going to be conflict like, you know, finding the buried treasure better be conflict within somebody's soul, Nicole hav center. I'm so grateful to you for coming back on the show and for your movies as well. I just admire them so much. Thank you so much that makes me happy. The Cole hall of center. What am my all time? Fades the land of study habits is streaming now on net flicks. You can watch it. And hey, here's a hot tip. If you didn't see enough sad. Like, I think it was one of the most a lovely and moving and hilarious romantic comedies of the last ten or twenty years. That's the end of another episode of bulls. Eye bulls eye is recorded at maximum fund dot org world headquarters. Overlooking MacArthur park, beautiful Los Angeles, California where just yesterday there was a crane so huge that it stretched far beyond our ninth floor window. We think it was lifting elevator parts into our building. I mean, it was truly gargantuan. I cannot overstate how huge this crane was. Or how weird it was to see it. Power up in front of our you know in front of our big picture windows. The show is produced by speaking into microphones, our producer is Kevin Ferguson. Hey, soussan Brosio is our associate producer. We get help from Casey O'Brien our production. Fellow is Shane into Loria. Are interstitial music the music, you are hearing right now and in between segments, and so forth comes from DJ w aka the great, Dan wall. World's handsome record collector. Thanks for sharing it with us, Dan or theme song is called huddle formation. It's by the band the go team they in their label. Memphis industries, provided it to us. Our thanks go to both of them. And before you go I have been making this show for over fifteen years coming up on twenty years since I was in college, and I have interviewed so many hundreds of people and almost every single episode that we have ever recorded is archived on our website at maximum fund dot org. You can also find our recent interviews on YouTube where they are easy to play and share. Everybody knows how to watch a video on YouTube bright, you can also find them on Facebook. You can find us on Twitter at bullseye or just search for bullseye with Jesse thorn. You will find all of those things and plenty of stuff to listen to. I guess that's about it. Just remember all radio host mature Selena. Bullseye with Jesse thorn is a production of maximum fund dot org can is distributed by NPR. Support for this podcast and the following message. Come from Comcast business having the nation's largest gig speed network was just the start. 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director Jesse thorn Nicole hall writer New York City NPR Ben Mendelsohn Anders Catherine keener producer Ben Mendelsohn Ted Thompson Larry Los Angeles America NBC Julia Louis Dreyfuss Nicole haw center James Gandolfini Hiti Falco
REShow: Peter King. Hour 1 (04-04-19)

The Rich Eisen Show

00:00 sec | 1 year ago

REShow: Peter King. Hour 1 (04-04-19)

"Orig- is on demand. Your show your schedule. Fifteen minutes after ball dot com. Check out the casts at richeisenshow dot com. Odd. Everybody. Welcome to our second day of free here in New York City where live in the AT studios in New York City right at the mouth of the Holland tunnel. Good to see Brockman del tufo back the sandwich you here. I mean, we have a jam packed show. Really you today. You just heard the guest list right there. They're all in studio. We're going from pop culture with the creators of the one of my favorite shows on TV billions. And Chris we're gonna start that interview at top of the second hour, David LeVine with some breaking news on the show. Nice. Breaking news on the show. I don't want to give away too much. All right. But that's happening everybody. Stay tuned. Big new huge news. I cannot stress. How big the news it? Okay. Pretty big show when it comes to billions and this show throwing it out there. That's a two one just drops. All right. Well, I just yeah. I'm dropping some droppings of crumbs here. Hank is areas. Coming in our number three one of our favorites. Brock Myers launched these three Obrock mar launched on a C last night. Taylor rooks from our Bleacher report family coming up. Peter King will be joining us here in a second and Manno, man. I just spent the last half hour. That's how long of a deep dive as they say in the business. This is I'm still going. You're still going. Yeah. Okay. On Bleacher report, as you know, we've got a new relationship with Leach report, rob bureau live every day. This is from the Biard MAG. So this is a long when you see magazine online. You know, it's a long raid. And this is by the reporter Tyler done who clearly has spent the last several weeks if not months trying to solve the rubik's cube. That is the Green Bay Packers. And what happened last year? That left Mike McCarthy the first Packers coach in sixty years to lose his job in the middle of the season after thirteen years at the controls making a Super Bowl eight playoff appearance, if he can go on and on and on about the relationship with him in Aaron Rodgers and Ted Thompson and what happened in Green Bay to cause them lose his job. And you point out Chris before the show. It's interesting that McCarthy made his first public comments since being fired. Yeah. Yesterday to ESPN's, rob demoss key. And when asked about his relationship with Rogers says what happens on the sidelines stays on the sidelines is like the sidelines Vegas, and and did not say his relationship with Rogers deteriorated spoken nothing. But glowing terms of Aaron Rodgers, and basically the target of his I r- and disappointment was at Mark Murphy, the president of the team saying that they have. Addled his departure awfully and I backed his play yesterday when you asked me about it. And I'm like well. Yeah, he had built all of this stuff. Right. He was the face of this franchise. When Brett farve was not kinda holy thing. It was not leaving. Right. And he took the bear the brunt of of Packer fans. I r- or far fans I r- and he also was faced front when people were criticizing the roster. Ted Thompson, I called him the ho- door of of of the NFL where he he could only basically say one word draft picks draft picks. That's it 'cause he signed no free agents. And so yeah, I mean him being bounced with a month to go when the fan base is really pissed after losing Narayanan clearly that the the season circling the drain in the green. Bay packers. We're not gonna make playoffs without an Rogers again that. The guy finished season, right? Now, I've read this article. And to clone this article. An expose is an understatement is a lot of unnamed sources in it. Yes. There's also some people that, you know, aren't fans of Aaron Rodgers like your Michael finley's been very vocal on that front. He puts his name cloak quotes. Somebody who was very critical of Aaron Rogers who put his name to quotes. I was a little surprised about Greg Jennings. He's been on our show few times, he has intimated that he and Erin were not on if you will the same page, but he really lays both barrels into Aaron Rodgers about him not letting relationships form between the quarterback and the wide receiver Jennings himself that anybody who spoke to players that had left the team. And Roger saw that he took it as a personal affront Jennings. Recounting story that went Jennings went up to far when far with the Vikings that Rogers had a problem with that. And he said that as well that Rogers was beginning to freeze receivers out that he didn't like. And that that happened. This is not according to Jennings, but according to Tyler sources that happened last year with all of those young wide receivers he was beginning to freeze them out because he didn't like them. He was how many times we're like, hey, hit the open man over you know, read over the middle field. Take the check down. Don't take the check down when he tried to play down the field. According to article, it's because he did not like also McCarthy's playcalling that he would in fact change the place in the middle of a game in the huddle. Yes. Sometimes making them up in the huddle. Tell these young receivers do this do that the receivers have to go back to the sideline and their coaches in the facing what are you doing? And he would basically these receivers would take it on themselves. I'm the one freelancing trying to cover for Rogers. That this was all happening last year. And then that's just part two of the article the first part sets up about McCarthy and how he had been mentally checking out for years and how? According to sources that McCarthy. Would. Not be in a team meeting at least once a week. He'll be M I A. And one of the reasons why he was MIA according to this story based on unnamed sources he's getting a massage and his office because he has a bad back. And according to this unnamed source that unnamed source new the masseuse and heard it from the masseuse. Yeah. I'm being snuck up the back here in Green Bay in the front offices. So nobody sees me going into coaches office. Exactly. And. Assistance where the ones preparing the team in their last go round on Saturday before games not McCarthy because sometimes was getting massage. It's not good, man. And then I'm I'm just giving just this is just the broad strokes. And there are people who say Rogers is not to blame. He's the one who kept the ship afloat all these years, right because of McCarthy's incompetence and also Ted Thompsons incompetence. That's the last part of the stories you get to Ted Thompson who was beginning of fall asleep in meetings that he was no longer physically mentally able to do the job. Oh my God. How are they able to tie their shoelaces or stay in any game? Why weren't they blown out every week? So there are some say Aaron is not to blame. He's still little sensitive. And then there are other saying McCarthy's not to blame. How could you blame him for trying to coach and overly sensitive quarter to quarterback who according to this piece again written by Tyler Donna bleach report the grudge that that began between McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers did not start. Last year did not start a few years ago in the passive aggressive comments from the quarterback and back from the coach would happen. According to this piece, it stems all the way back to the day that Aaron Rodgers went twenty fourth overall the Green Bay Packers and sat four and a half hours in the green room. Looking like a lost kid waiting to be picked up by his parents. It goes all the way back to that day because Mike McCarthy was the offensive coordinator the forty Niners and was part of the team. And decision making process to choose Alex Smith, I overall. And you can't blame are in Rogers for that sort of thing for have having that sort of fire that burns in for that sort of thing to motivate him and put a chip on his shoulder. We can't sit here and say that about Aaron Rodgers to criticize that while the same time lionising Tom Brady for using that. As his chip on his shoulder that he was chosen one hundred ninety nine th overall. On less. You could say basically say Brady again, I'm working all this out of my head. 'cause I just took this all in right? And I suggest everybody else. Take this in Brady never held it against Bella check and he passed on him six. Yeah. Well, five finally got around the six six without with a compensatory pick. But Bella check wasn't part of another team who came out and said at the time I like these other quarterbacks better like McCarthy. And again, as I'm reading this all in Brady's name is mentioned in this piece by Jennings pointing out Al Brady's relationship with Julian Delman in his receivers in gronk are the envy of Green Bay Packers receivers who would love to have had that relationship with Rogers. And they just never did because of Roger's personality, right? And an all I could think of while I'm reading this is in this world where you have soup really talented quarterback. If not maybe the most talented at the position we've ever seen. The only times we've seen throws like the ones that Rogers have made since Rogers came in the league in two thousand six was last year from Patrick Mahomes. Right. Pretty much pretty much. There's nobody else that that uncorked s-. Yeah. The on the run throw cross body across the body. Nobody can uncork that sort of the way that Roger Federer on on Corey cross court winner out of nowhere. That's how talented. That you have that talented of a quarterback a franchise in Green Bay that is all about continuity that they don't change coaches general managers, you get that continuity, just ask Josh Rosen how much continuity he would love to have to start his career. We can go on and on and on that's part of the reason why supposedly paste Peyton Manning had a great opportunity in this league is because he had the same offensive coordinator for so long. He didn't have that revolving door. So you've got continuity. You've got great quarterback if not the most talented of all time, and they get one Super Bowl out of it. And then you got somebody like Tom Brady in New England with a coach again, Bella check is on a class by self. Six rings. When you could just read this article and just see how sensitivities and locker room conversations can go sideways so fast. And chemistry could be thrown off so easily and moments happen like the two thousand fifteen NFC championship game where the. Game went totally south when they were whipping up on the Seattle Seahawks and then lost. And we can go on and on and on about how the Packers seasons. Remarkably went sideways, with the exception of two thousand and eleven. And how New England keeps doing it over and over and over again. Yeah. They have continuity again, they have Bella check. Which is obviously a difference maker. You wanna talk about McCarthy versus ballot. Check where we know who wins that one. But you also have a number twelve of your own under center, NIA, who's incredibly talented. Favor. And and you wonder what's going to happen with Matt leflore coming in who is four years older than Rogers. What's going to happen there? And how much how much all of this is laid at the feet of arrages and how quickly he'll turn on before. I've met Aaron Rodgers over and over again seems like the coolest, funniest smartest. Smartest guy who has so much on the ball knowing place in life lot in life as well about what football means in life. It's just stunning to read something like this. Yeah. Jamaica, Finley well, put his name to it. I know he's been growing in that the entitlement comments. I think you can't ignore those. Perfect day for Peter. King comes strolling into our studio. Lots going on in the National Football League grow with that eight four four two zero four rich number dial here on this program. That's a stunning read. Go check it out on bleach report Bleacher reports Taylor rooks in studio. Our to Brian cop, David LeVine, who are the co creators of billions as well as rounders one of the best. I guess poker movies of all time. Just stuff, you know, big fan of billions and Hankas area. Our number three news update your phone calls. This is a heck of a story for the Green Bay Packers. Peter King who's wearing the green of Miami of Ohio right there on the monitor. You not is that an Ohio city lasts for me. Miami of Ohio. Hi university. Oh my gosh. The green of Ohio University my bad. I've even spoken there on the beautiful camps in Athens, Ohio. Correct. Very good trying on on my way out of that hole, Ohio University. Bob cat. All right, baby. King right here on the rich Eisen show. We come back. Okay. This is the thirty second commercial. And I'm gonna throw a lot of numbers at you. But please stay with me. And just fifteen minutes, you could say fifteen percent or more on car insurance. This company's been offering great rates and great service for over seventy five years in anytime, you need help you could speak to one of their train specialists. Twenty four seven the company is gyco. Go to Geico dot com today. Sorry for all the numbers and five. Four three two one amount of time. Hey, if shaggy now that the NBA also we can is over it's time for the second half of the season to get underway. It's a tight battle in both the western and eastern conferences as teams vying for playoff position that I've been saying from us there's only one place again on all the action, then online dot AG sign up today for a free account and use the promo code podcast one. And when you make your first deposit you'll receive a fifty percent bonus. That's promo code podcast one NBA site is heating up. Don't miss out on all the fund bet Alon dot AG online sportsbook experts experts experts. Welcome back to the rich Eisen show. All right. We're here in New York City joining me right now for the Honda dream garage, spring event insider report is a man who's been with NBC sports with football morning in America column now coming up on a year since he's he moved over there. The also the host of the Peter King podcast and his football morning in America slash Monday. Morning quarterback column has been must read stuff for decades to see you Peter King our great to be here. You bet men. I said that I spent a half an hour before the show taking in this this long read from bleach reports Tyler done on the Packers. And you said it would take you the entire train ride down down from the Upper West side. And I started at the beginning. And I finished it, right? When I got off at housed in streets. Good. And I'm glad you did miss your stop one of those reading says it was a great story by Tyler in journalists in journalism sent sensory the one thing I really admire about it is that Bleacher report. Obviously gave Tyler done the time to do it. This is no one or two weeks story. This is just from reading the story. This to three month investigative story on what went wrong in Green Bay in the stuff that he has and the people he talked to the unfortunate part of the media today is that there's such a demand to fill the space and such demand to feed the monster of NFL coverage twenty four seven twelve months year that very often really good reporters are told you gotta write five stories this week. And you don't have time to devote to a story like Tyler done. Obviously did so kudos to Bleacher report for giving him the time and Tyler done is one of the young stars in our business. It's a great store. All right. So let's dig into what you obviously have been around know about the Packers organization for all these years. And what what rang most true will what what? Came. What what did you take from this long? Well, two things that occurred to me, right? When I finished the story are Mike McCarthy's gonna have a hard time getting a coaching job. I mean, first of all if they're eight coaching. I think they're eight coaching jobs open this year. And if one team interviewed him and the team who he worked with who. Now is the management team in Cleveland didn't interview that's telling to me very very telling. And I think the other thing is going forward will Mike McCarthy. Become Brian Billick Willie become this guy. You wanna Super Bowl and everybody said. Yeah, you know, good coach. But didn't get another shot. I mean, Brian Billick really wanted another shot to prove that the ravens were wrong in parting ways with him. And he never got the shot. Now will Mike McCarthy the shot and the other thing that rang true to me is that remember, you know, and just recently we found out. That Mike McCarthy or that? Mark Murphy, you know, who runs the coaching search now post Mike McCarthy that that Mark Murphy, basically didn't use Aaron Rodgers as as a sounding board as hey, what do you think? Aaron what would you think if we hired this guy was the offensive coordinator at Tennessee? Matt leflore, what would you think of this nothing? He never asked him for any input it all and now after reading Tyler story, it becomes painfully clear. Why Mark Murphy would not ask Aaron Rodgers. Because and again, look, you know, this is not my story. This is Tyler done story. But if Tyler done story is to be believed in I buy it. You know, obviously, Mark Murphy wouldn't be skeptical in the opinions of Aaron Rodgers based on reading this story. Well, and then so let's put a pin in that for a second here. So they bounced Mike McCarthy when they fall to four seven one four weeks to go they can go on some sort of run year, finish eight seven one is them just going through Mark Murphy's decision making here to tell McCarthy to go out and they stunk at the time they did stunk. But there's no way I don't think that there's no no seeing what not read in this article. We absolutely I would have done the same thing that Mark Murphy, did I I read Mike McCarthy's comments that you know, dirty. They did all that stuff. This team over the last two and a half years is the most disappointing team in football. And no one is close for second place. Rich just think of this this team in the last forty five games. All right is twenty one twenty three in one the vast majority of those games Aaron Rodgers played. So it wasn't like Aaron Rodgers miss two-thirds of those. It wasn't like this. All Brett Hundley losses. A lot of these losses are on Mike McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers they are a sub five hundred team over two and a half years with Aaron Rodgers playing. It's just it's I I empathize with McCarthy. And I like Mike McCarthy, but the he had no 'cause he had no reason to think that this is a bad decision to fire him with four games left. Peter King here on the Honda insider report here on the rich Eisen show. So what what of the floor coming in? Now, I head coaching job in the National Football League. You know, the one thing I would say rich is that the people who know Matt leflore are a little bit worried for him because he's not a commandant. He doesn't enter a room, and he's and be a commanding presence. And I remember talking to Bill Parcells in January. And Bill Parcells some of these guys. He literally does not know. So he doesn't know for sure who you know, what kind of people they are. But he said, I'm a little bit worried about the NFL decision making process when coaches are hired because maybe people think that that they're geniuses on one side of the ball or other. He's not he wasn't saying that, oh, it's this whole, Sean McVeigh thing. He he wouldn't care if it was defense. You know, if it was if it was somebody who was a brilliant guy on defense, a said, you know, you have to you really have to the reason why Tony Dungy struggle to get a job for a long time. Is that people think he couldn't Wayne Weaver? Jacksonville jaguars. I wanna hire Tom Coughlin because he can command a room, you know. And then you go you listen to Tony Dungy's people after Tampa Bay in Indianapolis, and he walks into a room, and you could hear pin pin-drop. He just was a quieter guy. But that's the. Thing I would be concerned about and we'll see how it goes. But Matt leflore it doesn't have the reputation of being this commanding presence kinda guy which I still think as a head coach you need. Well, according to this article that there was really no changing Aaron Rodgers mind with McCarthy because he went all the way back to the two thousand six that's crazy, man. That is that's now look I'm not I Florida's an have on his resume. Right. I understand that. But that particular story, I don't doubt the story. But if it's true, which I have never heard one time. But I don't doubt it. But if it's true that is crazy talk. That's utterly crazy. And if Aaron Rodgers resented him because of that, not cool on Ahrends part because my and my and my take on that though is why is it not cool for Aaron Rodgers to do that? But it's cool for Brady to say everybody passed on me, I'm hundred nine nine overall. I'm gonna take it out on everybody, and that's my fire. And that if he does sit there, and he thinks this. Guy. Never liked me from the beginning that and if he doesn't agree with the playcalling doesn't agree with this. Or that the other this guy never liked me from the beginning over. I mean, that's you sound like a player. Okay. You really do. Oh, he never liked me. Mike McCarthy is paid by Mike Nolan. And I forget was at Trent. It wasn't Trent boggy whoever the GM was at time. Scott mclean. I really forget who was but he's paid by those people to say who do you think is the better quarterback. And he obviously thought at the time that Alex Smith was the better quarterback. Now could Aaron Rodgers be angry about that to this day? Of course, he could. But in my opinion, it's hardly a realistic way to approach life, in my opinion. If I applied for jobs coming out of college and the Pittsburgh post gazette didn't hire me out of college. So in the Cincinnati Enquirer did did I ever say all show. Oh, you Pittsburgh post gazette. And I hate him to this day. That's I don't know. It's just not my thing. Well, I mean, if it is his thing the reason why bring it up here is at that would have nothing to do with Matt leflore zero right coming. They're coming in right here where Rogers thirty five but rose five don't you think that might McCarthy had he been Chris Simms, formerly bleach report? Now at NBC told me in the last spring when we were talking about this that might McCarthy's defenses are offenses basically were day one right office, very very old, nothing new and exciting and imaginative. And he he can't believe that they were so primitive. This is Chris Simms. Yes. And so I can't I can't believe for a second that if Aaron Rodgers that if that if Sean McVeigh passed on Aaron Rodgers, and Sean McVay became the coach of Aaron Rodgers that to this day. Aaron Rodgers would say, Yep. Sean McVay always hated that guy 'cause thirteen years ago, he passed on me, it just it's not realistic. What's realistic is? And I buy do by this that he thought that Mike McCarthy was not helping them become a better football player. Okay. So then the floor comes in when the off season workout program begins. I imagine next week because he's a new coach he gets new players. He finally gets to sit down think right right with Aaron Rodgers. We'll we'll look at that. Right now this week. Right. So so he finally gets to sit down with iron Rogers, leflore and Rogers gets to sit down if Aaron Rodgers shows up this week, and I don't know that he is or isn't. But when they finally sit down, I think, my gut feeling is that Rodgers will be impressed with the floors and offense, I think because the floor. You know is a is obviously a disciple of Sean McVay, and Sean McVay believes that everything new is great. And so Aren Rogers totally gonna buy into that. Now, you know leflore had a had a checkered season in Tennessee, you know, checkered season, and it wasn't all great at all. And the quarterback play was certainly not great. So again, I'm not I'm not looking to say, this is going to be trouble at all. I'm just saying I don't know how it's going to come out. Right. So I'm gonna give you a choice here. One of two choices. Yeah. Because this is the sports talk radio thing. There's no such thing as grayer in sports. What's more likely? We look back five years from now Aaron Rodgers sensitive stubborn guy who just sabotage Matt leflore and didn't win another championship in Green Bay. And and then we look back and say it wasn't McCarthy's fault. It was Aaron Rodgers just being so difficult or leflore and Rogers flourish together, they realized that they need each other. And it becomes it was McCarthy's issue, and they. Well, I I would choose the latter. Okay. But not saying, well, it was McCarthy's issue because I do think that Rogers McCarthy share responsibility for what has happened in the last few years. But I just think that Aaron Rodgers understands that he signed there in Green Bay. They're not gonna show him the door. He's not gonna pull an Antonio Brown. And in my opinion, I think that it sometime in the next five years the Packers will win a Super Bowl. Okay. Peter King here on the rich Eisen show. The coach the new head coach under the most pressure coming up this year would be ready kitchens. I mean, he's gone from being America's darling. A guy who thirteen months ago was hired by Todd Haley to be as running backs coach because he needed a running backs coach not because oh, this guy's a brilliant. Play caller. You know, he sort of you know. Just sort of almost lucked into being the offense of play caller because he he knows the quarterback position. So well and Hugh Jackson worked his way out of a job. So and hey, Freddie kitchens absolutely unequivocally bowl. You know, should be the coach of this team. And he proved that he belonged. So he deserves it don't get me wrong. But all of these improvements, it's almost like if the Browns win ten games and there were wildcard team, and they lose the wild card game. It's almost like it would be a crushing disappointment right now in what everybody thinks about the Browns. And look, I think the Browns have made all the right moves. I I mean, I covered them last year rich draft time, and I knew and I knew totally why they picked the quarterback and Baker Mayfield was the right choice at the time. There's no revisionist history here, and he's proven to be a very good choice. And now, they've got more pieces in place. So there's a lot of pressure on kitchens, by the way, I think if they win ten games go to the playoffs and lose their first wildcard game. It's always difficult for first time quarterback in the in the playoffs to win. His first playoff game. I think that would be actually a very good first year for I see mate. And maybe and maybe that's how it will turn out. But me looking at it right now. I mean, it's almost like well the Browns should be on and primetime five times Monday night. Should you know should have him on twice and all that? And it'll happen now it's not going to happen. You don't think them versus New England's going to be on a Sunday night. I don't think it will be the first one or them versus them them versus the the the jets, for instance, when when I come back from that life. Would want to see what I'm saying? What I'm saying is for the last four years. I sat with Howard cats on schedule making day. This is only my guess, sure. I have no insight magic, aided guests educate guest. But my feeling is last year. The San Francisco forty nine were the Cleveland Browns in always Kyle Shanahan and Jimmy Garoppolo. They're going to win the division. They're going to win twelve games, blah, blah, blah, a lot of flexing. And and and and right now you look back. They got four primetime games. And they got flexed out of their Sunday night games. Right. They did they they did not play on Sunday night because the quarterback got hurt. And I'm not saying, that's what's gonna happen. But that's why I would put the over under at four, and I would put the over under on Sunday night at one because you all and one being a home game in Cleveland. I do not think cl-. Cleveland at New England will be the opening game of the season either. Okay. I mean, my guess is it'll be Dallas. That's just my guess. But the other thing I would say is I think the NFL will want to put the Browns on Sunday night at home fairly early in the season, maybe against Pittsburgh, maybe against Baltimore. But against a team that there will be a tremendous of verve and excitement in the city for while. We're on Sunday night football for the first time in a hundred years. That's what I I like Baltimore because I think the Lamar Jackson response but Baker Mayfield twice a year is great obviously week seventeen was fantastic. Yeah. Choice for the opening night. Is Pittsburgh New England could be because I wanna see what Pittsburgh looks like. Yeah. Without Levy on bell without Antonio Brown night one in know, everybody. Everybody said I've got twenty emails after I said, I don't think it's going to be Kansas City in New England. And I there were two reasons why it's not going to be Kansas City in New England and. Opinion. It's been Kansas City in England on Sunday night football for two straight years. Remember opening day two thousand seventeen and then midseason two thousand eighteen plus the MO the biggest marquee matchup in all of football right now is Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes, the old in the new this her and NBC had it last year. I gotta tell you something. I will be shocked. If Howard Katz gives it to NBC gives it to us again this year. That's my guess last one for you here. Peter King, you said, Freddie, kitchens as the most pressure on him of any first time head coach what if the cardinals go ahead and give cliff Kingsbury kinda Murray. I mean, that's a huge would put a lot of pressure on him. But there was going to be pressure on him. Anyway, because so many people look at him and say how can a guy who had a losing record in college. And get fired in college and have probably one of the worst five defenses in all of major college football over a five year period never could build a defense ever. And how can that guy? Get a head coaching job in the NFL walking off of you know, walking out of getting fired. So I'm not saying that he they won't take them in. There won't be a lot of pressure. There will be there'd be a tremendous amount of pressure on them. But I always view a first year quarterback. No matter how much there is. I view it a team winning three games a team that had an awful defense and no offense of line. There's going to be pressure on him. But they're not a very good team. So I I don't I it's not like in Cleveland where I think the majority of Cleveland Browns fans majority expect that they will win the division this year. I don't think anybody expects if the Zona cardinals pick Tyler Murray that they'll win the division. A couple more minutes left here with. King. So have you met anybody since the on any breathing human being since the combine that thinks kinda Maury is not going to be drafted number one overall? No. But you know, again, that's that's sort of that's recency bias to the nth degree because look rich a as somebody the other day now that the draft is on ABC as well as NFL network and ESPN there's going to be more live television coverage of the draft than there is of the presidential election on election night. It's totally preposterous. But do you think that the NFL if they haven't said anything yet? Do you think the NFL won't at some point Seidel up to Michael Bidwill of the Zona cardinals and say, whatever you do do not breathe a word to anyone about what you're going to do? Do and let's not be dangling. Josh Rosen out in trade talks a week before the draft while they can't because they gotta they gotta make sure column or is a living breathing human being with the moment. They pull the trade. Yeah. As soon as they get him. But I mean, but but and again, I I guess I would also make this point this. I would make this point. I think that it is most likely, although I'm not I don't have any hard and fast reason. But I think it's most likely that Rosen would go to Washington or the giants if he goes to one of those two teams you've got Bruce Allen who is excellent keeping secrets and Dave Gettleman who's pretty good at it. Okay. So so if you have those two guys it would be possible for Steve kind five days before the drafter three days before the draft. Give me your best offer by six PM on Thursday. Day. Give me your best offer for for Josh Rosen. And I might call you that night. Okay. I like asking the poll question before we send them out the door. Chris Peter who do you blame for the Packers? Fall to mediocrity. Mike McCarthy the front office Aaron Rodgers. I I don't know. I I mean, it's a classic. Everybody deserves it. There's not a person that that's a talkradio question right there. That's why he came. All I can't answer the question. I'm going to chicken out totally because I don't think it's an answerable question. I think if you asked me to give percentage on that. I would say I'd say, you know, probably forty percent Thomson because I think he really got predictable. You don't build a team one way. Right. You don't build a team all the way through the draft. I think Preston Smith's it area. Smith's a great free agent. You know, daily double for this team this year. And then, but I also think that McCarthy and Rogers deserve blame. I cannot believe that I'm saying that the Green Bay Packers with most of the time Rogers playing have been under five hundred for two and a half years. That's insane. So he's changing the front office. If it's forty percent down. This puts the other two between fifty. It's thirty percent, right. But I'm glad it's the front office, but this Airlie fairly. It's it's Ted Thompson by knows in the bell. In the mile and a half Belmont Stakes with Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy down the next down the stretch and down the stretch. They come at Peter underscore king here on the rich Eisen show. The insider report brought to you by the Honda dream garage spring event where you can get a great deal on the Honda your dreams with elible Honda sensing and loads of hi tech features you won't want to miss out on these deals headed to your local Honda dealer today. When we come back. I have some news on that ABC ESPN NFL network coverage. I haven't mentioned it yet. Okay. Mentioned it right here on the air before rich Eisen show. Billions news gets broken by the billions co-creators top the second. Wait, just telling you. There's lots of news to be broken. That's next. Hey listeners just wanted to take a minute to thank all of my great sponsors. And all of you. Great listeners for supporting this podcast. Certainly couldn't do this show without either of you. And I wanted to remind you that you can support my sponsors by going to my show page at podcast one dot com. Clicking on the support this podcast button. And there you'll see all of my wonderful sponsors that. Help make this show possible. So thank you for downloading subscribing. And of course, supporting now back to the show. Cast one sports net is your home for the best coverage of the final four in this year's March madness. Get all the play by play and top notch analysis from sportscasting gurus, Dan, Patrick and rich Eisen then put in your bench with betting expert RJ bell on RJ bell dream preview and laugh out loud. With the biggest name in the game. Literally on the big podcast with shack. Download new episodes of these shows and more every week podcast one sports. Stay tuned for sixty seconds of eight news headlines right after this podcast. I welcome back to the rich Eisen show. Our poll question brought to you by Capital, One reimagining banking by offering checking and savings account with no fees or minimums that could be opened from anywhere in five minutes. They also offer one of the best savings rates in America, Capital One. What's in your wallet? Christopher what how over there? Yeah. Let's get into this Packer stuff. Guys. Blamed for the Packers. Fall. The mediocrity. Mike McCarthy the front office or Aaron Rodgers Peter King said forty percent for an office right now audience think sixty percent front office. Twenty one percent. Aaron Rodgers nineteen percent Mike McCarthy. Okay. And who's to blame for the phone ringing in the middle of the Peter King segment, and that would be me shake that is a ten dollar fine five dollars way. Both of you have had you've had a lot of sounds come up. What what are you talking about? We've we've owns are a major violence. Meiser on stunned before show, we could go back to see to you was the foam and take a phone, call real quick, Nick and Milwaukee here on the rich Eisen show. It's up, Nick. Hey, rich. Well, today, we had a couple of our worst fears confirmed as Packer fans one being that the entire NFC basically do our playbook from like twenty twelve on and to being that years back. We might kind of look back and say that was the dynasty that never was. So I guess my question for you would be do you think the Packers have missed their window to win multiple Super Bowl with Aaron Rodgers as a quarterback or at eight thirty five do you think they can get a couple with a floor? Oh, look, man. All you gotta do is look at breeze and Brady and Aaron Rodgers is more physically talented than those two guys. And he's thirty five and absol-. I'm not gonna sit here and say that the windows closed at all at all. He's still Aaron Rodgers. He still at the top of his game. Let's see what they can do with Brian good Akune show. Shop for the groceries and obviously all of the dysfunction that this. That's laid bare in this article is is one would think all of that involving the coaches out. Thanks for the call. I mean, whatever's going on between the temples of Aaron Rodgers, and how much blame is to be laid at his feet and what he can do from here on out. I just think he's smart enough to realize I got six years left. Here comes this guy. Let's see how it works because you know, unless this guy is totally incompetent. Then he's gotta figure out how to work with them. Not gonna bounce him like years left on a contract or something. Like that a man's said he's under a lot of pressure this year right off the gate. He's got an Aaron Rodgers trust. And over at its opening night against the bears in the NFL seasons. Can be great. So billions creators, Brian Koppelman. David Levin coming up. We're gonna break. Big big news, okay television. I mean this man, I'm about to do this right now. Remember, you heard Peter King say, you know, it's the drafts can be on AS ESPN ABC and NFL network. I'm going back on ESPN the day of the draft to promote the NFL. No, no. Hey, I love it rich how that'd be invite. I'll give you more details. That'd be that'll still be lost in the bay. I don't know, man. On time. I'll give you more details. As conditions warn our too coming up. Hello guys at semi fighter. Cheils senate. Check out my podcast. You're welcome with chaleston every Wednesday and Friday right here at podcast one. We cover the latest in mixed martial arts and everything else. Going on in the world of sport. Listen free to your welcome with jail, son and exclusively available at podcast one dot com and on the podcast one app. If you love the show share with a friend and leave us a rating and review. This is firefighters Raffaelle poor yet for firehouse subs. Introducing new firehouse payers pair, your favorite small sub with a signature side, like the awesome, five cheese, MAC and cheese. And remember, of course of every purchase at firehouse subs. Those towards helping first responders firehouse subs joy more subs. Save more lives. Participating locations only firehouse subs. Donate a minimum of one million dollars in two thousand nineteen to the firehouse subs public safety foundation by donating point one one percent. Every purchase possible tariffs. I'm Ed Donahue with AP news minute. President Trump says Mexico has been doing a better job of border security over the last few days, and he said he would close the border part of immigration laws changed in the US. It's Democrats are going to straighten that out and if they don't straight at out. And I predicted this. I mean, I hate to see. But at least I can say it was right. I told everybody this is you have a national emergency at our border. The president. Now says if Mexico doesn't stop the flow of drugs into the US, the US will put a tariff on card will do it. Just like it. You know, I will do it. I don't play games of doing thirties conducted DNA testing to try to determine whether a teenager found wandering and Kentucky is we claims he is an Illinois disappeared eight years ago around the time his mother took her own life. Target is raising the minimum hourly wage for its workers for the third time in less than two years starting wages will jump from thirteen dollars to thirteen dollars from twelve dollars. I'm Ed Donahue.

Aaron Rodgers Mike McCarthy Green Bay Packers Aaron Rogers Peter King National Football League Tom Brady Green Bay football Tyler ESPN Roger Federer Ted Thompson Matt leflore Cleveland McCarthy Aaron Chris Peter America
Nicole Holofcener & Lodge 49

Bullseye with Jesse Thorn

1:06:21 hr | 2 years ago

Nicole Holofcener & Lodge 49

"Support for this NPR podcast and the following message come from Hulu with their new original drama. The first from the creator of house of cards and starring Sean Penn, exploring the lives of the astronauts taking their first steps towards Mars. The first is now streaming all episodes only on Hulu. With Jesse thorn is a production of maximum fund dot org and is distributed by NPR. I'm Jesse thorn. Nicole hall of center is a writer and a director. She has made some truly brilliant films. She also comes from a show business family. Her mom was an Academy Award winning set decorator. Her stepfather was a producer for some of Woody Allen's biggest films. She get to meet all these great movie stars and celebrities sometimes even go on set to. So it's an obvious question all that time around filmmakers. That's what inspired her, right. No, on the film sets that I was on as a little kid. And then later as a production assistant, I was nowhere near the director or the action and I didn't know what was going on. You know, I'd see some the director whisper into an actress ear, and I couldn't imagine what brilliant advice he was giving her. Ha ha. Now I know it's like sit to the left. It's bullseye. Coming up. One of my favorite filmmakers Nicole hall of center in over twenty five years of making movies. She's shown an incredible talent making understated compelling films with strong fascinating female leads this time around though she thought try movie about a dude. I mean, somebody's got to make a movie about it dude, right? Thought we needed one more. There's such a shortage. I like men and I know they have feelings too, and have legitimate problems, and I loved the characters in the problems they had. So there you go guys. Then we'll talk with the creator and show runner behind the new show lodge. Forty nine. It's a funny weird series. That is in part about fraternal orders and secret societies and how. How they're kind of boring. It's basically people who by day are are working, you know, the daily grind and at night they can go into the space and be, you know, a night of the bras and serpent or something like that. And I don't know. I find that very, very human wish to add some grandeur to your life. Then for our outshot, Michael Jackson sang some of the greatest pop hits of all time, but who was the real Jesus behind those tracks. Does Michael Jackson, it's all coming up on bowls. I, let's go. Balls. I, I'm Jesse thorn. I up Nicole hall of center. She's a writer director. She makes quiet films usually little melancholic. Her protagonists are usually women. They're almost always complex flawed. If you haven't seen her work. I, it's brilliant. She was profiled in the New Yorker recently, and I think this line sums up her films pretty well. Often, movies are about people confronting extraordinary problems in overcoming them hall of centers, films tend to be about people confronting ordinary circumstances and falling short because they're afraid of getting hurt or getting old or simply of changing how center has worked with some brilliant actors as well. Julia Louis Dreyfuss and James candle Fenian and enough said Catherine keener and Francis McDormand in friends with money, Catherine keener in like all of her movies, hall of centers, latest film was just released on Netflix. It's called the land of steady habits. It's based on the novel by Ted Thompson and for the first time. Her movie centers on a man. His name is Anders. He's a middle aged retired. Finance guy played by Ben Mendelsohn. Anders is going through kind of late midlife crisis. He's just left. His wife played by eighty Falco. They still live in the same Tony community in Connecticut. He's worried about his adult son. He's doing drugs, and he's just having trouble figuring out where he fits in these days. Like an is seen from early on in the film. Anders is getting a drink with his friend. Larry who's also divorced Andrews is having regrets. His family has moved on a lot easier than he thought they what after he left. And as we're about to hear, Larry is trying to comfort him. I used to have this vision. My life was like a web of these threats. The connected me, you know, with the more webs could have coming from you in the more important were like. So if your doctor you cure bunch of patients then or a teacher, you got million threads, you know, and you would be basically irreplaceable, right? Because so many people dependent on you. You wanted to stand. Webs and Yup, but it's really not the case? No, it's the web. The web is is, is remaking itself revising itself every second of every day. So if you vanish then the people that were in your life, they learned to rely on someone else and you're gone and then the web just remakes itself and moved on without you. Nicole haw center. I'm so glad to have you back on bullseye. Thank you for coming back on the show. Thanks for having me is this movie is kind of about dudes. Yeah, I guess they, they're male. I mean, there's look. They're central female characters in the story as well, but there's a father in two sons who are really the the heart of this movie. And I wonder if you had to like choose that you could make a movie about dudes because I don't know if you know this, there are a lot of movies about dudes already know. I thought we needed one more. Is there is such a shortage dudes having a midlife crisis to write how original, but I love the story so much and the fact that it has dudes was nice. I like men and I know they have feelings too, and have legitimate problems, and I loved the characters in the problems they had. So there you go guys, is it something where. Like I sincerely don't believe you have a special responsibility to chronicle the lives of women. Thank you. Okay. So let's stipulate to that. But did you have to think about it for a second and say, okay, this is this is going to be about dudes. All my all. My other movies were mostly not exclusively, but mostly about women, and it's okay for me to make a movie about dudes. I've made a lot of movies and it's not my job to fix Hollywood now, nor can I unfortunately now, I mean it was wondering why you hadn't. So I'm I, I was trying. I up. I just go where my heart follows item, not making political statements with my movies. Certainly not with this one. You know, in political climate that is right now, this is not the movie that you know someone's should be making yet. Why not? This is a beautiful story, I think, and there's room for that no matter the gender. How is it different for you to direct you? Director? Lot of television including some of my favorite television directed some of my favorite bored to death's. For example, which is one of my favorite shows ever the case of the stolen sperm. Yeah, that's a good one. How's it different for you as someone who has for the most part written the movies that you direct. Like it's this big intense five year process for you to get a movie into theaters because you know you're making small to medium scale movies, writing them yourself, you know, presumably working on producing them as well and so on and so forth. Like it's this big deal. Whereas when you directing television, you're, you're just like there for a little while on where everyone else knows. You know what I mean? Yeah, it can be really uncomfortable like being the new kid at school, each time, the new kid at school isn't in charge. Oh, yeah, that's true. That's true. You have to listen to me and you don't know me and I'm on your turf. There's only been a couple of times where I felt really uncomfortable and that played out exactly, as you said like, it just was kind of tortuous where I think the actors were sick of visiting directors, sick of being directed by people who didn't, you know, aren't there all the time or it's an unhappy set. But generally I felt really welcomed and actors wanted to be directed by me. So few. Do you think that your skill set is suited to. What television director does. I think a certain kind of television director. Certainly certain kind of shows I wouldn't know what to do with three cameras show, you know, in that like a sitcom or anything, I'd be lost. But this shows that I direct feel like little movies or if they don't, you know, I just direct them as if I was directing a movie. I don't see any difference except that I have to please, the writer and the producer. And since I work on shows that I really like or love than I feel honored to do that. So does it come easily to you? I mean as someone who has successfully directed many films where you are. You know in a film that director is the be all end all at least you know. I am. Okay. Yeah, for sure. Is that your question that you're, you're, you're. You're doing this job and you're doing it for to please someone else ultimately, right? Like you have artistic input as well, but you have to do it the way that they like it and some ways you have to, you have to match the way. Other people have done it to some extent. So in fact, I try to, you know, I don't feel like I have to reinvent this show with my vision. I feel respectful of what's already come before, and I do want to have my voice in there a little stamp in there. But yeah, I wanted to be kind of seamless, not noticed like, oh, that actors finally good or that actors. Finally, bad people compliment me on my specific episodes and I don't feel really right to take credit. I feel like I can I curse on this, show it out. I didn't get up, you know, if I don't screw it up, then I've done my job. You know, I, if I did a good job, that's even better. But yeah, it's, you know, it's different one, please. Somebody else. Yes, but, and so it's more like a job in that respect. Like I can't overrule anybody's taste. I can't always rely on my own taste, but so far people have wanted my tastes. They've wanted, they've trusted me enough mostly to do it. And you know, it's a, it's a great job. I make good money in residuals and meet actors would never meet or DP's that I might wanna work with. You know, it's it's better than sitting in my house writing forever. Do you find yourself when you're working on television doing more asking rather than telling? I mean, I think I presume that when you're on a movie, especially when you've written it and someone says, I, I'm not sure what this is. You're the one who knows should. Sometimes they don't, but right on a TV show. Yeah, I might say. So how would you react in this, you know, and what come. What came right before this, or what about this character should I be aware of? Yeah. And then I tell them. After tell at some point, I think there are a lot of directors who. You know, one of the reasons that they became directors other than you know our well. Yeah, it's not not necessarily because they desired power, but because they were comfortable wielding it. Like I think that one of the reasons that people with social privilege are disproportionately represented in the ranks of directors is because they don't question their entitlement, basically. Yeah, totally. Is that what you're gonna say, totally. I mean, I was gonna say, go back to privilege, maybe but privilege and entitlement often go hand in hand, right? Yeah. Yeah. He said the straightway to to the straight might woman. I think I think that, yeah, I didn't. I'm more comfortable directing than I am sitting right here right now talking to you. I'm more nervous right now. Imagining that this is gonna be on the airwaves and the sound of my voice and all that crap on. But when I'm directing, of course, I get nervous and of course I make mistakes, but it really feels like I'm in the right place. I'm utilizing all of the creativity that I have that I want to express sounds corny, but it's true. Did you feel that way when you were young? I mean, you spend time on movie sets as a kid because you're stepfather was legendary producer. Did you look at that and think this is something I want or something I could do when you were a teenager, whatever. No, on the film sets that I was on as a little kid. And then later as a production assistant. I was nowhere near the director or the action and I didn't know what was going on. You know, I'd see some of the director whisper into an actress year and I couldn't imagine what really an advice he was giving her ha. Now, I know it's like sit to the left up straight, so I didn't know what really directing was, or it didn't occur to me that I could do that at all. So how did you come to believe that you could? Because I think at some point you have to believe that you could in order to actually do it, right? Yeah. Isn't that crazy? I wonder what made me think I could do it. I directed a short at NYU. That was probably one of the worst times in my life. I, I mean, making the movie. I was so in over my head that I literally wished I would get hit by a car. I was so anxious. I was really like one of the first times I felt serious anxiety, and then my producer was in over his head was throwing up in the bathroom and the movie cost too much money and took forever. And then I thought, okay, I'll be a writer. And then I started writing a bunch and went to Columbia grad school for writing see, but they make you direct videos. And so when I was directing the videos, I thought, okay, I'm better at this now. I like this. And they turned out well. So I thought, okay, I'm going to try directing again. You grew up in New York and partly in Los Angeles. Yes. And you move from one to the other when you were like twelve? Exactly. I cannot imagine a time in my life when I would less liked to have a disjuncture that big. Yeah, that was rough was my choice. Although at the time I was in with a bunch of mean girls when I was twelve in New York City, and I seem to be drawn to mean girls I was when I was younger. Cool. No, I guess the quiz. Cool. And then they realized how vulnerable I was, then they realize what a target I was, and and so they were funny, you know, mean girls are funny and smart, and I was drawn to that and then till they turn on me, then they're not. And when I was leaving New York that was sort of happening, and I was looking forward to getting away from these girls, but moving away from my dad at the time was really hard. He lived in, you know, near the city. And of course I, you know, was drawn to more mean girls and then I got bullied in my new school. Then eventually I found some real good friends, but I had long hair down to here. I had zits you know, I didn't were brought was like New York in the in the sixties or seven seventies completely different than the Los Angeles girls. And I tried to be one. What was it like when you get to. I had to take the bus, which was really weird. I was used to the subway and walk to a bus, which was very strange and I didn't. I felt like I didn't fit in until I started buying the clothes. Everybody else was. And then before I knew it, I was, I was I fit in. I don't know. I just did, and I like we got to have a dog and completely different lifestyle. You know, New York was pretty rough in the early seventies sixties. I was exposed to a lot of stuff I got. You know flashed bunch times when I was a kid in New York, and then I came to l. a. and I was on the bus and some guy was doing it and I'm like, but I'm in LA. What do they follow me here? Exactly. I thought, yeah, I thought only the perverts only lived in New York, but alas, they're everywhere. Let's it does. And all of us all my friends, we were all the wear it. So we joke about it and try to act tough about it, but it was scarring. Did you have to be tough about stuff in general? Did you have to have that kind of toughness fish walk around, like, is up. You know what I'm talking about -solutely especially in New York. I mean, I took the subway when like eight with my my sister, and so we were hyper aware and vigilant and acted tough until you know we got threatened. And then you know, we were puddles of tears, but I, I think I still act tough. I think people think I'm tough and I'm so not tough. I my feelings get hurt just like everyone else's or more I like to, or it feels like I do. But then I have a kind of gruff blunt exterior. That doesn't really well. You know, it is a part of me, but so is the other. Do you think that's partly because show businesses very unforgiving, and if you are a sensitive person, you'd better have a graph blunt exterior because otherwise, the you've going to die from all the people telling you exactly what's wrong with the things that you created that are most important now, that's where I turned into a puddle of tears. But yeah, this is a very tough competitive business. I've had, you know, been destroyed emotionally a million times and and I'm one of the lucky ones. So just imagine. And also it's just part of my personality. I think it's part of my humor. Is that. I can be kind of blunt and outspoken, and it makes me seem like I'm tough girl and then I find out I'm hurting someone's feelings of not so tough. I'm just an idiot. Is there a time that you can tell me of time that you regretted something that you were being having. Tough girl, blunt outspoken ex about. I was probably telling somebody that I didn't know that they had bad breath. Because I want someone to tell me or you know, I've accused someone I barely know like, did you fart? And because I just I like I like talking about things that we all know about, but don't talk about. I have that kind of thrill and I'm sure I've offended people, especially with the breath thing that's like a big part of your movies, not bad breath specifically. Although there is some chewing sounds talking in there isn't bad breath in friends with money. There I go. Yeah, but it's obvious that you get such a kick out of airing something that is supposed to be an intimate secret, right? Yeah. I mean, so much of friends with money was about that for me, it was. It was exciting in that way. I like to ask if I'm sitting with a close friend and they're talking about a good job, they just got, I might say, oh, how much are you making and to see the look on their face? Like is it safe to tell you what we think of me? And I often just tell someone what I'm making 'cause I know they wanna know and I'm either thrilled or shamed or embarrassed, but that's what it is. Yeah, I, I don't think I think people have too many secrets. People are too shamed in general, including myself will continue my conversation with Nicole hall of center after a quick break. She'll tell me why she isn't really interested in making movies about people who are likable, it's bullseye for maximum fun dot org, an NPR. Support for both and the following message come from squarespace, if you ready to start your new business, get your unique domain and create a beautiful website with help from square spaces. Twenty four, seven, award-winning customer support head to squarespace dot com, slash bullseye for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch us, the offer code bullseye to save ten percent off your first purchase of a website for domain. Thank it. Dream it make it with square space. Hi, I'm the Nina are going host of NPR Spanish-language podcasts I wanting. We're back with the new season with thirty six stories from all over Latin America and let community here in the US from one of the most controversial trials in Puerto Rico's history to the Venezuelan migrant crisis. Listen to voluntee- on the NPR one app or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, I'm Beth and I'm Theresa and we host one bad mother, a comedy podcast about parenting, whether you are a parent or just no kids exists in the world. Join us each week as we honestly share what it's like to be a parent. And then that's how my day start. Yeah. Sick. Over like I wanted to stop, but Theresa, you're hurting my ears. And that, no, that's hated. Yeah, I don't blame. If really sucks to join us each week as we judge less laugh more and remind you that you are doing a great job, find us on maximum fund dot org on apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts welcome back to bulls eye. Jesse thorn right now, I'm talking with Nicole hall of center. She's a writer and director of films include friends with money and enough said, she's also worked on TV shows like parks and recreation. Orange is the new black and sex in the city. Her latest project is a film called the land of steady habits. It's out now on that flex, this movie. The land of study habits is about substantially parents relationships with their children. I found that it terrified me as it should. I understand terrifies me too. Was that part of what resonated with you when you read the novel? The kind of TR of not knowing what your children would be in, not being able to control it? I think so, yeah, consciously or unconsciously, that's. I mean, I worry about my twenty year old twin boys all the time, and it's a real lesson to let them be who they are and to try not to worry into stay out of their hair. You know, the drug years are really scary whether they did drugs are not. You know, you're just in terror and they lie and do all the normal things. But these characters, I guess, were kind of a mother's worst fear one more than another. But you know, Preston's characters really like he goes to north western and then he lays on the couch. I mean, that's that's a really scary prospect. Let's hear another clip from my guests, Nicole hall centers, new film which is called the land of steady habits. Andrews is the protagonist of the film. And in this scene he's hanging out with Charlie, who's the teenage son of some family friends. They're both getting high and Charlie just talked about how he doesn't understand his dad. Anders starts talking about his own son, Preston, you know, why is one he was a kid. He had this big floppy bear was like a big sagging shitty bear, and he carried it everywhere. And I mean everywhere and he held onto that. Ning yell onto that in wait, wait pastime. When in was supposed to be hanging onto a bear, you know? So we took it out and we hit and we pretended that it was a lost we were, we were worried about in being paid or. That he wouldn't grow up or some bull. I don't know. Oh God. He was so betrayed. Trade him. He was devastated. It was broke. Let's be. Erin, sad. Yeah, that Ted Thompson, he's a good novelist and Ben Mendelsohn. Good actor. We were actually very good writer director. Thank you. Thanks. Have you ever retrospectively thought, wow, I failed my child in a way that I. Did not realize at the time. Anyone feels their children on purpose? No, of course not. I'm sure. And I'll find out more. They get older angrier and we start having therapy sessions together. Certainly, I will learn more and I have to accept that. You know, I want to be a perfect parent. I never wanna hurt my kids and to find out, you know, you were supposed to protect your child is hurt. Hurt them is just really horrible feeling, but we all make mistakes and that you know, I've made some, I'm sure. Do you worry about whether you're doing the right thing as much as characters in your movies too? Oh, gee. Yeah, I suppose I, I am aware. I worry if I'm doing the right thing. Yeah, right. Not not as much. I mean, you know, the character that Ben Mendelsohn plays, you know, he makes a lot of mistakes. He's not doing the right thing. I'm not drawn to those kind of mistakes. Thankfully, I think I have a better head on my shoulders, but that doesn't keep me from, you know, being insecure about how I behaved somewhere what I said or what I'm saying right now. Who's feelings of my gonna hurt or whatever. Yeah. Your movies have such sympathy for people who are making mistakes. There isn't anybody in your movies who isn't making mistakes for the most part. Like there's no, you know there's not a lot of Hercules is in your mind. Now there aren't. I can think of Simon McBurney in friends with money. He was a pretty good guy and being torn apart by his wife who had a lot of problems, but he kind of shows himself, I think to be well rounded healthy person. Are you like constantly making list in your head of Catherine keener 's and Hiti Falco's and James Gandolfini as Jillian Louis drive says these people that can do can do jerky mean little things and you still just want to give them a lead in a movie? Yeah. I mean, that's what land the land of study habits. You know, Ben Mendelsohn plays this kind of somewhat reprehensible person really selfish. Narcissistic. Insecure, ashamed, lonely person who makes bad mistakes. And you know, when I was casting the movie or thinking about who I wanted, I felt like he had all of that in his face. He could have all of that in his face. He such a good actor and and also it's, you know, sometimes it's the way someone talks are. It's literally the shape of their face, you know, like, Catherine, I don't know everything she says and does makes it more interesting to me then most actors. So she's really funny, and really now a joke she kind of has a little bit of sad is yes, absolutely. And so everything is colored little bit by this ad is which I love. You know, I mean, if you cast her in the proper thing, that's fantastic, but that's what makes her deep and same with Ben Ben has sad eyes. Those is. I mean, he, he just draws you in and I hope that you know. People, they don't have to love him or like him. But as long as you're immersed in his growth, are his story and entertained by great. I was thinking when I watched the movie mission impossible, yes, that Tom Cruise and I may be about to mess up my chances of ever having Tom Cruise. If you're listening to this right now, you're more than welcome to come on this program. I'd be fascinated to talk with you. He's not listening. You don't seem like a real human being, but I know you know, you must be because I believe people are. But like Tom Cruise in that movie like he's super human, right? You're I've so so. So what it's totally great movie, but he's super human in and he's absolutely credible as superhuman because of his. Astonishing an apparent certitude like the conviction, and he must just be like this because it like he must know how to enhance it for the screen, but like he must have some. This must be a real quality event. Well, we've seen it I think in interviews, right? Yeah. When people have laughed at him for seeming unhinged, it is for that exact same reason. The couch. Yeah. Yeah. And. That is like one quality of movie stardom which is you can credibly be anything like beyond the world lick anything in the world. I feel like the other quality of movie stardom is if you can be a jerk and we believe that you are doing your best. Yeah, I'm like like you for that right. Doing your best. That's that counts for a lot. Does I? I don't have any elaboration. Have you ever seen those show? Always on. It's always sunny in Philadelphia shout. So it's, yeah, I love it too high amazed that it's still so great. Thirteen years, overlying making it really wanna work with Caitlin Olsen. So she sells so brilliant, Larry, Joe, and I think like, why do I like these characters who are monsters in literally every way and idiots, both idiots and. Monsters. They're not just amoral immoral. Almost always think they're terrific people. They're terrific people. They're completely looted lake, and I was like, okay, well, number one, their friends, and I like things about friends and number two, they're doing their best right. Actually, they don't think they're good people. They know they're bad people, but they're doing their best at being themselves something what they want. No, it's relentlessly funny and they're all yeah, reprehensible. Yeah, love it. When I remember watching friends with money being mad at every character in the movie. Really. In a bad way? No, no, no. Not in a bad way. I actually really like your movies. As I said, a bunch of times so far. One of my all time famous, but like watching and being mad at this jerks at all. These jerks. Right. But still really caring about them wanting happen. It's for them and like believing in them in a weird way. You know what I mean? And that is not a common thing and film. Maybe one person like that in a movie. You know, you get one, Catherine keener, you tend to make comp- construct movies out of those people. Yeah, I guess they're all you know people inside of me and my life. You know people my life and it's just not interesting to make easygoing likeable people. I mean, even the dude, you know, easy going person, but boy does he but he's but he's doing his best. Yeah, that's just what's interesting to me. I like to see movies about, you know, if it's not gonna. To be conflict like, you know, finding buried, treasure, better, be conflict within somebody's soul, Nicole Hof center. I'm so grateful to you for coming back on the show and for your movies as well. I just admire them so much. Thank you so much. That makes me happy. Nicole hall of center. What am I all time fades? The land of study habits is streaming. Now on Netflix, you can watch it and, hey, here's a hot tip. If you didn't see enough said like, I think it was one of the most a lovely and moving and hilarious, romantic comedies of the last ten or twenty years. Bull's eye. Jesse thorn. If you heard about this show lodge, forty, nine to new, it's on AMC and I am pretty into it. It's about a guy named Sean Dudley who goes by appropriately dud. He say, thirty something burn out. He lives in Long Beach where he was born and raised. He used to be a surfer, but he got bit by a snake literally bit by a snake, and now he can't serve. He hangs out at a Donut shop. And if you know a place where he can crash tonight, he's all heirs. Anyway. One day he is metal detecting on a beach and he finds a ring and he asks around and it turns out that it belongs to a lodge for this secret society. The order of the links sort of like the freemasons or the elks. The ring brings him into the lodge and before long he's a member. He's fascinated by the robes and rituals charmed and befriended by the members. He gets swept up by the mythology and mystery. Here's. Here's what's great about the show, the order, the secret society. It is just a bunch of people. Most of them are about twenty thirty years old then died. They ran out there throne room to a bingo club, the plumbing drips a little bit. It's been a very long time since they've had a new member. And when you're watching the show, you're constantly asking yourself, is fate intervening in duds life or is this just luck? Happenstance? I talked with Jim Gavin, the show's creator and Peter Akot who is a television veteran who was show runner and executive producer of lot forty, nine. You'll hear from them in a second. But first, let's listen to a little bit from the show's pilot duds truck just ran out of gas just outside the lodge coincidentally, and he just found that ring. So he decides to walk across the street and return. He knocks on the door and he's greeted by Ernie played by Brent jenex an officer at the lodge in this dud asks Ernie about. Joining up. I hate to admit it, but someone asking to join is ravens these days. Really membership has been declining for years. Maybe this is a good sign. We need to get young. I'll just need your contact info. Oh, yeah, absolutely. So. Like, what is it that you guys do here? Community services, recreational activities. Plus there's a whole philosophical component chemical, whatever you wanna call it. Oh, but mainly we just get together tonight's bunko night. Well, that sounds great. You do stand. We may not take you for all. I know you could be some kind of dead beat or psycho. Definitely not a psycho. Welcome to both ice cream. Have the two of you on the show. Thanks for having us. Thank you, Jim. This was a show that you created. What drew you initially into the world of that? Fraternal orders. I've always kind of been obsessed with sort of the history of secret societies and kind of terra and all that both were it's kinda strange buried histories and systems of belief in ritual and stuff. But MO, mainly for the human element of the type of person who joins these things, particularly in their more modern expression. You know something like freemasons or the elks elks are more of a social club that I'm Eric. But it's basically, you know, people who by day are are working, you know, you know the daily grind and at night they can go to the space and be, you know, a night to the bras and serpent or something like that. And there's just a sense of, I don't know. I find that very, very human wish to add some grandeur to your life. And I think it's also a world that is feels like it's been on its way out for a while. You drive these places in southern California. They feel very dusty and more abundant feel like a bit of a relic, but they're still open, you know, and our story is basically one of the stories are telling us as a possible rebirth of particular lodge when a young man knocks on the door. So, yeah, I think we, we created our own the benevolent links, and it has its own crazy history and mythology is kind of, you know, combined some. Histories of freemason rain is inspired by certain things, but it's it's own thing as its own system of belief metaphor and stuff. So that was it's kind of joy and pleasure, but the real joy and pleasure just watching, yes, dud. Knock on the door and meet Ernie was the fact that it is in southern California, but not in Los Angeles also important to the two of you? Yeah. I mean, I think for me, that's naturally the environment I write about. You know, I'm Long Beach and Orange County areas. I know very well my family's there and I grew up there and all these things for me. It is in the dumbest way possible which is maybe the best way I write when I know and the certain type of people. And I think one thing about southern California, the setting is that we try to capture this in the shows that kind of sunbaked almost oppressive sunlight versus the very. The interior the largest dark and dim and cool, and has the feeling of a retreat from the daily grind. And I think for whatever reason that is that Jacob position is more drastic in southern California, my mind in some sense. So yeah, so it's it's set there because that's kind of where I know. But we also got go very much into the history of Long Beach and aerospace and all these things. So yeah, no, like Los Angeles doesn't even register on the minds of our characters at all. I think too, it's the kind of place that people have heard of, but they don't know. So you can't shorthand it when you hear it and you can't think you know it already and for us to there's because of that. We, we talk a lot about the kingdom of Long Beach where it is a real place with real people that Jim certainly knows inside and out. But it's also this to the idea of being the, you know, the brazen night you. There's a place where things can happen, which aren't. Necessarily something you'd see in, you know, straightforward daylight. Yeah. Yeah. The the light in southern California's is unique, and I'm not the first person to note this, you know, and I, you know, I feel it everytime gone for why? When we were in Atlanta shooting, I was gone for probably like three months, and I just remember just entering getting of just stepping out of LAX as the light is, does have this depending how you're feeling personally, you can either be the a gift or or like an almost oppressive thing and Long Beach. On top of that, I think hasn't even pertain more particular light that I that I feel and we were able to capture that in some moments because we do we did shoot there for a couple of weeks. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, for us that moment of sort of stepping out of the dark lodge and then a light and then seeing it, and it's just too bright and you have to shut the door and go back. It's it's, you know, it's the experience of being in a hole in the wall bar and coming out. It's it's, it's not the, I. Ideallic, you know, paradise like it's the opposite. It's this kind of you'd rather retreat more with Peter Akot in Jim, Gavin, after a break, stick around their show lodge. Forty nine is set in Long Beach, California, Jim Gavin was born in Long Beach coming up some extremely Long Beach specific questions. It's bullseye for maximum fun dot org, an NPR. Support for bowls and following message come from Starbucks, introducing new Starbucks plus coffee k. Cup pots, the coffee that keeps up with you with twice the caffeine compared to one pot. Starbucks, k-cup, Cup, coffee. It's an extra boost to help you make the most of your day available in Starbucks, blonde, medium, and dark. Roast k. Cup pods for the rich taste. You love look for new Starbucks plus coffee where you buy groceries. Hi, this is Peter cycle for twenty years. Wait, wait, don't tell me has been making fun of the news with comedians celebrity guests. We got silly lumber, got terrible impressions. If you think the news is a joke, wait till you hear our show new podcast episodes are available every Saturday. Hi, I'm Elliot arts and I'm Julia Prescott and we're the host of everything's coming in every episode. We cover a different Simpson's that is favourite of our special guest. We've had guests that our show runners and writers and actors like Nancy, Cartwright, de-miners minus I, and we've also had people that are on the maximum network already Homer wearing that golf outfitted. So funny. And would he get super. Pat. We've had weird Al yankovic on the show just to strip by how the writing is. I mean, that's no surprise because it's a Simpsons. But I mean, like you can't say that a lot of TV shows particularly one that at that point had been on here for fourteen years on maximum fun dot org, I tunes or ever you get your podcasts. All right, smell you later. You're listening to bulls eye. Jesse thorn right now. I'm talking with Jim, Gavin and Peter auto, Jim created the new TV show lodge forty nine. It's a little tough to say what it's about, but some of the themes include secret societies quarter life crises, and the stagnating aerospace economy in Long Beach, California Peter Akot is a writer executive producer and show runner on watch forty nine. It seems to me like, and tell me what you think of this assertion. There is some kind of parallel between the way that duds combination of optimism and naievety when he looks upon the world. Kind of gives gives the story away to like, look at normal things in a new way. That parallels the ways that the kind of metaphors of the mysticism of these fraternal orders are a way of looking at the world through new eyes. If I, I would say as an enter to that, the the one index card, we had an our writer's room above everything else was the idea of alchemy, which is, can you get something from nothing? And I think that sort of embodies that, you know, I think the the central metaphor for the links order is vision and seeing in how like the magnum opus of of how is can there are many different ideas of what it actually means. But thinking our land kind of just means seeing seeing the have an experience of the unseen or seeing the wilder new way where it feels new. And I think on some level dud, does that naturally just sees things that differ. Angle for else which causes no shortage of problems for him, and it often delusional. But I think he's someone who. Delusion might actually save him at different points in his life is as far in an addition to causing him great. A lot of grief. There is a mentor ship relationship at the center of this show between dud and an older guy named Ernie who is both the guy who happens to be inside knocks on the door, and a guy who is next in line to become the boss of the lodge, and Ernie is a pretty regular dude, a plumbing parts salesman up salesman to plumbers that is and he's African American and he's like, maybe like sixty ish, something like that. In a world where. People want sixty year old dudes to be. Like either magical or invisible and especially six year old African American guys, like either wanted to be Samuel Jackson or Morgan Freeman, you know, like guys who have more charisma than got Morgan Freeman often plays God, but like the most charismatic coolest most remarkable human beings on earth or just completely unseen, right? How do you like? How do you fill that role? Like, how do you decide? Yeah, I, I mean, the characters, you know, composite of people in my life, and in particular about small coach had high school and who was very close with. And when I, my basketball career ended, and I, I was in a moment of difficult moment in my life. Someone basically helped me in a way that I think was crucial. That's always stayed with me. Can you tell you what that was just like my family was we, my dad lost his job and we're everything was falling apart. He basically, I went and coached with him and I just had a purpose. And from what looking back now is with a little bit, I could see how screwed up his life was, and just because he was making all these decisions, his life doesn't mean he wasn't doing this amazing thing for other people, you know, and but anyways, but. It is, you know, it's a character. Imagine he's he's very much comes out of a Long Beach world and upbringing particular part of Long Beach. That's a character, but it's played by Brent Jennings who when we saw him, he's a guy who I think a lot of people recognize from as a character actor and stuff. But he embodied that kind of every man Leopold bloom a fully just he just has these nooks and crannies guys apprising in a lot of ways. And you look at them and you think you know him. And then he'll say something that just you realize there's many more dimensions to this guy, and that's. Yeah. So I think, yeah, he's a guy who still he's you find out, you know, he's fine at life doesn't just he's at its point. Never think you're going to be that old, but he still has this fight head of them like he's still has to live this life. And so he, you know, he and in wha. Really do kind of. They just embodied those characters is, you know, Ajoy to watch and to be fair next season, he does get a magical staff that summons lightning. Yeah. I mean, we're, we're heading screen test actor with the staff. What we knew we wanted to hold off for one season right coming. Let's hear a scene with Ernie played by Brent Jennings. He goes to a dispensary and the dispensary is owned by character named blaze subtly named blaze and blazes played by David square who's a sort of legendary Chicago improv guy, great, no show. And he is a guy who. He's probably the guy who's most invested in the mystical world. Yeah. Yeah, I have your earth wind and fire kit ready to go. Everything you need is right in there including instructions. Once it's mixed together, just rub it into his for or wherever. There's your take. Thank you and for nine doth things you see if the tavern Knight? No, after work, I'm playing with Larry and I've got other stuff, hot date. What. Okay. Look stress. I'm not sleeping is to crows him unable to wake me up every morning. They everywhere signs and symbols. Ernie the augury of birds van come on parasol says this sort of thing usually foretells doom contested. I mean, that's just an f. y.. It seems to me like maybe the thing that I. Respond to the most in lodge? Forty nine is simply that I would like to watch television shows that aspire to art. Like I like artful nece and there are so few that do not sign post their artful nece through. Depicting pleasantness and there are shows I love madman too. Don't get me wrong and we do. Yeah. Don't. It's the greatest to totally mazing television program totally blew my mind. I watch every episode. It's great, but at some point, like I would like, I, I'm so excited to get to watch TV show that is artful aspires to be artful. It's like intentionally artful, but also isn't. Curdled isn't about what's awful about the world. Yeah. I mean, I think any. It's kind of dishonest, either way, like a straight something. That's so just all jokes in row raw doesn't feel true in something that is. So this is what I feel mostly intelligent. So battering in bleak that on some level is is a pretense in its own way. The way I understand life is enduring. So my darkest moments I've I've had some my biggest laughs and some of my most happy moments. There's a shadow of melancholy, you know, and it is a challenge to pick that. But I think that's where you know, we, we love it. You know that we can move through different moods in a way and not rely, you know, you know a dead body on the floor. Although, you know, we'll get there eventually, you know? Yeah. So it's I don't. I don't know. I would say I'm an artist or anything, or, you know what the collaborative. I think there's a level of trust in what we're trying to do in the detail in it that I, the word I like is off hand. Like, I think some of our biggest moves are kind of off hand. You know. I hope it's a show that rewards a second viewing because you'll see you'll see things in the background and setups and stuff that you may have missed the first time signs and augurs. Yeah. Yeah. It's thrilling to be mistaken for art. And I think for us, you know, the guiding light is always what, what makes us happy? Like what makes us giggle and letting the characters kind of lead instead of feeling like we're to Philip formula. And the other thing is between like Brandt Wyatt Sony cats plays Liz, huge figure on her show David, Eric, and Linda are really, they all have a unique kind of they do have a comic sensibility, even then they've all done many different types of things, but the their sensibilities particular to the character in a way. And that's just really fun to right, right to you know. So, okay. Jim view are in part from Long Beach. I think he's been a lot of time in orange, California. I have both the producer of this show Kevin, and our production fellow chewy are from Long Beach and lived in long. They're both graduates of CS you long meet. This is my sister. Okay. So congratulations to all the cookie -gratulations to all the wave. Is that what it is? Forty Niners 49ers? Okay. That was a trick. Question right there. Here's your Long Beach questions is like a lightning round where in Long Beach, did you have your first drink. In Long Beach would be Murphy's I think on. I'm not proud of this on second street. I knew the bar guy bartender there. Andy horn. If you're listening, I feel like you you were ten? Yeah. You having described already a bar just a design for a bar that moved to tears. That was like you calling yourself out. Okay. What's the best place for tacos? Be aware that I'm worried I don't know for sure, but I'm worried this is test some sometime. Okay. I can't say it's the best. My favorite place to get a taco is CoCo Reno's one because I used to live near it and it's very cozy plays and you can take it into the order under the bar next door. I, they do yourself. I, I'm a little out of my sister lives in Long Beach or one of my sisters and she's probably more up on the contemporary taco seen my notes here say that if you had said, holy Moley that I should end the interview. Okay. So you're saying from that, do you own a t shirt from Joe joss? Actually, I do as a very recently. Kevin is so excited to talk about this t shirt. He tried to explain it was it was a gift. One of our lovely editor Sheridan whose from Long Beach graduate a Long Beach poly. She gave me a Jost shirt. So yes, Jim Peter, thank you so much for taking this time we'd be on bulls. I was really great to get to talk to you about your wonderful show. Thank you. Thanks to. Jim, Gavin and Peter auto the creator and show runner of AMC's lodge forty, nine respectively. Watch forty-nine is in the middle of its debut season. Right now, you can watch a new episode every Monday at ten pm, nine central. And if you get AMC, you can also watch the whole first season on the AMC website. I've really been enjoying watching it, give it a look. Every week on bullseye. We like to leave you with culture tip. Before we go, it's called the outshot. Maybe because Michael Jackson hallway seemed like a child. It's easy to dismiss his artistry, not the large scale impact that he had. You can't deny his stardom, but in contrast to say prints, it's easy to think of Michael as a naive. MJ wasn't a one man band. He didn't write some of his greatest tracks. One time. He brought a chimp to the Grammys. It's easy to think of Michael as an incredible instrument that was being played by others by his dad. By Quincy Jones, whoever I had a Michael Jackson dollars a kid, and I thought of him that way. And yet Michael wasn't prince. He didn't write a lot of his songs and he didn't play the instruments, and he never had that kind of white knuckle control over his art. But for all those things that he wasn't, there is one thing that Michael Jackson still was a genius. We're gonna be starting out maybe. In. Stop to you. This is the home demo of don't stop till you get enough. The single that pushed Michael to solos darnold. He's nineteen or twenty. Here brother. Randy's playing piano. A few of his brothers and sisters are helping with percussion and so forth, banging on coke bottles. Michael wrote this on his first Hornby number one. There's no strings. Rough mix. There is a genuine genius. Michael wasn't much of an instrument. I mean, he could bang out a song on a piano if he needed to. He was a singer dancer, he was transcendently really at those things. Justin Timberlake and usher and Bruno Mars can all sing and dance. They are all brilliant, but they are all tribute acts when you put them next to Michael. Jackson's greatest albums were polished to an almost blinding sheen but listen to him sing. She's out of my life accompanied by Qatar just to get tarm. Him. I don't know whether. Two. She's. By the turn, this song made it off the wall. It had strings and the whole nine yards. I mean, if slash had been famous in nineteen Seventy-nine, they might have brought him in to throw a solo on there. So it could make rock radio. But what makes it magic? Is Michael's voice. Indices and sit. And it cuts. I do the first in did not do the courses one to the done. I mean, I can't sit here and tell you that Quincy Jones wasn't or isn't a brilliant arranger or that rod temper ten didn't know how to write a hit song that Rodney jerkins or dark child or teddy Riley couldn't make track jam, but listen to the demo for Beata. Every track is Michael, and then tell me who the genius was in that room. Stone. It doesn't matter who's right, just speed. That's my job. So stone is. That's all for this week's poll side polls is recorded at maximum fund dot org headquarters overlooking MacArthur park in beautiful Los Angeles, California, where kind listener just sent us a record album. It's by monk Higgins. It's called MacArthur park. I guess he probably plays this on MacArthur park, but he is a saxophonist in there is a gorgeous picture of him in a bright blue suit on a bright blue boat, playing the saxophone in the middle of MacArthur park lake. Our show is produced by speaking into microphones. Our producer is Kevin Ferguson. He's the one who put that record on a chair sitting directly across from me. He had help from Casey O'Brien, production fellows at maximum fund dot org are, hey, Seuss, Broszio and shayna delory. Our senior producer is Laura. Swisher are interstitial. Music was recorded by DJ w ich dann Wally. Thanks to him for sharing it with us. Our theme song is tuned by the go team called huddle formation, our thanks to them and their label Memphis. Industry's records for letting us use it. I know I say that every week, but I'm genuinely very grateful to go team who personally approved that because I love that song. If you'd like to hear any of our past shows, all of them are free at maximum fund dot org. We're also on Facebook on Twitter on YouTube. You can find all the interviews and segments from this week's show on YouTube. If you type in bullseye with Jesse thorn, you can find them on Facebook like us there at cetera, et cetera. Then I guess that's about it. Just remember. All great radio hosts have a secure sign off. Bullseye with Jesse. Thorn is a production of maximum pun dot org and is distributed by NPR. Support for this podcast and the following message come from answer net essentials from Comcast, connecting more than six million low income people to low cost, high speed internet at home. So students are ready for homework class graduation and more now they're ready for anything.

director Long Beach Jesse thorn Long Beach writer Nicole hall Michael Jackson Los Angeles producer NPR Catherine keener California New York City Larry Ernie Jim Ben Mendelsohn Anders Jim Gavin Ted Thompson
Hour 1: A bad look for the Packers

Izzy and Spain

00:00 sec | 1 year ago

Hour 1: A bad look for the Packers

"Sir spain. No Jason Fitz again, Jason golf, filling in on ESPN radio the SPF Sirius XM channel eighty he comes so rarely and then disappears. Just as quickly. What I'm glad to have Jason off on board. We've got a big show for you got a lot of stuff to talk about. We got a lot to do people drop in Mike's people objected fans people cheating the game and a scandal in Green Bay. That's right. That's right. The old good old the Green Bay Packers. They don't need an owner because they're owned by the city and everything's going. Great, right. Sickles and training camp. And all the other stuff that happens and guy. Yards. Yeah. Yeah. It's all fun and games until you start losing somebody to get fired. It's all fun and games until you start digging is actually what happened and tied done started digging for a very lengthy story for Bleacher report that details how the team's inability to play up to its potential can be basically tied to its two. Biggest figures over the last however, many years Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy. So their interviews with players coaches personnel guys who spent a fair amount of time with the Packers and Aaron Rodgers is sort of painted as a bad leader who punished receivers if they listened to McCarthy instead of him as someone who is overly sensitive and was given too much power McCarthy portrayed as a guy who thought his coaching. Instead of the teams talent early on was the key to their success, and therefore stuck to his schemes despite talent leaving the ws coming fewer and further between all the while. Ted Thompson is falling asleep in meetings. So there's a ton to get to and we're going to have. Tide done on the show later, but Gough when you look at a story like this. What's the biggest takeaway? Well, the biggest takeaway one is tied Dunn's writing style is is magical. The fact got this. I I was in thrall usually long reads. I'm like, let me go make salads figure something else out. My attention span is that of a seven year old. But I was I was right there. The moment had happened since it to the group chat because I wanted to get into this which you guys because so much there. And in the end, I come away with this is a bad look for everyone involved including Aaron Rodgers including the Green Bay Packers front office, including Mike McCarthy, whenever there's a firing you hope that guys can move in their separate ways amicably. But the fact that air Rogers is holding grudges from the day that he was drafted by the Green Bay Packers because then offensive coordinator for the San Francisco phone on is Mike McCarthy said that Alex Smith he thought was a better quarterback. It just it just shows you little bit of insight to a guy that when things have creeped out about his personal life. He is not been too fond of it and also show. As you what money kind of does it enhances or essentially who you are. Right. It's kind of like liquor where you're around somebody and the little saucer. I mean, like, oh, this is the real you their players who are speaking on the record that played with Iraj about what he was after. He got the dough that he got and Mike McCarthy doesn't come away looking too good on this as well as disciplinarian or quote, unquote, a fake tough guy for a lot of people in that in that locker room and the lack of accountability there's just a lot here. So when we look at six nine one seasons or we look at losing seasons. We just think you're right guard wasn't good or your corner wasn't good. Or something happened in the playoffs. There's a lot that goes into these things on a day by day basis. And when you're not connected as a team, this is what happens. Yeah. You mentioned McCarthy think tough guy who preached a lot like that. But a lot of the players believed. He created a soft scenario around the team and particularly for the defense who complained that he often didn't seem to care much about them during practice repeatedly made them sprint to the other side of the field to meet up with the. Offense for drills didn't really respect them and treated them in the way, many of us all the team which was just wait for Rogers to bail you out and eventually that didn't work as much anymore McCarthy. Also, according to one source McCarthy about once a week would be MIA for a players meeting. And according to him, it was about emboldening assistant coaches to lead the lead final prep before a game or or to lead meetings. But according to a massage therapist who also worked with one of the players. He would slip up a back stairway to his office while the rest of the team prepared for that week's opponent and got massages. So that's not a great look. I just wonder as reading this. It doesn't make anyone look great. And even the guys who come across as not necessarily having much of an agenda, right of speaking their mind, despite no longer being a part of it and needing to rely on any one involved, whether that's Greg Jennings or or other guys to me what stands out is the question of. Does this make situation for this team going forward better somehow because instead of all the passive aggressive? Difficult to between Rogers and his receivers between Rogers and the new coach that it's just all out on the line. And they are definitely going to address everything that comes up in this in meetings and training camp. And that could be good for them, passive aggression is one of the worst characteristics that anybody can have. And I think we have certain levels of some people have more some people have less. But when you're not when you're scared to confront things head on it festers in any relationship. If you're not talking about the things that bother you immediately than those things fester, and they build up, and then all of a sudden, you're arguing about things that have nothing to do with what initially ticks you off. I think the fact that Aaron Rodgers had his issues with Mike McCarthy from the jump it seems from the reports that we re reread in this Bleacher report magazine column, it seemed as if he's not a guy that is privy to addressing things, and we can get into whether or not that that extends to his family live. You know, obviously, he's out there had the riff with close members of his family, and he's he's publicly of shot away from any of the. Those conversations or on a team two team basis to like if I'm in the locker room, and I've got a problem with you. There is no because we always talk about the macho Machiko manhood in the locker rooms, but guys carry themselves like, you know, less than the macho man she's thing that they want to come off as and then you passive aggressive. You're not make you're not throwing the guys that are open, but are listening to the coaching staff like the stuff from. I messed up as many as equa Miniya's round where you've got a rookie who's being told to do something buys coaches, and then being told to do another thing by the quarterback. And then when he doesn't do it. He gets scolded on the sideline and he has to lie and say he was improvising. So he won't anger the quarterback. And then be told by the by the coach to run the route like everybody in this situation was putting a bad position because guys didn't want to confront what they needed to immediately. And if air Rogers is going to go down as the most talented quarterback of all time fine. But when stuff like this comes out the air. Rodgers Tom Brady debate is over like this signifies exactly what the differences between the two guys. And it's not just Bill Belichick is not rob gronkowski is not the infrastructure is the fact that I don't think Tom Brady is a guy who shows away from things if you if you don't like something he tells you on the sideline if you don't like something probably tell you a meetings from what I have gleaned. It just seems like Aaron Rodgers the too cool for school stuff is all good. When. You winning and telling people relax is all cool when you go on a winning streak, but when you six nine in one and coaches, get fired. You gotta gotta switch up his style a little bit. And I think this'll be a proving ground this year. Yeah. I completely agree with you. And the problem with Rogers is while and in part, we were right? Those of us who blamed McCarthy for running the same schemes for having the same offense of sets for seven years in a row where other teams can jump around before you even get started. Because they know what you're doing because you're depending on systems that worked when you had more talent than everybody else and not changing them up to evolve that is a massive part of their failure. But you're right. If it's if it's a Brady versus Rogers. It's not whoa. Is Rogers for not having enough talent around him and being wasted. It's if he were asserting himself in a way that was not quite so sensitive in so passive aggressive. This may have been fixed quicker, right? If you can't pinpoint the problem, if you're not sure if it's him or McCarthy, or if he is creating as much of an issue as McCarthy is then you're not gonna know that that's the place where you need to make a change or maybe. He could've made good on what he had with McCarthy if he had decided to put in the work and to not challenge him at every turn even if he didn't believe in trust them. Now, the issue, of course, as it is displayed in the story is he was given a ton of power in the more power. You got the more. He saw himself as the one in charge. And so McCarthy whether those plays he was calling weren't good or not had lost the ability to make those decisions, and they let that go on way too long before they made a change. Now what's going to happen for Matt leflore the new head coach and this team is yet to be seen. But we're gonna have tied done on to break down some of the more interesting things from this story this Bleacher report story a little later in the show it Spain and Fitz Jason gov. Filling in for Fitz on ESPN radio. We are presented by progressive insurance. And brought to you by computer career dot EDU training for a better life coming up. Someone says James harden is cheating the game. Tell you about it next. Yes. Don mclean. Famously sang American pie. And famously claimed that James hardness cheating the game of basketball. It might not be the same dumb McLean. I'm not going to be the one who Google that. I'm not going to be the one that spoils thinking it's the same person for any of you largely fits with those might be the same same guy. Take is as old as Don McLean sang that song. Yes. Yes. So it's possible. Sarahspain Jason Garfield infants benefits ESPN radio at the espionage, Sirius XM channel eighty you can hit us up on the one eight hundred flowers dot com Twitter feed, you probably already have at sarahspain at Jason one Gough at Spain. And fits we know. It's not the same guy, but feel free to crawl doormen. She's. The same guy. He's now doing. He's doing play by play. Okay. Well. Plano crack. Excellent. So legendary songwriter McLean last night during. Another excellent performance by James harden, decided that his fifty fifth thirty plus point performance of the year was finally the straw that broke the camel's back, and he had this to say about what James harden has done to the Sigrid game of basketball. Feel like route this style. What hardened does is manipulating the game somehow like almost like cheating it somehow? I don't really have a thought beyond that other than I'm watching something that is it basketball like to me basketball player movement ball design plays not just the guy walking it up and isolate and every time who else can do this. You know, it's not like within the system. He's getting all these numbers assistant is built for him. So this the day the basketball died apparently, Don mclean's life. You know, what it sounds like it sounds like a guy who needs five passes to get open and hit a shot because he wide open shots Adama claim UCLA, I guess legend. I got Don mclean's rookie basketball car. This is herb take. If I've ever heard one, listen, bro. This man is is set to set the the seventh most points per game in the season on average thirty six points per game. This is a generational score. Is the dude who has lightened people up to the tune of getting fifty point triple doubles like is nothing Sebaq, relaxing joy his show. College basketball. Does he feel like the kareem's hook shot was manipulating the game too much or or shack backing down to Kim by boot tumble and and abusing him in a finals was manipulating game. No, you use the rules, and you use your talent to the best year ability and on top is not like he's just taking thirty shots against the dude is one of the best patches in the game as well. So Don, you got team got thirty piece last night. I can understand might be upset about that. But James harden is a joy to behold aesthetically can understand why some people may have a problem with it. But in the end saying that it might be cheating the game. He's doing nothing illegal. The refs are all out there watching the NBA hasn't commented on it. And he's he's. On a historic pace. This dude might win is second in VP, and it should probably be his third VP on top of it. I'm not with the whole cheating. The game thing the game. The game moves on the game transcends. And the fact that a little bit of street ball has been brought to the NBA is not a problem is well, you mentioned Kareem it's Jason Goth filling in for Spain and Fitz on ESPN radio. And that's where this. This is where it is all hinged on for me. It's that hardness essentially like tech disruption. He looked at the rules. You said you get two steps by can I take him backwards trying to cover it. Right. And that's the move that gets people. The most fired up is the step back three. It's tough to guard. He knows how to draw fouls. He goes to the line more than almost anybody. And so that bothers people it's not a static pleasing. When it feels like he's traveling every time, even though he's not sometimes he is absolutely. But a lot of times it's just him innovating and Evelyn of the game is tough for those two are used to seeing it one way. And yet you can see the old school style a bit with the warriors and really appreciate ball movement and appreciate great shooting. But that's not to say that. That's the only way basketball can be played. We talked about this on around the horn today. And this is a guy who like I said fifty five thirty point games this year team is third in the west despite injuries. They were eleventh when he had to go on his historic street when Chris Paul went out. He didn't even take the most shots last night. He was third most in shots taken last night behind cappella and Paul and he was tied with the cysts. He is leading the league in deflections and second in steals. He's playing a much more complete game than you would think if you're just looking at box scores or highlights and in the end Ramona Shelburne said it perfectly on around the horn, he's doing this because no one can stop him to best ask it ball. If you score every time, you try because someone else can't stop you. Whether or not you pass it around a bunch before you do it, sir. That's the most agreed just part of the statement to me is he actually said these words, quote who else could do this. That's the points. That's the point bold greatness. Like his point is because this system is designed to allow him and others have made that point this year. I so he's. He's saying. This is because of the system like, no, I don't think that's his point. He just doesn't like this system. And so he's saying if everyone was given the opportunity. Yeah. I mean, we'll have to call Don clean might be busy recording his new album. I don't think any new stuff is coming out from. We are saying we are stamping. It is the same guy. Exactly, right. I don't know if the next one fifty needs a new a new theme song down it'd be on it. It's also perfect. There's also many things are probably be saved for podcast. But it ties in the hand of the American pie song. This kind of take James harden being the target of it. If you love picking role basketball, which everyone loves the Stockton Malone was doing it. Who's a better pick and roll play in the NBA right now Namie one maybe one. The James harden, contempt is amazing to me. And like you mentioned over the last year and a half. He's played better defense than the narrative would allow you to believe too. So not that the fact that he has to do it because Chris Paul and Clin cappella missed so much time the fact that these they've been surrounded by shooters. So it allows the floor to be space. Don't get mad because there's a glitch in the matrix point guy. And by the way that Don McLean sound from Fox Sports west that from the game last night as as the thunder like you said put a hurting on them made them pay for it. One hundred thirty five to one hundred gleaners thirty piece. I can't say that like. Herb Brown ring from the diaphragm thirty piece of thirty piece that is there it is. I think you're right. This is just the same kind of take. We see when someone doesn't like a backflip. Right. It's about a style. Evelyn? It's about a disruption to the game. And I fully admit that. I did not enjoy watching hardened step bags for while. I did think I'm watching travel every time. And then when somebody put it into perspective to say, you get two steps he's taken him backwards. That was it. That was all I needed to say. All right, listen, I might not find a sickly pleasing. But this is an innovation. This is brilliance. This is us watching someone changed the way. This is the same thing that we got excited about with Steph curry shooting from eight feet behind the three point line. But because it's not peer shooting. We can't get behind it. The same way that's the difference. There was a time. When a point guard was all these supposed to distribute the ball hit free throws an open jump shots. And then Alan Iverson came in the game at six foot and one hundred seventy. Five pounds was like I can be to guard. I can be a league. And now, what do you have in the league you've got twenty guys at that position? Who if you're not averaging seventeen more people are looking at you like, we can replace you. It was a time when a guy like Michael Jordan was dot dune who's jumping over people would go change and dope sweatsuits and losing Larry Bird in the Eastern Conference first round. And he transcended the game as well. Like, there's a certain catch up period that a lot of people have to have when it comes to different styles and innovations of basketball, this is just one of them. This has been happening in pick up games on basketball courts all around this country for a while. Now, it's just the fact that now it's on a center stage, and people might think that the game is being played the wrong way. No, go to any local pickup games. He had a game is being played Goth. You know, it's easy. It works. For hoops. It works for life. Evolve or die down to Spain fence Jason off tune in for fits he by the way, twenty thousand baseball season is underway. The tune in app has every baseball fan covered all the way from the start to the World Series. Listen to your favorite team with live. Calls for every MLB game with tune in premium. You're all in one audio app. Tune in brings together not only MLB coverage, but other live sports music news and podcasts, including all your favorite ESPN radio podcast. Like, that's what she said. Was there Spain download the tune inap- and begin your free thirty day trial of tune in premium today. So coming up next who should be the MVP. We'll get a take from someone who's been up close with the action all season long next in Spain in fits Sarah Spain with you as always Jason Gosselin in for Fitz on ESPN radio the espionage, Sirius XM channel eighty we're joined now on the shell Pennzoil performance line. ESPN NBA writer, Tim Bontemps, Tim, you report of a group of people talking NBA MVP on ESPN dot com. When you decided whatever criteria are gonna use it. We're not going to get into that. Who is the MVP for you this year, there's still a couple of days left. So I guess Sarah something crazy could happen here over the fast over the final week. Dick, navy sway me one way or the other. But warring barring something dramatic happening. Big is going to be honest. Compulsive MVP. I think when you look at the totality of the box. Don this year for his great. As James harden has been as an offense of force. Maybe unlike the game has ever seen Jaanus dominant two-way force could be you know, arguably the defensive player of the year. Also could arguably be the MVP he's essentially prime shack with the ability to dribble and pass like guard. I think he's now the best player in the world. And I think just with the way he has dominated at both ends of the court for a buck. Steam that is easily the best team in the league. And so typically one of the best teams of all time. Arguably I think that to me he's the guy that deserves this award and interest, and frankly, I don't think there's a wrong answer to when if you do did you make the case for for harden? I think it's totally reasonable one. My preference, though, is it's free honest to win the words here. I'm little scared of Janas game being pushed Hayward Vance and soon. You know, there's been guys that we've seen before who always at the rim and playing that kind of pace and and play with that kind of force internati. And now we're talking about what's the next level of Janas game. Is this guy who can stay in this area? And this all where he gets his work done for few more years before we forced to jump shot on him because I feel like there have been guys Vince Carter who attack the rim the way he did. And then all of a sudden floated out to the perimeter. I think far before his time, you think Janas is in that weird window where people are going to start asking them to do other things. Or is he going to force himself to do other things next coming years? I think comparing Biscardi honest is Franklin insult the hones-, which is is probably be not fair to Vince. Who's a, you know, probably got a chance to be in the hall of fame and Celtic. Yeah. Thank you on it down at this much. Well, I think you on us is is on all the Brian James kinda track much more than if it's transfer more these mass Mason of his game forcing him out to all the perimeter bananas. What I mean like, I think to me it's like if you go back to LeBrun like when my Brian really took off like forty eight special against the pistons. Right. That was LeBron just repeatedly packing the rim. Will right? He wasn't necessarily can use a better shooter at that point. Then you honest, but still not great Mike when he really became transcended with the heat. It was when he started making thirty eight to forty percent of his threes. Right. That was kind of when it was like, holy crap. Like, how do you possibly guard this guy who can literally everything that? That's the one party, honest is gain that isn't quite there yet, you know, he he can knock down a three occasionally. But it's certainly not something anybody is Mr Lee worried about him doing, and if he ever gets to the point where he could shoot thirty five percent from three and be like a real threat from there. I just think he might he might truly be the most unguarded guy issue. Even more than say guy like hardness now with that step back shot. 'cause I mean, if you honest shoot threes, and you can't back off and do that. I just what you do because here's a seven footer with crazy wingspan who's maybe the fastest kind of cork. Who's maybe the biggest and strongest court who you know, like, I can basically play the point and get to the rim on anybody as it is. And if you've got play up on him to prevent it from shooting the ball, I don't know how you stop. So I mean to me, I think giving hardy works, I think that's gonna be something. He's gonna spend a lot of time working on and trying to get better at and even if he doesn't do it like, I don't think his mentality is going to change because he's always been a guy, that's like attack the rim. And I think that's probably the way his games always gonna be predicated. But if he can develop any kind of jump shot, I just think it makes that much more deadly of a weapon to try to stop at that point amount of not sure anybody, but to stay in Spain Jason Goss filling in for fits denied, any SPN radio talking to Tim Bon temps, ESPN NBA writer, while we've got you in bucks. They take on the. Sixers tonight, eight o'clock eastern, what do you make of this Milwaukee team as they head into the postseason so strong for so long? But these injuries are really making it tougher to tell just who will be available for them in the postseason. I mean, they're one of the I think the question of just how good the bucks are is one of the most interesting to watch the playoffs. Like, I said before you look at their overall statistical profile, and it's legitimately of an all time great team in the regular season. That said there are a lot of people around the league or skeptical of this team, whether it is because you honest can't really be ineffective shooter. There's because they don't trust guys. Eric Bledsoe and brook Lopez Malcolm brogden and Nico Americans to be, you know, really, effective guys. Keep members of a bathrobe Dacian whether it is your point the injuries. They have the brogden Fitch, and you know, Middleton just missed a couple of games. I mean, some of the guys they've had out. Whether it's also just the fact that Mike seems disappointed plans to the play offs. And these guys haven't won a playoff series. Right. I mean, all those factors together have people doubting the scene is and a lot of ways. It reminds me of the twenty fourteen fifteen warriors who, you know, higher per went six six games going to the play offs Abidine that that looks like. It can really be an all time team. And what it everybody do the whole playoffs at every turn right now. Did they could beat Memphis when they went down to one. They weren't sure they could be Houston when it was causing started series. Weren't sure they could beat the Cavs. When they were down to one even Doc Rivers that summer said while they didn't have to play anybody full strength into playoff. So, you know, who knows what would happen if they get right? So like in every turn they got dollars even after the one that's idle, and I feel like for this year's bucks team. They're going to have a similar path. Whether they win the fight or not, I think people are gonna find reasons to be skeptical of them at every level the ploughs until they either win at all or get beat by somebody. They take on the seventy Sixers tonight who've lost two games in a row three of their last five. And if it weren't for the the Celtics, I think more is would be on. Why this team is in Phil functioning on all cylinders the way that people might think if you just throw the names out there the starting five if they present what's been happening with the seventy Sixers outside of injury are pieces still having trouble fitting into the places they need to. Have such a short time since the trade deadline. I think it's a couple of things Jason I think for one they only played this starting five is excellent together. I think plus twenty two or something like that. But they've only played ten games together at this point, which is kind of remarkable given where you know week from the blouse starting right? The fact that the starting lineup for the Sixers is, you know, fairly play together at all is not a great fine for their chances of developing cohesion to go deep, and what is a really loaded these conference. Then there's also the fact that the other guys on their team outside of the starting five are pretty pretty weak. If you look at the rest of their the rest of their rotation outside of outside of Mike, Scott, I think is the one guy other teams look at reliable bench piece in the playoff series needed him. He's had some questionable decision making and games at times at the rest of their guys. Whether it's on out of it or the of McConnell, whether it's Jonathan Simmons. What are change NS? None of these guys are guys that you look at and go I can really count on. Them to make plays in a playoff series. So yeah, that's thirty five is great the numbers. They put up our great. They're going to be a handful for any team to go up against. But you know, the fact that they have barely played together. And the fact that the rest of that roster is, you know, certainly lacking from a talent standpoint, I think it's gonna be difficult for them to put this all together. You know, there's a reason she'd walls to the pistons like the one time in the last twenty years that a team has made a huge midseason trade and gone on to win a title, right? It's really hard to establish cohesion. And when you look at when you look at the Sixers who were trying to do it on the fly with multiple big moves in a year awfully big challenge. About wreck round to try to pull off your Philly stim- Bontemps ESPN MBA writer. Hey before let you go quickly. When you look at the east as we head towards the postseason is there a team that was your favorite at the beginning of the or most of the year and things have moved around or maybe even an early exit that you didn't expect early on that you think will happen now. I've been I've had Rana was my favorite to get out of the east and stay one. And they remain that way. I saw him last night in New York against the nets in Brooklyn. And they they're look like they're rounding inform. I think that the deepest team. I think they have the ability to play in any possible way. Askhat Siachen has become a star this year. Kyle Lowry in Leonard are also level players. They add Mark assault on damn Danny green shooting. Forty six percent from three this year. They're really deep. The really talented. I think they've been preparing for this all season long been experimenting with Linus of ready for the play offs. And you know, I think when the when the rubber hits the road here in the postseason expect Toronto to be playing Golden State, and FOX awesome stuff. Thanks for the time and enjoyed the game tonight. Absolutely. I tried me. Good stuff that east is going to keep us all guessing, I think because the bucks get healthy again. It's gonna be a tough one main offense Jason filling in for fence. We are presented by progressive insurance. Coming up next pop just being pop or something you should be criticized for and how much of this stems from the relationship between players and refs. We'll get to next. It's pain in bits here Spain with you as always Jason Goff filling in for Jason Fitz on ESPN radio. You can always hit us up on the one hundred flowers dot com Twitter feed at sarahspain at Jason one Gough at Spain and fits that was from altitude sports, the call that objection there afterwards, he jumps into the post game interview for the opposing coach nuggets. Coach Michael Malone doing his post game interviews crack some jokes about it. You know, does the typical pop move. Is it funny to you? Or is it maybe like, hey, man. Try not to get addicted twice a week and lose three of your win three of your last eight games and fall below the thunder. Standings? Well, it's the fastest objection in league history beat flips on the light flips on his by a whole, forty-three seconds. So that's something for the record books. But you know, a lot of stuff to pop does is cute to everyone else. I I respect him as a coach I think the sideline reporting thing has kind of taken on a life of its own where people are just trying to do their jobs in the end if this team doesn't live up to certain expectations because it's not like the didn't get anything back for violin it, right? They got Dhamar Rosen who was a perennial all star the Marcus Aldridge who was a all star. They just haven't played good enough basketball. And if this is one of those ways you can innovate, you know, some kind of or motivate some kind of energy for your team by didn't thrown out of the game. It hasn't worked last times. That's the thing. This is like a lot of what pop does. But you've got a team that couldn't be working to avoid the warriors in the first round of the playoffs. And instead you fall behind the thunder for the second game that he. Mrs that you lose. And you know, it was interesting listing doors Burke this morning on golick and wingo because the conversation about pop in his objection lead to a larger conversation about the relationship between the Rapson players in the league. And particularly how many veteran respected officials have left in recent years causing generation of younger Fs who are trying to not only establish themselves and relationships with the players, but also get the calls, right and figure out the flow of the game. And we've seen some demonstrative interactions between coaches and rest players reps. And it's had doers. Pretty worried about what it looks like to yours. There is a level of disrespect and then push Gration coming back from the officials where I'm in my homeless fan watching things, and I'm cringing. So I'm wondering what the casual viewer of the NBA think I think the frustration has built to a point for coaches for players for these fficials the level of discourses cut to change. And what the answer is. I don't know. But as a fan, I'm concerned. What do you make of that Goff? Are would Scott foster first entered the league? And there was a time when I was doing pre game and post game next Steve Holman for the Atlanta Hawks and Atlanta and Scott foster was the new guy who's the target. Everybody knew the Scott foster was a guy who's trying to prove himself. And now, you know, what you're gonna get out scofflaw. So I think that every time we get a new batch of referees. There's a certain establishing the needs to be set a foundational period that needs to be said. And I think we're just seeing more and more into it because you know, other than VP storyline. There's not a lot of storylines on down the stretch of the season. I don't know if it's an issue doors put it in some pretty grave terms just now in terms of disrespect and all the other stuff. But I don't know that it's it's huge an issue as that as it is a bunch of restaurant and establish themselves. And also make sure that they are respected going for. Now. The problem is if you're not allowing that that back and forth because you are working together on in in again, you know, the reps and the players. It just looks like the authority figures of the rest. We always talk about them with something bad happens, but they're working together. So if you can't have a working relationship with guys can ask you things, you know, how did I guard that guy what what did I do on that one? Then that's a problem. But if it's all outright disrespect because you think you could punk a young dude within some of these guys aren't going for it. And I can understand that. Yeah. I think it's actually both ways. Right. It's it's that they need to work together. And if you've got players who are immediately jumping all over dudes that doesn't work out. And if you've got a fficials on a power trip who won't listen to guys explaining their case without immediately charging technical. That's an issue to look at the warriors the other night. They were adamant that the referees. Had messed up all the calls and that late loss to the timber was to the point where they got find a whole bunch of money for blatantly almost aggressively and definitely disrespectfully clowning the officials during that and the NBA's two minute report said that none of them were wrong. None of those calls. It doesn't make. It right. And it doesn't fix it in the moment. But there is something to be said for needing to figure out this relationship. So fans at home aren't questioning whether things are being done the right way NBA on ESPN radio. Tune in tonight, Trenton the warriors visit the Lakers presented by indeed coverage begins at ten eastern on most ESPN radio stations coming up Aaron Rodgers versus Mike McCarthy will get into the details next.

Mike McCarthy ESPN basketball Spain NBA James harden Don mclean Jason Fitz Fitz Jason gov. Filling Aaron Rodgers Rogers Jason one Gough Green Bay Packers Chris Paul MVP writer Ted Thompson VP Sixers Evelyn
Matt Minich's BCT - with guest Mike Eayrs, retired Green Bay Packers Director of Research and Development

Cincy Jungle

1:13:16 hr | 5 months ago

Matt Minich's BCT - with guest Mike Eayrs, retired Green Bay Packers Director of Research and Development

"Songwriter Charlie harding. And I'm using colleges made loans or the host of switched on podcasts about the making and meaning of popular music every week Charlie and I breakdown the most interesting hits trends and artists to understand what they're doing what they're saying and why these songs so infectious we recently broken down. Billie holiday music with her brother and collaborator dissecting chance the rapper with Super Producer. Oak felder and covered everything from Dolly Parton to trust God. If you love music you're going to discover something ear opening in on pop so join US search. I switched on pop in your favorite podcast APP. Listen to an episode about your favorite artists and described from three apple podcasts. Spotify or wherever you're listening to get new music explainers every week and after listening you might want to check out our new book. Which Don pop? How Popular Works and why it matters at your dollar. Thanks RASA screaming ninety. You joke with coming to all right. Welcome to this week's addition of Matt Mimics bengals. Chalk talk here on. Orange and black insider Today I got a great guest Retired director of research and development for the Green Bay packers. Mike Ayers. How're you doing today? Masseurs doing fantastic Matt. All right. Great I really appreciate you coming on First off. I'm ready to ask for the abbreviated version because I'm sure director research and development for an NFL team You involves a lot but Just a real quick break down what What type of work were you doing for the packers On on an everyday basis well essentially my job was to incorporate a scientific viewpoint into football operations and what that entailed is just simply analyzing data trying to find out if there any significant trends in the information. And then using that and getting that information into the hands of our decision makers in whatever context and you'll play callers Scouts coaches players. Whatever so that essentially essentially it would improve the quality of the decisions they made to help. Our organization creates success. All right and so I think right now. We're kind of in a in a big phase kind of the dawn of analytics in the NFL But analysts become a becoming a much. More I don't want to see how much bigger part of the NFL. Because I think it's always been pretty big part of the NFL. But I think it's a lot more out there I think. More people are aware of it and And can kind of be a little bit more critical decisions based on research out there and known From from From different avenues different organizations. That are out there so You're you're kind of on the on the forefront of that and the NFL before the rest of us even even with that was they want him getting from you. That's correct basically. I was hired by the Vikings back in one thousand nine hundred eighty five to be a director of research and development and again. I was actually the third person that the vikings hired I had to predecessor says. He came into the building in the early eighties. I doing them in the mid eighty and you know analytics in one form or another has been around a long time simply because it had different names you know obviously research director and even when I was a player you know way back in the seventies we always talked about tendencies and probabilities and game plan. You know you could always kind of play a hunch if you watch a lot and I'm old enough to where I could even say when you're watching film rather than watching video but you would see things you know. And it's the most fundamental thing in human behavior that is whatever creates success is generally going to be replicated in future situations. So you know. Football's a great team to analyze. Because it's an here's great soundbite. Point football is a game of dependent decisions in other words almost every decision. That's made the course of a game or in the course of a draft choice or whatever he essentially is triggered by events that preceded. So if you can identify the chain you can probably often predict what's going to occur next and it works out real. Well it's a matter of fact there's only one true independent decision in entire on TV. Guess what it is because it's the only time yeah acquaintance from the time. The coin is tossed every decision following. That is actually a dependent decision and we used to analyze coin tosses. Believe it or not because we were talking you know some teams wanted a for some teams want to take the ball It varies whether your home or on the road at varies by environmental situations social so again you know which would analytics really is. It's a new word that basically describes the old word tendencies improbability. All you're trying to do is use. What's occurred previously to try to help you. Determine what's going to occur next absolutely and anybody. Anybody coach into any levels Been breaking down tendencies for years so now the the packers are are noted And for for being similar to the Bengals In the way they approach team building And you know being about building through the draft and drafting players Who you know the ultimate look to to bring in for a second contract So that is something that when the Bengals have had some bad years and You know in pets and bad draft which is you know obviously related there People have been critical of Can you talk a little bit about You know what? The connection is between the draft creativity in in trades In in overall process of of how to build a team sure well again when I was with the packers. We are a very much more so even than they are now very college draft. Reliant team and our reasoning for that was primarily to full number one. We fell more than anything. We're in the business of trying to create a culture and the best way to create a culture is to try to create stability and the best way to create stability is with the college draft because he essentially when you draft player or you sign a college free agent essentially retained the rights on that player for the first four years of their career. Or you have the option for the first five years if it's a first round draft pick so it gives you time to essentially develop talent and then the second reason why it becomes such a good thing is number one you want to create a culture that having the same players there regularly but secondly it's also a very economical way to build a team because again you retain the players players in their initial contract and even anytime soon their second contract. Are you know fairly reasonably priced relative to the CAP? The problem is when you go into unrestricted free agency. In Pro Free Agency is you're bidding against usually a nucleus of maybe a dozen other teams. That are trying to acquire the same player. And so you're subject to the laws of supply and demand it drives the salary upwards that you can use pro free agency to solve a need on your roster but the problem is almost always going to wind up paying more than if you were able to draft and develop to try to fill the same need and so it's just it just made economic sense because it allows you greater flexibility to resign. The players drafted if you got the original guys and you know you guessed right and signed him to their second contract. Basically you've created even more stability within your franchise and we felt. It was just the best way to build a team. We occasionally went into pro free agency to feel you know glaring immediate needs and the packers have gotten more aggressive in the last couple of years but I really believe the heart of it. All is the culture you create your locker room and the best way to create stability and culture is with the college draft. What do you say that You know from a front office standpoint you particularly the GM To to build a team like that get to have a lot of. Let's see honesty like being honest with yourself in your real you know truthful evaluation like Hey I want this guy to be successful. I want to think that we made the right choice in this guy And then two people to look at a guy for years later and be like no. This isn't a guy were given a second contract to you. I mean I is that something to kind of put Your Eagles Ego aside a little bit Face the facts unless things well. Honesty is a huge part of success. Probably in any organization. 'cause you you know you need to essentially keep your finger on the pulse of reality and I agree. I mean one of the things that we did as part of our culture is we had a relatively relatively the other NFL teams. You're in a year out. We were one of the youngest teams in the League in terms of the players on our roster and we really believed heavily in not just the draft but college free agents because one of the things that we did to help recruit college free agents to the packers is simply show them the numbers on our roster and that is every year we felt we were GONNA wind up keeping four or five college free agents guys that never got drafted but we're going to seriously evaluate and in some cases. We kept them instead of keeping draft choices. Because at the end of the day the culture we wanted to create is the best fifty three players are on your football team and then even to a degree transcends positions because we did not position differentiate our roster. We had years where we kept three fullbacks. We had a year where we kept five tight ends because essentially we were trying to fill all the rules to win a game and we felt like keeping those people. It simply gave us the best chance to win. Yeah I think there's probably divisions in the NFL right now that don't have three fullbacks but but again talking back now going to. I think it was the two thousand I believe. Two thousand six roster that might have had the threefold exponential. Yeah yeah the Larry Centers and Brian Mitchell type survived but you're not finding very many Moose. Johnston high everything is trend. Right it absence lawyer and the new trend based on how the forty niners used the fullback position is all of a sudden. It may come into a renaissance and people decide. Yeah your fullback probably would do more good on a roster than maybe a fourth died Internet even a third time. Yeah absolutely so now getting into the draft. Obviously that's the thing that's most pressing on people's minds right now and Win How how exactly do you put together a draft board and again? I know we're not GONNA be able to get into all the details today but you know kind of what the basic format and set up a of a of a draft for sure well draft board essentially is a table or a matrix that simply consists of columns and rows right and in the case of our draft board. It consisted of eight large roles where each will contain multiple players or could potentially contain multiple players and there was a role for each round of the draft and then there was a role for college free agents that we felt had a chance to make our roster and could fit into our system so role one is round one right and then essentially the most upper tier players in the entire draft class. Sit at the very top of the role and that was devoted to guys capable of controlling a game or projected to become very very dominant players. And then you know. It fell into line behind them then. There was a clear demarcation of players that were draftable in round two and this was a consensus greed based on the entire personnel and coaching staff and medical staff to. I don't WanNa undersell them because you see clearly. They durability becomes a huge factor in all this as well. But you know we'd have a series of draft meetings there would be a consensus It all started with a regional or area and would present a guy they would show highlight video and they would go into the process of discussing. Exactly how where he would sit into our roster which brings in the second part of the draft toward the calms the columns onto Matrix are all the different positions in our system. So you got the obvious ones like the quarterback in the fullback and tight end wide receiver so forth and same thing on defense. Your specialist your long snapping your punter and so forth and A. Maybe if you've got something unique to your system you know because at one time This transcends actually even the Ted Thompson era but when I first came to the packers one of the things that we did is we essentially had a hybrid defensive player that was part lion part linebacker and he was given actually comes from the old transfer. Cisco FORTY NINER system. He was called the elephant right and it was a guy that could play in coverage or rush the pass and he had a real unique role. We moved around the field and everything that becomes one of your columns is guys you think project into that and then based on the guys you project on that position if you feel a guy is worthy of navy a top five pick. He sits way up at the top of the list on the board for his physician. Because he's on the first role and if you feel worthy maybe of a pick in the twenties he sits down lower on that first role so that you have them great within the round as well as within the position and so you've gotTa Matrix and literally one of the things. They used to joke about the personnel staff. Is You do your research? And the board tells you whom the best player to draft is when you come around on the rotation but his imagined in your mind if you will a matrix of rows and columns where the roles are simply the rounds of the draft and college free agency and the columns are all positions that exist within your system of offense defense and special teams and one of the things again the matrix the matrix. Kinda unique is a lot of times in a given draft class. In a given position the round will be completely empty in other words and based on the evaluation of the personnel staff as they're looking at let's see Outside linebackers that's actually a pretty generic. Let's get real specific. Let's say nickel inside Slot Corner Right. Perhaps there won't be anybody in the fourth round right. 'cause basically they'll feel there'd be a big drop off talent in a certain area and you know. I think that'd be blank spots the other point is you know there's thirty two picks in the first round but I remember a lot of draft boards where our personnel staff would only rate same eighty twenty four or twenty five players as being essentially worthy of the first round. Pick so that tells you a little bit about how subjected the draft is too because different teams see players through different lenses each system and each team is unique in. Its own way that they're going about trying to win a game but you got the and if you build the board correctly essentially when your turn comes up on the draft board the Matrix tells you what's probably the best player and the best fit your teeth. Hi I'm David Fox senior vulture and host of the podcast. Good one a podcast. About every week I interview a comedian writer performer. About one of their jobs joke income their stand up special Saturday night live sketch or song or even a book breakdown. The joke and figure out how it works. What inspired it and what it says about their sense of humor for comedy fans. It's serious discussion about the craft of jobs for interview fans. It's a really funny conversation. Thing to people who have a lot about comedy Francis next advice podcast might not be exactly what you're looking for something to talk about after all that affects your new episodes a good one time on every Tuesday starting him credit for free on Apple. Podcast and your favorite podcast from culture and the box media podcast network. Have a good one. So if you're in that situation and and it's coming around and say as the packers often do in our this year You're picking towards the end of the first round and You don't have anybody in your board that evaluated as a first round talent It isn't that a time when you believe the best value is to treat out of the role round or or or. Do you still just take the best player on your board. Well you do it either way. You know number one. If there's a gap there obviously it's advantageous to trade and acquire more picks for later in the draft right but if you can't the green partner you know I guess you could just sit tight and let somebody pick ahead of you which actually has happened a couple of times draft but you use it on again. The board will tell you the best player available at that time and that pick by you know for by position and you if you take the board is rarely missed in the time that I was around but it answer your question yes. We often traded down when there is a gap in the board to acquire multiple piss. And do that. Because you have a lot of confidence in user staff's ability to evaluate the class you know conversely If you got four or five guys there That you think are worthy of pick At that slot or are you thinking? I'm GONNA take the one who's top even though there might not be that much difference or is that a situation where you're trying to three down three slots and get some value to it becomes very intuitive. You know because because essentially it's nice to see it's a matrix it's nice to essentially say we WANNA get value. It's nice to us all the great buzzwords but at the end of the day it's about acquiring players. They're going to help you win and so you know it becomes a judgment call or an intuitive call. I think where you try to decide you know about and I'll give you a really good example right. Basically we analyzed a lot of traits and analyzing trades is actually part of. My job is Obviously we had trade charts. We had other systems of evaluation that we use to try to determine how players when and how they were drafted. You know did. They live up to their expectation and we valuated specifically just trains and we found that essentially one out of three was what we called an imbalanced trade in other words. The team that traded up or the team that trade a down got essentially tremendous value. Right and I can. I can give you two specific stories right and they both turned out well for the packers so this is kind of a bias but essentially We had clay matthews rated very highly as a pass rush as a player because we felt he could do a lot of things but obviously as an edge pass rusher and that's a hard position to fill on a roster and Essentially the packers started trying to create up to get him because they figure in order getting it was gonna be vulnerable after anytime after slot. Seventeen in the selection numbers so we started trying to trade up seventeen to pick him up and we couldn't find a partner. People Seventeen had a guy they wanted. They didn't want to trade out then. The same thing happens in slot eighteen. Same thing happens and sought ninety then. We started getting worried that somebody's going to trade up because they knew we had a specific player in mine etc etc. The whole thing on hold we wind up taking him in the early twenties and we were looking at the time we were heavily criticized by NFL network. Espn because they thought we drastically overpaid to get him and we had because we rated as one of the top fifteen players in that draft class. But you know as Ted Thompson said when he was addressing the media and when he was addressing the room if we felt he was good enough to trade up the slot seventeen floor and we wound up essentially you know overpaying to get him at twenty. I can't remember twenty one. Twenty two or twenty three but it was in the early twenties. The whole point was we've had these good enough for the teens then overpaying for him in the twenties he still was agreed he became a great player so it worked out and worked out really well. And you know we had another situation where we're coming around and We have a player that we really liked right. And all of a sudden out of the blue we have another team call us and the team's GonNa remain nameless but they offered us an absolute boatload of picks to acquire because they had a specific player. They wanted they wanted to trade up to getting and obviously wanted to treat up very bad to the point that they essentially were offering us on a draft chart about six hundred points greater on a three thousand point scale then the pick was actually worth all right so we had a chance it in effect if this is a black decking. It's a chance to double down right. And the general manager passed right. 'cause he said we really like the player that's on our board. It's a great deal you know all of our analytics numbers tell us that we should go ahead and make deal because it's going to be advantageous us the right now or in the business of trying to choir players we have a player we really like. We took them and I'm not going to let the player Relieve Nan. This but the player turned out to be a tremendous success. And you know had we traded down and not had him in our locker room it would have been really difficult to believe that we would have gotten the same value by taking the boatload of pits. Yeah so so when you have that That player Targeted in a identified. The player. That's going to make a difference for you Even even if it doesn't seem to be you know correct value wise. You GotTa do what you gotTa do to get that guy. Yeah they'll get them greg because at the end of the day like I say it isn't about charts and it isn't about selection numbers and all those things it's about improving your football team and if you really believe that you've got a player on your board that's GonNa make us significant positive difference by all means bring them in. Gosh you know yeah absolutely coming to the Tashaun with with position thinking about you know. Different conditions and You know how it's broken down deeply differently than we think of You know obviously nobody. Sitting talking about the draft in near net is talking about the best elephant the draft. But when you're looking at in in that way Do you ever slot players into multiple roles You know for for instance. You mentioned a nickel corner before. Let's say you had a guy. And you think is best positioned is is Nichole corner and maybe maybe you slide them as a fourth round. Pick a nickel corner and a fifth or sixth round. Pick outside corner But now you know now as you go through the draft. Maybe got a nickel corner before you got to him. You're not gonNA take to nickel cores. Maybe you'd want an outside guy. Do you cross evaluate look at guys in multiple roles and that SORTA way you try to acquire an I can here Ted Thompson telling the entire room this over and over again you twidle acquired the best football players they can't you can try right and You know regard and believe it or not. This is probably gonNA shock your audience but regardless of position. 'cause like I say we entered seasons thin at some positions and really deep it others. But you don't always even to sell out by the time we got into October. You know because obviously it's a game of attrition. You never going to be able to predict who you're going to lose and disaster lists and bring guys in on waiver wires and everything else so you try to use every avenue possible to build a good football team but regardless of position if you have a chance to pick up a guy who's a great player and a great locker room presence because again. I'm going back to the culture. You know you want somebody that's going to essentially be positive in meetings practice and essentially elevate the people around and one of the things that I felt so neat about during my time with the packers is we had a fantastic locker room meeting room practice field and Game Day Group of people to work with you know they were just honest to gosh guys that you enjoy being around. They enjoy being together and it just helps make the whole process more synergistic. And so we really you know we had pretty good ideas of what people are. GonNa Project but again you know. It's an inexact science because you know I can remember. And this goes back to my vikings knees now but I remember the Vikings. We drafted a guy. One time that we thought was going to rule. The world has nose tackle and wound up essentially going to the pro bowl as a defensive end. So I mean that tells you just how much things can change you know because all of a sudden the guy got slimmer? The Guy got quicker and he became a great edge rush and the either we are ready to the ground. Because we thought he'd be run stuff you know so it's an inexact science you know. Yeah in India. You know these are. The days of the tackle was was a three hundred fifty pound guy. They're a little bit leaner now but yeah Now so you know what I'm getting from this is is that it's much more heavily Based on the best available player You know concept of grafting who's at the top of the board rather than going in and trying to fill specific slots in the roster position to need things like that correct. By the end of the day you know. Depth becomes a factor in decisions. All right because But I remember you know I remember one time we looked at our roster and Lo and behold we were looking at the. There's is anybody. Have any ideas you know is to you know where we might want to try to find a guy in pro free agency and essentially every guard that was on our roster at the time had three years or less experienced in the NFL. And I remember one person in the room suggested you know. Maybe we should try to find veteran to kind of try to teach these young guys a little bit about the game and so forth and You know the feeling was by. Our management is no. I don't think we're going to do that. Because the fastest way for guys to give better is to play and if we bring in seven or eight year guy and essentially. The young guys are going to lean on him. We're going to feel a responsibility to put him on the field and he's going to delay the development of the younger players so essentially believe it or not. We went to camp with four rookie guards. And you know a guy a practice squad guy but anyways it worked out really well God offensive. Line coach is pleased with we had in the room. We wound up starting young guys. We struggled early in the year. Also I tour three games because obviously it's a steep learning curve but keys by game five and gained six. These young guys were playing really well and it was a year that we qualified for the playoffs. So I mean we wound up with a pretty decent team. Besides you know so yeah. I definitely think it's not talking about your team development to and team building so. I'm sorry go ahead right but you know even though the roster may look a little suspect like you say there's a lot of things going on and the other point is we had a very aggressive management in terms of player for player veteran traits from time to time too because we made a number of try again because we believe that we could develop talent. We believe we had a coaching staff. That had a lot of good teachers on it. We essentially took the lead would make trades for guys in September and October after a lot of teams would kind of say. Okay this is the roster we're going to set and we're going to kind of develop with that and you know every once in a while. I really compliment our PRO personnel off. Because they would keep calling and find out if there's anybody that somebody was willing to part with and again if our management felt they could upgrade our team and bringing in good person and a good player into the locker room we'd go ahead and make those deals and we made a number of September and October deals that again you know by November December meter very positive addition to our teeth and they were can't friendly because the nice thing is you know at that time of year if a guy is a bubble guy and he's worried about being on his current team the next week and all of a sudden another team is willing to trade for him you know. What kind of a confidence boost does that? Give you know these guys believing me enough that they were willing to give up either another player or draft choice to bring me here and normally those later in the season trades wound up essentially turning out really well for us because it was a great show of confidence in an individual player. Yeah I think I think any aspect of life. When you're when you're having a rough time you know sometimes a change of venue can just do you get change attitudes so absolutely now talking about positions You know one thing that Talked about a lot. Nowadays is position value And in particular with the draft. I think a lot of analysts are are very critical of teams Specifically with the running back for this should probably the most obvious when when those guys are taken Highly in the draft Is Position Value? Something that's factored into you. Know original rankings. Or is it not something that that was really thought about to her How does that come into play when when constructing draft board here? Well the best answer to that goes back to my vikings dates because I remember one time essentially when I worked for the Minnesota. Vikings are player Personnel Department. Believed that there are about five physicians on the field where it was capable for a player to take over and dominated game and the most obvious one is quarterback you know because this is touching the ball and doing more with it than anybody else and you know a marquee running back can do it. A pass rusher can do it A shutdown secondary man can do it but only for part of the field but you know so essentially the thinking there was we had a special designation for those types of players and they are type position because obviously there's some positions where it's almost impossible for a guy to dominate a game. I mean you know an offensive lineman while he can lock out somebody. It's going to be rare for him to get two blocks on a play or something where he just totally takes a game all right but there are positions where it can occur and so we had a color coding system. Where essentially we would code the players capable that were evaluated is capable of dominating game and we made every effort to acquire them regardless of their position. But like say you're typing into a number of positions because not every position can do that on the field but there are some linebackers that are literally unblock. Couple you know. I've seen safeties it. Nobody could block. You know that all of a sudden they become a tremendous factor running game They're great litters and that they can still play in coverage you know and those guys are really premium to have because it gives you flexibility to do other things with the other players Hawaiian so you know there are positions. Running back is the one that gets beat up because of the de emphasis on the running game and the relatively short careers of players at the position. But I still go back and a great example I use is Chicago embark. I mean if you have a chance to pick up a guy that you believe from his position can control the game which on occasion see has done. Then go for it would be. My state is basically bringing them into your locker room getting into your organization and cut him loose and see what he can do. Yeah absolutely and we talked to a little bit about trades We and you mentioned You know the The trade value chart Are you and I've talked a little bit about this in the past that you can't can you talk a little bit about where that came from a House? In what is relevant is today with with the currency. Cba sure well. Originally the chart was developed by the Dallas Cowboys. Obviously Jimmy Johnson really made famous because number. One he's the one that essentially leaked it out to other people which was a good thing to do as well. Because essentially it establishes a value for current but the original tarn ironically was developed within the management side of their front office and it was based on compensation to sign so that hopefully they were essentially receiving or getting better value coming to the cowboys than they were giving up and going out and the whole idea was. It became a standard to where you have a norm table. Now for what the Fifteenth Pick in the first round is worth versus the twentieth pick versus the Fifteenth. Pick of the second round all the way through the entire draft order and you know essentially the fact that is based on compensation as it existed in the one thousand nine hundred ninety s makes technically invalid model in two thousand twenty great because subsequent studies the deal that actual player performance show essentially the Johnson Trade Chart overvalues first round picks and especially picks in the top fifteen and undervalues picks that are coming in the third and fourth round significant and so essentially we had. We actually had to charts right because we have. The chart was based on player performance. And then we had the original cowboys chart because for a lot of teams. That was the standard they use. And that was the expectation is basically if this is the one everybody's used you know you gotTa make sure that when you're because again it takes two teams to trade so the people on the other line end of the line mistrust that you're trying to essentially take advantage of them. They're not going to want to do a deal. And the the Johnson. Trade Chart was a great instrument in that it gave people the confidence to trade. And so you know yeah. Go ahead finish by leaking it. He did it. He himself a favorite. Because now people know they're getting completely worked over by and those deals and the amazing thing is roughly two in the time. I was in the NFL. Now I haven't been in a drafter for four C.'s. So basically it could have changed giving but when I was in the NFL essentially two out of every three trades almost exactly mirrored the values on the Dallas trait chart and subsequently the Miami traitor. You know because people still used it and accepted it right and again you know it gives you essentially a denominator and a consensus of agreement. That hey you know. We're not trying to take advantage of you. And again you know we had proprietary chart that the teams that we did a lot of deals with we actually share it with so that they could look at it and say well even on their own chart. Yeah this is a fair and other believe it or not other teams sent us their charts. So that as the draft is unfolding. We could see their decision making logic as to what they were proposing. And why are they were proposing it? Yeah I mean it's interesting. I think it's it's going to be difficult to adjust for you know for the win. The chart is off because human nature. I think we're always going to look at the top fifteen picks we're ruining naturally Elevate those cakes because those are the name's GonNa talk about you know the guys that That are that are making a newspaper. Ads The draft so Well human crush not gonNA make it right because again we've essentially would do a study. We did a series of studies each year that followed player tracking for six seasons and it was a little bit subject even bias because we used our own pro personnel grades. They determine the level of success that occurred league-wide in the college draft right but essentially what it revealed to us is what premiums those early Pixar. Because if you players drafted in selection numbers one through five right. Essentially out of forty percent probability that essentially at some point in their career. They're going to be named all pro at some point. In their first three seasons they were going to be voted to the first team of a pro bowl roster and so forth and and again. I mean basically they were given high enough pro personnel grades that they were capable of dominating again. So if you're drafting in the top five you got a forty percent probability you're gonNA take a great player you know. And that's one of the things. We always used to joke about right. Here's the top five slots these guys are taking which two are going to be the great ones you know and unfortunately which is going to be the guy that you think might underachieve. Whatever there's a whole wide range of variables that determine how it all comes out but the whole point is as you go further down in the draft that probability of finding a great player get slimmer and sliver in slim right. 'cause by the time you get to the selection one fifty seven right which. I think falls about to about round somewhere around six. You know you're to the point. Where essentially there's only one player that's GonNa come out of the whole rest of the draft. That's going to emerge as being a guy capable of controlling so obviously it gets harder and harder to find. So let's make the money right. That's right and again. I mean the idea is if you can find some of those guys you know if you 'cause I've always thought the secret to success in the NFL was your ability to locate players either through college free agency or on the final day of the draft and again I ve very fortunate the apart of a draft and develop organization. You know we were able to find a lot of players. Collar player personnel department are general managers. Ron woolfe Mike Sherman and Ted Thompson all and now Brian Kitts all did an outstanding job of essentially having great staff doing a great job with devaluation and as with the packers. We were very aggressive. Trade team we traded both up and down in the order to acquire specific talent that we thought was going to make a difference both in our locker room and then on the field as well and it worked and worked well got. We are in the playoffs. I think we ought to run going up about eight consecutive seasons at one point including the Super Bowl forty five so now. We talked about reasons why he might trade back when from. There's nobody there they valued to. There's a bunch of guys they value You know I know there's team like a New England. Patriots have some of needs and don't have a second round pick The forty niners have a first round pick and then don't pick again until Believe Fifth Round You know teams that find themselves due to trades and things like that with a deficit of picks are they are they more motivated to trade back and acquire a larger tool of picks correct. You want multiple picks because again basically the draft in college free agency is your most economical way to build a roster because the contracts are very easy to negotiate. They're very cap friendly. And you know you've got this young person coming in. Who's excited to be there in? Many cases has really good upside so you get them in the right culture and essentially playing within their abilities. Gosh it winds up being a win win situation but one of the trade scenarios you neglected dimension. When you're going over you know kind of choir. Multiple ticks is and it's happened it actually. It doesn't happen often. 'cause I can probably Count The Times on my hands that it occurred during my time in the NFL but the scenario is a team calls you because you're sitting at the slot where they think they need to take the guy and they literally say we. I talked about walking away from him. But they literally offer you the deal of the century in terms of acquiring picks. You know they're offering you their first round pick in future drafts and multiple picks in this year's draft and everything else and holy smokes. You know what I mean you look at that thing and you think well you know there isn't any one player that stands out above a bunch of other guys and with the picks we're going to acquire a maybe acquiring more swings at the bad is going to help us out at this point and so you agree the deal and like. I say you know the other point is like everything else because everything comes full circle right. What did we talk about when we started out we talked about tenants? And how essentially probability research has always been a part of the NFL. Well the same thing is true undrafted because our research when I was with the packers showed that essentially eight teams were a party that was involved in almost seventy percent of the trees right. So what you have. Is You have a quarter of the teams that are very aggressive about moving up and down to the draft order to acquire specific people or to acquire multiple picks. And you know the rest of the teams i. There were three teams in particular. They're hardly ever did deals. They just waited for their time to come up on the rotation and one thing we always got a kick out is when they came onto the clock. They almost always made their pick within the first minute because they knew who they wanted they were going to trade and you know frankly. I'm those three teams two of them. One Super Bowl so I mean there's more than one way to build a house you know and that's part of the beauty of football is you can develop a culture and a system and there are multiple roads here that lead role so. I mean if there was one way that was so much better than any other way. All thirty two teams would be copying that strategy but the reality is people have made a variety of strategies work and work well and like I say teams that essentially the Patriots for example are probably involved in more trades patron heels when I was in the lever involved more trades in any teams in the League. And you know you had other teams that you could count the trades. They made in multiple years. You know maybe a five year span on one hand and yet both were able to experience success. One waited for their turn to come took the best guy on the board and they found a way to build a team that won the superbowl another one. Essentially worked aboard flipped up down every direction you know and they found a way to win the super bowl so it as as we mentioned earlier. It's an inexact science but anyways if you WANNA work a deal. Essentially there were seven numbers. He wanted on speed dial because in touch with them. First because they're the ones that were both receptive to an idea. So we can. We can talk about You know the Ricky Williams deal the. Somebody caused the ridiculous offer but but at the end of the day you know. I think people mentioned as possibly for something that could happen to the Bengals who are we're definitely taking Joe Borough But at the end of the day. It's the Bengals in people. Probably know that the bengals they'll move around very much address also but one of the less likely. Take that deal. But that road is gonNA take you to the super bowl as often as the opposite path. You know because you know the one thing that I would do is again. You know I would sit there and I would say two of the teams involved in the fewest draft day trades in the NFL. Right have both won super bowls since two thousand ten so on the one hand you got the wild traders like the Eagles and the Patriots. As what and again they can be very successful but on the other side of the coin. You've got teams that have built their roster exact opposite way you know. They sign a handful of pro free agents. They wait their turn the draft and take the best guy available rarely manipulating the order at all and they've won the super bowl so you know the whole point is it's more important as to whom you're bringing in your locker room then your overall strategy of how you know you're going to run the draft because some people wanna have a draft class of fifteen guys and other people are content. Hey you know we're going to settle on are seven. Picks and baby got a compensatory pick in there and or maybe they don't have a compensatory pick because essentially they signed more pro free agents than essentially left their roster. But the point being both philosophies have won super bowls so like I say you know you just essentially play the cards. You're dealt as well as you can. Yeah I think too. Often people get caught up in. Well this is what this team is dealing with. You know we've done this for a couple of years. This isn't working. People trying really shift momentum shifts decision making me things but yeah the day. There's definitely multiple ways to to get things done You know you look at how the extreme example in football sense but you know look at how the Baltimore. Ravens are winning games this year. I definitely not how other teams who were winning. Football Games and So I'm absolutely absolutely with you on that now we're talking about trade value And is there a bump you know a little bit a little bit of a bump giving maybe to Picking I on a given day You know for the point is it and it end with I on a given day I reject that there's a premium if you're sitting anywhere in the first five or six slots on a given day and the reasoning. The rationale behind it is because people have time to formulate a decision and a strategy. And as you know given time study their own draft for all of a sudden they start thinking you know. This person at this slot is a tremendous value. And you know. Let's say that you're picking number twenty in the second round and there's a player you really liked you think can make a difference and you know there's no way in the world he's GonNa make it pass election number four five. Gosh rate becomes a tremendously positive strategy. And you know in your life where you were talking about where you have a huge gap in the draft and you're living in the first round and somebody in to wants to move up and they're offering you a whole bunch of multiple picks that becomes a good idea at the time one of the things that I used to preach all the time as a director of research is when you're making decisions understand the context of the decision. You're trying to make and the kings the forty niners. The context is well. We WanNa try to acquire more picks. So we don't have huge gaps between our selections and we lose players that we repeal could contribute positively to our locker room and our team and on the other side of the coin. You're sitting there saying well. We hold twelve fix. There's no way that many guys are GonNa make our roster and we're going to get them through waivers to put him on our practice squad all of a sudden it becomes a good context jewel decision. Let's bundle some of these picks and move up to the slots where we can ap- choir players that we have the evaluated especially high so again the context becomes a factor that drives the decision. Yeah and you're in a ton of sense to me too because when you talk about the The value in certain positions the likelihood of finding that that future all pro You know when you're after the first round you only have one pick until you know until the All of a sudden you're hoping to find one all pro guy in early and draft. You're hoping that that first round hits 'cause you know you know what the numbers Look Lake When you when you get in there at around five All right yes it. Do a really interesting stuff there and you know. Obviously the bengals are holding the first overall selection there also holding the thirty third And I and I think one way to look at that is that hey this is the thirty third. Pick you know contractually. It's not but it's essentially a first round. 'cause you know the way different people. Draft boards volume. You think a decent likelihood even if you only have twenty first round grades you know decent likelihood that they're the draft is personnel. Evaluation is highly subjective. And it's based on culture. It's based on system so that a person you know essentially from time to time We would have somebody rated in the first round and obviously other teams and organizations would find out about it in conversation. It's Kinda cheer. I don't think he's nearly that good. And conversely the reverse was true. You know One of the things. I always got a big kick out of in the drafter is And Ted Topsoil is very mature because it was a consensus as we move forward and Inevitably we'd be sitting there and we'd be in the first round and all of a sudden somebody would draft player that might have been second or third round rated on our board and as the guy would be pulled off the draft Matrix and put under the team. That drafted him in their roster. Ted Thompson was always kind of making the remark. I tried to tell you guys that was a good player. But you just don't even listen. I'm going to get drafted higher. You know but anyway it was a little drafter hoover there no other sound. But it's about the drafter it's your listeners. Probably Unaware of one of the things. That's a really neat thing to alleviate boredom with the scouts and the coaches and the support staff is all of a sudden site that start to go down as to which teams they're gonNa take which guys and the side that's artsy giving an amount of money normally their dollar five dollars and it was only deep to watch that action as the draft unfold. Because essentially there'd be a number times where all of a sudden the name goes off the board on the Matrix and you see scallops and coaches passing dollar bills back and forth. Do we all right well. You know what I'm I'm I'M GONNA change my My angle here. 'cause it seems like a pervert tend to bring up this question What was that draft room? Like as you wash Aaron Rodgers Fall. I imagine a lot of people were for a while. There's probably money going around and then people probably probably get scared of it and stop betting but What was that like Watching routers fall in. I mean did you. Did you know that you know that? That was the next decade of the franchise fallen into your lap. Well at the time essentially it was kind of a mixed bag because obviously there is a lot talk that he was going to be selected first overall and I think he's even admitted he was a little disappointed when a forty niners took Alex Smith instead of him and all of a sudden has a slide started. You know you kept looking at our slot and again you know. The player personnel staff in the scouts and so forth. They'd worked phones well and so they were saying you know blank isn't GonNa take him and they literally with name the guy that they liked and they were going to take and You know the slide kept occurring and when we got about four away. Essentially each of the teams ahead us were essentially stocked with quarterbacks so it looked like he was gonna make it through unless somebody traded up at the last minute and jumping ahead of us which is always thought but the excitement just kept building and building and building over and over and You know honestly. His name was so far above everybody else that it became one. You know I remember talking to Ted Thompson about it. He said it was one of the two easiest draft day decisions ever made. He actually had a decision that when he was with the seahawks that he thought was even easier to me because there was one guy so far above everybody else and frankly he's in the pro. He's in the hall of fame but anyways he said that he can fight it. That was the easiest decision. You ever but drafting Erin at the slot. Guide him. He thought was really close. Because you know like you say there wasn't a name anywhere ear that level of ability on the board and so you know there was quite a tear in the room. I remember everybody was excited. Yeah that was a that was an unbelievable one to to to see on TV and yeah we say that played out and what he has become his his career That was that was incredible So now you talked about the draft board is set up In terms of a draft rankings. Do you do change Do you alter how how that's done as you get deeper into the draft Meaning more value go-to player. Who has a ton of raw talent? But maybe he needs to develop. Maybe it's a triple action quarterback who needs to make a position change or just somebody who just never really got it in college but it seems to have everything all the tools really there. Are those guys favor to over more the hamburgers we were just kind of limited physically Or guys who you project as you know potential long term potential you know multiple special teams roles guys who might not be you. Know a star on offense or defense for you man. That's a fantastic question and You know the answer that I'm going to give you is essentially part of talk. The Ted Thompson gave the personnel staff at the beginning of each year. And that is you know. Our goal here is to put together a football team and in order to do that. You've got to have a harmonious locker room. You know you've got essentially have a bunch of guys willing to go out and practice work through. Fatigue worked through physical discomfort and so forth and You know which essentially brings us back to the point that essentially let's primarily base our evaluation What we've seen in football environments. Let's not get caught up in the underwear. Olympics or eye-popping. Physical statistics are all these things. Let's ask ourselves. What did he show on the practice field because obviously our area national scholar out watching guys you know and this is something I think again. A lot of the General Fan base may be unaware of but essentially they're evaluating practice habits. They're evaluating beating room habits. They're evaluating as well as game performance. What is he actually putting on the videotape of the Games? And let's make sure that we're making and this is how always tied it together but let's make sure we're making a football based decision because we're trying to build a football. We're not putting together a four. Forty relay team. So we're GONNA go out and draft all SAS guys all. We're not trying to put together an Olympic weightlifting. Deep where we want to bring in weight room wonders that can bench press four hundred pounds and everything else you know. Let's talk about how good of football player this guy is. And how much of a ceiling exists given the context of our team? Our competition and our culture always thought. That was a great. You know that was a great speech. Gosh you know Ted Thompson lead or not I think is really gifted guy and I. I don't think he enjoyed getting up and talking in front of groups but he did a really good job when he spoke very passionately from his hard. And I always thought. Gosh what a great tone. The set for your entire staff yeah. Let's make sure we're finding football players and not becoming inam rated by other things. That can be a distraction when when you get late in the draft so you know we're looking at seven round pick you know maybe even a seventh-round compensatory so really getting toward the very bottom You mentioned the importance of undrafted free agents and trying to find those those guys they could stick around and having a reputation for that actually Did you look at you? Know the sign ability of those guys you know. Would you Let's say a Green Bay. You've got to You know there's a there's a linebacker from University of Wisconsin And you don't think he's GonNa get draft you sitting there. Maybe the top of your board. But you're like Easter Madison. We'll be able to get him over here. I'll definitely sang with us. After so you you know you send you send you drastic guy from Hawaii instead because you. It's GonNa be a tough conversation to get into Green Bay. I'd there's any kind of gamesmanship coming to play with that staff or is it just no good. The Best Guy could get to the top of the board. The board generally pointed in the direction but there were a couple of exceptions and the exception were essentially we would occasionally and it's rarely but occasionally pass a guy to essentially draft a player that was going to be more difficult to sign in college. You know an answer your question. It does occur because essentially you believe that if you're on a level field for college free agency you know the agent has because one thing we haven't even touched on is who re whom represents the player in terms of their age because some agents are much more preferable to work with than others right and you know so whom a player chooses to represent him a lot of times helps them either get drafted by a team or for sure gives him the inside track on college free agency because like again. It's a human business and just like you have friends and people you prefer to work with. Essentially our negotiators and personnel staff had people within the agent community that they through third and frankly they had people whenever possible. They preferred to avoid because their agent was a difficult person dealing and I can't say that's endemic to the packers because it occurred when I was with the Vikings as well you know so essentially that can become a fact because basically it's something you have to acknowledge because I can think of specific situations where it indeed did occur. You know where we took player x over player. Why because we honestly felt we could get player. Y In college free agency and we didn't think we were going to be able to get it and I agree. That's very commonly done. Actually as early as the sixth round in some cases if you talk with people that are football executives and they got really candid about you know where it might be one of these things. Well now. You're speaking off the record. They they would probably acknowledge it. But I don't think you're ever going to get anybody at a press conference is GONNA get up and announce it to the world. You know it's one of those things that exists but is rarely spoken of outside of selected circles. And the other point I might have had here is recruiting for college. Free agents actually begins on the third day of the draft. You know and sometimes even before you know you've got people calling and saying you know and again they're not being deceptive. We like you as a player. You know you're currently being considered as a possible you know one of three. We're looking at in the seventh round or whatever and you know keep us in mind you know we really believe you got a great chance to make our roster. This is our situation at your position. And then a Lotta Times. The scout maybe visited with him in his region will put the position coach on and he'll make a strong pitch and from time to time they'll even put the head coach for the coordinator. The general manager a chief Scout. You know I mean I think about it if you're twenty one years old and you're sitting in a college dorm room or parents house or whatever and all of a sudden you have five people from the same organization all come on a phone line and tell you how much they would like to. Have you join their organization? You think that's going to make an impression. Oh absolutely take take you right back to recruiting you know. Furious previous recruiting it absolutely shooting pure and simple and again. I mean Both in my time with the Vikings and time with the packers. Hey you know we were talking to agents and we were talking to players long before the draft physically ended about whom exactly we wanted to target in free agency. All right. Well I I really appreciate your time. talking today and. I think it's very interesting when we talked about analytics And then bring stuff at the time but You know I was A. I was a psychology professor on top of being football coach for eight years So When you talk about You know dependent variables In in every aspect of the game. You're you're speaking my language From background and and and I think that that's That's something that gets a little bit overlooked Because I think a lot of times we we look at it licks and we try and look for universal answers and and there are There there really are. Because you've got every every single thing that happens field Is is is changing. What the situation is it's because you have a distinct started the action which is the snap and then stopping the action. Which obviously is the whistle? And then you essentially that stands as a unit now we move to the next situation with the next formation with the next defensive alignment with the next Defensive Secondary Contour. I mean there's all kinds of you know We had an assistant coach one time that I had a fantastic cool. 'cause he was always trying to get players to watch more videos and he goes. If you watch the video it will tell you the story of the opponent. You're and honest to God if you watch enough video and really become a student of the game. You'll be amazed at how much you can anticipate about what's going to happen and I. I really believe that's true because human behavior is as a psychology major. You have to probably agree. It's somewhat predictable and especially the more critical. The situation becomes the more. Reliant people become on trying to repeat things that have been successful in the past so we can identify that pattern. You know we can help our players to play more effectively to play after to react quicker and you know. Hey that's what the whole process is about absolutely. Yeah absolutely and you know the more things you can break down You know when you look at teams running multiple multiple formations in different motions. Things like that. It's all it's all a bunch of movements all of which things to make things look different but You know making things different and breaking down different areas Just creates more opportunities for tendencies with you hundred percent on that Appreciate you joining me. Great conversation I think everybody for for Tune into day if you go over to the orange and black insider youtube page This not appearing on the on the download This week but On a youtube page I I have broken down Patrick. Queen and Kenneth Murray You know to linebacker pro prospects coming up in this year's draft possibilities for the Bengals at thirty three if they make it that far specifically broke them down in terms of how they would fit into the bengals system with what Coastal in Aruba was doing last year defensively With linebacker so definitely check out the orange and black insider youtube page and that video For information on linebacker but Again thank you to my guess Mike Ayers from formerly of the of the Green Bay packers and I keep tuning back here every week throughout the off season and we will be continuing to have draft coverage and Soon to come free agency Covered as we As we get and deeper into offseason would.

NFL Green Bay packers football Ted Thompson Vikings Pro Free Agency Bengals Retired director of research a director of research and devel Apple Charlie harding League Spotify Mike Ayers US Football Patriots
RTFP #932: Andrew Brandt

Ross Tucker Football Podcast

36:43 min | 2 years ago

RTFP #932: Andrew Brandt

"Brian. I have more good news. I just found out yesterday that I won the podcast one sports net challenge for the second week in their own. I don't know if I was five for five again this week like I was last week but back to back weeks. I have won the podcast one sports net challenge, which means. I no longer have just five hundred dollars credit to give out. I have ten one hundred dollars credits to give out ten because I haven't even done it yet. So I'll send out a new tweet today at Ross Tucker NFL, and or re tweet my other one, and I'm gonna give out ten of you. I'll pick them today or tomorrow, I'll tell podcast one. These are the ten people that I want to get one hundred dollars credited into their accounts. If you didn't do it yet. Go to bed online dot AG sign up for an account using the code podcast one. And then go to my tweet and send me your account number. So I can get one hundred dollars credited into your account, potentially. I'm gonna pick ten of you ten different people. I don't even know if ten people already sent me their account numbers. So go ahead bed online dot AG using the promo code podcast one that is the key. If you want the free. Free money and that rhymes Bri. Let's do it. Still tucker. Oh, yeah. It is. But it's not just any Ross Tucker football podcast, by the way, I need to get a ho yet is t shirt the one I bought over Ross Tucker dot com. So far in the store is a bought. It's daddy soda time shirt. They all have the same front and the back get. Oh, yeah. It is. I think we're done here and it's daddy soda time. So I bought an it's dad's soda time. But we'll find out from you guys next week who want the free Madden. We'll find out which ones you bought because you'll just tweet at me a picture of you wearing the t shirt you bought from Ross Tucker dot com, the shop tab at the top. And then I'm going to pick one of those tweets next week for the free mad, then by Seekie because they're always giving you twenty dollars off the lowest ticket prices when you use the code Tucker. We also will have a new spread the word winner on Friday. That's just somebody that retweets me or Brian or likes it when I post on Facebook. That's a good way to do it or am I start posting them on Instagram? So that would count as well at Ross Tucker and fell sponsor confirmation Email winter you take advantage of any of our sponsors. And then send it to me with a question. You don't even need a question to answer to dander the contest. But I guarantee to respond to your question if you do and then this weeks man winner is someone that takes advantage of ZipRecruiter mutton bowel or seek codes for seek specifically using the code feast or even money this week. And by the way, last I checked not a single person had entered to win the Madden this week. Not a single person. It's wednesday. I'm picking somebody on Friday. So. So it's up to you. If you want to enter right now, if you're the first person you chance to be one hundred percent if two people do it. It'd be fifty percent. Yeah. Pretty good chance to get a free man this week. Anyway, we always have a good chance to Jada knowledge draft when we talked to the former long time vice president player finance with the Green Bay Packers. Andrew Brandt talking count picks. Sam Bradford coaches on the hot sheet hot seat. It's pig Showtime. All right, Andrew, let's dive right into it actually wanna start with Sam Bradford being released by the cardinals on Saturday. Believe it or not and your thoughts on that. Yeah. Day ross. I always talk about Sam Bradford I write about him. I talk about him. I tweet about him because he's a hall of Famer business football very fortunate. Young man. Last phone baby of the old CPA when contracts were outta whack for top picks. Fifty something million guaranteed out of that deal. Then he lands with the eagles bay trade format out of contract to use that leverage. Get a big deal. It's an eleven million dollar bonus from eagles before they trade him. Minnesota. It gets nice killing Minnesota. He goes there zone. It's fifteen million guaranteed to be a placeholder or Josh Rosen where it was already a placeholder for Carson Wentz. The total time played for those two placeholder sinement s-, three games, and the total money almost twenty five million. So this guy has been as fortunate any kudos, Tom Khandan is agent. I think is current about one hundred thirty million or what I think everyone would say middle of the road quarterback at test. Set by injuries but through circumstance through good agent timing. This guy is hit it big. And he becomes kind of a mean on Twitter every time he sees because people like me about kind of much money he made and how much he got off these teams. Yeah. And it's interesting Andrew because we've talked about compensatory picks before. But apparently they've released him because the guy still has to be on the roster after week ten to count against the compensatory pick formula. So them releasing him. Now the Vikings don't get their third round compensatory pick. And instead the cardinals formula will now reportedly project to them getting a sixth round pick. So, you know, we've been seeing the compensatory pick stuff happening for a while Andrew it's just interesting to me that now guys are getting released during the season in part because of it. I mean, every cat manager every front office. Every GM is looking for a way to sort of gain the system, we're seeing it more and more. Now, you know, we really are. Because it's just seems like everyone's got looking for an angle, you know. And I think the thing was Sam Bradford is they knew they were on the hook now. Yeah, they're saving the per game roster on it's everybody in the scheme of things that wasn't a big deal. So hit guaranteed money, and they knew there on the book even as a third string quarterback. So they said what are we doing? You know, we're not we're not gonna play 'em. We can bring up another roster spot. And then you talk about the formula which really favors in a way to sort of get at the Vikings, which may be not their intent. But they're in ten is to serve me skew the favorite towards them with formula. I wanna talk about compensatory picks Andrew because I don't really understand why they are necessary. There's something I'm writing about in my column this week at the athlete. I really don't understand why they are necessary in a salary cap league. I mean, it's the point now where certain teams are almost dissuaded from signing some of their own guys. If they know that, you know, they'll get a compensatory pick and return other teams, you know, don't aren't active in free agency in the early days because they want to be able to get some compensatory picks back when they lose guys. And really I mean in a salary cap league why why should teams be rewarded at all for not reciting their own guys? It's a good question. And what happened in collective bargaining over the years and strikes and lockouts says I teach in sports all the time. There was. Tradeoff nineteen ninety three the first time pre agency hit the NFL trade off. It's okay. You players get free agency. But we get a salary cap. And then this little footnote, we get compensatory picks to. So these are all set off if you will against reagents, easy, and it was such a bargaining chip for gene Upshaw in the union back in the nineties and the Reggie White case to get free agency that sometimes we ignore the fine print and the fine credits. Duck in their obviously through now. And frankly, I don't see the union making a big deal as we go forward into the next CPA. It's just it's hard to get that out of there. But as we talk about France, our teams are becoming smarter in how to use the compensatory pick formula and the formulas not as simple as you signed three. Guys. He's five guys. You get a pick. It's complicated. It's like a it's like McDonald's big Macs. Secret sauce. No one really knows. And people are trying to figure it out to the to the actual pick that comes back, but everyone's surprised in March when they get to convince toward picks. It's it's it's an annual ritual teams complaining that they thought they should've gotten more. But teams do have some idea of what the formula is like they've obviously discovered that if you cut a guy before we ten he doesn't count against your formula. So how did they know that like I had never heard of that? Until Brad forgot cut. I never knew that was a new part of it that I didn't know before. Yeah. I mean, it's again, it's part of the convincing thick formula. I think nonwhite you didn't know, but maybe even teams didn't know in the past. But now everyone's getting smarter. You got cap people that sit around all day. How can we do this when you're right more and more little wrinkles in the cap and the CBI kimes getting smarter? I mean, we're talked about language guarantee. Voids, you know, lane Johnson test positive for Stewart's that's fifty million of guarantees void. If I the eagles, I told her about it all the time business tilted towards management. So when you get a Bradford when you get into real re this when you get them at you, Stafford you're like, oh my God somebody's winning. But those you can count on one hand. So that problem with football compared to other sports. You know, we also saw the raiders cut Bruce Irvin over the weekend. And this is also something that's interesting Andrew because they got to pay him for the rest of the year as a vested veteran. I guess they're just saving cash or are. We seeing NFL team more or less taking at this point. Yeah. I mean, the raiders thing is is really intriguing to me. And I talked about it on Thursday night football last week on Amazon. It's just ironic that Jon Gruden as we know sneers sneers at the home of moneyball analytics thing, but that's what they're doing what they're doing. They've traded present assets for future assets collecting graphics. It's exactly what the seventy Sixers did exactly what baseball teams do that. Are I wouldn't say tanking playing for the future and they're doing, and, you know, listen. I thought they clearly got the better of the Cowboys in the Amari Cooper trade 'cause the market showed it when Demers Thomas is mid round pick and golden takes mid round pick. You know, you can better compare the players, but I think the Cowboys got taken by the raiders because of their zeal for Cooper, we'll see but the raiders are clearly playing disaster the other night against the one and seven. How to spend it any other way? Speaking of disaster, Andrew the Washington Redskins had to place three guys on I on Monday, including both starting guards. They also have both of their tackles are injured they signed three old lineman three on Tuesday or maybe Monday afternoon. I don't know. Have you ever Packers you ever experienced anything like this? No not that way. I mean, you do get hit and at certain positions. But this is extraordinarily feel for the Redskins because you know, their team that for the moment division. I think everyone expects eagles take him over. But that's the worst. You know, you get you get socked it had a position you it's a strength, and now becomes a weakness. And you know, this better than anyone the guys you're signing off the street. You're just not going to be as good. And you know, all the all the great things we were saying about Adrian Peterson they going to get harder and harder now because he's running behind backups. You know, Ted Thompson worked for for years used to sing through through the bane of our distance. The Redskins are living proof of that right now. Speaking of injuries, I'm curious if you have an opinion on the news that came out that former Vikings first round pick Cherie Floyd is suing Dr James Andrews for one hundred eighty million dollars. I don't know where he's getting that number, but one hundred eighty million dollars suggesting that you know, he he messed up on a surgery and ended Sharief's career. I you don't see that every once in a while we're grievances filed. But you don't see this that often where it's a real medical malpractice suit. No, you don't and certainly don't see it with the name like Andrew who's considered the legend in the business. Proteges of Andrews like Pat McKenzie. I were in Green Bay are practicing around league. He's considered the godfather and all the big time agents. Use him drew Brees. And so many have have had their surgeries with them. Yeah. Here's one that is gone south. And I'll be interested in tracking this because all of these things I'm a lawyer and everything was from. 'cause there's gonna be some personal value out of this. That's what I'll be looking for. I haven't looked at the case in terms of the actual charges against, but yeah, it would be some kind of medical malpractice that he didn't meet the standard of care, and it's caused. I would think what he's going to say fluids going to say tremendous loss of earnings and cases are. Yeah. I also saw Andrew Demi cut you off there are so that you had an interesting tweet yesterday during the midterm elections about the dolphins actually advocating. Thing. I Pacific Bill for sports betting. I mean, they they compartmentalize. Well, I guess. Doing bead, and you know, for any lawyers out there listening the ABA American Association and weren't doing a webinar on Thursday a webinar about sports betting. And what's where we've been and where we are in. I'll be involved with that. So check your APA website. But it's to me it's fascinating where we've been with sports betting. It's traditionally been so taboo, and not even traditionally the past six years six years NFL this in court, and in may they lost? And now I tweeted out we're on election day the Miami Dolphins are advocating for proposition on the ballot that would allow for encourage legalize sports betting. This is the same league that fought it in court for six years what a change and you talk about carbon compartmentalizing I just think we're in a new age. And sports betting is not only legal. But according to the dolphins, encouraged and promoted. Unbelievable. I also wanted to ask you, it really is also wanted to ask you, you know, we're getting more and more coaches on the hot seat. And we're also seeing more assistant coaches being fired. Did you experience either one of those in Green Bay, maybe when Sherman was on the hot seat or did he ever fire any assistant coaches when you were there? No. I mean, listen, we had a we had a year actually year we drafted Erin where you know. We had a bad year and Ted Thompson just come in. So this is the kind of thing that we see in all these cases like Cleveland where we had a new general manager who had been there before but comes in from the outside and just in coach Mike Sherman. So that was a tough year. I don't know if it's so much hot seat. But I just felt some some tension the whole year because you had a coach, you know. And then the pick of Erin was the source of all of this because it was a picture of the future. We'd coaches that are judged on the present. And obviously our first round pick that you're didn't help us at all on the field. So yeah, not so much in a acute sense throws. But a whole year of tension that two thousand five season after we took Aaron Rodgers first round. And. Wow. That's amazing. That really is just so uncomfortable because I was in that situation a number of time. And it's like, I I actually advocate when you know agai is gonna be fired. I I actually advocate. You know, releasing him firing him in the season because I feel like it gets awkward and uncomfortable. And it's like this cloud hovering over you during the second half of the year or the end of the year when the coach is good as gone. Everybody knows it. I think it's just it's almost like you can take a breath when you actually move on from that guy. Yeah. I think so I think you you describe what I went through. It's it's very uncomfortable. Sounding board for. Yeah. It's tough from that hacking and having Cleveland and maybe. Other places. Andrew always appreciate the time. Thank you so much for coming on as always. And as always keep up the great work on the business of sports podcast. You're rants have been awesome. Lately. Okay. Ross was a pleasure. So I'm actually I was actually pretty annoyed last night bright because my wife, and I were watching this is us. We DVR. That's like the one show we try to watch together. Although we watched the first episode last night. That's how far behind we are because we just don't get chance to watch television. But I don't have the T Bo bolt. You know, where my wife, and I watch TV I have a detached garage, which is like my studio, and where I work out, and where I watch a lot of football, and I have the Tibo boat box for cable. There's also a Tibo OTA for and it was annoying. Because inevitably when my wife was fast forwarding through the commercial breaks. It would stop either a little bit too far of a little bit too short. We probably it's been a lot we probably wasted additional five minutes. And it's just frustrating because I don't understand we even got a new cable box for our cable subscription, and it doesn't have a button that just goes to the next commercial. It's so nice though in my detached garage because that's what Tibo both FOX does for cable, so nice, and you can even watch. I watch football thirty percent faster. But they have pitched corrected sounds. It's not like. Like, it sounds normal. Just little bit faster. Like if you guys listen to this podcast on to ex same type of deal tvos put together deal just for you guys. Twenty percent off any Tibo boat OTA or T bolt. Vox, just head to tvos dot com slash Ross twenty and remember promo code Ross twenty that's Tibo dot com slash Ross twenty with promo code Ross twenty for twenty percent of if you watch a lot of stuff on DVR, or if you watch a lot of sports is a no brainer promo code Ross. Twenty at tvos dot com slash Ross twenty. Good morning. Cross twenty always a bunch of transactions on Tuesday. Let's start with the to not only fired their special teams coordinator, Joe Marciano, but also cut running back Amir Abdulah signing wide receiver Bruce Ellington Zach center. So it appears as if they had Abdulah primarily for depth in case, kerryon Johnson or THEO Riddick got hurt. It didn't happen. And maybe they thought that they would be able to trade him they weren't able to trade them. So they got rid of them the center things interesting. I think maybe that's partially special teams partially like third-down blitz pickup. If they wanna use Riddick more at slot receiver. That's my guess also maybe some short yardage stuff. Although Ellington is a slot receiver. So they're just trying to give themselves some more options there. Some other moves include the bills cutting cornerback Phillip gains Packers placing Tronto Allison on I r eagles cutting Dextra McDougal the raiders signed a pair of the D ends to help replace Bruce Irvin. Chiefs activated safety Daniel Sorensen and the Redskins signed a ton of old line help to try and make up the losses of both starting guards. And my question of this. When you say a ton of old line help actually a ton two thousand pounds worth of a line or just a generic lot of align. Generic lot of but fair question somewhat clever. Bry, you know, a ton is two thousand pounds. So they'd probably have to signed six guys, so many guests. You didn't really think they signed six guys? So you were just trying to be funny. I almost smirked almost, but I least appreciate the effort out of you. They signed three guys Luke belong. Punk o Austin Howard. And Jonathan Cooper Cooper and belong to can both play center and guard. Awesome Howard to tackle. And. It's kind of remarkable like with all the battle line's league. You almost forget that guys that are available belong co and John Cooper in Austin. Our that played a lot of football as for the raiders, they signed jockey Smith and Kony ealy two other guys that you're like, wow. Those guys weren't in the league Jackie Smith and Kony ealy, by the way for part of one year and all of the next year. I was that guy. That was like, wow. He's not in the league Tucker. He started a bunch of games last couple of years yet. That was me. Unfortunately, so other moves Texan McDougal was just the Nickelback for the eagles in the last game. But he really struggled. I guess they're going to go with craven love Lanc. They wanna see if he can do better at nickel journal Alison just means that the Packers are gonna play more. They're young guys. The the bills starting cutting start bra bra bra. The bills cutting starting cornerback Phillip Gaines is interesting at this point in the year. I think that they're on the hook for the rest of his salary anyway, but they wanted to promote Levi Wallace from practice squad. What have you the chiefs Daniel swords, and he'll help that defense. He is a very short tackler. So that'll help. I guess that's it. Jeez. In some acrimonious news. That means it was getting kind of ugly. You mentioned the lawsuit yesterday filed by Shree Floyd against James Andrews and also to marry his Thomas does not seem thrilled to be with the Broncos right now. It's getting it's getting it's getting kind of ugly. It's getting it's getting it's getting ugly. You know, what that song from? I don't the song actually goes. It's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic it's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic, and I have no idea what the rest of the song is the name of the song. Or who sings it? I just when you said it's getting kind of ugly it triggered like brains. Are the craziest thing ever you said it's getting kind of ugly triggered in my head part of a song. I don't know the name to or the name of the group, but it just triggered in my head. It's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic it's getting it's getting it's getting kinda. Hectic now, I must know while I talk Bryk, and you look that up please sure just Google like it's getting kinda hectic, and I'll tell you that the tree Floyd thing. Look, I don't really know what happened there. But I do a lot of times there used to be a rule. There was something like in the CBA where players actually they told you to net. Like, some people said don't ever let a team doctor do your surgery because there's something in the CBI believe this would be a good one for Dr Chow. There's something the CPA that says as a player, you can't file a malpractice suit against a team, doctor if they do the surgery. I remember hearing from NFL PA that you shouldn't use a team doctor because you have no recourse, if they really messed up to be going for dodger. That's an interesting one. As for Damaris Thomas. He feels like, you know, just reading quotes he feels like the Broncos kind of getting the run around that they weren't honest with him. And that you know, you heard that they were bad mouth. And when he when they left there like I will be better without him. It cetera guy. Was there nine years felt like gave a lot the organization and is just disappointed in the way, they handled it the reality is though it rarely ends. Well, it rarely is a positive when people part, you know, the retirement ceremony or the the ring of honor. And everything went great. It just that's just not how pro football works. Very often. All right to the artist is called snap. The song's called the power dance. Electron ick. Got the power came out. I got the power nineteen ninety and it was actually nominated for an American musical ward for favorite dance single. Nice. So nineteen ninety was when I was eleven and I think the first school dances. We ever had. We would go to a tone mint Lutheran church for dances when I was like in sixth grade, and the big thing then was we wouldn't actually fast ans-. We would just do like lame like jump over each other and stuff because we were all too embarassed. Too fast aunts that we looked bed. We would though slow dance. It was like sixth grade just sixth grade, but that was a big song back there. I've got the power skin. It's getting it's getting kinda hectic. All right could work Bri. Now, that's added value hit the sounder. Yeah. It is remember the I've got the power part. I didn't remember the hectic part. Yeah. Anyway. Jeez. Speaking of unhappy wide receivers apparently the saints Dez Bryant earned a Goshi right now. So this is an interesting one, I do think that they could use a nother receiver from a depth standpoint. And I will talk to Greg Cosell tomorrow about what he saw from Dez last year. How he sees Dez fitting into the saints because if you look they only have four receivers right now, Michael Thomas trick wants myth, Austin Carr and Cameron Meredith. Now, they do use Alvin Kamara and Mark Ingram in the passing game a lot. They have several tight end. Ben Watson, Josh hill. They like Dan Arnold who's a young kid that can run. So they have other options. But if they suffered another injury by receiver they'd be in real trouble. So they wanna try to rectify that now and get that guy. Now question is is this Bryant the right guy. You know, all the stuff he said about the Cowboys, and he he's not going to report to the Browns to work. He's not returning calls the Browns. Then he is. You know, what Sean Lee said about him about the lack of accountability. Is that what you wanna bring onto a team? That's number one in the Ross Tucker football podcast power rankings. I mean think about that number one in the vitally important Ross Tucker football podcast power rankings. I just don't know if that's something you wanna do. But it's something that they got to think about and they got to consider so from a purely football standpoint depth. They had the slot guy in car. Camera Meredith, I think is not been healthy or not been good enough trae coins Smith's, the young speed guy. Michael Thomas is the stud wouldn't be bad to to bring in a guy that can help them out. Contested catches third-down red zone like does. But there's pros and cons of that. For sure. And finally in the move it surprises. Exactly. Nobody the forty Niners. You can start Nick Mullins in their next game. Of course, they are. I mean, he earned that with how he played C J Beth gotten a bunch of opportunities and he's done. Okay. With it. Nick, Mullins got one opportunity and did great with it. So he gets a chance to to do more opportunities, by the way every once in a while. It's not like a paid read from an advertiser. I'll just throw out something just to give you guys a heads up on things to things. To businesses that are run by friends of mine that I'm involved with now that we're getting closer to the holidays. I was on the Doug Gottlieb show yesterday radio. And he was checking out the ball cannon and absolutely loved it. He is a nine year old who plays a lot of flag football. So as you guys start to think about holiday gifts ball canon dot com, especially I'd say if you have boys between five and fifteen go check that out. Make sure you tell them that you heard about it for me. So they know. So my buddy Fred knows I'm helping them out. And then my front page story dot com. I just got one of these for my my wife's Oma who moved into a senior care community. So we got her one of these stories, and it's incredible going to give it to her Sunday morning. I'm beyond excited. My front page story dot com and actually might be. Up on the site. So you could actually read the story about Oma. It's just incredible. She's ninety six years old incredible. But more importantly, it is the best gift you could get anybody. This holiday season my front page story dot com. Wanted to ask NFL player. A question will here's your chance? It's time to past. Email address Ross at Ross Tucker dot com, we usually get to one Wednesday one Thursday, if you take advantage of any of our sponsors all even throw my front page story in bulk cannon there any of them, and then send it to me Ross at Ross Tucker dot com. I guarantee I'll Rian respond your question on the show. What do you got bri-? Hey ross. Thank you so much for the twenty dollars off of my first event at staple center from seatgeek used to code such good venue with discounters able to get some great seats in shared sweet greatly game. I'm currently in my first year of roughing high school football. And I have loved that has brought back. Brought me back to the game. We're talked to enforce the rules without becoming a focus of any game. And this finally leads to my question. Did you ever have a game where you felt that you were singled out, and that Aref just didn't like you? Or did you ever have a game where the ref was calling only you while you felt innocent. Of any fouls. That's from Scott. Scott. That's a great question. I love it. I could do a whole episode on that first of all kudos to you for being an official. I saw around here in Pennsylvania. There's a shortage of high school basketball fficials, which really surprises me. You know, maybe part of it would be better. If people didn't yell at him so much they're not making millions doing this. You know, they're doing it. Because they want to stay involved in youth sports. I mean, give them a break. You know, give them a break. Gosh, I love what you do man. I love it. You know, the game can't go on without the officials who do it for peanuts. And to answer your question. There was one guy, and I would say I only ever felt like there were maybe three or four bad calls against me. And that guy was either all of them or three of. Them a bad hold a bad tripping. He was bad really bad. I forget his name. I think he's still officiating. But yes to answer your question. Absolutely good question. That'll do it for a wisdom Wednesday edition of the Ross. Tucker football podcast. You guys know the deal on Wednesdays gigantic days for us over at Ross Tucker dot com here at RT media. We've got fantasy feast part one with Evan Silva. We've got even money with Steve physics. So fantasy fees is the best fancy podcasts out there even money. The best sports betting podcast out there. So huge day for us hope that you guys already subscribe and listen to those and hopefully you take advantage of ZipRecruiter or seek using the code feast or even money or you buy a pair of jeans. So you can win the men this week. I think we're done here. Thanks for listening to the tanker jest. Make sure it wants to subscribe to the fantasy feast even money and the college draft podcasts all available on items and Russ Tucker dot com or wherever found.

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Unpacking Packers Drama; Jets New Uniforms

Around the NFL

53:28 min | 1 year ago

Unpacking Packers Drama; Jets New Uniforms

"Round with the NFL podcast. Ever slide into the? While another the around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan, I am joined any room build with some heroes. Mark Cecil to my left. Greg Rosenthal to my right? What is up? Does need. I well this happened a lot obviously during west is successful war against cancer. But I can't remember it's been awhile since the three amigos in the room have been together here that was everybody. Were calling ourselves stats are name. Why not but three Migo heels? A little definitely sounded a little too excited. The west it's definitely like a popular dad movie, you know, and we're bunch of dad's. I think it's a little before our time, but speaking of being budget dads and Ricky brought it up ripe for we started. So the shield came back on Wednesday should let you guys know that we are wanna know twenty three to twelve conquest over dollar taco played more like fifty cent taco. And very sore right now by body. So I am aging almost thirty nine. Now Ricky, though makes me feel better because young Erica tampo. See also feeling some aches and pains from the opener. I am. Yeah. It's also just muscles. You haven't used in a long long long time, different muscles. So it's like I was getting out of my car. And I lifted my leg to you know, swing out of my car and like the top of my thighs. I was like what? I like how you described that. You swing your leg out of like, you have a prosthetic or something. I do sprinting, you know, you're not doing a lot of sprinting and regular life that when he scored twenty three runs. There's a lot of running around the spread. Is that your biggest rump of all time? We've had games where we put up runs like that. But it was a nice way to start the season. A lot of people west played great. In fact, hit a home run and got on basis. He always does we we really hit the oil fielded pretty well. And the pitching by Brooke was always good as always. And there's one issue, and we're gonna get to it at the end of the show. Right. And it's side of dollar taco being in your league to begin with. Are you in are you even in the same league that you were in last time, we are in the same guests seem very suspect? They are new team and the has some hitters, but we took care of business. We there is some unfortunate softball related shield matters that we will hit at the end of the show. I'll just leave it there. Not everything was good on Wednesday night. Just like a little tease. Let's say that in this situation. Mark Cecil is not a Ted Thompson like character falling asleep during meetings. So he's on top of. We awake and ready to pounce coming up on today's show. Yes. The mailbag we have an open it up in a few weeks. So we reached out to our wonderful wonderful listeners of the podcast, and you guys hit us up with a bunch of questions. So we'll answer some of those. But let's start with the news. And yes, the big news of the week in what's been a slow week in the NFL. Well, good job by Bleacher report and Tyler done because they pick the perfect time to drop a bombshell about the Green Bay Packers. I guess there's only one thing to do. What's that? When the whole. That's leadership. That's that's Tom Barringer for major league. That's what you want in a locker room. That's what the the shield has. We have expert leadership at up at the top. What about the Packers locker room? Jake taylor. Isn't it wasn't major league? Great movie. The Packers Bleacher report dropped a long long long study of what went on behind the scenes the downfall. If an overall thesis of what was that these of this piece by Taliban? The downfall of the Packers related the relationship between Mike McCarthy Packers coach you've got fired last December Aaron Rodgers and the overall feeling of a huge missed opportunity. What could have been a dynasty wasn't. Why was it the case and Markle star with you here? There's the two principal characters here. Neither come off looking. Well, it McCarthy who comes off as a guy who got complacent and lazy and misguided about why the team is successful right down to missing meetings to get massages, which he categorically denies and then Aaron Rodgers a superstar who does not know how to get along with other people who is petulant who is sensitive, and the pack. Cours could not be functional with these two people at the center of the action. Yeah. I mean, this is one of those articles where suddenly Tyler done does all the work. He uses every single beat source avenue that he has used to attack as be right? He wasn't the past puts it out there. And then you get everyone else commenting on it and wanting to get their tweets about his story liked and re tweeted because it's one of those things that just takes off, and everyone has a point of view. It is a football story to me the skeleton of it is about football to some degree. But it it fit much more in like psychology today because it's about football to one degree. But it really was the study, and it said in the article, it was well stated an arranged marriage. That went totally south, basically. And I came out of it just fascinated to read how honest some of the sources got with him about what was going on behind the scenes, and I I look at Aaron Rodgers I don't know if I look at him differently because I think even on this show, we've always recognized that Aaron Rodgers. Is a little bit of an extra character a little bit of a different, dude. And to me this was it clarified some of the stuff about Rogers separates them a little bit from Tom Brady. I look at him as someone who has been a chip on the shoulder type quarterback which can be used in a well in a very good way. And he has but the mere of that is I feel there's a b line of an element of him the retakes grudge and he holds onto it for a decade. Plus, I mean, we heard that he essentially had a grudge against Mike McCarthy from the minute they were put together because Mike McCarthy with the Niners favored Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers we all know about the draft day sitting await for the Packers quarterback. And it never really got a whole lot better. And the thing that bothered me a little bit. And there's so much into your was the immense amount of backbiting and backstabbing that happened from quarterback towards coach in this. And also the coaching losing his essentially, according to this article his zeal to. Lead the team down the stretch. It will I think Roger's never based on this article fully bought into McCarthy's coaching. Yeah. That he was ultimately a helpful person in his career. And that's a thought he was smarter than Mike McCarthy. I mean, even he probably is. I mean, I I don't think many people would doubt that. But the fact that that relationship was so toxic throughout is is a shame. I mean, it's it's a bummer and my immediate thought reading this. And they hit on it towards the end is like the Packers struggled here because they don't have an owner. They're in a unique spot. Now. Now, there's a lot of NFL owners out there that maybe wouldn't have the ability or the gravitas or the wherewithal to step in and fix this situation anyways. But the Packers literally don't have an owner, but they had a president did. But even even during a lot of this especially early on that president figure, Mark. Murphy was not as powerful and not as up front as he is. Now, that's that position has taken some transition over the years. They did have a general manager. And so maybe it was on Ted Thompson to step in. Because ultimately McCarthy, I think some of the things that stuck out to me was McCarthy had to understand that his relationship with Rogers was the most important thing. And he never was able to address that in ultimately Rogers was never going anywhere. He's one of the greatest quarterbacks ever. So if this is the problem like that needed to be addressed quicker, either it sitting them the two of them down or it's getting rid of McCarthy quicker. I mean, it does remind you about the NFC championship in twenty fifteen that not only did he run the ball three straight times before punting it back to the Seahawks and not not cut brand boss boss, but he kicked field goals on the one yard line two different times. And it just a reminder of like, that's the type of thing that drove Aaron Rodgers. I think crazy over the years. I think there's a lot of different ways to view. How the Aaron Rodgers comes off. But there's not as many different ways to view how McCarthy comes off. It's crazy to think that the jets were reportedly interested in Mike McCarthy, there was whispers that Cleveland was that if you were a team right now saddled Mike McCarthy in this article came out as a fan you'd be concerned because he comes across as someone that to your point Greg the fact that he was stuck around for so long almost immediately outmoded as a strategist that the big the big that seemed like there were factions in this article the way there are when these come out where there were certain Mike McCarthy people who had issues with Aaron Rodgers the person then there were others who felt like it said that people sympathize with Aaron Rodgers for being stuck in an offense that never evolved around the league of talking about it for years, right? They're the most predictable kind of basic and not here not too because he'd had and calling them out for not adjusting type off. And so that you can watch that and you can see that. Then again, you all the stuff about Roger doesn't mean. It's not true. Like you've heard you've heard a lot of stories behind the scenes. Kill someone. All right something early on in their days as a beat writer of the Packers that Rogers in like, they won't speak to them for the rest of their time there in Green Bay. So that's that's part of it. And I think voice like James Jones who worked for our network and immediately kind of came out and was like that's not the Rogers. I know like the the one I know like one hundred percent is a leader that we followed that like we like that relationship. It does not seem like Aaron Rodgers necessarily a guy that's gonna get everyone on the same page. But I think if he respects you there's a lot of people that that have no problem with their enroll the strongest voice in this was Ryan grant, and he came out hard on Rogers. But Ryan grant is not being with the team for half a decade. Plus, I think with why articles like this are so great is this is all stuff that's been kind of under the radar and people that were close at all new. And I think that's why Mike McCarthy, for instance, the jets interviewed him, but never gave him any serious thought from what I heard behind the scenes, nobody else really took interest in them because this was all stuff that was. Out there within football circles that McCarthy had lost his eel that he kinda had lost the respect of Aaron Rogers. And Rogers to me is the thing that I took the most interesting at of this, and quite frankly was disappointing to read a lot of the things about his inability to connect with the young players how how hard he he rode young players as young wide receivers. The the way people are scratching their heads like how can you just cut people out of his life and not ever think about there's no kind of going back. Once you do that. He he has no relationship with his own family, Mike McCarthy. And it's a obviously not a great relationship that they ever had going back to for some reason Rogers put it on McCarthy that the Niners picked Alex Smith ahead of him that Mike McCarthy preferred Alex that he I mean, listen that was just a football decision. He buddy kept that with him Mike McCarthy tried to have dinner and and tell Aaron like, maybe reach out to your mom. Rogers was. Having any of it. And there is two sides of story. It's good to hear a guys like James Jones who say the other the other side that this was a leader. But you hear a lot here. There's a lot of smoke here that I buy into that Rogers is a major problem that why they haven't won the Super Bowl since two thousand ten and I do worry about and we and we briefly spoke we did an interview with Matt leflore at the owners meetings. He was not consulted Rogers before the Flora's hired. I don't know if that was a smart move, honestly, internally with that organization the way what they know about Rogers. And I and he's around the same age is Aaron Rodgers if Aaron Rodgers thought he was smarter than Mike McCarthy and elder who had been in the legal time. I wonder how that relationship is going to go with a young young guy first year coach it's a dicey situation. They said I found it interesting like Rogers type that wants to be challenged on some level that they felt the part where Mike McCarthy felt threatened by Alex van pelt who had a relationship quarterbacks. Coach is a lot of people thought highly of you could sort of see that even in the way. Carthy talked and carried himself that he got his own ego involved there, and I think Roger's gonna wanna coach that feels like as adding to him, and he probably never felt that with McCarthy, and whether that's right or wrong, like I don't know the organization to me would have had to step out, but you do under because some of these rookies you're talking about they're still on the team like the part about equity Minia same Brown and Marcus Valda scant Ling getting frozen out for or struggling with not knowing what to do. Because should I listen to Rogers and run the route that he wants me to run on in the middle. Or should I listen to the coach and cover for the terrible terrible. Look for Aaron Rodgers that he would put these young guys in that position where you can't win either way. And if you're a young guy trying to sabotage yourself in the league like you gotta know better. You got to be a better leader than that. That's like Tom Brady certainly run off like a million wide receivers over the league over the years on New England that couldn't get up to speed. But gloating a lot of young ones. I'm not saying I'm just saying that's part of. It's tricky. You gotta you gotta find the right line. But like that's part of being the quarterback on some level. I think the difference with the young receivers in Green Bay being caught in the middle of coaches demands. And the idea that they talk about Aaron Rodgers when you're out you're out with him. And that means on the field potentially off the field that's pure dysfunction. And it's kinda just beguiling agendas. Relationship lasted is light. That's what I mean. That's why the ownership thing was the first thing that came to my mind was like why this went on for way too long and put some fault on Rogers or not obviously has some of it. But either way like someone had to be stepping. He was changing a third of the plays by last desecrates. And they were mapping. How Ruutel if McCarthy read this is one where it's like, they say don't read it. It's like I hope Mike McCarthy didn't read this because it would be brutal. Like like, his low football IQ was questioned a few times. And I don't know if anyone is like standing on a table, and and back and the part where they're like Rogers kind of turned into far, which is like the thing. He didn't want to be is really kind of fascinating. I thought to kick her in this article was near the end. And you kept thinking was gonna come to the end and the numbers another chunky large anecdote coming at you. But when Mark Murphy, basically pulled Aaron Rodgers aside when Matt leflore was hired without Aaron Rodgers consult as they do not get in the way, you do not be at this time, the problem that was kind of breathtaking moment of that is by the way, a lot of mcneese yet is I mean that that is such a concern. Like Rogers has the power to blow everything up. He's so power. On that organization, perhaps too powerful, and I wonder Greg gas, but I I would say to that. Mark Murphy, you should've said that you go or had for sure I don't know. It's a tricky like literally back in the day was very confusing who is even running the Packer eventually turned into like, I don't know. I just feel like Ted Thompson who is deep out of the picture at this point. He did not come across well at all because he's obviously on the tach physically unwell, and like the modern day fan is like please be active in free agency. And I think there was voices within the organization saying please build a team around what should be a team going to the Super Bowl. Please add at parts and talk about an falling asleep means I think the thing is with the NFL the more you hear the stuff that we we don't hear as much as certain people, obviously. But when you hear little anecdotes that you can never go to air with some of them are stunning. And you're just like, wait a minute. This is the most human business because some of the F up behind the scenes and the infighting, and the lack of responsibility and accountability. And it came fourth in this article for multiple people in the massage. You know story. I even he put the writer Tyler done casts doubt about that. But I think he made a good point putting out the point was that the team that large sections of the team that believe that whether whether it was true or not whether the happened one time that he was getting the massage the fact that large sections of the team believe that I don't know. I'm still I guess I'm Aaron Rodgers fan alternately. And yes, this is disappointing. But I do just wish there was like another world where he had a strong offense of coach in mind that he respected that he played with previously in that. Matt leflore is that guy 'cause we'll have to see if metaphors that guy. Packers fans have had it really easy. I've always killed him for that that you've gone from farm to Rogers. It's been one thing. But if you read this I feel for Packers fans because it really feels like two or three Super Bowl rings were lost in the mix here. And it's kind of like when Aaron Rodgers is telling Greg Jennings after speaking Carlos Rogers about you know, this is probably my contract year in Aaron Rodgers simply saying. Go get out of here. You're not coming back. And like you're done with him when you're done with him, you're done. That's there's a good side to that. Maybe. But there's definitely a negative when he's your team leader in the sun that everyone orbits around. Final thought spinning forward is. I just wonder based on what you read in that article and the general feeling around Aaron Rodgers circa two thousand nineteen he says he wants to be challenged. He says he needs somebody or that. That's how he would work best. How this team would work best. I'm not convinced. He actually does want to be challenged. I somebody I get the feeling Aaron Rodgers might just be a guy says this is my world. This is my team. And he's going to have a hard time. Respecting anyone? It sounds like some coaches over the floor. That's the thing though. It sounds some coaches over the years have I really believe that he would because I because I think he wants to be great. But that he would need a great coach. And just like your run of the mill average NFL coach. That's maybe that's not going to be enough to be able to deal with them. They're just right. Well, I would imagine someone brief Tim aims to be plugged in. I think he might have read it ten times by now. I think it's safe to say that done family off like his crew. Card distribution lists not getting a lot of like one on one time with Rogers. We finally trust my Green Bay Dr that was buzzing for large sections of last season in the season previously. You never really what what what what had nothing to do with this that they were primetime a lot. About the whole Green Bay Packers experienced, obviously, are you saying into this into my radar. Well, let's spin. And when I read this I thought, oh, yeah. This is when they had it to your like prop bets you almost get right? But then since you're in the same area you say. Aaron Rodgers minions gay. Yeah. He did it. He did it give it to Aaron Rodgers. It's like he's the guy that you send out a billion gifts that week about how he's so technically brilliant and beautiful and look at this pass through behind his back and completed for fifteen yards. But there is an argument we vote talked about it in and out the podcast. There's always been some little bit of a chip missing or something that makes a little bit of a different experience. Sure this clarified. Well, artificial accurate, which we know. But he is regarded almost like you cast off as an aside as the most physically gifted quarterback to ever play football and he's miserable. But and that makes them kind of fascinating to be honest. That's like that's like the billionaire. We'll make him happy. You know, it kind of made me think Dan Marino because I think a lot Dan Marie there weren't as many, blah, the weren't blogs. Or there wasn't Twitter. Anything this weren't blocks. Right. This was a very similar narrative. Around Dan Marino. And a lot of ways different in some ways. Obviously with the coaches and everything but in terms of the talent and and the relationship he had with his teammates and freezing them out. And never kind of like, you know, fulfilling his destiny reminded me by his lineman, Isotoner gloves and another head coach stick around too long during his prime years. All right in other news. I'm really excited about these you forms from the perspective this organization. It's right theme of this team is take flight. We're ready to deter new era. Hashtag take flight baby. Is that like a cult leader who? That was David mctavish of the church of Scientology. No. That was Christopher Johnson. The acting owner of jets who unveiled their new uniforms misgivings, something like that Thursday in Manhattan, and as you guys would expect a lot of people on Twitter Zeus, or what do you think? What do you like him? I think they're okay. I think the certainly by thoughts on uniform reveals in general, it goes like this two components involved for me is that in the last five six years, the teams and social media seized on and successfully seized on this idea that fans love this. So you're going to build it up for months, and months and months and the downside of that is when it gets revealed after all the build up. It's almost always a little bit of that. That's all it is. So I think you have that that works with all teams when they do this. And then you have what I call the jets tax, which is ten everyone else gets. Have fun with this. And as rounds fan, you know, this to Mark, but I don't get on with this. But everybody else does. And I don't hate on it. It just always better to just kill the jets and make fun of the jets, and that's always going to happen. So that's why I think there was some criticism of the jerseys. I think they're okay. I like the green helmet. I like that. They modified the logo up top. I'm not huge on the New York across the chest. But that's another thing that happened about twenty years ago. A bunch of marketers gotten the ears of these sports teams the giants did the same thing when they went back to the NY logo. You gotta gotta you. Gotta get New York in the mix you got a market around New York. So I think that's why they did that the black alternate jerseys. All right, whatever that's just it is what it is. My favorites. I would give I'd give the uniform like a b minus a be it's not a disaster, not a home run curious guy. So I would say like not being a disaster is a win because as a Browns fan you lived in a uniform scenario that was a disaster for. Half decade. And one thing. I there is the whole hoopla surrounding the uniform reveal is tedious. I like the young team. I liked the something about Jamal Adams and Sam darnold out there together. And they were on good morning football today. Say one thing the uniforms looked a lot better on good morning. I don't know if it was the lighting on the set might thing with uniforms as always I don't care how they look on a stage. I wanna see what they look like on the field because they typically will look very different. I'm a big fan of Matt finish helmets over super, shiny. So I want to warm up to that. But I don't think disaster on any level. They're totally fine for the most part. But it was not a disaster. It could have been so much worse. The Browns uniforms last year by midseason when when they were playing well, and there was some hope the uniforms. It's a psychological thing to start it to look good mix. It's they started to look good. So don't worry about it. Well, yeah. And evidently, they're kind of you know, the design is using a new design trends, and generally people. Outside rough rider. You mean saying older people like us are going to push against it Gotham green the spotlight white. It's just white and stealth black. Those are Nike told the those are new colors. I love the black the helmet. And I like the lot of people were saying the same joke out there that it was kind of like the two lane green jets. So it's like if you're looking like the green wave out there, and it does look pretty much, exactly. Like, the one of the new two lane uniforms. I like it. And they that's fine. I don't. Yeah. That doesn't have bad thing. And then it was like, oh this Kotite jets. Well, you could pick any era outside nineteen sixty nine and say, oh, it's a bad error for their uniforms. They need to start something new. And that's that's trying to do. It's the whole the reboot thing. The the idea of the bold new look will be a bold new direction, which the buccaneers once upon a time actually pulled off back in the late nineties where they were terrible for twenty five years got new uniforms immediately became content because they changed with our shows. Well, the Br. Puncos had their Reverend when they moved to their more current ones. They went to two Super Bowls with Elway right away. There is some type of connection there and jets will be playing in February next year. That's what I take out of it might take also as you know, they make a big deal out of it. Because I do remember when I was more in that boss mode. The metrics I mean, people, you know, we could write like seventeen are great long forms for the rest of the year. They're not gonna combine to equal the amount of traffic. It was your uniform for like two just like the biggest articles year uniforms. It was a bigger deal when I was younger too. When Parcells took over and the first thing he did took over ninety seven starting in the ninety eight year, he said we want to call back to the name of era. And that's when they did the reboot the they called it. I remember back to the future. I think was there angled that time now now it's twenty years later, and I get it. It's time to kind of fresh things up. So we'll see what happens. Jackie. Harrison emergency take my money, and if shop going to get some Darnell joint about the people that bought a darnold jersey last year, though in her stuck with the it's probably, but it's not great though. It's a tough situation. I agree. Feel should have known. It was for them. Yeah. I feel like the back to the uniform things. But with the Browns I feel like they should just really embrace and just go back to the eighties. Look is that the thing. That's I believe from all hints out there, and this is gone back two years that they realize there they got a little too fluffy and a little too crazy that the overwhelming cry to make this change is. And they talked about it. It's nothing fancy essentially as the tags because they are the Cleveland Browns their whole thing is that they're just simple. Like, this is our franchise were that Brown's going back to that in their keeping the Brown. Uniforms that they leaned on heavy the right? Yes. Those ones the elf going to be phased out. I think the Elvis going to be which is the Elvis essentially been phased out for a long time outside of some end. Zone paint. And you know. Freddie kitchens baseball hats, like I think he's going to be a big part of it it or he he he probably a thing mystical creature. Woodland creature. Fairytale let's move on Kirk cousins. This is interesting. So he is set to address. Michigan state is all mater ahead of their final four AA basketball matchup against big. Texas tech. I believe Texas Tech red raiders. And I wanna point out am I totally comfortable if a Michigan state fan with Kirk cousins being the guy guys take this thing home. I don't know if I'm comfortable with it throwing that out there. Higher or lower grade than the jets uniforms. Kirk cousins, speaking in state, it's pretty random against the new jets uniforms. I if you're giving great Kirk cousins being selected to address Michigan state for me as a C minus people. I was checking around there's divergent opinions on Kirk cousins pre-games speeches because they have a lot of energy. He he's kind of the guy who does it for the Vikings. But sometimes they're a little weird. Remember the one last year where he was like, you know, they put us in prime time. That's because they want to see like he was very excited that they like lex them in or something we deserve to be flexed. So specific you're not watching any of the March madness, Greg I have not I did see games. I did see like the very end of the the Duke game while while in our hotel room in Phoenix. I remember the worst time of the year. I'm not. You know, it's been not hating to be like, my quite road used to be my favorite thing. But you know, when you get older sometimes in life, you just. You're like what connection? Do I have to any of this? I'll take my time to something else. What do you do? Instead of watching basketball spend time with the family. Read Ovalles did tennis. I watch a lot of tennis a lot of tennis. Well, I actually was at a Elsa. Goon dough taverna tavern. It's kind of more a bar and grill with an outdoor component to it. And it was watching the Auburn Kentucky game. And a listener of the around the NFL podcasts happened to be sitting right there. And he said Hello and said he was a big fan of show rock and roll themed place that has an outdoor sexually. I believe the it is owned by gene, Simmons and place. I mean there was there was data's there. Every Saturday from twelve till three if you are interested in seeing him again this time in my life, where the Yukon huskies where like my number one sport steam, I remember next girlfriend getting mad that like I cancelled on a plan with her because I wanted to watch big Monday, you big Yukon Villanova game back in the Ray Allen. I think Kerry Kittles recovered at the relationship find it's I mean after that now, I mean, it it failed for many reasons including that I think it was like a red flag that. Would've rather, you know, watch big Monday at that point. Ouch. Finally in the news, Patrick Mahomes. Guys got a cannon. He so gifted the chiefs quarterback. Well, you not another guy's got a cannon. Mark you boys. You're team the bills they got this young kid, Josh Allen. He could heave it. Anyway, speaking not always to the right person. But from western New York, he was honored at a charity event for athletes in full, philanthropic achievements. Nailed it Mahomes acknowledged offseason Twitter challenge from Josh Allen to see who could toss the biggest bomb. Josh is a great, dude. But no one that I've known has been able to throw a ball farther than me Mahomes said via the tabby a- daily news. I've never seen Josh throw in person. But maybe next off season. We can set something up to see who throw the pits gang further. I would be careful about this. Yeah. Why not why next off season dodging Sahni of time left to get that done debut, logistically, Mahomes as type of guy that thinks big picture above the treetops as they say in the corporate offices here, and he wants to make sure he's got an arena, he can get the promotion out there. They could move tickets merch all those still feels like you've got a solid four months threat. You're it's one of those things where it's like, oh, yeah. We should go out to dinner sometime and you're like well wait year. You're here. You're in town for a month right now, the cushite remake. Oh, yeah. We should do sometime. We'll be in touch and then two years later who see each other again. All right. That's what's happening in the news. Let's get to the mail bag. Because again, another tease we have. Unfortunately, some issues we have to work out with the shield in and some behind the scenes problem came up once then at so we're gonna get to that. But let's I hit the mailbag our great listeners of the around the NFL podcast who we love sent in a bunch of questions. So I'm going to go through some of them right now starting with. Neil. Underscore g see which team. Do you? Think has the best roster pre-draft going into the season. Who's got the best roster right now if you had Vic. Chiefs. No, not on Rams cults. The deaf one. It's a tough one. I think I'd go eagles. I've been kind of banging that drum chiefs would be close chiefs. I know it's like not really that great of a defensive roster Patrick Mahomes. And just the talent on offense is enough for me are boy Neel Dutt Matic though, asks what other team uniforms, would you and the heroes changed other than the Browns, pending in the bucks blatantly. Oh, that's that is easy for me the uniform, and it is no diss on a division rival the Cincinnati Bengals uniform to me is an as been an eyesore for thousand years. I would go the patriots. I'm not I haven't been a fan. I guess it'd be though you have too much glory with these uniforms to go back to Pat patriot. I think they'll they'll switch it. Yeah. Once Brady retire. Sped kind of doesn't make sense. And so then what about you? I don't a lot of. One of the first players I liked and it was pre- jets was boomer size. And and I and I really loved that Bengals team in the late eighties. And I always I actually liked the stripes the Jaguars. They're fixing their helmets too. I believe I think they've already done it. So they got rid of they did tone Morris season plus into that. Yes. I think all right. I said I I don't care as much about like when I was a teenager at meant a lot to me. It doesn't get me hung up. The rams. They don't do. They still have the mismatched helmet with the journal. To the blue tone. That's a little off enough into that. Yeah. I think they gotta fix that. All right here, we go Joey excuse me. Just got oh rights. Have you ever skipped work for a massage or plan to in the future? This one's Erica. I have. Yeah. I love getting just it's nice. I've only gotten one massage, and there was on my honeymoon same thing. That's so funny. I was just like, well, I guess if you're gonna do it now, and I enjoyed it. But that was the only time like, you know, really came up I had one ever. And it was with my wife where you have like a stew students or learning how to do it. And so it's a cut rate like ten dollar massage was fine. But I don't need to like, that's it's a funny thing to think about Simone, just like, hey, Mark. I've got a group on two for one massages ten bucks at the old thing Charlie's walking by school or something. It's a bit of a roll the dice how much damage can they do? But it's kind of like when well it's not like did you get? The first job. I've learned the trade in theory, and they're just about to become set apart as their weird with massages, though, they don't like, you know, I I tried to bring my brother Duma Sasha place. And he was like he was like I don't want like another dude like rubbing my back. And I was like, okay. Then I would get woman. He probably has some problem with you know, what woman myself, in fact, I did for my honeymoon massage. There was a big burly woman. Germany, well, they need to be using those elbows and getting in the city. Really good for your health to your in your muscles. I I try to get one. I think it seems like it's not so much. I I love the actual act of massage, but just like pain, it just paying money for that level of like, it seems so indulgent not that I don't indulge in other things. But it just seems wild indulgent. What do you pay money for food is spend way too on food this from our old friend TM our troopers to replace the around the af podcast? Can you do a Greg likes rap spinoff instead I'll? This is the wrap that were playing the rapidy wrap here. I don't think it'd be a panelist on this show. I mean, I would break it out open more than just wrap. Yeah. You do have a a larger pal. Yeah. We were just texted about the great new Jenny Lewis. Apple. Breaks club. Let's go down the line on the line on the line. This is this is like the music from white men can't jump during the two games. I'm Josh McKinney will the heroes becoming to Nashville for the draft if so we wanted to, but it was one of those things they actually the shadow league figures have done a good job recently sending us to event so can't complain. But for whatever reason, and we haven't done it for a few years the draft. We kinda circle Nashville is something we wanted to go to potentially. But it just didn't take off also west has we have a bachelor party event for Wes. And then like weeks later the wedding. And so two I don't know if west has done in fact right now for a wedding related event back and is Abby. Tilting. Yeah, she has on lock and Wes. And this thing about west three years ago. Would you ever imagine west just being led around like free? Soundbites soundbites, where he would be like, I'm not going anyway, I wanna get married my backyard. No, he was what the paramour. This all seemed soon as the actual person. You're getting married to get involved the rules change, very quickly prog power asks you guys have learned by now not to write off the patriots before the season starts east champs nine times in a row should tell you not to run with the quote changing of the guard narrative yet you can't seem to help yourself to run with it that is certainly fair. And yeah, there's a very good chance of patriots. Go twelve and four in win their division by three games. I am not ruling that out. But it is absolutely. Also fair in two thousand nineteen with what's going on around that organization to wonder if we are coming near the end. That's okay, too. I do for living. Well, it's funny because the the bar is so high now after eight straight buys or is it nine so in nine street AFC champion or eight street. It's like. If they went ten and six or eleven and five, and we're the we're the five seed, but some NFC, you know, some other AFC it's like that would be seen as somehow like the run is over. But the bar was high after four straight buys sure, they don't seem to care. This is a good one in honor of operation pink. Ponies Connor lapel me, what is your favorite NFL or any sport conspiracy theory in the realm of sports, I have a few and I'll throw him out there in the NFL. It's a popular one. This one doesn't do much for me. But I'll throw it out for the purposes of this exercise the Superdome power out outage Super Bowl, forty seven the ravens, Terrell suggs. And I believe Ray Lewis a both in vocal that the NFL and specifically Roger Goodell cut the lights because that game turning into a blow out, and of course, column capital and the Niners launched a furious comeback as soon as the lights came back on and my memory of that was that was our second Super Bowl, Mark. Yes. Yes. You were kind enough to hand over one of your Super Bowl tickets. So Keith my dad could attend the game. He went with Simone. They sat together she's a Niners fan of the game. And I remember when the lights went down and the air conditioning cut, and we were way up in the top the number one thing that oh I brought my dad's a Super Bowl. And now ISIS is here at felt like it total terrorist attack. Glad it wasn't. But it felt like one I'm with you that I don't like the the best. Conspiracy theory stuff that I know I feel like we can't say on this show. What do you mean your big into conspiracy? We're on the it's on the opposite end of that. Generally. I'm anti all conspiracy theories. And you're pro I've not pro I'm pro one or two not all items more anti like the way it's framed sometime like my least favorite NFL related conspiracy theory is whenever the Pete Carroll like nine eleven truth or stuff comes up. And it's always framed as I'm not saying anything, I'm just asking the questions, but he likes. No, no, it's been like asking the question is saying, okay, that's not a football conspiracy. But just about the football player talking about a conspiracy to to NBA ones. I love is that in this actually came up coincidentally on Wednesday show. Michael Jordan, David Stern forced them into a one year hiatus because of his gambling issues which led to play. League baseball, Patrick Ewing. The David start again. And then be rigging the nineteen eighty five lottery with a cold envelope to give the Knicks the number one overall pick and make them relevant again, but my favorite sports spirited theory. And I've heard this for years, and it popped up and that we could talk about it. Because both of the main people connected to it. While two of the three have addressed a publicly was that in nineteen Ninety-seven Cal Ripken junior who is still. In the still had his consecutive games streak going. Maybe it was before ninety seven because I think he said it ninety five, but the theory is or the conspiracy is that they cancelled an Orioles game. Blaming a electrical lights function because cow skipped out of the clubhouse because he found out the Kevin Costner had been an intimate relations with cows wife or he'd caught them in bed together. And he wasn't going to the game. He wasn't gonna play that is one of the Orioles. They're canceled the game. I I believe that until the Koster part of it. Then see the guy that Calcott with his wife and both sides cow and Costner refuted this. But a love it. The electrical part I could buy into that. They would cancel it for some reason for cow. Well, I I lived in that area back then and went to Orioles plenty of remembering that well. I didn't hear that then. But during that run, I could imagine them cutting the lights because it was the biggest thing going at all in that in that that city was like enamored. I remember that is one of the sports moments. You remember where you were I was in the bag shop at the hamden country club watching washing people's golf clubs. Okay. With the. TV on in the background. All right. There you go. That's the mailbag Ricky before we get to our last matter of business regarding the shield we haven't ducked into your DM situation while what's going on over there. Let's check it out. Right. Such a good one. I got one from trick. His name is trick to one three. That says, listen, you're cute. There's no getting around it. So I don't know if you like country music, but I was thinking maybe one of these days we could drive out to a field. Crank up some tunes smoke. A few McKenna dues. I don't even know. Those mocking Nudo. So maybe even toss a disc around, and then it's like pig Latin. I think way day eight Inc. Think way. What do you say? What's a M P A Y? Either way it's a strange combination of things, I think cigar smoking. Is that a reference marijuana smoking is type of cigar? Isn't it? That's even stranger. Nobody likes the classy. And then throw a disc around. I mean, what are we what is this dazed and confused sounds like a major stone or to me, you might actually be? Harmless. But I wouldn't just in case. I would not be failed of not maybe not maybe. No. Yeah. I mean, there's a pretty decent chance. You would end up as part of the mulch in the field you go. I'm looking in this guy cycle compost. So I don't doesn't have a killer vibe, really. Yeah. They are. I according according to their website, they are conic premium cigars signs move, though. Strange move. All right. Good trip in the DM's. The listeners they have a fall hard for the producer and just part of life. What can I say? Well, that's something you're used to. I'm sure all right before we go. All right. So here's the bad news about the shield. Yes. We won some sore bodies, some muscles and erica's swinger prosthetic leg out of the car, and that's hard to do for right now. But. We won the bad news is that our catcher are part time catcher, she kinda platoons with the paramour in fact behind the plate. Her name is brassy. I think she's maybe been on the show on. So he's talked about her a few times. She was not at the game in fact for a nine PM game. She she overslept, and and internally it was not something we were happy about we had enough girl. So we were lucky that it did not come back to haunt us because in coed softball the battle to have enough girls is one of the biggest challenges you face all season. So we were able to survive, but it doesn't make it any less irresponsible and frankly disrespectful to the team Ricky as a new girl. I know you don't as a rookie. You don't get to say as much you kind of just have to earn your stripes. But I'm sure you look at this. This woman brassy is has two titles. And this is how she opens up. Up our comeback season. Yeah. Studying right loss. Also not stunning. So there's been a track record here of red flags incidents over the years. It's fair some field problem so Wednesday show. I told you that the shield was in negotiations to bring Mark Cecil back aboard in front office role a hand he handles discipline. He's done in the past. And Mark is kind enough to agree to the step in handle this matter involving brassy because you got to cut this cancer out. It's not a good start the season. So Mark, would you be okay? If we got Brassey on the phone, and you could let her know what her punishment is. Yes. Because it's simply team business. Okay. Let's get her on the line. Hey, Ryan, can I speak with shown place? He actually just left. She's not around when you need her. That's that's par for the course. All right. We'll try. We'll try another number. Thank you. Okay. Okay. Let's try herself. Brassey what's up skip here? I'm going to pass you over to Marc sesser. He is the shields human human resources coordinator. By this is a serious issue. And I appreciate you to treat it as that. This should be addressed myself, Mr. Cecil, hold on number one the tone off the bat is concerning. There was an incident that I've learned about this morning at the inaugural kickoff game for the shield two-time defending champions game kicks off at nine o'clock. I to just I want to present you with the information that I have that you texted a member of our team, Brooke essentially, saying OMG, I just woke up the game. By the way, I pitch at nine pm. I'm going to be banned from the shield, and she writes back and says five girls at this point, you should be okay. And at that stage. She telling you just hurry that you're gonna get here you text back. Many many minutes later and bat an hour later saying I fell back asleep. In your own words. Trainwreck? Did you all have enough girls? I feel so bad. Brassey hold on your you will have a moment to speak not out the heritage house out of this. I want to tell you number one. What is present your case very quickly, and I suggest to make it very quick I retired. And I just must've turn my alarm off. I mean, I had my clothes on bag ready. I didn't wake up the thing that bothers all of us is that you are a two-time member of this team. You've been part of two championship efforts. You had a disastrous Cinco Demayo episode in the first season with the team where you showed up I would just say three sheets to it to the wind would be generous. That fact that you are a veteran on this team leader, we have younger people are producer erica's on the team for the first time that she has to deal with this from veterans that the younger players have to suddenly become leaders because our leaders are asleep in their beds and falling asleep twice after the first pitch. Brassey present your case very quickly. You have one last chance we have we have something else to tell you. I apologize. I was leap at the wheel. I immediately knew when I woke up I was going to hear it. So I've been bracing myself for punishment as I know what's coming. We do not need on this team. Some sort of low level ladder stage. Darrell strawberry type figure you are suspended for two games. And I can throw it over to the manager at this point, Dan hands. It's there is a possibility to appeal that down to one, but I see nothing based on your reactions or your actions that we need to take this down to one game. Dan. I don't feel comfortable having any further conversation on this. I know our HR representatives here, but brassy. You know, I love you. But I think also this punishment is fair work on your sleep schedule. Please. Can we make those two games on vacation? No, their affective media, Lisa's, not at your terms goodbye. Have a good weekend. It had to be done. And I don't like doing that. We just suspended ille- couple years ago, and that was an easy and this wasn't easy ther. And hopefully, she'll learn from this and grow, Greg. The Bronx zoo is in town right now. I mean, I'm a little more worried about kind of like the underlying off the field issues that are contributing to this. I'm worried about her as a person more important than what's going on on the field. Very true. All right. We'll be back. We'll be back next week to shows next week Monday Thursday, we'll do a Wednesday Twitter show, of course, two shows the following week Monday Thursday Twitter show as well. And then draft we kids and we'll be back three shows including Thursday night right after the draft do and the show and then Saturday night after round seven so check all that stuff out. Follow us on Twitter, of course. But also leave comments and reviews and stars in itunes. Also, the around the NFL sub read at which is growing and growing and growing. Love you guys we love you have a great weekend. This is Dan hands signing off for quiet storm, the all boss tonoki Hollywood behind the glass done. Mark had to had to be done. Monday. You did not get enough credit for your Badar comment. Like that was good will. On my my green radar are greet like bay radar. Green bay. Both of you guys are like. I got him buddy. It's okay.

Aaron Rodgers NFL Mike McCarthy jets Green Bay Packers Aaron Rogers football Erica tampo Twitter Ted Thompson Roger Goodell Tom Brady Tyler Mark Greg Cleveland Browns Mark Cecil New York Ryan grant
Packers Drafting Jordan Love

The Business of Sports With Andrew Brandt

15:07 min | 3 months ago

Packers Drafting Jordan Love

"Hither boys and girls time for emergency broadcasts about the bay packers. Picking Jordan love to talk about that as always presented by Bev Online. Online's works book experts. Use the Promo Code podcast. One get your free sign of that online are let's talk about it I'm getting bombarded. It's now Friday. After the Thursday night thick twenty six the packers selecting Jordan love and yes flashbacks to where I was fifteen years ago it was to the day that the packers selected Aaron Rodgers so to the day. Fifteen years ago. The packers use a first round pick on a quarterback while having a future hall of Famer Franchise quarterback playing it a superior level on the roster at age thirty five. The parallels are Erie The simulator Larry's air there couple different points to the packers traded up this year that in trade up Rogers. Of course. Let's talk about it. I flashback so I've told the story many times I'll give it a brief version so we can compare and contrast in two thousand five that fateful night of April twenty third. I'm sorry it was a day. Then they didn't do Then and they had fifteen minutes per pick Two things happened number one we had. I believe eighteen players rated in the first round seventeen of went like wildfire in other words. Everyone we wanted that we had raided a first round grade gone. We wanted demarcus ware. Bad gone cowboys. We Wanna Marcus Spears. Bad gone cowboys. We WanNa Derrick Johnson linebacker bad gone chiefs and it was clear that everyone was being taken that had a first round grade from our board except one player in that leads to the second thing that happened that night after Alex Smith went first to the forty niners. No-one was taking Aaron and even teams that told him. If you're there we'll take you weren't taken such as Jon. Gruden with Tampa told him. They took Cadillac Williams. He mentioned other teams that told him that directly and of course when other ways so here we are in. I remember being in the middle of that room to the Ra- my right. Where the coaches they were getting crazy. They were seeing what was going to happen. And they were Kinda. Yanking me saying we can't do this. We can't use your precious first round asset on a player. That will not help us this year. Maybe NOT NEXT YEAR. Maybe never with bread who never missed a game and they were not happy that it looked like it was going this way on the other side of me was management. Saying what do we always say? Trust the board and the board was telling us the only player we should take is rogers because he's the only player of the first grade and we're not going to dip into our second round grades to take a player when somebody's up there in the first round so this was happening and then of course we got Aaron on the phone I did. I thought I was getting Mike. His agent but Aaron answer the phone and then I had to talk to Mike and poor and sitting there with the cameras on them. All caterers packed up everything all alone for five hours and we had to make them wait even longer while we waited for the phone to ring. Dec- If someone would offer something that we couldn't refuse and we would have traded Aaron Rodgers in the. Nfl would look a lot different however no one called the crickets and we took him in immediately. There were problems called the coach. Mike Sherman breads aiden called me Lambofield party below US. Probably a thousand people resounding boos everyone aided Fans media we got all the DS and fs on the grade from the media and and it was like okay. This is where we are and then for the next three years the question I got all the time was when when are we making the transition from to Erin? Brett was not happy. Obviously managing that for three years from breads camp having to worry about you know hearing Andrew. It's no fun coming into work everyday sitting with replacement I got it. I understood and from errands camp. When is HE GONNA play? You know when he ever GonNa play and I got it. You know there are no easy answers but what we had done then we had hoped was secure. The future and that is not a good decision for people looking at short term gain because short gain as I said you're using a first round pick on someone that's not GonNa help you in the short term. Okay so fast forward fifteen years. Brian Goudie General Manager using the same phraseology. That Ted Thompson his mentor us. Fifteen years ago best player available on the board and not only did they take him. They were at thirty two to twenty six so two picks after we took Aaron. The difference of course is they moved up. They didn't wait around to see if drake would come in and they had buy in from the coaching staff. We watched last night. Matt Leflore was all smiles. Brian Gouda Joe Manner has said Yeah. He's all excited about Jordan love. They clearly desired Jordan. Love In a much more aggressive way than we desired Aaron Rodgers. But okay. Here's looking at it from their side. Which I was on for ten years. The most important position is quarterback The packers front off his fan base etc have been the most Football the last thirty years because they essentially have a hat franchise quarterback leading the team for three decades. No one has no one. Sure the coal twin for manning to lock but that has ended and that doesn't happen in football so the packers are saying. Oh my God maybe we can strike lightning again that no one ever does and secure the future with another franchise quarterback and the packers not having a non franchise quarterback on the roster for forty five years. Maybe we'll see that's a big ask of course but they have something in love. They clearly desired loved. If you will pardon the Pun so here we are now. Have they talked to Erin as of this morning Friday morning? They haven't but I'm sure they will. I'm sure Aaron we'll get it not ideal form but he's been through it on the other side as we've just talked about. Of course he has any knows they have to secure the future. The question is obviously when I have been on record on this on shows on twitter on my writing on my podcast saying after Aaron Rodgers. No one no. I quarterback will ever sit for three years. So everyone's asking me okay. Stand behind that and I suppose I am. Yes I am saying. Three years is too long. It's not going to happen again but I am not saying what usually happens with first round quarterback will happen here. Which is Sam Darnold? Josh Rosen Lamar Jackson Baker Mayfield name. Daniel Jones Dwayne Haskins. They're playing by the first year. It won't be this year. I think it won't be next year. So the question is to me is Jordan. Logan be the quarterback or Aaron Rodgers in twenty twenty two. So that's really the question we're going to be asking the next couple of years. I don't see any reason why this question's GonNa be asked is he going to be starting Twenty twenty or is he started? Cornerback twenty twenty one. But there's another angle to this. That is not getting as much attention. Obviously because Brett farve never ever ever missed a snap. That's what made the Rogers pick even more surprising here. Aaron is not at all. Don't get me wrong. Not Injury prone whatsoever but has had injuries. So if you know I've heard people say well the second most important position on the team is backup quarterback. I don't believe that to be the case but for that crowd. Hey what a great pick. And the packers have sort of muddled through the Brett Hundley as of the world and other Seneca Wallace and others through recent Times Matt Flynn With errands injuries. But Hey you know now we got one you know. Now we are where we were with Brenten Aaron. We have a legitimate future starter. Backup you know. Back in the day with the packers. We would always take quarterbacks in the draft. People always reference the packers taking quarterbacks in the draft and Aaron Brooks and Mark Brunell and Matt Hasselbeck my client but they were drafted to be traded. Because we knew I mean of course and if the packers took a low around quarterback in the past couple of years or the even this year you'd say okay drafted to be trade but not when you take someone at one. Obviously they're drafted to play Jordan. Love is drafted to be the next quarterback the Green Bay packers. The question is win win. We don't know it's the same question I got virtually every week for three years. Now the packers will get that every week for one year for two years and if it goes three years when but this is going to happen and back in the day. The question was always okay. Packers aren't really going to Rogers right. They're going to carry collins. Jeff Garcia Chris Chandler some stopgap when your quarterback tyrod Taylor now like Ryan Fitzpatrick now like a Josh mccown now. No we've never going to do that. We're never going to do that. We were going to take Aaron Azar next quarterback and now. I don't think you'll get the questions. Were Different Age. We're not going to questions about a stopgap veteran and they're gonNA go there go with love. The question is when so listen. The parallels are there. People are going to be upset. The packers game away from the Super Bowl didn't quote. Go for another player but listen. There's a lot of draft left. They were saying wide. Receiver will listen. That's not the Mo of the packers although we took Javon Walker back in like a one or two eighteen nineteen years ago. But it's second round. That's the that's the pattern with the packers for receivers davante Adams Randall. Cobb Jordy Nelson Greg. Jennings that's where they go and they'll get one. I think as I sit here today on Friday. They'll get one tonight and they're plenty left will see Get help for Aaron in the Second Third Fourth Fisk seventh-round help doesn't have to be the first round so I'm not shocked at some about the packers pick. I know some are upset. My own boys are upset. But you sit back. You'd take it in you. Think about fifteen years ago. Of course it worked out and it will it work out as well Jordan love. God I hope so. Everyone hopes Soza Pack. Who's related the packers? The question is winning. And we'll just see how this works. Aaron will get over it. He's been there on the other side. The question of course is win and then of course first of all contracts we saw if anyone in the world knows how contracts work in the NFL. It's me they can get out of the contract in a couple years. That's not an issue if they have to move there and again. I don't even like saying it's premature to talk about moving Aaron Rodgers from the packers but their hope is they have secured the future like we did fifteen years ago. We'll see how it works out. We'll see okay That's my thought again the differences you have the coaching staff buying in on this one. Not Listen let's get over any thought of. Hey they don't like Aaron Rodgers of course in my view and I think in their view the best quarterback in the league. I know okay here. Come the the MAHOMES PEOPLE I get but one year I wanNA rodgers so I'm obviously biased. And the question is will that continue? Will his play dropped off. What happens? But there's no more ifs about who's the future and that's a great feeling to have of course if you're right now they think they're right on Jordan love. I'm not a scout. I'm not going there. That's not my lane. I don't know Jordan loves the guy didn't know Rogers was the guy in here. We are so packers fans relax our L. A. X. We'll see what happens you know. Aaron is you know him California cool. He won't get up in arms about this and we'll deal with it but the good news is the packers in their view have secured the future of the bad news. They don't have immediate help at the first round. The good news is they'll get that in the rest of the rounds for Erin for the defense for the rest of the team. They're not gonNA take another quarterback is going to be. Rg three in kirk cousins in the same draft. Okay that's not happening here okay. So we'll see that's my emergency podcast on the packers pick of Jordan. Love quickly on moving up. I I just think from thirty to twenty six. They saw something with Seattle. Seattle was the next pick. Seattle only has one quarterback on the roster. His name is Russel Wilson. They were obviously getting Intel maybe directly from John Schneider who knows who's obviously fixture the packers for so long from Green Bay Wisconsin. They got Intel that the we're GONNA TAKE HIM. That has to be the reason so they jumped up ahead of Seattle and took them and again they give before round. Pick not not Too much draft capital to go four picks in the first round. I get it so there. We are joined that emergency podcast about Aaron Rodgers Jordan. Love Carlos fifteen years. Later to the day deja Vu. Flashback all those things going Ramon. That'll do it for the mercy. Podcast okay I'll be back next week with another addition businesses sports signing out on day two of the draft looking back on day one and we just don't know okay.

Green Bay packers Aaron Rodgers Brenten Aaron Jordan Rogers bay packers Erin Aaron Azar Mike Sherman demarcus ware Marcus Spears Aaron Brooks Nfl Seattle Cadillac Williams Derrick Johnson Brett farve Ted Thompson Larry Bev Online
McCarthy's the new sheriff in town

The Doomsday Podcast

41:00 min | 7 months ago

McCarthy's the new sheriff in town

"It is Matt Moseley alongside. Edward R actually is at the star as we speak. He is in shadows of The star out there with all the breaking news that has happened it was the first to To basically have it for. ESPN that Jason Garrett was out they finally made it official yesterday afternoon and then Ed The word goes out this morning. That Mike McCarthy is the head coach of the cowboys Ed from a timing standpoint. First first of all they had while Jason was not quite officially out although obviously they'd given every indication that they were moving on because they already interviewing people. Marvin Lewis was was in the mix and then Mike McCarthy the cowboys go ahead and get that thing done and then we hear more that that Mike McCarthy the state over at the Jones home and then so I guess Sunday Head breakfast over there gene probably did some put some good things together. Ed Any surprise from you how quickly this thing unfolded and With with Mike McCarthy well you know it's it's interesting to me that it took them a full week to officially announce the Jason Garrett would not return to the cowboys coach and it took a less than a day to officially replace him with with Mike. McCarthy and obviously McCarthy has contributed greatly to Jason Garrett's demise here because he twice life ended recent cowboys seasons in the playoffs by beating them. Even though you could argue he had the inferior team with the packers but You know I I think one surprise to to the fan base will be How precise in terms they were in targeting who they were we're interested in You know they created the illusion that many believe it they were going to pursue some of these high profile. Expensive College coaches given that you know that sort of where the NFL game is going now. It's more being influenced by college football and is the NFL influencing the way games played at the college level. And so I think there's a little bit of a surprise but you don't if you if you have a team full of veterans that you think are ready to win and have just been poorly coach in motivated and therefore underachieve then making a move in this direction with a proven. NFL head coach. I think makes a lot of sense. You know this is. He's GonNa be the head coach in cowboys history. He's held up the lombardi trophy in the very stadium. That Jerry Jones built although history suggests that's a negative because six. NFL coaches have had to franchise in Super Bowl was but nobody in NFL. History is won the super bowl two different teams as Shirley Jones family expects McCarthy to do but You know just talking to people here. I think they felt like I asked somebody we would do. You have to get out of this next head coach that was lacking under Garrett and and the list provided me by sources was three things fear accountability and discipline. Now Mike McCarthy had all of those things things early in his career when he was waiting with the packers those sort of things disappeared in his final two or three seasons leading him. Being fired during the Stephen Edward or has been at some of these super bowls is in embedded with some of these teams in. So obviously. You've come across Mike McCarthy over your years. Here's Mike McCarthy kind of interestingly Ed hold up with the NFL network recently and then also with our friend. Peter King and talked of you know kind of some things he you did While the his one season out of football to stay prepared and to be even better prepared for his next Opportunity Hey he had a head coaching Interview I believe with the jets had smother interests that he decided not to pursue and then he sort of had a club that he was there in Green Bay that he put together and tried. Domos keep a staff together while he was out from that report and he said he would put an analytics group together. From what you've been able to gather. What do you feel like Mike? McCarthy felt like he needed to change or what has changed about his approach that we might find the little different from his long and successful run with the Green Bay packers. Yeah he did in his season away from football After being fired by the packers and not being hired by the jets job he lost Adam. Gays he did get together and higher. Essentially a six. This person coaching staff that met regularly with him in Green Bay and the attempt was to sort of modernize his offensive and defensive philosophies to prepare game plans and play books and you know sort of coaching guide as to what they were going to I do when they got another opportunity. You know emotional and family familial standpoint you said. His family really needed football again that that was something that was the centerpiece of their existence distances. A family and it was something that they desperately needed to get back to. And it'll be. This is going to be interesting because you know it's going to represent a change in offensive philosophy. beat the cowboys in that. You know he's going to bring in the west coast offense of concepts While the cowboys had adopted some of that in their playbook this his last year with Kelly Moore calling the plays. The terminology is going to be significantly different. But I I did talk to Brett. Farve About this this marriage between the cowboys and Dak Prescott and like McCarthy who you know he played for for much of his career and he thought it was an ideal situation. Nation that McCarthy would would create a great platform and his offense per DAK Prescott To have success that he would be brash brash he would be creative he would be confident he would be believable. You know all of those important qualities in inheriting pretty experienced football team at least on the offensive subsiding fall. I think they'll be even bigger changes on the defensive side under Mike Nolan that we can get into later But this is a guy who comes with a lot of credibility but I think the biggest question would be you know. Why did Mike McCarthy for thirteen years in Green Bay Brett farve and Aaron Rodgers as quarterbacks and only win one super the one that he wanted North Texas Super Bowl forty five And I think if you look at the end of his career last three years you know. He was not terribly successful than and there was a lot of criticism that is offensive approach to this play calling lacked imagination and creativity and that he basically went to three wide receiver sets with a single back And then let air rogers just beer and Rogers in an attempt to win the game. Now I covered a lot of packer games. I like Mike Mike McCarthy he's a really engaging guys a serious guy he's a regular guy people would love him But the one thing that that I I always took away way was he didn't seem to be as committed to executing the running game on game day with his play calling as he would profess to be in talking to the media before the game You know until he obviously had a great runner an Era Jones who was greatly underutilized By Him and his coaching staff last year because this year he set packer records under Matt. Leflore the first year coach in Green Bay. Who's won the division advanced of the divisional round of the playoffs But Mike McCarthy didn't have a thousand yard rusher since Eddie Lacy Twenty fourteen so if you've committed you know your organization running the football. When you're making new Zeke Elliot? The highest paid back in football. Now I think Mike is going to have to figure out a way to make sure that the running game is a big part of what he does on a regular basis. He didn't do with that in Green Bay. You know it is I hear boy. You've had great information on on. ESPN and you've been on TV all day and In in really have enjoyed all all that but this is from a visceral standpoint. How do fans react to this This is not the most exciting name. This is a retread that said I think Kansas City has had tremendous success with what you'd call a retread head coach. Andy Reid had really grown grown stelle. He'd had great success for years with the Eagles but I think his time had truly come to an end in. And we're going to see now similar to Andy Reid's age when he you got to Kansas City. Is this coach sitting there. Fifty six years old wanted one more shot at this and now gets it and in a sense. That's what Italy did with Wade Phillips. oops he was at a similar age. Maybe a little bit older when he took over the cowboys. Job But You Know I. It's people that have done. It have been productive. Ed One thing Al bring up you know the Saints Organization as as well as anybody. What's funny is isn't it interesting? How in our minds some coaches or more exciting than others? I mean if we took his record and put it. Next to SEAN PAYTON'S IT won't be too dissimilar. In fact ill a one twenty five seventy seven and two do I think is the name that stands out in my you know as is the number stands out in my mind right now. And they both he and Sean Tab the Super Bowl but isn't it interesting. We still still think of. Sean is sort of that genius quarterback Guru kind of guy. And we don't necessarily have those same feelings toward award Mike McCarthy but but you know obviously the results in a sense but both of them had great quarterbacks Payton's been connected to drew drew brees. You know the the entire time. And as you mentioned McCarthy's had rogers in in Brett farve but we give Sean Payton more credit. People get more excited about him and I you know I. I just wonder how you react to that. Well I think that you know Jerry Jones could hire anybody football maybe even before he tire bill. Ballot check He would hire Sean Payton. I think he regards Sean Payton as the single most talented a person to ever be allowed to to leave the organization. And but yeah I mean but what you said about McCarthy and Peyton is true I mean I mean this is the third time that Jerry's hired a head coach with previous. NFL experience built ourselves eventuate. billips McCarthy is an accomplished guy. He Won Petr Board Games in eight different seasons in his thirteen years in Green Bay. He's won ten playoff games. which is the most by packers coach in franchise history and in Ohio Valley? A number only exceeded by bill belichick since McCarthy became the head coach. And if you want consistency I mean he's let a single franchise to eight consecutive consecutive playoff appearances. You know who's done that. Tom Landry Chuck Knoll. Bill Belichick Mike McCarthy. So He's a very accomplished guy I I oh I think he I think he lost his passionate interest To a certain degree you know late in Green Bay and you know maybe this year way has energized. He'll bring that Total organization that I think needs that I think they got tired of the Jason Garrett Approach Jason Garrett Message. Everything's fine don't worry about anything. I think we're GonNa win no matter what anybody else says. You know. We're not the problem the problems outside the building. Just don't listen to all that I don't think that'll be McCarthy it's obviously going to be a huge transition for him In terms of you go from this tiny smallest professional sports town in in in America in Green. The Bay Where it's it's a publicly owned franchise you know? Mark Murphy and the former general manager that he worked under Ted Thompson soon are very reclusive. They're they're not at all public. They don't speak almost ever and McCarthy was often not allowed to make roster moves in personnel decisions but he always had to account for them publicly and I think he grew frustrated with that role. And certainly. That won't be the situation here in Dallas us where I presume you wouldn't even have ask Jerry Jones to lower public profile so as not to undermine you know his his performance and authority as the head coach. It'll be interesting to see how all those things were addressed specifically as they went through contract points But I would assume that McCarthy earthy is going to embrace the idea more than most coaches would that Jerry Jones is going to stand outside the locker room and he's going to update injuries. He's gotta you no he's GonNa give his Public Opinion Game Strategy and coaching decisions And the performance of players just like he's always done But to some degree that might be a relief for refer like McCarthy. I don't think he craves the spotlight. And that sort of way can you and it is the doomsday podcast. Ed Werder Matt Moseley. Emergency podcast had cast a special edition as the cowboys higher. Mike McCarthy ed your mastery In of the NFL. And your Your longtime mm time contacts with a lot of these people. Take US back a couple of years to win. McCarthy was fired you said maybe he lost a little bit of that passion. Last three years years I would say part of that is Aaron. Rodgers is a difficult prickly personality. I don't think you would dispute me on that one. And he is not not in easy person to be around nor but for a while they made it work. They certainly had a ton of success together. From what you've been able to gather in what you remember about it. Why did why did that relationships our or was it just they just about had enough of each other and it was sort of a natural thing? Yeah you know I think it It digressed overtime Obviously you know McCarthy deserves a lot of credit for his role we'LL NC overseeing the packers through one of the most challenging quarterback transitions in history. You Know Brett farve forced retirement attempt to return and and and his you know affection for and support Aaron Rodgers as the packers starting quarterback resisting the will L. A. Brett Farve and and all that met in rebate and that carried a ton of weight And for him to align himself with Aaron Rodgers because he thought it was time for the packers Tabu on a quarterback that says a lot about the conviction he added Aaron Rodgers earlier than almost anybody else quite quite honestly And and so. I think arid appreciated that for a time But you know the intensity of being close together as long as they were with with. Rogers had quarterbacks coach is like Tom Clemens that he really liked and and and not unlike the John John elway Dan Reeves Mike Shanahan dynamic. You know Rogers McCarthy began to think that Rogers was too close to his position coach and it was detrimental to his his relationship with his starting quarterback and so you know he would he would either diminish that person's role or fire that person So that he had a more direct connection to rogers and Rogers would be upset about the move. I didn't feel like it was justified. Felt like it was done on not to his benefit and not. He didn't approve it. And so it just all of with those things I think overtime affected the relationship in a negative way. You know I I have a hard time seeing Dak Prescott that way in fact back when I talked to people out here today about how is he going to deal with the transition. That's going to be asked of him. I think we all know he's a pretty smart dedicated decatur football guy and that's what he's all about And he likes to be coach. He likes to be coached art. He likes to be challenged. So I I don't think there's GonNa be a problem anytime time soon if ever between Mike McCarthy and Dak Prescott as a quarterback and I think it'll be interesting to see as we go forward these next few days you know which offensive coaches remain. Here there are a number of them that are under contract that we understand you know Jerry has requested be considered positions and and I would include Kellen Moore and Mark Colomboa Woah. John Kitten That list And so some of that may help ease the transition in the system as well and got experience having played in the west coast offense aunts and I know that McCarthy has said that he has a favorable impression of California at least player And I would think that Jerry things after one year of calling plays that you know. Maybe it's good for them to sit behind somebody for a year or two and learn from you know Mike McCarthy and a different style of offense that ultimately it will benefit him. But but I wouldn't expect there to be tension between back and Mike McCarthy at least not very early on in this relationship just knowing the kind of person person is and given that you know. I don't think Mike is a real hard guy to play for So I I don't I wouldn't anticipate a problem if their partnership. Yeah this is In a lot of ways this this move makes so much sense Ed. Along the way you had mentioned simmers Zimmer wins. Wins that game the other day. They weren't supposed to win. Fact they were more than touchdown underdogs in in that. Really sort of took Zimmer. Pretty pretty much. He was already out of it. The the equation because they were talking like they might bring him back now you know they are and so. There was really no way to do that. I think this was the burden hand. They talked to Mike McCarthy. They liked liked him. It's a extremely. I would say ed when you talk about in the draft. Sometimes we talk about safe choices. This guy seems like a very safe choice. I don't know if he has the highest ceiling as some of these other coaches might have but we showed a note is floor is and we know I mean you you know you. Just don't you don't worry worry about. It's not like you're gonna get embarrassed by throwing Mike McCarthy out of your head. Coaching quite honestly with all due respect to Garrett and I personally I think both of us like likes things about Garrett but but he his his messaging and everything about him Garrett it was time for change in. They needed to make a change. Now Ed Mike Nolan. Poland newsbreaks this afternoon that he will be defensive coordinator obviously he comes from a football royalty in the NFL was the has coached about about everywhere but he was the head coach of the forty niners for about three seasons as I recall it. That's where he and Mike McCarthy Cross paths. Mike McCarthy was his offense coordinator before becoming the head coach of the Green Bay packers. Now you've watched and of course Nolan has ties to Denver and you have all sorts. What ties to that organization as well? What are you what light can you can you kind of shed on how different the defense might look or how similar it might be With under under Mike Nolan. Yeah my Mike. Nolan has some interesting ties to The cowboys organization through his father. Dick Nolan who was a longtime member of Tom. Landry staff staff and and even coach Jimmy Johnson took over Back in nineteen eighty nine for the franchise so he has that sort of history. But you know most recently been the linebackers coach With the New Orleans Saints I think he's done a lot in terms of contributing to the overall performance of of Dennis Allen's defense into Orleans and you know the cowboys are are are well familiar with how challenging that defense is what they they played 'em each last two years. They scored ten points in one game at thirty points. The other game So they don't know how challenging that defense is and no one really. Did it a physician where I think you could argue the sates committed. You know very few resources I think. They spend a lot more draft resources on their on their defensive line and and in signing Cameron Jordan Defensive End Markus Davenport they gave up a you know a first round. Pick to move about the get him a year early on the back end of their defense. They you know are shot lattimore. It was a first round draft pick. They they signed it or as Jenkins they traded for. Eli Apple so they made. I think they've made big. Investments either through trades or drafts in every position. I shouldn't accept At linebacker now Mario Davis was obviously a big acquisition. But you know he believes in aggressive attacking style of defense. He's he's used both the three four and the four three I would assume he's going to remain committed to the four three here and and I just like the defense. The defense it's a part of it is huge to me like it might even be bigger than the Mike McCarthy higher because the defense to me and the special teams is what really let this team down last year and didn't allow them to achieve their internal objectives and expectations. And I mean if you look over the last four years since since Dak Prescott became the quarterback Zeke Elliott. It was drafted to be the running back. They're thirty I in the NFL and interceptions. Thirty five interceptions. Four Seasons and twenty seventh and pressure percentage so to me. Those are the two things that That Mike Nolan's gotTA create More of if they're going to you know go deep in the playoffs and championship. Games Super Bowl but you know. I don't really think we should underestimate Mike McCarthy because he might not be a big name or a big personality but the guy can coach and he's won a super bowl and he's been in the playoffs on kind of very consistent basis in in a division. That's been very challenging in recent years so Yeah it's a it's a safe higher but I think the cowboys were in a position where they needed to make it. SAFE fire You know they've already. They already wasted entire decade. Jason Jason Garrett I find this unbelievable Jason Garrett coach all but what eight games in the two thousand a decade that began in two thousand and ten and it ended did with Jason Garrett having presided over the worst decade in franchise history as far as measuring it on the basis of playoff berth. Only only three and the entire decade the cowboys have never had fewer Playoff appears visited entire decade than they did under Jason Care so it was clearly time for a change. Mike McCarthy had thirteen years in Green Bay very experience guy. You're not going to surprise him with very much. Be well prepare. I think his this message will be on point where the cowboys going forward And and so I think this makes a lot more sense than going out and hiring a college did you. Did you like the cowboys. Ah Release you know what they said in it about that he was he did put the cowboys position. At least I forget how many times you know where they they were playing in the last game. The last game of the season you know. Obviously he felt several times doing that but they kind of used that as a as a positive to remind people boy they were in the mix a lot of the time but I I did also find it. Funny that one of the guys being interviewed at Marvin Lewis is a very respected D- in NFL circles. But that was about the only person you could find with less of a playoff record than in Gary and he at least gotten there a ton the times I mean if you think about it you've got to go for seven yes you gotta get there a bunch. He's just never one but that was like the first guy the interviewed but they get McCarthy art. The IT feels extremely safe. You're right. They were the talent where it is. They need to get it there and they need. They need this quarterback to align with McCarthy. They think think he'll be good with him and and I think all the there's there was more there were more exciting Folks I know Matt Rule supposed to talk to the panthers. He's my baylor coach. MILENA modern water and these supposed to talk to the New York giants. Does he have a chance to put in some sort of system. That could be great over the years. Maybe but that wasn't gonNA happen with the cowboys. Oh boys you think Jerry's GonNa let him. Oh Yeah here Matt Rule Let me just hand it over to you and you just put your system in and I'm going to go stand over here. That was not going to happen and I thought the point you made is is a good one. This is a personality while he might not blow you away. He is pliable. He is someone who can work with Jerry and that it was a really interesting point. You said he might even be someone a little relieved at times not to have to shoulder the entire blame. I will say this and and you kind of hinted at this point you may have tweeted this earlier. Ted Thompson was known in again. He had success with the packer. It's not like the guy didn't have success in the draft. And then of course Ron Ron Woolfe. Before him with with the packers but I I've met Ted and talked with him. He's a strange guy. He's very accomplished. Played for Bum Phillips. Yes I believe with the oilers back. He doesn't he doesn't look like a guy who played. He's just kind of comes across as kind of a strange individual or he did but he just didn't he you know they almost allowed him or praised him for not doing anything in in in free agency. Oh look the packers are sitting standing pat in the point you made was at some point. McCarthy is the coaches like we might need to do something. There are parts of this team. We could use help with in. That really really wasn't their mo well but but now it is now they have a new general manager and a new head coach. They promoted from within to replace Ted Thompson and they were very active in Free Agency in fact. You could argue that. Nobody did a better job in free agencies in the packers especially getting Darius Sniff and Preston Smith for their defensive front and you know creating real pressure that they didn't have I mean we all saw what happened to Dallas when they lost by ten To the packers this year and it's it's worth noting that Matt Leflore you know first year head coach. He's the only first year head coach among the eight in the league this year. who had a winning record? One is division in and went to the playoffs and part of that success was he inherited Aaron Rodgers. Nobody else did that And he had the good fortune of a general manager who was aggressive receving free agency and who made very wise investments and has created a defense. That's far more competitive than it was in previous years. I guarantee you Mike McCarthy was sitting up there in Green Bay is that we're gonNA thirteen and three but out of ordering. Well how come this expenditure was never. I never had the luxury of this opportunity. You know how how come I always had one of the youngest rosters in football because we lost guys. We couldn't sign anybody you know when Ted Thompson wanted to play all his draft picks early on And and so they were often in a position where they would get off. The slow starts because they're playing young guys who really weren't ready to be part of a winning equation on a consistent basis and they put a lot of pressure on the head coach. Put even more pressure on the quarterback. Yeah I did and we will remember Aaron Rodgers about four years ago. Four or five years ago famously. Said after one of those slow starts relax he in any in any you know looked at that quote and said Okay Eh in any kind of get it together. And they rallied that season but We give so much credit it is Kinda funny hell with a breeze. We give breeze please we. We sort of think they're almost equals. Pack keep coming back to that end was like Peyton and breeze. They can't do it without each other. But with Roger sometimes he gets credit for doing and get on his own and McCarthy was there with him that whole time and so they. You're right they had a lot of productive years. It anything on the offensive side of the ball we were. We're wondering okay. Kellen Moore John King all of that West Coast when we when we kind of look at that and how that's going to be implemented in a team or the DNA for a years was to the old camp easy tree. The longer routes we know Lenihan came from that school of thought. Obviously Kellyn came up. Kellen Moore came up under lend and a hand. How different should we expect this offense to look and we'll it I mean? Is it fair to try to think about okay. Exactly how Green Bay boy. Good point by by the way on the running game because for years they just SORTA got by with really not much at running back Eddie. Lacy almost eight himself himself out of the League may have ended up doing that and they got some production out of him for a time. But you're right. They for year one of the reasons they were so much pressure on their in Rogers. Because does he did not have a running game year after year after year. And and and I don't know if it's that They didn't feel like they could win that way or more likely to me You know I think Mike Got Captivated and it had enough Control of the offense that it became. Hey let's just let Aaron Rodgers you know being Rogers in. Let's have some playground football here and I know you know it was interesting because we're talking about the floor This year before the cowboys played the packers and that was one of the things he mentioned. Was You know I. I'm a guy who likes to run the football. And he did that Tennessee with Derrick Henry obviously and he wanted to bring that to Green Bay and he has a Jones but as they were making the transition he said you know you really have to make a point of it because it's so easy to just say. Wow Air Rogers getting we can just throw it every play like. Why would we want to do that? The guy is so you know incredible with the football in his hands whether he's in the pocket out of the pocket under the center and the shotgun. It's just really easy for Costa give into that and let Rogers do what he wants to do and and dominate with the passing game and it really you know creates a problem for your defense on the field too much and the cowboys at that. That experience But I I think what you'll see is you'll see a lot more Short passes a lot more emphasis on run after the catch a lot. More the running back involved in the past gingrich good for a guy like Tony Pollard. And Ezekiel Elliott. Quite frankly at fifty or seventy seven catches most franchise history for running back. I think think they like to have a tight end that to control the middle of the field so jarring would certainly seemingly be a pretty good fit in this offensive scheme But but that's a big part of what has to happen is Mike has got to be aware of the need to run the football. And you know that that's something that you just cannot be good work given the commitment that the cowboys a faith. If you want to know you know how effective this offense still is. I mean this is what the this this is Mike. Shanahan you know offense essentially and so it's Kyle Shanahan is running With the forty niners they were among the best running teams in football. It's what the Iran's are using and obviously todd Gurley two years ago. It was one of the best running backs in football. And so I think Zeke can fit but Mike McCarthy has to keep that in mind nine on a weekly basis as he calls plays in games I think he will and this is going to be interesting. Ed You've been great on this. Appreciate all your TV. Were appreciate you being part of this special edition as we get ready for the Mike. McCarthy era still trying to get used to this this is your. You're it's funny. What you said about the The the him haw and around about Jason. I mean there were reports that Jason was still lobbying for his job. which boy sounds strange range that you wouldn't be able to read the tea leaves but it just says a lot to about this organization and it is point they had to bull on and say we gotta go interview some some people and I think some of these other names you brought up Ed? We're probably in the mix. I'm talking about Zimmer Kubiak some of these others were always at least in the mix but when they get a guy that they felt like was a great fit and had the head coaching experience. They decided let's get this thing done and let's not get an deal. Where we're we're out here waiting on assistant coaches and quite honestly Jerry is just even even galax defense key? Who People are excited about right now because of some of the things he's done what he's he's been able to do a Dalvand Cook and others in Minnesota Jerry? That's not him. I mean the assistant. He was ever going to hire his own homegrown. I like like Jason Witten the thought of him going after even Josh mcdaniels. Who you're a big proponent of it just that never sat right with Jerry because he he decreed that head coaching experience? Well and with Josh mcdaniels you know. He's he's obviously operated in the Patriots you know organization Tation For a head coach in total control of every facet of the football organization. And you know that's not something that Jerry's going to embrace that kind of concept so I think the other other point. And you mentioned Minnesota Minnesota's a team that runs the Shanahan style of offense the West Coast offense. That's why they brought Gary Kubiak in because he runs that system and you look what they've done with. Alvin Cook is a runner and receiver. Like the cowboys have the ability to do that. In my opinion opinion as well and and to your point about Being Strategic and once you've felt comfortable with McCarthy you know immediately following through and making sure that that he doesn't go anywhere else. I think the timing of this was crucial in this way. I think the cowboys were motivated to act decisively once. They had a favorable meeting eating with McCarthy because they knew he was a candidate with three other teams where he'd already interviewed giants the Browns and the panthers and none of those none of those teams we're able to do with the cowboys did because they were still waiting to pursue Josh mcdaniels. He's interviewing in the mall this week. So the cowboys were able to maximize their leverage by being the I commit to McCarthy say hey you may be the Ba- It appears you're the backup guy with those three franchises. This is the biggest job in football. Aw and we are offering to you before anybody else. You don't need to sit around and wait and see where Josh mcdaniels goes. No you're the second choice of whoever offers you a job after that. We've got a team ready to win. We play in the Big Room in Vegas as Bill parcells once compared it to being Frank Sinatra playing the main showroom And so I think they made a compelling case to Mike McCarthy and the timing for them was exquisite in yet to get to stay at Jerry's house else that just that was the end of it. I think I compare this to you and you had some time off to kind of think about things and put your analytics crew together in really spend some time thinking. That's what McCarthy did in when he did make a point about that if I talked to Mike McCarthy's not the agents early on in this process trace Armstrong and one of the points he made when I asked him about this perception. You know Mike's kind curmudgeonly you know guy who's kind of stuck in a traditional football mindset you know. He said that Mike actually created an animal. The first analytics department with the packers Akers was all of the funding Four hirings and for any kind of technology that needs to be purchased to go through throughtout Thompson. And he just was not a big proponent of that because he was a former scout so he believed scouts intuition over any kind of analytical analysis data They couldn't get it approved. They could get the computers. I liked that you. What he I hope Jerry will approve will approve? So you know he famously asked Dan Reeves chiefs. He lost him over asking him to clock in in Dan Reeves said no but I do think Jerry is open to analytics. So we will See Ed great stuff. Appreciate all your work at at the star. And I'M GONNA I'm leaving the plush free donation productions. I may just drive out there and bring you something you just tell me. What do you need to eat? And you've you've been hard at it and if I can bring you something you just let me know okay. Well I appreciate that. You know the the cowboys boy. It's a great place to work when you're covering the team during the season at the star. Yeah the problem is second. This season ends. They lock up the building and don't allow US access it's anymore so we're not at the plaza which as you know is got a big giant artificial field and they're so a million kids out here throwing football around playing Lang and the good thing is there are plenty of restaurants and the people at the Omni Hotel have been very tolerant me Spending three dollars a cup of coffee so that I can loiter the hotel the rest of the day. Okay so we certainly appreciate that yeah. I'm well taken care of the moment by the way concrete cowboy. I will say this in in just a moment i. I called them to see if we could do something over there and they said if you need us leave a text and I thought that's the strangest thing I just went ahead and tried it within three minutes. They had responded and said anything. You in Ednid- so let's keep them in mind future. They were some of those others which I won't mention. We're a little difficult to work with. Concrete cowboy literally just responded to like a blind text and said guys. We'll put you a studio on our patio across across for so ed. Keep that in. Mind when you're out there the concrete the only thing the only thing that might do is They play loud music over there. Bill that could interrupt some reports but I actually very pleasant evening just before the season opener. up there with a rocky arsenault and associates as they were at flown in. And we're trying to resolve. The Ezekiel Elliott contract. They did that that very night. or in the overnight hours and God Zeke in you know so Jason Garrett could make a big run with all personnel to try and keep his job. Yeah I wanted to say something nice about him because they were they were very willing to meet all our needs. Thanks ed we really appreciate shaded there. We have a lot of knee. Let's we certainly do. And we. We appreciate you. Id and everything that you do. Ed is live from the star. Okay Ed go get on. TV there. He goes he's going to jump on TV now. There he goes Edward Live from the star. I the FRITO nation productions so much breaking news today and Want to say thank you. On the special episode of Hudson Financial Group UH H F g ventures dot net is how you find them h f g ventures dot net and appreciate appreciate Randy Hudson for all. He's done this year. That's a property casualty insurance. You can get all your life insurance. Needs met with him. And once you do that they bring you in and start taking care of all your needs and your financial estate planning all the mini things that you need to do in. You can find a lot of information. H F G GEE ventures that stands for Hudson Financial Group and we appreciate them and also of course the hottest capital Saul. Craig Hodges is while I was doing radio in New Orleans for the Boilers Sugar Bowl Craig. Hodges and his brother that's hodges capital they are a huge part of what we do and Craig Clark our coaches just great fringe of ours in Great Friends of the Doomsday. podcast Mart. Friedman a man. Who's boy I tell you? He's had a lot going on. He's had an illness recently but he fights through it all and He's laughing but He didn't really feel like he needed to share his illness. But free donation productions a beautiful place to get some work done and If you ever need to do a podcast I would recommend reaching out to mark frito Friedman Friedman. It is Matt Moseley. The new coach of the Dallas Cowboys is a Mike McCarthy who would've thought it but He is now l.. The head coach of the cowboys. We'll see how this goes. Moving forward will have a news conference later this week. But of course this was the Special Edition Doomsday podcast Gas Good not everybody Lots of stalkers Brady.

Mike Mike McCarthy cowboys Green Bay packers Mike McCarthy football Jason Jason Garrett Jerry Jones Green Bay Aaron Rodgers McCarthy NFL Ed Werder Matt Moseley Mike Nolan Ted Thompson Zimmer Kubiak Jones Mike Shanahan SEAN PAYTON ESPN
'Valentine's Views' podcast: Green Bay Packers enter new era

Big Blue View

22:59 min | 1 year ago

'Valentine's Views' podcast: Green Bay Packers enter new era

"Are you troubled by strange hockey trades in the middle of the night do you experienced feelings dread about N._H._l.. Free Agency have you or your family ever seen in New York islanders game. If the answer is yes then don't wait another minute. Pick up your mobile device and subscribe to Lighthouse Hockey podcasts from espy nation today our courteous inefficient hosts are ready to serve all of your islander needs and worries lighthouse hockey podcasts for New York islanders fans hello New York giants fans in welcome to a new addition of the Valentine's Clinton's views podcast here on big blue radio part of the S._p.. Nation family of PODCASTS. I'm your host Ed Valentine of Big Blue View. Today's show is going to be one where we continue previewing viewing the giants two thousand and nineteen opponents and up today will be the Green Bay packers and here to help us break down the packers will be Jason. Her Shorn who writes rates for espionage Acne Packing Company also writes for Espy Nation Dot Com and does some work for N._F._l.. Dot Com as well Jason. Thank you very much for joining me today at the be here Ed Hey okay so let's get right into this with the with the Green Bay packers things have changed a little bit and the the landscape for the the Green Bay packers over the last couple of years new head coach a little bit of a new philosophy. You're coming out of the front office in terms of how to deal with free agency and things like that so you know let's let's start here with with generic question. We're heading into training camp shortly. It's been a different off season for green bay coming off a six nine in one season a year ago. Do you feel optimistic. Paestum pessimistic or are you sort of on the fence about what what will see from the packers as we had to training camp will optimistic in the sense of them improving upon that twenty eighteen final record though that might not be the same as saying that they're definitely that'd be a playoff team. I think there's a lot of questions to be answered there in terms of their head coach Higher Matla floor he comes from a scheme that has proven success in the N._F._l.. So I don't have a lot of love questions about what they plan to do. schematically my questions Sir about the person who is implementing those changes. We really have not seen a lot of mettler floor as a coordinator has two years. Only one isn't often to play caller now that year was this past season with Tennessee titans and there are a lot of mitigating factors that might explain some efficiencies that they had but ultimately doesn't answer questions just excuses potentially <hes> some of those shortcomings so I think there are a lot of real questions about mantle floors ability to be a head coach at this stage in his career and his ability to sell sell not just Aaron Rodgers but that entire team on his vision for what the Green Bay packers are so I wanted to get into with you wanted to get into the la- Fleur Rogers Dynamic and you sort of headed that way we've we've seen from the outside some concern about lefleur maybe taking some of the responsibility or some of the freedom that Rogers has had in the past at the line of scrimmaged perhaps taking taking some of that away from him as Green Bay implements a new system. What are your thoughts on that dynamic at this point in? Are you at all concerned about it. I don't think anyone should be presented. Concerned right now both sides. I tip said this is going to be a work in progress as they enter training camp and as they enter the preseason. It's something that they're still figuring out where the compromise should be in the past as you mentioned Aaron Rodgers head the autonomy to change any eighth line of scrimmage rich to virtually anything else he could do with personnel on the field that seems highly likely to be the case under Matt Leflore but there are strategic reasons for that in this scheme and the way that is in it has been implemented recently with Kyle Shanahan with the San Francisco for narrative previously Atlanta the Falcons and Sean mcvay with Los Angeles Rams. It's very important to get to the line of scrimmage quickly. Get Your play-set quickly and enforce the defense to adjust so having a lot of these audibles just eats into that play clock and as the packers have seen in recent years under Mike McCarthy was this was McCarthy's Walter Rodgers they that play clock often got down to to you know one sometimes zero seconds and that really helps the defense really lets them key in on when they should start rushing the passer and that negatively impacts the often so getting to the line of scrimmage faster not audible in completely out of a play at there is going to be an audible control that Rogers has he at a minimum the building switch from the play. That's called to a different play from the same. Same set in the same personnel grouping those things can still happen but it's going to be a lot faster of an audible. If it goes that way my guess is that he rogers was gonNA end up with a little more autonomy than that but not nearly as much as he had under McCarthy. It's really interesting to look at Rogers and to look at the change in the Green Bay offense. We saw in New York when the giants brought in Ben mcadoo as head coach Ben came to the giants from the Green Bay system from the McCarthy system and I think that what we saw in New York with mcadoo was I think we saw the limitations in many ways of that system because in a lot of ways it seems like that system was a sort of simplistic one that basically relied on Aaron rodgers to make Aaron Rodgers kind of plays to make the system work the way that the that did sometimes in Green Bay obviously Eli Manning did not have the escape ability or the the arm strength of Aaron Rodgers so he couldn't do those Aaron Rogers type things and I guess it's a long winded way for me of getting around to asking you. Are you really looking forward to seeing being what Rogers can do a new system for the I really first time in his career and what this Green Bay offense ultimately looks like old definitely interesting as someone who covers the sport because there are a lot of things that these systems do have in common but the way they manipulate defenses is very different as you mentioned in McCarthy's offense. If you WANNA be overly simplistic it was about creating the best match ups possible between your pass catchers offers or you're running back to the if that's the case and the defensive players assigned to cover them or or the zone coverage assigned to slow them down. This offense tries to manipulate that even very different way he uses play action is such a heavy component opponent misdirection that really tries to move the linebackers more than eight of their position group out of position to create larger passing windows so it's other the matchups don't matter but it's at you're trying to really create these bigger windows through which Rogers or wherever the quarterback that can pass through and that creates more opportunities to take deep shots down the field more efficient versions of that then we've seen in the past from the packers so on paper makes a lot of sense with they're going to do but as I mentioned earlier. I don't have issues with the scheme. I think we've seen it proven at the N._F._l.. Level especially these versions of the Kyle Shanahan the Sean McVeigh versions of that Mike Shanahan Gary Kubiak offense. It's how is it going to be implemented in Green Bay because there's a lot of variety within that scheme it just look at Kyle Shanahan in Sean mcvay. They were to assistance on the same staff in Washington. They spent a significant amount of their career together and the scheme in terms of the playbook is probably pretty close to one to one but when you see the weights executed by those coaches McVeigh's spent the last two years almost exclusively at eleven personnel. I believe he's used more eleven personnel than I think any other team in the N._F._l.. Whereas you have Kyle Shanahan who uses it very little use a lot more twenty-one and twelve personnel groupings again same scheme but the limitation is very different so how is metal floor going to take the bones of that offense a construct something of his own? Is it gonNA look more like Shanahan's he'll look more like McVeigh's GonNa look like something different altogether but based off the same same concepts. That's what's most interesting to me heading into the twenty nineteen season. Hey Jason before we move completely off the the fluor Rogers sort of Green Bay coaching staff topic wanted to ask ask you Mike McCarthy was was Green Bay head coach for I don't even for a long long time. I can't even remember exactly what year he <hes> he took the job initially. Did you agree or did you feel like you know at tail end of last season that it was time for the packers to move on from McCarthy yet. It seems like that regime had run its course. I always surprised that he was fired in the middle of the season. That was not something I was prepared for. I I think a lot is expected the change to happen after the final game of the regular season but just McCarthy being removed as packers head coach seem pretty inevitable about halfway through the air okay. Let's take a quick break for a word heard from our sponsors here on Biglou radio than we'll come back and I have a few more rock green bay related topics for you. Hey I'm the only Patel editor in chief of the verge host of the verge cast even revamping the virtuous more and more lately leeann coming out with episodes twice a week sometimes even at third bonus episode on Tuesdays and talked to influential people around the world attack like Microsoft founder Bill Gates and other tech exactly founder of lime scooters the C._E._o.. Beyond Meat we've also been talking a lot of reporters and academics but the major suppressing policy issues intact like facebook's content moderation doing great he tubes harassment plan or lack thereof and whether or not the government rake Amazon which maybe it should and then every Friday I sit down with executive editor and Paul Miller for chat show we cover the latest news and product reviews. You bring other reporters around the verge. That show is party. Listen to you can hear all that more. If you subscribe the virtuous wherever you get your podcast bluff Rita listen and join us so again subscribe to the virtuous wherever you get your podcast we'll see they're. All right giants fans were back here on Big Blue View Radio and I'm joined by Jason Her shorn of Acne Packing Company to break down the Green Bay packers Jason what I wanted to get into with talked. It's a little bit about how different things are in Green Bay now and I wanted to well. Let me put it this way. I wanted to welcome the packers to the free agency era in the N._F._l.. Well it certainly was a pretty a pretty big off season for them. In terms of free agent spending the packers had dipped into free agency before but it was always in a very specific way twenty fourteen for example probably their last big big free agent dip their biggest expenditure was Julius peppers player that had been released by another team and therefore didn't count against the compensatory formula. That's the way the packers by and large had approach free agency during the head Thompson era clearly that has changed changed under new G._M.. Brian Gouda cons. They spent a not one not to three pretty big free agents to defensively impressed in entered Areas Smith. Those are the ones that are getting most of the headlines and for obvious reasons the packers defense it was pretty atrocious over the course of the last few years and bringing in pass rushers like those two will go these some way towards fixing that problem different approach for <hes> for Green Bay. I'm sure made the off-season made free agency a little bit more interesting and a little bit more exciting certainly different to cover right like in the past <hes> writers like myself. Could we wouldn't take the first week free agency off but it was not a period of time in which we were prepared or had to prepare to do a lot live work. It was mostly about here. Here's what's happening elsewhere in the N._F._l.. That obviously changed in two thousand nineteen. The packers were if not the biggest free agent spender amongst the very highest and look. It's it's for a lot of reasons. I don't know that this means going forward. The packers are always going to spend a lot of money and free agency. I think this might just be reflective of the deficiencies. They had on defense especially going into this offseason but Ted Thompson probably would not have approach team building this way with the same squad if he were still the general manager so I I think this is in some way still a sea change. Let's look at the at the Green Bay draft for a minute wanted to ask you. Your first pick in the in the first round was was defensive end Rashawn Gerry out of Michigan. He's a guy who was connected to the giants quite a bit in the pre-draft build up. Just your thoughts on what you've seen. I'm from Gary so far in what you think he might bring to the packers all we haven't seen much on any rookies anywhere across the because training camp is hasn't even begun yet so it's really about looking at the fits on paper and looking at the player valuation was coming out of College. rashawn Gerry was one of the most physically gifted prospects in this draft class but there's a reason why it was a bit of a surprise that Gary ended up coming off the Board at twelve he was out unproductive in Michigan but certainly did not live up to his billing as the number one recruit coming out of high school and that's that's part of the question Green Bay is he going to blossom now in the N._F._l.. May Be removed from Don Brown's evens which is one of the best defense in the N._F._l.. Or in college football but is maybe a little more restrictive than an what he will deal with Green Bay with under my pen. There's also concerns about his shoulder. He may not need surgery at some point on it and it's also about what is his role going to be early on his career now. The packers have said he's going to start out at linebacker. I it's a base three or four different so that that is a pass rush position but Preston Smith entered Area Smith the two players of the packers signing this offseason to play that role also at some point or going to kicking side as well especially the area Smith who did that. A lot in Baltimore is Sean Gerry going to also do that. He certainly has the body tie for it or the packers. GonNa say he's a rookie. We don't want wants to give him all of these new things to learn at once. Let's restrict his role so that he can really master that part of it and then move onto other things in future seasons right now. We don't know the answer to those questions but Rashawn Gary you just based on the death. Dr Is going to to play some kind of a significant role for the packers this year they simply don't have enough depth not to play the number twelve overall back so as you mentioned Jason we are heading up on training camp around the N._F._l.. Here pretty pretty quickly one of the topics that we've been discussing here on the Valentine's views podcast a little bit throughout the off-season is the growing tendency around the N._F._l.. If we're teams to to stay day at their home facilities to pretty much limit fan access to training camps the packers are an exception to that sort of trend end. Just I'm just curious. Tell folks a little bit about the way the packers run training camp in maybe couple of the of maybe your favorite things about <hes> about training camp for the packers well for as. Longs I've been covering the team. The packers have approached training camp pretty much the same way it's always in Green Bay. I know like decades ago. They used to move around but he's been in Green Bay for a long time now. Almost all the days are open especially early on to the fans into the media it in that sense of very welcoming environment certainly relative to what a lot of the other N._F._l.. Teams do which is as you mentioned more restrictive or increasingly restrictive <hes> the packers also have have with a call family night which despite the name is actually an open practice and used to be open scrimmage. That's probably the biggest change <hes> during my time covering the team a used to be a full on scrimmage safe for contact with the quarterbacks backs after I believe it was twenty thirteen switch that to more of a in pads practice so while they're still contacted. It's no longer live action in the same way but still the the packers training camp is very open in just about anybody who wants to take the tractor Green Bay can see them in action all right Jason. I think I have pretty much two more questions for you here. The first thing that I wanted to do is get your assessment on the the <hes> on the N._F._C. North on your division. You're looking at a pretty good bears team. You're looking at at the Vikings. Just just your assessment of what of what the division looks like well well. The three teams at the top of the division. Don't seem to be all that separated at least on paper those wings exact ones you mentioned <hes> the bears Vikings and the packers. I think that's reflected in the Vegas over unders. All of them are at nine or nine and a half wins the difference obviously the bears who won the division last year come in with certainly the most momentum and the most hype around them their recent to think that that might regress they were a very healthy eighteen throughout two thousand eighteen in a way that seems unlikely to persist into twenty nine thousand nine hundred necessarily GonNa be devastated by injuries. We can't say that but it does seem that they're not going to be as lucky as they were last year and that that is going to bring them back towards the center a little bit the Vikings on the other hand though with a lot more injuries they seem likely to improve and the packers in addition just to the offseason moves they made out with a coaching staff and with their personnel they dealt with a fair amount of injuries last year too two and if the new scheme is even a modest improvement in the defense income closer to the middle of the pack they should also being contention for that division crown. My guess is two teams. Come Out of this division with playoff. I obviously the division champion I would predict at this point. That's the bear still but I I'm not as confidence that as I would have been prior to free agency in the draft and honestly until we see more from what this packers office is going to be in my inclination to lean towards Minnesota because they have such a talented Rosser top to bottom even if you have questions about the quarterback which I do in Kirk Cousins I. I still think there's so much going there until the packers established that offense offense is rolling. I'm not ready to predict them to win a blaffer and my last question for you Jason is about the The New York giants just your impression from the outside of the off season that the giants have had in the kind of team that you think the giants might be in the two thousand nineteen season. I did not understand a lot of what the giants did this offseason the the Odell Oh Beckham trade seemed misguided. Although I do like Heaven Zeiler the offensive Lineman they got in return though not to degree that I think it mitigates the loss of Odell Beckham and like apparently the rest of N._F._l.. Media I did not understand the decision to draft. Daniel Jones six overall or a really anywhere in the first round if you think that he'd be a franchise quarterback it's fine to take him at six. That's not necessarily issue. I just do not believe that he can be a franchise quarterback players with that sort of background tend to not develop in the N._F._l.. Into starters let alone true franchise tilting players but this is the decision that the giants have gone with. They're going to pay our SAQUON Barkley. Daniel L. Jones if not immediately soon the season with a bunch of tilted weapons. I think that the giants do have a lot of those but I'm not sure how well they all fit together. Lot of those whiteout seemed to be better suited for the slot. They can't all play there. I'm exactly sure how they plan to utilize Evan Evan Ingram. WHO's also basically slot receiver is a lot of questions that at least at this time I don't feel we can answer well? We will find out as the season on Foltz how well things go for both the packers and the giants and hopefully when the two teams meet the game will actually have meaning for both sides Jason. I thank you very very much for spending some time with me before you go. Why don't you tell folks where they can where they can find your work on the different platforms where they can find John Twitter and and all of that will you can find me on twitter at by Underscore J. B. H.? You can find my work. ESPY NATION DOT COM ACME PACKING COMPANY DOT COM N._F._l.. Dot Com. I freelance other places well so if you follow me on twitter you'll you'll mo- most likely find myself Jason. Thank you very much in. We will probably talk to you again now when it so when it's time to to preview packers giants in the regular season.

Green Bay packers green bay giants Jason Her Kyle Shanahan Mike McCarthy Aaron Rodgers New York Rogers Ed Valentine Green Bay Green Bay Sean mcvay Acne Packing Company Sean McVeigh Gary Kubiak Ted Thompson Sean Gerry Espy Nation Dot Com
My Two Greatest Passions in One Conversation

The GaryVee Audio Experience

38:56 min | 9 months ago

My Two Greatest Passions in One Conversation

"Hey guys before. Today's episode of the PODCAST. I want you to text me. Two one two nine three one five seven three one. If you don't you're missing out on putting all my eggs in the fucking fucking texts basket two one two nine three one five seven three one sees Gary v Audio experience. Hey guys your about to listen to an interview with Jim Nagy executive that runs the senior bowl all star game for the best seniors and some juniors. You'll hear about that in a minute to get into the draft in the NFL underpriced attention cultural event. Type thing. You'll you'll get into it. I think enjoy this a little left field but if you really know me really follow interviews with me a ton of fucking sense. It's scary chucked fun conversation on the podcast with a gentleman that I've gotten to know a little bit less couple years of you know. Aj my brother are left lane or media three years ago we started being her sports. Very heavily in the Football player representation business. We've learned a lot. We put up some content recently about in when I had the opportunity to get this gentleman on the podcast. This one's fun for me and we're going to go into it here because as you guys know I love underpriced attention and and so when I talk about what's going on right now linked in and tick tock or everything. Good that's ever happened to me. You know in sports cards in wine in social media. It's how do you see something others. Don't and I think the gentleman that sitting with me runs and organization and an event and a weekend that I think is to be perfectly perfectly. Frank wildly underrated in the schemes of the sports world. And so we're GONNA get into that and then some of the other studies doing and maybe some old war stories so my good friend. How are you? I'm good. You tell the beaner nation who you are and what you do and maybe a little bit about your origin story. How you got into football game? Yeah Jim Nagy the executive director the senior bowl spent eighteen years in the. NFL is a scout Going all the way back to when I was a little kid people always ask. How did you get into the NFL? And in who you know and and all that real quick store just from the time I was a little kid my dad was a football coach. Grew up loving it. Where were you born in Michigan? Yeah small little town so go grew up a playing the game being around. It went to Michigan my only opportunities out of high school to play like small small college ball so went to Michigan worked with the team their last couple of years. I was there a high school football player and you are opportunities because physical stature and abilities were smaller schools and you decided to give up on the dream of being a player to go to the University of Michigan and get get involved with the football program. What you're saying you know in? His back was tough. It was pre internet solutions. Couldn't just google it google how to become an NFL. Scouts is really going blind. Where you you were you was a tough to give up the dream being player? Did you buy senior of high school kind of no you were not going to be an NFL player. It was tough just to give up the sport because again. It's it's not basketball baseball. Basically he can't join a softball league or Wreck Basketball Leagues. When it's over when you take you take pads off it's over so that was hard like even going to games my freshman year Michigan? There's there's first couple of months I didn't even go to the Games because I just couldn't bring myself to moments in September and October regret. What's that like? Was it so hard that you were like fuck. I should've went to Appalachian Estate Order. Fuck with guys. I would never played division one but all my buddies then right division too but you know it was it it was. It was hard because I had a bunch of friends plan. You know so. You'll see them on the weekends. And and that's what made it difficult. WHO's the best high school player you played with or against? That's a good one who then went onto. Did anybody become an NFL player. Not on our team. We had a really good team but we didn't have anyone go to the NFL. I'm trying to think of who we found. That's a good one. Those are always the fun. I've met some. I like a bit like you know. Knowing what I remember running into some guy who played high-school against Eric dickerson person and he was a safety and talked about the fact that Dickerson scored like eight touchdowns in a high school game against them. He goes on seven of the touchdowns. I was supposed to be the last line defense and I don't think I was within ten yards of him. When he got to my level he goes but those would have been better than the eighth one where he completely ran on me over and I'm still getting out of under the ground? It just Super Fun when there's like all time great. NFL players that play at the high school level just the distance between them and the the people that go onto not being in the NFL. Pretty Radic right right. Those guys usually pop out right away. So you go to Michigan you want to get involved. Yeah that was a high school football coach. He was he was the head coach. Yeah that's cool so you play for that high school. No no no he gave up. He got a teaching and coaching. When I was I duNno elementary school? Middle Elementary School got got it. Yeah you remember having memories of I'm GonNa play for my dad or was it even too early. It's too early for that. My memories are like being being out of practice sleeping on practice. Actes dummies and kicking field. Goals Scraping cleats money. Your high school career did you. When you are your own coach or other coaches would they say things about your pops to you he was? It's a smaller school. But yeah they knew there was like an hour away. Let's call it. Yeah Anyway you gotTa Michigan Ninety Two Ninety six ninety the two ninety six so as a rough stretch. We went eight and four every year but the key was Ohio. State came in undefeated two of those years and we knocked them off. So that was that was he ran on the field. The only one. That's no no didn't but it was really. It was a really good learning experience and again all I did was send resumes and cover letters out just blindly and the only the only foot you could get in the door back through. Pr So I got a PR. Internship with the Green Bay. Packers is my only house walking out the door for graduation and the phone rang and I heard the phone I ran back in it. Was the packers really out there. Ninety six it was lucky Lou. Wait a minute wait a minute you were just. I want to educate the kids. That are listening. You were running out the door. Do you believe if you missed that phone. Call that you wouldn't have gotten job possibly due to possibly I believe in that Shit. Yeah answering machine though. I don't even know if I didn't call it gets the NAG's ter- leaving number that's like Nirvana and shit. So you fuck it. Went to the packers ninety six. That's insane yeah it was. It was really cool. Timing in mind amy. Did they think they had a super bowl team. Yeah Reggie was there and Brett was just outcome and they lost. What did they do in ninety five Jesse Championship? They I knew they were in the next year. And then they signed Desmond Howard in the off season and there were there was what you were pumped about. Yeah there were stacked. That was a really you were set. Yeah it was so you know so I was supposed to be there just for training camp. Andrew Brandt there no no no Sandra after got it but I was only supposed to be there for training camp in. We were in the dorms. At Saint Norbert College is sold d three school so at the end decamp. They're like Jim. Can you stay for the rest of the year. We're GONNA have a good year. We're GONNA get a bunch of media attention as but I've got nowhere to live. We're moving out of the DORMS. And Luckily we traded at tight end in one of the titans and the team. Jeff Thomson have had an empty room in his house and I went through a mattress in his basement and we ended up being great friends and when he was in my wedding and it was just a cool. Yeah Yeah it's really lifelong relationships ninety-six like the Suba. Yeah and you beat the fuck out of the Patriots and I was like you stayed after I dunno know yes. It was a year long. Enter chip had nowhere to go that year. Were you hoping at that point. You get I mean you just want to Suba. You're hoping you're GONNA get right. Yeah but but again it was I was NPR. I wanted to Scout. I knew I wanted to scout so the nice thing was about that stuff there was five future. GM's in that scouting department. And so every time I win every super cool every time there it was John Schneider. Ryder Reggie McKenzie John Dorsey Ted Thompson And I'm blanking on the other one. Come to you later. There were five so every time I got a free second from my PR stuff up there. But Reggie in John Schneider lettuce they yeah they shared so I'd like knock on. Hey guys got committed and watch and they were. They were great. Yeah they were great. Scott McClellan was Scott. Yeah unbelievable staff. So it's one of those things it's like and who was the GM Ron woolfe wealthy former jet gm all so it was a it was a mad at the jets and wanted to build a fucking story. My Fuck. It wasn't. It was nuts year so I didn't get a fulltime job. I actually moved out here to New York for a little bit. There's a game in Dick SCHAAP. You Remember Dick Dick. Dick was writing a book Dick SCHAAP had a fucking show. Joe Nemeth right there. You think I don't know that next so dick was writing a book about about the old players in the new players in Green Bay. And how for years when the packers stunk in seventies and eighties. Like all the players rejected the LOMBARDI teams. Because like I don't want to hear about the Lombardi guys and and then in the nineties the teams they kind of embraced and then those guys got along so Dick WanNa read book about those relationships. I knew the guy the young guys and he knew the old guys. So he's like why don't you moved to New York helped me write this book. Just Gimme stories. How did you get connected with shop? Because he kept coming in through the year to be just like what are you doing after the Keno. Jeremy Super Super well very well. That's awesome it's right. He's go he's hopefully going to be part of the summit. Oh that's GonNa be the moderator but yes yes it was moved out here in hooked me up with his sports agency that they had a media arm so started working there and I really just you know bought my time at the agent thing like you guys are doing a little bit for about four years. Either that got me. Yeah that got me to the senior bowl every year that got me to the combine. So just how you were one hundred percent focus on scouting outing. Yeah so even when you are an agent you were pregnant. It was a stepping stone right absolutely absolutely so then. Let's give me a quick especially since I'm now in it like Gimme will not being agent you -tainer sports. GimMe a great funny story that you haven't thought about an awhile who'd you almost get who you get and then lost. Who Do you think was going to suck shit and now as a hall of Famer GimMe Gimme something for what agency did you work with? We with SF accessible marquee group. Then they got bought out by the time there was all these conglomerates gobelins each other up so like in. During that time there was one story we had Peter Warrick one year when you work. And Ron Dougans the two big receivers at Florida state. Meanwhile the the best one was Lebron James Coles and he was he was. Let's go good story about Laver's but tell me because he ran lightning-fast ran like it was a horrible weather day. We take them third round. Yeah it was a horrible weather day so they didn't have an indoor. We rented on wood floor in a gym and he was like four to nine or something crazy super cold war. What like nine to the bengals early? Yeah how good is he in college like to me I. I can't believe that guy's career wasn't more than what it was like Jersey Best College College players in the last thirty years. He's got to be in the top ten. Well yeah so so you had both those guys. We had both sets of those guys and we had them up here on a recruiting reading trip in New York and it was when when P. Diddy has restaurants restaurant up here and those guys wanted to go to it at all costs so I brought him down there and then they're you gotta get him down here. You've got to get Mike. Oh my goodness puff daddy back getting him down your so. I grabbed a manager. And I'm like guys these guys would love to meet Diddy diddy in so so they're like I can do. He comes to the table. He's like go outside. Go out that door. We go out there and this escalator something rose up and the door opens up and puff daddy's steps out. I'm like wow. That was easier than I thought it was going to be. They they were like Holy Shit Nags. UNSTOP ooh that was. That was a while juice while few years who was the WHO is the player that most heart. That didn't go with you in that forty or do you remember that you flat out like he told us going with you or every indication was there and that eleven fifty nine. He went with like well. Travis Taylor was was one the Florida receivers. WHO's GonNa Jackson and Travis Taylor in Dera actually out of that foursome was the lowest drafted but had the best career? But Travis Taylor went ten overall. The Baltimore Baltimore. We took him. We took him all the way through the training process combine po if he was with us and then literally like the week before the draft he dropped go to another agent. Yeah so that was. Yeah it was really late in the process it was a it was a kick in the nuts. So that's we know business. Take a tough business. Yeah okay so so. You're an agent for four years. Then what happens then. John Schneider got hired with Marty Schottenheimer to run the front office in Washington and that was the year we went. Eight eight probably was not a good roster that Mardi coaches tail off. You probably should have one coach of the year that year but they got blown up cute. Tony Banks Tony. Banks and I think can't agree. Kent Graham want us a couple of games too but yeah so it was. It was a weird year so they John Hired me to scout the west coast and those guys after one year out. So I'm sitting there in Washington left out on the West Coast and while this I finally got my foot in the door and this is going to happen Let's talk about that year. Now you're scout you're on the west coast for the redskins. Who's WHO's like who you know? I'm just I'm trying to imagine what I would do. I'm like okay I'm GonNa fuck and find somebody in this first year. That's going to put me on the fucking map like who. Who is your diamond in the rough or who was like? Who'd who you enamored hammered with what yours this? It was a one. Oh One yeah so what you're doing. The whole pack only the biggest geographic region. It's really hard area. It is great but you go from Washington. Washington Idaho all the way down through Mexico Arizona so long it was on your on your radar like Oh. Do you remember anything about your one. Yeah I mean it's hard to remember. I know yeah. It was a long sometime ago. I want to say I can't. I know you remember something it was it was it was David Carr and Joe Harrington that was the big. I remember in Washington entity drafted Patrick Ramsey in the first round. So those were the two those were the two big ones so you really focus on those to forget about what happened in real life at the time. Do you recall who you liked better. I really graded really similarly. I think I liked car. Got relict car and anybody was Ernie diamond out of that. You're going back so it's tough. You know the thing is it's hard to say. I've learned a lot in these three years. It's fun now like I watched no college football because I'm Jersey kids so now it's like now we're in your three. Some of these kids are ready. I'll tell you the biggest thing I learned in the first thirty six months. Holy Fuck Walk. I would have ripped my arm off if this kid would have signed with banner three years ago and he's out of leak Like some of these kids were mock draft public media first round picks real life when you get under the hood and realize what you and Aj do our third round guys they go third round. You kind of thought they won by I. You know I'm like Oh my God this guy's GonNa be top fifteen they end up going third round but you still kind of perceived them in the way you I saw them and now they're ready literally not playing out of the League in thirty six months like all the hyperbole I believe I believed in and like man. This is a tough thing. There are kids I can. I'm not going to call them out because unfortunately it's not worked out that like at this time we're now in November. Like I think so. I still don't know enough like now. I know a little bit better but I'm still seeing them in mocks going twenty-third to the Ravens. They end up going fourth round third round because they were slower heard or never really really that prospect because for everybody listening the mock drafts and the real life. There is a disconnect there is there is a real disconnect we all get pissed like I was a fan my whole life like how of talk the whole like whether it's Mel Kiper best available which is more educated and even the mocks in my opinion but like democracy now and you're like in round three and you're hardcore band you're like fuck look somebody who should have won the first round still now. Their fifth round pick their fifth round. Pick in Harper's I see all that because we watch a ton of tape on a daily basis and you read some of these marks and can you just WANNA call. 'cause we're doing your origin sorted hard turn. What is the senior bowl for everybody? Let's think what is the senior senior bowl. Is the most prestigious college all star Game. Not Saying saying that because it's been there forever. It's been a great game forever. I'm just kind of jumping on sale end. But it's been a great game forever. Seventy one years. Why was it started? You know I don't know why otherwise interesting. Yeah but unless it started in Jacksonville for one year and it didn't draw and they moved into mobile. And I don't even know how it got the mobile but fifty-three fifty three hall of fame players. You know current pro bowlers is forty. It's half that it's a third of the League we've got over five hundred but he's listening now. This game is when when is coming this year. Twenty fifth in Mobile Alabama. Okay now this game is not only for seniors right yeah. We can bring juniors if they graduate in December so so as long as they fulfil their academic league doesn't stand in the way so we can start bringing those guys few years ago understood. And and what's the EBB and flow of the the history of the game. How much has it gained or lost importance over seventy years? That's a I can just been going for about twenty four. Okay so let's those but but yeah the edge there I would say there was. There was a time where the senior bowl basically could pick. You know the players they wanted. It's it's really it's an invite. It's the high profile game. Yeah it's the invite it used to be. Where if you get invited you went and I think there was around in is actually talking to one of our former players about this? Recently he came in the office to watch tape it's decay. Hey Mike S. Dad. Terrence metcalf was in the office the other day he was a second round pick to Chicago I believe and he he was in the senior bowl. He's Jim when I got invited like you just went. You saw the guys before you go and it was a prestigious deal. He just when we can move up in the draft. Yeah you knew you could help yourself and he said when did it get to like we're guys weren't coming and I said I don't know probably around like somebody get hurt in one. Oh I just think that because the money got so big that I think is. I'm not trying to point fingers I think agents Have convinced people didn't want to get him her right. Because if you're if you're a solid third round pick an agent may go conservative and say hey until DNA. Ed either to play defense or offence. You're either you know run-and-shoot or your prevent defense like there's a and you're everything in between their agencies that hey you're not gonNA do anything here. That's going to skyrocket you into the first round so fuck it. The downside is way greater than the upside right on the flip side as a casual fan. Let alone what. I've been educated on there have been some iconic guys that have what crazy at a senior bowl that have shot up dramatically every year every year and again I say I think every the kid who's the temple outside linebacker Assan radic radic right. That was for sure right just yet. That was that was our first year. The yeah no I understand non-clients I get all talk about game. Titus Howard was a tackle from Alabama state up the road from us and he came third or fourth round pick and most by most teams left the twenty third. Picking the draft are absolutely our Guy. Yeah yeah so that that. That's the one thing that makes our game different. The All Star Games is the league. Assigns the coaches so last year. We had John Gruden's raiders in cal- Shanahan's niners and they bring their whole staff and they implement the team and that there's no rule right day assigned randomly top ten draft order. They go the draft order. Call this year. They'll call the bengals. Who will end up on the team and say hey bengals what do you want this and they can choose to do it or not? Yes okay they have the option but it's such an advantage for them. The Moshav anyone's ever turned it down because they did. Yeah they can't do down because bowls wasn't in place right. I remember thinking because that's why I thought some people turned it down because I'm like fuck. We were supposed to. That's it's right. Yeah they have to have a full staff in place that's right. That's right understood right. So that's when you can get and teams are coming off and fire coaches. So that's how you ended up with the second and fourth worse record team throughout the third and fifth or advantage to see what these guys do in meetings and how many hours a human when you rip their asset practice like how do they bounce back. How do they respond bonded that? There's just so many things during the week that these coaches and the scouts can can draw because they are behind the scenes they get to eat meals with them there with them for a whole week for the innovations that you're bringing the table because this is what caught my attention probably made me want to have you on from your innovating now. You're starting to do different conferences. During the week. It feels like it's becoming more than just a game. Yeah Yeah we we want to. We really have to last year I was. I was in Nashville for the draft when you work in the NFL. Like I knew the draft process was getting big I didn't know to what degree nationals the astound to. We went to Nashville last year. Doing some of that six hundred thousand people in that city Nashville's them. I mean it's great and Vegas is amazing and that's going to be the. NFL draft could be this year and listen. A lot of people are going to go. Because we're gonNA use the excuse to go to Vegas for the weekend that's always play but like Philly was a great philly great job. I thought now Chicago did an okay job. I thought this is my subjective opinion but Nashville is just a different kind of town Nashville's on ripping fuck and fire. Yeah Nashville Nashville. Biggest going to be more spread out. They kind of laid the blueprint out smell coho flow and you've got live music going. People are GonNa have a good time to meet our events different because I grew up loving the draft. Okay so I'm not GonNa do we all all dead right. That's why we all do what we do. But really the event itself was born Guy Walking across the stage Jersey up and Brogan goodell whereas Sadar the game. You can stand ten feet from we talk about how Goodell hugs. I think that's one of the coolest means in the game right out. I really think one of my favorite things in all of sports. This is how all in pot committed go dell is when he hugs the guy for everybody who doesn't know what I'm talking about. Make sure you watch this year's draft it's like he goes in it there's some long embraces it really. He really goes in like really gets in there. I think the giants pick right. Clemson kid like lifted him last year. I I thought lower whispering something in their ear. Congrat- made it. It isn't like it's a great. Listen I'll tell you this it's when you start getting under the psyche of a kid who since fourth grade has wanted to be in the NFL when four seventy eighty percent of them This is a financial windfall that completely changes the course of their family's future. That moment is emotional. Yeah I actually think few. I think way more guys should be crying. I know we get them out there. If you're listening the prospect of this just cry. It's a big move like stopping a tough guy like the male like you know. Let's start crying no doubt no. It's you hit it. It's it's the family thing. That's what as a scout. That's the good stuff you go into the schools and you hear some of these guys come from. So that's why when especially the kids. Yeah I've had. I've had guys when I first got an scouting I'd buddies from back home. That would throw stones at guys that show up on the ticker and they're throwing sounds like listening because it's twenty one years old. He's got twenty twenty million dollars in his back pocket like you don't expect these guys to make a few mistakes along the way so to see where these guys come from the backgrounds. It's those are those are special teams. That's gotta it'd be cool for you guys when you get them as clients in get those guys paid. And what I don't like is people throw a lot of shade at misconceptions around athletes. Like I will tell you right now. I've been in the wine business I've in the business I've spent a lotta time in Silicon Valley. I know a lot of people. It's the same shit. There's good good guys. There's bag is ninety. Eight percent of these fucking kids are phenomenal human beings. I hate what culture does with athletes. Ninety Ninety eight percent are phenomenal. Let humble work there fucking face off. Did everything right. I wish the media cared about Wall Street guys as as much as they cared about athletes and headlines about their behaviors. They're football players on their most debauchery day collectively in the last decade. Don't have as bad of a day as Wall Street guys will have today on the fucking record quote me so like they're great. Kids fucked face off. Are you kidding me. It's the best one and and obviously you know selfishly. Put a plug for sports. I don't think anybody's going to hear more and I don't think anybody's GonNa fuck and make more money off the field so I triple care because then it kicks into responsibility I get pumped. ooh Cincinnati drafted him. What business in Cincinnati? You know proctor and gamble what about local car dealerships. I get my juices going and then I'm very weird because I care about the jets more sports right. I care about my kids so I'm in some other different should altogether because I'm worried about the jets. Now the jets like one of our kids go. Ah Ha half the kids I want to go to the jets because I already know them and I think they're gonNA be great and it's it's become the best. I was so glad the just one yesterday. By the way just blue-chip yesterday was a fun day for me I would have been great either way. I'm into draft positioning at this point. You know I'd love to think they could run the table and make like a story story but I'm too realistic to more. Starters got hurt yesterday. Winters out for a year or offensive Lineman Herndon. WHO's been hurt all year after Greek year? So we're fucking decimated but nonetheless. Okay what else. What else on this podcast people? Actually here's my little plug. I'm going down 'cause I'm going to be at the conference this year and I'm going to hang a little bit because it's become important to me. I remember going to south by southwest tech not the music stuff in two thousand seven. It was already. It was very early compared to what it is now summit and it's funny I said to. Aj I went last year came down and spoke at your conference really in and out this year. I'm going much heavier little bit longer and I remember saying age. I'm like this is this is GonNa be cool like this is something that in ten years like. I think it's a crazy sports guy or Gal's weekend like to me like I. I loved how Nashville has become the last twenty years as a town. How how things like? Hey I know. Aj throws one of these. I've been fascinated by Kentucky. Derby party popped up things like baby moon. I don't know if you know about this propaganda. Now you have to go on a vacation before you have a baby. There's all these new things that spur up. I actually making a prediction. That's why again why I wanted to put this on film and audio. I think in ten fifteen years you'll start seeing a lot more. Call it as football fans which will skew more guys. I think a lot of guys weekends are going to be bill because it's inexpensive trip towards epic fucking game. The kids are walking around in the scheme of things and mobile. Really read like that was like it's a fun town. It's it's like a mini kind of New Orleans kind of thing going. Yeah so you talked about it. We we have the summit event that you're gonNA keynote now. When is that? It's on Thursday. So that'd be the twenty third so that lineup of great great speakers for that you know really business football collide sport collide. We're bringing in people from other leagues. No like right there with me on the pay like I was like okay. This is legit. Yeah Yeah we're GONNA rope the head coaches in every year from the game so we got that on Thursday and then Friday this year so mobile is the home of Mardi Gras and not. Many people know that it's more of a G. rated Mardi Gras. It's not quite New Orleans Orleans But we had the first one. So we're GONNA get X.. Rated or they won't let us Bama thank not senior bowl. We know. So we're GONNA have. We're GONNA have a parade with the players. They're all GONNA and a half they're not gonNA wear their recent senior bowl stuff they're gonNA wear their USC stuff there penn state stuff stuff and we're GonNa Parade in downtown. They're gonNA throw autographed. Footballs at the fans. We've got cheerleaders I get down there. Yeah keep it on. We got mascots from all over the country bands and then it's going to end up in Cathedral Square and we're going to have a live music act on there so we're really trying to really trying to Mimic Mimic Kinda. What Nashville then like cool music like the baby or like like some bullshit? You can get me baby. We're good facetime right now. We're GONNA talk. I'M GONNA so. This is the first trying to do it. Because again you give some gimmes and come down Thursday. They go to the summit. They go to practice Friday. Okay we got the street party. Mardi Gras parade and then Saturday's game. Yeah no I really really really see it like I really. They were sitting sitting on something you are. I'm like I'll be very frank. I love you and you're awesome and I like to be in. This podcast is selfish. I tasted it like last year. I saw it. I'm like you know what fuck it just like. I'm right about other stuff. Let me put this on the record that this is an underrated event and I see it. Yeah I mean again you so you get football right in your face you can. We were not real football. I mean like Baker was senior bowl. Right we've quarterbacks. In the last three years we attend share picks last last year. Surreal army guys accent like on a kind of made a joke but between the parade and throwing it out like the. The kids are obviously very focused and that week but like is it easy to stumble into kids walk around and getting autographs. Yeah Yeah I mean you can go to the second floor of a hotel and grab any of those guys right now. Hopefully we'll get to the point where there's enough people down there where we can't do that. We'll have two major security Baker Mayfield two years ago. I'm I'm sure this is like frowned upon and the players but I'm here for my audience like it was like an autograph flip arbitrage like you spend like five hundred to get down there and stay in a place like you rack apartments autumn. I've saw those honest with you. I saw them and everyone kind of frowns on them and I kind of like look wink and be like keep going. Mike is that's me and then the other component of it is the main drag in town Dolphin Street. You Golfing Street. Dolphin Street Dow thin. Da you takes. You knew where I was about to be out dilemmas camps in my fucking trip the guys in the League love mobile because there is a small town feel to it and they all got their own little watering holes in bars. They like to go into stumble into one of those places. And there's somebody who's GonNa be literally a second round pick in the NFL in five minutes. Your and your head coach. The players are out Saturday night after the game they can let it loose a little bit but during the week I mean you got nine hundred. NFL people down there so literally your head coach Gm. They're out throwing some back into the town this year. You have a sense yet or you know like Monday. It's cool real business. Gets done down there right. Yeah it's cool. I'm so pissed I WANNA go Monday. That sounds busy like I have to go and be like the Circus Act on Thursday like low. Everybody's face off with keynote that nobody will ever forget you coming to practice though right I think so as Friday or is that because I'm getting late Wednesday. I'm excited I like last year. Twenty this happened to me. A ton. Southbound I'm trying I think of other things lobby. which was this conference in Hawaii went to a bunch other things and I'm sure it will be listening to understand this? You know how you go to something whatever. It is Mardi Gras jazz fest and you realize since he never went before you actually came one day too late the baseball card convention last year in Chicago. I came one day too late in Atlantic. Because you're going one day early like like that's how I felt. I was pissed when I got there like I was like fuck. I should've came day earlier. I could feel that I miss some of the good shit okay. Yeah there's no reason that shouldn't be a major national animated such unique event. You got one hundred. NFL draft picks all in one place and accessible the the entire NFL nine hundred NFL guys. Walking around. And I really accessible. Yeah offensive me when I tell you the the the arbitrage rush between all these guys that go to the draft versus actually going to this thing. It's not even close. You'll have seventy eight cell fees of active. NFL players at the senior bowl. And you'll you'll have zero at the NFL draft. And that's what people want now. Jim I don't know if this thing but like that's all people want they don't even fucking what the autograph. I don't want the Selfie and if you get lucky that that guy ends up on your team it's fucking honestly what I what I realized last year when I asked you to be on the podcast for this because I want to put the flag in the ground of like the guy that was right about it is if I was on the other end of this podcast ten years ago. If I'm driving to wine library right now and there's somebody I'm following named Gary B and he's doing this podcast in the middle of it I like call. Aj and I'm like Bro. I have an idea. Let's go to senior bowl like that's how I thought of it in my brain like it. It just makes a lot more sense that a lot of the stuff that we think we go to. That's going to be as good. I couldn't believe the access. You know what it reminds me of the old timers telling me about old old time sports sports you talked to a sixty two year old a sixty eight year old. That used he's like always go to Shea and the game was over and I jump over fucking railing and just fucking hog nemeth like it was so different the access between money and laws and just culture and the society changed. And I think that's what's it's really cool about this. It's almost a throwback to access that we don't see anymore and I think our game I think we've had this small town mindset for a long time so I got here a eighteen months ago. I went to the game and this way bigger than we've all been given it credit for like we need to start blowing this thing out. It's not our little game anymore. This draft process forty seven million people. Watch it on. TV last year. Six hundred thousand went to Nashville like we better start going on that same. There's people tweeting out their own. Mock drafts right now. Like right now. We're in Tuck in November. And like you know like this has become a twenty. This is a twelve draft ten years like wait a minute. The League's twelve months sport. Because it I used to be really different the drafts of twelve months thing now I agree with you and I think your thing is. I mean besides the combine combine. I don't know I think it's the number two thing if I if I was to rank around draft culture the draft itself but then the combine and then the senior bowl our senior bowl because it's real football versus the underwear. Listen don't even get me. Sorry I won't say educates me and I get to emotional about it. I know it's both but I hate it. I don't know why why hate it but you're right I know it is and it's been proven to so I can't go on emotion. This is when bets with me. You wait till I get emotional and you just calmly say. Let's make a bet and already eliminated any chance of me winning them at so I know I know the patterns but I understand one is football and one is attract track me and I've been a part of teams that have messed up a lot of picks based off what the guys did at the track. Meet actually this fun for me. Jim Your personal. This is an official this Zap ficials senior bowl. You as a human off the record clearly on the record. Your percentage breakdown of the combine versus the eye test film. If you bought the jets instead of me tomorrow and you're like mandating from the top hey scouts and GM. I want you to follow the letter of the law of this. This percentage of valuing the tape and everything else and the combine. What what Matthew put against tapers combine ninety ten ninety ten? Yeah I mean the anyone on the legal tell you the combines. The main valley health the main with common or the medical strike the interviews which again those are even tricky those those are tricky. And it's like you know many people treat me during an interview and then you get in and you're like fuck in all the physical testing stuff all the on the field stuff all it does make you go back to the table and runs really acid. We see the sky right. Make you put on the tape again. Well yeah I know. We ran that but he shouldn't play like that. Just makes you check yourself. How many times do you think people draft these guys and on the first day? I'm not kidding. The single first day they come in many rookie minicamp and the senior brass all looks at each other and says fuck me. That happens more than you know. I never actually asked you in the background background. Shaking your head with it happens to me. Hiring Bainer media great process reference to male says. I've worked with him at the other place. I'm all pumped and literally the one meeting in. I'm like no we when I was waiting for the jets this year. Clearly checks cut third round fucking pick nags. Yeah we've had we've had that happened at some teams. There was one where naming a name like. Tell me those story unless you want him they we we send we send coach out to work out a player and and he was at the bottom of the board close to the bottom of the board coach. Works he magically ends up way up here because the coach really valued what is other coaches thought. Okay we draft the guy which around third round in we go to rookie minicamp in all our scouts or us. We're watching look at each other like holy crap author. Thirty get Scott can't play. That's the Darko. Darko Story to go basketball. Isn't it like a famous story where he gets in the gym the first time and like I do. Do you know the story demanding. A huge pissed bringing Darko is killing me. You're a huge fan. Never saw I can't in Frederick no no I think in the player's Tribune on Chauncey billups like a Players Tribune like hardcore thing or somewhere. This story exists where Darko comes in and the whole team first day is like Oh fuck do cannot not play well yes that was old school basketball. Worst part of the worst part of the dark. Who else was in that class the Pistons the Pistons? Good Ahead D. Wade. They could have Bosch. They could've mellow after. Yeah unbelievable the Portland Trail Blazers they with Jordan Jordan and durant all right. So that's what happens sometimes fucker. So you guys all looked at it and be like this fucking coaches shouldn't have as much right because it's like vein meteorite we have strategy and creative. That's how you get to ultimately all this stuff and it's really funny. They all blame each other than like fucking strategy fucking creative and I was thinking about scouts coaches. I'm like scouts and coaches should coach. And then and coaches are like fuck you motherfucker. After coach these people have to say right. Now there's a lot of that. There's a lot out of that in the good organizations. There's less of it. But of course what. What can we end when last-minute get down to mobile because it'd be a great year I'm appreciate you have and beyond the about dot com? Yes and your tickets on senior bowl dot com. It's going to be a great week so you come down Wednesday Thursday Thursday like you said ultimate guys weekend like you sit in that crazy parade working like get a bunch of the kids sanction flip it on Ebay. Oh Yeah Yeah Yeah and if you can. That was good to baby. We're good. I'm trying to. He didn't pick it up later. Jim Thanks for being on Oregon. Thanks man thanks guys for listening. Please please please share the podcast. Asked and make sure you've subscribed because a bunch of you aren't subscribed and more importantly a bunch of you. Listen every day and having told your friends it's the best podcast in the world. I'm watching have a great day.

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RTFP #932: Andrew Brandt

Ross Tucker Football Podcast

37:14 min | 2 years ago

RTFP #932: Andrew Brandt

"All of us at podcast one want to say, thank you for listening to this show. We would also like to ask a small favor of you. It'll take less than ten minutes. And if you're one of the first few people to fill out, the survey, we'll give you something for your time. We would like you to complete a short survey for us to help make things better around here. Just go to listening survey dot com and everything will be right there for you. That's listening survey dot com, the first one hundred and twenty five people to go and complete. This survey will get a ten dollar gift certificate to restaurant dot com. And there's a chance to win an additional one hundred dollars Amazon gift card filling out the survey will really help us out. Go to listening survey dot com and thanks for listening. Pry I have more good news. I just found out yesterday that I won the podcast one sports net challenge for the second week in their own. I don't know if I was five for five again this week like I was last week but back to back. Weeks. I have won the podcast one sports net challenge, which means. I no longer have just five hundred dollars credit to give out. I have ten one hundred dollars credits to give out ten because I haven't even done it yet. So I'll send out a new tweet today at Ross Tucker NFL, and or re tweet my other one, and I'm going to give out ten of you. I'll pick them today or tomorrow, I'll tell podcast one. These are the ten people that I want to get one hundred dollars credited into their accounts. If you didn't do it yet. Go to bed online dot AG sign up for an account using the code podcast one. And then go to my tweet and send me your account number. So I can get one hundred dollars credit in your account potential. I'm gonna pick ten of you ten different people. I don't even know if ten people already sent me their account numbers. 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And then I'm going to pick one of those tweets next week for the Freeman we're then by Scekic because they're always giving you twenty dollars off the Ardy lowest ticket prices when you use the code Tucker. We also will have a new spread the word winner on Friday. That's just somebody that retweets me or Brian or likes it when I post on Facebook. That's a good way to do it or am I start posting them on Instagram? So that would count as well at Ross Tucker and fell sponsor confirmation Email winter you take advantage of any of our sponsors. And then send it to me with a question. You don't even need a question to answer to or the contest. But I guarantee to respond to your question if you do and then this weeks man winner is someone that takes advantage of ZipRecruiter mutton bowel or seek key codes for seek specifically using the code feast or even money this week, by the way, last I checked not a single person had entered to win the Madden this week. Not a single person. It's wednesday. I'm picking somebody on Friday. So. So it's up to you. If you want to enter right now, if you're the first person your chance to be one hundred percent if two people do it. It'd be fifty percent yet. Pretty good chance to get a free man this week. Anyway, we always have a good chance to Jeddah knowledge draft when we talked to the former long time by president player finance with the Green Bay Packers. Andrew Brandt talking count picks. Sam Bradford coaches on the hot sheet hot seat. It's pig Showtime. All right, Andrew, let's dive right into it. And I actually want to start with Sam Bradford being released by the heirs ONA cardinals on Saturday believe it or not and your thoughts on that. Yeah. Good day. Ross. I always talk about Sam Bradford. I write about on. My talk about him. I tweet about him because he's a hall of Famer business football very fortunate. Young man. Last phone is baby of the old CPA. When contracts were outta whack for top ticks, fifty something million guaranteed out of that deal. Then he lands with the eagle bay trade for without a contract use that leverage to get a big deal. It's an eleven million dollar bonus from eagles before they traded him. Minnesota. It gets nice killing Minnesota. He goes there. Zona gets fifteen million guaranteed to be placeholder or Josh Rosen where it was already a placeholder for Carson Wentz. The total time played for those two placeholder sinement s-, three games, and the total money almost twenty five million. So this guy has been as fortunate any kudos to Tom Khandan is agent. I think his career earnings or about one hundred thirty million or what I think everyone would say middle of the road quarterback at best. Set by injuries but through circumstance through good agent. Who timing this guy hit it big? And if he becomes kind of a mean on Twitter every time he's lease because people like me about on much money. He made and how much he got up these teams. Yeah. And it's interesting Andrew because we've talked about compensatory picks before. But apparently they've released him because the guy still has to be on the roster after week ten to count against the compensatory pick formula. So them releasing him. Now the Vikings don't get their third round compensatory pick. And instead the cardinals formula will now reportedly project to them getting a sixth round pick. So, you know, we've been seeing the compensatory pick stuff happening for a while Andrew it's just interesting to me that now guys are getting released during the season in part because of it. I mean, every cat manager every front office. Every GM is looking for a way to sort of gain the system, we're seeing it more and more. Now, you know, we really are. Because it just seems like everyone's got looking for an angle, you know. And I think the thing was Sam Bradford as they knew they were on the book now. Yeah, they're saving the per game Rostrup on. It's everywhere in the scheme of things that wasn't a big deal. So hit guaranteed money. And then they knew there on the hook even as a third string quarterback. So they said, well, what are we doing? You know, we're not we're not gonna play 'em. We can bring up another roster spot. And then you talk about the formula which really favors in a way to sort of get at the Vikings, which maybe not their intent. But they're in is to serve me skew the favourite towards them with the formula. I wanna talk about compensatory picks Andrew because I don't really understand why they are necessary. There's something I'm writing about in my column this week at the athlete. I really don't understand why they are necessary in a salary cap league. I mean, it's the point now where certain teams are almost dissuaded from signing some of their own guys. If they know that, you know, they'll get a compensatory pick and return other teams, you know, don't aren't active in free agency in the early days because they want to be able to get some compensatory picks back when they lose guys. And really I mean in a salary cap league why why should teams be rewarded at all for not reciting their own guys? It's a good question. And what happened in collective bargaining for over the years and strikes and lockouts says I teach in sports law all the time is there. Tradeoff in nineteen Ninety-three. The first time free agency hit the NFL trade was okay. You players get free agency. But we get a salary cap. And then this little footnote, we get compensatory picks to though these are all set off if you will against tree agency, and it was such a bargaining chip for gene Upshaw and the union back in the nineties. Reggie White case to get free agency that sometimes we ignore the fine print and the fine credits. Guk in there, obviously through now. And frankly, I don't see the union making a big deal as we go forward into the next CPA. It's just it's hard to get that out of there. But as we talk about with our teams are becoming smarter in how to use the compensatory pick formula and the formulas not as simple as you signed. Guys weeds five guys you get a pick. It's complicated. It's like a it's like a McDonald's Big Mac secret sauce. No one really knows and people are trying to figure it out to the to the actual pick that comes back, but everyone's surprised in March when they get their convince toward picks. It's it's a it's an annual ritual teams complaining that they thought they should've gotten more. But teams do have some idea of what the formula is like they've obviously discovered that if you cut a guy before we ten he doesn't count against your formula. So how did they know that like I had never heard of that? Until Brad forgot cut. I never knew that was a new part of it that I didn't know before. Yeah. I mean, it's again, it's part of the convinced real thick formula. I think non you didn't know. But maybe even teams didn't know in the past. But now everyone's getting smarter. You get cap people that sit around all day. How can we do this? And you're right more and more little wrinkles in the cap and the CBA teams getting smarter. I mean, we're talking about language guarantee. Voids, you know, lane Johnson test positive for Stewart's that's fifty million of guarantees voided by the eagles. I told her about it all the time business tilted towards management. So when you get a Bradford when you get a Durell re this when you get them at you, Stafford you're like, oh my God. Somebody's winning. But those you can count on one hand. So that problem with football compared to other sports. You know, we also saw the raiders cut Bruce Irvin over the weekend. And this is also something that's interesting Andrew because they got to pay him for the rest of the year as a vested veteran. I guess they're just saving cash or are. We seeing an NFL team more or less tanking at this point. Yeah. I mean, the raiders thing is is really intriguing to me. And I talked about it on Thursday night football last week on Amazon. It's just ironic that Jon Gruden as we know sneers sneers at the home moneyball analytics thing, but that's what they're doing. That's what they're doing. They've traded present assets for future assets. They're collecting draft IX. It's exactly what the seventy Sixers did exactly what baseball teams do that. Are I wouldn't say tanking playing for the future and they're doing, and, you know, listen. I thought they clearly got the better of the Cowboys in the Amari Cooper trade 'cause the market showed it when d'humieres Thomas isn't bid round pick and golden Tate's mid round pick. You know, I am you can better compare the players. But I think the Cowboys got taken by the raiders because of their zeal for Cooper, we'll see but the raiders are clearly playing it was disaster. The other night against the one and seven. I don't know how to spin it any other way. Speaking of a disaster, Andrew the Washington Redskins had to place three guys on I r on Monday, including both starting guards. They also have both of their tackles are injured they signed three old lineman three on Tuesday or maybe Monday afternoon. I don't know have you ever when at the Packers you ever experienced anything like this. No not that way. I mean, you do get hit at certain positions. But this is extrordinary feel for the Redskins because you know, their team that for the moment the division. I think everyone expects the eagles take him over. But that's the worst. You know, you get you get socked it had a position you home. It's a strength now becomes a weakness. And you know, this better than anyone the guys you're signing off the street. You just not going to be as good, and you know, all the all the great things we were saying about Adrian Peterson. They just going to get harder and harder now because he's running behind backups. You know, Ted Thompson or worked for for years used to sing through through the bane of our existence. And the Redskins are living proof of that right now. Speaking of injuries, I'm curious if you have an opinion on the news that came out that former Vikings first round picks Cherie Floyd is suing Dr James Andrews for one hundred eighty million dollars. I don't know where he's getting that number, but one hundred eighty million dollars suggesting that you know, he he messed up on the surgery and ended Sharief's career. I you don't see that every once in a while we're grievances filed. But you don't see this that often where it's a real medical malpractice suit. No, you don't and certainly don't see it with a name like Andrews who considered the legend in the business, so many proteges of Andrews like Pat MacKenzie you I would fifteen Green Bay are practicing around leak. He's considered the godfather and all the big time agents. Use him drew Brees, and so many have had their surgeries within. Yeah, here's one that is gone south. And I'll be interested in tracking this because all of these things, you know, I'm a lawyer and everything was coming to see him 'cause there's gonna be some financial value out of this. That's what I'll be looking for. I haven't looked at the case in terms of the actual charges against, but yeah, it would be some kind of medical medical malpractice that he didn't meet the standard of care, and it's caused. I would think what he's gonna say fluids going to say is tremendous loss of earnings. And also the cases are. Yeah. I also saw Andrew demeanor cut you off there us a so that you had an interesting tweet yesterday during the midterm elections about the dolphins actually advocating for a specific Bill for sports betting. I mean, they they compartmentalize. Well, I guess they do indeed. And you know for any lawyers out there listening. The ABA American border sociation and weren't doing a webinar on Thursday a webinar about sports betting. And what's where we've been and where we are in. I'll be involved with that. So check your APA website. But it's to me it's fascinating where we've been in with sports betting. It's traditionally been so taboo, and not even traditionally the past six years, Russ six years NFL this in court, and in may they lost? And now I tweeted out we're on election day the Miami Dolphins advocating for proposition on the ballot that would allow for encourage legalize sports betting. This is the same league that fought it in court for six long years what a change and you talk about carbon compartmentalizing I just think we're in a new age and sports betting is not only legal. But according to the dolphins in. Courage, d- and promoted. Unbelievable. I also wanted to ask you it really is. I also want to ask you, you know, we're getting more and more coaches on the hot seat. And we're also seeing more assistant coaches being fired. Did you experience either one of those in Green Bay, maybe when Sherman was on the hot seat or did he ever fire any assistant coaches when you were there? No. I mean, listen we had a we had a year actually the year. We drafted Darren where you know, we had a bad year and Ted Thompson just come in. So this is the kind of thing that we see in all these cases like Cleveland where we had a new general manager who had been there before but comes in from the outside and just in coach Mike Sherman. So that was a tough year. I don't know if it's so much hot seat. But I just felt some some tension the whole year because you had a coach, you know. And then the pick of Erin was a source of all of this because it was a picture of the future. We'd coaches that are judged on the present. And obviously our first round pick that you're didn't help us at all on the field. So yeah, not so much in a in a acute sense throws. But a whole year of tension that two thousand five season after we took Aaron Rodgers first round. And. Wow. That's amazing. That really is just so uncomfortable because I was in that situation a number of time. And it's like, I I actually advocate when you know guy is gonna be fired. I I actually advocate. You know, releasing him firing him in the season because I feel like it gets awkward and uncomfortable. And it's like this cloud hovering over you during the second half of the year or the end of the year when the coach is good as gone. Everybody knows it. I think it's just it's almost like you can take a breath when you actually move on from that guy. Yeah. I think so I mean, I think you you describe what I went through. It's it's very uncomfortable. Sounding board for those. Yeah. It's tough from that hacking and haven't even Cleveland, and maybe other places. Andrew always appreciate the time. Thank you so much for coming on as always. And as always keep up the great work on the business of sports podcast. You're rants have been awesome. Lately. Okay. Ross was a pleasure. So I'm actually I was actually pretty annoyed last night bright because my wife, and I were watching this is us. We DVR. That's like the one show we try to watch together. Although we watched the first episode last night. That's how far behind we are because we just don't get chance to watch television. But I don't have the T Bo both. You know, where my wife, and I watch TV I have a detached garage, which is like my studio, and where I work out, and where I watch a lot of football, and I have the Tibo boat box for cable. There's also a Tibo OTA for and it was annoying. Because inevitably when my wife was fast forwarding through the commercial breaks. It would stop either a little bit too far of a little bit too short. When we probably it's not a lot. But we probably wasted additional five minutes. And it's just frustrating because I don't understand we even got a new cable box for our cable subscription, and it doesn't have a button that just goes to the next commercial. It's so nice though in my detached garage because that's what Tibo boat FOX does for cable, so nice, and you can even watch. I watch football thirty percent faster. But they have pitched corrected sounds. So it's not like. Like, it sounds normal. Just a little bit faster. Like, if you guys listen to this podcast on to ex same type of deal tvos put together a deal just for you. Guys. Twenty percent off any Tibo boat OTA or TV show bolt. Vox, just head to t- vote dot com slash Ross twenty and remember promo code Ross twenty that's Tibo dot com slash Ross twenty with promo code Ross twenty for twenty percent of if you watch a lot of stuff on DVR, or if you watch a lot of sports is a no brainer promo code Ross. Twenty at t vote dot com slash Ross twenty. Jeez. Good morning. Cross twenty always a bunch of transactions on Tuesday. Let's start with the line to not only fired their special teams coordinator, Joe Marciano, but also cut running back. Amir Abdulah while signing wide receiver. Bruce Ellington, Zach Senator. So it appears as if they had Abdulah primarily for depth in case, kerryon Johnson or THEO Riddick got hurt. It didn't happen. And maybe they thought that they would be able to trade him. They weren't able to trade him. So they got rid of them the center things interesting. I think maybe that's partially special teams partially like third-down blitz. Pick up if they wanna use Riddick more at slot receiver. That's my guess and also maybe some short yardage stuff. Although Ellington did is a slot receiver. So I've just trying to give themselves some more options there. Jeez. Some other moves include the bills cutting cornerback Phillip gains Packers placing Tronto Allison on. I r eagles cutting Dexter McDougal. The raiders signed a pair of de de ends to help replace Bruce Irvin. Chiefs activated safety Daniel Sorensen and the Redskins signed a ton of old line help to try and make up for the losses of both starting guards. And my question to this. When you say a ton of old line help actually a ton like two thousand pounds worth of a line or just a generic a lot of whole line generic lot of but fair question somewhat clever. Bry, you know, a ton is two thousand pounds. So they'd probably have to have signed six guys, so many guests. You didn't really think they signed six guys? So you were just trying to be funny. I almost smirked almost, but I least appreciate the effort out of you. They signed three guys Luke belong. Anco Austin Howard, and Jonathan Cooper Cooper and Bolocco can both play center and guard Austin Howard to tackle. And. It's kind of remarkable like with all the battle line's league. You almost forget that guys that are available belong co and John Cooper in Austin. Our that played a lot of football as for the raiders they signed Jack Smith and Kony ealy two other guys that you're like, wow. Those guys weren't in the league Jack Smith and Kony ealy, by the way for part of one year and all of the next year. I was that guy. That was like, wow. He's not in the league Tucker. He started a bunch of games last couple of years yet. That was me. Unfortunately, so other moves texting McDougal was just that Nickelback for the eagles in the last game. But he really struggled. I guess they're going to go with craven love Lanc. They wanna see if he can do better at nickel journal Alison just means that the Packers are gonna play more. They're young guys. The the bills starting cutting start bra bra bra the. The bills cutting starting cornerback Phillip Gaines is interesting at this point in the year. I think that they're on the hook for the rest of his salary anyway, but they wanted to promote Levi Wallace from practice squad. What have you the chiefs Daniel swords, and he'll help that defense. He is a very short tackler. So that'll help. I guess that's it. Jeez. In some acrimonious news. That means it was getting kind of ugly. You mentioned the lawsuit yesterday filed by shirt Floyd against James Andrews and also to marry his Thomas does not seem thrilled to be with the Broncos right now. It's getting it's getting it's getting kind of ugly. It's getting it's getting it's getting ugly. You know, what that song? That's right. I don't. The song actually goes it's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic it's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic, and I have no idea what the rest of the song is the name of the song. Or who sings it? I just when you said it's getting kind of ugly it triggered like brains. Are the craziest thing ever you said it's getting kind of ugly triggered in my head part of a song. I don't know the name to or the name of the group. But it just triggered him ahead. It's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic it's getting it's getting if getting kinda hectic now, I must know while I talk Bryk, and you look that up please. Sure, just Google like it's getting kinda hectic, and I'll tell you that the tree Floyd thing. Look, I don't really know what happened there. But I do know a lot of times there used to be a rule. There was something like in the CBA where players actually they told you to net. Like, some people said don't ever let a team doctor do your surgery because there's something in the CBA. I believe this would be a good one for Dr Chow. There's something the CBA that says as a player, you can't file a malpractice. Practice suit against a team, doctor, if they do the surgery, I remember hearing from the NFL PA that you shouldn't use team doctor because you have no recourse, if they really messed up. So that'd be a good one for dodger, Chad that's an interesting one as for his Thomas. He feels like, you know, just reading quotes he feels like the Broncos kind of getting the run around that they weren't honest with him. And that you heard that they were bad mouthy? When he when they left there like I will be better without him it cetera. So that's a guy was there nine years felt like gave a lot the organization and is just disappointed in the way, they handled it the reality is though it rarely ends. Well, like, it rarely is a positive when people part, you know, the retirement ceremony or the the. Ring of honor. And everything went great. It just that's just not how pro football works very often. All right to the artist is called snap. The song's called the power dance. Electron ick. John got the power came out. I got the power nine hundred ninety and it was actually nominated for an American musical ward for favorite dance single nice. So nine hundred ninety was when I was eleven and I think the first school dances. We ever had. We would go to a tone -ment Lutheran church for dances when I was like in sixth grade. And the big thing men was we wouldn't actually fast dance. We would just do like lame like jump over each other and stuff because we were all too embarassed. Too fast dance that we looked bed. We would though slow dance. It was like sixth grade. Yeah. I think it was just sixth grade. But that was a big song back there. I've got the power. It's getting it's getting it's getting kinda hectic all right could work Bri. Now. That's added value hit the sounder. Yeah. It is Jerry member. The I've got the power part. I didn't remember the hectic part. Yeah. But anyway. Jeez. Speaking of unhappy wide receivers apparently the saints Dez Bryant earned a Goshi right now. So this is an interesting one, I do think that they could use another receiver from adept standpoint. And I will talk to Greg Cosell tomorrow about what he saw from destler last year. How he sees Dez fitting into the saints because if you look they only have four receivers right now, Michael Thomas trick wants myth, Austin Carr and Cameron Meredith. Now, they do use Alvin Kamara and Mark Ingram in the passing game a lot. They have several tight ends. Ben Watson, Josh hill. They like Dan Arnold who's a young kid that can run they have other options. But if they suffered another injury wide receiver they'd be in real trouble. So I think they want to try to rectify that now and get that guy now. Question is is this Bryant the right guy. You know with all the stuff he said about the Cowboys. And he he's not going to report to the Browns to work, but he's not returning calls the Browns. Then he is. You know, what Sean Lee said about him about the lack of accountability. Is that what you want to bring onto a team? That's number one in the Ross Tucker football podcast power rankings. I mean think about that number one in the vitally important Ross Tucker football podcast power rankings. I just don't know if that's something you want to do. But it's something that they got to think about and they got to consider so from a purely football standpoint depth. They had the slot guy in car camera. Meredith I think is not been healthy or not been good enough. Trae on Smith's, the young speed guy. Michael Tom, misses the stud wouldn't be bad to to. Bring in a guy that can help them out. Contested catches third-down red zone like Dez. But there's pros and cons of that. For sure. Jeez. And finally in move it surprises. Exactly. Nobody the forty Niners. You can start Nick Mullins in their next game. Of course, they are. I mean, he earned that with how he played CJ Beathard gotten a bunch of opportunities and he's done. Okay. With it. Nick, Mullins got one opportunity and did great with it. So he gets a chance to to do more opportunities, by the way every once in a while. It's not like a paid read from an advertiser. I'll just throw out something just to give you guys a heads up on things to things to businesses that are run by friends of mine that I'm involved with now that we're getting closer to the holidays. I was on the Doug Gottlieb show yesterday radio. And he was checking out the ball cannon and absolutely loved it. He is a nine year old who plays a lot of flag football. So as you guys start to think about holiday gifts ball. Canon dot com, especially I'd say if you have boys between five and fifteen go check that out. Make sure you tell them that you heard about it for me. So they know. So my buddy Fred knows I'm helping them out. And then my front page story dot com. I just got one of these for my my wife's Oma who moved into a senior care community. So we got her one of these stories, and it's incredible going to give it to her Sunday morning. I'm beyond excited my front page story dot com and actually might be up on the site. So you could actually read the story about Oma. It's just incredible. She's ninety six years old incredible. But more importantly, it is the best gift you could get anybody. This holiday season my front page story dot com. NFL player. A question will here's your chance? It's time to ask. Ross Email address Ross at Ross Tucker dot com, we usually get to one Wednesday one Thursday, if you take advantage of any of our sponsors all even throw my front page story in Balkan in there any of them, and then send it to me Ross at Ross, Tucker dot com. I guarantee I'll read and respond your question on the show. What do you got bri-? Hey ross. Thank you so much for the twenty dollars off of my first event at Staples Center from seatgeek used to code such good venue with that discount is able to get some great seats in shared sweet greatly game. I'm currently in my first year of roughing high school football. And I have loved that has brought back. Brought me back to the game. We're taught to enforce the rules without becoming a focus of any game in this finally leads to my question. Did you ever have a game where you felt that you were singled out, and that Aref just didn't like you? Or did you ever have a game where the ref was calling only you while you felt innocent of? Fouls. That's from Scott. Scott. That's a great question. I love it. I could do a whole episode on that first of all kudos to you for being an official. I saw round here in Pennsylvania. There's a shortage of high school basketball officials, which really surprises me, you know. And maybe part of it would be better. If people didn't yell at him so much they're not making millions doing this. You know, they're doing it because they wanted to stay involved in youth sports. I mean, give them a break. You know, give them a break. Gosh, I love what you do man. I love it. You know, the game can't go on without the officials who do it for peanuts. And to answer your question. There was one guy, and I would say I only ever felt like there were maybe three or four bad calls against me. And that guy was either all of them or three of them. A bad hold a bad tripping. He he was bad really bad. I forget his name. I think he's still officiating. But yes to answer your question. Absolutely good question. That'll do it for a wisdom Wednesday edition of the Ross. Tucker football podcast. You guys know the deal on Wednesdays gigantic days for us over at Ross Tucker dot com here at RT media. We've got fantasy fees part one with Evan Sylvan. We've got even money with Steve physics. So fantasy fees is the best fancy podcasts out there even money. The best sports betting podcasts out there. So huge day for us. Hopefully, you guys already subscribe and listen to those and hopefully you take advantage of ZipRecruiter or seek using the code feast or even money or you buy a pair Mah, Bow jeans. So you can win the men this week. I think we're done here. Thanks for listening to the Tucker football podcast. Make sure wants to subscribe to the fantasy feast even money in the college draft podcasts all available on I tunes and Russ Tucker dot com or wherever podcasts Kindy found.

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Best of The Herd: 04/05/2019

The Herd with Colin Cowherd

40:25 min | 1 year ago

Best of The Herd: 04/05/2019

"Hey, everybody. This is Chuck from the movie crush podcast, and I wanted to alert everyone to a very special episode. I was able to get Mr. Christopher Walken believe it or not into the studio to talk about the movie footloose. Here's a little taste of what you can expect. And then, you know, I think you're talking about that great farmhouse dance sequence when he's by himself in the warehouse. It's one of the most absurd things I've ever seen. I mean, it's enjoyable as how is the dancer, you know, a Hofer at hot. But. Yeah, this kid and he's angry very angry. He's been pushed I wrote down. I took notes wrote down whole towns against them. Uh-huh. And and he took notes for this. I did while because I wouldn't remember anything my fear. An ex watched it yesterday. And you can listen and subscribe at apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. Thanks for listening to the best of heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from twelve to three eastern nine to noon Pacific on Fox Sports radio NFS one. Find your local station for the hurt at Fox Sports radio dot com or stream it live every day on the iheartradio app by searching heard. The best of the herd with Colin coward on Fox Sports radio. This is gonna hurt. We're gonna loaded Friday shell wherever you may be. And however, you may be listening. Los angeles. Iheartradio, Fox Sports radio app. S one man that I have power night asleep last night, nine solid. Joy Taylor is joining me on a Friday running. Oh, lord. As washed. It lasts me when you get excited about full. Don't you wake up every morning and try to figure out in your head? How much you slept? I do every day. Sometimes I'm chefs by I'm obsessed by sleep. Do you have like an app on your phone that can tell you how much you sleep in how you slept. No. I just ending on. How literally grab my phone right before I go to bed, and I think okay. Take fifteen minutes off last night. I just powered power slept in got so much energy. We've got a great show today. So I wanna start with this. I always tell young sportscasters because I will speak the colleges I'm meeting the kid tomorrow. I tell him the same thing. In two thousand nineteen. You don't have to be controversial tell the truth. It's controversial nobody wants to hear the truth. Everybody's PC. Even guys I compete against all over the country at this job at captain's safe. Take just follow go to Twitter and say obvious stuff and don't ruffle any feathers and eight nine years ago. I was critical of Aaron Rodgers. He was the golden child in the NFL. You couldn't touch him. I got massive blowback. I remember one time. I didn't get blowback Peter King on us at Peter. I'm watching his body language. I'm hearing things from former players and Peter king's where to connected, I'm like, the guy's a diva. He's part of the underachieving problem here, any Peter's, well sourced. And Peter's I'm not hearing it, and I know don't have as good as sources as Peter King. Because he literally that's all he does. And I was I remember getting off the air that Dan thinking in my missing something. I'm watching him. I'm hearing, but I always trust my eyes. And I always trust my sources, and I stayed. On him. And it's so amazing. Because the last six months, it's all coming out. It's all coming out. No more than I'll know more. You hate. Take your cheese head off. It's the reality that article yesterday, I thought it overwhelmingly clobbered Mike McCarthy because it unveiled new information on Mike McCarthy. It was a very well done article very well source. Lot of quotes a not all anonymous Aaron Rodgers I mostly knew it. So it didn't it didn't strike me. As new information. This is what I felt about Aaron for years. He's aloof. He's not a great leader. He needs the girl up, he's overly petty. But there is a moment in this article. Because this story broke ten minutes before our show yesterday. So I consume the article speed reading, and I missed one nugget of this article. And I think it's incredibly damning for Aaron Rodgers Tyler done reports that Mark Murphy who's the CEO of the Packers. He's a Harvard guy marks played for the Redskins for years. Mark Murphy's super smart guy, really really one of the smarter guys that runs any team in the NFL that he called Aaron Raj. Gers after they hired Matla floor. And he said don't be the problem. And he repeated at Aaron Rodgers don't be the problem. Murphy. It says is tired of the diva stuff relating to Rogers. Vokes his own family's taken shots at him. Grow up on it. Young sportscasters trust your eyes and trust your sources don't back down. I was right on Tibo. That's not a starting quarterback and Aaron Rodgers never been more right than anything. When I read that yesterday after I got off the show. Don't be the problem. Oh, okay. Oh, okay. By the way, the article continues. Here's an important non development regarding the twelve hours or so since the report the Packers have said nothing at all in response to various claims and contentions that cast Aaron a not so favorable light. They're worn out by him worn out by him. The story continue says Ryan grant, former Packer errands L was at a chip on his shoulder with Mike. This is incredible. Since two thousand five. Fourteen years because Aaron was mad that Mike passed on him when he was with the Niners. It took Alex Smith and Ahrends from no Cal. You're still holding that grudge. What? So you can't deny it anymore. You can't deny it. Put the cheese. Head down for five minutes. Be a grownup. K takeoff put them up pom poms down and do a better job. If you live in Green Bay of actually reporting on a team and not supporting it, not not routing, but reporting this stuff, it you can't deny it anymore. You can't listen one of the greatest attribute of Tom Brady and for years and years Brady and Aaron Rodgers were compared in Iowa said, they're not even the same personality errands, much, more Big Ben much, more passive aggressive, much, more heavy in a locker room. But one of the great qualities of Brady is that he makes really bad place. He's had pick sixes and Super Bowls. Tom makes big mistakes. He doesn't have the arm strength or the ability to escape things. Tom's made massive miscues big game small games, and he's had fights with his coach. He's had yelling matches with his. Coordinators, but you know, what Brady has the ability to do that. Aaron doesn't get over it quickly. It's called maturity skull being an adult not holding grudges. That's what separates Brady from Rogers leadership. Not talent Tom's thrown hair, pick sixes and Super Bowls and the next drive. He's eight for eight he gets over stuff. He fought with ballot. Check this year got along great. He said screaming matches with Josh mcdaniels. I'm not saying a little bit of errands. Chip on the shoulder is all bad. I like the chip, but it can't be a personal ping match like grow up get over. It had been ten year. Grudges that's just chain. Smoking hate you got to move on. That's beating you up. It's not beating anybody else up McCarthy's over at you're not. And there's another quote from Bleacher report from a former Packer scout that says errands become worn down and bitter about everybody's expectations and a type of Lee should be. He's Brett farve two point. Oh, he used to sail. Never be like that guy. He literally is. So I thought the report yesterday just a bombshell on McCarthy. And I thought it told me mostly everything I knew about Aaron Rodgers and I've been told by the way entrusted my sources night for ten years family teammates. They've said Greg Jennings is not a hater. He was totally validated. In the article. But if this puppy was bad in two thousand five. I mean that that's on Aaron get over it move on mature lead. That's just not acceptable. That's just embarrassing that that that's one of those things you wake up and read the article. And if you're the guy you're like, man, I look like a kid, and you can't have a kid running a franchise. Let's shift to this words are important. If I said to you full this is critical. Critical not the same as oh. This is desperate. Like critical is a doctor says listen, you have got to improve your diet over the next two years or you could have some physical issues. Desperate is. We gotta get you a new heart or you're dead in six hours critical is important. It is important that you eat more vegetables. Tell my son much of the disease starts in the mouth brush your teeth three times a day. That is critical desperate is. Oh, we've got to give you a new lung. Call the doctor immediately. When people go to the hospital, and they have to have an emergency surgery. That's desperate. The Lakers are not in critical condition. According to the articles, I'm reading today, they're in desperate shape. This story from Brian Windhorst says something. Historically, LeBron sort of been involved, but not all the way involved because he doesn't necessarily want to be known as the guy who couldn't close the deal in free agency. He doesn't want it all on him. Lebron has perfected the art of influencing deals without taking ownership of them. According to win Horst in all honesty. He's been recruiting players to come and try to be in Space Jam this summer. He can't close the deals some of the top players one in particular. They don't wanna be punked in the movie by LeBron optics matter for stars. This is the thing folks when you call yourself the chosen one and the king, you have elevated yourself among even other great players, Paul George chose Applebee's, and okay, see and Westbrook over LeBron. Kawhi Leonard reportedly more interested in the clippers than the Lakers just think about that for a couple of minutes. I saw an anonymous scout said yesterday the athlete very fine subscription based publication surveyed twelve exacts. Too. Many question marks said one of the scouts on the Lakers. Magic's destroyed the place they got rid of the Angelo Russell and Julius Randle for what Rondo and to get out of Timothy mobs Goth's contract. I don't think it's fair to say that magic has ruined the place but six months ago, they had a plan. Let's get LeBron. Today's Lakers have hope that's not a plan. There is a very real wheel of possibility. There are eight to nine players that are available to the Lakers from Zion kyri to collide Jimmy Butler to Kemba Walker to boogie AD Klay Thompson. Kevin durant? My feeling is bookie is there's if they want him. But I do not think he makes the Lakers a better place. He's combustible and somewhat toxin albeit talented, but he only works on an organization like the warriors who. Are so rock-solid that his nonsense doesn't become a tipping point and sway the boat. Off course boogie does not work with the current Lakers who lack leadership. But I'm reading stories and the word I keep hearing from LeBron. This off season is crucial. No, it is not it is desperate. And you gotta do better in that. We'll a possibility than boogie cousins. Be sure to catch live editions of the heard weekdays at noon eastern, nine AM Pacific on Fox Sports radio f s one and the iheartradio app everyone. I'm Dr Oz. I love getting to talk with you on my show every single day when the cameras stop rolling, the conversation isn't over quite decided to start a podcast in order to dive deeper into the issues, and ideas that I love sharing with you. It's health, unfiltered, my wife, Lisa will be joining me and together, we're taking wellness to the next level and having a little fun along the way. Listen subscribe at apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. I've said it for years major league baseball media. There's a few exceptions like Tom Verduci is a lot of romanticizing and not enough. Actual reporting NBA basketball. There's some really good friends of mine who do reporting like Mark Stein a lot. There's other people. I like Chris Broussard thing, but there is a lot of funding. But in football, there's real teeth to reporting and joy as you. And I this is not just about opinions on this show. We are journalists you you consider yourself a job. I am not a journalist. I think you're more of a journalist you sources, I I have I have source or shoe. You're a journalist you have. I know you do 'cause you tell me stuff that I don't know. So you're a journalist now, we may be small J journalism, definitely smuggled. We're not in locker rooms, but you have a bunch of I would say also, we don't do the vetting so much in the, you know, we don't have our hand in the dirt. And we acknowledged that. But we are because we're the home of great journalism. We are handing out something tighter done wrote, a punitive tough. Well source story on the Packers that took months to do. And I was just so fund of it. We are presenting for the first time ever bring that out. Please a trophy. He wins our first ever big j award to acknowledge excellent and hard hitting sports journalism. Let's hear it Tyler done. And let's bring him on cower global satellite network. This has to be a career highlight for this young, man. First of all look at the size of that damn thing. You deserve a ton of credit because by the way, these stories are difficult because I I've done I've never done anything to this level. But you did you call it. Let me start with this. Did you call Aaron and say, listen, I'm writing this story. Would you like to respond to it did how did that call go? Well for having me, Colin, I appreciate it. You know, the approach to this story, and it was about four or five months in the works. I guess when I started calling people in having covered the Packers for the journal sentinel lot of players lot of coaches lot of scouts a lot of people in the Rolodex. I wanted that perspective of forty five fifty people as many people as possible to just figure out what happened. I mean. How do you get from point a to point b how do you get from dominating doing whatever you want offensively to what you saw last year in the coach being fired. So that was the goal to get people to not have one singular agenda one way or another. We're we're we're going to we're going to hear the Roger story. We're going to hear the Mike McCarthy story, let's get everybody. And then if there are things to check it on things to confirm let's hear it from from the both of those individuals. No luck getting either tried. Both tried on both. But I think that to me the better story is that cross section of everybody involved to figure out the answer. That question just it's what happened and those are the two people that just keep coming up CEO. There is Mark Murphy. I think he if I'm wrong. He's a Harvard guy. He's a he's a highly educated guy. Very smart played for. I remember him as a player, actually. And he kinda runs the Packers. So he had to make a choice here. I mean, he had to make a choice not going to fire Aaron Rogers. So he fires the code. There's there's a moment in here. And I think this is great where he went to Aaron when he when he announced the new coach, and he said, hey with Matla Fluor don't be the problem. Don't be the problem when you believe Murphy could be five years ago, started realizing Aaron was difficult. You know, it's interesting Colin is when Mark Murphy became the president of the Packers. I mean, remember that time Brett farve is trying to take his job. Heck, and it's Mark Murphy, Mike McCarthy. Ted Thompson standing by Aaron Rodgers saying this is our guy when everybody is telling Mark Murphy, what are you doing? I mean Bradford just took him to the NFC championship game your third ten three. He was unbelievable instead by Rogers. I think he really wanted to be a president who wasn't involved, you know, extremely approachable guy. One of the vices team presidents that you'd you'd meet a western New Yorker. And I think that over time he just wanted. Ted Thompson to run the Roma's show run the football team. And it was on Ted Thompson, really he he never saw the forest from the trees, at least, that's the my reporting took took me a lot of a lot of people believe that he was so involved with the scouting so involved with the pro days. The draft building drafting develop. He did he never saw this big picture problem that Mike McCarthy in Rogers really couldn't work together. And that shouldn't have lasted a decade. Plus. Yeah. So he never stepped in. Now any health had a factor to play as well. I mean, I heard that speech was slurred. I was moving very slowly was falling asleep in meetings or people around to Thomson that really feel like Mark Murphy should have stepped in. We'll guess what? A Mark Murphy finally did step in. Yeah. Basically fired and quotes Ted Thompson, and then stepped in and split Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy long overdue. I think it's a good thing. Remember the fans all the team agree bait? That's the reason. There's even football in Green Bay. It's a unique set of it's one of the best stories in sports. But sometimes you need an owner to step in both the fist slam the table and make big decisions in so many words and his Mark Murphy way, he did that by the way, he went to Colgate and Harvard. He was also the AD at northwestern. He has a lot of grief from Georgetown. Remember, it was a very good player for the Washington Redskins. Highly educated. Just just a super smart guy who got stuck in the middle of this thing and had to make a decision. I think he you know, he made the right decision with Thomson ethnic. He made the right decision when you you know, years ago, I said, I eight years ago. I started saying this on the air. And I got a lot of pushback saying, you know, Ahrends doesn't connect with players in the sideline. There's a lot of I rolling, and I don't love it. When I when I read your story tighter. And he talked about freezing certain receivers freezing out receivers and go into devante atoms and not the young guys in developing them. That is really remarkable that stuff. I it's hard to get my brain wrapped around that. I don't think that didn't happen for years that was like this year it had gotten so ugly this year, right? Like that's not a trend of Aaron. That's just like a ping matching the last six games. Yeah. I think you're right, Colin and remember there was this talent drain the system worked scheme worked. When you have wreck Jennings one on one nobody can hang with. When you gotta Jordy Nelson. Those back shoulder throws when you got linebackers trying to cover your Michael Finley. When you've got Donald driver, James Jones, Randall Cobb, you've got all these players. I mean, of course, you're gonna win those one on one match up. So it got to that point over time. Where teams knew exactly what Green Bay was going to run. I mean, you've got quarterbacks calling out the routes. You wonder why the slant route died as a personal mental me they knew what was come in. Because the Packers didn't evolved in the depth. You'll lose that talent you draft three rookies. You know? I think that Aaron Rodgers got two point where he felt he needed to play superman he have to put that Cape on change place. Hold onto the ball. Pat. The ball wait for big play developed downfield field. But now the other side of it is you got to help develop these young players. You got to work with them does a Saint Brown. Does a valid scandal. Does a gym on more have that thousands of reps that Jordy Nelson had with Aaron Rodgers. Yeah. The same thing out there and make the same adjustment. No. But maybe. That's when you do stick with the call that came in you try to work without player. And yes, we wrote it. It sounds like he just locked it onto Monte Adams possessed. We trusted and didn't really want to embrace that development. So a couple of questions. I gotta get to number one the massage therapist stuff which McCarthy is denying. But I had a source yesterday. Telling me once I left the show. I tech somebody I trust. And he said, oh, yeah. The therapist was well known in the building. And this was a real thing and. The coach was often encouraging others to use the therapist. Were you surprised McCarthy denied the missing meetings for the massage therapist not surprise? I mean, what's he gonna say for one he wants to coach in the NFL again. Absolutely. And they're there definitely are players who weren't that offended that any Mike McCarthy was and those offense of meetings, and and as we wrote there was one I'll just call a prominent starter on this team who you wouldn't expect saying, well, maybe Aaron Rodgers floated that rumor to try to create a division create a schism create an anti McCarthy faction. So that speaks dysfunction as well to to hear that from player. But but yeah after Mike McCarthy, I'm seventy said has every right to say what he says. Of course, ten minutes later. I heard from a player who said that's just bizarre because it was widely known. It's no secret that you know, he was taken aback that. Jeevan denied it. So yeah, I I refer multiple sources that was the case. Even sources who you could term as pro McCarthy on this subject indicated that finally Tyler done Bleacher report NFL feature writer did a remarkable job. One our first ever very coveted a big j journalism award ridiculous trophy. And he's going on vacation, by the way, he should be driving now, but he did us a favor. So we do I know that. And I thank you for that. We'll pick up the first tank of gas John put that on our budget. Please. Okay. Finally, Matt leflore who I've been told is smart doesn't have a ton of gravitas to knock enemy wasn't great in meeting rooms, he didn't even galvanize. The guys wouldn't have a lot of alpha. But he's super smart. Sometimes maybe knows he's too smart. The concerns now for Murphy, you've got a wounded Aaron Rodgers who's getting beat up in the press stories like this. He's coming off an injury. According to the story, there's a little bitterness and defiance and defensiveness to Aaron and here comes this young thirty five year old coach I mean. I mean, give me a prediction. We have a minute left prediction for this year with that relationship is Ryan grant said it's not necessarily going to be the wins. The losses about how does this look and has Greg Jennings said does he make those subtle self sacrifices at the end the ball after running backs forty seven times in the conference Jansher gave us Tom Brady. Does does he play within an offense because I think the floor is gonna come with new stuff. It's gonna be misdirection. There's going to be motion. There's going to be row combinations. Nate Hackett is. Oh, see. I mean, you talk to this guy for five minutes and want to run through a wall for him. I think we'll get see the quarterbacks coach he's a straight shooter from everything I've heard the system is there for a rebound. And maybe that leads to excitement that leaves the revitalizes Aaron Rodgers it could. But I think there is some very expected skepticism from some players that at this point Aaron Rodgers with contract in hand at thirty five years old fully fully embraces and look. A tough division to the bears aren't going anywhere. Vikings aren't going anywhere. But knows what happens with the lions. But. It you make so subtle changes. They can be a Super Bowl contender. He's Aaron Rodgers. He's still one of the best quarterbacks ever. We're talking about all the stuff surrounding the numbers Tyler. We gotta run soda you. Thank you so much. Congratulations on the effort and the accomplishment. Great great work for you. Thank you. And they saw for having me on enjoyed it. What's going on everybody? John middle. Tom green out podcast. Brought to you by Colin coward podcast network. You like Colin show. You will like mine I'm talking all put ball coming up on Friday show. Aaron Rodgers is he just a fad guy. He AM is basically the fire festival of football. And Nick both of my thoughts on him as a player again three and out podcast for ever. You. Listen to your podcast with me, John middlekauff. So last night, I watched an NBA game, Milwaukee in these awful, uniforms. I don't know what the hell that was and they played Philadelphia and their usual uniforms, and it was a great game. It was a great NBA game. And it's one of those. You get about six of them in the regular season. You're like oh the playoff game. And these teams could meet in the playoffs. So I was glued into it. I went home yesterday. I was gonna watch this game. And it was really really good. And I could sit down today and have a little feel for it and say Milwaukee went on the road and one, but here's the problem. Jimmy Butler didn't play an increasingly in the NBA stars don't play. And so what am I supposed to take that game last night? I know Milwaukee's good. But Milwaukee last night in that game. Philadelphia needed somebody to make shot. Jimmy Butler didn't play he will in the playoffs. Philadelphia needed to make a stop last night late the chances go up dramatically if their best player or best athlete. Jimmy Butler is available. Folks when the stars don't care about the regular season. Why am I supposed to this is a classic example of should have been a great game. And you could take something from it and go hey late in the game. Jimmy Butler switched on Chris Middleton middleman because Chris Middleton, he'll get to the foul line. He'll never miss a free throw. But increasingly what am I supposed to make of the raptors Colli, MRs fifteen games? Well, what am I supposed to make the rockets? Well, Chris Paul missed fifteen games. It's one thing if you're hurt Chris Chris Paul was it's another thing if you're taking the night off because you want to take the night off last night, Jimmy Butler back tightness out would he have missed the game. If it was in the playoffs hill. No. But he missed it. Because it's the regular season last year. Golden State was the number two seat. What's it matter? Couple years ago, the rockets one twenty two straight in the regular season and they lost in the first round a Utah. One of the reasons I say the NBA got two seasons. He's got the regular season. As got the postseason. I love the postseason. I tolerate the regular season this game last night. I watched it. I was really jazzed up because I thought this was kind of playoff field till we about an eight great players in the floor. When you take Philadelphia's most versatile to a athlete and this game was decided in the last four minutes where Jimmy Butler would have been gigantic admitted stop he would've made a bucket instead of had to kind of rely because Ben Simmons the shooter to rely on jayjay Rettig who's good player, but they're not going to be relying on him as much as Jimmy Butler late. And so this this this this is a continuing problem. And I think it's a real issue inside league offices this load management people go to games the handful of regular season games. This was going to be a biggie in. It's like I watched it at the end. And I'm like, well, I can't make anything of it. Because. Jimmy Butler would have made a basket they would've design stuff for Jimmy or he would've made a stop because Jimmy's our best defender in like, I was just entertained for second half an hour. I was entertained, but I take nothing from it. And it should be this morning of Jimmy would have played you'd say so Milwaukee goes in to Philadelphia and Janas dominate Embiid at least late and Jimmy Butler. Can't stop Middleton you'd be like, okay. That's that's a thing. Like, that's a psychological thing. Don't kid yourself. Remember when LeBron James couple years ago at the end of the year, they went to Boston to play the Celtics and the Celtics had Brad Stevens any of the young young young young. And LeBron went in the regular season to Boston in was unbelievable. Played like, forty five minutes and they destroyed Boston. I think it was a Sunday or Saturday TV game. And LeBron was telling you in the regular season. Oh, no. No. No. No. No, no. If I want to destroy you. I will and LeBron today psychological stamp over the Celtics regular season can matter if the players care Philadelphia could have beaten them last night with Jimmy Butler and put a little poodle something in their head. He sits they lose. It doesn't matter. If you don't care. I don't care be sure to catch live editions of the heard weekdays at noon eastern, nine AM Pacific. Hey, everybody. This is Chuck from the movie crush podcast, and I wanted to alert everyone to a very special episode. I was able to get Mr. Christopher Walken believe it or not into the studio to talk about the movie footloose. Here's a little taste of what you can expect. And then, you know, I think you're talking about that great farmhouse dance sequence when he's by himself in the warehouse. It's one of the most absurd things I've ever seen. I mean, it's enjoyable as hell is a dancer. You know, I'm Hofer at hot. But. Yeah. This kid and he's angry. You know, he's very angry. He's been pushed I wrote down. I took notes and wrote down whole towns against him. And and it took notes for this. I did while because I wouldn't remember anything my fear. An ex watched that yesterday. And you can listen to subscribe at apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. Emotion media don't have a ton of courage. They don't like blowback. They don't like controversy. They don't like hate mail. Most people run from it. I frame mine. It motivates me. I think it's funny. And I don't know why I know a couple of guys in the media that feel the same way. I do. I just don't care. I remember watching people. I thought I respected when team Tibo one six games in a row, and I would go on the air and say elapsed much, this is stupid, but Tim t-boz following was so huge that media people like they were petrified to criticize Tibo and say, this is nonsense. It's not going to last. It's just a winning streak, and you have a lot of winning streaks in the NFL based on luck and timing and everything's working. And and and I just never never ever caved on Tibo. I'm like great kid. Let him play baseball, by the way, just met his brother four days ago. But he's not. I'm not building a franchise around a guy that can make a twenty eight yard out, then it's not gonna work. So whenever you get a story that you know, you should push back on push back on it the Cleveland Browns. Now are that story? So the Cleveland Browns finished in third place last year had a losing record or historically joke. The owner Tennessee football's a mass and the Browns are a mess. They both have the same guy running them. Freddie kitchens has never coat would never even interviewed for a coordinator job. He's headed for. And now he gets Odell Beckham. He's got stars. You've got an ego at general manager, and nobody will just say the truth. Ode L Beckham's not happy here. You don't happy look at it. Does he look happy? Saquon Barkley came out. This got buried in the story saquon Barkley came out and said he didn't react for a couple of days when Odell team it went to Cleveland, and he said, we talked over FaceTime. He just got traded. He was not happy about it. By the way, I talked to ode L Beckham. I talked about this about two months ago. He never mentioned Cleveland don't buy into this. Jarvis Landry thing. There is no NFL player that is more LA in New York. And Paris than Odell Beckham is an icon. He's a star is probably the most talented guy. I think he's the most talented wide receiver the NFL injury problems worry me, but nobody will just be honest about this Cleveland thing it has a chance to be a complete and utter dumpster fire. But if you say that you're gonna get major pushback from Cleveland and their fans because I don't know maybe because I don't know I'll hios very active on Twitter. Nobody will say be honest about this. This thing is chance to be an absolute mess. Freddie kitchens with these egos, and these stars in these I can tell you I have this as well sourced as I can have it on L Becca. He didn't wanna go to Cleveland. He wanted to go to LA. And I got this source in not happy. Eric watching them online looked at happy. Now, he'll make it work. But this was not as choice in. This is a bad organization that can't win and have been they haven't been higher. I think at the last time they beat the Steelers in the division was like the eighties like nine hundred eighty nine. So everybody if you say this people are gonna freak out just like eight years ago. I said and they're in Rogers read, his body language read his body language. Watch him watch Cutler's body language. He's hard to get along with. Then it came out. Jay Cutler is hard to get along. With now two stuff's coming out in Aaron Rodgers. Do you watch this Odell Beckham stuff and do just to a little sourcing on this? This thing as chance to be an absolute mess. By the way, NFL executives. We're quoted in a story who did this story. ESPN did a story. NFL execs were coated on the Browns. Here are the quotes. I know we're in the era of fake news. But these are people that would lose jobs if there were fake quotes said an NFL executive either executives in the league the Browns are like the guy you knew in college. It was super fun to watch on Friday and Saturday night. But you didn't want to get too close. I don't see a long term plan to retain players. I don't see a strategy. Just let's just grab some players and win. Another executive said, I respect adding talent. I'm just a Leary. A lot of this talent. Another one said, can I I'm head coach like, Freddie kitchens? Manage all these personalities, by the way, another one said on Kareem hunt. I think he was worth the risk to at least bring him in the building. But he did grow up forty minutes away from Cleveland where he got into trouble could get into trouble again, by the way cream hunt, by the way, got suspended in college. And he's been suspended the NFL. So he's got a little bit of stuff with him again, basic general sourcing, you can figure that out. But this is the story about the Browns. Everybody's afraid to talk about owed. L didn't want to go here owed ELS, not happy. The owners control-freak John Dorsey is a control freak. Freddie kitchens. Could be over his head. I'm not even mentioning Baker. Who's a kid? He used to baby. You're going to get blowback. If you say this stuff because everybody wants to celebrate Odell Beckham they wanna go to Cleveland. Wanna go there a little bit of their little drunk on the hater aid with the anonymous quotes on the Browns, while they're examining not edgy to criticize what the Browns have done over the past two decades that you're right? Okay. But visit a little bit. There's a little bit of hater Asian going on here. They have a lot of talent on that Rosser co. While you have to hire a new code code L Beckham's happy in Cleveland. Well, I don't know. I don't think I don't know if he's happy. I wouldn't be happy in Cleveland because I'm from Pittsburgh. So I'd rather be in Pittsburgh on to being a layer Miami. But that's that's neither here nor there. Sometimes you go to smaller markets like obviously trades are very difficult on players. He just got traded maybe needs a little time to adjust. I don't turn to go psychologists for Oto Beckham junior. He wasn't necessarily happy New York either. I'm not playing armchair. I am saying I have it incredibly well source that he was. I when he got traded to Cleveland did want to come to LA. He spends a lot of time in LA. All I'm saying is all of these quotes feel little bit like, well, they're they're not made up. No. But I can't even believe I'm like defending the Browns here. Can we just give it a little time? I'm not saying I'm just saying I'm gonna put it out there. Odell Beckham didn't wanna go. Here doesn't is not. I mean, I keep watching him. He doesn't feel like he's all in. Now. He's great, and he not gonna say anything and they're gonna and he's going to have a good year. But you think he's going to be there in four years. I'll make all make all all make a bet. Oh, I don't know. All I'm saying is Jared Goff was a bus and the Rams paying everyone was a disaster. And they were in the Super Bowl. First of all anybody that called your gafa buses ridiculous. Jeff Fisher Goth. It was terrible fit. By the way. I have not even acknowledged Baker Baker is not my issue. Here. Baker is not my issue. It's a crazy owner power. Dunk GM a coach what I think's over his head a superstar wide receiver who's gonna want a lot of attention and doesn't want to be there. This thing has disaster potentially written all over it. Does it it could go badly. But I would say looking around the league the Browns are not the worst situation to be in. No, no, no. I think I think they have a chance to be a nine win team. But I also think they have a chance to be a seven win mess. I I think it's going to take a lot to to bring all of it together. It is a lot of talent is a lot of coaching outer coaching matter in the idea that it matters. I think matters tremendous amount. And I didn't know that. Freddie kitchens had the. Was the right choice. If you walked in my kitchen, I wouldn't know forget if you can connect with your players the base of any successful coach to me is connection because all the Xs and os, you can put people around you to supplement that you have to be on the same page with first of all Baker Mayfield. But she clearly is not it's nothing against Cleveland. Like Cleveland guy, by the way, please send a zillion tweets to me a thousand million tweets to me, I'll frame all of them. I mean, I'm I'm in the strangest position defending my watch body language on Jay color, and I said at that dude got issues. He did we watch body language. Aaron Rodgers you're like their stuff going. I'm watching Odell in Cleveland. You know it. I'm just telling you, and I don't have to be a psychologist to watch body language. I know beautiful women I used to ask him out, and they weren't interested. I could figure it out. I didn't need to tell me they weren't interested. It's called like reading people. Can't you tell I think there's something to it? We did the body language thing with with the Bronco year. And it turned out that that was all right? It's correct. But I just think I think these things need to tell my bosses hate me. They don't have to tell me I can tell when we have lunch. I can read their body language. Jerry Lee Lewis v way, dead seditious incur. Kobe also did Amy wine-house Johnny cash and more disgrace them rock and roll true crime podcast stories about musicians getting away with murder behaving. Very badly is available now posted by me. Jake Brennan, you can listen to disgrace them the I heart radio app, apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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NFL Storylines  We're Overly Invested In

Around the NFL

50:31 min | 1 year ago

NFL Storylines We're Overly Invested In

"Around with the NFL jazz. Doesn't watch beaming. Welcome to another addition of the around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan hands this and joined room build with euros. Mark Cecil Chris Wesley hand, Greg Rosenthal. What is that boys? Hey, dan. That open. I don't need to keep poking the bear. And by the way, it's not even correct west watches thrones. He's our conduit. Yeah. I'm not looking forward to the finale like I would I'm seriously thinking about going all eight seasons and just not watching the last episode of that with the wild anyone's ever done that you I watched think four seasons and then for me right lawf-, I fell off and I blame only myself, but also the show. I don't I don't judge anybody for loving the show a free. What did you say? I blame only myself. But also the show. I like it. But I think the last show that I and this is a cultural phenomenon game of thrones, no doubt about it. The last show that I truly was head over heels for was mad men. And I remember those the final episodes not always thinking, oh, this is, you know, this is going how I wanted to go or not necessarily thinking sticking the landing, but enjoying all the final episodes because I'm gonna miss these characters you just want to hang out with the characters longer. And you know, you're not gonna get any more Roger sterling in your life after these last three weeks, or whatever I don't sense a similar thing or a same thing going on with game of thrones. And that might just be because the show itself is obviously so different. It's fantasy. It's wards bloody and violent, and I think a lot of people are getting killed. So I there seems to be and we're gonna get into it on today's show segment where we talk about what in the NFL where kinda to use a Greg term wildly invested in overly invested in a game. Spans Gregor so upset at seems about the direction of this last season because they're just so into the show don't necessarily blame them. But I think the after seventy six hours of investment that that everyone's given game of thrones. You know, you're you're the emotional connection is just making people crazy. They're rooting for their rooting for a certain things. It's just everyone so invested. It's like it's like the Super Bowl or something. It's like your team making it to the SuperBowl. And this season is the Super Bowl, and there's just a motions are high. I can't speak for everyone. But I went into the final season with the thought they had put so much time into this. They are so invested. They have brilliant people working on this brilliant actors. They have technology the likes of TV shows have never had. So the expectation going in especially with these mini movies every week there an hour and a half, the expectation is we might see television history. This might go down as the greatest television show a spectacle the likes of. We won't see for decades in. It hasn't been that experts. Those expectations are almost impossible to match that's part of what they were up against. But that's a good problem to have ultimately. Well, there's also another thing going on. So, you know, Shakespeare's globe featured players that's what they're called players. Are we going back into like the thirteen we go again? So like, you have football players players actors both of them are dramas, right? One more stage than the other. They both rely on tension and release mounting tension. Then resolution in game throws thrones. The last episode Sunday night the resolution was unsatisfactory much like the no call in the ram saints game. And I think this is the fallout. You're seeing it was a very unsatisfactory resolution for viewers. I think one huge winner is George are Martin. Because if I don't watch it, but I, but it's impossible to even log onto Twitter for more than three minutes without hearing every single person, you knows opinion on it. So I only call it from that. But the critique. Seems to be that since the books ended that the show is plot driven not character-driven that characters they spent all these time with are doing things that they shouldn't be doing otherwise saddles. If George are Martin who wrote the book sitting back saying, oh, yeah. I nailed it. The let these to show runners go in botch, the ending that is fair criticism hot. It's not my criticism. It's also like seven note nothing is meant to go on for seventy six. Alec this conversation period. No. I mean, it's fine. What about could have well that I don't agree with at all. I don't think ultimately it's kind of like an art. It's a form of art on some level. It is a form of absolute in. So think of all the greatest television shows of all time almost none of them were as good as they were in the final season as they were along. Because like, what's you know, it's like eighty it'd be like writing a four thousand page book. Like, I it's just you can't keep that level. How many shows do stick the land along can't stick the landing? Every single part of the show is at that. Same. It's a lot that how many shows can you name that had a satisfactory see series finales, very few. I love the sopranos at at that time. I wasn't trying to be contrarian or anything. There wasn't like that public opinion. I love the dead ended. Very well. I liked madman madman. Madman thought. So what happened in the final season was an awesome final seasons? Character arc for our boy and six feet under. I thought ended extremely well. Way. Back in the second episode of six feet under is one of the best hours of television. You mean the penultimate episode penultimate loves it up. Jumping on the right to fund word. They'll come. We don't pretend to be. I hear it. All this like, these guys, they don't know anything about pop culture. I'm telling you. I don't pretend to know anything about game of thrones. Settled down. Thank you for getting that out there. Mark you heard marxists. Don't come at them at Marxist or NFL, Danny of us. Yes, we got a lot to get into. Yes. So what are we kinda so invested in in the NFL that we're going we get him and keep it together? And it is hot near marks doing. He's got the not just me this time that should tell you something that is downright Prado. That tells me keep an eye on Ricky keep an eye on Mark Cecil because even when it's not hot he's hot when we are hot. He could pass that if we could put like some type of fainting couch next chair. We gotta keep Mark alive. Wheel it in. Maybe like one of those sprits bottles. We just have somebody requests too many. I think. All right anyway. So what are we overly invested in? But before that, let's do some news. So they're gonna lose that last game letting some younger guys play thirteen and three respectable for Sam darnold second-year. Good luck. That is Greg. That is the Mark Sanchez on NFL total access your NFL network predicting not only thirteen to three jet season in that in that game. They play where they hit the he went through every every game of the schedule. There are thirteen and two, and you know rested. All the starters against the best. That part is what I love the most. It was really great. He delivered it with a lot of panache, and I hope to see more of David Carr who we like he's been on this show, and he fostered a broker to peace between this show and Derek Carr. The raiders core back who had blocked, Greg. And I for a time, and then unblock us live on on broadcast, which still got goosebumps just thinking that moment. So does he we'd like to have a car, but car was a little bit annoyed? I thought that Sanchez was making a farce of what to me is the most farcical exercise on NFL network. Why hitting the button w? L for sixteen weeks. That's true. But it kind of made for better TV. He was this straight, man. It was like what's going on here? This show Mark Santa taking over Mark said just having fun. Stop him. Anyway. Good for you, Mark. I hope you get a job. But he's not on a roster right now. Right. Adam. Why not he's that's that's what we need on the knees. One of those featured players that the globe. He just coming in every once in a while trying to get that long-term deal. I do it. I think people saw just how inept t was with the Redskins last year, and he's not getting debt deal. He did going to be in the league elevate the NFL network. We're saying we move on from the envelope. Everyone's right. Yeah. Everyone was nailing. They all that different takes on what I laid out. But you're all right. All right. Let's get into a start with the Denver Broncos. That us have a Cup of coffee in Denver. Yes. Segue. Big fines, y'all on the head coach of the Broncos. Joe flacco the offseason trade acquisition will get all first team reps in OT as he dressed the media and made it clear that. Flaco will get those first team reps than we have an open competition after that will randomly play with the twos and threes when we do our reps OTA's began on Monday. Of course, drew lock is in the building the draft pick by the Broncos. So a lot of people are wondering how long leash flacco have. And speaking of Joe flacco gentleman, he spoke to the media today Monday and made it clear that the old reality show thing. I didn't come here to make friends. Well, Joe flacco says I didn't come here to mentor. Let's listen it. I think that is like I said it's kind of riches job, you know. And it's an it's an it's to be in that quarterback room and watch and that's how you can develop. Listen, I got so many things to worry about. I'm trying to go out there and play good football on trying to go out there and play the best football my life. So as far as time constraint and all that stuff. You know? I'm not worried about developing guy. Or any of that? You know that is what it is. And like I said, I hope he does develop. But I don't look at that as my job. My job is to go win football games for this team west you like what you hear? I mean, I don't really have strong feelings on that that I've heard that from so many different quarterbacks veteran quarterbacks over the years that it's customary that seems normal to me customary from flacco who said similar things last year. He does seem a little uncomfortable with the with the notion it may be annoyed and he's just a competitive guy in you kinda got the same vibe for meal. I man in when they asked him those questions a few years ago that he wasn't ready to give that up at that point. I think he lies maybe more ready now, I don't think I don't think Joe flacco is going to go out of his way to make it comfortable. I wonder if Flaco when he got traded from Baltimore thought, one of the advantages of this move was that he wouldn't have to be answering these questions this time of year that he'd have another young buck ready to take the throne probably was told that I look at it thrown. Mark the iron throne. I'm looking at a date here October seventeenth, which feels like the ideal date for Joe flacco to be benched. It is a evening game on Thursday night for him peeves. He will get benched through lock will step in with ten days to prepare and only a week before the by as well. Nice cushion for the youngster to come in. Joe flacco, I'm not buying this idea and west I don't mean to buck heads with you. I know you're all in on. Joe flacco that he's going sixteen weeks. I promise you if he goes sixteen weeks, I will give you you can come to my house and take anything out of my house outside of human being anything in my house cut that Ricky we're going to need to file that for potential if he does and I'm going to west this house and taken anything I want out of west this house. Do you agree to that west? No, I have some stuff. I like, yeah. What is work have that? You would take. You're not getting my sufi. Then I'll do it. The other way round. You don't have a car anymore while you stare. Yeah. I wouldn't take your car. I don't even want it. I mean, flat goes in a weird in a weird position. Because if you look at their talent, they might be the most rebuilding offense and the youngest offense in the NFL their running back as a second year player their top three receivers until Emmanuel Sanders gets healthy our second year players. They have a rookie tight end. They have a rookie offensive lineman starting they have drew lock in place. So this is about as young as. It gets. And then you have flacco kind of leading all the youngest. In other Broncos news, Chris Harris, the star cornerback. Well, looks like the Broncos are going to keep him around or do everything in our power to make sure he's playing in twenty nineteen at mile high. Mike Cleese of nine news Denver reported that the Broncos will not trade the cornerback. He's been a no show at offseason workouts, trying to get a new contract. The Broncos are expected to present a counter-offer next week might not be that money that Harris wants so Wes. This all pro corner. You know, he doesn't have a lot of leverage here. I mean, he could sit out mandatory minicamp and take a little pop there to continue to state his unhappiness. But if Denver does want to train them probably replaying with Denver. That's it. Everything was Copacetic. Until the Broncos went out and paid big bucks for Kareem Jackson, and then Chris Harris had to watch a lesser cornerback. Get a better contract in him. And he's not happy about it. But if you're the Broncos Chris Harris outside of Miller's your best defensive player and your secondary is night and day with and without him as we saw down the stretch last year. They're just not nearly as good of a secondary. If he's not there. But he's a, you know. You know, a guy. How does he right now? Thirty thirty coming off a major injury. It's always tricky to pay up like an agent player coming off an injury, and he was underpaid for so long. So do you pay on past performance because because you like the guy so much not many teams do that? I don't know Vic Fangio thought that his first year on the job would be minus Chris Harris, I don't think that was part of the deal in his mind. So you'd like to think they would get something done. Here fund is gonna get some business done fast. You let's move on and talk about. Yeah. We we now have our second deep dive on the Green Bay Packers and the culture within this one comes from Tom SilverStone of Packer, news writes for the Milwaukee journal walk each journal sentinel. Thank you, Greg and a really interesting breakdown. So Ted Thompson, Mike McCarthy fired. Obviously in December Ted Thompson as the step down or moved out of his position. And what's letter revealed as because he's dealing with some serious health issues? Mark Murphy, the president of the team. Had a decision to make how he wants this team to run. And and this team is run smoothly for decades. Now, it was Ron woolfe. During the Brett farve era into Ted Thompson. It was always a clear line of power who was making the citizens who's the guy in charge. Well, that's not so much the case anymore because Murphy Greg is put into what's kind of a three headed monster. Here that puts the the the organization and a little bit of a tricky spot potentially. We haven't seen any outward signs of dysfunction. But when there's not a clear line of deliniation of who's in charge that can happen. Your thoughts on this piece. It's really fascinating and his worth reading in full if you're into the inner workings of front offices, and I would say it's dysfunctional because the two guys that theoretically are as important as anyone in the front office Russ ball, and then the GM Brian Gouda cons. We're both on essentially unhappy with the job that they got that. They felt like they each separately felt like they were sold one job. And maybe got another one where they do. Don't really have the power. They didn't go to study was getting Ted Thompsons job. And it's not because he has a limited say for general manager, then you have Matt leflore over to the side takes a little fire in this one this too about whether he has a forceful personality, and you have these three competing areas of the team not on the same page necessarily. And then the thing that would worry me most about Packers fan is you have Mark Murphy getting in with the coaching staff and doing the types of things that bad owners, do he's not technically the owner, but he's acting like one a lot. I think one of the things that surprised me the most in our job over the past decade is the level of palace intrigue in these front office, the the level. The lengthy go to keep and foster power for themselves versus you know, kind of contenders for power and the same front office Guna. Guna interviewed for the job is Greg reference, Nick, Tim. Nick van. What is this again for new? This is Bryan on hold music. If you call Brian good guns, and you need to get through to him. If he if he's taking care of other business. This will be the song plays. Very proud of his German heritage a little off brand if he essentially is somewhat of a neutered figure inside the building compared to what we've it sounds like someone very powerful drop hammers under perhaps he picked that's before he found this out. But anyway, the interview he went in for the interview thought it was like Greg's at Ted Thompson job. He's going to get which was you know, all powerful job, and then was told actually notes not going to be that way. And he had to they had to wait for him to come back and say, I still want the job because it through everything kind of out of whack and then with leflore the head coach there's questions about how much power he had to even pick his own coaching staff and Mike Patton was you could perhaps see it as pushed onto a little bit. And then some other special teams coordinator the white liked quite a lot. And even the, you know, flew in for the interview, and then got apparently low balled and a contract offer and ended up being going to New Orleans instead Fatah cooks in the kitchen. It just seems like not every it doesn't sound like anyone's particularly thrilled with things right now. Now, if they go in there, you know, eight and three in November. Nobody's gonna even remember this anymore. But if a team sitting back to back losing seasons, if this thing goes sideways, while this is only feel like this is only gonna fester and become a bigger story. Some of these things take years to really blow up too. So even if they were eight and three I'd still be concerned with the overall structure these teams that have this sort of mix and match scenario where you don't really know who's in charge and inside the building there's arguments over who's in charge. And there's all these hurt feelings it can last for a year or two, and then it utterly crumbles. The worst thing like whether it's some sort of South American country or it's an NFL team when there's a power void. And everyone's rushing to fill the power. It's really it's really important that it's done. Well in the NFL in this situation concerns me number one based on every press conference we've seen so far out of Green Bay were. Mark Murphy is sort of treating Guti. Despite his on hold music and everything else, and they're young new head coach as almost like young children or or people that need to be tutored into the role in answering every question over them. This is your head coach in your at least media facing GM, and the if you read between the lines I got the sense goody might not even been totally the guy on boarder with the leflore hiring. And that he was on the side for that press conference. Which is I mean that that's troubling. I don't know if I'm a lot of it is understandable that you can see why. But it's how bad organizations star in dead. Ted Thompson having this auto pneumonic disorder, which we didn't talk about which is pretty serious illness that he might have stayed with the job too long. And then McCarthy in ball Mike McCarthy, the former coach where apparently totally at odds, and that created why his job is a certain way. And I don't know it's a lot. It's been Gladys success because since Ron woolfe was there, but Ron woolfe is no longer participating in Packers events in kind of is mad at the organization, partly because of how they treated his son. There's a lot going. I remember at the combine I two years ago when it was goodies, I run I ran leader. How you randomly see people in the elevator. And like the twelve year old, and you is like oh my gosh. That's Mike McCarthy. The Packers coach we were alone. I was like, hey, I really think your new GM seems like a great hire. And he just looked to me and like this door open. He goes. It wasn't that bad. But it was it wasn't like, hey, man. I think he's awesome. Dude. We're we're just like. In walked out of the. What hotels us we got to see if there's footage somewhere? It's the one. We always stay at an India Marya. Hill hilton. All right. I don't check hotel names anyway, moving on, Greg. Good news. Happy Monday for you. Some people got the case of the Mondays today. Not you Greg Dino's back. He knows back the Seahawks signed the journeyman quarterback. The former second round pick of the jets spent last season doing nothing behind Philip rivers with the chargers. And now he is going to be pro probably they'll probably be the number two behind Russell Wilson. But he's got some competition. You notice Paxton Lynch Lynch v Gino tobacco, Russ. I would call that. Totally speaking palace intrigue lip the coin. Sorry, greg. Well, don't be sorry. I think what teams are he knows better than Paxton Lynch. Even I'll say that I won't say that necessarily show to me, you know, what's more important talker action. You can lot of funny talk about gene over the years. Look at the action. What NFL you're not going to go back to the end. Of the twenty kidding me. By teaming about leadership. Void what the NFL teams are telling us. They're like if we want to pair someone with a quarterback who knows just about everything there is to know about the NFL, but needs a little something else behind them to really teach them the game. And Eli manning Philip rivers. Russell Wilson who they bring in. They bring in Gino. They bring Gino to help that veteran really be the best that he can be. Here's another way to look at it. If you have a quarterback who never misses a snap like in Philip rivers in Russell Wilson feel free to bring in Gino. Smith is your number two. He's never gonna play west nail. That will always defend that star Gino hat as a giant against the raiders. And that will always watch the tape watch the team. Let's the tape when he runs down the sideline cheering against Ryan fits pay was the best on the team. The best game giants quarterback off his own teammate playing quarterback because he wanted to play what a rotten teammate. I actually did a little bit of thought before the show and this putting together the rundown. Why does he keep getting jobs? He must be pretty good picking up a playbook, and he doesn't cost a lot. He throws a pretty ball. Throws a decent spiral when he throws it to his own team. He throws a pretty bowl. Finally in the Newsome, sad news. Former chiefs coach got Cunningham has died at the age of seventy two. The lions who Cunningham last worked as a D coordinator two thousand nine through two thousand thirteen and he worked with them as an assistant through two thousand seventeen announced the news born in Munich, Germany Cunningham, moved to the US at the age of ten and became a naturalized citizen two thousand ten he attended the university of Oregon where he played linebacker. But he was known as you know, a real lifer. As a coach in the NFL started with the Baltimore Colts. As an assistant spent time with the chargers raiders before moving to Casey as their DC from ninety five to ninety eight some really good chief teams in that mix in ninety nine he succeeded Marty Schottenheimer chief said coach for two years when sixteen and sixteen for more than thirty years Cunningham was a figure in the NFL Bucky Brooks. We joke about it. A lot on this program of Daniel Jeremiah having or not having a podcast here at NFL media long to talk about this one. First of all DJ wasn't. On this episode. It was rat filling in with Bucky that I think that's a great combo. I think it's something explore but Bucky played under Gunther Cunningham for a phase of his career. And he had some words about Gunther. So let's listen into the most recent episode of move the sticks. Look the NFL lost a great one because he's one of the best defensive Mayes one the more colorful personalities. He is a guy that I think everybody has a story when it comes to governor because he felt like he was the toughest guy in the room. And anyone who was around him? Anyone who was on his team had to take on their personality because look teams are really there. They take on the persona of their coach. And so having played for him you walk out with a level of confidence and a level of candidate bullying that goes also, look, I'm a miss him. Miss him dearly. He did so much for can't see and the rest of the league the way. Packed. It is said to see a great one. I just remember those late nineties teams his defense. Marty Schottenheimer got away with running the ball time. 'cause Gunther Cunningham's defense was number one in the league in points allowed two out of three years when they went thirteen and three I always feel chiefs fans have had some great teams of the years that that didn't get quite over the hump his defenses were awesome. He is one of the rare guys that was defensive coordinator for the chiefs became head. Coach went to another team. Then return how many head coaches return to their previous team as a coordinator. I cannot think of any other than him in these last twenty five years. Secondly, if we love hard knocks for what it teaches us about the coordinators, and the coaches and the personalities running the two thousand and seven chiefs hard knocks. There is no bigger star on that entire show than Gunther Cunningham who I had no idea who the guy was before it, and he is a raging bad ass through the entire thing. He's unbelievably enjoyable to watch. He's the same dude on thanksgiving. When Justin four set way back when. When against the Texans. He was with. He was with the lines. That point ran for that eighty one yard touchdown that couldn't be it. Couldn't be reviewed because swertz through the red flag during it, and it was a scoring place. So there said sorry that was clearly he was tackled to the ground, and they just show Cunningham taking the playbook and throwing it in the air like an old man sticking with this foot. Then a couple couple of either a year two after Monday night football shows up in this up in the coordinators booth chewing out fans that are like like ten feet away who are giving them. This guy was he was to me one of can see why Bucky feels away. Bihar forget them gut. They're coming home dead at the age of seventy two. That's what's happening in the news. Hey, guys. Lisa knows how important rest is to a better life. I you sleeping lately. Mark much better. Good. I had I'm I'm watching both my boys. My wife is away on business right now and the both slept in bed with me last night. Not a great night sleep. That's it doesn't a little eggs kicking you repeatedly arms kind of to protect your body even awake or not. When you little children in the bed. Gazelle gonna kick. You there little body? They're like little body heaters like space. You don't need that -actly. That's like what it feels like in here right now. I want to be crawling on the floor somewhere right now. Anyway, Lisa is the foundation of a healthy, healthier, happier. You all these products have been thoughtfully designed to go beyond creating a comfortable bed and to transform your bedroom into a sanctuary. You wanna spend time with speaking my son. My eldest, Jack, we got a Lisa bed for him. And you know, he's not sleeping last night. Not great. But in generally sleeps in it. Guess what growing? He's healthy stuff. I pointed all back to Lisa anyway. Then Lisa's most popular multi-layer foam mattresses made with premium foams or cooling contouring and pressure relieving support that's the standard Leesa mattress. So check that one out and just know that Lisa, please. All people should have access to depressed and relaxations. Don't miss out live healthier live happier by resting deeper offer today and get fifteen percent off your purchase. For a limited time at least dot com slash around and use promo code owned. That's L E S A dot com slash owned and guys. One more thing. I'm not going very far. I'm in a rush. It's too uncomfortable. Sometimes I just forget don't kid yourself. There's no such thing as a good excuse for not buckling up. If you've used any of these excuses or others. You're putting yourself at risk of injury or death in two thousand seventeen more than ten thousand people were unbuckled when they were killed in crashes. That's fifty one percent of people killed in motor vehicle crashes. That were not wearing seatbelts. No matter. What kind of you drive wearing your seat belt is the best defense in crash? Greg. You buckle up. Of course. Every time me buckle up. It's not cool. Not to it used to be ninety more. And I used the not buckle up in the backseat. And then one day. I smart up say, you know, what the buckles buckling back here to I grew up in a live and let live house where you didn't have the buck of your seat. But since I've been in adult, always buckle messy. Absolutely. I remember Wes. Was called you. Bob Bob's on on the show. My middle. Not get. There you go cops are on the lookout and writing tickets. So why take the risk? So do the smart thing and buckle up every trip day or night, front-seat or backseat? I added that in just a reminder buck up in the backseat click it or ticket nailed it. All right. I should add in my mom's defense that we're like nine of us trying to fit in a Firebird. So seatbelts kinda were. Drainings? My mom also came from a large Catholic family where there were six children. She tells the story when they would drive to the beach in the summer, they'd be packed into the back of the station wagon. There'd be a dog in there as well. And then poppy my late grandfather smoked a big cigar? There's no air conditioning. Character-building less helicopter, parental scenarios back then. Yes. All right. There we go. Let's talk about it. What are we overly invested in as we look ahead to two thousand nineteen at a level where? Yeah, this is what we do for a living. We should be invested in a lot of the subplots around a season as we look ahead. But for whatever reason these subplots of really kind of worm their way into our old brains, and I was going to mention like a part of a brain to just dress it up a little bit. But then I didn't know if it'd be mentioning the right part of the brain the north cortex like cortex would have been good. I was thinking what was the badeah thing? Was that part? You're on your Dula. I'm blunt got I almost did that. But I didn't want to stumble over the word I might have stumbled upon it myself. Well. Gregoire together gone. Maybe sometimes I don't have to you know, externalize these internal thoughts while I'm job as the host, and this is a somewhat confusing segment. And so I think it's it's good to set it up. But it's it really is inspired by game of thrones. He sort of did the intro ready right off the top. But just that people there into deep. They've they've committed so long with game of thrones that they're just losing perspective on things that's a little bit. How I feel with the Los Angeles chargers at this point. I've been predicting that this team is going to be one of the best teams in the AFC that it's going to go to the Super Bowl that it's got one of the best roster than the league from for so long that it is. No, there's no backing off at this point. There's no I can't go off of that. When they went twelve and four a year ago. But part of me does you know, the part of me that's not as invested kind of looks at it from the outside and and looks at that offensive line. It's garbage for the most part. And it was at the end of last season. And it's basically the same group coming back, and it's an it's an older quarterback. And as loaded as that defense looks and and it's really good overall. I do worry about a team that doesn't really have much of a home field advantage. And did they was that their best chance last year twelve and four. I don't really know. I can't tell because I'm in. So I'm in. So during today, I'm into deep can't see it, you're blinded. What about the idea of building into those things maybe worried about the way the offense played down the stretch. Yes. After that amazing. They peaked as a team one of the great moments and chargers history least regular season. Maybe you can go the whole kit and caboodle is when they went to Arrowhead and the buzzer beater win on Thursday night football and from that point on. I don't remember that offense being close to the same. What is that? Right. I do worry about that. They're a little thin. They have two great receivers. I believe in Keenan Allen. And Mike Williams is coming up. But after that, it's Travis Benjamin. And then there's a pretty big fall off it. It's just a team that you're nervous. I'm not nerve. I'm not nervous. It just looks. So good on paper that actually think. Now, I've been rooting for the chargers due out for so long. I'm getting some charger fans thoughts in my head, which is like it. Almost looks too good. Something's going to get funky. It felt like at the end of the year. The problem's two fold that they're running backs were injured, and they have one of the best most productive backfields all year, and they right out of the offensive line just fell apart and got exploited almost the offense was so bad the last four or five six weeks, and that was what I think separated this team. And the defense is really good. I hope Gus Bradley can take advantage of all the talent that he has. It looks great on paper. This is an organization where it hasn't always translated from paper to reality. Kind of like the last season of game of thrones. How about that? I brought it back around and Aaron Rodgers was the latest celebrity cameo on the show. I think he gets us. No, did you see wasn't that gonna be in the news? Forgot main. I wasn't looking for them. Because it was about game of thrones not some quarterback for the Packers. But no, I didn't see him. Well, the I saw quarterback for the Packers all time. Great. Yeah. But he plays football. A football player has no place in game of thrones. That's a whole different world that's mid earth. Everyone just actors disguise that hang out in LA and work on their screenplays suspension of disbelief matters more for me than most people. It's hard to pick them out. There's a scene according to to some again, don't watch it. But obviously should be doing. But he comes watch a show. He comes burning hound. You spent four or five scenes comes burning down like a left turn as the dragon is like tundra Rogers and burning everyone up according on Twitter. That's think anytime watching this would have seen that as Aaron Rodgers even if they were looking for it you'd have to go back. So the one defending Aaron Rodgers finally why are we so negative about him appearing on on a television these huge fan if he was dismissed it. Yeah. All right. It's like a little as a quarter. I thought he did seeing that they showed. He did a nice job awning. What's happening right there? He gets torched. It's kids hot in here. It is you say that some watching Aaron Rodgers get incinerated on game of thrones. And yes, it happened. So quickly that it's very easy to miss and Wes, obviously, that's something. You can miss. We completely bring the show. How would I know that? Erin, Ron onsite watching it no way. It's only been you. Got killed. That's the point. You're not supposed to know. Most of no that at ten and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with just saying nobody should be expected to notice that's Aaron Rodgers during the also think maybe they shouldn't have had them in shoulder pads in a number twelve jersey like the coffee Cup didn't help me out of the moment. All right, anyway, what am I wildly overly invested in while I'm gonna keep it real? It's got to be involving my favorite team. But it's a it's a bigger picture as well. I am too invested in the year two of the two thousand eighteen quarterback draft class just to see how this all shakes out. It starts, of course, with my boy Sam darnold who I'm really excited. I feel like he's kind of in a good spot where nobody despite the additions people still don't really think the jets going to be any good. So he doesn't have a lot of. I don't think there's a lot of expectations really built up around darnold, which is probably not the worst thing. But when I look at the roster, and Greg you hit the jets and the restaurant. They're better in almost every phase of their team from lashing last, a bad foreign twelve outfit. So that doesn't mean they're going to go and four, but I'm really excited, especially beyond lady on bell. And James, James and Crowder, the Adam gaze angle which as jets, and you just have no it's been so long since they've tried to build on offense with a coach has an offensive mind. I'm excited to see how gays and Donald work together Mayfield. And the Browns we've talked about that a lot. But you wanna see is he going to be a superstar is he going to be an MVP level guy. Unlike darnold, obviously, the Browns have a ton of expectation. So I'm interested see how he fares facing that type of scrutiny. And then the other guys Josh Rosen, I'm focusing on the first round obviously, Josh Rosen. What happens in Miami? Does he have a chance to Sal? Well, he will get a chance to salvage his career. What does he do with it? So I'm kind of really interested. How that shakes Josh Allen? Is he any good? I think there's some people that think Josh Allen is really good. And then there's some people didn't see enough to get excited about him. I he seems very scattershot to me an amazing athlete and finally Lamar Jackson. I feel like Dr group darnold has helped out a little bit. In terms of what you mentioned with lower expectations, by the fact that by the end of last year, I think Baker Mayfield, and you could argue Lamar Jackson became bigger stories than darnold tucked away on a loss Jeb team. But I would not say on any level that we're far away from it out here on some level. But there is no way that Sam darnold does not have high expectations around him. And he should he should have expertise there are high expectations. But a lot of pressure the scrutiny of the team be. I'm not talking about him. I'm talking about the team people aren't expecting the jets. Go eleven and five and knock off the patriot into different people aren't buying into. Now. I get that. But I do think there is a lot of expectation for a first year head coach and second your quarterback. Just because the talent around is so good that. John bell. You think Chris earned is gonna make a big leap? You got a nice receiver crew in Anderson in a new and who am I forgetting their Jamison Crowder? I mean, that's like a good. He should be expected to have a good season. This year, is coaches, it'd be better to I'm I would say this is the most excited I've been about a jet season in a longtime. He might have to go back to two thousand eleven after their second title game. We're just not as because I think they're ready to to make the make the move to be a contender. But just to see how the team plays and see how Donald develops. I've never had a quarterback in my life. Well, and you're not behind like that you're not forced to quietly back a total sham quarterback, right, which has been the exercise when you root for these quarterback free crappy teams for a decade. Plus, as you know, well, Mark. All right. Chris Wesseling, your invite Mark to go ahead of me, if he wants to because mine is more of a macro view sport it self bullet involve Shakespeare theology. No. But mine is very micro so notes, I I will go first here with with my thing because it is based on a smaller topic. Then the entire sport for me. I feel like when I get to way to deep. I cannot change my opinion on something even if it is changing. And for me, I am in way too deep when I look at the Detroit Lions, and I see nothing, but their immense profound untouchable dullness. Wait, you're into deep on the endless. I want to try to explain this. I think I have perceived them as boring for years on end correctly. And I need the team to pull off something dramatic to alter my worldview when I'm flipping through games. Whether they're live run game pass. I wanna feel something other than when I land on the Detroit Lions think to myself next the lions arguably have one of the top run stuffing lines in the NFC right now. Led by Damon Harrison, they have a competent quarterback in Matthew Stafford I like Carrie Johnson can golladay I kinda can get behind the Matt Patricia thing, but still I cannot see my way out of this conundrum. Here are few ideas to change my opinion. How about win a playoff game for the first time since nineteen ninety one longer streak than the Browns have about stopping the least interesting team in your division for once in my lifetime. How about consider the concept of not feeling aesthetically? The same exact dull trinket year after year after year and before any hamburger lion fans out Tom after me use should be ten times. More steamed than I am. How many Sundays have you wasted? Would you prefer to sip the most expensive champagne as the NFL crown is laid upon your brow or deal with another raging bull of vanilla ice cream comes September. It's going to take a lot to change my feelings. I'm way to deepen on this. It's like Saigon sixty eight who knows when any of us will get out of the. I agree with everywhere you said, and I totally get what you're saying that this could be the year. The lines are exciting. But you're too close to your to close to invested in this narrow not rooting for myself to feel that way. You're now I would love to feel different the rest of the league is become it's coming to the point where there aren't that many super boring teams left a lot of have gone out of the way to fix some of the Russians. For should be the the salve really for the for their, you know, boring nature because when he came in, and I was thankful that I thought he would save thanksgiving the early game. I was like all right. Finally, we're we're done with these lions quarterbacks that are lousy. We get Stafford in the nine thirty hole for the next decade. But I don't know, you're right. I mean, that's an underrated Marxist or storyline. His feelings about the lions. But I'm glad we export it. I just don't know if I believe it. But I think that I'm passionate about it's not going to be like I just can't stop thinking about the Miami Dolphins and their team building process. Like, I don't spend time thinking about that. And getting all hot and bothered over it. But the lions Zet annoying. I will say when I think something that is talked the lie. Shortly about this take since the minute this podcast started. And I'm not alone. Wes pigaso because of the way were indoctrinated in this country. We are minds tend to set and entrench as liberal or conservative, right or left business or labor. That's the bias. We bring into sports and the people who follow football closes tend to break down into two separate camps pro owners or pro players, and we lose perspective, we get into deep when we've you the league's issues through one of those lenses instead of taking a broader view about what's good for the sport itself. Short term long term as well as the most rewarding entertainment experience for the fan. More fans. More writer should be thinking about what's good for writers and fans not what's good for players or owners. What are some? I thought provoking idea there. What are some what what are some examples? Like, what made you think about this one thing a topic that came up a week or two ago? Oh, the franchise tag. When you were talking like that might be an issue that the players the NFL PA. We'll get rid of there's no chance of that happening because the sport itself needs the franchise tag. It will be an awful, awful sport. If quarterbacks can just go wherever they want like the NBA where you have these power teams and dream teams and only two teams or three teams are relevant every year. You can't do that and football. That's one thing. But I also think replays, another one. Yeah. Replay. I could I could totally see the franchise tag and player movement is is double edge sword with the NFL and the way talents dispersed and the salary cap. Good quarterbacks are almost getting their Kirk cousins, kind of put a no trade no tag clause on his contract in theory. Wilson could do that. I don't mind getting rid of. I don't mind a little more player movement. I think actually the NFL that might make it interesting that if better players got to free agency. But I think you're you're right about the replays that in this is across a lot of. Sports that I think you're losing the forest for the trees someone that hasn't watched a lot of NBA in recent years but like tuning in for these game sevens. I mean to see like a two minute delay to see if Joel Joel Embiid was acting or not when his I got hurt with six minutes left in the game was like come on. You're also let's wake up here. You're also allowed to look at the lady on bell situation and say, hey, the Steelers offered him a fair deal. He hates the franchise tag. But the franchise tag actually would have been good for him had accepted it and as a fan of the game. I would had a much better experience. If he was playing for the Steelers instead of sitting out all year. Let me ask you wit when it comes to replay. Because I like your argument that everyone it's great in in in March and April when we reconstruct replay, and it becomes more expansive. And it's going to address the stuff that hurt everyone's feelings a couple months ago, rightly so, but then the game suddenly when it's if they are going to become longer. We don't really know because I think there's arguments to suggest that won't happen. I don't know if any of this would be happening at all if it weren't for Twitter and stuff like that. Because in if this were nineteen Eighty-eight like the expansion hubbub over Minnesota in New Orleans would have died down about ten days later and been largely something people wouldn't even be communicating about publicly it states such a fervor and the owners have to react and the owners and everyone else had to vote that in. Like when you say pro owner or pro player, I mean, some of these issues are right in the middle. I with replayed. Like, do you want them to not be responsive to that kind of thing? The owners I thought they did at least they tried to make the game. I don't know for me. It's confusing. Their owners to me they tried to address. What was a truly beguiling issue for the league going forward? That's her. I don't think you have a lot of owners or. Right now like looking at the health of the league as the most important thing, which is a problem. It doesn't help that in almost every American sport the commissioners, essentially, powerless, and he's just a lackey for the owners. Getting hot in here again. I mean, that's the way that's the way it's volved over the years that like if you're an owner of the sport, the Commissioner is under your employees. That's just the way. It is. Good say guys, we have one more show before the Chris Wesseling accusa Jackson Jackson nuptials, by the way, your brother, Nick. Oh, yeah. I mean, I got him triggered he is. He is all up in his feelings. He's what happened. Now, he's setting me private texts. Now did saying how you know how badly wants to beat me, and he was gonna play left hand. But now he's gonna play right? He has your phone number two. I got my number the teach me a lesson, and it's just like, bro. I love it up here. Living rent-free in your head, Nick. And it's nice up here and roomy, and let me tell you something you're not gonna like what happens this weekend. It's noisy though up in his head. It's a lot of chatter a lot of chatter, but. Just realize the pressures on you buddy, the pressures on you. Let's say there's he's listening right now. Right. Yeah. Dick. You remember I'm the one with the microphone, and if you don't beat me this weekend. Next week will be one of the lowest points of your life. So you a Nick is is if we hear no updates about the game at all, you know, that Nick fared. Well, here's what's here's the problem, though. Nick, it's not a one on. Well, maybe you will do a one on one thing. But the problem is like if you and Nick are close battle that leaves me and west to to decide that the win ever in my feelings clear that I care less now about the two onto ELS their one on one court Hauge, and then just Nick, and I guess a little concerned about the top heavy nature of the Wesleyan Wesleyan team. Well, here's we're we're big time underdogs. I I don't mind it'll just it'll just, you know, make everyone more surprise when we shocked the world. But that's just the reality is we're also feels great as all mention to shows and road just to be completely knocked out of the lineup at whim by you hobbyhorses, enjoy yourself. Here's the tail the tape. Nick, clearly, a better cornhole player than Dan. We'll see. But here's say, Nick, not even in the same league is Dan when it comes to psychological warfare, and this could backfire on Nick if he's talking about throwing left handed because Dan might them force them to throw left-handed Nicol obliterated. We'll see. We'll see. I wouldn't. I wouldn't you said clearly better. We'll see because he's got to perform it's easy to do it when you're alone and Cincinnati in the backyard, but when the lights are on, and when people are watching it, and when it counts, we'll see what Nick Wesseling, Scott got anything in the heart. I'll leave it on that note. Let's go. Stan signing off for quiet storm the mailman you'll boss Hollywood behind the glass while you Nick Wesleyan. You don't.

NFL football Murphy Greg Wes pigaso Mark Twitter jets Joe flacco Nick van coordinator Green Bay Packers Germany Cunningham Broncos Russell Wilson Chris Harris Mark Cecil Chris Wesley raiders New Orleans chiefs