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"steve fury" Discussed on Trial Lawyer Talk

Trial Lawyer Talk

17:47 min | 3 years ago

"steve fury" Discussed on Trial Lawyer Talk

"Lawyers trial lawyers college lawyers. Who can to session on? Saturday and Mike trainer happened to being in town at that time us one of TLC psycho dramas. We all came together to work on this case and do the best we could with the limited time that we have to learn his story and it was hard because he's here alone. I mean he's families in Iraq. He had some friends here but he'd also didn't understand how pony was to have lay witnesses. Who can come and tell his story so we had to do with him alone and in that day. You know several hours of working Saturday with Mike Trainers help. And all the details he lawyers you know that when You do the discover the story exercises with people. You get to know them well and that helped. I think he sewing that process that the lawyers that we brought together to discover stories so that we could tell at a trial showed a Lotta love for him and give him a lot of trust and confidence in what we were doing for him. And so Dot created on and so when he told me at the end of the trial that he wanted me to visit him. I felt great but at the same time it was extremely painful because I feel like I let him down and He needed my help in ways to security's future and I fell to do that And he was extremely gracious soul. He's graciousness added to the pain that I was feeling It was more like he was taking care of me at that moment than taking care of him. So you've feeling that you let him down. Being met with his taking care of you tough it was it. It it it's it's kind of a surreal moment right. That here's a guy who Was counting on my work with my colleagues from the office. Scott Smith Steve Fury and others. Who wanted to really make sure that we learn his story? Well Yeah it was really. It was really hard. It was really hard when I think back. At the moment he solo helps me today at least two weeks after the trial to give myself a little bit permission for having lost his case that I least I can walk away. With the satisfaction maybe rather the fulfillment of knowing that he felt that. I care for him that I loved them and that I did everything I could with limitations that we had to really help them and I think he saw that and I think he was very grateful for that so but I don't think that would have been possible without a trial lawyers college. I don't think that I would have learned to care for him as deeply as we did so that we can tell his story right and we did tell the story right. Well maybe not. Actually I think if I had a chance to do it again I would do differently but I am stuck in this trial for different reasons. Not just because I lost a case for him and didn't end up helping him but The Andrew that I'm feeling today about how fragmented our country is was so evident indistrial and our jury selection was a complete moment of tribalism at his worst not at his best And you can see the groups within the jury pool how they were firmly in their positions and I feel like as a trial lawyer and someone who's gone through travelers college that I should have banned better equipped to have bonded this group together. Tell us about what happened. What they said so So we had A group of people that I would put in the category of Evangelicals Who also connected to police officers and they spoke about being completely angry and mad at anyone who would say anything bad about the police and that they felt that any criticism on the police was undeserved and Should not be tolerated and the use terms like anger and frustration and distrust for Any sort of criticism or attack on police conduct on police behavior. How did you respond openly? I talked to them about the fact that I understand why it's so important to have a police force and what solemn point to believe in the rule of law and I just let them tell me exactly how they failed The conversation turned out to be very positive to the point that several of them would say and did say that. If they were in some years shoes they would not want a juror themselves Which was a good moment and I think the only way that we could have gotten there was because of my training the trailer is college start. We can have a very genuine anonymous discussion with someone that they will be revealing those sort of Biases But he was opposed by opposing counsel. Obviously and the judge did not grant any challenges for cause in spite of the fact that what disturbs that said at the same time there were others in a similar position on a coup. Call the same tribe who refuse to acknowledge even though you can see it in their body language and their facial expressions in the way that they said in the way that they cross their arms in the way that they turned their bodies away from you though sort of things Yunhu That they would hold any criticism against the police against person that was bringing that challenge against us and of course when the core gets up and says can you follow my joints my instructions? And can you be fair and impartial? What is this person? GonNa say yes. Of course and so. They sat one of the amazing things in the jury. Selection process too was that there were people who have had bad experiences with police but interest. Selena these folks were Extremely opening candidate about their biases towards the police. And so they say similar things like you know. I don't think I would be writing this case because I think I would hold it against police. Those individuals were excused. And I didn't oppose that either because I felt that that was the right thing to do. That was the honorable thing to do. That is the thing that you do when you believe in the rule of law of course he hurt my hurt me the side of me. That wants to win to see them lose to see them leave but the right thing to do was legally they? They describe an internal bias that wasn't appropriate challenge for cause and of course they opposing counsel and the judge had no problems. Excusing this people so we ended up. Having an are jury. Pool was an extremely pro-police Jury but that's not necessarily a bad thing you know. I think what was a bad thing is that I did not know that moment How to best connect with them and I think that there is a way to reach him but given the moment and the situation I felt like I failed because we know we can connect with people who are different from us. Their stories are stories. Their personal issues are personal issues. did trials and tribulations are not different than anyone else's in that courtroom and I was not good enough at connecting that with them but I think part of it is also my anger towers. What's happening in our country? We're so divided that we only speak of hate. We don't speak of unity. A connection anymore and people feel more justified to dig their heels in the sand. And Say A -rageous thins because we can now And I liked that part about eight openness candor but I also think that people are not willing to look beyond their tribe and So tribalism worked against US this time around. Do you think that either the color of your skin or the way you talk or the fact that your client is Kurdish from Iraq had any bearing My first thought to that question is you know All God he's playing the race card you know he's he's talking about race but yeah race was very present. That Room Such saw that The few people of Color that were in this jury panel with the exception of one Never made it to the jury pool to actually sit and this trial I do think that The fact that he that Samir spoke with extremely strong Accent he look exactly from Iraq and that he was here alone and didn't have others present with him made him At the more vulnerable for the stereotype I don't know if my accent the way I look at any bearing on the trial. Sometimes I know he does because you can see people's facial expressions to what I say or do But I don't know I WanNa think that we could transcend those moments but I did in transcended this time so we have many tribes right. We've got the pro-police Tribe. We've got the TORT REFORM TRY. We've got different races different nationalities. How do we make our tribe? The jury's tribe so we can get over those differences and Kanak well we are all human. We all have Yet at some time in our lives we had a mom and a dad that came together and Made us we have that in common. We have in common our feelings our emotions we have in common the hardships of life that we all experience from being a little child who's hungry and cries to later on in life. You know feeling hurt by others or hurting others because we did something wrong at the end of the we are all really the same way not different There was not one person in that jury has not had a human trial or human tribulation. That does not connect us all in one way or another people have been punish. People have been betrayed. People have banned Berated people have fell love. People feel hugs. People have failed compassion empathy so we were all human But for whatever reason in this moment at this time we do not see itself as one on the same. We focus on our differences more than we focus on our similarities. And that's where I as a lawyer feel that I didn't do enough to really bring this group of people together so that they can see that we are all really one and the same and I could not get them to the point to see beyond the tribe that they belong to and see that we will part of the same one and if you were to do it over how would you do differently. Well I was afraid you were. GonNa ask me that question because I've been wrestling with this quite a bit There couple things that I think will do knowing what I know. Today I would have taking more of a leadership in the jury selection process Here's what I mean by that. There is a way that I do jury selection and this was a judge that It's new and he had said he was going to do some things. And so I was counting on those gains but he forgot neglected to do them and so I wasn't prepared for that moment And I would have asked for a longer period of time with jury selection and would have explained to the court why it was so important to have it I think that I needed to be more real with this jury about what I was seeing in a way that would not have come across as judgmental and as accusatory but in a way that I could said to them. We really focusing so much on our differences today. Why's that why? Why are we so focused on why we saw as opposed to what makes us all alike and I could assure story as to why and how I do that today? You know I'm having a hard time Dealing with people who in today's climate fueled justify? You know to say that Black Lives Matter. You know But I need to understand why they say that and help them so. I think one of the things that I would do differently. This time around is to to really talk a great deal of candor about how why we focus so much on the differences and not under similarities and see if I could have then Facilitated discussion with this group as to what makes us better when we focus on our differences or we focus on our common ground Maybe that would have made a difference.

Iraq Mike Dot Selena TORT US Scott Smith Kanak Samir Steve Fury