17 Burst results for "Stephen Kinzer"
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on KQED Radio
"San Jose should hit a Saturday high of 66 degrees. It's seven or six. This is fresh air. I'm Dave Davies in for Terry Gross. You may have heard stories about the CIA's secret experiments with LSD through which sixties counterculture luminaries like Ken Keesey and Allen Ginsberg were first introduced to the drug. There's a lot more to the CIA experiments with LSD, and some of it is pretty horrifying. Our guest journalist even cancer, has spent several years investigating the CIA's mind control program, which was known as MK Ultra. LSD was just one of the mind altering drugs that were used in the program to see if and how they could be weaponized to control human behavior. Many of the unwitting subjects of these experiments were subjected to what amounts to psychological torture. The MK Ultra program was created by Sidney Gottlieb in 1953. He ran it until it was shut down in the early sixties got. Li was also the CIA's chief chemist. Creating poisons and innovative ways of surreptitiously administering them. He also became the head of the CIA program that creates high tech gadgets for spies to use. Stephen Cancers book is called Poisoner in chief Sidney Gottlieb and the CIA search for mind Control. It's now out in paperback. One of cancers. Previous books was about the Dulles Brothers Alan and John Foster Dulles. Holland Dollars was the CIA director during most of the year's MK Ultra was in operation. Kinzer spoke with Terry in September of last year, when poisoner in chief was released in hardback. Stephen Kinzer. Welcome back to fresh air. Let's start with what was the mission of MK Ultra. During the early period of the Cold War. In the late forties and early 19 fifties, the CIA became paralyzed with a fear that Communists Had perfected some kind of a drug or a potion or a technique that would allow them to control human minds. This was actually have greatly exaggerated fear, but it played on something cultural that affected everybody that grew up in the early 20th century. We were fed a lot of books and movies about the idea of mind control that you could hypnotize someone or give someone a drug that would make them do something that otherwise they would never do. And seized by this myth, the CIA not only believed that Communists had approached or reached this Holy grail, but that the CIA should also find out a way to do it. So MK Ultra was a project lasting up to 10 years in which the CIA sought to find ways to control the human mind. They wanted to be able to have a truth serum that would make prisoners say everything they knew. Also an amnesiac don't make people forget what they had done and most important, a technique or a drug that would allow the CIA to direct agents to carry out acts like sabotage or assassination. And then forget who had ordered them to do it or even that they had carried out the actions at all. So M K Ultra was the most sustained search in history. For techniques of mind control. So LSD was created in 1943 by Dr Albert Hoffman at the Sandoz Laboratories in Basil, Switzerland. How did the CIA find out about LSD? As part of the search for drugs that would allow people to control the human mind. CIA scientists became aware of the existence of LSD and this became an obsession. For the early directors of MK Ultra, Actually, the MK Ultra director Sydney God leave can now be seen as The man who brought LSD to America. He was the unwitting godfather of the entire LSD counterculture. In the early 19 fifties, he arranged for the CIA to pay $240,000. By the world's entire supply of LSD. He brought this to the United States and he began spreading it around to hospitals, clinics, prisons and other institutions, asking them through bogus foundations to carry out research projects and find out what LSD was how people reacted to it and how it might be able to be used. As a tool for mind control. Now, the people who volunteered for these experiments and began taking LSD in many cases found it very pleasurable. They told their friends about it. Who were those people? Can Keesey, the author of one Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest? Got his LSD in an experiment sponsored by the CIA, by MK Ultra. By Sidney Godly. So did Robert Hunter, the lyricist for the Grateful Dead, which went on to become a great purveyor of LSD culture. Allen Ginsberg, the poet who preached the value of the great personal adventure of using LSD. Got his first LST from Sidney Gottlieb. Although, of course he never knew that name. So CIA brought LSD to America unwittingly, And actually, it's a tremendous irony that the drug That the CIA hoped would be its key to controlling humanity. Actually wound up fueling a generational rebellion that was dedicated to destroying. Everything that the CIA held dear and defended Even Timothy Leary, who turned a lot of people onto Ellis Diggy and help guide them through trips. He found out about LSD. Because of Sydney Gottlieb. He wasn't part of one of the experiments. But what's the connection? You're absolutely right. Tim Leary, who became the great guru of LSD first came across psychedelics through Sidney Gottlieb. Although Like all these other people you've never heard. God leaves name because God leave lived in complete invisibility. So Tim Leary's interest in psychedelic drugs was sparked by An article that appeared in life magazine 1957. It was about a couple of Americans who had gone to Mexico and found the magic mushroom that produces hallucinations. Leary was fascinated by this. He later went to Mexico. And before you ever tried LSD, he was using those magic mushrooms what he did not know and had no way of knowing. Is the dead expedition to Mexico that produced the Life magazine article was paid for by Sidney Gottlieb and the CIA. It was part of his effort to test all kinds of substances, including naturally occurring ones like shrubs and trees and barks and mushrooms and fish parts and animal pieces. As possible tools for mind control, So it's not surprising that later on in life, Tim Leary said the entire.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Endless Thread
"Your ability to put yourself in a mindset of constant existential dread has a lot to do with your place in the world and the time you're living in the years after World War. Two ended a lot of people felt relief. War was over is operation homecoming last official nation. Now the American eighty second division objective but at the same time the end of the war all the first atomic bombs detonated and the discovery of mass murderer and horrible human experimentation in the concentration camps of the Third Reich and while the Nazis had been defeated by the allied powers in the West. There was a new threat on the horizon to the east the Soviet Union by the late nineteen forties the. Us government was focused on the next war. A war that could include nuclear weapons. Americans were taught during that period that the Soviet Union was about to devastate us at any moment and could with the flick of a switch not only destroy our country but wipe away any possibility for meaningful human life on earth forever that is author former New York Times reporter and bureau chief Stephen Kinzer who says the weapons of the next big war imagined by the. Us government weren't just massive bombs people in the Central Intelligence Agency newly formed in nineteen. Forty seven worried about something much more. Insidious the CIA had witnessed to events on the world stage directly after World War. Two that had the spooks spooked. The I was the testimony of a witness in Nineteen forty-nine the Roman Catholic bishop of hungry was hauled up on the stand in a show trial run by communist powers there. He was facing charges for crimes. He did not commit weirdly. He confessed anyway. Weirder STILL TO CIA. Operatives and others watching the trial was the bishops behavior on the stand he spoke in a monotone seemed a little bit glazed. They looked at his face. They saw him confessing and they thought somebody else is controlling. This guy's mind. Zante became the victim of torturing and drugging that put him beyond the reach our realm of human health no the physical cottam exempt. He can no longer be saved. It is the other strange occurrence was something that C. I a. officer is supposedly witnessed among prisoners of war coming back from Korea. It wasn't made public at the time but some soldiers who had travelled from North Korea through China on their way home had reportedly developed what was dubbed a quote blank state. They also made surprising statements. Some of them denounced the United States for what it had done in Korea. Some said Nice things about communism so what could have made these Americans behave this way. The answer has to be in the mind of the CIA mind control so with this the CIA was electrified. Powerful people in the US government were scared but so were a lot of other powerful people who saw communism as the antithesis of Democracy Dusk Hue to the Party line and all will be will the vote yourself and all will be forgive. One conceived room passes very quickly over to authoritarianism with insistent urge to undermine the whole democratic system. Apart Dan is that is not a government agent at least it someone who may not have known he was a government agent. That is doctor. You and Cameron far away from the CIA as American headquarters. Cameron was conducting experiments with mind-bending drugs in Montreal on people who had come to him for treatment the LSD made her feel like her bones were melting like she was a squirrel trapped in a cage. She wanted to get out of her own skin and she couldn't get out of her own skin and made her feel crazy. But Dr Cameron wasn't just one bad apple using questionable techniques at a prestigious Montreal University Hospital whether he knew it or not he was doing the work of a secret government program to experiment with Psychedelic Drugs and torture a program designed to win an arms race and find a way to control minds for creating new human weapons weapons that would help the west fight. The Cold War. The war that powerful people felt the West had to win when the stakes are that high people put aside normal ethical and moral and legal considerations. I'm Ben Brock Johnson. I'm Amerson and you're listening to endless thread. The show featuring stories found in the vast ecosystem of online communities called read it. We're bringing you part three of a special series madness the secret mission for mind control and the people who paid the price.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on The Majority Report with Sam Seder
"MK Okay altered teams over to carry out these experiments. Now inside the United States got also carry out experiments although here he did not have the actual license to kill people because he had what was called in the documents disposal problem. He didn't have that over in the Philippines in Korea or Japan or Germany so he would carry out experiments often in federal prisons for obvious reasons using inmates. I found one. MK Ultra experiment for example. That was carried out in a federal prison is in in Kentucky in this experiment. Seven African American inmates were segregated into a cell and without being told what was happening to them or given overdoses of LSD. Every day for seventy seven days. The purpose of this experiment was to find out if that amounts of LSD over that long period of time could destroy a person's mind the protocols from that experiment we're among the records that have been destroyed. Lost I strongly suspect that the answer to that experiment question was yes I. I believe that I'm sure those people's minds were destroyed so the experiment would have been a success. What happened to them who they were? You're is something I don't think we'll ever know but it's something. I still wonder about every time I think about this experiment. So these were all ways that Gottlieb tried to find a way to create a void in a human mind. Only only to be finally persuaded that you actually cannot ever for example make a person go out and commit murder If that person is deeply opposed to murder it turned out that was a fantasy adapted from fiction and triggered by Cold War fears. Here's but the process of pursuing that fear laid waste too many lives. Is that what they're looking for is like a Manchurian candidate where they can just you know or or or what was it The boys from Brazil or telephone or whatever. It was where it's like. You know we just call up I got to do is read a is get this guy on the phone and then Say a poem by thorough. And they go off and commit some type of espionage or something Yeah that's certainly. One of the goals of the Godly was seeking a way to program person to commit crimes and and then not only forget who had ordered him to commit the crime but forget the DVD even committed them rag doll they were also looking for other example example a truth serum how do you get a prisoner to reveal everything that he knows and in fact Godly was the author of the first. I see Ya memo. Based on years of experience about how to break down and make them totally reliant on the interrogator creator that document in various different incarnations has gone all the way through Vietnam and Latin America and up a to Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo so in a way M. K. Ultra has definitely influenced the development of the techniques. sneaks that we now call enhanced interrogation have you. Has Anyone located. The subjects are victims of this. I know Whitey bulger apparently was one of those guys who was was dosed while in prison. Right Were there were there others. I mean you couldn't locate those Seven African American prisoners Were there others. Who who gave like a firsthand account to this? I mean I can only imagine the suffering that that you know those. Those host seven guys went through the worst of it is that of course nobody even knew that. MK Ultra existed or that there was some guy from the CIA. The IRA roaming around America and the rest of the world dosing people with LSD in various ways without their knowledge just observe their reactions and nobody would have believed them if as they had said so so it wasn't until about twenty years after the experiments went on that the first news of them began to trickle out and then at the beginning there was a bit of a series of people slowly realizing at. This might have been what happened to me. And you're right Whitey bulger's the famous Boston gangster was one person who came to this conclusion. He suddenly realized that. So whitey. Bulger's story is just one that we know you can multiply this by many others but it's one of the ways. I put my book together by trying to weave in the various stories that we have so in Whitey bulger's case he was a a young hoodlum in his mid twenties when he was sent to the Atlanta. Prison for truck. Hijacking there he. I was approached by one. Dr pfeiffer very eminent figure who was also the chief of a prominent department at emory university and he was asked to be one of the prisoners participating. An experiment aimed at finding a cure for schizophrenia. If Bolger were to cooperate he was told that he would have better treatment in prison and good time and so forth so he agreed. He didn't know what he was being given. All he knew was it was something that had to do with curing schizophrenia. Well what it was in the end it was actually LSD and he was fed LSD list. He just about every day for more than a year and later on he wrote a detailed diary for himself after he got out of prison is and what happened and how awful. It wasn't what he used to see in his prison. Sal How since then. He's had nightmares every night of his life and he can't sleep has to have have the lights on at night. We didn't say anything to anybody because as he wrote in his diary. I thought if I said anything they'd never let me out. But he's just one example and I discovered in no one book on Whitey. Bolger that at one point Loyd in the one thousand nine hundred seventy when the news about MK Alter came out. He realized that that had experiment. Had nothing to do with schizophrenia. It was a CIA experiment aimed mind-control any told the other gangsters the hung Out with that he was GonNa find that Dr Pfeiffer he's going to go back to Atlanta and he was gonNA kill him Pfeiffer die a natural certainly not long. After so Whitey bulger's never carried out that threat but he's an example of somebody who finally put it all together but what he didn't know was what was behind Dr Pfeiffer and that's because Sidney Gottlieb at that even then was totally totally invisible and part of the challenge of my book has to write a biography of person who lived in such deep in eighty. Tell us about operation midnight climax That is quite a name so godly was interested in trying everything possible that had to do with drugs and see if combinations of drugs with all kinds of other techniques might not help him understand ways to make people talk more freely and Open their minds to outside control at one point. He came up with the idea that he'd like to test the effect of mixing six with drugs. The question was something like it was their combination of drugs and sexual techniques. That would make commence speak more freely or in some way open up their brain to control so in pursuit of this highly scientific tiffin project he set up a Bordello in San Francisco on Telegraph Hill and he had an agent very colorful colorful federal narcotics officer set up and a ring of prostitutes who brought their clients up to this apartment and then dosed their drinks with LSD or whatever drug it was that godly wanted to try out that week. And meanwhile God leaves agent would be sitting on the other side of the one way mirror on his portable toilet oil it drinking martinis out of a pitcher and writing down what he saw. Through the mirror that was the extent of the deep clinical analysis Ellis's so this operation this CIA sponsored Bordello which was essentially your tax dollars at work. Work trying to find a way to protect America from Communism was indeed known at the CIA Operation Midnight Climax and really represents one of the most bizarre extremes of God leaps mind control experiments. I mean if if they were aware of this At the agents like what. What was the perspective like like? This guy's twisted were all twisted. I mean what I mean. Look the whole thing. Put aside the fact that it's some guys behind a one way mirror To a mirror I guess. And and and you know recording this. I mean what. What was their perspective? Was it just like this is a project doing. It's going to get a little weird but we have at at arm's length length enough so that we can say this guy's a freak and need just got out of control and he wasn't filing his weekly reports properly or something you're you're not that far off so at the CIA. I I realized as I was investigating the project looted this book. There's a certain culture that I think also exists Ayub secret services and that is that ignorance is often an asset. You don't wanted to know too much. It implicates you. So at the CIA. I think there were only a very few people who had an idea of what godly was doing doing. Allen Dulles was certainly one Richard Helms who was sort of the intermediary between God and and Dulles was another but a lot since those guys Dulles in house in particular understood that Godly was carrying out this sergent project and that they knew this would involve experiments. That would be brutal. The blood was being shed Ed. That people were probably being killed did not lead them to decide. They needed to supervise this much more carefully. It led them to the contrary conclusion. Since we know in our heart that these things are happening. We don't WanNA ask any questions. This is so important. That's why it's called M. K.. Ultra that the loss of a few lives are a few hundred lives is certainly a small price to pay. Meanwhile while by not asking too many questions we insulate ourselves and allow ourselves in the future to say we didn't know anything so in this way godly essentially worked without any supervision. I do think that would have been a mind. Control Project. Something like M. K. Ultra without a Dulles and got leave but it wouldn't have gone to such crazy extremes and eh this is really an example of how far the project was allowed to go based on the misplace terrors of that aid so aside from the story being completely nuts and it being incredibly compelling what when you when you look back on this chapter in chapter but the entire the entire saga What what is the the the? What are the lessons that you take from it are they narrowly Sara Lee tailored to just the CIA? Is it about sort of the way that people wash themselves of responsibility WH- whoa what's the big takeaway. I think that the ultimate justification for for committing immoral acts is commitment to a great. 'cause patriotism is one of the most transcend end then. Seductive of all causes godly. Lived at a time in which he all Americans were. We're led to believe that we were at the moment of imminent destruction and that therefore any sacrifice was necessary in in a way. That could be a little bit of a message for us today. We to now are being told that they're wearing a moment of special emergency in our country. Faces threats threats therefore although where you normally behave according to all international rules of ethics and morality and because of the the emergency we face now temporarily we have to give up some of our normal virtues and carry out operations in other countries that we might not otherwise have to do and we have to give up certain civil liberties at home. So it's a danger. I think God leave lost sight of a an elemental moral we'll calculation. You always have to ask yourself. Is there an amount of evil you do in the service of what you think is a good because the finally begins to outweigh the goodness of the 'cause I think godly loss lost sight of that and and it's a message not to be carried away by The fears of the moment and lose lose one's bearings by thinking that any sacrifices now necessary. Once you do that especially when secret agencies. Do it you so you begin to go down a path in which human life is devalued and so is democracy. Yeah and it's arguable that Godly made any sacrifices. It sounds like there was those Those sacrifices were off loaded to a lot of people weren't even aware that they were making them The book is poisoner and chief. Sidney Gottlieb in the CIA search for Mind Control Stephen Kinzer. Thanks so much for your time today. We'll put a link to that book at Majority Dot. FM Real pleasure fascinating story great to be with with you. Thanks in that goes back to our. Ooh I'm just got the Yes you have. Ah Okay in the interest of the option with breaks Oh good man uh..
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on The Majority Report with Sam Seder
"Sam Cedar on the Majority Report on the phone is a pleasure to welcome to the program. Senior Fellow at the Watson Institute of Brown University and author of poisoner and chief Sidney Sidney Gottlieb and the CIA search for Mind Control Stephen Kinzer. Welcome to the program. Good to be with you So let's let's let's start obviously with well. Maybe we should start first with just sort of the the broad strokes of the CIA's desire if you could contextualized. I guess for us the context in which the CIA came to be interested in mind control. This was an amazing project which ultimately became known as MK Ultra Allen Dulles. The head of the CIA gave it that name name because he believed probably correctly that if the CIA could find out a way to control people's minds the prize as would be nothing less than global mastery so it would tower over other successes of the early Cold War like overthrowing the government of Guatemala Milo or overthrowing the government of Iran he had this idea. Also that the Soviets were hot on the trail or that indeed they had already already discovered the secret to mind control so charged with this frenzy. Allen Dulles hired most interesting interesting guy who was the chief became the chief chemist of the and also the director you're of MK Ultra which under. His leadership became the most methodical and farthest reaching and most brutal search which for techniques of mind control. That have ever been launched in history all right. And before we get into 'em Kale tre and to to Sidney Gottlieb. Just give a little sense of of Allen Dulles. I don't know if people how familiar most folks are with the. I think it was a one of the longest running CIA director. I guess at this point and quite a character himself L. dollars was a towering hiring figure at the CIA dominated its early history. He came in near the very beginning. He actually helped draft the bill that created did the CIA and then all during the intense years of the Cold War he was the CIA director. So it's difficult of course to piece together everything that the CIA did and the story of M. K.. Ultra has only emerged in pieces because many of the records were destroyed in an effort to make sure that none of this ever came out Allen Dulles however we can now say was obsessed fast with this idea he considered the top priority of the CIA. And that's why he gave Sydney God leave the director of Kale. What amounted to a license to kill? In the course of God leaves experiments he was allowed to requisition human human subjects. Not just in the United States but across Europe in an East Asia where the CIA maintained secret detention the centers where M. K. ultra experiments were carried out and these this network allowed godly to have have essentially uncontrolled power. As long as he was carrying out experiments that were aimed at at doing something that he thought was a prerequisite to finding the key to mind control godly believed and Allen Dulles allowed him mm to go in this direction that before you could find a way to insert a new mind into somebody's brain you. I had to find away to destroy or blast away the mind that was already in there. So that was the goal of his experiments and He spent ten years trying to find ways to use drugs. Electroshock all kinds of other techniques in in ways that would allow them to destroy a human mind spirit and body and he did that for ten years before finally concluding including in the end in the early nineteen sixties that actually mind control is a myth and the entire search had been fruitless. We'll go through some of the the details of that ten years but how I made by two questions is one is like you know why. I specifically Sidney GOTTLIEB and two are are there. Is it possible. There are other Sydney Sydney. GOTTLIEB's out there that we don't know about Well first of all you ask why Sidney Gottlieb and that is a fascinating question. Because I truly believe that I have stumbled on the most powerful unknown American of the twentieth century. There can't can't have been anybody else who was allowed the freedom to do the things that he did on his own without really having any supervision at all so godly Libro was brought in to the CIA as a thirty two year old chemist in one thousand nine hundred fifty one but he was a very different figure from just about everybody else in the top of the early CIA. All of those gentlemen knew each other from the silver spoon wound background of the same private schools and investment banks law firms. Godly was different He was the son of Orthodox Jewish immigrants in the Bronx. He went to City College. He limped he spurred. I heard he was a very different figure from the other officers of that era and he also had a very strange personal life. The way he lived was probably different from every other federal bureaucrat. In nineteen fifties Washington. He lived in a a little cabin in the woods. With no running water. He was living at peace with the environment. He considered himself a compassionate Shen at humanist. He grew his own vegetables. He got up before dawn to milk goats so he can make yogurt. He meditated so by day he was carrying out the most intense in experiments on human subjects. That have ever been conducted did by any agency or officer of the US government and by night he was living this life of the contempt of of father other and husband who lived off the land and were in spiritually in touch with all the world around them. So they jekyll and Hyde anything going in a big way and your second question could there be other God leaves. I tell you something. This story is shocking. Even to to me in this is this book is my Tenth Book. But it's the first book I've written hit that I'm shocked by. I still can't believe that all of this happened and and as I turned it over in my mind during the years I've been working on this project naturally. I've asked myself the question that you asked. So if the lead then think of how much further advanced is the secret world and the how far further further along the technology is how much vaster is the computer potential so it would be naive to think that Got Leave as the CIA later tried to present him was just one crazy. Guy Who manage just slipped through the net of the CIA. Hi is that normally make sure that nothing. This extreme APPs that it's certainly plausible and probable. I would say that maybe maybe a generation or two. They'll be somebody exactly like me into being in having a chat with somebody exactly like you talking about something that's happening was happening happening in two thousand nine hundred nineteen but people back then didn't know anything about well in to that point and I want to get to the details of the story that do make it so shocking but but the but is it possible that there was other Gottlieb's contemporaneous like I mean we. You know we know you know. I just wonder like they didn't do. They certainly tried right to cover up all of the existence of this program. I wonder if it's possible that there were others. They just they were more successful. With at the end of God leaves career. He had to appear before a couple of congressional rational investigator investigating committees. He was able to do this in private and he never really had to touch any of the most sensitive things that he had done however he did complain that In many of the documents with which he was confronted there were various various signatures. All were blacked out and redacted as they say except for his and he kept saying why why me why my mind is my signature. The only one that nobody ever blacked out when he decided to release these documents and that made him reflect back on something we just talked talked about which is how different he was. What an outsider? He was at the CIA. I think that when the truth. MK Alter Begin to come out in drips and drabs. The response was to say well as actually as William Colby. The director said when asked asked about this once by some M. K.. Ultra victims. Some of our people were out of control in those days. There were problems of supervision vision so essentially this is a way to avoid all institutional responsibility and say well it was all God leaps fault. Could there have been others. I I don't think there was anybody running a program like this. Because GOTTLIEB had authority to travel round around Europe and East Asia directing experiments like none that have ever been conducted in the US government. So he really was a person who not not only carried out these experiments but conceived the entire program and I tell you one of his favourite draw. He's probably his all time. Favorite drug doc was LSD which he himself said he used at least two hundred times. And when I read that I started reflecting on how Bizarre Arwa where some of these horrific experiments that he carried out I had even asked myself when when wondering how you could conceive of these. He's experiments did he conceive of some of them while he was actually using LSD on his favourite drug and then his lettings mind go off in this grotesque tests direction. Well let's let's talk about an M. K.. Ultra so the IT sets out. He's tasked right with with this idea of like learn to we want you to learn how to brainwash people But you know before we can implant ideas in their minds we have to break. Take them down so was it his. He then decided like okay. Well then I need to. I'm going to use a wide range of techniques to do it like. Let's let's go through some of those. I mean you've touched on is just like a basically dosing people and but but go through the Langston Exton How long over? The course os ten years was LSD. Like okay we're going to start with every patient that we have every subject of this experiment is GonNa get L. Day Day and then we're going to do other things or was it. Cocktails of of different drugs are what was his. I guess scientific approach first thing he did was to ask himself like a good scientists. What research already exists? So who's out there. That's it's already an expert in this field and the field is how to destroy a human mind and soul and human body and how to use drugs rugs to do that and try to control people. Well the obvious answer was the Nazi doctors who carried out experiments in the concentration camps fs and those Nazi doctors along with some of their Japanese counterparts came to work for MK. Ultra projects. And and I tell you I while doing the research for this book visited what I think was the first CIA Secret Prison Beautiful Chatelaine. Hey in Germany and the young German businessman who owns it took me down into the basement. And he said to these were the cells in which the the MK Ultra doctors and their Nazi counterparts. Carry out experiments that were just continuations of the experiments that those same aim Nazi doctors had been carrying out just a few years earlier. This is nineteen fifty two. And exactly we're right in the early nineteen fifties now. So what kinds of experiments were the so for example a in that safe house or others like in Germany Germany. An experiment like this might be carried out. I found one in which people were. The victims were placed in a sensory deprivation chamber like a coffin and then injected with barbiturates so they will get fall into a deep coma then after a period. I'd like that. They would be suddenly injected with overdoses of amphetamines. That would make them hyper active. And while they were in the transition phase between coma and hyperactivity they were given overdoses of electric shock to see if this whole combination delivered at that moment might be something that could destroy a person's mind or kill someone and in fact the German businessmen. I was telling you about who owns what was then the CIA Torture House told me people in the neighborhood. The older residents have told me that in the forest around here is where they buried read the victims who were experimented to death and most of those places are now covered by shopping malls and apartment blocks so no those were victims who the CIA documents charmingly call expendable 's lie refugees who nobody was connected to or suspected enemy agents that the CIA had captured in East Asia. Many of the victims were North Korean prisoners listeners of war so godly had the right essentially requisition people to carry out experiments and then he would go over or send other..
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on WNYC 93.9 FM
"Time there was a chronic shortage of providers one Indiana Medical Center has found a workaround. how are you doing today telus psychiatry in my opinion dyslexic hi Mary Louise Kelley that story this afternoon on All Things Considered from NPR news. starting at four on W. NYC. this is fresh air and if you're just joining us my guest is Stephen Kinzer were talking about his new book poisoner in chief Sidney Gottlieb and the CI a search for mind control got leave created the M. K. ultra program which experimented with psychoactive drugs like LSD to see what the effects were with the goal of learning a fallacy could be weaponized as a form of mind control. it wasn't just a question of administering the super high doses of LSD for very extended periods of time there was also like questioning and other kind of testing that went along with the administration of these high does this tell us about that. god leave and the C. I. A. established secret detention centers throughout Europe and East Asia particularly in Japan and Germany in the Philippines which were largely under American control in the period of the early fifties and therefore godly didn't have to worry about any legal entanglements in these places he carried out his most extreme experiments some undoubtedly fatal we don't know how many people died but I number did and many lives were permanently destroyed so what you found in these Europe experiments was a confluence of two interests both that doctor preoccupied the CIA number one was got leaves desire to find the two the key to mind control which the CIA considered its absolute greatest project and most important priority second CIA officers in Europe and Asia we're capturing enemy agents and others who they felt might be a suspect in persons or were otherwise what they called expendable they would grab these people and throw them into cells and then test all kinds of not just drug potions but other techniques like electroshock extremes of temperature sensory isolation all the mean time bombarding them with questions trying to see if they could break down resistance and find a way to destroy the human ego so these were a projects designed not only to understand the human but to vow to destroy it and that may god leave although in some ways a very compassionate person certainly the most prolific torturer of his generation. and were there any guidelines in effect in the US that would have made it illegal had people known what he was doing this is one of the most remarkable aspects of the got leave story he operator almost completely without supervision he had sort of a check a jeweler boss and from Israel boss Richard Helms and from the CIA director Allen Dulles but none of them really wanted to know what he was doing this guy had a license to kill he was allowed to requisition human subjects across the United States and around the world and subject them to any kind of abuse that he wanted even up to the level of it being fatal yet nobody will looked over his shoulder he never had to file serious reports to anybody I think the mentality must've been this project is so important. mind control if it can be mastered is the key to global world power that the idea of a disturbing a few lives or losing even a few hundred lives could not be seen as important enough to outweigh that imperative only when you get caught up in a clause like that that allows you to put aside conscience and all other moral considerations and even serious scientific considerations can you allow yourself to get caught up in a situation like this where one person is allowed on his own whim to go out and torture and kill people and the people who might be supervising him really don't want to hear about it for reasons that have to do with the old C. I. A. code which is the code of all secret services the less you know the better you're not implicated as a result of this godly was allowed to work for ten years without anybody supervising him or even really being aware or wanting to be aware of what he was doing. so it before Sidney Gottlieb started experimenting with LSD he ran C. I. A. experiments with marijuana cocaine heroin masculine. I guess those didn't work as mind control drugs. he was trying everything he not only use the drugs that you mentioned but extreme forms of stimulants and sedatives one of the techniques they tested in Europe was to send data person to the call must state and then feed him extreme doses of stimulants and then when the person was in the transition phase between comatose and hyper active they would electro shock him with a very high doses hoping that maybe this combination would be the thing that could blow away a person's mind so. the CI a and got leave in particular and at were limited only by their own imagination god leaves imagination ran wild he himself used LSD by his own estimate about at least two hundred times so is managing nation was very fertile and under the conditions of his employment he was allowed to pursue any form of experimentation then you could imagine. my guest is Stephen Kinzer his new book is called poisoner in chief Sidney Gottlieb and the CI a search for mind control after a break we'll talk about how got leave thought LST could be weaponized to weaken world leaders and how he created poisons that can be used to assassinate them I'm Terry gross and this is fresh AIR..
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on WNYC 93.9 FM
"I'm David grain. And I'm Steve Inskeep next. We have the story behind some of the latest news, the United States confrontation with Iran. On is the latest chapter in a forty year old story forty years old this year, February is the anniversary of the nineteen seventy nine revolution. When an Islamist anti-american government took power. But really the story is even older than that. Because that anti-americanism in Iran goes back to an event in nineteen fifty three which we are about to discuss with the hosts of NPR's new history podcast. It's called through line and the hosts are Ramtane Arab Louis. Welcome. Thank you. And Rhonda Abdelfatta. Good morning to you. Okay. So what was happening in Iran in nineteen Fifty-three well up until nineteen Fifty-three, the US and Iran didn't have much of a relationship. But then there was the issue of oil specifically Great Britain's interests in Iran in terms of oil see for a very long time for decades, Great Britain controlled most of Iran's oil Reese, British Petroleum VP. There were originally called the Anglo Persian oil company and the Anglo Persian oil company how to deal with the running. Around oil that really favored British interests Iran didn't take much money away from the oil revenues. Anyway, there was an Iranian politician named Mohammed Masada who had been railing against this deal for a very long time. Eventually he was able to convince the Iranian parliament to nationalize the oil industry. And then he became prime minister. And then he shut down the British embassy because he was afraid that they were gonna use the embassy to state some kind of government the British lost their foothold there. And so they saw it as a real threat they sought help from their big brother across the Atlantic. Americans do because they were there closest ally in because this is all happening during Cold War and Iran happened to share a border with the Soviet Union. They've actually agreed and one of the greatest names in American history gets involved in the story at this point. Right. That's right. Kermit Roosevelt related to the famous. Exactly. He was a CIA agent who was tasked with going to Ron and overthrowing the Mossad the government and reinstating the shower Iran's kin who had been kind of shoved away from power at that moment. Exactly. They wanted to basically consolidate power in his hands because he was friendly to the west. So we spoke to Stephen Kinzer, an author who wrote a definitive book on this topic called all the Shah's men like how exactly do you overthrow a government? So he took us through it. Step by step step, one sees control of the Iranian press. Basically buy them off with bribes turned out that the press was quite corrupt step to recruit allies on the ground. Most important. The Islamic clergy or melas Kermit Roosevelt made strategic payments to a number of important Mola's in exchange for them delivering servants denouncing most a deck from the pulpit as against God. And your religious step three get Iran's king.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on KCRW
"A cell phone. Southern California weather excel for some low temperature is a typical southern California day coming your way, we'll have lots of sunshine today and tomorrow, clear skies tonight. Hi day around sixty overnight lows in the low to mid forty even highs tomorrow also around sixty right now, clear forty one in downtown. Los Angeles time is four fifty one. This is morning edition from NPR news. I'm David green. And I'm Steve Inskeep next. We have the story behind some of the latest news. The United States confrontation with Iran is the latest chapter in a forty year old story forty years old this year, February is the anniversary of the nineteen seventy nine revolution. When it has Llamas. Anti-american government took power the really the story is even older than that. Because that anti-americanism in Iran goes back to an event in nineteen fifty three which we are about to discuss with a hosts of NPR's new history podcast. It's called through line and the hosts are Ramtane Arab Louis. Welcome. Thank you. And Rhonda Abdelfatta. Good morning to you. Okay. So what was happening in Iran in nineteen Fifty-three well up until nineteen fifty three the US and Iran didn't have much of a relationship. But then there was the issue of oil specifically Great Britain's interests in Iran in terms of oil see for. A very long time for decades great bring controlled most of Iran's oil resources British Petroleum BP. There were originally called the Anglo Persian oil company, and the Anglo Persian oil company had to deal with the Iranian government around oil that really favored British interests Iran didn't take much money away from the oil revenues. Anyway, there was an Iranian politician named Mohammed Atta who had been railing against this deal for very long time. Eventually he was able to convince the Iranian parliament to nationalize their oil industry. And then he became prime minister. And then he shut down the British embassy because he was afraid that they were gonna use the embassy to stage some kind of government the British lost their foothold there. And so they saw it as a real threat they sought help from their big brother there began across the Atlantic. The Americans do because they were there closest ally in because happening during the Cold War and Iran happened to share a border with the Soviet Union. Eventually agreed and one of the greatest names in American history. He gets involved in the story at this point. Right. That's right. Kermit Roosevelt related to. Exactly, he was a CIA agent who was tasked with going to Iran and overthrowing them without the government and reinstating the or Iran's king who had been kind of shoved away from power at that moment, they wanted to basically consolidate power in his hands because he was friendly to the west. So we spoke to Stephen Kinzer, an author who wrote the definitive book on this topic called all the Shah's men like how xactly the overthrow a government. So he took us. Do it. Step by step step one seize control of the Iranian press. Basically buy them off with bribes turned out that the phrase was quite corrupt step to recruit allies on the ground. Most importantly, the Slama clergy or mullah's Kermit Roosevelt made strategic payments to a number of important Mola's in exchange for them delivering sermons denouncing Mosa deck from the pulpit against God. And here religious step three get Iran's king the Shah on board. Roosevelt took matters into his own hands began meeting with the Shaw almost every day at midnight and a taxi cab always in a different location Roosevelt managed to convince the Shah that most idea was a threat. And so the Shah agreed to the crew and finally step for go to done house in the middle of the night arrest him and put a puppet ruler in his place. But this whole first attempt fails Roosevelt's bosses back in Washington. Tell him he can come home instead.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Monocle 24: The Briefing
"I'm markus. Hip. Coming up on today's broke. Cram. We'll be asking whether the United States is running the risk of being tracked into conflict in Venezuela. Also ahead, we'll examine how the French president. Emmanuel Macron is attempting to watch the country's yellow best demonstrators. Plus the latest on a long awaited report on Australia's banks and a stunning cycled trail that takes in the very best that Balkans has to offer all that great year on the briefing with me, Markus pink. Venezuela's President Nicolas Madura says the US is running the risk of provoking a civil war in his country. Madura added that Donald Trump would leave the White House stained with blood if he intervened in the crisis. So what should we make of it? This is what Stephen Kinzer a journalist and author of overthrow America sensory of regime change from Hawaii to Iraq told Monaco's the foreign desk program in states intervention in Central America has been a series of repeated failures. So not only have we not learned from our mistakes. But we're actually doing the opposite. It was amazing to me to read that the person now appointed to direct our effort to overthrow the government of Venezuela. Elliot Abrams is the same guy that I watched promote the contras in Central America and defend genocide in committed by. Our allies in Guatemala back in the nineteen eighties. Not somebody with the same approach or the same point of view, the same person known as good to more on this with scores. Lucas who is a professor of international relations at the university of Birmingham. Welcome to the program scores. How much do we actually know of what the US is willing to do in regards to Venezuela and Maduro? Lister with the white context. And the problem is is that you heard from Stephen Kinzer is that everything from Venezuela to Iraq Iran to Syria to eastern Europe is sort of wedged into this idea of the US pursuing coups around the world. And the problem is that writes out what's actually happening on the ground in Venezuela, and it rights out the his people. So for example, is quite right that the United States has carried out a series of attempts through Latin America going back through the nineteenth century, including in the nineteen eighties trying to overthrow the corrupt government. However, this case the us, although you have officials like John Bolton Elliot Abrams who want to get rid of the Madero regimes. It's not just the us. We're not talking about US military action to overthrow twyla is dead. We're talking about diplomatic and political action which in some ways didn't start with the Americans. But it started with for example, the recently elected, president of Brazil, higher bellsa Naro, very hard right figure, but Bolsonaro is involvement highlights that you've got nine Latin American countries that have recognized the alternative president one Guezo that you have Canada you have European countries that have now recognized white up. So this is not a US led operation at a coup attempt. You might say the US is part of the international coalition that wants to replace Madero, but they're doing so because of the internal conditions Venezuela that have been there for some years, specifically the collapse of the economy. So we know that's Russia has made it clear that's countries in support of Madura butts does mature have much of support from abroad. Yes. It's important to highlight that again beyond the superficial US versus Madero framework that just as there are many countries that are recognized Guay though, you have not only Russia, but China who have sided with Madero you have a couple of important Latin American countries, Mexico and Bolivia who are still citing with Madero. Ed, you have other countries who are kind of caught in the middle of between Europe and the situation in particular, Portugal and Spain who been very measured in their position. So. So it is not a case of as we might go back to Nicaragua in the eighties or quantum novel. The nineteen fifties that this is simply just a US led operation to topple a government, which is on a shaky footing. This is a very complex local situation with the international community. Splitting at this point. And with to be honest with you, the key player in all of this is the Venezuelan military as long as they side with Madero doesn't matter what the US wants doesn't matter. How many recognize why though Monroe will probably stay in power despite the seriousness of the economic position..
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Monocle 24: The Monocle Daily
"That's more than were killed in all the rest of Latin America combined over those thirty years in political violence. So the Guatemala case is among the second half of the twentieth century among the interventions that was most devastating and one for which the people of that country in that region are still paying heavy price. Just finally at the risk of tempting fate when we sort of look at what may eventuate with regard to the United States in Venezuela. Is there any indication that the United States has learnt anything from its misadventures in central and South America. Has its style of intervention evolved at all well over the twentieth century, we did have one big change in our style of intervention up until the period after World War Two we intervened directly. We would just land the marines after the second World War. We had the CIA. So we began to intervene in a more subtle and in different ways. But I do think that overall United States intervention in Central America has been a series of repeated failures. So not only have we not learned from our mistakes, but we're actually doing the opposite. It was amazing to me to read that the person now appointed to direct our effort to overthrow the government of Venezuela. Elliot Abrams is the same guy that I watched promote the contras in Central America and defend genocide in committed by our allies in Guatemala back in the nineteen eighties. Nut somebody with the same approach or the same point of view the. Same person. So this to me is a very depressing answer to your question of whether we have learned anything that was Stephen Kinzer whose book overthrow a recommend haughtily complete episode of the foreign desk, which I also recommend haughtily premieres tomorrow at midday London time, you kind, of course, catch up with that an Olero the programming anytime you like on a website, or on itunes and so forth. This is the monocle daily up next the Asian newspapers, do stay tuned. Being pumps seems like a dazzling lavish lifestyle, right? Have you ever wondered how your favorite pop song was written? Right. And in the bus with my housemate sat on the toilet technophobes. Or who that song was really intended for writing love songs in Spanish, I say pathetic, sad things, and it would be a secret from the audience and also from the person that I was writing about join us on the sessions Midori house each week where we bring in a wealth of musical talent to perform live for.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Here & Now
"But you said, you mean for these turbulent times, what's the one thing that all four of these men went through that maybe know trying to what's the connection or the lack of connection that the current president has. I think one of the most important qualities in a leader is the ability to be self reflective to acknowledge eras to learn from your mistakes to grow as a leader. And all four of these men had had extraordinary experience in public life and they were able to have humility, which means they accepted their limitations. They all had. It seems most of them had even severe depression at certain points when they had failure. In In fact. fact, leadership studies have shown that people who go through adversity and come out the other side stronger than they were before. They went in. It gives them a foundation, like for example, FDR said, you know, when people said, how can you deal with all these pressures that you're under his president? And he laughed, but I think he meant it. He said, if you spend two years because it was paralysis trying to move your big toe, then somehow it's not gonna seem so bad, whatever you're going through and he learned humility. He became a different person through the polio. He'd always been charming. He was always a naturally gregarious person, but having had to spend four years just trying to walk again when he first got the polio, he couldn't even his back and his chest wasn't even strong. So he would ask to be lifted from his wheelchair to crawl on the floor of his library to strengthen his back. And then he tried to tackle stairs going up one step at a time crawling to the top. And the important thing is that when he got to the top that have celebrations, so a humility. But what about those. Who compare Donald Trump to teddy Roosevelt who teddy had this, you know, bluster and boisterous Nissen out of my way. I'm going to ride a horse to the top of San Juan hill for the way. I just want to take a second on that because you paint a, I think more sympathetic portrait of him that I've seen, let's say, from Stephen Kinzer who wrote the true flag book and he paints a teddy Roosevelt was kind of a foolish guys. Young man wants to have play war wants to ride a horse, and it's only after McKinley is he goes from vice president to president that he achieves a maturity your take on him with the rough riders in Cuba is more admiring. Why think he proved himself with the rough riders when he was with them to be a leader? I mean, he figured out how to mobilize them to give them the courage and the camaraderie and the morale. So whether or not it's a good thing to want to be in a war, which I think sometimes he did just to show his medal may. Maybe that's because he was an as Matic kid and he used to read all these books about explorers and courageous people, and he wanted to be them when he couldn't. But there always is something about teddy. I mean, as daughter, Alice said that he so wanted to be in the center of attention that he wanted to be the baby at the baptism, the bride at the wedding and the corpse at the funeral. So there is that likely to or similarity perhaps to President Trump well and President Trump's base has said he met so many of Trump's voters who have said that this is what they wanted him. Then care if he is crude or is bombastic. They don't even seem to care about the truth and you write a lot about how Lincoln you know if if it's not my word, then you know it just it doesn't count, has something happened where that may not matter. It used to matter a lot, you know, if words don't matter. And if the tooth doesn't matter, I think then that that is a worry. Awesome thing about democracy. I mean in general, what I'd like to believe that these four stories show that these men lived in far more turbulent times than ours. Obviously, you have Lincoln coming in when there's going to be a civil war. Six hundred thousand people are going to die teddy Roosevelt's at the height of the industrial revolution..
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on KQED Radio
"Nicaraguan president daniel ortega was hailed as a revolutionary when he led the sandinista national liberation front and ousted the somoza government back in nineteen seventy nine or take a lead the country during the us back kotter revolution which resulted in the deaths of more than thirty thousand nicaraguans he then lost the presidential election in nineteen ninety and was then re elected in two thousand and six stephen kinzer is a senior fellow at the watson institute for international and public affairs at brown university stephen welcome what did he with you while this latest crisis seemed to start with protests about social security and the social safety net students protested government police responded with a violent crackdown and then things spiraled what's behind this crisis in your view you're quite right to point out that the spark that set off these protests which was a change in pension rules was not the real cause there's been an accumulation of grievances over a period of years that have been just brought to a boil by this last crisis it starts with the decision of daniel ortega to remain in power indefinitely and to use the institutions of state to legitimize his permanent rule by not allowing dissent and opposition to emerge through normal peaceful political channels he has made it likely and as as it is now happened that that opposition will explode some violent way he has some experience with this of course and that has been a long tradition in nicaraguan history we're now seeing again this phenomenon of the peaceful road to change or opposition or alternating leadership closed and that then leading to a violent explosion now along simmer behind what's boiling over now of course daniel ortega was on the other side of a battle with authoritarian parties back in the seventies when when he was a leader of the sandinistas and challenged the somoza government but is this the first task for daniel ortega's authority in this way by nicaraguan people it's not the first test but it's certainly the first one at this level i think you're now seeing the first.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on WNYC 93.9 FM
"Nicaraguan president daniel ortega was hailed as a revolutionary when he led the sandinista national liberation front and ousted the somoza government back in nineteen seventy nine or take a lead the country during the us back contra revolution which resulted in the deaths of more than thirty thousand nicaraguans he then lost the presidential election in nineteen ninety and was then re elected in two thousand and six stephen kinzer is a senior fellow at the watson institute for international and public affairs at brown university stephen welcome would you be with you well this latest crisis seemed to start with protests about social security and the social safety net students protested government police responded with a violent crackdown and then things spiraled what's behind this crisis in your view you're right to point out that the spark that set off these protests which was a change in pension rules was not the real cause there's been an accumulation of grievances over a period of years that have been just brought to a boil by this last crisis it starts with the decision of daniel ortega to remain in power indefinitely and to use the institutions of state to legitimize his permanent rule by not allowing dissent and opposition to emerge through normal peaceful political channels he has made it likely and as as it is now happened that that opposition will explode some violent way he has some experience with this of course and that has been a long tradition in nicaraguan history but we're now seeing again this phenomenon of the peaceful road to change or opposition or alternating leadership closed and that then leading to violent explosion now along simmer behind what's boiling over now of course daniel ortega was on the other side of a battle with authority tarian parties back in the seventies when when he was a leader of the sandinistas in challenged the somoza government but is this the first test for daniel ortega's authority in this way by nicaraguan people it's not the first test but it's certainly the.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Radio Free Nashville
"Of a no fly zone it's a matter of figuring out a way to de escalate this conflict get these external powers out and have a proper political process whereby this atrocious regime can be replaced one of the other problems is it's not just the millions of people who are refugees and who are terrified of going back because they're afraid of the regime there are millions of people on the other side who are terrified of the opposition so a political process is not going to be an easy an easy business but that's what that's where we should be focused your response to the debate over the authorization for use of military force the math that's going to be taking place in the next few days any obstruction to the untrammelled power of an imperial executive in this in this country is in my view a good thing i think that the debate might lead to approval of the use of force i think i think the president should be restricted as much as possible the united states is fighting wars all over the world in countries where i cannot see any any possible interest for the united states or for world peace and as has said killing people because that's what happens in aerial bombardment i was in beta to nine hundred eighty two you bombed buildings you kill people whatever your target us whatever your objectives i wanna ask about what you know what us interests in syria are there's an article that was published earlier this week in the boston globe by stephen kinzer who writes quote the specter of a peaceful and prosperous syria under assad leadership terrifies them that is american military and security advisers they believe that until assad is gone it's in america's interest to keep syria divided unstable and impoverished according to the logic behind american strategy in the.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on KOMO
"Teams of people noxious thousands of forty or fifty people you know and the chemical weapons let's not at the united states apply your rock with chemical weapons when it was fighting iran back in the early eighties so i think that we have to look at what our role has been in throughout the world and i would just recommend that people read this book that i'm reading right now overthrow america's century of regime change from hawaii to iraq by stephen kinzer canyons er okay fantastic book if every american read this we wouldn't be involved in most of these countries so you're saying get out and stay out saying get out and stay out and and the other thing we should pull the basket thing i mean you there is nobody that can tell me within the next if we stayed another thirty or forty years and lost tens of thousands of more americans and and saw the slaughter of thousands more people that are be any different forty years from now richard that was exactly the point in vietnam no matter how long we stayed it was never gonna change all right we thank you thank you for your call all right frank is in binghamton new york this morning hey frank oh good morning evan and i agree with the last caller we gotta get out of these fernan tangle nets especially in the middle east it's been sucking our treasury dry many troops have come home injured and killed and there's no gain for the united states to get involved in other foreign entanglement i believe our george washington's farewell address when he warned us about foreign entanglements should be read on florida's senate and the congress every single day before they opened up session because it's just bleeding on nation dry we totally totally had a belly fill in the middle east and trains a dollar spent this thinking about evan where we could have done with that money here in the united states we're gonna showed up social security because it showed up medicaid we could have built new colleges and bridges and roads but it's it's the president is wrong to get involved in other furniture tangle men.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Radio Free Nashville
"It was not approved at the highest level that last voice allen dulles head of the cia from nine hundred fifty two thousand nine hundred sixty one at the time his brother his brother secretary of state dulles was secretary of state we're talking about the overthrow of iran for the british oil company that would later become a british petroleum is that right stephen kinzer yes the company is now called bp so you're seeing long term effects of these interventions and what you're seeing any ron today one hundred percent ties back to what we did in nineteen fiftythree we like to have this idea that these operations are discreet they're not gonna have any long term effects will remove one government place another favorable government in power then everything will go fine everybody will forget it and we'll have any long term effects but if you look around the world you can see that these kinds of operations to interfere in other countries politics what the cia calls influence operations actually not only often wind up devastating the target country but in the end undermine the security of the united states stephen kinzer alexa another part of the world nicaragua most people are familiar obviously with the reagan era attempts to overthrow the sandinista government or or the period during the roosevelt era of the attempts to to get rid of sandino as a forcing nicaragua but further back jose santos ally at the beginning of the twentieth century you talk about the efforts of the us government to overthrow celaya the lion was a fascinating figure certainly the most formidable leader nicaragua ever had he was a slashing reformer he was a liberal progressive he.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Radio Free Nashville
"The birth of american empire stephen kinzer we welcome you back to democracy now to talk sadly about the very same issue i'm not quite sure where to begin whether to go back to the beginning but let's start since it was sixty five years ago in iran in one thousand nine hundred fifty three in march of nineteen fiftythree the us was in full swing making plans for overthrowing the government of the democratically elected leader mohamed mossa deck can you talk about what the us did in iran then so well known throughout iran but most people in this country have no idea early in the twentieth century the people of iran began moving towards democracy was a very difficult struggle it was back and forth but finally after the second world war democracy did emerge in iran it was the one parentheses the one period of real democracy that we've had any ron over the last hundred years so the problem came when the iranians chose the wrong leader they did something that the united states never likes they chose a leader who wanted to put the interests of his own country ahead of the interests of the united states and that alarmed the west and particularly the united states most of the decks first move was to nationalize iranian oil we thought this would be a terrible example for the rest of the world we didn't want to start this process going in other countries so in order to set an example the united states decided we would work with the british to overthrow the elected democratic government of iran we sent a senior officer who worked in the basement of the american embassy in iran organizing the coo coo finally succeeded in the summer of nineteen fifty three most of the deck was overthrown and more important the democratic system in iran was destroyed forever this was not just an attack on one person but an attack on democracy and the reason why we attacked that democracy is the democracy produced the wrong person so we like elections and democratic processes but they have to produce the candidates we like otherwise our approval disappears the person he said that the us the dulles brothers sent into iran with the suitcases of money to begin the.
"stephen kinzer" Discussed on Radio Free Nashville
"The sixteen us elections we'll take a look at washington's record of meddling in elections across the globe we'll speak to journalists and historian stephen kinzer among his overthrow america's century of regime change from hawaii to iraq and all the shah's men an american poo and the route said middle east terror how do you think that in iran react when americans say you're you're over there you're brutal dictatorships you should have a free regime they say we had a democracy here until you came in and over all that and more coming up welcome to democracy now democracy now dot org the warren pace report i mean goodman president trump's sunday walked back his support for gun control measures that would increase the age that a person can purchase a firearm from eighteen to twenty one the reversal came as the trump administration said it will seek to arm and train teachers and school staffers with concealed weapons while making modest changes to a federal program providing criminal background checks for gun buyers trump's reversal came just two weeks after a publicly proposed raising the minimum age firearm purposes you can buy the handle you can't buy one that you have to wake you twenty one but you can buy the kind of weapon used in the school shooting at eighteen i think it's something you have to think about instead of calling for expanding background trucks trump's proposal out yesterday calls for education secretary betsy devos to head a commission that'll recommend ways to harden schools against mass shootings like last month's massacre at the stoneman douglas high school in parkland florida which killed seventeen people fourteen students and three faculty the commission was announced less than twenty four hours after trump told a campaign rally and pennsylvania quote we can't just keep setting up blue ribbon committees in florida republican governor rick scott has signed a series of gun measures breaking with the national rifle association in the wake of last month's parkland massacre the new restrictions will add a three day waiting period for handgun purchases will raise the minimum age.