2 Episode results for "Stanley Sloan"
Stanley Sloan and Holiday Prep Stress on Women
"The Promo Radio Vermont. It's the Dave Graham show on. WD It's your show about the people places and the issues that matter the the most of you. Now here's your host Dave Graham Good Morning for Monte this Friday the thirteenth of December two thousand and nineteen. Hope Y'all have the best of luck today the end I hope we have some good luck on the program this morning. I think we are going to have a short show today. We're going to go live ten o'clock to CBS. News coverage from Washington didn't of resumption of deliberations in the House Judiciary Committee on the impeachment of President Donald Trump. But we do have our first our guests that we had scheduled already to go this morning. I do believe in will. We're going to have Paul Heights on from seven days giving us an update on his terrific recent coverage about the problems alums at the Chicken and regional correctional facility provides only women's prison alleged to be rife with sexual misconduct By some members of the staff half as well as substance abuse by few anyway and other problems there as well as Just not a lot of oversight in responsiveness when people bring Concerns and complaints to senior staff at the at the women's prison there in South Burlington will be bringing Paul in just a moment after I tell you about our second half hour. Very interesting story developed involving Vermont. Person this week Man named Stanley Sloan in nineteen sixty. One graduate of my high school. Local guy makes good. He goes off. It ends up being one of the world's leading experts on NATO and EU relations between the United States and and Europe and In between between the Western Alliance That NATO is and then so we union now Russia and Anyway Mr Sloan was scheduled to be a speaker at a conference in Denmark This past Tuesday. He's been somewhat critical of president trump on over issues related to NATO and how the president has handled his His his contacts contact with the other NATO nations leaders and the US ambassador to Denmark. Carl Sands Announced recently that Mr Sloane would not be speaking at this conference in Denmark he withdrew slash blocked his invitation there and that prompted the Danish organizers of the conference conference to cancel the entire event so this is apparently the trump administration not wanting to brook any criticism and ending ending with a cancellation of a of an event on the future of NATO scheduled to be have happened earlier this week in Denmark. Well Mr Sloane Stanley. Sloan is visiting scholar at Middlebury College based here in Vermont of course and he is going to be a guest of the Dave Ramsey show in the second half hour program of the program this morning. You know if you can't get get your views Out into a form over there in Copenhagen Denmark we still have free speech rights here in Vermont. And we're going to hear what Mr Sloan has to say in the ED. Second part of this Short show today. But the first part I wanted to vote to this unfolding still unfolding story Vermont. That was really launched last week by Paula Heights. So seven days and Paul Haines is my guest. Good Morning Paul. Hey Dave has it gone. I'm doing well. How are you so tell me a little bit about The coverage that you you are on our show last week talking about urine sort of introductory story on this topic of real problems at the what used to be known as the four CS I guess back. When the official name was the Chicken County Correctional Center or something like that and but is now known as the chicken and regional correctional facilities? The Vermont's only women's prison and it's rife with problems And you give us a brief recap of what you find what your initial reporting was and then unroll force a little bit. What's happened since then? Sure so as we discussed last week I was able to document Quite a number of really horrific allegations evolving Both Kelly but also a little bit more broadly other parts of the Department of Corrections Then and these range from alleged sexual assault within the facility inappropriate and illegal relationships between the SEC. Staffers inmate former inmates under the DNC supervision. Outside of the prison retaliation You know some pretty serious drug use by a shift supervisor at the prison so a lot. There's a lot right in there It was like a thousand word. Cover story In last week's paper as In that story I we. We posted a email address and phone number for people to contact us with With more information that they know about It's going to Department of Corrections and we've got just a ton of saw a ton of tips since then so wading through those and In this week's seven days I had a story that sort love looks at what Officials knew about these allegations prior to our reporting and we were able to get our hands on. Um I'm quite a number of documents that show That a series of prison superintendents were aware of many of these complaints over the years. That current Commissioner of corrections fractions was aware of some of them and then Most surprising of all I suppose is that The attorney general teach Donovan was also where some of with them And I WANNA be clear that not. All these people knew everything right but In Donovan's case he met with to corrections officers one current one former and I believe may of twenty seventeen and they were considering suing the state because they said that they faced pretty serious sexual harassment at shooting in regional and other parts of the corrections department. So they basically went to Donovan to lay out their allegations and You know I think they were trying to avoid having to file litigation But also they say what they really wanted was for somebody to clean out the proper of corrections they thought that by brains allegations directly to the Attorney General. He might talking about that. This is actually a really interesting case. I think of of a tough conundrum for any attorney general In which is as follows. They are a big part of their job is representing state agencies. They are the lawyer for the Department of Corrections for example and so In that puts that puts the general duty. Wise doesn't it. In sort of defensive posture relating to the Department of corrections totally totally totally. And that's what it says is You know my job was to deal with this threat of litigating And what I did was I you know I settle all the case quickly. I did it in a manner that didn't put the The guards in a in the position of having to publicly fight this court battle for years years He thought it was a pretty good solution. I think both for the state and for These guards You know they were expecting something more and I think you do do point out a challenge with this role of attorney general right there. One of their jobs is to defend the state to the states lawyer but the other one is to to sort of be the the You know chief advocate in a way for the people right chiefly. We will advocate for the people. And you see the same issue with the EP. Five case yes absolutely and a lot of people. A lot of people want Attorney General to hold the state accountable. for whatever. It did wrong wrong if anything you'd be five situation but really in that case. His job is to defend the agency's not getting so You know I think maybe the bigger the bigger question me though is Regardless of what his His duties are on paper If you know a top elected official in Vermont Learns that there. Is You know there are ongoing allegations of sexual harassment Within a estate agency Perhaps that person ought to do a little bit more than tell the case. Perhaps after selling the case that person Could look into the situation more are and try to address it and I I think there is some irony here Because as you know Attorney General Donovan has very very expansive view of his powers. Our Attorney General. Yes he he just touches every issue he possibly can. I don't WanNa let him off the hook at all. I don't mean to imply that I'm I'm wondering actually did he go to Did he go to Governor Phil Scott and say. Hey you're my client. I WanNa sit you down to talk to you about you. Have a huge kettle of of problems. You know on the boil up in South Burlington here and you better pay attention did he. Is there any indication he did that. There is no indication that talk to who anybody about this and I you know I only know what he has told me But I gave him and his office A couple of opportunities to respond to this provide more information. Yeah about his response And they basically only pointed to his decision to settle this case so it does not appear that he went to anybody or did anything think to correct this problem. That's weird. I mean I if I were him I just I mean if in part to kind of cover himself into a little advance band aid on his own political future or whatever because this stuff is GonNa come out someday folks so when you see when you see problems like this and you are in senior level of government you you you don't just You know just is hope it goes away right well and I think that might be kind of a theme throughout this reporting You know a lot of the stuff. I know that. These allegations are surprised to too many people in Vermont but to those who are working in the system. They're really not. I mean the the number of people have talked to over the last week or so with the Mike Dunn. No kidding this is happening right like I didn't really know but we all sort of new right because You know April mccollum from the Burlington free press A really great story a year ago. about the plight of one of these cards. Could I described here. Pretty Sweet April first person as far as I know who reported on The allegations she made against the Department of Corrections. I read that story year ago. I didn't do anything about it. You probably wear that story. I don't know anything about it you know. We've all had some indications stations along the way you know we all bear some responsibility. I you are. You're correct. You're correct about that. Of course then we have our elected officials who are The reason we put him there has to pick up the responsibility that we all bear and And if they're not doing that or if they're not doing that very effectively then that certainly worth pointing out and that's what That's journalists journalism is four folks and You know again my hats are my hat off to you. Paul for for really taken this Sir all down the field the long way here and And continuing to push over the past ten days you you have not rested on your laurels. Tell us a little bit about the unfolding the developments that you've had sort of new revelations since your initial story. Yeah well you know Terry Smith a show yesterday Sort of the thing that I'm watching most closely right now is this. He has pledged sector. Smith has pledged to engage some sort of third party investigator to really take a more thorough. Look at what happened here. And Smith wants it to be somebody outside of state government meant. He's he's said in recent days he prefer it to be the federal government. the US Attorney the district of Vermont So we may have some news on that later today potentially I'm curious to see where that goes. let me stop you there for a second but it could be. That's so important. And you're right Mike Smith the secretary the Human Services Whose Agency of course includes the Department of corrections was on the day. Graham show here yesterday and he was talking about this idea of setting up a An outside entity to the to to basically be a place for complaints about the internal workings of the Corrections Department to go and have them be addressed and resolved that Cetera. I think there's a long history history here in a wide variety of different types of complaints within the Department of Corrections were inmates are allowed to file a grievance and and the ah or their grievance procedures for St Staff to you know the the Union contract with state employees And the a real problem though. Is that these things tend to just go down the memory hole because you're you're essentially complaining about a system in which the people who are receiving complaints also work in the system so I love to sort of separate these two issues. I think so what I was just talking about is is actually more a an investigation into what happened. And so so this is I think really could use a ton of investigations around this. There's the state police criminal Komo investigation. there is Mike this internal short term He's calling it a review now. She hopes to end by next week with some recommendations recommendations for the governor there. Is this Additional investigation that that he wants the federal government to take on which I think would look at what what what has gone wrong at at the prisoners apartment more generally over the past few years and then there is what I think you were just too which is What what is going to be the the ongoing system for people who are reporting complaints that happened now or in the future and so? That's that's another thing. That Smith is working on And he has tried his establishing Two different hotlines one of which is for employee complaints and that hotline hotline would go to the Department of Human Resources which is outside of the Agency of Human Services so that that number was set up yesterday. So please who has the report can use that hotline now Separately there is he's working on establishing a hotline for inmates to Report Abuse Service conduct of any kind I've got a story that shit lead on our website pretty soon hopefully That talks about what the system has been for reporting reading and It my reporting suggests that Vermont has actually knocked been in compliance with federal law. Federal law requires prisons to have have a hotline for inmates that goes to an independent third party so they can make a complaint And not complain goes outside of the facility ability and will be sent back to the facility in some sort of Anonymous fashion. So it's it's a way to protect people from retaliation allegation Vermont has not had that Vermont has had a hotline for inmates but the Hotline just goes to the Department of Corrections Central Central Office. which you know you can see why that might be a problem right? If you're saying some kind of abuse at the hands of prison officials you don't want to report that to prison officials So that is the challenge for Smith Right now is to find an outside entity who will actually take on that job up at according to Department crash officials. I've spoken to It's it's been difficult to find an outside Body willing to actually do that work or if you really need a response of hotline there's always eight six five ten twenty. That's the number for seven days paul-heinz folks and we also have just got a call in from Steve Howard of the Vermont. What State Employees Association obviously Among the players in this whole scene up there at the prisoners are a bunch of state employees who Who actually do the day to day work of providing correction action officers services etc.? Good Morning Steve. Good Morning Dave. How are you good? you got to be quick here because we only have a couple of minutes left. But what's what's on your mind. Well it's just a couple of things I think. It's really really important to stress that the vast majority of correctional officers across the State of course are upstanding folks who respect and Respect the rights of the folks who they are working with the incarcerated population in the state that needs to be said Straightforwardly but I also think we have to take a look at the Department of Human Resources and the role they. They played in in the Department of Corrections. And then what did they know how much worked. How much investigative work did they do? I would also suggest that Secretary Smith and others look for another entity that That are members could call to report information other the Department of Human Resources Somebody who is not attached to management Because I think that is probably going to be more successful in actually getting reports done than if few attach if if you ask people to call the Managers Department of Human Resources. Yeah I mean I I eventually is i. I was only maybe one quarter joking before the break. When I said you know the the the place to call is eight I looked it up about eight? Six five ten twenty. I think that's the number for seven days and that's so that's I mean. Let me give you a different number. Two Oh three six three. That's dedicated the SEC. Reporting live so two to three sixth grade the three so okay well. You don't WanNA flood your switchboard. That's Okay Okay Paul. Sorry about that man caused trouble. But I I think Steve You make good point but I also think that eventually that kind of is the role of the media when you want to get outside of government Sometimes the place to call to get really you know pretty pretty pretty Hard hitting and and tough and neutral and objective responses to problems within government structures is You know recall your local call the call seven days call call your local newspaper called digger whoever you want to. But that's the media play a crucial role here and I just you know again. My Hat's off the Paul for his work in this regard so something as well. Here's I just wanted to piggyback piggybacking. On what Steve was saying Some of the Many of the complaints that I've been quoting from the DNC employees who have been speaking out about this all right. That's what are the complaints that this story was from a Siesta Union Steward Who spoke out about this years ago? The you know the which to women who went to Cheryl Donovan Where Dr Phil Show any employee another good point? Unfortunately we had to leave it there so Paul Heights seven days. Thanks so much joining me. This morning Steve Our four. Thank you for your call as well. Let's go to bother me our breakfast. CBS News more than four. The Dave Ramsey show to follow on a different topic. Stay with US folks this Jack From the Warren store wishing you all a happy and healthy holiday season in asking all of you to shop local heat local in visit local the days ahead getting darker and it looks like winter is finally here. Give yourself the gift of stress. Free Life by shopping eating in visiting visiting local visit your friends businesses and restaurants and support their passion in performance. I know that they would love to see you. The Warren store where funky friendly and league and almost world famous. It's the Dave Graham show-me WD FM am and we continue into the second half hour our program. This morning it's Friday the thirteenth of December two thousand in nineteen and my next guest is stand sloan. He's nineteen sixty one graduate of my high school a local. Oh boy makes good. He goes off into the world and becomes one of the well known international expert on NATO. He's a visiting scholar Middlebury College. I spent some time with the CIA. Okay and Stance loan was scheduled from what we understand to speak at a conference this week. I think it was scheduled for Tuesday in Denmark and He was going to be talking about The future of NATO the current status of NATO the North Atlantic Treaty Organization of courses the Stalwart alliance the Western alliance between Europe and the United States. That has been the counterweight of the West to formerly the Soviet bloc and more recently Russia and of course We've had some strange ranger goes on with Russia. In recent years given our current administration the President of the United States has been quite critical of NATO and and many people have accused him of sort of undermining its fundamental purposes and he of course Takes the view that the United States has been too long The principal partner in terms terms of funding NATO in the military alliance in particular. That Europe hasn't done its share. We need to get more out of our our allies in Europe. If the if anything along the lines of session lions GonNa Continue. So there's a lot going on a lot of moving parts with NATO and stance loan is Was GonNa be speaking at this conference in Denmark. He has been somewhat what critical of president trump in president trump's stances on NATO over the over recent years all of a sudden the ambassador to Denmark for the United States that a woman named Carla Sands Who background as as an actress and chiropractor from California She She was. She's ambassador to Denmark and she weighed in a and said. I don't really want this guy. Speaking at this conference in Denmark and the Danish hosts of the conference then turned around and said well. Guess what we're going to have the conference. The whole thing's cancelled cancelled. So weird events there in relation especially in my estimation to the whole idea of free speech and so on. We do still have free speech here in Vermont brought in on including on the day of Graham show here. WD Ev FM and am and Long Story Short Dan. I'm sorry stand Sloane Stanley. Sloan is my guest this morning here in the studio. Thanks for coming by Mr Sloan. They thanks for inviting me in so if I got the basic facts of that story about your invitation this invitation Asian and the cancellation. All all right you do it The first reaction of the Danish Atlantic Council was the the in-country sponsor for the event was to let me know that I was off the program Then there was a very strong reaction to that and the next day they cancelled the entire conference partly because they thought it would become a debate about what had happened rather than about NATO and they wanted to do something about about NATO. And that's why I was invited. Yeah you know I I was saying the last talking on the phone about your appearance here today in one irony year is that if the ambassador to Denmark had not intervened and you had been allowed to speak week at the conference Just as planned and everything had gone off smoothly How much do you think the story would have gotten versus? What it's getting getting now? It would have gotten some local play because the local press media know something about me know my views and know that I have been critical all of the president and his approach to NATO and so it would have gotten some local press and I think that probably would have been the end of it but the action of the ambassador and at this this point we don't know whether she had guidance from Washington or not The State Department apparently has said that he didn't give guidance along those lines and of some sources that I have in Denmark say that People at the embassy believes that they did have guidon so we don't know whether it was her initiative or not but in any case It it has become a huge story and You know in in some way I think The Danish population prestigious waiting for something about this ambassador. I really think they feel disrespected. Getting an ambassador who apparently was appointed largely because she'd given several hundred two thousand dollars to the trump to help two thousand sixteen campaign. Yeah there apparently is an important qualification. if you look at for instance Gordon Som- Limousine Bachelor to the European Union. I think he's primary qualification for such an important post in international relations was being large donor to the trump campaign to as well right. Yes and this says happened with previous presidents as well but usually presidents try to appoint someone not only who is given to their campaign or supported them politically but also oh someone who has some experience or or contact to the country. They're being appointed to in this case. There was none of that the and and you know I. I think that that is a balancing act that I don't mean to pick on trump exclusively about this because you're right Particularly to to the smaller and more minor posts You know Some of the European capitals we hardly ever hear of they tend to get ambassador appointments under many presidents who have Been Campaign donors and and who have had MAYBE NOT IN A. They certainly haven't come up through the foreign service. Let's put it. That way certainly is true. The the problem is because Denmark. Marcus very strong important. Small country but NATO ally send troops to Afghanistan and they're very loyal ally and to treat them like this yes. I think they felt disrespected. And you know that that actually is a point worth making because You're right about Denmark. I mean I I do follow. Follow the history of the I happen to be a Danish heritage myself so I sort of follow. Follow the history and the role of Denmark in in the NATO alliance in another realms realms Just based on that kind of personal curiosity but I m my sense has been that they have been a real a real stalwart supporter of of NATO For throughout its existence really and have been among the first step up and several of the conflicts in which the United States is putting together Sort of multilateral Darrelle forces and so on and it sometimes to the point of criticism. those especially on the left who don't like the quote Washington consensus and the idea. You know the historic idea. That came out of you know George H W Bush about a unit polar world and and kind of the US ruling ruling the oceans and so one Denmark was willing in some people's estimations but but they They certainly have been there. And so now we have this situation where The United States is Kind of given the back of the hand I guess is that fair I think so the Danes in addition to being loyal allies in sort of the the sense of making contributions the they also believe strongly in the values that underlie the North Atlantic Treaty Organization the preamble envelop the North Atlantic Treaty in nineteen forty nine specified that the alliance stood for democracy individual liberty and the rule of law and the Danes. Really believe leave and and take this seriously and they believe that at this point the American administration is not necessarily serving as the the sitting on the hill. That Reagan used to talk about Providing guiding light for democracy is everywhere. They see us as falling off from that kind of off. Soft power leadership you know this is this is so important and this to me is really the crux of why I wanted to be a guest on the show today because We have we have a certain set of values that America traditionally stood for in the world. At least ideally now. Obviously there's a lot of real politics that goes on and there's a lot of criticism from both right and left of what the US actually doing versus what it says it's doing and its etc etc but on good days in the ideal world the the United States has been a beacon for Four things like free speech. The First Amendment to the constitution talks about a tolerance for dissent essentially and And here we have a person who is very well trained and schooled in in all aspects relating to NATO yourself Stanley early. Sloan and you are someone who is not afraid. It hasn't been afraid to speak out and say I think the president is wrong. Headed about certain aspects of his remarks act actions actions related to NATO and And so again ideally. You'd say well this this person doesn't like what the president is doing. bring them to the conference. Allow him to say that. Get another speaker to up there. Who are willing to defend what the president is doing? Have the back and forth. This is called The discussion that you hope will lead to quote unquote more perfect union elsewhere in the constitution. That phrase right. I happen to believe in the value debate in different perspectives. Yeah and in fact I've been doing public diplomacy speaking engagements for the State Department since the early nineteen eighties and the State Department has always respected the fact that it speakers may have different views than current administration policy. I've never found in all of those years speaking for the State Department. I've I've never had the experience where either an ambassador or an embassy decided that My criticism was Something that they they didn't want to put before foreign audiences and I've always argued that that's real strength of our democracy is the fact that our government through the State Department has been willing thing to provide speakers to foreign audiences at demonstrate that we have different points of view we can argue about them and we have effective democracy. You know and and and that's the that's the That is the aura. I think the United States wants to put out in front of an audience like this at a conference in Denmark anywhere in Europe or anywhere in the world really is to go out there and say we are. We are strong enough that we and self confident enough that we actually encourage criticism because sometimes we get learn some things and improve our game. That's you know that's that's That's what that's what it's all about. I mean again that more perfect union phrase is is really the sort sort of the push toward todd. What people in industry have called total quality improvement? You know and And that's been been a key part of the country three strengths over the couple of centuries it's been in existence and I just I really bothers me frankly to see it diminished that that principle diminish this idea of uh of of encouraging criticism. And you know from what I've seen of of I. I've actually been to a couple of conferences. And so on where people from the state eight department were speaking and and it almost seemed I remember one When I was in Europe years and years ago the The the goal seemed to be to actually purposely Ashley bring in people of different views and and say you know. Here's here's view a and here's view. Let's have it out kind of thing. And and and the and the idea that the that the United States of America could be a key sponsor of this event and willing to hear pretty diametrically opposed views on the topic at hand would be just something that I think other folks around the world really looked at that and said wow that. That's that's that's a sign of a strong country and a strong democracy that it's able and willing to do that Are we do you think we're going to be able to get back there. I hope so. I hope so I think a lot of damage has been done to both our democracy and also to our image overseas what we call soft power the ability to get people to follow us without coercing them that soft power has been diminished dramatically during the trump administration. We no longer have of they trust and it shows up in public opinion polls so far. Most governments are reluctant to criticize the administration but even there at the the meeting in London last week it was obvious that there were these Photo opportunities of many of the several have NATO heads of estate mad cow joking about the president that kind of thing truly diminishes our influence is not just a matter of image. It's a matter of whether people be willing to follow us except our judgments. What's what's what's at risk here? I mean suppose the United States says you know who who really cares about NATO anymore. It's getting old and we can. We can sort of really diminish our our role in it or even let it dissolve. Who cares what's the problem with that? The problem is that we're talking about out of a world in which there are still threats. Soviet Union no longer around Borussia definitely has been working against not only providing a fairly substantial essential military threat against West but also political one has one as well messing around in our elections and also messing around in European elections as well we also who have terrorism out there and and growing challenge from China all of those things benefit our interest by cooperating with our NATO allies. I I obviously the world is still out there folks and I don't know I've always taken a little bit of comfort in the idea that something like NATO was in business. So let's see let's see of listeners out there has to say friends friends online from newborn fred morning. It's an interesting theory is far as the State Department's concerns in the Defense Department's it's called the stability instability paradox and it seems to be working quite well right now. Do you think it will continue to work. Well what is the stability instability paradox red. Okay major powers The major powers don't go to war with each other but they have they have. What's it called proxy wars and Korea Afghanistan Nicaragua with that sort of thing And the question again is what the instability paradox will continue. What do you think about that? Stanley Sloan. It's not exactly Something that I have off put a lot of focus on but I think guess to some extent it will continue and It's always a challenge for major power decide when wants to maintain the current situation. And what it wants to change and sometimes they act of changing involves the use of force. Sometimes it works out sometimes. It doesn't and they don't use force against each other but they had these proxies that Right I and indefinitely is a good thing that United States and Soviet Union never use force against each other. That is a good thing if there's another theory of color Kind of dogs and that is one. We how is threatened by another major power will be threatened power tax major major power or its rival. 'cause it's GonNa move feel powerful the Peloponnesian war that well then that certainly Something which I. Frankly don't think we're going to get it. Get a real definite answer in the last minute or so that we have here the segment of the show. But I thank you for the call. Freighter provocative questions is always. Hey I wanted to mention that We are coming up at the top of the hour. I Wanna I think for thank my guest. Very much stands stands. Sloan international expert on NATO although really's been in the news. This week you can google his name Stanley. Sloan and you'll get some interesting coverage folks for Washington Post New York Times and We are going to. I'm going to monitor the situation over the next hour which is usually my second hour here. We're going to go live to. CBS News for the impeachment coverage. I we may be ducking back in here later on in the hour for some more the Dave Ramsey show we'll just have to see what unfolds And be back with us on Monday for going to have a visit with. Mary Powell the outgoing. CEO Green Mountain our so so Anyway there you go folks were go into a CBS News at the top of the hour. Here this is Jack from the Warren store wishing you all a happy and healthy the holiday season in asking all of you to shop local heat local and visit local. The days ahead are getting darker and it looks like winter is finally here. Forgive yourself the gift of a stress free life by shopping eating in visiting local visit your friends businesses and restaurants and support their passion in performance. Ordinance I know that they would love to see you. The warrants store where funky friendly almost world-famous. It's the Dave Ramsey. Show I W we are back continuing our program this morning today grab show and we are going to be talking about the holidays. And how women take on an awful lot of the burdens and chores and responsibilities really for keeping the holidays running smoothly in our families and it really is quite something I did. I decided to get into this because I saw an article. Recent recently. Why a writer named Hartley who was talking about emotional labor and the Emotional Labor is actually sort of taking on the responsibility for a A wide variety of thinking about chores never mind the chores I mean people have done studies forever about how women do a a lot of the housework and cooking and the childcare etcetera etcetera but emotional labor actually use the planning for all of that and the thinking about it and the the The time it takes actually to make the LS before you actually go out and buy the stuff on the list for instance just for one of myriad examples and around the holidays this. This seems to be the time of year when a lot of these issues are are very much stepped up shall we say and I I have a an expert on and How this plays out in the retail sector? And that would be Cathy Murphy and she is The proprietor of the street reporting right here in Waterbury our good friend and neighbor just down the street from the WD EVI studios. And she is of a Willis this this morning in the studio good morning. Kathy headlining and there's no better friend to US than WD said. Thank you dave. While I'm glad to have you here I think I think you came in last year. Just to talk to us about the the Generals Zeno the retail season in and the big black Friday etcetera season. Here that we get into this time of year this year I decided to. I saw this article agenda Hartley's piece on emotional labor and it struck me that boy you know it really is true when you look around and in fact I was talking to a good friend and colleague last week I said did you know. Sort of jokingly asked him I said have you done all of your Christmas shopping and he said you know my wife said to me. Well you only have to buy you only have to buy one thing meaning for her. And it's a sure as he goes out and she does all the shopping for the rest of the family and I said I kind of went Ding. That's topic for. Shell L. Right so cathy. Thank you so much for joining me this morning. Appreciate your stopping by. Thanks for having me and I believe we do have on the phone with us. Also Lisa Lisa Senegal. She is the chair of the Vermont Commission on Women. Is that right Lisa right here excellent. I'm glad we were able to connect with you this morning. It's been quite an adventure just to do that. So we talk about those details at some other juncture but Lisa I I wanted to. I wanted to start with you I think I sent you a link. Do this article last week about emotional labor. Did you have a chance to look at that at all I did and I. It's you know you won't be surprised that it's a topic of conversation. Tation both within the the commission and among women on a pretty regular basis yeah and and and I mean it was a tough article for me to read. Just because is I'm sort of thinking about how this kind of stuff played out in my own life and so on and so forth. I think it really did raise some crucial issues about You know as as I say I don't know if you've heard the the little intro but It was talking about how there's been a lot of studies you know in books and so on their remember there was a book called the second shift that was probably twenty years his old. Now we were Talking about how women in you know you have doubt sort of households which many times both spouses are working fulltime. I'm and they're trying to run a household also And and but a lot of that work of running the household of just doing the chores the laundry childcare the cooking king of cleaning etc tend to tend to fall to two women. Still you know. As if these old traditional roles have not gone away completely really not transitions to equal sharing by men and women but this article really focused beyond that on the sort of thinking about the stuff the the the actual you know. How do you? It's not just a matter of cleaning the closet but it's actually Figuring out where stuff is GonNa go when you do clean the closet in and that sort of thing Is this in your estimation. Do you hear more about this. This time of year with the holiday all the holiday shopping preparations incarcerating going on. Oh yeah absolutely it's You know there's so many different elements to it. You Know Women Still L. ended up taking on the bulk of responsibility for not just caring for children and all that goes along with that but women who are in the sandwich generation integration are also taking care of elderly parents and their relatives and that becomes even more important and a responsibility to make sure that that the holidays remain special For those folks but it creates creates a tremendous additional burden When you're already taking on all all the extra cooking and cleaning and Holiday parties and yes the cards. But you know all the increase stuff that happens Especially in elementary age. Children's James Lives and you know they're having school parties. They're having you know extra gatherings you've got the extra gatherings for for adults. Ah Commitments that you have both both just social and additional work and I know I have you know the parties. These are wonderful but board commitments. That you end up having layered onto that. So yeah it's it's a lot of extra Worked for women during the holiday season that unfortunately not only raises stress levels for women this time of year but it also so suck some of the joy out of the holidays and that has you know I I think all of us if we take a step back and think about our childhood the things that we've remember the time that we spent with family and friends and if that time ended up being marred with Parents particularly MOMS being incredibly stressed out that has a negative impact on the holidays just overall. It's just less less fun for everyone. If you're you're being frayed to the point that they know you're are not enjoying it and it it's creating stress within the family all that peace and joy stuff kind of starts to diminish somewhat. It does that that is that is too bad and and We're GONNA be going shortly to avert any our breakfast and CBS News. But I wanNA talk afterward about maybe see what you might suggest for that men would would want to think about doing to help spread the spread the work and then you know by by extension spread the joy joy because You know this is supposed to be time for sharing and carrying this time of year Ca Cathy Murphy We were talking last week when I was recruiting you to come on the show today. And you're telling me that about seventy five percent of the people who come into your store that stonestreet emporium ear on street in Waterbury are in fact female. They are female. But I would say it's only female. It's probably more like eighty five percent Because of course women come in with their partners and end Or the best is when they leave him at the pub to come in themselves and relax shop at leisure so that stress that Lisa it was just talking about isn't prevalent. It's SORTA like honey you you go get a beer. I'M GONNA go shopping well. It's tiny in our store. We we I do have a men's shirt rack Prada lucky brand shirts but we really call our men's department. The two Yemeni chairs that we have for the guys to hang out and while aw their female partners are that is the thing so the guy actually goes into the store what yeah and but then any ends up sitting in a comfy chair while it was wife Wanders around the store is still checking the list and looking at looking for what to buy stuff correct and and Are The guy she threw sheepish about this at all awards just Well you know. I don't WanNa sound stereotypical either for the for for the guys out there but I have had some come in and they are actually carrying the list. The guys are carrying the list and Well we can pick that up. Yeah let's break we're going to go to some some. CBS News at the bottom of the hour here and when we return we're going to continue our conversation about the load on women around the holidays. We'll be back folks. This is Jack from the warned. Learn store wishing you all a happy and healthy holiday season in asking all of you to shop local heat local in visit local. The days ahead are getting darker darker and it looks like winter is finally here. Give yourself the gift of stress. Free Life by shopping eating in visiting local visit. Your friends. Businesses says and restaurants and support their passion in performance. I know that they would love to see you. The warrants store where funky friendly and almost world famous now back to the Graham. WD FM and now we are back in. We are continuing our conversation about the load of stress and work and chores and preparations at center. A loaded onto women at this time of year. it seems much more so than then men and we have a couple of people who I think the big picture of you and also we're going to get some small picture of you. I think in a moment from Lisa She's the chair of the of the Vermont Commission on Women and and Cathy Murphy is. Proprietor of the stonestreet. Emporium here. In Montpellier terrific shop with. I'm sorry what did I say. I still half asleep phone. Sorry we are in Waterbury and install street is in Waterbury in the street in Waterbury. Okay now I've said it three times I should be able to get a right for the rest of the show. The street emporium in Waterbury were Cathy. Murphy is the proprietor. And you are Someone who is up close and personal to the shopping habits of men and women and and I wanted to check in with you Kathy because you were saying that You men come into the shop. And there's this phenomenon where the gender prevalence may I changed for just one day. Oh usually Christmas Eve Christmas Eve. What happens on Christmas Eve? Well that's the last minute HURRAH panic sets and it's all the guys who come in and say Oh my God. Yeah my wife's from shopping since August I am right yeah get it done in one fell swoop. So it's fine with us but we do find that men are more Acceptable to have help right away. which is awesome? They'll come in and ask for advice and suggestions which of course we're always happy to give and do so but it isn't it and and and you In is it fair to say the majority of the staff in the store female. Yes okay so here again. I just want to point out that what's going on there. It sounds like is these guys are coming in and say. Oh Oh I'm clueless. I need some health and women's step up and and and think through what they need to be thinking for sure I think we're I think we're continuing in some kind of a pattern here. But they come in with their kids and the kids really like to help dad takeout gifts at Lisa's Senecal L.. Is the chair of the Vermont. Commissioner women and Lisa you you look at these At a lot of issues related to gender relations from sort of a big picture theoretical perspective. I'm sure and and you you're well read on these topics but you also mentioned to me when you're talking about this scheduling. This program that you have some experience in retail yourself is that right. Yeah I worked in retail. Excuse me all through high school and then Off and on during in college and I worked at a department store and I had absolutely the same experience on Christmas. Eve of he primarily in the women's department was It was a desperate desperate men coming in who Didn't have clear ideas. They also didn't have sizes which was staying and and I would ask you know what ties does your wife or your your girlfriend wear and they would get a sort of dumbstruck look on their faces like it hadn't occurred to them that that might be information formation. That would be important when they went clothes shopping and they would be well. She's about yourself and and then after the holidays I the boxes would come back now in the heights of in the hands of wives and girlfriends who clearly were not about my size and and the men were just happy to have anything box that we would also route for them. Didn't didn't WANNA show up empty handed on Christmas this morning on my Gosh so truly we experienced that same things. How and I gotta say I'm getting more and more embarrassed here as a member of the male side of the species here because this is This is just. It's embarrassing. I gotta say I mean come on guys what is what what is what is up with this. I mean Let me let me. Have you give your pitcher Lisa. You're talking to men. Now what do you WanNa say about all this. Give them a little thought to it in advance. I would say that the the gift giving is the least of of What you could do to help participate? Ask the women in your lives what they have going on between you know and Christmas or during Hanukkah whatever holiday you celebrate in your family and and start getting a real rely dea of what it is Additional that are on these women's list to do and then sit down and take twenty minutes to figure here out how you might take on some of those things on the list and take some of the burden off. You know a person you will you care about deeply and and I don't think men don't want the women in their lives to enjoy the holidays I think they have a tendency To a large degree to not be aware of just how much additional burden is on women this time of year and and it's also partially women's responsibility to say. Hey look here's the list that I have of everything I have to do. Between now and the twenty fifth so let the down. I don't see how we can. We can split us up or Brussels. Some of this is a long list. I think I love all that Lisa. You're so on point I. I feel like men view shopping more as a necessity and women view it more as an event or an experience except for maybe this time of year. Are you know when they when they do feel the burden of getting everything done so going through the list. Yes you know I let me let me Let me say something. That's GONNA sound stupid and guy like and And and shoot this down because I mean obviously there's gotta be some kind of response to it but I mean and I hear me. I hear some men. I mean I had a conversation months ago about this whole just emotional labor in general with a couple of other guys and one was saying something like well You know women worry about what order the knickknacks go in and men worry about whether their favorite basketball team is going to sharpen up zone defense and And these are just two different realms and So so in terms of the actual mental energy that gets voted to These different topics. That's just kind of the way it breaks down in. What are we gonNA do about it sort of thing? So Lisa. Tackle that one Well I I would say as a sports loving woman that we also carry that weight of worrying being about our our teams are doing this time of year but beyond that on. I think it's important for you. Know there's there's some there's there's a nugget something really important in what you said. That man's response was and I- women in have been programmed and the programming is ongoing on the covers of magazines and on instagram. And you know checking out other people's social media and seeing all the wonderful things they seem to be doing to create the perfect Christmas and you know why am I not able to do more and shouldn't I be doing this and I think we have to look at the things that we play on ourselves and what we feel. We're responsible for doing and and start looking at what's truly important to be done. And what is just additional stuff we've bought into that isn't really necessary But we we take it on anyway so you know there. There does have have to be some reevaluation. I think of Our capacity to do things and the importance of doing various things. I think we have a tendency to think but you know other people have expectations of us that that if we didn't meet it would be okay. Christmas would still come. Hannukah would still come and people who would still love us. Yeah that's an interesting perspective. Actually I mean some of this does sound like not not that women are necessarily should be assigned yet another task but one of the if they were to take on a new task. It might be to Figure out tasks they can shed. Yes yeah I think we can. We can be planning to ourselves and Not Everything is going to be the difference between whether or not the holidays are wonderful for everyone or not and we have to figure out what is and what isn't important to young men about Christmas and and this whole topic just the other day and And one gets a lump of coal in his stocking with this response. He said Christmas stupid and if women want to take that on themselves. I'm not going to feel too badly about it. ooh That's right Kathy. What do you think of? That is a response. That's a big lump coal in his stocking. You know of course. I'm coming from a retail perspective. When I hear statements like that I fear? You're the downfall do my store and the industry because without women right now stores like mine would probably collapse so yeah yeah that I mean th th for that practical perspective. This is a really these are these are pretty crucial issues. I'm communities so that involves men and women so that is the case while. Here's here's another response. Got which I just have to repeat because I thought it was kind of hilarious. This other guy said the workers actually equally divided between the sexes is just that men men give all their work to one guy and his reindeer. I don't know let me let me. I want to bring in my good friend friend Dana. You'll hear because I got to blame him. He's the one who got me onto this. He's our he's our producer. He's also news guy here. He's a man whereas many hats here w. e. b. one of the last week was my interlocutor. When you're talking about almost half jokingly said so you all set with your Christmas shopping and he said well my wife told me you know you only have to get one thing thank meaning of course a present for her and she shopping up for probably the rest of the family and the extended family etc.? Yeah but she also made me feel like I was the last person in the world that did that. Okay wow okay that's important. That's important another strength in numbers. Shame yeah you're the you're the one guy who has this habit the of terra terrible thing and you better straighten up and fly right. I'm GonNa get it all done next week. Okay that's good. That's good and I. After that I sort of felt so guilty guilty actually went out and did a little Christmas shopping myself this past weekend and so there you go I mean it is it is possible guys it is possible people out there. I am going to thank my guest. Very much for coming in Actually Lisa Senegal's been on the phone. The chair of the Vermont Commission on women for sharing doing some thoughts about this issue of the extra burdens taken on by women during the holiday season. Of course it's year round but it seems to really step up during the holidays. And what can I say other than guys. We need to step up ourselves. Our own gave a little bit here. Cathy Murphy also has been my guest here in the studio. She only had to come a hundred yards down the street from our neighbors. The Snow Street emporium here in Waterbury Marie and It's it's great to see you Kathy's well thank you and I wish you both five very happy holidays by the way. Do some relaxation time. Please I I really want you both both in all the folks out there to do that. It's not all about it's not all about just getting the shopping done and Wiley so i WanNa meet you. Were who've worked fantastic store and I don't care if it's really wonderful. Thank you very much already there zero. So we're GONNA shift gears now because I did want to get a little bit more thinking talking about this News event today where the House. Judiciary Committee voted to articles of impeachment against the President President of the United States and with us to join. Join US this morning. Is Bob a one of our commentators National commentators. He was with talk media news for a long time. He's he's now Out is a freelance commentator on the scene around the national news and Bob Good Morning. Good morning how are you doing. I'm doing one okay. Just waiting for Christmas now. Don't just wait. You GotTa Get out there and actually do some. You're you're a guy you need to get out there and do some shopping and ask you why you know. Hey can I help out okay. What what part of the meal can I prepare? You know. I don't like the the elbows and things I'll do mine online share. Oh I see okay. Yeah that's the that's the other way ago well Hey Bob I wanted to check in with you because obviously big news this morning and you are You are I'm sure watching it very very closely. What what are your thoughts? Well they had a fourteen hour marathon yesterday a little bit of inside baseball. I always like to bring these things out. There was a White House Christmas party and they Member saw that that they were going to be missing it. 'cause The you know the the hearing was quote drug out according to the Republicans because because they said Chairman Nadler wanted more primetime exposure so as a result they drug it out longer since they had to miss the Christmas party it went on for fourteen hours. A little a little bit of insight personal stuff. I think the listeners You Might WanNa know. That doesn't count for anything but that's the way it is in DC. So it wasn't how long time and then today's the you know Official Movement on it and then it goes to the House floor He'll be impeached. I I think with no Republican votes and then the end result is going to be the Senate and the big thing in the Senate. Dave is pretty simple You you know. Are they going to fast or are they going to drag it out the president by the way sort of wants a drug out believe it or not the the president actually actually is He was saying last week or tweeting last week. I guess is the best way to describe it that he wanted a fast result in the Senate On the other hand I think on some days he wants to be he wants to get into bringing into Biden's and anybody else he thinks might Might come in for some embarrassment harassment or something What's the current reading here of what he wants holidays? Everybody's talking about bringing in the binds. But the Biden's have no relevance whatsoever. Let let's hypothetically I just wanted to stress hypothetically ear so nobody listening Kinda goes wild on you. Let's say hypothetically that Hunter Biden was wrong in everything he did in the Ukraine. Everything Shouldn't have been there shouldn't have even pointed to the Ukraine on the map. Hypothetically hypothetically okay. That's still raises the question though does the president of the United States have the right or the ability. Eighty to bring up. You know This in a conversation with another foreign president and the suspicion of linking it to foreign eight so no matter what Biden would have done or not did not do. It has no relevance relevancy to the call it doesn't And it shouldn't so I don't see the benefit of bringing hunter Biden in there except politically to damage joe by. Yeah I I guess. I'm GonNa play the devil's advocate. Take a little bit with you just for a moment. And you're a former Republican member of Congress and I'm somebody who's listeners occasionally keeps me of being too liberal at is kind of ironic here. Yeah but I'm I'M GONNA I'M GONNA I'm GonNa push the defend trump here. Well I'm going to push the baby the Jim Jordan Doug Collins Line here for moment And and and it would be like this. Yes That that if hundred did do something worthy of investigating And did something wrong. And and and the president of the United States is as head of the executive branch which doesn't include law enforcement calls up An another you know the head of another country and says hey we have this investigation instigation. Do we want to launch into ex Can you help us out with our investigation of ex The Collins Jordan at center reliance seems to be. That's it's quite all right but see. There's the problem I think is that if in fact that was a scenario With with Hunter Biden. Then I think that the State Department would have every right to be able to mention this that it should be looked at and mentioned it to the president isn't of Ukraine's Top staff our State Department should be able to mention it. As long as there's no tie to foreign aid I I'll and I'll give you the best example in the world I have been on. I know thirty congressional trips. Where at least on those rose thirty trips somebody from the congressional Side Democrat and Republican have mentioned to foreign and leaders and everything else under the sun that you know we have interest. If you continue to do this we may look at Not supporting supporting. You have interest how what where do you stand on Israel. Where do you stand on Cuba? Where did you know so I've seen that one hundred times happened? I think that the the State Department could have done it. I think the president himself. It's off color for him to do it now. The big question is did he tie a quid pro quo. Can they prove that to To cutting foreign aid. That's that's just the the question I think out there that to resolve in their mind. Yeah I I I think that that really is a key question here and I also think I mean I. It has been pretty while resolved in my own. Mind I I I'm not I'm not letting the president off the hook here and I don't want people to think that I am all of a sudden doing that because I mean if you think about this imagine if there were actually a legitimate investigation of some. US person that encompassed another country. This would never rise to the level of any part of a conversation between the two presidents of the United States in that country it would be handled maybe by the FBI may by You know if it were drug a drug thing. Da Va would be doing something You know right or you know maybe by the State Department of involved. You know some kind of counterintelligence thing I mean there's there's just so many levels That you would be handling this way below where the president right Operates it it just it. It is It's a mind. Boggling jumped up to think that all of a sudden the United States the president of the United States is going to get on the phone and ask for an investigation of somebody who got a cushy sinecure job I mean that's just That that is just not even really in the room. So I think they know the answer is was there a quid pro quo. I and they haven't been able to establish it look. I think the call was uncalled for. I don't think the president should have mentioned anything. Yeah about his opponent on the call but they still don't have the nailed down where somebody says. The president ordered me to cut the foreign aid. I think it was our that. The president is why I told them no quid pro quo. He said that to protect themselves. You know but but the question remains you know. I mean people believe it's a quid pro quo. Can they prove it's a quid pro quo. Now they had the president under oath That's a whole different world. Because that's what happened to bill. Clinton he got he got under oath. You know that's true at the time but he did know that that is true and then the failure to get the president under oath I think was a key. Failing on the part of the investigation from our. That's where that's where it should have happened And I and I do I wanna I do WanNa roll the clock back. Speak at all that because You know it's not that back that far but let's think back to the phrase individual one for a moment and we've and refresh us on on on what that was you mean with the The Michael Michael Cohen Michael Cohen ends up urban jail. The Guy He's allegedly conspiring with is the president of the United States. Right and individual one. Yes yes I I still can't understand why the Democrats I mean. I mean if you think if you think this one's a little thin this phone call to the president of Ukraine is a little thin individual one I think in terms of actual You know a real criminal nexus here is is. It's thicker isn't it. I do too. I think they had more to hang on the other thing too now. This is a pure political debate of what I'm about to say but I I oh I think the democratic side should have done everything under the sun in this impeachment. Everything under the sun to drag Rudy Giuliani to the table publicly. Everything and they didn't and I know they didn't It's because they didn't want to go into twenty twenty rudy would've fought it. They would've had to go to court battles. They didn't WanNa go into twenty twenty. You know with all of this out there but I think Rudy Giuliani could have led to you know. Who did he talk to on? Whose behalf would did he talk to anybody about the foreign aid did he talk to anybody in Ukraine about foreign aid? I mean I think that could could have been. I don't know I'm not saying that's the outcome. It would've been by surely think that Rudy Giuliani would have been a treasure trove of information rudy. Giuliani would have been and a lot of would've showed good. Is I'll tell you this whole connects. Well we'll have to let the historians deal with that. We got to at the end of the show here on this Friday morning. Bob Many thanks so much for joining me this morning. I have a great weekend. You that's about it for the day Graham show here. WD FM and am tune in Monday. Morning we're going to have. Mary Powell the outgoing chief. Executive with Green Mountain power on and don't forget to Stay tuned now for Bill Sayer. Commonsense radio in the middle midday news service. Evergreen have a great weekend everybody.
Sammie Collison and What Every College Student Needs for School HGG403
"This is the average guy network and you have found a geek show number four three recorded on may twenty third twenty nineteen. Here at home gadget geeks. We cover all the beaver technologies and. News. Reviews product updates conversation offer the average tech guy. I'm your host Jim Dawson. Broadcasting live from the arcada t- studios here in a stormy Mike. We, it is the it's like I think we I think we had severe weather like a warnings just come in. So we have until midnight tonight. So if the show all goes down, you know, why that's true. I haven't heard any lightning. We had some. We had a storm come through early this evening. The big ten is doing their college. The baseball championship series is going on at TD Ameritrade park here in town. I know that a stop for a second and then come back in. And after the storm came through certainly we have not been getting the weather of our friends down in the central plains, down there in Oklahoma and Texas, lots of flooding, it is it has been serious weather down there. So you've been affected by the floods, or just too much water down there of so sorry for you. And it's, it's just that time of year. And of course. So we in the midwest are kind of used to this, but it can be kind of jarring so be safe. Make sure you're using all your technology this time of year, especially in the planes to track the weather coast, we post the show with world-class show notes each week out of the average guy dot TV and then we'll be a few tonight. You can also join us live on our mobile app. Don't forget to download and you can get it for free. We thank our patriot supporters who do that, for us every single month. Appreciate what you guys do home gadget, geeks dot com. You can download that iphone Android. Have it available best way to listen on the road. Or if you have limited bandwidth, or in do it live on Thursday nights. That'll pop up. It'd be available there. But best way to get that home gadget geeks dot com to thank everybody as well, who's joined us in our discord group. Mike thing has been doing pretty well. It kind of goes in waves, right? Yeah. Bunch of activity than kind of nothing bunch activity. I think it's so we get maybe to the two hundred number, don't you think it'll probably be kind of off and on. Yeah. And we get these spikes, you can tell when people start to listen to podcast over the. On monday. We had a lot of people to join on that Sunday Monday, timeframe and a lot of good conversations still going on out there. People are still posting great stuff. It's been great having the different categories. So find a category that you're interested in and go and, and speak, your mind and chat. Join us in the disco group my daughter. Samantha see we call her Sammy, I e if you're going to spell domestique that up she won't be able to find me on Twitter. Shoe will absolutely crush you we, we are going to have around last week, but moved it to this week and Sammy, welcome to your first home gach geeks. Thanks for having me here. Let's, let's get to know you a little bit like smoke of the folks who listen to home. Gadget geeks. Have heard me talk about you. I probably talked about you more on the Gallup podcasts that I do not as much here, but a lot of family stories, I'm sure you've been mentioned a dozen or so. But tell us kind of toss where you're at in school. And what you're studying. So this fall will be a junior at northwest, Missouri state. I'm studying my full major is mass. Media multi me journalism, which is just journalism for the most part. I work for the northwest Missourian this fall, I will be campus news editor and promotion. Congratulations. It's always nice for dad to hear his daughter gets promoted had a friend at work call you the editor in chief. So you got that promotion. Even though that's not necessarily true Jen said in her mind, you will always be the chief. Journalism is under attack like especially here in the United States. Right. I mean it's just a crazy time to be a journalist. Why would why why would you want to be a journalist at twenty nine hundred? I mean, this has been a passion of yours for a while you wrote for the school newspaper when you were in high school wide journals, I came to journalism in a kind of roundabout way. But I've always at the heart of it for me storytelling. I've always been interested in stories. I read a lot is a kid. I love movies. I live TV shows, Annella podcasts. And I when I was younger I thought I wanted to be a novelist, but he never had the patience for that. And I just didn't like long form didn't appeal to me in my the way that I think, in the way that I write, but I kind of stumbled into journalism through a series of classes in high school and just really fell in love with it with getting to interact with real people, and tell their stories in get into what the world is actually, like 'cause sometimes it can feel like you live in a bubble when you stay in one town for as long as I've lived in Bellevue. So I just I kind of fell into it that way and fell in love with it. And I love, I've loved it ever since I've been doing it for four or five years now. And I just it's a challenge, but I love it. And I love every single story that I learned something through it in that I get to meet so many people took his disrupted. The news. World fishy. No papers like newspapers around the country, maybe around the world are struggling to, to just have enough subscribers. They're having to change the print. I mean they're having to change to go completely line line. If you go to an online newspaper today. It's just a mess like their staff to push so many ads your way to even have it makes sense. How do you feel I mean going into knowing in a couple years, you're going to graduate, and you've got, you gotta get a job to help me, pay those student loans. I certainly taking right at all things. How do you feel, how do you feel about the role of technology as it's replaced print, certainly? You guys are still printing on the college campus. Right. We get printed you bring print home and we see it, so it's not completely dead. But talk to me a little bit. How do you feel as journalists everything moving to the web print nod is applicable? It's a it's everything's in upheaval. The newspaper industry is trying to figure out how to fund the stuff and how to make it work. How do you feel about that? I think that. Well, in terms of advertising news has always been driven really heavily by advertising. Most newspapers for the past couple of decades have been more advertisements than content. So we're just seeing that translated to web in so that might look different from a web perspective Arista things being advertised for free, but I just don't I think I don't think it's that different. But I think people's the thing that affects us most people's attention spans are shortening, and they also want more. They want more content the accesses multiple stimuli. So people don't have as much patience for just sitting in reading, and that's it. They wanna see video. They wanna see audio. They wanna see photos, but you just don't get as much indepth news that way in one of the best ways for both retention comprehension and accurate reporting is print is, is text. And so, I think we're going to have to find a way to keep people's attention. Keep them reading, because that's what's best for news. That's what produces. Most quality news and obviously I'm biased is a writer, but the studies in the facts reflect that. And so, I hope that people continue to value reading in value print even if it's moved onto digital that there's, there's still value in text Mike as a lawyer. You, you rely a lot on text. How is this change? I mean, are you seeing is is this, this idea Sammy saying, you know, attention spans, and is that affecting you and your space and or or talk a little bit? Don't dialogue with me a little bit on that. How is that working as far as what you're seeing in your industry, one hundred percent? So you know how when you guys get a contract. Let's say you go and sign up at the gym, and you get a contract people already don't like to read, legal contracts. So now take the, the attention span aspect, and how people are not used to reading long documents or documents at all. I mean to be honest Jim, you can probably have a career where you don't read. Every day you might deal with numbers. You might listen to audio you might create video, but you might not be forced to reduction. So in my industry, it's coming to were actually. I mean in my field. One of my tasks when I first got into my new position was our CEO said rewrite this entire agreement I wanted to read, like I wanted to be entertaining onto be funny. I want this to be for the average person take out all the legalese. So I took, you know, one of arguments that has literally, the heart and soul of our company agreement. We use every single day with new people, and it was rewrite it. So that, you know, anyone who's had non-attorney could get in there and read it and enjoy it. And it was kind of interesting. So it's even changing the way we have to write and which is super hard for new law school grad, you've just been pounding your head. How to write in a legal way a legal format in a very formal manner. And now you have to change it because even legal contracts now need to be written in entertaining way. So it's changing our industry because you definitely recognize if I if I gave you guys three sample contracts nasty guys which one. In you, like the most I have some that are just I mean, I even enjoyed reading my handle would've loved reading them, and she is the opposite of an attorney. She is a polar opposite. And so it's really changed the way we read, because a lot of these now are intended, at least in my space, I'm in the murders neck was space. So these documents are going to the executive team in the board of these companies as far as whether you're going to buy or sell your company, and they want to see it in a more her -taining way, you know. And if you bore them to death, they're not gonna read it and they're gonna throw it to the side whereas if you can wow them. So I never thought we get to a day where I need to write a contract, that's actually going to entertain the opposing party so opposing counsel. Now opposing counsel understanding they hate it. And I hit as an attorney because it doesn't, you know, legal language has a meaning like there's a reason legal language is the way it is a lot of people think we're just being uppity, and, you know, low lawyers like to do it's only Laura's created, and that's not true. I mean, a lot of this stuff has, you know, case law around what a certain word means and there's all this history and, and actually if you're historian, if you are a true writer, you probably really do like the way. Lawyers, right. Because it has meaning it has history. It's really kind of it's, it's an art form. You find warriors who can write in a legal way in their effective with it. It's actually a really fine art, and it's really interesting to find a lawyer who can write like that. So yeah, it's, it's affecting us, too. But as far as me listening, I read so much every single day for my job. I, I am guilty. Sammy don't kill me. I him guilty of getting a lot of my news in podcast form, or audio form, video form, just because the only time I have is the drive to work, maybe the drive home and then over the lunch hour, I'm eating in. I'm already reading, so much during the day than my is just break into kind of listen to it, but my big concern, it's him, he'll have to weigh in on this, because what I'm concerned with is the journalists write the ones who go out and do the hard work. They knock on doors. They get the story they're investigative. Journalists are getting the, the nitty gritty details. They're doing the hard work. They work for, you know, the, the big news publications the ones we all know about. Right. Whether it's your big city newspaper. It's your New York Times a Wall Street Journal all the big papers, and they're the ones that Jim you mentioned early are struggling to figure out how to fund the paper, whether it's advertisements or or things like that. And then you get all of the second, I call it kind of secondhand news worth, the bloggers who pick up a story from the New York Times, they get the facts from there and they put their opinion on top of it. But that Rulli, maybe that didn't take as much weenie the investigative journalists to do the hard work. So we so it scares me, how people are focusing now. More on the blogs and everything like this. There's nothing wrong with dogs. I love getting my news, because it provides a different perspective. But if we don't have that initial source those people, you know, we were talking in pre show that people who go out and the beat journalists. Right. The ones who get the real story without those people. Everyone else is a creek without a paddle, right? Like they don't even have the base journalism to go off of. So I mean is that true? Or is that just a outsider's perspective on what's going on? But I see it as all like. A lot of the people are taking the good journalism, and kind of branching off and taking it doing their own spin on it. Yeah, we struggle with that not so much smaller newspapers, but overall in the in the kind of culture around journalism now, especially I personally have a lot of beef with the fact that we have a twenty four hour TV news cycle. What that's done to journalism because it's all commentary, all political commentary in, so the heart of the story kind of gets distorted because it's easier to just take the facts that you that, that match your viewpoint and then put a spin on it in that's easy to digest. But I think the big thing thinking about what journalism looks like in twenty nineteen. I think the important thing is to get comfortable with being uncomfortable because the facts are not always gonna line up with you with what you want to believe or what your preconceived notions are what your world view is. And so sometimes you're going to get you're going to get something thrown at you or a story thrown at you and you're going to be like that completely gives me cognitive. And you have to process that get through it in the move on and learn and grow from that in. So I that's why I think news is so important still inside the culture of twenty four hour news cycles in bloggers that, that. The facts and the two sided in the multisided situations are still important. I totally agree. That's why I hope we figure out a way to fund the journalists who are going out and doing the hard work art agree. We need to find some way, besides advertiser, some way to fund it because otherwise, there's going to be no real journalism. It's going to be just all the second hand and actually, the second hand people won't even have a job either because they won't have anything to report on point the facts from a lot of the people, and we were talking about a podcast earlier. It's called the daily in the New York Times it's their podcast. And in this podcast, they interview journalists about their article, and when I hear the amount of work that goes into one article that these people do, I mean some of these people are working on these articles for more than a year. Right. And I mean it's not rare in that was shocking to me, especially in what we just talked about in the age of quick twenty four seven, you know, new cycle Gidding get it out fast as soon as it happens. Get it online. And it was baffling to me. But it also showed me that okay. It's almost completely. There's almost like two styles of journalism. There's the twenty four seven news cycle, where they wanna fast. They want it now they want an emotional. They wanted polarizing one side of the other get your attention. And then there's the people who actually put in the time and the effort to look at every single angle and a man, it'll kind of opened my eyes to this whole world of journalism that I didn't even know existed. Yeah. There's a lot of newspapers in outlets that their policy is we have to have it. I it doesn't matter if it's right in the run. Twenty corrections on a story in it in the end, the thing that they originally ran with as soon as it broke, is, is from whole cloth wrong, really. Yes in so that's distressing to me, because. People need to have patience with journalism because good journalism takes time, and it takes talking to a million people in taking multiple half hour to three hour interviews, and breaking them down into the most important parts in putting that into cohesive story that takes time, but that stuff is important in. That's the real truth. That's where you're going to get to the heart of the issue. Couple of things coming from the let me just jump in really quick. So Mike earlier when you said mergers and acquisitions it sounded. I have everyone says that I've got to really enunciate my merger. Was down. That's what I say, IMI. But then people say, some people who aren't familiar. They say what's Manet and murderers, neck positions. Though, mergers and acquisitions though, it's super good. I think everybody thought it was just a, you know, I've thought about going into murders law to, you know criminal, you are a lawyer. Out. We could go hunting stuff, right? Yeah. Exactly. Justice says from the chat room, he says he wants his new news feed aggregate, or that d- dupes the data and searches for original sources that provides hard facts. Only I think we all do. I do think because this is a human deal. No matter what you, do you introduce bias right in into what we're doing CME, one of the things that has impressed me? The most about you is we've talked a ton about this. Like, you know, you and I get hours together in the car to and from a northwest, Missouri state. It's really been the best thing, I ever did was drive you to college all the time like it's been fun, talking on those with those this time together, but you have this, and it's always surprising me because, you know, doing a lot of podcasting, we definitely come at this from a very biased perspective like it. Podcasting the way we do. It is not not necessarily investigative journalism. You know, we spout a few things. We don't necessarily treat things fairly. We're not we're not. It's not intended to be that way. There is news in it buried. In it. There's facts in those kinds of things burden it but you've been you know, you've been very concerned about being unbiased, what, what is the drive for you? Like that keeps coming up of being fair. I mean you certainly have your own opinions, and I have heard them trust. Yeah. She has painted in spite of life, for someone I come across her purple innings, are different than my political innings, and that's okay. Right. Because we have a very a safe space here at the house to talk about those things. But why, why is that so important to you? Why is that idea of being unbiased so important you? Yeah. Joke. Sometimes sometimes, I'll be having a conversation, somebody like taking journalism cap off or this person Sammy, in this is journalism Sammy 'cause I, you kind of have to take your opinions and just put them in a box and put them away, but I think that's so important because of trust in respect. I want my audience to trust me, regardless of what my opinions are they wanna trust the I'm gonna tell them what, what the truth is regardless of what I come across in, if somebody tells. Me something in an interview that is the whole truth. And I it conflicts with my world view I have to show of my worldview aside, and I have to print that because it's for the good of the audience, and I want them to trust, and respect me in have that. But put that faith in me as a writer, we're doing a whole series of Gallup around trust in the media. We have a brand podcast coming out called outside the echo chamber out of the echo chamber. I think is what we're calling brand new. We haven't even put an episode out yet, but Sammy, we're, we're, we're focusing on this idea of trust. I played the trailer for you, and you're like, yes, because that is important. Right now, you know, the facts is, is tough still not always truth is not always true is still the way we see things is still filtered through our own cultural, education or historical biases that we have in, even though we saw we may see something happen. We may not be able to trust that one of the things you said. Sammy as you were saying, you got to talk to people in interview, people and get right? I mean, I think that's the thing is oftentimes Mike you and I come at reporting on this podcast, very central to our own opinions him, right? How did I like it? What did it do? There may be some facts buried in those opinions somewhere. What is very me centered Sammy on what I'm hearing a lot of times, the heart journalism is getting more than just how you think or feel about what, like what other people say what other people do what are you using from a tech perspective, when we think about some of the tools you use today? What is the modern journalist us, what are the tools? What are some things that you use my number one tool? But I use for everything is this isn't I found I record interviews on here. I often take photos on here because I check out a camera from the school. It's Dallas ESL are with a huge lens. It takes really nice photos. But sometimes you something. Happens on the street or something happens in a meeting, and you don't have your camera on you and you're like annual photo of this zoo ticket. You're found any ticket photo. The, the modern journalist is you have to maintain some of your humanness, but some sometimes you have to part of you always has to be on a journalist new always have to be looking for news. And you always have to be thinking about what's the story. Could this be a story? What's this person saying, what does that mean in the broader context, you always have to be ready to pull out your phone? The thing that we joke about is I went to visit my high school last year, and I happened to be in the newsroom at my high school when a lockdown drill happened, so they say locks lights on a site. You turn off the light lock the door, you get in the corner of the room that way, if an active shooter, walks by they think that nobody's in the room in Conley's talking to us while this, this drill is happening. And she saying, you guys know what to do if sugar comes they say, yeah. You do this we would probably get in the closet. We'd probab-. Barricade the door and I say, no. If an active shooter on campus. You pull out your phone and you start recording that he was a journalist or a different type of human being because sometimes when when something newsworthy, happens, you don't think I'm a member of the news. You think I must document? And so the journalist is mobile I can theoretically do my entire job on my phone. So that is the most important tool to me. Didn't you have a picture that you took that made the paper from your phone, and there was a photo on a one, I could probably dig it out later that I one of my then news editor, Katie was writing a story about a student who had died was just a medical incident was acted. I know. But they had a memorial for her on campus. In a ton of people were there, so many more people than we thought showed up, Katy couldn't make it. And so she said, Samy, can you go in just record? What happens like it's important bits, do interviews, whatever. Just like in Finnish filling out the story. And so I get there. I sit through all the talks in record a few things. I talked to a few people, but towards the end is people are starting to filter out. I'm just lingering seeing if anything's going to happen in this group of students gets in a circle, and they start a prayer circle and they're, they're, they're sharing emotional stories in everybody's crying. And so I am like standing arm like this is happening. So I pull out my phone. I climb up on a chair. And I take a photo of the I recall my phone messages to Katie in it ends up on one the next day. So that was a moment where I was like this, this, this needs to be photographed. I wasn't here to take photos. But this is important because we already had a photo plan for one we ran that one immediately under it, because it was just a powerful moment. One is for the for the novice. That was the very front cover, and it was above the fold which is prime real estate. And that was just a really good gratifying moment for me of journalistic instinct. Super interesting in the sense that we've gotten good enough hardware devices, it's the phone that'll take pictures, kind of kind of worthy to be on a front page. So to speak when you guys are working on articles stories. Do you have some kind of fancy tech, that you're keeping track of all of this on or what, what are some of the tools, so we write all their stories on Google Drive? And we also use trello, the project management system. So we have we have Collins, so we have stacks in every every store area gets a card. And then we put it in story ideas, and then, as it does the editing process, it moves over, and we can attach the story document from Google Drive onto the card. We can put comments and say, here's how it's going, we can attach of tug refer to that card. So that photographer can communicate with reporter, in, they can talk about what they're going to photograph for that story in it's just generally the best system, and we also use slack for messaging. Within the staff to keep in touch. So we have different channels than individually can contact reporters through there is everybody just have slack on their phone is that kind of keeps mostly like on our phone in that we use trello, both on our phones in on our computers. You probably use trello. More on your phone, then your computer or the other way around. I wore on my computer just because I always have my computer on me when I'm working, but I do sometimes use it on my phone, if I need to edit a story really quick before deadline and I'm like in class. That's never happened, though. Right. Never. No. Never definitely not not paying attention during history while I ended a story could could you mostly write a story on your phone, do an absolutely probably writing entire story myself, because I could record it with my use the just the voice memos app that comes on. I phone to record it. I can then plug my headphones in and type it out on Google Drive, and then write the story on Google Drive attached to trial out and send it off to the enters. Speaking of your phone, one of the things that you've mentioned to me, the importance of carrying battery and a charger with us network can talk a little bit about that. So I have a portable charger that carries about four charges on it also has a flashlight on it, but this is super important because having your phone charged at all times is super important. You never know when a story is gonna break editors gonna text you. You're gonna need edit something last minute or take a photo. But also, we keep these because a couple of months ago, the fires in California, trapped a bunch of college journalists on their campus in they were trying to cover the fire that was surrounding their campus while they were on campus, surrounded by the fire, and cutting off power in so they all needed to keep the story, they kept updating their website, but obviously, they had no power, so they pulled out battery chargers, they drained gas out of people's cars to charge phones, because that was how they were staying connected and keeping people on campus and outside of campus. Updated on what was going on because they were. The main line of communication just have that one. I, I just have the one, I can also charge off on my laptop but on campus. We started developing a debt disaster management plan, or does it. Astor coverage plan in that involves we need to get more portable chargers, either from for our newsroom, or I like individual journalists need to get them. So that wave a disaster does happen. We do lose power. We can keep our phones and laptops, charged that we, we continue covering, even though we may be in the middle of disaster. What brand is that one? It is case logic. Okay. Just just for the record last, when we had the tornado go through here that went south of here a couple years ago, wiped out took out. We'll member you Mike. You did the I think the video the drone video for the Harley Davidson. Yeah. Right. After that storm Mike on their around Junction City or whatever Pacific junction junction. Yeah. They I hit by it. Hard, we lost power for I don't know four days, it was kind of a nightmare, but I went out and bought Sammy and Sarah, both those Shopco the are actually clearances him in. I loved it because it had a flashlight in it. And so it was one of those kinds of things. Yeah. Where it was like, okay if we're going to have one of these, let's, that's at seemed like a really handy, a national thing to kind of have on it. Mike in your everyday carry a thing. You gotta you gotta battery new or a looks the exact same. That's what I was wondering. It's an anchor brand really like it again. Same sort of size. So it has about four charges with it. I got it because I was you know, when I was travelling a hundred percent of the time, it's slim slips right down to a bag in a century. It turned my backpack into like a portable charter because I would just always be when I'm traveling have not plug in, especially when you're flying, and you need an Uber like flying Uber. All it's it just takes a lot of drain on your battery. So I do I carry one every single day. I love it. It doesn't have the flashlight though. That would be nice. I carry us up full flashlight on me all the time. All right. And even on when you live on an older campus. There's not outlets everywhere. Or if you're in the dining hall, everybody's always hogging the few outlets that are in there. So it's nice to have on hand. If I'm just doing several back toback glasses in my phone is dying as I'm using it a complete it in and I also have six foot phone charger cable that I keep in my backpack. So I if I if there isn't outlet free or any dislocated my backpack and still work on it. I always have enough charter cable links that I can or like if the power strip is all the way under the desk. You don't want to pull it all the way out. Long phone charger cables are an underrated investment totally agree. Everyone complains about the bulk of them when you're like, no, no, they're I wearing the same thing and your dad. I think what Jim, you're the one who taught me I think it was you that when you're traveling, get the three prong outlet so that we've had an airport and same thing as you just said. And there's only one outlet like, hey can I it can you plug all police? And then you can still plug in. So if you have the three prong, and so I got one of the three. Problem with USB's on it. So that even if someone was taking up the spots, my K I all I just need to do is plug, and you can pull yourself right in, I just need this port. You're one ahead on the front of being courteous. It was your dad your dad gob into this, and I learned it in literally, every time I was at the airport. There was always that time where someone else had taken, both Alex Kennedy just plug in, you can plug right? In like oh, yeah. Sure that works and all this home, nobody ever says no to that by no one. There's no, like why would you know sorry I'm, I'm gonna pull it for a second. And in in plug in like, oh, yeah. That's, that's fine. Belkin makes that kind of the long ones, you're actually three I bought one. That's a square that's got to on the side. And then the USB is on the top. That's also super handy to have a kind of keeping your bag. That's sammy. Do you keep any other from from gadgetry standpoint stuff that you keep on you any other gadgets that you find really important? My phone's I have. Oh, bluetooth over the your headphones. I use this more than like tied with my laptop second place, from my phone, most us tech products. I have these on me at all times, because I'm always wearing them walking to class using them when I'm typing interviews off of my phone when I'm just watching movies in my dorm, and won't don't want to bother my roommate. I probably have headphones on during waking hours, more often than I have off, which is probably not great for my social life, but, you know, people in glass, so it's fine. But yeah, I use the crap out of these and they also have cable that you can plug in, so I can have them bluetooth connected to my phone, and then just trying to headphones off and plugged them into my laptop. And they can charge while I'm using them lose nice. I like to look at those yet either super great. I've had them since October and they will probably last fruit Neons Neons because I was so tired of ear buds that break after six months, and you have to buy those thirty dollars every time I'd rather just invest in. Or you were constantly buying her apple Brandon ear buds. And she was just crushing them every time every semester, Sarah was saying to me organic get a new ear buds. I'm like it just bought her neuter buds. Like, what the heck so for her birthday this year, we said, let's get let's get you really nice payer. We went down to best buy, and I let her try them on, and we tried everything from the beats to the bows, to the Sony, Sony to miss, you name it. She tried him on in. I was cringing because I thought for sure, I kind of told her she could buy whatever she wanted, and it was kind of cringing because I suppose she's gonna say Bose. Yeah. She's gonna say both now and those are though, 'cause you use them. But these are great middle price alternative because you are comfortable there a little bit smaller. They are they fold up in their portable, and I can just stick them in my backpack, and they sound super great. When I mostly music, all the time, actually a little more comfortable than the boasts really. Yeah. The buzzer will tight on my head. The pads have just a little bit more firmness, which is counterintuitive but it is more comfortable. This is good because I've been looking. So I have the quiet quiet comfort fifteen's, the noise Ariza twenty-five one probably twenty five twenty five sue their noise canceling, but they have the cord. They're not bluetooth there. The old Salman. I got these things back when I was in undergrad. They have lasted. They are the best headphones I have ever had. I've traveled with them every single week. Same as you Sammy when traveling I mean, I had him on my head more than I didn't. And so they've last as one but now with the court, I can't use it with my phone, and I don't want to carry that Davos, I'm looking, I'm like, okay, I'm gonna if I'm going to upgrade, I want to kind of start fresh and look at all the options, maybe I need to look at those audio Technica 's, I've been looking at because I have air pods though, yet on flights air pods are useless, just like every other earbud on a flight. You need the over air noise cancelling. And so I've been carrying around actually I've just plugged into my played into my ipad last time. He's both an ipad. My phone is a total pain question for you, though. So are these devices, so I have a portable recorder, here's the task Cam DR, forty I use this for podcasting because it's got actually DSL on the bottom. So I can actually plug full microphones into this record are portable recorders are those thing of the past now with phones for journalists, 'cause I noticed, I don't I always see people. Now hold up their phone. Not holding up a portable recorder, I think, so. Yes, unless you're doing radio or doing something like NPR format where you do interviews edit together into a story audio wise, I use my phone one hundred percent of the time, okay? The quality is good enough that even in allowed crowded. Like I didn't interview in a Starbucks it like peak-time at, like, noon on a Saturday. And I could hear the person I was interviewing just fine. Really in. Did you have it set on the table where you? Able or if I'm standing, I'll hold it like between us between us that way. Between us that way, I can hear my questions and then you hear them as well. But it picks them up just finally audio quality is great and for typing up interviews it works in. It's always on me. So that phone. I mean, that has changed the industry for sure, for sure for sure, you don't need you. It's preferred to have a nice microphone or next camera with you. But if you don't have it, it's not the end of the world because you can do it on your phone. Is there anyone that's doing maybe a high quality, Mike plugged into their phone? I'm sure some I don't have we we've we haven't been doing that in north west. I've thought about that. Okay. But I'm sure there are some people there YouTubers that do that for sure for sure. Right. And maybe, maybe once you get if you got into podcasting, maybe that would be a time where you look at look. I've never even looked in the options. I really don't know what would even be an option for. I'm sure there are a bunch of high quality. Yeah, it would make sense. I'm sure that I haven't used it, but I'm sure it would up my audio quality a little bit before apple. Took away the phone check act that was in there right at you could they made a microphone you. Could you could plug in I actually owned it? Now when I moved to the iphone eight it's now sitting in my bag, I really need to kind of give it away, or I don't know what to do with it at this point, I guess, get retrofitted onto something. But Mike, I do find from Sammy's. Testimony on this that the phones good enough in a lot of cases for kind of hold that in the center. Get close enough to it. Even with noise in the background it works works out pretty well. Yeah. The best deal you can invest in is journalist is a phone with a good camera microphone in a long battery life. See. You and I are on iphone, but the other day you said to me something evil. Oh. And so you repeat that for the for been thinking about once my contract with sprint is up in my iphone is kaput as it will be in a few years. I'm sure because the way of apple, I'm thinking about switching to pixel watts. He's so I can get on project fi, and I can also have that camera my, my family has by the way, everybody else in the family Sammy, and I are the only I phone hold. I was the dedicated loan iphone user for a while. And then I got dad on it. Now I'm going to ditch in. Now is this Mike that the windows guy becomes the apple guy who podcast with an apple guy who becomes a windows? I was I wanted to comment on your comment to her. You're gonna you said os. You're gonna say something, and it's going to be, you know, sacrilege whenever wait what are you an are you an apple fan? Now, this is we've, we've just gone in circles, how we don't really know which way is up. With not like apple. Salmon, you guys use Macs at the school for any of your in the lab upstairs has max and then in the newsroom, we have max because it runs adobe the best we use in designed to design pages muse Photoshop debt in light room to edit photos. Yeah. We use lease in design for video or nine designed us premier for videos use the full suite adobe has really locked up that I mean if you want to talk about a monopoly on that end of the market. Right. I mean it's a Dobie or nothing prices reflected, right? Yeah. Making it a subscription system has been raking in cash. No, it's just that my school base for it, and I don't will eventually though, someday, you probably will, like I do think your future, like the, you may work for somebody, but I think the future of journalism has a lot to do with both working, maybe four a, an organization Anna side hustle. I just I can't imagine most of the most successful journalists at I know today are doing their own thing, as well as writing freelance. And maybe that's the right way to say it, right. Writing freelance or hot casting freelance. I think there's a space. I alluded to this earlier, you know, Mike, and I do we're not journalists were podcasters, right. And we're having a good time and we're talking about stuff, and we're not really, we don't really care about bias or unbiased, but Sammy, I think there's a place for in podcasting, four news done, Mike. You mentioned you know, before this New York Times when the same there's a place for real journalism in podcasting. And I think you know. Yeah. And I think that as much as I'm personally, dedicated to print and writing and reading things in text. There is there is a place for kind of niche journalism in becoming an expert in one thing in reporting on that no matter where it happens in being mobile, and then Bod casting about it. Interviewing people one on one about it. I think that there's certainly a place in the industry for that. And that could be an avenue to go down. Or think it actually goes that way and the other way. So some podcasting about some things where you're interviewing people, you turn those interviews. How cool would it be if you're getting, you know, and who knows what kind of content this would be, but where your interviews Republic, you're doing these interviews as a podcast, and then you're putting all that information. Together imprint today, we're gonna live in a day where Google is going to be able to index. Everything we say audio and video is that's coming. But today really, really Orton I think still you get that audio content in. Written form so that the Google crawler can find it and, and do you guys when you're writing. So as the paper in your posting as journalists are you worried at all about SEO, does that do you think like, oh, I need to get keywords in here, and those kinds of things we try to be we're not very good at it is a new staff because that's just not what we're thinking about when a writing we're thinking quality journalism. We're not thinking hits online, but we do think about it, and I'm the one who as campus knew that are I'm the one who put stuff online. So I write the headlines for the website I put in all the tags in I write social media posts. That's why it's important that I take social media classes in, I'm taking web publishing this fall which talks a lot about a CEO. So we, we try to think about those things in our advisor encourages us to think about those things to write headlines differently for online than we do for print that way, they get if not more not. Mamoru search engine hits, but more social media hits because we gained a huge following this past spring. There was so last school year when I was a freshman, there was an accident at one of the bars in town, where a guy was drunk driving. Any crashed into the front of the bar and killed a north west student in it was hugely devastating for campus so many people knew and loved her in. So it was a huge story. And so this spring he had his trial in. We covered all five days of the trial with huge in depth stories in photos, and stand up videos outside of the courthouse talking about giving a summary of the story in we gained so many social media, followers on Twitter Facebook from covering the stories. So now we're trying to take advantage of that following and keep those people reading in so we're thinking more about what's going to get what's going to draw our community in, in keeps them reading our stories from a visual standpoint. And from a headline writing standpoint, can you do that and not be bias? Yeah. I think so. I think it's just honestly it's, it's kind of like calculus, like math putting all of the right pulling the right pieces out and putting them if the top will grab people's attention naturally. We don't. I mean you could stretch the truth or be or get people fired up in angry. Oh, we don't wanna do that. We just want to take advantage of the assets that we do have in pull those in the forefront to get attention. In a more organic way, funny you mentioned a mentioned calculus. I think a lot of people think journalists are just English nerds and actually Sammy's way better at math. In math. And just to this chagrin of her high school math teachers who wanted her to. She was doing great. And they're like, all, would you do more of this? She's like, no, I'm actually more interested in writing, and they just killed them. They would always talk to us, it parent teacher conferences, and say, oh, can't could you just talk to her in are like, no, actually, we can't, I guess it's not really what she wants to do. Speaking of the school at, let's is, is, we think about that semi some advice. This is the advice section of the podcast. A lot of my listeners have children who are who are your age or younger in high school. Mike, yours will be here someday, you know, the benefits of this, but one of I think the best kept secrets in in we see this all the time in the work, I do a Gallup with our interns, with our highschool insurance is the value of dual enrollment in Santa. We're going to get you through northwest and three and a half years, which is pretty great. Save us ten grand or twelve grand something, something. And I say us 'cause you're helping pay for your for your own education. Once they think is important. But in Mike, I know you took some Doolan I think you did, right. You got some doing all lying. So Sammy just talk a little bit about what did you take, and what was the benefit of it? We certainly there's a cost benefit, but when you were in school, what did you take the cost and kind of explain, I think a lot of parents don't know, a dual enrollment is compared to AP. Everyone knows what AP explain a little bit the difference in what it means for a dual enrollment. So I took dole enrollment I took two types of Dylan realm at courses, I took them to community college, and I also took them through the university of Nebraska Omaha, and those looked a little bit different metro was more of a traditional doing role in that setting where you take the normal high school class that you also pay a little bit of money to college in the teacher is certified in that course at the college, and so you get credit for both of them at the same time in. So I paid forty dollars to metro for semester of psychology in was taught by basically match. Tro psychology professor in. So I got credit towards graduating high school for psychology. But I also that went on my transcript in that went to college in so I took psychology wants Mr. psychology in two semesters of German through metro at my high school in, then I also through new annot U N does a special deal where you take doing, but you also pay they also pay for you to take the test because all of the classes are also EP courses. And so you take the class, you get the credit but you can also take AP test for free at the end in case doing doesn't transfer correctly or you do better on one than the other or you just don't like I took AP calculus in high school, and I did do my credit, but I also took the task because I just didn't want to take the calculus his final which was cumulative. Do you remember the price you remember what we paid for the unco, I think there are two hundred bucks or something one hundred and fifty for vowed half price by the way, half priced tuition for both schools for sure? And the nice thing about, you know, was calculus in college is dismissed class in high school. It is two semesters, so you get stretched out and also because it's high school in college. You're going to class two or three days a week. So you're getting most classes or three credit hour classes, but in high school my calculus in two semesters of German were all five credit hour classes. So I was paying the flat rate for the class, but it was getting more credit hours, which is more money safe, which five hours at north west would be to twenty three hundred dollars for that class. We're paying out of state five hundred hours for one hundred fifty dollars is a steal. Save me. I came into college with, I think nineteen credit hours of credit, factoring in also took an N P class and took AP test. That if I had taken sixteen to seventeen credit hours this nest I could have graduated in three years, but I decided to get a little slower some graduating at three and a half, which was super smart. Mike. What was your experience yet? Exactly the same as Sammy. So I had the same thing I went to school in Kansas City. And we had Johnson county community college down there, who offered the dual enrollment, same thing, extremely affordable probably around that same forty fifty sixty dollars per credit. And so the one thing I looked into was because I had the option right? You can do AP take the AP tests at the end or you can do enrollment or same thing as you take a dual enrollment course, and you can also take the at the end for me, the big determining factor was look where you want to go to college and talk to the advisors there. And see if they're going to accept that Duca some of them will accept, you're almost every college in the country will accept your enrollment credit. The question is, are they going to ply, just as a gen Ed credit or are they going to actually apply it as the course you took? Right. Is it gonna count as a? Calculus. Math course or is it just going to be general genetic? So I talked to Creighton I knew I was gonna go to Creighton I talked to him adviser up here. They said it's gonna count, if you dig doing Roland from JC will count it as I knew I didn't have to take the AP test whereas if I go to different university, they might have said, no, we're only going to count it as genetic, then I would have taken the actual AP test, so that I could have gotten the actual credit 'cause API very different beast. You take the test. It's counted as that course. So if you know where you're going to college, it does help or if you know, generally, where you wanna go to college. A lot of times if I know I want to go to Nebraska state college system, whether it's, you know, Carney, Omaha Lincoln, you, then you can go ask them. So for me, it was planned ahead. Kind of go ask what you want to a dual enrollment was amazing. You're in your own high school environment, which already very comfortable in the teacher, like you said is accredited at the university level and the high school level a lot less pressure. A lot less distraction. Right. It's much easier to do a class in high school in college. I'll just say it college distractions. Right. A lot more things you can do instead of going to class, a lot more independent you. You'd spend one hour in class in two hours of homework on high school. You spend two hours in class. Do half an hour of homework, a great way to say it. So you're going to naturally focus on it more and more time on getting more help from the teacher because they have students, they're more engaged Yellowstone. It's just ingrate system over especially for. So I did it for all the classes that I knew out a hard time focusing on in college. So I took all the classes that actually wasn't too interested in I took those, my dual enrollment. So I could get those out of the way I knew in high school, I had to be there anyway. So it might as well take some classes I didn't care for. So I took all the ones that I wasn't going to be too interested in once I got to college. Parents, I would say if you have junior high children or they're in high school right now. It would be really, really worth your while to investigate this idea of dual enrollment in the school that you're in, even if you're think you're students are going to end up in junior college, or you know, or whatever maybe you're not even think about college at it is something in Sammy. You really you pushed us on this, which I was really glad you did. I didn't quite understand all the things that were happening with it. I wish I would have looked into it. More I wish I would have listened to a podcast or who said, hey, you know, dirtball go go investigate this more. And that's what I'm telling you guys. Now. You just did it. And then you'd be like, oh, yeah, here's the Bill, and that was on, like, oh, and then once a Mestre, you're paying, like three hundred dollars for two classes. This is so much money, and now you're paying money for my summer classes near like this is so much more expensive. Could you view and taken that can we go back in time and take that kind of dual enrollment even more effect too? If you think of so this is a prime example, if you're an accounting student, if you want to be an accounting student, and you want to be a public accountants, so means you're going to sit for the CPA exam. Okay. If you, if you did do enrollment that means you have a bunch of extra credit going into college. The CPA exam to sit for it requires more hours than you would normally get in a four year program at university. So most students if you come in with nothing to take the CPA if your adviser is smart, they're telling you take summer classes. So you're taking summer classes, every single summer to make sure you're going to hours if your advisers, not smart. They don't tell you that you have to take an additional year, or you have to do a master's program in accounting, even to just get the hours to sift, the CPA exam. But if you came in doing roll moment, you might have your you might have covered your buck because you might have enough hours ahead of time that you're good. And you can get all those hours in a four year span. Without even taking a single summer credit now. Some credits are great actually highly suggest them. I run now yet, aren't you the best? There's less pressure there, there. I mean, they are consolidate at least mine, where in a month whereas you'd have all semester, but it's a little less pressure. Real more relaxed environment. So, but you could cover yourself in a situation like that from taking entire year extra at a university. And, you know, if you're at a university, it's expensive that, that could save you forty thousand dollars, depending even more if you're like an Ivy league school. So, so just just prepare. I think Jim what you were talking about is, you know, you didn't really know about it. Sammy luck who is bringing the stuff to you as parents. So if you can know about these options ahead of time. It can really save some coin down the road, and if, especially if your student if your your kid is having to pay for this. So it's a big savings. That's serious. Pro tip, they're less work people. Yes. For. But on if you're programs like that, not just accounting. But that was when I experienced so let me, let me courage, if you're listening to the spot cast on my kids are already gone or my kids, are too young help those around you with this info. Like I think this is really important. This is tens of thousands of dollars. We're talking about in savings in kind of just about an hour worth of work to investigate. It's you. It's available kind of think about it. If you're, if you're students are going to go to college in any form, this can be a huge savings. Is it necessarily tech related? No, but do we always talk about tech stuff here? No. Like this is this is one of those podcasts were, or trying to be helpful. So, you know, if you're if you're in that boat, or you've got friends who are in that boat, or you've got friends with kids who are in the junior high high school. It is a really an in my kinda what I find is. It's only in the in kind of the privileged areas where the students write that take things. So if you are. In an area where you were very lucky in Omaha. And in Kansas City areas, we both live in very great school systems. Here are pristine, really good if you are engaged. And if you talk to the advisors, they have the information if you know someone who's not one of these areas talk to him about it because this is available for everyone. It's just that in the not so well, educated areas if people or, or the I call them the engaged areas, if the teachers need visors aren't engaged with their students. The students are never gonna know and a lot of times, the parents, don't know. So, so help help your friends out, talk to front abroad, it this could literally save them money. They should be paying you for this advice. Right, basically, brought Brian our says tests, the relaunch of the financial tech podcast. That's bad. Into student loans, and everything we could have a whole episode on that I will. I did a whole podcast with Christian on how to finance college, and it would apply today. Is it of when he started at Maryland way back in the day should be foam or six years ago? Now, we spend some time thinking about this is tens of thousands of dollars. Let me think it is. It's a gigantic investment, and there's some things you can do. But if you're not in that boat. It's you everywhere. You can't you can't this goes through bankruptcy. This goes through this is till you die. Yeah, thanks for that. Reminder. Yeah. Thanks, mike. I appreciate it. There's always so-fi though. If you're released if you had a lot of private high interest loans. So fi is actually a really good platform. I'm hoping that I, I make enough in crypto that I'm able to pay off Stanley Sloan. So. Crypto earthy here at the end of the show Sammy sick of me saying that Sammy, let's get let's have a fun topic really quick as we kind of bring this in for landing. You have got your brother's got you into Pokemon go, which. Wait. Really? Like, I still can't believe like you're the holdout like they were doing it. And you never played the Nintendo games growing up. I knew nothing about it. I was the least video game least, like all my brothers built computers for themselves for gaming and I did not. And I'm like, of my family. I'm the least tech savvy, which is kind of Larry, but this January Tim was in town on leave in Josh came over after like early in the morning. He was like get your shoes on Tim. We're going to talk about when we're playing Pokemon go, and I was like, I want to come because I wanted to get out of the house, and I want talk. Oh, bell. And he was like, well, if you're coming, you have to download Pokemon go so on January third, I downloaded Pokemon go and here I am five months later, and I met level twenty nine. Like I got my gold, gym leader badge for defending gyms for thousand hours after one month of playing in Josh's. Like, and I, I have a spreadsheet, that's always open. That's full of like my candies injustice, like how do you become a Polk Amman nerd in less than six months like Josh you don't understand? I don't know how to like anything casually. I am all in on everything. I like Sammy. The I you are. We have a lot of things in common. I like all of us. It's worth doing is worth overdoing. Let me as soon as they started playing. Yup. I love it. That's fantastic. Yes. A now I go, there's a there's a cemetery. That's in the really old part of LV that's nearby. It's probably like what would you say dad like a quarter of a mile half mile? Yeah, it's all a pill though. But I walked there every day, and I do the gyms, and I spent all the stops and I catch Pokemon, and then I come back in, like, that's my workout for the day. Because like on campus college campuses are the best place to play. Pokemon goes you live on a college campus and you're not playing what are you doing because there's gyms everywhere there stops everywhere in. So it's really easy to get levels really fast. So I was like, you know, I might as well do this thing and do it for real. But I'm so used to walking all over my campus all the time because they don't have a car. So I'm like I need to keep up my walking over the summer 'cause I also live on the sixth floor of my dorm, and I take the stairs. Because I'm claustrophobic at afraid of elevators. So I need to keep up my hill walking. So I don't the stairs don't cripple me when I go back to school in August. So it's worth it to play. So I actually I was in polka mongo casually with my wife, we loved it actually, when it first came out, I didn't know it still. It's still going instead and they still update it. They add new Pokemon every couple of months a lot better since it first. Yeah. So many fewer bugs so so much easier. Catch things east to be like impossible to get certain things, and now you could find them anywhere. Like I caught like twelve pitches day one time. Okay. I'm sorry. Did I just fall asleep? I won't be brewed. No. I'm just kidding. Actually took Sammy. The movie, and I was telling doubt about it. It was like, if you're going to see this movie he's like, no, I'm like, okay, here's the spoiler. But I did I did go walk with her when we she was going out to do it. And so we took we took and super enjoyable, great. We, we love spending time together, so it's, it's fun to be a part of that. I am afraid like this is the if I started doing this. Absolutely. Yeah. With all the things that you do. You don't need another thing on your play. Do not it. It's like the one thing that I keep on my phone that actually is enjoyable because I've because social media has become so unenjoyable when iphone gains or just a dumpster fire of time. So I it's like my one thing, and it also encourages me to get out of the house into spend spend time out in the fresh air, and, like it's, it's goal oriented. But it's not so much of a time suck as you would think it is based on how into it. I am. But really, it's like I, I walk like thirty thirty minutes to an hour. Our day. I spend on that walk and it's good for my health. It gets me out of the house and its incentivize getting out of the house. So I'm not like oh, it's kinda overcast outside. I'm not gonna leave. I'm like, no, I need to get my seven day goal. You convinced me, I'm, I'm delanie right now. I'm getting. I was I'm really intrigued of where I left off on this. Oh. Oh. Vangelis very if you start letting me get wired. He did we got really into it. So I had to get back into it. Now, I'm going to start hearing stories from Sami about conversations. She's had with you can be like. Oh, yeah. Mike in hand. Like, we haven't you talked to them more than you talk to me. Yeah. Yeah. Ten mile bike ride, and we've got a bunch Pokemon. It's been great. Let's super great people's friends through mutual interests. I like it. I think it's been I, I really like the direction pokey mongo has gone in what they're doing with it in people out in, it's getting people active in and I thought it had kinda died down. And I think actually Sammy for the high schoolers that are behind you. I think it has, but I think your generation and above you and your brothers, you were kind of inbetween Tim in Josh who are now twenty six and twenty two are in that sweet spot. And I think you're you were a little young for about because your brothers were doing it. And you got got into it. I think we see the sixteen seventeen eighteen nineteen year olds there's certainly some that are doing I don't think it's as popular anymore for them as it used to be in. It's weirdly sessile for adults because we're more mobile in where more oftentimes remorse in control of our schedules. And if you live on a college campus as a great place to play because there's so much stuff going on. And it's so easy. Like the team mystic on campus has a group chat in so they do rates together. They'll go take over gyms together, which is knowing me team dollar because they're so. Well coordinated in. I'm sit a loner but like it's it's a community thing, and it brings people together. So I think that for for us young adults. It it's really inaccessible thing in a fun thing. I've lost weaker he's gonna he. He's lost me. I'm marty. I'm sorry. Go for a walk with the time we get out of this podcast. He'll have been in out, and then sold everything that he has. Fifty five dollars on the app. I've done the whole thing for free, except when I got the gym leader badges that five dollars to buy all of the outfit 'cause I, I just wanted to we'll Josh has been Josh has been on Pokemon go since twenty sixteen when I came out and he spent two years trying to get his gym leader badge, and I got an month. So I had to brag about it in front of him because I'm a sister. That's the. Incentivize me to spend real money. It is tough being a cost, and I am not going to let you got house, then you gotta have some intestinal fortitude to live in this house. Let's let me Frattini well for being a journalist because in the newsroom, that's how we show affection is were so mean to each other because journalists are so jaded in, we just have to let off steam because the world is so dark. Yeah. Brian in the chat, room says crypto coin go Pokemon go based mining. Why has known thought of that somebody is, I'm sure they have I'm sure they have Sammy is we kind of wrap this up. You wrote an article which I thought was really cool, not necessarily tech related. There's a little bit of tech in this, but you wrote an article for the school like cats guide. So it's like a mini magazine we put out every summer that we, especially catered a freshman that kind of it comes to the map, it comes with letters from the president, the student Senate president, in the editor chief in it's just kind of got, like fluffy stories and like how to guides for freshman to get them acclimated to the culture of north west is so ten things, and I think if you're listening to this, this is good for parents to, or if your college student, that's maybe appropriate to you. Sammy I'm gonna say the item, then you're gonna quickly say why we go in the first one's great. A thick robe will go in. If you live in dorms the fire alarms go off a lot, especially with the advent of vaping. I'm gonna. Tell you things that are not in the article that are true life because you guys get the exclusive. Did you pull that off the fire alarms in the middle of the night? Or when you're in the shower. So I have a really thick Lynn's Endro that's longer than knee-length. It's full arm. Length in. It's like Terry cloth towel thickness in that thing came super handy on the fire alarm went off when I was in the shower, and it was the dead of winter. To number to protect a surge protector. Power strip. I think this kind of makes sense why because they're not enough outlets in dorms and because there's so many so much like jersey running through the building. If you plug in a regular power stripper extension cord, you have the risk of blowing fuse. So if it surged protected than it's safe for the outlets and then you can play your phone, your laptop charger, your lamp, your fairy, lights, everything you're teak electric tea, kettle and meals are all the things that sit on my desk. Pick those up before moving day. Yes, the, the college, the Maryville WalMart is always sold out of those in your college down. Walmart will probably also be sold out in, you could probably quickly. Order them from Amazon to we had some just laying around the house. So we, we just had I ordered a bunch, you know, they're super cheap three bucks. Maybe each on Amazon little black ones. They're six outlets. I just kind of keep them around. You never know. Mike. You probably got how many power. Do you think you've you, you, you? I never find him when I need one that's the one problem. There's a billion right? Oh, a million later on, I don't even know number three handheld vacuum. Yes. The so the dorms north west have vacuums, but they're terrible or super old in some dorms. Don't even have them. So having a handheld documents nice for when you I don't know, excellently pull your microwave play out of your mic waited. Shatter at Oliver your carpet. Not that, that, that happened, this past semester, and was devastating. It's fine. But you having a hand held like desk BUSTER is a super lifesaver for when your hair when your floor is covered in hair, because you live with two girls like that's, that's the real stuff on hand, no earplugs. Yes. Because sometimes your roommates snores or the room next to you. The throw a party it 'cause you, you can ask somebody before you move together. Like do you snore and they'll be like no? And maybe they do and you just they just don't know it or they lie to you, or they snore when they have a cold or. It's just loud or knowing. So having your legs is nice so you can get sleep before a big test. Boz Boz has those new ones that play music to kind of mask somebody snoring. Do you think you could? And they're supposed to be in ear. Do you think you would prefer to have something playing or just plug it up? So you can't hear anything. I can't sleep with silence. So I just use regular ones, but I also sleep with a fan on which also helps for ambient noise outside of the room. So white noise probably could help but I can do without it. Justin says he tried to catch himself snoring. One stayed up all night, but couldn't. Hey, listen. I'm to the point now. I can hear myself as I'm drifting off, if I lay on my back in, I put my head up under the pillow, which is super comfortable for me is, I'm drifting off. I can hear myself snoring and then I'm like, okay, I need to turn over. So yes, it nor with the best of them. Emmy impressive. Yes. Yes. Oh, yes. Okay. Yeah. Sure. Wall coverings. Yes. Dorm blows are notoriously plain, white, and usually cement, bricks. So bring something to cover your wall to dampen that echo, that comes with an empty cement, dorm, room, but also to give some personality and sublime happiness. I have like a net a fairy lights that I cover the wall with but you can also get like super cheap tapestries, you can get posters for a while ahead a bunch of news clippings up on the wall, just as like inspiration or ideas. If if we bought you one of those photo frames that was constantly rotating, pictures through is that is that interesting for college student to have a I think he's. Yeah, I print regular photos. But I think that's also nice if you so you can add new photos to it is that what you can just have reminders of home and family and friends, and pets. I miss Pippin a lot when I'm at school. So I have lots of pictures on my board would be to get a photo frame, that's tied to a cloud account where mom and dad are constantly taking pictures at home. And then updating that cloud account, and they would dangerous if your parents are mischievous, but also get. Or make a terrible mistake. They'll just been goofy faces and just barris you in front of your friends at school. Okay. All your baby pictures of your bare but yeah exactly what I was doing. My brain went a coffeemaker. Oh, if you are addicted to coffee, there's does, usually Starbucks or scooters on scooters free in the midwest on campuses, but that gets expensive after a long time, and most people, I would say develop caffeine addictions, in college Zell, if you like coffee get your own coffee, it'll save you bunch money. And then you don't have to leave bed to get coffee can just turn it on. Like if you have a curate you can just put it next to your bed. Turn it on. We would here your t right drinker. So I have an electric kettle that says on my desk. You're pretty Medicated to, to t is a whole thing. I like subculture around, but I'm pretty low key with TI usually just drink like after like I started with herbal teas teasing acquired tastes kinda like coffee, but event now I'm just unlike straight black tea drink with no sugar no milk. I'll drink either decaf Earl grey or English breakfast in the morning. But super to you make it in smoke. It now. Okay. Listen mattress. Topper. Yes. Dorm beds are terrible and awful. And maybe even if you live in an apartment, the bet is probably awful. So I have like an inch thick memory foam. It's like it's got like cooling gel in it that way doesn't overheat. And that will make any mattress feel so much better to just put a top on it, and maybe even like a slip cover over it. So that way, if somebody spilled something on your bed, or whatever that way you don't stain the mattress topper or your mattress. Because then you get fined for that Mike, did you ever live in the dorms? Oh, yeah. All four years. Yeah. Any, any any, any tips, you'd add in here that, that you pulled out of the of living. Of the ones that. You have a favorite Cup. Get your couples you're up north. Her nose can use. Yup. Fillon brings me to this for Christmas. I love it. The New York Times one New York journal. Oh, yeah. The bake newspaper. Josh it looks like a newspaper. Have your Cup. That's my biggest thing was have your Cup. And I don't know. I always ran this is just the nerd in me. I ran my own wifi. I didn't want the campus. Why file on my own, so I would plug in. I would send an Email Tor IT department, give them the MAC address of the router and tell them it's an XBox. And then that way got registered on their network. So when I can have my own router, and then we can have all of our own land stuff privately. So we had a printed in everything. Yeah. Internally. So, I was like the nerd of our group. Everyone loved it. So I did that. But yeah, you're anything about north west is, we must have fiber something because north west wifi is faster than anybody's home wifi like both me and my friend Andrew were complaining about, how would we go home for the summer were like internet at home is so slow like, especially when you first get there, 'cause newspaper staff we come to campus week early start covering the news. Because we're crazy in that first week when nobody's on campus the internet so fast in even with everybody comes on campus. Where where are they getting the super festival for? That's super cool. Yeah. So I I love high speeds. And then there was also this was right around the time when smart home stuff was starting to happen, and you needed to have your own network network. Right. And so that was like, well, we can't do this. We can't all have this local network with with campus wifi. So we had in our own. So we had a little hack around there, but they're greedy mattress topper is totally awesome. Totally agree with that, try to think of anything else, but I think you covered literally all all the best aspects. So. While we're talking about this. But this put this up. So sarah. This is. Marine in the they didn't have a good back ume for their for their Tim's roommate was complaining about mom walking on the carpet with her shoes on because they were not letting anybody walk on the rug with shoes on because they didn't have a vacuum, and so mom bought them that Tim dustbuster for his birthday mailed it to go. It's super funny. So just funny that, that would that would pop up while we were while we were talking about semi final final wants something that motivates you. Oh, yeah. That was I was like I want ten to round it out. And I was thinking about how over my desk, it's school. I have like some drawings from some friends like my staffer of the week award. I have a bulletin board of my friends and family. But above that, I have. Editorial cartoon from Jessica Turbah, that dad gave me is going away present before I left in. It's, it's a bunch of people holding up newspapers and phones in magazines, and it's a standing up for journalism in Jeff guitar was a huge advocate for journalists he's the best use a family friend, and that, that cartoon, just kind of reminds me of why I do it to remember the people so that way when you're having those things around you that remind you of kind of who you are, and what you're about, and while you're at school really helps when is three AM, and you're working on a paper you procrastinated in your like I just wanna quit. Why did I come here was this classy would mean what's the point anymore and you're just like questioning lake life in existence? It's nice to have those things around you that ground you in remind you while you're there, you could push through, and persevere and get that, that maybe none, a probably be if you're procrastinating, it till three AM you can pass that class, and you can get that degree in remember why he did it in not lose sight of who you are along the way, that is such a cool idea. I actually. I never would have thought of that as advice to a college student at said, so perfect. Oh, because one thing now that I think back is throughout your college years to it doesn't mean when you bring into college, but something, you, you develop your college, get something that you will take away when you graduate and they'll remind you of your times there and what was important to you. So when we were in college, we had this, this table, cheap target table, sat in our room, all four years, but it would always be if you had, like, we have a bit the center of it is actually, a big army that whatever the what do you call it the symbol for the army, because at one of our guys was ROTC all four years until his stickers right in the middle. Then we all put these stickers if you ever came over and if you hung out with us in our room, and you like, you know, partied, hung out, whatever, you, we had a permanent markers on the table, and everyone would just sign it. And so we have this table, top. So when I graduate, I didn't want the whole table, but unscathed the top, and it is literally all my workbench, and I see it every single day when I get my car, and I leave and has all the signatures of everyone in college has all stickers has the army. Middle-sized think of Steve, he's out in California. I see all the we, we were in the long of his long boarding stickers like issues. But it's, it's so cool. So get something that reminds you of your college days, something that it's is memorable for you and take it with you, because you'll love that. I look back at it so closely every single day even you know, it's special to me greatly. Yeah, Hannah thinks it's junk, but I think it's pretty cool on edge. And. On edge with one of the OG. She was like one of the first roles to hang out with us freshman year. So it's always channel. Yeah. 'cause I just was like sitting in my dorm, like trying to write this article out, and I'm just looking around and I looked up and I'm like, that's why I'm here, always remember that. That's so cool. That's such a good advice. Super good advice in good to keep those things to in the past as a reminder of, of those times you went through it. And I had this bulletin board behind me with a bunch of stuff from middle school and high school, so I can remember what I went through. And like have my diploma up here on my desk, just to remind me of like that time was really hard and it was worth it. But like there was also like good stuff, too. So have much of photos in like pins in memorabilia, I wonder if my best friend has that same thought when he sees his ex girlfriend signature on that board all was hard times. But I got. We real persist, right? Saying, I'm thinking from the situation you, do you always do. Yeah. No, that's really cool. That's a fantastic idea. I never would've thought of that semi in the future, if people wanna follow you on Twitter. How do they or what's the best ways to kind of follow you? I'm sure there's folks, then why you wanna follow me? So for journalism stuff. That's my Twitter at Samy collison. SIM MIE CO L is a win that I post. I reach we all of my stories. I reach we journalism stuff and sometimes they bring tweet opinions because occasionally, I have them publicly but I also am a nigger in crocheter. That's what I do with ninety percent of my free time. I watched critical role I net blankets or socks. So my Instagram is saving. It's as AM MIE knits on Instagram, and I post, I don't post as frequently on there, I post my story, quite a bit of like progress photos in final photos of things that I make that's my primary hobby that I do in my free time when I'm just being human Sammy. When the journalism had off, I think that's about it haven't tumbler, but nobody knows about that. That's your thing that's just personal. Nobody from my real life gets to know about that is your oral Mike, Sammy's. First time podcasting. What, what do you think of a natural? I think that I think he you, if this is any indication on how you do journalism. I want to read your stuff, so I'm going to be following you on all the social media's it's some pretty great stuff. I'm not a big news reader, but I read her dad's so I'm supposed to, but I do it. I do it anyways, wrapping up. See if I can find that photo, I have a stack of newspapers from this semester. So she was she, she prepped to, like, she, she prepped podcast. It wasn't just half ass. Like I do most of the time I found it. Here's the photo from a one of the purse urkel that I took on my phone. You can probably maybe see in the corner. It says Sammy Colson. So by line. I keep I keep a copy of every paper that I'm in, even though it's all online. It's nice to have the physical copies and be like I did that I wrote that. It's it is. Yeah. In the tough times, because everyone big your look back like no, like look, right? Like look at my work and you're gonna it'll remind yourself of it. So it's yeah, it reminds me that, like somebody picked up a physical paper in looked at it and like 'cause I, I have some input design, and I have some input in other people's content, specially now that him editor, and editor. So it just feels. It's nice to have a physical product from all of your effort, that's by knitting crochet, because at the end of the day, you can be like look at this thing that I made with my hands makes you feel like your time was worth it and Sam even using jobber headset. That's the one we talked about when Michael was on here a couple of weeks ago. It's about seventy eight seventy nine bucks on Amazon. You sounded great. How did it feel feels great? My dinner. Dennis sound pretty sounds really good. Especially for the US behead. It's we've had a lot of guests, come on. With those this one sounds high quality, which I've had that one I've never been able to hear what it sounds like on the receiving end. Sounds sounds great now. It's, it's super cool Creston, you don't know. You sound great. You gotta get that way down on your chin. So because it will pick up your breathing and. Testing it back in the days when I had a headset, and I was podcasting. I used to breathe out the side of my mouth. Oh, like the chocolate rain guy that tool the internet. Yes. Chocolate ring love Chinese debris. Yes. Oh man. See it's funny as you closer in age than I am to her. And so you guys there's a lot more referencing time. I don't know if you remember who a kitty is. She did that video with nanna Lou the, the sale music video remake with the, the hose, where she's like dancing in the rain yet talking about. She produces music now. And I just bought it to get door first headlining tour. And I was like I fit in following her since like twenty eleven like I've been on YouTube, so long. That's so cool. So in those follow they, they start on. They started on YouTube before there was ads sense before you can make money off of it now their career, and I'm like I watched you grow up. That's me with 'em. KB HD. So he's a tech guy right market has Brownlee. And I followed him on YouTube since my thing, my senior year of high school. And now it's like now he's big shot in Super Bowl. You almost feel like you know them as a friend like. Oh, yeah. Yeah. They're my buddy play. When they just had ten thousand subs, yeah. People do brag about four hundred thousand or whatever craziness. I remember when there wasn't even a subscription, but in there, too. Variance describe was was a lot now. That's three million subscribers. After one video. Sammy one of the things as we as we wrap it, you know, we've gotten kind of famous over the last oh, I don't know year or so about talking about hellofresh. No, no famous on the podcast, this podcast for talking about hellofresh in one of the things I enjoy the most when you come home for the summer is you kind of get the meals kicked off, like you kick them off and actually a couple nights. I did the whole thing by myself, do the whole thing like you, you have it in, in done how for one. It's been great for me, too. I've enjoyed I mean I love cooking him with mom, but I really I like also cooking them with you. But how is that process for you? I mean as you think about have you learned new things through it has it been has been one of those kinds of things you like to do. I mean you don't give us any trouble. But now I love doing it 'cause I was always a Baker growing up, I was better at that because it was so exact in prescriptive. I'm not very good. At improvising. When it comes to food, I don't trust by cells. In. So it's kind of like that prescriptive nature when it come, but there's a little bit of wiggle room for you to learn stuff. So it's kind of a nice because I kind, like I always cooked with mom. So I kind of knew how to cook, but I had never liked taken the reins myself. And so I didn't trust myself entrust my instincts. And now like when I when I start dinner, I have the game plan, I have the map, I do the bulk of the work, and so, I am more confident in my abilities, as a cook that, even if I throw away the recipe card, and kind of recreate something I, I trust that I know how to do it, and that it will taste good. And I also way less afraid of cooking meat now because I'm super super afraid of poisoning, my family and I haven't done it. So, and I'm clearly better than data cooking chicken on the stove. So. It's, it's crazy. I can't I can't do it and she's doing it. Really, really, well, Sarah has gotten really good at cooking on the stove, you know, grilling a well or. Outside and put it on the grill. I just want to get it on the grill. By the way, I replaced all my grill in innards, this weekend, went down bought a new and we're going to get Mike and Mark back on the program here in a couple of weeks to talk about some of the girl tech. But Mike IRA placed all the innards of my grill the, the, the burner put some brick down. I put some I'm trying shields. The little heat shields, you know the little the little tents on those for the first time. And, and so I've got some cooking to do we're doing steaks this weekend for my birthday show. We're birthday the FM. Thank you. The outer is of that, that, that girl dough are older than me. It was vintage. It is true. It is. It is vintage girl. Well, if you if you stop trying hellofresh, when you went to I've got plenty of coupons to be able to get it done paying you for this man. It's okay. Jimothy three advertising. Because I believe in it so much like I mean, I love driving back and forth from, from northwest, Missouri state back home with you, but it's super fun to cook with you. Like I have a really I enjoy that part of it. And, and we've gotten to that point now, same with mom, where I'm like, okay, what do I do? Like I came in later night roster in the other night. And you're like make the Kremlin. And I'm like, all right. So here we go starting the ball put it together. So it was it was it was cool. Sammy. Thanks for for coming on. I you did. Great outing me. This is fun. I had a feeling that I would like podcasting, but now I'm sure that I like about get out. No. I think it'd be good at it. We, we kind of need to continue to think through probably have the back on the show. The summer's over. Some asked me about talking about some tech stuff and, and so thanks for come out will remind folks, if you want to support the show financially, you can do that through patriot by the way someone I think Justin had mentioned earlier in the program, you know, patriotic could be a source for journalists independent journalists right for people who follow them. So that's kind of a model that could take place. I certainly YouTube us in that sense, is another way to do it. It's Sammy it's tough when you think about, as soon as you start taking money from people do you get clouded. I think one of the things I know about you, as you just wouldn't care. You're like if you're gonna give me money. That's great. I'm not gonna say anything different just because you're giving me money. Yeah. Well, I mean, if I did accept money that I wouldn't change my views, but I also we kind of had an a discussion with one of our staff members she's cadre for she's talking about. Oh, a lot of these places do they'll do. Sponsored posts on their website. Where they'll take money just to do that. One post and maybe low feature product and I said, no absolutely not. We're not doing that, that damages our integrity. So it's funny. If you want to support journalism in, you really believe in it, especially in super indepth investigative journalism by subscription to your local paper that really helps people out that shows that you care that shows the your regular reader, and that puts money directly in our pockets, rather than the advertisers, who will threaten to pull out if we post anything vaguely controversial. So. Imagine that papers weird. Controversial, yeah. Imagine that. Join our discount discord group. The average guy dot TV slash dischord. Send me an Email Jim at the average guy dot TV you can track me on Twitter. I j Carlson. Mike is at Wieger tech. You can find him there. The average guy dot TV platform both web and media, hosting powered by maple grove partners. Get secure reliable high speed hosting from people that, you know, and you trust, and that's Christian. They're, they're running some new upgrades out there this this year. This summer is well that Christian was talking about. And I, I'm just amazed at what him and Gary or doing there in that if UNITA hosting website, their plans as little as ten bucks in their awesome dudes to work with maple grove partners dot com. We appreciate their support by hosting everything we do here. I don't I haven't been down Mike in. I can't remember the last time I had a I really had some take it down for maintenance from time to time. But I went to super great and never knows to be down now. Super great. Don't forget, you can download it on the app. And if you haven't done that yet home gadget geeks dot com, a great way to do that. And to have it on your phone. Ready to go? We are live every Thursday, eight PM central nine eastern out here at the average guy dot TV slash lively back next week. We've got a barbecue show. Coming up errands coming back here in a little bit. I haven't scheduled it yet, but she will be back as well. Lots of stuff to talk about summer is here. I've got some lawn. Tech stuff coming up, you'll wanna stay and come out and listen live. Thanks to those who did come out tonight, Brian, and Joe in Ron and Ken was out there earlier Mark was as well. Thanks for coming out tonight without will say good night. Everybody.