20 Episode results for "Skopje"

3 Tips to Make your Sales Copy Flow | Episode #008

Marketing Academy of Persuasion | Digital Marketing & Copywriting Podcast in English

06:41 min | 1 year ago

3 Tips to Make your Sales Copy Flow | Episode #008

"Listeners. I, didn't shave. Bits to make your coffee flow. Through these three matic. You can catch more. Which means more. Stay tuned. This podcast. Very. Evil on copy writing. And it's absolutely free for you saw enough of the. Within that sold just after this enrolled. has gathered in the region and that host. Some much which. Includes country. And Microwave your? Kid. Can this show is we shane about practical business mindset and ongoing digital marketing strategies which world in the now This show is all about bringing ready letting you. Do. Alright let's jump to it. So the first. I would like to share Moody's. Right in the way you. Great. Do Not Great Yourself Skopje Liking see with lots and lots of advance enlist vocabulary words. Alright. Make it very ladies simple. The issue the not vote buddy hot many billy to understand your poppy. You should talk in the way light your daughter's frame. Not Your prophesied Ortiz. Yeah. Because of this, you will be able to build trust in your. If you're able to. Emotions through the reader day yacht, all be gant create magic. Now coming to the second full tape, which is read out your copy loud once you are done with driving. You can also record voice or ask your friend to read out your copy now for you. So when anyone breeds out? Loud. You will surely find some broad bax or shortcomings semi light. One more lanes should be added after this this region should be more emphasized or this line should be delayed. and. Remember this team, your copy will become more. And more persuasive aspect you edited or right now the third and last. US GOPI connecting words now, Alexa. You're standing on the plus Lord and you have to go to the hard floor. All right. So you we go either by using state gas or by using lived right these things. At connector form point eight to point the. Same as the keys with doesn't Skopje if you want be or either who start from the beginning and you want them to rebuild the end and then performed the action that you want them to perform than make sure you have you some Gopi connectors as the name suggests, it connects the seals copy from top. Bottom some of the great examples of Gothic and. Let's take an example. In fact, in addition to this. Evening. Did you know this except Brexit Brexit Also use copy connectors innovating limited manner otherwise, it will look awkward your will look at official at times then it will not be. Same memo in e Book Bollywood's back say. Six farmlands right up powerful and persuasive headline along with many other separates but he did copy of. This book is free and how you can grab it. You get the details in the opera section of this episode. So so so very much for investing your busiest time. End of this episode. Nine. It really moves the world to me. It would even the word. If my three E.. Which is based on copy writing the title of inventories ballpoint bullets that said all right graduates. From website did. Much to. that. Lincoln's mentioned in the distinction boss as big somewhere new some- keynotes from people do shit your things. Them have entities. You can follow me on Linden if YOU WANT TO BE A. Family if you want to have to chat with. then. On instagram I've been very very, very happy to assist you all the links mentioned in the description box. One last thing if anybody from this episode kind. Of. August general taught upcoming episodes as Smith also rate my guys on whatever platforms. seriously. Not honest ribbing. So exit. Cornell either see you in the next one. And This is a boost. Signing up but. Never. Do.

Ortiz Skopje Alexa Moody billy Cornell Smith official Lincoln
Una taza de Dios S#2 ep#12 Fertilidad.

Una taza de Dios

12:12 min | 5 months ago

Una taza de Dios S#2 ep#12 Fertilidad.

"Decisively christopher literary competitor most podcasts. Cashew for your sh Can The idea by boca way muka medical. This could been deal and dumped a special she one day in pennsyl- i ever let me go Status offense doing right now. Civic noble noble recipe did as she Dvd poke And as offensive The reassembly arabian you. Gotta watch will not give within like i said Remodel i guess that every day wear Let's go to bed. Joe's little gig at inconsolable candidate In skopje vegetables that you know what anti jewish quoted they does a senior. He's modern america. S what. I put them on that so i think sunday maria being yet got. Cut any us if you go vessel in nigger last month. Stubborn campbell says so. I'm sorry you'll mega briefly. Seen go specials on daycare. I see is going to go to should Commit ac- dangling blend. But but i could think ac- Jeremy economic alleged linda Meant to other month battle Guess what about you and your address. envy a knee and the number of hustles Step look shima said. You would add

muka medical boca christopher skopje Joe maria linda Meant campbell america Jeremy shima
244: Tubal Factor, DOR & Recurrent Loss [SUCCESS]

Beat Infertility

59:18 min | 1 year ago

244: Tubal Factor, DOR & Recurrent Loss [SUCCESS]

"Welcome to be infertility a podcast where we get real about infertility empowered you to take back control and provide you with hope for the future ready. Here's your host fellow infertility warrior. Heather. Whom in Welcome to episode to forty. Four. Today. You'll hear the success story of a woman named Ashley. She has a thirty three year old senior resource manager who enjoys exercising and traveling. Ashley's journey was difficult from the start over a year of trying to conceive. She got pregnant twice but miscarried both times she had a DNC after the first an ectopic pregnancy with the second. A year. Later, she had her first round of Ivy of which yielded three embryos. She transferred to of her day three embryos became pregnant with twins. Her twins were born at thirty five weeks. But sadly, one of them passed away shortly after birth. She transferred her remaining embryo about six months ago, which resulted in another miscarriage. lets us know how Ashley and her husband will begin their second is of cycle shortly in attempt to have another child. Hi Ashley Welcome to the show I think so much for having me why don't we start as we always do tell us a bit about you how old are you what you do for a living and do you do for fun K. I. AM thirty three I am a senior resource manager for a large global recruiting company and I'd say I guess for fun. I enjoy exercising cooking and my husband and I do a lot of traveling so think about your life but for infertility becton, how would you describe yourself as a person? Well, I'm definitely a type A. Person I'm. Always trying to control every little thing about my life and I say I don't have a ton of patience will I do now but I didn't before and so I guess when I think about before infertility I was just a lot more under the assumption that if I put my mind to something I was going to achieve it. So I definitely was drawn for a bit of a curb all when things weren't working out the way I thought they would and I learnt quickly that there wasn't always a way to fix every single problem to me but the first time you. Met Your husband will actually met a few years before we started dating at a party, but we were both actually dating other people at the time, and then I was working at a restaurant and my husband came in with some of his friends and I served them, and then we were pretty much inseparable after that night, we had both obviously broken up with our previous partners and yeah, it was we were pretty much inseparable after that today how would you describe you and your husband as a couple wall I would say we're definitely a good team. We enjoy a lot. Of the same thing. So I mean we definitely hang out a lot and do a lot of things together obviously traveling being one of them but we both enjoy cooking and gardening and I'd say that we're fund people. We definitely like to entertain always having people over for dinner and hosting little parties at our house. So I just I think we're a great team were very fun and energetic I definitely feel like we are on the same page with most of the big things in life for sure. I. Imagine. You aren't hosting too many parties at your house at the moment. You know what actually the place we live in the COVID hasn't been very bad at all I. Think we only have I think it's four active cases right now. So we've been pretty fortunate but yes, there's been some serious social distancing going on and in pretty much every city. But in in our city particularly now you are allowed to have gatherings of up to fifty people. It's definitely a little better over here than. It is where you are. was there a specific moment in your life? When you I knew you wanted to be a mom I can't really recall a specific moment I think i. just always just are always part of my life plan. I just assumed that I was going to be a mom I was going to get married I was going to be and I know my husband's same thing we did obviously have A. Conversation when we met, do you want kids and both of us did but we just you know we both assumed we would get married and then star trying and it would just happen. So I can't really think of a specific moment. But my definitely always knew that I wanted kids for sure a hosted this longing to be a mom impact other decisions in your life. Well, I think just always had this natural sort of. Progression of life I would finish university I would get a job get married have a kid and I think that just not being able to get pregnant quickly. Made me realize that they're definitely like I said before isn't always a way to fix every single problem and things are not always gonNA work out exactly the way I thought they would. So I just think it really gave me a perspective change on life and just. Giving me some more patients in the sense that I definitely had to learn to just relax a little bit and SORTA. Let things happen as they would. Let's dive into the journey to build your family take us through your whole infertility timeline. Okay. So it's quite a long journey. We started to try in two, thousand sixteen after our wedding and honeymoon. I'd actually gone off the pill about a year before we started trying, I just wanted to go off it before our wedding to give my body some time to get itself back in normal hormone in cycle, and so I guess about six months after trying I went back. I. Had Been Actually temping using a basil thermometer in tempting Ri- cycles in tracking everything in an APP on. My phone and I sort of started analyzing this because prior to hadn't really taken too much thought into it I realized that it looks like I had a very short Lucia phase. So after about six months of trying I was getting a little bit concerned part of that is because I'm typing I wasn't being very patient and so I actually started talking to a natural path I. Just asking you know, is there a way that I can get my Lucia face to be a little? Bit longer because I was worried that I was ovulating and then like five days later getting my period, there's not enough time for implantation and all that jazz. So the National Path was working with did suggest a couple things and he actually mentioned maybe if you talk to your doctor, you can get put on a progesterone suppository. So I tried to natural stuff I it wasn't making too much of a change. So I did go to my at this point it was just my family doctor. and asked if I could start taking progesterone suppository. So this was probably about seven months in and she agreed I started taking this pedestrians positively and it was actually only two months after taking it that I got pregnant. So the first time I got pregnant wasn't too long into our I guess trying to conceive journey and I was pretty positive at that point things. We're GONNA, work out a couple of my girlfriends were also pregnant at the time. So I was you know pretty Hopeful that things we're gonNA work out everything seemed like it was perfect timing and then actually only a few weeks after I found out I was pregnant I started spotting that. Put me in a bit of a panic. I. Rush Back to my doctor and she agreed to send me for an ultra ultrasound at that point when I went for an ultrasound actually everything looked good the baby was growing on track I at that point they. Couldn't really see a heartbeat or anything but my doctor did say that it would probably be best if I would go for an ultrasound every couple of weeks just until the bleeding had stopped just to make sure everything was fine I had gone for an ultrasound at eight weeks and at that appointment, we actually did see the baby's Herp eat we saw baby moving around a little bit. So that was super reassuring men again I still. Spotting at this point, and then two weeks after that I went back for my ultrasound at ten weeks at unfortunately, the pregnancy was no longer viable. That was just super super depressingly. We were obviously expecting things to work out pretty naive at that point. I. Wasn't really educated on the whole miscarriage in how common miscarriages are. So at that point because I was having what they call miscarriage on I was having spotting still but it Was Not like I wasn't actually miscarrying what was inside me so they give me a couple options they said either I could do a DNC or do a I guess take the INCAS called Miss Misoprostol, kind of abortion pill and I actually opted for the DNC because I just wanted to speed things up my husband and I felt like it was a better option for us so we could get back to trying quicker so. I guess that was probably in like the early winter of two, thousand seventeen maybe it was fall two, thousand seventeen shortly after that I actually decided I was GonNa Start Looking into seeing a reproductive endocrinologist and. Of. Give you an idea of how the fertility clinics work in the city. I live in and I think Canada in general is a little different than in the states. But in the city I live in, you have to get a referral from your family doctor to go see a specialist out of fertility clinics. So I did ask my doctor to put me on the waiting list because there was actually a one year waiting list to get the fertility clinic in our city and so that was nice to get sort of put on that list. At, this point, we haven't been trying for a full year, which is usually what they recommend is try for a if you're not pregnant come in will get you on this waiting list, which is actually kinda crazy because then you're waiting two years before you actually see somebody but I was lucky because I had gotten a referral from somebody for a reproductive endocrinologist who actually had worked at the fertility clinic in our city but had started her own practice. So she was doing mostly like gynecology work now but was still seeing patients for reproductive issues so. I felt super lucky to her. She was just taking new patients at the time when I started seeing her she took a look at all the information that I've gathered just built my cycle and then you know about our miscarriage, she just tried to give us some answers. Obviously, there's really no answer for miscarriage every single time she did run some more tests on my husband and I out at this point, my husband hadn't had like a sperm tests done and I haven't really had any lead work done aside from just having my professional levels. Measured, and actually at this point, we found out some pretty devastating news. I had low ovarian reserve or diminish ovarian reserve. So I may a major levels came back pretty low. What they were sort of explaining to me is might as were functioning at the level of like a forty year old woman at this point I wasn't even thirty s and my husband actually had low sperm morphology. He was Kinda bordering on low to normal but with those two things combined, we were pretty Hesse mystic now about our odds of getting pregnant my doctor reproductive. Energy. Did say that you know with diminished ovarian reserve in the fact that I had gotten pregnant it doesn't mean that I wouldn't get pregnant again or I couldn't get pregnant again it just meant that if we did decide or to do IVF in the future of that, we wouldn't be great candidates to do. So I was really upset hearing that I mean obviously being a control freak and I feel like I'm a very healthy person I exercise. I. Always have eaten very wall and healthy. I just couldn't really wrap my head around. The fact that my ovaries were already starting to shut down and then dealing with this little morphology thing i. just you know, I, didn't really know what to do There's not a lot of ways to improve those things. But after finding out that I just thought was my main goal is how do we get this low sperm morphology thing to a better level and what can I do to just get my egg quality to be as best as it possibly could be so that we could optimize our chances every month so At this point, I started doing acupuncture I was taking tons of different supplements every day like a cocktail of supplements every day and just trying to be very mindful live a healthy healthy lifestyle and just add some extra things into my life that would hopefully help by quality. My husband stopped wearing underwear like we were just willing to do anything at this. Point. So that was, I guess, now winter of twenty seventeen, we got accepted into the fertility clinic inner city a bit earlier than expected. So it was probably about six months in a summer twenty seventeen that we finally saw doctor at the clinic and they did say to us you've gotten pregnant already unfortunately miscarried, but we think you should keep trying for. A little bit longer before we start doing I've ever is at that point. They did also say like doing it I might not be the most useful thing, but keep trying for a few more months and come back and see us. So at this point I also had right about Letras all and I did ask the reproductive endocrinology at that appointment. If he thought it might be useful for me to take lectures all just so that maybe I could ovulate a couple extra eggs a month just to optimize their chances and he agreed. So I started taking lectures all summer of two thousand seventeen and within a couple months pregnant again. So that was really exciting I. Mean I guess it had only been. Less. Than a year since I got pregnant the first time. So again, I was feeling pretty optimistic a lot of the things I was really concerned about sort of just went away at this point because I was kate, I'm pregnant again you know obviously I can get pregnant but now we needed to figure out a way to stay pregnant so I was Trying to do everything I could to not have a miscarriage which is obviously not necessarily possible. But this time I actually wasn't having any spotting at first. So I felt a little more positive about things right from the beginning but I was actually at my brother-in-law's cabin or cottage. This was a few weeks into finding after I found out I was pregnant. I started getting some pretty sharp pains on my side at first it was Kinda doll and it was just bothering me a little bit I wasn't thinking too much into it because I know bad with pregnancy does come some cramping but I was sleeping and in the middle of night I was woken up to some really really sharp pains. So the next day my husband and I headed back into the city and I went to the hospital actually and they didn't ultrasound there and they actually could not find any just sack in my uterus. I was super confused at this point didn't understand what was going on how could I have you know normal pregnancy levels but have no jess station sack in my uterus I think is about six and a half weeks pregnant. It was another ultrasound the next day where they confirm not it must be a topic pregnancy. So that was probably. Another, extremely low point in our journey just because now, i. was dealing with possibly having to have my tube removed after finding we had diminished ovarian reserve digits felt like another roadblock or something we were going to have to deal with going forward was just going to make it more difficult for us to get pregnant. So Luckily, I was booked in for surgery of Skopje Surgery to remove my two and the topic pregnancy but I started bleeding, and at this point I was seeing my gynecologist reproductive endocrinologist who is not working within the fertility clinic but she said to me, you know what? You're if you're bleeding heavily, maybe you are naturally mishearing. So we gave it a few days and I was naturally miscarrying. So I didn't have to have my tube removed at that point but obviously having an ectopic pregnancy, there was probably something going on with my tubes. My doctor had run a dye tests on my tubes in the initial appointment with her when we will I guess it wasn't in the initial appointment. But shortly, after my first appointment with my reproductive endocrinologist, she sent me for a Di test, my tubes which actually showed that they were open but that was six months ago or If. Not More than that. So she did say lake things could have changed. Your tubes may be starting to get blocked now and she suggested that it would probably be a good idea for me to to go for a laproscopy procedure just so that they can take a look at everything take a look at my tubes inserted. See what was going on in there. So that was in the late fall of twenty seventeen that I went for a locker Skopje and it was kind of shocking appointment because when I came out of the Opera Sabi, they actually had told me that they removed the by. Left Philippine Tube, which was not the tube that was the to with the experts pregnancy on the topic pregnancy had actually implanted in between my uterus and the end of my Lopion Tube. So they said that there was still actually some routine pregnancy tissue, but it wasn't blocking not to completely. So they left out one in but that might other to had something called the hydro sale pinks, which is a fluid filled sac in the flow into they actually mentioned that it might have been causing me to have my previous miscarriage just because there was probably some fluid leaking out of it into my uterus. And actually, sorry, I'm completely forgetting by third pregnancy that was before my laproscopy Skopje after I had had the topic pregnancy and I had let my body just match naturally miscarry I went on a work trip with I work with one of my good friends we went on this trip I decided you know what? I just had this miscarriage I'm to now I'm just going to go let loose of not going to focus on trying to get pregnant for the next little bit I had this latter Skopje surgery booked for A couple of months later, and while I was on this trip, I was having some strange spotting at this point I hadn't even gotten my back from the topic pregnancy and while I was on might work trip. I actually found out I was pregnant again and that was like maybe six weeks after this ectopic pregnancy as I said, I didn't even get my period back yet. But when I found out, I was pregnant. I. Was not optimistic at all like I. I basically was just waiting to miscarry and sure enough. It was only like maybe five or six days after found out I was pregnant that I had started leading and went for an ultrasound, and if found out that the justice sack was like super deformed and they they basically said it looks like the station sack was already starting to collapse on itself and I would probably be fully miscarrying within a few days which did end up happening. So sorry, forgot that part but when I went for. My laugher Skopje surgery that had been three miscarriages I had had I felt like this offer Skopje surgery was going to be a good way for us to get some information about by uterus and everything at that point my husband and I had also decided died we were going to just start I the F. in the new year. My doctor said after the Locker Skopje, we would have to wait six weeks in them. We could start a cycle. Of E F and we were just kind of done with trying naturally at this point having three miscarriages. I was just no I just didn't want have another miscarriage and I just wanted there to be some potentially answer. So you know at least doing ivf, they be able to get a better sense of my aid quality. We could see maybe a little bit more of a bigger picture on what was going on. So after Skopje surgery on that's What we did I waited six weeks and then we started our first cycle in the I guess it was the January twenty eighteen and I was not super feeling. Super Great about the whole thing because I knew with diminished ovarian reserve in my age levels had I probably wasn't going to be getting a lot of follicles eggs that we probably wouldn't get very many embryos. So I if I said, okay, it's GonNa take probably three full cycles to. Have something implant but that's what we were going to do in. That was the plan. So when we started our IVF cycle is really surprised because I was actually responding very well to the meds. I was on the highest dose of pretty much everything and I ended up having twelve follicles. So that was way more than expected. They thought I would probably only have maybe five follicles maybe get three eggs. So we ended up with twelve follicles they got nine eggs seven were mature seven more mature. And then everybody always with the dreaded wait while you're trying to fight waiting to hear the news on how many are actually making it to embryos. We were pretty surprised when we found out, we got three I'd say I was pleasantly surprised just because again I I didn't expect to get much at all and at that point though I was not really sure what to do because our clinic they usually typically only do day five transfers they will do day three transfers, but it's not super common anymore. So they said, okay here's your options. We could do a transfer today on day three or we would. Recommend waiting until five but the statistics are for day three embryos making today five is about half. So they just said you know hopefully by day five, you'll still have one left maybe you'll have to I was really not sure what to do I did a bunch of research that afternoon after I'd gotten the call I decided that I wanted to have two embryos transferred back on day three. I was just really worried that if we waited until they five, we'd have nothing to transfer back and I really didn't have had gone through all the meds and everything that month in and again I I still was thinking, okay. We're going to be doing more IVF cycles here because is probably won't work out but let's transfer to back at least I'll feel like I got to transfer something back and maybe we'll have one leftover who knows they agreed and again they don't usually transfer back to embryos on someone my age they kept warning me you know you might end up with twins and my. Husband and I weren't like opposed to having twins but we never that was never really liked the plan was to transfer back to to have twins but we had the to transfer back on day three and on day five. We actually got a call that are third embryo did make it to day five and it was a five bb last assists hatching bosses. So that was really really good news on. We were told that that embryo that wasn't transferred back wasn't too great. Embryo wasn't looking very good on day three. So to hear that ended up becoming like a fairly good embryo was really awesome news. I. Guess I was just waiting at that point to find out if those embryos would stick it was like ten days that led by and I was just back to shorter normal life. I was sitting out work and I just I started feeling really crappy. I got up to go to the bathroom and I was leading so I was. Feeling like okay I've either gotten my period backers. Something's wrong by clinic did say to me a lot of people do have leading with IV often and also If you are pregnant, there is the chance you cannot bleeding. But I was just I wasn't feeling very positive about things. I was pretty upset by Pasquale was upset and she knew that I was going through ivf sort of where I was out with everything. So she told me go home take the afternoon off don't worry about anything. So on my way home, I actually picked up a pregnancy test just because I wanted to be able. To close the chapter on I was pretty sure things didn't work out. I just wanted to be able to move on go home and just kind of clear my head I gone home I eat on the pregnancy test and like literally before I could even put it down on the counter I saw two line. So that was pretty pretty crazy. The usually run the blood tests I guess on Day twelve. So it wasn't super surprising to get a positive early, but it was very, very dark positive line. So I was thinking okay maybe I'm pregnant with twins because I felt like it wouldn't be that obviously dark. If I was just pregnant with one my husband and I were just very excited that we made it to the staff of the Ivy after any we got something to implant. So that was good and I was feeling a little more hopeful this because I knew there was two in there and I just felt like if it was just one that had worked, you know maybe with having that hydro CEO Pinks, remove things would would be okay and also I just you know I was I was just feeling like, okay I, think we might have a better chance this time around again just thought there was. Two in there and and maybe something good will come of this. So I called the fertility clinic right away and told him that I had done a home pregnancy test even though they tell you not to but I did mention the metal was having some bleeding. So they told me to come in the next day for an early ultrasound just to check things out they. You know they agreed like I had had tropic pregnancy before they wanted to make sure that if you know everything that implanted in the correct spot. So we went in the next day and sure enough there were two tiny station sacks in. Just, five weeks pregnant at this point. So they weren't able to see very much but there is definitely to station sacks in they could actually see also a hemorrhage warming. They were like that's probably where the bleeding is coming from. Don't panic with the F. These hemorrhages are very common especially with twin pregnancies. So don't panic will keep having you come in for ultrasounds every week just to monitor things will flee things will work out and I was at this point. I was very optimistic because there was two in there and I just felt like. One of them just had to work i. just you know the bleeding was obviously not ideal, but there was a reason for it at least this time there was this hemorrhage and I just felt like, okay I can I can wrap my head around this I can understand why leading and I was just trying not to panic that every drop of blood was meanness miscarrying so. I was going back for these weekly ultrasounds in every appointment was looking amazing they. You know we were hitting all the right milestones everything was growing on track at the eight week ultrasound they were able to see the heartbeats and everything was looking perfect baby was were moving around a little bit but my hemorrhage getting bigger this whole throughout this whole thing. So as the weeks went on, the hemorrhage was getting bigger, the babies were growing, but they still were reassuring me that everything looks pretty good and that hemorrhage was somewhat normal. So I was having quite a bit of bleeding like I was probably feeling like a pad, every five or six hours at this point so. I mean, it was definitely scary but having these weekly ultrasounds was reassuring to me and then when we made it to ten weeks, our clinic actually did say to us you know what you've kind of graduated off now to a Obgyn. So if you WANNA switch doctors and start seeing Obgyn that that perfect. So we actually decided to see the reproductive endocrinologist who I had seen previous to going to the clinic. She was also a gynecologist in an ob and was taking patients. So I decided to go to her because she knew us and I felt very comfortable with her she said Okay while you're still having all this leading. So let send you for ultrasounds every couple weeks. Now until the bleeding stops. So I think I went for those appointments until about fourteen leaks and everything was looking good. We also did a something called on harmony test just to double check to see to make sure there wasn't really any genetic with babies. We also wanted to know the genders which we found out, which was really exciting. We found that we were having girls by bleeding actually hit started subsiding in the last ultrasound that we had it looks like the hemorrhage was almost gone. So my doctor at the time said, you know what? Let's just start sending you for monthly ultrasounds, which was probably going to be the case anyway because I was pregnant. With twins but she said things are looking great. Let's not worry about it. So few weeks had passed in my husband and I were wanting to gender reveal party but we wanted to get some pictures of the baby some good pictures, and there's a private clinic in our city that does three D. imaging and gives you pictures and you can get a video of the babies and everything in. We decided to book an appointment to go there, and while we were there, the doctor who's not supposed to give you any medical advice or information she just kept looking at the screen and was just like she did something seemed off. I could definitely get the vibe like right away. And so she says to us, you know I'm not supposed to say anything like from a medical perspective here but I do these. All Day Long I see babies at this stage all day long and something is not looking right with one of the baby's heads. And my husband and I like what the heck and so she starts showing us in. This is on the big screen. So both of us can see you like super clearly what's going on in there? And she shows us baby be which was the baby on talk as she showed us the baby's head and said like you see how the baby's head is nice around and everything looks good and then she showed us the other baby baby a and she's like, do you see how this baby's head is flat on top and we were just like it was very easy to see it was very visible. We laugh out appointment like terrified and also very confused I didn't understand like how did none of the doctors at the hospitals hatch this? This random person at this clinic is telling us that something doesn't look right. So, honored drive home, we were just trying to figure out what to do I. Call the on call doctor at our clinic because it was the evening at this point and she was saying like there's really not much. We can do today obviously being that it's the evening by we'll try and fit you in sometime this week to come and do another ultrasound and see what's going on and so. I could. I just couldn't like this I couldn't wait. I was just like to my husband we need to go to the hospital or something like I'm just I'm having anxiety attack. I don't know what to do. So he agreed like let's go to the hospital in talk to somebody there just to see if we can get some answers. So we went to the hospital and they didn't ultrasound there. And they confirmed what the doctor or not the doctor but the technician at the clinic the Three d sound place had seen they didn't really give us any name or anything for what they were finding but they did say to moral will have you go to what's called fetal assessment here in our city and it's the place where I guess mothers are sent with high risk pregnancies or if. They see something wrong with the baby, they send people to the fetal assessments area in the hospital. So we went home drove back the next morning, and that's when the doctor there said unfortunately, baby has something called Annan softly and it means that this child will not be compatible with life. She's missing like the top portion of her brain and he gave us a bunch of information about one anencephalia. And we met with some genetic counselors there who Iverson in terms of what we wanted to do with moving forward with the pregnancy and to try and figure out if there was something genetic going on with my husband, an eye on that would have caused the situation. So. That was absolutely devastating I would say. For sure. The Lowest Point in this entire IVF journey in this tire infertility journey was that moment right there when we found out that one of the babies had. I mean, I was still grateful that you know the other baby was was looking fine and everything seemed fine but I was just in my mind I'm like if there's something wrong with the one baby, there has to be something wrong with the other baby like this. Just A, very dark place I was not thinking things. We're going to be optimistic at all, and then even scarier the options for how to move forward were either could try in abort the baby with Annan Steph Lee, but to do so would potentially poison the other baby an and they gave us the other option of if we carry through with the pregnancy, I did have a fairly high. Chance of having preterm labor or complications just because babies without incessantly don't swallow amniotic fluids. So the sack would probably get quite big and I would be fairly huge. I guess. So there's just so many different things to think about my husband and I actually decided we wanted to amniocentesis on baby be the healthy looking baby just to make sure there was nothing else going on with her? And then they did run like genetic panels on my husband and I, which took two weeks to get results for. So it was the longest two weeks ever but we were very happy when we found out that baby was completely healthy and normal, and at that point, we had lots of time to sort of discuss what we wanted to do depending on the results of a BB and. We decided that we were just going to carry forward with the pregnancy and just hope for the best and hope that you know everything went complication free and that I stayed pregnant as long as possible. At this point, we felt like it was going to be a blessing to be able to meet the baby with Annon's definitely just spend some time with her hopefully she would you know live A little while on they said to US normally babies with Anencephalia will only live a few hours but there was cases of babies living a couple of days. So we hundred percent. In that sense but we were just moving forward with the pregnancy. We were happy that things were good with the other baby and actually had a very good pregnancy. Otherwise, I was feeling grades. I was able to exercise mildly the amniotic sac of the baby without ineptly didn't actually get too big. So I wasn't feeling huge or having problems moving around or doing just basic things, and I actually worked right up until I went into Labor. I felt amazing. So I went into Labor at thirty five weeks and we ended up having a C. section just because with everything with the pregnancy and it being high risk, they needed quite a few doctors there to manage the situation in stuff in having a C. section just made it easier for everybody to be very in control of what was going on. So I delivered to baby girls Sophie was the baby with Annan cephlon. She actually lived for four hours, and as I, mentioned a thirty five weeks. So at thirty five weeks, babies can often need to spend some time in the Nicu just because they're fairly early but luckily, our other daughter who was the healthy baby Charlie Charlotte's we hold her charlie she was perfect. She didn't need to spend any time in Nicu. So I'm still so grateful for for that because we were able. To spend four hours together as a family, we had my parents and my husband's parents come in meets Baby Sophia in. It was very overwhelming for hours because I was obviously trying to learn to breastfeed this new baby and trying to take care of and spend time focusing on the healthy baby while or other baby was you know slowly starting to pass away in. So it was a very crazy surreal for hours, but it was also beautiful like we were. We felt very blessed. It was great. We had such amazing doctors throughout our whole pregnancy in in the hospital that night who just did everything they could to create special little moments. We had a photographer come in the hospital arranged for us to take pictures did some footprints of the babies and it was just amazing. I really couldn't have asked for a better way that that whole situation handle because. Obviously being nervous that something would go wrong or that we would be torn between two sides of the hospital one baby in the Nicu. The other one being in the room with us in slowly passing Leeann, it was just there is a lot of I guess anxiety going into, but things worked out very well, and we definitely left the hospital a few days later feeling like. At peace with the situation and then. Getting home, we had a brand new baby so we were just sort of whirlwind into being new parents, my daughter Charlie she's twenty months now. So it's been a bit It's been a while since we've been at home just settling into life with her. We definitely think of our other daughter all the time, but she keeps us very entertained in busy and I. Don't think we really had much time to feel very depressed about everything that happens a nor do I think that my husband and I are the kind of people that would view that situation as a reason to be depressed it was sad for sure. But we definitely saw the good in it and I think that we made peace in and just feel blessed that we. Even got the chance to be parents to Sophie and and that maybe for some chance or reason, she was the reason night you know our daughter Charlie is with us today is because she was in there with her and maybe that's the reason why we stayed pregnant I. Don't know yet definitely took away a lot of good out of the situation but back to trying. To conceive after we had our daughter, Charlie it was probably vote when she turns six months we started talking about that other embryo that we still had frozen and decided that we would start trying naturally when she turns six months, we would give it about a six month go at that, and then if things didn't work out, he would then transfer back that remaining embryo. Before those starting to try naturally, I wanted to find out if that tube that I had left with was still open just because obviously having one floppy into that was damaged and then removed There was a fairly good chance of my other two maybe be damaged as well. So I went for other it's called H. S. G. test and it did show that my other two was opened but it was. It won't die wasn't flowing out in smooth. So it didn't look like things were perfect in there but my doctor at the time, and at this point I wasn't back at the fertility clinic yet. I was just seeing my reproductive endocrinology outside the clinic again and she said, you know what try but let me think about planning another laproscopy surgery before you guys transfer back that other embryo just so we can see what's going on again in there and just. To make sure if we are going to do an embryo transfer if you guys are GONNA do IBF. Again, let's make sure that there is not another not a hydro sale things in your other two just to see what's going on. So I thought that was a good idea my husband and I actually went on a trip in when my daughter was ten months old to Italy we took her to Italy for a month and on we thought okay, we're GONNA just. GonNa try naturally and when we get back from our trip I'll do this offer Skopje surgery will back the embryo and then if it works great and if not will potentially do another cycle of IVF, I will say to like my husband and I we definitely would love to have two children but we also at the same time, we just feel super grateful that we even have daughter Charlie. So even though we the discussion about what to do with this other Emerald and then potentially doing ivf were moving forward and we. Moved forward with everything in with just a very I think relaxed mind set on you know what we would. We would just take things day by day and we would make decisions as we hit certain points milestone. So when we did the laboratofy surgery, I did find out that my other two still open but that yes, it wasn't really functioning super wall but because I still had some residual pregnancy tissue for my act topic pregnancy light what feels I two years ago they didn't want to remove that other too because they. Felt like it could Davidge my uterus. So they did say you know if you guys kept trying naturally and you did get pregnant the chance of you having enact tropic pregnancy are very high right now. So we decided at that point to just move forward with embryo transfer and not to necessarily focus too much on trying naturally we did that embryo transfer in January house January and I was not I just assumed it wouldn't work because we had two of our other areas from this cycle work essentially I know Sophie. Wasn't necessarily a an ideal situation, but the fact of the matter is we had to every implanted. So what would be the odds that are third and remaining embryo plant I was thinking it was like a five percent chance mar doctor did say to US though like we're young and you know she's like those the fact that you had to other embryos implant it's it's a good signs. There is a good chances when might work to who knows and sure enough it worked. We were super shocks I was actually having A. Pregnancy again, as wallet I wasn't having any bleeding everything levels were measuring perfect. They were more than doubling every couple days. Things were looking great by unfortunately at six weeks pregnant. I started like just gushing blood and I kind of knew when. When I started leading that I was miscarrying went to the hospital and they said Yeah it definitely looks like your miscarrying. There was a hemorrhage in there but they didn't know if that was just my body miscarrying or if there is a hemorrhage forming, but it was massive, it was like ten times the size of the generational socks. So they decide you know like this isn't very positive, but just give it a few days so that miscarriage was a pretty big ordeal I left there i. was still bleeding early heavily for a couple of days, and then it stopped went back for another ultrasound. They said that there was still some retain pregnancy tissue in there, but that might start leading again or maybe come might period I would lead out the remaining tissue. There's a lot of unknown on but I it was probably a week after I had my initial bleed that an I had stopped leading back all the sudden I just started gushing blood again in this point, it was like pouring. Out of me for hours on end. So I went to the hospital and they almost had to do a blood transfusion on me. So I felt like this was just a never ending miscarriage I was weeks and weeks of just like they're still retained tissue and they weren't sure what to do. They were talking about doing another DNC or a DNC to remove the remaining tissue. But after I guess it was probably about three weeks of leading on and off in almost having to have the. Transfusion, that finally it looks like things were normal in uterus and all was good. So that happened in the miscarriage happened in February and then we were due to start IVF in April my husband and I did decide that we would do an ivy cycle we figured we should just give it another try again if we didn't end up with two children that was okay. But let's give this a try and let's do another IBM cycle while we're while we're sort of in the midst of it all. Then colored hit. So our clinic closed down and we didn't get a chance to do that cycle. Luckily, I hadn't started taking any meds or anything I was just sort of doing the normal things they would do to prepare for I was taking some extra supplements and I was like juicing wheat grass and doing things like that. But I hadn't actually starting doing any injections or anything, and we did get the word last month at our clinic is open back. Up Again, they were only doing ivf cycles and then freezing embryos just because the impacts of Covid they I guess in Canada decided wouldn't be ideal to do any any embryo transfers right now on but I did find out last week that that has since changed in arguing frozen and fresh embryo transfer is again. so by husband and I will probably be doing a cycle either in August or September. I. Just WanNa wait until summer is a little bit more. Shorter wait till summer is closer to being done just because we like to do a lot of camping and stuff and I just don't WanNa be having to deal with injections stuff but we're trying to have a a nice summer and and also have all the bruises and stuff on my stomach. So that's the plan right now we're GonNa move forward with IVF in probably end of August or beginning of September, and we'll see where things go from there. We plan on just doing one more cycle. But as I mentioned restarted, just taking things milestone by milestone and day by day and just cutting going with what we feel is right but Yeah. That's s from start to finish. That's our journey. It was quite interesting. There is definitely a lot of highs almo is but you know I feel like at the end of it all we definitely got what we wanted. We have our daughter she's just perfect ed. Hey infertility warrior it's heather. This episode of beat infertility is brought to you by me. Regular, listeners of the show know that I struggled during my infertility journey with everything from the right clinic to advocating for protocol customized to my body to allowing infertility consume my entire existence and everything in between in other words, I've been where you are. Now that I'm on the other side and if interviewed hundreds of other warriors and fertility experts, I've discovered the fastest way to realize your dream of becoming a parent is to get educated. Regain hope build resiliency learn self advocacy skills and partner with someone who's been there whether you're an infertility Newbie or a seasoned veteran. It would be my honor and privilege to provide as one client. Put it unwavering support with fully engulfing and genuine empathy. If you'd like to learn more or schedule a free thirty minute call to discuss how I can support you during your infertility journey. Go to beat infertility DOT Co.. Hope now back to the show. I'm so sorry for everything you've been through it definitely was a lot of ups and downs and the loss of your your daughter. I'm just I'm very, very sorry about all of that. I'm curious how you manage to stay positive throughout all of this, and maybe you have some tips for listeners. There was a lot moments where I was feeling quite like sad and anxious I mean, I'm not necessarily the type of person that gets depressed I feel like I usually want to put my mind to trying to solve a problem rather than just sit there and let all the negative feelings fester so. I'd say that that's probably my biggest piece of advice in that could just be like more. So a personality type thing but I whenever I get some bad news, I would spend a lot of time doing research and just trying to wrap my head around everything right away rather than. Just sitting there feeling upset and depressed in and waiting. So for example, like with our daughter, we knew she was going to probably only live for a few hours in my mind just tried to play out that day ahead of time and just wrap my head around what it would be like what I was going to be feeling so that when it happened that I wasn't complete shock and surprise I actually asked a lot of the doctors to that we dealt with a specialist. Can you tell me some stories of like other families who have gone through this in our city? We are the only couple that ever had a twin pregnancy with an anencephalia baby. So It's like a one in ten million chance of this kind of scenario happening. But there was other families who had had babies and deliver babies with Annan Suckley justice singleton pregnancy. So I did you know try and gather some information on how those people felt. I also started following people on Instagram in searching for other families who had dealt with twin pregnancies with a baby without in lease I educate myself when I'm going through hard times and I just tryin who myself into action and and do what? I can to make myself feel better about what's going on it was easy for. US to see some light in our situation because we knew that are one daughter was healthy and I think that that made things easier. But in terms of just even going through the journey of infertility and trying to stay positive throat, the different parts of it I would say for me the biggest thing was just to keep my mind busy to always be doing my research educating myself on on what I was doing and I think it was a good destruction but also a away to feel empowered away to feel that I have some sort of impact on it right? So I could. If I was educating myself and I was able to go into doctors appointments with information on what I thought. Maybe was a good way to handle the situation our protocol I just felt really involved in I felt I was being actionable in in the journey for sure why did you guys decide to pursue another round of IVF? Lol We were going back and forth on it because like I said, we weren't necessarily hung on having two children it would be amazing but it's not the end goal was to just have a child. So the reason I think we decided to event like to pursue this other cycle was because in our province in in our city, we do a some governments funding for. It's a tax rebate that you get. So we decided you know like let's take advantage of that. It's to do an IVF cycle here would normally cost about sixteen thousand dollars but with the funding that's given by the government and also I do have some coverage with my work benefits on the medication. It would only ended up costing us about five thousand dollars to do a cycle. So that was a huge factor in the reason why we are doing. IVF again is because we realize after having our daughter that the five thousand dollars in the chance to have another child is definitely worth it. But yeah, I think you know we're still in our early thirties and we it would be amazing to have another child in I think just between the fact that it's not gonNA cost us a ton of money. We're feeling at a good point right now with our daughter's age and everything to go out at again. Kind of the reason why we're we're diving in again I, want to ask you a less serious question and probably mortally irrelevant. But what does your husband do instead of wearing underwear? He actually just he just didn't wear underwear. He would just be wearing going commando in every pats that he like even at the gym and I was like, how are you doing? This is really awkward but he felt like he was definitely making a difference doing that. So he's doing it again to just we're going through the second cycle soon here and I was. Just going to ask that if he's gone back to it. Yeah. No, I have to say he's been really good like he's definitely on board with all the crazy things I tell them to do or the under one I didn't he read that one on his own but like all the supplements just he's always been a healthy eater and stuff, but we're juicing week. On He's always on board to give it his best chance and I think he feels the same way as I do that you know we have the ability to do this this to try and get the best output that we possibly can, and I think also having had six thousand and our first cycle going. So all that we feel like what we did maybe it works maybe it helps. So it's easier to feel like it's okay and and it's a good idea to do it all over again because we get good results the first time. So how has infertility changed you I'm? Definitely more patient. That's for sure I feel like I'm more patient especially having toddler now it's like having patience is key. So that's been an amazing I. Guess Takeaway is a little more relaxed with things in life. Things are not always gonNA work out like even just this Cova Situation I'm in a commission job and normally I'd just be freaking out just you know the world basically stocked I. I was still working, but things were not going as well as they normally were with work and I. Think I just see the bigger picture. Now you know this is a moment in time or Is More to life than just getting hung up on little things losing a child will definitely teach you a million lessons. Just right there. I just don't take things for granted and every moment with my daughter is just that much more important than that much more beautiful because we had to work so hard to get her and I realized how easy it is that you could lose a child like I. I feel like there's so many things that I've learned throughout this all even just with my marriage, my husband and I I think you know we've handled some of the hardest things that parents and people will ever have to deal with in their life and we've only been married for or years, and we're in our early thirties so I think just even. As a team we function better I just I think I'm overall happier. It sounds crazy because with everything we've gone through I could easily walk around with a chip on my shoulder and just be negative in unhappy but I feel happier and I feel truly blessed that we have her daughter and yeah, I mean I think life is good and I see that. There is more than just trying to solve every little problem and to control every little thing in life sometimes, you just have to go with the flow and you have to just trust that things will work out the way they're supposed to knowing what you know. Now, what is one piece of advice that you give to your past self on the note of? Being more patient and everything I wish that I had been a little bit less hard on. or I shouldn't say that one hundred percent because I'm glad that I am a go-getter, not I took action and that I didn't just wait for things to happen that I would you know seek out advice I'd seek out doctors and different ways to try and improve the situation myself. But I wish I had been a little easier on myself because I think I was definitely i. wasn't feeling great about personally myself and I think it. It did give me a little bit of a like a self confidence issue in the sense that like finding your ovaries are functioning at the age of forty year old it made me feel just. I didn't know who I was I felt like I didn't understand my body I. Felt my body was betraying me and you know even actually going through the whole situation with our daughter. Sophie there was lots of points in that particular part of the journey where I felt embarrassed about myself and I thought I thought you know people are GonNa find when people find out what's wrong with our daughter Sophie they're gonNA look at my husband and I think there's something wrong with us or you know I my daughter Charlie I was. Like you know people and maybe she'll feel like something's wrong with her and I think that a lot of the like the low points in my journey have come from a lack of self confidence and feeling bad about myself. But if I could go back, I would say to my self you know it's this isn't your fault. This isn't something that you had control over on and you know you just need to be easier on yourself because at the end of the day you're doing everything you can you're doing everything rights and There's not much more you can do that. So I think I. Just wish. I. Would have been a little easier on myself and it's actually still something I'm working on a yeah. I. Think that's been the biggest challenge for me. Woodward's words of hope would you offer to someone who's just beginning their infertility journey right now? Well, I would definitely say you know just stay. Positive do your research be an advocate for yourself make sure that you are trusting in the process trusting in yourself always go with your gut feeling. I mean even just when I had decided to put the two embryos back on day three that was not something that the doctors were recommending I did my own research I went with my gut and I think there's been A. Lot of points in this journey where I've gone with my guide arrive I've asked the doctor like with this protocol be better or I've heard that this drug does this or even when we asked the lectures all which wasn't something normally doctors would prescribe to somebody like me, I feel like that's given me a lot of pride that I've been able to be a part. Of the journey in the sense of been very actionable I've been very involved in decisions I think that that is a piece of advice I'd give somebody is just make sure that you're doing your research and that you're being as involved as possible because there's nothing worse than looking back and saying, you know I wish I could have done more or I wish I would have. This or done that and I feel like I don't have those regrets. I. Don't Look Back and say I wish I would have done this or or read about that more. I was definitely always very involved in. It was one of the ways I kept myself my mind busy but I think there was a lot of benefits that came out of it and you know I've met quite a. Few, just going through the whole infertility journey, I've met with and connected with a lot of people who are more passive and I think that they sometimes just feel more confused about everything and maybe just less in control, which again I know that you can't be in control. But if I was going to have at least a little bit of control over things that was definitely important to me. So I would just say if you can just try your best to stay very involved in the situation and for my personal perspective and opinion I think a lot of the doctors that I've come in contact with throughout have been very welcome and welcoming and encouraging of being involved in the process anytime. I've taken researcher information to my doctor in astor voted it's she gets excited about it like. She's excited to see that I care enough or that I'm educating myself enough to want to do that research, and she's always very open to discussing new things with me and options with me. So the biggest takeaway I can say is just getting involved in definitely be an advocate for yourself. Ashley thank you so much for coming on the show today and share your story I. appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you for listening to beat infertility join our free private support community at beat infertility dot co Ford Slash. APP. If you find yourself meeting additional support visit our paid programs that beat infertility dot com forward slash pope you. If you'd like your story to be considered for a future episode, please fill out the form at beat infertility dot co Ford slash contact until next time.

hemorrhage Skopje ectopic pregnancy DNC Ashley US COVID Sophie Charlie Charlotte Canada Skopje Surgery progesterone Heather Ri Instagram Lucia Hesse jess station Annan Suckley
A Dog's Nose Always Knows

Wow In the World

26:24 min | 3 years ago

A Dog's Nose Always Knows

"Hey, Wilders before we start the show just a couple of quick things number one. If you haven't heard yet are wow. In the world Papa party is coming to the Keswick theater. Just outside of Philadelphia on Saturday, December eight th there are only a handful of tickets left so act fast to snag yours. For more info visit tinker past dot com slash events. Number two on Monday. December third we bring you the first of all new episodes of wow in the world throughout the month of December. So be sure your subscribed. And we'll be there waiting for you for more info on while in the world or to become a member of the world organization of wows, IRS grownups. Our website is tinker cast dot com. That's tinker cast dot com. For more info, that's it. Now, let's get on with the show. Action of. Good thing your sword. Doral? Yes. Door -able little bulldozer deceit. Here. Are you? Okay. I heard some. Doggiest? Roz babysitting. My aunt photos dog for the weekend. Worry about an indie nothing of bathtub full of hand sanitizer can't fix you. Much better. This sure is one big dog. You have here Mindy. I know right. He's a great Dane. Wow. So not just a big dog. But the biggest dog biggest dog breed in the old world, by the way. By the way. What what's the big guys name his name is meals. I get it. You get what? Feels like like like a no Neil in meals bore heels spor Neal's bore Neal's, bore guy Roz. He's the scientists who basically invented the field of quantum physics. Oh, yeah. Neal's board win the Nobel prize in twenty two. Sure, did and you want to know another fun fact about what he was Danish. Oh, that's starting to make sense. He was deigning. His name was Neil. He was a great guy intest in. Danish people are called Dane an so Neal's is a great. How that is very clever your old and Mojo, right? Yeah. So what were you doing that kind of Neil so riled up? So he was helping me to solve a mystery mystery. Yup. In fact, is what he does for his day job. He solves mysteries Minia here. You're not just confusing him with Scooby doo. I'm not confusing him with Scooby doo. Like, Scooby doo Neal's is a great Dane and both Scooby and kneels are working working dogs. Yup. A working dog is a dog. That's not just kept for a pet, but also trained to perform a certain job and don't worry already looked over his resume, and he is more than qualified to be on the case so meals this job here requires you to perform a lot of different tests. You think he'd be able to handle the workload like that? Nice confident like that. Now. What would you say is your biggest weakness, professionally speaking? Well, I have three she ate the honesty. Now. Finally, it says here that you've had three years of improv experience. Could you elaborate on them a little for me? Seek IRAs docs, like meals have been helping us humans out for centuries. It's part of the reason why we get along. So. Well, isn't that right? Pow. And you know, what I'm pretty sure I have a book on this in the library. Come by Ross Fola me. Course you can come to. Walk walk walk. We are. Mendi? I had no idea you had this whole Ibrar back here. Yeah. It used to be Reggie's taekwondo Joe but ever since he moved to the time machine. I've been slowly filling it up with all of my books and brains and bubblegum rains bubble. Oh, yes. So when I built this gingerbread mansion decided to organize all of my stuff alphabet order by room. Only never got past the bees rest of the houses of disaster. Obviously any who. Now looking for here the weird and wacky world of worms. No, that's not it. Weasels of Wisconsin. No, okay. We are working dogs of the world. Now, I just find this one Schapper found it. Okay, garros. It says right year that dogs have been working alongside humans for thousands of years with evidence of them being used on farms in ancient Viking times. Can you know now that I think about him Indy? I've seen working dogs used for lots of different jobs from security at airports finding people that are lost in the forest even detecting diseases, like cancer, the phone guy rise detecting cancer will Mindy. It turns out that some dogs are so good at smelling things that some scientists are using their incredible sense of smell to detect diseases like cancer, and even diabetes, that's bunker balls. They must be packing one impressive Snozzi if they're able to detect. Thing like that especially because to us humans those diseases don't smell like anything. And if dogs can smell them early enough, it might be easier for doctors to start to heal people who might have those diseases. So how do dogs smell something? Like that. When we look at the numbers. It's not really that surprising because dogs have twenty five times more factory receptors than we humans. Oh factory. Receptors are those things that are knows that help us to detect smells exactly, and you can't see them. But because of these extra receptors dogs have a smelling ability. That's about one hundred thousand times greater than our own bunker balls. Now, many we humans were very visual creatures, and we learn about the world mainly through what we see through our eyes. And because of this the. Human brain is largely taken up by the visual cortex visual cortex, being the part of our brain that figures out what we're seeing with our is exactly. And we also have a part of the brain called the olfactory cortex, which is responsible for analyzing what we smell. Okay. So how does it dogs factory cortex compared to ours is humans a dog's? Oh factory cortex is forty times bigger than ours. Let me get to strike. Iran is not only are these super sniffing canine able to detect Morris mel's than us humans. But because of their overblown factory cortex they're able to figure out what that smell is better than us to. That's right. Okay. So kneels here may have a pretty great sense of smell. But Howard these medical detection dogs able to sniff out diseases like cancer. Well, researchers from the Pierre and Marie Curie university. In Paris, France have suggested that cancerous cells, which are the cells that mutate or change to become cancer. Well, those cells released different chemicals than healthy cells into these dogs are able to smell the chemicals these cancer cells are giving up they can basically smell cancer. That's right. Remember mindy? These dog noses are a highly sensitive a real life superpower something. Hit really is Mindy in some studies have confirmed that trained medical detection dogs can even detect skin cancers. I just sniffing the skin or cancer in human lungs by sniffing. Really impressive barrows. And no idea the dogs were using their super sniffing abilities. And so many important ways. I mean, I was just thought they were using their noses to sniff each other's food. So by the way, what exactly is Neal's here, helping you out with you said he was a detection dog to the mystery. He was helping me solve. Okay. So well, bedbugs bed bucks. Yeah. This specialty spent edge you fall over the place for the last couple of weeks and frayed there might be break them. So kneels here is able to detect where the bugs are in your house. The the same way those medical detection dogs are able to detect certain diseases role. Yep. But it goes even deeper than that. So not only is Neal's able to Texas Mel of bedbugs, but he's able to pinpoint exactly -cation where the smell is coming from. And he does this using a very special ability called stereo, stop nipping Darrow. Skopje sniffing is that like stereoscopic vision will sort of stereoscopic vision is what we humans used predict Depp. That's right. And the way our vision works is each of our is sees the same thing in a slightly different way. So for example, I'm looking at right and one of my is seeing him and my other I is also. Seeing him goes to images combine in my brain to create one single image of Neal's. Otherwise, I'd be seeing two of him all the time. And that's how our brain knows. How far away we are from the things we see stereoscopic vision. That's so cool. Hey, now, I want to imagine what my life would be like without stereoscopic vision. You're easy Mindy. If crossing your eyes lose your balancing. Hand. Okay. My eyes just got all googly when I tried using my stereo Skopje vision to look at my nose up close. Any back to stereoscopic sniffing garage. Did you know that dogs are able to smell separately with each nostril show? They see the world with their noses kind of like the same way. We see the world with our eyes sector Reto Skyros. I wonder what this room smells like to Neal's. Well, I think it would probably smell like two thirty in the afternoon sorry to thirty four thirty four. What are you talking about Mindy that sort of other reason, I'm dog sitting for kneels here? I wont clock finally ran out of juice. I did notice that it had stopped ticking. Yeah. I haven't had any time to get down to the store to get some more OJ for it. So what does that have to do with looking after your mo-? Joe's dog without a clock to tell me what time it is. I'm having to rely on Neil's, which by the way, did I tell you that dogs can tell time through smell to. Okay, mindy? I know I can be pretty. Remember, the time you told me that planting curios can grow a doughnut tree that wasn't completely untrue. Pretty sure it was okay guy rise. Here's how you grow a Donut. Burst. You take the cheerio and place it in the ground covered up with a little bit of dirt. Plotter and let the sunshine in. You sure this is gonna work Mindy. Of course. I'm not sure. But if I'm right we'll have grown fresh donuts just in time for breakfast tomorrow. Yeah. I'm pretty sure that wasn't true Mendy. Well, this time I'm telling the truth guy. Roz according to professor Alexandra Horowitz from the dog, cognition lab at Barnard college in New York dogs can track in analyze how sense in a room change throughout the day. And this allows them to know what time of day. It is exactly does according to professor Horowitz throughout the day on air will rise usually along the walls of a room and then traveled to the center of the room and then brought in so docs, are able to track the, smells and all of that air, you got it. And by tracking those smells dogs are able to tell whether it's morning afternoon or not eat. Well, that might also explain why a lot of dogs are able to predict when their owners are gonna come home. Oh, yeah. Since I've been dog sitting Neal's, he's always waiting for me at the door when I come back for my trombone lessons. To just move that. Little Duffy face yard. Statement, it looks like deals you're might be getting it worked up meeting. We should take him for a walk. Okay. But Cairo's planning to do a second firm tation on your computer this afternoon. Yeah. But you don't want Mindy. I think I can wait. It's probably a good idea for both meals. And I get our. Yeah. Yes out. Finished bake gingerbread door. All right guy. Roz come should probably go catch up after you Mindy. What a day for a walk outside to chase the dog. I'm supposed to be taking care of sure. His Mindy though. I don't like the look of those clouds over there should've Poprad umbrella. We'll be fine Geyer is. Okay. You're sure. Rich. Running off like that. Pulling my leg, mini, but Neil's was completely right? It is just after two thirty in the afternoon told you could smell the time of day. But if you think that's impressive. You should know that dogs can also smell the you chair the future. Yup. They can smell it on the breeze. Dogs can smell the future on the breeze. Sure. Can remember how I told you that dogs can see the world with their nose the same way that we see the world with our eyes. Well, according to professor, Alexandra Horowitz, the sense that dogs used to build their picture of the world are often carried on breezes. So what's happening around that corner over there might have already wafted over this way. Meaning that Neal's knows what's around the bend before we even gotten there. Wow. Is that why dogs are often said to be able to detect oncoming storms? They can actually smell it coming. You know guy rise. So when a storm is coming in the ground kind of loosens up a little bit throwing all kinds of smells into the air. These mel's evaporate into the air. And the dogs can pick up on them as they travel on the wind. Wow. What is it? What's he saying Mindy? Wait. Saying where's he going to? Now looks like he's going up to that fire hydrant and. Buddy. Couldn't you hold. I guess he's just marking his territory actually Geyer is that might not be true. So here's the thing even though wolves and other wild dogs dolphin do peon stuff to Mark their territory sim. Scientists think that domestic dogs are the kind of dogs that live with us PM things for a very different reason. And what's that that same researcher from the dog, cognition lab, professor Horowitz? She describes it as a type of calling card. You mean like putting an add up on a bulletin board. Exactly. So here's the deal guy rise using their SuperSonics sniffing noses dogs are actually able to tell a lot about each other. And they do this by sniffing each other's p not making this up there able to tell how old the other dog is whether it's male dog or a female dog. The reason able to tell what it had to eat earlier that day. It's crazy. Let's see. Retriever two years old fourteen in dog years. Name is Frank dinner was steak tart tar fanc-. Visit frank. Sold. You should have brought them. Just remembered a laundry hanging out. I gotta go get it before. Print. What what what what what? And. Beckons? Closed one outside mini what on earth is head on your laundry pile. What these? These are pajama overalls Rimma Jeep or knitted them for me last week out of one hundred percent yak wool leap in every night. Last week. You say last week guy say Mindy? Think you have been bucks being Neal's bring your nose over here. Bedbugs. I think you've been itchy all this week. Because of these new pajamas. One hundred percent yak wool that explains. White Nielsen find any bedbugs time right now. Yep. Hi -gree. What did he say? He said it's time for you to get a new pair of Djaama's. Well, can't argue with that Neal's, really. Pointing to my nose. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Neal's really? This stuff. Wow. In the will be right back. Good. This message is boy yet support for this podcast. And the following message for parents, come from fat, brain toys from baby toys to brain teasers, fat, brain toys has educational kids gifts for all ages. Find a toy for every wish with their twenty eighteen holiday gift guide, featuring unique stocking stuffers personalized gifts and family games that will inspire kids to learn visit fat brain toys dot com and enter code. Wow. For fifteen percent off one item through January. I support also comes from stellar Nova publisher of the children's book the little space craft based on a real space craft by space. I l launching early next year. This story follows bury the little space craft and her big dreams a fly to the moon. Learn about this special tools berry will need to complete her mission and the importance of teamwork and believing in yourself. Just in time for the holidays checkout the little space craft by Dr mom on Amazon or at the little space craft dot com. That's it back to the shell. Hi, thanks for calling while in the world after the beep get ready to record. My name is show to enter from national. Kieran Lyda six years old my while in the world. He utters only trousers Paul. Oh, they don't drift apart by Mendi guy. Walk. Hi, my name is. Tally nine years old. And I would coming. Cucchi my well in the world and said reindeer have four of it. Hi, many guy rise. I'm Mackin eight from Providence Rhode Island my while in the world is that the moon doesn't give off the dome light. The sun's light reflects off the moon by Indian guy rose. I love your throne. Hi, my name is kyri. I'm eleven years old, and I'm from miracle, Tennessee, and my wow in the world is that every time I go to mastic practice Lee defied gravity. Thank you. I name Abigail. I live in Fairfield, California. My won the world. If it casts confused guard. I am show. My name is elderly. I am eight years old. I live in Oregon, my while underworld is that a was outside our window it as some of our grave Senate enough emailed Hudson hawk pouches could Harry their baby Jeff Kingery by Mandy by Guira. My name is Amelia, and I'm from Chicago and Maya while in the world is hedgehog. I might they're soft valley and that they can roll into a ball and like their quills and their little pot. I love your show and in guy rods by Indian guy rod. My name is miles from bronxville, New York and my while in the world that crazy earn or defense mechanism by. Hi mindy. Hi, I'm Connie from New Hampshire Miwa on the world that mount Washington. New Hampshire has the world record four wind speed of two hundred thirty one miles per hour. Thank you love your show. Bye. Ended messages. Good. Thank you so much for joining us this week on. Wow. In the world. And if you wanna keep the conversation going check out some of the questions we posted on this episode at our website, how in the world dot com and burn up there. You can find more details on how your kids can become part of the world organization of wows IRS. Lots of cool, perks exclusive t shirts. Autographed pictures of us and a bunch of other cool stuff. Wow. In the world dot com. Our show is produced by jed Anderson, say Hillary. With help from Thomas, Ben Calkins, Chelsea Ersan and Jessica vote. Meredith Halpern rancher is big boss. Our theme song composed and performed by the puffs can find more of their awesome all ages music at the puff up stock. Calm, and parents and teachers if you wanna send us an Email our address is Hello at. Wow. In the world dot com. Grownups you can also find us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram at well in the world. And if you wanna be featured at the end of the show, call us up and tell us your wow in the world our phone number is one eight eight seven. Wow. Wow. Now, that's one eight seven. Wow. Wow. And parents if you want to upload any photos, videos or messages to us, please. Visit wow. In the world dot com and find a link where you can do just that they hand if you haven't already done, so please subscribe on apple podcast, or however, you get your podcast leave us. A few stars in a review and be sure to tell a friend about the show until next time. He. Wow. The world was king task and sent to you by N P R.

Mindy Neal Neil IRS Roz Alexandra Horowitz Geyer professor Wilders Keswick theater Joe Philadelphia Nobel prize Wisconsin diabetes Skopje New Hampshire New York Paris apple
#38 Ole har gtt undercover i opprret mot opprret!

Liberaleren Podcast

22:02 min | 1 year ago

#38 Ole har gtt undercover i opprret mot opprret!

"Do that all pulled costs cost of man. Your Dean focused on the wall even our listener sick all them. Look on your debit. Hey y'all come on. Tell any of a liberal them post close all look who said yes. E- dogs report and the Cousteau Sundar Guy Matt source in the entire youth director for new to them and I had insisted here Bob lost the weight came in Sundays. We'll fees I'm going off in the neutral financial. Let's talk to death. Rockstar for Charlotte. North Pole Lebron often at Jimmy Com. Two fingers Paul Facebook.com SCO sick Lebron and pulled cost shake. Lebron all Indochino. Dr Nassar Do net DNA dog league delivered all the females instagram twitter youtube. Who Instinct Talk. We'll talk IOS TAE Inspe- bill tobogganing at Lawson heads yesterday. Note your own I recall Mattel Tedeschi trucks m. they went comfortable. It's a struggle. I also attacked Agroup C. Four Cabrera Mood Clem. History folklore mood folklore mclemore stadium associates a leak while the Elliott fastnet for oil hot hotter inland later sold stroller on a London. Hotel IN THE NEST. Nadeau would go up into the mutual sharing claim on DOGGONE COMMUNISM THAT TO UTAH. Skopje food up as I count drink shorts among agents they had sawtooth so take away today under tissue actual middle likes Mundo. Hewas six common dotted famed ailing. It fulco Focal Copenhagen will mice. Did you go to a year at the mercy? Eta negative public lifted Lavar Domino Mohammed skill secretly. Maverick Monfort comedian. This law of awesome come yet border. The much nip mnay could be much Nikola body unauthorised but yet Malta. Von Poor booed her. You discovered obvious that or does it. Also named eatable third. The Ideology Autumn Craft Kouteh lobbyist. Soup it positive they knock the sheep. They congressman In bunol to me on man that we can that some also rank up multi For Canopus on the home for the poor lots of his men the adults ask some Gordon Taylor sue get him up process or showed the monkey. Also Gordon pull to argue. They might throw a neutral spot. Assume that Obama mulitiple get through to make an exam or Gulag. Walter Mia Olivia Dental Important some usually bill our sharia normally muffled because people's desktop midnight on TV lime lativa dot com four alongside economies the Obama so the output slickly marveling at Tundra Mcclain's inside or outside on this knocks the bits. A yet attended. And no matter. Ping Airport will send that the Didik Doodo Michael. Morton launched or Hawks to deport most mid and all the nausea. And would certainly be that. I mean the caps at all or depending illuminate in in the cafeteria skippered today already the Alba's prosperity Mandela. I Woke Seles. Demand that Duska seventy eight every city benign adding it all by over four would also operative isel forever. If on the locked locks look snip sitting. You can lock the locks lock. The poor lump them in in in shifting Dr Awesome man it's absurd medically husky industry and three dogs. Ascending of your offense Cahuna for Comic Book. Loria some fiscal Thanksgiving thanksgiving days to throw multiple towards the oil steps before Thank you Baltic Y'All can I'm also said the argument them and percent on the Knox talked to throw him stealing share data altered Claude. It'll stunned so that Dot Com thank you aesthetic after motors on ship Some adult sport shirts or look all political officers. Federa- for guessing apopka offensively. Ah In Spectrometer Congo in control. Es L. to do sort of his skin Malta except Senator His said they are familiar to Soviet poll conducted all not that good poem cheap lighted on my console for trump widow data Amazon reaching the Athol If an overhaul LaPorte's You know well so added. Also father floyd out the hash looted. They've ordered Pity Minister Clark. Promulgated the sheep Your normal men departed the letter stumps. So that Madame. Slaughter the Gifford over comment on would also not skimp police X. Damola Vita Muliro or log in today for Lou of war composer behalf neither Mike. The e conflict market analysts cautioned mercure my also this optimum mom survey. Dr Begging opioid meaning. One cannot say actual enough what other I will pour a whole layer. What the clinic down to the Authority of course. Unless you're the I have Do concede that yes in offer iota. Oddly Zimbabwe Shield providers start on all them poor. Pick it up to the. I ain't got my mom there though a multiple comedy Mandy longed for your Sta At all of the Capital Smith. She ought to which lip at it goes. A mobile is in here. This is the method order among the Amazon Young. I'm GONNA tool now. Hardly and some novel of Nelson Concluded Mata Concubine Putting Utah at perspective or am Wallison thinkable. The bus placido also include NOCCO or Miana them and be dying clear. Then gruden post or not. That is really snow. Summer and fall on forgot Gary Oval somet- Ole Tom off if they're if they're all I can lead to sit in on them not attractive to quarterly about about us. How or community you normally get from the foul or Chicago. Seth does bring bling bling. Bling Ping Pong Creek Indiana Post. Ucla media in Nassir hooked up. Poor that Amundsen Stockton I in in the opener. Lister Mir on the Finance Committee administer new Honda dealer or Legitimately Special Terra Firma. Soy on the Hash also southbound after they are produced. Oklahoma the SHOE TO HOUSTON THIRTEEN GRUPO. 'til facebook evenly tonight. Peruta Assan to certitudes NATOMA. Some Law August seven. So thirty the fan you'll holler but the group tool not for for leaks. Among event occur according to the Russian Since aperture near Newark Economic Legal Local daffy calcium and then as a pros Yang contract. You want honey blister intern. Shulami is dysfunctional. They meet a tooling auto skier or a lot. Madeo liquidity hint health spirit to see Social Medica Floria Tint Drip Malone signal this the pleads quartet atom bombs Agung the disagree on their the deaths. Amaya standing at the climate skeptic air and so typically the heart so stormers Laura randomest legacy will do it. You do with your. Mayo except Heller our Palencia. Some CR Clean Air Act ended up owing calm. I want on the amount of Donald. See the specific set. Do Maduka smarter. I also engine them goal. Nagai focused focuses on multi. Likely my studio the I mean a lot to learn the concerts. Ms Fantastic missed. Effective immortal applicable said on the the WHO in leg irons mic audio on the body will dealings file or Gordon. Repeating them systematically. Leave it's hard as Tuncer Acceptance Nylon also at least all multiple multiple again but them also ops. Men met gap Asu authorized escorts fish oil on the Minsk is a multiple. Could he might not void ending it. Equally among the other witness coupling lager for the Yata couple of weekly mother is so puzzle. These men A DVD Kelly Gruber disc for my in. Mia Milia Equity Muffin. Take another. I D Talk Of High Healton Committee. Also the me. I'm not in the body to your boss. Will this be the call for Alzheimer's which Lippo's law allegory well? Osama allegory will get some or we still get older decided post op that on the so-called city ghetto -opoly tickets visit US also CEO for out. File men who took failed to pull in New York? This man So many visas Kahan reading motor and be Biden's so come knickebocker poor Vika that Avia. Also obviously donald the sculptural photo of y'all stimulus era deal awesome. Electives is simple that you man. Dan STICKS ON COMPULSORY MUNDANE. Is What patellar for workers in Harry? Avail the actor who's come Anura Renaissance. So they conduct obsolete. It's no audio only then about two years without taking modest abundantly. Em ferrall then they also focus removal Coppola Delta. So I'm sure along the now. They are better for schools. Wyden also harvey and Students reputation temporarily nervous scored. A Halla I get the Union League gift for them to in leg. Summon Ma'am there at two Diana can thumb national land activity at the DOCUMENTA Yongin. Yes ganging up Kept on Hong Kong saw Muslim silicone. Spirit it'll spree us on the dishonest yet. But I'll give you some of Louis Community a whole new book in that my Somali among reporters could Ima- the Mo- color Doppler scarlatti. Lots of good morning. Today go for long. Saban on Sailor Eric. I let nonstandard. Do I end speaking legged simply illustrate the news? So Mickey Comet Logo Pork that ten doing incompetent sitter. You told them literally. Politics igniting savvy. The heart of him suicide for family populist mystery kilogram stealing dramatics pastula limited to Steph Moscardini. Obgyn we have stall different eight. Oh you just started up on the all's well this student in leg To Namdar I'll tell you starting substance mattress come. Stay open now. This man they allow Democrats. Yes in torch. Ken Thomson So I guess the John. Galt that I saw emitting legs. Meh kids walk yet. You hit the button Darlie. Good the dog on the gifts will start your dinner for two or three quarter net tabernacle does not affect me the other now the twin leg now the Kush Lamelo Smith. I live very difficult among them. Yes Sir can do for you. Snow you put in your candidate from Pasta example matter how they will handle hocking. Orca beat right in the buffer data. It's not too Turtle McCall opened a platoon do Samantha. Covert agent We taught Ansi Salko. They'll be higher new samples. I somebody eligible goes South East CODA from Hiller ski but then booked a new. Could you don acid in Alabama all their needs soccer it via got inertness Hanukkah and sock did auction on numerous compasses artillery assault. There was a free Democrat often that Donald Trump two fivethirtyeight police scare was sort of to me. Economic Deals Onslaught Bonus Hunters New Hotel. Deceive some chunks of what he had to delegate for short handed special to open in less at soil Pomona. Joe Biden. Arkansas bitten Miss Audio did would you ditch major? Pete's else Warren or New Mike Bloomberg Kosten. Asano non consent dance the Tango Gift did it. The Democratic Mayor Some Democrats. Not because you think somebody's been Ko L. hateful or utilize software for the not for the answer from our yard L. Sort of give up Out Donald Trump for Democrats masilo. Hey understood at Uh on the Fox News Level they OUGHTA trump Las Vegas saw of Houston pulls it the rallies and they helped on the sanders. Solid will to`sign Men so I spend because politico not motor nursing Apple Restore Song Liberty National Socialism after they have been opening up Levin copy all set quick convenient. But what did I put? Kasha they are. They are from the normal stuff they asked for Dell moments because you ought to do meter skit on Komo added. We'll actually give for co-pathetic Guinea issue or so countries commendable. Social implore equal mediating. This Paul Potato tool calm duggan metal in either on the end of the system. That must up the I. Bernie Sanders John. Okay go up the puck common. I had taught me all multilateral for insider on some in the NFC also home so we trump some knock todd etiquette ricky sanders clear combustible not a conscious correct. Ted Penalties help salute the Iran. Songo T- lit up so vamp to president fog via waffly edited meden northern represent the detail. This map not awful to go to stem. Also Tonkin not under styles. Koga said this. Ultra Hispanics Taylor. There is I Clark he'll to see they also for the Nikkei to the Peterson. There's some they attribute is intended on Sempe Morton Monday conducted Hamas sound how to act in fact neatly men. The Joe Biden Sanders. Mike Bloomberg Al also team trump. Sat feeling down issue about government Dale and governments COMP UP TO ALZHEIMER. Tell nobody to open multiple holder from the rebel. The Bush Union Obama come so other relatives. Who now so thank you to the American. Their politics election at Clark to the end police newly spawned maneuver fivethirtyeight woman. A trump in the harmful asunder. So mom would not All Sanders will the weigh-in some an Taught visit Utopia well y'all so at Ronkonkoma to contravene defense stopped. Eliza outweigh that for the other. Vulgar is obviously but also some economic and SHUTDOWNS DISC. Milton called neurologists. Open border no So of the truck. It will not mention anything doesn't tell him what a and without the Stockton Mount Approval RATES IN. Hell appeals in the amount of data them. Oregan boss not physically mutated open for the external these skull talk in the awesome suck the Lebron olindo turnover. We're GONNA in sock and do Calypso de Luna Elliott who not looseness Paul VIPs some seve knee. Ansi of Tulips. Domer- FAM- sue me. Nci tools will be there to today deduction Mandala or markets must see US talk illegal under Donald e mails in this piece bar. North turned off not g mail things for facebook. Instagram twitter YouTube. You name it Does he talk talk for the dog? Do either listen. Podcast in Utah spoke to the globe liberalism. The saddest won't do post Dean Furlough. Ciano salt facebook instagram with Ob. Youtube. That's also near though. Keep it all down.

Lebron Minister Clark Obama Gordon Taylor instagram facebook Dean Furlough Democrats UTAH Joe Biden Joe Biden Sanders Donald Donald Trump US Malta Houston Skopje Agroup C. Four Cabrera Mattel Tedeschi trucks Dr Nassar
ODS Ep. 22 Michael Wagner, First Responder on Outdoor Rescue Situations; Bobby Monologues Outdoors Headlines, Some Mild Ranting.

OUTDOORS SCOPED

1:53:07 hr | 2 years ago

ODS Ep. 22 Michael Wagner, First Responder on Outdoor Rescue Situations; Bobby Monologues Outdoors Headlines, Some Mild Ranting.

"The welcomes him outdoors scope hunt fish conserved with your host Bob Falkenburg well. We're just GONNA start there. That's where we're going to start. Is What we're GONNA start with this shit setup tonight. We're going to start and and you know people don't like it then. They don't break in like it. That's what I'm saying. I had done welcomed outdoor scope by the way this is Bobby Falkenberg and you're on the scope and your your scope open your Skopje what you are. You're you're my sweet little Skopje. Take care of you treat you right. I'm a treat you just right because you're Skopje. Love Love my little Skopje's. All you little scope bastards acids man. I'm I'm kind of beat is what I beat Danielle standing here recording this sipping some whiskey since Texas Ranger we are upset twenty two outdoor scoped with Bobby Falkenberg welcome. I'm kind of got Mike Wagner tonight right but I'm kind of pulling inaudible. I had already recorded the intro for this back. In June back in June I recorded the intro for this but I recorded the intro and the Altro for Kelly van meter Mike Wagner and Brandon writer all at the same time I record it all of them at the same time because I was going out of town and then you know you know if you've been listening and if you have an update you laptop got broken had to ship it off to apple which I'm GonNa tell you. They're bad ass I know you're GONNA pay more out of the box for an apple than you are anything else but I- shipped I had to pay to get it fixed because it was out of Warranty Eighty K. I shipped my laptop. Actually my neighbor shifted off for me and they made it so easy. They sent everything to me. My neighbor got it off. My porch shifted off for me is nice comfy box that my laptop got to write him. It was back fixed. I Shit you not within three days was back on my damn porch which three days three days cousins and it works like a charm and all my data was still on it so you got to hear Kelly last last week and I had already the intro you heard I had sandbagged at Man I mean that was that shit was recorded June twenty-fourth so I'm talking about and I did one for Mike Wagner in Brandon writer and then I got to thinking you know I was rushing to do that because because we were leaving in it wasn't from the heart and you know it was kind of like Uh. Let's get shit done. Let's go. Let's let's get it all squared away and didn't sound bad you know bad. It just wasn't like wasn't I wasn't connecting with. You and I hate it. I hate that when we don't connect because I like you a lot fact I love I love you and I want to connect with you now. Really Kinda felt like I needed to Redo. It kind of felt like you know what he's been. More authentic antic needs to be more real XLII arch. You don't understand modern English that means needs to be more real real real. I'M GONNA get into so we got Mike Wagner tonight and if you're listening last week you know that Mike and I are going to be talking about rescue situations in the wild in the wild and we're GONNA be talking about people that sometimes I think people just honestly get into trouble and sometimes people are just fucking stupid. They get in over their head. They don't do simple research. Read the book death in Big Ben Read it get online lawrence parents friend of mine. He wrote it he. He's actually a friend of mine because I read his book. This is back in twenty ten. I read it in now. I saw that I saw where he lived. That's not far from me so I mean I looked them up. I found him and in two thousand ten I. I can't if I eat them if I call them but I was like hey I'm getting into backpacking because as I had in two thousand ten hey y'all know me you know all the backpacking. I've done how much I love backpacking and camping out in the back country in two thousand doesn't Tan. I hadn't done any none nine years later. I've done a shit ton of it but in two thousand ten I had done none. I had done a a lot of day hikes. I had done a lot of camping but I had done no back country camping or long-term backpacking things are different now and done a crazy bunch of it but I called him up and I was like hey dude. I read your book. It's bad ass. I'm a writer I. I want to pick your brain a little bit but I also WanNa talk to you about backpacking because we'll make noise here. I want to get into it. You know I mean it's I wanna do what you you do and he was like yeah. Come on come on so I went to see him and we had lunch and we sat there for an hour and a half and then became a friend on facebook and but anyways Lawrence Parent wrote death in big bend. It's a great book. You need to read it. This guy name Doug Pappas who was from New York and Doug Pappas wanted to go see balanced rock which is in big Bend National Park an Grapevine Hills which is kind of between the Chisels mountain range and the basin and last month Daniels they lost some wet those which the dead Horse Mountains and you know it sits there and there's there's a balanced rock if you get on Google and look up big band balanced rock you'll see what the fuck I'm talking about but anyways look there's a parking area you drive out from the main road about five miles and there's a parking area and you get out of your car parking area. You Walk not even a mile to balanced rock. You climb a little bit. You check the shit out. You take your picture picture. You walk back to your fucking car. You get in your car and you leave well. If it's during the summer months you do it in the morning or you do it. In the evening you stay on the trail. You pay attention to your surroundings. Doug Pappas happened was from New York and Doug Pappas didn't know what the buck he was doing which is unfortunate for Doug Pappas so he went out there in the same kind of clothes did she would wear walking up and down the streets of New York he had no water water had no hat short sleeves shorts which you don't fucking wear short sleeves and shorts in the desert. You don't do it go out there without a hat on and I think he was wearing sandals. We'll Doug Pappas. I missed the turn is what they think happened in he disappeared and they found him not far at all from in the parking lot dead burned up in the desert dehydrated went into heat exhaustion fell down died birger Chris rest in Peace Doug Pappas well that sucks for Doug and his family because he just read a few precautions he could have made the simple preparations. It took to go see balanced rock. Enjoy the fuck out of it. Enjoy the view drink bottles of water. Stay on the trail. Get back to your car and live another day that my friends is part of why this podcast exists I talked to people who do the hunting fishing and conservation backpacking camping outdoorsy Shit. That's what we do and we teach you. We have conversations so that you learn do this don't do that. That's part of what Mike and I have going on. You know that's part of what we're talking about and we're talking about. Why by people who are not prepared should even be fucking rescued is what I'm talking about this? Now I mean everybody like you'll hear Mike. You'll hear his opinion on that and I totally respect it. You know it's a first responder. I mean you do the job he do the job you're paid to do that that you agreed to do. It doesn't matter if more on your rescuing is an idiot that went through a high water crossing and endangered everybody's fucking life. He's going to have to pay a fine. She's GonNa have to pay a fine. Maybe do some jail time but if they live but it's still the first responders duty to rescue us. We're GONNA talk about before we get into Mike's interview. I WanNa talk to you about my friends over fitness. It's twenty eight seven hundred eight North Highway Twenty one tax. What was I saying anyways my friends over at Irony Fitness Twenty eight seventy eight north highway two eighty one bulverde Texas seventy one six three three eight one seven nine three nine eight hundred twenty one? I was just there. That's eight one seven nine thousand nine hundred twenty one. I was just they are today working out over the lunch hour. I did an adoption today down in Queiro. You know if you just new to this podcast. You know that I'm an outdoorsy as fuck dude dude but my day job is to lawyer eight society and I do mostly family law and today I had at an adoption down in dewitt county which is Queiro Texas the city everything went smooth a silk no problems at all. We were set for nine. There was nineteen cases on the docket. I notice the judge look. We got an adoption five minutes going to be out of your hair and he said you know what my only rule roll with. Adoptions is that I get to be a picture with the child's being adopted so we we made that happen and a man I was back on the grow by ten o'clock certified copies to my client and everything you need adoption. Done you give me a call but anyways I did that this morning and on the way back took let me two hours to get down there two hours to get back stopped in it irony fitness and worked out a worked out. Oh I did cross fit highly varied functional movements intense highly very functional limits the Kinda Shit that keeps you from hurting your back because you're back. We'll be strong this Kinda shit that keeps you from pulling mussels because your core is going to be strong your abs you back your stabilisers. Your Hammy quads you know all those little muscles that you never even think about that you use when you do cross fit and you will be a different person. You will be you will be the terminator as what you'll be. You'll be the terminator. You're going to be the T. One thousand the t one thousand. That's stitched up my daughter in callous spell Montana when she cut her head glacier national park a couple of weeks ago yeah yeah good my instagram. It's at outdoor scoped and you'll see a video of I think it was like day sixty seven. We're in glacier national park. She cut her head jumped into the car door. Stupidest thing she's ever done we laugh about it now but the t one thousand soder up he he looks much older now still a good handsome man handsome man but yeah he showed her up six stitches. I took them out a week later. In Wyoming Hotel in Wyoming took those stitches out the scalpel faithless holden scalpel hand out and I said scalpels it's called me a dumb ass has put scalpels my hand but I took those stitches out like like a goddamn pro cut him at the skin pull him out so that none of the suture feature that was exposed to the air goes through the wound did it all with the scalpels. No tweezers scalp related related motherfucker should have been doctor anyways yeah. You'll be the terminator if you fitness you will you'll be the terminator and it'll be bad ass and you'll be awesome and you'll be able to kick your brothers ass or if you're not any kicking your brothers asking your brothers cool. It's not a do start then you'll be able to kick your sister's ass or your mother in law or maybe even your neighbor be able to beat the shit out of them. it's been a long day folks. I'm just kind of pontificating on different. The things and I've got a glass of whisky my hand but anyways irony fitness. I was there today and did this. It was crazy easy wad. Let's call workout of the day if you don't know but it was as crazy water and it was basically like you first yes we did front squats and you know built up our strength and you want to build up your strength so that when you're working out I mean sorry when you're fishing your hike in your run in you know oh you're you're hunting climbing up okay. Here's a perfect example. When I climb up in my tree stand? Okay I live in Texas. They're oak trees and their gnarly sons of bitches riches. It's not a pine tree. It's not a frigging elm tree. It's not straight up okay. This is a fucking tree that grows like like a like. A woman walks through the department store. It's just a fucking like you never know where she's going to go next you. You have to put your cleats in the tree. Screw your cleats into the tree and but you still have to climb and you gotta strap up so if you fall you know fucking Condi- and when I climb up into my tree stand it it's taxing I it's physically taxing on my body and then I sit in the tree. Stand walk waiting for dear to walk by and that's taxing so cross it because it's functional. It's functional see you can kick ass as the T. One thousand and you can you can hunt better if you're a backpacker. I'm telling you what cross fit is the greatest thing in the world for backpacking because it works all of those muscles but anyways give them a call or any other fitness twenty eight seven hundred eighty north highway twenty one over Texas and the number is eight one seven nine thousand nine hundred eighty one twenty-one I also wanted to re record the intro because I when I did cause of action. I got to talk to you. People like a lot. We just got to talk you know and I missed that about. You missed that about you I miss I miss the time that we share together so I want that back so I've decided that here on outdoor scoped I'm going to you put more in the intro of of Mejias talking at you just gabbing at you you know just cabin and because it's just real surreal okay so why are people oh okay all right so I'm looking at my outdoor scope to facebook page and I'm going to go over this because if you're not if you're not liking me on facebook at following me on instagram. You're not a true Skopje okay. If you want to be a true scope that is a follower of outdoor scoped then you gotta go like facebook. It's outdoor scope just search for it. Azmy is a friend to personally bobby number like my law page but really this is about outdoor scope so like that and then I'm going to instagram if you don't have an instagram account I don't care how old you are get one shit. It's twenty one thousand nine hundred dammit get an instagram account. There's so much to see there is Dave Matthews would say there's so much to say get an instagram account and I'm on their outdoor scoped as well and then most importantly most importantly subscribe to this podcast on your favorite podcast app you go to the webpage outdoor scope. NOPE DOT COM was to us in there and you could subscribe subscribe and then every time I post a new episode it just POPs up in your in your in your do Hickey you pop up on your phone. You good to go you Golden Garden Cowden your amber anyways. If you want to go check it out go to scream facebook. Also I've been posed as some stuff on the outdoor scoped page okay. This is some fucked up. Shit all right right your mouth the kids if you need to headline a North Carolina father of six died after being struck by a wave at the beach okay we were in Laguna Beach last year in California. Okay okay cold bucket water huge fucking waves awesome great time great time had a great time. There was some serious shit shit was serious undertones. I'm serious waves. I mean I'm talking. I got slammed onto the Beach Several Times Body Surfing. I love to body Surf. I love to be in the wave. Save the waves pushing me in all the way well Laguna Beach. You're not getting pushed in to the beach. You're getting fucking slammed down on the beach on the sand and it's a little painful but it's it's like. I'm kind of an adrenaline junkie a little bit so it was a lot of fun this guy. I'm glad this didn't happen to me in front of my kids kids. This is on July. Twenty second today was published today this is from CNN this guy father of six foster parent great a guy adopted kids. This guy was salter the he was on a North Carolina beach which I did well South Carolina two years ago slammed damned him to the sand breaking his neck thirty seven years old playing on Oak Islands beach with three rebates kids Thursday when the wave knocked him to the ground the force of the impact broke his neck and made his throat swells so much is brain was deprived of oxygen. They had to cut him off support like within the next day. Have you ever heard of that. People go to the beach they get eaten by fucking shark. They get stung by sting razor jellyfish or they dragged out by the undertow Scott got slammed on the sand by a wave and broke his neck and and basically never heard that before my life that's on the face facebook. If you want to go get. It's a little bit more again. That's outdoor scoped. This is bad ass. Okay we're flipping the T. The F. Nineteen Wa- sp- you gotta go to my page and look at this motherfucker to t f Nineteen Wasp is a drone flame thrower attachment designed for bringing new levels of efficiency and manageability manageability to agriculture. It's a flying flame thrower. I'm telling you want legit as my kids would say it's lit but you gotta go. Check it out. It's it's flying through snow the fall summer the spring. It's it's it's flying and it's a it's got a fucking flame thrower on it okay. Let's picture this picture this okay so three or four years ago go my parents had a horrible Hornet Nest and if you've never messed around with the Hornets than you don't you don't know but Hornets Hornets oddly enough my guests for this episode. Mike Wagner helped us get rid of this Hornets Nest. They live like in the ground they make nests like under shit. Hornets nest can fill up a shed like if they have enough time Hornets desk could be so big. It fills up a shed. I mean you talk about off fucking scary. These things are fast. They're painful when they sting and if you're allergic to them or you have anthrax you could die okay. You cannot mess around with Hornets. We spent two hours and about four cans of that wasp spray that shoots like thirty feet shovels we were dressed up in coats with masks on and in Sh- shit wrapped around us because they were flying all over us and we finally thought thought we got rid of this Wa- Smith a Hornet's nest like we thought we got it was in the ground like the Queen. There's a big ASS queen down there. You gotta get her. You gotTa fuck her up like you gotta get that Queen Out of that nest or yet yeah ain't done shit like you've risked a my son was mowing in the front yard two or three years ago. I guess those three years ago we moved into our house because one day he came in he was like I got stung myself thinking. I don't know what it was and he was mowing the yard and we were like what the fuck well. We didn't know what happened happened. We wrote it off well. Two weeks later. He's mowing again and he comes running in screaming. He'd been stung several times and I went out there by the lawn mower and I saw these Hornets flying in and out of the ground the ground wasps what they call them whatever they are anyways I basically took a bunch of spray and and and killed those and Doug them up dug the nest up it was huge. It was probably like the size of like a woman's is big purse. That's how big that thing was under ground this little hole in the ground and they would come out and fuck people up. That's what they did but you gotta get to clean out of there so this nest was in my parents they have a shed where they keep their firewood and it was down deep on vic they had to firewood stacked on a pallet right the nest was under the pallet under all the firewood so we had to remove would we had to remove the Palette and we were we would run in. I'd run in my buddy who run in my brother would run it. We run in weed spray the shit out of it and we'd run out and then somebody else would go in and attack it it was it was amazing. Have you seen that video. Oh on social media those four helicopters just fire in full bore with those many guns at that mountainside. That's what we look like like. We were just fucking spraying Wa- a spray at this Hornets nest like fucking Apache helicopters with many guns and just firing rockets is and shit and and we took that Hornets nest out well week later my parents call back and apparently we didn't we we thought we got to clean but I think they had to. I think they were to Queens in there that were lesbian queens and they were they had a lesbian affair going on but they were still screwing all all the little boys in there and anyway so this flame thrower can be used to take out these Hornets nece. If we had had this flame thrower that day let me tell you what would have happened gone a little something like this would have flown the the flame throwing fucking drone right into that shed and lit that bitch up we would have burned earned every piece of goddamn would in there we would have burn the pallet we would have burned the shed down and we would have killed every Hornet there. There was the we didn't we didn't have it so you know we didn't do any General William William Sherman William tecumseh William tecumseh Sherman scorched earth policy burn up the south. You're thinking about that to come. Say what you to come set to come say. Is that an Indian name. I've I've never looked into it but was he part like Indian like native eight of American which would be really fucking ironic because he was part of manifest destiny after civil war which was sent everybody over to the West Coast and let's wipe out the Indians have to look into that all right now. This is the F- fucking Khuda Gras of this episode episode twenty two of outdoor scoped hoped posted this the other day on on the facebook page. This already made the rounds and I was like well. Let's it's pretty cool but and I read it again kind of went into it again and that was like God Dang. This guy is a fucking bad ass like this guy is the Chuck Chuck Norris of real life. Okay like I know chuck. Norris is tough and I know that you know chuck. Norris gives the sun cancer the answer and that you know Chuck Norris's toughest hell but he's also kind of like there's a little bit of hype around all that Shit Shit. I'm GonNa read you the headline about how bad this dude is. This guy has long hair to rattlesnake uranium whiskey foundering traffic stop. I could fuck and stop right there. I could stop right there. I don't have to say anything else because I just told you that a rattlesnake uranium and whiskey were found during a traffic stop. What else do we have to talk about with this with this nothing but we're going to talk about it? This is July eleven. I'm from the AP Guthrie Oklahoma Police in Oklahoma say they found a rattlesnake a canister of radioactive the powdered uranium in an open bottle of Kentucky Deluxe which is actually not bad whiskey during a traffic stop of a vehicle that had been reported stolen stolen. This guy is he's a white dude long skinny features. He's got the he's got a beard like a kind of like more like a goatee. It looks like he has long hair. Put back in a ponytail. He's wearing a fuck. Invest in one of those shirts like Patchy Indians war you know it's got like that knitted pattern material and he's got a vest on top of it and some kind of necklace I mean he is a fucking bad ass. This happened June twenty-sixth in Guthrie and they stopped the guy and they don't know why he had uranium but they they charged him with possession of a stolen vehicle transporting open container of liquor and driving with a suspended license listens as of July eleventh. He was still in jail but I think about that. How many people do you know think about it? How many people do you know that would be caught in a stolen stolen car with their buck and pet rattlesnake in the back there jar of powdered uranium tagging getting along for the Goddamn ride with a bottle of risky Kentucky Deluxe Riding Shotgun? That's about us that as bad as I don't mind saying so I don't mind saying so Fiftieth Anniversary of the Moon Landing Fiftieth Anniversary of the fucking moon landing okay I wanNA talk about that real quick because this is outdoor scoped and if you're on the moon you are most definitely outdoors Mule Armstrong and Michael Collins and other Jesus name can't remember Buzz Aldrin Buzz Aldrin the buzzer yeah sorry kind of blanked out for a minute Michael Michael Collins those older Neil Armstrong. Here's here's what's so bad ass about this recently. There was a video of some fucking idiot accusing Buzz Aldrin of the Moon landings being faked and Buzz Aldrin kept taking it kept walking away from the guy kept taking it kept taking it and finally he had enough of the Guy I and the guy called him a coward he punched in the fucking face and you know why that was so awesome because these guys we're not cowards and I posted that on personal facebook page yummy people died when they were trying to get to the moon things like guys dying in plane crashes when they were going from from one base to another to test out equipment guys dying in you know the three guys that died Apollo One ed white and Gus Grissom and I can't remember the guy's name they burned up in the capsule. These were guys who had been in the first astronaut corps or maybe they were the second nine the second night. The Astronaut Corps had been through everything had been in Space Ed White was the first I guy to do an eva in space burned up in that capsule sixty seven. It's fucking terrible man. These guys weren't cowards in any piece of crap. It's conspiracy theorists walking around talking to an American hero saying you're coward needs needs to get hit in the fucking face but anyways I digress let's talk about the moon landing and let's talk about how it's been fifty years and let's let's talk about how I heard some stupid woman outside of Spring Branch store the other day say oh well I mean they of course they were faked. Of course the Moon landings were faked. Yeah fact okay well. Let's hear your theory and I was eavesdropping was droppings meves. She's like okay think think about it and she's talking to these other guys that are just sitting there listening to her nodding their heads if they don't have the technology now the mid Mitt like how they had the technology not sixteen up the net and takes another drag rag on her cigarette and I'm like you fucking stupid as they spent something like two almost three decades just trying to figure out get to the fucking moon. Jpl Do you know how JPL was established. Jet The jet propulsion lab in in California by accident some college kids playing in chemistry students playing around in their dorm room and they blew something because they created jet fuel that they use to get the solid rocket boosters off the earth that the were they were testing the lunar module testing how to land it to get it on the surface of the moon. Neil Armstrong almost died flying that thing he was up in space pretty much one hundred and forty thousand feet in the air in what was it the x seven. I think almost died because he bounced off the atmosphere it. He had to figure out how to get back in. You know I mean I mean these guys were bad asses of and courageous people of the degree and you got people are walking around saying saying that they're frauds and they're cowards fucked. Those People Fiftieth Anniversary and you need to see the movie I man I know there's from the Earth to the moon is Apollo. Thirteen is good movies about space but you need to see the right stuff. The right stuff is a bad ass flicking. We've never seen the right stuff. Stop Calling Yourself in American start drinking some fucking orange juice and go watch the right stuff. Okay then you can call yourself in American again. Let's talk talk about I man Ryan Gosling. I've never been a big fan of Ryan Gosling but I gotta say I was super super impressed with his performance with the story with the presentation with the cinematography with the the music. The dialogue I man is a great frigging movie and I strongly suggest that you go. You're watching right now. No you really need to see it but anyways I was just talk to you about a few of those things but if you wanna see they was all trade points that dude in the face go to my facebook. Go check it out. Sorry sorry people are upset with me right now. 'cause I just posted on my private facebook page that I can't do fucking America's got talent or the voice or America. I just can't do that shit. That's just not me. Don't forget to go back and listen to last week's episode. Kelly van meter was on fitness enthusiasts. She's lost seventy five pounds what she lost and a little under a year. She and her team won the women's heavy civilian division of the Bataan Memorial Death March March Seventeenth Twenty nineteen out and White Sands missile range in New Mexico says she went from being unhappy and overweight to winning that fucking race and being happy with herself and Buffet Shit in about a year her and part of that is stronger you which is a macro counting and part of that is cross fit and rucking Denise Shuman Shuman was on her team and Denise Shimin is got a I. I don't know if you call it like an affiliate or what but she does stronger you. You can go find her on facebook and see what she's done for a lot of people but denise is GonNa come on as a guest as well look forward to having that she's GonNa talk about stronger you in count macaroni and how you can lose a lot of fuck away if you're dedicated enough and she'll keep you accountable but Kelly van meter one of her students and clients whatever you WanNa call it and her podcast was last week and it was really good really enjoyed it next week. GonNa have brandon writer on Brandon writer the singer just get on itunes and look Brandon Ryder. Get Online China look up brandon writer and you'll see that he's very accomplished very well. Known has nine studio albums and done a lot of touring one a lot of awards words very cool guy by the way enjoyed his interview so much. He enjoyed it so much that he said I want to do this again in person and sing some songs for you. I said Heck Yeah but anyways his interviews next week. It'll be episode twenty two so now we're GONNA get into my buddy. Mike Wagner and I talked about rescuing people off mounts that further ado here on episode twenty two US are brand writers going to be upset twenty-three this guy this fucking guy you give them a little whiskey and he can't count any more Jeez Schuss episode twenty two Mike Wagner next week episode twenty three Brandon Rider. Here's Mike then you're representing the organization so I'm happy with just saying that I've been a firefighter for nineteen years and I also do search and rescue. You just did it you. You just said I'm recording you okay so you are you're of can we say your name of you can say my name so Do you have your social ready to because I wanna I wanNA use your your social as well and whatever else we need okay I trust you your lawyer so I am here with Michael Wagner and as he just said he's been a firefighter for nineteen years nineteen years God we're old yes we are we are world and first responder Yep par for search and rescue team. I do search and rescue all so that's one of my other gigs and that's why you're here yeah because we have this this you're comfortable right. I'm very comfortable okay. We have this this great topic that you and I discussed which it was you know this is outdoor scope so I know we talked about a lot of hunting and fishing and shit like that but it but they're always a but there's always a but we we also talked about hiking backpacking. You know any kind of outdoor I it's outdoors scoped. It's any kind of outdoor activity whatsoever and one of the things that I have been reading about. I'm going to pull something up here but I had been reading about that. I was just like band. What what yeah I'm typing and it's loud about what what is the deal with people who go into crazy environments whatever it is and get in trouble where I know we have the people who they ignore barricades and they drive around barricades got the the people who there's a storm coming and they don't evacuate right and so on and so forth reminded me of a situation that you and I were the report of storm came in camping on the beach and we all slept through it yeah yeah yeah I remember that we lived we lived but we were young? We didn't Care Delia. We're invincible duck down but the point being my point being that there's also a situation where people can essentially affirmatively not through an act of God not through you know something that they can't control but they're like Everest Everest Everest Twenty nine thousand twenty nine feet high right. That's where commercial airliners fly yes when you look up and you see that little dot with the contro behind it. That's how high Mount Mount Everest is usually Sometimes they fly a little bit higher but the thing is when you make the decision to consciously put yourself into that situation situation and when you die on Everest you nobody can help you right like the chance of rescue is like zero percent yeah. It's you go up there knowing that if something he happens to you you're that's where you're going to. That's where you're going to remain. That's where you're gonNA. Remain and lots of people do remain up there and the other thing is they never re. They never recovered the bodies getting somebody who's with you who is standing right there with you. They can't even help you because they don't have the strength or the tools right to move you or do any. I mean there's some people who try and I've read a lot about Everest I know but let's say that those people in that situation relation I think this year so far twelve people have died on Everest slow your yeah Oh yeah and it's because there's bottle-necking on the trails trails people once you get above. I think twenty thousand feet or something like that. It's the death zone right might be a little higher. Your body begins to literally breakdown when you die yeah so you and I talked about and I'm sorry. This is a long introduction but I want to make sure people understand why we're talking about this. Take it take that into any situation nation where you maybe you have everest you have people who decide to Kayak River. That's too high. Yes you have people that decided to go rock climbing and they don't really have the skills. Whatever whatever it is you as a first responder somebody who's been doing it for a long time search and rescue? How do you feel and I had posed is the question on instagram and facebook should people who climb up on Everest? Should we feel sorry for those people because there is no rescue and seventy. I think seventy percent of people said no so I wanted to get the perspective of somebody who is paid and trained to do this to come on and talk to me about okay well. Let's talk about those people that purposely put themselves into deadly situations what efforts and how much time and money and expense spent should be put into trying to save them so that's why you're here and there you go so when you're talking about this type of situation I think bringing something like Everson Everson to it is really giving yourself a broad spectrum so everest like you said there's a there's an altitude which you hit which is called the death zone and once you get to that point like you said your body starts to die but also the people that climb Everest. They're not just rookies you know they theoretically they have been training for a substantial amount of time. You don't just walked walked Everest and in decide you want to climate. I mean it takes months of preparation so I think the people that climb mountains like that the extreme mountain mountain climbing. They know what they're getting into and they know that if something happens to them there's no rescue coming. Now you also brought up stuff like kayaking or people will that don't evacuate when there's a natural disaster coming of not a zero warning event but like a hurricane or flooding so I think there's a difference. Is there so from my perspective in my experience. If somebody gets himself caught in say floodwaters they decide they WANNA go kayaking because it's been flooding flooding for three or four days and the river is just prime for you know Whitewater well yeah I wouldn't advocate advocate that but if somebody has an accident and they're seen capsize out of their boat and float down the river hopefully they had their their. PF D. on and yeah we make efforts to try and rescue them and we will and whether it's first responder or whether it's search and rescue we will send mm people out and do everything in our power and exhaust all of our resources to try and save somebody so you're saying there's a distinction between the the affirmative choice to say I'm GonNa go climb Everest and somebody who makes the affirmative choice to ignore storm warning. Es Es yeah the difference that I see in it is you know taking an extreme like Everest. You can't get helicopters up past a certain level so there really is no rescue up there right however at normal altitudes you know say around here you know Spring Branch Guadalupe we do have the means to to rescue people to do everything we can to save him. We have helicopters we can take rescue swimmers and to to try and pick people out of trees. we have teams that are trained and swift water. You know there's things we can do to try and and help people and try and rescue rescue viable victims okay but what about the the people that ignore the whole turnaround don't drown and they get out there those to me. It seems seems like you know it's illegal because people who are trained invaluable society and risking their lives have to go out in the middle of raging water and save some idiot who couldn't read a frigging sign and or you know wouldn paying attention right. I'm not talking about the people who actually get caught up in. Those situations honestly sleep right. I'm talking about the guy driving the school bus. The camera. Show was pretty impressive driving around the barriers. It's like how what point do we say. You know what drown drown. Just we'RE NOT GONNA. We're not gonNA waste good lives on you because you were an idiot and decided not to you know think about it and you know. I guess the thing really is I think talked about this on our phone. Call I want you to hit on is that's what y'all are paid to do. The right which we don't get to make the decision. We're not going to go after that person because because they went around to barricade or they thought they could make it. There was no barricade up. They thought the flood marker was an inch is not in feet they didn't. They didn't and see that the water was that deep. We don't get to make that choice whether we're going to save them or not if somebody calls and says hey there's a person trapped in the water. Someone calls it their cell phone. We're going to do everything in our power to try and rescue that person when I get that because I mean I don't get to pick my my clients facts. You know if I'm appointed pointed to represent somebody. Oh how can you defend somebody who's committed a crime well. We don't know if they've committed the crime and even if they have they're still entitled to that Defense so I get that right right but is there a distinction though I mean. Do you see a distinction between somebody who says I'm going to risk my life. I'm going to do this and it's because I want to have fun and I wanna say it wasted on the top the world and somebody who drives around barricade is there a difference. I think there is a difference in the attitude of the person committing the act but from the rescuer side there's no difference to us whether someone was accidentally caught and floodwaters or they intentionally put themselves there. There's no there's no distinguishing rushing between that for us. They're a person they're alive. We're GONNA do everything we can to save them. if we determined that it's a recovery yeah that the person you know went under and they haven't been seen again well then we you know we have to scale things back little which we can specially with on the search and rescue side when wimberly flooded years ago you know that was one that was that was a long few days as trying to search for people who reported being seen floating down the river and then nobody saw them again so we put a a lot of a lot of manpower a lot of effort into trying to to find them hoping that maybe they were still alive somewhere that they were clinging to a tree or you you know by luck. They made it out of the river. I remember you know it's funny that you said that you say years ago. If it feels like it didn't happen that long. Was it like four or five years ago it was it was probably about five years ago and I remember the next summer because you and I have been kayaking. We've been backpacking together. Of course we grew up together going camping and all all kinds of shit right but I remember when we were kayaking down the GUADALUPI. I WanNa say it was that summer it was the summer after the wimberly floods it's right because there was debris fields everywhere and I remember you. I looked at one and I was like Gosh that debris field is as big as a house and you're like yeah. That's where the debris-filled brief hield like that is where they found one of the bodies right in wimberly and so you know I was just kind of thinking about that like let's let's talk about. Do Do what I'm saying when I was thinking about that it's like you and me have done things like when we were in New Mexico right the last night we can't almost twelve thousand feet it was called. It was really Lee really freaking cold. Did we make the decision. I mean you seriously we. I'm just thinking of how bad we smelled smelled so bad that we had dinner in in my tent yeah three of US having dinner in a one man tent well. You know that's the best kind of fun I say this often on the podcast. The kind of fun is the fun that sucks. Oh yeah and I gotTa Give Credit Stephen Ella for saying that but did we ask for when we went out there for four days. In forty miles we went forty miles. Yeah there was like thirty eight and change right on the cusp of winter yes and did we. Did we ask for a situation where if we had gotten into trouble. you know people say like well. You know they kind of went out there on their own and I know you're a first responder so you're always going to be of the attitude no we we're going to do whatever we can to save that person but speaking from the general public perspective people that go in there to rescue those people because you can get rescued yeah. Did you hear about the eighty five or eighty eight year old man who hit he was hiking this weekend with his grandsons nod in here about he was hiking with his grandsons in their fourteen in eighteen okay he was found on the brink of death and the grandsons grandsons had summited and gone down a different route and left him out there. Okay they found him in the field position frozen almost almost whereas this up I can't remember the state I don't remember but he was about to die and he told the authorities as this was my call. This was my fault. We've done this before I fell behind. I told them to go to go ahead and go ahead of me and do your thing right and and I was lagging behind. Will this time like he almost died yeah. They left him out there and he said I told them to go on without me right. What do you think about about that as a first responder well first of all is just as a person that's that's tough to aid tell someone to go John and to be that person to actually do it to leave someone behind that had to be really tough especially for teenagers from the from a first responder perspective and you know someone who does use our of what's use our urban search and rescue okay now obviously that's that's not urban search and rescue but it search and rescue and search and rescue yeah you know that one it can go both ways the two people the WHO the person behind if they if they can make it out then you have somebody who was there with firsthand knowledge of what happened so they can direct the rescuers to try and hone in on the location of the grandfather at the same time you know on the other side of the coin is now? Oh you have two parties involved you have the grandfather who's left behind and now you have two teenagers. Even if they've done before you could potentially have you know oh two separate areas to have to do to search so on the way over here I was thinking about our trip to Mexico and the topic is a whole you know if you're gonNA you shouldn't not go out and enjoy nature because of the potential risks are the hazards involved okay on our trip into Mexico. Anything could have happened out there of a broken ankle broken leg. Somebody could have gotten sick you know the the list is endless but but that doesn't mean you shouldn't be able to go out there and do that correct so if you do it smartly and you let people know where you're going to go how long you're supposed to be out right. The general area that you're headed will now if something happens at least rescuers have an idea of where to head so in and not knowing the full story of the GRANDPA and the two the two grandkids you know if people knew where they were going and they didn't show up back back to the car back wherever when they were supposed to and a couple of days go by they can at least go to the forestry service or you know whatever rescuers rescuers or are in the area and tell them hey you know grandpa and the two grandkids went out they were supposed to be here. They were supposed to be back on this day. They didn't show up. That's actually a lot of information for for rescuers to be able to go in and try and find somebody well. Let me ask you a question about that well. There's two things one is is just kind of aside to what you were talking about. What was what was I was just thinking of something? Oh I WANNA make sure we talk about what you do you. I know and I know you know but I want to share it with people because people listen to podcast to get enlightened. If you do get stuck in the wilderness or you get stuck somewhere somewhere. What are the rules basic rules to follow and let's get to that in a minute yeah but what was the last thing you just said it was about a a- about La- I was talking about letting people know where you're going to be young? People plan giving people a plan and that and when I yeah when I went to the Washington mountains in December that's what that's exactly what I did. I told faith you know. This is where I'm going to be. This is the direction I'm going even told her what direction I was going on the trail gave her every all the information and then I put a note in my car. Hey if you find a you know this is where I went and this is where I should be right if I'm not back doc by this time and I told faith that too if I'm not back by I think it was like Monday at ten. Am something's wrong yeah if you don't hear from me call for help and that was during the government shutdown down by the way Oh so you've got an answering machine seriously in the event of an emergency. Please help yourself but before so I want to talk about the basic rules so what do you do when you're screwed out there but we were talking about Everest people. This is a list of everybody. That's died on ever since three hundred eight people since they first summited back in the fifties right three hundred eight people have died on Everest and here are I'm not gonna read all all the names but like just just as an example so on May starting last one die last year was April twentieth may twenty first two thousand eighteen so this guy's from the United States. He was the first one to die April. Twenty twenty nineteen died after a fall while trekking down from base camp so he he he made it all the way up. All the way down was coming from base camp and died. shameless Shea Lawless from Ireland may sixteen uh-huh presumed dead after Fall Ravi Takhar may seventeenth twenty eight years old altitude sickness and I'm just GONNA go down the list. You know there's another American altitude sickness another one exhaustion on descent and Austin on descent you know they say mostly injuries occur on the descent see and that's one of the things that we emphasize when we're doing a search and rescue deployments is when we're demobilizing and what we're starting to break things down. That's when we have people stay on their highest alert because that's when people tend to drop their guard. Yeah is on the downhill slope of whatever you're doing so daunting think you've done John The hard part and you let your guard down right. We talked about that when we were in New Mexico because we've gone you know twenty miles. We're like okay. We're on our way back now especially on the last day don't get Lazy Lazy Yeah. I don't think that everything's okay this another one altitude sickness exhaustion and outside sickness exhaustion during the scent cardiac events during descent he did it. This guy was climbing the seven summits so who he was sixty to sixty two yeah okay so. Let's let's. Let's put this into perspective sixty sixty two not that far no it's not we're forty two. It's twenty years from now. you know it. Just it really makes me think as an outdoorsman you know oh I know when I put myself into certain situations okay. I'm taking my life into my own hands. I'm Brian Rusting myself and I kind of have the attitude. You know I would want somebody to save me but I don't ever want somebody to risk their life to save me. Well and that's one of the to me. That's one of the biggest when it comes to first responders and rescuers is that we're risking our lives so there there is there is always an inherent hazard with stuff like firefighting. Ems being a police officer helicopter rescue. There's an inherent risk in everything anything I'm sorry inherent hazard in all this stuff but thank you but we manage those risks by by being trained in what we do so you wouldn't just want your neighbor to come out to New Mexico and try and rescue you out of the forest. You want someone who's trained got it so the the trained professionals you know we we have learned how to manage those risks yeah so when you say they're risking your lives something like swift water. Yes that's always that's always a risky situation. two of the two of the most nerve wracking situations that I encounter are swift water and then believe it or not excuse me traffic accidents on the highway to me. Those are the ones that really have my have my senses alert and have me you know with the head on a swivel not just for me but for my crew because there's just there's more hazards involved with those type of situations so when when you're talking about you know people risking their lives to save you from the forest. I think that's I think that's not quite as risky as swift water or something like that so I just you know with with you not want people to risk their lives. I think there's there's a there's a differentiation between people actually risking their lives and having to take the time to come out and try and find you so what we didn't in New Mexico had something have happened to us like all day to day three. When we were the farthest out you know if we if we had been able to signal for help somehow I don't think those the service would have been risking their lives? Come get us now on the flip side during a hurricane or during the flood yeah putting people people in moving water. That's that's always dangerous. I think that's a really good distinction to make you know what the first distinction I heard you make was if you're dealing with the people who have applied for trained for and have accepted the responsibilities and roles of a job where they know okay. I could die saving people. I could get injured adjourned. That's my job. It's hazardous and then to is it a search and rescue or is it just a rescue. You know we having to search for this person. Are We having even to hike twenty miles. You know equipment. Try to get them out or we just you know we just right here but you and you're talking about moving water and whether it's a hurricane or tornado or high water crossing whatever right you've done swiftwater rescue yes. Let's talk a little bit about that so because there could be you know I mean in the outdoors the worst there's all kinds of ways that you know in Washington where I camped. There's a campground that they changed the rules and nobody's allowed to camp there because is in twenty eleven twenty eleven or twenty twelve thirteen people died overnight because it rained upstream right in the flood waters came down and washed all these people away and oddly enough. I represented a woman. Her son was one of those people I didn't put it together until afterwards and I was like that's what she was talking about but anyways you know so swiftwater rescue can happen to anybody anywhere right most the time. It's going to be in an urban area where there's a low water crossing right urban or rural. Some somewhat rural wimberly wimberly was mostly rural. I mean you have the town of wimberly but there are a lot of country roads out there so let's talk a little bit about that and what you think about what what what should people know before we get to the basics of survival arrival when you get lost or trapped right. What should people know about swiftwater process away from it? Just stay away dumb ass go over there. I don't Oh I don't throw names or labels but it's always best just to avoid swift water moving water and you know with the Internet Senate being what it is look up videos on on swiftwater well. Let's see I know I can't remember what flood it was but uh-huh I remember a video before I got facebook that showed the water rising at this low water crossing and was at time lapse. No it wasn't time lapse it was it was real time it was that fast and I mean within within a matter of I think it was thirty seconds. You saw a little bit of debris crossing over the road and then the water water got a little higher in a little higher in it really came in as a as a tidal wave and I mean it wasn't the kind of tidal wave you would imagine over your ahead and waves crashing but the water came in quicker than I've ever seen and one of the things that saw wimberly is we had one of our canines yes and the handler searching and debris pile and when we found debris pile you could walk to it from the bank cross a little bit of water that was maybe ankle deep and then you're on a new island that had been formed from all the the washout and all the debris so the dog and the handler are searching that debris they had some of our rescue specialists with them and myself and a few others were kind of on lookout is safety. Will we started noticing the path where they had cross it was ankle deep. The rocks were starting to disappear and what had happened was the day prior it had rained again way upstream so that surge urge was just now making it down to where we were at so what's that's scary shit well. It is especially when you're out there and you see it happening. So fortunately we had people on the lookout we had we had spotters and we we call down to them and said Hey y'all need to go and come on back so they did and in a matter of just a couple minutes where they we were at was back underwater so we had gotten them out before that storm surge hidden made its way down but for people who don't know to look out for that stuff they if you've never ever seen it. You wouldn't expect it well in okay so I remember in the flood of ninety a thousand to both floods we went down to the three eleven bridge over the Guadalupe River and both times the river was so it was so stupid I would do it again but it was so high we bunch of us were standing on the bridge. Yeah fucking house came floating down the river and hit the buttress and it was just feet. I'm not talking about double digits. I'm talking about single feet and we were looking down at the Brown floodwater and if you've ever been to the three eleven bridge and in this is in spring branch Texas. It's I don't know what thirty or forty feet high so the river was running out on how many million cubic feet per second I mean it had to have been up there in the high hundreds of thousands yes because I've seen it at thirty the foundation and it's it was way higher than that and so it's like you know you see that and and I remember I think it was two thousand a two. We were looking at it again and they came and got us off the bridge and they said Y'all got to get out of here. Yeah it's not safe because the bridge was shaking so but when I was I was going to tell you as my dad in my brother in two thousand two were at Rebecca Creek and they were standing there and the water was coming up so fast that they were having to back-off like step by step right so yeah. It's it's like super-quick. That's one of the things that you know again. There's a difference between being trained and not being trained in in it. One of the things that were on the lookout for when you're on the riverbank is find where the water line is at have a distinct marker and keep an eye on on that either the water's going to recede or it's going to keep coming up at you and that's one of the things that you're trying to look out for yeah so one of the th- you told me you made me think of something when you're on the bridge when we were out at Wimberly the Fisher store road bridge seemed seemed a relatively brand new version. Is that the one that flipped over it didn't flip over it was heaved up off supports. I've got pictures of it on my phone and the the road that was going over the bridge was picked up off the supports and it drops you know fifteen twenty feet downriver so if you think about the amount of force it takes to lift the road up off a bridge can't even and did that can't even fathom that that's that's why you know turn around. Don't drown is is for for real. I mean people don't realize how much force moving water has until you get stuck in it and when I was doing is with water technician training out at the shoots in new brothels one of the things that we do is with your with RPF dis on were clipped onto a rope and we go down the chutes and then they a whole bunch of people are holding onto rope and they stop you where you're at and just let you feel what it's like to you know sit there and be pushed in the shoots but not goanywhere onlywhere swift water to it is it is I mean that's a lot of water moving through there and it's difficult to move at best. You're not gonNA fight the current. It's going to win so you know until you've experienced that you just don't know so. That's why it's always a good idea to avoid avoid swiftwater if it's flooding watching on TV you know don't don't go and watch it in person because that's just more potential victims for for rescuers but good. It's I mean it's impressive to see you know to see a river. Come up as high to the bridge like you said at three eleven I know Guadalupe State Park. They've got the pictures and when it flooded back in the eighties eighties and they've got a picture of the camp ground or the the picnic area down by the river and then I think another picture was taken. Maybe thirty or forty minutes later and if you've you've if you've ever been to Guadalupe State Park the water rose all the way up to almost the top of the cliffs on the other side of of the river villages it's nuts because Clifford twenty five feet yeah thirty entire than that yeah so you're talking you know hundreds of thousands of cubic feet per second of water moving through there you know it takes houses foundations so it's best those are the situations that people can avoid you know if you live in a river house and the river comes up and gets you well. That's one thing but if you intentionally take yourself to that environment just to see it or to throw your boat in the water. Water your Kayak because you know the Guadalupe never been that high before now you're putting yourself in Delhi situation that you probably shouldn't be yeah and let's go the opposite direction for a second okay because you know a fire oh five so Ba- you've been a firefighter for nineteen years yes so let's just for a moment omit. Let's actually talk about fire. Okay so you've seen the movie only the brave yes okay in Hollywood does their thing and there's probably some things about the movie. There's a bit of dramatization tation. Yeah that real you know smoke jumpers and hot shots were like whatever or even firefighters who don't do that. Most of what you you've been trained on is in in your everyday job is but I know you've done real right firefighting but I know you're part of the the search and rescue and I know you've also been part of the taskforce. Would that yet yeah. That's that's the search and rescue portion so you're trained on rural as well. Yes okay so what about people that know that in California they know brushfires coming and they don't evacuate. They're like no screw that and you know maybe the man the evacuation. If it's mandatory or not maybe they don't have the manpower to get people there right there in that situation they get cut off by fire. What about those people like? How do you feel about that well so when you're talking about a forest fire to to me again there's there's distinctions between all kinds of disasters so take all the the forest fires in Colorado and California here lately if somebody somebody chooses to stay at their house when a forest fires headed their way there's not much you can do? you know from the from the legal side. I don't think law enforcement can force anybody out of their house. They can't go in there and take them out of the house. I think if there's an official mandate from like the governor run or I don't quote me on this but I think if there's like a almost like a martial law thing in his state you know it's like they can. They can remove you by force right right but if that's not declared the no I mean you have a constitutional right to die. If you want to the one one of the few things you can possibly do you know but when you're talking about the simple only the brave you know forest fires where people don't get out of the way ahead of time they're taking their lives into their own hands and there's not much that can be done for them. you know forestry firefighters wildland firefighters that is a totally different type of firefighting than structural and those guys really really worked their asses off. They don't have fire hydrants. They don't have endless supplies of water. They're out there with chainsaws are the dirt other out there was just starting shovels or so after they've already jumped from an airplane sometimes or heighten those guys really worked their asses off and there's really no way for them to get ahead of a fire to get people out. It's more of you know you either. Leave on your own or you take your chances and they try and identify your teeth afterwards. Did you think that was a good movie. I liked it. I mean just any any movie that has to do with emergency response. You know I take it with a grain of salt because Hollywood has to dramatize things I gotta sell tickets right. backdraft was really interesting. I I mean if we could see that clearly inside fires life would be so much easier you know or saw backdrop for the first time Oh gosh your house really yes. You don't remember that that it was a long time. We all got off on Jennifer Jason Leigh we were we were young as its back when she was hot. Yeah and you know so women can get older now. She still hot. We're older. I don't know how have you seen Morgan. No okay so Morgan's got Kate Mara in Kate Mara's Oh yes super hot Jennifer Jason Jason Laze in that and she's a psychiatrist okay. I'll tell her my problems she. I've seen women her age age much better I don't know talking about about her. I'm just saying hey. AH HAPPENS IT DOES I. H happened to me and I. I know that I'm probably horrible looking but wasn't going to say it. The I appreciate that but my point being being my point being I saw backdraft at your house for the first time we were kids you know and you know I didn't know anything about I mean I I know you and your brother Because Your Dad was a firefighter. y'All a lot about it but I didn't know shit about our fighting at that age. I thought it was a decent movie but when I saw only the brave yeah I was like okay I don't I've read about hotshots and I actually thought it was a calm. Look cool career told stone about it. You know 'cause my stone. Is My daredevils level yeah. You know you think he's just he'll do whatever and I was like dude. This is like you get to jump out of airplanes and go fires. That's pretty frequent cool. You know the best of both worlds yeah seriously but anyways it was it was kind of like you know how how well did that movie because my family watched that movie and we all all watched the whole thing together. Nobody got up and left. Everybody finished it right. the girls were crying at the end of it because it was a true story story and they showed all the pictures but I think about that like that whole Alan ruin the movie for people but don't be a spoiler. I'm not going to be a spoiler but you know something. Something bad happened. Yes and those guys put themselves in harm's way to save a structure to save somebody's place right and you know we're talking about people putting themselves in harm's way to save lives right so how do you what's the distinction distinction between that like you and I had a discussion before. I'm not going to send my guys into a burning structure where there's no possible way life can survive in there. You're right when when conditions are not tenable so yeah okay conditions aren't tenable right. Where do you draw that line with people that are in a situation where conditions aren't tenable to get to that person? That's that's tough. I mean from again. There's a there's a huge distinction between the structural side and Wildland outland so when you're talking about only the brave where they're out in the forest that's very different than than what we do on the structural structural side well they look at it from your your point structures so when we show up if you know if we strip of buildings on fire if there's reports that there are people inside even if there's not reports of people inside we still have to make sure that there's no one in there yeah but this is where the you know training and experience this come in where we're trained to recognize the signs of the building to be able to read the building the amount of smoke coming out of it. Where's the fire? At where does it look like it may be how much smoke is pushing out and then ask yourself does. Can anybody be alive in there so you can in play the what if game over will you know somebody maybe in a back closet tucked away hiding but I've seen since structures were you know smoke is just pushing being out of every nook and cranny and every opening and you know those those conditions are not tenable. If somebody's in there there's a high probability see that they're not savable. They've either die from smoke inhalation or the heat right and you know that's that's where we'll risk a lot to try and save someone who save -able but through training that's where we have to start to make the distinction you know our conditions is tenable for life and if they're not then we have to we have to reevaluate how we're going to attack or how we're going to use our tactics and what our strategy is going to be. if it's questionable well we'll do what we can. I mean we're we're not just going to show up. So what the hell fire. We're not going in there. one of the things that I've experienced is you know you start you start to make your way into a structure and with all of our protective equipment on if it's untenable untenable for us in our P P then you have to find kp for the people who don't know personal protective equipment all of our firefighting firefighting gear yeah if the conditions are such that with all of our equipment on it's not tenable for us than somebody somebody who's just in regular clothes. It's definitely not tenable for them. So that's where that's where we have to start using experience training and judgement to say now now you know there's we need to reevaluate this. Let's talk about that heat from it. We talked about the water. Let's talk about the heat right. You know I mean I've burned brushfires big ones that we started on the ranch. When I was in high school? We'd we'd have eight Jain Normaco brushfire right that we built with a front end loader yeah that's how big it was it would burn for hours and hours and hours and you couldn't even be within twenty feet of that thing would burn so hot lots of Cedar in it right but even a small small fire I mean you you know smaller fire rather the heat is intense. You know whether we're inside or outside describe for for the listeners listeners what the heat is like even in your P P. It's a limb people can understand if you're in a structure or brush fire fire or force fire because Diane Force fires. What does that heat like? I mean it's yeah I mean not not dumb it down on too much but yeah it it can get warm can get hot It's also very dark smoked banks down very quickly and there's zero visibility so you can just run right into flames and not even know that your head that way well with that Mo with if the smoke is banked down so thick. You're probably not going to have flames the flames. You know we'll probably be lapping over you. You may not see them. firestone needs oxygen and smoke displaces oxygen so you you know you can have a a room that's full of smoke and pretty substantially warm as soon as it gets some air in that smoke smokes are escaping the fire will start to build and then it gets warm. It gets hotter so you know it's if you've ever opened an oven while you're cooking in something and got that that you know Russia heat. You know it can feel like that yeah. It's you know it's yeah it can. It's it's different. It's definitely something that most people have never experienced and the Hollywood side is you always see people in a fire and they can see each other their their masks are lit up so you can see their faces. It's usually pitch-black. You're feeling around you know trying to well. That's why firefighters die because because when they're in a structured because I can't see with fuck they are I mean I know I understand that you can like. There's other things that can happen but that's what holds you up is that you can't see it's easy to get dose oriented which is why we practice searching structures and that's one of the big things that's been happening lately is working on our search techniques and how we how would rescue somebody who was lost in a building because it's very easy to get disoriented but we have ways to try and get around that and and you know we we pick stationary or fixed objects like like a wall. You know if you stay on wall then if you get lost you just turn around and go back the Opposite Direction WanNa hear an interesting story sure you're talking about staying on the wall which I totally get I read the moot. The movie came out but I read the book Black Hawk Walk Down. Yeah you know those Rangers went out with Delta. Delta was tasked with picking up the prisoners and the Rangers were tasked with security right right and everything went to Shit Eliane Blackhawks crashed and it was a whole forty eight hour dealer whatever it was but I learned in that buck the Delta guys told the Rangers don't follow walls because bullets follow walls people people come around the corner and they shoot shoot the bullet stays with the wall ricochets up and down the wall right so stay away from the wall by a few feet whereas maybe thinking that you guys the walls around the walls your friend that's interesting yeah. It's IT'S A it's a fixed object. You know a few if you keep it to one side then you know where you're at just like I was. I went riding of couple of weeks ago and had the Eliane Creek on when riding a bike riding. I didn't know Oh you in that yeah. I took my training wheels often. I'm waiting a long time ago. Mountain biker road bike both mountain bike and then I've got my road by had had no idea yup. I didn't think I could ride either and then I just I did it man. I took those training wheels off and I was gone good for you. I'm proud of you thank you. I'm really proud of you. Okay continual assurance good the Joe Boyd Open Myself Up to that one the point was I had a fixed object on my right side which was the creek which Leon on creek and I made it down to opie Schnabel Park went into the park got some water because it was hot outside and then started headed back to where I had parked art but the trail that I was on crossed over the river the creek a few times so it when I started the creeks on my right side and then a crossover and it goes to my left and then crossover again and by the time I started headed back it was okay. What part of the trail was I on in? What side is the the creek supposed to be on because not only did the creek change sides? Put the neighborhoods did so it was easy to get disoriented when a thought I came back to where I was was that and there's a three way intersection and it was okay which one of these well fortunately for the smartphone the compass on there and I was able to you know point north never thought I'd get lost on a trail happens. I was about to start in smoke signals out. Somebody had to come rescue you did. I was about to call nine one. Actually that's the last thing firefighters fighters do is call nine one. We took the words right out of my mouth is people who are on you know first responders especially somebody who's on search and rescue would did you ever call. Would you call I'd give the phone to the kid here. y'All do it and then when people show hey they're. The ones that were scared calmed down yeah. It wasn't me hey I was good. Good Yeah Yeah but it's easy to it was easy to guess my point is it was easy to get disoriented even on something like a paved running trail because the my point of reference had shifted a few times yeah so in a in a structure where you can't see that's where walls come in handy is because if you keep the wall on your left side and you have somebody oriented to that who that's their job amongst a few other things is to make sure they are an anchor so that if something happens hey guys all we gotta to do is pull one eighty and go back with now on the other side. It'll take us back to where we started. I totally get that. I've been out in the wilderness before by myself. You you know and I mean the wilderness. I don't mean like you know a couple of miles out in the woods I'm talking about if I don't take care of my shit. I'm going to die out. They're GONNA have to come get me right and I had a compass and had a map and shit just didn't jive up right because I was really tired right. disoriented whatever it was you know you you slow down you take a brand. That's the best thing to do is just calm down and get your your wits about you know so let's talk about that because we wanted to get back to it being part of the search and rescue team. If you're out there and you get lost you you're dehydrated. You're injured. What are the basics? What do you do Kiss your ass goodbye and boy you know one of the things that people are told if you're lost? Stay where you're at Bingo because you're just gonNA make yourself more lost if you try and if you try and find your way way out so that's you know this brings up something that I was thinking about when after you told me about this you mentioned taking a compass and a map out and things weren't jiving okay so as simple as it is to use a compass to put a company map together and actually know how to try and figure out where you're at. It's more complicated than people think it is and especially if you're tired or dehydrated right and and it made me think of a movie I saw not too long ago. It was a Robert redford movie. call all is lost real promising great flick where he's promising entitle you know there's hope it's all his loss but it's a great movie. It is and not to not to spoil it but for those of you who haven't seen it basically Robert Redford is supposed to be an experienced mariner and he sailing his sailboat to the Indian Ocean and run into a problem and solves loves the problem but there's just things keep happening and I'm going to have to watch that again forgotten about it was good. I mean the dialogue was good. You you think the three words uttered were fuck. Fuck Fuck when he finally frustrating first thirty minutes of castaway. Yeah I mean it was yeah it was I thought it was a silent film. Yeah anyway so you've got this guy who's sailing the Indian Ocean by himself and and has you know issues come up and he winds up in his in his life raft so one of the things he did was is he grabbed a box out of the boat and it had a sexton in it which is for those of you who don't know it's that thing that people use to navigate by the stars and and real sailing yeah yeah but the way it was portrayed in the movie was he was reading the manual on how to use it yeah so he was still able to kind kind of pinpoint where he was at but my point bringing that up was if you're GONNA go out and put yourself in a situation where you're going to be in the middle all of nowhere you're GonNa be in the middle of the Indian Ocean. You're GONNA go hiking. You know the Pacific crest trail know how to use your equipment because you know game time is not the time to learn how to how to read a map and I couldn't agree more like when I I learned how to use the compass when I was a kid but when I knew I was going out into the back country by myself yeah I took my compass outside with a map and I went and practiced and I was like you know this could be the thing if I if something happens because people think oh you're usually on a trey okay. Let's say you are on a trail and you get disoriented and you get off that trail or you take a wrong turn because sometimes the flashing that are on trees they are you. You can't see them. You gotTA on Something scares you. Something chases you. Let's say a bear chases you or something and you get off. Course you gotTa know how to figure out where your position is right and like you said you do not want to be figuring out how to use that stuff. In the moment you wanna be able to rely rely on your training and experience right to help save your life. I could not agree we have to practice with it and faith told me about when you were practicing with the compass and she said you almost got lost in the backyard that you found your way back to the back door. The kids were a little scared. You know little bobby was new on it was a trying five minute it was it was very trying five minutes in it. She was already you know thinking about dating sites goner and I wouldn't be surprised surprised you know she's she could do so much better than me. Okay okay so stay where you are. Stay where you are what next don't panic don't panic if you if you did your homework ahead of time and like we talked about earlier. If you let people know where you're going okay that's a big. That's a big step. if you're going someplace like a national forest you know there's generally places is to check in you know it may be national forest but even you know in Santa Fe you know we still had to put some money in the box because it's not free and there was there were all kinds of questions. How many people in your party right? Where are you going? When are you supposed to be back? You Know Yada Yada Yada and then we signed into the books along we we did and then there are some places where they'll take a prince of your boots to to try and match tread patterns. You know if you're lost. You know that's that's something the you know could help so if you've done your homework ahead of time then you've done your due diligence. If you get lost just don't panic assess the situation figure out what's going on and what are you GonNa do to either a weighted out or be you know rescue yourself. What is don't panic mean though let's talk about that because don't panic is a very relative term because I've been around people who can't hold their stuff together in any situation Amo minor traffic situation and they're losing their crap right and then I've been around people who've been in combat back and everything in between people like you who've been in you know a building full of burning fire and smoke? You can't see where you're going. Let's say you're the average right in the middle person who's not trained right and search and rescue your you've never been in combat you you don't have that like for me. I have a delayed reaction to everything. It saved my ass more than I can say. Faith will be like how the hell did WHOA. How did you stay so calm and be like it's nothing I did? I just have a delayed reaction. I don't freak out in high stress situations. I just deal deal with the situation and then later twenty four hours later. I'll be like Oh fuck again died. It sinks in the adrenaline wears off reality sinks in. I've done that so many any times where I've been like handled the situation but I was like Oh man you got balls of steel blood runs through your veins and then the next day I'm like Oh my God. That was bad yeah so it's just delayed reaction. That's all it is but let's say your average person who's GonNa Start freaking out right. What is don't panic mean well? Let me take it a step back a step back further your average person. Don't put yourself in that situation if you aren't experienced and something that you're doing don't don't take it to the extreme so let's you Santa Fe for example. If we didn't know what we were doing we shouldn't have gone to a national forest and planned on hiking for three three days and doing forty miles. Something smarter would have been going to a place like pattern alice where if you get lost there it's fine. Just keep walk until you find a fence the bunny rabbits might each you yeah got fangs and you need the holy hand grenade but no I mean to me that was one one crazy summer the cute and fuzzy bunnies yeah. I was thinking monty python but hey raboteau rabbits but no oh don't put yourself in a situation. That's above your capabilities so if you're experienced backpacking you know you gradually you work your way up. You don't start doing the Pacific Crest trail of the appellation of the continental divide as your first hike unless you're Cheryl strayed. No you ever seen the movie wild with yeah it had that was her very first hike and they made a movie out of it so crazy but no you don't put it yourself beyond your means so let's say you know what you're doing. You're experienced backpacker. You're a hiker and you just get lost cost. You get disoriented. Not Panicking to me is telling yourself in your mind okay. I'm in a bad situation but somebody knows that I'm out here and they know to expect me in a few days. I've got food. I've got water of got you know filtration system. I've got a tent hint. Hopefully I have some sort of skills. If I run out of food I can survive for a few days. I can ration my food. I can do whatever I I will be fine. I just have to wait here until someone comes and looks for me to made that's what not panicking is when we've done training. Where we're we get disoriented? It's okay don't panic. I know where I'm at. I know what I need to do. Just slow down. Take a breath and can work the problem. Don't let the don't let the incident work. You work the incident. I just told who has my wife just told her that the other day I said don't work the problem. I don't let work the problem. Don't let the problem work yeah. I think that's a great answer. What you just said is a great answer to the question of how how do we not panic? What is not panicking? Look like and you know of course it's relative. It's subjective right but I think you hit it on the head. When you said take a breath and realize what you have right because I think panic sets in is when you you aren't thinking about the reality of the situation Asian right you've seen the movie thirty three thirty the the miners miners? I haven't seen it yet. I know about it not a bad flick yeah well. The kids and I watched it really good flick but that is a situation where it's like. I mean if you see the movie you understand when you think mine. I don't really I don't I but I don't think people really understand understand what a modern mine looks like until you see a movie like that and it gives you a visual talking about. I don't know how how many hundreds or thousands of feet underground not hundreds of thousands hundreds Gal's worth thousands two thousand three thousand I mean your way way underground and it's a spiral that goes down yeah and they had a safe. Haven you know the sanctuaries what they called it. I think and you know those guys were down there for sixty something days as crazy yeah and they had to rely on the fact that the Venezuela Colombia Venezuela I think Colombia the Colombian government was going to be able to drill a hole into the spot where they were all trapped right. This mine was over one hundred years old. Yeah it was way down deep in the ground they drilled for weeks and weeks and weeks and they finally hit by chance the right hole because they have what they call i. I can't what they call it but when you drill it's not going to go straight down deviation right. The shaft is GonNa Deviate because there's just only so much control you have over it right. In those thirty three guys were sitting there one day and all of a sudden they hear a noise and the bit comes through and I'm not going to sell mark until the risk of priority and ruined some of it but we all know they survive sort of like titanic but you know some of them panicked and freaked out a little bit but most of them kept their error stuff together and we're able to say hey this is how much food we this is how much liquid we have. We got to figure it out so that's okay so stay. Put stay panic. What's the next thing Oh let me see if you get if you accomplish those two and like I said if you've done all of your due diligence ahead of time then I mean that's that's pretty much it yeah you know to me is what about survival although like I mean when Y'all do search and rescue you're clearly looking for somebody but yeah y'all have to learn? I was soon you'll have to learn what are people doing. The people people that were looking for. What are they doing so our search and rescue is more urban based so think of hurricanes along the Coast in Oh searching structures where people may or may not evacuated? That's the kind of stuff that we do. excuse me so for us. It's going to areas that have been identified as there may be people here so forestry search and rescue totally different ballgame. That's that's really not the kind of you know search rescue the that I've been involved with yeah. It's it's. It's all been urban based so I can't answer you know with any experience on what it's like to search the Wilderness for somebody but but I can say that the people who do that that's what they train and they train in searching forests for people and and they know what to look for so you know for somebody who's out there. It's it's more of again. I keep coming back to it. Don't put yourself in a situation nations beyond your means. Your experience is summit challenge you a little bit here who boy heavy seen deepwater horizon. Yes I have as a you know that that true story obviously a dramatic rise a little bit right. I remember I was working. Corporate counsel for Zachary in industrial will it was two thousand ten mayor Jean Twenty ten millions April and I remember getting to work that morning and pulling up the Internet and being like Oh shit there's a there's a whole Freakin fire going on out here with guys all over it in the Gulf and so are those guys for money and gals four money go out on oil rigs or drilling platform platforms and and take that risk of okay. You're putting a hole in the earth that is sitting on top of God knows how many pounds of pressure that has been there for millions one hundred millions of years and you're tapping it the gas that could come out of there is highly flammable right. You're using using electronics on top of it which create sparks right you're using fuel on top of it that is burning off of engines that have sparks in them. Yes and you're dealing with that pressure so deepwater horizon. Everybody knows that story. If you don't know that story you need to see the movie or go research it bad bad fire it was it was not good bad fire and I think there was. I don't know how many crew were on. It was less than a hundred less than a hundred crew. I mean I can't remember exactly how many was out on the number but then you think about that you know it's like when your search and rescue or or or rescue like the PJ's that went out there whoever it was or you know coastguard coastguard yeah you know what where do they draw the line. You you pull upon an oil rig. That's completely on fire now. Cruise around looked for people in the water. I mean you're not gonNA climb up on that thing in the end. That's where are being trained and experienced in a again. I've never extinguished a you know drilling platform out in the middle of the Gulf but if you see something and that is fully involved fire everywhere everything's burning. There's nobody alive in there yeah so that's that's where you have to do the risk assessment to see my sending my people into something where there is somebody who we can save or my sending them into a place where you know. There's nobody alive and it's just it's an unnecessary risk so that's where that's where training experience come in. That's got to be a tough call to make though I mean you must have to make that call pretty often. You know it's not often. It's it's I mean there. There's a few times I can remember where I've had to tell my boss or my incident commander Vander. Hey you know conditions aren't tenable in here. You know it's you know there. There's a laundry list of things that are going through my head right now. They're telling me there's nobody nobody alive in here. Yeah so we need to back out before somebody gets injured or worse and reevaluate situation and and you know it's The Times that I've made that call. I'd make him again because that's that's what I experienced and I didn't want any of my guys just to get hurt right so you know we will go above and beyond to try and save you know citizens and the public but at the same time I don't WanNa get any of my guys hurt or worse which leads us to the whole point you're here. That's the whole point of UB and here is were you know because I I saw that that that article on on Everest I thought it was because everybody else said No. No is because you're not because you're you're you're so much demand and eh what that and that really is basically what it boils down. We've only got about five minutes left but that's basically what it boils down to is. At what point do we say you put yourself in that situation and I can't risk the lives of my people to save you because year unsatiable. How do you make that calm well? It's not that they're unsatiable. It's that they're not how to live. It turns it goes so we differentiate between rescue and recovery okay so it's whether life is ten is basically is if someone is alive if a rescue do we will do everything in our power to try and save someone in risk your own life yeah if planet doesn't work. We'll go to plan B. C. D. E. in down the aisle so you would send send your people in and say hey you look them in the I say hey you go in there and risk your life and save this person because that's your job and it's on me if you don't make it out. What no we all go in together? I don't send anybody in without going in with them. if if I'm in command then then then to an extent it's what you just said. I need you to go in there in effect a rescue even though I'm going to be out here so one of the one of the things I do is I've been involved with has met most of my career and over the years I've gone from the hands on two you know being being team lead and now I have to send my guys in to do stuff that I don't do anymore and I try and make it very clear to my crew. I'M NOT GONNA GONNA send you into a situation that I wouldn't go myself. How do you feel about that having to relinquish that control and say I'm sending somebody in? They might they might die and I I know that because of my position they're going in and I'm not how does that make you feel well. If I have a thought in the back of my head that I'm sending someone someone in and they may die then. I need to reevaluate the situation. I don't WanNa send my guys into something where there's were. That's what's run into. My head is okay. They're going in there and they could die. I look at it more as I'm sending them into a situation we know the conditions I know the kind of equipment they have and it's going to protect them. I know what you know we know what to look for any kind of changes and we manage those risks so so through monitoring and observation we as a crew will say hey you know what looks something's changing their okay. y'All need to come out. Come back out will reevaluate and then we'll try plan B same thing with you know the fire. If we send crews in to try and effect a rescue and conditions change will then we withdrawal or we change our tactics or change our strategy to try and get around that that changing environment it but if it's too bad to where you know plans a through F aren't GonNa work well. You know that's that's where the the incident commanders have to make the decision decision note. Were you know we're not going to risk lives to go in there. Because the the likelihood that somebody is is still alive and there is slim. I'm to none yeah and that that comes from experience I mean you take a person who have never seen a house on fire before and it could be a room and contents which is just a bedroom burning earning. You know the stuff in that room itself is on fire and the rest of the house is not and it may look like you know the the worst day ever when in fact it's just one room involved and that's that's manageable versus a house where you have fire rolling up from all four sides you have somebody who's swept under water and in swift water next to a bridge and they don't porpoise out the other side you know the the likelihood they may have gotten hung up underneath on some sort of strain or some sort of object. That's that's where you know the training experience come in to be able to say you you know go or no go yeah and it's it's tough. I mean it's it's very hard to do but the first thing we do is we always protect ourselves first and our crew and then you know we protect the public look because if we aren't if we put ourselves in a situation where we can no longer be rescuers but we become victims. We've just added to the problem album and that's one of the things that we try to avoid well. I think that answer really kind of covers. The Gambit of what we were going four and it was very well. Put Wow very nice but it doesn't happen very often. That was that was very well. Put and I think kind kind of caps caps off this discussion of you know. Where do we draw that line but anyways Mike Wagner Michael? We really appreciate you coming on fine. Thank you thank me we've been friends. Since I think the third grade Oh somewhere or something like that yeah and now we're in our time. We'll go now. We're in our early forties so it was a long damn time ago but now you know you're you've been in this career for Damn near twenty two years Yup about to turn twenty and December yeah and you've done a great job with it. I'm really proud of you. Thank you I appreciate you coming on outdoor scope to talk about rescue and and Kinda like where do we draw that line and you hit the nail on the head so you answered the question of the whole podcast with pretty much summed it up. It was pretty awesome by the way I get a copy of this. Damn he just a cap the whole thing off but thanks for coming on man. I really appreciate you taking time and coming in. It's glad to be here really good deal and we'll get this out. Hope Somebody I hope people listening. You know. Take something away from it. I think so because you know I've got some. I'm pretty smart listeners. The people that I know for a fact you know we get a bunch of downloads but the people that I know for a fact listen to this are thinkers and then there's a bunch of people bill that I don't know that listen to it as well onto ranchos Rondos yeah and you know they're they're but they're thinkers. I I really think they are and I think that what you've offered here. Today is good stuff so thank you so much. Mike we appreciate you coming on You're welcome. Thank you for having me all right. We're out well. How was that I think it was pretty bad ass if you will I think it was pretty great pretty great? Thanks for joining us on Episode Twenty Two Bank Bills Day outdoor scoped and we encourage you again to subscribe subscribe subscribe on your favorite podcast APP. Check us out spreaker spotify Google play. I tunes yeah do it do and then don't forget to like us on facebook outdoor scoped and and follow me on instagram outdoor scoped. You won't be disappointed. I need to get some more whisky. You need to get ready to listen to brand writer on episode twenty three next week. Go back and look at our catalog outdoor scope dot com go learn some stuff learn some so she's naturally arch and remember this isn't just about hunting fishing and you know we do conservation too and that includes all kinds of activities related to the outdoors hunting hunting fishing camping kayaking biking canoeing hanging

facebook Mike Wagner Doug Pappas Hornets writer Everest New Mexico Texas instagram US Bobby Falkenberg T. One Skopje California Bob Falkenburg Everest Everest Everest Twenty Chuck Norris apple duty to rescue
Research Review of FASHION UK from PEDro

PT Pintcast - Physical Therapy

13:08 min | 1 year ago

Research Review of FASHION UK from PEDro

"This episode is being recorded in conjunction with Pedro the physiotherapy evidence database find them online at Pedro Dot Org dot. AU It's brought to you commercial free from our sponsors at Arias medical staffing the leaders in travel physical therapy if you look into travel the country as a physical Michael Therapist all settings all locations all across the fifty US dates Arias is the leader in travel pt. Let your physical therapy license since take you to where you WanNa go find them online at Arias medical dot com. That's a U. R. E.. US Medical Dot com whether the euro new graduate or a seasoned professional. Let your profession. Take you where you WANNA go. Whether it's the lakes the mountains the rivers the Oceans Alaska Alaska Hawaii Maine Florida Texas. Yes to all of those the leaders and travel physical therapy Arias. That's a you are. US medical dot com a U. R. E. U. S. MEDICAL DOT com. This episode will now be brought to you commercial. Free thanks to Arias. Pedro stands for physiotherapy evidence database. That's a free database of over forty five thousand randomized trials systematic reviews and in clinical practice guidelines and physiotherapy. Yeah I said it was free now. For each trial reviewer. Guideline Pedro provides the citation details the abstract and linked to the full text. Possible all trials. I'm Pedro are independently. Assessed for quality and these quality ratings are used to quickly guide users trials else that are more likely to be valid and to contain sufficient information to guide clinical practice. Pedro is produced by the Institute for Musculoskeletal Health School of Public Public Health at the University of Sydney and his hosted by Neuroscience Research Australia. And did we mention all this is free. You can find Pedro at Pedro Zero Dot Org Dot. Edu Now to celebrate Pedro's twentieth birthday. They've identified the five most important randomized control trials in physiotherapy published last five years. These trials were nominated by pager users and an independent panel of international trialists judge the nominations nations that were received. And now you get to take advantage of hearing a little more about these five standout pieces of work by the people who helped create the first first up is fashion okay. It's not about close or looking good. Thank goodness or I would be well out of my element but this fashion. UK trials trials title was hip arthroscopy versus best conservative. Care for the treatment of immoral tabular. Impingement Syndrome A multicentre randomized control control trial. Now see if you had scrabble letters you'd find fashion. UK In there somewhere and let's be honest fashion. UK is easy to remember then what it was the title again anyway. Let's beat some of the people behind fashion. UK therapists working here in the UK University. Cold The university. My focus is all white musculoskeletal problems. That's Nadine Foster. I'm the professor of Orthopedic Surgery at the University of Warwick that that means that I'm a practicing orthopedic surgeon but I also do research I tell some of my patients that is the most boring orthopedic surgeon in the world. Only do one thing. I'll just lick after hip problems in young people. Anything from teenagers through to professional athletes. And that is Damian. Griffin was quite a lot of controversy about hip impingement or tabular impingement syndrome. Not everyone believed it was a real thing not everybody believed it really existed but also that was a lot of Control Messiah talk about where the surgery was inappropriate treatment for it and especially hip arthroscopy and there were many people including the patick. Such as he said that author. Skopje surgery in the hip doesn't really have any value. It's it's not really a real procedure. It's never going to be a useful part of our armory and so they thought it was just flash in the pan a bit of a fashion through at that time so we call that mood with the name of the study but it was a serious study. We wanted to determine whether there was any evidence of affective -ness of arthroscopic surgery for some rest templer impingement syndrome. And the reason for wanting to do the fall was really that what we're seeing is a real rise and the number of patients happen this type of surgery and yet we knew very little about the high dot surgery compares in terms of night comes with what we might consider to be good clinical practice personalized therapy out conservative. After you guys identified the the issue what did you do. Essentially we went through quite a long program of research. We I hunted feasability of pilot trial to see whether we actually randomized patients either surgery or new searching conservative care intervention these are often very challenging trials to do it can often make very little sense to patients that we don't know whether surgery is going to be good for them or not and so we. I have to demonstrate to the funder that we could actually get our anna chest services involved in this trial I'm the patients would be willing to the randomized either to search rate or to what we called. Eh tting personalized observing. We ended up including three hundred. I'm forty eight participants. And one hundred seventy one allocated to proceed hip arthroscopy surgery hundred seventy seven received personalized therapy and we follow them up regularly or twelve months and fined rasped with PM function. And other I'd comes we delivered the personalized therapy therapy with a a really large team of physical therapists who forty seven different physiotherapist. Across many centers our National Health Service type of trouser our loan. How long endeavors The roads at has taken quite a few years but as I said trial published last year two thousand eighteen. I thought it was great. Because 'cause you guys were attacking it from two different angles. You're trying to say who would be the right person to go through it so you wanted to make sure that the right person was getting the right treatment. And you're comparing these the two troopers either hip arthroscopy or personalized physiotherapy for that particular patient. That's exactly right. We didn't know whether one or other was better. We it was a completely the open question unfortunately did give us a clear answer. The answer is it. If you've got Tabular Impingement Syndrome. So that's pain in in your hip and restricted movement with a positive impingement test to say that when someone flexes internally rotates your hip that's painful and then go imaging x ray findings on that plane x Ray. Cat Scan or an MRI scan that. Show that the bull in the socket don't really fit together properly. So if you will that person with this famous templer impingement syndrome. Then you can either be treated with physiotherapy or surgery and you can expect expect. The both treatments will help you in the first year but the surgery will help you a bit more than physiotherapy. Now that's that's on average H. That's the everyone taken together in lump together and just generating an average. What we have discovered is that some people seem to do really well surgery and some people do really well with physiotherapy and the really key thing is going to be in the future working out have to predict which one you which group you you are in but the first thing that had to discover was is there any point in exploring this any further on average? Is there a benefit of surgery and we found that was different separates figured on on the paper where you can see very clearly the ihop scores from the time randomize Asian to six pipe come unto twelve month like trump at six months. It was new difference between surgery and physical therapy interventions on average of twelve months the search rate was Kennedy. Yeah you'll be focusing on following the patients that you were tracking forward in the future and doing checkups. Yes we continue to track all of three hundred and forty eight the patients at the moment. We're about two and a half years out for the mice recently treated people we will track them all out to at least ten years and we're looking at. How do they feel? Do they still have pain being able to get back to function. But we're also going to be interested in the risk of them developing arthritis. Because we believe that this problem of from rest Tabula Impingement Syndrome are FA. I is one of the most important causes of osteoarthritis in the hip while we don't know is whether any treatment of that whether that be with Sergio physiotherapy changes that risk so this will be a fantastically important study for understanding understanding the long term prognosis. Can we do something to stop. People getting arthritis wouldn't that be exciting. I've slowly so you guys are looking at at a bunch of different things. Number one is is surgery surgery helpful right and then comparing that to physiotherapy and then really what I thought you're you guys were doing was saying which patient is right for which intervention that that was important but now you get to look down the line and follow those patients and you man. How do you prevent that arthritis in the hip which would be a big account all around the world every year there are millions of people who have hip replacements for osteoarthritis and we've invested a huge amount of resource and energy in developing new types of hip replacement? You just look it only advertising you see on the TV. In the United States and elsewhere look at all the different companies who have making things that different surgeons who are trying to do the operation in different ways that so good but wouldn't it be better to figure out some way of stopping it happening. I guess my biggest AK- career ambition. What I would love to be able to do is to figure out a way to still you? Jimmy getting author artists in your hips. I'm all in. We're all in for that. Everybody thinks that's a good idea. Anything else that you'd want the audience of Physios to know about the importance of this work or anything that they can take away from it and put into practice. One is that in order to do this study we developed personalized therapy and that's being published published in the British. Turn Live sports medicine. Anyone can go onto that journal. Download a free protocol from that article if you just search for personalized hip therapy. You'll find it and I think Jimmy you may be able to make the link available for people as well do so that's something every physiotherapists can download and use in their practice. You're not quite sure how to treat this problem. There is a good credible physiotherapy technique. Now then the other thing that physiotherapists can do is to answer questions when their patients say to them. Should I be treated with physiotherapy or should be treated with surgery. They can point them to the article and again. That's a free download from the Lancet They can point them tatical and say well look it does appear that base treatments are effective on average surgery is a bit better and then I would suggest that an experience physiotherapist pissed would be able to say in my feeling. Is that for you. Probably Yogurt being the group where physiotherapy is better or you're going to be in. The group with surgery is better but that is is going to be based on that physiotherapist experience robbery on research evidence. What the evidence backs up is that based treatments make you better? Surgery makes you a bit better on average. Thanks to team at Pedro for highlighting this work by Dean Damian and the rest of our team. It's fantastic passed to see professionals from different disciplines surgical physiotherapy looking to find the best answer for patients instead of funding the best answer to fit their particular narrative. Right work across professions there. And what Damian also highlighted what this could help us do in the future which is preventing the need for surgery in the future for hip arthritis. You could and find a link to their work fashion. UK In the show notes for this episode as well as several of the things our guests mentioned thanks for listening to this episode on Fashion UK. From Pedro Find Them Online at Pedro Dot Org dot. Edu the PT podcast. Hi cast is a product of PT Pine Cast Llc it is hosted and produced by PT podcast CEO Jim McKay and Cbo Sky Donovan from Marymount University We talk pt drink beer and recorded. This has done another poor from the PT podcast the PD intended for educational purposes. Only no clinical decision making should be based solely on one source while taking to ensure accuracy factual errors can be present more on the show at P._T.. PODCASTS DOT COM.

impingement syndrome Pedro Arias medical dot com US UK Arias Dean Damian professor of Orthopedic Surger UK hip arthritis Arias Jimmy Oceans Alaska Alaska Skopje U. R. E. U. S. MEDICAL Maine Michael Therapist
Re-release: Dysphagia Documentation Dilemma

Down the Hatch - The Swallowing Podcast

56:14 min | 1 year ago

Re-release: Dysphagia Documentation Dilemma

"Hey everybody welcome to down the hatch. The podcast about swallowing in this month's edition. The title is dysphasia documentation. Dilemma doesn't Woo It's a tough guys. I'm going to get into the background about why this topic came up in the podcast but there couple of notes that I wanNA keep you rest of before we get started. The first thing is that when we were recording it happened to be the same day that I was being followed by a photo journalism student at the University of Florida. So you're going to hear some shudder sounds from her camera. In the background also turns out that there are quite a number of helicopters flying over us. Again we're near to a hospital so it comes with the territory sorry about that but part of the GIG now. There are couple of things that I said I was GONNA edit by. Didn't edit just because the point. This podcast is free is to kind of be like a flying. The Wall listening to a swallowing geeks. Chataway so I hope you enjoy those very real moments and in those real moments there will be quite a number of prince references. I hope you enjoy those two and for all you fees lovers out there. Please know that while we mentioned video Ross. Kp consistently much of what we're seeing about. Documentation applies to fees as well all right guys. Poke enjoy it okay. So this is yet another down the hatch. Podcast and the goal of this podcast is to address an important issue and that important issue is whether or not NBS reports or video floor. Skopje reports. Give the kind of information that we think that they should so I just want everybody to introduce themselves and then I will talk about the background. That led to this topic okay. My Name's Michelle Sayer a first year. Phd Student working with Dr Humbert and have a clinical background. I worked in clinical care for about thirteen years before I came back to school and I worked across several different environments spent most of my time to care but I also work in sniffs patients rehabs my name's Nicole Roth. Nims speech pathologist at a Rehab Hospital in Gainesville Florida. I've worked in a variety of settings pediatrics to adults nursing facilities and home health. I'm Alicia Y'all know me by now. You've been listening to the PODCAST. I am a PC student but similar to Michelle have a clinical experience prior to getting my PhD Primarily worked in inpatient care but have dabbled a little in outpatient Shell and I actually worked together for five years and the Colon. I have recently worked together for the past year in Inpatient Rehab. I've done a little paranoid and I'm in. Hamburg and I am an associate professor and my life has primarily been in the research lab for swallowing and I am now going to discuss why this topic came up. So as some of you know Dr Plowman I have a course called critical thinking into stage management and we usually open this course with a section called elucidating inconsistent inconsistencies in dysphasia management. And another. Each of. You guys have seen that at some point and by each of you guys. The three folks in the room not everybody listening and at the end of the section inevitably after I've to some degree decimated much of what people think they were doing relative to their peers saying we actually varied not consistent. There's not much that's a standardizes. We think there should be Typically what happens is somebody raises their hand and says what am I supposed to do about reports that? Come to me that do not tell me anything that I can use. And in fact while that question comes up every time. It's never the goal of the talk. I think it comes up because we're talking about things that aren't standardized and things that affect clinical decision making so. Asha asked me to do something for their business. I forget exactly what it's called but meter no on later before then in the summer they their you know their business thing private practice. I'm talking about I do but I don't know need. This will get edited out but I did talk for. Asha and I talked about elucidating inconsistencies into space in management and they specifically. There's a question that came up just on cue when I opened it up and I said what questions people have and person said. What do we do about MBA's reports that are for lack of a better word crummy and actually went back to listen to that recording was the word crummy use the word was in fact used the reason why so the. Natia came to me later and said months later we would like you to write a piece for the Asha leader. Which will be out me. I on this topic that you have your evaluating clinician. The person who has been sent this patient who they don't know to do it evaluation from the treating clinician. The person who's in a position where they are unable to do their own instrumental evaluation. And they're looking to the evaluate inclination to give them real information that they can use to practice to make treatment decisions based on and there seems to be a rift between the two groups that the treating clinicians often feel like and the question always comes from retreating clinician. It's not evaluating clinicians wine. Why are my reports translating? They're done. They're one and done with this patient right whereas the treating clinician continually replies on other people to do this very important one time sometimes test meaning. This patient might not get the chance to another floor for a long time. And they're writing everything on this and it's like Netra. Thick recommended per patient on thin tried. Mendelssohn words or something like that. And what do I do with this information? So the reason we have you guys all here is because we represent a pretty decent rain trait so there is the research junkie. There's Nicole the clinician junkie. And then there's a Lisa and Michelle who've transitioned from the clinic in multiple domains to research. And why does research matter in this? It might not be obvious to people but research is documentation. It is precise documentation. In such a way that the best research papers are ones where anyone can read it and replicated identically but that is not the goal of documentation in clinic as it so that anyone can look at that and say I know exactly what you did. Every single step of the way people are trained to write documents right they learn on the job and if they learned well it goes well if they didn't learn learn well. It's hard to tell someone you stink after ten years or whatever whatever people really want to say that comes out in these meetings so I want you to just chime in our we feel like chiming in on the issue. I just read something really recently. I think it was yesterday. That Body Martin Harris. She's northwestern gave this really prestigious talking in that she talked about for those of. You don't know Dr. Bonnie Martin. Harris is sort of a pioneer in our field and standardizing not a pioneer. Yeah she is an amazing creator. Nbs be assigned P which is all about standard is all of us entered ization. And I didn't know this and I'm envious IMP certified. But I didn't really have the background of it. And she had mentioned that when she was seeing a patient that the patient had had ten Floros and she had access to all ten of the floor reports. The patient came into our care and based on the floor report. She actually had to go and do floor number eleven to know what to treat with that because she just didn't have the information from the reports that she needed to know what to treat All the reports were completely different from each other. But she wasn't sure had the swallow not change in. This was just different interpretations so I thought that was really. You know really kind of brought together this concept in this idea. Because I think we've all experienced that situation where you get a floor report and you're just like I don't know what to treat and you have to make the decision. Do I send this person out for another Floro to I? Guess what the speech pathologist. Men's joy try to reach out to the speech. Pathologist right trying to get access to the flora south in every every one of those situations has a pro and con. Sometimes it'll be time. Consuming can be confrontational. It can be hazardous to the patient that may be Sir treating something that actually wasn't impaired to be more money causing more funny increasing more radiation and those things should have to do that. It's frustrating I have to say I've been guilty of writing reports that I don't think we're very useful to the next Clinician practicing with that patient. So I think some things acute care that influence that were efficiency standards in getting things done in a quick time. Lick you really have to rush your things? Sometimes and I don't think I was reading your best reports. I think. Educational Background Held me back a little bit. I talked a lot about bullets. Fluid shoes pathophysiology. So it was Really eye opening when tables were turned and I began working in a sniff and I was receiving them for words and when I went back to acute care after that everything changed my reports. Were very very different. It is I think on acute care we. It's easy to focus on. What can they eat? What can they not eat and in the report is reflected by that is this is what the aspirated this they didn't ask Brady and then acute cares audio's diagnosed an audio straight you send them out and you're great. Have them on this beautiful diet but there is no to treat when they get to in their culture? You can speech that the most you work in. Rehab your bread and butter right. We get actually when we start talking about this topic. I thought about when I lived in Georgia and I worked in a couple of different nursing homes and then I also did home health and so I was at the mercy of the clinicians in you would have to go about forty five minutes to different hospitals. That could actually do a swallow steady and I got to wear. I would refer that we go to this specific the syllabi because I knew I would get from the ones and so I always kind of felt like sometimes. It wasn't worth the money for the paper when I would get and so that's interesting and it came into play when my son was having Swallowing problems so I knew I would not take into one town and I drove forty five minutes with him. Because I knew the speech pathologist I was able to go in and that was able to watch small study converse with her and then also the physician that was there and recommendations were made based on that and I just knew that I wouldn't send my son to someone so I wasn't GonNa semi patients either. Yeah and that's It's a bad testimony to kind of the state of some of our therapists and I know for myself. I'm really excited to be here because meeting leashes and then just getting involved in we all need more education. That's what we were talking earlier. I need more continuing education than than I need to realize where we can. But so let me ask you this. If if I had a continuing education course called how to write reports. Would you show up? I would now be night. Is Twenty twenty right. But let's say you were cruising along. You had metal Lucia right Queen of report writing rumors and put them on the wall. The Que- you had met the Queen and you're like what we talking about your clinician of how many years Nicole since ninety eight. Okay there you go to your clinician of since ninety eight. Because I can't do math. It is six thirty on Wednesday night. So don't even try right now trying to not get my PhD on. And so you at that point would be like what the heck this must be wise and I'm gonNA suggest myself wise. Go or this must be for students. This must beat. This could never be for someone who's had this many years of experience right. You think you might go. I think I might go kind of a different bird. I think on some things that maybe others okay so you think that your colleagues I think the Wentz now maybe some of the others in the past no way Hindsight's twenty twenty. So I put myself in a different position kind of you. Don't know what you don't know too. It's so right. I SORTA Hopkins. I wrote terrible reports that came. Oh my gosh that I had seen five years ago. That came back for a research study. Was this crazy story. They brought me this report and they said we saw speech pathologists in Q. Care five years ago we brought the report and I pulled the report and it was my report from places like I have the patient. I didn't remember. He is was really sick at the time. And if it's five years later and it was this moment of like once I got past that God. This is so crazy you what are we to incidents and I read the report. I was like you know it's like it's like when you look back at pictures of that output. You thought was the bomb in high school. And you're like Lord have mercy. You could not have been my friend. Let me wear those shoes. Those were the worst you know and I thought it was so hot but at the time. I know that I was writing reports that later. Self looks at and says it's not sufficient and that's what it is Nazi. Hey see that's no argument here. No one is saying. Oh my gosh. Someone is going to put on facebook a doctor humble report nine hundred thousand nine hundred went in realized. So thank you so bad. United mean it's going to be like some jacked up report. What all we're saying is at. What point do we say hey field? Let's look at our look in the mirror and figure out whether or not we're doing our patients a disservice and let's step aside from okay so maybe I didn't know what I was doing. And maybe a WANNA learn like you're saying a call and how can we improve but I worry about individuals who say I would never WanNa change anything I do because there's nothing wrong with it and even evenly Alicia. You might go you know what actually in a year. I probably would have adjusted. This and your imports are great right. People can look at them right now and say I know just what I would tree but we live and we grow. We learn but we can't be stagnant well. I think there's maybe people listening right now that are like do. I write a good report. Do I write a report on. How do we feel that? Let's talk about. What are some things you want to see in a report as a rehab therapists as a acute care commission as a quote diagnostician? What are the main components? So your question. Alicia is what should so. We've identified the problem right how we wait. Let's identified a problem. We cannot assume the problem is clear. We can take what it should be when we haven't said what it is. Yep So one thing that identified. Is this Sort of like they have aspirations. And you're sort of left high and dry. This person aspirated. That's not why they're here. I just I have because I think their aspirations but different levels experiences quite a bit never really categorize it in this way. The Barebones report that I get one where they literally. Just tell me. Paul Real Barebones is what are they? Metals you nothing a level up from that. Is they tell you what was penetrated or aspirated. And that's it and they don't tell you why no no mechanism but they do say you elise no okay. They should or should not be on this diet. That's all you know right. You don't know though if there was a one time aspiration event and if it was the first swallow you don't know how were they not queued right? Did they have to tell to clear? You don't know the motive delivery before during or after the swallow you don't know that's information right response to this intrusion aspiration events. A lot of times aren't included. Your next level that I that is so sounds like level. One is Bolles Lonely. You will to is. There is some attempt at describing physiology but I think this is one of my biggest hemmings and report. Writing is why people break this section up so much so in the beginning you just have like sort of a list of what is wrong in the swallow. They say patient had reduced tongue base. Retraction patient had delayed swallow initiation patient. Had Reduced you. Es Opening period next call is they aspirated thin. They were good with nectar nectar thick liquid. And there's no connection between the physiology and why what caused the aspirin. Why did it happen? Okay so level. Two is minimal phys mechanism so you know connection between the mechanism and you could even have pages describing the physiology just saying what was wrong but if it doesn't connect to the airway you know if there's invasion invasion earth there's residue or what's happening how that reflects your recommendation than it's pointless because so it sounds to me like what you're saying is you can give me a list of all the Amran bullish flow all the things that went wrong. You can give me a list of all the mechanistic issues but I can't connect that mechanism to the Boso. I'm just guessing it's like to work banks and it's a matching game like matched the bullets. I shouldn't have to do that work. That's why you're paid to do this. And that's why you charge the patient to make the connection for me right and I think this is one of the most common situations so the third level is being able to say for instance patient began with thin liquids. A five hundred mile bike up. Unh- you'd patient aspirated due to Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah right. Whatever they asked for it you know no Lorenzo. Westfield closure aspiration was we waited for five seconds no response. Patient was asked is anything on the wrong way. Patients said No. That's a lot of information on bullets. When and if you've got all that information you'd be like okay. Wow I was there. I felt like you were Harry Potter. Like the tapes on tape as opposed to being there right with the movie. But I don't think you need to go boas by Bolas necessarily and maker report five pages on. It doesn't even have to be five pages. I'll do that. That could be one. Wholesome but summarize what happened in Y in all the situations with all trials of thin liquid patient had loyd initiation that resulted in aspiration during the swallow with just giving an example of you know. Tell me the features. Tell me why and how. The patient responded. Because you see that a lot where you maybe you have a good sense of. Why the patient aspirated. But it's so important especially to those treating therapist to know. Was there a response to that? Because that's helpful in treatment and at the bedside if you know of your patient Hudson station or not. So that's another level I is abberant bullish flow physiology connecting the two patient response right so those are four levels that will tell people a lot. What do you guys think Nicole Michelle? I think it challenges me the more we talk about it the more I think about how the ones I just wrote this week. What did I leave out? Because I saw it so clearly in my mind. But what? I didn't articulate in writing And so that's how. I started coaching the students that I had at Hopkins. I wanted them to think about it in a way like they were the receiving clinician. So right it so that it clearly creates that picture in your mind of exactly what happened in the information that you would want to have as the treating clinician so like you were saying the pathophysiology or how do we structure our treatment. And that's changing the thought process like that. I think really helps them the students that I had. I always tell people to think about it. You know that game where you hold a piece of paper on your forehead and it has a word in somebody else. Describe it to you describe. You should be able to describe a Floro to somebody in ward so that as you're saying they can just picture the meetings and that's actually I give well. That's why in this year's dysphasia class. I changed it to where we needed. How problem based learning and we would show them Floros and they had to have a seat helicopters so they have to have a sentence about both slow that have their sentence about physiology and the sentence connecting the two N patient response and if they didn't have all those they didn't have all the points and we would then I would show them reports that didn't and they'd go. We'll I don't understand this and sometimes I would show them a report in the Florida. Say match the report to the floor. Oh or I'd give the classes versions to each other and say does that this group as floral match the report and if the group right next to you and you saw the same. Three swallows has a completely different reports. There's a serious issue with the way that we're reporting information. Well another piece of this is as therapist reading these reports. You also want to read that you are that the clinician. That did the Floro did everything they could. In the Floro rate so if there wasn't aspiration event so with more steps. We're taking more stuff okay. First is identify what the patient did on their own without your intervention right. So now you're saying so. Let's say we'll take that same example patience graded on five milk? Cup Sips of Thin Nolan closure appreciated when into the airway during the swallow patient did not respond. After a few seconds of waiting to see the response when asked they did identify in the airway. Next bowl attempted to pro. Whether or not that. This is the step you're now. Okay what did you do to challenge that physiology to try to eliminate the aspiration so whether it was a compensatory strategy whether it was Whatever I mean. There's a whole host of things that you can do to try to alleviate that or to make the physiology better rate and you want to know what those steps were in the floor. Oh right and that's not described to me. I'm always left wondering well. What if they did this and then it brings me right back to the beginning? I'm like now I kind of want to take this person back because I want to see what if we gave them a larger bullets. Maybe the increase sensory input in the oral cavity with caused an increase in L. VC closure the Hindu that oh gosh now. I'm torn again. Yeah right so I think that maybe people are doing this employment documenting. Maybe they're not doing there was There's an entry on facebook in the mid. Sap Forum recently that said Hey. I got this patient that had once while in one period when of solids and that was it that was the extent of the floor. And what are you supposed to do with that okay? Eight Michelle tell me that. My pet peeve didn't happen the people jump in and start giving recommendations you know sometimes they do. A few obviously should lighten reports an idea compensatory strategy or something. I always start this sentence with. Why did it to improve ex? I did this is order to what you're talking about now are physiological rationales. That isn't deep cut. Do you guys remember. I don't know if you ever do those. Itunes sort of songs like a pop songs. The nineties you can get your basics and then when you're in the deep cuts with some stuff that no one might bring your natural. Deep cuts are like okay. Yeah when doves cry? But have you heard about Josie? Okay so we're at that level where you're saying. Oh my gosh you're gonNA identify stuff and you're going to tell me that you're probing the mechanism and give me a physiologic rationale now. I am reading Harry Potter. I can see the leading both on his forehead help. Beautifully was described. You didn't even need the movie theater so that is that. What does that require? That's a level of understanding of swallowing that you would even have the knowledge to even say in order to increase. Interational rundown real closure unintelligent. Because we know that those studies have been done but most people wouldn't even think that right because you have to really understand how swallowing modified based on what the research literature. And sometimes you learn that because you you trial compensatory strategies and you see what works doesn't work right so especially for people listening that are like. Oh my gosh like now. I feel overwhelmed that I don't know sometimes you have to you. Don't just not try convince jury strategies. I'm not really sure it's GonNa work. Sometimes you especially with your new you throw stuff at the wall issue with six. And I think that that is specifically skill that evolves over your career as long as you're continuing to engage yourself and learning more about swallowing throughout your career you learn that increasing bliss volume increases Lorenzo closure. You learn these things and you in court you just keep layering in new reports and make them better and better in a little richer so that when somebody else we report they learn a hoy no. The increasing volume would increase LV. Report that in mind. Next I'M GONNA try that so I think it's has a ripple effect when you start documenting really well other people start documenting really well and I think that that has are you gonNa drop that hits the Ocean. The placid ocean only shot me. Are you ripped that is the ripple around English language Ripple Ring Number One around the ranger? Yes but I think that's really important because when I worked in a rural sniff a would send the patients that I wanted to go get more often could not because of finances and Insurance so It was the cost at the cost of the facility to send the patient the transportation and the cost of the study within the first one hundred days so they often didn't want to send them for studies that they didn't seem not spend the money necessary so I would have a patient for one hundred days without a study unless I could really fight for them and get them to go so it was incredibly important for that clinician. To give me the most formation that could possibly get and so I would often call them before the patient got air and let them know the situation and let them know the kind of information I needed and I think it was incredibly important to make sure that You have a relationship. The person that's doing the studies for you. I think such he. When I did home health I would try to go with my patients to the speech therapist. I really liked to gave me good reports as well. But it was because we had the reporter and she allowed me to be in the flora suite with her and we were able to talk about things. Try Different things based on. I was the treating clinician ninety. You hell the patient had been doing so well Gordon other facilities where we had Either mobile fees come in or mobile MBA's vans and sometimes it extended my day for me to take the time to go out and be with my patient while someone else was evaluating them. But I thought it was important for me to see how that evaluation was being done to create that relationship with the other clinicians so that I knew in the future whether or not I could really trust my patients with them and then I would stay later that day to continue with the rest of my case load but I thought it was really important to take that extra time to have that relationship in that information so it sounds like we're talking about a transition between what can the evaluating clinician do. Alicia really elaborated on things. That should be report but you guys are nicely segue to. What can the treating clinician do? It's not just about. Hey you're writing crappy reports or crummy reports is what let's not make it worse than it is right With regard to the clinician who is treating person. It's there this is ultimately as I say. This is my patient and their couple things one is sort of going around the obstacle. Nicole. You talking about. Hey guess what. That's a resourceful thing to do. It's efficient you get what you need but some people don't have that option so Michelle in other option to build rapport with this person. And say hey. I have a patient. Who's doing this that and the other and generally they're grateful because they see that they have a patient who they don't know and they know that their floor reports for the patients they've done a clinical exam on might be better than the patients for whom they have zero information. And that's another complaint when the discussion continues in these meetings that I'm talking about alternate evaluating Clinton but like. Hey I'm on the other side and I can't tell you how many times I see a patient wheel to me with under lap and it's just like I don't know who this patient is. I know very little end. I wish I could get more information so I could service the patient better and we all know that our flora's are supposed to be an extension of the clinical examination. It's supposed to set us up for the best possible. Thoreau Floro but can you imagine if you always came in blindfolded until the floral right. So they don't always have the ability to reach out to somebody because the likelihood they're they're gonna find you is hard then you're gonna find them because you see their name and you know. Been suit that your patient went to but they may not know who. The clinician is sending so patient to them so Michelle. I think that's a great suggestion. Speaking of one of my favorite Prince owns controversy. I was wondering what your thoughts are on when there is discord between the treating clinician and evaluating Clinton because one feels probably the evaluating clinician. The other feels that they are less competent than they should be. So what I mean is some people have said. I want to deal with telling that clinician that their reports aren't good enough because they have told me that they have a template they follow this template. Every patient goes through the same car. Wash I don't care if you're mack truck or a porsche. You're going to missing car wash and we don't care how are they won't say that but ultimately that is what happened some things get more clean than others and you know. They don't feel like it's their job to end up having this this Unpleasant experience so interested deal with it. Do you guys have any thoughts on the best way for people in those situations to open up communication and trust so that the patients get what they need and people's feelings are not the center of the issue. Silence John You're like you're describing my life right now. Well the way he said it up it kind of sounds like the evaluating commission. Maybe isn't open to feedback. Is that while? It's hard to know whether or not they are open to anything. Because we don't know what people's perceptions are we just show. The treating? Clinician is avoiding that interaction. So that is I can only say what the other responses and maybe Nicole. That's what you did. You're like why should I spend my time telling this person they don't write good reports underscore in one town over. But you also have the opportunity to do that with your son right. But what if that is the hospital that your patients go and this is the S&P that doesn't work? Those patients need to be service and we have to professionals. Where if they could figure out how to communicate The patients would get the best care. I think. Let me just blanket statement? I think I speak for everybody in saying this is a really difficult topic in. I'm somebody that I don't mind confrontation. At all. Like I thrive on it sorta but this is really hard and that thought a lot about this. Actually because this isn't like a all I can remember one time where this is the case. This happens a lot Probably more than it doesn't happen and I find that the way to approach is to be a little bit to ask a lot of questions And say instead of will. You should have done this. It's I'm just super curious like what was your thought process behind this or you know. What's your rationale and I? It's not taking a naive approach. But it kind of is a little bit because maybe that person actually has something to offer that you can learn and they think opening up the lines of communication. It does put personnel on the spot. But that's okay professionals. I think that that's something that we need to be able to feel comfortable with being in a medical field. It's something that every medical professional has to deal with and I think that there is a a way to go about it in a way to go about it in one way to go about in. Your suggestion is just to ask questions to open the discussion. Step open the discussion by asking questions and say can I take you one step farther shirt? What happens when you say so? I'm just curious your reports. My questions already damning Michael Three sentences. Okay so you're imports. Give me quite a bit of information about swallowing safety. I know whether or not patients aspirated or not. And that's very helpful for me. 'cause I can't confirm that at the bedside. I'm just curious about whether or not you see any utility in adding some physiology. So I can cause I'm treating the physiology so knowing what's problematic helps me to treat. That isn't the yes time. What are your thoughts on adding those reports? Is that a nasty question. I would rephrase it. How okay same situation? Elias given to me that right like the beginning where it's you know. I get a lot of information. Safe and unsafe. Sometimes what I'll do is I'll call the condition and say hey. I'm seeing this patient at one o'clock and I need to treat this patient on. What has impairment is. I didn't see it in the report. Can you tell me what caused this patient to ASP RATE? And it goes one of two ways. Either they say walnut really short and then it's okay. Well let's figure this out because I don't really know what to treat right now and then sometimes they'll say. Oh yeah you know. He had delayed initiation and causing to aspirin before the swallow. And I'll say oh awesome. That's super helpful now. I know it's a treat with this patient. If you don't mind just as a courtesy for me if you could include that in your report it makes it a lot. Easier for music treating clinician. Well so there's a lot of stuff I've never done in my life while you're right. I don't but it's almost the best confrontational but right. You're absolutely an ice struggle with non-confrontation because to me I when people ask me direct questions like why is your breath? No batum like well. Maybe just need a brush harder. I don't know like I don't even take it personally. I'm like just asked me and unfortunately my value system of truth doesn't translate to think about what's the what's the underlying thing you wanNA convey. I WANNA convey that. I don't know what to treat in this patient. And it's helpful for me when I have that information so no matter how you go about it that clinician in that moment. I've told them well. I don't know what to treat because it's not reported and it's helpful to me when it's included in the report and then hopefully in that situation the clinician is able to say like oh I never thought about it like I said my patients and next level. And what happens when you have that conversation and they expect you to call every time for that information. They never stay still never put a report. You get the information but you do have to follow call. Yeah well I think that maybe after the second or third time that you call but this is like it's insteps right now now. There's a couple of times and now I feel like it's a little more appropriate to be like. Hey it would be really helpful if you could just in case you ask directly like if you include a little bit more on the physiology it would make my life a lot easier in. Treating these patients takes out of my day to have to call in. And of course you're never going to get them directly right. It's all leaving number. Call me back. You Know Ms Connections Fifty Times. I think that it's a it's a step progression and that's part of building your relationship. Exactly you want you want to be positive to start out but I think that if you keep getting pushed back and you get somebody that's a little bit not obin to the needs of the patient. Then you have to be a little bit more confrontational and it's hard but you have to. It's for your patient. It's not anything personal. It's but I do think you have to take the appropriate steps before but that's just my own personal opinion that you know now. I just I think looking back when I was Dealing with the one therapist I prefer not send patients to what I know. Now I would go back. Maybe ask probing questions and then it was easier to go around them break but I think part of it is challenged myself over the years. I know what I didn't know then. And when I still don't know I wanNA be around people that stimulate me to do things better to learn more to add more information. 'cause I've been guilty of whether it be a swallowing record or something else just basic. This is what happened and so I think it's personality of clinician to of absolute. Call me you tell me like oh goodness what a great idea. I never thought about that. He met in a report. That's when I look at your reports. I'm like great idea and so I think we learn from each other if we're always in that learning mode and then the thing is it's not reflection of us an individual and so that's part of my problem as he. I mean is I. Don't take enough personally to understand that other people don't so I just ask questions in assume they would they they must. I don't mean them Mike. It's that paper that they wrote on it. They have the capacity to just didn't know I needed that. That's all but rephrasing your Waleed Probably is you know me going home and scratch my skin off before the next call we just prey on this and some people even my approach might be like. Oh my gosh. It's too much you know but you know what everything is absolutely have to take steps but I was just GonNa ask the other thing that could be useful Before I ask you. Michelle is sometimes. I say to students and elect to say in my class. I knew nothing about dysphasia graduated because they keep looking at me. As you're the expert number know anything I saw and it's been in and out you don't understand. I knew nothing about swallowing when I graduated from Grad School Zero. I know a lot because of self study. You should not have to do that because I paid money for my tuition and I didn't get it. You should not be struggling with report. Writing should have direct information we didn't we're writing reports for the school system. I know all about soap notes. Okay so what I try to do in some situations to go. Look if you look back my report they too okay. But this is what helped me. I saw report by this person that person and so I think if you put yourself in a position where they don't assume that you know so much of you're saying you know so much than it says okay. So she's human so show anything. I think that's absolutely true. I think when you show your insecurities that opens them up and Just helps them drop their guard and be more open as well so I think that kind of goes to what unleash. It was just saying about her. The way she would communicate with that other clinician is an. You said it much more eloquently because I was just GonNa say sometimes you just gotTa play dumb and pretend that you don't know a certain things or phrasings in a way on approach. Yes your personal approach. But it just opened up the communication. Yeah let it go from there. I think that that's one of the most essential pieces I think people want to be right and they hate to be wrong but you have to make them feel more comfortable going to be better with. Don't know how feels a master's degree in you have a license. It feels weird. Ask for about something that seems like it's it's basically report writing it every day and it says what have I been doing for the ten years of how many people may not have gotten the best care because one thing we do know is one report can follow you around for ten years. There are people who the only floor report floor. They've had been five years ago in that crummy if you will report is guiding their diet for five years because they may never have another floro all the more reason why documentation last longer than that conversation and there's no way that you can treat as effectively on a conversation. You had to think of it this way. If there are cases that go to court you can't say why you major treatment decisions will I called so and so and you know. She had told me that on the learn Lawrence wasn't working that's GonNa hold up when they say. According to this report this happened right when the conversation. That doesn't hold up the only see the paper trail right so we are all sort of. If we're talking about Governor Butts right good reports actually cars are but more than someone thinking. Who Cares about the sap who thinks that you don't you're talking about it's more important that the documentation shows you know what we're talking about. I think it when it comes to professional development. There's a billion courses on this device and this new treatment and this new thing if if you're a professional really want to get the most bang for your buck and make your practice better. I think report writing should be an area that you really decide to focus on legal reports. Better 'cause I do that every single day and that has direct impact on your patients when you can be a really good report. Goes back to the question you asked a while ago and saying if there were a course that taught you how to write a good report would you go and I think five years in my career I probably would have said no because I thought I was doing things well but it was later in my career when I realized they were still a whole lot of things that I didn't know that I would go back so ten years into my career. I would definitely say yes but five years. Maybe maybe not an. It's it's just a change in your perspective. And what you know and knowledge changing exactly so Stuck back in nineteen ninety six and then oh my goodness I feel sorry for my patients If I wasn't wanting to learn this being a good writer it's about communicating. The apparently being communicated communications specialist returned. Fancy Crows Four. But just tell me all these asteroids has why why did they ask very. Tell me that it can be bullet points. I don't care boy. I hope we you know we should do is when we post podcasts. Actually Post some reports that we think we wrote well and getting new. No almost anybody that wants to you know post sections of your report in and the Kremlin's to raping people listening now like what is a good report. Look like leash. You are the person with a good replacement parts well. I think that was really telling you your class actually when they had seen some your reports and then you put up a report written by someone else and I think that's what was really telling drove. The point home in the lab was that there are people that don't write reports and those students had no clue what was going on and where to go from there and they'd only seen Reports written by you or examples given by Dr Humbert and once they saw something that was not on the same level. That's what drove the point. Home is that there is a wide variety and they needed to be better to analogies that Alexa. Jump on that based on what you said Michelle I said. Said like five years into your career. You're like I got this. I think five years is the teenage stage in S. S. L. P. Time. Because it's kind of like I've been doing this. I'm no longer a Newbie. I've been here for twenty years and then it's sort of like your third of your life so meeting my mom kind of like you. That guy. What's tragic now. You thought about and then like ten years and you're like so. I'm doing the same thing over and over again and I don't know this works right and then the other thing that you're talking about like I kind of like being in our class in some ways is sort of like people who are raised in with a silver spoon in their mouth and then they're like wait so people don't have dinner Mabel. Don't have dinner. Not Everybody has somebody who studies swallowing all day as their teacher does. It mean that if they're getting it from somebody else's not as good. It's just that we spend so much time trying to understand swallowing and we spend so much time trying to write papers. Were anyone could ridden go. I know exactly what you did. So we'd naturally pull that into the classroom. Say even when they're talking and passing like okay so it went and the things slipped on the ice. I need nouns that I can follow by it. Do you mean bullets and by flip. What do you mean so I keep cutting them off and they don't love it and saying and you should say that sentence again in such a way that I can follow you right. I'm Kinda messed bus. Middle East writing give. Report does not have to take a long time. I think there is a misconception. That why timer report fifty four a day and you know I can just bare bones. And that's it writing. The report is not have to take a long time. It's about choosing salient information. Conveying the message because you can write all day about every piece of the swallow but if you don't tell me why the person aspirated it. Yeah it doesn't matter. I was thinking about that. When you were talking about all the pieces that you could put into a report talking about the different levels If you do nothing else at all identified the primary pathophysiology on that is so important. Not Mean it's like if you go to court and you have to have what they're charged with. You can't do that. We want to figure it out in court with this man. Didn't know what was the charge. You know what is the charge? And then we'll figure out the extent that wasn't real wasn't it but so let me just challenge you on this. How much do you think this? The underlying issue is understanding swallowing. Well enough to give that information. So that's always the Marvin this controversy privy out of the loudest right. This is the final layer. Where right now you should know that leashes handed straight of God. G is about to roll down. Give it to US leash because if you WANNA keep growing as a speech pathologist you get your report writing down right. But here's the existential question. If you're identifying the pathophysiology and using that to describe why there was airway vision a residue and you do this beautiful job. It doesn't matter if you didn't identify the correct path. The first place is inaccurate. If it's an accurate so that's the next layer is getting better understanding swallow physiology not over identifying things that are normal and and you mean not over diagnosing because if you over identity or that vaccines are things that are normal impaired. Because I get all the time. A report that says patient had within Liquids Boas had reached the pure form sinuses prior to swallow initiation therefore patient had delayed swallow buying on two thousand one boom busted normal people initiating a swallow. Wait wait wait wait wait. Wait of that speech. Pathologists probably initiates. Her swallow with the bowl isn't appear former every time all the types of reporting beautiful report. So it's like but you know so it ring us up over turn but better. That's the biggest thing is you need to learn. You need to be continuing to learn and islands yourself. Yeah I'm sure there's an eighty that really goes along with this controversy. Back I don't know. Goes AND DENTED THAN THAN THAN. I was thinking more likely express. I told you we're not. I thought it was a deep cut. If you really know prince than you know controversy. I'm just saying they're putting out there and he died okay but so what to close. We have a number of things that we discussed but before we do that. Can we get a drum roll for the thing that will solve all these problems? The treating clinician gets access to the Floro. Done mind blown. There's a lot of mind-blowing around here. That's the biggest one of the biggest take home things that I end and say solutions get access to the floor road. But it doesn't replace the report you still report. The report is necessary because that's correct absolutely but the treating clinician can still use that Floro to make decisions. It is just like an x ray is documentation. Flora can be documentation. Sure it's a little bit step forward but people use scans in epic pulls up for a reason. They might be looking for something different than the original report. What's meant to look for and so that objective information doesn't change. Your interpretation can change and we recognize as clinicians interpretations change or goal of the objective. Report for instance if you've ever had an MRI for your knee but you come back later. You have serious issues in your calves in the picture. They're not GONNA go. Let's do it if we need a baseline we want to know what happened five years ago. Oh you had. Mri In this region. Let's go back and look at different part so that's great. I mean so. That kind of thing is something another step to move forward to. If you're working with the place where they record Floros where you can have access to it. I bet you will keep them honest. God forbid that report doesn't match the flora and use the treating clinician goals. So you said here that you didn't open up kind of looks like stuff went through right. And of course we do to leashes when you're five conversations later you've finally mentioned it but it would get done. I just. I don't know we'll end on that. Look closing remarks. Do you guys have this talk to each other? Just do that. That's the name of the report of the article after said that they will talk to. Larry GonNa always keep in mind. It's personal that were professionals. We have a license for reason and part of that license includes being able to have difficult. Conversations open lines of communication and ultimately. All of this is not to win a pulse. Surprise in report writing about our patients reducing the amount of floors that they need to have and making sure that we're promoting treatments specificity for therapists out there. That are doing awesome Rehab for patients and just relationships. I mean the more relationships we can have with the different clinicians makes a huge difference. And I'm always learning. That's a biggie. I think for clinicians in. It's okay to ask questions I mean. I'm a clinician. Since Ninety eight nothing going to Dr Numbers Small and class with I can't and I love it. It's an island when you're there because you have a perspective like when you were in our last class said Nicole. Is there any truth to this because I think that they think I'm that Mamba doesn't want them to the kid and I'm like tell them about the time that you dated so now am I right all right so there? You know what able to say Nicole am I? Am I lying about the fact that there might? You might have their places where there's ninety percent productivity am I lying about the fact. Sometimes there's pressure to treat somebody who has no nothing to treat because they can't even they're like well. Why would anyone do that? That doesn't sound right. You're you're young and naive so we appreciate you being there as well I was just going to echo. Pretty much exactly what at least you said and I think we have to be willing to DROP OUR GUARD. Admit women wrong seek education and like you said ultimately remember. It's all about the patient so the decisions that we make influence them in their lives and their quality of life in such a way that we really need to take responsibility for that. And do what's right for them and it would be nice to obviously. We're going to post this on facebook. But I'd love for people to comment on. Maybe time that you learn something from somebody else in changed your practice. Not Because of a conversation that happened that somebody said Hey. Have you tried this or hey? This is really helpful when ex and you immediately change your practice because of it because I think that we can grow as a field professionals Even opened up about these stories and say hey there was one time. When somebody gave the suggestion I do ever since them or there have been times where I realized that there is tragedy at the end of some decision. I made you know what I mean. You're like don't want that sometimes. It's not because. Hey some good suggestions. Symbols like pointed out that sucked and it didn't hurt at the time to here is like. Oh Wow but you will never go back to it so sometimes you learn because of something you did right and someone says keep that up. Sometimes you learn because it's something you did wrong either way you learned and we have to be open in life to both situations people all stories stories you know or or it means that they're they're little hurt anyway.

Nicole Michelle Floro Alicia Nicole facebook Thoreau Floro Florida aspirin Dr Humbert Harry Potter Lorenzo University of Florida Asha Skopje MBA Michelle Sayer Nicole Roth Inpatient Rehab Chataway Dr Plowman
Introducing The Thread: The Insanity Defense

American Scandal

08:45 min | 2 years ago

Introducing The Thread: The Insanity Defense

"If you love American scandal and reexamining some of the most shocking crimes of the past. Then you'll love the thread, a podcast that explores histories surprising connections. It's like a cross between American scandal and six degrees of separation each season of the thread unravels the stories behind some of the most important lives and events in history to discover essentially how one thing leads to another including some of the greatest crimes in history season. Four of the thread, revisit, some of the most high profile criminal cases in history through the lens of the controversial legal defense that binds them together not guilty by way of insanity from James Holmes to Lorena Bobbitt to John Hinckley, jR, some of history's most notorious criminal defendants are linked by this common thread, the insanity defense were they bad or were they mad, and how can we know for sure you're about to hear a preview of the first episode of season four subscribe now to the thread on apple podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also. Find a link in the episode notes. Three fifteen and three fourteen shooting at century theaters. Fourteen three hundred dollar metoo avenue. They're saying somebody's shooting in the auditory him copy all available units respond to the theater. Seventy is still shooting inside theater number nine per an employee all of our same theater nine where Batman was playing. Free years Skopje. Somebody's spraying guests. We got another person out shot in the leg of female. I got people running out of shot. Get us from him death rafts for nine we can't get in are needed more core behind the deer sable size. Just gonna gasmask. Steve I got seven down in down. I've got a child victim. I need rescue at the back door theater nine now commissions thirteen some of these big vehicle via Corrigan a whole bunch of people shot out here. No rescue. Yes. Given cars give out of here. five minutes after midnight on July. Twentieth. Two thousand twelve a twenty four year old white male strolls through the front doors of the century sixteen movie theater in Aurora Colorado. He stops to hold the door open for two fellow theatergoers indoor after the young man calmly walks over to a kiosk and picks up his ticket for the late night showing the new Batman movie dark. Knight rises, he wears dark baggy cargo pants, a button-down shirt open at the front with a t shirt underneath and a slightly crooked baseball cap that covers a mop of hair that has died orange even with the dyed hair. There's nothing really on the surface to distinguish him from any of the other dozens of casually dressed young men there to see the latest blockbuster about their favorite comic book hero. The young man intersts theater nine and takes a seat in the front row of the packed auditorium. As the film starts you. You. Free. And it will be very long time before someone inspires us way. He did. Minutes later as the opening credits. Roll young man pretends to take a phone call. He leaves through the theaters emergency exit careful to prop open the door behind when he returns to the theatre at twelve thirty eight he wears dark, body armor and a gas mask. He carries a tactical shotgun, a high capacity assault rifle and the handgun you walked into the theater from the screen side exit through the tear-gas grenade across the theater, and he began shooting primarily I with the shotgun. My daughter, and I just pulled her up dragging speaking. We just gotta get out. Even just go to the doors. This. Kids out there. It was just so world the gunman walked slowly up and down the theater aisles firing at random people when his shotgun his empty. He drops it and begins firing with the assault rifle. Then suddenly the rifle jams unable to unjam it. He turns and leaves the theater he decided in his words the mission was over. He calmly walked out of the theater he actually walked through some victims blood as he walked toward his car. The resulting carnage is staggering twelve people killed and fifty eight injured seventy victims in all so many the police turned the back seats of their cruisers into makeshift ambulances. Police. Find the killer waiting for them in a white Hyundai sedan parked just behind the theater, they detain him without resistance in identify him as James Eagan Holmes, a graduate student at the nearby university of Colorado is in taken to Aurora police headquarters in placed in a beer interview room to await interrogations owns is still call the taxed an officer puts little paper bags over the killers, hands and tapes him to his Rhys a way of preserving gunpowder residue home sits there in the interrogation room with the bags on his hands. He's just committed one of the deadliest mass shootings in American history. He's changed the lives of thousands. Nds of people forever home sits there with the bags on his hands. And he plays with them as if they are hand puppets. The case of Aurora gunman Jane's homes was somewhat of an unusual one. Unlike the shooters in most other mass shootings in America like from Columbine Newtown in Las Vegas home survived. He surrendered and as a result lawyers psychiatrists in the American public were given a rare chance to grapple with a mass murderer directly to glimpse inside the mind of someone who is both mentally ill and highly intelligence to try to understand how an honor student named Jimmy from a loving family could transform into a crazed killer. James Holmes crime was horrific. And there was no doubt that he had done it. The question rather was why Colorado prosecutors sought the death penalty homes as lawyers fell back on a controversial. But commonly misunderstood criminal defense one with a long standing but checkered history the public got a first look today at a key piece of evidence in James Holmes murder trial a notebook that defense hopeful help prove he was legally insane when he opened fire Colorado movie theater from homes to the Raina. Bob it to John Hinckley, jR, some of history's most notorious criminal defendants are linked by a common thread, the insanity defense were they bad or were they mad? I'm Shawn Brazzaville in this is the thread each season. We unravel the stories behind him the most important lives and events in history to discover essentially how one thing leads to another in this season of the thread. We will explore some of the most high profile criminal cases in history through the lens of the controversial legal defense that unites and binds them all not guilty by way of insanity will journey back in time to witness some of the most extraordinary crimes and criminal trials of the past two centuries in doing so will learn how the insanity defense sits uncomfortably at the intersection of law and human psychology. How it challenges lawyers judges and juries in their pursuit of Justice. And how it speaks to things that all of us hold. Dear moral responsibility free will even our own sanity. Bad. Subscribe now to the thread on apple podcasts or wherever you, Liz.

James Eagan Holmes John Hinckley assault James Holmes Colorado Aurora Colorado Skopje Lorena Bobbitt Batman baseball Corrigan Shawn Brazzaville Hyundai Steve I Aurora Liz Knight university of Colorado Bob Jane
Bardenas Reales en Tudela  De Donosti al Cielo 120

Podcast RadioViajera

26:33 min | 11 months ago

Bardenas Reales en Tudela De Donosti al Cielo 120

"Status Gutenberg did not care Hilo. Van Gogh. This affiliates did not. Have your hit apple dot com. Look. There's this. There's a star, but you see my value part of our does from boogie today media or stay. Okay. The story, Cassie Colorado, Soda Yeah They Love Really we industrial feast. Thanksgiving. From stabilize in. There are no on the Pissarro. Who La Banda Mia. Anima in Dente therapy that normal. Okay. We. SORTA. Togo internist risk US was killed. The momento support whether we see that of course, US years we're proponent Koro lavar absolute amentities. ally. There could police the near. As Moscow, Koi than a lot of that. They lost by they're not realist is Komo's Cedeno Stress La the repent are follows this year told the ARETHA now they'll call us to most Rian die as AKC. Goes, are also facile meant. It s your novelist is Solo Demos. Gwen. Oppose him I'm into this their lobbies Costa Kennedy's West Combined More Bayer's Pueblo Costa. Mass. Montana's Amelia Montana either repent. Savvy in this year tournus iphone out and concrete commercial last Barrena? issue. No Mass Delo Skopje to Los Que IMOs pulley, cargo. Liberal battle. And Pulled as Moscow does LAS copied tillerson school sinus escape south. India? Compania they'll go to Cola company they'll Amelia. Simplest soon as solo thieves. Solo Mojo retiree trust also caceres to, lose work. Of. Task it and turn courts Wabi. But there must be tired or another motorzko Corsa C dot Rodeo important pavlovian Nikon author CTO scares Thatta. Capitulated colors. Yet lilla far more scientific foods as close as poor through the. Is August in an even faster Lico, lovisa. Norris throw. In. Those copied to loss in. Those people or Piss Tanya being total task April this. Not Allow marshals interesting. Comprise, liberally talented. As Leila. theon. The calm and logging Kelly S. Masters Liberal the other in glad total. Or Leibel intersting with Barry US those testing winter photography as he. fiene. Coyness. and. There's the DIADEMA's Comores Hysteric Auriol Paula reality. Or Control NOCCO SAP a marquee knotty up why no gear? No Savvy. Game. Schulman. Are and A. Another media. By the rallies allow to Ryan Thermometer America Gordon. Minnows Monkey. Key think wouldn't upper thin. Calor sake of classic out doing Anyam. La. Costa. Them no end. Up. Yesterday I enticing office. bobbling go about. Is Look at the end. There's not. Enough. Again, Lobau. Maseko new book of. Maintenance. No say. WHO. Media. Es Demos in what intake what else men? Who Scandinavian but the likes threaten us? Think restart the thin kilometers for Togas last. Minute dudas Brahimi Divas in You I. Guess. Those. Were but a lot of folk if you. missed. The announced they are not again you the tournament. frisky. Not. A. Not GonNa. Go Mushroom. Glee Maseko. Your Dog. Combine. Ema allows those what they. Last. Night. But I'm not a massacre does contain bloat up but a Lotta Neumann book. Possibly personalities for. Room Talk Radio or somebody. Sent me some way. Other GONNA be don't see now who a bit. Of Cochran Minorities tessies along with thug style. So we had another window. So let me tonight demand jet Bob Mueller. Is the by yesterday. As he be concluded how? Single. GEICO. Also will color. RANTEL LA TAZA common. We. Done the Passover Radojevic Elijah's widow pushed the this. Memo, scheduled Elijah Taylor up at address. Pastors. Of course is. GonNa stick I'd always even with the Marlins. No, you're as guerrillas maneuver. Through California. Cholera Mattei. ELOPING gala. Nervous Guar Laurel fail. Model. They've senior. Fault. Missy Moss. Anti. Rotan Lopez Leeann last funds they'll Rajon rubbing who'll by the NATO obsolete through. These push to Aurora. Recalls but a lot of. Humidity important are going through our. But I think it I'm we also get your thoughts with Gene-o silicones three shoot body that but I Know say. Lingua. Spell Better Alyssa Quintanilla. Cover yourself released. But Oh, this piece tunnels phillies. Then Song, crystal is. In Dude, I get another little bit of Circus Corduroy. Korean. Kills Antique rotavirus destroy. Poverty. miasma theory in Korean unless past bodies. Will Knock. Die Misconduct. Against Women rattled dot US dose overcast companion. Passer. Either but those little polly Tito. Guy Your. Spirit. Three risk. Palacios in Plaza Bonita. There's loom BELCO NUNC. Myung. One of them. Style are another. So got I got Bush Boras fast. or Go Years Maverick and other not what it'll be better than our own. alcott's your Moscone Shubra toys who blondie Toyota xl timoth lower than a Lotta will. But in. You escape get your personal Gotcha Famatta. They come. Close by that maybe I'm Tanya. They all Montana but I'm Scott is the Nadia's that belief has the lowest, but if they've been deduct body odors. The out I made the billionaire think went through by socket and distinct. started. Rallies Madison we we jose moving. The and then there's The. People there. It's Nice Young Nick. Why didn't they? Study as by circus and me this article but I said about WS faded levelness. Don't ask being distinct us in quantum I'll descend kneeled issued by second. Dilemma. Caparo. Show me. They gotTa Casteel Study Alabama. Ill. And infant thrown in Lanka die. Frontera home level then Nigga Lapaglia results. For for dwell the past. month. Yet, another billionaire owners pastors. Carly saleh-fahd at is the spot. Near Bernales bicycling moment personal Sadda- in Los. Angeles piece does the Gun. Off the beginning about an miss. It does planners thessaly radio skits the south ESPN and he's Gus Malzahn joining. The last night I'm going to love Rondo. Say for they Korea Los Flamenco she thought to. visit that Muslim I suspect. By then avalon. Quito. Keebler, but week wash then in the winter and. Lasts a lot. But he? Mrs They might your September. The they. Call Aloof Mass Steinway Meadow Shuki more. Roger dissolved as related cover for the last eight years and I'll walk in all that emotion. With but it must they must cuevas better than it has ended up. For another. Famous most important I. gave it to Linda rebel ORCAS. They're not story that if he theon monumentally INKATA's. Today, but I used to. Be that I saw fusses battling host. For Maranda Bohol Mistrust Kaplowitz Alibaba. Calmer. Share delillah Indra Lela. And throttle? Asante La, the study. Kassian gala those sake. Though she macanese Lago meeting on this big in your thorough slow. From the Maria owner for Intel. Out. Low Nafta. In Home Nothing. The Blida defeated story alone or squeeze momentum. Played. fiestas their inter-school. Komano Excel theon Mirada, but ice for the cutoff fusco were. Years. gatos. Zima like Yup interest or Federal Da Siegler physically. Not TV Dr Phil Live Poker Romana Mutri's important about their sigler Norway callers, Mosul modest. From the Komo town. fiestas loss Kiyo elephant most short more move. That Sarah this. School to. Uplift Fetal Columbia. ooh. La Plata, those photo schools to gear skin thrall. Plato's school does it out because Andy what taught us this out is the NARDILLEO. This Madison Komo elbow Ledeen Olah the lungs. Thyroid another phone. Going beyond the restart says they've finales over. Loris by yeah. Those polar liberal probably those episode per shoot the. DUMBEST Roseville. Okay. Do. They are, of course, some in the doctors they see wall is. This, the Seattle Garrido Ricardian we stretch ask about as the story arc on us but I think it memento La Hoya. At these. Realized, who Cathedral Demaria Maria Nealon your medicine dot in Montana phenomenon this the middle off into such and Quattro. Party, cory closed through a little romantic, the another thin around this still all. Copy Yeah. They'll Barocco Chula. Lak Appear Sant`Anna. Them, laugh. SEGEL thing. They love the Linda. Went Donna theon. Says later, this this anthem Maria. The. They're like this. Yeah. The sound called. Okay Little Carmen. La This NICOLAAS, they've already squashed Mbengue, toshiko share, Mita? Setup Temple. On of Alzheimer's Palacios Consolidate Komo they cannot. They'll see the. Style say the Lucielle the of this all of Palacios they'll Marquez there's another one. He held the market. What are they? Seattle to Lilla by. The APP must blofeld sit up on our list all these little. Rock and Blah. beavis Celta theon Louis Angels, rookie most the really AC- GIG. They will start famous as minister asses off. theon and this. ALLOWS US To our theology squad. See That they will allow the piece we. Moslo compare. To more Lionia into three day. Quattro, dubbed by Venice Paradise Ball Deora. GotTa. Does Not that must. Follow it's goofy the. Southern. They must start the remedy Emol Deora is. ALYSSA LA MONTAGNA LAS cuevas bothered. That's about it also. For Indian, Gulia show even eat they'll. They'll familiar I spit on mobile the deal was then it'll last spoilers while dare dust into. Dallas Mobile. Embedded. In the. Colorado's in the containers is stuck in thick every one in Las Cuevas. Doses in. Less than better to. US. Three. Mass on the. The normal that will be growing Guarino da does. The. Global Most probably a whole Fiddle Lockwood Montana Daytona Yeah cutout. Better. Young rather than we establish. ooh. Go you're going to. Have Been. Nice. You're not supposed to begin your Outta Minister of up-to-the aliquippa. Photography Lafi thelander. Super Beta Win Mindy. Come up this banner they cal. This Other he thought it allows us in. Last thing causing media yes. As from when Memento parenterals rallies not Katiba. Show Theaters. Metro stop. Assad Ave. Does in the Las Vegas theorists in. Vegas. Dhabi data's been there. Quattro kilometers pulled the Novaya in beat-up. By Suffolk I'm. Barack. But he made a picking yourself does this and. Sorry. Lettuce. Centrally, Informacion midair football four dollars. LA, LA LA picked up. Him Very meter. Of The printout kilometers. Keller think we made the squad boy outer. Rhythm. was engulfed. By surrogate, but if it's a Gators Alexey Total Cumby arche now gusset biathlon gustavus Carl MONTAGNA billionaire alabamian around established Baracuda Janos be this. Congress plaskitt. Hungary photomask. Also scabby. Governor these logos geared up push Liasson, GONNA use. A. Concealed real famous. them to must put. So Emerson, he'll interest US Kuando latter referees Gal about did they kill tunnel? Aloof. Guarino. So a Momentum the but. Tennessean done these. The Most Terriers lupis Ties David. Abacha Denver's. Coach him with his Pathum Indian Noga. We talk loss. has thrown last causes of guerrillas up lost three. Ballots photography as pull. In Minneapolis lamenting. there's a small. Dot Is. Not Benami cars theology talk. About her Style? Kabale they still. Guests. They'll Pellicano Lavar in Rondo PUNA. He the handmaiden. Data's data can do fair I'll. Be in Pasadena Massa. Mosquito study. Yeah and they gonNA about about Casteel. Dentist School. Laura momentum not allocate Apopka mass they think win Daniels, they beat us Gwynne tunnel cuevas and stuff on our POCO cuando authors Seattle poorer located. Soon, there's at an east gus important. Medieval. Soon as Beth. That it's I will. Are and undone chewed us. Baloyi. KOMO's boilers they will not follow Bonilla's believe those. FIRMA. the-in. This. gotomeeting she'll be I mean tomorrow no Strength Avenue Towards Para Har- pick in your course, your mother, they lost Tina's but at the end of the season. But how did we are still in Menia told up would interfere la. Forma, theon. Bully lighters. Yum. Betsy Corey up of the task CALICO CON LA. Pistola theater that. The demand denser PA those requests. Camino there's Puffy. In the Damascus who? Has came. Up. The deep lanos academics get another. So they'd be scattered in. Dorsey corners mass in the last in Dallas. County. POLKA POLKA interphone, his brother's. Thinnest on the. Planet. Prometheus newspapers in Colorado and then be in common with. Those gusty years. But as when we don't be scared wrapped thirty Emily musty EMPO-. Yes. Betty anthea new nappies around with. My thin me no minimums laughing Huda Young Ultra Buddha Yang confirmed mentally sound super parachute period, but I was with another. The Montana. National Ballet. So per meter your seniors outlast coon bonus. On those those those meters. Record. I'll. Tell. Me Tara continual STA hostelry Sada Casteel era who narcotic demi. Moore Komo Nita's for. I'm either it. Who's the Tabula Huda? They'll carry the tiniest. A. Panel Young, Beatha. In east coast I'm Beth, the still center toners hustle necessarily doesn't mean we have lost. Classic, our local school shown but I. Think. There's Lowell. CALICO fantastic Panorama Gavrilo. Some the if you noticed colonials luckily, no Los Angeles follow. His foster planner this for Las Delicias, the British, there's resuscitated guess who stole a lot of the quality NAS gase middle of. But Women told me did raise the LAVAR. Dinner Paulo Santiago Takeda on Bundy though. Portland Olympia. Very mass shooting, our own Las Louisville, Manca only. Dasa severe the. Koumba Montagnier who now nonetheless mass emblematic us their opinions rely very cockles. WHO's does thanatos cutoff they'll do. The. Last. pro-india they are only soda. Lousiana with us they told US era in movie. See blenders equal. There's Damian. On them we are still going to them better yet the Moscow harder style. Around every. Tom In Kurosawa's about the honest threaten. Thomas. There's accuracy of Castilla. Me newtalk subset of and don't picking your in Belsen. Gear that get them in by Minnesota enough via. The. Reliance on the school shown. Irakly allowed to be stop originally. Saad. Not Part of the ODA south here. Dan Oh Pamplona now. On this. One army the radio hit out from America Las Tunas this and rotate for thirty s case phone. Luna visit up the compacting income Battista method meter from out of the lock middle, School Yourself Square Cuevas Las Cuevas better than it has in to me and they say by Soccer Nico. Last they now realist darnest picked up who laddis paid associate. Last Day, laterally. In mathematics quite no mass Juanita's Goethe's saying Contra Dennis ass at an East Gus ems system. Or scholars, they'll media from narrow. In at. Familias allows nor fair now does tally but Gallo no Saturday, Kuwa-. Tampa DNA. There's there's. Also off the cardinals, Lingua. Thank you for this Kutab there's guys in spring. The bureau evokes I. As spotify who put guys a moot.

Los Angeles US Montana Moscow Leila. theon Seattle Lilla cuevas School Yourself Square Cuevas La Banda Mia Linda Colorado Palacios Dallas Van Gogh Hilo Beth Mass Delo Skopje Nikon La Plata
3 Steps to Convert a Bad Copy into a Good Copy | MAP75

Marketing Academy of Persuasion | Digital Marketing & Copywriting Podcast in English

11:11 min | 8 months ago

3 Steps to Convert a Bad Copy into a Good Copy | MAP75

"Hey guys before you tune into this episode. I want to give you a free gift. Which will help you allot to convert your prospects into high bain customers. I'm talking about by free e book which will be super duper valuable for you. The title of the book as powerful words that said so. Grab your free copy now from the link mentioned in the description all right now to the episode for which you are here right after this intro. Hello you awesome fantastic people. You are listening to the podcast. Modeling academy off rationing. I'm your host of the pool. Child la lincoln sales coach and this show. I will be sharing anything and everything about sales closing. I will also talk. About how roy on fossil brand through linda. Alright every episode will be garnished with business motivation and loads and loads so value for you. If you want to know how. I can tell you to elevate your business without spending a single door on ads than visit. My website got really good dot com sea bustle good. Copywriting is to sail so if you accidentally produce a bad copy you are losing money. That's why it's very important to own work before you send it out to the marketplace. Alright so what are some indicators of good copy usually follows a certain framework it's conversational and completely different from academic writing. It's very engaging and its goal is to get the reader to act on it and buy all right back. Copy has no substance and doesn't convert. The problem is nobody lights back. Copy on purpose so if your sales. Mrs doesn't invoke that he's a is you. Don't have the knowledge about the principles of copyright if you had a copywriter. Who's starting old or a business. Ona that i think copy for themselves. You want to learn the basic principles of copywriting you also want to learn how to critique your own work all right you see. Most people can write copy which is okay but they can't revise it themselves. They don't know what to watch out for and might send out a weak sales message. That's why bruin principles and self critic are white all right in this episode. I wanna talk about three step formula through which you can assist on be and make sure you use your writing time efficiently so the step one is what you have before to start. Writing see. most people will start with a blank piece of paper and try to come up that something but if want to exactly the opposite before you even start to write you want to have some basic medieval ready all right. Your head should already be filled with ideas. The thing is it's a common misconception at copywriting is a creative process but in reality it is a mechanical process. Starting at an empty screen and tried to come up with ideas does invoke because you are trying to be creative. Spark of creativity might elevate your copy. The b.'s has to be there. What is the bee's at. We are talking aids. Your research is operatives. Probably the most important part of a copywriting process all right. What did you before you died. Determines the quality of your writing. Great lizard also allows you to write that much faster. Do create amazing outboard you. I need valuable input understand hainan. Copywriting input equals output. If you are a copywriter working for lanes or even when you're right for yourself make sure you write in a boston voice. Right was a huge indicator of good copy muscles. Back copy back copy has no personality. It's neutral and cold. Where has good copy is based on the business owners. Natural speaking goes it uses words. They would use when speaking even. If you re date. It feels like you are in a conversation with them all right so when you do your research also understand and learn the voice of whom you're writing for it would make your stand out to them because it will be a relatable. Now come into the step number two which is used proven structures and formula's see good copy follow proper structure on the other hand bad copy. Might we confusing and without structure alright. A common structure is bs which means problem agitate and solution if you are following the structure. Let's start by describing the problem talking about the emotions. It triggers and finally offering a solution. Formula like this take the guesswork out of copy instead of being creative use. What's already proven to sail when it comes. Good copy versus bad copy proven structures and templates. Mckay who's difference remember god is not written. It is assembled right see. There are hundreds of proven carpeting formulas. the right formula depends on what type of copy. You're writing for example. A sales pitch might follow different structure than in email correct and there are also some common elements at all good copy should poses like a proper headline and opening day eggs and action right now. The step number three is use a swipe fight. This is the best of the best copywriters to as i've already said operating is in the creative process. That's why the professionals owned in. Wendy copy themselves the swipe ideas from others if you come across across a sales message and it absolutely hooks you then you want to add piece of copy do your swipe fight all so when you do that slowly. Build up a database of proven copy. So i think is a bigger differentiator between a good copy and all alright so when you are just starting out it might take a while to build up scifis but this also ties back beyond research. Electing fails helps you to find out what your competitors do all right. What kind of headlines and call to actions they use. How do they present their sales message. Their copy works. You can swipe it and create something similar alright. Swiping cards are writing. Time shorter and makes a seal. Skopje more effective venue. Swipe pieces of copy always keeping mine reach audience and industry. You're writing for. It might be there to audiences responding to different words than what you swiped fromm. That's why it's better to swipe the thinking rather than swiping the words all right. I'll ask yourself why this piece of copy works and how you can create something similar so i hope this episode more a lot of brand new for you today. I wish you all the best for your future. Seines tank you so much for investing your precious time until the end of this episode. It really means the world to me tanks once again. I want to tell you that. I'm mostly active on lingnan and you can also follow me and be a part of my lincoln family. My fall us blues for thousand people right now one last thing if you took any value from content then kindly good to my podcast episodes or my apple podcast or dead. Just right right that it you entirely subscribe to my podcast updates about upcoming episodes as well all right. So that's it for disappear sued. And i'm looking forward to have you on the next one. This is a host whipple signing off from your own show martini academy of his relation. Take very good care of yourself. And i love you took

bruin lincoln roy linda Mrs hainan aids Mckay boston Wendy Skopje fromm apple whipple
Scoop B Radio Overtime f/Brett Brown [76ers Head Coach] (2020)

Scoop B Radio | #SCOOPBRADIO | Brandon Robinson

03:02 min | 1 year ago

Scoop B Radio Overtime f/Brett Brown [76ers Head Coach] (2020)

"You are listening scope, beat radio, and on where you're listening from you and your loved ones a safer cope in nineteen period. Hey, this is the producers Scooby radio DJ meal. timeouts give a big thanks footer listeners to PA. We did record numbers last month so on behalf of Scorpion myself think full years of support in Brandon on his meter. If, you have a few minutes via. Please fill out a shortlist in a survey goto scooby radio DOT COM slash poll. We'll show you opinions about the show, so we know what works it will. We can do better than at school fee radio DOT com slash poll. SC, oop, deliver be are a do, dot com slash. He owes out. Don't worry if you didn't catch any of that. Lake will be into description. Be Radio with Robinson Skopje regret. Brandon? A lot about basketball. I figured I'd ask something different so that. New England accent. And I'm wondering age. You grow up a pats fan. What do you think of Tom? Brady going to the Canard's nears and Cam Newton officially becoming patriot. And so I'm happy if you wanted to talk about log storing or Stuff like that I on the two. Zero to. You Patriots question. You know you grow up in New England. I it is, it is sacrilegious if you don't have in the fall of Patriots share to hat in sacrilegious where assaulted. Shirt or how in the in the winter and it ends up the same thing with the Red Sox, as spring rolls around, and so with Patriots you know you followed them as a kid as many do. In New England you know from my perspective when you look at sort of the the success and the respect that I have a coach Bela Chat, and you know the from afar what Tom Brady did, and I'm proud of my spurs background. There are a lot of parallels with those two organizations. Just. This sustained winning and championships, and saw one and I think that Cam Newton. Thing in the system. Prevails often times the culture prevails often times, and you just caught in the current of history, and you caught in the current of success, and you got just amazing coaching and leadership coach. You know cams. Sick sessile or His his ability to continue to. That Franchise I. Think is I think it's a good partnership the risk. Would you know from the Patriots with him? I think it's a very good Harnish, this show from afar scoops be radio. Thanks coach. Radio seen you bring a coffee. Bring the Dunkin.

Patriots Cam Newton Tom Brady Brandon New England Scorpion PA Robinson Skopje England basketball Red Sox pats Bela Chat spurs
9 Best Ways to create a Strong Headline | MAP65

Marketing Academy of Persuasion | Digital Marketing & Copywriting Podcast in English

09:35 min | 8 months ago

9 Best Ways to create a Strong Headline | MAP65

"Hey guys before you tune into this episode. I want to give you a free gift. Which will help you allot to convert your prospects into high bain customers. I'm talking about by free. E book which will be super duper valuable for you. The title of the uk's powerful words that said so grab your free copy now from the link mentioned in the description all right now to the episode for which you are here right after this intro. Hello you awesome and fantastic people you are listening to the podcast mopping academy off rationing. I'm your host of the pool. Child la lincoln sales coach. And this show. I will be sharing anything and everything about sales closing. I will also talk. About how roy on fossil brand through linda. Alright every episode will be garnished with business motivation and loads and loads so value for you. If you want to know how. I can tell you to elevate your business without spending a single door on ads than visit. My website got really good dot com in any ad. Most of the things depends on the headline. it is why some copywriters unknown to spain fifty percent of their time on just the headline right. If the headline is poor that be raid and the copy that is not read does not sail. Good good eating an attention. Grabbing headline is perhaps the most important part of writing any copy and it's also the most enjoyable for inspiration. you can look at radius magazines. Also most people are converted by looking just at the headline which is present honored skopje. That is why owners hire specialist writers and editors to graph compelling headlines. Let's talk about amazon here. It is not headlines but the titles that make the seal so how you can create winning headlines in nine steps the first step is you have to understand that target before writing especially if we want a good return on investment and it is vital to understand the target audience. Great second step is writing outline of the ad. I then ride the headline third step. Is you have to write several different headlines and read them out loud. it is very important. The fourth step is you have to pick the most important you and you have to include that value in the headline the first step is you have to include the produc or problem in the headline itself. Six step is you can use any of the helen formulas which i have listed in my free e book. You can download the book through the link which is mentioned in the description. Right the seven steps. You use a fairly standard straightforward headline based off a formula. The ids tip is if you can write a headline that is whacky. Offbeat or ultra different. See this headline will feel some of the times but occasionally it will beat the normal headline so you need to know about it. Also the nine status you have protests like crazy and read is the headline when you see some degradation in the spawns. That's perhaps a little simplistic. But i believe at writing. Headlines should be a simple process. Simple is clear complex on the other hand can be confusing and confuse readers ballooned by see the very powerful and persuasive headline have box the first base but he hid. It is a short sentence at the top of the aussie often including the people. You are trying to reach lake. For example attention. Be to be entrepreneurs the second parties the mean had lane. It is like an ad for your ad it must meet. people want to read more. The third parties takes it is like short bullets. Introducing additional value see all elements must work together and lead directly into the first few paragraphs remember that headline grabs the attention of the prospect by making a promise drawing a picture stating a fact or asking a question right lake how glue my linden profile to thirteen thousand followers. I prefer slightly long. Mean had lane because they tend to keep the reader's attention. The headline must be derek. There at the target and start to answer the question. That's in the reader's mind that what's in it for me. You can also give your emails a headline and what's open. Rates and conversion rates skyrocket. Alright vanilla get an email. Without a headline i scratch my head and remember the subject. Line is not a headline. It's like envelope copy. Great suburbs in the copy. I just like mean headlines. Suburbs still story or feel copy phobos can augment the headline but must be relevant and complementary. You have to be positive and you have to turn negative statements into positives. Specific details on numbers can be valuable in a headline. How beat the stock market by twenty five percent last year headlines white because it draws the reader into the boarding finally practice and test. I wish you all the very best all right guys. Thank you so much for investing your precious time till the end of this episode. It really means the world to me tanks once again. I want to tell you that. I'm mostly on linden and you can also follow me and be a part of my family. My followers blue for tactic thousand people right now one lasting if you're took any value from content then kindly to my podcast episodes or my apple podcast or dead just right. I'd really you right that it you and finally subscribed to my podcast to get updates about upcoming episodes as well all right. So that's it for disappeared. And i'm looking forward to have you on the next one this is a host whipple signing off from your own show martini academy of his wishing big. Very good care of yourself. And i love you took interest

Child la lincoln fifty percent skopje roy linda spain uk amazon twenty five percent derek lane linden apple
Audio Vlog 17 - Bakit ka pa din Single?

Audio Vlog

16:31 min | 1 year ago

Audio Vlog 17 - Bakit ka pa din Single?

"Along Yup Hey and it's Jen. Why to be in doing the and he thin magazine us so this a just wanted to let down or let go of everything for you to move. The I'd be adding Dingo first sight easy easy. Better Alamo down. And he knew downhill and lawyer. Maurice a bad Christmas or life. Let's go and the more than You know but I mean that I think for one thousand nine thousand so Mikey land must be stolen. You'll sit under yourself. Be The up with people that we let you down and island Mona. I'm just GONNA go down or Linda. Hamilton let them down but always be kind of them will come Agai. Forgive them and do just me you are yes let them go and find four sale find people in a magazine. Happy Mumbai Gainof guy working law more by making holding on that thing Element of him than others. And I will find out. And you're inhabits by diabetes have been talking about some things down the situation Seagal Mesa Brooklyn's are electing one nine nine material. Does the Union mind booboo look up movements of Macau Progress Mahan next level destroying between beat so young Name Nikki Nikki under in getting a dog named Honeywell's the C. Three Sean by a bad Again materialistic about in Oh not bigger loan under name on boggy NATO up and now all the sale. So we're GONNA move on one thousand Bill Mugging Learn to let them go. Let them down and keep trying keep trying. You might keep on dying if you failed. Keep on trying if you W if not keep on trying just a knee Let doesn't end and boy doesn't mean a couple of new field guide on keep on trying on trying always the positive things about happy things. Happy thoughts joyful things. No we have Great Perspective in Life Homelessness. Into my name you know About being an introvert is snap e. c. n. yet a little things to buy nothing mugging Social Social Life by nothing more on And but anyway we have another topic for today at nine about be cool down blander planner INDIGO ALUMNA Blau for them to be anyway. I'M GONNA billing. Notable crown does seem. Well we're going. Remember about up was System we'll apple and a lot of about policy thrown Nego Nagago. That'll be not in Guyana. Forgo do nothing but guess Skopje. None of the none. Oh my with opposite with or Modine. Consistent plateau ceased in ceased deep sounding so I have to stop the I really thought about in single. Backup seeing it. Ma is asks. I go rhino or statement nine thousand Moncloa spare damning opinions. Aol single who and open known as thoughts on. I bought a gas single cutting employees. Or I'M GONNA money if they were the moisture got by GAM with funk shot me Funk shopping kind of Monday I used to move on about at the Hanna at does he nine. Kasey your Hindi. He knew he die. Or at the Sabine more democracy and EP NAPA by Adapt and then. I'm an IB. Don't worry my hand up morning comparison. You don't worry my hand up. Maureen Newman among their mythologies on Saturday. And obviously anyways on Saturday high would they got passing Sabine. Hey think about tabby beat that. Plus if by a by any means I guess he's a jolly McDonnell next Machado caucusing to see that was good mush advocacy by Neela and the Knicks made up mcguckian It sounds like with more on Angelman Dagnon or union and next is Oh echo gallon gate. Got The if the combined with more ECO gallon capacity yet Atlanta on throw Knicks Give Income Augusta going along so much not being unwilling as Iowa. He's like nothing and can be the guy who I know we've gone on. I miss at the next. I mean wins and the south side with domain gossip. I mean some counter at Summer Nine. Goldman questions back at comparing single so about annually helping Naggus done you guys And Literally Assegai but I mean Saddam at and have a great day. A blessed day by getting despite gas is brought to you by angry that you know because it's free and there's gracious loons that allows you to record Edgar podcasts. Right away from your local through. Thurs blessing and anything despite guests or audio blog from my phone. And of course I'm GonNa you'd still viewed by guests for you so it can be heard in spotify apple podcasts in many more places so you can make money from your bud gus. We'd know many will be serious. You Got Out. That will end up. Etf sale monkey the hot button. So it's everything you need to make a PUTT GUSTS IN ONE PLACE. So download the anchor App now for free or go to ankle that FM to get started so thank you anchor for sponsoring this podcast soon here.

Knicks Maurice Oh Hamilton Nikki Nikki Seagal Mesa Brooklyn Skopje spotify Ma Nego Nagago Guyana Mumbai Linda Honeywell Agai Modine Bill Maureen Newman INDIGO
263: Endometriosis, PCOS & Male Factor [SUCCESS]

Beat Infertility

55:36 min | 7 months ago

263: Endometriosis, PCOS & Male Factor [SUCCESS]

"Welcome to be infertility a podcast where we get real about. Infertility empowered you to take back control and provide you with hope for the future ready. Here's your host fellow infertility warrior. Heather whom in welcome to episode two sixty three today. You'll hear the success story of a woman named liz. She is a thirty five year old financial analyst who enjoys spending time with family and being outdoors. Liz and her husband conceive their first child following their second You is set goal when he was eighteen months old. They were ready for a second child. They return to the fertility clinic for you. I but the first cycle failed and the second cycle was canceled due to early ovulation. They were ready to try. Ivf the first cycle yielded only one early blast and the fresh transfer failed a laparoscopy shortly thereafter removed and atrocious an adhesions. She began a weekly acupuncture and priming with human growth hormone for her second. Ivf cycle when her baseline ultrasound revealed assist. The cycle was postponed eventually. She went on to get three normal. Embryos let's listen how liz's frozen transfer was delayed due to covid. But she's now in her second trimester with their daughter. Hi liz welcome back to the show. Hey has are we had you on in episode one fifty four which was way back in twenty eighteen if people want to check that out exactly two years ago but assuming that someone who's listening right now hasn't met you before. Why don't you tell us a bit about yourself. How old are you. what do you do for a living. And what do you do for fun. I am thirty five years old. And i am a financial analyst. I really enjoy spending time with my three year old son and my husband. I we have two dogs so we spent a lot of time outdoors and we enjoy watching movies kind of just taking it. Easy think about life before infertility back. Then how would you describe yourself as a person. So i was definitely still kind of am extremely type. A i like to have a plan for pretty much everything that i did. I feel like i tended to let my emotions control me a lot. More than i probably should have and i feel like i was more of a people pleaser in the sense that i go to the doctor. And they'd say do this do this this and i would say okay and i wouldn't ask any questions. So infertility is really helped me in all of those aspects and kind of turned myself around and improve myself. Tell me about the first time you met. Your husband actually met my husband at work. We worked at a financial company. And i joined his team. We were friends for about six months. And he finally. I guess asked me out one day and even though it wasn't really allowed at work ways greatly dated for about six months before he left the team and we have been together ever since that was about nine years ago. So we've been married since two thousand fourteen now so six years today. How would you describe you and your husband as a couple. I would say that. We are very strong unit We are pretty opposite. I am a little bit more high strung. He is a little bit more laid back but he is also extremely detail oriented. And i'm more of the whole picture type person. So i think that overall we truly does balance each other but going through everything that we've been through trying to conceive our children you know. I think that's really really brought us together over the past five years or so and we to this day are very strong can. I'm very happy to see that. Was there a specific moment in your life new. I knew you wanted to be a mom. I think i've always wanted to be a mom. But especially when my friends started having babies. I think that really solidified it for me. And i saw the love that they had for their children and also getting to spend time with their kids basically my nieces and nephews but i feel like seeing the love that they had for their kids with something i always desired in. It just lit a fire inside of me more so whenever i saw it within them outed longing to be a mom impact other decisions in your life impacted where we bought a house. We wanted to live a neighborhood that had a lot of families in kids and a good school district. I think it. It impacted my life in the sense that i wanted to make sure that i was on a good path in my career was not a little bit flexible when it was able to be adaptable as far as the coming among let's dive into the journey to build your family. Take us through your infertility timeline. I right so we started trying to conceive our first child in two thousand fifteen. I came off birth control pills after being on them. For almost a decade. i came off. The pill was not having cycles and went back and forth to my obgyn for an entire year. Trying to you know see if we could get my cycles going and also trying to figure out any underlying issues. Throughout that year she had put me on. Pro vera is a type of his fate progesterone. And it kinda supposed to trick your body into thinking that you had appeared that way you can actually maybe ovulate my body never funded to it the way it should have so i actually was not ovulating for an entire year after. Come off the pill. So my i n did some tasks you did bloodwork oltra sound and we determined that i likely had. Ceo s. i had spoken to her about possibly going on komai trying to do some time to enter cycles. But she actually. After a one-year mark specifically referred me to my ari who she actually used to conceal her two children. So we went to ari on dead the initial labs and workshops. Hsen history skopje. In all the blood work ultrasounds everything semen analysis and we were diagnosed with male factor infertility on my husband's side With a a stronger issue with the motilal and then we had a little a As well. I was diagnosed with link. P. c. s. and based on my history my ari determined that i likely had indo. We decided to go ahead and proceed with you. I am so did letters all trigger cycle and we did to. You is the second one actually led to conceiving my son so we got very lucky. We're very blessed when we wanted to start trying actually intended to start trying when he was about a year old way kind of for about six months did the were not not trying thing But then when he was about eighteen months you know he decided because of irregular cycles and never being able to time things the stress of that was actually really kind of affecting me so we made the decision to just go back to our and in november of twenty eighteen. We scheduled are consult. We went back in there and did our work again. Since it had been two years. They had me do the sailing ultrasound. Estrus copy bloodwork another seem analysis so it was basically like we're starting over which was fine. Came back again in. My blood work actually had improved a little bit regarding might be co us. But i still carried that lean s. diagnosis My husband still had male factor infertility. So that's always been an issue with us in then. He still kind of suspected the mild endow they did offer to go ahead and proceed with a lack of skopje. I decided to wait so calm. March of twenty nineteen. We decided to move forward with our i. I y that was unsuccessful. In in may of twenty nineteen. We were scheduled to have our second. Ui and oscillated three days early. Oh the irony of that. Because i don't ovulate on my own really so so. After that cycle was cancelled they actually proposed a lap. Skopje to me again. And i declined it and decided i wanted to move straight into idea so in july twenty. Nineteen we did. Our first retrieval. They ended up retrieving a total of six eggs. I was a pretty poor responded to the meds overall. I was a slow and steady grower when it came to my my ad council rather than a on time so they probably took me an extra day or two stemming to get to the six eggs that i had after retrieval we had a really good fertilization rate and one hundred percent actually fertilized day five we only had at our fresh transfer one early day five blast and that blast ended up not taking during the transfer so needless to say that cycle i think was a huge eye opener for myself in for my husband and we had insurance coverage for that cycle but we had a mac so he had actually maxed out at that point so we lost our insurance from that point on so the failure that cycle was just gut wrenching. Because you have the financial aspect of it and then also you have the emotional aspect of it knowing everything you put your body through. We decided to take about a month or so before it went in for our console with our a as they say w t.f appointment so when we went in we discussed different reasons of why didn't have more eggs and why at the end of day five. I didn't have any full. Grown blasts one issue that he really kind of hammered. home was ed quality. We determined that. I likely had severe quality issues manatt severe but more along the lines of severe quality issues. It wasn't the worst case but it was bad so at that point i had actually been kind of going back and forth on the laproscopy during that console. He actually brought it up. I said yes. Let's do it. I decided that having laproscopy was the next step to uncovering any potential issues. That could be hindering us if we were going to pay out of pocket for second idea for travel. I wanted to make sure that we did everything that we could uncover anything that could possibly keep us from getting all the quality exit we could get so in september me move forward and went ahead with a laproscopy. I woke up from my surgery. And i remember my husband telling me that my doctor had spoken to him and let him know that he excised stage. Two to three endo I had numerous adhesions would in my abdomen. I also had numerous cyst throughout my reproductive so he did excise everything i think. At that point. I was a little bit in shock because as a teenager. I had very very heavy cycles. End almost debilitating cramps. Where i couldn't function i remember as a teenager. I was driving home from work one day and i had to pull over. My mom had to come pick me up. I was in so much pain. And that's why. I went on birth control initially so coming out of surgery and hearing that might endometriosis. Was that bad. I was just like wow i wish i had done the laparoscopy sooner but you know that just wasn't in the cards for me and that's fine but i think it also gave me a good foundation on where to go next and where my head should be so. I felt more confident at that point because i knew that i had gone the biggest thing that i needed to do to uncover any other underlying issues so after my surgery went back for the console about our next idea cycle. My doctor had actually mentioned to me. Human growth hormone on atropine. I you know heard about it from the girls in the group and stuff and i. I was definitely intrigued by it because they don't have many studies. I guess on the human growth hormone. It's kind of when those things where it's like. Well we don't really know if it should be used for this. But i personally had a really good experience with on the trope. My doctor actually rather than only administering on the trope during stems. So while you're stemming he actually primes with it. So i started my on metro p- in mid-december in we intended for me to do my retrievable and mid january so i would have been on the omnitracs for a total of five weeks as a very low dose so my baseline sound the first week of january actually revealed a three centimeter cyst. My doctor based on my blood work in everything said look. You can continue because it's not a hormone producing cyst or you can postponed till february. I initially went back and forth a few times with my husband and after all of a sudden only realize you know we don't. We don't want anything to get in the way of this. We don't want to have any regrets so we decided to wait. I stopped on the trope for about two weeks. And then once i went back in for my follow up ultrasound and we confirmed that assist was gone. I was able to start back up on that. And we actually preceded with our february. Twenty twenty retrieval. So that retrieval. I ended up with eleven mature eggs retrieved. Ironically eleven is my favorite number said the day of my birthday december eleventh. So i find so much hope that number. I am a little bit superstitious. When i got the call the next day they let me know that nine out of those eleven eggs fertilized. I actually had a dream the night before. And i just kept seeing nine nine nine nine in migraines i don't know if it was just the universe or god somebody was telling me that everything's gonna be okay and i took peace in that. Which is you know. That's a little bit like spiritual side. But that's really how i got through that entire cycle to be quite honest with you. My ari actually doesn't do call backs until day six unless everything is done on day. Five days fix. I got the call and they let me know that i had three blast that they had frozen on day five. They had a couple. They were watching overnight but they didn't make it today six so those three but had on day five or frozen and this time around. We had decided to freeze all cycle with. Pg t testing just aside no on the freeze all decision. My ra had actually recommended that for me since prior or since our july. Twenty nineteen retrieval. We decided to refresh cycle. He let me know that if we did freeze all that would allow us to possibly stem for an extra day. And i'm very grateful that he explained that to me because in reality my body needed that extra day. I had some follicles february retrieval. That were a little bit further ahead. But then i had a lot of little ones that needed to catch up. So if i had not been doing freeze all cycle and i had been doing fresh cycle we would have had to triggered a day or two earlier so even though i lost probably two or three of my bigger follicles i gained four or five smaller ones. So i'm very grateful that he pushed me into doing a freeze. All it also allows my body to kind of recuperate. A little bit which i actually really appreciated after doing i cycle so going back to the three embryos that we had they were. Pg t tested and they all came back to my surprise. Normal that to me was an absolute miracle. I when i heard i had three embryos on day five know statistically i should be lucky to have one of those comeback normal and to have all three comeback normal was just an absolute miracle. It was the best news that we could've hoped to have received. I definitely attribute that success to the growth hormone dominant trope. I'm big advocate for that. Because i don't know of my body would have been able to produce a quality that it produced without that little booster so with those embryos we decided to go ahead and do a frozen transfer We scheduled originally for april. And of course everything got shut down because of code it. The biggest factor in all this kobe. The virus in everything for me was do. I want to be pregnant when this pandemic is going on so my nurse emailed me and said we can reschedule your frozen transfer in june because they had just-reopened so i was one of the first in line. She asked me if i was comfortable. And i went back and forth quite a bit with my husband and ultimately we decided to move forward because we figured you know we waited this long and we don't want to wait any longer. We wanted to end twenty twenty hopefully on a happy note but going into that transfer during covid was scary by the grace of god. I'm pregnant now. thank goodness. it's just a scary now. honestly we're very careful but it is. It is a little scary knowing that. There's a possibility of catching a virus. That could make myself more so than our baby girl sick at this point in time but i am just so grateful to be pregnant and to have our second child on the way i feel like all of this in hindsight has really made me honestly like a better mom to make sun and a better partner to my husband and i feel like i am such a stronger person because of it it was hard. And it sucked. But i'm actually now able to say that. I am grateful for the journey that we went on. Because i wouldn't be as strong as i am today without having gone through everything that we went through and i also made huge believer that you know timing really does happen when supposed to so. It's really hard to think that way when you're in the thick of it but coming on out on the other side i think i can see how i am pregnant now because i'm supposed to have this baby girl. That's pretty much sums it up. I want to go back to the very beginning with my questions. Here before years What was the first sign that you might want to consult a medical professional. When i did not get a period for about three months coming off of birth control pills. I've always been the tight. That s- i'm very very aware what's going on so i'm like i didn't get my period after the first month. I didn't get my period. After the second month and the third month. I got on the phone and called my obgyn. I was like. I need an appointment. I need to talk about this. I feel like my. Obgyn is much. As i like her. I feel like she made me feel like. Oh it's pretty common allergist. Give it some time but never happened. So that's fine. You said you went to a doctor who your. Ob used herself. I'm curious what was your initial impression at the clinic. The doctor the staff and has your impression changed. Since so my initial impression was everyone was very friendly. Their separatist est. Who is there. When i went in for my very first console. She was actually still there when i got released with my second pregnancy. And she is the nicest person everybody there always was very welcoming all remembered who you were my doctors. He's very compassionate man and he will be honest with you and very up front with you but when i walked in there with a notebook with like six pages questions. He answered every single question. I had in took all the time that i needed to make sure that i walked out of there feeling comfortable feeling like i had all the information that i needed. Because i've been to some doctors yo for other reasons than i feel like. They just kind of give me answers to lack. Better word to show me up. I guess you know just be like well. If this this this and then they just walkout that he was so compassionate and just took all the time that we needed granted. I had to wait like two hours for him. One time but i get it because the patient before me probably had a million questions too. So it's fine would lead you to have the laparoscopy when you did. I felt a little hopeless to be honest with you. I felt after that first. Retrievable that in myers was just a bust of a cycle. That i had nowhere else to go except that direction and i always knew in the back of my mind that endo was very likely my mom had it but i think i was in denial for a longtime to and the thought of surgery. Really scared me. I had never been put under anesthesia before. So after that. First retrieval i was like oh well it's not too bad so it didn't scare me as much having a full on surgery but hopelessness play a huge role in that in just feeling like i had nowhere else to go and it really was the best decision that i've made along this whole journey. If it helped me get pregnant but overall it's going to improve my quality of life even after i have this baby so hundred percent worth it i reckon anyone who suspects they heaven dough. An my opinion would be if you suspect you have it the only way to truly find out as to how Skopje have excised. I remember when. I was diagnosed in two thousand seven. There wasn't that much information out there about it at the time and i remember waking up for my surgery because i had a assist that ruptured and so it was an emergency surgery and i remember waking up and the doctor telling me oh you have this in called endometriosis. I removed it and he sort of moved on. Luckily there's a lot more information out there now. I was like you. I had debilitating periods from jump and it was. It was horrible so it's obviously improved my lifestyle just of infertility quite a bit by having it removed. Had it removed a couple of times. Now i am amazed with how much research they have done in the past ten years when i i was given the diagnosis of poor quality by my doctor. After that first retrieval. I started googling. And i started googling dimitrios equality and it's also amazing to see all the research studies they've put out with the correlations between endometriosis and equality and how it impacts that part of your fertility but in dimitrius says just impacts you it impacts any women who have it differently by. There's so many different ways. It can impact you in as an adult coming off. A birth control pills. I really didn't have many symptoms. So that's another reason why held offer wiles. Because i'm like well. I don't really have super heavy periods. But i think that being on birth control for so long you know it just kind of muted all the symptoms and kept them from returning with such a rage. Like i had wouldn't when i was a teenager though. Symptoms were crazy. It was it was awful. I'm so glad you brought up the equality issue. I don't know if this is the medically accurate way to describe. This is sorry to any of the doctors. Listening to this. But i often tell people that endo mimics diminish ovarian reserve a little bit because you often have poor equality and very little quantity i know. At least that's been my experience. It sounds like that was your experiences. Well and pretty much from everyone. I talked to said it's really important to know about a possible and oh diagnosis to yes. I totally agree like lot of the reading. That i've done online with studies. They talk about that how it mimics the. Do are because you know you'll end up with less eggs and they will be crappy Probably but i saw such a huge improvement from my first cycle with six eggs. Retrieve versus second which. I had eleven granted. Only nine were mature that time but to come out with no good blasts and come out with three genetically normal west between the two cycles within a six month window. It's amazing so. I totally believe that endometriosis. Really really impacts your fertility in about why. Why did you end up moving onto ivf after only two is technically one and a half so we had actually decided to move onto idea when we did because of insurance. When i did treatments with my son my insurance it was the same plan. They covered infertility services. Like i the f. e. y. All the work ups and everything one hundred percent in it would be a small copay but they did unlimited lifetime maximum so it was amazing and then i got the letter when i was pregnant with my son that starting on january twenty seventeen which is the month the he was born. I got that letter saying that. They were changing it to a twenty thousand dollar lifetime maximum. So we talked about doing a third. Eli but after weighing the possibility of success with and then having the funds to cover idea we decided it would be more practical gas to move just straight anti the f. And i'm so grateful we did. Because we uncovered so many things about my diagnosis and my quality of life is probably going to be so much better because of that lack scotty and we talk about maybe a third child but at this point in time nowhere content with the two that will that we will have come february but we have two additional blast that we have frozen so i think that having a couple embryos to spare case we want to expand our family down the line and the financial aspect of it having that insurance coverage those were two of the bigger factors that played into it and also my age may when we did with my son i was. I was thirty when we did. I want my son. And i just turned thirty five so age played a factor as well. Were you completely blown over when all three of your embryos came back normal. Yes i was actually at work. I had stepped into a conference room because My embryologist was actually On vacation so i had a called. And then i emailed my nurse after. I didn't get a callback a day. Later on day eleven that i hadn't heard anything about my. Pg t results in. I was like well. I bet they're available because it's been at least ten days so my nurse actually emailed me and said can i call you or email you the results and i said call me Step into a conference room. And i was waiting for her to tell me worst case so prepare yourself a plan for what is i. Don't remember the saying hope for the best. Prepare for the worst. I guess that's kind of what i was doing when she told me. All three of may embryos came back genetically normal. I collapsed into a chair in started bawling. I was in total disbelief. Total shock but at the same time. I felt so grateful in just so like like happiness just washed over me. It was a hundred percent. Not what i was expecting so i'm very very lucky and blessed and i'm so thankful i'm so glad to be able to share that part of your story because i have a lot of infertility coaching clients who have. Do are or and no or maybe even a little bit of both and a panic when they get only one two three embryos wondering if there's even a remote possibility that either all of them or fifty percent of them even will come back normal and i tell them i have had clients and you know you're sharing your example as well where this does happen. It is possible. Yes i had nothing on my first cycle nothing to show for that whole whole time and then my second cycle i have very. I thought i was going to come out with maybe one to mason. Hey infertility warrior. It's heather this road of beat. Infertility is brought to you by me. In addition to hosting this podcast. I'm an infertility coach. Who supports warriors. Just like you regular listeners. Know that i struggled during my journey to make good decisions. An advocate for myself as a result of took five years. Seventy five thousand dollars. Three egg retrievals seven embryo. Transfers four miscarriages and two stillbirths before i finally had my daughter in other words. I've been where you are now that i've on the other side. I help people like you navigate the complicated world of treatments and other paths to parenthood. I help people. Like you. Make scientifically based a well informed decisions about your next steps rather than relying on dr google and facebook groups. I help people like you. Prepare for points identify opportunities to ask questions and advocate for yourself. I help people like you become an active member of your facility. Treatment team rather than blindly trusting the decisions that are made for you. I help people like you become apparent faster. I only have a couple of thoughts. And they'd generally philip fast so if this is the help you need reach out today. Tell me your story and learn more. About how can support you during your infertility journey at beat. Infertility dot co slash. Hope now back to the show. Let's talk about the pandemic. a how and why did you decide to proceed during it took me. It took me a few days to really decide whether or not. I wanted to move forward with my transfer. The pandemic sort of came about literally. Right when i got my results. That's when you. The news started to kind of blow up. I remember my clinic shutdown. Mid april i went in for his through skopje and they shut down two days later. So was lucky. I got that in but during the shutdown like whenever my clinic was closed for about a month and a half as eager as i was to transfer i was also kind of grateful that they were closed. Because it didn't give me the option to move forward in. It forced me to kind of redirect my tension somewhere else. So i spend time with my son. We spent a lotta time outdoors. Which is really what we enjoy and we focused a lot more on family. Just bettering ourselves. I guess eating healthy and things. Like that. And i felt like for a little bit. Infertility was kind of the last thing on my mind and it was really nice. Because i didn't have the option to go in but in the back of my mind you know when it got to be around the end of april i think no not the end of april run may think right before nurse emailed me at that point i started thinking like email me told me they are opening what i want to proceed and i just went back and forth back and forth because there are so many unknowns They didn't know anything about how the virus is going to affect pregnant women and people are still kind of saying it'll blow vertebral over won't be around that long but ultimately at the end of the day it was a decision about my husband and i are family. We've been through so much with all this. And i will didn't want to put off something that we waited for so long for. I didn't wanna put it off any longer. So when my nurse called me and said clinic is reopening and we can get you first in line for frozen transfer. I didn't even talk to my husband. I just said yes. His i had time to kind of think about it leading up to bat. Phone call so when i went in for a transfer or i should say whenever i went in to get ready. Prep for a f. e. t. My husband wasn't allowed to come in for any of the appointments. Obviously mini clinics. Are doing that many doctors offices right now. They did allow him to come in for the transfer with very nice but it was a weird feeling like i wanted. I was so happy. But at the same time i was like. What am i doing. Because i didn't know like if i got pregnant and got the virus like what would happen and now i think they have a lot more. Studies come december. You know they seen that. Pregnant women are at higher risk. Yes of getting more sick. But we're very cautious. They have many pregnant women who have had the virus in. They ended up being fine so being pregnant during the pandemic. 'cause actually for me i think spend a little bit of a blessing in disguise. Even though it's a little scary knowing that if i go to the store. I need to be extra cautious. It's allowed me to have an excuse to spend more time with my family. Were working from home right now. And i'm able to be home. I'm able to take a nap if i need to. By being pregnant is hard in your comfortable in. I not really in the mood to see a lot of people. So it's really given me an excuse to kind of be a hermit which has been kind of nice but i actually just had a conversation with my doctor myoboji wyan us today about the pandemic and you know going in to have the baby and my biggest fear. This point is getting the virus. Before i give birth and what happens if i have it. Whenever i'm labor. We had a whole discussion about that. So it's fine. I think. I'm okay now as this episode is coming out. The vaccine has just been approved here in the us. Do you plan on getting it. And do you have any idea when you might be able to access it so that was actually one of the things that i discussed with my doctor yesterday in my appointment at this point. I'm doing february. I don't anticipate the vaccine will be widely available for the general public. And that's something came from my doctor. It probably won't be available by the time. I give birth which is fine. But she said if they did put pregnant women into the high risk group and then they decided to distribute it to hire individuals they are actually recommending like my ob. Their office is recommending. That pregnant women get the vaccine. And i personally would get it. Yes i have a lot of faith in and the scientists in the doctors that work on these trials and have a lot of faith in my. Ob if she recommends it than. I'm going to do that. Because at the end of the day i get the flu vaccine i get the tea dot bak scene and my son is perfectly healthy and i wanna make sure that i do what i can to protect my baby girl which means i have to protect myself when she's still in my belly but is it a little scary to think about getting the vaccine a little bit. Yeah but i have seen a lot of girls discussing it on the beat infertility app and kind of been following. What they're saying about it. And i'm actually a little bit sir. I'm pretty surprised by how many people are like yes. I'll be getting it. Yes i will be getting it which is great. I feel like having the Having the vaccine come out now it really gives you a little bit of hope. I'm really hoping that the labor and delivery nurses have the vaccine before i go into labor. We'll see as we're recording this just today. Actually i put out episode with dr rogers. That's bonus to ninety. It's all about the vaccine and infertility and pregnancy and breastfeeding. So i definitely recommend that people check that out just the the long and short of it is definitely the vaccine but you can hear all the science and everything behind that in bonus to ninety okay. We've talked about your surgery. We've talked about human growth hormone but you also did acupuncture. Why did you decide to do that. And do you think it helped. I always said acupuncture is not for me. It's not my thing. When i was in my consult after that first cycle that failed the nurse practitioner She's the sweetest person on earth she recommended to me. You know maybe trying acupuncture and the worst happened is maybe it helps with my stress levels. I've always been the type of person where it's like if i'm stressed out. I need to go need to go running. I need to go do something. I can exert energy. I never thought of laying down on a table having needles stuck into my body. I never thought that as relaxing. By when i met my acupuncturist who was recommended to me by my clinic. She specializes. infertility is one of the best in jacksonville area. Where i live. When i met her i felt like she was special in it. Made me feel good. It took me a couple of sessions to really be able to calmed down and kind of go in there on a weekly basis in. Allow my body to really relax but it was almost like transformative for me to where i got to experience this whole new way of stress reduction. I know there's so many studies out there about acupuncture. And whether or not it actually helps fertility acupuncturist has a really good success rate. And i can't explain it but there is a science behind it. I don't really understand it. Which is fine. I just go in there and relaxed as much as i can. But i felt like at that point along with my surgery. It was kind of another last ditch. We're gonna throw everything you throw the kitchen sink this. We're gonna try everything that we can get our best results. So who knows if acupuncture really helped but if anything it it definitely helps me be able to control my stress levels quite a bit end Really gave me somebody to talk to a weekly basis who was totally non-judgmental and she listened to everything i had to say and all my concerns so it was therapeutic for body and for my mind as well but like i said i never thought it would be something i would be into. I'm actually still seeing her now. I probably won't see her after pregnancy because it is very expensive. But i will be seeing her through the end of my pregnancy. And it's helped. I mentioned at the top of interview. That i've also interviewed in the past episode. One fifty four. Obviously the way you met your husband hasn't changed and all of that but i'm curious if your lowest point has changed yes i think so because when we were trying to have our first child i felt like it was something with e. that i felt like i was losing but the thought of not having my first child was just like i want that love. I want my baby. I wanna hold my baby and then with my second child it was. I want my son to have sibling. I don't want him to be alone if something happens to me. And my husband or when he gets older we get old and senile. I don't want him to be alone. it's almost like. I felt like a responsibility on for him as well to give him a sibling in. That was really hard on me. After our first cycle failed. I had a lot of moments where i would just ball my eyes out gang. We're going to be a family of three and for some people that's totally fine. I wanted another child so badly in a lot of it was because i wanted him to have a sibling but i felt so guilty so it was like the the frustration with my body. The sadness of not being able to hold another baby but then the mom guilt that i felt which is a real thing mom deal fell about not being able to give him something that i wanted him to have so badly. Ab- ling was awful. I just i felt so guilty. But i think after my surgery i felt a little bit more hopeful knowing that we had gotten all that gunk. I guess you could say. And i felt like my body was a little bit fresh new. Yeah i think right after that first. Ivf cycle. that was really rough times for myself. I want to talk about the second child. Part for just a second here. Society pressures us to have children just sort of period and people who are going through infertility. Really feel that obviously but then the moment you're pregnant not even the moment you had the child. The mummy pregnant with your first people are asking when you're going to have a second child in and i think that that pressure is a lot like you said we put pressure on ourselves but then society puts pressure on us as well. Aurora is still an only child. I'm about to turn thirty seven so a couple of years ago. I became apparently geriatric. I love that term. that's fantastic. Every woman wants to address in her mid thirties. But so yeah we have four embryos leftover. They're genetically normal but we still haven't haven't pulled the trigger and it's definitely weighing on me as well just. I don't know wanted to throw that out there. For conversation to say he does put so much pressure on women to have kids. I mean let me tell you. I'm pregnant with my second child. Which should to me feels like enough right now. The people are already like so. Are you gonna have the third. And i'm like first of all you don't know what i went through to have the first to second of all. Let me see how it goes with the second and then we'll hit that road but frankly it's none of anybody's business. What i decided to do but it drives me crazy when people ask you those questions why it will be four in january so we definitely started getting more and more of that when he is going to have another. When you face going to have another in. I had people at work. You know even reach out to me before they knew i was pregnant. Saying when are you guys can have another baby and kind. Everybody needs to chill k. Everybody needs to take a chill pill. Let let me work on my own time. You don't understand what's going on behind closed doors. We talked about the lowest point. What about a positive moment. From the second leg of your journey positive moment nothing could be the the two moments to the moment so the first moment being when i found out we had three embryos out of that second retrieval and then we found out author of those embryos or genetically normal. I mean just absolute balling messy ugly crying tears of joy. That feeling that i had. I will never forget those moments because when you want something. So bad and it actually comes to fruition i did. I did everything i could. And it's paying off now. you know. Sometimes it doesn't work out that way for everybody but very lucky that it worked out that way for me. I can look back and his moments in just be like. Wow how how did i get so lucky. A how has infertility changed you since the birth of your son. It's really made me a lot more patient. I think parenting is named elmer patient. But i think infertility. It's helped me in so many aspects of my life as far as realizing that. I can't control everything i might put out a plan but it's probably not gonna work out the way that i wanted to expect it to all the time and that's fine. Sometimes it's a little bit harder to galas and other times but my coping skills have really improved another aspect. That's really improves. My ability to advocate for myself and for my son. When it comes to doctors i feel like going through the secondary infertility aspect of it. I was a lot stronger in the sense. That i could go to my doctor and say look i noticed this and this is how i feel about and this is what i wanna do about it. And sometimes he'll say he was a yes sometimes he would say now. I've learned that the worst thing they can do is tell you now so you don't get an answer unless you ask my son. I mentioned this in the previous episode about considering my son he when he turned one that whole year he had a total of three phibro seizures. And i think that going through infertility with him really gave me the strength. There are some of the during that. I needed to be able to advocate for him so we had so. Many doctors appointments to follow up and make sure that it wasn't anything more than just the federal seizures which are the seizures that are triggered by fevers. But i was able to talk to the doctors in be very direct with him and tell them my concerns and not feel like. I was stepping on their toes because not because i was stepping on their toes. Because i felt like. I didn't care if i was stepping on their toes because at the end of the day somebody has to be an advocate for yourself and for your children when it comes to really anything education Medical stuff anything. I think going through. All the infertility really gave me the strength to advocate for my family. So i'm really grateful for that trait that it's brought out any knowing what you know. Now what is one piece of advice. You get your past self knowing what i know. Now i would probably advise myself to trust in the process of things and remember that these things take time and i can't rush it as much as i tried to. Sometimes i can't force things to happen when i want them to happen. I think my secondary infertility journey was a lot easier for me to accept that and it was a lot easier for me to say okay. Well this didn't work. Let's look at the next steps. I was a little bit more naive in my first journey. I also didn't go through as match. May i journey to conceive so just ultimately the takeaway is trust the time line. Just know that you know things will happen as they're meant to happen just to be grateful for what i have going through everything and i. I really think that going through infertility in general has helped me be more grateful for the things that i have and not necessarily wish for things that i didn't have. What words of hope would you offer to listeners. Who are still on the journey. I think so. I remember in my first episode that we did. About conceiving my son. I remember the advice then was don't give up in. It's still that. Don't give up. But now i know that it's hard. It's hard especially now that i've been through a lot more. But after my first retrieval. I really had to reflect and think okay. So do we wanna do second. Then when we decided to do a second retrievable. I realized you know what this might not work. If it doesn't work do we wanna do a third retrieval mean. That's another how much money out the door. You know out of pocket so i really have to reflect on being content with being family of three i had to think. At what point do i stop. So my words of advice more so would be. Don't dwell too much on the negatives and try and focus on all the positives in your life in things that you have to keep the hope alive. Try to have that plan for next steps if it doesn't work out There's so many roads to becoming apparent in. I'm so lucky that i get to carry both of my children. But i think a lot about if the second retrieval didn't work then what were we going to do and we talked a lot about adoption. That really was something we talked about quite a bit. Just keep the conversation open with your partner lose. Thank you so much for coming back on the show. I appreciated yes. Thank you for having me. Thank you for listening to beat infertility. Join our free private support community at beat infertility dot com forward slash out if you find yourself needing additional support visit our paid programs that beat infertility dot co ford slash pope. If you'd like your story to be considered for a future episode please fill out the form at beat infertility dot co ford slash contact until next time.

ari liz bloodwork oltra komai Skopje dimitrius Liz Heather vera Obgyn migraines sailing endo myoboji wyan wiles
239: Tubal Factor Infertility [SUCCESS]

Beat Infertility

46:08 min | 1 year ago

239: Tubal Factor Infertility [SUCCESS]

"Welcome to be infertility a podcast where we get real about infertility empowered you to take back control and provide you with hope for the future ready. Here's your host, fellow infertility, warrior, Heather whom in. Welcome to episode two thirty nine today you'll hear the success. Story of a woman named Sandra. She's thirty four year old senior marketing manager, who enjoys group fitness classes reality TV at essential oils after four years of being off birth control, and still not pregnant Sandra began to question is in her body like rapid weight, gain and fluctuations in menstrual flow. After several discouraging appointments with an Obgyn General Practitioner and reproductive endocrinologist, she was told she might have pc os, but it was never confirmed she switched to a new Obgyn and found reproductive associates of Delaware there. She learned she had tubal disease, and now Joel's on her thyroid. They decided I via was the best choice. After her first retrieval, she had a laparoscopy and History Skopje. Unfortunately her first transfer resulted in a chemical pregnancy. Let's listen to how Sandra second transfer was successful and resulted in the birth of their son. I Andre Welcome to the show. Hey, how their thanks so much for having me. We start by hearing a little bit about you. How old are you? What do you do for a living? And what do you do for fun? Sure so? My name is Sandra Wyckoff. In southern New Jersey in a small town called Swedes borough. Work in digital marketing for a financial services company. What's definitely one of my passions? I love understanding how people browse online, and how that influences them to make purchase decision so I definitely love what I do. I'm married to my husband Daniel. We've been married. It'll be seven years this month on June twenty eighth, and we have our son Jordan who is a result of our IVF journey and what I like to do for fun. I Love Group fitness classes. I Love Soul Cycle, which I'm doing Peleton at home since we can't soul cycle right now. I Love Reality TV. Bravo has my heart. Real housewives of New York number one franchise I'll stand by that I am passionate about clean and using essential oils for emotional support, which was a big part of my IVF journey and Matt transformed into kind of replacing my whole lifestyle with clean products. It's definitely something I pay more attention to having understood how some of the chemicals and things in in everyday items can impact for tillage. Think about life before infertility becton. How would you describe yourself as a person? That is a great question. I would say it was probably a little bit naive to just a lot of things in life being going through infertility definitely made me more empathetic in many ways More carefree and I was definitely more extroverted being going through. Definitely, mean me a little bit of an introvert and wanting to stay in my secure bubble and kind of abandoned bit of my love what my life was before where I was very social and always. Going out wanting to be with friends or Going concerts or things like that, but I just became a little more reserved after after going through infertility. Tell me about the first time you your husband on my husband I actually went in highschool, so we say connected through college and became more serious after college, so we've known each other for a long time today. How would you describe your husband as a couple? Don't know what I'd do without him. He's my rockies. We've gone through so much in our seven years of marriage in. In particular in the last I would say three be almost four years now with going through idea, and then have raised now raising our son, and you know some some other things that have happened in our life between now and then so he's definitely my go-to person, and I feel so lucky to have had him to go through this with. was there a specific moment in your life? When you? I knew you want to be a mom? You know what there wasn't really I think. Honestly it was when I didn't think it was possible. As when I really knew how much I wanted it because kind of took the approach of us kind of being if it happens, it happens and. I stopped taking birth control to kind of just see what would happen. We weren't tracking super close or on a schedule or anything like that, but then when we realized that it was becoming difficult will it was something I realized I knew I wouldn't be happy if we couldn't have a family. That longing to be a mom. Impact other decisions in your life. It definitely made me more cautious about things that I was doing just healthwise. It made me focus more on on wellness and fitness almost to an obsessive point, so that wasn't healthy. It's it's good to have those good habits, but they need to complement your life. Not Be your whole life so I was constantly trying to find new solutions in almost self diagnose because I wasn't really getting anywhere with the Obgyn that I was seen at the time, and then I had explored some other options with just a regular endocrinologist and a p. c. p.. I wasn't really getting anywhere, so it was going through this spiral of doing research online signing up for different programs signing up for different APPS just trying to figure out what was going to help me so kind of spiraled into. Trying to you know scale back on going out or having one two losses, a wine to becoming a full-on obsession, and let's dive into the journey to build your family. Take us through your whole infertility timeline. My husband and I got married in twenty thirteen the following summer, so it would have been August twenty fourteen. And I remember because we were, we were going to a family party and I just said should I started new pack of birth control, or should I just start one and we decided not to so as I said, we weren't really paying close attention, but after about a year of not having taken birth control, nothing was really happening. I started to question a little bit. Bit You know why is that? Does it take a lot of times? And I feel like a lot of people? At least in my infertility community kind of shared the sentiment of will, maybe it just takes time for the birth control to leave your system, and that's why you're not getting pregnant, so I raised the concern to my ob, and they kind of brushed it off. So at that point I was also had started to gain a little bit of we but I thought okay. It's normal. Hormones are changing because I had been on the birth control for so long I mean I had been taking it since I was. Probably fifteen an in looking back at that the reason why I started taking, it was because I was having such severe. Pain during my menstrual cycle and extremely heavy, an extremely heavy flow I always wonder if I would've known then what I know now what I have. Investigated that a little further, and maybe I would have had some answers sooner. I started to do some research as I as I mentioned I'm I'm a big information junkie. I feel like when we know better, we do better so started to really pay attention to the waking seen and tracking. It was about six month period that was forty pounds that I had put on, and I was still working out. Trying everything under the sun whole thirty high protein Kanak rose, all of that and nothing was working so in my research I was reading a Bow, and no chronology, and how there's other tests that you can get done outside of justice, simple blood, draw or basic labs that maybe year PCP here over would give you, so. I sought to get care from a medical endocrinologist. I did do some tests? I got my cortisol. Levels checked I still didn't feel like I was getting the the attention that I needed I would get comments from both the PCP and. The Endo, you're not trying hard enough. You're not tracking your food enough. You're still young. It'll happen when it happens. Like have fun. Just relax. All of those comments that kind of make your blood boil when people tell you that if you've if you've been going through. Some struggles with infertility. It's like the most frustrating thing for to hear when someone tells you. You should just relax solve all your problems. Wouldn't that be nice? I just decided at that point that I needed to find different. Different Care for my ob, because it was about two and a half years at this point that I was wasn't really getting answers, and still not getting pregnant. I found a new OB and they listen to the story I. Just told You I pretty much told them, and they were like. We need to get you some answers. I can't give them to you. You need to go to a reproductive endocrinologist, and here's one I would recommend, and it was a rad fertility in Newark Delaware. Once I started working with them. All of the things that I had been hearing like researching, they were asking me those questions and they were running those tests. That's how we found out that I had tubal disease which I ended up getting my rightfully into removed prior to doing IVF because my Ari, said had we not addressed the tube issue? It would have taken the success rate for IVF down fifty percent. We wanted to make sure we address that before. And I did my leg retrieval before the laproscopy in historic skippy surgery so I. Just in case I didn't want anything to happen to my ovaries, which were okay and wanted to make sure that we got the egg retrieval done, so we had seven embryos from. Our agricultural volt that are frozen embryos We have five remaining the first transfer was. A chemical pregnancy and that was that was super. Emotional time for us. We had just sold our house. We it was right around the holidays. So was a stressful time going through settlement and inspection, and all of that, and then also anticipating that was all during the two week. Wait, and then it was Christmas Eve when we found out, it was a chemical pregnancy. I was in the roller coaster of Beta. Testing where my I draw was love. Oh, and then I went back in the quant doubled, so I was optimistic at that point then. Following that it, it dropped the levels dropped back down, which was indicative of the chemical pregnancy, so that was extremely tough, a tough pill to swallow for sure especially around the holidays, and and it also made a tough because we were open Abou- our journey and In hindsight. I wish we weren't as open because I am such a people pleaser. So you know people checking in and people wanting to get updates I just felt like I had to. Share with them, and in hindsight I would have probably set a little bit more boundaries because. It made it made it a lot harder to share a failure for lack of a better word was a failed pregnancy that really made it tough, and that's what really inspired me to start my online community because I really didn't have anyone in my circle had a couple people that I knew who had gone through infertility, but I found that the people I was sharing. My journey with were doing the best. They could to be encouraging and supportive, but. It just felt like I was alone. No matter how many people reached out, so I started the infertility community on facebook. It's called fearless Thames. Facing fertility and I started that right around the time we were preparing for second frozen embryo transfer, and I felt completely different. Going into that one I felt more normal because I realized how many other women were going through the same thing and they were so encouraging, and they shared their stories, and I felt that I, had A. A, sense of what was to come and I also knew it didn't work the first time, but we had changed some things in my protocol. We increase my progesterone. We started with we I was taking baby aspirin, which is something? I didn't take the first time, so there were some other changes medically that I felt more confident going into the second transfer, and that second transfer resulted in our son. Jordan so I. Shared My journey with the ladies in their fertility group and The while supporting new women that were that were going through their journeys, and kind of it helped me to be helping them, because I felt like I could give them something that I didn't have when I was going through it. So that's something that's really important to me in. It's important to me to speak out on infertility and share the data points at one eight women experience it that you should. It's okay to to not know what to say, but don't isolate your friends and don't ignore them. They just need support in a different way, so I try to always share that type of information to help not only people going through it, but also people who have loved ones that are going through it to try to make them feel like they can understand the process a little better. Even though you were clearly having a fertility problem, you decided to start with your obgyn in general practitioner. Why did you decide to do that? Versus going straight to a fertility clinic because I honestly did not even know how to get there. I was so naive to even. Know what was out there because I didn't have any resources or anyone in my circle. That could guide me to where I needed to go. I was Kinda just doing everything on my own, and maybe that's maybe that's my own fault. Because I was private about it at first, but I also didn't didn't know any better and like I said I live in New Jersey and I ended up getting my Karen Delaware, so the number of providers in New Jersey, or at least at the time when I was. was looking for them. I I just wasn't aware of anything anywhere else. That I could turn once you did start going to a fertility clinic. What was your initial impression of the clinic? The doctor the staff, and did your impression ever change over time, so it was such a breath of fresh air. It was the first time in my I. Women's health care that I really fell that it was a place where people listened that people treated you like a person that they weren't trying to push the next best. For contraception to you that they wanted you to have success, it was a completely different experience than what I have had ever experienced for women's health. It was awesome and I feel so lucky to found them. I, keep in touch with them through running the fertility group. They They also promoted to their patients, even though it's not exclusive for radd patients, majority of the members are from Rod because they share the group out so much. As a resource for for other women and I feel like they just want everyone to feel supported and want them to know that they care about their success of their family, and my feelings have not changed at all through the process. You ended up. Share your story in a book. Can you tell us more about that sure? Yeah, so I am a part of an amazing group of women in the inspired book series. It's published by Kate Butler books and each there are five. They're now six books in the series. Women Who Leumi is the book that I co-authored, and it was the fifth book and all of the. The women in the book series have shared a personal triumph struggle lesson nave learned or just a story that they wanted to share with the world to help make an impact thus inspired. Impact is the name of the series, and that also was really helpful for me. I was inspired to share my story like I said because I felt so alone in the process, and I didn't want other women I wanted other women to know that it's totally normal. You're not alone. There are so many other women that go through this, and we should talk about it and celebrate our successes and be there for us in our struggles. With anything in life. But, especially for women's health, and for infertility I feel like it's just such tough pill to swallow when. You don't know things about yourself. And then you find out sometimes when you least expect it or hopefully before it's too late that your road to get to to motherhood or starting, your family's going to be a little different, so I really wanted to share my story to and talk through what we just talk through my my path of of where I started to get Mike Care, and how I finally ended up at the right place because I wasn't aware of all of the things that I needed to do so I really wanted to shed light on that. And I joined a group of twenty nine other women, so there's thirty officers in the book and each chapter is a unique story. There are a lot of online support communities for infertility. What inspired you to start your own as a posted? Join one of those well again. I had no idea where to even find them so. Wanted to start one that was sort of local. I live in New Jersey and it's about thirty minutes from the office in Delaware I'm also about thirty minutes from Philadelphia. Pennsylvania, so the tri-state area is easy to get around and I knew that I wanted to have eventually have im- person meet ups with the community, so we were able to facilitate that through starting this community and I also thought it would be helpful to have people from a similar practice because you can share you know. I had no idea of the any of the doctors that that were in the practice, so it's always nice to get feedback from people hear about the different personalities, so you can decide who you want to get your care with which are a lot of the conversations that we've had in the group but then some of the members that are outside of the rad practice also shared the same practices so. So it ended up working now. and I feel that it's a little more personal than just an online community with people from all over the country, because you know you kind of have the same sort of culture in the areas that we live in, and you can share things on a more personal level I felt. What do you wish more people understood about infertility? I, wish that they understood that. It's very isolating makes. You feel like there's something wrong with you. Even though we have all of this statistic and all the data when it happens to you, it's just. Such a shock. Speaking from my own experience, I don't want to speak for everyone but I fell that you know I thought I knew my body so well I thought. I took care of my body so well. And how could you know? How could I have known about this? How could I have not known where to start So it made me feel like a little bit like I was missing something. I hope that people know that how hard it is both mentally and physically giving yourself injections being on a schedule making sure you have all your medication. It's almost like a fulltime job managing managing all of that managing all your appointments. Making sure you have the flexibility to leave work if you need to. When you have mere lining checks, or you have your egg retrieval, it's not on your timeline. It's on your body's timeline, so you have to have a support system that is ready to kind of pit. However, your fertility schedule needs. Needs you to because it's not always on your time being understanding being compassionate, not holding it against you know an individual. If they're not feeling well, because you don't know how you're gonNA, react to the medicine. You know it's just it's just a lot, so I hope people realize it's not just the glamorous. I get to choose the gender of my baby if I want to, or I have so many embryos, and bragging about that or things that you might see on TV or in the movies like it's nothing like that at all. Hey, infertility warrior. It's heather. This episode of beat infertility is brought to you by me. Regular listeners of the show know that I struggled during my infertility journey with everything from finding the right clinic to advocating for protocol customized to my body to allowing infertility to consume my entire existence and everything in between in other words I've been where you are. Now that I'm on the other side of interviewed hundreds of other warriors and fertility experts. I discovered the fastest way to realize. Your dream of becoming a parent is to get educated. Regain Hope, build resiliency Lauren, self, advocacy skills and partner was someone who's been there. Whether. You're an infertility newbie or a seasoned veteran, it would be my honor and privilege to provide as one client. Put it unwavering support with fully engulfing and. Empathy. If you'd like to learn more or schedule a free thirty minute. Call to discuss how I can support you during your infertility journey go to beat infertility dot co slash hope now back to the show. How did you and your husband feel the moment? When you were diagnosed with tubal infertility, we were relieved a little bit that we had an answer, but I just felt more because it was my issue I definitely felt a little bit almost like mourning or grieving something because. I just didn't know I just keep going back to the I didn't know myself as well as I thought I did. In my thirty one years of life I never knew at the time before. I started infertility like I went all that time, not knowing something. That was so impactful to to my life. Tell me about the lowest point during your journey and how you pick yourself back up afterward. The lowest point was the definitely the failed transfer or the chemical pregnancy. Because up to that point, everything worked like once. We knew what the issue was. It was okay we needed to the egg retrieval that that had seven embryos. Okay, check. We got through that got through the surgery. They removed the tube. They removed scar tissue. They remove polyps. Check, we're good. We had our medications schedule for before transfer. Everything was working like clockwork. Thickening I was doing things on the expected timelines, and then for the the big moment to not work was just such a disappointment and that was definitely my lowest point I. Don't know if it was because it was around the holidays that made it worse, but I just remember feeling like I just couldn't imagine going through it again and having another disappointment like this. What about a positive moment from your journey I think a lot of it was positive like I was super. Optimistic Abou the egg retrieval. I love my team. I trusted my team I felt like they were giving me answer so a lot of it was really positive because I was at a low point starting when I wasn't getting anywhere. And then Rod Kinda, push me along, and and that's why I think I was starting to get more vocal about it because I feel like. I've got this like I can share this with people and the next step is definitely going to result in a pregnancy, so I think. I learned a lot about myself in the process in that I am a little bit of a tie. Bay control-freak person, so having to you know set. Boundaries for myself in and get a having Matt. Experience made me realize what is important to me to keep between my husband and I going forward, and what's important to share? Tell me about the moment when you first learned going to be a mom. I definitely did not believe I didn't believe it for those of you. That aren't in the infertility community. Community? The Hollywood is pregnancy tests. Surprise is not a thing you find out by either an email or for artists at at Radford tillery. We have a patient portal, so you find out in your portal, or and then they follow up with the phone. Call and tell you that you're pregnant. I was at work and I was standing in the stairwell. Stairwell at work. My husband's a teacher, so I had to call the main office. Have Him get paid? Go down to the office to get the phone to tell him that we were going to be parents, so it's our story and it's I. Don't know anything different, but it's definitely not not what I expected, but I didn't really I. Really didn't truly feel like it was real. Until probably six months pregnancy after infertility comes with this whole other bag of emotions and stuff that you have to deal with, and then postpartum after infertility comes with more stuff, so it doesn't end after a successful transfer successful. Whatever you're going through at least in my experience. There's more things that Kinda hit you throughout. The rest of your journey a. how did you balance work and your infertility journey? It was definitely a challenge, but I felt like I really compartmentalized. It really drove me to just focus on work at work I didn't want the emotions through infertility to impact anything that was happening in my professional life, so I just worked really hard to compartmentalize. There were maybe or two occasions where I felt like I had to leave early or just take a debt like a mental health day going through the process I have A. A really supportive manager who also went through infertility, so that helped a lot and I have a really supportive team, and I have great co workers so that that definitely helped but I wasn't sharing much with them. It was just you know they didn't ask questions. If I had to leave earlier, go for an appointment, so that really nice. Did you know your manager had gone through infertility before you started speaking out I did so. Do you have any tips for people on communicating with their boss about their infertility journey? I think it's definitely a personal decision, but I think that infertility community as a whole is really trying to spread awareness and get people to understand so if you feel empowered and feel comfortable in you, WANNA share. Hey, I'm trying to start a family I. need some help medically to do that. That's going to require me to be taking some time away from the office I just wanted to be transparent with you. You and I hope that you'll support me through this because I still care about my job, but I also care about starting a family if I had a someone who wasn't in the thick of it, I guess I'll say like I, was. That's how I would've approached it I hope. Were you able to afford all the costs during your infertility journey, we did have insurance coverage for a majority of our expenses. So. We're very fortunate to have had that outed infertility. Change your relationship with your husband. It definitely made me more needy. I definitely felt like we were very independent. We're both very career driven We have our mutual friends, and we have our separate sets of friends, so we were always kind of doing things together separately. It just worked for us, but I would start to feel like panicked if he was planning to go, hang out with friends or leave the house for an extended period of time when I was going through it because I just felt like I really needed. Needed him so much more than I ever did. And and that carried through the pregnancy and postpartum, so it definitely made me appreciate all the things that he does even more, but it also made me a little bit fearful of being without him. What about relationships with friends and family I definitely think those have changed I know that I'm very reluctant to share now just because of the disappointment, and this is probably something. I need to work on, but just. Didn't want to disappoint anyone else. Because people get excited about the thought of of a new baby and a new life, and you know starting a family and. I thought a lot of pressure to to share that. I had previously been really vocal about not being in a rush or not wanting to feel pressured, and when the time is right I kind of brush people off push people away when they would ask questions about a starting a family, so I felt like I owed it to people to explain what was going. Going on, and then it just kind of spiraled a little bit with some of the feedback I was getting, and maybe I put too much pressure on my circle to know the right thing to do. I didn't even know the right thing to do when I was trying to get treatment so I think it's definitely changed some relationships, but it's also made me realize. who was there through the hard times, and who understood that I did change a little bit, and and those are the people that are still close to me now and I found another group of friends through our fearless fans community that. Now, I I know that I can share certain things with them and other things with my other friends who was part of your circle. And why did you choose the people that you did definitely my closest girlfriends Mike Closest, family members, so my godmother and her family more probably, the people that I shared the most within of course, my mom, my mom actually came to the second transfer with me. That was successful, so she got to see it all happen, and she's definitely been big support even if she doesn't understand all the time I know that she just. Just. Once the best for us once wants to have more grandchildren, so she's doing good with the one right now, but I that I can always go to her if I need her. Did you have to advocate for yourself at all under journey? Oh, absolutely especially in the beginning when I wasn't happy with my ob Karen and trying to find the right fit that was big time for me trying to find even just a general practitioner that I felt gave more personalized. CARE has has been a challenge, but I never felt that I had to advocate with Rad. Were with my my ob practice now they just kind of get it and they listen, and they understand so I feel like I'm in the best care. I had. Some complications postpartum so being a mom to. You have to advocate choices. There's like I said. There's a whole other set of feelings that come after infertility is successful, so you don't ever stop advocating. Were you a natural self advocate, or was it a skill? You had to learn along the way. It was definitely something I had to learn. I feel that. The more frustrated I got guess the more willing I was to advocate for myself. The more knowledge I got and the reassurance from the infertility community. That I found a little bit after the fact, but it really kind of solidified the things that I always thought in my got needed to be answered and gave me the confidence to be more vocal. What tips do you have for listeners who are still learning how to advocate for themselves? Educate Yourself, so you feel like you have certain kind of a leg to stand on. Find trusted sources you know, listen to. This podcast listened other women that have gone through it. Find an online community that you feel as supportive and you can trust every year. I feel like there's more and more information out there about infertility. And I don't know if it's because I'm now part of the community that I'm finding it more easily, but the information out there. You just have to know where to look for it, so don't be afraid to ask even if you have you know a friend of a friend who went through infertility. I feel like the community is very open and supportive and wants people to succeed in wants to share their experience, so reach out to someone even if you don't know them that well, the information that they can give you to help you on your path to motherhood is just invaluable. Tell me about your pregnancy and the birth of your son so my pregnancy seem pretty easy, but I had to be induced for delivery and the night of induction I had an extremely high blood pressure, reading an I was experiencing pre-clampsia. That was something that I didn't realize could happen at any point in pregnancy, I thought. You would have just known because you get your blood. Pressure checked so many times. So that was a little bit shopping disappointing, and then my I labored for thirty nine hours before going to see section It was elective. It wasn't an emergency. C section I. Just was so weak because I had to be on magnesium. The entire time I was in labor because of the pre-clampsia. If you've never experienced that, it just makes you feel like you have the. The flu so of my body was really weak and I didn't feel like. I could push I only dilated to eight centimeters, and that was with potatoes, so I just knew that I didn't have the strength to wait any longer I just would have been more tired, so we did the c-section and then twenty two hours after birth. My son was taken to the nick. For. Well oxygen levels and an assumed infection I did not see him for twenty four hours, because then I got sick I had a fever and I had endometriosis, which is an infection you can get after C. Section, and then my I blood pressure and liver enzymes were increasing, so I had to go back on the magnesium, so I spend probably forty eight hours of his first days of life away completely away from him not even able to visit him in the nick you and then I ended up getting discharged without him and leaving the hospital. To come home and then getting him later on, so it was nothing like I thought it was gonna be, but our whole journey has been nothing like I thought it was gonna be so, but it all worked out. He's perfectly healthy. It's apparently very common for c-section babies to have. Breathing issues in their early life, because they don't go through the birth canal, they can asprey on amniotic fluid so another thing. I was naive to, but now I know so just sharing that with any. Anyone who may have experienced that your son is obviously very very young still, but what has parenting been like post infertility? Really. Tough I had severe postpartum anxiety probably for the first ten weeks. I attributed a lot of that to him, being in the nick and I just felt like I missed a whole week of his life I. Don't know anything about him. He was having some weight fluctuation, which again is common, but I was very hard on myself. We are exclusively breastfeeding so I was just convinced that the. The time away from him impacted my milk supply. Even though there is nothing wrong with it. I went to a lactation console in and everything was fine, but I was just so hard on myself. Which I think all new moms are, but I felt that going through infertility, and having the Nick you experience made. It magnified it for me, so it's hard. It's hard hard for any new. NEW MOM regardless of infertility. I don't want to discredit that. Because being a mom is just really hard, but I had a lot of baggage to come with the hard, but I feel like once. He hit twelve weeks really came out on the other side and I got to know him better and we've been doing great. You said you felt like you didn't know him while he was. was in the queue. Did you guys get a chance to be visiting with him? We did it just I did spend less time within the my husband did because of my issues in my mind I was missing out on things or a learning things from the nurses or like I didn't change his diaper until he was home with us, which I guess in hindsight, I got a break. Because I've changed many diapers since then, but it's the same kind of I guess way I'll explain. You had these visions of Higher GonNa, find out. You're pregnant or how you're gonNa tell your partner that you're pregnant or how you're going to labor, and how you're going to bring your baby home and it's just. I'm done having expectations. I'm just GONNA. Go with the flow from now on. Do you have any embryos leftover from your cycle I? Do we have five left? Did you do genetic testing on those we did not. We felt that we wanted the experience to be as much like a spontaneous pregnancy as possible, so we don't know the gender of any of them. We don't have any family, history or conditions. Conditions that we felt warranted the genetic testing, and I or my eggs are two years younger than I. Am now so at the time. They didn't feel that. My Age had an impact on the quality of them, so we just opted not to do it. Home was infertility changed you I think it's definitely made me stronger. It's made me realize I can handle a lot more. Made me, a better advocate in all aspects of life, and it's made me feel. More appreciative of of being a mom, and and having our family, knowing what you know now what is one piece of advice? Would you give to your past self? It would be to maybe pay attention a little bit more like you. You start off saying there's hundreds of communities online for infertility, but I had no idea that any even existed. But maybe if I had paid attention a little bit more to just infertility in general, being a female, I would have been more aware. It's Impor- in for women to just educate yourself on it whether it impacts your not because I believe that women should support each other, and you might be able to help a friend if they need it. If you had a friend that was going through a, you could help them. rather than make them feel like they're weird. They're alone because you just have no idea. What words of hope would you offer to someone who's just beginning infertility journey everyone journey is different. You will not start your lining sickening the same day as somebody else. Your body is completely different. You have to give yourself the grace and be patient with yourself, because you just don't know how. You can't control your own body I mean it's just that black and white, so just try to keep that in mind. The things you can control are the people you surround yourself with the activities you participated in. In your health and wellness things that can make you lift your mood. Those are things you can control, so focus on nat while you're going through the process and not everything. That's not working Sandra. Thank you so much for coming on the show today and share your story. I appreciate it. Thank you so much for having me. It was great to be her I. Hope that if you're in the area, you look up on facebook. Fearless FEM, facing artillery and I look forward to connecting with you all. Thank you for listening to beat infertility. Join our free private support community at beat infertility dot co Ford Slash APP. If you find yourself meeting additional support visit, our paid programs that beat infertility dot, co forward slash pope you. If you'd like your story to be considered for future episode, please fill out the form at beat infertility dot co Ford slash contact until next time.

New Jersey Sandra Wyckoff facebook Delaware Jordan Matt partner Karen Delaware Bravo New York History Skopje Heather Joel Peleton Daniel
3 Aspects of Freedom | Ajahn Brahmavamso

Buddhist Society of Western Australia

1:01:40 hr | 1 year ago

3 Aspects of Freedom | Ajahn Brahmavamso

"For the savings stomach, talk. The talk on the subjective freedom in religion. Is a great topic. Make guys very wide, very deep. And one of the reasons why I wanted to talk about this was basically in Singapore. At a concert which I. Told myself. Sitting next to at of the medicine, the government in Singapore. Does discussing many things in life and certainly the problems with religions. And the idea of religious. Okay. And also the freedom from sound. Okay. Try that again. Sound size. What religious freedom by be thought there was some terrorists community. But is a problem in this world on people sought religious freedom was an excuse for many things. Begs the question of what freedom reasonable each and also the bigger question what we mean by freedom. The certainly freedom is something we ought spy towards and sometimes it's good to understand what true freedom miss. Certainly put this scold of enlightenment. It is an inner freedom freedom from the difficulties and suffering of life which were aiming for. So certainly that over. aspiring towards the freedom. But sometimes, what we call freedom is really another foreign slave meant this is what I wanted to. Talk about this evening, we'll meeting of freedom. But just to start with the political and then go towards social and then the personal and then the spiritual. In order to start with the the political that. Things which I really objected to was what we call religious freedom in our than age. Is just. Another word for saying religious indoctrination but it just enslavement religious control it's not really freedom whatsoever. You really look at what the word freedom is and have a feeding what that. Word is pointing to. the freedom is the ability I would say, no to make free choice. Without any intimidation without any force without any control from outside of you is say the ability to. Go in which direction you feel you want to go in. The freedom of choice. And unfortunately that in many religions, sometimes that freedom is not there for person what they call religious freedom is basically religious servitude. Well you have to follow other people say one of the reasons which I became a police many years ago because that. Domination. Of You buy into sleet, is all by Dogma simply wasn't even put us some you're allowed. And encouraged to question here are encouraged to doubt. And you didn't have to follow while other people were doing in the same way that when people come in here of evening, not all this, an all of you sort of bow when you come in Halo by when you go out and that's fine and you're encouraged and allowed to do that there is a liberty here taken as much of this teaching all practices you want and doing what you feel is appropriate to you without any compulsion. Off Fear. And when we have sort of that degree of freedom, it becomes very attractive. Very comfortable. And it's pointing to something even deeper some the right send rituals and the external things we do are just. A mirror image of just the way we look at internal practice because there's no control or there's no hierarchy is not Domination by any party on you in the same way that's how we meditate without control without domination without fear we are creating externally. A topic for deputy, which was gone to reflect on our internal freedom later on. And I think that sometimes we'll society doesn't recognize what real freedom is. Some organizations can claim religious freedom is an excuse. For indoctrinated. For Enslavement and for many many abuses in our world. And, I will point out I have done my research in two thousand, one, the French government. Enacted a law. Which Limited religions? Any, religious practice which clearly went to gates fundamental human rights and personal fiefdoms. Illegal. Now, that to have more people know about that because a Western government has done that without any problem. With a religious groups in that country. Simply because the main religious groups no the the oldest African religions they also understand what to freedom truly is. Not The freedom to dominates and get your own way. By the freedom just to express your twiss. And as equitable way as possible without having those truce be forced on a person. So person could come into religion they can leave as well. I know that sometimes. Especially being Chinese New Year and because I go to Malays Singapore quite often. Some groups of religious people who go around to people wouldn't that dying. And they try and convert that parents their grandparents. By saying to them that if you don't convert to my religion, you'll go to hell of something even worse. And of course, the time of death time of a great signal is very vulnerable time for a person with the not in with their full faculties. and. Sometimes people do these things at the. End of their life and how many people in Singapore Malays of asked me well, what should we do if that happens to US maybe son daughter gets involved in one of these calls and they their pasta or whatever along the end I say oh. We feel convert we should convert what should I do I always. Best thing to do if that's happening to your dying person on the, your some comes wants you to confront from being a Buddhist to be Krishna something then convert. makes. Them. Happy. I was confronted around the room. Then you can convert back again. Practically think about what? The other way what's the big deal? Because Buddhism is very practical about these things if you try knock, you never get anyway. But if you. Could adapt as soon as I've gone that he can convert back again. But unfortunately, there's some people just get so much suffering in corporate with. These people. And I think that any act if it comes from a Buddhist Christian Muslim and Gio, whatever any act, which is like that, which is forceful indoctrinating aggressive, which doesn't really give a person, the freedom of choice, and of course, when you are sickly again that freedom of choice is not really there. Would you allow us in such a situation to sign a will and have that will being legally valid? Start great physical, and emotional pressure at the time of death. No same way. I. Think. Any group who tries to do that? That should be basically banned. For anyone who sort of forces childhood have distributional Davidge also should be allowed disallowed. I don't mind being put it to cohere, but of course. No person in Australia and. Eighteen is allowed to choose a political party. The reason ways because people aren't mature enough. TRASHY TO CHOOSE BETWEEN THE POLITICAL PARTIES AVAILABLE So, why are they able to choose religion such a young age A such a young age said not mature enough to know the difference between these religions and so. If they're not mature enough, they shouldn't be allowed to choose a rather other people should not be allowed to choose for them. Otherwise it's not religious freedom, his religious indoctrination. It's the same with even marriage laws. I think it's very wrong that a person who is one religion is forbidden from marrying someone of another religion. Whole you have to convert today, but before you can get married. I'm very, very proud. I remember meeting this US apart of some of the people that I've met I remember meeting this couple I've in Singapore and he was a Christian. A Buddhist? And they're very happy together and I said wonderful when you have a child, the first child should be Muslim the second also be a and it's such a Hindu. Now what I was saying is. Caught we allow our children to choose for ourselves car. We just allow people to be themselves. Why is there have to be forced? You must be this. Asian. Or another reason why we using emotional blackmail? Any other Pragnell to force religions of views on people that is office not religious, freedom. I think it's about time that. Human. Societies reclaimed the word religious freedom. Make sure it was not misused. As a form of religious domination. Or extortion. So when we can do this we have an understanding what really freedom isn't just fighting the French. We can actually have even laws in place. which actually protect freedoms. For overdose. and. So we can discuss things without any fear of intimidation violence. Are. We can discuss even in Buddhism without fear of intimidation violence. When people have argued with me, I've never beaten them up the never let me even more importantly. And you'll never sort of we never have any. Any threat of excommunication. Sometimes I think it'd be wonderful thing if I could do that. But it wouldn't be wonderful. We don't have that at all in real religion soon should have the freedom of debate, the freedom of inquiry, the freedom of choice because that freedom of inquiry choices. To finding the truth. Sometimes I, what people are afraid of with honest debate and questioning and investigation. Why are people afraid that we conduct our children to choose religion? Of course, it doesn't make any sense to me just because your parents are one religion, you have to be the same way to. That is sort of an idea whose time has long passed. So real freedom of religion think should be enshrined in all of us because we have to protect freedoms in the same way we protect other freedoms. ANYTHING ANYTHING WHICH Clearly goes against fundamental human rights, which is right to choose. The right to choose freely and not being indoctrinated not to be. Given false information to be able to question to bear to Arche such a freedom I think is fundamental. Fundamental certainly, what I understand is Buddhism. The whole pacifists. Practice recall put him. It's always allowed to question what was that allowed? To argue always allowed to disagree without any fear of. Being. Rejected without any fear of being excommunicated hurt or whatever. Which is why again that when people have good arguments, we always welcome those remember that. Even, my own teacher agenda many many years ago. there was the. Chairman of the English Sangha Trust, which was the organization which was inviting ten trials amongst to the West for the first time when they went to England. And so he came over to see the great master when he brought his daughter to have her eighteenth birthday, it was eighteenth birthday gift to go to Thailand amid the great agenda. But this was an eighteen year old English go really upper self. And so which he may attention she started off with him being totally disrespectful. When someone actually told you know this is a great time like you're being disrespect you're not supposed to argue. And then we're not show interrupted said, no leave her alone. This is good. and. He welcomed such arguments even though there was very cutting. A wonderful thing to be able to have that certainly all the years I've been in Australia. It was very easy to actually teach Buddhism entire them. But when you come to Western countries, that's when you really get tested. because. That's where people ask you some very, very difficult questions and you never say, no, you can't ask that question of course. Welcome those questions and even if they think stupid, you're quite welcome to say that. And you're not sort of faith. Argued With you not said, you're evil anything because you don't disagree with me. Perhaps the worst question of the most difficult question I ever got lost. was when I was teaching in the High School I forget which high school it was. It was a public school. IT WASN'T A. Particularly Good Subir because his fourteen year I'll go when I asked the questions about Buddhism. She. Put up a hand and say, what's your question? About, Buddhism. She said it's about you go still turn you on. So you see, it's very good big. Austrailia. People are free to ask questions. Think my has does like you devotee you ask questions about that. Actually I think what happened is as many years ago. I think one of her friends rescued me, etc. Don't listen to her. She always likes embarrassing everybody. I think that's actually what happened. But it was wonderful that she that you could be asked and people felt free to ask such questions. The reason why you welcome such questions, even I not questions but even better to st questions his because that freedom for inquiries important to finding truths. Religions are supposed to be worshiping truce and sometimes you know people sort of awesome is put to do you believe in? Do you believe in the Buddha? Nice question is we believe in the truth. Now in reality reason in finding out what's was evident. It's Finding out the truth is something you worship much more than any be. and. So when you are devoted to finding out the truth which hope many of you are we have to learn how to Mossos questions have to freedom of inquiry and when we have that freedom of inquire, the freedom to investigate and a liberty to go into any area. And discover these things for ourselves that will obviously be finding something very important and the the thing which I like most about about the search for the truth it was not just now what is right but what is right? What so so what was liberating? What was actually freeing? Meaning of freedom. Either meeting of freedom was actually the same. You feel. You know when you have like a weekend off your free from the burden of having to go to work. Because what I found that that inquiry, which was going to lead you to truth was also lead you to the truth of such things as happiness and suffering. Now. The freedom from pain and difficulties because much of my early life like much of many people's lives they feel like they're in a box of. Oppressed by work, they have to do all the difficulties they face it life. and. I sat feed them from oppression. which is not just the the of inquired the philosophical freedoms but also what we the emotional freedoms. And that was the second type of feed which I really enjoyed with practicing Buddhism. Freedom for all these talbot emotions which created a lot of problems with human beings which crate prisons for oneself. some of those freedoms while I'm talking about is that not just the freedom from fear for the freedom from guilt and freedom from anger what I was talking about the last week. When the why can't we let go of the pain of the past difficulties we faced or the? The. Bad things which we've done mistakes we have done in the past. Because there was this great liberty in Buddhism that you did not need to carry around the Pasta and punish yourself. There was no. So judgment at the end of time which you have to make sure you being a good boy or good girl good montcalm. Nano whatever otherwise you big trouble at the end of time. This is wonderful. Sense of life forgiveness and letting go. And that was one of the great freedoms which. We worship Buddhism. which we want to protect the freedom to forgive. His once we've forgiven somebody. Got, gun. How do you feel? Great Bird which had been carrying around for such a long time it's no longer there. It's like you'll not like you've taken off a heavy rucksack or put down your suitcases or put down your shopping bags. And so often some of the things which we carry around with us it just. Really. Ridiculous It's not just what other people have done to us how they hurt us now what we've done to others as well. Touch, coming in an old. Story which I can tell you. Singapore. Few weeks ago. Was a classic story if they. Are The two soldiers? From the Second World War Two X POW's from channy POW. camp. Meeting together. And one of them see if you've forgiven the Japanese yet for what they did to us World War POW camp. We all know just what happened in that POW camp tangy and on the death row ways of. Thailand. Those X. though soldiers which treated abominably many died. Badly, Tweeden Treated. So. What I soldiers said, how can I ever forgive what I saw? What was done to my friends? How can you ever forgive that? You can imagine if you lived through that time and so all that unnecessary torture in pain. And Abuse. You could understand why it was hard to forgive. So I said no I haven't forgiven. I cannot I forgive you shouldn't forgive what about you. The second show this reunion said I forgave those gods many years ago. That's why I am free and you are still imprison. HIS DID NOT POW camp? As a wonderful lesson how less? We've let. An forgiven. We are visit. Row In prison of our past. What someone did to us why they did how did or what we've done? Some years ago like. A talk at a conference. So in the Skopje show tell us. That big hotel I've had wonderful city or something. Observation City yeah, in observation city. Shows you I don't have a go down there haven't gone done that once I think. And this be conference over there and it was a conference on grief and loss. In as many people there. who were imprisoned by the grief? That was them and they could not let it go their children had died. There the parents of? One of those. Serial. Killers. Was Care Gladdens. Pam. Expressing that grief many years. It was another lady who came up who also had lost Asano. Remember which And she refused to let her pain. She was imprisoned by that event. If not happened many years ago, she was still living through the sentence. And such sentences of guilt. Grief Our anger. It is like difficult to prison. But that's a prison with the door open you can walk through any time. When you walk through, Do you feel freedom? By letting go of the past. And that is impressed me much about Buddhism. This is actually for me. It's almost common sense. Why. Why do you have to keep thinking? Wabi and hurting yourself about the past. The and particularly if it's what someone else's done. Every time you remember that now think about that you allowing them to hurt you again. The very least you shouldn't do that. Why allow people to hurt you again and again, and again we go forget to move on. What belongs to the past does not belong to the present. Freakin do things like that. We feel a great freedom. That's one of the first freedoms. which we feel in the practice of this dam of this teaching this meditation. The second feed is also the freedom from fear of the future among society from Penny from worry. Is, a great big. I will experience that freedom as well. As a monk. SORT, of not having to give. All. Also places. I told us to the monks that just before I appeared on the state in Singapore couple of weeks ago in front of people is very easy. Just giving some talks like I gave here just a few stories. I wanted the other actors turn to me just one minute before it's too to go on and said. Allieu a fight. Are you excited? I don't tell myself. No of course not. Why because I wasn't worried about what's going to happen next? I had no script I didn't know what I was GonNa say I never know what I'm GonNa say. But because Yoga laxed you didn't feel anything of the future. He felt so free. Isn't a wonderful thing to feel free from worry about your future about what's going to happen next. And how can you achieve that I? Would a gave the clue a few moments guy when retracing the meditation. Now. Is the time your future mate? If, you keep on focusing on this present moment more and more and more. I know that that's the best possible thing I can do to secure a prosperous successful happy future. So putting this in the context of this Chinese New Year when people wishing each other a prosperous new year. I will not wish you a prosperous New Year I. Wish you a prosperous present moment. Happy now. That's the only time you have and the more you focus on making prosperous. Happy present moment. The free you feel. Free from the worries and concerns about the future. And, he will find by that type of freedom you're creating the best possible future imaginable for yourself. Crediting the freedom from fear worry. And that's something which is encouraged. Valued cries celebrated encouraged. In this we're not supposed to be afraid of fide will judgment. Sometimes, when some of these people come on. What's going to happen to you when you die? I you. Sure you'RE NOT GONNA go to hell. What's your answer? So I haven't died yet. Live in the present moment I'm happy now. Or, whatever something like that because all this idea of trying to create fear Renews Soon as people to create fearing you, they have control of union not free anymore. Really he's obviously notice that fear is a way of control anxiety. which is created in you control. and. Freedom is something completely different. When you talk about. How a person how a person prepares for death? Are you afraid of dying process? How can you prepare for death? The only way you can prepare for dances leading how to live life You know how to live this moment well, today will. This is actually where you practice if you did this live this moment. Well. They've it pace if it compassionately live with mindfulness you effort into this moment. You will find that's the best preparation. You can possibly have a death if you live this moment well. have nothing to be afraid of. Your free when you know about half in the present moment. These are the great freedoms which we have freedom from anxiety from FIA from guilt from anger. I think any psychologist who found the person that was free from those things will thank you just an amazing wonderful person. Too many of us in our world. Just caught up. By the process in the future. no-one do we don't have any happiness? And again real freedom. Has To be the cheaper of that happiness. That's a sign of freedom. You feel just loose at ease without any burdens not oppressed at ease. Which is why that apostle of freedom is. Of Happiness is a positive com-? One the other great freedoms which we celebrate input of freedom from having to think too much. Most of the thinking about why about the futility the past the guilt? The anger. The FIA which makes you plan too much about what's going to happen next. And you know the every time you go planning something. This is one of the great sayings of the Buddha whatever you expect it's going to be it always turns out something different. That same when I first read it saying put or whatever you think it's going to be you expect it's going to be it would always be otherwise. WHAT YOU TAMARA What download a piece of paper Bet, you don't do half those things planted. So. Why bother planning in the first place? Low Way you stop too much padding a too much seeking about the future you've got nothing much to think about. Great Freedom so many people. Might, be like come. Meet me because excessive thinkings sometimes people because thanks how much. They get the brain in a not if you use your brain too much early age you got nothing much left your later years nothing. That's way got Alzheimer's disease for. You used up all your neurons when you were younger what you delight now, why do you seek anymore you bride words out. Yeah See She agrees with me. So. It's great to have that freedom from thinking as well. One of the wonderful experiences you you have in meditation. And even just. As, you do here every now and again especially when I do that trick about letting you. Listen to the. Spices Between My. Words. While had those pulses you weren't thinking. It feels so nice to be free if this burden of sort just to be aware alert and not having to do anything. Really this the freedom from having to always do subsequent go somewhere. Now one of the biggest problems of human beings they. have to sit still. Has Why was Lee, Pascal. One of the French. Philosophers to electronic years ago said all the problems of human beings come from not knowing how to sit still. What he meant was not knowing how to stop and pause and enjoy this few moments of rest. If life is a journey than sometimes that life is a constant journey for us the always moving onto the next thing always going somewhere always doing something. Never sitting still on doing nothing being peaceful investing. You don't have to keep moving onto something. Yeah. We can have the freedom to stop. Not, keep moving on. There is one of the delicious freedoms we have especially as monks. The freedom just to sit down and do nothing. Not. Go anywhere. Make anything happen. Just the freedom to stop just to be for. How many of you experienced freedom this week He when you have holidays, you just have such a lot of list of things to. His important you do something spot. Sometimes we get so tired. We don't do things. Well, how many people in business the one of the reasons why people get stressed out is because when they are working very, very hard. They get to a point where the brain is not working efficient efficiently anymore they're just simply not productive. Y to sit down stop and rest for a few moments. Because if you take just one minute of stopping. And freeing yourself from the While we've all that work you have to do and all that business just free the brain for one minute. From that burden, you will find the energies come back. The plane is pretty resilient and it does the energies do come back pretty quickly if you give it half a chance. The next fifty, nine minutes of that hour. You'll catch up with a one minute you spent just wasting. In the same way that if you know how to sit down journey. Then you can walk much faster off you got up after you've had arrest. I don't why people forget that the thinking then Brian they can force it to keep on working hour after hour after hour long our US I think they can be productive. It's obvious when you're tired, you're officiency goes way down you make lots of mistakes which makes more work for you. So to stop the freedom feel that you don't have to keep on doing something you can stop and pause for one just rest. You can have a holiday. Just wrist. But there's so many things to be done. That's why that my famous favorite stories. was about this? In the south of Todd and put it thus story. This. Is One or two member on the weekend. He was building this whole this monastery. And they came to the the rains retreat period the wasp period the answer in Thailand where the monks pull the work, we spend all that three months to doing meditation or study. We pulled all the external business aside. And so he'd only off finished his whole. When visit Saint told his start the retreat Peirce, I total of the workers go home come back again in three months. So they all win her a few days later this man visited. The temple and he saw this whole. With Nobu Fun. And the ask the monk when is your whole be finished? Now say K. to where the my said Sir the whole is finished. To which visits said, what did you mean? It's finished no roof on. There's no glass in the windows, this cement bags and pieces of lying all over the place. I. Ain't GonNa Leave this what you mean it's finished. And this might get very wise replies. It's. What's done is finished. And then he went to meditate. What a wonderful was saying that is. What's done is finished. So the work you're doing this weekend. I. Even have a vest and stop and free yourself from all choose and buttons responsibilities you have. Can you do that? You'RE GONNA be working all weekend. Cleaning up the house during this, catching up on paperwork or whatever else it is. Can you actually say to yourself what's done is finished and have a break have arrest. Be Free. From the responsibilities which you have to carry for the rest of the day while the rest of the week or the rest of your life. Otherwise. Whatever can you find? Freedom. If any of you think you get everything finished for us for everything out of the way, and then you have a prank, you'll never be able to do that look at the monastery where I Live Bird Indiana monastery twenty five years we've been building that monastery. Still building it. But nevertheless every and again okay. That's enough was done is finished reliever alone. Go Meditate. And that's what I learned today. That paperwork which have to do led to as those talks Well, the heck. I'm a monk what's done is finished and I just go and hide in my cave. And that makes me very efficient. Not Lacy you can find you get much more than when you know how to stop regularly. This is actually the freedom from stress. That's one of the great things which. Now these teachings actually help he'd have to worry about anything. He cannot see. Let things go. One of the other things which is really worth freeing yourself from his finger self. For yourself from wearing what other people think about you. I know to south telling another month last night so when I was young. Always, trying to to other people's expectations. Now. Trying to please your parents and be a good son. At, trying to place your teachers doing what at School university trying to get good degrees and they're trying to please other people. Then you had girlfriends and trying to piece the girls that was very difficult to. Sustain the other way you know you go. So it's even harder having to please the boys. Got You'd have to your body's I still remember just was so much compassion going to Melbourne wintertime. and. The newest fashion was having these these low skirts and just high. Tank tops I think never called and so this exposed Lena Flash on. Women's bodies. Going blue too so cold. To what you have to do to catch boy it's just not worth it. I'm. Glad they've been done. Have that fashion. Would you do that for can you really can sell other people commute trying to sort of make yourself attractive Find that that's a lot of you still doing that. Trying to survive by while the people's interview. And that's such a pain. Isn't it wonderful actually have some freedom of that and just be yourself. Whatever that happens to be. One of the great advantages of being among addressing up in sort of goes class, which is address. It looks like that way some people. And that's you're watching people look at you you get up fortunately the people got used amongst these days, but it was really great and the other years here in here in Australia. People didn't know who you were. And that would be. That was really funny. Sometimes. When you go to the Tortoise People, point you to the other direction the ghost. is very getting embarrassed because. Why are you so imprisoned by other people's comments what they say about you think about you. Wonderful to be free but fair of that. Recently was in Thailand giving some talks. I, not I never be. Must site on Todd of. Gratitude for everything which targeted to me but this is a case not really want to go to China and was just busy not. So when I to so many places and get so many invitations to go overseas and I really liked to spend time over here in. Perth. You guys with my monks, my monastery. begonias invitation. So I saw outcome I'm going to go to Thailand. And I'M GONNA give some talks of care what they think of these talks. Because if I really upset somebody but being over the talk then they weren't invited to time again and that was my plan. So. I. Gave a couple of toes in Thailand and not just was really sort of laughing and cracking jokes and these objects have nothing do with. Buddhism I thought I'd get upset Nevada me back again. It was actually the opposite happened I thought was really good about time mangams monks taught like. Reveal popular. So I'm writing mistake there. is a wonderful feeling. You know when you can go and give a tall he doesn't care what the people like like it. So you completely relaxed your free of the concern for praise and blame other people. Because, I'd been in this business for such a long time. Sometimes I feel given a really really good talk anathemas people said was really hopes. and. Another times like even the table toxin that was really really good. So I keep up. Isn't it wonderful having to worry about price play not what other people think of you? Because really when you look deeply, how can anybody else judge here? How do they know? Now. What you've been going through. What what you've got to deal with. And how can they really assist you? No one can. Which is why when people? So the price Oh may I started listening anymore. How can they know exactly what I'm doing why I'm doing what I said why is it what I meant? No they know what they heard blessed not sometimes what I meant. Is. A strange thing happens with words when they come out of the mouth, they actually chained before they go in somebody's ear. Says not the same thing which is said which you here. I've noticed that many many times. So how can you be worried about what other people think of you? So great to be free of that. Now when you have these types of freedoms freedom from fear freedom from guilt free from remorse fearful wearing other people think of you. You don't become a sort of a pain in the ass to other people. That type of freedom. Makes you relaxed when you relax your happy in that piece when you're happy in that peace, you tend to abuse other people. Don't tend to be a pain in the ASS for other people. It's only when you're trying too hard. The upset others. When you relax? You. Allow other people to relax. When you are free. You become kind. You can see that another people when people try so hot. They always make mistakes when they relax life flow smoothly. So the most freedom, which you could ingende inside of yourself, the freedom from all this worry about the class in the future, the freedom from thinking the freedom for while the about other people think of you. You actually growing as a human being you'll. More spiritual, more wise more compassion. Reason why you become kind of is when you're not so concerned about your own problems. About you own grief and anger Wabi concerns. You have more space in your life other people. That's why become more compassionate than we'll free you feel from your own problems. For freedom agendas, wonderful kindness, and this wonderful virtues sometimes I wonder why the people why do people say awful things. Things because they have in pain themselves and they want to share that pain with other people. If you at peace and happy. Then you don't want to sort of ECON share. Anything other than that piece in time and Tom Unkindness with other people. That's the nature of things. That's what goes deeper in to the idea of freedom and spirituality. The thing which really sort of imprisoned cheer. Misses the depot type of Buddhism off I- cravings and desires I once not once. Which is why my book I opened the door of your heart I mentioned a very deep pot. Dumb. That, there are two types of freedom in this world. The first type of freedom is called the freedom of desire. And that's a freedom which we think is a freedom which we set up right in our Western world. That's why. We want the freedom to actually to choose whatever dot we wanted to Marcus and have the money to bail to choose where we wanted to go in the world do whatever we want. and. That's one of those feelings which I was seeing as a false freedom. Because now I'm a monk been for thirty years and I can't. Exercise, is is. I can eat what I want I just ate what you give me. I can watch the TV watch a movie. What is thought to go on a holiday somewhere. All of those. So called freedoms we take for granted in your life I have announced them. Really, when you look at like a monk's life, you say, wow, what do you do that for? You must be really think about your monasteries a prison. Monasteries not a prison many of you pin down. It doesn't feel like a prison even notice down the road is another prison. People have confused too because we've got a war. Karna prison farm hasn't got was just got a fence. And people who actually act because they didn't other place together actually gone to prison farm and said it any in here. Fortunately fortunately there wasn't. But. If you look all the rules which we have to keep. Wow that really tough keeping all those rules they Connie Eaton, the afternoon why not be free? You can't have alcohol. Roskam champagne or something after you get enlightened. That's something worth celebrating. No. So many rules. People think that that's really an imprisonment for you but. Inside being a month, you feel incredibly free. Was One of a strange things when I didn't understand why it was a month I felt more free than I did in the life. I realize it's because the life I had to feed them of this is. Could do whatever I want out with ago. Go coach pop go to a movie. I, defeat him of desire as a layperson. When I became a monk I had the other type of freedom. What we call the freedom from desire is. This is is what Nev- anymore. He No. One of the biggest problems of modern life. We have such power to have so many Desai's achieved to go to so many places get so many. Material things see so many movies. He has so many pieces of music we can actually go such. Freedom of desire and I'm born world. That's why we feel the modern world as a prison for us. Do you really feel free. So many things to. Sometimes you go into, I, remember going to shop to choose some classes. So. Minutes choice there I felt imprisoned. So I said I'll take those and good out soon as I possibly could. and. That's not going shopping not for grass. It's we don't actually go to supermarkets and shops as much easier for us. It must be hell for you guys. Going these supermarkets in the seventy different types of Muesli. Shit that's great because actually even somebody puts some museum my cup in the morning and that's I don't even choose much easier much more freeing that way. So it's an interesting contemplation of the two types of freedom, the freedom of desire. And the freedom from design, which one do you want? Those of you who've gone on retreats nine David Creates Konta Monastries to stifle while. People that enjoy that. What is no TV there's no move faces. No sex is no sport. Why did they? Why do you like that? To. That time you can't you'll freedom is limited your freedom of desirous limited before this one other freedom you don't have to have this desire pushing importing you all the time. That's why the freedom from desirous opinion freedom of all. Record it contentment. This is good enough. I don't need anymore. It's a freedom of stopping. Freedom of just on this weekend. Sitting Garden. And even though the on these wacky. And All the flowers need watering there's so much work to. Senna Tamara. The freedom of desire to have to do things. To have to change things to have to make things. National Show External Garden what about your internal garden, your heart how many of you think? Yeah I always defilement snow I'd need to be chained to stop this and I going to change that about myself. We actually say, yeah, there's so much wrong with me, but this is good enough. And just accept yourself if you were. For few months. This, cold resting. This also called Love compassion kindness. The door of my heart is open to me as I am the I'm conditional acceptance of this moment code you. Can do that. You see this no desire left. That's why one of the highest happiness is people have is unconditional love. With unconditional love if it really is unconditional. That person to be anything different just know wanting this notice is a freedom there. Isn't it wonderful when somebody gives you that unconditional love. Why because you don't have to live up to anyone's expectations now. He'll free of having to work so hard to prove yourself to another person. And a know what freedom is. So, you can give that feed into other people. Maybe, to certain people. By giving them unconditional love. An in your company though for this amazing freedom. And you can give that to yourself. No matter who you are no matter what you've done. have, no desire to be different. Relax be yourself. I tell terrible Joe's people tell me. Repeat all the time. I enjoyed them us what don't care what you think. Well I do sometimes but always say wonderful you can be free that way. Now, these are great freedoms which you create for yourselves. And they're not freed of which plummets in another exists. They're not just say believe in this person or follow that person. Later one you feel freedom in some heaven realm. You are creating a heaven rogue right now in this very life. But you understand what the freedoms are. And this is not forcing you to do anything because that forced that compulsion out of fear all control of having to do this and having to do that. That is precisely the same things which stop you being free inside. It's not unconditional. Only. Fought over religion if this conditional, not conditioning this condition that condition and this condition in that condition. Really when somebody was asking just recently. They wanted to join the committee and to be joined the committee to the half to Kaitlin five precepts. Indicate the five precepts precepts is not supposed to take alcohol. Somewhere not maybe a little bit of alcoholic you now and again. As far as Buddha's was, you're trying and intend inclining towards that. The not be very happy to sort of no sign your you in as a full member. Sunday as reclining towards keeping his doing your very best in situation you have. got. To. Give people a bit of freedom. If you give people that freedom they always live up to that. FIA. They try hot try harder to keep the freedom. But if you actually Mike holders very very hard rules on people, it just becomes control it again and people get tight. They get tense of afraid. That No. That story about my father, Ted me the first time the door of his heart. So is out to me about what I ever to. When he gave me that degree of freedom. I lived up to it. I've always found that in life. I trust my months saying the other day traveled away so much. When the mosques away the cat will play. Up Put it the other way round. Play the cat face. So, nice he trust iffy. Party. When you trust people, people live up to that trust. and. That's a very high blinded sort of path of religion of life. When there's no force but this trust. And when you do that to yourself, you don't fool yourself. You Trust. Yourself. You're kind to yourself. With gentle to yourself. The unconditional trust yourself trust yourself. Wonderful to say yet I, trust me. I don't need to force me. I trust myself. I will go in my own way in time. I'll be able to keep peace after a while. You do things like that. You actually giving people the best possible way for growth. And Not in the best possible way we are teaching what will freedom is not compulsion. But trust respect and battering the human being to live up. The very, very best. The. More freedom we give people. Especially, ourselves the more we will live up. To the freedom given US become more peaceful, gentle kind virtual someone partly happy people. Because when we? Free We want to be. Here. So lassitude story about freedom. So, great story that went to. Max To casuarina prison many years ago. And they thought they asked among about what life was like in the Monash Register this briefly for so many the story. And what he described life budding the monastery and serpentine was much harsher. Than Life in Casuarina. Prison. casuing the don't have to get up at four o'clock in the morning. And CASUARINA, you get three or four meals a day. Him Prison you get to watch the TV and watch movies -mongst onto any of their. A Wendy's monk told him about the routine of my modesty. There was so upset. That Amok, they got to light conduct had to live in such austere conditions. But one of them. One of them actually said forgetting where they were that's terribly in your industry. Why didn't you come in here instead with us? Invites you to join people to prison because it was they had point. It is much more comfortable in Casuarina jail than it is in boating monstrous serpentine. But the point was, why is it that people try and get out of jail? They trying to escape. One no tries to from Bodine Yana monastery but they liked to. Book Up to try and get in. There is a waiting list usually for people wanting to come. Either just a week ago, hat to write to somebody. Else in Malaysia wants to come and spend the vines retreat and I'm monitoring this year said Soviets four already. No one actually wants to come and stay in catch Joe. So, what was the difference between a monastery and a prison? And the differences in a monastery. Wants to be there. In. No one wants to be there. And that is a definition of freedom in prison. Any place you don't want to be. Is a prison for. Any. Place. Futile WANNA, be here tonight. You WanNa go. This is your prison. If you're in a marriage relationship you happy with. Your relationship is appraiser. A job you hate your job is a prison if you're in a body which is sick or ugly old. Your body feels like a prison. How. Can you escape from prison? You don't need to change your partner. Nor your job. No. Your Body. Just change attitude. To be. Any place you want to be. You feel free. Again, the ending of desire. Craving. Wanting to go somewhere. Wonderful who teaching that He can see how many prisons you might in life. When you call the traffic vice, you don't want to be you want us to get to work quickly. That traffic light feels like a prison come on change. The so many prisons you make in life. Where you don't feel free. You know why doesn't do with the world? So everything to do with your attitude. Whether you want to be here or not. So it's cancer prison. Feels like it. If you don't want it. If you want to be here. Whatever. That is. He will feel free. Even. In Austere Monastry, people want to be the. Whole is feel free. That's what freedom is. Not Being told to be here. By, someone sovereignty. But he had to be here. Then you know what freedom is. So that's support for this evening going from the political freedom. So the social freedoms, the psychological freedoms to the biggest freedom of all. enlightment the end of desire wanting to be here. So. There's this evening. Hope you enjoyed it because that's all you're getting. So any comments or questions about the evening? Khamenei's questions. Okay. So amazing that when I asked very questions now puts a hand up as soon as we've finished as a whole line of people coming to US questions. Well that's life. So we can have some announcement first of all, and then actually break for cup of tea or go to the toilet, but at nine thirty. If you can stay here for that time the monster succumbing. The lions are coming to the lion dance for Chinese New Year. So he can stay just announcements maybe go to have a cup of tea but please stick around for nine hundred thousand for the lines. Of. One. The. POTTY pan. WONKA's. Song. A.

Thailand US Singapore Australia FIA Joe Tortoise People Western government Gio Krishna Casuarina Austrailia High School Skopje extortion Singapore Davidge
#66: Can Neurofeedback Help Your Adopted Child? (with Sarah Jordan)

The Adoption Connection | a podcast by and for adoptive moms

38:24 min | 1 year ago

#66: Can Neurofeedback Help Your Adopted Child? (with Sarah Jordan)

"This episode of the Adoption Connection Podcast is sponsored by our upcoming thirty days of hope. Last April we spent thirty days going through our are devotional faith hope in connection with a whole group of adoptive parents in our facebook group and it was so great we just day by day had discussions about each of the devotional for that day. We've had a lot of people. Ask us to do it again. And we thought what better way to start the year then to do it together together as a group so we're going to start fresh into the new year on January first with day one of the division also to be really easy to figure out what what the rest of us are doing. The days of the emotional will correspond date in January. Thirty divisionals this is a a compilation of thirty entries from Thirty Authors Off Foster and adoptive parents and it's going to offer you a window into their own lives and families. Yeah you're gonNA recognize yourself time and time again in their words because they are walking the same road so many of you are walking and there's really so much wisdom that they share and I just loved it. We had a wonderful time creating this devotional and reading together as a group is just a really powerful the experience. So you're going to want to grab your devotional if you don't have one already or if you'd like a clean copy because our journaling pages built right into the devotional devotional so you can do that by heading to the show notes for this episode or just searching on Amazon. It's available in paperback end on Condole. I'm just go to Amazon and search for faith. Hope and connection welcome to the adoption connection. podcast where we share resources by I in for adoptive and foster MOMS. I'm Lisa qualls and this is Melissa comes. Don't worry we get it and we're here for you. Please welcome welcome to episode sixty six of option connection. podcast I thank you Melissa. So funded be here this morning with you so I have a little question for you. You know. We're you're one week away from Christmas. How you feel about that I think I'm okay. Okay here's what happened. A you know we always talk about our were terrible gift. Givers give yes I and so much so that just a couple of minutes ago. We actually thought there were two weeks so Christmas. And there's really only one so we're clearly really together also a podcast listener and I listen every once in a while to the Is it the big blue cast like with I think say shankill and severe Hadson. For some reason they crack me up the remind me of my best friend at me they did did a two part APP assode two-part gift guide episodes back to back like way back when when people normal people were thinking about Christmas shopping came. So if you're still really stuck you listen to that episode those two episodes because when I finished listening to his episodes actually felt like going shopping for people because they gave such good ideas. Okay that's really impressive. Can you think of one of the ideas they suggested that kind of stuck with you okay. It it turns out it's super expensive. 'cause we check it out. Who's we are thinking about doing it for my father? But there's a at C.. Shop that does custom bobbleheads and when they explained explained it. I thought they were you. Send a picture and and I thought they kind of like took this picture in kind of like pasted it into a sphere or whatever I made a bobble head out of it but we went to the SE shop and they actually take a picture of the person you send and they handcrafts like hand mould like some Skopje. A Three D. The sculpture of the person who send and turn it into a bobblehead. So like I said it's a pricey gift option but super impressive But they also have really good ideas for like teens which is great because I have no idea what teams are doing And good like hostess gifts like Great. They would make great like sister-in-law mother-in-law Gaffes. I duNNO I. I was just super impressed. Well that's great. I will try to listen to that because I need a little inspiration so beyond Christmas shopping. We have a lot other things that you and I have been talking about. And one of them is about today's episode. You interviewed a friend therapist about neuro feedback and adopted children. Do you want to introduce her to us. Absolutely so Sarah Jordan is a counselor and a nurse technician I guess would be the correct title for her and so I love that she has these two different minorities intentionally is a couple other modalities as well. Aw that make her really such a great professional for adoptive families to have because we know that finding qualified people that really understand. I am nuances of our families. Sometimes they're few and far between. Sarah has been working in the mental health field since two thousand five and the last twelve twelve years. She has been specifically specializing in neuro feedback with families that are healing from attachment issues and other types of trauma. She is so knowledgeable eligible end in the interview. She was really able to take the neuroscience of neuro feedback and really connected to the specific nick issues that our families are facing. She works out of an office in Idaho near Boise so anyway I just thought she was fantastic. Well I loved listening to the interview. I learned so much. She's a great teacher. She explains things really really. Well Sarah Welcome to the adoption can extend podcasts. Thank you so much for having me. So we're GonNa talk about neuro feedback today. Something you're really passionate about and something that we've used as our family to one of the tools in the toolbox Weren't talk a little bit more about kind of how complex complex that toolbox can be a little bit later. But he's off by just giving us a brief overview of exactly what North back even as for this people who've never even heard about it before or who've heard about it and haven't gotten a clear answer you Betcha so One of the first definitions actually is biofeedback So biofeedback no feedback is an umbrella term and it is just any time that you're making somebody aware of your biological processes Teaching skills to change them towards healthier patterns bats biofeedback and neuro feedback is a specific type of biofeedback working with brainwave activity And I we get to see what the brainwave activity he is like doing a an eeg so we can actually see what's happening with brainwave activity and then we can actually train the brain and teach it to go into healthier brainwave patterns. That's kind of the the some of what it is so cool. So what does that training look like. So obviously the brain mapping the. You're talking about happens within. EEG WHICH MR familiar about. It's kind of like they kind of connects lots of little electricity delivered ahead Visual Joel of what's going on which is really cool for those of us. Who are bringing gigs like me? 'cause it's ninety. Yeah Yeah it's nice to get to see all of that play out and see it can be really helpful to see the brain patterns. That may be precursors to what we're seeing as behaviors with our kids. So how does want exactly train brainwaves. Sure so I'll give you one of the most common examples that we see with with the neuro feedback that we do. Oh a lot of people have overactive what we call High Beta activity. High Beta is GONNA be associated with a lot of anxiety a lot of overthinking And and so if we want to help him brain to not generate so much high Beta than we'll have somebody hooked up and the brain map like you were referencing before before that against us Ah Protocols that we develop in so we know which areas of the brain exactly would place the sensor on the head and then do a live reading of what's going on in that particular partner brain in if we want to decrease the amount of High Beta than whatever we're using as feedback for the individual Will well have a response. And so usually what I'm using is a movie so I hook up again and we're working with that one spot and we're reading the High Beta activity that they're producing and then if the brain starts produced too much of it than the movie will have either fade out or pause in it and So what happens in the brain learns that it is causing the movie either fade out or pause and it will start to decrease the amount of High Beta that is producing an over the time than the brain learns that it's actually easier to function without so much hype Ada and so it starts to do it on its own outside of session it will. That's so cool. So what are all the brainwaves. We have Beta kind of what are they. And can you give us a really quick for kind of how that yet interact with what we're doing your life. So when we talk about brainwave frequencies we're talking about how frequently Wave occur in a second. So that's where it gets. Its name brainwave frequency. Let's see so the very lowest brainwave frequencies are called Delta and Delta is GonNa be associated with Being Asleep so babies for instance have a ton of Delta hip we map to baby they'd be all Delta but it also forms all of our foundation so So having a good night sleep is kind of like Doing a mini Britian. took a baby again so recess your foundation from which you're GonNa live the next day. The next one is data in data's associated with what we called twilight state. So as you're falling asleep as you wake up and you have that kind of groggy feeling that's GonNa be your Theta State is also associated with a lot of creativity And and the next one above that is Alpha Alpha's associated with a self suitability. That's the one that calms us down from stress and anxiety eighty So the process of getting a good night's sleep actually starts with Alpha when you close your eyes and your brain should shifts into Alpha calm down. Calm the stress down that you experience that day then Tikki into that really pleasant data and then you go down into that Gelson fully. restful night's sleep above Alpha is your Beta and Beta is associated with this Cognition so as you're thinking processing problem-solving you're gonNA have a lot of data and then High Beta is going to be kind of bad on steroids. And that's Kinda hyper vigilant state and we need that. Sometimes if we're in a stressful situation many times ADA above that is another one called Gamma and gamma. I'm actually doing a little bit more work on lately. Because it is actually associated with a bonding branding and transcendence quick rundown. Thank you so much for that. And we've talked a lot about brain mapping for those of you who are visual in our kind of curious as with looks like we're GonNa have a bonus training that Sarah's offered to show us like a video of what a brain map is competitor. Read it there's going to be download so we will have all that in the shut so when you stop driving or stop running around and chasing kids hop over to the show notes while the link to that at the end and you'll be able to Even dig deeper into that. If you're an interesting so you said nerve feedback is a part of biofeedback or one on way. So it's like the brains version of a biofeedback within nerve feedback. Are there different types of feedback. And what do we need to know about that. As we're kind of looking into this as a tool kits sure so there's There's GonNa be a single channel where you're just working in one spot at a time for for the brainwave brainwave activity and that's usually the one that I'm doing. So that's more the traditional neuro feedback. There's another type of treatment called Lens. It stands for low. Oh energy neural feedback system. And there's been some people have found a lot of success with that one That one is doing a reading but also giving US stimulation at the same time but it's a low low energies in relation Another type of neuro therapy that we do that. Based off of neuro feedback is called neuro field in the neuro filled who is also a stimulation with that as well at significantly less than a cell phone. But it's kind of molding for the brain or training in a different way And I actually the US. Both of the Neuro Kelvin. The Standard Neuro feedback perfect so when parents are thinking about this as a tool for their kids. It's what are the types of outward facing behaviors and or symptoms that might lend itself to nerve feedback. Continuously it's not GonNa fix all of our things you know magically Zap some of the attachment issues. We're talking about in all of these other things. So what does it do. Kind of. What doesn't Senate do sure So one of the most common brainwave a dysregulation that I see with kids with attachment issues is actually a lack of Delta Alta activity which is very I really slow one. And what we found is that they're just missing some of that foundational regulatory a piece for them if there was some early childhood disruption. So what you're GonNa see then with with. That kid is a lot of inner chaos that's manifesting outwardly. And so with the neuro real feedback. That's one of the primary ones. I'm working on is trying to teach their brain to get back into that foundational mode. The brain has the capability to do which it's just gotten so tracked if you will in this fight or flight response that it just stay stuck in it. So the neuro feedback helps to get it unstuck doc and another one said before the really common is that too much high Beta activity which is associated with anxiety so anxiety symptoms a lot of chaos symptoms. Those are the things that that the neuropathy Beckenham helpless another one that comes up often I don't know that people have experienced this but a lot of the kids come in at been diagnosed with. Add ADHD and when we look at their brainwave activity. It's actually not consistent with somebody who would typically be diagnosed signals with that and so sometimes those those symptoms of where they feel like they're all over the place isn't actually that they had. Add or ADHD. It's actually actually just more of that And so we can work with the brain to start regulating that the other really common one that Alpha that self soothing ability most of the kids I work with a really lacking in their ability to generate self soothing and and because they can't do it inwardly than they have a hard time even accepting denote from From parents who are supposed to be the ones that are teaching them that because they can't do it themselves and they are getting that so. That's another one that we work a lot on. What about things? Like sleep patterns Canarsie back ten of Ability to sell you know like you were talking about like that. Delta is asleep so if we see a lot of sleep disruption neuro feedback. Can we really helpful with that and then if it is more traditional. Adhd you can nurse feedback kind of help with focus and concentration can keeping the brain in the pattern that it needs to be at the frequency to be for that like thinking work absolute uh-huh yeah that's There's there's been a lot of studies with neuro feedback the one that's had the most studies eighty. ADHD in its boundary has been found to be very affect. Okay so it's so interesting because sometimes we see our kids with these behaviors and like a lot of other things. Behaviors are just symptoms. And so it's so fascinating to me how you know an eeg can kind of tell us a will. This child can't focus because he's always anxious or can't self soothe. This child really is struggling with the actual frequency that you know is focused and concentration and so really understanding kind of the foundational needs needs is so huge because if we treat all the behaviors the same but they're from different yes foundations than it's it's totally. Were barking tree really. That is a very very good point yet. And that's why I think that there are some neuro feedback practitioners. That don't do the mapping day. Just go based off of symptoms. And they've had good success with that but I'm someone that I need to see a map starting to exactly what is causing the symptoms overseeing yes Now what's the time frame for something like this like a lot of parents in desperate places right. They're like just fix it fast. Fix It fast. But if they start to explore feedback Kinda what is the length of treatment. I know it's probably depending on the kid. But you kind of expect like this is like not like a one session thing or is it like a year long thing. Can t give us kind of a range. So the ballpark figure that we give is about forty sessions. I'm for a typical client. I have found just to be completely honest with with with the kids at have significant trauma. You're probably looking at more like a year Sometimes more but that's that's probably about right with that and So yeah somewhere. Forty to sixty up to a year sessions okay and and like weekly like twice a week. What does that look like? Generally so I So clients that are here in town Just because it's more convenient for them to be able to just come weekly or a couple of times a week that's usually what we do But we do have people that will come from outside of the state in will come do a two week intensive witness and so with that intensive actually doing two to three sessions a day with that for two weeks and so what we have found a again. There's there's studies with this run that it's it's more important. That amount of sessions than it is the frequency of session in terms of results. Is this one of those things where it gets worse before it gets better or do we kind of see you're gonNA see improvement right away so any time we go through change process. Yes it's stressful. Even if it's a positive change typically we see we start to see some positive changes within the first ten twelve sessions and I actually liked to do another brain map at that point so we can actually visually see how the rain is responding to the treatment there are sometimes that will hit like a plateau or there are some reversion. That's happening Usually typical again of any kind of change process that we go through the the the system just kind of checks with a cell phone. I don't know I really want to do this. with the intensive we do tell parents that around Thursday we call it angsty Thursday. Stay where where. The kid is getting their brains getting a little tired and that's usually take a weekend off to just let their brain rests But there is when you when during rapid change. Sometimes there's a little bit of weeks. Yeah I get that so in terms of some of the other tolsma toolbox things like amd are there are other body treatments their brain type things you know. There's listening therapies and protocols where would you place this like Sometimes people are like what do we do. I is there something that you know would help us prepare for something else when you're looking at a bigger picture and a treatment protocol wear like how stable does a child needs to be to do this. Obviously willing you're not gonNA Russell a keurig right to do that. The you know. Is this something that allows us to have other. Have other therapies. Be More effective or like. Where does this kind of fall in the treatment? I'm in range so that's a really good question too. I actually as part of the the intensive that we do that you intensive we actually incorporate a family therapy. MD are and hurry variability training which is another type of neural feedback and even gut training that we do And so all of those things are are important but we do have sometimes clients commended. Their child is so district that we just go with during the neuro. Therapy the feedback piece. I the Nice thing about the neuro. Fill that other Equipment that I was talking about before that does not require As much of hooking everything up to be able to work with them we have we have an emotional palming protocol that we do with that. That if if someone's really distributive just start off with that So Oh i I feel like now I was a I was a counselor Just doing talk therapy before I started doing neuro be back and would work with clients science than would have some success. I mean it's a good modality talk therapy but I would feel like sometimes we get really stuck and when I learned more about the neurological piece just do it that opened up new pathways for the clients that I was working with and And I feel like it's the same with everybody. You know that if we can help the brain into open up more It improves all the therapy that we do. So I'm biased but I I do feel like if the rank it's more stable than it helps everything. Yeah that's a good word. What's the minimum age that you typically work with when in terms of being able to tolerate? Bring my pain no sitting for the therapy and things like that Youngest I've worked with is for That that's a little bit young The probably it probably around eight and ANA is is the easiest as far as getting them settled We're watching a movie for neuro feedback and so most most of them by in pretty easily to that one. Let's go to therapy movie. I can be an easy sell right. Yeah it is okay so talk to me about this. Tricky thing that we're all dealing with which is insurance has insurance cover ner feedback and if it does does. Are there like things that we should know about how to get it. Covered or what types of insurance might cover it more likely than others Yes so the. We are considered alternative treatment We don't quite fit the medical model that the most insurances go with but we have had some success with with some insurances inches plans pain. Some reimbursement A good good thing to know is the code for that. I've got it written down here at nine nine zero one So if you want to check with your insurance and see what they would cover with that The insurances that have been the easiest for people to get reimbursement. Is striker and Bluecross. Blueshield had some success with that. Okay and about about Medicaid. 'cause sometimes kids foster in foster care other things is that like yeah So that one is that ones decided. Every state has their own standard for that. I'm in Idaho in. Idaho does not uncovered however we have had clients that have gotten a single case agreement They're just give some people some verbiage with that if they're if they're trying to trying to get Medicaid to help pay for that especially if they are in the foster care system Z if you can get a single case agreement to work with the practitioner. Okay thank you for all of those really practical things somebody in our community asked. We've been told that the child and the parents should do it. It together is widely recommended. Can what's the thought process behind that in. How'd you guys handle that near practice? So yes if I can get a parent that'll sit down. I and let me do a brain map on them I I would love to do that. just because again going back to the the the kid is usually manifesting outwardly. The the chaos in the trauma that they fill in relly and that does have a tendency to traumatizing affect the rest of the family And so if we can if we can do work on on on everybody There's there's more success with it. If we can have a whole family that will come in and do an intensive with us we love that. Yeah what What would you say to families in terms of results in like what if it doesn't work? What are the like kind of guarantees? I mean there's really Never any guarantees in life right. But how do we. How do you talk to families about can of success what they should look for so so Again a ballpark figure say about eighty percent success rate with our clients and what we have found is that the the ones that it's not really working for There's some missing information somewhere so not so much with the family but sometimes we find out later that somebody Holliger had some addictions that they were dealing with. They hadn't told us about But a lot of times With the kids with attachment issues. They have a lot of secrets that they're that they're dealing with The thirteen and we see that anytime. I see regression in behavior with a kid. I always start asking about secrets. Because there's there's something going on there and so the brain sometimes we'll get really stuck in in maintaining. It's almost defensive in a way it feels like this is the way that I'm going to operate for the rest my life and we're gonNA keep doing this because it's helping me survive there there can be Yeah just kind of that sense of stuck. Nestor defensiveness with yeah. Are there any counter indications. For when you wouldn't want to look back as a solution while I'm biased. I agree with that but obviously if somebody's not in a safe environment Then you need to make sure that they're they're feeling absolutely saved before before you bring in yet another practitioner to work with them So I wouldn't start doing it like right after so many comes into your home I would give them a chance to get settled To get used to you and to start to learn that you are trustworthy personal interest in the Eltsin. Yeah what what about any other medical conditions like. The children have a history of seizures or other things like that. That one is just you just need to let the practitioner. I know that they have that history There are certain things that we avoid when we're doing neuro feedbacks with working somebody who has that history So that's just good information. I know but neuro feedback. Actually in its infancy. Work a lot with a seizure activity okay. Good to know. What would you tell our families please just kind of about the the transformations that you've seen in the families that you work with? Why are you so passionate about this? what's kind of like the hopeful message surge that can is wrapped up in a therapy like nephew back to Yeah I I do this work because I love it and it's been really heartwarming for for me to see good success as happen Where where parents sees as their child say yes mom for the first time ever or something like that or be respectful or does not just not go into the same level of temper Tantrum that they've gone into you before but I've also seen just a really powerful healing just even in explain what we're seeing in the great map just even in another itself can help nope and be really validating for people Successes that we've seen were kids. They weren't able to be around anybody else can certainly not suddenly But are able to be a at school even and to have success there actually develop friendships with people. What's really awesome to to see that in just the level of calm? That's able to come into a home when that the the center of the storm is able to calm down Tom There there can be really big difference with that And it's for me. You know I will sometimes get calls back from from from people that have worked with me just just recently. I talked with somebody who worked with me a couple of years ago and and they were just checking in and letting me know that everything was going really well and they were grateful to be Really good experience for me to tell you that. Yeah so once you can see that success. You're in we're talking. Forty to sixty sessions or whatever kind of that initial thing is is that kind of it or is there continue Kinda like maintenance situation some people. It is so a Berenson's with the intensive that we do we always do a at last a brain map so we can see. Is this something that we need to keep addressing or do we feel like you need to take a break and see what happens. typically the clients that come Grin Intensive I. I don't actually usually see them again. some of them will go back home and find a practitioner in their area. That will follow the same protocols that I was using in. Just see them once or once a week or a couple of times a month for a while it just to do that maintenance every once in a while we'll have somebody that will come back and do a follow up one week intensive with us It's just it tended depends on on what you're seeing and is there any version. Are there any new traumas that come up for the child. Growing up sometimes can just be a trauma go through puberty beat up it comes up again and so that's that's sometimes when I've seen them come back. Yeah so I love can holistic your approaches and you have this history story of being able to walk with families also using your skills as a therapist and counsellor can create some support around the tool of feedback. my guess is not all practitioners. Maybe have that in their back pocket. So what are some things that families should look for if they're not local to you or they can't come in a two week intensive as we're looking in our local communities for practitioners that are going to be a really good perfect for our families to have these like complex Quetta's with trauma histories. Yeah that's good So a good place to start. Art is the website B. C.. I A. DOT ORG so be. CIA is the the largest of the governing in bodies Ford Neuro feedback and stuff you go to be. CIA Dot Org. There is a tab on there that says finding practitioner. And you put in your zip code in search radius and then you can find somebody that is specifically trained in certified through that organization. So that's a good place to start Look for somebody who let you the free initial consult That's a good indication of therapists. That wants to make sure they're a good match trio if they are willing to talk to another practitioner like for me. Talk to me for instance That's a good sign to that just shows that they're open to learning and and And even if they don't don't know much about attachment issues are they willing to learn about attachment issues and talk to somebody. That does is somebody who is open to the process of it. finds somebody who's it is specifically trained to that website. Yeah and so. Is it also possible or have you ever heard you know. Maybe if a practitioner who doesn't have that that experience in attachment may be working collaboratively with Maybe a family already has like a attachment therapist or trauma therapist who doesn't have nerve feedback back as a tool. Maybe they're talk therapist and then they could. Maybe work together as a team. Canada US yet. Absolutely create your dream. Sarah all right. Thank you so much for all of that information. I know that it's really helpful for folks. We'll we'll have in the show notes. How people can reach out to you or your practice if they want more information I love the idea of the two week intensive because like you said you know. Sometimes it's it's helpful to do something in there that's GonNa take a year and then it also allows people to access you. Who aren't you know right down the street since since you have a lot of experience expertise in this area And like I mentioned if you are listening to the podcast and you want to jump over to the show notes We're GONNA have a little donating from Sarah on kind of what this is. You may already have a brain map from another practitioner and have no idea what it means and so this. We'll help you decode what information you have on like. Sarah said it's really validating. At least it was for me to see in black and white or living color as it is because it's really colorful all of the things that were going on in our children's brains because with kids with that have invisible disabilities with these behavioral symptoms. That can be really hard to remember in our minds that our kids brains really can't do some of the things that we're asking asking them to do so Sarah thank you so much thank you. That was really a great interview. Melissa thank you so so much for inviting her to be on our podcast. Now you have a little bit more personal experience. We were talking about a story from your own family. Do you want to share that. Yeah so grace did by feedback which Sarah mentioned at the beginning as being kind of a bigger umbrella of neuro feedback. And she's to call her brain lean reset Brain reset whenever she was feeling extra. Anxious one of the things that she noticed was that it really improved her sleep and this is a young lady who came to us with super disrupted sleep and then she's still kind of struggles with but biofeedback for her really help that and we all know that for getting good sleep than the trickle down effects for that is huge. Another caveat. I'll say just insurance and part of our story is it's worth it to ask your practitioner. If there's any physical thing with your child that may be able to help you get coverage for Nerf back because Nur feedback is a also medical treatment for things like Like Sarah mentioned epilepsy Z.. Stroke recovery and also Concussion recovery so of course we can't make any claims here but it's worth following up because if it it can be billed as something physical. It will still help your child's brain and you know it might help you get through some of that insurance stuff to make it just a little bit more approachable from my financial perspective. Yeah thank you for sharing that so our show nuts this week. Have lots of things for you first of all. If you go to the show notes there is place where you can request a bonus. Video about brain mapping an extra interview that Melissa did with our guest there will also be L. linked to the big blue cast episodes that Melissa shared and don't forget that we're starting thirty days of hope in January so in the show notes. There's a link to where you can get the book and to the group that you'll want to join so that you can walk with us day by day. Through the month of January and be encouraged courage and built up for the new year as an adoptive or foster parent. You can find the show. Notes at the adoption connection dot com slash. Sixty six. So next week is Christmas Eve and then the week after New Year's Eve and we didn't WANNA take two full weeks off of the podcast So we do. Something can the compromise and reach back into the archives from the early days of the adoption action. PODCAST and bring you two of our most popular episodes so the first episode were releasing is giving voice to siblings and in that one. I interviewed my daughter. Anna rose about being being a kid in a family and adding a bunch of new children through adoption. And it's a really great interview. Hope you'll listen to that. And then the following following week where re-releasing parenting teens and young adults with the future in mind and that was a great conversation. So you know we were just starting back then. We didn't have as many listeners. And we don't want you all to miss these great episodes yeah and siblings and teens are probably the two must come in topics we get asked about so Go be there for you to catch up on as you're going about your holiday tours or traveling with your family so so we will be back with new episodes on January seventh until then have a very very merry Christmas happy New Year. All the things things We are praying that you find little pockets of peace throughout a season that we know can be really challenging. Yes Merry Christmas and we look forward just seeing you in the new decade twenty. Twenty before you go. We'd love to connect with you on social media. You can find us on facebook or Instagram as the adoption option connection. Thanks so much for listening. We love having you if you enjoyed this episode. Please leave a quick review on itunes. It will help us reach more moms. Who may refilling alone and remember until next week? You're a good mom doing good work and we're here for you. The music for the PODCAST is called new day and was created by Lee Roosevelt.

Sarah Jordan Melissa ADHD Idaho facebook US Neuro Kelvin Delta Amazon Condole Skopje Lisa qualls Anna rose Senate Boise Bluecross
Ep. 38  Dr. Maria Adelasia Divona  Champion for Gender Equity

Taking Her Lead

1:04:58 hr | 3 months ago

Ep. 38 Dr. Maria Adelasia Divona Champion for Gender Equity

"When i experienced obstacle challenge on pass it almost shattered glass ceiling in normal kiko. It hurts just national glass ceiling. Wow we literally have to be superheroes the walk through this life. Wild might have been the first. I prayed last Momma she was telling me are we should marry an officer. He'd be so nice who have an officer as a sony et cetera budget. I did something that impacts. I became an officer and she was super proud. You try to explain pink and then they understand. And i'm so glad that we me his mother their mother and their fault that we are able to provide them grow them at then grow with these inclusive. There is nothing. I can't hello listeners. This is taking her lead. I am joshua. Everett mayor. And i'm janina lotto here. We strive to give women a platform to tell their stories and explain how they lead. These conversations. give us unique insights into the impact. Women leadership can make in transforming the way we work and live. Today's interview is with malaysia. Donna joshua about how adalah zia came to be a guest on taking her lead. You know she is heavily. Involved in gender equity issues obviously. It's her job but she's very well connected. Globally and she posts articles from her connections associates around the world fairly frequently that are germane to the issue and i was only didn't simply noticed one of her posts and thought. Oh my gosh this is she is just right at the forefront of this work to promote women and to bring about gender and reached out to her we had a fabulous i zoom chat and i knew just a couple of minutes into it that she'd be an amazing guests and her work is critical. And it's fascinating in the location. Where she's at and how she's interacting with the government there in macedonia but it's her life story that really gripped me and we really hope that it will grip you as well our listeners. I have a soft spot for people whose names have a history and personal story. And so i love hearing hers. There's something special on touching about connections your history and roots. And i'm so glad she shared it with us when i heard her talk about punishing violence against women in the fourteen hundreds. My first thought was how much more we have to accomplish on the seven hundred years later. I know that it'd be hard. I choose to embrace the progress we've made and keep the conversation going about what more needs to be done. It's overwhelming though. It is and i think one of the reasons why we both found her. So courageous is that she gets exactly how it is and keeps putting one foot in front of the other fighting this fight. She's energetic she's delightful and she uses her voice to make a difference without further. Ado please enjoy our guest at allows you devan on taking her lead at allows you welcome to taking her lead. Thank you joe. Shaw for inviting me and had law to you will resign and all listeners. I am just thrilled to be doing this with you. And at our first conversation had a blast hearing a little bit about your story and your perspectives and have a wealth of wisdom regarding gender equity gender issues in the workplace and you're passionate about many things but passionate about effecting change in that area so this is of course our heartbeat taken her lead specifically with regard to women and playing our little part carving the way helping break the glass ceiling and so this is a this is a pleasure all business so generals. Thank you very much. I'm riddick bladder. I hope i can keep the the bar so high. You're going to be fine. Fine thank you. Thank you very much. So let's just start off and if you take a couple of minutes and talk to us about what you currently do. I am currently serving as a senior gender officer. Adele always see mission to skopje. And i don't know if your listeners are probably not familiar. We always see see the largest the security regional organization in the world and they've accounts for fifty seven states going from north america to russia and deborah. Few almost everything in between. Wow yeah i know. I had no idea. I'm glad you said that. Well you know it's sometimes. I guess that the oil seen considered as the poorest among the big international organization if you compare it to u. n. and sure nato for example but still steel and the most important thing is that it is a security devoted organization which is focusing around three main pillars that political-military the economic and environmental and human aspect of so gender. Equality is something cross-cutting the free dimension. Because you can't a comprehensive security without the agenda perspective. I'm sitting in this position since september. Eighteen twenty twenty. Do you remember what aetna september eighteen twenty twenty. Please remind shooting you should. Unfortunately we lost the justice. Ruth bother give thank you. We did a bit on the on the podcast. We talked about it. Oh my goodness. I'm going to edit that out. I don't want anybody to know that. I didn't know thank you know. I mean this was just the way to say that for me was quite a sign. I don't know how to put. It was quite significant for me. That i was taking on my very first assignment gender officer in my capacity in the very same day that she passed away and so i think i will always remember it. I will always remember her for the amount of work that she did for against discount. Women discrimination and and that equality and women's rights. Your can't even there aren't words to really capture the gravity of what she didn't. Wow that's auspicious. That's an auspicious beginning. That's interesting so then you are so your your work is focused on gender equity so it focused on gender equality and gender mainstreaming. What i do is too simple in my my is to brock deeply initiate and deliver the necessary policy advised to the head of mission and to the senior management in order to comply with that or see gender commitments under the free pillars. Basically what we do with scope as the mandate of the missions under the politico-military pillar and the human dimension as much effect. I'm hired under the human. They mentioned department and so my boss is the head of human department on the other side. I also have a hat as agenda focal point for the mission and in that capacity. I responded to the head of mission interesting to buses. Yes it's it's like having to bosses. That's a despite despite that the thing is that i mean Ship we've all the mission members because among my task is abso- main task is provide advice to the center management but also proactively propose agenda inside the overall framework of activities permission. And the first important thing is that that supported the development of agenda competence among the mission members interest so so for context. Your activities are external and internal. Yeah i have to say that safaris has only be internal because the situation is affected by the kobe. The soul so far didn't reach out for any institution outside mine but yes we do. Support the government here. That's what we do about. The government in each and every aspect from supporting to the judicial system will load development. Like the loans volley the knoll on prevention against gender violence and domestic violence. We do a lot of work with the police. For example police there to support the day of training to deal with gender based violence human trafficking trafficking human being but those revenging encountering by your antics and all these things they they do have agenda because you know these are the kinds of areas of field of work that do usually are maala dominated this type sir. I mean we use this comprehensive approach and we can't have a comprehensive approach without taking of the gender aspects of a new situation that's complex. There's a lot going on there not of work to do. Especially when you have to deal with you know. Contra differences for example take into consideration that this county is composed by several ethnic groups of which the majority are musk original macedonians and than alban's which are the minority so two languages non. Not you have cultural differences. You have different religions. Because you haven't orthodox sir the macedonian side and the muslims on their size and everything that is in between because they are a different social among the differencethis. Right nuanced accurate. I want to go a little bit into some of the particular initiatives that you're involved in but what is your job look like day to day i'd allows you know meetings lots of lots of. Hey here's another one. Almost let's say are. The week is panting. The meeting sunday there is the organization is doing a lot of work right now on gender so they are provide the nonce with lots of opportunities from vietnam which we were the criteria. The based and from barsov aware now got big branch of organizationto needs of the year. We have over this chances to improve our gender capacity to grasp ideas around northern tool. Do a better job in the field. The operations where we are posted what they did for example in the last week is less sucrose. But focusing on supporting. My new colleague said the new commerce. We have people coming and going almost every moment. Assault or see a non non-career organization so we have quite a high level of turnover so one of my task. He's sparta micro colleagues especially. The new one provide bamboo agenda perspective. What the mission is doing in terms of gender equality also support them in development in developing their project management objectives saw the gender. I fought that they won't put in their day to day. Work is so iodide. Gotta couple of doom meeting with our new colleagues and the other thing is that did this week his prepare. The drafting started the drafting of the gender activity. Plan for twenty twenty one. Which is something that i i. Don't do alone me alone. Nine a to use less professional. I made that my colleagues to my work. So i started to these nord actively plan. We've all the things we need to do and say awful. The plan is related to projects that each and every unity's romeo inside that the mission mandate from my side. I need to take care of the training. The gender agenda related training both my colleagues soil. So had these couple of conversation. We've that child department in order. Prioritise the needs of my colleague. Symptoms of gender. How many staff at the mission in macedonia around one hundred forty three poll of which of thirty our internationals and you can find the all the capital professional basically human rights experts. I mean my local colleagues. They are experts in low for example but they are also expert in security and international law are most dealing with the supervisory role the middle management roles so they around the local stuff that makes sense. Thank you tell me a little bit about early experiences in your life. That had an effect on your path. You could be as a child as an adolescent things that really impacted your ultimate trajectory. So i grow up as i can't say that grow up as a bully and selfish barrels. It's anonymous coming out. I think it was. The consequence of sort of isolation is soft a safra doing kindergarten and primary and primary school. The finger ed is. That was a big child of physical compared to the other seoul was keen sense and nobles literally as the elephant in the room. I was mostly excluded. I mean i was five another look like eight or nine so to say is when i started to take advantage of my physical super your it team and had an aggressive emboli attitude the and then when i was twelve i mean i was so big that The feminine doctor always push my parents to send me to do any kind of sport. He wanted me get some money around in order to avoid to get fat or or an obese child saw when i was i matt Hannibal trainer spar and the team. Live a at me in almost civilized. human being. I have to say. I learned to play to win. Learned to focus on my objectives. Learn how to be defeated and look back at the mistakes and i learned to rise again after being defeated. The handball was my life four. Almost twenty years. Oh my goodness now. I played as a professional humble player. In the i league goalkeeper. I also played in the national team for similar year. And that would give me the chance to travel around europa eighteen. When i wanted a now. If i compare my solution to those of my classmates. I had travel the also. You know my goodness. That's how it was amazing. It was Is probably the thing that made me what i am right now because it gave me par and community imagine your teammates teammates community life and leaving as a family. Because you can imagine. I left my father. I was living with my parents until eighteen by the from fourteen to eighteen. They barely so me the house. I bet the better. Because i was always out called the matches on with training in corinth and when i was very young was spending all the categories was claiming and the union league and was playing on saturday. I went to play with the. I league and i was sitting in the bench looking at all the amazing player at that time us pipe changed now but it really shaped the mine existence in a sense it also taught me about what discrimination means because i was short that i was doing a professional sports live but it was not like that because immediately professional. Sports is not recognised adult. So we don't have this sense of being a pro exports. It was quite you know i had. I had a chance to taste the feeling of discrimination. Because i used to be rid in the best. I was very young. Got married another. Hannibal player was playing in the i league. And he was blaming the secondly hemi was earning more money in that i was earning and actually it was not an early was an allowance. Call it what you want. But it was money. I mean i got leaving aback. Gave me the chance to go to the university to buy the car. You know that stuff. And so i really wasn't able to make up my mind. Why are you earning doubled. What american. I mean doesn't make any sense why you didn't ask her won anything in your life and everything. What's the difference. I am the winner. He were not why you are earning much more money than the money. That doesn't make any sense. I was probably not aware about the meaning of discrimination because For me was like got the equality and gender equality in the article. Three of the constitution saw in sardinia in italy. I'm talking about. They tell daytime constitution. Dinner is another thing broke so in italy it's there. It's in the constitution. The constitution saw a. Why do you have to fight for equality. Wendy is something that the constitutionally strapped into you know. I can tell you something. I was doing my pitch the end that certain point do paternity for research. Assignment came out one of the professor. He offered me these research assignment as soon as this proposal. Come out they immediately took it back. And the reason was that there was a kalita. Good that just got married. And he needed to support his family saw the priority was given to him because he was just married and his wife. He had a wife by the nobody thought about me. Young women us jus- coming out from a divorce without the any resource center support myself on my career and of course i was needing their research site. Yeah yeah it wasn't me the so what's the basis i mean. I know that my my cultural talent countries have communistic culture. So the mail is that bruce stop was at in. You know as soon as you start to grow up on the stand the mechanism of senior stand. What the discrimination he is because feel on your own skin but until you failure in your own skin. You're not understanding the other thing. The really shaped my path was this international master in public policy that i took it was quite an novelty for program and it was based on the just to pedagogy. Yeah jesuits yeah yes. We've talked about that. We have this thing in common. I have nine years of jesuits ten years of jesuit school. How many how no only two. He was on that myself and my spirit one father and my to torah back then. The big colt me. Like a jesuit sister because it was a privilege to have to occasion in a sense because despite being a living in a catholic county in walls and not completion confessional education in a sense course the mostert in public policies was raised ethical issues because the ethics as focused on just retired but that was back then was the first time that i was faced with gender equality issues and i was exposed to the meaning of either. She was funny. As soon as i was a rolling programme and i went through the first glasses and that was asked to write down paper it was the for the very first bury my life so i wrote down. This paper was about unconditional. Busy can come so i went into my tutor. Who was a jesuit tonto. Apologised and i was so happy because i was sure that you know how much my my job. My paper was super good. So i went to him live with the paper in his was started reading it and then he made that paper bowl out of my paper and throw it into the paper boston and then you know. I was fuming us. At what the hell are you doing and you say well you know we all know here that you are a super and always student but now we need you could take how the best out of yourself you need to be that all sort of euroleague products and i didn't understand the meaning of such. I understand it later on. The muster was made up to educate the community leaders. In the for this reason i also received a fellow cheaper from the saqawa young leaders fellowship found which is a found belonging to talk. Your from foundation in japan belongs to the were family. They do a lot of educational law support. The around the world like eighty eighty and county nice additions around the world and gave me a chance to go to university of california san diego to take a postmaster training so you had the climate and you went to southern california. That is not fair. that is not fair. it wasn't awfully you know. I didn't want to go there because i was never the past the final. Us so was looking for a program like go to sweden have a summer training in sociology. Because i was having my society saw. That's what i want. The but nobody from northern utah at the something welcoming any program to welcome union. And then when i wrote the mail to you see as ucsd. They wrote me back because they are also receiver of this sakala young leader now. So that's the reason why now so back to the paper that he crumpled up and what he was trying to convey. Yeah so the thing. Is that that program was based on a different concept of leadership so leadership in the western says we use having some is based on having someone who is able tween to us the followers for a common goal for the organization or whatever the goal is and this is a very pragmatic western way to say think so it might provide limited the perspective of what the jets. We've done this leadership program. Thought me is that. I be to be Of my own action. This concept dog Outdoor shaper instead of leadership. It's based on what kind of relationship there in between the leaders and followers saw easy authority relationship will come in Yeah yet sense. Nor even latin out for an authority have the same. That's why the kind of leadership. I've been told that experience a paper fraud. The paper basket is older shape and the message was to and our waiver with many talents. And you need to put the both stalin's perserve robbers and nine hundred ninety nine darsur. You are developing a relationship you will be able to support them and become alcoa themselves. Salt bet was the message. That was the message of the paper thrown in the paper dramatic. But i can see it now. I mean i don't know. But i guess that the poster of your Education was in the same thing work. Yup absolutely highly relational. I mean yeah. That's where i got my start as well. The same that same foundational principle so i didn't now for and to be restored. Take responsibility because everything is shaping is shaped around the taken responsibility of what you do the responsibility of your action but also responsibility towards the people that are around you and this is the sense of being a community baroness. Were there people who influenced your journey as well mentors or sponsors or friends parents who had an impact on you yes. Of course. I have. But i think that me myself and i wear the great importance of my of my my bed but yes jokes bars. I don't think i would have been able to do. Do something meaningfully. My life without my stubbornness and my assyrian seem in one on one side and the support of the people around me on the other side and this is another less learn. Because i always fold that i am nasa and i can do everything i want on my own but this is not the truth. I mean if i was able to do what i did is because behind me. I had a bunch of greek women all my friends that despite the fact that moving around the world that they are always there there with me and checking manson barton me and also my masters for example guide. The death row my paper in the buster. My spiritual father an amazing woman who is my mentor. I met her fans have name. But i doubt she's from slovenia. I met her in twenty in gender training in austria and was like lava lava sites. We were both interested in gender issues are not agenda polity fighters and the wheel saw. Sheriff this Patient or yard me. She was working for the ministry of defence. Since and i was just about to approach a short pather the die that the head is a service woman and breida far. Sheasby my lighthouse. She the kind of person i would like to become. She's really harnessed and journal. Rosa end open person and she's always there to help others without asking anything in return but then when she needs to ask something and when she asked something is never for itself but always for those surrounding her. She's able to ask in a very noble and influencing way of she's got a style in the and i i'm so j.lo's i always thought i. I wish i could be able to do the things the way you do it. And she recently started to say the serpa. I was gonna say interactions that. I've had with you so far. I'm seeing that but you have your own opinion. No i know all right. I'm sorry because a leading for me is always said one of my drivers and learning from. It's something amazing. Saw at don't ever feel like i reach the finish line and they know everything. I always feel the need to be supported guided and to be not to micromanage it of course about the someone that can show me the options in sense and then have my own reflection on the options and take my league. You spent much of your life in italy but you were born in sardinia. Yes so. I have These regents. I think that i was blessed because saturday night. An amazing island. The second-biggest is on the mediterranean. It's quite renew the phone. His the for the beautiful beach see nato. Why that set. That up of course is one of the twenty regions in italy but there is quite a different history. Different jail girl. She because he's the answer center emerged land in the mediterranean sea and the language is different because we got this own our own language separate and different from italian and we were. I can say like colonized by italians. And this make our indentity as sardinians quite because there and one of the difference for example is that the sardinia always had the microcosm society saw women enjoyed unequal status. Seen the ages of times so when was the constitution drafted in sardinia. The constitution was the first constitution. I thinking europe. I don't want to be wrong. Combat both out the first constitutionists are geena davis. Back to fourteen ninety two so we didn't have kingdoms. We have the so-called the judge plays so we we had the judge's ruling on the region was divided into four kingdoms ruled by judges. We have any story of Familiar judges like that is there was one of the first dub judges eleven ninety s. Are you named for her. I am name from migra mo who was living in the village where the casanova bolaze is located. Wow okay that's fabulous that's fabulous okay. Please go on now. Fourteen ninety two judge elianora about voting in one of the judge and she came out with this constitution which is called the the cartha place like the money the magna carta the place. Let's say she did something amazing. She disciplined the the treatment of the rape perpetrators. Which is something. that's profound. Yeah yeah can you imagine in fourteen ninety two someone thinking about how to discipline the treatment of the rape perpetrator. That's included varnish meant that Restoration berry conciliation approaching. That was so advanced saw fans and we had example. Amazing women have been so for me is we were talking about when when we talk a first time is something that i always bring bring with me. I mean bring my leg together with the italian flag. But it's my high mocked high matesa gentlemen conception coming home. The romanticism appear via the end. The concept related related to have in these small homeland. So i've got my my motherland my motherland. Which is. but i also have my high marco. Which is abby now and this is a huge part of my identity as an italian. When did you move to italy. How old were you. I've moved from island to island. Because i moved to sicily when it was almost nineteen to play handball saw. I found the team there. They promise made that. I could attend the university. There saw i won. There stayed there for like thirteen years and then went to. I'm after thirteen years. I moved to northeast. Italy infuriates julia region. Which is another high up and other homeland because as scott the almost the many of the that selena's like as on its own language. I was there for ten years of working as a consultant for stations and then moved to north. Oh with it. Northwest italy where the nato which is located close to stay there around for years. And then i moved to you from beautiful place to beautiful place to beautiful Yeah i was very lucky in. The sense of namibia was quite an experience. I won't always dreamt about africa. United nation gave me the chance to go and work there when there we under you and the initiative as a gender technical adviser for the gender responsive budget off the country so basically it was devising the government of in how to distribute and allocate resources in a fair way based on the needs of men women girls and boys and i spent a one year and a half of working. We were you indiana women. The county totally copter man. A piece of minorities there because the people are meeting the county's a something that seem it south of the bitter root so you don't know much about that but a huge county landscape it's fables there was the first time for me covering Safari in sahara expedience was the challenging professional experiencing in a sense. Sometimes frustrating rights of women are still violated. The much more than you will on you have to face. The reality of things is like i was just arrived then. A girl was found in gutter saw. She disappeared they found the was just two days after my arrival ahead and went to these marcher protest led by the prime minister which was a woman the fight of the african women for the rights to something that stronger than our fight because they lack the basics. I mean at least we in in the worst developer. Were we got the basics. Wake up the right cup for education. We got the right to record Out not everywhere. Look at this happening right now in london for example. We've abortion. These are things that are locking down there. There is so much work to do and they need a lot of support but steeler male dominated environment the despite the fact that for example county like namibia. They got the disappointed Zebra system they alternate the in debt major party which is the biggest than almost only team the county. They have these zebra systems so they alternate the woman for every position. So usually you have in the government position. If the minister is amanda. Deputy minister is a woman on the permanent secretary. Secretary is the same. They alternate the mainland woman but still the voice of african women. They still dylan hair. But i can tell you. They're putting a lot of fourteen what they do. Y what an experience if you could choose one particular initiative that you're currently working on that you're very passionate about one program. What would that be. I am our team to six months in my current position. So i'm still in the exploration. But there was an initiative that promoted as soon as i arrived and i was supported in this initiative by gender working because in my capacity of gender focal point. I share the gender would group which is composed by police commune almost from all the unions. So one thing is that the i propose what convinced inspirational john. Legacy bides every two weeks and michael me and my colleagues we write about something that related to the work that we do as mission and we relate the work we do as a mission what is happening outside the mission away. Simple revolving commission realization and the we touched upon several topics like us over gender sensitive inclusive language we wrote about the role of male allies. Which is something that i really been not in the highest consideration especially in this assignment doing right now because i'm lucky enough. Were ahead of lesion. Which is May lie because he's a father of free so he's really aware of gender equality means and so he is a big commitment. He was one of the founder of the malays on networking organization in the organization. So i quite luckett weather As so we touch upon the male allies with agenda gender inclusive insensitive language. I touched the ball now was less time now. I don't remember but for example this week. Good that bites. That are coming out on tuesday. They are about something that is affecting macedonia right now and it is these public room scandal. Basically is a chat group on belgacom. Were seven thousand. Men are sharing features all women under underage girls. Or you know the kind of cyber crime that it's very difficult to tackle here so one of the things that we are doing right now is who subsidize the mission members on what we can do about. Didn't with such an issue what we can propose at the host country in which way because supported that host-country because sometimes these kinds of things that they are not on the agenda and then they come out. And you don't have the means in terms of police judiciary system to tackle them didn't steps the mission. Yeah exactly exactly so. This is something where we can provide our contribution for example one thing. That really made me proud. Is that wanted to send out the survey my colleagues Understand if these gender legacy bites they are working or not. I mean we are putting forth in south in use it to really reaching our colleagues our colleagues emission members interested in the topic so we are touching. It was amazing. Because i receive a couple of games are really encouraging the same. Nah sarah quite an eye opener for us. So i think i will keep on. We carry on me and the gender working louisville carry on with this initiative and now one of the things that we want to put in the agenda with no song harassment. Because i think that we don't speak about that. I don't think that having Single online training can help you to understand the problem and the root of the problem. Indeed we were discussing about doing something about about that and the other thing that i really want to focus my attention as a professional inside. The mission is to iran gender. Auditing gender auditing young agenda routing insider that the organization. This is why. I recently been certified by international. Liberal mutation has a participatory gender routed facility. So my idea Some resource. I i mean i need to look look for resources to do. It is run agenda albertini mission to scope in order to process our organization and procedures so understanding if we really do. We were best Interacting gender shoes on restraining gender into our baseline analysis guide thousand toward the development over better service to the country. Will that pave the way for a similar assessment of the country. Well it is something that the county should the request. We are here to support the county not to tell the county walker. They should gotcha interesting. We are here to support them when they request our support where there. But the onus schipa is there thank you for the work. You're doing that's really it's really important. What are you most hopeful for with regards to women and influence and women in leadership. I wish women has a seat on the table. The centers that comes to my mind user britain. Don't give you a seat at the table. bring share. but i'm fed up of bringing hold insure with me. And i'm fed up with all to that. The next generation of women will have to bring for insure with them us. Just accept the book. We mun me to stand up for what they deem important. Whatever it may be because sometimes what's important for a single woman can become important for someone else this says. I guess that women leadership need to embrace responsibility fide to twelve responsibility and be accountable and transparent. I think as women this is our added value take responsibility and be accountable and avoiding mediocrity that second largest almost Doing a lot of work on now mediocre leadership and men Reaching the highest places without being competent enough for on the because of their confidence. I think that we should strive to avoid the mediocrity and always say excellence which doesn't mean to be perfection because perfection is only a waste of time and is dangerous and it's toxic because a lot of time in time in trying to be perfect which means seemed perfect for the way that other especially men considers prospection. The other thing is that we need who beyond despite the we can be strong woman. I mean i. I think of myself as very strong woman but it took me time to understand that i need to be humble clerk is something that the start to do in recent years. I never did. Even the best. And i can tell you that. Probably diese choice of not asking helper and we never think by myself. A harvard my in my path in a sense because i didn't build up. Networks was the running around as a stray dog and in a sense these Slow down my my. We can expect us to solve our problems on our own. There are times in life and worker in our professional careers that we need to ask for two and god side and ask the people that you consider as as a valuable asset. What can we do together. Not what can you do for me. But what can we do together to solve this. This is what. I wish farm. If this interview is between you and your self at the age of nineteen what would you say. What would you tell yourself. Well you know this is an exercise that my career coach asked me to do last year and spent a two full days writing a letter to my younger so because it was a lack of reflection so basically many things that i just told you. Stop being angry. So i think would be stopper to make a comparison. There is nothing harms armful and toxic as a making comparison to sit well with the situation of other. Our other women just work harder than find a better weight web yourself and support others. Stop being at bouncer. Stop beth sponsor that i had. I used to have this Tank at your answer. I really love these direct confrontation and crashing. It was really my my cup of tea with something better. But then i really reading my my personal story one of the things that i accept the as just don't from my ex husband is he used to say me. You know i. I've always been a fighter. Saw was fighting against does more or less than the biggest injustice that came across my life and he always used to say february time. You encounter a stone your you kick it off you kick it away every time. You need a new pair of shoes and this is unless under. Because i learned a different way in dealing with issues and problems. I still a law direct confrontation from time to time but i still have a summer reminiscent of these way of shifting my position and defended and causing clashes and conflicts inside the setting up the stage for diallo. I learned with time but this is not the way things were aware that i still need to work on this kind of thing so this is the biggest recommendation that could give to my younger son. You've touched on this a couple of times. But are there particular challenges you faced as a woman that you would like to explain a little bit more detail in your life that have perhaps giving you the impetus to what got you into gender equity really. I mean what. What are some of the challenges you faced. How did they give you the passion to do that. Everything comes out the front data paper phone in that paper bosca because that was the chance that mike tutor had to tell me in this paper. You're talking ignoring the feminist perspective and the might apply was i need the feminist perspective because equality gender qualities in the constitution. So i don't need it. why communists. They're angry wash. You talk youngest too stupid stupid okay. Okay and so. I'm thinking that he did was to overwhelm my email. Inbox with like one under the feminist paper on the feminist perspective on the basic income and scientists arrived the readout this papers and take out my own sites on stock to reflect. Not the maybe this feminist despite the huckabee are too angry they are right and then something happened because when a finnish might be started to work as a consultant. I took committees Angry angry feminist perspective. And it didn't take me anywhere. I can tell you. I mean it's useful one way you have people that are on the same page. So you don't have to be the tanqueray Made for in convincing people but it's totally useless especially in may dominated environment and he's not the kind of off to the for example. You can have inside. The army saw. Join the army as a reserve officer while concurrently has with your consultancy. Yeah because in italy we have The system is quite different from us. So in italy the armed forces they take on neom sir. We require expertise. They bring civilian sombor the but the bingaman borders officers by all means to saw. I went through a selection process. And then i went to the army school and a at a very basic army training and then i was. I was employed. My first employment was so it's basically you are hired the for short that simon usually six months but they can last longer than that so. The first assignment was a military researcher in the conflict. Study center of the army and then the second one. I will suppose that as the social analyst inside the nato each north than nato rapid deployable corp seat being assila by trade i was hired as a social anonymous inner team where my two colleagues a one was a political analyst and the other one was uneconomical wearing a uniform was my dream as for me was something extremely important because i was coming from mom. My father was a carbonated which is law enforcement. Yes it's the law enforcement something that the. Us is quite loose about the because quite peculiar law enforcement and that the us you are taking some example from the way becca caveat cayman functioning. Yeah especially because of all the violence from the police side but anyway because we don't usually say usually we don't have that kind of stuff but coming back to them. I mean i can remember. I was five years old. When i was telling i want to be. You know the classical question when they ask you. What are you going to be when you grow up. And i said Cla in a feminine former. Which doesn't i mean didn't exist by the time but was gender back bam using agenda language interesting and and everybody was telling. No you can't pick near the women can be coming at it. And say i would be one and my mom. She was telling me are. We should come. Marion officer be so nice to have an officer as a son-in-law cetera than i did i did something better than that. I became an officer and she was super proud. And when a join that assignment in seat thirty the think was that the my voice was totally unheard. So we had these recurrent meetings of by the time i was the only female officer in the hq saw was sitting in these meetings romo. We went under fifty man saddam in me. I was supposed to have to speak because my all day doing research about the the social situation situation in middle east to north africa. And i never had the chance to report it and it was so frustrating and the reason was that one. I was a reserve officer about the most important there was a woman so they didn't consider my my stance so i think that to prove that worth it was working so hard about the problem. Is that the despite the fact that that was worth working super high was not until one day after meeting that that wasn't able to speak unto provided information was requested that went into the deputy chief of planning sign said. Look if you don't need my work. I'm here only to steal my salary. Justin me my calm. I need to stay here. you know. And that was arguing with this guy. He was a lieutenant colonists and then that shift blind columnist from colored communists. Say what's the problem here as sir and we are having to meetings a week and i was never able to provide my perspective on these things and what said you know took me on side and he asked what was the metal. We've you say look. I'm here to work on your not allowing me to my work and that can prove that my work is valuable and said okay every day before a meeting you go and you send the your worker to my deputy and he is not letting you speaker. Put your fist on the table. And tell him that. You have to speak because you are valuable information in he. He's not listening to you as the last resort. That just come to me. Because i am the only one allowed the say who has the right to speak or not and from that moment on i was speaking in the meeting every single time and i had the of the in front of my door because they understood that they had denied with me. Wow so he's an ally. Yeah and the fingers if you don't build a sheep especially in a male environment made the minute environment as the woman. You're not going that far. Unfortunately unfortunately the other thing is that the whatever the environment you are in you need to establish a good network over relationship because along. You're not going anywhere. you're probably get faster so we're bucknell along. The long run takes time to establish network. Yeah wow that's impactful but yes but yes it takes time but the you know the outcomes must you are able to build a relationship and sheep. The outcomes are good for everyone. Not only for you so it sounds like over time. Your focus has become more and more on gender equity and gender equality from the broader perspective is sociology that that be accurate. Now it took Took me sometimes. I cook me to get my hands dirty. Who say things are are stand and to understand that something was awry and to put my first and this is now my passion is my life might. Vision is the perspective that Never seen a do the perspective perspective that i have as a tool kits boys eight hive. It's my perspective one on one. One year he was like five. Say i don't want a pink pink glass because pink is awful and i said that the corals for everyone if you don't want the big lassie you're not going to drink anything that work and it's arguing with with him when he was saying because kids are influenced by their peers especially in kindergarten one. The it came back girls can do sport. can you imagine. And the momma emitted said you're anti she was spot champion and you say now away like these non they call me back and say but it's true that you were at a handle say yes but so this is to say that the can do sport as well as i say my goodness what. I tried to explain than than they understand. And i'm so glad that that we me his mother their father their mother and their that we are able to provide them with grow them out and grow with using perspective. There is nothing that girls can talk. i'd allows. You is so honest and sincere about who she is. I absolutely loved her response to how she would garter younger self. Her approach to conflict and the use of anger was such a helpful perspective and her description of cultivating a mindful and intentional approach to influence was spot on. Of course i love the part about hearing how she's grown through. Having an executive coach thought that that was great she. She talked about how strong she was as a child. And how that in some ways gotten her way. She was born a pioneer strong woman. You know just pushing. And she hasn't stopped to this very day. And i'm sure she won't until the very end of her life she just. This is how she was written full of passion and her desire for goodness in the world her enthusiasm and she has the bright that bright laughter which is just you know addicting to listen to. It's it's a wonderful actually. I love her laugh. Yeah she just. She's constant moving the needle through the work that he does in skopia and obviously around the world so it was a pleasure having her. And i'm hoping you'll think so to your support of the show takes us closer tour goal of creating a wide reaching platform for women to share their unique stories. We'd love to hear your thoughts and reactions to our guests at taking her lead dot blueberry dot net. That's b. l. u. b. r. y. Net you can also follow us on twitter. At her under sport taking please subscribe rating review the show on youtube or on your favorite podcast platform. your support makes a difference in how discovered by our listeners. For those of you who are tracking with us and sharing in our success because of your support sharing the love of women's stories. We are now downloaded in close to sixty countries credible yay and so we really appreciate everyone. Who's been sharing and making it happen for us. I'm for you very very grateful. If you're interested in knowing more about our guest at allows you to vote you can find her on lincoln. Also please hop over to our youtube channel to view livestreaming episodes of our upcoming guests and those livestream on mondays of course at various times because our guests are all over the world and then those are recorded and put up again within about ten minutes. So you can view them later and as well as those Episodes will be edited and the audio will be available here on our podcast platforms. You can also follow are taking her lead page on lincoln where you can receive notifications about coming guests and as always we appreciate you sharing the podcast sharing the links to those events and episodes with network and asking your connections to share it as well so for all the women who are leading influencing in their daily life and for you her making an impact in the world around you sharing the best version of yourself. He make a difference. This is janine accomplish lotto extra leading from where you are and from who. You're this is joshua everett mayor.

italy macedonia Donna joshua adalah zia nato sardinia matt Hannibal jesuit school handball janina sakala devan manson barton skopje migra mo elianora matesa aetna alban
The Belle poque | Haute Cuisine & the Tour de France

Can We Health You?

1:01:36 hr | 8 months ago

The Belle poque | Haute Cuisine & the Tour de France

"Welcome to our podcast. Can we help you episode seven. My name is alice lloyd. Nutritional therapy practitioner. And i'm leslie ornoff a registered yoga instructor and we today are talking about the belle epoch period france yes in france specifically yes yes yep Kinda like the gilded age i guess would be comparable or is a gilded age but big bill epoch. Wouldn't you say the same period It was a period of high artistic and cultural development It literally means beautiful age and has given to the period in france from the end of the franco prussian war in eighteen. Seventy one to the start of world war one in nineteen fourteen During this time between the wars the standards of living and security for the uproar upper middle classes increased it became a golden age compared to what was behind them in what we know now laya had another war had no idea. They were like living up this summer. Time to take. Did you say about technology. Technology is advancing in seattle as well. Yeah absolutely are as you'll say Cuisine will bray could zine yummy. French cuisine Well so yeah. We now to that the belt up the expression talk. was only applied to that era. In retrospect as a way of highlighting the decadence exuberance and frivolity that hidden mines the hetty era before the outbreak of world. War one. Okay know they weren't like they weren't like living in the moment being right saying yeah right now it was. Yes after which i'm guessing. Probably the gilded age the same way right they probably lived through it and then look back on it with a certain sense You know look that fine time You know kind of the stall with a sense of gently. I'm thinking During this belle epoch period there are a lot of notable people that kind of existed in redoing things Marie curie and her husband were working in the realm of physics and they won a nobel prize in one thousand nine three so they were chemists. Physicists monet who is dubbed. The founder of french impressionist painting was in giverny france painting lily pads sunday pulled landscapes other notable artists of the day. Were renoir degas. Cezanne picasso moved to paris in nineteen thousand four matisse and monk were also Kind of doing their thing at that. Time fred. Excuse me freud. Rather not from read. Floyd nici were expounding on psychological principles during this time period though they were not in france epa guy but they existed so. I'm sure their ideas were kind of penetrating. I'll sharon was think movement was becoming a little more. You know readily available. Yeah of course. They're all in europe. So you would think that this closer together. Abby exchange of ideas would probably happen chiro rally and guesting so we'll no wonder they call it the beautiful age all those artists. Yeah amazing artist. That alone makes it makes it. The beautiful Wow so as this time brought much glamour glitz to france. The quality and quantity of food also improved so became the hot cuisine or grand cuisine Which is still a term today. So did that is that when the term visitors became. Yeah yeah all right. So this is the cuisine of high level establishments gourmet restaurants in luxury hotels. So haute cuisine is characterized by detailed preparation. An elaborate presentation often served elegantly in multiple courses at a very high practice. So all this upper-class people i mean it was like a gift to them almost. Everybody was super excited them. You know interested in this kind of like up level rain. give them a certain sense of superiority. This era also emphasized that how and why of cooking thereby distinguishing itself from regional cuisines which tended to instead emphasized the traditions of cooking developing out of political and social changes in france. This high cuisine represented a hierarchy in the seventeenth century that only the privileged seventy two seventeenth century. That's wrong thankfully await wenli back to the nineteen nine with Foods like tom. Caviar Serving foods out of season. That was been sense. Yeah showing showcasing elaborate kids not at fran. In france actually performing elaborate in difficult recipes all characterize this style of the time the leg. yeah In addition to who was eating what hope cuisine can be defined by who was making it. And how this when professionally trained chefs came into the picture so prior to they weren't professionally training. They may just intern do something or they like the Yeah of the professional chefs were bubbling at the surface this timeframe when there were people that were willing to pay for a higher level. The chefs also became higher level. Okay tonight any demand. yeah Okay so they were quintessential to the birth of the style of cuisine made up so they made kind of extravagance during this time required fine ingredients time equipment in therefore money cycle. Can i ask a question. 'cause you said tongue right. Yeah gross to me. And i know the awful like the brand broke sweet sweetbreads. When i found out sweetbreads matt i was likely around your client that i know now. Kind of upper level incorporates. What would previously considered peasant food rang. Kind of the weird stuff has. It's only eight because they didn't tell you animal he and he'll say the good cuts to the wealthy people So is that kind of when the started or do you now. It seems like tongue. Why would they eat that voluntarily. People i get an sorry if i out by the same with caviar. They're bringing a foods that were previously sort of like underutilized. Or like you said used by the lower class and elevating South finer ingredients around the item. Or maybe the the the time. The brands the wassall. We talked about another episode ads. Like a rate like raised. Yeah banner So the quality of the pieces of more exotic ingredients so farming kind of improved maybe the growing of the animals themselves at tiffany's like it. Yeah because the shafts now are becoming more demanding quality Because there people there to pay the price they're yeah they're charging us exorbitant. Yeah fees and they need to be able to back it up riot with their money. Yeah especially if. I'm not so cool that they're bringing in foods from out of season right. Like i think a chef now might not do that. Somebody well no. I think it's kinda frowned upon. Yeah better for us to eat in the right. Yes of course yeah but to do something like unique. It's hard to gap I think was something that defined the time. Yeah okay makes sense. Yeah upping the ante. Yeah for sure so so. There are but a handful of chefs from this time that are steer still revered today. Like they're in. The show are in textbooks for school. Yeah so chef. Anton koran was an early proponent of this elaborate style of cooking. He is often considered one of the first internationally renowned celebrity shouts and is known as The cook of kings and the king of folks. Oh nice title is catchy however it is chef. A goose iskafi a who modernized karam's complex and ornate style stuffy. A was a famous french chef restaurant tour and culinary writer who popularized updated traditional french cooking methods interesting. So you can i ask. When did the michelin system come into play. I don't know not at this time. Not here yeah okay but they would have been michelin starred chefs. Oh my likely absolutely. Yes yeah i created where the show you know. Somebody might he. I'm not sure exactly when that started but they would be. Were like the. They're like the chefs that now earned the michelin star right. There sounds every show. Yes one hundred. And so that's the reason was wondering yes you know dirty every getting ratcheted up like let's go ahead and start you know reading our chefs. I don't know when it started to comment. Yeah so yeah. He was he he was kind of like. There's there's a handful of chefs. Now that are well-versed in hotel. Restaurant adams writing or tv. You know there. There's just a handful of them that are like that. Have all of these talents. Lia like a triple threat Super bowl so this is coffee. A is so any was three eminent figure. Oh yeah he enjoyed and learn about him in culinary school really. You'll see my to linda in my little thing so he is coffee. He worked in london and paris. He was good friends with the guy. Ritz who was so you know. This is all happening in the eighteen. Ninety s and early nineteen hundreds that ritz crackers to i don't think so disappointed circumference hotels and crackers. So this this guy. He was born in a small town near niece in eighteen forty six. His culinary career began each thirteen in his uncle's restaurant and he continued straight through until his death at age. Eighty nine thirty five. Wow along the this is not surprising to me. I mean this is the life of all. I think good chefs. They become good at a very unaided. Yeah and they just boom the psych standing in a kitchen you know probably standing for all those times good for them. It health wise. You know what i'm saying. And then yeah and they're eating done eating but they're eating quality food. Yeah it's an interesting lifestyle for sure it's intense is not your so he spent in his yon like young teen years too early. Twenty s. He spent seven of them in the army stationed throughout france. His army experiences led him to study the technique of cannon food so cool yeah and he was actually like the chef. At one of the station's not surprising. Yeah yeah he is also the creator of the brigade system in a formal kitchen which also likely stemmed from his military training fascinating. Yeah okay so for those. That don't know. The brigade system brought a spencer organization to the kitchen. Like everybody has their own. The action right. Yeah you know where. I learned about the brigade system. Where gordon ramsay in up in hell's kitchen your which i love watching At all the time But yeah so. What about the debate and everybody being on united make sense. It seems like it would be a more efficient way to prepare multiple meals absolutely. Yeah so yeah Before he had such an influence in the industry kitchens were rambunctious and loud jerking on. The job was like common. Skopje brought this professionalism to the line right so the brigade the brigades day cuisine system delegates like you're signing specific responsibilities to members of the kitchen team so this is why they're called shifted cuisine. Sous chef saucier is the person that does sought ray Is the person that does fash. Ci the roasting station automatically the entrees Kobe is an assistant cook. Lubiani is the vegetable armijo cold Pace during these are all like words in my everyday language of my husband. Bright so these words that we use even though we're americans and we could delay apps and desert you. We still use those french terms. Oh my god. Yeah and i love kitchens. All of those terms have you yes Except for maybe the assistant heard me pull me becoming that so funny because some like when you're young chef and you you'd wanna get these jobs and really university way and when you get a job as a company But yeah it's a big deal. Yeah means you're on your way to shop often. Select the little puny job right but make sure this is up guys. Got a chef excited to learn all the different you're shadowing it's an apprenticeship shadowing genuine and all the positions really then you can be like i really wanna be a you pick the kind of positions that you wanna focus later yeah The good communists will do every position in the kitchen. I mean i would think that he would in order to be good at your job. It's like working formula roundup. Yep yep absolutely fascinating yeah so. It is referred to as the emperor of the world's kitchens and is best known for defining french cuisine and dining during this period boxes. Like his his pirin. Skopje did much to enhance their enhance grand cuisine by his predecessor koran while skopje credits him with with providing foundation for french cooking escapee is the one who simplified the flavors dishes and garnishes in my mind. Khurram seems like more like a crazy like artists. All over the place. skopje. I kinda like honed. Him down and simple. Some of which you think would be better not only for preparation. He'd like militarized kitchens interesting. Yeah sounds like was necessary. Yeah for sure but you think it took to hold it down simplifying. It would be good not only preparation to keep things moving then. Also you don't want a whole lot necessarily you know you only a few things nicely together. Yup in my opinion yeah chef but in my own cooking you know not to go to bananas with anything absolutely no simplicity. Yes blend things that make sense together. So streamlined skopje. Extreme of karam's elaborate fussy procedures fussy. It sounds like he sought simplicity aimed for the perfect balance of fewer ingredients. That was my favorite kind of dining. Have soldiers it lay not so muddy less on the play. Yeah beautiful beautiful. Food can be so simply presented delusion. Hesitation makes you wanna eat it when you say yeah so perhaps what he is most revered for is classifying sauce. Work into the five families of sauces still recognize today. They're the five mother sauces so we need to thank him for this. Because anyone who has enjoyed french dining knows that the sauce work is really what makes the composed dish complete may not to mention luxurious savory. Delicious software isn't really something that you make at home. i feel like it's just it makes. The dish is room minister party. But i do grease at home so you do. I wanna make mac and cheese anything great dogs. You're better now. That's five mothers looking at your mother song. Yeah so yeah so so. The definition of a sauce is a liquid plus thickening agent plus seasonings the five classic mothers. Also our best smell Tae panel tomato tomato and holidays. I have heard of all of these. Yup cente- online now so it's believed that sauces must obey the general laws of rational hygiene. Where for they should be served in combined in such a way as to allow for easy digestion by the quote frequently disordered stomachs of their consumers. Why are their stomachs disordered. I think this is a nod to chefs are to him like honoring the quality than what they sir Instead of just like this haphazard way eating you know your because they deficit espanol. Ms known as also as veal zhou which is a three day sauce. Three day process while so. These are like very thoughtfully inc. Sasa that aid nisa. That can be seen as aids digestion. Instead of like you know go eat out any like stack. Yeah french cuisine is the care about the final it lubricates. They care about how their customers walk away and feel. It's an experience. Yeah i'm starting to. They're not feeding overfeeding Right which some people will look at. Especially maybe americans any lake wylie. Getting house dime sci fi like on tasting with let alone. But they're the news bush. i've got some jets. Want their customers to leave satiated not full and maybe a little bit like a little bit more At that makes sense yeah. Skopje says that any sauce should be smooth. Light without being liquid glossy to the eye and decided taste like season properly. Okay got When these conditions are met the sauces easy to digest even for quote tired stomachs so. He's worn seeing that. He's giving these people nutritious food kind of rejuvenating none of that. Yeah yeah okay. So the sauces bench mel volusia tae and spn. Y'all which is also known as feels you all have a roux to create the consistency of a chef wants in the sauces. So a roux is is the thickening element of these leading sauces. The darker you cook the room the more nutty it becomes so a brown ru goes with the espanol sauce which is veal joe. A pale ru goes with tie and the white room goes with best now The ru is equal parts butter and flour whisking constantly every to to get desired depth of flavour it is basically browning butterworth flour So bench mel uses milk. After the you know and is like the french virgina golf freighter sauce. Yes you know. What i know i use grier young also now becomes a different. When you add cheese right it becomes a nanny to these. Five sauces are the as the mother sauces vendors. Like i wanna say. It feels like hundreds. It's a crazy Mosses that come off as mother sauces vance's organization that he did anything innovator so with the bash mel you would use that with pastalic. Who said. that's your mac and cheese and vegetable dishes or chicken Va luta uses stock to senate more to become about half the consistency of bushnell So that's kind of like the filling the saucy feeling a chicken potpie Delicious or the or like a soup can be. You can have like a cauliflower. Falutin can look. I've seen that on many of the and sometimes of volusia finished with crame mar soupy. A ham the tacoma one. I feel like she kind of stands alone on the five sauces. It's literally it's usually. It's always alabama garlic tomatoes herbs. It's more like the era and the holiday sauce is a butter based again. It's a better based sauce. Thickened with jokes as the thickener. So there's no room in the tomato or holidays so whole butter thins out the holidays. Okay stays better. I'm going to do a demo politics. The eight i mean. I think i made not soon and then it picked up and it did a comeback. It's all about these. Sauces are about temperature control. It has to stay cozy like a warm section of your stuff. Yeah i think. I made it to the side. Our coach eggs via at brooklyn. Now if he said good. But it wasn't what i wanted to also will do so. The holidays is actually made better with g. o. So you can or you can buy gate now. It's all about the thing. So when i make holidays you boil the butter and the water steams out And the milk solids float to the top skim off those milk solids and you're left with one hundred percent fat content mutter. Butter is made of fat milk and water. So you'll see that in my little devil due to it. So across french cooking evidence in all these sauces butter is an important ingredient to obtain viscosity and enhanced flavor. I call her the queen of fat s- And it is in fact seen as the perfect fat by many scientists nutritionists and ken. Butter has a perfect fatty acid profile. the short and medium chain federal agencies and butter are always saturated and they have unique properties. The body uses them directly for energy and never stores them as fat really. Yes the butter the butter. Listen all this wonderful. So because of that They're butters actually ideal weight loss at boost metabolism. It creates Like satisfaction on the palate tastes delicious. The as yet yeah. I don't know there was some like decide of time the whole politics but apparently it doesn't add to your body because your body is using the fatty acids that pulls it out and puts it not stores. It exactly lies so the more everybody should. I hope they do now. After this spanning better markets the fatty acids in butter they stimulate the immune system also and support inter cellular communication making them ideal for fading cancer. These powerful fatty acids have anti microbial. Pack freddie's eighth killing pathogens including candida in gut. Right butter is the best source of meyer. Ristic acid in the western diet which is important for kidney function. It provides eric. Ron don acc- which the body turns into feel good chemicals for the brain yup and vitamin a. d. e. n. k. We can all use more feel good absolutely not only looked at substance so if butter instead of whole bottle of wine the whole it's also butter is also a natural source of cholesterol. Which is needed control is needed to produce a variety of steroids that protect against cancer mental illness heart disease. Wow between the vitamins and cholesterol in butter fertility in both men and women is enhanced and protective in two thousand seven. A study showed that as butter. Consumption in america declined rank infertility and with sexual development increase interesting. So if you want a saw this quote in a book that i was studying now if you want to have grandchildren give your own children butter visit while enhance their reproduction. Rate but are also contains valuable minerals including selenium which is a trace mineral mineral with antioxidant properties. Butter contains more selenium than wheat. Yet it also has an magnesium magnesium is like the mood enhancer kind of mineral narang so butters look better in their battery depot. The coffee doesn't make him to the bullet of And then two there's butter sometimes. People might use ski in. Yeah cases well either one yet simpson. Yeah essentially i mean Is yeah yeah. I should start with that bulletproof coffee. I kinda tried it. I didn't like it that much. Maybe make bullet you buy bulletproof coffee right. I thought it was a tight. But maybe i'm wrong. I could be wrong. I wanna look and see. Because i've also met people that drink bulletproof coffee but brand. It's the forest like using. This mixture made it bullet per. I don't think so okay. I don't think so. I don't know what butter and coffee is called. But dan sokaia really. Oh my gosh you drink coffee With cream and sugar. I just put cream a creamer at creamer. Yep try boehner instead along with my creamer now instead. It's so nutty creamy has like like just tap or pat tables hold on. I'm thinking of coffee thing. It's like jimmy the whole thing. It's about two cups so like maybe teaspoon in a cup. Okay track right yeah. I will A half a cup and put like a debt is not. Mix it up really. Well will get like y'all frothy on the top yeah. It's super breakout cinnamon in my veteran. Yes cinnamon yeah go to be really good. Try and pick out so clearly. The most celebrated chefs of our time like scott. The i knew how important good to the people that cook far. He was worried about the digestion. He was wearing you know he wanted to incorporate nutritional principles it seems like because he is so much butter on. The french. People did as a all right in there. There's this book like french. Women don't get fat there. It's like why do the french have such good health longevity and they eat these rich foods. But now you're saying so yeah. We don't need to eat our margarine. And now you know. I sort of like consulted my husband a little bit on this. Because he's a french chef right and he says that chefs like him and you know that have that are sort of like students of Really try hard to make sure good food to make sure that they present good food for good bodies and that is often the ultimate goal of chef is to provide nourishment So i just think it's kind of a cool full circle. That food has more meaning than meets the eye. Man old old guys like a stuffy. I knew that way. Back the turner to censure Younger ago yup and the legacy has lived on. Oh my gosh strong. Really as in the beginning of every culinary cookbook. Haley and so better was part of the beautiful beautiful aged Lock as i am so events imminent Incorporate more better. I'm excited for you. Discovered that the tour de france as i will call it france which is so extra did not sound pretentious. Maybe i'll say toward france originated during that time. Awesome as those will be interesting. So i have just a few little facts about it which i found interesting are not gonna go into the origin story attacks of the tour. So the tour de france france for an average writer they would need to consume in order to complete the course itself. One hundred and twenty three thousand calories o in order to complete it so that is like before and during during during like the whole to complete the course from start to finish they would need to consume that many calories molin that much. That's the amount of exertion then. They're putting out there that they need to bring in that many calories to keep their body moving going so that would be like eating four hundred ninety five croissants hundred and fifty two full english breakfasts or two hundred bottles of champagne i am. They probably weren't doing that Area they were drinking initially. Yes my all my god. This is as they saw it as therapeutic and energy like away to prevent her energy which. I don't know how they got that. But so the youngest cyclist to win. The tour de france was anri corn. Nee or henri cornet as we would say in america on the second edition of the race in nineteen of four. He was only nineteen so in nineteen zero four nineteen year old completed. It and i guess he's been the under services. Oh yeah In the same race talk about the scandal. There is a scandalous associated with it again at Talk about that later. A scandal a suit of the race. Oh yes well they're to do with the was delicious bring none of Yeah because you know it's more fun to talk about those details so yes just to talk about the race so in the nineteen twenties competitors shared cigarettes while riding because it was believed at the time that it would be a stimulus that it would rather open up the lungs for climbs weird. Did she see something about cigarettes. Being good for the throat. Or that. Me when i was reading about the seventies us well. The marketing was so backward outs. Yeah than the twenty ounce but they didn't they thought they were anyway so alcohol was Was consumed throughout the race to ease any pain solo. Your muscles are paying like that would be your pain reliever but it was banned in nineteen sixty as it was believed to be a stimulant all that way all along. They were buying her beer. I i ran a half marathon and people were talking about how like you would drink beer during marathons and half marathons to help with because of the carbs again and i would not because you get so dehydrated. I get really dehydrated. So maybe my body just me. Other people don't finish marathons on you like congregate and have a beer hump. Yeah wasted like beer is your and your endorphins and everything. Yeah i i did. I did a relay. Race that ragnar. It's called insect there. Iran thirty three miles over twenty four hour period in legs. I didn't do it all at once. Oh and yeah. We had beer afterwards that anyway it was exhausted. I would never do it again. Okay more on that later. I want to know if he gets. Keep talking about the toward fonts okay. So this thrilling. In on starring race attracts over twelve million spectators each year in that makes it the largest sporting event in the world. Get out of town. Yeah the courses that long so they can be in a sentence a and yes so they're congregating along a very long route But i'm sure they move as i don't know i've never been honestly of number again watched it. I've only heard about you know all the daughter. Aalyah yard on the news about whatever team is a hang here. But i'm not. I'm not a big cyclist so Anyway but these teams that come to compete the supplies generally so this is kind of like what people might bring with them for thirty nine hundred nutrition bars. Eighty kilograms of nuts raisins Figs three thousand water bottles and most importantly twenty georgia jam for one person. That's the team over. Dude teams on so yeah. That was be again. You need a significant of calories to complete this so this is how you get your calories in and you can eat those nutrition bars while you're there being the nuts reasons. I mean that's super good easy to just pop in your mouth. Yup so now. I just want to discuss. How the tour de france came to be Interesting story i thought The origin of it so it is known as one of the most difficult thing races and it was created in one thousand nine hundred three as a promotional tool for the magazine lotto l. Auto lotto was a sports inclined publication with an emphasis on a new phenomenon which was car racing. Oh so this is where it really gets interesting. The mere existence of magazine can be attributed to controversial and polarizing political scandal of of the time. The dreyfuss affair. Have you ever heard of that. You were researching and kept coming up on looking at stuff. And then i finally made the connection between the two. I was like this amazing so we do have some french listeners. So i'm going to kind of talk about it up a little bit and hopefully you know i'm sure they already know about it. inefficient Details wrong certainly. Let us know. But when i was doing research. This is what i discovered. So the dreyfuss affair Which was basically Kind of broke people into two camps. And what's very interesting that you can kind of see similarities today. So nationalism and antisemitism fueled much of the discourse around mckay's so the scandal began in december eighteen ninety four when captain alfred drive this was convicted of treason drank. This was a thirty five year old alsatian french artillery officer of jewish descent and he was sentenced to life in prison for allegedly communicating french military secrets to the german embassy in paris and he was imprisoned in. Devil's island are on devil's island in french. Guyana where he spent nearly five years so in eighteen ninety six. However in the midst of his five-year stay in evidence came to light which identified the real culprit of this treason as a french army. Major named ferdinand walson. Okay ferdinand walson esterhazy lot of syllables. However high ranking military officials suppressed the new evidence and a military court. Unions unanimously acquitted eszterhas housi- after a trial lasting only two days. So i guess they thought well let's him up because it seems like perhaps he's the one who did it but the military officials were like we're going to keep out the evidence that shows that he's guilty 'cause we got injured best and you know that happens a lot our justice system. They're so desperate to like find somebody. They're like we got our guy. That's not even digging more. You're terrible hopefully. Things will change anne way so the army after this acquittal of esterhazy the army late additional charges against dreyfuss jazz based on forged documents so the possibility of his innocence was leaked to the press which then broke the society into two camps. So there was the Excuse me pro republican mantica clerical drive sars and pro army mostly catholic anti-drug dreyfuss arts. So you either with them or you're against him and kinda fell on so So he was eventually cleared the charges. It didn't matter that he was not in fact in Guilty and he did go on to serve in world war. One he you know. Why would he go back to the military. I how Anyway so yeah so it broke the people at two camps so one of the largest sports paper is called live elo midst sports coverage with political commentary and its editor pierre. Ghaffar d- believed is innocent and said so in his paper in hebron's maxine paper So this led to some of the magazines advertisers to start their own magazine which was lotto. Oh cool thus promoting their more nationalistic viewpoint They came to be the counterpoint. Okay on and they hired. Henry disagree dig range who was a prominent cyclist as their editor. And you know they. They rolled it out. I guess they're experiencing lagging sales and so in order to boost readership. Destroy change along with one of the magazines. Journalists gio favre had the idea to create a race around france naming at the tour de france in nineteen. Oh three courts The first race took place on july first and included five dozen writers mainly from france but there was like a smattering of germans belgians and swiss as well as italians national and so the first race wound around fifteen hundred mile course in france which started in paris than move to leone marseille to loose bordeaux and nonce before returning to the venture capital coal their initial race unlike the race in later years there were no plan climbs in this first one and it was carried out in six stages so later they kind of expanded on the race in also unlike the race in later years each stage of that first race was no less than two hundred and fifty miles amid each staged two hundred and fifty miles. At least i think some there was a break. Es you do a stage heartbreak do next. I think three or four days. It's over The so now the state are no more usually no more than one hundred fifty miles each so they acquired it down but there are more see thirteen or fourteen stages with i. Is it still over. Thousand miles missing sounds like harder. So it's all terrain ye. Yeah go up in via they go up so i talk about that too. Okay okay. So the cyclists in nineteen. Oh three road over unpaved roads without helmets half they wrote as individuals not teams like we have today every team today. Riders could receive no help they could not glide in the slipstream fellow writer. Writers latinos kind of can do that now or even behind the goal. They couldn't do that. Couldn't utilize that chris. Hula cars. Pry them yeah. They rowed without support. Cars cyclists were responsible for making their own repairs. They even road with spare tires tubes wrapped around their torsos. Oh in case they had flats. Oh my god to repair on now. Yeah had to be the repairman now that now. It's like a race check. Yeah right like the pit and you have your support vehicles. Whatever you need So the first stage between paerson leone was in awe inspiring three hundred miles And it is noted that since they had no real support cyclists might not necessarily concern themselves with with finishing the race so much as surviving rail share and trying to survive. Attorney verse how. I felt when i was reading. These long distances on news is to get you. Don't care what you not. Just make a nager over the course of that first race only twenty one out of the sixty men completed the race with the last one crossing the finish line sixty four hours after the first home ike godsey right the last one of that. Twenty of that twenty twenty one. The twenty-first sixty four hours after the first that's a long way. God like is he coming losing everybody else just like pilau later and stop senior. Cnn let's go home. Go cycle over to switzerland. Mike might as well just done a huge amount. I dislike all right so the race did for the magazine. The editor at hopes and saw its circulation grow significantly. Its readership grew six times what it had been prior to the tour de franca job. Yeah but we need to come up with some sort of race right something. So the first race was an honest success. Despite the numbers of men not able to complete the race the second race saw a problem that perpetually plague the race for many years feel like every year after which is cheating she achieved a cheater. There's all sorts of ways to cheat but okay so here. I play some of the ways. People cheat So in the next race the nineteen four race garin who was the nineteen or winner was riding through sauna. It yen in fans of their hometown writer antoine for better. So the their homeboy. They formed a human blockade and beat the man like beat the other racers until the favre arrived and warriors pistol. To break up the melee febres the person associated with locked up. Yeah yes if he had to fire pistol. Break it up right. So they're like blockading it. Because they gotta win while later in the race fans protesting the disqualification of local writer place tax in broken glass on the course the writers acted not much better. They hitched rise in cars during the dark and legally took help from outsiders. Garin himself was accused of illegally obtaining food during the personal on stage. The race was so plagued by scandal that four months later dig ranch range disqualified garin and three other top finishers while it would of course not be less time tour winner was stripped of his taedong. We go lance armstrong. Other thing happened a long time. There was there is still being and there was you know. Civilians are thrown is not the first to dope or use enhancing drugs. You know physical hanson drugs. But i feel like because he's an american. We know a lot about him. His downfall was pretty significant. It you know. And even probably around the world you know addendum a noticeable in very sad down so lance armstrong won the four seven times course his career the most of any competitor and when my sister ian susan the ninety s to the early two. Yeah like mid nineties attack okay. Though we now know that he was accused of doping later confessed to it. The united states anti-doping agency said armstrong was the ringleader of quote the most sophisticated professionalized and successful doping program. The sport has ever seen lau know his team. Let's get this. Was he a sing singular writer overseas team whose parbatiya like american or or whatever teaming they were all doing that's the way i understood it Yes the team. They work and i believe he can. He would not have won seven titles with ice our team because sometimes they would come into the front and they local spock or yet maybe do that slipstream. But they'll work together and it was kind of with the purpose to get him. Cross-stitch line you don't have to be the first to cross the finish line. You have to win the most stages I say race so you might not win every stage but if you in the most in the right amount of time you know it'd be come in under a certain amount of time than you all so yes at. What is like steroid isn't needle. How do you take a state as a pill or the needle. Maybe but i think there might be both options for you I'm not one hundred percent. Sure so since he was such a prolific doper He was eventually stripped of all his titles and banned from participating in all sports that followed the world anti doping code while a poor guy mean. He did himself be because he was doing such good with his kind of celebrity. The was drowsy married to sheryl crowe married. Mary a belief. He's a cancer survivor. Got through his twenty five and it was metastatic mini red to his brain. His lungs sliver while he was athlete rice and but he he was cure lick. His doctor looked at him and said that you're gonna be okay a bit also Honor but he told him he's gonna be okay just kind of keep going. Oh we have this kind of like kind of heart. Warming stories like the survivor. Such an athlete and he's got his live foundation so it meanwhile also it's such a tragic events for him. It has so. The tour de france is a challenge to both mind and body as we on exits physical and mental in. This was not made more clear than when a writer died on the course. Oh jesus in nineteen sixty seven. Tom simpson and accomplished cyclist. Who had performed well in the nineteen sixty two tour de france. You had started to feel unwell as he cycled through the apps. So this is. The outset been incorporated. Course he was determined to continue and se. Climbed the infamous mount than toe. Fan saying that right Also known as the giant of provence he started to slow and slipped towards the back of the racers so he kind of started the peter out he begins zigzagging and moving radically and roughly a kilometer before the summit he toppled over a guy. He was held back on his bike. His he wanted to keep going and road for a bit more before. Nearly crashing again spectators rushed to his aid in helped him upright but he was unconscious. The tourists medical staff made attempts to revive him but they were unable to. He was airlifted to avenue early in his pronounced. Dead e at a heart attack or something. Well yes the official cause of death was heart failure due to dehydration and heat exhaustion. On how ever. Traces of infamy founded his body and the medical officials said the drugs were probably a contributing factor to his death because they likely allowed him to push his body to like more than he yeah he he was listening to his limits. You know who's listening to his body So there is a memorial on this vento mountain. Mount malt asks amount Near where he collapsed in is a popular pilgrimage site for cyclists from all over the world. Like to go there. Honor him going to summit that he never made it made. It should have been taken in. That means god maybe though the race is too hard for just the common person to do. Maybe they did a needs Plenty of people do it without to it. Seems like a lot of people. Do at the big robin has been. I mean they've really tried to to work on. Yeah eradicating it from the the tour but yet they thought you rate they needed so harm almost unless you are like peak video fitness you can if it quite different a person riding bike than a person driving a car yet onerous like the you see the tour guide currently at this looks good. Yeah but mike per a human yeah did women always do. Those women are not. They don't participate in the tour de france. Stephen now this map. Japan can occur. Why do you hold a little tip on that. not so. The tour de france has happened every year. Since since nineteen three with the exception of world war in world war two during the oh did not like the middle of a battle. Yeah yeah they had other things going. Yeah stage for three weeks in july. Usually in twenty day long stages therapists twenty day on stages are typically comprises of twenty professional teams of nine writers. Each in covers their thirty six hundred kilometers. Two thousand two hundred and thirty five miles. And it's mainly in france It occasionally will visit belgium. Italy germany and spain. Oh just like demi around. And i think I read like it started one year in england. Tall teen or something. So you know they do go places with Most of the races of there's like a leg of england that they all let you start here and then you make your way into address. I guess england needed have to give to garner this bridge. There's a tunnel the tunnel. Yeah yeah there you go. We didn't i know that anyway. I think okay. So the route changes each year The format of the real estate the same however with the appearance of time trials the passage to the mountain chains of peer knees and the apps. And finish on the sean lee ed in paris That's where that's kind of what you can expect now for the ladies. They they've tried. I guess to create a similar sort of race. It doesn't seem to me that it's obviously not as popular right on. And i'm not actually sure still happening in our french friends. That are the senior people to let us now. A little deeper died but that is called la course by the tour de france. La la lady. Yes so yeah that is so they get back but otherwise yes. It's just a male centric. Sports interesting for six of the lease will be on the team. You know doesn't have to be can be a you know i don't know i don't know i like obviously female team in a meal team but like you know here. Mix it up wild. I would think so. Especially now. I look i might i mean. I don't think women would like use drugs to enhance performance as much as five general. I mean jesting jessica that we're that much better. I mean better. Call a queen honor instead of a king and hello you again. Maybe navy is just so hard. 'cause you know women were justly are different athletes that van anonymous physical in that way. You know what i mean so we certainly can do endurance sports. But maybe it's just the to be so great. You know there'd be competing just to compete not not to win in mind. You may that salia. The twin falls apart without lovely time. It gave us a lot. I really done. Yeah exciting well. Thank you for. Listening to argue for the style o'clock episodes. Please subscribe right us. A nice review. Perhaps that would be wonderful. You get a couple of stars. Yes yeah review rate about us. Some interesting topics that we're going to be exploring the next few episodes. What rethinking next episode. We're gonna do work on china. We're gonna work on china and the time when the great wall being built up. That's a big time period. Yeah yeah but we're gonna head it down bit. I'm excited to learn about that. Yeah absolutely we're going to investigate the eighties fun decade. Yeah yeah we were growing up in the we were we were. I think we're going to visit greece in this season All of us please. On our social media Instagram coming up you underscore and facebook chemi healthy. Yes and rg mail or email account is can we help you at g. Mail dot com. Yeah anything you wanna let us know there on her social media thanks yeah.

france skopje Skopje tour de france alice lloyd leslie ornoff renoir degas Cezanne picasso Floyd nici karam wenli Anton koran paris Sous chef saucier Lubiani Khurram mel volusia tae browning butterworth grier young laya