20 Episode results for "Sheldon Williams"

LLM 94 Leah Olson

Lessons Learned in Marketing

37:59 min | 1 year ago

LLM 94 Leah Olson

"Ideas are everywhere. Welcome to lessons learned in marketing. The Phoenix Group podcast. I'm your host David Bellary am I guess. Today is Leah Olsen and she is is a leader in the agricultural industry especially well across Canada but especially here in Saskatchewan. She's been apart of executive leadership teams and her most recent recent role has been The CEO of technology and seed. Master manufacturing we it talks about her roots her passion for agriculture and manufacturing factoring the need and the opportunity for marketing and branding and agriculture. and Leah gives us great insight into team building and leadership overall parole. Enjoy the conversation. Welcome to the PODCAST. Thank you so much for coming in today Ellen. Super very excited to be here so I want to talk about kind of agriculture where things are headed women in agriculture. But maybe I could we talk about you. who sort of for those? Who Don't know you a little bit about your background and how you got to where you are today? Well it's always fun question Russian to ask people 'cause most most people haven't gone the way that you would think so. I grew up on a farm grain farm. Just north of Tompkins the southwestern corner of Saskatchewan. And it's a population less than one hundred. I think our class size was six to eight depending on how certain people to end in the year or if people moved or didn't move I graduated from High School here in Regina. My Dad was an inventor slash farmer and so depending on who was asking. I would say my dad's inventor which sounded super cool in some areas or I would say he's a farmer which sounded super cool in the areas where inventor maybe sounded crazy So we moved to the city graduated from high school from Sheldon Williams and then went on to do an Undergrad and graduate degrees at Concordia University in Montreal. I've worked pretty much in agriculture. And some sort of Wales wrote wrote my career and came back to Saskatchewan in two thousand and thirteen really to be closer to my family and to my dad's specifically typically And not has brought me very much back to agriculture. My husband farms happily just south south of the city. And so it's been a great ride and I think because I'm passionate about agriculture. It's an easy fit in in terms of career choice for me and I guess growing up on a farm. Did you see agriculture and farming as a business always no never in keeping in mind. I grew up in Saskatchewan in the eighties and early nineties and so I recall dust storms. And that's when we were using using a lot of tillage in cultivation so the farm practices have you know thank goodness. They've they've evolved since then and so. When I was a kid Ed looking at the opportunity I never considered farming something that I would do primarily because it was a you know it just wasn't an option? Commodity prices prices are low. Interest rates were hovering around eighteen to twenty eight percent so financially. It just didn't make sense but it's always been something that I've been passionate national about and so I was really. I'm I'm still very grateful for the opportunity to be in the industry and to work with the people that I do. I think many people in that armie age have come back to the industry or you know they have stayed within agriculture. But as a result of many people within my generation fortyish type thing You know leaving and then coming back I think it makes for stronger. Business Decisions and definitely an appreciation appreciation for the ups and downs. The cyclicality of affirming now you've migrated and there's a strong career passwords manufacturing. And does that come from your dad being an inventor and I guess was there manufacturing there as well with with a hitch in the drop panel. Yes so I think that my fascination with farm equipment definitely comes from my dad and when we were farming being essentially in no disrespect for those in the Tompkins or the you know the that area but we essentially farming in the middle of nowhere and so so if something if a piece of equipment went down you had to fix it and my dad is someone who was never satisfied with the status quo and so the first farm show I worked. I was twelve. That was in eighty seven. I think and he wanted Innovation Award and there was a lot of people around found that thought out. That is the most simple thing. I can't believe I didn't invent it and I think that's sort of seed of innovation is within many in the farm industry industry because you have to find a way to be efficient particularly when you're farming and there's not a you know a service technician around or close and so you have to be a problem solver so fast forward to two thousand and fifteen when I I was approached to become AMC's the president of the agricultural manufacturers of Canada. It did seem like a natural fit because I I enjoy the manufacturing industry I enjoy equipments and perhaps most importantly I enjoy working with farmers whether they're male or female it. It doesn't really matter. I think that there's a lot of really interesting things happening in the industry right now the emergence of hemp coming out The you know organic onic versus conventional the trade relations and some of the things that are going on with India and China right now. There's no shortage of interesting Topics that you can cover and worst case scenario talk about the weather so the weather. Yeah exactly how do you you see agriculture right now as as a business. What kind of opportunities are are out there? Well I believe strongly that There there is a requirement to feed the world and the question right now is will farmers. Conventional farmers be permitted to to grow their food. And we know that we don't have to have any world food shortages we just. Don't we have the capability to be highly productive active but it comes down to the science and the emotion of of selling not. And you know so when I look at the future of the industry. I'm a little concerned to honest. That consumers who are very far from what actually happens on the farms conventional farms will dictate hate that they will not eat certain types of food and I'll eat anything off of our off of the farm always have and always will but that fear and that emotion for the for those who are more in the urban settings worries me because they you know. There's there's I understand when when you're your mother or a father and someone saying to you this food could harm you. It's very sooners the vaccine movement and the Anti Vaccine Movement where we know that we can get rid red of major major diseases and yet the emotion of a vaccine is holding us back from completely. You're advocating certain diseases so I think you know. The Future of agriculture is going to depend quite a bit on the consumers and to to a certain degree the marketing of the industry to those who don't understand it but on the flip side. We're seeing some really neat things happening with artificial official intelligence with automation and many of it much of it coming out of Saskatchewan with Dot Technology Corp or on the automation side in artificial intelligence companies like Artificial intelligence precision agriculture. You know there's some really neat things and I think because Husky Cashman has such a large number of farmers it lends itself well to being an agriculture superpower. Because for those those that aren't on the farm we can and should be thinking about. How can we help? Farmers be more efficient and help them be profitable in a sustainable way. I always find it interesting that we you know. I'm not from Scotland and living here. You understand or you see really that that we are in agriculture superstar yet. We don't don't seem to get the credit for that anywhere and is that a marketing problem or is that just because we're so small or why why I too. We sit in that spot of being I guess not as not as respected isn't the right word but not not acknowledged or not given that that credit for for the work that's happening here in the amazing abilities that are people here. Well I think you know Saskatoon because the other thing we are as we're very rural you know when you look out the proximity between Saskatoon then Regina or swift. Current are larger centers. Prince Albert are larger centers are quite a distance away. And so there's a natural. Well I think affinity for those of us that do come from smaller hounds to not be overly boastful about where we come from and what we've accomplished because in a smaller community. If you're that person you might find yourself isolated pretty quickly and I don't think that that's a bad thing You know in the largest centers where I've lived. There's usually a curiosity about. What is it like to grow up on a farm and you you know when I tell people that? My Dad changed the hitching industry across North America and has received countless awards there. Oh it's it's really interested in hearing more so you know. I think it can be difficult to be loud and proud about your accomplishments ends. And if it's not if you're not comfortable doing that than by no means you don't have to but I think that having cheerleaders within the province Muir Al Qatif not is is a very big Cheerleader Bill Gruel President and CEO of Protein Industries Canada. He's got a a mandate that is large. But you know one of the things that I know that bill will be doing is getting really excited about some of the technologies coming out of the Western in Canadian provinces. So I think having cheerleaders is really important and I perhaps there is. There's definitely a need to have strong marketing and public relations. Because there's the old saying if you don't tell people what you've done does it really matter and I I do think that that is relevant particularly in the agricultural industry Because I mean we can use the example that I referenced. Earlier are where consumers aren't aware of all of the good stuff that's happening not technology In we've reduced redundance applications locations of of herbicides and pesticides I mean it's tremendous. We've reduced fuel consumption on farms. So who who should be telling these stories. It's almost like everyone wants or knows them. But WHO's the voice. Yes well I I think it's up to this may sound a little funny but I think it is the responsibility of our business leaders To be doing it and to recognize that you know when they don't know how or if it becomes a little overwhelming to engage professionals to help them out you know marketing is such a unique and I think with social media now it's kind of journalism everybody thinks that they can be a marketer or a journalist journalist and the reality is that a really good marketer is going to help you do better during the good times and they're gonNA help you do. Yeah well during the the conditions you know the market conditions. That aren't grade so there's definitely a role in that But I do think. The business community overlooks the requirement. For that Simply because they're too concerned about a my going to be you know making ensure that my customers are happy and obviously. There's a need to do that but telling sort of the broader stories Sometimes that probably gets over reluctant. McDonald's did that Greek campaign where they sort of just opened opened up the back room. And said we're GONNA be transparent. This is what our burgers and we're gonNA meet the farmers murders and all the rest of that and it was. It had a tremendous impact and surprisingly looking back at it. It's like well. That was pretty easy. Actually yeah absolutely absolutely well. And I think that's where transparency in how you speak to your customers are would be customers is really important now. In contrast and W and earls I think are still dealing with the repercussions of how they managed their food selections and those are just two very or three. I guess various different approaches to the you know the beef industry specifically typically that have had long term repercussions but definitely. I applaud McDonald's for what they've done because they haven't been transparent and think when you don't don't tell people what's happening they will make it up and that's human nature and so as a business leader it's important to ensure that you you are transparent about what you you know what you're doing because if you don't people will make it up and what they say is not always great so you mentioned. Am W and I want us to talk to you about any mentioned protein industries Canada. So we are. Regina is the headquarters for pick and and and W with their beyond Meat Burger that the whole plant protein movement is just seems to be unstoppable. I mean the government government of Canada introduced the new food guide and it had more plant protein. It it seems like an amazing opportunity. Right now for Regina China forces. Gotcha and what do you think that looks like for our province or could look like. Yeah I think that it's you know with the Canadian. Aim We board not being in place anymore. One of the things that I had hoped what happened sooner is to get food processing You know in the prairies or to have it happening on Canadian soil So when we look art opportunities to do more with plants. I think that it's something. We should all be celebrating because it means that we have more food choice. And what a great way to To be able to feed the world on the flip side I think we do have to be careful not to suggest that there's something better or worse the vegetable protein versus the beef industry or versus the the meat But I see major potential in what is happening you. You know the the people in India but also those in Canada North America that are wanting plant based protein We have the technology to feed them. which is fantastic? And so my hope is that we will in that way. Continue to be a world leader in food. Production is is. Is that something that we can. We can I guess own as a brand or has has that for scheduled for Regina or yeah I you know I. I think that we will see that over the over over the coming years I think we've got so many Ranchers that are still involved in the beef industry that you know if we see it as a a zero sum game then that's not gonna work out very well whereas if we recognize that this isn't you know more for plant protein based on food means less on the meat side If we look at it from that perspective then we definitely will need people to make informed decisions but I do see the growing populations and such that. There's space for both you know plant based protein and conventional beef with chicken and and An animal meat based protein. So I do think that We will be a leader in food production. But I'm not sure that the ranchers will be comfortable making a decision and ideally they'd be involved in both because because both are going to be required I think and consumers you know have choices and I think that that's that's great. Yeah there's so many voices out there. It's hard to yeah. You don't want one to just kind of quiet everybody else down or like. Yeah and everyone's all contributes to the to the bottom line into nutrition in the end. Yeah well I think that that's where I'd like to see and my hope. Is that the you know the Canadian Food Guide is you know it is based on science and I'm a type one diabetic Bene- can so I I I've since a very young young age been very aware of what. I'm what I'm having to eat and my worry. I guess not that I have a lot of worries but I I would want to ensure that when people make decisions about what to eat that they know that for example organic doesn't mean more nutritious it just means there's a difference in how it was raised and so whether you choose organic or you choose something that's been raised more conventionally. They're both pretty good and to have that. Abundance of food is not just a privilege. But it's something that we can't take advantage of and I think back to the early eighties when we were having major food shortages and seeing them in Ethiopia You know we don't get that now. The food shortages that are experienced now are usually because political well or you know bad things wchs and have nothing to do with the fact that there's not enough food in the world there is enough food in the world and that is the result of major productivity gains being made by farmers and many of them in North America. So it's you know as we think about the food conversation I would. I hope that we would continue to to make sure that we check in with what is the science and what is really going on because once emotion gets in and we start to skew you and perhaps I can be accused of that but you know I believe very strongly in conventional In conventional means of of food production and and. I think that it's it's great to be able to have a conversation like that. It's GonNa flip this a little bit and talk about Marketing and branding in the sense that you know a lot of consumers are in the opportunity now is to be able to trace back your origins of your food food and a lot of farms. Maybe not a lot farms themselves starting to get into like branding themselves. What do you see there? Is that important. Yeah now it is. I really believe it as and there's some really neat This is where artificial intelligence and monitoring on the greenside is catching up to what's happened already in the livestock side It's I think going to again. Be The apart of the discourse that farmers have with consumers is that you know your whatever it is that That you're eating. This is where where it was raised and to get to know who that farmer is I think a really great opportunity to bridge the you know the two sides and when we look at the origins of food once were able to show that I think that the consumer fear will go down down. And you know. I'm not saying that everybody's going to want to go out onto a farm but most farmers are pretty open boat. If you WANNA come out and run you know sitting in the combine fine with me and be happy to answer your questions and so I think that'll be a really great opportunity for us to get to better understand both asides Because on the farmers side they're typically very proud of you know what they're doing but oftentimes they're not even sure you're exactly where their products are being exported to or what the you know which markets it's going to be processed so the our our some of our biggest biggest businesses in the province and often people don't see them as like a business but some of the producers would you would you think they should be thinking about their own brand in a sense or is that you always get into trouble when you tell them what to do and like they don't have enough. I think think of you know. I think that branding is there. Aren't unity there. Maybe I shouldn't have. I think that there really is. There's I knew of a couple of farmers that have done some marketing endeavors and quite a bit of it is because has there proud of their their employees the proud of their land and they're proud of what they're doing th the the environmental footprint that they have offer that they don't have so there is an opportunity for marketing and you know the challenge. Is that most. Farmers will will contract to a major grain buyer and so that grain buyer doesn't necessarily care if they have standard operating procedures for their semi's or you know how they run their equipment. If they're you know the type of farmer that will make sure that their drills are running pretty much twenty four seven on say two or three shifts chefs and making sure that employees are sleeping properly but at the end of the day. You know a farm's safety record. And how they operate eight Does I think get into the types of product and the sustainability of the farm overall so in the first two years of operating. Maybe some of those things don't matter but in fifteen to twenty years when you're trying to continue to grow and expand the reputation that you as a farmer will have with your your neighbors is going to dictate whether or not you can acquire additional land and whether or not they go to you to To sell the I want to ask you a kind of changing or shifting topics because I was reading that you're known as a team builder and putting together some high I performance teams. What's what's what's what do you look for? How do you approach building a team? Well I mean when you come in and I've come come in a couple of times where you know at at a senior level and you can choose to fire and get rid of the team at is one approach or you can choose to to promote and It's whether you know which approach you take really depends on if the team is willing and able to be coached and mentored Most recently when I joined seed Master in dot my approach there I knew knew that it was a very good team and so I- instantly promoted a couple of key people and was excited to do so because I knew that they were doing exceptional exceptional work and that the promotion would demonstrate that you know the standard is going up and I think it's very similar to I know you. You Love Dogs There's two ways I somebody told me when I had a dog that the best way to get her to do what I wanted to congratulate congratulate her and to to you know like Nacre praise and make sure that she's happy and so I learned that with my dog and then I subsequently currently did it with I used to coach quite a bit of rugby and subsequently did it with my rugby girls and ironically the last place that I did that was within. My management practices is in the workspace. And you know if I look back now I think boy I could have done a lot of a lot more better than a lot. Better things had I taken that approach early on in my career on. I think that for us as managers that when we are giving feedback you know. There's is always that sandwich approach for every one thing that you have is constructive feedback put it in with two things. That are positive It's I think important when you are building a team and you're trying to get everybody on the same page to recognize that the human element there is fear of change there. Is You know a desire to make sure that you're you're doing good work. And most people I think if not all people always do their best and so as is a senior person you have to be careful about the sort of feedback that you give and ensure that you're giving constructive and and Realistic feedback it back. But also don't overlook the fact that people want to know that you know that that they're valued and that they are doing a good job but maybe they need to do you a job in focus a bit more in in a different area. It's great advice span fantastic advice so the podcast is lessons learned in marketing and I'd ask you to draw back and look at kind of what lessons. You've learned that could apply to marketing through. Maybe you're your your long short career. In agriculture and manufacturing lessons learned on. What advice would you give yeah? It's something that I've been reading a lot on lately. Lee is the role of the chief marketing officer and the role of marketing and organizations writ large and we were talking earlier about you know when budgets budgets get tighter often. It's marketing that gets cut first and you know that bothers me because when the market conditions are tight that's generally generally when you need marketing the most to set you up for future success and so the role of marketing I think is really vital vital but the marketing team has to understand is the financial environment and so when they say that they. I WANNA do a specific type of event if they don't relate that back to what is the return of the investment of those dollars. How does this go beyond just positioning us as a leader at that company or whatever I mean being positioned as a leader is one aspect of you know what makes sales happen but it is important? I think that marketers understand that you know when you're putting some big dollars into Evan's hands and in two different campaigns that it has to relate back to additional sales whether it's today or tomorrow but you know inputting timeframe in there and making sure that that actually happens to monitor it is really key One of the things that I I did when I was out seed master dot was I pulled the marketing team. Closer to sales under One of the senior managers managers there were Shell Bozo and I did that because I thought it was really important that the marketing team was very creative and very good but by just subtly pulling them closer to the sales team and getting them more engaged with the sales team. My hope was to to be able to help them. All focus a bit more on. Why are we doing all of these events and these campaigns and and then to get the sales team more involved because there's often this perspective that well you know? Here's the marketing campaign sales now. You guys just I have to go out and do it. But increasingly it's the voice of the consumer that is really important and if sales and marketing aren't seeing eye to eye then you can only imagine what the response from the CFO is going to be or the head of engineering. Marketing is saying we need more money. I'm a strong believer in marketing at all times. Also strong believer that when when times are tough that you marketing team should be able to give you some options fans that help you not just in the short run but in the longer run so that'd be one of my key lessons. Is that just the importance of marketing. It's weird that I know kind of the history of it that sales and marketing have been in these silos and they seem to across a lot of companies. Anyway be moving living together and I guess unifying around the brand or around a central vision or purpose. What what advice would you give to kind of help to help? Make that work because there there are some some from friction that happens when those two teams come together often. Yeah well I I think it it sometimes. I mean it's like anything right if if people are speaking but nobody's hearing them then earn listening than you're GonNa have challenges. So perhaps having additional additional conversations of just the sales and marketing teams and truly listening to each other Doing a bit of a hat swap if you will wear you know if your sales team is coming coming in and they're meeting with marketing team that each individual if they are normally in sales then you switch them so that their marketing The role playing can be valuable valuable. Because that's where you get the assumptions that it'd be made on both sides come out and sometimes it's those assumptions that are holding people back from being able to really really work well together and they may not even be aware of that and so that would be one way that you know i. I've I've seen the sales and marketing teams work together better But definitely in the development of any marketing campaigns. You know bring sales in N- or if sales team has some ideas about how the company can better market itself that open communication. I think is really important because it can result in better It in better campaigns. To be honest I worked on a campaign When I was with Pfizer Canada and it was in the vaccines area not surprising and we had Jane Seymour come in as our kice spokesperson. And she was there for a very brief amount of time and the way that we identified her was I was obviously okay on the marketing side and we talked our sales team about who within the population. It was a campaign that was aimed at those rose over fifty. We wanted to raise awareness about pneumococcal disease and then raise awareness about that. There is a vaccine available To help prevent pneumococcal disease in older adults. And you know we all had different ideas on. Who is it that this age cohort will listen to? And Ironically Jane Seymour came back and you some of us sort of giggle because we think of her as a bond girl but It was because has of her role as a doctor and she I mean she did an outstanding role and job answered answered. A ton of questions did Did some really good Promotional work for for Pfizer Canada at that time and and I think that's an example of the sales and marketing teams coming together. Obviously doing the the right market research to understand kind of who should did that. Spokesperson be and then being able to hopefully secure him or her accordingly. I love that you reached out to sales i. The freezer opened this podcast with all the time as ideas are everywhere. And it's one of those things that you know. We we encourage here when we have a brainstorm more any kind of idea generation. It's not like the creative department that has to come together. It's it's you know everyone clydeside the front desk. You know it ideas do come from everywhere but especially those people who are on the front line. They have great knowledge and understanding of who you're talking to and if we do you just like you say listen. You'd be surprised sometimes. Yeah Oh for sure. I think that it's one of the most important people in any organization that it has bricks and mortar. The person who knows the most is the person greeting everybody at the door employees they greet you know Suppliers they greet Customers they are a huge amount of information and you know in an ideal situation they will have have the ear of the senior management because they will understand really. What's going on? At least able to identify some frictions that could be made easier. Well we're we overtime. I it's been fantastically. Thanks so much for spending some time with us any. Can you say anything about what's on your horizon or well at this point I am. I'm I'm a board member of a couple of organizations and you you know I think as I said earlier I recently resigned as CEO seed master in dot and so. I'm not exactly sure what's where I'm going to end up but I put myself through university waitressing so I can always do that or I can run farm equipment so you know and those really aren't aren't bad scenarios so we'll see people connect with you if they want to. Twitter is probably the easiest it's at Olsen O. L. S. O. N. Lia L. E. H. or also in Lincoln. I'm pretty Pretty active on both linked in and twitter. Thank you ago. Yeah thank you. I really appreciate it

Canada Saskatchewan North America Regina CEO Leah Olsen High School India Phoenix Group Pfizer Canada president Twitter Saskatoon David Bellary Ellen Sheldon Williams
Ep 20:  NBA RE-DRAFT 2006

Chad Ford's NBA Big Board

1:06:51 hr | 6 months ago

Ep 20: NBA RE-DRAFT 2006

"The locked on podcast network your team every day. Hi This is David Locke CEO of the lockdown podcast network is just amazing to have Chad Ford Back Chad's always been one of my favorites talking the NBA draft. I wanted to make sure you know what the lockdown podcast network is. We have a daily podcast for every NBA team. That's right. Your favorite team has a daily podcast so when you're done listening to Chad, Ford's MBA big board. Make sure you go find your favorite teams daily podcast on the lockdown podcast network. Enjoy chat. Into Chat. Ford's NBA Big Board walked on podcast network days. Episode is brought to you by rock auto dot com, amazing selection reliably low prices all the parts your car will ever need. I'm your host chat, Ford? My guess today's the athletic senior writer and hosted the Hollinger and Dunkin podcast on the lockdown podcast network John Hollinger welcome back. Aloha Chad. It's. Great to be with you John. We're going to go way back and our redrafts this year all the way back to two thousand and six. Times, actually a few players left still active in the NBA. From this draught but the ones that are are really good. And if you're tuning in for the first time for a redrafts, John and I will redraft the lottery. We will go back and apply hindsight in other words. What team should have done based off of players careers? And John You're going to get the first pick in this draft, but before we. Dive in. Let's take a look at what happened. In two thousand and six, and this one's a little bit complicated because there was a. Crazy amount of draft day and draft night trades in this draft in the lottery. Yeah and you know a lot of it didn't amount to much as it turned out right there really was it the result of movement and it's not clear at all. Whether any of these guys are or most of them were actually worth. It will give some Kudos to Portland. Who moved up to number two. And and and really got arguably the best player in the draft, so let's look at what happened. On draft night. the raptors had the number one pick in the draft first time ever for them. They kept it Bryan Colangelo was the GM at the time he loved international players. He loved Italy spent a ton of time in Italy the clan. J.LO's did selected Andrea Bargain Yanni. Yeah and this this is one of those where. It was like it was. It was almost preordained. Because of those connections you mentioned and that that it was going to happen this way and. In retrospect, you know as an organization, you need more. Internal firewall sometimes so that's something like this doesn't get such a such A. Head of steam behind it that it becomes impossible to stop and that was one of the things I think I really took to heart from being on the on the inside for seven years talked to some other people who were as well and Rabaul it. Talk to me a little more frankly than they might have a five. It's working at ESPN so. you know you just wonder looking back. What they what? They could have done internally to kind of stop that train. Before it got such a head esteemed at that it was. It was stoppable at some point. Right like everyone knew by like April right? That's what they were doing or the second. They won the lottery. And it was interesting while while there wasn't a consensus number one guy in this draft, and that's part of the problem this is this is a very shaky draft and and I am. People even knew that at the time coming into it, he was probably cleanses was probably the only general manager in the League that had Bariani number one on on their board. And and that that doesn't mean that other teams didn't have him. In their top five or top ten wasn't lucky. He reached incredibly Bariani. Okay number two. The the Bulls had this pick, but on the day of the draft they swapped picks they. They swapped four with Portland. Portland moves up to two. CHICAGO GETS four and Victor Crap out of Russia. In, the deal and they select lamarcus Aldridge out of Texas the Hornets. I believe they were the Bob cats back then. At number three select Adam Morrison out of Gonzaga Far and away the college basketball player of the year. No question. He had a remarkable, an incredible college basketball career. We'll talk about whether he should have been the third pick in the draft. At Four. The Blazers are sorry that the Bulls now have the fourth pick in the draft. They moved down to spots in the draft. They select tyrus Thomas out of Lsu. At five the Atlanta Hawks Select Sheldon Williams at of Duke. Another. Another sort of strange trade. A lot of trades happening here was picked six and seven Minnesota originally has it? They ended up swapping this pick again with Portland who gets pick seven for? It's a long story. Let let's just end with the blazers. End Up with the six pick in the draft. And they select Brandon Roy out of Washington and Minnesota essentially moves down one spot in this pick that originally belonged to Boston and they select Randy Foye Villanova. Houston has the eighth pick in the draft. They traded to Memphis. lex Rudy Gay out of Yukon. Golden State. Warriors at ten Patrick O'Brien. Out of Bradley. The Sonics on the board at ten. Mohamed Cyrus Na. who had a ridiculous wingspan ridiculous wingspan. Only played three seasons forty seven games in the NBA at eleven. The Orlando Magic selected a highly controversial pick at the time. Jj Radic at do teams all over the board about radic in what he would be in the NBA. He also had a really terrific college basketball career, but lots of questions about how that translated the NBA. At Twelve The New Orleans Hornets. At, the time selected Hilton Armstrong. At a Yukon. At Thirteen Philadelphia. Trades this pick. The Bulls, It, up. Dabo Cephalonia. Out of Switzerland. My People Taba Cephalonia out of Switzerland and at Fourteen the Utah Jazz Ronnie Brewer. Out of Arkansas, let's to start by saying. This is one of the most disastrous top fives. I've any draft. Exactly right and three four and five or all going to be major bus. Some of them were more controversial than others. Adam Morrison teams were all over the board, but again a great college year Tyrus Thomas Teams were all over the board on him. Everybody scratch their head. When Atlanta selected Sheldon Williams, and they were locked into that from like April to that was another one where they just they just went all in on that so early and everyone was completely bewildered a out. Out to Portland by the way for getting to all stars out of a dog, she really mean that's. That's pretty fit. Pretty good maneuvering there and you know Brandon Roy by the way who was brilliant at Washington, then had no knee issues at the time where teams knew going into the draft that his career was likely going to be significantly shorter than his tally talent suggested, and actually that was something I. believe the teams actually knew going into the draft on this particular one. This was a really really hard draft to try to figure out how things were going to work out a on almost every single one of these prospects, I remember covering this draft man everybody polarized, some teams had raised on Rondo in their top ten others had him in their twenties. Cyrus sending some teams in even having been the first row J. Rettig was all over the board. would teams Patrick O'Brien all over the board team. Some teams had rudy gay. As, the number one pick in the draft. And and goes and goes eight. Incredibly challenging draft will will tell some stories along the way I'm GonNa. Give you the number one pick in the draft I. Think we know what's coming. Maybe you're going to surprise us. Who'd he got it number one for the raptors. So at number one for the Raptors, I will pick the same position, but I will pick them much better player and I will give them lamarcus Aldridge. Who went went number two obviously to Portland. But member of Six all NBA teams I think the like his his peak is definitely higher than anyone in this draft, still a pretty good player. number guy in this draft. If you just look at total accumulations of like wind shares and points whatever. Just a really good solid career and you know it's crazy is even in his case. There wasn't a lot of stretches where he was actually the best player on his own team. Which Mike for the number. One guy in the draft is kind of amazing right. He's right at the cost of. The the transition of big guys in the NBA, and what's in what's coming and that there was the polarizing thing about Aldridge? Did he have the body strength to play the five right was he liked to play on the perimeter more. He was much more face, the basket sort of guy and back in two thousand six. This was still. A. Question Mark about whether that's what you wanted I in your big men in their lot of questions about lamarcus Aldridge toughness and how he was going to fare in the pain, but I think what. The blazers for side and Kevin. Pritchard, who was the general manager at the time? WHO really everybody? A lot of fans loved Kevin Pritchard as general manager because he rolled the dice, he wasn't afraid to be innovative in what he was doing. He was very aggressive and making trades in the draft was a great example of that. He saw it. And Toronto and I I think Aldridge was probably the only guy that was maybe like a lock for the top three in this draft, but there was still a lot of questions about it. Sure did not have a great freshman season at Texas. it's hard sometimes with college bigs if the system isn't right for them, and they don't get the ball in the right places, you end up with not a lot to evaluate But. I think it was obvious even from. It was obvious he'd be at least okay. His rookie or by second year was obvious he was going to be a long-term guy in the league and. Might have a pretty high ceiling, the Blazers. Are At. Two. And they have. A really interesting conundrum the year before in the draft. They famously trade down in the draft because they don't think that Chris Paul or Darren Williams is necessarily going to be than Sebastian, Tell Fair? who is there who has their point guard at the time? And so you know, say what you want about the Great Kevin Pritchard, there was also some pretty big mistakes, and they end up taking martell webster actually. Instead I'm there the year before so I'm going to give him. A point guard who also is small in stature liked. Tell Fair, but I think was a much much better a player at two, and that's Kyle lowry. Sure yeah got me clear. Clearly I think the number two guy in this draft just such a bulldog. The evolution in his shooting obviously was the big thing that raised him from. He went twenty, four, th and this draft because. Because a Collegian. He just could not shoot it all night. Even make a throw and to see him become a really good long range shooter at the NBA level to the point that it's the main weapon in his game. I was almost unthinkable for anyone who saw him in college. Yeah, you're right. It's it's. It's fascinating the evolution of his career because it's not, it's not clear. Early on. That he is going to ultimately be like the second best player in the Strath, his years at Memphis. Were you know okay? mostly coming off the bench? At Memphis, it's not really he doesn't become a starter really until the two thousand ten eleven season. In Houston when, yeah, when half the other guys in this first round were already out of the League right, so he's he's at this point had one two three four. This is his fifth season in the League before he becomes a starter and even as a starter in Houston he he's he's solid. He's not great. He doesn't really explode. In my mind and tell about twenty eight twenty nine years old, yeah, Inter in Toronto and so a guy that just kept getting better and better, and I think you know to your point. You look at those three point shooting percentages, and you know we're there in a shot, a twenty five percent from three his second year in the League twenty five percent from three the third year in the League, actually the scouting reporting was right his fourth year in the League twenty seven percent, and then there's just this freaky jump in two thousand ten. He jumps the thirty seven percent. In Houston and doubles the amount of threes that he takes. And then consistently shoots around that number. For the rest of his career I. Don't know how many guys have done that I mean we always talk about Kenneth? Guy Learned shoot, and of course every agent in the draft is like Oh, vk. She'll learn to shoot. That's the thing they'll always say. No. He'll figure that out and I. generally my reaction is no. He's not going to learn how to shoot in the League somehow Kyle lowry dramatically. Changed Change this part of his Gamera. Yeah, and it meant everything, and while we're since we gave Bryan Colangelo some. Some Shit for taken barn Yanni trading a first round pick in the teens for Kyle. Lowry was certainly quite a move for the raptors. Yeah it it. It was really the start of of turning things around for him, so he doesn't make an all star team till he's twenty eight years old. But then he's been on straight. all-star temps and even at thirty three years old. especially at a player that relies a lot on an athleticism and quickness toughness. Get a really good season for Toronto this year. Probably, the best current player of anyone in this draft. Okay, that's number. Two Kyle lowry loved him in the draft by the way because of the toughness, the fierceness where the that he played the competitiveness, the shooting obviously was a major major question mark, but there was a lot of things to like about Kyle lowry's game as well and and and he just rounded it out. Okay, the third pick in the draft. GOES TO CHARLOTTE Adam Morrison. A. Great College Basketball Career. Throwback player. People were trying. Is. They're always looking for the next Larry Bird. To to make arguments that that Adam Morrison was the next Larry Bird. Turns out. To be an absolute disaster. For Charlotte. Some of it again because of a health health issues in an injury concerns, but I don't think that was. Totally it. because when he was healthy on the court, he was also struggling a lot. Who Do you select three at three, I, will not be selecting Adam Morrison I will select believe. He led the nation in both scoring and rebounding in his final year at Louisiana Tech was selected forty seventh by the Utah Jazz. They actually took somebody else at forty six ahead of him. So. Brownie was even on their out of Illinois. Yes, but I will select Paul millsap. At number three and MILLSAP had this this great college basketball career. You know again. Some of it is look at where he played in probably I was scouting. This was this draft was held. The pre-draft camp was held in Orlando. He comes in to that. pre-draft camp out of shape like woefully out of shape. Nan was terrible. Just just flat flatter by one of the guys that like just torpedoed his stock. Because and again I think it probably because he was so far off the radar screen. You know a lot of these. A lot of these players get with really high-profile trainers. The agents get a man. They get their bodies in the best shape of their life. They're looking great. They're playing pickup games against other other prospects and you know they're ready for testing. They're ready for this entire environment. It looked like Paul millsap at the end of the season had just like lived at McDonald's drive-thru for the last for the last two months he. He, he did not have a big time agent. I think it was like his brothers. Cousin or something was his agent, and so in defensive teams that had him going as low as he went, he did not look like he was prepared to make the jump to the NBA and it obviously for scouting reasons I think you could go back in, and you know. Look at that and say look you know millsaps we have seen more out of him out of out of college in and weighed that more heavily than what you saw pre-draft. But. You can't really blame NBA teams when you see a prospect come in out of shape and seemingly sort of indifferent to the process that that's going to raise red flags for teams and leave such an impression, and when you when you are in a system where you're just going home from the dance with one or two players, it's so hard to walk away and say yet. That's our guy. Right and spent especially when our guy didn't come from Duke Right or Kentucky or anything like that if you're from Louisiana attack. You've got it like. Prove something extra. Right to really make teams jump absolutely. He starts his career in Utah and he's. He's actually he's actually kinda solid. Right away. I I mean I so. I covered Utah's playoff series against Golden State that year and to me. So millsaps Carlos Boozer's backup, but if Bob Boozer hadn't been there, I think millsap would put up numbers almost right away. Because every time he came in. He was good. He played as a rookie about fifteen minutes a game in the playoffs. And was was was earning was earning significant minutes, and then it's You know you look at his his pr his advanced statistics. They were always really strong, and it doesn't. It doesn't really take long. For for MILLSAPS TO BE. A really talent play one of these guys that just seems like. He was also kind of perpetually underrated, though his whole career and I don't know if it's because he started at Louisiana attack, or what have you, but one of those guys when you look at it like every year that millsaps been healthy, he has been productive, really talented. NBA Player and a guy that I just think he has made four all star teams. those four years that he was in in Atlanta, but maybe deserved a few more. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's always tough getting named to the team out of the West in Utah. And then he went back to the West with the with the nuggets. Anti like he's still a pretty good player like he's a guy who even this summer will probably get paid as a thirty four year old thirty-five year old, free agent just because he's still a good productive player pretty like for. For A guy who came out as kind of a grunt, you know layups and rebounds Guy Pretty Skilled, not just in terms of shooting, but can handle the ball and pass and do some things. He had some grab and go in him especially as a younger player, just a good overall clare all right the fourth pick in the draft. The Chicago Bulls trade down to spots. Take tyrus Thomas one year out of Lsu. Obviously like a freak athlete, there were some appeal there. It gets a little harder now. I I think those three guys at the top clear top three guys in the draft and then there's a little bit of a drop off here. I'm going to select for the Bulls. A guy that is just had a long long NBA career and another guy that starts off slow. Despite his college pedigree, but really begins to turn it on Jayjay radic at four one of the elite shooters. In the history of the NBA. I obviously bought that and people hated him. At Duke thought he had a bad attitude, there was questions about who he was gonNA. Defend in the NBA with were were accurate whether he was going to be able to be a starter in the NBA or whether he was going to be just the scorer off the bench. He starts his career at Orlando. Pretty Slowly I. Actually six points a game, his rookie season second season, four points a game, an Orlando, third season, six points a game, and he doesn't really take off and tell he gets traded. To Milwaukee, and then those years with the clippers, and the last few years with Philadelphia really really strong. Again sort of finish to his career at thirty five and he was in New Orleans this year is thirty five year old, and still was averaging fifteen points a game and was shooting. You know a terrific forty five percent from the three point line. And then that's that's. That's what radic does. He shoots a high volume of threes, and he shoots the very accurately and credit to him for getting his defense to the point that he could stay on the floor his rookie year, the opposing team went at him every single play as soon as he checked into the game. And he figured it out though he got his defense to the point that teams don't. attack him that way, and that's you know that's that's part of it. If you can at least get your defense competent right then you can be on the court for your shooting and. And make your living that way, but if you're if you're so bad that they're just gonNa is so against you then you got no chat career forty one point six percent three point shooter. On a on a lot of attempts, five attempts game in two thousand fifteen sixteen, maybe his best season, and the NBA led the League at forty seven point five percent from three, while still taking five and a half three game. Okay, John You've got the fifth pick in the draft. This one belonged to Atlanta. They took Sheldon Williams. This is Billy night. The Billy night era, the dark dark dark days, and on time Lanta at the time. Help out your your adopted home team here. Yeah I'm going to take a four time. All Star who is still a halfway decent player in the League Almost a decade and a half later. That is rage on Rondo. Could be a little overrated in some. But actually think in his twenties. He was also just a really good player because he was so good at both ends. Just defensively really active, really smart, crazy long arms for size, never a shooter, and that always hurt offensively, but a really good passer, who, at his peak had enough quickness and speed to Kinda negate the fact that teams weren't guarding him because he could get in the paint so easily so I think overall just a really good player for a number of years in an in this draft there just aren't that many up yet, Rondo. And I debated with Rondo and radic at four. Rondo the talent was clear. There was playoff Rondo was a thing the super competitiveness in intensity with which Rondo played the game. was was amazing. Has the Freakish Hands that his nickname in the draft was e t because of the way how long is fingers were especially and I remember I was at I was in Chicago watching. Guys work out and you know it. It started to be the point. There was a time when I was covering the draft. When just about every prospect would like full on workout for me like they would? They would go play five on five. They would do everything right, and and over the time agents kept pulling back more and more and more now. You're going to see kind of guy. Shooting Jumpers alone in the gym is where it sort of digressed to the problem with Rondo is. You can't show Rondo that way. That's that's the worst possible look for Radon. Rondo and Rondo was all over the board, and so I. Ma- An. An, egging on his agent like there's five on five. There's NBA players out on the floor. You know if he really believe in this guy. Let him go out and run. And finally he caved. Put Rondo out there in Rondo just destroyed, everybody I out there he was so itching again in the game. I mean that was the thing. He was pacing tiger on the sidelines because his agent wasn't gonNA. Let him play when I was there and just went in and destroyed everybody and you could see immediately that competitiveness, the defensive intensity the willingness to pass the ball. Why did he slipped a twenty one? There was a lot of concerns starting Kentucky about how Rondo got along with his teammates. How he got along with his coaches. He was a very difficult player to coach. I, don't think. In the experience with Boston would tell you any differently. That talent was there. His relationship with his teammates was was rocky at times, and and that became the other part of Ron and not only could he not shoot, but when you added him to your roster, there was going to be some chemistry issues and some problems with the coach, and and his teammates, and that just kind of turned out to be true for a lot of his career. Amazing led the League in assists three years. And led the League in steals. One year as well. This is the pick that Phoenix sold I think to Boston Boston was seriously looking at Rondo at seven. before they end up, take the end up trading, Minnesota, who ends up trade, Tradenet airtrades it to Portland, and then then they switched with Minnesota that in Honda was one of those guys that were just all over the place. So then Boston buys back into the first round to be able to get Rondo. And this was the thing they traded for that night Sebastian tell fair as well and so they ended up bringing in both point guards Rondo, until fair and we which turned out to be yet or get. Yeah to pretty good guards in the twenties. Air Rondo a twenty-one Larry, at twenty four. Okay. I want to talk about our new sponsor. ROCK AUTO DOT COM. It's a family business. 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Now which I think is really really cool. and you can mix and match and and. And essentially like build your own box, and so you, and maybe if you got a lot of people in your family or whatever big, it's their favorite, you dislike a lot of variety as well and so as we get back to redrafting the two thousand six NBA draft. I want you to go to bill bar dot. COM Use Promo code locked on, and you'll get ten dollars off your first order. Use Promo CODE LOCKED ON AT BILL BAR DOT COM for ten dollars off your first order. Okay! John Bath! Doing the two thousand six. NBA Redraft. lamarcus Aldridge Larry Paul Millsap J.. RETTIG raise on Rondo off the board one through five. We're not GONNA do pick six through ten. The Blazers. Are On the clock via the wolves. Again it starts to maybe maybe drop off a little bit. This is where I'm going to select. Rudy Gay. Okay he went eight. He moves up two spots. Never lived up to in my mind the potential. That was there in this player good size. Excellent athlete. Could score the ball from multiple places on the floor shot threes. But lacked maybe that killer instinct, or that that intensity or drive, and that was sort of the knock on him at Uconn as well almost almost too smooth gliding through his career. Little bit had a really terrific. Career at Memphis then in Toronto for a couple years. SACRAMENTO, ending his career in San Antonio an Achilles injury along the way, but that's right right Achilles injury. Yeah, yeah, tore his Achilles and at in his I think it was last year in Sacramento, and then signed with San Antonio and still put together would like was really good last year, and then still pretty decent this year. You know we had we had rudy gay obviously my first year in Memphis and The thing to me was less about like he. Him playing hard wasn't a problem just the the fit of guy who was really. trying to be an on the ball score with Zach Randolph and Marcus Saul who kind of needed the ball in the block. It just didn't work, and so that that that was why my first year there. We ended up trading him to Toronto. WE TRADE HIM TO TORONTO A three way deal. We got Ta Sean Princeton Ed Davis in a second round. Pick and What I mean, obviously we had luxury tax issues to that played played into that but. The fit was just better with somebody who didn't didn't need to like. Try to back is down and. Hold the ball and do whatever where we're prince was going to be you know play more of A. Game where he was going to enter the ball in the post, and then you know, be more of a spot up shooter. In retrospect, I wonder if the grizzlies had kept Shane. Batty not made this trade if that would have been the best iteration of this team. That was the trade they made with. Houston it. Was it was? It was strom. Swift and Shane, Batty A, and and Rudy Gay came back to the Grizzlies, and so you're arguing that if they'd kept. Shame, Batty A and moved off and just let rudy gay low to Houston Houston. Take take the pick, yeah! That would have been a much better fit for them long term and and frankly really gays. First season and I'd in Memphis. Was The you know maybe as worst. Okay really gay solid player never made an all star team. Solid starter in the NBA that's were at at six and pick in the draft. Seventh pick goes the walls. This was a trade with the blazers, but also via the Bulls, specimen urged via the the Celtics Best Intel. Fair ends up going. To to Boston the steel. Who Do you have at seven? So, I've actually had this guy higher on my board brandon. Roy and my argument is that so he only played five years. The played five games in a six season when he couldn't. Play Anymore Minnesota, play five. But he was so good for those five seasons to me. The draft is still about the ceiling and about, but as the you know what what produces that most high-end potential outcomes for your team, and so getting Roy at that level where he played, assess especially his second third and fourth years in Portland. Only, a couple of other guys in this draft ever attained anything close to that level, so I think at this point he has to be the pick. Yeah I, I have he was, he was. This is where he was. My board sounds like you had a little higher you know to me because even that two thousand ten eleven season where he only played forty seven games and his production plummeted. Is Phil Go? Percentage plummeted everything plumbing data. We're really talking about three all star seasons and one yen one good ricky season. for him and that that becomes a little tough when rudy gay place fourteen. To me to me. So you have Brandon Roy, playing at an NBA level, his third season on a rookie contract, and then what's unfortunate for the blazers that they escape him a Max Extension? And then he hurt his knee right away. Because the argument you can make is the guys the years. The guy isn't in the league you don't have to. You. Don't have to pay them for. You can get somebody else, but you. It's hard for you to get. Get somebody who plays an all star level at any price, so the that'd be my argument for Roy unfortunately mean thank God for the Blazers. The amnesty rule came in right after that and they're able to kind of wipe that away I guess you know Paul Allen still at the forecast the money, but at least it didn't hurt the happened the rest of their team's development, and it's really interesting, because Kevin Pritchard came heavily under fire. Then forgiving Brandon Roy that extension, but this was a no win situation for Kevin Pritchard. If they said look, we know the knee shaky brandon. Roy has been all everything for us, but now we're just GONNA move on. because we're going to bet that his knee doesn't hold up. He would have been killed. As well for moving, not only was Brandon Roy great player for them. He was very much beloved. By the fan base by the team I. He he sort of had to resign him. And and doubt was what the market was going to be for Brandon Roy his knee blows out the next year. They knew it was a risk coming in But again this is one of those situations where as a fan, it's a lot easier to point fingers and be critical, but when you're sitting in the hot seat is general manager. There really wasn't. A great other option for for Kevin Pritchard at this point either gave away that asset. Let him go sign with another team and handle and bet and gamble that he doesn't get injured in the next couple of years. It is an out being an all star on some other team that you refuse to play. Yeah, it would have been politically untenable. I think not to do that. Max Extension Unfortunately, so there ended up being five guys in this draft that made all star teams. which is. Not Bad if there's GonNa, be another big drop off now. We're at eight. I think at this point you know I. Don't i. don't know Rudy Gay was the selection for the grizzlies. Maybe they don't trade shade, Bat Batty and Strom. Al Swift at the rockets, maybe rockets or are picking here because there's a pretty big drop off at this point in my mind about where older you go here in it, it's GonNa get worse. It's going to like. Drop off a cliff again. And the second. Is this a bad draft? Yeah, like I try to fourteen players. That were like worth selecting. I also was thinking. Maybe we should just cut this off at ten. I thought about having that conversation with do a speed round. I it's, it's that bad. I I'M GONNA. I'M GONNA take a player who's had a long career in the league never been sexy on the offensive end, but has been terrific on the defensive in Taba Cephalonia. Yes my Swiss brother, this high level defender on some really good teams had some. You know it was a was a plates. Point Guard actually when he came up with Chicago. I mean people think of them now is like a three four, but. Has had ball handling chops to him. Never really got to a great place as a shooter that always limited him, but good defender, good athletes, especially as a younger player, good just all around team player was partisan goods teams in Oklahoma City in Atlanta. Yeah, you know it's really interesting. He averages. And this may be tells you a little bit about where we are in the draft. Average is five point seven points per game for his career. And his high mark was eight point two points a game as a thirty-three-year-old in Utah. That was it that was his High Martin. It was interesting in those. Oklahoma City years he went. A couple of seasons for them, two thousand eleven, two, thousand, twelve, two, thousand, twelve, two, thousand, thirteen, where he shot over forty percent from three. Yeah, that that two thousand twelve season shot forty two percent, and took three threes a game. For for a non shooter, and then he sort of regresses right back down at after that to to what he was most of his career but I think the bigger question is as you look at the number field goals attempted. For his career, he averages five field goals attempted game. Yeah he wasn't taking shots. Just wasn't yeah just kind of a kind of a wallflower on offense most of the time. But the defensive presence, and the fact that he did make an impact, and was a starter on some really good teams in Oklahoma City and frankly teams that didn't need his offense because they were loaded on that end made him a great complimentary player on those on those thunder teams. Second Team all defense in two thousand ten. Okay. That's my selection at eight. The warriors are on the clock at nine. They're not gonNA. Take Patrick O'Brien. I guess I think that's a think that's fair. Fairly safe bet. I'm going to take a guy who did not get established in the League until two thousand twelve. Even though this is the two thousand six draft. But is now a starter, and probably currently almost as valuable as anyone from this draught right now, and that is PJ Tucker. Who? With the thirty fifth pick Toronto again. Got A better player thirty five than they did at one. And what do you like about Tucker? I mean just the defense is the biggest thing just so tough and it was hard. He played is a very undersized four at At Texas as especially at the time, and I think it was tougher coming into league, everyone wants to make him a two three and the league kind of evolved to the point where it came back to him a little bit I mean. He got better outside shooter especially from the corner, so that helped, but I think one of the big things that help. The League started sizing down and started vowing. Vowing more kind of the things he could give you in terms of being tough and switchable and able to use his body and get under big, but not not necessarily like a rim protector anything, and and so now he probably has as much value as he's ever had as thirty three thirty four year old. It's really interesting. His career he, he actually played seventeen games his rookie season for Toronto. And then he's out of the League for the next five years, and he goes to Israel goes to Ukraine. He goes back to Israel. He goes to Greece. He goes to Italy. He goes to Germany. I mean this guy is moving all over the pro leagues. Throughout throughout Europe and doesn't come back and tell he's with Phoenix, and he's a twenty seven year old, and for most NBA players that that's a death nail being five years out of the League. I don't care what sort of career you're having in. Europe NBA Tinkle's guys never come. Teams aren't GonNa, touch you in. It doesn't often make sense for them to come back. Back because they're if they're good overseas, they're making enough money and they're playing a big role on their team that the comeback and be Ed role player in the NBA make a lot less money actually doesn't make a lot of sense for him. PJ Tucker gambled on himself, and it paid off, but actually very rare profile for a player to come back and do that. Okay the tenth pick in the draft. Seattle selected Mohammed Cyrus, Sunday just think they looked at his seven foot, eight wingspan, and said we'll take you. that. Was a a major mistake. And may have been the biggest bust of any any of the top prospects in this draft. I'm GONNA give them. The number one pick in the draft here. Andrea Bariani. Oh okay this won't. He didn't have Brandon Roy numbers, but there was a couple of years in the league. We're bar. Yanni actually looked like he might. Be something. He averaged twenty one point. He was twenty one points a game. In Two thousand ten eleven season for Toronto Nineteen and a half points a game in two thousand eleven two thousand twelve season. and. For early in his career, and this is a really sort of weird fame. He was actually he could could stretch the floor and really shoot shoot. He shot forty one percent from three, two, thousand, eight, thousand nine season's third year in the League, thirty-seven percent kind of drops off a cliff later his. His. I'm glad you brought that. His non development as a shooter I. Think was a big surprise like. As much as much as Toronto shouldn't have taken number one. I still thought he'd be better than this. And the reason is like his his stats from Europe were pretty good for a young player and his potential as a shooter. I think was really. Really tempting you really thought he could get to a place where he was a reliable pick and pop weapon. Who could maybe like you know be forty percent being sort of an Italian. Dirk almost not that level. He was never that athlete or anything, but just in terms of being a big could stretch the floor and confused defenses, whatnot and you just never got their man. He didn't get there. And I think one of the things that is the curse of being the number one pick, and in this case, Bryan Colangelo Fed into this was the comparisons the dirk he was gonna be the next. Dirk Colangelo was. Referred to him. In in those context himself at times, and so you're comparing him. To a hall of Famer. And he was never going to get there in part because he didn't have as you pointed out dirks athleticism. and. That was going to be a major major difference in Bariani and Dirk. He also was a poor rebounder. Defensively he was he was nothing, and and that's putting a and I. You so he was. What he was and that was a a big that could stretch the floor and could score the basketball a bit and and I think that those expectations being the number one pick loomed over him. You'd Kinda hoped when he went to New York when he was. When the Knicks decided that Bariani was going to be. One of the worst trades ever what were the details of that trade again with mixed, gave up a first and a second to get barn. Yanni even though he like his contract was terrible. WHO's making over ten million I? Want to say this was. This is at a time when not a lot of guys did and. The next set, a first anti second to Toronto in order to acquire him any played a grand total of seventy one games over two seasons. For them to of the worst seasons of his of his career played one more year in Brooklyn, and was done, but if you look compared to the rest of the guys I think we're GONNA. Talk about about peak Bariani. In two thousand, nine, through like two thousand and twelve you. You had a guy who have nothing else could stretch the floor and put up twenty points at night on an NBA eighteen, which is pretty hard to say about anybody else. That's left on this list than why I have him at ten. Okay, let me tell you about my secret weapon for learning new things and getting ahead. It's hard to find the time to sit down and read and learn more when you don't have free time. You can't read or work on personal development. There is an incredible APP that solves this. This problem and I highly recommend it. It's called blinking blinking has really unique, and it works on your phone. Your tablet or your web browser blinking takes the best key takeaways the need to know information from thousands of nonfiction books and convinces them down and digest. 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John who do you have at eleven? I'll give him the same initials. undrafted out of northeastern university, still ticking fourteen years later JJ berea world champion with Dallas. had a forgettable three year interlude in Minnesota and otherwise been a maverick, the whole time and I think that's worked out. Great for Dallas it really has and you know. You think about scouting and JJ BEREA and you understand why he wasn't selected in the draft right, he doesn't really. Short tiny arms, not a great athlete like you know all, not even a great shooter. A great shooter! I mean really play the game. But as far as like draft metrics ago, it was sort of understandable that he went undrafted. Absolutely yeah, and and this is again. You know those metrics. Can all say whatever they WANNA say, but sometimes guys just really know how to play in the end they figure out a way to minimize their weaknesses and maximize their strengths in the NBA and credit to Jj Beret in Dallas for making that happen. Yeah absolutely, I don't know if he was in this year's draft with that. Golly resume whether he would go in the first round. This is a really rocky draft twenty twenty, so maybe Segura okay. New Orleans on the clock. They took Hilton Armstrong. Now, Disastrous draft for New Orleans here because they adjust elected. Chris Paul and David West the previous drafts, and they a two picks in the top fifteen here this is really the chance to cement that team and make it a you know an elite elite team for number years in the West and they missed on both picks with Armstrong and Cedric Cima and the one thing that I say though is I'm not sure they were gonna hit. I mean we're at the point when I'm like you know they. They weren't going to add to that core. With any of these guys that's left I'm going to give them. and. Again this is. Not really sure who to give them here. I'm going to give them Randy Foye and You, know He. He was never what we thought. He was going to be out of Villanova. A guy that that looked like he was going to be able to play multiple positions, and and was going to be a strong shooter and score. In the NBA his best season was his third year in Minnesota. Where averaged sixteen points? A game and four assists the game and and. Looked like maybe he was going to be an up and coming player, but after that became a journeyman with the Washington with the clippers went to the jazz went to the nuggets went to o'casey for a year back to Brooklyn. There's a number of guys that I could sort of select that sort of fit that profile I'd say that Randy foyers I three years in the league, and then as a sort of middle section there with the clippers. And Jazz probably warranted him going a little bit higher for me but Randy foy or I think whoever we're going to select with. The next two picks wasn't going to be the guy that was gonna put. At the next level? no, no certainly not okay. the Bulls are on the board at thirteen. They got this pick from the seventy sixers. Yeah, so I'm going to take a guy who actually did end up playing for the Bulls a few years later. Ronnie Brewer! Kinda forget about him because he's his career flamed out around twenty thirteen, but. Started over three games in the NBA. Was a starters starter for some good Utah Game Utah teams when he came his second and third season. League, especially and then. The League really evolved away from him because he could not shoot. And although he was athletic and decent, defender could run the floor and do some things I think as the year after year, his inability to shoot just became more and more of a drag, and especially as he got later into his twenties s in Las math lettuce, but just got to the point where he couldn't have modern. But I mean the that start of his career was still really good certainly compares favorably to what went on. This board is Ryan So. You know it's a double figures score his second third season and did it like as a role player. Did it efficiently. You know shot fifty five point eight percent second year, so I I'm going to go on. I had as well. You know this is actually really weird for his bad draft the. Grasping for straws like our our thirteen guys have been the same thirteen guys that that says something that with very little hat variation I Ronnie brewer here as well, and and I think that's just a great point I actually really liked Friday brewer coming out I actually watching him as a twenty two year old twenty-three-year-old in Utah, you would not have predicted what was going to happen with the rest of his career, and how quickly it was, go downhill from there, and I think to your point. The League evolved away from Ronnie Brewer as much as his game deteriorated and You know that happens. Okay you leave me with the jazz at fourteen. I looked at this list like twenty times to try to find the. Pick is a real barrel skirt for dear. The draft I just think I ended up settling on like longevity maybe. With a thirty second pick in the draft. Steve Novak Marquette. Okay, and you know the one thing that you can say about Steve Novak was that he was a career, forty three or forty three percent. Three point shooter in the League could stretch. The floor was valuable in that way never had a season where he averaged a double digits, did have a season in two thousand eleven and twelve for the Knicks when he led the League in three point percentage and taking five threes a game, but even then he was, he was good that that you're in New York at five three game and somehow still didn't average ten points a game. And that you know that that that's kind of all, you need to know that season he only. Of of his field goal attempts for the season he took six field goals. A game and five of them were threes. That's my guy. All right journeymen around the board. You WanNa. Fight me on anybody else. was there a guy that you had at fourteen that you like better? There's nobody. I didn't have no back at Fourteen I. Actually had a booby Gibson but. Like. This is not a fight. Worth Guy All right? We will not fight overby Gibson. Let's where maybe there's some fun in this draft is doing some CSI at what happened in the top of this draft, so let's start with Adam Morrison. What went wrong, so I think there were a lot of red flags coming right out and just in terms of. Athletic indicators were coming out against SAGAS. Think are writing about this at at the time, And Analytically. there. There are some things that really made you wonder if he was going to be able to make the transition. And unfortunately, all those things played out. He obviously had a knee injury, too, which didn't help because he was already at a little bit of a deficit athletically. Then just a guy who's whole game was built on tough twos was now trying to take even tougher twos at a pro level and it just at some level just didn't work. You know all of this hype was essentially generated around his junior season averages twenty eight points a game. In the college basketball said, which is really remarkable, and in that season one thing that dramatically improves as it goes from being a thirty percent. Three point shooter is I two years in college to being a forty three percent three point shooter. And you know. That was part of his game that he really added. By if you look at. Everything else there was questions about that in a and turns out that he kind of regressed back to the mean, even as a shooter. In the NBA Lynn. Even Britain didn't even really bring that to the table. I think the even scouting him. There was there was questions about it couldn't offend anybody. We knew that was going to be a major issue. And then as you said his creativity and being able to get shots was really fun to watch in college, but you wondered when he gets around more athletic defenders, and he's already having to do and make these incredibly tough shots just to get his points. What that's GonNa look like in the NBA and actually almost feel. It was kind of predictably played out the way. That most of the concerns about him. At the questions that people are asking like all of them were answered. All the concerns were. Yeah, that's a concern. Yeah and the you know the diabetes as well I think was a a you know clearly also played a role. In all this. Fair Point yes. Absolutely, he was frustrated. Though and you know I've I've I've heard him talk. You know since then that he doesn't didn't feel like he got maybe the fair shot. In the NBA as well and you know that's that's it. It's really tough when you go from averaging twenty eight points a game on a team like Gonzaga. You're sort of a national icon hero to come into the NBA and like what is just has to happen for almost all of these players at least for the elite. You've got to start to fill a role. And and do something that makes your team better and it wasn't clear what Morrison could actually do. he wasn't going to score efficiently. It wasn't going to defend who was going to rebound What does he do? To really move the needle for your team. Just an in a series of Charlotte mess ups. This one was was pretty dramatic. Because at least at this point, there were other guys on the board that that certainly could have been better. Let's talk about Tyrus Thomas. What happened with Tires Thomas? Good Player for a little while like we see it taken thirteen or fourteen, just as easily is first season, Charlotte after they traded for him was actually really good. Then he started having a knee problems and everything went downhill because there was just no skill level to have to be foundation for him, so it was all athleticism. Run Dunk Block shots so once that some of that bounce went away in a game, just got really hard for him. He needed to be that crazy. Energy Guy, and you know project guys and I'm all for that. I hate just. Looking at a prospect insane will. This is what he can't do and so never be able to do it I mean we just talked about Kyle lowry, and and what he ended up learning how to do, but for someone like tyrus Thomas this was a clear case of embrace what you do well, and you'll be okay in the league, but if you try to be Kobe, Bryant, you're going to bust. Sheldon Williams. Yeah, I mean I. saw him a bunch I. Don't think this is the case, red flags or anything he just he just wasn't that good and shouldn't have been the fifth pick. Right like there's there's no mystery here. You should have been in the twenties. Thirties on on a draft board. Yeah and The hawks just. Lost their minds. Taking five I mean this was What you know we knew actually there was a lot of. There is a lot of rumblings that this was the guy that they'd locked in early on him. Whatever but everybody was like they're not actually going to do it or they're going to trade down in the draft of getting or whatever awful. Patrick O'Brien. Yeah. He you know. That was like a speculative pick a little bit like he'd had a pretty good year Bradley right, but he wasn't. It wasn't what it wasn't drafted based on what he was. He was drafting people projecting ahead for what he might be certainly not as quite as desperately as Muhammad Senate was, but it was the same idea right well, he I mean he did have that. One assist and I do mean one. He had one career assists career now. In fairness, he played two hundred and sixty minutes. So, his career wasn't much of a career. Obviously, people are thinking about shot-blocking being being his assistant turnover ratio. Fifteen turnovers. That's gotta be some sort of historic number as well. Yeah one assist to forty four fouls. That's. There's well. I feel like the NBA made. From these sorts of picks. I'm trying to think like in the last five or six years where anybody's done something like Muhammed Cyrus any. And I and I don I I just don't think so I think that. Maybe maybe he became the cautionary tale about just taken international player based off a physical profile and hoping that the turnout, or if they've done it, and they've done it like Bruno was the twenty first pick or something twenty nobody they haven't done it a ten. And but Bruno had some game. Right now whether translate the NBA or not I mean sire. Sunday was like the only thing could say about his game was that he was really long in that he you could project him as a shot blocker. All right. That was the two thousand six. NBA Draft. Let us never speak of it again. You've been listening to chat. Ford's big board. Thanks for listening to the lockdown podcast network for off now Jackie Alka daily locked on podcast network for your favorite. Find it right now in your favorite podcast APP and be sure to subscribe or follow, so you never miss an episode? The lockdown podcast network your team every day.

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The Greatest F1 Team - Team Principal

The Autosport Podcast

25:58 min | 6 months ago

The Greatest F1 Team - Team Principal

"The greatest one team. Hello and welcome to the final part of what is being a very special seven We've attempted to answer the question. What with the lineup of the greatest F. One team look like from Race Engineer. Team principal lead to lead drive at chief designer and even the ready coveted number. Two driver's fault we've set out to build an F one team made of the best that has ever been. Iron House panel made up all of our F. One experts from across the globe have all pick individuals throughout history. That they believe are the greatest of all time and in this series. We've been discussing the careers under winus of the individuals that have made it into the top three for each joke role. I'm jess highest. And today I am joined by James Allen John Noble then Anderson and Rebecca could so I reckon everyone but want to be a team principal given the past anelle disposal but what does the ideal candidate need to be good at? What makes a great team? Principal STANDOUT OVER. The key thing is just being all areas. You can't just be strong in one area. Econ speak to get in the sponsors in. Just be good at managing the drivers. You conscious be good at dealing with the politics you need to be there across all areas and keep things under control And I think all our a top three team principles all delivered this their most accessible peaks of their careers They've will lead from the front stood out in the crowds and they've all proved to be moss strike in winning championships. It's unbelievably difficult to win in formula needing to win World Championship. It's been when multiple world championships is. All three of our finalists of dom is odd. Takes an awful lot of them because it's like it's like a bar soap. It's always on the move. He's just keeping hold things in an someone wants to lead. This wants more money in that drive to keep a winning team together is really hard and then to motivate them to win again and again and again even though it might look easy for me. Outsca IDAHO YOU know. These teams winning multiple Welsh Car Course Are But just having the best just having the best drive of getting to that? Point is unbelievably difficult. So I think that's why it's been good that you've signed this to the last of the series early. Because this is the ultimate row because Ev Fountain at everything comes from the team principal younger I team principal. Younger right designer. The right drivers in anybody people don't want the team with the right team principally they on the the team so it's it's fundamentally important massively difficult to do. Well let's look at the passing. We find in third place as voted by our panel of experts from around the world. And it's going to be one of the most iconic names in Formula One. That still carries his name to this day. That's of course Steph. Frank Williams who founded the team his own team in nineteen seventy seven and was celebrating the first win two years later at remarkably US drivers and constructors well championship in nineteen eighty. And they want to be the last of his winds. He really is emerges sport legend. Isn't he yeah he's He's lost of the MOHICANS. The among our our shortlist echoes. If Chapman far came before oversee he competed against a guy who's founded a team from nothing. I started by entering customer. 'cause then decided to strike as a constructor. He was much derided early on in his team cooling wanker Williams but he pressed on forced amazing partnership with Patrick Head. That team to the very a. You could argue that you know as time has gone on. Williams's obviously declined incredible success Through the nineties recapture the glory as with BMW in the two thousands maybe some strategic decisions when against them. I should frank given up more control to allow seem to modernize but you have to hand. It in. His team is still going and night. Chapman's tain latest STA- declined in his later years Ferrari. Before his death they went going through the best of times. It's very hard to stay on top as change saying earlier even to get to. The top is extraordinarily difficult site. You have to hand Frank Williams. He's probably not the guy you'd you would want running on modern great steph form team considering that Williams has been in decline for a while now and they have won a race in two twenty twelve. And we've only won one since two thousand and four but nevertheless the legend Formula One. Somebody that we should definitely acknowledge that Frank Williams is not only a fantastic principle. Listen example of the termination because Rennie stocked to follow his dream. E was not a very good condition. E E bill this team from the ground so it was not easy to start so yes to do a lot of problems because was not easy especially the first couple of years but the way you build the so big company into mortal sports fighting with the big factor because of course they time also providing wasn't while the doctor will feature was is an example of patient. When you when you're really believe in something and you spend all your entire life to follow your dream. Sometimes you sacrifice everything our new also there that the human relationship because you out totally folk who said when your target for me. This is an example for a lot of people and I think now is more difficult to find the person that every time is ready to risk himself everything just because he want to to to see his dream realized in the sporting the target that the achieve was absolute Testing I think the number of people might be a little surprised. That is not wrong. Dennis rather than Frank Williams. I think it's seems class finding the balanced decision of this wide level. Our F when experts from across the world. But I think for me what makes Frank Stand up a Ron? Dennis is one of the points That which is he used. Determination outside apples that resilience solvency coming back from his nineteen ninety-six road accident to then. How will the success to be had but I think it also speaks about the way that he built a team. In how empowered the team around it mentioned actors fundamentally Off of the success of Williams. I always used to say Ron. Dennis was the best and worst thing about McLaren because we such a big personality. Sat Dad. You couldn't really get away from that wears with Frank Williams. It's I think the fact that he was sort of Sorrento had multiple phases of success which which is difficult every extended period of time but those are the fact that people have bathroom empowered and he's organizations than they were in Rome. Dennis is in my is why he made the two thousand three and runs Frank won't be running on pavement. Fortunately and nor will the current FAA president. John Todd now. Obviously Ferrari has always been a high pressure environment and that hasn't always lead to success and before taught became team. Principal Ferrari had gone eleven years without a constructors title and fifteen. Without a driver's he built the team that would go wants dominate the early two thousands. Just how did he turn that around? These friars ruled viewed as united. The Shoemaker Gloria's and brilliant job Michael Jordan but actually it was all the results of what Jonathan to turn for around scared of the old. Furry mentality come into this. New reactive racing team wasn't straight straightaway didn't come easily difficult early years trying to turn things around and get them going but once he hit his stride once they got but Dream Team's cover of Schumacher Ross brawn. Rory Byrne John Todd you know they pushed on and paradorn an a brilliant brilliant era Formula One and three John was a brilliant team principal roofless times unpopular times but three all is number one focus winning And the end of the day is your drop as team principal. The number one responsibility is victory. The rebuild challenge that John Leads to. Diaries is not to be underestimated when he went that they didn't have a gearbox departments in. Marinella informant while it was in Surrey so I mean there was so much work to do. I'm in bed. I was watching biography. Michael Schumacher. John gave me a lot of a lot of times and he was sort shining around it that before. He got that if you like. And he said it was like kind of creaking old building that has some wonderful architectural features but basically ahead interiors just needed to be completely refurbished and essentially what he did Starting just after his his run of success. Excuse me with pleasure and building the team up for MEG. And then putting the right pieces in place obviously Michael Schumacher was a fundamental Came along in nineteen ninety six and then Ross Brune in nineteen ninety seven alert. They added some extra personalities. That was Kinda cool about team. The way they operate it was on a Fair so the principal figures. Todd ruin the shoe Mecca Montanelli but none of the wanted to let the other one down and it was just this e credibly intense so to grew a leadership group. The top of which Schumacher was definitely off the meant that they will always always always striving for that extra few percent occasionally them across the line carries neither. Do some things that were not particularly popular. Whether it's t motors decisions. Some strange stuff. Lighten Black Flags and so to get out in the steward's removed was kind of thing but they will absolutely bang up against the limit of what was what was permissible de. Never wanted to let each other down. I think that's what made that team. So so unbeatable. I think that quarry that are two points that might be of the coupons for the success of jumped out the first one that he was able to choose the right people and When each as you said the sproul cash market Audebert that that was very top-class in slow the second one is that e the responsibility over everything in Maranello that was a big risk because in case of bad result of course he was the first one that still be fired but he said I am the team principal. I am the boss and the everybody must follow Meyer. That is not easy. Ferrari because there are a lot of politics in the history and it's a very crucial I think that the is the only way to run properly for if you want to run property you bus heads. The complete control of the debt was John. Paul was able to have it to able to establish a new culture a long established team which is extraordinarily difficult to do especially when that team has gone through a long period of failure in an underachievement. I think he can make a really really strong case for being the number one choice for fifteen principles ferry very close. Run thing A great hit rate was almost a hundred wins. I think in fourteen seasons there you know he set the template radio think for being a modern team principal in charge of a monolithic organisation hundreds of people disparate departments. Trying to bring together while dating with politics an issue in the final reckoning. Hold against him the fact that he's in charge of Ferrari to have special standing within the school had a veto with the rose. Will these kinds of things and of course when route changes did come up to threaten Ferrari's again? The the two thousand point they did they did struggle and didn't quite recapture their their former glory. So he couldn't. He couldn't renew the team really having established that dominant runways she mecca at Towel. But nevertheless you make radio strong case for I think if you WANNA join analyze what is specialty was Roberto saying. I think it's that commitment Incentive was was sort of the ultimate example of commitment is a racing driver things. The same is true with talk to whoever is working for whatever badges got on his shirt whether or whether it's Ferrari whether it cepheid today would go through a brick wall so that organization. He wasn't the owner Frank. Williams was the name of the. He was always an employee but he was employee listening. Would go through a brick wall to achieve what he wanted to achieve him. That's what made specialist team principal. But that's not quite enough to lead our team because our team principal is actually betted towards run of five consecutive drivers and constructors titles. And of course we're talking about a satin. Mr Toto Wolff Mercedes is now one the past six championship doubles anti-thai Wolf has been the man seeing all and a k. the team took advantage of the new power unit. Regulation twenty fourteen but through all the rule changes since then nobody can seemingly managed to end the run. So what makes wolf just so don good? I think it's the way the way the championships have on from each other. New Challenges overcome all the time when when the titles one in two thousand fourteen People put it down. Oh the best engineers by far the best. This is why they wanNA talk little bit. As the years went on as the rules were changed. Is the challenges. Came up of drivers of new era rules as just got better and better and better organization No complacency Taito management style has allow people to flourish Kept the team very very consistent and the best people And I think those those qualities ability to harness people. He's got much in the right way. get a very unified team. Is I think just put some above the rest right now. What surprised me a lot. Is that Mercedes? Looks like a magic box. I mean game sale is on was fired by Ratty Andy Mercedes is doing from dusty job. The same had been sweet out. Costar was the Cincinnati fighting by fanatic. And then he must see does he. Different dusty jump. What surprised me. A lot is the relationship incitement. Cdc's disease from Iran lease ward where people is constantly and oppression. But I think don't talk. Create the system that the for me. It's difficult for space difficult to understand. But he create a system where the people is the condition to give this one hundred percent. We doubt politics and without stress. That is something that consent you to reduce New People into the place people but we know effect in the result is not one main show e create. The system that for me is the best quality at the best part of the job. That thought did the last ten years. He's got this line. I don't know how to design Surface but I know everything about the guy who does. I think that's exactly right. He goes back to what Ben was saying on about culture of see told had to come into Ferrari adapt a longstanding coach to be what he wanted it to be sort of an iron fist whereas with toto obviously Ross Perot lovely establishing work building up that team from bridging from home. A broom into early diocese. But what hotel did and when you get a chance to cover these service. Cd's and talked to him about it. He's April combination about modern psychology German military tactics and all sorts of other things together into this management style. Whether is a no fare coach? You know they don't blame the person. They blamed the problem that the nonsense that everything an everything that they do. They just do it better than everybody else. Now if you look at times in how he's aged how he's gone over the last six or seven years it's taken a lot out to them and that's why it's interesting at the moment to see what he's going to do next and how much longer he'll carry on doing this full. Because he's obviously ultra high achiever. But what else does he got left. What else do ambitions contain an? I'm fascinated to see that I think it was very close between him and solve this crisis referencing principle but just the creation the shit depths of of culture. I think he think the only criticism you could probably level types of is that this thing that James Lead to that. He kind of inherited the team in a way that taught didn't up that sent. He also supercharged. Mercedes through the hybrid arena. He's made much more of what is there. He's created this culture as we said of FEHB also have accountability so every employee there is is able to express how they feel about how things are going without fear or favor and they can attack legs. Problems unimproved the fact. They've been able to sustain they rom. Three to significant rule changes over the last few years may not that some precedents is far as we can see and his hit rate of success beyond the fact that he's got the stakes and six compared to five and five. Mercedes one something like ninety two races in seven years with taught at the helm you know. That's that compares to talk winning a ninety nine fourteen years so incredibly efficient in terms of winning and he'll say manages it with the other things you know he's he's good on the politics He's a good front man for the tape. He manages the commercial side. He started that team in a way that makes it not too depending on the parent company. Daimler I it. Sustainability and another key thing is that he's been able to get the most out of historic driver Lewis. Hamilton Lewis is better bathroom better with Taito at the Hellman. Lewis speaks really highly of title. As does James Allison him as the best boss. They've had in foam and that speaks volumes. The other thing about wolf is that he doesn't have a background. As a manager he was an investor many was sheldon Williams. He got the opportunity to become a manager Obviously he's had to his management style in the job from the get-go winning world championships where we'll see John had many many years Managing Persia teams etc etc. Before that and I think that's the most remarkable thing about about such a wolf is he. He told himself to become manager literally whilst winning his also had varied experiences dealing with different types of Dr Relationships. You know you've had the the equal number ones of Rosberg and Louis where you're trying to control to drive coming through championship. Who are totally loggerheads? We each other dealt with the controversies. The Monaco Escape Road Instagram Nikko. The Spanish Grand Prix in two thousand sixteen when the Pack Alighted Subsequent Collisions. He's dealt with a lot but he's also managed to utilize the arrival of protests. The facts made Lewis a bit more comfortable and rather than allowing Louis to back off against your comfort zone and not be a strong. He's actually used it in a way of getting more of Louis had that long winter chat entitles kitchen where they went through their relationship while they fought each other is lifted. Lewis to a new high. And I don't think we've seen Louis better than he is right now if we could put it down to one thing or is it simply a the fact that he seems to hold many skills. But I'm really interested to know if you have to pick one aspect of titleist pass or management style that puts him head and shoulders above the rest. What would that one element Bay is apply colleges? He knows perfectly out to approach the people in a different way and that is a very good quality especially run would have to to what a lot of people every people is different than Eat knows how to approach everything. The best where everybody in the best way and a the same time and other big quality. I think he's able to predict the future so he I think at the moment is the best team brings Because E is able to know before all the rest of the field what is GonNa Happen? This is not a very good quality. For increase to human psychology side. It comes to most of having significant intellectual. He's very very bright like any. He's never satisfied with anything. He's always trying to learn some more senior situations where he's drilling able for information about how they manage this situation. You know the people from op spend time with him. Brian for the event ones the boss of the cycling this one older Toda Francis and he was drilling in for information about how keeps the team on the bubble in always ready to go again so the next year? So the phones. So it's just that relentlessness I think is wall marks out any great in our sport whether you're a driver or MSCI mechanic aura. A Race Engineer. You have to always be seeking mall. They have to always be relented to see looking to improve yourself and everybody around you and I think that's that's that's what it is within. Yeah he says that same trait with Lewis. Hamilton is easy. Well it can happen when you on top you can get complacent Could back-off Jomo talking about this earlier. As well with Ross wig out with the team suddenly off to twenty sixteen Louis could have Perhaps but Louis stays on it. He keeps trying to get better chases as he describes it ghost 'cause when he's out on track and I think Taito is of a similar stock you know he's he's never satisfied even when they winning. He's always looking to improve looking to stay on top and cross the opposition. Is that relentlessness? James said stands in my car and it seems all winners up pretty pleased that they've been placed in the positions on our greatest f one team because once again. We have a message from the winner. Let's take it across to missed a tie wolf. Hi everybody trusted afford. I would like to say thank you to the Motorsport Network. Journalists that have participated in the voting and I must say very Hambo to have been elected the best team principal. When when? I'm looking at all those names Giant and particularly Frank Williams they role models for me shrinks Stamina Andrews. Zillions is incredible and I was able to blog and watch from him was at Williams at the end of the day. We old just figureheads for the team. Every single individual in the team deserves that credit. And this is why I would like to pass on this award. This prize to everybody within Macedo. Swiss had to make races and titles. I'm also very happy to see. Many of my teammates haven't been elected in the top three on medals and bundle to guys who Trends WITH RUSSIA. Very very strong bond as well as royals who have been the Johnny and and of course Lewis who has won the type based tribal as you know Lewis and I are very very close and seeing income out on top so we won the team principal. We've on the driver is great. So thank you very much and again you know the strength of the pack so this is a price for all of US federal budget. Thank you again for the. But I think it's safe to say that our team is in rather good hands and he completes our lineup so we now have paid Bonington. As Race Engineer Adrian newly as chief Designer Stefan Melancholy as sporting director Ross brawn as technical director Sustaining Moss as number two driver Lewis Hamilton. Taking the lead as on the one driver and of course we've talked it all off today with title Wolf as team principal. Good look stopping that lot. I think is safe to say but do you think you could put together a better team than our panel of Global F one experts. That is know your lineup in the comments. Thanks ever so much for joining us on this special series Lookout for more special series coming your way across the motorsport network channels at thank you for joining us. And we'll see next time. Thanks so much for back.

principal Frank Williams Ferrari Hamilton Lewis John Louis Mercedes Schumacher Ross brawn Dream Team US IDAHO World Championship Principal Ferrari Lewis Hamilton James Michael Schumacher Race Engineer Iron House chief designer
The Safdie Brothers Talk Uncut Gems, Kevin Garnett, and the New York Knicks

The Full 48

36:18 min | 1 year ago

The Safdie Brothers Talk Uncut Gems, Kevin Garnett, and the New York Knicks

"The full forty eight is supported by. Cvs Health where pharmacies are just part of what they do from home care managers to administering intravenous treatments and patients living rooms. They bring care to those who need help most from refusing to sell tobacco to making older own skin care products Paran free. Cvs Health knows what you don't don't sell is as important as what you do. And when you put people at the heart of health people take health to heart. Cvs Health where health is everything. Not all services available allstate's problems. It's human nature to hate problems. But why is that after. All problems inspire spire us to mend things. Ben Things make things better. That's why so many people work with IBM on everything from city. Traffic to ocean plastic nick new schools to new energy flight delays to food safety smart loves problems IBM. Let's put smart to work. Mark visit ibkr dot com slash smart to learn more. It's forty eight hours senior. NBA Writer for bleacher report man. I'm I am thrilled today to be joined by two guests. Their brothers I wanted just introduce them as long suffering knicks fans. That's redundant and it doesn't do them justice. They are the writers and Directors Uncut Gems starring. Adam Sandler Kevin Garnett. That's coming out on Christmas. It is awesome Joshua Benny Safdie. Thank you so much for making time. This honor thank you know honor Honoris mind all right so I've seen your movie now twice the second time right. So here's the thing. It's the first time I saw it knowing nothing about it. At when you guys at the screening at Lincoln Center on that was phenomenal. I was sitting two rows behind Elton brand. I was amazed. Yes yeah he was. There was awesome. It was and then I got them to send me a screener because I want to refresh my memory for this interview. Guys is stressed the fuck out of me at times. Did you set out to making making movie. That would stress the hell out of me but I guess anybody 'cause that's kind of the thrill was cool about that screening and Lincoln Center was. You could feel I watched a bunch of it with the audience as you can feel the whole audience because it's a thriller. You know what I mean you can. You can feel the whole audience like know what it's like to have a one hundred fifty five thousand dollars on basketball game and be stressed out by it but also the laughter like the Sandler. The humor of it was like this cool release so it was it. What what that's very very satisfying to know that we went we set out to make this movie? That's a thriller. It's supposed to be intense and then but also know that. There's a strange comedy element. Tim It is it is it is rare like wall. We were kind of in the post editing. That three seconds could make or break. A scene held too long for three seconds. It didn't work and so you really. We are dealing with milliseconds so there was this idea that this was a moment in the movie where once it clicked in. It doesn't let up which I I. I remember some years ago. My God that ending go from what point and then they only twenty minutes to Syria. Where and then they told me a moment those like forty five minutes? No Oh there it is there are there are many moments that worth detention is just peaking. And we're going to try to keep the spoiler free so we won't spoil anything about any a piece of that ending never-ending an- but no it was the other part about this. Of course I just have to say this. There's a lot of people like saying like fuck you Howard Howard. That was just like you. Yes earlier for me you know like do people call you Howie high school years and some and some college years then I moved away from it and then my byline became Howard Beck and so anybody who calls me how. He's either knew me from a certain period of time or just like trolls on twitter. Trying to just just like pick. It sounds somehow more denigrating. Really Nice. Take Howie like good call. Howie I think how what's funny is? I've found that certain people in the promotion in this movie likes to call our main character Howie even though he gets Howard most of the throughout the movie but how we all get how he but people feel so comfortable with him they feel like they know him so well that they can just call them out so I think it's an endearing. What's what's it's in slaughterhouse? Five I think his name I forget what. What's the main characters name? But what he goes goes by an e and his father tells him always do that because people always feel closer to you. Yeah some way just by the nature of hearing that kind of fun. It's like sparky Anderson. Anderson could be like seventy five years old. But he's sparked Bobby Knights Somehow. Maybe they thought that would soften him not not sure that last name is the scariest last time with a K.. So congrats on the movie. People are going to love when they get to see it. I'm going to be the first to declare. I think I'll be the first time I've not seen this anywhere else. This is a basketball movie. Diehards Christmas movie this. This is absolutely a basketball movie. Otherwise why would it be on my pocket. Did you set out at some point. I know this was ten years in the making. Did you set out to whether it was combining what you guys knew of the Diamond District and the jewelry operations from your father. Who as I understand it worked briefly or just your passion for basketball where you're looking for an excuse? Excuse to get basketball into a movie that you were making how. How did how did that become the kind of the underlying kind of all of the above? Yeah basketball has always been I. I mean I remember I read. We recently moved to Pat Riley which I didn't know he was going to be at the screening lose their and someone said they were telling all these people who are in the screening and it was humbling and crazy but I when I heard pets name. I don't know how I was very conflicted. Because gave us the calls came I. I loved him him as a kid. Then I hated and I remember when it showed up for that first game and he member you go to the whole garden give it to me. And then they got they. They actually got the he got hit with the tampering. So when I met him I in this is you know this also goes to like you. Know like a big talker. When I see this person in my mind Second Amendment was like Oh my God I wanted to call them pat? I want to see the bag out exactly when I met him. I wanted to call him pat the rat but I just like to Riley right in the hallway. I'm like Josh. Pat Pat the rat and then as soon as all its when I asked him I question asked him was play was to go down to doing. Wasn't it and he's like John was supposed to lure one out of the paint faked three dumbed down to ewing for for the jam that we have a chance. said he said if a Lajoie didn't go out your shoot but he did and he should have pat. I remember being a kid and and I remember I remember this is becoming relevant. Remember being a kid and obviously stark Scott us. You know we wouldn't have been in that position if you didn't shoot at our way anthony but remember being so upset John starks. I I loved him and then the closest thing I ever got him later on his JR Smith. But John starks was. I was so upset. Set cried and I was so angry and I remember carrying my basketball to the park and thinking to myself I give my heart to anyone ever again. The Way I gave my heart to the Knicks Wchs and should be out your twitter handle which no no no no. That's just basketball stuff. John Stark's sucks and but anyway so so that you know there was there's always been two loves in my life and I think that they're the two loves. I think they're related. It's movies and basketball and and we did. A documentary called Lenny Cooke that kind of combine. The did obviously literally combine the two basketball documentary. But there's a pace and a speed to the sport and I think it's and there's a Drama and and start him to the sport which I think is the reason why the second growing fastest growing sport in the world. It's the exposure. It's the fact that there's all these mini dramas Thomas You know look at the rockets clippers game the other day the drama between Russell Westbrook impact beverly is. You can't write that any better. You know what I mean towards Meniscus just because of Pat Beverley you know what I mean and I've been denied a championship exactly so there's so much loaded tension in that game. So there's and the speed of the game it's like jazz. It's to be outdated to say that but it is you have solo people. There's moment the momentum in basketball people are are in little intimidated. They look at the final score. One hundred sixty to one hundred and forty sometimes is two hundred and fifty three. It's just you think you have something like soccer three or hockey. It's like three to you know but in basketball you get one hundred sixty you can have one hundred and sixty points and that the mania of the sport is so and the narratives and it's the beginning beginning the middle and the end. It's so much like film so my point is that the way broadcast the way it's it's you've got all these different angles and you can cut to the close ups and see who they are you know. There's there's a whole language to that as agreement actually. I hadn't really thought about it in terms of of the entertainments item. And just just the these these obvious touch point these images or the the cuts that are made the you always. You're going to go to the coach right after the blown. Yeah Yeah Yeah. There's there's there's there's there's a very well very well covered the game of basketball again. I think it's part of why it's growing sport. It's very from a thorough graphic soon. I wonder if stern had anything to do. With this. You know the team I think T- and NBC and AB NBN NBC. The John Tash done like got A. Ah It's yeah. Everyone should youtube John Tash yes. live performance NBA on NBC. It's because when you look at like there's too when you look at like the NFL. They've had from the beginning the most incredible coverage of their games because that was just part of they had they shot on film their archives. When you look at like old old footage of the NFL it's always the most perfect pristine footage but we always talk about it? You can't see the players behind the helmet. There's a little bit of a hold back there. But and then I guess just just to go back to Lenny Cooke that what we didn't realize in a way was that movie was kind of a stepping stone to this because it's like there were a lot of scenes in that movie where we had to dramatize Taes Basketball Games that the outcome may have been pre known. You know so how do you do that. And that was literally just okay. Let's let's try and use all of our tools and tricks that we know oh to make that the case and yeah it was as amid the long long answer for a short question is basketball and movies have always been intertwined in our minds and we. We just found pain particularly on gems away to permanent to perfectly fuse. The two this was inevitable. I mean Lenny Cooke and Chat Harvey Eric Von my good friend and former colleague. Because I think that was part of the inspiration the basis for your. He's in it too. But that's a documentary and this is something else entirely so this probably was a different itch to scratch for you. You guys in terms of just Creatively there's already been a lot out there. The great stuff written about the moving about how you guys got to Garnett as as the starring role of of the basketball basketball player. Who you need that that that animating role of somebody who's going to fall in love with have the superstars attachment to this black for COPA and that that that sets off everything else so it's been written that you guys I we're talking about having Amari stoudamire who who was out with your beloved Knicks Kobe Bryant. I'm curious how different this movie we would be. Happy had been your first choice. Your second choice has garnered and then Joel two dwelling while right. Because I'll just say this to Garnett was amazing and it's not people think garnishes playing himself yet kind of but an island out at all. I think he was incredibly convincing. In a way that I took advantage of all the best things about Garnett incredibly intense. Yes a little crazy but he was incredibly convincing so if it hadn't been him though so now I started thinking about it both. Could I imagine a Mari or Kobe. Definitely not sure about Amari. I'm not sure about embiid. Have you guys thought about meeting. We wrote into your scripts each person. Listen and they were. I imagine very different single why we had over one hundred sixty s of this because every time we meet a different casting decision we had to really embrace that because cash incision Asia and you had to embrace the personalities that you're writing for. I actually find the. Kobe won. T he never read 'cause it never got to him. Our agents were like religious. Talk to him. He's like I never heard about this. I know reached out to Tommy's like never know what's what they're talking about because it never reached him because his agents agents were trying to maybe lobby for us to kind of get him in the film on my issue with Kobe was add believes jewelry type guy and he's a west coast player and this is an east coast movie and the actual regional quality of like being like like when it was when it was Amari was obvious because he was a Knick and he really was doing the rounds. Yeah there's an incredibly the actor Timothy Shallow. May there's an actor he. There's a picture of him when he was ten years old. When Amari sorry signed to the Knicks? He heard a huge knicks fan and he lived midtown midtown. So he he he heard that Amari was at a Broadway play right after he signed and he ran to of the play with I think he had like an Alan Houston Jersey or something and he made Amari and so much. Paparazzi guys snapped it of Amari not realizing they were. They were snapping a photograph of future Oskar nominee getting sign autograph of Amari. So like Amari did do the rounds. You can imagine him. And he's a Jewish person so like we wrote and the movie centers around a a black opal from that was on earth by Ethiopian. Jewish tribe Beta Israelites so you can imagine the similarities of the the theme thematic reasons the way Amari would work doc and he was a centric. Mari was Senator Player. That was used all those like those early knicks videos that he would do where he takes. The camera crew like bookstore and talk about history. He he was an interesting guy. Yeah we actually did a bath. Yeah Yeah we did a Chabad dinner at Amari House I really yes so it must have been something it was something and then and then we tried to cast did up quote unquote to try to get coby. Coby was tough. Because I'm not a Lakers fan. I never rooted for the Lakers. The actually the I weirdly weirdly the only time I was ever a celtics fan gland. It was against the Lakers. In two thousand nine ten intended US tonight so it was tough but but I ended up writing and it was all about Kobe. Become using the gem which is the thing that the player in the movie wants to wants to own because he feels like it's empowering our in Him He wants to. Because it's like a youth elixir. And that night he has the sixty one point game at the garden. That was how we were going to write it with. The problem is is that when we had the weekend also in the film home his public persona didn't really exist until two thousand twelve. So you can't use that game so and like I just. I don't know I always had a hard time. Kobe just like we had at this would take place during the east coast stretch and like is he's you know you can imagine him Conan thing but is how is he coming back in. You need to find the movie works. You need a good game about game and a Good Game Yeah so then then Joel. Total Succession Joel. When we thought about the movie the themes of the movie having an African player from Cameroon Maroon? With specifically with Joel's trolling humor. It worked really well like this idea of a character getting this seeing this thing from Africa. Taken taken from Africa reclaiming and being empowered through reclamation also worked mix and we and we got actually Joel's manager Jannie sacks plays Kevin's manager in the movie and Jenny's amazing. She was also. The fate of the movie is like we met. We happen to have met a a sports manager. Basketball players manager. Who worked at a needle exchange in Rochester? Who'd seen a movie that we made about about heroin addicts? So it's like. It was a small movie how that broke into her. World was incredible so so she was very helpful and Joel was you know Joel was really engaged with the movie. But then once we went into the season we had to use a retired player and again as Knicks fans. It was very very very very very difficult to even entertain the idea of Kevin but he's such a unique guy and I can't imagine anyone else. There's a depth to the performance that I don't know would have been in there with anybody else because he really did just totally give himself over and he says Oh yeah. I'm just playing myself but he isn't really. He's playing this strange version of himself. How Oh people see him and then at one point move he just opens up and feel so honest and so real? It was pretty incredible. The full forty eight is supported by. Cvs Health where pharmacies are just part of what they do from home care managers to administering intravenous treatments right in patients living-rooms cvs health brings care to those who you need help. Most from shipping millions of prescriptions to front doors each year to hand carrying delicate medicines to cancer patients. CVS health is changing. How health is delivered from refusing to sell tobacco to making all their own skin care products paraffin free? Cvs Health knows what you don't sell is as important as what what you do and now at select locations. They're rolling out. CVS health hubs with professional care teams for clinic. Services and testing prescriptions corruptions and health care products under one roof in one trip on your schedule with these innovations and more. CVS Health has learned something important. When you put people at the heart of health people take health too Hort? CVS Health we're health. Is Everything not all services available in all states eight problems. It's human nature to hate problems. But why is that after all problems inspire us to mend things. Ben Things things make things better. That's why so many people work with IBM on everything from city. Traffic to ocean plastic new schools to new energy eighty flight delays to food safety. SMART LOVES PROBLEMS IBM. Let's put smart to work visit. IBM DOT COM slash smart to learn more things about kindergarten. One is that among the players. I've covered intersected with at times over the last twenty years. He's one of these guys whose juice just uniquely intimidating because of his height complete because of persona and a half and he's just got a bit a little bit of love hate with the meteorite so short with us so as you phenomenal with another times a little bit ordinary. He can't be. How did you guys find as Knicks fans who? I know you've been written you. You didn't exactly like Kevin Garnett hate weird because it's like a soon as we got on the phone we we couldn't get off. You realize he was the most incredible storyteller tells you these shapes things out in like almost must three dimensions and put shape to the story which is unbelievable acting an incentive but it was shaped to a story knowing reading the room is ending and then we kind of a natural inclination. Yes for sure thing that we also noticed okay. This was put on. He'd like we found recently loved wrestling so he was feeding off the energy of the crowd in a way that oh he was yes he was using us for his own passion which I guess is hard but at the same time you see who he is and wasn't my guess true. I don't know he he's he's he's always going to be fighting for himself and for his team. I think Kevin is you know. I think now having gotten to know him. He's such an honest person really honest and I think he's honest with himself emotionally and he's had a really crazy story. His life story is is is crazy and making lenny. Cooke was was such important process for us. I mean that was the film that made him WanNa work with us And you know what it did is a humanized players players for us because the players are so you know that they're aggrandize because you can never. I'm now thirty five years old. I'm now I can't even like players to me are older than me even though like some of these guys. RJR Nineteen. I still look up to him and you know I never get rid of that and I and I'm wondering when that we'll be when I'll start to look at this kid. You know what I mean. You hear older generations of this kid in the league. I don't think I'll ever have that because players are such on pedestals for me. They are gods. Gods so and Lenny Cooke in particular with Lebron James. That movie made me a Lebron Fan because going into the movie he was so vilified with the move to the heat right but I was but what making that movie I realized the amount of measure the NBA players out of control. I mean it really is difficult and the noise around the player so when I when we met Kevin we talked with him I came in with lots of pre preconceived preconceived notions like I hated him. He's the player who came in and made us fool. Made US fools in the garden. He had no respect for the for the garden. He had no respect for our franchise and he would would just come in and just destroy us all the time when he was in timber wolves every time and but particularly on as a Celtic and Yeah he was just so he he's. He's funny he's also funny and use and and he's famously. I mean he's got first ballot hall of fame nomination. He's he is. Such an honest is player. Heat player empowerment. I think the young players in the league now look at him like I told the truth and I think he'll never not tell the truth and that's what makes him so interesting. They said a few a pretty Simmons opening statements. That's him he'll say he's not afraid. He told a story once where he pointed at. MJ and said you're an owner. And and why are you acting this way and I was just like Whoa. WHOA did you find? Once I started the process or just starting filming did that intimidation kind of fall away or were there moments onset. We're your we're you're still dealing with that. He's still elusive. I would text him and I wouldn't get a text back before like two days before the shoot being trying to send him some more like you know but as director you you get people into the vibe. And he wouldn't respond Kevin's the cages not responding. But then he shows up on set and he's you know. He was so focused August. He was never on his phone. You know and most people sit on. He was so present and open. I WANNA learn this. I don't know how to do this. Teach me and that was unbelievable. That person of his stature is coming in like that Sinn credible I I look by the time we was over the first time I I saw among the things as I came away with I'd never seen any of of of Adam Sandler's dramatic roles so I am. I really got to see him do that. And I was blown away by by Sandler. I was blown away by K. G. and I thought there's actually enough there that you could see where he could play. Non Kevin Garnett roll down the right. It'll be hard because we recognize the great in the movie. The rim the remake of Blade aide. Imagine him as a vampire missing. Yeah no I keep telling empire in history it would be so awesome no but you can imagine tall empire he. The thing is is like people on set were so shocked. They couldn't believe what was going on. I wasn't an actor who became a basketball player. He's also we already knew all the superstitions about him so he fit the character really well because of the character had to be superstitious about the black opal. And it's and it's it's It's so we know the pre-game routines with everything everything else. Did he do anything like that. In as an actor was banging his head against like the direct you know but he did call me coach. He called me coach. Yeah coach he goes. Yeah you're the coach. That's the playbook point of the script and goes and this is the game and yeah just about this said comparison between basketball and filmmaking was something that was like Oh my God this is amazing to hear from his point point of view because yeah he just broke it all into the new there was so there was a play that dock designed around his acting abilities and it was designed for Pierce and the whole play predicate. I asked Dhaka's doctor. Some voice work in the movie I said. Did you knew it was an actress that I did. I don't play designed for him. It was coming out of the huddle. He had to just act cocky like he was the guy getting the the final shot and the beauty of Docs team. You could go to Pierce Allen or you know what I mean or K. G.. So he he had to Akaki get DABS from everybody and then right as as they're breaking in the play he had to clap right and the clapping was the the selling of the play and and NCAA Kevin was down for the everything else but when it came to clapping he felt foolish. Always overacting but he did it and then he didn't work and then you gotTa Clap Louder Five more more and more than he caught three times everyone gravitated. Of course Kevin Left Pierce alone game winner so I mean in terms of like rituals that you do on set. He was a lot of his scenes before we he started doing seen solo without Leuke stanfield when he was acting with Keith the standards and incredible actor and he had he would do these things. Keith would kind of improvise these actions. That happened before the scene begins. And he would just start improvising them. BEF- like can tell how we're GONNA start rolling soon. And that was you know I hadn't ever seen an actor do something like that before and Kevin picked up on it really quickly so then when Keith wasn't around Kevin Having started doing that with Sandler and these realize this guy's a lightening fast learner. He really is when the he also did want. He wanted to go very fast. You know he didn't he when we were going he wanted. One is just keep it going keep going keep going like if they're very little breaks in between his. I didn't go into his trailer ever so I don't know if he had some superstitions. Who's going on there? But we did there. Is I remember. When we shot the the post game at the end he would walk off to the side and he would be like winning writing he would get really angry if he screw up a take? Thank you would take a sixty two pack a bottle of water and he would just walk up to the thing open one up and just squeeze it in water would fly everywhere he would just roll the water around her dump it all over his head and he would just be screaming and I'd walk up to him and you know his K. G. Intense K. G. knew he had to get into game mode and that was actually the best because he was doing a little bit of alternate history there because like when he was talking about the whole. Yeah you know like I think we still got a lot on the tank. You know maybe win another ring and it was interesting to go through that. I'm I am a few quick ones here again. No no major spoiler here on plot points folks so if you haven't seen it it'll be all right but he does have to basically put up his championship championship. Ring as collateral would cagey in real life. Never ever do that wherever where ring because you need to have to to where it's always in a safe right so I saw that he said that I I buy that. I believe that I'd never seen him. I cannot imagine I'm actually putting it up for the two rings. There's that won the two thousand eight Celtics Ring The nineteen seventy-three Nick Serena that Howard Ratner's Sanders Those are both replicas. According to Zach Lowe's reporting as through earn railway we we we just saw the the real one at the Celtics screaming we had had owner. showed us the real ones. It's x Ray on my podcast. A while back he brought in all of his rings to well. He's got three made in the case to our. Yeah and it's Day are I mean they're they're incredibly heavy there amazing. I don't know I would be far. It is very very religious. They've gotten someone museum. Show of the history of the Knicks. One is big. The seventy one is big. But it's like yeah you can you can see somebody wearing the the Celtics won it really. Actually when Kevin Wears it is nice. There's a few it looks like. I don't know Easter eggs kind of things in the movie I just wanted. I saw the apartment. That Howard has There's a cut out cutout uh-huh yes knicks player. I'm thinking maybe Bradley. No it's not it's Pete. So how did that. That is a a artist. Actually the producer of Cook Lenny. Cooke as here's a gallery and stuff and he represent where this artist who made work in the sixties and seventies and eighties and he did these cutouts of players. Yeah so that was. Yeah that was in there and pick some people pick up on that. Yeah there's it's such a quick flash a little piece of our work. It went by by really quickly. And then how renders office. He's got four basketball's behind him. One of them looks like an. Aba Ball threat white and blue a couple. Baseball's are those anything specific where there's just just put in there just for the movie or the one is Dr J.. Signed Ball legit legit one minute warning and Yeah Dr Trajan is he's Dr Jay's he's he's the first wheel MBA's or what's amazing about. Dr J. is almost all of his highlights are myth. Because there's there's no footage of it. There's lots of wasn't televised all of his insane records. There's a couple of There's a couple the other side knicks balls back to their to there's There's a couple of great basketball. You know somewhat current modern day. NBA References to Chris. Paul this is right after two thousand twelve. There's a reference of course to the Knicks. Because you guys are as established long-suffering Knicks fans and so the obligatory allusion to Jim Dolan. Basically ruining everything You are you worried that you will not be welcome back for the record. I love the Knicks. We love. We Love we love Dolan. No Oh you know Sandler actually improvised that line and it's a great. It's a great long yet. said it's a reference to Lin sanity because it's crazy to think back in two thousand twelve and even think at this point where we are as a franchise that we were gifted this thing this this unbelievable structure that run at one of the first Games of Lin Sanity. Telling even the most fun I've had couldn't believe it was. What was it like? We don't have much time of no one will be. We'll have more time to come on this in the nine years that I was a daily beat writer covering that team. There are only a few moments that I thought were actually enjoyable. All is a job. I don't care about outcomes it comes I say it all the time. It's not my job to care whether winning or losing but winning teams are more enjoyable to be around the house. They didn't have that many of those. Obviously the time I was there but of the fifty four win season is the moment that they signed Amari and those first three months with them. That was what our movie took place really before the Carmelo deal and the Carmelo trade. I won't go down that road but did it change the complexion of that team time. I don't think they were as enjoyable as the young team built around Amari whether that was going to last Tony was huge Dantonio as usual but Lin sanity that three weeks that was by far the most joyful for any of us whether it was an expands expands whether it was those of us covering the team the entire world and so I mean yes I can only imagine what it was like for you guys as fans because for me as a reporter the electricity the the you talk about like the like the suspense of the NBA on of you know of of cinema. Anything you can't script that you every. Every time he did something it was like well. That was amazing number. The Toronto game winner. Then there's the trump game with hot and then there's the shot over Kobe Dirk and then it just kept going and you know. That's that's why we watch sports. That's why sports covers. Sports is because of the unknown and and was Jeremy Lin was the ultimate known. We see it coming. It's tough watching that speech when he when he was leaving the NBA this past year. It was tough. I understood understood why you get to go from so high to now out of the League. It's unbelievable it's unbelievable. I feel form and I feel for more because the way people reacted so that was so unfair. He's not saying that yes. Of course he's made a lot of money and he's had a nice career and it was unexpected. It doesn't mean it's any less of course difficult or Joie disappointing at the moment that somebody says it's over now or maybe over in a weird way though. Don't you think it's so perfect for the Knicks. Legend that we got rid of him him. You know what I mean like kind of like. You can't imagine imagine. He got like the Dunkin Treatment and he just became Jeremy Lin he as you go to a game you get the hands. He'd be like Larry Johnson is now not only that but I think that they've never actually given him the wants to nick. Nick no never announcement when he's come back which I think is incredibly unfair. Incredibly credibly petty by the organization. I saw Chris told US Dave Novak. Gets you know disrespectful. Exactly like Jeremy Lin who provided some of the most a memorable joyful moments. I remember I remember watching the nets broadcasts first game because I remember couldn't get because the guard member. MSG was blacked out. Ah Yes yes yes. Insanity Helps Jen blackout. Yes network started like that was that I remember. I couldn't get MSG. And I was like that was the only reason I called. Time Warner was such a special time. I was Gonna ask you guys before. I let you go. So best moment as Knicks fans in the last twenty years whereas everything kind of tucked away further. That Amari run was insane when he had the the eight games. Nine Games of thirty points or more in the ten rebounds that was incredible credible. Yeah I think that the obviously you can't not talk about Lin sanity because it really was storybook But the last twenty years. Here's your saying I mean the last twenty years we got. We had this run with with Jeff in that incredible team. That is all we have to hold onto gundy holding onto onto the leg twenty. Yeah that's the Best Ben. Gundy was pretty special. I know he's on my bucket list. People shake their hands. I I would say of the last since Stefan Marberry I would say I mean you gotta sadly the things that pop up is like the Eddy. Curry Limos Story. You know what I mean. Limo drivers starting things that like things that you hold onto as a knick fan but I think if Sheldon Williams I'm that's the that's what saddens added my main. You know what I mean but I mean personal memory for me is is is getting a hug from Jeffries after after that Utah Lynn game just went down to the court. I got down there and I was at the end and I was so psyched at at Jeremy. Lin Wood Jeremy Lin and Jar Jeff. He saw how excited it was these. GimMe a hug Jeffrey. Miss that shot against Austin thriller. The Chicago thriller was amazing. Mellow Ashikaga thriller. See the Woodson run when he was still running. The DANTONIO offense was amazing and then it was devastating when the eastern big. And what are you doing. The A lot of trees down and treat me at East is big big man big. Who could who could argue at? Oh we can sit here and reminiscent talk about basketball and the knicks forever. But your first hovering and I know you you gotta get Outta here you're gonNA interviews to do the record. I would say here forever. I would do this for so you guys have a lot more promoting to do which I understand another media outlets that need to hear from you you guys. Thank you again. Is Uncut Gems starring. Adam Sandler and Kevin Garnett Josh and Benny safdie awesome fantastic movie I loved it. It stresses me out in all the best ways if you ever WanNa make any more movies with people yelling at Howard and Howard is fine. I'm GonNa go with the thanks guys thank you problems. It's human nature to hate problems. But why is that after all problems inspire us to mend things. Ben Things make things better. That's why so many people work with. Ibm On everything from city. Traffic to ocean plastic new schools to new energy flight delays to food safety. SMART loves loves problems I._B._M.. Let's put smart to work visit I._B._M.. Dot Com slash smart to learn more.

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2000 Redraftables: The NBA Draft WOAT. With Ryen Russillo | Book of Basketball 2.0

Book of Basketball 2.0

1:24:09 hr | 8 months ago

2000 Redraftables: The NBA Draft WOAT. With Ryen Russillo | Book of Basketball 2.0

"The Book Basketball two point. Oh podcast on the ringer podcast network is brought to you by world central kitchen. Their relief team is working across America. To save distribute individually packaged fresh meals and communities. That need support now. Serving tens of thousands of meals daily in New York City Washington. Los Angeles May Sam Cisco many other cities. They've also formed Hashtag chefs for America Coalition Restaurants Tech Companies Working together to provide meals to Americans that need assistance and they're supporting workers and local hospitals. Were working wartime light conditions as well as local restaurants who've been impacted by the cove nineteen crisis. How are they doing that by launching initiatives across America to deliver fresh hot meals to everyone on the front lines go to W. C. K? Dot Org to learn about initiatives like frontline foods off their plate feed the frontline in Los Angeles and East Bay feed. Er you can directly help the heroes in hospitals and clinics were fighting for us and you can help. Keep your local restaurants alive. Learn more go to W. C. K. Dot Org were also brought to you by spotify. I don't know if you know this. But they own the ringer and they have an awesome. Podcast APP on spotify is to do. Search your favorite podcasts on spotify that they have elaborate over seven hundred fifty thousand including all of the ring. Pass that were buds Once you find the potty like click on the follow button near the top. That's you subscribe and then later you'd go back to the APP. You'll find that the little letters in the top. That's a podcast that'll have all your podcasts separated by episodes downloads and shows on spotify. You can even adjust the speed of the pods to seven. Different SPEEDS EGOS fast as three times. If you're insane you can do point to which is my favorite. Sounds like everyone's had a cup of coffee or you can go all the way down to zero point five and I sound like I'm drunk. Zero point five so there you go The spotify up connects to a lot of different cars out there. It's got a great carplay feature. I don't Wanna APP. Shame you but you should be embarrassed. If you're not at least trying out a podcast on spotify make the move. Listen to podcasts on spotify I recommend it there. You Go Coming up the two thousand redraft ables that I did with Ryan. Russillo on my podcast. The bill passed and we are rerunning it right here here. We go josh these basketball full all right. So we've been redrafting. How about the fact that we didn't realize we should be calling this. The redraft Took took a reader last week to to send an email being like hey man. Why aren't you calling these redraft? Ables like I don't know so we've done ninety six ninety seven ninety eight ninety nine. One was that yeah. We're calling the redraft ables though just better. I I just thought when I yeah I duNNo. I thought that that was what it was. But I guess editor for the Poster Guy. Yeah so You can find all the old ones v the easiest way to find him as on the book basketball or you can search for Solas archive for one you can. We did this one last week. We did two thousand. The real reason we wanted to start this whole redraft. Ables thing was just to do the two thousand draft. This is our favorite draft. It is I wrote once that the best thing anyone ever said about this draft was well. At least nobody ever killed someone from this draft. I might be the the most praised you could go The the the stats are incredible. Only five guys at a fifty eight potentially could have been like a real important started out a playoff team there were seven lottery whiffs strom. Ou- swift was the number two pick. We had a Priscilla Dueling Melissa Thomas Alexander cleaves collier run for six straight picks from nine to fifteen. We had the seventeenth through twenty third picks for better than picks two through fourteen. We had the poor clippers. Who had three ten in eighteen and it turned out to be the worst draft ever so they're rebuilding thing there and there's more facts we'll get into but this draft was bad in the moment and there are lots of reasons for it Which we've talked about another pods. Where the one and done in the high scores and all that it was just depleting depleting the possible draft that said sometimes draft class. That bad luck yeah it ebbs and flows depending on the air but we do it that college because it was a lousy college year. Can you name the four best guys in two thousand National Championship Title Game? is that machine cleaves yet. There's one Mope e yeah remember. Who played they played Florida? Yeah Mike Miller at Andrew. You DONNAS has them eighteen years old Damage your big teddy dupay guy back then tire love. Teddy dupay still holding out. Hope keeping your fingers crossed but that was what we're used them. The right way cleaves sprains his ankle in the second half and still ends up being the MVP the final four but it was the first bad college basketball tournament we'd ever had. It was up until through ninety nine delivered the goods year after year. In that year's like what's going on it was like one of those summer movie seasons where there's just no good movies or like what's going on. Where the movies so good for is though by the way it felt like is oh needed something there to then be because I just think the world is oh so I wanted like whenever you were getting into arguments about which college coaches you'd like us. It's fascinating the basketball world. Like how many people think some of the biggest name coaches at the biggest name programs have had these unbelievable careers? They think. They're absolutely terrible. In game coaches rare is oh would be the guy that gets all that respect and it just goes the whole consumption of Izzo would have been dramatically different heading up. Pull that off so so this draft. The Nets had the first pig Vancouver second quarter Third Chicago fourth. Our top forward Kenyon Martin Straw mouse with Darius Miles Marcus fizer Orlando Atlanta Chicago. Cleveland next for Mike Miller Dhamar Johnson. Chris MIHM JAMAL CRAWFORD. Then we finished it out with nine through fourteen. Houston ORLANDO BOSTON. Dallas Orlando Agenda Trait Joe Priscilla candling. Jerome we so Yvonne. Thomas Courtney Alexander Mateen cleaves Jason Jason Collier with fifteen It was weird when it was happening. They're not a lot of excitement. There was enough of a dearth of prospects that Darius miles all the Senate became super exciting. He was from Saint. Louis there was some cagey stuff with him. Where it's like. This could be another cagey but if you actually watch the clips offended highschool there's no resemblance to Keiji. Aig at all. He's basically a six foot. Eleven jump shooting small forward. Who can't shoot but good athlete? Fun carried himself a certain way. But I I don't know how the K. G. things started and And just a mess all the way around when you look at when you look at just the first round which. I'm so I need to clean up something. Here I was thinking Donell Harvey Florida. Declerk is still on my mind because the ninety six draft that we did so to Clark had declared years earlier so I just WanNa make sure. I cleaned that up. Darius is big for me because he was supposed to be going to Saint Johns and Saint John's was still pretty relevant and in our tested. Just been there Eric Barclays in this draft to Eric Barclay could could score but e like a lot of guys. It's just another big time scoring undersized guard that never gets a sniff of the NBA After the first couple of years so miles was supposedly going. But you're right like I went back and watched. The beginning of this draft on youtube was a t and t broadcast which I do. WanNa bring up with later and after Kenny. Martin goes one. It's were still in this new world which you wouldn't have thought of where they're like man five straight underclassmen Darius Miles. You know and you're just like Oh that's right. It was still weird and people would be complaining like addict by Towel. Come on and be like how come you're not taking mateen cleaves. Like I remember him losing his mind. That Mateen's glazed and go after. It had this epic run. Because that's Bitel what he does. He just get Super Mad that the older kids. He's just do it ad nauseam and you're just like well. That's an honesty. Mateen cleaves went higher than he should've unit address because it. Just people kinda see teen cleaves. Adam I don't really think he's a good pro. Even though this whole class was so bad so that was kinda thing going back and watching the youtube. Cots of the draft picks in the analysis. Where even though it's two thousand which yes? It's twenty years ago but it doesn't feel that long ago. It still felt like this uncharted world of looking taking all these underclassmen so some fax Kenyon Martin. Macaroni the only guys who earned more than one hundred million in this draft only four cracked fifty wind career shares Turkoglu Make no or make Jamal Crawford. Only five played twenty thousand career minutes which is like normally that number's double figures. There were only three all stars from this draught. Michael Read is humor. Shoe-bomber GLOR- at this is even better than only three. All Stars only sixty one combined all-star minutes from this draught power. See One minutes of the All Star game dirty. That's like wait a minute. Only three I mean three. All Star selections for an entire class ever not three guys were all stars three selections and then our Research Department decided to be even meaner with that minute total. Is this Zach. No of getting him in a second. I have two more for for me. Eleven of the first fifteen picks played less than twelve thousand career minutes. Eleven of the First Fifteen Six of the first fifteen picks played fewer than three hundred fifty games. So now ZAC cramped from the ringer. He had a couple of extras here. We call the Zack's Michael read the only person who made it on Bay team. He made Ambi- thirteen This is the only time in in recent draft history like in the Monitor. The draft were only one person from a draft. Made it on a team players that we mentioned out only three all stars the second lowest total from the latter era for players for draft making the. All Star team was thirteen. So this this is this is again so the so the second lowest in the lottery era. Where we're going back to eighty five here. Yeah is thirteen all-stars thirteen all star. Thirteen All Star Games. Thirteen All Star Games. Thirteen All Star Games. This one had three games three hand. Anything else it's the only draft ever in the ladder without multihull stars. There was not a single guy who made more than one all star team and then an average of thirteen point seven career would shares the fewest for any draft in the latter air. So it's just a train wreck all the way through and through. Fortunately there's a lot of comedy Reggie theus interviewed Algebra and described them. After as quote a veteran of the lottery process. He said this with a straight face like this is a copy of it at asset. He's a veteran of the lottery process. You know that means you suck as a GM when you're a veteran ladder process. So that happened. That's the nicest way to say you suck as GM raising veteran that's like when they call Like some local radio hosts like veteran veteran local. So and so. Who's in be just means you've bounced around locally and worth a bunch to stations. So we had. We had an all staff draft night trade of Joe Priscilla for Jason Collard Future number. One that happened we had a green room. Watch with somebody who didn't even end up being good Jake Colitis who I think you were in on. Us sack elitists. Yeah he felt at twenty five because people worried about his contract. Yeah they should be worried about his talent. We had A. We had a surprising moment. When the clippers took miles third. Nobody saw that coming and he came out. It took him forever. Come out he had a cream colored suit on. Put Blue Clippers hat on it. And he did. He legitimately hug stern in a way. That in two thousand was not something we saw at the draft Sarith Hamilton and huckster in the year before this one was almost genitals generals. Now we see goodell. 's hugging everybody but normally you just shook hands maybe as shoulder tap miles went in for like a real hug like he was catching up with an uncle at Thanksgiving or something. So that made it first and then after that Charles Barkley was doing this draft and he just went nuts and the clippers and this was right after he retired. We were getting. Oh could Barclay be the next baton for these drafts? Barkley said I. Don't think the clippers are good environment from ouster terrible organization. I hope he gets out of there. The clippers are one of the problems sports. The perfect example of that. Let's all their good players go. Every year they give their fans a bad product. It just like went in on them and it was like the first exciting draft announcing moment in the history of of the draft where somebody actually was like going in We also had. Oh my favorite moment for my dad. It did did the draft our that year The Bulls took somebody named Dalibor Garage. Yeah Number Twenty Four. At this point we had the sporting news where they had. They had like mock drafts at this point in the Sporting News and my dad looked down. And he said he's not on my list and just see more confused than anything Dalibor big arch. Just it was like where did this? So yeah lot of Three years of the Bulls three years. We're going to redraft so each one Rank in the guys from super-duper stars of five quality starter is a one. All Star is a two star. This is the only draft. Were probably ever GonNa do where? There's no to star guys I think would you? Would you have one to start? Yeah I think Kenya Martin. Why would rate him as a quality star? Wouldn't rate him as an all-star would you you mean perennial all-star just like all star was there an all-star this draft. I think the answer's no Michael. Read had a really nice stretch. He did wild get going but I know once we get to him in that whole thing because he was a second rounder and I think if you look at the the cumulative stats the analytics You Know He. He holds up well compared to all these other guys so we can either do the redraft or whatever but I would like to just before we do that. I WanNa ask you because you got to do the draft and ESPN. And as I've said it two thousand you go back and you look at the production it's TNT. I'd be saying the same stuff it was. Espn 'cause they don't really care. We know Ernie's a glue guy backbone keeps the thing going in the right direction but she had John Thompson up there. Who didn't know anything about anybody? Huby who didn't know anything and then they brought by Rick Maderas for like Comic Relief and he actually it just fascinating that even in two thousand we would have the NBA draft on television. And you wouldn't really have anybody that you knew was putting in the time and doing the scouting reports and the NBA hadn't really had. I mean this is even pre chat for being on the radar. Now we have a bunch of different guys that are locked into kind of that draft thing. But I don't know what I want like I go back and watch it like Mateus said at one point. No no Huby said this. Choubey said that that our test is better as a two guard struggles as a small forward and then he turned in one of the best small forwards in the League When they were talking about like rosters and healthy and people freaking out about Christmas. I'm not going to the Bulls because the Bulls need size. And so what? The guy's doing 'cause they weren't putting any time into it. You could just tell that they're like all right. The Bulls don't have a center. They have Elton brand well. They'RE GONNA Take Chris. Mihm and like Thomson would say oh. I saw this kid play and he'd be like Oh. Wow John Thompson zone playing high school and then would follow it up with like really no depth to it so it was a bunch of people on the desk for this really important that you and I probably take too seriously and you go. That's amazing that you can have a TV product. And this isn't like it's nineteen seventy eight and two thousand and nobody. They don't have anybody there that actually like put in real depth in real scattered reports and I'm thinking is that just because nobody thought any wanted that just want big because I remember even. Espn like we'd have. Stephen Aid Have Mark Jackson van. Gundy none of those guys are watching any of this stuff and up on synergy or second spectrum breaking I remember Stephen. A there was a pick he goes. He's like I've never seen the brother play. But I hate this pick and I was like what the Fuck Lake so I don't know what I want right like. What is it that I want? Because sometimes it's up. I want maybe a boring television product. And you've got to do it and I'm sure there were times where you felt like. Hey we're doing the wrong thing. We should be doing this and the TV. I'd probably telling you you're wrong right. I feel like everybody has averill. I thought we did a good job at the draft but we everybody had a role like Bilas was the college guy which is sorely missing from the two thousand draft telecasts. You just talked about because John. Thomson's not GonNa say anything and I don't even think he was in college anymore at that point but Bilas the guy who over by the bill was the guy who had seen all these guys play and then was crunching tape on them. And doing the thing so you could trust him. Jalen. I think at least the first year was still on the college show so he was at least seeing these guys at person had feel for them but could talk more about You know like what's it like what you like college versus where you could blossom into and my thing was more trying to figure out what the teams were doing. You know and that stuff where you really need somebody out there. Who's like Oh. They're doing this because they are. Actually they have these guys eligible for free agency and they've got abroad and you just gotTa know all the moving chess pieces and that's not something you can study. You have to either know it or you don't know it And now it's something we're even like. When van Gundy was on his brain he doesn't know what the caps situation and she stupid. Shit like that. You kind of have to know that stuff on the fly because there's trades to infiltrate happens. You have to go all right. Well why they do that. Well what what's the purpose of this and and almost like react? We would on a podcast. So it's a night that has a lot of moving pieces and if you have people that aren't totally versed on at least whatever their specialty is supposed to be. It's going to go really badly but nobody can. Nobody cared in two thousand though. This wasn't like a huge event back then but I've seen ESPN lineups. Were in. I understand like I think TV executives. They err on the side of names where they go. Let's put our biggest stars on these shows and we'll figure it out but I really think if you're gonNA have a draft on and it's GonNa be five hours of the stuff like the stick in the Zang's after a while like if you don't know anything about the players Got The point where I stopped watching on TV. I did six years for radio yen. I said the only way I'm doing it as an analyst I'm not going to host it and they wouldn't. They wouldn't even let me on the radio one for a bunch of years and then after the first year they go. Can you come back next year and I was like? Yeah no problem and then you know a couple of years I did did it with Scott after the fact which is great. I mean I couldn't believe it was after the draft is done. I'm on Sports Center. Skopje Appel breaking the whole thing down and it was. You know 'cause I were pretty much non stop on it and I just watching in two thousand. I'm going this was this was considered good and that would get destroyed. It happened now if somebody said. Hey let's just put a bunch of NBA cronies on and wing it. I really like doing it. The shocking thing about it that I hated was how fast the Pigskin 'cause it's five minutes between packs so the guy walks out. He shakes hands then. He has the interview with whoever? And that's like three and a half minutes. Bilas is doing his whole breakdown. That's a prepackaged thing and then you basically have like a minute to react before the next pick. Which isn't you know you're talking like lottery. Picks like when Cleveland took Anthony Bennett that we could. We could talk about that for fifteen minutes. But it's like all right on to the next one who's number two and it's like Cleveland. Just took a guy who if they didn't take them there might have fallen out of the top ten. We should be talking about this so I wish it was. I personally think the lottery should be its own night and I would make it fourteen picks. That's it fifteen. Minutes between picks twelve minutes twenty picks. Let's really go into this and make it like a dramatic night and then do the rest of it later but I. I think I'm the only one who would probably want that. I would like it but we're wrong. We know a wrong on this because they wanted to move and they wanna get everything done and all that stuff but it should at least be for the lottery. It should be ten minutes between six or eight minutes or something. You should get more because you got so many different people on it you have now. That will just part of it. Who really is the most important thing? Because he knows all the moving pieces array stuff. But when you don't have the news guy you need a new guy you need somebody who's seen them play. And then the other thing that's tough and this is where bill is. His role is really challenging. Despite what an authority is on the college game in comparison to most people that he's sitting on the set with over the years I've watched on. Espn is that. It's really tough to go up there and just let me just pick. Lauri Markkanen right. You know because I actually think Lauri Markkanen could be okay. Set back a bit this year but like say Lauri Markkanen taken seventh and Bilas goes. This guy sucks total steph. Fraud can't can't dribble can't shoe. That's you can't really do that. Even though that would be the best it would be awesome if somebody just decided. Hey that's going to be on one of these draft shows. Nfl NBA. You know you don't have to say sucks necessarily but everything is spun into a positive because there's a very delicate thing of not wanting to ruin a kid's night well now is the big thing for Jalen especially because you could hear the people in the arena could hear us at least one of the years But jail is I. This is the best night of this kid's life. I'M NOT GONNA trash pick. I'm just not going to do it so I was in the spot. Where all right? There's bad picks and we're going to have to like dance around you know. Oh man why did they do that? But you can't guys whole families watching so it's definitely delicate balance. True true or false. Did you feel more comfortable? Trashing a euro pick just because the language barrier. Now I I loved it I I gotTa say the Most Fun. I've had on TV. Where the two drafts? I really had a good time because I was such a fan of what was happening to. It felt pretty natural to just be like sitting with two other guys are hosted doing which that pick well. Here's what I thought. And he's Kinda goes really great enjoyed. Did you say it was one of those moments despite the success? Where you have this little moment where you kind of look around and go like Holy Shit. I'm actually going to do this because it goes away. How successful you are you know. No that one because I had done the draft diaries for really from ninety seven to two thousand twelve and then all of a sudden. I'm there but the first of all we did was stern's draft. It was his last one so I saw I remember. I saw him before the draft and he just gave me we get. It was a handshake. He gave me that look like the same way. Somebody's dad would look at them when you're about to take their daughter out to the prom or something just kinda like don't fuck me on. This was one of those looks at it. Was it was hilarious. It was his last one and he was like bilking the crowd and waving you know waving them to boo him. More and all that stuff is pretty funny. If people don't know this too that stern and it's it's through the NBA media thing. But if you're going to be on the air covering any kind of NBA product. You have to fill out this form and then be approved by the League so when I did a couple Celtics Games I to fill out to stuff. And they're like you're fine and then I remember when I was trying to get on the draft show for radio before I was even allowed on. 'cause I'd still at Bennett. Espn so six. And I was like. Hey Look I go to Portsmouth I go to Orlando and then I was hosting the combine in Chicago which I did for five years ago you know can I? Can I get on this thing and I remember again? Just a lie and they're like well you know there's some people in the NBA really don't like you and so we can't get you approved to be part of an MBA broadcast product. And I was like really knowing me. I call up somebody in the NBA. That week. I go hey you guys have a problem with me over there. That's one hundred percent. Not True is even if you said so if we don't like people like you you're not an asshole you care you're a voice for the NBA type of thing. You're one of those guys that obviously loves this league to whoever told you that you're not on the broadcast because we have a problem with you straight up. Lie to your face. I was like awesome. We're GONNA do the redraft. Do you like when I take these moments to kind of do a little therapy session on something. That went wrong now because I I think I think we both love the draft and we got to be there the room for a couple of times at work it. It was still fun. It was awesome 's awesome. I loved it. I think the two thousand thirteen draft would be a great documentary. I it was SUPPO- plus you. I think that was the first draft when woes was just tweeting the picks before Espn was. I remember like going on my phone and just seeing who the next pick was second. It was either that year fourteen. One of the two I did. He just had all the picks before they were coming out the stage and he was completely bending it. Do you remember when Jeff Goodman at one point one year he had somebody in the pipeline who is just giving them the right and that was crazy because then Jeff Goodman was tweeting out every pick not as breaking news but like hey this is officially the pick and he just had it all night long because somebody he had a guy so the nets had the first pick in two thousand they took Kenyon Martin in Cincinnati. Do you want the first pick of the second pick? But he wants to go one or two. I'll go one all right. We'll Kenyon Martin go first again in our Redraft ables yes or no okay There is a case against him. Analytically here if you WANNA go for you know. He's he's behind guys. You WANNA go win. Shares that kind of stuff There's a couple people behind him. You know he was older coming in and I would say as much as I. I've always had this thought. If you're GONNA be really really good maybe not just great here but below that really really good. You're probably going to figure it out no matter what the fit but Martin and Richard Jefferson going to play with Jason. Kidd is the best thing that could have ever happened to him. It really was and I think Martin what he gave you even notch notch like. I'm probably GONNA go with him versus reds health. So I'm still GonNa Take Martin Number One. Even though there are strong arguments with like two or three other names I just I just like the whole Kenyon Martin thing even though it was probably a little underwhelming for an overall number one pick and offensively he was a non factor for a good chunk of the end of his career so I think he was a better asset the micro read. When they're both healthy he also had a knee injury and he had the microfracture surgery. Mike read blew out his ACL during the OWADO. Nine twice yeah So here's the case for K. Mart and I agree with you that it should be. I picked second best player in two finals teams. I think that matters Ruined Walker's career. He really did. And I coincidentally I wrote an airplane to Chicago with him just randomly sit next to him in mid February and didn't talk to him the whole time because I hate talking to people who get talked to all the time but then he kind of was looking at. He was sidelined near the and then. Here's a hey man you bill and so we just started talking and I was like you broke my heart and oh to like I thought we had you guys. I went to those games as a you just destroyed Antoine. And he was saying when he went into the NBA. He just started talking about it. We're landing and he's like one of the NBA. Anton was an all star in the east. And I was like I gotta gotTa beat that guy. That's going to be the guy that I'm just going to be better than them. Because if I'm better than him than on the All star in the east and if you go back and watch series like he he just kills them. Antoine couldn't figure out what to do against him his three and four in the playoffs. They made the finals three and have a really good series against the Pistons and four. They lose he was nineteen and ten solid. Good really above average defensive player that I thought like not like a defensive player of the year but definitely like an all defense kind of four any of the bigs. Any of the big could play bigger than they were and then also hang athletically with any of the premise. Just allowed you to do stuff I mean. That's why I've mentioned how much I was loved the Pistons structure of of switching guys. But you know when you can switch and not give up stuff. That's that's what Kenya was doing on top of running. I mean latest game. I gotta be honest. I really his game. He got signing traded to Denver in two thousand and four and I forgot CICIS July fifteenth. Two thousand four Denver. It's three first round. Picks up giving up two of them were lottery protected. The one the Denver picked that was in there actually was like very lightly protected. The picks ended up being joey. Graham Rinaldo balked ball. C'mon and Marcus Williams. But you know he made one hundred thirteen million. He had real value. He was also on that Denver team in nine. He wasn't one of the best reporters at that point. That almost made the finals pretty good career. Like you definitely can't call him a bus like he made. A lot of money had had some good moments so I thought that was a good pick. I had Michael Read Second I just finished with one. Kenyan thing though. I'm sorry yeah I know it's annoying but I remember you know. I love tough guys. I love the real tough guys as opposed to the fake guys that do stuff and when I asked net sky I go. You play with with Kenyan right. What's the story there? But like no no. He's all the way real. Do he goes. He actually like guys. Were fucking scared of him. Straight up Anton was and I'm like yeah but this is his teammates. Oh you guys were scared of him really. Yeah like if you would get into it and you were fucking with him in practice like he do this thing like better. Get My name motherfucker mouth and then like guys would be like Whoa. We're supposed to be on the same team here so I love hearing stuff like that. 'cause that means you know that that somebody who's not gonNA wilt so there's a cut so. I like this conversation. There's a couple of guys. Oakley was obviously the the captain of this team. But there's some guys over the years and you talk to anybody from that era and they're like they're difference between the tough guys in the game but the actual elect. Don't fuck with guys. Stackhouse was another one like that. Yeah I'd heard that too. I very set years. Yes that there's famous stackhouse stores him punching out Kirk Snyder after game and shit like that. Tony Allen. I think was like that where it's like. Yeah don't don't actually fuck with Tony. Out and like you can try. Talk Trash on the court Don't actually fuck with them because they go there and I think. Yeah Zach Randolph Zach. Randolph is another one. Don't you gotTa have a Little Fun doolittle? Trash talk but don't go too far But I wasn't having in. Kenya was legit. He definitely was like that. All right. My second pick and this would be for Vancouver's picking the spot poor Vancouver just getting slaughtered in these drafts factors not enough. Bring a team back. Vancouver support the Sonics. Would you agree? Yeah now I think we have Seattle Vancouver would be my top two picks for tavern MBA teams again so you actually think they should have a team again. Yeah I was kind of I think they got host. I think they got hosts too. I don't understand why people wouldn't want you know. Look there's there's always gonna be the Canadian thing that some guys down here. I'd rather Vancouver than a lot of cities me to Michael. Red Is my second pick. He from two thousand four through two thousand eight four seasons. He averaged twenty four game. I didn't realize it was that money. forty five percent field goal thirty seven percent from three. He was one of those old school Old School guys. From if you just put them forward fifteen years probably would have much more fun career. Probably taking eight or nine threes thirteen Mambi a and then when he tore his knee again and feel it. Oh nineties and it was over but he was the guy. Milwaukee wasn't very good in the mid two thousands. I don't think anybody was in more. Fake trades him. I know I personally threw him into about one hundred but it was always one of those. Oh you know they could package bub-bubba national get Michael Read. That could be the missing piece and he just was in that group for three four years. I like this game too that he was good. So that's my second pick now. You're up on the clock three. I'll be interested to see what you do here. I think there's like a no brainer number three pick a red blue out his his. Acl AND MC L. and the same left knee twice. Yeah and you're right. Like he has that stratego man he went off and then when it was over it was absolutely over. But he'd signed that. You've got a six year extension back then and that was the first year Lebron. I was going back and looking at the two thousand five free agency stuff and after a free agency they got Larry Hughes Donyell Marshall when they wanted read they want Joe Johnson. That I don't know he was talking about trying to recruit bosh out there which was going to be way too early. Unless they're going to try to tell him to force a trade in bully him but Yeah People Thought Michael. Read was going to go there because he went to. Yeah that's right. They thought he was going to go there. But remember the raises were bigger incrementally year to year. They are now they. They used to make more of an incentive for you to stay home with the longer deal in the better raises and read was like look. I'M GONNA stay here but team you're right like they had forty two wins because it took for a while to get red started. It was really his fourth year when he was like. Whoa this guy's awesome and then the team never won more than forty two games. Okay I guess I just wanted to use my free agency notes because I wrote them down. Sorry third pick is obvious is now. There's two names given. Who's on your board? Let's hear it well it's Miller Turkoglu. Okay and Miller is another guy when you go back. Read wasn't surprising. There's some Miller stretches where you go man he. He lit up a little bit and the second leg of his career. Kind of like Ray Allen Allen Iverson thing but I actually think I like peak Turkoglu better than Miller so How Turkoglu Okay make the case? Well if I have to start with fifteen years I love that he went to Sacramento when people were Kinda like pages in his way. It wasn't it was just like why because he's another tall white guy that's not from the states. It took a while but from Oh four zero five till two thousand ten and what he did and how he fit into that. Orlando team like I just thought he had moments during those Orlando runs where Turkey who was like an incredibly talented scary guy. I know he floats I know is rebounding numbers are pretty Ma. You know. They're just not as good as you'd want to be. But he actually became like a pretty good playmaker therefore Orlando there towards the end. I know the end. Was You know? By the time he's back in Orlando thirty three clippers last couple of years. It's Kinda over stint with Phoenix. But this is more of a talent thing where I think the peak version of Turku with somebody who could give me a tougher Buck Miller and I think he's another one that ten years later you'd be running a lot of the stuff like they were doing anyway in these playoff games for For Orlando which we did one of them on the book. A basketball game for the nine Lakers were. They're coming out setting the screen spreading the floor for him and he was pretty crafty. I I I don't totally understand. Why Sacramento couldn't figure out how to use him. And then he goes to San Antonio for the oath three or four season where they lose Bass Clarinet Fisher shot. I think they would have won the title that year and they couldn't really figured out either and it wasn't until he got Orlando that he got unleashed as this guy. Who's like I'm going to score sixteen a game? I'm GonNa make almost forty percent of my threes. I don't really need the ball at the time but but in crunch time you can kind of go to me and I'm weirdly reliable I don't understand why Sacramento couldn't figure out how to play him in page together. You would have thought like great. Put both of them out. There will see web like let's go. Would you trade them for Brad Miller for at that was that was very strange? Can I read you the names of the on in the trade? Yeah all right because I was yeah perfect. That's exactly what I was going to do right now. Because it's awesome names in this. So it's a three teamer Indiana Sacramento and San Antonio and the only thing we know for sure is that Indiana's just going to end up with white guys like what. However this plays out there getting wet guys in the trade so Indiana Trades Brad Miller to Sacramento and they trade Ron Mercer to the Spurs Turkey Turkoglu also goes to the Spurs Sacramento Trade Scot Pollard to Indiana and San Antonio Trades. Danny Ferry to Indiana. It's a it's a double Caucasian booth for the Pacers and I and Turkoglu is by far the best guy in that trade ad that I didn't join that one Brad Miller season on the kings but It seemed like a heist. I remember writing this at the time. What a heist. For the spurs like really excited Turk Lewin. The Spurs never. Really happened was until the magic that he kind of found his his place. The magic contract though was like I think at the time that was I bet you could go back and look like what are the magic doing like they're giving. Turkoglu this much money but he had only at. Oh four oh five. We're talking him being in twenty five years old and the reason I when you mentioned the Pacers getting rid of Brad Miller and you're talking about like Brad Miller was so white. He counted his two white guys. So that's why they have ferry and Pollard. Back right anybody. That packs a dip in the fourth quarter of a game. We need at least two white guys to make up for his whiteness would have been fun at Brad Miller and the artists bailer though I feel like we were cheated out of that. I'm taking Mike Miller with the fourth pick so Kenyon Martin one mike read to Turku Three Mike Number four Michael third on my board. I couldn't be happier right now. Forty one percents three point shooter career career. I mean the year that included the year five years with his luggage at the end of his career still finished over forty percent Oh five through eight Memphis on some pretty sneaky. Good Memphis teams fifteen five and five forty eight forty to seventy eight percent splits forty two percent from three that whole stretch playing a lot of minutes game five two thousand twelve finals. Seven for eight from three twenty three points you mentioned are Bada had that huge game seven and two thousand thirteen. Noord did the same thing in game five and that was one of the series that it was a four one finals. Dick Consensus now is that. Oh Yeah Miami one in five. They had it the whole way. Those first four games all can analyze one or two plays and even in game five. I didn't feel like that series was done. Nowhere came out. Shot the lights out Had THAT NOT HAPPENED. They would have gone back to okay. See FOR GAME. Six and seven so is was it a must win. Every finals game is a must win but there's a scenario where you know. Durant. It's hot in that game. Five and maybe it goes back to. Okay see now. The crowds go nuts. Who knows Lebron had at one entitled yet? There's different variables Miller shut it. All down he was awesome in that game. Probably might the jump shot. I was the most jealous of just personally like if if you could have bought somebody. Jump shot on Ebay. I think I think I would've taken Mike Miller. Who would you take? Ray Yes raise the other choice there. I really like most jump. Shot but Miller Miller is a good pick and was it close for you on on Turku Miller or were you like adamant. 'cause I was I was split going into it I always. I always liked him and I just thought he was in weird situations for most of his career that If you Kinda just did his career ten times I think there's universes where you know there's times when it could have been awesome for him You look at all the teams that could have drafted him in this draft where it goes do Jersey Vancouver Clippers Chicago Orlando Atlanta Chicago again. Cleveland I mean all those teams sucked for years. Any situation he was going to is going to be a bad situation I. It's a shame that he couldn't have just gone to a team that was good but for one year ended up in the lottery. You know where he was like just playing with good players all the time. 'cause I was thought he had a really nice feel for the game. I read you some Mike Miller Trade Trivia so. He was the last piece of the Chris. Webber Penny Hardaway Trade from eighteen. Ninety three he was the last first round pick. I couldn't believe that when I looked at up today at carried over from Nineteen Ninety Three. He was traded in two thousand three with a first round. Pick for Juergen which is a trade. That just seems abysmal. Now I can't believe they you'd have thought drew good Annetta. I for Mac Miller. Now's the other way then. He was in that crazy. Kayla of OJ Mayo. Chris Wallace fiasco where Chris Wallace. I would it have the fifth pick. Yeah and he I forget what it always. Four forty went down to five yeah he flips picks so he can end up with. Oj Mayo and gives Minnesota Kevin Love and Mike Miller both of them so somehow they eat Chris. Wallace is where the two guys that are still trying to figure that out. And then a year later He's traded with Randy four in Joe. Houses least favorite wizards bullets trade of all time Randy. Foye Mike Miller for the number five. Pick in two thousand nine. Which could have been steph. Curry Ricky. Rubio said Washington. Have it kind ends up getting it and then somehow lifts and takes Johnny? Flynn and there. You Go Four trades where the other team probably Has the fans have their feelings hurt? I really enjoyed Mike bowers game. I can't believe he's a top pick and redraft but There we are. Who Do you have for five? I just wanted to add to that that draft in two thousand eight to make sure we had it right now. That's right yet. He had wallace had five. Any traded up to get to three with Mayo in Westbrook went in between them and Westbrook at the time was like four was kind of a reach. Felt like that's his high lawsuit. Go when we do. If we do the away redraft Westbrook will be obviously four or higher but I loved Westbrook in college. I was stunned when he went for it. It's did love him I did I. Ha I have stuff written I e by big sleeper in the draft but I thought he was like just this energy guy off the bench. I didn't think it could be Russell. Westbrook I always liked the prestige in none of those guys did. Pj Carlesimo who you know. I became close. Who I was like. What was going on there he goes. I was screaming banging the table. Going Brooke Lopez's Brook Lopez's Brooke Lopez's and he goes and every time I come back to prestige press. Tb Like we really kind of loved. The idea with this guy can be. And I'm telling you like you may have liked him but like for press actually pulled the trigger on it. That's especially over Kevin Love. Yeah I watch that that. Ucla I watched a lot of that team. That you watch I Kevin Love not to be the first. Ucla Guy Off. The team at a draft was inconceivable. Westbrook was like the first like couple months seemed almost like a six-man even on the UCLA team and then he started a blossom. Was still there too. Yeah Man. That team is amazing. You know they played slower Holland style. And all that stuff. So I mean hell I I honestly think prestige taking Westbrook when he did with the actions it seriously. I think it's like one of the greatest picks of that decade. Because you have to go back and go okay. But what are you actually drafting back? Then we were still little more position obsessed. You know the same thing like what Turkoglu. In pages you're mentioning. Now you just figure it out which is kinda crazy like now. We can't do that like we already have a six ten white guy. We can't do that. We can't just put another guy out there that can shoe like the cow stupid. It was that we didn't let basketball. Have this evolution where it's a wait. Those guys are both really big and can handle and can shoot or are we just let both play right and Westbrook is is another argument. That by the way in that Miller deal Thuan was actually recycled in that trade and Brian Cardinal Walker. Who ACTUALLY MY PICK BRIAN? Cardinal The custodian AK the janitor. Aka Citizen Pain Brian. Cardinal out of purdue. Are you even serious right now? Now I just want people to freak out the Nash. Iverson thing no all right so this is where it gets a little interesting. But I do think you're gonNA go Jamal Crawford. I liked him more. I thought he'd be different. He was a guy liked a lot before this. He ended up going eighth but just the fact that he put buckets for this long up until two years ago when he was in the league last year. So I I know. He played for teams. I'm not saying you're winning any games with them but he was somebody that just you know to give you. That much also has a lot to do with the other options. That are out there. I just think Value Ham. I getting almost twenty years of shooting from the sky despite that it's a little isolation heavy. Yeah whatever. I'll take Jamal Crawford. Three six men in the year words. I had five as well. I think it's the right pick. He's one of those guys if he's like your eighth guy incredible feature six guy that that actually would. Yeah but that also means you're coach might be playing a crunch time. Yeah and it is one of your best four guys. You're not winning anything as we found out with the first ten years of his career. I always Kinda liked his game. I mean he's one of the worst defensive players of any good player the last twenty years. He's just a complete sieve. But that that thing. That was annoying with him on the Clippers. Near the end there was he really would take the biggest shot of the game. He is the Marcus smart. Addis where it's like. I got this and it's like no. I'm not even sure you should be out there with five minutes left. He's he's to me like you almost want him the way the Celtics US Daddy House. Two Thousand Eight. That's my dream Jamal Crawford scenario. Give me an awesome sixteen minutes a game instant offense and then kind of stay out of the way if I'm trying to win a title. If on seventy eight minutes left in the fourth quarter against subbed out yeah you have to. You can't play him He played seventy four playoff games. Thirty nine percent fuel goes shooter. Thirty one percent from three the other thing with him. There was this thing like that. He was as awesome three point shooter and he he just wasn't you know he was like he was the master. The four point. Play which you know. Congratulations that's great. But that's not helping me when a title. He was that good of a three point shooter and he was one of those guys that always seem like the shot was going to go in but it went in a lot less than I think people remembered. So I'm I'm sure people are listening going. Wait a second. What was wrong with Jamal Crawford? He was awesome as like sorry He's player. Isn't that Nice piece tab on a team but You know just not as good of a shooter as I think he thought he was. He played in big cities. Chicago NEW YORK Atlanta L. A. He also had a little bit of time with Minnesota Phoenix at the end. Yet a Portland running there but he likes hit all the major markets. I love that. He has a nice New York stretching there. He actually went for twenty game with the Knicks when he was twenty seven but he has become oddly overrated. A little bit. Because we've seen the crossover a million times on the Internet and it's sick. We've seen him shake people pull up from deep the fourth place. I I wouldn't say like he's not even close whenever we start going historic great shooters of all time. You're not talking about your. I think everybody really likes him. Okay that's the key point hoots love this guy so overrated like I feel guilty even saying that a little bit but the idea of him is. He's a really good player. Had A really long career. He came out really. Early was just one year at Michigan. But I think everybody loves this dude. Every time I see him on a panel or some show guys light up a little bit so he's held up a little bit higher than the fact is that you know. Look you've never I don't think of him like I never felt like Jamal Crawford was a star and I think sometimes he's talked about that way so two things there one of the most popular actual players the other players. I think he's gone a short list of just do everybody. Everybody loved them also really popular with the media and there was a year when I went the last time. He won the sixth man award or he was up for it and it was just insane that he that he was even a candidate. But I think just the media really liked him. He was always really gracious and thoughtful and awesome to everybody. And you know it's smart was well played but You know I think if he's playing thirty five minutes for you you're not you're not making round to the playoffs. I don't think My six pack. This is where it could start just for the people listening. Here's on the board right now. No particular order. Most Peterson Quin Richardson. Desmond Mason Joma Glory Darius Miles Eddie House to Shawn Stevenson Joe Pris- Bila Joe. Priscilla should've Gone Joel Brazil. I think he would have been more intimidating There's a little speedy claxton. Edward now. Hurrah UNDRAFTED Balik Allen. I like not Harare Kion Dueling. That's really what we're looking for here. So I'M GONNA go with Quinn Richardson because for two years ago. Four or five. Us Sixteen and six almost seven three is a game mid thirty six percent not great but not awful but was you know in modern times more of a three and D Guy Who could rebound a little bit a little bit ahead of his time. I liked him on the sense teams He was fun with dares miles when they were doing the tap their head thing. I think he was a a lacked teammate. In different places and his career was bad. He became kind of a contract. Figure there for the second half of it but At least I know he could contribute to a good team because we saw so. I'm taking him sex Quentin Richardson. He could have been the mixed. Maybe for five yeah. He ended up in a nice player in in a good role player. Where I think you're right. You knew kind of exactly. We were getting from him and then they did have that little. Run there with the clippers where it was just so much fun but again with. That's not necessarily what we're drafting. And that also means a Darius Miles is still available which I imagine will be available here for. Wow this draft. By the way was one of the drafts it. Kinda was like. Hey russillo little wakeup call here. Stop falling in love. The long athletic guys long length because Strom all swift is the poster child for that one love Strauss with coming out Strom swift was almost instant flame out. I was going back in Reading Billy Knight who was the GM that pull the trigger. Do you remember the head? Coach for Vancouver in two thousand was due. Jackson is Sidney Lowe. Oh yeah he was the nego like nine and forty one or some some terrible record. Six and forty two four they. I went back and read the article of them being interviewed after the pick they mentioned. Hey this guy's young like every other sentence every other sentence and one thing. I've always noticed with busts. It's unbelievable how often this repeats. Itself is that you don't play nearly will rookie year. And then what they do is they give you a ton of minutes in your sophomore year to prove that you do actually suck and you'll see so many guys that weren't good that have this real nice Bob and like you know. His best career year was his second season right and it's not because he improved and then fell off. It's because they actually gave you more shots and forced the issue with you. Ran More stuff through you just to make sure they could okay. We actually made a mistake here and so I stopped. It was Kinda my Earl Clark Reckoning Earl Clark Louisville long score did some stuff at Louisville and I go you know what but if you if you're just long and I don't see that you have real basketball skills this this draft fucking my head so bad because I stopped loving. All these really tall guys can't dribble and can't shoot the first one. Was Brad sellers going back to the eighties? Wow that's the first time where I was just out on those type of guys from that point on Kazan. J. Kind of needed Brad sellers in the late eighties. And he was a staff like He. You know he was the six eleven guy who couldn't shoot a rebound so it's like well who what's left. What are we doing? Yeah we do. Are you out there? And you and your soft so yeah. I was shocked to find out. Strom hours with played for nine seasons. I don't remember. I always say if we you and I are through the bigger basketball fans. I would love to talk to random. People should be a rigorous series. What was your favorite Strobe Mile Swift? Memory 'cause I have none. I don't remember anything about his career. They hit a dunk on Was another lsu. Guy Who also is one of my other guys tyrus Thomas Thomas. Yeah right so tires Thomas Wade. Save the auto six redraft. Because that's when we got to do because I remember I was on a flight with GM leaving. Virginia after the Portsmouth Tournament. And I go this tyrus. Thomas run because Davis had that really Nice Ryan he goes. Oh my God and he sold me on Thomas. I'm still young and impressionable. He's so because he goes not only can tie up. Thomas do all this front court stuff. You can run your offense. He's the sickest all different things and I go. I gotTa Stop Liking these guys. All the tires had a little bit more well rounded stuff in his game but yet the strom all swift memory. It was going around this week because everybody sent it to me because they know how I feel about. Strom out swift is he. Dunks on tyrus. Thomas and tires gets back to the play to try to reject it and swift. I mean the dunk is one of the best dunks you've seen in a game. It's that awesome of a dunk. But you get a little bit older you start thinking who do. I WANNA marry versus who I want to date and your evaluations get better. I haven't incredible Strom Auschwitz factory you career record in the playoffs Owen. Seven like games not net series. Never WanNa be wear seven like not playoff routes games. Oh and seven never WANNA playoff game nine seasons so who you taking seven. You didn't tell me he actually got a decent second contract by the analogous to that. But the thing is he made forty two million forty three million those good athletes who could offensive rebound would just throw you off the scent. You know you watch. Someone gave the Ed Pinkney was like that too. I picked it was way better than stromer swift. But those those lanky forwards who could like just get put back that guy. Oh and it was. It was always deceiving. Who'd he avid seven strom was done as a starter? Twenty five years old. Kath all right Going through the board here going through the board we could probably speed it up at this point of the of the redraft almost added material. You know I. I think I'M GONNA GO Eddie House. Wow I thought I was going to get them later. Eddie House. How many playoff threes? He hit entire career to guess. No I don't take guess. Guess twelve now thirty nine. I thought it was like a hundred twenty. Do It'd be low because he's not in the playoffs or many times. I just figured between the the Phoenix and the two Boston seasons. I don't know why in my head. He'd made all these streets but he was in to Boston years. Twenty nine for sixty eight from three but he helped win the title. Game Game Six. I made huge shots. This is a massive Celtics playoff. But who am I overvalue like who am I missing on? There's another draft room behind me. That's freaking out being like. I can't believe they took Eddie House who one day they found a scattering report on him. And I know I've said this story before but this report said won't shoe unless he has the basketball. I had them tense. Just just say you know my board. So it wasn't a big upset on now. Was it reach reach. Nothing now is a reach. I thought take a good. I'm going to take a good locker room guy pretty well. So that's the case for any house is Awesome Locker Room. Guy Could actually come in and make a big shot in a game. It's not it's not the wrong pick I had Desmond Mason seven so I'm GonNa take him an eighth You know like a bunch of the guys in his draft at his peak was a fifteen and five I just want to say he was enough of an asset that he was basically the centerpiece of the Ray Allen Trade because if you look at that trade it was Gary Payton News and Expiring Contract Desmond Mason for Ray Allen Ronald Berry Kevin Kelly in two thousand and three first round pick. That was like the fact that Milwaukee basically they give up their first round. Pick N Ray Allen so they could get Gary Payton for two months and Desmond Mason. So he had to evade real value back. Then unless Ray Allen is the biggest cancer in the world I didn't realize it but that's one of the Weirder trade so anyway. I'm taking him a mad. That Eddie houses off the board. Who Do you have a number nine? I look at the fact that eighty house come in and make big playoff shots that that puts him in another class. Where a lot of these guys. Even get a chance to do that. So that's why I'm Gonna I think it's a reach because I actually meant to take this guy before him and then take Eddie ouse- after but it looks like would've been Joma. Gore should have gone this late. You should've gone either. The last two picks you said that without any irony at all. No what are you talking about? A Shimomura deserves to go. Seven eight not night in the two thousand miles above the draftable is green room. Going with Eddie House really. Yeah he made an all star team minute all star team and I'm going to tell you the more I dug into the Jamal. Mcclure story the more. I realize the numbers don't don't do it. Justice so just the unquantifiable Jamal. Magor he yeah a double double with New Orleans you know I mean I kind of liked him I I am up to the tenth. Pick your pick Darius. Miles can't fall any further. I gotTa take them here. The case I dare smiles. Who did get hurt to be fair? He he is another like we talked about earlier. These guys that. I'm not sure what they did. He couldn't shoot three's Had No post up game to speak of was a career. Forty seven cents. Shooter was just a good athlete was fun to watch on a fast break had a lot of personality. I'm not really sure what the best case scenario of it was in Portland whose plan on the. Oh six blazers. Before he got hurt he was fourteen and four and a half a game basically but But had an effect that he got traded for hundred biller. When Andre Miller had a lot of value that Cooper's cavs trade and never totally happened but I just want to say I really enjoyed them. I was rooting for the whole time. And I still haven't totally given up on them. We always talk about the guys haven't given up on yet. I have no idea why I wanted it to happen so bad. I I thought he had a nice feel for the game like he was a good passer he he did. He had the right instincts he just. He was like a six foot ten. Tweeter eight six five nine. I guess I never knew what he was supposed to be. Or who is the guy? Who's the prototype that he was supposed to be following and I don't think he knew it either? Yeah because back then to. We were still doing this. Mcgrady stuff where anybody that was big and handle had a little Bit of vision. It's just a knock. It's almost insulting McGrady. How many different guys? We thought would be these next tall athletic guys. But I'm I'm with you like I remember being on the East Coast and I had a thing for Darius as I mentioned earlier because you know there was. I don't think he's ever going to Saint John's but I was always paying attention. And that's when you kind of. I started your season ticket. Thing too with the clippers right and it was fun. It was kind of like wait a minute. This team might not be very good but this could be something. That was when I got a when I got League Pass. I remember watching a Lotta them that one really fun year. It seemed like something was happening with them. Yes yeah and and. He seemed like he had a chance. It's funny I remember when I was preparing for the two thousand thirteen draft watching the Jaanus highlights of him at the Greek. Ymca when you back when Yannis was like six eight thinking that he reminded me. There's miles this is before. He grew an extra three inches when he got here. But same kind of thing. It's like what is this. This is something. It's funny how we just get attracted to those guys like There's something if he can only unlock. But now I look back miles on like. What would he have unlocked? I don't know the roadmap for him to be an all star but I'm taking stuff is so hard began. I couldn't. I'm so glad you said that because there's a version of the honest thing where you go. I'm not falling for this again right. There were plenty of teams. That also did it. It's like this draft was a draft of redheads. And then all the GM's were like blondes from here on out. Yonder say that. Y'All female either way. Yannis went fifteenth and it seemed like Pretty Fair in fact it seemed maybe two maybe two spots early but it was like all right. Yeah roll the dice with the fucking Greek head. We'll see but at that point here. We're doing that. Whatever will give this one a shot so I like the miles just. I'm happy for him too because we know that it was really rough for him. Yeah and you know. We don't know these guys but I guess I'm with you. I've always had a soft spot for him. I love reason and I'm just. I'm happy that it looks like you know he in Q. Getting a podcast. Go and all that stuff. I'm just I'm just happy Because I read into. It's just sad stuff so I'm glad for one one thing that's been lost. I think they did a six episode series of the life were. They filed the clippers around which. I can't believe is an on youtube if anyone has this on their VCR whatever like. Please put this on Youtube for America because it was a lot of like behind the scenes with with Quinn Richardson. A D miles and I remember damages their senior them getting gas. And Shit like that and it was just. I just want to hang out with these guys like these guys anyway. Let's rip through this. Who Do you have at eleven? I'M GONNA go mopey probably should have gone higher? Yeah he's what he went to. Low is overall analytics. He holds up. He's like a top seven top eight guy and You know unfortunate for him. I think you know he was always kind of an off ball guy which could leave you out a place back then a little bit too much so you weren't as active now off balls like Kinda where you WanNa be and he would have been more productive today but he had a better career. I think than you realize you know. A lot of these guys are like. Oh you know the guy stuck around. It's easy for victims of the second half of some of these careers but moby probably should've gone higher thirty seven percent career. Three point shooter. I have Wow I can't believe he's still here Joel. Priscilla I'm grabbing with the twelfth spot here Eljay was better to the lottery process. Light of the night Joe Bell. Just a veteran played played thirteen seasons. Had you know a couple moments there with Portland in the only way to nine range when they were doing the two headed monster thing at center So in Oh eight. Oh nine together. He's playing twenty three minutes a game. And averaging almost nine rebounds a game so he's just kind of one of those big white guys who Kinda knew how to put his hands up and grab a couple of rebounds and could finish a pass in the paint so I'm getting value there with at twelve with Priscilla you could do a lot worse than Joel. Priscilla the rest of the way. He's a veteran. Who have thirteen another guy that I lift on here. Marcus FIZER OH. I was always. I was always no. I'm not taking him. I just wanted to mention Pfizer. All Iowa state guys. It's kind of like the the Babe Ruth League you WanNa check the birth certificate there but he was only twenty two and he came in but immediately it wasn't gonNA work and then everybody's acquire they taking them with brand what I love about the Bulls. Remember Jerry. Krause his famous line after they broke everything up in one thousand nine hundred eighty eight which really thinking back on. It is one of the dumbest thing that doesn't get knocked enough for being one of the dumbest thing in the history of modern sports that in ninety eight they said okay. We'll find like we're sick a fill in. Mj In this whole thing. And we don't want to be the Celtics that was aligned. Jerry Krause saying we don't WanNa be the celtics hang onto these guys and then be a relevant and then have a forever rebuild. So let's just do this. They take fives or they end up. Trading brand you get another pick later on in the in the Eddy Curry Tyson Chandler thing and from ninety eight when they won their last title in one sixty games the next three years they went thirteen and sixty S. They went thirteen and thirty seven. Seventeen sixty five fifteen in sixty seven. They had one second round appearance in the twelve years after that. Nine hundred ninety eight deal and they took Pfizer who I liked but he was just too small for power forward then not quick enough and all those things he had the ACL tear. He had thirty one tattoos in March of two thousand six. That was the full count there. Also a youth minister Marcus. Fizer started in thirty five games for his career. He was also turned his life around after retired. Yeah Youth Minister Yeah. I think he was a pretty pretty sketchy as teammate. I think he was one of those One of one of those guys when he played was kind of like. Stay away from that guy and not locked in. Yeah I'm really on thin. turned his life around. I just wanted to talk about five or a little bit. Because that's another whiff I go whiff left and rightness when I think I even like you know doing a little bit more dueling might be the call. Here I'm going go key on dueling okay. It's fair could be could be a a nice man. Potentially on like a second round playoff team was gonNA take Hurrah for screens and toughness. I've always had a thing owner. Robert I I just don't think it's fair to take take him over Dueling Giraldo so still there. I don't want to end up with strom out swift and I'm not taking Pfizer or courtyard exander Speedy Claxton well so I think the right pick here is either speedy Claxton Harare just because they made plans. But I'm not GONNA do that. I'm going to go off the grid. I'm going to surprise people here. Aj Guyton. I'm GonNa Take Chris Carrawell. I'm gonNA take Demar Johnson. I see what you're doing there so if you look at his first two years. I can't do that. He was even as even before he the car accident and he was a good yeah. I'm not doing that I'll take out take a speedy claxton. 'cause in Oh three. He actually played crunch time minutes for a team. That won the title when when Parker was still in that like almost like two thousand eight Rondo. Version Tony Parker when Either those young point guards. You can't rely on them every finals game and you you kind of have to need veteran guy that can come in and kind of right. The ship speedy Claxton was there in his his His Spurs stuff. Twenty four playoff games as fourteen minutes. A game Average five again. That's all I need. He was in the rotation of a finals team. So there you go I I have him. Just a nudge over stroz swift and Jerem Louisa. Couple other names here Lavar. Postel who loved Saint John's I was Kinda like Gallon Maliki Allen Naturally I remember Khalid all mean played one season. How about the Bulls? After this. I did find some bulls articles that were bullish on their future. It's like man we got Pfizer and Crawford and we got Guidon Jake Vasco all in on. Well you mentioned the the idiotic bowls rebuild before it actually worked. They just did it for the wrong drafts. 'cause you think about it. The the in ninety nine they got the first pick out and brand two thousand they have the fourth pick in the seventh pick and then in two thousand one they flip brand for a top three pick and they had another top three picks so they ended up they had five top seven picks in a three year stretch though brand. They turned into one of those but Just really bad luck tab a fourth pick in a seventh pick in the same draft and not only gopher to but it's justifiable that you went over to it's like it's like you can have such than that. Yeah you actually. No-one should have no one. Should you know Yorick who played for The Spurs I always Kinda liked him. He came in the League. I think what he was. Twenty Four Marco. Whole couple of season ticket runs with him because he the first couple years. I the clippers tickets. He was pretty competent. I actually liked his game too. Yeah he put on some smaller guys as I would watch in the only thing I have left on this too is historically as you mentioned plenty of times and it's it's clearly thought out how horrible this is historically but I was going to look at it the teams that were drafting. Like when you look at the top six teams in this draft. How bad their starting lineups were. Yeah this the basketball is even close to being like we know. It's better now and the depth of stars and the exciting storylines and all this stuff but it's almost easy to forget like where the hell were these teams like. What were they doing the nets now that first year Martin didn't have kid it was Marbury and this actually isn't a terrible five but it Steph van Horn Kenyan Kendall Gill who was at that point on the way out Aaron Williams. It's just a role guy. Vancouver's team was SCHRIEF Abdul Rahim Bibi. Dickerson who's going to get her othello. Big Country The clippers had a twenty one year old. Odem Jeff mcginness Eric. Bykovsky although a candy and mcginnity was only played like nineteen minutes. A game the Bulls had Ron Mercer. Elk Brand or test but our test wasn't our test then now at all he's twelve game. Hoiberg. Bryce was getting fucking real minutes all year long. I mean the magic had T- McCoy at twenty one put up a twenty-seven eight five season but after him it was Daryl Armstrong Grant Hill played four games blowout law D- Brown Atlanta's lineup was Jason Terry coup coach. Seventeen Games matombo Jim Jackson and Lorenzen Wright these teams. Those are thirty guys that were playing the majority of the minutes for those six games or furloughs sixteenths. It was a talent soon and it loudly US. It lasted basically all the way till seven eight range. You can even see it if you go back and you read some of the trade value calms I did you. I'm just laying out. What the assets were in the moment and guys who are like eighteen or twenty or twenty four. It's nuts. You can't believe it. I think once we hit oh nine two thousand ten range I think things really really flipped. But you also had you know I've written about it a million times about the Too much too fast. Too Soon era from like ninety three ninety nine of all those young guys who just got too much money too fast and just didn't have the careers that they should add when you think about the two thousand season. This should have been the peak of Kenny Anderson and big dog Robinson and guys like that some of them made a Derrick Coleman. There are all these blue chip guys. That should have been in their absolute hate. And they just weren't so you're missing like probably nine to ten blue chippers. That should have been awesome and Vin Baker He's already starting to Peter Shawn Kemp's already basically played his way out of the League and you go on down the line. It's just like what happened but that's probably Start for another podcast but that was also to you. Remember the lockout in people being like. Are you guys kidding me like we started this podcast talked about guy staying in better shape? I would imagine I would give most players the benefit of the doubt of you know. Just make sure you're ready and there's GonNa be some disappointments. That was the big joke twenty years ago when a lot of these guys came back from the lockout they were never the same. Like shot camp physicals. Never the same person show after the lockout. And it's like well you just. You just didn't care but it's that's a great point though. I hadn't really thought of it that way. The too much too soon thing. I know you've written about it but it's just it's just a good reminder of you have these classes that are all supposed to replace each other but then you have this group of incredibly talented guys players. We kinda liked. And you're like what what the Hell's going on here and then you add in this class and I also noticed too when you go back and read some of the stuff how many GM's that were running some stuff and no one should really be blamed for anything after this kind of classes just went through but a lot of these guys never got jobs again. I mean billy NYC at the the Atlanta job when everyone in the world news taking Sheldon Williams Duke Five. And you're like what could you possibly that shook me for a month? I go back and watch more and more Sheldon Williams and I'm like how could anyone take this guy? V Like. There's no way this is real. And he took him fifth and there are some guys taken picks there that would never be given the job to run a franchise. The way they had twenty years ago will Just give me one movie recommendation. Before we go bombshell liked it oh interesting. Yeah the dude seriously. Shelley's they're on plan. Megan Kelly creepy good. How good that is and you know Margot Robbie you know like a change the channel. I didn't like it as much as you like behind the scenes. You always are away. You've always got out of the office so anything that has to do with like television being on the deal and I was. I was in it every day. Yeah home in the hallways you were above that seat in a field that I really liked the movie I called never rarely sometimes always which is not the most uplifting movie but I thought it was Exceptionally well done and kind of an important movie side recommend that one okay And then Ozark sees a win huge fan. I have Going backwards movie for you. Okay just quickly. I watched election with my daughter today. I fast forward. I knew there was a couple of things that I the remote ready. Just like to pause and then get through it but How old is she? She's fourteen she can handle. I don't want to be in the camera with urban stuff's happening but That movie's really fun rewire. There's certain scenes yes. There's a couple but I was on it. It was never an issue Early Alexander Payne Matthew Broderick had that FUN DRAMA. Run THERE FROM LATE NINETY S. He's in you can count on me the year later early early reese. Chris Klein being a doofus before we realized that was his only move Look at this actor. And he's not acting. This is just what he's like of but it's a really fun. Quirky Boo had seen. Wow we even did. I think a Rewatch ables ninety nine on and I wasn't on that one But I I just. I like the Alexander Payne movies. I've watched that. I watched the descendants and I'll watch sideways during the quarantine and and You know I'm not. I'm not breaking ground by saying that guy's really good but it was just fun to watch all three of those in ten days and see the progression I love sideways. Sideways is like one of my favorite movies. The last fifteen years so there you go. I saw I saw election in theater loved immediately. People thought I was a Weirdo. Because I was really on it and I think you're GonNa see this movie election movie election and a couple of girls. I mean you know. Twenty three twenty four. They're like that movie was kind of weird. Like do you not see. That's how simple it is and perfectly executed the whole deal this great like when the kid who's in the wheelchair gives the speech running for president. Vice President Yeah And it's perfectly like the way he says it and I'm like that's high school that's being in high school and the whole deal. And then yeah one of the other person like somebody else's giving a speech in like some pimple face red etiquette to eat me raw reeves in the background and then the guy playing the principles perfect. The you know the. We're not GONNA do that here. And the Principals. Perfect the whole thing. I love election and sideways is funny because I did not like it when I first saw. It was too young of too young to understand how heavy that movie is. It's it's I can watch sideways. Sideways is up there with with very few movies like watch because I just started up Shashank. I just was going through a want to see some scenes question for you. Tweeted about it. If read in the crew his lunch crew. There were close enough to Andy Defraigne to get him on roof tarring duty outside couple bottle of suds yet. Where was that crew when the sisters were beaten the hell out of them and we know what else is going on so like? I'm good for tarring but you guys can't help me out with these dudes. Well read says that I do believe those were the worst two years for Andy which is being repeatedly raped by the sisters which I think I would hope that were the worst two years but Yeah tarring happened after. I think this system has gotten kinda tired or ended that point but I think the friendships with those other guys. Kinda deepened. A little bit later. But they're still rigged as the they still rigged it he got picked. So there's a scene. It goes right from that to write to that. I so basically what I found is a problem. One of the greatest moves of our lifetime. So I'm just there's a lot of problems. I don't want to say that because I could see a movie now. It's one of one of my favorite movies ever but you could really if you're going to really start nitpicking. You could do movie. Yeah I still don't know how he knew which way to turn in the sewage pipe because left because I think the grade I'd I'd I don't think you've worked instruction enough. I think of Andy. I think you could just use people can. I could tell if something's level just by looking at it just years on the site. What he's doing he's going. I need a certain grade. Because this is a pipe dispensing outwards. He probably just felt the level. I think I would have screwed that up and gone left and then be like. Oh Fuck where is this? Where is exit? Throw up again Russillo. Stay safe we'll see in a week and And I don't know I don't know. What the next redrafted with us is going to be but but we might end up having to do. Oh three at some point may maybe not next week but at some point all right I'll We can listen to your podcast as well which you'll be doing at least one of this week and fell draft is coming. It'd be the last like real sports. Were probably going to have her for what? But anyway Good senior talk to Sinn Arthur. Thanks for listening to the two thousand redraft ables with me and Russillo coming up later this week. The two thousand one redraft ables Zach Lowe. That was an insane draft. Stay tuned for that one. Thanks as always for listening to the book of basketball pockets.

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2006 Redraftables: The Unluckiest, Goofiest, Most Incompetent Draft of the 2000s, With Chris Ryan and Joe House

Book of Basketball 2.0

1:22:57 hr | 5 months ago

2006 Redraftables: The Unluckiest, Goofiest, Most Incompetent Draft of the 2000s, With Chris Ryan and Joe House

"You're listening to the two thousand six NBA redraft ables on the book. Basketball two point Oh podcast. My name is. Bill, Simmons. Let's do it. Shot. Josh. Of, basketball. She twelve fashion. Of Fast. Food. The two thousand six redraft the Bulls Chris. Ryan is here Joe Houses here. This is one of the dumbest copious draughts. Yeah other than two thousand thirteen Probably the dopey is draft of this entire century we had. A for our first pick was named Andrea. We had six lottery whiffs. We had out of our top five picks. One guy became amnestied later tires. Thomas One guy was an iconic all-time bust at Morrison, one guy became a internet punching bag and a despised New York knick Andrea. Berg Ninety, and then the number five pick was a guy who's nickname was the landlord that I had totally forgotten until until I did all the research for this lamarcus. Aldridge was the only good top five pick. Out of this draft Chris Ryan this was also the last blog post of your chauncey billips blog, which has new four hour documentary Coming up by Ken Burns. What do you remember this draft? I when you think about it I it's intertwined with my experience on basketball Internet and like the first three or four years at two thousand, where it was truly weird out there you know and people were just blog about the personalities that they were attracted to infer as much as this. This two thousand six draft is honestly like. It's probably a waste of this podcast time to re-litigate. It wouldn't island of misfit toys, man, and what a strange group of individuals to be in this lottery much less this whole draft and I remember those that night, and just like that was back when like basketball was truly weird back then when the when guys like this get picked like Sheldon Williams would go into the top five or six picks of a draft, and you were just like what am I doing with my life. I'm just watching. This guy named the landlord gets elected. House Russillo and I. We did the two thousand five redraft ables. And discussed. This is an epic. EPIC GM run of just terrible decisions across the board for five solid years, and you can feel a lot of them in this draft combined with one of the Weirdest College seasons we've ever had where it was basically the height of Jj Redick, becoming like a Cobra Kai America's villain on Duke and then this bizarre Adam Morrison thing going on, and all of us are like wow, these are the best two players in college basketball. This is not a great side for the draft. What else do you remember from that college season? I don't remember a from IT I. Think the overriding overwhelming. Sentiment is what you guys have been saying. which was just crazy weird? It was so weird I thought that Duke team was very good, and yet they they won right. They won that title that year I never thought that Sheldon Williams was a White House or kind of guy and he got picked. A fifth in the draft it was like. Is. This draft I think is proof of how hard the draft is like. How can you fault GM's? How can you fault? Teams for you know taking a swing on a bunch of guys. You know the track records here are all over the place. How how can you possibly mine a diamond like Paul? MILLSAP it back in this era. This is this is the kind of takeaway for me. Yeah there. We don't really have the advanced metrics component yet. Even if you look I, don't WanNa. Spoil the redraft that we're doing later, but. You Have Rondos the twenty first pick calories twenty-fourth. Paul millsaps forty seventh. PJ Tucker's thirty fifth. and. These are all guys that would become like top eight or nine row of and guys, and then you go the other way with the top five Wurley. One Guy makes it I, we knew it at the time. And this is only happened a couple of times with the draft I. Think it definitely two thousand, definitely two, thousand thirteen, and then this one. Where people are like Holy Shit. Get! Hold onto your seats. We don't know what's going to happen This draft has some. SUGGEST LEGENDARY DUMB ASS traits. So Chicago ends up with the number two pick because of the Eddy. Curry trade that is Ahah Thomas made the previous summer where he gives up to unprotected first round picks. The first one manifest itself as the number two pick in the entire draft. CHICAGO GETS Insane Dumb Luck Oh my God. I can't believe this worked out for us. Not was too good to be true. They flip the pick to number four Portland. for the rights to Tyrus Thomas and Viktor Crapper House Victocrat, joke. Yes, it's Victor Crap. That's the joke well. That trade was Kappa Portland acquires the seventh pick from the Celtics, Randy foy. Raeffel, Francis contract which ran for Two more years? Or three more years and and Dan Dicko. In exchange for Sebastian. Tell Fair Theo. RATLIFF S- contract which was expire year sooner, the Mayflower, France, which is why boss the wanted it and a two thousand eight second rounder. We're GONNA. Go until later, but this is about as angry as by Dad's ever been on a draft week. He was just completely enraged. We'll cover it later and then the other one. That's nuts. Phoenix says the twenty first pick. Marcus Williams on the board. Controversial Point Guard who was. You can still some laptops? Let's let's just call. It seems laptop steeler and then regime rondos on the board who everybody was like Freakish athleticism huge hands. He was one of the original freak guys. But, but had some some chemistry issues it Kentucky. We'll leave it at that Phoenix has the twenty first pick? They just traded for future Portland first rounder. Meanwhile, this is the height of Phoenix being great. They just could have had Rondo. They pass that up. eight Chris why were the GM so bad? Is it like the Internet hadn't properly bullied GM's yet for bad behavior? What was going on here so I'll tell you I'll tell you what I think is I remember sitting in the back of a of a wonderful record store called Mondo Kim's on saint marks place in new. York City and reading your columns back then like, and that was the first time that I was like. Oh Yeah, you know what somebody makes these decisions like these don't just appear in Sixers, uniforms and I remember that was the sort of like the that you you know you among the first people introduce these ideas of like these guys can actually screw teams up for years, and it'd be paying more attention to how they spend the teams money. How put these teams together when I? Look at this list of I, mean I? I actually am nostalgic for the era of dumb. GM's I think that a lot more fun. When there were David Cons and less Daryl Murray's nowadays like it's pretty rare winsome screws up on a monumental level. You know this was the year I wrote the atrocious summit for four months before I think one common theme with a lot of this stuff, there's more ex players running teams. This was still the last. Part of the Era House You House I. Don't know if you know this, but you've had a couple of ex. Players run the bullets wizards. To to mix success. I. Think what's happened by the time we get to two thousand twenty. It's A. It's just a lot more smart people who didn't necessarily play basketball professionally. You know. I, think back then you think like you have west, Ernie Grunfeld Thomas It just goes on and Michael Jordan's making picks for Charlotte. And the wave is coming of the Daryl Morey Sam Prestige guys that are looking at it completely different data taking advanced metrics in in new account that aren't bringing in explorer player biases of no, this guy's talented. We can save him things like that house. Would you rather have an ex player or a smart person? Run your team just. Pick. The one thing I will say in in reviewing this draft in thinking about it. The the dearth of talent. This is really a talentless draft I mean yeah, there was one potential superstar in the draft and he got hurt, and that's it like Adam Morrison. Yes and his name is Adam. Morrison, that was my favorite part of Chris. Ryan's Lash blog post ever by the way was was. What was it what you call his outfit? I. I compared to Guy Greeting you at a best buy, but I have to go back and chatty. You call them like. A rector like you know a guy like rectory. Does let member how many Adam Morrison conversations. We had a no six. This was still an era when people really really cared about college basketball, and he was an incredibly fun college basketball for both him and JJ. where? It's hard to think of it this way now. Jj turned into such a good role player, but He was awesome to watch college and the other schools really hated him, and he's talked on his podcast about you know. It was tough thing for him to deal with as twenty and twenty one year old. When you're getting hate, he'd done you like that with Morrison. This is Gonzaga's real of yours. You break out as A big time program. Yeah, and he was unlike any other college player he he was buckets. He was putting it up. word out the point of the conversation where I have to ask you guys. Adam, Morrison! Could. He have made it if he didn't blow out his knee and the Hornets Bob Cats whatever they whatever Charlotte version they were at that point I. Kinda liked him. Freshman year our rookie year in Charlotte I thought he had a couple of DC moments that I think the knee injury just killed them. Yeah, I think there's a couple of guys in this draft who are drafted a couple of years too early. I mean they're probably a couple of guys who were bus. No matter what, but this draft is is a really interesting snapshot of time before I think people started getting a little bit more creative with how they. How they developed talent in the NBA so you've you see a couple of guys here and you're just like. Yeah, this is just someone just straight up drafting power forward because they think they need some help on the boards. And Morrison drafted in two thousand twelve is just a much different player than he is in two thousand six. He might have even succeeded in the era that he was drafted into if he hadn't gotten hurt, he that was the worst possible situation for him. Based on what we now know was his. You know particular kind of psychological makeup like he just he you know as you said Bill, he didn't have the. Disposition the demeanor, the psychological wherewithal to be Alpha, and they needed. MJ needed Alpha out of that draft. Pick and the funny thing is. He showed a ton of Alpha as a college basketball player. Like yeah, this is incredible. Atkin Zag I loved him, and I thought he was going to have at least a good a career as somebody like Keith van Horn like you know That felt to me like his. His basement is his floor. but I think it was you know the injury obviously was the career all terror, but if he landed somewhere where he didn't have that pressure and he'd be got got picks. You know later in the lottery in the ten to fourteen range I think he could have been successful in that era. There was some red flags. that. We did not know. Had to take into account in the mid two thousand, because even with him and I remember my column had really taken off at this point at a lot of is the first time I was really getting inside information from different people. And the the the the word Morrison at Gonzaga was, he was really fragile, and they really protected him from the media. He was almost like putting a bubble there because they were really worried about him. They were worried about what he could handle and they really sheltered him and a lot of ways, and that was the word even before the draft and I think now in two thousand twenty. Teams the science of studying like just the brain and mental makeup of a player, and there's so much emphasis now mental health. They were real red flags with him. Throw him on Charlotte with a ton. Expectations doesn't have a great rookie season. He still averaged eleven a game, but he's on a team with Gerald Wallace Raymond Felton Meko Kapoor And and it just he gets the knee injury, and he just kinda creators I think he would have been put in a better position to succeed, but I also don't think he would have gone three because I think. I think teams would have been really concerned about some of the red flags with him coming out. College. Thing a good. Though, it's also like that catch twenty two, where the most value is derived from him, if he's a focal point of the offense, but the most pressure, put on him when he's made the focal point of an offense it also if you're an NBA team and Adam Morrison is the focal point of your offense where you're going right the another guy that tires. Thomas ends up going in the top five. It's fueled and by the way I I will admit I was completely wrong I thought he was going to be a good pro. One of the reasons I thought that was. He was awesome in the tournament, and it was a classic case of. The Guy Lighting it up for two weeks in March madness. And everybody going Oh this guy and. It was just the dictators house. We've gotten sucked into those guys over and over again. That was a classic Bartsch. Bad this almost like a contract year liquid jerome? James had his contract year. Making thirty million in the playoffs it was the college of that I think people are more hip to that now. getting. Used by too much bad this week's. Yeah I. Mean we've acknowledged it a bunch of times doing these redraft. That back in in that era, and even really especially in the late nineties. We used performance in the. NC AA AS A. Highly weighted. Indicator of a potential future success, because you know the logic and I think it's not crazy logic was that. On the biggest stage in front with the highest amount of pressure seeing these guys perform, there should be a a reliable kind of indicator of how they're going to withstand that same kind of pressure once they're in the NBA. Maybe don't take somebody from LSU's a good draft strategy. A Name Shack. The number one pick in this draft Andrea Berg dining. None of us were that excited about when it happened. And I and when we do the redraft ables, I wanna go into his whole career, but here's here's how people felt when it happened Jay Bilas. The draft says. A solid prospect with a chance to be a solid player. Red Flag number one then he says later in the draft. This is before he's even taken. He does not rebound. He does not post up. He's not physical. He needs to work on his body. That's how bad this draft. Number one pick. And our go nuts because we love brandon. Rang College. We were just like. Here's the one guy in this draft other than Jj. Who I I think we both fell was we knew at least he was going to be a valuable player. We're GONNA BE STAR. But Brandon Roy was like we know what he is. He's a guard. Who's going to be able to create a shot? He had a very identifiable kind of crossover hesitation move. That was just like one. The NBA score twenty a game. I wrote when Minnesota took him sixt. I wrote in the diary with the six pick Minnesota somehow ends up with the best porn draft. Brandon Roy funny how it works out that way with the new rules necessitate move loan is good for sixty and eighteen points again next season and three or four. All Star appearances down the road. That was exactly what happened what we didn't know we didn't have. Have the intelligence that his knees were like every every good medical staff that looked at him was like that guy's got five years, and so there was a real shelf life, and yet Chris an iconic four five years for him. Oh Yeah I mean some of the most like breathtaking moments of that of the NBA era associate with brain a Roy. It's miss them. Miss Actually really enjoyed how unique his game was. Oh, God i. Think some of these guys man like I missed. These types of players 'cause you think like Aldridge is in this draft still growing strong, he's on San Antonio is going to be a free agent after this season. Any think like we could have had fifteen years of Brandon Roy. We basically got four. And it wasn't like he did anything wrong. It was just his body. There is a whole thing about he was missing acl and all these different things but the Celtics. Had the seventh pick and the. Doctors basically. I think they've talked about this. This is what I was told by my Boston people like the team. Doctors were just like you can't take this guy. He's going to be added a league by the time. He's twenty six twenty seven, do you? There's anything to the idea the way like have understanding of how to get guys healthy like. Is there anything that could have saved for Roy I? Mean you're not a doctor, but like the way the sixers put guys on ice for a year or two here and there. Is there anything that have been done to prolong or save? Roy Career I'm sure. I'm sure I I don't know if it would have. You know one hundred percent. Save his legs, but I'm sure there's a scenario where it opens. The other one you know will do out and when we do. Oh seven, but the Odin stuff was very very basic things that could have saved him right? His legs weren't the same size now they would know. Oh, just wear these sneakers. It'll even out you know then your body won't be off kilter and things like that. It's weird. We were thinking this way in a. Two thousand six, but we weren't one other note. We should talk about Rondo goes twenty. One and Larry Goes Twenty. Four I didn't like when the Celtics traded for Rondo. Here's what I wrote. The list of NBA teams that won an MBA title with the point guard who couldn't shoot looks like this, and then the list was just all empty. But then I added on the other hand by Celtics. Balls told me that Rondo absolutely destroyed. Randy Foreign Marcus Williams and their work out a few weeks ago. So who knows they win a title within two years later. Better draft. Ari performances the great reverse jinx. There is an argument to be made. And I'm sure we can make it if we were GONNA do not okay. The entire career that the skies have but if we were going to say the best version of these players, how would you redraft them? I I think national. TV rondos in the conversation for the number one pick. Wow, while tell you this well. We'll I I want to save some the Rondo staffer. When we get to them, but I'll tell you this. His rookie year, which was a train wreck and they're tanking for Tim Duncan Basically Two months in. and. Rondo was clearly good. And it was almost like. Inexplicable that they weren't playing him. More and I do think they sacrificed some of his rookie year because it was like when he was on the court, good things would actually happened and. You could, you could just see something. It was not surprising to a when they do. The K. G. Trade they. It was the one piece they wouldn't put in because Minnesota's like. Give us Jefferson give us Rondo. You're not getting Rondo. We actually think we can win. The title of fees in our seven rotation, so that happened some comedy from this draught. Here's what I wrote on the Thomas pick quote. In the draft diary I love that pick for them. Not, just because of he's a freakish athlete with the seven foot three wingspan. You can go to war with titus. Hockey. World War was that Star Wars, the the Faulk, the Balkan Island fucking was the faulk way, crisis. Another one was They had a whole debate about route. Gays potential because Rudy Gay starts sliding, which was actually dumb, I mean really gave was talented. We're all frustrated with him, Yukon. There's a whole rap that he knew that he didn't care enough. Greg Anthony argued. That gay will be better than people think. Stephen is on this draft and it was clear he had watch Basketball Steve Nee countered. I haven't seen him play that much. And that was the argument. Stephen is one of the people on this draft I. Haven't seen the play that much about Rudy Gay. who was a top pick Randy Foye. Everybody was really excited about including I think. US 'cause we liked them, Villanova. At some point, they're talking about the pick. He goes seventh, and then they Minnesota in Portland. Flip six and seven. And Portland Gets Brandon Roy Dickie. V comes in devious available. This draft to and he comes in and he goes. He's way way baby. After. Had just won the two thousand six title. He's wait wait, so that was rough. Tough Fund Stu Scott was doing the interviews. He interviewed Patrick. Bryant nights and he said. This hour we started the interview before the NCAA tournament. Nobody knew who you were. What's the best thing about your game? Bryant that people don't know S- called Bryant. That was a rough moment Senay yes. seven-foot eight. Wingspan. Seattle jumped on him at number ten. And there's a story that a hat. The draft our that I researched true that they had taught him how to make a layup off his correct foot twelve months before and that house he'd played in a Belgian Professional League, the season for the draft, the average three points a game. We're there red flags in your opinion here. Basing thing is that after that kind of a resume and with that kind of background. That some number of years later, using land got drafted. Yeah, Wayne here later, he was the he was the first. Senate was set by the way he paved. At a chairman. There's a what fair because Seattle rextall on the board at that point. If Seattle takes rettig. They had ray Allen. And then durant's coming in. Oh seven, they could've. They could've had just all three of those guys on the same team and had like the first ridiculous three point two. Or does it make them good enough to that? They missed around. Oh good point. Well. I'll tell you who did make them good enough Sarah today. So then that we were already for the Knicks to take Marcus Williams. Controversial pick. A point guard. I had a joke in the draft. Our I'm still proud of for ten years later. He's leading all NBA rookies in steals right now. Goodwin, thank you be here all week. Dan Patrick was the narrator the draft. In had like a kind of some tension with stern and at one point. Utah was on the clock. They made the picks stern. Come Out, and Patrick was doing where where to go jokes. Stern emerged and say Dan, I was sitting in the back, listening to your pithy comments. He's the word Pithy to Dan Patrick ever do another draft now. And then there's the iconic moment of this draft and when it really went to another level was the next round the clock at twenty. Marcus. Williams is on the board and again people thought Marcus. Williams was like a top ten pick before the laptop stealing thing rondos on the board. The Knicks don't have a point guard they have. It's like they're in that Steve Francis. Marbury just like it just headed off a cliff, and why not take a young point, guard? And they take out Bachman. And I don't know as the years pass. If the humor has stayed in place the way it did in the moment, but This was at a time of is as GM rain. where the sex stuff was already going on, he said he'd made a whole bunch of terrible trades, and we had now reached a point where it's like anything was possible with the Knicks draft pick and when they took Bachman, it actually delivered. It was as good. From a comedy standpoint as we ever would've wanted, and then they cut for some reason. Stern said Rinaldo is not here. The crowd booing. Crafts go crazy and Dan Patrick Os and it's probably a good thing. And then they cut right to spike. Lee, who's just like looks like he just lost his dog, and that was the New York in two thousand six. That was great That's really about it. Other than Marcus Williams said they they had fourteen percent body fat down for Barca Swims. Read. Houses wing it at right now. That's how like after a trip to moment google. Present fourteen percent fats high. Yeah, anyway all right. Let's do the draft so. I had from a crapshoot rating I had this draft as a nine and a half out of ten. It's just an incredible redraft from where guys were taken. Who wants to for give the first pick because this was the the final Chauncey billips blog blog spot draft I. Pick I am GONNA. Probably go a little bit controversial and I'm going to go kyle lowry! Wow, yeah! Gosh. First of all loved him on that. Four Guard Nova team with Mike Nardi. Allan Ray Randy. Foy I that that that was like a rule precursor to offenses to come. I think he's got a ring. I think he has really been an example of what you can do. In the second half half of your career, would if you change your body a little bit. Make the argument that his a lot of success is due to, but I thought he's had. I overall feel like he has had more memorable and impressive career then lamarcus. Well here's the irony of that pick. Toronto had the first pick in the real draft yeah. And I should have done this I'm sorry that the Westerns, here's how the actual draft went. TORONTO! Bark, Donnie Shock TOOK ALDRIDGE TRADED PORTLAND. Morrison, Third Portland's pick for trades it to Chicago Thomas. Atlanta v showed Williams Minnesota six brandon. Roy flips in the Portland for number seven Randy, foye Houston, eight Rudy Gay Gold State, nine Patrico, brand Seattle takes a Orlando eleven with Rettig, and then it gets goofy after that so. You have Toronto. Ending up with collar anyway, yes, you think of that pick well. The the problem is it took kyle a little while to get going like he didn't start every game until two thousand fourteen, he didn't make an all star team until two thousand fifteen, and this is, we're talking about the two thousand six draft, so you need to be a team that has eight or nine years worth of patience. At the payoff now he's. He's really validated that that selection over the last five years. I mean you know incredible at has. Trust the process. What hell of a process Chris Right. So! Yeah, I I couldn't do that spot. So. This is the same year Darrell. Maury takes over the rockets which would probably should've mentioned the top. He's running the draft for the first time ends up making the controversial for shame, bad trade, which eventually became a giant Michael Lewis feature and is really like. The first moneyball moment for the NBA where somebody's. Breaking Down Shame Bat is all his Glue Guy Stats and decides. That's more valuable for the team we have. Then Rudy gays potential, and it's the. It's honestly the first trade like that of the thing. I knew Darryl and we've talked about it on the on these pods going back when he was at the Celtics took the job talk to him a lot in this time. And I remember, he asked me for advice. When he took the job in my advice was this. find the DUMBEST GM's possible. Call them all the time. There's a lot of them. And, that would be the easiest way to improve your team. So he trades He Trades Four Kyle Larry in February. Two thousand nine cow. Larry was somebody we all elect. He was buried on that. MEMPHIS team. They had had Mike Conley. Conley was a top five. Pick a year later for them. And it was my Conley's team and Larry's just trying to fit in. And he gets Kyle. Larry he gives up. RAFER ALLSTON TO ORLANDO. MEMPHIS ENDS TRADING COLLAR IN MEMPHIS. It looks like they got a Donald Foil Wilkes in thousand nine number one pick to Memphis, and he gets caught Larry now I remember talking to our after I'm like you motherfucker you figure. You traded with Chris Wallace smart move. Where to go, but he steals cholera Rate it took awhile. Yeah, you know. We did the two thousand five drive we were talking about. How do Williams has basically two careers where he's like? Kinda like Jamal Crawford with less pr for the first nine years of his career, and then as the league changes, he becomes this weapon. This free throw a three point. Weapon and Larry is another good example of. You know. If you look at I, had him second in the redrafts record, but you look at him from just two thousand, fourteen, two thousand twenty, so it's basically year nine of his career on. He's eighteen seven five. Is Thirty eight percent from three and a good defensive player to It's defensible. Six All star teams made thirty mile and be a, but most important is a good example of somebody who wins the title and his whole career trajectory is just going to be looked at differently forever. They don't win that. Taito you don't take them with the first pick. No, although I been thinking because you went to Cardinal, dougherty high school in Philadelphia. Phillies stuff He wins the title, and it basically takes all the baggage away. Whatever bag of cholera it's. An incredible title. He was awesome. In that final game? Put his ball at that whole series. You put his balls on the table, but especially the last game. He really want my respect house. lamarcus Aldridge is landed in your lap at the number. Two pick one. Yeah, I'M GONNA. Take them. I mean. A steady contributor performs at a high level throughout his career. Nice number of All Star appearances couple all NBA teams. You know kind of a throwback player. He he might have been better in the like the first part of the nineties his face up ability you know, and the pace of play back then but look. He's still playing here. You know fourteen years on and making contributions. He still one of San Antonio's best three players. So you know I i. I feel pretty good about taking the Marcus at this spot. It's funny at the time. We were lukewarm on him in this draft. Because we'd there'd been this history of these six eleven, guys weren't quite centers. there were still some Charles Smith residue the next the next guy. Just, a really soft eighteen seven, but you couldn't count on him when it mattered, and we just had such a bad history with these guys I wasn't a huge fan I. I never was impressed by in Texas, but he's a good example like Russillo was talking about in two thousand in the two thousand five draft, some guys allow in good ways and bad ways right like we're talking about two thousand five thing about how Marvin Williams was really athletic. Lanky six foot nine freshman at UNC, but then he fell down, and he just had this really heavy lower body image. It kind of changed through. He was aldridge filled out in good ways like he really became Kind of a modern post guy you know is never like a game the block, but from ten to twelve feet was really good. One of my favorite games is to just go go through. College teams and just play a little bit of a what if what if this guide state ear and we did miss like a pretty incredible. Texas LONGHORNS team with lamarcus. Katie comes a year later. And, if if everything cut it breaks right, you might have a Texas LONGHORNS team I'll be at one coach by Rick. Barnes that has Katie J., Tucker Daniel Gibson, and lamarcus and yeah. So he's nineteen and a half and eight rebounds a game for his career. To second on Bay three third team on a, he's only one four playoff series ever only one in Portland. two thousand fourteen playoffs, which was a year before his free agency was really his breakout in I. Remember doing countdown that year us do segments about. Is the Marcus Aldridge one of the best players in the league now like that in the playoffs, he was twenty six and eleven. In this is to play series, they beat Houston. And then they lost to San. Antonio and six Santoni, winning the title that was when Dame was really coming onto dame. Finish the Houston series with the buzzer beater. And then a year later, he left to go to San Antonio and there was all kinds of stuff about he. He didn't like that Portland was becoming Dame's team. All that stuff. was like billboards right they they were replacing him with dame on the billboards, and apparently he really wanted to go the Lakers, and they fucked it up, and he ends up. He ends up in San Antonio. When he goes to San Antonio. We don't know that is going to become quiet and you think like. The had a couple decent teams, but that two thousand seventeen spurs team that was ready to go toe to toe with the warriors that that year was probably his best to I don't know if they would have beaten that worst him I. Don't think they would, but that would've been a slugfest. That series coagulates hurt the first game. We never know I'M GONNA. Give you the best forwards of two thousand of the two thousand tents. You. Tell me where lamarcus ranks. Lebron durant coli. Is that better than any of those three? Here here, the candidates for the fourth spot Blake Griffin Paul George Carmelo Anthony in Tha Anthony Davis Kevin Love lamarcus. Who Javan the fourth spot! Davis Yeah me, too. It's not it's a no brainer to me. It's Anthony Davis. Agree I would have blake in the fifth spot. I agree with Blake Blake in two thousand fifteen. Was the third best guy in the league. so now. It's Paul George Carmelo Kevin. Love Lamarcus for the sixth spot. I think I'd go George me, too. I'm with Chris Ryan. Paul George just because of the defensive offering that he represents. So now it's Kevin Love. WHO's really really peaks there for a couple of years and then moves into something else. Carmelo who peaks the first three four years of the decade entails off. And then Aldridge who's been pretty steady. The whole way I give the edge to aldridge out of those guys. So I would say he's. The seventh best forward of the decade. That's pretty good. It's not bad not bad for a draft. Pick all right. I'm on the clock with the third pick. My scouts really took this seriously. We We looked at a lot of rage on Rondo tape. Looked at JJ radic tape. Really, really did some background work on on Rudy Gay. Took Paul millsap out for a nice long dinner talked to him for while Really looked at Brandon Roy. Thought about him. And where we landed was rage on Rondo. Yes, here's the case. Two thousand nine to two thousand twelve playoffs sixty six games. The Celtics are a contender. Every one of those years they almost win in two thousand ten, and he's the best player in the team that you're. In those playoff game, six playoff game, sixteen, ten and seven. Forty six percent field goal two point steals. Outplayed Derrick rose in two thousand, nine derrick rose a rookie, but more importantly outplays Lebron in two thousand ten, and this is Lebron second of a back to back MVP. Lebron up to one in the series. In rondo takes it over. And wins the next three and he's the best player in that series. This is a bad thing for Lebron's goat campaign. By the way because you feel like all right. He's the goat well that one year when Reshad The fucking playoffs kind of hurts the case. Also Thirteen Mile Mba and I think it's important to remember. He got he hurt. He blew out his ACL rate as he was really at his peak, and I feel that cost them a year and a half was never quite the same, so at everything up, and the fact that he really national TV Rondo playoff Rondo somebody. You could really go to war with in a playoff series. And I think he's the third pick house. I would have gone millsap, but I understand the case. For Rondo. MILLSAP! His career was immensely helped by landing in Utah at an established. You know a team that makes the play offs every year with a culture and a support system you know institutional integrity is the way I like to call it, so you know millsap on a different team. Can he blossom that way? I don't know, but Rondo turns out we had this. We knew this about him from college. He's a motherfucker. Motherfucker and you know what that's valuable thing it turns out. He is the diametric opposite of Atom Morrison in terms of his competitiveness in his basketball now I don't WanNa. Say Basketball Iq, but like his psychological competitiveness, his ability to jump in, and you know just basically say f all y'all I'm gonNA. Do My thing, and now that translates into him, not being able to coexist in a lot of different. Circumstances, you know the the Dallas situation will be a go down as an all time abortion, but you know, raise it. John's the resume is strong and. You backed off the basketball IQ. Thing but I. There are few smarter players that I've seen on a basketball court like. If you get a chance to ever sit close to a court while Rondos playing, you could hear him calling out sets. You can hear him calling out. Opposition defensive cassettes. He will be playing D. and just be like. This is the play they're running. It's UNCANNY. It's too bad because. You know he has the ACL thing ends up with that weird Dow situation goes to Sacramento that sucked. It's a pitch. That was also awful. And then I kinda gets rejuvenated for that one really fun to Orleans year. With Davis where it Kinda unlocked again and I do think he's a great example of. Had to be on the right kind of team with the right kind of players at very high expectations for everybody else sees openly a deck if if he wasn't happy with where he was, and the other thing is, the League started to shift against them a little bit. and his inability to shoot, which he got a little bit better at you know starting in two thousand fifteen. He's at least like over thirty three percent as a three point shooter. All those are wide open, so he wasn't like a catastrophe. But you know is a guy that really would have made more sense in the eighties and nineties I feel like. You know and when the game was just played much closer to the basket in the stuff that he was doing. Just the league kind of changed on him. He was also the other thing that that happened. That was really too bad as he was just a bad free. Throw shooter. And never got better at it. I don't know whether it was because his hands are too big or what, but if you look at you know in two thousand nine and two thousand ten at least averaging three and a half free throws a game, not great, but at least he's trying to get alone that dips to the point that by the time he hits the second half of his career. He's basically not going the free. Throw line at all I mean he has in Dallas He. He shot zero point. Nine free throws a game he's he's doing everything. He can not to have contact and I think the book was out on him by the second half of his career that when he drove to the basket, he's dishing. Yeah, he's not going to try to bounce off guys. He's not gonNa try to finish because he wants to get fouled and I think to me. He's one of the top five guys I can remember. Nick Anderson's one. Antoine Walker is a good one. Guys who just didn't WANNA. Get fouled and it changed how they played house was the opposite. House love the concert of recontact. He loved. It was the easy way to pad the stats. He wasn't afraid especially at intramurals, afraid to lurch into guys like I wanted to go to the line. Rilo is the opposite so I I I actually I feel like this wasn't the best version of his career. I think there's a different version that's just better than what we ended up with, but it was still really good. Yeah, he's obviously coach Guy. He's obviously a guy really mattered who who wound up being the coach, and it wasn't necessarily always. The better coach Carlisle's obviously one of the best coaches we've had an NBA longtime, and those guys couldn't be near each other so you. The sort of environmental stuff with Rondo. It's like crapshoot I. have no idea who he would have thrived under well. The the observation I wanna make is there could still be another. Maybe it's not a full length chapter, but half chapter for Rondo. In these playoffs coming up that we're going to have in the twenty twenty season right. He's healthy now and that Lakers situation is absolutely perfect for him to flourish and for him to make an impact and Chris. You've said a couple of times. It's prime time Rondo. Like he's going to, he might be play a meaningful role in how the the Lakers end up in this twenty twenty playoffs, well, he. Better Than Lebron, so that's good. I've been saying for years that national TV Quarantine Rondo was the most dangerous player in the NBA. Yeah, so it'd be interesting to see how that plays out the if Rondo had gone third in this draft that Charlotte taken. Which means Michael Jordan region Rondo would abandon each other's lives. So you could tell me. That they actually would have fought to the death over a four game, or you could tell me that it would have been the greatest thing that ever happened to both of the. Where Jordan site, this is my soul, this guy hates his teammates as much as I did. Super Competitive. and. Rondo just would have been like a nineteen time. All Star in Charlotte and we would think of Jordan as this great owner, maybe like Charlotte could be like an Italian soccer team. We're just getting. The coach fired every three months right like scarlet nineteenth coach of the year. This guy used to work in an Arby's. Coaches hey you, but Rondo seems like. Oh. Those, oppressed by a connect four tournament online. I Chris you have the fourth pick in the draft. This was the pick that was technically Portland. And then they traded up. Do you have yeah? I'M GONNA. Go MILLSAP here. Even though I'm bored, even saying the two words Paul Millsap. It's funny I had him six in my redraft, but I think it was out of pure boredom, solid guy, seventeen and eight from two thousand eleven and two thousand, seventeen, four, all star teams I think that was partially had to do with the forwards just loaded in the West and pretty pretty weak in the east for the most part for forty seventh pack. Really couldn't have turned out better and I can't think of anything else to say yeah I mean. Cool kind of bridge player, like as a member of that a bud hawks team, and the move into pace and space, and move into into this sort of drunk on threes, NBA but I feel bad that I just can't muster a lot of life poetry about Paul Millsap. House. You're on the clock at five. I'M GONNA. Take Brandon Roy here I think that five years of Brandon Roy. Is the functional equivalent of the longer careers of of some of the guys that came after him I mean the this this five spot. The eligible candidates are like Jj, which is you know totally legit? who who rudy gay. PJ Tucker Guess I'll just take Brandon Roy right here. He made he won rookie of the year, and he missed twenty five games that year. He was an all star by his second season. He made to all NBA teams in his five years. So you're basically you know evaluating with all of the information we have now. What can I get in this five year window that I have a of Brandon Roy. Is it. Is it enough with other pieces that I have around me, and at that stage? This was Atlanta. Pick right. Am I right the fifth pick? Overall was Atlanta. So. They had Josh Smith and Joe Johnson, at that point like what a dynamic scoring team in the east at that moment I, just you know, go ahead and take a swing as is my view with this draft pod listeners can tell this Joe. House just settle of that with a picture of John Wall behind him. So you know he knows what he's talking about what he's discussing a leg injuries. A brain arrests first four years twenty, five and five forty seven percent field goal thirty five percent from three eighty percent for free throw. for He, baited on a second team. which is really impressive, that means I am one of the best players in the League during an era where there were some really good guards you now, so you? You've Kobe in the League at that point of Chris Paul Dare. Williams Tracy. McGrady etc, etc, He Made A. he made a third team Mamba mid three all star teams. and. Know this is. This is A. Little out there, but in the Oh nine playoffs. He plays a six game series against. Houston and they lose. He averages twenty seven game in that series. If you're averaging twenty seven game in a playoff series, your legit and You Know I. The Portland's just taken so many heads over the years you think about like. Greg Oden Sambu. They walked into Bill Walton. Brandon Roy the the talented guys that just it's almost like the Bermuda Triangle and a lot of ways. What was a real bummer about this was what a great guy he was. and. You know I I hate sometimes when the talking heads talk about great guys, character, guys, or whatever, but this was like a model citizen, awesome guy who kept having bad luck in his basketball career, but really handled it with real dignity, and when he had that moment in the playoffs. What was it two thousand eleven when he's hurt? Yeah, when What series was that? WAS IT DENVER? Yeah I think it was Denver because I remember it being kind of like a a an Intra Division playoff series, and he has was I'm sorry was Dallas the two thousand. Eleven Dallas series. And it's a really weirdly pivotal moment with dousing because dowse goes to win on that win the title that year. But their favorite in this Portland Series Brandon Roy Zahn really his last legs at that point. And Portland. Wins two in a row at home to tie to tie the series. And in one of those Games, Bryan Roy has twenty four. And and the crowd is just. Out of their mind. Out of their mind because he has this throwback awesome out tools, Dirk Nowitzki. OUTTA that game four. It's two and everybody's like fucking Dirk. What a choker! Typical! FUCKING DALLAS FUCK! This team skies cowards. And then they win the next two, and then they go on to win the title and it was really like the last time got sucker punch like that by somebody, but that's one of my favorite random games from this decade that. Brandon Roy throwback awesome gained. The crowd loved him. So anyway I was for it I. Just WanNa make one observation I I wanted to make sure I give credit where it was do. You gotTA HOOK UP PORTLAND. Forgetting arguably the two best players in in this draft, and they were a fifty loss team coming into this draft in two years later. We're a fifty four win team, and I think it's some combination Kevin Pritchard was heavily involved and Steve Soto Tom Ten to took over from John Nash. But you know that in a draft that we started off this podcast talking about how weird it was in the first place how? talentless. It was and how all over the map that talent was for Portland to go. Get the two best players. Shout, shout out to the trailblazers. Yeah, well, it S. we covered in the draft. They completely shit the bed. No five 'cause they had the third pick with Chris Paul and Darren Williams on the board and traded down three spots for Martell Webster Lioness cleese. And Future Number One. That became Joel Freeland. So that was like this is like a jekyll and Hyde thing with the new administration Although I know house was high on Joel. FREE LINT The. Joel Freeland was high also. The six pick on the clock I'm. GonNa take our guide Jj. So. First of all average thirteen, a game for his career. a forty one percent career three point shooter. And somebody who? As the League evolved over the course of the decade. It evolved in all great ways for him. and. He adds up. Is a forty one point six career three point shooter. Is Somebody that if it's a good team, he's a huge asset. And for basketball fans really frustrating. First few years Orlando for him. where it just didn't feel like he was playing enough, and it didn't really make a lot of sense, and we cover this in a previous book basketball pilot that two thousand nine finals, just so weird that they didn't space the floor him. More doc rivers was the first one that really got it. WHO's like if we get this guy? I'm basically getting what had with Rayon in Boston. This guy who just constantly running around screens. Screens who is creating space for Blake? Griffin and he just figured out Jay's ban and asset ever since, but I think one great thing with him as just the the longevity of just he still going I, mean yeah, he probably play for another six seven years, so you get jj house to four and a half years of Brandon Roy I totally get it I'm getting like twenty one years of Jj Redick plus an incredible podcast or Get all his multimedia. I'm when I draft JJ I'm smart enough to also get all his media stuff, so it's a win all the way around I. Think you're right. We haven't even gotten to the late period. Kyle Korver of JJ career yet like Jj. Weaving his way through four screens perset like we haven't gotten to the like all trail, and just just drilled US Open three after somebody gets penetration, you know. That he's going to be. Rear Eleven minutes a game and just score nine points. That might push you over the top. It's an awesome point. He's still fast. That's that's I. Think the point. You're making Chris and and in view of He's also an avowed foodie. Loves loves to eat and other very relatable thing about him likes to eat it. All the best places has had many great food. People on his podcast. I admire that engine that running engine. That has to feed with good fuel. Great job JJ. I'll tell you this. He's a top three NBA, player going nuts during the quarantine because he's been knocked out of his routine. Says he's just somebody who's whole was structured and goes to the gym. And not being able to just do do normal stuff, though those shooters are different breed. where it's just like at three thirty. I will shoot seven hundred ninety three's. In these seven spot, and then I'll be done at five. I'll see you then like you. Just Kinda have to beware that way wow Chris. Bench to see what you do here at the seventh pick you think I'M GONNA get funky is one obvious pick. There's a couple sleepers. Who Do you have Josh Boone No? No I'M GONNA go. Rudy Rudy is an interesting person to pair with JJ both coming out of relatively streaming. Jj obviously had a more storied college. Gerbert Rudy was great Yukon. And he comes into the League and I feel like immediately pretty soon after he gets into league becomes a poster child for an outmoded silent basketball and kind of never really finds the place that really took advantage of his skills i. don't think he was ever. GonNa have that McGrady gear, but it was clearly a scorer built in that mold, and maybe just wasn't good enough to deserve all those touches and had a game that was really eighteen feet in at a time when the game kept moving out an out and out. For, oh, eight, two, thousand, seventeen, I basically ten years of his career. Thorne at his rookie, nineteen and six. Thirty four percent from three. No all stars, no all NBA teams. And I think you made the key point. He's involved in trades. That really frame the last fifteen years of the league. The first one is the actual draft day trade were. Darrell trades the reds to Rudy Gay for Shame Bat. A trade that nobody type of trade nobody ever made. There's really only a couple examples like in the late seventies. Philly trated George McGinnis for Bobby Jones. And the real NBA. People knew how good Bobby Jones was. WHO's an incredible defensive forward Aba legend all that stuff, but George. McGinnis was like a quote unquote superstar only he wasn't. When you're at really picked it apart, and you look at is like a ball stopper can guard anybody. Kind of redundant with Dr J.. And they trade for Bobby Jones, in it's awesome trade. Rudy Gay on paper made a ton of sense with McGrady and yeah right. It's like great. Here's our third score. In Darryl is looking at differently. We Shame Baddie a great corner. Three guy. awesome defender won't need the ball I don't need to get him touches and just looked at a different way, so that was the first trade. The second one happened when I was on a countdown in two thousand thirteen. MEMPHIS JUST HIM TO TORONTO. And basically got back. The Jose Calderon tatum Prince Contracts Ed Davis. And created some cap space. And we went on the show. And it was the big argument we had. The regular season wasn't like angry, but it was. We had magic and Wilbon on one side me on the other Jalen kind of in the middle are arguing about this trade, and they were killing Memphis for thrown away this season 'cause Memphis was a playoff team. Yeah, and potential contender, and it was like what are they doing? Why would they do this? And at that point, we had enough advanced metrics stuff like at grant land. We were really ahead. I feel like we were really ahead of the game. Those first couple of years with the way we were covering basketball. We had Zach Lowe I. Don't remember if we Goldsboro at this point. And, there was a ladder early date about Rudy Gay. Like this guy actually doesn't really help your team. It's it's actually empty. Calories They might actually be better off redistributing. The shots that he was getting other people and we argued about this on the show like really really really vociferously. And I gotta say I ended up winning because Memphis made the conference finals that year partly, this was a classic ewing. Theory Trade House. You're in all along. You never liked rudy gay dating both uconn the thing that made that trade work for Memphis with Tae Sean. Basketball I Q through the roof. I mean talk about a guy. I've been in the same places him before walked up next to him if he's ever weighed more than one hundred and seventy five pounds in his life I don't know when it when it was but that guy is so smart and such a good chemistry guy and he was a perfect complement to that Memphis. Team in Memphis, got you know better? By subtraction by getting Raya boss, I mean gay. Sorry, a ball stopper out of the mix right bottle stopper. They got more minutes for Tony. Allen Tate Sean comes in as kind of the Glue Guy Little. Batty a ask to really smart trade. And it's funny. Because all the smart basketball people got it and all the old school basketball people. You can't give up ready. Gay Man. He's got ended the game. That's who you go to guy is, and it's like actually none of the stats back that up. We had crunch time stats at that point and he was terrible. Yeah! We like it was the transition from having arguments about guys with Albatross contracts to having arguments about guys with empty numbers. That was really hard to get over. Where you're like looking in nineteen points gaming, the NBA's hard like that is not an easy thing to do especially even to average it for multiple years like that, but at the end of the day. If you think Rudy Gay is one of your best players. Your team has a hard ceiling. Well it was also an old school. way of thinking about things right because I remember magic. Magic. I thought we got a really good year out of him and a lot of ways, but he was still had that old school thinking. Sometimes of like you get a guy like rudy gay. You can go to him in the last two minutes and I remember being on TV being like how hard do I fight with him on this? Because all the data says this isn't true. It's actually not a guy you want to go to. In the last two minutes of a game he doesn't. He doesn't deliver but I think you look at the stuff that's happening during this beginning part of the two thousand tents. And the data is starting to get really good and the teams that had the data. And real access to it started to make smart decisions, and this leads to the heart and trade. This is darryl going all in and harden as a superstar because he's looking at these numbers be like well. What would happen if he played thirty eight minutes instead of twenty eight and what would happen if he started on the line more what happens what happens if if I build the right team around him so new Rudy Gay. Just weirdly involved in these two pivotal NBA. Moments that I think kind of personify when it street or that he winds up on the team that we've historically thought of as one of the more progressive teams in the League is. He's now on him. lamarcus are now on the spurs kind of as these dinosaurs of an of a bygone era. So he's. He's second in this draft. In Point scored scored almost sixteen thousand points in his career seventeen game guy. He bounces around a little bit. HE GOES TORONTO THAN SACRAMENTO GOES and get some. He averaged twenty game in Sacramento for the first two years. He was there then then when saying Antonio got him. That's what everybody's like all right. What's going on here in San? Antonio is just trying to zig whenever annouce zagging and I think that's how partly we'll have. They got in trouble. 'cause, it's like. Don't really maybe don't Ziga. Yeah maybe zag is where we should be with with putting together a roster, so they trouble house here on the clock with eight. I am going to complete the TRIFECTA here of taking guys that are still playing and confessing up a little bit of recency bias I want PJ Tucker here and it is another guy who? Like Christmas Pick Kyle lowry gotta be patient. Because PJ Tucker was out of the league with within a year of of being drafted and it took them six years he visited places like Israel and the Ukraine and Greece and Italy and Germany, so he had you know very well traveled a terrific travel resume. He was signed by the sons in two thousand twelve the. D. Deanne Tony, small. Ball era and he's made a whole career out of that, and it's a damn good career for a guy. That's six, five hundred and forty five pounds that Houston plays at centre. I mean I I love the two thousand twelve to two thousand twenty, PJ Tucker and I think in view of all the guys that are around him in this draft. I've I liked this spot for him. I remember when he started a thrive in Phoenix. Which I- Dantonio was gone at that point, because he went to the Knicks, but they were still kind of in that mode of. You know the little little small balls mobile to watch like. and. He was one of those guys who is really good. Kinda secretly if he had league pass, but it wasn't wasn't ever discussed, but he would always jump out when you watch the like man. The PJ Tucker's bad ass like that guy. Yeah, love to see him on a good team. He became one of those guys because he spends basically for four years in Phoenix, not really going on. But then when he goes to Toronto. when they traded firm at the deadline and Toronto is a real contender. At that point, it was like Oh. This is that's a that's a good one. That's a mix. Say to see him on a good team. And then it finally happens with Houston. It's funny, though there's really not a basketball reference page like this because he's thirty five now. But to have one rookie year, and then five straight plays because your Europe. and has how said Israel. Ukraine backed Israel Greece Italy Germany. I it's it's uncertain unprecedented for Basketball Reference Page and the league moves in his way. He moves his way in a bunch of different ways, but again it's almost the theme of this podcast League moves in Darryl's way because there's another guy to pass through Maury Bowl Ball University here. Amazing I to be one year and out as rookie. Oh! He had some G. League stuff to house seven ladder G. League. Do you remember the trade the Toronto Trade. February deadline. Will Phoenix gotTA GOTTA motherlode. I didn't realize Jared Salon Jer. A, two, thousand, seventeen, Gerrad, or two thousand eighteen second rounder. Yanks. All right I'm on the clock at nine. Fuck everybody taken Andrea Bargain. Yeah. He's not a bus. Oh Andrea. Is A bus. Thing is bullshit. It's not accurate. News accurate. No, it's not. It's not accurate. I'M GONNA make the case. Go ahead. First of all I played ten years. He averaged twenty. One a game on your. In Two thousand eleven his fifth year in the League Twenty one point four game. From Two thousand nine. To Two thousand twelve! He's basically nineteen again. Decent three point shooter every once in a while. I thought he was feisty yet. There was a little Italian feisty edge to him. And I'm not really sure what happened because I remember when the Knicks when the Knicks Traded Forum I, remember Kinda liked the trade. Being like that that's cool. That's somebody you know. You could spread the floor for Carmelo stuff like this. And now I think because he failed with the next. There's been this revisionist history that he wasn't a good pro. The reality was he wasn't a bad pro. Even on the next for two years he's averaging thirteen and fourteen a game. He's playing twenty seven twenty nine minutes a game. He wasn't a bust as my point, and if I can get them at the ten pack. or Ninth Peck I'm happy. SHITTY DRAFT YEAH! I think that the the funny part is. Is that like it's Hilarious to hear you say that, and then when you look beneath him, it's kind of like. Oh, like who else are you really going to pick? Right the only thing I'll say nice about. Is. In Two thousand twelve. Mall in Orlando for the All Star game and Andrea. was there not to play? But I will say this. He stayed in the same hotel complex as US and his girlfriend. Absolutely on believable, it was I try and be a decent person and not be a stair with the mouth open person I just. It was a it was a long stare. I didn't care. I needed to consume all of it. Well he had. He had a little sutton something there for a couple years like he was Italian. have go you. Better that if Andrea was a corleones son, who would he be? We'll sonny. Wilfredo sunny mix little sunny, the little No, he needed sunny if he had sunny might have been these the player. You might have been better than know tenth in this crappy draft. He, he also didn't live through his time in New York. I'm looking. I was just looking at my trade valueless to make sure I put him on a trade value. Thing I don't think I did. He was bad I think if you average twenty one points a game as a pro. You weren't a bust. I'm sorry, so it sort of my rules Chris! You're on the clock with ten and we just had a drop off. Yes, it's it's pretty. I mean part of me wants to be funny here. But there's actually no punch lines like there's nothing funny about say I'll take. I'll take movie or I'll take Steve Novak here. I'M GONNA go with Babo probably a little unfairly regarded now at this point as One of the reasons why the thunder probably? We're not ultimately able to get over the hump, although there are other reasons, but like his inability. For reliably knocked out a jumper is is one of them. A great defensive player and and I think ultimately like those years in Oklahoma. He's a real. He's like an Alpha defense the defender. House the drafters dropped off your at the eleventh pack I have nothing to add to the. Conversation, but nobody disagrees with it, Vegas. You could go Ronnie brewer there. How's Your We're launching a new ringer podcast next month called the best fifty. Swiss NBA players of all time. And I don't WanNa step on that, so we'll save it for that house. You're up at eleven I'll take jj BEREA. That's who I had there you still in the league. Another guy. I mean this, is it? I'm just taking the guys you know at at this point when your. Choices are Watson and Ronnie Brewer, and who who else I mean you know? I wouldn't have taken by NONI Steve Novak I. Guess I mean you know Berea. Played meaningful minutes has been a terrific role player for Dallas, and actually was a nice contribution for his little bit of time in Minnesota as well. It's clear that he hasn't team leader. Kind of capacity, and that he's well liked that that coaches trust him at this stage with this group. That's enough for me. I thought he should have gone higher. Brea spot are yeah well. Here's the thing. In two, thousand eleven. He Plays Twenty One playoff games for a team that wins the title. Eighteen point six minutes a game. Nine points a game and famously. fucked with Lebron's head when Dallas had him guarding Lebron and it was the all-time Jedi. Mind Trick, fuck you, you're not. You're not mad. Enough to posts. Guy Up. We dare you and it broke lebrons brain for four finals games another another goat advertisement. A really like undermine the Lebron case but. You know he was. He! He didn't hurt them. In those finals than anything had a couple of good moments, but he had a galvanizing effect on his teammates that I think we can't sleep bunny there. Where when he succeeded, it got the whole team fired up. Yeah, he's this Little Green Guy Yup and if he made a big play in crunch time like the whole bench like went bonkers, but I know he's a beloved teammate to and I. I think he's one of those. Is He still in the League? Obviously, he's on Dallas. He's one of those guys that will stay Oleg. Where he'll stay in the league three years after it's over just 'cause. He's so good to have on your team. So. For the eleven th pick I think that's strong well. I'm up with the twelfth pick here. It's pretty grim. I'M GONNA. Go the Randy Four. And here's my case at his peak. was like a fairly interesting. Coming off the bench Guy Remember on the two thousand twelve quips. He was a third guard for them eleven game. Five threes game. Thirty nine percent of three point shooter was a pretty good three point shooter in his at his peak. And most important careers thirty six point six three point. Most important houses dumb ASS team training, the number, five, two, thousand Jaffer Him and Mike Miller so he actually did have value. Head, didn't he? Was He was? He was terrible in Washington and I. Don't know if it was because he didn't want to be here. or whatever the situation was but you know he he is, you know, look up. journeymen now he play. What is play seven hundred game seven hundred and fifty regular season games. But I-. I- unfairly hold against him. What the franchise, the position the. Put Him in by basically trading away the opportunity to have steph curry, and I'll never forgive the taste for that Rubio Steph curry one of those gusts. Yes. So. This brings me to one. I had been saving my dad for the right moment. My. Dad was so upset this draft when they this is from my draft diary when they traded the seventh pick for a package highlighted by Sebastian telephone their. My. Dad's quote was. He's a five foot. Eleven Point Guard. You know what is going to be with more playing time. A five foot eleven point guard. I saw him in that documentary. By the way, not only would I not want him on my team. I wouldn't want him in my house. Fair Fair Character Assessment Casino was multiple gun things after that, so that happened. My Dad loved Randy foy. When ready for it goes to the Celtics spot my dad goes. This sucks I. Really Liked Randy for that everyone else city at the draft the sucks. My whole night's ruined. A might take tomorrow from work. I'm really bummed out. I can't believe this. For my dad, and then on Rondo, he said after they got Rondo to new point guards. One of them's five eleven, and the other one can't shoot and I'm supposed to be happy about this. He was enraged. It turns out he wants. Yeah so. The Randy Ford. People did like and Dickie when he came on, and it was like this guy can be Dwayne Wade. It was ludicrous, but it. It was said by somebody who had a basketball. Analyst Job Yeah. So anyway. Of happy together with a with by pick all right, Chris you're on the clock. We've three picks left. This is going to be really brutal. Do we really have to do? Yeah, we gotta get to fifty and. I you know I'm GonNa. Go Novak That was GONNA be mine. Yeah. I like the belt that that's about all. I mean like Ronnie. Brewer never had anything cool as the belt so I'm gonNA. Go with Steve Novak? Really could wing man during sanity. Great and couple of the celebrations was really right there Bombini Brown style. He was getting his sanity on. Another one of those guys that. Probably born ten years to too soon. Right? Yeah! 'cause you. Forty five percent. Forty three percent from three for his career is is quite good. It's weird that the spurs never took him. Say He seems like he's the of guy. Who has to rings? If he plays for the Spurs other did Kim I'm sorry by policies they did give them a test drive in two thousand eleven. Did they yeah so his to nick? Seasons cheeses the. There's a Casey might have gone too late here. his to Nick Seasons nineteen a game. That I'm sorry, nineteen point seven minutes a game. And he shoots forty four point five percent from three four point seven threes a game for two solid years. And was kind of dangerous yeah. It was a garden favorite. Good Value Chris thanks. House, your last pick number fourteen. I am taking this player just because I wanna make this immensely juvenile and stupid and obvious. And I like booby. That's it I'm just taking. Daniel Gibson here. Three hundred ninety seven career Games sixteen win shares you know played important moments with the cavaliers and is the name is booby, and that's all I have to say about him. Yes, so. In the seven playoffs. He plays twenty minutes a game for our final steam. And shoots forty percent from three only playoffs twenty five point eight minutes a game for that team. And shot forty five percent from three and basically. Spread the floor couldn't do anything else. That's it great value house. For my last pick. I thought about Cy Year Sin-. Maybe a couple of years working on the lab on the right foot. I don't know. I guess Thomas. You're back in love your guy. Let me, look at WHO's. Share war with bill don't, think twice. There's some. Potential. Oh I know I'm taking I'm not taking tight. Thomas fucked that guy I'm taking Leon Poe. Okay sure Leeann pro with the Celtics in the two thousand eight playoffs. Twelve minutes a game. Played every game. And has an iconic finals game I think it was game to. There's one either game game. Two is the Leeann Poe game I think. When he just kinda comes in and lays the smackdown on the Lakers in. Does this thing. The guy had like no ACL's. And the disdain. You aren't as excited about this well I'm looking at this and I I'm trying to see if it's wrong. I believe he has the highest win share per forty eight minutes of anybody in. I think I'm looking at this correctly there's. Game Too. He put his fourteen and a half minutes twenty one points thirteen free throw attempts game. Tokyo Lakers, singlehandedly swings the Games. announced the new ringer podcast feed. Oppose. Leeann POS games this. Year, three of the Corinthian, the. Pos. Play so as fifty greatest Swiss players ever. Both of those ideas could happen. Yeah. I think we covered everything. What a bizarre draft, so we went! In in order. Larry Aldridge Rondo millsaps Roy rettig Gay Tucker bugged on a Berea. Upside Ninety Cephalonia, Berea. Foy Novak Liam Poe if you just do those top six where they were actually picked two twenty, one, forty, seven six eleven eight, thirty five. This is a weird one variants. HOW SOMEHOW THE WIZARDS! We didn't make fun of them. In this draft for we go is there are some sort of wizards mistake? We could've growl. They took the the mistake was at the eighteenth spot, Rondo and lowery and Paul millsap. There's a bunch of PJ Tucker. There's a bunch of guys still out there. That could have immediately contributed. They drafted a guy I think he's Ukrainian. Alexi Pesher off. WHO's best attribute the number one thing that he contributed to the franchise is being a dead ringer for St Louis From Family Guy, that. He looks you. Every picture of this guy is a dead ringer first Louis, and I think that's really all I can say about him. He was seven feet tall. He lasted three years. And never played more than ten minutes a game. The Wizards didn't have a great track record with international drafting. Save is beyond. Vassily. That's exactly right. Saleh's. I really enjoyed myself. Thanks for redrafted in two thousand six NBA draft I just WanNa. Ask to be on a good draft sometime with you. Wouldn't be a good one. To consider. You're never going to be on a good draft. That was the two thousand six redraft the basketball two point Oh podcast stay tuned for two thousand and seven with me and Ryan Russillo on this feed later in the week until that.

NBA Brandon Roy Adam Morrison basketball Rondo Portland Randy Foreign Marcus Williams League Jj Portland. GM Chris Lebron durant Marcus Aldridge Celtics Paul millsap Charlotte Chris Ryan Minnesota Bill Walton
Beach Steppin' | We're All On Our Telephoneses

The Free Agents

1:12:49 hr | 2 months ago

Beach Steppin' | We're All On Our Telephoneses

"The SONOS move is the best portable speaker I have ever owned. And I am not just being she'll here. It's too good to be called a portable speaker it up and spits out its competition. It is high quality. I use the move as both a stationary speaker and all around my house garage and my outdoor space and I've dropped a crap out of it. Regular portable speakers can't take his life to move not sure I should be saying this but I dropped it down the stairs. Maybe I should be saying this I'd be happy to get a second. Actually. I. Don't need a second even sonos states don't worry about accidental drops or bumps moves components are protected by a hard wearing shock resistant case and my system with one I take around my place is working very well I use my move as a stationary speaker a lot. It hangs out on the charging base. I love that don't have to plug in charging. It has an eleven hour battery life. No joke. It works with all streaming services, the Sonos at or airplay Bluetooth, Amazon Alexa and Google Assistant. I'm too lazy to be looking for new music. So I have really loved the SONOS radio option. Some of my favorite stations are rare grooves, hip hop archive or just keeping it mainstream. If you're in the move, go to Sonos dot. Com to learn more and get your Sonos move today. Stepping on the beach the only place to read your emails and tweets. It's still Wednesday. September. Ninth. I'm still ged skeets an alongside me. He's still here's smells hey everybody. Hey, we got the bearded one Trey Kerby. ooh got the International Mana mystery taking to the Max Leila's friend. last but not least making the magic happen. Here's jaideep hello. There is, and here we are once again on a Wednesday, thanks so much to everyone who sent in questions over the past week or so keep them coming guys, email us no dumps at the athletic dot com or tweet him in at no dumped inc or use the HASHTAG. If you want no dunks, another great crop tasks of questions this week keep sending them through that Poe service our post service will always be working. I one hello non-existence lamps first time emailer here. To Brag I e mail getting it right. into the chat here last season. Bamut. A bio was one of the players I subconsciously became a fan of as a person who tends to root for energetic versatile bench players him getting both an all star nod and being the M. IP runner up this year brought me a lot of satisfaction I compare to the joy. You feel when your favorite obscure Indie band finally gets a big break. Here's my question which current bench player could you see benefiting the most from expanded rule next season factually entertainment and for all your hard work since the restart turnips Lou, Pearl made Some sort of medication there for something, we won't discuss your I looked it up wholesome Lorenzo from the Philippines trae your thoughts bench player. Man Lorenzo. Look this first time emailer first question read that's undefeated. Just like the Phoenix Suns he has remember the Phoenix Suns when they were undefeated in the bubble what a story that was it feels like five million years ago that that happened when that was happening, there are playing rookie by the name of Cam Johnson. I thought he was really impressive. The numbers aren't crazy right? He was like at about thirteen points a game thirty, three percent shooting from three, but the team looked so much better. I thought with him out there as a spacey option is a bit of a stretch for and you know coming into to next season. It's always hard to say what you're going to get from the Phoenix Suns. We've seen them put together nice stretches before, but it definitely felt different in the bubble maybe that's 'cause it was the bubble but whatever it was the Cam Johnson effect felt real to me and I would like to get a little bit more time. Next season I think he's a perfect. Modern player to play. Devon Booker alongside De'andre eight and just giving more space out there. So they can put a little pressure on the rim. Renounce are just Cam Johnson seemed like they were the perfect wings for Devon Booker to play with they're going to be greedy. They're gonNA shoot that three. It did seem I know it seems suddenly seemed like a perfect world for the Phoenix Suns, because it was. Eight and frigging hope. It's unbelievable when you think about it we got. Another. Guy I think it's a pretty natural adjustment I. IT looks like Chris Paul is out of okay. See I think Dennis sure to just come into that starting lineup and and beat these the starting point guard on that thing. So off yeah. I've seen that happen before yeah. Yeah. We have and didn't work all that well, but it just seems to me. That's the natural progression. I don't think I don't think sure would appreciate it if someone else came in and took his job, us. Ok going behind Chris Paul because he learnt a lot and Chris Bowls a legend but I think Dennis sure it would now like that opportunity like a second chance at being the starting point guard on to see if he can become. More successful at it than he was there in Atlanta, but of course. This is going to be some changes there. They're going to be a new coach. You figured it probably going to be some personnel changes. Well, maybe maybe sure there's not that I know but I, think if he is there, he comes into that starting lineup because he was at times thunders best playoff to down in the dam and the bubble he was. But if the thunder leaning very heavily into the rebuild, how much do You worry of Schreuder sort of stepping on the toes of an S J if he is your point guard for the future could be a little bit of a problem. I know of course they play together. They've worked together but that's what Chris Paul I wonder if that changes when it's just the two of them yeah. Yeah. Well, it's possible but I think. I just think if Chris Balls go when and and he doesn't even coming to that starting lineup, he'll be a little bit unhappy. I think sure I think he's earned that as well. These earned the right get in there and I think I think that can play together. I think. I think that's GonNa be the challenge for her the new coaches but. You know you'll just Alexander is certainly the the fight of the future but next as I think, it'd be okay to have those together and just to see the see wishart or is was this season a bit of an can't say that word anomaly. Right or has matured as he matured and he's like right I. I'm a better player. I wasn't Atlanta I'm going to go with I. Guess Sort of a guy in a way similar to Cam. Johnson. I'm going with a rookie who has this year he started some games but not a lot. But I think he'll be starting very very soon in this league consistently because of what he brings defensively Matisse stable. For me is he's going to be especially are these going to be making a lot of these all defensive teams, of course, not making it yet as a rook, but it's not going to take to to long like Mikhail bridges with the sons for him to be perennial name I think are at least in the mix for a lot of these all defensive teams. And he's just a perfect sort of complimentary player if you've got enough. Talanoa there to be your fourth or fifth guy and as he works on his game and he gets better because he should in a second year hell he might be most improved candidate in your well that'd be wild mentioned rookie getting better in his second year after playing with NBA players for your. I'm kidding I'm kidding but yeah, will start very very soon and I think he is going to be able to contribute to whatever team he's on. So that's an obvious pick for me on if you have one test. Do. It's basically the opposite. These liable a guy who can't get on the floor because his defense is so bad but as offense is so great Michael Porter. Jr. Seems like an obvious one for the Denver Nuggets to be jumping into the starting lineup a but he had his little time in the in the sun. He came down the bubble they had him in the. Starting lineup, but they had to yank him because of the defensive issues that being said as a selfish basketball fan I. WANNA. See all that offensive talent as much as possible making highlights for us in October through April, how many guys can get an empty Jim jumping not too many and Michael Porter. Jr. Did that is dad even had to? You know make those Emoji is. While wearing a mask was pretty cool in the bubble there It's Nice to bring your dad to as your family member. Now that I think about it, it's pretty cool. And the difference of things definitely gotta go into the summer and just literally work on Defense I. Don't know of any player in the history of NBA has just worked on defense throughout the summer but. I think that makes sense for Michael Porter Jr.. There's a question if Paul millsap comes back with the Denver Nuggets. A free agent will Barton's future with the team. So I think there might be an opening in that starting lineup and I know Michael. Malone is. Having to put him to the bench because it's a he is getting smoked on a defensive. He ended up having problems guarding the pick and roll. But hopefully, he can be different player come his second season when he could win most improved player. Jeremy Grant he's also free agent I believe don't quote me on that I don't quote me on that I'm not one hundred zero. But you're gonNA live with Michael Porter Jr. being bad at defense even during the regular season I. Think it's Kinda strange for like we're seeing in even the seating games right? He wasn't a great defender then but malone was happy to give him a run to see what he could do out there, and during the regular season, you're happy with mistakes a little bit more if he's going to be able to give you twenty five a few different nights here and there may be averaged sixteen or seventeen for the season. The offensive talent is there and he does contribute on the glass too I. Like that you. Know, he might not be a great one on one defender. They're pulling them into switches all the time but at least he uses that height that he has to hit the glass end sometimes on the offensive boards as well. He can be a plus defender but even if he's not, he's going to have a big role for the nuggets next year they gotta hope he's going to be at least near all star level at some point in the near future because funny you said that I was going to ask how many like what would you set the over underline on Michael Porter Juniors All Star appearances and it's A tough one. Because I mean, honestly you could convince me he'll never make an all star game and you could legitimates me now he might make eight all star teams for all we know so I don't know. If it's like three and a half a two and a half where you set the line feels fair one and a half feels fair. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So Nice. Yeah. I mean, is he? Yokich is the All Star for the nuggets. No doubt about it. I extend line. You're probably thinking. Jamal Murray. They've gotta get sixty five wins. They get to the three all-star. They've got the home court advantage. They'll grow together a little bit but. A lot of great players in the West that's the tough part. Yeah go ahead I'm just thinking is a well, he's I think he's my. Wand in the and he was an offensive play at second or third option for a lot of teams. So yeah. He's base should be better than wally but. While he was a pretty pretty consistent flag shooter there for a long time but on the wolves just didn't really. Cagey and that was about it really wasn't it I mean who else from Minnesota? Sam Cassell nil. He'd never made one. Trusted. Wow Wow Michael Porter Jr. is the new wally. Wally Banger. DRP dropped the skeets bomb. It's happening the dog the dog must have got to his his modem already. Comcast all right. Read this next one then or go schedule Catcher up. Hainault donkeys after a few weeks of good quality playoff basketball still think the eventual champions will have an asterisk looming over their heads. It sure felt like that. There would have been one when the idea of the bubble was being tossed around. But now I'm not so sure no dunks for life that's from. Kirk. I'm with Kirk definitely felt like there is going to be a huge looming over this season. Months ago and even as they came into the bubble in July but it feels different. I will say there's going to be an astronaut because the astros because of how different it is just a conditions there's no fans there's no homecourt advantage no-fly, but I think it's different. Than the other Astros because the basketball has just been so good and ninety, nine and twenty twelve the basketball wasn't as good because of the timing of the hiatus that happened it was before the season in ninety nine guys just didn't come in shape back. Then it was a different time and so the basketball wasn't what we see right now and in two thousand, twelve guys were definitely more in shape but the fact again that it was before the season. It changed the dynamic of the back to backs There's no practices in general the the guys just didn't have a lot of time to get better together. But now because the hiatus was midseason, the players were an absolute great shape when they came down to Orlando and so there isn't going to be this idea that Oh man they they came down there and they played sloppy basketball. Of course, there's going to be the. With the Year of twenty, twenty, four ever, and that it will be, it's going to be a weird sort of season in terms of history. But the ASTERISK is really different and that it wasn't sloppy. But Yeah Obviously, just an anomaly as like supported of a season but at the same time, not the same sort of Asterisk we thought there was going to be the agree with that trae. Yeah I. Agree. It's not been a sloppy aspect to it at all. It's almost like being in the bubble has leveled the playing field without with the lack of travel and playing in the same gyms time in. And time out, you know you can get in a rhythm and I think there's a natural flow to play one day them. We're offer a day. Then we play one day. Then we're off for and you just kind of get used to the rhythm of the series and We're seeing that the effect of travel really has during a series both from the narrative standpoint when you're like okay, well. They're up to but now they got to go win one on the opponent's homecourt that doesn't happen here, and now it's just who's the better team who's going to be the better team for these seven games and without having to go back and forth from city to city to city to city people are just able to play at their best, and that's why I think. We're seeing great shooting I. Think we're seeing offenses that have clicked. We saw these fifty point games in the jazz nuggets series. Things are just a little bit more. Even we're always going to associate this twenty twenty your there's going to be the biggest astronauts from the standpoint of yeah. Remember when they were playing season in a bubble, but there's also going to be very little asterisk. From a this doesn't count standpoint because it seems like everything counts everybody was ready to play, and the Games have been really good everything from the seating games through the first round even into the second round here we get it right from the beginning that there was only GonNa be in my opinion on Astra on this season if heaven forbid a star player on title contending team. Got Covert and was removed from games, and fortunately that hasn't happened because they've done an incredible job with the safety protocols and this entire campus environment and the bubble that to me was really okay. Yeah. If Lebron is removed because he actually contracted the virus then yeah that hasn't asterix on it for me but it didn't happen and you're right everyone is for the most part. Pretty. Healthy and safe and yeah, we're getting the best of the best down there. So that's sort of removed in my opinion and it's it's weird. It's always going to be remembered. Weird but no. The legit eventual champion of knock on what we get there and we should will be legit, right? Yeah. Yeah. No question about it and it's actually kind of fun seeing out teams just compete when everything is basically at that same playing field. You know there isn't like wow, man they just can't win in Denver this series they they have to go out there and play there every night. So I actually think it's been really good. I also think it's difficult from a to predict standpoint because right now. WHO's the favourite to win the championship I mean obviously, the lakes and the clip is likely to come out of the West and then the east it's going to be down to now three teams which all three teams I think have at least a stake they know they can climb listen if things go away weakening there and we can win and I think that's really good. You know. It's kind of like. Well, the worries is who's going to really beat the warriors nobody, but that's not there anymore I, think I saw raptors beat them last year. Well. Kevin Durant wasn't there you know and and whatever. But I think right now it's like the Lakers could win the clippers could win. Less convinced about the nuggets and the rockets are probably just behind them as simply because I have to beat the Lakers and then they clip his bet I sort of feel more teams have got a chance right now than we've seen in the past and I, think that's great I I think it's really really fun and you see well, the play is out that there's nothing changed from my passion standpoint look. Like who cares this one doesn't carry true everyone is flying with the same level of intensity that you would expect in the playoffs. So I think overall the basketball, the quality and the standard has been as good as we can possibly expect about this point from antanus. Popadopoulos, in the Youtube chat who says I don't think there's an asterisk with regard who wins the title we all agree on that but there's An Asterix for teams like the Bucks who normally would have had home court advantage the home court advantage has gone. There's no doubt about it. Crunch time feels a little ex- crunchy. You're not getting the benefit of your crowd getting Tabu the referees when they make a call disagree with you know maybe getting in their heads a little bit that is in effect I would agree I would agree with atmosphere, right? Right. You can't deny that. It's tough because the bucks were just bad. The entire bubble right I mean, that's the thing they were not convincing in the seating games and it's of continue a little bit into the playoffs I. Think they went but they lost ten games all regular season like the normal regular season. and. Then they lost ten games in the bubble alone and obviously much much fewer games. But now it's a great point I mean, I was Gonna saying. Yeah, we really missed out on homecourt advantage. We had one of the better ones in the league in you know, and they would inspire us to victories at the same time. There are other teams like the heat and the sixers who are. Really, great home teams throughout the season but the heat came down here and kicked out of everybody Even if they didn't have home court advantage, there are bad rotating there in that sixers. Family. So I appreciate how it wasn't using it as an excuse for the bucks until Yannis just sort of brought it up. But I think that was just after the fact he was talking about it wasn't an excuse, but it was more just A. Real it is real that it has been a level playing field. It's an equalizer no doubt, and that's why you would. Definitely you have to mention it. You have to bring it up. But at the same time the he came down here. CAME DOWN TO ORLANDO and we're just rock-solid I. Think one thing that does change in this was a question we didn't include. But the common refrain, the common saying of a playoff series is that a series doesn't start until a road team wins a game on the road. Now, we don't have that saying anymore windows a playoff series start nobody knows impossible now yeah. There is no almost because it almost doesn't start until it's actually over. that. Okay Yeah that doesn't end dotes over either. Right. Right. That's a good one. Now, let's hear from people with the Eric's question there have opinions about that one Now, this whole thing doesn't mean anything it probably depends on who you're cheering for. Your Buck Spanish. Yeah. This doesn't count. This is stupid. This is. But other teams are going to disagree with that. So let's hear you thinking that at least on twitter and the Youtube comments. What's next one here? Hey, no dunks while talking about Robert Williams Lea Lea referred to them as the landlord. Before quickly correcting himself the time Lord that's his nickname. There wasn't much of a reaction but I thought it warranted at least a tray giggle. Which NBA Player deserves the landlord as his nickname and why stay. Sweet. Thanks John P skeets where do you think who deserves the landlord? Wasn't a tray giggle or was it a skiing all it's tough to tell sometimes us for people out there listening. Yes the landlord is a good nickname. It really is especially for for big guy. Now am I forgetting anyone in NBA history that was nicknamed the landlord Leon Williams. Yeah, okay yes. Okay. Thank you I knew there was a guy I was I was struggling to find it on basketball reference. I should have just went to the old google that would have helped I'm sure extent. But Okay Sheldon Williams that's right. Okay. Sheldon Williams suck the Right Oh. Yeah. Yeah. He looked like Ken griffey junior from the Simpsons episode whereas. Really, really, back, yeah the baseball episode. But I love the nickname for a big guy. So I'm sticking with the big guy and I'm going to go with Mitchell Robinson as the landlord because I'm going for I want a young guy that's the thing you can't really go like Brook Lopez could he be a landlord because he's inside a lot and he's blocking shots and deterrent shots and but he's already got good nicknames. So it just doesn't feel right Mitchell Robinson is nicknames right now according to basketball reference the block Ness Monster It just doesn't roll off the tongue and lobby NSEN and that's not I. Don't landlord works for him being a young guy, twenty, two years old the average two blocks per game. Seven best in the league. You know he's controlling the pain does is offensive work even inside the pain never leaves he's one of those landlords that lives in the building. And, you know he's a he's a Stanley Roper from three's company. There's a tiny reference-oriented. Robinson? Feel about it. Yeah I tried to come up with something creative to for this because. showed him Williams was the big shot blocker Duke I, think back in the day and that's that's why he got the nickname. And I was like, who is that go ahead the Davis it doesn't like no. I can't really boring on instead and I'm just GonNa say Russell Westbrook because he covers the most land I think he's like a he's like a sheepdog out there just running, running, running, running, running around and. He's all over the court. The whole time he'd never knows how to stop. So yeah, that's that's the best like there's not enough food actually, but I should have come up with something else covers a lot of land, rover? I. Thought Man You Define Yourself. Did you come up with a creative answer for this one I thought? So until I saw it echoing in the Youtube Comments Jeff. Green is the landlord to me because you can always get a rental from him. Or is a lot of ways to tackle the landlord nickname. That's a good one. Okay. Yeah. I also thought a Jeff Green but I didn't want to go with it because he's always renting. You never owned a home 'cause he's. Been Hey. It's a really good one I I went I went old school. I went to former colleague Shaquille O'Neal who at Turner Sports when we were working there at once upon a time came up to our table. And we were with one of our colleagues, Garrett and shack knew that Garrett was from Philadelphia and he said to Garrett. From Philadelphia Garrett's yes. He goes I have a house there can't sell it. You want it. I got houses ever. Landlords. Doesn't offer it up as. I WanNa to do just because he was from there I. Wonder if he eventually Soda Try, he's like you just trying to. Anybody anybody to take it yeah. That's not a great nickname for me not the landlord now. Any. Other Youtube suggestions out there for the landlord and good ones that you guys got your eyes on. Bead Apex Frazier said he owns real estate in Audrey trump. Okay. Yes Scotty. Very. True. Also making does do a lot of work in the paint. That's the main one I would say. Yeah but he does too much work outside of the. C.. He's he's got a he's got a building that he maintains for sure but he goes away he goes to Florida for like you never hear from them. Yeah Right. I've been waiting for my dryer for six weeks, right? It's Just send an email after email. You're not hearing back for sure Fabio nozaki roots Kyle lowry because he takes charges. Charges People. While reach and we're region. I did this one Jeff Green is the tenant. Instead of the land. Jeff. Good one. Good. Speaking, ten jd of you're gone to the movie theater yet to watch tenant or interesting add no of course no, no, no, we're in a pandemic. Don't believe. Don't believe the hype out there. I'm not going to any theater. Okay. It's usually twenty million i. hope we people were going maybe it's over maybe. Should we go back to the? Office? And still have an office I. Do we have office is all my art gun that we hung up I missed AL's. Smell of lease. Trap to win. A lot more questions still to get to. But let's take a quick break here from our sponsors. Now is the time to celebrate because footfall is pushing back and. I didn't feel. anyway and drop. This week is. The leader in one day fantasy sports is putting you in the center of this weekend's action with over eight million dollars up at grabs across all of their context kickoff the season draftkings is giving new users a free shot at one million dollar top prize with your first deposit when you use code maze during sign up. Getting on the action now, draft your lineup. Now feel the sweat like never before every run passing catch means more withdraw kings lineup. It's simple. There's pick Ilana stay under the salary cap and see how your team stacks up against the competition nothing to sweat of watching the game quite like having a shot at a million dollar. 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Who or what is your spirit animal jump Puff Lucia. Blossom these are apparently pokemon names. Catch them all That's from Jordan in Auburn so spirit animals. Trapped Yeah I did what anyone would do for this I went online and took a quiz to find out what my spirit animal was. I filled it out and I got butterfly. I Click on what tramp stamp tattoos should. I get. I got the exact same. We must taken the same with. The first one. Do. You have a giant beards use your. That easy. It was all about the patterns. So for me I was like I don I can't. I can't go with butterfly I I gotta think of something more water based So, then I was thinking, I, don't know I've been really really like in to act like a wall in the pool lately ramming with my head, but they got a smooth look to them the Nar Wall. Ultimately I decided on sea turtle. Okay now got a weird luck. It can be in the water it can be out of the water they're not really in a hurry much like myself. So. Yeah. Sea Turtle. Allingham. To me, this is like a nickname where you can't really give yourself your spirit animal other people have to. Talk to you I think. Yeah. So so did you put the work in and you're going to assign an animal to each of us? No I. Didn't I just that's just my analogy but. I think you'd be a bit of a cat ski cat. Wow that'd be a cheetah. Cheetah Nah I, think just the hell. I was. Okay. Very nice. trae would be. Free would be some sort of bear I think these. Bear. I think attacks. That's would be like a dolphin. Thanks. Interesting Very smart, very intelligent. Likes to get out there. In the morning get sweaty when it comes in I don't have anything to do with a dolphin but. WHAT ABOUT JD? You might as well finish this. Jd. Yeah. He'd be more like a Walrus I think jd. Wow Here comes the wall. Areas CUCKOO guess. He's going to be the waller's I'd like to be an egg man. Task answer this. I also put in the work I did a quiz. Wow. I told the was sitting beside my lovely wife. Danielle and I told her that I got a tiger and she goes I should do it again. I don't think tigers. It's and then you read the synopsis of Why you're. You know you're like into some certain animal and it's like reading a horoscope like you can find little tidbit. Sure. Sure. Dumps sometimes outside even. Exactly. Yeah. You're right. About. Yourself. Act Slowly, but you can act fast when needed I like that I like. That ME. Perfectly speaking of animals. We just got a dog. This is. Quick developing. Story here in the ski tow soul we just got a puppy this morning. Someone was looking. To obviously find a home for this puppy last night on Instagram I mean, it's crazy instagram. What can it do and? It was a friend of a friend of a friend and yeah this little puppy was dropped off this morning. We believe it's an eight week old Australian shepherd girl. We're not harm presents you any of that, but she's got she got an. Appointment tomorrow but very, very cute. Don't have a name yet, but let me just throw. Let me throw the name that's being kicked around the house a little eerie actions because he got to see the reactions. Again, I she's black and white, very, very tiny puppy Luna. Okay that's. Weird faces. Okay Luna's right. Now at the forefront, we're throwing it around see if it works, but you gotta try yelling at a lot. Yell at Lake outside and Yell. Out. That put it down. Exactly. I hope I didn't really upset. House cats and dogs so I don't know. My neighbor's got three outdoor cats. So this is going to get interesting very quickly here. But. Yes. Very well, I'll show you a photo later. Okay. So let's get to our next question. Well, we got tests, Chrissy Teigen and John Legend are going to love that cat. Oh, that's right. That's one of their little girl's name. That's right. Yeah. That's right. Yeah West instagram's great for everything especially learning the names of celebrities. Guys, please look into your crystal ball and predict the biggest name to change teams in upcoming free agency for. Magnum. Macau in Norway skeets back to ball biggest name to change teams are coming free agents well, not back to ball yet nora just text me she got so scared when you yelled that. I feel bad horrible. Dog Dead. Getter in her great question little free. Agency. Why not? Let's talk about it This is GONNA be a weird free agency for a lot of reasons. Of course it's tough to pick the biggest name because a lot of the names on the list like have player options or just probably not going anywhere restricted free agents signed like Anthony Davis. Okay. He's not leaving the Lakers. I don't think Brandon Ingram is not leaving the PELICANS. Damore to Rosen. Unlikely picking up a player option. So I would think. At least signing still to be with the spurs who knows what happens from there. Gordon Hayward same thing. Like Bogdonovich, with the Kings, I would think if anything buddy he'll does moved and stuff like that, and he's a restricted free agent. So. I Guess Fred Van Vanfleet a question will someone pry leave from the raptors. He's an unrestricted free agent possibility. I think Ari I don't know if that name is big enough for people out there. But we saw with the doing moving on their coach I mean, are they really going to just lean heavily into a rebuild? I could see some interest for a goal and Ari from a lot of teams. He seems like that sort of like you know fifth pc would want on your roster and maybe even starts to become a six man in his career. So those two guys I mean I know it's not sexy, but it's really just not the greatest greatest free agency classic I don't think mantras. Herald is going to go anywhere. I. Think actually he resigned to the clippers I. Am I missing a name or is it van ve leader Ari? The only other one I would add was. Gordon. Drag it because van Vliet was kind of top of the list. Because I mean. It's not going to happen tonight. But what if the raptors were to lose and not win the championship? They've had the built in rebuild kind of ready to go from the moment they traded Marta rose and right they've been ready to go onto the next phase of whatever their team is going to be in a fat means. A second round exit this year maybe Fred van delete leaves. Then you can talk maybe serge. Ibaka maybe marcus all and then who knows what the raptors looked like at that point at some point, it's going to be building around Siachen though maybe that seems a little bit more nerve wracking at this point but. I don't know there Fred Vanfleet to me could be the first domino for the raptors, but they have to be eliminated from the playoffs I it hasn't happened yet. The Raptors will have spice to sign him as just how much worth and are they prepared to pay more than anybody has now as unrestricted free agent of course, he can and the and get nothing in return. So it sort of is out of their hands in that respect maybe he's just gone over team whereas. Like I want to be Star and they're gonNA pay me more because I have no question that there'll be a lot of interest in him. So just how much going forward, the raptors are prepared to is caused got a year left at thirty million and then pass gals massive do kicks in next year starting at twenty nine, million they got norm palette a bad tell me that's about it so they got enough room it's just whether or not Messiah wants to pay him. Hundred and fifty million. I mean, right I think he's I think he's getting somewhere around that I really do think. Depending on how desperate teams are to sign a guy who's got a good reputation, the playoffs and coming off a successful run. Money's not out of out of the Ballpark for Fred is just whether or not the raptors in Messiah going to pay it to him so. That's that's probably he's probably the biggest name I. Think I really think he's the biggest name out there as an unrestricted tardily free agent. So yeah. Yeah I, think the biggest name to be moved won't be a free agent at all I think it's going to be Chris. Paul which. Everybody and their mom said the same thing approximately ten months ago whatever I guess fifteen months ago in. Free Agency popped up in in two thousand nineteen. But I think same Prestia. So confident, he can get good value for Chris Paul. He's even telegraphing that we're rebuilding letting go of Billy Donovan in that mutual decision there. He's that coughing 'cause Chris balls value as Zada surprising high. I. Don't think anybody would have expected such a great year from Chris Paul but as he said in the Oklahoma last year as he said. Multiple Times anyone who will listen sacristy knows that? Okay See. Needs to tear down a little bit to get back to that championship level and they were at the championship level I don't think Sam, Presi has any interest in being mediocre too good because that's where they're climb would be in. This is the time to trade crispell I. Think it would be the absolute great time to trade him in if we're watching the Miami Heat and I might be trapped in the moment here. But Miami here get into the conference finals. Maybe it's just the the circumstances here in the BUBBA teams are kind of over achieving. So maybe somebody'll overpay to get Chris. Paul. I don't know if it's the heat if born driver leaves. We talked about Milwaukee potentially jump in there. There are some teams who would love Chris Paul as their. Number, two, three guy if championship team could make that happen we that would be great stuff and I think that'll make some big headlines in what November now free agency is potentially being pushed back to. Always changing, you never know we don't know. Yeah. It's supposed to be sort of mid October mid late October and then now by all accounts a month later mid-november something like that who really knows all right great question next one here all all wedgies I've been listening since the Basketball Jones days after discovering y'all during a promo, a soccer podcast. I am a born and raised Lakers fan kyle or Carl. Kuzma. WAS MINUS Twenty one against Houston in game one I feel like an old man yelling. At clouds whenever I express my dislike for Kyle. Kuzma. Publicly who is the player from your favorite team that you knew was terrible but anytime, you brought it up people argued with you about how you didn't understand his value. Am I taking crazy pills? Please tell me Gd has this happened for you with a marvel slash star wars character or maybe even a band cheers from Lake T in Huntington Beach California is interesting timing with this email tasks with the kyle slash Carl Kuzma yeah. Bad Game One. Pretty Damn Impressive Games two and three as we talked about on our daily podcast. So he bounce back in your face Mike T. You get start at Gd I. Definitely want to get your your your answer to the Marvel Star Wars what you got task Kyle Calicoes a very good basketball player. Let's start with that I. Understand all the talk about cal coups. My you know coming out of the gate as a rookie. There is I guess high expectations after how he played as a rookie and then he started taking a bunch of shots on Lebron less team and he didn't look like a great player he looked like a guy who's just gonNA shoot the ball out. But zero in on what he's doing. Now, what he's done in the bubble, what he's done as the guy down the pecking order on a team, he is phenomenal right now it's sometimes you get expectations as a as a fan of a team and you think. We've been talking about Marvin Williamson, he was a number two pick he should be a great player. Calculus sudden. He could be a number two guy number three guy we could train them for Anthony Davis. Well, those expectations just GonNa meet what how who's me is but if you're lower those expectations and understand what coups matters done, you got to be happy with him. He was in the bubble in the regular season seating games take a couple possessions on James Harden as he's doing in this series or a couple possessions on Leonard and doing a really good job defensively who had fuck it he's exceeding expectations on that, and so I, think you've got to be really happy if you're a Laker Fan I, you know caucus. Not going to be a number two number three guy. But in his role, he's great and I'll just answer the other part real quickly as far as being a fan of team You know I was more of a raptors fan a long time ago in those Basketball Jones days and I would say, no player was terrible when I was a fan I love them. All I have crazy expectations like I. think our email here a mike t does they're all going to be great TJ Ford Oh yeah is going to be the best. All these guys are are going to exceed exceed expectation lauren woods the next thinking alone. All of. Them. So the landlord Lauren would. He owns the woods. Yeah part of. You know a die hard fan. You're right and talk yourself into all of the guys on your team we would trade that. Guy. He's going to be at twenty per game score for sure lead anyone. I don't know which teenager for. Just going back to. Answer their call us still fina callous. They'll fan I wanted to murder him sometimes when he went out and fight for the raptors. Took some bad bad shots didn't do anything on defense and didn't really do all that much else. But every now and again, you'd see Carlos Twenty seven point six threes and people say Delfina Mandel Fina he's. He's he's a bench she's Avenue Johnson he's the microwave off the bench and I'm like don't get sucked into by that real estate in college they'll fan I so yeah, he used to get me. So angry especially in the playoffs against the Orlando Magic that year they lost in five games he had one good game, and then he just dunk it up the rest of it, but he kept getting minutes and I was furious Urus. I mean he had some some moments international play moments to. Decent player. Walter Hammond he sort of just lived off these like. One on to memories that people have that all of the sudden this guy was fantastic. Yeah. But day-to-day on my God, he got me angry sometimes. Trade Bulls guy or to that you were very, very high on. Well, here's the thing is that nobody thinks the bulls players are good so that's confessed the tough part on the Internet no-man's Zach Levine could be an all star, but then I talked to my dad back home and he's like Zach Levine. How is this guy? Not An author? He should be an all-star my dad he's terrible. So I'm really caught in the middle here people on the Internet have the wrong opinion. They think the Bulls are mostly terrible which they are but I can't. Let my dad know that they're not that good I have to keep them I. have to keep him in his place So it's a tough spot, but it's very weird being a bulls fan. It's like when they were good they derrick rose and he was widely respected as a good player. But everybody kind of realized that Carlos Boozer was tough spot. But nobody on the was like no man Carlos Boozer's holding this team together right I know the Bulls seem to be very properly rated. and Jd if we could bring you in here, do you have an answer for the Marvel Star, Wars Angle and well for? The band everybody knows I hate oasis and every time I say that. People just they attack me as if as if you know A. Great I'm happy you like oasis they suck. They're the worst than nickelback and I hate Nicholas. That's harsh. Love nickelback is going to get jabbing there got always Oh, and for marvel as a kid growing up. The the comics doctor strange. I never. Got It. I. Just I. You know I? Don't like magic. I don't like Harry Potter I. Don't like that kind of stuff I don't like the mystical You know the X. Meka's always Oh presto your saved. You know like, Oh, I. Forgot I had this spell up my sleeve so. That said though I really liked the doctor strange the movie. So in the movie yeah benedict he sold me on on old doctor strange. Cu. We can't we. We had a drop. Months and months ago of this kid doing a review of doctor strange like and he started the review by saying doctor Doctor Gimme the news I gotta bad case of them doctor strange. That, but I bring that up because that's the only way we say doctor strange in this house all like in our family you cannot just say doctors, do you have to do that entire drought? Comment. Here JD I. Don't know if you WANNA put it on screen 'cause it's knock on you but from Giovanni music don't look back in anger. All right. Great great questions here. I'm telling you I love six right now task. Let's keep going here. Here. We Coconino Dunks I. Hope you don't take offense to this. But. I am slightly toxic as I. Send this email and I'm using dunk says asleep medication I listened to the podcast and it helps me sleep although I do listen to it sobers. Well, this leads me to my question. What is something you use for a different purpose than it was intended for love the podcast that's from Ryan ps your manscaping average legitimately made me by the product p P. S. it has taken me like half an hour to prove free this email. So I'll be disappointed if there any spelling mistakes The ironic part is Ryan. You put proofread as two different words to separate. It's one word. But no spelling the savings you could you could use Gramley oh free. Right, there leave. What are your thoughts something you use for a different purpose well I. I don't know if you go sort on twitter the other day I think jd has a photo of it. He Cassidy Habat tweeted out of Jason. TATUM. When he turned up to the game, he had his lion king lunchbox there, and he has it as a little sort of symbol to his son that deuce loves lines and Love Lion King. I always carry my food to the game. So I was just a little something for me when he sees the picture, he sees that daddy has a liking lunchbox and that just melted my heart immediately there because you guys remember last in. The in the office and even this year still an annual office I would always bring my son's leg lunchbox fat my leg my lunchbox in his Lego lunchbox because it was like when we when we get his lunch ready in the morning and he would say, what are you doing for lunch that will impact in this one and put in there so even though I would use it still for lunch, it was more just that symbolism. That I connected it to there with him and also you know he's got a couple of schoolbags that he's going through and he's had a Lego police wound and he had a star wars as well, and so often use those now as allied Deepak whenever we're going somewhere if I need to pack a few things I use one of his and put it on my backpack and I just I. Just love that sort of feeling of like we're together in this man we're together we can play together. We can have fun together. That's that's the sort of connection that I made with what Jason Tatum did there with his son so You know like I say I sort of use them for the right purposes just. Seeing a forty four year old man walking around with a Lego lunchbox on the surface doesn't look normal to a lot of people talk. It's meaningful to me and I when I saw Jason Tatum doing it is just like Oh my God that it just hit me so hard and I thought it was beautiful. You're a Lego fan to or not. Yes. Yes. The A. Bit of a break head. Aren't you? Well? So it's my my four year olds today actually and. My my eight year old. Yeah. Oscar for my eight year old Oscar. Sebastian bought Oscar Lego for birthday and he actually eight for it which was like shocking to me because he was like data want to get him a Lego. So he bought him Lego we'd reacted together and then this morning Sebastian opened that president that he gave them the Lego out of the box, build the league, and they took a leg up to his room. Her Simpson buying a bowling bowl. So. Yes. Yes. All right well, happy birthday to little low Oscar four years old Oh my God where does the time go? Man Man you to looney tunes full man or? Around tomorrow. Four. Drink out of her dog bowl. Sherrod. I, didn't know why you. Like wait. Dog Owners do. Dog Owners do got to. See other looking. Yeah I I forgot the link to the lunchbox that was well played. Do you have an answer astray a product that you use for different purposes and maybe it was intended for yeah I don't know if you guys can hear this. That's popcorn ten but it's also my laptop stand. On this thing could hold three different kinds of popcorn. But for right now just holds my computer up. So that, you can see my face at the perfect angle You know it's like a homemade tripod if you will a homemade laptop stand. I'm doing the exact same thing not using that I'm using a box but. Actually the box. That might came in. So it's the empty cardboard blocks. It's the perfect I. got that one working to hold my mind the. Oh. Yeah. Excellent. That's funny show. Let me show this same thing. Oh boxed-up yeah, nice box and it works as we knock these mics around a little bit makes them funny sounds but what are you got tasks anything? Not, a real interesting one I gotta be honest but when I make my French press coffee in the morning I mix it with a chopstick. Is I think it started as. I. DidN'T WANNA get grinds on a spoon I feel like I lose less grinds if I used the chopstick, which is true although it's nuts I mean who cares Why not just use a spoon but I think I also use it because it's long. Because the French presses a little bit longer, and then you don't WanNa have to dig your hand in there. But also just feels like I'm real Barista because I'm doing something different in just changing things up I could have thought about getting one of those long spoon I have one for a mixologist uses for drinks. and. Nuts just to feel like I'm really into it or feel like I'm having something exciting other than coffee in the morning potentially some feel like I'm drinking some alcohol but I just feel like I'm more into it. I'm not a crazy. Coffee Guy GotTa do this gotTa do that I'm not like our friend Jay who's got a nine minute steeping process only. Poured in here forwarding year sifting through year look at it for four minutes but I'm. It just make coffee but I. Use a trump's of course story bro. I mean you you reminded me of something so. When I'm not watching basketball right now as the Games has sort of you know chilled out a little bit not four on every day is only the to on usually at night now and it's GonNa get down to one and eight soon and I've been watching you know there's a million of these. Like international shows where you go and rent a house or buy a house like there's so many variations of these shows. So I don't even know which we're watching right now I forget even where they are. There's some Croatia and like they're definitely been in Greece in a couple episodes. Anyway I bring this up because he said, coffee my favorite part of every single one of these episodes without fail when these people are looking at these houses that are in beautiful settings don't get me wrong overlooking these beautiful beaches or they're up in the gardens and stuff like that, and the all trees and all that they always always because they go room to room and the cameras follow them and they're obviously told by a producer to be like, Hey, talk it saying what you're thinking. Like this must be the master bedroom. Yeah. No, there's a giant king sized bed in here and yeah, there's a bathroom it. So they say all the obvious things but they always say I'll get to my point here and I love it every time they always say, Oh, I could really picture myself drinking my coffee here. Sort of like Verandah porche whatever little outdoor area again, beautiful spots. Every single time they have to say I could picture myself drinking my coffee here in the morning and I, always wonder. Always. How many coffees are actually consumed when they go with that one house I mean it happens for a little bit sure. But it's not as often as you think, it's just a nice thing that you'd convince yourself that all I can see myself buying or renting this because I could see myself having my coffee here. Anyway that's a cool story. What have you watch those shows? You know exactly what I'm talking about because they do it every single time and it becomes quite funny. It's fun drinking game I drink my coffee every time. They mentioned that cold drink here. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers to that my spin drift here today. Let's take another break quick from our sponsors. Sick. But literally, the first thing I thought about this morning was doing manscaping address. is still closed thinking about man's gaped. 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The shears two point Oh is a luxury four piece nail kit and it's the perfect add add-ons. Perfect package you get slashed tipped weezer rounded point scissors, fingernail clippers, and a medium grit nail file. Your hands will be in tip top shape whether you're eating wings at magic city or handling your Rodney mcgruder. Right now you can get twenty percent off and free shipping with the code the athletes at Manscaping Dot com that's twenty percents off with free shipping at Manscaping, dot, com and use code the Athletic Twenty Take Your grooming game to the next level eliminate Dick. Slivers with manscaping. Next one here high no dunkers big fan from Scotland listening to lease story about being at a wedding with Steve Nash. Reminded me of a story. My friend told me from when she was at a Footballer Stu Holden's wedding in Las Vegas. Her friend's Dad was doing some classic wedding mingling with other guests and his son walked over as he was speaking to a tall athletic looking dude, his dad was. Rambling on about a few Scotland be team rugby appearances that he made when he was younger and then said something along the lines of when you get near the elite level of sport. You see that there's a huge jump in talent and drive, but you might not know what I'm talking about at that point his then mortified son had to pipe up and say Oh my God dad that Steve Nash. His Dad had no idea who Steve Nash was but apparently Steve was a great sport and took it all in stride and good humor. Have you guys ever made a fool of yourself in front of anyone of note that's from Lewis in Edinburgh Scotland trae to fund story fund, Nash Stories to hold. Of course, really good friends with Steve National checks out. This makes sense I. Don't know why you would ever make this story up I. Believe it. But what do you think have you ever had this incident? The only thing I've got similar that has nothing to do with basketball because I mean we've all made fools of ourselves in front of basketball royalty at this point. But for me something in my prior life, I was like I don't know sixth grade seventh grade we are playing and a flag football tournament we were driving up. Irving Park Road, and you know we're dumb kids sitting in the passenger seat. So we just decided to make faces at the people who are driving by and I did at one time it hit like a dumb face turned out to be Chicago, White Sox shortstop, Ozzie Gin, driving the car next he gives me a crazy facing just floors and flies on by Ozzy, on the license plate like what? Got Ghanem. Leonie. craziest stories share well, I guess just going back to the Steve Nash Wedding there we were sitting at the table and. We were talking about soccer obviously 'cause we played soccer and we'll talk about and then and then he said had he had he known about so heading how much about soccer and I said well, I used to live in London he said, who's your team? And I said, Arsenal I love Arsenal and Steve Nash as anybody who knows anything bad Steve Nash and soccer knows that he's a big tottenham and Arsenal and writing about the beaches rivals this. So it wasn't super embarrassed. He wasn't super awkward or anything but I remember thinking like I wish I didn't just say that because it's like we probably automatically hate each other now. I see I see. August like Nash, flip the table broken bottle. Neck. That would-be, what a Tottenham family due to. They're gonNA come at me now. Ask Jab they're. Nice Little Steve Jabbie there. I Wilson Lewis just quickly. Edinburgh. One of the spectacular cities in the world it's own juice go is that if you haven't been. On the shortlist. God, it is spectacularly beautiful. Dancer way better than Dublin Right. Yeah. Tasks I just WANNA point out from this story I thought this was a weird part when the data saying when you get near the elite level of sport, you see there's a huge jump talent and drive. To me, you could have just ended that sentence right there. That's a great point. One, hundred percent true. Especially, if you're an amateur athlete and then you really see the pros. But why did he have to throw in in in a setting where you don't really know a lot of people but you might not know what I'm talking about. Like a real weird jam to me, they're just check out there speaking of the Steve Jab. He's like, why why did you? Why did you have to add that part? It'd be of a Dick Random Dad. Didn't likes these. Tight look. I guess. Restraint part yeah. Do you have an answer this? Well for our show, I once had to dance at flirty girl fitness. Witches, I. Do a little dance with the bowl. You wear your tights and that kind of thing somebody sent. The video to Chrissy teak and why? Why that happened. She replied with a wwe wild and that start following me. So I didn't do anything embarrassing in front of anyone. But on the Internet same thing trying to think why somebody sent it doesn't make sense. You'RE GONNA want to she's out. Chris Yeah, you're GONNA WANNA see this. Yeah I think she was I'm not sure I think she was at the peak of powers and people sending her stuff you. WanNa. See this. You got to see this I don't know I have no idea anyways she loved it absolutely love it got to fall out of it mentioned her twice already in this. Job Keeping that relationship. Yeah. Second Child's name is miles sweater cute kit. Okay. Moving on. Hey there drinkers and dumpers but no dunkers and almost every commercial break recently, it seems like I've been seeing at corona commercial featuring snoop Dogg. I have two questions, snoops presence make Lee reevaluate his corona stance and to which celebrity would make you try a product based on their endorsement. Thanks for all the basketball and non basketball content as always turn up Levy. Guys. Awesome. That is from Doug Inputs Pittsburgh legally. Where do you think is a change your krona stance not really no. Dot Really I mean the thing is. And I don't know when it was some time in the when we talked about it. Were taken over by the same brand that sells budweiser is that right and Anheuser Busch? Is that right? Right right. And I saw my theory basically has been proven correct I definitely think they've cheap them on the on the ingredients and they've tried to mass market and it was working until this year when everything coruna has just been badly affected. So I think they must have paid snoopy alike. To get him to endorse these to get back on stoops of pretty well liked and pretty well respected Guy Cyrus like, yeah this is great. Your taste to. Any crosses a few different. Genres area sport. Sport. To the lake is there. OUGHTA. Stretch. STINGL maybe but he's I respect respect. Bring out the big guns they're but. Improve your product, improve your product guy back to the way it was eight years ago and I'll. I'll be back onboard because it was a great be but no longer it's A. Stick and shaggy should add snoopy. Trio. Like, I the commercial is fine. You know keeping up on your telephones as sort of. It's fine but men, I don't know about you guys I know we've watched a million basketball games here since the restart and that's great. I feel like we have seen the same commercials aver there. There are maybe what fifteen commercials maybe twenty total and that's always in every single game. You are seeing the exact same commercials there's this one. There's of course all the. GEICO insurance won the singing one, the taxidermy tax account whatever one I I don't even know who that woman is. Some Edina Mandel. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. There's the Jake from state farm and man, it's just like. Ad Nauseam with these ads Ad Nauseam that's why they call it that. That is one. We need. We need a refresher for the conference finals like he got the second sake or something here because I don't know man too much jake now, just too much jake in too much taxidermy tax attorney i. read that wrong Oh. Yeah. That song is in my head from the minute I. Wake up until the mid I write a manscaping gave raid. I hit the mute button for the commercials now like I let them play but I go silent. We've heard it. We've heard the Joneses on their telephones as. One thing with that that's new dot commercial, the colonel and. He's wearing socks on the beach. Drives me insane I guess people do it, but it drives me insane. That's just like that's you know that's the last place I want to wear socks beach step in right now is anybody wearing socks everywhere No Sex. No. No chain. So that's that's odd. But then maybe he's like self conscious about his feet and he's like I'm keeping my socks. I'm not saying my feet. You're either going close up or you're just keeping my socks on. So I don't know I mean I get the socks with the flipflop sandals or whatever he's got on but on the beach espn doesn't make fast. No, it doesn't make sense you kicking back with the corona you're not really kick him back when. He is wearing just a lot of close in general for your. SHIRT HANDLE ROBOT, right? That's a good point. Good Point. These commercials we lost dog, but we're done with these commercials. Does anybody have a question an answer for which celebrity would make you try a product based on that question right? Well, Denzel Washington I? mean. If he if he was maybe he should be the corona do. Anything basically yeah. Yeah. If he gets that active voice going and he's at, he's trying to really convince you wouldn't even need to convince me too much if it's good enough at Denzel good enough for me. So yeah, I would like to see a Leila's Manzke keeped. Do What They. Wouldn't what? You, would you do a man's game to add read if they paid you enough live and you guys not here I think. I heard you. You seem to be lagging I don't know if it's your baby essentially lagging a little bit Samania. But what do I do a live Manzke? Maybe maybe. I don't WanNA I don't. WanNa commit to anything right. Coming back to backfire in the bump. So maybe you know. Okay. Final one here because my Internet's laggy. No dunks just tell me if you can't hear me while I read this being at home over these past six months has made me notice many mundane things. Here's one which way should the toilet paper roll go? My wife always puts the toilet paper in so it dispenses under. Always over we have been changing its direction mid roll for years. Now, months ago I confronted her about it and she said she's been meaning to ask me as well after twenty minutes of laughing and debating in the bathroom we did not come to a conclusion and are still living in this t p disoriented situation over or under under over I hope you can help that's from pat in Ferny Creek in Australia Tasks over under or no opinion on the TV. Ho I've gotten opinion I. over under I'm not sure if they do different in Australia but you gotta go over I. It's all about the ease of ripping it. It's harder to rip it's under up. Listen I'm I'm one to struggle. So if somebody mistakenly put it on in the under in my house, if Danielle put it. Under and it was a mistake, obviously, definitely a mistake I'll live with it but I won't be happy about it I probably won't even flip it like this couple this couple that's an amazing story that four years mid roll somebody changes it and they don't talk about it just keep changing it over and over you gotta come to a consensus, and hopefully, this question will do it for you over is the best way because you never get a grip you never the wrong way. It's always perfect. But if you go under, you just never know what you're going to get. It's like a box of chocolates. Okay Anyway. We you think over on do they do a different and Australia? Yeah. LE-. Let's get your take on it. Now there's no standard. Why is I think I would think normal sign people would have it over I. Would have it underneath. Wow. Wow. That's one of those things that it's like if you go to someone's house. You just like we gotta get it of human. Just leaving. God stay here. I just thought of something Lee. Because you do the leap every once in a while do you it set up in your bathroom that you have a toilet paper dispenser on both sides? Because if you're on one way, you're grabbing with your right hand. It's on the right there. Sure while you're facing a normal person sitting on a toilet but once you turn around now it's on your left hand. I don't know if you're comfortable grabbing with your left hand, maybe you have another dispenser because the right of. You. Don't need the paper for the P.. Anyway. So Right. You're never you've never done a Li Mao. No. No I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. Saying I'm sorry. Question himself and I've only done that at as well and the my. Arm House advantage or harm toilet advantage I wouldn't. I wouldn't dead at someone. Else's house. Right. Okay. Good to know. Thank. You for that rather trae what's your take? I mean everybody's going over here over for sure. Oh, for sure and I mean yeah. I'm super worried about miss rips. Up, for me going over, it's just all about the ease you can yank that thing down. You got a fistful of toilet paper. You're good to go. Okay. All right. We're all saying over I will be shocked that there's a lot of people out there. All admit I never really noticed this like the phenomenon of you could go over under until like I was like twenty five years old I didn't think about it for a good portion of my life and then when you notice it then yeah, you never not see it all go to somebody's house now that's wrong. Now hopefully, that was a mistake hopefully Danny just put that in the wrong way I won't say anything when I come out but I hope that's a mistake I to give her the benefit of the doubt but. We've been in so many battles over at that for time, we were just putting it loose in a basket. Because we couldn't this a dog kitty those are those people. There's Not Just. A basket. Go over Pat Pat you're right. Your wife is wrong on this one it's over keep us updated. Let us know. All right. We'll call it there. Thank you so much for your questions. Keep coming dogs at the ATHLETIC DOT COM at no Dunton twitter are sent jd a little photo while we were doing this there's A Little Cutie. As cute dog. She's very, very cute and. So far so good. Had Her for About six hours now. So killing art in my opinion, the perfect dog after six hours. I'm dogs at a distance pictures a little close to close well too close. I'll get you dogs that has just for the edgy no problem she's looking in the distance though. I can see my dog bowl out there on the GRANDMAS. Wow this this is going to sound crazy as we wrap it up here but I've talked about it before been putting the working on my front lawn at least trying to get the grass like looking good looking healthy and it's unlikely words here. Heart my grass I'm going to say this isn't the tasks would say I feel like my grass now that I have a little cute little puppy to run around in it across crass might be too good. It to thick. It's too nice. She just disappears. I love to get your toes on task at your opinion on the life of this grass but she's cute like she almost like disappears and it's not like like. Cutting. The grass dummy no, it's not that it's like very, very thick. Bermuda grass. So We have to rip up my old grass now putting. Just. Her peon drenched drains. Bermuda grass. Is International House Rush? Where you have your. First thing I say what we looked at his house. coffees. coffees I've had their one. It's too hot over here. Guys thanks so much for joining us for this episode of beach step in again, keep your questions and your comments come and we will see you on Thursday morning ten am eastern live on Youtube subscribed your youtube page, hit the notification buttons. You know when we're going live hopefully, the raptors win tonight I'll be in a good mood come Thursday morning and hopefully this little puppy doesn't keep me up all night life clever. You heard it here. I have a great time turn-up. Love you guys. Awesome. Thanks for joining US and remember. You can tell it's no dunce second show of the day when we start talking about grass. Bracelets. It's been so long your. Family.

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Matt Babcock on His Past Life as an Agent, Growing Up Around an NBA Franchise, How His Dad Helped Discover Giannis Antetokounmpo, His Transition to Media and More (Ep. 135)

The HoopsHype Podcast With Alex Kennedy

44:08 min | 1 year ago

Matt Babcock on His Past Life as an Agent, Growing Up Around an NBA Franchise, How His Dad Helped Discover Giannis Antetokounmpo, His Transition to Media and More (Ep. 135)

"Let's say you just bought a house. Bad news is your one step closer to becoming your parents. You'll probably the lawn and skiff anybody noticed you mow the lawn. Tell people to stay off the lawn compare it to your neighbor's lawn and complain about having to mow the lawn again good news is it's easy to bundle home and auto through progressive and save on your car insurance. Which of course, we'll go right into the lawn. Progressive casualty insurance company affiliates and other insurers discount not available in all states or situations. Welcome to the hoop site podcast by name is Alex Kennedy. Joining me today is a former NBA agent who is now the owner and founder of Babcock hoops. That's new media outlet that provides a wide range of content from articles to podcast a ton of draft content. My guest is mad Babcock Matt how're you doing? Well, how are you Alex? I'm doing really well. So I wanna apologize right away to the listeners for my voice. I feel like I'm going through puberty I've been sick. So my voice is kind of cracking here. And they're going in and out. I feel like I'm losing my voice a bit, but we're gonna power through. But if that's happening now, you know, why people may recognize the name Babcock because not only were you an agent that worked, you know, in and around the NBA for many years, you have a ton of family members that work in the NBA. Your ankle Pete Babcock your uncles Pete. And rob back Babcock were both general managers for several teams. Your dad Dave Babcock is it as twenty first year working the bucks for an office. And then you have two cousins Nate and Chris who work as coaches for ATM's. I think that's so cool. I want to start with that. Before we get anything else, your whole family is he works in the NBA. Did you kind of grow up knowing you were going to be in some kind of MBA related position? And and how did that happen? How someone of your family members go down the same path? We just to give you a little bit of background on how my family initially got NBA. My oldest ankle Pete was a high school basketball coach in Phoenix. And obviously a little basketball. We you routes from New England's we we've all been Boston Celtics fans growing up, and he just had this interest in NBA knew that he wanted to work in them. I did it didn't really know how to get there. But he, you know, he volunteered some scouting. And you know, just one thing led to another, and you know in the mid eighties found himself as GM of the Denver Nuggets. And from there he hired my uncle rob to work work for him under for the nuggets. And then my dad followed follow them. And then, you know, my cousins they joked when I started. Working as an agent that I was, you know, the black sheep of the family, and I I went to the dark side. It's so it's it's it's it's kind of good for me. Now that I'm outside of the business, and I'm lose doing something a little bit closer to my roots. Interesting thing for anyone that wants to go check this out. You have a series of articles called growing up a buck. Where you talk about how you know your dad worked in the front office for Milwaukee for so many years. And you know, you talk about your experiences kind of growing up around those teams in the nineties and early two thousands with rayon Glen Robinson, George Karl. Can you guys talk about what that was like being a kid around an MBA? I mean, it sounds like it's every kid's dream. And do you think how did that kind of affect your career as well? It made you want to you know, have some kind of basketball related job in assure. You know, I, you know, I I had some exposure to the NBA growing up with my uncles work in the NBA and my whole peed. You know, when when I was a kid he was a pretty high power general manager with with Elena hawks went when he left everyone's Lannon, you know, they had those teams with Dominique Wilkins and Mukhi Blaylock and then eventually Steve Smith at that's great. Teams. And so I was able to spend some time around those teams, but not living there. I wasn't around that much. You know, my dad was a college coach a kind of kind of grew up as a coach's, son. And then when my dead job with Machi bucks, we moved to Milwaukee, I was in eighth grade and really got the full exposure to to the behind the scenes of VA, and you know, just hung around my dad's office and saw how. Yup. Rated as far as draft preparation and scouting and doing his scheduling, you know, I a in on just sit in on certain meetings. I said the the war room, and then you know, as a ball boy. So I was in the locker room, and then George Karl was hired his son. Coby is the same age as me, and we just became really good friends is being basketball joke as in you know, kinda of coming from a similar background. And we'd we'd you know almost time with the team. And with the coaches, we traveled with the team and just I mean, just overall exposure to the inner workings of. VA from from every angle is definitely benefited me a lot. It was a lot of fun being when I started working just had a at a good grip of of the whole landscape of the MBA. And is just you know, it's something I feel very very fortunate to have had the opportunity to experience so many different things, you know, behind the scenes, so what made you decide to go the route because I mean being around team so much being in the war room. And all that, you know, you could've went the executive route. And since you knew what what tailed what made you decide to go down the agent path. You know? You know, it it wasn't really a long plan. I I had always intended to be either a coach or follow my dad's footsteps. I mean, since you know, the kind of answer your answer, your first question fully is with my of my cousins, you know, the intent was always the work in in the NBA. We wanted to maximize. Our our towns players which didn't didn't take us too far, but we always planned on on fallen our dad's footsteps, and then what happened with me. Specifically is my first job out of college. I was a walk on at Arizona, and I left Tucson to take a summer internship with Wasserman media group, and sort of what my worked a few different hats on this job, and the primary role was I was Dave Eggers assistant coach Dave Eger was G league coach of their delayed coach at the time. And he and I did all of the pre Jeff workouts? And we had great of guys that year. They had let me think about this. It was lamarcus Aldridge Brandon. Roy Sheldon Williams JJ Riddick. Jordan farm are Joel Freeland. I mean, we had I think we have like five six seven, you know, first round pick. And so it was just Dave. And I doing the workouts every day, and then I also was doing some office. And I was I was pretty green at that point never really had a had fulltime job in. So doing office stuff was a little different. And even then I think about being an agent I wanted to be a coach and from there. I I took an assistant coaching position with. Team called beer twos. Below an Italy. And a different agent helped me get that job. Oh, Sam Goldfetter of acceler sports management Puzo Jeff Schwartz partner. I wanted that. And I don't know. I was the young guy just really trying to figure out my place in the world. I knew it was going to be in basketball. But I was still trying to trying to find my way like most most kids, and I just I don't know. I was a little homesick. You know, they had a that a weird deal where they wanted me to stay. But the assign a two year contract and get a coaching license. And it was just it was a little bit of a bigger commitment that I wanted to make at the time and. Long story short. I ended up going to job with with Jeff and Sam and move them back to LA, and then you know, from there the rest was history bounced around a little bit and ultimate in a as an agent on my own having my own company, but it wasn't it wasn't really planned to just kind of happened. And you know, as as we talked about the last time, I was a guest on your show. I over time. I just I wanted to get back closer my roots. And you know, so I just decided last was it last summer summers ago. I gonna make drastic move get out of the agency business. And so that's what I did. And now, I'm doing this about gossip stuff. Yeah. I mean, I think great you guys produce a ton of great content. I enjoy the podcast the articles you have a full draft coverage team. So basically, you guys are covering the NBA draft is like at NBA organization would it's been really cool to see Babcock kinda grow. And it's become really quick. I wanna take a second to thank our sponsor. This episode. Loop site podcast is brought to you by seatgeek dating. Tickets online can be far too complicated. There's hundred decides out there, you don't really know who to trust. That's why seek is the way to go. They pull millions of tickets into one place. So you can easily find this each you want for a price you're willing to pay. There's nothing quite like being there in person and seek edgy to the action for great value. Those your favorite NBA team, your favorite comedian favorite musician. Seek will hook you up by searching. Multiple tickets is in grading every ticket based on value. They help you immediately identify the best fit your budget, plus every single purchase as fully guaranteed. So you don't have to worry about getting ripped off your shopping with confidence with seek. I actually have the Sieg app in my phone. They were one of our earliest sponsors here on the podcast. So I downloaded a long time ago. And I still use it. I use it all the time. I recently bought tickets for my brother-in-law for Tampa Bay Lightning game. I usually give out tickets as gifts, it's a super easy app to use definitely recommend it to you guys. And right now, they actually have a special where if you download the seek app and put the promo code hoops hype. In you, get ten dollars off your first seatgeek purchase. So download the seek app promo code. Hoops site, but just like the site, and you get ten dollars off your first seatgeek purchase. Is there any part of you though that down the road like if a position in front office where to open up we see now more than ever agents like Bob Myers, rod linka lawn. Bobby a lot of agents, you know, make that jump and become executives. You know? Is that something that we may see from you down the road? Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, it's definitely an option that that I'm keeping open I've pursued know some jobs to you know, since since I got out agency business nothing. Nothing. More worthwhile is really presented itself. But I definitely would you know, the sort of interesting there's sort of two parts of me. There's there's the little kid in me that it's like all right? All I wanna do is worth team. It's what I was born to do. It's what I've been kinda groomed to do forever. But then there's the business side of me in the family man, part of me, you know. Family denver. My wife's got a good job. You know, we're we're about to have our second child pretty established. So it's kind of one of those things, you know, the NBA lifestyle at you know, it's it's pretty helter skelter. I mean, a lot of guys have to move quite a bit moving up the ranks. And so I'm I'm I'm staying open minded, I've really like everything I'm doing right now with Babcock coops. I I think it's going to end up lead to to be in a pretty successful. Venture. You know, I it sort of one these juggling acts where I'm just letting sort of options present themselves and kinda taken a day by day. I'm curious now that you've kind of experienced things from so many different perspectives from you know, you've seen what it's like behind the scenes to be GM and run a front office. You've seen the agent side. You've seen the media side. What are the what's the most stressful of those jobs in which one requires the most travel time away from home? How do you kind of compare and contrast those three positions because obviously, you know, when you're media, you're going you're going to ally different events in covering them. When you're a GM, you know, you have a lot of responsibilities and as agent, you're traveling ought to, you know, often you're often going to the same places. I guess if I'm trying to say you're just doing a different job when you get there. But from what you've seen. What's the most stressful of those jobs, and how do they differ the most? Well, I mean as far as stress goes, I would say at GM in an agent stress is probably pretty comparable. I mean, it's a little, you know, the the source of the stress is a little different. But I think you know, I think there's a lot on on G plan. I think there's a lot of agents played in a lot of times. I think the one similarity is. A lot of the things that you're being judged on our out of your control little bit on that. That was that was my biggest frustration as an agent is. It could be is prepared as possible, you know, work my butt off in sometimes I just couldn't control the situation as much as I wanted to with with a player, you know, whether it's you know, where he's drafted or how much money were able to generate and that that led to allow stress I think from travel standpoint, there's all you know, there's a lot of traveling all pretty much all these jobs within sports a a scout. That's that's the hard part of of the scouting part of them. BA is guys on the on the road like crazy, and I I dealt with with my dad kind of moving up the ranks. And now he was gone quite a bit for all the perks. You get to work in the NBA you have to be from your Emily quite a bit. And it's that's you know, that takes a toll on guys for sure. So I want ask you this. What were the most challenging and frustrating? Parts of being an agent. Yeah. Sort of what I just allude to a little bit of, you know, the the, you know, everybody expects you to be able to control everything, and you know, if you do a good job yet, you can influence things, you know. But you really are just a middleman an intermediary between a player in a team or you know, player in a company for marketing deals, and there's only so much agents can do. And so I mean, I think that that's that's the most frustrating part of that business is just not being able to really control everything I think the job security would terrify me. I mean, I'm someone that has a lot of anxiety. And I think just with knowing a player could terminate me at any second and with how common poaching is. And the agent world. I would always be worried. I think you do see that from a lot of agents where they're kind of you know, on guard or paranoid that they're gonna lose their their guy. But I mean, usually it's happened before and they missed out on a huge payday because someone stole their client that they worked, and you know, spent years on developing and trying to get the contract negotiations. So I mean, that's kind of out of your control whenever you're go. Going through the agent process that you have a lot of anxiety or fear about job security whenever you were on. That's things. Yeah. You do. I mean, it's a stressful job all the way round. I could go on and on about the the negatives of it at it. You know, I think thing that that changes with that that scenario specifically is what what is your job specifically and agency business, what's your company set up? You know, I I've worked for a number of different companies. I had my own company at one point in. You know, if you're an agent under a big company, it's probably a little less stressful. When you made it when you're an independent agent, and you're spending your own money on each player, and you know, that you know, the net profits of the company is essentially your net profits that that makes everything a little more stressful. So I mean, I think you know, stress is included in the job, or what it changes, depending on on the, you know, the company setup them. Yeah. That makes sense on a more positive note. What are some of the more rewarding things about the job? You know, the parts that you enjoyed. Yeah. Now, this is an easy one for me. And I really didn't matter the level of the player. You know, didn't need to be an NBA star could have been an international, but the the same the same thing was okay. When it when I recruit a player, and you sit down my my way of going about it was okay, but outlined a detailed plan here. Here's what we do. Here's my role. Here's what I'm gonna do. Here's what you need to do. Here's you know, here's sort of the the trajectory of your career. Now, I think this is going to work for both of us. And when a player would buy in an entrust you in the plan would work it just was, you know? Crazy rewarding. I I it was the best feeling, and I really really enjoyed that part of the business and just unfortunately, you know, that doesn't happen every single time. And then that's that's even I was great agent. But with great agents I've seen it guys will will will lose players. And I know they did a good job. And I felt like that happened to me and number of times. And but you long story short when the plan does work in the player, you know, appreciates you for it. That's just a great feeling of assure. I I bet I'll get more into agents stuff in a second and Babcock coop stuff in a second. But I want to ask about this. You mentioned talking about an agent that, you know, finding a player, and you know, the the plan all working there was a an your dad. It was obviously with Milwaukee is still with Milwaukee in the front office there. So I wanted to ask there was recently this documentary finding Jaanus on TNT, and it was all about how Janas onto the bows agent kind of discovered him in Greece. Brian to the NBA. I was here. I'm curious because your dad does work in the front office in Milwaukee. And you know. This story was about agent finding layer, and then the bucks, you know, doing their homework and getting on us at number fifteen in the draft has a huge steel, y you know, how did the books come to draft him? And you know, because your dad is an position, you know, what was going on behind the scenes at that time. The the way I understand it. How it went down was John Hayman was the general manager of the time. Jeff weltman. I think was Jeff I think Jeff was Jeff was decision. But I think he had he that's spring. He'd left for Toronto remember correctly. The anyway, they had saw they seem Janas practice early in the year. And then my dad, and I were both incidentally, in Italy at the euro Kampen and Theresa Italy, and he left to three days, and I think number of MBA guys went to watch. A play there. Remember that in Europe? They calm friendly games in Europe. But they're they're essentially exhibition games. And that's when my really got to know Jaanus and became back in you know, it was was raving about them to me obvious not to everybody. In the you know in I guess a little step back. You're kind of explain the landscape of how how it comes to, you know, a team taking a guy, so John, hey, experienced MBA guy. You know, he's worked up the ranks within front office work for Joe Dumars. And the difference is with a guy that is a general manager is is primary role as the run the team. So on a day-to-day basis. He's not on the road. Scouting granny does scout. But depends on guys like my dad who was vice president player personnel to know the draft, you know, top to bottom. And so what had happened with Janas is that my dad influence a pretty heavily. Of course, I'm biased and saying that might my dad was the driving force there. I my dad really liked Janas. You know, he understood the draft. Well, thought he earth worth a gamble because with John is there wasn't a whole lot of information. He was playing with his low level team in second. In greece. Which is just you know, beyond, you know, a better level. And there wasn't there wasn't much background information. There there wasn't you know, medical information going around. And so to take him win that were they take him fifteen. I think if the and yeah, it was it was a risk for any player. Regards. How good you've thought he was is just not having all the information on the kid. It was a risk. And so my my dad definitely lobbied the push him into do it. And the whole staff was on board. It wasn't wasn't a deal where is my dad's pig, but you know, there was definitely a little bit of a dicey. You know situations for is. Okay. I is this worth worth the risk. And luckily enough for all them it was into accredit the in for for your own the Dyson. I mean, you know, one of the best players in the league, not the best. Yeah. I think credible. I remember that story. So before I was at hoops hype. I used to write for a website called basketball insiders, and Steve Cuyler was my editor my boss, and he was at that. You're okay. Remember, he he told his story that year, he came home and was saying, yeah, you know, everyone left the gym all the NBA guys were gone. So the media guys were gone, and no one really knew what was happening. And then he said there is this kid that's playing an essentially a YMCA level type league. Like, you're saying it was just absolutely amateur. And, but he had you know, all the physical tools in the idea was, okay. Maybe he's a project. You don't maybe someone takes flyer on him. Then you know, he goes over fifteen in that draft in that draft. If you look back, he doesn't thirteen you know, I I get why he went fifty and just because they're worse will be question marks around him. But that wasn't a great draft class to being Anthony Bennett. Those number one there guys that you know, if you look at guys that went before Jaanus, you know, some of them are already out of the NBA Shabazz Muhammad. Obviously guys like, Trey Burke about around baccalaureate, Alex, Len, you know, there's guys that haven't really been able to find a Michael Carter Williams the guys that have really stuck in one spot. So getting honest, fifty and you know, even more crazy when you look at that draft and see some of the guys ahead of him. But do you think you honest, I guess while we're on topic honest. He's obviously being talked about as a possible MVP candidate this year up there with James harden and Paul George who would you give the MVP award chew as of right now. Well, again, I'm certainly biased on on this topic. Yeah. Definitely give the honest. I mean, they've got it still have the best record in the east. I believe and Yana Yana says the real deal. I really the main reason I love Janas not because my dad was a part of of drafting them. But the I got see, you know, from behind the scenes, you know, how hard this kid worked the, you know, an agent and grown up in the NBA. And you see so many kids get drafted and kind of come into money and sort of change a little bit. And you know, sometimes gets you guys get it. Sometimes they don't with Janas. This kid was the most humble hardworking guy. He is first few years in the leaky, the bucks had a practice facility that was kind of off the beaten apple it wasn't downtown and in a popular area and Janas got an apartment right across the street and pretty much just lived in the gym. I mean, they'd have to kick them out. And you know, of course, this kit containing get better as body at her, you know, everything that he, you know, he did on the floor behind the scenes is what what we're seeing now in you know, he's just such a great influence. You know on the league in general in for like, the younger generations of if you want to be good, you know, put the work in. And so I I'm rooting for him. Because of those reasons, you know, mostly. Yeah, he's a great kid. I did a one on one interview him during his sophomore year. And he's just that he was the most wide, you know, big kid I've ever met, you know, it is super happy super funny. I mean, it was it's been cool watching his transformation from a wide kid. That's just happy to be here to maybe the best player in the NBA. It's pretty crazy. Just watching his confidence grow and him to get more comfortable on and off the court. You know, it's been really awesome to see speaking of the draft. So we just talked about how the draft is inexact science, and you're always trying to evaluate guys. And you know, there are guys that slipped to fifty fifteen who may end up being superstars when you're looking at this draft class thousand nine thousand NBA draft you guys are doing mock drafts. And as I mentioned have your own full draft coverage team, what do you look for when you're evaluating players? Is it, you know? Looking for the most upside, how do you kind of pick your diamonds in the rough or you know, guys other people aren't talking about maybe they should be. You know? I I don't think there's a simple answer there. You know in this year's draft. Specifically, we've got you know, there's about ten guys that I think are sort of like the tier one group within that group. I'm you've got you've got some guys that are are not really proven. But have the upside, you know, guys like Bulbul heaven porter Cam reddish. I mean, you know, any of those through all those Reagan to being stars. But it's a little risky there. Just hasn't been a whole lot of consistent production sperm in the dairy garland whose only played with four or five games on the air. So you definitely look it upside at you look at you know, the Santita pick, and you kind of got away at out. I don't think there's you know, an extreme one way or another look at it. It just got each kid as on isolated basis in compliment when you look at design Williamson verse RJ barrack debate, where do you stand there because I know some people are Jay, and they feel like his game, maybe translate spider to the NBA or translates with more organizations or or systems, whereas I have to build around him. And I know there's been questions about on know with his weight and his size. And what position you play him? At obviously, I think he has enough talent athleticism's a overcome some of those concerns. But you know, what what what are your thoughts on this? I on RJ debate. And who do you have going number one overall? I will Zion. All the way I have been from the start. You know, I think he's a guy. So unique, you know, this this happened early on before the season started as a lot of people were pretty critical on him. Just because you know, he's no centrally what? Six five two hundred eighty pound you know, what position guy? And so I it's from one standpoint it's hard to evaluate him. Because there is you know, you can't really put him in kind of traditional box. You know for me. He's just he just so athletic. I mean, it really doesn't matter. What position you put him in? It was just throw them out there. He kinda fend everybody and make things happen. You know, just by being Zukile force until I I'm Zion all the way RJ's a good player too. I'm not quite as high on him as as some people. I I don't think I don't think it's a want to race between the two of them. Who would you have number two? Then. RJ's right there. But I mean, I think there's there's I and then there's sort of debates with some other guys guy. I saw I saw John Morand last last weekend. I think he's in the mix there. I really liked Ryuhachi Mer from Gonzaga, which he's a little bit more of a safer pick that rather than an upside, you know, read order garland bubble. I mean, there's there's some guys with some serious serious upside know in this year's draft. I think they're all kind of in that same mix will obviously there's there's a lot of information gather on these kids, you know, following season leading up to the draft it it's going to be pretty interesting that the kind of see how that that group sorta shakes out without question, and you mentioned go gathering information, you guys that fantastic article on the importance of Intel in the NBA, and how you know executives agents. Everyone's always trying to gather information, and it's basically traded currency around the league. I don't think fans may realize how much that occurs where you know, Infos being traded how how often. Is that happened? And is there certain until the most valuable? Yeah. I of all my colleague Haber wrote that article he did a really really terrific job. And you know, he's got a lot of experience being a scout in Portland in Charlotte in one of his primary. Roles was gathering Intel and enduring the pre-draft process of of sort of interviewing people doing school visits us. I have a huge huge asset and be able to work with him to to gather some information to answer your question, you know, as far as what Intel is the most valuable. I mean, how we look at. It is you know, it's not necessarily positive or negative information thing, you know, in one specific category. It's pretty much any information that allows us the paint the full picture on a player in thinking from from a team standpoint. Whatever information that leads you to either draft a player or to pass on a player, that's the most valuable information. And so every kid that the most valuable information is is completely different. And so that's why you gotta look at it on a case by case base. As far as valuated, his talent on the floor in kind of looking at the, you know, background type stuff, you know, just to get the full picture. And you know, what your sign up for with these young guys? And I think that's what they were at similar from an agent standpoint to a executive standpoint where you're breaking down, you know, the players game, obviously. But you also while earned as much as you can about them off the floor and gathered information, and that's why you know, not only do executive trade info but agents do as well, they they talk to the media. They talked anyone that has any kind of info. So I find that so interesting, but I want to ask you that, you know, when you were an agent, and you you had to kind of recruit players and figure out who you're, you know, represent how much time did you spend evaluating players when you were an agent, and how did you go about deciding who you would pursue because I know I've talked to some agents who say they won't go after guys that have, you know, character issues than it's just not worth it for them because they don't want to be putting out fires all the time. Other guys, you know, they'll take a risk on a guy that they have red flags because the potentials there and they can make a ton of money down the road. How did you evaluate the players? You were going to represent and what decisions did you have to make you know, based on the things that you learned about them. You know, again, it's you know, I I would take on a case by case basis. Look at every every player is its own unique investment. And so, you know, same same as what we're doing. Now where we're looking at each Blair and kind of break in and seeing you know, what what's the risk was to reward. And just making good decisions, you know, player by player, and you know, as an agent a lot of it. You know, my role's changed with whatever company set up by head. If I was with a big money and all they wanted was upside NBA guys those guys on targeting and be would be willing to take a little bit more risk. And it's it was a little easier for me when I'm being directed on what type of player to go and get more kind of risk. They're comfortable with. Whereas when I had my own company, I was a one man got a one man show sort of sort of an independent agent running my company now spending my own money. And so I'm kinda looked at thing a little different differently from a business standpoint. And I I was. Much more conservative in. So I kind of took the approach of aren't I don't I don't necessarily need to take a ton of risk. But I do want to turn a profit and every single player that I'm representing her, or at least hope to it's all again, you know, just a sort on on the pros and the setup you have. So that's again, that's sort of what we're doing. Now, you know as far as putting together as mock draft evaluating these players, it's a similar approach to what I did. It's agent. Okay. Make sense one thing I find interesting. I I wrote a number of different articles on you know, the agent world. Whether it was how they prepare for free agency how they prepare for the trade deadline. You know, crazy stories from behind the scenes, and actually, you know, I talked to you for number that articles requoted in them one thing, I found it really interesting is a lot of the agents were talking about how much the profession has changed and how you know their specific job responsibilities changed from the time. They got into the industry to where it's at now. You know, how much did the agent world and your job specifically change from when you started to when you got out of the game. Yes. So it might my first year working in the business when I did that intern ship. It was two thousand six and then I was, you know, pretty a fledged working in the agency business in two thousand seven in in what I think it is already started. But you know, what sort of continued to evolve from what I heard from from some of the the, you know agent more veteran agents at that time is that before then what had happened was a lot of a lot of the head coaches at schools had a lot of influence and players, and they'd have relationships with for example of David fog, hip, aren't telling me of these bigger name guys for from the nineties, and you know, before my time that would have relationships with the big big name guys. Roy Williams Dean Smith, you know, Thomson at Georgetown, and the head coaches would set up the agent selection meetings, and they invited two or three of their their agents that they knew and you know, that the player would select the agent. From there. And so it kind of was a much simpler cut and dry type process. Whereas when I got in I think, a you coaches in these assistant coaches that were on staff for recruiting purposes got more involved, the shoe companies gradually got more involved in. It was just you know, a situation where all these issues that we're dealing with now with FBI investigation and whatnot. They just kept getting worse and worse. I mean, I think that that all that's system before. But it just it just got in Vanuatu. And and it's at the point now where I think though, the leads come of popped off. Yeah. Now that makes that's good answer. I think anyone's kinda watched it from behind the scenes it's been clear that things are getting worse, and you know, more money being thrown around, and it just kinda crazy there for a bit. I also I think a lot of people turned a blind eye to it. So a lot of people thought. Okay. This is fine. And I almost have to do this in order to keep up with competition. So it got pretty ugly there that actually leads next question. Whenever you were working in that industry. You know, you hear stories of agents, and, you know, people talk about certain agents that are, you know, doing things the wrong way or they're kind of sleazy. Sometimes you hear stories about agent kind of looking out for themselves as opposed to the player, you know, for example. I remember one agent was being criticized because he basically convinced a relatively big name player to go overseas rather than take a deal in the NBA because the overseas deal was more, and he would have gotten he would have received ten percent of the of the deal instead of four percent. Do you see that often where agents are looking out for themselves and are kind of doing things in a sleazy way? Was that hard to kind of be around. Yeah. I mean, the industry industry's got fundamentally a number of issues that that you know, put agents in in bad spots. And so I think a lot of on of bad habits sort of come from that just with how the industry is set up. And then I, you know, I think the job attracts a certain personality too. So we we do have some sleaze balls running around, you know, as far as what you're talking about with an MBA deal at four percent and ten percent of these. I mean, there's a number of different scenarios that could be in play. I think the most common would be a player that is playing in Europe or overseas that has an international agent involved. And you know, how this works. A lot of the time is that a player coming up in in Europe will have an agent in in in that Ray the local base agent. And then that agent will have a collaboration with an American based NBA agent her agency and they have different setups. As far as how they split up the pie with agent fees. But a lot of times if that agent had the player growing up, you know, he's entitled to all of the fees in Europe. And so you run into a number of conflicts of interest between the agents on the back. And that's that's where things get a little little located that that's one that's one pretty common scenario that I think players overseas deal with but yeah, no, it's it's an ugly business. I mean, there's there's a lot of there's a lot of willing. Dylan going on. And you know, bizzare some of the reasons I got out of the business. Yeah. It seems like, you know, I'm not there. Obviously. There are good agents to their guys out there that you know, do things the right way. And they aren't breaking the rules and stuff, you know, they're they're every industry. You can have certain guys that are sleazy and kind of doing things, you know, doing things wrong way. But so I don't wanna get song every agent does that, but you do see of course, I do see the bit the player agent relationships. Really interesting to me, you know, there are a lot of players who are really really close with their agent, especially if they got discovered by them, and you know, they've the agent kind of found them and help them make it to the NBA there. Also, some guys who don't have a close relationship with their agent, and it's kind of more of a business deal business, dealing can you describe what that relationship between the player agent is like and how important that is? Because I feel like a lot of things we're talking about whether it's, you know, the guy being poached by different agency or the trust would you know, when you're negotiating a contract. And you know, the agent is advising the guy where to go all these. Things come back down to the player agent relationship. And how important that is? Yeah. I think I mean for me personally, I've had a number of relationships on both ends of the spectrum. I've got some guys that I'm still really close with that are like family members, I have gone to their weddings. And and you know, we're we're close, and I've had other players that I represented where I was essentially due their contracts in at find them a deal, you know, advise them on their own, you know, negotiate the contract, and it was it was a pretty at arm's length type of relationship. I think one thing that I've noticed, you know, especially now being out outside of the business. I have a good relationship with a number of agents, the friends with and everybody talks about, you know, best friends with all my clients. I think what happens is, you know, all these agents are constantly sort of, you know, campaigning for new clients and trying to make it look like they're they're situations better than anybody else's. It's it's not uncommon for you know, guys to represent players that they don't. Even really like that much minute. That happens quite a bit. I mean, especially early on an players careers. You know expectations are all over the place. And you know, a lot of these guys can be hard to to deal with and know agents are, you know, having to deal with a lot of tough business decisions. You know, because of the instability of the things you're talking about with these guys be able to fire fire agents at any time. And I don't know it's it's it's a tough. It's a tough business. But if you are able to get through some of these things, and you represented play a long time, you'll have time the these relationships are real. So you kind of see both both the spectrum like mention there are there are also situations where you know, an agent or guys camp will be criticized for not doing things the right way. There's been talk about Anthony Davis. And you know, his camp he has Rick Paul has agent who also presents the brawn James. So it's interesting because there's you know, some people are looking at that and thinking, okay, you know, there's kind of a conflict of interest there. Some people say no that's going to be what's best for Davis because he'll get to team up with abroad, potentially. You know in you know, have. An inside track to LeBron and Beal talk to Ron and all that. But I I'm curious what your thoughts are on the whole situation. Cleveland Jabbar came in the podcast, and he says that he said re Rich Paul anti-gay is a camp have already mess things up. That was his wording. He said that he felt like they should've kept things private that they shouldn't have made their trade request. When they did in the middle of the season. What are your thoughts on how this where the Anthony Davis was handled in if you put yourself in Rich, Paul shoes? How would you have handled it if you were a agent? Well, there there's a few things there to address me. I first of all I mean with with just the clutch sports management or their names called that setup. I mean, you know, there's there's a lot of conversations going on around the league of you know, if that whole setup is a conflict of interest. You know, not not just this deal with Anthony Davis in the Lakers is just I mean, you know, everybody's impression is that. The LeBron essentially owns the company, or at least, you know, is flu influential to a point where I mean, he he's like a power player in the league. And that's just I mean, fundamentally, that's that's a problem. I I don't have enough information on the talk more than that. But you know, that's that's one part of it is just is clutch issue is with Anthony Davis civically I've ever had. I've read all the stuff, you know, on hopes. I have been everywhere. It's different different interviews. I think the one thing that that's really hard to you know, really judge the situation as we we don't know what's going on. That conversation between Davis rich ball Xanthi Davis really want. I mean, I know you came out saying, okay? Boston's on the list all these teams are options is real though. You know, I I don't know. And so I think depending on what Anthony Davis is sane to rich or early. You said if it were me representing the kid, you know, it depend on what the what would Anthony Davis wants in. What what's real? And what's not? So it's hard to give a real clear answer as far as how I I would proceed, you know. It's just I think, you know, as far as what's been released in the media. You don't know what's real one thing. I would ask you to is if you're in charge of the NBA and NBP for a day. What changes would you implement to make life easier for agents or to fix certain problems that you dealt with when you were still working as an agent. I think I I don't necessarily have the answer. I think the the issues I would look at the most right off the bat would be the agent selection process for for kids coming out of college. You know, sort of to kind of give you lay the land of how how it works is. You know guy will finish up school in will meet with a number of agents in. There's there's a few things that are always discussed in in these these these agent interviews, and you know, that the talk about okay, you know, they're they're done with school. There's no scholarship coming in aware where they gonna live in where they're going to train in. You know, I need pocket money in new who's who's paying for all this and who's providing the money? And so, you know, not not that there's a lot. There's that. There's not, you know, sophisticated business plans being talked about the there are but fighting the financial vit- is such a big big part of it of player selected his agent. And I just think that is so backwards. I think I think. Players that are I mean, essentially what you know, two three four months away from being millionaires. They should not be making decisions on who's representing them based off money at all. And again. You know, what the solution is there? But I know that's a problem because players need need guys that are you know, that they could trust that are prepared. And they need to prioritize those things rather than you know, who's gonna make them most comfortable for for a couple of months now. That's a great point. And I think that would if you fix that problem. Then maybe you, you know, help agents down the road to because I feel like a lot of times whenever guys fire that first agent that they have it's because they didn't get to know them. Very, well, they did just pick them because they were offering you know, the biggest credit line. So maybe that, you know, actually lead to some more long term relationships between the player agent because it was a good fit for more reasons than just you know, the money. That's a good answer. Last question for you. Is there anything new that we should be on the lookout for with Babcock hoops? Yeah. You know? I mean the college season wrapping up. I mean, we're really looking to pump up our draft coverage. And so we're we're going to be doing a number of different things as far as you know. Extensive video breakdowns were actually gonna launch another podcast of it's gonna be the Babcock hoops podcast, which I'm gonna host on. We may actually launch a third eventually, and is just going to a lot of things that we've been doing but just kind of them up quite a bit. How are you? Join this. I mean early on whenever you were kind of making the transition over to the media side things you, and I were talking a little bit about the process and everything's that you would need now that you've gotten to experience in it. And you're doing the podcast, you're writing how're you enjoying this. Oh, it's been great. You know? I mean, you know, some of the back end stuff with the media has been a little tedious. That's that's you know, there's been a little bit of a learning curve on that. But you know, as far as, you know, everything I'm doing I'm really kinda created credit role for myself to just do exactly what I what I love the do. I'm traveling going to college games evaluating players, you know, networking with with guys within the industry, and, you know, the part of it's really really just a vehicle to to kind of get some exposure on everything that we're doing, and and and it's just a fun of, you know, fun outlet to be able to share some stories and kinda felt I after doing some of the writing for Sports Illustrated, which were very business heavy, you know, now having my own outlet to kind of do what I want with it. It's sort of fun to kinda share some personal stories with with my unique background, you know, being a kid grownup grown up in the NBA and everything and just really just really love and everything I'm doing and and just come to take a day by day. And and join him you guys are doing a great job. It's been really fun to read out recommend everyone. Go check out. Babcock coops dot com. Make sure if all in that on Twitter at Matt Adcock eleven I think our audiences are very similar because at hoops, we don't just have like surface level fans. They want the deep die hard behind the scenes information. And we tried to give you know, give them that kind of stuff with the long forums and different things that we do. And then you obviously because you have guys that worked in the NBA, and you obviously have your extensive experience, you can kind of cover things in a different way that other people can't. So I think we have a similar audience here. And I want people to check out your say. So again, I'll say it again Babcock loops dot com and follow him on Twitter at bat nap cock eleven mad. They switch. You're doing this, man. Things very appreciative. He up the great work. And if you guys wanna listen to their episodes of the hoop site podcast. Check us out. I tune Stitcher audio boom, anywhere your favorite podcast can be found. And until next time. Thanks for listening. The stylized lounge presents an evening with the progressive box. Let's go tickling the ivories. He just saved. By bundling home and auto progressive gonna finally by a ring for that gal of yours Hugo send condolences. This. Nice treat. There's. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates. Discounts on available in all states or situations.

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147: The ALL-INCLUSIVE Tournament w/ Steve Forbes & Robbie Hummel

Jeff Goodman Basketball Podcast

50:50 min | 2 months ago

147: The ALL-INCLUSIVE Tournament w/ Steve Forbes & Robbie Hummel

"Am I welcomed in another edition of The Good and Plenty podcast? I'm joined here by Wake Forest coach Steve Forbes and walk ins Robbie Hummel and forms. You look like you've done like seven or eight Zoom calls today. Well, you guys are young. Okay when I was a kid Zoom was a PBS TV show. Okay, like Zoom came on after Sesame Street. And so I'm completely zoomed out today's are quote unquote off today. And so that means we have jam-packed zoom meetings and the first one other day started off with some fireworks and then just kind of to that was just down a built from there. So hey glad to end the day on the the good and the plenty some more firework savour fireworks, All right. So we go through go through for Robin. What that that call that a cc you're the new guy on the Block right? You got K. You got Roy you got Bay Haim thought you miss Pitino. I mean you could add that full quartet there. But but you got the the trio. What was this? Like did you have any idea of what today's call was going to be like when the news came out? You guys were unified then everybody. We're going to be all inclusive with the NCAA tournament going to have six hundred teams in the NCAA tournament. Now we're going to 347 team is the proposal that Coach K and you guys came up with today. No, it is start out like that actually started out with some proposals that are coming up here pretty soon as far as when the seasons going to start allegedly or you know, we hope and some NCAA waiver proposals and some on some hours care hours just you know, some things of that nature and then a lot of times and it just just kind of open it up to And whoever wants to speak and you know, I mean I gotta be honest with you. I mean I've been on these since May one and you think about who I've been on these calls with it's very informed Advantage very thought-provoking and and and honestly, I've never really got off that phone kind of went man. I didn't make any sense. I'll be honest with you everything that I've heard for the last month or months. I was really been spot on him. And so you just came up, you know, it's been discussed before about Maybe having everybody make the tournament but but the reason why it came up was because it had some momentum in a meeting with I think Coach K and took other coaches in the league and a couple of ladies in our end our commissioner were all for it. And so the discussion began and only and only reason why I wheeled towards me Thursday just asked me, you know, rightfully. So how my feelings other last year when we were Thirty and four and made the tournament and didn't get in and then get a play-off and you know, it's awful, you know, awful feeling awful for the seniors offer for the kids and didn't get a place not their fault, you know, so I think you know, they didn't have anything to do with money and you do with you know, saving people's jobs, which I didn't look at it. That way. I looked at a more like this isn't an unprecedented time. Sometimes you do unprecedented things and so long Genuinely just felt like maybe this was a year take the pressure off and give the players the incentive of being able to okay, you're going to get a plane. It's Army no matter what the regular season looks like and we have to be honest with ourselves. We don't know what the regular season to look like. You know, if the sound well, we're going to get a plate 26 games. We may not, you know, we met play 18 depends on covid-19. Dona quarantine depends on a lot of things and so are we going to play non-conference? I don't know. I can't answer that. I think a lot of you know, there's a lot of talk about bubbles. I don't think that's I don't know how realistic that is because I don't know how many teams are really going to play in that when it really comes down to it. We're spending $75,000 a week on Kolb test and just here at Wake Forest. Are we going to jeopardize that by going somewhere where they where the there's no protocols or there's very few. I don't think so. And so I don't know. And what was your reaction force? When was it Kate who brought it up first and then kind of you went around the zoom room and everybody voted. I mean Coach K talked about Kevin keatts. Who's there for the meeting Tony Bennett mean everybody talk behind Brownell Chris Matt me who else learn a real tall boy Royal. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah coach Hamilton didn't say a whole lot today, but he's always very engaged. So yeah, I mean birth. And I mean it kind of took a life of its own Mike Bray spoke a lot migrate talked about which I wasn't aware of that they'd already been kind of been asked by the radiator kind of work on a bracket off, you know, see how that looked. I'm not that smart. So I wouldn't even think about trying a 340 16 bracket for 2018 bracket. I don't I don't know. I'm a history degree. How much can figure it out don't work almost from but he went to Purdue. I mean, I mean I mean, but you know, you know, so then it came to okay should we should do you know one, you know One release one one statement one statement and then it kind of came out. Well, we just do our home, you know, and so it's just all so we would and you know, I think Chris was first maybe I was second and then just kind of You know went on from there and I mean honestly a lot of people just lost the mind over and I was kind of like it's just an idea. You know, I mean, I may end of the world here, you know, I got a role in a tournament and nobody said not one time in a mink anybody say we need to do this forever, but it's just this is unprecedented and I said it last year, you know this cuz you have me on I want in my seniors to get another your eligibility. Yep, because I thought it was unprecedented. I just wanted to get that chance. I didn't happen, you know, and so there's a lot of smarter people than me. They'll try to figure all this out. But at least we're talking about it, right we're talking about the tournament. I think that's what more than anything else really wanted and I don't really believe in my heart that the those Hall of Fame coaches in our league are going to ever do anything that's proposed things to really hurt our game. Or you know her college basketball. I just don't believe that I think they have the game. I think they have the best interests of the game. Rob what do you think? What do you like the idea of 346 teams finding the NCAA tournament? I mean, I'm from Indiana. So you look at you know, what the the single class in DMV high school basketball term used to be just the greatest High School tournament there ever was talked to anybody who lives there though. Tell you right? So in that regard, I think it's intriguing. I also think from a coronavirus virus standpoint. It kind of makes some sense on one point you look at and say, all right. You have a team. Let's throw out Western, Illinois. Let's say West Illinois am having a tough year. They're Five and Twenty. The players are going to be like man. I'm going out. I don't care. I'm not we're not making the tournament. This gives them a reason to maybe not do that because you can be a thing that says, hey we can make a run here still now doesn't mean they're going to they're eighteen to twenty-two year-old kids up to the ministership. It's telling me it's going to happen. But I think that makes sense and then also dead. You're going to have teams that probably get kids sick. And if you're looking at from a resume perspective that stuff for head coaches, if you've got a quarantine players or someone that gets not even 6 exposed and you're coaching Francia tournaments in the in the normal time. Where that is evaluated as a successful year not now that does start to mess with people's jobs. So I don't really hate it. Like I really don't I think that you can make it work and then you could regionalize it. So that seems could could bubble like early odds wage. Yeah, like do politics Forbes Avenue right now. No, I think it makes a lot of sense. Honestly be fun to watch too during have some crab games. There's there's no doubt. There will be horrible games in the early part of the tournament, but that's fine. I think it's a terrible idea telling you that in Robbie. We live in a different time and you went to college and when I woke College and I'm sitting there going through with my players. Okay, and I feel formal in a way. I mean, they get the rod jammed up their nose a couple of times a week. They can't go dead parties. They got a social distance. They can't even hang out with their teammates in the locker room. We can't even have a a catered team meal. You know, we got a social. I mean there's so many things are not normal about a college experience going on right now now, we're lucky because we're here we're and we're excited about that. But I would just like to give them the opportunity to have a nice carrot, you know that because it's exactly what you said. Listen, we may only play 20 games. Who knows. I mean, we might just play Converse games. I mean a lot of schools a lot of these may do that and then what happens if you get off somebody gets quarantined in the middle of it and you missed four games. Now, you played sixteen, you know, if you're a 24. You played, you know twenty. I don't know. I I think there's so many things off. So we just don't know that I wouldn't want to be on how would you like to be on the I going to be on the committee making those decisions when you just okay your decisions made for you this year? I probably like let's go man. I don't got to do. I mean last year. I went into the counters Championship 29 and 4 and people were telling me we needed to win or we were going to get in come on home. You know what I mean? So don't get don't go on the wrong person to be talking to about you know, well, you know, we need to play it on Congress games. Come on, man. It's all just worried. Listen. I'm for it. Like I'm okay with it. I just feel like we go to 96 we go to 3:46, whatever you want to do. I'm good with the only thing I would say is twofold one. Are you increasing the risk off? Yeah rather than playing with 68 or 60 14. Obviously, you're having you're adding almost three hundred teams to the mix now. Hopefully things are better come March dead. You've got you know quick rapid effective cheap testing. Maybe we do maybe we do. So I think still the tournament to me. I'm not sure we got to worry about the tournament today. I think you gotta worry about the regular season today. That's the part. I'd start with I know K said let's work backwards in a story in with Daniel has been on that the whole time coach has an unwavered on that about working back homes knowing what the term it is. When is it? What are the parameters but how do you know when it is towards until you know what the regular season is going to look like? I think you gotta decide when one of the one of those TV want to CVS say maybe it's just when we're going to happen, you know, it probably is I don't have any listen it makes it makes a little bit of money for them. As long as it doesn't interfere with a master's. Wow. You pretty much can move everything else right? I mean it's going to it's going to do better ratings than anything else you're going to put on and in April. I mean, I think yep. Yeah, I mean I think before you have the term, you're going to have to quarantine no matter what. I mean, I I'm under the mindset that no matter what their sixty-eight teams are three hundred teams. We're going to quarantine before we go. We're not going to just drag it there. I mean there won't be team's will go. I mean, I don't think press you gotta realize now. We have five thousand students around campus and things off relatively going very well right now for us. Do you think our president is going to allow us to drag that back? I mean, there's more important things than than basketball. There's all these kids going to school here. So that's what I think a lot of people aren't taking that into consideration, you know, when we're talking about Bubbles and this and that. I mean, we're not we're not dead. I mean, maybe I maybe I'm wrong but but I'll be surprised and and I think with the Instinct tournament, I'd be shocked if we didn't have to quarantine at some point before we go home. Be surprised shocked. Yeah, just going to be interesting again, you know between the risk and then the financial part of it for the NCAA, you know the cost of testing the cost of potential travel and again took some Rob what you can do. Certainly you can do it where you're regionalize it. So teams aren't getting on a plane for the first however many rounds. I just think there's a lot of hurdles to clear for something that being and and I talked to a source a couple of weeks ago from the NCAA and they said and I tweeted this earlier. We're much more likely to go to 6:32. Then we are to expand now maybe that changes with the power of of K and Roy and and behind if you get Calipari and all the listen my thoughts on that is why not try to get everybody together because let's face it most coaches are going to be in favor of this because it's it's potentially going to save their job. To get him another NC double a tournament appearance. You know who you can't I mean absolutely you're absolutely right. You gotta be an idiot to be against it as a comb because not only is it help you but it helps your kids, but that's see that's the thing. I mean, I think you know, we all get caught up in us our jobs and whatever but it's really truly. It's about those kids and and giving them something you know, you say well that's what the Commerce tournaments for what we don't even have a I don't know what people get covid-19 to play college tournament. We going to play, storm in front of fans. Probably not, you know, and where you going to play it, you know, how you going to do it and listen, it's just unprecedented endless. I'm pretty strong. I got tweeted out today. Nobody said we gotta get that passed today if I mean, come on man, we just Just trying to give people they got everybody on board. That's my take like just the ACC was cool that you guys were unified. But man if you had done it, right you might have been able to get everybody all 32 leagues and then we'll talk to somebody in a big town later leaked it to you and no doubt. I thought of that. Of course, you're right next to me during the meeting man. Come on down even go to you wouldn't return my damn text. I had a 10 minutes earlier employer. Oh, you know, that's the problem. You can't do that. If you want anything secretive. I thought I completely thought about Europe too bad, but it's kind of like let's get it out. Cuz this is gonna then we don't have control of it. We don't you know, hey, here it is. We're listening. Everybody's listening. It's like I said, nobody today was like man, it's better get past tomorrow, you know, come on man. I mean, it's something wrong. Well to think about about think about sure Rob, how do you do this? What if if you're running college hoops. Now, how do you how do you make sure this gets off the ground? And we played a twenty five games this year? Cuz honestly, I think everybody would sign up. If you said hey we can get 18 conference games twenty conference games and a half dozen non-conference. See the bubble like for the NBA Works cuz you're on a huge campus. You can golf you can fish you can do it's warm if you're going to bubble in cold weather package is like let's say the Big Ten bubbles in Annapolis. You can stick these kids in the JW Marriott for like two months and be like, hey just chill in here. No can't do that. So like off my thought is like short and this would you would need like effective rapid testing for sure to do this, but like short-term bubbles like have like these men that kind of non-conference tournaments wherever where you can go for two or three weeks. But again, you're coming back to campus like like code form said like now you're endangering your student population if she somehow I guess the good thing is is that we've seen Didn't Pro Sports you can mitigate the spread of this you can bubble and you can stop it from being transmitted. But I think with the expense of the testing that's really a concern with us in a perfect world like in a perfect covid-19. Doing what you said, but just starting right away with conference games. So we have we have a cushion. When something happens that we can make those games up and we're all have the same protocol in our league and I think that's you know, you know, that's where I think the non-turbo is in Jeopardy now, maybe not for the whole country right my mom, but I'm speaking, you know for okay it right for its some leagues you think are not going to sign off on non-conference games and going through a bubble and coming back to campus or certainly bringing anybody through your campus. I don't think I think there will be some teams that will not do that. I can't speak for him. But just, you know being in the business for 32 years and having a lot of friends and listening to coaches. I it's I mean, I I kind of get a chunk of those texts is one tweet. Some people say, you know, there's 16 major Conference teams going to this who right I mean dog No, I don't. I mean you got the ivy league is not play until January. I don't know what the Pac-12 and is doing. I mean, you know, we have us and the Big Ten and the way I mean, I don't know. I mean nobody really knows but nobody is definitely saying that we're going to be playing these now, I have not heard that but I have heard a lot of talk about, you know, playing the games now, maybe we can do both but you know, like for instance the other day, it was kind of frustrating to me and the coaches in our league that it came out that okay. We're going to push for I think I talked to you about this November 25th, but you can still play 31 games. Come on can't you can't play three one games and done November 10th barely thought I mean, I guess I guess the only way you could Ford's is if you're not traveling in you're in a bubble and you can play maybe three games in a week instead of to play every day. I mean come on the NBA back to back spring brought to college. You have to call my boy nurse. I'm see how to handle that. I don't know used to that. I mean, I don't know, you know, it's it's one of those things. I'd I think we'll try and hard to figure it out and get ahead of it. But there's going to be some things. I don't know if we're going to know, you know until we get down to it. And and how do you put together a all have a non-conference schedule? But how do you do it? You know how you you have right now right now in your non-conference schedule if it goes it will remember 25th, if we start November 25th, I thought well, I would lose five games. Yeah, so I would be it I think 26 Cuz we get 20 League games. I think I think I'd be a twenties. I think as we get 31 with the empty. I think I'd be a 26. I think I counted that to that counted back, you know, so, you know. Depends again and you know what guys Robbie and whatever it might not even be illegal. It might be an Institutional decision, right? Maybe maybe my President says doctor has said you're not going to somewhere or you are going there, but you're not going there, you know. I don't know. I also look at like State travel bans. Like if you're right now and you're going to go to Wisconsin, like if if the University Illinois is playing at Wisconsin warranty reports need my mom was distraught. She lives in Lone Tree Iowa. Yes, I grew up in Iowa Hawkeye. My brother went to the Wisconsin Dells last weekend. I thought she was going to have a major meltdown on my brother who's in a cabin isolated, you know, Wisconsin Dells, but she told me you not supposed to go to Wisconsin. Yeah. I didn't know that but I understand you get it. I mean, I don't and it may it's not going to be just Wake Forest. It's going to be the state law like that. That's a that's a state government or a city government. That's all right, cool. Let me so I mean there's a lot of things that we don't and won't control, you know, as far as like we're going to play College GameDay here this weekend against Clemson with no fans dead. No, I don't get to go hang out with course on Irby street. I'm depressed. You can't even go to the game. Nothing or you going nothing. You can't even you gotta watch it from home. Like the rest of us. Are you watching at the drive-in theater package? We're having a social distancing watch party at the drive-in Course. Robbie doesn't know about driving and now they're popping up all over Chicago know all over the place here. All right. Cool. Yeah. I mean, that's my only shot man his drive-in theater, but I probably watch it right here till house can the Guinness Book of World Records? Give 2020 world's greatest delay-of-game, even though Sports had a break your business. Didn't you have to keep moving and that makes hiring even more important than ever indeed is here to help indeed.com is the number one song in the world because indeed get you the best people and they do a fast unlike other sites and E gives you full control and payment flexibility over your hiring you only pay for what you need. You can pause your account at any time and there are no long-term contracts plus indeed provides powerful tools to make your sorts of that much easier. Like sponsored jobs, which is shown to be three and half times more likely to result in a higher with 73% of of online job Seekers visiting indeed. Each month indeed is going to get you the entire you need just like they have for over 3 million businesses right now indeed is offering our listeners a free $75 credit to boost your job post which means more quality candidates will see it and we'll see it fast try and eat out with a free $75 credit at indeed.com good. This is their best offer available anywhere else. So right now to indeed.com good terms and conditions apply offers valid through September 30th. Well, I can't believe that that the chiefs were reporting this on on Wednesday night after your boy Nick nurse just forced the game seven with the with the Celtics, but how about the Chiefs? I didn't even realize this so like nobody else in the NFL is really have advanced this weekend for the most birth. But the Chiefs are having like 15,000 or something. I don't know like twenty percent. I think it's crazy. I mean, I just think it's dumb flat out dumb and irresponsible to start that way like most teams are starting whether it's college football, whether it's the NFL with like we're going to try like two games. Let's try it out with no pants. Like isn't that just like common-sense guys? Well, I'm not going, you know, I won't be there and I like the Bears game a couple of weeks. Well, so entertaining will probably go the Patriots quarterback situation. I can't stand the Patriots. Let's say yeah, I mean you you were crying in your day of college jerseys and I don't even go down with I told them that it before the game or up and on it. I'm the biggest Andrew Toney fan in Boston it ever okay grew up a huge Sixers fan. I am a Jayson Tatum guy. Yep. He knows that again it again. What are your thoughts on what he's been doing? Here? He is so talented but hate him hate him. He cries too much. First of all, like he's never going to get a call back cuz he thinks he's already thirty-two and he's earned all these calls and it can and he watches everybody else and I can't even I can't watch I can't walk somebody three months is like Elementary level screw up awful Campbell was bad tonight defensively at the end. No Jayson Tatum those frustrating cuz he'll make to like big time plays the way that double overtime but do like six dumb things. Yeah, like I don't I mean Jaylen Brown same same type of thing. He'd be great one night great, you know terrible the next Thursday and I've said this Nick nurse and I'm not saying this cuz Forbes is on any kind of grew up with Nick. He was my pick for Coach of the Year easy what he did with that group this year and those two little girls Can guards who are tough and shit? I mean they are lower, you know Fred he coached Fred. So you're never going to get forces gushing. The comedy should have known nurse in Fred is like Forbes. Just wet dream. Okay, I don't know if I can say that I did. I mean, I mean first of all these amazing young guys are small as they are are playing together. Nobody would ever thought that was possible and then tonight he's got pussy Gatto be playing a five or Pascal. I mean, they're cheesy home. She wears short passes the test needs dunking it and you're like come on and I didn't get to watch much cuz I was zooming but I did see the last 3 minutes and then the whole time and hey man, they just toughed it out. I just it's just resiliency. And I do think they have a big like they have a great connection among themselves. I think that's what next month. One of his biggest strengths mean he's obviously a really good coaching. He's a little bit of a Riverboat Gambler or many conventional and you're not afraid to throw a box of one or a triangle into or a trapezoid country. I don't know but but he's connected to the players and if he if you got that you got a chance, right and in this day and age, especially I think was cool that he comes from such an unconventional place. Like I used to watch a lot of video games when I was playing in Russia because my high school teammates Scott moir who's an assistant named now, he was playing a new Castle, his team. So I watch the Newcastle the Eagles like all the times. What am I going to do in Moscow right in a player-coach name is Fab Florida. I think he took the rafters now, they usually bring an icon in English basketball. I got all these video games and I would laugh so hard because Scouts girlfriend at the time. Her dad was the color guy the announcer and he he'd be doing these games. I watch everyone he'd be like, oh, you know, we we all remember the Battle of Life stir like he was talking about like the Jordan Flu Game right legs. It's like dude like I have no idea what this guy's I think it's cool that he comes from a different place than most head coach the NBA do know, it's a It's The Road Less Traveled know and and and we we had that moment together really we were in a dorm room, you know camp in Canton st. Joseph, Missouri right outside where the Chiefs play and there's a bunk bed. And yeah, I was probably on the bottom cuz I'm a little heavier than him and we just kind of had that moment, you know where I said, you know, I'm going to leave where I was at a new coach. Barton County Community College and he said well, I'm going to leave you know, where he was at. I'm going to go back overseas and cuz I want to coach in the NBA someday. And so okay. So we just went off, you know, every summer. We you know, we meet up. I've called many of those hotels in in Manchester and Derby and you know Brighton or east coast and talk to him on the phone and and then once summer he called me say I was going to start a that time of day League team to how energy and I think I'm going to run up and he knew he got some investors against Jerry Crawford and some people and they're they go and about two or three years later they win the title and then he goes to Rio Grande. Anyone's it again. And then Colangelo son was the GM of the members. First name is GM of the Raptors at that time. I come down and watch him Coach. I think fifteen games in a row something like that and he called me I almost blew it for him. He called me cuz I missed her social media. He called me and said say I'm I'm going to get I'm going to be assistant coach the rappers and he was getting frustrated because he wanted to be in the NBA, you know, it's hard. I mean he put all this time in and wasn't getting any breaks and one a couple of thousand dollars and and I said, you know, it's awesome. I'm going to be doing cases system. So I go right on Facebook. Hey. Congratulations Nick nurse. Mom calls me. What are you doing? It has a dead dead and I'm like, you know, so and then he just you know, hey, you know, I've been there. I've been I've taken over one job. Did you go or head coach got fired? And I got the job. On these, you know, I'm easy, but we won you know and and and you know, I know it wasn't easy time for him. And then what what I'm capable situation to get Kauai and do a great job with him and when the title and then lose him, you know, and I'm talking to him on the phone and he's in the hotel require inquires upstairs and he thinks he come back and then there's not, you know, and and then to do what he did this year with his team pretty remarkable if he asked me but it's just like Robbie Hall Moon me. He's Small Town Iowa dude loves basketball and you know studied the game and and and it's not offensive, you know, not afraid to to to try some things. I think most people aren't willing to do. Hey, Rob, you ever go against Kauai when you were in the league. Yeah, so when I was in Minnesota, I started like the last like six games in my rookie year and we're we're playing the Spurs and it's like, you know, Duncan Parker Ginobili and Kawhi Leonard's coming off his career-high at that time like 29 and this happened multiple times in this game like three games stretch where I was I would go off like the pre-game meetings thinking I'm going to definitely nice and I like rob you got koala leather not much else like it would be perfect for me to guard Danny Green tonight. Right? Like he's going to shoot threes and run around and I can chase him and it happened the next game against the Bulls where I'm like, oh guard Mike Dudley know your garden Jimmy Butler. I'm like why I work at home and tortured. Why does he want to watch? This dude's 4:35 tonight and actually surprisingly quiet coming off that career night, and he really wasn't very aggressive now he was so young. He was he was still figuring off. Oh for sure, and now you see them but he's just like his hands are enormous and he is strong and he's athletic and his pull-up game is absolutely Flawless, He is he's a stud. I was really fortunate on that night that he just was not he must it must have been like a back-to-back. He wasn't looking to be to be very aggressive. Thank God off his freshman year at San Diego State. We play them in the first round NCAA tournament in Providence. I was there might have been there was so I think he missed a shot maybe even a close game and afterwards Robbie. I got the statute. I'm like, who is this, We Leonard guy, we let her man had 22 rebounds. God works out where you see these guys doing. All right. I mean, I'm like Leonard think recruited this kid, you know, I mean, you know, Yeah, well, there we go, you know take time takes off and he's held employer. But I mean I'd I didn't know who he was until he got 22 rebounds. It was like, I don't know if I've told either you this story. I've said it before I think on the Pod, but I went out to San Diego sophomore year early in a sophomore year you started to blow up a little bit and not set up an interview with them at noon and and in the sports information directors office. It was just First National story. I was with Fox I think that gun through four spots since then walk away. So noon comes I'm thinking koalas going to be here. It's his first national story. He's going to be here 20 minutes early excited noon. No Kauai 12:15. No Kauai wage of thirty. No quiet. I'm like what the fuck finally the the SSID Darren calls him and he's like why like man, you know, I'm here like we got a national writer here. Where are you dead? and he's like You know, I'm with my cousin at the Department of Motor Vehicles. Just helping him get his licence. I'll be there in a little bit and I'm like man. This guy's disrespectful this is bulshit off and and he comes he sits down across the desk and couldn't be that like again not super engaging he's not going to talk for a long time but a nice respectful was really good and and I realized that I was like, all right, he's not disrespectful. It wasn't showing up late to disparage me or anything. He just didn't catch. It just doesn't care about media attention and it was that day that I was like man, I love this like I love and and that's him. I saw him a few months ago six months ago before the shutdown when they came in a Boston I was going to do a story on Brian Dutcher leading up to the inside of what term he's done unbelievable job this year at San Diego State. So I walk in to the where their practice birth. Downstair like a health club in Boston and and I knew some of the writers and I said like quad that, you know, well, he talked before shoot-around and they all looked at me like no, he hasn't talked much like good luck and I'm like fuck I drove all the way in for nothing. I mean I saw DOC for a few minutes, but I'm like it was worth a shot whatever so I go up to him before and I'm like why they you know, you got a minute just need a couple of minutes on a story. I'm doing I'm Brian Dutcher no problem sits down with me for like ten minutes and and I think he is like he doesn't want to talk about himself informs. You probably heard these stories from from Nick a little bit. Like I was talking to talk about him. And it's just like nobody else. It just wants to work. It just wants to play ball that's being loved and loved coaching and loved him never said a bad word about him so different just so Dodge different in this day and age when everybody wants to take just social media and keep including you Forbes and say what they're doing, you know all the time and koalas just like now just want to play ball. I just bought a ball to know you want to play ball. I know but I assume number eight. I'm just being a team player man. I'm just you know, I'm on the head coach man, and you know what? I did today go home screen shot. All the coaches meeting resumed. Oh you cuz I'm going to keep that in case you get fired before the season. I mean I'm talking about I just some day I'm going to show this to my grandkids. This is who I've been how you get with I've been pushing against these guys now, you know, I mean, that's what you want to see you soon this year. Honestly, you need a season this year. What if K retires off one of these guys in their 70s retire you need you need this year. You think I want to play twenty six conference games? Yeah, you gotta go up against them come home and I don't have home. I don't have a starter back. Maybe a guy in your team. Not one guy. Well you can I say I'm used to this is a good I like me to see went to Brewster Academy. He's good. Then there you go. Right he's got yeah, we got off. Yeah. No, I don't know if we have one right now. I mean, you know, it's Rob Guerrilla Guerrilla mum Wake Forest basketball. I had Wake Forest last year, but the guys are gone now, so I well and I want you to have Coach K next time you're on the zoom call though, if you still think Saddam from California, I think I took an unofficial visit to do offer as like a junior in high school. Cuz Chris Collins is sending me some mail like they were sort of recruiting. I mean, they weren't recruited me, but they were sort of stuff and I was visiting NC State with herb said and I was visiting a UNC Charlotte was with Bobby Luke's and I go I'm just like, well, I'm going to be there and Duke scrimmaging and Coach Collins is sending me this mail why not so they're dead. They have this scrimmage. That's like awesome. Like it's redic. It's Sheldon Williams a shot Roberts. Like it's a big-time team and I go and I'm there's like three hundred High School coaches. There's like us it's like it one of those days where you have all the high school coach much and after the scrimmage Chris Collins comes over like yeah coach she schefsky and come talk to you. All right. Sweet sweet girl comes over and goes Robbie. Thank you so much for coming all the way from California. All looks like hired like shit McNair good evening at all. I told John this cuz I play against John I've known John since high school. He thinks it's like the funniest thing ever. He says it sometimes they'll talk about it though, like laughing that's vital sheets are for her son. Yeah. Well people have those Duke. I got a whole bunch of them. Like I'll be talking look down down. Recruits what they had him for the real recruits. You have to buy a shoes of fake ones. You didn't like Ford's the wait is finally over football is back. You might not get a game this year, but you can still be in on the action at BetOnline the NFL Futures the chiefs of the favorites plus 600 Ravens right behind him at + 650. Then you got the Saints wage earners in Tom Brady's Tampa Bay Buccaneers plus a thousand Bill Belichick and Cam Newton net + 2200 been online is going the extra mile to make sure you can get in on Thursday everything imaginable decision game spreads and totals to team player and coaching props that online gives you more options to wager than any other place online. You can get in on their season-opening bonuses today and start off wagering on wind Division and Championship Futures today had a bad online take advantage of all the great sign up bonus has been online your online Sportsbook expert. You know, it's funny. I was doing one tonight. I can't say who but it's crazy how this the world. You know, the kid's dad. I went to Southern Arkansas off a mule Rider by the way, and the guy looked at me and I looked at him and I got robbed. I went to college with the guy. Come on. Yes, where you go home and knows his dad. That's awesome were to you and it was it was probably that recruitment might be over. Okay, I don't know but both are good way. Yeah, but I mean, it's just like, you know your life like you never know with you it might be over the other way. You might have something to the dad. I mean I was looking at the bio sheet like God, I think I know this guy, you know. What's it before? We let you go rob and I were were texting before and he was saying like we gotta ask him what it's like to take over and I know you've asked this before but you know, you take over late. You can't watch players. You can't evaluate them. You can't have my campus. Like what what the hell is this like to try to build the team? You know and but I'm not afraid of the challenge, you know, but as you guys know when you take over a job immediately get to go meet the team immediately thought of them in the office you go to lunch with them. You work on my out try to get some credibility with them on the court you visit with them at night, you know to me that's who you recruit. First name is the players and there was Zero that I mean when I after my press conference in front of nobody had two players, I think everybody wanted to portal wage, you know, and so it was a really scary two weeks of Are we going to have a team, you know because it's Wake Forest. I'm not going to go out and can't just go out and sign a bunch of new guys man cacc high academic wage going to work, you know, so I had to really work hard with our staff and you know trying to regain these just build some relationships with kids who didn't know me. I didn't blame them. Mendo mean I didn't watch East Tennessee State play. I mean they did it. And so then once we got done our control then it was trying to fill out the team with 2020 with kids are good enough and cuz you can get in school. And can't leave campus and can't come to campus. Okay, the 2021 recruiting them right now. I'm not a lot of those kids are making decisions based on their visits wrong with Robbie just said I went to Duke when I was a junior. I went to probably tend to Purdue games. And so these juniors are now seniors are making decisions based on what they did their junior, why wasn't here and they didn't come here and then 2022. Here we go. So, you know, I'm not complaining but I have to be the only coach maybe in history basketball. They got a job May 1st, never meant 13th of July 15th think about that and then and recruiting three classes and I've never left a campus and never had a visit and I don't know when that is going to happen. You know, it's dead two very first probably, you know, and then our campus is closed like, you know Wake Forest has got three months. Chooses to the to the school was padlocked and to have a guard gate. You ain't getting on campus. They can't even get mine and see the campus. Now. Let's say officially apply off and then get a get a visit but the but the buildings are closed, you know, so not every school is like that. Okay. All right. I mean I'm not I'm not saying because we knock on wood so far. We've kept things in pretty good order here, you know, as far as is that discovered spreading around but at some point I you know, you gotta be able to go out, you know, you gotta be able to bring at least bring some kids to your Chemistry to me. The number of one of the best. The biggest selling points of Wake Forest is bringing a cake his parents onto our campus and them seeing that and we had around in beautiful and and academics and you know in the facility and and so we just haven't been able to log To take advantage of that and you know being out in the community, you know, I'm big into that with employers and myself and you know that's been pretty curtailed to because it's just not a lot of events purple are having big events, you know of a lot of people so maybe someday I'll write a book, you know, maybe maybe Robert maybe I'm the dumbest coach in America to take a job during a pandemic wage. I don't know how to write a book. But but I will tell you this it's a special place and I don't have to tell you the lineage of players that have played here. I think you should own and the coaches. I have picture of Dave Odom and Skip Prosser my office that I put in there to remind me everyday what this can be and and so long, you know, we we're going to we're going to keep plugging and and hopefully one of these days get them into recruit, you know, I mean, it would be it would be it would be dead. Ice, you know, it's our personal, you know, I can't go home to my mom. You know, my dad passed away a year ago and she's living by herself and Iowa and and I can't even do that because not only can I not take the risk of giving it to her. I can't spend fourteen days in quarantine away from my team cuz I got a practice, you know, so it's a different world where world you know, and and and I thought to jump around but that's another issue with the season. They're they're they're telling us that we still have to recognize the three-day dead. Around Christmas, which I agree but there's going to be a lot of Old School coaches are going to send their players home. Right right when when you come back, so there's a whole new window of of of the season. It's not going to be played for some teams. And in my situation we came back July 4th in the quarantine till the 20th. Basically I didn't they haven't gone home. Well, When summer school is over we kept going. So how long am I going to keep them? You know before they get a chance to maybe this isn't the year to do it, but I'm telling you there's going to be some coaches are going off the players own Christmas or holiday. Our you all look at it. Okay, you know and when they come back they're going to quarantine, you know, and so that that's going to take away from games. Mm that are scheduled in late December. So last thing I have is Rob what were your grades in in in your your ACT score? I want to find out if you could get any way. I did not take the money csps. I see my GPA would have been like probably in high school three seven. Wow. My SAT score I think was sixteen seventy. Oh my God 2400 though. Oh, okay. That was those. Those are the days of the 24 MOS. They didn't last long, right? The 2468 ability left. I'd be more than glad to have a conversation with you to hang out. I could have played with Dan. I got a plan with James Johnson and and jephte. I recruited James we had to go off about that on the phone when I called him. He's only he's gotta be like way from Wyoming never go away. Come on, man. Also like a black belt in Taekwondo or whatever country Play Wake in the Big Challenge my junior and I was so glad he went to the league that like Danny the garden. I was going out for a comedian, which said they were loaded man. They were really good. Yeah. Yeah loaded settle, you know. Hey, we know it can be done and That's where we're headed. You know? Why not? All right. Listen, I appreciate both of you rob doing it. You got an early flight out tomorrow morning to the West Coast. I feel horrible for you going to San Diego kind of course how many Zoom calls tomorrow when he got on top? I got three or four I got the I got the racial reconciliation committee tomorrow. Okay. Yeah, so couple of recruiting ones and do I got another one there somewhere might be a rotary club or something. I love doing Rotary Club on Zoom. That's that's a blast. Don't feel bad for you for excuse cuz I know what your paycheck says. All right, you're my name is everything come on. I think it's public Wake Forest a private language on the private school. That's right. That's right. Well, and I do have to make one more recruiting call here after we hang up might maybe to I'm a call home over here and make call K-Dog. See if you got any eligibility left. There you go. Thanks guys. I appreciate you doing this and we'll do it again. We'll do it again and and be safe, and I talked to see you got thanks guys.

Wake Forest NCAA basketball Robbie Rob NBA Nick nurse chiefs NFL Steve Forbes Coach K Boston Roy Ford president Iowa Mike Bray San Diego Tony Bennett NC
2001 Redraftables With Zach Lowe: Parker or Pau? Arenas or Iso Joe? Elgin, MJ, and Wallace Doing Stuff! | Book of Basketball 2.0

Book of Basketball 2.0

1:37:53 hr | 8 months ago

2001 Redraftables With Zach Lowe: Parker or Pau? Arenas or Iso Joe? Elgin, MJ, and Wallace Doing Stuff! | Book of Basketball 2.0

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Shame you but you should at least try out a podcast on spotify. Check it out. It's as easy as I just described and speaking of checking out stuff. The Ringer Dot com still cranking out sports pop culture and a whole bunch of other things. We have some good stuff in the works. We have not slowed down despite other stuff. That's going on. I hope you're staying safe. I hope you're listening to the doctors. And scientists were. GonNa get through this at some point. We're trying to get some context for you so I know everybody's board out there I know. I know it's been tough times but We're just trying to do our job over here and hope your stand safe coming up me. Zach Lowe the two thousand one redraft ables here the basketball. But that's still near Josh inch of you should bash bashed all right. The redraft ables continues. I was on his podcast last week. Doing our belated. Mvp ballot this week. Zach Lowe and I are redrafting the two thousand one draft which is one of the last drafts. We're just all hell broke loose And it's a really weird one to look at again first of all How much old basketball are you watching these days? Now that we are in week four of the Quarantine. Not as much as you would think honestly Not that much like seriously i. I have a lot of work to do. I feel like I have a lot of work to do like they still want some of my regular columns there's the whole like is the NBA. Coming Back News Story. That we're all kind of tracking. I've kind of tried to lean into like I WANNA cover. What teams are doing now rather than full on the stage road and then when it gets to like nine nine thirty at night? My wife doesn't WanNa Watch basketball. She wants to have a glass of wine and she got me into the Great. I'm watching the great British. Bake off right now. Unbelievable Oh wow look at you What do you can do is unbelievable for so am. I did a podcast yesterday and kind of stumbled into a conversation that I got increasingly excited about. Since we've done it and I think I'm probably a little too pessimistic about sports coming back but if the able to figure it out one of the one of the hurdles I couldn't get past was how weird it would be to watch everybody empty arenas and how nonsensical that'd be and as we're kind of talking it out. I was saying well. It would actually make more sense if they did it. In like high school gyms Smaller facilities places like that. And then Had somebody who knows things told me that practice facilities actually could be the way that they're going to do this and there's some benefits there one. Is that way less people involved with the practice facility? The teams basically. I think there's every team own some semblance of practice at this point right off thirty. Yeah either that or they are well there are a couple that have it in their arenas yes. I wonder if there are any other just straight up practicing their arena regular floor anymore. I'm not sure there are so you would cut down on the people that were actually working there and then from a media standpoint the way that they could do the cameras would actually be pretty cool because everything would be so close to the court and there's no fans you could get way more creative and basically make it look like the most awesome version of a scrimmage ever like you know they have the famous Dream Team Ninety two scrimmages and the footage leaked out of some of those games and it was like awesome to watch but they're in a big arena. You kinda can find that to some awesome little area and you just had them going in their uniforms i. I'm starting to talk myself into this. I might just Miss Basketball though the practice scillies of definitely been talked about the NBA. Definitely sniffs smells opportunity like. Let's let's the the brightest possible bright side of all this if we can come back even if there's no fans in the venues are weird and all that like people are dying to watch this on television like. It's an opportunity for US people trapped in their houses. They want to watch something. But the practice facility thing is like you know you read about what baseball is trying to do with all the spring training facilities in Arizona versus this Vegas bubble thing that got some media. Traction how many practices Cilliers are reusing like over using one centralized one? We are decentralizing. It again in this idea. That's the challenge to me is like who's where how many people have to hop from one place to another. Does anybody have to hop from one place to another whereas the finals idea that? That's that's up in the air. Yeah well I think one thing that I I'm officially on this point from this point forward if we do this it's not going to be in the NBA. Arenas and I think I think people in the League have even kind of accepted that that if this happens it's gotta be a smaller venue. Maybe it's pepperdine. University for the Lakers. Sir May be. It's you know some some high school that state of the art in the La area. Maybe it's the Lakers training center You go on through. They'll figure it out. I'm not that concerned. I also think if they do it'll be just the playoff teams that come back It just makes it so much easier and whether it's eight we talked about eight teams twelve teams last week on your pod Maybe everybody gets a first round by the top four seeds. The seeds five through twelve plan. But I there's there's certainly motivated financially to figure it out and Oh yeah On all sides so we'll see goes all right. We're talking about the two thousand one draft. This was the first draft our differ. Espn this does Iran too. I read it. I wrote diary. Yeah it was probably like by six column I ever wrote for. Him and I was really excited. Unleash the concept of the draft diary on. Espn's audience remember led the website with it. As very excited. You were with Dad. You were watching it with your dad and the dogs were very dog or multiple dogs. Were very excited about the draft. I can't remember. I can't remember how aggressively you talked herself into Joe Forte in that In that draft diarrhea. But we can talk about that. It was fairly aggressive. So what they would show forte. He actually was good at North Carolina like in the two thousand NCA tournament. He made big plays. And you know I think there there was some stuff going on with him. May Be off the court that derailed him to some digress. I'm not sure what position he was. It's a classic like Oh this guy will translate as a pro and then he gets to the pros during like well. You're six two and a half but you're not a point guard. What are you those guys with? Very rare exceptions don't seem to make it but I remember one of the things. Think back to this draft the Tony Parker thing lingering. Nineteen Year Old. French point guard and being like all right. That sounds great. But what are the odds? This guy is GonNa make it. His nineteen is from France and he plays point guard. We've seen young point guards get chewed up. Left and right When you think back to how you were looking at this draft in two thousand one do you remember what storyline? You're the most interested in I think it was. I think it was the the big men and the high school. You know the peak of taking guys out of high school and you have. We'll talk about the the all of that. I assume but you know just Curry Chandler. Gamay like is this. The wave of the future is this. Just how the Bids GonNa be now taking taking high school guys. In all these seven footers coming into wants that was definitely the main storyline and then there was like some some like you know our p like Eddie Griffin was sort of like weird skilled. Big Guy like people didn't know what to do with a ham and then the but but I remember the I remember the big guys at the top obviously and the contrast with Batty in particular like Classic College Polished Duke Guy Versus like these raw seven foot high school dudes the first four picks in the draft if you go to a basketball reference dot com our friends at basketball reference so. I get a lot of action these days. There's no college next to the first four picks how this all also in there And then the eighth pick to sign a diop no college and then Ladron Radovich number twelve seed. Six in the first twelve guys did not go to college which was really unusual. And now as I think a little more typical but and and your guy and your guy key Brad went to Oakland Yukata Walton Community College. Yeah Use Juke Guy. So basically seven of the top twelve guys were not college guys. There is a sense that we felt at the time that something was really shifting with the draft because by this point dirk was having real success as a foreign foreign player We started to hear the rumblings about Manu may be the spurs at lucked out. He was gonNA come over at some point and then with the high schoolers cagey was now. A top fifteen top twelve guy. Kobe was rounding into a superstar. And there is a sense of. Where's this going? Where's this heading? Is this GonNa be completely different in ten years? What's funny as this was really the last really super crazy. High scores all at the top of the draft cardio year it settled down after this and you look at the top. Four picks Washington ended the first pick and Michael Jordan Was I can't. He wasn't there yet. I think he was about to start. Those were owner. Oh he yeah he were hold on. I can't remember how many years he was out. But he was in charge of this draft and there is a famous he worked out with kwami. Brown thought he had a lot of dog home and and it was actually a A. It was a bad assessment. One of many reasons why Michael Jordan turned out to be a bad executive and owner but Washington had the first pick so yeah this was his to Washington seasons where Oh one zero two to three so he had this pick and one of the ironies of this draft. You've Jerry Krause in Chicago WHO's trying to trade out brand. Who is really bullish on? I WANNA get Tyson Chandler and Eddy Curry. I'm GONNA have basically the Highschool Mikhail and parish or the Macaire or the Sampson Malaysian. So Eddie out. Brain is for sale and Michael Jordan. Hey Jerry Krause so much the most logical move for him in so many different ways just flip the number one. Pick for out brand And then bring him in. You have repayments and they're already Jordan like you could actually have a playoff team right away but he hated Jerry. Krause so much ends up taking kwami Brown. Do you feel like Kwami. Brown could have made it in a if we play his career. Ten Times is there six versions of the Quami Barranco rare where he's like an all star and all star is strong like? I don't think he ever showed enough on offense to to be an all star but to your point like his career was Troubled so immediately by his wizards experience. Which is what is the name of that book about. Jordan's timing the wizards in Washington. Polite away yeah. It's like when winning is all that matters or something like that. It's a fantastic Jordan I think Jordan hates the book. And you probably should. Because it's just an unfiltered look and one of the subplots of it is just how he famously just kind of broke. Kwame Brown so I think there probably is a version of his career. That goes better. He sustained for a while in the NBA is like a solid post defender. Backup Big Kinda Dude and made a good amount of money. But I think there's definitely a version his crew that goes better but offensively like he just never really showed you much like ought to be an all star. You usually have to be a pretty damn good offensive player. I don't think ever showed that well. Unfortunately he crosses paths with MJ IN HIS FORMATIVE YEARS. Stubborn old angered everybody. I'm Jay then. Eventually ends up on the Lakers with Kobe. I would say those were. The two were teammates. He could have had for if you're talking about a fragile guy with potential. Who in a different circumstance? Maybe there's an arc where he makes it. We talked on the nineteen ninety eight draft about Nowitzki. How fortunate he was just end up in Dallas. He ends up with the perfect coach. Don Nelson he ends up with Steve Nash. Who takes him under his wing? That I share nuits is super lonely. He's not happy in the NBA. He's wondering if he made a mistake. It's the lockout year it's fifty games. It's a lot at once. There's a lot of pressure on him. He wants as he's like second guessing that decision to come at that time and his two. He's got Mark Stein. And Steve Dash basically being no no. It's good and and he rides it out and he makes it but think like there's an alternate universe where he goes to. I don't know or he goes to Memphis Milwaukee instead of them right and maybe he's ends up in Germany in two years like I'm just happier in Europe so I look at qual- thought he was really athletic. Those earlier's member the second half of his career. There are all these defensive metrics that he was actually like a really really really good defensive player and you could do real stuff on defense like he was a decent to good defensive player for sure. See have him. Steve Washed and they were found that the clippers eligible Taylor. I wrote this in the draft. Made maybe the only good trade of his entire GM tenure until two thousand six flips tight Tyson Chandler pick number two for out brand and bison early on this really professional. Non Clipper kind of Guy. Who just is a pro handles his business who's an automatic twenty ten and that was a fantastic trade Third Pick was Atlanta and I think POW GUSAU. Not Maybe enthusiastic about going there. There was some sort of something that they they'd love. They ended up slipping him doing this whole Memphis trade him right and so he goes there. Chicago's got the fourth pick according to my draft. Ira they're doing a whole smokescreen. How much they want. Power saw really they WANNA curry? They WANNA do the Chandler Curry Combo. So those were the first four picks. I felt this way in the moment. It's an and especially as it evolved and we knew Powell is good pretty quickly. It's always been interesting to me that M. J. never went never sniff POW that if he was going to take a gamble on a young forward that he wouldn't have clicked better power. I don't know enough about the background of that Bo. Do you remember anything about that. Why they didn't gravitate toward pal. I don't remember I don't remember. Maybe it was too much of an unknown. Maybe there was still sort of like do. I trust the international guys kind of thing going on at that point. I don't know I don't know why. But how walked in the League and was was pretty damn good. 'cause if you're a wizards fan you look back at this and you go. Oh man we could have had pound rip Hamilton basically two years apart we had. Mj Who was still at twenty point score at the time and the League was pretty weak back then. And I think Powell at least could've put points right away. The Quami thing was just just went badly on a lot of expectations to. I'm glad you defended the The clippers acquisition of Elton brand. Can we talk a second about Elton Brand? Just walks in the league as a rookie and averages twenty and ten like as a rookie walked in twenty and ten you can tell me about the limitations of his game like you know how. How much brandon his prime drive winning? I think I think he's actually underrated in that aspect. Because we've sort of we've sort of downplayed post scoring and he wasn't a three point shooter and he wasn't like a seven footer with shop locking skills that at an elite level and all that but Elton brand was freaking good and Tyson Chandler for Elton brand. I mean that is like a crazy challenge trade. That is an amazing trade. That's like it's not quite Luca for trae because those guys were drafted at the same time. But it's like age wise. Those guys were so like Elton was twenty. One I think at the time of that trade that you don't see a lot of traits like that and Elvin was to walk in the League as twenty and ten guys really really hard. Well the other thing Tyson was a local kid and I think people felt like the clippers. We're GONNA take the local kid day. Didn't WanNa take another kid and they don't even though he was only head into his third year. I think is just you know he. He's now that he was always kind of a mature younger guy and I think they they really valued that In unbelievable trade really like would you think of all the bad trades. Elgin Baylor made and how great that one was. You talked about how he was underrated. We talked about this a little bit. Nine pod Elton in that Oh five oh six quicker season when they really could have made the finals that year. I think I was going to those games. L. Was like twenty five and eleven every single night and was weirdly valuable on defense to I. I thank God that your was mobile. He was smart. He has super long arms. That made up for like kind of his lack of fight. At least when he played some five he was like in August that year. He was amazing that was his best year and then he was automatic. Other than that. You're twenty and ten. Before he tours Achilles he was he was a walking twenty and ten. Who was a good smart defensive player and you could go to him at least that you're at the end of games which wasn't always the case with him but that year he he was. I gotta say a Little Dunkin Ish Is that was? The Dunkin. Apex was kind of on the tail end but he was somebody that every night. I went to a Cook Gamma Dombrowski scored twenty five points tonight. There weren't a lot of guys in the week and then Philly does sing. About what Philly does he tears his Achilles and we're still all in we're still here's all the money or almost all the money not quite all the money but almost all of them. I think it was not going all the money we can throw at you. Yeah you just suffered a torn Achilles. We'll bring you over. I'm actually reading Audrey with dollars book right now and Andre. I loved Elton Brand. He loves he loves it. He got to play with like old out and Brandon Philly and he really gravitate toward L. andbranch learn a lot about managing money and just like to talk black history with all sorts of stuff but he talked about how I believe. If I'm getting all my details right if not forgive me I believe Eddie Jordan was the coach in Philly for part of that and they were trying to play the Princeton offense and Andre talks about how Elton occasionally would be like fuck this Princeton off and I just got. I just got to get some numbers I gotta get some touches. I gotTa Get some post touches and Andre had this weird like he kind of. Didn't like it when Elton break the offense. Because it's not how I'm not a Princeton offense again. Just give me the ball dumped me the ball and get a score bucks but he also kind of respected. How Elton would just be like nope. It's my it's my time now. We're not ready to prison off. It's L. E. Kinda respected it Isla. I really liked his game. Great Trade for the clips So one other thing. Which cargo did this year where they're in year three of the post? Mj rebuilding project. Which in the M J documentary. That's coming on. Espn from our friend. Jason Hare it. It's never truly bent. Explained why the Bulls were like. Yeah cool we're done with this done winning titles with Phil Jackson Jordan. Pippen thing like it ends this year And I wrote a column for US probably three years ago when I was trying to figure out what team Lebron was gonna go to in two thousand eighteen When it became clear like around January February that he probably wasn't going back to Cleveland. But where was it going to go? We didn't have a team and it was the same dilemma Jordan. Had that year and I'm always going to think that's why he retired. Because they're blowing up the bulls play anywhere else. There wasn't really a situation for him other than maybe the next the next nab the cap space to sneak them in he. He wasn't GonNa the Lakers. He wasn't really. There is no other place from Nagoya so he retired and I think that was a little bit of the situation. Lebron was in two thousand eighteen. He goes to the Lakers. Because it's Los Angeles Great. I get to move there. Basically the two thousand eighteen season is gonNA sock but maybe we'll make some moves after that So anyway a I never understood why they blew it up. I think there was a lot of organizational arrogance. We're in year three of that. Mj Blow a plan. And now they're blowing it up a second time. They're doing building around the too high schoolers. And when you think about how long this took. They made the playoffs in five with a lot of fun team first round. They were a little frisky. Had some guys in there but it was a six year. Run just to lose in six in round one. And then it craters again they end up getting derrick rose and then they get rejuvenated but it was really. They threw a decade stu bad it's hard the NBA can be unforgiving man. What's your bad if you don't get the right guy in the draft. If you don't get lucky a couple of times like you can be bad for a long time and the Bulls were bad for long time. Then they were good for a long time as much as Garen. Packs are getting hammered now and demoted now like they they had a decent run there for a while before the last few years kind of Senate around the Butler trade where everything kind of went sour. I mean they they they. They had once they got rose. That was a good team for a while. Yeah and it seemed like if you were betting When it rose get hurt was at that was two thousand. Twelve playoff say eleven twelve season. Yeah so we at grant land. We launched Grantland June two thousand eleven and we never did this calm but if we did like who are the teams most likely to win the NBA title? We had done that October. Two or two thousand eleven. Whenever the lockout ended I think Chicago would have been one of the top three packs. I think we were Cog Oklahoma City Miami right. That's an injury that for anyone who was. That's that's a sort of a that's a you remember where you were when that injury happened because it was like it was a great. They were the number one seed. It was shaping up to be. Chicago and the Lebron heat like year after year after year in the playoffs. And you had the sense of the Bulls like they just. They didn't fear Miami. Like Noah and Taj Gibson. Those dudes like love to duke it out with Miami. They hated the Bron- like it had a chance to be a rivalry. And I think that's one of the things when people look back on the bronze salmon. Miami is the East like Indiana sort of just slipped into this in the east and I think we're going to be debating for a long time. Like how good was that. Pacers team really that good or were the product of the conference. That just didn't have another capital t team to to challenge Miami like the Bulls are supposed to be that team and you had even though as an ACL and people recover pretty well from those. Now I even at that moment given the way. The Derrick rose played it. Had this feel of like ooh like things just changed forever. I agree eight sometimes with an ACL. You go like Klay Thompson and like he'll be back in the year he'll be fine with rose. It was like taking one of the most carefully built five hundred thousand dollars talion race cars and just watching. It crashed wall and then have somebody to tell you. Yeah the car should be finding like. I don't know man. That was a pretty bad the way he played the Torque put on the lower part of his body. It just seemed like Oh man how is he going to come back from this mentally and as we saw took how many years five I mean for you never got back to it you know. I mean he never got back to that form ever. I mean he was. Mvp Year before he's never approached that that level he's a he's a good player now in the NBA is rebuilt himself into a good useful NBA player. That's the credit to him. Two thousand playoffs. The Celtics ended up creeping into the conference finals and coming very close to sneaking into the finals with their on fumes of their fumes. At this point that team they were like five hundred for a three month stretch. I think in two thousand twelve the the other one the other one that was kind of missed opportunity team Other than Chicago was Brooklyn. Because if I'm just looking at those four Miami years I don't I will never understand what happened to Darren Williams but on paper with the talent they had when they added Cagey impure state year. That should have been an awesome team. And for whatever reason Darren Williams was already done with his prime even though. He was the same age as Chris. Paul if you put like an actual twenty ten Darren Williams the guy from two thousand eight on that nets team with all those pieces. I think that would have been a really tough team for Miami. Beat but he just wasn't the same guy thought going to be really good And they just like you said just it just didn't work. I never I I not. I'm not sure how much believe that. They were going to challenge Miami but they had the potential to be really really good. And Yeah the twenty playoffs. That's the uncut gems playoffs. Now that's the uncut when they slog it out Boston Philly and one of my everyone you you just have these some images just stick with you from Games in like some people forget certain things. Like one of the things always remember from that playoffs. Game seven Miami. Boston Brandon Bass ends up being the guy the Celtics asked to guard Lebron down the stretch of that game and crunch time. Third and fourth quarters like they're out of ideas they've this is the last idea that they've come up with. He had like a few possessions in the previous game where he looks pretty good. They're like Oh yeah Brandon Bass. That's going to be how we're going to get through just like they're just out of ideas. Yeah I remember. Making a couple of massive shots just heartbreaker shots that fourth quarter but yeah all right so the rest of this Top Ten and GOES GOLDEN STATE MEMPHIS and I had in that draft. Ira MEMPHIS takes shame. Badea and stern is a bullion. It's so it's the first time he's happy. It's a four year senior Duke. He's just so happy to have an adult in the draft. The Nets are seven and they make the biggest traders draft other than brand trade. It's a pretty crazy trade actually When you really sit down and look at how much they traded for Eddie Griffin. So they're picking seventh Houston has thirteen eighteen and twenty three and they out I got Freddie Griffin misspoke. Yea So the nets say. We'll give you the Eddie Griffin. Pick number seven who's got a lot of value For the people who don't remember him he's dead now but he was this guy from Seton Hall who had been in a lot of stuff but was really talented mallet so it's like a modern NBA talent to write like a potential multiple. Oh Mba guy. If you could just keep him in check who'd you compare him to do you remember? I don't really remember his game that much at this point but I remember him being a an all around score tall guy you know. I don't know if he was technically seven feet but an all around score. Looks like a guy that you could a guy who a big guy at dependent potential to play inside and out and exploit mismatch is just like across the board. Whoever that whoever comes to mind for that description for some reason I wanna say Michael Porter is that fair to what we have in our head of. How good porter could be that. That's kind of how remember feeling about Eddie Griffin? I think he could post up a little more. So Houston says we'll give you thirteen eighteen and twenty three for seven six three first round picks just to move up six spots which is a bad as big of a price as we've seen other than like the Chris Webber trader support that the nets as sure they have At this point they have already made the Jason Kidd Trade. They are to have any Martin they already have Kerry kittles they end up taking Richard Jefferson thirteenth. So it's going great with the eighteenth. Pick Zach Randolph on the board take Jason Collins Instead and then with the twenty third pick they take Brandon Armstrong for pepperdine yet. Didn't go well and one of those two like one and a half or three Jason calls was a useful. Nba Players Zach Randolph. You can play that game with a lot of guys but like just causes good. Mba DECENT NBA player from a talent standpoint it. It felt like Randolph at fallen too far and he was another guy who people had some head case questions about But they take brain. Strong Gerald Wallace is twenty five. Sandown bears twenty six. Tony Parker's twenty-eight Gilbert Arenas thirty one there's a world in which the nets traded Griffin and built a dynasty. Yeah 'cause they could even if they had taken Richard Jefferson Zach Randolph. Tony Parker which is conceivable That's a monster hall. So then the other plot bears the Celtics have ten ten eleven and twenty one. And if you're a celtics fan which I was at the time I was still living in Boston. They had Paul Peirce St Anton Walker. We've got Rick Pitino We there's momentum. Kenny Anderson was whatever Tony bootees whatever they have role players but you think like man if we nail this draft and it's deep draft We could really be set here unfortunately for the Celtics it was a nine player drafted the tenth pick. So why did somebody bought? Somebody needed to do something dumb in here. Come THE CLEVELAND cavs. They take the sign of Diop eighth and everything falls into place. Joe Johnson falls to the Celtics attend the Cajun Brown. Pick number eleven. You remember the story of this Peck Right. Oh yes so they have a Denver. Pick that they can just roll over two thousand two in. Its top five protected road over again. It becomes unprotected in two thousand three. The nuggets are one of the worst franchises in the league. They have no real young anything yet. They do not have a pick in this draft because the Celtics are taking it to. Something's just said. You keep that pick. We're going to roll it over there. Only get in the eleventh pack and then in o-3. It's Carmelo Anthony. Which is the pick the Celtics Agai the weirdest thing about this to Celtics Deep Divey? But they had all these luxury tax fears and fifty games into this two thousand one two season. They Trade Joe Johnson. Apparently they gave Phoenix to pick Joe Johnson or CAJA BRAND. You can have either. They pick Joe Johnson. The Celtics throw in two thousand and two first round. Pick and get Rodney Rogers. Tony delk back. They're so excited that you brought up that trade because I remember at the time this is near the Celtics. Make the conference finals and lose to the nets. I remember at the time twenty five year. Old Twenty four year old me. Then he got twenty Belkin Rodney. Rogers as you said Tony. Delk was twenty eight and like okay. Rodney Rogers like a very intriguing. Both faceted big man who could shoot threes and do some stuff. I remember at the time being like that is one of the most aggressive win now trades. I can't remember given the like that. Celtic seem wasn't that good like that wasn't a team that you would be like. They're they're Rodney Rogers away from being a championship. Contender was that was not being like the east stinks. Were not very good. Let's get freakin crazy. And that trade. In retrospect like Belkin Rogers had some moments for the Celtics in that very strange playoff. Run that they had like that is a crazy trade. That's a crazy trade Chris Wallace I remembered liking the trade at the time But thinking they paid a heavy price with Joe Johnson and never for a million years understanding why they also had to throw in the first round pact. You were produce. This is probably why they did it. Because they're so starved for that at that point from for like post bird anything like poachers. Give us a playoff run of any kind. Yeah will lose in the conference finals. But it'll be worth it because they'll just be so fun like teams talk themselves into that and the Patriots just won the Super Bowl. Did they changed at one or did they win the Dow? I know what I really. There's a lot of a minimum of like the Celtics are good. The Celtics are fun. Forget these other to pieces. Maybe a win. The problem is they traded for to bench guys. And you're right. This is a trade that if it happened now the Internet would riot. You'll be like Joe Johnson's good you're giving him for. You're giving up a Joe Johnson after fifty games for like a seventh man and an eighth man. What are you guys doing like nowadays? They would never do that. You'd probably be able to get both of those guys for the two thousand two first round pad yet and Joe Coretec tag and yet there are Celtics fans. Maybe you are one of them. Who Will Whisper very quietly? You know we actually. Kinda played the Lakers. Tough that year. If we had made the finals like you never know you never know. I'm like yeah. I know shock would have smashed her entire team into smithereens and four games. Will you still here man if we had just gone by the net? You never know we give those Lakers seems trouble in the defense of those celtics that which include myself with my dad. He played the Lakers off of that year. Paul Peirce is a problem for them. We won in La. I wanted to play them. I remember thinking if we just kept by the nets we can give this laker steamer run. It would have been that. Oh to Lakers team. That was worn out for that kick series two. Who Does Paul Pierce Get taught Okay so we had that. So plot so celts have ten eleven and twenty one and a chance to really really really lay the groundwork. There's a ton of rumors in Boston at the time. They're gonNa Take Tony Parker number twenty one. He came on my podcast. I think in two thousand thirteen in I'd always heard they're gonNA take him so I I asked him and you can find this clip. I think it's on Youtube. How close was it? He said they gave him the hat he still. Does it? Totally know what happened from when they gave him the Celtics at? You're going to get caught up to the stage. To all the sudden the Celtics took Joe Forte. There's been a lot of blame passing. That's gone around Chris. Wallace almost immediately was like that was read our backs. Favor repairing the draft Joe Forte was at the radar. Back Camp I still feel like radar. Back was an eight year old man at that point. Where are you listening to him on? The twenty-first packed like do. What's best for your team? The Parker would if of this because there's so many different things that play out. He falls to twenty-seven the spurs end up winning. How many more titles? Because he falls to twenty-seven could you I don't envy P he's A. Tony Parker is the two thousand seven finals. Mvp with thing. Is I think Dunkin. The over unders probably three for titles. He just should win because he was tim. Duncan I think I think Parker adds to could be. I think that pick adds at least two. Titles 'cause two thousand fourteen also would be one. Yeah and then I would say maybe oh five or seven one of those. He swings one of them. So so that happens. So those were the The big subplots So I have a scrap rating crapshoot rating for every draft. Okay in retrospect what what what kind of crafts you was an a scale one attend. I gave this a seven point. Five seems lower. I'm a redraft standpoint. Yeah it's it's it's because I mean need the two thousand draft is infinity. Draft is a ten. So you know I'm A. I'm a hard grader. For comedy standpoint. Some great ones here. This is a draft telecast where they use rip. Petito as a TNT guest analyst. You love it. Not sure whether they did that he was. Guy Traded Vitality Papago for unprotected lottery. Pick but The Bulls to get current number four. Rick Pitino congratulated Jerry Krause on a successful bluff and I said that and I said in the draft. That's the kiss of death when Patino part of your Patino animus was very fresh in raw. It's fresh and Ron. Two thousand twenty my friend. So that that's the moment when it occurs around At Number Twenty Six amd Albert got selected by the sixers came out of the stands. Yup To my knowledge. The first time this ever happened. Nobody has time. Yeah so it's amazing. Like security to take them out thinking he was like some crazed fan but it was actually saying. Oh Dal unbear- Spoilers Sam. Del Bears in my Redraft Lottery Oh we hope so. He shouldn't a lottery pick for me and then Do later in the draft Patino called. Tony Parker Troy Parker Multiple Times. And then when when Parker actually got taken in the twenty seven th pick at Berkeley and this draft and he said I don't know that much about him but they got him in the first round so he must be a good player. This is when networks just did not care who is doing the draft. It's like you're famous. Huby Brown is in this draft for some reason More of that. Tony Parker pick the lore on one end is definitely read are back Blandford Boston. Not Picking Tony Parker and the lower on the other end is that was the that was the time the young Sam frosty was like I'm staking my claim. This is the guy we should take in San Antonio. That's the young that the legend I you know Sam. I don't know that he's never talked publicly about if he did. I'm sure he went deflect credits everyone else but the story that has been told in the media and elsewhere is that's that's young. Prestia was the guy who brought Tony Parker in for a second workout. 'cause he bombed the first one popped in like him like this. I'm staking my reputation. This is a good player. Let's take him. Would you put that above or below Russell Westbrook in two thousand eight? Which was a huge reach when they did that. The other people that wanted to take Brook Lopez's instead I mean anytime you're in the well it works. It's twenty eight makes it seem more impressive like last pick in the first round but also by then it's sort of like your risk is a little bit lower because if you blow the twentieth pick no one ever remembers that if you blow the fourth pick and it's a reach people really remember that. I thought the Westbrook pick was really Bazi. Resilient I've talked about when did the two thousand draft I loved Westbrook and college never millionaires? Thought he was a top floor pick. He just seemed like a little bit of a project as a guard was unclear. What position he was. He clearly something but I mean they took a had a steph curry and Brook Lopez and people that we knew we were going to be good pros. Yeah I think I think I'm buying into your argument. That the Westbrook pick is ball's ier just because aware took place in the draft. I'm GonNa Steph Curry Kevin Curry and Kevin Advising Steph Curry's in my favorite draft. Yeah we're doing that for your part couple- couples Zack's from Zach. Cram the ringer zone. He said the two thousand one draft six all NBA players. Ninety six is the only draft in the laterally with more sediment. Oh Wow okay. The average player from the two thousand one draft tallied twenty six point one career wind shares the fourth most the latter era behind ninety six three and ninety nine okay. Kwami Brown averaged six point. Six career points third worst for any number one picks since the invention of the shot clock trailing only can yes although a candy no he he put up buckets. He was like double figures for his career. Yeah you're right now. There's one easier one my blanking on it. I'll give you hint hint. Anthony Bennett. Oh wow see I was. I was trying to wrack my brain further back than that. Y- Anthony Bennett. That's the that's the other one. You won't get Larue Martin. The Guy Portland a famous one. Anthony Bennett yet. That's a bad one. That's crazy draft to get out and that's a fun draft Zach says Gilbert Arenas ranks tenth in total career. I've been peaked value. If you look at their best five seasons he ranked second from this draught. That's the biggest difference for any player in any draft in the latter era. While tell you I'll tell you right. Now he's going high on Zach Lowe a drought there you go and then our top drafted this year. Mo- Evans the Immortal Jafari of moon like Jamaica mood and Carlos Arroyo who had like a cup of coffee of saving really good there for a while then became good international eleven fan but I remember remember that one year was that Carlos Arroyo kind of looks like John Stockton Great Fiba Player to okay and then that's it all right. We're doing the redraft. You went the first pick of the second. Pick Golden State draft. Oh boy I'm gonNA give you the first pick your the guest. Okay years giving it to me Do I. It's almost like with David. Stern gave the Knicks. That number. Pick in Nineteen eighty-five then pretended he was pulling out of. I think this is an easy one. PALCA soul is the first pick in the draft for me. Make the case. Do I mean do I have to spell castle? That's my that's my the only competition is Tony Parker To me the only competition is Tony. Parker's paolantonio it's everybody else. I soon. We'll be picking Tony Parker now and I just think size all around skill I was a good defender. At peak and underrated defender at his peak is passing his ability to blend in any offense. Yes it was funny when we do these exercises. I'm kind of drafting like halfway for what the NBA was like then and half way for what the MBA is like. Now so yeah POW POW wows game I think is less fitted to twenty twenty NBA. Then like twenty Parker's gamble though. Tony Parker never became an off the dribble. Three point shooter I just think POW better. I think peak Powell was better than peak. Tony Parker period. That's it that's my case. They've they've made the same number of all star teams. Statistically I mean you know Powell had a few more points whatever I just I just think house better power comes in as a rookie puts up seventeen point six points nine rebounds two blocks a game thirty six point seven minutes a game and Joe. House is just going insane in that. They took me Brown. He's going to these wizards games going. Kwami Brown looks like he needed like four more years of college. Go to college and spend all four years there before something happens. Powell is good immediately and from two thousand to two thousand sixteen which is fifteen years and a thousand fifty five games. He played thirty five minutes a game. He averaged an eighteen and a nine and a half and almost two blocks. Six kids are sentenced to Damas Parker. So I went back and forth really really hard on this and I gave. Parker was number one on my board. Wow I like it. I mean look. It's you can make you can make the argument peak. Tony Parker was a was a an all. Nba Level Player mcpeek. Tony Parker was a great great player. Here's my case and this is just you know I like to hold grudges and to ends and I and sites I never liked how ended the Memphis thing. It really bothered me. I don't think he gets enough of a penalty for in historical thing. I think he was an incredible player. I really liked him. I thought he was the two thousand ten finals. Mvp He never won it. But I thought he was the best part in that series. I thought he was absolutely immense in game. Seven which resigned recently nineteen eighteen rebounds. It's the Mohegan four engaged the most important game of pogo souls career in the NBA. That was egging. I sat behind the basket that they were scoring on in the second half for game seven because I was doing like a live chat. Espn thing which. I wish. I had I wish I had written about that series. Instead the live chat thing but Kazaa was a fucking man in that game he really was and he's going against there's no Kendrick Perkins Perkins is hurt going against Keiji. Who's eighty five percent of Cagey at that point? Eighty three. He's going against a pretty spirited Rasheed. Wallace sutures burned out late. Thirty five minutes laboring but spirited both at first half spirited second-half needs like a lung transfusion and and There's some was there some big baby that year. There's one other guy that had but you know a competitive celtics team sheltered some cameos in that series. Oh my God. I might've famous. There's a famous Sheldon Williams throwing away. Inbounds pass at the end of the half. It might have actually been game seven where everyone where everyone agreed in the moment like gets like Sheldon Williams. You can't just get out of the premise. Like he just needs to leave. I could in my celtics lifetime. That's only happened a few times in a playoff game. Because I remember one time Fred Robertson the ADA Detroit series. And I think I went to the game. It was game. Five was when the Pistons finally flipped it And somebody fouls out Zig Mikhail fouls out and Fred Robertson. That point. Everyone's just done with them. But somebody asked to come in. And there's like a murmuring of you could just twenty thousand people gone man. I hope it doesn't put in Fred Roberts and Fred Roberts stands up on the bench to go in and the crowd goes no. You could honestly hear it but the Sheldon website was same thing. I think he was like minus eight two minutes in game seven. It was so crazy stat so anyway. I have lots of SPEC FOR POW. I actually thought he was underrated Both on those Lakers teams and just as a pro. I didn't like the Memphis thing and so it was that little I felt like it was like dead even between him and Parker. It's funny by coincidence. I just on Saturday did one of those NBA instagram wives. Things with Powell And I taught so I prepared by talking to people that know pal and we're talking about Memphis. New is like super super frustrated in Memphis. The losing they just weren't going anywhere. They want zero playoff games. They got swept every year in the playoffs. He was there but when he got traded. Somebody told me he was like actually unhappy like his first reaction by going to the Lakers. That he was upset at unhappy heads. Kinda like like did I. Did I play this right and then very quickly realize oh? I'm on an awesome team and then POW POW talked about why he felt though. But it's interesting that we remember it is this as this sort of frustrated guide trying to push his way out of town and then when it happens first reaction is sadness more than elation well and. I think there is a fear at that point plan with Kobe which cannot be understated. You know his. He had those three straight years and he was a difficult teammate. And I'm sure he was like. Oh Shit now it's like I got my wish. I'm on a different team. But now the stakes are going to be different. He fit in immediately with that team. Though people people someone on that team told me no one ever ever before or since picked up the triangle offense faster than POW. It was just instant like he got it. He didn't need to be told anything. You understood it immediately. I don't know what the right pick is with this. So so like the Oh seven grizzlies. They had Mike Miller who was eighteen and a half a game forty one percent from three probably his best year that he had a young gay. They had Damon Stoudamire Chucky Atkins Data Chemo Little Dante Jones. Some late Coretta Jones like wasn't a bad team and yet they went twenty two and sixty and I feel like I just don't think Powell is a number one guy now. I'm not sure Tony Parker was either but I the reason I I had parker slightly higher on my board was he was. He was such an unstoppable offensive guy for so long And like weirdly. You look back at the thirteen finals which we both covered. And there's that moment in game six when he's hurt he's playing with like he had a bad near bad remember and he just takes over with three minutes left. He's playing against one of the best teams we've had in the last twenty five years and he takes over the game and it seems like they're going to win because of all the stuff he's doing. I never felt like Powell is as good as Tony was in that kind of stretch or even Tony in two thousand fourteen Tony. Oh seven finals. Tony's Tony's kind of offensive apex was just I felt a tad higher. But I honestly I feel like this is one a. One B. and I don't feel close. Tony was a twenty points scored twice in his career They'll jump shot. The long three never really came but he did eat adds a monster playoff moments in in game one of that series in two thousand thirteen. He hit the jumper dice game. I mean he was a monster that you're I don't you know I think POW was better. They both made all NBA four times. It's it's an argument so it's a IT'S A. It's a tough argument. It's a great one. Tony Two thousand nine twenty two and seven fifty one percent shooting one of the things I liked about him was that he could have an impact and didn't need to have a high usage rate. This was not like a Russell Westbrook situation. This was like he didn't need the ball that much when he gave it to him. He could score his teammates. Even Alaikum I think other teams really hated playing him you know. How many guys can you remember being like? Oh man they they completely throttle Tony. Parker like it did feel. It always felt like you could get wherever he could go. I remember on Instagram. A couple weeks ago. Somebody had a minute long clip of Tony Parker spin moves the three sixty driving three sixties. He has to peak toy breathtaking yet. He would have stretches where despite not having the sort of vertical athleticism or explosiveness of like a Westbrook. He would have stretches where you would think. How does anyone keep this guy with from the rim like you can't keep them away from the basket which is pretty remarkable series not that bigger stronger athletic dude at the rim to yeah so from an all MBA standpoint? Both of these guys made it right. A four-time all NBA. That's something you and I both value the NBA's 'cause that's basically it's an announcement you're either one of the best ten or fifteen guys in the week. It's really the only document we have that. You're doing arguments matters. All right you have the third pick So if we had done this draft correctly or if the teams in the moment democratically Washington would've had POW Gusau and then. We're Tony Parker to the clippers would grade from the third pick. Seems pretty obvious to me but I am interested to see what you do here. Well I'M GONNA I'm gonNA reach a little bit because he didn't have the best career of of All of these that are candidates for this pick But I'm going with the Zach cramped peak value method. I'm picking Gilbert Arenas because I know that Gilbert Arenas and in his prime now maybe I can't prevent the knee injuries. I Dunno I can maybe prevent some of the other unpleasantness that derailed his career in Washington. Yeah but I know if I'm drafting like I said halfway halfway for now I know I can plug peak Gilbert Arenas new NBA offense and he can run fifty pick and rolls again. Make off the dribble threes and be a guy that is going to make my team on offense at least really really good and so. I'm drafting for peak value on picking Gobert arenas third. I remembered reading some calm when he was on the warriors and kind of not dismissing him but just not gave him credit for being really an essay yet and getting a couple impassioned emails back when people said civilly bills. Instead of just being like you fucking Sauk. Sac Talk You. This is the era of like. Hey I'm GonNa send what my favorite thoughtful email that he might have gotten this wrong and I got all these emails from the worst fans are saying. Hey you should watch Gilbert that Gilbert's coming on in a real way like something's happening here and at that point the worst socked There was really no reason to watch him on league. Pass unless I was like going into the game or they're on TNT or something on my guard. I'll I'll Gilbert a whirl and it was like. Oh what's this going to be? He's going to be a restricted free agent member. They ain't. They changed the rules because of his restricted. Free Agency there is now the Gilbert Arenas rule right so Washington comes in. They come flying in off the top rope and they grab Gilbert and houses like what's going on Mike House I've been. I watched this guy a couple times. This guy is. This is an amazing move for you. You might have gotten whatever but he was actually turned into a superstar like there is probably a two year stretch there where he is on the level of t. Mac and all these guys. And what's interesting is. I actually think Pete. Gilbert was a higher level than any season Vince. Carter had except for that one awesome house one season. Hey honestly like if you're just talking about who did more offensively Euler. Gobert Gilbert Jr is brought more of the table. Pete Gilbert was twenty nine and six on like eight threes or seven threes a game which in two thousand and sixty thousand seven. There weren't many people shooting seven or eight threes. A game We'll look at look at his two thousand six season and tell me the two things that jump out seven threes again. Seven attempted threes again. Thirty seven percent and ten free throws Ten game so he's basically he's hardened james hearted two thousand six but there's no possessions back that people remember how slow was back then twenty nine and six and so like the the hardest thing to find in the NBA is a legitimate offensive fulcrum who can be the number one guy every possession on an above average offense. I was he your pick for three at three You have the floor. It was either him or Joe. Johnson Gilbert for three years from five toast. Seven was twenty eight and six years peak value. And I'm just. I'm imagining that. My team has a healthy team culture. We're going to nurture all we're GONNA make all the right decisions off the floor on the floor. We're GONNA WE'RE GONNA WE'RE NOT GONNA be we're not going to be the jail blazers we're GONNA WE'RE GONNA WHO's relevant for one of the Pixel. It's coming up a we're GONNA have a good culture. I'm going to get the best Gilbert Arenas for a decent amount of time. Oh six that series against Cleveland. That was just Kinda Of Really Fun Playoffs and that was a fun series six games. He plays forty seven point three minutes a game. Ridiculous in the six playoff games. Thirty four points. A game lead the lead the player but went toe to toe with With Brian and what are the things I liked about him and where I think you know he was all MBA third team? Third Team Second Team for three straight years. Vince was Vince. Doesn't have anything like that. Three or stretch one of the things I liked about him is he really honestly believed. He was better than Lebron James in the pleasures. Those wizards teams were just so they wanted all of it. They want they wanted everything. Bring everything on. I think I don't think that's the wrong. Pick 'cause you you at least know you're getting four top fifteen seasons of guy. I thought I had Joe Johnson kind of three eight three B with Gobert. Couple things Joe He. He made seven all star teams which I was shocked by. He only made one third team on bay. His name is on. It is almost seven time. All Star. Joe Johnson. I mean that's almost like how people refer to him for that reason because people on the all stars next to each other like how did he make the spending all star teams the Job Johnson? The Joe Johnson Hall of fame debate is going to be frisky. It's GONNA BE A. There's going to be people who are like Joe Johnson. And then they're going to be like well twenty thousand point seven. All Star Games. Whatever whatever it is. There's it's going to be like if you you have to let in Joe Johnson and Tom Chambers. If you're letting Joe Johnson Tom Chambers then has to get in I think but His First Five Hawks seasons twenty two five and six I was shocked by his stats on the o five sons. A team that I really loved watching he He was forty seven percent from three that year. Taken like five game and when he gets hurt That to me. That's the big. What if Joe Johnson in the case for him for being the third pick in this draft is if he just stays with Steve Dash? Just how about this? Stay with the best point guard and one of the best teammates we've had in the last thirty years on a style that's uniquely suited to all the things. You're good at to stay there. Stay there and be in contention. He goes Atlanta. And it's just like or pay or a him if the blame the sun's pay him keep him do whatever it takes to keep him. 'cause it is remarkable that you know the Celtics stratum is a rookie in that deal. We talked about earlier and then the son's when he's still very young are like yeah or did they just can't work it out and so he ends up on this sort of like it does. Nba Backwater at the time. The hawks get really good. That hawks team like everyone sort of looks at them as this poster team for like upper crust mediocrity like. It'll you don't Wanna be the Joe Johnson Hawk skin out in the second round all the time but like that was a good team. There's a there's a good NBA team and he was well. The keep thing with Joe Johnson the contract kind of overwhelmed half of his career. He made so much money and it was so ridiculous that he just became overrated and he wasn't over e game based on what I want for the two guard position Here's a guy who can score twenty two twenty two points a game and he'll make four out of every ten threes like that good. That's what makes the next five or six picks interesting. Is that drafting from the perspective of twenty twenty. You have Joe Johnson. Richard Jefferson. Jane Batty Jason Richardson Wings. Who like now you'd be like? Yeah Joe Johnson played two three four like they all shoot. Threes there multi positional. And then you have like you have some guys who are more old school like Zebo or Tyson Chandler. Like how do you but had really great career? So how? I'm curious to see how we valued those sort of attributes. The Joe Johnson thing was the Celtics is tough because you just like came in if him and Paul Pierce together. It's not exactly the same but it's it's reminiscent of the tatum Brown Combo they have now or every team in the league would be like. Oh I'd love to have to win guys like that. I just build around those guys for ten years in you look back retroactively to go. They'd Paul Pierce Joe Johnson. And they just had that for twelve years. That seems like they should want to do that. And he was gone after fifty. Yeah I had Joe Johnson forth on my board after arena so we have the same top four guys in a different order but I joe Johnson for all right. So you're up you're got the fifth pick I went back and forth a lot of times on this for the reasons I just talked about about position on versatility and all that but in the end I just thought the raw talent of Zach Randolph couldn't be denied at this pick and even though he's not sexy in the position versatility shooting threes. He actually got off to quite a slow start in his career in Portland but I think at some point you just have to say he's the best guy of these guys he's the most talented guy and I'll find a way either to play inside out around him or maybe all coax him into shooting threes way earlier in his career than didn't really shoot threes into the last couple years of his career. Probably could have been a decent three point shooter if teams had actually directed his game that way and I will have a good healthy culture on my team for Young Zach. Randolph there is not gonNA be jail. Blazers Shenanigans going on so I- debated RJ debated batty as sort of like al-shabaab. Da Does win you know I debated a couple of other guys but I just went at some point. Eight straight years averaging eighteen points a game just a problem Zach. Randolf was a problem and so I went Zebo. I had him there as well. Twenty ten guy for from two thousand Ford through two thousand eleven the thing. So it's funny. He got he's at Portland. Gets traded is a key traits form. Everybody's like well that's the dumbest thing ever GonNa play Isaiah. Nettie Your Eddy Curry Zach randolf together and Isaiah was doing that. Whole the rest of the league's getting faster and has more shooting ominous zig the other way. I'M GOING TO GET BIGGER. And it was a disaster immediate going bully ball and it was like wow the and all the relatively smart basketball people like. He can't play those guys together. There'll never work defensively. You'RE GONNA get destroyed like please don't do that. He tried it. I went back and read old clips and it was. It was a trip to see New York Times. Era Howard back after twenty games writing. I guess scouts around the League are like one of these guys has to come off the bench. Because it's not working out with Eddie. Korean Zach Randolph. And like David Lee is getting lost in the shuffle. It's a disaster foof so he gets traded the clippers. I had season tickets. That was the era almost gave up my season tickets. After the season I run a diary of going to a game where it ends with their down to Zach Randolph. Airballs twenty nine footer. Coming out of a timeout to the game at that point there was Zach Randolph. Stock was like a penny. I would have not wanted Zach Randolph. Stock I was just like this guy's a loser puts a empty calories stats on bad teams. And that's where I'm landing but you look at that Memphis. He GOES TO MEMPHIS. Got Memphis. Got Him and it's just a straight salary like please take saccharin up. There were Quentin. Richardson was in that dealers. Like other stuff but Memphis got him for essentially free right they get him but I think that two thousand eleven season He's twenty and twelve and it goes into the playoffs and this is one of the loss. Great playoff upsets. 'cause we the Spurs now from eleven through fourteen. There's this second spurs run that's happening and in eleven they get just derailed by this crazy Memphis team. That's terrible matchup for them. For whatever reason I think they easily could have made the finals at year. Two thousand twelve. They're about to make the finals. And Okay see taps into this unbelievable potential they Dan. I'm not making it two thousand thirteen. They're up five with twenty seconds left. Blow it and then two thousand fourteen. They finally win but man. If you look back at that spurs run the over under for titles is easily to. It might even be two and a half. Considering what else happened in the League at that point and this two thousand eleven it was fucking bonkers memphis not only upset them. It was legitimate. It was like if those teams played twenty times. Eddie Memphis wins like fourteen or fifty. And just everything about it was a bad match up but a Jew. Nobody was injured and I believe the last game of the regular season that year. He heard his arm against Phoenix. I want to say miss the first game of that series in and but what people don't remember as much is the Spurs. Were coming off first round loss in. Oh nine getting drilled off the floor by the sons and the second round two thousand ten then they win sixty one gains in its discreet feel-good story and they lose in the first round. Yeah nobody's injured. There's like you know like some extenuating circumstances but that series after those two previous playoff series. That was a time when people were like. Maybe that's it like that. Losing a one eight series. Who's like people didn't see the twelve thirteen fourteen? Run COMING AFTER THAT SO I don't look at that necessarily as like one continuous run. I look at two thousand twelve particularly when they got. Do as the start of sort of a new identity of what the spurs were going to be. And you could see sprinkling you could. You could see coming in two thousand ten twenty eleven but when they lost that series that was when people most started loudly saying maybe it says over like maybe they're they're run as a championship. Contender is over and that totally wrong. They add collide. That summer. To the draft isn't isn't all sin Alzheimer Asphalt Alzheimer. I still think there's a world where the Spurs make the finals in eleven 'cause then the other thing that happened was member they're talking about. Do we trade? Tony Parker. Tony Parker might be the table. They ended up trading George show instead but there was a whole case for a while. They just lost the first round again. Got Shake it up. Maybe they maybe Parker as the most values in his prime and they flip show for the rest of that series was also the Marcus. All breakout series. Fourteen and twelve against the spurs in that series. And then just classic Tony Allen trick or treat toy kind of evolved into the The full fledged Tony. All right so I guess you got to six pick and now it gets really interesting so we went Palca Saal Tony Parker Gilbert Arenas Joe Johnson Zach Randolph. I'm taking Tyson Chandler with the six pack. Oh and here's my case. I think his career if you played it twenty times this is probably one of the worst versions of it. He goes to that Weird Chicago team. nothing goes right. Just you know hurts his back. That's a huge setback. gets traded to New Orleans with Chris. Paul great this is this is GonNa be awesome has a couple of good New Orleans years for them in. Oh eight he was almost. He was twelve and twelve regular season Sixty two percent shooting and then at some point he ends up on. Its UP ON CHARLOTTE. Do you remember why he ended UP ON CHARLOTTE? Do we have a record of that? Did he sign with them? transactions own involved traded at traded straight. Up for Mecca. Okeafor Makoko for this right. Yeah and up in Charlotte but then if you remember. There's this unbelievable fork in the road with him. Were okay for him. Yeah and then vetoes the trade because of a physical and he almost ends up on this team with the Baka durant and Westbrook as the Kendrick Perkins piece they would have kept Jeff. Green Trade for somewhere else says a couple of forks in the road there where I just feel like man in a different situation. He's better asked. Think as like a screen enroll guy in two thousand twenty. If you take mid-2000s Tyson Chandler. I think something happens there to other cases for him he's thirteen mile. Mba in two thousand twelve for the Knicks and then in the in the Dallas series even though the stats don't really measure the full impact. He's one of the reasons they won. That Dow the Miami Finals with a the defense of him and Marianne and just the way there was all the while. He was insanely good in those finals. Defensive Yeah Insanely Good. Anyone defensive player of the year once for the next Probably so he's basically he's basically a ten and ten from the two thousand three season all the way through two thousand seventeen. He's eleven and twelve for those fifteen years. And I just I like the longevity and I do think that. And he's also a great teammate. Beloved teammate by all counts Right Jeffrey. Here not a lot of bad. Tyson Chandler stuff out there. I was probably low rough. Phoenix was rough I you know Dallas Round two. He had a he had moments in Dallas round. Two for the two thousand fourteen fifteen mavs. I ended up. He's basically at a different point in his career at that point. Yeah I ended up taking him much lower than not much lower but a few spots lower than you did because I think you nailed it right the first thing you said if you play out his career this is one of the worst versions of it like he wasn't good in Chicago. It's like if you boil down. Tyson Chandler Career. The heiser really high like he's an NBA champion. Uses the defensive player. There is a criticize the keystone of an NBA championship defense. But his game never changed it all right like Tyson Chandler. This is how you have to play on offense. He just has to screen and roll. That's it you can't play any other style. We can't do anything else but he did. Great and you're really getting like if you boil it down. He had five good seasons. Maybe six the to New Orleans Seasons C. P. and then Dallas Knicks Knicks after that the decline Kinda came fast and given his his one dimensionality on offense and his relatively may be abbreviated peak. I had him a little bit lower but I loved Ice Chandler. So I you know I. I don't feel strongly about my six seven eight nine order but I did. I had him lower than you. The one thing I one thing with channel forgot to mention I think if he had a really good point guard it's a little light dandruff Jordan st and Marcus Camby. There's certain guys is like if if you if they're just the recipient of somebody else's brilliant stay actually are going to be much better and the stuff. I thought he was great on those orlands teams. But if you're a lot catcher and you're playing at that time with the best lob throw in the NBA and David Wests. Stretch FOR INSTALL. Yaacob pitches involved like you're just going to be rolling into open space. And you're going to thrive and same thing with maps like smart offense dirk at the four like you're going to be rolling open space. But think about him on the as view took two thousand Chandler and put him on that two thousand Twenty Lakers team in the Dwight. Howard Chevelle spot. That's like the ultimate situation firm. Anyway all right. You're up seven thick I went now. You get since you've taken Tyson Chandler off the board. Now you get three wings who I have all right next to each other and Richard Jefferson And Jason Johnson. I flirted with taking batty a here. Because of just how long he was like a an elite stopper on defense in one of sort of not original but one of the version. Two Point Zero of three and D guys But I just I I went with Richard Jefferson in this spot. Because I how I I just thought he's he's Twenty points scored three times in his career. Seven straight years. Fifteen plus feel like decent defender that I could have got to defend it in elite level of in like multi-positional no all star teams on these guys are made any all star teams But I just thought upside I'm taking. Rj is a two way player who can create off the dribble and run in transition. Maybe post the occasional mismatch can do more on offense and Shane. Batty can do was a good three point shooter so I went upside of Richard Jefferson. Plus because you get old you get old. Richard Jefferson. You get two thousand. Sixteen Finals Cagey veteran. Who can actually play a game seven? Richard Jefferson the but the like from age twenty nine to that finals was rough for Richard. Like the the decline happened. It came Fast Spurs your Richard Jefferson. Warriors Your Richardson. Lega wasn't it wasn't great for a while so I went but I went. Rj in this spot at seven. Beloved Teammates I. I thought the I had Jason Richardson. The highest of those three. I'M GONNA make I had. I had them the lowest those three. I'll be interested. Maybe we should do a twitter vote. Who would you in the redraft? We could put those three guys. 'cause I I had the same thing I had. Those three guys together is trying to figure it out. Here is the case for Richardson. So you take Richardson eight them. In the end this March I'm taking him eighth Oh seven warriors at some. He had some Monster Games in the. We believe run electric team in the playoffs. Eleven playoff games thirty nine minutes a game. He was nineteen and seven took seven and a half threes. A game of the. Oh seven playoffs so I just felt like if you're extending forward until we play basketball now it'd be even better 'cause you know he's jacking up the thing that really pushed it over the top for me other than you know. I just think he was a better. The Best Player of those three guys like just you know he averaged twenty two a game golden state no sex for seven five games but I remember I was friends with Steve Kerr by the time. The two thousand ten sons team really rolled into a team. That almost made the finals and unexpectedly in lots of ways and I remember when they traded for Richardson. Just talking to Steve about it at the time and he was like this guy's such a good player we had no idea and I knew Nash a little bit at that point because we're doing thirty and he was like we had no idea rich. Was this good. He just not only does he fit in with all this stuff we love to but we can actually like throwing the ball and he can create a shot and you look at the The playoffs that year they played sixteen playoff games. He was twenty and five forty seven point five percent from three. So He's another guy that I if you played his career twenty times. I wonder how many times there's a better version of what we ended up with. Where basically he's he's stayed in Charlotte for the first eight years of his career. Those teams sucked. I don't know I don't quibble with it. I you could throw these three wings in any order you want. I had them all ahead of ice in Chandler. Just because I'm drafting with a little bit of an eye on twenty twenty versatility I just I I just. I never quite trusted Jason Bridgeton. Big Spot I just remember summaries. I never I just never. Maybe I'm maybe the missed box out. He had for Phoenix in game. Five of those conference finals when are test tips in the Kobe? Air Ball his color. Neva's standards Unifem but the we believe thing was like found money that was just feel good fun times and they were a really good team I just I just kind of never trusted Jason. Richardson like a just a big big. Big Spot never trusted them so I had. I had him after bad here so I will then take batty with what we had the ninth bake. I'll take batty knife. Can I give you two Trades Jason? Richardson was involved. But they're easy is involved in a huge trade with Gilbert Arenas so in two thousand eight Richardson and Jared Dudley to Phoenix for Raja Bell. Boris diaw Sean. Single Terry Steve Curtis winning. Winning trade gets basically the best two guys that are trade. Because Boris Boris kind of create. A little bit there and then in two thousand ten December. He's traded with Earl Clark and heater Turkoglu to Orlando for Vince. Carter Marsin Cortott Michael Patriots. And a two thousand eleven. I A lot of stuff in that trade. I don't even remember that he goes. That's that's a three team trade in Gilbert Arenas in that trade to Orlando as well That's there's a whole bunch of stuff going that's not in my basketball reference page. Then he's also he was in the insane trade Right near the end of the two thousand twelve Olympics when all the sudden Dwight Howard was traded. You look at it in the white our trade. There's so many names in that trade. The on his Basketball reference page. It's like a giant paragraph like a war and peace pair of everything up in front of you. Yeah Batty Ninth Pick. I think it's fair. That gets good value. I think Couple things have to be mentioned. Just quick with him. He's basically the the George Washington of advanced metric basketball players right. The Michael Lewis. Piece about why Daryl chose him over route again. That's all star right. He becomes the moneyball baseball. Whoever the guys on the Oakland A.'s were Michael Lewis wrote about for that Scott Aberg I his two thousand twelve finals game. Abs ARE TWO THOUSAND. Thirteen finals game seven. They needed somebody to get hot. Who Wasn't Lebron James? Somebody to make some threes. Who's either GONNA BE HIM? Mario chalmers Array Allen and if one of those three guys that have made some threes. They're losing and he got hot but remember. We were working that year in member. We talked to him during that finals member. How bummed out he was. He was saying you went. You went. He was like barely playing. And then we were asking him like what's going on man you cool and he just had that look like there's so much I wanna say but I'm not WANNA upset the apple cart but well. Let's fuck man. I'm not playing. Look at this game log last. Three Games Against Indiana and the conference finals eight minutes. Four minutes D. N. P. I four games of the final six minutes. Five minutes eight minutes eight minutes. Then he's up to seventeen twelve and then in game seven twenty nine minutes six threes end. Razi game seven and honestly. That's why they win. Because that game was was a two point game with a minute left at say that tonio the ball and if he doesn't make fig if he goes oh for eight or one for eight they lose so so I I had him. I think shame bad is a winning basketball player so I had him a little harder but I will say I had him seventh on my board but I will gladly accept him with the Ninth. Pick in this draft. I handler in Richardson. Yeah I went back. I went. Rj Six body seven j rich eight Tyson Chandler nine. I can't wait to see who you pick ten well for everyone scoring at home. There's now a drop off. We have now and as the GER Joan Wallace memo. Ochre trae Murphy Eddie. Curry Vlad. Red Bandaged kwami Brown sandown. Bear Jamaal Tinsley Earl Watson Carlos Arroyo. Yeah we can we can probably be. Yeah we're we're we're we're in the homestretch. I I really enjoyed memo for getting ahead. I thought I was going to reach him tense. He's a no brainer Ted Fiqh. It's it's a guy that for a couple years there was was first of all. He finished his career as a fourteen. And Seven. Which I was surprised by. But then you look at some of the three-point Stats. Yeah an an. Oa to nine combined. Let's throw in two thousand ten to actually So three years on Utah competitive teams and he's forty percent from three taking three point three a Gabe fifteen seven. Be think like nowadays a basketball. He'd be like coveted right teams. After Momma memo core he would be like he was and now would be even more in elites like a really good stretch. Five like memo car was really good stretch. Five that's what he would be. He'd be bombing threes. He would be on offense. He would be Brook Lopez's except he would be taking twice as many threes on defense you would not be Brook Lopez but that he would be a dangerous dangerous player so I had him tenth. No no brainer. Two Thousand Eight playoffs twelve games. They lose to the Lakers round two fifteen and twelve. Does Utah Fun with Boozer and Okoro and de well. Those are fun teams. Fifteen and twelve took four point. Three three is a game thirty seven percent from three so well ahead of his time. Who Knew Memo car a Mike? Buddha Holzer kind of coach would get him today and be like you're taking twelve threes again. You'RE GONNA put pick and pop every play and you're gonNA take a million threes and he got hurt but he's the other piece with him was he was on the Pistons Originally Yup and they kind of fucked it up and they got rid of him and he's somebody that would have helped them in the mid to thousands as they you know went down some of the bigger. He's one of those guys. Where if you have him and you keep him. You're able to transition more smoothly from one era to the next without as much of a a drop off so. I had him tenth to eleventh by the way he played in an all star game. Scott memo was good like I thought about. I thought almost half for fun and have for serious. I thought about taking him even higher than this. So the The Pistons let him go for that summer. They couldn't. I remember. There was something where they could of locked him down and just decided not to It's it's hard when you're that good to carry guys. Who you think are ready to help you win. Immediately but Memo occur was a good. Nba player tours. Kill I believe he also tore his Achilles and that sort of derailed his his His lawyer I forgot he got. He got a ring and four. He played eleven five minutes a game on that. Oh for I am notation player. I have no recollection of one thing. He did in the O. Four finals I watched two of the Games recently. I don't don't remember. They did all right. Who Do you have a? What is this eleven yeah eleven? I went Gerald Wallace Just just if we could ever get the shooting a little better the value like just a guy who can guard everywhere and was you off the court I think The stories about his diet in his habits are pretty. Well known like I but I think on my team we would have been ahead of the curve with personal chefs like delivering stuff to his house. In the off season I would Gerald Wallace a better three point shooter. And just you throw in the defense. Like Joe Walsh was good man. I I have no. I'm fine with him at this pick. What was I? Don't remember? The diet stories is just an ox. Guy Yeah I think he I was a bad eater and And I would have rectified. That he was a really good point when he when he kinda declined. Fast people were yeah. People in the League were not surprised that he declined fast like after age thirty. So he got Rod Strickland Itis. Maybe there was. I was playing fantasy all all the two thousand two thousand ten season he had. He had some good Charlotte. Charlotte teams. Were Weird. They competent there for a couple of years. Captain Jack was involved there a little bit. Yeah but he. He averaged ten rebounds. A game in two thousand ten is eighteen and Ted but I remember hearing a couple of games that year. We have twenty five rebounds or like some crazy and everybody Jerry Wallace. He's see how little you put a little guy on him. He could mash him in the post. Like Prime Gerald Wallace could do a lot of stuff. We can't let Gerald while section of the podcast go without bringing up one other piece Damian Lillard now three player draft three per draft for guy. Billy King. Have you have you ever told the story in a podcast of would of the billy king story or does that she would just do it now? Like the eighty minute mark billy. I have reconciled Reconciled a strong we never like non reconciled but He was one of several NBA figures. Who did not like me on first blush because of you. It had nothing to do with me. It's just that I worked granted. I had the nerve to take a paycheck from you. Who put him in the atrocious? Gm summit as just a regular. He's like a star of the atrocious. Pm Seven Multiple Times. So I it was it was. It was very clear to me that I was being hated. Vicariously us not the only NBA executive to do this It was made no. It was made very clear to me that I was not a friendly presence at the Barclays Center for a little bit. But we got over it. We got over it. He's a very nice guy but Yeah He. He was not the only one and he was friendlier than the other ones. Who who took their anti bill cinnamon out on me. You know it's funny. I always felt like I was job. Performance mean at that point especially like the Li- from like two thousand mid two thousand nine. I don't remember like getting Super Personal. Like with billy king was just like this guy did a bad job like the Joe. Walsh trade is it negligent trade. You're doing your your trading for this guy's contract Portland's delighted to get rid of for any first round pick because you're not even putting the right protections. 'cause de will needed veteran help and like your wallace. The bad trade too stuffy didn't phillies before he got outstare. Like kinda indefensible now. I'm getting mad. The bill king was mad at me. How dare you mad at me for All right Twelve pick only one guy on my board and then it gets dark. I thought Troy Murphy and a couple of good year we are we are in lockstep last. Step Troy Murphy. Is like the the slightly. Jv memo or if you were today people would just make an stretch five. You would shoot a ton of threes. And he was a really good shooter so as you know. My Dad loved any left-handed white guy who reminded him of Dave Collins was. Is The quickest way to my dad's. My Dad was very upset. When they didn't take Troy Murphy with the eleventh pick in two thousand one the Celtics and then as it became pretty clear pretty quickly. That Q Jake Brown was destined for Yugoslavia or Spain or Russia. Or whatever country? Who's GONNA playing in? There is a true murphy year. Oh five yeah. He puts up fifteen eleven for Golden State and sheets almost forty percent from three to sticky. Good three point shooter And then became openly. Good when he got to Indiana 'cause they actually had him shoot the threes and my dad was just furious about Jerry. Murphy you would have thought Troy Murphy was like the next Larry. Bird some man. We miss that. So his career didn't quite pan out that way but man if you look at his two thousand nine season when he's fourteen and twelve and he's taken five threes agape shooting forty five percent from three first career is thirty nine percent three point shooter. A he would have had a better art now. So Trey Murphy underrated yeah. I had him no easily twelfth. Pick and I thought about taking them higher but I just couldn't but yeah he would just shoot a lot of threes. That's why my thirteenth pick. We're getting we're entering the part of the draft where I'm just defaulting to like. Can you do one thing really well in his? That one's shooting right sad so I took a thirteenth. I took Radovich because I was just like I know this guy plugin plays he's a four. You can shoot threes like could he be `Davis Britan's now and NBA just launched tons of threes. Not Quite that quick release may be but I just default into. I know what this guy is. He's good at the most important thing. I'm taking them. Career thirty eight percent three point shooter asset had thirteenth. So now I had the last pick unless you WANNA fifty and pick no so. It's basically Eddie courier. Sam Down Bear so a two enticing choices Sam Poise eight hundred eighty six games peaking with a ten in ten on the sixers Bounced around in a really insane way somehow played for six teams Eddie. The case for him is that that that one eddy curry season where he is falling apart quickly. That one season that. Oh five bowls where he's putting up sixteen game in twenty eight minutes But I mean that. You just can't win with Eddy Curry some taking Sam Dalbar I we had. I had Delaware Fourteen. I think he was a A good all around player. Who could do good shot? Blocker had a little bit of touch like a tiny bit of touch that if nurtured correctly could have been like a decent pick and pop touch Right ran the floor. Good feel for the game. I took him over Eddy. Curry Eddy Curry. The plus minus stats were ugly. Even when he was put up numbers Just because defensively. I didn't I didn't know how to take into account the health issues. That were the reason. The Bulls ended up trading up to the Knicks. Like an all time New York. Next bad trade But I took in Brazil so that so that means picks one and four do not make our revised top fourteen kwami brand or eddy curry not to mention Eddie Griffin and Tucson a Job Rodney. White. He drink brown all fall out of Eddie Griffin off. Which I did I didn't know what to do with Eddie Griffin but they all fought the lottery so we went Kazaa. One Parker two arenas three Joe Johnson four Zach Randolph Five Chandler six Richard Jefferson Seven. J Rich Eight. Shame bad ADENINE. Yes memo ochre. Big winner this pod. Ten Joe Ross. Eleven Troy Murphy. Twelve Rodman Ridge. Thirteen down bear fourteen before we go. Which guy have you still not given up on yet from this draft? Even though all of their careers are over as anyone. You're still kind of holding out hope for This is a great question I always have soft spot for Jamaal Tinsley. Who was the twenty seventh pick in this draft and had some decent years in the NBA in could really pass. So obviously he was a major participant in the malice in the palace. And some other stuff but I'm going I'm still interested in Jamaal Tinsley so mine is I thought that was a great pick. I remember there was a Jamaal. Tinsley Gamer had like at least twenty two assists in a game or some crazy number number. My Guys Bobby Simmons. I not just as easy namesake. Bobby Simmons from you but I just wanted to say in Two thousand five for the QUIP. Sixteen and six forty three point. Five percent from three granted didn't take a ton of threes and then Milwaukee signed him he cashed in And forty two percent from three that year and then he got hurt and his crew was never the same but I really liked. It was a three indeed guy. I think he's the kind of guy that you know. He could have had a Marvin Williams type career where he just played for fifteen years and was a good teammate and made some threes it just kept going and going going gone but he got hurt and it's so funny like guys get Guy One injury. It's just your career's over and it's so unfair. Some guys that happens to other guys are fine like even in the Michael Jordan the documentary. That is coming out next week. He breaks his foot as as a second year guy and like what if he had just continued have problems with that foot for the rest of his career. And we never Michael Jordan used ever know so I feel bad for him because I thought he was good. I if people could've bet preemptively on this podcast they could have won a lot of money I think on. Do they get through ninety minutes without the words? Brian SCALLOP GREENIE. Being uttered at any moment the thirty fifth pick in this draft. Not that he was going to be a candidate for top fourteen given his celtics ties then and now as an announcer you would think scowl one of the Red Mambas would would come up in this. Discussion somehow is probably a top fifteen salary guy from this draft who that's because e e here that one contractor where he made like fifty million for five years or something curry ended up making close to one hundred million. I'm sure Chandler made a Shitload Gobert. Had that one crazy crazy contract that than Otis Smith ended up trading for which was one of the dumbest moves of all time But yeah some guys from this draught cashed. Tony Parker probably at three different fifty to sixty million dollar deals at some point. Probably he probably made in the one fifty to one seventy trans show. Yeah there we go. That was the draft was a fun draft so down the road bringing do. Oh nine with you on your on your part to my favorite o-9 is my in recent vintage. Oh nine is just I just Kinda WanNa redraft the whole thing for like four hours that hold that whole draft is like insane and I love every second because I'm looking forward to that Zach Lowe. Glad you're staying safe. Thanks for coming on pleasures. Always always a pleasure my friend. Thanks for listening to the two thousand one redraft ables with Being Zach Lowe. Stay tuned on this feed will be running at least a couple more redraft ables including the two thousand three redraft with my old nemesis frenemy. Friend Chad Ford. This was the first draft. We really battled over. That's coming up later And you can listen to his brand new podcast that he just launched two if you want to hear even more draft content there. Don't forget about the Bill Simmons. Pack has don't forget about the Rewatch ables where we had We have a couple of new ones this week. Total recalls already up and made. The State is coming later this week in the next week. It's going to get super walk. Stay tuned for that. And that's it stay safe.

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Ian Johnson on Starring Overseas, Battling OCD, Playing With Carmelo Anthony in High School and More (Ep. 190)

The HoopsHype Podcast With Alex Kennedy

48:45 min | 9 months ago

Ian Johnson on Starring Overseas, Battling OCD, Playing With Carmelo Anthony in High School and More (Ep. 190)

"Welcome to the hoop site podcast. My name is Alex Kennedy just reminder. We have new episodes every Monday and Thursday. We recently had mark Cuban. Or Sean Holmes Sean. Marianne and Greg Oden on the podcast attract those episodes out joining me. Today is Ian Johnson. Who Played at Oak Hill Academy in Davidson? Before becoming an all-star overseas he won multiple championships in many individual accolades throughout his playing career. He's also an author who wrote the book the bounce in the Echo dying to love a game about his basketball career in his battle with obsessive compulsive disorder a link to order book. Have you found in description this episode Ian? Thanks for joining me. How are you? I'm doing great? Thanks for having me. Yeah thank you so for your time. I had to say this was a fantastic book. I'm not just saying that because you're here I really enjoy reading it and I couldn't put it down. I want to ask you this. You know I've always wanted to write a book and it's on my bucket list. How how long did it take you to write this? And what was that experience like true story? I didn't actually want to write. A book about basketball will learn about myself. I wanted and still want to be anonymous. I was writing all these practice novels and none of them were any good so then taking the advice of someone else started journaling and then a span of two or three weeks. I knocked out. It'd be fifty thousand seven five thousand word just didn't realize how much to get out and then through a contact someone the first chapter light it and then put me in touch with the publisher in publisher said. Hey you got more and I said Yeah. Tens of thousands of more words can we? Can we make us into a book and then kind of went from there so it's almost like an an accidental book? But yeah that's amazing. Glad that I wrote it. Yeah you know I. I write long articles for hoops hype but the idea of writing a book and sitting down organizing it. It just seems so daunting intimidated by but at some point. I'll get over that and do it but I was so impressed I WanNa talk about your story a little bit. You describe yourself as a recovering athlete and I found that really interesting the first time that we were kind of talking and use that term. You told me that you even just playing pickup basketball. Brings back this competitiveness that you don't like and affects your mental health? Can you describe what you mean by recovering athlete? So the the idea for the term recovering athlete. I borrowed from the terms for recovering alcoholic and recovering addict so in AA alcoholics anonymous when an alcoholic or an addict to get sober. It don't consider themselves cured of alcoholism or addiction. Consider themselves in recovery. Even though they're not drinking or using anymore and When I was an athlete to operate it under some pretty intense and ultracompetitive mindsets which you know I think most athletes can relate to and now you can see that I was kind of addicted to the hits and the highs that are needed from the game to feel good about myself and then once I retired. Those mindsets weren't useful anymore. They were almost relevant. And Ragnar discovered that there were other better ways to live and so decided to work to dissolve and let go of those unhealthy mindsets and it's been great to none thankful for that process but I like to stay aware that I can pretty easily slip back into those old patterns and this is why I relate myself to the alcoholics acts and I call myself a recovering recovering athlete. Like you said. Sometimes we'll play pick up basketball and I just found myself just indebted to the game like I need to score. I need to kill this guy in order to feel good about myself. That's ultimately how I decided I didn't WanNa live. Yeah for sure so whenever you are. Let's say you pay pick up or that kindest are happening again What does that do to your mental health? I think it triggers a triggers. Read the book. suffered suffered a lot and still suffer sometimes from obsessive compulsive symptoms and and the no hybrid repetitive world of of Sports. Those obsessive compulsive compulsive symptoms get triggered pretty easily so I take a lot of steps in my life to make sure that I stay healthy and symptom free no one steps. I fortunately or unfortunately have to take this thing away from those altered competitive situations like like pick a basketball well. That's great that you've been able to figure out. Okay what can I do to? What can I stay away from to make sure I don't have those symptoms? Great that you've been able to kind of figure that out and Have less of those symptoms later in life but in the book talk about dealing with that as a child to and how you had a very specific bedtime routine and things like that. At what age did you start experiencing those symptoms? And how was that as a kid I think well first of all with OCD. It's it's different manifestation for for every single person who experiences it. My own symptoms began when I was about nine. And it coincided with a a family moving down to To Virginia from Pittsburgh feels like a big move from everything that I had known and then I went down to Virginia. The story I tell my first Demoiselles walking up the stairs my new home and there was a bug on the second step up and then for some reason associated that that bug in that second step was something really bad happening to someone or something like I might die if I stuck step on the second step so I started voiding that second step every single time I walked up the stairs for for decades and the symptoms as I got into Middle School and Got Older. They kind of from there. No bedtime routine was a very strict rigid thing ahead almost like a schedule so I had to lay down in bed at a certain time to flip through a magazine certain way looking at certain pages and then when the time was right to choose you like twenty two minutes twenty seven minutes past the hour. I could get up. Go to the bathroom and then come back from the bathroom. And then hopefully I feel like things are okay to go to sleep. And if they're not then I go through the process again for another hour and tiredness than then I fall asleep but You know like I said everyone's symptoms are different. There's trouble twenty or twenty five different subsets of of OCD from harm CD when you embark thoughts you think you might harm somebody. There's what they call pedophilia. Ocd when you think you might sexually abuse a child even though you won't there's a homosexual cd where you feel like you're queer even though you're not and the delicious this keeps going on and on the very confusing. It's a very complex illness. And it's it's different for everybody. Yeah I've learned so much about. Ocd in the last few years. Because my wife who you've met. She works at a clinic where she works with patients that have OCD and anxiety disorders. And things like that. And I really didn't know much about it. I haven't had any relatives that you know had it. I A friend now. I know a friend. Now that has it but you know I've learned so much and like you said I didn't realize that there was different manifestations violent. Ocd and these people you know for people who don't know they could be walking in a hallway and they see someone and they're terrified that they're going to hurt them in some way like you know something's going to follow their bag and hurt them. They're going to bump into them and they're gonNA fall on crack their head open. You know even if there's no chance of they're actually gonNA hurt the person they're worried and it kind of the worst case scenario so I've learned a lot. About what age did you kind of realize? Oh this is what I'm dealing with. I know in the book you talked about being in college and you had professors. I was reading about what? Ocd was and you felt like they were describing you. At what age did you kind of realize oh I have? Ocd and really learn a lot about it. And start addressing that I had had hince throughout college and early twenties that I might be experiencing those again like you said. I took a class in in college called psychopharmacology and we spent a week on each different mental illness and then on OCD. I was reading about. I think man. This sounds a lot like me but I didn't want to be a HYPOCHONDRIAC and so I said I was kind of dismissed it and then once we got onto the next subject. I didn't think about it that much anymore. I was I was I think. Twenty five or twenty six years old when I was first diagnosed having experienced pretty severe symptoms for about about sixteen years and the thing is that there is a cultural perception folksy which revolves around germs. And as good as gets with Jack. Nicholson not stepping on the cracks. And stuff like that but I think the with the OCD researchers are finding now is that. There's a huge other subset of OCD. What's is sometimes called pure? Ocd and the symptoms aren't made manifest in a physical way. So you're not stepping on cracks or not You know washing your hands hundred times a day. You're just all takes place in your brain. It's kind of like a hidden hidden disease. And that's that's kind of what what I experienced. If you paid attention you could. You could see some of my symptoms. You know some people that were close to. I think we're confused. Sometimes if something's idea or would say but for the most part my symptoms stated stayed in my head. I think part of the reason I wrote. The book tried to give a little narrative to that head part of ASEAN to help people realize that there is a way out for sure. Yeah and the book you do a great job of weaving your basketball story in with your OCD story and kind of how you were struggling when battling OCD WALL. Doing amazing job as a basketball player. I mean I want to talk about your basketball success for a bit here. You know you played Oak Hill Academy alongside Carmelo Anthony You went to Davidson. Played there for years. You were professional overseas. You gave an all star overseas one championships. I mean you had success throughout your career. Let's start with high school. As I mentioned you play with Carmelo. What was that like and at that age? Was it obvious to you that he was going to become this? Nba superstar or was he just another team mate? A what was that kind of a leg that experience to be honest as I didn't really know much about okay. I didn't know anything about Carmelo before I got there as it was a really good Team have won National Championships tyrod rise at Oak Hill and it was just as incredibly calm and peaceful place in coach. Steve Smith and his wife. Lisa are to the most grounded Humorous they laugh real easily a at the situation there was just a very loving and welcome place and then Carmelo. I didn't know that he was as good as he was for for awhile. I mean he had blown up his junior year a senior. He really really exploded onto the scene. And now he's I had a chance to catch up with them in. Two Thousand Sixteen is still pretty much the same guys one of the funniest people I've ever met. He's pretty granted he's got A. I think a good could perspective. I don't WanNa say the. Nba Hasn't changed him in some way. But I think he he's sensitive I think I'll stop I. You had a front row seat for the Carmelo. Anthony Lebron James Showdown between Oak Hill and saint minutes eight. Mary's do what do you remember from that night? I remember from that night is obviously the basketball and I think you could Go Online and Watch. What some of the clips. But the memory I have of that is after the game we'd won. I think it was sixty. Six sixty three. Lebron had thirty six Carmella thirty-three was basically a one on one game for most of the game and then if they got stuck they pass it out and it was. It was great. I'm not knocking after the game. After I showered I left left the locker room. And there's this kind of lobby area and the Braun was on the far side. The far side of the rooms are surrounded by probably five or six different TV cameras in between Your twenty-five print reporters and they're all just bombarding him with attention that he's he's sitting back on the table and he's not axing on his His backpack strategies and he's looking down backpack strapped. He's trying to fix the saying Dang. Look at this backpack straps and it just struck me but the while got seventeen years old and the with this kind of attention the way he can handle. It was just amazing. Yes that he's going to handle things and he's doing things. His own way is is is is awesome. I think recently the The people getting on the Brown for trying to mentor younger players is is just ridiculous. I I cannot stand that kind of criticism in. I just love how we handle that the other night. He said they could kiss his ass. I think that's great. Yeah he doesn't get enough credit for dealing with all that I mean I always say he's basically a child star you know. He was sixteen years old whenever he started getting national attention and became one of the celebrities in the world. Like you know when we talk about child stars from music or acting. It's always oh you know. They grow up in a mess. And they have all these you know issues with law and Addictions and things like that. But I mean he has been. He's lived up to the hype and then some and not having any of those issues. It's just phenomenal. I mean I think it's pretty impressive and you had to get enough credit for that obviously gets a lot of credit for his career and his accomplishments. But I think that's that's amazing to me what he's been able to do just he. No one has grown up like Lebron. He has one of the most unique lifestyle he could have and yet it really to all online athletes. And if I can relate. Ocd to Lebron for a second. Yeah so I think I don't know Lebron but I think one of the reasons. Lebron has stayed as grounded as he has is that he's kept his core of friendships that he's had for his his whole life. I think if you take away the guys. Lebron been friends with from a young age. Lebron is not to Sing Lebron that we know him as and northland. Ocd The years. Where my my symptoms were the best. You could say what was suffering the least with the years when I got along most was able to get along most best with with my teammates and just having that Brotherhood in that Camaraderie keeps keeps you human in a way so I think that's profit abroad for staying staying friends with the right people. Yeah that support system is so important and you kind of see that You know whether you're struggling with OCD or not. Everyone's struggling with something. So when you have that support system it just makes things so much. Easier as a great point After kill you went to Davidson. You played four years there when you were a freshman at Davidson Dickie. V put out a list of the five most promising freshman to watch Carmelo. Anthony Chris Bosh. Jj Redick Sheldon Williams and Ian Johnson. You you write about this in the book how the other four went onto the NBA lottery. Picks you also talked about being profiled in the paper and having a bunch of different newspaper clippings what was it like dealing with the expectations and the pressure. That kinda came along with that hype so the I mean the truth is I didn't know how to deal with them and I didn't know how to do with the hype which is another way of saying that. I didn't know how to deal with success in praise. I play my best games and games. Where either people definitely didn't think we could do well or there was no external expectation and No part of that is just not having a sense of self and part of that is is not Not Believing in myself the way that I could have believed it myself and And the book. I talked about the difference between what other people see me as and what I saw myself. As and when that distance was there and No. I couldn't meet the expectations that other people could on me. My response was to just almost self sabotage. The My my first half my freshman year was was really promising like you said that was that list from DVD and Night at some really high profile games those first three months of the season and then got to a point where I was like man. What is this? I don't know how to handle this. Who Am I and my response was to just back off and and I know I confuse confused. My coaches and confused myself. But if I didn't know who I could become and didn't work to become that person and that was wasn't going to be that person's right now for sure. Yeah absolutely I know you wrote in the book about how you started drinking as a sophomore. You kind of realized when you drank your. Ocd symptoms go away. What was that kind of that realization? That could have been a dangerous realization and dangerous path to go down. Because I think a lot of people do that. They start self medicating and they try to turn their brain off when they're kind of dealing with those kind of things. How did you kind of balance that to make sure you know it didn't become a problem But I'm sure that's tempting when you're that age just kind of figuring out what's going on with my you know with with all these symptoms attempting at the time. I think there's a history of alcohol abuse in families something that I'm pretty fluent in and nothing the especially as I distance between myself and my younger years like I definitely abused alcohol A Lot when I was in college and that was almost primarily to escape my mind like if I could have ten or twelve beers or take eight or ten shots and Simpson's kind of went away. I could feel almost your floor for a while. And even that the hangover the next day was like it was pain and like I think part of me just wanted to feel pain or to be where I was. The pain of a hangover's is a real kind of pain. So in a way I kind of enjoy the joy that too and then I think the reason that I didn't know become a blown alcoholic is that There one I didn't have the allergy as I called in In a way which be like be like a genetic component to the game so it my my relationship with basketball's definitely was definitely kind of a love. Hate relationship hated a lot of things that That I am blamed it for but the same time I loved so much about it and one of the things that I love. The battle was at a relation structure and no. It wasn't always like this but I know sometimes look for just just like being in a five on five situation even in practice Lego and then I also thankfully wanted to wasn't GonNa let down my coaches my teammates by being an alcoholic. Either so I'm grateful that I was able to put a lid on that hard-drinking yeah you know that kind of interesting that the structure and Again that kind of support system kind of helped you in that aspect to you kinda you wrote about how you were raised and not showing you emotions and playing sports. That's stressed even more by coaches in different thority figures. It seemed like that was something that you had a hard time with. Do you think that contributed to some of your struggles as well. I'll have absolutely I think that One of the things. I like to say about a mental health and mental illness. Is that a big part of what we can do is just normalized. Human emotions too. It's not not that we fuel certain things as what we do with those feelings and if we can express those feelings in healthy wave we can say. Hey I'm saying if we can say on no have this. Ocd something. That's really troubling me than we could that starting point one in terms of working through it but new ideas of masculinity which thankfully there's a new narrative coming out but old ideas of masculinity word. You as as a young man should restrict yourself to this very narrow sliver of emotion Toughness competitiveness can probably help me fill in the blanks here but the nowhere in that is the idea that we should admit the tougher More emotional sides of ourselves right now. We're in there should stay. We should open up our hearts or anything like that. Those are always been associated with with feminine ideals. And what is sports if not sports for males is not a good if not a Nor last bastion of these these old school masculinity and so once once I learned how to express the notion knows it was my second year as a professional I can went from now getting cut from a team my first year and just being so confused so obsessive compulsive to not being all league and making the All Star team averaging twenty five and eight per season and then I attribute that largely to a one ahead of a good team management that I was planning for in to just being able to express myself on the court to be able to scream after I dunked hitter. goof- goofed off like during a game. Sometimes with with my teammates not away this going to detract from the game but a high FIS Screaming manages the expression of by full of south learning how to do that was a was a huge huge turning point huge pivot. Know for sure it makes sense to you know. I want to ask this to you. Write about this in the book and I got chills reading about this part. You write about re strongly considering suicide even grabbing a pocket knife and you know really thinking of more than strongly at tried right. You attempted to aside. I mean it you also talk about reaching out to an assistant coach for help you know going back to that support system but did the people around you know how much you are struggling. You know my my My college roommate got him gun in Chris and he He was on. The team is a teammate. And he was always very suspicious of some of the ways that was acting. There's a couple of times when I did some some really weird stuff. I think I think he was. He was definitely pretty suspicious but besides him I was a really good actor and I had the kind of OCD that you could hide in your head. And I stayed mostly in my head so I don't think very many people New and if they didn't say anything to me about it for sure Shifting back to basketball for one second is mentioned you play. You played four years at Davidson And steph curry arrived a year after you laughed but you met him when he was being recruited and played pick up against him. What was your first impression of Steph curry when you met him? I knew I knew this. Kid steph Curry Davidson. It's twenty minutes north of Charlotte in any of these kids. Staff WHO A. Had to make some trips during the year to see a couple of games. I knew he was supposed to be pretty special and nor coach after my senior year ended was was telling people quietly like watch out for the skit. Steph curry and so like I was. I was curious I remember. He came up with the summer to play a game of pickup. And then maybe three or four minutes in the first game a pickup. He came down the court. And then there's a screen. I switched switched onto him and he took me into the high post and that he leaned his shoulder in to stop my mom my defensive lament him and then he turned around. And this is so smoothly at this knockdown jumper from the from the free throw line and I remember thinking well. That's that's a mature veteran. Move Right there. This kid could be good and just his humility was was something that those really impressive to he was so shy and just just had no head about him and was was willing to work. Can't say Surprised when he blew up I do. I don't think I don't think he even. He thought that he would become one of the greatest place about time. But there's definitely something special about him from the beginning for sure and right. After Davidson you started playing overseas. You went to Spain. You talk about in the book kind of struggling with that adjustment and how you know early on in that stint you really hated over there and things weren't really easy for you. What was that like having to? I mean I think for anyone. It's difficult to make that kind of adjustment. I talked to players all the time that go overseas and whether it's language barrier or different things that kind of affect their stay over there and they have a hard time adjusting but doing that while battling ocd in these different things. What was that like for you making that adjustment in Spain I mean the the first the first half of my first year who was extremely tough like it was simple to really challenging. And I don't think it was. The coach wasn't great. The team situation wasn't great but I think the the big things one like we talked about. It didn't have a vocabulary for For Myself I didn't know how to express Mario. Cd's ABS even to someone back back home in the states and to the We talked about the camera. Honoree like I was. I felt so alone over there for her. Most of the first or the the only American on the team and I just went to practice all the guys and then we didn't hang out or anything. Afterwards I was. I was one of the younger guys. I was twenty two and everybody was cut was older and had families definitely isolated myself and so I think going back like if I could have made better friends and had a better support system would have been different but I did have those. An I know felt sorry for myself at times and hitting myself in that all that added up into not exactly a good situation will then after that you played the Czech Republic and at one point you wet and months without getting paid and that was interesting to kind of read about in the book but we did an article on hoops hype about players in their crazy overseas stories. Just talking about you know. You're not getting paid or you know one guy was talking about how there was like fires being lit in the stands and batteries being thrown there. Were just a lot of crazy ones in there Do you have any stories that stand out? The story about not getting paid is one of them. Seem like the guy was kind of giving you the runaround repeatedly. What was it like kind of adjusting to that and do any crazy stories. Stand out to you. I mean I actually Kinda loved the Czech Republic like once once I left Spain. I gave myself the sledding go freedom I kinda surrendered and said you know whatever is going to is going to be in kind of a weird way. I didn't. I didn't mind not getting paid. Actually they gave me like a little per diem So I had no a meal at a restaurant that that if I wanted to like I was going hungry or anything. Anyone who's been played overseas has all kinds of stories. It is definitely a little bit crazy. The fans are given a freedom that they're not given here No assault of coins and batteries and tomato slices from the stands. Real security isn't exactly security muster for the home team. But no we're talking about the Czech Czech Republic and then the story election there. Is that everyone on. That team had a no drinking clause written into their contracts myself. And a check is that we weren't supposed to drink if you had any alcohol whatsoever and got quote caught drinking that they could withhold your entire salary but now Czech Republic. This was GONNA Stop Young. Twenty something basketball players. And so what we did is that we had like a speakeasy which was on. The far edge of the city was in the basement of this building. And you have to like you didn't quite often knock and like a secret knock to get in the door but you kinda snuck in his back hallway and We caught up the sailor pub. We'd go there and get really wasted after game but just have had a great time in play the accordion now and then and then once we were hidden. I'm definitely not promoting drinking. Now you're good and it is part of or their culture and then once once we were good unloaded. We'd go on a fun dancing earth hanging out of the bars apparently there was like fans who the GM had on the his side on the sly. Who was supposed to keep an eye out or something like the team? We started losing. Hey have you seen whatever in one time I did catch. Has One of our personnel team personnel. Who's in charge of drinking stuff sneaking upper aback hallway of the hotel room in a certain sort of rendezvous which his wife probably wouldn't have liked once. Once I have. That's a fight back with I. I stopped worrying about the drinks. Natural Areas I know. Didn't one point Your coach tricky. Tricky like Oh this beer good. Do you ever drink this like was he? I think he did. He invited me over at the. Gm The guy who put this no-drinking clause in the contract invited me over to his house for dinner and so we're sitting there and he elvis and asked me what do you think of the Czech beer. I signed the contract Before even arriving trucker public. So if I if I answered this question honestly I technically have been in breach of the contract. I forget how answered it but he did not say we go to. We got to speak yeah. It's funny I really enjoy that that from that same portion of the book you were talking about having a conversation with GM and he kind of asked you. Why do you play this game? And you came up with a simple answer. Basically it's fun. I like the Camaraderie and while it's partially true in the book you write where you're actually thinking. It was really interesting. You basically say that you started when you're young because you were tall you had find and then everyone keeps telling you you could be good enough to do the next thing. Play in Highschool get a scholarship starting college. Then it's the pros and then into contract and they're always dangling that next care in front of you and you talk about how you kind of kept playing for that next thing and then why time you play basketball for a while. It's such a huge part of your identity as a person and you put so much time into the game that it seems crazy to stop playing. So did you come to these realizations back when you were still playing or did that not happen until after or did that happen after your playing days were over it definitely definitely happened after I think subconsciously in not certain feelings like I might have felt some certain things have felt some wonder and maybe even your late at night or something GonNa Sleep. I might have had some articulate verbally some of these thoughts but for the most part a lot of the reflection in the realizations. That ahead came came. Once I retired of the. Here's an analogy that likely to use on that. When you're is Isaac Newton or Albert Einstein Marie Curie and also the scientists discover the laws of Calculus and physics radio-activity. Whatever like after. They made their discoveries that didn't burn their findings. That are you know. Hide the results in a drawer somewhere. They publish the work in textbooks for written in the near the knowledge was passed down and built upon generation after generation. It's a visit students in twenty twenty when they enroll in school. They don't have to try and discover gravity or special relative. Look at all all their own from scratch. Mean Marie Curie died from the harmful radiation. She was to join experiments but people learn for that now. We know that we need to wear those big. No lead vests when we get our teeth. X-rayed the dentist. Yeah no but the point. Is this an even though? We've made a lot of progress and venting from tranches more or less what we still do. As human emotion our kids go to school and learn about capitalism and biology. And that's great but they don't learn about shame or anger or fear or any of the deeper reasons. Why things are what they are not more or less expected to learn about their emotions and their minds from scratch or from the parents if the parents never learned themselves or are culturally afraid to talk about the real stuff and they won't be able to teach their kids and I think basketball maybe even a little bit in sports general. That'd be a little bit worse when it comes to emotions processing no self discovery. I don't know if you've seen it book. Usa Basketball has pretty sick pamphlet that they'd pass out to their youth. Coaches got all kinds of various specific skills. In IT skills. The young players should be working on your wonderful pull up your left afloat or Ryan floater. And so on. That's Great. Basketball player should learn basketball skills but nowhere in that packet. Are there skills like how to process a loss or not to accept a shame of public humiliation how to do with pride out to know yourself apart from the way your coaches and You know the fans. No you particularly terms of retirement. There's nothing to prepare serious athletes for a time when they'll no longer be in the game and I think this is just assume that this is stuff we we expect our athletes to pick up somewhere along the way on their own. Maybe data rate. Has Shane Flavor something? That I don't know about but I don't think so. That's I'm I'm definitely in that category of someone who noticed by getting a great education in having a decent support system Five known how to use it. I never knew how to use that. Everyone had discovered myself and it was only retired that I found from the motivation to your look back with with real honesty. We all want to think of ourselves as the best version of ourselves so that we can validate are experiencing somewhere. This is a speaker for people who don't have a firm grasp themselves the In the Book I talk about the myth that we create for ourselves ghost of ourselves that we attach onto that myth is is the are Beth's our best selves and no part of learning about yourself and discovering yourself as letting go of that breath letting go of of your old ghosts and finding out who you are a new if that makes sense for sure I totally agree and I recently had greg on the podcast and he talked about some of these same things about you know until he retired and had to walk away from basketball because of his injuries he basically said. I didn't know who I was so whenever that time came it was who am I? You know other than basketball. What do I even like to do? You had no idea what his hobbies or interests were. Because his his life was show tied around basketball. I revolve around basketball so I do think that a lot of players go through that and kind of like what you were saying. There's no information kind of passed down. I feel like there's all these players that retire in their thirties or forties. If they're lucky you know something I believe in their twenty s and they have to struggle with that and figure out what to do next and I know the retired players association does certain things they have certain programs and there's like an often court program that's all about those first five years after retirement to help players adjust in make that transition but I every player not every player but a lot of players still struggle and have a hard time figuring out what that next chapter life is going lake so I think you're right there whenever you decide to retire you know. How did that decision come together? And what was that like for you so much? My retirement came. I've been going through a lot of life like in my My third fourth fifth seasons playing professional. I was Not relatively stable. I was regularly making all star teams. I kinda founded niece for myself. I think I settled down and are comfortable in the pros than a lot of the the underlying issues that had with obsessive compulsive stuff Kind of bubble to the surface and I became very disillusioned and I was like what is the point of of this and I was actually recently. Read a Bill Russell Go Up for glory. And then he talks about. Like being in Huddles in games and looking around and be like what is this like what? What's what is this basketball structure. And I now think it's like a really beautiful thing if we can get the right perspective on it but at the time like I had no idea so I think my retirement was kinda spurred by the desire to figure myself out. I think every athlete every Athlete at some point his or her career in a hopefully. If they're lucky it's a chance to ask themselves in a very real way. Who who am I did that? Probably my fourth year planning and then. I played one more year and at that point. I just felt like I was a cheating. The game and makes us says that he's going to retire. When he cheats the game I had heard. And say that quote and quote in a way it Kinda spurred me on and into this into this retirement and then once Once I retired I almost involuntarily without much conscious decision when cold Turkey from the game for about two years like I had this kind of telescope vision of of where wanted to be like the stars way off in the distance and then had to find a way to You know happened my spaceship and get the heck into space and start moving towards it so like a one maybe two years without playing a game without reading about the game without being around the game. I didn't watch your game. And if they are just read a ton of books no basically re educating myself on the world because it was a high level athlete my education was pretty secondary and then I traveled all over the world. I went through hours and hours of therapy. And I'm grateful that had the resources in the willpower to do all that and do feel like every nude myself nicely in back in the game as a coach and as a fan in a really meaningful healthy relationship with basketball again. I got an up teaching kids the game as my profession but not everybody has the time or the money or the motivation or the guidance to go through that process so we talk about the cliche that every ethic dies twice once for real when they start playing are. I don't think that's I don't think that's true at all. I think he's you stop playing. But you don't automatically dot US kind of Us up your balance of memories until you become a ghost the new state ghost until you learn how to know ghostbuster self. Yeah I like it. You're now coaching as you mentioned with the the scoring factory in Pittsburgh you've trained a Lotta kids I know we had talked about how you train cam. Johnson and his His brothers he's now in the Phoenix Suns. How How is your transition coaching? How did that go making that transition? It was It was a challenge. It was it was no to be honest when I first started on. I coached a eighth grade girls team and this was just just kind of get back into it and then I started the private training as well. At the beginning I was a I was a player who happened to be coaching. And then I was able to transition into a coach who used to play. I think that was a really important transition. In the beginning I worked really hard. I was really attached to the outcome of my players. Partly because like I just like I did with basketball like I biggest myself worth on the outcome and it's paradoxical the way it works but the more let go the more I know kind of lesson. My don't care about like how my players do the far better and more effective coach. John and that's because I'm much more sure of myself if that makes sense for sure. What advice do you wish you could give Highschool Ian or college in everything you know now and like you said being able to stay away from basketball and you know re educate yourself and therapy? What advice would you wanNA give your younger self? You know. That's the I think I wrote a book to answer that question? That's very I don't know if I have one one thing to say I. I will say that the The Ways I wish coaching would change is as a as a coach. Now like I. I tried to empower my players and not by teaching them giving the players the opportunity to make mistakes to figure stuff out on their own. Let's say I'm doing a drill. And I got a group of guys. Divide those those groups up in a different baskets and they're working on the drill. It's I noticed. One group is an doing perfectly. The older version of me might have said like jumped in and automatically tried to to micromanage incorrect them but the no the the newer version of myself as a coach. Let's let's steps back and lets them figure it out like if they actually don't know it that I might step in and tell him something but otherwise I might just stand on the sidelines across margin. Sadie I bet you guys can figure it out and then my challenge somebody to be leader said. Who's going to be the leader here and step up and in No take control and then make a might take an extra several minutes but I think kids get more out of it and learn more about themselves and they find more awareness of self and self empowerment if they figure things out for themselves if they're not micromanaged all the time and then that goes hand in hand with giving kids a healthy and safe platform in which they can fail in make make mistakes having someone bring it down on their back. Yeah I think your experiences a player and you know the different things that you kind of went through and maybe what you wish you would have from coaching. I'm sure that helps you so much when you're now. Coaching kids enabled to do those things in the authority role. But I was GONNA ask you. You know now since you've been able to Get a diagnosis and start working on your recovery. Where you're CD symptoms at today. Something that you and I talked about Off here but where you kind of out with your recovery. I think I'm in a really good place I was GONNA say. Knock on wood. But that would be isn't like I'm in a good a good place with with my symptoms. I think with see one of the few go through today like the mainstream treatment centers that only effective Treatment method that they espouses called. Erp EXPOSURE IN RIPON response prevention. And I think I'm kind of outside of the mainstream and listen that I didn't even know what Europe was until about a year ago when I attended the International. Ocd Conference and in the ways that I've got healthy Have been through. Fostering a real sense of community and having deep friendships and re restoring and repairing relations with my family and and being able to say to them. Hey Look I'm I'm struggling with these feelings that can you offer support and Whether people understand or not like just a building to have someone listen there's really helpful and then Finding meaningful pursuits and eating in a way that suits suits me and getting regular exercise and valuing sleep in nature. I think all those things have played a role in my recovery. And I'm not knocking European. I think it's a really effective in powerful tool and I've definitely played it myself Employing the whole spectrum of treatment options has been really beneficial and I want to end on this note. Nba players are starting to speak out more and more about their struggles with different mental health issues. Whether it's anxiety or depression with Kevin love into Marta rose in being two notable examples the NBA is also trying to address mental health more. There's new rules that require every team to have at least one mental health professional on there fulltime staff. There's also written action plans in case there's a mental health emergency. What do you make of the? Nba's new mental health rules. And what was your reaction now that we're seeing more and more players. Kinda speak out about their struggles. So I think the the really encouraging thing about the mental health Stuff today is that. There's definitely not much of a stigma anymore. I was reading the other day about Ricky Berry now. Rigg Bay but Ricky Berry and he was a guard for the Sacramento Kings in the late eighties. He was apparently this incredible feat on one quote. I read was from Kenny. Smith was a contemporary and he called him. Reggie Miller with a handle with rick. Perry killed himself unexpectedly after his rookie season. He shot in the head. And that's a that's tragic. Obviously but a a according to a lot of the articles I read the following season the NBA hardly acknowledges his death. There wasn't even like moment of silence with the Kings in his first game back. It's just kind of swept under the table because no one knew what to make of it. If you G- knowledge it you had knowledge it a a much broader problem and I don't think that would ever happen now. There's a platform before the tough conversations about mental health. You've got men and women speaking out you got organizations that are forming and reaching out you got the stuff you mentioned in the players organization. You got the players to Beaune giving platforms to different people. And I think what we need is a more messengers and were variations on a message. There's a saying that the Messenger is as important as the message if not more important and we all react differently to different things depending on. Who's saying it so one troubled athlete might react well to Demar Derozan speaking out about his depression but another kid might not associated with Kevin Lavin. Kevin Love's talks about his struggles with panic attacks so the message monastic. If we can get more messengers the more messengers we have in more ways. We can get the message across than the kid will hopefully inspire to educate himself and get help. If if necessary Ian you so much for your time man this has been so fascinating I love being able to pick your brain and I say as I mentioned earlier. This book is fantastic and I want everyone to read it. We're going to go ahead. Include a link in the description and it's also going to be on the post On hoops I if anyone's hearing this conversation and watch no more about e ended his story Be Sure to pick up the book the bouncing the ECHO dying to love a game Ian next year time man. We really appreciate it else. It has been my pleasure. Thank you so much for Chemo. Divan tastic work. And I'm looking forward to future novels from you because this one was amazing. And if you guys want to hear more episodes the hoops podcast. Check US out on spotify apple podcasts. Wherever your favorite podcasts there. Until next time thanks for listening.

basketball OCD Ian Johnson steph Curry Davidson Nba Anthony Lebron Carmelo Anthony Czech Republic Anthony Chris Bosh Steve Smith Alex Kennedy mark Cuban Oak Hill Academy steph curry Pittsburgh Greg Oden Sean Holmes Sean Ragnar HYPOCHONDRIAC Europe
The Drop | The Podcast Must Go On

The Free Agents

1:00:12 hr | 9 months ago

The Drop | The Podcast Must Go On

"Here the the the bro the so Skewer and welcome to the PODCAST. On the Athletic Network Friday March Thirteenth skeets alongside. Meat has always task. Smells the go. Forget the bearded one trey kerby international man of mystery taking it to the Max Ellis Joe and last but not least the magic happen. It's GD hello. We didn't even bring it today guys on a Friday. Got The drop podcast for you here. Follow us on twitter and Instagram at New Dunk Zinc. You know we're on facebook at FACEBOOK DOT com slash. No don't think we'll I guess it's official? We're now on facebook. Nmls email us your questions and your comments. Oh boy do we need them now. More than ever know dunks at the athletic dot com we will be stepping on the beach. Four Sherlock it in likely a few times next week so get those questions and comments. Don't be afraid whether their MBA related or they're just straight up silly. We'll answer them all all right. We are going to have some laughs here. Hopefully on the drop podcasts. On today's show we do have tweeted the night. We got some Zini rapid fire questions as we always do and Lee is taking over the punt man. It's long settle in this. One could almost be a podcast by itself just cricket at all or did you just take every single suggest. You'd be surprised how few suggestions I took. Because I got a lot of similar suggestion. They just came to me just throughout the week though just popping in and I was throwing them down okay so we teased this that you were going to be taking over the punt gun because we were going to do a cricket version of PUNK guess. I was thinking about it last night when I started getting worried that you were going to be doing this on the podcasts. Are you doing? Mba Cricket plans are the cricket pawns with an MBA slant. It's been overlap. Yeah that makes sense. Yeah Yeah Yeah I mean the you know some leading with the basketball leading with the creek upon you just and what I'm GonNa do. I should explain it later. But I'm going to rattle through them and then when you have questions you can come back to your questions to Koa. I've tried to also make it so that you can kind of understand what the plan is is that we thought would help. Because that's the thing we don't really know a ton of Oak Creek or any of the cricket players. Sure you're going to be sprinkling in do WANNA just change this to cricket podcast now or I mean we're almost there. We're almost there just giving that one. I'll be honest I know we'll we'll get to that. It's such a tease. Keep your because we want to give you the the NBA Slash Corona Virus Update of what we've learned since last time. We talked you guys on Thursday morning there are few things the first one NBA Commissioner Adam Silver. He appeared on inside the NBA on Thursday night last night and revealed that the League's current suspension would last at least thirty days his words in addition to his statements on TNT silver posted an open letter to fans which he signed straight up within it. He described the situation a bit more detail explaining again that the league does hope to resume play this season if possible. He also said tickets already. Purchased for postpone game will be honored when the game was rescheduled and if games are not played played in an empty arena. Teams will work with fans on a credit for a future game or a refund. So yeah the Big News. I think in the last twenty four hours in regards to the NBA. Is this idea that it's at at least thirty and potentially longer but we were trying to figure out what what is this Is this hiatus two weeks three weeks four weeks or more and we are now have a definitive answer. It's at least four weeks. It's at least a month. It's definitive but it's also independent. One hundred new the hackney little. What's going to happen fast? Back is a month but yeah right. It's going to be. It's a long time and and I started to think about guys not playing for a long time. There's you know the the rumors start coming is Kevin durant potentially coming back to season is. Is there a chance but on the other side the players who will have to come back like let's say a Joel Embiid who probably uses games to stay in shape? You just came back from an injury. Didn't look extremely spry against the Pistons. His talent scored him over. There got him over thirty points because he is that good but I think it will hurt a guy like Joel beat to sit out and then go potentially directly into the postseason to think that hurts the sixers chances because theoretically here a thirty day suspension with an immediate return puts US resuming basketball at basically Saturday April. Eleventh Right Saturday per eleventh. Let's say April twenty something like that before the virus. I mean the playoffs. We'RE GONNA end Wednesday April Fifteenth. And then they would start on the eighteenth you know. We always have that little gap that Thursday Friday break and then the playoffs start on the weekend and we get all those games and we've talked about this yesterday. Are they going to just pick up the regular season and everything's gets pushed back later into the summer or is there the possibility of? It's just we basically just go right into the playoffs. Now the data. I think what you're getting to their task is correct. It's like can we just assume these guys could immediately jump back into playoff intensity basketball? Probably not I mean you would think that would be you know could lead to injuries and just poor basketball has it is so then is there. What's is there like basically a preseason games exhibition games practices. What it will be the decision there or will the regular season. A truncated version of the regular season be looked at. Is that sort of warm up? Is that makes sense. You'd have played sixty five sixty four sixty six so maybe they use that week to say. Let's everyone to sixty seven something like that and then we just call it from there because that's the thing because they're also being advised not even workout together. So that's the real problem because you know you can. You can go to the gym and shoot and stuff like that but guys especially athletes like this like to have that competition at least and those other people working with them so you would expect that the NBA probably wouldn't want them to go straight to the playoffs. I would think right to have a couple of games under their belt if possible and again one eight hundred sixty six and they say we're going to call it at sixty seven that any market one team one game but that might at least give some sort of evenness but you're saying if the NBA doesn't come back and just say we're GONNA play the rest of the regular season. Yeah and we're going to start the playoffs a month or two later. I mean which is in play. I mean I think it's definitely a possibility. You're looking at using some sort form of the regular season. Let's say let's call it three five seven games. Whatever it is a truncated version of it as a basically a second training camp lead into the playoffs. And what the thinking about it even more they might say. Let's go just to seventy games. And then the playoffs. Maybe week two weeks or make the first round best-of-five again or something like that to make it make it work a little bit. These are all the questions for Adam. Silver in the board. I don't know how they find the right solutions. Well the first round is always pretty spaced out anyways so that could easily be sort of sped up. Yeah Yeah there's two games on each night. Quite offense sometimes three games. You could easily bunch games up to shorten it a little bit. Because I doubt they're they're not GONNA change the playoff format. They're not going to go to best of five but they could start later. Speeded it up. I still imagine that I mean it's all going to depend on how long the hiatus if it's a thirty day hiatus. I think we'll get the rest of the regular season because I mean seventeen games a lot. You Twenty Games as a lot. But it doesn't take all that long especially if you're then going to smash together the playoffs and make make it not be a forty nine forty days and forty nights a first round if you're able to smash that you're able to play the entire regular season because the owners are going to want to play those games. The owners are going to want to recoup the money that they are missing out right now. Non Playoff teams for sure. Everybody literally everybody. If if owners are fronting the money to pay for the people who are going to be out of jobs during the hiatus they're Gonna. WanNa that money back so that's if it's thirty days though I mean if if it's a forty five day wait like how long are they gonNA push the season to go to because I would agree with tasks that they probably won't change the format of the playoffs like we'll probably still get best two sevens all the way through just because that's the way it's done but I mean if the if the hiatus stretches longer and longer than perhaps those get smashed together a little bit too and we talked about yesterday if you use the Chinese Basketball Association as any sort of example at ten plus comes from when they stop to when they started going again in the League? Mba is hoping that you know. Maybe they get started a lot earlier than that. Of course be at the four weeks five weeks or whatever it is but yeah and then do that. I mean if it if they just pick up and they continue the rest of the regular season and then the playoffs in all its entirety. It's just going to have an effect of course on everything else. Hit the draft and whatever if the Olympics are happening. I mean you can basically write off a lot of these guys for team. Usa guys. I would assume maybe other other international players for their team's going to represent it would be like bud up right against it. Yeah again if that even happens and so far is on which seems a little while but yeah I was cool refreshing to at lease and silver came out. He said this is at the minimum. This is the hiatus and also we don't know from here we do not know. We are still in like full-blown information gathering just like everybody else's but we have decided and we saw how quickly a lot of the other leagues followed suit after the NBA. And after commissioner silver said Okay well we're shutting this down. Forget this idea of like playing in front of Noah. No fans in the arena. We saw how quickly everybody else started to do that. But I liked least said he was like we don't know though this could be. We're hoping it's a month is. It could be a way longer. Yeah I mean. The funny thing is withdraw. Obviously the tournament is so important to determining the the few first picks I mean I. I wonder what's going to happen with the draft. I mean you know. They've been playing games. But you know this. This is the time to Sean. Many of those players. So it's GonNa be a really weird situation this year. It's it's definitely an indefinite period of time. But you will definitely be with no dunks for as long as it rolls we will be here to see it through however long it is. It's thirty good. Be a heck of a lot longer. Yeah they also pushes back free agency and all that in bumping into August. But we'll be right and then what effect does that have if any on the next season and when that starts and is that pushback and it's it is this domino effect here. Yeah you said at the AA. Its men's and women's basketball tournaments on Thursday because of course the spread of the corona virus. So that's done. March madness completely done. A lot of you were shocked by that decision. Because that's the straight up cancellation now. That's not like hey we might do this later. Which you gotTa feel for. Obviously the senior athletes and I'm not just talking about basketball is older. Ncwa winter and Spring Championships baseball volleyball bowling fencing golf gymnastics hockey track volleyball. You know beach volleyball mental rifle rowing skiing softball swimming diving like all the tennis water polo wrestling all of them. And if you're a senior athlete like you're done yours and your season's over. Yeah and you know I saw a lot of people. I think it was east. Tennessee's states coach basketball coach. He's suggesting like is. Is there any way like some of the seniors should be another here? Eligible have eligibility for another year. Because of this weird circumstance and you you do you gotta feel bad for all those athletes that are like gearing up for the championship. They're swansong and they don't even get a chance. Now it's crazy. I don't know what to say. I mean it's like all those sports enlisted all. Those people affected a lot of them hoping to make career out of it too. So this is I mean. Everyone's just everything is on hold around the world. This is just something we've never seen before. Where so many things? So many people just affected by basically just being told stay home right. Now that's the best we can do. That's the most we know crazy stuff. This is super super low on the priority list. But I'm just curious if you guys have seen a tweet that maybe I missed addressing it you know. I said silver talked about refunding fans the idea. If they can't get these Games that they're refunded their money. They were like League pass subscriptions if there are if there isn't another if there isn't a quarter of the regular season or those people refunded like a month through their cable companies or through the NBA. Yeah I was thinking that last night who knows You get sort of would think they would almost have to. They're not giving you. The full service deals though right whether like watch the last few weeks of the regular season twenty nine ninety nine or something like that discounts towards the end of the year will not if I paid full price at this point. I mean I paid for. They're probably going to be say and you'll get those games. Yeah Yeah April back. Yeah I just hadn't seen anything written about that The other news yesterday Rudy. Gobert apologized took to instagram. His first public comments since testing positive for the virus. He says it was careless with his actions that expose others to the to the disease and he says that he hopes that story serves as a warning and causes everyone to take this seriously Chance to read it. I'm sure got to sort of feel bad. I I know it's fun to clown touch the MIC. And it was careless and he addresses that but it is weird. Though then you see I think it was Bruce Arthur Toronto star saying in a weird way did rudy. Gobert save a lot of people from themselves here in shutting down the NBA. Really being patient zero and then spreading to all the other leagues in a weird way to the accidentally. Maybe do you know if you're trying to look it a matter of time? He is the first one and unfortunately for him. He's going to be the guy who brought the corona virus to the NBA for the rest of his career. And we're GONNA have the video of him. Touching all the microphones. Even though he likely didn't pick it. Up from the microphones. Or get it from the microphones. They say that's a low risk encounter with Rudy Gobert. That's why you don't joke about it because if it comes back and you have corona you're gonNa feel like an idiot and that's why he said I was embarrassed. You should be embarrassed but you're right. I mean it was going to happen eventually. We know that Donovan Mitchell. Had if he stayed as symptomatic he probably wouldn't have been for the entire time maybe in two weeks he gets it but then we've played two. More Games are two more weeks of games when people are altogether. Who knows who the heck knows who has it and who doesn't have it. It has to be you know permeating throughout the NBA. It just it just has to be and Donovan Mitchell. You mentioned him. He wrote a post. Didn't mention rudy whatsoever. And I know it's not a time to really read into things but he goes on. Espn says there's risks in the in the in the jazz locker room. And I did think Donovan Mitchell. Not Defending Rudy in that post Was something clear especially team struggling on the basketball floor as well. I think if you're looking at teams that need more time on the floor to get better at basketball before the house. I think that's one of the sixers or one of them too. It doesn't bode well for for time. Victor Oladipo needs more time. Some of these guys need more time off in it and like we saw in the shortened season went. Good teams like Spurs who ended up winning the thing Are Together for a really long time had been together for a really long time. These these scenarios don't bode well for for basketball or just whatever the heck is going on in that locker room but yet rudy doesn't deserve all the hate but unfortunately videos exist For him well also on instagram. Kevin love he pledged one hundred thousand dollars yesterday to aid arena workers displaced by the League's response to the Krona Virus Loves ACT OF GENEROSITY HERE IT echoed a joint statement released by the cavs and their home arena the rocket mortgage field house where they vowed to develop a compensation plan to continue paying our staff. An hourly workforce that is impacted with the changes to a regular event schedule. Great this is on the heels of Cubans saying similar things as soon as he found out that the league was suspended. The other Night Mavericks Hawks Kings Pistons and Sixers have committed right now to some sort of compensation program for arena staff. So you know I think zillow rights more and keep your eyes on you. Know what teams are in are not doing anything or even saying anything at this point because it is important to a lot of these people it takes a lot of people to to run an NBA game you know parking and ticket sales and obviously concession stands at security and on and on and on and a lot of them. That's how they make their livelihood and if there is something in plan from some of these obviously billionaire corporations and that good on them and they should yeah and I hope more follow so Yeah Kevin. Love's example there because he just did it and the we know that a lot of plaza on a lot of money that they could you know form together and put one hundred thousand dollars each and really make this Not Too bad for those people who think about how much the owners make. Well should have already from owners that they're going to be paying this. I mean it's awesome that Kevin love doing it every player that would be great if every players willing to kick in one hundred thousand dollars but every billionaire owner should be kicking. I agree a hundred percent But for the fact that Kevin Love's stepped up already. You know you you would think the other players will fall asleep to some degree. I mean not. All of them can probably afford that. The summer on the on the lower end of the The the salaries that they but you would think that they would certainly try to do something. Show their support and appreciation for those workers who put in so much to make the make the game so great all right. So there's your updates now unless I'm forgetting one. I think it's obvious who the real worst is. A week is hoax. Give it to the virus shutting down the NBA which we love so much but you got something else in store so we're still. Luik Ladies Gentlemen the worst of the week yeah. The virus can't get worse. Luik can see and everybody wants to give it to Rudy Gobert. But he was joking when he did touch those reporters recorders. He didn't think he was getting everyone sick. It was a dumb dumb move but at the same time when things were being canceled on Wednesday night everyone was still embracing and high fiving in the NBA. Vince Carter hit a shot. He was hugging. Everybody it's happening throughout the NBA Rudy. Gobert has definitely the poster child but few mentioned that video until after he tested positive as my man. Stan van Gundy says right. The story when the corona virus is in the air. Okay so yeah everybody. In his defense he was literally showing solidarity with the media. Reporters like this idea of like all. We gotta be six to eight back. It's like we don't want you the reporters to infect us the players and he's mocking joking that concept. I think in a sign of support for the media you know what I mean. If that that makes sense Brian Lebron got up. There had the exact same thing. He didn't touch everybody stuff. And said I miss you guys? That's another nice way of doing it. Without touching everything was he was being a child. He made a big mistake at the same time. The report the recorder should have been there. It really doesn't make a lot of sense to have. We talked about it on Thursday. Show to have this six feet gap but to have devices that we all touch right there. Anyway let's move on Rudy. Gobert is not worse than the worst of the week. Winter is a Greek Fan who was at Staples Center this week. Following the Lakers win over the box. This guy confronted bucks brothers and fellow Greeks Gupo in the tunnel. The fans taunt super lame. I was surprised to editor. Kube Rose especially the Nasi turned around to confront him so let. Let's listen and you'll hear the interaction and then I'll translate after here the clip which is courtesy of Lauren. Jones Okay so the fans starts by saying Yanni you ate it. You ate it today in the ASS. That's good that happened to you. This is knbr brother. Vanessa turns round runs at Greek man like that Hawk America America America America America commit close. Yanni also falls. Come here and that's how you talk. Your kids must be proud. You're a liar. You're a liar I salute you. I salute you Bravo. Bravo was a quick quick interaction there but I think the fact that this Greek man was speaking in Greek really irked. Nasi especially because I was ready to just go back to the locker room but I was peeved and such a lame. Taunt me in the ASS is it's it's basically eh great like a great thing to eat it in the ASS. I guess because they they had just lost. You lost to the Lakers. But he also you know he. He recoiled to if an SE. When Adam he was he didn't want it as part of a shock and it was good story. Lame lame taunt just to throw that in there just to get another language in there for everybody out. There travel the world right now but travel at another time. Also don't do dumb stuff like that because it's a perfect example of someone with the stupid stupid You know insult as it is Ruining the possibility of a good thing for everybody else right the one bad apple. Because we've seen these before these interactions. Let's say in the back sort of going back to the locker room. You said right. It's like in the tunnel and it's been cool to see I think a lot of Nba Arenas have this word. Setup like fans can sort of stand there and see them. Come out and go back right. I know there are like there's like that little cool bridge thing and Is that Madison Square Garden. I think it is if unless I've got a mistaken with another arena but anyway my point is you have these interactions. Will you get to the point where they're like? Well why would we gonNa have this for everything else? So just completely get rid of this cool thing and I mean cool thing for like kids and being a kid and seeing. Jonah's run by you like one beside you would maybe give you a high five again before the virus but you know what I mean. That's Awesome I. I can't imagine I never experience that when I was kid. Be The coolest thing in the world. See Your Superhero one foot away from you and maybe give you five or throw something you get an idiot like this and then eventually you can like this and then it's like well. Let's stop doing this and sad. It's it's the same thing if someone's sitting courtside pushing player and it's like you're just going to ruin it for everybody else. That is actually really enjoying the experience. Just being nice to people you know. That'S PRETTY EASY. Very very weird. All right good worse Luik Test. We got fired upon gun. Still we do have tonight and we got rapid fire but Lee. Yeah we're from. 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Boss that was pretty nice. Okay but wasn't maybe not fitted as well as it could have been at the time looking back on your phone because it was kind of it wasn't it wasn't tailored to me when I bought it actually for a friend of mine's waiting Benny off the rack. No Yeah Right. But then they sort of a junk waco to tighten it up a little and yes. I four years later still manage to slip into it which was nice. Yeah so it was nice. Did you just go pretty simple? Visit a black suit. Black suit light blue tie for me and I bought Daca blue ties from my Now were you in complete control of those decisions or does your wife is roxy. Say we're going with this color. Palette sheep sheep. She chose him address. Vera Wang I believe it was really not And I took care of the boys so yeah yeah I told them I said where docs bring a doctor. Because I wrote flying in I I I know one was local now. We're coming from Australia and England so I just said. Just bring one of your best. Doc suits and watch it. I'll take care of the ties. Yeah it's great. You're happy with your wedding photos. Yes happy yeah Yeah we had a very good photographer. I think it was three guys in the end with. No there was a girl by one guy left early. So yeah they weren't in your face you didn't find ours. I in fact one of the photographers stock. Because it was free booze was opened by. I think he was indulging so it might have fun because we had one of those arrays like. We didn't get our photos after our wedding for like two months man. What's happening here turned out? Our photographer had a heart attack the day after our wedding. Oh what but he made. It made it through the pictures turned out whole no signs the NATO values party at home. It's the most fun I've ever had it a leading. Oh Nice cool man. I'm glad you're having a great time a little too much for a while. Excel Okay Great. Jd Weigh Yourself. Have you ever wedding photos? No not really to be honest. Did you get married in Mexico? I did yeah. And we had The the resort that we got married at provided the photography. It was fine. It was fine except that We had a big fight with him. Because we wanted the negatives this is like we wanted before digital negatives We did finally get them but the prince that and I'm glad we did because the prince that we got there so faded and he used such cheap paper and they're just like they look like old time is like we got married in the nineteen to go into a boardwalk dress up as an old time and then you expect her and then you burn the edges of Photoshop sepia toned. Not Kid and now people are doing that on instagram purposely. Ahead of your time by being behind your time so videos because you're wanting a dying thing right like less than less people I feel like our into it. Maybe that's true. I remember it being a huge debate before our wedding we are. We GonNa do this or we're not going to do this. We eventually decided not to but now I kind of wish we would now. I wish I could actually go back and look at it but just have another wedding. You know all the people we've met in the past eleven years. Sorry not account relieve video winning but I think it was more just a compilation of other people's things but the funny thing is when we got it you watch it like once and that's it and that's what the debate is right. It's like we could pay all this money. You're right sort of cool to have but like are we going to watch this winter? We actually like I wish I had it because I don't have it if I had it what I actually do anything with it. I know I haven't looked at my wedding album for. I mean maybe once a year when the girls are curious about it and I'm like yeah you guys can look at this but literally. Do not touch only physical photographs. We have look do not touch us like the Declaration of Independence Modal Feet from it. Maybe that's why videography I for weddings are dying out a little bit. People have their phones there. Yeah some of your videos. At the end of the night you know everybody get into landscape mode will cut them all together. Your own document right there just either doing yourself like a lot of people could or just hiring editor whippet together. Yeah did you did you videographer. No no I don't I couldn't remember somebody. Wait WAIT WAIT. You got married. Congratulations thanks all right. We're going to do here. Yeah we're GONNA fire the punt gun. Dad well he challenged earlier this week to come up with some tasty cricket puns and you've had four days which is longer than the usual ten seconds. Sir. One M prepared to be dazzled. All right here. We go run and test match. Austin one Austin Pitch Richmond Tim leg break where League La Iman stumping Karl Anthony towns. Cat Munns no bold. Tom Gugliotta Tom. Gugliotta just googly. Yes sorry Thom googly. Oughta that Riley Ball Robert Covington long on Baron Davis Saunders. Murray Wayne Wide Kevin Golden Duck with Golden Duck First Ball. If you go out first ball if you go to bat and the very first bull you get caught behind the golden duck yet if you go at like second knock on wood is just the duck. A Golden Duck is I. Yeah Jerry West indies. This one I came up with just last night. Saieed and one and one Regina Richie Benaud Rudra. And I've heard that name speaking Richie Benaud. How about Yoenis Valentina? Now he pronounces things. That's all that viv. Richards Jefferson White House. That MC Alonzo g shelve is William Sheldon Williams. We'LL BE W L B W will be free. See What I'm saying that Colin six ton Jalil Oca- four nauseam one hundred just just numbers all right. The rule keenly express Raymond sessions. I wanted to really like shoehorn. The Rural Pindi expressing it Audi. Jay Ford out traffic new court was the acronym Allan Back. Boorda finally can be Matombo over and out the most ever. Oh Man. That was fun unbelievable. Yeah can't believe you didn't couple of session tendulkar kind rick crazy right great. Shane Heal warney perfect. All right let me get to the third. Most famous person to ever play cricket. Brian Lara Bar. I got nothing well so that was a lot of fun for you. Yeah thanks to everyone. Who sent in suggestions so I couldn't give share that so many of them. A lot of these suggestions got doubled up a little bit. I had some of my own as well. So you know but the cricket community and the basketball community really starting to overlap here. It's a lot of people suggest. And let's have a quick podcast. While we saw I saw you might have to be doing that. Are they playing cricket? They actually playing cricket with Empty Arenas Right now which is Very very weird That they still playing because the basketball and strata. The League finals are on right now and I played two of that like this morning. Fans and friends friends and family were leading but Yeah pretty crazy. Jd. What'd you think he killed? It killed it I would have you know just putting my Matt Austin had on shorter a little show. Wow See. I couldn't risk like saying putting ten. That's it that's all you could come up afterwards so I'M GONNA go way too many here fair. It is cricket. It should be long. That's a good point and it wouldn't have been able to get rim. Yeah Manute Bol I think was choice. I was I was shocked by how many actually understanding their couple in there. I didn't have any clue what you're really referencing. But Flip Saunders. Yeah so what sets like. Shane warne balls. Didn't know that it sounded like a cricket tax is fielding position Haslett. Murray a excellent work. Yeah there are a ton of people who sent in random punt guns. But I didn't give them to you just just because I wanted to. Do you mean through email Daniel Daniel. How's that Chris Middle Stump? Yeah I had a house that bold has that Modena's understand what house that is by the way. So when you if you'RE A Bola and you bullet and so your legs and let us stand in front of the wicket and the Bulls. Block block repetitive. Hit the Patriots. You have to appeal to the empire and say how's that to say was that out. That's what you appear in the empire and say how's that to say. I think that was leg-before-wicket LBJ. W so you're saying or the pitcher is the one saying the fielding team. Yeah everyone can appeal. Yeah exactly how's that and they're saying how's that that guy put his leg in front of the of the saying how's that is that out and the empire will give you a little head or he'll raise the finger like that. Yeah but now you can appeal these decisions instant replay. Yeah well we go upstairs and I and I have to line it up to see if it was like it was in line at the page and they have Hawkeye. Basically determine we're slowing down a game that takes two. I'll tell you what works pretty well and this because it helps affect the decision if the ball was going to carry through to hit the stumps or not well. He's one of the worst offenders. I'm glad he's fireworks narrow and if it gets guys we're good all right. Great stuff really. Let's get to tweet of the night. Tweet remarried all right well You know I went on twitter at this morning and last night Trying to find something that wasn't corona virus related And I found one from someone who I like to think is a friend of the show. But he probably doesn't even know this show even though he's been on the show it's league our favorite bass players and basketball fan and he tweeted last night. Wealth just cried at an episode of Friday Night Lights. This is what it's come to. I'm finished take it easy. Take Friday lights. You know. Clear is full hearts. Can't lose your rate here year. Human man you're just human. He's actually insect but well true true but it got me thinking in this age of binging. A lot of people just haven't gotten around to seeing certain shows. Yeah Alley Gertz a former editor at mad magazine that I follow recently tweeted. She was just just now getting into six feet under and loving it and we're all about to have a lot of time on our hands So I'm going to actually run through my top five in case you missed it. Show off on top by Tom. Tom Top now number. Five is Friday Night Lights. I mean who doesn't love a good high school? Melodrama I seen the whole thing the whole thing. It's so good loved the movie. The movie was great. I I would say that. In this instance the show is better there does. There's a major misstep in the second season but make it through that you will be handsomely rewarded and it has probably one of the best mid series resets in television history and. I'll leave it at that. Okay how many seasons are we think there's five let's see so yeah? Would it be ridiculous to hop in season three? No not no. I gave up during season. Two Yeah Fair but I would. I would just jump back insertive at near the end of Caesar season number four godless. Now this is a mini series at seven episodes threatened written and directed by Scott Frank. He wrote things like minority report. Logan like movies and it's just a really fun Western. It's on Netflix. This is a western. Yeah I'm in. I'd heard about this once. I had no idea it was a western you it you missed all right. Mrs It. You'RE GONNA love it Number three this is a weird one. It's the my the entry into Reality Television it's the profit now have you heard of this show it's on CNN CNBC. It's basically if you love makeover shows which I do and if you love by rescue do you know John. Taffer yelling at people. Just I just one of the most entertaining you can see but also just failing businesses that are made over and but without the intensity of John Taffer So it's basically the prophet is Marcus Lemoyne is. He's a billionaire and he goes to different failing struggling businesses any invest his own money. And it's great. It's just great television and sometimes and every deal is different and sometimes he'll just walk away and it's just a really great show this was on that's on CNBC. Yeah wow so you can stream that on. Nbc Dot Com whatever profit number two fargo such a great show. I don't know that a lot I don't hear a lot of people talking about it The fourth season is about to come out. Each season is stand alone with a completely different cast in a completely different time period. But it's still all connected and it's just great it's just a great show From the movie it is. It is very loosely tied to the movie right. It's in the same universe as the movie for share and the way they tied into the movie is very clever Chris Rock Song. Yeah and it's great number. One is Downton Abbey. This show one of the greatest of all time. You'll get swept up in the in the romance in the the The intrigue and just turn of the century nineteenth century Britain upper class lower class. I love it I love it I love it. It is done now right because they've started to make a movie. The yeah the movie came out. I haven't seen the movie yet. It's one of those things where I just don't WanNa Watch the movie because they don't want it to end. I don't want it to be over. You'll laugh you'll cry. It's just you have a favorite character. That's a good one Mr Carson love Mr Carr saw you know about this Downton Abbey. Yeah I've heard of it. No interest not really You're missing out. You are missing out. How many theories like five or six years six seasons and then the movie which I assume is out on streaming now rented can add that to the list one hundred percent. Yeah I was upset. Laura went without me great and then she came back like it was good. Like you WANNA see it. I was like well. It doesn't sound like you're excited again. So guess I'LL BE WAITING TO SEE cousin matthew in my own home. What are you GONNA do? I mean those are some good suggestions. You'RE GONNA take any of those or do you have something else that you might tackle with no basketball What are you GonNa do it yourself? Yeah well that'd be numb thinking about an idea. I'M GONNA give it a try to do exist because you obviously haven't committed but if you say it now you will undoubtedly commit well. My wife has been Encouraging me to write a book okay so I I did actually start this probably two years ago but it didn't really get going okay. Okay and I've always had you know it's hard to get into during the season and then during the season it's always hard if you're traveling. Yeah and stuff so little window here. I've got some time and I'm going to just she just said. Just write down your stories right in things and see what happens so a memoir or is it a novel kind of. It's kind of a journey basketball journey of like you know where I started following the NBA. Then working for MBA. Doing it as living in you know. Obviously things like shooting with Steph curry and you know you know excited listeners. Art Listening to this right now. There's a lot of yeah here. We go this book. I'm serious. It's funny when you know because like task it's very it's Tony because I'm like. Does anyone really care? But then when you start writing stories and tell stories and people talk about on the show like we'll see. I don't know how long it's GonNa be at the records much be. Hey here's some stories. Please call the book. Here's here's some stories. When you start when you get to. Whenever you're done writing it just please be the last sentences that'll do. Yeah I mean it's GonNa be just traveling stories and basketball stories and how they sometimes intertwined I think Oh man does get his own chapter well he might because he's got a tattoo so yeah we'll see I don't know I mean I have no. It's it's one of those things didn't WANNA share. Because I'm like what I'm GonNa do with this weekend. Edit this out just got to at least try. That's the thing. It's a huge challenge to to feel that like you know you can actually put something down. That is readable sure. What's harder writing a book or reading the environmental? There's another challenge. I can try to knock out in the next days that he's right. Thank you thank you. Good Good Luck. He was posted. We'll share some of what you've written or the coming weeks old pieces and then we could be just a chapter of his book. Yeah the potential chapter and then we can. Yeah we can go. There's something I'll try to have one for next Friday. Okay great love it so you got set a deadline thing. You need to be outside right. I'm doing this and that's it and the the other thing was you know with the boss will in Australia last year. I thought that was a good way to sort of so. Yeah yeah the prodigy son returns. Yes just how how I would've felt as a twelve year old knowing that like the best in the world we're coming close to the business to that'll do All right well good luck. Yes something to look forward to again next. More Workman is the worst thing. You gotTa write a whole chapter and then read this guy. That's more than fifty long all right before we go here for today's podcast. Rapid Fire Fron. Got News for you guys earlier this week before. Of course the virus scare. Espn posted a great story about how bobbleheads become the NBA's biggest little status symbol. Did you know that then? Wolves Guard Chauncey BILLUPS was the first bobblehead given away at an NBA game. Wow I had no idea so funny looking bobblehead to bobblehead technology has gotten a lot better. It's improved quite a bit. Yeah there's even like quotes in the article there like when we first started doing these it was just about getting him out didn't matter even who it looked like. We gave them a bald head. That's fine like if you had shown me the bobblehead said try and guess who it is. Michael Ruffin was off the Phillips. I think but anyway. It's a fun little fact knowing that now I want you to tell me though. What personal details would be included on your bobblehead leap? Well for me I would like it to be dressed like Mesa shorts t shirt and flip flops and a boat in the shorts pocket which is indicates a Hanky panky onside fucking okay and also allied bid because thinking on two years now having a bit. It's a state. It's a part of me. Glasses of classes. Yeah loss and maybe two sets of headphones one on your ears around your neck sure. Why not? Okay task? Well I'm not going to have a beard even though I carry one daily. I'm going to have just a soul patch. Why have always wanted one? Not really a by. I think it would be only bobblehead in the world with just a soul getting. It'll be a HITO Turkogle doll and it'll get injured and broken. You never had a soul patch and it's always interesting to watch because there was a look those out there. You gotta try it. It's one of those but it's more it's it's it's a lot more beneficial when you think about it this time. Thanks rare to pitchers in the major league baseball who had soul patches that were grown up past their Chin. Did Not like that. Like a rat tail on Calia face. Rat Tail Jd Yeah what do you got on your bobblehead mine is. I will have a beard. Obviously be wearing headphones. Yes cargo pants and I would like to be roller skating on roller skates. No particular reason. Just it's fresh in my mind. Cause still bummed that. I missed roller skating. We go back. We gotta go back well if they're still open. I'm not sure we have a lot of talented designers. I'd love to see like mockups of these three bobbleheads. In if you're up to it you know Lee with all the things that you mentioned task gotTa have a soul patch. Jd on Roller Skates. Hey I know you guys can do all right our next one. This question comes from Mike in Luxembourg. Who recently bought himself a Kabukicho? Thanks to Lee always going on and on about it it was Mike's first taste of that. Sweet fermented tea and he found it disgusting. Mike was not a man who's Maybe a little disappointed so his question though. Have you ever been talked into something and then immediately regretted doing it or buying it? Well Hey Mike knows it or more than one flavor Kombucha I was gonna try something else because there are a few wolf wants out there. I will say But yeah in terms of being talked into doing something. I one time my turn to do the driving for not out on the town with the guy's house at twenty or so and now we're having a few beers in the back and we're part of the freeway where it was open and one of the guys who go on what was put your foot down cops adhere feeling peer group pressure. I put my foot down within honestly twenty seconds. I saw the red and blue flashing lights and win the Cup. He wasn't happy by Naughty. Saw The guys in the back during you addicted. Speeding with a couple of DICKHEAD might get out of here but get Outta here. He was not happy but rightfully so to chapter twenty years. Old Twenty a few traffic infringements on their. Yeah yeah that's rough. Yeah but again I mean someone just says going your worst and you've got all right cost me bad one hundred and fifty bucks which you know. That was a lot of money back. Then would you get that bad way up to Like not that far. I think it was one hundred ten kilometers per hour when I was doing like a hundred and twenty five Bailey. I think I think you're allowed up to one hundred officially latte up to one hundred and twenty three or something and I was doing one twenty five. Yeah so listen to this party story. Yeah I can follow that baby. I'm in Costco. I'm with my with Danielle. My lovely wife she said. Let's get these Kale chips for a healthy snack. I said sure I guess I'm not really going to draw pictures we get into. The car is big bag of chips. I'm talking the length of a torso big bag kale chips opener up. Dig In and it's just dry nothingness. There's no flavor there's nothing but crumbly Kale bits in my teeth. A waste of time so he turned that car around and we return it to Costco. Full refunding they do they. They'll take back they'll take any and no questions asked but you didn't even I'd just hate these zero no excuses. Not I'm I'm allergic to Kale. No nothing and this was an effort. Costco wasn't but honestly what a party time that. Jd Pretty much every time. I'm invited to go golfing and I accept. I regret it almost time. How many times does this happen? Probably ten times total just I suck at it. I get really self conscious because I had to. Because you know there's people behind you plan through and and all that and I don't like riding around the carts the only time I've ever enjoyed it as if I'm walking if I'm carrying my clubs. I like that because it's just a walk in the park. Really Golfing tone. You do the What do they call it? The par three courses little Little tiny courses someplace. Those are fun. Yeah I'm a horrible gopher to but you can sort of hang with that. Yeah Yeah in Toronto. The right by Victoria Parkas Dantonio anyway. That was one of the few times that -secutive course yes. They could think all right final one here. This queue by way of Mark See. He writes sup. No pants currently listening to Wednesday's shorts and pants classic. I was once told by a young man working at a Banana Republic that a belt is an accessory not a necessity really stuck with me in a way. That influences everything. I do pants related. Do you have anything that someone said to you when you were younger. That really stuck with you sleep. Well lots of things stuck with me. But I didn't really realize until I became a dad and I started just saying bad things to my kid and the one that really harm was on when Sebastian was just born about three months old and used for feet so as We sort of got Roxana. You know to go into the breastfeeding position. He started just cry. You know because I just get like they needed straight away and I just said okay okay. There's no need to carry on like a pork chop you'll be there. That's that's just. I don't know if that's an Australian dad site but it was like I know it doesn't make any but I was like wow dickey must've said he said to us a lot. Yeah but you know you sort of forget about it when you grow up then you become a dad on that dislike. It's it's just heating the way you were talking a three month. No no all right task. Cool well when it comes to life. The days are long but the years are short. It's true claw. Go a plug away every day. You work hard you go to bed. You do the same thing the next and before you know what? Those years a pass it's true. That's very true depressing bill. I don't know if it's depressing. Reality is a you know. I actually don't know where I think you would say. It's just a saying out there. Yeah it's not it's not something I've Proprietary information but it's a good one. That's very good. Jd My grade for teacher. Ms Sheffield once told me a person's shoes you look at a person's shoes you can tell almost anything everything you need to know about her. Heard something like that before. Yeah and to this day the first thing I will look at. If I'm meeting somebody for the first time is there. She's always. I'm always looking at people's and do you think it. I think it's kind of true in the sense of obviously the style of shoe. They're wearing Of Quality of shoe like that both of those things and what kind of shoes they're wearing if you see sort of like a dude in a business suit. But he's wearing cowboy boots you know just tells me there's just intangible thing about this guy he's just. He does not conform to things. And you know he's a redneck at heart. Maybe you know oil. Yeah exactly exactly so. You're always looking down always looking down about a dad wearing a t shirt shorts and flip flops with big Baggy Bolger. This pocket guy is unconcerned. Bobbleheads who just want to us so do the markup that one we'll see if we could share it on inskip all right. That's rapid fire. Cut The music. How do you feel about that music? Jd WITH RAB. Far Back about it. you know. I mean I don't care. Yeah that's the rapid fire music. Yeah Yeah I mean. That's kind of the joke. It's not rapid but it's it's try it goes on forever. That track is I've lost it. How long is it? It is Is Six minutes seven minutes anyone else already? Four thirty thirty five twelve eight. It's nine forty. A rapid fire often almost always have to restart. Yeah so wow speaking about being rapid. Let's go back to the topic. I've been looking at your shoes jd. 'cause I can't see your face the last week or so. Yeah you've been wearing the same shoes sort of Standard Sita's trainer. Use me well every day. I think every day for the last five days every day. Don't let your answer day. Don't have to be you've been wearing days. Why are you offended? You have to wear shoes when you leave the house. He picked the shoes. I'll I'm I if you notice I'm also wearing Track pants like I'm going to gym after after. That's why you're right because there are different shoe for you. Yeah they are not my usual. This is my my runner. Runner look usually Ra- cowboy boots. He's FLIPFLOP I. Do you feel about leaving the gym. Sweaty shoe I don't like it but it's efficient and I just got my cargo. It's what I wanted to know. End This rapidly. Absolutely love it guys? Email us no dunks at the ATHLETIC DOT COM tweet at US. Hashtag no dunks at no Dunks Inc. We ain't going anywhere that's the plan we're going to continue podcasting even though we don't have the NBA for at least thirty days here. We're going to try and make it through. We're GONNA have some fun. I've seen already 'cause I asked. We asked you guys sent in some really good ideas. I mean there's been some brutal ideas and twisted but there have been some good ideas in terms of maybe concepts for a particular show that we already do a series. We already do like squad. Or you know crossfire. We wants dead or guest or something like that or even new ideas that we could try. And I think that's what we're going to be doing. I never had a brainstorming session later today. Jd you're not going to the gym anytime soon. We gotTA start planning the weeks ahead here and get creative so keep your ideas come in is my point at the athletic dot com or at no dunks. You heard it here. I have a great time. Turn up love you guys awesome. Thanks for joining US and remember. Everybody puts their shoes on one adidas sneaker at a time brace the weekend people a B. It's been so long days it's Kennedy.

NBA basketball Commissioner Adam Silver Rudy Gobert League Mba cricket Instagram Lee sixers Mrs It editor US twitter facebook Jd Kevin durant trey kerby Zini Espn
Jalen Rose, Judd Apatow, and the 2006 NBA Redraftables

The Bill Simmons Podcast

2:41:18 hr | 6 months ago

Jalen Rose, Judd Apatow, and the 2006 NBA Redraftables

"Today's episode of the bill. Simmons podcast on the ring podcast network brought to you by Ziprecruiter. While we know covid nineteen, it might change the way we attend sporting events or whether we can attend them at all. Who you're sitting next to how you're getting food and drink whatever else? Ladder things may change as our world starts opened up again, but. There's one thing that won't change representing sponsor Ziprecruiter's mission. They'll continue doing what they've always done helping. Growing companies hire for their teams and helping people find jobs. If you're actively hiring ziprecruiter will buy candidates to apply to your most urgent roles, making it faster and easier to reach people you need by bringing employers and job. Seekers together Ziprecruiter is work in to help all of us go to ziprecruiter dot com slash work together were also brought to you by the ringer dot com in the ringer podcast network where we. We just have season. Two of one of my favorite podcasts. The wire way down the hall with Van Leith Hill that launched. So if you're ready to hear people arguing about whether Ziggys Apopka was a terrible character or whether the season was underrated. That's your podcast. Check it out. It's really good I love it because it makes me remember the wire, one of my favorite shows of all time, but also it's fun to hear people arguing about things that I was just arguing with my friends about like Bacha. I didn't love Ziggy pocket, but I thought he was in his central character Because of all the drama, he caused left and right, but yeah. I I wouldn't say I would have poster him by office, but anyway that's the kind of stuff they argue about. Check it out coming up I have an awesome podcast for you. You probably can't listen to in one sitting, but that's all right. My friend Jalen rose is GONNA come on to talk about a couple things including more than a vote this really important thing that he's doing Lebron James and some others were doing the two thousand six redraft with being Chris Ryan and then old friend. Jet Appetite is stop by this. Is Action packed? But first burlap. A. Belt friend Jalen rose once upon a time. He had a little podcast grantland podcast work the Jalen rose report. With the guy named David Jacoby. Who didn't even have his name in the title for like two years. And now. Four PM ESPN. Jalen and Jacoby, it was a long journey was a decade long journey to get there -gratulations haven't officially congratulate you on the podcast. We give people. They walk. And I WANNA. Give you a big show as a matter of fact, I'll look over my shoulder in the studio. have to go grab something because this is live. We family, we uncut it unfiltered while you give me shout outs and. Acknowledgement not only are you my brother and I love you, but how `bout this. Before to my best selling book. Right. I write that out of you remember. I. Have K.. You're ru Jalen. Oh, yeah. And so I had to say a few things just content wise. What people call you to park by other? You. Know, you're the one who caused that. Record well the reason why everyone should call you to pop father. Is like now. It's seems normal when people want to let their voice be heard, too. Have A podcast radio show. People I want to barbershop. Feel that our hair down with you know, get relaxed. Like you were so very far ahead of this movement. in. Florida roles report and Jalen and Jacoby and the grant last studio, and then we had grantland basketball our. The job interviews we were doing. Well the grill and basketball are now. We only did ten episodes as very proud of them, but I are big legacy Dow is. We were the first people to put Stephen Jackson on television show now he's now. He's one of the most famous people in America. How about? How about that and I'm so happy and proud of him. He's doing amazing job. You know representing how George Floyd was tragically killed, and when I saw pitcher, and they called each other twin, I was like Yo. They do just look alike. At I'm older than him, so it's refreshing to for me to see people just grow into their ma'am bones and. Things become. A passionate to them. And things circumstances take place, and you get a new calling and I see in him now. Somebody that understands that. A. He has he has. He has a bigger opportunity to make a great in Florence. By representing the legacy. Like he has done so very well and. You and I've talked about this for a really long time. And Somebody was born in the seventies and old enough to remember being taught about. What happened with emit to lie all? He was whistling white, woman. y'All why people come. You've got across the street or you got to eat in a different restaurant like segregation in laws were passed in the late sixties, but it didn't end the next day so like there the portion of my childhood where I got exposed to this. And I know about. Fred Hampton when he was tragically killed in Chicago, they ambushed police ambush this house because the government and the president at the time didn't want another Black Messiah. So like these days I was exposed to a my childhood. Yeah, Love Basketball! Father's Jimmy! Walker did norm and stuff like that, but it was like man. League didn't go to the military really. Luau S- tinder was there. How was he? Tim Brown Bill Russell Greatest to ever do it so that. Early Seventies! Kid It was important to be socially and politically conscious. It changed. In the eighties, because athletes needed to grow their games, you notice. bestselling author one of the greatest. People at. You know really been historian again. Right and I love you you my brother, everybody know that. That's not hyperbole. That's a that's a flat fact. Google Bill Simmons and spotify. Okay, so. Burr is a magic were charged with growing the game. Right people like Oh in the last day has MTA was snitching. SNITCHING that. MJ sanded league was drug at Tokyo team is like a squirrel chases after a nut. Everybody knows that. He didn't do was named people. He didn't say someone's name. that. That's the line of the case, so they were like growing the game, a magic and bird a very academic, and we know what they accomplished. MJ Took. The marketing of a black man mainstream 'cause I remember because I was in college with I M J Nike. We were counted Nike. We didn't have our Shubra Hey let's. He's Barclays Karachi's. Diaz let's what he's Bo. Jackson. And we going places like bath, five nikes and black shoes, black socks and We're part is, and then here comes Alan Iverson. We're core rolls or stuff like that and. It really kind of. From a socially politically conscious. Nature kind of tailed off from that perspective because athletes. Suburbs rapper start moving to the suburbs. Get paid top dollar in all of a sudden start looking at the stats and I wait a minute. I was still getting killed by police. Still getting treated like the sixties, people were sick dogs on us. And treating us like we were three of a man, and so now bill that the giants that current athletes stand on their shoulders and I love seeing your Celtic Jalen Brown and Malcolm Brogden. And people that. Want to stamp for what is righteous I want. The American white gotTa Know America when you were born. Nike If you're fifty, fifty five or older is different or your family and your nieces or nephews in your kids, it's forty and under. They grew up listening to rap. They grew up wearing long. Shorts lack shoes black socks. In sports haveN'T BLACK IDOLS HAVEN'T BLACK PEOPLE? They want to watch their movies or dude their comedy and stuff like that, so we're. We're family. We're a melting pot. and to see so many different people, racists colors increase all be. Now marching and protesting for a common good, it's refreshing in a breeze me back to you because. There was a time in this industry. Were I style too much so sad people? and. I know you were getting corporate emails about the things I was saying and you just let me in US cook. In allowing that voice to grow creates moments wild proud that I could get up and we're talking about the scenario. We talking about now and I'm able to articulate myself the way I was able to do so and I wanted to thank you. Because the roles report in Jalen Jacoby but came out. Let's talk about board at basketball and that was a stereotype that I wanted to overcome O.. E. Play basketball. What is he doing talking about football? Talk About Baseball right just the dumbest thing ever. And, so I appreciate you in? That's my soapbox. I thought we had more problems with countdown. With. The grand stuff was easy I could navigate that but. You trying to find the balance of who you actually are to hang out with versus who you are on a studio half hour show that's being shown to twenty million people, and you try to navigate. That was really fun to figure out with you. We talked about it a lot. How far do you go? We get feedback from people like hey. Man, tone it down like tone it down. This is my personality. and. Don't say James Doll through people out of the building like okay. Well, you can google these things. I'm not sure I know he owns the team. I didn't make this up. On. The most interesting that happened the two years we worked together. WAS THAT CLIPPERS? Where's game? Because people I don't know if I've ever told the whole story like you were actually involved behind the scenes, talking to people in the locker room and at one point. It did even see. My Dad agreed on doing anything. And you just disappeared. You left the room and you were talking to people for an hour, and they end up doing the warm up jacket thing but I look back at that moment. And I said this on the pot a couple of weeks ago that that's a moment that I think in two thousand twenty is probably handled differently I think they didn't totally know how far they could go and what they wanted to risk, but now I think in by two thousand twenty standards. They're risking it at that point. They're not playing. And again I notice. Comment is GonNa Probably. Made, some people uncomfortable, but we know ultimately. The power comes from WHO has the money. And when Tommie, Smith and John Carlos did their protests. At the Olympics they were ostracizing would never able to get jobs again, and they were not made heroes. The the gentlemen at the Ali Summit. Who Over my shoulder? Win May political stances as you know, they were not celebrated by the media, and so now we do all of these. WHO's the greatest of all time list? I to be honest with you guys like I, if you guys be like Oh bill! Russell was only eighteen in Kareem was playing against like I'm not even GonNa Talk Basketball with you. Like for real like you guys don't understand the reason why they weren't celebrated the way they should have been celebrated is because their political stances. Is Not because Michael Jordan Lebron James achieve more than half. We start talking about greatness and dominance. You gotTA. Start with rustling, career. Bright. Started coming to say conversation or you using the word wrong? All the stuff they did beyond basketball to it's got. You gotta include the whole package. You're right. Muhammad, Ali, Center He he's a young puffiness pitcher, he he wasn't even in the NBA yet. Right. He wasn't not in the NBA. Is So for for Colin Kaepernick to take a NEOM become symbolic to George, Floyd killing because the visual is a mirror image. Now. Players that have been able to stand on the shoulders of the giants that I mentioned. They make more money now bill. They have more power now in. It's been more awareness. So when Colin took knee at Twenty Sixteen, it was twelve or thirteen players. This, year is going to be hundreds. What's the difference. They know they won't go sponsorships now. While member Trayvon when wouldn't Trayvon Martin thing happened and. And the Brian and those guys. They took. What was it an instagram picture? and. We were doing TV back then. It was. Doing countdown that year, and it was like a debate or getting credit member. They're getting criticized Why are they waiting into this? And so. Our strength. Clearly comes from our intestinal fortitude of what we do it at five hundred years in this country. That's where the initially comes from we're. Taught, you gotTa Work Harder you're GONNA, do do ten jobs and get paid half as much like these are either become inherent. But you are I'm I'm really I'm willing to fight that. Ends up happening is when in twenty twenty was celebrating that Nascar. Is it using a confederate flag? It I can't celebrate that. You celebrated Common Sense Right? It's like it's like we're not asking for reparations. Equality. Well I I was planning on having you on next month as we got closer to the basketball playoffs because you haven't been on a while, we haven't shot the shit about stuff, but you did this thing with Lebron and a few others this week. That? I thought was was really really cool. Really important, really powerful, and you mentioned You Know Kareem Ali and Russell and guys like that. Lebron's done some really great stuff I. This might be the best thing that he's kind of spearheaded. Because this is something that could actually influence real change, and you are prominently involved my friend Jalen rose. What you're doing and how it came together. So Lebron decided as you mentioned that he wanted to create a coalition. They basically knowledged while. Wanted to acknowledge why. Your opportunity to make a change. was basically more than a vote. So. A lot of times, people get discouraged deal because we look into candidates we like. We don't like either one of them. To be frank with you. I we don't necessarily know how they're going to influence the plight of the people that look like us. But this is a unique climate. Were One of these gentlemen have clearly just gone way too far in so? It's not even political. It's more. Knowing you're worth. Being a tax paying citizen in a contribute to society. In overcoming. That are placed in front of you and your communities. So in the inner city, the lines are longer. You get up to the poll and the ballot. Does it work? You have elderly people working in the city, but you have younger stronger. People who are more tech savvy in the suburbs. The lines are shorter. A lot of people don't have trust in the system. They don't feel if they send in their vote via mail. This actually GonNa get counted in then. There's the elephant in the room. The popular vote. Tally dictate who wins the president's. People don't like to say that I love, but there's a thing called the electoral college and all of their pitches up. They look a lot more similar than opposite. And that discourages a lot of people. And so the goal is is to. Is is to remotivate them the way it happened two thousand eight with Obama. In two, thousand twelve with Obama, we didn't have that same energy in two thousand sixteen. We need to have that same energy. In Two, thousand and twenty, especially, when the person in power won't even say the phrase, black lives matter. Or won't even say the phrase. I can't breathe. You that that that that tells you, you have an opportunity to make change prosecutors. Senators Mayors President you have an opportunity to make change. Let Your Voice be heard, and so that's why I applaud, Lebron because as the best player in the NBA. And an iconic figure, you and I both know win. You're in his position when you start to have a political one. Everybody is going to disagree with you. Even if they're wrong or not knowledgeable about the topic, so that's what I always appreciated about him. And He's been consistent and I know you like that as well. Will you talked about raising the energy? Of for two thousand and twenty for certain community. what about the fixing? Some of the stuff that you mentioned a little bit earlier about? You know there's a little chicanery with some of the voting places. The lines are too long that things don't work. They'll shut the shut the stuff down and eleven o'clock at night all those things. How can you fix that with this coalition that everybody put together here. So I I just want to. Paint a picture is one of my favorite songs growing up with GRANDMASTER FLASH AND MILLION MEAL THE MESSAGE I remember being a little kid. And Rapper's delight came out of hip hop behavior. I can't front I remember when I first heard it and everybody was loving it I. Love it like that. It was like the greatest rap song effort to every by Allied. Her broken glass everywhere. People physical steps you just don't care like. That's it right there. And that's the pitcher paint with this because. Are So many people who are able and willing taxpaying citizens actually won't won't vote. But all of a sudden you go to your voting site. Off Man, the line is so very long. It's to deflate you. It's designed literally to deflate you. You name any place you go a ballgame. A concert, a supermarket, the longer the line. Less encourage you to the stand in it. Especially once you get to the front of the poll and it may not be working. So now you see all of these people coming outside arguing create chaos. What is going on what is happening? It neck creates a level of mistrust. That has gone for decades, so it's like. Okay is my boy's really gonNA be hurt also. The thing we hold in our hands twenty four hours. A day is called a smart. Why can't we vote from? Your NBA voter bill. You're a really notable CEO of a company. You do almost everything from your phone. Your computer, right? Yeah. Okay If everybody's eighteen basically has a phone. Everybody is bill every month for clearly inviter phone. Wifi service is tracked. We should be able to. Vote on our phone, or how have the date at we vote? Be a holiday where people are all. If I make forty thousand dollars arrest. I really WANNA. Make be heard, but you know what I can't do. Take off work today. Right. So you foreign, basically a nonprofit. that. Will eventually be able to raise money. What are you going to spend the money on? Where does the money going to go? So basically what you try to do, is you try to eliminate any barriers emotionally psychologically or physically dust going to make people feel that mob voice Ma vote cannot be heard. It will not be impaired. We're in your living room. Hey, Bill! If you feel this out and you can't go vote on this day. Yes, you can. You can track that it actually arrived. Your Voice in your vote will count, but people have. Not Trusted the system for so very long. There there are people who feel like delivering the mail sometime is like. Oh, you can fed exit. Way House now you can fed ex. There'd be in. You'll have to draft. You can fly there, right? And so I'm really enthusiastic. Who was on the car? Skyler diggins. Drama trae young. Donnas has loomed Draymond Green. Kidron Perkins. Stag Jack Big shot the Stephen Jackson as I mentioned earlier. It's going to contain a mushroom. It's GonNa continue to gain power and it just about voices it just about. The charity to Kinda makes it. A hood is Kinda just empowering those of voices. They get left out it's. Actually it's not political. It's not even political. Mobilize people to vote ain't political seems normal. Order on. Does it get the bottom? What a taker! Came with the cure for cancer. Normal well, that's how you able to be a nonprofit, because you're not leaning one way or the other. You're just making it easier for all human beings to vote. Fair thing. I didn't know such a big thing I was like okay see. If, you say okay. So Lebron said I'm inspired by the likes of Muhammad Ali I'm inspired by the. Bill Russell's in the cream of village bars. The Oscar Robertson's those guys who stood when the times were even way worse than they are today. Hopefully some way down the line someday down the line, people recognize not only for the way. I approached game of basketball, but the way I approached life as an African American man. What year did you think he really fully understood the gravity of San? Something like that because it seems like in the last I would say six seven years. Once, he got a couple of titles out of the way as he was trying to put everything together. Then you start thinking all right. Big Picture. Hot OUGHTA be remembered fifty years from now. When do you think that was for him? All by the way you'RE GONNA appreciate this couple of my greatest woods in modern era championship history. Yeah. MJ Had not retired yet. If Shaq and Kobe not broken. If Lebron not left Miami. If k. d did leave the warriors. I think the Brian got his man bones. When he left Miami. When he went back to Cleveland. People forget the letter to Dan. Gilbert wrote. So that was basically a decision. It's almost like Spike Lee. Being a knicks fan yet garlic to how bad jay is. And they throw me out of the arena. I said ten million dollars on open. All of movies have. Front row been their number one mascot forever. Even, he can't stop me from being a nickname. That's how Ron felt about going home I'm going to bring championship to Cleveland and so to me. That's when he started to. Roll into the philanthropist. Is that we see these days. You know one of the greatest. Whatever's if the legend had played you a little more ninety eight the? Phone different. Kept you. If They didn't cut out the last dance. They they tend parts they. Want famous. Yes. Happy did I got an interview Code Looking? He been up for two thousand, but it was a little too late. That was fun to. That was fun to see you in their new Just eat A. WE talked billion times about that Pacers both series in how close close it was for them to go down. There was interesting to hear the way he talked about it. Like it was. Thank. You pushed him. You pushed into the tail end of it and he's still he's still got up. Disappointed thing is like he's. He's the goat. So when arrested a world watches that they get a chance to celebrate his greatness. It's like the hero in the movie like he's GonNa find a way to persevere. We know rockies going to find a way to win. so that's how everybody's watching the last end. And I'm seeing footage. The added no exist it. I'm like. He was carrying pot belly smoking cigars in the locker room. We should have. We lost it in pip, it's hurt. cussing out Jerry, Krause Demeaning Hill. I'm like. I'm like I can't believe we lost the now, and then I thought about it Bill Tony crew coach He. Yeah he got, he got you. People sleep all him. The waiter had like he had at least twenty, yet they the way they were constructed for a game like that. To get to basically over ninety points they needed wildcard guy. Whereas, you guys could always get to whatever point total, but that was a really good pacers team I. WanNa save stuff for when you come back before the season starts. Did you anytime weight? Have you talked? Have you talked to your lovely wife about three and a HALF MONTHS IN ORLANDO? She aware though so, what's happening here? Here's what here's what we decided I'd like I gotta check the guest list and you on it, so if you going to be there Dakota, we got like six or seven people. Oh! This way cope is going. He's that leaving for three months. As, process. How about this? If you go, I'll go. Oh, so you're not going. You're basically telling me you're not going right. Saying! If you go out, go otherwise I'll come to la. Do the show. Instead of going to Bristol I'm saying that on wax. Those are the options. I I was studying round two. which would be two straight weeks? At least it's eight eighteen, so it'd be at least two games a day by allegation. It would be like you know those last two rounds of the Olympics. It'll just keep going for two hours. He great I was thinking that would be plus the ran to match. UPS are going to be incredible and I I'm Kinda looking at that one, but if I have to let go and get quarantined for a week and all this stuff. I don't know what we'll talk about that. When it gets closer, I'd be psyched if you came no way though. That's the player. We'll see if they do. In announcement for the NBA schedule is likely to be on. ESPN and we'll do allies, so I'll make sure we catch up. And if we do another pod, we have to do the deep dive on I. We never talked about the conversation we had with magic, and we'll by that time about Detroit Detroit Chicago basketball. And Magic's whole thing about George Gervin, he was the greatest pickup basketball player of all time, and he's just laid out the case for us for like four minutes and we were like okay. Good enough we agree. Hey, imagine being a little kid. Thank Cecilia, Jim I'm a little skinny kid. To give me like five dollars to get everybody, gatorade or Fagel stuff I'd say, go grab ice. Jorissen some ice. Just think about this house. A youngster get to grab Johnson is for the Gatorade on Dan believe you'd be an idiot to pay he he like you know much. Ma money money, catch cash cab. Ice Ice. I feel just like he saying he's word, an Ma like thirty five in a row, we Wisconsin I was a little kid what? ilet! Georgia's on that team just one. Hundred by once, and he could score anytime. You have the basketball so is like. So magic figure that early all right so I need Georgia by team, and then I'm just going to be able to stay in the court for three hours for those that don't know that that's a modern day. Kevin Durant. Yeah so when? They yeah, he'll join the seventy three win team, but he will be the lead score where finals MVP. That's her can of Iran. That Modern Day version. You agree with dad that fair. Yeah I mean we almost like Gervin with twenty four foot range. Same kind of. Shooting, oh, he have been shooting know. The thing with Gervin, it was just he was getting a thirty two. He was getting eight points a quarter, and that was it, and then there might be the sixteen point quarter and their the twenty point quarter, but he was getting eight. Every quarter was just happened. You're a prolific score in all time. Great Legend when you go into the final game of the season in noted the guy that you're going into score tied at sixty seven to sixty eight. Over seventy and you get it right. Yeah crazy! It's true. All right so you come back when we actually had the playoffs, that was good senior said everybody gives Kobe Kiss for me. I talk to you. Sir Love You, brother. See. All right. The two thousand six, three draftable is coming up at one second. Joe, House and Chris, Ryan or on. It wanted to mention that houses fairway rolling podcast is back because golf is back I. Actually went on their this week with Nathan Hubbard to try to figure out who's GonNa win the colonial, but we are doing a free tournament fandom dot com slash ringer golf every week that they have a PGA tournament you can try. Try To beat me in house and you won't because houses the best that this stuff and has really good steaks with WHO to pick. WHO'S GONNA win? He actually wins bunny betting on golf, which is just dumbfounded to be but if you if you like golf, or if you WANNA, get into golf more and try to figure out what's going to happen. Refer Checkout Fairway Rolling all right. The two thousand six redraft ables right now. All right the two thousand six redraft ables Chris Ryan. Is here Joe Houses here? This is one of the dumbest Pius drafts. Yeah other than two thousand thirteen probably the dopey draft of this entire century we had. A for our first pick was named Andrea. We had six lottery whiffs. We had out of our top five picks. One guy became amnestied later tires. Thomas One guy was an iconic all-time bust at Morrison. became, Internet punching bag and a despised new. York knick Andrea Bernani and then the number five pick was guy whose nickname was the landlord that I had totally forgotten until until I did all the research for this lamarcus. Aldridge was the only good top five pick. At of this draft Chris Ryan this was also the last blog post of your chauncey billups blog, which has new four hour documentary about it coming up by Ken Burns. What do you remember this draft? I certainly think about it I. It's intertwined with my experience on basketball Internet, and like the first three or four years at two thousands, where it was truly weird out there you know, and people were just blog about the personalities that they were attracted to in I much as this. This two thousand extract is honestly like. It's probably a waste of this podcast. It's time to to re re relitigate it. What an island of misfit toys man, and what a strange group of individuals to be in those lottery much less this whole draft. And I remember those that night, and just like. That was back when Lake basketball was truly weird back then when when guys like this would get picked like sheldon. Williams would go in the top five or six picks of a draft, and you were just like what am I doing with my life? I'm just watching. This guy named the landlord gets let. House Russillo and I. We did the two thousand five redraft ables. And discussed. This is an epic. EPIC GM run of just terrible decisions across the board for five years, and you can feel a lot of them. In this draft combined with one of the Weirdest College seasons. We've ever had where it was basically the height of Jj Redick, becoming like a Cobra Kai America's villain, on Duke and then this bizarre Adam Morrison thing going on, and all of us are like wow, these are the best two players in college basketball. This is not a great side for the draft. What else do you remember from that college season? I. Don't remember a lot from IT I. Think the overriding overwhelming. Sentiment is what you guys have been saying. which is just crazy weird? It was so weird I never thought that do. Team was very good, and yet they they won right. They won the title that year. I never thought that Sheldon Williams was was a wiser kind of guy and he got picked. Fifth in the draft it was like. This draft I think is proof of how hard. Draft is like. How can you fault GM's? How can you teams for? You know taking a swing on a bunch of guys. You know the track records here are all over the place. How can you possibly mine a diamond like Paul Millsap it back in this era? This is the this is the kind of takeaway for me. Yeah there. We don't really have the advanced metrics component yet. Even if you look I don't want to spoil the redraft that we're doing later, but. You Have Rondos, the twenty first pick Kyle Larry's twenty-fourth. Paul millsaps forty seventh. PJ Tucker's thirty fifth. And these are all guys that would become like top eight or nine row of guys, and then you go the other way with the top five. Wurley one guy makes it I. We knew it at the time. And this is only happened a couple of times with the draft I think it definitely two, thousand, definitely two, thousand thirteen, and then this one. Where people are like Holy Shit. Get hold on hold onto your seats. We don't know what's going to happen. This draft has some. SUGGEST LEGENDARY DUMB Ashtrays. So Chicago ends up with the number. Two pick because of Eddy Curry trade that Zach. Thomas made the previous summer where he gives up to unprotected first round picks. The first one manifest itself as the number two pick in the entire draft. Chicago gets this insane Dumb Luck Oh my God. I can't believe this worked out for us. Now was too good to be true. They flip the pick to number four Portland. for the rights, Tyrus, Thomas and Viktor Crap House. You have a victim crap, joke. Yes, it's Victor Crap. That's the joke well. That trade was crap. Portland acquires the seventh pick from the Celtics Randy foy. Raeffel Francis contract which ran for. TWO MORE YEARS Or three more years and and Dan Dicko. In exchange for Sebastian Tell Fair theoretic lifts contract, which was expired years sooner than mayflower France, which is why boss wanted it and a two thousand eight second rounder. We're GONNA. Go until later, but this is about as angry. As by. Dad's ever been on on a draft week. He was just completely enraged. We'll cover later and then the other one. That's nuts. PHOENIX, says the twenty first pick. Marcus Williams is on the board. Controversial Point Guard, who was of at Uconn, still some laptops. Let's call. It seems laptop steeler. and then regime rondos on the board who everybody was like Freakish athleticism huge hands? He was one of the original at freak guys. but but had some some some chemistry issues it Kentucky. Leave it at that. Phoenix has the twenty first pick. They just trade it for future Portland first rounder. Meanwhile, this is the height of being great. They could have had Rondo. They pass that up. Chris. Why were the GM so bad? Is it like the Internet? Had IT properly bullied? GM's yet for bad behavior. What was going on here so I'll tell you I'll tell you what I think is i? Remember sitting in the back of a of a wonderful record store called Mondo Kim's on saint marks place in new. York City and reading your columns back then like and that was the first time that I was like. Oh, yeah, you know what somebody makes these decisions like? These guys don't just appear in Sixers, uniforms and I remember. That was sort of like that you you were among the first people introduce these ideas of like these guys can actually screw teams up for years and be paying more attention to how they spend the teams money how they put these teams together what I look at this list of I. Mean I and I actually like amnesty for the era of dumb? GM's I think that a lot more fun when there were more David Cons and less. Darrel worries now he's like it's pretty rare. Win Some screws up on a monumental level. You know this was the year I wrote. The atrocious GM summit for four months before I think one common theme with a lot of this stuff. There's more ex players running teams. This was still the last. Part of the Era House House I don't know if you know this, but you've had a couple. Ex players run the bullets wizards. To to Mick success I think what's happened by the time we get to two thousand and twenty. It's A. It's just a lot more smart people who didn't necessarily play basketball professionally. You know I I think back. Then you like you have wes unseld Ernie Grunfeld Zach Thomas. It just goes on and on Michael Jordan's making picks for Charlotte. And the wave is coming of the Daryl. Maury Sam, Prestige guys that are looking at a completely different that are taking advanced metrics in new account that aren't bringing explorer biases of our. No, this guy's talented. We can save him things like that house. Would you rather have an ex player or a smart person? Run your team. Just I I. Don't know what your pick I mean. The one thing I will say in in reviewing this draft in thinking about it. The the dearth of talent this is really a talentless draft. I mean. Yeah. There was one potential superstar in the draft and he got hurt. And that's it like Adam Morrison. Yes and his name is Adam Morrison. That was my favorite part of Chris. Ryan's last blog post ever by the way was was. What was it what you call his outfit? I think I compared him to a guy greeting you at a best buy, but I have to go back and check the team. You call them. Erector like you know a guy like Oh. Yeah, rectory! That's right. Member how many Adam Morrison conversations? We had a no six. This was still an era when people really really cared about college basketball, and he was an incredibly fun college basketball where both him and JJ. where it's hard to think of it this way now, jj turned into such a good role player, but He was awesome to watch in college, and the other schools really hated him, and he's talked on his podcast about you know. It was tough thing for him to deal with as a twenty and twenty one year old. When you're getting hate, he don you like that with Morrison. This is Gonzaga's real of you'll breakout as rally a big time program. And he was unlike any other college player he he was buckets. He putting it up out the point of the conversation where I have to ask you guys. Adam, Morrison! Could, he have made it if he didn't blow out as the and the Hornets Bobcats, whatever they whatever Charlotte version. They were at that point. I kinda liked him freshman year our rookie year in Charlotte I thought he had a couple decent moments that I think the knee injury just killed them. Yeah I think there's a couple of guys in this draft who are drafted a couple of years too early. There are probably a couple of guys who were bus. No matter what, but this draft is is a really interesting snapshot of time, before I think people started getting a little bit more creative with how they. How they developed talent in the NBA, so you've you see a couple of guys here and you're just like. Yeah, this is just someone just straight up drafting a power forward because they think they need some help on the boards. And Morrison drafted in two thousand and twelve is just a much different player than he is in two thousand six. He might have even succeeded in the era that he was drafted into if he hadn't gotten hurt, he that was the worst possible situation for him. Based on what we now know was his particular kind of psychological makeup like he just he you know as you said Bill. He didn't have the The disposition, the demeanor, the psychological wherewithal to be Alpha and they needed MJ needed. Needed Alpha out of that draft pick and the funny thing is. He showed a ton of Alpha as a college basketball player like yeah was incredible Atkin. I loved him and I thought he was a going to have at least a good a career is. Is Somebody like Keith van? Horn like you know you know that felt to me like his. His basement is his floor. But I think it was you know the injury obviously was the career all terror, but if he landed somewhere where he didn't have that pressure, and he got picks later in the lottery in the ten to fourteen range I think he could have been successful in that era. There were some red flags. That we did not know. Had taken to account in the mid two thousand, because even with him, and I remember my column had really taken off at this point I had a lot of is the first time I was really getting inside information from different people, and the the the the word on Morrison at Gonzaga was. He was really fragile, and they really protected him from. The media. You know he was almost like putting a bubble there because they were really worried about him. They were worried about what he could handle and they really sheltered him a lot of ways, and that was the word even before the draft and I think now in two thousand twenty. Teams the science of studying like just the brain and mental makeup of a player, and there's so much more emphasis down mental health. They were real red flags with him. E throw him on Charlotte. Ton Expectations doesn't have a great rookie season. He still averaged eleven a game, but he's on a team with Gerald. Wallace Raymond Felton Meko Kapoor And and it just he gets the knee injury, and he just kinda creators I think he would have been put in a better position succeed but I also don't think he would have gone three because I think. I think teams would have been really concerned about some of the red flags with him coming out of a college. Thing. With Morrison, though it's also like that catch twenty two, where the most value is derived from him, if he's a focal point of the offense, but the most pressure, put on him when he's made the focal point of an offense it also if you're an NBA team and Adam Morrison is the focal point of your offense where you're right. The another guy that tires Thomas ends up going in the top five. It's fueled and by the way I fully admit I was completely wrong I thought he was going to be a good pro. I thought that was he was awesome in the tournament, and it was a classic case of. The Guy Lighting up for two weeks in March madness. And everybody going Oh this guy and. It was just the dictators house. We've gotten sucked into those guys over and over again. That was a classic March badness almost like a contract year like with Jerome. James Sat his contract year. Making thirty million in the playoffs, it was the college of that I think people are more hip to that now. getting getting seduced by two good much bad this week's. Yeah I mean. We've acknowledged it a bunch of times doing these redraft. That back in in that era, and even really especially. In the late nineties, we used performance in the NC Double A. AS A. Highly weighted. Indicator of a potential future success because you know the logic and I, think it's not crazy logic was that. On the biggest stage in front of you know with the highest amount of pressure seeing these guys perform, there should be a reliable kind of indicator of how they're gonNA. withstand that same kind of pressure once they're in the NBA. Maybe. Don't take somebody from LSU's. A good draft strategy. Unless, his name Shack. The number one pick in this draft. Andrea Bark Donnie. None of us. Were that excited about when it happened? And I and when we do the redraft I want to go into his whole career, but here's here's how people felt when it happened Jay. Bilas at the draft says. A solid prospect with a chance to be a solid player. Red Flag number one then he says later in the draft. This is before he's even taken. He does not rebound. He does not post up. He not physical. He needs to work on his body. That's how bad this draft. Number Pick House INARA. Go nuts because we love brain rang college. We were just like. Here's the one guy in this draft. Jj who I think we both felt was a we knew. At least he was valuable player his star, but Brandon. Roy was like we know it is. He's a guard. Who's going to be able to create a shot? He had a very identifiable kinda crossover. Hesitation move that was just like well in the NBA He's going to score twenty a game I wrote when Minnesota Tim Sixth. I wrote in the diary with the six pick Minnesota somehow up with the best part in the draft brain arrive funny how it works out that way with the new rules necessitate move loan is good for sixteen eighteen points again next season and three or four. All Star appearances down the road. That was exactly what happened what we didn't know. We didn't have the intelligence that his knees were like every every good medical staff looked at him, was like that guy's got five years, and so there was a real shelf-life and yet Chris and iconic four or five years for him Oh. Yeah, some of the most like breathtaking moments of that of that NBA, I associate with Brandon Roy. It's miss. The Miss Actually really enjoyed how unique his game was. Oh! Some of these guys man like I? Miss these types of players 'cause. You think like Aldridge is in this draft still growing strong, he's on San. Antonio is going to be a free agent after the season. and. You think like we could have had fifteen years of Brandon Roy. We basically got four. And it wasn't like he did anything wrong. It was just his body. There is a whole thing about he was missing an acl and all these different things but the Celtics. Had the seventh pick. And that their team doctors basically I think they've talked about this. This is what I was told by my Boston. People like the team. Doctors were just like you can't take. This guy is going to be out of the League by the time. He's twenty six twenty seven. There's anything to the idea of the way like we have a better understanding of of like how get healthy like? Is there anything that could have saved for Roy I mean? You're not a doctor, but like the way the sixers put guys on ice for a year or two here and there. Is there anything that could have been done to prolong or save brainer? Roy's career I'm sure. I'm sure I. I don't know if it would have you know. One hundred percent saved his legs. But I'm sure there's a scenario where it odin the other one. You know we'll do out and when we do oh seven, but the Odin stuff was very very basic things that could save him right. His legs weren't the same size now they would know. Oh, just wear these sneakers. It'll even out you know then your body won't be off kilter and things like that. It's weird. We were thinking this way in a. Two thousand six, but we weren't one other note. We should talk about Rondo. Goes Twenty One and Larry Goes Twenty Four. I didn't like when the Celtics traded for Rondo. Here's what I wrote. The list of NBA teams that won a title with a point guard couldn't shoot looks like this, and then the list was just all empty. But then I added on the other hand by Celtics Balls told me that Rondo absolutely destroyed. Randy Foreign Marcus Williams and their work out a few weeks ago. So who knows they win a title within two years later. Better draft diary performances the great reverse jinx. There is an argument to be made. And I'm sure we can make it if we were GONNA do not okay the career that the skies, but if we were going to say the best version of these players, how would you redraft them? I I think national TV Rondo is in the conversation for the number pick. Wow, while. Tell you this what we'll I want WANNA. Save some the Rondo stuff for when we get them but I'll tell you this. His rookie year, which was a train wreck and they're tanking for Tim Duncan basically. Two months in. and. Rondo was clearly head. And it was almost like. Inexplicable that they weren't playing him. More and I. do think they sacrifice some of his rookie year because it was like when he was on the court, good things would actually happen, and you know he just you could. You could just see something. It was not surprising to me when they do the K. G. Trade. They'd eat they bay. It was the one piece they would put in because Minnesota's I give us Jefferson give us Rondo and the you're not getting. Rondo, we actually think we can win. The title of fees in our seven rotation, so that happened some comedy from this draught. Here's what I wrote on the Thomas Pick. In the draft diary I love that pick for them. Not, just because he's a freakish athlete with the seven foot wingspan, you can go to war with titus. Warren was. Talking What were what were was that star wars the at the Falcons at the Balkan. Island fucking was the Falkland. Crisis. A. Another one was They had a whole debate about root against potential because rudy gay start sliding, which was actually dumb. I mean really gay was talented. We're all frustrated with him Yukon. There's a whole rap that he knew that he didn't care enough. Greg Anthony argued. That gay will be better than people think Stephen. A. Is on this draft and it was clear he had watch basketball. Stephen countered I. Haven't seen him play that much. And that was the argument Stephen is one of the people on this draft I haven't seen the that much about Rudy Guy who is a top pick Randy for everybody was excited about including I. Think us because we liked him at Villanova. At some point, they're talking about the pick. He goes seventh, and then they they. Minnesota Portland flip six and seven. And Portland Gets Brandon Ray dickey comes in is somehow involved the strap to and he comes in, he goes. He's way Wade Baby. After. Had, just won the two thousand six title. Like he's do eight way, so that was rough. Tough one Stu Scott was doing the interviews. He interviewed Patrico Bryant who at nights and he said. This I started the interview before the Ncaa Tournament nobody knew who you were. What's the best thing about your Game Bryant that people don't know scalded Bryant. That was a rough moment Member Sire Senate yes. Seven eight wingspan. Seattle jumped on at number ten. And there's a story that I had in the draft EIR. That research is true that they had taught him how to make a layup off his correct foot twelve months before and then house he'd played in a Belgian Professional League, the season for the draft, the average three points a game. Were there red flags in your opinion here? I mean the amazing thing. Is that after that kind of a resume and with that kind of of background? That some. Number of years later Yizheng. Lane got drafted. Yeah Later. He was the he was the first. Senate was was. Hey the way to pave the way. At a chairman. There's a good what if air because Seattle rettig still on the board at that point. If Seattle Takes Rettig, they had ray Allen. And then durant's coming in. Oh seven. They could have just they coulda had just all three of those guys on the same team had like the first ridiculous three point two. Orders genetic make them good enough to that. They missed her aunt. Oh good point. Well I'll tell you who did make them good enough. Sarah Today So then we were already for the next to take Marcus Williams. Controversial! Pick Point Guard I had a joke in the draft. Our I'm so proud of fourteen years later. He's leading all NBA rookies instills right now good. Thank you a be here. Hero Week, Dan Patrick. Was the narrator the straffed in had like a kind of some tension with stern and at one point. Utah was on the clock. They made the pick stern didn't come out, and Patrick was doing where where'd he go jokes? Stern emerged and say Dan I was sitting in the back, listening to your pithy comments. He's the word Pithy to Dan Patrick. Ever do another draft now. and then there's the iconic moment of this draft. And when it really went to another level was The Knicks Round the clock twenty. Marcus Williams is on the board and again people thought Marcus Williams was like a top ten pick before the laptop stealing thing rondos on the board. The Knicks don't have a point guard they have. It's like they're in that Steve Francis. Marbury, just like I. It's just headed off a cliff in. Why not take a point guard? And they take Rinaldo Bachman. And I don't know as the years pass. If the humor has stayed in place the way it did in the moment, but This was at a time of Isaiah's GM rain. where the sex stuff was already going on, he'd he'd made a whole bunch of terrible trades, and we had now reached a point where it's like anything was possible with the Knicks draft pick and when they took Bachman, it actually delivered. It was as good F- from A. Port as we ever would have wanted, and then they cut for some reason. Stern said Rinaldo is not here. The crowd booing. Crowds. Go crazy and Dan. Patrick Os and it's probably a good thing. And then they cut right to spike. Lee Who's just like looks like he just lost his dog. And, that was the New York. Knicks in two thousand six. That was great That's really about it other than Marcus Williams said they had fourteen percent body fat down for Barca Slams, which should have been read by I. Think Houses Wing Right now. That's how sound like after after a trip to mobile google. He's at forty percent forty percent fats high. Yeah, anyway, all right. Let's do the redraft. So. I had a from a crapshoot rating I had this draft as nine and a half out of ten. It's just an incredible redraft firmware where guys were taken. Who wants the first? Let's give the first pick. Because this was the The final Chauncey billips blocked blog spot draft I pick. I GONNA, probably go a little bit controversial, and I'm gonNA allow. Wow, yeah like A. Controversial thing. First of all loved him on that foregard Nova Team with Mike Nardi Allan Ray Randy Foy I that that that was like a real precursor to offenses to come I think he's got a ring. I think he has really been an example of what you can do in the second half half of your career if you change your body a little bit. I you know and you could make the argument that his a lot of success is due to fly, but I thought he's had. I overall feel like he has had a more memorable and impressive career then lamarcus. Well, here's the irony of that. Pick the Toronto had the first pick in the real draft. Yeah! And I should have done that sums up. Sorry listeners. Here's how the actual draft went Toronto bargaining. Chicago took Aldridge traded to Portland. Morrison Third Portland's pick for trades to Chicago Thomas Atlanta, fifth showed Williams Minnesota six Brandon Roy flips on the Portland for number seven Randy, Foye he houston eight Rudy Gay. Gold State Nine Patrick. O'Brien SEATTLE TAKES UNAI Orlando Eleven with Rettig, and then it gets goofy after that so. You have Toronto. Ending up with collar anyway, how do you think of that pick well? The the problem is it took kyle a little while to get going like he didn't start every game until two thousand fourteen, he didn't make an all star team until two thousand fifteen, and this is, we're talking about the two thousand six draft, so you need to be a team that has eight or nine years worth of patients. The payoff now he's. He's really validated that that selection over the last five years I mean you know incredible it has. Got To trust the process. What a process Chris Right. So, yeah, I I couldn't do kyle at that spot. So. This is the same year. It takes over the rockets which you probably should've mentioned the top. He's running the draft for the first time ends up making the controversial Rudy Gay for shame, bad aid trade, which eventually became a giant, Michael Lewis feature and is really like. The first moneyball moment for the NBA where somebody's. Break. Down Shame Batty as all his glue Guy Stats. And decides stats more valuable for the team we have. Then Rudy gays potential, and it's the. It's honestly the first trade like that of the thing I knew. Darryl and we've talked about it. On the on these pods going back when he was at the Celtics, took the Houston job. Talk to him a lot during this time. And I remember, he asked me for advice. When he took the job and my advice was this. find the DUMBEST GM's possible. CALL THE TIME There's a lot of them. And that would be the easiest way to improve your team. So he trades he trades a four Kyle Larry in February, two, thousand, nine Kyle Larry was somebody we all liked. He was buried on that Memphis team. He what he they had had Mike Conley Mike. Conley was a top five. Pick a year later for them. and. It was my Conley's team and Larry's just trying to fit in. And he gets Kyle Larry He. Gives up. Rafer Alston Tour Landau. MID-FIFTIES ENDS UP TRADE COLLAR IN MEMPHIS IT looks like they got a Donna foil Mike wilks and a two thousand nine one pick to Memphis and he gets Larry now I remember talking to Dow after you motherfucker you figure. You traded with Chris Wallace smart move where to go, but he steals Skylab houses rate awhile. Yeah, you know. We did the two thousand five draft we would talk about. How do Williams has basically two careers where he's like. kind of like Jamal Crawford with less pr for the first nine years of his career, and then as the league champion. He becomes this weapon. This free throw three point weapon and Larry is another good example of. You know I if you look at I had him second in the redraft just record, but you look at him from two thousand, Fourteen, the two thousand twenty, so it's basically year nine of his career on. He's eighteen seven and five. Is Thirty eight percent from three and a good defensive player to It's defensible six. All Star teams made a third team. All MBA, but most important is a good example of somebody who wins the title in his whole career. Trajectory is just going to be looked at differently forever. He's. Don't win that title. You don't take with the first pick. No, although I think because he went to cardinal dougherty. High School in Philip. Yeah you have your phillies stuff He wins the title, and it basically takes all the baggage away. Whatever baggage we had cholera, it's. An incredible title he was awesome. In that final game. Put his ball at that will series. You put his balls on the table, but especially that last game. He really want my respect. House. lamarcus Aldridge is landed in your lap at the number two pick. Yeah I'M GONNA? Take them I mean a steady contributor performs at a high level throughout his career. Nice number of All Star appearances couple all NBA teams. You know kind of a throwback player. He he might have been better in the like the first part of the nineties his face up ability. And the pace of play back then put look. He's still playing here. You know fourteen years on and making contributions. He's still wanted to San Antonio's best three players, so you know I don I feel pretty good about taking marcus at this spot. It's funny. At the time. We were lukewarm on him in this draft. Because we there'd been this history of these six eleven. Guys weren't quite centers. there were still some Charles Smith residue the next the next guy. Just, a really soft eighteen and seven, but you couldn't count on him when it mattered, and we just had such bad history with these guys I wasn't a huge fan I I'd never was impressed by in Texas, but he's a good example like Russillo was talking about in two thousand two thousand five draft. Some guys fill out in good ways and bad ways right like we're about the two thousand five thing about how Marvin Williams. Was this really athletic? Lanky 6-foot-9 freshman at UNC, but then he filled out, and he just had this really heavy lower body and it. It kinda changed, so he was aldridge filled out in good ways like he really became a. Kind of a modern low post guy you know is never like a getting. The block from ten to twelve feet was really good. One of my favorite games is to just go through a college teams and just play a little bit of a what if what if this guide state ear and we did miss a pretty incredible Texas longhorns team with lamarcus. 'cause that was Katie comes a year later. And if if everything breaks rate, you might have a Texas longhorns team. I'll be at one coach. Rick Barnes that has Katie PJ. Tucker Gibson and lamarcus and yeah. So he's nineteen and a half and eight rebounds a game for his career. To second on Bay three, Thirteen Mambi A, he's only one four playoff series ever only one in Portland. two thousand fourteen playoffs with a year before his agency was really his breakout and I. Remember doing countdown that Year Austin segments about? Is lamarcus Aldridge one of the best part in the League now. In the playoffs, he was twenty six and eleven. In this is to playoff series. They beat Houston. And then they lost to San Antonio and six SANTONA winning the title that was when Dame was really coming onto, dame finished the Houston series with the buzzer beater. And then a year later, he left to go to San Antonio and there was all kinds of stuff about he didn't like. That Portland was becoming Dame's team. All that stuff. was like billboards right. They replacing him with dame on the billboards, and apparently he really wanted to go the Lakers and they fucked it up and he ends up. He ends up in San Antonio. When he goes to San. Antonio we don't know that is going to become Hawaii. You think like. The had a couple decent teams, but that two thousand seventeen spurs team that was ready to go toe to toe with the warriors that that year was probably his best chance to I. Don't know if they would have beaten that worst him amount they would, but that would have been a slugfest that series coadjutor the first game we never know I'm GonNa. Give you the best forwards of two thousand of the two thousand ten's. You tell me where lamarcus ranks. Lebron durant coli. Is that better than any of those three? Here here, the candidates for the fourth spot Blake Griffin Paul George Carmelo Anthony in. Anthony Davis Kevin Love lamarcus. Who you have in the fourth spot. Davis Yeah me, too. It's not it's a no brainer to me. It's Anthony Davis Agree I would have blake in the fifth spot I agree with Blake Blake in two thousand fifteen. Was the third best guy in the league. so now it's Paul George Carmelo. Cabin Lover Lamarcus for the sixth spot. I think George me, too. I'm with Chris Ryan Paul George. Just because of the defensive offering that he represents. So now it's Kevin Love. WHO's really really peaks there for a couple of years and then moves into something else. Carmelo who peaks the first three four years of the decade, then tails off. And then Aldridge, who's been pretty steady the whole way I would give the edge to aldridge out of those guys. So I would say he's. The seventh best forward of the decade. It's pretty good, not bad not bad for draft. Pick all right. I'm on the clock with the third pick. My scouts really took this seriously. We We looked at a lot of regime. Rondo tape. Look at JJ radic tape. Really really did some background work on on Rudy Gay. Took Paul millsap out for a nice long dinner talked to him for a while Really looked bring Roy. Thought about him. Where we landed with rage on, Rondo Yes. Here's the case. Two thousand nine to two thousand twelve playoffs sixty six games. The Celtics are a contender. Every one of those years they almost win in two thousand ten, and he's the best player in the team that you're. In those playoff games, six six game, sixteen, ten and seven. Forty six percent field goal two point one steals. Outplayed Derrick rose. Two thousand nine Derrick rose a rookie, but more importantly outplays Lebron in two thousand ten, and this is Lebron second year of back to MVP Lebron up to one in the series. And Rondo takes it over. And wins the next three, and he's the best player in that series. This is a bad thing for Lebron's goat campaign. By the way because you feel like all right. He's the goat well that one year when Roseanne Rhonda. fucking playoffs kind of hurts the case. Also thirteen and be a and I think it's important to remember. He got he got hurt. He blew out his ACL rate as he was really at its peak, and I feel like that cost him year and a half was never quite the same, so at everything up and the fact that he really national TV Rondo playoff Rondo somebody. You could really go to war with a playoff series. And I think he's the third pick house. I would have gone millsap but I understand the the case. For Rondo. I mean MILLSAP. His career was immensely helped by landing in Utah. At an established, you know a team that makes the playoffs every year with a culture and support system, you know institutional integrity is the way I like to call it, so you know millsap on a different team. Can he blossom that way I don't know, but Rondo turns out. We had this. We knew this about him from college. He's a motherfucker and you. You. Know what that's a valuable thing. It turns out. He is the diametric opposite of Adam Morrison in terms of his competitiveness and his basketball. Now I don't WanNa, say basketball IQ, but like his psychological competitiveness his ability to jump in, and you know just basically say f all y'all I'm going to do my thing, and now that translates into him, not being able to coexist in a lot of different. Circumstances, you know. The The Dallas situation will be a go down as an all time abortion, but you know. Raise it Ray John. Resume is strong and. The you backed off the basketball Iq, but I. There are a few smarter players that I've seen on a basketball court like, would you? If you get a chance to ever sit close to a court while Rondos playing, you can hear him calling out sets. You can hear him calling out opposition defensive sets. He will be playing D. and just be like. This is the play they're running. It's UNCANNY. It's too bad because you know. He has the ACO thing ends up with that weird dowse. Situation goes to Sacramento that sucked. It's at Chicago that was awful. And then I kinda gets rejuvenated for that one really fun New Orleans year. With Davis where it Kinda unlocked them again and I. do think he's a great example of. Had to be on the right kind of team with the right kind of players had very high expectations for sees openly a deck if he wasn't happy with where he was, and the other thing is, the League started a shift against them a little bit. You know and and his inability to shoot, which he got a little bit better at you know. Starting in two thousand fifteen. He's at least like over thirty three percent as a three point shooter are wide open, so he wasn't like a catastrophe. But you know is a guy that really would have made more sense in the eighties and nineties I feel lick. You know and. The game was just played much closer to the basket and the stuff that he was doing. Just the League Kinda changed on him. He was also the other thing that that happened. That was really too bad. He was just a bad free. Throw shooter. And never got better at it. I don't know whether it was because his hands are too big or what, but if you look at you know in two thousand and two thousand ten. He's at least averaging three and a half. Free throws a game, not great, but at least he's trying to get the line that dips to the point that by the time he, it's the second half of his career. He's basically not going the free. Throw line at all I mean he is in. In Dallas, he shot zero point nine three game. He's he's doing everything. He cannot have contact and I. Think the book was out on him by the second half of his career that when he drove to the basket is dishing. Yeah, he's not going to try to bounce off guys. He's not going to try to finish because he wanted to get fouled and I think to me. He's one of the top five guys. I can remember Nick Anderson's one Antoine Walker is a good one. guys who just didn't want to get filed in change. How they played house was the opposite. House. Love the concept of recontact. He loved it. Was the easy way to pad the stats. He wasn't afraid especially intramurals. He wasn't afraid to lurch into. Guys like I wanted to go to line. Rhino is the opposite so I I I actually I wear. They feel like this wasn't the best version of his career. I think there's a different version. That's just better than what we ended up with, but it was still really got. Yeah, he's obviously a coach Guy. He's obviously a guy who really mattered who who wound up being the coach and it. It wasn't necessarily always the better coach. Carlisle's obviously one of the best coaches we've had an NBA, longtime and those guys couldn't be near each other, so yeah, you know the sort of environmental stuff with with Rondo. It's like crafts. You have no idea who he would have thrived under well. The the observation I WANNA make makers. There could still be another. Maybe it's not a full length chapter, but half chapter for Rondo in these playoffs coming up that we're GONNA have in the two thousand twenty season. He's healthy now, and that Lakers situation is absolutely perfect for him to flourish for him to make an impact and Chris. You've said a couple of times. It's prime time. Rondo tied like he's going to. He might be play a really meaningful role in in how the Lakers end up in this twenty twenty playoffs. A can't be better than Lebron, so that's good. I've been saying for years. That national TV quarantine. Rondo was the most dangerous player in the NBA so to be interesting to see how that plays out the. If Rondo had gone third in this draft that means Charlotte would have taken a. Which means Michael. Jordan regime Rondo would have been in each other's lives. So you could tell me that they actually would have fought to the death over a connected four-game, or you could tell me that it would have been the greatest thing that ever happened to both of the. Where Jordan I. This is my soul mate. This guy hates his teammates as much as I did his super competitive. and. Rondo just sort of been like nineteen time all star in Charlotte and we would think of Jordan as this great owner, maybe like Charlotte could be like an Italian soccer team. We're. Getting the coach fired every three months right and they're like scar on their. Coach of the year this guy who used to work in an Arby's. Coaches Aa you, but Rondo seems like. Those. Oppressed by connect four tournament online all right, Chris. You have the fourth pick in the draft. This was the pick that was technically Portland and then they traded up. Who Do you have? Yeah, I'M GONNA. Go Mill here even though I'm bored, even saying the two words Paul Millsap. It's funny I had him six in my redraft. But I think it was at a pure boredom, solid guy, seventeen and eight from two thousand eleven to two thousand, seventeen, four, all star teams I think that was partially had to do with the forwards were just loaded in the west and pretty pretty weak in the east for the most part. for forty seventh pack. Really couldn't have turned out better and I can't think of anything else to say yeah. I mean a cool kind of a bridge player like as a member of that bud hawks team, and the the move into pace and space, and move into into the sorted drunk on threes NBA, but I feel bad that I just can't muster a lot of life poetry about Paul Millsap. House here on the clock at five. I'm GONNA, take, Brandon Roy here. I think that five years of Brandon Roy. Is the functional equivalent of the longer careers of some of the guys that came after him I mean. This this five spot, the eligible candidates are like Jj, which is you know totally legit who who are rudy gay. You know PJ. Tucker I guess I'll just take Brandon Roy right here. He made. He won rookie of the year, and he missed twenty five games that year. He was an all star by his second season. He made to all NBA teams in his five years. So you're basically you know evaluating with all of the information we have now. What can I get in this five year window that I have of Brandon Roy. Is it. Is it enough with other pieces that I have around me? And that stage this was in Atlanta. Pick right am I right? The fifth pick overall was Atlanta yet, so they had Josh Smith and Joe Johnson at that point like. A dynamic scoring team in the east at that moment i. just you know, go ahead and take a swing is is my view with this draft pod listeners can tell this Joe House just set all of that with a picture of John. Wall behind him. So you know he knows what he's talking about what he's discussing. Leg Injuries, yeah! Brain Arrests First Four Years Twenty. Five and five forty seven percent field goal thirty five percent, three eighty percent for free throw. for He baited on be a second team. which is really impressive? That means I am one of the ten best players in the League during an era. Where were really good guards? You know so. You have Kobe in the League at that point Chris Paul Dare Williams Tracy, McGrady etc, etc, he made a, he made a third Mambi mid three all star teams. and. You know this is. This is You know little out there, but e in the nine playoffs. He plays a six game series against Houston and they lose. He averages twenty seven a game in that series, your averaging twenty seven a game in a playoff series, your legit and You Know I. The Portland's just taken so many hits over the years you think about like. Greg Oden Simba, we they walked into. Bill Walton. Brandon Roy the the talented guys that just it's almost like the Bermuda, triangle and a lot of ways. What was a real bummer about this was what a great guy he was. and. You know I I hate sometimes on the talking heads talk about like great guys, character guys, but this was like a model citizen, awesome guy who kept having bad luck and his basketball career, but really handled it with real dignity, and when he had that moment in the playoffs. Was it two thousand eleven when he's hurt? Yeah, when What series was that? WAS IT DENVER? Yeah I think it was Denver 'cause I. Remember it being kind of a an inter division. Playoff series and he has always I'm sorry was Dallas Oh the two thousand eleven Dallas series. And it's a really weirdly pivotal moment with that Dallas team dowse goes to win on that win the title that year. But their favorite in this Portland Series Brandon Roy on really his last legs at that point. And Portland. Wins two in a row at home to tie to tie the series. And in one of those Games Bryan Roy has twenty four. And in the crowd is just. Out, of their mind. Out of their mind, because he has this throwback awesome out tools Dirk Nowitzki. We come out of that game for its to to everybody's like fucking Dirk. What a choker! Typical! FUCKING! Dallas fuck this team skies, cowards and then they win the next two, and then they go on to win title, and it was really like the last time Dallas got sucker punch like that by somebody, but that's one of my favorite random games from this decade that. Brandon Roy throwback awesome gain. The crowd loved him. So anyway, I want us for it I. Just WanNa make one observation I. I wanted to make sure i. give credit where it was do. You gotTA hookup. Portland forgetting arguably the two best players in in this draft, and they were a fifty loss team coming into this draft in two years later were fifty four win team and I think it. Some Common Kevin Pritchard was heavily involved and. Steve, Tom Ten to took over from John. Nash, but you know that in a draft that we started off this podcast talking about how weird it wasn't the first place how talent lists it was and how all over the map? That talent was for Portland to go get the two best players show. Shout out to the trailblazers, yeah, well, and as we covered in the Oh five draft, they completely shut the bed Oh five because they had the third pick with Chris, Paul and Darren Williams on the board and traded down three spots for Marta Webster Lioness cleese. And Future Number one that became Joel Freeland. So that was like this is like a jekyll and Hyde thing with the new administration although I know house was high Joel Freeland. The. Joel Freeland was high also. The six pack on clock. I'm GonNa take our, Guy Jj. So? First of all average thirteen game for his career. a forty one percent career three point shooter. And somebody who? As the League evolved over the course of the decade. It evolved in great ways for him. In he adds up. Is a forty one point six. Three point shooter. Is Somebody that if it's a good team? He's a huge asset. And for basketball fans really frustrating. First few years in Orlando for him. where it just didn't feel like he was playing enough, and it didn't really make a lot of sense, and we cover this in a previous Book Basketball Pie with two thousand nine finals just so weird that they didn't space the floor with him. More doc rivers was the first one that really got it. WHO's like if we get this guy I'm basically getting what had with Rayon and Boston? This guy who's just constantly running around screens. Screens who is creating space for Blake Griffin and he just figured it out and JJ's ban and asset ever since, but I think one great thing with him is just the the longevity of just he still going I, mean yeah. He probably played for another six seven years. So you get jj house took four and a half years of Brandon Roy I. Totally get it. I'm getting like twenty one years of Jj. Redick plus an incredible podcast. Again all his multimedia. When draft James Smart enough to also get all his media stuff, so it's a win all the way around I think you're right. We haven't even gotten to the late period Kyle Korver of JJ's career yet like Jj. Weaving his way through four screens percent like we haven't gotten to the all trail and just just drilled us. Open three after somebody gets penetration you. Oh, yeah, he's GonNa. Rear Eleven minutes a game and just scored nine points. That might push you over the top. Yeah? That's A. It's an awesome point. He's still fast. That's that's I. Think the point you're making Chris and and in view of He's also an avowed foodie. Loves loves to eat another very relatable thing about him like eat it. All the best places has had many great people on this podcast I admire that engine that running engine. That, he has to feed with good fuel great job JJ. Tell you this. He's a top three NBA. Player going nuts during the quarantine because he's been knocked out of his routine. This is he's just somebody who's whole. Day was structured and goes to the gym, and and not being able to just do do normal stuff, though those shooters are different breed. where it's just like at three thirty. I will shoot seven hundred ninety three's. In these seven spot, and then I'll be done at five I'll see then like you. Just of have to beware that way wow Chris. I'll be interested to see what you do here at the seventh pick. You think I'm GONNA. Get funky is one obvious pick. There's a couple of sleepers Who Do you have Josh Boone No? No I'M GONNA. Go Rudy. Rudy is an interesting person to pair with Jj. Both coming out of a relatively St- I mean Jj. Obviously. A more storied college curb at Rudy was Great Yukon. And he comes into the League and I. Feel like immediately. We're pretty soon after he gets into. League becomes a poster child for an outmoded silent basketball and. kind of never really finds the place that really took advantage of his skills i. don't think he was ever going to have that McGrady gear, but it was clearly a score built in that mold, and just wasn't good enough to deserve all those touches and had a game that was really eighteen feet in at a time when the game kept moving out and out out. From Oh, eight, two, thousand, seventeen I basically ten years of his career. Thrown out his rookie, nineteen and six. Thirty four percent from three, no all stars. No all NBA teams. And? I think you made the key point. He's involved in two trades. That really frame the last fifteen years of the league. The first one is the actual draft day. Trade were Darrell trades the reds to Rudy Gay Shame Batty, a trade that nobody type betrayed. Nobody ever made there. There's really only a couple examples like in the late seventies. Philly traded George McGinnis for Bobby Jones. And the real NBA people knew how good Bobby Jones was. WHO's an incredible defensive? Forward Aba legend all that stuff, but George McGinnis was like a quote, unquote superstar, only he wasn't. When you're at really picked it apart, and you look at is like a ball stop. Our can guard anybody kind of redundant with Dr J.. And they trade for Bobby Jones and it's awesome trade. Rudy Gay on paper made a ton of sense with McGrady and yeah, right. It's like great Here's our third score. Darryl is looking at it differently like we shame Daddy, a great corner, three guy, awesome defender won't need the ball I. Don't need to get him touches and just looked at it a different way, so that was the first trade. The second one happened when I was on a countdown in two thousand thirteen. MEMPHIS JUST DUMPED THEM TO TORONTO. And basically got back. The Jose Calderon tastes on prints, contracts Ed Davis. And created some cap space. and. We went on the show. And it was the biggest argument we had. The regular season wasn't like angry, but it was we had. Magic and Wilpon on one side me on the other Jalen kind of in the middle are arguing about this trade. And they were killing Memphis for thrown away the season 'cause Memphis was a playoff team. Yeah, and a potential contender, and it was like what are they doing? Why would they do this? And at that point, we had enough advanced metrics stuff like at grant land. We were really ahead. I feel like we're really ahead of the game. Those first couple of years with the way we recover in basketball. We had Zach Lowe I. Don't remember if we had Goldsboro at this point. And there was a Lotta early data about Rudy Gay like this guy actually doesn't really help your team. It's it's actually empty. Calories They might actually be better off redistributing. The shots that he was getting other people and we argued about this on the show like really really assiduously. And I gotta say I ended up winning because Memphis made the conference finals that year partly, this was a classic. Ewing Theory Trade House. You're in all along. You never liked rudy gay dating both uconn the thing that made that trade work for Memphis with Tashaun take on basketball. I Q through the roof. I mean talk about a guy you know we, I've I've been in the same places him before walked up the next to him if he's ever weighed more than one hundred and seventy five pounds in his life, I I don't know when it when it was. But that guy is so smart and such a good chemistry guy and he was a perfect complement to that Memphis team in. Memphis got you know better. By subtraction, Getting Raya boss. Okay sorry. A ball stopper out of the mix right bottle stopper. They got more minutes for Tony Allen Tate. Sean comes in as like kind of the glue. Guy Little Batty. Ask To really smart trade. And it's funny because all the smart basketball people got it and all the old school basketball people. You can't give up. Rudy Gay man. He's got ended the game. That's who you go to guy is, and it's like actually none of the stats back that up. We had crunch time stats at that point and he was terrible. Yeah! We, we was like it was the transition from having arguments about guys with Albatross contracts to having arguments about guys with empty numbers. and. That was really hard to get over. Where you're like look man, nineteen points a game. The NBA's hard like that is not an easy thing to do especially even to average it for multiple years like that, but at the end of the day. If you think rudy gay one of your best players, your team has a hard ceiling. Well. It was also an old school way of thinking about things. Right 'cause I remember magic. Magic I thought we got a really good year out of him in a Lotta ways, but he was still had that old school thinking. Sometimes of like you get a guy like rudy gay. You can go to him in the last two minutes. And I remember being on TV being like how hard do I fight with him on this? Because all the data says this isn't true. It's actually not a guy you want to go to. In the last two minutes of a game. He doesn't. He doesn't deliver but I. Think you look at the stuff that's happening during this beginning part of the two thousand ten's. And, the data is starting to get really good and the teams that had the data. And real access to it. started to make smart decisions, and this leads to the heart and trade. This is darryl going all in and harden as a superstar, because he's looking at these numbers and be like well. What would happen if he played thirty eight minutes instead of twenty eight and what would happen if he started on the line? Mourn what HAPP- what happens if if I build the team around him, so new Rudy Gay. Just, weirdly involved in these two pivotal NBA moments that I think kind of personify when. He winds up on the team that we've historically thought of is one of the more progressive teams in the League. He's now on him in. lamarcus, are now on the spurs kind of. As these dinosaurs of an of a bygone era. So he's. He's second in this draft in points scored his scored almost sixteen thousand points. is a seventeen a game guy. He bounces around a little bit. HE GOES TORONTO THAN SACRAMENTO. Goes and gets them. He averaged twenty game in Sacramento for the first two years. He was there then then when San Antonio got him. That's what everybody is like all right? What's going on here in San? Antonio is just trying to zig. Zagging and I think that's how partly will have. They got into trouble. 'cause, it's like. Don't really maybe don't zig on this one. Yeah, maybe zag is where we should be with with the other roster, so they get in trouble house here in the clock with eight. I am going to complete the TRIFECTA here of taking guys that are still playing and confessing up a little bit of recency bias. I WANT PJ Tucker here. And it is another guy who like Chris. Pick of Kyle. lowry gotta be patient. Because PJ Tucker was out of the league with within a year of being drafted. And it took him six years. He visited places like And the Ukraine and Greece and Italy in Germany, so he had you know very well traveled a terrific travel resume. He was was signed by the sons in two thousand, twelve, the D. Antoni Small Ball era and he's made a whole career out of that, and it's a damn good career for a guy. That's six, five, two hundred and forty five pounds. That Houston plays at centre. I mean I I love the two thousand twelve to two thousand and twenty PJ, Tucker and I think in view of all the guys that are around him in this draft. I've I liked this spot for him. I remember when he started a thrive in Phoenix. Which Dantonio was gone at that point, because he went to the Knicks, but they were still kind of in that mode of. You know little little small bottles to watch like. He was one of those guys who is really good. Kind of secretly. If you had league pass, but it wasn't. It wasn't ever discussed, but he would always jump out. When you watch the Suns like man, the PJ top bad ass like that guy, yeah love to see him on a good team. He became one of those guys because he spends basically for four years in Phoenix. Now is really going on. But then when he goes to Toronto. when they traded for him at the deadline and Toronto is a real contender. At that point. It was like Oh this. That's a that's a good one. That's a mix. Say to see him on a good team. And then it finally happens with Houston. It's funny, though there's really not a basketball reference page like this because he's thirty five now. But to have the one rookie year, and then five straight plays is your Europe. And as how said Israel Ukraine back to Israel Greece Italy Germany. I it's it's honestly unprecedented for Basketball Reference Page and the league moves in his way. He moves his way in a bunch of different ways, and again it's it calms the theme of this podcast the League. Moves. Daryl's way because there's another guy to pass through Maury Bolt Ball University here. Amazing I to be one year and out as a rookie. Oh. He had some G. League stuff to house o-7 Louder. G.. League Do you remember the trade, the Toronto Trade. February deadline. Will Phoenix gotTA gotTa motherlode didn't realize Jared Salinger? A, two, thousand, seventeen or two thousand eighteen second rounder. Yanks. All Right? I'm on the clock at nine. Fuck everybody I'm taking on a bargain. I mean. He's not a bus. Andrea Byrne Donny is a bus. Thing is bullshit. It's not accurate. Accurate? No, it's not. It's not accurate. I'm going to make the case. First of all I played ten years. He averaged twenty one game on your. In Two thousand eleven his fifth year in the League, Twenty one point four a game. From. Two thousand nine. To Two thousand twelve. He's basically nineteen. Decent three point shooter every once in a while. I thought he was feisty here. There was a little Italian feisty edge to him. And I'm not really sure what happened because I remember when the Knicks when the next traded forum I remember kind of liking the trade. Being like Oh that that's cool. That's somebody you know. You could spread the floor for Carmelo stuff. Fight this. And now I think because he failed with the next. There's been this revisionist history that he wasn't a good pro. The reality, was he. He wasn't a bad pro. Even on the Knicks for two years. He's averaging thirteen and fourteen game. He's playing twenty seven twenty nine minutes a game. He wasn't a bust as my point, and if I can get them at the tenth pick. or Ninth Peck. I'm happy. This shitty draft. Yeah I think that the the funny part is. Is that like it? To hear you say that, and then you look beneath him. It's kind of like. Oh, right! Like who else are you really going to pick? Right the only thing I'll say nice about bargain Yanni is. In two, thousand twelve, we were all in Orlando for the All Star game and Andrea. was there not to play, but I will say this. He stayed in the same hotel complex as us. And his girlfriend. On believable, it was I. Try and be a decent person and not be a stair with the mouth open person I just it was a it was a long stare I didn't care I needed to consume all of it. Well he had. He had a little sutton something there for a couple of years he was Italian. He did have A. Bit of that if Andrea was a corleones son, who would he be? Sunny. Afraid of sunny mix, little sunny, a little No, he needed sunny. If he had sunny, you might have been decent player. He might have been better than you know. Tenth in this crappy draft. Well, he he also didn't live through his time in New York. I'm looking. I was just looking trade violators to make sure I never put him on a trade value. Thing I don't think I did. Don't know. I think if you average twenty one points a game as a pro. You weren't a bust I'm sorry, so it's one of my roles Chris you're on the clock with ten and we just had a drop off. Yes, IT'S A. I. I mean part of me wants to be funny here, but there's actually no punch lines like there's nothing funny about saying I'll take a I'll take booby or I'll take Steve Novak here I'm GonNa go with. probably a little unfairly regarded now at this point as One of the reasons why the thunder probably? We're not ultimately able to get over the hump, although there are other reasons, but like his inability to for lively knocked out. A jumper is is one of them. Off. Though to -fensive player, and and I think ultimately like those years in Oklahoma. He was a real use like an alpha. Defense the defender. House. The drafters dropped off your at the eleventh pack I have nothing to add to the. Conversation but nobody disagrees with it, I mean I guess you could go. Ronnie brewer there, but how's your? We're launching a new or podcast. Next month called the best fifty Swiss. NBA players of all time. And I, don't WanNa step on that, so we'll save it for that house. You're up at eleven I'll take. Jj Berea That's who I had there. Are you still in the League? Another guy, I mean this is it I'm just taking the guys you know. This point when you're choices are CJ Watson and Ronnie Brewer and Who else you know, I wouldn't have taken by Noni. Steve Novak I guess I'll I I mean berea. Played meaningful minutes has been a terrific role player for Dallas, and and actually was made a nice contribution for his little bit of time. Minnesota's well. It's clear that he has some team leader. Kind of capacity and that he's well liked that that coaches trust him and at this stage with this group. That's enough for me. I thought should have gone higher. Branches spot are yeah well. Here's the thing. In Two thousand eleven. He plays. Twenty one playoff games for a team that wins the title. Eighteen point six minutes a game. Nine points a game and famously. fucked with Lebron's head when Dallas had him guarding Lebron, and it was the all time Jedi. Mind Trick Fuck you. You're not. You're not mad enough to post this guy up. We dare you and it broke Lebron's brain for four finals games another advertisement. ledbetter are really like undermine the Lebron. Go Case You know he was. He He. He didn't hurt them. In those finals than anything had a couple of good moments, but he had a galvanizing effect on his teammates that I think we can't sleep on either. Where when he succeeded, it got the whole team fired up. Yeah, he's this Little Green Guy Yup, and if he made a big play in crunch time like the whole bench like went bonkers, but I know he's a a beloved team to and I think he's one of those guys. He's still in the League obviously, he's on Dallas. He's one of those guys that will stay a little like Donna's on. Where he'll stay in the league three years after it's over just 'cause. He's so good to have on your team. So For the eleven, th pick I think that's strong well. I'm up with the twelfth pick here. It's pretty grim. I'M GONNA go with Randy foy. In, here's my case at his peak. Was a fairly interesting coming off the bench Guy Remember on the two thousand twelve clips. He was a third guard for them eleven a game. Five threes game thirty nine percent three point shooter was a pretty good three point shooter in his at his peak. And most important careers thirty six point six three point. Most important houses dumb ASS team training the number five pick in the two thousand for him and Mike Miller, so he actually did have value. Nor, did I? Didn't he was he was? He was terrible in Washington I. Don't know if it was because he didn't want to be here. or whatever the situation was but you know he he is. You know, look up. journeymen now you play. What does he play seven hundred game seven hundred fifty regular season games? But I? I on fairly hold against him. What the franchise! The position the franchise put him in by basically trading away the opportunity to have steph curry and I'll never forgive the. Rubio are Steph curry one of those guests. Yes. So? This brings me to one. I had been saving my dad for the right moment and. My Dad was so upset. This draft when they this is from a draft IRA. When they traded the seventh pick for a package highlighted by fair. By! Dad's quote was. He's a five foot. Eleven Point Guard. You know what is going to be with more playing time. A five foot eleven point guard I saw him in that documentary by the way, not only would I not want him on my team. I wouldn't want him in my house. Fair Fair character assessment because he was multiple gun things after that, so that happened. My Dad loved Randy Foye. When Randy, foy goes the celtics spot. My Dad goes. This sucks I. Really Liked Randy for that everyone else city at the draft the sucks. My whole night's ruined might take tomorrow off from work. I'm really bummed out. I can't believe this. Quotes from my dad and then on Rondo, he said after they got Rondo. So we have two new point guards, one of them's five eleven, and the other one can't shoot and I'm supposed to be happy about this. He was enraged. It turns out he was. Yeah so The Rain Ford. People did like and Dickie when he came on. It was like this guy can be. Dwayne Wade. It was ludicrous, but it. It was said by somebody who had a basketball. Analyst Job Yeah. So anyway. Happy, together with with by pick all right Chris. You're on the clock. We've three picks left. This is going to be really brutal. We really have to do them. Yeah, we gotta get to fifteen. I. You know I'm GonNa. Go Novak. that was GONNA be mine. Yeah, I! Like the belt that's about all I mean like Ronnie. Brewer ever had anything as cool as the belt so I'm. GonNa go with Steve Novak. Really could wingman Lind Sanity. Great and couple of the celebrations was really right there. Boone Dini Brown style. He was getting his sanity on. I another one of those guys that. Probably born ten years to too soon, right? Yeah! 'cause you percent. Forty three percent from three for his career is is quite good. It's weird that the spurs never took him district say he seems like he's the kind of guys to rings if he plays for the Spurs. They did BA I'm sorry, my apologies. They did give test drive in two thousand eleven. Did. So his to Nick Seasons Jesus. There's a case he might have gone too late here. his to Nick Seasons. Nineteen game. I'm sorry. Nineteen point seven minutes a game. And he shoots forty four point five percent from three on four point, seven threes, a game for two solid years and was kind of dangerous. With a garden favorite? Good Value Chris thanks. How's your last pick number fourteen I am taking this player just because I wanna make this immensely juvenile and stupid and obvious joke and booby. That's it I'm just taken Daniel Gibson here. Three hundred ninety seven career Games sixteen wind shares You know played important moments with the cavaliers and is the name is booby, and that's all I have to say about him. Yes so. In the. Playoffs. He plays twenty minutes a game for a final steam. and. She's forty percent from three Oh eight play offs. Twenty five point eight minutes a game for that team. And shot forty five percent from three and basically. Spread. The floor couldn't do anything else. That's it great value house. For my last pick. I thought about sayers today. Maybe a couple of years working on the layup on the right foot. I guess I Thomas. You're back in love your guy. Let me look at WHO's. Going to war with bill don't, think twice. Of Jordan farmer potential. Oh I know I'm taking I'm not taking tie. Thomas fucked that guy. I'm taking Leeann Poe. Okay sure Leeann pro with the Celtics in the two thousand eight playoffs. Twelve minutes a game. Played every game. And has an iconic finals game. I think it was game to. There's one either game game. Two is the Leeann Poe game I think. When he just kinda comes in and laid the smack on the Lakers in. Does this thing the guy had like cl's? And Did his thing. You guys aren't as excited about this. I'm looking at this and I. I'm trying to see if it's wrong I believe he has the highest win share per forty eight minutes of anybody in the strength. I think I'm looking at this correctly. There is a game, too. He put his fourteen and a half minutes twenty one points thirteen free throw attempts game to get the Lakers single handedly. renounce the new ringer podcast. Feed the rewatch oppose. All Leon posed games this. Year three of the Korte the REWATCH, oppose. Play so is fifty greatest Swiss players ever. Both of those ideas could have. yeah, I think we covered everything. What a bizarre draft, so we went! In in order. Larry Aldridge Rondo millsaps Roy rettig Gay Tucker a Berea. Absurd ninety CEPHALOPODA BEREA. Foy Novak Leeann Poe if you just do those top six where they were actually picked two twenty, one, forty, seven six eleven eight, thirty five. This is a weird one lot variants. HOW SOMEHOW THE WIZARDS! We didn't make fun of them in this draft before we go. Is there some sort of wizards mistake? We could've growl they took. The mistake was at the eighteenth spot. Rondo and lowery and Paul MILLSAP. There's a bunch of PJ Tucker there's a bunch of guys still out there. That could have immediately contributed. They drafted a guy i. think he's Ukrainian. Alexi, Pesher off. WHO's best attribute the number one thing that he contributed to the franchise is being a dead ringer for. From family guy that. He looks your. Every picture of this guy is a dead ringer. First Stuey and I think that's really all I can say about him. He was seven feet tall. He lasted three years. And never played more than ten minutes a game. The Wizards didn't have a great track record with international drafting. Say, the! That's exactly right. FELLAS. I really enjoyed myself. Thanks for redraft in two thousand six NBA draft I. Just WanNa. Ask to be on a good draft some time with you. Want to be in a good one. Consider it. I. You're never going to be on a good draft. JET APP is coming up right now. He was on. This week, we did say anything. It was his request. Really Fun movie to Break Down I'm glad we did it, so wanted to remind you to check that one out, and then for the redraft ables two thousand seven, so that would be Sunday night. So get ready for that one. That is the Odin durant draft. Hold on to your seats all right here. He is Joetta. Jet Up Dowse here we. We're taping this on the same day. We just the say anything. So it's like a double header so now now I have we did the re watchable I now. You're like a little groggy. It's like you had like a couple of drinks. Later Night Ehud got only those we're going to say. You have new money coming out June. Twelve King of Staten Island What is your first movie in four years? State you directed. You train came out two thousand fifteen. On what you consider directed because I I directed three documentaries. In the middle there the one about. So right, strawberry thirty thirty. And the what about Gary, shandling another one about the eight brothers that's directing. Debate some nine nine yeah movie movie directing movies. I did a lot of crashing and love and. I didn't direct over girls, but working over there, so I was I was busy I had a one movie fall arts and It takes a while to find something. You want obsess over. It's so much work for me. I. Try to never do it unless I'm completely obsessed with the idea, you know you don't want me walking in for the page. That's not going to result in anything that is ever going to be on the re watchable. Well Dick about the ADA brothers Doc Shanley docked. That was a good example, right? If you, do you like all the way on those? And unfortunately for me, my wife and the AV brothers, as it's kind of taken over the last eighteen months. My wife partly blame you. Yes love with them, and I get it I. Get bullshit she she fucking went to Boston once and told me she was going to see her. Her friend and I gotta catch up and then all of a sudden. They're in Worcester David. Brother show and I'm like what the? That's why he went back. Why are you? Hiding things for me but yeah. They have a rabid fan base. That is super loyal. It's it's unusual in this in these times. Yeah, they're. They're fantastic. The movie's called May at last and me and my friend Mike he'll followed them around for a couple of years with no sense of what it was gonna be, and we realize wasn't a lot of conflict in their lives, and we thought well. Maybe this is a movie about good guys who are really dies and make amazing music and. It's just positive. You know usually when you make these documentaries you, you're doing the slight good and Darrell Strawberry Story. It's about dark nasty stuff, and you know people trying to kill themselves somebody, but this was. This was fun, too, because it was about creativity, brother and it's really happy movie, so it's on itunes. If you're out of content if you're cues empty. It's on the IT. Will, you had when you did. The Docking Daryl thing you had the. Unexpected wrinkle of thinking that both of their lives were pretty cleaned up, and they were in good good shape and then. One of the two was not as in good shape as maybe you thought. To? figure out how to account for that as you're filming it. And early call very. Same because it was, you know the initial idea that I had was I had never seen them together talking about their journey. Yeah, I I have ever seen an interview. They had similar journeys in terms of being very young people, having a lot of success and fame, and and great years of performing in baseball an this terrible crash. And I never saw them. Talk to each other about it. So I thought that'd be interesting. I guess partially inspired by the thirty for thirty a about Roberto. Duran yen the no last year. and. So while we're making it, we fully realized that. was still having a problem. And we didn't want to make that movie the. Unmasking him is still struggling. Who felt terrible for him. But he would not acknowledge. That it was happening. So as we are speaking to people becomes very clear that his struggle is an over. and. I called a lot of people at a lot of documentarian. Say Well, what do you do because I don't want to hurt his life, I can't lie at this point. We're pretty deep into this. And after we made the movie. You know he's had troubles. He got arrested a few months ago. I feel a little differently now, talking about it more explicitly, because now it's out. Movie I think it's handled more. Artistically, you couldn't tell what we're signalling mainly to this one scene where he's giving a speech at a restaurant, so bunch of people's clearly hired him to just tell war stories, and you could just tell by the way he is talking how he looks, and he's so skinny and this giant suit that he's having a hard time and. It's pretty remarkable. How long he struggled for! It must be so exhausting. I really have a lot of compassion for that, because I just think when you're caught in that kind of addiction and really is a nightmare that most people can't even fathom right. Oh I I hope he's. Getting. The help he needs, and then I just see Darrell Strawberry on TV all the time as A. Out of Donald Trump supporter. Somebody, confusing feelings and When you make a documentary you do need. Some break sometimes and I. That was a bad break that. 'cause it was, it was the docket. Darrow idea was one of the original thirty ideas. We'd had that idea in seven. You know it was like you make a last of like what ten the ten docks. That hasn't happened yet, and that was always to me like that has to be one of them. And you know it sucked that he wasn't in great shape when you're actually Filming it, but hopefully hope hopefully it'll get better at some point. Did you watch the Michael Jordan? I. Did you know let me say this? I had pizza last night. I I'm still here today. I still showed up. Even when my pizza was poisons. Now. Let's talk about this for a second. I loved the documentary. They did an incredible job. Let's talk about the one flaw of the documentary. You can't present the pizza story like it's just true. Because you have to raise the question. Why do you need a lie and say you have the food? Why can't you just say you had a bad pizza? Like? Why do you need an elaborate cover up for eating too many slices so I don't know what happened, I'm not even guessing. But I don't believe the pizza part of it because. He is not just embarrassing like a pizza I I don't know it seems to be more to the story and I wish there was a voice of southern going really it was a pizza. Well or it's to me. It's realistic that you order pizza from the one pizza place. That's open in Salt Lake City. At you know one of the morning on some night and that the pizza turned out to be like they use bad sausage or whatever? You know and then you got food poisoning from this crappy pizza place and fucking Utah like. That's more believable than five guys showing up with a pizza. After having stink, stink it up or whatever they did well. Let's explore this first second, yeah! When you order a pizza. First of all the. They're trying to say that. Those people know it's for Michael Jordan. When Michael Jordan Orders Pizza, he's. Play. This is Michael Jordan. Your finest pizza right like you don't tell people. It's Michael Jordan in another city, because people know that that is a dangerous thing. And if five people showed up to like Ogle at you, they delivered the pizza. That would make you a little bit nervous and bill. Let me say this I am saying this as Bacau. Author of the Film Celtic Pride Right about fans kidnapping. Before the big game. And what team did he play for? The Right. So I. Know a lot about the you know abusing Pico before. Before big games. I've thought I've thought this through. The only way I see it being conceivably possible. Is if the place had closed, but they answered the phone. This was the last place open. They're like hey, now we need a pizza and their leg now. Man We're. We're closed. Sorry, like Hey, no, we really need that pizza. It's it's for Michael Jordan. To try to see if they would reopen the pizza place that has never happened. Ever you know what happens. I say only conceivable explanation other. Why why else would he ever say his name to a pizza place? That's insane you do it happens. You're Michael Jordan. which that's like saying led Zeppelin. Or whoever right? Yeah, and you call the front desk in I know room services closed. By these are anyway, you guys can make me a roast chicken and they go. I'M GONNA go get free right now. Sir, I mean you wouldn't have to go to the local place. Somebody would figure out how to do it. That's the whole in the story. The Marriott where they're staying at is just unwilling to serve. Jordan his staying sweet with a piano, but kick ass Eddie food. She's played. But you think of it is true. That the reason why he would say you had the flu is because the idea. Having food poisoning is embarrassing. Yes Like it shows the weakness of some kind, and also by the way you've all had food poisoning. Does it affect you that far the next day? They. Say flu like symptoms. Flu. Whatever that means. Nobody on the team ever like snitched on the pizza story now not yet it'll happen. It's some point. Can we talk about How old are your daughters now? Twenty, two and seven. Are they both home quarantining with you. They are all of us here together on a roller coaster of emotions. So this is kind of secretly a win for you because there. There was no scenario where you were going to be with your daughters again this much at the age. They're at right like like. What other scenario would have put them under your roof with nowhere to go, and they're just stuck with you. Know other scenario where they would wanNA talk to me for more than five minutes range. Let's sit down and play board games with me for three. Now. And I think that is part of this. Know people are beginning to talk about I. Heard Jerry Seinfeld talking about this this morning on the radio. You develop a more intimate relationship with your family and your kids because you have a Lotta time to fill, and you know we at seventeen twenty to your your kids. Rightfully are looking to leave the house. They're not looking for marathon, mom and dad. Now so you have these moments where you're like. Well, this wouldn't have happened. This dinner wouldn't have happened US cooking together for two and a half hours. WHO HAVE HAPPENS US? Watching? The whaling on itunes wouldn't have happened. Whatever movie you're watching. I was talking to a friend and we said this is all like. ICING. Moments. Right well, your older daughter I mean she's been acting now for. Many years now at least five right. Like. She was in knocked up. We shot that in two thousand six, but when is go, but now she's like a real. This is what she does now. Yeah I mean Maude is on euphoria. Also is in the TV show. Hollywood on Netflix and she plays Davidson sister yet in the chain of Staten, island, which was really fun because I hadn't directed her. It was two thousand and eleven last time I directed her in this is forty and shed those great scenes where she would curse out Leslie and Paul, Rudd, and and she was fantastic back then, but now she's a very skilled. Actress, so stab her play. Pete sister in an all seen. She's the person who calls Pete on all his bullshit and is very aggressive with him, so they're really funny electric. Scenes. With what is the dynamic? I. I can't imagine because my daughter is just always gonna Iro may if I screw up in a great daughter, but you know if I if I say something that she takes personally like I. Just, Kinda know your own kid in a way that nobody else would understand if they're all in the room with you. So how do you navigate that? From directing standpoint ammos interested in how you do that? The sensitivity of their feelings. Yeah, well especially with you where it's just you, you have the lighter. And they're covered in gasoline at all times when it's like daughter, right? We'll just different than if you were just a normal director well on one level. You're allowed to tell them what to do. Which you know at twenty two to that listening much at this point, though tell us. On a set I do have the ability to force her to do things like ghastly. Pick her clothes everything that you would never allow. Pick your hair. Cut Right now. and. Sometimes! You have a short hand. You know we're like she'll say. How was that and I can call like not good and all? Do it better and then i. just walk away like sometimes comedic. However, you'll try new things. I mean her instincts are so good. There was a scene where we first meet her character and I probably made her do it. You know eight or nine times and gave her all sorts of direction and I got into editing and I watched all the takes, and the first thing before I had said one word to her was so much better than after all adjustments, because he's just so subtle and was already doing. Pretty Great, but it is definitely. Fun for like we get a kick out of doing it and she. She cares so much so. We have a blast. Impede is really fun to work with. He's very presence and alive. When he's acting. It's not like someone who's making notes in his script trying to figure out how he's GonNa do it. He's just living the. He is there. You are experiencing that moment. It's almost like you've entered a reality. It's not like. Actor boy, a WHO's. decided like here. I'll be loud in here. I'll be quite. Pitas just re very presence, and and that makes us scenes Greg why did you? I'm sure this is the question. You'RE GONNA. Get asked the most as you promote this movie. But you look at certain people. Any spot something in them. That makes you wanNA, make a movie with them. You know and I think this has happened repeatedly over the last few years. What was like the one thing you saw him? That made you thank this guy should actually. Be The lead in a movie. You know it's interesting because it. I always talk about like. Sports you. You see these rookies and you get excited about the I remember. When I was a kid, we knew darryl strawberry was coming the year before right we talked about it had strawberries Unday from Carbel? We had promotion Darrell. Strawberry is coming, and then you watched him, and you're like ours so excited. Even when he wasn't playing well like I think it's going to happen I. Think this is. Is this is the guy I had season tickets to the Lakers, Kobe Bryant started and I saw all the those first games. The Games where he was buying terribly and we would laugh like look at this guy. He doesn't care that he's missing. He's GonNa. Keep trying. It is not slowing down at all. He is gonNA figure out how to get this done, and it's been a zillion people who? Were in the same position and never figured it out. Right, they just they never got better. And that's how I look at a lot of these actors and actresses. I'm trying to spot them that early bullets, whereas Fan I'm like I think it's I. Think it's amy sure. I think that's the person who is going to be and then as opposed to just watching it. I just try to help them figure out how to tell a store or your how to execute. Who they would be as the star. Of A movies, but but it's very much like a fan who like when I was a kid I. Remember seeing Andy Coffman on Saturday night live, and then I heard he was going to be on taxi, and I was like Oh. My God incompetence on the TV series now and I would track is career the way I think people follow athletes, and that's how I felt the P I saw stand up. He was nineteen. And it was tall and lanky way funnier than I was at nineteen, darkly funny. And you could feel all the emotion in his eyes and his history and His joy and his pain, and he was instantly fascinating, and every once in a while it might happen every few years or once or twice a decade. You get a gut instinct. I think that's the one I think. That's the one who's going to break out. It's funny I. Remember doing that even dating back to like the eighties right like sick. 'CAUSE Letterman, Modo is. He especially early when he was in the eighty two to eighty five range, and he would just get all these people that Carson would never have on. And you just become attached to some of the right like it'd be like. Michael Keaton. Who In these people are happy? They had careers like Michael Keaton was a night shift, but you'd see him on Letterman your back I'm with that guy man. It's GonNa Happen. It's GonNa, happen the biggest way and hanks was like that Seinfeld was like that, and then there are a couple of other ones that. Didn't totally make it, but you. You're holding on to hope for. Way beyond the piscine pop in a movie like. There is. Attached to people yeah. But Leno wasn't someone that Johnny Carson loved and Letterman had him on all the time, but that was partially because cars and didn't want him on all the time. Richard Lewis. was somebody that you know was on the tonight show, but Lederman was the guy who loved him. Really put him on all the time. George Miller all the time I mean he used to have his? Goto dudes Leno, the Iron Evelyn a letterman thing was just that was his best guest. Bill Hicks on the tonight show now. Now so it is funny. That's an Al you could see that they've never totally figured out how to use Pete. But you could tell Lauren is super enamored with them, so they always like we'll put on update and they'll always try to work them and things because they know he knew something, but he's not your typical like sketch performer like a wolf, Farrell's something like that, but he's something. Funny is in these Home Shows Pete has really excelled Oh. Because I think you're getting a not watered down version of what he finds funny. And I think in a lot of ways. He's just beginning to show people what he can do on that show. I've watched a lot of friends. Get that job and slowly figure out how to navigate the process of how to get sketches approved on the show, and it's certainly a challenging place. And, but he man, he is so funny. I mean to be Iraq on. Really is ridiculously funny I also think he's a great actor, and when I was working with him as an actor. I thought this is really a spacey supposed to be, and he's a great leading man. He's very subtle I when people tried to. Auto is called sweaty. Personal sweaty. but not like that is his very presence and. He's not. Trying hard in the bad way, he's just real and he's very willing to be vulnerable in a way. Most people are not. You yet Bush among in this movie. And it's like. You just Kinda. He's not in the movie as much as you would normally expect from St Shabby. You kind of using him. He's just coming off the bench to shoot some threes. Rebounds Guard the other teams best guy for three minutes. And it's a really I really like him and I'm always happy. He's one of those guys right. You're always happy when he's in the movie. Oh? SHEMEIT's here. And you don't want to give it away, but he's just the whole soul of the movie. Yeah, so you I mean what he doesn't movie I don't want to give away, but it's. It's very powerful as somebody who is. Trying to be there for P.. Stephen Shammy wasn't. A fireman before his acting career took off for for about four years, and he stayed very close to that community, and when we were writing the movie whole time we're. If, we have seen the apart of this. It would be so great and also. There's not a dozen firemen and fire women in the movie and half of them were real current firefights, and so we Ito, your biggest fear is that it's not gonna be accurate, and they're going to be able to call bullshit on hunch, so he said. If we just feel this set with all the real people they will tell us. If we're making any mistakes. Who Have you worked with just about? Everybody wanted to work with at this point, or is there still an ample list of people you haven't gotten to yet? I don't think I've worked with anybody, but I was hoping to work for so work well. You've made a lot of movies though you're able to grab people. Kind of pick and choose who you want at this point, so who's left well, usually the issue is that I? I'm only made six movies, and so if there's thirty people I dreamed of working with then that's not gonNa Happen and a Lotta Times I'm I'm writing movies about by age group whatever that happens to be at the time or Younger years, so it usually doesn't line up so one of my disappointments in myself. As I? Have not sat down and cranked out the perfect movie for one of my heroes. But that's okay. I mean which here I. I mean all of them. All the great. SNL Monty Python people that I grew up with I was never I had the great idea that would include them, and I hope to have those opportunities. I definitely do the person I was able to work with, and it was a dream Albert Brooks who is in this is forty and that was everything that I hoped it would be, and you know when we were shooting. Every day. He would email me ideas for jokes for the next day. And that was the best part of my day. was the email from Albert icon? Say this here and it was always great. There's always fantastic. He was really fun. Did you ever cross? Pass a super dave. I never met Super Dave. Who couldn't be funny, but I don't think I. It seems like people are either on the cross. Pass with Albert Brookside. Are there on the I've I've crossed paths? Side, but nobody's ever has been able to do that, compare contrast. I couldn't do a compare and. CONTRAST CA Super Day was in the You know the Kimmel circles, so we got a little bit and he was like. I. It's just hard to believe they were related. It's gotta be one of the straight this. Sibling combos that we've had what about Lebron, James now that he moved to l. a. or you guys just. Just your. House on Tuesdays. How does it work? So because you know, you have this very intimate week. Where you spend all day everyday with Lebron, James. I also just find so funny. You know it's just like having Babe Ruth on your set for every day, and he's also there to act and he hasn't really done this before. He's been in commercials, but he hasn't really created a character. Version of himself instill. Character that we made up. None of it is actually Lebron James Behaves. And he's there. Working his ass off. So into it so fun to deal with. He is hilarious. You know when you watch all the scenes. None of it is because I got it out of him. He showed up. Rockin from the first rehearsal yeah. I mean we told them what we thought. The joke was which is you're basically Bruno Kirby? from when Harry met Sally some reason, the person the bill Hader talks about his relationship problems with is Lebron James Because Air France, and for reasons which there's no reason for. Your cheap. Your and the job. You couldn't care more about his relationship like you're totally their friends. That's funny, but it just made us slough that he's. He was good with that. He laughed so hard. We pitched it to them at lunch one day. When we were trying to get them to do the movie, and he just laughs his ass off, he got the joke. Instantly and it was all nothing but fun the whole time. Then we did all our press. It's things together was always great. But I went to see a game a couple of years ago when he when he came to the Lakers, and for some reason I felt very uncomfortable looking at him. Like I felt weird because my experience with him was. Telling him what to do, or guiding him somewhere in my head I thought I want to lock eyes with them because I feel like I've been a distraction. During this name now that's not true at all. There's no chance he would be distracted, but for some reason as a Jewish man, I just thought I. Don't want to bother him right now. We went through game. Not. Too Far before the pandemic. And I turned my wife, and she's just lit up like a Christmas tree smiling and waving, and I turn left and Lebron James is blowing my wife a kiss Not, me by the way right. Yeah, you. You only excited to see me at all, but he seemed very excited to see Lesley, but said he was. What how long did the decision? To actually release this movie as demand thing like what was the process of that was a quick. Was it easy? visit the only recourse like how did that work? I had a sense that it might. Be something that would be discussed. Just because people don't know when. The theaters are GONNA be in a real way because they can open up. And a lot of people may not go. These movies are gigantic investments. So. Movies have been sold to Netflix's or other streaming services, and the studios do needs to make some money. They can't just hang onto all movies and and just sit out for the year. So. When universal called me and said well let let's kick around the options for the movie and we talked about it. Very quickly, I realized. The movie's done. Like leave it on the shelf for a year and the movie is about first responders. You Know Pete's Dad in the movie is a fireman You know who who lost his life in service and his mom is a nurse in real life. Pete's mountain is a nurse and his citizens and the movie was about sudden trauma and grief and healing and. Even though it's a comedy. It is about how we get through difficult things, and it is about heroes, and it just occurred to me Oh. This was supposed to come out right now. Like it would be weird to not share this with people so I'm kind of thrilled. People are going to get to see it I mean you got to see it? I did and the I'll tell you like. I I don't mind the whole on demand movie thing just in general like I've always kind of wanted a version of this. Where we people just have nicer stuff and the TV's are better than they can accommodate the wide screen, and all that stuff and it just it never made sense to me that we had. We were forced to go to the movies. You know same thing like. I look at like what Qube did. WHERE CRIB created this? Youtube competitor whatever and they're like. You have to watch it on your phone, so it's like the one thing I felt like we've learned over the last fifteen years is like people like to choose how they're going to consume something and the more you, the more choice you give them, the more. They almost appreciated so a movie like your movie which I would have seen the theater. Now Matt Guess. My kids are older, but you know my kids were younger. Like train wreck. My daughter I, if my wife and I, we're GONNA go. That were like well. We'll leave my daughter home alone with our son, or we'll get a babysitter it just. It would have been so much easier just to to on. Demand it so I like that. Where at least testing this out and seeing what works doesn't work, because I think this move is the perfect example like people are GonNa on-demand this like a night. There's no sports. Elections, there's new any. All you have is King Staten Island I also think the movies are emotional and I think it's as funny as the other movies, but it's definitely real. And and you just want to cry alone. You don't WanNa be sitting next to somebody googlers next to you while you're crying, it's funny. We were testing the movie so before the pandemic we showed the movie to you know crowds of four hundred. That's how we realized that it's working or not. We can notes and people fill out cards and it's. It's actually very helpful, but at one of the screenings Ab- sitting the back, taking notes and the guy in front of me like. Seven minutes before the end of the movie. Where when there's this really deep emotional able seen just picks up. His Popcorn is just like tot. And he's eaten so loud and. I almost lost my. Ruin the scene for me. An Avenue, the movie and see how you think that such and work there like I don't even know what happened. I'm so angry. Accord eater. So you know, I think what I'm GonNa do is grain by brainwash myself into being vod experiences perfect for this movie, and then as soon as the theaters opened by will, I will shit on Vod and go back to the theaters. When I what are you expecting from? Staten Island from this movie. How will they feel about the movie brains fully? Will they take it personally what what is going to has to play out I think we describe Staten Island accurately. You know it's an interesting place because there's no attraction there, you know there's six flags Staten Island. There's nothing there that would make you go there. You didn't have a friend or relative or live. I remember I was talking to Christopher. Guest needs at old. There used to be a great guitar shop up by USA. Goto on Staten Island in the seventies like that's the kind of place. It is lot of people. Work there maybe commutes to the city that the people who live there most of them don't leave that often. And the people that don't live there. Don't go there unless I, you know their friends are relatives. They're so it is. It is a strange bubble, but everyone was super cool. When we shot the movie. There's a lot of. Collar people they are like. The cops and firemen and and nurses great people there. It reminded me of Long Island where I. where I grew up. I felt very at home there. Is. There's Massachusetts towns like there, too. That are just far enough away from Boston. That you probably wouldn't commute. But. You also wouldn't go from Boston to go hang out there and they just become these little bubbles that are. Really close to this much bigger city, but they don't interact and really anyway. Yeah, absolutely really funny, making fun sound, but he loves. I mean he still lives. There so it's Definitely you know near, and dear to his heart is. Pete's pizza issues over the years have been well chronicle like. How concerned were you building a movie around him when you weren't? Weren't sure what was going on with in day to day. Well. We were just talking about it very openly because he was a producer of the movie to and. Worked with all sorts of people I feel like when when you were very respectful, very transparent, and you tell people what is required of them, you know for the most part of course rise to the occasion. which is what he did I, said. You're the producer of this movie. There's a couple of hundred people who work for you. You're the boss, so you're setting the example based on how you approach this but one part. Of which is really great, so he loves being responsible. He loves it people. Thinking isn't responsible. Right I think makes him happier than showing up early every day. Hey, chat early. You didn't think I'd be early, but the early. So, he actually was really easy to work with, but part of that is. No preparing. Here's what is expected of you. Here's the job and. People are making a big investment in you, so you need to think very seriously and he did. He couldn't have worked harder and the movies so personal. That I felt like it's a real gift for him to share his life in the story in his pain and try to make a movie that hopefully is meaningful to people I mean. He did something that. I think is kind of incredible because all of us when we make movies are first movies like heavy. Beetle! Nobody makes the king of Staten Island right from the top of their career. We all make eight goofy movies before we try to. Make the more substantial one and I think he did a remarkable job especially as a writer. Did you feel like at this point in your career, you needed to make a movie. That was a little more I. Don't know heavy. It's not so much. That I wanted to make something. That was a little more substantial. I. Just I wanted to do different than I felt like. I told a certain. Story I talked about relationships and coming of age stories, and I wanted to make a movie about sacrifice, and that word just kept coming into my mind for years like sacrifice. What do you expect Judson? Never? Write about sacrifice. No people who risk their lives for other people and I wrote a couple of other screenplays. And I never felt like I understood it enough or cracked, but I knew that was the space I wanted to be in and when he'd started showing interest in coming up with a fictionalized movie that was inspired by. Parts of his life. I realized Oh, that's this, is it? This is what I've been. Airing for because a lot of the movie is about what happens after. You know a very brave. Person gives his life to help other people out. Is it affect their family? How do they process you know the grief from that? How does it affect his ability to? Look kind of job he wants. To. Get off the couch and stop smoking pot. Like how do you not just? Go into a depression and have a really tough life and. Those are pretty Those are ideas that you rarely hear about in in movies and you know it makes for a movie. That's both very funny, but. It's it's directly addressing grief. And how people climb out that. Well you're dipping into like pizza experience much like. When you made the forty Virgin Steve Corrales virginity in real life I know. was. Really That's on the re watchable schedule this summer. I love it the fifteen year anniversary coming up fifteen years a long time did did happen fast. What do you remember that movie? So give us a little back story, so I have material for the. Well the main thing I remember is I was a producer on anchorman, and I was on that new. Know watching. Everybody shoot, and they're all killers. They couldn't be funnier but Steve. Corral was just. Crushing, And McKay Would Adam McKay would feed him lines then sometimes, he would just go Gimme the other. GimMe another Gimme. Another's and corrals improvisations were just incredible. He was so funny. The whole cast who also killing. We're kind of an of what was happening with with brick. And And one day I said. Did you ever think about being the lead of a movie? And I don't think he had really thought that that was possible at that stage in his life, I think he thought he was a funny, supporting guy or a sketch player I. Don't think he was chasing that at all. And I said I. Think you'd be great as lead. Do you have any ideas and? A couple of days later he walked up to mania two ideas and One of them he said was based on a sketch. He had played around with, but never really developed about a video. Poker game, and he's telling sex stories and slowly. Everyone realizes that they're all bullshit. Lie that he pitched me was kept saying. You know lagging touch a woman's breasts. It feels like a bag sands. And you put your hand down her pants and all that baby powder. So stupid, but it made me laugh so hard and I hate to say it I totally related to it just this shame. Because it really is about shame. You know barris being embarrassed. You've never connected with someone in that way, and then you start thinking. Maybe there's something wrong with me. And even though it's a silly movie I I did understand the emotions. Behind it and then Stephen I. Talked about and said what if we? Would, we made a you know a high comedy, but really made this character credible. This is a real person. This is what he would be feeling at this stage. It's interesting with that movie and a lot of movies net decade. You now have this generation of people who are now. I don't Know Sixteen to twenty five in those become their movies the same way that. You know for us like when we were growing up, it's like the Animal House and Caddyshack, and all those things now it's that whole generation. really from I. Don't Know Three Two oh nine. It's just a murderer's rony. Look back, it's it's kind of unbelievable. And then the amount of talent that was available to be in the movies. It was like this perfect storm of filmmakers and actors and ideas and. We get older. Someone put up a grid of all of those movies on twitter the other day. and it. You know. It was wild. It was. Like everybody's movies like Oh wills movies Ben Stiller's movies all the Vince. VAUGHN movies all that Jim Carey movies, all of Sandler's movies, and it was just a grid little boxes of all of them. And some of you're just proud of everybody. Because we were all just knuckleheads hoping to be allowed to do anything yeah. You know now that we're you know slow service our in our fifties and we look back and go. We did a lot of stopping in a moment like this. When people are really having a hard time stuck at home. You really feel like. I'm glad there's something for them. is going to give him a break and. Happy. I, really feel the value of the silliness. Because I know what I'm having a rough time. I might go. Watch the. Something about Mary Right now or or the movie loved from that period. That I had nothing to do with that. I know like I'm the as two hours of my life. Looking at that, because sometimes you just thank God. We're all just such idiots. Point of all this. And Now you realize Oh really. It makes people really happy. Yeah the to kind of pandemic viewings by house, comedies and movies set on locations like. Bora Bora in Hawaii where you get to like escape somewhere. You can watch like added like forgetting. Sarah Marshall is a good one. It's in Hawaii to go to Hawaii state resort, either. You can't leave your house exactly yeah. Those great movies. He's always said. Let's go make a movie La Fund place. Yeah, he kind of invented that. I Don I invented. Can you shoot the movie on your own block and sailor was I. can you shoot the movie at a place where you wanNA spend your summer or I so July twelfth. King Staten Island. It's very good like all your movies so I don't. Do too much pimping, but I'm excited for Pete. A But, they're better. I've just say he's just as there. Some celebrities out there that you just kind of instinctively route forward. You don't really know why I've always liked I've always felt like he was one of those guys, so yeah, he's A. He's a good guy. He deserves all the accolades. Hopefully he'll get and. I'm so concerned about this pizza. Cover up story I feel like there's. A lot more to be learned about it. Maybe he should invent one. Maybe he should invent pizza. Cover up story to help promote the movie. He late Sunday wise that. You invite someone on this podcast. who was on that team like you know someone going to get? Somebody yeah, somebody didn't get a lot of playing time and just see if you could trick them into finding out the truth. Yes, I WANNA put that on my summer list. which are IPAD battery right now I'm I'm at nine. Am Okay, I got. This incredible. Nine when we started I, just thought you were going to zip away. Jack thanks for thanks for giving us all the content today. Of course. I filled I felt a lot. I feel like I sold a lot of ads. Talk to you later. All right thanks do Jalen rose thanks to Japa- Tau thanks to Chris Ryan and Joe House. We will see you again on Sunday night. You Might WanNa bone up on the two thousand seven NBA draft because. We'll be diving headfirst into it. Enjoy the weekend. Stay safe make good choices. Down the wind.

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Saving 2020 Sports, Bored Quarantine Tales and the 2000 Redraftables (The NBA Draft W.O.A.T.) With Ryen Russillo | The Bill Simmons Podcast

The Bill Simmons Podcast

2:27:45 hr | 8 months ago

Saving 2020 Sports, Bored Quarantine Tales and the 2000 Redraftables (The NBA Draft W.O.A.T.) With Ryen Russillo | The Bill Simmons Podcast

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Boyd put up Thursday night last week we have total recon enemy the stay come in this week. We're also going to be doing one. More redraft ables beyond the two thousand draft. That we're about to do with Russillo in the second half of this podcast doing two thousand one with my old friend Zach Lowe so both of those are going up on the basketball if you missed any of the ones we did last week. Ninety six ninety seven eight and nine you can find all those on the book a basketball two point zero podcast man. Four weeks ago Did Not expect that that would be the last time we had a normal Sunday night. Podcast with Priscilla. I hope everybody is staying safe. Listen at the doctor's listening to Scientists and tried to stay away from people until we can get through this hope. Your family is safe. Let's bring in our friends from pro jam. All right Saturday Ryen Russillo here. As only four weeks ago we arguing about Lebron versus Janas the MVP and we had a whole rest of the best plus late against us and now this is just becoming the new normal we had. I guess the biggest thing that happened this weekend. The President Donald Trump talked to all of the commissioners except for the tennis commissioner. Because did you know there wasn't a Tennis Commissioner Russillo? It found that out this I do now. Yeah seriously. That's good content for some of these shows should tennis have Commissioners Abe. Lot feels like it so the tennis was not represented but somehow the wwe was and trump talked all these commissioners about could we do some. How can we get sports going by September and this is something that has been a recurring theme the last couple of pods? I've done I think. People slowly coming to grips with the fact that sports by not becoming back until September. I WanNa do a sports thing like if we were appointed Co Sports Ours. But before we do that. Are you coming to grips with the fact that sports might be going away for a long time including football like we might have the rest of the two thousand twenty here with no sports? I'M GONNA make not ready for that. Okay I'm not I'm not ready for that yeah Yeah I think a lot of people you know in the beginning of anything I can't really say anything like this because we don't have anything to compare it to but in the beginning it's it's not something that I'd WanNa be right about in the prediction phase a few days in because he just you don't know and I I think a lot of people are probably realizing the magnitude and how much more serious this is and Any any projections that we had even a couple of weeks ago seem ridiculous. I mean even some of the stuff that was coming out charts and I remember reading. Oh the mass doesn't really matter and now everybody's being told you should wear a mask. Kids can't get it. Dogs can't get it and I saw something about a tire getting it so I don't know what to believe anymore but I do know that with uncertainty. Mike leads to write no but any serious. It means with more uncertainty. It means less ability to come to some conclusion on this so we did. The podcast March fifteenth. I believe is when I talked to somebody. You know different leagues sources and then a League office person that was like look. We're kind of just collectively. Shrugging her shoulders on this. And that was kind of sixty days out which would have been may fifteenth. And then we'll have the piece almost immediately that night but we're taping saying ninety days which is even further out so there's no news that we've gotten that makes us think that this thing is going to get figured out sooner than later. I guess I'm just still trying to be a sliver of an optimist here in that. Maybe if things calm down people go well wait a minute. Maybe we don't have to write off the rest of two thousand twenty because I'm not there yet. Despite the increase in magnitude. Can I ask you how they figured out that? The Tiger had corona virus like with the Tiger little sluggish was the trainer. Worried like like what's wrong with Tommy The tiger with going is he won't need is meet today and we should get him tested. And Are we really wasting Corona Test Tagger? I'm not a big fan of some of the social media when somebody goes they got tested. And it's like Oh they got tested. You know when the person's now there's some times if somebody's getting tested and you're like yeah. I can kind of understand what that person get tested. Heaven other people getting tested. I can understand if you're listening to a family member that hasn't been able to get a test or didn't get a test right away but yeah if you wanna go ahead and say must be Nice Tiger and get a test. I I would probably be okay with that one. My my son is lingering 'cause wrestlemainia starting a I told her class. I told him recipe started at seven. I think he just figured out that. I lied to because I wanted to watch it to him after we did. The Pot I I'm pessimistic for sports because the more I think about it. What scenario is there where people are going to want to be in a crowd? I brought this up the last couple pods but now I'm I'm doubling down unless there's a vaccine and everybody's like There's no vaccine for fifteen to eighteen months. Then you know. We could flatten the curve. We could do the whole thing. Less people could have it like we could ease the burden on the hospitals. All that stuff. But eventually if there's no vaccine and it's kind of lingering and then somebody get it's just gonNa keep going so I don't. I don't see a scenario where I'm in a crowd. I guess is what I'm trying to tell you okay before. He addressed the crowd part of it though. Because you are right like any part of this. There's no part of this where I read something. Like when trump says hey after he praises his own ratings and make some joke about dating models. And then it's like okay. Let's get to the pandemic though now that I've got that out of the way let's get to the pandemic. I don't care that he's like L. Football Zing Zang little. Boom you know start tackling people September for I could be sitting around a bunch of astronauts being like. What do you guys think about Mars like in two years? It doesn't mean anything brands. Nothing and it's not even being anti-trump that's just being pro reality and for him to come up with anything where I'm supposed to read some article where we sat with all the commissioners a sports and his. It's trump says football by September. I this guy one of the country ready to go by Easter because it sounded right so I just and this isn't even political. It's just simply. Why am I putting any any thought into like okay? That's going to change my mind because it shouldn't change anybody's mind because you're right. It isn't just about the crowd thing it's about the medical medical field but their capability to be able to handle any of this stuff and then the scary thing where none of us should believe any number from China. I don't WanNa hear anything from China. Nothing and I also look at this as you know some of the stuff you could read. Where if the weather starts getting colder again the starter football around that time like we could. We have this thing where it's cycles back. Like we were through it and then all of a sudden I it it kinda comes back so then what but I'll defend. I'm not deferring to you but I'm following up on what you said you can be anti crowd but don't you think that there's a lot of wins if people can find a way to get these games on television with no one watching them live. No sound in the venue. So we're taping this Sunday afternoon. My son and I watched wrestlemainia part one last night. There's no no fans I was kinda shocked how much I didn't like it and you realize now this is wrestling. This isn't like a real sport. You know real sport like it's not the NBA playoffs. You sure yeah. I'm pretty sure reasonably sure we realized with wrestling wrestling was kind of exposed. Because you realize how. Much of wrestling is entrances and fans reacting to entrance music and like here is Ryan Russillo and your music's playing you come out. You walk down the runway. You go you go into the ring you stand on the on the top one of the robes and you do your thing. Stick your chest out. What's that's removed. All you really have is people fake fighting. And the best part of part one yesterday which was also terrible was the undertaker. Has this outdoor batch that they film like a movie. So it was almost like a scene. From roadhouse he's fighting. Aj styles through multiple cameras. They're doing a couple stunts. That maybe you wouldn't be able to laugh. Thing is actually pretty good. I so wrestling was exposed. My question is if we're just watching. Mba players with no crowd noise. I just think it's going to be too weird. I don't see a scenario where I'm like. This is awesome. I CAN'T WAIT FOR GAME. Five like a probably watch it. 'cause ON BOARD WE'RE GONNA GO ROB Lee probably you're one hundred percent watching it. We're both watching all of it. I don't know I thought I'd be awesome baby and I made it in our half okay. Look I'm sorry because there was no guy with a sign that says tim an Arrow pointing down to the background that you ensure him ruin but to compare wrestling to any of this stuff just said that's real honestly think game five of the NBA finals with no one there after you become accustomed different. I'm talking about like if we're talking in round two now. What what else are you doing doing? Tell me what you think. It will be weird. But here's kind of no. I'm just GonNa be thinking the whole time. This isn't just doesn't feel right into it here. Here's what I think would happen. Though is that I. I've been a long believer in this that. If you want to change something about yourself you have to kind of make it through those twenty eight thirty days right. If you want to work out you've got to find a way over the course of a month to go three or four days a week and then after a month it kind of feels routine and if you don't do it something's missing If you want to work on a book like you have like it sucks to get started and you think everything's terrible but if you just do a little bit each day. It's the same way with studying if you read. If you're like I never read will read for like a month straight musical any of this stuff. So in the beginning it is weird. The wrestling thing is one of your first experience with fans and so it should be weird it you should enjoy it less but if we had weeks of NBA Games NFL Games. Baseball with no one there. I really think we'd accepted says new normal where no one has to argue. Is it actually better? Although I ache would wouldn't be hilarious. Billick is the NBA. Actually better fans Because of the baseline it won't be so it won't be. I'm in agreement with you but I I honestly think everything should now be pointed towards. What's the safest way to get this stuff back on? Tv because the players are going to lose money. I know already things. I'm pro owners. I'm not but they're worried about their money The television part of this different right pro owner Ryen Russillo the people that whether it's the ad revenue that ESPN has to make good back. You know like those make goods on stuff and then just the amount of things that could be connected to try to salvage some revenue stream for not just owners and players but a bunch of things around at the advertisements that are being sold all the people that will lose their jobs in sales because that stuff is not coming in. I have to think only if it's safe because the counter is now you can't do that. And how many people can be working on a truck and all these different things. I'd have to think that there's some sort of neutral location where they could get. Some of these games back on and ratings would probably do well enough. Despite the fact that people be annoyed. You know France like fans. That's what I would be working on and thinking about the entire time right now. Can I tell you what I would do? That would actually get excited to watch it. I think the party can't get around. Is How depressing would be to watch these guys playing in a completely empty Ridha. I think the move so like it's as you know if the Seltzer if the Celtics are playing the bucks an empty arena. Obviously I'd watch it. I won't be dramatic. He if they're playing each other at like equinox and it's like hey man you hear about the run yesterday the Celtics payback's really can here. He could acts like yeah. Yeah they were. They were just running. They just decided to. Plato ONE HUNDRED. So maybe the key. If we're GONNA do this you know without fans may be changed venues to like. Maybe the Lakers play at pepperdine. Pepperdine's like a thousand seats. It's just a little more intimate. Maybe even go a little less. Maybe you just play in high school gyms you know maybe pick like. I don't know some some five hundred seat high school gym and do it that way. So it's like contained and the noise will feel differently in a row just kind of feel more fun. Maybe is different uniforms. Maybe just go shirts skids. I don't I don't know I just think if it's going to be different like it should really be different. It just shouldn't be like all right here. The Lakers versa clippers in an empty staple center. This won't be weird at all like get get invented with it all right but so you're all right so I I saw an agent the other day saying you know if I'm a player do I have a right to to not have to play right. Could I point to the scare? The threat of the coronavirus. That number is going to be so minimal compared to the amount of guys that don't WanNa lose twenty five percent of the regular season paycheck and then all the playoff money on top of everything else if you think of the four hundred and fifty players in obviously it's a bigger number than that. I mean Hell and football we had over two thousand guys eligible to vote on the new. Cba what percentage do you think wants to get back to work especially in football to make sure they don't miss that paycheck so it was weird as it is and I think you're venue? Change thing is is fine. If it's safer even better solution but really the only thing you should be mattering is. We don't care how it looks. We just wanted on TV because it salvages something here. And if I'm a player what I'd be worried about. So what's your purpose to keep going with? No fans and like this kind of macgyver revenue. This is just money that's it. Yeah why I'm GonNa say the thing now on the podcast that everybody else is afraid to say openly because no owner wants to come out and say like hey. We're trying to salvage his money but if I'm a player why do I WANNA lose money? Why why do I own is that is again? And I'm going to say this probably for the last time because it should be accepted that is again if there's enough medical that can say well. This is actually doable. And this doesn't put everybody in a really dangerous situation If you were of the belief that no one should ever be talking to anybody you know and everybody should be isolated You know those I don't. I'm not going to be able to counter an argument with you. The counter would be they start doing this and like four days and it turns out. Somebody has the corona virus cause some twenty two year old. He's out the night before and he's like fuck it. My two friends came over in then. That friend had just been somewhere in all of a sudden. Somebody has it now. You have to stop the tournament again and you have a bear situation. That'd be one thing so well you're you're right. I mean everything that I'm presenting here is theoretically where the country feels better off sixty to ninety days from now that okay. What this this could be. Something big happened I don't think this thing's going to. I'm just watching the behavior of even like You know I think some neighborhoods have embraced this more than other. But if you read the news. There's a lot of parts of the country. Were there like fuck social distancing. Don't tell me what to do and it's just. I don't think this thing's going to the way it is. It's like if if you get if you have it and you in vicinity of somebody else you're gonNA give it to them and either they're a symptomatic or they're gonNA actually get it and they might carry it not even know it and give it to somebody else and I I'm really pessimistic about You Know Way with no vaccine. How does life go back to normal? I think football will be the one because nobody is greater than the NFL guys. They're going to figure this out. They're going to figure out a way to do it. And they're just GONNA do it and their attitude would be like look the we're we're plowing ahead even if this is like a twelve game season whatever but if you run that call last night me. New are the CO Czars of football. Trump goes ours is sports and trump's like hey I got all the commissioners on you guys have a plan I think the first thing in my plan would be like we got to have a drop dead day for baseball. It can't be we can't just kind of drag along and play this by air. It's gotta be like if we don't start by this date. There's GonNa be no baseball like what is this. What is the schedule for a season? Look like what is the plastic like it probably is like a seventy game season right. Maybe more teams make the playoffs if shorter series but whatever version of it. It's lasting for about three and a half months and there's got to be a drop dead date for that because you want these guys playing even if they came back. They're not be playing baseball. In mid-november Ludicrous. So my first thing would be what date to start baseball? So what is it safe July first July first spring training or starting the actual season? You know what I would. I just think spring training a little different. I mean the problem is pitchers. You'd have to trust that. I do think you know one of the things that has been better about. Sports is that because of Instagram. And because of everybody bragging about their workouts all his stuff even though because some guys just totally full of Shit and just a side note to draft prospects pushing a car on wheels. I don't know why we still think this is impressive. In Two thousand twenty. It's not that fucking to push a car on a road if it's flat and then somebody the other day was like this. Guy's doing it with the car that has brake lights. Do you guys realize that you can tap the break in the brake lights. Go on but the brakes are not engaged and we actually were like social media. Believed THAT AN OFFENSIVE. Lineman was pushing a truck where the guy had pressed the breaks all the way down all right all right that rance over so you have pitchers who have to make sure their arms are built up the right way. I think you trust that. Most of them did that. I think guys are so tuned in now to prepping their arms getting stronger they ask you just do it. You go outside and you throw a baseball and then you start doing it. Further and further the Winfield Vol- pens. And then you do you know I know. But what if what if? You're if you're on the mets and you have an apartment in New York City and you're staying at your folks house and you don't have like somebody to throw to and you can't go anywhere had he. How do you like working? Your arms is your thing I don't. I don't know that we're going to be yet. We're not going to be good Kosar's then because you don't want anything to start no. It's not that I don't want anything to start. I'd want to really try to figure out. How many weeks would it take for these guys to be ready like? I feel like they should be doing all this stuff now. Talking to all different trainers and players like hey if we just said it's go time. How many weeks would you really need figure that out? So is that seventeen days is at twenty days. Is that ten days. What is that and then the second piece would be all right. Then what's our schedule? Seventy or eighty arena doubleheader shoe seven inning games. She tried to do two games in one day to kind of move the schedule along What's are playing there. And then what's the playoff plan? How long is that? How many teams bake it or we're doing best to three. I feel like they should be talking about this stuff now and I haven't heard anything. 'cause June is now two months away less you know by but why would I say on April Fifth July first drop dead date for baseball and I don't know how anybody would say that why does NFL have to talk about week? One being in jeopardy right now we don't know. Do you honestly think you know what you could be as negative as possible. Let me let me say I'll be as negative as you are. I still why. Why would I start making decisions in the beginning of April about what's happening September first especially if I'm football knowing that I don't have any like Arena stadium Crossover issues I don't have to worry about it the way the NBA does yeah baseball and basketball and the clock. No my question is and I'm sure they're having these discussions. I would just love to know more about them. They think baseball should just start. You know like I know that sounds. Hey the pictures are going to be ready. Oh well that's on you that's on you to find a way to get his ready as you can through this whole thing like what are you supposed to do? Just sit around and not do anything right. He playing right now anyway. So you know we know there'll be guys that don't take it seriously. I think more athletes take it more seriously today and instead of trying to do. Let's do two weeks of spring training if they can even get this thing going again but for every league it's about salvaging any way to put anything on the horse thing comes out where the NBA gave me my start. Having these horse competitions up to right now go for it. Like my first thought isn't let me tear apart your horse proposition. My first thought is get is creative as you want. Putting anything on television yeah. I wasn't one hundred percent against the horse saying that. I was a huge advocate of it. I used to read calms about it and they did it in. Oh nine and two thousand ten and it just didn't work and it's so funny like what you have in your in your head for what would be fun about horse isn't how it actually plays out. When the guys are getting competitive they ended up just shooting like 20-footers or twenty eight footers or whatever. And they're not like doing the pete marriage like sitting on sitting on the floor bank shots and stuff like that they just. Don't play it that way. Saturday. How you would make it work more creative. I'm positive I don't want Dwayne Wade involved. Though that's the only thing I know for sure do I knew retired. Like J. Hang it up doing. It's it's just mean he retired times now can you? We've we've had four ceremonies for you. It's over just retire. It's fine you're like the guy at the club who's fifty who who's hanging out the twenty year olds it's done. Hey take it easy for both of us. Now it's just these guys they Y- when you're done you're done you. Should you know part of part of retiring is being graceful about it and turning it over to the young guys and now? It's their league. It's not your league anymore you retired. You know what I reminds me of his. I Avenue decent secret collection and some of it was sent to me over the years. Some of it was boredom And I went. You know what He. What are we doing here and had a pair of the off whites that were really popular in. And they were the the Jordan ones the the blue ones and I saw co-worker wearing them and I went. I'm selling those this week and that's kind of what I think of when it comes to the Horse Competition. I don't know what the NBA is GonNa do. But I have the most confidence in the brain trust and the owners and silver and people like that out of all the league's have confidence in mlb versus NBA VERSA NFL. I just just the acute power in the room to actually like come to the right decision on some of this stuff because for some reason and I don't know whether it's because I love the NBA the most but for some reason. I trust that group the most and maybe I should trust the NFL. The most because those guys are ruthless. And they'll probably figure out the most ruthless way to do this but I think the NBA will actually like put real thought into all the variables to this. You said that though. I'm glad I'm glad you said it that way because the initial reaction is why the NBA's probably the most adaptable. Like they're the most open minded of any of the League's best debatable. But if we're talking strictly who will get product on the television sets the NFL such a heavy favor in this that it the Vegas has taken it off the board well and the other piece is just tell they're to do the NBA. The players will have a relationship to the decision. I think it'd be an whole league thing where they all decide to do it. I do think you're underestimating though. Two thousand plus players that have a shorter window in the NFL going. I don't WanNa lose any of these paychecks. Where the NBA? I don't think any of these guys really. WanNa lose their paychecks you know but the the number of NFL players that will say hey even the little gray area a little uncertainty. If things are things are coming around we feel better about this. But there's still a level of danger I don't care gum riskin concussions out there like get me out there because I may have three or four years earning power. I'm talking about a lot of the marginal players and all that stuff and knowing that they've raised while the raise minimum for the new. Cba SO WE'RE CO CZARS TRUMP SAYS RYAN. What do you think would he tom? Just in general set Ryan. What do you think I'd be like? I'm surprised that you're doing anything to help the NFL. Because I thought you're still mad about not getting a franchise that's true. Yeah I thought about that. That'd be great he's like NBA go NFL. Yeah not good sad I my pitch would be like. I already said I've already done. It would just be getting things on TV. It's not just about owners. It's not just about players. It would take care of a lot of other things. If there's some kind of product can we get to a level that safe enough we feel good and if that means? A bunch of teams quarantined in one city and running multiple games You know and I think after a while we'll get used to think the weirdest hell the first time you're watching NBA game or an NFL. Game with the one in the stands. But I think after a little while you go. This is better than not having it now. I watch three old playoff games today. Hey let's talk about the return of the fx original comedy. What we do in the shadows. The Hollywood reporter called the series first season quote ridiculously funny and warned that quote. You'll die laughing well. This season shadows continues to follow our four favor. Vampires who had been living together for hundreds of years at multiple pupil my life who loved the show what we do in the shadows premieres Wednesday April fifteenth on fx Streaming Next Day fx on Hulu. And if you miss season catch up now an fx on Hulu. I'd like to give you my top five most board things. I did during coronate so far number one. I signed my wife for survivor now. I don't know if she's GonNa get picked for real. Yeah I legitimately filled that hole advocation. I took a video of her talking. About how if she was on survivor She'd probably win some challenges but not eating a lot in eating infrequently like would make pretty hostile to other people so she'd be a great great cook character but ultimately they would kick her out so I have talked about that in the video but she does didn't realize I was filling up occasion for I did everything else and then Senate so you send it in for real I really a Senate for real with with offer Info and everything is signing your wife up for sale is signing your wife up for survivor and twenty twenty the two thousand nine hundred. Peleton gift if I say I my dream to see her on that show for twenty years because she really would be good during the challenge is if the problem is you know the whole thing of just like Oh rice again I she would lose it and if somebody like fuck with the race or eight half the rice and didn't tell the other people it would she'd be like swayze. Addenda roadhouse just like out the trap so That was number one number two. I watch seasons two through five of melrose place. It was odd. You skipped one because I had already watched it a million pre quarantine. I watched it it's on CBS all access. And how do you feel about yourself now watching it? What are we talking like almost thirty years later? Twenty seven years later. Now here's the thing I like having. Tv shows on in the background. When I'm doing other things that I'm doing emails when I'm writing Google. Docs whatever I liked to have either music or some TV show that that is Kinda on. But I don't have to really monitor like The third thing I did that this ties into it. I finally watched season one of ozark which had been one of those things where I'm like some day. I'm GonNa Watch that. I'm Kinda saving it like a nice bottle of wine. There'd be some moment where I'll be like all right. It's time what better moment than a Corinthian that one. I'm watching it. I'm not doing other things that I'm melrose place. It's just Kinda odd and just things are happening and people are having car accidents. Kimberley's pulling her wig off Allison and turns out. Her father was molesting her Sydney's a call girl then she's running the running the call girl serve. It's all just kind of happening in the background for me. That's number three. Show push the limits. It really did. It really did Number four I watched a lot of the nineteen ninety-one Bruins Penguins Series on Youtube. The bees had to nothing lead huge six five win and not Unbelievable Ray Bork era and then And then in game three same you'll saying cheap shotted neely. The series flipped but it's like peak peak lemieux Its peak neely till he gets hurt. It's one of my favorite bruins teams and I was just enjoying all of it so I devoured that and then my fifth one is I was driving the other day and NBA TV show was was the NBA radio station channel. Eighty six hundred serious. They were running for whatever reason game. Three of the nineteen ninety-five finals between Orlando and Houston. They're running the radio broadcast of it at the time and I got in the car and there was like nine minutes left and I got to where I was going and there was like three minutes left and I just sat in the car and listen to the end of it because I can remember what happened and what happened. Is there up one at the end and and big shot? Rob makes the backbreaking three to win it and they go up three nothing in this series but Clyde Drexler good the answers are into it and it just felt like basketball is really excited to have it back. The crowds going nuts. They're coming INADA commercial. They're talking about. Who SHOULD FOWL? Who as a this is great? This should just be on all the time so those are those are my top five bus board things. I've done. How `bout you can. I just ask you a follow up there. Yeah other than survivor thing. How different of those four. From the things you would do don quarantine I think. Youtube deep dives have have taken out a new level of desperation. Where you're just like. Hey what happened in the one thousand nine hundred eighty two and say tournament before the Georgetown North Carolina Game? You just go in and that that and then just the Amana TV. I'm watching is just staggering. It's really honestly like Ozark by the way. Oh Yeah you're Bateman guy so that was a layup great Bateman it's Great Bateman Great Laura Linney I like ones where I like. I like shows where the husband realizes the waves cheating on him but but kind of holds it for the for the information. And it's just kind of lingering for episodes he knows but she doesn't know or in this case what episode but I just liked everything how they dealt with that then it kind of circles back later ozarks head. It's a really good Star I mean when you're starting a series and you're doing the pilot and all of a sudden the husband's watching a video of his wife having sexist with somebody else like that's That's a wake you up moment. Yeah nothing tops. Billions where you know. Gm as being urinated on. You're okay we got here here. We go okay. We're we're getting right into this. I'm twelve in Ozark. Saga eighteen left got caught up. I caught up next. Podcast for for us. Ozark continues the tradition of. It's impossible to write a likable teenage daughter right. Yeah isn't it. It's just didn't pot like no one's ever able to kind of if the teenage daughters A. B. or C. Character it they always come out unlikable although I do like Charlotte Charlotte will grow on. You know spoiler there and Jacob who is the local running the heroine farm who speaks a dialect. That's different than others. He was one of the soldiers in braveheart. Didn't really feel like fighting. And also the drug dealer trainspotting which kind of blows you away when you realize it. It's one of those shows you especially when you watch too many of them in a row which I did I Probably Watch twelve and twenty four hours where you start thinking. I could run a strip joint. This could this couldn't be that hard right. I I would have improved. I would improve the girls that were dancing like that was he. He's crediting Jason Bateman crediting. The new manager like good job upgrading. The town it's like well. That was a no brainer would have done that. Maybe would made a lot safer maybe the VIP room really laid the smack down and nobody has sex in there but You just think these alternate universe Israeli like could I have run a strip joint? I think I could have could. I have started a small casino on the river. Like I feel like I could have figured that out but you may be thinking these things. I think you'd be trust you to room strip joint that would you know? I don't think I trust house. I'm sure now hassle involved without there's there's other people who have fly. What would you call it the? Bs Review had caught the rigor. It gets just ringers spotify. Your fingers is perfect. We need to talk about it anymore. Well IN MELROSE PLACE THE BAR. That somehow jake buys with fifty thousand which APPS SO. China got the math on that but initial loan shooters. It's called shooters. We'RE GONNA head out shooters. I always thought that was good. Name but ringers. I think would be Man What happened last night. A rough night ended up at ringers. Serta three in the morning got cleaned out. I lost my credit card. Yeah I think that could work with suck. It would suck having to go to ringers to get your debit card. The next day there was there was the sketchiest weird a strip club in exit up from. Espn do you know the one? I'm talking about? Oh Yeah Yeah right so it was known and I went one time long longtime ago and some some people from work went and one of the girls that were with. It was pretty funny. 'cause she called me the next day goes. I can't believe it. You know she. She got a little wild and she was like you know I had a wild night as again. Oh no problem no problem problem. She's like is there any way? You can bring me to the place because I left my car there and my debit card and I have to go in during the day to go get it and I was like as long as I don't have to go in I'll give you a ride. Yeah Yeah there should be a phrase for that. Can you give me your top five? Most board moments you during the Corinthian. I started a book. Oh it's called the better book a basketball nice and I expect you to laugh more. Look you gave me thinks like you thought that was a dick now. It's called Letters to my younger self. Some taking the entire concept. And it's just GonNa be thirty chapters great. Can I read the forward yeah? I'm actually looking people right chapters and then I'm just GonNa Publish how you doing the Richard Deitz. You're getting other people to write a way a minute I built a squat rack. I'm close to Billingham squat rack in my living room. So I move all the furniture around There's no kids running around. Obviously no wife soon have to worry about that So we're just go for it because if this is going for a few months I I could adapt said number two. I've tried to order as much as I can. I have gone back and watch a bunch of games today. I watched game seven of the two thousand thirteen. Nba Finals Heat Spurs. I WanNa talk to you about that. Keep going I want to circle back to two thousand thirteen dollars. 'cause I also watched a lot of that other members of the media those that I'm close with. We're having these side text thread debates about. Is it really great content if you just post everybody else's videos on twitter there's a few people that have built up quite a following that way and it seems like they're universally praised as somebody who drives be creative and likes to acknowledge people's creativity? I think people that just post everybody else's videos for re tweets and follows that it's actually not that creative so that's something we'd be debating and probably wouldn't care much about if we didn't have this much free time and I don't know let's see let me see here. That's the I'm upset. It was one of those texts. We can add you to it. I just don't I don't understand what happens. You see somebody else's great video and then you just save it. And then you put your own caption. Sometimes the same caption word for word. He said and then you're psyched But again if everybody just re tweets it and you get a ton of followers. Then you're you're kind of doing what you're supposed to be doing but I just think it's lame fucking lame. I've tried to do less twitter than ever. That's good not missing a ton twitter's pretty dark red. Now it's it's about as as as bleak as it's been 'cause especially because more people have more time kind of flooding. Yeah you're right now. You're right twitter. The great thing about twitter is that it does kind of eventually. Let everybody know who you really are? If you're on it long enough I go. Oh that's what this person's deal is and sometimes it ends up telling US way more about that person that we want to realize but anyway Lasting is I've been I've been debating hobby stuff. Got a lot of stuff in the shopping. Carts haven't hit check out on any of it yet. I don't know what it's going to be. I don't know if it's instrument. I don't know what you know. Smaller Molars base over here especially since we're opening a gym so I don't. I'm not going to have a ton of rehearsal area so I I don't know so. Par-five is debating what the hobby is going to be. That's likely a purchase in something. I never look at sixty days from now so we were talking before we went on about. There should be an advanced metric. Maybe they could figure this out at the next conference. How different your life is during a quarantine based on what it was like free quarantine and if it's only twenty. Maybe if the cutoff is like forty percent if it's less than forty percent different than it was when we didn't have a quarantine it's time to reevaluate. Thanks we're like we're like I was already alone all the time and never outside and and watching the TV and the only real things that are changing for me is like that one night a week. I'm not joke with my buddies or I'm not like it's harder to grocer-shop thin by the whatever the metric of that it's time to reevaluate things medical hobbies Q. E. R. K. Q. E. R. Yeah exactly if you're a Corinthian you're like that different year. Q ers is either too high or too low. I don't know what 'cause like. Yeah I don't know I don't know what that would mean. Yeah right what is the low? Qe are good. Is it the inverse? This feels directed at me because whatever the key formula is mine's not that different. I've said it the entire time. I mean other than the gym other than that night that I get every few weeks. Now you're out. You're playing hoops. You're doing stuff you come to the office. I was thinking more my dad. 'cause my dad's like this is terrible is just home. I'm like your home anyway. Like like what's really changed. You're not going to sell the government's you don't get to go to. He so he he made the case. He's like look. We went out to dinner a lot. We went to sell two games and I really liked walking the dogs and talking to my neighbors those three things out the window. I'm like all right good case at made them word for it though. I made him sweat it out but yeah the Q. Er His Q. E. R. I feel like it's still like thirty five Steph. Definitely not fifty. I've wondered if you know the positive in this looking back and that people write books years removed from this if they'll argue that everybody needed some kind of resetting so instead of the mental fix yourself resetting and whenever you go to a bookstore you look at like the shelves you go. How many possible help the self health books can be written like? How can there be fifty new self-help books this year? Like who saying Shit that hasn't been said already. And a lot of times to giving other people advice and never being able to execute it on our own but this is all just theoretical but will people argue that this time was this massive resetting that society needed so that we come out of this different like come out of this a little more positive. A little more appreciative I think both those things will happen but I thought that after nine eleven quickly faded away within a year absolutely like it was so cool to be patriotic there for a little while and then it was kind of like all right moving on and yeah we inherently become selfish again but I wonder if there ends up being this resetting where anything is lasting and that that's kind of hard to look. It's it's nearly impossible to predict right now but it is something that. I think about a lot with this. I forget where we started on that. What was your dad? Know to follow up on that. I do think it's weirdly. Made people appreciate their friendships. Like my wife is doing these zoom calls with like six of her friends or they have a glass of wine. They shoot the shit before they used to do like. Oh we gotta get launched and then it would be like every two months. They would their schedules. The line they'd go get lunch now. It's like they're weirdly more more more communicative with one another or or just like in each other's lives because they're bored I my Dad's family. They do families zoom car. Every week doubt like all his brothers and sisters. They weren't doing that before so I do. I do think and we said this last week on the pod that it has caused people to embrace some technologies that maybe they didn't fully understand would be assets for them. You know they even like I look at the Ringer. We use to come over to the podcast with me. Now we're dude on zoom. It's basically the same thing you don't have to be here to do it Wherever to cut these videos and just kind of adapt go so I do. Think there's been a couple of positives out of that I think people appreciate toilet paper more. They definitely appreciate parral in clorox wipes which you still can't fuck it find anywhere I don't know how I got clerks ripe wipes I I got out really peril out send you a tub of those wipes you need him Burell I'm out toilet. Paper was never huge issue solo. Although I did read a fascinating piece toilet paper where it completely changed my mind was like Oh this is the psychological thing they had these psychologists talking about just this mash shopping. Shopping is different things in this other guys like. No He's like you guys are all wrong is you're not going to work. You're not using toilet paper there. You're not going to restaurants. You're not using toilet paper. They like all these different places that you would normally use toilet paper. You're now not using him. So your usage at home is jumped higher usage rate. Yeah so exactly so. It's not that people are buying it. The S are some people. Hoarding buying an uncertain. But there's a reason there's a real mathematical reason that people are buying more toilet paper because they're using far more of it at home than they ever were before because no one's leaving their house I was like. Oh yeah that should have been easier. Figure out pooh-poohed rate All right I wanNA talk about the thousand thirteen finals. And then we're going to do the two thousand draft but Let's take one break. We're all stuck inside right now. Trying to keep ourselves entertained adjust to the new normal while still needing to work out and find different ways to be healthy and stay calm no matter what twitter says when we're stressed or forced to switch up by routines and don't sleep. Well guess what our immune systems weaken and become more prone to getting sick and the best natural way to boost our immune system is through. Yeah great sleep right now. 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Dot Com enter Simmons at checkout to save fifteen percent sleep. Better recover faster. Trains smarter optimize your performance with whoop. You and I both been watching a lot of basketball. I was doing this anyway. Just for the record all the people who are like oh I watched the so and so finally games like this was just what I just like. Do this anyway The two thousand thirteen finals. I had not dove back into in a while and they had a bunch of them I think I'd be TV. I can't remember what day they were. But it's been on and then it was. There was another game those on this weekend and this staggering amount of talent in that finals which. I didn't even really full. It fully realized the time because we didn't know. Colli was gonNA turn into what what happened with Guay but look at finals. Now there might have been hall of famers there right the four San Antonio guys in the four Miami guys in crunch time in game six game seven you might have had eight of ten guys on the court as hall of famers. I don't think I fully realized that at the time I knew I remember I was doing. Tv that year. And I remember game before game. Six did a whole thing that I thought Dunkin was going to reach back and have this one awesome Great Dunkin game. 'cause they're up three two. I thought this he still has it in him. A little shack in two thousand four in game. Four against the trait. He's going to really lead the smackdown one last time and try to grab this title. Because he knows he doesn't want to game seven and I think he had like twenty five in the first half or some crazy thing like that he wore down In the second half but Colli was awesome in game seven Wade was really good in game. Seven Lebron was great. Both Games Parker was immense down the stretch in game. Sakes wasn't getting game seven. It was just so much fun to watch all those guys on the court. What stuck out with you without game. Seven two dramatic things. Lebron was really everything in that third quarter and then every possession was him dictating it and still seeing as much as we appreciate. How gifted physically. He's still is thirty five Even though thirty five it's not the normal thirty five year. Old Athlete is a guy with all of those minutes right and he still has moments with these lakers. Where you're like. I can't believe he's still doing this. But then whenever you force yourself to like junk back five years ago. Oh It's actually harder. Watch the decline in normal progression as opposed to going back and be like. Oh okay wait a minute now. I see what's different here like I remember you talking about Westbrook in that warriors series going. Oh my God like go back and look at Westbrook because I still have moments where I walked. Watch westbrook now ago. He's the best athlete. I think I've ever seen in the game and you're you just have to go back. Oh that's right that's what it's like when it looks like a guy's in his young twenties and here. Lebron was just five years ago and it still is different but every possession was him and every time something good bottled up then he would find somebody else. Baddie a start at five or five from three. He's really you know beyond Lebron's dominance in this and dictating everything that was happening offensive possessions in the Second Half Batty. You argue wins this game. After game six. The closing group was chalmers batty lot of lot of Chalmers. This finals like Like a shocking amount. Exactly it Ray. Allen Played Listen Twenty minutes even scoring game seven on the court there towards the end I'll save the Bosch part for later but Ginobili is a mess. He has three huge turnovers in the last six. And a half minutes of this game and just blowing those possessions one. The ball goes out of his hands out of bounds. Another one he just whips it out of bounds and then on the last possession after Lebron hits what's elbow jumper that's basically for an NBA title. And that's something that's always bothered me the way we look at clutch and it's hard to keep track all this stuff okay. There's tons of things that I forgot it from this game that I watched probably twice before but Lebron hitting that elbow jumper is about as his clutches. You can be without the clock expiring because that's it game seven to win an NBA title. That's the shot and it's never thought of it really isn't unless you're heat fan or like the biggest. Lebron Fan and we just have a hard time. Every giving credit to any of these things aren't in the last. Possession went to me that shots just as clutches. The shot clock expiring in some ways. Maybe even harder in a way. Because you're well. Hey there's a play that still open here and game six. So they're they're about to lose the title heading into the fourth quarter and he plays one of the best nine and ten minutes stretches of his career that he is absolutely every version of a. You know all the different pieces he had him of. Oh He's a little bit of magic out. There's a little bit of Ti Mac in there. There's a little bit of Karl Malone there. There's a little bit of Larry Bird. It's just like the full the full package for nine ten minutes and then you know. He ends up missing the first three when they're down five. Four Spurs are under the basket. The thing ricochets back so fast none of them get the rebound Wade. Tips IT OUT. Come back. Lebron makes the second three but in general him in those two games in that season I feel like that was peak. Lebron that was the twenty. Seven game winning streak. That was the the season when he was. It seemed like conceivable. He might shoot sixty percent the first two months. Remember that when it was like could Lebron shoot sixty percent for a season I decided he was at the peak of his power. One hundred thought of that and game seven you know between that game seven and then the Two Thousand Sixteen game seven game seven in Boston in two thousand sixteen. There's some other ones. It's funny how he eradicated. The whole Lebron is a choke artist thing that started for mostly silly reasons in Oh eight Oh nine and two thousand ten and then and then eleven was when it really kicked in the finals. When he kind of fell apart in the Dallas he did and from that point on was able to kind of flip the narrative. On that yeah. The criticism of Dallas is totally justified. I mean I just. I don't think you have to imagine going through life where you're handed a jersey in years like you're on the red team at nine and then you have to stand the red team for the rest of your life like that's how we handle some of these opinions where you just go. Hat's it's fair to point out that Lebron was underwhelming against Dallas in Dallas. Did a really good job concessionary against him and it went it went for it went further than that though because he he they definitely kind of broke him in some ways in that series where you know even being in the building it was like his brain couldn't totally solve what they were doing all the different ways they were they were building the wall in the middle so he couldn't drive they were fucking with him when he was on defense and just it was like their whole initiative that whole series was how do we knock. Lebron mentally out of this and make him start second guessing himself and he did and I think yeah he. I think it had been the best thing that ever happened to his career because from that finals on he's a different guy so when I look back at the game six ending and and I don't want to spend too much time on this but it just because Lebron had had that turnover that was bad at thirty nine seconds on the quite play the yeah the little later. Yeah like he he was having these plays at the end you go yod but just think like Ginobili gets fouled at twenty eight seconds. He misses that first. Free throw makes the second. They're up ninety four eighty nine. They should have been up ninety. They should have been up six with twenty eight seconds left in that game. Now I know Spurs fans look at it and say well. You know you win that when you're in the back. I don't know that I think it's much your bulls theory which you were the first one. I've ever heard anybody that wants to give Michael Eight Straight. Just because it's took US years off is giving him credit for the two that he missed but then not factoring in that you really think he's going to be able to keep his no. I don't think I I would bet against it even though I would never want to bet against him Jane anything I don't think the spurs come back and win the next year because they constantly as you know this. Their singular focus all year long talking to people that are around them. They didn't just shows the toughness of the entire organization. The makeup those guys is that they were mad. I mean they started game one. The next year mad feeling like Miami got their title and they carried it out and I thought smashed him in the finals there but man who misses that free throw in six and then he had those three turnovers and then after that. Lebron elbow jumper really to win it in game seven they ran a play remain who's GonNa go baseline and get back to Duncan. And he turned it over there too so watch it again to you like man like manages had a. I remember tough. Stretch disperse where shooting on the basket where are set was in the fourth quarter game six and seven and I think they're down to like maybe forty seconds left something like that year in the in two thousand thirteen and Dunkin had a little bunny. He had like a little five footer with a on them at a shot that he's made ten thousand times any like back rimmed that and it spun out and then Miami had the ball they had the momentum and I remember Dunkin going back and I think somebody called a time out Dunkin just like slammed the floor and was like really just so pass but he he knew like that was the moment like that game was a lot closer. I'm glad you watched it 'cause I was that game was a lot closer to a lot. More exciting than people remember ever remembers that series for the reaction shot game. Seven is a really good game. It's really well. Played those teams. You know the Spurs broke them. The next the next year you go back and look at At the fourteen finals those last three games they were up the Spurs. Were up twenty plus. I think they won by like nineteen nineteen or more each game like they killed by him that series they wipe them out. They'd send them home. And they ruined the Lebron Dynasty. That was it he left so I am a loss game. One a fourteen by fifteen. They won game two by two so they split in San Antonio then they come home to Miami and lose two straight by nineteen twenty one and then game. Five is a seventeen point loss. And what San Antonio did. I think it was kind of an early three point. Barrage preview of what? We're GONNA start seeing yet. It just felt like there are stretches. Those guys couldn't miss and when I watched the game seven. Thirteen thing like today you know. Colli was not a major part of the offense he was an afterthought and isn't wrong like he still was somebody where you're going. I don't know what he's going to be so you can't go back and be like Oh you need to get the ball more. But he had these moments going. Hey there's a lot of times or no one can do anything with the sky offensive rebounds around the glass always in the right place hitting the big three. He did back rim one. I think he had sixteen boards in game seven. But if you if you're watching what Miami was doing enough defensively they're just completely leaving them alone he's they were packing in the middle trying to double team people and whoever was defending Hawaii quads. Just five feet by himself you know and I think by the next year he could shoot threes. And you can do that anymore. But that you're you could. Yeah that's right because it was kind of this. Wait a minute Kawai this guy. Who's this really Nice player? You'd love to have him on your team. Raimi's start draining threes. Like what what's going on here. And he's still so young but the other thing that happened in In thirteen was parker was hurt and Enga- even he was always like why is he playing? I think he might have even sat out. One of those final games and then game six. He was the guy that Miami couldn't stop. That was why chalmers Had to play so much. Stay none of the other guys. We're going to Duane wasn't going to defend Parker But in game seven he sucked he sucked because he was hurt in game in two thousand fourteen. Those guys were healthy. It was different story but the Parker. The Parker injury was the secret factor. That two thousand thirteen years. This is also that thirteen stretch for for Miami where I know people have a hard time with my Bosch position. But I know he's GonNa make the hall of fame Because it's it's the basketball hall of fame and you look at the Eastern Conference finals against the Pacers. He played thirty plus minutes in that series in the Games. Four five six hundred seventy scored seven seven five nine and then in this game seven. We're talking about now. In the win against Spurs he played twenty seven twenty eight minutes. He had zero points and he did a really good job. with Duncan Duncan. Made some tough shots on it. Because it's Tim Dunkin but you could see other times. Dunkin we'll get frustrated by Bausch and the fact that Bosh could hang there defensively. All of those things are positive A and I understand what that is Bosch but zero points in a game seven of the NBA finals and no-one ever says he just has a lot of games. Rita's score at all in in big playoff spots and we can talk about weight and the broad and all those things and other shots were therefore him. I mean one six three seven one eight three thirteen zero five I I just think sometimes bosh because he was on that team in the team's success. There's just I don't know what I'm trying to say here. I guess I've just like Boston is not a superstar. He was always. He was always one of those guys. That was overqualified for the spot. He was in definitely so I look back game. Seven against the South Dakota two thousand twelve when he made I think the big shots in the fourth quarter Ebay two or three like monster threes that enabled him oppo away. He's eight for ten in that game. He made three threes. And I think too were in the last quarter nineteen and eight but I thought he was awesome in that game. Like I thought. It's kind of a thankless role to be the third guy. It's not they're never going to be like. Oh man we gotta get Chris Touch. Let's get him in. Let's with get Chris more involved. Because you're just you're not gonNA do that So he almost had to like be the Draymond of that team and I felt like he was a little bit him and he was fine with it but I do think before. He had his Ailment where his career basically gets derailed. I think there would have been really fun. Stretch for him once. Lebron those guys laughed when Houston was trying to get him. He ends up going back to Miami and it was going to be his team. I think he would have been back to being like a twenty five an eleven guy again and we just never had put it. He put a big numbers At you know we know what the Toronto numbers are but yeah there were right as I said before. I mean there's no playoff moment for Bausch and Toronto other than thirty nine and a loss in game four against the magic in his second year in the second year in the playoffs but I also thought it was when I went back and looked at. I go wait a minute. Spoelstra played him twenty seven minutes. Oh that's right. It was false yet five fouls so he played only twenty seven minutes in that game but just didn't score. I mean this is. This is not. It's not even a knock on him. I just I just think sometimes bosh depends if your heat fan. You think he's a superstar if you're not maybe forgot and if you're me you'd think moments where you forgot he was out there and you know. We're talking superstar hall of fame. I just think that we should be a little bit more. People were surprised is the right word or what but people were surprised. When we were both saying Antoine Jamison was going to be a hall of Famer and I was saying it like he should be a hall of Famer. I just think he's GonNa get in because twenty thousand points is getting hall of fame. I think the standards are low. They're like they are. That's that's always my whenever anybody's like. Hey Do you think I don't even? I don't even need you to finish the sentence us go. Yeah probably really time. John Rich made it. Did he deserve it. He's averaged twenty points for a few years. He was a good forward. He was never like a top ten guy in the league and then he coached to To rockets title team so I guess the totality that but like at some point now so does I don't know I just don't know what the line is anymore. I can't wait for you to get in it's going to be unbelievable would of though. Thou Kurt Gowdy thing. Yeah I fifty now. I'm Kinda surprised you haven't gotten it. It'll be after I'm dead the bag. I wish to give it to him and he won't be here. Yeah if you get really sick they'll give it to you then if you die you'll definitely get it but they will want you to get it now. Let's do it the two thousand redrafts. We're in take a quick break. Hey It's Bill Simmons. I just wanted to make listen to podcasts on spotify. Here's how you do it. I search for your favorite podcasts. On spotify Zap they have elaborate over seven hundred fifty thousand pods at this point. So let's say you're searching for the watchable Dave Chang show or the ringer. Nba show once you find them. Click on the follow button. That's how you subscribe. Then Click on those letters near the top of the. That's a podcast. All the pies. You're following will pop up separate episodes downloads and shows weight. Against better on spotify. You can adjust the speed of the pods to seven. Different speeds zero point five times as the slowest actually sound drunk zero point five. He could do zero point eight times one point times which is my favorite. Everyone sounds like they had a good cup of coffee. And then there's one point five times two times and if you're completely insane three times anyway. Spotify as APP connects directly to many of the best automobiles in the world. Even has a car play feature. That's pretty cool. Best of all. It's free download spotify in any device and you're good to go. She'd be embarrassed that you're not listening to podcasts on spotify. I don't WANNA APP. Shame you but the answer unfortunately is yes. Make the move. Listen podcast on spotify back two years all right so we've been redrafting. How about the fact that we didn't realize we should be calling. The redraft. Ables took took a reader last week to to send an email being like hey. Why aren't you calling? These draftable is like I don't know so we've done ninety six ninety seven ninety eight ninety nine One was I ordered that. Yeah we're calling draftable xlt now just better. I thought yeah I duNNo. I thought that that was what it was. But I guess editor for the Guy. Yeah so You can find all the old ones the easiest way to find him on the book a basketball pot or you can search for Sylla's archive for can we did this one. That's two thousand. The real reason we wanted to start this whole redraft ables thing was just to do the two thousand draft. This is our favorite draft. It is I wrote once that the best thing anyone ever said about this draft was well. At least nobody ever killed someone from this draft. I might be the most praise you could go The the the stats are incredible. Only five guys at a fifty eight potentially could have been like a real important started a playoff team. There were seven lottery. Whiffs STROM SWIFT. Was the number two pick we had a. Priscilla Dueling Maluso Thomas Alexander cleaves collier run for six straight picks from nine to fifteen. We had the seventeenth through twenty third picks for better than picks two through fourteen. We had the poor clippers who had three ten eighteen and it turned out to be the worst draft ever so they're rebuilding thing there and there's more facts we'll get into but this draft was bad in the moment and there are lots of reasons for it Which we've talked about another pods. Where the one and done and the high scores and all that it was just depleting depleting the Possible draft assets sometimes drive class. You just bad luck that it ebbs and flows depending on the air but we do it that college sailing because there was a lousy college year. Can you name the four best guys in the two thousand National Championship Title Game? is that Mateen cleaves yet. There's one mope e yeah do remember who played they play Florida Mike Miller Andrew. Clark you don has them eighteen years old Azlam Dammit you are big Teddy dupay guy back then I love Teddy dupay still holding out. Hope keep your fingers crossed but that was used them the right way cleave sprains his ankle in the second half and still ends up being the MVP of the final four but it was the first bad college basketball tournament we'd ever had. It was up until through ninety nine. It delivered the goods year after year. Net years like what's going on. It was like one of those summer movie seasons. Where there's just no good movies are like what's going on. We're the movies so good for is though by the way it felt like is oh needed something there to then be. I. I just think the world is. Oh so I wanted like whenever you were getting into arguments about which college coaches you'd like us it's fascinating the basketball world like how many people think some of the biggest name coaches at the biggest name programs have had these unbelievable careers they think. They're absolutely terrible. In Game Coaches Roger Izzo would be the guy that gets all that respect it just is owes. The whole consumption of Izzo would have been dramatically different heading apple that went off so so this draft. The Nets had the first pick Vancouver Second Clippers Third Chicago fourth. Our top forward Kenyon Martin Strauss with Darius Miles Marcus fizer Orlando Atlanta Chicago. Cleveland next for Mike Miller Dhamar Johnson. Chris MIHM JAMAL CRAWFORD. Then we finish it out with nine through fourteen. Houston ORLANDO BOSTON. Dallas Orlando Again Detroit Joe Priscilla Kion Jerome Musso Yvonne. Thomas Courtney Alexander Mateen cleaves Jason. Jason Collier Fifteen It was weird when it was happening there. Who's not a lot of excitement? There was enough of a dearth of prospects that dairy smiles. All the sudden became super exciting. He was from Saint Louis. There was some cagey stuff with them. Where it's like. This could be another cagey but if you actually watch the clips of him in high school. There's no resemblance the cagey at all. He's basically a six foot eleven. Jump shooting small forward to catch shoot but good athlete. Fund carried himself assert way but I I don't know how the K. G. things started and and just a mess all the way around when you look at when you look at just the first round which is out. I just need to clean up something here. I was thinking of Donell Harvey Florida. Declerk is still on my mind because the ninety six draft that we did so to Clark had declared years earlier so I just want to make sure I cleaned that up. Darius is big for me because he was supposed to be going to Saint Johns and Saint John's was still pretty relevant and in our tested. Just been there. Eric Barclays in this draft to Eric Barclay could could score but he like a lot of guys which is another big time scoring undersized guard. That never gets sniff the NBA After the first couple of years so miles was supposedly going but right like I went back and watched the beginning of this draft on Youtube. It was a t and t broadcast which I do want to bring up with you later and after Kenyon Martin goes one. It's we're still in this world which you wouldn't have thought of where they're like man five straight underclassmen in areas miles. You know and you're just like Oh that's right. It was still weird and people be complaining like addict by Towel. Come on and be like how come you're not taking mateen cleaves. Like I remember him. Losing his mind that Mateen cleaves didn't go ir after. It had this epic run. Because that's Bitel what he does. He get Super Mad that the older kids he's just ad nauseam and you're just like well. That's honesty Mateen cleaves went higher than he should've unit of address. Because it just people. Kinda KINDA see teen cleaves ago yeah. I don't really think he's a good pro. Even though this whole class was so bad so that was kind of the thing that going back and watching the Youtube Concept. The draft picks in the analysis. Where even though it's two thousand which yes? It's twenty years ago but it doesn't feel that long ago. It still felt like this uncharted world of look at them. Taken all these underclassmen so some facts. Kenyon Martin Macaroni. The only guys who earned more than one hundred million in this draft only four cracked fifty win career shares Turkoglu Mike Miller make Jamal Crawford. Only five played twenty thousand career minutes which is like normally that. Number's double figures. There were only three all stars from this draught. Michael Read Possible. Shibam glor- at this is even better than only three. All Stars only sixty one combined all-star minutes from this draught ever this trump hours fifty one minutes of the All Star game. This is being dirty. That's like wait a minute. Only three three all star selections for an entire class ever not three guys were all stars three selections and then our Research Department decided to be even meaner with that minute. Total is Zack. No of getting him in a second. I have two more for for me. Eleven of the first fifteen picks played less than twelve thousand career minutes. Eleven of the First Fifteen Six said the first fifteen picks played fewer than three hundred fifty games. So now ZAC cramp from the ringer. He had a couple of extras here. We call the Zack's Michael read the only person who made it all. Nba team he made on NBA team. this is the only time in in recent draft history like in the monitor the draft. Where only one person from a draft made it on. Ba team the players That we mentioned out only three all stars the second lowest total from the latter era for players for draft making the. All Star team was thirteen. Does this say that again? So the so the second lowest in the lottery era where we're going back to eighty five here. Yeah is thirteen. All-stars Thirteen All Star Games. Thirteen All Star Games. Thirteen All Star Games. This one had three games. Three anything else is the only draft ever in the ladder without multi all-stars. There was that a single guy who made more than what all star team and then An average of thirteen point seven career wins shares the fewest for any draft in the latter. So it's just a train wreck all the way through and through. Fortunately there's a lot of comedy we had. Reggie theus interviewed algae Baylor and described them. After as quote a veteran of the lottery process. He said this with a straight face like this is a couple of it at asset. He's a veteran of the lottery process. You know that means you suck as GM when you're a veteran the ladder process so that happened. That's the nicest way to see suck as a GM phasing veteran that's like when they call Like some local radio hosts like veteran veteran local. So and so. Who's it and be just means you've bounced around locally and worth a bunch of states so we had. We had an all stiff draft. That trade of Joel Priscilla Jason Collar Future Number one that happened we had a green room. Watch with somebody who didn't even end up being good jake tests colitis. Who I think you were in on a Lotta. Data's sack elitists yeah. He felt at twenty-five because people here worried about his contract. Yeah they should be worried about his talent. We had We had a a surprising moment. In the clippers took miles third. Nobody saw that coming and he came at. It took him forever. Come out he had a cream colored suit on put. Blue Clipper sat on it. And he did he. He legitimately hugs stern in a way. That in two thousand was not something we saw at the draft Syrup Hamilton and hugs. Turn the year before. This one was almost genitals to generals. Now we see like a Dallas hugging everybody but normally you just shook hands maybe as shoulder tap miles went in for like a real hug like he was catching up with an uncle at Thanksgiving or something. So that made it first. And then after that. Charles Barkley was doing this draft and he just went nuts on the clippers and this was right after he had retired. We were getting. Oh Barclay be the next baton for these drafts Barkley said. I don't think the clippers are good environment from ouster terrible organization. I hope he gets out of there. The clippers are one of the problems in Sports. Perfect example of teed that let's all their good players go over here. They're fans of bad product. It just like went in on them and it was the first exciting draft announcing moment in the history of of the draft where somebody actually going in We also had. Oh my moment for my dad. It did did the draft our that year The Bulls took somebody named Alibegovic. Yeah Number Twenty Four. At this point we had the sporting news where they would put their head like mock drafts at this point in the Sporting News. And my dad look down and he said he's not on my list and just see more confused than anything Dalibor garbage just. It was like where did this guy. So yeah lot of I. Three years of the Bulls three years. We're going to redraft so each one. Rank in the guys from superstars of five quality. Starter is a one all stars to star. This is the only draft. Were probably ever GonNa do where there's no to guys I think would you? Would you rate? You don't have to start. Yeah I think Kenyon Martin where I would rate him as a quality starter. I wouldn't trade him as an all-star would you you mean perennial all star. Just like all star was there an all-star this draft the dancers. No Michael Read had a really nice stretch. He did get going but I know once we get to him in that whole thing because he was a second rounder and I think if you look at the the cumulative stats the analytics You Know He. He holds up well compared to all these other guys so we can either do the redraft or whatever but I would like to just before we do that. I want to ask you because you got to do the draft SPN. And as I've said it two thousand you go back and you look at the production it's TNT be saying the same stuff it was espn. Because I don't really care we know Ernie's a Glue Guy Backbone keeps the thing you know going in the right direction but she had John Thompson up there. Who didn't know anything about anybody? Huby who didn't know anything and then they brought by Rick Majerus for like Comic Relief and he actually it just fascinating that even in two thousand we would have the NBA draft on television. And you wouldn't really have anybody that you knew was putting in the time and doing the scouting reports and the NBA hadn't really had. I mean this is even pre chat Ford being on the radar. Now we have a bunch of different guys that are locked into kind of that draft thing. But I don't know what I want like I go back and watch it like Maderas said at one point. No huby said this. Choubey said that that our test is better as a two guard struggles small forward and then he turned one of those small forwards in the League When they were talking about like rosters and how it and people freaking out about Christmas. I'm not going to the Bulls because the bulls needed size. And so what? The guy's doing 'cause they weren't putting any time into it. You could just tell that they're like all right the Bulls don't have a center. They have Elton brand. Or they gotta take Chris Mihm and Thompson would say oh. I saw this kid play and he'd be like Oh. Wow John Thompson Sam playing high school and then follow it up with like really no depth to it so it was a bunch of people on the desk for this really important night that you and I probably take too seriously and you go. That's amazing that you can have a TV product. This isn't like it's nineteen seventy eight and two thousand and nobody. They don't have anybody there that actually like put in real data and real scattered reports and I'm thinking that just because nobody thought and wanted that did we just want big names. 'cause I remember even. Espn like we have. Steven aid. Have Mark Jackson Van Gundy? None of those guys were watching any of the stuff and up on synergy or second spectrum breaking all. It's like I remember Stephen. A there was a pick he goes live. He's like I've never seen the brother play. But I hate this pick and I was like what the fuck so I don't know what I want right like. What is it that I want? Because sometimes it's up. I want maybe a boring television product and you got to do it and I'm sure there were times where you felt like. Hey we're doing the wrong thing we should be doing this and the TV guide probably telling you you're wrong right. I feel like everybody has to have a role I thought we did a good job at the draft but we everybody had a role. Bill was the college guy which is sorely missing from the two thousand draft. Talk has talked about because John. Thomson's not GonNa say anything and you. I don't even think he was in college anymore. At that point but Bilas the guy who could take over by them Gut Bilas was the guy who had seen all these guys play and then was crunching tape on them and doing the things so you could trust him Jalen. I think at least the first year was still on the college show so he was. At least seeing these guys person had a feel for them but could talk more about You know like what's it like. What your college versus. What you could blossom into and then my thing was more trying to figure out what the teams were doing. You know and that stuff where you really need somebody out there. Who's like Oh. They're doing this because they're actually say they have these guys eligible for free agency and they've got abroad and you just got to know all the moving chess pieces and that's not something you can study you have to either know it or you don't know it And now it's something we're even like when Van Gundy was on thank God he's like he doesn't know what the CAP situation and she stupid shit like that. You kind of have to know that stuff on the fly because there's trades to infiltrate happens. You have to go all right. Well why they do that. We'll what what's the purpose of this and and almost like react. We would on a podcast. So it's a night that has a lot of moving pieces and if you have people that aren't totally versed on at least whatever their specialty is supposed to be. It's going to go really badly but nobody can. Nobody cared in two thousand though. This wasn't like a huge event back then but I've seen ESPN lineups. Were in. I understand like I think TV executives. They err on the side of names where they go. Let's put our biggest stars on these shows and we'll figure it out but I really think if you're going to have a draft on and it's GonNa be five hours of this stuff like the stick in the Zang's after a while. Look if you don't know anything about the players I got two point. Stop watching on. Tv I mean I did six years for radio and I said the only way I'm doing is an analyst. I'm not going to host it. And they wouldn't. They wouldn't even let me on the radio one for a bunch of years and then after like the first year they go. Can you come back next year and House again and then you know a couple of years? I did did Scott after the fact which is Great. I mean I couldn't believe it like I was after the draft is done. I'm on sportscenter. Impelled breaking the whole thing down and it was You know because they were pretty much nonstop on it and I I just watching in two thousand and this was considered good and that would get destroyed if it happened now if somebody said. Hey let's just put a bunch of NBA cronies on and will wing. It I really like doing it shocking. Thing about it that hated was how fast picks Kim because his five minutes to impacts so the guy walks out he shakes hands then he has the interview with whoever. And that's like three and a half minutes. Bilas is doing his whole breakdown. That's prepackaged thing and then you basically have like a minute to react before the next pick. Which isn't you know you're talking like lottery. Picks like when Cleveland took Anthony Bennett that we could. We could talk about that for fifteen minutes. But it's like all right on to the next one number two and it's like Cleveland just took a guy who if they didn't take them there might have fallen out of the top ten like we should be talking about this so I wish it was ted. I personally think the lottery should own night and I would make it. Fourteen picks that's it Fifteen minutes between picks or twelve minutes picks. Let's really go into this and make it like a dramatic night and then do the rest of it later but I think I'm the only one who would probably want that. I would like it but we're wrong. We know wrong on this because they wanted to move and they wanna get everything done one at all that stuff but it should at least be for the lottery. It should be ten minutes between packs are eight minutes or something. You should get more. 'cause it's you know you've got so many different people on it you'd have now that is part of it. Who really is the most important thing? Because he knows all the moving pieces and stuff but when you don't have the news you need a new guy you need somebody who's seen them play and then the other thing that's tough and this is where Bilas role is really challenging despite what an authority is on the college game comparison to most of the people that he's sitting on the set with over the years when I've watched on. Espn is that. It's really tough to go up there and just let me. I'll just pick Lauri markkanen right. You know because I actually think Lauri Markkanen could be okay setback a bit this year. But let's say Lauri Markkanen stake in seventh and bill goes this guy sucks. Total staff fraud can't can't dribble can't shoot. That's you can't really do that. Even though that would be the best it would be awesome if somebody just decided. Hey that's who I'm going to be on one of these draft shows. Nfl or NBA. You don't have to say sucks necessarily but everything is spun into a positive because there's this very delicate thing of not wanting to ruin a kid's night well now is the big thing for Jalen especially because you could hear the people in the arena could hear us at least one of the years But JALEN was I. This is the best night of this kid's life. I'm not gonNA trash the pick. I'm just not going to do it so I was in the spot whereas like all right there's GonNa be some bad picks and we're GONNA have to like dance around. You Know Oh man. Why'd they do that? But you can't guys whole families watching so it's definitely delicate balance ballots. True true or false. Did you feel more comfortable? Trashing a euro pick just because the language barrier. Now I I loved it I I gotTa Say. I've is most fun I've had on TV. Where the drafts? I really had a good time because I was such a fan of what was happening to. It was it felt pretty natural to just be like sitting with two other guys that are hosted that they're doing just be like. Oh what did you think that pick? Well here's what I thought. And he's Kinda goes really great. I enjoyed you say it was one of those moments the success where you have this little moment where you kind of look around and go like Holy Shit. I'm actually GONNA do this because it goes away successful you are you know no that one because I had done the draft. Diaries for really from ninety seven to two thousand twelve and then all of a sudden on there but the first of all we did was stern's draft. It was his last one so I saw I remember. I saw him before the draft and he just gave me we. It was a hand shaped he gave me. That look like the same way. Somebody's dad would look at them when you're about to take their daughter out to the prom or something just kind of like don't fuck me on. This was one of those looks at And it was. It was hilarious was his last one and he was like milk in the crowd and waving waving them to boo him. More and all that stuff is pretty funny. If people don't know this too that stern and it's it's through the NBA media thing but if you're on the air covering any kind of NBA product. You have to fill out this form and be approved by the League so when I did a couple Celtics Games. I had to fill out to stuff. And they're like you're fine and then I remember when I was trying to get on the draft show for radio before I was even allowed on it. Because I'd still at Bennett. Espn since Oh six. And I was like. Hey Look I go to Portsmouth I go to Orlando and then I was hosting the combine In Chicago which I did for five years I can I. Can I get onto this thing and I remember you know again? Just a lie and they're like well you know there's some people in the NBA really don't like you and so we can't get you approved to be part of an MBA broadcast product. And I was like really knowing me. I call up somebody in the NBA. That week. I go hey you guys have a problem with me over there. He's like that's a hundred percent. Not True is even if you so. If we don't like people like you you're not an asshole you care your voice for the NBA type of thing. You're one of those guys that obviously loves this league to like whoever told you that you're not on the broadcast because we have a problem with you straight up. Lie to your face and I was like awesome. We're GONNA do the redraft. Do you like when I take these moments to. Kinda do a little therapy session on something that went wrong now because I think I think we both loved the draft and we got to be there the for a couple of times and work. It was still it was awesome. Xausa a loved it. I think the two thousand thirteen draft would be a great documentary. It's any Bennett was suppo- plus you. I think that was the first draft. When woes was just tweeting the picks before Espn was that. I remember going on my phone and just seeing who the next pick was a second fee. It was either that you're fourteen one of the two I did. He just had all the picks before they were coming out the stage and he just was completely upending it. Do you remember when Jeff Goodman at one point one year he had somebody in the pipeline who is just giving them the pick right and that was crazy. 'cause then Jeff Goodman was tweeting out every pick not as breaking news but like hey this is officially the pick and he just had it all night long because somebody he had a guy so the nets had the first pick in two thousand they took Kenyon Martin in Cincinnati. Do you want the first pick of the second pick? But he want to go one or two. I'll go one all right so we'll Kenya Mart and go first again at our redraft ables yes or now okay There is a case against him. Analytically here if you WANNA go for you know. He's he's behind guys if you want to go win. Shares that kind of stuff There's a couple people behind him. He was older coming in. And I would say as much as I I. I've always had this thought. If you're going to be really really good. Maybe not just great tear but below that it really really good. You're probably going to figure it out no matter what the fit but Martin and Richard Jefferson going to play with Jason. Kidd is the best thing that could have ever happened to him. It really was and I think Martin what he gave you even as a notch. Like I'm probably GonNa go with him versus reds health. So I'm still GonNa Take Martin Number One even though there are strong arguments with like two or three other names. I just I just like the whole Kenyon Martin thing even though it was probably a little underwhelming for an overall number one pick and offensively he was a non factor for a good chunk of the end of his career so I think he was a better asset Michael Read. When they're both healthy he also had a knee injury. He had the microfracture surgery. Michael read blew out his ACL during the OA denied Weiss. Yeah so here's the case for K. Mart and I agree with you. I thought he should've been. I picked second best player in two finals teams. I think that matters Ruined Antoine Walker career. He really did. And I coincidentally I wrote an airplane to Chicago with him. Just randomly sit next to him in mid-february and didn't talk to him the whole time because I hate talking to people who get talked to all the time but then he kind of was looking. He was signed me near the end. And then here's a hey man you bill and so we started talking and I was like broke my heart and Oh to like I thought we had guys I went to those games as you just destroyed Antoine and he was saying when he went into the NBA. He started talking about it. We're landing and he's like when the NBA. Anton was an all star in the east. And I was like I gotta I gotTa beat that guy. That's going to be the guy that I'm just going to be better than because if I'm better than him than on the All star in the east and if you go back and watch those series like he he just kills Antoine. Couldn't figure out what to do against him. His oath three and four in the playoffs. They made the finals no three and have a really good series against the Pistons. No four they lose. He was nineteen and ten solid. Good really above average defensive player that I thought like not like a defensive Puerto Year but definitely like an all defense kind of forward any of the bigs any of the bigs. They could play bigger than they were and then also hang. Athletically with ended up primer stuff. It just allows you to do stuff I mean. That's why I've mentioned how much I always loved the Piston structure of of switching guys. But you know when you can switch and not give up stuff. That's that's what Kenyon was doing on top of running game. I gotta be honest. I really enjoyed his game. He got signing traded to Denver in two thousand four and I forgot SEUSS's July fifteenth two thousand four Denver. It's three first round. Picks they end up giving up. Two of them were lottery protected. The one the Denver picked that was in there actually was like very lightly protected the pick. Senator Being Joey. Graham Rinaldo Bachman Marcus Williams. But you know he made one hundred thirteen million he had real value. He was also on that Denver team. No nine he wasn't one of the best repairs at that point. That almost made the finals pretty good career. Like you definitely can't call him a bus like he made. A lot of money had had some good moments so I thought that was good pick. I had Michael Read Second. I just finished with one thing though. I'm sorry yeah I know it's annoying but I remember you know. I love tough guys. I love the real tough guys as opposed to the fake guys that do stuff and when I asked Net Sky I go you play with with Kenyan right and I go. What's the story there? But like no no. He's all the way real. Do he goes. He actually like guys. Were fucking scared of him. Straight up Anton was and I'm like yeah but this is his own teammates. How about you guys? Were scared of him. Like yeah like if you would get into it and you were fucking with them in practice like he he do this thing. You'd better get my name out your mother Fucker. Mouth in like guys would be like Whoa. We're supposed to be on the same team here so I love hearing stuff like that though. 'cause that means you know that that somebody who's not gonNA wilt so there's a cut. I like this conversation. There's a couple of guys. Oakley was obviously the the captain of this team. But there's some guys over the years and you talked to anybody from that air and they're like the difference between the tough guys in the game but the actual elect don't fuck with that guy. Guys Stackhouse was another like that. Yeah I'd heard that too. I very set years. Yes that there's famous stackhouse stories him punching out Kirk Snyder after a game and shit like that Tony Allen I was like that where it's like. Yeah don't don't actually fuck with Tony out like you can try. Talk Trash on the court Don't actually fuck with them because he'll go there and I think. Yeah Zach Randolph Zach. Randolph is another one. Yeah don't you have a little fun? Do little trash talk but don't go too far But Yeah Kenyon was legit. He definitely was like that. All right. My second pick in this would be for Vancouver's picking the spot poor Vancouver just getting slaughtered in these drafts not enough bring a team back to Vancouver supporters the rest of the Sonics degree. Yeah I think we have Seattle Vancouver would be my top two picks for TAB. Nba teams again for you. Actually think they should have a team again. Yeah I was kind of. I think they got hosed. I think they've got to. I don't understand why people would you know. Look there's there's always gonna be this Canadian thing that some guys down here rather live in Vancouver than a lot of cities midkiff. Michael Red is my second pick. He from two thousand four through two thousand eight Four Seasons. He twenty four game. I didn't realize it was that money. forty five percent field goal thirty seven percent from three. He was one of those old school Old School guys. From if you just put them forward fifteen years probably would have had a much more fun. Career probably taking eight or nine threes third team on a and then When he tore his knee again and feel it. Oh nineties and it was over but he was the guy. Milwaukee was very good in the mid two thousands. I don't think anybody was in more fake trades in him. I know I personally threw him into about one hundred but it was always one of those. Oh you know if they could package Bubba Ness and get Michael Read. That could be the missing piece and he was in that group for three or four years. I like this game too. That he was good So that's my second pick. Now you're up on the clock three. I'll be interested to see what you do here. I think there's like a no brainer number three pick. I don't know if I read blew out his his. Acl AND MC L. in the same left knee twice. Yeah and you're right. He has that structure. You go man. He went off and then when it was over it was absolutely over. But he'd signed that. You've got a six year extension back then and that was the first year we're Lebron. I was going back and look in two thousand five free agency stuff and after free agency they got Larry Hughes Donyell Marshall when they wanted read they wanted Joe Johnson that he was talking about trying to recruit bosh out of there which was going to be way too early. Unless you're going to try to tell him to force a trade in bully him but Yeah People Thought Michael. Read was GonNa go there because he went to. Yeah that's right. They thought he was going to go there. But remember the raises were bigger incrementally year to year than they are now they used to make more of an incentive for you to stay home with the longer in the better raises and read was like look. I'm going to stay here. But that team you're right like they. They had forty two wins because it took for a while to get red started was really his fourth year when he was like. Whoa this guy's awesome and then the team never won more than forty two games. Okay I guess I just wanted to use my free agency notes there because I wrote them down. Sorry I third pick is obvious now. There's there's two names given given. Who's on your board? Let's hear it? Well it's Miller a Turkey blue. Okay and Miller is another guy when you go back. Read wasn't as surprising. There's some Miller stretches where you go man he. He lit up a little bit and the second leg of his career. Kind of like our Ray Allen Allen Iverson thing but I actually think I like peak Turkoglu better than Miller so Turkoglu. Okay make the case. Well if I have to start with fifteen years I love that he went to Sacramento. People were Kinda like at pages in his way. It wasn't it was just like why because he's another tall white guy that's not from the states. It took a while but from Oh four oh five till two thousand Tan and what he did and how fit into that Orlando team. I thought he had moments during those Orlando runs. Were Turku like like an incredibly talented scary guy. I know he floats. I know is rebounding. Numbers are pretty You know they're just not as good as you'd wanted to be but he actually became like a pretty good playmaker there for Orlando there towards the end. I know the end. Was You know by the time? He's back in Orlando thirty three clippers last couple of years. It's Kinda over a stint with Phoenix. But this is more of a talent thing where I think the peak version of Turku was somebody who could give me a tougher bucket than Miller and I think is another one that ten years later. You'd be running a lot of the stuff like they were doing anyway. In these playoff games for For Orlando which we did one of them on the basketball we did game for the o nine Lakers were. They're coming out setting the screen spread in the floor for him and he was pretty crafty. I I don't totally understand why Sacramento couldn't figure out how to use him and then he goes to San Antonio for the Oh three or four season where they lose basically on that Fisher shot. I think they would have won the title that year and they couldn't really figure it out either and it wasn't until he got to Orlando that he got unleashed as guy who's like I'm going to score sixty in a game. I'm GonNa make almost forty percent of my threes. I don't really need the ball the time but in crunch time you can kind of go to me and I'm weird. They reliable I don't understand why Sacramento couldn't figure out how to play him in page together. You would have thought like great. Put both of them out there. See Webley let's go. Would you trade them for Brad Miller for that? That was that was very strange. Can I read you the names of Ron in the trade? Yeah all right because I was. Yeah perfect that's exactly what I was going to do right now. Because there's some awesome names in this. So it's a three teamer Indiana Sacramento and San Antonio and the only thing we know for sure is that Indiana's just gonNA end up with white guys like what. However this plays out there getting white guys in the trade so Indiana Trades Brad Miller to Sacramento and they trade Ron Mercer to the Spurs Turkey Turkoglu also goes to the Spurs Sacramento Trade Scott Power to Indiana and San Antonio Trades. Danny Ferry to Indiana. It's it's a double Caucasian food for the Pacers. And and Turku is by far the best guy in that trade that I did. Enjoy that one. Brad Miller Susan on the Kings but It seemed like a heist. I remember writing this at the time. What a heist. For the spurs like really excited see Turk Lewin the spurs never. Really happened was until the magic that he kind of found his his place. The magic contract though was at the time that was. I bet you could go back and look at this. You're like what are the magic doing like they're giving Turkoglu this much money but only at O. Four zero five. We're talking him. Being Twenty five years old and the reason I mentioned the pacers getting rid of Brad Miller. And you're talking about like Brad Miller was so white. He counted his two white guy. So that's why the ferry and Pollard. Back right anybody. That packs dip in the fourth quarter of a game. We need at least two white guys to make up for his whiteness would have been fun. That Brad Miller in the our test bailer though I've felt cheated out of that I'm taking a Mike Miller with the fourth pick so Kenyon Martin one micro to Turku three. Mike Miller four Mike Bill or third on my board. I couldn't be happier now. Forty one percent three point shooter career career. I mean that's been a year that included the year five years when his luggage at the end of his career and still finished over. Forty percent Oh five through eight Memphis Johnson. Pretty SNEAKY GOOD MEMPHIS teams. Fifteen five and five forty eight forty to seventy eight percent splits forty two percent from three that whole stretch plane a Lotta minutes game. Five two thousand twelve finals. Seven for eight from three twenty three points you mentioned are Bada. Had that huge game seven in two thousand thirteen. Noord did the same thing in game five and that was one of the series that it was a four one finals. The consensus now is that. Oh Yeah Miami one in five. They had it the whole way. Those first four games all came down to like one or two plays and even in game five. I didn't feel like that series was done. Miller came out. Shot the lights out Had THAT NOT HAPPENED. They would have gone back to okay. See FOR GAME. Six and seven so is was it a must win. Every finals game is a must win but There's a scenario where you know. Drink hot in that game five and maybe it goes back to okay see now. The crowds go nuts. Who knows Lebron had at one entitled yet? There's different variables Miller shut it. All down he was awesome in that game. Probably might the jump shot. I was the most jealous of just personally like if you could have bought. Somebody's jump shot on ebay. I think I think I would have taken Mike Miller. Who would you take in? Ray Yes so razi other choice there. I really jump shot. I'm but Miller Miller is a good pick and was it close for you on on Turkoglu or Miller or were you like adamant. 'cause I was I was split going into it. I always I was like them and I just thought he was in weird situations for most of his career that If you Kinda just did his career ten times I think there's these universes where you know there's times when it could have been awesome for him You look at all the teams that could have drafted a in this draft where it goes jersey. Vancouver CLIPPERS CHICAGO ORLANDO Atlanta Chicago again. Cleveland I mean all those teams sucked for years. Any situation he was going to is going to be a bad situation I. It's a shame that he couldn't have just gone to a team that was good but for one year ended up in the lottery. You know where he was like just playing with good players all the time. 'cause I was thought he had a really nice feel for the game. I got to read you. Some Mike Miller Trade Trivia so he was the last piece of the Chris Webber Penny Hardaway Trade from eighteen. Ninety three. He was the last first round pick. I couldn't believe that when I looked at up today at Pitt carried over from nineteen ninety. Three he was traded in two thousand three with a first round. Pick for jour- gooden which is a trade. That just seems abysmal now. I can't believe that you thought drew. Gooden had a first for Mike Miller. Now see other then he was in that crazy. Kayla of Oj. Mayo Chris Wallace fiasco where Chris Wallace. I would it have the fifth pick. Yeah and he I forget what it always four did he have forty went down to five. Yeah he flips picks so he can end up with. Oj Mayo and gives Minnesota Kevin Love and Mike Miller. Both of them. So somehow they Chris. Wallace goes with the two best guys. That are still trying to figure that out. And then a year later He's traded with Randy Foye. Joe Houses least favorite wizards bodes trade of all time Randy. Foye Mike Miller for the number five. Pick in two thousand nine. Which could have been steph. Curry Ricky. Rubio said Washington have it. Con- ends up getting it and then somehow lifts and takes Johnny Flynn and there. You go four trades where the other team probably Has the fans have their feelings hurt? I really enjoyed Mike bowers game. I can't believe he's a top floor. Pick to redraft but There we are. Who Do you have for five? I just wanted to add to that that draft in two thousand eight to make sure we had it right now. That's right yet. He had wallace had five. Any traded up to get to three with Mayo and Westbrook in between them and Westbrook at the time was like four was kind of a reach. Felt like that's his high. Go where we do. If we do the redraft Westbrook will be obviously for higher but I loved Westbrook and college. I was stunned when he went for it. It's seems I did love him. I did. I have stuff written i. He was like big sleeper in the draft. But I thought he was like just this energy guy off the bench. I didn't think he was going to be Russell. Westbrook I don't like the prestige in none of those guys did. Pj CARLESIMO WHO? I became close allies. Like what was going on there he goes. I was screaming banging the table. Going Brooke. Lopez's Brook Lopez's Brook Lopez's and he goes in every time I come back to prestige prestige like we really kind of loved the idea what this book I can be and I'm telling you you may liked him but like for Presi to actually pull the trigger on it especially over Kevin Love. Yeah I watched that. Ucla I watched a lot of that team may stop. I Kevin Love not to be the first. Ucla guy off that team in a draft was inconceivable. Westbrook was like the first like couple months almost like a six man even on the Ucla team and then he started a blossom. Was still there too. Man Now team is amazing you know they played slower Holland Style and all that stuff. So I mean hell I I honestly think prestige taking Westbrook when he did with the allegations are serious. I think it's like one of the greatest picks of that decade. Because you have to go back and go okay. But what are you actually drafting a back? Then we were still a little more position obsessed you know the same thing like with Turkoglu in pages your benching. Now you just figure it out which is kind of crazy that like now. We can't do that like we already have a six ten white guy. We can't do that. We can't just put another guy out there that can chew like how stupid it was that we didn't let basketball. Have this evolution. Where it's a wait. Those guys are both really big and can handle and can shoot or aren't we let them both play right and Westbrook is another argument. That by the way in that Miller deal was actually recycled in that trade and Brian Cardinal Walker who actually my Pick Brian Cardinal The Custodian Aka the Janitor Aka citizen pain. Brian Cardinal Out of purdue. Are you being serious right now? Now I just want to freak out about the Nash. Everson thing no all right so this is where it gets a little interesting but I do think you Jamal Crawford. I liked him more. I thought he'd be different like he was a guy. Liked a lot before this. He ended up going a but just the fact that he put up buckets for this long up until two years ago. I mean he was in the league last year. So I I know. He played for a million teams. I'm not saying you're winning any games with them but he was somebody that just to give you that much at like. This also has a lot to do with the other options. That are out there. I just think Value Ham. I getting almost twenty years of shooting from the sky despite that it's a little isolation heavy. Yeah whatever. I'll take your offer three six men in the year words. I had him at five as well. I think it's the right pick. He's one of those guys if he's like your Eighth Guy. Incredible feature six guy that that actually. Yeah but that also means you're coach by playing him and crunch time. Yeah and he's one of your best four guys. You're not winning anything. As we found out with the first ten years of his career I always kind of liked his game. I mean he's one of the worst defense suppliers of any good player the last twenty years. He's just a complete sieve but the the thing that was annoying with him on the clippers near the end there was he really would take the biggest shot of the game. He like a is the Marcus smart. Edis where it's like. I got this and it's like no you not even sure you should be out there with five minutes left. He's he's to me like you almost want him the way the Celtics used Daddy House. Two Thousand Eight. That's my dream Jamal Crawford scenario. Give me an awesome sixteen minutes a game instant offense and then kind of stay out of the way if I'm trying to win a title if I seven eight minutes left in the fourth quarter against subbed out. Yeah you have to. You can't plan He played seventy four playoff games. Thirty nine percent fuel goes shooter. Thirty one percent from three the other thing with him. There was this thing like that. He was awesome three point. Shooter knew he just wasn't you know he was like he was the master of the four point. Play which you know. Congratulations that's great. But that's not helping me when a title he was that good of a three point shooter and it was one of those guys that always seem like the shot was going to go in but it went in a lot less than I think people remembered. So I'm I'm sure people are. Listen is going wait a second. What was wrong with Jamal Crawford? Who's awesome like sorry He's Today's player. Isn't that nice piece to have on a team but You know just not as good of a shooter as I think he thought he was. He played in big cities. Chicago NEW YORK ATLANTA. La Yellow had a little bit of time with Minnesota Phoenix at the end. Yet a portland run there but he like hit all the major markets. I love that. He has a nice New York stretching there. He actually went for twenty game with the Knicks when he was twenty seven but he has become oddly overrated. A little bit. Because we've seen the cross over a million times on the Internet and it's sick. We've seen him shake people pull up from deep. The four-lane plays I wouldn't say like he's not even close whenever we start going like historic great shooters of all time. You're not talking about tomorrow. I think everybody really likes him. Okay that's capable. I love this guy so overrated like I feel guilty even saying that a little bit but the idea of him is. He's a really good player. He had a really long career. He came out really. Early was just one year at Michigan. But I think everybody loves this dude. Every time I see him on a panel or some show like guys light up a little bit so he's held up a little bit higher than the fact is that you know. Look he was never. I don't think of him like I never felt like Jamal Crawford was a star and I think sometimes he's talked about that way so two things there one of the most popular actual players with the other players. I think he's like on a short list of just do everybody. Everybody loved them also really popular with the media and there was a year when I would the last time. He won the sixth man award or he was up for it and it was just insane that he that he was even a candidate. But I think just the media really liked him. He was always really gracious and thoughtful and awesome to everybody. And you know it's smart. It was well played but You know I think if he's playing thirty five minutes for you you're not you're not making around to the playoffs. I don't think My six pack. This is where it gets dark just for the people listening. Here's is on the board right now. No particular order. Most Peterson quitting Richardson Desmond. Mason Joma glory there smiles. Eddie House to Sean Stevens San Joel Priscilla Joe. Brazil should have gone with Joel principle. I think he would have been more intimidating There's a little speedy claxton. Ed Eduardo. Now Harare undrafted Balik Allen. I like now. Harare Kion Dueling. That's really what we're looking for here. So I'M GONNA go with Quentin Richardson because for two years. Oh four or five u sixteen and six almost seven threes. A game made thirty six percent. Not Great but not awful but was you know in modern times more of a three and D Guy. Who could rebound a little bit a little bit ahead of his time? I liked him on the sense teams. he was fun with DERAs miles when they were doing the tap their head thing. I think he was a of lagged teammate. In different places and his career was bad. He became kind of a contract. Figure there for the second half of it but at least I know he could contribute to good team because we saw it. So I'm taking him sex Clinton Richardson. He could have been in the mix. Maybe for five. Yeah he ended up being a nice player in in a good role player. Where I think you're right. You knew kind of exactly. We were getting from him and then they did have that little. Run there with clippers where it was just so much fun but again. That's not necessarily what we're drafting. And that also means a dairy miles is still available. Which I imagine will be available for this draft by the way was one of the drafts that Kinda was like. Hey so little wakeup call here. Stop falling in love. The long athletic guys long length. Because Strom all swift is the poster child for that one love storm Auschwitz coming out Stromer swift was almost instant flame out. I was going back and Reading Billy Knight who was the GM that pulled the trigger. Do you remember the head coach? Vancouver in two thousand was due. Jackson is Sidney Lowe. Oh yeah he was the nego like nine and forty one or some some terrible record six and forty two four day. I went back and read the article of them being interviewed after the pick. They mentioned hey. This guy's young like every other sentence every other sentence and one thing. I've always noticed with busts. It's unbelievable how often the repeats itself. Is that you. Don't play nearly as well your rookie year. And then what they do is they give you a ton of minutes in your sophomore year to prove that you do actually suck and you'll see so many guys that weren't good. That have this real nice. Bob and his best career year was his second season right. And it's not because he improved and then fell off because they actually gave you more shots and forced the issue with you. Ran More stuff through you just to make sure they could okay. We actually made a mistake here so I stopped. It was kind of my Earl Clark Reckoning Earl Clark Louisville long score did some stuff at Louisville and I go you know what but if you if you're just long and I don't see that you have real basketball skills this this draft fuck with my head so bad because I was stopped loving all these really tall guys that can't dribble and can't shoot the first one. Was Brad sellers going back to the eighties? Wow that's first time where I was just out on those type of guys from that point on 'cause I'm Jay kind of needed Brad sellers in the late eighties. And he was a staff like he you know he was the six eleven guy who couldn't shoot a rebound said who who what's left. Are we doing yeah we do? Why are you out there and you and your soft so yeah? I was shocked to find out. Stromer swift played for nine seasons. I don't remember I honestly. If if we are to the bigger basketball fans I would love to just talk to random people if you should be a rigorous series. What was your favorite strobe miles swift? Memory 'cause I have none. I don't remember anything about his career. The head dunk on Was another lsu. Guy Who also is one of my other guys tyrus Thomas Thomas. Yeah right so tires Thomas Wade. Save it for the. Oh six redraft ables. Because that's when we got to do because I remember I was on a flight with a GM leaving. Virginia after the Portsmouth Tournament and I go this tyrus Thomas run because you know he and Davis had that really nice round he goes. Oh my God and he sold me on Thomas. I'm still young and impressionable. He sold me because he goes not only can tie up. Thomas do all this stuff. You can run your offense. He's the sickest happy all these different things and I go. I gotTa Stop Liking these guys. All the tires had a little bit more well rounded stuff in his game but Yeah Strauss with memory. It was going around this week because everybody sent it to me because they know how I feel about. Strom out swift is he. Dunks on tyrus. Thomas and tires gets back to the play to try to reject it and swift. I mean the dunk is one of the best dunks you've seen in a game. It's dat awesome of a dunk but you get a little bit older. You start thinking who do I wanNA marry versus you? I want to date and your valuations. Get better I have an incredible strom out swift fact for you career record in the playoffs. Owen seven games not net series. Never WanNa be you wear seven. Not Playoff routes games owned seven. Never WanNA play game nine seasons so who you taking seven. You didn't tell me he actually got a decent second contract by the gets to that but the thing is he made forty two million forty three million those good athletes who could offensive rebound with. Just throw you off the scent you know you watch. Someone gave the Ed Pinkney was like that too. Picked it was way better this drama swift but those those lanky forwards who could like just get put back that guy. Oh it was. It was always deceiving. Who Do you have at seven? Strowman was done as a starter. Twenty five years old. Now all right Going through the board here going through the board. We could probably speeded up at this point of the of the redraft almost added material so I I think I'm GonNa go Eddie House how. I thought I was going to get them later. Eddie how how? Many playoff threes. He hit his entire career to guess. No I don't take guess. Guess twelve now thirty nine. I thought it was GONNA be like one hundred twenty. Yeah I do to be low. Because he's not in the playoffs or many times I just figured between the the Phoenix and the two Boston seasons. I don't know why in my head. He'd made all these streets but he was in to Boston years. Twenty nine for sixty eight three but he helped win the title game for game six like. He's made huge shots. This is a massive Celtics playoff. But who am I overvalue like who am I missing on? There's not another draft room behind me. That's freaking out being like. I can't believe they took Eddie House who one day they found a scattering report on them. And I know I've said this story before but the scouting report said won't shoot unless he has the basketball. I had him tents. Just sit on my board. So it wasn't a big upset now. Was it a reach? I WANNA reach nothing. Now is a reach. I gotta take a good good. I'm going to take a good locker room guy pretty well. So that's the case for any house is Awesome Locker Room. Guy Could actually come in and make a big shot in a game. It's not it's not the wrong pick I had Desmond Mason seven so I'm GonNa take them an eighth You know like a bunch of the guys that his draft at his peak was a fifteen and five I just want to say he was enough of an asset that he was basically the centerpiece of the Ray Allen Trade because if you look at that trade it was Gary Payton News an expiring contract Desmond Mason for Ray Allen Ronald Berry. Kevin Kelly in two thousand three first round pick. That was like the fact that Milwaukee basically they give up their first round. Pick N Ray Allen so they could get Gary Payton for two months and Desmond Mason. So he had to evade real value back then unless Ray Allen is the biggest cancer in the world I didn't realize it but that's one of the Weirder trade so anyway. I'm taking him a mad. That houses off the board. Who Do you have a number nine? I look at the fact that he would come in and make big playoff shots that that puts him in another class. Where a lot of these guys chance to do that. So that's why I'm going. I think it's a reach because I actually meant to take this guy before him and then take Eddie House after but it looks like would have been Jamaal. Magloire should have gone this late. He should have gone either. The two picks pat. He said that without any irony at all. No what are you talking about? Shimomura war deserves to go seven eighth not night in the two thousand wraps. Yuma glory was the redraft Green Room going with Eddie House really. Yeah it's tough. He made it all star. Team Minute All star team and I'm going to tell you the more I dug into the Jamaal Magloire story the more I realize the numbers don't don't do it. Justice so just the unquantifiable Jamaal. Magloire he yeah a double double with New Orleans you know I mean I always liked him. I I am up. This is the tenth pick. Yes unpick Darius Miles. Can't fall any further. I gotTA take him here. The case for dares miles who did get hurt to be fair he. He is another like we talked about earlier. These guys that. I'm not sure what they did. Couldn't shoot three's Had NO POST UP GAME? This speak of was a career forty seven percent shooter was just a good athlete was fun to watch on. A fast break had a lot of personality. I'm not really sure what the best case scenario but was Portland. He was playing on the Oh six Blazers. Before he got hurt he was fourteen and four and a half a game basically but but had an value that he got traded for. Andre Biller when Andre Miller had a lot of value that clippers cavs trade It never totally happened but I just want to say I really enjoyed them. I was rooting for the whole time. And I still haven't totally given up on them. We always talk about the guys we haven't given up on yet. I have no idea why I wanted it to happen so bad. I I thought he had a nice feel for the game like he was a good passer he he did. He had the right instincts he just. He was like a six foot. Ten twenty nine eight six foot nine. I guess I never knew what he was supposed to be. Who is the guy who's the prototype that he was supposed to be following and I don't think he knew it either? Yeah because back then to. We were still doing this. Mcgrady stuff where anybody that was big in handle had a little Bit of vision. It's just a knock. It's almost insulting to McGrady. How many different guys? We thought were like these next tall athletic guys. But I'm I'm with you like I remember being on the East Coast and I had to think for Darius. I mentioned earlier because I don't think he's ever going to Saint John's but I was always paying attention. And that's when you kind of I started your season ticket. Thing too with the clippers right and it was fun it was. It was like wait a minute. This team might not be very good but this could be something that was when I got league pass. I remember watching a lot of them. That one really fun year. It seemed like something was happening with them. Yes yeah and and. He seemed like he had a chance. It's funny I remember when I was preparing for the two thousand thirteen draft watching the Jaanus highlights of him at the Greek. Ymca when you back. When I was six eight thinking that he reminded me. There's biles this is before. He grew in extra three and a half inches when he got here. But same kind of thing. It's like what is this. This is something. It's funny how we just get attracted to those guys like There's something if he can only unlock. But now I look back a miles. Like what would he have unlocked? I don't know the roadmap for him to be an all star but I'm taking this stuff is so hard began. I couldn't. I'm so glad you said that because there's a version of the honest thing where you go. I'm not falling for this again right. There were plenty of teams. That also did like this. Draft was a draft of red heads. And then all the. Gm's were like blondes. From here on out right Jaanus sledge. Say that yacht female either way fifteenth and it seemed like Pretty Fair in fact that seem to maybe two spots early but it was like all right. Yeah roll the dice with the fucking Greek kid. We'll see but at that point and that's folks were doing whatever. Give this one a shot so I like the miles away. Just I'm I'm happy for him too. 'cause we know that it was really rough for him. Yeah and you know. We don't know these guys but I guess I'm with you. I've always kind of a soft spot for him. I love reason and I'm just. I'm happy that it looks like you know he and Q. Getting the PODCAST. Go and all that stuff. I'm just I'm just happy Because you know reading into it's just sad stuff so I'm glad for one One thing that's been lost. I think they did a six episode series of the life where they followed the clippers around. Which I can't believe isn't on Youtube if anyone has this on their VCR whatever like. Please put this on Youtube for America because it was a lot of like behind the scenes with with Quinn rich said a d miles and I remember them just their scenes of them getting gas and shit like that and it was. Just I just want to hang out with these guys like these guys anyway. let's rip through this. Who Do you have it eleven I'M GONNA go? Mopey should have gone higher guy that he went to low is overall analytics holds up. He's like top seven top eight guy and unfortunate for him. I think you know he was always kind of an off ball guy which could leave you out a place back then a little bit too much so you weren't as active. Were now off balls like kind of where you WANNA be. He would have been more productive today but he had a better career. I think then you realize you know a lot of these guys are like. Oh the stuck around. It's easy to forget. Kinda the second half to some of these careers but mopey probably should have gone higher thirty seven percent career. Three point shooter. I have Wow I can't believe he's still here Joel Priscilla I'm grabbing with the twelfth spot here You know eljay was a veteran of the lottery process. Light of the night Joe Bell. Just a veteran played Played Thirteen seasons. Had you know a couple of moments there with Portland in Oh eight. Oh nine range when they were doing the two headed monster thing at center So in Oita o-9 together. He's playing twenty three minutes a game. And averaging almost nine rebounds a game so he's just kind of one of those big white guys kind of knew how to put his hands up and grab a couple of rebounds and could finish a pass in the paint so I'm getting value there with at twelve with Priscilla you could do a lot worse than Joel. Priscilla the rest of the way this. She's a veteran. Who have thirteen another guy that I with on here. Marcus visor. Oh I was always. I was always no. I'm not taking him. I just wanted mentioned Pfizer. All Iowa state guys. It's Kinda like the the Babe Ruth League you want to check the birth certificate there but he was only twenty two and he came in but immediately wasn't gonNA work and then everybody's acquire they taking with brand and what I did love about the Bulls. Remember Jerry Krause his famous line after they broke everything up in nineteen ninety eight which really thinking back on. It is one of the dumbest thing that doesn't get knocked enough for being one of the dumbest thing in the history of modern sports than ninety eight. They said okay. We'll find like we're sick a fill an MJ in this whole thing. And we don't want to be the Celtics that was aligned. Jerry Krause saying we don't WanNa be the Celtics and hang on to these guys and then be a relevant and then have a forever rebuild solicits. Let's do this. They take five or they end up. Trading Brandy get another pick later on in the in the Eddy Curry Tyson Chandler thing and ninety eight when they won their last title one sixty games the next three years they went thirteen and sixty S. They went thirteen and thirty seven. Seventeen and sixty five fifteen in sixty seven. They had one second round appearance in the twelve years after that in one thousand nine hundred and took Pfizer who I liked but he was just too small for power for then not quick enough and all those things he had the ACL tear. He had thirty one tattoos in March of two thousand six. That was the full count there. Also a youth minister Marcus. Fizer started in thirty five games for his career. He was also turned his life around after a tired. Yeah Youth Minister. Yeah I think he was a pretty pretty sketchy as teammate. I think he was one of those One of those guys when he played was kind of like stay away from back and not locked in yeah Early on then turned his life around. I just WanNa talk about five or a little bit. Because that's another whiff I got a I go. We have slept in writing this one. I think I even like doing a little bit. More dueling might be the call here. I'M GONNA go key on dueling okay. It's fair could be could be A ninth man potentially on like a second round playoff team was going to take her off for screens and toughness. I've always had a thing for what? Oh now rob. But I don't think it's fair to take take him over dueling Girotti so still there. I don't want to end up with strowman swift and I'm not taking Pfizer or court Alexander Speed accident well so I think the right pick here is either speedy claxton or not her just because they made plans. But I'm not GONNA do that. I'm GonNa go off the grid. I'm going to surprise people here. A J Guyton. I'm GonNa Take Chris Carrawell. Aminat take Demar Johnson. I see what you're doing there so if you look at his first two years. I can't do that. He was even as even before he had the car accident. He wasn't good. Yeah I'm not doing that I'll take I'll take a speedy claxton then 'cause in all three. He actually played crunch time minutes for a team that won the title when when Parker was still in that light almost like two thousand eight Rondo version. Tony Parker when Either those young point guards. You can't rely on them every finals game and you you kind of have to need that veteran guys that can come in and Kinda right. The ship speedy Claxton was there and his his His Spurs stuff twenty-four Playoff Games as fourteen minutes a game Average five again. That's all I need. He was in the rotation of a finals team. So there you go I I have him. Just a nudge over stroz swift and Jerome Louisa. Couple other names here. Lavar POSTEL WHO? I loved Saint. John's I was kind of like Mark Allen. Me Alan Naturally I remember Khalid Al Mean Played One season. How about the Bulls? After this I did find some bulls articles that were bullish on their future. It's like man. We got Pfizer and Crawford and we got Guidon Jake Vasco and Calill elamine all in on. Well you mentioned the the idiotic bowls rebuild before it actually worked. They just did it for the wrong drafts. 'cause you think about it. The the in ninety nine they got the first pick out and brand two thousand they have the fourth pick in the seventh pick and then in two thousand one they flip brand for a top three pick and they had another top three picks so they ended up. They had five top seven picks in a three year stretch. Other brand they turned into one of those but Just really bad luck tab of fourth pick and a seventh pick in the same draft and not only go over to but it's justifiable that you went over to say it's like you can have worse than that. Yeah you actually. No one should have known. Should you know Yorick who played for The Spurs I always Kinda liked him. He came in the League. I think what he was. Twenty Four Marco. Oh I had a whole couple. Season ticket runs with him because he the first couple of years. I the clippers tickets. He was pretty competent. I actually liked his game too. Yeah he eating on some smaller guys as I would watch in the only thing I have left on this too is historically as you mentioned plenty of times and it's it's clearly thought out how horrible this is historically but I was going to look at the teams that were drafting. Like when you look at the top six teams in this draft. How bad their starting lineups were. Yeah the this. The basketball is even close to being like we know. It's better now and in the depth of stars in the exciting storylines and all this stuff. But it's almost easy to forget. Like where the hell were these teams like. What were they doing the nets now that first year Martin didn't have kid it was Marbury and this actually isn't a terrible five. But it's Steph van Horn Kenyan Kendall Gill. Who was you know at that? Point on the way out Aaron Williams just roll guy. Vancouver's team was SCHRIEF Abdul Rahim Bibi. Dickerson is going to get her othello. Big Country The clippers had a twenty one year old Odem. Jeff mcginness Eric. Pike Hausky Koloa Candy. Megacity was only played like nineteen minutes. A game the bull had Ron Mercer ELT brand or test. Our test wasn't our test then now at all he's twelve game Hoiberg. Bryce drew was getting fucking real minutes all year long. I mean it. The Magic had team McCoy at twenty one. Put up a twenty seven eight and five season but after him it was Daryl Armstrong Grant Hill played. Four Games. Bo Outlaw D Brown Atlanta's lineup was Jason Terry coup coach. Seventeen Games matombo Jim Jackson and Lorenzen Wright these teams. Those are thirty guys that were playing the majority of the minutes for those six games or for those sixteenths. It was a talent soon and it allowed us. It lasts that basically all the way till oh seven or eight range. You can even see it if you go back and you read some of the Trade Value Calms. I did for usually. I'm just laying out. What the assets were in the moment and guys who are like eighteen or twenty or twenty four. It's nuts you can't believe it I think once we hit oh nine two thousand ten range I think things really really flipped. But you also had you know I've written about it a million times about the Too much too fast. Too Soon era from like ninety three through ninety nine of all those young guys who just got too much money too fast and just didn't have the careers that they should've had when you think about the two thousand season dish should have been the peak of Kenny Anderson and big dog Robinson and guys like that some of them made a Derrick Coleman. They're all these blue chip guys. That should have been in their absolute heyday and they just weren't so you're missing like probably nine ten blue shippers that should have been awesome and Vin Baker He's already starting to Peter Shawn Kemp's already basically played his way out of the League and you go on down the line. It's just like what happened but that's probably Start for another podcast but that was also to you. Remember the lockout in people being like. Are you guys kidding me like we started this podcast talked about guy staying in better shape? I would imagine I would give most players the benefit of the doubt of just. Make sure you're ready. There's GonNa be some disappointments. That was the big joke twenty years ago when a lot of these guys came from the lockout they were never the same like Shawn. Kemp physical never the same person show after the lockout. And it's like well you just. You just didn't care but it's that's a great point though. I hadn't really thought of it that way. The too much too soon thing. I know you've written about it but it's just it's just a good reminder of you have these classes that are all supposed to replace each other but then you have this group of incredibly talented guys players. We kinda liked. And you're like what what the Hell's going on here and then you add in this class and I also noticed too when you go back and read some of the stuff how many GM's that were running. Some of the stuff and no one should really be blamed for anything after this kind of class that we just went through but a lot of these guys never got jobs again. I mean bill night at the the Atlanta job when everyone in the world news taking Sheldon Williams Duke Five. And you're like what could you possibly that shook me for a month? I'd go back and watch more and more Sheldon Williams and I'm like how could anyone take this guy? V like there's no way this is real and he took him fifth in there. Are Some guys taken? Picks there that would never be given the job to run a franchise. The way they had twenty years ago will Just give me one movie recommendation. Before we go bombshell liked it. Oh interesting yeah dude seriously. Shelley's they're on Plan Meghan Kelly creepy. Good how good that is. And you know Margo Robbie's Yeah I'm not gonNA change the channel. I didn't like it as much as you'd like behind the scenes. You always were weighed. You've always got out of the office so anything that has to do with like television being on the deal and I was. I was in it every day in the hallways you were above that seed in a few that. I really liked the movie I called never rarely sometimes always which is not the most uplifting movie but I thought it was exceptionally well done and kind of an important movie side recommend that one okay And then Ozark sees a win huge fan. I have Going backwards movie for you. Okay just quickly. I watched election with my daughter today. I fast forward. I knew there's a couple like sex things said I had the remote ready just like to pause and then get through it but How old is she? She's fourteen? She can handle so. I don't WanNa be in the summer with urban stuff's happening but That movie's really fun. Rewire there's certain scenes. Yeah yeah there's a couple but is I was on it. It was never an issue Early Alexander Payne Matthew Broderick had that fund drama. Run there from late nineties. You can count on me the year later early early. Reese Chris Klein just being a doofus before we realized that his only move resigned. Look at this actor. And then say he's not acting. This is just what he's like. It's a really fun. Quirky had seen a while we even did. I think Rewatch ables ninety nine on it. I wasn't on that one But I I I like the Alexander Payne movies. I've watched that. I watched the descendants and I watch sideways during the quarantine in and You know I'm not. I'm not breaking ground by saying that guy's really good but it was just fun to watch all three of in ten days and see the progression I love sideways. Sideways is like one of my favorite movies last fifteen years. So there you go. I saw I saw election. Theater loved it immediately. People thought I was a Weirdo. Because I was really on it and I'd be like you gotTa see his movie election because he's movie election and I'd like a couple of girls you know. Twenty three twenty four. They're like that movie was kind of weird. Mike Do you not see Alec? That's how simple it is perfectly executed. The whole deal is it's great like when the kid who's in the wheelchair gives the speech running for president revised praise. Yeah yeah and it's perfectly like the way he says it and I'm like that's high school. That's being in high school and the whole deal. And then yeah one of the other person like somebody else's giving a speech and like some pimple faced red-headed kids eat me raw reeves in the back and then the guy playing the principles perfect the guy. You know. We're not GONNA do that here. And the Principals. Perfect the whole thing. I love election and sideways is funny because I did not like it when I first saw. It was too young too young to understand how Heavy that movie is it's it's I can watch sideways. Sideways is up there with with very few movies. Watch 'cause I just started up Shawshank I just was going through. WanNa see some scenes question for you tweeted about it. If red and the crew his lunch crew there were close enough to Andy Efrain to get him on roof tarring duty outside couple bottle of suds yet. Where was that crew when the sisters were beaten the hell out of them and we know what else is going on so like? Oh I'm good for tarring but you guys can't help me out with these dudes well read says that. I do believe those were the worst two years for Andy which is being repeatedly raped by sisters which I think I would hope that. Were the worst years but Tarring happened after the sisters had gotten kinda tired or Andy at that point but I think the friendships with those other guys. Kinda deepened. A little bit later but still rigged as the they still rigged it so he got picked. So there's a scene. It goes right from that to write to that. I so basically what I found is probably one of the greatest moves of our lifetime. So I'm just there's a lot of problems I don't want to say that because his family now it's one of obviously one of my favorite movies ever but you could really if you're going to really start nitpicking. You could do that movie. Yeah I still don't know how he knew which way to turn in the sewage pipe because laughed because I think the Grade Yeah I. I don't think you've worked construction enough. I think of Andy. I think you could just you people can. I can tell if something's level just by looking at it just years on the site. What he's doing is he's going. I need a certain grade because this is a pipe. That's dispensing outwards. He probably just felt the level. I think I would screwed that up and gone left and then like how fuck. Where is this where exit throw up again? Russillo stay safe will see in a week and And I don't know what I don't know what the next redraft ables with us is going to be but it we might end up having to do all three at some point may maybe but at some point all right. I'll We can listen to your podcast as well which you'll be doing at least one of this week. Nfl draft is coming. It'd be the last like real sports. Were probably going to have her fur wet but anyway Good senior talk to our. Thanks man. All right thanks to world central kitchen. Don't forget to go to W. C. K. Dot Org and if you have the means give we can help out check out. What they're doing. Maybe you will get into it and want to give something thanks to what we do in the shadows. The dramatic return of the fx original comedy. The Hollywood reporter called the series first season ridiculous funny and warned that you will die laughing. This season shadows continues to follow four favourite vampires who've been limited hundreds of years premieres Wednesday April fifteenth. Nfl streaming next fx on Hulu. And if you missed season one catch up now on what we do in the shadows on fx on Hulu. Stay safe out there. Listening doctors listened to the scientists. We'll have more later in the week. One more redraft on the book of Basketballs Padres in two thousand one and Zach Lowe and then to Rewatch ables total recall. Come in Monday night. An enemy of the state meek stay safe. Listen to experts. See the wayside.

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Ep 25: Hollinger & Ford 2020 Draft Prep

Chad Ford's NBA Big Board

1:01:27 hr | Last month

Ep 25: Hollinger & Ford 2020 Draft Prep

"It's the lot on podcast network. Team, every day. Aloha. You are listening to Chad Ford's NBA big board of the locked on podcast network. Today's episode is brought to you by built BAR GO TO BILL BAR DOT COM and use Promo code locked on and you'll get twenty percents off your next order. My guest today and Longtime Co host John. Hollinger from the athletic is back with US John. It's been several months but it's good to be talking to you again about the two thousand twenty NBA draft. Yeah. It's good to be back in. We're finally closing in on the big day here after a six months of hype with no game. So this'll be nice. You know For so long we were talking about this, we had no idea. win. This was actually going to happen. and. Really you know back when you and I were talking it was still just really unclear. What was GONNA happen the League. But we've had a successful bubble. We had a successful NBA finals. Things seem fairly back to normal in some ways with the NBA. That certainly, the draft evaluation process has changed pretty dramatically for teams in the the rules that the League has has put teams as far as how they can evaluate prospects bringing them and to the jam and as a longtime MBA. EXAC who went through that process, right? That pre-draft process I with the grizzlies for years how much do you think this affects NBA teams what the League is limiting teams on doing right now? Well. To me, it actually subtracts some of the rash decisions that I think took teams down the wrong path a little bit. We've had a lot of discussions I know in the past chat about whether team should do workouts at all whether the whether the recency bias of the workout was so strong that it basically overwhelmed your decision making process to such an extent that that did you more harm than good? The the one thing that teams are going to get. It looks like is the measurement data that they would normally get from the combine, which was the biggest thing they probably wonder about. Heights weights wingspan spans those types of things. We always like to Redo those with the prospects that we brought into our own Jim. And just make sure especially there was sometimes. Measurements that are maybe a little suspicious. You know the guys did the old trick where they would short arm the standing reach so that their vertical look bigger you know a couple of little tricks that there were one or two guys. Maybe we had certain questions about that are trainers do specific. Drills or measurements with but by by and large, I think not having the workouts might make the draft better I'm with you. It's interesting to hear the NBA. And Scouts I've talking to complaining about this but it seems like again that we'd have to do some sort of empirical study on this. I'm not sure it's ever been done whether though that draft process in the end actually hurt. At teams more than more than help them. Now, of course we have we have the added problem this year, which is that they didn't get a full scouting season in I'm as well know NC double a ton of it. You know, for example, though I think you and I have talked about that in the past as well as sometimes being problematic for MBA, teams to and overvaluing. Yeah especially because that tends to be when peripheral decision makers let's say. Say. Owners and head coaches especially get more involved in the in the process and maybe. Come you know come to a decision based on a small sample that is not representative of the players overall season I think for most scouting department's their feelings. Almost they're done by the time. The NCAA tournament starts you know. Sure there watch the Games if they're on, but a lot of people are. Focused on Europe by that point actually And the conference tournaments are really kind of the end of the scouting season cycle I. Do I do think that a lot of? a lot of teams are disappointed. They didn't get that one final look at a player in a conference tournament or. You know where you can. You can see so many players obviously the conference tournaments it's really great. One Stop shopping from his scouting perspective. So a lot of teams will feel like they fell a little short scouting wise because of that, they just didn't have their full conference tournament season. This would only affect a few teams who had. A top pick but how much does it affect the team like Minnesota or Golden? State that they don't get Lamelo ball in for example or James Wiseman where you had a much more limited a window to scout those players than you did a college player that played all season. Usually, this is maybe when that time would have been more valuable I know that can bring someone in and it's not like Lamelo or James Wiseman was going to be. Playing against someone else in any of these workouts. But do you think it affects that process at all may maybe a little bit I mean what the Wiseman thing took people by surprise. So I'm not sure everyone got eyes on him. So I think they got hurt with that Lamelo most of the teams I think were aware that they needed to hustle and Australia if they want to get eyes on them because he probably wouldn't play a full season. where it could hurt a team like golden state is that they didn't necessarily think at the beginning of the year that they need to make needed to make plans to sea level mellow. Bond Australia? They thought they were GonNa Win Fifty eight right. So we if you're a surprise bad team I think maybe it has. Maybe hurt you hurt you more what happened there. I'm not sure where Minnesota falls on that continuum but. They were initiating a new front office at the same time. So maybe you know. Getting getting there, guys down there to see to see Lamelo might not been on the top of their list either. So it's an interesting scout for both those teams. Thank. The other thing we're going to find is that a couple of players were able like, Danny Omnia the come back and play and maybe we're going to see a reecey bias with him a shooting up a number of of board because he was like the only only player that you could see play and he plays you know eight games in the Israeli League which is a pretty limited sample size plays really well, we'll talk about him. In a minute, but he had one of the rare advantages of being one of the few players that actually could go out and play five on five basketball in a competitive setting and scouts focus on him. WHAT'S THE What's the situation with the medicals because I know actually? You know we talked about measurements but I think the biggest takeaway from the pre-draft camp and everything is obviously having those physicals and getting that information and I know teams often like to have their team doctors there as well, and they like to do their own their own workup on these players. How much do you think that's going to be impacted by the protocols the putting in place to get teams though the medical information I do think that process will definitely be affected I wonder I mean I go back and look at previous drafts I think. What happened with Greg? Oden. Scared the crap out a lot of teams in subsequent drafts and you go back and look and teams were probably too conservative with medical cases. And so you almost wonder if if the opposite situation exists where. As sort of as with draft workouts whereas something that had been causing teams to make worse decisions is now removed from play. I've wondered about that at least there does seem to be. It's interesting because I think as human beings we want as much information as possible even though I think the research shows that sometimes there can be too much information right in can actually it could actually cause us problems but I think the instinct when you're making huge multimillion dollar franchise altering decisions I want as much information as possible and it's really interesting to see how skittish NBA teams are. Right, now about this draft, even though in one aspect because teams were shut down for so long, they've probably had more time to actually focus on tape. And have discussions about the straffed and to think deeply about what they're going to do with the draft. Background calls to which right part of it. Yeah. Right. Because the NBA season so compressed typically that you know you're talking finals and a week later you've got the draft and for teams that are in the playoff hunt there isn't a lot of time to do it, and also you have to be thinking about free agency as well and all that timeline is really all smashed together. The fact that it's it's it's expanded out a little bit for the NBA this season actually think it means that you have more time to think about this deliberate about at your coaching staff clearly has more time if you want them involved. That's double. Edged Sword there. Right. But they normally just don't even have the time right to really focus on that when they're when they're planning for games and I think some of the critique about getting coaches involved is that they haven't dug deeply into these players right and so it's more a superficial perception that they're going to have about particular players I with a lot of teams that are coaching staff has gotten a lot more involved. They typically would just because they have the bandwidth to do it and do you think that. Do, you think the coaches voice matters more when they actually have the time to do the homework. It's tough because. You can't. You can't deny the things that they're going to see as coaches, but the perspective is so much more short-term driven on the coaching side. which you can hardly blame them given the life expectancy of coaches in this league right. But I think I think that can influence bad decision making a lot of times. That was really interesting. I re watched moneyball this week I'm just randomly was on net flicks I. I needed something to do and you know. Talking About Baseball and Billy, bean in the Oakland A.'s. But really the start of using statistics advanced statistics in baseball with a team that went all in on that and the conversations that he has I with art how the manager to the point that he has to make some radical trades midseason including trading away a player who was probably going to be an all star because he wanted to play a guy who was a catcher his whole life At first base who didn't really know how to play first base solely on the premise that he gets on base more right and I it's. It's really I think it's really interesting still in the NBA and you see you know Daryl Morey I've been let go by the rockets. How much they're still is a lot of differences in front offices about how you evaluate talent how you put together a team. What really matters does it matter and then it reflects back into these conversations about the draft because your philosophy about how you're going to play and what and what your team's about also is reflected in what you value in the draft. Yeah and. I've always felt like though at the end of the day, it's talent grab and if I if I can get talent, you can do trades and you can do other things around adopt demise your team but. If you re regardless of position or style or whatever. If you get somebody who's just not that good like you you you've wasted your draft in some ways 'cause. I. Mean because you can get minimum guys or whatever just be back into your rotation players you don't need to draft that necessarily. All right, John Well. Let's dive into our big boards. I just released on. Friday. My Big Board two point. Oh, which was updated after talking to a number of NBA team scouts I know you've been doing your own analysis all along I'm interesting. How much of things changed since we've talked last time because you you don't have. A lot of extra data to input into into your system now, but I know that that's not all you do putting together you know your your big board at have you seen a lot of chain your borders it pretty much stayed the same for you. It's pretty much the same although I want to see where some of these measurements come in like I'm interested to see how tall tyrel terry measured. There's word out there that he's supposedly six three now which I think that that does change evaluation of him a little bit and he's put on twenty twenty plus pounds, right? Yeah. I mean putting on the pounds. You know. Whatever guys fill out as they get older sometimes you guys put on too much too soon it's it can be. It doesn't work out quite as well as people might hope so. That probably that probably wouldn't sway me too much. But actually physically being taller like that isn't fixable right so that that that that that to me would be something to push him up. So I'm interested in some of the measurements that they get on these guys know shoe height wingspan. Standing Vertical I think is the other one. That's kind of interesting. To look at but basically just you know the the physical factor of just how tall are you and how long your arms like Those are the ones I'm really interested in because those are the. Ones that aren't changeable. And of those two John. Wingspan standing reach or just taking straight. Hi, I'm assuming it's the it's the standing reach and the wingspan that that probably matters a little bit more someone six three with a six eight wing or they're six four with a six four wing The. That seems like you go with a six, three, six, eight wing as as being a bigger player. You would think that right because you don't block shots at the top of your head but. We've. Actually, found. That they all sort of matter and there's So It's With, what's Word I'm looking for? There's but multicolored. Like they're all correlated with each other, very, highly right but. That it sort of depended positionally, which one was the most valuable of the three. So that, there wasn't one across the board answer actually. But you're you know 'cause actually you're you're just your overall height does matter because that's your eye level basically. To see the basket or to see place. So that actually does matter some too. If you think about it and then obviously you're you're wingspan. Matters for the amount of. Horizontal Room you can cover and the standing reach for the amount of vertical room you can cover. So they they they all kind of factor in. Hand size I know the NBA majors hand size of found. Any real correlation on enhance is now no I actually wish they still did the bench press because that is negatively correlated. In other words. Yeah. Yeah. Remember when Kevin Durant I, think could like. Zero zero right and everybody. Panicked for a minute and boy, what a what a waste of time that was Sheldon Williams zillion right hand size doesn't really matter. Not I mean it probably does matter but there are other factors that are much more addictive how good you are at basketball so like once you have those, you don't need hand size what about the what about the speed, the Dash, the lateral, the lateral speed test in anything there that really correlates for you. This shuttle is so technique driven than I. Think it's kind of worthless. The the sprint actually. I kind of like to look at that for for guards especially small guards you. You SORTA like if somebody's five eleven and doesn't run fast sprint, you're Kinda like, yeah I don't know if this is GonNa work you know. But the guy, the guys who can really fly in the sprint. At the point guard spot especially, there is some correlation there. Every team has their own techniques about what they're gonNA do when they bring a player in and you know some some players you're going to be able to get the play against other players. Some players agents will insist that they're only going to do you know the essentially one on none workout one thing I, think probably pretty uniformly that teams do at some sort. Of shooting drills they're going to sort of look at shots and put them in various positions. I'm sheet the basketball have you ever seen any real correlation with a a a player shooting drills on a particular day It seems like it seems like this is another one of those double edged swords right I bring somebody in if they shoot the lights out that day, which is a pretty small sample size, right because players can get hot. I I'm predisposed to say especially, if the shooting problems maybe they've been working on their shot at, you know it's really dropping here if they have a terrible day. And nothing goes in which even happens for the best of shooters. From. Time Steph Curry has games where he's one for nine from three. Predisposed at that point start to question things I wonder why you even do it right like why in a in a drill setting other than maybe you want to look at shooting for him but I still think I would prefer to look at shooting form in a game setting than a drill setting. We always liked to have. We shooting coach that we would have look at them and just kind of give us an evaluation of like. What what is what do you think of this technique is it is it broken is Not Great but fixable is it really good ju just kind of you know where is he on the scale? You know obviously a lot of people can see what the eye test like Hey, this guy's pretty good shooter. But There's there are some cases where maybe it's not totally not as clear and so getting that input is helpful. The other thing I really liked it for, is that some of these college bigs just go just never take jump shot. And so you have four jump shots the entire season on tape well, then if they come in and shoot a hundred in your Jim. You have twenty five times as much information as you did so. From that perspective, I think it's good but you're right for a lot of these college guards have. Hundred you can see tape them shooting one hundred, three's over the course of their career like, okay the. What they did in your Jim, you can kind of devalue because of that. Anything to this idea because often the NBA three point line is further away I, I know in the college game anymore, some some some guards are pulling up. Well, you know well beyond that anyway, and we're able to see You know that that shooting range. Anything to. Looking at how they're shooting from NBA three because maybe there isn't a big sample size in college and how big of a how big of a shift is that for college players from the college line to the NBA going back I think we've all overrated that because the guys that I thought were going to maybe have that were like good college shooters. I wondered. Okay. It looks like a little bit of a strain is he going to be able to do the same thing that they all are fine i. it seems like the one thing that really correlates again and you've talked so much about this is how they should free throws is probably going to be the best predictor for how they're gonNA shoot NBA threes. More than more than anything else that you might do an Jim on a given day. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely, and usually you have a ton of information on that. If there are good college player, they're probably getting in the line of Bunch. Well, if you're listening and and your draft fan in your, you're panicked a little bit about what your team is enabled to do a hopefully we've dispelled You know some of that anxiety about you know how much this is really going to impact NBA evaluation and I tend to I, think this is a great experiment in some ways this year you know taking away some of those tools whether it might actually interestingly be helpful. Let's dive into our big boards. And all I. I'm GonNa Give my top five and then I. Want to hear your top five and then let's discuss that for a minute. So I've got mellow ball. Wiseman to Anthony Edwards three tires Halliburton. Four Killian Hayes Five, and again, this is not predicting where they will go with a particular team. This isn't a mock draft. This is just over all talent. This was an aggregate talking to NBA teams and scouts about where they had particular players ranked and I will just add there was a lot of variability here as well and so. Guys are all over the place on NBC boards. There's not what I would call at like a major consensus like there was last year with Zion Job Mirant. What do you got for your top five right now? So I lamelo ball number one. I have. Anthony. Edwards second. Killian Hayes third. On Yucca Akon fourth and OBI top and fifths. Okay. So. Let's We both have Lamelo ball one you still confident. He's the best player in this draft is, are you do you have him clearly number one or is it close for you for me? For me it was closed just because there. There wasn't like one Supernova talent and this that there's no Anthony Davis in this draft, right? I do think Lamelo balls ceilings pretty clearly higher than than some of the other players in this draft as like a big guard who rebounds can push the ball can make all the passes like there's there's a lot there to build on. So I do think he's the most. Talented player so to say so To me, he's fairly clearly number one although I could see it like I could see a case for Edwards I could even maybe see a case for Hayes but for me, it's Lamelo ball interesting Killian, Hayes. GotTa give Kevin O'Connor a shoutout for the ringer who early on in the season put him number one on on his big board which I think a lot of people thought was really strange. But. It's really interesting. The more that I've