4 Episode results for "Shannon Daniel"
From Suicidal to Saving Others with Ben Gomes
"Please silence. Your cell phones, hold all sidebar conversations to a minimum, and we're going to get started with between the slides in three two. Thank you for coming back. Wanna give everybody heads up disaster. So can be pretty heavy be talking about suicide among public safety in other areas, but wanna let it running out front on that subject wouldn't be retouching on is, is pretty serious. So we will have some great resources for folks. If you're in Christ now on certainly get a little Kalsa body, and we're gonna pry resources for you, and any of us to be able to help each other, so who are some statistics, unfortunately, pretty grim statistics, and that we're going to get into my guests, who has has some interesting perspective in this, and we'll get into why that is, as we go to the episode when she had firing fire EMS workers have in eighteen to one hundred thousand suicide rate. Police officers have an eleven to seventeen to one hundred thousand suicide rate, the general populace of the United States, as thirteen to one hundred thousand. Suicide rate in two thousand seventeen one hundred and forty police officers committed suicide compared to one hundred twenty nine there were killed in a lot of duty in two thousand seventeen at least one hundred and three fire fighters, for EMS workers committed suicide compared to ninety three who died in the line of duty this data shows didn't twenty seventeen police officers and firefighters are EMS workers were more likely to die by suicide. And in the line of duty. That sending was part of a ruderman white paper, on mental health and suicide of first responders from April two thousand eighteen with dated provided by agit life for police data and fired into coming from firefighter behavioral health alliance versus honors. Meaning police fire EMS. And in this case will also talk about nine one communicators are exposed to horrible experiences on a daily basis. Sometimes many times in a single day today on the show between this leads episode twenty nine from. Suicidal to saving others is then goes, he's inexperienced down one communicator for slaughter now his professional firefighter, who was true. I refund for many years, the one who took the calls initially that sent out there. He faces owns demons darkness related to suicide than welcome to the show. Thank you for being here. Good man. Thank you for having me. My first podcast pretty excited mine, too. That I guess reserved yet it's pretty neat really appreciated. Look forward to provide folks value on this now. We know pretty serious topic in general, but also from circles were around or in a benefactor directly in, you know, a lot more about that. We'll get into as far as how we can help things. But let's let us know about you. So where are you from? How'd you worry now man? So a generally, I'm from Richmond, Virginia grew up in Henrico county grew up in a little part of Henrico called lake suds just north of the city. Grew up there on my life volunteered for the local rescue squad because that's what my dad did. That's the only thing I really knew what to do. And I only really live a couple miles from where I grew up now live over near Richmond international raceway if there's any NASCAR fans, they know where that is. Still living in the same county. I love it excited about what I do now for everybody in public safety. It's awesome in so how did you end up a we first met as we were both richer nameless? You've been there. Good. I got dinner as the planning captain. I'm Scott to do my incident management thing touch the streets a little bit. I know you know, mostly administrative guys I tried my best not to call you radio whenever you're on that was out there. So if I did, I apologize, but how did you end up there, what to so you volunteering? So you were at where at lakeside, on rescues at revolt here. I was I actually started as an explorer in the county when I was in high school got introduced to the law enforcement side ends did that explore route in realized I wanna to do the fire stuff because seemed a lot cooler? Did that started volunteering for lakeside of back in? Two thousand four two thousand five rain there for a while worked, I've done, private done public EMS fire, I've been around from how I got into Richmond. I worked for a private transport company for a couple of years and just just applied to Richmond to see what, what would happen to see if I could get the job as a communications officer. You did. Nice did. Yeah. Somehow it. Nice. So when you when you got hired did you have training already or did you go through a training program when you got there? Nope. I hadn't really zero communications experience. I worked work part-time for kings dominion for a couple years for their fire EMS department, kind of dabbled with some radio traffic when we would help them out, but nothing major applied got on in a lot of the training. There is strictly on the job most communication center. You go through an academy for a couple of months, and then you're put on to the floor with somebody in, in your training. Excuse me. There you're, you're strictly put on the floor from day one. You learn how they do things how their system is different in their system is different. If you're interested in checking that out. Controlling that system role in the term that I disliked the most. So they do national kademi of -mergency medical dispatches, the three day course you learn all of the card sets that they use the reason they asked the questions that they do in its strict you have to ask the question word by word. You can't deviate that's not the rules. Did that training did my on the floor training probably took I came in October of twenty ten? When I got hired there. And then I was released probably by January twenty eleven so about three months. And you were in the we are in the calm center exclusively or journal ritzy doubt. Nope. I was exclusively in the consonant tried to break free a number of tons, but that just never worked out on. And that's where I was for seven years, seven years while. And so then you transitions FOX rider with help all the city of hope ball, fire department, correct. I went from basically long story short. I went from Richmond to the city of hope while further fire department again, a dabbled in a lot of different things. I'm I'm one of those people that likes to get my hands on different aspects of the job volunteered for Hanover, fire EMS at station six for two or three years. Got my fire stuff and then hope while it was the department. Pick me up. I went through a bunch of application processes for everywhere in the central Virginia area in they were the ones that pick me up in. That's who got me nice also ever alone. So. Great department out there. Love of those other Levin. So you had than fire one or two has met opposite Ivanka good stuff. So did you have to do an academy when he got the while or was it kind of like a lateral kind of thing we are, are qualified? So I hope well, we're, we're a very small department where the city is eleven square miles in some change. We have twenty to twenty five thousand people in the city on a good day. That's just residents in than we have a staff of new more than sixty people. We have each shift has about seventeen max with two or three off during the day. So we run a very minimal department with two stations to engine companies to medics of Quinn of Italian chief in, we make do with what we have. And then. So when I got picked up we did like. Two and a half week. We did we get seven people that came on of one of their biggest hires. Because they had extra slots, basically granted by the city to add staff into it. So they had seven people come on. We did all training in house for two and a half weeks in that we went out to do shift work. And so since you already had experience on the street and on the calm side of it, then was, it was not an easy 'cause, you know, it's not an easy gig, obviously. But the transition wasn't our imagine a stark as if you'd never been on the street. Did you find that or no it, it wasn't too bad? One of my things was when I was working in communications as I always worked field job, e either part time or volunteering or something, because one, I didn't want to lose my patient care skills. That's a big thing 'cause sitting in a seat, you're just gonna lose that. And then. Always wanted to better myself in actually funny story is worked for medical transport for part-time in one, they're non one contracts was the rescue squad in Hopewell. So I, I knew a little bit about Hopewell for about three years, almost in work down there. So that kind of probably gave me on it's nice eater. That's one thing and you know, this is that I would say the non emergent when, in oaks really wants to get him to go and do the high-speed staff. But one thing, our cell phones is the non emergent is region can really, really hone your people. Skills assessment for sure. Like, if you're not taking advantage of doing thorough, thorough segment, when you know it's not getting crazy, so to speak. But that was always a challenge, because everyone wants the big sexy traumas or whatever tell CNN actually get one. I go. The thought DVD more but yeah, that's, that's a good experience. So and you've been there how long now on hip all I'll be there two years in July. So couple of weeks actually, probably two weeks from what we're recording. Now. Will be two years. I love it. I'm on forum. I'll be there while. Yeah. Right. On have been there quite a few times, working with Ben our emergency management saga. So only cool that. Yeah. Good guy. And you guys have the now Connick I think it's been on quite a few places de Saint the flag with the fire behind it, that rasonable. What was that a BMW or something similar w that was, it was a hotel loose. Lodge is the order of the Meuse believe it is that was actually my shift night and the iconic moose lodge fire that we actually are our fire department chief say flag with another guy to be Sabilo. We, we, we got dispatched for smoke coming from the structure got there. The second are the first engine marked on scene with smoke coming from the building. We got there after them in started walking around in the fire just came through the roof in it. It just went off in the, the moose lodge flag. Apparently burned up this all happen. I was on the rear of the structure and they were on the front the moose lodge flag burned up because all the heat. And then chief hunter said, we're going go get that flag down, and he ran up TIMMY, Beulah who was on the first engineer, he ran up in Sistan system. And they pulled that down than they pulled the state flag, which everybody was wondering what have been with that. But both lives got brought down the moose lodge is going to incorporate that into something when they build a new one, and I actually ran that flag for Brad Clark's titled tower race. We took that out. And then we ran that on the course also for him. Well, that's awesome stinks. Awesome good. Get on in. That was was that funnel zone, your Instagram or your Facebook than federal that fire or who captured that was the media. I believe the fire marshal cop the video in what it is. It's really it's a screen shot of the video. I believe. But somehow, it's just right that it makes it looks good. Right. That's awesome. Yeah. I didn't speak in abroad minimum few times, he did that whether it's through five classes on talked about it when I went over that ISIS three hundred relapse odes and did known as well as maybe your other folks. But every single description, or the, you know, the hand sickness would be like, okay, you didn't need it. See him that often to pick up automatically like that was that was wild in working where work now the system Hannah chance to at least try and you know how when folks were there peeling entertainment with there. So. That was that was definitely toxin. So everybody slick move over in slowdown gonna throw that through that in there for now. So let's let's get into it. So being exposed like we talked about the numbers for folks. In hoping, safety, they're horrible. 'cause you see horrible things all the time, or hear that more can't see them, but hear them in, in, in the case, you know, Vienna communications, which is just super hard to when was it when, in some kind of your store was when you were in communications that you started, having some was like PT ass, or just kind of depression, are mix of that are kind of what, what started happening. How did you kind of start feeling it? I guess as say we just get into this just do the story, a big thing in out, give a little heads up. P T S and. P. T. S. D P, T S's, post traumatic stress. So that's, that's any stressors that you have from an event. That don't lax basically more than thirty days. If you have structures over any kind of motion feelings after thirty days in prolonged, then it becomes a disorder, basically. And that's the difference between those two a, a lot of people get kinda confused on that or wonder what the differences. So. My story, I started advertisement in October twenty ten like a said, went through the training got cleared in January in September seventeenth of twenty eleven. We answered a phone call in the early morning hours for a male that had for a male that shot himself in the parking lot, and it came in as a gas station at came in as the corner of Malvern in broad in a little confused about that is, it's right on the county and city line for Richmond in Henrico. So we were trying to figure out if it was our call. If it was rank goes, call long story short. We figure that out. We only received one nine one one call for and the girl that sat next to me on night shift picked it up. I Islas did because we had actually had a similar case, maybe a week or two before that in about how to quote unquote code the call which in national cab may terms is to figure out how to assign at the right nature problem. Anyways, listening in on the phone call. This lady identifies her as a paramedic in one of the co workers has shot himself in the parking lot of. The ambulance company that they work for come to find out, I worked part time for medical transport in that is the corner where medical transports Richmond base was and. So I knew who was calling it in a recognize the voice and just sitting there remembering listening to that call. That's just Har hard enough fast forward a couple of hours the supervisor comes back or let's rewind. We sent crews out they staged waited for police to clear the scene because unfortunately, the county and city line actually runs through that parking lot. Anyways, crews went went out confirmed a male died in, I gave a radio Tommasi or four fifty five that's the time that we always have to give or there is a time that we always have to give for death. The supervisor came back a little while later was explaining it. He said the a, a male and female had come back from going out the night before they had argument in the parking lot. They were boyfriend girlfriend. She was trying to leave in. He said. He said that he had said, don't leave him at shoot myself don't leave, don't leave. And unfortunately the gun went off. Him explaining that to me identifying that it was boyfriend girlfriend, they left the car there. I instantly knew. New new, the male knew who shot himself in that was Jameson gray Powell. J F Jamie for short. Jamie was one of my friends who we went to high school together. He was a year behind me. He also volunteered for Henrico volunteer. Rescue squad in the same county that Ivonne tier for an I just worked part time with him on enabling probably a week or two before this incident. So that really that debt struck home in believe, once I found all that out, I've got up a left my console in walked outside tried to call a number of friends, of course, this is five in the morning. Nobody is picking their phone up. And I finally called my wife, who was working night shift at the hospitals in just laid out what happened and out like just a Hayes, just a haze of everything just going on went home didn't sleep the whole day. People were texting me people knew that knew where Wirt people knew I knew him. In dated. Yeah. Yeah. I would like to take a moment in say this also in this is for his mom, who I'm very close with not all the ways. But when she needs me or on need her for something, especially for the, the situation hold off on your Facebook posts. Hold on for changing pictures. There's a number of people who are for this now. Hold off on all of that, because a lot of the instance that we've had lately are also spouts his are finding out beforehand before notification. And unfortunately that's how his family found out man. It was not even like two hours afterwards people were posted, south tagging just just hold off hold off a day or two it's not necessary. We were all grieving in some some aspect, but there is a small community of us that are very against that in we tried to watch out for people because. We are such a tight close group that we do find out details before the news finds out, but that it also you don't know who's been notified. So hold off on that. So went to a debriefing pre sure Odessa had had followed that up or set it up, sees me. Quote, undeviating mess. Lawrence three. Yeah. Quote unquote, debriefing because none of us in that room were associated with the instant per se in that, that was okay was more just agreement kind of thing. And then went back to work went back immediately back to the same console back to work to do the same job for twelve hours runaway same day. You mean right away shakes Klay same day. So thirty six hours a week. And then I'll rewind real quick. I will give a shout out to mind, supervisor at the time he did ask if I was ok in gave him the usual bullshit answer. I hate to say that I don't know if it if that's allowed, but the bullshit Ansari of your I'm fine. I'm cool. We could change writing uploaded yet put that big e. But I mean that's what that's what I. Due to say, I knew to tell people, you know, hey, I'm fine. It's, it's cool. I'll take care of it. Yeah. So. We'll skip about five years sitting in the same console same room was on night. Shift for a number of beer, switch today's because of family and just other things. It's hard. Remember when I worked nights for a number of days, if not a couple of weeks after I would always look at the clock in the morning, and it was always ear for fifty five in was the strangest thing on I was like, man. This is weird in then that was probably my biggest stressor, there were other things that lead onto it. And I mean you add on top of being a communications officer, we only are only expected our life. Expectancy of on the job is only two years before you up and quit, and go somewhere else to figure something out so be thinking about have been there seven years. I was either doing something right? Or I was doing something wrong again. It's two years before you're out of it in your done with it. Entirely for the most part. Yeah. Is, is two years. That's why a lot of places have high turnover rates for their nine one, one communications, officers end people don't think that. I always acquitted, especially when, when I worked at Richmond, we were one of the few centers where you actually had to be able to do everything when I say everything you had to be able to dispatch a call women came in Sindh into the right appropriate truck you had to feel that nine one one call. You had to talk to that caller figure out what was going on in the new also had to keep your radio up to date with whatever crews were saying in you had to talk to two different people in also multitask. Like nobody's business in. I always kind of acquainted to playing a video game in. It's sad to put it kind of in that term. But that's what it was. But unfortunately, it was with somebody's life. One of the most rewarding things have done, but one of stressful things, and we go into about twenty sixteen twenty sixteen a hard year. I'm in account center for trooper Mars line of duty death at the greyhound bus station. That was March thirty first of twenty sixteen and I had just taken a break right before that gave my radio to somebody else. I was running a primary. So I was dispatching all the trucks for the city that day that, that was my job went outside took a break came back in, in not even three minutes into the incident on walking onto the floor in the girl is like you need to come take this radio right now. I do not want it. And I was like, what is going on? It can't be that bad. I just stepped out. Sit down scroll through their notes for the bus station on Mike. Why are we sending so many trucks to the bus station? And I read it as the trooper shot trooper down multiple other people down. And I was like, oh my God. Like, what are we doing today? And then the worst part to add, even a personal effect to this is two weeks before that me and my white miscarried. In, I should not have I should have never been at work. We debated about taking time off, but unfortunately, we both work, I work public safety. She works in the healthcare field in. There's no time to take off so unfortunately it we, we grieved with what we could with the time and I was back at work, and then trooper Jeremiah's line of duty death hit, and I was done. I held my radio for that happened in the afternoon sometime like noon, maybe even the alot earlier in the day, and I held my radio until six PM until night shift came in nightshift came in earlier. So it might have been before that. But the supervisor for nights was like you need to go home, now, it's like no, no on again. And she was like, no, like go home. We'll take care of your time. So that was I appreciated that, and even another shot up to Jamie's mom. Jamie's mom found out. We were talking about everything that happened before that line of duty death. And she was like, hey. Here's my address for my beach, house, down in the Outer Banks, you and your family just take a couple of days. Go get away. And that's what we did. We Friday, Saturday, Sunday. We we ducked out, nobody knew in. We just took some time for ourselves. So big shout out to her for that. Twenty sixteen also a big year. Not only that instant for trooper, Derm ours, line of duty death. But I had some, some problems with my supervisor that I worked for at Richmond in this is nothing against Richmond, aimless authority. This is nothing to get them. But there were things that I just did not agree on, and I started questioning Colin out on certain situations certain issues. And then I felt like the it was having a potential negative effect on me in what they knew that one of my goals was to get back into the. Field either at Richmond or somewhere else. So I was in the I was in Hanover, volunteer fire academy at the time for the year twenty sixteen in we were, we were finishing up in December twenty sixteen. And just one day during December. I woke up I started plot suicide start planning at out. I have the means I can figure out a way to just go and be begun. And nobody finds me until whoever finds me later on. But I knew that, that wasn't the way already have one friend that close that has killed him himself. I've a family. I'm not I'm doing one of the best careers in the world. There's no reason for this. There's, there's a reason why feel this way. And I reached out to Shannon Daniel Richmond, Abiola authorities. She was a close friend, and I believe I've told her this, but I, I actually tried to step in numerous times to her office before, but she was always busy, or something was going on in our will this is just not the day for it. And Finally, I, I stepped into her office in said, hey, I shut the door. I said, hey, I'm having some dark beans. I don't know where I am, but I want to potentially in my life. And she made sure that I was safe that it wasn't going to act on anything in got me to a psychologist at VCU that offered her services for us for anytime that they needed went in software. It was about a week or which is normal, the sad part of mental health is, there's no quick getting into see somebody so. When saw her she was like you definitely have BT ST. There's no doubt about it in she, she put me through a therapy called short its EM DR. It's I'm movement desensitization reprocessing in. That's a lot of words in really if you Google it, it is the most hippie thing. They wave a hand or a light in front of your eyes, and what it is PTSD is if we really want a devil into this even more. PTSD is your brain is basically not processed. Everything in, you have gone through the seven steps of grieving there, seven steps, or processes to grieving invented. It doesn't have to be a work related vinegar, be a death of a loved one. It could be anything, but you probably has to process that, and AMD are helps you focus on that event at you're having trouble with. And you actually go through the steps of processing grieving in your mind is, it's almost like a control all delete. But you still you still have that feeling still have that situation in your mind, but you handle it a lot better. That makes sense. Is it something about the light in the movements that just hits different? Parts of the brand are also affected by the tremendous experiences. It's the lying in the hate or the light, or the hand. It depends on the person who does it, it, it doesn't have anything to do with the event that traumatic event or anything, it's in, if somebody will call me out, if I'm wrong, it is your brain has something to focus on. But your brain is also able to rejoin that memory in actually go through it. It's emotions that it needs to do. That's why sleep is such a big part of. Of our downtime. But we work in a job where our sleep is interrupted your sleep. Every day is part of a process that your brain goes through to actually go through all the events that you encountered. That day processes it in puts it away. But with us, we don't always get into a cycle of sleep where we can get our brain to do that. We're always at a a heightened. Yeah. Yeah. Always ready to go. So our body can't believe relax. So our brain holds onto that stuff can't process it. It makes sense to the it forces, you or allows you forces candidate that allows you to process, the event when you didn't when you suppress it when you went passing near get it back to duty. And so one is that like dancing to the to the psychiatrist or psychologist said? Of the tip. The difference one tribes in one dozen. But essentially, they help you process, he ever went ethic. We did like two or three days of that. And you like your first set your first session, you fill out a sheet of how you feel about whatever traumatic event that you're going through, then at the end of therapy, you fill out the same sheet at your answers to see if it's helping or not. And in my case, it was helping so to you reach out to trusted colleague very much. So, so for those of us were raided, say's public safety agencies government agencies or just about any really there's EA pay right there, his own APA this. Did you ever use that? And if you did not, why I did not I had I've never used it. I will be up front about that. But I've heard a lot of people that have that have not had good experiences with it. I've always heard that they didn't help or they didn't understand where I was coming from. A big thing is we in public safety, no matter which discipline, you are fire EMS police communications, whatever it be. We only wanna talk to our people or somebody that knows where we're coming from. So a big part of us asking for help is one we don't want to just go talk to the stranger. That's one of the hardest things because that person can't relate to us. The other is the stigma about behind it is, we work in a profession where we are the strong the we work in a profession that we are the strongest people in. We are the people that are there to help. We're not going to ask for help, but we should. Right. And she you see that for me personally that exactly happened. When I when I talked to some folks. So as unfortunately intimately involved in that however, lean accident happened years ago. Right. And so fortunately, I had good friends that owed me up with some counselors, right? Win for government in as I talked about that event. And then fuse later, talk some about kind of build up to it was like the shock in that person's face was like, oh, my what I was going. Wait a minute. You're, you're just in one of them told me like half the time their problems, so I'm like, oh, okay. M sure. And again to disclaimer, like I'm sure there are folks that provide services for AP because what like five free session so today on it is a great tool, but I would say guess, fairly experiences vary is probably a safe thing to say, but it's, it's interesting. You mentioned that India, when you talked to your. People it's because like they, they understand it or not a lot more. So it's not so the and of course you know where you went and asked him pretty top notch people. So that's great. Is that somebody that in there she in a new? Yeah, I know. He actually, the doctor from VCU actually reached out to Richmond, ambulance in, we had a CIS mtm setup already on. But this was kind of before peer support in all this other kind of came about. So she had, although she had already contacted us and said, I'm here if y'all need us in interesting. She she's not practicing every day, she's actually in charge of a couple of different depar- couple different committees for the department of psychology. So when she does take on patients as kind of like a case by a case by case basis. They so mentioned for early to give up to you. So it made a difference in those sessions. And then how do you create the longevity and keep, you know maintain or, or get better comeback whatever the right wording is? So you know because that's certainly not the end of it. It's not like okay hand wash your good to go. So so then what happens after their sessions. So. Finished out my sessions with her in me and Sheehan kind of, and I don't want to be in Shan. I'm sure there were some other people we'd we did have a couple other people at Richmond. We would actually come into their new employees orientational, and they would take out a an hour to for to basically talk about mental health in odd share my story. We had a couple of other providers shared their stories in their frustrations with with the job in. That's, that's a whole 'nother topic. But that's something that we that we need to start doing is starting with a rookie schools are new EMT classes recruit schools, whatever. For your department, like giving them a heads up because I remember I worked part time for a communication center around here for a couple of months, and I was sitting in training in. There was a blurb. It was literally a paragraph. If dot just a couple sentences about stressors in the mental health aspects of, of the job in it was, maybe two or three sentences and I swear, I'm not a religious person. I. I'm kind of just, you know out there, but I felt a tap on my shoulder like somebody was telling me, hey, speak up. So I did you know, I said, I brought up Jamie. Sue Asada brought up my feelings about it in this was before. I went and got help. I said, you know, hey, this is one of the hardest jobs that you're ever going to have to do. You literally sit in. Listen to somebody's worst day in, you can't do nothing about it. You are literally, a sitting duck in you have to wait until somebody gets there to help them, but you do have tools to help them, but sometimes the, unfortunately you have to sit there and listen to it, and that's gonna take a toll in, we need to start here day, one with the new people because you don't know what, what you're getting into the way that I knew that I got the help that I needed was anew get. This is five years down the road from September. Eleven. The following September after I finally got help I realized. I was five days into the month in realize that it was the month of September in years past every day of September was just dreadful for me. I did not. I did not want to be around for September. It was just it was long dragged out. But September fifth hit in like didn't even realize were into September. So I knew that it that it was working, of course, each each September seventeenth that comes around is still hard, but it's not as bad as the prior ones. I'm going to get to that. As this noodle or starts to come back to the kind of baseline, so to speak. It is an it's not one of those, like, oh my God healed on. I'm good to go excuse. My language, but that should is still stuck with me. I mean that's a personal thing that I carry with me every day. But it's I understand it better. I can handle it deal with it a lot better. I have the tools to deal with it. Right. Yeah. That, that makes sense. I mean, the east of call kind of, you know, I had this little back room in the adequate, my brain shove stuff in there and wanted door, pops open, and you may clean it out. But you still going to still to have some stuff store near. Right. It's it's never gonna go away. Very mild. I mean, thankfully, you got the help in someone. Listen to someone was there. Right. Which is a huge factor. And then you had that ability in that you did speak up 'cause you're right, especially going into a new place. A lot of folks like what to beater and get through my probationary period. Make it like not rock the boat that whether it's the right thing to do whatever. So good view, you've gone certainly beyond that, you mentioned, you know, pure support again because the peer support was especially the fire services. They say around the kitchen table for women onto police isn't can make a doughnut shop Joe, but know for our people. We love it in the law enforcement, but you aren't being you're a you're right? We've. Actually been doing peer support since day one. Peer support is defined as informal informal an informal is your table. Talks is sitting at the dinner table in the station sitting in your patrol car side by side. Sitting in the truck together way on an EMS call to come out that is informal peer support. It's two people there for or more people, therefore each other just hashing out. Whatever formal is you were somebody referring, you to somebody who is willing to listen is, is there not to judge a big thing about peer support is it's confidential. You know that, that person's not gonna speak out or tell whatever you're thinking or feeling or whatever. And then again four malicious to people discussing potentially some dark things. You have to be prepared for you have to prepare yourself to listen to a lot of hard things to listen to people are gonna come to, to, to you about mental health. But there's also finances. There's the horses were in a career public safety for the highest divorce rate. We know that there's alcoholics in our fields. We know that there's drug abusers in our fields, there's marriage problems beyond divorce. I mean, we are were messed up. Organization. But yes, as I looked at those specifics, about suicide substance abuses is in every study like that because it's hand-in-hand or it's the trigger that, that takes down the that last wall, you know, sometimes in an folks do it in one thing, I heard on a huge Jacka podcast fan that from Dhaka willing. But there's a he's talked to a few people on his show war veterans now. So similar different circumstances. Obviously that obviously, huge PTSD in talking about the informal from World War, Two wear. Parental guidance film certainly had pedia see, but the informal aspect is they had to be on a ship for a long amount of time with their colleagues, and so they had time to decompress whereas his use of gone by we can travel so much, or the stigma we don't talk about it. So we let it go for, you know, having a lot of time to decompress with, with somebody it's been through the same thing as you just. It was very interesting kind of a comparison than take. Not that for like you mentioned, you know, sitting at a post, you know, in a in a truck for hours and you're sitting there and you can no shoes, whatever with, with your colleagues in other folks around their mixed make a difference. But in in you make a excellent point they had time on the ship to wherever they were they were coming back or if they were going to a new post. A problem that are. Said that public safety is having now is our call. Volumes are up or call volumes are exploding in that's, that's another problem that's gonna create issues with mental health is our brains don't have time to again process events. If you look at let's just take the Richmond model and I'm not trying to throw that out there. But it it's Richmond is you are stuck in a truck in ambulance for twelve hours roughly with you and your partner in you go from call call call call call there were days, where trucks would run a couple of calls, but there were also days where trucks would run eight to twelve calls a day in a twelve hour period, if not more than. You have time to drop your patient at the hospital. You have time to go run your fire call. You have time to go run your police service. Call in field. People in the field can take that time before they clear up to sit there to process to do whatever they need to do to compose themselves to get them back in service. A big problem with communications is your tethered. You are legitimately tethered to your console in once you're done with one phone call that phone is still ringing enacted. Assure you that phone is still ringing in that, that's a problem because you, you have to pick the phone up. You can't just walk away Bill, like oh man. I'm gonna go take a break. Now, you can't do that, that phone call in once the phone slow you kin step up in walkaway, but no matter what communications were a person in. Field is we don't have the time to process, the heavy calls that were going on because we're going from call to call to call to call. So to your point in a in a day in the in, you know, in, in the city of Richmond highest was per capita, call volume. Thank right in the US, so super-busy system over that math works out. We like tower. But I mean if you look at it, it's sixty four square miles is the city of Richmond. We would have twelve to eighteen trucks on during the day, sometimes, and I mean, it's, it's a busy system in there will be there be people who would just run the whole shift and. One of my friends talk show Robinson, she that she was one of the people that would speak during new employees or intake, as she suffered a breakdown, basically because of the call volume said she was getting she was getting the crappiest Paul's, and I'll be the one to save. Because when we talk about this in, in lectures, and stuff. She always says been which sitting on the shittiest couples, and it was I would send her on call and add texture. I'll be like, I'm so sorry, I don't know why you keep getting shafted with us. But it always seemed like when we worked together, I would sit around the worst calls in there were there are providers. We all know people who get the shitty calls every time. But that's just another factor. The somebody how many calls do you think you pretty much dealing with a day? Regulating question. But I think day shift used it. Yeah. I think day shift. We used to average between thirty and sixty in it wa it in that's per person. That's processing calls in day shift. We would usually run. I'm just gonna take a shot in the dark at least around one hundred twenty calls a day during day shift. Somebody wants to try to try to fix my numbers. That's fine. Because I'm just trying to remember. Just thinking about one shift dealing dominate phone calls. Like you said, just even simple math is, is raising the trying trying to figure out is there anything that so that you tried that didn't work or, or other folks, tried that didn't work for like healing, the healing de-stressing just kind of generally. Excuse me, on Shannon would always tell me go meditate or work on your deep breathing Britain, like breathing exercises in and I was like I can't sit in a room or like five to ten minutes. Like insolence or music, or something like I have to be up and I actually found that working out is the best thing, just like you. We need that hour or two a day to just work out and that's in twenty sixteen. That was one of my failing factors. I'd I'd call it I was again, I was trying to get on with the fire department or go somewhere with to get back into the field. And I joined a local group in Richmond called seal team physical training in the it was outside workouts. An hour in the morning, intense. No matter on what the weather an I, I started that earlier in the year been through it, and December hid in it was cold in like I'm not working out. Twenty degree weather. I can't do this. So I stopped for a couple of weeks working out now. It was probably one of my big, big failing factors for myself because now within the last year. Religiously at least on my days off me and my wife are in the gym up an hour or two a day. And I remember last week or two somebody contacted me wanted me to come talk to them, or at least call them in, like, hey, may I just pulled into the gym. I was like I need this. And I told him later, I would call you but nine AM in the morning for at least an hour, if not too. That's my time. I'll check my phone if need be. But. That's my town to just zone out. I don't think about work. I don't think about anything. It's me in my music that I'm listening to win pushing wait. Posted it said it whatever the where they go to a gym or garage. Jim it really is, therapists are or one of them candidate for sure. Because his to your point, when you plus when you challenge yourself on your own me seal team training, awesome. Because that's the Kamara commodity everybody's they're getting after then when you start going on your own. And it sounds like in December you could probably feel those two weeks. You're like eater not. You don't feel as good out vanden when you are now going and getting after noon. It's, it's less of a to go on, it's like, you know, you want to end. It's part of your life. A good for you for notch out all the time in. It's also another good bond renowned for marriage to like same thing for my wife and I were getting up, and then we'll look at each other it can be frustrating, but it's like, oh not getting up today. So as no would you let props to golfer that marriage. Because I've tried tried working out together. We're too. Competitive, and one tries to pick on the others form. It's usually her picking on me about my former what I'm doing. So when you walk in the gym, we drop her kids, and we split, and that is also our time for a load because we enjoy working out, but we do not were a workout well together in I apologize. If you're listening also. We and we've probably similar just in the same area pleasure area, but effect just this weekend was one of the first grade. She did a full workout together other than like she's done the Murph. You know, a couple of added. What is the, the group that you're west or that you do? And you know that you're part of or groups, I know I like the project incur the India, visit Richardson's right Virginia first responders support group. It wrong. It's Virginia first responders support services. So I hoped them. About a year ago, a little over a year ago, I approached when I went to Hopewell chief hunter had already been friends with Shannon. Aw in in. They worked together for Shannon's doctor for psychology or one hundred papers closely. So he come a new my, my, my background in what I was passionate about and I approached them in said, hey, you know, this group, I just stumbled upon they wanna provide a two day, peer support class, and I'd like to go check it out. I think it'd be something I know that I'm interested in hope. Well at the time had no see I s m team or peer support, or anything like that for potentially after bad calls. So luckily, they were gracious enough to send me went to the training in Virginia. First responders support services was started by Bendon, Sarah Thompson. Ben is a career firefighter with the city of. Harrisonburg fire department has been there for over ten years over twenty years and fire EMS throughout the area up there. Sarah, his wife is there clinical director, so she's licensed professional counselor. She's certified through the national certified counselor broom order, however, that is in if you're listening apologize, if mess that. Awesome couple. They stumbled upon that group basically because she was doing a paper in found out that there's really no big support services or groups out there for public safety in the ones that are out there. It's not it's not as personal. Maybe I guess is the best way to put it. So. Long story short for Jane first responders there to provide mental health in motion support services to any in all first responders throughout the state, or no matter really where where you are. What we do and they've been gracious enough, I work with John gain in also outta Chesterfield fire EMS were regional coordinators for the central part of the state. We have people up north in the state of Virginia. We have people out west and were trying to get the word out about them. A big thing is if you're having trouble dealing with a call dealing with personal issues. Whatever it may be were there to lend ear inn. It's not just us. There's a whole list on their website, which I'm sure we will include in the links below for the podcast. There's people all throughout the state were slowly growing, but a big thing is you contact them either through a form on their website or there's a phone number listed on the website to call and within twenty four hours, somebody's gonna give you. A callback. That's, that's a big thing that we do in a really nother. Big thing is within seventy two hours were going to meet you in person. We're gonna come out in talk to just to make it more personal to listen better in. That's what a lot of people need is just somebody to listen, somebody that they can trust that. They can go to. And then we also offer a two day, peer support class, which basically will give the give you training in active listening skills in how to set up your peer support team or. I guess peer support team. Yeah. For four year department will give you ideas for your SAP's or Esser. Jeez. Whatever you wanna call them. And then we also offer a three hour class, that's kind of like an awareness, will give you statistics, and we'll give you more information about peer support. But basically allow the teams in the area for year old c I s MCI SM works, but only in certain cases where Pierre supporting come in basically encompass everybody because you might not necessarily be affected by a call that somebody else ran, but over time you've been affected by numerous calls. Well, c I s Molly worked for one for one call. Whereas peer support. We can come in for what whatever, and that's kind of where the issue has been. And then not to ramble on more. But I also preach on, sometimes you don't wanna go to somebody in your department, whether it be stigma, whether it be small department might be a really big department. But you might not want to deal with somebody in your department, Virginia. First responder can come in and assist. You with that we know we have people throughout the state. We will find you somebody that you can mesh with to come out at least talk like get whatever is off your chest off your chest because it's not doing you any good to beholden back, and it, can they can kind of set that meeting out where whatever's comfortable for them, yet you base, it would emit you whatever. In all of our people have been through the today. Peer support class a number of us have more trainings in. We're gonna hit were we're gonna hit them with the hard questions that, you know. Hey, are you thinking about committing suicide? If we can read that or clue in on it, because her questions, nobody's gonna ask you potentially like nobody in your department. That's not on a peer support team, nobody's gonna ask because they're afraid to in in. That's okay. But we need to be watched now because the statistics are out there, the statistics that I have for just the fire department alone. One in two people have contemplated, suicide. It's me, and you talking one of us has contemplated it. And I mean, we already know who, but I mean, you know, you look at your shift you look at the people who are in your firehouse, there's five people in your firehouse. There's two or three people. And then we go to go more into that plan. There's one in five that have made a plan to commit suicide, so you look at a fire station as five people in it potentially one person in that station already has plans. So mean. The statistics don't lie in actually, I, I feel that the statistics are misleading because those are people that willingly, put that information out. And if we look at the firefighter behavioral health alliance, they say that their numbers are off the, you know, they're, they're number should be more. But it's proving. Yeah. That's true. How how you found is each experience, just like people, I guess, unique or have you found kinda summit in probably it's raining? Imagine kind of some standard approaches, the only equivalent I've had had like mental health first aid. But yet is the, the jeez, I gotta look at life, the pin from a badge to. That's the ISD. That you get for the Ellen west Beirut health, folks on calls, right? Talking down make like oh understand note. That's like, you know, correlating when you don't know, our is there something similar, like that, that you provide in this circumstance is the big thing, just kind of listening. And then there's some some good prompts that the training provides as far as you know, recognizing how to kind of gets somebody to help process. A lot of it is just active listening skills, actually being being there in the moment with that person at how your body language. Is taken by the other person. You don't wanna close stains because then they think that okay, well, this person's not keyed in, you want to have open states, you want to let them know that you're here, you're in the moment, you put your phone away. You have no distractions on the table. A lot of it is also listening normalizing, you know, hey feelings that you have our normal, we've all had them validating their feelings, and then also like trying to. Traffic of the word relate relate to them, so me as a person, I have multiple parts of my story. I can relate to you, somehow someway in, you're gonna know that okay will this person has been there that person's been in my shoes? It can get better because we go a lot of people are scared to speak out because of the potential for being, I guess, E C owed, or being detained for seventy two hours because they're having these thoughts, I had these thoughts, I was never put, you know, somewhere away for a couple of days, I still have the gun that I own that was not taken away. You know, everything a course I was made. Trying to think the. I was checked on to make sure that I was in a safe place that I wasn't going to go off in actually follow through with my plan in, I made a, a packed with Shannon to not do anything until the meeting go talk to somebody. I m in that, that could be a great area. But that's where trustworthy confidentiality in all that because. If you know that that person's not gonna go speak about your problems to somebody else, that's helpful. But we also do have policies where quote unquote, if you're a high risk person if you do have a plan, if you do have the means that you are, if you're not willing to take our help. Okay. We'll now we do have to act on something because you're not willing to go get the help in you're going to do something for there are that narrows policies in place. Is that something that you found though for you, would you were you know, in, in a bad spot, and then for you now helping others that is helpful is to have that kind of commitment or promise you know what I mean? So you made a pact or a promise, right? That kinda gives a you know, something to hold onto while you're working through it on either side. Did you find that as as a big aspect of helping you do that? I think for me personally, I knew I knew that I needed the help. I was already in the months at that I needed the help. I just didn't know where to go, and I knew that my thoughts I was like this is not right. Like this is not where I need to be. But for some reason up, I'm here with it. I have personally talked to other people that have felt like if they go and tell their therapist at that time, or they go seek the help if they say. Hey, you know, hey, I'm thinking about hurting myself, or I do have a plan, or I do have the means that they're gonna have their guns taken away that they're going to be locked up or sent off to some psych ward or something for days, you know, what's going to happen to their children in their wives. Their finances and all that. And I'm like let slowdown because we're not even to that point. Like there's nothing there's nothing that's going to get you to this point. But me take my story and telling them, you know, hey, I was in your shoes like you're fine. I've been there, I've been there with numerous people. I've been there with people at my table, and my kitchen of my house. In. They just need that reassurance that they're going to be okay. And then you make a pack together that, you know, hey, let's go get the help in if need be if you feel that your unsafe with. A weapon in the house. Or if you are thinking about taking medications to try to kill yourself or whatever, you know. Hey, can we get that medication or that weapon at somebody else until you get to a, a better place? How, how do you coordinate that could someone you know, it's Louisiana because big let you in their house, right? Exa-. Yeah. You know what you hold onto this for me. And if it's someone in a different part of the state. Do you. And I totally get it. So when you have the moral obligation to act, if they're like, right there. They're on the verge. Do you ever give a heads up to because it's a tough balance? I'm as confidentiality right by services that could help with that. Whether it's you know, I guess, resent law enforcement really other mental health services in, in their locality when you are going out there for the higher restaurants. It can be it can be a risky thing for for junior. First responders support services been in Sarah field every initial call. And if it's a high-risk thing, Sarah will take the call en-. She will she'll do her questioning on the mental health side and all that in chill. That's them. That's that's all on them. In a good example, is I had a friend reach out to just me it was like, hey add a friend in the western part of the state. She wants to talk to somebody, but she does wanna talk to anyone around. Can she talk to you? Again me. Just enter my phone number. And I long story short she was in a bad place. She needed to get the help, but she was unwilling to go talk to somebody in, like, hey, you know, I had these people in harrisonburg, let me give you your number to them, and let them talk because it was way beyond what I can handle in. That's what she needed. She needed to talk to somebody in the mental health field. She didn't need a peer support person that was way beyond what we could handle for me, if I was to go out and talk to somebody. That that was seized me. That was thinking something like that. There is a you need to tell somebody, you need to sell you know, hey, I'm going to meet up with a person in what I would probably do what I usually do is. I tell my wife, like hey, I'm gonna go talk to somebody. We were going to be here. We're going to be here for an hour. If if you'll hear from me in an hour. Like my wife is already texted me, it's an hour this in. She's like, hey are you. Okay. You know, tell somebody that you're going to do this because. Be dangerous to you about staying right? Live in a crazy world. No matter their co worker, if they're somebody in our public safety community, or just the general population. Everybody's crazy to some degree, but you, you need to tell somebody where you're going. But even then if it was a high risk thing you need to go see somebody else, because you're way beyond, what I can handle, and I'm gonna make sure that you go talk to somebody, you're making a point in if you don't, then I'm going to find out where you are in the state in going to send law enforcement out to you probably something like that. But luckily, I haven't had to deal with that have you so talking about law enforcement in really all the different disciplines. Have you found at a disparity between the acceptance of this program, and by just main I guess, related kind of metric, I'm thinking of really is the training provided right to localities or, or departments or both? I guess it could be the host and say, hey, we want that here. Have you had a good number while in force inserts, also in the trainings and involved in the program on the staff or the early, volunteer? Also, we have in the city of hope while the police department ahead actually already had a pure. Support program set up, and then I helped the fire department set up. There's in it kind of seems we call, where hope while is the Tri cities areas. It's more south of Richmond in it's different localities. It's four or five localities within the area and they all kind of have a similar system. There's actually a psychologist out colonial heights who is one the long Forsman psychologists for the area. He does a lot of the cycle of psychological interviewing in all that for the department. So he actually is a creator four. The Virginia peer support association, and they do a lot of legal aspects. They do trainings also, but they've actually gotten a couple of bills passed through the government here in Virginia for like, workers comp and all that, or peer support or mental health really for the state for us for public safety, and that's huge because public safety is not a hugely high paying business to be in either. So I know for folks that said they do use it be run. Out than it's another obstacle. Gary heard of his okay. Now after pay these co pays or my churns doesn't cover it because I'm not in addition, it has in. So that's awesome to hear that, that legislation is out there. And, and should be in one thing I've seen too which is a notoriously, obviously relevant to your former career in other countries, they're still doing communications is more states now or some states, I guess, are classifying communications, folks, as first responders officially numb, even though for all listeners for those of us that work with occasions folks in all the other disciplines like we know that, that, you know how we treat each other Mary's on that. But the official Lassen -cation typically is police fire or police fire slash e amass. And, and unless you kind of know, you know, dispatch folks, incubators aren't included in that kind of generally, but it's good to see at least a few states officially saying, hey ran classifying which then was up the door for. Benefits, right in for retirement, different things like that. So that's, that's good to see in plano. I don't know about Virginia, if they are not don't miss. That's we talked before. We went live recording, but there is a movements called a hash tag. I am nine one one it started by a former communications officer in he does a lot of talking on that is to change it from a clear, ical job listing, I guess, or classification is at award. A lot of communications officers are listed as a clear or secretary type of work in against studies in just data shown shows that it's not just sitting in front of a computer like there are multiple aspects to it in does take a toll on you after a while after a while. Absolutely. When you were saying that example, in I was fortunate to work with sham project, that active shooter training. Stop within the city in one huge aspect of that particularly for the, the folks who are going to deal with the surgeons, you know, what's been horrible happens in most folks seen on the news, 'cause they're all trying to get the shot of whatever's going down. But in the background the just flood of calls from the real halls talking about the problem. Everybody else that wants to report it kinda like posting in being the wanna post it in the media, which is just hammering the same places. His running wants the scoop in the ground truth, so to speak. And that level of stress and things of that was a big factor. I mentioned for dirge Uber. Dear myers. And that's something that we're gonna talk about their too, but on. So you've made a ton of progress of for yourself for the commonwealth's for folks in it, which is awesome. So thank you athlete though. You and everybody around you and folks. You've helped. So let's say someone's listening. Now, they're in that spot in that spot, what these suggests for them to make progress like we've talked about. You know, you other people like you process. There are kind of going to talk to somebody, you know, you trust. It's going to be confidential getting professional help for sure. When it reaches a certain point, you're your colleagues can only help so much in, in, in at some point, sometimes it's too much like it's almost not fair, so to speak, even though because they don't know what to say, right? I mean unless you're trained in it. So what would you say to someone listen now it's anti spot. It's har. I it's. This is always the question that I get hit up on, because I've been on both sides in it's, it's like all may just go talk to somebody, but then. I've been on the side of I don't wanna go ask somebody on a one look weak on a wanna look stupid. I don't want to have somebody else worrying about me, but you gotta go find somebody that you could mesh with in, whether it's pure support or it's going to talk to a counselor psychologists psychiatrists. If you don't mesh with a person, go. Find somebody else in. That's why that's why I linked up in, I love Virginia first responders support services. If you don't like your departments, peer support team or if you don't have one come, call us. We've seen minutes on the library in fifty. Please pay your Bill before you leave. Go find somebody that you can talk to it doesn't have to be your department. You can come to Virginia first responders support services your regional EMS council might have a support team. Find somebody that you meshed with in, even if they don't have peer support training, if you can trust in somebody in, you have a connection with them. Go speak out. Go ask for help, if they don't have if they can't find you the help hopefully they can. But I know if you come to me, I will find you the help that, that you need, or I can get you on the track to getting somewhere to ponding, the help just because out of in the central part of the state doesn't mean that I don't have a connection out west. I don't have a connection out east north south wherever, but I want you to find that help. It's a shitty place to be against us, my language, but it's a shittiest place to be in to, to be in that dark of a place in feel like there's nobody there to help you in. There's no way out there is a way out. You just need to drive a dig in get out. And ask for help, a good point is after someone Tuesday, do commit suicide often post comments, whatever is, oh, they should have asked for help, but they should have gone to your point when, when, when you're the bottom part of the deepest practice lasting, you wanna do go tell somebody your was because you're, you're not like in a Chipper place where you're ready to Chit chat with somebody, the n you mentioned two parts of the state. Are there similar groups that you all connect with outside the state? So let's say someone's listening to your 'cause we're in forty one states. Now, then we are big Tom punching gets, what is ever conscious? So if they go, oh, hey, this, let me call this for ram that can maybe me up in my state, or something like that to you all have an opportunity or would you maybe just gonna wracked with someone their department or is that possible dares? A lot of the states are starting to get their own peer support teams. Illinois. I think it's the Illinois firefighter peer support alliance or team or something like they are huge North Carolina. Has one. That's coming up in. It's huge. A states are getting their own peer support teams. If you don't know where to start in it kinda sound silly, but reach out to your localities mental health offices. You know, that's, that's a good place to start, you might not get the help that you need. But there might be somebody there that can assist you or point you in the direction that you need to start going in. And, you know, the further out, you get the more. We'll, there's not a lot of resources out there. Unfortunately, in a lot of the hospitals are your go-to, and you might not wanna do that. But context, somebody contact me I don't care like, whoa, put my phone number in this podcast. In just send me a text message. Give me a heads up that you're gonna call me and let's find you something because I love to use Google Google spa for. What if you get the power turned off on you in the library? Recording said, what's, what's coming up? Actually saw it was probably on the pace books. One of the trainings coming up actually not going here in near harrisonburg, the Virginia, first responder just stumbled into some grant money unusually we usually they, they charged for their classes in just covers materials in whatnot July thirteenth fourteenth is when their first free two day classes again, it's a two day class, but the classes free in that will get you the peer support training, get you active listening skills that you need to start talking to people in again, this is just a class, you know. Hey, I got it. Good. I'm done. Like there are more classes out there for you to go to. That's in harrisonburg. It's at the Rockingham county, Adleman building, which is in the city of harrisonburg. Again, it's free. There will be at least two or three more by the end of the year that are. Free, if you want us to come out and talk to your department for three hour class were more than willing, we had regional coordinators all over the state that are willing to put in time. It's all again. We are strictly bought a volunteer, there's nobody making money, all of our money goes to pretty brochures, pamphlets, everything for class is in all all that. There's nobody is making a dollar. I can assure you on that because we're still working public safety. Makes sense. How can folks get in touch with you? You mentioned weaken types of one of the show notes in the context in all these organizations talked about on the on the socials get ahold of you. Get ahold of you, if they want to get you that way, while main actually story, my Instagram pages, don't call me radio still, but on a real note, my Email domes GO, EMMY S dot Benjamin dot just the letter P as in Paul edgy. Mail dot com's my e- my personal Email, you're more than free to Simeon Email. Ask me questions. My phone number eight oh, four four three two seven nine zero one sent me a text message. Let's link up. Let's, let's talk. Whatever it's always on my wife gets on me, but, you know, she she, she knows that usually most of the time, I'm connecting with people. But sometimes I'm Parisian Facebook. But there's that I'm more than willing to talk Virginia. First responders support services, WWW dot V, F, R, S, S dot org. The first letter of the tire name again on their you'll find contact information on number that you can call if you're having trouble fill out the form, if you need help to be don't wanna call again. We will give you a phone call in twenty four hours. We'll meet up with you will within seventy two hours so there's that there's, there's lots of other resources. There's the national suicide hotline. I don't have that number I apologize. We'll drop all that. There's code green campaign. There's, there's a text for suicide hotline. If you don't wanna talk to somebody reach out and find somebody that you can talk to. Sounds good. We'll again we'll put his out when we push the episode out for sure. So we'll make sure every sources and all that for the show y'all questions. Follow up for some reason, on Twitter, Instagram. I am Penelope. A. N. N. E. L. L K G used to be PSE to PMP than if you're gonna use my real name trying to be flashing, and then we're between the slides dot com. So we have every episode available there as well. Ron the tune Spotify everywhere you your podcasts Ben. Thank you so much talking about this understand. It's tough. It's a hard subject for folks out there listening, please use these resources. Think about this around, you think about yourself. We want you to be here. We want you to be around seek about the impact if you're not on safety is hard because hard people are in it, and that doesn't mean that you have to try and be that way forever. It's okay to have problems to talk about. It's okay to get help on help everybody got some help out of this podcast. Dan? I'm glad that you did. I'm glad you're doing what you do. Now are really appreciate it. Thanks for coming on the show. In hasn't been no problem. Godspeed best, you good luck with the squabbles at the gym with your spouse. Way to get after this. Awesome.
New Final Fantasy VII Remake Trailer and Gears 5 Review Whats Good Games (Ep. 122)
"Yeah the what's good everyone and welcome to another episode of the Good Games podcast your source for video game news commentary commentary analysis in funny stuff every Friday. I am one of your hosts pretty rumba alongside the beautiful stunning gorgeous Christine Steiner thank you so much just gathered me up over here. It's one of my favorite things to do when it's the steinbrecher shows just introduce you like the lovely woman you are. I feel like I need to bring you with me everywhere though in order to do that like if I'm meeting perspective boy and then I'll just be like hold on. Here's Brittany Realize Your Business Ooh then they'll be like she's crazy. Coupon snow this time Barker show our lovely Andrea Rene was is going to join us this week however her. PC was having some major issues and today was her final day of kind of funny and so we're like girl in movers are coming tomorrow. It's a whole thing she's she's very busy very busy so we're like this. Is the last thing you need. Why don't you just step away? Just have the peaceful relaxing Alexa evening drink a bottle of wine. Pet your hats and we will. We'll take a episode one hundred twenty two yeah we will yeah we got to it. Let's do it okay so let's get into some some house keeping okay so packs west the thing that happened obviously last week we took some are and are we uploaded packs west panel as our episode last Friday and and you enjoyed it great if not boo but I just wanted to thank you to anybody who came to that panel live. Oh yeah that was a weird time. Seven PM on a Sunday yeah. It was a weird time. We really appreciate all those who made the effort to come on out yes and thank you to square for sponsoring are amazing party or life is strange party art marble twenty-one that Friday and yet like Somerset everyone who came out and hung out we really appreciate it got a little stuffy in there a little hot as the Steiner knows people in in Seattle. Don't really believe in air conditioning no no so those few months a year that it gets kind of hot it gets real. hob is still a great time. We had a lot of fun seeing everyone in meeting meeting you shaking her hands have drinks with some shots and it was really cool to meet the voice actress Shannon Daniel for life is strange as well. Yeah it really was it was a good time I'm another thing regarding patriotic okay so we are going to be streaming. Obviously we have our patron exclusive streams this month however we're still kind of figure out the working out the kinks because like we said Andreas moving and it's just like everything's up in the air so this could be happening really quick just want to give everyone heads up. We might be like Oh my God. We have three days to do this this this whole month and those three days start tomorrow. Let's go yes also another quick. No I know Britney already mentioned this in the Patriots on blog but are August postcards accompany a little late Nelson. There's some miscommunication say happened so yeah. If you are a postcard or you've got mail or polaroid patron hatred for August you will begin yours this month. Allowing our actual September postcards employees as well and speaking of the Patriots went to give a little shout out two patriot dot com slash west good games. I don't feel like we talked about it enough on this podcast but it really is what helps keep our lights on and keeps US lovely thing going. We just uploaded some fun blogs this week and last week they are Patriot. Exclusive steamer wanted to murder a fire alarm. Co two slash fire alarm because they're all one Yuna. Anna and both of mine died yeah this week and it was not fun fun. Andrea's latest blog was her person goodbye to our studio in San Francisco so these are fun things we do once a week and we just kind of talk about whatever the hell we want and it's just a little way for us to talk about things other than video games sometimes and before we get into the news as one also ask you if you enjoy what we do here at what's good games if you wouldn't mind head over to that that little items or wherever podcast platform you like and subscribe to us and leave us a five star review that would be great because those little five star reviews offset the one-star reviews. We get like this one from lucky zero three one seven called no personality and the quote is they seem fake his got it right here she he or she got had it right. Where we are the fakest speeches you will ever meet we are we don't like actually like video games at all we know is this is money money the whole year of payment easy money? I know I tell people that have been doing this for like ten years now. I think I can make a living wage off this fan. We cause as we love it anyway so if you wouldn't mind oh this is funny. We also got a two star rating from someone he said we spent too much time is pronouncing names. Probably the Patriot list. It's absolutely the Patriot list but they're like to start reveal. Your podcast sucks. Actually they actually liked her. They liked our content. He just didn't like the fact that we you know man. They doctors three stars for that. Yeah the harsh criticism this is why we need your support friends also out to our patriotic producers Alex couples choose Godson David Gallucci Fairy Tayo okay a Ta and Muhammad Muhammad and welcome to our Patriot on community Nathan Chris Young Audrey Watson Carla Callahan Brenda Clark son of the Sun with you Stephanie Lancaster Jason Evans Tony Baraka Yeah Joe Jordan Maigo Christian weren't you oh Kayla Arendt's Saxton welcome back and David Taylor we appreciate you so so much and before we can get into the news. We want to say thank you to our sponsor this week. RECON so steiner it's two thousand eighteen and everyone needs a great pair of wireless ear buds but before you go dropping hundreds of dollars on a pair you to check out the wireless ear buds from RECON RECON earbud start at about half the price as any other premium wireless ear buds on the market and they started just it's amazing. The company was Actually Co founded by Ray. J and celebrities is like snoop Dogg Cardi B. Brandy. Jr Smith are already obsessed break-ins Eve fifty wireless ear buds have totally changed the game for me. They're comfortable and so easy to take anywhere where I recently started going to the gym and they have been a godsend because they're so little and they don't take you know I hate it when you were like big headphones because this is the amateur mistake I made summer the or these big headphones and then it got really sweaty yeah. Here's what's a real thing so I'm like some of your other wireless options on ear buds are both stylish and discrete with no dangling wires. Here's our stems and of course they don't look that he sound great to yeah so like are we also I also exercise and I will go running sometimes after I train and and I had been using these ear buds that did have like the dangling wires and I did not realize until I got these recons how much nicer it is to not have that like just frigging cable around you so they're amazing. I also wear them all over pacts because my hotel was a little bit farther away away so it'd be walking at least ten to fifteen minutes to get to the conn anthony just pop in my ear buds listened tunes and walk and it was great perfect walk doc Christine's hammer and they offer a fun range of colors too and different sizes. It's really cool unbeatable price so good by rake on dot com slash. What's good to you? Get fifteen percent off of your order. That's by RECON DOT com slash. What's good for fifteen percent off Rakhine wireless ear buds? If I appear now is the time to get an amazing deal wartime time by ray CON DOT COM slash. What's good alright? Let's get into some news and I guess we'll just start. This batboy. Final fantasy seven remake continues to look like a brand new game GR- skirt. I am granting the thing I oh my God okay so this right of comes up from cocoa could talk you. It's short but then I have course like my Britishness things. I WanNa like deep dive into okay so blinking. You'll miss some of the brand new additions to file fantasy seven four the remake as showcased in this new trailer square INEX- put out an honor the Tokyo game show this week. Oh Yeah we should start with that. It's not will be starting so we're recording this on Wednesday Wednesday evening and I'm sure whether time this show goes live on Friday. There's a whole bunch of news new stuff out but for now we'll just cover. We got so among other things. There's a new boss fight with Reno Reno some sort of dark mini game a brand new member of soldier hot blonde man. If I see bike sequence with the members of avalanche cutesy epilepsy call ups President Shimmering Hologram someone's effort and Sheva both of whom are obtained way after mid garden the original version of file fantasy seven five hundred seven remake comes out on March thirty twenty twenty twenty it will include cloud wearing a dress what what is that sentence about still in the Sir that because that's all that's all my notes okay so in the original final fantasy seven there is you are with earth and so air and aries. This is the same person but I think it was just mistranslation so air is the correct name for this girl Dino. Yes okay played part of this game. I just never have I've only I played like maybe ten hours of it. Oh so you've probably got through this part. You probably don't remember it so there's a part where you and I are just chilling and you see Tepa being in carried away in a carriage and you guys really joe like what the Hell's going on with that we should go investigate so the two of you go and look like chart figure out where she is or why she's in the back of a carriage rich and you go to the honeybee which I think is just like a brothel and talk to the guy you talked to the Guy Upfront and he's like Oh yeah tvos our new girl but if you wanted to see her you know she's not the dawned on Cornell's house having an interview. This is what we do with all of our new new girls so then you're like okay. Let's go to mansion so go to don tornadoes mansion and there's a dude out front and he stops from going in and saying like cloud. You can't come in because you're like a dude but Gareth you're cute you can come in and air turns a cloud. She's like hey hey. I'll just go in and I'll see how do we make sure she's okay and clouds like you're not going in there by yourself baby girl and so now they're in this predicament like what do they do so brilliant idea is let's turn you into a woman. Yes the old yes wrestling bids crossdressing yeah yeah so then it turns into this whole mission Shane where you get to pick out address you get a wig. If you go the extra mile you can get Kiara and makeup and some other stuff and you can actually be like the chosen girl of the Dawn that evening Ning may is saying yeah yeah so it's it's I mean we knew this coming back. I mean I think he's been confirmed for even a few years now but it's just cool to see more of it because you see Don Cornell Cornell like in his bed like saying hey gimme Gimme some sugar and it's like okay. That's creepy but what's interesting. Dan is that it looks like Tika and heiress are both with cloud when he's going to get this addressed. That's kind of what eludes needs to why this is interesting is because in the original it's only Eric you have with you. You don't have teeth with you right so it would be fun if Tebas along for that ride which kind of leads me into the squad squat many game which is why this is important because you go to a gym and then you have to compete and squat competition or to hopes doesn't squats or pull ups so squats the original so the polyps is new. Oh Yeah so yeah so what do you have to compete in a squad competition in order to get the Blonde Wig Egbert cloud wears so it's a game but then you see teeth doing pull ups which makes me wonder okay is not a mini game takes place later or is like she she along for that whole lakeside quest because it can't be too much later because the entirety of this first episode is taking place in mid Gar which is interesting because it only takes like maybe the average like four to six hours to get through mid Gar in the original final fantasy seven but anyway that's real good so other things that I unnoticed okay. Obviously we got the Turks Got Reno. He's a due to the red hair. He's he's very attractive man. Have you seen the trailer yet. No I haven't okay so yeah. Just wait a minute. I'm just GONNA play it yeah. That's just game good. I love you for it so I'm not going to. I'm going to stay away from spoilers. Am One of those people who like I think people if they can experience this for the first time they should so. I won't give anything away but at school that you get to see the Turks and let's see this other there. No I have oh yeah and obviously we're getting a few different story tweaks and additional scenes which makes sense because this game is supposed to be in line what was first installation in line with the mainland final fantasy game so like thirty ish plus hours kind of been like what's been said and like I said you know you can get through bid Gar in the first four to six showers so obviously there has to be a lot more to do here so we see his teen where ariff is with Marlene and if you don't know what I'm talking about I'm sorry but those who do not I'm talking about bill appreciate it and one of the Turks comes to get her and that's going to be new footage out. We haven't seen before because in the original file fantasy seven like she's. He's just like straight up like taken and I know I'm trying to avoid spoilers but this isn't anything major but you don't get to see how that confrontation went down so I think we're kind of getting an idea of where they're going to be exploring for more stories that we may have missed out on the first time we also see some paragliding which is new it shows bigs in Jesse and maybe this will take place ace after a certain thing is destroyed and comes down which might mean some certain characters might actually live in the scalp that would be kind of cool again. We got the new blonde hot boy soldier on a bike and there we go those are like my biggest takeaways. Obviously the summons look really great you could see Sheva and she's just like this beautiful ice goddess and I love her so much and I'm just very excited. I just love me. I should that's right. I mean I do the correct way but yeah yeah about that so also it's been kind of interesting interesting. Chatter is how this whole the whole honeybee scene is going to be played out because there's some controversy Chrissy because of the way the game the way the game portrayed certain things in the original final fantasy seven so on your quest to to infiltrate the Don kronos mansion and I hope was first name is I'm not making that up. I feel like I'm just saying that like pure habit saw on quick to it's really like straight darn. ESO In order to get in their cloud. You can get a membership key so you can actually get into the Bronco and Eric is like what are you doing in clouds as well. You know I for for research. I'm really going to be a woman. I need to be able to get in here and see what I can get done and whatever when he does get his makeup done in there but there's different rooms in there that you can pick and choose if you want to like okay so you can choose a real that I'm assuming it's supposed to be translated to like the the fuck room and I say that because in the game and it's all those like little symbols like the at symbol the exclamation point you know like in a comic instead of swearing they would just use all those symbols all strung together you okay so you can go into that room and cloud goes in there and he he kind of has like a weird like a vision. He's he's countryman balls a bit and then he wakes up and then he wakes up to being rubbed and then these are the ones that are being described. It's like Rub Rub thump pound point P. O. K. squish you here then clouds ow and then he wakes up dude on top of a dude wearing steeper tight wrestling outfit kind of thing and he's like pounded on him like literally and he's like don't get so suppressed. He says don't get so depressed over thing like this happens to me all the time and then you get lingerie from the room attendees Asari Prize which goes on to like the Don Cranial mission and that was like a little weird but like it's nothing crazy right but I think where people get a little uncomfortable is when you go into the bathtub room and so cloud goes into the bathtub room and he's standing there and he's just like I said Rimsson and brothel and these like nine burly men with like these really tight like little outfits. There's same dudes that are from the gym where you have to do the squats to get the blonde wig like they come in and they're like hey we're gonna rub you down and like clean you up up and all that kind of stuff in cloud says I have no time to be messing around with you and then the watch it again today. The one of the main guy says loosen up bubby. Let's wash off our sweat and dirt together gather and then it shows cloud kind of backing up like as close as he can to like the player in terms of the camera angle and then it shows all these crowding putting him and then a screen kind of fades and then you hear the sound of his clothes being taken off and then you hear the one we'll look at that and then it pans over and then clouds back back in the bathtub but like nine of these men and its head all you can see the top of his head and the main guy asks him like how do you like this and you can either respond by saying nothing or you can stay it hurts and if you select it hurts cloud says it's too stuffy in here and the main guy says oh you'll get used to it. Try counting to ten and so then clouds counts to ten and meanwhile this guy is like saying kind of creepy stuff to him. He gets to ten and the guys like why don't you stick around and play. Daddy is so lonely and then he like leaves so I don't know if you've heard about the honeybee store controversy in how can we played out but that's more or less. It sounds like there's just some hints of nonconsensual will rubbing shirt. Obviously this game came out in the nineties. Things were just a little different in terms of like what's appropriate. What's not to make light of you know in terms of culture pop culture and stuff like this but anyway I kind of went on a tangent but that is like I was like this is a lot to digest? This is like what people are talking talking about like how the crosshairs house. It's going to lead to the honeybee seen anyway. I know down the thing but that's okay but that's the thing that people are talking about and I apologize. Guys got it all right now. I know now stories so boring but fine do the next to you get one okay that is fine apple arcade release date price games at everything else you D to know this is from tech radar so as you may know apple had their event this week and it talked about a lot of shit there was apple watch garbage if you like they're great but there was a lot of light. There's a ah one of those things also apple arcade so the gaming subscription service will release on September nineteenth and costs four dollars us and ninety nine cents U s that is of course different pricing for other regions but the apple arcade subscription service for Games is just the latest sign of Apple Getting on the Gaming Bandwagon with a curated list of exclusive titles also come to your iphones IPADS macbook computers and even Apple TV at an affordable monthly cost. It's apple take on the whole net flicks for gaming approach tying gamers into a monthly subscription that gives of access to top quality video game adventures that aren't available anywhere else. Apple Arcane has a good heritage behind it was arguably the first company to take mobile gaming seriously and make it financially viable and as a result. It's now got the backing of some of the most important names in mobile game development. It's also great news for owners who have always played second fiddle to gamers when it comes to finding topnotch gaming experiences says on their platform Apple Arcade boasts over one hundred unique in the story it says read indie exclusive to Apple's devices including beneath a steel sky a remake of the classic adventure game with art by Watchmen Comic Book Legend Neil Gibbons and in addition. The collection of cames games available is set to be cured by experts and we'll be updated monthly and will include original releases from renowned creators hero Nobutaka Gucci. I'm so sorry a Ah Ken Wong will write anymore so I personally obviously a huge game. I played a few things on my phone like Florence and Lego Tower but this is definitely one of those subscription services. I will be opting out of not bothering sorry. That's not what I was expected really. Okay 'cause you're like this is one of the service I will be a good deal right like five dollars and you get like these reoccurring during games deal if not going to blame them if you're not gonNA play it no no as you are. I'm looking at this list of developers to our support pledge and you got like Sega devolved digital. Ross Fury Game Lofts in apprentice in there. I think they were Yep yeah. They have their one game Konami. Yes there's a lot of good. It all looks very interesting but I just know my set and that's not for me Capcom Screen TV softball no same here. I'm right with you. I think this is awesome. It seems like good bang for your buck especially since you can share among your family members like that's real. This is what this is. What ticks me off? This is what grinds Mike years baby girl. It was talking about this with Fred. We were both commiserating about the fact that they're always like with any of these subscription services right there like you can share it with your freely and I'm like it's just me I am my family. This is all our gut. Where's my cheaper price because I can't split the cost between the people and justify it like if I had four people in my family? Oh my God a dollar person amazing. It's just me I have a single person tax and I don't appreciate it. I I mean listen Sam. I'm your family and I'm not blood related. We you and I enjoy a family plan and could on your cell phone players enjoyment Nintendo's switch membership yeah. Actually I do have a family planning though sorry okay wow what a tease I know I know it sounded again. I realized I had nothing to offer you just like every other man in my life. I love you like this. Is I mean I'm sure sure they're gonna be I mean I looked at some of the Games. They looked fine but like Sammer. It's just doesn't do it for me if I have my phone. Chances are reading about video game news or I'm looking at some stupid stupid. Article and buzzfeed are checking my email. I just don't play Games on my phone. Yeah actually there is a few games that I play in a what's it called. I talked about got it on a show. Maybe last year and I can never say the name of it. hold on. I gotTA pull it up. It's it's like it's supposed to look like a normal last phone. It's it's basically you're finding a phone. Ashtrays yeah called the loss phone. I thought yeah there's a a normal loss phone in like another loss but the one I'm talking about particular and I could never say it last time. Similar KARA SIT S IONA CA-CAR S. I M. U. L. A. SIMILAR LA fuck. I don't say it anyway. There's a new one coming out and these ones are fun because it's mostly about the phones being possessed and like people are dead and it's my kind of thing. Oh yeah that shit that's kind of games. I like to play on my phone but and he'll yeah good for you. Guys do a thing get. If you want it yes but not for us the right girl right and are you the next one and I can just grunt. You'll be grunting a lot because guess what everybody eighty project resistance revealed as team based resident evil game this comes to us from Polygon so project resistance has been revealed ahead of Tokyo game show as a quote brand new teammate survival horror experience. Perhaps similar to resident evil outbreak. The game looks like a four player cooperative game using online multiplayer and features the variety of characters going against a robot man who seems to be in control and the relevant looks similar to Mr X. Resident Evil too but we can't really be sure if it's him or not yet well being teased. The new game was dubbed Project Resistance though it seems like the game will be keeping this title fans will be able to watch game play at the Camp Capcom boost during Tokyo game show at at times Japanese residents will get to go hands on with the game but only if they've registered advanced project resumes will be released a playstation four windows PC and xbox this one at an undetermined time apparently this is. I wish that we got to get more information about this game before we recorded the show but we have not heard anything else else. We've seen the trailer so I'm GonNa break down the trailer and I won't talk as long as Jerry about fantasy seven. I promise it does it really does look like Mister. X It yeah because it is okay. Why did the article is like? We're not sure but I'm looking. I literally just looking at the thumbnail. I played not enough resident evil and I'm looking at it. IS THAT NOT MR ex- 'cause it looks exactly like him. Yeah I don't the robot man I think I think personally they may have just been a little confused because my my understanding my belief is that the person in the control control room is like a real person but he just puts on these like mechanical gloves which then allows him to control Mr X. Okay so the trailer for those of you haven't seen it. It's only the accident no okay okay yeah yeah so the trailers only like a minute half but it opens up an dude this this is the mystery man he walks into a control room. There's a billion monitors and like VCR looking tech and stuff so you assume it's kind of like probably set in the nineties my assumption anyway big control room and I was trying to sleuthing and I'm like looking on the Monitor to see you know like where are they and one of the areas did look like the parking garage from resident evil to she remake couldn't be totally sure just that out there so then he says Downing Pushes the whole bunch of buns and then you see the select five minute mission timer start clicking down or ticking down and then it shifts to the laboratory where you see people walking through looking all cautious like cautious Kelly and one guy has shotgun and one girl has like it looks like a wooden plank of nails sales on it so variety of melee weapons and then the dude starts flipping switches and we start slipping switches as they're walking areas different enemies come out so the first wave of enemies you get like eight or nine typical slow shambling zombies and if you look real close our favorite timer you understand us but our favorite resident evil two girl she's wearing a pink take top oppa the Jean shorts she makes a cameo and noticed her and I thought that was really cool so she's in there and then he starts flipping switches and then he unleashes a liquor and then once the liquors dead did he that's when he puts on like these gloves and then then it pans over to Mr X. who lifts his head up and then eyes start glowing red and then the guy's gloves start glowing join red so then you assume okay this guy is controlling mister x which isn't out of the rental possibilities all these things have been created you know with viruses and other weird things so sure why not why not Mr exit the tyrant and so there are a lot of tyrants so there's not just like Mr Exeter hearts but tyrants grants are aplenty tyrants like a specific thing in this universe or do you just mean yeah. It's it's in particular bio up new like liquor. It's like its own certain thing. I've got to think of it like that yeah so the question is what kind kind of game is this I like to I would like to think am I perfect Brit world. It's disappear co OP game but there is reason to think obviously that this could be a four V one. Oh yeah that would make sense yeah yeah and I. I hope it's not I mean. I just never really been unless I can play with style. I don't like plain in people especially you don't even like playing co op so the only person you're going to play this with this Jason Well Nia. I mean probably but like if I have have to play against with you. I guess we'll play with you. Don't even tonight at this point now. It's so I could it could go either way. I could see it being a forty one. I I would like to think it's just a pure co op shooter where you go throughout specific areas of raccoon city 'cause what the dude is wearing a raccoon city. Things have varsity jacket which is one of the things end end outbreak game so I like to think maybe post outbreak in resident evil two. It would be cool if we could get some stories in this that would be cannon this kind of show us what what that outbreak was like few weeks after it happens in raccoon city before everything gets blended smithereens but yeah we'll just have to see there's just we'll just have to it would be cool if that was whisker in that's like one of the old the main bodies of like the first five or five or six games you want to count like are easier and could and I'm getting back to find out what's what the sad part is. Obviously we're recording this on Wednesday and the show starts tomorrow so so we will probably have a much better idea of what this game is but if you google it right now I'm sure you'll find new information on exactly what project resistances live anywhere yet. It's cool. I think it's I think it's great didn't Capcom in a good position right now where they can kind of test not test their wings spread other wings there you go spray writings and try to not fall to their deaths. Please don't I'll be very sad. Killing Monster Hunter obviously double my credit really good Rosen evils in a really good spot so understand why people under nervous about nervous about this but it's you know we're going to get a we're still going to get our three remake. This is just them trying something new and if it works for them sweet if not they'll know about it right. This one's fucking crazy all right Nintendo teases switch peripheral focused on physical exercise. Have you seen this trailer. I I clicked on it before the show. Okay okay so this comes from Games Industry Dot Biz Nintendo. Oh has teased a new peripheral for its switch console which seems to amplify and extend its motion control functions yesterday Nintendo released video that shows the new controller and action the peripheral Israel is split into two parts a wheel and strap each of which can house enjoy con controller the video depicts people in various countries using the controllers with the wheel gripped in the in the hands and the strap attached to the by many of these activities involve physical exercise running stretching aerobics and adopting yoga like positions Nintendo will reveal more details on September Twelfth Aka Tomorrow for us but very yesterday for you every home side of this the worst instead it was always the worst this but the very fact that the name imprecise nature of the controller were not included is significant in itself a teaser preceding a full announcements tactic often employed with products considered to be a major launch the physical exercise depicted in the videos also familiar territory for Nintendo the most obvious example being we fit which was a huge hit back in two thousand and eight since then the Japanese company has made frequent references interest in promoting. I need help and quality of life through its product visually. If any of you have ever done pilates before the wheel is a pilates wheel almost exactly what it is uh-huh. I've used them before so it was into it when I watched it. I was like that's just the pilates wheel but like like with a thing in your controller so just to see how much this bad boy is yeah yeah and it reminds me of just all of the weird things intendo has done and it's like what is the world a better place. Britney are let people be fits yet and hey you know what the we fit the balance board. That was the first hour they're going to kill uh which fit oh my God the switch. It sounds fun switch fit. I like it but now the balance was the first time I ever did yoga and I learned about it and so actually not Jay scenario like twenty minutes of Yoga Day because we very we need to see we're not flexible at all so she's like naming off all these pose it like oh I learned that and and we are we fit yoga like six years ago thirteen years ago holy shit so speaking other weird things than Tun does doing they have. That's deep tracker so summer. This news broke. I think when we were in London so I think we I I kind of missed. It and I didn't really hear a lot about it but it's called Pokemon sleep and you know what I saw right because I was I made a jet lag. Joke like can poke in monthly helped me get to sleep right now yeah yes. I remember that joke. That was a good job. Samia the vest it uses. Is this pokemon go plus plus which is what it's called and what it does is it monitors user sleep patterns rewards them for time spent sleeping quote. The concept of this game is for players to look forward to waking up every morning so my God that's so sad. I know this mission statement I ever heard I know that's the CEO of the company on one hand. I'm like Oh man other hand like hey. If it works for someone hey I know but like and then they twenty fourteen they had that quality of life platform they announced which is probably died. I think it's actually been rumored that has been dead for a while but what it was it was the sensor that monitored analyze you all you slept and it was just something you would stick like next to US radio waves they would check out your heart rate respiration fatigue and it just would like basically scope you out all throughout the night and even partnered with manufacturer who specializes in medical equipment and everything but clearly that fell through and then never forget get the we censor that never became a thing oh yeah it was just like literally a heart monitor clip yeah like you said I appreciate. They're trying to do good. Thanks for the world. She's like cool this silly I mean I will. I don't need this but other people. If this gets you interested in fitness cool makes it seem approachable cool yeah you do. That's right all right. This is called switch fit if it does it's not called Switzerland. I'm going to be upset. Are you going to boycott. I mean I'm going to boycott it anyway because I don't need it but you know I know Oh. This is your such a kind soul. Everybody people been tweeting this at me. Constantly Fault of us like you guys do to play. I love that you're thinking of me about this with the story so for those who do not know. KFC is apparently creating a colonel colonel sanders dating don't emulator which looks remarkably like dream daddy may say from Paula Gunn. KFC Yes the fast food. Restaurant is working on a video game with developer cy the fried chicken connoisseurs are releasing dating simulator called. I love you Colonel Sanders of Finger Lickin good the dirty just so dirty there is an exclamation point after sanders official you know branding and everything the game popped up wanting this morning as quote coming soon according to the listing a KFC representative told polygon the game will be available for free on steam on September twenty fourth a quote from the same people who brought you. The bucket of chicken comes the world's first Colonel Sanders dating simulator the description reads. I love you Colonel Sanders finger licking good dating simulator the later we'll put players in control of a promising student studying alongside a young young young Colonel Sanders. This is not old man. Dan Colonel Sanders while looking for love for you've got to make it through the culinary school part to if you're lucky Colonel Sanders might even take you on as a business partner you partner in bed partner in life of the nine characters. There's also would dog who is apparently a professor at the Culinary School of course of course I of course. KFC's that there are multiple hours of Gameplay a secret ending and recipes there are also cooking battles eleven herbs and spices and plenty any of quote miniature food also reminds players a few times that yes. KFC Did really make this game well. I love you. Colonel Sanders a finger lickin good dating later is they bizarre intriguing move from the fast company. It's not too out of live and twenty eighteen cancelled fancy loves the gaming twitter account called. KFC Gaming the social media account is all over the place hurling music video clips all across debt. Oh my God this. This is the story of this week I agree. I think this is my favorite story. You've ever read I love you Colonel Sanders and finger licking good. I mean it's ridiculous and I appreciate that they are just I don't I don't love it. They ripped off for him. Daddy's art style but I them props for knowing that dream. Daddy was popular and for them trying to imitate but they should give some licensing question have you have you seen Colonel Sanders this young yes. Oh of course yeah okay okay. Would you hit it. Yeah really one thousand percent not really I think I would I would make him shaved the goatee part. If I with the mustache yeah he would have to do something so he doesn't look like himself because I can't see I'm not okay. I'm not trying to sound like an asshole. I'm kind of repulsed by Colonel Sanders as you should be. He pushes gross greasy chicken on everybody and this is the has anything to do with the physical appearance of them. It's just it's weird that you have this like dude who was like a cartoon character. Originally I don't know as origins now. He's like a real human human and now apparently I didn't date him and it's just too weird for me and I I'll end up playing. I mean this is to anime style for me to like. Get caught up on what you just said. I'm just like hot anime. Boy Only thing I would do is shave your chin hair because it looks weird. I mean that's what Colonel Colonel Sanders facial hair does look like but to me. I'm like it'd be much hotter if he just had the mustache and it would be better because in my opinion would be like will young Colonel Sanders exactly goatee part yet like he just had had the mustache and then later he got older he decided to for whatever reason grow this disgusting thing on his mind but yeah so are you. Are you goatee or the mustache team goateed if you want more this for this image depends on the person everyone's 'cause like sometimes the goatee is good if you have to like high level Russian but the for this guy in particular that I'm looking at on the Internet this Colonel Sanders lose the goatee. Keep the mustache some Sam looking kind of lose lose. I'm looking at it. Why don't you shave off then? He might look to you know because they've looked to you. I think the moustaches fine with him back back. I don't mind it at all. That is not a not a barrier for entry the mustache to me. It reminds me too much of old colonel. Colonel Sanders is where rights too much of it. I lost that then it would look like a young dude with a moustache. Maybe just shaved it all off. Though Oh look twelve I'm not into that. I'm not either but it'd be better than I would not be better better depicting adults as young children and is never a good thing. It's a very creepy thing I'm just saying in this case. I think you could shave off the facial hair and he would look at he would look eighteen nineteen and it would be okay. No you wouldn't be running a frigging culinary institute at Eighteen or nineteen. Hey Man I'm sure some people have I'm sure you're yes in the history of the world perhaps but are you saying you don't believe in Colonel Sanders. It's one of those shows as did you think of like grandma got run over by a reindeer lake. If you believe girdles enters but that's where we grab all we believe I don't know like like you can say you don't believe in Santa but you can say you don't believe in Colonel Sanders Okay and the the other saving grace. This anime character of Colonel Sanders is the little like black Bowtie doesn't look like his body you know. Have you seen those beams where it's like that looks like the Black Bowtie. It's just a big head on a big none of small body not seeing that no oh yeah it's weird weirds me out all right well. I think we've detected poor Colonel Sanders and fucking oh no looking at the logo and I see it I see it. It was released yeah I can't. I can't see that how that's unfortunate. I think maybe if his hair was white and he shaved something. Oh I like that the Harris White especially especially because the art style and because it's super animated I love it and that's great. It's nothing to yeah. It's nothing dude the direction it's just him I. I just can't think of old dude on the commercials again. I'm sure you're going to be old onto one day. God Sammer No. I'M GONNA I'M GONNA get in Jacksonville input test tubes and I'm going to be preserved forever and ever and it's GonNa be great and I'll come aww banks Malians all right ladies and gentlemen. It's it's time to move on so points to end this thing and we'll be back with some hands on impressions like years of war five I and other things that haven't read yes. We'll be right back. Welcome Back Ladies and gentlemen to segment of the what's good Games podcast retail you what we've been getting our grubby hands on number doesn't have grabbed my hands clean the are you always have beautiful manicured nails and this is Joe Polish off that they are bear. That's good I I need to get my nails done because their to their objects their weapons weapons of mass destruction right now because there are too long and we are not gonNA talk about our hands anymore okay so we have been playing video games so I've been playing gears five. I finished Blair. Ah finished gears five at finish Blair witch. I've been playing deadly. Premonition is short. It's like yeah like maybe five hours Oh yeah and a little bit of creature in the world but always talk about that until Andreas back because she has been playing. I think she finished it. I think she did good overachiever all right so I married well. You've playing gears I have but I started that because so I got this beautiful care packages. I believe you did as well well so thank you thank you to xbox sending us over you know obviously codes for the game and then they step us like consoles and controllers and all sorts of lovely things that I was not expecting leasing so it was it was super nice but I was waiting to install the new xbox before downloading the game and I had already started playing nights. Listen bike so I kind of put it off until I finish that but I got into gear last night. I'm obviously not super far into it but I just started act two. I'm like done with chapter one of two and although this may be a premature thing to say I'm hoping you will confirm or deny for me Brittany. I feel like this is feeling good. I I feel this feels more to me like the og gears did I did not like for the record I did not like yours for I did not finish cures for I felt it was a little boring boring. I didn't enjoy the level design. I didn't enjoy the set piece for the most part felt it miss it was missing something for me and I think a lot of that was variety and I hate to say it like soul soul or something. Whatever that intangible thing is yea? You sometimes are missing. That's what yours for was for me now. I know exactly what you're talking about. I think that's part of the reason why a lot of GOP Jeez these days they try to recreate cree of old like they're great but it's got a city like Tokyo. RPG factory they try to remake gop but they lacked certain something they're good Games. They just lack that fine technical game exactly a yeah like for me I just I don't know something about it was not not clicking didn't like it to finish it and it even has like one of the loves of my life Laura Bailey sorry. I really liked the character kate so to me that is what signifying how I have felt about gears before and so I'm very excited that now I am super into what's happening here sure and also gorgeous like what a walking they dave built some beautiful pieces for you to explore the lighting is par perf like it's just so so crisp and beautiful. It's like an uncharted game and some parts of it. It's just so so pretty and I lost my train of thought. So you pick something up. Okay I got you girl. It's currently sitting on the eighty five on metacritic so yeah people are people are digging it. So have you played all the other Aguirre's game steiner have finished gears one gears to I finished like three quarters of gears three the only reason I didn't finish that one was because of this is not a dig at you but a different friend not throwing shaded Britney different friends they would play with me while I was waiting for them and waiting for them away for them and then and then it happened just never happened. I never finished. I don't even promise anymore you you were fine yeah. I already know better until like count on you for that. Gears four didn't play because I wasn't enjoying it okay. That's totally fair. I've also played all of them. Including judgment so I like me some gear as you know after he spent after your five six games into the series of you include judgment you kind of have a specific bought an expectation from these games. I agree with timer that to neatest one feels like it takes everything from niggers series and just makes it better. There are a few things that I'm not sure about and I'll talk with you. Bottom up to it but okay so we'll keep spoiler free as well obviously so we will not spoil anything for you. Never you fear like Samra said thanks again to xbox in the Coalition for providing does those amazing care packages and the codes. I believe the game comes out on the sixteenth for everyone but right now if you had game pass ultimate I think it's out yet yeah out for a while right. Okay so the story of yours five picks up after gears of war for that said I think you can just hop into gears five you might be here's the thing I played all the gears. Here's games and I'm still a little confused so yeah I mean basically like big bad bugs came and back to Earth and there's this big weapon called the hammer of dawn that you're trying to like bring back so he can kill everything they hammer abs on is essentially a mega power laser by satellite yes but you need the satellites. It's to coordinate where the hammer of dot actually goes so and it's been a thing since you know the beginning right hammer gone so good though one thing that's interesting to me and so I didn't finish gears for but in gears five in acts one it basically recaps a lot of what happens in gears for or that was important and most of it. I've seen so like the fact that I didn't finish that game and I recognized all those countries I was like did nothing happened in the last part of this. I was so confused what it was yeah no yeah that's a good point. I forgot that they do. They do recap it so you can jump right into this this when you do not need to play gears for they will sort of loosely set up exactly what happens and yeah you'll be fine would worry too much about it. The bad guys you shoot them. Big Bugs getting even call them sometimes so yeah. I've always been a linear game in the story. Progresses is yes you do the levels. Will you have some dialogue you go to the next area of Rinse Wash repeat the writing and these images so beautiful facial animations. They are just like oh very very good. I was playing Jason. I played with Jason this whole game and he made the comment that he thought these were the best facial animations he's seen in a game. I think God out of wars better but still like these are really good yeah. We're not going to say that they're the best out of anything because I haven't sat down and like aired eared but they're very very good and even when they go back to show you the gears for cut scenes you can see how far they've come graphic which is kind of Nice. I thought totally so it's beautiful and you know it's good when you can just look at character and there's like a little twitch in their eyebrow or something as a thousand words so it's it's beautiful so in this game the something that's I don't remember this was in gears for over was I don't remember this many but there are a few open areas this time around and baby during the last one but I can't remember because that game came out years ago and I don't have that good of a memory but there's two for example. There's two towns and one of them was rather large and if you want to like walk around and check out everything and there's things to collect and conversations to listen in on one appears is actually one of the towns and that's pretty you find when you hear her talking and then there's the obvious open world mini open world sandbox. Whatever you WANNA call it areas that you explore on indistinct called a skiff and it's think of it like a jet ski but not like a very big long modified jet ski thing anyway anyway you could use that and you can traverse around the world the areas as well and by doing so you can find side quests and decide closer fund because obviously reward you you upgrades for your new Buddy Jack? He'll talk about in a second but it's great because it gives kind of that moment of rest for the characters were there. You're in something a little different where they can kind of have those dialogues that want to have in the in the regular campaign skelly overdoing this thing that said the side quests are all will shoot me waves of enemies you find thing of course but it is nice to kind of take them away from that main campaign and have them engage in dialogue that you went to hear otherwise like silly Cork Sui conversations so that's nice to put like those parts are good but I feel like gears greats is when it is kind of that okay linear. Let's go action action action dialogue. Maybe have like a five ten minute moment where you have some like Loki downtime where you're just exploring but then you throw you back in action. So have you come across any of those areas yet so the first one yeah the beginning of two is where you will find a lot of Pierce's character character and so I've heard her. It was cool but yeah I think granted again. I'm super early into this game but I way have enjoyed the pacing of it so much more than I enjoyed gears force pacing because even though yes what you do for the majority of this game is shoot things the cover shooter. What else are you going to do? I've found like they've been able to break it up so far in such a way where it doesn't just feel like walk into a room get get behind cover shoot walk down a hall right behind cover shoot it they didn't do that which I actually felt like gears for was at some some points and that was part of what was really frustrating me. I just felt really bored of it but they've really played around. Even they've had some fun with it. Which obviously I'm not going to tell you anything that happens but some of the missions are you can tell that the design team had fun figuring out the set piece battle and like how it would play out and they also have a lot of fun with the characters and the way that they are interacting with each other which makes everything so much better so much more interesting so much? It's more fun to breathe life into the game just the way that they all are bouncing off of each other and like there was just a twist that I hit and now I'm like Oh my God what's happening so so they're really coming to together as a really good story. My words are Oh. You don't like it's all coming together to be like Oh. This is a studio that Ken tell really interesting stories so I look forward to seeing where the rest of this campaign goes yeah and that's. I'm glad you brought that up because it's it's so true. There's hardly any there's not a lot of moments of silence and in good way. It's not like all those annoying banter back and forth but there's enough to always keep you engaged in the writing is so good that even the few sentence you get every year and every now and again. It's enough to tell you a lot. What about the characters and that you really understand like what they're going for like what their Mo is and I feel like no matter what we whatever we were doing? They would comment on it which is so so damn nice because that's one of my biggest pet peeves and gaming when something really cool happens but no one has anything to say about it like no this is the thing you're like. Ah Yeah so speaking of characters. Jack is the new buddy rose walk. New robot friend originally is dave the Dave's the other day and so you jack and what he does to combat is really fun so he has these abilities that you find oh components I think is what the name Lamar throughout the levels yeah and you collect them and then you can use to upgrade Jackie has like a skill tree of sorts of sorts and as side missions. I was mentioning gene earlier. You'd like you go explore those defined awesome upgrades for him and that's kind of like the whole point of doing though cyclists and I'm pausing because my computer just beeped at me. Are you there. I'm still here okay. Everyone's still here's everything still recording. I know yeah no beeping okay. We are good anyway so yeah like I was saying what he does is he has he's fun abilities. You can use in combat and have like a little bit of a cool down but they the really quick so the main ones I used was shocked traps which is really convenient. When you have a whole bunch people like running out you you just set him on the ground and it'll take electrify them sometimes even explode them and it's really good at slowing down the big guys like the wardens and whatnot and there's awesome ability that I just got that allows you to confuse enemies and it turns them on their own allies? ooh Can you talk about the big ones yeah target you can't target like the word ends and stuff like that but you can target almost anything else that you can't target the science but you can target target the bashes or sort of a little robots robots that shield them. It's it's at such a fun little twist to the combat and man the combat is super super intense excited saying it's it's a cover shooter but I think gears is mostly known for its amazing combat and it's so much fun and it's so intense I get three battles in particular where Jason I probably he died like ten times and it was a thing where it's like okay. What are we doing wrong and we figure it out different strategies? We figured out what worked what didn't it but it it always felt really rewarding and only one of them felt unnecessarily punishing but we played on intermediate so it wasn't you know we didn't have a hard time or anything like that but it's just the intensity of the battle is that they the coalition is really struck awesome balance of feeling like overwhelmed but it's not impossible to do yeah yeah. I'm also playing on intermediate so far. I haven't run into any too much trouble. I've been down a couple of times with a it will just pick me back up and yeah so so so far. It's fine again. I've met a few more acts Toco but I am excited like so. I actually got up earlier this morning and played before I had to go to work and then I was slightly late to work because I wanted to keep playing. I just WanNa play gears now something else. He brought up earlier that I also want to say it's just the level design in this game is just so amazing. There's one part in a game where you're in a kitchen and I was just marveling at it. Jason Thought I was really nerdy for this but I am you bad bro. It's just the fact that someone built like the most intricate kitchen for like a real that you're gonNA that. Most players are just going to run through in like three we seconds and never come back again but if you just stop and look around and look at the attention to detail this kitchen has fucking incredible and it's like whoa like someone took all all this time to build this even though players is probably gonNA run through it hardly ever take the time to look at it. Yeah I've been taking my time through all of the levels and I look around because I'm also looking for components opponents for the robot and I also actually had a similar thought Britain. I was like you know I feel like probably the majority of players just run through to the next subjective. I must take my time gonna like walk around. I'm GONNA see what they've put here and see what they tell stories obviously through what what is left around the world and like there's one part where you're in this area actually. I can't believe whatever it's just interesting the way like oh just setting up up some suitcases or something else can can show you what was going on there right before you came in and so if you are if you go low to play this game which I would suggest you do because you can do it with game pass. Just take your time with that like go through the levels. Take a look around and number one because you'll get components which is always helpful and then number two appreciate kind of what people taken the time to build the school. Yeah I know exactly the area you're talking about and that was also my thought to you and it's amazing when you look around you really digest what story is being told through the level design itself off. Your Shits fucked yeah his dark and twisted. This is a you appreciate the Banter Times two characters have because if you think about what's going on in this world of gears did it's really not good. Here's a war is definitely one of those and I don't. I don't take this lightly because I don't think suicide is the thing you should say Liley but this is a game and if I lived in this world I would kill myself one hundred percent like there's no way I want those leach things coming after me. I don't want any of these horrid things coming after like no this terrible. I don't think I could do it. I don't think I have the strength or resolve to make it through a world like this. It's yes I'm happy UPI so that too because it's I mean I don't want you to do that. I will never happening out. We're actually we'll never be in gears of words World Sarah. We'll that'll never gets here. They'll never happened but yeah. I think this is the first game in the series where it's like you know things you're screwed up but I think in all video games are screwed up but this is the first time in gears for I've kind of stopped and looked around and I guess not really ever realized how bad things were and that's just again like the level of Zion and of course we don't there's collectibles where you can collect pamphlets documents another the thing that little box stories and whatnot as well but yeah I mean I just I just really enjoyed my time with it and I think it's it deserves all the praise. It's getting I did have some connection issues the weekend after launch obviously but it's Kinda like what game doesn't have those issues like. I'm trying to play torchlight to you right now and I just can't because it just keeps keeps booting us so that was kind of frustrating and there was some bugs was like infinite checkpoint save and whatnot but I would say like the only thing about it. I'm still not entirely early. Sure how I feel about it. Are The open world ish type areas. I enjoyed them and I had fun with them. I just don't know if they were necessary and I I remember mostly optional yeah. It's all optional. You know the size of totally optional but you have to like get on the skiff and drive from point A. to Point B. and maybe if you I do that. It's not as intrusive. I don't. That's the right word but you know me. I wanted the triumphs thank you. I wanted to try out all of the side. Quests and I did all but maybe maybe to at the very which I knew it would have got me another Jack Upgrade Component as like this is fun and it's it's cool but I think again like I was saying earlier. I think we're gears. It's really shines is when you are in like those beautifully paced for the game forces you to go its pays yeah 'cause open world. The tricky part of Oakland role has always been pacing and storytelling storytelling because you can't dictate what the player does you just kind of like well hurry go. I guess I don't know literally where you're going to go. You could go anywhere and I have to make this makes sense but so yeah I haven't gotten to that part yet so I but I imagine I will likely err on the side of last aside quest because simply I find I get fatigued out of shooters relatively quickly and unless I'm playing co op and I'm not playing with anybody right now so it's just like well. I'll probably skip most of those died missions and just go through the story because so far the story missions have been very well paced and I've really enjoyed toward them yeah. It's great and characters are Great Dulles. One of my new husband does eggshells coup delco yeah and you know the game really does set you up for quite the intense ending so it's good it's really good and I would definitely recommend checking it out. If you know it sounds like your kind of thing so little props to the coalition you did great job great fantastic game a game. I will never play Blair witch. Yeah Okay Yeah so Blair witch and thank you for the codes as well for this so employees obviously Blair witch has been around since like the ninety S. I think it's one of the first one came out. Was the mid nineties or why are you asking me. I have no idea I'm trying to think of what the player was project. I came. I don't remember I was hugging and you get one. Let me the Blair witch project movie came out in Nineteen Ninety nine yeah and it's detain then then then is that a song not exact cadence but guess yeah so the movie release nineteen was supposed to take place as the nineteen ninety-four and the creepy. There's been a few different Blair. Witch is like since then but the creeping about the Blair witch is it's this area of woods and I play this game like a week and a half ago so memories aren't totally pristine but I've seen the movies anyways area of woods and there's some weird shit going on and there's like all the Blair witch. She's coming to get you but burn. The creepy thing about this lord of whatever is that. You don't really get answers if you've watched the first movie you don't really quite understand what happened happened or why and movies don't end on a happy note like the thing is never discovered or killed or anything like that so I was kind of expecting so then what are the movies. Is this just like wandering around like something killed me an end of the movie I mean that's usually how most movies and is like you think you've solved the problem and you think you're fine the new twist but in the first movie for example you know it just ends with someone finding their friends staring in a corner and then Oh my God and what are you doing and then the camera gets knocked away and then everyone said and then the movie and then it ends and the idea is this is found footage and everyone's like Oh my God what the heck happened Sunday. These poor college students goodness. That's they went into the woods. That's the problem they ought Lord. Don't go anywhere. Stay in your dorm room. Stay on campus Sunday GonNa say reports of people went out in the woods and this is going back to kind of the the movie people been missing in the woods or in thing where things have happened happen so these kids go out and they go camping and they wake up in the here like weird screaming in the ways to hear sounds they wake up. They're walking literal circles. They don't know how any something's messing with them and you'd never really quite get like the closer so which of the Blair on the Blair witch game developed by Bluer so again you bluer further the review code it. I was kind of expecting something more along that line of the game. It's spooky. It has its moments where like you know you're GonNa Pitch Black. All you have is your flashlight and you have your dog which is like a really good boy your dog. You have a dog in the know. Is the dog okay. I mean I can't remember the dog's name bullet. I will not spoil anything about the dog okay but I never playing this game. I don't care but yes obviously if you're listening and in her excited don't you have yeah so it's you. You're okay so you're a you're dude and you're going to the woods you have your dog bullet and we're going to try to find this dismissing dismissing kid so you go out into the woods just unbelievable and you so you go research. Can there's already like a search effort underway and you just go with your dog. You recently like you don't have relationship issues and you're thinking this is going to be good for me so you've got a nice Johnson. The Woods Woods. We'll all of our relationship issues going to die out here. It's fucking terrible double so you get out there and then like sure shit like you know kind of weird. Things are happening you know Y- Since the game takes place in the mid nineties while I believe and I say that because the phone that he carries with him and it's access year your Ui for everything it's an old like Nokia it's where it has some games on it and it has like the greenback screen green. That's like all lit up and those who are young probably are like what the heck are these kids. What are we talking about? That was the way the phones back at mcdavid old cell phones. Yeah battery lasted lasted for four days the best it was the best battery does last excrete of you know you go in there with your flashlight your cellphone some dog treats your wallet and a walkie talkie and you don't have any food for yourself now. I don't know this man stupid stupid great so I don't know what the standard is. GonNa have to eat dog treats and of course you ever Cam quarter will like obviously those kind of people guy's name is Ellis. He goes into the woods and you know then weird things. Start happening to them and I'm like okay like this is Kinda freaky. I can see this in the dog is great. You can tell it to go search but you can have a stay by your side. You can have it stay you. Can you can pet the dog like don't some the poor pauper out to search. He sees his Hugh at all times. I know four puppy the the the thing about it that kind of turn me off is the game more tells a personal story of the main character Ellis this and it seems more like he's struggling with his personal. PTSD because of the woods around him and while it is a very interesting story. I don't know if his story was right for the Blair witch game I when I think of what the Blair witch story and more of this guy's story right exactly and ah some people some people thought that was the most interesting part of the game but I think what I had kinda had everybody has the answers I know I think you're right. I'm someone like twisted. It messed up. I just wanted to go into the woods. I WANNA get fucked with. I don't want to know why I just wanted to quote for ages because Bluebird team is so oh good you know layers and layers if you're too observation like they're so good at these kind of games and I love them so much and the this is a fine game issues not kind of what I had wanted or expected from it but I will say you know in the Final Act while it does drag on a little long. That's really where I think it shined and really were the talents bluer stood out because you are in this area and you have your camcorder and you're like Oh. My God like this does feel like something that would have happened in the movie and that's when I found myself enjoying it the most there there are some weird design choices. You know there's one thing where you literally walk in a circle for like a few minutes if for no real reason you don't understand why you're doing it and it's weird. It's hard to explain without spoiling anything but it's just some of the things I'm like. Why would you do that and the combat just feels like it wasn't necessary to combat is essentially you point in your flashlight at these like would monsters who are trying to come after you and the only way you know where they're at is if your dog like if bullets like barking at them and then you kind of aimed your flashlight or the dog is barking and then you catch them then big bright flash goes off and then you do like three times and it's just an feel necessary? Sorry just wanted to die in the woods. I know I mean yes. Yeah I mean I I wouldn't have minded died in the woods. If it was like a weird like Oh my God and then you like piece it all altogether any he'll yeah and there's multiple endings but the way did you look up the multiple innings after I finished the game because 'cause I wasn't happy and they were any of them satisfying to would you like. I wish I would've had that one. No I mean the one I had. I think was fine but there's tap capital of fine. The weird thing is to get if okay if you're going to go into this game and you. I don't know if you'd WanNa play it twice and you want to try. GotTa get like the better and Dean I would. If you WANNA consider a better ending I would say like just look it up because there's some things that the game really encourages you to do. It's like hey here's this thing right in front of you this. Here's a button prompts. You should do this and not do a once. You've ruined all chances and has happens within the first like I don't know like ten ten fifteen minutes of the game brierley shock when like the few killing dooms yeah and it's stuff that you win it it doesn't you would never even think about it. It's yard so anyway like Saul Mind Games. This is the mind gave you wanted this. I guess this really really been hammer yeah. I know it's definitely spookiest definitely creepy. I don't think the personal story needed to be told in this game. I think it would have been better saved for different Kinda game. I think Blair witch what comes along with that is a certain set of expectations but I mean yeah it's INDISP- UC things in us are scared of being in the woods and there's there's a puzzles in there that are like why are these admitting here. I don't know anyway I still live a game and not to walk necessarily later. I guess that's the thing they don't you don't need to maybe they don't look it well. I Love Bluer team but I don't think it was the right design choice fair enough but that's just my opinion but still there are great studio and you should support them all right Sandra. What's this one thousand bikes? You don't know about nights and bikes. I don't okay through this is from our good friends at double fine. Also thank you for the code so I love a lot of things that double fine does because they're cute and quirky and I think aesthetics of them always yeah nice and bikes aesthetically reminds me very much of like a costume quest sort of I'm not not for one for one by any means but just generally I guess and so it's the story of two girls girls who are relatively young I don't they don't really say exactly how young they are and I'm terrible with children and guess and agents so I'm not I gotta try but it's a story of friendship. Basically between these girls were going out on adventures together and they pretend to be like a centrally and the bikes are like their steeds and it's a really fun little game. It's the there is combat so it's not just like running around around. It's not walking seven. It's not anything like it has actual game play to it. At a lot of that is based on the fact that first of all Brittany you would love this game because it's Coop Yep perfect and so you either play as Demelza or Nessa and each of them have different moves for weapons as you go through the world. You'll power them up power them up. You will basically find you up for your arsenal. Let's do different things and it's sort of there's not a ton of this but there is is a little bit of the this part of the map will unlock later sort of thing once you get a certain scale. There's not a lot of it but there's it's very minimally there. It's like a little bit of like seasoning salt on on the steamer but it was really cute game and then explored friendship ship but especially at that age what it means and how relationships are and it also really explored some some more. I'm trying to super vague because I don't want to give away story but it does explore deeper almonds with one of the girls I think my own my main bummer is it doesn't explore the other one very much. She's he's just kind of like that piece. You get their relationship but you don't get any backstory on her or where she's come from or like why she's there and and that was sort of a miss for me I wish that they had explored both girls stories equally but maybe the sequel who knows and otherwise I think this game is also beautiful like the colors are super rich. The lighting is fantastic. There were a few moments elements were urinated because of the way that they were trying to send a medically do the camera made me feel almost claustrophobic. It was like a little too far in you would not be able to quite tell where he was. It goes through like running into walls and shit and you're like wait. I don't know if it's harder to explain exactly but I I put it at certain points. It was difficult to maneuver properly because they were so zoomed in and I couldn't figure out I was supposed to go. It doesn't happen a lot but it does happen enough times where I noticed that I was like annoying. Why are you doing this? Let me zoom out looks really cute. I'm loving the style. How long did it take you to you? beat it. I don't know how many hours I started over the weekend and then I put in a few hours every night so it's not super long. It's not super short art kind of somewhere in the middle. Maybe four to six okay something like that. It's not too bad and there are a lot of co oppa sort of puzzling things in the sense that you'll need to figure out which one of the girls should be doing whatever move to like help you move forward so it's like eleven environmental puzzles old and then combat you'll be fighting these curse things and start with Oh. Let's give you an idea. DEMELZA does a lot more of the we started more Malay kind of things ness was a little bit more arranged and so like a democracy has like willies as you can just like kick him stops and starts with the Frisbee where you just like toss it at people or you can charge them up and basically shotgun spread out and that was really fun. I really feel like this game has to shine with co OP. I'm super bad I played it by myself but even though I was playing thing alone I was having a good time with it because it's such a beautiful cute quirky little game it's again. I think already so this is part of why left double fine is that they make things like this. I and I just think they're really unique and special and you should support them. It looks it looks cute. Is it kind of like a feel the game yeah okay. The elements of the story are feel good like a deficit. It explores some tougher conversations but it doesn't bring you down yeah like live so yes it touches both light and dark. I would say and it does so fairly well L. Alexa durable. I had no idea if somehow this game completely yeah left my radar and it looks adorable. Yeah it is horrible. It's out out now. It was out on August twenty seventh. It's on playstation four xbox. I think you know pc all the usual spots. I played playstation four and then another thing I really love Baba's. I love the way they animated it. So is a little red headed girl who has like kind of to lay Ibans that just like bounce around the way that they had a Panamanian her. I like her faces. Throughout the game are the absolute best makes she makes faces. She makes oh my gosh. I should like a she's you. She's just realizing because like the face is so intense sometimes and you're Whoa Jewelry Nessa is supposed to be a little bit. It's hinted that Nessa is older than they don't. They don't really say how much or anything again so but you can really tell they animate them very beautifully sort of the top one who saunters a bit a bit more and then expanding alum. I God and it's so so cute so if you have somebody that you like playing cops co-op games with I would definitely pick this up if you have kids. I think this would be a decent one too. Few are looking for a thing to pick up and play. If you have daughters. Here's our health funds whatever but totally actually text raced in right now until him to get this downloading because this looks really cute because I've been playing like a lot of not dark but just kind of like looking for a little bit of a pallet cleanser. 'cause you know obviously gears. You know it's intense. It's not like a depressing but it's intense and Blair witch and I hopped into deadly premonition origins which is a ride all in itself and so I'm like I need something like little things right. Yeah yeah go nights as as in like knights of the round table is in the time of day nine hundred seventy a yeah we got borderlands coming up on talk real quick about a deadly premonition origins. I don't have to say about this right now because I I think the patch just went live yesterday but there's gnarly audio bug that's again. Can you believe it simmer. I'm having having another I don't how is this possible to be fair like digest me. It's a known issue but it's funny because they bought the known issues you just give him. No audio cuts after like twenty minutes but you know in a game like deadly premonition. It's almost okay because I mean for those. Who Don't I know you wanNA give a little back story deadly premonition? I don't even like we did you not oh. I never played it back. In the day I remember when the lodge I know it's one the most polarized games because like again to bring up a lawn. It's her favorite game of all time but then some people gave it a two out of ten so I it was at this game came out and Eric pigs still a friend of mine was reviewing it at Oh my at first he was like really into it and by the end he hated it like this game is broken. It's stupid and it is I love I love it yeah so let's keep it originally came out in twenty ten for those who might be confused is a survival horror game and kind of one of those if you fall under the camp of it's it's so bad it's good. That's where this fell. If you liked it or you were like no. It's just bad like so. That's a good way putting it yeah I've been trying. I've been robbing a poor brandon rock and I'm like how do I describe people that this is not a good game but it's so good at the same time yes. It's just like it's so bizarre and so we're I did try originally backed. I came out. I played it for maybe like thirty minutes and I remember thinking how ridiculous it was but I I've never forgotten it and so when it came out on the switch obviously Nintendo had their their big thing last week I was like okay now's a good time to happen but there's this audio bug that's plaguing me and the the audio cuts out and then it's not so terrible but it's just whatever so I think it's fixed now so maybe like seven hours into it at the moment and it's just so beautiful beautiful and I just WanNa love it and take care of it nurse it to health cannabis Samer. Let's clear again yeah like I said it's either. It's so so bad it's good or it's this is just bad and for me. I think I would probably side with broad big for me. It would just be bad game but now it's yeah for sure because it's frustrating. I've definitely had like a few moments like okay free because there's a lot there's a lot of driving and you have a map right driving in but gators no way to mark where you gotta go you just literally got to open up your fucking mapping your menu and like look at it and kind of rotate like okay. How do I get what streets streets away turned on so it was like that's kind of an annoying bug? It's kind of game where you have to save at like manual locations like there's no auto save or anything like that and it's hard to figure out like how fast travel works how anything works in this game so I'm finding myself on the couch with my ipod game fact like walk walk through and make okay. So what do I have to do because it's just yeah it's a good thing I want to play it but it's like I don't have that much time to dedicate to like learning this whole system so I'm Aziza Guide and it's it's made my life a little easier. I would think you would need to if you are like awesome need to churn through games. Oh my God it's a beautiful baby but I think that essentially covers it like I mentioned earlier. I am trying to dabble in torchlight too but there's this unfortunate issue. I don't know if it's other platforms but on Xbox it's voting people out of your games from trampling up so that down obviously we got borderlands coming up. We'll we'll be playing that all weekend and yeah. That's going to be a game itself but yeah I think I think that's it my student anything not that I can think of got a nice short and sweet one for you this week. Yeah I think we we melt it. I talked about five seven and a little bit so I could give us some padding now but it's all good it was another fun episode so and we hope you enjoyed it so if you did remember go counselor people who leave us one-star reviews saying that were fake or we mispronounce people's. AMC Much well. I mean we do is accurate that we mispronounced but we do. Don't talk us three stars for it. I'll accept one started action and that's it yeah but don't you just give us five years. Give us five because you who needs to make up for the people who deduct three. Please help ask well. Thank you guys so much for watching and listening on say watching on Itunes and listen in on Youtube but that's completely ass backwards strikes out verse it thanks for watching on YouTube dot com slash. What's Good Games and listening on podcast service is is wherever you listen to you all right friends? I'm hot. I'm sweaty. Star steamer is beautiful. We're going to call it
Full Show (MJ's docuseries, Dak's deal, Tom Brady, Shaq + Kobe vs. MJ's Bulls, Jalen Green, Brian Hoyer)
"Welcome to the undisputed podcast. I'm your host Jerry Taft. This podcast is the full show from today's episode of undisputed from start to finish. They've got a busy slate. So Skip Shannon. Let's get to it. Good welcomed undisputed. I'm Jenny Taff with CABELA's Shannon sharp Friday. We've got show. How are you guys doing today? I'm doing great. I'm doing great this deal. No you can't see me so know now in California you gotTa have a mass going to go out in public and I was feeling Cadillac blending in with everybody else and so I have my Gosh Ron Barber to make me some custom Louis Vuitton and go yard man. I say because if I'm going out I'm going out in style and I'm going out with a smile or did they did. Why why did he wears a mask for this whole show? So nobody can. I would prefer got to hear you during the show and I appreciate the fact that you're shouting out somebody who gave you a free mask to put a mask on the air. That's what's happening. I got it still okay. We got plenty we got the INSEAD nineteen or whatever. I don't know what it's called but I I wear retard. Is that one. I got that one. Yeah so has there ever been a more fitting day for me to wear my little wayne chain goat on top of John Man Goat as the junk man? Doc The doc drops on Sunday night this is GonNa be someday here on undisputed it if give. I'm very excited. I'M NOT GONNA lie. I'm excited to see this light one of these summer blockbuster movies that's the anticipation and the buildup for this. I don't I can't recall a build up for something like this in an extremely long time. I'm very excited to see. We also come to about the release of that Michael Jordan documentary. How about we start by talking about the goat Michael Jordan? Because he recently said in an interview after watching the footage back. He's worried about coming across as a horrible guy. It's also worth noting that. Mj Did have approval of all the footage the final output of that documentary so Shannon. Are You surprised that Michael Jordan is worried about coming across as bad guy? No because you know Michael. He wanted to make sure his best foot was always forward. If you notice he never did an interview with him all sweaty. He was always button up. He would get fully dressed. He will put that goal earring in his ear. He would be a suit shirt tie. He wanted to make sure he was impeccable. He wanted people to only see that side of him and then when he was on the court he was all out but bear. Few people got an opportunity to get a glimpse at this skit when we talked about this. A little over six weeks ago about this documentary. I said there's no way that Michael Jordan is GonNa let all this release without having some without having some kind of safe some carol approval and was being out there. That's just the way he likes control in most people's were you doing the doctor made about my life. Absolutely I'm GonNa have some say what gives relief was killed. I think the notion is that people tend to think that if you're successful in your unanimously. Everything he's a choirboy he's goody. Two shoes eating their hurt anybody. He didn't offend anybody. And that's farther from the truth. The more accomplished a person near the more driven they are and the more they will not only still own your bank roll over you in order to accomplish their goal and make sure you're in the right brain my mind to help them accomplish that goal and they will bring you along so. I am not surprised because Michael Jordan has done everything since he burst onto the scene in nineteen eighty two almost forty years ago. He's done everything to protect his off. Decor because a lot of this Dr Mini yes. We're going to see him on the court but a lot of this is in the locker room but a lot of this plane riding on the bus. And you're GONNA practices and you're GONNA get enough. People will see Michael Jordan in a totally different light now is not going to change my perception of Michael. But I'm sure some people might may Michael the last Demo Dart Him all cable lay right with like believe it. He was like that and he should not have to apologize. Was Killed My gave your account a glimpse into what he was like at his hall of Fame Beach Hall of fame. You speeches give a celebration of carbonation of the ultimate validation. You're going to your sports heaven. And he took a chance to take a shot every single person he and his speech so I am not. I am not surprised that Michael is somewhat like man. How am I going big bigger? Look at me in a totally different. Like not surprised by that so yes. I'm not surprised but I'm still anxious to see and it's not GonNa Change my perception of I'm interested to hear how you feel about okay. I believe that as we speak. Michael Jordan is scared to death. He's going to come across. Is a horrible guy in this documentary. Even though he had the executives editorial control of this he signed off on every last inch of the footage that you're about to see in the ten part documentary had total control but I believe deep down he saying I could be damned if I do and damned if I don't. He really wanted this documentary to happen. He needed to happen right now. We're GONNA talk deeper about the wise of it a little later in the show. But I'll just give you a of the wise. In my estimation I believe he does get sick and tired of hearing that. Lebron James is the new goat and I believe he gets sick and tired of hearing a lot of times for me the biggest Michael Jordan fan that he is the absolute worst general manager team builder in the history of the NBA mostly with the Charlotte Hornets. So the point is as he approaches age sixty. He's turned fifty seventy starts thinking. Gee Maybe it's time I'm not on twitter. I'm not on. Maybe I should do one big epic documentary but to do so the you know sort of the producers involved. They're all saying well. Gee Michael we got gotta be real here and he's trying to be as real as possible and I'm trying with you today to be as real as possible. I think there's a double edged sword operating yesterday. You basically accused me of. Hey you got too close to him in Chicago and you pull your punches on it. Well sometimes maybe I do because I love the guy but I loved the horrible side of him so today. I'm trying to be painfully honest with you. That side of him. There's a side Abid side. He's not a nice guy. What if I told you from the start about Lebron James? He's too nice of a guy so Michael was the ultimate cold-blooded basketball killer. You're going to see that in this documentary and on the flip side. Lebron can beat you with his supreme talent. But it's not natural to him. It doesn't come natural to Lebron to be a cold blooded basketball assassin. That's not his nature that was Michael's nature so that nature. You're going to see behind the scenes behind closed. Doors is the nature that drove the rest of his teammates to try to achieve his level. So yeah he got fistfights in practice with Steve Kerr and will perdue Vanderbilt University. And Yeah you're going to see in this documentary. He is psychologically just pushing an intimidating. Were Scott Burrell. Who was the twentieth overall? Pick in the ninety three draft and Michael. Gist was all over in every minute to try to live up to being the twentieth. Pick in the first round of the draft. And you're going to see the guy behind closed doors. Who was a horrible guy in a great way? So that's the side. I always embraced. And that's the side that I think a lot of people are going to say man. That's not the guy I saw in space jam in Nineteen Ninety six that that guy in space jam that was the cartoon Superhero. Who was Michael Jordan? He wasn't that behind the scenes. And I've always told you all the things that I got to see is I was around in through the ninety eight season the last dance season. They weren't always pretty to watch but they contributed to winning. A six championship in six tries was six files. Mvp's because it takes nat horrible side of him to be that great so to me. I I do think he's going to sit back. Because Shannon my final point. I'm going to turn it back. You is Michael. Jordan was was even more protective of his image. Even more guarded in his image than Lebron is ever thought about being because a lot of times. Lebron will Kirsch publicly or he'll do things get mad at teammates on twitter between the lines. That sort of passive aggressive. He'll do it publicly and that's not a pretty sight to me. So he doesn't care that much about his image but Michael cared about his seeker. His SNEAKERS SELLING IMAGE. Probably to a fault he scared and I think the thing is that there's a public persona of my in their private persona and now that he's alive the product of the come out. Maybe he's looking back but I really have to do it like that. But he's not gonNA apologize for what he -CCOMPLISH but I think sometimes we get to a certain defamation and I look I'm not a look. I will preface this. I'm not saying I'm Michael Jordan. But there have been times. I look back wondering if I could have done it differently. A got the same results And that's wishful thinking. I don't regret anything that I've done because I don't know I'm not necessarily sure that I could have got to this point without being that waste. I remember what I got the John John was great player. And I'M NOT SAYING JOHN. Elway is Michael Jordan but he was safe things that he wanted to make sure that Shannon and the other guys would ready come game time so he would. He would do certain things not to this. Tommy John With quarterback through the different levels kept trying to buy anybody. Nobody's really trying to fight the quarterback. But I'm saying great play of they need to make sure it's give. I wanted to make sure because I need to know who I can count on with Mike. Ask a question or head coach question. What should we call if I can't get it with him because I know he's ready? What Michael Jordan? I lied I lied. Scott is going to be ready but I lied to know who isn't going to be ready so I'm GonNa push buns come practice time. I'M GONNA push buttons behind the scene so our no count on skill when you look at. We THINK OF MCDONALD'S. If we take a gatorade everybody the WanNa be like Mike and Mike said Hell when they see this. They don't WanNa be like Mike. Like forget might yeah let's give. He should worry about that. He should make no concession about what he was because skill. When you think that's what happens. We have to public people in the health. Frailty behind the scenes and they come out you like. I didn't know that he was like that audit and she was like that. And I think that's what Michael is going through. But in order to tell the story in its totality he had to put the majority of this out here so we could see because it. You don't want to run the risk of having a bunch of stuff and then somebody come back and say well. This was not all there was more. So I don't think anybody's going to come back and say man because without dry snitching might may might behind the scenes me. Different breeds giving people. Don't really get it. Because for the most part bear few people got an opportunity to get a glimpse behind the curtain. But might kill when you say. He's a different animal in when people say he's a different animal. Bet Don't really understand the count of animal that Rykiel but he was different and the women get before I go. If you're listening to everybody talk about Michael. You look at shock and you look at all the other great players. They all describe. Michael is like a god-like figure. If they say he's like he levitated is getting out with the first thing. I told you when I met him. I could not believe this. Land is levitating business Michael Jordan. Everybody says they shack is a great player can arguably a top ten player and other great players that's the Mystique basketball aura behind Michael. I don't know I don't know we'll ever see another player that can possess that. Okay but what I learned in ninety eight being around on a daily basis was he fiercely protected. That side that you're talking about in the public didn't see that side and to this day hasn't really seen that side. The first big glimpse came if you remember following the first championship season back in ninety ninety one when my former colleague at the Chicago Tribune Sam Smith wrote a book called the Jordan rules and it had a number of behind the scenes. Glimpses of that guy. You're talking about that guy you could write off as a horrible guy and Michael completely dismissed the book. He said basically a laugh at it. Then I'll move on. His teammates all defended him by ripping and shredding. The book and the book was dead on accurate so that was the first glimpse behind the scene and then from from there on. He does a ninety six as I mentioned. He does space jam and everybody went back to thinking. Wow is a cartoon superhero. He's the nicest guy on the planet and the first thing I noticed in ninety eight was in covering the Games is that to your point. I think I told you this early on. He never missed a trick. He never did an interview sweaty ever after a game. Except maybe a quick one with Ahmad Rashad courtside. Obviously in is still in his bathroom but the he would would make us wait for an hour hour fifteen if we got completely showered dressed. Got The earring in got everything perfect so he could present the perfect image to the public. So would always got me. Was that guy that that you would think would just own. The fact that he was a ruthless competitor wouldn't own it in public. He did not want the public to see that in the the infamous quote remember that he reportedly told her friend. Republicans buy sneakers too so he was completely apolitically. Didn't WANNA take side. He didn't want to take any social stand. I've always lauded and applauded. European Lebron James For all the social commentary and blazing some new trails and taking stands. That could cost him. Advertisers or advertising and Lebron has guts in that realm and. Michael always said not me out. I want to sell more sneakers and he sold billions of dollars worth sneakers as we all know and they're they're great product in their worthy of buying. I'm wearing them right now. But the point is that he had to protect his image. So you had the duality of cold blooded killer in reality that Guy. Who off the court flu man? I mean capable of just about anything and I'm not sure how much of that would be in the documentary to your point but again in the Public Guy Pristine image and I think he's very nervous right now of G. I needed this documentary now. I needed it in in large part to show the billions of new blind witnesses. Who Think Lebron is the goat led by La Shannon Sharpe? I need to show them what I used to be. Because that was back in one thousand nine hundred ninety eight and that was twenty two years ago as we know there are a whole lot of people watching our show right now who never saw Michael Jordan and and I get it but if you didn't see it live it's hard for you to get it. So he's saying watch this but in saying watch this is he gonNA show you too much. Will he alienate some of his fans? Who will say I didn't know that? Maybe maybe he wasn't the Nice Guy. Thought that he was nope he was not but I personally never thought he was a nice guy to start with. And that's in large part what I loved the most about him as a basketball player. Slash chiller skill. We you know we hear a lot of athletes says that you know there have a great game. The have a great. And you're like you know one day I'm going to be able to sit back and I'm going to tell my grandkids would. This is Michael Jordan. He's the only man you said he's fifty seven. He's the guy he's about to pop in the tape and entail all these people look at what this guy idea because we hear that all the time. I didn't really think about it but one day I'll be able to tell my kids. I'll be able to tell my grandkids. Well hard to Jordan is about to put a CD or DVD. Or whatever you WANNA call it now. And he's about to let the world see what he did for those. That did not get an opportunity to see up close and personal and he's also going to take you behind the scene skilled. Even though some people know was insulted me once they found out how it's made they still ate it. They're still going to be some people that after the videos they're still below Michael Jordan and rightfully so. I have no problems with it. He was just like I said you gotta give. I just wish every person in America can America's gift could just be a righty one time until by just riding. I'm not talking about how the conversation which is within five ten feet of I mean. Just look at it. You'll see what everybody else has been saying. Skip is not real is it is. It's an unbelievable feeling not in those skip. I know my grandmother's rolling over. She's a boy. You should not have reverence for any man like that. There's only one man you're supposed to have reverence as opposed to give dollar tree is no no. This is ridiculous. This is ridiculous. In his Bora and his prevalence and what made him whatever prince theme as impeccable as he was like you said yeah he might stay courtside with Emma and give it interview but he was not bringing it to the podium with a tower drake ride. His back would've tower drake next. I sold his Nishat into the podium. That was not Michael Jordan. He was coming with that. Who can you remember the rookie? He used to wear big gold chain bar. You theory here at the polio. But they'll be wearing. The actual game was killed. I am so excited to see this. I would not miss. This is GonNa take ten thousand soldiers an act of Congress and a calling from God to have me this. I would not miss this all the tea in China you know. They make a lot of tea in China. But I'm not missing this. I want to see because like I said it's a lot of what happened on the court as you because you were there so you know but I really want to see some of these random you got a little glimpse of it and when Jerry Reinsdorf told a story about how Michael broke his foot in one of the comeback and the doctor said there's a chance he could miss it up. It'd be missing up again. His career was over and Jerry reinsdorf explain. They might their tablets. Tim Peel none of them. Were cure your headache. One would kill you. Would you take one might say well how bad that can do saying? Do you understand the mindset. Would take a headache is hurting so bad. I roll the dice wherever he got up out of out of bed. Skilled this great great Drori. That's the only thing that I can think of greatness. He wanted to be great. And when you say people like Michael New because is they'll say twenty games into it he's GonNa create another position. Labyrinth called a man. Jesus was makers you talking about to pay all time greats. And that's what they were saying but this man early in his career so they they saw it covered. The song was on the horizon or Catholic. There's going to be a storm coming and it's going to be a big one. Well with the without technology just would is. That storm is coming and it happened in native born. And it's going to blow through this league and we're not gonNA see anything skill. I don't look. We debate the greatest of the player. But nobody is going to have the aura that this may create it. Impossible is impossible. So does that mean that right here right now. Live on undisputed. You're willing to concede that Michael. Jeffrey Jordan is the goat skill. What skill I say the man's Aura. As you can't take that away from you can't take away. The guy played in the you. Take the chance to try to slide in there. Brian the goal that I mean. I guess what I'm going to have the same anticipation twenty years from now being maybe Sam and hopefully my side is good but if a kate I hope like still here and I can hear about Gold James and the behind the scenes. How is he wasn't maybe he put Paul's somebody like you'll guy he stole. Steve Kerr too. I hope they showed added the footy where he stole. Move Steve Kerr stevie Simone theme it. Big WHEEL PURDUE. I guess we'll purdue desert that it about it for bed. Vanderbilt deserve this though because he promised that align with by at least likely teakwood on somebody's own size with will perdue because we'll produce seven feet tall just for the record. Skill abroad is not like bad who Brian is. Not One of those guys broad is like we tried to bring people together. That's what we do. Bring US getting your. There's there's different ways the league now. I don't want to go with this get. I've been praising Mike because he's historically generational he's ten generational great in there. You try to take a swipe it Lebron. I'M NOT GONNA kill where we're J. for now. She didn't put your mass SPEC on. We're moving on see last night the NBA Horse Challenge came to an end. Zach Levine and Mike. Conley met in the finals. We talked about the fact that Connolly set up was pretty incredible. What an indoor gym he was playing on compared to Levin he was playing outside on a wet court either way currently did end up winning by three letter so Shannon what was your take. What was your thoughts on this competition? My colleagues really good horse escaping and I have a feeling that my colleague and I said in the beginning I saw him play and that he's equally as good shooting the basketball non dominant hand which is his right hand. Aah these is dominant hand. Which is as left as he's not losing scale and what I saw from my car last night he just say okay. Oh they got a horse tournament okay. Let me go practicing. He previously shots lot. Skip the shot. But he he was dribbling and then behind his back off the backboard into the into and straight in in the over top of the bag. That's not something you just always at the week. Just go out there. And do he made it look so easy. Him Spinning the ball and then punching it. It goes in Skill N. Tells me that might carly practice these shots a lot that he's had a decided disadvantage because even the confines over a seventy degree indoor spaces indoor gymnasium was kicked out the anyone would have beat him because in order to be good at heart. What are you GonNa have imagination creativity and some of the things that he was tempted really skill? Now I'm thinking well maybe they can have this at the All Star game but you're going to have to cook. Could it doubt you probably going to have to play peekskill because you get a bunch of guys keep it probably GonNa take a little longer than what you want to so instead of having five letters you have to have three with? This would be something that would be very interested they can do away with the dunk contest. Knows Zeidler being Aaron. Aaron Gordon say he's not participating anymore so have this and maybe you can get stale. Maybe you get K. D. James hard some of these other guys that can participate because we really look at it the dunk contests used to get the big name guide. You Got Dominique. You've got Dr J. by Jordan Kobe. Not Getting that level of talent anymore guys get donkey. I'll give you that. What does not Lane Rick mission that we're used to? This was something I could get behind. Okay congratulations to Mike Conley. Junior love him had him on shows off the court. He's a great guy. Great winner of this competition. But I gotta get this off my chest about what my final before that final. And this is not a reaction to what I saw last night because I had a pre action at the end of yesterday show at which time I challenge. Zach Levine too. Please play fair against Allie Quigley in the semi final and he did not play fair he did not go straight versus strength. We all know. That Zach Levine. As one to don't contest we know he can jump out of the gym as quickly said on the show last night. Hey I got no ups. She's got no ups but she has won the WNBA as three point shootout and she can do lots of trick shots off the backboard behind the backboard. Even sitting down on the Court Pete Mayor Mich style off the backboard and I thought she had a chance. If Zach Levine would cite fair place fair and go strength versus strength because despite him winning the two Duncombe tests he also has made the second most three point shots in a game in the history of the NBA. He made thirteen in a game. Which tied staff and fourteen is the record clay so he can shoot it crazy hot with anybody and it outrage me that that Alley. I she dared him to go strength versus strength and then she all but pleaded within. Please do that. Just lab out with you threes. Because that would be a line. And instead no he's got to go do a bunch of acrobatic leaping shots at the rim there near Dunks but but he gets right to the rim and it looks like it's closed and then he doesn't dunk it. Well obviously she's not even capable of making that shot pulling it off and she's going to look foolish the way Paul Pierce Look Foolish. What we saw last Sunday trying to even do the shot because she's not going to be able to get off the ground as Paul Pierce could not get off the ground so it was. It was an outrage to me that he would just admit okay. I'm going to do this because I basically I don't want to say and try those one point she got to him. I think he was up. Eight showed nothing and she said come on like shooter three and he tried to. She won three and he missed and she made hers and got a letter on him. But in general come on Zach I mean I believe she could have beaten him if you play play outside the lane horse. That's that's the way I like to play outside the lane. If you want to shoot off the backboard fine shooter from out of bales and on the in the corner threes from out of bounds. But just stay out of the lane because once you get into the lane. It's it's it's not even horse anymore to me. It's closer to a dunk contest so I was actually happy that Mike Conley then took him to school and took advantage. Zach Levine because the truth was in the final Zach. Levine is terrible with his left hand. I mean he's he's like if I may say well. I won't say that the point was that Zach Levine. It was no contest win. Mike Conley would say shoot with your offhand. I've told you this before about Mike. Conley we've talked about spurs versus the Grizzlies. Because they might twenty one times. Mike Conley is the point guard versus the Spurs and he would just torment lie spurs. Because I he's a better shoe. Righty ended the knee his left hand and he said that last night. I wish with my left hand. Yeah he said he said. I'm a better shooter right okay. Well that's not fair either. That will it's like such a huge advantage. That Zach Levine. Shot shooting with was offhand which was his left hand with the thing is is that he didn't don't skip he can't give all of his advantage. You talk about fair now. The last time I've been to a fair I got a candidate. Apple with peanut ruled the Mayor. Go Round Count in Kenny and I saw elephant. That's what the last time I've been to a fair skill. If you have the number one rush defense I have the number one passing offense. Why trying to run the ball against you. Why not why? I'm trying to win. And then when he loses there are the WNBA. No no no no no no no no no if I lose. I'm lose but I'm going to lose with my friend. Well my colleague you. They shouldn't say what my colleague you can't do. Anything which are non dominant hand. Because as he said I'll shoot better with my right then I do my left and I should have never started tinkering with my left hand skill. He's shooting you can't tell the difference and I'll skip. He's got a bag and he's been it almost seems like he's been waiting for this gives you like. Oh Man I hope. They asked me this question. They asked me to add. It's not kids and the spelling Bee's killed when that guy gives them a this word orange and then all of a sudden it gives you put it in a sense and they get them in the Senate and they start rocket back yard. No this would go with well. My Horse is outdoors with it scary. I mean one drive. He goes throw the ball off the backboard. Swishes the net. Everybody's like it's no skip did not beat him. And I'm I'm I would have never thought might I miss get when you think of Horns. You're thinking of the guys can shoot arguments. Stamping clay guys have tremendous English. Like James Harden carry but my Collie and a game like this. I don't know how anybody beat him. Especially if he's like okay. Shoot with your non dominant hand. Yes we know everybody getting in the NBA can lay the ball left handed. If you're writing or laid the ball right if you're lifting but actually shoot the ball that's a whole different ballgame. Okay okay. Back Zach Levine. He also had the number one rush defense. If you WANNA use that analogy. He had both had the number one pass defense and the number one rush defense he can really shoot threes. So why wouldn't you in the spirit of competition say? I'm going to beat her at our strengths. Because I know she can't do any dipsy doo shots at the rim. Because she's not a leaper she is a pure standstill catch and shoot shooter. So so why. Would you make the competition? Why would you render it? Moot an unfair saying Oh let let me get four letters honor by doing leaping dipsy Doo axiomatic shots at the rim touching the back when she can't even try to do that but if that's all you can do if you're a non shooter if you were Shaquille O'Neal you couldn't shoot it three and you could barely shoot a free throw if you were that guy. I'd say okay you don't really have a choice. He had a huge choice because he's not just a good three point shooter. He might be even better than she is but he didn't have the guts on live TV. I know they had taped it. But he didn't have the guts to challenge her at their strength instead of going to just his solo strength and it really offended me. It took a lot of the fun out of the competition for me though. It is whatever I win and I'm trying to win. I'm trying to win skill. We we we. We got this thing. There's movement that women want in power. And so empowering them and so when you come back you come into the arena scale. Just like soccer player. Says he wants to kick Bilbo okay. What you do. Those skill on blocked field goals their opportunities. You might get clipped so no we don't we? We we played fair. You come into our review play by room. That's how we do it scale so now my colleague. Why don't you give me credit? I'll take my colleague from the beginning. You say about that. Well because I told you he had a decided advantage being indoors but I also think that the one guy who had an equal advantage being outdoors with Zach Levine. Because I didn't sense any wind out there. He's in a little suburb of like thirty thirty five miles north of Seattle and it looked like they'd shot the whole tournament on the same day. I know you'd mentioned that road in Denver Shot. They shot it all at one here today. Yes because the day. Zach Levine got north of Seattle that it looked like I can't was calm and it was obviously sunny in so I think the court was just fine. I think his conditions were just about equal to Mike. Conley's conditions indoor in his own gym in Columbus Ohio. So I thought that was pretty much a fair fight. But you're right. I tweeted right after I saw Mike. Conley the very first day on Sunday. I said he's going to be very difficult to be because he's ambidextrous we'll skip. They're starting to look started missing something that was like started. Like maybe a little a little. Mr Lewis no or some type of precipitation started to happen now. I know what the weather was in Denver yesterday and they did not shoot yesterday. Colorado CO babies. 'cause they got somewhere between three seven inches of snow in Charleston. He's not I think. China might being capital pilot castlerock which of the suburb of Denver. But it's not in the Colorado area. Yeah we're so if he doesn't they shot all this still no problem with that but my colleague he got back he some. You know. Some people like bill kicker skip. Some guys are better at onside. Kick the numbers because they practice things of that nature like Tricia. Let's just say the quarterback had trick shot throwing competition. Do you believe me to my goal. Patrick Mahomes with all the TRICIA that he excellent. We'RE GONNA game. What does he attempted practice or doing a warm skill is so that's how my college strikes me as a guy that's in practice. He's attending a lot of these things. I saw video last night. Aware of Luca Danni throughout the floor and kicked it into the basket from about forty feet. I mean these guys are really good. Get they practice a lot of this stuff. I mean he's sitting around to break the monotony of just okay five on five whatever you know running through screens and things of that nature guys want to break up the monotony. And you know you've you've been around football basketball practice to know that our guys are. I got it but I thought Zach Levine. Didn't play to his strengthen the final either in that Mike Conley is not a great three point shooter especially from the top of the key from the straight on three in fact when Zach Levine. Finally made one that he called backboard on from the three point straight on. It's not a shoddy you gotTA backboard it. Mike Conley grown like he knew that's not his spot and he missed that one badly so maybe if Zach had played more to his own strength he could have defeated the bag. That Conley had if you start going out to the top of the key or shoot deep threes. He didn't try any deep threes on Mike. Because Mike's not the greatest shooter he's he's just okay. Three point shooter okay. Free throw shooter. I thought Zach could have gotten him if he'd gone crazy hot from deep three like we saw him do in the game in which he had thirteen. Threes was. Keep our thing. The thing is is that calley picked up eight. Joe Are on him so quick. It took him about what he would probably do because he was never internet fantasia situation. He never got an opportunity to relax. He knew like man already got three letters on me. So let me just let me draw to do some dipsy Doo and then once colleague got a rhythm skip. Once you're playing from behind you have to get ultra hot in order to come back because the guy's already up on your three. Oh and so. What happened with him? Is that Collie was like you said. Indoors he's comfortable and that he skipped plus you can look at a guy said okay. He's uncomfortable doing so. I can stay right right right round the edge and he can do either. The stuff that I'm doing and I have a really really went deep into my bag yet. So I believe currently has even more tricks that he could use. Let's just say of something like this. Were to come to an all star weekend but skill to finally get something that we could see other than the eighty five finals. The two thousand fourteen fifteen finals and this was a welcome relief for me. Yep and all I know is that got what he deserved in the finals. At least we had something to watch right guys. It was entertaining and at this point. We'll take us see all pro receiver brandon. Marshall thinks that Tom Brady and the bucks are a perfect fit. Marshall said the bucks might have the best receivers in the league but it will still be dink and dunk offense so Shannon. Do you agree the threat of Marshall? No but he. I do re- when he's asked will be drinking a office. They went bombs over Baghdad last last year and now they're digging and don't get all scared. Tom Brady Cannon. He feel through it Brennan March first of all my home. The things are the Place de la Vina. See Sal my no said over the last three years. The things have the most winning fail. Thirty seven the saints drew brees. Sean Payton added Emmanuel Sanders Kamara steal their skills. Stop this notion. I mean we need to stop this. I look everybody happy. Tom Brady seemed to be happy. He's out of New England coach thumb even Tampa is nice and sunny. He's staying on the Gulf of Mexico. Endeared big palatial estate we get all of that but now all of a sudden because he's in the division the Saints Window has closed. Who they'll I'm complete brandon near. He wants to he training right so he wants to be heavyweight boxing champion of the world. Maybe just comfortable sparring. And he was a little tired. Maybe you know he got tired and knocked the air out it but he must be out of his mind he thinks the window is closed for the saints and is wide open by the Tampa. Bay buccaneers you. And I both know. That's not the case and my good friends at bugs says the over for the saints is Taylor the have win type of the with the forty niners for the highest see. The bugs were nine. Also have the second best odd represented the Super Bowl behind the forty niners. Well I bet last. I shake gambling. Size don't get into business to lose money. Do this kill so. I'll take my good old friends at Fox Bay. At words they go did not win in the division. Are this skilled. I already predicted that. Brady's buccaneers will win next year's division. I already told you they're going to go. Twelve and four and I figured the saints will be very good at eleven and five but I believe they'll split their two games with the Brady's schedule is a little easier than the saints schedule and that they'll be right on time because he now has four weapons and two coaches. He did not have in New England and back to Brandon Marshall. I know him I love him. I appreciate him. I've had him on lots of shows in the past missing him hope we can have him on undisputed at some point soon but the point is his point was completely correct. And I remind you Shannon. Bruce Arians has offensive genius about him his consultant. Tom Moore is an offense is Guru. So obviously they're not going to ask forty three year old. Tom Brady to do what they too often ask. James to do a year ago as the bucks went seven and a nine and that was to stand in the pocket and hold it and hold it and hold it until you're about to get blasted in the face and Mahmut and India blasted in the face. That's not going to happen this year. As Brandon said correctly they're going to spread it out with all those four weapons but there's a fifth weapon named Little Scotty Miller a rookie last year. Six round. Pick out a bowling green. He has elite speed and elite quickness in short area routes. He'll be in the slot. They've got the two tight ends. They can use one or both. They can get five. Receivers out into a quaker pattern through last year and Tom Brady will do a lot of quick throws if you want to call them dinking and dunking is they work for five yards seven yards eight yards four yards five yard six yards. That's good that will work but trust me on this. If all of a sudden you WanNa Single Mike Evans with a smaller DB and Tom Brady sees it and they make eye contact. Trust me. Tom Brady will say watch this. And he'll throw jump balls up to Mike Evans. If you get Chris Godwin on a slower debate on the other side singled up. Trust me Tom Brady will say thank you. I will take that because I'm going to remind you of my favorite stat from Brady last year. In New England on twenty plus yard throws into tight windows twenty plus yards. That's getting way down the field. Tom Brady was tied for first in completion percentage in the national football league. He can still throw it. There's nothing wrong with his velocity or his deep ball. It's the same as it was before he'll begin getting rid of the ball for the most part much quicker than James ever thought about it because nobody can speed read the way Tom Brady. Can't he's the greatest speed reader ever so to me? They will re tater this offense to Brady and it will be very difficult to stop and I told you todd. Bowles defense is being underrated and this will be the team that emerges as the division winner next year. So let me get this right. So in the words of one scale Baylor's Baylor's Bruce Arians Mata sabotage Jameis Winston. Because he asked him to stand in the line of fire and take the move down the Gumbo intake between the chops and throw it whereas he's going to ask Tom Brady Tom. We're going to get the ball. Quick out of your hands. So is that what you're telling me? He thanked James Up Failures. That would you telling me because he is to push the ball down the field. Why would you push them all down? The Field Jameis Winston if you watched him at Florida state and washed him through his. Nfl career is not the most accurate passer mid range or short range. He's better throwing the deep ball. Bruce was playing to James's deep ball strength. Tom Brady is deadly accurate underneath as well as throwing the deep ball. So why wouldn't you take what the defense is going to give you underneath with accurate quick throws? Which is Tom Brady? Strength? That's all. He was trying to play to Jameson strength but unfortunately Janus tries to win one for the gipper on every throat. He every every rollout James his hand he wanted to be a touchdown pass so he threw thirty. Three of 'em last year. That was second to Lamar. In his thirty six touchdown passes in the League but he threw three interceptions. Any lost the ball on five. Fumbles as thirty five turnovers twelve more than any other quarterback in the League and obviously you can't win that way and Tom Brady will not turn the ball over thirty five. Times is the case. Why why does like five of the six quarterbacks of play for Bruce Arians had their career high intersection if he always caters the offense to what they do really well? So guys like Andrew Luck guys like peyton. Manning had three high Zarian is coordinated or the quarterback coach wise that because he cares the office. There's no way because you said no way. Manning was a rookie when he led the NFL and interceptions. Under Bruce Arians soaker again. Hey was a rookie. If they'd gone on together they're going to do a lot more dinking in dunking because Peyton could Ding. Dong with the best of them. Also where you do realize that it's not like Peyton through. He was premiums. Are Ninety eight ninety nine and two thousand is not like pain had five interceptions ninety nine and two thousand he had hired he was in the double digits. Those years also rumor realized that right skip. So what am I enjoy? I did getting hooked. Okay just checking. All I'm saying is what what did he do. Worse Andrew Luck. What was I told you before the draft? I told Everybody Television. Before the draft he holds the ball too long and tries to throw home runs on nearly every play again areas. Playing to Andrew lucked strength which became his weakness because he took way too many shots and as we speak he's retired. I hope becomes back but he just took too much punishment in too short of a time skill as offense. Because you've said Okay you've James holds the ball too. Long until shove edgy. Look maybe that's the office because the one thing that there's no correlation between Andrew Luck and Jameis Winston. The only thing that they have in common is who called the place. They'll see at the time in which they took all those who and Bruce Arians so he he bears no responsibility. Shannon Bruce Arians now has the goat. The goat has been much better. What the goat does then? Bruce's ever been at what he does. Because Bruce hasn't won a super bowl as a head coach so his credentials. Don't eat will brady's so obviously he's going to listen to Tom's input also and obviously they're going to have a lot of check with me. At the line of scrimmage a lot of option routes that Brady will call so he'll be dictating a lot of the play calling. At the line of scrimmage. It will be Tom. Brady's offense which with a whole lot of input from areas especially the great tom more so and obviously Byron left which is calling the plays so they will all get their heads together and the offense is going to look a lot different this year than it did last year. Because obviously Tom Brady is not going to risk a career ending injury. For one touchdown pass. He hasn't done that for the last five six seven years of his career. That's why he's had the longevity that he's had were there James Jamerson staredown. Gumbo wait to the last possible second of all. Why would they ask Tom Brady well? Thomas Forty three years of age and the Super Bowl with Tom Brady and he'd like to play until he's forty eight hours of age so obviously he's not going to do the things. That's what James did best was. Hold it hold it. Hold it in bombing. That's what we'll ask him. James James Says I'm twenty five. I would like to see my thirtieth birthday which I'll ask me to stand in the line of fire. Don't flinch what Tom Brady should be asked to do. The same vein right. You said. He's the same Guy Tom Brady. Nothing has changed when I say Tom Brady was starting to play it all. But now you WANNA make sure of a bridge because you all you WanNa do is Deacon Deacon no push them all down to you know risk it no biscuit it sounds to me like you're getting nervous that Tom Brady's going to be full on Tom. Brady next year is just days after it was reported that Dak Prescott would not participate in the cowboys. Virtual offseason program with no deal. There is now a report that the team and Dak are not any closer to reaching an agreement so Shannon I review. How will this play out for the cowboys? Probably GONNA end up dead end up having to play one. You're on the franchise tag deal skip. They're not getting anywhere close because I think that they can give the cowboys. Won't everything on their term. They want the length of the contract on their terms. They want the money on their terms. They want the wording in the language in the contract on their term. And that's like no. You gotta give up some concessions. If you won't see here's is going to cost you. Forty million if you don't we're going to have to come to some kind of agreement here because I won't four and get an opportunity to get back at the bite of the apple will the cowboys like. Nah We're going to do because obviously they want to spread it because you can spray eighty ninety million dollars over six years a lot better than you can't spreading eighty ninety million over four years and I think everybody gets. That's how contracts work decided is pro rated over the length of the contract so we can spread it out over six years. That will something more than four years because he wants to get back at the table. He knows they just got labor peace for the next decade and the new TV contracts about the become up. And there's going to be more money that doesn't want to be three years into a deal with three years lip on ice or that are obsolete contract for the quarterback position. But what this tells me. I don't care what anybody says. They can dress it up by. The cowboys are not sold on decorous. Got Because we saw other quarterbacks get their money be it with Being Gone Matt Ryan Matthew Stafford Russell will everybody has got their money Ryan Tannehill for a game got his money and they dealing with that press guy that I keep telling you they tell you one thing this malley you based and they told him how your because I it's not jiving skip bayless lowest. Javid my Grandpa to tell my brother is the more I see better than I hear now here with Jerry. Stephen said Dacca's a franchise quarterback we can win multiple super bowls. But when it's time to pay up they money Joan Funny Dak Prescott. See Your Training Kale. I told you there's this won't happen. Y'All playing with this man that said. Y'All play all you want to see your training camp and let's hope for the best but it is what it is so you are loving this. I M hating this more and more by the day in back to Jimmy's question. How will this play out? I'm pretty sure it's GONNA play out badly for both sides. I think this whole thing is going slowly south. I have no more positive expectations on Dak Prescott getting any deal done by the July fifteenth deadline. It just feels like they're getting farther and farther apart in. It feels like they're starting to be some resentment. Bitterness ranked core between the two sides because DAX is starting to act to me out of character. He's starting to do things that make me not even recognize the Dak Prescott that for years. I have defended on this show all last year. You told me how below average Dak was to the point that you often gave him fs for his performance apps and I would give him an a minus and you'd say no he was terrible. And now you want Jerry to pay terrible and I don't understand that because that is the classic speaking out of both sides of mouths but obviously you want jerry to wreck my salary cap. Our salary cap and again. I'm pretty sure that deck in his new agent are asking for unrealistic money out of bounds. Money as much as I love him as a quarterback. He's not Patrick Mahomes. I don't think he's quite as good as Shawn Watson said that from the start. I still love him. I still believe in him. He didn't have a great year last year. He put up a lot of numbers. But my man Shannon. Sharpe kept telling me empty calories in losing efforts. They went eight hundred eight. He didn't make enough of the plays to win the Games to get them over the hump and I can't defend that and I didn't offend that so my point. Shannon is all of a sudden. I'm seeing a new DAK. And when when the other day we had the conflict over how many people were at DAX party or dinner whichever it was last Friday night it is house we go tonight in Prosper Texas just north of Dallas. Remember he the. Tmz story said there were around thirty. In Stephen Jones then went on his radio. Show to say that will happen again. That was after the police got called to check it out and dad came right on top of that with a public rebuke of Steven Jones and intern Jerry. Jones by saying no. We had fewer than ten people. There will Dak is Shannon agreed with me. We saw the team's video of this. Buffet spread video. Sweep of it. It looked like you were ready to feed fifty people there. So it's it's hard to believe there weren't thirty plus. It's hard to believe that the police were called because you were having a nine or ten person dinner party. I think there are a whole bunch of cars and maybe all budget noise and I'm good with that most times but not at this time that we're in right now in this country so again it looked like he drew a line kind of quote unquote war with Steven Jones publicly. That's not my quarterback and then we had the story this week Shannon that. He's not going to participate in any of the off-season virtual as it might be but it sells like he's going to sacrifice the goal of winning for his personal gain in his contract. And when you're the quarterback you can't do that not for this team this time. Which give you Fred Sherman? You talking about both sides nick because he said he got else and now you won't Jerry to pay him were killed. Bela's gave you aids but doesn't want him to get paid. I'm confused. You also said you can't defend if the calorie staff in losing efforts and they go on a date but you fought tooth and nail at the time. So I'm confused Bela's if you give him as at the time last year. Why do you have a problem? Giving him forty million dollars if you gave him as you say. Last year he worth it all. He the top five quarterback now when it comes time to pay are now. He's not worth money. Back is starting to see what? I've been seeing all alone. Doll reward me with your praise. Reward me with that money. 'cause I spin praise. I can spend money so you tell you jerry. Y'All say one thing but when it comes time to sign documents. I can't get no signature on it because who told me he gets an a+ I'm like genie. How do you get from this? They lock all. He gives an egg quarterback unbelievable now. You'll quarterback unbelievable all year income time to get that money where he was a late he didn't make be throw he loves to Carson Wentz. He loved the Teddy Bridgewater. Yada Yada Yada all the things that I tried to tell you during the season. We're to have a problem with low. I agree with you. The hall of Famer said that didn't get it done. Oh I'll let you off the hook like desk. You pay. That man farted million Jerry. Pay Him I'm not GonNa let you off the hook because I told you. I'd I across the debate desk in the Fox studio on the Monday after the New Orleans loss. What was it twelve ten. I told you back missed and early. Throw across the back line of the end zone to an open randall. Cobb eye doctor for that. I definitely didn't give him an a for that game. He came on hot at the end of the game but it was too little too late and they scored only ten points and I definitely did not a for the game at Philadelphia. A game that was sink or swim to win the division. You could win or lose lose and go home. And what did he do late? In the game. He had Tae von Osten break wide open for a touchdown any just missed him and I told you the next day he missed him. That could have been the throw the game. They would have to convert a two point conversion to tie it at seventeen but they lost the game in large part because he missed that throat. So they're the two throws where that was the difference between ten and six. You gotta make those throws again. He's he's a top ten quarterback to me but he's not top five not yet he couldn't be at some point but right now he is not earned or projects to Patrick mahomes money and if they're asking for forty plus million a year. You can't do it because I'm with you. Jerry doesn't think he's that good and all I know Shannon is. Id No Jerry Jones and when Jerry says one of you know me not to get one of these done. That's true. That's what he said before. He Got Zeke. Done ahead of last year's oper right and right now. He's not getting this done. Because he's up against a quarterback and an agent who are asking for out of bounds. Money it's so much money that you're overpaying and remember look what happened to the rams. They overpaid Jared Goff. Overpaid Todd Gurley. I think they overpaid Aaron Donald. I don't think they'll ever get that much bang for their buck with Aaron Donald. Well the cowboys are teetering on overpaid. Overpaid overpaid across the board. Zeke demarcus Lawrence Jalen Smith. I can go out obviously lorry. That was too much money for Amari. But you're sort of damned if you don't you can't let him go. You need somebody there. So you overpaid. Now you're GONNA way overpaid for the quarterback. Well you'RE GONNA wind up in salary cap. Hails stuck at eight nate. If you're not careful we'll see jerry hitting deals on his turns down for the first time is booking scale are the newsroom. Told me something longtime ago. He says fifty three guys on the roster. He says forty probably forty. Those guys go take what the hill ideal. Now there's going to be five or six guys. We're going to be tough negotiations. Were going to be four or five guys. You're going to be at theft mercy dealing with the hell they want. That's how it works out scales. That's how it works out. And that's what they're doing. All these are like they're at the mercy of Amari Cooper. Large got what he wanted because they knew there were other teams bidding. All you had to do if you want to see what Dak Prescott value was. Put a tag owning. Don't tag leading the market would bear. And then if you WANNA match he can bring them back to you visit okay. This was out there. I'll give you an opportunity to match is not okay. I'm sorry but for you to put a tag on him. If he's not worth that you shouldn't have put the tag on him and then you could have found out what he was afraid. This is all heading is that DOC will reject the tag in that deck will actually start holding out Allah Levian in Pittsburgh holding out real games missing real games and if that happens obviously on sunk next year. Shannon over there celebrating. We're talking about the head of the release of Michael Jordan's documentary on his final season with the Bulls Nj recently said in an interview that after watching the footage people may think he is a horrible guy. It's also worth noting that. Mj Did have final approval of the documentary but skip. I want to ask you this question. You got to know him very well. Why now why would Nj want to do this documentary now? Several key reasons reason number one. He gets sick and tired of hearing. Lebron James Himself Declare Lebron the greatest player ever as he recently did in an episode on the shop in which he was talk. Lebron was talking about how they came back from three one down to beat Golden State Two Thousand Sixteen finals and Lebron's quote was that right. There made me the greatest player. Ever that right there also made somewhere Michael Jordan cringe and I believe that Michael also get sick and tired of watching undisputed and hearing my man Shannon Sharpe Proclaim Lebron James and the and mislead millions of young fans into really believing. Lebron is the goat so as likable approaches age. Sixty he's now fifty seven and he starts thinking. Gee maybe it's time to re Polish my legacy and remind people just how great I was that I was the goat. He's not on twitter. He's not on instagram. So I think he decided. Why don't I do it the way? I do things with an epic inside Michael Jordan documentary. Obviously the other thing that sticks in his craw is that he probably occasionally. Here's me his biggest fan points out the fact the glaring fact that as a GM and team builder owner and operator of the Charlotte Hornets. They're terrible he is the worst. Jim In the history of the League Shannon. They've they've made the playoffs three times in fourteen years this year. Their woeful there. Twenty three and forty two so far. So they're not GonNa make these play offs if in fact we have them so all that combined drove Michael Jordan say okay now is the time and I think he will benefit in many ways of reminding some of the younger viewers just how great he was skip. I really can't put my finger on why Michael Felt. This was the right time to release this made. It was a skip. A part of what you said could possibly be true alluded to this earlier. You know when athletes are playing spatially historically great transcended athletes like one day. I'll be able to sit down until my kids or my grandkids. This is what your data this. What Popeye did skip? I believe this is an opportunity for Michael Jordan Dapa. Dvd and says okay. Well all you guys. The didn't see all you guys that saw only glimpses. This is the opportunity for me to show you what I was really like on the court but it also gives you a behind the scenes of what made him take off the court to get him to that point where he could perform at a supremely high level on the court and we really never know what makes a person take less they tell us and Michael have given us glimpses skill being cut He always felt he was supreme. Not Making this or not doing that. And so that drove him someone would beat him the night that La Bradford Smith Drop thirty. I think he dropped thirty. Five on him is okay. I'll see you tomorrow. And then he dropped thirty five thirty six at the half now even so that was. That's his mindset skill and he says I'm concerned about how people look at me now still for the most part we have an image most have an image of Mike we see him always duck. We see the commercial being McDonald's and we see the space jam we gatorade be like Mike and we see him on the court. We saw the video scale but he was with Michael Jackson. We see that fried. But there's a dark side. They're the break Dr Jekyll Mister Hyde side. Now we're about to see that size skill. We keep giving. He divided the show was. He didn't have the if he didn't tell. Tell us or show us how the sausage with me we could be permanently by his eight of the sausage and have this pristine image of what my kids and who is but he decided to take us into the factory and show us all ingredients and how was made he decided that and so I'm going to watch it for me is not gonNA. It's not GonNa Change because I have like. I said I know a few people that know embarrassed. Well and so I've I've heard stories about it but to see it it's give there's one thing when you hear something okay. Yeah and maybe if someone would do a documentary on Wilt Chamberlain and we opportunity because we don't want when you hear number. He averaged forty points a game for five hundred and fifteen games. Or He's a hundred. Has Seventy eight skipped new here. Fifty five rebounds a game skip. That doesn't do it. Justice for someone to just tell you about it but you could see in the game or the game before you became blocked. They say some fifteen twenty blocks in the game. He had a quadruple double blocks just as Bill Russell. Someone would chronicle him give context to show you. Just what these guys work but Michael to do this in an age like you said there was no G. There is no twitter. There's no facebook. There's nothing basically you watched it or you got word of mouth. Now guys sky the putting their own highlights. I G own twitter. My says you know what I'm Daddy I'll do it on his talk. Downplay it with my name. So I'm about to show you what what Michael Jordan Michael. Jeffrey Jordan was really about your skill. He smoked cigars. That's a no. No Apple's not supposed to smoke drink doing the thing you might drink a little bit happens either but UK drake door. You'll go home for game. You don't go to Atlantic City playoff game. You play blackjack. Uk Do. Watch me play around golf today of a game. Who Does me so ever skip all the you think? Athletes shouldn't do or they shouldn't partake in is especially when competing at the highest highest level of competition marriage or blue all that away. Not only playing golf with his smoke and say not only. Was He Tequila or that brandon eyebrow my little bra but I put them puts them on NAVC lighting them up for the morning skill. He did everything to do things. We shouldn't do to be great. Michael was smoking cigars. Gray hit was he could do it. I don't know how you remember Detroit. Game Magic Johnson told a story of destroy short game and how he came to be. They have to three in the morning and the night before the finals. They might drop six threes in the first half. I can't explain it either magic but I made sure to see it bro. I WanNa see I WANNA see. I got to see it. Just remember when Dr. Jekyll became Mister Hyde. Mr Hyde Man. Mr High Boise unstoppable ruthlessly. So and I'm with you. Michael would actually smoke a cigar on his long dry because the traffic is so bad. We Chicago from his suburban home. Downtown to the United Center. He would smoke a cigar on the way to his games. Too Big playoff games. I didn't love it but it didn't seem to bother him. Because there's a flip side to that. Thanks to the Great Tim. Grover his trainer. They got up every morning at six. And had what they called the breakfast club with Scottie. Pippen and Ron Harper led by Michael. And he was in supreme shape all the way through that nine thousand nine hundred ninety eight season in Chicago and he sort of reinvented himself as more of a stronger a little more ground bound player but he became obviously in ninety seven and ninety eight seasons Shannon. He was the greatest Two point turnaround jump shooter. We have ever seen nobody was before lethal shooting. Jump shots two point jump shots. That was his game. And ironically that's the opposite of Lebron's game. Lebron is drive it or shoot threes in. Allow me to point out that Michael has been painfully aware of all the adoration the idolatry if you will of Lebron James and I found a story that that had caught my eye back in two thousand thirteen. I looked it up again last night. It was on. Espn the magazine by the Great Right Thompson. And it was about inside Michael Jordan February of twenty thirteen and he readily admitted that he was studying. Lebron's gain and that he heard every word uttered by all the announcers about Lebron was entering the same category with Michael Jordan. And that he'd already deciphered is game down to that. When Lebron goes right he usually goes to the hull but when he goes left said Michael Jordan in this piece that he usually pulls up and tries to shoot some kind of a jump shot so Michael said if I have to guard him. I'm going to push him left so nine times out of ten he's GonNa to pull up and shoot the jumper and I can contest it but if he goes right he's going to the whole. Michael said I can't stop it. What do I always say about Lebron? Greatest driver the basketball so I ate letting him go. Right said Michael Jordan so even back in twenty thirteen seven years ago he was already thinking is mind how I can beat him how I can defend him how I can shut him down so so. He was painfully aware. All the way back then of Lebron and I believe he's hearing so much now about Lebron that's probably the driving force of him. Doing this documentary is to open. The younger fans is to just how great he was as a player because they only know him as the GM of the Willful Hornets. When they've been so sorry he wants to say no. I'm I was that. But what if you're going to pull back on dad you're going to see Mr? Hi You're going to see not a Nice Guy. You'RE GONNA see cold-blooded basketball killer in ways. Lebron doesn't function like that. Lebron's a really nice guy. Good good guy off of court. He doesn't have all that that that Michael had going on off the court. Skip them when I was reading the article the other day about whether because he said he could train deontay wilder to beat. Tyson fury and they were talking to the article that Floyd Mayweather could be a historically great trainer as long as you realize. None of this would be well. I believe Michael Jordan can be a great general manager as long as he realized none of the players. He's drafting we'll ever be. Ill and I believe there lies the problem. That's why so many great struggle. They can't understand what I'm telling you what to do bra. Imagine imagine said man. You should do that right there. And the guy turned him like urban. That's not you you ask him someone to do what came. That's why it's so either to you. That's what makes you generational generation great. Everybody can't do that. You don't skip the thing. Is that when we look at? Applebee's kill you know some athletes. They go into this thing. And it's like okay. I'm training and I'm training for this and I won't drink don't smoke. I don't partake boxes. Say They don't engage in sex and whatever. The case may be skilled but michaels smuggling went to skill. Who Plays Golf? You know how you got to walk the golf course and I'm not saying he won't eighteen whole year. He had a car but still I remember what I play is my would tell us on Friday. Get off your feet. No going to the grocery stores they tell you. We'll let you go do that. Somebody's gotta go get picked up for mayor. Send a car. Let somebody else do that. Get up your fee scale. This is on a Friday. We're playing Sunday. Michael Jordan is walking on the golf course. Michael Jordan's casinos. So we have this perception of what great athletes are supposed to do. And if they don't because you said that was giving somebody that Blake play whale where he must have been out partying all night. You can never say that about Mike. Because they were not very many games that he had all game. He was dropping thirty. Forty fifty at the player tonight card after probably having a couple of drinks Tequila. Maybe that's just who he was. He wired so you're going to get an opportunity to see he's allowing that to happen. Skill is kind of like the boat is like when I show people Schuch man. I ain't no you had all those shoes is like you see me wear different but don't actually see my closet. Well Michael Jordan's showing you fourteen years closet all the pay. That was in the ball that he probably didn't he get to see this when he was playing that. He's allow you a glimpse at that now that he's done and so does it surprise in. Burmese give I still like okay? Why why now I get I get moved it upscale and they were going to release this twenty twenty. All they did was moving to us that we're going to be released in June so it was going to be released. Your thinking I'm thinking. Why are you doing this at all? Okay let me go back to what you said about Floyd Mayweather that you have to realize that guy. You're training camp. Be as good as you. What is my rule of about most great players? The greater you are the worst. She'll be Players to play for you. If you're you're you're the general manager. That's my rule of thumb ultimately validated by Michael Jordan and again. I'M GONNA validate my objectivity because I'm going to be painfully honest. Michael has been a terrible ticker of players when he drafts draw. Hornets just a few of his swings and misses. He passed on Brandon. Roy undrafted Adam Morrison. He passed on through holiday and took Gerald Henderson. He passed on clay and Colli to take Kimba not not bad but again you got to be better than that. He passed on Bradley Beal and Damian to take Michael Kidd Gilchrist that that won't work. He he passed on. Zach Levine that we talked about to take Novon lay. He passed on Devon Booker to take Frank Kaminsky at will work Siaka to take Malachi Richardson. And then Donovan Mitchell to take molly monk you just mis- mis- mis- mis- because you're so great you can't even see why others can or can't play you. Were in your own wild. You're the goat to me. But you're the UN goat of draft. Gm team builder. That will kill your franchise because when you miss players is not like your calendar which other player once their contract comes up or want to go. See the Lakers give missile and players? But guess what that's a franchise that's late teams player the go there in. Charlotte you end. The thing is how do you keep that play? Okay you hit on Kim Book. But you couldn't afford to keep him because he's such a small market so you've got to be great or boom. We're GonNa hit everything documentary wise Michael Jordan. It cannot come through enough. I do talk about a different go. Rhino mercy all right guys. It has been twenty years but Tom. Brady's still has not forgotten about being passed up in the draft. He posted a list of every quarterback taken before him with the caption. Nope I haven't forgotten so Shannon. Why are you surprised by this? No the great ones always remember being slighted as permit as I mentioned earlier skippy remember Michael Jordan Hall of fame speech with this is classic. Tom Brady J. One Minute. The guy doesn't care about his legacy and the next minute he's telling you about stuff that happened twenty years ago. I'm glad this is all you need to talk because every time I tried to tell you. Tom Raiders just like everybody Sharon sharp the Hulk Shannon which you don't understand is Tom. Brady is unique. He doesn't have really have everybody if you want the first pick in the drought new feel slighted. Let me tell your story Jenny US give. If you know who Fred Smithfield's France milk was the guy that wrote a term paper. He turned turned paper in. He said I have an idea. He's there because you know packages they take so long to get there. I believe we can take package. Just send them to a central location and get them out through about planes and get them leads day or two day. The professor gave him lorrimore. Press myth started Fedex that whole that drove him but Tom Brady is different. Oh Tom Brady stuff that bothers. Everybody doesn't bother Tom. Brady skip made us at some point in time. You're going to have to agree with me. I have never been. I've never going to be as great as Tom. Brady on the football field. But this notion because I'm not that I don't know what makes this man is sadly mistaken because Shannon Shaw was a seventh round draft. Pick one ninety two in the seventh round in nineteen ninety and I remember Jackie Harrison. I remember just the Edison and I remember Eric Green and Alexander Wright Reggie remember and my Bellamy and Fred Barnett. Will you remember all those guys that went before me and I never forgot it and I remember buddy who the head coach of the Philadelphia. Eagles still came to work. I personally I took my shirt off. He's a son if you available when we are we going to drive you play without shirt because you'll scare hail all the DVD's passed me not once not twice but board timescale. So how do you never know? Drove me just like drove. Tom Like his drove him. Drives THEM SKIP. You never forgive being slighted. I don't care if you the relationship. Oh you broke up with me I will get even with you. I'll just GONNA get somebody that looks a little better and more successful than you. That's we'll get back at you and that's how I did. I got all team that passed on me. We won superbowl and I went to the hall. How you like me now. Well I don't love it that you continue to put yourself same sentence with Thomas. Edward Patrick Brady Junior. He is the goat of quarterbacks. And the point of this. This topic is that. He's forty almost forty three years of age and he's still haunted and driven by the six quarterbacks picked above him and he can rattle off their names and by the way Alexander Wright was a wide receiver. You saying wideouts peak above you being there. There'd be dozens of those. I would think do whatever you know. I'm I'm greg good okay. So the point is that he can rattle off names. Nobody can even remember such as Giovanni Carnot's Who played not didn't even make the team. The forty niners took him in the third round. He couldn't even make the team couldn't even play in the League. And when you look at the totality of the six peaked above him. Chad Pennington was not bad and he did. He lasted eleven years and he was forty four and thirty seven as a starter not bad. He was two and four in the playoffs. Not Terrible Mark. Bolger was pretty good. He actually made to pro bowls. His starting record was great. It was forty one and fifty four. He was one and two in the postseason. But if you add up all the records of all those quarterbacks Tom Brady is already one hundred and fifty. Seven more games than all six of them combined and still counting. Because I think he's going to win twelve more games next year but the point is it's a little nuts. It's a little crazy. It's even psycho that that you're still posting the names of those six guys and saying. Nope I haven't forgotton as you approach. Age Forty three and yet it relates to what? I always call Tom During Games. He goes psycho talk sometimes. I can't even recognize because he loses it during games because he gets over emotional. He's gone off somewhere else. Competitively into some other dimension. That is not the man next door Nice nerdy cliche. Ridden lame dad next door. That guy gets left at home when he goes Psycho Tom. During Games and psycho. Tom Is still driven by six. Quarterbacks got picked above and he can still rattle off their names because he's obsessed with this. He plays possessed in ways that have shattered the mold. He is unique. We've never seen anything like this guy. I think he's going to be more driven than ever at age. Forty three and I do think a lot of the older players including you are a little bit jealous of him because he's actually had a rebirth at forty three in his talking about playing until he's forty eight and I'm not going to bat against him because he's the one guy in sports outside of the days of Michael Jeffrey Jordan. I don't bet against Brady just the way I never bet against Jordan. They're very similar though very very opposite in how they come across off the field but they're competitive drive is the same rare. We've never seen anything like either Jordan or Brady and the brighter. The lights the bigger the moment the better brady has always been saying for Michael so so now he's had a rebirth in Tampa with Bruce Arians and for weapons five weapons. Maybe that he didn't have in New England last year and he's on fire with it. He's trying to meet his his new teammates. Virtually and get to know them because he's going to show bell checks. He was wrong to Jordan esque because as we talked about earlier. Michael took the opportunity of his hall of fame. Speech to blast every person down the line who doubted him or cross-stitch and Brady's got a lot of that anymore. I don't think he would do it in his hall of fame speech but he's basically doing it on instagram right here right now and reminding everybody. I'm still standing in here. I'm coming for you. Brady doesn't have that emotions. He different. So why would he do? You keep telling me and I'll not try at. I made that bundling clear. But he's played so whatever he used motivate him. But the problem that I have with you is that you won't acknowledge that. Brady has the same feelings emotions as all the other athletes. Just because you're great does not mean you don't have feelings. That's the point. I'm trying to get to you. You refuse to acknowledge that skill. Just because I don't show fear that doesn't mean I don't have fear. Those are two different things. You want to pretend brady. Don't have a fields. If he doesn't show him. Why are you putting these guys? May they didn't pick themselves before you. You should think the team that Pink Bill O. R. G. You let it the wrong people see again again. It doesn't care about his legacy done. How gotta it didn't have feelings or motion doing that? Somebody else would. Do you tell while Lebron do that. Why Lebron say that while? Lebron do that Tom Brady. Does he motivated? He's such a leader. He's a fiery man. Get lift me with that Bull Jack. Tom Brady Shannon. Sharpe is not Tom. Brady all Shannon. Sharpe did with Goto division tools for balanced date get drafted in the seventh round was slut failed. That he was slighted in too. Because guess what skip whether you win you win fixed. You want super bowl whether you go to the hall of fame you the best player in the hall of faith or worse so really. Tom Brady and a lot of like contrary to what you think. We're a lot alike. And Guess What? He should have put. Brian Griese there too because he couldn't beat. Brian Greasy output. A starting job at Michigan. How about that or do Hinson actually was. The Guy couldn't be grief because my grief one of my greasy now with Ryan Grief. You WanNa roll vote in the national title. This is the coach's fault because you had to go off like Michael Jordan Dean Smith had the goat and he he actually shackled the goat. He was the only man who could stop. Michael Jordan was dean. Smith is college coach in same thing for Tom Brady. Who when he finally got his shot and his last game at the Orange Bowl against Alabama. He threw a party and a lot of teams. Should have seen that coming in by the way this is another referendum on just how bad the NFL has been over time. Eh Picking quarterbacks and next Thursday night trust me. A whole lot of GM's in personnel directors will swing and miss on quarterbacks. This league is terrible at evaluating and predicting quarterbacks but back to your point I have never said that Brady wasn't human. He is very human. He's just very rare as a human. Because you told me that at age thirty five you hit the wall. You didn't want to participate in the film study in the meetings anymore and Tom Brady is on sire with film study. That's what he does. He loves the meetings he lives for this he wants to go on. He's going to shatter the mold because he says I figured out how to stay healthy and on fire all at the same time. He loves playing football. He doesn't WANNA play golf. He doesn't want to commentate. He wants to study tape participate in quarterback meetings and running offense. It go win games that he's he's still going. He's loving it more than he's ever loved it and a lot of ex players say gee. I wish I could've done that. Nobody could break down physically. I broke down mentally. I just being WANNA hear to J. Paul Anka driver. They WANNA sitting meetings. I would want to go to meetings in the morning. I didn't WanNa do meetings out the practice. I didn't want to study for two three hours on my own but skip as rare as Tom Brady. Es and he's rare. He's still have the same stimuli. He feel grief. He'll feel happiness. Sadness disappointment anger just like you and it rarely. Eos SORTA thing thing that people make Tom. Pick did elicit up to this one. No I don't like this. You're not paying attention. I'm cutting you off. We're done with Tom Right now. Listen Shack is now saying that you know what he and Kobe's Lakers could have easily beaten. Mj and his bulls easily. We Debate Z. After the NBA's all time dynasties were ranked. Two couple of days ago shack was asked if his three P. Lakers would have beaten Michael Jordan's Bulls Team. Checks answer was short. Of course yes easily Shannon. Who Do you think of one question? I'm going to ask like Shaq. Ask at the end. Which is Phil Jackson going to coach? And that's GONNA be interesting part scale but if we can cut we get to fill Jackson's skip. I might have to take Lakers because you know skip because of what you say. The most unstoppable the most dominant figure that you saw was that three years strich in which Akil O'Neill was he was unguarded. Will he in the three finals? Average thirty six fifteen three now. You have to understand what Michael Jordan win against in his final run. He WanNA get smart West. Kevin don't work risked his soul. Cliff Livingston. That's not gonNa cut it and Bill Cartwright Will Perdue Luc. Longley was not gonna be able to do anything with the diesel. Not being not being and the game has started to change a little bit. So let's give out saying that we'll take Prime Jordan and we're GONNA put them in the two thousand where we're starting to see a little bit more emphasis on the three point shot because a they'll snipers around him. Robert Ory endearing Fisher and you've got to realize colby has started started all of a sudden being colby so I'm GonNa say Ooh I will say just because guys that and nobody's going to be able to do anything with Daddy. I'm taking diesel. I'm taking the Lakers. I'm sorry you gotTa take the by the way still coached. Michael I so I think Phil belongs Jordan. Not said the Lakers game. You Know My side. Yeah Yeah Yeah Okay you know what I think. I'm GonNa say it again. I'm not willing to bet against Michael Jeffrey Jordan. Even in a series that would be epic. That would be an all time great battle to watch between the shack. Kobe Lakers in Jordan's I'm going to go to the end of the line. I'll I'll to the ninety eight bowls because we're talking about the last dance bulls. Let's let's take that team. I told you that was the greatest defensive team I have ever seen in the NBA. It was nasty. It was physical. It was shrewd operation. It was they knew each other. They were unified. They played off each other. It was hard to get the basketball across half court against Pippen Jordan and Ron Harper. Because they were so long in so strong in so quick in just so committed to to just terrorizing the opposition just as they tried to get the ball past half court. So I'm going to give them the big edge on playing defense and then I'm going to remind you that. The Shack Koby Lakers went down in blowers Li. They lost that last finals. In five games to the Pistons Chauncey was the MVP that finals and obviously it was rip Hamilton. Ben Wallace taste. Sean were she'd but it wasn't up to the caliber of star power. That the Lakers had what are the Lakers? Have underlying shacking colby. Never quite got along. They were always at odds. If not at each other's throat and it really manifested itself in that final siles. When they came apart in somebody had to go and it was finally shocked. That had to go so I'm GONNA give Jordan's team a psychological edge because they were united around Michael and if we want to talk about shack and I've said it many times and you quoted me and I I appreciate that I'm standing by it. Shaq was the most dominating offense enforce I ever saw during that period? It was almost impossible to referee him but he never had to play against what would hit him between the eyes in this series and that would be Dennis Rodman who who's not seven feet tall. It's probably six maters you but Dennis Rodman was a nasty physical defender. Who knew every trick? In the book he would be Shacks Way. Along with one of the seven footers either Winnington or Luc. Longley would be shacks way. Every time he started wheel and every time he started a wheel and dive to the basket. You'd have Jordan or pippen or Ron Harper clawing at the basketball and knocking it out of his hands. He would get frustrated by that collapsing defense on him. And then I'm going to remind you as Kobe always said the late great. Kobe always said my big brother was Michael and I do think that Kobe in the end would be a little bit overwhelmed. Trying to play big brother obviously brother. Who's player and now you'd be a little bit overwhelmed by it and in the end the greatest two point jump shooter in the history of the game Michael Jordan. I believe that he would be the difference in this series. I think it would be a game series. I think it might even go to the last shot at the end right on on Q. You have Michael Jordan pushing off on Koby getting a little push off rising holding the pose as he switched to point jumper to win this game. Seven by one point so I got Jordan making the last shot over shack and coby ski of that point in time. Kobe was starting to beat Kobe. Kobe he was he was starting to be colby up until then he was Kobe Bryant. He was starting to become colby he was starting to take over ballgame shed getting fouled trouble. I got a doll. I'll bring it home. And Colby was not going to ship freaking holding shrink in moments and the last thing he would ever want to do is to shrink in front of the man that made the most of him basketball other there. Obviously it's probably was a big influence on his life skill but here in Moscow he modeled his game. I mean they're gonNA be looking at each other legal. Now you've got a wristband elbow you gotta at least leave pulled out like that you wearing bags yours you chewing gum you walk. What am I looking at me? It's almost like you'll be looking at each other scale. The only difference is one half time was skilled. You got to be did. Rabbinate will do nothing with Shag. First of all that's not happening. And then you know hard grab was on the team to skip gave a Ali by the age. Betas Shat thirty thirty six fifteen and three now mark West Livingston Residents Kevin Dog Worth. That's what the big man Komo's scale you know. The visa would run them. Okay but timeout. If we look at the three finals that they won remember. Shacks going up against Allen Iverson sixers overachievers. That's not among them. They add Matombo but but again hall. You got up there in years at that point. Then how about Reggie's pacers? Reggie was getting up there in years. I don't know that was pretty easy for the Lakers. And then it was Jason Kidd. You know it in the nets it again. They were pretty good but they couldn't deal with shack so I'm sorry I'm not seeing I in the end again. There was no horace grant at the ninety eight so it would be just the two big seven footers. Dennis Rodman nausea horses on our side of the lake. Had Horse at that point in time. Oh Yeah Yeah. Yeah Okay I got you all killed. You'll make it seem like Jordan. Was being eighty-five Lakers and big three Celtics. Look at what he went against Phoenix. What big superstar. What do they have the trailblazers one? They have Utah really cover. Loan wasn't five. Call Four faith anything like this lever. Okay but you can listen to trailblazers were loaded. That was Clyde. The glide and Terry Porter and Duckworth was. He was huge and that was a that was a deep basketball team. That was a tough match up for them but they always figured it out and they did have to play. Barkley was great player greater than anybody that the shack Kobe Lakers had to face in that run so to me that they would just figure it out. I shock would get bothered by that defense. Because there'd be four on one at all times and he would have a hard time harder time than he had against the other. Finals opponents argue. Skip the Lakers. What they had to face was getting out of the West in San Antonio Tim Duncan and David Robinson that was there are tapes. You got past that. There was pretty much smooth sailing on the back on the bag fried but just getting the West when you had to go through Duncan and Robinson and Pau and some some of those teams. That's what made it hard. Once you got past that it was moved failing but shah was big and skilled. Nobody join them as their Jalen. Green is the number one high school basketball prospect and he is now decided to bypass college and he'll be joining the NBA's at G. League Developmental Program. He will also be joined by another top prospect. Isaiah Todd who says he's also skipping college so Shannon. What do you think you like that? They're doing this. I love it. It's given I don't think there's going to be you know now. This is going to be the wave of the future. But I do believe the top recruits. This is a viable option for them. I think the green young man skip is GonNa make five hundred thousand dollars. That's real money and I look at it like this. If somebody's GONNA make money off my abilities should be it will force the force the NBA. What you're GONNA do all this. We came Pale. We WANNA keep it. Soudan Apple Lee and we WANNA keep amateurs thick and all that other foolishness. You'd have to do some because headphones and sweatsuits ankle cut it and five hundred thousand dollars. But that gives them an opportunity to sneaker deals and other streams of revenue. Now why wouldn't I? If I'm the number one recruit can take this avenue and make money. Make a have other screams of money also give in the same length of time? Yes wuss get one here I to the NBA. I'm this I love it. I love guys. Maximize the opportunity betting on themselves. So what I get I go to. I go to North Carolina. What am I assume? And thanks for coming. 'cause I'm only going one year if I'm a top player I love this. I love this. I don't like it I love it. Good points all before I answer genie's question I'm GonNa take a quick right turn and mentioned that little. Wayne just texted me and he'd called me Nathaniel and he did so because last week on the show cannon sharp said my middle name was nathaniel. And it's not my middle name. I've never even known a nathaniel in my life. I don't know one now. And yet Shannon Daniel. Little Wayne thought it was. So funny he's now calling me nathaniel and I guess get kicked minutes. Maybe it's my new Middle Name. I don't know go back to the drawing. Yeah it is now. Thank you for that. What what I would love to see. Obviously is what happened during Lebron's Day when if you didn't want to go to college and you wanted to go make the money you knew you could make in pro basketball. You should be able to go. It remains unconstitutional. That these kids can't go straight from high school and make however much they could make as a top pick in the NBA draft. Straight out of high school. I know a lot of people say oh but they are not going to college if they want to go to college they can go in the off season they can get a degree. If so choose. I liked college. I was cut out for college. That was just me. I didn't have the talent that these kids obviously have to play pro basketball. So there's a part of me that's still a little bit angry that they're forced to either go to Australia for five hundred grand or to the G. League for five hundred odd grand somewhere in that ballpark. It's Shannon says. It's good money but they could make better money if they're straight into the NBA as a high pick grit draft even if they just slotted in okay. Now I'm GonNa there's one thing they're going to miss going. G. League Australia to me Shannon. The only thing they can help speed their growth if they go for one year Duke or Kentucky or wherever. They're going to go Michigan. That is that when you get to play on national TV in big games on huge stages such as March madness. I think it helps. Hone your ability to handle pressure like in the G. League. I think they're gonNA play like a dozen games and nobody's really going to be watching so when jalen green actually gets into the NBA and plays a big game. That's going to be the first big stage game. He's ever played in so I do think it helps Zaylon. Let's say to play in the ACC tournament in a big national TV game on Friday and Saturday nights Sunday afternoon and I do think it helped that he played in the march madness turn on the NCAA tournament where you're playing on Sunday with the whole world so to speak washing you. I think that's a good. That's the only good thing about playing one year of college basketball because the rest of it to your point Shannon is just. It's just foolish hypocrisy because a lot of the kids aren't even going to class for the year anyway directly still you know you never heard when we see all the young men and women that leave high school and go straight to the military. Not One person say you know what they should go to college I? They should be made me go to college before they can go to the military. Nobody is there but no I got a chance to make five million ten million all you need to go to school skill. I go to school. Get an education to help me make money if somebody will do kick out that middle process if they go from high school to scrape making money who are very low. I wish my skill that would be like you. You coming out of high school your great writer in some become as they scale we want you to start writing for us right away heritages. When he started going to school we got a hundred and fifty two hundred thousand dollars a hundred fifty two hundred thousand or I can go to college. People don't get that that's what you were going to college so I can go deep me a good job and make money. Somebody's GonNa give me the good job right after high school and guess what you really was his goal his. He's only year. They played North Carolina. The tickets go on for two three four thousand dollars monies. I on here what? I couldn't agree with us. One hundred percent if a guy have the ability. Lebron got nothing from going going. Ohio State Board Year Kevin Durant got nothing ever rain should have been allowed to go to the NBA but not his view their scale. If I can go make five hundred thousand and Bypass College. Why wouldn't I do that with Libra Ronnie going back to get no college degree? Trust me okay. And don't get me started. Shannon on your league the NFL where the Constitution says. We have to go for three years to college. Don't get me started on. Adrian Peterson or dare. I say a Maurice Claret. They could've played pro football when they are playing freshman football at Ou and the Ohio state. It's just wrong and I someday. Somebody will make this right well. Bill Belichick might not be as sold on. Jarod did as we thought the. Nfl Network is reporting that Patriots plan to use a premium draft. Pick on a quarterback and that Brian Hoyer will likely be these starter. Next season in New England. So Shannon's can you see Brian. Hoyer starting a for the Patriots next year. He has to say I say that skill but he has started thirty eight games in his career and for inner report to come out of New England and say they know what Newland GonNa take is not true. They keep in close to the vest. I have yet to hear somebody get it right. We're GONNA take this guy and they actually take that guy so nobody knows what New England but trust me. Skip bayless coach did not give Tom Brady and extension to have him leave in order to bring Brian. Hor Your back so let me get this right. We knew Tom Brady was gonNA leave. And in the process we still them in the wings but clean is gonNA cut Brian Hoyer. We're GONNA Refi Bryan and Brian. Horton's GonNa start usually tonight and how ridiculous house get Baylor's I believe Bryant. I believed Jarret. Stidham will start now. If he falters. I don't believe coach. Belichick will have an opportunity. You don't have a problem putting inserting Brian. Hoyer but I believe every opportunity to start this this year on that we agree the player he now calls stead nicknamed instead you. I believe he wants that player. A fourth round. Pick two years ago to be his next. Tom Brady the former sixth round pick. I'm with you about Brian Hoyer. This is his tent. Nfl stop this is his third time around with New England. It's hard for me to believe that was the grand plan. It's also hard for me to believe. But sometimes belshaw can have an ace up his sleeve that he's going to figure out how to have a premium. Pick to use on a quarterback of note that could be their starting quarterback next year or at least the next. I don't think to to number twenty three or bill check sits right now. I don't think Jordan love fall that far. Maybe Bell Check has fallen in love with another quarterback second third round. But it feels like it's did or bus next year and I'm not seeing him being it doesn't have the draft capital to maneuver up the first round to get one of the Star quarterbacks. He's Jacoby process started. But that was out of necessity. Tom Brady was suspended. Jimmy Garoppolo had gotten injured. The likelihood fit we've known coach Belichick head coach. He does not like starting rookie. Quarterback's unless absolutely positively have to. So I believe this is. The situation vets did opportunities. Thank you for listening to the undisputed podcast. I'm Jenny Taft. Keep an eye out for the weekend edition of the podcast tomorrow morning. Featuring this week's best segments have a great weekend everyone and support of.
Life is Strange 2 Spoilercast with DONTNOD interview - What's Good Games
"And uh-huh what's good everybody and welcome to a very special episode of the ones cookies. The podcast is is not your weekly source of news commentary of instead it is the long awaited spoiler cats for life is strange range to. I'm joined in studio by MS Christine. Signer Hilo and Brittany Brown also joining us a wall and I'm Andrea Renee. Welcome and I am very excited to finally talk to you ladies about all of these decisions so we made the call last year after kind of going back back and forth about when we were going to do the spoiler cast to just wait until all five episodes were completed. And I'm glad that we did because now we can talk about it all at once and we even even have a very special interview with Michelle John Luke for the Teen I. We're GONNA sprinkle in some stuff from them as well so we hope that you guys enjoy. Obviously obviously this is a spoiler cast. Say it's going to be filled with spoilers eleven so if you haven't finished all five episodes highly recommend you do that I I or if you're like yo I'm never gonna get there just no. We're not holding anything back okay. So now that's all the way both Brittany kind of put Little Synopsis Upsize Synopsis. Enough size. So I I think that's what it is together about five episodes because we can't go into every single decision that's made across five episodes can be here forever. And some of them obviously are less impactful than others. But we're going to kind of hit the highlights so just as refresher if you guys have been played in a while life is strange to is a story. About a journey of two brothers they are Sean and Daniel Diaz that starts in in Seattle Washington and ends up in hell. I guess it ends up where it ends up question. Well it's intended to us sort of solution that areas where Mexico where they're trying to get you are six feet under or in prison. It's great. Yeah there's a lot of options this time rounded to decide like how your body is going to go because the first one really had like two endings. So that was it. Yeah it was very. Yeah are you going to flip over this that way like clearly. I feel like it should be one way but apparently not well how you flip that lover actually dictates what what happens in some things in episode five which will get you. So let's start showy yes with episode one rose the episode who know that works too so we start out in Seattle. We get to meet Sean Daniel in their home with their father Esteban and Dan this kind of sets the stage for the relationship with shot and Daniel. That's going to follow. There was an altercation with a neighbor boy outside where there was a little incidents of bullying big brother Shan comes to Daniels rescue. But then that's where we're kind of goes sideways. So very their father comes is out to kind of get involved. And then there's a bunch of yelling and it looks like this boy has been hurt and then you know long story boring. Boring Daniels powers emerge after his father gets shot by police officer. And that's when the story really kind of kick off so when you guys I kind of set at the relationship between Sean and Danielle did you guys set out to be a good big brother or were you like. Hey you know what do what you want. Yeah I don't care. I think I played it how I imagined I would be who teaches galway. I don't want to be bothered with I. I feel like any teenager regardless of male or female. That's not a time when you really want to bond with anyone who's a different age unless they're a little A little older and not a lot older like you as a teenager tend to be like the no I stick with this this small demographic and maybe a few years up but like down absolutely not so. That's how I kind of felt he would naturally be. Maybe I just haven't been around a lot of teenagers. But that's that's how I felt it would go and so I played it that way regardless. I knew obviously like something bad was going to happen but this felt true to me. That's sweet it's not really pretty not no so you actually got into character. So it's one of the things I really liked about. Playing the first life is strange was I felt like as a was was an old adult. I got to guide Max and make decisions that I think would be more beneficial decisions. Maybe someone already gone through high school been there done that would experience rather than someone someone who is caught up in this social Shenanigan of high school bullshit so I was like you were going to be a good brother Sean. You were going to be patient. You're going to to be firm and you're going to let them be a little kid. So that's how I played it I Daniel did you know he was kind of annoying but he was a good annoying. He was like an appropriate level of annoying. It wasn't like over the top. He was realistically annoying. But I found that even that was too much for me not understand if that were me in real life. I don't know if I could have done it but I'm just sitting back on my nice cozy couch controller in my hand so I had a little bit more scarce. Yeah makes sense. I'm I'm with the I see both sides of it. I see Steiner's divers angle of being like I just can't be bothered because it's not my responsibility but the same at the same time it's like well. What am I going to do? Let them take my my brother. They're away you know. My mom is abandoned us. And he's all I have left now like dealing with the shock of like watching your father getting shot and kind of dying in front of my before for everything like the the little bit before after. I definitely played him a little bit more fatherly because I feel like after events that intense you would naturally have to change your personality. But I think before when he's trying to just be regular teenage boy that was like go. I like get out of here like I can't be bothering you. You are my kid brother. Yeah well that makes sense. Yeah play though is not a monster. Keep telling allowing yourself okay. So let's talk about leaving Seattle Unless there are specific questions or decisions birth that you think we should go over in Seattle. No not really. I mean while it does set the scene and it's very intense I think is one of the most comfortable opening scenes through or one of the most uncomfortable scenes in the entire game. Actually it's the opening part. It doesn't really play your part so so no sense. It moves everything forward out it but yeah literary term for that right for like a big narrowed. Analyst Ark Catalyst thought there wasn't a specific literary term. Tommy John Drake when you need him he would know exactly so I did have of one regret about the opening. I wish I would have stolen the money out of the jar and I didn't and I after everything went down was like Dang if I had actually just stolen the money I my dad would never profound out and then I would have been much better off but I did the right thing and didn't steal the money you know. That's life sometimes you do the right thing and you get hosed for it. Ain't that the truth. What did you think about Lila? Shaun's friend I thought she wanted the D- totally right is. She knows about friends with benefits before the absolutely yeah I know. She was playing matchmaker between him and Jen by Scott. This feeling of now she wants her. That's but you're just a young kid and you don't know any better. Yep Yep that's all right too. I didn't get as much of a connection to her am. I didn't and ended up speaking to her or calling her at any point in the series. But it wasn't a sense of remorse having to like walk away from literally everything and everyone you know because as you have this sense of obligation to protect your family even though it's not what you want to be doing right now. So after they leave Seattle on the run from the police they are sleeping out in the wilderness and they come across gas station so in this gas station is when they run into Hank and Doris. I believe it's like a husband and wife team that are running it and they also run into brody here as well. So how did you ladies play out your time in the the gas station. Did you steal anything. Did you buy anything. Did you get supplies. Did you eat what happened. I tried to keep him as orderly as possible. Also I didn't. I Stole Asleep at the very end of this episode. I think it was this episode. Maybe it was the second one. They can't hear the camping gear. I still camping gear. I do do not remember exactly when that happened but I am pretty sure was at the end when like you already know. These are terrible people and like I don't care that I'm stealing this fucking sleeping bag from you. I'm sorry Argh by but otherwise I didn't steal anything before that I was like. No I'M GONNA keep keeping the book because again in my mind logically urgently like if I do get caught by someone like the last thing I need is more marks on my record. If only a bad things that I I have done. So so yeah camping gear at the very end when I was like fuck it sleep outside anyway. I may as well be comfortable comfortable. I'll have money for this. Yeah that's going. I also didn't steal anything because in my mind I'm like well if I play this right from the very beginning timer. Maybe you know they won't get me for theft. Maybe maybe I won't stick out like a sore thumb. Maybe if I don't steal anything they won't call the COPS and maybe I won't get busted. I don't know all these things are going through my head so I played Simon. Did but I thought Brodie at I was breaking breaking creep. You know he's sitting in this little gas station on his laptop looking. I don't know I guess it turned out to be nudist colony stuff. And then little Daniel Shuffles over. And he's like what are you looking at. It was that dirty stuff and I was like. Oh no sir. What do you like? It'd be a pedophile. How are we going here? What are we after? Everything happened in the I. Life is strange. I feel like nothing too dark because that got really dark. Yeah so I was with you that I had some flashbacks of the creepy professor. Whatever from the original but I'm glad that he turned out to be a good guy but I felt like I never quite believed that he was going to be good? I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop because he ultimately helps the boys escape from the gas station right so that they run away and then he gives them a ride and that's where they meet mushroom the puppy and irritated those so irritating to me and the dog took the and I was like. Yeah because that's what we need. We need another thing another bit of responsibility ability right now. Thanks very much. Not only do I have to take care of you child. Now take care of this puppy which is a doorbell. Sure but I got enough stress Happening right now. Don't need puppy on top of it. How dare you I hate you? Why don't you listen to me? Kids are stupid and right. Now that's true. Daniel have the right response to beginning. He said Urn. Sean sorry. We don't need another dog that we don't need a dog. This is a huge responsibility. Like good job. I thought the dog was going to be kind of like a cute little joke. Maybe like think you're getting a dog but you're not ha ha video games. Oh no you get a dog you talk whether you want the dog or not you get the dog. And she's very cute she is. She's sweet mushroom is a weird name. But you know that's okay. I think that something that we didn't talk about in addition to talking a little bit about Hang Dourson why they were bad. It's just how you know in your face. Don't with tackling the idea a Mexican American racism right away from this first episode. Obviously the Diaz family is of Mexican heritage. They made that clear in the very beginning. There's a lot a a Spanish language moments that happen in all five episodes. I'm and they do touch on that. Racism that underlying idea that they don't belong long here and they're not here despite the fact that they're American citizens quite a few times over this series. Did you ladies think that it was heavy handed or did you think that they handled it with the amount of tack that was necessary. I think I was a little. I mean maybe you can speak to this a little bit more Brittany but I was surprised to see it so blatant didn't like a in Washington state. Even if it was sort of Hicksville I feel like Washington in general is a bit more liberal in the way that they think so. I was surprised to see it so early on not necessarily the cops because cops can be really dumb but but like with people out you know this is I think technically Washington orf it wasn't it was still it was Oregon. It's still kind of out there. I was. I don't know I was sit there. I wasn't surprised to see it in general because I do think that it very much exists on his prominent I tend tend to think of it in other areas more. Yeah I'm with you. I mean as much as I e Yeah Right. Washington is very liberal. But definitely you know there are some pockets of eastern. Sorry if you're no you're right you're right you sir but also more like south to of like Seattle where the kids may may have. Thanks I think by that point. They've been walking for two days or so so there are some areas can make well. Maybe you could be here but the reality is there's astles everywhere right. That's true and then Hanke at I. You know I was like okay like you know what these kids are being hunted for. Apparently they kill the police officer of course going to lock them up but then when he was like well maybe I should call ice and see if you're legal or something like that. I was like Sir Sir Sir. He's used Sir Sir. Excuse me you don't need to do that. And as you know as far as like the tax goes I guess. It's hard for me to speak to that because I I think it's Tacky is hell obviously but I've never experienced or anything like that before in my life so it was interesting. I think I meant to pull an email. This is my bathroom. Not Getting it from someone who was Mexican American and they were talking about this but he sends it like a year ago right when this first episode out. So I think it's buried in my email my bed. That's all right. If you confined by the end of the spurlock has great. If you can't don't sweat it okay. So let's kind of get to the end of episode one move onto episode two so in Brittany in this doctor that you pulled with all of these questions and kind of the percentages. I think the one to me that is is obviously the stands out is like the biggest difference is Daniel and lies. Yeah this idea that you promised Daniel. You Won't lie to him again or you said you'll try to be honest. Yes so you're outside Sean. Outside and he comes back inside the hotel room does after Brody's helped set you up and Daniel sees on on the news. Their Dad dead the new story and he's like Dad's dead and everything swirling around him and then they have this emotional moments and they have a conversation Daniels Lake. Thank you brother. Please don't lie to me again. And then it's that moment you promise not to lie already. You're trying not to lie again. I assume because the breakdown here is ninety. Eighty one percent that I probably promised him I would like even if that was a lie. That's that's the kind of like tough part about some some of the dialogue that was written here. It's like a lot of times when you get into these narrative choice adventure games sometimes. There just isn't an option for what you would actually want to say. It's kind of have to pick the thing that is closest and I think the idea that you're promising him not to lie again. Is something that you say to kids all the time. Yeah like he's like eight nine in your dog. Yeah totally never going to lie to you. Ever know your eight or nine like you're not a real person yet you are. But you're you're you're meter might not be quite there. which is what you're building throughout this whole game so cooked yet? Not Enough Lee baked it in. Yeah exactly so very impactful first episode and then we had to wait a little while to get episode two rules. This is quite a different tone than the first episode because there's a lot more world building and relationship building there isn't like a giant moment I think of action which I was actually Kinda glad for so. The boys are out in the woods. They found this abandoned house to live with mushroom and they're eating canned Ravioli in kind of walking around kind of just living almost like boxcar children with the right. Yeah I was like you could just I mean here's my thing for at the beginning. I something like this had gone down my first instinct not be. Let's run to Mexico which is really fucking far away. Who'd be turnaround? Go North and go Canada because you'd be there in a day and a half and especially from Seattle Wing. I'm sure they would agree to see it's Canada. They're really nice. There certainly not if I was going to think of a country that would protect me if I was a Mexican heritage citizen. It's just more of getting out of the country as soon as possible is my is my thing and just go hide and Canada for a really long time and hope that eventually you can get a flight from Canada to Mexico or a boat or get a boat. I don't know but I would just be like American soil feeding we'd be very bad fugitives. Yeah this is why this is why I obey all rules. I don't WanNa ever have to think about it. Okay so Britney. Did you kill the Cougar or did you not kill the Cougar. What happened in your place? Let's talk about what happens to mushroom we go to Cougar. You wake up in little mushrooms scratch on the Basque because she has to go patty and so Daniel Mushroom go out out and you kind of drinker on the house. A bit of Sean. And you're like okay. I need to go get those to go up. You follow the track. See Mushrooms caller her little handkerchief just kind of sitting in the snow. Battlement I I knew at this moment it was not going to be good so you keep walking keep walking you turn the corner and then you see mushrooms lifeless bloody body and you see the accuser kind of corruption in front of it. We'll behind the body and then Daniels facing both of them and then at that at that moment you have opportunity to encourage our. It's an encouragement Matt but go ahead and kill the Cougar or tell him to not kill the Cougar. And at this moment this is like what is going through my head and like this is a very hungry animal. This was a little puppy granted socks. That mushroom is dead because mushroom is very dead at this point but the Cougar is probably hungry. This is just the fucking circle of life man. Daniel Cougar solves absolutely nothing. It just teaches him him in that moment that he can use his powers in moments of extreme anger to her like hurt or harm. Something says like this is not going to end. Well if I tell him to kill it so I stepped in front of him and I was like no. Oh I'm going to wave a stick at this beast. Oh Hell No. I told him to kill it but really because I was I was like this is a dangerous animal. I don't know what he's going to do. We we have no weapons. Really shaking his stick at it could work or it could fucking pissed so I was like you have powers. I mean it's dangerous and I'm not somebody who's like violent towards animals usually but it was more of like if I'm panicked if I've seen it's just killed something in front of me. If he and I are the only other living around that could possibly want to eat. Even if I wouldn't have done what he did but just like fling it maybe like force push shit away. How people just like crush like he like snaps its neck race in A? I think that's what he does. I'm pretty sure I've ever been like we've all right. I mean you didn't need to do that with it but just more humane way to kill it. I think that's a pretty humane way to kill an animal. I get. I was saying he didn't necessarily it. Kill it but it was just more of like out of the air and it off. Yeah it has got fourth pushed hundred feedback. I don't think it's coming forth anymore. I I think it's GonNa go home yet. And it was second mushrooms body then. The Cougar like picks her leg up and drags off in the woods and it was very sad. Yeah I also did not kill the Cougar. Because in my mind I was like the cougars probably starving humans have probably pushed out of its natural habitat. This the dog is another mouth to feed. It's it's probably better than it's gone. I wasn't mad. Because that's the Cougar. Killed The dog to be clear I agree I agree with that. Yes that's circles of life. It was more I felt in danger and I did not want to deal with a dangerous understood understood okay so after that terrifying incident the boys decide. Hey we're almost out of food. We gotta go. Let's try going to see our grandparents the parents and see how it goes and so like the annual sick right that was also part of the. Yes Yeah Sean was like Yo dog. You're not getting better. You have this cough so you need some medicine and we just was probably time. It's probably time for us to show her face and so they decide to go visit their grandparents. Stephen and and Claire who our next door neighbors to one captain spirit. So we actually briefly meet these two. We Claire in the adventures of Captain Spirit. And then we see them in the post credits scenes of captains spirit. And so we know that they're gonNA cross paths and Chris's part of this universe. I'm really glad we had this cool moment. Where were Daniel guts to kind of be a kid again? So the show up at the House and Daniel and Claire or excuse me Stephen. Claire are rightly like Yo. Where have you guys is been? We saw the news. What's going down okay happening? No No. We're not so. How did you ladies approach our relationship with the grandparents? Were you open and honest with them. You like let's keep Daniels power secret. Did you want to get close to them. Oh I kept everything a secret. I didn't really WANNA get super close to them because I had a feeling we would need to be moving on again in mice. I felt like they stayed everywhere. Way Too long for me for my comfort level of being a fugitive live on the run. I'll be like no no no we gotta go. We don't have time to sit here and talk to you But since Daniel's sick and whenever they had a reason to stay it's like okay we're GONNA it'd be as polite to these people as possible. We're going to fall all of their rules. But we're not gonNA like hopefully get comfy here because I know realistically we're not going to say yeah. That was the thing that was always going through. The back of my mind is how this is going to end. Like how are we going to paint a pretty picture of everyone. So cute and cozy and comfy. They're nice bet and cute jammies but it's coming to an end real quick but yeah when it came to talking to Stephen I think I lied about his power and forty nine percent of people confess this Stephen About Daniel's you want percents pretend you didn't know anything because I was like look. The less people know the better for our sake and their sake but yeah I was very very good kid I did all. Oh my laundry. I did all my chores. I picked up when I could thanks for. I can't remember if I told him about the powers or not I did. I did use them to save. Stephen Armoire whatever's fault all I did was like just help him too quickly and quietly. Ah I don't I can't remember if I if I lied to him or not. Think that was also a good way to show Daniel. It's okay to use your power for good reasons like this as long as discrete and I think that was a that was a decision that comes into play later on. When you're building your little brother? Yeah absolutely absolutely inner lincoln logs. We'll we'll we'll get into yeah we'll get into education events in just a little bit but so I also like like kind of kept it a little reserved. Because I didn't know what to make of Claire and Stephen and I like how they touched on this idea of religion in the home and being in somebody else's home home with religion that's different than yours or something. You might not believe in like how you would respond how you would act. Because I think it's GonNa be a really touchy thing if you're at somebody's house. They like all hold hands to say a prayer. And you're like wait. I don't know what this prayer is and I don't know what we're doing it but do I go along with it. Do I not make a scene. If you're in that situation do do you go along with it or do you. Not What your personal experience. I always go along with it in their house. I may not know what's going on but so long as we're not about to do. A ritual will sacrifice telling someone I think like. What's the harm in holding people's hands and like saying you're you're grateful for what are you have? There's there's no reason to not in my opinion and listen just being a real stubborn asshole thank just say it. Just just go along with it. You don't even need to believe it but if it makes them feel oh better. That's the least you can do for them. Yeah I have exact same mentality. I'm not religious but when it came to the game like okay. Yeah hold hands make everyone feel good. Give annual annual a little morale boosts maybe feel comforted comforted. I guess for the thirty minutes of comfort he has right in higher fucking game had he should also learn that again. Sometimes you do things because they're important to other people not necessarily is right. I did in the game as well but normally family in person. I don't full full truth because I'm just like all sit there quietly and not say anything but I don't know there's part of me that's like I feel like I'm doing something false. Also I just don't hold their hands. I wouldn't say the prayer probably in real life. I like holding people's hands. Yeah yeah sure. I want complete the circle. I don't want them to feel realized. There's a weird missing link. What did you guys think about Daniel and captain spirit being friends doral? It was like thank you know. Thankfully I'm glad he had friend that was his age. Go play with your friend. Yeah Yeah that parent. It'd be like Oh just go. Go play with toys. Go do this do that. And then this is the I. I kinda have an issue at the beginning of the game where it's like. Why would you run but I get your panicked teenager? Maybe I don't know but this is a game where they had the the episode where I had the biggest issue with I think the game and that was when you know. Everyone's all buddy buddy Daniel and Chris or Q.. Chris's dad what's his his name. Charles Charles they're all hanging out in. Okay we're GONNA go and we're GONNA get to the second but we're going to go to a tree farm and that was when I was was like. Oh no you're not and there's no option to stay home and I feel like if you're a fugitive on the run. The last thing you do is you go to a tree farm with but these people this friend you just met where you put your face out in public right. Yeah especially because I feel like a grand. This episode was while ago they played it. But I'm pretty sure you had some sort of agreement with Clarence Stephen. It's like we're GonNa try like Labor Day in your house or like in the very general vicinity backyard and that's this far as we go so yeah for them to just be like cool. Guess we're going to the far. I was like this is a narrative device. Awesome because otherwise they would just be. I guess chilling and their grandparents also feels false. Because where else would you look of course people who are related. I think you go down eventually. I think that they did say that. The police did come to their house before they got there looking for them right but yeah immediate. Probably come back at some point so that was just annoying because then the whole lot out with. Oh so when saw you at the tree farm in now. You're the police throughout the door. You're like we'll know duh. Well the reason I got caught and we'll talk about meeting cassidy at the tree farm just a second but the reason I got caught is because I decided to try to call Lila. 'CAUSE I didn't call in the end of the first episode. I never called her back and I felt bad about it and so I was like you know what I really want to try to get in contact with my friend but like in hindsight I should have known error better than I know. I know everyone's dead to you. Yeah rows house now everybody everybody. Everybody finds you feel though in this day and age. If you're able in the year twenty twenty if you're able to find like a public payphone that's like one of the last place phone call traceable. Yeah but even if they can like they'll know your general vicinity that's true to be like other in this state in your like ship ship shaped Nano State real quick. You have a hair loop by your right ear binder. The Mike is the microphone. Looks like a hair loop and I've been yeah. I know it does look like here. It's just it's literally part of the microphone. I can try to Tuck it. I mean part of the. It's part of the heads. It was weakened at me but yeah so the other thing thing to this. I know we'll get to the tree farm but when you when you first arrive you have that conversation or you have the opportunity to have that conversation with Daniel about Chris in the powers. Ours'll Chris thinks he has but daniels tricking him into thinking. He has these powers and the decision. You make their. Oh my God it can really impact the end of this episode But in the meantime do you know. Did you tell Daniel to suppress to tell Chris the truth or did you tell him that he should just keep it a secret and let Chris continue to believe that he he has these magical powers. I don't let Chris believe the kids are at that age. Like let him believe that he's powerful. He needs that like narrative escape into his imagination from all the crap that's happening in his household with his drunk dad was like. Don't tell them don't take this away from him just let let's just let him have it. Yeah I did that too. I felt really bad the end of the episodes but I was like. He's walking off. I told them but I still was able to save Chris. I mean he didn't die isn't he. Just gets hit my car. He didn't get hit by the car. My place no no. He got hit by a car and mine told Daniel. No no yeah you can just let him believe but whatever keep a chill and then at the end when he was like I should use my powers I was like no. You should not so did in your through Andrea Daniel. Use Power to move the COP car at the last minute. Yes okay. 'CAUSE if you've encouraged Daniel to not use his powers he won't so Chris Breaking runs out put his hand out in front like he's going to stop the contact his friends. But the copter snacks and that my friends is a metaphor for life. Life when you think you're helping out Saturday or you're helping you're hurting them. Later on I was talking about more about the car hitting thing you either word. Okay let's talk about meeting Casio so we get to the at like this little parking lot tree farm thing where they're buying a Christmas tree and there's a couple of what are you know. Look like Homeless Teens Youth Young adults. It's unclear exactly. How old cassidy is unless they put her age in some of the details somewhere and I just missed it? But she's singing a song and they kind of set this up as like a go. A teachable moment about ignoring people who are just kind of on the street st because I think a lot of times we go about our lives and we see homeless people or displaced people on the street like just looking for help are looking for conversation then our instinct is to put your blinders up and be like I have my own business need to attend to. I can't stop and help your keep walking especially since you know there are. There is an epidemic Emiko in specific regions with drug use in homeless populations. So I think it's something that does not did really well tackling this issue that we haven't really seen explored too much watch in video games afford this idea of what it means to be homeless and why they're on the street and like what their motivation is. And I don't know if we ever really get a clear idea of like what what cassidy's life goals are what she wants to do and another they had some conversations about it but I thought that it was a really nice moment between Shaun Cassidy in the parking lot. That was unexpected for sure. I also don't expect her character to sound like that when Oh yeah like the like the town of her voice. I don't know why just to be like younger sounding. I guess she didn't have a mature voice but maybe some shit down in her life made her voice drop with a few actors powers. No it's not but we maybe maybe a could. I'm no scientist. Yeah I said before I flayed episode to ahead seen snippets from episodes three and four so when I saw cast in the tree arms like oh I know you're going to be a big deal so I made sure to pay attention to her out when I saw her. I don't know if I would have made my blinders have been put on like okay. She's trying to get a few bucks and then go about my business not buying Christmas presents for people. Because did James by Christmas presents for anyone did I bought. I bought one thing Daniel. Yeah I bought the Christmas presents and I sat and talked with her but mostly because I really liked her song. I was very pretty and I thought he would definitely thinks she's very pretty too. So let's just Chit Love Breath. Let's give him a little bit a little excitement. Yeah I mean I feel like I really tried to balance as best I could. I mean we are the puppet masters of these people and like look. You're gonNA have really rough things head even though you've already had a bunch of rough things happen to you. There's more coming. So why not have these little moments when you can have them and really appreciate them true. I agree I love you. He was free. It was in a donation box Fox. Oh I took the two. I don't remember if I did this stealing. If it's free it's just took it. Well give any donation box. That was not intended for me. Well I see what you're saying. Oh it's like Kylo member this pair during got it so you took it away from some other child to give to your child essentially so I don't know if that really counts does it 'cause like the intended purposes still the same same to make a needy child happy exactly. I feel like you did that. You'll like you're probably okay. Good Morality Wise. They're good good so that kind of brings us Since we already talked about Kris and the police officer brings us to the end of episode two. Obviously after this scene in the with the Christmas tree you go back Chris and his dad go to their houses at tree up. You go back. And that's when Oh Clarence Stephen are like what the hell we told you not to leave or were you. Did you do this. And the police show up and they try to hide you and then obviously does not work out you go into Karen's room And you get to learn about your Mama and you're like man. Yeah a good person that was like a whole thing because league I stayed true and didn't did not want to break into Karen's room that game kind of forces your hand at the very end of the episode. And then you get to like see. Karen's room in in kind of figure out a little bit about who cares because your mom is barely been a mystery even up to this point. We don't really know what Karen's motivations are. We don't learn those until episode four. So let's go ahead and power through rate to episode three so you're on the run again after having had this kind of Nice moment with your grandparents parents and with the kid next door and with this girl you met in the parking lot or kid next door in wait till you do your Christmas fine curses alive and not heard by the car he was. Chris was because I told Chris the truth so he was on his swing set so he pointed me to the troll forest path at the end of the episode. Oh so you didn't even have Avocado Chase Chase you. Okay Yeah I. I saw that. That was an option and I was like Oh Dang maybe very that was the way to go. Yeah so then. I had the COP car chasing using me and I'll like Daniel note and then I got hit. smooch is interesting that off. Three of US got different Different outcomes in that play that episode. Yeah but he's fine. He's fine. The kid is fine. I mean capital find a few broken bones. Kids heal studio fast. He'll be fine okay. So episode threes called wastelands and this is quite a bit of a shift totally in. What's happening because I think it gets a lot more serious because now they're on their roane there in this pot farm? It was interesting because I believe I spoke to Michelle Gianluca about this because when they originally wrote the script. Marijuana was still only approved for sale for medical uses in the state of California but went to this episode was released it had been legalized allies for recreational use. Thus kind of making these illegal pot farms moot innocence and it's really changed the dynamic of commercial growing of marijuana marijuana in northern California. So they don't exactly say this but it's kind of hinted that it's in what's called the Green Triangle of Humboldt County in northern California if you guys chameleon that exists in that area it was really kind of where certain types of medical marijuana strains were were pioneered. I heard there is specific sections of the West Coast on the northern side in like the Oregon and Washington areas as well where. There's a lot of growing happening so I thought it was interesting. Choice from don't ought to say. Hey we're going to target this well-known area in California so we've come across them. They're sitting around the campfire. And the kind of like kicks off off the episode brought to you WanNa recap this one. No and I don't know I think you were sitting sitting around the campfire. And we see cassidy. Obviously she was kind of the links. We catch up to cassidy in Finn. Who was the guy that she was with in episode two in there on this his farm that belongs to this guy big Joe so big? Joe's kind of like the foremen. He runs the ship in. He pays all these big big. Joe Didn't own it. I thought he was just like the muscle. Doesn't the guy owner. Yeah he's the muscle. So who's what's the name of the guys that I forget the name of the owner. But he's the guy at the very end of the ups owed okay so that's my bad forgetting in that wrong. I'll just double check the other notes so we kind of get this different dynamic because now it's kind of feels like it's a northern California commune and where there's just a bunch of young people or middle aged people who are like I WanNa get off the grid. I just WanNa live without responsibilities and I'm just going to work for food and work for a little bit of money. That will help me keep clothes on my back and keep my my stomach full on a roof over my head rather as a tent or whether it's like a trailer or whatever they're living in and it's it was an interesting. I think. Look at motivations for life kind of ambitions and kind of taking this. You say dea that you're supposed to do this certain path like you're supposed to go to school and you're supposed to go to college is just to get a job supposed to start a family right like this idea that society says you have to do. XYZ swines aid your life and these people are kind of threw that out the window to be like. I'm just going to like live out in the middle of the woods and do nothing I could do. What could you do with Steiner for a limited amount of time? Sure but the problem. That would give me as I like indoor plumbing too much like that's the thing where I could do like lamping or whatever like tiny house in the middle of the woods. That's what I could do. I couldn't do what they do in this episode where they're basically sleeping in a tent. The bathroom is just like a bucket on the ground and the other bathroom. The shower is a bucket above you of water. And I'm like okay. I get it and I could if I needed to because of course course you can pretty much do anything if you are in a bind but it's not how I would choose to live for an extended period of time if I had the options comes down to camp for a few days but yeah I prefer not to anyway. The guy's name has meryl mayoral. Okay so my nose star are where everyone sitting around the campfire the day before payday. And everyone's Kinda passing around the lose. Oh No I was just going to say so. I went in the first night when they're all drinking. Whatever your you wake up in your tent before that? And it's like he has like a thousand dollars and I was like you can go sure it's not you're not. You may not have the greatest most cushy trip down to Mexico but like pretty sure you can make it to Mexico so you could get a bus like you. Can I mean granted. A bus would not be. You need to cover your face and then you could get a bus like you have what you have the money. I don't know what you're waiting for. Child go pay baby. I think they just kept I. I would imagine it's more of the comfort getting stuck in a Rut in a sense or not but thirteen. This is routine and I know how to do it and I can. Just keep saying that we're saving and saving and going to go but really am writing this out as long as possible because I know what is actually out in real world land and I prefer to stay over here in the woods in in somewhat of a fantasy land again Zina's also come to an end real quick Sunny who. Yeah you're all sit around the campfire. Then they're passing around. I think it's just alcohol beer beer and you have the opportunity to drink it or to pass on it and then shortly after go to sleep with Daniel or to stay up late. Let Daniel bogut escorted thin to his tent. You remember you ladies did yes I was sober. uh-huh I played Drunk fairly straight edge his guts. I just felt like if I number one again. I'm a fugitive. Who knows at what point the cops are about to raid this pot farm and would discover me and my brother? I need to be alert at all times. I can. I do not have time for the drunkenness. And then I went to bed with Daniel because he had mentioned already like hanging out with everybody else and I was like all right whatever whatever we can go to sleep now. Yeah now I did the same thing too because then when you go to sleep Danielle and I remained sober which was very hard. He's talks about his anger right. And you get to have the hearts of Heart Combo with him and throughout this episode you can tell he's really kind of looking up to thin been is like the guy in portions like man. I just want some credit. Hey that's kids for you. It really is yeah. I think I went to sleep with Daniel Because I was just like like like feeling like the Big Brother Love but I definitely got drunk around the campfire I knew Daniel Ilya deleted. I can do it. I don't need a drunk. Power super powered kid running around this like the last thing. I need no agreed. So that kind of leads us into the kind of the meet in the action of this episode so for the next day you have like obviously this altercation with big Joe and go both ways and really we're here for the heist right. So fins got this big idea fit the only this is folk would have just done what he was told and not have went inside the house. I wouldn't have been an issue that little punk. Yeah so there's a lot of things go sideways. It can play very different ways depending on but yeah yeah and I before we get to the action of the highest. There's talk amongst the group kind of ahead of time of like that dictates. What happens with the rest of the euro relationship with the rest of the people most notably fin cassidy? This idea of like. Are you going along with the highest. Do you think it's a good idea. Do you think it's a bad idea. I from the GECKO and I maintain this with every decision was like this is a bad idea. We shouldn't do this. They have lots. Have guns what are you even thinking. We shouldn't do this. I don't care if we're going to try to use Daniels powers. This is bad no no yes same and let the I think we may be all. I'm this swim yet. This is a terrible just to clarify. I was talking about when you're trying to get paid and you're you tell Daniel stay here stay put. Oh your guest. Daniel goes in. He gets caught. We get fired and so unusual that he's like. Hey you know he has a lot of money. You guys could get enough money be Outta here right going going back to like how sometimes in these games. You don't get the dialogue quite that you want. I really wish there had been something a little more explicit with Daniel. Where you're Sean we're like? Hey they're on the last like we're on our last threat here. They are about to get rid of us. Can't unique to stay here because it's important to us. Keep this this job but I feel like you're just like stay here. Yeah by and I feel like Daniel is smart enough at this point. He's seen enough shit. Go down that if you explain it to him and we're like this is why it's important that you stay outside. I understand. You're you may be bored but your your boredom come to us being able to survive right. I feel like he would go at that of course but I think also as humans we we are all guilty of making terrible decisions against our own self interest. Oh sure because. Sometimes we don't have the wherewithal to see even one or two decisions visions down the line of like the domino. That's going to happen from what we're about to do. And I think that's obviously the case here but I did think it was interesting. How which which way you decided to go with the highest dependent whether or not you had this moment with Finn so when I played episode three I thought that this romantic moment within came completely out of nowhere I was like no point? was I ever flirting within. was there any kind of romantic interest and I thought maybe it's just because I didn't make certain decisions along the way. Did you guys get options. That were making you. Lean towards having any kind of flirtation or feelings for Finn. The only option I saw and this was because as I was watching someone else's let's play was when you decide to stick around and not go to the tent with Daniel. You're hitting hanging around the campfire and you're having a conversation about maybe pass flings is or whatnot and at that point you can have. Sean say I'm more into girls. I think some boys are cute or something like that but that was the only conversation I've saw another I. I was with casts but I never anything within. I didn't even realize there was even an option until I saw at the end of the episode and it was like you kissed him. I was like You know that was even an option. Yeah same but it's okay because I actually really liked the moment omen that cassidy and Sean had so so. Did you get a tattoo. Did you pick the Tattoo or does she pick the Tattoo. I got a tattoo. It's a wolf. Yeah Yeah I got the wolf to pretty basic the sexiness cast also really funny to midnight. Swim Woo but here's what I think is hilarious like you can have. I mean I don't think they're using company they did. I don't remember if they had condoms episode but yes sexy naked. I'm freezing to death swim. I feel like I wouldn't be in the mood after that but maybe I would never gone skinny dipping once and it was really cold. And it's not fun I don't you don't like walk out like it's a hot tub right. You're not like Oh my God were exactly you're like I am. I'm shaking because I'm so call right. Excuse very close to somebody that person better be fire. It's not gonNA work 'cause you to the bone any it's really real and then when you're done he's like I'm sorry I'm sorry. Yeah but I was more like. There's no way there's no universe in which I'm having sex in this ten when everyone is right there like all you didn't hook up no we did. MCI MCI for me. Oh no real life for whatever sean go ahead try again get get your knocks where you can get them because they're not going to get them later before it for me in real life. It'd be like absolutely not we're not doing this. I know everyone can hear me. Well you now. Maybe it's different strokes for different. Turn folks I guess Britney and I are like we we would do it laughing with all of you will only go glamour. We'll each have our own room. It'll be defied okay. We have this nice moment and kind of like it was nice to see sean like be able to take a step back and be like hey like have a moment of connection with somebody because he's clearly clearly had so much stress put on him to kind of thrust on him unexpectedly after the death of his father. And everything's happening with Daniel. But then when you know you kind of come out of this like dreamy eyed moment to find out that Oh shit to Daniel is now off with Finn and they're going to go through with the highest even though you're clearly were like no and then you've got to go 'cause I'm trying to stop it so you get into Merrill's they break into Meryl's House and then you kind of meet up with them and then this is when it all goes all goes back to take the gun or not take the gun. That wasn't even an option. Yeah listen an option from either because like for big Joe so because you have to get a car to chase after them I assume none of you alerted or like option. I advertised without alerting him. Twenty six percent. You woke up a big Joe. He went after he fourteen percent you sabotage his vehicle so he wouldn't come after you could possibly have taken vehicle without alerting him because they forced me to break a window. Yeah I thought that was kind of loud and obviously I made sure like the other cars. The tire was slashed and the engine was broken. But then I was the only way that I can think to get into this car because I've looked everywhere and tried to find a quiet way is breaking this window so I'm curious as to what the without alerting him at all is because the minute break the window. He's alert maybe has something to do with how your conversations with big Joe and the beginning of the episode. Oh I didn't alert rb I sabotage the cars that we did too I sabotage and she said she broke in but didn't alert him. No no I'm saying that the fact that that's possible was confusing visit. steeled iron advertise the car his car so he could not chase after us but he did get alerted when I took the other car because I had to smash the window to get into that that car so to not alert him at all seems impossible. I think you can break the back of the truck and open the window and you can get in you. Unlock Okay I will be smarter. Thanks so we get to the end of the episode. Where the action's kind of as peak doc and now excuse me you have this big decision to make about Daniel and used power because it's going to dictate what happens at the end of the episode? What did you do trying to? I think I was like Yo dog. Just go along with it but then I think if you do that Merrill to at least shoots him anyway and then he lashes is out. But I didn't instruct him don't I can't remember. I did not instruct him to do anything even when it looks like he had a gun on fan. Part of me was like dear. Daniel life choices have consequences sometimes. They're mortal I wasn't I didn't I wasn't totally holy shit like he probably Macintosh. Maybe he's going to like knock him with the back of the gun and like knock them out. It was kind of how I thought he might do it. no he's point blank with shock an hour so fins definitely dead in play through and then Daniel like freaks out obviously only few percent of people got thin was shot dead. Daniel lashed out at Sean. Is that well. I did that was when I was one of those two percent the Daniel lash out at Sean. Yes yes well yeah basically it was like this is all your fault. It's because you're with her and she's blood she's poison and so he just like super super science you and then you're knocked out cassidy's knocked out and then lovely fit and Merrill's also kayode. Oh He's not dead but he's out. Count Jan my playthrough. Everybody was down for the CAP but nobody was dead same. Everybody was but nobody that. So that kind of leads us to the end. This was probably the biggest cliffhanger of all the episodes this idea that you can kind of believe with the shot of of Sean with glass in his eye. And you don't know what's going to happen with Daniel and then we wake up in episode four faith so you wake up as Sean Sean in the hospital. You don't know how you got there you don't know where Daniela's you don't orphan or cassidy are you're basically like I'm booked and you had at this really nice. This like a physician's assistant is this a nurse and so he's helping you. His name is Joey Yes yes it's true and he's he's a cool dude that's like yeah he was on your side but also like do. Don't get me in trouble. This is my job I need my. Please don't do so. We we also also meet agent Florez. Who is this officer? Who is following you trying to get you to admit that you did something wrong and be like do not like her dislike button? I thought you said Dude I like her. I was like Oh do not do that like her. So how did you play your relationship with Joey. Brit I was cool P.. Lights me Yeah I mean I was a good kid. Possible is missing an eye when it came down to having to escape. I didn't turn on him like some people did. I chose not to go that route. Yeah I like how he brings sketchbook like yeah yeah. I thought he was going to help us escape. I was like are you too but I'm glad that he was like Yo dog. You're a fugitive. And this is my job and and I don't know you. You seem cool but I can't help you but I do want to take a quick. Aside to talk about the sketchbook. Ledger brought that up. So this is kind of like the the alternate maxes taking polaroid's in the first life strange. So now you have the sketchbook did it take anybody else like a crazy amount of time to learn how to do the sketch mechanic. I felt like I kept drawing. I didn't realize you could go back up and take detail and so I kept drawing. Why was drawing suck so bad? I'm terrible at this up. I I did not have issue. Well what did what did irritate me. Though was I feel like I wish they would have recorded more felines for him because he says the same thing every time. When you're like Oh maybe I can get more like stop just be quiet time when I'm scheduling? No one needs to say anything. Maybe the first couple of times you do it or even like the first sketch of each episode and then turn it off. Do not talk to me again about schedule. Some people stammer didn't know how to do the sketch mechanic and they needed the guidance again. So I you said you can do it on the first one. I've ever episode episode. Were very far apart so I totally understand forgetting and being like wait how do I do. I just felt like that sketch I mechanic didn't really add that much world building to the overall narrative and I just kind of founded on only. Because you know he still practicing it. One constant the thing that he can keep with him as normalcy from his previous life throughout his life on the run and then after this episode is the thing that he has to relearn how to do because this is gone and therefore all his perspectives are off. And will he ever actually really be able to draw the same way he was before and this is yet another thing. That's sort of taken away from him. And that's how I felt about. Yeah okay so I was in the minority. That's fine so did you tell Asian Flora's at the robbery was fins idea. It was yes fuck fin. Yeah same I was like I very much was angry at Finn. I was like this is one hundred percent his fault. I didn't feel any allegiance to excuse me to him whatsoever. Now I don't know yeah okay. So how did you escape the hospital. Did you hurt the Joey. Did you hit the guard who do not not hurt. Anybody hurt. no-one I almost the guard but then I if I would attach guard you did yeah. I attacked him. Help bad didn't try to didn't want onto but then I screwed up hiding things in the bathroom and then he caught me and I was just like well hiding here. We go so I it took me a while. Like how do I get into the Arctic. I took me starting to figure out how to get into the bathroom because it was dark in there and I got turned closes the curtain. Oh No I was. I was lost lost. The ten foot hospital room. Couldn't figure it out but no because I can kind of get to the door a little open. But then he's like I need more force Mike. Okay we need enforce. Let's go get some force. I did try to brought Joey and he was like you know. I can't help you know like fair enough. Go about Your Business and then when I got was able to get the pool bar off the guard said something like what you're doing in there but I just close the curtain again and then it would around he never came in or said anything And then I just Jimmy. The window open when out along the edge to the scaffolding and walked down so on the scaffolding is where if an had been alive in your playthrough you would pass another hospital room and see Finn in bed instead it was Merrill Oh Maryland so I saw Finn and I was like fuck that guy. I'm not talking to him. I'm not trying to help him escape. Leaving him right where he is and getting the hell out of here Zane. I didn't want him to see me. I don't want anyone to see me. What if Flora's went and talked to him music? ooh All that kid last night can't be trusted. Fuck thin right actually. Exactly I'm so we get down to the parking lot and you steal a car and then you head out out to the desert and then you kind of take a break you fall asleep and then your car gets surrounded by to vary not nice gentleman who are like what the heck are you Hicks. I mean they are Hicks. Yeah they are. They're rude. They're not nice. And then they you know they essentially bully sean out of nowhere. How did you feel about this altercation? Hated comfortable hated every minute of it and I imagine living through something like that even though I know happens all the time yeah and this is one of those most uncomfortable moments that I wanted to talk about during our what's good game awards because it it suck and as badly as I wanted to fight back in punch and do all that stuff I just thought you know. Don't don't get more of a reaction if you can try to help it and just seeing the damn song and remember what's at stake here and that's what I did but it was really hard to do that. I didn't. I was not asked to sing a song I was I but I also very similarly played very cool. Did everything else that they told me to do. I didn't fight for the toy. I was like these people. I don't know if if they have a gun I don't know if they have called anybody for more people coming. I know nothing I also know that. I haven't I very injured so even if I try to throw a punch here what good is is GonNa do me. I probably will miss and even if I don't Miss I take out the other tackles meat so like there's no winning in the situation from you know when you're we're trying to assess all of the possibilities and so they basically asked me to say several Spanish phrases. I did actually translated. It was like really uncomfortable and it was like you know how do you say this is my country. How do you say something else like? You could say something wrong in Spanish. But I'm not gonNA play with you. I'll I'll tell you what you want to hear in the hopes that you let me go. It's essentially like playing dead as an animal kind of like all right. I just I'm here not nothing. I got no fight in me if I have no fight in me. Maybe you'll leave me alone and that's kind of how it worked so yeah I think I have a minor altercation altercation with them so I ended up singing the song but I came out of it with the car with an Okay it was like this banished song that I I am not familiar with Sam. Full Stop. Don't know where this August. I was curious because I I didn't have it. I can play for you afterwards if you if you recognize. Is it so now you're kind of like up Shits Creek. Your car won't start year like well. I'd better get walking. And then you kind of have this moment of. You're seeing things in the desert and to stop to take a little rest underneath the billboard and trucker comes along. I couldn't get into that truck doc. Fasten care I'm getting in. I was just like you know what this could be a bad idea but I also will die out here in the desert if I don't don't get out of it so we're just going to hope to God. This is a nice trucker man and not a creepy chucker man sandwich and he wasn't nice trucker man. I'm glad I do like they sort of turn stereotypes on their heads like that. Because usually it's trucker danger danger will Robinson and instead it was like then I'm GonNa give you sandwich in some water and you can take a nap while I drive you to where you need to go fix fantastic. There was a split second of me though. I should just walk. I was scared more just having anybody having seen me but then that's also why I would not walk this close to the road. I would be walking further into the desert a Just because I don't want people like lose this kid hitchhiking always missing an eye. Oh wait I think I remember report about because now you are so identifiable I identify. Oh Jeff that I stay stay so much further away from other human beings. It's possible that's true. That's a good point. I was just thinking about like I was just thinking about survival. So we get it from our trucker rider from your walk into the town of haven point right. This is where we know that. Oh no no. I'm just shaking my of course I hate that place your head. What happens from point? Yeah so we get into this town and this is kind of where you get to reconcile Gal with Karen where you get to meet her. And I can't remember exactly like how they meet up in your sketchbook Jacob writes in there you know Daniel is here. 'cause it's Jacob's olds like Colt family thing. Oh yes take your courses. A reminder is one of the guys that was at the tree farm right so you get inside that I welcome youth open arms of course and they're using Daniel as their little miracle worker and you Daniel Yo. It's me like let's get the hell out of here but Lisbeth is obviously manipulated. The shit out of this kid and Daniel. Now this is my family now. And then Sean Sean gets thrown out of the church. And he's like trying to fight back. Karen's like Nah. Come with me. We'll work this out and he's like well mom and then that's it. Yep Yes because yeah. It's yeah she's a surprise entrance after getting kicked out because they were like Oh crap the boiler. The brother came back. What do you guys think about Karen when you meet her? I was unsure of her time at this point you on. I can't turn away hope. Exactly yeah still piss so like because you don't know anything about her except for what Daniel Urban Sean has narrated Baz like yeah. You're an adult. You probably have money of some amount. Maybe you can help. This is your kid to yeah. She didn't she didn't disappoint. It's interesting interesting. Seeing the dynamic between Sean and Karen because he was old enough to remember life with her and to remember what it was like to have both parents in the house into remember heard leaving leaving and really not getting any answers as to like why she left and he's an adult now almost and so he's very much like I'm mad at you. You just completely ran away from your responsibilities and from us in from taking care of us and so it was hard for me to pick that. I wanted to open up open up to Karen during those conversations but but the way that I kind of looked at it was. You don't know if you're ever going to see your mom again after this. You don't know what's going to happen with your brother like this is like your family. It's your one opportunity to say. Hey like I either. Just hold a grudge and be managed to or I can take this time to be like what the let's walk. Yeah I think it's always healthy to open up versus clamming up and also even if all that's doing is giving you a little bit of sense of closure and you're like no now I decided based on these conversations I will go on hating you and like whatever forever and ever like you said. You don't know if you're going to see her again so I mean if this happened in real life I do think yes. Talk to the person that you are estranged with will at least make a more informed decision before before we have the what if what I appreciate about her. She was very open and honest. You can tell she wasn't trying to sugarcoat anything she was like. I loved you guys but I needed my sense of freedom and that's bullshit have two children and you just like I'm in the peace out. One day leave all of you in the dust fucked up but at least you know she's not trying to make it up Jeez he's just telling them. This is what it was which is shown the ability to just accept it and like you said make peace or continue to hold that grudge and she was fascinating character character. Yeah I think that I I liked how he gets know her even better in episode five but I think you know when you first meet her. Are here. The sense that I got was they were trying to convey her overwhelming urge to protect and care for her children knowing full well that their father was gone and like they didn't have anybody and she had to put her own selfish desires assigned to be like. Hey like they're alone. They need somebody to help them. I was glad that they kind of took that angle with her. Even though I was kind of going into this episode pretty upset of being like can't just like walk away from when your kids you're like a deadbeat mom which ended up itself. I think was a smart narrative. moved to say hey. We're going to turn another kind of trope on its head this idea. That dads walkaway. And that there's a lot of deadbeat dads say like no like women can walk away from their kids to like. It's not just one gender or another so don't not just Hitting on all cylinders in this in this season so do is take care. Help do or did you refuse her help. Any help could get. Yeah Yeah I mean when I think this stat we're looking at this document is when you need to clean your right. And she's like can. Yeah I do that. Can I do a motherly thing for you. I was like sure why not. This might be one of the last motherly things. You do life so sure saying I accept yourself out also I I want to do with the time taken out my contacts. I can't even imagine I feel like the eye. Injury was like the worst. I'm so glad they didn't go super graphic with it because I was like. Oh please don't show me. I don't want to see it like like like Oh if it happened to me I would be very upset so I do want to. Just keep this moving along so I'm going to kind of like fast forward to the end of the episode when things kind of two ahead head so you have this moment with Karen you have some good conversation. She's like Hey let's go get your brother. Let's you know kind of like Break him out of this church president. He's in so so you go back to the Church and then you have this series of events where you have to sneak in around this Guy Nicholas. I believe his name is crazy. It was kind of like her lackey. Or whatever And then you have to get to Daniel and try to convince him. Hey We're here to help you. Your mom is here. I'm here please come with us. And then you get into this power or struggle with this woman Elizabeth who is the head of this flock. WHO's very much a crazy? religious fanatic. And then you kind of had this moment of conflict at the then with Daniel Daniel Hurt Elizabeth or hurt. Nicholas as Do you does she get shot. Does the Church light on fire. Where where were you guys at at the end of your episode does the Church Notch? Catch fire some of them. Get all these catches fire always catches fire because the initial when you're in in there and he goes he does a little Pouf and then like little candles but candles fall over and drives away on you which is Bullshit Elizabeth is. This is your fault because you didn't train Daniel well enough and he knocks the candles over this whole Sina. Gina was really difficult for me on a couple of levels one. Unfortunately there was a bit of a bug and like Sean had a walkie-talkie embedded in his hand the time like vertically through Oh now though that damn it this is a really emotionally impactful. I wish this wasn't happening. But that aside the so basically you kind of keep getting knocked down and you keep getting up and your mom is sort of their encouraging. A new washing. Your can't get this shit. beat out of him and that feels a little bit weird to me. It feels like she should've taken a punch maybe at some point or or helped him more rocky bubble. I don't know like claiming the whole active symbol symbolic. Maybe I think. Maybe that's why I agree with you so you let's step in. But I think if she were getting punched with Daniel Care you know like I don't know but at least he would see that like. Hey this family is sticking together. And she took a punch for Sean Danielsen over there. These people who are physically hurting his actual family and he's not doing anything about it. Okay I think it would've worked solves. Maybe didn't take all the punches. I'm just sitting here. Nothing at this point. She's just some blonde lady right right. Yeah but even Daniel at that point would even if she was. Nobody doesn't like seeing people get hurt in general so washing someone the fact that these these people who are supposedly nice and kind are doing these things to hurt other people especially people as far as Daniel are completely innocent isn't and have done. Nothing are just by centers. I think that would have been even more powerful personally. Yeah I came out of the episode with everybody. You know not hurt. I convinced Daniel to not hurt her until like walkaway and we all kind of made. I did give the money to to jakup up to help his sister 'cause I was like there's this opportunity to reconnect with him. Because you meet his sister Sara Lee I think it is yeah And you discover that she's really sick because this these religious fanatics don't believe in in medicine in so they're like oh we'll pray for her to get better better better in like no dog. She's got a bone. Yeah like literally GonNa die. It's very curable and somebody her age if we can just get her antibiotic Beth. Breath was taking medication for one of her ailments. It was just like yeah. You discover that if you poke around her house sneak in there. You'll get a lot of hypocrisy I Of course sixty one percent of people shared money with Jacob but thirty nine percent kept it for themselves. Greedy I kept it. But here's Steiber. Here's right because I think the point at the point of the episode and when you can give that to him I wasn't clear on like where you are where Daniel were financially or anything. I was like well. I wish that it would have happened later. Like as you're leaving I probably been like sure you can get your whatever. Take it but it happens kind of before you go into the Heist I Hong Kong to call it for you. Go to get Daniel back and I was like I don't know man first of all you brought him this crazy but you needed needed. He needed to bring him somewhere. That where they would keep him alive right and not get caught yes but also how did he think he would not get caught. They're they're literally advertising housing him on flyers because I think he knew that the flock was so fanatical that they would rather keep him for themselves. Then turn him in that. That part is true. Yes I'm just saying. Lose with the stupid and they eventually the K.. Wait it's this kid. 'cause we've seen him before she was like you can say hey that you can say his last name as whatever but he fits the bill. She was came from nowhere. And you don't seem to actually have had any children so I wanted to kill or no hospital records records of this or adoption papers. Something's a little fishy. Yeah okay. That's that's fair. I do have go into the final episode so at the end of this we walk away. We've got sean and Daniel back together. They are reunited with Karen and we see them. Excuse me like the post credits credit. Seen kind of going to New Mexico with Karen to kind of have a beat with her before moving on to the wall. How she he lives? We're has been living this entire time. which is very interesting Exactly so begins episode five the final episode called Wolves and we open up with the guys. Having a little sleepover and the Canyon and it was so confused for either of you confused. Yeah that way because like Herod did she'd like to carry Bandon us again. Look sleeping outside with like no the happening. Also like it'd be cold desert at night but luckily you quickly discover that you are just outside the camp and then you get to to have this moment where you kind of walk around. And you meet these people you meet Arthur and Stanley you get to meet. Joan also is a Joanne or Joan. I feel like Daniel Colored Joanne. I if you like they said Joe Emma thanks Joe Yeah same all that hard to me for coughing. How dare you how dare I okay? So that's it's either here nor there. I thought at this point quite honestly at that. A lot of these characters were throw away characters. I was like I don't really care. No Arthur Stanley. We're on our way. I'm like cool. We're going to have a nice moment with John j-o-h-n whatever name is but the Home Dinger of the episode Britney's talking point says at all could. Can I tell you how stupid I am for. Yes so wind said character shows up. It took me I was little. Here's here's why I thought. Wow they should get some new character models because it feels like they were used this one and I'm not really that's hilarious. What I thought? That's that's what I thought and then I realized it is in fact. Britney wanted to get away. Yeah so Karen comes back with groceries with this character named named David. We've only kind of heard hints about if you talked to certain characters or whatnot or snoop around houses and they're pulling everything out and you David entities talking about he's always so he's praising you and I don't know if he does this if daniels a little ship these praising you for doing a good job at raising a kid and you did so good trust me parents to further in combat combat. Any talk and talk. And I'm like okay Blah Blah Blah. And then he mentioned something about being called a step dish and then as soon as he said that I a literally like Jason was next man what I saw and I looked at his face I was like Holy Shit. That's like David David and I did not see that coming at all. Yeah I again. I just made a character that looked exactly like Stepdad. It's so funny and I just thought it was supposed to be a different person and then I had that that conversation was like it was much more so if you haven't followed of course David is the new husband of Joyce chloe's mother in life is strange and life is strange before the store and he is the only character from the original. Life is strange that that we get to see here in life strange too but it's a really nice call back and depending on which ending you picked at the end of life is strange will really dictate tate. How you interact kind of the Easter eggs that you're gonNA find so my play through was that I sacrifice Khloe to save Arcadia Bay because I was like listen send not all of these? People should die for one person like greater good. I was like by Khloe. deuces Brett. What did you pick same? Yeah Save so so we all have the same but in the game. I don't remember if I didn't select anything or if I failed an import or whatever because the game acted acted as though I had saved Khloe so if you did not save Khloe if you were like the three of us and you told alert to kind of kick rocks into the into heaven kick rocks and you have moments with David where you get to go into his trailer and kind of look at his belongings and they will be very different. You'll see a photo of David Joys and chloe on the fridge you'll see we some other things some other knickknacks his he'll talk about how hard it was why he got divorced because Joyce and him just couldn't deal with the death of her daughter her was really hard and you overhear a phone conversation of him talking to Joyce and kind of having this kind of somber moment. But Ah if you did save Khloe or if you were like steamer didn't make a choice. The game auto chose for you. There's way more Easter eggs eggs about chloe and Max and you get to see photos of climax and there are hints that Khloe Max are actually living together in New York and you get ahead. He says resident phone if you listen to that David House. He's he's like I told you in New York was crazy and it was really nice moment and I watched I watched both the one I played through You know she was dead so I watched the full seen online and I thought it was a really nice moment actually asked in the interview. We're GONNA play right after this. I asked you know you'll get an M. Shell was like so is do you have a cannon ending and they said no there is no cannon Hanan ending for any of the life strange episodes and I was like okay. Well that's good to know. Yeah it was really sad. 'cause in my playthrough also told collided kick rocks into heaven. uh-huh when you get that post car that letter that or is it A. I think it's a postcard. Actually that he's trying to write to Joyce and you can see what he scratched out. And he God's Love David from David or as like every it's just oh my God it was just really sad So what is your latest. Think about him making an appearance appearance at all. Do you think it was like cool. Do you think it kind of seemed like a cheap way to redeem the character. Because I know like he wasn't very liked in life astray injury. I don't know that he was redeemed. Necessarily here I did. I was pleasantly surprised to see that they brought somebody back again for a minute. I was just confused but but once I got over that was like oh no. They're just like kind of tying these two stories together I thought it was nice to one again reiterate that this is the same universe and everything crazy crazy happened in Arcadia Bay happened and then to again. I don't think he was super redeemable because he basically tells you to turn yourself in seig about. He was always a staunch supporter of the rules. Which I appreciate a serial rule follower myself itself but I think the idea that was got confusing for me because I was like so wait? How did David get out of Arcadia Bay? I thought the storm took over Arcadia Media Bay and then if you listen to how chloe is killed. He says that she was murdered by some rich kid at school. which happens in episode so too I believe of the original life is strange? But then of course. Because of Max's rewind ability you can rewind and then you get through that moment where chloe is shot in the bathroom or whatever until like It was Louis decided to go with that. I always thought that that was what was happening. So I thought like storm is due to who you messing with time and space and then it once you decide. Oh actually no I need to let go. It's actually that very first decision. You ever use it in order make it. And that's where time the timeline is stored. August is when she supposed to die as opposed to you manipulate L. manipulating it makes sense to make sense see Nathan Prescott photo in his trailer to kept it. I'll it's creepy. Yeah well yeah because Sean doesn't know anything about it. Obviously he's like why does he have this photo in here. This is creepy and during his phone. Call choice you know. He's saying that something about lawyers and haven't and I heard that he's about to get out of prison that little shit. I began to presenting in a on as he would. I do that. The captain fairly true to his his character regardless of which way it goes he he does have contact with chloe. And Max if they are alive and together but it is kind of awkward still at. Its him trying his best and I feel like Khloe might be receptive. Only little everyone else she knows is dead yet so oh and he's the only person that would really have. Actually that's not true not true. Yeah sorry my brain got confused again with timelines Israel yeah. I'm glad I'm glad they did it to answer a question. I think it's a really nice call back to don't odds work on. Life is strange to say. Hey don't forget even though we've told you this is in the same universe. Even though we you know the adventures of Captain Spirit was a thing to kind of tie it together. I think this really cemented. Hey these storylines intersect Zach. And I thought the way that they handled it was really well. Done like rewarded. You for actually like exploring stain and listening because it's it's very possible that you could have missed all of those Easter eggs. If you never went into David's trailer right yeah. It was cool how he was so strict. But he's like here's a police scanner and I'm going to tell you how to cross the border and you said that he encourages you to turn yourself in. I kinda got the impression that he's like. You have a few options. This is is like what I'm going to suggest but you don't have to do this either way. I was like okay. You're breaking the rules. Mr David Sir. Yeah did bring them a little bit for you. which was nice to me? It felt like he was like well. You can't run forever. So what are you gonNA do. You might as well just descending now or do in ten years yeah yeah yeah exactly. Yeah I can just not come back here as could be okay but we've got. We've got a little bit more to talk about before we get to the final decision of the game so you say your goodbyes to everybody in the can't Karen's enjoy your way. You have the opportunity to have some niceties with her or not and then you set out on the road and this is kind of where again shit go sideways as is when you get to the wall. And you're like okay I'm going to have Daniel uses powers like open up the section of the one. This was like almost like painfully slow. I was like just the car. Just go uh-huh faster just like what are you waiting for like. Why are you still need to be in? He doesn't need to be outside to do the forest pool thing like in the car. Be Ready to gun on it the minute that he actually gets it open. Why are you why are you walking away? Chains like watching a horror movie. Yeah don't go upstairs ears. Go out the door what are you doing of course. And then. They're like we did it after he does Daniel successfully. If you're with your coaching rips a Holm's wall they have they have a fucking victory moment and I was like no. You haven't made it now. You need to cross the border Zenia. It got this edge of the border. Does you no good get your ass over and I thought I was getting a happy ending. I thought that was going to be it because I thought I had done all the right things in August. I knew there was no way that it was and then as they're walking away I was like sixty forty. I'm getting a good ending. And then you hear the bullet and then that's it so yeah so so that was pretty traumatic watching Daniel get shot this idea. Also that these vigilantes these kind of militia that are you know what's the word I'm looking for here. They are kind of self proclaimed the border police when in reality they have absolutely no clue whatsoever. Does idea idea that this that these vigilantes can just shoot. A child is It was that they made they made this call. And even more while that the actual border patrol that shows up immediately like you shot a child like you're going to jail so he bring. They had this altercation he ends up locking them up anyway. Everybody's locked up. Daniela shot. You don't know where he is. And Sean has this moment where he meets this couple. Who got caught border-crossing border-crossing as well in prison? This is another really bold moment. I thought where don't not said. Hey we're just GONNA go at this head on and make you be uncomfortable with some of the dialogue and with some of the choices that are going to happen with this couple so you meet them. Their names are ago and yeah. I don't remember right down both of their names. But essentially you us to figure out why they got caught and you had this conversation with them about Harlot Diego Criolla. Yeah so did you guys. was there any doubt your mind about what you were going to do. With the vigilantes in what you were going to do with the couple my thought was initially I do nothing with either of you. Look just leave them where they are also win every so you're being interrogated. Ah by the police or the border patrol and then you start to get the. It's the T.. REX trembles liquor. The lights are flickering. You're like Oh Giscard Daniels awake and so you kind of have that moment and then as I was I actually didn't even know you could do any any of this because I was so focused on just getting the hell out of dodge that I didn't stop to take revenge. Middle Vigilantes or let these people out of jail. I actually think I looked quickly to see if I could let them out of jail and I couldn't find them and I was just confused and just wanted to get out so I just left just left everybody. You have to let the conversation I think between Shannon Daniel Occur. I where we're daniels like. Hey who are these people and then you get the option Yeah I didn't have that. I was like we go. They're going into come after US very swiftly very aggressively I freed the couple and I just let the vigilantes alone like stay in the cage. I WANNA kill you but I'm not going into. Yeah I was like you just say there for as long as you have to but like yeah. Let's a couple go so now you're once again on the run in this time you're trying to make AAC it actually for the border. 'cause you're relatively close but not close it up because turns the heat is on so we get to this kind of final moment where you're at the border. Did you ask Daniels to shoot the officers in the know station so I did accidentally because I didn't know that was what the option was. I I thought it was gonna be like again flick them away and then so I hit it and it was like Daniel Kill the and I was like Whoa. WHOA Shit I WANNA do that jails but Daniel thankfully was like? I don't WanNa do that. Good Yeah we don't we don't want to do that. It was. I was just ended up finally like getting something where I knocked swimming coming on them because it was that was a panicky moment. Where you're like what? What can I throw them to get them to go away but anyways yeah so that was that it was ABC's but Daniel was good? I taught him well before Johnson. I'm Greg So what did you did you. I I saw the prompt above them and it was like kill and it was like. Oh No we're not doing that. So I also just blowing stuff out them and then as they got closer had the opportunity to throw him in a room and then put a locker in front of it they were just in finding their. Yeah okay so I want to now go to the final final showdown the final showdown so like you're in the car you're with Daniel off. I allowed allowed Uber. They're they're like we made it. We're GONNA make it was like in what universe. Yeah are they not guarding the open border right either. Drive drive back to the hole in the wall and hope that they didn't put anybody there or on you make a hole in the wall. Those are only two options you're going for the actual will actual border. I don't know what you're thinking now. Yeah I agree. I think they clearly were just like your local on panicky and right right and so they get there and like there's just so many officers on like I don't know how this is going to end well so at that point I was like you know what we just gotTa go for. We've made aided this far we're not surrendering now and so I- pressured Daniil to just like we're going. We're doing it hoping that he would just again fling them aside and not actually like like go terminator on them. So did he happened so in my playthrough Daniel was reluctant but did kind of go after a couple of officers and we got it for the border and at the very last minute he opens the doors and like tucks and rolls out of the car. As I'm driving across the border and I'm like new. Yeah that's pretty much exactly what happened in mine too and it was. I don't remember it was. I don't remember where in the prior episode. It was the conversation with David. Did I think where he says. Hey you know. Nothing's going to happen to Daniel. He's a kid ever GonNa send him to jail. And that's when I was like okay so I'm the only one getting hosed hear Daniel's going to be fine regardless of how this goes down if I'm surrendering. I'm just spinning most of my life in jail. That doesn't seem like a great option. that's why I was like we're GONNA buy clydes go for it or wait a minute the cliff but we just got an or go. I see what happens and he was also reluctant in mind. But I was like. You're shooting at us. Maybe do something he was like okay putting And then he hopped out too but which to me after like kind of seeing some of the other options that can happen I feel is the best one. Yeah so that's the parting ways in Dean and I I did the redemption ending. So this is when you're you know Daniels asking Sean. How does the story and and then enshrine responses? I think it ends here. He surrenders he gets out of the car and he gives them this big along speech. I don't know if he does that. Also in the other Indians about don't don't forget your Diaz how much I love you. I'm proud of you. Forget you are Blah Blah Blah time for speech Speech he stands out the arrest. Him they like share one long. Look as he's going away in the police car and then that's what it ends. And then you get the same sort of montage of Daniel growing up you know he gets a job at a Barista a he's all graduating high school. He gets a car he moves out on his own. And then fifteen years pass and because Sean gets convicted for fifteen years and it's actually Kinda low thing. They've racked up both either. I have issues with the sue. But we can talk about it in a bit Then he leaves. If you wrote a nice note to Karen sorry. He's done with his prison sentence. He walks out of prison. Cairns there Daniels there this is the ending where Daniel the oldest at twenty three and this ending and the other one's US sixteen seventeen and he walks out. They give them a big hug for Sean like looks kind kind of like Joel from the last of us. He has a big scruffy beard. And all this crazy hair and Sean and Daniel Goto that first park where they stayed on there like right after they escaped so they're camping out underneath that rock and Daniels telling this really animated story. Sean you can tell he's trying to catch him up on stuff and bumping around around and stuff in Sean just starts breaking down just starts crying downhill wraps his arm around him comforting him and by this point and then the next morning Dave get in the car they hug they wave drive their separate ways and then that's the end it's crazy. How many different ways ending can go and how the one and then I got? I'm definitely happy with happy. With even though the blood brothers ending I feel I could have liked to make it to to Mexico. which was the original plan plan and they have like the Diaz auto repair shop? Whatever but I like the idea that Daniel get to have a normal life that he gets to grow up with his grandparents and even though he's clearly under house arrest because he's got this ankle bracelet on that he's still gets to like be in America and experience? You you know the American way of life and that eventually you know he'll you know not be under house arrest in that he'll be a free and clear citizen but I think there was so much more that you could potentially dig into there because it's like what does it mean in America to be convicted of a crime whether it's a misdemeanor or a felony and have to have that on your record and everywhere you go every job. If you apply for it's like it's like a scarlet letter in this idea that what does redemption truly mean like. What kind of atonement is enough? You know like what is it is time served. You know that he also has to deal with still like the racism element of it. Yes so those things coupled will make life very hard for him in America. Not saying he couldn't overcome it of course could but But yeah he also. I don't know it's kind of one of those things where it's like. It'll go one of two ways for Daniel. We don't we know ever really get to see that far in advance. Yeah see I don't think baby boy's ever getting off I think he's being monitored by the government because everyone saw what he did with those cars so I can't ever imagine a world where they'd be like okay. You have supernatural powers. I can let you wander around right. Incidents incidents that would be my ideal ideal ending. Why not if a if? They're watching him. Is he even ever allowed to leave. and Go Visit Sean. Can they have had the union or is he prevented from doing that. Because of his tracking bracelet he also. There's just no fucking happy any of this and it's just so sad but I think the issue I had with the redemption Indian. Is You know if you go back to the first episode. You remember that teaser trailer. That life is strange released before the first episode ever came out. And you see see the events unfold from the officers Dash Cam and if you watch that video you can tell clearly. Tell that like things have been like blown apart. You see you hear Daniel's screen scream in the things get blown away and it's I think it's kind of obvious that Sean did not kill that. Police officer granted. He did do a lot of other things that he needs to spend time for. Probably but it's just that idea of. Is this realistic. I don't know obviously not like no one. Has Superpowers like that. But it would have been nice if there had been a universe where where someone says. Let's look at the footage. We reviewed the footage. Or maybe there's no footage to review. It's not really touched on. At least I didn't hear anything. No I mean that's a fair point. Wayne I- I'm just so jaded about where a lot of the Police investigations are particularly when it comes to prosecuting crimes teams from men of color in like the fairness that they're actually going to get even though they are kids right. Sean like a teenager and Daniel I think was always going going to be in a fine position because he was so young when the incident happened. That there's a lot of protections in place for kids like that and obviously like it wasn't his fault it just kind of it. It just happened you know but like manslaughter is a crime for reasons like sometimes you don't intend to murder somebody but like sometimes accidents happen and people dying like there needs to be some kind of tone tone for that right and so it's it's a tough thing to to kind of ponder to be like what would have happened if they hadn't run. Would the charges final charges have been you know. Would they have been able to get a lawyer to Kinda like get the judge to like talk down with their sentence would have been who knows. Yeah Yeah what should A. Yes one forward pass. It's it's hard to go back right because then the minute shitty. It's like such a terrible senator with. Well why did you run. Your like Iraq is a sixteen and scared and like I just saw my dad gets shot and then my brother did something weird that I can't explain so yeah I left. I don't know what you want. You want me to sit on the curb and like with more people to come pick me up. I don't know what you want from me. Offer me that other ending the lone wolf one is really sad this is where are you. Try to cross the border or no. You don't want to cross the border Shawn's like now this isn't us. We're GONNA give ourselves up Daniels like no I'M GONNA make us go. And so he takes control of the car Dr with his powers drives it across the border getting shot at and then by the time you cross the Border Daniels like Oh my God. We did it in Shauna. She's bleeding from the neck and then he dies terroir. How terrible and the Mexico have to teach daily on for that? Probably had to kill the Cougar. Like keep played with the score. Kill the Cougar. A he was still a regular. You've redeemed yourself. It's okay I didn't depressing to. Yeah I mean there's no doubt that you know don't not knows knows how to do depressing. I mean we all remember some of the terrible things that could happen in the first game but I think what I liked about what they did differently this time around with mechanics know before the first episode episode came out a lot of people were like. Well there's no like super mechanic like the rewind but I really was happy with how they kinda played out Daniels supernatural ability. Even though we're it kind of was left unexplained of what we're came from the whole time but I did like. Is this mechanic this education mechanic where they had very specific events that happen on each episode. That went to this idea of his brother ship that they have and how Sean is supposed to be teaching. Daniel like had to be a good person and how to be an upstanding citizen doesn't like the right and wrong that normally would fall on a parent to teach their child and how they wove into already the overarching narratives. That get tied to your decisions ends and I thought that was a really nice elevation of the mechanic that we've seen so far kind of narrative adventure games any final thoughts. I'm so you about it. After I know right so much impact I was. I was just happy with with my ending. Because Yeah you get to see Sean is with Cassidy and hanging out in Mexico. I don't know what they're doing but their he's alive and free he's alive in that is better than and most of these other ending dead or in jail and then he and Daniels still have. I think a tiny bit of C- He sends a postcard or whatever simulator but that's all they can really do for now which makes sense. It was really interesting getting to talk to to donate about this episode episode about the season about where it's going because obviously I think life is strange is a really important franchise and I think what they've done with fantastic and we've done a lot of work with them here at what's good Games and hope to continue working with them but they were pretty tight lipped about the future. The only thing that they would say is if you guys want more like strange to make sure that square UNIX knows so I I if you guys are listening to this Gosh Dang I need more tweeter scoring and send them a message on facebook. I don't know write them in email. If that's possible breath very literally you can write your mom but we do have a fantastic interview following this broadcast immediately so we hope you guys stay round and check that out. I had the opportunity to sit down down with the CODA. Creative Director Michel Co and the lead writer Lucchino of don't not when they were in town for the game awards and it was really nice to chat with him and they have some interesting tidbits that you maybe didn't see coming so let's go ahead and toss it that interview right now enjoy. What's good? Everybody everybody Andrea Rene here with a very special interview. I in with some of the team from dump nod talking about life is strange to please. Welcome Michelle Shale Co and jean-luc. I'm going to get it wrong. The only Gianluca can now roll new canal. Yes US French names. They always trip me up guys. Thanks so much for taking the time to chat with me today thank you. It's really cool to be here heading into episode five. What were some of the things that you you guys were really looking forward to seeing fan reactions of the final episode off of a big Johnny is always the communication I I think of everything we tried to tell the story So you're right you you talk that you said that could stay in a way with Karen and then actually did I think during the time between four and five state around two months with with her and stuff this time in the beginning of the episode when you can enjoys a last Cohen before before the storm or something like that But she has unfortunately they have to steal runaway because polices baptism leftism. I think for us this last episode should be where the player sees that everything you did. Over the course crossover false I for episode is said around then yet every single tried to teach will be used and we'd come back get at him or we'll shave Danielle on our his at the end of his journey. So it's a big boy that's a During this then you will get more and more independent choose. Choose by himself based on everything you said and you teach you talk to him before so that was our biggest. Will I think for this is just the players it gets. It gets his idea and discover version of De Niro. That's been shaved. Is the decision before the game. I'm glad you brought that up because the morality rally system that you guys wrote into the game was a bit of a departure from what we've seen previously in life is strange. Obviously you had to make decisions in. Every of the episodes of life is strange previously. But this time for for number two it was really like woven into the game play so John Lee. Tell me a little bit about why. It was so important to you guys from a narrative perspective to really emphasize those morality choices and how they impact Daniel and John's relationship. You you know I think because that's the main themes of flights trench to is education in the first season of trench the main theme of the coming coming of age becoming an adult. Assuming is the decision. So that's why the the the last choice of the first life. Trench was a choice that resume. What all the thing you have done before but in life is to the last choice of the game that you have in at the end of abuse he's at five will defend your this region but also about Donya reaction and everything you shaped in by your decision by the choices of you're dialogue by your actions so because of the theme of Education is the main theme of trench to we thought about that's the Depend of these two parameters so during the conception of the game during the prediction we put some controls on the decision. You are going to make as some of the decision are more important than others but must most of it. Every decision counts. I think yeah it was really a question of you know. The first game is small. Some big impact on choices where you don't exactly exactly know what will happen. And you can rewind and test the outcomes and replay with this rewind power which was linked to to Max personality With is the fact that she had a lot of issues to go forward and to make stand to just decide for life in life is to try to see the Constance consequences stimulus stamina quite different way where it would be much bigger number of smaller Choices modell dialogue lines smolder actions. Sean that you can do and then is around you and we really wanted the player to sink about our would act with Daniel but not really think about the immediate consequences of choice. It's more about what kind of education that might giving Dan. Those still some big choices for Chicago kind of cool because it's still part of what's of storytelling moments. Where Sean is alone or Sean is facing a decision that will impact himself but fought near there is tons of small choices that impact back then of course of Of the game. And you say that you talk about this system I think we use the world morality As as a shortcut fall for the name of the system but we tried to not to say that there is morality. Good or Moratti bad way. Hey to make a decision so it's more and I think the idea of the game is about do you align with the rules of society or do you make your own rules for your own benefits and this is kind of. Id where we don't have an answer of which one is better or worse and it's more for the player to decide. Ah What is things is the writing to do based on the situation the characters and and his own beliefs. It's really fully in effect in episode five because the decisions that you have to make have so much weight especially when you get towards the very end of the episode really culminating you know this the sequel right this. What's happening with with Sean and Daniel and I? It's crazy when you look at the way that the decisions kind of domino at the very end of the episode and how intense it gets especially when you consider the age of these boys right clearly. Sean is the big brother. Daniel being such a young kid you know having having tasked with the idea of are you going to essentially murder these people at the end of the episode you can like take their lives and for what purpose and for what reasons. It's a kind of a crazy thing for me as a player to stop and think about you must have to like press the pause button and go like this is a really intense moment. Like what am I going to I do. And sometimes I get really anxious in games like this where I have to make those decisions. Because I'm like I just want to know what's going to happen both ways. I think what's great about what life is strange to is done with these. Decisions is that they mimic real life in the sense that you don't really have a lot of time to think about what you're going to say in a conversation a big decision you have to make you. Don't get to press pause when you're talking with someone and go. Let me pause and think about what to do next right so for you guys as a as as a creative team. How do you decide what are going to be those really big pivotal moments and what are going to be some more intimate quieter? Peter Moments in the game do have a process for that. Is that something you guys. You know. Have a collaborative thing or somebody. Who leads those decisions? John Lucas that you wouldn't says there is really a big process. In fact we never say. Okay let's have four or five big moments of choice. We've seen an episode. I think it's a bit more organic looking at what's is a story. The main seems the story and the CHARACTER ARCS and fighting. The good moments is to put the play on to a really complicated choice in face the choice and also the more just said moments where you have small choices Ever wearing the game. Yeah I think it's You know we begin to work on. Life is twenty two in December. Two Thousand Fifteen and with longtime ago. Foyer that's crazy and in the very beginning we imagine the story. We've Michel hold the cooking talk. And after that I'm writing the first big draft of the street. We talk a lot about it. And after that we begin the pollution of the episodes and when we are diving into the desert we sometimes a lot of time added all the decision. We have already in mind because we taught about it and return big big step into disappeared but we did a lot of small decision inside the since the fact that Sean can talk about You know when mushroomed is in episode to the fact that when Daniel is asking Sean will be in paradise with that. You have the choice to say. Yes mushroom is in Evan and she will be okay with that or oh no there is no event or there is no and these decision. These dialogues was not in the first draft of the script but when we are watching the war scenes say okay. We are going to talk about religion in the grandparents house. So let's put one small decision before these to shave Daniel and shape is Is Answer when he's talking to and it's even there's a lot of example that's right and even sometimes just for Shen and I think it's more for the player we. We know that we have seen that. We know the big How would walk? And sometimes when we're just start to tinker and right in deeper detail as a sin really sink of what also the player wants to answer I mean when you create a narrative gets more really. We don't want to frustrate the player by never giving them options would would like to get wasted. A character is still united his personality but we try to somehow happen is data collections to the more. Aw logical choice that the player One example is I think in five when you're in and In prison in your talking with Diego in Canada the Mexican couples and you have Medicine Days in front of you. This was a really tough talk to to create because of course we have our own opinions about the situation but we also wanted to present What's happening being to immigrants trying to cross the border? And those vigilantes are real just also sometime. Citizen wants to help the police in a way. Okay Bye Bye fobbing immigrants to cross the border and having this dialogue we we. We walked a lot on a lot of back and forth on day up to try to find the good facility from the player and we also added answer whereas a player could somehow confronted immigrants. Also to you just to not have only sales that would be okay. Vigilantes are bad the Mexican. Come good people because it's always a question of not. It's trying to push our own opinion as black and white but also find a way for the player to have some variations and Bush abilities to answer in a way that would reflect also his own beliefs chiefs. Well that's very nice of you to say. But those vigilantes were great people in my personal opinion and hopefully people agree with anybody that is willing to shoot a small child with an automatic weapon. Probably out of good person but I understand you're trying to be you're trying to be neutral just because you know as creator or by making life trend captains career in life is to ensure as Michelle said is not to give our opinion what we want to achieve is to put the player in front of situation and make him think about it sometimes People will change their mind off sometimes stick to their own beliefs and that's fine for our job is only to put them in front of new situation. That may be not that face before and yet probably changed the mind or or stiegler beef and that's with mine. That what we said we try in and dialogues to cover. Every part of the Dan tell you can have at least to have some some degree areas and for sure we didn't give the option to to say to the vigilantes that you did the writing of course not but I think that what we did is is. There are some dialogue options at where you could at least try to try to ask. Why is it that we didn't didn't want to just have the Golsen that would be just confrontation? We wanted also to adoption. That would at least twice to go deeper on the subject and get in a way it gets a bit of their point born to you absolutely and I think that so important. When we're tackling these really big issues right in this whole season of life is strange has so many of them in immigration? Obviously a big one particularly in episode five really on its face you guys just going rate at it not only with the wall just being there. Yeah right but you know with the Mexican couple and do we free them or do I leave them in prison. And do I want to have some kind of relationship with them were that did they do something right or were they. They doing something wrong. But you know each episode kind of tackles its own individual issues. Which I think is why your community loves this game so much why we what's good gains love this love this game? AM so much. And I think what's really cool about it. Is that a encourged discourse as you guys were saying it encourages players ago. How would I handle that that? If I was in Sean shoes if I was in Daniel shoes like would I want to take revenge on the person that shot me you know or am I going to be the bigger person and walk away. Hey it's it's hard to say like in the moment what you would do. But I think what's great about the game is that it doesn't courage discourse and more discourses always better so we get some really cool blast from the past in episode five. I did not expect to see David in this episode. I'm sure the the rest of the families is like what is he doing. I'm so can you guys explain a little bit about why you guys chose to bring him back as a character and kind of wear in the timeline. In relationship to the original life is strange ancient. David is at right now. I think that the one part is from the beginning. We knew that we wanted to have back a character from the first lady's trend to create a balance between the two games from the beginning. We knew that trend to is taking place in the same universe as the first season three years after and we always wanted to have Easter eggs on links and David is a I think we sh- which was David for in in one part because David can be burst alive. We are less to your decision. Banning to your decision at the end of life is strange if if you choose to save up KGB W will be saved so he would be alive and if you choose to save chloe David will be alive because it was in the bunker arresting different so the what knife forest arrest and on the other end which they did You can maybe explain this better. KONTA voice to Karen and we Also wanted the cameo from the first season to walk with our story if a player never played his one so in a way David it worked really well symmetrically with With the story at this moment you have Karen we explained to shun that Shannon is to sing by himself if to go with his own rules to go up to the end and to leave the life he wants to leave which means maybe crossing the border and forcing Crossing the border if you need to energy opposite David is more of the voice way said that. Maybe that's not your best option. Maybe maybe you have to turn yourself to the police. Maybe maybe you will. You will do time but maybe at least will be free later. This is a way as to basically Karen and David were explaining some no matter what would happen after your final choice so it was really interesting that even if you don't care about David you don't know about Mexico Arcadia obey this character steed as its Own Place in the story. It was really nice exploring his trailer. And finding all the little Easter eggs the photos of Max chloe the and the family photo of Khloe with you know her mom and David together was really nice and then the phone call the phone call was the best part so I I need to know. Is this though the cannon that Max and chloe are in New York is at the thing definitively twins these there is no oh Karen ending. Life is trench one. The bus endings are Canon and the same life is French too. There is no cannon ending and life insurance. It's too but when you start playing life is twenty two. We had this question in the beginning. What was your choice at the end of the first half and if you haven't played life if he's turned the there will be a random choice so if you choose to save chloe at the end of the frustration you will have from core faulk from Khloe? If you choose to save you will have another from which is cannot do because the two ending Ooh now I have to look at what this other phone call was. Because I'm going to be honest. I did save Arcadia Bay in my playthrough I was like. They're really cute. But there's so many people in Arcadia Bay alike. I'm sorry I gotta go but I that's not the that's not a choice. I got 'cause I didn't I left it blank at the beginning. Random choice if he is alive But Yeah I guess that's I players. Who Saved Klay? Definitely we can say that at this moment avin maximum crew in New York during this phone is can we just don't explain much more. What's doing in this in this and of course it's a really nice nod to also to some of the events that happened in before storm because Rachel had this plan before the storm like go to New York? Then obviously you know didn't work out so Rachel But I thought it was. It's a really nice like moment where players could just stand and listen to the phone call and hopefully people listening if you missed it because you just walked on by I go look it up and listen to it as a really nice. It's a really nice nod to to the original. Life is strange but I do also want to kind of talk about like. What's what's going to happen now? Post life is strange too so we get to the end of the episode. We knew there had to be some kind of resolution to this police chase. That's been happening the episode one and they're seven different total endings to the game right. Yes I haven't watched them all but I've watched a couple of them then the whole time. The kind of theme of the Brothers has been trying to stick together and support encourage each other. And then they ultimately end up apart heart. And that's like both beautiful and heartbreaking at the same time it's like this idea of like sean making the ultimate sacrifice ultimate sacrifice for Daniel Gno when really it at first. You think that Daniels making the sacrifice for Sean and then at the end of it. It's like well. Actually they almost are meant to be apart. And I'm so conflicted I don't know how to feel. How am I supposed to feel? I don't even sing. There is one very good ending. You said that for the one good we it's when Daniel ends up with Claire and Steven because he jumps out of the parts of the the two of them are trying to cross border. Yeah I think that every ending there is flow main endings and there. There is Three variations on top of those Formenting so it's still some phobic story and motivations that brings to to seven lendings but just the idea was more like I. There is no right or wrong endings or is not good or bad ending. It's it's sad every dings where we walked on them. We wanted those to to be a good reflection of the players. Play through to what he it does to to Dana and it was brought on. I two show. That's in a way like in in real life. I'm I mean We are talking characters that I've lost a bit of their own possibility of full choice because of their system. MM around them. So whatever choice you may still is just not just not Shannon yet. It's the it's the cited water on them that will have an impact on them so it was important to to never have a good ending because of a message is also to talk about what excursion about how it is to face to face oppression in a world and yeah. It's it's one of the reality that had a bunch of Israel to comply with the road of society and maybe make make a big time in jail maybe longer and what was What should have had so most of these ending can be a bit unfair fair and I think it's like it is because unfair exactly mean for us on do you when you approach something like writing multiple endings and trying to figure out what these resolutions are going to beat the story lines in? Is there ever a time when you are unsure if you've made the right decision well you know when I'm writing this story. I'm I'm doing it close to Michelle howl so it's not a lonely work. It's it's only work when I'm tipping it and adding a lot of stuff inside but we are. We already talked a lot about what will happen. Then and the the it's also because of the episodic structure of the game you know the different the first draft of the script where return in two thousand in sixteen I think and we begin to work in the fiefs. Absurd in May been approval may in this year and we thought about what was due ending so we have two years and we read it back and say okay. We need to to make some slightly adjustment. No because we grown up and the game from what was written as evolved because we had a lot of stuff so basically we we stick to the idea of the foreign ings and but we are than we changed some little Stephan. It's a chance to work with Michel how closely the three of us because because we change ourselves a lot every time it's okay we add this and is it good. Is it bad and okay. I don't like it but I like the idea. We have to change the Sittings to to make the bitter and we. That's why we we. We work so cool together because we don't have any ego and sometimes it's hard to do to face stuff but it's At least that's what makes the game better. I think the right now I can only imagine if you is came to blows over a decision right of saying. I think Dana should do this and I think Daniels to do this and then you can't come to a resolution you know it could have dramatically changed. What happened with the whole story? So it's great that you guys have a great writing relationship because sometimes is that as you mentioned can be really contentious especially with creative ideas. People get so invested in their creativity that it's sometimes hard to share that and tout's it's awesome to hear that you guys work really well together. We you know. From the beginning we had this vision and the story about this too and when we read the first the first Meeting notes meeting notes of the basic idea of life. If you start to realize that we take to the vision we add four years ago and most of the state the same with with adjustments but the the worst are crossing every step we had in mind. So that's that's really cool and something over your so of course. I walking working with a great team of designers narrative designers and I mean if like the the big steps of the story. are steelers. Aig End of the project. But of course we are really sharing and talking all the creative tenants that are not team that we walking with really happy to walk with and it also brings a lot within. I mean we are is we have this scene we show them our sins is created and then we have the feedback committee. This could walk better so it's always a struggle with rigby creative process with the rest of the team of the cost of the of the four years. How many people worked on this game? The Wolf is that in a in a peak. It's maybe when was up to sixty on average number forty five okay. Can we talk a little bit. numb propaganda get stonewalled here. But I'm going to ask it anyway. About like what happens. Next is their ideas or plans to hopefully continue. Something in the life is strange. Strange Universe obviously like no announcements right now but I mean it seems like you guys. Did this phenomenal job. Creating this whole whole new cast of characters. I speak for myself when I say I would love to see some of them again because I think there was no some. That didn't have nearly enough time. You know we would like like to maybe explore some other story lines. That's something that you guys are considering or contemplating. We know that he wants to continue to create game together with Johnny can hold and we have a lot of stories and ideas and short of great games that we want to walk on and therefore for nine. I just wondered Something that's a question that needs to be seen with crying because it's Just is owned by screening. So we'll see what happens with that so everybody everybody started tweeting Next to them and say I need more. Life is strange. Make Life is strange three. Make it happen okay. Here's the last question. If you guys could bring anybody back from life estranged you or the original life is strange that was either killed or for is gone kind of like a favorite character of yours. Who would it be? Who would you guys bring back to to bring him back into new game? Yes just a hypothetical not a real thing but just just for funsies bring mushroom yes. Mushroom mushroom gets so. She won't be there and just to confirm that would bring back differs. No no no no no sound. Jefferson mushroom that I've seen to be on. I really loved the character of Karen. Yes she's an interesting one. I didn't really like her when we first met her but she grew on me and then obviously by episode five her arc has really come a long way. So tell me what do you. What do you love so much about Karen I I think she was one of the product of the most complicated too right because you know what she what she has done? She Show I've been done a achieved enough. How many and it's yeah? It's it's a bad thing. Bert also wanted to explain a reason and not to be judgmental on our one to we want so it was a little bit difficult to to. We'll have this balance about not judging but letter explain what a what was there. A reason and make understandable by the player. Can you even with her. On a on a on a broader it was interesting. There was a lot of topics associated with with this story. Kind it's it's the topic about How we outwitted? Different men in situation exists. I'm in a lot of Fazul's leaves family and get away with it really easily. Career Women's outdone. It's finished and nobody wants to talk to them anymore. Because it's a road that society wants to put on women that have to be mother where men men don't have to be and it was something this idea and can tell Rutta about how also sightsee I t.. Forces us in different roads and would be two women are in each kind of of culture and uh-huh and different Different where we are. We are pushed away in a row that someone wants to push us and it was important for us to talk about that into into Show so that sometimes you are forced or you think you are forced to do something and then if you just sink to. I've regretted maybe not too late to change even if something were done so there was a lot of topics Ridi strong William importantly wanted to deal with carriage was a lot of back and force together with narrative designer and just to see how are we could share and make sons through and prisons those topics in a way that we are not false fit exempt to the player so it was quite quite complicated. But I'm really happy with the way and Eh now if I were to choose one CACTI would bring you back well good choice. We can do like a buddy comedy with Karen and mushroom and it'll be great perfect thing back together. Losing well John Lee Michelle. Thank you so much for chatting with me. Today it's been a wild ride in life is strange to room. And don't forget guys you have have to message screenings because we need more anymore. Life strange in our lives big. Thank you again to not for taking the time to sit down with me. It was great to see Michelle. Luke we hope you guys enjoyed the spoiler cast. Of course we want to hear what you want to say about it. Don't tweet to US THOUGH WE WANNA keep it private for people who don't WanNa know but do leave is a comment on the video or you can always go to Patriot dot com slash. What's good games and leave us a comment there as well? Thanks so much for hanging out with US everybody. Nobody will see you next time. Bye yeah.