20 Episode results for "Sean Ramos"

India's Muslim ban

Today, Explained

16:09 min | 10 months ago

India's Muslim ban

"In what is seemingly becoming a tradition on this show before we get to the show. I'm going to tell you about another podcast. Think of it as like a trailer for a movie before you see the movie you actually came to watch watch So here we go in a world where there's a podcast called by the book. That is half reality. Show half half self-help podcast and one wild social experiment in this world. Comedian Gillette Greenberg and culture sure critic. Kristen minder choose a different self-help book to live by for two weeks. Along the way they record lord themselves at work at home and out in the world they share. If said. self-help book is improving or in some cases destroying doing their lives by the book. Listen and subscribe wherever you. Listen to your podcasts. The breaking news you guys. India is a very big country the second biggest in in terms of population. It's also home to the second largest Muslim population in the whole world and that's why the citizenship amendment India's parliament passed asked yesterday Doodo Nineteen Possible Looks About Research Rajasa is going over in. The amendment simplifies the path to citizenship ship for Hindu refugees from neighboring countries. A lot of people though are saying what that actually amounts to is a Muslim ban. We called up Niehoff. Must See in New Delhi to explain. She covers India for the Washington Post and says this legislation is just one part of the ruling. BJP PARTIES HE's Master Plan. So this is a part of the BGP's vision for India as a Hindu state as a country which Hindus can call their homeland. And so tell me what's in. The final passed version of this bill. What does it say so the current built was passed will make fundamental change to India citizenship law? which will include for the first time ever religion as a criteria for nationality? So the bill says that minorities of from Afghanistan Bangladesh and Pakistan and a specifies the religions which include obviously Hindus or Christians Parsis Buddhists Jane's and seeks six religions will be afforded an easier path to citizenship if they have come to India illegally or without papers or have overstayed their visas back by two thousand. Fourteen this does not include Muslims. And of course does not include three other India's neighbors including China Burma the Entry Lanka which have prosecuted minorities which include Muslims. So that's where the controversial aspect of the bill is so I think that might be confusing to people. You're dealing with three countries. Six religions excluding a bunch of other countries and even Hindus from those other other countries. Why well I think one assessment is that the three countries mentioned will most of the potentially illegal immigrants who will be Hindus so majority of those will be from these three countries particularly Bangladesh as to the other part of the question that why does that exclude the other countries because if the other countries like Burma or Sri Lanka would be included the minorities there include Muslims? So that is the intent of this. Bill is being questioned that it is discriminatory as it excludes specific countries where Muslims are minority. So if the if the government wants to provide amnesty to prosecuted minorities in the neighborhood it should have idly included all of the countries so to be clear this bill that passed in India. This week is great. If you're a Hindu emigrant from three countries and bad if you're a Muslim immigrant from a number of countries that would be accurate and it's it's clear that this isn't an accident at this was the design of the bill This was asked repeatedly to the home minister during the debate in parliament and there was no clear answer to other countries have been left out while these have been included. Why specific religions have been named and others not named named but the ruling Hindu nationalist government says? It's bill does not discriminate against Muslims. This bill will not harm even a little bit any minority especially our Muslim brothers and sisters who live in this country because this bill only give citizenship it. It doesn't take it away from anybody in this. They are targeting a community without naming it. It violates the basic structure of the Constitution it is divisive and exclusive. It has consequences that you can't even imagine and this is part of your political actors. You so outside of India people are framing this as a Muslim ban. Does it look like that inside India well so it is more complicated than that and I think there is definitely a difference from Mr Trump's Muslim ban. Here's the ban is actually a form of exclusion and in light of possible future actions of the government. It has deepened concerns that are Muslims citizens and citizens of the country will be reduced to second class citizens without any rights. I wonder if this if the government here was intending to to limit Muslim citizenship and Muslim immigration in some way. Did they intentionally complicate the bill so it didn't look that way. Well it's hard to do you know state someone else's intent here and of course. These are questions that will get challenged in court in fact earlier this morning. A constitutional challenge has already already been filed against the bill arguing that it goes against article fourteen which crowns everyone equality before my anything. Come of that challenge. It will take some time. Legal challenges are long John Affairs particularly in India and there will be several other challenges coming up as well so it won't be very sewn. What other opposition face as it made its way through the legislature and pass this week so about trump the opposition in parliament there have been protests in the northeast particularly which have done a violent today? Thousands of people have defied. The curfew to come out. Internet has been suspended. Many here in Assam see the passage of the citizenship ship Amendment Bill as a clear message from the Hindu nationalist government that they are second-class citizens government. What does the trying to make minority in our own? Very stint in our one video allegiance by giving if there is a lot of violence that is going on there and in the rest of the country there have been civil society protests that have been organized people have letters to the president and Prime Minister Stowe offering them to withdraw the bill. People have also declared that if this is passed and if there is a nationwide registry next they will refuse to summit people's solidarity not with Muslims or declared themselves Muslims so the response has been widespread of course there is also a segment of the population that supports the BJP's move and does celebrated the passing of in a country of one point. Three billion people. Do you have any sense of how many people support this legislation. That's a very hard question to answer. Unfortunately what is the measure of support that we would use to do that if we see electoral success as a measure of popularity. Not for the government's action then. Yes it would be constructed because Mr Moore. They came back in power earlier this year with a big majority than he had. And all of these. The proposals were part of the party's manifesto and he's spoken about them during the campaign so in that way yes it does enjoy popularity however if you look at the percentage of woods that the BJP one across the country it's still within thirty to forty percent depending on different regions so that also shows that a lot of the country did not vote for the BJP or Mr Moody Tell me about Modi's Modi's vision for India right now Mr Audience is from the BJP. The view India's history as a series stories of humiliation of I by Muslim rule under the mobile and then of course by the British colonial pile And for them their aim amore. Goal is to redress that by reclaiming the glory of the ancient Hindu civilization so for them India secular Oh polity India's founders envisioned a secular state and constitution is is something that they seek to undo so apart from this Muslim Ben. How's he going about achieving this vision for India right so In his second term the government has lost no time in implementing winging its larger vision or plan saw in in August soon after being elected it revoked cushman which is all muslim-majority region Excuse me is Semi Autonomous Status has flooded Jammu in Kashmir with tens of thousands of extra troops and police the result an atmosphere of uncertainty dapper -hension and since then has not gone back to normalcy. If if I can call it that the Second Ping which happened soon after After the decision was the Supreme Court worked on the Ram Temple. This is again a long standing demand which the BJP had promised to fulfill that. Ah Krant Ram temple will be built all where. Once a mosque stood. They believe the nearby sixteenth century. Babri mosque was built by Muka. Emperor after destroying temple on the exact spot we got round was literally born frenzied. Mobs tore down the boss sparking deadly the riots and driving a wage between those and Muslims and then of course the latest one has been the busing of citizenship. What's next in this plan There are two other things that are likely to come up next. One is the citizenship registry. which has to be seen in conjunction Shen with this bill so if that happens then all one point? Three billion people of the country will have to prove that they are citizens however the terms and conditions and watch What will be the parameters? I'm not clear right now and and if that happens then Muslims Who get excluded will not have a brought to citizenship again? While Hindus who may get excluded will be able to find a way back and the last I would say is is the uniform Civil Code so India is the secular country allows different religions to practice their own personal loans but under uniform Civil Code. All religions will will be governed by common law and not and not by that Boston does and how will that sort of serve this mission the BJP has consistently accused the opposition particularly the congress. Party not which has ruled India for most of its seventy s independence as pandering and appeasing the Muslim minorities so Muslims follow their own personal law. Which means that there are certain aspects or customs that they are allowed to follow which they won't be allowed to do if the uniform civil code is brought in? How soon will these actions in Kashmir which we've talked about on the show before plus turning this mosque into a temple altering the civil code? How much do these actions actions serve the end of turning India into a Hindu state Well there are several aspects to that one is of course the legal and the constitutional framework India's constitution remains on people A secular secular republic. So that will be harder to change for that. They will have to go through a legal framework via the courts because that can be challenged. So that's one aspect of it but what they can do is bring in legislation nations like these which fundamentally changed the nature of the republic. Even if it's not law and that's something that a lot of critics of the government as well as columnists have pointed out that feels like the Citizenship Amendment Fundamentally alter the idea of India that it was founded upon nationalism really seems to be trending ending right now is there something uniquely Indian in this push. We're seeing to create a Hindu state or do you think this is just part of a broad resurgence of identity politics Baltics across the world. Both I think it's a bit of both. There is definitely a move across the world towards right-wing populist leaders who increasingly recently are showing authoritarian. Tendencies but again in the Indian context if I were to say there are also things which are uniquely specific which means seen that In Jazz whom to a large number of minority so so the other is actually not an external threat which you know Mr Trump has been able to make Eh for instance the other India. Actually its own citizens my name is I am a writer and activist activist and I walk on gender rights and minority rights. I happen to have a Muslim name. So yes I am identified as a Muslim being grown up in vide- leap looted Douglas country. In which we have intermarried with Hindus and Christians and have grown up in an extremely happy Situation there has been absolutely no sense of discrimination. That one has experienced personally or professionally for that matter. A lot has changed in this country from two thousand thousand fourteen. We have seen people being being fearful of traveling or revealing their identities on buses on chains trying to disguise that identity entity if you will. We've seen this kind of mysterious hatred growing people being lynched on the streets beaten to death by mobs. Video recorded did uncirculated as symbols of triumph. This is what you saw in the antebellum south in America this is what the universe what humanity humanity believes should never be allowed to recur. We've seen that. In India that is across the board among those who consider themselves says liberal voters of this country who consider themselves people who believe in the idea of India as India was when it was born when it was but when we gave ourselves institution in nineteen fifty all of us Hindus and Muslims together will yes. That is a steely resolve. We we have to fight this and we must fight this. We will fight this with. Thanks to Netflix. And Nia must see for joining us from New Delhi today. I'm Sean Ramos from this is today explained from the District of Columbia Awesome.

India BJP Bill BJP New Delhi Mr Trump Kristen minder Gillette Greenberg Kashmir Washington Post Bangladesh Netflix Burma Mr Moore Douglas country America Baltics Assam Boston Sean Ramos
Still not safe to drink

Today, Explained

19:27 min | 1 year ago

Still not safe to drink

"A lot of you are about to enjoy a long weekend labor day here in the united states lay board day up in canada. If you like labor day deal stitcher would like to offer you thirty percent off stitcher premium. You get a whole lot of ad free shows including this one plus bonus episodes from some of your favorite shows and comedy albums to listen listen to if you're interested go to stitcher premium dot com slash labor day and use the code l. a. b. o. r. d. a. y. Labor day for thirty percents off your subscription <music> welcome to the two thousand nine hundred as my name is sebastian maniscalco and i'm going to be your host tonight. Aw thank you so much. This is my first war ever own right now. Jordan taylor swift everyone. You're nominated twelve all times to make how does that feel. It feels great. Just a minute ago. A bunch of protests are just came down rushing toward the prudential center on edison avenue. You could see if you take a look behind me. In most of these protesters testers are residents here in newark who are trying to call out the city right now for holding the a._m._a.'s instead of cancelling the b._n._a.'s in wake of the going carrying ye. You've been covering the newark water crisis in the star ledger. What's behind these protests. We saw this week week. The lead crisis has gone a lot of attention recently but really this problem dates back to twenty sixteen when levels began to spike in the public school system annual water contamination tests set newark's public schools were conducted between december and february newark school planning to seek the consent of parents of students to conduct blood testing for lead into thirty schools with elevated levels on tuesday on wednesday. The district turned turned off water at thirty schools after results revealed unsafe lead levels and they shut off about four hundred sources of drinking water and they pass asked out bottled water to children who were thirsty short answer the mayor's call and delivered more than thirty thousand bottles of water after the city cut off the drinking water at thirty effect at schools and this this came at a time right after flint so at that point there was a lot of alarm over whether this could be another flint but the district at the time move pretty quickly to replace all all of the old let plumbing in the schools avenue filtration systems and implement a more robust sampling plan so they know whether this continue to be a problem did they find out what the source of the lead was in the schools officials at the time said that this was an indoor plumbing problem. The lead was coming from old awards. Lead solder oils lead faucets old led fixtures and those were subsequently replaced so it sounds like it's still limited problem at this point in two thousand sixteen right fast fast forward to two thousand seventeen. That's when we started seeing lead levels citywide prior to two thousand seventeen newark was on a three year testing cycle so they basically had to sample fifty homes every three years as a twenty seventeen they had to sample a hundred homes every six months and the first time that the sampling we saw big nick problem more than ten percent of the sampled homes were above the federal limit for light which fifteen parts per billion. How bad is that as anything less than that okay. This is just a bar set by the government. That says you know if certain percentages of your samples are over this threshold. You have to take action but there's no safe level of lead for consumption at all. I mean it has affects primarily on children pregnant women when it comes to cognition when it comes to development lead lead is in the water lead can be in paint. Let could be in dust. It's in multiple different areas and children can be exposed in multiple different ways <hes> so in june two thousand seventeen they they have these sort of alarming citywide results what came from that announcement what happened next at that point. The city issued an alert and a ah announced that they were starting a program to replace the source of the lead which is these lead pipes that are snaking underground so is that where the leads been coming from. I'm not the actual source water pipes lead is coming from the infrastructure newark gets its water from different reservoirs ores in the state and that gets treated and pumped through a distribution system so the lead is coming from these pipes called lead service lines which are the size of a garden hose and they basically connect individual homes to underground water mains water mains are kind of the big pipes that run in the middle of of residential streets so these lead service lines are the connector to each individual home to pump water and in newark. There's about thirty six thousand service lines and about eighteen gene thousand of those are made of lead. There's a ton of lead piping under newark. How is it only a problem now so there's as a treatment called corrosion control and this is basically a set of chemicals that gets pumped into the water as it flows through the distribution system. It's supposed to react with the lead in these pipes to create a crust like a protective barrier to keep that lead from dissolving into the water and so when that failed you essentially having corrosive highly acidic water flowing through these pipes causing the lead to dissolve into the water and come out of the tap yep so it's a twofold problem like an infrastructure problem and then a failure of treatment problem. I see so if you have lead pipes. It's not necessarily the -sarily a problem if this corrosion control system keeps working ideally no right. I mean if a water treatment plant is operating as it should you have to protect against you old infrastructure and led the could be leaching from these old pipes. Do we know when this treatment system stopped working or why it stopped working. The city hired an outside engineering nearing company that drafted an extensive study looking at this and all that report could tell us is the treatment failed sometime before two thousand seventeen which is when we saw the lead levels spiked as to what caused the treatment to stop working sometime around twenty twelve there was a new rule meant to prevent possible carcinogens indigenes from being in the water and to meet this rule this treatment plant that we're talking about the pokorny treatment plant lowered the ph of the water and in making the water more acidic take the water became more corrosive and rendered this corrosion control treatment less effective over time wow so they were trying to solve another problem than in created this exactly that's called simultaneous compliance or trying to comply with a medley of everchanging standards and rules and so it seems like in an effort to prevent possible carcinogens from being in the water they lowered the ph rendering the cruise control treatment less effective over time. Okay i feel like i have a solid understanding of how these pipes hypes work now. So let's jump back into the time line twenty sixteen we see let in the water and some schools two thousand seventeen we start seeing lead levels citywide and then twenty eighteen is when the n._r._d._c. gets involved is that right yes the natural resources defense council and they are our water advocacy group and they sued in flint a few years back and successfully won their lawsuit and they came to newark and started making a lot of public records request to find out how about are the lead levels roles. What's been the city's response and from what they found. They weren't satisfied. Eventually they ended up suing the city in federal court in june two thousand eighteen. The lawsuit claims claim state officials ignored federal law when they fell to treat drinking water for corrosion leading to dangerously high levels of lead and lawsuit is still ongoing and what was supposed to happen with the water in the meantime the city handed out these three nine thousand filters and that was supposed to be the short term fix while the changes treatment and made a better and while the city also so dug up these old pipes and replace them with copper pipes today the mayor announced corrosion control system is no longer effective and home filtration systems are needed study showed that corozzo control presently being used <hes> has not been effective in various parts of the north ward parts parts of south ward the west ward and essential war the treatment process can take up to a year to get remedied and then the replacing all the pipes was supposed to take eight years to a decade okay to get remedied so in the meantime they said look use filters but what happened in august is that three homes were sampled post filtration so this means that the water water went through the filter which are nationally certified and when they tested that water to water filters came back where to lead was not reduced to a level that we were comfortable comfortable with these are filters that have been used across the country they've been used in flint and have been found around to appropriately and effectively remove lead and make the water safe to drink and they weren't doing that here. Newark they were removing lead but they just weren't not removing lead at the levels that they should have that prompted the e._p._a. To get involved really say to newark like you have to provide an alternate source of drinking water until we figure out what is wrong with these filters that prompted the roll out of seventy thousand cases of water to affected residents from brushing teeth to cleaning produce to cooking. Almost everything is done with bottled water. August ninth is when the e._p._a. Sends a letter to the city saying we're. We're recommending strongly that you distribute bottled water by that monday august twelfth. The city rolled out its plants distribute bottled water by tuesday. We find out that i bet this bottled water which had been provided by the state from their emergency. Supply was past its best by day and the water bottle distribution was halted residents. It's headlined up at several locations to pick up the water provided by the state but we're frustrated by the latest headache water doesn't expire but for residents that better frustrated that aren't really sure what to believe to read this on the bottle that it's it's passed its best buy the best day was made twenty nineteen. It just raised raise more concerns and and more fear about whether they drink this water. The water problem in newark is getting real bad almost like point mentioning may have a rocket raka is worse than the officials in flint because he knew this. It makes me feel angry. It's a situation that wasn't control before it got. This bad water is right water. Water is a human right a new batch seventy thousand more cases of bottled water rolled into the city tuesday night and you know the distribution resumed in a lot of people people were saying you know this is this has been going on for three years. We've been hearing about letting the water in the city since two thousand seventeen. Why are we getting bottled water right now. Mm-hmm what's been the response from newark mayor ras baraka recently. The mayor has been trying to assure residents that the waters i have led that they're not flint and that the city is moving as quickly as possible to fix the problem. I will control the hitter stopped working. We didn't purposefully take get out of the water so to make a comparison is not only disingenuous to me is almost insulting and is mayor baraka right is what's. It's happening in newark different from what happened in flint in meaningful ways. I think there are some differences but i think there are some similarities one of the things that the mayor likes highlight as a as the difference is that in flint they switched their source of water to save costs and they didn't treat that water properly in newark. The water source has always always remained the same. It's reservoir water. That's never changed and the treatment to the corrosion. Treatment has also stayed the same. It just stopped working because ph levels were changed but flint anouar both predominantly black and brown cities. We see similar infrastructure problems. Newark won't be the last city to have a lead problem. There are other cities in the state that have elevated levels in the water and several cities across the country that have these very same lead service service lines so then do you expect to see this and other cities and towns in the future that's unclear. I think newark and flint are forcing a lot of towns to reckon with the infrastructure to take a look at you know do they have lead service lines to even have an inventory. I mean a lot of towns that by newark water don't know if they have have lead service lines or copper lines like a lot of these records are old does not clear if it's reliable a big problem is that in a lot of these towns these service lines are privately the own their own by homeowners so it's a question of who should pay and how are we going to pay for it but you know some homes in newark have elevated levels but don't have a lead service lines so that could mean that the water is corroding lead faucets lead solder other lead components in your home that you may or may you not know about that. You may have to get you know inspected but that's really on the homeowner right. That's not necessarily something. The city can do so what's the latest update are are they just in wait and see mode using questionable filters and drinking bottled water. There was a big announcement in the city on monday. That actually significantly expedited one of the long term fixes potential light at the end of the tunnel for newark residents who are impacted by the crisis of lead in their water newark. Mayor ras baraka made a major announcement about the issue we actually announced as we said earlier one hundred twenty eighty million dollar investment made possible by essex county improvement authority to expedite the modernization of newark's drinking water and infrastructure at no cost to affected homeowners. One of the fixes here is to get rid of the source of the problem which is these old lead pipes dig them up out of the ground and replace it with copper and and the city had a plan to do that for seventy five million dollars but it was gonna take eight years and with additional funding from the county where newark resides they were able to get one hundred twenty million dollar loan and they're going to be able to get that money upfront and what that's going to be able to do is it's going to allow the city to more quickly. Replace these service lines so that narrows down the window to three years so citywide there should no longer be lead service lines in the next three years and the city is also rolling out its new treatment plans new corrosion rosen plan that <hes> those new chemicals have been added to the water since may and that's gonna take six months eight months up to a year to be effective and over the the next six to eight months while the new chemicals are taking effect. What are residents supposed to do. That's to be determined so we know that the sampling plan that the state and the city of doing to figure out what is wrong if anything with these filters is going to take two weeks. We're not really sure what's going to happen after the city and the state figure out what's happening with the there's a lot of that will depend on the answer and so for the next two weeks we know residents are going to have to rely on bottled water <music> and have you spoken to anyone in newark. That's had to deal with this that stands out in your mind. Yes i spoke to one mom last week and i think her story is really indicative of this whole journey that we've seen the city go through i mean her son is ten years old now. He he has elevated lead levels in his blood and his former school was one of the elementary schools that had its drinking water shut off in two thousand sixteen because there was elevated lead levels in the building his home where he lives with his mother has lead paint and the home also has led service line. Is there any way to know how that might abducting her child. She told me that her son has learned disability and she's noticed that he's regressed in the last couple of years. He has elevated blood lead levels but it's really hard to say well. It came from the paint. It came from the school that came from the water because it's hard to know how or when that child absorbed the contaminant another mom that i've spoken to her child was also tested and had elevated levels in his blood but she had her home home inspected by the city and she does not have let service line so that raises the question of where is this coming from and what the solution to that is yeah. That's really tough. If you can't even trace back the source of the contaminant that you're finding your child's blood. How do you go about trying to solve this problem right and and she doesn't have a let service line. Her line is not going to be changed. I think at this point she's relying on bottled water and waiting for the city's new treatment to take effect and hopefully hopefully that will reduce levels coming out of her tab and in terms of sort of repairing that trust. Is there anything that we've learned from what happened in flint about about when people will start to believe that their water is safe to drink again. That's a really big question <hes> for the city and for the future of newark's newark's water. I'm not sure i think in flint. We've seen some reports where people don't trust the water and i don't know when they will <music>. We're starting to see a little bit of that in newark where residents aren't really sure who to believe and this as trying trying to put out information but there's so much of a national spotlight right now on the city of newark and at this point it's a little bit late right given event of the messaging that the city has put out in the past. It's sort of hard to go back so i. I don't know i don't know where that's gonna. Leave the city in terms of will the residents be able to trust this water in the future. I mean the water treatment will be fixed. The lead pipes will be fixed. I don't know if you could say the same thing about public. Trust in the water mm-hmm hearing ye is the newark reporter for nj advanced media work also appears in the star ledger. We reached out to the newark mayor's office but they hadn't hadn't gotten back to us with a comment on this story by publishing time. I'm john fong filling in for sean ramos firm while he's on vacation. This is today explained <music>. Um <music>.

newark newark flint united states ras baraka sebastian maniscalco stitcher canada Jordan taylor mayor baraka nick reporter john fong essex county sean ramos three years eight months
Biofuel duel

Today, Explained

23:36 min | 1 year ago

Biofuel duel

"Support for this particular podcast comes from akiko they make projects that are designed to spark creativity tinkering and learning and kids of all ages. They'll send them right right to your door or the door of a kid that you wanna get a kiwi co create for right now because offering today explained listeners the chance to try them for free at ccri co dot com slash explained splint friday august ninth twenty nine thousand nine hundred and it's a fairly quieted august d._c. Afternoon and i get a phone call from one of my sources saying i should be expecting something smaller finery waivers and it's around two thirty three and i'm like about yeah and he's like they put don't go to the happy hour. I'm like who mira pamouk mook covers energy for reuters and she'll be the first to tell you that it's not the most breakneck beat in journalism which made this call all the more out of the ordinary so i started making calls and then the decision comes on all how breaks loose statements statements from corn states lawmakers trade groups industry groups start raining on me criticizing missing slamming this decision minds you. Some of these groups are like completely pro presidents. They're mostly republican and these statements are fuming a few weeks ago. The environmental protection agency decided it would allow thirty one oil refineries to bypass a requirement to make certain amount of ethanol into their fuel as you might know ethanol is a biofuel mostly made from corn the more ethanol ethanol refiners add into their oil. The more farmers get to move their product. I remember hearing the president say that he's the best thing to ever happen to the farmers <hes> as a matter of fact. That's a joke he's creating problems that are hurting our farming community three screwed us when they issued thirty one waivers compared to less than ten waivers during the obama years and we thought that was bad but guess who's not crazy about ethanol our message to our investors yesterday was it's a good time to be chevron. Our portfolio is stronger than it's ever been and you don't have to look any further than the permian to see that exxon mobile shares are trading higher right now. Following the company's quarterly report earnings seventy three cents a share expectations of sixty six. It's oil versus ag and whoever wins. It's gonna be a big drag for the president. Corn farmers and oil industry have been in a dispute for quite some time now over over the nation's biofuel policy. It's fair to say that the battleground has gotten extremely intensified over the past couple of months over over what we call renewable fuel standard which is the federal policy which requires oil refiners to blend <hes> bio fuels like biodiesel or corn based ethanol into their fuel pull within this policy. There is a program called small refinery waiver program so if an oil refiner says complying with the renewable fuel standard profess is causing me a lot of financial burden jordan and if they can prove to environmental protection agency that it's causing them financial trouble they could be given a waiver. What president trump has done recently is. He has gave the green light to e._p._a. To issue thirty john oil waivers to refiners on this is really really upset corn farmers because what they're saying is like the more laurie give waivers the more you're cutting demand for our product and our product is corn based ethanol okay so we've got these fuel standards that require oil real companies to use biofuels better for the environment good for farmers but the government hands out waivers and under trump and the e._p._a. They just handed out a a bunch of them and now a bunch of corn. Farmers are mad. They already have been suffering from trade wars. They've already seen their our export markets disappear because of the trade war with china they've already been struggling with an extremely low price environment so renewable fuel standards like the nation's biofuel policy is one of the key things that still gives them some sort of a market so president trump trying to take it away from them has really really upset american farmers. How many of these waivers is the federal government usually handing handing out. It's important to remember that during obama times you could say may be the total was less than ten or within a calendar year. You would be looking king at half a dozen however since trump administration came to power they have significantly conly expanded this waiver program and pretty much granted a waiver to whoever applied you've got like exxon mobil oh plans chevron plants or facilities than refineries by carl icahn applying for these small refinery waivers and actually actually getting them and obviously this has caused a backlash so what happened was president trump did not know about this in this detail up until june in june he went to iowa to council bluffs to actually unveil this policy called e. fifteen <hes>. If you've seen is the higher blend ethanol gasoline by fully embracing even fifteen we will reduce dependence on foreign foreign oil by up to two hundred and fifty million additional barrels every single year. I mean quite simply it. It means more energy and what can be wrong with that and it's very good energy he's meeting and speaking with farmers and he's expecting nothing but gratitude however their gratefulness comes with a caveat he speaks to the farmers and and they keep complaining about the small refinery program and he's confused and he calls u._s._d._a. Secretary it's tony purdue and e._p._a. Administrator andrew wheeler and he says what is this and he finds out that these small finery waivers are given to the likes of of exxon and chevron and he tells them to fix this and how are they supposed to do that. Now he does not really specify how so these two agencies along with department of energy starts meeting on brainstorming among each other while corn lobby and oil lobby start their own work to push for their own argument as well and this decision to grant thirty one small refinery waivers to refineries including ones owned by exxon mobil. I can't imagine anyone considering them small. Is this the e._p._a.'s way of saying that. It's just not that into this renewable fuel standard orifice so oh this is like a more than a decade old federal policy <hes> what it basically does is at the time of inaction they said okay. Let's put this policy in place to reduce u._s.'s dependence on foreign oil and then at the time the idea was to replace fossil astle fuels with more environmentally friendly fuels and at the time biofuels were just the ideal alternative to that and also also to create a market for american farmers within the past decades over the past twelve years. There has been a lot of research emerging about maybe corn based. Ethanol is not after all that environmentally friendly because it takes up a lot of nutrients. It's extremely intense. Sort of production process takes a lot out of the soil their husband a lot of land conversion to cropland. There's just a lot of research out there. Now dot says that this is not necessarily as environmentally friendly as housley thoughts a decade ago so there seems to be more question over whether r._f._s. Going forward should stay as it is right now. Does the president care whether it's whether this biofuel azaz environmentally sound as previously thought is that his motivation here no no that wasn't his motivation. President trump is facing a very very difficult choice over the bio fuels policy. Both oil and corn are super important constituencies because they are important for iowa. Obviously ethanol is one of the most important things for iowa but oil and refining industry has also been supportive of president and it's an important constituency for him. He cannot just forget about them and be favorable to american farmers so he has been sort of trying to strike aballah nsinga act but because of the nature of this policy it is extremely difficult to make both sides happy at the same time fine i mean all the democrats just descended on iowa. They were mostly eating deep fried foods. As far as i can tell did this come up several democratic candidates sort of when they're unveiling their agricultural policy i was seeing that they have started dedicating a couple of paragraphs on small refinery waivers on the renewable fuel standard. Amy klobuchar had an events and she said that at most there should be like just a few it should not be handed out the way it is being right now by this administration this standing up to the big oil companies when it comes to climate change and it also means standing standing up to the big oil companies the you don't grant them a bunch of waivers from renewable fuel standard behind closed doors. Joe biden tweeted are reuter her story and basically came in the fence for the farmers and he said in his tweet that he's not going to sell american farmers to the highest is better. This is effectively a political story. It will come to more center stage because of the election action and because of the iowa primary no politician can dare trash-talk biofuels and ethanol in iowa aw saw tug of war between these two industries which are super important constituencies is just going to intensify going forward in in a minute we head to the heartland to find out how all of this is sitting with farmers i and the ethanol industry hera we are too low. Is this aria aria money sean. I spoke with your mom last week and she told me she had just got. You hooked up with kiko that's right. What was the key. We could create that you got in the mail. <hes> i failed to workout this 'cau- your mom told me about it. It's like one of those claws you find in <hes> like an arcade where you drop the claw and pick up fun comprises lol. What color is the claw and rush dumb cut great and i hear like picks up the yarn balls. Did you like building this claw our what was the best part on our cat. You sound like a very satisfied customer. Do you know with your mom went to kiwi co dot com slash explained our where you can try kiwi co out for free. It's great for kids of all ages. Okay tell your fred's are yeah right great to talk to you. Are you nice to meet listen to sean mm-hmm. My name is nick from the president and c._e._o. Of elite octane in in atlantic iowa and sioux linda jackson nebraska. I'm just outside of sioux city iowa ten miles here today at our jackson nebraska facility at suhl so i'm watching many of our area farmer's pull into our plant today and deliver their corn to our facilities. I'm visiting with you so it's fair to say that you were directly affected by this announcement that the e._p._a. The trump administration would be granting more waivers to oil refiners absolutely louis. I live in a town of ten thousand people in west central iowa and is made up of a lot of different businesses all all have agriculture as foundation and so the president's decision on these thirty one small refiners. It's more than just an impact onto ethanol plants. What's the impact extends down into all these rural communities that depend on a healthy agricultural sector to to remain economically vibrant and i imagine you're in touch with these communities. What was your reaction. What was the reaction from these communities that rely on on ethanol ethanol in this industry people are livid. I think what this really is is destroying demand for agricultural products here at home while we're dealing with the loss of numerous export markets all over the world. Give me an idea directly how this affects your business. How this affects farmers what what's the actual pinch that they're going to feel the united states consumes about one hundred and forty billion gallons of gasoline each year and the renewable fuel standard the law that has been on the books since two thousand five and was amended in by congress in two thousand seven. What that law does does is it sets each year. The amount of renewable fuels that this nation is supposed to blend in the laws vary specific that the obligated parties who are responsible danceable for doing that blending are what many people would recognize this this country's large oil companies and the president's epa has been coming in after the fact in handing out these exemptions to oil companies so at the end of the day the country is not being held to blend fifteen billion gallons arena will fuel and you add up over the last three years with the addition of these thirty one exemptions two weeks ago. We're at four billion gallons of renewable fuel. That's been given a free pass and what that represents to the farmer is over one billion bushels of corn nicole. I can't help me picture a billion bushels of corn. <hes> i mean let me think about that shine. You might have to ask me another question. I'll come back to that <hes> because it's cool to take a second i mean i'm just like i think it sounds crazy but i don't think there's any way most people can even visualize that <hes> one hundred times one hundred would be ten thousand zain square miles times six hundred forty acres in square. Mile is six point four four million acres. Okay times you know the corn that we were talking about that. One point one billion bushels of corn so one hundred divided by six point four yeah that'd be a national yield the old of one hundred seventy two bushels acre. That's spot on wow so you're talking about like enough corn to cover the state of massachusetts. I don't know how big massachusetts is but if it's one hundred miles by one hundred miles and that would be i looked it up. It's ten thousand square miles. Is it really yeah and that's just a decision two weeks ago for one third of the destruction. That's happened over the last three years. So what do you think the e._p._a. And president trump should have done here instead of letting this corn horn pileup well. It's it's really not even my opinion sean what they should have done is followed the law and what the law says is that if any of those small refineries experience disproportionate economic harm then the e._p._a. Has the authority to grant this waiver but but let's say that exemption amounts to five hundred million gallons the e._p._a. Should take those five hundred million gallons and reallocate in the exempted gallons over all the remaining refineries in this country so that at the end of the year the country still blends fifteen billion gallons of renewable fuel so what what the president and administrator wheeler absolutely should have done in what they're still time for them to do is to simply take these exempted gallons and reallocate them to the remaining refineries in this country. That's what they should have done and should do. There is still time to fix this. How do you think it'll go over form if he doesn't fix yeah well if he doesn't fix it. I think this has become what i would consider the latest piece that's causing many of his supporters in iowa and all over the agricultural states the united states to step back and say you know we've been great patriots as he calls us but to watch this president and this administration choose these largest refining companies the world knows at the expense of our nation's nations farmers. It's a step too far and it's a step that many out here enroll america aren't going to stand for and so for the first time and i think think a lot of people's lifetimes that have always voted toward the republican way. Many of them are seriously considering are the democrats intelligent enough often. Pick a candidate that on rural issues that makes it very simple for those people to decide to go a different direction for the first time in their life. Do you see a candidate like that yet. I see elements elements that are certainly sticking out you know one person that definitely comes to mind is senator amy klobuchar from minnesota senator klobuchar dr has been closely tied advocate to the agricultural industry and i think she sees the direction that that tag policy recently is headed. I hear snippets from several other candidates that have a very different vision of what agriculture would be and <hes> <hes>. I think we'll just have to see how that process boys out. How do you think the president got this so wrong. I mean he you can tell from any number of stump speeches how much he like that farmers support him how much she wants to support farmers back and yet this decision on these waivers just flies in the face of what farmers in places like iowa want. What do you think was going through his head well. I'd i'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt <hes> when he said a week or ten days ago that he feels misled by his e._p._a. But it's very clear in my mind he had plenty of time to consider the issue to surround himself with people that could talk about the details of the issue and i suppose <music> at the end of the day two weeks ago he had to make a decision on were those factors strong enough to override a decision to continue these exemptions and at the end of the day. He picked up the phone and directed e._p._a. To hand out these exemptions so i think that was a very very very poor decision absolutely that could have huge political ramifications for him and you know the one key message that if i were sitting across from him today what i would tell him. Is that mr president. You've got this wrong. You should acknowledge that you got it wrong and you should fix the problem because you you have the authority and the time to reallocate these gallons and so that's the good thing here. He can fix this problem if he wants to. <music> <music> <music> nick bow dish is the president and c._e._o. Of elite octane in atlantic iowa and sioux land ethanol in jackson nebraska. I'm sean ramos firm and i'm the president of today explained irene noguchi as the show's executive producer of themes shapiro's the engineer halima sean noam hassenfeld domina al-saudi and bridget mccarthy produced the show will read on vacation and the mysterious brake master cylinder is behind the beats. Today explained is produced in association zeeshan with stitcher and we are part of the box media podcast network <music> <music> <hes> the moment. We've all been waiting for. Kiwi co is on a mission. They'd like me to tell you about the mission is to empower kids not just to make a project but but to make a difference and not just one type of kid kids of all shapes sizes ideologies ages cubicles offering today explain kids the chance to try amount for free to redeem the offer and learn more about the projects visit cuba co dot com slash explained.

president iowa trump exxon mobil obama reuters senator amy klobuchar iowa united states sean ramos nebraska andrew wheeler Administrator trump Joe biden massachusetts sioux city
The loneliness pandemic/Betraying essential workers

The Ezra Klein Show

49:07 min | 5 months ago

The loneliness pandemic/Betraying essential workers

"To burn hello and welcome to the show on the box media podcast network. I'm taking a break today. But not too much of one and I wanted to bring you to episodes today explained Reverend. Tell you why you should listen to today. Explained which is our Daily News. Podcast hosted by SEAN. Roms from on tell you why. I do is unbelievably overwhelming. And just sitting there refreshing. Doing it on twitter. It can drive you a little bit crazy and I say that as somebody producing some of that news and today explained is I find a calmer clearer way particularly. I'm trying to take a bit of a break from daily updating to follow you get this great carnivores update at the top. And then they've just been doing an extraordinary job slowing the issues down and either looking directly at something that is court of the crisis aura. And I think this is such important work finding what I would call current virus adjacent stories of things in our society that are maybe not the main story here not being treated as a main story but this is shining a light on something we really need to pay attention to and so those stories in particular are helping me understand not just this crisis better but the world we live in the world we lived in the world we will return to hopefully one day better so wanted to bring you to episodes that. I particularly got a lot out of this week. One of them. I'm in so maybe this is a humble breaking or something but it's about the loneliness pandemic and the way krona virus is worsening a crisis of social isolation and lonesome nist that was already existent in our communities and particularly for vulnerable. Who are going to be in much more severe trouble now for some time but the other one which actually feel more strongly about is about the central workers we now have these classes in many states of who we call essential and look who it is. It is people who work in GROCERY STORES AND GAS STATIONS. People who are health care workers nurses and yet those essential workers. Essential workers are the people we treated before this crisis as inessential and they're treating now is disposable they are often not paid well. They are not protected. They're taking risks on behalf of all of us risk. They often have to take to keep their jobs to keep their families from being economic. Probably aren't people want to be heroes? In many cases they're just people who have to get up in the morning and go to a job and while many of us are staying home they don't get to and they are getting coughed on and they know they are at risk and their employers in our protecting them and society is pregnant we call them essential. We call them in many cases now if you listen to politicians heroes and we treat them as disposable and it is a national shame that particular episode of Today. I just feel so strongly about and I hope he listened to it and I hope you advocate for folks and I hope it causes some change so I'm GonNa Start here with the loneliness pandemic and go then to the essential workers episode if you like what you hear and I think you will subscribe today explained wherever you get your podcasts. Hi My name is Sean. I'm calling from New York City. I am relatively healthy. Twenty seven year old and I'm maybe the most anxious I've ever been in my entire life and I just. I don't know what to do about that. I get that the response needs to be a mitigating like actual real health impacts for the most memorable sections the population. I get that I really do but What can the rest of us do just to feel okay? Has Anyone thought about the kind of a psychological impact that this is having on the population? Thanks so much. Thanks for calling. The answer to your question is yes. Your boy as recline has been thinking about the psychological impact of this crisis. He wrote a whole piece about it for. Vox Dot Com. I think in politics were very used to looking at the economic impacts of things. What is it going to do to GDP? What is it? GonNa do to the unemployment rate but what? Krono virus is doing is disrupting something more foundational and fundamental even than that. It is disrupting whether or not we are able to see each other to give each other a hug to go visit a parent and there's been a revolution in recent years in the medical science around social isolation and loneliness which are different things notably social isolation is objective measurable. How many people do you see in a week? Loneliness is subjective It is whether or not you feel lonely. But both of them have mental effects on people and they really do physical harm they. They are a genuine health risk so understanding that and then trying to abate it recognizing that we have to do more than just physically distance. We also need to socially connect particularly for the most vulnerable. I wanted to write this piece because I think it's unbelievably important. Other numbers on social isolation are they as bad as these jobs. Numbers were saying. We don't do it in a national way. Moment to moment the way we do for the economy it is in that their daily unemployment filings for loneliness but we do have surveys and we have a lot of data on this by coincidence just a couple months ago the National Academies Science these two huge report on the health consequences of social isolation and loneliness in older adults as you might expect. Older adults are among the most vulnerable to this. So forty three percent said they felt lonely and about a quarter fit. The definition of socially isolated. And this is pre corona virus or is pre corona virus and remember. You may be Valenti all or a Gen zero. Whatever who socially distancing right now but if you're over seventy you're doing something in most parts of the country if you're paying attention that is much more severe your quarantining. You are terrified of catching this. Not because you might give it to somebody else which is bad enough but because you may not survive it so a lot of people who were already quite lonely quite isolated have moved into a period of self imposed quarantine that does not have a clear endpoint and the more that young people go out the more that their children or their friends are out in the world and potentially able to catch this virus more they have to segregate away from them so it's really really difficult and loneliness and isolation particularly among the elderly is a tremendous health risk. It seems to be physical in some deep way and the particular way in which it's physical the former Surgeon General Vivek. Murthy has done a lot of work on this. He's got a book coming out on. Is that it sets off a tremendous stress response in the body human beings no on a deep level deeper than our conscious to feel safe in a group. If we're not in a group we wake up more often during the night. We are more afraid we are. What's called hyper vigilant? Were constantly scanning for threats. We don't relax and this seems to then set off a chain reaction of very dangerous actual physical reactions in the body so in this National Academy of Sciences report what they find is social isolation and. I'm quoting here. Has Been associated with a significantly increased risk of premature mortality from all causes and this causes include a fifty percent increased risk of developing dementia. A twenty nine percent increase risk of incidence of coronary heart disease at twenty five percent increase. Risk of cancer mortality. A fifty nine percent increased risk of functional decline and a thirty two percent increased. Risk of stroke now. That is over time. It's not necessarily over two or three weeks of being lonely but if this goes on for a long time it is worth being clear. Being lonely and being isolated is a health risk a direct physical rest of your life. I'm sure there are some people who are fine being alone. I know a few people who seem happier in quarantine than they were going to work every day but what about people who already suffer from serious anxiety or depression people who are already desperately lonely. This is a huge issue. I think so the way I would think about this. Is that the people who are already at. The highest risk for social isolation and loneliness are even more vulnerable in this era. So we've been talking about the elderly but disabled are another group here. A lot of people who is already hard for them to go out already hard for them to go take a walk already hard for them to see people for one reason or another and then people with serious mental health issues who are socially anxious who are depressed. This is GonNa make it much harder. Both for them to go out but also harder for people to reach out to them. They may have an extreme reaction where they have trouble even taking incoming help. Even if people are trying to be safe about it and I want to be so clear. We need to do the social distancing. We absolutely need to. But we also have to remember that the cost of social distancing will fall disproportionately on those who are already most vulnerable and already were the most lonely and isolated and that will have not just psychological but also health effects for them. I'm doing okay for my hair is Iraq. Because I had I figured I'm not going anywhere so securely in my name is Dorothy Shelly. I'm eighty four years old. I live alone in I'm pretty much in isolation it's really hard to just be stuck in the house all the time. I like to be with people. So I miss that and I seen my daughter on Saturdays from a distance. She brings me groceries and lease the Mini Garage and tells me not to come past kitchen door and the same with my daughter-in-law who she leaves stuff under front porch on doing dueling go on my IPAD and Italian mostly to keep my brain active and then reading a book. And then I keep planning out some drawers to Guyana. Eighty four. And I've got so much stuff accumulate you can't imagine then that's basically and watching movies that I recorded an evening or TV shows. I like jeopardy and real a fortune so I record them and I didn't even know what facetime was last week when the phone started making noises and I answered it was my son doing based on so I said how do you do that. So he explained it to me so luckily cellphones and checks messages and stuff like that and facetime with my family. So that's good but I'm looking out my window right now and the trees are starting to bloom a live place and the birds in the morning. Our guest is such a thing as corona virus. And they're all singing and building their nest in the trees are in my house. It's so funny to hear them singing and being happy. I'm this being able to hug my grandson. Who's nine years old? I have five grandchildren. But he's the youngest and I just miss the closeness you know being able to hug somebody and have somebody hug me and which I always do with my family. We're hooker so I miss that. Yeah my advice to other people that are in. My position is to keep busy with your mind. Do something what something pleasant read a book. That's interesting and Try to stay. Positive is the main thing and I think you know position has to think like that has to be positive otherwise they may as well. It's just you know curl up and die because it's People have died from depression. Just being sad. So you just gotTa keep thinking positively that this will end. Hopefully I just hope it all does and yet right now. We cannot be overwhelmed. We have to work to keep our loved one safe protect our communities. We have to work to stay strong. Stay connected to stay focused. We have to work to inspire to innovate to build new solutions. For All of this to work we have to work together at Ziprecruiter. We connect employers in people every day Today's different we're partnering with. First Responders government officials the medical community the innovators the manufacturing transportation food distribution industries to make sure. We're finding the right people for the right jobs right now. Let's work together. Ziprecruiter DOT com slash work together. Hey It's Swisher you may know me as the only person who looks cool wearing sunglasses indoors but in my spare time. I host a podcast called Rico decode every week. We talk about power. Change THE PEOPLE. You need to know around tech. And beyond some of my recent guests include Edward Snowden Megan repea- no and the cast of the l word which was a huge thrill for me. If any of these sound interesting to you should listen to them now on Rico. Decode subscribe to the show for free on apple. Podcast or your favorite podcast APP to be the first to hear new interviews every week. Ooh Ooh Ezra we heard from Dorothy. Who's learning Italian Dueling? Go and getting the hang a facetime. Keeping her mind. Busy is on us to figure out for ourselves or is there something like I don't know the government could do to help or what to be fair. It is a hard thing for the government to do anything about. This isn't one where you can easily imagine a policy that will solve it. We are right now in attention between our public health policy of social distancing and trying to keep the economy going one of the ways I've been trying to think about it and I saw this going around on twitter is I wish we had message this as physical distance and social connection. We need to be more physically distant from each other but the same time we need to be doing more not less to reach out. We need to be calling the people in our lives who are vulnerable. We need to be setting up ways to call the people who don't have people in their lives to call them as some doctors mentioned to me when I was working on this piece. By definition the people who are most at risk are the people who are not going to have a social network. That activates in this moment. They're the ones who don't have kids. We're GONNA make sure to call them every day or twice a day. I've really up to the amount. I'm face timing my son in with his grandparents. My parents but a lot of people don't have that. So what are we doing for them? That is something where I guess in theory the public sector but also civil society could activate right. That's a good APP. People work on by the way. That's another thing that there's going to be a digital divide among seniors here. I was talking to some seniors. Who are having real loneliness and isolation issues already from Corona virus but seniors. I'm talking to other people to get in touch with vox right. And they were saying that a great thing for them as they learned in recent years or at some point in the past how to use computers how to connect digitally how to use skype but older Americans the ones who are least likely to be heavily online and so for a lot of folks who haven't built a comfort and a confidence or even haven't bought the hardware. Let you have these kinds of digital connections a lot of the ways? The rest of us are trying to manage this era. Social distancing are not there for them. They can't easily join zoom with all of their friends because they don't know how so even helping older people in your life set up and become comfortable with the digital solutions. Here that are a partial replacement for impressing connection that can be really useful but beyond all the zooms in the face times and the House Party APPS or whatever at issue here especially with the elderly is that they may not have a social network to begin with right. You're saying we need a totally new solution or APP or something that could connect people who are free and willing to talk with those who are desperate for connection right like. I don't know maybe like a chat roulette but without all the pervious. That's a good. I like chat roulette without La Chat Roulette but for helping older combat loneliness. Does that APP exist or do we need to make that up? I think that is a good idea. Anybody's out there. Wants to make it and hopefully somebody is but I want to say that. One of the ways. Colonel Virus is an unbelievable asshole of disease visit in addition to the direct death and sickness. It is causing it is causing tremendous economic and social disruption it is rending the very fabric of our lives and something that. I'm trying to add to the list of just what we are thinking about. Is the possibility if some of the more grim cases are corrected. We are social distancing in in pretty significant ways. Let's say through the end of the year. What are we going to do to connect people but you know I spoke earlier about how you've been face timing more with your parents so they can see your son their grandchild and like I got to say as a pathological keeper in touch. I've been pleasantly surprised to see friends who've never called me or facetime me calling and face timing now and I just use that. House party APP last week for the first time and it was uttering total chaos. But I appreciated that. A buddy organized. I don't know if we have any like actual data yet. But is there a chance that this you know cross continental corentin changes the way we communicate with our loved ones? I mean fewer means and links and photos and maybe deeper conversation about how we're really doing and how we're feeling I do think so and I also think it's going to go in all different directions for people adult different times so I want to know two things that are little subtle here. I spent some time with Vivek Murthy. We did a great episode on on my podcast. Actually about loneliness in something that is in his book and in in other work is idea that when people are lonely they are touchier. They experience more things as a slight right. They weren't called. They'RE GONNA BE SCARED. They're going to be anxious. Are going to be angry right. They're going to need somebody to talk to. They'll be freaking out about something. And then you call and other ranting at you and you just called to have a nice conversation and then on the other hand they're going to be people and I've definitely felt this myself. I'm in a house with A. I'm here with my wife and my wonderful but totally nuts one year old son and two dogs who are cooped up and not getting enough exercise and I'm not always the best version of myself either and so as much as I want to be out there connecting and trying to be a good Samaritan on all this. Sometimes I'll call somebody and I don't get the reaction I'm hoping for and I don't have some of the motion bandwidth deal with it and so I'm finding it really important to be mindful. That good intentions aren't enough. You also have just have to recognize is going to be hard for everybody and we're GONNA have to be really generous with each other and try to find the times when their space. You need to create space to do this kind of reaching out actually setting aside an hour a day like pig pen depressed. I and they'd be a good place to talk to. People is difficult but in the same way as everything else in this crisis if we have the bandwidth for aid is something that we have to do in a pro social way. It's a way we can come together and show solidarity. We don't just need social distancing a very deep way we need commitment to solidarity social solidarity as thank you so much. Maybe we can have you back to talk about this once. Someone makes chat roulette without the pervious wants to do that. I'm not gonNA come back because I'm to be on chat so much having great socially connecting conversations Ditto as reclines aforementioned. Podcast is the Ezra Klein. Show I'm Sean Ramos Forum. This is explained. The team is working remotely in Maryland. Virginia and Washington D. C. But we still make time to check in every morning via zoom. A theme Shapiro has big hair. I'm not Assadi has noisy neighbors. Jillian Weinberger has a spare room. Bridget McCarthy has Dan Charles no Hassenfeld as always wearing headphones and Halima. Shah is clearly a cat person. Liz Nelson joins US once a week and Desmond joins her about once a month so far. But these always welcome. Cecilia lays checking our facts from San Francisco. The mysterious brake Master Cylinder Makes Music From Outer Space. I'm guessing we extra help this week. From Paul Mounsey. Jon Lord did us a few solids to today. Explained part of the box media podcast network That was the loneliness pandemic now on a move to the next episode here which is very very aptly titled All praise no pay this Khurana. Virus pandemic has changed who we call. Heroes it's not just doctors and nurses and emt workers anymore now. It's our delivery. People are food service. Employees are public transit workers. These people who have always been essential are finally being recognized as such Liz. Warren has a plan for them. Vice President Pence is hailing their service to the country. Tom Hanks is shouting them out on Saturday. Night live but a lot of them are suffering now more than ever take terrence wise. He's a manager at a McDonald's in Kansas City Missouri and has been advocating for fast food workers since well before this crisis with fight for fifteen. It's an effort to raise the minimum wage and unionized. Fast food restaurants you know before the corona virus pandemic me and my fiance whose full Tom home healthcare worker will mean my fiance. My three little girls. We were homeless. You know it was US five. Living in the basement of my sister-in-law's house and she's got six in our household. So you know. We had eleven and a three bedroom one bath house. So you know we're supposed to practice social distancing and all of that but we had eleven people under one roof and you know right after that you know. The school started closing not only here in Kansas City but across the country. So it's been a struggle you know childcare for the girls and now you gotta feed them three times a day because schools close and then you know going into the workplace since the Corona Virus pan-demic. I think the number one thing and it's been impact and not only fast food workers but everyone has been the mental aspect of it. You know being afraid on edge. I've been a full-time worker my whole life. I'm forty years old. We've never seen anything like this so to just go to work with the fear of going to work in and something going wrong is one thing and I'm normally a full-time worker. A manager forty hours a week and for the past three weeks. I've been only getting twenty eight hours a week. You know so not only if I've been impacted mentally but the financial challenges today in coming forward going into the future is going to be some trying times you know. Did you have benefits when you're at forty hours? No benefits no health care. No dental no paid sick leave vacation time. No benefits whatsoever even fulltime worker and a manager. You know so. The difference between going from forty to twenty eight is mostly that you're just making X. amount less money. It's been like that across the Board. Not only in my shop but across the board like. I'm down to twenty eight hours a week. Some workers have been taken off the schedule all together and that because businesses slowing down we normally do about nine thousand dollars a day at my shop and recently we are saying about seven thousand five hundred a day so cells are down about twenty percent and when I tried to explain to folks yes cells are down but we have a Labor targeted. Mcdonald's as well we're supposed to do twenty one percent Labor every day which is twenty one percent of the sales and for the past three weeks. We've been doing seventeen eighteen percent. We have fewer workers on the schedule. And we're supposed to practice social distancing so we have five workers on each shift. It all turned. But it's still impossible to practice social distancing and the McDonalds environment keep six feet from each other and customers so that plans not been working. But what fewer workers even though the sales have been lower. We've still been busy. And what it actually means is running seventeen and eighteen percent labor is. We should have two to three more workers to handle the traffic that we we have come in through so even though our hours are down. Sales are down. We're still making profit and the few workers that we have the it's really weighing on them because they're working harder now. Tell me what if anything. Mcdonald's is doing to keep you guys safe right now their responses just to simplify. It's been weak. You know we've been organizing not only here in Kansas City but across the country to fight and win protections that we should already have. We've been fighting for protective equipment mask and gloves that have been non-existence Sneeze Guard you know. We've been fighting for hazard pay of at least three dollars. We've been fighting for the ability to get paid sick. Leave if we get sick you know recently. I've been sick. Tried to call into work and was pressured by my manager to come to work. So we've been fighting for all these protections and McDonald's you know been lacking in their response. We were on a call just last week with a shareholders analysts you know with McDonald's and a fight for fifteen workers across the country. Some in California were on the call as well and you know we laid our demands out for the hazard pay for protective quip man and the paid sick leave if one. We're sick the ability to get tested and the day after we aired out these grievances. I came to work and we had mask for the first time. This was like two days ago. Hey so you know that we saw that as a victory and then I looked at the other side like. That's that's not right. We have to fight and demand the ability to be protected as anyone around you your colleagues. Your Co workers. Family members gotten sick out. Color reminds in a group session. Like therapy where she meets with a group of folks weekly and she attended the session and they alerted her and let her know that you know you were in contact with someone who has covert nineteen and she had worked shift after this exposure. I worked with her. I actually took her home that night. When we got off and She of course the next day lifted job no. She called McDonald's and told them and they told her that she needs to stay away from work for fourteen days. They didn't offer her to get tested. They didn't offer me to get tested. They didn't do a thorough cleaning of our store any of that they just told her to stay away from fourteen days and she can come back and she has an apartment she has a life so that's fourteen days of no work was she won't be paid and I can tell you for a few days after that. Not only was I on edge. I know everyone in the shop. Was you know we were around someone who was expelled in? We had no idea what the what the outcome of that situation would be. If you had to give McDonalds. A grade like between one and ten. How they're protecting you and making you feel safe right now. What would you give him? I would give them a zero damn. We would have to go below the skill being a part of the five fifteen and a union movement. You know the the need for paid sick. Leave in protections. It's really been highlighted by the Ron Virus. Ten damage but we've been fighting for these protections for seven years now and McDonalds. You know this is not a mom and pop shop. This is a global brand a dollar corporation and they have a greater responsibility not only to the customers. We serve but the workers and their response and whole. It's been weak. Now we know they. They've announced that they're gonNA give five percent of their stores. Two WEEKS OF PAID SICK. Leave if you test positive for the corona virus and then that's verified. Now they're not offering the tests. You gotta go get it done. You got to be tested then. Test Positive to get two weeks of paid leave. And it's only for five percent of their corporate stores and not only that they've been busy in Congress lobbying against worker protections so McDonalds has been busy doing all the wrong things in their response to ensure that the workers are safe in the public. Assay has been lacking. You know. It's fine to think of McDonald's as as unable to fulfill the needs of its workers because it is such a huge corporation but obviously the government is stepping up and stepping in here to protect American workers. Everyone's getting a check in the mail. Do you feel like where. Mcdonald's is slipping the government has your back no and when you think about it. The proposed package and and every little bit helps. Let's let's be clear. Workers need every bit that they can get. But when you're talking about a thousand dollar stimulus let's just say that my mortgage before I was homeless was twelve hundred dollars a month. That's not counting food. Gas in the car is to get the word basic necessities so you talked about a stimulus package of a thousand. That's like putting a band aid on a gash was my life look like in workers. Life look like one month from now to three months down the road. So we're going to need a lot more than just a one time band aid. You know to help fix. Not only what's going on in workers lives but to help them and Mcdonald's you know in doesn't have to wait on legislation you know. The government does subsidize their workers with food stamps or assistance. They can make changes now but not enough is being done by corporations. Our elected leaders to make life easier for what we call a central workers. You hear me sure I mean you see sort of off. Labor actions being organized in different places across the country. Fast Food Workers in California Amazon staff in New York. I know you're no stranger to Labor Action Yourself. Do you think there's a chance here for essential workers like you across the country to do something big? We know in the Labor movement. It's not about a how big get Scott to get bigger because we know folks with power. Don't give it up willingly and we know as workers that when you look back even as the history of our country not only do we have the bloodiest labor history out of any country on the globe but when you look back at our history of our country nothing it's been one or gain in this country without mass movement and organization when you talk about women's rights civil rights the ability to vote all of those things where one through a movement you know of. Working Class folks coming together and taking action and going on strike is one of the most important tools in our toolbox. Someone died to give me the right to be out here today to stand up and fight so we we got cloth that were cut from the working class. And we're happy to live tradition and we look forward to escalating net as well terrence wise managers at McDonald's in Kansas City Missouri. Where he says he's gone on strike a dozen times and he might soon make bakers. We reached out to McDonald's to ask about Terence's zero rating on a scale of one to ten a spokesperson robak overall. This feedback does not represent the feedback. We are hearing from the majority of employees across the country and that McDonald's is implementing wellness checks providing masks where they're needed most and adding protective barriers among other measures. They said they had the health and wellbeing restaurant employees top of mind more than a minute on today explained this advertiser content as a journalist. I'm part of the problem. We reduce people to one minute. Fourteen news packages. I've done it. I've done it myself about my people. Newsrooms are tasked with covering the whole world but they don't represent it more than three quarters of all newsroom employees in the US are white and three out of five of them are men. This has an impact. That voice you heard is known for her diet. She's a journalist a thirty something. Millennia woman of color and a Muslim now for is the host of course correction a podcast from Doha debates and Cutter Foundation. It seeks to include the voices. We're not hearing in the conversations we're all having around important global issues and I was fifteen years old and I was watching the news and documentaries. It was like this big told white man who's telling me what the Brown people think. Right and I'm the Brown. People would be presented to us as fact so the cost correction. Podcast is basically my attempt at trying to change things. A Classic Journalism Trope is the view from nowhere. A single journalist certain of their impartiality presenting information as fact. But there's always view from somewhere to Nella for that personal. Experience is a feature not a bug. We all come with a set of bias sees. It's about taking personal responsibility. Not just an individual not just as mean Nella for a person but as a journalist to report accurately and truthfully be a part of the conversation for Change listened of course corruption. Wherever you get your podcasts. Hey I have been grateful overtime. That many of you have asked how you can support the show. Hey can support box then. We've never asked for that. But we are now and we are because of Corona virus right now. Our work has never had more meaning more importance. It feels really clear what we are here to do. And what we need to do but at the same time. The advertising industry is collapsing. And even where? It's not advertisers. They don't WanNa be next shows or articles about a pandemic flu. That's another brand association. People want so the same moment that the work becomes most important. Our ability to resource it is weakening. We're okay but in order to make sure that we can continue giving this work the resources and focus. We think it deserves on this show and elsewhere. We are trying to build new ways of funding. It and so this week we're launching a contribution effort at vox dot com slash give your contribution will help. Fox keep making podcasts. People need to understand and navigate the current of crisis at a volume that matches what it actually requires physically show. Of course it's part of oxes part of this effort and your contribution will help support us on the show to keep doing the work we're doing which hopefully is bringing some value to you. You can contribute by going to vox dot com slash give. Contributions to box are not tax deductible. Thank you for listening and thank you for helping to support our work. All right. We're back. We left off with tarrant saying he's looking forward to an escalation of the strikes. We're seeing in places like California New York with workers across industries demanding. Better pay an protections. I asked Professor Jamea Michener. If there's a chance. Labor groups could get together and Organiz for better conditions across industries. She's a professor at Cornell who focuses on how policy affects low income people. Well I think if there's potential it's here now because the depth of grievances and the fact that people are literally putting their lives at risk to provide essential services creates a kind of context that we couldn't have imagined or predicted but is also a bit of a tinderbox that is kind of right context for people to respond in maybe ways. We wouldn't have expected and that are unprecedented. And there's a name for this type of labor action right. It's a general strike. What exactly is that? So a general strike is a strike. That's not limited to a specific trade or occupation or employer so it's not like GM workers striking or McDonald's workers striking. It's really when the strike transcends. Those individual companies are individual occupations and its workers on a broader level uniting to fight for a kind of similar set of demands and. When was the last time the United States saw something like that? You know I don't know that there's complete agreement on that but there was a general strike in Oakland in one thousand nine hundred forty six might think about as the last time but not many people know about it. I think that the seminal example of this that really looms largest in everyone's mind historically is the general strike of Nineteen nineteen. It was the kind of first general strike of the twentieth century and the biggest and most impactful one pretty much a century ago. Interestingly is like the last time we had a wide scale global pandemic was as I think nineteen eighteen with the Spanish flu right exactly so this was in the wake of that and also you know following the end of the first World War and so people had been sacrificing during the war. They had been dealing with frozen wages and been told that they were doing that. For the sake of the country and for the sake of democracy and things like that and and then when the war ended the wages they'd frozen and so after years of sacrifice and after suffering through a pandemic people had had enough and we saw kind of massive strike and it was across industries that started with a shipyard workers but it went beyond them and workers all over the city of Seattle coordinated and shut down the city for for six entire days so it was pretty unprecedented and we haven't seen anything of that scale since then honestly did workers get what they were asking for it. Did they get better wages? Did they get better benefits treatment? They did not so in concrete sense. The strike was not successful. There was a lot of push-back. This was also just a few years. After the Bolshevik revolution in Russia so everyone was super afraid of communism and this was viewed as kind of a potential harbinger of communism and so there was a lot of pushback in the officials who were charged with negotiating in particular with the shipyard workers who had a gun that strike. They didn't capitulate and they didn't provide wage increases or do many of the different things that the workers were asking for so by concrete metrics. This was a failure but I think by a broader metric which was the long term impact that it had it was very much success. There were strikes that followed on this pretty major strikes in San Francisco in one thousand nine hundred eighty four. San Francisco's ever smoldering labor. War breaks out a new with uniform. Union members parading protests against their employer. This strike stands is kind of example of possibilities in the US where after general strike organized labor on the code where not only active. What but we're going to attack a long-term effect in terms of how it shaped the Labor movement and the possibilities for Labor in the United States. But it didn't result in concrete gains for the people who actually participated in the strike so they just ended up going back to work they and then some of the kind of the salient people who were involved at that time were actually arrested and they were charged with you know being communist and things like that but I think that this shows that that was a political context where the risk was huge and people still did this right. They still took that step so it tells us a lot about the possibilities I think. And what about the risk and possibilities now you know one hundred years later you've got vice president pence praising food workers and calling them vital and saying they need to step up feeding America? Meanwhile people like Taranto saying they want a strike to demand better conditions during this pandemic. But it's Kinda hard to strike when you're not supposed to God cider near other people. I do think it makes it hard. You know something that happened in the nineteen nineteen strike was a really sophisticated and high level of coordination. People work together. They made sure that basic needs were still met during the strike and that's just required to a certain extent being around each other and we can't do that right now at the same time a lot of the workers that we're talking about our workers whose jobs were mediated through technology anyway so they're used to engaging the world in ways other than being physically proximate are physically close to someone so while. I think that the pandemic makes it hard. In the sense of physical distance there are possibilities that remain regardless of that. I think a higher bar as far as difficulty is just how difficult it is to look beyond your own material needs right now your health your wellness. That of your family's food on the table rent being paid and when people are thinking about those needs. It's harder for them to kind of coordinate and work with others and organize at the same time. Those very needs can be a motivation to do more than you may have done before. Because you're desperate times in is we have pain. I saw this Walmart commercials. Weekend with Bill Withers Lean on me playing and and the messages like salute your Walmart. Heroes and I was like is Walmart saluting. It's Walmart giving people. How much did they pay to license? Bill withers lean on me. Could they have distributed that money to their workers at giving them some some some solace some financial safety net? In this moment. I mean it seems like workers have America's attention right now. Is there something they can do? If general strike is out of reach what can they do instead? What workers can do is really build on that? Maybe not in of a general strike. But in terms of the kind of level of connection organizing. That's happening among themselves. You know my nephew works at an Amazon warehouse in Queens. Actually because a few people there came down with the virus and there was lots going on and when I talked to him about these things. He's super aware of the strikes and of the discussion around striking. And he's not someone who's very political and who thinks these things outside of this context in normal life so the fact that workers are recognizing not just that the public is recognizing their important but they're recognizing their own importance that they're recognizing that in order for Americans to be able to live the lives that they wanna live. They need people packing their Amazon boxes and delivering their food and etc that self recognition of their importance I think is the first step towards continuing to build beyond this pandemic. So there's the question of do we think a strike can happen right now during all of this and I think that's that's a high calling and one that is probably not quite possible but then there's another question of do. We think that some foundation can be laid now in terms of altering the way that worker see themselves and altering the way that the public sees workers so that a year from now or two years from now after some work has been done some organizing his happen we might see something closer to a general strike. I think if we stretch the time horizon that way than than there is much more that it's possible. Is it too late though? Is it too late in two years when people have maybe even forgotten how grateful they were to their grocery store workers back in pandemic and in the spring of Twenty twenty? It may be. I mean if there if there's a real possibility now I wouldn't say way right but if it doesn't look like things are going to move in that direction now I. I don't know that I would say that. The moment will have passed two years from now. We're looking at a long road of economic struggle ahead of us and that doesn't go away even when the most intense part of this pandemic Wayne's and I think people are going to continue to have deep needs. I think people are going to continue to recognize you know that. They're not getting a lot from their employers that they're very insecure economically that their families are not cared for in the way that they should be given. How much work they're doing. And these issues are going to continue to like percolate and be a part of the public conversation whether or not it will be too late. Two years from now is going to depend on what happens between now and then you know. The strike in Seattle. Didn't bubble up just out of nowhere. There were people on the ground working for years beforehand to make something like that possible to connect different unions to each other to connect workers to each other who previously didn't understand their fates as linked. I think if this moment can spark that kind of activity then two years from now might exactly when those things have built up to the point that the capacity is there to really organize people to push back. Jamea Michener is a professor in the government department over Cornell University in Ithaca New York. She's got a book. It's called Fragmented Democracy Medicaid federalism and unequal politics. Maybe see if there's a way to find your local bookstore and tell your essential workers how much you appreciate them. And you know maybe ask if they're accepting tips if you can afford it in the immortal words of Kanye West if you admire somebody you should go ahead and tell them. People never get the flowers while they can still smell them. I'm Sean Ramos Forum. This is today explained art. That is the show for today. We will be back on Thursday with a whole new interview if you like what you heard. Please subscribe today. Explained as I do wherever you get your podcast. Thank you of course to. The today explained team flooding is user episode today to Karma for Researching Jesse Gulf producing the VOX media podcast production.

McDonald social isolation US Kansas City Sean Ramos Mcdonald Fast Food Workers McDonalds California twitter San Francisco Terence Vivek Murthy Dorothy Shelly Amazon Seattle Walmart Labor movement
Red light, green card

Today, Explained

19:19 min | 2 years ago

Red light, green card

"I've been promoting the website get quick dot com slash explain on this podcast for a while now. But one thing we've never discussed his how fast you can actually buy quip electric toothbrush at get quip dot com. Slash explained. We're gonna figure that out today. Everyone knows how President Trump feels about illegal immigration, but he's not crazy about the legal kind either on Saturday, the Trump administration proposed new ways to limit who gets a green card in the United States. The limits are on immigrants who might become what's called a public charge. Someone who might end up to pendant on the government for assistance, stuff like food stamps or Medicaid public charge is a term you'll find in US immigration law. But the thing is it's never really been defined by congress, and that's where the Trump administration comes in. So the Trump administration is now proposing a statutory definition of public charge. That just happens to raise the raise the standards of stanchly for who can get into the US and makes it much more likely that immigrants with lower incomes or he used public benefits will be deemed public charges and have their green cards tonight. Dare Lynn reports on degration vox and she's been sifting through all this public charge business for a few days. Now it's an extremely complicated calculation. The regulation was about four hundred forty seven pages when it came out on Saturday night, what it ultimately comes down to a lot of discretion for the US citizenship and immigration services officers who are actually looking for immigrants application, they're supposed to take age into effect, health status, family status education skill level, and they're supposed to look at kind of the household assets and resources. Part of which is whether. An immigrant has used public benefits while in the US or whether they're likely to use them in the future. Do we have any idea what might get you rejected and what might not like where where the bar is what the clearest thing in terms of rejection is that if you have used public benefits substantially over the years before you apply that is a strongly weighted negative factor, it's super unlikely that if you've hit that level, you will be able to get a green card that whether or not you've used public benefits to that level is its own kind of calculus. They actually have this this three way formula that you can trip that bar. It counts what they call monetize -able benefits, which include food stamps, section, eight housing. Some other less common cash benefits and non monetize will benefits most most notably Medicaid. So using more than a certain threshold of the monetize will benefits or non monetize -able benefits for certain amount of time. Either of those can kind of trip the wire and get you considered likely to public in future. So does doesn't affect people who already have green cards. The short answer is yes, like with very, very few exceptions. This is a test for what's called admissibility. It's not something that counts for maintaining your status, and it's not something that you have to pass again after you've already been given a green card. So we're talking about people who are legally in the country with visa who are trying to get a green card. Right? And also people who are living outside the US and are trying to immigrate. You know, for example, a parent who's adult child is in the US and is trying to bring them over. They won't necessarily have the kind of record of using benefits, but they'll be subject to the other parts of the test, like whether they're healthy or if they're not healthy, they have private insurance. Are they old enough that you know they're going to be a concern for retirement, benefits, that kind of thing? Do we have any idea. How many people were talking about here, thousands, tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands millions, not millions. There are definitely going to be millions of immigrants who are subjected to this test in future. We don't know what the approval rate is going to be because we don't know how strictly this is going to be implemented. The Trump administration says that about a third of a million people each year will be evaluated based on this test. They're not making any predictions about how strict it's going to be by super, super, super strict interpretation. One that says that if you don't have the strongly positive factor of making a certain amount of like two fifty percent, two hundred fifty percent of the federal poverty guidelines. If no one below that threshold is being accepted, we're talking about a massive reshaping of legal immigration, specifically family based immigration to the US that would affect like two thirds of incoming Mexican immigrants about two-thirds of incoming Chinese immigrants. I mean, it would be huge if it were that restrictive, it's probably not going to be that restrictive as a question of on a spectrum from there. There to the standards where they are now wear is the new line, get drawn to other countries, do stuff like this? Do they go like, oh, you wanna be says in here, you want to join the team. What are you using? What do you need? Well, maybe we don't want you so much. A lot of countries do some kind of assessment of labour-market. Fitness education is definitely considered a lot of places. This is really a variation on that in. There are also different levels of how opened the welfare state is to immigrants. And frankly, this isn't the first time we've developed something like this. Either the concept of public charge is there in the immigration law and as saying, we already do restrict benefits used to some people. So it's the kind of question of how open is your country versus your welfare state is a question that a lot of countries that have safety nets have had to deal with. It's much more that this is turning something that's kind of become just of lake. It's vestige in the immigration law right now. It's just extremely unlikely for it to actually get you. Used into something that would really be a central consideration and a green card application. Might there be any unintended consequences of sort of resurfacing this vestigial rule. I don't know if you can call them unintended consequences. If the administration is already aware that the existing acknowledges them. Part of the four hundred and forty seven pages of this regulation are the administration trying to calculate, but we call the chilling effect. The impact on people who aren't covered by the rule or who are looking at their US citizen children who are supposed to be eligible for all of these benefits because they're US citizens and are going well, I know that there's going to be some problem if you use public services. So I'm not gonna use public services. There's already evidence of a drop off in food stamps and income assistance us from immigrant families, including green card holders who wouldn't be subject to the rule and unauthorized immigrants who are worried about, you know, getting benefits for their citizenship children. It's really hard to communicate to an affected community who's already really worried about the Trump administration often worried about getting deported exact details of if you're in this subgroup of this other group, it's okay for you. These benefits. It's also hard to communicate note just because there's rule has been. Proposed, even if it is covering you, it wouldn't be a problem until it goes into effect. There's there's no penalty for people using benefits before the date of the final rule is effective. So there there would be no reason for people to drop off the rolls now, but that's exactly what you know. Some service providers are seeing, and it's really hard to get over that fear. Coming up. The Trump administration might be the first to really try and nail down what exactly a public charge is, but it's not the first try and use the concept to keep immigrants out of the United States. This is today explained. Hi Sean, a, you're care vox media, and you help people with their with their with their computer stuff. So you're always walking around with a computer. Is that fair? Yes, that is fair. And I was thinking you told me on the on the computer on the slack that that you wanted to buy. Quip electric, toothbrush idea. So as fun as an experiment, we try to save. You could buy electric, toothbrush, get quip dot com in a minute, because that's how log this ad is. Sounds good. Great for audio. Should we try? Yeah, let's give it out. Okay, so I see a brush better sign right here. Your free ten dollar refill credit will be automated applied on the final page of checkout. Amazing. I think of saying five dollars, ten dollars, ten dollars, even better. Well. All right. Okay. So I have an option to shop, so I think I'm going to click the shop button. Okay, that sounds smart. There are few options here. We got starter sets prepay deals. I think this is where I got a little slow down. Yes, I have bad news. I. I think that's been about a bit. As he will try again tomorrow. I'm so glad I was going through this with, you know. Dan, you mentioned that this public charge concept goes back a ways. How far back eat goes back to eighteen eighty two, which for immigration laws super far bat giving. Yeah, that's that's the period where you know you could get excluded from the US if you were Chinese. So in addition to being Chinese or being a lunatic or a bunch of other terms that really it's their questions about how they would have been defined. The idea that view would deny entry to somebody who looked like they would be a public charge, became a matter of federal law there. And that's kind of during the Ellis Island era where a lot of people who are getting denied are literally coming up to the seaport. And then getting told, no, you cannot enter the US. You're gonna have to find your own way home or we'll just keep you on at the hospital on silent for while a different era. Yeah. So how is it defined back then? The idea of public charge it was. It was not defined in the law. So ended up kind of interpretation that at the time immigration and Naturalization Service officers used was you had to have twenty five dollars cash money on you. When you enter the country, if you didn't have twenty five dollars, they would not be confident that you could find a place to stay. You know, find friends pertain to wherever you were hoping to get a job or start a form set or whatever that I don't know what that looks like for inflation, but twenty five dollars for people who are often coming from relatively impoverished countries, not insubstantial amount of money at the time. And that meant that a lot of people who were getting rejected, we're getting rejected on those grounds between eighteen ninety and nineteen twenty had a majority of people who are getting turned away. We're getting turned away on the likelihood that they would be public charges. So when does that start to change? So it starts to change around the middle of the twentieth century when a lot of attitudes toward immigration kind of start to relax some. And then in the second half of the twentieth century, you have decisions with envy 'immigration bureaucracy that it's kind of unfair to put somebody on a certain threshold of like, if you can't meet this bar, then we're going to call you a public charge. It should be a totality of the circumstances test, and that's kind of the origins of where you now have this very complicated, multi factor test. The administration has proposed not it's supposed to be the way of an individual's situation looking at their, you know, earning potential or their history trying to predict whether they're going to be using benefits future those codified in nineteen Ninety-six in the law that's called ira- ira-, which did a lot to kind of restrict immigration and immigrants privileges in the United States. This administration has taken. Strong stand to stiffen the protection of our borders. And so that codified that factors should be age, family status, education, financial status and health status. Were there any immediate attempts right after that then to use the sort of idea of the public charge as a way to limit legal immigration? Yeah. In the wake of the nineteen Ninety-six law, there started being reports that anyone who had used public benefits of any kind was getting their application denied for that reason, which is kind of the opposite of what you're trying to do with this five factor test. Right? So as a response to that, the Clinton administration put out this interim memo basically to the officers that were looking through locations saying when you're looking at whether someone is dependent on public benefits, it should be, are they getting cash benefits and are those half or more of their income? Like that's the bar for whether you're dependent is it literally has to be a majority of the money coming in that never got finalized as a regular. And they kind of fainted toward doing that, but they never really followed up and then through the Bush administration's, they just kept relying on that field guidance to set the bar for policy, which created the opportunity for Trump when they came in and said, well, we think this is entirely too lenient to immigrants. There are lots of public benefits that they could be using that aren't getting counted here. They had the opportunity to codify something that hadn't been codified before and change policy that way. How does that fit into the larger picture of how the Trump administration is sort of limiting legal immigration right now, the Trump administration has stated pretty clearly that they don't particularly feel the need to be letting in a lot of family based immigrants lot of people who are, you know, relatively lower skilled or lower educated and who are going to be coming in permanently. The think that a lot of that is legislative in it is the congress has a lot more power to set legal immigration levels than it does say thorny over the enforcement of unauthorized immigration, but there still procedural things that the Trump administration can do. And it's been doing a lot of those through US immigration services. They have instituted new policies of if you're -application is rejected. And that means that you're in the US without status, they will automatically refer your case Thais, meaning you could be arrested deported. They have restricted the use of. Of kind of follow up questions for evidence saying, we'll just deny it instead between the kind of slowing down some of the process which has also resulted in total bottleneck for refugee applications. A lot of the reason that the Trump administration resettled about half of the refugees that it said it was going to resettle last year is because there's this massive security bottle met with all of the extra vetting that they've proposed the line between where is there a slowdown in the process and where you just trying to reduce overall numbers is not super clear, and a lot of advocates and lawyers are worried that they're using slowdowns as a way to kind of just get fewer people coming in. Is there a lot of support in the country for just limiting people who might need to come in here who immediately will need benefits who immediately will rely on the government for support. There are definitely a lot of people who are concerned about, you know, immigrants using welfare, but I don't see a lot of people say, we understand that people can't use public benefits for five years after they get a green card, and we understand that unauthorized immigrants can't get benefits at all, but we still think that it's important to adjudicate based on this. Right. A lot of tends to be based in the idea that people are coming here for the purpose of getting welfare, which if you know it's, I'm not saying that it's implausible that people could do that, but they'd have to be playing the long game where they weren't getting any public support for five years, middle, any number of other countries you could go to and sooner get benefits. Right. And it's also, I mean, the US doesn't just have a like, you know, right? Your application essay. Tell us why you wanna come to the US. These are people who are coming to live with their families, or, you know, in some cases seeking asylum or refugee status through an acknowledged international process, although those aren't people who would be affected by this rule. But you know, when. You're looking at the noncitizens who actually use public benefits. It's people who are, you know, coming for other purposes and humane not have perfect fits with the labor market. But you know, the US immigration system is isn't just set up to deal with the US labor market. It's set up to deal with the US as a society that values things like family ties and humanitarian obligations. And you know the result of that is going to be that not everyone is going to generate tons and tons of income and never need to go on public assistance. Other other sort of vestige immigration rules policies at the Trump administration might try to, you know, resurface bring back to life in the next few months. I know a lot about this and I've been, I have not seen some of the stuff coming, but this particular regulation has kind of been in their sights for a while. This was something that was actually initially teased in a draft executive order that just never got signed in terms of stuff. That's this big. It's not necessarily clear that anything this big is coming down the pipeline, but the really are so many small ways that they can kind of tighten the system that it's hard to know exactly what could be coming next. Dare Lind is one of the hosts of the weeds podcast. Vox I'm Sean Ramos firm. This is today explained. While it remains to be seen whether or not you can buy quibble electric, toothbrush, get clipped dot com. Slash explained in a minute. You can certainly do it in more than a minute and many before you have quit starts at just twenty five dollars. And if you go to get quick dot com slash explained right now, you'll get your first refill pack free with your quick. Toothbrush. Again, that's GT Hugh IP dot com. Slash explained.

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Noise will be noise

Today, Explained

22:42 min | 11 months ago

Noise will be noise

"It was in two thousand fourteen when Carthage TALLEC are. I heard the sound. This low pitched wine e gene. He was living in this neighborhood and Arizona in Chandler Arizona. He'd moved there with his family and used to you decompress after work by taking long walks around the neighborhood at night and it was on one of these nights that he I noticed this low steady wine. Somewhere in the distance sounded like concept White And at first he brushed off. Thought you know maybe someone's pull up but then later night he heard it again and again and again and night after night after night. He was noticing it as he was going outside. Garden Gordon or grill that it was in his backyard and then worst yet he was trying to go to sleep one night when he noticed that there was that noise inside his house that was in his bedroom and it was keeping him up at night. I had a hard time falling asleep and then after falling asleep on three or four. Am It would get very loud. You would pick up. It sounded as he described it later. Like these tons of mosquitoes buzzing in your ear. Only they wouldn't stop them. He tried to move bedrooms. He started sleeping with earplugs when that didn't help you tight a towel around his head and night after night he would try. Try and fall asleep with its earplugs in his head bandaged and the sound just wouldn't stop. It looks like constant video editing and it was very upset. Carthage didn't know at this point where the noise was coming from. And so he's set out to figure out what was causing it and he would go out at night on what he called. These noise patrols I he set out by foot but when that didn't really work. He started to widen his circumference and I started expanding the perimeter driving in my car biking bike to figure out where the noises coming from and he would stop every so often to listen for the noise after eight weeks or so car. Thick finally traced the noise backed. What he thought was the source? It was this gray windowless building with all the charm of a shoebox and it belonged. He discovered to a company called Cyrus. One Cyrus one was a data center basically a column Barium for thousands of servers the servers that were hosting data to make it accessible for processing processing or access from just about anywhere in the world has discovered. The noise was being unfortunately not caused by something temporary. This wasn't just the noise of construction but the noise was the steady hum of chillers. These big essentially air conditioning units that had been installed installed on the buildings and were there in order to keep the servers cool servers sort of like people are most comfortable at around sixty to ninety degrees Fahrenheit and so these chillers ensured that these heat generating servers would stay cool enough as they worked. We hear a lot about storing data in the cloud. It's such a lovely elegant euphemism. This idea of data sort of existing in the ether but in fact it exists in places like Cyrus one in some ways. The sound of Cyrus One's datacenter this low so often the desert. That's the sound of US living a bus clicking of US searching for lyrics online shopping poking people on facebook liking instagram posts. That's our noise too so carthy began to try and take action to silence this noise. He's Carthage actually reached out directly to someone from Cyrus wanting called him very late at night when he was unable to sleep because of the noise. And this other man said that he was trying to sleep and Carthy told him that I am trying to fall asleep to dude. He took this issue to anyone. One he could think of his homeowners association the members of the city council the mayor the police. He sent them an email actually saying do not think I am imagining. Thinks here in Wisden. People's time he added that he'd taken his family with him in one of these noise patrols. I drove my entire family to the same spot and they the two could hear the noise. He was told there was nothing they could do. He was told it wasn't that big of a deal and to him. The noise just got worse. I Cyrus one kept building. They were expanding they added more buildings they bought more land. They added more chillers. There were Nice where at Carthage perfect just couldn't get to sleep whatsoever. He started wearing earplugs sometimes during the day when he drive home. It was always with this sense of dread of returning back. ACT The noise. He thought about installing new windows or planting trees to block the sound but in the end he decided that even though he lose money even though he'd have to move to through smaller house he was just going to have to sell his home. It was around three years after Carthage. Had I heard word That another neighbor of his began to hear this humming coming across the street from her house. Here over half a mile away on on walnut and Bluebird we walk outside our house. There's annoys then. There was another neighbor that noticed that there was this constant constant steady wind like what one person described as sort of like a constantly rubbing engine or the jet getting ready for take-off I would describe it as a blender blender on steroids but at a distant so it's like a just drills in your head almost like a mosquito in the past half years I can honestly say I've not slept a full night's asleep wave comes and goes to me. This sounds like someone is down my street in their car laying on their horn nonstop and finally one of Carthage neighbors who lived nearby but in a slightly different housing development began to post these flyers around the neighborhood asking if anyone else had been bothered authored by the wine. This is the lovely noise and we are right next to Dobson Park. We are in the middle of the neighborhood and you can hear it this morning and it felt strangely relief. I won't say good. I would use the word relieved. I was relieved that others are having the same issue and that we are are going to potentially come together to solution. Eventually with the added force of all these neighbors together they were able to get a sit down meeting through the city with Cyrus one. It's a sound that just won't go away allowed. How consuming a Chandler neighborhood? You can hear the hum of those fans if you're out playing at the park like these kids are tonight. The problem is so can the hundreds of neighbors that live across the the St Cyrus one actually did vowed that they were going to do something about this. They said they would spend around two million dollars to install noise abatement around the chillers essentially to wrap them in these blankets that were designed to muffle some of the sound so there is progress. That's being made on this. Although although there are neighbors that I spoke with who will tell you that. They don't think it's better yet. Cyrus one told the city they address the noise on twenty four of there chillers neighbors say it hasn't changed granted. The company is doing something but of course devilish thing about our noises once you notice Orissa and especially when you're irritated by it. It can be very very hard to unlearn here. There's research that shows that we actually start to listen for the noise. That irritates us that we train ourselves to pick it up even better than we did at the outset so while the low pitched wine plagued the specific specific neighborhood and Chandler Arizona. Noise isn't just a problem. That exists there all of us are affected by it in ways. I think most of us don't realize we're thinking about. I mean knows this violation that we can't control and to which because of our anatomy we cannot close ourselves off and research shows that the world is getting noisier. I think that noise tends to be this issue that we dismiss as this kind of minor issue for cranks go for the idle rich but in fact it's an incredibly widespread problem and one needs to be taken more seriously coming up the dangers and the weaponization of noise. I'm no I'm Hassenfeld. Filling in for Sean Rotherham. This is today explained Maybe you know what you're doing with stocks but I have a feeling that you don't which is why you should probably check out so-fi so fi is basically investing made easy. It's the first investing platform to offer stocks. Automated investing in Crypto. All in one tripped out and with so five bits. You can get a piece of your favorite brands stock with as little as a dollar. Here's how it works. I go to S-o-f-i dot com slash explained and create an account. Then either choose do it yourself or let Sophie's automated investing build you a portfolio again. You get started with as little as one dollar and and listeners. Who Fund their account at S-o-f-i Dot com slash explained will receive twenty five dollars in mystery stock? Just signing up mystery stock. Get your free mystery. Stock at S. O. F. DOT com slash explained so Lennon Corp CFL number six zero five four six one two to extort Ivanka busker the Atlantic. How big of a problem is noise? Exactly do people really care about it. They do and we should all care more about it nor is is a huge issue and really. It's always been an issue. I mean the earliest recorded noise complaint is four thousand years old. ooh It's from the epic of Gilgamesh. One of the gods were so irritated by the racket caused by humans that he he and the Council of God's decided to solve the problem by exterminating mankind. And there are a number of cases even since the beginning of the year here of people shooting each other killing each other in part because of noise and in case there's any doubt as to just how offensive of and harmful noise can be. I think it's worth noting that the US military and law enforcement have actually repeatedly relied on noise as as a weapon. They've used it to try and hurry up getting the dictator. Manuel Noriega to surrender by actually just pounding. His hideout with kiss troops have used it in Iraq I mean blasting the battlefield ahead of time. What kind of stuff guns and roses? ACC and they've used noise in the form of torture technique to the meow. Mix Jingle so we want to ask. That sounds miserable yum yum yum yum yum yum. Yeah like a technical goal definition of noise. What's what's the best way to think about it? There are various definitions of noise but noiselessly different from sound noise already that word word implies sound with the judgment right. Sound that is annoying sounded is disturbing and part of what makes noise such a difficult thing thing to fight is that it is subjective. I spoke with an acoustic expert. Described it to me as sound when you mow your lawn noise as is when your neighbor in those their lawn and music is when your neighbor. Mos- your lawn and I think what's tricky about noise as a kind of faux is that it doesn't leave a trace it vanishes when you go after. It's hard to measure it's hard to describe and again it's subjective. You know your music literally. Sometimes right. If you're living in an apartment with your neighbors blasting music is oftentimes minorities you know one also thing to keep in mind is. That noise isn't necessarily loud. I think a lot of us had this idea via that. Sound has to be at a really high volume to drive US crazy. And if you ever tried to sleep through like a dripping faucet you know that something can be very quiet and still drive you up the wall so it can be annoying for people. I is it actually bad. Is it bad for health or anything like that. Yeah well there's certain short-term effects of noise so in response to noise you know we release stress. Hormones are blood pressure goes up our heart rate rises houses and our body can respond to noise especially in night as low as around thirty three decibels which is around as loud as purring cat. Studies have shown that over long periods of time prolonged exposure to noise can lead to a higher risk of high blood pressure coronary heart disease. Heart Attacks Strokes Diabetes Dementia Depression. It can be very harmful to children. There was a landmark. Study that was done in the seventies that there were two classrooms in in a school in New York one of which was very close to the clatter of a subway track and they found that the reading level of that noisy classroom through was actually around a year behind that of students in a quieter classroom and that difference disappeared once they installed some noise. Abatement meant to reduce the sound. Is it mostly affecting people that live in. Cities is it affecting certain types of populations differently. Noise levels tend to be higher in poorer communities liberty's as well as neighborhoods that have higher populations of black Asian and Latino residents and in fact these researchers thought that their numbers numbers might actually underestimate the difference because people who are wealthier probably take soundproofing measures to even further protect themselves from any noise that may exist. I like you're paying a premium for silence when you pay more for housing or something or even quiet quiet as something. That's only accessible to people who work on lush corporate campuses or have the money to go to spas or silent yoga retreats or you name it to escape again. I think we often think about noise as being the kind of one percent problem. Something that people they complain about the leaf blowers their vacation homes but in fact noise can have an undue burden on people that don't the have the resources to protect themselves from it. There really is a concern. That silence and quiet is becoming a luxury. I imagine there are different laws in different places about this. Is there like a national law against noise. In any way the federal government briefly had an appetite for noise legislation relation in the seventies in nineteen. Seventy two the Nixon administration passed a federal statute designed to quiet the country but in in Nineteen ninety-one just nine years later. The Reagan administration withdrew funding for that. And so since then as one of these experts put it the Federal Government Overman has essentially been out of the noise business and the burden has fallen to local governments to really take charge on quieting their constituents so if the burden is falling to local communities what kind of regulations do they have. How do you even stop things like this? In general local noise codes tend to be either qualitative or quantitative qualitative basically prohibits any sort of noise. That is disturbing or unreasonably loud. But they don't go so far as to to define what constitutes disturbing or unreasonably loud. A quantitative noise code on the other hand will define in quantitative measurable terms terms what is disturbing or unreasonably loud. So New York City for example has a quantitative noise code. There are rules that say that a dog can't bark for more than ten contiguous minutes between seven. AM and ten PM. Believe that's what it says but between ten PM and seven. Am I believe a dog. I can only for five continuous minutes. Seriously that's a real thing. Yeah I mean if a dog is barking for three continuous minutes at two in the morning I think Jack. Luckily it's okay but there are noise. Researchers argue that even with these measurements we may not be measuring noise correctly. AH NOISE CODES TEND to not put as much weight on. Let's say very low frequency noise that can travel very far distances and be it can be felt low frequency noise. That's things like the rattled from sub Woofer or the thudding of a bus outside the things that you may feel right more than you can actually hear them. Yeah I remember when I lived in New York I lived with his restaurant and they would play music pretty late at night and when I went down to ask them to turn it down and it just wasn't that loud down there I mean I could feel it upstairs because of the base but down there it just seemed like it was at a normal volume right but I'm sure you were annoyed by it. I mean not to worry you but it probably wasn't good for you either. So with the Cyrus one example simple you said. They ended up wrapping the chillers to make the noise better. Even if you're not exactly sure if that ended up working but did they have to do that was it. Because of a noise always code violation. I know from speaking with a local police commander in Chandler. That there wasn't really appetite to issue a citation to Cyrus Fun. It wasn't something that at least at the time they fell had violated the noise code when the city issued the permits. They weren't required to consider her the noise footprint of Cyrus one nor did they. I think what was frustrating for the neighbors was that the police would common in sample the sound whereas they were living with it. What can be kind of tolerable during a brief visit? Something very different. When it's inescapable an so cyrus one hasn't to my knowledge technically violated some code or ordinance that the city has put in place and unless they are trying as they put it to be good? Neighbors are taking some efforts to try and quiet themselves. Okay just to be clear. It's really noisy out there. And the regulations that we do have aren't exactly doing too much. Do we just have to get used to a noisy world. I think it's important to appreciate the way that the nature of noises changing. It used to be that a lot of the noise was created by the human hand. You know we were ringing bells. We were driving carriages. We were crying as town. Criers a now when you look at the noise. That's being produced. I think one thing. That's kind of chilling is the way that it's become autonomous. Right machines are inexhaustible source of noise. You know their vocal chords don't tire. They don't need to take a break. They can just keep going and they can be amplified of course people who spend a lot of time in quiet. Talk about really being able to tune into yourself more to not be accosted with a this external activation all the time because we have become so surrounded by noise. I think a lot of us have responded by adding our own noise always to it. You know we insulate ourselves from outside noise by giving ourselves personal. We listen to podcasts. We listen into music and so I think in some ways that may not be helping the problem do want people to listen to the end of this podcast but I also think that in some ways we reacted defensively to noise by adding more noise right and I think it raises the question of if we took out art earphones if we had to listen to the sound of our cities of our environment where we hear bothered by it and if we are bothered by it let's do something about it. I wonder if people haven't turned US off already. Maybe we can use a couple of seconds of quiet gotTA RUIN IT Bianca. busker is a contributing writer for the Atlantic. She also writes books for most recent one is called Cork Dork and and it's all about one. Thanks for connecting us with Carthage Todd. I'm no I'm Hassenfeld filling in for Sean Ramos Forum. This is today explained.

Cyrus Carthage US Arizona Chandler New York Carthy Chandler Arizona Carthage Manuel Noriega Carthage Todd Wisden New York City Dobson Park Sean Rotherham Orissa Sean Ramos
Netflix has no chill

Today, Explained

41:11 min | 2 months ago

Netflix has no chill

"As, you may have heard on the show. I just took a week away from the show, and it was weird because I wasn't working for a week. All I could think about was rise dot com. It's this all in one system that makes online training easy to create an enjoyable to take in simple to manage and. Learners love it. Managers love it. It loves it and strangely I am in love with rise dot, com C., Y., you will love rise dot com by starting a free thirty day trial today at rise dot com slash today. explained. I'm Sean Ramos Firm. We've made who knows how many episodes about cove nineteen in quarantine, but we've had this big blind spot the entire time, not one mention of Tiger King or love is blind or extraction. We have not talked about net flicks. According to data from Nielsen, the Global Pandemic has more of US turning to services like Netflix than ever before streaming doubled between twenty nine. Nine, thousand, nine, hundred and twenty twenty, the company added something like sixteen million subscribers in the first few months of the year, so many people were streaming shows and movies that the. EU had to ask Netflix's to lower their video quality. Netflix's almost broke the Internet during quarantine. There's no denying the company has changed entertainment as we know it and our friends over at recode have a new. New podcast all about how that happened. It's called land of the giants. The net flicks affect, and it's going to change how you think about Netflix over the course of seven episodes, which you can't yet binge, because they're coming out one at a time every Tuesday for the next few weeks. You're going to hear about how Netflix's kind of a call t company to work for and how? How the company eviscerated blockbuster and disrupted Hollywood how they're creepy, Algorithm knows what your brain wants to see next end why the company is totally cool carrying the debt of a small country, so be sure to subscribe wherever you're listening to this right now and to wet, your appetite or running the first episode on today explained today here days land of the giants, the Netflix's effect episode one. Back in early March about a week before we all went on lockdown, our team got on a plane never planes and went to Netflix's headquarters in Hollywood to meet with a bunch of their top executives. A news crew. Folks from. All right. The way through the famous Netflix's lobby, which has the state of the art video screens that showed Netflix's movies and TV shows, and they change every couple of seconds it's it's really impressive. Pass. These bountiful micro kitchens are overflowing with snacks and food and everything you'd ever want and we went to a conference room where we sat down with the most powerful man in Hollywood. Thank you for making time? Easy question? Tell us your name what you do Ted Saranda on the chief content officer. Netflix Ted Serandon spends billions and billions of dollars a year to make TV, shows and movies get watch back couple hundred million people around the world, but a decade ago. netflix's wasn't reshaping entertainment as we know it. It was just a company that rented out DVD's and streamed other companies, old TV shows and movies. Ted Sarande wanted to change that. He and his boss CEO Reed Hastings WanNa Netflix to start making its own stuff stuff. That was as good as anything. You'd see an HBO NBC. They wanted to show their customers and Hollywood that they were serious in order to do that. They needed a big zero Hinton us how you devour whale. One time. Inter House of cards give and. Well The Washington. A big budget political drama starring big-name Kevin Spacey. This is back when it okay to like Kevin Spacey and made by a big time director David Fincher, who made movies seven fight club social, network. Ted Surrenders really water this show. But, so did everyone else so when I looked at that and said how. Why would they do the show with us? everybody wanted has a card Senate Hbo fx AMC. Everyone was bidding on it and Why would they do with us? We've never made or released an original anything. As so basically I, said look, we're going to have to have an answer for that. Hbo Could Tell Fincher and company. They were the home of the Sopranos and sex in the city AMC could boast about mad men and breaking bad, but Netflix's just had red envelope mailers for their DVD's Serandon had to get creative, and he had to break out his checkbook. This committee has accused me of. Of a great number of things you accuse me of hey to play. The didn't work. We will have dramatically overpaid for one show, and if it does, work could fundamentally change our business so to me. It was a classic risk reward analysis, and we were able to apply to it. This is the deal. Netflix paid one hundred million dollars to make the show, and promised to make two full seasons without ever seeing a single pilot, the giant for any company in the content business, but it was colossal for Netflix which had never done any of this before, but the craziest part wasn't the money, or even at a tech company was GonNa make two seasons of a show sight unseen. How much of your ability to get this deal done to a hundred million dollars to seasons is specific to Netflix's culture well a hundred percent because. I told read about the deal after we did it. So that he had no idea that you got down a hundred million dollars. Seasons have company still believing that exclusively within didn't matter. So you call up and say by the way spent hundred dollars on the show pretty much. What Sarande US is talking about here is a big part of Netflix's internal culture. It's something employs referred to as freedom and responsibility. It's what allowed Saranda to bet really big on something. He had no idea how to do and to do it without running by his boss versed. Ceramics believes it Netflix's culture led by Hastings. Is what allowed it to become the industry changing zeitgeist defining giant. It is today. It was him creating the culture that empowered me to do that and knowing that I could rationalize the rest of ward side of it upside of this deal, if it works out and knowing if I thought that I was going to get fired if it didn't work, I probably would have missed it. What was his reaction? When you said by the way we just bought a show for which he was? was very excited about it i. mean he was little a little anxious? One hundred dollars is a lot of money in the US at that point, some context here a couple years earlier Netflix's spend about twenty five million dollars to buy huge catalog movies from Disney and Sony for two years and this one hundred million dollars for a single show, I will tell you that he completely understood the logic going into it and understood what we did it. And I just it was fast moving and. That's what we did and the idea that if it makes it. That we become much different than what we were, and if you think it was hard, getting here, you beginning to understand what I'm willing to do to stay. You know the rest house of cards was a commercial and critical smash, told Hollywood and everyone else. That netflix's wasn't just a place to see reruns anymore. And Now! Netflix makes just about anything. It wants whenever it wants. Ted Sorrento's was right. This is land of the giants. The NETFLIX's effect I'm Peter Kafka, and I'm here with my colleague. Ronnie Mola Peter and I are both reporters at recode in Vox, and over the next seven episodes. We're going to explore how Netflix's has reshaped. How we watch and what we watch. We're going to cover a lot of ground the season from the way Netflix's toppled blockbuster video, and disrupted Hollywood to the streaming wars that have kicked off thanks to Netflix's enormous success, but we're going to start the series off with what people at Netflix's we'll tell you. The most important thing about flex its internal culture which I. Bet does not look like any company you've ever worked for. Maybe heard about hard-driving tech companies Netflix's certainly one of those, but it's way weirder than that. There are all kinds of things at that sound better than the place you work at like you get to make more money or take as much vacation as you want. And there are lots of things that sound really worrisome like the idea of the company is concerned trying to figure out if it can replace you with someone better. Or that you're gonNA constant criticism from your co, workers and managers are pretty much anyone. And then you've got to take that criticism seriously. Culture comes with its own language to so if you WanNa work there, you have to learn to use phrases like blast radius. No Brilliant Dirks keeper test. Sun Shining. If you think that sounds like a cult well sometimes working on this podcast. We felt that way, too, but this isn't a management fad that Netflix's picked up recently it's deep in the company's bones. An ethics believes deeply that its core to its success. Much culture was shaped by re tastings and his longtime head of HR Patty mccord, who is now a corporate management superstar based on her work there the way mcchord tells it. A critical part of the NFL Danny, came out of a brutal day in two thousand one, when net flicks was just a few years old, and she laid off a third of the company. We say goodbye because we ran out of money. I mean we were just broke and what we literally did. West Week gathered in the parking lot where we always did and read said today is the day we're gonNA. Take a by some of you and your going GonNa. Tell you who goes to see Patty. Entertainment. Hr and who's GonNa stay. Boris. Drought men was an early Netflix engineer. He remembers standing outside in the parking lot. Listening to hastings address the company wondering if he was still GonNa have a job when hastings finished speaking. You'll going go back to the office and you manager will tell you whether you made. It didn't make it. On, so after that we all kind of trickled in back office and the manager started calling in people who didn't make it one time to the office and letting them know so. That was pretty pretty tough. Jam Survive those cuts. Though is obviously freaked out the for Patty mcchord. This is what she did for a living. Come on! This is I've done that I had done. This I've been in Silicon Valley for thirty years. You think I haven't done a layoff before. This was nothing but even mccord who was used to firing people were surprised at would happen next. That layoff was what Begat. Begat the high performance culture, and we got twice as much done with the third as many people, and it was more fun, and that was that truly I think was the beginning of the culture. which is you know we're working so hard and we're getting so much done in that beautiful startup. If you've ever been in, it's still really the takeaway from mcchord and hastings and other netflix's executives was that laying people off can be good for the company and more than that. Netflix was a team, not a family, so it wants to swap out the players. It has for better ones whenever it can. Some employees like drought men. The ones who kept their jobs were not as excited about this. What I've heard was the notion of the team of. Employees be been considered as a team of football players. If you can upgrade any one of them, why wouldn't you and so? It was very kind of cold and calculated approach to human resources. You can call that cold and calculating. mcchord thought that this idea along with the other values they developed along the way really defined what Netflix's was or could be the really want to figure out a way to cultivate and preserve this culture, so they wrote it down. If you go back and you look at the quote, famous Culture Deck, the first chapter is about the values and behaviors that we expect from each other like if I want, if I expect honesty from you, what does that mean and if you're dishonest? What does that mean this? This is the beginning of what's now known as the Netflix's culture deck Netflix kept US inside the company for years, but in two thousand nine at shared it on the Internet you can still find version of it on Netflix site today it's this one hundred and twenty five page slide show presentation. This was a huge hit at tech and start up companies because it can start up companies idea of moving fast and making it up as you go not worrying too much about art charts sounds kinda familiar. Even if you don't actually do that stuff, it sounds like something you want to do. Because that's how you're supposed to disrupt the big entrenched companies in your way, the way the Google and facebook did it. So in Silicon Valley, netflix's model was aspirational and also plausible an echo of stuff they already believed and what's not to love Netflix's preaching efficiency, hard work, building a team of all stars, giving people room, or rather the freedom and responsibility to work the way they want to work. Okay well. We have adults who are high performers. Will. Should we have a bunch of rules you know at the time we were at that chapter. We had just gone public and everybody was telling us. It was time for our employee handbook, and it was time for all the policies and we thought why. Really what if we experiment with that? But if we don't have a travel policy, what if we don't have time off policy? And this is crucial. This wasn't advice coming from business, school, Professor, or a consultant, or do I writing blog post when Netflix puts on the Internet, this was coming from a company that was winning. They're kicking ass and they were telling you. This is how we did it. You can do it, too. For employees. The trade offer all this excellence has been the things are not necessarily stable at net flicks. You may like that or you may find that really unsettling. You're only on their. When you're performing your best, and then once you're not at your best. You get cut. Shawnee Ramachandran is a Wall Street Journal reporter spent years covering Netflix's and wrote a fascinating story that really dug into the pros and cons of working there. You started to see. That people are like this is super weird like this it actually is. Not that fun place to work. Where really scared of being fired? A lot of the people I talked to felt that there was a culture fear. In fact, there's a former HR executive who said that she often heard that. But I think that at the same time it wasn't just like Oh, it was a horrible place to work I regret it. It was often it was really tough and I hated the way I was fired and my friend was fired, but I'm really glad I got to work there for some time. When crucial point she explored, a reporting was the way the people at the top of the ORG chart felt about the culture versus the rank and file many of the top executives as you can imagine drink the Kool aid of like Netflix's obviously has been doing a great job and business and innovating its own business, and so many of the things that it's been doing. They can point to our culture. Culture, it's working the top line. Results are great but I. Think what many of the people at the top probably can't see is what's going on as you grow this breakneck pace? As we were working on this podcast, we spoke with people who worked in Netflix's. Who told us some of the same stuff? I talked to a marketer who said the company had a punishing work ethic. That was not sustainable. And, she also told me that when she left Netflix's. She knew she never get paid that well again publicly. Netflix doesn't express any doubts about how it runs the company. It thinks it's high. Achieving culture is what enabled it to beat blockbuster and leap years ahead of everyone else in media and tech and Netflix's believes culture helps recruit employees, mcchord and Netflix's Co. founder Marc Randolph have written books about it and Reed Hastings. Hastings has one coming out this fall, and let's be clear. Lots of companies say their culture is key to their success and lots of companies spend time talking about their values in the original version of the Netflix's Culture Deck Reed. Hastings pointed out that Enron had its values including the word integrity chiseled on the wall of its lobby, and this was before it went bankrupt, and its leaders went to jail for fraud. But it Netflix you just can't pay lip service to the stuff. You really need to believe in it. Or at least act convincingly as if you do you need to be all in the bosses do acknowledge that. NETFLIX's culture born in a silicon valley startup developed at hyper speed may not work everywhere. Hastings for instance doesn't think you could use the Netflix model to run a factory that makes cars or vaccine stuff. You have to make exactly the same way every single time using a very strict set of rules. There's also a question about how will. This culture is going to work as Netflix's moves from being a Silicon Valley Company to a Hollywood company? It looks now as big office. Right on Sunset Boulevard, and over the last few years, a lot of Netflix's hires have come from movie studios TV networks. It's paying a lot of Hollywood veterans much better than their old jobs did and in the process. NETFLIX's remaking Hollywood, but we're going to find out how well those people can adapt to the net flicks way of doing things. L. Isn't the only concern here. NETFLIX's setting up offices all over the world at a culture that works California may not fly in Europe or Asia is a huge global test for Netflix and it's. Right now we're not going to get the results for years. Spencer one was a Wall Street analyst who covered Netflix and Reed. Hastings liked his work so much. He hired him as head of investor relations where he would talk to other Wall Street people and up until then Wong thought he knew Netflix's pretty well until we found out that who worked there to the most valuable information the company had. It's a running tally of subscribers. Going my gosh, this is like if I was an analyst. This is like a gold. Mine like this is exactly what I why I was like. Oh, so like who gets this like you know. Like a couple thousand people like whoever signs up I was like. WHOA, that's crazy. John Friedland was a reporter for the Wall Street Journal where he spent a lot of time trying to learn company secrets. Then he went to work in Pr Disney which tries really hard to keep it secret secret. Working for an ethics was very different. Never forget because My first meeting there up there, talking all the numbers to. To everybody director in up, which is how many people at that point, it was maybe a hundred people, but it was like holy Moly, what Friedland was looking at where netflix's financial results numbers at hadn't made public yet at other publicly traded companies, those numbers which are only released the world, every three months are treated like nuclear launch codes getting that information earliest worth a ton of money to a ton of people. and. NETFLIX's basically handing it out to its employees. There's no armed guards NOLAAC not to go to this place where they're just freely talking about economic outcomes in the finances prior to public disclosure struck me as remarkable because Kim fighting in that large group of people about very sensitive, financial materials was kind of a high level of trust and confidence to put in your staff, and you know what it worked just fine. It's kind of crazy. That netflix's never had these numbers leak out. It just lays them out for hundreds of its employees and almost dare to abuse it. It's a pretty cool message which is, we're going to treat you? You like adults in part of being an adult is understanding. What's going on at Your Business? So you know what we know and also part of being an adult is being discreet in other words. The company is telling its employees. We trust you. This is a big part of the Netflix culture. This idea of radical transparency we believe in internal transparency because we want our employees to be will equipped with context a what we're trying to do as a business so that the employees feel empowered to make smart decisions on behalf of the company, so maybe being able to see inside your company's finances sounds like a good thing to you. What about letting your coworkers see what you make. A little less good, but that's radical transparency to the some five hundred executives at Netflix's that have the ability to see what every single employee makes, and at one point recently, Reed Hastings suggested that every employee Netflix's should be able to see what all seven thousand employees make that one didn't happen because other. Netflix's exempts shot at down turns out that even people who embrace radical transparency. Draw the line somewhere and. And even the executive we talked to earlier, John Freeman surpassed the boundaries of Netflix's tolerance for candor. Another one of the companies buzzwords in two thousand, eighteen, the former communications chief use the N. Word to illustrate how harmful saying the word retarded could be an an ethics comedy special. Use The word again that day. When he described the incident hr after an internal uproar, freedland apologized Netflix's employees. He was eventually fired. Coming up how Netflix made the biggest mistake in its history, and how the lessons from that self inflicted wound ended up making its culture even weirder. Support for the show today comes from nerdwallet smart money podcast. It's the podcast that wants to help. Keep you informed about all the pressing financial issues that you might be having right now and also financial news whether you're a finance pro or a finance, bro or just someone trying to do a little bit more with your money or just want to keep up. Up with the you know economic climate in the country right now, the smart money podcast has you covered. You got to hosts. One's named Sean so perfect. The other one's named Liz so that's cool, too. They walk you through the weeks. Financial News and breakdown all your pressing questions and you know there's a lot of pressing money questions right now, be they about. Mortgages or or rent or student, loans or unemployment or or government benefits all that stuff and more financial news. You'll find a nerdwallet smart money podcast. Find it wherever you listen apple spotify. One of those APPs check it out. NERDWALLET S- smart money show. Welcome back to land of the giants, the netflix effect we're exploring Netflix's unique culture, and how and why they made it. We're GONNA. Tell you about a part of Netflix's culture that came out of one of its biggest mistakes. Okay, Roddy. I'm GonNa, take you back to two thousand eleven. When Reed Hastings almost sank the company. Here's the deal. Today Netflix's announced. It was splitting its business into to I. I mean the good news that's GonNa. Come out of this longer. will new coq be the worst public announcement? It's really got to be quick. STOR which I'm saying is dead stor. This was Netflix's attempt to get the world to embrace streaming long before streaming was mainstream and it failed. It's one of those experiences that no one wants to think about. That's for sure. It feels so badly the Netflix. Cindy Holland who runs original programming have tried to forget it. Let's back. Netflix's started out in the late nineties, shipping movies and TV shows on DVD's through the mail and two thousand seven Reed Hastings began letting us subscribers stream videos over the Internet to free. At first this was the thing that appealed just an early adopter, but by two thousand eleven millions of Netflix's customers doing. Hastings wanted thanks to move even faster. He wanted everyone to stream, and he wanted to start getting out of the DVD business. We were a hybrid service with DVD and streaming together in the US, starting to do streaming alone, internationally I realized it. We would be better if we could split those two services, so we were not dependent on DVD and that we were the best streaming company full stop. You can hear it in his voice. Hastings is a tech guy and he's a very logical dude. And like a lot of Silicon Valley, logical dudes, especially those that have had some success early on like heated hastings assume that. If it made sense to him, you'd get it to. In his mind, this was simple. Streaming feature in Netflix's had to make itself into a streaming company, so hastings tried to force the issue. You still be able to stream movies, but if you want DVD's, you're gonNA have to use a whole new service. Boy Are people pissed off about that one? In two thousand eleven, Netflix's announced that its basic service which offer. Offer DVD's and unlimited streaming for ten bucks. A month was now going to be two services. If you wanted to watch stuff on the Internet, you'd pay bucks a month for that, and if you wanted to rent, DVD's you pay another eight bucks a month for that, too, so you have to pay a lot more to get the same stuff you got before. That is a good way of putting. It was a sixty percent price hike delivered. When Americans were still climbing out of a huge recession and went along with the move to make a simple service way more complicated, you can imagine how that went over. No one was thrilled by the recent net flicks pricing increase, but the way in which they deliver the message was what really seems to have caused the majority of the backlash. This is one of the first mainstream Internet uprisings against a big consumer company. A lot of this happened on facebook. Netflix customers went to complain and. And sometimes they would find Reed Hastings. They're answering some of their complaints. He was extra hands on back. Then it's hard to remember what two thousand and eleven was like a lot of the internet mass behavior social interaction. Stuff was just starting, and so this idea that then people would be upset on facebook, and then other people would see it an amp up the total conversation. We had not witnessed many of those in society before Netflix's customers weren't the only ones who didn't like hastings idea. Many of his executives also had doubts, but they were scared to tell him that. Or more generous figured. Reed Hastings Super. Smart and he thought it was right. It must be right even if it made no sense to them. I. Do remember the conversations. In the difficult thing about it is breed had been right about almost everything. Cindy Holland is one of those executives who didn't know how to tell hastings at splitting, the business into might be a mistake. This was really the first big example where I think there was some nervousness. Yeah, there were some doubts, but. He just been right so many times. This wasn't terrible logic by the way reed hastings was the guy who started a video company back when everyone in the world got their videos from blockbuster. Bad idea, right? But he won by two thousand eleven, Netflix's had more than twenty million subscribers and blockbuster was bankrupt, so maybe hastings did know what he's talking about. Everyone knows the tail of the self absorbed arrogancy Oh. Who doesn't listen and there's an element of that because we have been so successful at so many things before. But. The more subtle one is that I had been so successful before that most of the executives thought this isn't smart are I. Don't think it is smart, but read has been right on so many things I'll bet he's right on this one, and I'm just not seeing, but the customer sought and Netflix paid the price. By the end of the year, more than seven hundred thousand people had canceled their netflix subscription, and at one point, Netflix's stock had dropped by seventy percent. What was it like inside the company when you ruled this out, and then saw the feedback coming and saw the stock drop. What was what was it i? We were a defensive end. We're like we knew it was gonNA. GonNa be hard, we weren't stupid. It was people were to like it. Customers bailed on him. And investors hammered stock and hastings double down to emphasize the future of netflix streaming. He announce that NETFLIX'S DVD company was no longer going to be called Netflix's anymore, and he decided the best way to announce. That was a video. Hi, I'm re tastings, CEO and CO founder of Netflix. We've been working for the past fourteen years to build Netflix year by year into the best possible service we could built. We're making this video today to apologize in person or at least on camera. For something that we did recently, this is a weird video. It features hastings sitting outside at a patio table, wearing a bright -til button-down shirt. It's also weird because he's not really apologizing. He saying he's going ahead with this plan that everyone hates. Oh, and he's got a new name for it to. We think that the DVD service needs its own brand so that we can advertise it. So we've named are DVD service. Quick. Stir what the Hell is quick ser! Why is it being spelled Q. W.? And why is the CEO of Tech Company shooting Lo fi apology videos outside his office. This video and that name were so widely pan that even Saturday night live when after it, and now a message from Netflix DOT com. I'm Reed Hastings CEO and Co founder of Netflix this is Jason Dak- says Reed Hastings and Fred armistead next to him as one of his underlings, fake Reed Hastings by the way is wearing that t shirt. We know you love. Netflix's because it was an easy to use website for all. Your movie needs to make it better. We split it into two separate, slightly more confusing sites. NETFLIX's for streaming video and quick stor which will handle DVD rentals. Did we spell a quick? Stir in a normal way. No, we didn't know. W I K annoying but easier right. And by the way we know, it's off putting to see the CEO of a powerful company rocking a goatee and teal shirt. Trust us. We know what we're doing. This is a great video by the way it is definitely worth looking up and Netflix got lucky. The skit never actually ran on snl itself. It was only online, and you remember the S. and L. Video yes. wincing, Steve swayze handled PR for netflix's. During the quick. Stir to buckle the thing is netflix moves fast on everything, and when it's the consumer benefit. Everybody loves it. But when it's a mistake, it's amplified and that's when we really started to feel the hurt. That's when people really revolted. The non apology apology video did not work. More subscribers left and Netflix's stocks sank even lower and Reed Hastings, the super logical guy who was convinced that he was right, and everyone else was wrong. Finally got the message he was left with. With no choice Netflix's abandoned. QUICK STIR! It's widely panned movie streaming service Netflix, says it was just too quick with its plan for quick stir in other words. Quick stor is dead, even today. Hastings says he was wrong with that wrong. The big thing was we did sixty percent price increase to twenty million American families in the middle of a recession so. There's no communications is going to make that. Go down well, so to recap. Raise prices. You make a simple service complicated you create a terrible name for a new product that people do not want until everyone who hates it that they're wrong. This was not a great run for hastings and put the life of his company endanger. But netflix survived eventually subscriber numbers started taking up again, and since that's all Wall Street really cared about the stock went up again to, and while the quick name has gone to Heaven Hastings still ended up going forward with his plan to make DVD's separate from Netflix's streaming service today. If you WANNA get net flicks to send you DVD's you. Can you go to a service called DVD DOT COM and you sign up there and you pay another eight bucks a month. The lesson for Hastings was not that he screwed up or that he was too early. Pushing streaming, or maybe should've worn a different color shirt in that video. It's that lots of people around him could have told him. He was GonNa make mistake, but they didn't. They lost their own self confidence. It wasn't me suppressing it. It was them overly deferential. Because of the track record of their beating blockbuster all these like crazily unlikely and hard things. And so afterwards, what we realized is okay. We need to be much more active at farming for to set. Hastings vowed to run a company where everyone everywhere could tell everyone else what they thought of them in their ideas, and specifically Netflix's came up with this idea where you could take crazy big swing at something, but you better ask other Netflix's to troubleshoot at first. This is what hastings Netflix's college farming for dissent. You're trying to get your co workers to tell you what's wrong with your idea. If you tell everyone about your plan, and you get their feedback and they hated, and you still want to go ahead you can, and if it fails, you'll be okay in theory, but if you haven't farmed for dissent in advance, and you also fail, you're going to have a problem. Because then they'll see each other's just an open Google doc, so they'll see how each other feel and then everybody has to. To vote in public in writing of. Do they think this would be wise? Stupid, not stupid, and then it's up to me to write a summary of okay. This is what I heard and it might be that we're still doing X. or Y. which might not be the popular choice, so no one. It's not advertised as a democracy. Let's voted up like the Senate or something, but it's everyone on record. One hundred percent sure that employees will ever be candid with hastings or their boss, as they might be with people who can't lay them off and ruin their lives. You're suggesting that it's one thing could tell me that you don't like my salad choice. Go tell our CEO that you don't like the direction. The company's going exactly yeah makes sense. In Reed Hastings made one other decision after quick stor. He hid that teal shirt in the closet and he never wore it again. And a few years later, he gathered his employees in hell the ceremonial burning. Where did you burn it just? Isn't that same patio? The videos? That's awesome. Retailing's as happy to tell you. He got quick wrong, but enough. Everyone is supposed to tell you how they got something wrong. And if you're at high level and you screw up, it's not enough to just admit that you screwed up. You have to do it in public. Shawnee Ramachandran at the wall. Street Journal wrote about this process. It's called Sun Shining Sunshine is when you have done a misdeed and you're forced to be in front of various numbers of people whether it's your team or a bunch of executives the whole east that they call it all the VP's and above or the full director's level of involved what you'd be hundreds of people and you're supposed to go up there and you're supposed to say. This is the bad thing I did I'm sorry. These are all the ways that I was wrong. Maybe depending on how you think about work or the people you work with that could sound like a good idea or a super awkward one. But it's hard to think that many people would be comfortable with one of Netflix's most radical ideas. The keeper test he protests is. What managers are supposed to apply constantly to anybody on their team, which is the question of Are you the best person for this role? And if the answer is no, the what the keeper test says is that person should no longer work at the company. Many people come there knowing that they might get cut anytime. This all comes to the keeper. Tests Ronny I. GotTa Say I am. Am Not comfortable with the key protest. I don't think I'd be comfortable with it during boom times when it's relatively easy to get a job, and now we're in a giant recession. Yeah, but N- ethics argues that doesn't mean it's firing. People left and right. It's total turnover rate is something like eleven or twelve percent, which is says is in line with the rest of the tech media industry. But even people who liked working at Netflix's say the protests, and the idea that you're constantly having to prove yourself or at least prove that you're applying the keeper protests to people who work for you can be just as nerve wracking as it sounds is every single person in my team the right person to be here? Do they deserve to be here and something? You're supposed to be constantly asking yourself some. Some managers even told us that they feel pressured to fire people or else they risk looking to soft the knowledge of this keeper test, and the fact that people know about it that they're managers are constantly judging them. It makes them feel worried that well I could be fired any minute. The key protests is supposed to apply to everyone including the person who helped reed hastings created. That's HR director Patty mcchord. Ultimately. I had to make the decision that the company would be better with someone else. In that role. In Two thousand twelve hastings decided that mccord was no longer passing the keeper tests. She knew the deal. It's a team, not a family, and so he let her go. Because we had made that clear, they can respect me making a judgment for the benefit of the team. Even if it's hurtful to them, and still be great friends and allies. Do Things Together so I? Agree that it's unusual. Mechanic falls out of being clear affront that were working together for the benefit of the company. and it's not family so then. It's not a violation of a social norm. If you ask either hastings record about what happened, both of them say they don't have hard feelings about it. The company had grown and changed. It was becoming more of a Hollywood company and less of a pure tech company and mcchord didn't fit there anymore. But even Patty mccord, who discusses firings and layoffs with such ease, who one point laid off a third of the company? Has a difficult time discussing her own departure. Of course, it was an emotional experience. I'd worked with this guy for twenty years. This is my company I still talk about it. As my company I still believe Spike Company. It was berry. Mary said to leave, but it was completely reasonable. I really was not the right person. I'm not the right person. Other top executives that hastings has unkept include Neil Hunt on early product executive at a longtime friend and Marc Randolph who co founded the company with him to me. That's a little jarring, so I asked hastings about what it was like to let go of some of his closest earliest collaborators were them surprised that you fire them? You know you use the word fire, which is in some sense accurate, because I get a severance package but at a senior level is not like walk into an office and do the your fired we in both cases talked about it over many many months so i. don't think there was any surprise you know at the end that sounds difficult, but hastings says he's gotten better at it over time. The key he says is to not be too human about it. The first time I was a CEO I couldn't do it at all. Because I was so. Focused on kindness and sort of the human value, and you know in hurting someone was just too hard for me and so then it's like someone really needs to be fired. I would sit there and fumble around good, even say the words you know like that total bad leadership situation, and ultimately I realized that honesty is very valuable, and as long as I was doing it for the right reasons, because I thought it was better for the company. I live with myself even even though it hurt me that hurt the person when he started running the company back at the turn of the century, not Netflix's few hundred employees, and the big challenge is figuring out how to move discs in envelopes around the country. Now it's about buying and making content for the world and streaming over the Internet and managing more than seven thousand employees. So what if it turns out that Reed? Hastings isn't the right guy to run Netflix Wedneday I asked his number two rondos. Who's going to tell read that? He failed to keep her test. Nobody. Why would they. But Hastings knows that one day he is going to be replaced. How are you thinking about your succession? Plan in your your keeper test you know I'm not the best judge for me. The board is really the best judge I'd love to stay at Netflix's for a long time I had no other plans besides philanthropy, and if the board is looking for a reason to keep hastings, all have to do is run the numbers. Here is the most important one. Its stock price in two thousand two. NETFLIX's when public share the company's worth about a dollar today is were recording this. It's worth about four hundred and forty dollars. And Reed Hastings will tell you. He has the Netflix cultured to thank for that. Okay Peter you pass the keeper. For this episode. For the rest of the season we're going to discuss how Netflix's revolutionized what we watch how we watch and more like how Netflix's forced huge companies like Disney apple and Amazon to chase after it Yep we're diving into the streaming wars, and what the future of streaming looks like. We're also going to look back to a time when Netflix's change your Friday night trips to the video store tonight. Make it a blockbuster. Blockbuster understood that only twenty percent of customers who came in would get the movie that they wanted, and they would have to get something else the other eighty percent of the time I. Had People Tell You I saw you in here when I dropped it off. You tell me you didn't check it on time. Not Paying that it we. It got heated. That's right. We are going back to blockbuster video and on. Netflix killed the video store. That's next time on land of the giants, the Netflix's effect. This podcast is a production of recode by box and the box media podcast network. This episode was produced by Bridget Armstrong, and Zach Mac our is Charlie Herman, felt them Sheikha Sean engineered and scored this episode and composed our theme Zach Mac. Is Our show, runner and shot Kirwa is the executive producer quick disclosure box, dot, com and box media makes shows for Netflix. None of the people working on this season. Land of the giants are involved in the production of those shows. I'm Peter. Kafka and I'm writing Mullah thanks for listening.

Netflix Reed Hastings executive CEO giants Blockbuster US hastings Hollywood Patty mccord mcchord Sean Ramos Firm Reed Hastings Wan director Ted Saranda reporter NBC
Bovine intervention

Today, Explained

23:16 min | 1 year ago

Bovine intervention

"Support for today explained comes from Kiko their projects are designed to spark creativity. Tinkering and learning in kids of all ages and they're offering today. Explain listeners the chance to try them for free to redeem the offer and learn more about their projects. Go to Keith dot com slash explained. A couple years ago, a friend of mine who has this rare red meat allergy was like, hey, Sean, you wanna get lunch, and she never really asked me to go to lunch. So I was like, of course, like sure and then she was like come on. We're gonna get impossible burgers. And I of course, said Amy what's an impossible burger? And she told me it's a spur that tastes just like meat. But it isn't. It's totally made from plans, and we went and Amy was right. It was totally novel experience, the the meatless meat tasted like meet a very satisfying burger, and then I didn't really think about it again until last year when I was in Chicago for weekend and heard that the white castle few blocks away from our hotel was now serving the impossible burgers. And I was with today explained engineer a fiend the dream Shapiro at like two in the morning. And I said fiends you want to go get the impossible burgers at white castle. And was like sure, and we went, and that's about when I realized then this meatless meet thing is really becoming a thing. And it is it's white castle. But also red Robin Carl's junior sell taco. Then on Monday Burger King announced plans to have every one of its locations across the country serving impossible burgers by the end of the year and beyond meet the maker of the other big meatless meet out. There is expected to go public tomorrow, it's likely valuation over one billion dollars. Tamar house bowl has been on the meat beat for the Washington Post. We started with the impossible. The impossible burger is made by a company called impossible foods. It comes shrink wrapped in it. Looks like raw meat there's a chain here called Dave and Buster's that tends to sort of load things up cheese and special sauce. I think it had over thirteen hundred calories, whereas at other chains it's more geared toward a health conscious customer and not so loaded up. It has vegetables on it. And it doesn't come with French FRA is and this other company beyond meat with the over a billion dollar IPO. Are they doing things differently? Do they have any advantages over impossible foods share? They do. I don't believe in possible foods is available at retail for you and me to buy and cook at home, but beyond burger is and you can get it at whole foods, a number of other places I've had that one too. And I will say that. I think that the impossible burger is a moth. More convincing substitute. But I think they're both reasonable substitutes. Once you put them on a bun with a coutry mall and put it on plate. I think it's high time we establish. How exactly this stuff is made? I think when my friend I told me like, hey, we gotta go try this impossible burger. She said is like they figured out how to make like beats bleed. I don't know if that's accurate, but I'd love to find out the impossible burger bleeds. And I've seen it bleed on video. I will tell you the two that I tried did not bleed, but one of the ways they accomplished this. And this has been somewhat controversial is with a soy based Keam the stuff that comes out of meat when you cook it is Maya globe in which is very closely related to hemoglobin. So this is imitating hemoglobin, but they're using a genetically modified east to make that. And of course, that has made the Antenne go up on people who are suspicious about genetic modification in general, and that carries connotations that a lot of people are not really comfortable with to be clear. This is not like lab grown meat that you've heard about like, no that was growing lab that didn't hurt an animal, but is still animal based. Yeah, they're two very different things. So what we see on the market right now is actually plants that have been processed into something. Beef like the thing that they're working on lab grown meat actually starts with animal cells and gets cultured in the lab in a growth, medium that mimics an animal and those cells do what cells do which is reproduce. It's not available anywhere yet. It's very challenging technical process. There are some things that make it really difficult to do at any kind of reasonable price point right now. You know, you're looking at thousands of dollars a pound. Wow. But yes that is going to be indistinguishable from meat because it's going to be actual meat. It just won't involve animals, except for those few cells that you begin with do you. Remember the first time you bit into an impossible burger Tamar. Sure because it was like last week. There's this local chain called not your average Joe's my husband, and I went up to one near us, and it was served with mozzarella cheese in sort of the pesto, and it was delicious. It was a bona fide burger experience. Now, if you take a little piece of it off and eat it just by itself, you can definitely detect planty flavors. It's not going to compete with like the burger at the corner bistro in New York. The big medium rare burger where the beef flavor is really what it's about. But in fast food, burgers, and in a lot of fast, casual restaurant, burgers, the flavor of the beef is not nearly as important as the fact that you have this charred meaty substance with delicious things pile Bonn it absolutely passes that bar. I remember thinking the same thing. Like, this isn't like the juiciest. Most flavorful burger I've ever had in my life. But if you compare it to like, a Big Mac or something this is at least as good as that if not better, right? I want to go try this because I'm really interested. How this works on a fast food menu. And what it tastes like? But the other hand it makes me a really crappy assessor of how good it is. Because you really have to ask the people who eat these things frequently. And so have you asked people who eat these things frequently I have asked a couple of who eat these things frequently people who eat these things all the time in are given the whopper with an impossible burger have no idea that they're not eating the standard issue whopper. It's a very fairy good fact simile, and who is like the market for these. Because I mean, I don't know imagine there's a ton of vegetarians pulling up to a Burger King on a daily basis. Anyway. Well, that's the crux of the biscuit here because whether this is going to have a positive impact on the environment depends entirely on what people are eating the impossible burger instead of my husband. And I went out for a burger when we would have been very unlikely to go out for a burger under other circumstances. We went out specifically to try this. And I think a lot of people are in that same boat. They're very curious about this. You know vegetarians are trying it because a lot of them have a soft spot for. Are the taste of burger? And this gives them that taste in that experience without actually eating meat. But for this to do the thing that it's being touted as a substitute for something that is ecologically questionable people who have to eat it instead of meat, and I don't know that we know yet whether people are doing that right now, it's complete novelty. And I think it's too early to say Cousy eating it and what they're eating it. Instead of I also think that it'll change as this goes more and more mainstream and people would come accustomed to seeing a plan based alternative that tastes good in standard issue burger clothing. I kind of want to go to not your average Joe's now when you went did you ask the owner of the manager whatever when you were there like who's been ordering this thing, I did actually not at not your average just but when I was in Miami. There's a local chain they're called carrot express. Of course, Carol. Express caters to a health oriented clientele. So they're not probably going to get big old carnivores coming in on a regular basis. And I said, you know, are people doing it for their own health? Are are they doing it for environmental reasons? And she said to me this is Miami. Nobody cares about the environment of Florida. How much does it cost? I remember it being pretty cheap at white castle at one restaurant. I it saw it. I can't remember which one it was. It was like a dollar surcharge above the other burger price and their couple of places where it's quite pricey. But as this becomes more mainstream. I expect that to change. Do you have any sense of why like fast food restaurants might be adding it if they might have to charge a surcharge and might not be the most, you know, like gang busters business initiative, but look at who's going to it and look at the press that they're getting if your Burger King, and you have the option of putting this on your menu, which could bring in a client. L that you didn't have before. Why wouldn't you do it? We should make a date to talk a year from now and see what's happened because it's going to be super interesting to see the kind of acceptance this gets among everyday meat eaters. I'm putting it in the calendar now. All right. All right. Good May Day twenty twenty. No matter what day. We're going to talk to me or we're going to talk the absence of that's right one or the other. After the break. The main course can meatless meet make the world a better place today. Export. Here's the deal last time Kiwi co was sponsoring the show. I told you guys a story of this wail project. They said me, and I was thinking who would be great for this project. And I gave it to my six year old neighbor Jackson around his birthday, I left it on his stoop. And then I never heard anything about it ever again. So when key co was last sponsoring the show. I finally, hey, did you ever get that Kiwi co project I left on your stoop for Jackson, and they were like no never saw it which made me believe. Whoa. Kiwi. Co projects are so desirable. That like within minutes of me, leaving this on my neighbor, stupid, seventy m someone stole it. But what I found out later from my neighbors is that they already had Kiwi co subscription and they did. In fact, get the wheel project. They just didn't realize it was a gift from me and Jackson loved it Kiko is offering today. Explain listeners the chance to try them out for free to redeem the offer and learn more about their projects for kids of all. Ages. Visit Kiko dot com slash explained. That is K. I w I oh dot com slash explain. Tomorrow. If you like there's three reasons why people might wanna eat this stuff. There's nutrition there's environmental impact. And then, of course, animal welfare. Can we start with nutrition is the meatless meats healthier now? So I looked at the nutritional profile of the impossible burger versus beef the impossible burger has somewhat less saturated fat, and the people who are in the saturated fat is important Campbell say well, that's a win it has somewhat less protein and the people who are in the protein is important camp will say, well, that's a loss. But all in all I would say there's not enough to choose between them to say that this is going to have any impact on human health. What it can do? However is it can be like the chicken Caesar salad. It has the word salad in it. So people think it's good for you. But when you look at the stats, it's got fourteen hundred calories and all the saturated fat from the dressing, not to mention tons of salt. Because of course, all the calories come from dressing and croutons and everybody knows you can't eat dressing in croutons for lunch. But that's basically what you're doing. When you're getting the Caesar salad. So if you think it's a plant based burger, and it's better for you. You know that health halo can extend to the cheese the special sauce, the French fries, even the milk shake. It's easy to get a sense that this is better for you. When it's not really. How about the environment? Does it does it actually do a better job there? I was told initially when I tried this that it took a ton of time in the lab to produce these burgers, I wonder if that ways the environmental impact of harvesting meet yet took a lot, and I don't know how they amortize RND into the environmental cost of the burger itself. But I've seen one life cycle analysis of greenhouse gases done for the beyond burger. It was done by researchers. I believe it Michigan. And they found that the beyond burger had ten percent of the greenhouse gas impact of beef. Now, this will bring the beef people out to point out that all of the life cycle analyses of beef. Don't include you know, the ecosystem services that cattle can perform if they're grays properly. So we can go down the rabbit hole of enteric, methane and sequestered carbon in grasslands or we can say that it's probably a significant. Greenhouse gas win. It's going to be a probably for now because we have not seen an evaluation of the impossible burger, technically the jury's out. But enteric methane from cattle is a really big hit chicken pork have a much much lower greenhouse gas impact than beef because neither chickens nor pigs have that enteric methane. My guess is that these burgers are going to be some place in the same. Certainly order magnitude as chicken, and pork they might be a little better. But it's kind of an important point to make that from a strictly environmental perspective, chicken and pork are way better than beef. So substituting chicken or pork for beef is nearly as meaningful greenhouse gas impact as substituting one of these veg based burgers, and then I guess the most obvious argument in favor of the impossible burger or beyond me. Eat and meatless meats broadly is that no animals to die to make your sandwich. That's right. I think that the way animals are treated in our industrialized agricultural system has rightly caused a great deal of concern, especially pigs. It's certainly reasonable to be concerned about the welfare of animals in our system, it's reasonable. But do you think enough people actually care about animals in that way to stop eating meat? I think people do care. But again, there's a difference between compassion that is genuine and being willing to pay more for something. If you're a working mom, and you're trying to feed your family, something that doesn't take an hour and a half to make that your kids are gonna eat and that fits into your budget. You might not have the luxury to care about these things. I've also heard from a lot of people who say. Say I want everything in the grocery store to be okay for me to buy. And I want our regulatory system and our agricultural system to make sure that that's the case. And I get that perspective. Also because I mean who has the bandwidth to try and understand how this pig versus that pig was treated in the supermarket and tried to decode these labels. I mean, I do it for living in sometimes I can't tell you can't expect people to have the bandwidth for this. So we've got you know, del taco, which you know, for my money is the superior of the two major fast food. Had to we got Burger King. We got the white castle will be a huge game changer. If a company like McDonald's signs up for this. I would be willing to bet that McDonald's is going to sign up for some kind of plant based meat substitute. And all even put a time on it within the next six months. You wanna take that bet? Sure. What are we betting an impossible burger yet impossible burger when we're both in Saint place at the same time deal. It's do it. Loser. Buys six months. Yeah. And I have no insider information, this is a wild ass guess, but I think that so many other chains are jumping on this that, you know, McDonald's has to be lookin' very very hard at it. And if that were to happen, do you think you would get people to care more? No, no. I don't think it'll get people to care more. But. What it does do is demonstrate? I think the way we get a better food system because changes aren't going to necessarily be consumer driven. We've seen that with McDonald's on cage, free eggs, for example. A lot of these big corporations don't want to be the bad guy in this scenario. They don't want to be the lowest common, denominator beef, and eggs and chicken. And so they step up their game. If say McDonald's introduces this in six months like you said, and then I have to buy you an impossible burger. That's right. If they introduce it at the exact same price point as say, whatever their quarter Pounder is right now, let's say it's three fifty and you can just say quarter Pounder impossible would people still choose the meat option. Or would they choose the meatless option? So you want me to haul 'em crystal ball. Don't you Billy crystal? I would suspect that as. Soon as they rolled out the impossible burger, they would see a big bump in impossible burgers that did not cannibalize their beef sales. And then after we get past the novelty phase of this McDonald's will probably bring in a few new customers and some of their customers will opt for the impossible burger for variety of reasons, it might not be the environment. It might be that they have the perception that it's better for them. So if you are an animal rights activists who also really cares about the environment and looks impossible meet as like the last bastion of hope for saving the cows of America and the world what you're really hoping for isn't that McDonald's introduces the impossible burger six months, but that McDonald's takes the initiative to replace its entire meet. Menu. It's beef-based menu with impossible meat, and I think we're a long way away from that. But I don't think that it's out of the question. I don't think it's impossible. It could certainly happen. We're looking at time horizons that are basically blips as far as climate change is concerned. And when my kids are my age, it may be that we have meat substitutes that replace almost all of the beef that were eating I certainly wouldn't bet against it. Tamar hassle writes, a monthly food column called unearthed for the Washington Post when she's not doing that she farms on Cape Cod, which I guess gives the rest of something to aspire to. I'm Sean Ramos. I this is today explained my favorite burger is the stuffed portabella mushroom situation over at shake shack. Watch out for the exploding cheese. Irene Noguchi, the show's executive producer, my favorite burger is the fried chicken sandwich from naked lunch in San Francisco, which when you bite into the acme bread the thermal coal flaw, just drips down over the chicken into your mouth. And it's just so good. No. I'm Hassenfeld makes the show love my mom's. Homemade Turkey burgers. So does ominous El Saadi any burger that so smothered and toppings. I don't have to actually taste the beef and Bridget McCarthy. Well, I can't eat hamburgers with a clear conscience anymore because my husband said the single biggest thing we can do to fight climate change is to stop eating. Chief? Thanks, dan. Brit Hanson's been helping this week five guys. But I also love fancy burger Sione Petro's is our intrepid intern buffalo Bella from hip city veg in DC why because it's amazing vegan spicy. And it doesn't feel like it's begin. And as you heard up top of FEMA Shapiro's, the engineer. My favorite burger is the Kirkland signature quarter, pound ground beef hamburger, Patty frozen. Thanks to my pal Amy Pearl for bringing our past conversation back to life today. Let's see. Pencilling since I've had a burger Amy makes a show at WNYC called ten things that scare me check it out. Burgers, scare the mysterious brake master cylinder, but he makes music for our show. Anyway, today explained is produced in association with Stitcher, and we are part of the vox media podcast network. There's one place that's still serving up the meat, right? We have the meats. Thanks to co for supporting the show today. Kiko co is on a mission to empower kids to not just make a project to make a difference. QE co is offering today. Explain listeners the chance to try them out for free to redeem the offer and learn more about their projects for kids of all ages. Go to code dot com slash explained.

Burger King white castle McDonald Amy Pearl Burgers Washington Post Jackson Sean Ramos engineer Joe Kiwi co Robin Carl WNYC Chicago Shapiro vox media Dave
Repetition

Start With This

29:40 min | 11 months ago

Repetition

"They what's up. I hope you're enjoying this podcast. And maybe you're also thinking. Hey I could have a podcast. So what's holding you back Google podcasts. NPR Ex have an awesome series. A free podcasting one videos hosted by me Sean Ramos firm from Fox's Today explained and my fabulous co-host lovey Ajayi from Ranson randomness. and Jesus in July off. You'll get loads of tips on everything from getting started to get your podcast out into the world. Come on tell your story go to P R X dot org slash podcasting one. Oh One to learn how you can do it. You can do it. You can do it start with this podcast featuring night Ville creators Joseph Pink and me. Jeffrey Craner each episode. We discuss a topic. Then give you two assignments something to consume and something to create. Start with this repetition. Kevin Rudd start some you inside inside. You're writing needs a message. Maybe that messages political or moral or funny or satirical. Maybe that messages personal or just weird. I'm not here to tell. Oh you what's a good or bad message. I'm just here to tell you you're writing needs a message conveying. That message is up to you when I read. I like something something indirect like Poetry Metaphor Dream logic magical realism something that keeps my brain aloft. When I watched theater? Or listen to podcasts. I like something adding more direct something that creatures like this. Your writing needs a message and one of my favourite techniques as both a creator and and a listener is repetition centering on a point spiraling out from that point but always circling back to the point preachers and songwriters and performance formats. Poets used this approach regularly. They're writing has a message and they make sure to keep that message. Focus by repeating it. Each iteration is slightly lightly. Different in its velocity in its momentum. Each time that repetition moves the energy forward drives home. The point makes sure their listeners. Don't lose it. because repetition signals importance. Repetition helps memory. Repetition feels like a song. You're writing needs a message and repetition repetition can help. I'm Jeffrey Craner here with Joseph Pink. Let's get going. Hi Joseph. Hi there I really love. Repetitions one of my favorite things to huge especially when I'm writing for voice rather than on paper just because I think there's ways of using percussion vocals or using something thing. That's almost like a song it makes me think of a good song or growing up in Baptist churches. It makes me think of preachers and there was something about driving the momentum in the energy by using using repetition of a moral thought. Yeah repetition is something that definitely you encounter it in different ways almost every form of art. The human brain likes patterns so every form of art I feel like plays with repetition and its own way certainly as you were talking about anyone that performs out loud performance formats poets Peter Artists preachers. You learn very quickly. There's almost a magic power in repetition. It can make anything feel important SOKAIA. Yeah any kind of snake oil salesmen or something like that classic trope or whatever but the idea of you just want to keep repeating the benefits of your should he product or even if you have a good product you wanna keep repeating those benefits. You want something that's memorable something that people say loudon. Yeah if you if you have a product in you telephone it's healthy sound and safe and it does all all of these things and it's also healthy sound and safe and you should buy. Southie sounded safe eventually. No matter what some part of you is going to be like sound healthy sound and safe if two. Yeah those are all three things. I really love she this product but yeah I think those two things are intimately linked in. We're writing the whole point of writing. Anything thing is that we want to tell a story and the only way people are going to keep reading our stories that they feel attached to it in some way and some of that is in they feel connected to the point they feel like the point of your story the message of your story resonates with them. So I sort of broke down the idea of repetition devices into just five major ways in which I use them or I noticed them and so I thought we cover them. If you think of something else that is missing from this feel free to add it. I don't think this is comprehensive so thinking about repetition devices. I'll just say them I'm first. Then we'll go in detail of one is using repetition to review an idea or a plot or concept reviewing seen to for rhythm three to help with comprehension or memorization for for emphasis. Like if at first year old succeed try try again and then five for using it to disoriented displace the reader or listener. Repetition can do that so one talking about using repetition to review an idea I thought immediately of the he said she said Motif I think rush. Amman is everybody's Goto example of telling a story many times for many points of view so that people have something to see see and then see again from a different point of view gives you different analysis of something I mean at this even goes back to like speech one a one. You know the whole idea of. Tell them what you're gonNA tell them. Tell them tell them what you told them. Like in even more basic level this is this is just repetition is a really really good way to make sure people get the point. Whether that's rush. Amman where that's the story repeating over and over the same moments I think also of a fun home. The graphic novel fun home. Yeah yeah which. which has this kind of circular quality where she just circles back over and over these same moments? It's in her relationship with her father till those moments start to have this vast importance they have this like ritualized quality because she just keeps telling the same stories about her her a father and over and over but also yeah like it can be as simple as just you're trying to write Thousand words that delivers a message being sure to be like like. I'm here to tell you about this here. It is. I told you about that. They can be as simple as that. I think about do a lot of cross swords I love crosswords and I do you get into these loops where I will especially you kind of. GET DOWN into one little corner of the crossword and you just can't solve it and then you're left with like four five clues that are unanswered. And you'll spend our Ralston several minutes just staring at all of them being like I know this answer I know this answer and you just keep reviewing it and every time you kind of go through another process of what's another way of thinking about what this adjective the synonym of or something along those lines and I think about shows like movie Groundhog day is a perfect example. Where the protagonist is actually aware of the repetition and they become the audience placeholder for re-examining back characters life? Most recent example. Obviously is Russian doll on Netflix and then the TV series. That I was telling you about the other day. That's on Amazon. Undone is another. One that uses constant repetition repetition for re-analyzing. What's really going on by repeating time over and over? Let's talk about rhythm. I like the musical quality of repetition officially in songs as you know one of my favorite. My one of my favorite country and Western bangers is parked out by the lake by dean summer. Wind if you have a spotify account please look up. Look up parked out by the Lake Dean summer wind and listen very closely to lyrics. Really wonderful it's one of the better lyrics have seen for a popular song in quite a long time. Please immediately immediately goes into that. You know in that song. It's meant to be funny The repetition of just the same the same lyrics over and over. But you know I was thinking i. I thought immediately of the opening of tale of two cities. Because it's the repetition was this and it was that it was the best of times it was the worst of times it was the age of wisdom it that was the age of foolishness. The repetition not only of the dichotomy of two of the items in each sentence but also just repeating that. Sometimes I think like seven or eight times that of the same structure sentence it really gets you into the sway back and forth between it was up and it was down it was left. It was right and it feels feels musical to me when I read that even on the page it feels like there's some bounce. There's some drumbeat happening. Yeah and that I think even made probably intentionally echos one of the more beautiful passage. It's I don't think there's that a lot of translations lose this but the book of Ruth has this really beautiful obita poetry in it in which were is leaving behind the tribe she lived she lived with to join the Israelites and she gives the speech just to the man she's marrying. Is it the MANCHUS marrying or deep mother of I think it's the mother of the man she married. Who then died? I believe that's been a bit since I read the book of Ruth but she gives this beautiful passage. It's like where where you go. I will go where you eat. I will eat where you dwell dwell on. It ends where you die I will. We'll die in there. I will be buried and it's that same. It's that same Siri that rhythmic series in in Hebrew. It actually is even more repetitious. Because this is one of those languages that you can embed parts of the sentence into the word and so that whole passages just a series of paired words where it's it's like you will go is one word and then I will go the other word and it's just those series of paired words down the page kind of sketching out life and it when I have that power without the repetition I mean obviously like this is a fairly well known ideas idea parallel structure which is just repeating repeating the sentence for them. You just did. Yeah but it can be used and some powerful ways. I like the artistic experiment of the Book of Ruth Having been written on an excel spreadsheet. Sort of like to imagine that. That's how they did that if I don't know how to find it for Y'all but you should do some googling and reading Ria some stuff about the linguistics Booker Ruth because it is actually a fascinating. It's very short and it's full of a lot of word. Play and puns and weird bits the poetry that generally doesn't come across well in translation. But it's just it's it's fun to see humans thousands of years ago doing puns. And make you brought up the other point about rhythm that I in repetition that I really love to which is not just the rhythm itself but when you choose to break the rhythm and so in Ruth or you die I will die and there will be buried. You finally get a culmination of that phrase. We finally bring it to your the one of the real benefits benefits. Rhythm as it establishes a pattern for for the listener or the viewer or reader that then when you break it that break provides a lot of power I think about like the disintegration loops that are these short loops of music that gradually fall apart. And it's precisely because you hear that same mm-hmm five second thing literally two hundred times by the time it starts to stack another glitches start to enter into it. They have a lot of power and boy that they they want. If you hadn't heard that loop many times I think just in writing and storytelling you're building up tension and somebody you're building up. Sometimes you're just playing to people's expectations that's right you don't want to always remove what the reader wants But you don't always want to play to what you think your reader once you're telling a story so you have to have a back and forth for those things and part of it is you need this prolonged thing of building up something and then paying it often the actually when we you and I were driving back from New York yesterday and I'm I'm trying to remember which song it was but somebody online somebody online did a remix of it was electric feel GMT. There is a remix mix on twitter that just they just never go to the chorus and so it's just the slowly building song never never pay some which is amazing. It's sounds is profoundly irritating. But yeah there's there's that pay off in that rhythm of building up some kind of momentum and then it just never quite goes anywhere I wanted to talk a little bit about comprehension and memorization. A lot of this. Is I think about this on a on a smaller level. You're not really. It's not very often that as a writer you're trying to as a fiction writer that you're trying to train your your readers your listeners to remember something specifically but I was thinking about you know in welcome tonight bill. We have a character that we refer to constantly as the faceless old woman who secretly lives in your home and then there's the the men who drive crates out in the middle of the certain one is not tall and the other is not short. And it's the repetition of those ideas that kind of create place holders for names. There's something where you have that it gives you. It gives you a way to more profoundly label something than just naming somebody Stephanie or something to that effect it gives you a more detailed. Glimpse at a person's percents renaming. A thing in your own words it creates that more memorable effect. Yeah I mean we do that a lot in Vale with taking simple phrases and then just repeating them Over and over and I don't know if this directly relates to comprehension and memorization but definitely that kind of reputation gives a weight to that phrase that phrase starts to mean something even if it doesn't really yeah but just by the Tenth Eleventh Time we've heard that phrase We start to identify with it. Starts to feel like a part of the identity if whatever we're describing to keep samples from Judaism percent raise is the Passover Seder a phrase. You will hear constantly throughout his throughout a lot of Jewish as you were slaves in the land of Egypt at least in my tuition usually translated in that exact wording you were slaves in the land of Egypt and and that repetition of that phrase not only is it about comprehension. But it's about embedding it in your identity. It's about you repeat it so many times throughout out your life that it becomes this like sense of identity. That part of your identity is at one point you were this and so you should remember that. And so that is the power repeating language the other thing in in repeating that language especially if you can come up with something that's evocative in some way that's memorable feels unique enough not just a cliche or a common phrase but something that feels unique to your story you can bring that back not necessarily just as a naming device but as a as a recall of emotion or a feeling Gina in within the wires in the first season used a phrase in describing one of the characters is having a cloud of dark hair and then We've repeated that phrase a couple of times with other people and it's not to say that they're the same character. It's just simply to to give you the same emotion of that moment. It's to create to send you back. It's just to call back. I was thinking this idea of memorization. I think we're more pops up most is in the mystery genre where you need to you. We need to set clues early on. You need something that when you call it back later. Somebody remembers that you did it. But you can't be obvious about it in the moment you can't just say oh I looked over and I saw a gun that matched the gun that we think was in the murder over on his nightstand. Like that immediately says. Oh this guy's a major suspect you need to do something different like the example I sort of just sketched edged out. I don't know if this is a great mystery or not but you might have something like he might have a describe a crowd on a train platform and you in the process. You might describe lots of different people in the background but one particular man might be extremely late looking and he's looking at his pocket watch and then he's tapping you might right into the text. CLACK clack clack a couple of times the create it's sort of an effect or just a rhythmic effect. But then maybe later in the book when you need to pull back this really random ass character that has no real development. I'm an you need to make the major. Suddenly you can have the protagonist here. The clack Clack clack written out always one word and Italics or something that immediately brings us back to that moment. on the train platform. so that was the repetition that I was thinking of using call backs for memorization. Yeah human brains are so attracted to patterns that we will remember them in a way that we don't remember other things. The next time I wanted to get to was a was emphasis. I think this is where I I use repetition. The most this goes back to the you know preacher background or not me as a preacher. But like listening to fire and brimstone preachers because the thing about fire and brimstone preachers. Here's when you're when you're a kid and you're not there to really discern what is morally right or wrong. You're just there to take in whatever somebody tells you. And they are super convincing people people because of that rhythm because of the energy that they bring to that and when writing for performance I really love bringing on repetition as is a form of emphasis to keep driving home a point to keep coming back to a point keep reiterating that point in more minor ways I you know a lot of the ways of emphasis are very very attractive. You can kind of create that to keep emphasizing to appoint and also. He's handsome dapper. Charming handsome did I say handsome to humor effect. But it's another form of emphasis my question to you though in thinking about emphasis like how do you know when you you push it too far. Can you know if you're being too didactic or too simplistic as and he's very very very handsome. It's a great question because it's one of those ones that it's it's it's it's very difficult to answer a gut feeling question. A lot of it is gut feeling like it's similar to being like. How do you know when a melody you're writing for for a song is good? The answer is you've heard a lot of melodies and you've written a lot of melodies near like this one feels good but it's really hard to be in technical terms. Here's why why this particular melody. I'm writing catchy and I used that example Because there is as you say a lot of repetition is about musicality there is a huge. There's a huge connection between any sort of linguistic repetition and music. Music is generally repetitious music. That never repeats kind. kind of generally sounds awful to us. General there's a reason that there's generally a first melody that comes up a bunch of times in a coronel that comes up with a bunch of times and it's because it's built around that repetition and so I feel like it's a lot of the same gut level thing of does it sing for you. If you say it out loud saying out loud would probably help but it doesn't feel like it has some rhythm and if you're at a point where like I don't know I don't know if it does that's a fair point but that's probably just means you need to read and listen to a lot more stuff and when you hear someone repeat in a way that seems good to you you don't even have to dissect it but you should like listen to it a few times and be like okay. What are they doing here like? Like what am I feeling and just try to get a sense of that feeling so that when you write it yourself and you read it out loud you can be like. Yeah this feels. That has that kind of that. Same feeling. I was thinking about momentum using specially the first course verse Chorus Bridge Type Structure Especially pop music but there is usually usually Ryan songs like that. There's a key change usually on the second iteration or third iteration of something which creates momentum creeks of vector creates direction. Four something to go and even if the words are the exact same. The speaker of the singer has changed their tone in some way. And I think about that in writing to as in if I were to repeat the same phrase raise again where the second and third and fourth and Fifth Times I say it where am I in my feelings at that point so the reader. Where do I want them to be in their feelings? Is that an increase in urgency throughout like helped me. I'm injured and then other things happened helped me injured helped me I'm injured. There's an urgency that bills and and sometimes it could just be a thing where you say I love you very much and other things happening I love you very much. And then by the eighth or ninth time somebody said it. It's lost a lot of the feeling because of the things things that have happened. In between US I love you very much and you no longer feel bad so having a direction or momentum is something I feel like from my own writing always sort of looking for to make sure that it's repeating to to a place finally start about displacement or disorienting the listener or the reader using music against again again. I think about dance music modern dance. I think there's just kind of a running gag that most modern dancers have done a piece to either Steve Reich or Phillip Glass at some point in time and the Common Joko about the repetition of Phillip Glass Music. But the thing about those is that we don't really experience Steve Reich in terms of in terms of course verse chorus verse or in terms of Even Fraser keys or even immediate feeling or sensation. Like if you just hear a couple of seconds kinds of of Steve Reich or Phillip Glass it may not evoke anything immediately other than irritation. If it's something you're not used to over time there's like a slow evolution in in the music that these guys make and the repetition of what they're doing and it's a much slower burn and over time you realize. Wow I have moved moved and I haven't realized I've moved. There's something negative about it. Something trance-like about those music is about their music. And I think that's where you use repetition to lull somebody into something else. You disoriented their sense of time and their sense of place yet bringing list to language we've talked about how when you're writing language you kind of especially for the page But also for performance you sort of set the timeframe using the language that you can stretch and compress. It's time you can do this literally by writing a character being like Bob Walk into the store or ten years later by Bob would die but today Bob is in the store and you kind of have jumped back and forth that way but you can also yeah you. If you have this strange repetition language you can start to stretch it out or compress it. Depending on how the repetition is done but you can kind of affect the sense of time for the person experiencing language. Yeah I think one of the best simples in in in writing words is really just in the form of like mantras right like when you have you have a mantra. It actually physically affects where you you are mantras and breathing exercises. We use a lot in a lot of meditative exercises to help to help. Bring your body to some level of calm or some level of the concentration of something to that effect and is another way of slowing time down going back to the Russian doll example. There is a disorienting nature to the repetition repetition early on in that. Show when you first realize what's happening in May take the second or third iteration to get what's going on and to see how everything everything has changed in between and I. I definitely found the show delightfully disorienting in that way. to to use that repetition to change your expectations nations very subtly constantly. Yeah you mentioned like Mantras and and this is definitely a technique used. I think a lot in in religious texts to to bring us one final time to Judaism I think about the prayer cold neater which is a prayer done on the night of young Kapoor. It's literally the services named after cold natured. So it's the central prayer of what is arguably the central holiday of Judaism. It's done three times in full traditionally me and it is a long prayer and it takes a while to do it three times it this way of kind of setting that parasite giving get power is is being. We're going to carve out the time to do this language three times in full. It's it's it kind of hits a lot of the points we've talked about. Got In that it sets those words aside makes them feel more and more important the more time you carve out to to listen to those words over and over Let's let's take a break week and then after that break we will come back and we will give you. Your assignments sounds great And we are back. Let's give you some assignments first to consume. So you're consume mm assignment is the podcast. Song exploded specifically song exploded episode twenty eight songs. Splitter is a podcast that every episode picks apart a different Song looking at Hallett was written in house recorded in this case. It is the song the commander thinks allowed by the band. The long winters they talk with John on Roderick. Who is the person wrote and saying the song? It is a beautiful episode. I tend to when I'm recommending people song exploded. This is the opposite. I played them. And it uses repetition and a couple of different fascinating ways one is musically. There is a story about how the drum track was done for. That song that involves volve using repetition is fascinating and kind of mind blowing technical way. So that's the technical musical aspect of repetition and then there is this key moment when John Discusses repeated lyric that he wrote in his decision on why he wrote it that way and why he repeated it. It's it's a heartbreaking episode and that that repetition of that one phrase is really the heart of why it is heartbreaking upset. It's fantastic episode. If you haven't heard it already I'm very excited for you. So this is your create. What should come up with a three to ten word phrase? No more no less brief and it doesn't matter the content of it. Don't worry about whatever your story or he's GonNa be just finding a phrase actually that we do this all the time. Just find something that sounds good to you and doesn't sound like a phrase that maybe even exists in the world right now it could be weird or could be make make total sense. Just get a phrase written down. Don't think too long on it. Now you're GonNa read it two hundred word story it can be monologue a story a poem song if you want. If that's sure thing and want you to use that exact phrase at least five times you can fit it in more. That's great it's only two hundred word story but see what you can. Do you go for more if you can manage it and as you use it I want you to concentrate on each iterations. Meaning when you repeat that exact phrase. What does the second iteration do do the I did not? Where are you in the story? Now when you're repeating what is the fifth iteration. Do the third did not what a what is the movement of that repetition Asian. Does it. Move your story forward. Does it emphasize your point. Does it create a lull rhythm a disorienting nature for the reader is building on some feeling or idea. Just think think about what those repetitions are. Don't worry too much about how detailed your story is. or how will you land it. Just think about the repetition what that's doing to your two hundred word story. So those are your assignments have fun with those things. Have a great time with those things. Have a blast with those things and that's all for this episode but your assignment is just beginning head on over to start with this podcast dot com to join our membership community becoming becoming a member allows you to share your science with other listeners. Talk about what's sparking creativity and find future collaborators. Plus you'll be able to ask follow up questions about this and future episodes and gain exclusive access to episodes where we answer those questions. Membership is just five dollars. That's only two jumped turnstiles on the MTA MTA. We can't wait to see what you're working on. Start with this as a production of nightmare presents. It's produced by Julia. Melfi editing by grant Stewart mixing by Vincent Cascione on theme song by Josephine. If you'd like your own cover of the theme song featured on the show analysis start with this at night bill presents dot com or posted on our member message Ford. All of their music is by caged. Animals find more caged animals dot net very special. Thanks to Adam and Christie pressman checkout knightdale presents dot com for more information about this show and all of our other shows. Thank you for listening all right and we will leave you with this. It's the one of the more popular inspirational phrases that we all know in love which is if at first you don't succeed. Try Try try. Try Try try. Try Try try again. Thank you thank you. This is tyler. He's veteran of the Marines guy. Looked up like how long does it take to transition. What happens when someone does transition and so I thought maybe it would be better if trans people weren't able to serve but yeah I guess they just have a lot of questions and this is maddy? She is also a veteran of marines. I served for sixteen years in the Military Tehri. So I haven't my heart for the Marines is right next to the place where I feel in my core that. I'm trans Hi Mattie conversations with people who hate me available wherever. You love listening to podcasts. ex.

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The BlowHole Episode 6: Return of the Mediocre Dolphins

The Phinsider

1:13:23 hr | 2 years ago

The BlowHole Episode 6: Return of the Mediocre Dolphins

"What if all you're breaking news alerts had a voice what would that sound like it would sound like today? Explain its daily news podcast from vox. I'm Sean Ramos grim every day my team, and I take one essential news story, politics, two movies sports science, and we break it down into twenty minute episodes. Perfect for your ride home subscribed today. Explain on apple podcasts or wherever you listen from Stitcher, and the vox media podcast network. It's Monday night party. And you're listening to the blowhole on Finsider radio with finkle and Einhorn coming even earlier this week for no good reason as usual Finkel nine hundred or nowhere to be found. So once again, I James radio and my co host rob cast are admirably taking the reins. It's jets week. And we have a special jets correspondent joining us tonight to argue over which team is worse. The jets are the dolphins. How does that sound rub? Well, we have a better record. So obviously, the jets are worse. Have you seen this team? Play. Jets are worse. The last ten quarters of footfall. Jets are worse. We have Brock Osweiler at quarterback. I'm just standing no defense. I'm just sitting in a corner huddled saying over and over the jets are worse. The jets are word. Is it time to start talking about plan for a better draft pick? What do you think you think this season still salvageable? Yes. Well, what do you mean by salvageable? Do you mean playoffs playoffs? Well, yeah. I mean, if you can't make the playoffs and when he planned for draft picks. Right. So I posed the question again. Oh, turn that off. I don't wanna watch that. So what do you what do you think? What do we have to play for like, what's what's reasonable here? And we're not gonna we're not going to get to into our third quarter predictions for this team because I'm too mad about Thursday. Well, we we're going to use the time to talk to our jets correspondent a jet fan. So we'll save that for next week. But I did I did look at it briefly. So I I do I do think we're looking more of an eight eight season at this point. I'm, you know, a little more realistic and less of an optimist, I suppose, but I don't see how this team wins anymore games. If it plays defense like this. Oh, I agree with that. I just some part of me feels like they can fix it something their defense didn't play that poorly in the beginning of the season. The last ten quarters. They've been the worst the worst defense in football for the last ten quarters. That's like two and a half dollars. That's that's that's a substantial amount of time. But it's not a lot of money fair. Fair point. I guess were there any positives for Monday from Thursday night. I mean. I thought the offense was okay Parker. Was parker. Did would I had a feeling like he might actually do if you need a guy to catch a ball that kareem's out of Jiechi playing? Well before that he played great played great. He played. Well before that there was some good calls. Osweiler started to look like us wiler. I mean, you didn't. Well, actually, he did throw one really bad interception. He didn't connect on the deep. He had. He had a he had a wide open. Parker. He didn't connect on those. You know, he threw some much better passes before. Honestly gave you the best. We could hope for was like the bears game and played like he he doesn't. He's not the reason we lost. It doesn't matter who your quarterback is the you're not gonna win when your defense is playing like that. And I said that after the lines and he didn't. And he didn't he wasn't. Yeah. He's he's Oswal. He's not he's not a savior or anything. But he did. He did what you want your backup to do. He's fine. I think this offense is eighty percent with him in to where it could be with Tanna hill. A healthy healthy hill. And honestly, I don't even know if we've seen it at one hundred percent with tannehill. Anyway. So that's he's not a problem. I mean, but but I'd like to see tannahill back. It doesn't look like the shoulder is going to be strong enough to play against the jets. But again, if you you you shouldn't need him to beat the jets no talking about the defense. Again, the defensive line was completely absent that made the linebackers. Look even worse. And then the secondary was blowing coverages all night long. And they've they've been they've been doing that even when they play well, they would blow a few coverages here or there and that was worrisome, and then it truly exploded like guys just just you could see a pre snap. So many times. There's just like there's that pointing like who's got him bub-bubba. And like, it doesn't seem like they're ready or they know what what they're supposed that like they're not on the same page. And then it turns out, you know, you have a guy running all by himself. Somebody lets him go into coverage. That's not behind him is part of that carryover. Do you think from the from the lions week and not having enough time to prepare? And and just you know, they seem on their heels the entire the entire lions game. And then kind of translated into into this game. Maybe I mean, I I mean they had no time to prepare. I'm not making excuses for them either on it. Yeah. They had no time to prepare an obviously, they probably spent whatever time they did working in a new offense basically without having stills are Wilson like and being down to just two guys that have played regularly and working Parker back into the mix. So I'm sure that's that was most of the coaches. Head coach was probably the offensive head coach is working with the offense of their with the offensive team there. And I think the defensive coaches took the week off I need to to quantify this you've seen. A bears team light them up for the second half of that bears game. Then they went and they played the patriot the bears when played the patriots scored a decent amount of points. So it looked like their offense was actually. Okay. But then you saw the lions light us up and then go home and play the Seahawks. Just get absolutely shut down. And now we just we just got gashed by Texans team that up until this point was not a very good offensive football team. And they looked like well, they're they're show on turf they've been getting better week to week. They're talented didn't even touch to Sean. Offense one of the worst offensive line. Their offensive line is terrible. Their skill positions are pretty darn good. You know Watson Hopkins fuller. That's that's pretty good and Miller is a capable running back. But they've played nothing. Nothing. Like what they've done nothing like what they showed against against us on Thursday all year. You haven't they because they're woken up, man. They're ready to go. I told you I'm heavily invested in and the Texans. I I started out in a lot of what a lot of leads. I guess we'll see they have the Broncos this week. So I guess we'll get another look we'll get a chance to see you know, if they're truly that good. Or if really if this defense is just is just that bad. I mean, well, the defense right now is that bad. I think it's it's fixable. Because so many of those was scheme so many of those guys running by themselves that wasn't it wasn't. It wasn't guys getting beaten. It was guys in the wrong place. That's fixable. I don't know if we fix it. But it's fixable. Well, they're also not getting into the quarterback. Like, there's no there's no pass rush. There's absolutely no, no pressure. And that's a that was a bad offense of line that that's a bad offensive line. We made them run a little bit. And and he in the first half a little a little but not much not enough and the guys were out of their gaps. I mean, Lamar Miller's gashing them. He hasn't really been that great this year. He was good against the Jaguars. He had a decent game. He wasn't busing sixty. I runs and offensive line. So you know, he hasn't had the holes. These these seem to figure it out when they needed to. And maybe you're right. Maybe we just can't play on Thursdays. Well, that's part of it. I think but I mean, it's not part of it come on. That's not a thing. I really don't know. What's happened enough? It's happened the last, you know, we've also been crushed on Sundays too. Yeah. No, that's true. But not every Sunday every Thursday, but Thursday, they tend to try to put a good team with at least one good team on the dolphins. Have not been a good team in a while. So we're usually the bad of the two teams on playing on Thursday. Okay. Right. So you wanna play like that? Hey, I got to cling to something fair enough. Anything else of note? I mean, Parker was good. I think grant looks like he can be a decent fill in for. We. We said that last week. He's he's a he's a he's a Wilson light. He's he's built in that. He's built in that mold. Yeah. He's not. You know Wilson is is better at it. But grant is good at it. Amendola amendola Ndola. That. I mean, that's the sort of the thing. I mean, the injuries are terrible. But each guy had had a version, you know, the the other players to step up our of the right mold to fit like we don't have somebody who could be amendola if he went down, but you know, Parker can stretch a field the way still stretched a field. Grant can take it and run the way Wilson can take it and run obviously, not the first choices because those because they didn't start the season in those roles, but they can do those roles. This is true. I guess it is really early in the week. So we're not gonna have any kind of injury inside as to who's going to be playing on Sunday. It looks like Bronx probably going to be playing. We're gonna have another week of Brock Tober fest. Stills most likely out if I had to guess just based off of what I was hearing last week. I don't think there's too early in the week to get beat on that did feel like it was a multi week the injury. I don't I'm looking right now as I speak. I do not believe there's has been anything to come out on that the latest news. I see is. It's just not a long-term concern. But. Here's a shot to play. I need another drink. Do you wanna talk about the jets leading up into into calling our guest? So the jets are my least favorite team in the NFL. I grew up in New York in the New York southern New York area where the jets and giants ruled among most fans, and I was a dolphin fan in that sea of green, and I don't like them. I don't like them at all. But most people don't I think we can beat them. I hope we can beat them. Because if we can't beat them, we really can't beat anybody this except the bills people talked about last week. I was kind of an important game. It was an important game. Because the winner of that of the winner of last Thursday's game we were both foreign three becomes five and three in a good position right for play offs. And all that stuff. Even though it's way too early to think about playoffs with the dolphins. Especially with the second half schedule. We've got. Yeah. But this one this one this to me is is as much of a must-win games you can have in week nine. Oh, yeah. Because you you this is one of those teams you have to be your at home. You've already beat them on the road. And you're a better team. You have a better record the two bills games in this jets games. Like, we have to have those three we have to have those three to get to seven and then. And then we have to beat some teams that are probably better than us to get to eight or nine wins and the playoffs. Really? Don't seem possible at this point. Yeah. No, I'm I'm I'm with you there next week. We'll get more into our q three. But this week. We do have a have guessed his name is Mike are Giulio. He is a New York jet fan who. But he's a great guy. Yeah. He's he's one of my really good friends. He actually he plays drums for a band called grey market here in the area who are one of the better local bands that I would say, actually, they're my favorite local bands. So thanks a lot. Yes. Sorry, rob. I do like I like your band sue. But no. But gray market is fantastic. Honestly, go just go like Google at thing gray market as the band. It's it's hard to explain they're like, they're it's it's a great combination of everything. Yeah. And their live shows are fantastic. They are. It's just it's two guys. Mike plays drums, and then you have caves there. Lead singer. He plays guitar and sings, and they have a lot of electric stuff that they do. But it's a it's a lot of fun. Yes. Fantastic. All right. So let's see what happens push this button. All right. I don't know if there's gonna work. We'll see. It work last time. Hello. Hey, mike. Can you hear us? Yes, sir. All right. Welcome to the blowhole. It worked on the first try. Why for you record it? We are recording live, but we posted after we get done recording. So so so we we are we are clean podcast. But if you drop some F bombs, we can take him out. I I appreciate that. Warning. I was going to ask up front. I am a very animated individual. So I will keep that in mind. Excellent. Thanks, mike. All right. So we just got done letting our listeners know how disappointed we were in the dolphins performance on Thursday. Did you happen to catch any of the dolphins game last Thursday? I did not know you didn't miss anything. Well, I guess it would have been really nice for you to watch that. No, they got they got absolutely murdered and thirty fence looked terrible. So that's been. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yep. You know, we're talking about. So that Jobe, you know, something to look forward to for your young quarterback this week to feast on our terrible terrible defense. I don't I don't know. We took care of the bears yesterday. We did beat the bears. Sure did shirt if so what are you? What are you feeling about the jets this year, Mike? Well, you know, it's one of those things that is a little bit Faren because I think that everybody is pretty confident in Sam and the pick and his performance and the week he's looked so there's this really unfamiliar twinge of hope and this light at the end of the tunnel. And that's all really exciting problem is after what seems to be what will say underwhelming set of draft classes, we would really like to see him put in a more ideal situation. So that has people kind of feeling impatient. It's been four years since the regime took over and the roster today stay for Sam is not better than when he took over or what they took over I say, so that's kind of this this. Is knowing issue. So it's you know, kind of a coin flip. So we can we can see the hope there. And and and that is all really exciting. But. Remarkably we're still talking about doing need to clean house. I'd agree. I'd agree with all of that. Do you think it was kind of you guys got kind of setback by that one year where you you guys played? Well, and Fitzpatrick won all those games where you guys you might have thought that that was a good team to build around and ended up not being a good team to kind of set you back like a year. I guess man still frustrating, right? It's like you could see that. There was a plan. And then this unexpected you left left turn at nowhere. And it's like how is this happening? And how is it happening with this guy? You know what I mean every even looking at him in Tampa. Even like, I'm watching what's his Patrick is doing into habits allow me to warn you. Please heed my warning. And and it doesn't matter. They've they've bench Winston today. And he's going to be starting Fitzpatrick's wouldn't be starting. And so, yeah, I mean, it was just one of those things where it's you know, you feel the hype and you get excited and you just want to get behind your payments for team. Who knows maybe it's Cinderella thing. But it comes crashing back down to earth. And you know, ultimately what everybody felt the original plan needed to be and should have been executed. It was is so yeah, it's one of those things I mean to to be fair. Fitzpatrick has always been Fitzpatrick. He's always been flashes of brilliance followed by complete utter digesting of pick six year. It's heartbreaking because he's like, I'm most likeable guy. And he's really he's a riot. You know to the press he's a riot teammates love and grain locker room. It's like if only people if only teams could find a way to relegate him to that to that bag of role and never get him into the starting role. It would be probably an an easier story when we apply look back on his career. But it, you know, it's always going to have these except that when he threw seven interceptions in one game like gonna come back Chica new. He's the only quarterback to ever throw six touchdowns in a game. And also have a game with six plus interceptions. Crazy leak, man. That's do. I tell you though, you know, not not that the parallels are the same. But you know, watching. These talented quarterbacks Mahomes and the Rogers the guys who get to sit and watch a good quarterback. I don't know. But you know, maybe it wouldn't have been terrible for the jets to have fits Fitz. Fitzpatrick starting this year and having darnold just sitting and watching you have a Fitzpatrick already blown up his spot there because he wanted so much money and then played so poorly after they gave him the one year deal that there really wasn't anything that you'd get through. So I never really subscribed to that. I didn't really subscribe to, you know, the new kid has to sit back and learn I always thought that if if the guy if the kid has the tools, and he's got the wherewithal, and he's got the mind to process the game at a reasonably fast paced, you know, understanding that the NFL level is going to be much faster. But if he can do those things then get him out there like a little bit of a project that he's a little role. I've been yelled. Yeah. I could see that. But when you're talking about guys who are drafting and not out of necessity. You know at the top, you know, once you three four five six picks these guys. They should be ready to you know, sort of take their legs. And again, as I said with the caveat that obviously quarterback is the biggest reach anybody ever makes draft and sometimes overdraft quarterbacks that's to be understood. But when you're talking about like, the top guys were taken, I don't I don't think they need to actually that's a great point. It's a little bit of a red herring because the team's where guys can sit. It's because they're good teams there guys who fell in the draft or short later. They're not required to be the savior of terrible team. So they they sit they get to learn how to how to watch film how to be in a meeting and all of that. And then they inherit a very good team that you know, that didn't pick for in the top five of the draft. So that also helps that a lot and the way the NFL structured right now is if you get you draft a quarterback high, and you don't have to pay them that much for that first rookie contract, and that gives you all those those years of flexibility within the salary cap you want that kind of play right away. And you wanna know you don't you don't have as much time to waste. Wait for them to develop you need them to get in there and play right away. And you kind of seen what what has happened with you sell. Russell Wilson and the Seahawks win a Super Bowl within his first three years. Carson Wentz last year. Even though he died in the actual Super Bowl was a big reason why the model that's what the bears are trying to do their like Rams right now. Yeah. And the Rams right now, they're like, the that's why the spending all their money on all the other positions until they have to pay Goff twenty million dollars a year. And they can't spend all that money on a second defensive tackle. I think it is the bears going to have this Ben twenty million dollars to keep Trubisky. God, I hope so. Ice cold, man. Nobody you definitely Ryan. Because you I mean that's bringing of Tampa again. But you know, there's just at the front of my brain, you know, when you you've got to play these guys because you have to know what the investment is. Because you have to know, you know, jobs are won and lost in in this league in three years. You know, so you know, Winston's in a contract year. I know that he was not looking great. And I know that he was out for another suspension. But it's like, I don't really care how well Fitzpatrick's playing. I need to know what this kid's paycheck is going to be on. This benching essentially means is gonna give them kind is gonna come at a discount. So. Yeah, exactly. Well, and this is this is one of those things as if if Dirk cutters playing for the long haul like if he if he's playing for his job he's playing Fitzpatrick because he gives them a better chance to win right now. But the terrible situation is an organization need to know what they have in Winston. They need to play out the string and say is this guy we are going to give money to or not. He's thrown ten picks and. In less than three games. I think they know what they have with right now when you get to sit behind a guy like Fitzpatrick, you got to learn a finger to whatever the thing and the and the jets were in this exact situation with rookie sitting while, you know, someone else by whether mccown or it was or as Patrick, but it's like look I've got eleven years of tape on Fitzpatrick. I know what I have played the kid. I don't like I know like I said wins and losses in guys are playing for their jobs. I'm sorry. We this is the investment we invested on the kid play the cat. It'd be fair. Those rookie quarterback suggests have were like Christian hackenberg. And guys like Gino Smith and g. Mark sanchez. Absolutely, right. We'll both right. So so again, you get into this catch twenty two right? So with Martinez like, okay? Well, what did we have this very small little exciting run two times in a row? It's like, okay. And then you know comes crashing down to earth. But you can also correlate that with some of the other some of the other personnel decisions that were made after the fact with mccown if it's Patrick it's like, okay? Well, guess what? The team is. Now, you know, three and six. Get the kit and let him get his routes over. We're not going to the poor knock on the playoffs. Call today. You know, see what you have in the investment and from what I can tell he's played pretty well. I mean darnold from what I've seen. He's had a good start. But the last the last few games have been have. I mean, that's the bears defense even without MAC is still a good defense. But so and so Mike what what's your feeling on on how SAM's been doing this year through the first half? Yeah. Sure. I'm well. Let me I'll just preface with the the obvious caveat that it's like rookie quarterback. Okay. So you know, every single every single review of every single one is his performances is for rookie quarterback. You know what I mean? So let's put that up. Right. He had his first three NFL pro games in eleven days. He faced two of the best defense in the league in the in the Vikings and the and the Jaguars, you know, in in this very brief stretch overall, total Jansher still good back. Then right, right. Yep. And they weren't yet. Right. So so the thing with darnold is we still see him going through his reads. We see him making progress in where he was struggling. So for example in the first two games. He was still trying to force every throw doing his best like Brett farve. I'm sorry. Former jet hall of fame quarterback Breitbart. Right. And then by games three and four you saw him throwing that ball away as opposed to taking this acts or throwing an interception in in terms of his decision making you can see. Okay. He kind of getting a little bit of a feel for the game. We can see that. He kinda has an idea who has go to Hans receivers are. But then the receiver started getting banged up. We saw in the first two and three games have trouble at the long ball by the time the third and fourth and fifth games came along. You know, he's throwing dimes to Robbie Anderson in the in the back end, you know, what I mean back the end zone. So we can you know, even in the short term, you can see progress. So I don't I don't think that it's a question of is he going to be good. It's a question of how good is he going to be? And I think fans outside of the people that don't follow the jets don't realize, you know, how much of a security blanket a noon while was for him. And that him going down did a lot. And they're all we know they have anything. They're like they don't have. I mean. Outside of outside of darnold and now Anderson's hurt. And he's any obviously he hasn't looked the same as he did last year. The running game is is not great. They have a decent running game is good. They've the they've got two good running backs, and they will. Have one but mcknight's should come back and in a couple extra couple, actually, I don't know when he's coming back, but he's supposed to come back this year. And honestly, they were they were the talk was that we're gonna cut Powell because of night, and then when he got hurt, but, but honestly didn't matter who it was, you know, whether it's Crowell or Blau Powell jet so much. Well, I need running backs and fantasies investment research. You're a little bit here. I'm I'm I'm getting the vapors. Okay. So. Yeah. I mean, the deal is that you know, you kind of look at every or any rookie quarterback in part of that development. And part of part of what the story is on. That is going to be what kind of position did they get put into right? So you have a guy like Mahomes. It was like wait a second. You're telling me that I have a killer run game added killer. Oh line until receivers. Okay. Well, I'm going to let it go by right? And then you have others like will which is more often than not they're going to crap team with you know, who expected to be the savior, and it's gonna be a little while. So. For the dolphins. I mean, really now the Powell's done. So you won't have to deal with him Johnson. The number one corners out Quincy is the number one receivers out you really have an advantage or an opportunity rather to to take on this game. If you can stop for the dolphins if you can stop the run game, especially up the middle because they're jets for some reason really don't really go for the edge and the end around. I don't know. We'll never know the interior line for the jets offensively is a problem. The center is also injured long his hand as a finger injury. People literally having trouble like snapping the ball. So take advantage of that. But yeah, the dolphin. Yeah. Yeah. So often can stuff the run you are going to put yourself in a better position to succeed for sure. Well, that's good to know. I feel a little bit better about Sunday. So I wanted to kind of hop. Let's let's hop in the time machine and go back to two week too. So we have the one annot Miami Dolphins traveling up to New York to play the one in New York Jets the hottest team in the NFL. Let's look. Let's look. Did they really did? And both teams actually looked. I mean, I thought that there was there was hope for both teams at the time and the dolphins just they jumped all over them in that game. And then the jets played a pretty good second half and made it interesting, and it was did come down to like the second to last possession. When the dolphins got the ball. And we're able to run the clock out. But it was I mean, it was it was a good game. It looked like both teams were on the up. We've both teams have gone through quite a few injuries. Just as you touched on. And now now we're beat up. I don't know if you knew this about the dolphins. But in the last ten quarters of football they've given up over one hundred points. I didn't know that they're getting their defense has looked absolutely awful. And if you like to run right up the middle. That's something. We're very very bad at stopping. So. That's really. Yeah. We've well we've been awful like absolutely terrible in the last ten quarters. Yeah. So so I'm I'm pretty nervous about this game is a dolphin fan. I don't know, rob. How are you feeling about this game? I am mildly optimistic because. Well, we have to we have to win this game. If the if we're going to do anything this season, right and Mike. I'm sorry. But it is the jets. I mean, no, no, I understand. It's funny because both fan bases seemed to be like, oh, man. This this next game just often vets the turning point I've seen by both Ben basis talking about it. And I I don't really believe in that sort of thing. But I I didn't even think it's funny. They're both ended to know. Right. Yeah. Because we we do we do the cardinal sin of looking ahead. And if you know if we if we can't win we have to win the two bills games in this jets games. Just to even pretend like we're going to have a shot to be five hundred to get Nate. Right. If we don't win these games. The dolphins. Second half is insane. We have like it's like Vikings Packers. Jags, you know past the Jags are bad now, though. But. Yeah. Yeah. It's yeah. It's it's a crazy football crazy, man. I mean, injuries happen. And then these guys they get they get so discouraged. I think more than any sport you'll ever see. It's because I think the games there's not as many games. So there's each one is so important when you lose one Hughley shifts, it really shifts that mood in that shifts that locker room and you're seeing the Jags just completely fall apart. So what's your confidence in the in the in the jets this Sunday? I don't think the jets will win. But I think that you know, you'll probably see them fired up a little bit. I think that they're starting. As I mentioned earlier, they're they're starting to little bit of heat on the front office and the division game. And there was a poor. But well, what what we would consider a poor showing against the dolphins last time. And it's like, you know, we've really got to see some kind of halftime adjustments. We've got to see we've got to see a fire coming out of these guys because you know, now, it's two in a row. You know, we've got to see some kind of creativity on the offense, even though, you know, people say like, oh, well, there's no Tyler. Well, what do you expect the offense to do? I hear that a lot. Actually, I hear that. I'm on your I was reading your Espy nation side a little bit earlier. And it's really fun that you see the same exact stuff from. It's like, it's always the circular conversation. Well, it's like, well, there's no town. So what are you spike? The coaches do. Well, the GM's for the talents like, well, the GM and the culture hand in hand. But it's always like in the circle. But it always drafting always the NFL so different than like, you know, something like basketball where talent could win out. Like, it is it is so much coaching. You know teams like like the patriots that you know, they they haven't hit on a draft pick. And I can't remember the last time they hit on a draft pick since maybe Brady was the last one, and yet they still plug it and they plug in guys and it works. My granted. Right. Have talent right by but they also find a way to make it work. And they also cheat. And they cheat right treating. Yeah. The cheating. So don't forget ever. Never never never forever. So all right, Mike. So let's go I'm interested in hearing. So give me a little bit of a background on your on your jets fandom, how long how long have you been a jets fan and just it's it's been awful being a dolphins fan. But how awful hasn't been being jets fan. Well, actually. I'm a little bit more fortunate than you are I I was born into a family that was kinda split my brother's like a giants fan, but he was always a big sports guy. And I was always a music guy. So I never really cared. I just needed that. I was going to be a jets fan because my father was the jets fan, and I like to work for the dog. And I from growing up peripherally. I just knew that the jets were always the underdog. I didn't really get into the jets until like the first year Rex Ryan. So for that it was like, whoa. Look at this thing. And now the jets are coming on strong and the whole league was taken by surprise. And suddenly the jets were front page news. And you know, they they had the backpack AFC championship games. And and again like to have this kind of notoriety around the jets out after so long in the doldrums was like really exciting. And then the whole thing just sort of steadily crash. So for me, you know, it hasn't been all that painful except for like that like this middle section where it's been like poor draft after draft effort failed quarterback experiment after all a glimpse of fits. And then another kind of. Fail quarterback experiment. And so now we have this opportunity, which it's still only an opportunity to do something and make some noise, but it really depends on who's in the front office. And it's it's been hard to kind of look around at different teams and how they doing and how how they draft and all that stuff because you just never know what's going to happen. Like, I I actually forgot entirely by the way that trader Mike was now in your front office going. She was you know, he was just pissing away draft picks for big name splash players for so many years at the jets, and it just devastated our draft license because we had no picks for so long. Anyway. So I guess, you know, but the short answer is it's been, you know, okay. A little bit painful, but I'm very aware of the history. And why the same old jets thing is the thing. And you know, gangrene is a thing. And you know, I guess that. But I I've been a little bit lucky because I'm late to the party. So that's good. I I was afraid you either. Did something truly evil in a past life or or ran over some like gypsy woman's kid. Yeah. No. I I appreciate that. I do appreciate. I mean, I I am fully aware that the jets passed up on Marino. I'm fully aware that they passed up on them sap, you, you know, I like, I know about the history a little bit. I'm just like us. Remember that? That kind of thing. Yeah. So I did I was actually I did a little bit more diving into the history. So like in like the years that I've been a sports fan. So my my earliest memory is my earliest memory is the nine hundred eighty four Miami Dolphins Super Bowl against the San Francisco forty Niners in which they were. Absolutely murdered. Wow. You're old. Wow. You're really in it. All right. No, no, man. That yet that's loyalty. And that matters. That's why. From that time to this time right now both the dolphins. And the jets have not made any more Super Bowls. And in that time span the dolphins. And the jets have played in three AM C championship games each. So that's so yeah, we're we're both we're long suffering fan bases. And they do they not like, we're not. We haven't been good. Neither team has been that like real good. And in a very long time. And I found it really funny. How much the two fan bases hate each other like just giving like they're they're like I feel like we hate the jets more than the patriots. And I don't know if the jets the dolphins fans as much as they hit the patriots. But I know that that's for us. Like, you guys are like our main our main foil like we don't even really like we hate the patriots. But yeah, I think it's because the patriots warrant like this, you know, evil until relatively recently like from for more many more years it was it was the jets in the dolphins. I spoke to you about this once in the past. It's like when I was a kid or by the time. I was a jets fan item really have any. Exposure to that rivalry. So I don't really care because neither has been a threat to the other. So hardcore jazz fans. Hey the dolphins. But I just really want. The patriots all like implode. I hate the pair. That's more than frankly any team in all sports. It's really to me. Yeah. That's fair. All right. Let's get into predictions for Sunday. Rob would you like to go? I I would love to go. I all right. I predict for what's the line on this game. I forgot to look it up. I haven't even it's probably I think it's just three the regular home already. I don't know what the under over is. But I don't care because the dolphins are going to win this game. Twenty four to nineteen. Yeah. They're gonna hold the jets in nineteen points. Yes. Okay. All right, Mike, I'm gonna pass the ball prediction for Sunday. I think the dolphins win twenty one fourteen who nice. I hope that's the case. All right. Well, I guess I'm going to be the black sheep here. I'm gonna say jets thirty one Miami. Don't twenty one out of my house. This guy, can you? How can you bet on this team right now? Like, are you serious spending? We're predicting that that's the same Millwood's. Not a bet is you believe your prediction so much you will put money behind it. I guess that's fair. But I bought you put money on the dog pointing though he's got a point though. I mean handle it is the as the dolphins hasn't been four in a row. They beat the bears. They they've only lost two in a row. Yeah. We went. We started three, you know, then to three and one four and one and then lost the next three. But they gave up twenty eight points in the second half to the bears. Okay. So I will with with all due respect. I will say that. I mean the dolphins. Are there certainly an impostor team? Do I mean, nobody thinks the jets or anything, but people seem to think that the dolphins or something? And I think they're going anywhere. I can see the dolphins winning this game thinking that they're back on track and going back to reality. Again. I think but I think. The back to reality next week. They actually go to Green Bay to see if to see if Aaron Rodgers can score one hundred points in a game. Yeah. Yeah. It's not gonna be. It's it's it's not looking good for the Miami. Dolphins. Can I just say anecdotally? Well, really, I I should say perfectly that booger McFarland is the worst announcer actively working calling game called card. I'm shocked that he that he got onto the to national. I mean, he was a local host here for a while. And I remember that and I believe that personal. The one game was a one time thing. And then they kept seeing him on Monday night football. And it was like the timbre of your voice alone is horrific. But like the things his commentary is just so it's like worse than mad and bad. So it just gone to anything. Anything? I just hated it. He's supposed to be like, you know, like the the once in a while go to the guy on the field, and like he's practically in the booth that he's practically part it's like a three man team. It's just just talk like, you know, once a quarter who's getting. No, you're totally right. You're totally right. I thought he was just going to be like the guy on the field with even getting his like his stupid little chair with the camera like. Siragusa used to do on the sideline and say, something goofy. Like, you know, once a quarter except for like. Yeah. Way more. Oh my God. It's it's so bad. Give me like give me Romo all day every day. He's been a revelation. I hope he gets. I hope he stays for a long while these great. Oh, he will. He's fantastic. He's been great. He really has been. I was I'm honestly I'm a little disappointed that they didn't get colored back in the booth this year because I would have liked to hear him phoned in every Sunday. Oh, he. Don't care care enough to play football. He's going to care enough to like learn you can hear name lighting up. Cigarettes, say our feud has a question accident that occurred to me if you were like short for time. But if it's quick I don't I don't think either team is going to do anything at the deadline. But are you guys? Are you guys like seriously one hundred percent behind like tannehill as a future still right now today? Rob. Would you like to take that? I because I have my own take on that, y'all. Go ahead. All right. So as far as tannehill goes and the most frustrating thing about tannahill, and you, and I rob I've talked about this ad nauseam is just you just you. We have we have. No, it's not like Sanchez where you could tell that. Sanchez was terrible or any of any Linton or Gina Smith where you can tell the Gina. Smith was terrible or any other jets quarterback? You guys have gone through recently. That's just been like like, you can totally tell this guy's awful tannahill. Does he's never like he's never been. I mean this year. The patriots game was like, wow. That was the worst. I've ever seen him play. And you found out that he was hurt. So then it was like, okay. So now, I'm wondering he's never been great. And like, I don't think Santa your question. Like, no, he's never going to be. He's not a franchise quarterback. He's not Aaron Rodgers. He's more along the lines of like an Alex Smith like you can win with him. If you have a decent team around him. I don't think he's ever going to take you to the Super Bowl, but it's really impossible to say because we've never we've never gotten a he's never gotten a fair chance and we've never really gotten a fair look at them. But he's thirty years old now. So it's never going to happen. I'm going to be my follow oppression. Right. So then given that answer and given the time line, right? And however long you in your mind think it would take to draft enough talent to be loaded and ready to make a run. What do you do? I mean, you got all your all your ready to sell the farm what I'm saying? Are you ready to sell the farm in your picks to move up to get somebody? I don't know. I don't know enough about this quarterback draft class. But I am ready to get to to move on from tannehill. Because this regardless of what happened this year because this is basically what's ended up happening? This year is like we're getting another one of those. Well, we don't know and getting real well, we don't know like now now that we're never going to take the flip side is off. Wiler. Looks competent in this offense this terrible. Yeah. No. Like, he's he he does what he does. He knows how to read this offense. He's competent enough. And honestly tannahill was not that much better than him in this offense. If it was better at him at all tech by the numbers, he's not even better than him. So that's what makes me think that Tanna hill is at best an average quarterback. I don't wanna go out. I you know, what I I wouldn't have given Kirk cousins that money we didn't have we couldn't afford him. Anyway. But but I would love if one of the top one of those four guys fell I would have wanted them. You know would have wanted the dolphins to pay them. I don't know if I would have say trade up for him. I would have wanted them to paint them. And even though we said, it doesn't work would have been happy for him to sit mind hill for this year. And learn it and see what happens and then and then really, you know compete for the job next year. Yeah. I'm glad they drafted vinca. Fitzpatrick mingka's great. Yeah. I'm just saying if if one of these four fell. I would have been I would have been happy to to see what you know. I wouldn't have been mad if they took him. I watch Allen. Do you guys have all seven draft picks? Does your I think so. Okay. I think I was just double checking. And I was I mean again, I know you're I was trying to look at your roster because the deadline was coming up. And I was like you said I was thinking about this. But I don't know what you really have to offer another team if you were going to fire sale, for example, you know, Cameron wake is is old. You know, I is a giant whatever. Thanks, john. And who's the Cousteau car running back? Now Kenyan Drake and Frank gore. So go train was when I was thinking of people are your fans are high on Drake, right? Oh, yeah. I love. He's my favorite dolphin, actually. Yeah. I think he's even have anything to put on the block. I'm talking about trading. Devante parker. Who's there? You know? He was their number one wide receiver draft pick from a few years ago. And he's been injury playing. But if this happened last year, see I I remember reading about partner, but they didn't pull the trigger last year. Right. They didn't trade him last year. And then this year he hasn't really played much and he hasn't really been seriously injured. So it's been kind of a thing with the coach with gas not wanting to put him in because he's tired of watching him kind of half ass it on the field. And honestly, if if are receiving corden get decimated with injuries, they probably would have traded him. They can't and he played on Thursday night against the Texans. And he was actually by far and away the best player. One hundred and fifty yards receiving and was like lights out was their best player. But they've they came out this week and said that they're not going to trade him because they can't because I mean all their wide receivers are hurt. So they they need him. So, but you guys wouldn't it be or okay, how much you think that they are ready to make on? I mean, we would you rather? Hold onto them richer rather flights fire sale. Whatever you can. I mean, if he's if he's the the most valuable asset you have would you rather try to get like a two four him. If you think they can get one for him. But if I was the GM. Yeah, I if I could get the the the word on the street is they were looking for three. So if they could get a two for him, I would trade him, even if it meant we had to go in with two wide receivers against the jets. On the practice squad guys. I mean, that's fine. Because I mean, they got they got a third round or for a giant last year. And he was you know, and he was arguably their best player two years ago. But he's also younger he was under contract longer. Parker's actually almost at the end of his rookie deal. So I would argue the Drake's better than a giant as well. Oh, I thought you were talking Parker. I'm just saying I'm just saying you had a backup behind him. That was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You don't have a guy behind partner. That's the same skill set. But why don't but then, but they don't give. But and I love Frank gore. And I'm I'm I love him as a pl-. He's a great player. Great guy. But he but Drake needs more touches, he'll probably get them in the second half out. Imagine of the season. I don't even pretend to know what they're going to do. They don't do things that make sense. They share don't. That's another one of those things that everybody says about their fan base. But I all I know is at this point right now today, it's ver-. It's basically like, hey what's going on with the dolphins? Oh, still running with tannehill. Okay. And then onto the next object. So I mean, I just feel like I I assumed that that was the answer. I was going to get from you guys that like I said, I didn't mean to make the pockets run over. But I was curious to hear of them somebody inside because it's like I have to assume that you guys are ready to like, please. Can we move on? But you gotta find a way to move up because you keep winning these games. When and games you're getting further and further away from the top of the draft. So that's exactly how I kicked off the podcast. I was like are we ready to melanin this year? Like, I mean like seriously because it's like you're not we're not winning a Super Bowl. This year. We're not going on a crazy run. I mean, I just I I don't see what I think. But I don't know what quarterbacks are out there this draft class. Even it's not even that. I mean might you know, you guys picked in the top of the draft for a while. It's it's it's still a crap shoot, you know. It's not just because you pick a quarterback in the top five doesn't mean he's going to pan out. Well, that's true. But well, two points. The first thing is that the jets hadn't really picked we've picked at the time. Back in the top of the draft in a very long time. But the second thing is it's really the only way like you have to at some point is on at some point. You have to roll the dice like you'd have to make the investment and say one way or another I need to be like the top three picks to try to do something because there's this mess with Kirk cousins that just happened like that only was that like completely out of control. And and you know, massive overpay that sort of thing doesn't happen. So if you want the guy, there's only one way to get the guy, you know, what I mean? I just try opinion. I'm sorry that that's the way. I see it agree. No. The dolphins are like one of the prime clubs right now to be like we need to look in the mirror. We need to make decision. You know? I I don't know. How talented you think you're Austria is. But if you feel like which again, this is a very familiar feeling to me kind of bereft of talent definitely don't have anybody on the roster sitting on the bench to come in light it up at the quarterback position. There's really only one choice because it's dude that was nineteen. And we've got there's only one way you know, what I'm saying. So so yeah. As far as talent. I mean, I think I think this is an eight team that if everything broke their way, and they got super lucky they could win ten or eleven games and play a wildcard game. And maybe at I'm best. I'm talking best case scenario win one playoff game. And that's that's like. Going right now. And that's that's more. Maybe that's me before the more before the season with injuries happened injury talent that was just talking talent. None of that's in play. Now. Exactly. But that's talent wise. That's what I think we have, you know, not not not a not a BI week team not a contender. But. You've got some pieces that something. But the thing this year. I mean, we all knew I think by like week three weeks four that. Yeah. FC is going through New England. You know, it's probably going to be looking at the Rams. You know what I mean? So it's like, okay. Can my team beat that team on any given Sunday night team that team you know, what I mean? Oh, yeah. This is where those hard conversations you kind of have to. Yep. I think I mean, I think we could have competed with them. You know, we could have competed with them if we were fully healthy. There was there were guys they brought in. There were veteran like tough leadership guys that they brought in on the offense and the defense that they had that have gone out on the fronts, and you're kind of seeing some of that right now you're seeing them going to push around up front and not unlike what you kind of see in other sports like basketball like it does seem like gays built this team to to compete with New England. You know, built the, you know, they're not they're not pulling it off. But built a fast offense that can you know that in theory could could move the ball against a slower, you know, defense like they have get getting the pass rushers because we all know the only way to be Brady is get pressure with four. With four. So so we loaded up on defensive line, the injuries of took made a strength, the weakness. And now we can't even get we can't even sniff a quarterback, but they build it with that in mind, they didn't pull it off. And the one really exciting player. We had Albert Wilson is now gone for this year's well. So he was he was he was actually a lot of fun to watch. He was he was doing some great things for this. I remember I remember reading about him. And that's I mean, that's good to know. I mean, at least look, and you can correct me if I'm wrong. But I mean, if you do have at least some kind of confidence in your front office, that's still something. Because I mean, if they if he was building a team's going into the patriots. If you're in this division, you are derelict in your duties, if that's how you were be building the team over the last ten years. You know what I mean? I mean coming to an end now, but you know, over the last ten years, that's how you had to be looking to build a team. And you hit the nail on the head. You we need a quarterback this team needs this team needs a leader. We were hoping to get a clear definitive answer as to whether or not Ryan tannehill was that guy. I mean, we're not going to get a clear definitive answer. But we we know that it's it's not. So you want Jameis Winston or Blake Bortles next year. I want. Oh god. I'm no, no, no. No, no, no, don't do it. I don't want either. I feel like they'll both be available. My thank you. So so much for jumping on the podcast, you brought up a lot of very very good points. And you were very very knowledgeable as a jets fan to come on. And thank you for posing a rational sane jets fan for other people to see because we don't get to see a lot of that down here as you're well aware. I'm sure those rebelling and rivalry no, I appreciate you guys. I had a blast. I would come on. Anytime. You guys are great smart and had a good time. Oh and one last question because I can never spell gray correctly. Are you is is great market a wire e y e y because. Because. No. Because what we told folks to look it up. But I realized if they can't spell it. Then they can't find it. So great market gray. Spelled E Y. Go ahead. And look those guys up especially if you can find videos of them playing live. It's fantastic. And you guys are on IT and sue right, Mike. We are on all platforms. Locked and loaded. Excellent. You guys got anything coming up? I know you just did the new album come out or when it came out recently. Correct. What we did was kind of just put online the work in progress. So we had like, okay. So we're so damn pretentious. As a matter of fact, that we're doing space opera, and so in in all through fashioned, you know, of all that nonsense. We like sort of collected the first part of it is like act one. And so we just put it out to people here. So it's not done. We just wanted it out there. So that people can see what we're in the middle of doing. We are soaring to book some new shows around town. We've got something coming up in November. We're putting together or something in December one in Tampa Saint Pete. So they'll be up shortly. Awesome. Thanks again. Mike, really, really appreciate it. Everybody. Check out great market when you get a chance and go dolphins this week guys. Thanks, thanks. They have. All right. It's nice to talk to people who are beaten down a little more than we are. Man, if they can be optimistic, we that means we shouldn't give up hope he thought the dolphins are gonna win on Sunday has do I traitor monster. I've got a traitor. I just are you serious. Like you've seen this team play. Like you've seen. What we have right now. You're a monster. I'm I'm taking offense minus three and and we could put that as one of our vets that I crushed you again to two one God. I really hope you're right. I will be I will gladly take the l I will gladly take the L on that one. All right. Do you want to quickly run through the games? I have them pulled up on my phone. Yes. Let's before we do that. Let's talk about last week. So quickly. James, and I have been on a little see-saw I win in all the odd weeks, and he wins and all the even weeks. It went it went three and out at three zero to two zero one one two two and one. And now it's two in one again, I. I crushed him. Not only like crushing my even predicted how I was going to do it because with because I took the bucks plus four. And I said, it will be garbage garbage cover a garbage backdoor cover, and it was exactly what was Fitzpatrick fits fits magic carpet cover. My my my belief that the ravens were a good team cost me the one win because they are as bad as the dolphins apparently there with the same record. So I lost on that one. And I think better than you thought. Hugh Jackson was going to give the Steelers a game. I did and it cost him his job. Actually, you should be fired too. I believe that they would cover. I didn't believe I believe I said that. But yeah. No. That's. Yeah. Fair enough. I mean to tune one I mean, we're pretty close on the year overall. Yeah. What pry for practice? You're a half game up on me because of the tie. Well, no, well, I've had one more week since we do the weeks. I've had more one more week of beating you now you have to go to in one this one to get to just be up to to get within that half game of. Gotcha. All right. So so are we are you are you going on record with the jets here? Or is this one you're taking I'm going on record taking the jets, and you can shoot me in the face. 'cause I really hate that. Like, I hate that. I would ever pay. I hate this because it's your week. How can you pick this team? You've seen them play. Like, I don't even. I can't even I I could not with a good conscience like as an impartial. Okay. Hickory of games pay no bonds to ever win another football game. Because I picked them every week. I'm goddamn Homer. I know they're so bad. They've turned into a garbage foot one team list. The worst defense I've ever seen nine horn. I did a no show while Finkel was there. But I horrid. Nine hundred in the same room. But when when we first decided to do this I thought I was going to be the pessimists than you're going to be the optimist. But gosh, darn it. You put these headphones on me. And I just wanna talk about how good these dolphins could be. I love them. Like I love the dolphins. Like, I I love the Miami Dolphins. Jim. Jets. Oh, we're going to have to learn that one out. Mark it down. What is this episode six, and we have our first f bomb dropped live on on the fence are on the blowhole from our from our James radio, the professional. Of course, it comes on jets week though, it has to be well, I'm also for Celtics at this point. Because you're so torn because the jets I do not love the jets. I hate I hate the jets. I just hate this dolphin steam right now, I hate the way they're playing football. It's awful. I mean, I love the dog. It's fixable. All right. I don't know if they again, fix it. If you say sandy fixed. Yeah. Well, yeah. Whatever the defense. I don't understand it. They we. Yes, linebackers are only good at one thing. Like, you know, they're young. They need a defensive line in front of them. And it's banged up. But it's still there still enough. Good guys that we should they should be playing better. It's a domino effect. I mean, honestly, Robert Quinn has been he's all of a sudden gone invisible. He was getting some pressures at the beginning of the year. And now he's not like now. No, he's not Charles Harris. I think you know, he doesn't have he didn't have a ton of Saks or anything, but he was getting pressure. And he hasn't played the last couple of weeks William Hayes, who I think is one of the most underrated players on as gone. You know, Jordan Phillips for whatever reason was like, oh, and he was a good solid rotational player that was up there. And you're seeing God Chon and Spence and Taylor just not covering their gaps and getting gashed and they're not they're not covering. They're not getting penetration. They're not covering the places. There were supposed to be and Cameron wake. I love him. But he's he's he's hurt. Obviously he's coming back off, and he's already had surgery already and he's not young. No. And then you have two other guys off the practice squad playing water too. I liked but I don't even know if he's been back yet. I haven't even I haven't seen him. And then I think Cameron Malveaux is the other one. And I mean at this point you're talking about your your twelve exactly exactly, you know. You know, so and that's what you have a friend right now. And it's you have no protection for those linebackers. They're young aside from Alonzo the other two were young and Alonzo if he doesn't have protection. You see how different he is. He's yeah. He's he's like night and day. He's an he's like, I I'm not gonna say incomplete, but he's like when given help he's amazing all. All great linebackers need assistance. Even Ryan Lewis when he didn't have those nasty giant defensive tackles in front of him. Like, he wasn't the same. I mean, he's great. He's a hall of Famer. But I know who's going to knife those people for you. Exactly, exactly. And then you have I mean, I love Rashad Joensuu. But I mean, he's he's clearly playing hurt as well. Fitzpatrick is doing the best that he can. And Howard's doing the best that he can. But McCain's also hurt like none of these guys are one hundred percent there. So banged up back there that it's it's it's just it's really unfortunate. And they're just they're out of position. They're getting no help. Nobody's you know. They're just they're not making the plays that they are making the beginning of the year. And it's so it's fixable. You agree with me? Yeah. If they all miraculously get healthy and not. Yes. The NFL everybody hurt not an excuse. All right. Let's get to the slate of games this one. No one's going to sit through this. We've been talking for a while. And we're talking about the jets your second favorite team. They're not my favorite team. I know my favorite team. They're the team. I hate more than any other NFL team. All right. So to start off this week Oakland at San Francisco San Francisco favored by four at home on Thursday. Both of these teams are garbage. They're worse than the dolphins. Don't. Yeah. I don't like this. I this is this is weird because I love picking against Gruden San Francisco's at home. I know. But I I don't think they should be giving four to anybody. They just lost to the cardinals. They did they blew a twelve point lead. So I'm going to take the I I would I would pick the raiders in this not so much that I'd want to bet on it. But I'm just going with the points. I'll agree with that. They have the better quarterback. And I mean, it's not really a road game for them because it's San Francisco. All right. So Detroit at Minnesota Minnesota favored by seven. I like the Vikings. Well. I wouldn't touch this. Because Detroit is the Tennessee titans of the NFC. Meaning they they're only good when they play the dolphins. There does the dolphins are bad. Well, but we can be making a joke. I know it was just terrible. No there you just never know. They they looked great against some teams. They looked terrible against other teams. You never know what you're going to get there. A weird team. I think they're talented on offense. But they're you know, they haven't shown up since that dolphins game while I guess that's the only one game. So Minnesota has to have this game. Minnesota all well, they did lose the other one. But Minnesota just they don't look like the team from last year. There are good. They're great team. Well, not a great team. They're very good team. Yeah. They're good team. They're they're a more consistent solid team than Detroit. They're not in. Yes. Probably and they do and they're at home. But it's a lot of points a touchdown. This a lot of points. I mean, are you happy when your team scores a touchdown because it's because they just got a lot of points. Yeah. So that touchdowns a lot of points. So I don't know if it's one I'd be I'd be betting on. But I lean Detroit. Mostly for the points to cover. All right. So wait. So wait is that too. We are we've had out of. I what I'm saying. I'm not this isn't one I want to put some weight behind don't feel strongly about Kansas City at Cleveland Kansas City favored by ten and a half not enough all those points for Kansas City. All right. Although, well, we probably already mentioned everybody knows Hughes. Gone. You feel like they get a little bump. Oh with you Jackson out there. I don't know as I I'd mentioned earlier to you off air the he'd already won twice as many games this years. He'd one in his previous two years combined tripled his window. It'll lot of wins for to fire. That's for the Browns. That's a lot of wind Salako of. No, I think you Jackson's a terrible head coach, I think well, Greg Williams is also not a good coach statue they replaced Jackson. Yeah. I'm gonna take the the Kansas City Chiefs at the points in that one the I'm not I've it's hard for me to go against the chiefs. Yep. All right. The next game is a one o'clock eastern. Pittsburgh Steelers at Baltimore Ravens. Baltimore Ravens favored by three and home. Baltimore getting the home three. I you know, what I recruit I've recused myself. I've thought the ravens were a good team. I felt they were like, you know, could be possibly top five in the AFC. And I was wrong. They're not good. Their defense is good. But I don't know. I don't know what to make them. This is the Panthers. The Panthers are good team. True. They lost the Panthers on the road as well. The Panthers are a good team. They also good team at home. I don't know. I feel I liked the patriots. I'm waiting for the Steelers to just shrivel up and go away, but I'm taking I'm taking basically I'm taking points this game. Probably going overtime. So I'll just take the points. That's bird. Yeah. All right. Sounds good. I like Pittsburgh. Tampa Bay Ryan Fitzpatrick pain Ryan Fitzpatrick travel to Carolina where Carolina is favored by seven points. Carolina all day. Carolina all day except Tampa Bay is the king of the back door cover as they proven last week. It's not not I'm getting if if we don't have any games I can come back to this into the Detroit since it's your week anyway. But I looking I'm looking at the points in that one just because Tampa Bay they've been blown out in so many games, and I've come back to back door cover the this team can with their offensive talent can garbage time better than anybody. Right. Atlante? So wait. So you're taking that one. So that's one of your three if we need one. Let's see if we find ones like that. We've that I wanna root for the Atlanta Falcons travel to Washington DC to take on the Washington Redskins is a three point line. The Redskins are favored by three at home. This one's only. They're only got one and a half. Okay. So I yeah, there's multiple ones on here. Most of them are one and a half. So all right. We'll go one and a half. So I am contractually obligated to no longer back. Matt Ryan on the road. Would that? Terrible defense a great. Honestly, I think the falcons win here. But I can't I can't pick them on the road ever. Yeah. I Washington actually looks like a decent football team. I think they're like five and two now, I think I see I actually. We we've gone too long. So we won't get into this. But I have a way of sort of looking at teams there's like there's bad bad teams, like your bills, whatever then there's those bad good teams bad teams. But they're good and they can show flashes. Like, a maybe the jets or something like that. Then there's oh you love the jets apparently are. Our team, but you said a good bad team. This is the second rung on the ladder from the bottom. The jets you had the dads are highly bad, then they're good bad teams. The next one are bad. Good teams, which is a team that should be good in can be good. But we'll lay eggs like the lions there a bad good team. And then you have good good teams like, which is obvious. You're you're Rams and your chiefs. There's like four tiers to me and the Redskins are a bad. Good team. They have Alex Smith is their quarterback. Hey, that means they can make the playoffs in now. Win any games or win one game in? Yeah. That's that's what it sounds good right about now. Can I send out for that? Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. They'll they'll win the game. All right. I'm with you. All right because I can't go with the falcons on the road Chicago buffalo, there's no line because Buffalo's playing right now, I guess that's why there's no line. I mean, Chicago wins. I don't care what the line is. I am with you. All right Houston at Denver. This one. What that no Houston by ten is pick. Even I have never mind having to even say here. This one says Broncos favored by two and a half Broncos favored by two and a half. Yeah. They're getting. I mean, not the whole home thing. But they're they're basically taking they're only half point worse. Yeah. That's what I'm seeing here. I'm seeing mostly ones. Wow. All right. Oh, no. There's a two and a half. All right. Yeah. Two and a half. Wow. I well, just because like Houston shred us, and this I, but then Detroit shredded us and got stomped by Seattle. Who's not that good either? This isn't even first-hand knowledge. But apparently Denver is pretty good on like the stats and whatnot like especially their defense. So. I think that them at home people not believing in the Texans because even though they really off all those games. They haven't beaten a good team yet. Gimme the Texans. The texans. Dude. I can't believe that bad. I can't go. I do believe the dolphins are that bad. But I well they wore last week their defense was that mode. Lord. All right. This is a good game. LA chargers at Seattle Seahawks. Seattle favored by one to one and a half at home. This feels like the one where the coach and kick our blow the game. But I'm taking the chargers. The chargers. They're a better Seattle Seattle is one of those teams that everybody wrote off and they're actually their defense is okay. And Wilson's a good quarterback unless it's people look at Wilson stat. And they're like he's terrible. They're just running the ball like crazy. They're not asking him to do anything. And they probably should have him do more than he does. But they just they just run run run run. Yeah. I mean, I they have good decent running backs. And they have a good quarterback who doesn't turn the ball over. And they have a defense that can tackle people and cover which we do not have stopped making this all about you. I know I'm so hurt chargers. Galaxy charters. Ooh, here's a good one Rams at New Orleans. Wow. New Orleans is favored by point at home. But only one point in Allman still. Yep. And you know what? I'm going with the Rams the Rams the dome not going against they're not. I'm not going against them till they lose I feel like after the big win against Minnesota. And everyone's like, oh, this is the, you know, the this is the saints chance to prove and whatever. I would not be shocked if the saints win this game. But I'm going with the Rams. So this means oh other more those that the Monday night, or no, that's that's just Sunday. That's Sunday afternoon. I like the Rams, and I think the Rams win. I like the saints a lot. But I mean, they haven't played anybody. Like the Rams yet. I'm with you. All right. Green Bay at New England. New England favored by seven or six and a half. This is in New England, man. Wow. I I like the Packers. But I mean, I think in New England. Yes. New England's going to win. I probably lay the seven there. I think the I'm believe me. I think the Packers are going to destroy us in the week after but. Yeah. But going on. Oh against the patriots. I would take the patriots. Yep. Yeah. All right. And your Monday night game of your favorite. The Tennessee titans. Facing the Dallas Cowboys with Amari Cooper. You think Amari Cooper makes a difference? No, really. Well, not an enough of a difference. I think he makes him a pretty interesting offense, actually. I mean, they were good when they had Brian and. Don't you think he's as good as as Brian? Now. Oh, no. No. No. No. No. No. I mean, I don't. Yeah. I don't mean him like he's Brian in his heyday. But I mean, he's Bryant probably like that that year when they went to the they should have gone to the NFC championship game. What are the catch? That wasn't a catch. Yeah. I'm not. I'm not an Amari Cooper believer. No. I mean, he gives them a credible wide receiver. Now. He's like a rich man's. Devante parker. Well, the same draft class and at the same guy, they have the flashes of brilliance, and then the disappearing act I think he makes them a little bit more of an interesting team. I think their defense is pretty good. Here's here's here's me going big. I care. So little about this game. Not even picking it. I don't care who wins. I don't care who covers don't care. All right. So now we have to go back. So so it looks like I'm going to be because it's your week. It's an even week or an odd week. Oh because we started in a weird week because we started in week three. So now when he did. So it's my week. I'm even weeks because I started week for and I won weeks one-two-three because we didn't pick them. Yeah. So oh my God. I'm going to. The bucks plus seven. This is terrible. You're taking the bucks plus seven at Carolina. Yup. All right. And you have the dolphins. And I have the dolphins minus three. And there was another one where I was kind of. On the other side. But like Detroit Minnesota. You gonna take Detroit. Or there was also Atlanta Washington, which I think you agreed with me on the Texans. I took the Texans. Morongo. I'm taking the brunt. It's the two and a half is what we said, right? Is that what we're going on do have better odds in any of your others on my having giving my giving up less points on one of yours, say two and a half across. I can't give points. I see an even and then two and a half. Yeah. I'll take the even. Yeah. No. I mean, all right. I do think in wins outright. But now it's your week. I'll do minus two and a half. Which is crazy. This is just stupid. Tampa Bay and Miami. Yep. You sure about that. The I gotta give I gotta let you win on your weeks or it's just not fair, right, man. Well, no, I don't want to hear any of that. No. You know, why? Because Vegas is a smart. These lines are set you could flip a coin on all these things and do just as well as our prognosticating. Well, yeah. And the other thing which maybe we'll get into next week. We have we have to start really showing the game that makes no sense and the pick that contrarian pick because there's always that game at everyone believes is going to have like like the Rams like not covering. There's always that game that everyone is on and bega seems to win on it. We're going to start next week. We're going to start pointing out the contrarian pick, and we're gonna and we're going to tally it up and see how we would have done if we just went against the most popular pick this week. I would say that contrarian pick might be that Denver game. Actually, I'm already on it. Yeah. Right. What other ones were like weird? Well, I mean like if you look through the through the weeks, obviously, Minnesota, you know, when they lost the buffalo that like that like destroyed ninety percent of survivor pools. After the fact. Well, no, no, no, we're going to we're going to pick them. We're going to look at the ones where like most people are picking one side. And we're going to we're going to point them out and say keep an eye on these. And then you know, what after four weeks if we're wrong on all four. We'll look like the idiots. We are. Yeah. Well, I don't know. I thought the dolphins were good. There you go that looks like the idiots. We are. There we go. All right. Well, thanks for sticking around. Ladies and gentlemen. I hope you did. It was actually want to say, thanks to Mike. We're coming by providing some very good jets insights on the jets fan and being actually kinda rational. We all know. Oh god. We're only halfway through the year. Hello. I'm Spencer hall from SP nation. And I want to tell you about my new show. It seemed smart it seems smart as a show about people doing things that for some reason or another same smart at the time. Those things might include don't a little cocaine driving a bike up a mountain or I don't know maybe racing one hundred miles per hour across the country in the middle of the night with no one's permission or even stealing a bat from an empire is room in a major league baseball park, check it out. And if you like it Tele friend, I'm Spencer hall. Don't do anything smart.

jets Mike NFL Devante parker bears football Fitzpatrick mingka patriots dolphins tannehill Miami Dolphins Sean Ramos Jaguars rob cast Russell Wilson vox media Tanna hill Seahawks Brock Osweiler
Thanksgiving Disasters

Shutdown Fullcast

1:34:00 hr | 10 months ago

Thanksgiving Disasters

"Today's show is sponsored by Travis. Matthew Travis Matthew has represented the absolute benchmark in men's active apparel for over a decade producing comfortable high performance clothing clothing and accessories. That can handle anything. The day brings Travis Mathews commitment to making quality clothing. That suitable for work and play has solidified their reputation as an elite sportswear brand and this holiday season you can save up to sixty percent on select styles if you shop between Black Friday and cyber Monday checkout check out Travis Matthew Dot com slash shutdown to learn more. That's Travis Matthew Dot com slash shutdown. Hey this is Sean Ramos from the host of Boxes Daily News podcast today explained you know just late September. We have done probably close to dozen shows on this impeachment inquiry from the sort the early rumors of a whistleblower complaint too Nancy Pelosi launching the formal impeachment inquiry to the whistleblower complaint coming out and the so called transcript coming out to the Republican counter narrative to the White House stonewalling. We've done it all but it all felt like it was leading up to this moment of televised impeachment hearings and the event of that event was the testimony of Gordon Sunland and we wanted to make sure we made an episode that properly showcased and explained the significance the historic significance of that testimony. And we did it and we want you to hear it. It's available available in our feeds right now today explained. The episode is titled Impeachment TV. Mr Sunland goes to Washington. It's a must-listen I I wouldn't say so if it weren't go check it out and enjoy. Thanks ooh ooh to shutdown full cast is the the Internet's only college football. podcast you know what a little something different. This week we came into the dulcet tones and tunes ends of the original shutdown forecast. They make a shutdown fullback theme for those of you with no taste long memories. Thank you Keller Color for submitting that we are attempting theme music. May God have mercy on all your souls but we are attempting to have the music music. We're accepting different versions and renditions of the shutdown full cast. The music you can sign up Zydeco is the next priority. I have already Cardi claimed the Auto Hark do not attempt to dethrone me in this matter and I recently expense McLaughlin Spiel if anyone has the annihilation since Yeah Yeah let's let's compromise zydeco annihilation SIMP- okay did I accept Natalie Portman Characters Cajun. ooh ooh big rock. That's the passion play a weekend all throw instead of watching the egg bowl now if that movie were filmed in Louisiana. How would you know? Oh the difference you would. You would be put him on the defensive line. Oh dear friend move GotTa who came in my house. I have one other thing. I have to limit APO- before we get going best friend turned into a tree. Not Having Boudreau that's fine. This is just a reminder for anybody who doesn't follow me on twitter that the roadway the records university police department chief is named Kenneth Cop can go there you can go not rutgers dot Edu. You can find Kenneth Com executive director of public safety cheese and our state police hop COP. Not No we're talking. Ken Cop School Cop. It was it was it was it was putting out to me. That in his rise to become chief cop he was officer Cop Surgeon Cup. We couldn't enter COP OP. So you're telling me this dude walked around for how ever many decades on the force with a badge that said cop. Yeah that's right. Oh Aw my mind blown you know my first reaction is obviously well. My Second Reaction Records Rica's truly eternal and following US everywhere. My third reaction is if I were a cop. This would be a way to get away with anything. I'm pretty sure I somebody said this and I I haven't totally fact checked it. But he has. I believe a sister in the Rutgers Athletic Athletics Hall of fame who was a women's basketball player in the ninety s Her name is Cheryl cop note. This is the second episode in what three weeks discussing the Rutgers Athletics Hall of fame which last year so wait. My third reaction is my third reaction is what's his badge number nine one one Jeez. Let's actually really is Rudy Giuliani's batch number number is cop from now on if you see me in public. I'm referring to my right BICEP as hank rutgers and my left bicep is Kenneth Calcutta Cop Third Nipple is Cheryl Cop and Being Ryan. I don't have one if you would like to submit your Your best guess at the shutdown forecast team will play it. All you have to do is send it to compliance. Hi It's a banner. Society Dot Com remember Band Society your online home and community for all things college football where production of Said Organization. Sation were the only one because if it's a college football home it would probably and we're the only college football podcast. That's correct by the way I I am the first tonight to mention Banner Society Dot Com. I will collect my twinkie afterwards. As I've explained to literally every person on this team who is not Elliott. who was already doing this? You don't get rewarded for doing the thing you've been supposed to be doing all along. You think about all the problem getting for Chemists Cup. That's very true. Ryan gets twinkie true. If you know Kenneth Cop email us at banner society all right compliance at Banner Society Dot Com important. The thing here is promoting literally anything via here listener. If you're out there and you would like something from moded you you need to send that to bill handcock at the College Football playoff because he will forward it to us. Yes nicest man. So Oh that's a disaster of an opening hey segue nailed it nailed it. I'd loved it. I was grateful for it as in giving thanks. See Mayor this. That's next week now. You're doing too much know too much. I'm wondering you experience for you. I'm in the season. Feel it appropriate appropriate. I'm tired like when I look at Pat McAfee space on television. I'm that tired. Is Pat McAfee human of cleaner. Does he just suck all the oxygen out of a room. Maybe the actual energy vampire of ever seen like I'm still in there even though I'm even though it's like week. Nineteen we never this season. I'm still in the habit of flipping the Thursday night football and I turned the game on and I see Adam and unlike Adam my friend. Let's settle in for a long night and then I see or hear either Matt Hasselbeck or the other one and all the life just drains from my body. I'm so tired they're great win. It's is a big moment but not every moment is a big moment not Thursday night in November no there are no big moments in NC state Georgia tech they. ACC's two teams are playing in that saying a lot. Big Moments are going to be few and far between might take is pat. McAfee is fine. It doesn't like I. Yeah I think over. We're all balances out to find. My main quibble with this broadcast team is that I can't tell him apart from Hasselbeck and just like dude. WHO's talking over Adam the entire time? I need them to be split up because they sound exactly the same. Well I think my my think from since uh-huh week to has been. We need the xbox one notification at the bottom where it shows the name of the person speaking in your gaming online. This tells you who is calling you a racial slur working less less likely to happen on. ACC Thursday night football broadcast is unlikely as it used to be. Wow least it'll tell you who is a little too excited about a Fourth Downplay Lau how Kelly Colin cowherd seventy three was the guy who called me that inappropriate thing okay cool. Is there lane taken. I don't know you should check. Now be careful. This is how we ran up. This is how we round up with Wolf. Dick Sixty nine as all of our Bernard Count. Yes Note Ryan Year Gamertag his way just Kim bone. No Kenneth Again why not all cancer related. I don't know where this is coming from. What speaking of Thursday night? There's Ken Bone. WHO's not fatkin bone? He's the basketball coach. He's the associate basketball head coach. Upper nine how are we now in an episode where Spencer Jason are trying to keep was on track and holly keeps redirecting Walter Bone water happened. Water finds its level. Water finds its level. They told you I turned on Thursday thanksgiving disasters episode. We're GONNA talk about Thanksgiving disaster. We should do being talked over by a bunch of men when a new experience agreeance online what we should do we should have the safety zone. Have a shutdown disasters disaster episode. That's just the Atlanta live show. We already made that. That was that was the live. Show disaster episode. It's it's the one it's the it's the episode where I had to produce it with me doing the director's commentary. It's the one right before I where right before Spencer got in decided to attack John Popper and totally derailed. I think like a semi final preview. Show yeah facts about. John Popper please at him. An Stephen Godfrey in the same tweet. Hey Ryan Norwood recording and like two or three weeks final previews Agai- God damn it. The huck the hook is bringing us back. No no no no. Don't you start now now at least bring a harmonica. If you're GONNA do this young. I picked up the hatching music. You do not want to give me are on a gun alive. We Need Spencer. We need theme music. Hold on what. Blues Traveler Sends US Theme Music. Yeah we use it the up fighting. We'd like to extend a peace offering. Would you like to come on our podcast. But no not you just your whole Monica anybody know about. Does anybody know about Ragamuffin. De no so on topic so the Rutgers President arrested so I'm sure you're all aware of the macy's Thanksgiving parade in Chicago has their cities they have one have on like. Okay thanks Ali good. Yes ending their. These parades exist in part. Because they were trying to quash what was the original Thanksgiving Day. New York City Eighty specifically tradition. which was Ragamuffin Day? which was the thing where children would dress up? Like like homeless New Yorkers and they would go door to door asking for money and food on Thanksgiving they were not themselves like homeless kids. Who who were you know trying to get a bite to eat? They just like were like. Hey can I have some candy and some money please. And The New York Times in nineteen thirty wrote several articles in an attempt to end the tradition that the children were annoying adults on Thanksgiving Day. And so oh organizations popped up in the late thirties to start hosting Thanksgiving Day. Parades so that children would not go beg for money on Thanksgiving. I mean all my heart. What this shit? What's wrong wrong? What's wrong with all of you? And that's why we that's why we have giant balloons that sometimes kill people at the first macy's Day parade with the giant balloons. loons at the end they let them fly into the sky and they all exploded. They were they were they. Were not expecting that. And I'm trying to imagine it must have been like as a kid in cool a runoff balloon. Oh my nineteen fifteen so like the characters. Yeah like as best this man Mexican Joe Oh there goes to burke yellow sis man in the Kaiser look look he's going into the sun we finally blown him out of the Sky Racist Mickey Mouse Goodbye. Farewell European a European yourself. I don't know probably Woodrow Wilson. Gather balloon so realistic and frail. Buck you woodrow Wilson. That's right so I just want as we as we get ready to talk about some Thanksgiving disasters I wanted to bring you know it used to be worse because while your Thanksgiving was going south random children were ringing your doorbell asking for money pretend mocking the homeless remember. That's an important part of this whole equation right. Yeah Yeah. New York always the leader and culture and empathy. Yeah go dress up like a homeless cut. That is so do you know what explains Howard Stern explains everything about New York. Hey what did you get your kids dress them up like some bums and go send them out. It'll be hilarious. This asshole Halloween. Yeah that's all that's almost New York. Culture is is asshole Halloween. Just one a former another of it. Yeah Santa Con is asshole Halloween. Wouldn't it be funny if you just went and you were just like Total Dick Great. We're not we notre dame winter lasts. They dressed up as New York Yankees. Yeah dresses up like assholes. Every time they go there Saint Patrick's dance asshole Halloween. Yeah this is. This is actually tracking. I would I would argue. The marathon is the only thing in the city. That isn't asshole Halloween. Yeah but that's marathons across like everywhere anywhere. There's no such thing as a negative merrythought right. There's no marathon where people get together and they're like you saw Bo. We when we announced that we were doing a Thanksgiving disasters episode. You were the. I think you were confident that you were going to have the worst one. Oh yeah you have said that. You have retracted. Retracted that based on the submissions immediately. This got darken. Hurry but I but I am curious before we dive into the submissions. What what is your Thanksgiving disaster? That's very sweet of you to lab that up for me because it's the story all three of you know very well Related on the podcast floor and it's known to most people online because while I did not tweet through it I was mad at shit about it after it I it was now I forget what year was it. Is the Thanksgiving after gotten married and My husband and I were in charge of day after Thanksgiving breakfast for our combined families which is like fifteen people and and we were cooking Bacon like twelve pieces at a time on broiler pants in the oven? which is the best way to Cook Bacon? This is not a distinct and my I'm other in law. Where they lived in they had one of those double ovens and one of the Evans was significantly above the height of my eyes? That will become important important in a moment. And as I'm saying my eyes I'm realizing actually could have been a lot worse. I was pulling a tray of Bacon off the top shelf shelf in the top oven and could not see because it was above the level of my head that the extremely shallow broiler pan. We were cooking it on the bottom of it had filled up with Greece. And so when I pulled the pan out of the oven the grease sloshed out of the Pan. It did not hit me in the face which is great. What's less great is that it hit my leg and melted Mike Tights to my skin? Dan Pretty immediately My sister-in-law had a partner who was an army medic who got me immediately mmediately into the shower as soon as he figured out what. I was screaming about it. Took them a minute because I had black tights on I was just standing there holding a pan screaming bloody murder. I guess that's kind of been shocked when they pulled my tights off. All my skin came off I I did not the hospital right away because my father in law was a doctor and he was like keep it clean. You're fine and then a couple of days later I was like do I have a fever. And that's how I discovered that Grady Hospital in Atlanta has a one of the only level one trauma burn centers in this part of the country. Very and they're quite excellent. I'll tell you this. They're quite excellent over the six months. It took the wound on my leg to close up after which I was left with so I was left with two things. Three things the knowledge of what my own flesh smells like wind is cooking thing which is truly something that will never leave my head. does a very deep like limbic horror. Yeah sure A star on my leg which I have alluded to before which is in the shape of an enormous purple Dick Flaccid. Please don't ever try to talk me out of this. My own mother was trying to comfort me about it as I lay in a hospital bed. And she's like Oh honey. I'm sure it's not that she's pulling back the sheet and she's like l.. I'm sure it's not that best. That subpoenas a way is that podcast business. Dick pod might be it is the original business third and maybe worst thing of all of this is that This was the day before for the kick six and I fucking missed it. I was supposed to cover my first iron bowl. The next day off didn't get to go because I had a huge In wound on my leg was bandaged from if to ankle a and hadn't really figured out how to walk on crutches and up but it's okay because it just turned out to be the funniest football moment of our generation may be in modern history. And I was supposed to be there in person. He's there's a CODA to this. which is that the next year? We went back for Thanksgiving again and Friday morning. We're making breakfast again. Dan and all through Thanksgiving. Everyone had to make these little jokes. You Know Oh hey Hollywood. Better better knowledge. Take that pan. Ha Ha ha and I had spent benefit's V. is hard. Let me tell you that this is an entire Commonwealth Cup Family So they're they're not big on empathy at the end. I should stay there. Lovely people but they. They had jokes right. The next year I having been having spent from November until March a showering with my leg in a garbage bag to keep myself from getting Mersa undying didn't think it was super funny so I put up with jokes for about thirty six hours and then on Friday morning I found myself alone in the kitchen and I look. I had not planned. This just happened. I looked left looked right and I let out a blood curdling shriek at the top of my lungs and everybody came into the kitchen and I was like. Are we done with the jokes. We're not married anymore. I I don't know how much suck trivia to it but I don't feel I don't feel like an extended our relationship there much. Here's here's my question back to the kicks part of the story. Yes how many Auburn or Alabama fans do you think we're at that game with with a burn roughly as bad as yours at least fifteen percent. Okay and mental andy or Penis Burns that that's a culture. That probably has a higher incidence of peanut shaped branding irons that I would find in my own family. Scher yeah they get up after some wild shit round Lake Martin. Just ask that die anyway. I thought that was going to be the worst that that was my worst ex giving never Even worse than the time I had to dance in the macy's parade and ate Thanksgiving dinner at planet. Hollywood God I don't love Thanksgiving on Venice. Van Start Real. I was abused of the notion that I knew what a bad thanksgiving was very rapidly up our own readers alarm. You imagine that Bruce Willis was is also eating Thanksgiving dinner at that planet Hollywood by himself just sobbing quietly. Oh wow that's that really throws the whole thing into a sharp relief. Yeah you're right you're welcome all right all right But yeah I I was very shortly Put in the rear view mirror by many of our readers sped right past us with their own darkness. And for that. I congratulate you Jason Spencer. I don't have one but I do want to make sure you have the opportunity to share Thanksgiving wall of your own. If he sues Jason. Do you have one officer. It's not mine. It is my wife's okay. This was her first thing. Let me let me we actually back up so we have. We have this. This is in the McDonald's fire is it. No you know all about two or three. Yeah I was like come on to tell it and she's like no significantly more traumatic. Listen to this podcast. Cast No. She's with you smart. Very Very Stewart on her show this is significantly more traumatic for her than the time she burned down a building. And so we have this and this and on the general a large of the midwestern person. It is best typified as of late by Dan. Dear Doors Michigan announcer. We've also done like Ohio State Bro. War Dad we have of this Subcomandante Wayne taking many forms. Yeah this is our general mid Western character but this is more of a big Tin East if we're talking big ten west North Big twelve. That is an entirely different kind of mid West. That is where you find raises like salt of the Earth. Wholesome traditional welcoming cinnamon rolls in Chile? There's all yeah we'll we'll take we'll take freaking anything in and try to endure it so my wife is from Kansas which a lot of people here that and they say they they begin to laugh because a Ha- Kansas how lame I think Kansas pretty great because everyone there is nice she comes from like you know big huge welcoming family? We're all GONNA pile into a huge. Everyone has prepared prepared meals. It's all going to be wonderful and wholesome and holding hands bands singing in like in the WHO's in Whoville everything is going to be completely wonderful. she moves to Georgia. I first mistake it right. Her first Thanksgiving with the entire Kirk family. Oh yeah so in a little bit less. What's your family like? Let's say a little bit less. Effort went into her first Thanksgiving in Georgia. I'M GONNA I'M GONNA give you two words all right. The second one is platter. Zack's beats the for the record that would be the hardest final puzzle on wheel of Zack's speech did platters. Honestly well for Thanksgiving heck do so. Yeah later Z.. Thanks is Thanksgiving. The thanksgiving years later I was like Unitel this on the podcast. She's like no. Yeah I mean now. She was Kazaks. These platter I would assume nothing but chicken but now she's completely commandeered Thanksgiving like she'll roll up. She's like I'll do it myself. You know she'll completely prepare a completely wonderful awesome meal and like she's since since recruited the rest of the family into joining and and so now we are a traditional midwestern recruited or conscripted. Yeah vastly vastly improved. Let's say that axes. Would you want to send a message. We don't care God is dead. Eat Saxby it was neat wasn't a spencer so this was Thanksgiving at whatever I did and that wasn't my that wasn't the worst Thanksgiving that's probably one of his better ones. Yeah it was. It was way better so oh I had thanksgiving where my uncle and my aunt and my mom all got into a screaming fight like out of nowhere like I think this fight started thirty years prior started and it never stops. So it's like it's like Kimchi right. You just let us sit right. Well it's like it's like a video game where you wander into a village and villager start fighting but before you were there. They were just nothing. Weren't even there. La like they've hated each other for thirty years. This is like a second. This is like a fucking whack conference rivalry. Yeah I think I think they were all Manchurian candidate each other right like the heard one word they were like must kill the queen right like they were all sleeper cells and something something is something on a random thanksgiving involving paint pong. And someone's kid getting insulted just blew the hell up and it was this kind of unseasonably warm Thanksgiving I remember so I came out my new clothes and I it just hit like that specific level of like prepubescent fat that you get and I The pants were kind of tight and I felt really awful and everyone had already screamed at everyone right and I think the dog dog had stolen some sort of thing off of the table of food right not the Turkey but something Turkey adjacent right so the dog couldn't even fuck things up right. The dog was like ooh cranberry. Now you're supposed to drag the bird off dramatically and it's like no cranberry with the ridges from the can on it you know and I remember walking out and I I was like I don't belong on this earth. This is really all bad. I'm just GONNA sit here. We'll myself myself to die and I walked out of my new Thanksgiving outfit and my aunt goes. Hey you're flies down. Yeah and it was and at that point. I didn't commit suicide and and nothing is. Nothing's been able to kill me sense. Okay heartwarming heartache. Hey here's the good news. It's going to get worse. I can't believe you don't have one. I know we've had like my so crackle with your rib-cage parents are both from California and we did not do family travel for Thanksgiving. Thanks giving so we always thanks stated Tampa and everything was great. Here's the thing we live in Tampa like you judge everything by that metric so we went to outback steakhouse. Now we had we had like food. We we go. Yeah my mom cooks I I will say this thing is that maybe like three years ago I was home for Thanksgiving and my my mom is making a big dinner. Even there's only like seven of us or something she's like. Well we have to have this side and we have to like your sister likes that. And I gotTa make this and Blah Blah Blah and as we're sitting down. Uh she takes. She looks at the Food and she says you know. I don't even like any of this like that's fucked up so that I will say that is why I started my own personal crusade of like if you don't like if you are in charge of cooking and you don't like traditional Thanksgiving food make something nothing else make something good that you can share with people. But I've I cooked the last two thanksgivings. I'm not doing it this year and we did Mexican can food one year and Italian food the second year and it was and everybody was fine with it. This is a good rule but be careful because your family might just orders. Xp That's how you well New York is new. York was too poor for his axes. New York doesn't even have the culture to have his. XP So was it coming up. Holly you have one that you really want some economic cut in front of your best Thanksgiving he's giving adjacent at. It doesn't really have all the food disaster or anything but from User Vandy import on twitter Who says his Thanksgiving disaster was Thanksgiving at my girlfriend's where my newly widowed mother asked my girlfriend's mother? If she thought my girlfriend and I were living together as brother and sister sister does not say whether or not this was true does say my mother went onto marry my first cousin once removed. Making me my own second cousin. They divorced divorced and are living in sin and then in a subsequent tweet reveals that. Although this tale is Obama's hell yet has moms from my hometown. I just thought that was really special. I have a similar one on if I may. This is from Dmitri revenues who who's a friend of the show. This is Thanksgiving two thousand. I had come home from college and found out. My parents. Parents were separated and went. See How my dad was doing. He told me that he didn't want to reconcile because he had been unhappy for awhile. I told him if that's how he felt he. He needed to tell mom because she was confident. They could work things out. They had been married for twenty years. She invited him to Thanksgiving Dinner. He walked walked in the door holding. Flowers gave to mom and said I want a divorce in front of my whole extended family. WHOA MOM burst into tears? My aunt asked my dad what he was thinking. And My dad pointed right at me and said he told me to do it. This was the first Thanksgiving my then girlfriend now now wife spent with my family and every year she is aware of the looming threat. A bouquet brings with it to any holiday. What Oh yeah? Yeah Yeah Man. Yeah we're GONNA don't worry we're going to get some here. They're like food got ruined and we didn't have a good time. But like Shannon heavy stuff out of the way skilling Thanksgiving can go bad it can go so bad. I'm just GONNA go like I was like a window. I do this one because I just think it's perfection and DWI save. I'm just GonNa hit you with it now. He wrote mine next to it in the show notes in all caps. Yeah let's get art. Let's get our heavy ones out of the way. No No. I'm doing this going. This is a kind of heavy. Jesus I just read this one. So we're eating reading the mashed potatoes. I it's right and listening. And their raw create a layer Arab starts at the bottom of what. We're what we're doing. Is eating an entire bucket of mashed potatoes and having the post meal Bourbon before we actually start meeting right advocating a base of sediment. It's a great river that flows through Thanksgiving. It needs a bottom hold that we've got a couple of garbage disposal stories race at torque split one. I was stationed in Korea. We're already off to a great start. Suspend tastic Thanksgiving morning. I called by girlfriend and she broke up with me skin better. I started drinking Jack at nine thirty. AM after that. I hit on a girl that ended up being my CEO's girlfriend and topped off later by accidentally setting a local Michael Barr on fire citizen. They we're going to revisit on this on this episode. Are Several of you several of you sentence stories. Where we're the core story has nothing to do with fire but it ends with something on fire for unrelated possible that stationed in Korea as possible? The the bar was in North Korea and this was like international incident at an act of war. Yes yeah listen any any story that ends with and then I accidentally set a bar on fire. You automatically put a file in my head that says accidental bar arson listen and then that implies the existence of intentional bar are said well well attentional bar definitely have even been to the Atlantic coast of Florida Florida. Yeah now that's that's very true. Also I just imagine like when I accidentally set them bar on fire Korea. I imagined some very tiny little place in an and extremely dense city. That has thirty people in like thirty square feet right like go take the stool on the ceiling. And he's like Arganda flame. It looks like in the sims like ones whereas on fire the arts and it being career. There's people who did not leave the bar. 'CAUSE they're like I. I was at work sixteen hours straight. I'm going to be drinking for another eight and then I will get zero seconds of sleep sleep that I will go right back to work and this bark and burn and all I need to do is drink so I can feel something I have dragged through words. God dammit John Hoult this guy thinks he should leave the bar. 'cause it's on fire at the Thanksgiving. Thank you. Happy Thanksgiving realize area. Career is in Wisconsin Korea's total. Are you kidding Jason you can either give your view of the heavy one or if you WANNA pull his skin you're welcome. Let's go for the moment of Levity from Internet subscribers see co pack probably good head skinheads. Yeah let's just do both wants to mashed potatoes related issues. Why and I feel like these are like separate years one to high heat at the end and and the bottom burned and they tasted like cigarettes? So we've ruined the potatoes. What that sort of ties into number two number number two brother making potatoes sister bumped into him knocked a bottle of champagne into the plot? Kind of yeah so we got boozy infused in fused mashed potatoes painting cigarettes. That's new. Here's here's my thing about this story when you knock over a bottle of wine it's it's not like a bucket where you're like. All of the liquid is out like you have time to keep most of the liquid in the bottle. There was a decision. Somebody made that point where they're like fucking these are champagne. Let's see where this goes. Yeah like let's not pretend that this was just like we had no choice like a decision was made neither neither smashed potatoes mashed. I think you sound pretty fucking awesome and I might try them on purpose. Champagne champagne campaign makes everything better and better all. Yeah you can tell people it's classy. That's the Nice thing. Shin potatoes Champagne Champagne. I saw it do this. You know it's gotTa be good and please don't don't ask me and say I need garden has never had champagne infused mashed potatoes. You know she has. I mean I will say this I garden has at least made that combination organically by consuming both at the same time by the way. Can I just say they would a lovely goddamn evening. It would be to just be like. What are you doing going to eat this entire bowl of mashed potatoes and drink follow you? I worst nights on this earth. That man it's like it's like yeah. I'm just gonNA pound grilled cheese drink Rosa. All I see I see a problem with any of these constructions in theory. Nothing but stuffed crust pizza and champagne. Holly Holly you're up next next. Let's see what do I want. What do I want? I'm GonNa go with User Bacon Flavor in. which is her name still available? But I'm proud if you're one of our listeners. Bacon flavoring the night before Thanksgiving. We went to a restaurant highly recommended by my grandparents. I ordered a chicken sandwich. They asked if I wanted cheese. I said sure we'll that's your mistake. They brought out a fried chicken sandwich with craft single fuse to the middle of the chicken. The waiter noticed I was confused and asked me if I wanted more cheese so I said yes brought out another craft single a ball. This is this is the the the entry that most reads like drill owns. A restaurant did not say but I really. I'm sorry I don't know I don't know if this is a he reader reader reader a shredder But he doesn't mention whether the wrapping was still on the craft single when it was in the bowl and I really WanNa know it's like it's like serving a fish returned to show this I. I you take the wrapping with Russia. You know this is a good one. Yeah you get yourself. It's like fun that sounds like a fondle on don't my wife's craft time. How can I read? I can read it very confusing. One please preferably this this all right. I'm mostly. I'm confused by the the and maybe y'all can help me here. But there's A. There's an assumption here that I don't understand and it's in the first sentence this is from dirtbag queer on twitter. That's family was real into Pumpkin chucking. TV shows it was. Yeah this was a thing but the Tennessee explained. Yeah okay this is a this was a thing I forget the exact name of the show. Yeah now Where let's say Pumpkin chuckers? Yes with Z.. I don't think I think you're actually like really close to the actual name of this show show was like I'm pretty sure it was no. I'm pretty sure it was just called. Pumpkin chunking Oh my God yes pretty good and if in case you think that is the stupidest knowing that the potato gun show now if a case you think this is the stupidest show from the era of peak filler. TV Let me remind you there was an entire reality show about people who may luxury aquariums. Okay right yeah this this this is not even so this is a real. There's a real thing. Pumpkin Junkin was the name of the show and One particular addition event was called pumpkin chunk in all caps APPs superchunk with with an exclamation point right so to continue the story. A couple of my routier uncles built a rickety catapult in one uncle's backyard in the summer never tested it on Thanksgiving. We'll work through this and pieces first of all yes. We have multiple rowdy uncles. So this is already trending back based on past disaster episodes second. They've construct struck a weapon a siege weapon and third. They have not tested it. Yeah well that's that's the part. That's the part I wanted to get to was no testing stink. Of course it's not a Honda I don't have to government can't make me. It's not school on Thanksgiving. They vaporize to Pumpkin again against the back of the house. So for the record you make the not tested. Catapult was was that was the turn learn in the catapult worked. I was in the gut splash zone and I reached for weeks. The Gut splash zone. You know we love any any story. That includes a splash zone. This story has so much to it. It's one of my favorites. It's maybe like lease that I can identify with as a Thanksgiving activity but maybe I should. Maybe I'm missing out. Maybe I need to find some rowdy uncles Pumpkin chuck so the The PUMPKIN chunking. TV show show I think I found what got cancelled. Oh here's a headline. Did someone die injured. Pumpkin Dunkin producer disappointed show is off faces aces long recovery Suzanne. Dark Asians. Memory of the explosion is hazy continues on from there. What an awesome country we have now? Here's a question. What is technology how you're listening to me right now on your phone your smart speaker or laptop we know that's tech but tech is also the way we develop new mets dissidents? It's how we compose music. It's our connection to friends and strangers and it's changing everyday. I'm Ariel Jim. Ross and when I see see those changes I see worlds. I can't wait to dive into and question because none of us are immune to those changes and we need to understand their impact right now. That's why I'm hosting in New Tech. podcast called reset from recode by Fox will examine how artificial intelligence agence is changing the way right. I had a bizarre enter my head. which was I wonder if at some point these eyes are going to be people to write my novel ideas better than how Algorithms augment flaws in our thinking over and over again? We're seeing that these algorithms display bites. They can have very serious real world consequences for people. We'll talk to the bio hackers who are challenging regulators and end scientific standards. So would I sell crisper that somebody could inject muscles baber Bruno's and we'll look at the tools we have to save our world. Oh Yeah I've seen meaning Jones. I think you need fixed-wing detection. Raider the public everybody. It's we're all in this together. Every story is a story. And we're going to break that down. Subscribe right now on Apple podcasts. Or your favorite podcast APP from stitcher and the VOX media podcast network. Hello Listener her. Sean Ramos firm host of today explained. Vox Daily News. podcast every day Monday through Friday my team and I look at what's happening in the world. We pick one one essential news story that defines our moment and ask smart people to help us understand in about twenty minutes or less. It's the perfect way to start or end your day subscribed today explained for free on apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast APP from stitcher and the Vox media podcast network I would like to. I would like to cover a at king told me that one is the first one on the sheet. Let me tell you it contains one of my favorite things in any sort of piece of casting. which is this a woman who after years taking care of other people? It's as it has absolutely had it. One year. We let my grandmother cooked Turkey levels. Lead is doing doing a lot of work there. Okay let me I. Based on based on the average age of a listener to our show or even the rains like anyone's grandmother has probably cooked to shit ton and is not looking for you to let them do it. Yeah and let me go ahead and just dispel maybe an assumption in some of your heads before we get to the next part. Grandma might not enjoy cooking right like oh my granny she really enjoys cooking. Granny might be sick of this crap. Granting might be be like dear God I gotta put another set of eggs on some whiny little shits plate again. Just because I'm their grandmother I just want to have a lean pocket but you gotta come to my house now got to cook. All I WANNA do is go down to the Puffy Muffin. They get a coffee. PUFFY MUFFIN is a real place five. Muslims real no. It's still goes. I just wanted to go down to the Chunky. Pumpkin Timmy. Down take me down. Take me down to the PUFFY MUFFIN and get my pumpkin show. That's what my grandmother would do. I heard that about yeah she would never cook and she Dr Carr. My grandmother drove one speed in one on speed. Only in a cutlass. She drove it once. I'm sorry old. ADHD and she would drive. It stays go. She would drive at fifty five miles an in our everywhere highway fifty five miles an hour through an orphanage fifty five miles an hour. You're verging between between this detail and Puffy Offi muffin killer killer. Mike versus Puffy Muffin is but it sounds like a pickup line breakfast breakfast. This is as a breakfast. Establishment Brentwood Tennessee. Where my grandmother would go after getting her hair dyed her muffin? Puff because it's still open. Still Open they go and get her hair dyed with only the firmest most unholy black hair dye because that was natural and would go at fifty five miles an hour through that parking lots and come to a screeching halt. And go to the Puffy Muffin. Okay do you know why she didn't want to cook for anyone right. She's she's GonNa go to the Puffy Muffin all right so back to the Turkey. The grandmother cooking it. Someone said fairly quietly this is a lot drier. In last year's that person is the one who gets everyone killed right in the story. You got to jettison this person from the friend group and if you don't know who it it is in your friend group. It's years you. Yeah if you're on the lifeboat and you can't spot this person throw yourself overboard. No King told me that one says it was way dryer. She overheard it and proceeded to start throwing all the food in the trash. Because we weren't report afford what a fucking flex Beasley funky hoax dawning. Staring the little bastard right and very slowly not the trash blow dry after you starve to death and your body is taken by the winds erosion. Let's go over to quit airbags house and get blasted in the face with a kid. That's not dry. If you weren't wet food so bad you go down to the puppy gets you worthless asses. eighty-eight all of you and then. Why don't you just truck yourself on down to the poppy muffin? I will say this. For our collective raising wait we are all of childbearing slash borne age now l. and most of our children are old enough to be real shit birds. Now I feel like even when this show began we would have sided with the grandmother. Absolutely yes oh yeah yeah uh-huh yeah also. I'm sorry. This still sounds like a pickup line. Like hey girlfriend that puffy muffin. Here's the ears. Disappointing thing about the poppy muffin often. I just looked at the menu. It's not slang for pussy grabbing. There is nothing this appointing Sir. The menus totally normal. It's just like quiche French toast. Yeah they totally fuck it. Fuck you Brentwood. Yeah Pretty Much luck you pretty much I WANNA there. There are a few here that sort of have a common terrifying theme. The first is from cerberus. Two hundred x Thanksgiving morning. The oven permanently flipped itself to Broil. uh-huh mom would speaking a Cherry Pie. We had to. We had to UNPLUG IT in order to get it stopped to get to get it to stop and borrowed every three of in the neighborhood to finish cooking to laddis was a bit charcoal. CERBERUS included a picture. It's horrifying but the filling was delicious. There are at least two other stories on here that include at oven that won't turn off and they're they're horrifying. I mean like I don't know what to do I. Is this a thing that happens. I think you just sell your house very quickly. Okay 'cause because the the other one that we got one from read it from J W one one one and to skip to like the main basically what happened was his wife cooked Turkey in a disposable foil. Turkey pan poked a hole in the bottom. A bunch of Turkey juice in Greece leaked out and created some sort of electrolyte light reaction where all the electric starters were simultaneously activated and and he said so. The dog was barking continuously at the possess stove. No one could figure out how to unplug it because it was built into a kitchen island and so a group of sixteen people. All eight Thanksgiving dinner with the stove loudly going quickly look like my alley dachshund sacks yeah. That's a sucks beautiful man. Yeah who is next year you. It's easy okay. This comes to us from Ian is tweeting on Reddit. No tweeting is in his name. Pay Attention Parents by advocation home with two ovens shit the ovens are back the lower lather big big group one Turkey per oven. The lower over. Turkey isn't touched until I make a sandwich before my flight home Friday I start to feel ill in the car or plane sprint to bathroom at the ten thousand foot belt throw it violently. Pass out a welcome by crew. Fourteen minutes later get sick again. And then faint and I'll it's the swine flu era so they attempt to land the plane in Portland but can't so continue to Seattle paramedics. Carry me off the flight. Four hours after symptoms before how far as after the begin my heart rate is about two hundred beats per minute over two hundred beats per minute which is the case the entire time obviously food poisoning when five hours fourteen pelt. She did cook. That's not food poisoning. That's contagion from the wrong grill. This is you are an NFL offensive linemen and you have played an overtime game. That's that's cutting off your arm. Worst part I missed the Apple Cup. I'd flown home early for now. I followed up with the witch Apple Cup because we we're not one that if you had attended it would have been even worse than throwing up. Fourteen pounds on the plane. Turns out it was two thousand nine which means it was the year after after Ian had to watch the Crap Cup a year later think oh everything will be better than that and somehow find something even worse magnificence own own crap will cup. I'm you know what I'm just going to salute by the way was Ian or Apple Cup. Dave I'm going to do this real quick nick only because I actually disagree with the premise. Here I think this is a disaster. Okay at David Wide Cook and this involves another user which is amazing. The snitching here was really fantastic but as good. I'm actually going to defend this. nitwit Guy Tat snitch. SNITCH timed his friend. Yes yes I think. I think that's a strong move but I'm actually gonNA defend this NICCI here Okay we had a friends Thanksgiving giving during graduate school and angry Stevens contribution. That's at angry Stephen on twitter. That was just a guy called angry. Magris do I mean maybe. That's that's Godfrey we already know. Guy Hangary's bomb angry Stevens contribution was a ham however he forgot to thaw the ham before trying to cook it so he showed up with this ham five hours. After we've already eaten. Okay let me tell tell you what would really improve my Thanksgiving angry steven. You're talking about ham fourth meal. Yes because think about it. That's about when if you completely recovered right like everyone like you've already watched the horrible. NFL Games that are inevitably scheduled until for that day cowboys lose. Sixteen to seventeen right. And you're getting ready to settle in with in like in better times the the egg bowls on right And then maybe I don't know tech say. Lsu is on or whatever college game we have on right on Thanksgiving and you're feeling a little peckish. But you don't necessarily want to like you know. Hammer the carbohydrates again because you've already been on that Roller Coaster auster twice that day right extensively out case for night him and then all of a sudden a dude shows up with a pipe and hot delicious hand perfect. It's Hampton Claus Claus. Right typing hot. It was only recently thought Yeah but if he showed a five or like why would you show up five hours late with a ham that you hadn't finished cooking just eat at that point you know he'd wait for the sex so I think it's fair to assume it's at least warm ham okay. I'll settle for warming him. Yeah but he rose heroes up like with the clutch with the clutch aasheim watching introducing clips ham for your Puffy Muffin. The angry Stephen did reply to this and defensive himself. Quote this is slanderous personal personal personal attorney Michael Rice replies. It's liable but only if it's not true so that is no. This isn't a disaster. Yeah no if I've forgotten that you're coming coming to think about it if you're an hour and a half late I can be mad if you show up five hours late clearly. You're just you're just doing something different. If if you're five hours late I have forgotten exist. Yeah and you know what Shit Bonus Ham. I'm happy to see you. Oh Shit Product Ham. You're the fucking MVP. Yeah good job. Angry Steven goode jock. Stephen Holly what you can pick one now back I'm GonNa go with wayward ohioan. Who says first Thanksgiving on my own didn't realize you needed needed to start thawing the Turkey the night before called my mom to ask if there was a fast way to sell it at like one pm she laughs so allowed? I had to hold the phone away from my ear like you see in. TV shows had a ham sandwich. Cod See once again damn saving the day Clutch Damn nightmare but this is also this is also like this shows you the two sides of the coin because this person decided to give up the two sides of the ham hero and the Euro said No. I don't care that I haven't thought it yet. I will press through and I will finish. They started tell us about a time when you trusted in Night Ham. I'll tell you to. I don't know. Does this lead to us. Selling Warm Warm Ham nightshirts on homefield apparel it. Yeah that's and they're definitely Arkansas. Themed one hundred percent. Yeah Art let me. Let me tell you what way hold on Warm Ham. oriole stadium Houston. But hey that's a really fucking good idea with Mitch Mustard. The Him mm-hmm the context here with him. By the way I am entirely fascinated by my reaction to the suggestion that Hamby the post host mule meal. Because normally when you see Hamid holiday like noon you're like a little too early for all. The Ham slowed the flow. Much like cold slimy not really feeling it but man some night ham like a little bit of biscuit night here ham biscuits are actually Christmas Eve. Dinner dinner in our family going way back. My Dad's mom makes mazing country ham. I'm telling you Ham Hammond. Sunlight do not mix. You gotta serve it at night. Yeah it's it's it's once you're you're like you start even Thanksgiving start with good intentions. I'm going to have green beans. You know like all that but after after a meal and then dessert and then leftovers pam is just garbage enough to be sweet spot bringing me night him. It's time Therapa light up the signal commissioner. It's time for. Oh no no yards have shrunk to know like whatever whatever decorum restraint you might have thought you had at noon you walk into the Pantry. The at eight or nine that night like Anikin into the Temple of young links right morality balloting morality in shame no longer exists execute order piggly pink. All right this is from Bexley pay on read it. My extended family gathers at my uncle's every year for Thanksgiving. Each branch of the family is assigned a side dish. or a desert to be made in Institutional Quan- quantities as fifty people as slim crowd. One Year my mom was assigned to the Collard Greens. She hates washing them by hand. Dan Heard from a coworker that large quantities of Greens could be washed in the washing machine. OUGHTA gentle cycle era Odyssey gentle cycle. This is GonNa go fine because Judy's here so mom goes to. The store. BUYS IS BAGS OF PRE trimmed. Greens throws them in the Washer and goes about her business. She did not hear coworker. Say was that this only works for whole leaf chief Greens. The extended family ended up eating several huge cans worth off brand canned Greens dressed up with bacon fat and red pepper. Surprisingly well liked. That's it's the other secret of Thanksgiving is that it reveals that people are totally fine with like quick food rather than carefully made food and our family. We picked plant matter out of our pockets well after the new year. What Kale smells so bad? So bad yeah yeah. Thanksgiving thanksgiving is a Thanksgiving is a time to try new heck. I'm going to call this an urban legend because I've never heard of it. If it is an urban legend I get how it started because salad spinners kind of look and work like the drums of washing machines shore. Also you don't have to wash your underwear aware in the master. I guess would be my other point. Here's the thing this feels like Have you ever stumbled upon a recipe. That's like from a very strange like a very strange range about like. Hey Desert MOMS who cook dot block spine feels like a thing you would see their. Yeah Man Desert Moms who come from me now. God Damn it therefore crazy now we thought twitter and survive. But we're ready for anything. I don't need water. I did have a friend in idiot friend who decided that to. Oh wow his in laws who are not people who by the way exactly impress my in laws man designs and bad plan. I'm going on here. I tried to impress my fuck in this cool Dick Anyway. You wound up with. That was an entirely different form of night him. I was you end up with the mark of an impotent. God on your leg now man I tell everybody. Stay on the sleepy sleepy splits. We all have night hand means different things to different people. This has never happened before. Well it does happen half time actually scare the so. He decided to impress his in laws at Christmas. Now thanksgiving but at Christmas by cooking a goose. I had this terrible. Hadn't he ever met. Can I ask you can't he. Had He ever attempted a Turkey before Ooh he makes a full chicken. Yeah Feet Things Turkeys and Eagle. This guy doesn't even can't even tell birds apart. No no Ben. Franklin wanted the Turkey to be our national bird so so bays more Turkey is an eagle. Yeah Yeah same bird. According to Ben Franklin our greatest president all birds are ducks. Jason can we get a ruling from your daughter on this. It's been it's been decreed All birds ducks all right. So Ma Ma boy puts goose in the oven and I think he really thought he would do the thing where he pulled it out and it would be this. Golden luminous like a Christmas Carol Right. Yeah like that it would just. It would look like tiny tim would appear from the corner right and he you would set it on the table and they would all go. Oh my God you keep her a heart than home as well as provider member of the family right you baked nicked wonder. Yeah you amazing figuring for me. Yeah you amazing. Titan of a man bad and he put it on new bird master Goo slayer put on this. It's just how lady hawks should've ended the put it on the table right. He put it on the table to serve it and he's thinking it has had. Wow that color doesn't look great and that's probably I'm power through and at that point once he said it on the table The dad add got up grabbed his flip phone fired it open and it was like yeah dominoes. Wow Yeah judged yeah. Do we know the color of the goose. I think I'm I'm going to guess it's pretty gray. I'm GONNA say gray. Yeah Yeah it looks like like Scott Walker food picks the description. I got was Do you remember Solomon Grundy from the description I got was it was the color. Solomon Grundy's Dick Cheese that's that's evocative. Hey this is this is another thing I'm GONNA do instead of watching the poll I'm just GonNa Cyber bullies. Scott Walker's instagram with an annual tradition. Listen Yeah please yeah. It is absolutely what. The Founding Fathers Lit applauded Spencer. Pick another one. I'm just GONNA gotTa do this for I. Keep going for the dark ones but dear God. They're really good this this was at HCC Anderson. When I was five or six my dad came home with a live Turkey? I thought he was our new pet. No he lived lived in our garage for a few months. I'm on I love that Turkey. Yeah it's only. I watched my grandfather hold that Turkey and his lap pettit sing sing to it to come down than watched him bring its neck. Wow to it. Yeah and and then he rang its neck after lived in the garage for several months I imagine for. HTC Anderson later when he had to come home after university versity and spend a couple of months of this folks. You could sleep in the garage. There's probably something else used to sleep in that garage. Hey grandpa yeah pa you doing. Oh God I'm just GonNa come in here and saying to you. Don't worry why don't we. Why don't you just come sit in my lap? I'm going to swing wildly in the other direction. This is from Donny. Bridges on twitter. The night before Thanksgiving got introduced to drink called sparkled. Dog Andre Andre and Mad Dog Twenty Twenty Orange Jubilee. The next the next morning I wasn't hungover so much as the laws of nature. Were angry with me. Remember what I said earlier about fire coming from nowhere here has anyway. That's how I learned. Toasters could canton by the way. If you mix Andrea and mad dog twenty twenty jubilee it makes a handgun and a glass. Yeah this guy got this guy or girl got so drunk in hung over that. They like Ghostbuster D- their own own kitchen on fire. They were so goalie goes there was like make better choices. I I am the key master requests for me. Think about your actions drink water before you go to bed. Mad Dog really really. Is it my turn. Yeah I think so. Yeah all right. I'm going with a Reddit user I'm totally Gary Busey. I absolutely believe well given the age difference. I questioned this but this will come to bear one year in the mid nineties. My family drove from New Jersey to West Virginia for Thanksgiving on this particular drive winter weather caused massive delays on the Pennsylvania turnpike and we were forced to change. I route this. It'll be fine. Had My sister and I not been fighting like rabid possums. Needless to say our father a priest was on edge after twenty minutes of purposefully torpedoing every food option. My seemed or seem. My sister seemed to show any enthusiasm for my father. Tokyo drifted into a Maryland. Buffet a restaurant to shut us up at one point during dinner. My sister had the gall to ask me to go and get her more cottage cheese from the salad bar. I protested tested after minutes of going back and forth. My father looked at me and said just go. Get the fucking cottage. She God had spoken as I approached the cottage cheese with fresh plate. I couldn't help but feel slighted wronged. Cast Aside Okay Gary Then I proceeded to fill a full size salad plate with cottage cheese. I proudly walked my mound of Chunky white past grossed out and horrified diners. I could hardly contain came by laughter as I placed the plate in front of my sister. Here you go. I said expecting laughter in said my father pounded the table with his fists. gave the death stare and said one word leave. I remember just walking out the front door of the restaurant into the snow legitimately wondering if my family was going to leave me there to suffer a fate worse than death living in Maryland. I was struck by a priest at an off brand golden corral and this led to a six hour silent drive to our destination. That's a Fargo episode. No no I have a Fargo episode Sir Story Topper. Now it's not it's a compliment at the W. Fun to four two. Who tells this tale straight from Cohn brothers movie in the mid nineties my father single handedly decided that instead of cooking we'd pile in the car and and what like you know go to vacation like like good disneyworld right or kiss that that'd be cool if if you went to Disneyworld and sit no we'd pile in the car and drive three hours west to Hastings Nebraska because at the time it was home to the only theater in the state? Okay get past due on Thanksgiving. Okay not on Thanksgiving instead instead of thanksgiving. We're going to go see that. See the mummy. It's GonNa be Brendan Fraser's Creighton. It we're GONNA go see that movie about the penguins. They're so graceful in the water order awkward on land graceful in the water. Think about the policy of that. Think about the beauty and the irony in that one moment. Think about think about what I could have. I bet if I didn't have kids go to graduate like appendage anyway. Three hours films list of Amex films released in Nineteen ninety-five ozarks legacy and legend. Great one you guys are going to love it. It's about the ozarks irks. Ozark the ozarks reach up to seven hundred feet altitude. It's crazy so story continues. ellipses Duck Duck Duck. It was closed because in the mid nineties and central Nebraska and the holiday as my mother tried to tell him couldn't find it open open place to eat drove home to Lincoln. Hungry then. Dan Relented and cook the Turkey the following weekend. That's like a six hour round trip. Must be nothing. I zero for a payoff. That would've been how toys are made owned what what's really great about. This is like this is what life was like before everyone had a cell phone. You just went places on like you. Just sorta hoped they might have streaming content like. Hey there I've confirmed there. There is or was it movie theater here. I know it sometimes is open. I will do nothing further than this. And we'll just go and see what happens. What are you GONNA do? We're GONNA go see that every time Max it's going to be like you know what better way to celebrate Thanksgiving then to like watch. The death of nine climbers great. It'll be fantastic. Thankful aren't you. Yeah what are we going to eat. Knowledge Yeah then. Afterwards we'll go to converse. I and milk duds knowledge. Second favorite part about the story is that Dan relented and cooked the Turkey the following weekend meeting. That house had to be an icy dead silent like like Nebula of brewing passive aggression for a week and then the following Thursday right. He's like no fine critical Turkey. I think how dad plays this office. Aw Hey Turkeys are good and cheap now absolutely. I got a half price Turkey. I I think it's actually good when you fuck this badly. Because it's sort of like establishes a pecking order for the next. I would say at least ten years where there's no if if as long as you submit to. It's it's like you're just bad ideas dad and you're you're just gonNa live with that so you have to come up with like. Where are we going to go on vacation? I'm the fuck up. Drove to a closed. I Max ax three hours and asked me e I accept that. I don't have a role here. Having to make choice ever again. I will somewhat defend dad ad here because he was like. I'm going to do an idea with an idea with some some ambition and he gets it wrong one and I bet he never got anything through Karma it ever again. We're GONNA drive you the fuck fuck in Rocky Mountains to watch a movie yeah. He should've kept driving because he was driving. West us these right well. We've come this far to Oregon. This is how the fucking Donner Party happened at that point at that point. Light at your kids and be like. Hey I knew the Max disclosed we. Can't we gotTA leave. WE'RE GONNA CHANGE OUR names. We are old. Life is dead now no I definitely. Of course I didn't think an Imax theatre was opened on. Yea I would never be that stupid. It's adventure time now. I still three credit cards up that guy in the diner. We gotta get Outta here all right so so want everybody you pick one more before we wrap up on this already some so long episodes. But that's fine. I'm GonNa go I you all can sort of gather your shots and pick your final final entries. This is from at this hog. My 35-ish year old cousin Kata Squirrel. Whorl and thought it'd be a good idea to bring it inside the house to show everyone so? Of course it got loose in everyone freaked. I assume it eventually got back outside but I can't recall some say. The Squirrel still haunts Thanksgiving Day. Richardson talk talk easily. The like harshest part of this is the age reference. Because you could have just said my cousin my dip shit cousin but you had to you. You and I appreciate that you did this. This is hog. You wanted us to know that this is somebody well into voting age Who should have gotten all of their dumb assery out over the past decade plus who should know better than this but who still oh hey kata squirrel and be just brought it inside the House on Thanksgiving like I appreciate that you did not lead us down the path where we would have thought what what a dumb nineteen year old? No father. This is a dumb father yes I and as a dumb father I feel better. Because there's no scenario this Thanksgiving or any other where I will catch a squirrel and if I do be like hey time for a little petting zoo in the house. Same thing I believe you can catch us for all I have no intention of doing you can do you can. Why why would I okay because it wanted me through the rest of US okay? Okay Yeah I might do it for that. Reason can do it. Remember what John F Kennedy said about going to the moon. They're squirrels there. Yeah of moons haunted on debts. Wait yes squirrel so big that they prey on the Moon Tigers curse which are cannon us for our earlier episode you know the Russian cosmonauts guns us into space in case they landed in Siberia and had to fight bears set up. Yeah no that's true. No I'm pretty sure I'm going to get a tattoo. Do of it is fucking great. There's there's two things that right and there's this there are photos per Per Cash Book about prepping to Mars by the lady who wrote Stip Mary Roach. She wrote that Natalie. She confirmed the story that Russians and did have firearms right in case they landed on the steps and needed fend off wolves or bears. And then the second thing she found a photo of two Russians downing an entire squeezy bottle of brandy on the Mir uh-huh Americans like we've never had alcohol on there and the Russians are big sack and brandy is scientific chest waist pretty drunk. I'm GonNa say something wildly unpacked patriotic. I regret that we landed on the moon. I because the Russians would have popped out strapped on hundred percent. I mean none of us landed on the moon so it's not a fight. We've had this discussion Russian before room strapped but bus was package plus I think butch is through a nice fat. The low gravity gave me time to dodge chicks us. Buzz Sir. Armstrong's drugs out there like having the one emotional moment of his life and shedding his one tier of masculine emotion for his entire life span and inside ride. Buzz Aldrin's like butterfly knife quick while he's distracted by the emotion you'll ever allow himself to have the first thing that I can possibly imagine by the way it's plus seat like waiting looking out the window right waiting till Neil Armstrong's foot takes the last step off of wrong and then going he's turned shutting the door. uh-huh that's not kneel down there near yourself out of this fucking aw we go to attack. There's a moon man down there. I also like from Neal's perspective. He looks rockets. Gone and he says well still got a job to do. He's collecting dirt in his little jar. Ebeling it I'd just see him going like last piece in solitude at last I Free from purdue football goodyear like he would miss. Are we still going to the moon. Michael College's well let's get back in there and Buzzer man. It's crazy right. He's shutting wanted to stay. I don't know I was like Neil. Are you sure okay. Okay gotta go Mike. which is about an airlock over there? What do you mean you had a radio on the whole time? I couldn't find him. You go down there and you can be back to Michael so in big trouble for this Stephen Jackson after mouse total success. It's really toured with trouble. Yeah but he never he never got on with US scared. It was the two of us the whole time. He's probably in Hialeah the dawn track. Can you believe this. I thought you had him. Neal was a Russian the whole time. Tommy Dirty Commie were the companies like the cold. He's on the moon now. I just see them. Getting back and buzz going Gera- leave your dog and arrested. It's like that and you dad but also you just gotTa keep going. Yeah well on the upside. We cut some weight and saved fuel. That's what would happen if neil got back in there alone. Good I'll get. I'll get back three hours earlier. Good this look good on my expense report but also it. Would you do the inventory if there are five knives missing. I don't know why additionally if we now have ten within the way. Why did she knives on your family personal items Earth without an ar fifteen in? You came back back with what I was there. What do you what are we leaving the mood for some kid to find? That's not safe still does this does alter be like throwing error. It should not watching your back on the moon. Chicken the book. Hey remember would push me at the pool of that party three years ago. Fuck you. You're a mistake. It was loading our meal. Ever is the prestige shooting the STELCO. Don't go through the window. The Way Not enough dropping spacey plants and just like Jaren bear so Tom Hanks. If you're listening we will make this television series two day. Glad they're scrotal prints on the windshield of the module Aliens Aliens Alien Alien shape like scrotum horrify eight. Neil Moon tenures. That's supposed to if the Russians had made it I they would leave some of their just approved how hard they were. Yes we left Andrei. They're building a yeah. I know you guy will stay. I will fight you for state. Are you going to be okay Andre. No no no are any of us ever really okay. He is happiest moment of my life. Happiest I stay here. I go home same end. I wanted to do my last one. Which is which is? That's the American said for like five years alive Armstrong. Surprise me again Eh. Hopson smoke my dad. I almost didn't put this one on. Okay okay I'M GONNA. Yeah it's fine. It's fine I'm going to read it because I will tell you. The person involved is absolutely insane. Okay like like this is obviously a complex and there's a parenthetical that makes it a little bit more a little bit. The first parents had a colt. Mount the second you wouldn't necessarily do. We have to say all of this. We don't we. Can we can amend it. How about that? I'm going to amend it okay. My then great uncle stormed awesome. Stop there then agreed. Yes by then. Great uncle store because his great aunt was treating the l like very. Yeah no yes. GIVE SKIP SKIP skip. So there's there's a point in here where where. The great uncle uses a racial slur that is not to be not that is not applicable that that is neither accurate nor appropriate and Hobson smoke by the way anyway did not type it out right. Yes so to his credit so after stewing East dorms parties he left yes so so so scared. Your your uncle said something crazily racist. Yes your uncle. And then he's orange show and took the trouble to remove himself so that you don't have to remove him that was Hannity. Yeah so and then he went to the bar great decision. The great uncle is already done something really completely out of pocket and then he goes to the bar where he stews for a while while then he comes back. Raised a big stink went upstairs. Smoked a bunch of Shitty. We'd this is going great flick. He had to charge up the solid snake. Right hide in dumpster smoke cigar and proceeded to throw Christmas Christmas presents off the upstairs balcony. This wasn't just one. It was like twenty boxes all wrapped in thrown off individually. Yes this was Jacksonville. Smoke a bunch of dirt weed. Everyone's like Jesus. Christ he's looking like a powder oh to weed up there. Yeah it's really bad. They were hoping like well. Maybe that'll call him down. He'll just go to sleep or some shit in drug your shit on snake. Deploy Deploy Magical Cigar and then he threw old Christmas. This is presents down the stairs. I will say this one of my favorite things about having A child who is of a certain temperament is that my younger child. If Christmas presents were just raining down the stairs and everyone is just horrified at how completely antisocial. This man's behavior was my younger longer. Child would have walked up and begun unwrapping them. Whatever just like everyone else is like he wouldn't have even been like sneaky about it he would have been like no one is looking? God is not real time into tied to strike is now I can deal with those on the moon. Closing the Bam Gotcha Strand Yorkers real alternate energy. Yeah Oh he's he's going to punch somebody like one day for saying he didn't walk on the moon. Even though as far as IDO by younger son is never walked on the moon yet yet Jason Holler you each have one Mine is pretty short but it brings up to to personal memories of my From Warren Abel's I think on twitter as the last dish to finish cooking my mom. All right so our wording here we're GONNA WE'RE GONNA WE'RE GONNA WE'RE GONNA work on our wording. Mom placed a large glass pan of corn bread dressing on a ceramic cook top. She did not know one of the is was on. The PAN exploded into a million pieces spring glass shrapnel into all the other dishes now we have glass infused mashed potatoes This this did happen to us. Once it was green beans. Green beans exploded and we had several other podcast. Readers send in tales of exploding PYREX and whatnot We are very explosive. Bunch of the copper to warrant sale is we ate pizza hut for Thanksgiving and there were a lot of these found. All of these heartwarming Pizza Hut outback. a gas station Just dirtbag college students. AH WE'LL go get we're we're going to get you know anything edible and that's thanksgiving. This reminded me of my very first experience with adulting my parents write. The town is divided to an aunt's house but couldn't make it. All I had was a pizza and of course I fuck even that up out because I left the cardboard bottom on the bottom of it so that was one of your kitchen disasters time. Yeah I just wanted to sort of bring that that one over with us as well no. That's that's a good portable sadness the colony holly. I'm going to ask you to take us out on the item in row fourteen protein of the item and were fourteen from user from user. Hey Mr Tally Ma'am Damn yeah. Okay my grandfather. who was a furrier missile? Come to bear in a moment. Start carving the Turkey he noted well Turkey is really juicy. He had cut his hand. Not the Turkey hadn't noticed tonight everybody.

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Cupid-19

Today, Explained

24:16 min | 6 d ago

Cupid-19

"From director Jay. Roach and writer Paul redneck comes coastal elites a socially distant satire and five comedic confessions about coping with the new abnormal the all new seventy, five minutes, special stars, Bette Midler, Caitlyn deavere Dan, Levy Sarah Paulson e suray as five characters breaking down and breaking through as they grapple with culture politics and the pandemic coastal elites premiere Saturday September Twelfth at Eight PM on HBO and streaming on HBO. Max. Today explained I'm Sean Ramos Room and over the past six months. Now of everyone being some state of quarantine or lockdown, we've talked a lot about how that's affecting our society, our economy, our cities, our buildings are relationships are our families, our our psyches, but we haven't talked about one essential component and that is our love lives. But today explained reporter producer Helena's Shah has been focused on just. That thing for the past few weeks Halima what have you discovered? Well, cove in one thousand nine has basically made an already awkward gain more awkward and there is a lot of sadness when it comes to relationships during the pandemic. For example, a lot of people who might have been in the early stages of a relationship are finding that it's fizzling out and a lot of people who were. Divorce or maybe splitting up are basically having to cohabit with the people they were planning on leaving. That's rough but and there's a big button here or growth. Yeah. There's a silver lining I was about to cry. We don't want people to cry anymore. We make them cry plenty on this show in the silver lining in this case is that some people are finding that the pandemic and the lockdown is helping them advance their relationships. Cool. So are we going to hear from some couples or what we're going to hear some couples? We're going to hear from young people living. In cities who are in their twenties and thirties and we're also going to hear from people who are facilitating these relationships are going to hear from matchmakers of sorts Cuban. We're going to hear from the digital version of Cupid we are going to hear from one of the leaders of bumble. Cool. All right. Where do we begin? We begin with twenty-four-year-old Sierra? I'm from Chicago. I live in DC I identify as queer. I'm black. I'm a woman I like scary movies. And I knit I asked her if that's where her tinder profiles said. If you wanted I could probably pull up exactly what? Sierra and I met at a park by the way reporting like dating during a pandemic often takes place outdoors and six feet apart. Okay, here it is. So my profile says always aiming to find the perfect first date with like the rock on hands big NERD and huge extrovert I love meeting New People and trying new things more than anything. Shy City Tall Sierra was on tinder before the pandemic started and she has a pretty good response rate the people she likes tend to like her back. But after the pandemic started Sierra was browsing tinder swiped right on one woman who she wasn't sure would be a match. Rachel. She also probably saw has her tender up heritage. UBU like. Excellent pictures of her. Very intimidating. It's incredibly intimidating because that's and that's the bio. Her style I would say as Blake. Like simple upscale Kinda chic. She has a couple of photos in swimsuits She has a few photos in suits. She looks like a model. Yeah. I remember just being like, Oh, well, that's not gonNA happen but like she's really hot and then swiping and we instant match leg. There was one problem though. Sierra and Rachel from tinder matched in March just as Washington DC shut down because of the pandemic. On top of that, Sierra lives in a group, House with five other roommates who all agreed to strict social distancing rules. We have to wear a mask whenever out of the House for the first month of quarantine we were only going on like night walks. That's the only time we're leaving the house is like to go to the grocery store and going night walks as a group. Can't go on anyone else's home It was all very precautionary and because I was living in a group house where I wasn't. Only, in charge of my own health, I didn't feel comfortable like breaking that. Since, it was agreed upon. So I asked Sierra what she was looking for on tinder. Someone to secretly break the rules with a pen pal. Like a hot romantics ish pen POW. That would end at the end of. Quarantine I had just not of a relationship in like November. and I was very like it is finally time for me Sierra to be intentional about like being by myself. So I not trying to start dating anybody I had I was wiping on tinder lot because I was bored I was like oh I'll just like you know snatch up a few quarantine booze like have people to talk to there are plenty of people in their twenties who will tell you the same thing being in lockdown is boring especially if you're single That's Nikki Dell's and arrows experience. She lives halfway across the country in Chicago with one roommate before covid. Through Kovic, I have been single I have been on the APPS every once in a while intermittently, but I never stay on them for too long 'cause I don't love them. So then I sort of just try to meet people. Who are friends of friends or doing activities that I like to do in the wild her natural habitats are bars, baseball games, comedy shows, and all of them off the table in the Cova era. So to date while social distancing in twenty, twenty Nikki found herself connecting with the men of Twenty nineteen? Yes. Yes. There are only two guys I've hooked up with. This year and they were both people that I met in the fall but Nikki is being cautious and not just because of covid. Nineteen what we've been seeing in memes and social media for the last few months is that the men who come out of the Woodwork from twenty nineteen? They don't have great intentions. You know they're just trying to see if you'll break quarantine for them. Because are just like fuck boys who can't meet anybody new so They're going through the old books that said Nikki seen upside to dating during covid nineteen, the pandemic kind of acts like a filter and weeding out people who aren't taking the seriously like who aren't wearing masks who are traveling all over the place and hanging out in large crowds and I'm like if you don't take the seriously, I don't have a chat about when you were tested or what your exposure look like the you can't break quarantine with me. Filter has kind of worked for Nikki. The first guy she saw during quarantine was open about where he went his roommates activity and he discussed getting tested in the case of another guy on social media he had been. Talking Shit about trump's response to cove it and I was like, okay, he must be taken seriously and then he told me lived with his grandparents and had been tested like a week prior, and this brings us to the reason a lot of people are dating during a pandemic sex. One survey found that more than half of young adults in Chicago broke quarantine to have a sexual encounter. Same with a quarter of people in La and nearly fifth New York. Public health departments know this and since kissing through mask or sex without breathing seem impossible local health departments are releasing guidelines for safe sex cheering covid nineteen. Common advice is your safest sex partner is yourself your next safest is someone who lives with you, and if you want sex with someone outside of your household, have as few partners as possible also discussed cove nineteen as you would any other safe sex topics and do it beforehand. For Nikki taking those precautions feels like the smartest way to continue dating right now you are trying your best to. Have a life. You enjoy, but also think of others. So maybe that's just my personal justification by. I think it has been healthy for me. To find some middle ground. Back in DC people like Sierra who live in big group houses have to take extra caution if they wanna go out with anyone during the pandemic. She and Rachel from tinder were texting back and forth and seeing each other virtually. The to wanted to be more than pandemic pen pals but Sierra had some strict house to consider. So for the first in person date, they sat six feet apart at a park near Georgetown University. It was George Son's graduation day sound out later on our day that she had graduated a couple hours before a date. I think we both brought like beers and like traded, and this was when I was still like sanitizing every single thing. So we just yeah, we just sat in a park and talked for three hours. Sierra didn't tell her housemates about her date. Or the next one or the one after that. But she says, those dates were all socially distant. It reminds me of like courtship my parents when they met were in this very devout. Christian. Church and you weren't allowed to date you quoted and so you didn't touch each other. So then I asked Sierra the obvious question. When did you to finally touch? It. Was it was an Malcolm. X Park. It's a huge part. There's an upstairs and downstairs. So like a flat part top and then stairs lead down. Hill like areas where people have picnics. brought blankets and wine and food good and just kind of like sat and talked. We got quite drunk in the park which was nice because it was a beautiful day it was. It was drum circle Sunday. So. You could hear the drum. It was very romantic for his like a city and. Black we're? Room. While like an African drumbeat circle happening on top. She was being super careful around me. She didn't want me to get in trouble with my roommates but. This I was sitting next to her and I had my legs over her legs. We just kind of like gently brushed legs. And touched each hands. And I wasn't really allowed to touch anybody else. So like it was such a huge deal. And just like that. The era and Rachel from tinder broke the covert rules. It didn't go any further that day and right after they touched Sierra used hand sanitizer. But the date went well Sierra and Rachel from tinder wanted to keep seeing each other and eventually become intimate. So Sierra and her housemates set up new travel and sex roles. The sex rules were once you have a sexual encounter like you wear masks house for two weeks and you get tested you kind of quarantine yourself. You just wear a mask, you have your own set of dishes. it can only one person. So it was a very like choose carefully type of situation. So Sierra kept seeing Rachel from tinder. They both got tested for covid nineteen they stayed home as much as possible. And they only met at Rachel's place because she lived alone. So Holy Moses just like a booty call between Sierra and Rachel what happens to their relationship. You will find out what happens to their relationship after the break. From director Jay Roach and writer Paul rebound comes coastal elites a socially distance satire and five comedic confessions about. Coping. With the new. Abnormal. The all new seventy, five minutes, special stars, Emmy, Grammy and Tony Winner Bette Midler Golden Globe nominee Caitlyn deavere emmy nominee Dan Levy Emmy and Golden Globe winner Sarah Paulson and Emmy and Golden Globe nominee easily as five characters breaking down and breaking through as they grapple with culture politics and the pandemic when the shutdown forces these distinct and impassioned people with varying points of view across the United States to cope in isolation they react with frustration hilarity and introspection coastal elites premiere Saturday September Twelfth at eight pm on HBO and streaming on Hbo Max. Okay Halima. We've heard from Sierra. We've heard from Nikki. Is it time to hear from Cuban herself? Yeah. It's time to hear from multiple CUPID's actually because for months now states across the country have ordered people to social distance, and if you're trying to date those rules are going to make it really challenging to meet anyone in person. So this is where the digital matchmakers come in. Even though people are staying home, they're still looking for love since the pandemic began dating APPs have seen an uptick in use bumble has seen a twenty six percent increase in messages. Now Tinder, there's been an increasing number of conversations that are taking place in has also seen uptick as much as thirty percent increase in messages in March dating APPs like bumble and the League are seen an increase in activity as people stay home to practice physical distancing apps are adapting to the new normal of dating tumbles Vice President of strategy brief Joshi said the APP rolled out new features to help users stay safe during the pandemic. We launched a feature called the virtual dating badge, and you know what they're able to do basically is used that badge to not only indicate, hey, I am comfortable going on a virtual data socially distanced date essentially distance date with a mask on but then they're also able to filter based off of their preferences and so they can find other users who are kind of in the same risk tolerance if you will as they are just so that everyone can feel safe and comfortable. It's a great time to own a dating APP match group which owns match tender and OK cupid recently released its second quarter earnings report. It shows more people are using the absence cove nineteenth started. We actually saw an increase to nearly seventy percent in voice calls and video chats right around the time that cove it was declared a national emergency back in March to the first week of May we also saw that these calls were actually on average thirty minutes long which if you think about it, that's a pretty decent first virtual date. Briefly sees it as a sign that users are interested in more than messaging. She says, they want to be more vulnerable with each other talk for a longer period before meeting but wild cove nineteen is slowing some relationships down. It's speeding others up. Josh, and I were together I should know this take for example, Josh and JC we started dating in. What Twenty Tan and we were engaged in two, thousand and nineteen. But did we have a date set? Maybe in our heads we did yeah, I don't think we discussed it really outside of hey engaged. Now what Josh and JC talked to me about their amorphous wedding plans from their home in Madison. Wisconsin where Jaycee works at a public radio station that offers health insurance and where Josh is transitioning out of a career in academia, which does not come with health insurance I was already living in precarious life in academia and. Bouncing around from a few different institutions and I got really sick really randomly and it was pneumonia. But like for about four or five days, I like couldn't get out of bed and it was it was really scary that was in mid-november a few months later, US started seeing its first cases of community spread of covid nineteen. Once the the pandemic kind of became this real thing I had already had a taste of what? Life. A without health insurance would be like, but then also be without the sort of contractual protections you get when someone is like your emergency contact or go to prison or like whatever someone you can put in your will. So that was like one prompt I think. I think are combined experiences in the fall with the pneumonia and hearing that it was a respiratory thing was like, Hey, we don't really WANNA. Fuck with us. Being at urgent care with. Josh. Not, being sure if they were going to let me go back with him at times that I didn't have the same rights as. Know people who are married I am your emergency contact but that if anything had happened in an emergency room, we weren't sure if they would even be in touch with me. So, in January, the two got a marriage license. And in March a day before the marriage license expired JC and Josh got married at a courthouse in New York. We were like Nicer version of whatever be packed like probably what I was going to wear my interview is what I wore. I wore a pair of olive colored pleated Pants Anna, turtle neck and the wedding went something like best. Do you, Joshua take this woman to be your wife Yeah I. Do Blah Blah Blah and you JC do you do the same thing? Yeah. I do okay you're done by It was rushed, but it was still really charming and weird and like whimsical, which actually added to like some of the romantic part of it. Cove it really did forced the hand of a lot of people either in really pushing up their time line and getting married sooner rather than later or for people who have had to stop their planning altogether because so much is up in the air. It's just a weird time. A weird frustrating and sometimes romantic time especially for people like Sierra and Rachel from tinder. There still seeing each other five months after they both swiped right? We're dating. She's my girlfriend's and it was wild to me that like I fully created and fostered or relationship we didn't even hang out in person for like two months. And we didn't touch for three months. Sierra thinks the pandemic created a unique set of circumstances that brought the two together. We're both like LGBT and so we were going to a lot of the same bars and we're both really tall people and we're both black women and both of us always say like it's wild. I never met you out. We've even date stamped certain days where we knew we were both at the same bar and like we probably were there within fifteen minutes of each other and just never ran into each other. So each other I asked if they dropped the elbaum yet. We have said L. Word. Because I. Love Her. We both agreed that we probably wouldn't have dated. Or even spent like maybe more than like one or two dates like hookups with each other had we not had to get to know each other for so long because I'm a very sex positive person I don't know why taking that like aspect out fostered such a like interesting relationship with each other and like a good relationship but it did. So I think I learned a little bit more about like slowing down with somebody and like trying to delve really deep into like who they are as a person. I mean I'm very in love. And I wasn't expecting it. That's kind of fun. When we set out to talk about love in the age of Covid nineteen, we asked our listeners to share their stories. And we got a ton of messages. Probably more than the shows ever seen and it confirmed a suspicion that a lot of us here had. The, even though so much of our lives have been put on hold in twenty twenty. Love still finds a way. Be It a spouse a new. Boo. Or pandemic pen PAL. And if you're not trying to lock it down in lockdown, there's always the fuck boy from twenty? Nineteen. Halima show she's a reporter and producer today explained her story was edited by Jillian Weinberger and the theme Shapiro's The shows engineer. The rest of the today explained team includes Amna Al Saadi moods eighty and Noam Hassenfeld who contributes music to extra help this week from bird, Pinkerton and Cecilia lay and major developments. This week will rejoin. The team will was once our intern. Now he's straight up producing the show we're so glad you're back will and no big deal Gold Arthur joined our team this. Week to run the show where most stoked to have you called. Thanks for joining us. Kelly Nelson is still vox editorial director of podcasts, and we still use a lot of the mysterious brake master cylinders music. Sincere. Thanks to all of you who generously and some cases very candidly shared your stories of lockdown. Love we laughed we cried we sloughed. We're thinking about a spin off to date explained to dates. Splayed will let you know in the meantime today explained his part Vox media podcast network. From director Jay Roach and Paul redick comes coastal elites a socially distant stat higher and five comedic confessions about coping with the new abnormal. The, all new seventy, five minutes, special stars, Emmy Grammy and Tony Winner Bette Midler Golden Globe nominated Caitlyn deavere Emmy nominee Dan Levy Emmy and Golden Globe winner Sarah Paulson and Emmy and Golden Globe nominee array as five characters breaking down and breaking through as they grapple with culture politics and the pandemic when the shutdown forces these distinct and impassioned people with varying points of view across the United States Cope in isolation they react with frustration hilarity and introspection coastal elites premiere Saturday September Twelfth at Eight PM on be Oh and streaming on HBO Max.

Sierra Rachel Sierra Nikki Dell Jay Roach HBO Chicago Sarah Paulson United States director Emmy Josh Halima Golden Globe Golden Globe writer Tony Winner Bette Midler Bette Midler Sean Ramos producer
Who framed Mayor Pete?

Today, Explained

20:33 min | 1 year ago

Who framed Mayor Pete?

"Before we get started with the show today. A quick reminder that it's may it's time for spring cleaning. And that includes your belt. The quip electric toothbrush starts at just twenty five dollars. And if you go to get quick dot com slash explain to right now, you can get your first refill pack for free. That is g e t q IP dot com slash explained. There was a press conference this morning that you might have missed. Well, there are these stories out there. These these reports about a kidnapping took place. Young nineteen year old man, various media outlets have repeated this everyone from the Daily Beast to the New Yorker, and so on you might have missed it because it was held in a driveway in northern Virginia. There were some sort of kidnapping subway sandwiches. There was a nineteen year old involved. The press conference was mostly given by guy named Jacob bull to double down on alligators against mayor Pete Buddha. Judge allegations that could end his presidential campaign. The thing is they won't will summer's been covering this very messy smear for the Daily Beast. So this very thinly source sexual assault allegation surfaced on the website, medium, a young man hunter Kelly claimed that he had been sexually assaulted by the mayor, and he he really didn't have any details. And he sort of said, I will be revealing my story later, and what was the story that he revealed later. The post was very vague is just said mayor Pete sexually assaulted me. So this had all the hallmarks of as sort of right wing smear. Very few details. Basically nothing that could be corroborated. Besides this young man's name. Nevertheless, it blew up on right wing media guy mentioned on blogs like big league politics, and the gateway pundit, which are kind of these classic like hoax, blogs that run this kind of stuff and soon it made it over to one America news, which is a cable network sort of Kim to Fox News and an online blog post today the alleged victim. Identified himself as hunter Kelly. He claims the alleged sexual assault happened back in February. When he didn't know who Buddha. Judge was Kelly did not provide much detail of the alleged assault, but claims Bodo judges actions, deeply affected him and provoked suicidal thoughts. So it got some pretty wide pickup. But to those of us who follow these kind of right wing hoaxes. This had all the hallmarks of a smear by Jacob wall. And Jack Berkman who are to kind of like pro-trump operatives in famous for their blundering attempts to smear people with sexual assault allegations. This was also suspicious because one of my colleagues at the Daily Beast already had a recording of Jacob Boll and Jack Berkman approaching another young man and saying trying to convince him to make up a sexual assault story about people digits. So then when this allegation comes out, it's really obvious that they've essentially succeeded in getting a young man to do it. So how does this allegation accusation fall apart? So they pick up for a couple hours and then the Daily Beast. Fronts a story shortly after that hundred Kelly says never mind it was all fake. I was tricked into this in a Facebook posts. And he lays out a story that is really wild. He essentially says that a couple of weeks ago Jacob wool notice that he was following him on Instagram is kind of this like hunter Kelly's this young Republican. Okay. And he said, why don't you come to DC, according to honor Kelly said Instagram message, and we'll brainstorm, you know, how we can maybe dig up some dirt on Buddha. Judge. Kelly's claims that he wasn't told you're going to make this sexual assault allegation. We're just kind of think about ways to take down. So then he gets to DC and he's taken a Jack Birkin's house and Jack Berkman this kind of like longtime Republican lobbyist real kind of a famous bumbler. And so they go to his house which ecobill and hundred Kelly cleanse, it's really late at night. And they say, basically, you're going to make this sexual assault allegation and hundred Kelly claims he said, oh, no, I don't want to whatever. And then he goes to bed the next morning. He wakes up they've posted supposedly posted it in his name with his face attached to it. And he goes, oh, no. So then essentially he they have security guard there, and he feels almost trapped late like he can't go anywhere. And so eventually he has this ruse basically where he calls. His sister lives in the area and packs his bags and says he's taking a nap and secretly he's trying to negotiate his escape, and then he sort of. Runs out the door to be rescued by his family. And then proceeds to say it's all fake. Why go after mayor Pete? He's not even like a front runner. Kind of got a low profile, right? Seems like a nice guy. So according to the recording the Daily Beast, Scott Jacob bull in particular was very scared of mayor Pete's electoral ability against Trump where Hugh you to win the primary. He said he described him as this major threat. So it appears that they decided to sort of cook up an allegation against him to take him down. And did anyone actually by this story before or after you and your colleagues debunked it? Well, I think the way the stories work is even if they fall apart relatively quickly. The key is to sort of create the idea and to to get it floating out there because the way conservative and sure pro-trump media works is there's not going to be a ton of disapproving of ideas that that work to their benefit. Yeah. So for example, in the case of the people to just schmear we saw a lot of right wing blogs jump on it immediately without. Any any confirmation? No, one had talked a hundred Kelly whatever I mean, any person could have made that medium post. So from there kinda circulates it gets on Twitter, and you know, it just kind of lodges in people's heads. I talked to sort of an average Trump supporter today this happened. And she said, well, you know, I heard people to judge sexually assaulted someone and the Domon king had come out hours before. But you know, once you get that. It's like, okay sounds good. You know, you're not really following for updates on that tell me a bit more about this. Shady duo Jacob Jack Jacob all Jack Berkman, our guys who have sort of gained reputations. As tricksters independent one of one another Jacobs, really young. He's twenty one. He his dad is a sort of a pro-trump lawyer Jacob originally became famous for being the youngest person ever banned from futures trading after this sort of investment scheme. He had went belly up, and he basically got out of it just with this lifetime band in Jack's case. He's Jack Berkman is a longtime DC. Lobbyists known for big stunts. So before this. He's most notorious in Washington for being a big Seth rich conspiracy theorist. So the Democratic National Committee staffer got murdered DC police theorize it was a botched robbery the latest in a string of attacks in the neighborhood as Richard's family and friends mourned, he became the subject of a baseless conspiracy theory, the claim was that he was the source of the DNC emails about the Hillary Clinton campaign that WikiLeaks released later that month Jack was claiming that it was like this ATF hit team that did it all this stuff. So these two guys linked up last year and ever since then they've sort of combined their powers of like chicanery and kind of. Incompetence I guess to produce these really catching stunts that fail almost immediately. So we'll is is Pete Buddha. Judge the I like prominent politician these two guys Jack and Jacob have gone after. No this far from it. They were most recently in the news for attempting to smear Robert Muller when he was still the special counsel with a sexual assault allegation last November. So in this case, they had attached their names to it. And they had essentially said we have this young woman who Muller sexually assaulted when he was FBI director. And again, they had a name attached to it. And they said, you know, come to our press conference, and we'll prove at all. But but even from the beginning their their scheme was sorta starting to fall apart. Jacob had this fake intelligence agency called surefire intelligence that purported to be, you know, all of these operatives across the world looking for information on Robert Muller, but it was actually just photos of Hollywood celebrities and models. So like Christoph waltz from inglorious bastards, for example, was like the head of the agency and the the picture of the guy who really ran the agency was really dark, but if you use Photoshop to brighten it it was just a picture of Jacob. Well, and they didn't go to jail. They did not go to jail, they do not appear to face any legal consequences. I should say that the the alleged Muller accuser, they had a couple of months later came out and said that Jack and Jacob and essentially tricked her into it just as one hundred Kelly now says he was tricked into it. So she's denounced that said that they made it all. Does these dudes have jobs right in terms of what they do for a living. It's really unclear what Jacob does, you know? He's a young guy, obviously, he can't trade futures because he's been banned from that. So it seems like he kind of just professionally like comes up with schemes. In jackson. But these schemes don't sound like they pay much. Right. Exactly. I mean, it's very mysterious. I will say one thing is like a big question is if anyone is funding them, and, you know, whether they're getting funding from other Republican donor are where that money's coming from in Jack's terms, he's a lobbyist although not a very high powered one he's a lawyer in DC, which also I think raises questions about how he's still barred. After claiming that these people are as clients, you know, they had this affidavit about Muller that later turned out to be they said, oh, look there's this. This victim signature is on it. It turned out to be docu signed. So essentially anyone could have done it. And so there's going to be a lot of very interesting criminal issues here that have not been fully explored or should be left to the authorities. So it doesn't sound like this'll be like the last we hear from these two guys. It does not appear to be the end of jacker Jacob at least for now. I mean, they really do not seem to learn from their lessons or been chasing it in any way. So I think they'll be back at it soon enough. Jacob and Jack may be totally incompetent. But they're using a template. That's worked before. I'm Sean Ramos firm, the anatomy of a smear after the break today explained. Hello. Hello lily. Hi, sean. Rumor has it you and Peter getting married and in advance of that marriage. You have both purchased his in hurt. Quips? We've did that really cute? Where did you get them? I got them at get quip dot com slash explained. GT Q U IP dot com slash explained lily. I have great news for you. And for Peter and for your his in her quips with quick now has a kids clip. Did you know about this? Oh, gosh. We're getting pressure from. No pressure. But you know, it's the same old quip, but with a smaller brush head for the kids and anti-catholic watermelon toothpaste lily. I can't get over this end. I'd cavity watermelon toothpaste and might just get it for myself. I love watermelon flavor toothpaste. They have them at the at the get quick dot com slash explained. With a starts at just twenty five dollars as you. Well know and your first set of refills is free. Have you gotten your first refills for free yet? We haven't yet the quips are very new can we check in once you do. Sure. Sure. Okay. Great. Hey, say hi to Peter. I hear he shy will do. Thanks, sean. Well Jacob and Jack didn't invent this game. Right. Didn't didn't even come close? No. I mean, certainly, I think one of the most obvious examples would be James O'Keefe sort of an Torius right-wing prankster undercover operative Abby on Planned Parenthood. All right. Exactly, you know, supposedly dressed as a pimp and went in during the height of the Alabama Senate race, he attempted to basically place false rape allegations against ROY Moore, the Republican Senate candidate at the Washington Post. Yeah. Essentially trick the post into running these claims and then embarrass them. So this isn't the first time that a fake news story, particularly fake sexual assault. Story has been dangled in front of reporters. I mean, probably the most successful one would be the birther conspiracy theory right about Barack Obama's birth certificates being born in Kenya. Why doesn't taste show his first ticket? And you know, what I wish he would President Trump, obviously help that one chart, but who actually did the legwork wealth. I think the most obvious. Person in that case would be Jerome Corsi. The sort of longtime right wing conspiracy. Theorist who's now swept up in the molar investigation. -servative writer drone Coursey today. Filed a seventy eight page criminal complaint against Robert Mueller, accusing special counsel of engaging in a coup. And this is a guy who if you're looking for someone who's much more successful at these kind of dirty tricks. That's probably you'd look to because he sort of creates these things out of whole cloth, and they take on a life of their own. They're taken on by various people in the right wing media who have their own agendas, and who's rarely see the advantages in terms of audience and profit to promoting these ideas, and then it kind of goes from there. So Jacob jacker sort of a poor man's version of your own Coursey. Because of course conspiracy actually makes it to the big leagues to Fox News. I think that's the idea on the other hand jacket. Jacob are discovering. It's not that easy, particularly in the case of sexual assault claims which are pretty closely vetted because of the damaging nature of the allegations. But I think. At the same time. They also I think wisely realize that Democrats particularly sensitive to allegations of sexual assault from their own candidates. Yeah. And so that if they could somehow make this stick in the primary they could have a pretty good chance of injuring particular candidates chances. And this kind of happen to Cory Booker recently too. Right. So yeah. So sort of the incident to this people to schmeer was this anonymous Twitter account that was claiming that to be a man who was sexually assaulted by Cory Booker. There wasn't a real person making the accusation. There wasn't a name attached to it. Nevertheless, all these same, right? Win blogs that picked up the Buddha JR. Thing pick this up just based on a couple tweets. And they said, wow. You know, this is this is real, I guess, and it got all over the place and this was during the bread cavenaugh confirmation hearing. So it was sort of like, well, you Democrats when will you answer for Cory Booker completely nonsense claims, but it nevertheless, really sort of worked its way into the right wing firmament and people thought of it as a legitimate thing. So in that case, we never found out who was behind it. You know, this r- Republican lawyer claim to be representing the accuser, but we never found out any more about it. So in that case it was unfortunately, success another. For instance, Elizabeth Warren who's facing all of these just wild accusations about her. So for example, recently her there was this hoax circulating that. She takes his antipsychotic drug called rispler doll. And this was a relatively little known thing in right wing media that was floating around. But Elizabeth Warren campaign came out, and they had this site that included apart. That's Elizabeth Warren does not take Riverdale. Now. I think for a lot of people had never heard of that. And so that's sort of ends up fueling the rumor as well. So you sort of end up in this situation where sort of damned if you do damned if you don't so democratic campaigns are trying to figure out how you deal with these rumors these hoaxes, and unfortunately, I think a lot of times the way they decide to deal with them and often the only way you can deal with them is by aknowledging them, which usually ends up just giving it more oxygen? Speaking about all these Democrats who've been accused of stuff like this makes me wonder have left. This group's done this to Republicans recently. Or is this kind of Haag wash always flowing in the same. Direction. That's a that's a good question. I would hate to say it's never happened. But certainly in recent memory, I don't think so. Yeah, it's interesting because I think a lot of what Jack Jacob are working with here. And what we also see what the James O'Keefe thing is their operating on this idea that comes up whenever there's a Republican accused in a high profile sexual assault case. So whether that's all the women who have Donald Trump of sexual assault or ROY Moore or or breath Cavanaugh. So basically, the right wing media tells viewers and voters they say, this is totally made up. This person is probably getting money on the side. This is just a political ploy. So then it appears the Jack Jacob see this. And they say, well, why don't we do that? And not face any real consequences. Right. I mean, I I think that that one open question is how many legal issues Jack and Jacob we're going to face over this. Yeah. Or over their previous stuff at the same time. I think we're seeing the social media networks take a lot more aggressive approach versus what they had twenty sixteen. And I think that's mainly because they've kind of been, you know, just yelled at a lot in congress. So they're being more aggressive. I mean Jacob has been kicked off Twitter for operating various fake Twitter accounts. So I think all of these people are aware that if they sort of pushed too hard with this with this fake news, kind of stuff, they'll get kicked off social media. I mean, frankly that sorta the only thing we have right now. But like we're caught between not wanting to take allegations like these seriously, you're breathing life into them. And then absolutely wanting to take me to type allegation seriously and believe accusers. Right. What position does that put like your average news consumer in? Right. I mean, I think Jack, and Jacob are are recognizing that that issue, which is that, you know, if you were saying, if they said, you know, people to judge robbed a Bank or something, you know, people would just say you'll get out of here. That's ridiculous. But because, you know, especially after me to you know, I think we're seeing people treat victims with or accusers with a lot more respect and. Credibility. And so that's sort of what they're playing on a particularly insidious way, essentially is by by using that sort of that special status reserved for these sexual assault allegations, they are using that to their advantage. Jack, and Jacob are basically running a clown show. But they're pointing at a real thing that they're sort of grasping for which is the the effectiveness of kind of false allegations and smears against political candidates. And it's in the way that the right wing media, and the internet and social media can can take those even the flimsiest allegations and just blow them really wide. And so while Jack and Jacob have proven to be exceptionally incompetent at it. I think if you had someone who was better at at this could become a very significant issue. This summer reports technology and the internet for the Daily Beast. He's also got a newsletter about right wing media. It's called right, Richard like the Richter scale you can sign up for it at right, Richter dot com. Thanks to the quick electric. Toothbrush company for supporting the show today. The quip does now have a kids quip no child issue gimmicks. They just want your kids to brush like a grownup, you can go to get quick dot com slash explained right now to find out more. The quip starts just twenty five dollars and your first Pac refills is free at GT Q, IP dot com slash explained.

Jacob Jack Jacob assault hunter Kelly Jack Berkman Jacobs Twitter Jacob bull DC President Trump mayor Pete Pete Buddha Robert Muller Jacob Boll Jacob wall Elizabeth Warren James O'Keefe Scott Jacob Sean Ramos Peter kidnapping
Showdown at High Nunes

Today, Explained

26:26 min | 10 months ago

Showdown at High Nunes

"Ever since I had a step to generes on the show last week talking about Kiwi Co in one of our ads. People have been saying I had no idea that. Qa Co made made stuff for adults. Well Kiwi Co does. You can try out your first month. On Kiwi Co for free right now and Kiwi Co dot com slash explained. Uh it was hard to not feel a little cognitive dissonance watching those impeachment hearings the last two weeks it here. The head of the House Intelligence Committee Adam Schiff same thing like are we prepared to accept that president. I'd states can leverage Fischel Acts Military Assistance White House House meetings to get an investigation of a political rival and then you'd hear ranking member. Devin Nunes respond with something like they got caught trying to obtain gene nude photos of president trump from Russian pranksters throughout the two weeks of televised testimony. It always seemed like the ranking Republican. Devin nunes was chasing a completely different story like he had zero interest in the story about the trump administration that was being presented to him. And then right right as the proceedings were wrapping up on Friday. Devin nunes became a part of that story. He wasn't interested in which is actually not that unusual offer him. Maurice Law Goes co-hosts political breakdown. It's a podcast from K. Q. D. in San Francisco the congressman who is from California Central Valley essentially essentially was accused I daily Beast Story. That love Parnis. One of those Indicted Associates Rudy. Giuliani essentially said that he had helped arrange arrange meetings and calls for the congressman with some Ukrainians another of lawyers. Ed McMahon told the daily beast earlier this weekdays partners quote helped arrange meetings and calls in Europe four representative Devon Nunez in two thousand eighteen newness aid Derek. Harvey Harvey participated in the meetings. The lawyer said which were arranged to help newness investigative work and then there was some congressional records showing that Nunez indeed he did travel to Europe last November December early December with some of his aides on the taxpayer's dime. I think we should now and now it's an interesting time frame. I'm right because at that point. Democrats taken by the house at the polls but hadn't actually been sworn in so he was still in the majority party at that time so there was you know not a lot of oversight from the minority party which was about to assume the majority. What exactly is lead parts trying to suggest representative? Nunez was doing in Ukraine. Well if I was a little unclear but over the weekend there was some other reporting and a couple of his attorneys have essentially come forward to a couple of different news outlets and Said said that Nunez asked Parnell to hook him up with that former Ukrainian prosecutor. Victor Shokhin Short. It's a war is a symbol of hiding corruption and support him corruption especially high rent for option in Ukraine. Who Has van sort of the center of a lot of these questions around the Biden's and weather shokhin you know who is widely seen as corrupt by the West had been investigating Biden right in And other Western leaders and you know as I said. It's clear that Nunez did take a trip to Europe around this timeframe but this is all based on the word of the attorneys for a guy who is indicted on campaign finance fraud charges. Right now right so the the insinuation and is that representative Nunez may have also been seeking help in investigating the Biden's. Yeah I mean. We know that he's one of president. Term strongest allies in Congress These allegations would indicate that even as he's been you know the ranking members sort of helping preside over these impeachment inquiry hearings and really calling them completely ridiculous the whole time that he perhaps a year ago was actually the one when not Rudy Giuliani going to Europe to try to encourage an investigation of the Biden's and of course Joe Biden's son Hunter Biden and not Um energy company Burris Ma so as bad as that could be representative Nunez. The flipside is it's coming from someone who doesn't exactly have a sterling record of credibility ability. Yeah that's totally true. And I think that you know. There's a lot of sort of tainted folks with this entire process and so essentially one of his lawyers saying hey. We love to testify about this in front of the Intelligence Committee which I think raises questions about what he might hope to get in exchange for that. Of course I. He's being prosecuted by the federal government. This is Congress they are separate department of Justice. you know as part of the trump administration so it's It's very messy Sean. If this turns out to be true could could newness have just avoided all this by saying hey by the way. Let's just get this out there. I also went to Ukraine for a minute and had a conversation. But it's all good good. Nothing happened here we are. I guess maybe but from what has been reported so far and if you look at the timing it looks like specifically did it at a timeframe when he thought he wouldn't because what so. That doesn't always bode well right if you are sort of building in hiding something and I think that this gets the sort of crux of these impeachment questions which is like is there any situation where it's okay to enlist foreign governments to dig up dirt on political opponent lake. Maybe but it's I think the fact that it seemed to have happened if it did happen on the public dime is also going to be really sticky for him so this news broke on Friday. It's Monday what has representative Nunez said about about it. Since then he criticized all the outlets have reported. This is fake news the Oh yeah. He's never been particularly fond of of the news. Let's say I think the media has become totally corrupt but now they're willing to actually engage and help with criminals indicted criminals. He's been threatening. Ming lawsuits We are going to tasteful. CNN and the daily beast likely into federal court. Right after Thanksgiving. And I I think sort of denied it but has it took him a while to get to that point on Fox so I think it's a little unclear and he's promising more details to come in his lawsuits and other responses. WE'RE GONNA file all this. Everyone's going to know the truth. Everybody's GonNa know all the facts but I think you can understand that I can't compete by trying to try and to debate this out with the public media when ninety percent of the media are totally corrupt so he hasn't come out and just flat out denied denied it. He has promised further action further information and is suing CNN. I don't know if he's filed a lawsuit yet but He is certainly threatening to. And that would not be out of the norm for Devon. Nuno's what do you mean. so He's been very Su- happy feely. He has sued a farmer in his district into other folks. Who actually went to court asking that Nunez not be allowed to be called called a farmer on the ballot last year? They felt like it wasn't accurate because he's not really farming anymore He's sued a couple of anonymous. Twitter users Rann parody accounts against him including one. That's at Devon cow neighborhood. Devon's boots are full of manure. He's utterly worth Earth. was faster time to move them to prison. And the people involved in that is a Republican consultant if you can believe that who he thinks is responsible. For some of these parody accounts he has gone after the Fresno Bee which. I think it's worth noting until this past cycle had actually endorsed Dorsey Nunez. Every time but has done some reporting on some of the financial interest in his winery. And some of the bad behavior by those folks When he has basically accused them of smearing him he's gone after another journalist Ryan Lizard from Esquire who really interesting story about noon as than how basically we his family? Dairy farm has not actually in California anymore. It's an Iowa So yeah he's he's happy to go to court when he feels like people have defamed him. In none of these cases has he been successful yet but actually some of them are still moving their way through the system. But I think there's an argument to be made that some of these it could be viewed as frivolous for those of us. Who just spent two weeks watching Nunez on a national stage? It seems like he's very much with the president and aligned with this Republican cohort who sees these democratic proceedings impeachment inquiry as a total farce us as a shambles. How do people back in? Devin Nunes is home district. See Him right now. That is where I think it gets really interesting. He is bad aben sort of embraced as a hometown. Hero by farmers in his district does come from a dairy farming family and I mean I think people a lot of people not everybody but by the argument that it is a conspiracy against him by the media that he is sort of doing right by his district. He's been really strong on farmers there's water rates which is basically like the issue in the Central Valley And I think a lot of times what we hear from folks is like. That's what we care about. All this other stuff is noise. It's you know it's it's the left-wing media trying to tear him down And he's one I mean he only won by five points last time which was a pretty dramatic difference in that district is you know has a Republican registration advantage. so He's gotten more real challenges in the past couple for years but he seems to still be really well likeness district which is fascinating especially in part. Because it's very heavily Latino and we know in two thousand eighteen eighteen. Latino turnout actually helped Democrats slip a lot of other districts around the state that had been held by Republicans but they have not had success with this one. Yes although I should say they are going to targeted targeted again. Tell us a little bit more about his district. It is farmland. I mean this is the Central Valley and includes Fresno but also parts of two Lhari County. which is I think? Sort of even more rural Fresno's kind of you know one of the population centers in the Central Valley and it is a very different place than the coast in California. I mean we think of California as such a blue place but if you go east a couple hours it's farmland its heartland it is largely very conservative and again like people people who I think understandably more concerned with their bottom line especially as farmers which is a tough industry to begin with Then you know what's happening thousands of miles away in DC or quite frankly a couple hundred miles away and like San Francisco or Los Angeles and did Nunez grow up a farmer. Does he actually have a claim to to the cohort. They did farm. His family does still own dairy farms but in Iowa so I mean that's part of the reason that you've seen like folks who oppose him come come out and say hey. Why do you get to say farmer on the ballot? Like you're not really a farmer I mean he has really been as an adult a politician. I mean he did go to Lasko. He had run when he was in school for like the Board of his college because he was worried that they were going to shut down their farmland. The kids trained on When in fact they said no actually just printed by bigger place so sort of conspiracy theory launched him into his first political office which is pretty fitting? Because that's sort. I like his vibe. I mean he's always been very much like on the outskirts of the mainstream sort of assumptions And it's not just like a Republican Democratic thing even when Republicans run charge of Congress than you know. He's on the Intelligence Committee. There's a lot of anecdotes about him. Sort of listening to one person in the field contradicts. What the entire intelligence community is saying and Republicans really getting frustrated with him over that so like I think that there was something especially with trump today saw ida ion from the get go and really sort of bonded over which was like this distrust distrust of the system? And the idea that everyone's out to get you and that there's something like whatever the establishment thinks is the case. There's probably something different about it. I mean he's always had that sort of skepticism. And I think some people would say paranoia about the intelligence community about D. C. about the media is online with sort of his approach to politics. I would say probably life Devin nunes constantly casting doubt on the legitimacy of our institutions isn't just a one off in a minute. Fox's Dave Roberts argues it's part of a grand old plan I'm Sean Ramos Firm. This is today explained Michael from Condo all the way up in Toronto. We spoke last week. About how your daughter Jillian got you signed up with the coupon code. Subscription at Kiwi Co dot com slash explained where people can get their first month for free. We didn't talk about the particulars you start with a pinball machine with a pinball machine so you know probably collectively if I hadn't been interrupted probably took two or three hours to put together but it's that particular thing and I don't know what I said what's next is coming Was His really quite durable. I was quite surprised when it all got tied and snap together and I've got a almost a four year old grandson and and a seven year old granddaughter and they're not always to gentle but they've been playing with the thing and then joined the heck out of it and the best part is you now have a subscription to these Kiwi GEICO projects and there will be more. Yes and my wife wasn't too pleased stall that. My problem routers David Roberts you write about energy and politics for Vox and you recently recently kind of wrote about how people are running out of energy to participate in our politics. You wrote that. Were undergoing an episode crisis. What does that mean? Gene is the philosophical term for the branch of Philosophy. That's about Knowing things but knowledge but how we gain knowledge about how we assess knowledge. What is evidence? What's the difference between Truth and opinion all those related questions in philosophy or known as epistemology and so when I say an an episode Emmett crisis I mean crisis in the way that we collectively come to know things I e? We don't seem to collectively family come to know things anymore. It seems we are now have been kind of hived into two separate episodes communities who no different different things trust. Different sources of information have different procedures for evaluating knowledge in just are increasingly unable to communicate across that chasm. And I think that would sound or seem familiar to anyone who watched the impeachment hearings California Representative Schiff leading the charge for one community and California representative newness leading the charge for the other and these two representatives of the same state May as well have been from different planets and you argue this particular phenomenon. Is something called tribal epistemology. What's that about sure what the term tribal epistemology is just just meant to sort of indicate a situation where the kind of dictates and interests of your tribe in this case meaning sort of the right wing tribe in the? US what you come to know and how you come to know. Things is dictated by the interests of your tribe rather than vice versa. You believe of what's good for your tribe to believe disbelieve. What's not good for your tribe to believe this isn't something that trump invented right? How exactly did we get to this this crisis that you read about sure? It's been ongoing for decades. But I really think Mitch. McConnell Republican Senate leader is a politician who almost more than any other. Contemporary politician has realized what's going on and how to use it as advantage so he realized before Obama even took office. People aren't paying close attention to politics and they have kind of the basic they apply to politics in one of them is if something is legitimate. If an idea or proposal is legitimate it will get some agreement. On both sides sides of the aisle it will command some consensus that sort of like a signal of legitimacy to everybody really like it's a it's it's really deep in us to to think that way. And so what Mitch. McConnell realized was well all I have to do to prevent Boma from being able to command consensus or get cooperation on. Both sides deny cooperation cooperation. Like I can single-handedly make him. Look polarizing I can make him look divisive just by refusing to go along with Sam one of the most fascinating stories about Nixon's impeachment is Roger Ailes even or one of those right wing fears was actually in Nixon's administration and said if you had a network of your own we could get through this like almost verbatim ever since then. They've basically basically more and more come to view mainstream institutions. That's the mainstream media the mainstream science. The academy you name it as as their enemy as members of the other side right so they have decided we need to build institutions of our own basically so they built a kind of parallel set of think tanks and academic institutions and media. So now you have this sort of separate epoch tribe bribe with its own sources of information. Its own history. Its own principles. Its own I mean. It's own sort of free-standing world pre trump. I think they felt the need to sort of keep a foot in the old world or at least speak. The language of mainstream mainstream institutions are sort of speak a language that gave their kind of tribal reasoning are kind of plausible deniability sheen of being something else but what trump has done is rendered that impossible because in eastern principle you stake your claim on. He'll violate the next day. I mean we've seen it over and over again. They keep trying to tell a story about why. Why is behaviors? Okay and he'll come out the following day to stop all over this story so even this notion that we need to sort of like frame these beliefs in a way that's plausible given the old standards has kind kind of faded away and it's just become a much more naked thing. Things are bad but our lawmakers used to shoot each other and and you see legislative sessions in other countries descended straight up brawls but still you argue that this is a crisis that could like make or break our democracy. I'm only about halfway sure of that. I mean I. I've been watching. You know politics several decades and I keep thinking like this. This will be the moment reaches a boil. This is the crisis point. Something's got to break. Something's got to give but it just like keeps going on and on so I should say like maybe not. Maybe this isn't the crisis but it feels to me like a combination of the stakes right. I mean this is the third impeachment trial of a president in American history. It's a really big deal. And what's more trump's guilt in. What he's being accused of is just so so obvious at this point it's it's almost comically obvious? We've got multiple witnesses. Multiple Administration officials have admitted to it on camera that he also mentioned to me in past the the corruption related to the DNC server. Absolutely no question about that. But that's that's it that's why we held up the money before later team and scrambled and tried to take it back. We have a significant reversal now from the White House. A new statement from chief-of-staff Mick Mulvaney he's saying Once again the media has decided to misconstrue my comments to advance a biased and political witch hunt against president trump. Let me be clear there was absolutely no quid. Quid pro quo between Ukrainian military aid and any investigation into the two thousand sixteen election himself admitted to it on camera. Uh on those on the White House lawn at a great conversation I had was largely congratulatory. Gradually Dory was largely corruption. All of the corruption taking was largely the fact that we don't want our people like vice. President Biden is creating big ruptured already Ukraine and did it again solicited help from foreign powers investigating his opponent to help his political. Rhyme Shaina started investigation into the by. Because what what happened in China is just about as bad as what happened with With Ukraine he did it on camera in front of all all of us so to me. It just seems like if even this can't break people out of there us versus them our tribe versus their tribe. Dr Sort of fixation. Then it really seems like nothing can and further more like the the conservative movement is going to see what happened with Muller and then it's going to happen again with impeachment. They're just GONNA learn again that there's no reason not to make stuff up it's become uh-huh so much easier to lie and get the lie out in front of millions of people. I mean it's literally now easier to get ally in front of millions of people than it is to get a truth in front of millions of people and Representative Nunez actually pin the entire weight of these proceedings. On exactly how how. Many people were watching as if the only possible metric of the importance of the entire impeachment inquiry would be how many people were watching it on TV. Well Mr Morrison. I have some bad news for you TV ratings of way down way down. I don't don't hold it personally. I don't think it's you guys whatever drug deal. The Democrats are cooking up here on the diocese. American people aren't buying I should say millions upon millions of people wore watching this on TV so he was again misleading. At least some American people because some American people are inclined to believe the ranking Republican Republican member on the House Intelligence Committee. What is the antidote to this moment? Were into this tribal epistemology. The Antidote Dote to noon is for institutions to do their job. That's sort of the key crisis I'm trying to describe here is like this looks to me like us institutions just like their last gasp or last chance to sort of behaved the way they're supposed to but the institutions are weak Sean. I don't know if you've noticed this but like our institutions are weak and they've been under constant assault. The media is a great example samples just been under constant unremitting assault from the right for decades now and it has been beaten into this position and sort of terrified hesitant and sort of refusal to sort of draw clear lines say this is true and this. Isn't it so the institutional checks that used to sort of keep this behavior limited in its its impact at least are are weakened and dying so this just one of many many many reasons. Whenever trump's gone whenever this country things about how to sort of rebuild and revive itself we've got to recapture the value of these norms of? I'm just like fact checking of like evidence in respect for principles even if they work against the interests of your tribe and you're beholden to them this sense that we're all of us beholden to some principals higher than partisanship. We've got got to restore that sense somehow. All of politics is suffering from lack of it Whether you're seven going on eight or seventy nine going on eighty kiwi coat would like to give you the chance to to try out there fun. And engaging and educational projects for free to redeem the offer you can type in K.. I W I. C O Uh Dot C._o._M. Slash E. X. P. L. A. I. N. E. D..

Representative Nunez Devin nunes president representative Ukraine California Kiwi Co Sean Ramos Firm Europe House Intelligence Committee Congress Fresno Dairy farm Kiwi Co Rudy Giuliani Intelligence Committee Joe Biden Dr Sort San Francisco Hunter Biden
TFW your dad gives you Covid-19

Today, Explained

30:06 min | 6 months ago

TFW your dad gives you Covid-19

"Hey I'm Sean Ramos Firm. We're doing a new thing today. Explained Corona Virus Update at the top of the show to keep you on top of some of the biggest stories of the day. Here's what we have so far for Wednesday march eighteenth. It's official all fifty states now. Have people who've tested positive for Kovac Nineteen West? Virginia's governor announced the first positive test result in his state Tuesday evening. At least one hundred deaths in the country have now been linked to the corona virus and the virus is down more than two hundred thousand people worldwide and at least one hundred and forty four countries the. Who Today said Africa should prepare for? The worst as cases doubled in South Africa and the United States and Canada have agreed to close their border to all non essential traffic. The Krona virus stopped Ohio from voting yesterday but primaries went ahead as planned in Florida Illinois and Arizona Joe Biden swept and Bernie Sanders is now reassessing his campaign. President Trump said today that he'd send a thousand bed hospital ship to New York harbor but a Pentagon spokesperson said the ships being repaired in Virginia. Right now probably wouldn't embarked for New York for weeks. Us stocks took a nosedive today that triggered a halt in trading and an NPR. Mayor's poll found that eighteen percent of households have already reported someone being laid off or having hours reduced because of the current outbreak. Women were hit harder than men people who earn less than fifty thousand dollars. A year were hit harder than those earning more which is just another reminder that this all but inevitable corona virus recession. That's coming will hurt those who are already hurting most. So thank your grocery store workers. Thank your sanitation workers. Thank anyone doing essential services in your life consider tips also Kevin Durant has tested positive for covert nineteen and it looks that he was recently hanging out with drake. Who has now? According to page six self isolated in his Toronto mansion expect some corn tunes? Soon please write us with. Your Corona virus questions emailed today explained. Vox Dot com or tweet at us. The show is at today underscore explained. I'm at Rama's forum. This episode is brought to you by course correction a production of Doha debates and Cutter Foundation hosted by journalist. Nellie for her diet each week Melford takes on new challenges to confront the world's problems head on the challenge is to only live on fifty liters of water a day. Like out you shower and connects with the people most affected by global crises. Or they put us in a very small SALESA prisons and so it was very dehumanizing experience. Challenge yourself to change the world find course correction presented by Doha debates. Wherever you get your podcasts low can anyone hear me yes I can hear you. Who Am I speaking with Sean? This is drew. Hey drew this is Shaun. How are you doing well man? How are you doing doing okay doing okay? Lots of time on my hands. Yeah and who are you with right now? Drew With my son Trevor. And my wife Aggie and we are here in Williamsburg Brooklyn just gathered around the kitchen table. So why are you guys just sitting around gathered On a on a on a Tuesday afternoon for fun I wish I wish it was for fun but no yesterday. I got my test back that I was positive for covert nineteen so on Monday. I was after school. I was talking with my principal and I said and this this is Monday. The what the the ninth or whatever. Yes exactly Monday. The Night I was talking to my principal. I said count me out for tomorrow. I'm not sure what this is I said. Would you prefer I go to the doctor just to have it checked just in case he said yeah do that so I went to the doctor. The next morning the flu test came back negative and then they took and other viruses tests. That also came back negative a couple of days later so. I'm still out of school Tuesday Wednesday Thursday. My doctor calls me and says I want you to go take a corona virus tests. But here's the thing I had to actually get on a subway to go take the test because it was we live in Brooklyn. The test was being given at a hospital in Manhattan. So I had to do that. And then four days later which was which brings us to yesterday's when I found out the results so in between that time my room was already deep cleaned. A people were aware in my building. I was being tested and I also sent out emails to all the families of the students that I teach to let them know that I was being tested as well so I could see how complicated this is. Because you know you're in New York City your options are sorta limited in how you're going to get from point. A. TO POINT B. At that point when you were going to go take the corona virus test were you like I should take a car. Should take an Uber and risk infecting the driver. If I have something which I take the subway and risk infecting who knows a dozen people or something. I'm not sure what the process you go through was what what was it I work gloves and I had a face mask at that point from the doctor's appointment today before so I had gloves and a face mask on my was not coughing it also. I'd like to think that I controlled it as best I could but but at the same time when I got there and the doctor interviewed me and he was a specialist in infectious disease specialists. He said after this interview I normally wouldn't test you because you're not exhibiting any of the symptoms right now and I said well I'd really like I'm here. Please test me because I need the I need to know this to get back to work. And so he said all right but I really be shocked if you were positive and here we are. What did the doctors tell you to do? After you got tested we were already in a in a self quarantine for a few days since I took the test and once the results came back They they said. Assume that everyone else in your in Your House. And in this case we live in an apartment In your apartment has the viruses well trevor and Aggie have also shown symptoms over the last few days. I started showing symptoms a week ago yesterday. So our other son is so. Trevor Trevor's twenty-three Arthur son is twenty. He's here with us to under quarantine but he's not showing any any signs yet. Oh No should he be there with you. Well was the that was the question we ask the doctor and she said she yeah. She said it's too late just assume that he has it. Oh okay I guess I just WanNa ask how you all doing. We're feeling well. We're feeling well. I think we've all we've all gone through a slight fever but the fever is gone right. Now we've all gone through. Some body aches and kind of tinguely skin sneezing and coughing but everything seems to be improving. I just seem to be a couple days ahead of everyone like emotionally emotionally. That's the that's probably the harder part. Is You know here. We are not facing this new reality and we're also in in a city that that is the big city in the country and they're talking about a possible lock down and you know we want to make sure that when we're locked in here that we're going to be would have our basic needs met. Yeah yeah can I hear from aggie and Trevor Is? Hi Sean. Hey thanks for making time for us. Sure sure how about you. How how are you feeling? What are your concerns and thoughts right now? I'm I'm doing okay I'm grateful that we get along as well as we do. My company recommended that everyone start working remotely a week ago yesterday. So I've been working at home but Yesterday was kind of a rough day and withdrew diagnosis. I decided to take a you know a couple of days off from work so for me right now. I'm just relieved that we're we're okay and that we're here and I don't know I think I'm just grateful for a couple of days of rest. True Rest Yeah. Are You mad at your husband at all? No no not at all. That's good I ask him sorry. I'm not trying to like insight domestic strife. Have you been in contact with your Doctors Aggie? So while drew was going to get the test are physicians. Were meeting with Trevor and me via Tele Doc. And they were interviewing us. I mean they were asking so many questions and they could not find any trail back to where we may have contracted it. That's the biggest mystery of all because we weren't anywhere where it was that we know of course that we yeah which is just scarier. I guess right because this is spreading in New York. It sounds like new. York's on the cusp of being in total shutdown and New York state has more cases than any other state in the union right now. You're you're governors calling for military assistance like having it be sort of unknown feels even scarier. Well Yeah and the the doctors did not think that drew was showing the Kovic symptoms. They did not think he had and he pretty much asked for the test so that he could be cleared to go back to work because he would not have been able to go back are thinking of this. Point is that plenty of people are walking around with it who might not even realize it because it feels like the regular flu or a or a bad cold all right. Maybe I'll ask trevor. How he feels about it is I mean it's it's a bit nerve racking for sure it's it's a completely new situation but like my parents said we all get along really well and we've gotten along really well so far so if I was going to be quarantined with any group of people I'm happy. I'm happy it's my family. I can say that I think that something that I guess is weighed heavy on me more than maybe my family is. Just that I went to school to be an actor and I just got off of a touring GIG and a lot of my friends right now. Are losing jobs because you know. Regional theaters everywhere are shutting down. And you know Broadway they. They shut down indefinitely or until I think sometime in April. So that's been something that to grapple with. I guess is as far as employment. That's been kind of an interesting situation. Well Good Luck Trevor. Can I talk to this fourth family member who doesn't have it but definitely has it? Yeah let's see. He's he's in the up to talk to. You is in the other room right now. Is that will call social distance. Get Your family. Like he's the other exactly like we said we've been figuring out how to keep same with each other in a very small living space here is this is L. assured us up when you visit Elliott and he sounds just like trump me. Hello Hello Elliott. Hi How are you? My Name's Shawn I host. The podcast call today explained. And we're trying to explain what it's like to get cove in one thousand nine with the rest of your family today. Yeah I can give an outsider's perspective from inside the Quarantine. I guess I don't. I don't even remember what day it was at this point but I just I was just laying in bed and I just woke up and I'm not fully mentally there when I first wake up in the morning and my dad's just leaning in my room and says hey I have to go and get tested for corona virus. I'm not really not feeling well and I was just kinda shocked and I had to go about my day which was weird and I've been kind of been playing catch up because I'm still in school and I have a part time job and I've been emailing my managers my job and the head of my program at trying to keep them updated on the situation and trying to keep everybody updated that I might have been in contact with which is kinda nervous or kind of nerve wracking but I tell everybody. Yeah I like I haven't shown any symptoms yet and while you know. It's pretty much widely suspected that people in the like the younger you go the more likely it is. That people can be silent carriers There isn't enough evidence to sufficiently say whether or not you're more infectious in this period you're less infectious whether or not you can transfer it while you still have it. Which is kind of a thing. I have to keep reminding myself to not try to feel like I just spread it to all my friends and everything but or us. Oh patient zero to how spoiled. Yeah it me it was. It was me all along. We really brought you out here to confront you. We're actually changing his silent carrier. Y'All hilarious you're like you're like then Norman Rockwell portrait of Cova Dyke. Just the best possible. What do what do you think I mean because this will be heard by lots of people who don't have this yet. Who are seeing the news coming out of New York state which is worrisome to anyone around the country and especially maybe people in New York and this everyone promises. This will get worse before it gets better. What would you tell people? Who are you know living alongside you and beyond about you know how to best prepare themselves mentally and even physically for what's to come? Well I would say I to to follow the instructions that were being given to denote to keep far away from people to stay in as much as possible. You know all of that. I mean that's that obviously is happening. A little too late in a lot of places but just listen to what they're saying. Stay home I think that there's also at least for me because I still haven't shown any symptoms or anything. There's one thing that's helped me. A lot is is staying as informed as possible and trying to find information from many different news sources possible because I think one of the things that's kind of been affecting me is like you know for the past five five or so nights like every night as falling asleep is kind of thought of like. What if I just wake up tomorrow and start feeling symptoms and if I let that fear grab hold of me it's GonNa you know not allow me to think as logically and as rationally as I should be able to think so? Just let that. It's just it's not worth your time to let the fear control you. It's just best to keep a level head and and respond to everything that you're seeing in the news you know. Make sure you have some some basic supplies in your in your place figure out who? Who can deliver to you if it's needed to be delivered if you need to stay in and go out? Yeah stay calm. Pass that on. I really hope you all get better a slap. Rocky Elliott drew aggie and Trevor. Thank you thank you in a moment. We'll talk to Dylan Scott. Vox He's got the latest on getting tested in the United States today. Explained have all this corona virus in Cova nineteen business. Has you feeling like you need to speak to a professional better? Help is here for you. Better help has a team of licensed counselors standing by these are professionals who specialize in depression and anxiety of been hearing that there's some depression and anxiety in the air right now. The better health counselors are also ready to discuss grief and trauma and stress and anger and relationships. Whatever it is you WANNA talk about better. Help has counselor standing by for you. You can connect privately with a better help counselor through texts through phone calls through video calls and get help on your own time at your own pace. At a rate you can actually afford. It's pretty flexible. And if you sign up right now you'll get ten percents off your first month with the code explained so visit better help dot com slash explained. Today that is better help dot com slash. Explain there's ten percents off when you sign up tech has consequences and recode by. Vox is exploring them. All with the new multi-platform journalism project called open sourced through videos and articles open source to explore and demystify controversial issues surrounding technology everything from facial recognition and surveillance to how add micro targeting will affect the twenty twenty election. The project is supported by omid. Your network a global network of innovators entrepreneurs and technologists committed to addressing the most critical economic technological and Seidel issues of our time checkout open source at Vox dot com slash open sourced. Find out everything you need to know about the hidden consequences of tech box dot com slash open sourced Don't Scott you cover healthcare. Vox hard is it to get tested in America right now. So testing capacity has increased dramatically. As of Tuesday. We were able to run about thirty seven thousand tests in a day. As of Tuesday we had conducted more than fifty thousand tests which is up from less than eight thousand at the end of last week. So just to be clear here. Testing thirty thousand people in a day is not even close to being able to test one percent of the population. It's not even close to a tenth of a percent of the population in a day. Exactly and I think that one thing to appreciate here is if we had had really robust testing to start as a country like South Korea. Did it might have been a lot easier to contain the virus to you. Know figure out where it was. Who had it and take much more targeted steps to try to fix it. But because we had such week testing to start we've had to resort to these much more dramatic social distancing measures closing schools telling people to work from home canceling large gatherings. Because we don't know exactly how widespread the coronavirus is in the United States because we haven't been testing enough. Let's talk about the process here. If you actually think you might have this I mean how is that changing right now first off. Is it still if you feel? You've had a fever for a few days and sore muscles. Call your doctor. I yes I think we still want people to sort of go to have sort of a normal medical regiment. So if you don't feel very good you know think you might have a slight fever. Achey you've got a cough. Don't go to work. Try not to come in contact with other people and yes call. Your doctor tried to arrange an appointment. We don't want as much as we want people to be cognizant their symptoms and seeking help. If they need it we also don't want to be. Overloading are hospitals because we already expect that the corona virus cases are going to exceed the amount of care that our hospitals are able to provide. Okay well let's see you get to the point where you do actually need to be tested for covert nineteen in the United States. Knowing how limited the tests still are and knowing that the countries currently overcapacity what happens then. Where do you go to get tested now? Hospitals are the primary places conducting tests. I think they're also being distributed to physicians offices. As you know capacity allows there have been some places particularly in Seattle that have set up like drive throughs for people to come through pull up in their car get their swabs taken and have those samples sent out to the labs to be tested. So it's definitely worth checking with your doctor. It's worth checking if there is one of those pop up testing clinics in your area if you get tested and you test positive for Kobe. Nineteen what happens from there is probably gonNA depend on a lot on your symptoms and how you seem to be handling it for a lot of people. Homecare is probably going to be enough if you just have a low grade fever you a little bit of aches and pains light dry cough. The hospital and the doctors are probably GonNa send you back home. Tell you not to contact anybody isolate yourself etc. What we're worried about is the most vulnerable populations people who you know. Older people are people with underlying medical conditions in their hearts or their lungs. That could make them more vulnerable to the virus and those people are potentially going to be asked to stay in hospital for a few days to be monitored and obviously if your symptoms progress significantly enough that you know you're having trouble breathing on your own or have other complications arising than you're probably going to be putting an intensive care unit and standoff but like for a matter of weeks both to make sure that your body can continue functioning and then to make sure that you're recovering from the virus fully. I think something that's important to understand is like especially for younger people. It's a really small percentage of the population who are going to require hospitalization. Even if they do get infected like we're talking just a couple of percent of people but when you look at people who are older like fifty and over sixty over they are much more likely to need hospitalization at least for monitoring or they'll need to be put in an intensive care unit to make sure that the body doesn't fail them so that's where this wide range of the symptoms that people experience because of Covet nineteen comes into play. It can be everything from you. Don't really feel bad at all your address. Elba and you tested positive. But you don't feel sick yet and it sucks Listen I'm doing okay. I didn't have any symptoms. I got tested because I realized I was exposed to someone who would also tested positive or it can escalate all the way up to severe pneumonia and death most likely for the elderly. And so that's one of the most tricky things about both identifying the disease and then treating it tell me how it works in the United States as far as healthcare coverage is concerned. Are you paying out of pocket for the tests? Are you paying? You know an arm and a leg for the hospital treatment. If you get to that point so obviously. In general America has some of the highest out of pocket costs in the world. People here are much more likely to skip medical care including for serious conditions because of the high out of pocket costs. And that's a problem for a situation like this when you want people to seek care and you don't want to be a barrier now. There's a little bit of variation here and this is another one where it's like you gotta check with your own health insurance company but there have been some states like California and New York where the governors have issued executive orders that require either their state Medicaid program and the individual or small business. Private insurance plans that are regulated by the state to provide testing and treatment for Kovic nineteen free to the patient and we have just seen anthem One of the biggest health insurance companies in the country announced that they are going to waive co pays and out of other cost sharing obligations for patients who are tested for need to be treated for covert nineteen so there does seem to be a recognition that we don't want people to avoid seeking care because they're worried about the cost. We don't want people to be hit with four thousand dollar bills if they end up being quarantined or hospitalized because of the situation. But it's very much a piecemeal approach. The problem is a big federal law that governs large employer. Health Insurance plans that cover about half of Americans. Those plans are not subject to state executive orders for those people which is a lot of us. We're GONNA depend on these voluntary measures that these health insurance are willing to take in reaction to the crisis. One other thing that I just found out is that the CDC does think it has the authority to cover the cost of tests and treatment for uninsured. People in theory they could be hit with the full cost of what it takes to be tested or treated for covert nineteen but it looks like CDC. We'll be able to pick up those bills. Dylan I feel like a lot of people out there. Right now are worried. And the things that they're hearing aren't inspiring confidence. We were late to this whole thing. To begin with our testing was not up to where it should have been now. We're playing catch up and we're still not at capacity governor. Cuomo is calling for the military to come in and give him more hospital beds and it's still hasn't even happened. I mean you're hearing from readers right now at. Vox Dot Com. What are they saying are they? Are they scared? I think primarily people are are scared and they feel like they don't know what's going on. We have a healthcare newsletter called. Vox Care that's going out three times a week now. During the cove in one thousand nine outbreak you can sign up for it at vox. Dot Com backslash. Vox Care I've put out a call over the last week or so for questions and I do think the through lines about this. Are you know what are my risks? What does the disease feel like? And then just like what am I allowed to do? Am I allowed to go outside of my house I will? I got an email from a woman this week that I will not forget anytime soon. She said she lived in Northern Ireland. She was sixty eight years old and had copd so certainly somebody who is potentially vulnerable to the crow virus but she asked me she was like. Can I just take my dog out on the beach? Walk by myself like she just. She didn't even know basically she was allowed to leave her house and take her dog for a walk and so I think that is a signal. Both of how scared people are they are. They are afraid to do those most basic of their daily activities. And they just don't have the information that they need to be able to make decisions about what they can do what they should do. And she can take her dog for a walk as long as she practices safe social distancing from other people right exactly not a doctor. This is not medical advice but yes. It's okay to go outside. It's okay to take a walk. Stay six feet away from other people practice. Good Hygiene Wash your hands when you get home etc but like we are not all being bound to our homes by authorities. But I think a lot of people feel that way because there is just so much fear and so much unknown about the pandemic You want to give people something to be hopeful about before we go so I can try to answer the question. I also all the time between being scared to death and feeling a little more sanguine about the whole situation and the things I've seen from nurses working on the ground from patients who are trying to be really proactive about protecting themselves and protecting other people. I talked to one guy who belatedly got a cove in nineteen tests in Chicago but before he ever got tested he had already started calling people. You've been in contact with recently to tell them how he was feeling and that he was worried he might have grown virus as it turned out somebody he had been in touch with at his physical therapist. Office had a father with lung cancer. Exactly the kind of population that you'd worry about with Corona virus and so. That was him on his own. Trying to be proactive in trying to help other people. And so when I see that kind of stuff and sort of this. The slow but steady of mobilization across our entire society like I do think people are thinking outside. The box. Do think they appreciate that. It will take an entire society to get this outbreak under control and that makes me hopeful for as much as the initial response was lacking and too slow. We are starting to get our shit together. And even if it's going to be hard even if it's going to take a long time we're going to get through it. Tell people where to find your newsletter one more time Fox dot com slash locks care. Send me your emails. Sign up subscribe. I'm going to do my best to answer them and we'll get together. Tell people where to find you on twitter DOT COM DYLAN L. For Lewis Scott. All one word Dylan Lewis. Scott thanks so much. Thank you Sean

Trevor Trevor New York United States Sean Ramos Firm Aggie Your House fever Rocky Elliott Vox dry cough Virginia America Kevin Durant Toronto NPR Ohio Kovac official Africa Rama
Big Blue preView: Second half expectations

Big Blue View

40:09 min | 2 years ago

Big Blue preView: Second half expectations

"What if all you're breaking news alerts had a voice what would that sound like it would sound like today? Explain its daily news podcast from vox. I'm Sean Ramos grim every day my team, and I take one essential news story, politics, two movies sports science, and we break it down into twenty minute episodes. Perfect for your ride home subscribed today. Explain on apple podcasts or wherever you listen from Stitcher, and the vox media podcast network. Hello and welcome to the big blue view podcast. I am Dan Zuhdi joint here by Chris. And we are coming to you in like the second half of the giants by we're now entering week. Ten giants are playing on Monday night. We're going to just be looking forward a little bit at what we can expect for the second half of the season before we get into that will just give you quick update on some of the things that have been happening with the podcast network. As most of you have probably noticed if you subscribe to the podcast. There has been a new episode uploaded. That was not Chris. And I it was at Valentine who runs biglou view. He is now officially part of the podcast network. So he'll be contributing probably two shows a week. So our show that has been a preview and recap show. We're. We're still gonna come to you two times a week. That's mostly going to be a recap episode after the games, and as of now our second show because of pretty much just how the giants season has unfolded. So far our second show of the week is going to start focusing more on college football and the NFL draft. I know it is early for that. But hey, that's kind of what we have to look forward to it will give us a little bit of a different look besides just repeating ourselves. A lot in the preview and review episodes, a will just be able to look at something new and something to look forward to you with that were probably going to have a new name for this show. A were still work shopping that we're still coming up with ideas. If you guys who are listening have ideas. For what this show should be named. That might be a dangerous thing to say. But please let us know you guys have some ideas. Maybe we'll take some suggestions. We are open to it. Just so we have a differentiation. So everyone knows what show is going to be mean, Chris what show is going to be ad just so when you see it in in your podcast apps, or however, you get your podcast, you'll just you'll know immediately. What show you're going to be listening to so we're going to get to that in a little bit? So when you start seeing some new names there too don't be too surprise. But for now, this is going to be the same show that we've been doing it's going to be Chris. And I talking about what is going on with the giants. And with that we're gonna see what's we can maybe expect what we're hoping to see in the second half of the season. And Chris that isn't a very optimistic. Conversation that we've been adding to this point. No, not really as you can probably tell from the fact that our preview show has moved right onto previewing what they can do after their season is finally over. Yeah. We do in a lot of that. Just kind of look at specific players will eventually look at different games and that'll become in later in the week. So I guess we'll we'll probably described that show more when we do that show waiter in the week. It will probably be similar to the podcast. We did with Mark Scofield that came out last week. Thank you to those who have listened to that show, we've gotten some really good feedback on that. And it was definitely a fun show to do. So we'll try to do more of that type of stuff with the show. But for now not much has changed since the last time, we talked to you guys. The giants are still one in seven because they had a bye last week. They did not play also. Nhs. They did not lose which only the second time this season that has happened is. But as we move forward they'll kick off the second half of the season against the San Francisco forty Niners on Monday night football Sipa. Cisco is coming off a game where they completely blew out Oakland. So maybe we'll talk about that game a little bit. But mostly we're just going to be talking about what we can maybe expect and hope for going into the second half of the season. One in seven right now football, outsiders has them with a twelve point eight percent chance at the top pick. A fifty seven point two percent chance at a top five pick the top. Pick numbers is the fourth highest top five big numbers is the fifth highest a so they are probably going to have a pretty high pick and think the one thing as we now look forward into the second half of the season. Whether this team is going to improve. Or not that might come just with the schedule the schedule might just ease up a little bit. And that my allow the giants to look a little better than they have even if the team isn't necessarily better a so- per football, outsiders has their past schedule. I as the seventh hardest so the games that have already been played looking back. That was the seventh. Hardest schedule in the league going forward. Now, they have the twenty sixth hardest schedule in the league. So that's a significant difference there. And as we go forward, it's going to be to keep that in mind as we just kind of look at the possible performance there's going to be for this team. So I think like we usually do with these previews will break down the offense, and the breakdown the defense a what we can try to look for and maybe hope for in the questions we have. So we can jump in the offense. And obviously, I think the the. We need to start is quarterback. The giants returned to practice on Tuesday. Pat, Shurmur said that Kyle will would not be suspended by the team for his traffic arrests last week. So I think that eventually opens the door for him to at least get some playing time in the second half of the season. Whether that's from starts or whether that's just getting into games. I if they're out of hand, which you know, they might be if they go with the same way giants games have gone, so far UI manning has been named the starter for the San Francisco game Monday night in week ten that's probably not a surprise, especially with the timing of everything that had to do with the. But there's going to be a time where I think that the move has to be made. Although when Shurmur was asked about it on Tuesday. He said the idea of sticking with manning right now is that we trust him and his comment was a let's go on a run here. So there's no decisions to be made that line right there tied to made me stop bit that kind of sounds like he's if the giants like start winning out, and they will stick with ally. I I don't think that's a good idea at all. I think even if they they're they're not going to go four into over the next six games or whatever. But even if they do I think you have to see all because I think you've seen the Thirty-seven-year-old UI manning. A maybe not the biggest problem, but still not something you want going forward for this team. I I don't think thirty eight year old ally. Manning in twenty nine thousand nine is going to be much better. So I think that the let's go on a run here. So there's no decision to be made. That's that's a troubling statement to me because I think. It's at some point. You have to see what you have in. Whether you believe he's the answer. Not. I mean, I'm not someone who does I think you still have to see him, especially when when you're looking at what your options are going to be going forward. Yeah. Unless maybe that Shurmur isn't quite sh- were or doesn't really believe that Lola is ready to put his best foot forward for lack of a better term or doesn't believe that he could show much of anything positive with the offense in the state that it's in. Yes, he is more mobile than Eli manning. But if the offense of line keeps hemorrhaging pressure like it has been they might be worried that the rookie could get shellshocked or just not even have the opportunity to impress them. So that could be where that's coming from. Or it could just be coachspeak and saying we want to win the game. We are hoping that ally gives us the best chance to win. Yeah. I mean, just at at some point I think you have to start seriously talking about how there is an issue that will eventually need to address did. Yeah. At at quarterback. That's something you're going to have to think about just hoping that suddenly elementary is going to be better. And it I mean, if we're being honest, he lamenting has not been great for a couple of years now. So I I don't understand how this like this magical idea that he's somehow going to be better. I'll looking at his so adjusted net yards attempt is basically yards. Attempt that factors in touchdowns interceptions and sacks. And I'm looking at his his rate stats where if you look at a hundred a hundred is league average above one hundred a percentage above the average below is whatever percentage below average. He hasn't had an adjusted net yards per attempt plus over a hundred since twenty fifteen so I don't know what he li- manning were waiting for Kenny play better than this. Maybe. But just this entire quarterback thing is something that really needs to be taken into account quickly. But as you look past that and what we have in front of him. And maybe part of the reason ally has been like he has been for the past couple years is the offensive line. So last week the giants actually made a waiver claim and took on John Brown from the Los Angeles Rams, which actually I is is. A really good move. So Brown kind of lost his starting job with the Rams this year because of a suspension for the first couple of games of the season. And then awesome Bligh from slid in and he's played pretty well. So the Rams really didn't have anywhere to put him. So they waived him the giants because of their spot on waivers of because of their record were able to claim them. He was apparently claimed by a couple of other teams giants had priority there. But he he could be pretty good. He so he played right guard for the Rams why she started all sixteen games over a thousand snaps only allowed one sack. I'm looking at his numbers per football outsiders in sports in both solutions here he had the fewest blown blocks on that Rams offensive line last season while playing the most snaps of those authentic vitamin so this is potentially a good piece. That could be added to this authentic line going forward and outright guard where the giants do definitely need some help. They need a lot of help. It would also let the move John Greco back to center, which would be an upgrade over Spencer poli who at times it looked last game. Like Brecqhou was trying to make the protections and pulley didn't have a whole lot of idea. What was going on? Which is not what you want from your center Brown might wind up upgrading to spots, which would be a significant improvement for the giant after surprise to me that they were able to get him. Because usually there are not thirty two or sixty four starting guards in the NFL. I mean, how many teams have starters that you look at and just should not be. Starters. Look at the giants. Yeah. So it's it's it's a price to me that a smart team and a team that has been intelligently aggressive like the Rams let a starter and a solid. Good star light Brown leave and not just let him leave but cut him. So the giants had to starting centers and let one leave and let the other one go. And now they're winding hole wind up hoping to be able to move an old guard back to center it. It's just a surprise to me that he was even a be claimed. It's potentially a quality of player that is not available in that way. Very often. This isn't like a a Sam Bradford or a even a Bruce Irvin. Both of whom were just released this past week by their teams who are maybe. He underperforming expensive options that probably aren't going to be claimed. This is a guard who has potential has already played well in this league Hughes who is third round pick in two thousand fifteen he has one year left on his rookie deal. And it's only a billion dollar campaign right now for the giants. So that's a type of move and type acclaim you should make a hundred times out of one hundred but day just rarely had it so this this could be a huge break for the giants as they're trying to figure out what the future of this authentic line could be. Yeah, we're not used to the catching breaks like this. But it could be one. Unless there was an actual reason, which we don't yet know why the Rams cut him. But right now than brace hope if feels good his two game suspension in the beginning of the year was because of violating the substance policy. I don't think we have a lot of details. What had happened in a statement released on Twitter, Brown, apologize and splendid? It was an isolated mistake eighteen months ago. So that was back in July. So this was apparently what had happened was a very long time ago. Obviously, there's not many details that come out in these types of situations. But he served a suspension came back. So you know, we'll see in last year. He played all sixteen games. So he had does have the ability to be healthy. And so definitely still the potential. I think maybe what we talk about the offensive line or we can talk about some some pieces we wrote this week. So you. You looked at some of the season mistakes. The giants have made I think you were kind of recapping Bill bardwell. Article on ESPN that showed the giants had some of the biggest mistakes in the off season. One of them was signing Nate soldier to his current contract. And then I wrote just kind of as a thought experiment. I think when we talk about the authentic line a lot. I think the common defense for one the the solar deal and this current state of the offensive line was that the what else could the giants have done. They had to go out and get help. So that means they pretty much had to overpay mate soldier. And that means the didn't have a lot of other options. So I just kind of wrote a piece trying to be as realistic as possible looking back at the options they had at the time of what first of all whether the giants could have rebuilt an offensive line in a year. And what that would look like. If they did. So in my piece, they come out with signing. Chris Hubbard in free agency to play right tackle. And then I just as they had drafted Quinton Nelson as second overall and also still taken will Hernandez in the second round. And then also the boarding of day two of the draft when it was rumored that the patriots antithesis go forty Niners. We're talking about trading Trent Brown as a giant probably could have just snuck in there often offered a better third round pick and come out with a left tackle there. I thought those were possibly reasonable things that could have happened at the time. I believe that comes out with a better offensive line. I think that comes out with some more flexibility going forward. Obviously, it's there's nothing the giants can do about it now. But I think that refrained that there's nothing else. The giants could have done. I don't totally believe that. And and I don't think it's helping anyone to to just say, oh, we'll get them in did all he could do he paid the top guy on the market. And that's what they had to do after coming away with that piece on them. Not sure I totally believe that knowing that was basically, the thrust of barn wells peace and my reaction to it from ESPN, which was an insider. He's so tried to just bring the relevant bits two giant fans. And basically the giants through good money after bad particularly with Nate solder and Patrico. Mommy, the Seahawks. Hiring Mike's Laurie who was the giants offensive line coach last two years and signing DJ fluker who was eventually after injuries. Forced Ben mcadoo's hand the giants right guard last year was rated as one of the. The best moves of off season because of the impact they've had on the Seahawks running game. And that was the thing that fluker brought to the giants. Because the about roughly five games he was able to start the giants fueled at one of the bull say most efficient rushing attacks in the league. They were averaging better than five yards a carry. And I believe I don't have the numbers in front of me. But roughly one hundred and three yards a game on the ground. And that was with an offense that had absolutely no commitment to running the ball. Even if it was working and fluker signed a deal that was one tenth the money. The giants gave Amami and only a one year deal as opposed to a three year deal. So that was obviously mistake and then going and making Nate solder the highest. Paid lineman in league history at least to that point. And as you pointed out, it it wasn't something. They absolutely had to do. Nobody had a gun to the giants. Head saying. Do this or else they have other options? It would have involved being a little bit more creative than just going after the biggest name on the market, but it could have been done, and it definitely would give them more cat flexibility. Where maybe they wouldn't have had to go in trade Brett Jones, and they could have had a natural center starting for them. Yeah. Of that is true in of course, hindsight is twenty twenty. But I think so requested these moves when they happened. I wrote a piece before free agency, I looked at the top ten free agents by position, and I wrote about the this solar and even mentioned Hubbard in that piece of what the difference in play was between the two and how different the price would be. And I think that was something that that could have been a realistic possibility. But I feel like the giants felt like they needed to make the big splash move to say, hey, we are. Doing something about this offensive line. I even though that hasn't worked, but that's bad. As the offensive line has been another thing. We've talked about on this podcast is just how the giants have not been super creative in trying to get around the offense of line. And that's another thing. I want to see out of this offense is hopefully see a widow bore creativity and bring some of the things that Pat Shurmur showed in Minnesota someone pointed this out to me on Twitter. They reminded me of post I wrote back in like January about how Pat Shurmur 's past offenses have not been super great. When you look at where they've ranked by Devia way. A lot of them are in the twenty s his best offense was second. But that came while he was under chip Kelly in Philadelphia and just basically everyone that was Kelly's that was that was chip Kelly his offense. No one credits. Server with that offense. Even though he was the authentic coordinator. That's like saying the giants. Offense is Mike Shula's offense. Right. Yeah. It's the same thing right now. And then he wasn't in the his only other season in the top ten was last year in Minnesota. So I wrote this and then I watched the Minnesota offense. And I bought it because I thought there was some things he had learned from that time. There were new schemes and new types of plays that he has brought in from everyone that he has worked with when I bought in. And hoping that the offense was going to look like something that more resembled Minnesota than whatever he had run in the past that just has not been the case, they're not running a lot of play action, which he did in Minnesota. They're not using a lot of pre snap motion, which he did a lot in Minnesota. I wrote a big piece about how will Pat Shurmur used motion to not only I mean, usually when you talk about motion, it's sometimes just trying to figure out whether the authentic is in. Man or zone. Whether someone follows the receiver or not when he's moving, but there's so much more than that. It can open up plays in and you get just misdirection. And it's definitely a piece that can be used to open up offense more. But if you look at where they have been with with motion by now, and the per sports info solutions numbers the giants have used motion on the ninth fewest plays in the league. They have six point three yards per attempt on pass plays where they've use motion and five point four when they haven't. So they've been much better emotion. That's actually one of the biggest gaps one of the biggest positive gaps in the league. And they still haven't used it. If you look at play action, they are only twenty seventh in the rate of play action. And while they haven't been great using play action. There seven point two yards per play is just twenty first it's still better than the six point eight yards. They have. On passes without play action. So these are just simple things that Pat Shurmur has used before their misdirection type ways that get the defense is off guard a little bit. They opened up things for the offense. They just make things easier for your offense. And they're simple things at this offense just isn't using. So when we get to the second half of this season. I want to see if they are going to use these a little more because they're just very obvious things that can help. Yeah. And even moving on from that, maybe have or not maybe they should be using Evan Ingram for things other than shallow crossers know where he can actually use that four four speed provided. He catches the ball. But that's some that's a different that's a different conversation. And might I think be influenced by just how few plays the offense as a whole or making. But again, different conversation. But you know, let him run vertically down the field use his athleticism use saquon Barclays athleticism as it stands. Now. He's tenth in the league among running backs in yards after first contact. So he right now is picking up more than tuna quarter yards after a defender hits him the touches him. The first time. If he's doing that. Why not let him have that first contact in the defensive backfield rather than the offensive backfield, which is a common refrain on this podcast. Let him run down the field before you throw him the ball. There are other things they could do like run more RPO's. Which would you know? It's a simple quick read done properly. They're practically free yards. They played it you lie. Manning strengths. Let him do that something I've been wanting to see since I don't know twenty twelve. Maybe even earlier why not incorporate the pistol they've they did that approximately once in the preseason. And I don't know that we've seen it sense. It offers a lot of the same advantages the shotgun. But. Also has a lot more versatility. When it comes to running the ball. There's things they can do that. They just haven't. And that's one of the things about Pat Shurmur, this disappointed me that he hasn't brought in the c- creativity and flexibility in his scheming that we really expected from them. That's been one of my biggest issues with what's been going on. There's just I just I would really like to see any sign of creativity. A going forward in the second half. I I don't know how how you trust. Whether there's a rookie quarterback or whatever next year, if if there's no creativity to get in this offense going right now, what's to say, there's going to be you know, next year. So in the second half of the season. I I definitely want to see more creativity. And there's there's no excuse as we look forward to what we're going to see against San Francisco man L Thursday night. They played Nick Mullins at quarterback. But they stuck to the Kyle Shanahan scheme. There were guys running wide open and again that was against in Oakland Raiders defense. That is absolutely terrible. If you look at adjusted net yards per attempt Oakland's allowing nine point five this year and Patrick Mahomes is nine point four five as a quarterback. So Oakland is allowing opposing quarterbacks to be slightly better than Patrick Mahomes this year, but still I don't think the giants would have been doing that against Oakland. I don't think it's crazy to say that I would not see the giants throwing light crazy against that raiders defense. If that was their time to do that uh. So, and I yeah, I just really need to see some creativity for this. I don't understand the way these these players have been used at when you have all this skill position talent that you have. I've said is great and debt. You have admitted is above like the weeds best at each position. But you're using them like you would almost any other player at that position. And that doesn't make sense to me at all. But I think we can we can move on. And so on the offense while we want to see some more schematic things happen and see some hope there when we know mostly the players are what you want to spend at least at the skill positions. I think we'll switch to defensive side. I think we just wanna see some new players and see what they can bring because that's somewhere where I think I have a little more competent in the scheme. I just have no idea. What players are going to be a part of it going forward. Yeah. On the defensive side of the ball. The questions are really all. All personnel. The giants have some pretty big money decisions to make over the last eight games of the season. You know, they have to decide on whether or not they want to resign or extend Landon Collins, he said today that the talks have not yet begun, which seems like could be slightly concerning, but the giants tend not to be in a big rush to extend players anyway. So that will that will happen in its own time. If it happens at all they have to decide whether or not they want to keep janoris Jenkins or cut him for decapa room that decision, you know, he's he hasn't been playing as well as he did in two thousand sixteen but he's still viable starting corner. And the prices of those guys are is only going to go up. So. His contract will get better as it in comparison to the rest of the league as time goes on. And you do need good coverage to run James Bechers defense. Otherwise. Bits blitzes Wilburn you. And then there's Livia Vernon who he's on a sizable contract of his own and the giants could decide to try to cut ordeal him for some cap relief. But then on the other hand who's going to rush the passer as we saw through the first six games of the season. They don't really have anybody else who could be primary pass rusher, or at least as it stands. Now. That's definitely true. Especially when you look at what they did when I wrote during the bye week just kind of how the rookies have played. I I kind of wrote how I'm kind of still holding out on the hype of Lorenzo Carter a just because of you know, he hasn't totally been affective to as a pass rusher. And I looked at just kind of pressure rates how many Pasha snaps and how many pressures these players have had Encarta was only three point five. But would you will get VA verb? He's at seven point five percent of his pashas snaps come with a pressure, and that's easily the best of the giants edge rushers right now, and you can see the pasteurized completely changed when Vernon came back. So I think they still have this balance of veterans and young guys that they need to mix in for the rest of the season. And and as we look to go forward Vernon's definitely going to be one of those guys. A we have some young guys some young guys that we know are going to continue to see playing time like or rental Carter alike BJ hill who we saw and one of those guys now who is going to be added to that defensive line his fifth round pick RJ McIntosh who was just activated. A from the NF I list on Tuesday. But the Chris I think this is going to be news to you. Because it actually just came up as we were getting to this topic. In order to create the roster. Spot for MacIntosh to be activated. The giants waived Quadri Henderson. Oh. Wow. Yes, I did not have my Twitter feed up and just they finally find a guy who can be reliable as returner, and they let him they got rid of him. I guess that means they really like she will Davis as that return guy. But I mean Henderson even in his his short time was was better than Davis was. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know why that was the move that had to be made. I mean Henderson Henderson was easily the best returner. They're on a team that did not have good returners in our latest round table. He was good enough. I listed him as a possible building block. Finally, they it took them three tries, but they were able to solidify that finally, well, I guess not not anymore back to the oval onboard back to unknowns in having very bad return. So yeah, that's that's breaking record this. But yeah, you would have thought Henderson was was. A piece even though he wasn't probably going to contribute at wide receiver at as a kick and punt returner, he was was showing more flashes than anyone had seen or anyone had shown so far this season. But as we get back to the defense, and there's there's the just the young guys. You wanna see wanna see grant Haley get more snaps, and he probably is if if the game against Washington is proof. He was the starter. He played a quite a bit. Did Sean Chandler had had a bigger role those were two undrafted guys absence after the bye now he's not exactly young. He's not one of the rookies still fairly young into Tony with Pat who was signed. He's still coming off that achilles injury. But he's had the weekend. He had a week and a half with the giants. Now, he has that by a we'll see if he gets on the field at cornerback now and those guys the undrafted guys Lapasset the giants need at least one of them to step up and look like they could be an answer at one of those spots either slot corner outside corner free safety because otherwise they've got. What an awful lot of holes to address, you know, maybe definitely more than they can address in one off season. If they don't come out of this season with any answers from the the young guys and maybe more than they can address this off season next off season if they have to tear down and rebuild the offense of line yet again and somehow try to find a quarterback, those are the positions. I think they're really bear the most watching over the last eight games or so. Yes. Absolutely. And when you talk about things you can't do in one off season finding like eleven new players to put on a defense is definitely one of them. I don't think there's there's any way we can get around that. And in the giants might be looking for. I mean, depending how the rest of the season plays out light. Like, maybe six starters. I don't know maybe at like four at the waist is possible. So it's it's there's going to be a lot of work there. A, but if there's things we're looking forward to for the second half disease in it seeing these young guys and who is going to contribute. I've said multiple times I have some high hopes for grant Haley it whether he sticks us law Kunar, they wanna use them outside. Probably is more likely to stay in the slot. A Tony lapenne is someone who I have liked. But we just don't know what he's going to be like coming off that achilles injury that he had caused him to miss the entire twenty seventeen season. So right now with the giants have on defense is a whole bunch of dart throws and a we don't know if they're going to hit the board or not let alone stick somewhere useful. That's what we're going to look for on on the defensive side of the ball. It's just seeing if. The of these players are going to be worth keeping around or if there's even more work that needs to be done for this defense going into the offseason. Yeah. The giants have a lot of holes they need to plug. They need some of these guys to step up, and unfortunately, more than a few of these holes are ones they made themselves. But that's what the second half of this probably lost season. His going before just an expanded preseason for twenty nineteen. Yup. That is that is what is going to be. So a couple of things at while we buy, unfortunately, while we might not be watching for a lot of wins. There are definitely things we can keep an eye on to give us maybe some clue of what this team is going to look like in a throughout the off season and into twenty nine thousand nine hundred. So I think we can end it there. If you have not subscribed to this podcast. Please do so you're going to now get our shows and Ed shows all going to be in the same channel. So just subscribe to big move you wherever you download your podcast on you're going to get everything in the same feed. Please written review if you haven't already again, if you guys would like to throw some suggestions for what this show should be called, a please let us know we will be. Back later in the week. And remember that is now going to be our college football and draft show ED's probably going to have another show coming this week as well as we head into week ten with a game on Monday night. So thank you guys for hanging out. And we'll talk to you again soon. Hi, I'm Karen Fisher. I wanna tell you about another podcast. You should check out. It's called Rico decode every week. I talked to tech media's key players about how they're changing our world. I interview tech executives like Facebook CEO, Mark Zuckerberg, political figures, like Hillary Clinton and media personalities like John Kerry, you literally wrote the book on thoroughness once again the name of the show is Rico decode hosted by me Kerris wisher. You can find it on apple podcasts or wherever you listen to the show. See there.

giants Pat Shurmur Chris Hubbard manning Twitter NFL Rams football vox media Oakland San Francisco John Brown Mike Shula Eli manning Sean Ramos Kyle Shanahan Valentine Haley Tony lapenne
'Valentine's Views' podcast: Bears-Giants preview

Big Blue View

18:08 min | 10 months ago

'Valentine's Views' podcast: Bears-Giants preview

"This is Sean Ramos Firm. I'm the host of Oxidative News. podcast today explained you know late September. We've done probably close to a dozen shows on this impeachment inquiry from the sort of early rumors of a whistleblower complaint too Nancy Pelosi launching the formal impeachment inquiry to the whistleblower. Complaint coming out the so-called transcript coming out to the Republican counter narrative to the White House stone. We've done it. All all felt like it was leading up to this moment of have televised impeachment hearings and the event of that event was the testimony of Gordon Sunland and we wanted to make sure we've made an episode that properly showcased and explained the significance the historic significance of that testimony. And we did it. We want you to hear it. It's available in our feeds right now. Today explained episode is titled Impeachment TV. Mr Sunland goes to Washington. And it's a must-listen. I wouldn't say so if it weren't go. Check it out and enjoy thanks Giants fans welcome to a special weekend edition of Valentine's nineties. PODCAST here on big radio part of the SP nation family of podcast. I'm your host. Ed Valentine we've had so much good content tint here on big blue radio. Recently I had as guests on my show of had former Minnesota Vikings general manager Jeff if diamond had former New York giant place kicker Lawrence Tines quarterback Guru Tony Resio p. over on the Khorasan. Enjo show we've had been so lack of the draft network in Emory Hunt of football game plan as Chris Fleming Joe Daily owned begin to get you guys ready for the twenty twenty. NFL draft so that to be honest is why we're actually bringing you a uh-huh Weekend Edition we've had so many good guests and so much going on that Here on Valentine's views podcast. We really haven't had opportunity to fully previews Sunday's giants bears game and to do that. I'm going to To bring in Gene Special Guest Lester Wilt Fong who writes for SB. Nations bears website. Windy City gridiron. Let's get right to the interview that I did with Lester. And after that you'll hear a quick break for a word from our sponsors and then you'll hear a couple beloved of clips from Thursday press conferences from offensive coordinator Mike Shula and defense coordinator. James Becher your hope you enjoy giants fans I'm joined now by Lester wilpon of SP nations Chicago bears website. Windy City gridiron. As has we continue to get you guys. Ready for Sunday's giants bears game. Lester thank you very much for coming on for a few minutes on how you doing today. Oh no I'm good. I'm good listen. You know neither one of our teams has has met expectations this year. You know it's probably a little bit less surprising for the giants to be struggling than than it is for the bears to be struggling at this point when I think when you and I talked in the summer we talked about the bears as a as a super bowl contender. And that was your expectation that they'd be in that mix and they're four and six right now and probably not making the playoffs. I mean how disappointed are you and how oh disappointed fans at this point. Yeah I mean it's one of those situations where you know coming off. The twelve enforced season last year. You know the the playoff game was. It wasn't with a tough old swallow Lilo but we expected that that that would be something that would drive. This team. Forward was the defense had pro bowlers and all pros at each level. They're young and ascending sending unit still even though they were one of the best in the league last year. And then that offense you know. Even though they were kind of a middle of the pack they showed enough flashes and they had enough young talent. Were you figured this group will take another step in second year of the Matt Nagy System and that hasn't happened. I mean the offense has regressed to the point where it's affecting the entire team team. You know the defense is on the field. Too much. Defense has to play more more close to the vest there. They can't they can't take any chances no they. They never get a chance to have a lead so they're always planning from behind and offenses regression has really hurt this entire team and obviously a lot of that regression. Of course you know centers around the quarterback centers around Mitchell trubisky. And I guess what I need to ask you and I think I already know the answer to. This is obviously trubisky in his third year. I think we know that he's not going to be. You ever really probably be among on the top top tier of quarterbacks in the League at this point is there a way forward beyond this year for the bears with trubisky or four or did they simply need to go out and find someone else before their window closes. I think which Bisky is. I mean. There's chance for him to come back from this few and far between with players in the NFL player struggled early in his career than they found some life later but usually it happens on another team. So whichever Richard One more year on the contract so he'll probably be in Chicago again next year. But you know you just cannot go into a season with with the defense as good as this. One is in Tuscon young skill players on offense with a quarterback that can't make the simple plate so he's going to have the rest of the season to try and get things figured out if you kiss. He has a miraculous comeback season. Here maybe they roll with a lesser veteran. But if you keep playing like as playing now they have to get a veteran that can come in and be a starter next season whether that's a trade for Cam Newton. That's a guy in FRAC- like Marcus Mariota or Ryan Tannehill again. These aren't great names here but the way the bears offense is going. Now it'll be an upgrade over Mitch. Trubisky let me ask you this. You have trubisky. Giants have their own young quarterback obviously sleep first round pick in Daniel Jones. Giving your choice between the two of those guys right now. Which one would you take right? Now it's Jones but I I will say that you know it's still early in Jones's career and at that point you know last year you know what I said about Trubisky when people are asking me as a guy and then I'd say you know it's still too early to tell you know you really don't know about a young quarterback you know until he gets a few years down the road so this is citrus. He's third year now. We're kind of seen the regression could bounce back that you can't but with Jones. He's had flashes he. He looks to be able to read a defence a little better that in his early stages of his career her then trubisky can right now in your three so so the easy answer is jaws. But you know. I'm not ready to say he's going to be the savior of the giants franchise. He's glad I guess you know my personal take on that is I think I would take Jones simply because we know less about we. We know less about him at this point. We know a little bit less about his weaknesses as far as what he's going to be. I think he's still a little bit more of an unknown so I might take the upside that sets the hope the giants fans every now is the young quarterback that's sending and that hope is pretty much out the window for the most part first Chicago. So what about what about Matt Nagy. I mean you know. Obviously last year you know everybody he thought he was wonderful and obviously darts get fired at coaches when when when things don't go well I mean how much of of what's going on with Chicago this year could could you pin maybe analogy on the job. He's done yeah I mean. He deserves a big person to blame. As wow I mean. Last year he made a lot of a lot of good decisions. This season you know. He has a struggling offense and he's not willing to do what it takes to fix it. The good example that we saw in the game with the Rams against the bears coach. Sean McVeigh He. Totally changed his offense of system. He does not want to run the bollock. He was doing in that game but he knew what. The struggling offense struggled quarterback he had to make some changes in order to win that Cement Matt Nagy has not shown a willingness. Do this season. The bears have had success running out of the I formation. And that's something that the negatives really want to do. So it's like he's trying to force feed his version of his offense on his team and they're not the X.. Cute it oh sadly lester. That sounds all too familiar with that with a bunch of young coaches and unfortunately personally if that young coach can't learn how to stop being so stubborn and be more flexible than they. They're not going to be a coach much longer. And that's the situation on agreements. Kogyo Matt Nagy has to find a way aid to get out of his own stubborn head in do what it takes to win. And then at some point he make it the players in place where you run what he wants his vision but until that time in your players can do you know Lester. It happens with older veterans. Second time head coaches to it did I did. I just say something about Pat Shurmur. Maybe I mean it's it's one of those things that happens in. The success coaches can adapt and the guys that candidate you know they. They may get a GIG here in there but they're not going to have that locker of success at a guy like Like like Bill Belichick does because he adapts his scheming his offense pretty much every year here from a pretty much week-to-week basis do what it takes to win. It's an amazing thing lester and it's an amazing thing that that you know. I always find when you listen to coaches. You read coaches say coaches love to say it's about the players players and not the plays. Yeah and then when they turn around and call plays or call defensive schemes. You've you've you. You tend to find out that for many of them it actually is about the players are the schemes. I think they have a bit of an ego to to a point and they just got to get out of their own way. I mean like the great coaches through the years have done that. They have that that that Eagle mentality where it's their way or the highway but at some point you know you gotta deal with what you got what you got like. The situation terrific can't make player in the pocket. He just can't do it so you have to roll him out you have to do more and more are running. And he's shown Houston. He's unwilling to do that right now. All right so let's talk a little bit about `bout Sunday in particular if you look at this you from a giant perspective. How would you look at this as if the giants are going to go into Chicago and pull what would be an upset? I think it's a six point. Spread right now and the giants have lost six in a row if they're go into Chicago and break that losing streak. How do you think the game's going to unfold? I think the giants had a good chance to win this game. The teams have done. You know they pass Ross to keep trubisky in the pocket you know. Even though it's risky doesn't want to get outside. He seems to be more content to stay in the pocket whether it's his decision the coats and decision he's been in the pocket more and in a lot of defenses. They have been playing them that way. They've been spying him a little bit. They've they've been doing a contain rush me outside to keep them inside and you WanNa make him be a quarterback in right now. I can't do that so if you guys keep him in the pocket. You make you make decisions. I think that we get a chance S.. Win this game giants fans would giants fans would love to come out of Come out of Chicago with victory. You know it's one of those deals for the giants where they've lost some games this year where you think they should have one But maybe you know maybe go into Chicago and and and get a victory in the rest of a year can be a little bit better. Yeah I mean right now the giants and bears in the same situation. They're both trying to play spoiler. I know the bears have a much playoff teams at the end of the season. And I'm not sure about the giants schedule but when you're a struggling franchise and there's no playoff hopes there you can hope for is the show some improvement towards the end and play spoiler. All Right Lester. Thank you very much for joining me. good luck on Sunday and it looks like I think the way that the way the the NFL schedule might be unfolding. We might be doing this again next season. That's the way it looks both in third place right now so we should do it again. All right thank thank you very much. We'll talk to you. Ever go on all right bye-bye Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk and we're the host of the shutdown forecast your avengers of college football podcast. It says in the script to riff on what that means and basically what I mean is. It's all already spoiled every Tuesday. We talk talk about everything from cooking disasters pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college football. Every now and then like mascot fights announcers I fleeing the booth early. And unfashionable pants. That coaches where now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP. Hello Listener I'm Sean. Rama's firm host of today explained. Vox Daily News. podcast every day Monday through Friday my team and I look at what's happening in the world. We pick one essential news story that defines our moment and ask smart people to help us understand stand in about twenty minutes or less. It's the perfect way to start or end your day subscribed today explained for free on apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast cast APP from stitcher and the VOX media podcast network. This clip is giants offensive coordinator. Mike Shula talking about Chikako Pass rushers Khalil Mack. In Leonard Floyd. Yeah those guys are. They're not the only to pass but yeah we have to mix protections actions have to get the ball out we gotta stay out of the more you know as we say here stay ahead of the chains. Stay on schedule Whether or not it's I have a guy help chip as as we say But you can't do it every point. And they know that they're good at that and they are not just pass. rushers expedience understand when you're trying to keep guys in. It's harder to throw the ball down the field with guys. So it's going to be a combination evolves and we've got to be able to stay out of May make first downs on her. This is defensive coordinator. James Aims Bet. You're talking about what he needs to see for the remainder of the season from struggling first-year cornerback De'andre Baker. No I think they're Very similar to some of our other guys in Cologne players. First second third players that There's some snaps the office that I think he probably would be putting. I want some snaps back for him and he wants back to and I think but the thing that that bake has shown me as he's willing to come to that he comes in a meeting room and if something's wrong he doesn't you know I would worry if we're sitting in the meeting room. He didn't own a mistake. That's what I'm worried but I don't worry because because he owns whatever the correction needs to be whether it's on him and in in Hey it might have been on someone else to you know sometimes when you watch this tape. If you didn't know you might think that this was on player when it might really been on your seat and continuing to work very similar to the rest of young guys in. We're trying to narrow down the things they need to get better at in the immediate future. We're trying ah those things and prioritize and that's how you help young players that's how you help players develop is You know I've said it to everyone here is it's it's very similar to get a prescription. You know you need to do a B and C I handle ABC. Then then we'll square that away way to help you get better there then. We'll work in whatever the next progression become a better player short-term and long-term for football and that's our show for today giants fans. Please remember to subscribe to Biglou Radio on all of your favorite podcast applications. Check out my show here on Valentine's views. Check out the Chris. Joe Show please also remember to To sign up on on our website. If you you haven't done so already to participate in a discussion with other giants fans check out all of our giants bears coverage this week and everything everything else at big blue view. Our facebook page our instagram page. As always we appreciate your support and we'll talk to you soon bye bye.

giants Chicago Lester NFL football Matt Nagy Ed Valentine Daniel Jones bears Lester Wilt Fong Mike Shula Nancy Pelosi James Becher Gordon Sunland Sean Ramos Firm Minnesota Vikings Washington SP nation
Was Rudy Giuliani always like this?

Impeachment, Explained

55:34 min | 10 months ago

Was Rudy Giuliani always like this?

"The thing that Donald Trump is trying to do with respect to Ukraine was bad. And so when you forever stymied by process because the thing you want to do is bad or corrupt or an abuse the power you have no choice but you someone outside the system who can be bent to your will like Rudy. Giuliani in. That may end up being down. But the reason it's bringing the president down is because the thing that he wants to do his back as a client and this is impeachment explain. This was a similar quieter week for impeachment. We did not have public hearings this week. It's Thanksgiving Week. Happy Thanksgiving to all of you. The members of Congress are home A lot of them are trying to hear what their constituents to think of all. This trend Their next move the important things right now are happening behind. Closed Doors Congressman Adam Schiff and the House intelligence committee Prove the majority on the house. Intelligence Committee are writing the report that they will give to judiciary so what is coming up now. Is the hand off. Basically so far we've seen a public investigation instigation conducted by intelligence. Things are going to now move to judiciary which is going to actually set and write the articles of impeachment. As Lon- I've heard people using that intelligence handled the information to share. Handles law sought will probably be true. So WanNa look at two things today. One going to be joined by my colleague medically ceased to talk about where we are impeachment and what is coming next and some strategic and procedural decisions that will shape it. And I'M GONNA be joined by PRI Pera to talk about Rudy Giuliani who has entered into a strange political twilight as the key figure arguably in this entire impeachment scandal. But Jimmy I is not neglect. She glossiest guest. Could you be here. So where are we. We had the three days of hearings in the Intelligence Committee. What wh- where are we what happens now? It seems as if the intelligence committee is not going to hold any further public hearings. They have absolutely ruled that out. But they've given no indication occasion that they want to and so. The Intelligence Committee is chairman. Adam chef along with the other relevant chairman of jurisdiction but but primarily shift. They are going to write eight some kind of a a memo. Guess about what they have found. They're going to pass it to the house. Judiciary Committee and the Judiciary Committee is going to consider a drafting acting articles of impeachment. And it looks like Democrats want to do this fast. They don't want to drag out the drama they want some kind of vote Probably so you know late this year or early next year. Yeah I there's a quote from representative all demings from Florida. WHO's a democrat? And she's on judiciary she sicily intelligence committee eighty and she said to politico. Wouldn't that be great Christmas gift for two all. Wrap up by Christmas. I think it's very possible. Why do Democrats want this to wrap so soon? Given there's a lot of people haven't heard of a lot of things arguably at least if you believe there should be a wider angry. They have investigated. There really does seem to be an emphasis on speed. That doesn't totally seem obvious. From the outside I find the tactical and strategic thinking here to be pretty questionable but It's clear that the most vulnerable frontline Democrats rats. The people who were not enthusiastic about impeachment three months ago they are very worried about the perception. That obsession with impeachment is preventing them from getting things done in Washington and they seem to want now that they have been kinda committed to doing this. They want to do it quickly. So that they they can turn the page and say they are doing other things. I don't really know how this works because it's not like there's going to be like some huge bipartisan Koumba. A`moment moment coming next next August and their idea that they're going to pass this a US Mexico Canada trade bill and that's going to help them with trump voters seems a little fuzzy Z.. To me but at any rate it's the front members who've been driving leadership's thinking on impeachment for months now and they seem to want to get this done sooner rather than later and then conversely Adam Schiff the other Democrats who've been investigating this they say that look they have not all the evidence one might want in the world but all the evidence you need to draw conclusions about trump's behavior that that seems to me to be a big question here on the one hand. I don't feel like anything. We learned in the impeachment hearings. Dramatically Beckley changed the story as we knew it from the original whistle-blower account and then the the White House record on the other hand. They're certainly part of me. That would like to hear from Rudy. Giuliani from Mike Pompeo from some of the other key players up the chain of command under oath. That would be interesting. And but at least flesh out the details. Bid Minder stemming sending from the Democrats is that the problem is these people won't testify claiming executive privilege or attorney client privilege and Giuliani's case and they don't seem to want to take the time it would require Choir to litigate that out but it means we're going in with a lot of key players not hurt from. This is a political process right. If what was happening here was that Democrats were saying will look we think You know two thirds of the Senate Republican caucus is super open minded. And they've really just want to look at a compelling said of evidence we feel like we've got that evidence so we don't need to rush ahead like well okay fair enough but but nobody thinks that that's what's going to happen and and so in practice we're talking about shifting from a process that Democrats control right. Were they decide which witnesses get called and they decide you know do they. They WanNa make a big stink. Hold a press conference saying it's outrageous. That would be Guiliani. Won't testify Or do they want to hand this over to the Senate where Republican and majority is going to decide what happens and where it sort of spirals out of their hands in a way that seems to me to be at least riskier than than they are really considering. We've we've begun to see some hints of what that might look like Senator Lindsey Graham made a statement this week that he was going to be asking the State Department for any and all communications related to the Biden's and Ukraine which raises the possibility that the way Senate Republicans are going to respond to what Donald Trump did in Ukraine is by running an impeachment. Each been trial. That does the thing. Donald trump was trying to through crane which is Castle of Aspersions on the Biden's and try to accuse them of corruption in a in a way the damages Mitch's Biden his potential opponent to trump weight. And I mean you saw this right in the Intelligence Committee House. Republicans had a list of complaints. That Schiff had not called as a witness. Hunter Biden The whistle blower of this woman. Andrea Chalupa who worked at the DNC at one point and they you know wanted to stage some kind of counter trial in which they were going to expose both the alleged corruption of Hunter Biden and also some kind of nefarious Ukrainian conspiracy to bring down Donald Donald Trump In the Senate Republicans will have the opportunity to to do that. To in effect put Hunter Biden on trial and to make the argument that this was a warranted instead of inquiries that trump was pushing for I think that's not like for a long time. It seemed like the ideological safe-space Republican senators would have been to say This call wasn't great but it's not impeachable clearly. That's not what trump wants. That's not what trump's Biggest fans on Capitol Hill want. And there's a real risk. The Senate trial in effect turns into a trial of hundred Biden. There's the question of length in the house whether or not Democrats keep going with the public part of the investigation. There's also the question of scope as this moves to the Judiciary Committee and a will hold hearings. Although I don't think the hearings will be an investigatory in the way we're thinking the way they've been under the Intelligence Elgin's committee. There is a question of when they write articles of impeachment. Do they add in things like corruption What trump has done with the hotels or other forms of self dealing? Do they add and other things around honesty or breaking of constitutional boundaries. That issue of do they build a broad set of articles of impeachment. That could then lead to more avenues of inquiry certainly in the Senate trial only two more things being aired or do they try to stay very narrow on the Ukraine question because they feel very defensible. Ground seems seems to me like the the key one and really not seen clear signaling on what Jerry Naylor and others are GonNa do. I mean there's a disagreement among Democrats going back to before. This Ukraine story broke as to whether there should be impeachment charges related to obstruction of justice in Muller's findings There are a lot of other sorts of things. Out in the air about the emoluments clause about A bunch of other stuff and I know one reason that Nancy Pelosi has been hesitant. Hesitant to broaden the inquiry at all. Is this concern that it's kind of like once you. Poppy can't stop sort of phenomenon with so much stuff that someone or other could plausibly say is impeachable that you you don't have like a limiting principle whereas if you hold the line at Ukraine than even though that's GonNa feel sort of arbitrary sorry it's also contained defined at an it's over. I mean here again. I think you know one can question the logic of this right. I mean Ukraine issue. It's something that this handful of moderate Democrats was comfortable with for a little while. Look Republicans maybe had some real concerns. Trump's conduct appear on the other hand. It's so remote from like the normal life of a typical American person. It's a little strange to me to to stay limited to this on the other hand. It is is true that it's like once you brought out. Where do you stop? I think something important to mention here as a part of the process. Is it every impeachment article that you to share it comes up with will. They voted on separately and so when NC Pelosi and others and democratic leadership are thinking about what to allow in not to allow in and as you say they they're very concerned they begin to open it it up. It will be very hard to say. For instance that trump's racism should not be an article impeach him. Because you say it isn't well then are you saying it's okay but once you open it up. Every single one of those votes gets taken can individually and so you don't want to lose Democrats on articles of impeachment votes Before you go to the Senate in some ways that I think they're thinking talking is you want to have as much as you can so at the very least people can save Democratic caucuses divided on this the more different kinds of votes. You make people take the more likely it is that they begin to moderates begin peeling off on at least some of them right. I mean exactly You know you might want like throw one extra one in there to sort of give everyone everyone a free vote to say. Oh no I'm moderate like I shot this one down but if you get a really long list you could have an embarrassing situation. which it's like judiciary wrote up thirty? Seven charges is an thirty three of them. Couldn't pass the House and now we're having a trial on on this random subset so that's a tricky one. The flip side I would say. Is that You know the hearings themselves. Have I think clearly not been great for Donald Trump right you have had a parade of people career. US government people bowl. Sometimes trump appointee is saying things that mostly reflect poorly on trump and his team right and to the extent that you can go broader and actually put this kind of issue that people have been talking about for years but hasn't really dominated the news agenda. If you can put that on television you know with networks. Cutting into their regular programming coming big cable news roundups in prime time with discussions about hotels Discussions about sexual assault discussions about You know sort of pilfering offering military construction money to build the wall at that strikes me is something that you don't be a a good look for Democrats who've oftentimes been complaining that they can't quite getting media attention for some of their criticism trump. Whatever you say about this Ukraine think they got a lot of attention for it? That seems right to me. One of the things that has seemed to me to be a strange sub set of this is that Republicans seem to be convincing themselves the polls here are good for them even though they are objectively reasonably bad and and Democrats seem very concerned. The Pos will turn on them. Even the polling right. Now is is good and I can't tell if the two sides are just They're sort of playing a public public relations. Game here or there seeing something I am not but this dynamic where Republicans seemed more confident than impeachment can backfire if it goes a little bit too far and Democrats dressing terrified of impeachment backfiring has created a funny a symmetry of confidence in how aggressively to prosecute the case between the two parties. Right and I mean I do think that part sort of that is you know as I'm sure listeners of the show know. The electoral map is skewed in favor of trump relative to broad public opinion and that frequently puts Democrats in tough positions right when something is narrowly popular among the mass public that makes the Democratic Base. Feel really indignant indignant about it like you guys should press forward with US right But House Democrats are still looking at the same gerrymandered map that there used to be a lot of hand wringing about before for the two thousand eighteen midterms They did well in those midterms. But it it's still that same map right. A lot of the critical members repping districts that are three four five five points more Republican than the nation as a whole The key electoral college. Tipping Point States two or three points more Republican than the country's a whole and the Senate is even more more biased pro. GOP So Democrats have this symmetrical sense of caution about impeachment about all kinds of things. I think it's not necessarily unwarranted but it can also be very frustrating to liberals who who look at this who see what they want. Who see these broad national poll numbers look bad for trump? So it's a it's a tough position to have the plainfield tilted against thank you very much. Thank you in a very strange way. At the center of all this is of course donald trump but next to him and arguably pushing him forward has been Rudy Giuliani. He of all people the former mayor of New York. How Giuliani got to the center of how he ended up comfortable running hawk foreign policy how he became Donald Trump's international bag bag man and how he became the person who arguably pushed the country into this impeachment saga serving central for understanding? Both Y. Were here and and having that context I think helps contextualize a lot of the news. That is coming out. And he's going to likely continue to come out so I'm joined by He is the former United States attorney. Attorney for the Southern District of New York from two thousand nine to two thousand seventeen. That is a position that Rudy Giuliani held at some point before him. He's Giuliani for longtime force. The the host of the great podcast stay tuned with and this was just a great conversation. So join me next pre-primary What if all you're breaking news alerts had a voice? What would that sound like? It would sound like today. Explain its Daily News podcast from vox. I'm Sean Ramos Grim Everyday my team and I take one essential new story. Deepali me to movies sports science and we break it down into twenty minute episodes. Perfect for your ride. Home subscribed today explained on Apple. PODCASTS is or wherever you listen from stitcher and vox media podcast network Rudy Giuliani. I've known him since I think the beginning of time probably figure in New York and I came to law school in New York in one thousand nine hundred and he was pretty prominent person. Then I came to know. Oh him a little bit personally. When I became nominated to be the attorney for the southern district the same job that he had for six and a half years that I did for seven and a half years one of the things that I did which I thought was a sign of both Respect for people who've had the job before and also my own sort of on the job training is is. I got together with everyone I could. Who had led that office and one of the people who lead for the longest period of time was was Giuliani and often? Say because I get a lot of questions about rudy these days. I'd like to preface what I say because my view has changed but I'd like to preface my remarks with a clear declaration of how friendly. He was how generous he was to me. Advice he gave me. We had a long dinner. We spoke on a couple of other occasions. I think when I was just starting not about anything that we're talking about today not about politics politics not about ideology but about the importance of the work that that office did How you run the office? how you get morale to behind the office which I think was high when he was uh running that place and he was. It was nothing but a gentlemanly and terrific to get advice from that was the job that launched him I in mayorship and then obviously to to this role in American politics was his reputation in that role when you sit down with them for dinner. What were your impressions of him as US Attorney you know depending depending spending on who you talk to people have different views? Everyone does that job a little. Bit differently I did a little bit differently from From how rudy did it or Jim Komi did it or Mary Jo. You're white did it. And we all did it differently from each other. I tried when I did the job to take the best of what I thought. Were the qualities of the other people and the and the the plans and strategies of the other people who had done it You know I did a little bit more public speaking then. Some people like Mary Jo White. I did a lot less public speaking than somebody like like. Would you Guiliani so I think you know I I gave more interviews and some people but I always tried to stay a you know within the lines and not talking about issues. That were far afield from the priorities of the office. Rudy would sometimes make very clear his political ambitions beyond the office of US attorney him he became yeah. I was young when I became the attorney. I was forty. I think if memory serves rudy it was like thirty seven to thirty eight even younger so look there were some people in that. This is true of everyone. Who's done that kind of job? There are people who think you're too the aggressive that people think he talked too much I think he did a lot of good things when he was the head of that office. He made a lot of enemies I believe is true that they were death threats. It's made against him. He did a lot of work on Wall Street. He did a lot of work. With respect to organized crime and organized crime you know the traditional Cosa Nostra was a big deal back back in the early nineties when when he was in charge of that stuff and he made a lot in wrote a lot of cases. One of the reasons ask about that. Is that at least part of his public persona was as somebody who had fought against corruption. Both on Wall Street and in organized crime and so the transition from there to here where he's at the center Erba case that is deeply The has a lot of corruption involved in it and has people running strange businesses with Mafia. And the name is it's. It's a pretty unusual one. So in between between. He's the mayor of New York and he's mayor of New York during nine eleven and I think a lot of the impression that people outside New York of which have him his of this somewhat liberal Republican mayor. They are of a blue city was he the guy then that we see today or was he different than in his changed you know. I don't know that I'm an expert to speak about you. You know what he's like in what is in his mind. I will tell you that as a New Yorker and someone who was in the. US Attorney's office as a young line prosecutor at nine eleven. You know people have their own views about cities running. Everyone has an opinion on the mayor. A lot of people don't like the current mayor a lot of people didn't like The prior mayor. WHO's now seeking to become the United States? Michael Bloomberg Sutherland strong opinions in New York. But the one thing about which there was consensus in this forged certain kind of reputation that that launched him on a presidential campaign that go very far because maybe for structural reasons. He's not as conservative. At least it wasn't then when he ran as maybe the rest of the Republican electorate wanted him to be or that he is now but in the days following nine eleven unlike today where he often says the wrong thing when he goes on television. Listen News Networks to talk about Donald Trump and about Ukraine back. Then he always said the right thing you know. We had a city that was in pain and in grief and everyone was crying all the time and you know on top of that what people forget is now we know that there was no immediate follow following attack. But I remember going to sleep in my apartment with my With my wife. And my young daughter four-months-old ten twelve blocks south of the Empire State Eight building and you will get rumors that another building was going to be hit by a bomb or a plane or something. Even the planes have been grounded. You kept hearing these rumors and so two things. Every time rudy spoke spoke about the lost. He spoke in a gracious and sympathetic and empathetic way. That maybe we hadn't heard him do before when he was sort of the jousting mayor of an unruly city and then second he was saying the right things about public safety and about. Oh how I responded. Were doing their jobs. And how the FBI and JT ATF. And even the American military was engaging in operations to make sure that we were safe and so he was very reassuring presence in the immediate aftermath of of nine eleven. I mean so much. So that he thought he could make a gambit but to evade the the term limitation rules and maybe extend his time as mayor to to a third term. It didn't work but in the immediate aftermath of nine eleven I think yes. That's how. Oh you've viewed him. That's how a lot of people viewed him that faded over time of course an argument that I've seen people make of his tenure there up in this primarily relates his reputation Asian before nine eleven but but seems to me potentially important through line to where we are now and through his relationship. Donald trump a lot of his work. A lot is most controversial work had to do with the conflicts talks between the police in New York and the public and he's known for defending the police against accusations of tally or wrongdoing to pretty extreme fame degree and an argument that my colleague medically he's made is it. Giuliani has always been more about law and order politics than the rule of law itself that he's in general been quite protective of those in power and those who practice a almost quasi authoritarian. Sean or politics do you think. That's a fair estimation nations. Yeah I think there's something to be said for that You know I haven't gone through all his cases and I was pretty young person when he was the. US Attorney obviously an older or adult when he was the mayor he practiced a certain breed of tough guy law enforcement and tough guy leadership so zero-tolerance. It's broken windows a lot of things that there's a healthy amount of you go there. They're famously I don't know how much of them are true. And I've worked with no vary. You know there there was a You know double duty of both police. Commissioner Bill Bratton and Ray Kelly. The both came back and do the job the second time and their stories. I don't know if they're true or not but they wouldn't surprise me me. That originally sometimes felt some competition with other people who were significant figures and law enforcement like the police. Commissioner always is in a city like New York work but yeah he valued in a very serious way maybe more than others an image of being a tough guy after his tenure as mayor and after he did not win the Republican nomination for president. He's been doing. What in between trump and now? He's been doing what I think he. He went back to private practice. He was he practiced at a couple of different firms representing international clients At some point I've come across him because he was representing somewhat famously among other council This Turkish National Reservoir who was charged by my office is former gold trader truck mode with my by my office four significant against sanctions evasion in routing resources to Iran and would Yuliana in the former attorney Jelly United States. Michael B Mackenzie came in for reservoir and and some of that has been the news because Rudy and Mukinzi went and travelled to me with Oregon. So he's got a lot of dealings in foreign countries in various somewhat odd ways. It's not the typical thing that a criminal lawyer does represent someone in the course of trying to vindicate their rights. We get them. Freedom were presented for are being convicted to actually engage in the kinds of conduct. That look more like you're a special envoy from from the United States and meeting with foreign leaders and there are echoes of that in what we're now learning about his exploits in Ukraine and other places I think he he has fancied himself not just a high powered lawyer in private practice but one who has international contacts and runs around the globe trying to get good results people not necessarily purely through legal process process. Interestingly but through you know his brand of diplomacy and negotiation yeah. This seems to me to be key. Connective tissue of what happened here. That so Rudy Giuliani the as I understand. His career became a national figure after nine eleven and because he had national ambitions tried to transmute what he had done in running and comforting hurting and leading the city after nine eleven into a foreign policy argument for himself. His speech at the two thousand Republican National Convention is very foreign policy related and then he seems to have gone into consulting private practice dimension where he acted almost as in his own way of form of shadow. US foreign policy the or an effort to show that he could run US foreign policy. When Donald Trump is elected he tried to become secretary of state? doesn't get that for a number of reasons but one of them is that he has a lot of shady and usual foreign dealings and then in doing that and that hurt him in the are there. I didn't think that was a dealbreaker. These days all turns out it doesn't have to be right because he becomes he becomes the presence personal lawyer and begins running a foreign policy from that perspective. So can you to say what. What is the the president's personal lawyer at least in theory what job is Rudy Giuliani doing for Donald Trump? I frankly I don't have any idea. There are times where that's an honest answer. There are times wear rudy. Seems to be somebody who is just a television lawyer. And he goes on the airwaves and he defends the president against some reporting. They've leaked out with respect to the Muller investigation or now Ukraine there other times when he claims to be acting the presence legal interests by having meetings in Ukraine. There are other times when it seems to be that he's a you know another campaign consultant and try to figure out ways to do messaging and improve the image of the president. The president himself on at least one occasion was asked his room on your lawyers that I don't know technique right there. exactly therein comforting. You know it's the client who decides if someone's their lawyer or not remember there's a substantive reason why no matter what roles someone is fulfilling on behalf of a principal answerable president or otherwise. Why you WANNA cloak that in an attorney client relationship often? It's the case that that's going to be protective of the principle bill because of attorney client privilege and all sorts of other things. You know people still view that relationship in some ways the sacrosanct and protected and it doesn't have to be transparent and everyone knows if you watch television even if you're not a lawyer that what happens between the lawyer and a client is secret and is allowed to be secret and there's nothing you can do about it even a prosecutor who's trying investigate a murder. You can't get the information from the lawyer that the client may have told him so. There's a lot of good tactical reasons why you want to you know make it seem like that's the relationship and a lot of people abuse that power. I mean the mafia used to do. We're not comparing these two things but the mafia to do it all the time you bring in the the outside counsel and on the principle that you can make an argument that every conversation you have with the lawyers sitting in the room. You're talking about shaking people down. You're talking about racketeering you're talking about Mafia hits as long as the lawyers around. You can make the argument later. Well it was a attorney client privilege conversation so it's it's a knee jerk. I think but also also tactical strategy to shield the relationship from outside inquiry and gives you free rein to do a lot of things but the fact that you have a law degree and your conferring with the principle about something does not mean. It's an attorney client relationship. Something that is so striking to me about how this is. All played out is when Rudy Giuliani joined as president. Trump's as lawyer potentially the idea was that president trump needed people who would protect him that he was under assault from all directions from the deep state from the media views under investigation and they needed people who were loyal who understood the political system the legal system and could protect him. What appears to have happened is rudy? Giuliani only has endangered him. That it is not a hundred percent obvious how much of this began with Giuliani. And how much of it was done at the orders of Donald Trump or how much it it was co created and Co dreamed up between the two of them but nevertheless it seems very strange to have your personal lawyer b the person who gets you into potentially really the most consequential legal or at least political trouble of your presidency. You know the interesting thing about that and I would have tended to agree with you and I think still do agree with you but I wonder if Donald Trump's shares that view Giuliani has on occasion. Gone on television. That things that I agree with you as a traditional the lawyer and someone who knows something about crisis management with think this is terrible for the President United States and the longer that he's allowed to keep doing it and he doesn't get muzzled muzzled he goes quiet for periods of time and he comes back on the recent reports that he started his own. podcast maybe who who doesn't want to District Klein. I yeah it's kind of I think it's in the constitution. Yeah former government former government officials must have podcast. I don't know that the president thinks that that's so and I haven't thought about this as deeply as I might but it seems like in the in the current universe where you have a president under assault from various quarters Muller investigation. His private lawyer being investigated my my former office. Espn y you have the impeachment inquiry now that the president thinks is most valuable because public sentiment is important is a bellicose belligerent. TV Airwaves defender and not someone who so necessarily a button-down You know legal brief writer and he has some of those people also you don't don't see them on TV. or He has had them in the past and I don't know that Donald Trump would agree with the assessment of Guiliani does a lot of harm. I think the people around trump thinks that. But I'll say look you. Donald Trump became the president. Those people didn't and to the extent you can make the argument that to the extent. Giuliani goes on TV and toxin. Weird phrases and in hyper detail about things that don't make a lot of sense and don't follow logically. In stream of consciousness to the extent he confuses infuses people about the issues. That's a helpful defense to the president states because at the end of the day you have to sway public sentiment. If there's going to be a conviction in the Senate You have public sentiment if the house was going to act on the Miller report which it didn't do and so. I think you know our traditional play of thinking talking about crisis management and defenses. I think has been turned upside down. You another example. I think you and I if we were to to speak about crisis management had handle scandal in the past which they will if you if. You'd said three scandalous things on Monday. Probably you don't want to say anymore more. You WanNa you WANNA take it easy and be less controversial. The president will instead say seven more scandals controversial things on Monday evening and maybe six more. We're on Tuesday and you've forgotten the first three scandal that happened on Monday. So no the standard playbook of how to defend yourself against things including accusations of lying thing. This president thinks is more line and more scandal and more obvious Gatien so I guess as a traditional person on these on these in this field I agree with you but I think there's a counter argument as well. I think that is correct There's no doubt in my mind that the trump administration and trump himself is always run by the the idea that it doesn't matter what the conversation as long as you're controlling it and the way to control it is constantly adds something outrageous into the mix so all of the attention turns to you and the people he likes the most of the People Kellyanne Conway and Stephen Miller who will do that on his behalf but what strikes me about Giuliani is in reading. The testimonies emerged in watching the public hearings in the house. In reading the reporting that has emerged. He was doing something beyond that role of media surrogate which is he was running at some level a shadow foreign policy round Ukraine. That seems to have been the thing that got that everybody else in the White House or the foreign policy establishment was tasked or forced to respond to and it's the tension between the process. Giuliani was running and the process at the traditional foreign policy establishment was trying to run that seems to be where most of the impeachment The potentially impeachable axiom of emerged. So from your watching the testimony money and you're watching of the stories. It's unfolded how do you think about that dimension of Giuliani's job but he seems to be doing running that unofficial side process in Ukraine was so to me again again being a traditionalist in these areas. I think it's it's insane. Think it's lunacy. I think it's crazy. You have an entire State Department. You have a Justice Department. You have the full of authority enforce of trained diplomats public servants and you have a National Security Council. And you're going outside. All of that with Rudy Giuliani. And so you know I credit the reporting and the testimony of those who have said that John Bolton the short-term National Security Adviser referred to what Giuliani was doing is cooking up some drug deal. That's his phrase and I think normal rational thinking people people who are in the traditional mold. Whether you're you know a a hyper conservative Hawk Republican like John Bolton or you're you're you're redubbed person who may have worked for a different administration on this regard is probably agreement. You go through proper channels you make sure that everyone is on the same page you make sure your consulting thing with and checking the boxes With your secretary of State and others you know Donald Trump has never wanted to work within normal channels. I think but I also take to heart what you know. Various witnesses said including Ambassador Sunland to the EU sitting on this issue of whether or not there was some other channel non-official channel. He said. Then we'll how can my channel not be official when the president was in the loop. I think the vice president was in the loop. The Secretary of energy was in the loop. This was the channel and I think Few and a Hill said words to that effect. In what does it say about Rudy. I'm not sure It says about Rudy that he's prepared prepared to take any kind of outside role that allows him to be in the mix and to engage in this sort of free ranging international man of mystery. She kind of stuff. But it says more about the president's dates and the president in his entire life has always chosen the bellicose unorthodox outside. Ride the lines kind of person several who now pending to prison or imprison like Roger Stone or like Michael Cohen. Or Paul Manafort or you know the famous late Roy Cohn. He's he's attracted to and wants his work to be done by not the button-down chain of command kind of person but by the sort of radical large personality behind the scenes. A back slapping egotistical figure who thinks highly himself and rudy is in that tradition for him you mentioned of players around Donald Trump who've gone to prison and so far in this particular story to the players have gone to prison is in our two of Giuliani's associates loved partisan eager Freeman. Were arrested convicted. They've been arrested. Yeah I'm sorry. Yes arrested at an airport with one way tickets out of the US on campaign finance violations. So what are we what. What do we know about them? So we know that they are Shady business people. We know they have had a lot of influence in politics. We know that they were doing some of their activity if you read. The indictment brought down by the Southern District Bjork for the purpose of giving some other person and a Russian national influencing elections And I think there's a lot that we don't know about them. We also know most recently that the lawyer for one of those two gentleman allman is prepared to have his client give information about other people including the ranking member on the house. Intel Committee Debbie newness so there are people who every time time you turn the TV. You see another picture of one of those associates Partis rooming with someone like Donald Trump or another person in the administration so so there are kind of person that you see sometimes in the world who has money to throw around likes to be connected in likes to know have hidden agendas now to to be clear. The indictment makes clear that with respect to the campaign finance violation. Those two gentlemen took efforts to hide it from whatever candidate they were supporting and from other people so to the extent some people are. You may ask. Does Giuliani have jeopardy with respect to the campaign finance violation you never know until the investigation has done but the indictment took pains to say that the scheme that they had to channel unlawful money to candidates was not known by other people in that scheme as I understand understand it was trying to push members of Congress are trying to support members of Congress who would aid removing the US ambassador to Ukraine. Yeah Yeah I mean. That's that's that's part of it and so that ties into this whole fortnight of hearings that we've heard and you know with respected expected Marie Ivanovich Right. The former ambassador to Ukraine Giuliani clearly had some involvement in that in the president. I think reportedly took the advice rudy. Giuliani there's a smear campaign against Marie Ivanovich separately with respect to this campaign finance violation. It that seems to have been one of the one of the mode is one of the purposes his so yeah in that regard. There's an overlap between what these two associates were thinking about what they cared about and separately. What Rudy Giuliani cared about and learned about? There's been a rash of comments in the press. Both from named and even more often unnamed Republican members of Congress saying will look. I'M NOT READY READY TO TURN ON DONALD TRUMP over this but I'm definitely getting tired of Rudy Giuliani and it seems to me. There's a an effort to begin building a narrative that Rudy Giuliani it was freelancing and the president got taken along for a ride or is being implicated a little bit on the side. What do you make the idea that this was all just a Giuliani scheme team? That other people didn't quite understand somehow got caught up in. I don't I don't buy it. I don't buy it because that's not how the president operates you know the thing that makes the president most unhappy her. Even when you're talking about a cabinet official cabinet secretary who has full reign and authority to engage in. You know whatever area that they're supposed supposed to be engaged in secretary of State Secretary of energy you name it. He gets mad when those people seem to look like. They're two autonomous not rogue but an autonomous freestanding. He's standing cabinet official MAKES DONALD TRUMP UPSET. And so now imagine how upset he would be and this is true also when you talk about campaign operatives. He doesn't WANNA give credit to people like Steve Bannon another another all the president. The president's doing it the presence responsible the presence smartest guy in the room the president has a brain unlike anyone's ever seen stable genius etcetera etcetera. So for for the president he wouldn't have operative would usually on your running right now. As as as cavalier as rudy is I think both indeed and in word he keeps. It's coming back to the to the fact that he was doing everything he did at the behest of the president. Did he do. Some things did out details or me with some people without doing long briefing of the president. I guess that's possible but I think that Rudy Giuliani was not being rogue the other reason why I think that argument doesn't hold water. Is You had multiple witnesses. This is talking about how things were vetted around what Giuliani was doing and in particular again obviously ambassador silent has a reason to make sure that he's giving the impression that everyone knew what was going on. Is that the defense of him. Because some people were beginning to throw him under the bus along with Rudy saying well you had silence and other folks they were kind of rogue someone very credibly in other areas not fully credible but in this area I think he was. He said over and over again in his testimony. The everyone was in the loop. I mean he used that phrase repeatedly and he kept talking about the things that he did with respect to Ukraine and you know the linkage between this for that as being at the direction of the president of the United States he does it over and over again so I think this idea that allies of the president have. It's a typical. You know strategy to blame some other person to have a fall guy. But that's just not with Rudy. Because of what Rudy himself would say really himself has said and what other witnesses like can bastards Tomlin have made clear the other thing about rudy himself might say he was on Fox News over the weekend and he people think he goes away but he doesn't I don't know he's he's always there and at some point he said I've seen things written like he. He meaning the president here is going to throw me under the bus when they say that A. He isn't but I have insurance. What did he make Rudy? Giuliani saying. I have insurance on Donald Trump. I don't you know he is then said Rudy has himself said it was as being sarcastic in funny kind of sarcasm. Well the reason speech. It's hard to. It's sometimes hard to explain Elaine. The intent of people who are hard to understand so the single best lines on this whole area. You're the euro very rational reasonable person advantage in this in this period. Both it's it's actually a problem right. I agree because you think other you think other people act like you do and everyone is engaged in rational decision making and careful speech and they're just not they're just not the president assessed off. He says later it was a joke. When clearly wasn't a joke he says you know? When he's in Helsinki he says I forgot to say the word? Not You know I. I don't know why impressions would interfere the election or the exact phrasing was so language gets turned on its head and I don't know if this is an example of a gaffe that the people say is when you speak the truth and Rudy was actually saying something that he shouldn't have said because he's got some kind of insurance policy but he says as I think he said he made he was talking about the the incriminating information he has on the Biden's you know I I don't know I don't know what to make of that. I often don't know what to make of of what Rudy he says in that regard. I think it's a very good insight though that one of the problems. Here's people try to attach a more rationalist Dick Straightforward Way reasoning onto some of these guys and they have and I think the other side of it and you mentioned this little bit. When you brought up Gordon Salman's I very good point that? How can you say his process? This was unofficial given how many senior appointed officials were in it one of the things about Donald Trump and something that appears to be true now about Rudy Giuliani in his post. Mayoralty altea is that they don't really run by process Donald Trump's very famously ran his businesses. Quite loose he just does a lot of dealmaking his people around him kind of picking up the pieces of the things he says does and starts up Rudy. Johnny seems to be creating in his own consulting and legal practice a strange meows MMA of relationships and obligations and thinks he tells people he can do for them and they can do for him and something that seems to me to have just attracted the to each other. Is it their work in the same way. They're working. They're both on some level or have become dealmakers and they're trying to run foreign policy dealmaking. Yeah I mean someone call them rogue cowboys And they believe in the power grown personality they believe in the power of their own persuasion And they're larger than life they aren't they're larger than life personalities member usually anyone who was when he was mayor of New York. Donald trump has been for many decades for those of us who've lived in New York. We know that Look on the one hand I'll l.. Say something positive about the presence proclivity towards you know. Fast Action on things I worked in the government long time there is a lot of bureaucracy even the worst insult they hurl at. Anyone is bureaucrat. Whether you're lieutenant colonel with the Purple Heart Or actually somebody's pushing paper in the basement of some government office building and bureaucracy is something that the government needs to streamline and faster decision-making process reported but I. I've sat in meetings and tried to get decisions decisions on things and the government to take too long and so you know some acceleration of decision making and streamlining is good. But there's a difference between you know stoltifying stoltifying bureaucracy and total chaos is what the president seems to favor is total chaos. And you know he likes people who are available available at the drop of a hat. He calls people up outside the chain of command. That's one of the one of the reasons why I I may be gone from office. Pretty United States likes to pick up the phone and call lead the sitting. US Attorney in the district that has jurisdiction over all his businesses and properties or many of his properties or call the president of Ukraine to ask for a favor though or take a call from a restaurant in the middle of Saturday afternoon from Ambassador Gordon Silent to find out if the Ukrainians are going to conduct the investigations that would harm Donald Trump's political nemeses. I mean that's what he does. He goes around Protocol he goes appearances chains of command and he reaches just down to do whether it's the weather service or anyone else and so I think he likes people who who have a certain profile and that is in this regard people who short-circuit process us and and claim that they can get the job done by having a face to face meeting with somebody rather than involve you know fifteen people at a meeting in also people who were full of bluster and fight and strong language and Rudy Giuliani fits that bill but the problem is when you rely on people like that one of the reasons you have all those processes and people in the meeting is to to make sure folks aren't overstepping or do something against the law and it's a it's a fascinating thing to me that This is the way they ultimately open. Open themselves up to so much risk right with a lawyer with one of the most establishment Republican figures in the entire game. It'll be a deep irony if it will be Donald Trump's connection to somebody who was a Republican in very good standing that ends up being the most dangerous thing he did to his own presidency. Yeah but but I get that but you're talking about normal people. People and and rational people and traditional leaders bear in mind that what Donald Trump wanted to do that. And how that all works right. You go through traditional channels if the thing you're trying to do is good in the national interest and on the up and up the thing that Donald Trump is trying to do with respect to Ukraine was bad in my view and corrupt and undermining undermining of what the United States was about undermining national security. Has All these. Witnesses testified they was underhanded and an abuse of power. Now when that is the thing that you want to accomplish more than anything else in your obsessed with it and you're terrified of Joe Biden candidacy and you want to undermine him anyone have anybody At arm's length say say that Joe Biden and his son or corrupt will. Then what do you do. You can't go through proper channels because even your own handpicked people as we've seen in these hearings have integrity and they have lines and they have limits and they're not going to do it and we've seen all these stories over the last two and a half years you and I both talked about at length where even people like the chief of staff. Kelly and others who claimed loyalty to the administration of the priorities of the president have sought to thwart what the president wants to do. And so when you're forever stymied by process because the thing you want to do is bad or corrupt and abusive power. Then you have kind of no choice. Who makes us sort of you know logical sense? You have no choice but to someone outside the system from who can be bent. Who could be bent to your will like Rudy Giuliani? And that may end up being him down. But the reason it's bringing the president down is his own. Fault is because the thing that he wants to do in his band Ribeira. Thank you very much. Thank you as one of the things I keep thinking about as I think about among other things the strange role rudy. Giuliani has played in all of this. The kind of assemblage of misfit it toys and odd figures that Donald Trump collected around him. The crazy prostheses run in parallel to each other trouble. He's gone country and himself and his White House. The Republican Party in Donald Trump fit into a long time Republican talking point. Not Just Republican. It's been around in politics forever. That what we really need is for the federal government to be run like a business but we need is a businessman. Somebody who's actually run a corporation and the reason that all got let's set the reason that was such a powerful talking point in American politics. There's long been this view. Well the problem with politics is no actual count ability. Yeah you stand for election but elections are. There's a lot else going on in them. Aside from direct look at job performance the great thing about how corporations around in circles accountability people get fired if they do a bad job you can tell things are being run efficiently or inefficiently. Donald Trump has obviously run businesses. We can argue about how successful. They've ben but at times have been successful in some of them certainly have been. He's an amazing marketer As a businessman but he also played a businessman on television for a long time and he played one in the New York tabloids for a longtime and so he was known to the country as a as an icon of American business. That's what many of his books are about what his carefully tended public image is so he puts his name on all these hotels and brands. They ideas to associate him with business and when he ran for office he said he would run. America like a business had on like all these politicians Christians who didn't make a deal or manage people that he would hire the best people that he would make the best deals because he was a businessman he had succeeded in the cutthroat world of New York business. Frankly of international business and who's going to bring that to the country no board of directors none would permit a serious this corporation to be run this way the way. Donald trump is run the government which I think Rudy Giuliani's role in the administration is example. A of the way. Donald trump has run this. No one would permit the way he tweets the things he says the things he does it start and the fact that within in that context it looks like Donald Trump of all people has almost ironclad job security outside. The context of elections is just remarkable. They're different ways of looking at leadership. One way of looking at leadership is that it encodes relationship between what is owed to the leader certify. His followers another way of looking at leadership is it is a promise of excellence that the leader owes to his followers. And you can really see the difference difference here putting even aside the impeachment power you can imagine Republican Party where Republicans were saying right now whether or not donald trump should be impeached. This is not a way to to run a White House that he owed us better than this that he promised to be. Better the ness and that we think he should step down or we think he should at least change change the way things are run very dramatically so this kind of thing doesn't happen again but Smith Republican Party acts as if the point of having Donald Trump is leader is that they owe him mm-hmm their allegiance. That leadership is in about what you're doing for for the organization or in this case the country and party that you lied leadership is about what Oh you deserve. As the very dear leader conservatives are supposed to believe in markets in accountability being fired for doing a poor job the the fact that Donald Trump who arguably has this job because he was in American living rooms every week for years firing people all for doing a poor job on things of tremendously less consequence than say foreign policy towards Ukraine or running the American government or being the public face of America America to the rest of the world the fact that he was out there firing people and I gave him a reputation for efficiency and clear management and decisiveness that helped launch him to the presidency under the argument that he would run things like a businessman that he would run the government like a business and then he runs this administration with this collection of chaotic figures chaotic processes and things happening with total lack of accountability and then ends the country in this just total mess and that he nevertheless holds the complete loyalty of his own party. Because I don't know because the wages ages of polarization because the incentives of politics are such that he must they must hold onto him. It's just wild. I guess on some level. There's some not the comfort but at least a sort of comforting irony in recognizing that the person who ran the government leased like business was the person who was supposed to run it the most Osa business right the one who showed just how unaccountable things getting government is the corporate leader. But there's also just a sadness to the whole thing that you know you can say what you want about whether or not trump should be impeached but this is not hey run the federal government and the fact that we have federal government where we put the person in the most important position in the world and then there is no consequence from your own party from the people who in theory elected you for poor performance. It's awesome great way to run anything. Impeachment explained is hosted by me hostess recline producing edited by Jeff jeld yelled research by Russia Karma engineered by Cindy Gill or theme music is composed by John Matches and our executive producer. Is Liz Nelson. Your joined the show please rate us on a podcast or send the episode to your friends. We'll be back next Saturday.

Donald Donald Trump Rudy Giuliani Ukraine president US US Attorney Senate New York Guiliani Congressman Adam Schiff Judiciary Committee Hunter Biden Intelligence Committee Congress State Department attorney Sean Ramos
OchoLive: Sounds From The Locker Room After Cowboys Loss To Titans

Blogging the Boys

45:13 min | 2 years ago

OchoLive: Sounds From The Locker Room After Cowboys Loss To Titans

"What if all you're breaking news alerts had a voice what would that sound like it would sound like today? Explain its daily news podcast from vox. I'm Sean Ramos grim every day my team, and I take one essential news story, politics, two movies sports science, and we break it down into twenty minute episodes. Perfect for your ride home subscribed today. Explain on apple podcasts or wherever you listen from Stitcher, and the vox media podcast network. What up world? Welcome to another episode of Ocho lie presentative in partnership is always with us being nations. Blogging the boys dot com Marjo, Joey no me, of course, from BTV and from right here as you're humble host on Ocho live. I know we've had a lot of issues lately. And so I'm glad we're here right now. So we can all kind of gather around the campfire and talk normally you can watch Ocho live every day about three PM central time on Twitter, periscope YouTube live or the blog on the boys. Facebook live we've had some technical issues as of late. So we've had some trouble getting off the ground that will be fixed this week talking about week ten of the NFL season. And we are at week ten because we are through week nine. I sit here. In my hotel room. Putting together the podcast with the sounds from the Dallas Cowboys locker room the losing locker room on Monday night football the last game of we can I the Dallas Cowboys losing to the Tennessee titans. Twenty eight to fourteen. You know, if I had told you back in August that the Cowboys would defeat one of the Texans titans Jaguars. I'm sure that you're one guess would not have been the Jaguars. But nevertheless, here we are the Cowboys lost at home for the first time this season. It was Jason wouldn't return. It was his homecoming. And it was a really flat performance by the Dallas Cowboys, and you know, I say flat. But. They started off hot. I mean, the Cowboys came out, and they definitely started off and came out Amari Cooper caught his first touchdown as a member of the Cowboys on his second possession or their second possession. Excuse me. And you know that really sounded or looked like it was going to bode well for the Cowboys. But that was kind of all she wrote that in score in the second half. In fact, the Cowboys crossed midfield just once in the second half. So kind of concerning certainly if you're a Cowboys fan, but this game was gross. And the Dallas Cowboys are now three and five the Washington Redskins are five and three atop the NFC east. The Philadelphia Eagles are foreign four and nobody cares. What the New York Giants are doing. And you know, we talk so much about this at blog on the boys on Ocho live on the seven five. Tony Casillas on ESPN San Antonio is a Saturday morning hangover. I mean the Cowboys had to have this game. All right. I mean. You know, I wrote about this. If you weeks ago, they have a gauntlet coming up the Cowboys do on Sunday night football this week. The Cowboys are going to be in Philadelphia. And if you don't realize that it's the first game of significance for the Cowboys in Philadelphia since Tony Romo broke his collarbone there three years ago in two thousand fifteen because in two thousand sixteen to Cowboys had wrapped up everything by the time. They traveled to Philly and week seventeen and a year later last season. It was vice versa. The eagles had wrapped up everything. By the time. The Cowboys got there and week seventeen. This is the first time in the Dak Prescott in Zeke Bill Elliott era that they will play a game that matters in Philadelphia. And those eagles will be coming off their bye, and they will have a new wide receiver that they want to show off and golden Tate, and it is the Cowboys. I visit to Philadelphia where there is a Super Bowl banner hanging from the link and after that the Cowboys have to travel to Atlanta, and there was the burning of Atlanta. Last year. And Atlanta is a team that has scored over thirty points in four of their five home games. The Cowboys have yet to break seventeen points on the road. They have yet to win on the road and their next two games are on the road. And then after that their grand prize is they get to come home and host the Washington Redskins who currently lead their division on a short week on Thanksgiving Day and seven days after that the Dallas Cowboys had the New Orleans Saints who look like the class of the NFC at the moment and NFL networks chain Slater reported on Monday night, right before kickoff that Dez is working out for the New Orleans Saints on Tuesdays of maybe this will be coming back to that are coming to that game. I should say. And if he does by the way, it would be kind of poetic that game is on Thursday night football on November twenty ninth. And it was on November thirtieth last year on Thursday night football when the Cowboys hosted the Redskins that was the night that Dez Bryant became the Dallas Cowboys all time leader. Receiving touchdowns. That was the night. He broke the record. And so it would be kind of poetic if he returned almost a year to the day to age into stadium with the New Orleans Saints, but that is getting a little bit ahead of ourselves. Unless by the time you listen to this. Maybe he's a Saint who knows? But back to the game at hand. It was not good. It was very very not good. It was troubling to see the Dallas Cowboys play so poorly. I was troubling to see some of the decisions they made. I mean coming out of the two minute warning down fourteen points on the Tennessee thirteen yard line. The Cowboys tried to run a reverse the Kobe's Louis through. And you think about it? I mean, I just you know, it's. You know, every week blot on the woods dot com. I write five winners and five losers. If you're listening to this and to all of our podcasts, blogging, the boys odds, are you read that and I have never had a harder time coming up with five hundred or so then I did for this game. It was tough. It was very tough because there's not a whole lot to like I think that you come out of this game against the titans. And I think if you're a Cowboys fan, you feel really good about Amari Cooper, and you feel like he certainly can be. Somebody that's impressive and certainly a wide receiver one. But you know, other than that. What is there a, you know, maybe Michael Gallup, I guess certainly had some moments in Alan Hearns did catch touchdown tonight as well. Monday night for the Cowboys. And by the way, both Amari Cooper and Alan Hearns caught touchdowns. Those are the only two touchdowns the Cowboys scored against Tennessee. And Monday night was the first time this season that the Cowboys had two different wide receivers. Catch a touchdown in a single game. It took them eight games to have multiple receivers. Catch a touchdown in the same game. So I mean, it is what it is Dak Prescott. I mean, you know, this is probably I think the lowest that even the staunchest deck supporters have felt about Dak Prescott. Monday night, did not go. Well for the quarterback back Prescott played quite poorly. He had another moment. I wrote about this. If you weeks ago belong to the woods dot com. Doc had a few mental errors in Detroit win and in the loss at Houston with just basic fundamental things things like getting out of bounds things like throwing the ball away. And the former excuse me the ladder happened against the titans. Dak Prescott the drive after the titans missed field goal. The Ryan suck up missed the doing that ended up being a gift at the Cowboys. Connect cashing on Dak Prescott ran at abounds, and he could just throwing the ball away. And by the way, I know I'm sort of whispering and not at the usual volume. But again, I'm in my hotel room. It's late into the night into the morning. However, you wanna look at it. So, you know, apologies for that. But this was one of the the worst deck Prescott games. We've seen I tweeted this, and I wrote about it as well. And I use this line. But if you've seen friends the seminal classic sitcom, there's a scene. There's there's an episode where Joey and Chandler to the main. Characters or arguing and Joey is talking about how Chandler crossed a line and Chandler's like, yeah. I know I crossed the line in Joey says, you are so far past the line that the line is a dot to you. He's saying, you know, you're so far away from the line that when you look back, it doesn't even look a it looks like a dot because you're that far away. And you know, I mean that Prescott rookie season was marvellous. I think we all agree with that. But that is becoming more and more of a dot in the rear view mirror. The larger sample sizes becoming what has happened since what has transpired since. And it's been a long time since we've seen Dak Prescott look functional, you know, and I say that, but you know, two weeks ago on Washington Dak Prescott, you know, put on some wheels and had some some bright moments for the Cowboys. But this was not a good game. Again. I think this was a good game from Mario Cooper. And that's about it. And. I think the most common thing talked about in the locker room after the game was energy coincidentally enough. Everybody mentioned energy and talked about how the Cowboys had a lot of it to start the game. And you'll remember the last game. The Cowboys played at home before this loss to the titans was the win over the Jacksonville Jaguars. And remember that that was the game that Conor McGregor was there for and everybody talked about how that kind of got them got them up. I mean got them, you know, excited and into the moment and into the the mood, whatever you wanna call it. And so energy is Trump a discernible thing with this team? And I think you know, if you watch the game the Cowboys definitely had an energy early on. And then it just faded and just dissipated. I mean like somebody yanked it out from under the carpet. So it's something that everybody touched on. But this is our sounds in the locker room podcast episode Huron Ocho live. So without further ado, let's get to it. Let's start off with the man of the hour. Jerry Jones, the owner. The president general manager of the Dallas Cowboys spoke after the game. And he was pretty honest. He was pretty honest about how he was feeling about how he thinks things might need to change or you know, how they might need to be some evaluations things like that didn't make any promises. Don't, you know, don't think one thing or the other? But but here is Jerry Jones on the sounds of the locker room episode here on Ocho live. Actually. After that. Started the gay. All the time. The game actually tired. The case all physically. Get the stops. Procession. Disappointed. That too. Again, we didn't see this coming. That's all. We did have time to. Get ready mix changes. Give us a better shot. So this. What do you attribute the second half? Offense of struggles to. Execution execution. I think. The job defensive tamed. Stay in their close enough second hand to play. Pretty close to the best. Sure. Still disappointing start hitting. Likes plays. Session. Question. Tonight. Thank you. Really? Go to the open. Thanks. Applied. Hoped that he might. He came in. To take. Poking initially whether it's. That coaching. Well, again out of. Plays games, confidential. From my thing. Jerry starting to slip away from three and five now. Well, I think after a game. So got to. Recognize reality. But more importantly what recognizes? Not so much three wind losses. Loss's game with like the game. Like. Better than. Got to play. Changes your. Again. Discuss. Where's your patience? He's. Really? Patients. Don't have. Mentioned. And trying to say before. Got it. Oh. Gender player. Again, I thought it was really interesting that Jerry, you know, was was honest. I mean, he said we have to be better. You know seem like he was taking some accountability. This seemed like a really humbling loss and Jerry had a really kind of humbled demeanor to him when he was meeting with the media, sometimes Jerry will we'll walk and talk with some swagger, and I met I mentioned in reference the Jaguars went a little while ago after that win when Jerry walked out to me with the media. He he kind of played around kinda straightened his tie and smiled and put on sunglasses, and you know, went incurs, all and winning and losing different things. But he was way more humble in terms of his body language after this loss to the titans. You heard from Jerry Jones, and let's head and listen to Zeke Elliott Dallas Cowboys running back here on. Oh, Joe live. I will. I know no one's. Just the fact. Wanted to buy vision. So I mean, we have a lot of ball list. Just got out. Fast. Has. Two. Scores. Nope. No points in the second half from an offense. Like, you're just how disappointing. Gordon's type. Disappointing. Came on. So. Moves. I thought it was very interesting that Zeke said that the Cowboys have to fix this fast. And you can feel that. I mean, you can sense it they're three and five. I mean, they can technically I guess if you want to be out domestic afford to lose one more game. But even then I mean, that's that's some tough sledding. This is already a very difficult road that they've carved out for themselves, and and that is very obvious and very understood. But you know, I said the man of the hour a little while ago when it came to Jerry Jones, this is really the man of the hour. The most popular man in the Dallas Cowboys locker room without question. Let's go to Amari Cooper here on the sound from the locker room episode of live on the blog of the boys podcast feed. Regular. I would say. This is my. This turned on the fact that he has been. Yeah. I mean. In the ready? These. Scores. Something we've got some points out there today. Lose. How do you want? I'm not sure I'll have to go back and watch. You know, obviously if I'm out there dominate in then they would have to focus attention on the passing game. And that would open up stuff. But just knowing what I did in practice dealing with coach sandy coast me to do. You know, they'll kind of in a weird look bracket. Type look that play supposed to work on that particular defensive look. But you know, I really sold the first route. And he went for your first experience with results. What would you think of what you guys did? Where things break down. Yeah. I mean, I really liked offense. Some of the stuff that I did in college. So it works definitely works. Like, I said earlier, we just didn't cap LA than some of the things that we should have capitalize on as far as you know. When we were in the red zone. Definitely we definitely lift some points out there. And you know, they went ahead, and you know, continue to fighting Hata game. So that's why they want. On interception. It was kind of brecca covered. The coveted force. It. I mean. I shouldn't let the guy. Hold me. You know, you gotta expect us in times receiver. For some reason. That's what my mind on that play. Let them kind of hope that wouldn't have happened. I would have been in the ball has been able to go up and make that place. That's true. Those who really excited man they brought a lot of energy early on. It was it was cool, man. It was part of notice that energy dissipated any point. They of course. I mean, there were obviously some extenuating circumstances as to why. But. You know as long as we're bowling, and that energy is going to stay on that same level. So. Right. Thank you. Mark. Amari mentioned that energy, and he talked about, you know, again, how it faded and how it was some things some extenuating circumstances. I think was how he wanted it. And you know, I don't know what those were guess the tide turning the game changing. Who knows the script changing? Just variables beyond the Cowboys control. Who knows but but Amari Cooper seemed, you know, he seemed very happy and seemed you know, like he wants to win that was sort of the another take away from the locker room is that everybody kind of had this bitter taste like they know they're better than this. And everybody kind of wants to snap themselves out of this funk. Let's talk about what Byron Jones did before we get to him. He's he's the next person you'll hear from I thought that was really great how Byron Jones ran to defend the star. Obviously mimicking George t. Where's the number Allan? Kevin Byron ran to the star celebrated. I thought that was awesome and Byron Jones talked about that. And and Byron Jones is sort of a leader within the cows. Acronym. And I say that. But I mean, he is a leader is not a captain, technically. But Byron Jones is a big voice in the locker room. And so he took a lot of accountability. And he talked about kind of the mood within the defense, and how they're expecting things, etc. Here is Byron Jones Dallas Cowboys cornerback. Gonna have fun honest. And that celebrate you overstep the boundaries when you're going to start. Is George tonight. Yeah, Scottish reminded me you told me about that. Oh, just don't want to lose. Right deflate in was defense made early turnovers screen early turnovers off it's not get a points. Really, sustain them defensive info. Good early on regardless of what happens on the office aside when we're getting the ball, and we're trying to in three dollars. We loved it. We're just office many chances. They can. Unfortunately on fell off the game. Couldn't tell you. What? How much can gain a different at the office. Head can turn you never know. You never know what could happen. One thing that defensively we tried to uphold this great internal candidate in the first quarter and expect the game to go your way breath entire game. What? It was like dick and dunks. Come back here come back here. And there. Rouse, depending on when it come to the game. And that's gonna kill you. When they come on third down. You're gonna get you. I let it want to not let it and we're gonna. When heading towards the field. I thought I thought the other end good love having nice round. Look back on star for how hard was it. When you guys you thought you had a term third fumble you've already so you guys are very celebrating had to get back on the field. They go eighty yards and fifteen plays. I think so when I went to say got ready to that. It's not fungal. So I think we all had their heads after we celebrate. It has okay. Came back out there. I'm not sure what happened. Points driving now. Obviously still have eight games. This cease help. Is this? Playoffs. Look at it. And what team do you want to be winning team in the first quarter the game you want to be hostage? Consecutive coach has got the right kind of guy. Hi, guys. Lesser with back way showering thing. Kind of breaking came apart. We'll miss said motion. I mean, there's no need for having fun. But I think when you go and try to going to start, you know, everyone knows what's going on you come into the Cowboys. Just about respecting your strength. You said. How suffice I mean, they should. It's not full harder than just. That's one thing that we struggled setting. Even little bit towards of. I. Scott reminded you had you've seen before too. Yeah. I I just felt like highlights back in the day probably four or five years ago. You just told me about it. You were young kids. Beyond your purchase or teammate into after you ran on. Somebody that had a really interesting role in the loss to the Tennessee titans. Was Tyrone Crawford. Obviously DeMarcus Lawrence is dealing with his injury. And David Irving was out. And Randy Gregory was out. And Tyrone Crawford was kinda the man of the hour. I've used that phrase three different times. Now, I again, I apologize. It's very late. And I I've had a lot of coffee, and you know, Tyrone Crawford had a lot to say. And in fact, Tyrone Crawford was the only person to really go at the officiating into couch had some questionable officiating over the last two weeks. Now when you look at the snap and fraction in Washington. When you look at the time out fiasco against the titans and how they got the call a time out that ended up counting and gave the titans life and the targeting penalty on late in Vandereycken. I mean, it was unreal. So Tara on Crawford touched on the officiating as well. As a lot. Of other things here. He is on your live. Off the field. I. I can't tell you on that one. Transhipment just wanted to today. You should. It's coming. I mean, no one wants to come out of the bible. There any week with loss. You don't want to lose in the NFL. So the frustrations. We've got. Going to we did wrong. Actually. Plate. Yeah. Shocking. Shocking to see the way. You know, what we did on? Research. Has hasn't turnovers and we're excited kind of. Definitely. Definitely, thanks. We'll talk about. Did you? Terminal, I like archway after like, you know, what this guy we've been bringing this year. It's been it's been great for us. Like, how we do those things as a defense show together, togetherness, you know, just just are are gone. I guess. And unfortunately. Today. We need to get points. Terms. You know, better. I'm gonna say. Recreation reading just like last in Washington. You could kinda here at the beginning of the Tyrone audio taco Charleston trying to get out of there the way that works. If you run aware is it's literally the Cowboys locker room and guys are changing they're getting dressed, and they're leaving taco Charleston's lockers next time around Crawford's. And as the scrums surrounded Tyrone taco was ready to get out of there. And so he he he he walks through us and that was why that little scuffle happened. But the final person you'll hear from here. I would say had a fair game against the titans and certainly has been one of the bright spots for the Cowboys this season, Jalen Smith, and Jalen spoke at great length, and he talked about a lot of things. I mean, we've heard him refer to the couch Stevens as a tribe, which he did again, he talked about Sean legal out of this game with what looks like a hamstring injury. Looks like he's gonna miss a few games. You know, maybe potentially. We'll still see what Jason. Gert says later this week that would be unfortunate. But Jalen Smit's, you can tell I mentioned that Byron Jones is a leader on this team. You can tell the Jalen Smith is is cut from a leadership cloth. And it's definitely going to be somebody who is a big voice in the Cowboys locker room for years to come. Here is Jalen Smith. Jalen, you guys came out on five both sides of the ball. And you said you wanted to create turnovers trying to make some things happen. And it started out that way. Can you talk about what happened and what happened after that? Absolutely. You know, anytime we play at home. You know, we feel that we have no some home crowd advantage anytime that we can get that momentum early get our crowd until it just get everything going that's at least a success, and we showed that early. But when it died down, and it was time to just play football. We we weren't the better team third conversions. They I don't know if you've heard about the stem, they like ten thirteen third, Dan, that's ridiculous. And was any rhyme or reason that you saw is very unacceptable. It's something we've been great at the entire season. And we have to we have to evaluate get and there's a bad taste in locker room. Everybody's tonight. Where you go from. We never wanna lose at home that happened tonight on a big stage. Monday night football, something we're going to grow and learn from where young. But we're hungry. So. And we're going to Dallas up and get ready. We gotta short, but. Shift not taking advantage of some of turnovers early. Goes it's a combination execution on both sides of the ball. I something that we have to. Like. Momentum. Went away and on the defense side of all we don't worry about that. Oh, all we do is control. And that's been side getting off the field. We didn't get off the field on third downs tonight. And that's something that we find it ourself on. But we were successful. We're successful. You to. Especially this week about the how focused you were the effort to get back into things you talking about how we're in the divisional in the sense of urgency for this team now after losing this game. What do we want this to season this season to be defined as? We can show on right now. We've won three games lost five. And we we have we have eight games left. We gotta get it. Right. Division one of the margin. For error is always limited. It's always limited. And this is something that we have to we have to pride. Ourselves execution. Getting off the field. Score points on defense. We got turnovers, but we didn't score need to score. Fumbles at all not about. All that is just a celebration of the comradery. We have as defensive unit are tried deaths. This came football, we've been planning our entire life. So it's about having fun that had no effects on you know, a strapping kind of the momentum and not executed. It's just it's a mental thing. Physical thing. We gotta get it. Right. We will then been a constant talking point this year about this team you guys defense, generally. Speaking of the ten of thirteen on third down today doesn't necessarily back this up. But overall this season the defense has played well on the offense has been where the the failing point has been more often than not how do you guys defense not get frustrated in those situations? Like tonight where they didn't take advantage of turnovers. Create we gave them twenty eight points. That is unacceptable. Can't allow that to happen. I believe we were giving them like seventeen points a game or something like that. We gotta. Low. You gotta keep a lot. We didn't do that tonight. We gotta look ourselves in the mirror. We one thing about our offense. We believe in our offense. If you have talent they have. Veterans. They have guys elite skills and guys that are hungry. It's there. Do you feel like you like the locker room has bought into what Jason here's pretend right now. Yeah. I mean, Jason's the Hello guy. You know? And I would I would love to you know, to play with him mind tire career. He's a he's a hell of a coach even better person. So I think we all bought in. It's just about executing on game two would you targeting? Determinant? No com. Jones. Get in this team. Whether it's attitude ability tally effort. You see you see it in this team the ability to be succession the season. Whether it's attitude effort passions. We have time we have time. We got a lot of games left. The time is now to get it. Right. But he's the guys you want to go into battle with the rest of season. I personnel changes. Obviously this week is this the team that's going to take you guys to be six. This had the success that you guys want. I'm taking all of these guys in the foxhole. Shenley came up landing in tonight was did look like a hamstring again. What what kind of pressure? Does it put on you enlighten? Obviously he has performed in those situations where you've had to but. It seems to be kind of a recurring theme. What how do you respond to the rest of the linebacker? There's no pressure. You know, we've prepared for the moment to be in the game succeed at a high level. Sean is a hell of a guy and we learn from them every single day. He's aspiration to team everything he's been through. And how he's continued to fight. He's got a lot left. You know that I need to learn from them and I'm looking forward to. But it's a it's a next man in mentality mentioned that Jason Garrett together you'd love to play for for your entire career. Is there any part of new given the way the last couple of weeks of gone that is concerned about that being reality. I'm not a general manager in control all at so I don't worry about that. I worry about doing my job and making sure that my decent. Right. And I didn't do that tonight. So. I'm gonna get it. Right. Totally understand. It's not your call. I'm just saying are you concerned about a lot of other words. I got a fever. But like I said as a hell of a coats and vouch for him, I want to coach I wanna I wanna play on my, you know, my career I've learned so much from. And this team we have a team. We we have we have guys that that wanna play the right way and get the job done. We just it's on us. It's on the players. We're out there playing. We gotta get it. Right. We didn't do that tonight. Just thank you. He was not going to take the bay when it came to questions about Jason Garrett. But I did think it was notable. How you said he wanted to play his whole career for him. But I mean, you know, what's going to say at this point in time. It is going to be a week like that a week of question week of doubt a week of criticism a week of finger-pointing from the outside in and it's going to be very interesting to see if calbos can hunker down and really right this ship because right now it is looking quite rough. You know, the step was floating around all over the place. I I know that they've helmet of Dallas Cowboys dot com. Had it in caterer opposites that Asman news. This is the first time since two thousand fifteen that the Cowboys are at least two games under five hundred. And I think that that is significant, and this is something that I think that should be set in closing here. There's a lot in sports about quit and gumption and fight and resolve and generally Jason GARRETT'S Cowboys, don't quit. I think that that is definitely worth saying and worth giving him credit for he gets his teams to buy into what they're doing the lone exception as we all know was that two thousand fifteen season when Tony Romo got hurt and everything fell apart but ever since then they have fought. I mean you look at last season they fought the whole season long through the Zeke, you know, off the field drama suspension stuff, and they found a way to win nine games. And it feels like they're teetering as much as everybody talks about how they have the right guys, and how they believe and how they've bought in etc. You don't lose the way they lost to the titans if things aren't teetering and if the Cowboys are teetering they're headed to a place in Philadelphia. This Sunday they wants to push them. Over the edge. If they fall to three and six on the road against the eagles. I mean, man, this, you know, this November could be interesting, you know, it could be pretty wild. But but that about does it for these sounds from the locker room episode of Ocho live again sincere apologies to those of you who have been looking for coach alive episodes in your podcast feed and on all of our platforms. There'll be sure the show on those technical issues will be fixed this week. I'll be traveling back to San Antonio on Tuesday. So cut me a little bit of slack. Have you can't? But we will have an episode of the seven five oh up. So let's shoot for Wednesday November seventh at the absolute latest eleven seven kind of the opposite of seven eleven. So we're reopening so to speak. But hopefully, you've all been having a fantastic beginning to November hopefully headed fantastic Halloween. Fantastic. We nine as much as you could. Obviously didn't go the way we all wanted to. But the good news is that we're only halfway through. There's there's. Eight more games left. So let's see how they all shake out. So make sure that you have the absolute best Tuesday and Wednesday of your life. We'll see you at the absolute latest on Wednesday. And you know, why you gotta have the best Tuesday Wednesday of your life because you deserve it. My friends will see in the honor my friends as always go Cowboys. Hello. I'm Spencer hall from SB nation, and I wanna tell you about my new show. It seemed smart it's smart as a show about people doing things that for some reason or another seems smart at the time. Those things might include doing a little cocaine and driving a bike up mountain or I don't know maybe racing one hundred miles per hour across the country in the middle of the night with no one's permission or even stealing a bat from an empire is room in a major league baseball park, check it out. And if you like it Tele friend, I'm Spencer hall. Don't do anything smart.

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The Chris and Joe Show: Breaking down the loss to the Bears

Big Blue View

28:44 min | 10 months ago

The Chris and Joe Show: Breaking down the loss to the Bears

"This is Sean Ramos Firm. I'm the host of Ox Daily News. podcast today explained you know since late September. We've done probably close to a dozen shows on this impeachment inquiry from the sort of early rumors of a whistleblower complaint too Nancy Pelosi launching the formal impeachment inquiry to the whistleblower. Complaint coming out the so-called transcript coming out to the Republican counter narrative to the White House stone. We've done it. All all felt like it was leading up to this moment of love. Televised impeachment hearings and the event of that event was the testimony of Gordon Sunland and we wanted to make sure we've made an episode that properly showcased and explained the significance the historic significance of that testimony. And we did it and we want you to hear it. It's available in our feeds right now. Today explained episode is titled Impeachment TV. Mr Sunland goes to Washington. And it's a must-listen I wouldn't say so if it weren't go check it out and enjoy thanks You're listening to the Chris show presented by ESPN Asian and big blue. You joined by Chris as always to discuss in breakdown you recent he said you're kind football game and they're coming off yet another loss seven straight this time to the Chicago bears falling nineteen to fourteen and like we do every single Tuesday. We had some time to digest. Look at the tape. Break things down and give you the positives and the negatives on the offensive seven defensive side of the ball so surprised though. There are actually more positives than you would expect in a loss like this. It was a close game against a very very good defensive team which is why why there's some things that we really want to highlight and let you know that you may be did not notice from watching the full broadcast so one of the first positives that Chris and I have here is is that the there was a lot of creative. Play calling touch on this in the quick take show and it was more apparent when we actually went back to watch and break down these things and see what what the concepts were in the play calling. There are a couple of different things that really showed up to us on tape specifically a reverse pitch to sterling shepherd that got a first down with eleven seven minutes left in the second second quarter and there were a bunch of others that really stood out to us. Yeah I think the giants were really at their best offensively in the first quarter and a half at least from a playcalling perspective. I liked the way they used the wide receivers Especially on that run. By shepherds to attack the bears perimeter and get them looking horizontally and not just running the ball up the middle. Because we've seen that just doesn't work. Berkeley is not a a good inside runner and the giants offensive line isn't getting the job done there. So using these creative play calls using misdirection getting the Opposing defense flowing one way and then attacking the other. That is what the giants really have to do in these situations with the way their offense is playing playing in general and the way defenses are playing them that was good to see would have been better to see them sustained over the course of the game but it was at least good to see in the beginning you all met reverse call the essentially ran a fake read option and then gave it back to shepherd where there was clear running lanes for a shifty receiver to take advantage of another thing and actually getting to break down that that missed catch by saquon Barkley early in the game it. It really stood out to me. How much of a good play? That could have been The the left side of a bunch look was running concepts to the right side of the field so that pulled all those receivers fevers away was man coverage. They sent five oncoming rushers at Daniel Jones because it was third and short and that left a wide open saquon Barkley but they were not able to connect on that things like that should be replicated in redone. They haven't shown much of it so they could catch another team off guard if they run something like that again. Another play that I really liked was the the first passing touchdown. They faked a power run to the right and Caitlyn Smith came parallel. To the line of Scrimmage Khalil. Mack was assuming that he was pulling and because of that. Cain Smith was wide open was able to get a grab and essentially walked to yards into the endzone. Last thing no the last play. That really was very very good and and unique was towards the end or not unique but worked well that they can continue to build on in us more more and more was the one carry that on hand for a big rushing gain in ought was was power to the left side of the field in the fourth quarter They pulled we'll Hernandez and they also brought cadence Smith in motion. Both of them cleared a wide open path and got saquon Barkley some space to the outside so stuff like that really works and it makes you wonder why they don't run more of it yet and those questions as to why the giants don't do this more often though seem to come up almost more than you know. Wow Oh that was a great play. I have been wondering for a year and a half now why we'll routes are a staple of the giants offense because they absolutely Louis should be you get saquon Barkley the ball in space. He's passed most of the defense when he gets the ball. And the giants can do things like run it out of a bunch set and use concepts to pull defenders away or maybe create natural rubs and with that route prevent prevent Roquan Smith who is an athletic rangy linebacker but just create enough traffic. That he can't get over to the side to cover Barkley. The giants could also also run those routes with Ebony Ingram when he gets back in hell he is capable of lining up in the backfield. The end he has almost as much raw athleticism as Berkeley does. Even even though that play didn't work that something the giants Abbott absolutely should go back to that should be that should be one of their primary plays in their offense that plays similar to it or built off of that they could really open up the playbook if they use some similar concepts to that one in using wheel route the other positive in the final positive for the offense that we have is something that I can't believe. I'm actually going to say something that we set in a very very long time but the pass blocking was actually not that bad. They had a decent day. They did not have a perfect day because they did give up a strip sack for fumble that led to a touchdown but they still kept a pretty clean pocket for Daniel Jones and gave him some decent amount of time to operate and find receivers. Incomplete passes passes so I will at least give credit when credit is due because they were able to actually clean some things up today against I would argue one of the best defensive lines and pass rushes in the the NFL again. I'd say it was probably weighted more towards the beginning of the game. The giants were able to get Daniel Jones some time when they went up tempo impo in the fourth quarter. They did a really good job of getting him out on the perimeter in the first half getting him just away from any pressure that was going to leak through but for the most part for I would say I three quarters three and a half quarters. The giants did a pretty good job of holding Khalil. Mack in check holding Leonard Floyd in tackling just all those defensive players who are so good in the bears front giving Jones just enough time to get the ball off and get the pass away. Hi Yet it's I think we kind of saw the bears. Talent start to take over yet in the fourth quarter in the late in the second half. In the I watched the touchdown to Golden Tate. A few times and I absolutely give Jones credit forgetting that pass off getting it. Far enough down the field for our take to catch it and get the touchdown but I will also say it was lucky that it happened both nate solar and we'll Hernandez got beat bad on that play cleal. Mac was again about a tenth of a second from sacking Jones or hitting his arm as he threw through and then Hetty Jackson. I don't know what he was thinking. He broke down on the route. And just let take get behind him. Which is rare rare for a safety as good as he is so I would say that was a lucky touchdown but again credit where credit's due four Daniel Jones being able to deliver the ball where it needed to be now onto the negatives through the offense we only have one that really is clear and apparent we? We discussed a little bit of not in the take show about not being able to get points on the board off turnovers that was really a hindrance to the offense but actually looking and seeing seeing some things that they did one thing that is very notable is the bad run play calling on most of the called and design runs wall where we were praising and saying good things about Pat trimmers decision to be a little bit more creative on these on these plays and more so in the passing game. There was just a lot lot left on the field because of these questionable decisions Very specifically to pitches that resulted in losses of yardage. One of them was on an important third and short art that resulted in a three to four yard boss. Those things clearly weren't gonNA work. They have athletic defensive ends. They've got athletic outside linebackers. They're going to be able to track ACA play like that and then the other thing that that really irks me here. was that the continual commitment to run the ball. Right up the middle into no yards. It seems like hollow. The Peo- is not really getting any push up the middle of the field it. Just if it's not working you shouldn't keep going back to it over and over and over again again. Do the things that work which is running stretch plays outside zone power to the outside of those things have proven to work because saquon Barkley as athletic he can find those seems. Liam's you can find the those narrow gaps and turn them into a five ten yard gain. Yeah I think defenses are really kind of wising up and anticipating beating the giants short offense their throws. Behind the line of scrimmage their pitches toss plays the really really short crossing routes. They liked to run and they are swarming downhill. You're seeing a lot of linebackers and Secondary Mary players just firing downhill. Whenever it looks like Saquon Barkley is going to get the ball in one of those situations? And they're aiming for his hips a lot as tacklers which is good. Yeah that's bad for the giants. Obviously but it it could tackling form warm. And it's really limiting the effectiveness of his spin moves and a lot of his quick cuts. Also for me the first I fourth and four play call where the giants run a rub route and then have Sony shepherd run a crossing route. The problem is they called the route short of the sticks. Probably hoping that the RUB would create enough separation that shepherd could turn upfield and pick up the first down. But if you're going to call that four three yards why not five yards and make sure you get the the first down why force shepherd to work back to the ball and then have to get upfield against safety like ha ha Clinton dix and Eddie Jackson the rest of that bears defense and this is something that POPs up every single game for the giants. They love running plays short of the sticks and hoping that their offensive weapons can pick up those yards after the catch and defenses. Just aren't falling for it. I also think that the execution on that play wasn't really entirely their gain L- Jones through the hair backwards towards the line of scrimmage to sterling thrilling shepherd so he was in relative range of the first down marker when he ran that concept but the the problem was he had to come back and catch the ball in turn and come back upfield. So there wasn't any real room to do that. Because he had a corner right on him and somebody was able to come and make a play tackling shorter the sticks so you know as much as sometimes that does work for teams. I just don't think the execution was additionally there and when you have a rookie quarterback make things a little little bit easier for him. Make sure he doesn't have to be in that situation. Where if he's a little bit off the place completely blown up and it doesn't turn out the way that it should up next? We're going to discuss the defensive positives and negatives but before we do that we're gonNA take a very short commercial break. This episode is sponsored by Stash. A SMARTER SIMPLER WAY TO START. Investing with Sash you can begin. Investing in a wide array of companies in diversified funds for as little as five dollars stash offers unlimited unlimited trading with no add on trading missions. So you can invest without worrying about getting nickel and dined. You can choose your own stocks and funds to build a personalized portfolio for. Let's Dash Dash help build one for you stash. demystify is investing with personalized financial guidance and education. They can even help you set up a plan for retirement saving Stachel give you ten dollars today to get started investing just visit. WWW dot stash dot app with the code espy nation. That's www dot stash dot app with Code Espy Nation Nation to get your ten dollars to start investing on stash investment advisory services offered by Stash Investments LLC SEC registered investment advisor for disclosures and to learn how to acclaiming ten dollars to invest visit www dot stash dot at. Hey I'm Spencer Hall. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan Nanny. I'm Jason Kirk Mark and we're the host of the shutdown full cast your avengers of college football podcast. It says here in the script onto riff on what that means and basically what I mean is. It's all spoiled every Tuesday. We talk about everything cooking disasters to pro wrestling. Too unfashionable pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college football every now and then like Mascot Scott fights announcers fleeing the early. And unfashionable. Pants that coaches where now if you want to take college football exactly as seriously as it should be taken subscribe. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. or in your favorite podcast APP positives on defense. We actually had had a good day for some of the young secondary players specifically Julian love. Who We talked about in the quick take show and then this seems odd to say also also seems like it was a complete opposite day for the giants that there was a quiet came from the Andre Baker now he might not have been on the field as often as he was before war because they were trying to get some other snaps guys like Sam Bill and Corey Ballantyne? But he's still looked like he wasn't doing anything and making these huge mistakes. I I was saying to you Chris that I didn't notice any agreed errors. That immediately stood out to me that I got all worked up about because he keeps making those mistakes. I'm waiting till the end of the game to say to myself. Wait a minute. I haven't noticed anything from the Andre Baker. So that's a step forward. Because they have a a some good receivers like Alan Robinson who he was. He was mirroring for most of the game. You had the only time I really noticed the Andre Baker was on a pass break up and that is good to see now as you said. He didn't play as many snaps he normally does. He's normally on the field for every defensive. Snap this game. He only played about two thirds of the snaps. He he only played forty gate snaps. Total the giants Took him off the field and were able to get Sam bill on the field. Who again he had a pretty quiet day to now? Oh I don't know if that is just because they were playing well enough that middle trubisky avoided them or if they really liked the matchup they had on Corey Ballantyne which we we will get to in the second part of our defensive breakdown because that was his play was definitely not a positive but the fact that the giants young secondary players for the most part were being exploited that they weren't having bad plays no hustle plays and when Julianne Love was able to get on the field and he was on the field for most of the game playing forty two snaps as you know a corner safety not that was good to see it really was good to see and when when you're talking about a young corner being able to say that you didn't notice them on tape sounds odd but to to add truth to the matter. Is that if you're not noticing anything that means that they're covering their guy. The guy that they're planning is having a quiet day the only only really bring them up if they have a pick or You know some type of defensive touchdown. He didn't have any of those things but at the same time he didn't really give up any big gains. Maybe gave up a couple receptions here or there but it was nothing that was really ingrained in noticeable overall. I mean the passing defense took a step forward. I understand where they're replaying a lower quality quarterback in an offense that has been struggling with the only allowed one hundred two hundred seventy passing yards. So that's a step forward. That is a step in the right direction. We're going to get the Corey Valentine's Valentine's performance because he ended up being the only outlet for this offense the bears offense to get any actual yards final. Positive we have is that the defense was able to create really consistent pressure. They two sacks six quarterback hits not perfect on the day but still we're able to make things very hard for recorder back. That was already struggling. Yeah in fact it would have been three sacks Janoris Jenkins had a defensive. Hold that wiped one off the board and gave the bears a first Chris down. They still aren't getting the really consistent pressure that we would like to see from them. The kind that's going to frustrate an average or good offense but this did seem like a step forward. It was a step forward and I noticed a lot of plays early on in the game. There were hands in the face of trubisky. Maybe there weren't anything that was recorded on those plays but enough pressure to disrupt him make him feel a bit flustered and we talked about this in the preview. Show saying that trubisky is not a good quarterback and if you make things health for him and confuse him and put him in pressure situations. He's going to make mistakes. The two picks are a clear indication of that pressure may not have been bearing down on him in both those plays but him having that thought in the back of his head is like Oh. Am I going to get hit soon. I'm I going to get hit soon. Makes a young struggling quarterback second guess his decisions wins in what he is capable of doing now. Negatives giants lost but only gave up nineteen points first thing that was very noticeable when we look back and watch the tape was it. The defense was very jittery. There were a number of offsides calls and I also saw a lot of flinching a lot of jumping forward and then quickly coming back so the really great that they were they were getting caught like that because they were so overly excited to get a jump on the play. Yeah I think one of the points of emphasis over the bye week is was trying to get the defense to play fast. Really take it to the opposing offense which was probably why they had so many offsides penalties. I think markets golden was probably putting a lot of pressure on himself to produces a pass rusher and create create that create that disruption and turn pressures into saks getting to the quarterback before he could get the pass off and I do think it did show up in the giants run defense where they were not hesitating at all to come down hill to attack hacked the ball carrier string the string runs out until they could be run out of bounds that I thought was a very strong point in their defense but as you said they were jittery is just a great word for it all game long. It's really also a matter of discipline in having those things locked down which is a little bit of coaching a little bit of mental disciplined by the players. That's something that probably won't show up every single week. The bears did a good job of going with the hard account trying to get them to jump and it was able to really work for them. The final negative we have defensively was a rough second half for Corey Ballantyne who was attacked attacked and the single most targeted corner pretty much in the second half and give a ton of yards because of it yet the the bears made a second halftime adjustment and they went after Corey Ballantyne just relentlessly. He was their primary premature. They're only target on their first two drives in the second. Half and in five receptions Ballantyne gave up one hundred thirty nine yards and a touchdown in one quarter that is I. Don't WanNa get on a young corner too hard but that was definitely tape. He's going to want to burn and bury. It was a step forward for De'andre Acre but not really for Corey Valentine because he gave up almost one hundred forty yards and a touchdown was burned by Alan Robinson. who was able to score a touchdown things like that? You don't really WanNa see he was looking. I'm pretty competent. Some of his other games but again this is a step back for him because he was able to build off of that that That consistency that he was having thing. So last thing that we promise you that we're going to talk about was the special teams and me is now a former long snapper college long snapper. After my last game I obviously as Lee need to speak on this because there was a bad snap. Actually there were two bad snaps in this game so you know. It's my duty as the I would say knowing most about special teams Then most people on the missed field goal biologist process. There was a rolling rolling snap which resurfaced on twitter continuously. All of all of yesterday. It rolled back there. It disrupted the timing and while the ball was able to get picked up up and put down by Riley Dixon things like that. Get into the head of the kicker because he sees the ball not come where it's supposed to be out of the corner of his eye when he's looking down for for the placement of it he's GonNa hesitate. His steps are going to be just slightly off. If your steps as a kicker off by even an inch it's enough to completely redirect the ball and put it somewhere it's not supposed to be and then something that people weren't really talking about was the second snap the one right. After that he ended up missing. That was also on long snappers. Act The OSCE because if you watch it that ball was twisting and and wobbling at an incredible rate. Nothing that I've seen from a professional long snapper apper before and we haven't even really seen it from Zach Yossi before having a bowl that is not coming back there on a spiral into the right exact location location is also enough to disrupt the hold in the timing of the plane. I'm sure auto sauce was able to see that out of the corner of his eye and it just continued to build pulled up on the the the mental doubt that he was having. I would not be surprised because of those two specific plays if they chose to use Colin Holda who they recently signed to the practice squad and cut ties with the OSCE who has been a longtime giant but his time might clearly clearly be done. Yeah and I have to wonder you would know better than I. If perhaps those two missed field goals in the doubt that has to be creeping into Rosa's mind had influence on that shanked kick off at the beginning of the second half it also might have disrupted his his mental wellbeing on that play to. It really hurts to be having to say this about somebody that I've I've honestly looked up to Zach. Diaz has been with the giants for so long and being a long snapper. I've always been and watching and seeing him do things which not a lot of kids do. It does pain me a little bit having to say that they should probably move on from him but not everyone's career can last this long. And if you're a specialist and you have to back to back bad weeks and even if you're a veteran coaches are going to make that decision ten times out of ten. There's a lot shorter of a leash for specialist slowest. Maybe a little bit longer. If you're a veteran you and you've been there for a lot longer and I would say that his longer leashes because he was able to do in back to back games but do not be shocked if they choose to make some type of decision and let him go the other thing though on special teams that was a major mishap that I think not a ton of people were giving a ton of a lot of attention to it. Ed made sure to put together a post about it because he was also messaging after the game saying that there were a lot of issues issues with that play in that negatively impacted the game in the end of the game. There is a a situation where the bears came out in their offense with at their offense on fourth down in about three this was before the final giants drive in the giants kept defense out there. What was supposed to be a safe? Look with no Oh returner they had no punt returner in ended up putting Janoris Jenkins back there but had very last-second. The bears shifted out their offense. They're punting comes on and and they snapped the ball and the opponent but I think what some people don't know is in that situation if you make that transition and the offense comes in subs the defense. The return team also has some has time to make that sub as well now if they wanted to stay safe with their defense. I can at least kind of rationalize that but you are not allowed to snap the ball until you at least make some type of substitution on the punt return team so that means getting golden gate or someone out there instead of Janoris Jenkins who let go sailing over his head that could have been filled by someone other than him and at least caught in fair caught or return for a few years instead. It was inside the ten which I would argue completely disrupted any momentum that the offense had gay. I don't WanNa hang that. On Generous Jenkins he is not a punt returner. He can be dynamic nick with the ball in his hands. But that returning an interception returning a punt are just two different skill sets. I don't blame him. Four letting the ball go hoping for a touchback credit to the bears. They made a fantastic play to keep it out at the end zone. I think Neural Patterson saved by like an inch maybe two inches and they round up downing it at about the five yard line so that was a great play on their behalf that has to be on the giants coaches offense sorry when offenses offenses substitute defenses always get the chance to match personnel and make some kind of substitution before the center is allowed to snap the ball. It's the same on special teams and I don't know why the wouldn't take advantage of that. I don't know why they wouldn't either. And at the very least you get that returner in their own needs to do is catch it because there was room for him to catch it but Janoris Jenkins was probably not that confident in his ability to grabbed that ball because he's probably never taken a return. Rip in a very long time so I just don't get it. I don't get why you're not wet better prepared and that was frankly quickly a coaching mistake in a lack of awareness in being prepared for them to do something they were too busy reacting to the bears and not doing what they thought was the right thing in that particular play. That's GonNa be it from us. Folks thank you for tuning in as always be sure to rate subscribe and review and additional finally. Make sure you follow on social media at Biglou view befall me at job. You Leone D. E. L. E. O.. Any four I pat rafter 'em pay.

giants bears Daniel Jones Chris saquon Barkley Corey Ballantyne Janoris Jenkins football Nancy Pelosi Hernandez Ox Daily News. Mack Gordon Sunland Corey Valentine trubisky Washington Sean Ramos Firm Chicago White House Alan Robinson