7 Episode results for "Red Press"
56 - SIX The Musical: Kristy Norter, Music Coordinator
"You're listening to the broadway. Podcast network presented by climate power. education fund. Does big oil care about our streets flooding or our home burning not according to an exxon mobil. Top lobbyists did we aggressive. We fight against some of the science. Yes you know. We were looking out for our shareholders they care about profits not people learn more at polluters dot exposed isolated incidents a six part audio series following five essential workers and their families as they grapple with things -iety and the knee honesty and how race impacts every interaction and decision. They make the series shows that may be all those isolated incidents aren't so isolated after all lease lesson to all six episodes available wherever you stream your podcast as well as on broadway podcast network at bbn dot fm forward slash isolated incidents. Hey everyone welcome to page a conversation with theater makers. We're your hosts. That's brian and that's mary. This episode is part of our series on six the musical in this series we uncovered the process behind the musical through our central question. What role does history play in the storytelling of six a show that uses the history mix as a device. We hope you enjoyed this episode. Hi my name is christie nortre. I am the music coordinator for six. I'm also would win player on musician. Tina turner musical in the saxophone player on and really excited to be here talk together at six and smaller stuff l. com of hinted that before we hit record. But i'm very always very excited when we discuss a new role in the industry on the podcast and we have not yet had a music coordinator on so we've had a few other roles from music department but never so. I know we have a ton of questions for you about before researching this this role before we were talking with your this job. I didn't really understand what the what the role was. What the responsibilities for Until i was looking on maestros website And i'm wondering if you could give us like the basic functions or maybe dislike the basic data day of what you do as the coordinator and don't worry. Obviously there's like we'll go way more in depth as we continue talking. But just i guess to lay the foundation if you will. That's a very interesting job varies throughout the production. The beginning what they call a pre-production you're hired by the production company. So you're hired by the producers. You work for the producers but you are the liaison between the american federation music or are union and our local union which is able to with the producers. I advise them on the contract and the rules and sometimes it stuff that's tedious lake You know you their rules about how often you can have rehearsal the minimum call for rehearsal. How the kind of warnings that not warnings but if you change the schedule like it has to be within a certain period of time. So i'm there to protect the rules to protect musicians and also to protect the producers from inadvertently doing something you know i also setup payroll and again that can be very tricky at the beginning of the show when you're adding rehearsals here and they're filming b roll doing all kinds of stuff and then once the show is pretty much. I've been running. I'm running payroll and dealing with any small problems personnel problems or like the exciting stuff. Like let's say six we're gonna be on a tv show coming up like that. Might be part of my job. To hint. hint nudge nudge. But i would do on the union paperwork. Our liaison with whatever tv show that was and where the union contracts in regards to television videotape and properly have the band paid and get what they need and one thing that i will say you know at being a union member for like twenty five years. Is that now. That i'm dealing more with contracts I think a lot of people. Think the unionist so that People get paid and and that working conditions are good. But i feel especially in musician. Union is about protection of the actual work protection of the job. Meaning you hire me to play on one song and you pay me you like. This song is going to be on a podcast. And i'm like okay. You pay me appropriate rate. If it's not on the union contract you could take that song and all the sudden it's in a marvel movie and you only paid me a hundred dollars for it and it's in a blockbuster movie i have no protection whatsoever. So the union is kind of the you know it can be tedious. But all of the paperwork goes in to make sure that musicians paid fairly for the originally use of their work and if it gets reused in different ways You know like for example the commercial that is currently running. We're using stuff from the show but it's a new use of from shows of the musicians will get paid for other so interesting. A lot of what you're saying reminds me of. Maybe what stage manager does to protect the actors in a way. The end deals with liaison between the the Company in union. And the rules. So how did you get involved with six on. It was kind of interesting. So i've always been. I've been a musician on broadway for like twenty years and as the industry was starting to change a little bit. You know that it's a very small group of people that Are music coordinator trump broadway and it was pretty much mostly men and white men and so as we were talking more about diversity on. I had a discussion with georgia state. Who's the founder of my music. I said in a conversation. I was like i. You know i. I wish that i could contract like this is something that i think speaks to. My skill sets a come from a family of accountants. So i already have an affinity for spreadsheets and designing excel sheets. A math nerd. I love contracts in love details of numbers in addition to loving music and being a part of the and so i said to george plus. I've been in the pits. I know these musicians. I know what it's like to be there in. I just want a chance at this job. But i don't think that's something that's available to me or most other people at such a close knit thing. And she was like well then. Just be a contractor. And i was like. You can't just be a contractor like crude. I'm a movie star like you. Just call it it. Subtly calling your shot. And she was like well. We'll work on it. So you know she made a couple inquiries and i stood a few offering ratios and then out of the blue. I got this email in. It was basically the production company. I for sex and they were like we're looking for music coordinator An obviously the nature of six it looked good to have a female music coordinator and that was important to them. You know and so. They reached out to georgia state because they wanted her to do it because toby lucy new georgia. She's like our contractor. This is who you want. And so literally georgia just handed me the which was very sweet and i'm so appreciative. And and she's amazing. I can't speak enough about. How awesome music is there you know. I'm really fortunate to be a part of it. They let me teach some classes. And i i enjoy it. So and it's directly led to me getting you know noticed in the industry and being able to you know row in the skill and learn. Yeah i mean especially like nowadays. I mean i feel like obviously everything's online but now like connections can be made online on. Yeah do you recommend anyone who might be interested or eight in any part of the music department. That could be a part of a show. Do recommend that like meister might be a good way for networking. Are there other ways that you think might. Obviously everyone's path is totally different. So it's hard to exactly what is recommended. But you just think like networking is the best way to get your foot in the door. It is and i think that the more that people hear your name in any industry the better off you are. I also think it might be slightly generational thing. Because i feel like people in their twenties currently likes you guys grew up with social media you grew up with you know the online profile and so it tends to come a little easier and sometimes a little too easy that everything in life is put on social media. And i'm a little older couple years older than you and You know so for me. My mentors were all you know. Keep your keep your nose down. Do a good job. Don't don't to your own horn in an you'll progress in this industry so there really is a fine line between like throwing name out there in being earnest and like i'm trying to make connections versus you know kinda gone crazy off the rails when people you know being a low much with people so yes to answer your question in a roundabout way meisters. Great group it's designed. The directory itself came out of georgia state in mary. Mitchell campbell is fabulous empty an awesome person in being on so she and georgia were working on a an off broadway version of sweet charity. That started sutton foster. And they wanted an all female band and zeh because bam's would be visible and that was lee silverman's vision like everything is so they were like you know mary. Mitchell was supervising. And i think georgia was emptying and they were like you know they call me there. Can you percents when i was like. I'm starting bronx tale on broadway. I can't and then it was like Will that was the sax player we knew. And then you know and then they realized that there might be one or two women that they knew for every chair but there's a pipeline issue someone also recognition issue in so georgia That's where my strength in the directory came from was that that's the origin story that and they were. You know georgia has said this allowed. I'm tired of hearing people say. Well i don't know anyone will. Then you can go look here like you want a female violent player okay. Then go look violin in directory. And then their they're sister or brother. Group sibling group is news which is on musicians. United for social equity And that's directory for people of color in same thing like if you're like we need to not just have a band full of white people you know. That's a really good starting place when you're hiring for musical theater to find people in in for my shirt and from us it's not just the instruments they will list like. I'm a copy as an arranger on. Md i do this or do that. So you really could fill a music team With those kinds of jobs as well. It's not just like i played trombone jenner but it gives people more options. And especially you know. It's it's an interesting time on broadway. Because for me there is much to be gained from paying your dues but at the same time many of us who have been paying dues over the years don't necessarily get the same shot that others have been given so there's like that fine line of providing access to people which is really amazing thing but i'm also a firm believer provide access to training and apprentice thing mentorship and let people earn their strikes so for me. It's about early intervention Access and that's really dedicated to and i also just to add on that is like with the access and the the apprentice you know ideas that people who go on and who are successful in their role should always are i. I believe at least should always think back to the coup. Can i bring onto my team. Who can i help in. Extended the arm to 'cause then cycle where everyone's helping each other within the community and that's how you bring people up and bring people in but then still maintain that Creative license if you will in your bio christie. You mentioned that you're the only female music coordinator working on broadway is that currently or just. That was current. Yup honor has been other females before you ready. There are two other fabulous female coordinators. One is talith affair. Hr in she is She mostly deals with tours so basically. She's the contractor troy on a bunch of other like tours and a show that she was contracting came in for a limited run but the first person who has straight up Music coordinator credits. As a woman would be kim wirtz and that show was a year with frog toad. But the thing about kim is that she's been doing this behind the scenes for years. You've seen her were constantly. Is rate the tony awards. She contracts that. The kennedy center honors. She contracts that so she's and she also works a lot with red press who was a legendary music coordinator in our field and so to me. She's really she's the first. She's high-near When we're talking about music theater for music. Coordinating fabulous. She's great and just to clarify also so does every production guetta music coordinator or are there certain productions that may not call for one in the even dialing in a little more specifically. I'm guessing most musical slash all musicals and then maybe plays that have live Live musicians yes so the contract the contract's kind of weird you in it. Some of it has to do with that. This contract was written. You know seventy five years ago. I forgot. I don't even know when the first broadway continental something. I'll look up later the first broadway. Cba there's language in it talks about The inside contractor like which we call the in house contractor which is a person who is in the band and they're the ones that run the day to day. They make sure that the subs were there. They make sure the regulars are there on time. They keep track of subs in do the basic payroll and then kick it up to the music coordinator music coordinator job kind of i think was out of necessity that somebody needed to keep track of all of these things But it's really funny because if you ask producer sometimes a coordinator dozen like i dunno. I just need one and so this is. It's been kind of a funny situation but yeah there are a few shows that don't have an outside coordinator but then if fault it has to fall on some money and then with plays. I think that you know that was something recently. pianist on stage but it was clay and that atoms accordion. The actor themselves were playing allah. Like bandstand of course. They had a musical something. Where it's a play with music ret you also have music coordinator. It's funny because i originated bandstand when it was a paper mill. And i couldn't do it on broadway. 'cause i was doing bronx tale but on i was in the pit not on obviously not on the stage But if you get depending on the different rules you get into equity. If they're playing on stage they have to be members of eight of our union as well and so they kind of get paid like a variation of olson extra rules and on the actor. If they're playing piano they have to be a member of your union. Zehra musician onstage thing. Yeah oh. I'm curious how you how this role integrates with the other roles in the music department like music director ranger that those kinds supervisor even especially because the producers hired you yarn that director or the creative team as a whole yes but it. Many times The supervisor or the md or sometimes the composer Will requests the coordinator that they are comfortable working with on and so you know there might be a coordinator who always does so and so's shows like some you know like what's you know sondheim like i i'll do all sondheim shows like whatever and so some of that is you know but but also there are some producer like y. Prefer to work with this person So it's it is who you know again with the networking and You know six took a chance on me. Which i'm very very appreciative than in. I also find it really like my very first chair on broadway. That was my chair was. My show was in the heights. And that was a kevin mccullough song her show as producer and then for six to be my first broadway credit as music coordinator like to me in. It's also a kevin mccollum show like it felt right. It sort of felt like it was somebody you know for me like those kinds of experiences are really important and i'm very nostalgic person. I'm very appreciative in so it just seemed kind of poetic that it was kevin shows you know. Yeah and he's he's amazing. It's business He's he's just a very obviously He's he's had a couple of shows that did okay and very however apropos that he was our first guest for the series of you so much fun to. He's a is a really great speed. So i saw i know also you said earlier when you're introducing yourself at you. Play sax for fourteen over at tina. Is it so it is possible to be a contractor for one show but not necessarily play for those yeah as the music coordinator you can Read press for years. He was a music coordinator the inhouse contractor and the read one player on chicago for years. So it's possible very yes and was contracting. Because i can contract as many shows as i'm offered or want to do you're not limited to coordinating on one. So how does that work from a time management. I'll let you know in a couple months right. Because i've been right when you guys started previews you. What does that look like. When they went into tech and then once they went into performances themselves six Speaking on the best part of sixes location is that there is a back cross between the hotel so if you come out. Tina turner stage intern right. Edison hotel i think has a walk through and then you turn left coming off you basically cut through a hotel lobby and come out on the left so i i can get from one theater to the next in about three minutes which was helpful during that time As i'm learning how to do things. I'm trying not to overbook myself. As a musician i try to do is many gates is possible uncle running from gig to gig but this i tried to be patient and not worry about taking off from tina now and again you know. It's not worth a little extra money to play the show. What's more important is that i focus and really learn how to do this job. The right way but there are times has we. I'd i play a lot during tina turner but there are definitely some like ten minute periods. Where we don't where horns. Don't do anything. And i've gotten really good at multitasking. A definitely had an emergency at an off broadway show is contracting while i was you know in one of those breaks in basically got like the base chair covered while it was like in the pit for teen which was kind of fun but yeah you have to learn how to keep a bunch of plates spinning and that it is really important. Time management is something. I don't. I know how i used to do it. And now that we've been gone for a year and a half it's like i'm brushing off the cobwebs right now but it's okay Happy to do it. Happy to have the work. Yeah it's it it can be an but again it depends on how things line up so you know in the spring. I have a couple of things. And of course they lined up Zim time so that might be a very stressful period. Up through previews through opening and then once opening is over like okay. I think everything's cool. I just gotta make sure payrolls. Okay you know in deal with any obser- after the show has opened you're just maintaining the payroll. You no longer have to go in zoo either. Physically it can be done remotely can all be done remotely but i also believe in being present in. Yeah and because it's not just you know i interact a lot with production stage manager Like we we liaison the sound team. guys the crew props ideal with if there's an issue like six thera- playing instruments special instruments like painted or made for the show you know they're not playing their own instruments which is unusual but then that becomes property of cedar and that therefore it falls under local ones the prop guys his. It's considered a crop and so you know like even silly things like oh here's a great example of six utilizes Confetti at the end of the show. There's been confetti drop in its broadway. So they're like we wanna bait convince trump you know. We have keyboard on stage and we have a keyboard programmer who is also the person who is responsible for giving us our equipment in either purchasing it or renting it and depending on the show and he was like He's he's a friend of mine his name is randy. Cohen is actually pretty. He programs everything. These kind of an interesting person you guys might wanna talk doctrine point He would right off. The bat was like. I don't like where this is headed with the keyboard. I was like what because that's his job. You know unlike concetti. That sounds awesome. He's like that. Sounds like a nightmare. Because it's going to get down in the keys and it's gonna break the keyboard and so we're going to have to swap out. The keyboards in so like part of his headache was then figuring out a budget. How often do they have to take the keyboard into the shop. What will that cost so because of confetti which is the funniest thing to me but these are the kinds of details that you could never a million years predict or be like. What do you do for a living. I prevent confetti from messing keyboard. It's like if that role didn't exist like who would have known to have like thought of that pre to prevent it you know to not to prevent because obviously you can't prevent it but she'll were to hopefully make sure that there aren't any new ing nor options that yeah i think the job also it evolves on every shows different and i think one of the best skills is to be A problem solver. So you know if you walk in and in the stage manager comes running up to you and it's like we have this huge issue because in your like Like i can't even think of a good example right now but you know like we need the dressing room because we have you know we have a dog in the show now or something and you're like okay So rather than be like you know so it's like well that's what the show's needs so let's figure out a way to do it in. That's you know the challenge in the fun and sometimes the stress of okay. Let's just make it happen. You know we'll figure out what is something that you intimidated. Or what is something that you may have wanted from yourself as music coordinator having been having been in the pit before you know what is something that you look for music coordinator that you wanted to employ as music coordinator. That's a great question to me. Music is very important so musical skill is very important but another thing that i strongly believe in his is doing good working professional And holding our behaviors and not to higher standard. And so you know. I was am usually still like one of the only woman in the pit and one of the women read section. So i although i have a tough skin Certain point i started realizing like i need to step up and say to people like now and not because i don't want to hear you say something like that but because the twenty year old who wants to be like me someday i'm setting her up for failure by not addressing these problems just going along with it and it's a different world right now so one of the things that i really wanted for myself is to never have any musician feel way that i have felt sometimes in pits an but that doesn't say like i've thought my whole career like there have been moments. You know But i for me. I really wanted to make sure that everyone can go to work. Dewick jump respect each other and move on best friends but you also you know you to treat everyone. Well you know. I to hold myself to the same. We all make mistakes and they also need to leave room for mistakes but now we can try to make it matter. We can try to make people feel more welcome And hopefully we can continue to do that but as again as i said before. I'm still only to pay dues. People need to do the hard work. But i you know that access for me is really important in that. I'm willing to take time and help somebody trains. Somebody mentor somebody you know. Jump on the phone I'm part of news. Has a mentoring program right now. Some part amuses mentoring program. There's a woodwind wtrw. Are we talking today. Because he wanted my advice on something. He's a great guy. We met a few weeks ago. And we just talked you know. He's like on on tour with a show and he you know he's doing all the right things he just needs a little help and advice and you know what. I'm happy to do it. Because that's how we grow as musicians we've apprenticed. I mean even even somebody like mozart the apprentice. They learned the business from someone who had done it before and showed them the way as what we do and so when we get away from that kind of destroying the lineage of our of our tradition. So i'm wondering how is six different from any of the other projects that you've worked on a as music coordinator while on it's the only broadway show so far although i have another coming up so i'm still very early in the scheme of things. I'm still very new at coordinating. So i've done a lot of one offs things some a lot of streaming things and some you know like garas and and a few off broadway shows and i'm currently working on another off broadway show that's also coming in march called. Suffrage is that is announced. The selfridge's chena tabs in musical injury. Sandy are on that for a while we did get sidetracked because i tend to lab. Sorry disaster stitch. She knows But one thing that i do in the production part of my job is look at talent and look at options. So when you're asking before how. I work with the other people if the supervisor you know whoever wants to be involved in okay. It's time to pick a ban. Some people are very hands off. They're like just getting van. We need seven people. These are the chairs the slum looking for you know make a list. That's fine some people are like. I want you to hire this person. This person this person. I don't know anyone for this chair and some people want to be collaborative process. So you know there's phone calls in. Google docs links bios in all kinds of stuff and generally in in the room with you. Or who's having this conversation with you is it really. Is it including the producer as well as everyone on the music department. The producer rarely gets involved with personnel. They would be the height like coordinator they would want a say in who the in house coordinator was on. They would probably want. Obviously they get to hire supervisors orchestrators all that but when it comes down to just the band unless there's someone that they have had a problem with productions or something like that i think they defer to the music team But that's definitely changed in industry. And i do know that You know that way back in the day Use accords could just be like. I'll get your band and they would. This is your band on nowadays music coordinators. They do exactly what they're asked to do in it's 'cause it brings or you know it gives more access and different access instead of he's guys. I was call my guys you know. So it's i get people seismic People that loyally hire me over the years. Like i understand what it'd be loyal to good workers but has a new person to break in how i mean especially since looking at six you know having been gotten Haven't gotten so far to the finish line if you will Before everything shut down. What are you doing now. Especially since all the announcements have been made. Hopefully that we're able to you know. Move forward with all those intended dates of course but what are what are you doing now. To prepare for the opening in a few weeks to months Yeah back and forth with the supervisor. Lot with the production stage manager and the end the general manager works under the producers I'm really lucky that john. Gendron and suzy brand on johnson gm and Releases associate jim. the fabulous Good to work for and they They also understand that. You know this is my first broadway show so they have been very cool you know. I'm also the kind of person that i i won't be asked like it. I don't know something. Or i don't know if i don't i'll just say hey giving it let me give me a day to figure it out but let me uncle talk to somebody. So they've been very patient and not. I'm probably being harder on myself. That i need to be but you know we'll be mistakes and it's fine. We all make mistakes but they were for in their fantastic room great. I think it's interesting. That company managers generate payroll for the actor. Then you're generating payroll for the musicians and then it goes. It goes to the house manager because and then it goes in the eye at that goes through the same thing musicians get paid by the theater owners so the payroll goes to the house manager so when i get a check for tina. It's the neater landers. Yeah it's not tina mary. I think it's time for our lightning round. Let's do it. Won't i know we're going to rename it. We're gonna rename the next series because we've been calling lightning round and we get that response england. We're not you. Mary want wanna kick us off. Yes What is one thing in the theater industry that confuses you tradition some traditions because like most rules things are. It's the history of it. you'll look in a contract. It'd be like well that's on. Why do they you know. Why is this in the contract and there's always a good story as to why well because it phantoms. Somebody so and so did this. And so now we have a rule for it. What are three adjectives that describe your ideal working environment fun professional respectful. I know we're not going to respond. But i will just say i'm pretty sure i'm like ninety five percent sure that everyone that we've talked to from six has included fun. I'll have to pull the audio clip. It is there something in your process that you find unique to you for hobbies. I am a do it yourself. You know like do home improvement projects. So i am sort of in my process. I joke around with friends that i'm the contracting contractor and i'm the only contracting contractor so i can redo your kitchen for you while hiring an running payroll and i believe on the only music coordinator who can do that. I'll stand by that. bring it on everybody else. Next question was what is one hobby that you have outside of the theater so that would be it and also my love of the buffalo bills which is more of a lifestyle. I think not a hobby. What is one job in the theater industry that you would trade jobs with for one week definitely crew carpenters or something you know. I'd love to have already made friends with the head carpenter at the tina show terry. He's great. Do you have any books or resources that you find helpful to you in your process I live with funny. Should say that. 'cause i haven't earmarked copy right now. Hot off the presses from six years ago this is the eight. Oh two collective bargaining agreement. This is literally the entire roadway contract between the league of producers disney and local tow to that is the bible. 'cause most of the answer there. Yeah it really is and i. I have it on my computer my ipad. I have it. You know paper copies. I have one in my locker i have one on. My desk is brenham around. It's fun little light reading little train. You know yeah there you go Okay cool our last question is what your favorite part of the development process of new show. I'm going to answer it as a player in answer it as a coordinator Everything's so as a player. Normally i get in the room when the score is completed like i'm not a composer and arranger people have been working on it in working on the story than working on writing songs and lyrics and putting together in that very first day after you know. Usually the band rehearses i for a few days. And then there's zits probe and that's the moment where her full orchestrations or played in these singers. Who have been rehearsing piano in. Everybody just goes. Oh wow 'cause it's just like you can feel it and you know that one moment where everyone's just shocked. I never knew could be this. You know and that too is amazing. I think as a coup cordinator. While i enjoy all those moments i feel like once band is like okay opening night so like we made it or good. We're gonna continue. Everything's great and things are working. We can just get down to business now through all the tough stuff means ing gonna link to Maestra on our on our show notes will include it on our social but other other other places that you wanna shut out that our listeners can find you on social I mean i have. I have my own a sham. Having to send you guys like my twitter facebook and calm. I ditch my face. Insta- whatever the kids have a seventeen year old daughter. She's like oh my god it's not funny. Don't like nobody facebook's unlike yeah we do. We do proudly even the twenty year olds. I don't even think. I had a my space. But it's okay. I truly think that like my age. I just turned twenty five. And i think that my age is like that last group that may still use face collapsed as we're holding out for facebook and some people are like on the fans knowing you can still use that. You sent me a message. Thank you so much for coming on. I absolutely loved hearing. You speak about a role that really. When i woke up this morning i knew nothing about ask head to ask my fiance. Go stand what is it music coordinator. Emily tell me the ones that you've worked with in the past like what they do. Yeah so. I'm really really happy that we got young. Talk about this. I'm so appreciative. Asking you if this man is rate. I'm very excited for for. come back. Obviously grief finale to our six series. Thanks everyone for listening to this episode of page two stage to keep up with us. You can find us on. Instagram and facebook. Page to stage podcast. If you enjoyed this conversation we have other episodes with eater makers from six the musical. Check them out until next time. That's brian that's mary. We'll see later in. Hello broadway fans. Get ready for the most anticipated theater. Podcast created with you in mind. What's up broadway presented by the broadway. Podcast network is a weekly talk series that features industry breaking news hottest interviews deep dive into theater twitter and fans hyun aid. I will be joined by brilliant. Rotating co hosts martine acuna and christian louis after over a year. A pause broadway is back. And that means what's up. Broadway will kick off on tuesday august tenth right here on the broadway podcast network or wherever you stream. Your podcast talk to you. Then you're listening to the broadway podcast network.
Interesting If True - Episode 46: Wetter Water Wonderland
"And welcome to interesting true though podcast that's wetter than others pocket because today shows about what water. I'm getting some mileage out of that. Do we really have to bring greater than a pocket back. i'm gonna make it a thing. I thought it died with forty-five nobody thinks died with forty. Well i'm your host this week erin and with me are sha- i'm shay and this week. I learned that x the most popular form of children to eat a right. Then and steve. I'm steven i prefer to eat. The eggs mama's heavily battered and drowning and saw now. I want fried chicken. Fried chicken is better than snake. Oil though the cure-all didn't we have a story. A longtime ago where we talked about like literal actual snake oil and how it did have like maybe one use so before i dive in. I'll take a moment and say that almost every source. I've found refers to alkaline water. Today's topic as snake oil. And i understand the sentiment. But i can't help but point out the snake. Oil wasn't snake. Oil until charlatans replaced the minimal effects of elixirs made chinese snakes with you know whatever that's what it was an alkaline water just what washes down the drain. When you're this show should be the alkaline water as literally. Never ever been good for you but it has become incredibly popular. Alkyl alkaline is the opposite of asset right. It is that i taste alkaline water. All the time. Isn't that just what happens. When you take regular water and put an alka seltzer in it. I mean among other things alkaline. Water down that has definitely definitely raising the ph beverage marketing corporation a research and consulting group. Who does exactly what their name suggests found that. In two thousand fourteen alkaline water was forty million dollars a year proposition and for years later in twenty eighteen it was close to seven hundred million dollars a year while. That's because the world is full of rube yesterday. That is exactly the math now. Of course anyone. With half a brain cells should be able to suss out while alkaline diets and alkaline. Water won't ever help you but indeed can harm you and if you're particularly unlucky kill you horribly. Oh fun yeah if you drink enough of it and then i choke some vinegar. Can you turn yourself into a science volcano project. You absolutely can unless you get the balance right. Then you just go back to putting mentos and coke in your mouth shaking your head in your head explodes. Do i think she she put one minto sinise nostril and then backwash some dire definitely explode then could turn those into like a double barrel middle available at rock. Nettle dot com. Never been so clean to understand. Okay water though To your point. I will need to understand acids Those are things below seven on the scale and basis or alkaloids those above seven on the scale with seven itself being neutral. Your your body is already slightly alkaline with blood. For example typically being in the seven point four range barely barely meanwhile stomach acid can be between one point five and three point five. Typically coffee is in the four point two to five point three range and on the bay side of things. You'll find your blood but also most cleaning products baking soda and even more so if you bake it and make bak- baking soda as one might do to make rama noodles. What have you been smoking. Baking baked baked makes baking soda. And on the extreme. And you've got things like potassium and caesium which are very fun. Yeah cesium caesium was a radioactive. Both oric acid. That's your stomach acid. So that's the one point five right. Yeah that's on the same area coca cola's something like what. It's enough that if you prettiest my favorite science experiments to do with little kids you take a glass of coke and then you put an egg in it and you leave like overnight and you come back and the shell will be completely dissolved away leaving only the membrane and the egg visible inside when i was in kindergarten. My kindergarten teacher broke off a little bit of a pocket knife blade and pop it in a glass of coke and we waited until it disappeared. Took a couple of weeks so lemon juice has a ph around two point. Five coke clocks in at two point. Three because of all the phosphoric acid there. You go more acidic i was. I'm doing the ph story. So see away chemistry in college a long time ago how good. I'm glad you've got that base though. Because that's gonna get the vein throb in here in a bit patriots section in particular. Steve's really good at chemistry because it's one of the few sciences that hasn't changed they haven't really found any new elements to learn on a so. What could possibly say healthy more than upping. Those alkalinity points with alkaline water and an alkaline diet until you gain the awesome raw power of caesium. That's right nothing so it was a rhetorical. Don't want your superpower to be cesium. No no no. One of the isotopes of caesium is terribly radioactives. Larry i think it was a part of the radium. Girls story there for a little while. Yeah i think it's in some like medical imaging devices because of bone stuff will get to so drink up as because totally reputable site nova. And that's what a hyphen between each letter. Because nova dot com is probably already taken says that alkaline water can one restore ph balance in the body. So i guess everybody pre bottled water was just walking around leaking acid everywhere like as with hemophilia that does explain the state of my bedsheets at a basic blood is already a little bit basic. I'm not sure. I'm buying this mel. It increases energy levels. It's extra hydrating than other water grammar there and it can help reduce signs of aging. Oh unless it kills. But not as can-do you'll lowdown on real low down on alkaline water. I had to do some googling and surprise surprise. I quickly found out all about the alkaline secrets. That big water cycle doesn't want you to know about a for example because it can cure cancer. Oh owned with chemo. If you're listening to this and you think alkaline water sounds like a good idea because a high hydrating it is just remember h. two o. That's regular water. Why don't you just go. H two o to get extra hydrated. Drink some hydrogen peroxide. Oh yeah well actually. We'll actually come to that i. That's that's definitely part of this. We're talking about the same crowd that drinks p shea. Oh yeah they're concerned about making a covert shot but they'll drink p cool because yeah because it's nature's lemonade. So it's not limited nature logic mountain dew this little closer to nature that amounts do if you need this doctor. The cancer claims are almost entirely. Based on the idea that cancer cells create an ever so slightly more acidic environment to thrive and therefore alkali using the environment will kill the cancer cells which is true in a laboratory setting course laboratory cells. Erlich surely really kind of difficult to keep alive and the same logic a handgun will eliminate cancer cells by making a petri dish hospitable. Say there's no good evidence that it works the way they think it works fact. There's lots of evidence that it doesn't there. S now that you bring this up. I remember reading an article about it at terribly long ago as i say. I'm a particularly long list of things in the footnotes this this week so alkalis in your body. Though is an entirely different hill to climb than a laboratory setting unfortunately for the basic their basic basic was. Yeah everything in nature goes against the idea that you should alkalis yourself. Even co two in our lungs and in our blood is acidic so alkaline. Izing yourself isn't going to be easy. Which is worth a real water. And its competitor's will help you out real water being a brand name. Oh i was like how does real water have competitors. Can't i just go get it from puddle. Is it that really clever cylindrical bottle with the neat little block lettering or a smooth. I this is the one real water is in the one that is in the squarish bottles. They kind of look like fiji bottles. The one you're thinking of is also got the healing power of good vibrations. Okay anyway talking about good. So water apparently is supposed to be if you believe big science around seven but real water likes to make their water with ph ranging from five to nine They've got water. That's for you no matter what side of the seven year. Woo falls on. If your water isn't seven is it daughter. I mean it's water with stuff in it pretty much. All of our waters. Water was stuffing still from science based medicine by way of flying crane acupuncture kangan water. Another brand name has recommended. Four deep breath cancer. Autoimmune disorders chemical sensitivities gird allergies kennedy l. I'm disease biofilms protozoan. Nfl nineteen fifty-three fibromyalgia fatigue syndrome. Insomnia leaky gut syndrome migraine headaches multiple. Sclerosis perot psoriasis sinusitis and all other standard american diet ailments so. Why aren't we all drinking. This erin i know because we all have protozoan. Nfl teen fifty three. Apparently i'm glad i knew that fifty three sounds like a terrible place because it's like four dollars a pint. Oh man you wish figures. Yeah it's fifteen bucks for an eight ounce bottle we'll just we'll just cut to the chase on if it's more than a bucket. Oh my god she. Just so. According to mark chris slip on science based medicine. Nfl nineteen fifty. Three is a non identifier heeded. Some looking around with super. Dr google illness and surprise surprise found nothing were of note in any of the journals. E looked in but did find a reference to protozoa room. Matica which i'm positive i've mispronounced but also i don't care because that doesn't exist it's not it's not a it's not a thing i don't think that wrong. That's pretty good seriously. He found a reference to something he made up. He found a reference to something. Someone made doesn't straight up doesn't exist. Asphalt's not real cool. Is this the same guy. that said vaccine's cause autism. That's not circles and in fact the only person who thinks that that's real. Is dr stephen fry not the one you want it to be a little. Wanted to talk to her as an honorary. It's an honorary title dodgers. Stephen fry though he hasn't published his findings of course but he's pretty sure that this protozoa that somehow grows up to be a worm which then causes the fungal super infection of her. And fibro and msn ls. And of course doesn't michael. Oh good so this. Nonexistent thing doesn't like alkalinity dump. Glad we covered. I'm thinking he's on the job kilos guy. Quick call list. He may well be that would be. That would be the crowd. Yeah and so if you look at the article in science based medicine there's images of the bug which are being widely regarded as a red blood cell or in the case of a few other photographs and artifact but you know those are no longer available to download from florida. Detox dot com. I'm guessing for truth. Reasons couldn't find it again. Wants to clean the lens on his microscope. Right that said they can still cure your lyme disease with stuff honestly. Judging by the wall of nonsense on their side it might be easier to have ghetto. Thanks for listening to interesting true if you like what you heard. You might two sheriffs on the socials or leave us a review. Wherever you're listening you can always subscribe at patriotair. Dot com slash. It where for as little as a dollar a show. You'll get patron exclusive story. Each week out takes regular show and more you can contact us. Find out more and see what else we do. It interesting of true dot com takes the patriots part of listeners. Like you interesting truth. Proud supporter of wyoming aids assistance registered five. Oh one c. Three charity that provides support to wyoming nights living with hiv aids. Find out more. Wa dot oregon. Thank you for listening sharing and donating still the cancers a fungus. Hiv aids is a toxin crowd. Aren't gonna give up. Just because they're thing is demonstrably nonsense. Couldn't slow down nice arrived. It'll put them in double dry overdrive. That would just let big germ theory win. And we can't have that to that end companies like gangrene real water and others have been making not just bottled water. But also machines that somehow use electrolysis and salt to make alkaline water or acidic acidic water to your specifications and needs of course none of this works because separating ph neutral water and h no too low voltage currents just creates all the stuff you need for water not a terrible way to make fuel for your car right some hydrogen off the top. Yeah unless your goal is flammable. Gases doesn't help you if you need a farm potatoes on mars. Maybe i need to so. The wu planned though is to split the water and h such that. We're left with more. Oh ions which are basic as bitches. Unfortunately you're also left with extra hydrogen ions which are both acidic and prone to recombining with oh to to make water so water. So electrolysis doesn't help. You make alkaline water. His by most of this stuff you'll buy just has baking soda in it. Oh well that makes sense. What is a one hundred and even a thing what. Oh yeah yes. it's a hydroxide. Your body is very good at regulating. Its own ph and altering that through diet is virtually impossible. I would think at this point that it's obvious but let's walk through this. You get some alkaline water. And you drink alkaline water and let's say it's even upwards of nine point three on the scale which is probably gonna taste super gross. But whatever i don't know what kind of side effects you'll greg yet still within p after leaving the bottle. The water is introduced directly into your stomach acid which immediately neutralizes it. Now you just regular water and your stomach. Lots of burps. Yes unless like any solution you mix coverage into it you can change its ph and there are people dedicated enough to do so so does that mean just drinking a ton more. Yeah it means just alkali using everything right too dangerous. Think about it this way. You two are constantly making an effort to lower the ph of your stomach's when you eat all those damn time. That is pocket. Tom's that's the whole point of it. Is this neutralizing best this alkaline. Water is light milk of magnesia milk of skimming so got another question. So if you're one of the people that wants to completely neutralize everything you neutralize everything you eat. How does your food breakdown in your stomach. If it's acidic there anymore. What they want to do. And what the actually aligned. If they did they would be too dead to talk about it. Generally what that causes you need to eat a lot more and then never again off the shelves so if you were really really dedicated and you were to say mix baked baking soda which is just you just take so you put it on a sheet trae cookie tray you bake it at like two fifty or whatever for an hour and then you can use it to make alkaline water which is used in making rama noodles but you could if you wanted to pour it directly into the water which he should absolutely never do because will chemical burn the hell out of you. This is a this is a rubber gloves process. Oh like it is basic enough to burn. Wow yeah when it when it comes out of the oven even after it's cool off if you get it on your skin the moisture on your skin. Can you a chemical burn. Yeah wow okay cool. I didn't know that. I mean that's not the it's not. It's not like that scene from fight club. Burn through you but don't worry about the bacon soda in the box shave murphy. Fine with that. I mean don't eat it. Unless you're putting it into russia and to that a little dabble will do all we. Little tiny teaspoon is usually enough to make rama noodles for two. If you could push through the stomach acid limitation through the kidneys and liver limitations and slowly began to. Alkalis your body. This is basically what would happen after reiterate here that would take an enormous amount of effort. Because you'll have to push through chemical burns massive digestive issues abdominal pain and a growing list of symptoms associated with what you're doing yourself which is known as alkyl alkyl so if your body is giving you digestive issues abdominal pain and all this that and the other is not your body trying to tell you. Hey don't don't don't do that down donna that some people react differently. They're like hey. I would like one. Mild five percent poison please. Alcohol is usually caused by youtube building up in the body by way of respiratory issue. But if you were to do it orally which would be a feet. Here's what you'd be dealing with. And it isn't even a little bit to cure for cancer. You're looking at starting out with muscular weakness and then pain followed by severe cramps coupled with muscle spasms And eventually like the kind that break your spine it will cause transport proteins in your blood ionized who and ions causing free calcium to bind more strongly albumin which causes tenteni seizures. Then it gets into your central nervous system and causes strokes or rhett syndrome before eventually melting your lungs brain ability to not be dead at. What point is my cancer gone and my fibrosis and my protozoa and bacteria from drastic part. They go away the same time. Your consciousness does does work leaves your body shape work because what you're what you're saying. Yeah all of that stuff curate. At the end of that paragraph secure the same way as a bull to the brain which probably cheaper another thing. We have in common with petri desert palm. But don't take my word for it. Twenty sixteen systematic review of the evidence on alkaline diet for the prevention or treatment of cancer concluded quote despite the promotion of the alkaline diet alkaline water by media and sales people there's almost no actual research into either support or disprove these ideas. The systematic review of the literature revealed a lack of evidence for or against diet acid load and or alkaline water for the initiation or treatment of cancer. Promotion of the alkaline diet and alkaline water. The public for cancer prevention or treatment is not justified. Which is a way of saying. Don't do that very nice way of saying this is much less like how would that even work very nice way of saying yes and remember me mentioning that if your blood. Alkalis you can create free calcium. Absolutely a bad thing but when filtered through ignorance it sounds a lot like something that could be good for bone health. So i was gonna say calcium. It's free. I don't have to pay for it i want it. Give me free. Calcium in my vein. Yeah to that though. A twenty seven systematic review of alkaline diet for preventing osteoporosis found that quote a causal association between dietary acid load and osteoporotic bone disease is not supported by the evidence and there is no evidence that an alkaline diet is protective of bone health. The end knock it off just another paragraph saying. Don't do this study that year science learning. No no that's dangerous and you don't want anything to do with it. And if that is a little bit too scienc- for you are we can bring it back down to earth with a quote from the fda the recent one in fact quote we are advising consumers restaurants and retailers not to consume cook with or sell or serve real water alkaline water until more information is known about the cause of the illness. We are working to determine how the alkaline water may be related to the illness although the investigation is ongoing epidemiological information currently indicates that this alkaline water product may be the cause of the illness we will provide additional updates as more information becomes available. Did real water start cova. Didn't it real water did kovic. Are you wondering what the illnesses steve. Yeah yeah on. I thought maybe. I just dropped out for a minute and i miss oh wait. We talked about cesium earlier. I'm getting old. Sometimes i just lose. It seems really soluble in water. Did you just straight up poison. People with radioactive seasoning see see seasonings season a season. It's called oregano. Yes oh leila's. They're talking about their little vague. Because it's what five kids in nevada who have recently like last month have been sent to the issue with their parents were also admitted with varying degrees of the illness. The illness is defined by the fda as a non viral hepatitis. Traced back to consuming vegas-based real water alkaline water reeling non viral hepatitis. Direct evidence that it's truly bad for you. Apparently it causes all of the bad stuff that you would normally associate with hepatitis. Dying because mom is woo. Yeah basically they got they got a bad batch of real water alkaline water and it everybody all of the families and the hospital to varying degrees and one family. The daughter doesn't go in for the wu and she was the only one who's fine. seems pretty. good evidence. I hope she had some choice words for her mother right. Like no thank you. Maybe after she found out her mama's gonna live again. I guess you're right. I was being as banharn like selling back. People whether on their oss little bit. You know you wouldn't be here if you weren't such more on. I'm not sure that helps them heal you. Don't want to steve. yeah. You don't do that but i've wanted. I mean of yelled at other cars like you don't do that. That's my idea of a great sunday afternoon. I may not have done it in real reality. But i've done it in my head a lot. What do you do during the weekends right. Go to the hospital and yell at people or make fun of ugly babies in front of their parents. It's great has so for their for their part. Real real hotter rep jones. Who that's that's his name firs goes jones says quote. Real water is asking that all retailers pulled the product from the shelf effective immediately and hold it in the back rooms or return it to the distributors. Customer who has purchased real water from a retailer is asked to return the product. The end not not commenting on all at all on the people. It's hurt just put it in the background. That'd be fun. don't feed it after midnight. Gosh alkaline water may claim to cure cancer but definitely does give you all the symptoms of hepatitis. At least the top of their web does have a nice big red press release real water product. Recall on it. Oh yeah they host that up real bad. There's a bunch of these two. There's so many places when people to sell alcan is or machines that purport to do it in your home. And how much of the they're really affordable right. Like 'cause if you have a company like this you wanna make sure everyone lives longer so you charge very little except for real water. That's fifteen dollars. Yeah right you can get two eight ounce bottles from their website for thirty bucks. Even if you're peddling snake oil shale you don't wanna kill your customers that makes you a bad virus live so they can keep getting more alive. Yeah it's a. it's a horribly corrupt symbiotic. Relationship is instead of charging for the water. You just have to write me into your will. And i'll give you as much water as you want for as long as you need it. I call the baptist approach. I think if you return a case of tainted real water you should get a jade egg just you can also use it as art. Rose so to summarize. Simple bottle of alkaline. Water will not alkaline. Is your body. Even if it could their effects would be anything but healthy desirable. Best case you get sick worse case you wind up on a liver transplant. Lists like the five kids. I just mentioned and maybe die also just say no to water will say no to all who. Let's just put their lives out of detroit than our flint unless you live in flint in which case might not be the worst alternative to tap water a picture poison moment but instead the people from flint need to go get jaden smith's water because he's actually been handing out water for flint for years without saying anything about it strangely enough awesome. Yeah go him. Well congratulations steve. I hope that. What did your appetite for water. Puns in an upcoming quiz. I'm erin and i'd like to thank all of our listeners. Our supporters and mike. Oh ho steven thanks guys. We will get you. Yeah maybe i. I can't promise sorry love you. Though on this week. I learned that if you can bottle it someone will buy it. It's not necessarily a good thing to know not the takeaway you should want ever aboard final. Where about the show. Social links and contact information interesting to dot com music for the episode was created by wayne jones and was used with permission the opinions views nonsense expressed in the show or those of the hosts only denier ever send any other people organizations or life forums. All rights reserved interesting through twenty twenty.
Episode 161 Next.js with Tim Neutkens
Inside Europe 07.02.2019
"The w. Inside here. Hello. I'm Keith Walker in Bonn, Germany. You're listening to inside Europe on today's program Francis yellow vest crisis at least fourteen people have lost an eye after being shot by controversial police defense ball launchers or LB dis. I've seen several times LB shots into crowds. And then you see people falling to the ground with leg injuries or sometimes I- injuries. That can be a lot of leading. It's quite shocking. Also on the show the number of antisemitic incidents across Britain is growing, according to a UK monitor Jewish communities across the UK will look at these latest figures with a great deal of Navistar that report makes grim reading we've got more coming up and the security issue. Worrying European leaders these stories and more coming up on inside Europe. According to Francis libra hash on newspaper at least fourteen people have lost an eye after being shot by police defensible launchers since the country's juillet your protest began November this new generation rubber bullets rifle usually known by its French acronym. LB d has been banned in many countries, but France's highest administrative court. The council of state has rejected legal bills to suspend its use there with this and the other latest developments in the French yellow vest crisis. John Lawrenson reports from Paris. It is become the new state of the news in France. The theme of the latest weekly act of the Georgia drama. The most recent the Woking wounded. They opened fire on the people with a weapon of war is that today's France, Jill mode league is one of the leaders of the yellow vest already had long black pirates bid. Now, here's the black eyepatches to match. You lawsuit Nye the Saturday before like thirteen other yellow vests protesters according to liberal, but has been trying to sift the truth from the full in the claims and counterclaims over the casualties of this conflict people injured when they heard this sound. Tally of serious injuries. So far one hundred forty four suffered by protesters and journalists these include severed hands and fractures hooligans having lost their main function on quotes of grenades. Stuck in feet and OEMs serious burns and cuts to the head enormous bruises. You get from taking L B ball on the cheek not counted. For example, some of the worst injuries and probably all the lost is have been afflicted by the VDI dark gray futuristic sub lethal weapon whose most famous version is the flash bull made by vani Cal affirm that we manufacturing hunting rifles since the seventeenth century. What do we get is exaggerating? It's not a weapon of war. You would want to fire rubber bullets in a war. But it's pretty nasty. Clem Leno is a photojournalist who's been following the protests on the ground. They we could Blissett Sola manifesto digital. Jess the LB d. Is dangerous. We've seen a lot of people injured during the vest protests. The security forces aren't allowed to fire the LBJ at the head or the lower body. But a demonstrations people are moving all the time as a lot of movement. So it's difficult for them to aim properly. I've seen several times LB shots into crowds. And then you see people fall into the ground with leg injuries or sometimes I- injuries. There can be a lot of bleeding. It's quite shocking. We're not used to seeing this sort of thing demonstrations in Europe LB's have been banned in Austria island, Finland Norway, Sweden Denmark, and the UK only Greece Poland and Spain outside of Catalonia allow they use become footed by the decision of the consider interior minister Christoph cast, speaking on RT, L radio said the security forces absolutely need this weapon in their weekly clashes with July, June Tonka, sir Ivar contact techno. There are rioters who come to demonstrations with the sole aim of fighting with the security forces. And I know that if we take these weapons away from the police, what will they have left when they are attacked and forced to defend themselves. They can fight with their bare hands or they can use their service revolvers, neither you nor. I would want them to use their service revolvers, and I want to avoid hand to hand fights what we can do is provide a better framework for the use of the LB D. I have ordered that. Whenever in LB, d is fired. That shooting is filmed last Saturday. There were thirty two LB shots fired. Thirty two were filmed. True that the level of violence at the end of demonstrations in France has become extreme in the past three years. Not all LB de guests. Grenade. Injuries were provoked by rises. There have been numerous testimonies from people who say they were doing nothing violent whatsoever. But was shot by the police after talk into journalist Clem on Leno. I spoke to the colleague of his low home back to Lucy who tells me he was shot in the leg. LB while reporting on a demonstration he was wearing a red press. Armbands was a good distance from any demonstrator and was shot Fano reason tool. He says casino systematic filming of LB shots could curb this sorts of abuse. Another thing says Clem Leno would be to extend riot training to those now using this dangerous weapon. Police all say there's not enough training. So this is something that can be improved on in particular for the so called anti-criminal brigades PAC who have been drafted into confront the demonstrators over the past few weeks. These men have unlike the Sierras right police and the genome never been given riot control training. They used to firing their LB in more static situations against criminals. So maybe the solution would be if we're not going to ban LB dis to better train, the people who use them. The French interior ministry has ordered a further one thousand two hundred eighty for the next four years. John Orson d-w Paris. And I'm Keith Walker in Bonn, Germany. You're listening to inside Europe. Many Europeans were nervous about US. President Donald Trump's state of the union speech this week after a year in which he imposed sanctions on imports of steel and aluminium threatened to tax German cars on revealed just how serious he is about pulling the US out of NATO the speech ended up barely mentioning European interests. Except for one as Teri Schultz reports. President Trump didn't quit NATO Tuesday night, which brought us I of relief in many quarters, but he did mention another security issue. Worrying European leaders who don't actually have a say in it the US withdrawal from the intermediate range nuclear forces treaty, or I n f after years of Russian violations of the nineteen eighty-seven bilateral accord, while we followed the agreement and the rules to the letter Russia repeatedly violated its terms. Been going on for many years. That is why I now NSS that the United States is officially withdrawing from the intermediate range nuclear forces treaty, or I n f treaty perhaps. We really have no choice, perhaps we can negotiate a different agreement adding China and others perhaps we can't in which case we will outspend and out innovate all others by far. The pull out and the pled to outspend out innovate the rest of the world on nuclear weapons got plenty of applause in the US congress that enthusiasm is not universally shared in European capitals. Which would be the battleground of any nuclear war between Washington and Moscow the international campaign to abolish nuclear weapons. I can still hopes the treaty can be saved over the mandatory six month waiting period, but more than that. I can't advocacy director. Leo Hoffman Thome says he hopes the seriousness of the situation. Leads more European governments to sign the UN treaty on the prohibition of nuclear weapons. Nuclear weapons do not contribute to that security, especially since Europe would be Decio where nuclear weapons would be exchanged between the US and Russia, so they would be squeezed in between the European powers all small to medium sized powerless. That's simply don't benefit of this ams race. So I think that in the medium it's going to become clear to everyone that this is dangerous game. The US uses the same argument to try to garner European support for its withdrawal from the treaty due to its years of documented development by Russia of a missile system. That breaches the allowed range now the US plans to build its own new missile system saying that will better protect European allies US under secretary of state for arms control. Andrea Thompson briefed journalists the day after the state of the union speech to hammer those points home, this isn't a prototype. This is an alab. This isn't an house somewhere. These are fielded battalions wolf. Battalions across Russia. They can range partners and allies now. So the decision was made to to for us to to withdraw from nine treaty again. So we can build the systems that will defend Americans, home and abroad and work with our partners and allies. Now, the department of defense will be able to conduct those research development activities that they hadn't because we've been complying European governments say their own intelligence backs up American claims that Russia has developed a treaty busting missile system, which Moscow continues to deny. But that doesn't mean everyone's comfortable with the direction. This could be going even leaving aside the horrific prospect of nuclear conflict, the idea the US may want to station more conventional weapons on European soil is unpopular in some countries, although those nearest the border with Russia share a different perspective and are more welcoming of a stronger American stance. Christian mulling deputy director of the German Council on foreign relations explains that with the current standoff over Europe's head there doesn't. Seem to be any way around more weapons being developed if not deployed continued talks and at the same time you have to develop options if there is no way to go back to control, and we can't wait until the until the FOX have failed because the signals that we get from the Russian side on being winning to enter into meaningful discussion and meaningful potential ons control off towards I'm not that pundits. How can you force the other side to go into more meaningful discussion about the weapons? And if this is possible only through talks, then you have to put something else on the table that can be negotiated. Milling says NATO needs to come to terms with the threat and clarify its nuclear policy. Nato defense ministers meet next week here. In Brussels, where this crisis likely to dominate the agenda Teri Schultz, d-w, Brussels. I'm Keith Wilco in Bonn, Germany. You're listening to inside Europe. A monitor in the UK has found the number of anti semitic incidents across Britain is growing a new report from the community security trust makes for grim reading we've got more VAT in less than ten minutes. But first the European Commission on Wednesday announced its decision to block a merger between two companies one French one German, they both produce long distance trains. German giant Zeman's on its French competitor Alstom produce the long distance high speed, it's a and Tae trains at respectively. These the very fast trains thought speed along Ryan Haith has political correspondent for politico Europe. Hello, ryan. Hello. How're you doing? Good. Thank you. This merger was very ambitious. What happened? So the E U or any last year had laid out in three hundred ninety five pages said of charges against the company saying that they weren't going to delay. The officiant sees that they were promising by the Mojo, and because such lodge companies that they will really going to hinder the ability of other countries like Bomba of a Canadian company to compete in the market, and we already know that role as is not a very competitive market because it used to be a very heavily state arranged and state owned. And so the was saying we're not going along with this just because France and Germany want to create what they call national champion. Following this story. I mean, it goes further because like back more than ten years. Absolutely. So what ultimate Siemens were trying to say is that they need to be big in order to compete against China. And what the EU is saying is that national governments and companies only have come to asking it to bend the rules when they claim there is some kind of crisis going on. And so you seeing the Germans in this case making the very same arguments that the French made in two thousand eight and two thousand and nine when they asked to be able to give special support to companies like Citron and other as in the car industry after the financial crisis, and essentially the EU was saying that where the only people defending the level playing field in this single market. And even if times tough, even if you face tough competition from outside when not going to break those rules and give up all of the distributor benefits of the single market. Just to help as one. Two companies. Now, the commission decision comes about two weeks after Germany and France signs, a pact pledging deeper cooperation with each other as off to a good start isn't. No. But is also going on is that the French and the Germans doing much Deepa defense cooperation we saw some new contract signed in that regard this week. And that's interesting because defense is an exception to all of these competition rules that the just applied against Olsen and Siemens. So if you want to join up on national security measures, then you have a much greater scope to do that than if you were just a mea train company or a car company, for example. So is is the plans to produce because they want to produce a new joint fighter jet is going to get off the ground. Well, all of these things take decades. So it looks like they're on the right track for that. In the same way that France, Germany and other countries joined up to create Airbus more than twenty years ago now so. So the proof is always in the results. You can't say a contract is going to deliver a fighter jet at. So we might be waiting more than ten years to to see whether that is really going to turn out. But if France and Germany do want to try and build up these national champions. They'd be well advised to try to look more into the defense military space to do that they'll have an easier ride if they go down that route rather than if they tried to with ordinary industrial companies Ryan, hey for political correspondent for politico Europe. Thank you for your time and expertise on inside Europe. Thank you. That report from anti semitism is coming up next the recorded over one hundred anti semitic incidents in every month of twenty eighteen Jewish communities across the UK will look at these latest figures with a great deal of nervousness on Keith Walker in Bonn, Germany. You're listening to inside Europe. A monitor in the UK has find the number of anti semitic incidents across Britain is growing for the third year in a row the community security trust has recorded record instances of semitism up sixteen percent year on year. Jack foster has more the highest total antisemitic incidents in the UK ever recorded in a single year. That's the headline finding from the community security trust or CS tease. Antisemitic incidents report twenty eighteen last year, the t China teak created in nineteen Ninety-four to ensure the safety and security of the UK's Jewish community recorded at one thousand six hundred fifty two antisemitic incidents in Britain. That's an increase of sixteen percent. From the previous year, the specter of antisemitism has been growing in the UK over recent years fueled in large part by scandal surrounding the opposition labor party leader, Jeff. Adamy Corbin whose vocal support for Palestinian communities in the Middle East has led many of his critics to accuse him of being soft on antisemitic sentiment inside his own party. Former chief rabbi Lord Jonathan sacks last year echoed what many in the country's Jewish community are feeling anti semitism or any hate becomes dangerous. When three things happened. I when it moves from the fringes of politics to a mainstream party and its leadership second when the party sees that its popularity with the general public is not harmed there by and three when those who stand up in protest of vilified and abused for doing so all three factors exist in Britain. Now, I never thought I would see this in my lifetime. That is why stay silent. For it is not only Jews who are at risk. So too is how humanity rabbi Lord Jonathan sacks. Speaking journey a debate in the house of lords in September. And if his words gave pause for thought the findings of this week's antisemitism incident report, make four even more unsettling reading the recorded over one hundred anti-semitic incidents in every month of twenty eighteen the first time this has ever happened in a single calendar year almost three quarters of the incidents recorded to place in grits. London, angry, Manchester, the deport also claims that to a likelihood of under reporting the number of anti-semitic incidents, which took place last year is likely to be quote significantly higher. I spoke with Dave rich who's head of policy and threat of communications at the community security trust. He's also the author of a book about those accusations of antisemitism level towards Jeremy carbons labor party called the left's Jewish problem, and I began by asking him about that claim that these figures may actually be. Lower than reality. The crime survey for England and Wales mice recently estimates thrown the around Hof will hate crimes come to the attention of the place. But that was another survey done by the European Union agency, fundamental rights last year found the only twenty one percent of British Jews who'd experienced anti semitic incident or hate crime over the previous five years had reported it to anybody. So is quite possible that the real figures of several times larger than the incident soles in our report, perhaps the most unnerving of the support is a graph which shows a month by month, kind of the the number of on symmetric incidence going back to two thousand seven no that many peaks and troughs alone that graph. But generally speaking, we can only see an upward trend starting around the tail end of twenty fourteen and instantly. Fifteen do you have a sense of events might have precipitated that trend. There's a whole series of events that have fed. Into it. There was a big war in Israel and Gaza in two thousand fourteen where we saw record numbers of anti Smits incidents in those months terrorist attacks talks in Jewish communities across Europe. But also talks in all societies as a whole the divisive nature of the arguments. Iran's semitism in the labor policy on will say the rise in xenophobia following the Brexit debate in this country as while in all of these different faxes have fed into just a more general atmosphere of division on Anglesey in the Jewish community bounce Simon schism Dave rich from the community security trust and the Ponti political aspect. Dave rich talks about highlights shift in the source of anti semitism in the UK as seen by the CS tease report this week prejudice. Which has traditionally been the preserve of the far right appears to spread to elements of the left to right now, the Jewish communities across. The UK will look at these latest figures with a great deal of nervousness, particularly that consistent increase in anti semitic incidents for what is now before consecutive year foster d w. Inside Europe comes to you from d-w in foam. Jimmy, you can listen again all download the podcast at d-w dot com slash inside Europe. Where also on soundcloud and die teens. This is inside here up every week. We bring you the big stories from Europe from our team of reporters all over the continent as well. As in studio, guests will deliver the latest, and politics, culture and more. If you enjoy the show do your friends of favor and tell them about us we're here every week. And if you'd like to get in touch with us, we would love to hear from you. Here's our Email address Europe D W dot com. Thank you for listening. This is inside Europe. And I'm Keith Walker in Bonn, Germany. This is inside Europe. I'm Keith Walker in Bonn, Germany, a very interesting thirty minutes coming up Spain's far-right vox party putz, gender equality and gender violence back at the center of Spain's political debate Xs and Italy amid warnings from pope Francis about the devil working to undermine the Catholic church. Every year five hundred thousand Italians visit an extra cyst five hundred thousand we've got more on that coming up and a German mother space to us about being told of her daughter's conversion to the ultra conservative version of slum known as Salafism income because it's she got it into a head that she had to convert to his Lomb because it protect hone protect him. We'll thoroughly than the religion. She grew up with also coming up parents are urged to restrict kids use of smartphones. But that's easier said than done has one. Mother finds is these stories and more coming up. Jimmy. You're listening to incite. And the last four decades since the end of the Franco dictatorship women's rights in Spain have seen huge advances. But the recent electoral success of the far, right? Vox party has appeared to unleash something of a backlash known for its opposition to immigration and customs separatism the party is putting gender equality and gender violence at the center of Spain's political debate guy. Hedge co reports. Demonstration by women in the southern city of death. They oppose the arrival of new right-wing undersea and regional government particular. They were angry that the new administration needed the support of Vokes exchange for its backing vocals wanted the new government to strip funding from women's groups for laws protecting women from violence to be revised such ideas have led many to see Volks as misogynist extremist labels. The party itself rejects even spinal folks is head of international relations defends its controversial gender policies. If it women because as a man of anything the man's presumed guilty until proven innocence, which is absolutely radical. I don't think the answers to criminalise fifty percents population. Espionage, says fulls acusations of filings by women against foam upon us, a rife and the Genda vol. Problem is exaggerated. There is a number of women that are being murdered by men, which is always an acceptable. Even if it was just one it would be an acceptable. But if you can hear the more than half of those have to do with tourists or immigrants who happened to be here for one or another reason, then it turns out to the stats. Looks more like half of those those GM. Nearly fifty women were killed by the partners or experts, but that annual figure has dropped dramatically in recent years in great pomp because of cross party corporation conservatives and leftists worked together on quality and gender violence. Mark. Doug on Silas is a member of parliament for the conservative Popular Party, which is leading the new on the loose in government progress has been huge during the dictatorship Spanish women could not for instance, have a passport and leave the country without permission from their parents or husband's. They could not open Bank account without the permission of their husbands. And these has changed completely changed after the constitution of nineteen seventy eight. And in the last twenty years, we have made huge progress in what is related to gender violence. Is there a possibility that's all these advances at spayed made over the years could be in danger. Because of the fact that your party is willing to make a deal with vox, which is a party that opposes many of those kinds of advances. It seems not that's all I would like to very clear on this issue because we have to bear in mind that very important agreement a packed on gender violence and all kinds of violence against women has been very recently approved. At the congress and the Senate in Spain among all parties Vokes wasn't pause of that national pact. And although it's demands on gender issues and under Lucius wouldn't accept it. Its efforts to disrupt the consensus seems to be paying off the seems to be an increasing willingness among certain politicians commentators and even members of the Catholic church to speak out against what they call radical feminism and the so-called criminalization of men. The campaign for equal rights is not only being fought out on the streets or in the country's parliament. It's also being waged in places. Like this a local government building in a working class district of northern Madrid. Here. A weekly workshop takes place called men against chauvinism. Fabiana Luhan associates CPA vises the sessions which explore how men can change their attitudes in order to improve their understanding of the position sex. Not by the thing. They'll somebody's gays content on commuter crisis. There are men who own opposed to any changes for women with FOX's policies now seen as legitimate that part of the male population fields in a stronger position to fight a lot of men who were feeling unable to speak out because it was proved of now feel they have permission to take very tough stance against the ideas and practices that women are putting forward it's worrying because it's a step backwards in the British Sunday. Political official official. For now, vox is influence on the new and Lucy and government is limited to areas other than Genda instead some of the party's policies on more. Marginal issues have been accepted like protecting and promoting bullfighting and Flamenco music. But this may further local elections could see vox influence spread across the country. If so Jen the politics will once again be at the center of debate guy hedge co TWA Madrid. From bonn. Gemini, you're listening to incite throughout his papacy. Pope Francis has warned of the presence of the devil. Last September, the punt of even said, the devil was working overtime to undermine the Catholic church and seems many Italians also believe in the devil's work every year five hundred thousand Italians go to see an exorcist. The city of Rome has seven exorcists our reporter Anglo van Schaik joined some of the faithful hoping for an audience with Rome's most famous exorcists Padron Chen's. Oh. It's seven o'clock in the morning, not far from kin chis- code something into spoon Tina opens its doors. People have been waiting outside for hours to be among the first to meet battle Vincenzo. Shinzo is eighty one year-old Incheon's with our belly. He's been the official exorcist of the diocese of Rome foot twenty nine years in Shan. So is the most famous of Rome's seven exorcists, and he and his colleagues are inundated with work every year five hundred thousand Italians visit an extra Cest five hundred thousand so it's Italy a country in headed by the possessed yet. Thank bit king. The. The demand is rising people becoming less religious. So the devil takes his chances people tend to turn away from God and look for certainties elsewhere. But they think they'll find it with Shauna. Tns and that's very dangerous. People seek out Dave Incheon. So every time he's in the parish. They want to meet him talk to him. But he only receives people twice a week on Monday and Friday mornings off to mass. Part of Incheon. So Hans numbers to select people his audience only twenty five people chosen at a time, so bad luck. If you number twenty six then you have to get up early again next time. People come here for an Xs him. Do you need an extra schism? I don't think so do not come here because of everyday discomfort your priest needs to refer you to me. These two women have been waiting about insurance. Oh morning. T- to Bennett, I came to positive Chen's. Oh, so he'll bless my religious medals pay stronger and more spiritual than other priests. Through then through fifteen years ago. I went to pan more the Vatican's most famous exorcist back, then I headed Rame telling me to do this. My grandmother had just I two now is looking for comfort, and I found it now. Again, a dream send me to an exorcist. There are some problems in my family. My brother is very ill. So I'm looking for comfort again, if you're not feeling well and your religious your turn to God. And you talk to God through a priest, but an exorcist does a more spiritual priest. So that's why I'm here. When will you leave? You've made her suffer a lot. All ready go away Satan, I exercise you in the name of the father, the son and the Holy Spirit. Amen. That's cataldo. One of part of insurance was colleagues in Palermo, Sicily. And that's still way really tough cases are treated the devil is exercised through what are cold liberation prayers? Sessions can be repeated if necessary. But fought of Shinzo says most cases, less dramatic. Me hit me by the media. If he most people come here because of daily problems troubled with children fights with their parents, most of the time people just seek comfort are seen thousands of people over the years, but very few people who are really possessed maybe a couple of dozen, but I've met a lot of disturbed people. People started to scream trade full them. We'll put my hand on the heads people who are not possessed, but certainly disturbed. Dimona ta demography I'm convinced the devil exists and his greatest strength is making people believe he doesn't exist. Personally, do not believe the devil exists. But I d- believe that economic hardship and social problems can increase someone's need to hold onto something. So perhaps those five hundred thousand talion who visit an exorcist each year. I'll simply looking for support in these tough times. D-w rome. I'm Keith Walker in Bonn, Germany. You're listening to inside here up. I find maker apple has agreed to pay ten years of back taxes to France. It's the latest US company to strike a deal with France, which has led a push through the European Union for higher taxes on technology. Giants DWI business. Correspondent Andrea Becker is here. Hello, undress Heke. So how much are we talking about here where the exact figure has not been announced? But fringe media have reported a sum of five hundred million euros for the past years, which translates into about five hundred seventy million US dollars. Eople said in a statement, what they always say in these kind of cases that they know how important Texas that they pay taxes and all the countries whether operate and that they follow the Knauss FRANZ house being talking about introducing attacks targeting the big US technology companies known as the gafa companies Google, apple Facebook, and I'm on Gotha. Now that was to be in place from the start of this year. What's what's the latest with that? Whether the Bill would be put to parliament this month, and once it's passed to the law will be attractive to generate and it would affect companies with global sales of more than seven hundred fifty million euros and twenty five million euros in France in FRANZ hopes to earn an additional five hundred million this year. Okay. I it's not just FRANZ from what I understand. No. I mean, the logical thing to do would be an e you wide legislation. The problem is all twenty seven members if you don't count the Brits have to agree on it and some countries Australia posed Ireland, for example. Exum Burke, but also Denmark, Sweden, they attracted major investments from gafa companies, and they are frayed. They might lose lose out and Germany was not particularly helpful in pushing for a u wide digital tax the fear retaliation by the US government in form of higher tariffs on that cars. So the whole issue has been referred to the international organization for economic cooperation development, and they hope to reach some agreement maybe sometime next year. In the meantime, some countries push ahead with a national tax fronts. We just talked about it, but Spain Austria Italy, they also toy with the same idea. Okay. So I mean countries like Arlen their corporate tax rate is really really low. So they attract a loss of huge tech US companies, and they use the different text tricks, mainly they wrote the income through low income nations such as Ireland and Luxembourg text rate is much lower, and then they declare their profits there. But it w-. Was worse. If you years back in two thousand fourteen for example, according to the u commission apple paid an effective corporate tax rate in Ireland of listen zero point zero zero five percent on profits, which translates into fifty euros for every million euros in profits. The practice has since been declared illegal, and it has been changed. But one thing says, it all Ireland had to be forced to ask the money back that didn't really wanted them much prefer this that as of being Apple's darling because of their low, Texas, and that brings also enough money for them and also jobs, exactly under spiker DWI business. Correspondent thanks for coming on inside Europe coming up in just a moment. A German mother speaks to us about being told her daughter's conversion to the ultra conservative version of a slum known as Salafism I'm capable Kerr in Bonn, Germany. This is inside here up. Can be few things more terrifying. For mother than being told by thirties that your daughter is planning to move to a part of Syria under the control of Islamic state, one German woman Monica moolah fantasy self in that situation about five years ago. Low the information the police picked up in a mosque turned out to be a full rumor Monica's daughter does have a history of Slama Craddock lies -ation. She talked to DWI reporter Montana's phone Hein about her trials decision to wear niqab under determination to marry a mom who shares her religious ideology, the names of people and places have been changed through this report. It's presented by income us. Monitor is nurse stranger to the perils of radicalization. A doctor by profession. She now also works with a project that tries to alert young people to what can happen if they go along with someone else's radical ideas, rather than thinking for themselves, and that does not only apply to radical forms of Islam does are Canova. It would be the same with young people who became right wing radicals. Watching what happens to the family. How does it change a family radicalization? Tariff family pond. That could have been the story of Monica Miller and her daughter severe, but things didn't turn out that way these days. The mother stays in close contact with her daughter, they speak on the phone almost daily in visit each other when they can. But reaching that point was fraught with difficulty and long periods with no contact sometimes for months at a time. So FIA who is now twenty four was a teenager when she converted to Islam. Her mother says the decision was triggered by a traumatic experience outside the family round. She doesn't go into any more detail than that. But says it profoundly changed her daughter who is earned twelve at the time creating in her a deep desire to feel protected Safiya went to therapy. But when it failed to give what she needed. She eventually made a decision that was impossible for her mother to understand stern in corporates. She got it into a head that she had to convert to his Lomb because it could protect her own. Protect him will thoroughly than the religion. She grew up with India's, Costco, Kvant is. Sofia who was born into a Catholic family and used to be an altar server was sixteen when she secretly started going to the mosque less secretly, she surrounded herself with girls who her mother describes as coming from Islamic or north African and very patriarchal backgrounds. The situation at her Andrew tents fair decided to start wearing a hint scoff. She was seventeen yard. No, it's Margaret sh we saw. Sofia has two siblings. There were always discussions aways arguments. She accused us of being infidels. She used to carry the Koran around with her wherever she went on other books like the Muslim wife the Muslim marriage. Your Mitsu hunger slip. So the eventually moved out and married a Turkish man her parents had never met, but the marriage didn't last long demo. Invite Yale would on former husband wasn't devout enough for her. So she came back to us. I thought it was over that. She had come to her senses. But that wasn't the case. When Sophia turn to online Muslim marriage forms in her search for a more devout husband the tension at home escalated her father confiscated her smartphone. She dropped out of high school just before graduation and left home again. Parvo? Hunch. Peter fonda. A couple of weeks later, we learned that she had married. A Muslim man was now living in the city of minster at that time. She was wearing the niqab for flyer. Kneecap so fear has since had two children and is now pregnant with a third Monica. Regards, her daughters interpretation of how a woman should live as extremely regressive for four-plus swells. The woman stays at home and looks after the children and make sure the man's dinners on the table when he gets home. Monica Miller tries to have a normal relationship with her son in law who she describes as a fundamentalist he has twice driven to Syria for an aid organization could minutes in mid health's, which the North Rhine-Westphalia in office for the protection of the constitution regards as an extremist Salafi operation, although she also says he has now distanced himself from the group. She knows a fundamentalist families that keep that children cut off from the weld, not allowing them to sing or watch television. But she believes having kids over earn has softened so fears extremist views initially, she refused to send them today care. But now it's important for them to grow up with other children also a chance to make new friends other snitch swim causing severe doesn't have many friends because she doesn't come from around the most contractors through friends of a husband. They meet up with all the families within the family, my son in laws. Two brothers with children. The arkin. So fear used to talk about moving to an Arab country, learning Arabic and studying the Koran but Monica believes having children on her earn has changed her daughters. Thinking scrupulous monitoring orca metro as she's realized it's important to give her children a good education in this country. And that it's not so easy an Arab country, especially not for a woman. On for an of hall of his own Monica milliner longer worries that the thirties will reappear on her doorstep to inform her that her daughter is about to move to Syria. But she believes the fact that the young families apartment was searched last year while neighbor away indicates that her son-in-law is still being monitored by the state security services. Income you'll without report which was compiled by Mateusz, fun Hein. You're listening to inside Europe. I mean warnings that too much screen time, maybe linked to psychological and behavioral issues, parents are urged to restrict kids use of smartphones Thomson. Walker reveals what happened when her daughter's school tried to tempt kids away from their digital devices with an archaic card game. The I ni Fung Ihnen usually when teaches and Langat males to the parents of the charges. It's to tell them to buy a session book attend a meeting or check for knits. I'm used to that kind of missive but a couple of weeks back. I got one that cuts to the heart of a matter increasingly close to my own. Came flying into my inbox with the news that my kids clause of twelve and thirteen year olds demonstrates and unwavering and apparently unprecedented addiction to smartphones. And to flag out what it described as a miserable. Great average the connection between the two was every bit implicit and the proposed solution was to teach the kids Scott one of Germany's favourite national cod games, not so much as a means of heightening concentration, but of showing them that that's fun to be had outside the confines of the hand held devices. The collective parental response was part of fended and mocking. But on the whole that was a sense of about time to in truth. I couldn't quite see how a complex three-person cod game dreamed up in the early eighteen hundreds would offer lost tentative appeal, but I was perfectly willing to accept that might have something to do with the. Fact that I'm not much of a player. I was also happy to be proved rowing. When the follow up. How we go home with project Scott mail arrived last week. It was to say that most kids have already lost interest. Oh, well worth a try. And I mean that because given ninety six percent of seventh graders and even sixty percent of fourth graders in Germany have a smartphone that disposal, and although this puts me at risk of sounding like I'm a hundred years old, then not generally using them to expand a young minds grasping the need for motivation seems pretty important. He us how much do you need? From Scotland ten in case you like live station media once. Once stuff and most people just went up right up to ten they wouldn't they wouldn't want to live without their phone. And where were you? I see. When the same bunch of kids will asked more recently, if they'd like general French-style middle school ban on smartphones. Most were opposed they can breathe easy because that's not about to happen. Despite early reports from FRANZ that the ban that has reduced cyber harassment and his encouraging greatest June direction. But Lynn's education Senator has clearly stated that schools in the German capital should decide for themselves whether or not to regulate and for now, at least my daughter's school has ruled account she'd have been happy with the ban. She really would. And I find clarity on the issue. Refreshing. I think I'm spend too much time looking at my phone. Use it lamps. I'm never far away from my own phone, and I regularly catch myself pulling it out of my pocket when I'm waiting for the traffic lights to turn green for the bell touring at school. But I've become more aware of it since the Scott experiment, and I'm now making a more conscious effort to leave my phone alone. Amazingly the world has never changed much between my glances. So even if a clause of twelve and thirteen year olds didn't get much out of an ancient card game. I'd like to think I did without even having to play Thomson Walker for inside Europe. That's it for today. The program is produced with help from Helen Seaney, and Sarah Stephan, the sand technicians Christoph Gruber and Leonova can I'm Keith Walker. Thank you for listening. You can also subscribe to the podcast of the show on your favorite podcast provider, including signed clydes Spotify and June's inside Europe comes from Germany's international drug caster DPW in Bonn.
The New Drugstore Products Were Loving Right Now (Mascara, Skincare & More All $35 or Less!)
"The following podcast is a deer media. Production guys welcome to breaking beauty. The podcast all of the best selling beauty products and the damn good stories behind them. For your host Carleen Higgins and Jill done. Hey everyone welcome back to breaking beauty. PODCAST I'm your co host Jill done and I'm Carlene Hagan and so hopefully by now you guys know that our weekly podcast were all about the breakthrough products people an moments in beauty and given that word to beauty editors since day one. We've always wanted to deliver the damn goods on. What's really worth your money? So we really aim to separate the greats from the gimmicks here and in today's damn good segment. It's all about our top drugstore fines in twenty twenty so far the year is young but we already have our eye on some favorites Ritz. Yeah and even a couple of fails. We're going to tell you about today's some stuff. We had high hopes for that. Maybe didn't really pan out before we get into all of that. We want to just want to get caught up on some of the news of the day. The News of twenty twenty so far and curling. What's been happening? Have you been catching up. Rallying the headline is just like January. It's like what have you you been doing to entertain yourself. Well you know what you and I were talking about this morning. It's been kind of a funky January as in like people are in a funk and for good reason there's just so much going on in the world so I do think that in a lot of cases beauty is somewhere where it can kind of like lift us up and distract us from some stuff yep and Atas practically save us from the world. I would be lying if I wasn't on Amazon all night last night. Looking for face masks for my upcoming flight if you guys have a recommendation of a good good inflate mask in flight face masks to cover like Corona Virus Corona virus styles story. I thought you meant like a jelly mask girl. I got you No like I felt like Soco Glam Charlotte show. She hasn't seen one from Korea but she like and everyone's like where'd you get. Where'd you get? Where'd you get it? And then that sort of inspired me because I am going going to do some travel in the company and I was like I want that for my face but does it really. I heard it doesn't protect you from the virus or I a virus arres unless it has like the hip filter. One she has has that so i. That's what I was looking. Up At my feet from Mac Like Mountain Equipment Co op. Obviously but if you guys have one that you know when you trust a new Lavin easily find let me know yeah drop us. A line in her facebook chat room or in our Dr Alicea Very Doomsday Search. Yeah I'm like what face powder do I wanNA bite. I'm like how to protect myself from Corona virus but anyways yes this is twenty twenty okay well and if they come in packs of two I will you'll want one loudly your Your backup I'll take the backup so yeah I know I have. I've been listening to some podcast. I've been going deep down the true crime wormhole but you know I need a break. Sometimes because again it just it can get depressing depressing. Yeah right so this morning I checked out one. I believe you mentioned this one to me. Originally it's from the host of you must remember number this very popular podcast Karina Longworth and she recently launched an eight part companion series called. Make me over. Yeah and it's about the relationship between Hollywood and the beauty industry and you know it's the kind of thing that you just know how much time in research went into these stories and it really is storytelling. The she's commissioned or the network has commission different writers to go deep on all of these different topics and then the the writer narrates the story themselves So the one that I listened to was the kickoff episode about the actress Molly O'Day who underwent the first weight loss surgery surgery like way back in the nineteen twenties. And just what that entailed so as you can imagine it was like I was watching as I was driving on the highway this morning. A little little bit by. I'm picturing a lot of drainage tube. Yeah Oh yeah. Yeah so am but it's really think about what you and I have talked about about just our our love of beauty as a topic and how it can be a lens to so much more. Oh totally and really. So you're getting this you know. It's the intersection of Hollywood and beauty. And just how we see ourselves and our body and so it's like psychology and sociology. And all of that so I was taken and and I'll be interested to listen to the rest of them. Yes she does. Such an incredible job series. And I think it'll be like a viral hit. Yeah sure there is another sort of Interesting podcast Oh right now. I haven't listened to it myself but the subject of the series is Dr Frederick Brandt. He's the late Dr Frederick Brandt right and he was known the Baron of Botox. I mean in New York circles. Everyone went to him. Madonna went to him Linda Wells. whose the editor in chief velour? She openly talked about jam. I've met many many times. I'm sure you did as well. I don't know that I did actually. Yeah he also has Dr Brandt skincare. which is still around so he had a very tragic ending to his wife? Life Ray and this series sort of explores his life and what led him down the path to end his own life and so also a very heavy topic but they think it's just interesting that you're seeing kind of what you were just saying like all of these figures and the stories that they aren't just snippets on instagram stories. You can go so deep and there's so many facets to it I wanNA listen to that one yeah for sure So you guys know that were obsessed with reading the reviews that you guys leave for our show. It really helps us so much. I know he sounds like a bit of a broken record talking about reviews but frankly it helps other people. Discover our show. And that's how podcast grow is word of mouth so I just wanted it to reach you curling this one. Okay this one. So this is from at Glow Grove and thrive and she left a review on Apple podcasts. That's the best place to do it. So she says says by far the best podcast there for all of us beauty and skin care lovers. I honestly was never able to get into podcasts. No matter how hard I tried until Jilin Carleen came into my life and only have I listen to every single episode by. They have listened to multiple episodes multiple times. How I've stepped up my knowledge around a better skin care and overall auty routine and I always enjoy the loss from these two while doing so it really feels like I'm sitting around and having a glass of wine with some brilliant girlfriends even some of my friends joke okay? I'm sending Jilin Carleen a holiday card this year. I won't say I haven't thought about it just so they can see this amazing skin. They've helped me achieve through their education. Jalen Carleen thank you for everything you put into the podcast. You're chemistry is a team is phenomenal in your interviews or educational interesting and so inspiring. You're a hell of a team and I'm a Hell L. of Fan. Thank you for that. So sweet and is a card anytime yet. Resilient picture yeah things. Yeah and we'll we'll send you a pop socket. Yeah about that we We did just do that. Big giveaway for our hundredth episode for our pop sockets and those are in the mail. You guys you should receive them any day now and if you do please take a Selfie with it because we wanna see you wanna see what you look like and where you listen to your podcast and yeah and yeah take your nails. Look like when you're holding your pop socket can yeah so if you can please do leave us a review or otherwise get social with us and let us know you think of each and every episode you can leave us a voicemail as well ask any questions at eight four four two seven zero three zero two or drops a dam on instagram or breaking beat. PODCAST or join our private facebook Rupel rupaul. Link to all of these things in our show notes today and every single product we mentioned today. It's on our blog. It's always on our blog at breaking beauty podcast dot com and you'll the blog dropped down right there. We always sort of like hit you up with all of the products that we discuss. Yeah with links to buy. We're not really set up on our affiliate so we don't make money from those. Yes we probably should be but were not so. Yeah it's all like ready to go there And so do you guys want to hear about the products. We've been testing and what we've been loving so far. These are all cheap and cheerful. Drugstore buys all right. Let's get into it and now we want to take a brief break to tell you about a new show partner. Were really excited about the brand is called Noemi it's a luxury jewellery label that you can find only online. It's kind of like a best cap secret actually Joe. I was out of fashion event. This past last week it was a dinner with a bunch of other editors and I happen to be sitting beside a fashion stylist and as we're talking she clocked my new ring and ask where I got it. Because she's looking for this kind of thin really delicate ring. You know that you can stack or where Solo. Yeah we actually ordered the same ring twinsies. It's called the petite sheet diamond band minds. Eighteen karat white gold. Did you get that. I got the yellow goal right and just over a millimeter in with and it's got these fine pathway diamonds on it and I'm really minimalist when it comes to jewelry and even I love how simple this lungs. But just like that hint of sparkle. If you guys want to see it we actually made a video over on our instagram on our. ID TV so we did the whole on boxing and you guys can see what the rings look like. I literally have not taken this off since we got it goes with everything thing. I've been loving it so the thing that's special about Noemi is that you're GonNa get this amazing quality jewelry it's conflict free. Diamonds has a designer designer. Look and feel essentially. It's half the price because they're not in retail stores and they make everything themselves so there's no markup Noemi is a safe space to buy luxury St Jewelry Online. You want to know that what you're buying is authentic zone they have what's called an IGA certificate and that details color clarity and the appraisal raizal value. And whether you're buying for yourself or as a gift you can return any order for a full refund even if it's been engraved or if it's a custom design so there's literally early no risk and even shipping in the. US's completely free yes so if you're looking for quality fine jewelry that's made to last a lifetime from a luxury brand you can trust. It's it's Noemi. They have thousands of five star reviews online. We suggest you read some and see why people are raving about this company so head on over to Hello Noemi DOT dot com slash breaking beauty to see their collections. And get fifty dollars off your first purchase with Promo Code Breaking beauty that's H. E. L. L. O. N. O. E. M. I. E. dot com slash breaking beauty willing to that offer in our show notes. And don't forget to use the Promo code breaking beauty for fifty dollars off I purchase and now back. Today's episode are a Gel. So where do we WANNA star. Would've been trying and loving okay. So real talk. Today is Monday. I head Ed one of the most exhausting weekends of my life and I don't really complain about being tired very often what happened. Basically there was water damage Water damage in my apartment and he came in my ceiling. I came home from a night out at a concert and I came home and the plaster had LegCo. There was water dripping down all onto my my bad. Oh no just a real disaster moment so for the time being until it gets fixed. I literally have my mattress on my living room floor floor at the moment university style like I felt like I was at a sleepover last night but there was no friends there and there are no good snacks. Either so I just like sorta tossed and turned I have now been sleeping also looked so bad this morning. I was like everyone has been there like the Monday morning. You wake up and you're just like Oh there's no helping today. Yeah so I had just gotten these pixie beauty brightening eye patches and I thought what the Hell I had put them in my skin care fridge that I just got And so that was great because then they were chilled. So these are called the beautify brightening eyepatches there twenty four. US dollars thirty four Canadian they just launched. And there are thirty pairs in here. And so it's like a tub that you have in you sort of unscrew the top An inside are these. These pairs of Hydra gels just look like third drenched. Yep In product in serum and so. They're the Hydrogel ones which are like slippery little suckers. Yeah I uh-huh Alley. Yeah well I've tried them but this is the third iteration right. This is At least the second the they have different one. I believe it's the third so I just asked I. I double check that this is just launched in the states too and so this one is meant to just sort of like brighten. Your whole under area has vitamin C has liquorice and I was like you know what I'll try anything. That's yeah I know And you know what I really want to give a special shout out. I love when brands think of details. Because these are slippery to Kinda get on and so they have a really genius little spatula. That actually has a place for your thumb. Okay on the spatulas he can easily scoop out. The hydrogel is and get them underneath your eye. Okay sometimes with the SPATULAS. They're like yeah. It does doesn't help. No sometimes it like folds them over and rice stuck together Ernest a disaster. Yeah Yeah and so tell me about some of the key ingredients. What is you versus the other ones? So this has liquorice and vitamin C.. which are both meant to be bright? Rang out and so they are drenched in serum. So I just put them on underneath my eye and you leave them on for about ten minutes and then afterwards you just like massage judge the serum in underneath your so. I felt immediately afterwards at my eyes. Look less hollow and also. I'm just realizing right now. So that I didn't put conceal her on okay afterwards so I went from like feeling very haggard to not have to conceal her today. That's a win right so are are these like a long lasting paying are my going to be gone forever. No right but they made me feel good and I do think that the price point is amazing. What you get a lot of times is these types of products are luxury only? And they're like three times the cost so I think it is a nice perk to have especially if they're cold around the all you got that deep huffing and get that brightening yeah and everybody needs a lift like that now. I know that the previous versions basil out on a regular basis. Yes right Um So I'm sure that anyone's who's really into vitamin C.. Right now is as I don't want to give this a whirl. Yes so what have you been trying. We'll skin care wise so oh I wanted to talk about a new range from a brand that I don't talk about a lot and that is Garnier. Garnier is launching a new line. It's called bio bio in English. But in French she would say B. O.. Had Spe- I oh and it's a ten piece range. That is all EKO cert certified fide and Vegan. So that's really a big step for Garnier. I feel because they may have played in like the plant based and natural space. But they're one one of those kind of inbetween brands that it's like you don't know exactly where they said right well exactly so I feel like with this range. They're putting a a stake in the ground when it comes to organic yes and this line. I actually experienced this line for the first time in twenty eighteen I went to Paris for the worldwide launch of this line and so this has been available in Europe for a while right including the UK yeah so the US yet. I don't pink yet no it's not in the US. And I don't know when it's coming so this is one of those products are ranges. That maybe WANNA scoop up on your next visit to Oh Canada or the UK or Paris because it is really affordable so. I'm just going to pick one product. I did try the entire range the product that I personally personally liked. It's called the Garnier. -Bio Bio nourishing moisturizer. It's twenty four nine thousand nine Canadian. And it's got organic aloe Vera Hyler Kylo onic acid and then so it's all about hydration at said to give forty eight hours of hydration it's got some antioxidants in it and it's soothing. Enhance the Aloe Vera and I guess the thing with me why I haven't been the number one fan of Garnier. Skin care is the fact that I do find. It is generally quite scented and that does irritate my sensitive skin Even if it would say for sensitive skin I would I would still be bothered by it. Here's the box. If you WANNA have a look at the ingredients and years the product if you WanNa try it on your hand or whatnot and so this one I do find has verily ascent at all they do have a balancing moisturizer. That's for normal combination skin. It has a lovely texture. It's a little bit more. scented that one one so they've kind of seemed to have like peel back on the one for sensitive skin but it just has a really beautiful texture that I really like. It's not greasy not at all you know typically when you see any type of product that says right on it like this one. It's for sensitive dry skin right. You're just getting hit with like this greasy type of attacks. Her and I don't like that at all. So I think this one is really beautiful and also The one word Normal two combinations can. We've talked about this before in kind of the natural space. You don't often find Nice moisturizer. That's for oily skin. And this one has a you can if you want to test that one. The Tiger on that is really lovely as well and there's also a really big focus on recycled packaging for Garnier in this. You know where they're going. Yeah the Sustainability Element I remember. Yeah that was huge exactly so this is a really big direction. I think for the brands a whole they say that with their hero ingredients audience that are organically produced. It's with respect to bio-diversity which I think is a concern. When you're talking about ingredients like Argon yeah that could would be an issue with over harvesting? And also they're saying that it's all fair trade so when they work with The producers they are paid a fair wage. Yeah so together right. Yeah absolutely and I think that this is what's really significant about this range to me is. It's almost duping and niche indie brands. Yeah in terms of what you might see what you might get. But it's not a mass level MHM and you have to remember. That's really powerful. Yeah just the numbers of people who are shopping and drugstores. So I think it's really positive that the parent parent brand being L'OREAL says they are Investing and heading in this direction is you should check that out and I think it's exciting to see Gurney really making these moves happen. Yeah absolutely and it's just it's lovely to us like I honestly really like the texture. Yup I did find it soothing because I have sensitive skin I didn't have any redness sadness after Iran continue to use it. Yeah fantastic so I do want to talk about a skin care product that I tried that I had really high hopes for but maybe I didn't love quite so much and be curious to see what your take is because I know that we just got this at the eleventh hour and you didn't get a chance to try again yet okay. So we're talking about indeed labs watermelon melting elting bomb hydrating cleansing bomb. It's twenty four ninety nine Canadian. It's around twenty two twenty two. US It would have just launched by the time you guys listen to listen in the last week right. So it's the first cleanser from indeed labs which is kind of exciting anther ten years in the making this year the brand. Yeah and it's a Canadian brand so we talked about this line briefly last year by it actually wasn't in the US at that time. ULTA beauty picked up indeed labs this end-july so now you have access to every product that they have so obviously just going by the name. Watermelon is a key ingredient. They use watermelon seed oil and it also has hempseed oil. It's color and fragrance free. So it's really designed to remove dirt and make up while nourishing the skin and a really gentle manner. So it's supposed to be safe for sensitive skin but also safer acne prone skin it also contains an ingredient called visible well all that as soothing ingredients that often comes from Cammo Very unusual and I think the reason we are both very pumped to try this. Not a lot of cleansing bombs at the drug store so true Absolutely true and I think just the name watermelon. It's beautiful lavender tube. It really was giving me glow recipe by So so I mean it could be sort of a dupe. What is unique is the fact that it's in a tube and it's not in a tub which typically cleansing bombs are? So they're saying that this is more hygiene Sir not sticking your hand in over and over again potentially contaminating it. Let me just explain. So you're meant to put it on dry hands and put it on a dry face and then you massage it in for about a minute and it's going to start to dissolve the makeup. That's on your face and it does do that but what I found found is that when I went to then rents I mean. We talked about this in the Rene Rollo episode and her kind of hate on for cleansing bombs. And I was like no wait but when I used this product what she said came flooding back to me. And that's all the residue that's left on your face after you use a cleansing bomb and none of your products after after that are going to be able to penetrate and I just really felt like it was amiss with this product that it says nothing on the back that you need. Use a wash cloth with it right and if you don't I can't even explain to you. The thick layer of goop. That was on my face after over a minute. I'm trying to rinse it off and finally I just gave up and use the towel rates to to dry my face off. But you absolutely need to use a wash cloth which you do with most cleansing bombs but like don't assume that it should be on the instructions which a lot of clean bombs they are some of them come with Muslim claw or you need to do a second cleanse. After I was just going to say you need to do a double Abo- client is sounds to me like it's the perfect first clients to get all of that. Make up on everything off and then well it does loosen it. Yes so so what I used after was the Garnier missile. This alert rate water Mesler cleansing water so used that with a cotton round story. Joe Was not reasonable this time. I'm just using what I had from before but what I found is then you look at that round and there was a bunch of makeup on it still You know again like the claim is that it washes everything away. Okay and I was like well. There's a lot of sitting on my ipad so I don't know I feel like I am a question for you when you normally use a cleansing bomb that's more luxury price point Do you you do a second cleanse. So typically I haven't and so- Rene was the one who got me thinking about the fact of whether I wanted to. But why in fairness if you'd used used a Mr cleanser with any of those bombs to you might have had makeup on your face unknowingly. I would but what I'm saying. Is that in this. This one compared to other bombs. There's like this milky thick texture. There's way more residue left on your face. That is really hard to get off than the other bombs. uh-huh that post fair. So maybe I just needed to me that Like way too much. I'm like where's my towel. I didn't want to open my eyes. Okay you know okay And maybe that's a function of how much you use and everything but what I do want to say learning curve. Yeah What I do want to say is that indeed labs is a really a cool brand and they have a lot of great products? I just think as a gateway product try their hydro Laurent moisturizers. They're amazing they're filled with hollow onic acid. The price point point is fantastic. I know you're a big fan of the no acid pad. Yes they're really cool. That are much more gentle. The retinal reface is great. The the vitamin C.. Twenty four is great. There's got a lot of lights to the exposure later to that they. I think they reformulated it Just in the fall. And that's a great duke soup for the cleansing bullying. Powders that we talked about last week. This is pretty much again to your point the only one at drugstore that dupes exfoliating eating powders. Yeah let's pause to chat about an innovation from bioscience a treasure of a brand and one of our valued show partners curling. You know way back in two thousand eighteen one of our most popular episodes. It was up thirty one. I think it was when we dissect everything being to do with squealing totally. I remember you even went to that. Bio San's pop up. They did on a bus downtown. You're out there asking everyone if they knew. WPF's she f- square lane was. Yeah Roving reporting. It was so fun and as a quick Refresher Square lane is a mega moisturizing molecule. That's great for skin's Barrier Health Minute Senate weightless Louis locks in moisture so skin is softer and more plump and and biosciences line. It's all about scaling derived from sugarcane so the latest list innovation. Let's talk about that is the Bio San scaling plus ten percent lactic acid resurfacing night. Serum people are loving this product. I I know it sold holdout on at least one retailer online. It's Vegan Formula Super Silky texture and that lactic acid another one of those tried and proven ingredients. It's an H. A. or an Alpha hydroxy acid and it delivers a gentler. But a quick fast resurfacing. So you're GONNA wake up with more luminous skin here for it. What I I noticed? Even after one use is that it really refines the skin's texture so and I didn't notice any redness no air -tations really gentle. Yeah so I have sensitive skin and that's the same thing. I noticed that I didn't get any drawing or flaking that can somehow times happened with so stinging so it was gentler but if I just woke up in the morning even after that I use I would say my skin look more refined in radiant. GotTa love that. Yeah we have a special offer for breaking beauty listeners to try this damn good new Overnight Serum for yourselves so head to bioscience dot com to shop and use Discount Code Breaking Beauty Twenty at checkout for twenty percent off in a friendly only reminder that anytime you support one of our show partners. You're supporting us in creating this show. That's right so visit bioscience dot com and enter Code Breaking King Beauty Twenty at checkout for twenty percent off willing to it in our show notes and now back to the podcast. So what else have you been trying. Okay so I gotTA put like my lab coat on infamous one. This is the most technical product and probably the most innovative of all the formulas we are talking about today. Consider me intrigues. So this is the Laurie. Al Paris wonder underwater Lamela Rinse out eight second treatment. It's tenuous dollars and twelve ninety nine in Canada. Have you tried this. No okay so as you you can see from the top it's Basically LAMELA technology. It's kind of like taking over the hair industry has an insulin lamela treatment so lamela emily technology the way it works. It's formulated with ultralight molecules. That are ten times smaller than those found in traditional conditioners and masks. Okay and they're activated when when they come in contact with water out almost like an essence or water for your skin where the molecules are smaller so it penetrates that it actually is activated by the water in your shower okay. So when activated upon water these molecules form an ultra fine topcoat on the surface of the hair. And so what you get. Is this like hyper shiny. glasslike finish not unlike glass skin that you would see in Korea this is like glass shine and manageability for your hair okay. So it's a treatment that's right so you could use. Is it every single time that you're in the shower but at some it's not a shampoo conditioner exactly an extra stop. Yeah you shampoo your hair as usual you can use whatever shampoo normally alike and then what you WanNa do is you put this on your hair and it has a nozzle not unlike the ones you would find an at home color kit. You'll find tip nozzle. The bottle itself is two hundred milliliters. And Will you'll notice is on the side of the bottle it's like an apothecary style kind of like dark amber. Yeah yeah amber. And along the side you'll see twenty millimeter increments sort of marked out almost like a Meghan Gossamer. Yeah so what you WANNA do. Is someone like me. I have medium MM thick hair It says she is twenty M l.. So you'll be squeezing out twenty milliliters of this product. So what I do is I put it on wet hair and you put it in your hand hand and then throw it on or you put it directly on your hair. Put it directly Omega because of the nozzle and it's meant to almost be like a flash contact with your hair hence the eight seconds begins to put it on for longer right. That's how fast it works. I'll tell frigging hair. I'm so lazy with hair mask. Yeah I'm like who's got ten minutes. I'm like freezing in the shower. I don't WanNa wait. I'll do hair mask. It like this law but at home I want treatment. That's quick okay. So this goes on your hair. I put on twenty m L. after I shampooed the first thing you notice is it warms up like I poured it right onto my hair and then I used my hands to sort of massage it in and it's like I asked why that happens is and they said it's an exothermic reaction. Okay when the molecules come in contact with the water okay. I have not heard that before so. Leave it on too long. We'll your hair catch sean. Fire no it will not unless you're like around a deputy candle or something but No so it's just the eight seconds really just indicates how quickly it were brave and so for me. I use this just to as a treatment of to get that Silky glasslike shine. I did not follow it up with conditioner but many people might WanNa follow it with conditioning. It's also if you have a lot of tangles like me. Yeah and it's also different application in the sense that most treatments you do after you condition your hair This goes in the middle. Oh Andrew Shampoo this but wonder water and then commissioner if you WANNA get like skin care it's like you you WanNa have that straight contact like directly with the hair hair follicle right exactly so basically the Lamelo is kind of like missiles and missile or water. There are Lamelo and Lamar Technology and they deposit actives like Amino Acids in proteins straight to the hair. cuticle in the genius thing is that it only delivers to the area of the hair damaged and needed the most okay. So there's positive charges in the malls and those are attracted to the negative charges of hair damage. Okay so they mind those to the hair and smooth it all out exactly where it's needed needed it so fascinating. Yes I love that. It's eight seconds because I'm lazy slash busy and so at the end of the day. Did you have glass hair. Botswana's ask for me my hair type. I don't have really frizzy hair. I don't have curly hair. I don't have very processed here. The result is hair is like instantly transformed. It was way straighter way silkier right without being weighed down. That's my biggest issue with conditioners and I think people with fine hair will be really looking for our products like this okay. There's a lot of them. Just skip conditioner can entirely right. ryssdal get hair damaged from brushing her hair and just yeah wear and tear you know. It's like an lighter weight alternative to a hair treatment demand kind of smooth for his as well yeah it smooths Frizz and Lake in the in the salon like Harris offers and insolence treatment. A- LAMELA treatment and sorry. It's been something that's been insulin. And it's definitely taking off and you're going to hear more and more about it but this wonder water is really first to market innovation right in a couple. We'll just a little learning curve. Things US twenty M l.. Twenty milliliters as indicated on the bottle. But it does say that people with thicker or curl. Your hair should use forty milliliters or up to sixty million. Oh that's like a third of the bottle. Yeah so you may not want to use it every single time and I put it on in like just test the waters a little bit it to see how much you need And if you WANNA use conditioner afterwards by all means you can. I think you do have really thicker. Curly hair your you probably will right okay and I won't Overdo or do it. No that's right and I just found like yeah. My hair was Very Silky very shiny. I'm going to show you the box because there are some images of before and after is on the ball. Wow Oh oh do indicate how well it works but there is a learning curve to using it. Let's talk about some of the makeup products. We've been loving so far. Yes I WANNA shout shoutout one that I think is really fun. It is uplifting upon site It's the next cosmetic. Sabrina the chilling adventures of Sabrina. Marina is shadow. Spell Book Make Pallet Mouth Fall. It's thirty five and forty five Canadian and it just went on counter last week And I've got it here. I know that you and I saw it in person but just as a reminder it is so beautiful it's quite large. It's almost the size of a small notebook. Like like if I guess if a piece of paper is eight and a half by eleven. It's probably like six by seven or something like it is large not as I have no idea But it looks like a spell book inside like it's got all these little glimpse and you know obviously reminiscent of the show tells you are those glimpse inside not recommendations of the shadows to where together together for different spells. They were saying Oh. I didn't put that together Ashley. That's smarter isn't that funny so the look has to spell enough the ex boyfriend where the rideau some of the names of the Yes. So of course. This is all based on the Netflix. Show with cure an in shape guy and I think this is really smart. Art because the euphoria show popped off and like lead to total trend. So I feel like it's almost capitalizing on that so it has thirty pans of newly newly formulated our shadows and I think that's important to mention because so many pallets are like an amalgamation existing shades. These are all new shades which is really cool? One thing I will say is that if you read the tiny tiny fine print on the back five of these quote unquote is shadow. Shades are press powders that are not not meant to be worn near. Is We learn about this in our caller pop episodes. So I don't know where you're GONNA put this red press pool and the hot painting while they have to make that disclaimer. But let's get real. Most people probably wearing them around the is so true and then it has three Sheikh Pans at the bottom is wall so that's a lot of pans of color for the money and I'll tell you about the ones that I've been wearing. So one is called Mortuary K.. And it's dusty Mauve rose and I wearing worrying that today right here with the one right beside it. It's called eternal bliss and it's kind of like a rose dusty rose shimmer and On the weekend they were this one called dark carnival which is like an iridescent kind of peacock too black color rate It's one of those shades says like difficult to pinpoint what it is and it looks Kinda different in different light and there's like an orange one in here that's called Devil's work and there's also a green called frog legs which I I think is really fun because it green is probably really the most underrepresented makeup color gains in the world of beauty. Let's be real And so so I think it's really great that they have one here like there's just a lot of out of the box shades that I really want to like get into and play where it can. I see yeah yeah. This is a hot commodity. You guys and it's how smart is it. That netflix is doing a makeup collaboration. Like there needs to be like a tab on Netflix to just shop merch. Yeah Yeah because like I would buy cheer sweater from Jerry Did you watch the documentary. Bonilla leader I didn't. I'm obsessed with sex education right now and I. I would wear that T. Shirt all day long. It's so good so there's one here that's called many charm. and that's the shades are Salem and dark carnival that you just mentioned and limbo. Oh Okay Yeah. Everything's just like casting a spell. It's really cool. This is going to sell out to put my glasses on and actually recommended combos adding up your Vanity Idiots still still a work in progress so true and so yeah I think that it's all very like enchanting and bewitching and I feel like for the price this is just a bundle of fun yeah it really is. You're up your February. What about you in the world of makeup? What do you let go? I'm GonNa talk about an eye shadow palate to this. It does not have like bright colors at all. It's actually a neutral shadow pallet. Who doesn't need one of those never still always searching for great news? I have so many pallets but I always dip into new neutral Palette so this one lately there's so many different nuance is it gonNA look muddy for two ash-shihr Chaki sailing. Yeah so this one is from Mabley New York. It's called the nudes of New York. It's thirteen ninety nine. US dollars at seventeen ninety nine Canadian and there are sixteen different shades in this pallet. I I saw this I believe Casey Muss Graves who. I'm obsessed with her. Makeup artists. Used it on her for an award show back in November and You might think. Oh this is just another nude palate but what's newsworthy. And what caught my attention. And Caroline's is that the first pallet custom designed to flatter for a wide range of skin tones. Okay so You might remember a few years ago. Like abeline created the red for all lipstick line and there were seven shades in that each of those seven red lipsticks was tested on fifty. Different Skin tones. So they've taken a patron that with this particular Palette that are all or just nudes. There's some Shimer's there's some mats there's The Champagne Konak collars these these like dark. Chocolate kind of colors gold's green golds olds and they've made sure that they look good and that they show up on every skin tone right so maybe the first at masses you means to tackle like all skin tones in one unpalatable a verse from the ramp. Okay so what I think is really impressive. Is that a lot of times nude pallets at the drugstore. There's a lot of pigment fallout. The pigment. Payoff is not there and worst of all on dark skin tone they look really chalky or they can look really dull the call. It's just like why would it on yellow I I I did. I tried it myself. I really vouch for the quality of the shades and then I also did some research online to see the swatches on women of color and you they do show up there and create a lot of beautiful looks with that and I see of course So like I mentioned there are sixteen Hughes and I just think in general right now as a brand maybelline salinas killing it. Yeah they've had some really good launch. Yes I would. I agree in the past everything I tried from them at the drugstore this this time around from their policies slash lift Mascara. You tried that too. It was quite good. They have this genius new liquid eyeliner. That is a hexagonal shape. The Pencil itself is a hexagonal shape. So it doesn't slipping Zaire hand. John Handle it holds still so you can get that liquid liner on. Well I wanNA tell you mention the lashof Mascara for maybelline. I did try about one knows quite good another Mascara that I'm really liking right now. It's the BIRT's B.'s all aflutter volume izing Mascara. It landed in stores in January. It's twelve ninety. Nine and thirteen ninety. Nine Canadian comes in three shades. Black Brown and Navy so birds. Bees launched their first Mascara I called the nourishing Mascara Moscow back in two thousand seventeen and that really focused on lengthening and defining and I I gave that when Kudos because it was really good doesn't smudge at all in in my experience and it's just like a great every day Mascara that like I said it's easy to wash off your it doesn't smudge like it's that's kind of a dream for so many women like like me. It has nourishing B.'s walks in Hobart oil. So it's not gonNA be Vegan but it is meant to be good for sensitive is as well so hypoallergenic neck opthalmologist tested no parabens pilates or petroleum in the making of the product and not tested on animals. So has all those qualities going for it. This new one. Obviously he just going by the name is volume izing. So that's what I had said about the original as it's a subtle luck but I like that it just kind of did its job right. So this one's GonNa Review Review Eight. Now Yeah it looks great. So this one's going to give you more volume so it's basically like the bird species. God's listened to what I said and they were like okay. Let's make them more volume izing when they actually have have another foreign one. That's meant to do four different Lake Curl and define and all that stuff but I think I lost that one so the volume izing Mascara. I do recommend now one thing I will say about it is. This is one of the funniest packages that I've seen in a while. I think this is like but ugly. Oh it's just like it's dark doc Brown on one side Wedlake a gray pewter on the other so it just and the shape is like bazaar just doesn't have anything like again if you look at a typical like maybe lean like I love the colossal bright yellow or you know or just like something else that has more sophistication however tradeoff for purpose right. Yeah so what I'm GonNa say is probably the reason for that. Is that this Mascara is made from eighty one percent post consumer recycled content. That's a win. That's amazing. Eighty eighty one percent. Yeah that's a really high like a lot of products will try to use post consumer recycled content. And it's like twenty one percent something like the I like. This is almost completely you know so. I think that that is a win. They As a brand have been carbon neutral certified since twenty fifteen meaning being. They haven't said anything to the landfill. That's incredible and they also in November launched with Tara cycle so you can download a shipping label able and send your products back to be properly recycled and they do sort them separate them and make sure that they are being properly recycled and and I just want to do a quick other shoutout to another birthdays products that I have been using all lot and loving since I got back in November it just launched and it's the birds bees defining eyeliner k the shade. That I like. I really like as called gilded sage. It's again twelve ninety nine super inexpensive. It's a gorgeous bronzes green so again going back to that color I feel like people are talking about that right now. It's like. How often do you see? Just this really lovely kind kind of green. Bronx Watch that you just did. This is not the right way brought along shaded. I'm sorry I thought it was like a foresty one it it is. It's kind of like a ED bronze e green and I do think green is one of those things where you have to get the right shade to make it. Look good on your eyes and not just one that's really like I was talking about the To the makeup artist on an event and it's very versatile on a variety of skin tones I colors and it's just something a little different and I have found myself using it as my last stop in almost any our shadow kind of configuration. I've been using to go out at night and it just like completes the luck. Yeah and it's so much softer than a black rate. Eight site like a little bit more sophisticated than a brown. Yeah so yeah I've been using it alive Well it's interesting to me that the products you talked about like at least half are basically like really moving the needle on the echo front. Yeah for sure and Jessica tells you about where we are in the industry right now on where we're gonNA continue to grow in and see more of that happening at the drugstore. Absolutely I totally agree with you. I think that's what we're starting to see is. Is this inspiration from in India brands. That starting to finally these big conglomerates that take so long to make a move yeah are starting to make moves and thus really exciting exciting going into a new decade. Yeah and there's going to be more launches to calm. This is what we got our hands on and had time to test for right now but We will obviously every single month. We we try to bring you these damn good episodes so let us know if there's something else you've seen on the drugstore shelves that you want us to test any topics that you want us to do really deep dives on for Product reviews we will test it all. Yeah so thank you guys once again. Everything we mentioned today is on our blog at breaking beauty. PODCASTS DOT COM. Join US on instagram. Grandma breaking media podcast or join our facebook chat room where we have a lot of fun conversations and we will see you next week. Thanks thanks for tuning in visit breaking beauty. PODCASTS DOT COM for details on all the damn good products. We talked about in today's episode and be sure to sign up for our newsletter. That way you'll get every episode delivered right to your inbox. You won't miss a single thing or subscribe to us on Apple podcasts. spotify stitcher Google play wherever you get your podcast fix and please show some love by rating us or review us in. It CENEX time
Fredy and Mies
"I feel like. I spent the last three four years trying to learn how to be an organizer. Like a you know and then you there. There are actually tools and things you can learn and then there are certain things from the world of graphic design that kind of lend themselves well and so now. I'm trying to kind of like step back and think about you know. A role is designed play but also look at the labor of graphic designers or the labor of designers from the harvard graduate school of design. This is future of the american city conversations. On how we live where we live today with daniels a graphic designer interested in the means of production and the labour. Daniel joins us today to discuss her work on in detroit. Danielle walk thank you. Thanks for having me so among the many projects you've been engaged in recently. I know you've been doing research on the work of fredy perlman and the detroit. Printing co operative who was fredy perlman. Fredy perlman was a leftist. He kind of relisted any kind of labels but he was interesting to me because he's sort of like leftist thinker and writer who got really interested in printing opened the sprinting cooperative. That was like this site where anybody could print for free as long as you learn to use the machines and kind of maintain them you sort of opened it with a group of people but he got really interested in print technology and started experimenting with ways of putting together books and like hamlets and things and so at certain point. I got interested in. Like detroit's graphic design history and trying to figure out you know. Detroit is in a place where we have a ton of like universities or schools. Necessarily that are doing graphic design. There's cranbrook academy of art which is like forty five minutes away. The college for creative studies in detroit but like when we talk about graphic design history in the. Us it's usually organized around what can oriented around east coast or west coast. So i started to look for detroit. Scrapped busying history. I came on freddie. Romans work which you know. He's totally untrained. Was like really interesting to me because it was sort of political but also just like very idiosyncratic. That's sort of how i started to research it. But but he's mostly known as a sort of like anarchist writer anarchist thinker specifically and our go primitivism and he and his wife lori and prominent founded black inbred press which published tons of books in. He's he passed away. Eighty bay his way still keeps black and red press going today. The notion of the detroit cooperative press obviously extended well beyond the perlman's so what kinds of things what kind of people were involved in that coa only be here. Yeah i shouldn't. Maybe i can give like a sort of chronology a little bit. So basically free pro. Men came to detroit in nineteen sixty nine with his wife lorraine so he was not originally from year but he had an appointment at a western michigan university as an economics professor for a couple of years and then moved to detroit in sixty-nine at a time when it felt like kind of there was revolutionary potential of the city there had been the uprising sixty seven and there's a lot of activity going on around unions. The league of revolutionary black workers was active in. The city was a black panthers party than there were like through the publication the fifth estate which is also going to now. It's called like an anarchist. The location at the time. I think they identified themselves that way but so they moved to detroit and kind of mit some other like minded people and decided to step set up what they called at the time of revolutionary printing. Cooperative where they wanted to print they were printing pamphlets and things that they were writing but they were also kind of working alongside members of sds students for democratic society. And like at that time it was really important to be able to print in order to get your message out or whatever you know so there are still there was actually Owns like censorship but like printers weren't always willing to print certain kinds of things because it could get them into trouble so when freddie and lorraine prompted moved to detroit the kind of like set network of places where they could produce pamphlets so there was a god one place where they would do the typesetting in someplace else they would do the printing and then at the end of sixty nine they found out a used offset press that they could get access to and then they collected funds kind of borrowed money and then a group of about six six or seven people set up this trade printing co op and that ended up running from nineteen seventy nine one thousand nine hundred eighty and so didn't really have official members but they had more what they called users and it was like they kind of resist. They didn't want to be a part of any kind of political party or anything like that but they were like committed to being like nonprofit also they also became members of the i w w industrial workers of the world and so they created this lake logo like kind of like printers label that says abolish the wage system on power to the workers that they printed on everything that they put out and they considered the property at the co op to be like erlich considered the machines to be social property so like anybody could use whatever they wanted as long as they kind of helped keep it up some of the groups that came through there where members of the league of revolutionary black workers which was like this. I can talk about them a little bit later. But they were like the group of that had come out of the car. Factories sort of this like marxist leninists kind of militant group within the labor union that was sort of resisting. Uaw leadership which at the time was a conservative and white dominated by white people. So they kind of it was like a group of link militant black workers that started the screwed. Some of them were using the print facilities. But but there's only one small allow people from the fifth estate raising at members of students for democratic society. And then just other random people among many other things came out of the co op. In that decade. I understand the first english translation of debord cited spectacle for example just to give our listeners. Some sense of some of the actual commitments yet. That's actually how i came into this project was. I didn't like so there's a first. English translation A society spectacle was printed at the co-op and they also did. The translation was like a unauthorized translation. It's like an addition that a lot of people are kind of familiar with. It has a picture on the cover of people sitting in a theater with three glasses on and that was just a picture that one of the founders decided to use all the images that are used with without rights. but it's but it's interesting because french edition the gables. Original french copy is like kind of like very Cidade has no images of classical typography but then they did the us edition they brought in images that they put that they kind of like used to illustrate the text in a way and then that ended up being really like the the only copy that circulated in english until the ninety s when like another translation came out. So those the copy that. I kind of recognize surprising to me to find out that that was actually printed industry. That was certainly the addition that i encountered in grad school. Right when i i was exposed to bore. And so what's so powerful daniel. The story is the notion of the the means of production in a city like detroit. That of course has been compared to you. Know as as much as any other american city a place in which you know. labor rights labor union labor organizing have been at the forefront. But the means of production that there was a surplus offset printing rig available and that could then be made in a kind of kind of cooperative and arctic forum to all number of users. I think is fantastic. Entry point so so. This is a research project that you develop some time in. It took the form of an exhibition. So tell us about this exhibition. And and what were the choices faced. Who were the audience exhibition so that we might understand how you interpreted the work of pearlman and his collaborators. A i became aware of this work at an exhibition. That was in hamtramck organized by steve. Panton who had a gallery. In his apartment in hamtramck it was on edwin street and it was like or ben weekends whatever and he had put together a lot of the black and red publications and i saw society of the spectacle there and then some other books that spoke called manual for revolutionary meteors which was actually written by freddie and lowering roman under a pseudonym michael belly. And then there's another book called incoherence of the intellectual will do very heavily illustrated those on this play. And i saw though than i thought like. I just thought it was interesting. Because i had never seen these before. But there was like so much care and attention was given to printing them and then lorraine perlman was. Was there one of the days that i visited the exhibition. So i i like kinda became aware of it. Then and i spoke to steve panton jury that show about it and i was like interesting to look at this from the respective of graphic design in black and red is just like very well known i think among i wasn't that familiar with that press but really like if you're like active on the left or like reading a lot of left stop. People know it because they translated a lot of texts that weren't otherwise available in the us society in spectacle the most thing that circulated the most widely but there were like a lot of other texts. That can people knew so. I was like you know. Be interesting to look at it from the perspective of graphic design. Then he kind of encouraged me over the years. He's like you should really do that. We talked about that. Let's do a show like a few years later. He had another show he had another. He moved into a proper gallery. Space called nine hundred three eight campo in dramatic and then he held meet laurien promo ends and talk to her about what she was doing. And i became interested in actually at the co-op itself as a site of production. So like not just the things that black and red printed but like all of the groups that printed. They're trying to think because a lot of times. When you look at publications you can search by author or by publisher sometimes by designer but to search printing location as hard Is not information cataloged. But they had this crazy bug. Union that says like abolish the wage system. Abolish the state's power to the workers. And i had actually seen that bug before you know it always been like. What is that about it so anyway. I decided to organize the whole show around the bug and like instead of trying to think like okay if they were trying to be non hierarchical in the way that they set up their coop. How that translate in visually you know what does like the visual manifestation of like a place that's opposed to the wage system. Look like in. Does it look like something specific or what and it also ends up so it kinda ended up being like this record of like a snapshot of this political history of detroit and fredy perlman's things are kind of the most like mental things that were printed there. But there's a number of other things that are just kind of these oddball things that were printed there. That was into like for instance. There was as one. There's like this said of newsletters that were presented by a group. That was a group of architects and engineers. Were trying to organize of like a union within detroit's among detroit's people who work in architecture studios here and i don't think it succeeded but there's this record and this these newsletters called the noman but it's all written like under pseudonyms actually don't know who was publishing things but they have these critiques of like of like development projects that were happening downtown at the time lake. Blue cross blue shields building. Which is still there. This little can take down on that building so by bug for our listeners. You're referring to the co ops kind of logo there kind of imprint. They're kind stamp this thing that how would they use it. Where would that appear. Yes oh anything. That was pretty of the co-op would have that on it. It's not a logo exactly but it's something that's used in union print shops so if you ever get any kind of like political sign normally if it's printed at a union shop it'll they'll print this little label in tiny usually and it says like allied predicted it just means that like all stages of production road by unionized workers is would be all those low those lawn signs right so all of the political lawn signs are i mean and so like union shops. Don't always include that bug on it but if you ask for it they'll put it on it but if you're non union you can't put that bug on it and it's basically like a stamp said kato marks the type of labor that went into making something but then the co op members joined the i w w which is like the pretty alternative type of union. It's different from traditional trade unions. it's more radical more kind of invested in direct action and global committed to the left globalia. Yeah yeah it's basically like all workers belong to the same union so it has kind of these. It has this big the wheel of industry thing in like the print communications one category so the co-op it had it must have had space somewhere in the city so to what was it physical space in the city yet. So they were in a southwest detroit. And i think it was on michigan avenue like michigan vine would of people who city and the building's not there anymore but in fact the reason they closed in nineteen eighty was because the building owner sold to sell the building and then it was raised after that so lorraine from describes it as just sort of cavernous unpleasant sounds like it like leaked and stuff. They got the space quickly because they had. They got the printer before they got the space so they kind of like one group of people went to pick up the printer and the other had to like secure a location and the building that they were in from my understanding it must have had two stories or it had two stories at least because upstairs was the printer was a for the radical education project. Which was the students for a democratic society. Like printing arm in. They had been in ann arbor michigan which is like forty five minutes away they had been in ann arbor up until like sixteen nine and then they moved to detroit because everybody was sort of trying to move to detroit which would be like where the working class revolution could happen. But it sounds like it wasn't nice. Laurien says she talked a lot about how like. Actually the work was difficult. Word is gonna dirty but it sounds like it was colegio like there was it was like there were a lot of people coming. In and out and people had good conversations had like fun printing but timely story couldn't be more timely for the range of the range of issues that we're confronting with today in the american city but i'm taken by this image of the securing of the surplus printing press as the means of production. That's the kind of launching of this venue for disseminating a range of viewpoints and in some ways the history of printing suggests that now i mean is it too much to read into the printing press in its history as as a vehicle for the dissemination of ideas that are both endorsed and otherwise new. It's actually totally that. The connection between printing and politics is really rich and mystery so like like one of the things that it's like a bunch of things related to this but one of the things i learned more about. While i was researching the printing cobb was just a connection between anarchism and printing. Mike how there's like all this sort of tropes about anarchists being really do predict longtime so there's an old anarchist printer named joseph abadi. There's a collection of a in the archives. At the university of michigan eleven collection does name for joe celebrity who was like a guest liga pretty well known guest But also there's also this sort of wake. Long time connection between anarchists using old printers like old broken down burners so the printing co had this press that it was actually a fifty year old press so even when they got it was difficult to use at a lot of the things that they print are kind of like. they're badly predicted. This is a long history of the anarchists using printers. That don't really work to print their stuff and get it out but but another thing is is that. There's this episode that i became interested in in detroit. Printing history around a the league of revolutionary black workers who who is the sort way you know labor militant labor group. Some of those members were predicting. This newspaper called inner-city voice for a while and that group was having trouble printing it in detroit. So they couldn't they would print it. Someplace in that printer would get raided by like fbi. Then they would have to move to another printer and printer started to turn down printing inner-city ways where eventually they had to get it printed in chicago and there's a sort of like anecdote that's told in his book detroit. I do mind dying about how they able to jump from printer to printer in detroit until the international typographical union. It you which was like the union of people affiliated with like sprinters decided that they would refuse to print intercity voice so basically the union and kind of took the reactionary position a to print this black use paper which drove them to have to chicago. So as kind of interested in this moment of the it. You being kind of like a conservative force. But there's a lot of interesting connections between you know labor activism printing anarchism of alternative printing. And then it kinda plays out in the dry suits in yellen in your work. I wonder beyond the fredy perlman in the detroit. Printing cooperative story. Have you run across other histories in a city like detroit in which the kind of visual production graphic. The kind of the visual imagery of the city comes to the forum. I'm i'm struck by the vibrancy of detroit's visual culture in our conversations with folks in detroit we've learned a lot about the history and tradition of street art. We've learned quite a lot. Obviously about the various forms of cultural production. But it strikes me. If i if i look at your work. I look at the work of the people that you've been researching. There is an absolutely specific of energy and vibrancy and the the visual description of detroit or the visual culture of detroit. And you could say something. The having made the decision to to move detroit. Yourself is a graphic designer. Yeah that's a good question. Because that's something i've been thinking about. I think since i moved here in two thousand and five one of the things that struck me right away win a moved here was the way that detroit was in a way removed from some of the places i was coming from because i had gone to yale and most of my friends moved to new york or los angeles and i wanted to move to new york but my partner had gotten a job at wayne state university in the english department. So you know. I was like okay. We'll go to detroit. I had never really thought about detroit before. That didn't we didn't have a connection year and when i got here i was struck by just how much of the graphic design world is really situated around like capital cities. You know like there's like is global capital cities. That's all the wealth is. That's where all the clients are and that's where all the cultural productions happening like. You know the tv stations the magazines that everything you do something you do like. Let's graphic design work for the whitney in new york and it gets amplified immediately. You know i mean everybody sees it but it's also like it just goes into the media machine is like out there and then in detroit especially at that time in two thousand and five you know it felt like you're like outside of this outside of that circuit and i was searching for the local visual culture like what is happening year And so some of the things you know. I've always been interested in like us. Whatever so my partner. And i we both of us would like go to the used bookstores. And we would see a lot of these oracle pamphlets things like that things that were would have been printed. A the detroit printing cooper places like sun press. There's other you know other places broadside which is like this Independent black run like a magazi- forgery publisher broadside press had like a lot of templates but like in terms of leg local. Detroit graphic design. When i got here there weren't really any design studios or late and should say there weren't any but there were very few you know and it's still kind of the case. I mean there's definitely more now but it's definitely tied to capitol like it's tied to money and so as like money has started to flow back into detroit since the bankruptcy in twenty thirteen at phil ache all of the kind of late appendages of started to build up like the studios and kind of practices. You know it's it's become a space with these kinds of things can exist but it's it's it's hard to. It's sort of hard to put your finger honest pacific. I'd say light graphic design language. That's here in detroit. You've touched on the role of capital since the bankruptcy in the city. Twenty thirteen you've seen over. The course of the past. Fifteen years city changed quite dramatically. So how is the the visual culture or the. The image of the city changed in that period of time and in your experience to say is changed a lot. You know like from two thousand five through. Maybe two thousand and so i got here. Two dozen five. Two thousand eight was foreclosure crisis and then two thousand thirteen was the bankruptcy and so for that period two thousand five to two thousand and thirteen and really felt like flowing out of the city. You know the pie. Overall population was going down. I remember the statistic In two thousand and ten where it was like they did. The said systems the only city that had lost more population than detroit was Wore orleans after katrina and you know they they kind of like did a survey was like most people were than fifty percent of people would leave detroit if they could. They had the means. So you can feel that you and i think like when you're asking about the visual culture on kind of maybe thinking abstractly like kind of about just the buildings which is the way it felt like walking around and it felt kinda heavy and like abandoned. You use the word. It felt like things were just like going out. You know just like things. Weren't the street lights. Weren't really working so now since two thousand thirteen since the bankruptcy there's kind of money coming in and we're getting more of these new developments like these kind of new constructions and like branded developments and it feels sort of like glossy or something and if the fake you know like it doesn't feel authentic and so and so. I think there's this kind of weird ambivalence where you're like. It's not like before was difficult but then now it also feels sort of like Like it's not of detroit. It feels like these things are kind of getting transplanted. I mean there's one thing that i've talked about with red before which is like sometimes i feel like being in detroit but like i'll sometimes get contacted by people who are not in detroit who are submitting proposals for new developments in detroit and they need like a local person to represent you know to be on their team and i always feel like sort of like ambivalent about that too because it just feels like the world's attention has come onto detroit. Detroit is like where you can kind of invest in speculate and so people are like looking. They're they're like we don't want to parachute in and we just want to make sure that we're like respecting what's going on in the city. But at the same time they have no connection to the city and so but it feels like. There's a lot of that going on a lot of people from outside or people who are here but been trained outside detroit which include myself in that group. Were kind of like coming up with ideas for how to shape the city and how it should look. It feels a bit like you know authentic or something so yeah. What other kinds of work are you doing. What the projects are you engaged in. That might be interesting to talk a little bit about in in the sense of so you say that you often get calls from teams are offshore offsite parachuting in their part of international design teams. Now that designers are are all kind of focusing on detroit's what are the kinds of projects. Are you engaged in. What is your practice. Look like these days. If you're not working with those teams yeah. I shouldn't say it happens that often. But it's something that has happened. So i kind of shifted away from a lot of client work a few years ago inserted doing sort of like coincides with doing the work on the printing off that research and sort of switched to more researched based work. But also. Because i teach at wayne state so i have like a full time teaching job but i also started kind of getting more involved in clinical activism like after trump was elected Like i think a lot of people did it so over the last three or four years. I actually spent a lot of time trying to get a handle on the political landscape in detroit. Trying to out what all the different groups are like. Who's doing what and then not necessarily as a designer. You know just like as a person. But then i have this design skill you know so then i started using of course you kind of end up doing graphic design for all these groups or like you start providing graphics for people and then and then so so lately. I'm trying to think about how graphic designers not as in detroit but like everywhere kind of engage with the left. And what does it mean to be kind of like leftist graphic designer. Can you give us an example of one of those groups or one of those projects. Yes so i was very involved with the democratic socialists of america the dsa which has a pretty active chapter in detroit. It's like one of the older chapters in the country. I'm also a member of my union like at wayne state. It's a a. Up is also afc. The american federation of teachers which is like one of the biggest unions and then or since you know the black lives matter protests asserted to kind of meet those people when people that are kind of organizing those in detroit which in detroit. It's it's a group. Called detroit will breathe and they have kind of. Maybe the interesting for you. But they've also kind of a lot of the key leaders. There have been very active in housing rights activism. So through this group called detroit render city and some of the people that are also part of charlevoix villages association which is kind of the block club. That's become uncommon activist group that sort of resisting development in in detroit in the neighborhood that's now called is sometimes i feel like i. After trump was elected. You know like i tried to. I wanted to. I people you want wanna do something. You marches and you're like let me make a poster or whatever it doesn't feel like enough for like then let me make a flyer to promote the protest. That's about to happen but then that also doesn't want bill enough so then you can get deeper and deeper into organizing and so ah got a lot more kind of involved like the labor hooman indeed and then these various activist groups and so now. I'm trying to kind of like step back and think about you know a what role does graphic design play but also look at the labor of graphic designers or the labor of designers. You know is there a way to organize designers as a class. I think things have really changed since like the nineties. What you when. I started when i first became a graphic designer. Seemed like you know there was magazines like add busters or lake guerrilla girls. That act up there was like kind of that motive activism around grab make design but i feel like materially changed. So yeah so anyway. That's kind of what i'm thinking about now. So just just to build on that you know the we again by speaking about the printing press and this kind of tradition kind of tradition in which the access to the printing press becomes an important vehicle both for literary production pamphlets and broadsides and other things so did democratization if that's the term to use or the kind of the lowering of the bar to access to the means of production effect with a simple laptop and a printer people now have you know can avail themselves of all sorts of tools and techniques. Has that you know. Have you seen that in your experience. Produce more information or kind democratization of the voices that are being held. Heard an detroit. Or what in your estimation has been that the result of that transformation that now that we all have on the tools that we have available. We can all be amateurs graphic designers. Yeah well yeah no. That's one of the things that i am kind of. You know trying to reflect on the fact that you really first of all. You don't really need predict flyers. You know like you just need instagram posts. Stern people out to things but also that like a lot of times the most effective fires or graphics or whatever they're produced by somebody who was one of the main organisers of an event. It doesn't really matter whether they have graphic design skills and so they kind of like. I mean i shouldn't say it doesn't matter at all but i feel like with just some really rudimentary abilities. You can put things together and then had this conversation with a friend who designed this Sort of like beautiful zine that sort of like with tax that were authored by different people should have been bombed an active in detroit and they had they had created zine to pass out of some of the summer protests black lives matter protests but then when the other people in her group so determined it was like chew beautiful to distribute newsprint on rizza graph printer. And they were like this is too nice. Can't give this out for free and it had all these texts about like you know about like why protests now in about political texts that people had written but we were just talking about. That was just funny. He was like if you design something. That's too nice. You don't wanna give it out anymore. So kind of has to be like signed a in a report to be useful. So yeah and i think any of the other thing we were. I've talked about with another friend. Who's a who's a. She was a member of dsa California and she's been working closely with nurses the nurses union out there and she was talking about how they tried to. They've been trying to train people to us canada or like these sort of free tools like free app so that they can design their own fires for protests because the most important things to just be able to turn around quickly and then so it's like trying to teach people like the basic skills as sort of enough is like really what's what's more kind of affected were more necessary than designing some amazing thing so i mean among the recent projects you've been engaged in three or practices many kind of directly working with The united auto workers and other labor organizations with respect to political change on the ground in detroit. So tell us about one of those recent projects. This is what i think about it because at wayne state because i teach at wayne state. I'm a member of the union. you know. So as a as an academic which is not as a graphic designer but as an academic. But i think very few graphic designers are members you know like but then as an like organizers you know in terms of organising i feel like i spent the last three four years kind of actually like trying to learn how to be organizer like a. You know there are actually tools and things you can learn and then there are certain things from the world of graphic design that lend themselves well like i come as being part of the dsa and like kind of participating and other local groups. I did realize that. I do have a certain skill set. That's lake like i can do google forms and all those things really easily. You know which for other people like. It's not easy for everybody. So i'm like okay. Like maybe i should take evenly. Spread sheet stop by strategic these tools. Ticket advantage of that. I mean and then there were other things. Where like 'cause. I know how to do graphic design and produce printed things even though you can say those printed things are not as useful as they once were. There are still moments where a really useful like fall of. Uaw went on strike. And they've they didn't have enough signs so the start of the so they hadn't really planned on going on strike and so at the start of the strike. They didn't have enough signs in their members of the essay who were auto workers who wanted signs that said like it was like it was like about the tier system. They wanted to abolish the tier system. Because basically like workers who had come in since the last contract. We're getting paid less than the old workers so they were saying everyone tier one. They wanted assigned. They wanted the negotiations to kind of be oriented around a how much people were getting paid. But also guaranteeing that newly employed workers could get paid get the same benefits from people who were hired before before two thousand nine something like that. I was able to work with the local screen. Printing plays kind of screen printing. Kind of co-op ocelot And make these signs like in like in like twenty four hours. We turn them around. You know just because like. I know where you can get card stock and i know where you then. I knew that these guys would be willing to print for free. And so then all of a sudden everyone had these everyone tier one sides so then all the national media you know like bernie came to visit and people had everyone tier one signs. You know that they were holding up and it was because we had made them. Yeah anyway because it'd be people believe in that but the actual you we w didn't really stand behind that message but still i felt like that was. The woman was like okay as a graphic designer. I do have a certain set of skills. But as a designed to sign it was so simple as the texts. Find a narrow typeface that it could fit like really large on sign. So daniel i i encountered you and your work Now almost a decade ago through this a publication That you and your co editors produced title. Thanks for the view. Mr meese describing your experience of lafayette park where you're not only a co editor of that volume but also a resident. How did you come to be interested in lafayette park as a subject matter for your own research. Well i moved to detroit in two thousand and five and my partner and i Neither of us from the area and we you know we knew that there was this muse monroe kind of development in the city of heard about it. Then you realize we could actually live in it which seemed to us kind of somehow somehow. Couldn't believe it so. Yeah we just visited moved into the lafayette towers and we lived there as renters for several years. And then move down into the townhouses. We bought a townhouse. I started doing the research on the project in I guess officially like in two thousand nine. But i had a friend it from graduate school. Who lived in croatia and another friend who lives in brooklyn. Lana kumar and natasha johnny. And basically the three of us talked about trying to do project together. We felt like lana in croatia. Immune detroit we both felt like we were kind of like the margins or something like everybody else was rothe either new Or whatever and so we talked about doing a project about police. Sort of just generically. And i think when we started we were almost thinking almost like a kind of a academic exercise or something. Just something to kind of keep us working together and doing something we wanted to do. That was less alienating than linked the client projects that we were in goblin and so we thought okay. Let's do a project around lafayette park. Because lana had come to visit me and she had she come from. Europe was just also dislike kind of amazed that i lived in a newsvendor row apartment and not only that i rented an apartment on the same floor to us as may studio four hundred dollars a month you know so she just seemed like so extravagant that like we live in you know i had the means to replace that we lived in and then also just like could work in the place it down the hall that know like an apartment that we have. We didn't have a living so we sort of started with that that we have said. Oh maybe we'll do like a magazine or something and we'll just interview people who live here and we knew yearbook because when we moved here. That was the only book people that was out that it was around on lafayette park. So everybody who lived here. Had a copy of your book case the book. Yes oh so that was like so then so then yeah so then we had a copy of that and and i think also because we were new detroit and detroit is a very interesting city. You know like i mean. I'm sure as sure. But he's listening rises like as soon as we got here. We tried to get whatever we could find about the city and then then we thought okay. we'll do. We're not architects graphic designers. But we'll just do something from the point of view of the residents because we don't really know about mies van der i mean. That was the only part we were kind of nervous about that. We didn't feel like authorities on architecture or on knees so we will talk to the residence and then that's kind of how it started but then the more content got the more we kind of ended up like turning into a book project because it was just a lot of good material that we were getting so we worked on it for like three years before it finally came out. And while new disclaim you. And your co editors were not experts in history or vendor of you certainly had expertise residents and for me. A part of what landed about the project was on the one hand surfacing the voices and the stories of the people that lived there. I mean i think for me. That was the first thing that got my attention and then secondarily or maybe more subtly what comes across as just the care with which the volume has been put together not just visually and graphically but also textual. It's a very kind of layered a portrait of the place It does surface even the very title but in the narratives the story. It's surfaces that lived. Experience of people are living together in this place and and that for me was something that i frankly thought that our case lafayette park. Detroit edited volume. We weren't able to do nearly enough of you know whereas ours was really written for edited for academic audience and a design audience. I thought just the vibrancy. The sheer enthusiasm of the voices that you catch it was was just an extraordinary contribution to tell us about the title. How did you arrive at that. Handle for the prussian. Yes that was my neighbor kanji. Who's a so we have this neighbor. Look just down the road from our neighbors in the townhouse. We have this neighbor kanji pattana. He's in the end of his wife. Shantha have here since nineteen seventy three. I think absorbent here for a really long time. They spend half the year in india and half the year here in lafayette park and we photograph them for our book ingram. You'll end his blake beautiful series of photographs of people in their living rooms and we photograph them and and we were having a conversation about the blinds in the windows because when the building when the house of the towns reverse designed they had vertical blinds. And then i guess there's also this pretty major issue with condensation on the inside of the windows. Where would kind of like run down to the floor and then like destroy the floor. Kanji said something about how. They changed the blinds or they didn't like the blinds or something and he said something like i'm sorry mr me's but he said something like that like i'm sorry mr music doesn't work with your style or whatever and then we decided it was really funny how we were. I was really funny. That us district joking. About mr music. Because i think that for me for us it kind of captured this sort of feeling in the neighborhood where it's like one of the things like about this neighborhood was that it felt like if this was any other bigger city like more kind of like money to city like all the people living here would be like you know. Modern architecture aficionados but in detroit the people who are living in lafayette park for the most part they know about measly. No i mean. They know that it's kind of Architect or whatever that's not what brought them to the neighborhood and they're kind of putting their own you know they're doing what they have their own taste of their own thing that they're bringing into these this sort of this this sort of this idea that there's like mr means or whatever is this kind of figure but it's not necessarily I don't know these kinda like a playfulness around it. So i thought so relate where that came from yesterday we just. The view is like the whole thing rate lake. Whether you're in the townhouses or in the towers giant windows is like the the you know. The meter draw basically for everybody interviewed. Melissa dittmer referred in competition to this as almost voyeurism of lafayette park in spite of its decentralized horizontal landscape driven centrifugal space. It is a place where you are proximate to your neighbors. Your living together In my experience some interested in that in that history so clearly. Lafayette park was on the one hand. A resultant of the racist urban renewal practices of the federal government says enabled by the city of detroit. Americo having with the planning department erased The housing of thousands of black detroiters in the neighborhood known as black bottom the site sedentary for four years of course as political failure isn't failure of urban renewal and it was only through herbert greenwald. The chicago developer can take up the cause that the project was eventually realized and greenwald's argument was for a a mixed race mixed class future for the american city. And this was of course a fairly radical formulation for projects at that time in the late nineteen fifties certainly in the context. Urban renewal projects the united states. It was remarkable. So mr daniel in your experience having studied it published the book but also lived there now for some time. To what extent would you describe. Lafayette park as it as supporting that mixed race mixed class vision today. Yeah well. i think that it's really changed since the bankruptcy so when we post the book the book came out in two thousand twelve and since starting to shift but you still had. It did still feel really like a mixed class mixed race kind of enclave in the city and definitely more recently integrated than other parts of the city and then the suburbs you know in that way it felt it was very very unique and i think but i think even then other people from other president would would kind of joke. That is a bit of a joie like neighborhood. People talk about it as a gated community. Even though it doesn't actually have physical gates. I think just the tree covered like the layout and the fact that it's like super bock that's separated from other street access. It just feels like separate from the city but you know after the bankruptcy win kind of things were all. The sort of finances were all reshuffled people all of a sudden Speculators started coming into detroit. Things really changed here in. Lafayette park is situated in that area. That was designated for investment. It's like this sort of like midtown downtown area. This t shape that like referred to as new detroit quote unquote. There's new detroit. And then the rest of detroit and all the kind of investment was concentrated in this area so we saw a lot of really you know i mean. There's been a lot of changes. So for instance like street lights are starting to be repaired. The lafayette plays on the big park. Got a lot of funding and actually so so to say parenthetically that we had a second edition of the book. Come out in twenty nineteen and for that. I had to new essays like marcia music who was in the first volume but then also one from matthew piper who is a resident of lafayette hours Tracks a lot of history between twelve and like till now and so. He sort of like writes about what happened in the park. Because i hadn't like all these changes happen. But they kind of happen incrementally but like for instance things like sidewalks were repaired. They resurface tim escorts of the north end of the park. They put in a new playground like replaced one of the playgrounds and they put in a soccer field. And you know all these new trees and then the like cities started to take care of the park like mowing it and used to just get more like twice a year. You know now it gets more and more regularly but these things are kind of tied to increasing the property value. You know around the neighborhood. And so the housing like the the cost of the units in lafayette park in the town. Houses where i live like a tripled between like twelve and twenty nineteen like kind of insane then between two thousand fourteen and twenty seventeen. There was just like in our end of lafayette park. Twenty units and seven of them changed hands and it was people who are coming in and paying cash for the units and buying them for like way more than they had soldier before. So it's very palpable. You know like a change. The class of people that can afford to live in. Lafayette park is definitely changed in the evening. The towers which are rentals in twenty twelve. When our book came out the towers were in foreclosure they had been kind of mismanaged by the new york-based developer group called the northern group. That just was like absentee you know. And so they were down to like fifty percent occupancy. They would have like a week or they didn't have any heat. You know is a mess like we actually lived there at the moment at the first moment of transition is like one of the first things they did was. They came in fired all of the staff that had been there for like twenty years or whenever they fired all doorstep and then offer to hire them back at lower wages so as awful so that the occupancy was way down than it went into receivership and so like hud takeover and then hud sold it to this guy. I think in two thousand thirteen and then he kind of build it back up and so rents have been going up. They're not as high as some of the new construction. Like gives the new places that are getting built in detroit the new developments but it's still higher at people are kind of slowly getting pushed out. It's sort of like the overall. Like fabric is definitely changing now. It's not really the same kind of multi class multi racial neighborhood that it was you know in some ways it feels like maybe had been kind of had managed to be that for so long just because of the disinvestment in detroit. You know it kinda like held on for a long time yet now. It's a different moment. Although i think that all but actually since covid what's going to happen now because a lot of the construction projects that had been going since. Kobe seemed to be on hold. You know so. There's things like on the west side of lafayette park sort of projects. That just empty fields. Where i think there were projects. Were supposed to be going up at aren't happening now. And i don't know i don't know what's gonna have been so you mentioned the fact. That park had both been more mixed racially ethnically than the city or the suburbs but also had a tradition of of Occupants that itself selected from the from the progressive side of things. You know it was a place where chose to be a part of a community that was mixed both a variety of measures as you say as it's maintained its value one of the ways it's done that is through its maintenance. It's the cooperative form of ownership and the upkeep of the grounds that gave a perception too many outsiders that it was in fact. Gated as you say not a gate to be found fenced off community but in fact quite open and porous but yet somehow the the prosperous image of this kind of mature landscape In some ways leaves leaves that sense for many viewers. I think i had a minor. Dustup with Blair came in the extra critic of the chicago tribune. He referred to lafayette park as a good bit of an enclave. Close quote and i. Of course you know had to remind him. That enclave in the latin comes from lock and key in fact. There's not a key anywhere. But in that regard i've been struck by the the example. Lafayette park presents. Because it connects back to that original idea of mcgarity that original notion of the enlightenment in that sense of maybe the european version of modern architecture that it means a social need you know and the notion that a developer in the nineteen fifties could have a publicly acknowledged mixed race mixed class future american city strikes me again as a very very timely call. Obviously we need different instruments today different tools. But i really. I have come to enjoy the account of lafayette park and living in the people's voices that you gathered in the publication. So thanks for the book daniel bear. Thank you burn adding me. You've been listening to future of the american city. You made by the office for nerviness at the harvard. Graduate school of design. This conversation was the knightfoundation and the jets. The american cities despite disease dot. Gst dot harvard dot edu.
Episode 226 | Your 2019 Comic Book Holiday Shopping Guide
"This is the comics. PODCAST I'm your host for this week's episode Paul. JC filling in for the immortal. Mike rapin but I'm not alone. Of course I'm joined joined by two wonderful people to talk with Caitlin fear and care shambaugh risky. It's good to have you both here. We are very quickly Almost too quickly to believe heading for the holiday season so we have a great episode about that today but before we get to the main topic I want to ask the questions. I am legally early obligated as host to ask for every episode. How you been? How calm expend? Let's start with you Keira I have a slight cold. Which is the tragic to me because I have made it so far into the school year without getting anything from any of the tiny children so too oppressive so so to be so close to Christmas break? And to. Now have the sniffles. I'm like Now out of your system care you don't have to live like this in terms of how have comic spin Obviously super excited that Brian I fire continuing with our Irish star. Wars comic books special our weekly gift to our fellow starwars slash comic nerds at the center of that Ven Diagram Diagram. You will find US getting way too excited about star worse in yet another medium so oh This week I read a comic. That was on has been on my list for like think two years now. Two years ago it came out where I kept being like. I'm obviously going to like this. I know I'm going to read this eventually and I just never did. The luckily motor crush is on HOOPLA. So the man that did finally happen rose like I don't have I haven't used any of my December polls yet. Let's finally dig into motor crush so I read the first issue and This is a series that is done by the creative team. That did that backroll reboot a few years ago. Where where she got her like yellow doc martens than is in the Gotham equivalent of guests Bushwick in New York It's Brendan Fletcher. babs Tar and Cameron Stewart and. This book is definitely designed to play to babs tars aesthetic strengths. Like she's very the Almost kind of like a modern pinup situation in how she draws women and I think dudes are kind of her afterthought where she's like I can draw them but I'm really here to like show you some Lipson hips so which is great. But it's definitely. I was definitely reading this vogue and I was like And not even like not even that. I'm saying that the women are over. sexualize it's just. She definitely takes the time to give them essential edge. Even if they're like Hossan biker gang so motor crush the first issue kind of introduces you to this world where it's is like slight alternate reality near future situation where you're like okay. A lot of things seem familiar. But this feels like maybe twenty twenty to forty years in the future from where we are now so they're action is centered around these like motor bike races is is racing circuit and our heroine of the first issue. We see her racing on this circuit. We kind of like meet her dad who is a former racer. Yes sir get like a sense of her situation as a character than we like the second half of the issue has like tonal shift where you see like Oh actually her she's an upcoming racer in the legit circuit but she is caressing it on the illicit circuit where you raise for drugs which are called something like crusher crusher hence my terrible pun right there but so she races to get these drugs and these drugs make you go faster her. But obviously there's like you you get addicted to them and we actually see someone getting like. I'M GONNA go with murdered by this drug lake. Take like What would you call like a like a warning kill like an exhibition? Kill where you kill someone in front of a crowd of people to be like this might happen to you to. It's kind of like execution style. Yeah Yeah Yeah so the so. The person like running this shady race like says why caught this guy like stealing our or stash. Let's give it to them. And they pour a whole thing of this one drug down his mouth and he just straight up explodes like his body is just a pile of goop on the ground. And I was like what do to this book. I thought it would be reading like everything is really Lake Fuchsia and neon and like shiny screens and everything. But it was pretty dark underbelly guys and the last issue the first issue ends on such a bleak. Note that I'm Kinda like do I want to continue like get kind of want to continue like aesthetically. I do like this creative team but this is way darker than I thought. I thought this was going to be like fun. Motorcycle girl. Gang Situation Nation like Betty and Veronica vixen over at Archie or The work that I think almost exact creative team or like like no no Do you remember the Black Canary book from a few years ago. That kind of looks like this but I think is some Veronica fish doing the art. Yeah so like that kind of aesthetic aesthetic where she was also sort of in a biker. Gang like there's like a certain subset of Lake Lady creators in comics who all of a sudden like a couple years ago. Were like everything. Everything is a shiny sexy girl gang. And I'm like Kay but can you all not do the same thing at the same time. Everything is sexy motorcycle motorcycle girl gang. I you know I I will say I am a noted fan of drug gang comics And I did pick this issue up. I remember reading this first issue and I think I had a similar reaction where I didn't go back for issue too because tonal shift at the end. But I be curious now. That's free on Hoopla to go back and revisit it I might like it more but yeah what stands out to me is our work. The color is fantastic. I love that like Bright Fuchsia that they use for the book. So yes yes we revisit this one. It looks fantastic. They've got great roadbuilding. Think tar does better action sequences in this than she was doing in bad girl which makes sense because this was. I think the host bat girl so she'd had some practice but Overall I was kind of like this dark. I don't know if I wanted dark necessarily the -sarily I want that like a west side story girl gang not necessarily the dark scary girl gang right. Yeah like like len more pink ladies than like curious Atta Girl Gang you know. I'm sure there's analogy somewhere. But what was the girl gang. From the Warriors Guy Blinking. Now's a listener will remember and legislate on twitter. Please what was the name of the girl gang in the warriors. Thanks uh-huh Kate. What did you read this week? I read the I am a hero omnibus which kept remembering as I am hero. Like I thought the guy's has aim was gonna be hero but anyway This is by Kengo. Hana Zaghawa and it was James's pick for the two thousand nineteen good reads reading challenge. I'm super for behind on this reading challenge. I don't think I'm going to be able to read like the ten books that I have left between now and the New Year but I'm trying really hard. Anyway this was a very you long Manga. It's definitely omnibus deserves. That name But it was also a it ended up being Zombie Story and the combination of these two things at being very long and also about zombies. Meant that it was engaging but also that I was reading until like two or three o'clock in the morning which is is peak creepy time and the are with. The zombies is creepy enough. That it's like it's a little bit like the ring like it's it's extra scary because of the visuals. So Dart was good just not for three but ah along with being as Ambi- story this was also kind of I felt like it was a medium for the Creator to kind of talk about his philosophies about Manga. Because that's a lot of what the first part of the story was about was just this. The protagonist is among a creator. And he's talking was co workers and his girlfriend about what Manga is to their culture and what makes a Manga Gray and it was really interesting but at times. A Guy. A little bit preachy. I felt like and then suddenly there is Arby's so it was. It was kind of a cool combination but also so It it felt a little direction. List's up until it turned into a Zombie book so I am interested in continuing like I want to know what happens next because ends on a cliffhanger but it is just like it's a little bit unusual. It's an unusual combination of things. Sounds interesting I I like the idea of using zombies as a sort of Meta textual device knows is really about. ZOMBIES are about larger issue. I think so. It's interesting all this this week. Did you also read a book with an unexpected and abrupt mood shift. I did I did actually yes. I really did not plan this friends. Yeah that's very funny. I read the hard tomorrow which was an og n by eleanor nor Davis. It was published by joining quarterly last month. So just recently came out and it got a lot of advance buzz. I remember hearing about it from a couple of different sources so I picked it up up at the shop kind of on a whim and it's a stunning book. It might be the best comic I've read this year. I know there's a that thing of reading the most recent thing you read you love the most but really it's a fantastic book And it's basically set in a near future or you know world very similar to ours. It's about a woman named Hannah. Who is part of an anti violence activist group sort of like an anti for sort of Our ANTIFA pronounce it collective Fighting against or protesting against these chemical weapons at the same time. She's trying to build a house off the grid with her her husband. They're trying to have a family have a child. And it's a basically a meditation on the balance between the seeming pessimism and futility of that activism awesome and the optimism that drives it. You know the hope for a better world versus the terribleness of the role that you actually live in. And it's really a balance between those two it. It does have a very shocking ending a moment toward the end involving her husband. I don't WanNa give anything away. But really the star of the book for me. Is the way Davis illustrates illustrates at her line. Work is very fluid. It's it's sensuous has a maybe a nod kind of patient but it does have a fluidity to it that's very evocative love. It's all black and white. She doesn't amazing narrative work in this some panels that had to stop reading just absorb it all. It is a truly stunning book. And I don't I don't want to give too much away but If you WanNa read something that's unique and different and feels like an important statement. This is the book for you. I highly highly recommend it would. Would you say that this is a book for someone who is already familiar with the comic medium or would you feel comfortable giving this someone who normally reads pros. I would say you kind kind of have to maybe be are already comic fan. This might be a hard sell just because her artwork does look simplistic at first I think having appreciation Russian or background in the nuances of cartooning would definitely help that makes sense because I mean it. It is very beautiful book but I think the the ill looks simple at first but once you kind of are familiar with the story telling techniques maybe if someone again reads like understanding comics and then comes to this they'd be able to see like one of the amazing behind the scene stuff. That Davis is doing artistically. That make sense. I ask because I still have no idea what to get my brother for Christmas. So I'm fishing. Okay well I I would say maybe give it a flip through maybe just judge you know their tastes in their self though like artistically. That might be a good book. I think it's a serious book. I would buy it for yourself because I loved it so much but yes. I also read a Batman Comic. I can't leave without talking about Batman since I'm the host. I read Batman Creature of the night number four. I want to mention this book. Because this is a fantastic miniseries the series the first issue came out way back in November of two thousand seventeen. So it's a two year long. Wait for the story to end. And it's been worth every minute. This is Kirk writing art by John. Paul Leon I don't want to speculate too much by believe Leeann head some serious health issues which has caused the delay way. But I'm very glad that they let him finish the book because it's all about his artwork. It's such a beautiful looking book. And if you don't remember I think I talked about the first issue two years ago on the show but The Gimmick here is that it's a basically a semi sequel to the book that Buzek did with stood imminent called Superman secret identity. Where it's a superman story set in our world? Where Superman is only exists? A fictional character. This is a similar story involving Batman follows. A young boy named Bruce Wainright who lives in Boston. He loves Batman He loves Adam West. TV show. He collects comics is obsessed with Batman the fictional character and then after his parents are killed by a mugger He begins hallucinating. This dark creature of the night that is taken revenge on people that have wronged him so the book is basically like a real world example of like what would how would operate in the real world and by this issue of Bruce Wayne White as an adult. He's the head of the company that he inherited from his parents It's the same stories Bruce Wayne but this time it appears that the demonic bat like creature that's venting for him might be a figment of his imagination or something that has possessed his personality. And he's trying to make sense of all this. It's a meditation on how we process grief. It's an expiration of how we make sense of violence. It's all the stuff you want from a Batman story story but it's really rooted in a sort of real appreciation for what the character means As a fictional character bright so and as I mentioned Leones our work is beautiful. Beautiful such a good looking book Do favorite whenever the collection comes out. I'm she'll be out soon. Flip through it. It's a fantastic Batman. COMIC WANNA stand on bandmate comic. This might be a book. I'd recommend commended. Someone who likes you never read never read comics but is interested in Batman. This is the book for you so it's all about thanks. I'm trying all right. So that's what we read this week. Of course there's more comic books coming out this week on December eleventh already. Kate what what are you excited to read this week. I'm excited to read firefly unification war volume two. I've been talking about firefly a lot lately on the show. I'm so glad that boom picked it up. This is by Greg Pak Dan mcdaid and Lee Garnett and that there are a lot of things that I want for our planet but for what I want for versus just more firefly. I covers some of the backstory. That's mentioned on the original TV show So fact focuses just on Mallon Zoe and and volume one is already out and also they've released the sting which focuses just on all the ladies that we on the show and I'm so excited to read that one I picked it up and I haven't read it yet but maybe maybe next weekend I'll just sit down and read all of the new firefly so kate. Would you recommend this book to someone who's maybe never seen the show or didn't like the show. I'm asking for a friend. That's a really good question I actually I'm wondering if the sting might be a better place to start with because it seems like it's going to be a one off story. Okay I see but let me read it and get back to you about that. I appreciate that 'cause I this is an amazing creative team and I'm really interested in reading it because of that but I I tried to show and it just wasn't for me but I can't be Dan mcdaid on Art Greg Pak writing. That's that sounds great so yeah I'll probably read all of it. wants volume. It comes out at least all of the boom stuff so I can be thinking about that while I'm reading it back to you. Excellent thank you. Thank you Karen. How about you? What are you excited for? Okay so As I mentioned earlier. I'm really hyped about this. I read Star Wars Comic Book. Special that we're doing and Next tweak actually the show is going to be a spotlight on Dr Afrah who is a star. Wars comics native character actor that was introduced in the Darth vader series and was so popular that she got her own series. That is now on. Its sixth trade coming out like it's been going for a while and so Bryan and I. We're talking about volumes one through five for the episode that we recorded and I got to the end and I started like talking on the show to Brian. About how like and I can't and like this is a great place for it to end. And and he was like what are you talking about. It's still ongoing and I was like. Oh that seems like a basic piece of knowledge I should have had right so My comic pick for the week of December eleventh is Star Wars Dr Effort Number Forty I have been going through the the trades on this but now I'm wondering if that's a mistake because the solicit for this one says that DARTH VADER is catching up to Dr Afra and I just just need her to be okay. Because she's a terrible person who brings me joy and I just live lead everything to be fine for and like you. You know how I feel. How about Darth vader? I'm such trash. When it comes to antagonize hate San Skywalker but like I really need to not get his way in this percent unlike? I have like anxiety about this fictional character. Even though I'm like easily six to eight issues behind on what she's actually up to but she survived this far. She could still do it. But you know the the the the title for this story. Line that number forties in the middle or end of is a rogue's end like don't do that. Don't do that that so I'm emotionally invested. I have to get on this I I I'm bad. Star Wars Fan of narrowed any of this recent marvel sour stuff but this sounds like the most appealing serious might be the one after jump on checkout. I'll say you should listen to our star wars special either read along with fit or just be like you know what screw it. I'm going to get full spoilers and then I'm going to decide what I'm going to go back and actually get into. Yeah yeah either way though. Yes I will have to do that. I I'm in full star Wars Geek mode with the new film coming out so I'm in the right mindset to do that so excellent. I'll make it so yeah As for my pick this week I'm going to pick pick for sector number two. This is second issue. A twelve issue limited series that DC is doing camera which imprinted it might be the young animal imprint camera. Br exactly but It's basically Green Lantern Story. It's written by n Que Jemison and with art by Jamal Campbell. It's about a green lantern. Rookie Green Me Lantern Named Sojourner Mullen and she's investigating a murder in a giant megapolis a mega city out somewhere in the distant far sectors of space hence hence the title. It's there's a murder in this city and it turns out it's the first a homicide that's taking place in the city in five hundred years because the different alien alien races that inhabit the city have all somehow like Tampa down their emotions. So there's not really any type of conflict there So this series is picking up a murder mystery where no one knows how to investigate a murder. So it's a green lantern shabby figured out and take charge but she's a rookie still kind of learning the ropes. It's exactly what you want from Green Lantern Story it's part Science Fiction Police Procedural and Hal Jordan's not in it so it's basically perfect green lantern story out in my eyes. I'm just kidding. He's because he's such a cop. I mean it's like okay that was that was not the right thing to say but like I know what you're saying cobb and leg so if you are not and like when I say he's such a cop up I mean like you don't want him at a party with you because he's the guy who's like sir. Are you old enough to be drinking beer. which like is is the job? And that's what you're supposed to be doing. You're supposed to be upholding the law. But like you don't want Hal Jordan at your party unless hosting with Barry Allen because I feel like very can bring bring out that side of our. He's just like okay. Maybe just this once maybe bend the rule. It'll be fine but yeah Colorado Grill intern. Exactly I think being a kid when Carl Reiner I was introduced in the first green lantern I read. I've always kind of a resented HAL Jordan coming back from the dead. It's like man. We had a great religion without. Oh you why do you have to come back so anyway. This is really good series. If you if you like the green lantern mythos but maybe aren't In up up to date with current Green Lantern Story the issue series. This book to check out. The artwork is lovely. It's got a lot of futuristic. Sifi stuff if you're into that stuff so yeah Really interesting series. I'm excited to see where it goes. So with. That said we are going to be taking a quick break here but when we return our theme for this episode episode is our Comic Book Gift Giving Guide. What books do you give to the People on your Christmas shopping list. We'll be back Shirley to discuss that. Well I'm looking at the calendar right now in. Christmas is very quickly approaching. It's a little nerve racking thing about who have to buy gifts for but comics make great gifts and Cara. You have already mentioned. You have a gift giving dilemma. So we figured we'd get together and talk about. How do we give comics? Or what comics we give to the people in our lives. You WanNa maybe start hearing me talk about your Nice gift giving anxiety yes. I struggled locate so my struggle is as I'm sure you and many of our listeners. Identify with this since I love comics. That's my like instinct as a gift is I'm like but I love the thing and therefore might you also love the thing. If I make sure that the comic I choose is within your genre interests for film and Television but like I've I've come to a point where like I do like I've tried to give comics to family members and friends and like sometimes it's successful sometimes times it's not I try so hard with my mom. But she just doesn't have the the the like she's not a person that sits when she does she's like an Obama sleep so it's like so like I have given her some comics over the years to be like mom you have to read this But like actually the one time she did ask if she could read something is when I was showing her The Kevin Keller Trades ahead from Archie Comics. She was like oh I heard about that. Can I read that and it was like sure. But it's been like sitting in her bathroom for about a year now so I don't know if she's actually corrected opener got but So talking about like Oh Paul that book you read. Maybe maybe that's the thing I can get for my brother which I can say because I don't think he listened to the show in on it but but yeah I've given him some comics before and he's given me some some comics before like it's not his go to medium but if there's something where it's like it's in his interest in general will give it a whirl. Well I think the I think that's interesting because you know it might be a little bit self serving in some regards saying cured. I love complex. Therefore I want everyone else love comics. But if someone's not a normal Compaq albuque- reader and you kind of take the time to think here's something that they don't know exist that they might like based on their taste. That shows a little like some nice thinking. It's the you know. The the thought thought that counts as they say so. I I like that idea. Yeah and then My mom texted me the OJ. Because she's getting presents for our younger relatives is that we like maybe only seen a couple of times in their whole lives kind of thing because like you know people live far away in travel. EST travels expensive but so she Texts me just like what Star Wars books do I get for children under the age of ten. I'm like what this actually pretty broad mom like to you have to narrower scope in mind But it just got me thinking how like yeah for for people who are like. Oh God I've got a niece and nephew and got like a second cousin and I should probably bring something. But I don't know what like I. Yeah I do think comics are a great gift because like that's a way to get kids reading like even if they're not strong readers in school. I find like working in a school. I find generally if you had to kit a comic book. They're gonNA devour it because even if they can't get through all the words or syntax they're going to be able to follow along with the pictures exactly and again. It may be self serving but if you get kids addicted to comics that gives us more listeners. In the future makes perfect sense so here but I like that idea I do. I give the idea of giving kids comics so you have a few. We've whole list here stuff different people in your life so you WanNa maybe run through some different age groups so you might recommend. Yeah I was thinking about it and for kids that like the more like elementary school reader level like maybe not necessarily maybe not like third grade and below depend I it depends on their level of reading because like when I was in third grade I was just starting to read chapter books. Some kids don't read those until later. Like I think you should know your audience to that level but Like I see the the kids at the school where I work reading. Raina Telka Myers works Okay yeah like guts. And what's What's other ones And sisters I mean. There's a wildly popular books. I'd be surprised if they don't have not heard of him before we give it to him rate and then it's like okay. Well if if that's not got a good pick or if they've already read them because again popular and there's published by scholastic said they definitely seen them at scholastic book fairs I also like the book amulet what which is kind of like a children going on in adventure? There's like a secret world under the Family House and and they start discovering it. It's like maybe a little more advanced but again like if your kid can handle the brave little toaster. Whatever it is the kids are watching? These days is like adventure stuff like yeah sometimes adventure scary but like you can do it Something that I have at the elementary level but I think actually is more orf I would safely call all ages. Is this series called alley that I am like so obsessed with because it's like it's so oh well done so. There are very few words in this book at all. It's about this adventure the adventures of this little owl who lives in the woods and I get kind of an e or the vibe off of him. 'cause he's like he gets like sad by things like oh no my friend would away. Where is he just like? Just has these huge. Is that all of a sudden. Have like this downcast turn you're just like my baby But like all the dialogue like where there would be dialogue in this book is Like represented in kind of like pictures or exclamations So I really like it Ed. Because it's a way to kind of practice reading comprehension without necessarily knowing what the words are which in some ways is kind of a more advanced skill because instead of relying on words to tell you what's going on you do have to be paying attention to the art and the representations and you know if you've got a kid in your life who who maybe doesn't quite pick up on like all the words or maybe like really Is attracted to animation because the faces are more stylized. So it's easier to read the emotions I would say alleys good pick to kind of practice going wing through a story and following the emotional journey as opposed to just plot. If that makes sense Greg does make sense. Yeah Interesting I. I've seen that that book around. So yeah that does a good pick so I don't Kate. You were excited to see that Pneumonia was on the list for a couple of different age groups. So I'm not food that book. So what's the sell. Their new Mona is kind of this Meta book. That is fantasy based man. It's hard to talk about like it's kind of pneumonia herself as the protagonist and just kind of an anti hero. She she shows up and she was all excited to help out. The bad guy and the bad guys is just in it for attention because he misses the guy who was the the community hero basically so if he does all these bad things to get his friends attention but they're not that bad but no monarch comes along and she's like let's explode the kingdom and so she's a bad guy but you're understand that like these are not things that you're supposed to do in real life so really it's just it's very cute and then it keeps it will occasionally reference something that isn't Like European Fantasy S. C.. which is kind of the suggested setting? So it's this really kind of Quirky yeah it's it's just very quirky. It's very cute and I love it and I am thirty years old but it's definitely at the age range that a definitely a high school there may be even like seventh eighth grade but would understand probably enjoy. Yeah I would say you can read it at the middle school level you would get more of the nuance as a high schooler. Depending on your social emotional development level well I read it in when it came out when I was in my mid to late twenties and I- vastly enjoyed it and was kind of like where the hell was this. One I was was fifteen interesting. There is also an audiobook adaptation to it which is fascinating. Yeah it's very it's very very sound produced so there's a lot of extra little noises to it but if you've got if you're trying to like have a theme to gift for somebody could get them both the audio book and and the graphic affect novel interesting is done by Noelle Stevenson. Who is the creative force behind sheer on the Princess's of power on net flicks and and she also did I think my favorite wonder woman comic of all time which was a one shot in? Oh is it sensation. Asian comics yeah. The digital series are go yes sensation comics Noelle. Stevenson did a wonder woman one shot where wonder woman is. Maybe maybe like middle school age and like shows up at Man's world but like at a carnival boardwalk and you just see her like interacting with kids her own age in terms arms of like. Oh those boys are bullying someone. That's not cool. Let me play video games with these girls. Try Ice Cream and it's just so so wholesome while still capturing like who wonder the woman is at the core of her character So like I only have good things to say about Noel. Stevenson's Work Mona. I think is the book that kind of put her on the map map in terms of like people knowing who she was Nice Nice And then I see on the list here also for high schoolers you might recommend young avengers by the Gillan Mckelvey tag team there. Yeah Yeah this is a book so when I was in high school my jam was Teen Titans and I was reading the Geoff. Johns John's run once. I realized like 'cause watching the TV show. And then I was like looking it up online. I was like what do you mean. This is based off of a comic book. And like what do you mean. They're putting this comic book in the stores. There's still so that's how I found in my comic shop and so I was reading that and being like these guys are teenagers. I'm teenager so that's how that works but I like but Again like in my mid twenties I read the young avengers run. That Gillan and Mckelvey did and I was like Oh this has like nuance that was the other one was reading so I think we want to give a a high school the reader something that might be like feel a little bit more on their level. I would say young avengers then you could be like the cool aunt or uncle uncle who has like I get you. You can talk to me about stuff. It's fine I feel like another one for a high schooler might be runaways. Both the original run and today's run. Oh yeah definitely pick. It's a guy that like. Everybody is in high school as far as I remember except for Little Molly And it's kind of have like you're in high school. You're kind of becoming who you're going to be as an adult you're maybe like not necessarily rebelling but at least questioning everything the thing around you and with runaways. Being the parents are evil. Oh but wait. There was a reasonable along. It's really I feel like it would have really spoken spoken to me high school. Yeah that's good pig and then for if people are in college like all all I can think of is Neil diamond stuff because I feel like when I was in college literally everyone who is like I work in comic shopper. I read comics so it was like what do you mean. You haven't read sands man Dan yet. I still haven't read it so because people were pushing so hard to read salmon famine. You gotta read Sandman. I'm like I hear you but also you're the people who keep telling me that watchmen is the end all be all so I don't know like so so as I was thinking about that and I was remember my college experience. It's kind of when I got back into reading comics like more full-time was when I was in college. And I think it actually was reading Scott Macau's understanding comics which is kind of like a text book. Yeah it's a good book to kind of say like it is a comic but also explains the series kind of gauge on a deeper level. It might rekindle your love for comics like it did for me. That is also add. Recommend something like love and rockets by Hernandez or even so Mike Harvey Pekar Merican Splendor. Stuff if you're a cynical college student that's the stuff to read right there. So it's more along. The lines of some alternative comics makes them more literary whatever that term means style. So if you were to pretentious college kid like I was like go appeal to you. Basically ask yourself. Would this be reviewed in the New Yorker magazine exactly. That was my gym so so yeah I think that's a good look there but obviously see we have younger Relatives what about our older l.. Twitter are are parents that might not read comic. Save ideas what we'd get them and keep in mind that all parents sir different rhetoric you know. Put them all in the same basket so to speak and I really do hate lists like that. It's like gifts for her like man I hate to. I hate to bring it up. But I'm going to bring it up that Peleton ad that everyone's flipping out on like don't write like don't get your lady significant other an exercise machine without knowing that as something that she's actually explicitly asked you for but like so so and they're just like look. This is a gift you could get your lady friend. I'm like Ooh but what if she's like not into that right like think about them as a person but I did want to kind of discuss like if you could make your parents like re re comic or reconsider a comic like what might be see for you. Know the first thing that sprung to mind for me and it's actually a book I've actually already talked about my dad with his Berlin by Jason Lutes. I was recently collected a really nice hardcover. I think last late last year and that is a if your father or someone you know is very into European in history particularly World War Two history. This is a great book because it's all about pre World War Two Berlin sort of the nineteen twenties into the thirties when the the city is a metropolitan seen. There's art jazz. There's a sort of a libertarian. Underground culture with cabaret at the same time Amihai political battles between the Socialists. The Nazis it's based on real real history. It's beautiful stated beautifully. told and it's a really amazing using piece of historical fiction that I think a lot of fathers might be into that stuff. They might appeal to them. Yeah I'm going to piggyback off you there because I also picked a world war related book for uh-huh Reminding Her my dad An actually think I'm cheating a little bit because I don't know if you'd necessarily put this in the comic book category or like the illustrated scroll scroll category. It's called the Great War by Joe Sacco and this book came out a few years ago. I remember seeing it in bookshops and being like that it looks that looks interesting and then not actually getting because I was like my dad won't read it but it's actually this like twenty four foot long pullout but where it's like a continuous illustration about World War One. Okay so it's like if you again if if you're if not necessarily your father but if someone in your life is into like the history of war and you think they might like a different way of of looking at that. Perhaps this pull out visual narrative that is like I again. I didn't get it but I saw like sample pages and the art is Really striking interesting when I think of. What do I get from my dad? I kind of jumped to Westerns or SCI FI and the copperhead would be great for that so if your dad is open to Affection and likes Westerns and Saifi. COPPERHEAD was a great book. I went I went with great. Were for this because I was like look at you. Don't even have to read it. You can just pull out the things and like my dad does read a lot but whenever I try to give him comics he just like Kinda glances that forgets about it but if he actually was going to read it then I would probably get him a stack of the James Bond comics that dynamite has been in putting out because those are actually great. Like I don't know if you guys have been reading those at all but every time I read one I am pleasantly surprised by how good it is interesting. I yeah yeah that's a huge Blank spot my pop. Culture knowledge is James. Bond's that might be a star but I also say like maybe your dad read comics and he was a kid so maybe maybe find out what he read. There's all sorts of trade collections of silver age and Bronze Age comics can get him a few years ago. I did get my dad to collection of Silver Age Justice League comics. And you loved today. 'cause it's a trip down memory lane so that's also good a good thing to think about in that regard. What about our moms moms like comics to fix fix here? I think a lot of MOMS like to like to cook. I don't want to generalize because but that's something I was thinking and all moms moms or exactly I'm saying I cook. I'm not trying to be too specific air but My mom also loves a good recipe and I think the book relish my life in the kitchen By Lucy nicely as a fantastic book. Because it's a cookbook and a comic. It's about her remembering specific. Memories and childhood could events based around the sensation of eating in like how taste and smell can trigger memories and growing up around food and appreciating shitting food. It's also filled with a bunch of recipes that are illustrated they can make so. It's a double function book. It's a memoir and cookbook all in one. So that's a good pick for anyone that likes suspend time in the kitchen. Add that to the list for my brother. Thank you call probably great for my shopping For for my mom my first reaction was actually a comic that I think as of now is still only available in French and I was like damn it. Why does it my mom no French? It's this series called old Mamat and there's like a sort of a prequel series for petite mimets league little momentum so the series memet is about this like adorable old lady just kind of like going about her life being an old French lady and then the series petite memet is like. You're seeing her story from when she was like a child. Living with some more extended family members kind of allude to like other stuff going on in the background of France but like she's safe in the countryside and I like pre electra like pre electricity situation. I think it's like an earlier twentieth century. Like maybe World War One or World War Two situation probably World War Two And it's such a beautiful story like I just. I wish they translate it into English because I remember like reading. The PATINA met series in like crying. Because it's like you're you're following the story of this a little this little girl but you're seeing the things that are going over her head also because you see her like aunt and uncle and like other relatives kind of like talking above her head. She's like going off into the woods. Like well La and but from there like glances or like they'll even devote panels to The adults reacting to what they turn or learned about. And it's like pretty pretty heartbreaking to read but in like a Beautiful Cathartic Way and so it's just like Oh. My mom would love this if only she read French or it was in English. So it's like okay. Okay okay are Carey has gotta pick something in English. So that I thought of the Book Lulu which I read God probably like six years ago at this point It is a hybrid of. It's a French urges for from another European country. Comic translated slated into English about this Middle Aged woman who just like decides to not go home one day and she she ends up lake walking along the beach for like miles and miles and like goes to a different town and talks to strangers and does all these things that have just not been a part of her routine of being wife and mother for the last twenty years of her life. And it's really striking like if you like. I don't know if you'd necessarily give this is to someone who's going through a midlife crisis or if it would help them but like I just felt this release while reading it of like Oh like what what would happen if you just kind of left everything. You knew all your routines. If only for like a day thought about Lou new for like my grandmother also because my grandmother at least is she she still has wanderlust Alexa. Travel and things like that So I felt like Lulu anew would be a really great pick for her and and I could see her sitting sitting down to actually read this. I mean I feel like it's not very wordy but there are Israeli. Good so if you've got somebody if if you're if you're older other female relative has bad eyesight or something like that. This would still be a decent book for them up making note of that. That's a that's a good suggestion. So so there's a few other again. We have a very long list. We're not get all of it but I do want to make special note that we probably have people in our lives that used to read comics and maybe stop. So we have lapsed APPs to DC fans leapt. Mario APPs marvel fans. There's so many great books they might not know about. What would we recommend for elapsed? DC reader that we want to get back in the game so to speak. Speak back in the game as like. I even think I'm a good example of this like you. Love the DC characters but you've kind of fallen Off Reading everything month to month and there have been so many changes to that universe that you're just kinda like Do I still recognize what's happening. Do I need to know continuity and sometimes you just WanNa a story that's like what about the characters that I love. What if I wanna read like story with them that I don't really have to worry about the rest of it and that's where Mister Miracle Comes uh-huh and you listeners to the show you know we've talked about this at length but really really if you have someone in your life who used to re DC and for whatever reason hasn't read Mister Miracle yet the series that was published this this past year you gotta get them the trade? I finally got around to reading it. Do Wii understand it. No is it great. Yes will I re read it. Probably like if you at all like the new gods or or just even mister miracle and big Barda even if you just like big Barda like I was in this for Barda. It's like it's such a healthy representation tation of a married couple like I'm almost stunned that this book came out of a big to company. If I'm being totally honest it's it's a very good book. I ask someone. That's already a huge Jack. Kirby new Gods Fan. I knew it was going to like it but I'm I'm heartened to hear that people. That aren't familiar with the new stuff. We're still able to find something in it at that. spoke to them. So yeah I would recommend that if you have fans that maybe don't know those specific characters and have vowed the game for a while I would say the new frontier by Darwin. Cook is a great book to give someone that the DC fans and maybe hasn't read that so that's the classic characters away they would recognize. It's very celebration of silver age. It's a fantastic book and looks. Amazing does look amazing cod. I love that book so much. It's Yeah I saw it on my shelf and like after we read that I haven't read it in a while so for marvel fans again. I'm not as big of a marvel reader so I may not be the best person to suggest but the book that got me a recent book Guy Me. Reading being marvels of regularly the immortal by doing rin valuing with Of course I'm blinking the artist name and I feel terrible about that Put that's a book it you know you know who it is. That's a book that s someone that likes the hulk in theory but maybe not in practice. I immediately grabbed toward that book and thought it was. It's fantastic so when that is familiar with marvel stuff that'd be me now reading contemporary stuff. That's an easy one to jump onto. I think that just makes me think of Hulk Grey okay like I read. Then I feel like the hulk is kind of like wonder woman. There's no real like this is the series that you must read for. This is character that defines them in the way. That like you know you think okay Batman Dark Knight stuff then like Superman unlike Like death of Superman or things like that. There's more like series that were like I can point to that and be like that big thing that they did right but the hulk and wonder woman I feel like not so much but like their stuff that people say. But what about that one. But what about that one and like this origin story and I feel like for the hulk. Gray was a revisitation of Bruce Banner and the hulks origin story but done by contemporary temporary writers and artists. But still with like a retro vibe. That does kind of remind me of. DC's new frontier like that for me. I was great because I didn't really know. Oh anything about the hulk beyond like Hulk Smash and I was like Oh you sweetie this is like Frankenstein's activated yeah. Yeah and that's that's sir. Geoff Logan Tim Sale. I think right now book. Yeah and the immortal homegoods Joe Bennett. Of course on pencils I remembered So yes check that book out firm for Marvel stuff for me the stuff that I really like. Is there like more recent like bubbly colorful unbeatable squirrel girl roll. Miss Your vols like the stuff like that And then I if for some reason you have someone in your life who who used to read. A lot of marvel and for whatever reason did not read the fraction of Hawkeye. You should probably get the volume one of Hawkeye. That's a good pick to And Yeah I'm sure. There's plenty of lapsed X. Men fans and I think there should be if marvel smart a hawks pox collection out before Christmas is coming up workers basically all of comics twitter's like hawks pox and I'm like what disease that you're all about like what happened. What what new concrete nonsense is this But it is an x men series that everyone is like Holy Shit. This is the best so even though I'm not really devoted ex Fan I am like okay published hawks parks. I will get it from the library. I will read it and then I can be like Holy Shit. You guys were right or like there will be no middle ground. I will say as a very skeptical X. Men fan never been a big X.. Men Fan I bought all of those issues and I actually really loved all album so yeah. Oh lindores hawks as a as a X-men Newbie so to speak so it doesn't sound like we're just talking about this the house of X. Powers of ten. So yeah you can find it at your local comics are but I think the collection should be both those series presented narrative. We are supposed to be read so yeah cool. I'll give that a thumbs up can do you have any. I know you're not a big big to read or do you have any insight here or should we jump to another another another topic. I'm going to double down on the runaways as great also degreasers. Yeah I think I think the trick here is books that aren't leading down with continuity and those who come sometimes to find. I think that might be good. Pick gotten so yes yes I want to very quickly talk about Star Wars. I know you've already mentioned a bunch of Star Wars Books Cara suggestions. I want to say. Maybe there's someone that likes star wars but maybe has already consumed all the extra media only likes the movies I would say maybe give them outer darkness. The image series that John Layman rights with art by Abu Chan. I pick that up on Hoopla on a whim and it's great. It's a sort of that same. Space Western vibe space opera but there is elements of magic involved there's the spaceships that are powered by ancient gods. That are no longer being worshiped. The use their energy of the God to power the ships. It's a weird mix of magic and sci fi than probably appeal to a lot of sours fans in the our work is lovely semi. Be a good alternative turned of gift to the sci-fi Stars Fan in your life does appeal to me thank you. I will add that to my list for myself. This is very self serving episode persona making my life easier in so many ways. Is there any trying to think what else we have here on the list again. We will post's full list of suggestions on the website because there's no waving thrall this time allotted. I wanted to talk about a couple series that like I read once runs along time ago or actually a red press twice. That's not fair They read these books and they just kind of like stick in my mind. Like even. If I'm not the like rise up unbidden bidden because other things remind me of them For your friend who can't turn off C. Span probably the book pres- From DC do somewhere in the twenty fifteen through twenty seventeen time frame. They revisited a series that they had done in the the seventies where the premise is. A teenager is elected president but Okay update that they did in The late twenty tens is superb. It's a short series. It's about this this teenager. Nick nicknamed Corn Dog Girl Goes Viral on social media and then elected president president. And it's very like near future dystopia. Ian Corporations are just like personified logos. who were really controlling the government kind of situation but like everything feels close enough where you're like? Oh Fuck. That's probably what's going to happen like if you like Black Mirror her or okay politics in or like following the political nonsense. That's happening these days you would probably find pres- at least thought op provoking read and then Sort of on a on a on a dovetail to this topic if you think Silicon Valley companies are evil and like the Internet is maybe not like a I mean the Internet is a tool. And it's just what people do it that becomes like good or bad but like God probably like six or seven years ago. Now Boom I think it was did a series called medic me medic and and That book is horrifying then. It's like the premise. Is this like sloth meam goes viral role but is like a mind control device and the end did. I'm not going to spoil the ending but it's way crappier than anything you're thinking of an I almost threw up so I don't always have a physical reaction to comics but like even just thinking about the last few pages of medic just it'd be like all And not even just not even just like from a gross out perspective from a like. Oh we really all think very close mindedly about things Ziva when we don't realize it and it just if you if you want to feel a little uncomfortable about life you should probably leave read or give it to someone who's just like telling you that they're canceling all. There's subscriptions to everything because Google's watching okay so interesting. I cautiously put one on the list. Oh speaking of current events and political stuff I want to quickly recommend rolling blackouts by Sarah. glidden this came out. I think two years ago It's a sort of a memoir nonfiction comic and Sarah Goodin basically doing gay memoir about. You're not a memoir word but sort of a journalistic approach to going to Turkey Syria and Iran and she's with a group of journalists who are covering the refugee crisis. There and the book raises a lot of issues of what's the responsibility of a journalist. Can they tell a story. Objectively is opportunistic to tell a story objectively. Are they being biased. It's a meditation on news coverage in the wake of a a very real sadly humanitarian crisis. That's happening there with refugees. It's a somewhat depressing topic but the way good addresses it I think is really I opening and Someone that might be in tune with that stuff would really appreciate that approach to it so add that to the list and we have done so far armful list will will be in our notes because like Paul said. There's just so much because basically started this episode being like I don't know what do we recommend in our like. What don't we recommend? Let's break down friends. Yeah I think the main give takeaway here is that. There's a comic out there for everyone. That's Kinda Roy. I tell people when they ask me. What comics I like what they should check out say look does go to your local shop? There's going to be something that's going to speak to you either. Artistically or thematically and that's your entry point it's not just superheroes obviously we know that but a lot of people still think that way so being able to find something that you think is going to speak to someone on your list. As I mentioned earlier that is does show some initiative and it is a nice way to introduce them to this wacky world of comics that we love so I feel like we are getting toward the end here. Do we want any last wrap up recommendations before we wrap it up here anything. You're dying trying to recommend that's on the list. Don't forget all of the old newsprint comics. Like Calvin and Hobbes. Yes for somebody who likes the retro stuff or an older relative. Yeah I yeah I would even say Kevin Hobbs for your younger readers. Maybe kids didn't read it when being published. Those books are still great for four kids like I. I remember being so excited every Sunday to the Big Kelvin Hobbes's on the front of the comics page every Sunday. So that's Nice trip down memory lane for people the our age and also for younger readers they would still be I think be into that style. That's a recommendation across the board. They really put Calvin and Hobbes in the same category as the early peanut stuff from. I'm Charles Shulz. 'cause like the early peanut stuff was a strip like about and I guess four children but really speaking to adults also and Scholtz was really really biblical and philosophical in his early work in the fifties and sixties with Charlie Brown and the gang. Just like straight up philosophizing and like Schroder was playing Beethoven. What six year old plays Beethoven? But Right Kelvin. And Hobbs. I kind of put in that tradition. Because Calvin and Hobbes are named after philosophers I and a lot of the the day to day Comic Strips were about some more lake like Childish Fun and Fantasy Worlds in like Calvin Ball but especially in the Sunday strips that you're talking about looking forward to like sometimes sometimes those strips would just be like Calvin and Hobbes riding in a wagon down a hill wall straight up philosophizing to one another. So I totally agree agree with you. That Calvin and Hobbes is like all ages like basic. I guess my shortlist then is like when in doubt give someone Calvin and Hobbes. That's two solid recommendation. I second hand endorse that. So yeah that's great and maybe there's one here I didn't on the list for the person on our list that we wish read comics would be our like our our book to say. Hey I knew I didn't comics. This might be the one that converts you we have some good picks here so I already mentioned runaways. I got somebody put that there. And what else do we have. Yeah yeah runaways. Is The book that got me reading comics but I kill giants as the book that kept the kept me reading comics. 'CAUSE IT meant there was more than just your your team superhero books like a could be Abou- how one girl dealing with her personal demons. I read that book recently for the first time and I did cry. Yup Yeah Yeah. That's that's a really good. I kill giants. I threw paper girls on the list because I think that's a book that has a sort of universal appeal and I think it's a really engaging story that's a book that no one's GonNa just end with the first volume gonNa want the next one so that's good very addictive pick to get someone hooked on buying comics. I think so I agree cool. Well we will post as we said the full list honor on our site here which you can find and and if you have any suggestions that we missed we'd love to hear from you you know where to find us. We are on the Internet. All over twitter Cara is at K S Zam. I get that right yet. Okay Kate at Kate L.. Fear I am at Ohio polly and the show is at ISB podcast hard. Cast we post Comic Book News Art. We like Sassy comments and a whole lot. More show is powered by fans. Like you patriarch. Find our patriotic at patriotair on dot com slash. IRC podcast joins us now for access to exclusive audio articles previews of the IR CB schedule early access to top off of my pile posts and more are good. Reads Group is a lovely community of comic friends and join our yearly reading challenge and comment on our weekly threads. This this week's threat was holiday. Themed comics check it out at IRC podcast dot com slash good reads head over to be PODCAST DOT COM for our pronunciation guide discord server merchandise. And everything else. If you haven't already please rate and review our show five stars and I tunes and Beyond and will read your review on the next episode. Email the show with what you've been reading recipes corrections whatever I should be podcasts. At gmail.com infinity shred are the best band in the world. They also do the music for our show. ZANDER is a wizard. He's behind the curtain like the wizard of Oz. He also edits the show. I want to say thank you kate and Keira for joining me on the episode. I was really really fun topic. Thank you for listening in until next time comics are good and sore you. mm-hmm good work friends. We I think we did a great job. I'm really proud of us. Really excited ended about my comic picks to and then as I was about stopping like let me tell you about the mighty morphin power rangers and teenage mutant Ninja Turtles Number One but it came out last week and I didn't see that until until I was actually on the detail page for the item. No I was very excited to hear you geek out about of Oh. I'm disappointed that I must have. Yeah Okay I'll do it in briefer. You're right now. Basically like what ridiculous names for teams. Obviously I want to read this thing. That probably exceeded your twitter limit just through third the title very curious. Have you watched any of that. The netflix show the the toys that made us. Because there's an episode about both of those at sounds up my alley. I have not seen that yet. It's worth checking it. I haven't watched every episode of just basically watched watched the episodes about toys that I actually had a kid. But what's great is the Ninja Turtles One. The first like ten minutes episode is just Kevin Eastman and whatever whatever layered guys acquitted. Just them geeking about Jack Kirby for like ten minutes and how much I love turbans. How the became friends is that they love Jack? Kirby together I I think it's great so oh that's adorable. Thought about leaving my bed to go do the next phase of laundry and then I thought no. Why would I do that thing? Do your laundry outside. Is that why you need it to be nice Yes like all because I not always like there is a drier but I do have like. Today was the day that I needed to wash jeans. And just like recently read a whole so I got a lot of my nerdiness for my dad but he liked goes through phases where he either really embraces being a nerd or is like no. I'm cool But he like is having nerdy moment about like Japanese salvage denim from Brooks brothers. And he's like is he's he's got like one pair of this really nice denim jeans and he like read up on how to take care of them and he's like carry you cannot put done them in the dryer it ruins the elastic fibers. So now I'm like hang drying my jeans and then I also had to hand wash few sweaters so those Zara hanging and yesterday. It was raining all day but that didn't really matter because I was out of the House the whole time but I was like okay. I really need to do laundry today. And this morning it was like cloudy and rainy but then the sun came out around like noon so I was like laundry time and this is how I knew I was a grown up. That's how I know I'm a Grad of what I'm excited that I'm able to do laundry in the manner to which I'm accustomed stormed if the gas prices are less than four dollars a gallon and like I have a favorite grocery store. It's trader Joe's I get that.