20 Episode results for "Peggy She"

10 Years Ago, Braden and Powell Were Perfect

A's Plus

27:14 min | 7 months ago

10 Years Ago, Braden and Powell Were Perfect

"Hello and welcome to as plus the San Francisco Chronicle's podcast on the Oakland A.'s. And Major League Baseball. I'm your host chronicle as beat writer Susan's lesser and today. We have part two of our interview with former as catcher. Landon Powell. This week will be the tenth anniversary of Dallas. Braden's perfect game. Landon Powell is the man who caught it. He'll tell us more about that. Day In two thousand and ten coming up next on as plus our guest today on as plus podcast as part of our as gone by series is land in Powell. The former as catcher in land in this is such a great week to talk to you because Saturday is the tenth anniversary of Dallas. Braden's perfect game and you're the catcher. I know that's a highlight for you for any catcher. That obviously is involved in even a no hitter. It's a it's a major accomplishment but correct me if I'm wrong you just come up like two weeks before that is that right. Yes so I applied to be with you. Susan and Hope you're well and yes so I was bouncing around a little bit. That's spring so I I year the year before and that spring training we made some rule five moves and had some new guys come in and we are was very tight actually You know I started the season. Think down the triple eight for the first ten games. And then I came right up and I went back and forth down the Sacramento in Oakland. Back and forth between sacramen- Oakland about five or six times between opening day and the end of May so But that yeah that that moment perfect game I had been up for maybe a couple of weeks for sure. 'cause I called a couple of doubts starts in a row. I was him Kinda working together. And you know I. It's perfect game and then I think maybe the next outing he pitched in I think it was Anaheim and had a great outing. And then the next time he was due to pitch I got sent down. Actually the they did the ceremony at the field in Oakland where they Unveiled the the logo on the fence and presented him with home plate. And all that stuff. I actually sit down that day I was. I was part of the I was part of the ceremony on the field and was very grateful to be there and be a part of that but yeah I got sent down that day. Yeah baseball it's business and and you know as we're trying to do what was best for the organization so they're zero heart feelings for me but I've actually came back up. I think the middle or into May and stayed the rest of the year and And so yeah the fond memories I it was an incredible day Just one of those magical times in baseball I tell you so many stories about that day and and a great would have been a part of it. Okay let's let's get into it though because I got. I got lots of questions about that day. So you mentioned you. Not only did you. Catch DOUSE A lot. That's season you'd caught him for a long time. You guys kind of came together. Did you realize that his stuff was special in the bullpen day? Did you have any sort of inkling? He might be extra on. You know not really to be honest with you. I'd been to. Douse drafted the same year. And you know came up through the minor leagues together. Like you said pretty much. Every level played together In Arizona Fall League everything so I'd spent tons and tons of time playing with him catching him and had a good rapport with him so Dallas's repertoire his facile on exchange upwards is really locate US fastball. He he He had he had great control. And that was the more like a screwball to be honest with you. He kinda threw two different one. Zero one that you know Was more of a contacted. And then he throw the screwball which was more of a swing and miss but they were both I would just call. Changeup knew which one he felt was right for the situation. His third pitch was a slider his breaking ball and It he had not had a ton of success with that breaking ball leading up to this point in that season and so that day in the bullpen. He was really working on striking. Is Breaking Ball? His fastball on his changeup were good like they always were But I didn't go. You know when the bullpen was taking myself got. She's getting ready to strike out fifteen. It just was like. Hey He looks good. He's dialed in. He's actually running a little bit late that day. Which is unusual for him. He's always he's on a mission. The pitches doubts is like you know on the days. He's pitching he's going to war. He doesn't talk to anybody. He doesn't smile like he's you know he flip switch and he's a competitor and and that day he was actually run a little bit late which was unusual for him. You could tell it had him in a little bit of. He's uncomfortable us more panic that day than I think he normally did so That was unusual. That's something that I remember. But once the game started he was hitting the spots. He was using his fastball inside. Really well locating both sides of the plate That change up was as good as it's ever been that day and to me one of the the biggest X. factors that day for him. Slider breaking ball was really good and he was striking it early in counts so we were stealing a lot of strikes with it by calling you know slider when they may have been sitting basketball and they would just take it for strike one or maybe he fell behind one. Oh and we would just flip that slider in there and they would just take it because it wasn't a big part of his repertoire hitters. Had been looking at scattering watching video. They weren't really worried about the slider but that day he was he was using it really well and it perfect times and To me that changed a lot of those even council him and made him stay ahead in the count which allow to use his changeup and located fastball. Which is bread and butter? It's funny as a when perfect games are no no hitters happen A lot of players say they don't really realize it as it's gone along until pretty late in the game now as a catcher. I would think you're on A. You're not one of those guys that looks up in the seventh inning and goes oh wait. He hasn't given up any team. You must have had a pretty good idea throughout like wait. Nobody's nobody's reach base at this point so I knew I knew the no hitter was obviously going on at followed obviously the catcher fallen every every inning so third-inning at any hit but to be honest with you. I didn't realize the perfect game part of it until maybe the fifth or sixth innings. That's like the first time I thought to myself. He's got no hits but oh wait. I don't I don't think anybody's zoomed in on base. Has there been an error. Has there been? I mean. That's probably the fifth inning is when it really like I don't even think anyone's been on base and so that's not that it changes a lot because to be honest with you Susan as a as a catcher. You're so you're so anti superstitious with moments at you know you just assume that it's not going to happen. You know like I. I've been in hundreds and hundreds of games where you know you're going into the six or seven nobody's been on base or no one's gotten a hit yet and you're like all this is going to be the day it never is. It's never the day so you just kind of assume well something's going to happen. It's baseball And I probably didn't get nervous for Dallas or for the situation until maybe the end of the seventh inning when he finished the seventh. I was like oh. Wow this can really six more out. Does nothing really happened and in Dallas too? I mean I think he will admit this. His his Taos was a contact pitcher. You know. He wasn't a big strikeout and Oakland. Obviously the big field with a large outfield lot of open area. So I always thought like Oakland had more blue pts and CNN singles happened. They are than a lot of all parts and me the contact guy. Just you know I was. I was wincing the last. You know two innings. That game just pray. Something didn't happen man. It was an awesome day. You've mentioned to me a couple times. It was kind of an unusual day anyway. Noticed a couple of little strange things that had happened particularly when you guys were kind of exchanging baseball's like throwing a ball back in getting the ball back out of the pitcher to What happened there with a? I think it was tim. Wolf behind the plate. So if he's a plate who who was one of the best guys to work with. I love you always fun to work with one of the things about a gym wolf. Is He loves these. He's a great athlete themselves. You know obviously the brother fits in the major leagues for a long time. But gyms a great athlete He. He's in great shape and he loved to throw the ball back to the pitcher. That was one of the things that a lot of buyers don't do but Jim that was how he kept himself loose back there and he had fun with it. Says whenever there's a foul or ball in the dirt you know. Most catchers grabbed the ball from the empire and they throw back to the pitcher will will. Wolf wants a third himself. So when there's a foul ball each be just grabbed his bag and he fires it back. Pigeon Mountain know he slings it he throws it out there pretty good but he also helped her knuckleball. He keeps it like said that day. I think it was like the second or third inning There was a ball in the dirt that block I believe and it rolled maybe fifteen twenty feet away from home plate up I jumped up and grabbed it and I went to switch it out with Whoopi and he flipped the ball at the same time flipped him the bad ball the ball that had just been southall and so you know if you can imagine twenty feet away and kind of underhanded the ball to each other in mid air right between us the balls collided led the hit in the air and you know they felt the ground me you just started laughing about it you know like what are the odds you know that was kind of silly. I picked up the ball and threw it back to Dallas. He picked up the bad ball through to that boy off the field and You know it's just one of those things happen sometimes. It was kind of funny. We'll fast forward like seventh-inning and Dallas out and he doesn't he doesn't want the ball he's got he steps often forever. He's maybe had a cut on her. Maybe he just didn't like the way the ball fell so he you know he waved that he waved it with his hand toward me and said. Hey I want new ball. So he threw the ball and I was reaching from Woolsey to get the other ball. Wolf went ahead and threw the ball to douse right. And so as the ball stemming from Dallas from from sixty feet six inches away. Douse throwing the ball home. Play Wolf's turn the ball from behind home plate and they collide in mid air in between hopefully the mouth like the same exact thing came in and just me and up each other and we didn't laugh we were just like what like crazy like that happened twice in one day and you know the physics of happening from sixty feet away or very rare. I can tell you in my entire career playing baseball. That might happen twice or three times. I mean it's something that never happens. And so that that's one of the things to look back at that day and there's several things but that's just one of the things that sticks out man I was a magical day. You know just It felt like things were happening for a reason. We'll be back in just a moment with more with Landon Powell. The twenty twenty baseball season like all sports is on Hiatus. But we get the chronicle that you still want to hear from giants players coaches managers and other baseball news on the giants slash podcast on beat writer. Henry Shulman colleague John Shea and I plan to keep you informed imprint online and here on the splash especially on the important matter of wind. Baseball will resume the giant splash available on your favorite podcast APP. Now a Lotta Times in perfect games. There's some crazy great place defensively. There weren't a lot Necessarily like really hard place behind. Also Day Kevin Coups Munaf. I think in the eighth inning makes a really nice plan a foul ball in the dugout in the ninth inning. Eric Catterson has a little bit of a has a line drive. That kind of cuts a little bit on him makes that play. Wh what were your as your behind the plate. Where do you kind of thinking as you're watching the defense and you're watching all these big outs especially in the eighth and ninth inning? Yeah I agree. Those are two plays that definitely stick out to me You know coups coups made several good place at third During that game And the one in the dugout on a foul ball. I mean. Obviously it wasn't going to be a hip. It was a great play. Count was a favorable count for the hitter. So kind of bailed out a little bit but that was an incredible play. And I remember who's making the foul territory and Oakland is so big you know how was a a big catcher? That didn't run well so Foul balls for the DUGOUT. I just I. I didn't have the range to get to a lot of coups around about fifty yards to get that ball And it was a great place. I remember the one that Patterson NC. Eric and I played in college together. We're on the USA National Team College. I up playing with woody pat for a long time. And he's an infielder by trade and use a second baseman and had not played a ton of left field To that point and was kind of you know for us at that time and he was not an everyday out an everyday outfielder He was a guy that we're kind of plugging in there. We had Adam resolves playing second that kind of move e pat out the outfield During that particular time in the season so Eric was not a you know. He was not an accomplished outfielder so but he made several good plays out there. And that line drive you spoke of and that was the one held my the whole time. I just felt like it was going to fall I remember a couple of blue to first base that when it was first hit I thought it was gonna go over Derek Barton's head and it just hung up just just enough. Derek was able to get underneath it so there were a couple of plays stuck out. I mean the biggest one I think was gave Kappler Trying to remember. I don't know exactly what inning it was. But he was a three one count Well shoot I mean it happened twice I think his second allots battle in a three one count and he swung the ball out of the zone fouled it all and it should have been ball four and then he ended up getting out on the three to count. And then the last play the game the ground Teddington was also a three one count and it was a ball. If you go back and watch the video it was probably out of his own. And he grounded out to end the game so But that's anytime there's any kind of no hitter a perfect game you gotTa Get. Lucky and You Know Dallas Dallas did differently than most pitchers me. He only struck out. Think six guys perfect game. Which is maybe. It was at the least ever in a perfect game. So it's not like he went struck out eighteen guys or you know a lot of things had to happen. It was I think both Dallas myself anyone. That was a part of that. Game will tell you that the luck was on our side so yeah that well that varied the last pitch I'm sure you know I don't know if you actually knew. At the time. Dow Stint other count. Dallas thought to pitchy. Actually I think he shook you off and he's told up to me. He's told that story about say that said. Wow Yeah so. He thinks it's too too. I think you cough fastball. Right and he he shakes off. Is that basically what happens yet? He didn't shake up much that game. I mean I tell I tell people that you know I called every pitch and I think he shipped me off three times the whole game and And that was one of them and the other ones. Were you know that there was a foul ball and one on my ball design but we were pretty much on the same page the entire day. If you the count maybe me off. I just waiting for that but it worked out. Yeah I mean that's that's A. That's an awful lot luck now. Having Known Dallas as well as do Dallas is a singular personality Kind of kind of unusual. We all I think we all know that You caught him a lot would was he a guy you ever would have thought would have thrown the nineteenth perfect game in baseball history. I mean No probably not no disrespected Dallas. I mean he knows I love. You know he's my guy but he's not he no he's not he didn't have the type of stuff that you assume a perfect game guy would have but you know. Eric Burly through for The Berlin threw a perfect game. Mark Burleigh sorry That's bad that didn't say his name. Mark Burleigh the perfect game right before dialysis. Which was I think? Four or five years earlier and him. Dallas are very similar pitchers as far as their stuff So it's not shocking but also you would assume that guys like Randy Johnson or or Felix Hernandez guys with electric stuff or gotta be the guys though. Perfect Games in in Dallas will be the first one that wasn't him he didn't have ninety five in the tank. I mean He. He was a pitcher in Dallas. Taos new how to Pitch. And he knew how to compete and he was a bulldog and he was savvy. He would change his delivery every pitch. It seemed like the different timing of hitter. He's constantly messing up the timing of the hitter. You couldn't run on them And obviously in the perfect game was on the base anyway but he still used some of that tempo some of his changes in his delivery to mix up hitters just as much as he was due to defeat runners. He would do it to to mess. Hitter's timing as well so he's just a crappy cagey but no probably not a guy that would have thought within a perfect game and You know I probably wouldn't have catcher. That many people thought would be catching a perfect game so that that's what makes the story even cooler. Yeah I it's really I mean there is because it's Dallas. There was all sorts of other stuff going on A lot of drama and I think the best part for many of us. You know the fact that happens on Mother's Day in Dallas had lost his mom when he was in high school and he was so close to his grandma. Peggy who was there? Wh- I know you were among the many of us who are really touched when she came down on the field. Where do you recall about that moment? Man I mean just I wanna the I remember as I thought she was. GonNa hurt herself. Jumping off the DUGOUT. She you know she she was. She came down the bleachers on top of that dugout and is rated to dive headfirst off the dugout like it was a mosh pit You know like she was Gonna Crowd Surf but Yeah JUST WATCHING DALLAS. Pick her up and and the hug and the embrace they had you know it's hard it was hard to hold back tears and you're so happy for him and knew that he what he had been through in his life and and. I don't know if everyone of that time New Dallas story but Yeah the kid overcame a lot and his life to give me was at that point and his grandma was such a huge part of that and for them to be able to share that moment on Mother's Day. It's just one of those other special things. I was talking about like the balls colliding amid air just so many things fell in line that day. It just made sense that you know that I'm a Christian so for me. It was like God designed all that. But if you're not a person of faith you just look at that and say you know. Our Earth has a way of just things lining up and having these perfect days and that was one of them and And I'm so grateful that I was able to experience that I know Dallas toots. It's it's changed his life forever. Yeah it's a it's amazing. He also had the the kind of really the running controversy with Alex. Rodriguez at that point. Two had you were you up when he got into it with a rod when Rodman ran across the mound in Dallas there. I was there for that in the and you know. A. Rod a rod kind of dismissed them after the game. Like you know. Who is this guy? And I'm not even going to answer that question and give him his fifteen minutes of fame so that was like a big deal and You know get off. My mound shirts were being made. And so there's that whole riff and it was just poetic justice that within fifteen days or whatever that that happened that Dallas went and threw a perfect game and now he's in his history in the game of Baseball fifteen minutes of fame. It's a the guy made a name for himself. It's GonNa last forever and says I'll tell you a story Susan that'll that'll go with that If you got a second this kind a little bit strange when you know when pitcher so perfect games they typically gift their catch catcher. Something you know Roy. Halladay gave a catcher Affiliate game like a rolex. I heard you know there's other guys have bought catchers cars done things like that so obviously. Dallas wasn't making type of money that some of these big name pitchers whereas than I and I didn't expect any huge gift Dallas my wife's and I to Hawaii On a seven day vacation which was incredible eight. They paid for the flight he paid for the hotel. Rooms it was awesome. And it's one of those trips. My wife and I will always remember and I. It's a an awesome thing so I'm so grateful. Doubts did that for me and my wife was so we're in Hawaii. Four Seasons in Maui and my wife and I decided to do the drive to Honda. And it's all long winding that takes you up to the top of a mountain. I guess there's all kinds of stops along the way there's waterfalls and black sand beaches and things that you can stop at so we stop it a black sand beach and we're total tourists. My wife's got camera hanging around her neck. And you know we're we're we're sourcing it up and and we're walking down black sand beach and it's a beautiful day and there's nobody out there. I mean you can see. There's a couple of people way down the beach a couple of people over here but you might be fifteen people in the whole beach and see. Feel very isolated. So we're walking down this beach and I see a fallen palm tree or something laying over to the left and there's a guy and a girl sitting on palm tree and they're eating Some kind of lunch out of a bag and ask walking and we're getting closer. I looking at that. Looks just like Rod I'm like no way they run like surely it's not him but it looks just like him and as we got closer sure enough it was a routes in. I mean he's sitting there on this tree eating lunch at a black sand beach in Maui and he looks at me like he recognizes me. But he probably doesn't because a nobody backup catcher. Had No clue I was he. He could tell he was looking at me like you recognize me and I obviously knew who he was so I kind of walked Everson said hey era I was like. I'm Landon Power. I'm the Catcher for the as and played against. He's Oh yeah and I didn't even pay attention Susan who's sitting next to him. I I really didn't I was so taken aback. A-rod was on the beach in the middle of nowhere but he was with cameras. That's not my wife walks up. And she's like star Cameron Diaz because she loved her and so there we are a Ron Cameron Diaz deserted beach. So a-rod asked me was just Kinda dumb question when you think about it. But he goes. We were total tourists and my wife had a camera around neck and it was obvious what we were doing there. And they ragas. What are you doing here? Are you from here? You've lived and I started laughing. I was like no. I don't live here I'm on vacation like you are probably He Goes Oh you know it's Kinda Funny Actually Dallas Brayden sent me here for the perfect game and and I kinda. I've said it so. I tried so hard not to laugh when I said but I know grinned. Kind of a little bit of a kind of a gotcha moment for Roberts. Yeah grading sitting here per game. He was like Oh yeah oh cool and he didn't really WANNA talk about that. He didn't like the name. Doubts Brayden being said but I I felt felt like in moment. I had to say doubts his name. Just a you know. A rod deserved to But yeah that's one of those crazy stories How how things aligned so yes. It's absolutely nutty. My favorite era thing from that day was Dallas. Was Grandma. Peggy She she talked to the media afterwards and she was absolutely delightful. She's a pistol Shocker should just just like als but I asked something about the Iraq thing I was like well. You know a couple of weeks ago Arabs like I don't even know who this guy is. Lease only got a handful of wins. Who is he Do you have anything to say about you? Know a two a Rod essentially now that Dallas has done this and she said it's a couple of well you know it's whatever and I know you know we don't Blah Blah Blah. And then all. She's she stopped. She paused and then she went. Stick it a rod and I think that's the most laughed laughter I've ever heard in the press room it was It was hilarious. She's definitely she's definitely a fissile. You nailed it on the head. There's this silo I love here. What ARE THE NEW YORK? Writers then went and told a ride like. Hey Look Douse Dell's brains. Grandma just said stick it after his game. And and A-rod said circle so yeah you show it up on a beach go like hey. I'm here. Dallas ME. He was like Oh no. That was another uncle moment for him for share. So funny that's so crazy. So how many times do you think you've watched the perfect game or do you watch like just parts of it? So you you. You're not GonNa like this answer but I've never watched it I've never gone back and watched it like the whole game. So I've seen some people like put like highlights on on social media or something that might show every out the twenty seven but it's only the twenty seven pitches that outs are made on. So I've seen that. I've never sat down and watched the game. I've watched an ending here of air. I watched the last maybe the last two innings But no I've never actually gone back and watch the whole thing so I if I were you. I'd have it on a loop in my house just constantly playing what. What do you still have two young kids? I have a seven year old daughter and a ten year old son and they've never seen so I need to actually probably need to like show Tim at some point but I I try to. I try to be modest in And not you know that's up to come up. They'll love it though. That would be so great. What what do you have from that game? Did you save much stuff? Yes I have a have all my catcher's equipment at all I guess authenticated authenticated So I have all my catching gear I have my That's about it. That's about all Jersey Jersey is authenticated me in Dallas signed at the day of the game and And I had some baseball's they got the leftover gained balls There was like forty something other than that were already rubbed up. And they were the official game balls for the game and so Dallas and I wouldn't sign them all and I got a dozen of them and said I've given a couple of donated a couple of years to charity and basketball have ample. I'M GONNA keep one my son and my daughter and then I had the the last out of the eighth inning. Bj Upton struck out and have the ball. And I have in. Ob off indicated. That's that's some of the little things that that's really cool. Thanks join us on as plus awesome are. Thanks again to Landon Powell for joining us on as plus our producer. Today was G Allen Johnson. We will be back again next week with mores plus thanks for listening. And he's plus is a production of the San Francisco Chronicle support as plus and all of the chronicles journalism by signing up for Chronicle membership at SF chronicle dot com slash pot.

Dallas baseball Landon Powell Susan Oakland San Francisco Chronicle Major League Baseball basketball Peggy She Anaheim writer A-rod Taos Grandma Braden Powell Mark Burleigh Sacramento Dallas Brayden Wolf
Muses: Loretta Lynn Part 2

Rock N Roll Archaeology

58:27 min | 4 months ago

Muses: Loretta Lynn Part 2

"Hey sexy this pleasant Gaiman rockin row witch and culture. Maven. You're listening to Pantheon podcasts around. Pantheon PODCASTS, Uy presents. From. Toronto Canada. Muses. With your host. Shanty and links. The podcast that celebrates the women are rock and roll. Interviews. Stories. And Fabulous Bond. So. Grab those backstage passes and let's get to our show. Hey, welcome to muses. This is the podcast all about women music, the musicians, the photographers, the wives, and girlfriends the groupies you name it, you name it we cover it. You name it we covered and if we haven't covered it. Let us know we'll cover it. Everybody welcome. My name is Shawn T and this is the beautiful talented links all thank you. That was a really lovely introduction there. Appreciate that. And how are you doing? Welcome I'm doing great I'm really excited to do part two of Loretta Lynn Avert Lynn. So. We'd a great time with part one. And then I left you hanging on the edge of your seat. You'd certainly did my God. What a story. All right and before we get into that everybody so much for being patrons supporting us on Patriots. If you haven't done that already and you would like to know pressure over to Pedro Dot com slash muses podcast, and another one at you can support us is by going to our website. And you can sign up for our newsletter which we send out. Once. A month. And they're great newsletters to Shanti makes them and they are fabulous I get them and I get excited when I get them so. Good Work Sean. T. And then you can head over to the blog and read the amazing twenty questions that links was the was the brain on that one and we ask amazing women, Lay Pamela, Bar Maureen van Zandt Kristen Casey Roxana. Shroud. Twenty questions about everything under the sun there things you know concerts that they've loved and meeting rockstars and it's just another little fun thing that you can go and go and read about. So head over to our website and uses pod dot com and there's lots of extra fun stuff there for you to. That's right. I'm so excited for this. Her story is incredible part. One was amazing as is, and to know she has this whole other life after already having like a whole life before she's twenty. something. Else I know I didn't want to edit this episode in try to squeeze it all into one because like what could have taken out from the first episode I thought it was all great. So That, you thought that it'd be okay to do a two parter for the first time and uses history. So maybe this won't be the last one but we kind of left off where Loretta had been gifted at Guitar I originally said when she was fourteen, my nose hearsay eighteenth birthday either way she was between fourteen and eighteen when she got a guitar and that's actually a little bit old sometimes as like you know a lot of people start playing guitar when they're much younger than that. But either way she practiced it and she got really good and just singing up in butcher holler up in the mountains and rocking babies are on the porch and singing to them and listening to the radio. That's where Loretta learned how to Sing I was going to say it's amazing that she even learned that guitar all when she had four babies that she was taking care of an actual babies 'cause they happen like some fast one after another a no. So no excuses people out there if you. Start a new hobby you just go ahead and you pick up guitar. Yeah Yup growing up in butcher Holler. They Sang Lot. They sang that country music and they kind of passed on from family members. and. So there were other members of Loretta family that were not professional singers at the time, but just kind of enjoyed it. Now, one thing that we did mention in the first episode as well is that Loretta was thankful for her husband do little for really encouraging her to start a career in music, and then he really helped her out with the business side of things, and she also really thanks him for some of the inspiration of some of her best song. So I figured that we would start off with a song. and. This is one that doolittle especially inspired and it's called. Don't come home a drink in with love and on your mind. Love it here it as. Abby. When you came home last night. You're been out with all. Then you. have. They just don't mix leave the ball me behalf. Come. Your. All right. So when once the radical got married and had children, she had been away from home for about ten years and then when she went home and spend some time with her family members, she found out that some of them had been singing in bars and hotel clubs. So all in all there were but four people in the red his family that ended up being in the music business in Nashville but none of them would today's big as Loretta ever got. That's so cool that they all. gravitate not all. There's a lot of them, but some of them gravitated towards music like she did the Yes. So Loretta was twenty four years old when she really started her singing career, her oldest daughter was ten. Wow do little really encouraged her to practice her guitar and sing. She didn't take any lessons and she I began by singing kitty wells songs, and then writing her own now like we mentioned before an episode one. Loretta was very bashful as she called it and do encouraged her to sing in front of people. He said it would be a chance to make some extra money. So she kept practicing and you know he really made the decision in those days She says that she still be a housewife today if dude didn't bring her that guitar home and encourage her to be a singer, she says, it's great that he did that. Yeah. She says, why deny it do little is a brilliant man always looking to do something different or better if we're off in Kentucky and somebody says the road to Daddy's graveyards washed out do little don't grumble about it. He borrows somebody's bulldozer and goes up and fixes the road he's a good worker and a good businessman to I've always had faith in his judgment that way when he told me something I was pretty sure it would probably work out so good partner in ways foreshore in one night and this nineteen sixty. They went to a bar with live music with another couple the boys started drinking and do pasturing the band leader to let Loretta Get up and sing saying I, got a girl here tonight who's the best country singer? There is next to kitty wells and I ain't kidding. So they didn't let up that night, which is was good for Loretta because she was like new button bandleader said to bring her over to their house on Wednesday and they try her out. It was the house of John Marshall Pen two guys in a group called the western years. New One song look to play and she wasn't sure what Ki-. It was in saying for them and thought that was that like that's it. But they came over the next day and they asked if she would sing with them that Saturday night. So they liked what they heard. They saw something special just like do had so they. Pay Her five dollars and use the tape they recorded for of her on their radio show like she couldn't believe it and then she got very scared. Up on stage when it was time to go, she tripped over her dress. She dropped a Coffee Cup with the governor's feat that night because he was in town be listening to them sing and they thought it would be a good idea to have herbal served coffee. But she's like. I was so clumsy would never be a good server but she played guitar that night and she sang and they invited her back to sing next Saturday for another five dollars. Yeah And she thought that she was a million hair. It's cute because this chapter is called beginner's luck. But it would just keep rolling for her honestly. She is that not many people liked country music than if you did you call it closet country because you listen to it in secret. I wonder what they were listening to instead good question, rock and roll Elvis. So four months. With this band and Loretta doolittle decided to go out it on their own thread, a played, the Rhythm Guitar and her brother Jack Played Lead Guitar. They had a coffee pot and they painted a kitty on it, and if people wanted to request a song, they drop nickel or dime into the pot. Group was called the reddish trail. Blazers. But Jack said that they should have called themselves Loretta, tail riders because she used to ride their tails so much to do better. So her little bossy spirit and that little meanness, Cameron, handy because she was self-assured knew she wanted and she was the leader of the Bandon ways. So at the time, little was working as a heavy duty auto mechanic during the day and he would go and supervise their shows at night Loretta was terrified of performing and I was scared of saying a word to the crowd. But in later performances, I would watch and she seemed so confident and at ease and full of charisma like so sweet and like she seemed like a natural. at I she was really scared. She grew into it. Yeah. I've never enjoyed playing music for other people. I've always really enjoyed to play the piano and the guitar for myself but I hated recitals and I hated it when my mom would be like friends over like playing song for them. Practicing the piano today in somebody walks in all of a sudden start doing. Terrible. I am not. and. But Hey, at least I'm not a bad public speaker. So you're great public speaker are take it. So Loretta was terrified. As I said but she eventually came out of her shell and tune. If she was playing six weeks a week which Loretta enjoyed because she'd been a housewife since she was thirteen she was finally getting out like if she'd gone to high school hall or Never Gotten married, you know she would be learning things and going places and she never done that before. Yeah she's living really for the first time like her own unique life type of thing. Yeah. On Sundays, they play at different kinds of hospitals and air force bases. She sang in a fair and Lyndon, and she won the Grand Prize? Of Twenty, five dollars and. Was Confident enough that it was time to go to Nashville. Yeah. So the RETA had someone spot her on one of her TV appearances that she made when she was there and he wasn't exactly in the music business. But he had a lot of money and he wanted to help a make a record. He ended up being quite a good man. She started writing her own songs and to help her she picked up a copy of Country Song Roundup the magazine with words to hit songs and she figured well, if anyone can write these songs, it's nothing to it really I can do it too. She did that's right. After writing some songs, she was given money to head to la do accompanied her and the kids stayed back with the red, his brother and his wife it wasn't as easy as they thought many places wouldn't even take their money to record Loretta, but do persistent. So he found a place who agreed to let her make a record. Loretta. Says that the recording studio was half the size of a motel room with machines and a few musicians. But they liked what they heard and they called in some really good pickers to come and play on her song. A few weeks later, they sent them a shipment records. Amazing. doolittle ever of A. Renaissance. Man had a hobby of Photography and so he took the photo of her for it. She said that the album was fine but you know they were pitiful. They didn't know how to put out a record. Yeah. Send copies to radio stations all around the country and even wrote up a little something about her life to go inside. So you know when they were packing the record, they would pack the photo that do took of her and this little letter and they call the disc jockeys themselves to get played and most of the time the DJ's played it. People would then hear the song on the radio and they would want to buy their record, but they couldn't get the record in stores fast enough. So the stores never had the records, but one day they're still guitar player came over and told them that their song was on the charts. So we're gonNA read it in. Do didn't even know what the charts were. A top ten on July twenty, fifth nineteen, sixty billboard charts and number fourteen in the national country music charts. So we're into the nineteen sixties. So she mentioned having recorded two songs at the time for that record and I think this song called. Honky tonk girl was really one of the first things that she had ever written and it started to get really popular and it really started to get played so less listen to Honky tonk girl. The. Main. Hard. Off. Okay so this mystery man who was giving them money in the business guy, his name was Mr Burleigh he was financing their record and he was really happy with their success. He paid for them to do a promotion trip around the country. He really was good man and he wanted the ready to learn as much about the industry as she could, and if she ever got the chance to be on a major label, he said he would release her from her contract because he didn't want to stand in her way what an amazing Guida have for support. That's that's fantastic I know it's like a nice refreshing oriented. Absolutely we waiting for me to be like, but he didn't stick to his word and there was A. Role but no, he like he's talked to it so. That's fabulous. So Loretta doolittle went on Tour and not being able to afford to stay in motels they slept in their car and they eight Baloney Sandwiches Bologna and cheese. Thing she. CanNot Baloney Sandwich? So she only had one dress and a list of radio stations. They turn the dial when they got close she changed her dress and they'd go into the radio station. So small or large they would hit all of the radiation that they could. She still kind of looked like a kid and do never let her wear makeup. So the disc jockeys were always kind of really nice to her. So she says. At one place. They were all really nice to her except for like the sky at first. I one place I asked if they had me record and they said, no. But I looked out the corner of my eye and I spotted it in the garbage can. I asked politely, if I could give them a copy they said all right. I walked over to the garbage can and I handed him the record they smiled all sheepish like but ever since then the studio has been behind me all the way. Man The read out for her for not letting like. You know affect her. Yeah. She eventually loved you know chatting at radio stations and meeting all the boys do would sit in the car and listen to her on the radio. In Arizona, she met a very nice disc jockey around the same age as her me had pimples and greasy hair they ended up sending letters back and forth until he got into singing to she says. Waylon Jennings that's who it was. Yeah I love. The way that she kinda tells these stories like she builds it up a little bit and then she's like I'm believe his name was. Waylon Jennings. So, yeah. She met someone named Hugh. Cherry. who was the man who would break the hillbilly records in California so she gave him Honky tonk girl he played it and she told that she was going to get to the Grand Ole opry and he said, you know it usually takes about four years to get there but Loretta did it that very same year? Oh my goodness like the same year that she started singing me to record. She made it to the opry or you know pretty spot is crazy. Wow and then it was L- listed with a few others as the most promising girl singer. Loretta is like moving fast. She's putting into Nova's e and she's got a good little team and she's got that real natural talent. So I love. and to be for her. Absolutely. While, the disc jockeys did help her by playing her Music Loretta was lot to her fans people started listening to her and liking her right away. So they would request her songs they would buy her records and she says like there's really nothing like country music fans their fans for life. She even recognizes some of her fans all around the country. She says that most of her fan. Club is women and that's how she wants it. She says men have enough going for them. Women have to stick together Yeah I love her so much. Oh my goodness. So there were these sisters called the Johnson Sisters who really helped Loretta first they were huge fans. They Pester Club in Aurora Colorado to Hire Loretta for one night. So Loretta hopped on the bus and she went alone. She was so nervous when she arrived, she said that the three girls were standing backstage and they were so friendly. It's like they had known each other all their lives. So like they were there, they put on the show for Loretta the. Her with open arms when they got there, you know amazing Patsy Kline had played the club a week prior. And this is going to kind of kick off a little bit of a friendship between Loretta and Patty soon now. are going to start to. Soon. But. Booth that before Loretta went on the girls had asked her like aren't you going to get made up? And she never had before. So for the First Time Loretta, put on makeup the show success. And these girls stayed friends for life. Says they're not fans. Their friends are I. Love A. One time one of the Girls Bought Loretta, a short skirt and the said, Oh, my God you can see my kneecaps. Famous for a really long dresses and then address that like went up to her neck you know and she gets outlook from in years. The girls even travel around their area asking for Loretta. Records and their juke boxes, and if they weren't there, they made sure they got put their Loretta had fan clubs all over and once a year she'd invite the fan club presidents out to have a party at her house a large meal. Dance you know to say thank you. She is just the most wonderful sweetest woman I love that she really cared about everyone who was helping her with her success. You know, Nia. She really tried her best to chat with fans after. But once she started playing many shows had begun to have the migraines that her father had. Played Her for many years. So lots of times after a show she just have to go on a lie down in her boss but before that, she tells a cute story about a time. She finished a show and there was a man in his eighties waiting by her bus his daughter said that he was going to die soon and really wanted to meet her. So Loretta. Hugged him and gave him an autograph and you said. Take Me Homeboys, I'm ready to die now. So. Fans loved her and she loved them. So while on the road, she was getting another real education she knew from her marriage with do so far that married couples didn't always get along Loretta was told that people would like her singing better if they didn't know she was married but she didn't like really care about what people thought and she eventually started wearing a wedding ring and didn't slow men down from giving her their numbers or asking if she'd have drinks with them after the show and sometimes guys will get out of hand drinking and try to grab her. But whenever I was around, he would take anyone outside who attempted anything like that. Or I bet he would when do wasn't traveling with the Reta Mr Burley's sent this woman hired this woman to travel with her. So she thought it was for safety with the Woman Wanted Loretta to ride around in a convertible with the Bikini go on disk. Jockey because that's just the way it's done. So yeah, you wouldn't do any of that. She was going to sleep with anybody from the radio station to get her records played and the woman ended up getting fired pretty quickly. But you know read it was like learning like so people do these things in the music business when she just didn't. You know look for her. Yes. So threat saw a lot on tour learning about people in their behaviors. Most people think that her songs are all about her and her relationship with do but she'd really write about things that she saw like the song you ain't woman enough to take my man about a young woman who came to her show one night found the Rutta and told her that her husband. was there that night with another woman and at the same time Loretta just said to her? Don't worry about it. You Go and you get your man kind of like how she had done when do as he cheated on her and so let's listen to that song. You ain't woman enough to take my man. You Pass. Now You. Thank you can. Take. Did. In a bonus then. All. Right. I gotta say. I'm just I love the titles of her songs. I know I told my younger brother that we were going to be doing episode on the red. Olin he was like I love her and I'm like we do and he's like, yeah, and my younger brothers grade he always surprises me and he was telling me like, do you remember what episode of the Simpsons with Lorraine Lump Lumpkin and I was like yeah, he's like, I'm pretty sure that character was based off Loretta Lynn like Oh that makes sense. Did you watch a lot links? Know who talking about absolutely. Yeah, do. Her manager. Stage? But I do. That's that's right. I. Love It. Yeah. She was very clever with her lyrics. Yeah and I think. Yeah. So it makes sense at Loretto. Lumpkin was based on Ritalin. Yeah in Little Way anyways do never had to worry about Loretta cheating on him. You know when this book was written after Twenty Five Years of Marriage Loretta had said that she hadn't ever cheated on him. She said she'd met a few men who she could have liked but none enough who could ever take the place of her family. So she stayed out of trouble she's had met all. Oh, her around all over the city that they live in. Call Her hotel ask if they can come up but she never went for it. Now at doesn't mean that Loretta hasn't been accused over the years not do. But by people she been really with other country musicians as those she'd write songs with and she'd sing songs with but Loretta never did and she said that if she did sleep with someone else, it wouldn't have been to get anywhere in the business. anyways it would have been for her own accord. Yeah That's a good reason. Asleep was somebody I think So, Loretta is first appearance at the Grand Ole opry was October Fifteenth Nineteen Sixty. Now how did she get the GIG? Well, she got it for herself. She went to the manager and she said that she pestered him and he let her on the show and so she sang Song Honky tonk girl and was invited back and I believe this is where Ernest Tubb makes his appearance in the movie is when Loretta is invited up on stage the character that sang before her was Ernest Tubb but sense him in the movie so. Yes call true to his word Mr, Burleigh let Loretta her contract. When she moved onto something a bit bigger. She made Song of songs with Decca records who already had pasta Klein and Brenda. Lee assigned artists she was both polishing her act but staying true to herself she was encouraged to pronounce the words the way that she wanted to and they never made her feel stupid for talking as she calls it like. A Hillbilly one of the guys said people will always understand me because I was always myself. That's of her band members. She could only afford to bring her brother Jay Lee because she couldn't pay the rest of the guys to move away from home and pay their salaries, and that's when I'll his family settled in Nashville in Nineteen One Loretta started getting regular performing dates and was invited back to the opry every week. She says that there were many other girl singers trying to make it big them and they were jealous that Loretta was getting so many gigs and attention. So quickly, Loretta says that if it weren't for Patsy cline, she might have given up let patsy and when Patsy was only twenty seven Patsy had known hard times about what it was like to try to make it. They became fast friends if Passi had a fight with her husband, she called the Reta if learn how to fight would do little she called Patsy. So. Again quite a very unique and interesting friendship and the red even wrote a book about their friendship now I also noticed. On my wishlist of episodes to do patsy has a whole book, right? So we could even do a whole episode on her one day. Perfect. Yeah. Yeah, we'll get into her briefly since Patchy had made appearances with Loretta and an event with a bunch of other country singers. The stamp of approval meet everyone except Loretta wants Patsy said there it was cool. Everyone was like all right I guess she school. Patsy Thought Loretta She taught Loretta about show business. She bought her clothes. She gave her rhinestones, curtains, drapes drapes for her own because Greta was still too broke to afford any of these things herself and. Payment to go on the road to keep her company. The last time. Loretta saw Pazzi Pazzi was hanging drapes at House and had brought her a huge box close. On March Sixth Nineteen, sixty, three patsy was in a plane crash with a few others and there were no survivors. The RETA said that Patsy was like a mother and a sister to her and when Loretta would have twins awhile later she named one of them after Patsy. My goodness I love this friendship. Yeah. It's a shame that it ended. So early in that. So young when her life ended do little stayed home with children a lot. It was a hard subject for Loretta because her career paid off in money and other things but she missed out on a lot of her children's upbringing. Once he joined Loretta more children were left with their uncle and grandmothers in Indiana because both of the grandmothers had been living in. Indiana at that time when they moved to Nashville, they had babysitters Loretta oldest daughter had children pretty young as well, and so Loretta was grandmother by Twenty Nine do and Loretta taught their children to work hard and since they were young still when they did get money, they tried not to spoil their children. They still made them wear hand-me-down the kids never went to imagine. Being a grandmother. Right now. No. No it's just the most wild thing that I can think of being a mother right now it's just Too Much for me I'm St One. Twenty Nine Goodness Loretta goes into detail about the personalities of each of her children but since this episode is already like seven hours long you can read the carrier. Loretta says that she could do it all over again she would still go into show business she would have been with her children more in one, thousand, nine, hundred, sixty, two, Loretta went on Tour Working Forty, two shows in twenty five days. She was on television shows seen throughout the south and appeared before bigger crowds that she'd ever seen before. Rutta, jokingly calls herself a heifer her because she was so clumsy she has these stories about falling over on stage Bra straps breaking pantyhose, falling down to her ankles, and you know learning that it was important to smile as she walked onstage even if she was feeling sick or missing her kids. In Nineteen Sixty Three Loretta played the Hollywood bowl with Johnny cash. She went from playing for three hundred people to thousands. Wow. Yeah. The the fans started getting weird. They would try and piece of clothes off as a souvenir they would try to snip her curls and even her eyelashes. That is they want. Oh. My God owner been scary. Eventually, Loretta, booked all over the country and she really started enjoying it in was finding it a lot easier to be on stage. About her women fans, she said I tried aiming my show more at the women even though some of them got the wrong idea one time I was playing this club in Baltimore and this woman comes up to me in says. You're the woman that's in my husband's life. That's all I hear before I go to bed when I wake up in the Morning Loretta Lynn and I'm GonNa break your neck I sent. Woman I, don't even know your husband but if you touch me, I'm tired of you before I got the chance bound through through out of the club. My. Most of the women liked me though they could see I was. A mother and a wife and a daughter who had feelings just like other women sure I want to mend like me but the women were something special. They'd come around the bus after the show when they'd asked to talk to. They felt I had the answers to their problems because my life was just like there's whom. Yeah she's a woman's woman. is. First album was number one in nineteen, hundred, sixty, three, and in nineteen sixty four she was named top female vocalist. She was at the Grand Ole opry for seventeen straight shows, which was a record for anyone who wasn't a member, and then finally they asked you to join. Yeah that'll do it. Yeah. So Loretta Heard Kitty Wells sing songs from the woman's perspective because country music from the men's perspective was all truck driving easy women and cheating. She remembered how Kitty Sang. The woman's side of the story and wanted to hear songs more like that and she says, you know it certainly helped that kitty wells and patsy. Kline can before her and they kind of like led the charge Loretta. Also just talking about music that she really liked she really loves Ray Charles she said that country music owes locked to him preparing fans, Johnny cash and Merle Haggard Charley Pride. The first black country star is one of his all time favorites as well, and so she says that she's his biggest fan. So the song don't come home and drink in the one we mentioned earlier got to be number one. In the nation was also the first album ever made by a woman singer that a million dollars she says, she didn't want any outside influences changing her music and so she really didn't listen to Joni Mitchell or Bob. Dylan or the Beatles kind of stayed in her own little bubble. One of her personal highlights is when Ernest Tubb chose her to sing with him on an album of duets and so when she's with him, she feels like that little girl huddled on the floor in front of the Pico Radio on Saturday night. Now, before she knew it, they were making more money than they'd ever dreamed of she went from twenty five dollars a show to fifty to a hundred and above. She still did her own canning and put food away from the winter. She said, you never know when the show business is to go for fluey. He says once you've been poor you always feel in the back of your mind you're going to be poor again. Started paying off. Do gave up his job as mechanic to take more interest in the business and they found a forty five Acre ranch and rented a little house in Madison Tennessee in late nineteen, sixty three. We'll the ready discovered that she was. A pregnant again. Loretta. He. Yeah. With wins by the way. Loretta was worried that her career would be interrupted. Things moved on she named them Patsy and Peggy She said that they were godsend. It was like a whole second life for her and do happened because they had them when they had the money and time to devote to them. She was on the road a lot and they were adult the. Loretta new little were adults at this time to call. Yes. Yeah. So they got to spend more time with them. They were identical twins in. Loretta couldn't always tell them apart especially when she just come home up the road. She begged hey twin and they don't call. Me By my name. So, reticence that they were never really part of Nashville social scene and that forty five acres ended up not being enough for them and they kind of got lost once on a drive and found a beautiful one, thousand, four, hundred and fifty Acre property with an old house built on a hill or the whole town, and it had like white columns in the front. It was in such bad shape though that when Loretta was on the road, do actually thought he'd set the whole thing on fire. He had tears in his eyes because it was probably best to just rebuild, but he knew how much Loretto loved the House. So he fixed it up for them. So threaded. Didn't know this again because she. was educated in some ways and not in some ways but she didn't know that it had originally been a plantation house and if you look at pictures of it, you see it immediately with the white columns, the way that it's built. She talked about seances that they've had there because it was a salute. There was a civil war battle fought there on the grounds that they're actually enslaved people buried in the property and when she found that out, it made her really sad. since they ended up buying so much of the land, it's kind of like the ended up buying the whole town. So do fix stop picks it up into a real working ranch and it's worth a lot. Now you can see it and take a tour you can go and Youtube people have taken tourism it and made whole videos of it so. Just, you know search hurricane mills and it definitely has graceland vibes. Cool. I'll look it up. That's where the recreation of the butcher Holler home is as well, and it says, you know it portrays the legacy of the rags to riches coal miner's daughter Yeah. I just looked it up and like you said, yeah you can really tell it's beautiful but Yeah, you can tell. Old Plantation Home in the House Loretta explains on the wall going up the winding stairway. We've got all forty five of my albums framed in the order that I did him. This is nineteen, seventy five that truth this and there's forty five then more now there's some one I didn't use any makeup before do finally let me you can see me changing album after album. It's really kind of weird to see I've got all kinds of souvenirs around the house a bed Hank Williams zoned the cowboy hat tex ritter used to wear my second rhythm guitar some personal things Patsy Kline gave me I have Roy Roy. Acuff. I don't know how to say that Yoyo. Yeah a suit from Hank snow a coat from Marty, Robbins Chet, Atkins Golf. Hat, and beautiful gown that my friend June Carter gave me while she's got quite collection. there were always animals on the property through our for dogs, cats, snakes, skunks. She says, like I told you, we're country when she's there, which isn't that often she enjoyed planting flowers going for rides in the jeep and maybe riding a horse mostly she just like to sit and talk with her friends. The place was mostly used for TV specials and album cover photos. It didn't feel to private because fans would just walk right up to the door. It got to be too hard to only be there for a day. So when she was in Nashville, she just stay in a motel. She says, that's what I mean when I say being success don't guarantee you happiness. The ranch was kind of deal in the way, but it also caused a lot of problems in their marriage. It costs them so much money. So she had to keep a busy schedule in order to like. This kind of new lifestyle, right and that was wrecking her how. Do, is working so hard watching the kids she was gone from home. A lot of people also try to split them up making rumors about them that they'd each been dating other people. She says that despite the rumors little was a family man, he'd rather be setting feeders for his quail and riding his bulldozers and escaping to Vegas to gamble and see showgirls things would run more smoothly when he was on tour but he didn't like being cooped up in a motel room for too long and out of boredom and social anxiety, he would drink too much and then criticized Loretta for something she did or didn't do on stage and it really hurt her when he drank, they'd have fights in. Front of their team and it would make people nervous. But by the morning her endure back laughing and joking until the next time, that is when they got to Nashville, they agreed to almost any good cause because they got invited to you because they had a place in their hearts for people with the sad story, they'd visit hospitals she tried to give as much as she could to charity people would even right to her telling about their problems and ask if she send the money and a lot of the time, she would want to do that until like their manager would have to look into it and be like now this is real. This is not real kind of be careful so and Nineteen seventy-one Loretta started to get worn out her health started to decline. She had really bad period pains kept getting worse should experience migraines and rumors started that she'd be drunk onstage but she didn't drink in nine, hundred, seventy, two, a tumor was found in lettuce ripe breast, and since there wasn't much discussion about cancer back then she didn't know much about in she kept putting it off but eventually got surgery to remove the tumor. Then, she found out she has high blood pressure and it was all kind of a mess. So she started taking time off at the end of each month got water pills for her migraines and stopped taking aspirin because it turned out she was allergic to them as a little bit of a break place. They built a home in Mexico now she won't say where and she loved it because no one knew her the there and nobody cared and it was something that she says really helped improve both it's the one place I can go to relax swank a tell nobody where it is she says. They're. The fish in the eat all day long and it's good because on her tour nineteen seventy-three, she got down to about ninety pounds and like the stress had gone to her So when they would go to visit Mexico, she eat all day long gaining one pound a day for almost a month she said do said I. was like a flower opening up every day he could see the collar coming back day by day and it was true I'm telling you I was born to be a housewife, not a singer. So, in Nineteen, seventy five when she was reading this book, She was making about ten thousand dollars a show she says, she doesn't think she's improved much performer. So must just be the people who are managing her business are doing a really good job. Do little wasn't really a part of the management anymore they hired some real professionals. Loretta and Conway twitty made their own booking agency called united talent, and they had the best schedules and country music she used to play two hundred shows a year, cut it down two, hundred, twenty five and mainly because her money was handled better. So she didn't have to work as hard for. What she would or no that didn't come out right she didn't have to work as much and she was. Getting. Paid better. Okay. Yeah, she had some people help her write songs emotionally she kept writing them or solve when the movie will miner's daughter came out. People got to know her more. Fans also made her familiar to people. She says only took her a couple of hours to write what she considers the best song she's ever written. She recorded it, but you can the can for a year because she didn't think anybody would like get the song made her so popular that alleged the biggest award for lifetime at the time at this book was written. So, the song of course was coal miner's daughter and the award entertainer of the year goes to the best performer who puts on the bash shows on tour and on television plus puts out good records. So at the award show which was a nineteen seventy-two hearn Conway twitty got the award for vocal duo of the year and they named her female vocalist of the year around this time. Loretta of course, struck up a friendship with Dolly Parton. And I was wondering if she was going to come at. of course, and the two of them loved talking about the old days you know when they were both poor and you can see some awesome videos online on Youtube of Loretta and Dolly singing together they sing a mash up of Dolly's favourite Loretta songs and they seem together and it's just amazing. Like. A Raw. Natural talent so cool to see them together. Sold right. It was always very encouraging other women in the industry never being jealous or mean she says there's room for all of us honey. That's right. While the it was winning all these awards she was also getting death threats. Some pretty scary stuff would happen like ice following her to her hotel room calling the room phone saying they were outside in the hallway you know one boy walking her bus with a pistol you know. So she started having hire some big time security she had like some super intense groupies a yeah but they like yeah. I. Don't know if they want to hurt you. Can we really consider them a groupie? No. I don't know. had. Calls from people saying that they were hit men. Know People mad at her because she thought that she broke up conway twitty's marriage select. No wonder she gets sick right? Like no one knew your health. Yeah. All of this pressure. So Lord not toured around the country she toured around the world politically Loretta never wanted to endorse politicians even though she was asked and she made a point to say that she wasn't really interested. She would say that it was time for honest people to start running the country. So just get somebody that will feed the poor and forget about the wars she said that she was waiting for a politician who will help the people and then maybe I'll support him or her. Loretta traveled with her bandmates tour on a tour bus for a very long time. She designed it herself Purple Velvet Gold Pascal's and an entertainment unit up front eight bunks in the middle for the boys and the back part was just for her. You know she does go on to talk about how unglamorous it is for people who think that riding on a tour buses like A real thing that you wanna do for for a long time of your life but she actually almost had an all girl band which she says would have been fantastic. She would've loved it. But the double standard of the music industry said, it would be bad publicity if she had a girl band and then the girl band members would go get in trouble you know lake. Considered. Loose women and her tail and buy INS that decision because it was okay. If an all male band did something like that, right Yup. That's infuriating. That would have been so cool for her at have like this. All girl kick ass band. Loretta used to be a bashful girl from the mountains. WHO's only dream was a comfortable house for her family. She grew a lot. She learned a lot. She stuck up for herself in her career. She's grateful for the benefits her family has enjoyed because of her property prosperous career, and at the time of writing the book, she said, she just wanted to put her life in God's hands. She wanted to give more people in two more people in need she wanted to travel more, and as she says, I love to work more with the American Indians people. That's. How she said in Nineteen, seventy five. So she finished her book knowing that it wasn't the end of her story but that there was more to come Loretta, is the most awarded Female Country Recording artist has gorge twenty four number one singles eleven number one albums she continued to tour for many years appearing at the Grand Ole opry and releasing new albums in Nineteen Eighty Eight Loretta was inducted into the Country Music Hall of fame she returned to the public eye and nineteen ninety-three with the hit trio album honky tonk angels recorded with Dolly Parton and Tammy Wynette. Thousand and Two Thousand Loretta released her first album in several years called still country in which she included. I. Can't hear the music a tribute song to her late husband doolittle who had passed away. Yeah. She releases her first new single and more than ten years from the album country in my genes and the single charted on the billboard country singles chart and made Loretta the first woman in country music to chart singles in five decades in two thousand and two. Loretta published her second on Biographies Still Woman Enough, and it became her second New York Times Bestseller, and then in two thousand and four, she published a cookbook you're cooking it country. Great it was. Any world. Davis in that one OH. Good question I hope. I hope. For she released Leer Rose Ryan mentioned in. It was the first episode and this is the second album on which she either Cole wrote or sang every song. So the album was produced by Jack White and featured guitar backup vocals by him. Her collaboration with Jack garnered her high praise in magazines that specialize in mainstream and alternative rock. So she was in spin and blender rolling stone voted the album the. Second. Best, of two thousand and four, and it won the Grammy Award for best country album of the year. So in late two, thousand and ten Sony Music released a new album titled Culminates Daughter Tribute Loretta Lynn featuring stars like Reba mcentire, Faith Hill Paramour Carrie Underwood and they were performing Loretta is classic hits Spanning Fifty Years Laura. Recorded with Miranda Lambert Sheryl Crowe. that single cracked the billboard singles chart, and so made her the only female country artist to chart in six decades. So Thousand Nineteen lifetime aired the highly anticipated movie Patsy and Loretta, which highlighted the friendship of Lynn and Patsy Kline. So the right of Lynn? She attended the Nashville release of the film and that's about up to date on what what's been going on. So there's so much more you can go in like you can watch those movies. You can read all those book but that was that this is the end of our two part special of Loretta Lynn. My goodness I love her so much and I love all of her songs. I'm so excited I'm going to rewatch coal miner's daughter and I had no idea. They made a movie about her and Patsy. So that's definitely something I want to check out his wall. Wow, thank you so much for this. This was like this was a fantastic way to do a two parter She certainly deserved. She deserved it. Okay Great I'm glad that you enjoyed it. I hope all the there enjoyed it and hope that you're having an amazing summer. Thank you so much for listening. Go and check out all of our past episodes were were into August I am assuming. So you know I think it's a good time to listen to all of our elvis episodes. Oh. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. And check out your Dolly Parton episode to because that one was great. Yeah. Why not that was you know what? That one I think people are saying people have said that they could go for another Dolly episode because I only highlighted jet very much like Loretta had such a rich early life that I, really only got into Hurley stuff right? You could definitely do a part to on Dolly as well. Yeah. We did hank. Williams too. So a couple of people mentioned in this we've covered and. Yeah, plenty more to check out as you said in part one. For our patron members, you gotTa pull up for your next episode. So if you guys want to be part of our decision making over here, sign up and let us know what you're thinking. Yeah. Links has got a couple of options. Maybe she'll throw a poll up there and you can vote on Lynxes next episode. Yeah I'll do that for sure. All right well, that's it. Everybody thinks so much for listening wear sunscreen stay hydrated and we love you see a becks time. On. A map. Bonds meal. What? On Matt Daddy's knee. Listen. To the story said he to. Let that all the grand lack of tragic memory brom passed past and say. And Pepper. Friend. down. Law. Music is produced by Shantelle lemieux and link so leery and is part of the Pantheon family a- podcasts. Find. All of our shows notes social and links at Pantheon podcasts dot. com. All songs can be phone wherever you get your music. Please download and purchase these great and important tracks. Combined us at Pantheon podcasts on. facebook. tweet US at Pantheon pods or see us at our an archaeology on instagram. Hey, this is mark from performing Zaidi here on the Pantheon podcast network. have. You ever wanted to sit down with your favorite artists and here the wild stories that happened on tour or in the studio. We get these stories for you and a lot more Stories, like the singer who was defeated three times onstage in one night. The guitarist who was shot outside a white castle by fire marshal. And there's the keyboardist who got his start making instruments from trash. Then, there's the ban that had to sneak their manager across an international border. About the Bass player who's almost stranded in Poland. And Front man who spent his sixteenth birthday in an Israeli prison. Ever wonder what Bourbon paired with your favorite song got that to. This isn't a bullet point. Sound Bite interview that shows the conversation one honored the best stories you've never heard. This. Base I play Bass Club Western publicans. Michael J. Raw. Arm. Everybody this is Chris Trainer from Bush. This Barbara. I make records I am scarlet page everybody. I am we. Era See and I'm. Sorry. This is Mark Lanigan near listening to performance anxiety. Join US here performance anxiety every week for the best stories in. Music.

Loretta Loretta doolittle Loretta Lynn Avert Lynn Nashville Patsy Kline Loretta family Loretta She Honky tonk Peggy She Loretta oldest Dolly Parton butcher Holler Pedro Dot Toronto Ernest Tubb conway twitty Jack White Youtube Canada
November 8, 2019: Carolyn Wasilewski

Today in True Crime

12:35 min | 1 year ago

November 8, 2019: Carolyn Wasilewski

"The today is Friday November eighth two thousand nineteen on this day in nineteen fifty four fourteen. Thirteen year old Carolyn Waza loose key was murdered. Her body was found the following day with the name Paul written in lipstick on her thigh. Why to this day? No one knows for sure why her killer wrote his name or what role he may have played in Caroline's murder. Welcome to day in true crime. Apar- cast original due to the graphic nature of today's crimes listener. Discretion is advised extreme. Caution is advised for listeners under thirteen today a day we're covering the brutal unsolved murder of fourteen year old Carolyn Waza Lewinsky before we dive into the investigation. Let's go back back to Baltimore. Maryland at approximately six fifteen pm on November eighth nineteen fifty four in a chilly wind greeted caroline. As she walked out of her house she shivered and and pulled her black scarf tighter around her neck. The ends dangled down and danced just above her dark skirt as she started down down the block. She could already feel goosebumps on her exposed skin. Caroline turned back to grab her jacket then reconsidered she. I didn't plan on being out for long anyway. And she really didn't want to risk another conversation with her parents. She couldn't talk to them anymore because they didn't talk. They just nagged about her friends. Her behavior her life was it any wonder why she kept running away whenever she told them how she felt. They dismissed it as teenage angst but she had good reason to be depressed she could hardly go outside. Without being harassed by Amen Caroline turned onto the familiar route to the south way where she was meeting her friend Peggy. She picked up the pace trying to warm herself self up the exercise helped and she started to smile as a group of boys from her school passed by on their bikes. They snickered back at her. One yelled back from the end of the street calling her a good. For nothing drape there were the provocations right on cue caroline just kept her head down no matter where she went people called a drape aggressor a delinquent just because she liked to slit her her hair and wear black clothes. Why couldn't she wear what she wanted without everyone else slapping a label on her? She kicked a loose rock into the sewer and listen to the echo as it fell. She wondered if anyone would notice if she disappeared like that. Would anyone be around to hear the echoes. She he left behind. It was hard to be optimistic these days the week before. Caroline was forced to testify in court against a disgusting man on who took advantage of her friend. She could still remember the look on his face during their double date if only caroline had said something before she let her friend friend ride home with him. Maybe she could have stopped it. She hoped that creep got what he deserved but even if he did Caroline knew surfing would really change as soon as the trial ended. There were signs the adults around her wanted to forget the entire ordeal even even right after the assault. Some acted like it was no big deal. It was easy for them to pretend like it never happened but caroline knew her her friend would never be able to forget thinking about. The trial made her shudder all the more. She crossed her arms and stuffed her hands into her armpits pits. Caroline forced herself to look down and forward just one foot in front of the other. She would get to the southway soon then she you would feel better. How many more steps probably hundreds? She started to count then tried humming a song to herself. Nothing distracted distracted her from the feeling that people were watching her even though she was certain she was all alone on the street. Somehow the loneliness made needed worse. Where was everybody? It wasn't that late but none of the houses around her had their lights on every street. Lamp hit her like a spotlight spotlight in the night. She felt like she was playing to an audience hidden. Just out of sight somewhere in the shadows. She told herself L. to relax but her heart pounded in her ears. Caroline tried to convince herself she was just being paranoid by now she was only a block away from the southway. Maybe she should just run the rest of the way but then she would have to explain herself to Peggy. She went back to counting steps. One hundred and twenty one one hundred and twenty two. She had almost calmed down when she heard another set of footsteps behind her her at first she decided not to turn around. She didn't WanNa seem weird and she knew what it was like to be stared at but then the steps APPs grew closer. They were moving fast. Caroline turned around just as the pursuer caught up to her. The blood drained from her face as she realized who it was they had been watching her all along. Coming up. Police investigate the murder of Caroline Wasowski. Hey Friend I wanNA tell you about the new three dollar Littlejohn from Jimmy. Johns a skinny mini version of any original sandwich. For only three bucks. It's littler than a regular sandwich which which is perfect if you're not super hungry or if you WANNA try a couple of different sandwiches or if you like bragging that your lunch only cost three dollars order a three dollar Littlejohn at Jimmy. John's dot com or with the Jimmy John's APP participating locations taxes delivery fees. Extra now back to the story on November Eighth Nineteen fifty four fourteen year old Carolyn was loose key was was abducted and murdered on her way to meet a friend near her home in Baltimore Maryland. Caroline had a history of running away and initially. Her parents believed she had done so again. When she didn't return that night they worried she had gone off with a friend or possibly eloped with a boyfriend? Caroline had gone out with several older men before they had taken advantage of her and even physically abused her after their daughter had been missing for three hours. Caroline's parents went out to look for her. They started driving around town but their search was interrupted by an air raid siren. The Cold War was in full. Swing by nineteen fifty four and air raid drills were common in big cities throughout the US caroline's parents since were required to pull over and find shelter. As soon as they heard the blaring alarm this delayed their search and even worse it meant that no one else was on the streets to notice caroline or her captor after the air raid. Drill the Waza loose. Ke's continue you. Their search to no avail they hoped caroline was out with a friend would return home soon in the past. She had always come back though. Sometimes it had taken a few weeks unfortunately caroline's parents couldn't cling to hope for long the following morning November ninth nineteen fifty four caroline's badly beaten body was found in a rail yard. Her t shirt and Bra were pulled up around her neck and one of her fingers was broken. There were no signs of sexual assault but her skirt was missing most baffling. Someone wrote the name Paul on her thigh with lipstick based on the evidence at the scene. They suspected she she had been killed in a different location around eleven pm on November eighth and was dumped in the train yard post mortem an autopsy determined determined that Caroline died of blunt force trauma to her skull. The Waza Lewinsky's identified the body on the night of the ninth. Caroline's is father. Stanley was so distraught by the sight of her that he reportedly fainted in the morgue. He wasn't the only one shocked by the violence silence. The entire town of Baltimore was disturbed by the murder of such a young girl for the next two weeks. The media covered the story. Relentlessly police interviewed anyone who knew caroline. Most of their prime suspects were her older boyfriends among them was a twenty year old man. Dan named Paul Caroline and Paul had recently broken up and she took the split hard. It made Paul the obvious prime suspect but he was far from the only predatory man in her life. There was also frankie a thirty year old bus driver who had gone on a bad a date with caroline and Johnny also aged thirty who had dated Caroline recently. All three men were possible candidates in the eyes of the police but they were never able to gather the necessary evidence against any one of them. The tragedy of Caroline Waza Lewinsky's murder remains a a local legend in Baltimore. Nearly half a century later. Allegedly her mysterious death was the loose inspiration for crybaby. The John Waters film starring Johnny Depp. According to one Baltimore detective the station still occasionally gets calls about caroline on on the anniversary of her death. Though her killer was never brought to justice her tragic memory reminds us that it isn't delinquent children children but rather abusive adults who pose a greater threat Thanks for listening listening to today in true crime. I'm Vanessa Richardson. For more information on Caroline was loose. Candy check out our episodes of unsolved murders that delve deeper deeper into the investigation. Today in true crime is a podcast. Original you can find more episodes of today in true crime and all other podcast originals for free on on spotify. Not only to spotify already. Have all of your favorite music. But now spotify's making it easy for you to enjoy all of your favorite podcast originals. Like today today in true crime for free from your phone desktop or smart speaker to stream today in true crime on spotify. Just open the APP and type today in true crime. I'm in the search bar at podcast. We're grateful for you our listeners. You allow us to do what we love. Let us know how we're doing reach out on facebook and Instagram at podcast and twitter at podcast network. We'll be back with a brand new episode tomorrow in True Crime. Today in true crime was created by Max Cutler is a production of cutler media and is part of the podcast network it is produced by Max Ron Cutler sound design by Russell Nash With Production Assistance by Ron Shapiro. Joel Stein Maggie Admire and Travis Clark. This episode of today in true crime was

Amen Caroline Caroline Waza Lewinsky Carolyn Waza Lewinsky Baltimore Caroline Wasowski murder Paul Maryland spotify Peggy assault Apar US Johns facebook Max Cutler Joel Stein Jimmy John Ron Shapiro Littlejohn
 Second Cup: Pair little tasks

Before Breakfast

06:06 min | 7 months ago

Second Cup: Pair little tasks

"Hey listeners with the capital one quicksilver card you earn unlimited one point five percent cashback on every purchase. That's unlimited. One point five percent cashback on everything you buy an unlimited really means unlimited with quicksilver. There's no limit to how much cash back you can earn capital one. What's in your Wallet Credit Approval? REQUIRED CAPITAL ONE BANK USA IN A. Welcome to before breakfast a production of iheartradio. Good Morning! This is Laura. Welcome to the before breakfast podcast. Today's tip is to pair little tasks with things you already do. By pairing habits, you'll be less likely to forget. We all have little things. We know we should do regularly. Maybe. It's saying or writing in a journal. It can be very powerful to make these decisions automatic, but building habits is hard. That's why I'm always on the lookout for ways to make habit building easier. So I love this suggestion that I received from before breakfast listener, Peggy. She wrote in that I realized I. Have a habit that helps me with getting little things done. That can be overlooked I. try to combine two or more tasks so that I. Don't forget one of them. She, gave me a few examples of pairings that worked well in her life. When I make my bed in the morning, she says I pray. If I see, my bed isn't made I know I forgot to pray also. Peggy notes that she injured a muscle in her leg. At one point knows she needs to stretch it. I was forgetting to stretch it after running as I'm usually short on time in the morning. She says I found when I am in the shower and conditioning my hair after a run, I just stretch that particular muscle for a few minutes while I. let my conditioner set. I had problems for years with this muscle, but once I started this routine. It hasn't been a problem. Praying and stretching are frequent tasks, but other little things don't need to be done nearly as often. There are few tasks. I have to do once. A month Peggy rights. I finally realized I needed to combine them all on the same day. The first of each month I put in a new pair of contacts budget and write out checks to my kids, music and Dance Teachers Wash my vacuum filters and do the cleaning cycle on my washing machine. I have written down my monthly items on my phone, and I do them all at once. I think these are great ideas. All sorts of little habits can be paired with others for instance I've suggested in previous episodes that people keep time logs. It's empowering to know where the time goes, but it's also easy to forget to write down where the time went until so much time has passed that you no longer remember. So I suggest that at least during the work day people pair time tracking with bathroom breaks. When you come back from a bathroom, break right down what you did since the last one. Or here's another opportunity for pairing. I. Don't know about you, but my car has a tendency to accumulate a lot of trash. Now and I'm putting gas in my car. I set the handle to keep pumping, and then I clean out the car. This feels like a real win. Because I wasn't using that time for anything important anyway and now ever much cleaner vehicle. I don't watch TV much and I almost never watch it live, but if you're watching something with commercials, this can be a great time to do something like stretching or strength training. Or you can use the time we'll. Food heats up in the microwave in our house. We Stack Mail on the counter under our microwave and it has a tendency to pile up. If i. sort the mail anytime using microwave I can avoid losing important notes in the mess. Now to be clear I. Don't think we need to pack every minute of every day. People can go a little overboard with Paren-. I have personally been mocked in more than one article for the idea of using microwave time for anything. But I also do that. Small things done repeatedly. Add Up. Habits are powerful, but relying on our conscious minds to remember to do all the things we know we should do is just asking for failure. Pairing new habits with things we already do greatly increases the chances that we stick with them. Just ask Peggy. His leg. Injury is no longer bothering her. And keeping spiritual commitment she decided to make to. What habits do you pair together? I'd love to hear about them. Please email me your pairs at the breakfast podcast at iheartmedia dot com. In the meantime, this is Laura thanks for listening and here's to making the most of our time. Hey, everybody I'd love to hear from you. You can send me your tips your questions or anything else. Just connect with me on twitter, facebook and Instagram at before. pod! That's be the number four then breakfast P O d. You can also shoot me an email at before breakfast podcasts at iheartmedia dot com that before breakfast is spelled out with all the letters. Thanks so much I look forward to staying in touch. Before breakfast is a production of iheartradio. For more podcasts from iheartradio visit the iheartradio APP, apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. If, you need business communications, US bondage. They've got unified communications, contact centers and Communications Api's that will make your life complete communication wise, but that's it. Those are the things they're great. They're not great at making really interesting podcast with helpful time management tips for that kind of stuff. The person reading this is way better so vaunted for business communications that save you time and energy before breakfast podcast for quick tips that save you time and energy voltage. Now we're talking.

Peggy Laura US Communications Api apple twitter Instagram facebook five percent
 Pair little tasks

Before Breakfast

06:24 min | 1 year ago

Pair little tasks

"Humans make a lot of stuff piles of stuff and it's got to go somewhere some of it is treasured. It was nothing else like this on early television, some of his junked, they were totally indiscriminate own, what take collected some of it is just forgotten about there hasn't been a guess, culturally that they matter, so they get thrown in the garbage. The only thing clear to me is that nothing lasts forever. It's over. It's ephemeral. Listen to a federal now on apple podcasts, the iheartradio app, or wherever you listen to podcasts, and learn more at a federal dot show. Welcome to before breakfast, a production of I heart radio. Good morning. This is Laura welcome to the before breakfast podcast. Today's tip is to pair little tasks with things you already do by pairing habits, you'll be less likely to forget them. We all have little things we know we should do regularly. Maybe it's fluffing or writing in a journal, it can be very powerful to make these good decisions automatic but building habits is hard. That's why I'm always on the lookout for ways to make habit building easier. So I love this suggestion that I received from before breakfast listener Peggy. She wrote in that I realized I have a habit that helps me with getting little things done that can be overlooked. I try to combine two or more tasks so that I don't forget, one of them, she gave me a few examples of pairings that worked well in her life when I make my bed in the morning. She says, I pray if I see my bed isn't made. I know I forgot to pray also Peggy notes that she injured a muscle in her leg. At one point and knows she needs to stretch it. I was forgetting to stretch it after running as I'm usually short on time in the morning. She says, I found when I'm in the shower and conditioning, my hair after a run. I just stretch that particular muscle for a few minutes while I let my conditioner set I had problems for years with this muscle. But once I started this routine, it hasn't been a problem, praying and stretching are frequent tasks, but other little things don't need to be done. Nearly as often there are few tasks, I have to do once a month Peggy rights. I finally realized I needed to combine them all on the same day, the first of each month, I put in a new pair of contacts budget and write out checks, to my kids music, and dance teachers wash my vacuum filters and do the cleaning cycle on my washing machine. I have written down, my monthly items on my phone and I do them all at once. I think these are great ideas, all sorts of little habits can be paired with others. For instance, I've suggested in previous episodes. That people keep time logs? It's empowering to know where the time goes, but it's also easy to forget to write down where the time went until so much time has passed that you no longer remember. So I suggest that at least during the work day, people pair time tracking with bathroom breaks when you come back from a bathroom break, right down, what you did since the last one or here's another opportunity for pairing. I don't know about you, but my car has a tendency to accumulate a lot of trash now and I'm putting gas in my car. I set the handle to keep pumping, and then I clean out the car this feels like a real win, because I wasn't using that time for anything important anyway. And now I have a much cleaner vehicle. I don't watch TV much and I almost never watch it live. But if you're watching something with commercials this can be a great time to do something like stretching or strength training. Or you can use the time, we'll food, heats up in the microwave in our house, we stack mail on the counter under our microwave. And it has a tendency to pile up if I sort, the mail anytime, I'm using the microwave I can avoid losing important notes in the mess now to be clear. I don't think we need to pack every minute of every day people can go a little overboard with pairing. I have personally been mocked in more than one article for the idea of using microwave, sign for anything. But I also do know that small things done repeatedly add up habits are powerful but relying on our conscious minds to remember to do all the things we know we should do is just asking for failure. Pairing new habits with things we already do greatly increases the chances that we stick with. Them. Just ask Peggy. His leg injury is no longer bothering her and who's keeping spiritual commitment. She decided to make two. What happens to you pair together? I'd love to hear about them. Please Email me, your pairs before breakfast podcast at I heart media dot com. In the meantime, this is Laura, thanks for listening. And here's to making the most of our time. Hey, everybody. I'd love to hear from you. You can send me your tips, your questions or anything else. Just connect with me on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at before breakfast pod. That's be the number four then breakfast p o d you can also shoot me an Email at before breakfast podcasts at I heart media dot com that before breakfast is spelled out with all the letters. Thanks so much. I look forward to staying in touch. Before breakfast is a production of iheartradio. For more podcasts from iheartradio. Visit the iheartradio app, apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Hey, animal lovers. I'm Kate golden, I studied psychology and biology, and I host a comedy educational puck has called creature feature. The podcast delves into the most unbelievable animal and human behaviors on the planet, every Wednesday gives comedians and scientists delve into the minds of the craziest creatures. Evolution has concocted. We ask are we really that different from our hairier cousins? Iheartradio is number one for podcast. But don't take our word for it fine creature feature on the iheartradio app or wherever you get your pockets.

Peggy apple Laura iheartradio iheartradio Iheartradio Kate golden Twitter Instagram Facebook
S1E10 - COVID 19 Your Stories Part 2.mp3

The Shining Scholar Education Podcast

14:16 min | 3 months ago

S1E10 - COVID 19 Your Stories Part 2.mp3

"Welcome and thank you for tuning into the shining scholar education podcast where we talk about secondary English language arts tips strategies and resources will also share the ups and downs in the wonderful world of teaching I'm your host, Charlie and teacher Creator here was shining scholar education. We hope you enjoy the show. Logan my friends and thank you for tuning into the podcast again. This is part two of the COVID nineteen stories. What is your experience as a teacher been like and we received quite a few emails and it was really hard to choose the wants to talk about. But I think you won't be disappointed with the ones we selected there was so many good ones but we tried to pick a little bit of. Everything just to give everybody a voice on the podcast and thank you again for all of you that participated in Tennessee emails and direct messages on Instagram and on our facebook page we really appreciate you reaching out letting us know what you think about the show and sharing your stories with us. One thing we notice with a lot of emails was that they. Were coming from teachers with spouses in the medical field like doctors and nurses and EMT's We had one writer Sam and Gary Indiana. She says her husband's a nurse in a covert unit and he had to set up camp in the garage for fear passing on the virus to his family. He unintentionally got it while treating covid nineteen patients at the hospital. According to her email, he's had quite an experience with the virus one memory that sticks out in her mind is him having to hold the phone as one of his patients was going to die soon? So he was holding the phone as his family were on video chat and saying their goodbyes as a person was oxygen and wasn't expected to live much longer. We I can only imagine what it's like to be in that position. Let's just rough all around. It's not an easy easy thing for anyone. However her husband does have a message. He says, please wash your hands and wear a mask because you may not get it but you may give it to someone and that wouldn't be a good thing. So imagine giving it to a kid. And again, this is the the idea that her husband is setting force in the e mail she wrote to US giving it to a kid. and. Then feeling responsible and guilty for knowing that even though it didn't do much to you. It could wreak havoc on their lungs and immune system and everything else so. Sam Please Thank your husband for everything. He's doing for us. He's on the front line. He really is a hero. and. We hope recovery as quick and. He gets well soon. We had another email from Simon in Shreveport Louisiana and he says what hurt him the most was not being able to say goodbye to students because his school was shut down speech break so He never got to give him one last hug and say goodbye and help them along with the distance learning that they had in the near future He says he's been struggling to get the hang of Google classroom any struggling to reach the kids that don't have. Internet services or devices, and Simon says he's coming up with creative ways to get the Internet to kids along with devices. So they can do their schoolwork at home I have to say, Simon you're an inspiration to all of us and your kids are very lucky to have you as a teacher and carrying so much and trying to look out for them crazy time during his crazy time of need and unprecedented circumstances. We also got another e mail from Michelle in Austin Texas. She says, some teachers there have already been protesting and there's talk of a strike she's considering quitting because going back to school with a little one that has a respiratory condition is not an option for her. She didn't say which respiratory condition but I wouldn't WanNa do that either now she also says you can't strike in Texas because you lose your pension and all your retirement and your teaching license. So there's severe penalties for striking in Texas and she says quote, it breaks my heart to quit but I don't know what else to do. Michelle goes on to say that one silver lining she's found throughout all this is through the nextdoor APP which you can see people around your neighborhoods I have it for I live in and it's pretty neat people post things for sale local events in the neighborhood and the city different things like that. So really fosters a sense of community. She says that she seemed people post they're willing to help go get groceries or run errands or pickup kids meds or just do anything that needs to get done that they might not be able to, which is really neat because when you. Consider. Everybody's at home right now and they're sitting around and they have a car and they're able bodied. That's really wonderful that these people are stepping out to say you know I can help you with these things and she says, she was a little iffy trusting people for doing that picking up her kids meds she realizes she had the swallow her pride and ask for help if she needed it, she goes on to say it's a beautiful thing of humans helping humans and she says, it reminds me of Mister Rogers quote that when bad things happen to look for the helpers. I. Remember that quote. Mr Rogers was a wonderful man. We've great lessons. we several emails from teachers saying that they have to reorganize little desks for elementary schools anywhere from three to six feet apart though be no moving round interactions, the kids will be wearing masks and a lot of them said that it won't feel the same it's not GonNa be school. It'll be kind of like detention they said, yeah we'll be interacting and everything, but oh, it'll be interacting verbally but no physical touch. No, hugs no high fives nothing like that. So. Wow. This is really a new norm. It's GonNa be hard to to get used to this. We have another one from a teacher named Stephen in Phoenix Arizona he says, they're striking for fear of more teachers dying Kimberly Bird, did she and two other teachers were teaching remotely There was three teachers in one classroom, but they were teaching remotely. To the kids at home in their home, but they were all in the same classroom on campus. So, according to Stephen. They followed the protocol to the tea. And all three of them still got it. Now, only one of them passed away the other two survived, but he says that according to the news reports, it's been a really uphill climb for them. And this virus is like something we've never seen before it's it's really scary and to know that one teacher passed away already in Phoenix Arizona the heartbreaking We also got one from Peggy and Michigan. Let me see the she. Yes she's from Kalamazoo Michigan. She says, she was kind of forced into early retirement because she'd met her minimum requirement and she didn't want to get the risk of getting the virus at her age. She doesn't say how old she says quote this is all I've done for the last forty five years of my life, and it will be a big change with lots of adjustment while forty, five years of service. Thank you, Peggy. That's that's amazing. Who knows how many lives you've touched during those forty five years and continue to touch and their effects onto other people. So a great teacher lights a thousand other candles, those candles light. At thousand more. So props to you, peggy she says she and her husband had hoped to travel it after retirement but she says it's not a good time right now but they are thinking about buying an RV and interact with people on their travels as little as possible. She says, they would only really go out for food and gas. So it'd be the as staying home. She says she's never been to the Grand Canyon nor Las Vegas and she would love to see them just in case his virus has number Oh peggy don't say that I'm sure you're gonNA live a long long time and see the fruits of your labor, their forty five years of. Wow that's impressive. We had another person right in George. He didn't say where he was from but he said that he brought his mom to live with his family she lives alone and she suffered from depression and he and his wife decided to bring in. His mom to help take care of the kids during this time of quarantine because he and his wife are working from home. He says she felt lonely as it is. So now with quarantine it even worse there were all tested before moving in together house very smart George, great foresight, and while he and his wife are working from home he says that they all see each other for lunch will break for lunch when they can and that grandma's having a great time being so close to the grandkids. Georgia also says that they take quite a bit of time for things that didn't used to take a lot of time. For example, he says, they sanitize everything that they buy. Even though he says, they don't go out for grocery shopping anymore. They just haven't delivered through. Amazon prime. He says, it's very time consuming the more you buy the more you have to clean and we wipe them down with clorox wipes and when we run out of that, we use a disaffected spray. But. He says, it's worth it I wish everyone out there the best of luck and stay safe and happy while Georgia seems like you and your family really have a handle on things. We thank you for your your tips and we hope you you folks continue to be happy and healthy throughout this crazy time This last email we chose only because of the effect, it was very, very powerful email not to say the wart, but this one really stuck out to me. Kelly. She doesn't say where she's from she says, she's a fourth grade teacher she stayed at she stays at home with her two little boys and her husband kept working because he's in the central worker and he works for ups. He did get it but it didn't kill him. It's left him with what the doctor called impaired lung function do from scarring from the virus and she says that her husband spent seventeen days in the hospital her and that means not. Seeing them or anything, but facetime One thing that really surprised her was one of his first symptoms was loss of taste. He didn't have a fever cough or anything flu related, but it was just loss of taste. He couldn't enjoy his favorite foods from one day to the next. She said that his energy levels just dropped and his fever spiked. He said she started off on a Tuesday with ninety nine and then by Tuesday night, it was one hundred and one. Wow and she goes on to say that she he had the watches kids from his garage because he didn't want interaction and the fear passing it on to his kids and Kelly goes on the say that it's very strange not to be able to hug and kiss the person you married she says my husband's my best friend and I can't hug him kiss him. She also says that her husband. Would sometimes be a little grumpy when he had to get up and go. Take care of the ten month old in the middle of the night after a long day at work. But now he says he can hear the baby cry from the garage and he says that he wishes he could go help. and. One of the most powerful parts of the email was this one right here. She says even during this time of Corona virus of all the unknowns in all the fear and all the panic. All. The pain of all the suffering. It's funny. The love we found that debts doorstep. In, a way it's brought us closer together. That's beautiful Kelly. One piece of advice Kelly does offer to her fellow teachers is is to not feel like you have to put on a front. It's okay to not be okay. She says, we're actors at heart because we always have to put on a smile even when we're having a bad day just so the kids don't pick up on it your students and you get to the lesson and they can have a good day. She said, but this a state of emergency don't try to be a ridiculously strong teacher at home. Your human she says allow yourself to breakdown allow yourself to share your emotions. Don't try to be a super powerful person that pretends to be in control of your emotions time. She said she had to take a day when everybody was asleep in her husband was still in the hospital she cried and cried for hours and then finally. She fell asleep due to exhaustion. It's okay to be vulnerable as you do you have to do to get through that stage to get to the better parts Kelly thank you so much for sharing your experience. You packed a lot of wisdom in your email, and so we're very grateful for that and thank you for allowing us to share it with our listeners and hopefully they'll share it on because that's a very powerful story seventeen days away from your husband with your kids. It can't be easy. We hope you guys are doing. Well, stay safe. Keep changing the World Kelly you of all people I know for sure our and your husband is well. And we might make part. Three of the series folks if we get a few more emails, if you have something, you really WanNa share with the world. Please reach out to us at shining scholar education and gmail.com or you could shoot us a message on instagram. Same thing shining underscore scholar underscore education on twitter at shining scholar on our facebook page for shining scholar education reach out to us in the most convenient way for. You and we'll be happy to read your story. Thank you so much for listening in tuning in We hope the this podcast has been a service to you. If you can think of three people that might benefit from this episode share this podcast with them help us grow again, this is just a small team of five teachers right now is I'm recording in my studio in quotes Studio Air. Quotes. It's my small closet where I can only have enough room to stand my mic and my laptop. But we're doing this by teachers for teachers. Again thank you to all of you that reached out to us. There was Peggy in Kalamazoo Michigan. George who didn't say where he was from let's see Kelley again. She didn't say where she was from all the other teachers, every doubt. Stephen from Phoenix. Michelle and Austin Texas Simon in Shreveport Louisiana. And Sam and Gary Indiana I. Think we all learned and we got something from today and it couldn't have been possible without you folks sharing your story. So again, this your host Charlie signing off. Thank you again for tuning in teachers and everything you do keep changing the world make it a great day. Thank you again for tuning in and if you enjoy the show, please like subscribe Sharon, consider leaving a review. It really does help we make resources for teachers by teachers check us out at shining scholar education, Dot Com and our teachers pay teachers stores. Well, we'd love to hear from you. So email us at shining scholar education gmail.com to share any questions or topics you'd like on the show. Thank you for all you do teachers and keep changing the world.

Kelly Sam Michelle Stephen Peggy Michigan Mr Rogers facebook Charlie Kalamazoo Austin Texas Simon Phoenix Arizona Gary Indiana Louisiana George Shreveport Texas COVID US
Covering Covid: Not Enough Tests

Embedded

22:32 min | 8 months ago

Covering Covid: Not Enough Tests

"Hey I'm Kelly mcevers and this is embedded and first off. We just want to say thank you to all of you who have reached out to us this past week. We are getting in touch with as many of you as we can. So I have this friend who works in an Er in New York City which as you probably know is where the highest number of people in the US now have covered nineteen and where the highest number of people are dying from it anyway. Last week I called her to ask what she was seeing and back then she was like mom in Manhattan. Things seem pretty normal. So far maybe because a lot of people left town and then just a few days later called her again and I was like. How's it going now? And she was like. Oh my God. It's terrible it's really terrible. Like truly terrible. I can't play you the recording of our calls. She's afraid if she uses her name or even if someone recognizes her voice she could get fired so I'm just going to tell you what she said at her hospital. Primary Care. Doctors are doing a lot to keep people from coming in unless they absolutely have to still. My friend says the hospital is totally packed and totally overwhelmed nearly all the patients coming into the Er have Cova did after one shift the other day. She told me it felt like she was swimming in it. And she said it's just really frustrating to try to treat these patients. The only thing I have for them is oxygen. She said like there's no medicine to treat cove it so the only question is how to get oxygen to patients. And when like this one patient who came in he's in his seventies and his wife had already been admitted to the hospital with Cova did and was in critical condition. He's a healthy guy with no other medical problems and once he got covert symptoms. He tried to ride it out at home but he started having a lot of trouble breathing so he came in his oxygen was so low. My friend immediately called for a team to put in a breathing tube so they could get him on a ventilator. The team came running down and my friend told the man what they were about to do. But the man said no thank you. He did not want to be on a machine and my friend said I just WanNa make sure you understand. There's a chance you could die. And the man said yes and then my friend called the man's close relative just to confirm this was consistent with his wishes. The relative said that it was and this is the part in the conversation with me where my friend got angry. This relative could lose two people in one week. My friend said and it did not have to happen this way like this. Many people did not have to get sick. She says instead of only testing people who were admitted into the hospital we also should have been testing people who came in with symptoms but then were sent back home and people who we know were in contact with infected people. And here's the part where I'm just going to read you. The words my friend said I just feel so angry when I think about it. Because this was totally preventable. We had knowledge that this was a possibility. We had the sequencing of the freaking virus already. We had months to prepare and we did nothing. They'd been testing right from the beginning. We never would have gotten to this point and now it's just so so sad because it's taking out all of the grandparents two days later. I talked to my friend again. The man in his seventies was still alive and still not on a ventilator. She told me it all just shows you that. Were learning how to do this as we go home. We'll be right back after this break Right now every household on the country is being asked to fill out the. Us Census is the form that helps us determine how voting districts or redraw where to build public schools and hospitals how to spend Federal Money. So why are some people are afraid to fill it out? We're getting into all that this week on. Npr's coots which podcasts okay. We're back and on today's show. We're GONNA be talking about another thing that happens when you have an outbreak. And there's not enough testing to see who does and who doesn't have the virus. Sometimes people try to take advantage of that you are joining a call with two other people embedded reporter. Tom Drives back has been looking into one company that offered that seemed too good to be true. I can you hear me okay. Yeah we eventually figured out how to talk to each other and to record it. Okay I am recording. Are you recording? Yep Yep I'm taping him taping in Maryland. I'm sitting in the shed. Okay so yeah so you have a story and you're going to tell to me. So why didn't you just me start so this story starts a little more than a week ago With a tip the tip came in the form of afforded email and the subject of the email was Kovic nineteen test now available. Fda approved and the person who originally wrote the email claimed he had a connection to a company that was selling an at home cove nineteen tests. That was ninety. Eight percent accurate. The only cost forty ninety five. And you could buyers now in get it shipped to you within about a week. And it linked to a website called STOP CORONA TWENTY-EIGHT DOT COM. So what did you think when you saw that message well? My immediate reaction was definitely super skeptical. Okay the person who sent the email. His name is Johnson median and he works for a company called zero g colony That's his company. You know probably the one thing you may have heard of about this company. Is that back in twenty thirteen. They were promoting a planned lady Gaga concert in space Where they were GONNA go send Lady Gaga into space and she would be the first person ever to do a concert in space. Okay I never heard of that is an actual story lady Gaga. I was taking her out of this. World affects out of this world. So be the first to sink in space. The performance will be in partnership with the three day. Zero G colony. High-tech thing is Lady Gaga never would to space. Didn't think I'd heard about that. Yeah and like the question is what would a person who is most famous for you know trying to promote a lady Gaga concert in space have to do with corona virus test kits. Right obvious question. Yes so I emailed back and forth with him. I tried to talk with him on the phone but he would not agree to a phone interview but he did tell me by email that he was promoting these tests as a favor to his friend with a company that was selling them so he's basically saying. I'm not directly involved in this thing. I'm just passing it on. I mean he told me he wasn't making money on these tests right now but he did say he was going to work with the company on what he called big wholesale deals around the world and he said he was going to earn a commission on those deals. Okay nextstep was trying to figure out. Okay who is this company? That Johnson was connected to Where are they getting these tests? From how how are they selling? That took me down a bunch of different rabbit holes. Eventually I was able to track down an address to a company called the wellness Matrix Group. Which is the small publicly traded company in Southern California and Huntington Beach California and I tried to reach various people there at their main phone number and their contact for investor relations. That really wasn't getting me anywhere. And then I spotted this tweet by a guy named Brian J Esposito. He's from New Jersey. He says it is with great pleasure to announce the rollout of Hashtag Corona virus at home testing kits and he links to the Stop Corona twenty-eight website. I figure okay finally. Here's a person online. Who's talking about these tests kids? I replied him in a tweet. Say Hey can we set up an interview? I'd love to talk to you about these tests. He says absolutely not only that. He says he'll set up a time to talk with Vice President of marketing for this company the Wellness Matrix Group. A guy named David Salt Kelly as thinking about the interview And preparing then I go to the FDA. And I asked them you know. Is it true that there's any at home test kits available and they send me guidance that says very explicitly the FDA has not approved any at home test kits period? And then I called up. These guys David. Kelly and Brian Sposito case so soon. Confirm I'm recording now David I'll start with you. Do you have any background in healthcare? And we know that I used it. I don't I don't mean to make that as a joke. But my biggest background is You know startups in marketing and promotions of that. Then I started asking. Okay tell me about the tests your supposedly selling. He says that they had been working for several months on finding the right manufacturer they had found that they had gone through the FDA process to get those validated. Make sure they worked. Obviously gotTa make sure the accuracy of the test you just. Can't you just pull it out of nowhere? And then I asked him. Okay but where the tests from you know? We're not going to give you the exact source. But we're right now is From Hong Kong. And then I ask you know the biggest question of all the most important question is the FDA says they have not approved any at home test kits and yet at this company is selling at home. Test kits yeah. They don't they don't really make sure they look at your testing. Did you. Test was accurate. In what you're saying you know is accurate. So they don't endorse is what I'm trying to say okay. But don't they have to approve or authorize? You say they did approve your your product. I'm sorry too technical for me but pooled in gave me. Poc approval which is their point of care. Means a test that you can take at a hospital or clinic instead of like a lab test. That is different than an at home test. Okay but but you're selling your product for at home use right. I don't WanNa be rude. I don't know it's probably you know an attorney question. Okay I I just don't want to give you an answer and not be right Brian. Maybe he's going to have more. I don't know yeah of. That's not my area my areas Help the company grow With any of their products medical devices wearables. Or I think that yeah we is. Larry no yeah So after this They promised to send me additional information but over the course of several days of me asking. I never got anything from them that provided any evidence of FDA approval. Now I'm wondering. Has Anyone actually ordered these tests? Have people actually been using a cove in nineteen tests that the FDA says it has not approved? And then I get a message on twitter from a guy named PJ Sadowski. He replied to me because he saw I had message someone with a company and he said he and his friends had all bought tests reach back to. Pj He connects me with a whole group of friends that have been doing. Basically the exact same sleuthing that I've been doing all week. Turns out they got the same email that I got in the beginning. The one from Johnson median the guy who worked on the Lady Gaga in Space Concert and this group of friends like a lot of people. They've been hearing all of these stories about how there's no test kits available and even if you get one it can take days or even weeks to get a result you know. They were terrified of getting sick themselves or even getting other people sick and they felt like these tests might be a lifeline. I talked to more than a half dozen of them and they all kind of different reasons for wanting to buy the test kits You know there was Mac slows. He is an employment lawyer here in L. A. And His mom he told me has. Alzheimer's is bombs named Peggy She lives just outside of La. She's on hospice. Care Right now. He's not sure how long she'll live. And at the end of March her eighty four. Th Birthday was coming up your. She's not in a condition where I can facetime with her and have her even be responsive at all the ability to to put your hand on someone's shoulder right now in her condition. It's really It's really meaningful vital. But he just thought. I don't know that I can visit her without being totally sure that I don't have covert nineteen. I just felt like it wouldn't be responsible to be around her without having some confidence that I'm not contagious. And so he got this email and figured normally I would do a lot more research and googling but you know it was a pretty professional looking website it said. Fda approved and other people in the group were going through similar things Chelsea. Gooden had gotten sick she was worried it might be covert nineteen might have felt like. I smoked a pack of cigarettes so I was. I was just freaked out her husband. Charles Gooden was worried about the rest of their family. My parents live nearby and I thought wait a minute. You know they're in this mid seventies. Let's just get some for them. And they have it in case so they bought six kits in total. Pj and his wife. Anna bought kits. So I was having a lot of one on one contact with people and also you know eleven weeks pregnant and I was just very concerned about my exposure level and so they all bought these test kits but then a week went by the tests still hadn't arrived and that seemed to confirm you know their fear that what they had bought was not what was advertised which was a quick. Fda approved at home test. Eventually most of them tried to cancel the charges on their credit cards And for Mex- slows who's just trying to visit his mom. Her birthday came and went and he still hadn't gotten a test. He still didn't feel like he could visit her and so he missed her birthday and he told me he's just not sure when he'll be able to visit his mom next to think that someone would prey upon people's known anxieties and fears in a moment just so fraught with uncertainty and panic so repulsive at this point. I have enough reporting to take what I found. Two people in the government Actually go to the house. Oversight Committee reach out to them Two members of that committee Roger Christina Worthy and Katie Porter launch an investigation based on what we've reported and then because this is all unfolding in southern California a reach to the Los Angeles City Attorney Names Mike. Fewer his office in response sends a cease and desist letter to the company asking that they stop selling any at home test kits I also go back to the FDA AGAIN. They reiterated to me that they have not approved any at home tests. I think they're sick of me asking at this point because I've asked so many times just to make sure but they declined to comment on any individual company. Finally the company removed any link on their site where you could actually purchase anything anymore. Like shopping cart on the website was taken down and they put up a statement Where they say that it was always their sole intention to sell the test as a point of care system so that means only for use with a doctor or healthcare provider in other words. They're claiming they never meant to sell purely at home tests to us by yourself. And if customers inadvertently purchased the test kits without access to a healthcare provider. They said they could either get an immediate refund of their purchase or they said they would provide telemedicine so that some sort of healthcare provider could walk through that process. So they're saying if you bought one of these tests we'll walk you through it. Don't worry we'll help you do the test on yourself right and so I went back to the FDA. And I asked okay. I know at home test. Kits ARE NOT APPROVED. But what about at home test kits with some sort of telehealth component? Where a doctor walks through it and they told me no those are also not approved. We have not approved anything where you can take the test at home with the guidance of a doctor and so do we know like how many people have bought these tests. We don't know exactly how many But I was able to verify more than one thousand dollars in purchases by looking at the receipts from the customers I talked to the company would not tell me how many that they had sold. And the one way that we might actually get that number is because the. Us House Oversight Committee. When they sent a letter to the company they asked four that exact information and so they might either get an answer voluntarily or they can actually issue a subpoena to the company to force them to say how many kits they sold. And how much money they made off of it so you know journalists. We don't have subpoena power but the congress does so maybe we'll be able to find out that way and did you ever. I just want to be really clear to. Did you ever end up talking to anyone? Who received a test? Who ordered one no off the customers? We talked to they all say they never even received a shipping confirmation email and nothing ever came in the mail and so I mean the thing that I just can't help thinking is like if we had the testing from the beginning right in January when there was the first confirmed case of cove in nineteen in the United States if there had been widespread testing at that point like all the experts agree we needed to have. This might not have even happened right. That people wouldn't be so desperate that they would rely on like an email from a friend of a friend of a friend to buy a test. And you know actually talked to his this woman named Patty's at Ler. She's a law professor at the Ohio State University she used to work for the FDA. She was a associate chief counsel there and she told me like this always happens in a public health crisis when the disease or condition doesn't have a clear treatment or cure there's just opportunities for scammers basically to cheat desperate people out of a buck right and so the news you can use out of this reporting that you've done time is really simple. There is no at home testing right. Now Yeah if you see anyone selling an at home test it is not FDA approved which essentially means the US government does not know whether it works or not and so really watch out for that. If you or anyone you know has tried to get anything calling itself an at home test kit right to Tom at. T- dries box. That's T. D. R. E. S. B. A. C. H. At NPR or. Find Him on twitter at. Tom Drives Bach. Also we want to honor the people who have been lost to this virus and so if you or someone you know has lost someone. Please reach out and tell us their story leave us a voice memo and send it to embedded at NPR dot org or just write to US embedded at NPR dot. Org this episode was produced by Tom. Drives Buck and Chris Bender. Evan edited by Lisa. Pollock and Neil. Caruth our lawyer is Ashley Messenger. And we had help from Stevenson's Berg special thanks to Patty Settler Hanky Greeley Nita Fair honey music from blue dot sessions and rump teen Arab. Louis we will be back soon with more stories from the pandemic in the meantime thanks. Stay healthy and safe.

FDA Us Tom Drives Lady Gaga twitter Johnson Manhattan New York City California PJ Sadowski Kelly mcevers Cova Cova La David Salt Kelly Primary Care attorney Maryland NPR New Jersey
Finding Your Child's Passion - Daily Reset 4 Success

Natural Curiosity

34:16 min | 6 months ago

Finding Your Child's Passion - Daily Reset 4 Success

"Welcome to the natural curiosity podcast. We are live on Youtube and in our facebook group with two shows. Wisdom chats for the curious and daily reset for success. Be sure to visit our videos so you can see what we look like and be sure to say I. Today's episode is the daily reset. Four success now enjoy the show Hello and welcome so glad that you're here today. This is the daily reset for success. Show and we have a real treat not only for us but for you to and lady. Who's GonNa tell us all about it? Now don't forget. We're here live on youtube and facebook almost every day. And we're also on your favorite podcast APP case. You WanNa take us with you and you're in the car or walking the dog so just look for us where natural curiosity and we've got lots and lots of great information for you about how to reset your life because that's what we WANNA do. We want to keep that in mind that you know no matter what's going on in our lives we can wake up the next morning their reset again struggle over fresh start. You Know Eighty Ninety Marian. Oh we are so excited. I friend Julia Last cousy was on a month or so ago. She was the singer and the actress and she told us about Isabella Mongolia. And we should. We've never had a youngster on our show and I don't WanNa call her child because she's definitely not child. She's a youngster. She's eleven and she's already got her musical. The theatrical rear started so Isabella Guyana and her mother in Net Mugabe. E- excuse me I'm him. Loan Eighty were interesting now on today because this is all about finding your child's passion as the news of the this particular show and it's you know she could've stopped you right. Isabela. Your mother couldn't just said No. I don't want you out there. I don't want you to you know. Share your gifts with the world. Because I'm afraid right she could've sparked you so we thank you actually a net for being the person that you are sharing your daughter off. You told me an APP that Isabela was going through. Some stuff is a A youngster and she didn't find things it was. They were not lining her up. They just weren't her passion. Tell us a little bit about that story. So she is like I guess everybody Trying to find something she would like so we started with a ballet at some point and After you know as monster go on going on she was making excuses not to go like up from school and she was like okay. My Toe hurts today. Go to you yes I would. I would just not want to go. Try to think of any excuse ahead like this. I can't go unless you get in the car from school. She started making excuses like it was like she thought about it the whole day. What did I say today not to go then? Then we tried to masks and and it was kind of scary right Bella. Yes beckoning since I was younger. I wasn't as scared. You know I would just kind of leap into things a little bit more but still pretty scared like bars and stuff especially I would get scared of. It looks to carry you know when you see him on. Tv and like you know. And they're don't ball. Yeah I would be scared to Definitely surgery that I was really scared. So yeah gymnastics. I wasn't yes. It wasn't and so after After six months gymnastics was over. And we try taekwondo right and that lasted two years but he was like how'd drag because they would make sign six month contracts and after six months I would ask her. Do want to continue. But if you continue you have to commit to six months and she would think about it and she would say well you know. Let's go let's go ahead and do it because she wanted. I wanted her to learn how to defend herself. And it gives you disciplined focus and it has many things that I think are very you know good for for kids in but it was dragging her to type on the after a little while and I did like it but I just got tired of it because it wasn't losing at my thing so I just get tired of IT and again. I would start with excuses to not go now. Was this calculated these excuses or did your your friends help you come up with the right ones. That work through their parent I privately. I probably would just think about it all day. Thank you know what my head hurts little bit. I can't go you only get I do. I didn't WANNA play piano. Why make me play piano? I don't want to yeah I've got now. Who is calling Sandru? I think Jia and that's my husband off Hanes just put the little message. There at theory is kidding. That's so finely how did Isabela how did you finally decide what you really loved? Well on when I was in second grade we did a school musical and after that I liked it and I said hey mom I want to do a musical but we have agreed and fifteen musicals. Emmett school so I said I won't be able to do it for very long. And so my mom got me into a theater camp and that's started doing theater and musicals and I started loving it at the director. Did you never even on weekends? You was like she never complained and then hurt theater. Teacher would tell them. If you're how is it bill you're late I if you're later super late if you're in time you're late. No she said she said if you're on time you're late so pretty much. You have to go early so that you're you're ready. You're completely ready. You're warmed up. You had your costume Ron. Yeah if you're telling me light. Oh that's a drag meek. I was being dragged on time but my thought was. She was getting a little shy in front appeal so especially adults. Sometimes so I was like will theater is going to help her with that. You're going to feel more She was going GonNa. I mean it's going to help her. Somehow she's GONNA learn to speak in public. She's going to learn things that are going to be useful for her in life. So but I never thought she would stick to it your audience Isabella Teen Isabella about checking in from Philadelphia. Young Vivian Vivien with. That's my putty. Media's I'm so proud of though isn't it and that's already so what would you musical? Isabella was the first time you we're on stage that when you were in the second grade well yes that musical was go fish and then my first musical an acting class was Cinderella. We're usage around. I know I I did so. I think I was some townspeople Ariza. A ballroom dancer. So I was kind of just in the background. Were that's worse. Oh yeah I got to wear a Unicorn Horn to not? Oh then what was next? After that I did Cinderella again and I got the king doing musicals twice at I can get a better role of second time and then I went to any eyelid. Pinocchio twice as well yet. Weinstein were these in school. Jimmy were they make reductions are were they someplace else. They were somewhere else. They were in a acting school. Oh yes wow so you were already on stage as third third grade. Second Third Grade. Second Look early. Start yes now. Let's talk to another little bit about the process as a parent having a child as you can see she lights up about this particular thing so you could see you're dragging around with the you know all the other things you tried to get her involved in and then all of a sudden it's like mom. I'm really excited about this. How did that make you feel? And how did you support her to where she is now? It was hard because I'm not knowledgeable this area at all. I didn't know where I was and so I would talk to the theater teacher and I didn't know that the terms of I I was clueless so I think sometimes I kind of annoyed her. My Business Broglie were so basic then So I didn't want her when I started seeing her. Getting more and more serious I was like well. I don't want her to not have a childhood so I kinda I support her and everything she would ask me to do I. Would you know enroll her? I would even Jest things I just don't want her to to be overwhelmed with this because I want her to still be child but whenever she would find a difficulty I would support her by looking for someone who knew what they were doing. Because I didn't what it was doing. And she was very She was very concerned about getting. You know a good role in getting becoming better. The first time to went into a into an addition that drill la. She came out and told me mom. Everybody's better than me. They're everybody was better than me. I was like that's okay. Hey because I've seen kids that think that theater is going into an addition and being one of the leads and that's not it. It's you get a lot of On simul roles and she wanted to get good roles Issue would work. Yeah should get a you know work really hard for her dishes so I started by enrolling her in classes that were not just like the place actually but like technic technique and technical classes and even there was a class for a of for. Td Right film yet film countdown. So she did like a year film classes that she says she's not. She's not that passionate about that. She warms theater so my home. You mean like television or a movies or we all of it. You rather have the live. You'd think television yet rather like theater than like television and movies. I feel he just doing the scene over and over again can get iris affected. How you you know the kind of role that you're GONNA get. I mean there's not an audience right now so is that is that swayed you. Maybe going more towards television or no audience on not that much. Since since I'm not doing musical or anything I get more time to this. Everything and practice my lines for the play. I'm actually doing right now. Tom Question from the audience. This is Karen here Anderson is. Are there tips that you're acting teachers? Tell you to do daily or monthly to keep you up on being ready for your next big role. Thank you for that. So we think so to keep ready for your next big role I think she's talking about the extra sizes. Maybe what you have to do. Oh exercises maybe to a practice like auditions. Maybe you're gonNA yeah all right so maybe just will. I heard this tape. That is kind of go in and kind of be yourself a bit I'm trying to think of anything else that I've been told Mom Can you think of anything that I will? I've I know every time you see. You're acting teacher. She gives you exercises for every single class where you have to warm up and you have to practice lines and you have to practice monologues and work on becoming a character. You're working on so that transformation that you know she talks about those are important tips. But it's practice practice practice practice at monologue very important. She's not crazy about. Yeah it's it's part of it because you have to memorize a lot you have to memorize a monologue and analyze a character and become that character right. Yeah yes I'm interviewing Julia got involved with you. How did you find her and how she helped you both of you? I'd like to has no blessing one by Dula Villa. Do want to say do want me to tell them here Well I use a Halley. Got Julia I'd say okay so when she was in one of her musicals She started sheet will was all theater the whole two months. It was like theater classes all the time. It was either technique out audition Singing dancing in an acting classes but it was the whole summer by the end of the summer she started she had lead in. She started complaining that when she would sing and go to higher notes. It would start hurting her so i. I contacted her acting teacher her teacher and she told me that she was not using the right techniques and the she needed vocal coach so. I started searching for vocal coach and I found somebody. Who was there not a good bit so it was really hard? Because I didn't know what to tell her and I didn't know how to help her at all. I had no clue so we want one of my friends. Her son is in Broadway and I didn't know because she's like a work print so I had no idea. She had anything to do with this and she told me. will My my son brought way. I been there so she gave me Julius number. And that's how we got to. Julia and Julia gave her the best thing EEK. She has never heard herself again. And and also. She has grown so much locally. My rage is expanding a lot. That's wonderful I am so happy to hear that so other first time I got to listen to Julia saying was at Unity Church of Houston and I literally cried. I admit it she just sings like an angel. And I'm looking forward to hearing you sing so for those of you. Who are out there watching us either on Youtube or or if you're on a podcast listening to us you're in for a real treat because we have it on good authority. That Isabella's thing. I later on here that so stay tuned all right all the different things that we're talking about if you want to get a hold of them if you want to make a comment down below in the description there's a way for you to talk. You can ask US questions right now because we're live in Youtuber facebook. All you have to do is put put comment in and we'd be happy to answer your questions. Lady Moo or no. You have another question. Yeah I WANNA ask Isabella how have your friends reacted to your singing career? And you're acting one. Well they say I'm going to be on Broadway someday allow it. They say that I'm GonNa be doing a lot of things and I'm really supporting the they support you. I think that's beautiful and who did do we have a heat. So fealty in Isabela is amazing. Here Florida Theresa. This is also just light up Isabella. That's wonderful this beautiful trade to take it from his hers. We've got all your Trente China. Oh my gosh this is beautiful because your friends are really supporting you and your relatives your father and everybody. I love that because if we don't give our children's support how are they going to grow an I pod you bet and your husband and all of your relatives because this is given as a boost in confidence in herself that she might not otherwise have gotten so that is perfect? We're behind a hundred percent. We are so excited for you. Know You have a big fan club and what I mean by that. It's not just you know weirdoes out there. They're looking at you. These are real people that care about you and that we want you to succeed and so you just keep doing what you do best which is acting and singing and putting yourself out there with what lights you up you know. So many of us We take jobs or we get stuck in situations where it's not really what we WANNA do. And we're not good at making the excuses that you did at Isabella. We're just blew it. We just get up and do it because somebody told us too. I'm proud of you for just keep going to figure out what you're passionate and going for it. I'm I'm jealous. I'm jealous. It took me so I was a late bloomer. It took me so many years to find my passion and I'm still finding it at seventy five and I I like that. I'll never quit growing and that's what you're doing about. You're growing and expanding and getting more and more confident and it's it'll show in everything you do now because of this confidence good fresh elections to you enter your Mama and dad. Oh this is beautiful. Another Allah of my friends Leah Ongoing. And soon you'll achieve your main goal. Well that brings me to my now. What is that well? I don't exactly have one. It's I would say it's too little on Broadway and doing I love to do which is a singing acting dancing. Just keeping moving forward. What are you For See as the future for Isabella. Do you see You know this taking off really fast too fast just right you need to slow it down. Speed it up How are you seeing this in your head? You and your husband. I'm trying to go out her pace so I see her getting more and more serious which I was not expecting Especially since you started seeing duly at because she started getting better better and so I see her getting more serious but I'm GonNa let her decide and if if in five years she decides this is not what she wants to do also one hundred percent. I just want her to follow her own passion whenever she decides my speakers. Let's hear that beautiful voice. Peggy Peggy say. She said her speakers are loud. Let's you're listed. Well shall we go ahead? 'cause we will come back after you sing. How how's at Isabela? You Wanna go ahead and sing now. Let me describe my music. How right take just a second. She needs to stand up so she can get the air and her lungs and we're excited. What are we going to say? I'll be right back. Okay you know what I'm saying. Yes she's Gonna. Start so she's GonNa sing two songs one. They're both Short one of them is a classical piece. And it's Oprah It's an opera. Ps It's an Italian. It's cold Nil Corp Yunan me central mass which means my heart has lost. Its speeding and it's Kinda like about suffering for love but it's it's an Italian piece and then the other one the music about that and the other one is a little piece of circle of life from Disney Hawaiian King Maggi. She was going to be in lion king tonight. Oh the presentation. The opening night was tonight but It was obviously rescheduled more November. Oh well she yes. And so she was Ready to perform that. She knew all her lines. Even before the the first rehearsal she knew her lines and she was really excited about that play. So hopefully we'll be able to see her in November. Oh so back and let us know when that is so we can all go and support her on right. We're ready for wrong one right there. She's GonNa give you. The full screen are perfect. Just tell me if you can't hear too I can play letter me say mean girl. Need G musty Be Don't you well. It gave me goop spouse over right now for number two are so that'll be circle of life. Yes they do. He's going nuts handling step into there's no oil to see can never be seen more to do than to live. There is gonNA take more than connect owned but unrelenting. I keep more on the endless I Move Oh ho I we on the ice goes of La. I huge is Bella. That was beautiful Wouldn't that lovely? Gosh you are quite a talent. I am so happy you found your dinner willing to share it. Wow well we're so happy that you're here to and thank you as Abella for putting all this together as I had no you to have worked very hard. It paid off. It's a beautiful beautiful day and you have sung very well Me WanNa come and watch you at your your next and south. We need to know when that is a we can come and support you for sure. Don't you forget about us now? When you're you know a big do we say that invitations. If everything goes well as enrolled to being Moana in June in July suffering. But we don't know how do is going to look like and lion king was rescheduled for November. So and she is young. Simba in line. See that's fine role isn't it? They were running out of this one question for you. Ills Avella when you sing like you did just now and you give it your all you get more pumped up or are you drained like. Oh my God I need to take a nap. Well I get really excited. Especially when I'm able to do things that I could do like hit a belting know who which is A high no that he's not in your head voice. If you know what I mean. Chest Voice yes and I. Somehow I knew that because lady Liu and I've had that discussion before you know like if you do something really great you know. Sometimes the next day you feel tired you don't WanNa do it and I just like if you send me till I can expo or something like that where there's a lot of people that's where I get really pumped up on like are you kidding me. I'm on top of the world so I totally get that. That's because that's your passion Isabela. That's why you feel even more excited We had one question and then we'll have to go. This is from Peggy. She wants to know. Where is the lion team going to be playing in November November? It's going to be the showtimes theatre it's In Katy Texas a ten ninety nine close to King's Lenders Church If you if you look for Showtime Theater Online it's a community theater hearing Katie. You'll find it. It's showtime theater town. Yeah they'll have it. It's close at ninety nine. An kingsland boulevard. Excellent rate is about how we have you back on before your show starts and if you low more publicity. Would you like to do that? Yes of course. And you where you are you're costumer. Will they let you take it home with you? I think so. I don't know if I'll be able to wear it. But if I am that I will tell them you have debut on live stream video. Yeah right working lady the inner you'll have your ipad with you right when sure behind islands. Yes also you can maybe take a picture something that to own my. Gosh this. It's so fun. Thank you both for being here. And we thank all of your supporters. Your fans who tat headed in live and Eric. We appreciate everyone in. Our audience is so special to US too. So thank you again Isabella for the beautiful music and for your view on you do. You're going places and thank you Annette. That because you have encouraged her and giving her the confidence to soar and that's beautiful thought. Thank you so much. Thank you for having US having I I. Are You an entrepreneur or business owner if you said yes check out. Our natural curiosity business mastermind. We are online using soon video chat meeting every week you will find support training and lifelong friendships. I encourage you to visit Patriots. Fan Dot com slash natural curiosity and get the support. That you want now Thank you for joining us for today's show. Remember it's our pleasure to bring you interesting co hosts and topics so connect with US often. We're looking forward to the next time we're together by for now.

Isabella Teen Isabella Julia Last Isabela Youtube Isabella Isabella Mongolia Isabela La Isabella Guyana Cinderella Bella facebook US Emmett school Showtime Theater Online Vivian Vivien Ariza director lady Liu Jia
Agent Carter S2E9: A Little Song and Dance

Capes and Lunatics

29:05 min | Last month

Agent Carter S2E9: A Little Song and Dance

"This episode of Capes and lunatics is brought to you by tweaked audience. Awesome headphones good at tweaked audio dot com and use the coupon code southgate to get thirty percent off free shipping and a lifetime warranty where he can get there through the link on our website Southgate Media Group DOT COM. Hard eason welcome. wincing to. Stream ahead, I'm your Captain Charlie, the Professor Esser, and with me is always may I mate in skinny rich friend? A mass. Oh, welcome. Once again to agent Carter Season Two, episode nine, a little song and dance. Peggy desperately tries to save Dr Wilkes with a dangerous plan to Stop Whitney Frost but Thompson makes a surprising move that could destroy them all a director. This week is Jennifer gets Zinger Stanley Inject Kirby. Of course, have those based on marvel comics by credits Reading, The got Christopher Markus and Stephen mcfeely with are created by. A play by this week is Chris Dingus. Story. By is from Michelle Fazekas and Tara butters and then. Sue Chung and Eric Pearson or our executive. Story Editors. To Extort executive story editors over the hardest working woman in show business Lindsey Allen are springer, old story editor. Go in this. Yes. I'm sorry what? You need those. In need those well, you know. She, there's so much she has to being so hard working she actually needs to executives over her to make sure that it's just so much they have to supervise. One. Executive editor could not supervise as much story editing as she does so. Working Woman in show business. Mice. Getting. Back to the actual story little signed dance, and of course, as the title implies we open with a big musical number that Thad. How, do you feel about big musical numbers smiles as long as they're in a dream I'm perfectly fine with them. Okay. Okay. I don't think I've ever had a musical dream. So I don't think I have either. Yeah. So even when they're in a dream, it's kind of odd to me. Yeah you know so but it's it's fine. It's it's a showpiece. They wanted to do that. So they could get to the end a gag at the end of it, but we also, and also most importantly in this, we actually were able to get Angie into this series. Angie R R remember the waitress actress waitress. Gus Abacha Gotcha. Yeah Yeah. Now, we've been I, you know I remember when we when it was first announced that they were going to California and was like Oh that's going to be so great and he's going to be exploring life Hollywood actress. Did. Not. Know. Angie to the last episode or I'm sorry the penultimate. To during. And and Dance about you know you're torn between two lovers Yada Yada. Yada. We get a little bit from From Buddy in this, you know where she says Oh come on peg always in your head. was, delightful, and then You know drivers comes into break it up, and then of course, rose comes in and says, I'm sorry, just not right for the Arab. Health. Agency and then. She wakes up in the back of the van with journalists because they had been captured. Because as we saw last episode. Drivers tried to shoot Whitney and actually succeeded in it for the dead and. Whitney basically realized that in order to control welk she needs to. Have Peggy under control as well because you know. Loves her. That's how it goes in. Hollywood. And It's it's Ya that that that relationship and I really think that relationship never gets properly resolved in these last two episodes will get to that. Because at this time, Wilkes, is still villain. Wilkes, is still a bad guy. And I think that's important because I think out most of this episode everyone is like, why are you defending this man? Is it just because you've got a thing for him and injured I don't know how I feel about that. Because I don't know exactly we're. We're. We're Peggy's loyalty is what I do know her loyalty is on that. She is very against killing even people like Frost in court would smith although. I think she sees redemption and she's a fan of that and I think she also sees his value as a the person he was. A way to get him back. That isn't that what we should all be aiming for. Yeah I. Guess. So but at the same time, it's a big risk to take when we're dealing with lots and lots zero matter because that is the that is the problem of the weakness is that we have a surplus of zero matter that wants to devour the universe. In this in this moment Peggy drivers do escape, the the truck and do their own little confrontation as they go. But meanwhile over with Thomson and. And a Sousa. Samburu somberly. They realize they're starting to worry that you know what happened to them. They. Disappeared and Were left out here in the desert today When they see the Truck car coming but realize it's Kurt would Smith's men and Thompson? Of course, quickly realizes as Susa. They're not coming to to save them. Or to take back to. Older probably GONNA put them in the whole. The probably GonNa put them in a hole on the desert right this simply. At this point yes. But this where Thomson comes starts his plan and starts I think. Showing. His value. You know. I think I know that we some disagreement about this maybe this episode maybe next episode but I think in this moment he does he understands and this I think is where you get the basic disconnect between someone like Thompson than someone like Peggy Peggy is an idealist. And Thompson is not because Thompson understands or at least Thompson is thinking about. The angles in the compromises in what needs to be done to get them to the next step. Because essentially what he does, he portrays himself as. You know the person who captured. Same Samper Leeann Susa. Instead of as their co-conspirator which arguably just. You. Can See what can see how this looks like. He might just be saving his skin, but we do see that he does have a broader plan and is quite manipulative in the way he deals with everybody. You know I I think I like Susa story in this. But Tom Tompkins Thompson story in this specifically because he shows that he understands how to work with people's understands how to to. Tell them what they want to hear to get them to do what he wants and I think that's a positive thing and especially for person in the game that he's in right I mean. Bottom of the barrel for looking for things to you know take pride in in Thompson for well you know I mean I I mean I'm I'm very proud of Whitney frost in this as well. You know get. She is pretty awesome for everything she does. She is. Manipulative and and and a monster to. She has a guideline of ethics that she lives by Thomson macconnell moment whatever is most convenient. I think I think that Thompson has code as well, and I think it s I. Think it is. It is. It is a code that says what's best for Thompson, but I don't think Whitney's is anything other than what's best for? Whitney. And this is what I was gonna say I like the fact that what Thompson does he puts himself in a situation where if it ever go south, he has an But he's also planning on what is the most? What is what will do the most good and solve our problems and also keeping safe Aimed in that direction is something he accidentally falls upon the last resort I might as well do it will do some good too. That's how I see. See. I. Think that it's very intentional and deliberate from from his initial. talking you know the the The Guardian into taking. And back with him talking i. mean he had no other choice in that moment. It. Do? What? He'll him to. He knew they were there to kill him too because he had already run out on. What's his name? The general he already is back on him and he wanted to kill him and they said as much to him. Hey, listen we're here to kill you too. So it was an active self-preservation he really had no choice. For Survey Shen what I'm saying is his acts of self preservation if it was truly venial, he said. His I don't know what you're talking about I don't recall that member he had his brain wipe. He didn't recall what he had done. And the fact of the matter is is he could have been shot Sousa. And said you know I still? Better to loose it's like. He was back in decision every time. That's what I think you know but. You, know Long as she comes to a good decision, I don't know if it's a problem that he was back into it. You know. The person that occasionally lasers himself into the same direction as good. Well, no because I think it would be much easier for him to. To dutiful he'll turn. Now has he would have been more work in this situation. Well, I get the feeling that four turned on them. Then they would have said, no, he's not here capturing us. He was helping us. Just gets all three of them killed in. The Post. The just the two of you couldn't turn on. In unless he and his little say in less shoot Susa, I. Right exactly and. Shooting. He he's not an evil person. He's just a you know a lazy coward. Well you know. Fair, enough because I'm not gonNA deny that these lazy caliber also say I'm impressed by the by the by the plan he is late. I think he built out a very smart and intricate plan sure with a lot of double crosses to be sure. But all double crosses that I think in the end, serve himself as they're serving the story and and to put it simply. Without his double crosses. I think Peggy would have gotten them all killed. 'cause they're rigid plan, which is he he's GonNa. Say the original plan was okay KIRKWOOD'S GONNA shoot. Whitney. which we don't even know if that's GonNa work only knows at maybe it's GonNa, knock the the the the the zero matter out of her but you know even that it's just this it's just this attempt to attacker which make an and which may cause her to attack. Basically if it doesn't work, she's GonNa kill all of them plus it puts them in in debt to quit Smith meaning that he's always going to have something over them. And he realizes the only way any of us get out of this is if we can take out Kurt would and Whitney with extreme prejudice right now because Whitney is a real danger, not just an esoteric danger but a real danger to all of us. To the world is the argument and so yeah, he needs to do that and then he also knows that quite frankly the arena club is a danger to everyone as well and take, and they're already you know already disheveled but you know if we can take out Kirkwood that gives us some strengths too. So I think the idea of I think Thompson's plan although yes, it was definitely. Say Kirkwood's plan was the kind of plan that I think Peggy would have come up with from the way she says how she would be because you know we saw when will. Threatens Peggy she says, well, you should let me let him shoot me. Just I would. Never you know. I. Would you always let the other person die if it? Progresses the mission. For the good of the mission, you let the other person die and that is you know that is help Peggy may say she wants to be but as we see this, she's not you know she is she is softer than that but. Getting back to the actual story. Peggy and the gang do get back to what? Peggy and Jarvis do get back to as our headquarters where she immediately starts to Pummel Poker would smith. Levy. Which is, which is both comedic in scary because it really looks like she's GonNa kill this old man. God. Never nothing she is. Much worse for the wear. Yeah. Well, you know. There was no blood. No bruising as men she looked like she went to town on his face. Yeah. Maybe he's really good at you know. Rolling with the punches I don't know but yes. You should have it. Would've made this much more complex. We're maybe Peggy's just is good enough to know how to hurt you without leaving a bruise. You know she got moves but yeah. And that's where we do see Thomson's plans start to play out, which is also we're going to, and let's see I like this episode again, like I really feel this is Thompson's episode. I really feel this is where we get to give Thompson this really strong art we're. Yes he's Venal. He's cowardly whatever, but he's also intelligent. And a planner and you see that he's more than just a big dumb guy who can beat people up you can see these more than just you know allowed. A person who can shout orders that through a bullhorn, he's a guy who can actually plan and strategize. And his plan is. What they say he tells you know we need to take out he he appeals to Kirkwood by playing to his entities saying you know you don't like taking. Orders from this woman let's blasted with the gamma cannon. We'll bring you. The mccaddon will will will blast with it knocked the you know knocks the zero right out of her, you know bring her down to our level and then. Take take take it from there arrestor and deal with that. Meanwhile when he go then goes to Whitney he sells out Kirkwood explains what the plan is and then you know says I want to be on the council wants this and the other plays into her senses of Oh this is you know a venial power hungry monster I can I can I can work with that and. Then the third act is is no actually he was playing other than because his plan is to have Sam Burley turned the Gamma device into a bomb. To blow them both up and essentially saved day and of course, this goes wrong because. She he because Peggy goes to get welk's woke says, don't save me. You leave I can't be saved. I have this too much dark matter in and I can't leave because if I leave is already going to tear me apart and we're going to kill a lot of people. Exactly. That's what he was saying. He's like look you have got to leave. This is not safe I have to be here. Okay. If he blows up the gamma thing, maybe that'll take me out to and that would be a good thing and peggy is willing arguably to sacrifice everyone for this one person who has already turned on them. Once you know for what it's worth you know. you know for all of the for everything that Thompson has done. He's never turned on anyone in the Sr. you know he's never actually done a full villainous turn I'm GONNA work with the bad guys in now every time he's made a venial or petty choice or cowardly choice. It was always in in its own way in the service of a greater good or greater idea of good. And will you know when he betrays them? He really has betrayed them because he wants to figure out what's going on and get to what the answers of his powers now once he gets. Its adduced by the idea of so much power and being able to control it to. Yeah. I, mean there's lots of the. There's lots of side aspects to I'm just saying you know it. It's. It's a mistake to think of you know Thompson's plan is being bed just because he doesn't mind that Wilkes is in this too because Wilkes has already betrayed them once. If, example makes the point. Isn't it with the bad guys now? We just go over this and but it goes into that whole idea that she does not want to sacrifice these people. You know she's okay to second for bad the other people but not for. This one although she was never even that good was sacrificing them, which is the point she meets. You rather bring coat wordsmith suggested she would rather bring. Whitney. Frost justice. If they can find a way to do that the only reason why she's tolerating is it because he doesn't understand there really was no way to bring them to justice. So that was the split decision. Literally because you know Susan's Setting vote on it. But she draws the line at Wolves and. You know they go and they have this little confrontation. We're basically they have this discussion that if we do not kill Whitney in Kirkwood, you know. What he says is like look Whitney's Kirkwood right now and I'm GonNa hit this button and that's going to Hit the button that's GonNa Kill Them, and then you realize realizes it doesn't work realizes it's them goes goes and confronts somberly and. Sousa and that's where they have their big confrontation Pai's got out. She's GonNa Shoot Tomkins are Thomson Thomson Times that says you know I'm going to push the button and then the explosion happens. And That's where we're actually. Explicit doesn't happen. What actually happens is we see Wilkes come out of the room he lacked himself and because just prior to this. A Kurt. What is? Has Been A as he is being. Killed by Whitney she stops because she realizes he's smiling. And he says 'cause they got you too and then she turned around and realizes that the game Obama's armed. And then just as that happens, that's when Wilkes comes in and explodes in a zero matter and then everything goes to black. And then we come back to it next week MAS. Don Dunstan. It ends on a cliffhanger. What happened we don't Never know we'll never know well, actually we will not because there is one more episode after this penultimate episode ticket drank. The little short. No. The next episode is the final episode doesn't seem but whatever happens at the end of that episode we never get. Inkling as to who did it or why Get that that is the mystery. Danzon. What a shame Shame shame we never got back to agent. Carter you know she signing onto another TV show there was all politics with the whole agents thing and whether or not they're going to do another Carter season really her and the woman who played sift they all had a lot of. There was a lot of back and forth with with everybody and. Especially, because he was having kind of a tug of war about the future of marvel with the person who is in charge of marvel television. And so between now, eventually, it got to be so bad that Disney had to essentially slap them both and say baggies in charge. He makes us billions of dollars you guys shut up and do as you're told and. Gets us to our current era, the Disney plus era where foggy is in charge of everything and where. you know I, think would be getting a lot of great things. So now the question on everyone's mind is does foggy hold a grudge. I don't think he does because I think one thing he's going to be doing, which I'll talk about on superconductivity this week with felt is I think he actually is going to be wanting to revisit things that were done poorly. But show how they could be done right I'm with that and I think we may get some stuff back with with Carter and I don't think he's going to just throw out the baby with the bathwater I. Think he's going to bring it in. Tacitly, acknowledged what it was, but then say, but here's here's here's the deeper truth and take there. So we'll see what happens we punish a movie. I've heard rumblings right. There's always rumblings about punishing movie basically at at Mar at Disney right now everything's on the table except right now nothing's on the table because of code. So. But yeah, I mean back when they were making movies constantly punish it real possibility everything's real possibility and the reality is everything is still a possibility once things. Start to move back to normalcy when we start to move forward with things. As it is, we have to get to that point. You know. So but for right now hopefully he's GonNa come back. Hopefully, we'll get resolutions to this. We'll get resolutions to Peggy Carter Story. This I would love I mean I know that there's there is there is a demand out there to find out what's going on with that. You know and what's going on with how the next episode ends and you know there's a lot going on. But we'll talk about all that next week. Myers Any final thoughts on tonight's show No I. Thought I thought it was a good one but. I'm really excited about the next one. Next one is that's our big our big Hollywood ending. In the meantime. Lords and ladies. Who have been listening to our show perhaps, you're listening on some standard audio equipment and that is a shame because there's great things being talked about here. So why don't you hustle on over to tweet CARDIO DOT COM yet T. w. e. k. e. d., A. D. I O. DOT COM. Use The coupon code southgate to get a discount on any of the high quality audio equipment you will find over there at tweets audio dot com. You can use that same code over at hunter killer dot. com to basically get an escape from delivered to your house once a week or once a month which three awesome they're even starting in new Blair witch themed mystery for you to. Yeah so that should be exciting and of course, if none of that really interest, you can always go down to the show notes, click the Amazon link, which will take you to Amazon Dot com where you can buy anything you want and it costs you nothing to buy their but it helps us if you click from the link on our show notes. So that's great. and. While you're there, check out pod life the book the book produced by and buy in from the Southgate Media Group Empire. Little vignettes written by. The men and women of Southgate media. Group about who they are, why they podcast in how podcasting. Has and will change the world. And once you've done all that if you would like to get in touch with US mice, how can they do that? Oh, they can email me Mas Manzoor at gmail.com or find me on facebook under Mas Manzoor. That's M. O. Doubles E. M., A. N. Z. Double-o O. R.. And of course, right to me that old fashioned. And Pas, wants did at superconductivity blog. Eh gmail.com super activity buck one word. Jimoh Dot Com could follow me on twitter. They live tweet things that are live when I feel like quitting them, which is not often because nothing's really live anymore. Turtle yes. Sir. That's Really. Yes. ESI are looking to ease in the middle for quality. Thank you, M- has. H Era Filthy landlubbers you've come across another wonderful evening walk in with us through the world of Peggy Carter. Please come aboard again next week as we once again sale. Stream ahead.

Peggy Peggy Whitney Frost Tom Tompkins Thompson Peggy Carter Dr Wilkes Thomson Kurt Sousa Leeann Susa Kirkwood Kirkwood Hollywood executive Smith Angie R R Executive editor Chris Dingus eason Southgate Media Group
Tekarkana Phantom Part 2

Cherry Avenue True Crime Podcast

32:14 min | 1 year ago

Tekarkana Phantom Part 2

"Welcome back to cherry avenue crime podcast. This is part two of the techs are cana- phantom case if you haven't listened to the first part yet, please go back and listen to part one. There's a lot of information there that you'll want to hear I just wanna say quickly. Thank you so much for all your support. I've gotten some really nice emails recently. And I really appreciate your kind words and thank you so much for listening. I'll put the Email in the show notes and also recited at the end of this episode, also, please let me know if it is, okay. To read your Email in the feedback section, which we will do eventually at the end of the show. And also, let me know if I can use your name, or if you want to be anonymous, okay on with part two, this is a true crime podcast. And it contains material and descriptions that may be disturbing to some people this podcast is intended for mature. Audiences only listener discretion is strongly advised. Okay. Let's do a quick recap for part two February nineteen forty six. We have a young couple parking and lovers lane. Amass man, shines a flashlight out them orders them out of the car, and then sadistically assaults. I the mail then the female they survived this attack. Although the young man was in serious condition and remained hospitalized for several weeks. Jimmy Hollas, and Mary Jean laret were the ones who were able to give us the description of the attacker. So we know he is approximately six feet tall and was wearing a white mask with eyes and mouth holes. Cut out note. I have found that I might have been pronouncing Mary jeans last name incorrectly. And it is pronounced laret. I apologize. I had heard it said as Larry a few times before this and thought that w-. The correct way. But I now believe it is Mary Jean Laurey. Then in March of forty six there is another young couple Richard Griffin and pollyanna more parking in different lovers lane. Sadly, they do not survive the attacks and are found shot to death the next morning. It is thought the young woman was killed and raped outside of the car and put back in. In April of forty six. We have a young couple in high school Paul Martin and Betty Jo Booker parking on a road near the spring lake park. They were both found shot to death. The next day their bodies miles apart and away from the car the final attack attributed to the phantom was in may of forty six and was at the Starks. Farmhouse on the Arkansas side of texture cana- Virgil Starks was shot twice in the back of the head while sitting in his living room chair the attacker shot him through the close double window Virgil died at the scene. Katie Starks was shot twice in the face while trying to call for help but managed to get out of the house and run to get help from neighbors. She was driven to the hospital. An although she too was in a serious condition manage to survive. So now, we will get into a deeper dive into the main suspects one of the prime suspects was of course. Issue will Sweeney on Friday June twenty eighth nineteen forty six Arkansas state police officer max Tackett, a rookie at the time found a car that had been reported stolen in a parking lot. He staked out the car until someone came back to it that someone was Peggy Sweeney who had just married you'll Sweeney Tackett arrested twenty one year old Peggy she told him they had just gotten married, but her husband was in Atlanta, Texas, trying to sell another stolen car. Max Tackett had a theory about a car being stolen on a night of a murder while a previously stolen car was also abandoned on the night of a murder because of this. He was looking for you'll Sweeney hard one of the books. I recommended in part one was phantom killer by James Presley. He makes a much better case for you'll Sweeney than I've ever heard before I never really seriously considered Sweeney until I read this book, I'm not convinced as Sweeney though. But Presley puts up a good argument. Sweeney's new wife who would have been his girlfriend when the murders were taking place had a lot to say. And most of it was very condemning. However, the account she gave were made over the course of a significant amount of time that she was being held the courts never heard these accounts, and she refused to testify against you will Sweeney Sweeney was never charged with the murders. Of course, she might not have been telling the truth. And of course, if she was telling the truth, then she was present at at least one murder scene, and what does that make her? It is said that when a lawyer told her that her husband was being held for a murder. She had said how did they find out? Peggy was arrested on June twenty eighth nineteen forty six and you'll Sweeney was arrested in mid July, nineteen forty six when max Tackett caught you'll Sweeney Sweeney said, please don't shoot me Tackett replied, I'm not gonna shoot e for stealing cars Sweeney, then replied, Mr. don't play games with me. You want me for more than stealing cars in the letters that were written up for Peggy. But that she would not sign. There was a lot about the Booker Martin murders. Peggy seemed indicate in her interrogation letters that. She was at the crime scene with you'll Sweeny, but that she did not participate in the crimes. However, her story kept changing whether she was changing it on her own or she was being led by the questions they were asking or if she just heard some of the details while she was being held her. Confessions were contradictory in her first account. And she was just sitting in the car while he did the killings. He then drove somewhere else and took a large black leather case out of a coupe. That was sitting there empty and told her a friend said he should pick it up for him. It was presumably the saxophone Betty Jo Booker had with her. However, we know the killer did not take the saxophone because it was found in some overgrowth in an area of the park, some six months later, and it was clear it had been sitting there ever since the murders. In another statement after this one she said, you'll told her he was going to rob someone and she went with him after driving around for a while he picked the coop to rob they parked aways away. And then they both walked up to it together. And he told the boy to get out. He then shot the boy twice then you'll went and got his car and backed it up to the coup. He put the boy in the back seat and made the girl get in the front seat with him. He made Peggy sit in the coupe while he was gone. He came back at daybreak picked Peggy up and took the black leather case and left. The next statement is even more muddled was stories of Peggy getting in the backseat of the car with the girl, and you will got in the front seat with the boy, and you will drove the coop around when he stopped the car. Everyone got out and he shot the boy it was about to leave when he saw the boy walking. So he went back and shot him two more times. Then he drove somewhere else got out of the car with the girl. Untold Peggy to stay there. She heard gunshots and then he came back. He got the saxophone out of the car and threw it over the fence. This statement was made November after the actual saxophone inside its case was found in October. So this is how Peggy would know that the saxophone was thrown in the location where it was found. Okay. So now, we have lone wolf Gonzalez is interpretation of the scene. What his understanding was of what happened April fourteenth. The killer watched Martin and Booker in their car for awhile. He then walked up to Martin's car with a pistol and demanded to get inside. He drove Martin's car around north park road. He demanded Martin to get out he shot Martin in the face blood splattered on the bushes. Martin ran off the killer shot him three more times while he was fleeing. He then drove the girl back to where he parked his car near spring lake park. Birkir got out and ran her high heels made prince in the soft ground he caught her and pulled her inside his car. He then drove her out to Morris lane where he attacked and killed her. Could you'll Swinney have done these crimes he was just a car thief? As far as anyone knew up until that point. You'll Sweeney does have a sad background most family members both siblings and cousins said that both of his parents were not loving towards him. And in fact, he seemed to not be wanted. One story goes that the whole family was eating dinner in the house and his father the Reverend of a Baptist church made him stay outside the whole time. You will told one of his sisters. He was starving and begged her to bring him one biscuit, his parents, divorced and his father got basically, what was considered custody back, then he was supposed to stay with his dad during the nine months of school and could go with his mom in the summer if she wanted him. However, it didn't quite work out that way, he was living with grownup siblings part of the time. And then part of the time with his dad and part of the time with his mom. You will said one of his stepfather's was abusive. Yes. One of. Both parents remarried more than once you'll spend time in a reform school when he was a youngster and even had a serious injury when another reform school student hit him in the back with a two by four. He ended up getting a spinal hemorrhage from that. There was also something said about an injury. He had as an infant. But the details cannot be found. His family was definitely dysfunctional in. It sounds like he was at best neglected and at worst abused. There was a definite lack of love given to the boy. Later on. There were accounts of an incident where Sweeney had his wife Peggy hold a gun in a man while he whipped him with the chain. He seemed to derive pleasure from being able to whip the man while the man was unable to fight back. The afternoon of Friday may third Sweeney and Peggy had an argument with her sister over boarding money. They owed her Peggy's sister asked them to leave Sweeney and Peggy left her house that night soon after the Starks murders. It was said Sweeney flood with Peggy to Oklahoma. And he took a job doing hard labour. This was something he very rarely did. So that could point to his guilt, if you will was the phantom than there was a lot to point to Peggy being at most if not all of the crime scenes with you'll if he was the phantom she herself gave accounts of being at one of the murders. Although she refused to sign any of the multiple accounts. She gave. Also, not long after the Starks murders, you'll took Peggy to get married in Shreveport, a wife could not be compelled to testify against her husband. Here are some of the things that point to you'll not being the phantom. You will fingerprints did not match any of the latent prints at the Booker, Martin crime-scene Peggy Sweeney. Recanted. Her confession, the Texas Rangers and share of Bill Presley were not convinced that Sweeney was the phantom Sweeney denied being the phantom and never made a confession officers, including Bowie county sheriff Presley Miller county sheriff Davis Texas city chief of police Runnells their officers and both state police departments work day and night for six months trying to validate Peggy Sweeney's story of their whereabouts. They deduce that Peggy was not telling the truth and that on the night of the murder of Booker and Martin. The couple was sleeping in their car. Under a bridge near San Antonio. You will Sweeney was arrested almost two months after the last murders since each took place less than a month apart. It is possible that he was not the killer as he most likely would have moved on somewhere else to continue killing his wife was very young which explains part of her behavior. But they're also must have been something a little off about her as well. Some of the police who took her confession statements said the elevator did not go all the way to the top her bread was not Brown and other sayings like this. So that could mean she was crazy enough to participate in these crimes with you'll or she was crazy enough to make false confessions or she was just odd. Not that you have to be crazy to make false confessions. I do understand how that happens. And it's really sad to see how many have happens because it's just been so hard for people to understand it. But in this case, they all thought something was off about her. I went over everything I learned about you'll and Peggy with someone who is in law enforcement that I know he agreed. It seemed unlikely it was Sweeny. He said, it was definitely possible. Peggy was being led in some parts of her confession letters, especially way, back then whether it was intentional or not also telling the authorities, whatever they wanted to hear, but not the point of signing any of the declarations for some reason this part really bothered him and us then I found out about the letter to her parents I called to tell him. He was right. And here is the clincher. This is a letter from Peggy. He to her parents while she was being held. It comes from the F B I files and is being read as is with uncorrected spelling and grammatical errors. Dear mom, dad and kids will write you again today. How are all of you fine? I hope I guess the sheriff on the Texas side, and that F B I man had been out to the house for they was up to see me yesterday. They still think Sweeney killed those people. I don't know what to do. They don't believe me. So what else can I do? But to tell them that he did it. They will believe ally. If I send Sweeney to the chair that would be on my mind the rest of life for taking his life when he was not the one that kill that little boy and girl on April thirteen I could send him to his chair, then I would be killed that. So and so that you all rented that house from said that we was in the field on. April fourteen that is ally. I wish that dad would have said something to him about it too. I don't think they won't send me to the Penn. But it is Swinney that they are after Mr. Phillip told them some light to I guess, he think if they do away with Sweeney that it would help him to get out and that I would married I wouldn't married him. Now, if I knew I would get out by married him in my books. He don't rate as high as Sweeney does and Sweeney don't rate at all. Mother. I don't know of this will pass out of here or not. But I hope so I find out why the judge wouldn't lower my bond. It's no use in trying to make my bond because an FBI man, you know, who I in talking about would have to go out and look at the land and everything he would turn it down or he would rise the bonds so high that you can't make it. I find out more than the lawyer. I think you and dad just threw away two hundred fifty dollars Sweeney was put away for life for being habitual criminal for the repeated car-thefts a three strikes, you're out program type something they did this because they thought he was actually the phantom, but they couldn't make a case of it. Some think they did it as a just in case he was the phantom kind of thing, but they weren't completely convinced. It was him Sweeney was released from prison in nineteen seventy three. But went back a couple of times due to other crimes he committed such as counterfeiting after being released in nineteen seventy four you'll Sweeney approached the gazette to get a writer to help him write a book about his imprisonment, and why it was for so long not because of stolen cars he said, but because they had falsely believed him to be the phantom killer. He wanted to tell the story of how in fair this was, but he didn't think he could write the book by himself the editor ended up. Introducing him to James Presley who was working for the paper at the time. He told Sweeney he couldn't help him because he was writing another book at the time and was too busy. He did not tell him his uncle had been part of the law enforcement that put him away. In nineteen Ninety-four Sweeney died in a Dallas nursing home at age seventy seven his ex wife. Peggy died in Dallas to in nineteen ninety eight at age seventy two also on a strange, but interesting note. Unknown as to whether this was a sick prank or a true confession in anonymous woman contacted family members of the victims one in nineteen ninety nine and another in two thousand apologizing for what her father had done. You'll Sweeney was not known to have ever had a daughter or any children at all. The other main suspect is H B duty Tennyson, October nineteen forty eight HP or duty as as his nickname committed suicide and left some notes one of the notes confess to double murders. He also said he killed Virgil Starks and tried to get MRs darks. There was a whole riddle. He left that had to be solved in order to find the note with the combination to the lock box where he had the letters for his family. The note read the opening to my box will be found in the following few lines in tube of paper is found rolls on colors, and it is dry and sound. The head removes the tail will turn and inside is the sheet you yearn to B's mean a lot when they are together. These clues should lead you to it. A note was found inside a fountain pen marked b b for a double broad nib, which was a brand of pen poison was found on the cap. It was thought he used the pen to crush up the poison tablets. He took the note inside the pen contained clues to the combination of a lock box. Not in the mood for playing games. The police forced to lock box open inside was of you master was several rolls of film of Mexico and a stack of papers under the stack of papers was a note confessing to the texture Cana killings. The note read to whom it may concern. This is my last word you find people, and you are fine. I want to thank you all for the trouble that you have gone to to send me to college. And to bring me up. You have really been wonderful. My thanks to L Alea. This was MRs McGee the owner of the house. He was rooming in for letting me stay with her during my college career and to Belva Jo who was MRs mcgee's twelve year old daughter for putting up with. Me the way she did. She had to I know, but I fell in love with her about a week ago. If she was older, I would have asked her to marry me. But that would be impossible. Why did they take my own life? Well, when you committed to double murders, you would too. Yes. I did kill Betty Jo Booker and Paul Martin in the city park that night and killed Mr Stark and tried to get MRs Stark's, you wouldn't have guessed it. I did it when mother was either out or asleep. And no one saw me do it for the guns. I disassembled them and discarded them in different places. When I am found which has already been done, please give this typewriter to Craig who was Tennyson older brother and tell him that. I hope that his child is a boy it will help him in his work. Everything can go wherever you think it will do best except for the view master, which will go to Belva Jo. Please take my bankroll and give it to daddy. I think it should go to him and tell him I don't want the car now. Well, goodbye everybody. See you sometime if I make the grade which will be hard for me to make H B Tennyson. Even though H B only mentions the Martin and Booker killings and the Starks attacks it is thought he meant to imply he did all of the killings. And the reason for only using these names was because he knew them personally. There was an interview with a former neighbor of HP's when he was a kid. He and Don woods hung out with HP a lot. They were close to him and thought he was a good guy. They couldn't ever imagine HP being the phantom. He said that James Freeman live near them as well and hung out with them sometimes. But not that often Freeman had started saying derogatory and sexually inappropriate things about women. The woods boys started to distance themselves from him when Don woods, a close friend of HP's heard of his suicide and subsequent confession letter. He was in shock. He was listening to the radio while he was shaving. And the news came over. He asked his mom if she had heard it he then finished shaving untold, everyone that he had to go to the police station. He never did say what was said at the police station, but his younger brother was certain that dawn did not think h. Be had committed the phantom killings. Both Don woods and James Freeman were in the band with HP and high school and both down woods and James Freeman were pallbearers at HP's funeral James Freeman later told authorities after the funeral that duty was with him the night of one of the murders. They were playing chess or checkers he had told them some things that could help point toward age. Be the tool of an usher at the time was a flashlight HP Tennyson was an usher at the paramount theatre, which is now the Perot theater Jimmy Hollis, and Mary Jean larae saw the movie three strangers at the paramount on the night of Friday, February twenty-second Richard Griffin and pollyanna more saw the movie snafu at the paramount on the night of Saturday March twenty third Paul Martin saw black market babies on the night of Saturday April thirteenth. Betty Jo Booker did not see the movie with him as she was playing in the band out the VFW. H b Tennison was tall for his age in college is freshman year. He was six foot three when he was sixteen at the time of the murders. He was around six feet tall. So that does matchup with the witnesses account of the attacker being six feet. Now, we're going to go over some general thoughts about the investigation thoughts about these suspects and the rumors that were around. After the may third killing of Virgil Starks and severely injuring Katie Starks, the murders abruptly stopped why. One of the suspects. You'll Sweeney will who was never charged with murder was however, incarcerated some people point to that. As the reason, however, he was not arrested until over two months after the Starks attacks. The other prime suspect HP Tennyson committed suicide in nineteen forty eight leaving behind a suicide note implicating himself in the phantom murders. But that was two years after the murders stopped. And then there is James Freeman. He was a friend of HP's and live next door to Katie Starks sister. He was known to speak and derogatory and sexually inappropriate ways about women. He to killed himself but much later in life in nineteen seventy four he had lived a largely reclusive life with his mother until her death in nineteen seventy three. None of these suspects dates of being out of commission. So to speak explains why the killings suddenly stopped was at one of them. Or was it two of them working together was you'll Sweeney actually the phantom and his wife. Peggy have something to do with the crimes was HP Tennyson the phantom or is both he and James Freeman the phantom working together in some kind of strange friendship bond over the love of killing and sadistic treatment of couples or was it someone entirely different someone who was injure viewed. But only just and not thought seriously about or possibly someone who flew under the radar entirely and the killing stopped because the killer left the area. Possibly left the area and continued killing somewhere else. It was the nineteen forties. Going into the nineteen fifties and states did not consult with other states about their crimes. It would be decades before any computer databases would be put together and systems like Kotas would be put to work and decades before DNA would help clear cold cases. When John Tennyson MD was asked if he thought the killer was sociopathic. He said, yes when I answer. Yes. To your question. I am mainly affirming, my sense that the perpetrator or perpetrators appears to have an incapacity of conscience or difficulty empathizing with the victims. It is probably the case that the perpetrator knew the victims were suffering, but didn't care and the perpetrator probably took pleasure in that suffering. So the perpetrator or perpetrators was probably a sort of sociopathic sadistic hybrid. Unfortunately, in this case much has been lost. There is no DNA sitting in a box somewhere. Waiting to be tested, even the police records have been lost gone. And that is from both sides of the city both states. Yeah. Explain that crazy take a look at the crime scene pitcher of the window at the Stark's home. There are just two holes as we discussed four shots to holes. It was said to be closed double window. I went over this with my law enforcement friend, and we went over all different scenarios. I was wanting to know if the shooter had to be someone specially trained with rifles or guns such as someone in the military. We concluded that we needed to know more about window glass. Nineteen forty when the home was probably built I did try to do some internet research on it. But found too many different types of windows. That were not like the Starks. I would be interested to know more. If anyone has an insight, you can find that picture on cherry avenue true crime podcast. And they believe I've already put it on Instagram, and as well as the Facebook page, all right, again, just recommend some of the other things that you would like to check out on this case. It's very interesting. John Tonnison and Jeremy Kennington have YouTube videos out. There's also a Facebook group and a website excellent information. They're very thorough. Kennington said he started putting together information for Wikipedia and Facebook etcetera to gather the truth as so many rumors and falsehoods were out there, and they were believed to be the truth, which I really like I mean, you know, like, I said, I really enjoyed the movie the town that dreaded sundown, but unfortunately, much of the movie was, you know, not factual and a lot of the ways that they portrayed the killings were be known to be factual and people, you know, took the took that and bought it was fact, and you know, spread it around. So John Tennyson MD grew up hearing about this case in his family as HP was a first cousin once removed. He ended up seeing the movie town that dread. Sundown even though he was only eight at the time when he was in medical school. He saw that someone had transcribed one of the notes some of the notes on the early internet, and he got curious about it. He wanted. He wanted to know how they ruled him out HP he sort of put it on the back burner. And when he heard they were making the new movie, I think this was in two thousand fourteen it rekindled his interest and around two thousand thirteen he started asking questions. It was then that he learned about this guy named Jeremy Kennington who knew a lot about the case. There's also the dock new documentary murder in the moonlight which came out in two thousand eighteen is by Jeff Waldron, W A L D R I D G E. And again, it's called murder in the moonlight two thousand eighteen there is the phantom killer by James Presley. It's a pretty good book. And it's got a lot of information as well. You can go to cherry avenue. True crime podcast dot com and click the link get in touch and send me an Email. I will put the link to the website in the show notes. You can also find the picture of the window on that website. I would love to hear your thoughts on any of the cases that we've covered. And also any case suggestions you have. Thank you again for listening.

Sweeney Sweeney murder Peggy Betty Jo Booker HP Paul Martin Virgil Starks James Presley Starks Katie Starks Sweeney Tackett James Freeman John Tennyson MD Sweeny spring lake park Texas
Agent Carter S2E2: A View In The Dark

Capes and Lunatics

35:16 min | 4 months ago

Agent Carter S2E2: A View In The Dark

"This episode of Capes and lunatics is brought to you by tweaked audience. Awesome headphones good at tweaked audio dot com and use the coupon code southgate to get thirty percent off free shipping and a lifetime warranty where he can get there through the link on our website Southgate Media Group DOT COM. Last me Hardee's and welcome once again to full stream ahead I hear Captain Charlie let Professor Esser and with me as always ease its MAS. Might skinny rich friend man. I am I don't think i. gave you the proper Intro last week last episode. What is wrong with me I'm way. Too, much going on possibilities and it does get easier because this is tonight's episode agent Carter Season Two episode to aid you in the dark peggy discovers her murder investigation has huge ramifications that can destroy her career as well as everyone near and dear to her. Directly this week is Lawrence trilling. Stanley. Kirby, of course. Those great. based. On Marvel comics by credits. scrolling down, Christopher Markus and Stephen mcphail feely get a created buys. Eric. Pearson in Lindsay Lohan get a written buys and Sue Chung. Hardest Working Woman in show business is our executive story editor making sure that all this story make sense and meets time. WAIT AGO sue. So Man So we open up end where. We've basically just had A. A interesting turn of events know the detective who we find out was cleaner has been dealt with that was actually the intention of won Miss Ms Underwood or right? No. That Daddy. No not daddy dot is not even in this episode Daddy's they're saving daddy don't worry. He's coming back now Whitney Frost Whitney Frost who is pushing her husband, Kevin Chadwick. Towards all of the things that we need him to do however, we get a very interesting character in this who is a callback from season one he doesn't have a big role this episode, but we see him in the Gentleman Social Club and that is huge. Jones. Ray. From Roxana, well Remember him from last. So we get this again this tie in that. There's a lot of really rich powerful men with their fingers in a Lotta pies. Pulling the. Strings. So That something. HEALING WITH HERE We also find out that Peggy meets seuss's girlfriend. Oh. Actually I got we have to open up with this, which is that what we? Jarvis. Getting himself. and. You know. Here's a thing. It's cute and it's its own ridiculousness. I think Jarvis would attacked it with the level of physical physical aplomb that we would expect. You know look here's the thing. Here's the real thing. Okay. So the Jarvis Elfriede dynamic throughout comic book history is a really interesting thing. Because those who don't know Alfred didn't used to be. Guy. And still the until they sort of bring up all the stuff that Jarvis didn't. Know Jarvis wasn't a tough guy. He wasn't like special OPS or anything. Like it kind of they built up. So it's interesting how how both characters because both characters were always supposed to be just the hired man of the millionaire, and then after they decided that that Alfred was going to be the one who who raised. Raised Bruce that is heard that Jarvis was gonna be the one who raised Tony. And they started integrating all these aspects of characters into each other. But Jarvis wasn't any more but Alfred wasn't an EX special forces until they've decided that that something in Jarvis's background or that he was at least had military training. So. That the modern Elfriede that we know that s the you know. Basically paid assassin hired to be the bodyguard of the wings, but just decided to be the Butler instead That is very much time to the things that happened with Jarvis's history. basically about the time they sorta do basically in the eighties is when a lot of this stuff happening because that's when they brought back Peggy Carter into the Captain America and the avengers storylines, and they essentially established the site that Jarvis really did have this sort of backstory factor in the war that he you know he fought in the war he fought in World War Two he you know worked with the SAS and all these kinds of things, and all these things then filtered back over Alfred. So so I kind of feel that Jarvis who does have his war record in this although he was just an attache. I feel. He probably should be approaching this with a little more dedication and physicality. Then we kind of get from this although we do see his furious turtle. which is I think of really amazing move. Because obviously, you know he's trying to pick the phone with Peggy Peggy throws them. Drivers does begging because I didn't able to sweep per pretty pretty easily and she's quite surprised this. Exactly, it was. It was a delight and. Yeah. So that's that's fun and that's our starting point and you know. And he's in his old timey. We're cats which you know workout talks, which is very Jarvis thing with the weight about everything. and. He's wearing a way out in this whole thing for like these tiny little baby waits on his barbell. It's it's ridiculous. That's why I don't know about that had. Those look like the maybe not. Could have been twenty and he'd sags to weights any. Well. I could see that being one hundred pounds I could see I'm just saying I'm not saying they were being at least one hundred pounds. And he you know granted, you know you don't normally do a dead left on one hundred pounds but you do repeated curls and you know and yeah, it get some. You get some bonafides zero. You do like squats with that and that's going to help build you up but the so but it is played for comedy because it is. You know that's what he's there for we we get the scene. because so there are several scenes in this, but you know we get to the we get to that. Then we get Peggy coming to the office and meeting. Souza's girlfriend. And you know as an interesting because, of course, played for the stress but really. Picky wasn't did ensue so that we know of right but but I think what really puts a point on it is the way the secretary reacts to that whole little scenario and she gives them like knowing look like man you are in a pickle, you WANNA cookie? And he looks at her like, what am I gonNa do so that really just lays the idea bear there's no ambiguity about it from their like he's obviously had feelings for her from back back back in the day and she's finally come around and now he's not available in lies having these thoughts and Blah Blah. Blah and. I for some reason, there's something about this girlfriend is that seems kind of fishy? No. Well I mean I don't remember anything. Any dark storylines that happened I don't know. Dark or but like Whoa I guess now because you've seen the rest of, but it just seemed like she's Maybe, she just noticing another woman circling or territories so she's trying to be ultra. Well you know what it is. His real say is I think. If if she is Martin Luther territory she's basically saying yet it's my territory Peggy. You know but it would not let me it's like I don't write you hang out with them because I am confident in our relationship. You know what you think I don't know. He using using, he hasn't mentioned who you were. But it wasn't meant to send a message to her. It was meant to send a message to Susan. I think to say, Hey, know your place and luck she knows who I am too now and she knows what it is. So I've made it really easy for you to not to mistake things or Yada Yada. Yada you know. Fair enough. Yeah and and you know. What's funny. Is, Sousa. and. Jarvis Mrs Jarvis had the same moment but it has a completely different emotional timbre. Well, yeah. Because well, because there's IT essentially, you know when when, when, when Mrs Jarvis walks in on drivers on top of Peggy. She knows I I've she'd already married the driver so she knows service. Knows I got office is not in the midst of something untoward. The first time they met the first time she met Peggy. Jarvis. Walks in and she lays a big kiss on his face and it makes them really uncomfortable but she didn't do it for the same reasons. So it came off more wholesome more like she was just messing with Peggy because she'd already accepted her as A. As opposed to this sort of situation I just found that was kind of interesting. The peggy walks to situations not different. Each was yeah. No, that's that's a fair cop. You know and you know for what? It's worth throughout the thing we do get the fact that. You Know Susa and you know I. I'm so torn by to see because of course, you know when Susa and Peggy you're talking about 'cause you know. So. Okay. So you're GONNA have ourselves get the warrant for nine, which apparently had to come from the East Coast Office which is weird. But sure why not? They get the warrant. A tonight and has already put up the danger radiation sign basically saying, you can't search our offices because of radio activity. In this of course, pre presupposes the where this happens after the meeting between Chadwick and the tire Inner Circle. Group Trying to think who? I don't think that was. Gerald mcrainey might be the actor who looks like Gerald mcrainey who I confused frontier of mccranie. Among the other the other members of the inner circle. forgetting who was but Any Iraq tire yet known as well? Ray Wise is a waxen guy but then there's the other group of people. There's like two people talk there is there is the Ascott guy which is the Roxanne Guy Right. Yeah. That's you, Jones who is who honestly has a great career playing a ray wise and a lot of films and yeah I'm I'm just trying to figure out who that other person is let me series at. Thomas Cloud Chester or director Kenneth. Yeah, there there is. It is Casey Sanders who he is he is he is not Gerald mcrainey is who he is. He was The Dad Big Bang theory for Bernadette he's Brunette Stat. and. For years I, thought this guy was nick rainy 'cause he looks like. He looks like G-O-V mccranie in every conceivable way and I just that he's not Gerald mcrainey just messes with my head. Because I've never seen them in the same room together. That's all I'm saying but yes, see. Sander. As the head of the Organization who basically tells Chadwick Yep we're liquidating the whole thing. We're stopping the project we don't care. It's gotten too hot, which is an interesting thing. But of course, it's it's an it's an interesting thing. I'm a couple of different levels. One level is that he's basically saying we have this substance that will make atomic energy looked like stone knives bear skins you didn't know and they're like, yeah if we get to figure out how to make it work. We know how tonic energy works. We know that's a billion dollar idea in rock cents handling that aspect of it for us. This other thing you WanNa do. We don't know what the power is and we already know it kills people horrifyingly weirdly, and that causes people to sniff around. At least at least radiation kills people. Slater. They cancer got cancer from anything. Everyone smokes now you know. Cancers it was from the smoking you know. I feel like they should have a team of terminal patients ready to go into situations like this like, Hey, look if your schedule or if you're slated to die well, before the radiation would kill, you might do us a favor. Well I mean. We has people like that. You know. Who Hey? Tell you. What we don't see that at the end of this, but we get this we're going to see is it what are these sort of situations? Yeah. It might kill you might give you a superpower. Right right right of course. That's how it works in this universe. Could kill you might give your superpowers. We don't know. We don't know it's a crap shoot mostly it's GonNa. Kill Ya probably gonNA kill you horribly. Current sounds like a reverse version of the Salem witch trials. Hey, if he doesn't drown, she was a witch. Anyway. We get this situation. We go there and of course. Man There is this beautifully framed scenes. where? Peggy confronts. Wilkes And as she confronts, Welk's behind him is this WPA mural. Of Slaves picking. Cotton. And it is one of the you do see a lot of WPA murals throughout this which is, of course, era appropriate 'cause WPA murals were the thing but you know when you look at like. So for example, in Detroit we had. It on getting his name now of Rivera. Rivera he was Oh. I'm pretty callous husband and he was known for making these amazing murals about industry like but of course. The Style and then this one, they're all motes ex but there is a mosaic. In the. Offices that are of slaves picking cotton, which is a weird thing but also, very historically true. But also maybe maybe a chew too generous version of the I mean what the artists actual intention was who knows but Frames it in. It's interesting way especially based on what we're GONNA see. With basically, will says, look you know I said I is the only company that would hire someone of my persuasion. And let me work in a lab. So you really think I'm GonNa just turn on them. and to that extent, it is this idea that he is this guy who yeah, he is in a difficult position, he has to respond to the issues at play. And he is trying to build his own life and position. At the same time, he's working for people that are engaged in dubious practices but then again, dubious practices are kind of the norm for the nineteen. Fifties. Roy donors that. Interesting interaction, with adults guy. At Leo after the mobster shoot at the end and we'll just like yeah I, know that's every time i. go into Donut Shop. You. Know because you see this every single. You know yes. I know that Guy I knew what his thing was. I knew how you approach it. And You Can I. Please have a Eclair you know. Even as the guy even after they he they're out and they're trying to use the phone you know you know. You say what you will about the Guy Makes Dang finally Clare. Speak but of course, because of course, forgot like Welk's this is all background noise. This. Oh he's fine with it. Now, it's it's a horrifying world eleven, but it's also the world he lives in you know, right? Right right. It's like I'm not gonNA sit here and. Throw a fit. You know even when he and and that's sort of what happens. So getting ahead of myself of a lot for those who haven't seen the show while you're listening to the recap, but anyway fill in the show. You know he basically asks Peggy to meet him at a club where he won't stand out Although we can see that there are, of course, there are white people out in this Cup without any any problem. So there's not like it's a blacks only club, but it is a club that is. Adequately integrated even though it is family staffed and frequented by by black people so. He, you know he he basically says, listen what happened is I was brought into a room with a bunch of lawyers. They reminded me of how top-secret Oliver our work was and through words I'm like treason and a hanging. and. So yeah, it was a little bit and then they just sort of had their thing and now he's already stolen, which is an interesting he already stole. The evidence he's GonNa give to Peggy. so He's already committed the crime that he knows he's going to he knows what he's going to do he's just needs. No is Peggy the person I can trust to give it to. and which is what this whole thing is about. It is presented as a date but I also think it's also presented a very complex. He's got to assess who this person is. 'cause he's casinos. He's involved in something bad now but he also knows that there's not much you can do about it unless he can find someone. Who Can? Help Him. And this is his this is essentially a hail Mary. You know this yeah. I. I hope to goodness this woman is not. Secretly Try to trap me exactly. He's hoping he's opening goodness is she's piggy cutter Nat Karen Carter. DOTTY underwood pretending to be pegged. W-. W Underwood, we're totally on his side because she's evil and would just like no. No, he's cool. He's without deal now. The thing he could be thinking is the guys I work for our evil what if they send somebody in to slip me up and see if I would give over the secrets? So if she reeler is she you know a plant or am I being set up and now we don't get it here we get. There is the thing that's going on here and I want to say because there's a character we're GonNa meet I think next episode. Who is Who I think a lot of the the killers were meeting right now are working with him 'cause it's not Chadwick and I don't. Because there's I. Mean I could be wrong could be wrong but the people that are doing the killing here. Actually, it could just be hired. I don't know they don't reveal them in this episode, but we're going to see a character who has tied Spiderman later. So keep an eye out for that. I think it's next episode kids but anyway but yeah so the or The the organization which has the Little Aden symbol or not upside down V or Arrow point or rocket or something. You know although interesting as one can point out is the upward. Center with a downward. Sliding, design, which could be. The head of Hydra and the tentacles or the head of the Eagle in shield. Clearly. There's some symbolically going on here that we don't get, and then of course. It at the same time when this was coming out, this is the season that they went to the planet with high on it, and we see the design of the NASA program that went to that world. It is likewise. That same designed granted it's a IT'S A. Curve Triangle in a circle, which is a pretty standard design. So maybe we should read much into it, but it is interesting that we of course, that is what Peggy sees Wednesday steal the car from the people that were there to kill her. One of them currently had a pen and dropped it in the car, which is just bad form. Thank. You. Know and she sees me wreck Mrs. Symbol as what daddy was feeling. So. By. The end of this we get to James Wilkes ceiling, the zero, energy, and then Whitney Frost comes to also steal the. Zero. Energy. because. Of course, she knows that the organization is shutting down. I said on energy and the zero energy with zero matter project. So she wanted for herself. And there's a really neat. Conversation between the two of them you know we're will says, look I'm I don't think you're going to shoot me while I'm holding this you know what this is. Essentially, what this is, you're not gonNA shoot me, but they still go a struggle over. Little vacuum to filled with it, and it's just it's. It's amazing. Serving goes through the vacuum tube but I'm guessing. Fair Day cages, and there's this whole process Does and obviously it makes sense if they're going to experiment with they're gonNA take samples and do tests and do things like that but in this situation. Yes he he has it in the thing they fight they've struggled it drops. And we get a big explosion. That rocked that shatters throughout the building you know and blows a hole in the side of a wall. And works disappears we don't see Whitney at the end, but we do see risk in that moment we at the also also just to give a little bit backstory, the film that Wilkes had stolen earlier that he showed Peggy showed basically that A. Nuclear Bomb Absent. fun fact. Weird thing about this power is it seems to be dark energy, which again going in the themes of a children other projects. Related to both. stuff that with. Shield and because at the time they were running this. They were also starting doing the teasers for the cloak and dagger series. which also deals with this kind of zero point energy in that gives cloak and dagger their powers. So there was a Lotta. Reminded me of the shrike and how they enter our world. Shield. There's. A little bit I mean I think it also has some ties to the dark. Dark Dimension and Doctor strange that was coming to. So I think there was a lot of cross pollination going on. And they're always very careful in this I. Guess the advantage to a shield is they never have to call things what we will call them later 'cause they always get to use it. Right. Yeah because the first one. So But Yeah. So at the end of it, after it blows up Peggy's just completely. By. What what what just happened? What did she see? And You know it's it's. It's. It's. It's. It's a really big story line that we're looking at here in. You know and when it's all done, peggy is taken away by by Sousa and they sort of come to the thing you know that something bad happened. No, one can find a wilkes. And then we see that. That Whitney has five, but she's got a weird spooky black thing on her forehead. I couldn't tell if that was at first it was like a popping vein or if it was a cut that was seeping something out and then when you touch it go. Okay. So it seems like it's like a cut or droplet on her face I couldn't tell what happening there. Insert her lead steam from her finger was interesting. It seems like it is some kind of. I mean I'm I'm guessing it's supposed to be the zero energy and that. For what is this where it's spoilers spoilers it's zero matter and. Not, turning her to is. 'cause it's 'cause your veins are already coup. Idea that you know superpowers are in their own way very psychically oriented to who you are as a person. Prior to your exposure so I and this whole time every image we've seen of this unquote zero matter. Has seemed to have a consciousness of some sort. It has an intention it's trying to break out it's not happy being contained. So what if it is an entity of some sort and it has found someone that has the emotional resonance that makes it feel comfortable. So instead of freezing, the person is, Hey, this is a host I can. I would I think I can affect her she's thinking sort of along the same lines that I am. You know I, don't think that's at wrong and of course when Tristan I saw in this as we're watching these together, he's like Oh that looks like the NBA Ryan or I thought. It does it does you know there's also a tidy gravity Tony and all these other things that we've seen. So there's a lot that has been put in this that is meant to make people speculate because I always get the feeling. They like to throw a lot of stuff out there and just to see what fan theory stick and then they decide which fantasy they like best. And I think that's The anyway, any final thoughts on tonight's episode Mazi. No I I think we got to it. Yeah I. graded. So I mean I. You know I. Love the agent Carter Series I I'm looking forward to more with Susa I'm hoping we get more agent Carter eventually now I mean she's She's out there she asks he's dancing with Captain America but that was only in one universe and their. Number. You know that's the great thing about universes Anyway, if you guys have enjoyed listening to this podcast and would like to enjoy even more, maybe you should be listening to it on tweaked audio headsets, which are, of course, a sponsor of the show and the makers of some amazing audio equipment that you could be listening to this show on right. Now, if you go to TWEET CARDIO DOT COM, you'll find a wide array of excellent. high-quality devices at a fraction of the price that you're gonNA see from other name brand producers. So check those guys out and we'll see if this sounds better when you're listening them if you don't, it doesn't sound better. What can I tell you? I just sound so great I elevate even the most pedestrian who had. Maybe, maybe you need to get your ears checked if it doesn't sound right. Exactly. More to the point among other things you could do we have another show, which is hunting killer dot com. Hey, would you like to have an escape room delivered to your house every month? I don't mean like people lock you in your own house and make you try to escape and saying sort of a mental escaped from your house. Once a month, a hunter killer, dot com you they will send you a package that will give you the fictionalized cold case of one Michelle. Gray with a series of clues and bits of evidence that you're going to have to comb through to figure out exactly who the real killer was and help Michelle. Great close that cold case and If that interests you go to hunter killer dot com if it doesn't interest you, I don't know what to tell you. But Hey, you know what might interest you literally anything else in the world and if you go down and show not you're gonNA find a link to Amazon that. Took on that link. It's GONNA ticket, AMAZON DOT COM, and they literally everything else in the world. So by stuff they're using our link and it costs you nothing helps us out and while you're there, check out pod left book the Southgate Media. Groups. Book written by members of the Southgate, Media Group community about podcasting and how how they do it whether they do it. Now, it's saved their lives so Hopefully. You'll enjoy that and it's not. I. Don't know what to tell you but you can always come back here next week And if they do come back here, next week and they want to sort of prep up for it by talking to Umass, how can they find find you? They can email me at mas manzoor edge email dot com or find me on facebook under Mas Manzoor emo doubles e. m. a. n., Z., double-o our. and. Community old fashioned way where Moslems superconductivity bucket JIM DOT COM. That's super connectivity blog. All one word Edgy Malek's. Only on the twitter is alive in a scam twenty minutes the penultimate episode take a drink. Of agents of shield at Shirley. Answer that CHR. E. E. S. CR, liquid the to ease in the middle. For Quality. Thank you my is. Just GimMe Gimme email address anyway. I don't even know what's going on anymore. Gentleman. Me Loving landlubbers you've gotten through another episode of for Stream Ahead Comeback next week, join us on the ship and we will sail once again added to the in Kemah of streaming digital video content. Stream. Are.

Peggy Peggy Mrs Jarvis Whitney Frost Kevin Chadwick Ray Wise DOTTY underwood Jones Lawrence trilling James Wilkes Karen Carter Welk Tony Sousa. Gentleman Social Club Gerald mcrainey Alfred Kirby Stanley Peggy Carter Eric
Troubled Waters

Dateline NBC

43:19 min | 5 months ago

Troubled Waters

"In. The mid two thousand James Arthur Ray charismatic self help guru promised his followers a path to wealth and happiness, but not all who followed him finish their journey. This is a story, told a new true crime miniseries from wondering called. Guru the dark side of enlightment James Arthur Ray wasn't well known until he was in the movie the Secret, and after that ray was a guest on Oprah's TV show, but what many didn't know, were his more extreme methods methods that pushed his pupils to their limits, giving some transformative life experience. They dreamed of killing others. Be Sure to subscribe on Apple podcasts. spotify or you can binge all six episodes ad free right now on the wonder Yep. I felt guilty. I couldn't live with that. I said I know something an it's terrible. I'm the only other person that knows the truth. I had to do something. He swept her right off her feet. I was drawn to him right away. He was handsome. Hugh, super on it a dreamy single Dan. Wealthy Charming Smith. I never been spoiled like that I remember thinking I was like Julia Roberts in twenty one. He'd been through so much. A mysterious accident at sea he went under and when he came up. He said he no longer source wife. Just hysterical neighbor, never able to find her. It was heart wrenching story, so why Van? Where so many people so suspicious? No one knows exactly what happened on that. Vote an accident a disappearance. You thought what she faked her death. Or maybe a murder, there's no way absolutely no way. I felt like the police for just trying to frame an innocent man. She would be the one to unravel it all. I thought I could do this in a dangerous undercover operation. May heartbeat was going to best. He said. You need to telling me the truth. I'm lester whole than this is dateline. Here's Josh Mankiewicz with troubled waters. If you crave money or fame. Or if you WANNA meet beautiful, people. Maybe even become one of them. You will find your way to southern California. It's where everything is possible. For seems to be. This is the story of two women drawn for different reasons to the sound to the bright lights. To the bluewater both chased that promise of success. Both saw what can go on. It was a gorgeous summer day in Newport Beach California last of Fourth of July weekend. Some lucky tourists aboard an eight passenger boat called the green machine. Marveling at a school of dolphins playing in the water. When they came across the unexpected. The Captain Radio, the coastguard that a small speedboat and circling out of control in the water nearby was a man holding a little body bird. Parts. About. Water his frantic. Kathy. Like, he's pretty distraught over. His name was Erik Boeckler. His wife was Peggy. was nowhere to be found. What did he do? Now. Talking, Morning Yeah Now? Can you make out any words that allowed. Kind of. Any anytime now that It was a stunning end to what began as a perfect day. This newport. Beach couple was celebrating their wedding anniversary and Peggy just turning thirty eight. It was her birthday. You know so she was in good spirits. US Lahser was one of the friends they'd invited to a big party a couple of days earlier. He's talking about how much she loves Eric. How great life is! And maybe life once grade. Because Peggy handed all. Her story begins in a small town Dexter New Mexico. This is where Peggy made her entrance. I have often said that she was born winking at the doctor swinging on the Chandelier. Was June and Glenn Marshalls Fourth Child and June says pay. He was going places from the very day she was born. She was never steal. She danced, sang played sports, and it seemed nothing could hold her back. She had scoliosis as a kid young. Peggy had to wear a brace around the clock. That's a terrible burden for a young kid like that the bear. But it also kind of ended up motivating, didn't they did? piggies doctor talked with her about a career in physical therapy. She volunteered and loved it, and she made up her mind thin that she wanted to be a physical therapist, and she wanted to move to California and be beautiful blonde. Should. A farmer's daughter with big dreams, so peggy left the small town of Dexter for Sunny. California and settled in Newport beach. That's where she met Glenda. Who was also from new? Mexico and they immediately hit it off. Hegi was probably one of the gregarious people that I've ever met. She was happy and. She was always smiling and says Glenda Peggy was driven to establish herself as a successful physical therapist. She had almost everything she wanted. She did WANNA find a guy McLaughlin was taking a little bit. And then one day on the Beach You found somebody for. We did. So one afternoon on on a weekend, Peggy called me and said what are you doing and I said well. I'm going to go down and watch Dave. Play some volleyball on the beach. Husband. I asked if she wanted to come down with. And she said absolutely. She immediately spotted Eric and said WHO's that Alex Butler then in his early twenties was a walking commercial for the California Beach Life. I'm going to guess that. When she notices a guy playing beach volleyball, he's good looking and in great shape. Indeed, he was handsome ferry. He was all those things. And he was available. He was also eight years younger. was that a problem for either one of them? It was not a problem for either one of them. Peggy she when she sets her sight on something she's going to make it happen. And it developed really quickly really really quickly. Within a year they were married within four years. They had three beautiful kids. Peggy and Eric went into business together. Up Her own physical therapy, business and Eric, a computer whiz manage the technical side of their venture, which quickly became very profitable business was doing good, and she was happily married. The happy couple was also happily spending a lot of money on a German. Sports car, Italian clothing. And a spectacular bluffs, side home in Newport beach. A little, Dream Story! Beautiful Girl Good Looking Guy. Tribe Nice. Cars beautiful children. Until that summer, day in nine, hundred, Ninety, seven, when the unimaginable happened. Distraught. Overboard. It was a boating accident, said Eric, and the Coast Guard agreed some. They see all too often. But soon secrets emerged. That would make some people wonder. What really happened to piggyback. Ler When we come back, I absolutely thought they'd find her. Maybe Alive I did. She's a fabulous swimmer. Where was Peggy and what had gone wrong on that boat and I've been crying. And his face is red and accepts side. There would be a sea of questions to come. You thought what Peggy faked death. It said there's nothing more beautiful than the way. The Ocean refuses to stop kissing the shoreline. This was supposed to be something like that. The romantic outing! An anniversary birthday gift Eric Better Plan for his wife Peggy, but it turned into something else. And now Peggy was gone. The coast yard immediately launched a search, but by nightfall, no sign of Peggy, alive or otherwise. And so eric called Peggy's mom June. His says We can't. Find Peggy. And I said what do you mean? You can't find her worries? She. What? What are you trying to tell me? Who told you that piggy was driving the boat towing him on a body board when all of a sudden a wave wiped him out. When he came up from under the water, he said. He could no longer seat Peggy inside the boat. We thought that should be finding her because. We really just thought she would swim out of it. You See. Peggy was quit at home in the water. Growing up was the only time she didn't have to wear that back, brace. And she became a very accomplished swimmer. She wouldn't panic. She would swim because she loved the water. The next morning June Glenn Marshall were on the first flight out to California. Peggy had been missing almost twenty four hours. Of course that ocean is just bigger bigger bigger than you think about if you're in New Mexico. piggies friend blend tried to stay optimistic. I absolutely thought they'd find her. Maybe a lot I did because she's a fabulous swimmer. Blenda went to the Boeckler House to see Eric Howdy look. Hysterical! Crying and you know his face is red and. You know all of those things looked. Bill except side. As he should be. One would expect to new. Is Best Person. This video from local news shows a devastated Eric. It was now day two of the search for Peggy still nothing. The next day. The coastguard interviewed Eric. Eric Boeckler! Barely speak. What did you say? We had. Bags incurred. Kellyanne though so hazy. are, out Eric told the coastguard. He tried to Bonnie Board on the way out and said there was pretty good swell in the ocean. Side of the boat holiday. Said! They stopped out here on the water. Do enjoy some Margaritas. Peggy it made and then later in the day the decided to try the body board again this time on their way back to the harbour. Peggy was driving Eric was being pulled on the board. As they. Get real big. Jerk. On the. A. Circle. England's stand there real his. Own. Impose. So, so bachelor was simply gone. Maybe even within sight of the same beach that had spawned her marriage. Eric seen devastated, fearing his wife and business partner was dead. But Eric's mother Linda saw things quite differently. Share that they would find I'll turn out well. Not just because Peggy was a strong swimmer. One knew that. Linda new more a secret. About her daughter-in-law. And you thought what Peggy faked her death. Or disappear deliberately. Coming up. Peggy secret. What was it stop down? The stairway said I have to talk to you and. ENTER THE BIKINI MODEL! She was just. A hot number as they say, how would she figure into all of this? Willie geist here this week on the Sunday. Sit Down podcast Jake Jilin. Hall is latest run on Broadway his blockbuster role in Spiderman and the movie he says changed his life forever. Get the podcast now for free wherever you download yours. beat. A Brilliant Pacific Ocean sunset closed out day three three of the search for Peggy back look. And, even though Peggy's family and friends, trying to remain hopeful reality was slowly starting to set in. And it was painful at this point. You didn't think she was alive anymore. I kept thinking that she lies, but how could she? You know that length of time? Unless of course what appeared to be an accident was not. The coastguard conducted a reenactment at see to try to understand how peggy could've fallen off the boat. and. They couldn't do it. They said it just is not doesn't appear to be feasible to them. Given the seek conditions. That's when the Coast Guard called the Orange County sheriff's office. Detective Sean, Murphy was put on the case, they weren't able to duplicate even close to what was alleged by. Eric Boeckler that his wife was tossed off by a rogue wave. If Peggy's disappearance was no accident, Murphy's job was to find out what did happen. Detective started by re Interviewing Eric and asking him about his relationship with Peggy. He said his marriage was good. It was no problem so it. You can take his word for. Now in our game, we don't take anyone's work for anything where you look into it and. That's what we did. They met with the improbably named Koby Laker. Eric's best friend and coby backed up Eric. I had a terrific, and there was no problems whatsoever, but if the marriage seemed solid. There were questions about Peggy at least according to Linda Bachelor Eric's mother. Linda says Peggy told her something in confidence just before she disappeared. Stop mountainous the. As I was leaving Tim. Said came out and said I have to talk to. She said I'm afraid I'm going to jail. According to court documents about a year before Peggy disappeared, the couple sold their physical therapy business to another company, but they stayed on employees then just four months before Peggy vanished the Bekker's were fired amid allegations. They had overbuilt Medicare for more than a million dollars. So when Linda her, Peggy had vanished. I started thinking of that. Disturbed. She was that. Going to jail. And she wondered if Peggy had somehow staged her own disappearance piggy friend. Glenda said no way was paid boeckler capable of. Committing White Collar Crime Medicare overbilling and my opinion now. But if you're wrong about that. Then maybe the idea that she. Faked her death to escape possible prosecution for that. Maybe. That's a little bit more laws -able. But white collar crime and Fake your death and leaving your children and your family or to really separate issues combined. Glenis piggy adored her children and would never abandon them. I will say that people who have never been in the inside of a courtroom where the inside of a jail so. Sometimes do. Pretty crazy things when they realized that might happen to them. And believe that they not Peggy. Glenda did tell detectives that Peggy and Eric were having some issues like how Peggy was busy with work and kids. Well Eric seemed occupied on the volleyball court. She just confided in me that they were having some financial troubles because they. CATA pretty high lifestyle to keep up with. Glenda, said Eric and Peggy seemed determined to work everything out. But now peggy was gone, and Eric was a single dad with three kids under the age of four. and. A new player was about to enter the story. You were drawn Eric Right away, yes! Like countless young women before her Tina new had dropped, it looks and Hollywood dreams. She'd done some Bikini modelling and had a small part on the TV. Show. Baywatch nights. But that turned out to be the peak of her career. Soon Tina found herself slipping into the darker side of Showbiz. She started drugs and lost custody of her two young children because of it. And fell for a succession of guys who did not treat her kindly. Expert from gun, my head on a play Russian roulette between me and him I was held over the balcony. My Neck Tina was broke and Mir. Rock bottom was desperate. I got down on my knees. Literally begging and I said I'll do whatever you want Laura helped me. I can't do this anymore i. need you to show me. A Sign Universe Eric the next day. I meet him all my problems are gone. Taken a modeling gig and candy at a trade show. Eric was there promoting his new business. It was three months to the day since Peggy had disappeared. He's really handsome. Some serious chemistry from the beginning. Yes. We went out that night. Actually he asked me out that night, and then I moved in the next day. Really fast. You don't wait, do you now? Not The end. In a giant house and drove a Porsche. And he was a gentleman in her life after a long string of man. who were not gentle I never been spoiled like that. I remember thinking. I was like Julia Roberts in pretty woman. was moved by Eric Story. He said to me that his wife died in a tragic boat accident and that they were never able to find her. Noticing how great he was with his kids, sit on the floor and play with them, and I actually thought he was a great dad, and she was eager to help. Taking care of the kids. While Eric went as usual to the beach to play volleyball I thought they've lost their mom. They need someone to step in and and not be their mom, but do things that aren't would do for them. When they took the kids to visit Peggy's parents. There's a lot of animosity towards me. I understood why we saw. Was this hot young woman who'd been brought in to replace their missing dawn? Right in exactly three months to the day I can't even imagine what they were thinking. Peggy's family wasn't alone detective. Sean Murphy had also noticed the new woman in Eric Bachelor's life just. Ostentatious I mean she was just a hot number as they say, and she was cohabitating with them right after this horrible boating accident with his wife, so Murphy arranged Bumpy Tina, and said Hey, if you have any information about this boating accident, evolving Eric, your boyfriend, just give us a call and I. gave him my car. My number on it. Nothing came of it. Tina didn't call. But someone else did. Coming up. The best friend has second thoughts. Kobe Laker goes undercover. I basically made you look like say and the new girlfriend is about to see this case in a whole new light knife at the videotape in and I, said Oh. My Gosh, what is this? To Detective Sean Murphy. It's sounded more than suspicious Eric. Boeckler taking up with a gorgeous redhead just three months after his wife was lost at sea. But Murphy didn't have much more than A. And he's got until his phone rang. Are we got a call from Kobe's lawyer said he wanted to arrange interview again with Kobe Kobe. Eric's best friend and volleyball buddy he told Sheriff's detectives. The boeckler marriage was great now he had a different story. Eric's told me on several occasions. He's sick and tired of his wife and here. Tell me that he just couldn't take. It anymore used article. About seven months before Peggy, vanished Koby says he and Eric had a conversation that Kobe describes as haunting him ever since air. Asked me about what he thought what I thought of the idea him killing his wife. And I I was shocked I didn't know what to say. You told me. That he was thinking. Take her out to the ocean. Dumping. Errol you said that when he saw that there was a boating accident, and Eric's wife was missing, knew right then and there he saw it on TV. He knew that he killed his wife and he lied to us. He said because he panicked and he was afraid and he didn't know what to do. Detectives convinced Kobe to wear a wire and to meet Eric at a restaurant in Orange County Eric had no idea that police were listening in even so he stuck to his story that Peggy's death was a terrible accident. Might not. There could be. People could. Never said hey look man I don't know what you guys. Talk it out, but I'm innocent. You've never said anything about anything. Would Be Tried again. I protected you I basically. Made you look like a saint? In the interview I had with the detective work. But detectives were now convinced that Eric killed his wife. Even though in the lead anything that conversation with. Kobe, that got you from suspicion. To know it moves it all the way over, so we knew we had a homicide, but knowing it and proving it. We're two very different things. You didn't get the process that but a crime scene for almost a week right right so that That wasn't good that hindered the investigation. The boats said detective. Murphy was pretty clean. Crime scene did find blood just one drop under one of the cushions. But not enough to determine whether it was human blood, it could have come from a fish. Not Enough evidence to arrest Eric for murder or even prove that a murderer Kurt. Peggy's close friend Glenda didn't believe Eric was a killer. There's no way that Eric would have done that i. mean there's just absolutely no way. It was fashionable to me. Tina new felt the same way I felt like the police just trying to frame an innocent man I thought. There's no way the way he treats me. There's no way you could hurt his wife. Pena also notice that Eric kept food does of Peggy in every room of the house. She could not imagine the man who had killed his wife who want to see her face everywhere. Eric was really answered all your problems for a while and. He was so you weren't too anxious to question him now. I believed him and after about six months he says. Will you marry me? Yes, and you say I said. Yes, you don't say no. Yeah I mean he traded me so good? She also admits she knew Eric was due to collect more than two million dollars in insurance money. Once he was cleared in his wife's disappearance and everything would work out. Everything would work out. Well you were wrong. Definitely wrong! The been a couple for two years still not married, but living together often. One night, Tina was showing Eric. Some of her old modeling shots and TV appearances. We were looking at my pictures, but then I put the videotape and. I'm fast forty and it just stops. Purely chance! Pima accidentally recorded a news report about Peggy's disappearance. The whole thing was just a picture of her face and I said Oh my gosh. What is this? Then, she turned to Eric and I looked at him his face turn white, like he literally lost the color in his face, and he said to me. How did you get that and I said. I don't know he's reaction troubled her which she hit play and it just got worse. The News report did not match the story Erica told her about pays. He told me there was three to four foot waves. It's really choppy out there. On the report. They said on the day Peggy went missing. There were only two foot waves, and the weather was described as an ideal. Allied Allied all this time to me. And he was just really quiet. WHO's emerged right next to me? Look at that point. Flushed and stressed I yelled at him and said. Why is this different than what you told me? And he just really quiet. Inch, she says. told her a new version of what happened when Peyton fell off the book. He thinks she hit awake and she fell off and he said and I didn't get to her and I said you didn't get your, or you didn't want to get to her. And he said I said he told me that he didn't get to her. Then later he changes that I could've helped, but I didn't know. That's completely different from what he told police. Chilling as that sounded, Tina feared. Wasn't the whole story. She was determined to get the rest, but like a career in show Showbiz. You have to be careful what you wish for. Coming up. Fighting nobody knows anything you from model and actress to undercover operation a secret operation to learn the truth. This is where it gets really scary. Tino new thought she'd found happiness with Eric Backlog. Until he changed his story about what happened, the day wife disappeared in the ocean. You didn't think about going to police. No, not yet. I just felt like it wasn't timing the truth all the way. And I was really afraid because he was always with me. A free yet. They continued to see each other sleep together. Party together about two weeks after Eric changed his story, he and Tina went to club and took the drug ecstasy. Get home, we walk inside the House, and we're just both laying on the bed, staring straight up at the ceiling together. All of a sudden as we were talking just came to me, and I said to him I said Oh my God. You hit her over the head and he goes. How did you know that? The crowd did she hadn't. Call it intuition or the effects of the drug or a random guess. But! It wasn't opening and peanut barreled through. I said you need to tell me the truth. He's calmly talking to me and he says I. Tell you the truth he does. We had this huge party, so everybody could see. How happy were together all their friends? Were there witnesses to the happy marriage then a couple of days later. She says Eric told her he took Peggy out to sea on that rented boat, and although Peggy didn't know it. He took along some weeks in anything. 'cause then I walked behind because Tina I hit her so hard. She didn't feel being I'm just like. What do you need Hetero so hard? I hit her over the head with a weight. She said he told her there was blood everywhere. Then Tina says. Eric. Boeckler told her how he got rid of his wife just not that he knows. He did her wrists, and her ankles together so shoes completely bent in half. He said he took the two trash bags that he had an put her body in it, and then he said he picked the awaits in tied down to the robe, and through Iran, two years after Peggy vanished a stunning confession, and then you go to sleep next to a man that you. Now, actually then we have sex. And I felt like I had to do it because I think that made him feel like I was going to be quiet in you know he was. Sealing the deal with me or something with the deal was not sealed, not willing one. The case was still open. And detectives have been keeping an eye on Eric and Tina all on. They knew the relationship was growing volatile. WE'RE EXCITED ABOUT IN A. Morbid Kinda way because we knew it was going to go sideways. Because one relationships go sidewise, sometimes people start talking. That's right. And that's what happened two weeks after Eric's apparent confession. A neighbor called nine one one after hearing, yelling coming from Tina's apartment. When police arrived Eric was gone, but Tina was angry. And she still had the business card detective Murphy had given her almost two years earlier I grabbed my partner and we went out there in the middle of the night and we met up with Tina. She told Detective Murphy and his partner Gary Jones. What Eric had said a big break. Yes, but not nearly enough for an arrest. Remember team that was pretty far from an ideal witness. Detectives new. They need more than her word against Eric's. So the ask Tina. Will you wear a long? Wire and I said yes well. That's the only way you're gonNA. Get them. Why would you turn on a guy who had basically taken you from a terrible life and giving you a great life because I couldn't live with myself. Away. Police planted microphones in her car in her purse and on her body and peanut arranged a meeting. She told Eric that after the Domestic Violence Call Sheriffs Commissar detectives came in to ask questions about Eric. This dinner day. Dina told Eric was to get their stories straight. In case, the cops questioned her again. Tina wired up, picked up Eric from his home and drove to a restaurant called El Torito. For you worried about this. Not Really I was more worried that I wasn't going to get him to confess again I. Have to throw in my head. I don't want to screw up at all. Tell it to you. Weren't there was an accident? Once inside the restaurant, Tina tried to get Eric to repeat the details of Peggy's death. Eric wouldn't go their. Worry about? So, Tina tried to get him to say why he did it. I. It's no confession, but it's not a denial either. Are you saying to yourself at that point? That's I got him I honestly thought that was good, but I still thought that wasn't enough. Remember. Peggy had a life insurance policy worth more than two million dollars. Again, she tried to get into. Give her a reason. You Go. Back to like she's still canceled. Eric reassured team. Never ever do. She was good. She was really good, but the drama wasn't over. Tina left the restaurant with Eric. Still wired up. And this is where it gets really scary this, so we're walking out to the car and he says to me let me drive. Was not part of the plan. Lose sight of him. In a movie, this is where you hear the sound of Gunshot Ha. That would not have been good. In the car with Eric, now behind the Wheel Tina cranked up her acting skills and the tension. Talked about over here to have you don't work with. He. Terminated you ought to. I don't care. Job Everything. She talked to me that when now tried to get Eric Out of the car? Like, oh! They. Don't test you already. I'm just asking you don't have nobody knows anything you. Have to tell anybody anything. Full over and got out and t the hop the driver's seat. Maybe my health. And just like that he knew drove away from her old life. In the end you got enough. Oh, absolutely! Yeah, you understand your interest. Eric was arrested and charged with Peggy's murder. Owes like to get the call Eric. I'm interested well I. Just traveled all over. I couldn't really couldn't believe at. Two weeks after Eric's arrest made headlines. Tina made some headlines. The put the whole case in jeopardy. Coming up. This Crime Eric Boeckler on trial and Tina's credibility. That's on trial to choosing. Anybody would believe you now without that statement. They don't have anything that makes this a homicide. ooh! Beach Volleyball is a kid's game played by GROWNUPS. Murder for profit is played only by adults. And for camps. Accusers believed Eric Bachelor. was trying to be successful at both. The technical had put him in jail. But then two weeks after Eric's arrest came this headline in the local paper. Witness in murder case doubts suspects guilt. Tina. Worn a wire and help police nail. Eric now said maybe he didn't Kill Bay. Knew that the kids had lost their mom. And now they're gonNA, probably lose their dad for a very long time, and so I felt guilty guilty, she'd helped jail a man. She wants thought she'd married. I've ever called me from jail. Any told me that he had tried to hang himself. With his sheets, it was Eric's frantic behavior from from the lockup that was enough to make you think twice and wanting to die. You feel guilty guilty, and you try to roll the whole thing back. And did, but she says she always believed he was guilty. and. In the winter of two thousand, Eric Boeckler went on trial. The Star Witness Tina new a witness who was to be fair compromised not just by her waffling about Eric's guilt and our own checkered past, but also by one detail in the story Tina says Eric, told her something defense attorney John Barnett says is critical. You'd expect if Peggy's head was caved in by thirty five pound dumbbells. There'd be blood. Everywhere and there wasn't. On the stand Tina tried to defend herself a horrible witness. When it comes to looking at me on paper, choosing anybody would believe you now i. You know I knew that. I told exactly what he said to me and I knew I was doing the right thing and I honestly didn't care what anybody thought? There was the conversation she had recorded El Torito. Eric's own words, the jury who all of them nobody knows anything. BorNet offered his own explanation I argued that the reason he said it is to shut her up to calm her down in any event, the defense said Eric. Never said on tape that he hit Peggy. The only person who heard him say that was Tina a drug user. A woman with a fraud conviction on record without that statement, they have a lot of circumstantial evidence and a lot of what ifs, but they don't have anything that makes this. A homicide with defense offered another theory about Peggy Boeckler. She was under a great deal of pressure and could easily distracted. And in combination with alcohol, which she rarely drank. But did on that day could contribute to a lack of care and driving the bone. You don't think piggyback fake your death using. She's dead. I don't think she fakes her death. No I do not think that music she died. Accidentally enter body still hasn't been found. That's right. Prosecutor, Debbie Lloyd argued Peggy's death was Eric's doing. We basically had three and a half million reasons to kill her, and that's about what he stood to gain. If had gotten away with it. said the prosecutor, the circumstantial evidence was compelling. Eric had a weight tree back at home that appeared to be incomplete. Investigators believed Eric used the missing waits to killed Peggy and then sinker. And what about the blood? Luminol test conducted on the boat indicated there might have been a lot of blood in the boat. But that it was cleaned up. Matching Tina's testimony about blood everywhere. And of course there was Tina herself the spider past and her criminal record and drug use. She ranked Trudy. Absolutely. Jury. Believe and would Tina's past make a difference? It doesn't matter what I did before or after I met him. You know what I did with. Myself has nothing to do what he did after seven days the verdict. Guilty of first degree murder ear thrilled that the man who did it is behind bars. Put. Nobody wins in this situation, nobody the children now have no mother. No father, so there is no winner with the jury did not believe Eric Killed Peggy for the money. He was found not guilty of murder for financial gain. and His sentencing, Eric Boeckler addressed the judge once again denying he killed Peggy. was horrible tragedy. As the phones, both of our families, and as much as the marshalls are earning my family. WHO's also hurting? Because, I. Knock at this crime. The judge sentenced him to life without the possibility of parole. Eric's mother. Linda thinks the verdict was wrong. Is it possible you don't know your son as well as you think you know? Me I know that kid like the back in my hand, look I can understand a mother, not wanting to believe or son committed a crime. Listen if I could. Draghi doper! Narrow, do well FIV. Rapist murderer. What well yeah, but he isn't. He, is it? Boeckler body has never been found. You want to know what happened, but you still don't want to hear murder, but at least down you. That's still pretty hard to take. And even with all this information. We don't have a body. Yeah, you discover your stronger than you thought you were Oh. Yeah! biggies mother and sister ended up raising her kits. And one more person was stronger than she thought Tina new. You're leading. The different. Life is completely differently. He gave up. Drugs Married a nice guy. And now she's a stay at home, mom with five kids. A Hollywood happy ending. No. Sometimes real life is better. That's offered out I'm lester halt? Thanks for joining us. The made the press, Chuck Todd Cast. It's an insider's take on politics. The twenty twenty election more candid conversations. Some of my favorite reporters about things we usually discuss off camera. Listen for free wherever you get your podcast.

Glenda Peggy Linda Bachelor Eric Eric Boeckler Tina Eric Bachelor Detective Murphy murder volleyball California Eric Howdy Peggy Boeckler Eric Story Eric Out Ocean Eric Backlog Julia Roberts Eric Josh Mankiewicz newport James Arthur Ray
Episode 18 - Trauma and Intimacy

Uncomfortable.

38:36 min | 1 year ago

Episode 18 - Trauma and Intimacy

"He everyone, it's Deb here. Welcome to another episode of uncomfortable. Comfortable conversations around uncomfortable topics. He guys thanks for tuning into uncomfortable. My guest for this episode is Peiqi. Lou Peggy, and I discuss her trauma can faked intimacy in relationships firstly. Let me tell you a little bit about Peggy. She is a writer storyteller, self-proclaimed, bibliophile, and a mediocre advice giver, I do love her honest. He when Peggy isn't digging her way to the bottom of peanut butter jar or walking around Vancouver with her camera. She's analyzing and over analyzing, relationship dynamics, cognitive and behavioral patterns as well as her own life choices. Peggy recently completed her undergrad in English literature at the university of British Columbia, where she was also a mental health columnist for the student newspaper, the U B C, you can actually faint her main Germain articles on the UBS's blog, and she's currently working on her. I quit. She says will be finished when she can stop overthinking her own ideas. I really hope that you enjoy our conversation, but do not as always there will be some adult language. So when you're listening, it's best to pop on those headphones. Agee. Thank you. So what for coming onto the plug cats beaver having me, your welcome? I'm excited to have you. We chatted a few weeks by the topic that you wanted to explore a little beds. And so I just wanted maybe to start with you Kane of giving a little bit of background on yourself. And then, you know why this topic is perhaps important to you. Yes. So I grew up in this area and went to school in Vancouver. I attended UB see for the past five years, where I majored in English literature, I've grown up with a huge passion for books all my life. And that's where I decided to become a writer, and it was through that experience, that I started blogging and writing a little bit more about mental health. Because just through my university experience. I certain. Noticing a trend among coworkers and friends about how their mental health has been affecting their relationships and their personal lives and how they perform in the classroom. And so it led me to pursue this topic a little bit more in question my own areas of mental health and my own relationships with my friends and my family. Awesome. So is there tells it like a specific or is there a specific? Expedients. That can't happen to you. Whether it was in childhood, childhood, or even teenage years, or quality that can affect your relationships know that you can is a writer in a someone who's explored this world alot, but more, you can Kane a look back and see, oh Kay. This is why Iraq this week, because of this particular thing that happened. Yes. So it was largely due to my romantic relationships and the conflict that came out of that, then made me realize, oh, this is the thing that has been going on at repeating throughout my life. But I wasn't consciously aware of that. And so through disorder of, you know, dating in university is kind of a thing everybody. And it's something that a lot of people were interested in talking about very openly. And so that kind of allowed me be more open about my own experience with relationship. And the different conflicts that come up, especially rounds. This topic of intimacy I noticed that there was a large spectrum in the way, people defines their capacity for intimacy and their different approaches to it. And so that led me to question my own capacity for intimacy and relationships, and how that affects the conflicts or lack of conflicts that may arise in my relationships is, did you fame people in like, especially university, age college age were pre open to talking about fairly intimate expediencies, or at that point, you feel like people were still closed up in my experience. Most people were fairly open about talking about their relationship experiences. But maybe that was because of the people I was. Hanging out with I for a longtime in university. I was working part time as a brief STA. Okay. And so it was largely a crowd of people who are very extroverted, very talkative. They love getting to know people and, like, sometimes I would have friends where they would just spill their life stories. You're random customer. They're like, I want my morning coffee and then my friend would be like oh, how are you like over the weekend? I went on this blind date, and like Boba and they're very candid and very open these things. And so that helped me become more comfortable talking about this very sensitive topic. I feel yeah yeah, that's fake the open to talking of it. Yeah. Other life in a complete stranger. But it's great. Hey, that also, then affected, you did you find and growing up that you were not someone who would often be open about talking, you know, like romance, intimacy or. Anything like that with your family, or even friends young age? Yes, I've found that my entire approach to speaking openly about the subject when from a one eighty like I was I was very afraid about talking on the subject of feelings, very sensitive matters of my family for pretty much all my life until I started attending UB. See. And when I met my circle of friends, I started feeling more comfortable like I felt like it was a safe space to be able to open up and talk about these issues, whereas growing up. It was kind of this unsaid agreements, where, if you talk about your feelings, people are going to be uncomfortable, and you don't wanna make people income gap. Yeah. I mean my whole job, right? Nose to make people feel uncomfortable. It's interesting higher. I feel like I had a similar expedients to you Were's view when I was younger about generally wasn't the case. And it was the thing. You don't talk your feelings to people, you don't wanna try in front of peel, 'cause you don't want them to feel Cain of uncomfortable. Or like they don't know what to do or they're gonna lay cure something should, I hug, you lay should I something make you feel like I feel like there's a sense of responsibility someone's like showing their emotions. But that's not really how it should go like you're definitely responsible for holding space for that person, like fading safe-space till allow them to express themselves in this way, but you don't necessarily have to take responsibility for how they like pour out their feelings because that's, that's their responsibility. Yeah. And you don't even need to have the answers. They're not. Often looking for you to solve their problem. They just want someone to listen and hold that space. Exactly, as you said. Did you come from a family that were fairly traditional? I'm assuming then and the sense of, you know. Yep. Feelings just weren't talked to the can swept under the rug. Yeah. And how did how did that volt I because I feel like I'm similar situation. My family agree. Oviously. I feel like I can talk to them about anything. No. But when I was younger, I never felt that we am and that was just they had learned, you know, no judgment on them in the head learnt Kenna deal with things. And so I'm curious to know you know, going to university, you start to feel more open. And in hose, the process of then feeling like could you go back to your family, at that point and start to have a more open conversation who was that dynamic? It was interesting because I can relate with that family dynamic where things are a little bit more traditional. Generally, don't talk about your feelings. But I think through my experience in the humanities area at UB see, like it's encouraged to talk about difficult subject matters, and so through that experience as well as through my personal life like hanging out with friends and dating, I learned to become more comfortable talking about the more uncomfortable in sensitive matters, and so gaining that kind of courage and sort of willingness to open up, I started to, to slowly, try and bring that into the family dynamic. But it was surprisingly met with a lot of conflict. Omay not surprising. But I think it was just a clash of opposing perspectives. My family has often held a space where the uncomfortable, the grittier subject matters are sort of reserved for, like closed-doors private conversations. And then there was me coming in with all these new ideas. And this fresh perspective, you know, just out of university and bringing that kind of that kind of perspective into this already pre existing dynamic at home. It didn't mesh well, and I think there was a certain sense of not, not discomfort, but almost fear. Like, why are you prompting me to open up when I don't want to? And I could see that kind of reaction from my parents, especially and. I don't blame them because like you said, I think it was just the way that they were brought up in their own family dynamics. This is how they learn to hold in their emotions and to not feel safe expressing themselves. Yeah. No, it's, it's fatty cheer you definitely don't blame them. But it's all kind of learned behavior in the urges doing what they thought was right as Payton's. And yet that's really interesting. I'm curious to gain a let's take it to Kane a more intimate relationships. And having been brought up in again, the more traditional sense where, you know, we don't generally talk about feelings, you did, however, through a journey of where you learned to talk a little bit more about it. But did you still struggle when it came to, you know, fainting partner and having intimate relationship because they're not whole different thing. Even just talking openly to your friends so high, you know, high did you approach that for myself? I, I kind. Went in with us mentality where I'm just gonna lay at all, honestly, on the table because that's something I really craved in romantic relationship. I created that honest open communication where I can can just lay my wounds out on the table and have someone see that. And be like, yeah, I understand. I see that. And I'm okay with it like hit, doesn't scare me. It doesn't make me uncomfortable. And so I went in with that mentality where. I would just kind of talk openly about whatever him to mind, even if it's very personal and is not necessarily something might bring up. But I kind of just wanted to cut the bullshit, you know, like disfigure out, like who's in this for the real deal and dislike filter it out. I steer them eight person. Yeah, it was definitely like a confidence building exercise. I when people would be put off by that kind of like dating mentality. I was crushed. I was like, is there something wrong with me, and my two emotionally needy, my to real in my to honest, and I began questioning myself. And so it's definitely been like a grounds up kind of experience, but so much more rewarding like you literally cut through a lot of layers of bullshit, just by being honest about your past experiences, whether they were greater not. Yeah. I mean I dated in the city for a while. And I yet totally. Especially for someone like me, his, you know, hitting the other side of or as in the other side of thirty and doesn't have kids, yet, and really wants children having that was a hard conversation to have with people when I was dating them, because I don't want to spend fight like bring up after five months to year and for that person to turn Reina's e Noel, I don't wanna kit have kids. So it was like something that cannot to bring up at the beginning. And so people were like, whoa. She's one of these bat shit. Crazy. Chicks who just wants to get pregnant, like whole know why one of the right person, but it's a deal breaker for me man. Like that's just down the thing about intimacy is that you have to learn to be up front about what you need. And I came to rely that those needs can vary hugely from person to person like I went in with this mentality where I wanted, like basically. Early romantic best friend, you know with not just someone date to go hang out. And like, you know, have nice dinners and watch movies, with, like I wanted, like a soul mate. And I was ready for that kind of incident relationship with another human being. But not everybody wants that or is emotionally capable of that. And that brings up this whole other issue of, like unhealed childhood trauma, and pass wounds that have been neglected or just avoided. Yeah. You never meeting gathers, probably those guys reacted to me and not really crazy, lady. But I don't know what's going on in their worlds for them to Qena feel like well, that's not something I want. So it's always respecting the other person's belief. Sinn wishes to even maybe devastated. 'cause you really liked them in youth on was the one there's always this or could be underlying trauma, this happened that not person either hasn't deal with or is attempt trying to deal with, but as quite ready to talk Bates. Have you found in relationships that trauma, you've kind of maybe expedient in the past his kind of held you back from sheeting feelings and emotions with partners or if not for you for a partner sheeting with you? I think there has been several times, just a lot of unhealed like self confidence issues because I've had a really heavy dates and awful experiences with many, they're taking a. Vantage of me and sort of just manipulating my, my -bility to be honest and vulnerable. And so sometimes that has held me back from being as open as I would like to be in. Fully sharing myself with whichever person. I'm dating at the moment. So I think it's it varies from person to person because sometimes you can have that level of trust with someone you've never met other times. It's like I can see the mental wall. You're building up tween. Yeah. You were me. I I don't really want to break down. Like I don't wanna spend that energy like opening myself up to being vulnerable and sharing myself when as obvious that you can't reciprocate. And then I would feel like. Right from the gut go. It's kind of a waste of my emotional energy, 'cause I only have show much. I love that. It's true. I mean even with current partners that maybe you do think is the one or are you love? You have to be very main full for your own. Well being if the argon through something you obviously want to be there for them, but you've also got to take off your own emotional wellbeing. Dad. That's pretty huge too Cana come to realize Asian. It took me pretty much all twenty years of my life, though. Bars like to look to really learn that and not just learn that. But honor it because can I just say you're located at twenty like thirty six and I feel like I only just realized I it's I think it's obviously, it's difference for every person based on their experiences dating, but also. So I think it comes with the people that you surround yourself because people are really good at pointing that out for you. And so I've thankfully been careful with the friends I choose. I, I wanted the friends who would be honest with me. Yeah. Even when it hurt. And so, you know, just learning that ability to honor your emotional needs, is heartbreaking, sometimes, because for people who are a little bit more mindful and just have so much love to share in want to be able to be there for your partner that person you love. And it's not it's not necessarily a burdens that gives some of yourself up and to be like I can hold this for you right now. I can hold your pain. I can hold your your fear. But there is a limit and I think learning that limit is is part of the heartbreak. Yeah. Definitely. I am recently just did an episode on body positivity. And Caroline, who is speaking to that hit says, you know what? Self peer rated all. Comes back to when you're on the airplane and the oxygen Moscow's down, and it says your mass gone first before you, you put someone else's on because otherwise if you pass. How can you be there for someone if you have no energy life? Can you be there for someone else? Yeah. And it's, it's kind of this idea of if everybody is trying to be there for everybody else. Roll come just like emotionally, mentally incapacitated because we're not taking care of ourselves. And there's no real foundation. You know, it's like how to build that kind of community of taking care of each other. Yeah, I would do you do take care of yourself in, like, especially in a space where others? You're in a relationship with someone who may be does need more emotional support. How do you look after yourself for me? I've mostly spent time creating. I think it's it's a little bit counter. Maybe not counterintuitive that's not the right word, but it's like expending energy into making something that something that is somehow reciprocal. And it gives me something back, like it gives me, this sense of accomplishments, and satisfaction this, this pride in having created something when there wasn't something there, originally. It's like, hey I did a thing. And if they're now it's there for other people to appreciate and to learn from, and it can be in the form of painting writing has been a huge huge, huge way for me to process, a lot of my experiences. Do you faint just kind of journaling? I mean, lots of people say, at the end of the just can't have poor. All I onto a page, and that or Cain of writing something more structured may be. For a blogger for publication won't works best for you. It really depends in the past few months. I've felt so. Knots. Quiet up to writing structurally yet. The past few months have been pretty difficult for me. And so the most I was capable of was journaling, and it's, it's neat though. Because once you reach a certain points in your healing, you realize all of this Messager, knowing and all these, like, unstructured idea is really the foundation in which you can build a more coherent narrative around. Yeah. Nuts. That's when you can start writing proper blogs proper stories, and so it's, it's all part of the big picture. I feel. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's is fatty to. And I mean, I've even heard of writers who are like novelists, just seeing just get off the same time every morning, or nay Andy just right. And maybe fifty words of that. That or like one page and hitting awful. Like you just need to fry. Yes, exactly. Just like just like vomit all onto the peach, but n there could be something just like perfect and could be healing. Could be perfect for the next. Whatever is that you actually want to to Ray are published so we digress a little bit. But it's that's awesome. Let's come back to Qena Vam the intimacy factor in having those conversations with your partner that you, would you kind of want to express a feeling or an emotion or something that you're struggling with or something that you want, whether or not sexually, or just in the relationship in general. But you're struggling to kind of communicate that white Cain of 'em. Or are, how'd you manage those conversations when the when the have to come up? In my experience. It's it's been a little bit difficult because I, I realized that my ability to hold intimacy in relationships has largely been bigger than my partners. And so this great some really weird dynamic of the sort of like I'm grasping for more intimacy and like trying to express my, my knees for, you know, affection or my views concerning a specific matter like I'm grasping for like that conversation. And then in return, my partner would kind of pull away because they're, they're, they're afraid of opening up in that kind of intimacy and so cut like sharing these things haven't been the smooth. Case us in the past, and I'm still trying to learn that in just trying to figure out what is their limit. You know what is their limit for having these conversations for talking about intimacy and talking about what they need -cause. I've learned that the more you push someone to tell you what they need the less likely. They're going to tell you. It's like they need to also be ready and point Cain of talk, like if you've ever been able to sense when the your partners being ready for that more intimate conversation or is that something that you're still playing right with China figure, it's the right time the right time I feel, I don't I, I have really mixed views on this concept of the right time because I feel like there's always going to be something. Always always going to give you something. So is there like there can be an appropriate time? Is there a right time? And I think sometimes you have to set aside this notion of there, not being a right time to have a conversation, 'cause if you feel like you need to our conversation that indicates said, you know, you need to receive so it's probably the right time, but finding the appropriate time when maybe your partners, less tired, and less frumpy, and that is something that you have to kind of intuitively feel out. I mean just. Yeah. Did you ever remember having a coach? And I wanted to have a particular conversation, you know with that client, I think it was about Bo. Jeez, or something the time, and she can't have gated me through high to have this conversation. And she actually advised that I can have defies them that I wanted to talk to them at this particular time in Cain, of like almost get them prepared for the fact that I was lately gonna have a corn relation at needed a bit more. You know, your focus and, and it wasn't really going to be just the tasks that I'm doing. It was gonna be maybe a bone or something more uncomfortable. Would you ever think of giving them like a heads up? Yes. That is something I've tried to do in the past, just sort of let them have the time to digest this, like emotionally prepare for this, and also make sure that you set a time. And a place where you're talking face to face. I've had conversation through texts with my previous partner where we were I tell him, hey, I would like to tell you about something. And he's like, no, no. I can't wait like after. No right now. What you're talking about. But he's not physically. Here's the texting and that's where a lot of things get Lawson communication text. So that's a big no no don't do what I did. Yeah. It's funny conversation with a girlfriend texting in relationships in the height. It's just like pack up the full ignore. I really see the person because there's just takes an Email, you, you don't really know that passan's like how the, the field are mental emotional state attainment, the right that could something that signs, either, really funny, really Sakasi really horrible. And it be the same line like the same wanting at it. Just can't of you have to pick up on what their mood was. When the said that so feeling takes. Should be bond in relationships. I think so too console easy to just jump to conclusions based on your own fears, yet Kennedy comes back to fear trauma again night. Yes. And things that have happened in the past. And yes. So, like, in terms of things that have happened in the past to you. Whether they're all like, really traumatic or just things that you realize can happen, when you were young Stelle, generally have an effect on you. You're looking back known hopefully overcoming those things. Is there any kind of resources that you would offer to people who also wanna Canna change their perspective? And look back it Louis things that can of the struggled west but night, you know, they want to be able to deal with them. Yes. So I found that the most obvious resource is to seek counseling talking to someone who's in that position of authority, and, you know, knowledge can give you a better understanding of where you personally are in terms of unhealed trauma, and sort of where you are on the line of or sort of, on your own journey emotional, growth, and healing. And I found that reading on it can really help. And when I realized that my. Own capacity for intimacy and my ways of coping with unhealed trauma has been sort of like characterizes like anxious attachment dining, and that like opened like a holding perspective for me. And I read this book by Amir. Levine LeVine on attachment theory, and sort of having these books as my resource gave me the ability to pace my own sort of journey to seek this knowledge. Okay. Yeah. And it was hopeful that my counselor suggested several books for me. Yeah, that's also will be sure to Canaan. No. That one is the Sean was, I haven't heretic before and is kind of interesting how you came to that conclusion of that kind of, like anxious attachment. Did you feel you're like oh shit is what I do. He. Cheat like work to change that. So the first thing I did was. Through experiencing a lot of conflict in my previous relationship I started googling myself and could be the best or worst possible. Glenn. Glenn. Then the more you read on it the more you start to resonate with some of the articles things he read and I realized I do all that. And this is maybe what I am. So when I when I saw the words anxious attachment type like fuck anxious, am I that like crazy lady, like, you know, that's on a lot of these television shows and movies. It's like we're she'll like coal her boyfriend twenty times a day. And like where were you today like M I that person? And there is a sense of shame that I felt. But then there was also this, this feeling of relief like I've identified the problem. Yeah. And now I can do something about it can seek help. I that's when I started seeing my counselor. And so it's in creates a lot of different conflicting emotions. But it's I think that is the first step to fixing the problem and beginning healing a lot of these past traumas and childhood traumas, even so it's, it's whole difficult convoluted process, but it's you realize so much about yourself. And I know that sounds completely cliche. But is true. Yeah. I mean like just from someone who also kind of face on and off with anxiety. I can't get it like that. And I can totally see her was probably similar specially like late teen like mid to late teens at that point in my life. And then I look back, and I'm like deer Goma sometimes life. I hope like that anymore because I can't stunned clinginess like people are super super clingy. Let's too much for me. I can't either. So it's weird like I would end up exhibiting this kind of behavior Valiente. That I did that to when I was young. And I've learned to Qena move away from inau be that person. And again, it's being just through a whole process of watching my behaviors and just recently, signing up for, for therapy, and the new teacher training. So you can't learn a lot, but yourself through those types of trainings us, well, which is amazing. But the fact that you, you're still early twenties, and you're discovering this is is phenomenal because it takes some people a long time, right? Again depending on on their journey and yet. So this is being I opening an amazing for me. Any last thoughts anything else you want to share before we wrap up yet? I, I think I would just like to say that this kind of experience of meeting partners in, you know, dating and even friendships. Is gonna come up and it's going to realize your own capacity for holding space for another person. And if that makes you feel uncomfortable and you feel ashamed of your behaviors and pass relationships and friendships, even with your family. No. That. There is a huge difference between feeling ashamed and feeling guilty for arm did. Because feeling guilty means that you can take responsibility and you can learn to slowly, you know, shift your perspective and change your behavior of viewing. Shame that's when you feel like, oh my God, I've done, all of this horrible, clingy avoidance, stuff, not means there's something wrong with me. But I think I, I would want people to know is that there is not anything wrong with you just been kind of shaped by your childhood, your environments, your experiences with pain and fear and. That's the doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you. And so k yeah. And it's okay to explore those things started Laron and move forward kind of just approach it with a very open and non-judgmental mindset. Don't judge yourself or it, it happens. But you have the ability to fix it. Yeah. That's awesome. You so much. Thank you agree. Take here and Bill, make sure to post everything in the show news links to you had said, you had some other resources books, so that, yes. So we'll post those other people can share. Thank you. Thank you. He everyone, thanks so much for tuning into the episode. If you are someone who struggles with cash trauma, mental health issues or just struggles in general them, firstly. I appreciate the fact that you're tuning into these conversations. But please also note that there is help out there. You can head to her shoe where we've listed some great resources. If you wanna connect with piggy than head over to her blog, which, again, posted a link to initial along with some links to heart main your main articles. If you enjoyed our conversation than feel free to let us know in the comment section over on our website uncomfortable, don't belong or on any of her social media channels. We're on Facebook and Instagram at uncomfortable dot blog and Twitter at on comfy underscore point cast, you could even support our little podcast by signing up to be a peach on and pledging a small fire. Five dollars per month so that we can keep on running. For more information you can. Visit uncomfortable dot blog forward slash donates. Thanks again. For listening. No go there and get uncomfortable.

partner Cain writer Kane Lou Peggy Qena Vancouver university of British Columbia Peiqi Deb Agee Iraq Kenna Kay UBS Germain Boba Payton Qena Vam
Thursday 1/16/19 - Our Lady Of The Angels Fire Part II

Chicago Dog Walk

30:06 min | 11 months ago

Thursday 1/16/19 - Our Lady Of The Angels Fire Part II

"Ri Bang Bang. Today's Thursday January sixteenth. Chicago Dog Walk Avi Listener yesterday. Heard part one with Gavin Chicago store in we talk about the our lady of the angels was fire. We get into Kinda you know just how the rooms are laid out. You know how it was extremely flammable and today we're going to get into part two but before we get to part two. I do WanNa talk about are one of the sponsors as for the show it is Roman Roman swipes You know there's obviously everyone's got their trick to last longer in bad. But why not use something that's clinically proven to help you They're effective. They're easy using fast acting and they require prescription. So you know. It's not something that you need to go in and see Dr Four. If you're kind of embarrassed about that so Roman Roman swipes. They're easy to ship as well. They're discreet there on mark packaging each. Swipe packet is small enough to hide in your wallet whenever you need it The stripes are great. You know they won't transfer onto your partner as well so you don't have to worry about that. You don't have to worry about her being like. Oh what's what is what's going on. It's just it's just something that's for you to kind of help you feel better about your situation and other supervie's used like I keep saying just take the swap out of the pack. It's ripe and let it dry and you're good to go. That's it so head on over to get Roman dot com slash. I dog walk. You can get your first month stripes for just five dollars when you choose a monthly plan if you use the link get Roman dot com says dog walk. That's GET ROMAN DOT COM sized dog walk. Okay let's get it apart to with Jim. Gibbons about the Lady of the Angels Fire. They're jumping they're jumping 'cause they got fire behind them and so basically they will run their with bladders but they can't reach it. Guess what from that Second Floor Window down is a twenty five foot drop twenty five foot drop drops straight down and there wasn't grass there there'd be like concrete that was there because after all the children and you wouldn't know this and maybe I don't know back then you went home for lunch so when you go home for lunch back then you my wife's like this'll be before Bozo's circus but when I was a kid you go home and watch suppose circuit circuit. Wasn't sure so you'd be home for lunch. You'd come to school in the morning. Go home for lunch. And then after lunch hour come back on in. So they basically didn't need much. Gotcha the school yard there did. They didn't need grass. You go back into the building but when you are jumping out of a building and not having grass or anything a soft thing he got like concrete. You got like asphalt something they're gonNa hit right into as they're jumping so that's what they're going to have when they looked out of the windows. It was a twenty five. I put dropped one. Girl's GonNa say my God. It looked just like we were looking at the empire state building looking down. We have to jump to this. That's what they had. They do now with no direct connection to the fire department. The fire department didn't know how to get there fast. But now you're asking okay. Oh one other thing. I've forgotten this is something else has been changed. If you have your roof for place today it used to be. When I was younger I lived in Downers Grove for the we had to have our our one roof replaced aced? Well they'll take the old roof and put on top of the first roof while now they don't even do that. They take them off because guess what they had five layers of hot ktar on top of a roof. We just keep pouring and pouring the tar on tap right now. What's that GONNA do? Okay that does seal the roof up but if you've got a fire underneath that it can't burn through the roof it can't burn through it so the only way it's GonNa go is a across. That's what's it's going to happen that day and everything happens to be made out of wood. They have an attic in their call but top blocked and the Kak loft actually is about three foot. Hi Up and that fire is going to be able to burn through. So it's going to have to burn across right on top of the children and the non set day as they're doing things things you're gonNA ask well where that fire start word start. It started in the northeast corner of the North Wing. There was a Oh what is the northeast corner happened to have a staircase going up and down okay. Staircase going up and down. The North Wing had something it had. It had had classrooms up there and again the north wing so when that's going to get at the APP so that's the one that's going to get the worst. Okay you have fire. You have smoke all that stuff. North Wing classrooms up above. If you're going towards so the northeast corner okay. You'RE GONNA have your seventh grade up at the northeast corner on the second floor in the middle. You'RE GONNA wind up with the fourth graders and on the very very end of that North Wing. You'RE GONNA wind up with a fifth grade classroom. That's room to twelve and it's GonNa wind it being The coroner well that's right there off of abors avenue across awesome. That is to eighth grade rooms on that North Wing. And also they're going to have have on the. The one corner is something which is called the chiefs box of cheese box half and had like fifth and sixth graders in there so those are the ones that are in the most danger of fire is is that northeast staircase on the northeast wing. I'm sorry not sorry. The North Way I was was that close to the annex that yes it's right up against the antics he annexed. The antics is right there off. The sixth graders. Okay which is the my brain's trying to kick in. which which is the cheese box okay? So you're annex will attach that area there the cheese box area okay. It'll run across the south wing and that is where your your fire escape is your fire escape actually happens to be off of that cheese box area right. There now. Forgot to tell you something else. That's kind of good. Where are you going to hang your coat? Note that day where you put it on pegs up and down the halls. That's what you're supposed to do. There weren't any lockers so you have your clothing hanging out there in front of their body. It take a matching back. Then the clothes were all burnable. You take a match the close now. They're going to go up aren't they. See if got that as well but again people didn't no they didn't know what's going to happen so what happens. How did this fire get started? Where did it get fire? Okay the Northeast Corner staircases. This is where the fire is gonNA come from however the basement area of the north The The school the North School is where they The fire origin is that basement area that northeast staircase in the basement area. They had a chapel down there. The Chapel has matches is if you remember what those video light candles and that kind of stuff. So that'll be down there. They also have a boiler room down there and they also have a girl's restroom down there. So that is is the basement area of that north wing which was the old church on the northeast corner is the staircase and the staircase is going to take you all the way from the basement. All the way up the second floor K.. So what you've got is you've got wooden stairs and it wouldn't stairs are all made out of wood. Would all highly varnished all highly polished on there. And we've got. We've got the sixteen coats of paint with the two coats plasticizer on the walls right there air and then we also have tar paper on the staircase and on top of that we have linoleum tile that Burns all of that sitting right there now remember we have one thousand six hundred sixty eight students. This building was built in one thousand nine hundred ten around the time of William Howard. Our Taft is when it's built so it's going to be renovated okay. But with that many students going up and down staircases. Imagine a toilets being flushed with that many students. It's IT'S GONNA get worn out. It's going to get worn out so this is nine hundred. Fifty eight at the building isn't really that old however it's going to start to wear out now in that northeast northeast corner. What they're going to have is down in the basement area where those boiler room boiler room is children will go down there and the fire started but Bondo between between two o'clock and was out was done by three o'clock pretty much as far as you know killing whatever was gonNA kill and so it was less than an hour's time period when this happened and so around two o'clock in the afternoon the nuns and teachers are going to tell the children okay naive? Got All your daily paperwork. And what we watch Gotcha do so take some a kid empty the baskets take it down to the boiler room down there neither dump it in the furnace or Jim Raymond. WHO's the janitor will do that? You can kind of put in trash bins down there. And he'll dump these papers into the furnace to kind of keep it nice and warm or what's going to happen is you. Have that northeast corner. And in the northeast corner there is a trash bin in there and the old trash bins back then were made out of cardboard and you wouldn't remember this because you're too young but I remember suspension and they had a wire ring around the the top and so these were rather tall trash bins. And that's where you would put put your papers in there. Well there was one trash bin. That's going to catch fire and this trash bin is near that staircase right there air. Okay right underneath. There's also a window down in the area as well a window then when it gets heated up it's going to shatter so that windows sitting down there in that basement area as well. There's also something down there called a pipe shoot is the name of that. What is the pipe? Shoot and you're gonNA to find a really this cool stuff on oil a fire dot com so you can. They have a lot of people talking about these things happen but the pipe hued in there has wires and it goes safe in the basement area all the way up towards the attic area. And you're going to run wires along the side you can also put pipes in there. Okay so this this is where the pipes and the the wires will travel along the side inside the wall between the walls. How it's going to do it while they had an old abandoned Water Fountain Area Down There and so the fountains gone so they have this hole in the wall that was connecting the pipes to the fountain and now this hole in the wall is down the basement and that whole goes all the way up to the advocacy. You've got that you can kind of see the scenario on this thing. So what's GonNa happen is that fire is going to start in one one of those trash bags and the trash bin down there and the trash bin happens to be. It'll always will kind of it'll smolder in that. been an in almost go out and all of a sudden it's going to heat up that window which is right next to the trash bin and shatter it at soon as it does that the fire is something they're gonNa have oxygen now. I can travel and so what it's going to start to do. It's going to start to get bigger in that trash bin which is all made out of cardboard board and suddenly it's going to start to take off as it's taking off. It goes right towards the staircase with all the wooden. It's going to chew itself right up through that would loyd. There's all that sixteen coats of paint. It's going to go through that all that varnish all that stuff it's going to go up there and it's going to go towards the first floor. As it approaches the first floor there is a door. That's up on that first floor and there is a window inside that door okay at because the door is closed. The fire can't make it up there now. At this particular point I had done the presentation at one of my libraries and a young child. WHO's not an older man? Came up to me and said you know what I saw that fire. He said I saw it. I was like in first grade than other guy. We were out going to the restroom and we were on the opposite side of that door opposite side of it. We almost open it up but we were scared to death are none was gonNA kill us if we did so. We just let the door close. Went Back to our desk askin sat down. That's we did our. Let's take a quick break to talk about JP Graziano sear obviously located in the heart of West loop at ninety one west Randolph. You can also go go to their website. JP GRAZIANO DOT com if you bake an order to the code dog walkie ten percent off your order. Push that one awhile so make sure you're using that In also there's all forget about the catering aspect catering aspect is big They could fit any size parties or business meeting or presentations they deliver it as well sub trace any pasta betrays catering sales desert trays and could always call them up. Go Get something I'm guarantee you that the people will appreciate it. Don't be going over those shame places make sure hitting up our people over rich. AP Graziano Nine hundred Randolph. JP GRAZIANO DOT COM can only dip is definitely a fan favorite. I keep saying all week but I guess it can only dips in my mind. I gotta go over there. It gets could only depth but yet go over there. Get a full cannoli to if you wanted to get a Mr g try it all out. J. Grozny dot com nine one restaurant off. Make sure we're headed up for your next party your next presentation like I said I think he got gone. You need a lot of food for make sure hitting up JP's okay. Let's get back to the interview but wait Jim so I get. I understand that. That's what triggered it was the cardboard trash bin. He said the kids have been down there. They tried to give it to the the gender or the custodian. Whatever he kinda throw it in to the homework to one of the pieces of homework on fire get thrown away? How how does a so you want me to go head that direction yet or I can tell you how it happened in in a minute or I'll tell ya yeah I can't do it? Okay okay thank you any rate. So here's here's what's going to happen okay. In fact I'll say it was done by hand I'll start at that that direction and then we'll go back. Okay okay so it literally. Somebody struck something to start that. It wasn't was not the kids down to the best of my knowledge with the trash bin. I and of course that's another scenario ever thought about that but what it was basically was this fire is gonNA chew. It's way up to the first floor because the door orest kept closed. It's not going to go on that first floor. It's not but it's going to go up the second floor it's GonNa keep going up and there's no door there. So what were the door. I moved out of that. Gore's were made out of like well. Let's see door for kind of metal doors. They were like metal doors in there and so they could kind of protect things so the fire it had like this metal title door there to protect you okay. But we were grandfathered. Up Top show grandfather clauses are the single most thing that can pretty well. That's that's where a lot of fires are caused grandfathered you. They had the fire inspectors in there about a month ago or so prior we know what they do have one thousand nine hundred fifty nine codes but after all your building was built in nineteen ten. So yeah you don't need you don't need a second fire door up there so now well guess what the fire can go right down that hallway the second floor hallway down there because there's no Dr the first floor had a door and because those kids didn't open open the door it would've held it. It held it within the staircase so they literally saved the lives of the entire for the entire per forgot out took the death. Total could have been double. Hey go even more than it. Yeah because they were hit the first floor and come up below the children on the second floor it would have been worse Scotland and those kids. They were smart to believe that guy who told you that he could open that door. Yes yes very easy very easy to open that door. That's all he had to do because he could say these that I saw the flames right there but I was too scared of mine on and trust me was in Catholic school. You didn't cost nuns uh-huh yeah and you're darn smart not to write. Because they were right most of the time ninety nine point nine percent of the time and so you'd go sit back down after all they're an adult they know more than you do. Do and we're not supposed to be touching any kind of firearms plus where this kid was. He couldn't touch fire alarm. Could he now. And the sprinkler systems. Were the what what do you call it. the canisters the you know the put fire out exterminator fire extinguishers they were seven foot off the ground. The kids couldn't touch those so there's no no way you can touch it so this fire is going up that staircases second floor now. A lot of people had said this in fact there's a movie out or a DVD out called Angels Too Soon W W strongly recommend getting that you can only get through. WTT W about maybe twenty four twenty five dollars shipping or it's definitely worth it. They show it every single year. Round December. I it's called angels too soon. Is the name of it and so what it is. It actually got a An Award Grammy Award. If I'm not mistaken an Emmy Award Emmy Award for it but it's going to show you how that fire started. But what they they said was had. They had a door on that second floor. The fire would have just plain gone out with a fire and a staircase and just gone on out. At least that's what they were saying in there however however I still see that pipe shoot on the one side so that fire now is going up right and it's going up towards that second floor hallway but you also had the pipe shoot with a pipe shoot. It's now going between the walls it's going straight on up towards the cock law which is seven foot high. I'm sorry it's the attic addict. which is a three foot? High Attic Almeida would Almeida cobwebs. All Up above. They may have put children's papers in there. It's an attic and and so with it not being able to burn through that roof it is now going directly across the top of the children and the nuns are up there. Teaching not realize that this splash fire has suddenly gone above them they also have to vents. They have a hallway in there. Okay the hallway separating the eighth grade and the sixth great from the one side and seven fourth and fifth grade from the other always down that center and again. It's got all your coats down that hallway to with a traveling across the cock law. which is the attic right above them? They have to vents one end of the hallway and the opposite end of the hallway. These events so the fire is going to start coming out the one event one and travels fast can towards the opposite side and now becoming out the other Band Fire Commissioner Commissioner Robert Quinn back then said this fire travels faster than the fastest human being can run can run so there was no way for them to be able to get out at north weighing except to jump because guess what you have a fire totally carbon straight down that hallway and so that is what's going to it'd be greeting those nuns now end. Yeah they they were nuns. Also teacher Nolan picking all nuns all nuns up in that. Wow isn't that and it didn't matter which side of the hallway or you were on a Nielsen. You're doomed. You were doing because guess what you could not get out because guess what you had a fire fire was totally down that hallway. In in fact I forgot about that little old pipe shoot thing remember. That's how could it crept on up there through that area there. So That's within the wall over there so this thing is coming down the hallway away and everybody's getting warmer and warmer and warmer within the classrooms and so with them getting warm and they're one of the nuns seventh grade teacher. Take your who's right up against the fire there as like my gosh. The things are getting very very warm in here. Wow so she's going to sell the open up in fact by the way they give your classroom. Okay you have a door up by the teacher's desk okay. which is towards the front and Adore towards the the the the the back end of the classroom? So there's two doors ores in there okay. Two doors into the hallway so the none in the seventh grade sister can acis going to go and she's going to open that door to look out and slammed the door shut because it's hotter than blazes out there in fact her face the black face. It's GonNa be that bad that bad but beforehand. They're sitting in their. What's going to happen is all of a sudden? It's going to start to rattle. Everything's rooms getting warmer and warmer. Let me all the windows. Everything's starting to rattle. The air is getting getting sucked out of the hallway. It's all getting sucked out of the hallway. So what's happened is they're starting to laugh in. The seventh grade is like my gosh. We got ghosts in there. Don't we we have goes out out there. All of a sudden it's GONNA start getting warmer and warmer and warmer and all the sudden. The walls are going to start to turn from from from white to Tan Dan to Brown the room getting ready to ignite. And so you've got all the ceiling turning that color you've got the walls during that color sisters sisters GonNa look on out and go. Oh my God. We're trapped we can't get out the only way to go is to the windows and so the children in the seventh grader GONNA go. Oh towards those windows and according to the movie angels too soon they're going to say we were grotius. Animals inherit to get out. We had to do whatever are we had to do. And so they're going to go out towards that windows to a twenty five foot trap and some of the children will fall right along the brick as they're heading all the way to the bottom. One girl will shatter her hip pretty bad to where he's going to have four hip replacements. What she's going to have to have there was nothing in there was no sprinkler systems? Mo- smoke alarms. And that was that particular arom now. Their Room is GONNA wind up. Being the fourth graders in the center they're going GonNa get it the worst and they're the ones that were between seventh graders with your right up against the fire. Fourth graders are in the middle of the hallway. And they're right up against it's the fifth graders. which could have maybe had the best chance to get out because they were towards the front of the building neighbors avenue fourth grade? What's going to happen in their one of the the sisters is going to be in there? She's at one end of the classroom and he's going to sell they realize my gosh. It's getting awful warm in here. So what she is going to do is share her name. Sisters seraphic graphic. Kelly is sweet non. They said they referred to her sister. Holy Water She's always blessing. Everybody my friend Cathy. Cincinnati had told me Al.. We always assist holy water. She was such a beautiful none. He's going to be at the front end trying to see what's going on a child's going to go to the back end both of them open the door at the same moment and this is going to blow them into the room. Now the fire is in with the fourth graders and the fourth graders are going to pile up towards towards the windows. Trying to get on out. Drawback is going to have to pile up one after another trying to get out there too short to get up an out of the windows and they're going to have to jump. There's a beautiful girl binding this Sharleen Camp Anneli and Charlene is going to be there in the center and she's all of a sudden gonNA get up and she's going to realize I can't do anything except go. Go out those windows. The boys are going to be pulling on her. Like you wouldn't believe and she's going to say no I've got to jump. I've got to get out of here. I've got to get out of here. So what's going to happen with Charlene. He's still on the said. My God it looks just like the Empire State Building is I'm looking down there. And she will suddenly have to fall out of the bill out of the room and when they're out there think think about it. You're hopeful that somebody's going to be able to catch you but with fire behind you. You've got all of that going on now. There's my dear Peggy's room which his room to twelve. That is the room of the fifth graders and John. Raymond who is Jim Raymond Son is going to be in that room along with Peggy aggie. And when he's in there he was kind enough to talk to me in two thousand eight and this was the fiftieth anniversary of the fire. He spoke to me very pleasantly over the phone to me and said things were very very different in that room. The Fifth Grade Room. And what's GonNa Happen is he's in fifth grade room adjust getting ready with their geography. They're closing the books and all of a sudden it's starting to get warmer and warmer and warmer in that room and so his none is gonNA GONNA get on up and that sister. Mary Clare Therese his only twenty seven years old. And it's GonNa start getting warm in that room where he's going to say hey kids. Let's open the windows here. It's getting Kinda kind of warm in this room with Mr. Raymond has had stoked the furniture up but seems to be rather warm in here so she is suddenly going to go towards that door or in the front as she does. She suddenly going to slam the door. Shut my God. The whole hallway is on fire and so as I asked John John Raymond I asked him. I said so you were Peggy. Cincinnati was that day and he said yes. He said she was right next to me. He said in fact I found out that Peggy was seventy so she was right up against the windows right there where she could have jumped. What's going to happen is is he said all of a sudden we saw all all this smoke coming into the room and he said I started to stand up she started to stand up and all of a sudden he was seeing the none was suddenly getting draped with all these children children screaming for their mothers coming around as the smoke is pouring into the room he said Jim you could not see your hand in front of your face eventually? It was that bad but the the smoke but he will look at Peggy. She will look at him he will suddenly look towards the boy who is right up in front of them and can't see him. The boy was wearing a white shirt. Like I'm wearing wearing right here. Couldn't see him at all in fact what's going to happen with John. Raymond is he's going to try to get up and get out down the aisle and he suddenly falls over the boy's body in front of him. The boy is dying gasping for air. So is John Raymond and what John told me was this. He said it was like drinking several glasses of tax. He said said if you have ever and that's how they said Christ died he suffocated okay. You suddenly suffocating. You will do anything to try to get out. And so he pushed shove whatever he had they do to get out those windows. That's what he did. Plus he had those damn desks right there in the way they were bolted to the floor bolted to the floor so John Raymond's going to get up up there on the ledge and tumble out. He's going to hurt his side badly as he tumbles out as he looks up he's going to see all the smoke oke in fact the the movie angels too soon. By W W is going to show you. It's like a cardboard box effect. The smoke is billowing out there. There's no way you can breathe. John told me this he said Jim. This may sound heartless but he said those guys if he ever saw nine eleven. How they're jumping out of that building? He he said that was the best damn thing that ever happened for me. said I sound heartless but if you have ever breath in smoke like that where you are gasping for air. He said he'll do anything to add air and he said for those God love those people that fell out of that window at least ahead air before they hit the ground he said I have never been through such hell as not having been able to breath but he said I looked up at the window. He said there was my none trying to look on out. He said but I saw less and less children. Non and more and more smoke smoke twenty-eight children plus that none will die in that room due to smoke inhalation. That's how they're going to die. Not Flames smoke in in that room because he talked to you about his jump he no. He didn't talk to me about how he just jumped. He said he just plain jumped and then he was on the bottom and then he was kind kind of just kind of looking up a little bit and somebody's going to help them. There's a beautiful candy store lady. Who's right next door? And he's going to try to help us. Many of the children out of she she can because my God they're all jumping they had fortified children at one window jumping and this was before the fire department came there because guess what the Fire Department wasn't signaled right away so how that happened. You're probably wondering. Why did they finally show up? What happened the Fire Department while the fire started it could have been my thinking to twelve what I'm taking on too many things pointing towards the number to twelve for me? But they said that a boy and we're only gonNA doesn't say boy because the neighborhood doesn't want any names sad nothing because there's other people that could be badly hurt. I guess to this day so they never mention any names on this but there is is a boy and his boy is going to be in the fifth grade room fifth sixth grade class. Mr Pearl's to stand up and Mr Stanton. Oh this is about two o'clock in the afternoon tone. Mr Stanley is going to be on in there. As like this kid's GonNa raise his hand teacher. I gotta go potty. I gotta go potty and school's going to and and what three o'clock while you're not gonNa have mess in his pants so she turns around and says okay. You can go to the restroom. That's fine but you get back up here as soon as you. Can you get here quickly right so. They had the boy the restrooms on different floors than things. So what's going to happen. He's GonNa pass the faculty restroom. He is going to go towards towards the northeast corner of the building and had from the second are where he is down to the basement area. What we have here is something uncalled pyro? Maniac and the thing is they kept troubled. They love fires they get infatuated with fires. That's what he was. He was a troubled child. They who's known to be a nuisance in the neighborhood at five years old. He said his first garage fire and so he was known to be out of your sold five years old. This is a sickness disease. This is something to where I was living in Downers Grove. And that's how some of the Lord's somehow comes around and and says hand with a wink at you and thinks you can see how fast these things can happen. There was a home two doors down from me and both the husband is gone for the day working. The wife goes out to due to Shopping River comes back and a sixteen year old kid had gone into the house poured gasoline all over the place and set fire to it and sit out front when the fire. This is seventy five thousand dollars worth of damage on this house. And he's standing out front and they're going to say so. How did this this happened? I did it so one of the kids was a pyro maniac and went maniac and he was the one who and he's never was convicted of it. Ever Aber ten years old okay. We're GONNA stop right there for today. That was part two about the our lady of the angels fire will be back with the final part three tomorrow.

Jim Raymond John John Raymond North Wing fire department Empire State Building Downers Grove JP GRAZIANO Peggy aggie Chicago Cincinnati foot drop Northeast Corner Gavin Chicago Dr Four partner Gibbons smoke inhalation Grammy Award Bozo
Humanoids from the Deep / Monster (1980) | Barbara Peeters

Around the World in 80s Movies

31:08 min | 5 months ago

Humanoids from the Deep / Monster (1980) | Barbara Peeters

"Welcome to around the world in eighty s movies. My name is Vince. Leo I am the author of the Film Review Website Webster Dot. Net I've been doing visas ninety six. You can read them. All hipster dot net is where to go Q., wip. Our Dot Net while you're there doing courage you to check out the other podcasts now they do that looks more at newer movies, even though there's not a lot of new movies coming out at least in the first half or the first seven months of twenty twenty but I will be keeping up with that as soon as we start seeing more theatrical releases again. Dot Net is where to go to finally to that podcast today I'm going to be getting into the third in a series looking at underwater creatures that put. Humans blow them on the food chain. I just looked at two films in the Parana series. Now I'm going to get into something. That's a little bit more close to you. Human in terms of our nemesis, in fact, humanoid humanoids from the deep, it came out in one, thousand, nine, hundred eighty. It is an R. rated now, but it does have nudity sexuality. Gore violence and language, the run times an hour and twenty minutes. Doug McClure and terkel and Moro are the main stars Cindy Weintraub Anthony Pena, Denise Gallic Lynn Teal and Megan. King are also in the film barb repeaters, the credited director. The screenplay is credited to Frederick James Although. That is a pseudonym for William Martin and I'll get into the reasons why his name changed on this film as we get into this review now. humanoids from the deep set in this small coastal fishing village, the village called in its in northern California. It's actually a place up there in northern California in Mendocino county where this film is primarily shot. It's around the Fort Bragg. The residents in Noyo are set to celebrate their annual Salmon Festival. Being the main commodity that they are known for the festival has been on the decline though of late because the fish population has been dwindling, and it leaves the town suffering Doug. McClure is fishermen and trusted community leader named Jim Hill, and he's doing whatever he can to keep harmony among his neighbors. In these trying times, Vic Morrow is much more aggressive type. He's twisting. Whatever arms are necessary around Noyo to get a company to establish a cannery? There Anthony Pena, though is among the native Americans who happen to be protesting of cannery that they think are going to be exploiting his tribes land now the corporation, the one that plans put the. The Cannery there they've been experimenting with ways that they can escalate the growth of fish in the area and and terkel. She plays this scientist need Dr Susan Drake. Who has led the experiments which involves tinkering with Salmon, D. N. A. so that they would grow larger and increase their spawning activity. They're going to be bigger and more in abundance. However, this experiment as you can imagine goes awry after these prehistoric fish known as Seila, cats, they began to consume these genetically altered salmon, and that changes their own makeup. Their offspring starts to evolve very quickly into these humanoid sea creatures that emerge eventually out of the ocean, attacking landlubbers with an. An overwhelming desire to not only feed on whatever mammals they can find, but they want to procreate with human women. That's the basic set up of this movie. It pretty much goes on from there to be a horror movie. In many respects now humanoids from the deep is produced by Roger Corman new world pictures of just talked about him recently for Piranha. So this is another one that came out a couple of years later that plays in the same play ground. They collaborated with United Artists and contributed to the one point five million dollar budget in exchange for foreign distribution rights. Now this is an obvious Omar to the monster movies that. that. You could find in the nineteen fifties, especially creature from the black lagoon as well as Korman's own early film from the fifties called monster from the ocean floor. This one is much more graphic in keeping with the early nineteen eighties. slasher vibes now some will also compare this film to another one that came out in nineteen, sixty, four called the the horror of Party beach. It's kind of obscure to most people today, but in that film there's this nuclear sludge that creates creatures that come out from the ocean to terrorize people on the shore. That's basically the same premise we have here. Although instead of nuclear sludge, we have much more. Genetic experimentation now just the year before a film called alien that had really kind of originally started as no Maget to those nineteen fifties, monster movies, and then it became its own thing, and of course jaws, being the film that really propelled a lot of these films that movie launched a thousand other B. Movies that try to emulate jaws and humanoids takes beats from both alien as well as jaws in many respects here now Barbara Peters the director. She claims that she was offered humanoids from the deep. Deep, which carried the originally the working title of beneath the darkness, because all of the other directors that Roger Corman had asked had turned it down, and first choice for taking it on was the director of Piranha Joe Dante because he was successful with that, and this was very much in keeping with that same vibe, but Dante, you know. He thought that this was essentially. The same story is GonNa with different creatures, so he turned it down, but corman counter. This was actually different than Frana because here. The? Fish were breeding with the humans instead of eating them, although they do kill many of them, but that still wasn't a very persuasive distinction to Donte, who wanted to move onto other things specifically, the howling what you would do, the following year now as Corman was not used to anyone turning him down within his Camp Dante's refusal effectively ended his tenure with neural pictures. He was big enough to move on. On cormon didn't take it personally. He appeared in several Dante projects over the years since then including eight cameo appearance in the howling now other directors also passed on it. They claim that the script wasn't anything that they wanted to do. In fact, a lot of people considered the script to be pretty bad in its original state, but peters. She had worked on a few films under Korman's Production House, but She also didn't think that this was the sort of film that she had experienced or even a desire to make. He was not a fan of horror flicks, but she needed the job she had just taken a year off from directing. She had terminal stage melanoma cancer. She had been put on hiatus by the directors guild of America from working on a union film, pending medical clearance, but to prove to them that she had the stamina to direct a film. She would accept humanoids as her next feature for inspiration as to what to do. She turned to the scariest movie that she had seen as a kid. That aforementioned creature from the Black Lagoon. She analyzed that movie very closely to figure out. Out. How she was going to make her masters scary for the audience, as she got underway with the production, the shoot she found not particularly pleasant. Peters couldn't swim that made being out there in the ocean for some of the scenes very harrowing for her. They shot the water action late November and that's when the water was very much freezing up there. In Northern California, the actors had to swim in that water a lot of the day or stand around, and they were pretty much with Blue Lips, a lot of the time which they had to continue to remedy now while sitting with crew on a barge to get the ocean shots, Peters, and the rest of the crew had a contest. Five dollars that would go to the first person to throw up each day that happened to be a very common occurrence. Now Peters wasn't just squeamish about the water. She also happens to be a major lover of dogs and descript college for several dogs to be viciously killed by these monstrous creatures, which he had a hard time trying to film herself. She said she could deal with the killing of a child that happens in this film and also of all. All of the men and even the sexual violation of the women that happens during this film. But when it came to portray the dog deaths, she left the set when the dogs were shown lying dead on the Docks Hewlett somebody else shoot that even though she knew that these were not real dogs with real deaths now the fight scenes that are in this film. Some rawls proved to be a challenge for her as well not only because there was. Was Not a fight choreographer to appear on the set, but because Vic Moro the actor whose character instigates most of these brawls was a notorious class, and had a very difficult time trying to look coordinated enough to pull off his fighting prowess effectively, so they had him have a gang of other people who would do the fighting for him Doug McClure. He had experience being a stuntman before he would have the action centered around him to try to minimize using. Using Moreover, much more than one well-placed kick during a brawl, both McClure and moral had their own issues during the filming of this, they both suffered from alcoholism, and they could get quite cranky if either of them either had too much or not enough of the alcohol, so they would have to ration them beers every couple of hours throughout the day to keep them from getting too dry or a little too tipsy to make it unpleasant for everybody else. Now during the shoot, Peters did get approved to return back to the directors guild. Expected her at that moment to quit this nonunion film to honor Heard Union, but she would not do that not midstream, and that subsequently caused her to get a fifteen thousand dollar fine from the DJ for making this movie, which really wiped out pretty much what she was making on it Corman. Did tell her that he would cover the fees, but he never did. Get around to it. Ended kind of on bad terms, so it was not something she felt comfortable asking for, but as for the reasons, why ended on bad terms? It's because it started with Peter's turning in her final. The film editor Mark Goldblatt. He was piecing all of this footage together. He was feeling like things were not really popping as they should. Certain coverages were not adequate. The set pieces that Peters had filmed lacked a certain excitement to them so Goldblatt took the footage that he edited together to Roger Cormon to have a look and Corman agreed. It just really was kind of lifeless, so he asked Goldblatt try to cut things. A little bit tighter tried. Tried to punch it up, but even with this the film just was a little bit too tame for the kind of movies that new world was used to putting out and also cutting it up. This much reduced the run time to less than customary at length for them so corman. He said that they needed to add more to this, so he initially told Peters that. They were going to change a few things to enhance not only the visual. Visual effects but to add additional scenes to make this movie much more of a feature length, but as he began to look more closely at what needed to be added, cormon started to zero in on this notion that it was the rape scenes that were too subtle, and that's why it seemed very tame. Peters was pulling away, and she was denying the audience the shock value that should be there, so he wanna Peters to add more footage of. Of the women getting victimized needed, they're close to get ripped off needed to see these creatures, actually going at it with these women but Peters being feminist, she refused to direct rape scenes or overt vehemence against women as part of this pure entertainment flake so Coleman told her that she's not going to do it. He's going to get somebody else to do it. And he laid her outrage in that moment by saying that she was going to be. About the footage that they were going to add to it before it was put out for release, so she consented to at least wait and see Korman immediately he promoted second unit director James Sparta Lottie. He went from the second unit director to the first assistant director, and he filled in these re touches that Corman expected from the film if you look at. There's another director that is credited battle beyond the stars director Jimmy team or a Commie that says that he directed additional scenes, but there's a lot of back and forth to which Jim actually this was aginst Bartolotti or Jim a commie. It depends on where you look somebody. One of them directed additional scenes that included the Salmon Queen. She gets her top ripped off and then attacked by these creatures. There's this assault and a tent, involving a ventriloquist and another. Another woman who would provide a little bit more nudity there, and there's these explicit inserts used for the rape of Peggy played by Lynch. He'll that were also shot and put into this film now Peters didn't actually get to see all of this footage. As it was coming out. In fact, nobody who was in the cast and crew, not involved with those scenes, even saw it until they had previous screening where peters and the rest of the cast solve this. Film and she grew livid at the amount of sex and rape that was injected into her feature, not only because what the added she felt was degrading, but it was also very unnecessary, and she further complained that the new footage doesn't even match a lot of the shots that she had put into her feature for instance in the rape scene of Peggy. She originally had a close up of Peggy just screaming, and then we would see her hand clutching. Clutching very futilely at the sand, so we don't see the actual thing and they made it much more much more graphic than that, so the graphics was the main complaint, but it was not the only thing that peters really disliked. More creatures were added to the first half of this film. They are shown much earlier much more often than they were intended to be. Because in the original script, these creatures will not going to appear until you see the. The final twenty minutes. In fact, the nature of what is killing everyone in the town is kept a complete mystery, and so it was going to be a big reveal that these creatures even exist at least until later in the film. She also did not like the fact that they changed the title beneath the darkness, was now called humanoids from the deep, and with his new title, and with the early appearance of these creatures. There is absolutely no mystery. Mystery no suspense that is afforded. It's replaced all by shock and sensationalism. The scenes that she had in this film. A lot of the character touches dramatic acting. That was being done by these very good set of actors they were all, but completely excised in favor of more horror and more action more mayhem, gratuitous ta all of the stuff that is not even part of the main plot. In fact, the plot is reduced to almost nothing but the bare. Bare essentials, but what upset Peters most of all as she finished watching, the movie was that her name was going to be attached to this Phil rendering film critics and audiences to attach degradation that is found in the movie to her has the person who put it all in there? She wanted her name to be removed or changed. She voiced her opposition to receiving credit for this movie. That would not only upset her fellow feminists, but it was also. Also potentially going to pigeonhole her into this career of just making exploitation films forever, this was what she was going to be known for. Peters was told by Corman. She could have her name removed, but that was only if she was willing to pay for the cost of producing all new credits, a peters decided to let her name stay on the film, but she was going to publicly denounced the objectionable scenes as not her doing when it was finally. Finally released and terkel. She also was outraged during that preview in which he screened it, she decided to join Peters by stating humanoids from the deep was not in any way, which she and the other actors had signed on for this was supposed to be a dark mystery thriller that revealed some science fiction elements in its climax and Terkel, who happened to be married to Richard Harris. They had already known of this happening to other established actors for instance. Instance Peter O'Toole who happen to be a friend of Richard. Harris he had the same thing just happened to him just a couple of years before when they signed on to do a film call Caligula that was made by Penthouse's Bob Guccione into a porno film. She felt that she was being similarly used. AMD betrayed because they were luring good actors in with this other script with a different title with the intent of trying to lend credibility to this. Pornography of sex and violence, and that's not what she originally signed on for g really wanted just to have a starring role that did not include her estranged husband Richard Harris, who by the way announced his intention to divorce terkel partway during the shoot, which was an emotional thing altogether, she also wanted to use this film to dissolve the notion that she succeeded in getting film parts only because of nepotism on the part of Rigid Harris and she also actually really liked the script as well as the mysterious and alluring title of beneath the darkness. Drawn to that title, and her role would be as a scientist, and that would offer her something to portray. That was not emphasizing just her looks, and furthermore she appreciated as well that it had a female director all things that she enjoyed and the being attractive enough to bring aboard other known actors that she wanted to work with Doug McClure and Vic Moro. But now the script had completely changed without our knowledge along with the title, and it was just nothing more than a B. Movie, and they're pretty bad one in her estimation. She absolutely hated this title humanoids from the deep. She stated that if this had been the original title, she never even would have read this script much less signed onto a project with that as the title, she accused Roger. Cormon and the producer Martin Cohen of pudding beneath the darkness on the. The script, and continuing to call it that during the shoot, merely to lure an placate the actors that they had signed on board, she was so incensed by this. She refused when she started to do promotional interviews for the movie. She refused to even say the name of the film if she would tell the person interviewing her not to say the name of the movie, too, and that's something that pretty much upset. Corman who really wanted this film to be successful. Terkel felt that having humanoids from the deep on her resume made her look like somebody who is willing to accept any role to be an any movie. She did not even want to be associated with it. She filed a grievance with the screen. Actors Guild, I to stop the film from being released, because they as actors were being deceived, but if they would do that, she wanted her name removed, but unlike the writers guild which allows screenwriters to change. Change their name from a project when a script changes to their dissatisfaction, no such protection did exist at that time for actors. Now Martin Cohen's shrugged off all of these complaints he said that beneath the darkness was just the working title. It was not set in stone, and when they finally started tinkering with the film beneath artist dot captured what the end product was going to be about so Cohen had consulted with Roger. Corman on switching back to the. The original title that he and intended for this film humanoids humanoids for the deep here because he wanted the audience to better know that this was the kind of movie that they were going to be seeing because beneath the darkness has really no explanation, and people were going to be going into it and completely repulsed by what they saw. If they were thinking, it was going to be just a mystery thriller now as for the nudity, Cohen, did state. State that there was no such thing in his mind as too much TNA well except for having to clear it with the MPAA because they needed to do some toning down of the material, the excessive Gore the rape because it was initially slapped with an x rating, so they had to do a little bit trimming to get it down to an r rating. Cohen does credit. The controversy caused by Terkel for going public generating buzz for the picture so. Even though she was trying to hide the name of the movie, it did give it some buzz. It made it a bigger success because now people were going to want to see what this controversial movie was. So he glibly told the press that Turkey was welcome to get on her so box for any future movies that he produced now. Chris, Wallace was originally the first person that the asked to do. Do the makeup effects for this movie, but he was busy on a few other projects, so he didn't know if he was going to have the time, so he suggested that they go to Rob Bouteine. For this film rubber team famously in fact I talked about him a couple of episodes ago, he did work on Piranha so a natural choice there now, Boutin initially declined the offer. He thought that the. The title humanoids seemed like it was Z.. Great Flick, but Korman said that the title actually had just changed to beneath the darkness, and they had redone everything to be a much more classy production. They were going to bring in a female director, but bouteine signed on, he made a very good handsome costume over the sweat suit to play the monster. He was going to be in costume himself. He's six. Six foot five so very imposing a lot like Ridley Scott's alien very much not seen fully until very late in the picture they did manage to get Chris Wallace to come aboard to do some additional work. As this film progressed, he designed the extended arms to attach to this costume Ken, Myers also came in, and he sewed all of the pieces together for the suit and they were asked to. To craft and enhance additional suits that weren't as intricate, but the could work in the background because they were going to add more and more creatures through clever editing through mirrors, they manage to make three humanoid suits seem like they're actually dozens of them on the shore humanoids. They were ugly. They're not particularly scary. I think by today's standards. They do have those long arms. These exposed brains for heads and. and they used hemp fiber, resembling seaweed all over the body to try to cover up some of the seams and the joint work, and they had to really be on the ball. The make up team was never given a script, so they had no idea what they were going to be asked to do. From day to day, everything had to be done in a very short amount of time be. Be. Pretty much the same day. A fake dead dog that they were asked to be put into this film had to be thrown together with whatever materials that they could for a single shot now one day into the shoot, things started to get a little bit sour for Boutin. He was a pretty much a young man. Nineteen twenty years old. He came to the set one day and he was told. told, get right down to the beach. And he was asked to rip off the top from a lintel, missed July nineteen, seventy five. She's credited as Lynn chiller for this film. He was supposed to tear off her top, and then push himself on top of her to simulate a rape sequence, which made Boutin very very uncomfortable and he questioned. How like Korman said this was going to be classy film. What is going on with beneath the darkness? But he was later told by the replacement director four peters that they were in fact, changing the title to humanoids from the deep, and the movie story was going to be a much different vibe, so he pretty much was stuck. They're doing what they asked him to do. The suits were very uncomfortable for Boutin and his other actors to perform in in addition to being asked to do things that they didn't want or like to do these suits. Themselves were hard to get on and off. They had hinges to keep the tail on place, so it didn't. Didn't allow them to sit down for hours, and and it was comfortably hot, and when they had the extensions on their arms. They couldn't even use their hands, so they pretty much had to stand around doing nothing until they were asked to do something that they didn't even want to perform as he was not too happy with what happened here, this would be the last film Boutin. Ever did for Roger Corman in his career boat. He would go on to say that he just wanted to forget. This film ever existed, and he does not understand when he's asked about it in interviews. Why some? Some people actually like it now as for the themes, obviously, this is a movie that has some things to say underneath rural blue collar families and their reliance on certain industries for their survival. You can look at the corporate mindset how making a profit comes above the environment you know this is metaphorically embodied in the ugliness that occurs to the ocean, due to the growth tampering of this company, trying to make easy money by tampering with nature, and then these humanoid creatures that come out. They're toxic to the community. A lot like pollution is in real life killing these creatures. The don't life that they. They find there before taking the residents of the community down, the community is proverbially raped by this company, and then killed by the lack of concern of the environment. There's also this message I think underneath about the futility of prejudice, and when we should be finding on the same side to conquer these ills before they conquer all of us, we shouldn't let these things divide us for money's sake. humanoids from the deep despite its controversy despite its low budget, despite the director and one of the main actors not wanting to promote this film still managed to be successful at grossed about three million dollars. In the United States off that one point five billion dollar budget it was released subsequently overseas in parts of Europe as well as in Japan where it was especially successful because the Japanese like this kind of movie, which very much echoes, a lot of Japanese films to begin with, and they proved to be pretty kit for Corman overall, and eventually took on a status on video and in cable showings now, although a lot of viewers are going. Going to find aspects of humanoids from the deep to imporant to enjoy in fact I would probably caution anybody who's not into these gory B. Movies to steer away from it, because it's really the kind of movie that a lot of people will not enjoy if they don't like this exploitative cinema, but if you do happen to like that, there is an audience for this if you like Gore, if you like graphic violence if you like. Random acts of mayhem. You certainly are GonNa. Get that here and you're not put off a lot of this cheap exploitation. There are some recommendable parts to this film that make it a cut above a lot of other movies of this type affect. The performance is here. They brought in some good actors, so they're performances are objectively fine. Vic Morrow is in particular, pretty menacing as the town's bad guy. Does it well? The cinematography here is actually to actually looks very good for something made very cheaply, and they got aboard before he was famous Academy Award. Future Academy Award Winner James Horner some of his promising early work. You will hear here because he composes the Mesmerizing score of this film at Peter's. Peter's request Horner created a very piercing sound for the Shriek of the humanoids as well as delivering this very interesting score for this kind of movie now. I'M NOT GONNA. Say that this is a a good film. It is good for people who like this kind of bad film. I will say when it's bad. It is very bad, but it does have enough of those good elements I think to keep it from being a bottom of the barrel entertainment. There are things here that recommendable now in a twist of irony, many many many years later. Barbara Peters did catch humanoids from the deep one day on Cable and she admitted in an interview that she thought it actually turned out to be. Be Contrary to her. AB- HORRI- at the time of its released to what was being done to it. It holds up as a fun little movie, so she has come to a certain peace with it, even though it was taken out of her hands and changed in a way, she definitely did not like at the time now as far as what I give it. I'm going to give it pretty much to stars. I think the highest I would give this film. Even though I do recognize, there is a specific audience that will very much enjoy this kind of movie if you're into Gore into violence into this kind of creature features, you know you don't have any expectations of a good film. Film you just want to have some good escapist. Nasty entertainment certainly humanoids from the deep will fit the bill for you, but I think most general movie. Going audiences will be very much turned off by what they see here in humanoids from the deep. So that's why, even though there are some recommendable pieces to this film. I'm going to caution the majority away, but I still will give it enough stars to suggest that this is not that bad. If you examine it with some objectively, so stars is what I'm going to give humanoids from the deep also known as Monster, depending on where you live now as far as what happened after this, you might find interesting and Turkey would become friends. In their defiance of this film. She would collaborate with Barbara Peters. They wanted to start their own production company called M and g productions or J. prods, and terkel was set to appear for that company in a film that Peters would write and produce and direct called brother sister, but it never did get me barbed. Peters also would write a screenplay for a movie that. That was going to be entitled. The Indian that sold the Brooklyn Bridge was going to star Turco's husband Richard Harris, but that also didn't get made. Obviously, terkel and Harris were divorcing, so humans would mark Peters last credited film to be released in theaters, although she did direct some TV through the first half of the nineteenth as a Lotta. TV actually now a sequel. Sequel script was spearheaded by Martin become. The producer sold off to Mongolian and his new production. House called Twenty first century production that was in the early nineteen ninety S, and it was going to be directed by a visual Effects Guru who had never directed film before called Kevin Pike Pike Co wrote the script with Stanley Isaacs. It was going to be called humanoids from. From the deep to the next generation, this feature promised humanoids had learned in the interim, the ability to talk, so we were going have humanoids here, but the project did fall through when Golan's company started to encounter a string of financial failures, and they could not put the money necessary behind humanoids from the deep to there was a remake that did get made though. In Nineteen, ninety-six directed and written by Jeff Yoenis, and at started MSM's and Robert Carradine and that was part of the Roger Corman presents series for showtime, the same one that remade Parana for that cable channel. So if you WANNA see the same thing done not quite as good I suppose you can check that out as well if you're interested in continuing the series from here, but since it's from. From the Mid Nineteen Ninety S I am not going to be talking about that. In fact, I'm going to get into another trilogy coming up and the first film I'm going to be talking about after this one is a movie that is set in the water, and it does have genetic mutations as part of its main plot. Just like this one, it is from the opposite side of the nineteen. Nineteen eighty s from humanoids from the deep from nineteen, eighty nine I'll be talking about Leviathan for the next episode. So if you haven't seen by than now, these are not generally considered to be very good movies, so if you don't see it I, suppose I could forgive you, but if you WANNA. Keep up with the movies before we get to the reviews, you should check out Leviathan or next. Next week from nine hundred eighty nine now. If you have your own thoughts on humanoids from the deep, you can go to my website. Stir dot to write to me. Find links to my twitter feed facebook page instagram to follow me or contact me there, too. If you so desire until next time, thank you so much for listening and joining me on this trip around the world in eighties movies.

Barbara Peters Roger Corman director terkel Korman Doug McClure rape Gore Peter O'Toole Vic Moro Vic Morrow Film Review Cannery Anthony Pena directors guild Richard Harris William Martin Martin Cohen Black Lagoon Frederick James
The Evil to Come

Dateline NBC

41:54 min | 10 months ago

The Evil to Come

"What she saw was a nightmare. She screamed and she yelled and she cried terrible. Did she fall down the steps? No one was thinking someone did this to her but did someone do this to her and it just unraveled from that moment on. I went screaming out of the House. This was prominent women murdered in a home late at night. Almost certainly someone jeanette correct this horrible. I lost my mother and now the fingers being pointed me you pull them out and you told police. Oh you're gonNA find my fingerprints on. The knife for the safe from online is that I would be a suspect or my wife of suspect. What's going on here? How many people are involved in this devious? He's evil mine. Someone just doesn't turn into a minor. What pushed you this far. It was hard to look away when he was in the picture. Her beauty was captivating but she was also smart and vicious and she loved that little girl. Peggy nails image survives in home movies and in memory from the days when she was relishing. Motherhood blissfully unaware of the evil to come. I was with my mother. Always Suzanne Needles Casio. Was that little girl and says her mom. Eggy was everything. A mother should be a child. I ice skated. My mother would sit in the rink. And she'd sit there with a code on all bundled up shivering Suzanne and her younger brother. Jim grew up in suburban Rockland. County about forty five minutes north of New York City. We were able to go away to sleep away camp when we were little. My parents traveled at first. Iggy did what many women did in the nineteen sixties? She stayed at home while her husband rob headed off to work. But Peggy was drawn to something bigger than her suburban sanctuary. When Suzanne was young her mom was back in school earning her MBA. She was probably one of the few women in the in the graduating class. Remember wanted to a man's business ends this somewhere very hard much like the fictional character. Peggy Olson in the hit series. Mad Men the real life. Peggy broke the glass ceiling at Xerox and became a rare member of the executive boys club and Martin was in that club to have too many female managers and Peggy. She rose very quickly because she was very intelligent and always well dressed. Peggy were a lot of black love to dress and where the latest fashions unlike her fashionable mom. Suzanne was a blue jeans and t shirt kind of girl Suzanne and he explained Suzanne just quirky. She's outgoing she's Athletic Dorsey. Greenberg is one of the Suzanne's best friends she spontaneous. She's talkative she also likes to be close to home after college. She came back to Rockland County and went to work at Xerox herself. One night in a bar. Suzanne twenty-one fell four. Well actually fell over a seventeen year old race car driver name Bobby Casio. She actually stepped on the I was. We were falling around then. I somehow wild up slipping on the floor. She's picked me up then We saw each other and Started talking thirteen years later. Suzanne and Bobby who was by then. A welder and steam fitter were married. Peggy was okay about it. Let's not unreasonable to believe that. Maybe she was kind of hoping that her daughter would marry a guy wore a suit to work. I think so I think Yeah I think. He was hoping for our Harvard son-in-law but she got a son-in-law from the that went to the school of hard knocks. You know. Bobby made a good son-in-law he was always there for Peggy especially after her husband died in two thousand three by then. Peggy was retired but never slowed down traveling the world and treasuring her family her son. Jim was now a psychologist living in Florida with his wife Diana and their two children. I get the sense that Jim was not as close to your parents as you were. I'll agreed why would that be? Maybe because of the distance that he was so far away he did call. He did speak to them but my brother is my brother. He kind of lived in his own world but Suzanne and her mom. We're very much in the same world often. Did you see your mom almost every day? Suzanne always on the road for her work as marketer for hospital would often drop in on her mom and when she wasn't visiting she be calling speak to her in the afternoon and evening make sure she was home. So it's almost like you're sort of the parent and she was the kid you're checking up on her lap -solutely life was good for this family until one morning in. January of two thousand fourteen. Suzanne went to check on her mother. I'd need any everything. Changed will the heartbreaking discovery that set a mystery emotion. I was screening. Suzanne is in the driveway looking rather frazzled. The first thought was Oh my God. She tripped and she must have hit her head. No way did she fall downstairs Saturday January twenty fifth. Two thousand fourteen started off cold and snowing. Suzanne says her day started off as it nearly always did calling her mother. Peggy called the cell. She didn't answer. I call the house. She didn't answer. I said I. Maybe she's in the bathroom or she went out into the garage for something. Suzanne who lives in a suburb of New York City called Diana her sister-in-law in Florida. And I said have you spoken with Mommy this morning? She says you know other at seven thirty and I haven't heard back from her now worried. Suzanne gotten her car and drove to Peggy's house as I'm driving calling the house to sell the house this up no answer and now. I'm getting panicking. I pull into her driveway and I saw the roof of her car through the garage door. I said Oh this is not going to be good. She was right. Suzanne says she found Peggy crumpled at the bottom of the stairs with a knife in her chest and I thought was. Oh my God. She tripped on the cat and fell unstuck herself then. She says she saw the blood. I said Oh my God. She must have hit her head when she fell. And then Suzanne did something that would later raise a number of questions. I pulled a knife I was GONNA do. Cpr You pull them out of her. If your mother was lying there was something sticking out of that was hurting her. What would you do Yvonna make that hurt go away? Could you tell is used in her law when I touched her neck and she was Kinda Colt. Suzanne ran out of the House and called nine. One one I was screening. I'm sure the neighbors that were around hurt. I need one calm down. What's going on there? I mean my mother died when I am in Standard Gel. Suzanne was right about one thing. Piggy needle was dead. Her next call was to her brother Jim in Florida. I called my brother's house. He didn't answer. I Call Diana on herself and I said Mommy's gone. And she started screaming at the other end of the phone. What he me. Mommy Scott I said she's gone. She died something happened she died. She would Clarksdale police. Detective Stephen Cole. Hatchard and Earl Lawrence were on the scene. They noticed that Suzanne looked a wreck standing in front of the house in the snow. Suzanne is in the driveway at the foot of the driveway. Kind of pacing looking rather frazzled. She told detectives what she told the nine. One one operators peggy tripped over the cat. Her mother must've tumbled down the stairs and stabbed herself with the night. While detective Cole Hatchard stayed outside with Suzanne detective. Lawrence went inside the house. This is police video of the scene taken that morning. Lawrence knew right away. This was no accident no way. Did she fall downstairs and tripped over a cap? The ticket Lawrence Song Hegi had been strangled then stamped and it also looked as if she'd been beaten with a statute head found her body and a gold medal ball near the crime. Scene itself was very concentrated. Everything was at the bottom of the stairs and in the bedroom upstairs. Something else caught. The detectives attention to cheers. Were pulled out of the kitchen table. As if Peggy had been sitting and talking with someone Peggy's computer wallet and jewelry. Were missing jewelry. Box Lay near a chair in the living room. Empty but Earl Lawrence. The burglary looked phony staged of the bedroom drawers. There were neatly pulled out neatly placed on the floor in front of the dresser at normal burglary. Scenes stuff is everywhere. People go through tornado correct and this wasn't a break and enter job. Police could tell that when they looked at the fresh snow outside the house there was one set of footprints and now is the responding officer checking the perimeter of the home. So nothing suggesting that. Somebody walked around case. The place was in the front door. Hadn't been Jimmy or broken. In which king in deadbolt in the front door that's required to open the door from the inside and that was in a lock meaning begging from inside that afternoon. Detectives brought Suzanne on her husband. Bobby to the police station and started asking questions. Suzanne told them contractors had been doing work on paintings bathroom and that Peggy also had landscapers and a cleaning woman working for. I'm guessing you guys spent some significant time and effort running down all the people who worked on the House. Absolutely any of that go anywhere. Dozens of people not a thing who would want to kill pegging a Dell and why assistant district attorney. Richard Moran thought he had an answer for that second question. The match Lucia was in pretty good shape Very good shape. He and her late husband had built quite a large nest egg. All in all the estate ended up being worth about four million dollars. Well you've probably seen people killed for a lot less a lot less and who would stand to benefit? I felt very early that it was most likely a female a closer look at Suzanne. You pull the knife out and you tell the police right away. Oh you're gonNA find my fingerprints on the knife. A few million motives for murder by mothers worth high seven figures. This is not the way I wanted to get my main. That's the exact word. She used taking a Dell had been murdered in her home in suburban Rockland. County New York Detective Stephen Cole. Hatchard and Earl Lawrence say the team from the crime lab had shaken. Peggy's house to its foundation looking for a lead forensically. You guys get almost nothing off the same not almost nothing nothing fingerprints. Dna DNA o'clock no hair. Nothing but the scene did tell them something. I felt very early on that. It was most likely female or two females. What point being willing the fact that there was seven or eight lacerations on Peggy's skull from the statue head. That statue is heavy. An effective weapon in strong hands. My non medical opinion is that if she was hitting the head with that statuette by a man or head would have hidden a man would have been able to swing statuette harder one or two times at the most and all of that pointed straight to pay his daughter. Suzanne not only did Suzanne inherit half of her mother's four million dollar estate. Detectives thought her behavior was suspicious. From the moment they arrived on the scene she sang. My fingerprints are all over the knife. My DNA's all over inside the house. And she was telling detectives the same thing she said during the nine one one call that it was an accident and then Standard Gel in one one call. You are offering a theory of what happened. That's very unusual. I thought chief out secondly you pull the knife out and you tell the police right away. Oh you're gonNA find my fingerprints on the knife which sounds like somebody who's thinking ahead to the fact that that knives get dusted for fingerprints. Would you not agree that all of that is pretty suspicious when taken together? Maybe to them wasn't to me. I mean obviously. They formed an opinion from the GECKO. Detectives thought this was awed as well. She said listen. Maybe this was a burglary check for a large ring a laptop and jewelry. And I call into earl earl check for those three things. He called me back and said hey pretty much the only three things missing I asked about jewelry. I asked about a wallet credit cards if they said it's you know somebody murdered her. Why why was it a robbery so here you are offering theories again then again. In those first few moments Suzanne started talking about Peggy's money one of the things she yelled out was my mother's worth high seven figures and this is not the way I wanted to get my money. That's the exact word she used. The swollen wants to talk her way right. Say Yeah absolutely at one point. You said this not how I wanted to get my money. I don't recall saying that. But if they have that on record but you believe me that that's what you told plays because again you're answering a question of police haven't even asked. You. I guess I watch too. Many of those dateline shows in the middle of the night. Detectives had already talked with Suzanne and her husband. Bobby on the day of the murder questioned them for hours. But you had nothing to worry about now. No not at all not at all farthest thing from my mind is that I would suspect or my wife of suspect. Police were feeling differently and as their scrutiny intensified bobby and Suzanne decided to hire an attorney. There was a point at which you and your wife stopped cooperating with police and hired attorney. We didn't stop cooperating with the police. That's what they want you to believe anything they wanted to know. All they had to do was ask my attorney about that. Oh absolutely absolutely. She was scared that they were GonNa try and pin it on her once again. Suzanne was right. We had we believed probable cause to arrest Suzanne. We just couldn't do it because something's wrong. What's wrong I mean everything? Points at her would have been easy way out to do that too early. Sometimes you get a ground ball. Wasn't this would be no easy out. Detectives would be going into extra innings. The two final phone calls of pegging Adele's life. One came from a secret. Phone is the phone's used by drug dealers killers cheating spouses. Exactly could that call her? Be the killer. Four days pegging Adele's murder family and friends gathered for her funeral for Peggy's daughter Suzanne. It was all a blur. What's it like to process both the fact that your mom was actually murdered? And you're the suspect was horrible. Horrible lost my mother. I lost my best friend and now the fingers being pointed at me as eight-year-old Pegging Adele was laid to rest today. Her daughters Scott has hired a lawyer people in the area. It's all they talked about. Suzanne's friend Dorsey. Greenberg was hearing it almost every day. There were people who said she did it. Oh she did it. Even I heard a neighbor yelled out. When are you going to arrest her for killing her mother? I mean this is someone that probably us and she was a child. Dorsey was convinced. Suzanne loved her mother and would never have heard her. She was grieving. She was crying every day. She could barely get out of bed. She couldn't sleep at night. Bills murder was now the biggest case ever to hit the Clark's down Police Department the whole detective bureau on this and some other agencies and I've never seen them work harder on anything in my life perhaps because police couldn't talk with Suzanne. They stayed very close to her. And her husband Bobby and very visible. They parked outside my house and sat. When I left left when I came home they came. They were following my husband. Did you think police were gonNA come zone you yes I did. I was sad and I was scared. Police even looked into Suzanne's shopping habits and found something that intrigued them. Suzanne bought her groceries at a nearby shoprite. A big supermarket chain in fact. She was a creature of habit visiting there. Twenty two times in the month prior to Peggy's murder but on the twenty third time the night before Peggy's murder Suzanne shopped at a different store the one near her mother's house. What she by. She cleaning supplies rubber gloves and some other items like that had the crime scene been cleaned up. Detectives didn't think so but still found it suspicious just before your mother was murdered. You go to the shop right not the one near your house. The one of your mother's house and you buy rubber gloves and cleaning supplies. Did I mean by cleaning supplies all the time have a cleaning girl? She probably needed rubber gloves. She probably needed floor cleaner. That's interesting they knew what I bought and tickets wanted to know more about who peggy might have had contact with in the hours before her murder so they made this list of numbers they found on. Peggy's home fall as they looked at them. One stood out. It was a call from an odd area code and came in at one seventeen in the morning that was from turned out to be a track phone to commonly referred to his burner. Phones are throwaway phones. These are the phones used by drug dealers killers cheating spouses. Exact a few minutes after that track phone. Call the alarm at Peggy's front door whose trip and at one twenty three a m. The alarm company called the monitoring centre with bullets curious. This is pegging Adele. Leigh Yes code. Word is Amac's I'm sorry that's okay Ma'am on recurring. Glad everything's okay. We'll regard for you have a good night. It was probably the last time. Peggy's voice was heard by anyone except her killer. Police were convinced. Still arkansas-based Peggy was leading in someone ci new Suzanne. Maybe but why would she use a track phone to get her mom to open the door in the middle of the night? She wouldn't have to let me in. I have a king and I know how to work the alarm. Police had warrants for all the family members phones and a few weeks later. They had boxes of records to comb through detectives analysed. Suzanne's I what could you tell about Suzanne from her cell phone records ally investigator? Rahman areas from the West Chester County. Da's office specializes in phone data analysis. I've I've figured out a pattern of Suzanne's laugh just based on her records and on the day of Peggy's murder that day was like every other day in Suzanne's laugh there was not change for that particular day and you'd expect to see a change of somebody was in the process of committing murder for the first time correct. Correct suggesting she's innocent either. She's innocent or she has another fireman or they certainly wasn't communication. That indicated that something was going to happen as hot as detectives were on Suzanne's trail. They had never stopped looking at the other members of Peggy's immediate family. You took the Payson Jim and his wife. Diana wrapped the murder. Yes when they came up they lived in Florida. Correct were they in Florida Order Jim Wasn't Florida and Diana said she was in DC. Why would you say said there was a family wedding? And the records back that up when Robin areas looked at Jim Cell Phone. It never left. Florida Diana's phone records. Check out to. Where was Diana's fall during that time in DC? Let's move if I went to DC went back to Florida. Dan Never left his absolutely. You're smiling the it was just a break. The pattern just was off. Diana's records were speaking areas and detectives were about to get a break that would shift the direction of the entire investigation. Let's just say this case was about to go south that secret burner phone. Who BOUGHT IT? Who used it get ready for a whole new circle of suspects? So what's going on here? How many people are involved in this? The question of the day. Hi Everyone. It's Chris Matthews this week on my podcast so you want to be president. I talk with Pulitzer Prize. Winning historian Jon Meacham and former Merlin Congresswoman Donna Edwards about winning campaigns. That make on the spot calls that put candidates on the right side of history search for C. A. Wouldn't it be president wherever you're listening right now? And Subscribe Detectives Working on Pegging. Adele's murder had been looking at her daughter Suzanne. But now they were also looking at Peggy's daughter-in-law Diana Diana and Peggy's son. Jim had been married for seventeen years and well. He may not have been that close to his mother. Diana was always on the phone. I sister in law used to call every morning. She my mother would be on the phone with me and say oh I gotta go. Diana's calling on the other line there. Anna was a stay at home. Mom with two kids Leah and Harris. Peggy doted on her grandchildren and would fly them up to New York to spend summers and holidays. Detectives had already confirmed. That Diana's cell phone had been in Washington. Dc At the time of the murder but when phone analyst Robin areas looked more closely. At Diana's calling pattern. Something seemed off when she was in. Dc. Her activity was just all over the Place de Frenetic fill. It was definitely something going on now. Areas look at WHO? Diana was calling putting names and faces to the numbers on her phone. She noticed Diana suddenly seemed to have a lot of new friends in Washington. Dc A lot of people just popped up in Dinas life for a very brief migrants areas calls them frequent users people. Diana was calling repeatedly what was interesting to me about. These frequent uses is that they had such different lives. Very Anna was a suburban mom. And some of these people well a lot of them had criminal histories living in DC REMEMBER. Diana had been in DC for a wedding. Maybe these people were you know those friends of the groom you have to invite. The detectives got the Guest List. And not enough that high frequency. Call us at the wedding. None of those people. When areas looked at the Hannah's phone records on the night of the murder Friday night into Saturday morning the time of the homicide it was very little activity on. F. I look eerily quiet. What did that? Mean Diana's phone had been in DC. That looked like a dead end. So detectives went back to that track phone that had called. Peggy's house moments before her murder. The kind of phone you can buy for cash activate from almost anywhere and then dumb when you're done a lot of times that's a dead end a lot of times but not this time to figure it out. Detectives began by using the track. Phone number defined waiter. The phone had been sold. And where was the purchase family dollar store in Miami Florida Miami two miles? From Diana's home detectives contacted the family dollar chain and got very very lucky family. Dollar was able to give them security video of someone buying a track phone on January twenty third just two days before Peggy was murdered Diana on the tape it doesn't appear so so under the RAV. No no because the woman buying the phone was someone. Detectives recognized not Diana Definitely Not Diana who is carrying him Samuel. How did they know who she was? Karen Ham with somebody I had already profiled as a person who came up frequently. On Diana's call records. She was a high frequency caller. So you've got a friend of Diana's buying the disposable phone that called Peggy just before she was killed yeah. There was a big moment now. They knew who had bought the phone. The next step was to figure out who turned the track phone on track. Phones needs to be activated using another phone to call an eight hundred number after three weeks. Detective Cole Hatchard finally persuaded a track phone manager to give him this piece of paper. He had circled phone number. And it was the number that called activate that travel. Whose number was that Andrea Batson named surface before. Yes absolutely. All over Diana's phone records. She was one of those people who popped into Diana's life when Diana was in DC and Benson had a rap sheet. So what's going on here? How many people are involved in this? That's the question of the day the other big question. What did they an-and Adele do while she was in Washington? Dc detective started with our arrival at Reagan National Airport. Nine thirty Friday morning the day before Maggie was murder we at the video from the airport to follow her through the airport and then follow her outside to where she got into a car. Here's video of Diana being picked up curbside. Who picks her up Andrea Bendtsen? How do you know Zander Bentson? It's her car registered to her. You can read a license plate cameras pretty good. Detectives obtained data from Cell Phone Towers in Washington. Dc that allowed them to map the travel of the cell phones as they pinged off the towers. Can you follow? Diana's cell? Phone bounced all around Washington. Dc simultaneously with Andreas. They were together the entire day by late Friday the night peggy was murdered. Diana's phone stopped moving and went quiet but Andrea phone. We saw Andrea's phone head out of the Washington area and head up. I ninety five th exactly what you would dry if you were heading for. Peggy's house along the way. The track phone was activated and at one seventeen an it pinged the cell tower. Right near Peggy's house. What was going on? Was this murder for hire did Andrea Benson drive up to New York. Call Peggy on the track. Phone somehow get into her house and then murder her assistant. The Moran didn't think so Hegi would never have let a stranger like Andrea Benson either house. So that had to be a friendly voice on the phone yes. Detectives thought that voice might have belonged to Diana but they had nothing to put her on. The scene in Peggy's house at this point is Susannah. The Hook Diana's now the higher suspect. Suzanne wasn't off the hook. They could be in this together. Yes that's where it was because they both benefited absolutely now. Eight weeks into the investigation. Detectives still didn't know who would kill pegging Adele with suspects in Florida. Dc AND NEW YORK. Detectives came up with a new strategy. And they're fooled expert. Liked it a lot gutsy? I mean a lot of people. Don't go to those lengths on a homicide case. I thought it was brilliant strategy but would it solve the case. Did you have anything to do with your mother's murder? The daughter or daughter in law was one of them the killer. I'll God her. Eyes are probably bill as big as the headlights Volkswagen Beetle. Three months after the murder of her mother Suzanne made else Gasio was still saying she was innocent and she couldn't believe she was ever a suspect. You won't stay long time sometimes as you know people look guilty. But they're really not. Are you in custody right now now? Were you ever arrested now? Did you have anything to do with your mother's murder now? Deep into the investigation of Peggy Natal's murder. The prime suspect was no longer her daughter Suzanne. It was her daughter in law. Diana Diana had told police from the beginning that she'd been in Washington. Dc TO ATTEND A wedding. Her Alibi was wobbling. Diana couldn't account for her time in DC. She hit Washington at about nine thirty and didn't reappear again until about eight o'clock the next morning so the tickets called Diana asking her to fill in the gaps. I just have to confront from Washington is. There's somebody talking that's what we had to keep it real simple with her. Listen we just WanNa get you cleared. would just spend the night. What did they not tell? Diana detectives had a warrant and they were tapping her phone. Police now sat back and listened as Diana multiple calls to people. She knew in DC as she tried to find someone anyone who would say they were with her in Washington at the time of Peggy's murder will she ever successful enough to find somebody to say. Yes I will say Diana that you were with me. Yes she did. Yes which was her third attempt. Detectives were Diana Taylor female friend to say Diana had been at her house in DC but the woman seemed confused was not in the morning at nine at night six. Actually okay. This organized crime not the most intelligent people involved. I don't believe sure enough when detectives call Diana's friend. Here's what she said to Diane. Stay overnight with you shoot. Shoot Looping clockers she of course detectives already knew. The woman was lying and that was trying to cover her tracks. But they still didn't have enough to charge Diana so they headed to Miami to speak with. Diana's friend bought that track full Karen Hamson. They brought Karen into Miami Police Headquarters for questioning. Karen admitted she bought up track phone for Diana and then they asked her if Diana had said about pig tails murder answer. Lewa she was prosecutor Richard Moran. Was there listening in another room. That's the first time we have first hand information on that. Diana was in the house before long. Diana was in that same Miami Interrogation Room where she recognized some familiar faces. She probably wasn't pleased to see and she knew why they were there. Yes it was and after five months. Their investigation was about to end. Burger that same day. Another team arrested Andrea Benson in DC. The tech is lawrence. Coal Hatchard were confident. They have the right people in custody and that Suzanne was finally off the hook. She heard the news from relatives. They said they arrested Diana from from my mother's murder and that there were other people involved in it and I was shocked. Suzanne says her mom had been sending money to Diana regularly to pay for home repairs and expenses for the kids. But she says Diana wanted more see live my mother's life dwell on things that she couldn't afford to do and to do that alter the news enlist help of a few friends and commit a murder. Detectives did not think Jim knew anything about his wife's deadly plan for his mother. And what exactly was her plan. Diana had stopped talking. Ask for a lawyer. But her friend Andrea Benson did talk and toll. Da Richard Moran the whole Sordid Tale Andrea. Said she had never met Diana before and had been told by a relative to pick Diana up at the airport and as they were driving Diana Dell said to her. I'm not really here to go to a wedding. I'm really here to kill. My mother-in-law she says is to a person she's never met before. Yes and Andrew Benson says okay. I'm in for ten thousand dollars an right there. The deals done in that car and the plan starts taking shape. Benson said she drove the four hours up to Peggy's house and then Diana used that track phone and called her mother-in-law Ianna tells her I'm here. Don't you miss me? I WANNA come see you at one. Thirty in the morning and piglets are in Benson said she went in with Diana. They were wearing hairnets and gloves to keep from leaving evidence. Diana Peggy sat across from one another and talked Benson said at one point pegging went upstairs. Perhaps to call for help. She and Diana followed her. That as Peggy came back downstairs that's when Andrea Benson started choking Andrea said. Peggy was still alive when Diana hit her mother-in-law with a metal ball and beat her with that statute head. Andrew Benson's words where she wouldn't die at that point. According to Andrew Benson Diana Dell went into the kitchen got a knife came over and started stabbing peggy injury. Benson pleaded guilty to first degree murder. The sentence was twenty to life. Is the woman who bought the TRACK PHONE KAREN? Hand Samuel was never charged with anything. Dan apparently not content to wait in jail for trial was caught on tape. Trying to arrange for Hitman to kill Karen Ham Samuel in Miami absolute pro after that Diana also pleaded guilty to first degree murder. Dan did not respond to our requests for an interview. She did speak on the day. She received a sentence of twenty three years to life. Very sorry for Lash and that I am extremely sorry for any pain. 'cause especially to my husband. Suzanne was there at sentencing. You took away wonderful mother and Graham and you're going to die out. I hope you say prison until you take you all enjoy on mother's Day Suzanne and Bobby went to visit graph close. Finally it was all over. He kind of look at life a little bit differently. You know life is very valuable respective. You don't really special for yourself. Treated myself to a car. She's a fancy German lady that likes to go fast. My mother always said spend a little. Enjoy your money. You'll have mine someday. Who knew that someday was going to be so so soon. The meet the Press Chuck Todd Cast. It's an insider's take on politics. Twenty twenty election and more candid conversations with some of my favorite reporters about things. We usually discuss off camera. Listen for free wherever you get your podcast.

Diana Peggy Diana Diana Suzanne murder Bobby Casio Jim DC Diana Adele Peggy Olson Florida Andrew Benson Diana Dell Richard Moran Detective Cole Hatchard Andrea Benson Washington Diana Dell Miami New York City
Scandal 18: The Eaton Affair

Political Scandals

46:20 min | 5 months ago

Scandal 18: The Eaton Affair

"In the year leading up to the twenty twenty election, we're counting down the biggest scandals in American political history. This is number eighteen. The eaten affair. It was a brisk morning in Washington DC as President Andrew. Jackson ushered his cabinet members into a White House meeting room, among them were special guests. Reverend's Ezra, stiles, ely and John in Campbell. They had been invited to consult on an issue of moral delicacy. Notably, missing was Jackson's own vice president. John C Calhoun who had retreated back to his plantation home in South Carolina with his spouse. Secretary of war John Eaton was also absent, but he hadn't been invited. As the topic at hand was his wife with palpable discomfort, the group began to discuss whether Eaton's new bride Peggy was a woman with an adulterous past. Jackson defended her. The president was in sense that sect a dear lady. The wife of one of his closest friends could be victim to cruel accusations. But despite his best arguments, the room was divided. Both reverends and several cabinet members remained convinced that the gossip surrounding Peggy Eaton was true. That she was indeed a scarlet woman. Welcome to political scandals apar- cast original. I'm Richard and I'm kate. You can find all episodes of political scandals and all other park assist originals for free on spotify of our ever you listen to podcasts to stream political scandals for free on spotify just open the APP and type political scandals in the search bar. Today. We're talking about the eaten affair. A real housewives of Washington DC TALE THAT LED president. Andrew Jackson to force the resignations of nearly all of his cabinet members. Will get into the drama right after this. If Capitol Hill had a menu in the eighteen hundreds it signature dish would have been a salacious stew of gossip and government the eaten. There was no exception mixing hearsay with political fallout. That would shape America's future. However the instigators of this particular affair weren't the surly wig. Glad males of Washington but ladies and petticoats. Roasting one woman in particular Peggy Eaton, the daughter of a Scots Irish innkeeper from Washington DC. Her exclusion by political society would inspire both the downfall of an executive cabinet and the making of a future president. But to set the context for the vicious rumors surrounding Peggy. Let us. I meet her predecessor. President Jackson's wife Rachel Jackson. Rachel Donelson robards Jackson was a divorce say the former wife of a gentleman named Lewis robards. After three unhappy years of marriage, the pair separated in Seventeen, ninety and twenty year old Rachel returned to her family's estate in Nashville Tennessee. Accompanying her on the journey home was twenty three. Andrew Jackson. The pair quickly fell in love and were married in seventeen ninety one. But just two years into their nuptial bliss, they received some shocking news. robards had not finalized the divorce after all legally. He and Rachel were still married. The situation wasn't totally unheard of at the time. Divorce proceedings were imprecise, often due to shifting territories and differing state laws. This was evidenced in the reaction or lack thereof from Nashville Society to the couple's plight. They didn't find the Jackson situation much to gossip about. Rachel's divorced from robards was swiftly finalized, and she and Andrew Jackson quietly renewed their vows. Nevertheless after thirty three happy years of marriage, their past came back to haunt them. Jackson's eighteen, twenty eight presidential campaign will be covered in a future episode, but suffice it to say. A lot of mud was slung between Jackson's nascent Democratic Party and its rivals, the sitting president, John Adams and the National Republican Party. Jackson's opponents emphasized his famous temper painting him as overly passionate undisciplined. They warned that Jackson presidency would be the moral downfall of America, and they held up Rachel as proof, calling her an adulterous and A. One Republican paper inquired, ought a convicted adulteress and her paramour husband to be placed in the highest offices of this free and Christian land never mind that sixty one year old Rachel was a devout Presbyterian who read her Bible daily. For political purposes, the opposition labeled her a scarlet woman who would morally stain the White House. Jackson was powerless to shield his wife from these cruel depictions devastated throughout her husband's. Campaign she suffered a deep depression hit herself away from the world. In the days leading up to the election, Rachel lamented that she would rather be doorkeeper in the House of God, then live in that palace in Washington. Unfortunately. She got her wish. Just a few weeks after Jackson won the election in early December eighteen, twenty, eight. Rachel suffered a heart attack and died. Despite her pre existing health problems Andrew Jackson blamed Rachel sudden-death on the stress from the election. As, he laid his beloved wife to rest. He uttered a statement that would underpin his future dealings in the eaten affair. May God Almighty forgive her murderers. I never can. It was with this attitude of stubborn vengeance that the sixty one year old president elect prepared to take office. In fact in the months leading up to his inauguration, it seeped into another issue close to Jackson's heart. He was more determined than ever to support the wedding of one of his dearest friends. Senator John Eaton Tennessee to a controversial young woman. Her name of course was Peggy Margaret O'Neill or Peggy as her friends and family knew her came from an unassuming background, she was born in Seventeen, ninety nine, the daughter of Scots Irish immigrants who owned the Franklin House a Popular Boarding Lodge in Washington DC. Back then most congressmen and senators opted for temporary lodging in Washington the Franklin House was often their hotel of choice when Congress was in session. The men enjoyed its modest accommodations and gathered together in its tavern for evening shop talk. Most guests were regulars politicians. Peggy had known since she was a child when she perched on their knees and listen to their conversations after dinner. It was there that young Peggy learned to cultivate her own opinions, which she voiced with increasing liberty as she grew older. As her teen years approached Peggy developed into a striking beauty with dark hair and piercing blue eyes. She attended one of Washington's best schools for girls where she excelled in every subject including music and dance. First Lady dolley Madison. Herself Crown twelve-year-old Peggy, the best dancer at a local ball in eighteen twelve. With her position on the fringes of Washington's high society, it was only a matter of time before she was discovered by a prominent suitor. However Peggy's upbringing much as it prepared her for the upper echelons would ultimately hold her back. As a teenager, she held out her family's business by working in Franklin's tavern. Females didn't set foot in bars and rarely worked in them. Any woman who did was looked down on as promiscuous was more. Peggy didn't hesitate to insert herself in men's political discussions, speaking with unusual candor wit for a young lady of her era. Genteel ladies were not voice political perspectives, much less cast these opinions alongside men, and as Peggy began showing her face at more social events, rumors circulated among the women of Washington that she was serving Franklin House patrons as more than just the barmaid. Peggy further this stereotype by attempting to elope in eighteen fourteen, when she was just fifteen years old as she herself boasted in later years, while I was still in pellets and rolling hoops I had the attention of men, young and old enough to turn girls head. Meanwhile Washington's politicians actually praised Peggy having witnessed the breadth of her intellect from a young age. But this only fueled awareness and disdain towards her by the women of Upper Society. It was difficult for them to fathom how some unlike Peggy so free spirited, and with so many male acquaintances could possibly be chaste. And virtuous or not? Her Blythe personality was unwelcome in many a parlour. Various women made a point to snub the teenager beginning with the next first lady Elizabeth Monroe. Other hostesses followed suit making sure young Peggy got the memo to never set foot on their porches. Then, in eighteen, sixteen seventeen year, old Peggy O'Neal married someone who is considered closer to her own social rank. A thirty nine year old navy purser named John Timberlake. For being a ship's accountant, Timberlake was terrible at handling his own money. When the pair married, he was already deep in debt. In an attempt to dig himself out, he quit his position at the navy and set up shop next door to the Franklin House, but this venture only added to his bills during this time in eighteen eighteen, the young couple met a new border, twenty eight year, old widower and senator of Tennessee John Eaton. The three became fast. Friends eaten even petitioned the Senate to forgive Timberlake's debts in eighteen, twenty one, but his efforts were unsuccessful, and by eighteen twenty three. Peggy's husband had returned to his old post in the navy to make a living. In his absence, he transferred guardianship of his wife and their two young daughters over to eaten. Timberlake hoped his compatriot would keep an eye out for the families wellbeing and he did around the same time, eaten introduced peggy to his friend and fellow Tennessee senator at the time Andrew Jackson. Jackson called Peggy the smartest little woman in America. He gushed about her and letters home to Rachel saying how they all enjoyed Peggy's piano playing on Sunday evenings. This was innocent praise Rachel Jackson met and approved of Peggy herself during a visit to Washington in eighteen, twenty four. But the Jackson's senator eaten and the other Franklin House borders were fairly isolated in their regard. With her husband away at sea. Peggy's set many local tongues wagging once more. Mrs Timberlake was not doing as good wives of deployed navy men did sitting at home and pining for their husbands. She was out on the town with as her escort, and they were frequently seen conversing with each other at the Franklin House. Peggy, herself called eaten my husband's friend up Pure, honest and faithful gentlemen. There, socializing apparently took place with the full knowledge and trust of Timberlake and under the nose of Peggy's own family, no less. Still it wasn't hard for outsiders to imagine what else she and eaten might be up to. Before long the society members who had once deemed Peggy promiscuous? Devolved into calling her an adulterous. As a woman Peggy's reputation was more mercilessly assaulted than Eaton's one rumor was so bold as to suggest that she had recently miscarried. Another man's child insinuating that her husband had been gone too long to be the father. Thus, attend social atmospheres set the tone for early eighteen, twenty, eight while Jackson was campaigning for the presidency. Barely three months later on April second twenty nine year old Peggy received word that lake, who frequently suffered from emotional distress had died at sea. It would later be rumored that he had slit his own throat. Hegi for one refused to believe her husband had killed himself maintaining, he had accidentally cut himself in a fit of asthma. But Washington Society was quick to assume the worst gossip emerge that timberlake had caught wind of his wife's affairs and had committed suicide out of grief and shame. These accusations took on a more serious tone when Peggy and eaten announced their engagement in December of eighteen, twenty, eight, a mere eight months after timberlake step. Up to this point, the rumors surrounding their relationship had been idle gossip attempts to further shun peggy from gatherings, but now the whispers seem all the more valid. And with Peggy's foot on the threshold of political society, the opposition against her took a turn for the worse. Coming up a social scandal becomes political. High listeners if your fascinated by the mysterious manipulative side of true crime you'll love. The stories told in the park cast original series colts, every Tuesday step inside the minds of those who lead and followed the most controversial radical and sometimes deadly organizations in history. Go beyond the headlines and discover the foundation behind notorious colts like Jim Jones and Peoples Temple, the Raj Niche Movement Heaven's Gate and more. Each episode of cults is full of illuminating details of their improbable origins and sinister intentions. But not all colts are from decades past. Be Short. Catch the special four part series on nexium. A Modern Day pyramid scheme turned sex trafficking cult doomsday predictions, religious beliefs, extra terrestrial orders find out what really happens inside a cult subscribe to colts, free on spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. Now back to the story. Eighteen twenty eight was a whirlwind year that April John Timberlake slit his throat at sea, leaving behind his twenty eight year, old wife, Peggy, and their two young daughters. Then in December Andrew Jackson both won the presidency and lost his wife Rachel. Tying all this together an engagement was soon announced between Jackson's friend Senator John Eaton and the widowed Mrs Timberlake. Washington society was already convinced that John Timberlake had committed suicide because Peggy was cheating on him with Eaton a rumor. That would never be confirmed. Now onlookers were shocked that the pair would remarry a mere eight months after timberlake's death. Back then it was customary for a woman to wait at least a year, if not two before remarrying a sexist standard granted that men were only expected to mourn for six months. Meanwhile the president-elect supported their engagement. Jackson reportedly told his friend eaten. Why yes major? If you love the woman and she will have you marry her by all means? And Mary. They did on New Year's Day of Eighteen, twenty, nine, defying all the raised eyebrows in Washington. Politicians like Maryland's Louis mclane quipped that Eaton had just married his mistress and the mistress of eleven dozen others. Even Margaret Bayard Smith. The forward, thinking wife of a newspaper publisher had a scathing review on day of the Wedding Smith wrote a letter describing Peggy. She has never been admitted into good. Society is very handsome and of not an inspiring character and violent temper. The ladies declare they will not go to the wedding, and if they can help, it will not let their husbands go. It's worth briefly examining why women like Smith accused Peggy of having violent temper, and what they're deeper motives were in avoiding her. Throughout her life Peggy had several friends who rose above the gender conventions, appreciating her free spirit and political opinions, but too many her charisma was interpreted as a lack of self control, something inappropriate for Genteel women, and which furthered the rumours surrounding peggy. In the early eighteen hundreds women were considered the moral gatekeepers of society as hostesses. They held great power. The ladies in Washington especially saw themselves as the rudders of morality mantis steer the young nation towards virtue and piety. In light of this rebuffing Peggy Eaton was not a simple act of meanness or jealousy, it was a moral choice meant to preserve both their own reputations and the standards of high society. It was their duty to snub her for the greater good. Which is why it was so alarming when Peggy married Senator Eaten further ingratiating herself in political, society. And as word surface that Jackson might make her husband one of the cabinet members, the wives and daughters of Washington's elite steeled themselves for a scandalous rebuttal in eighteen, twenty nine president elect Jackson was eager to include senator eaten in his new cabinet given their long history as friends. Eaten had served as an aide to General. Jackson during his army days, and the pair had been senators of Tennessee together in the early eighteen twenty S. In fact Eaton's marriage to Peggy only strengthened Jackson's resolve to promote his friend. The president elect was outraged by the gossip that called Peggy an adulterous, not least of all, because it echoed recent accusations against his late wife Rachel. With her death just weeks behind him. Jackson was poised to stick it to the same political society whom he believed had killed her. Jackson had already earned the name old. Hickory for good reason, his stubbornness and quick temper could be flipped on instantly when concerns were voiced about Peggy's reputation, he flared up saying. Do you suppose that I have been sent here by the people to consult? The ladies of Washington has to the proper persons to compose my cabinet. And so Jackson selected John Eaton for his cabinet early that Spring, naming him secretary of war. The irony of this would become increasingly clear. Meanwhile Jackson had long since chosen his vice president, a politician by the name of John. C. Calhoun. The man was no stranger to the white. House Calhoun was presently serving as vice president John Adams, but the pair had become estranged in their political views. Realizing he was no match against Adam's second presidential campaign Calhoun had crossed party lines volunteering as Jackson's running mate. It was a shrewd move. Calhoun could serve as veep for another term if Jackson were elected, positioning himself to become his successor after two terms, or perhaps he wouldn't need to wait that long. One needed only to look at Jackson to know the man was in terrible help. Old Hickory was rotting from the inside out at sixty two years old Jackson suffered from chronic pulmonary infections. Malaria dispatch Zia osteomyelitis, bronchitis and decaying teeth to name a few. Calhoun likely hoped that before the next four or eight years were up, the new commander-in-chief would drop dead, leaving the reins to him. In the meantime though he had little control over Jackson's appointment of eaten. or his own wife's reaction to it. March, second, eighteen, twenty nine, the day of Jackson's inauguration, arrived, and the wives of Washington had their first child to publicly flaunt their disdain towards Peggy. Calhoun wife Florida was chief among the detractors. Florida had tolerated visit from the Eaton's after their wedding just weeks before, but she had since determined that the buck would stop there refusing to repay the visit. Now as the WHO's who of Washington Rub, shoulders during the Presidential Ball Florida made her intentions clear, and it seemed she'd already bent the ears of other political ladies together. They made a marked effort to ignore the president's little friend peg. One by one. They switched past Mrs. Eaten in their skirts and curls refusing so much to look at her. All hopes Peggy may have had about their acceptance. Where instantly dashed and any ladies who might have begun the day wondering how to behave towards Begi would have noticed Florida's example. This was more than petty conduct dinner, parties and balls crux of Washington bureaucracy, an arena for men to make new contacts and women to forge key relationships between political families. As a cabinet wife Peggy was now one of the most important women in Washington and she was certainly one of the leading ladies of the Democratic Party. For her to be spurned by the vice president's wife and other cabinet, women spelled a huge problem for the fledgling party. As the weeks turned into months, the Eden affair emerged as a political scandal. Right smack in the middle of Jackson's cabinet, the proverbial elephant in the room. With the ladies of Washington, at its helm, onlookers sometimes referred to the scandal by its nickname. The petticoat war. It would have been far easier if Jackson had heated the writing on the wall and quickly dismissed eaten once the scandal became apparent. But Jackson dug in his heels with a vengeance. He was determined to see Peggy's reputation, come full circle, both for her sake, and for his beloved late wife, the President even went so far as to postpone his inaugural cabinet dinner for the foreseeable future, literally giving the ladies more time to mend their differences. Yet as a man, Jackson's actions held decidedly less way in a female regulated society. Even Florida's husband John Calhoun would helplessly wonder about quote. The difficulties in which Florida's behavior would probably involve me. The implications for Calhoun career remained to be seen. Meanwhile, Peggy continued in the genteel pastime of leaving her calling card at the homes of other politically connected women. Custom mandated that these ladies return the favor by paying a visit to the eaten household at a later date. But as weeks turned into months, Peggy's drawing room remained disappointingly empty. As Eliza Johnston the wife of a Louisiana Senator, admitted the movement to exclude Peggy seemed quote arbitrary. She seemed to feel bad for Peggy. Nonetheless. She felt obligated to leave her calls unreturned. In the meantime it wasn't surprising, though certainly unfair that Peggy's been John. Eaton remained indecent favor with Washingtonians. Eaten benefited from a sexual double standard, regarding male and female conduct. Whether or not the gossip about the couple was true. Peggy was irrevocably tainted in the eyes of society, while eaten maintained his favorable reputation. As one politician Richard K call put it eaten, had one blemish and thousand virtues. And so the petticoat war raged on. Washington, wise refused to attend parties where Peggy Eaton would be present save for those unavoidable events, involving foreign legations and certain. White House parties. When they were obligated show face. They simply continue to ignore Peggy. Perhaps, the most astonishing detractor was President Jackson's own niece in law and White House hostess twenty two year old Emily Donelson. Emily was the wife of Rachel's nephew. Andrew Jackson Donelson, the young couple had come to live with the widowed president in Washington with emily in the acting role of first lady. Donaldson was likely spurred along by the opinion of other cabinet. Wives like Florida, Calhoun not to mention her own moral compass, and after one call to Peggy. Emily announced that she was quote so much disgusted with what I have seen of her that I shall not visit her again. Her disdain was especially evident on July ninth. Both emily and Peggy's families were journeying from Washington DC to Norfolk Virginia via steamboat. When emily became sick and was on the verge of fainting? Peggy politely offered her a fan and some Cologne. Emily poignantly rejected. She would rather be rendered unconscious than accept a favor from Mrs Eaten. The incident left. Peggy furious with embarrassment, and she didn't waste time in returning the favor later that day. She told Emily's husband Andrew, that she felt more pity than anything for him and his wife. and Peggy remarked if things didn't go differently, President Jackson might send them packing back to Tennessee. Andrew bit his tongue. This was one of the selective instances able to be passed out from histories letters where Peggy Eaton's blunt and unladylike nature is especially clear. She didn't hesitate to voice her frustration to her own husband and the sprinkling of friends she did have. These brave friends included Mrs, Catherine Berry, the wife of Cabinet member and Postmaster General William Berry as well as a few other political wives. But Emily Donelson. Like most Washington ladies had firmly made up her mind. She give no more than minimum courtesy. She couldn't Ban Mrs. Eaten from White House events, but she could certainly keep her shoulder cold as ever. And while President Jackson chose to look the other way in his own household. It was only a matter of time before he would need to address the eaten affair head on. Coming up. Jackson makes a decision that startles the nation now back to the story. As fall of eighteen, twenty nine approach Andrew Jackson was several months into his first term as president, but so far the greater portion of his efforts had been spent trying to suppress the vicious rumors surrounding peggy eaten. Save for a couple of politicians wives who dared to pay occasional visits to peggy. The vast majority of Washington females had decided she was a scarlet woman. They couldn't risk encouraging her kind much less endangering their own reputations. And this wasn't the only pushback Jackson witnessed against Peggy, his own pastor Presbyterian Minister John N Campbell voiced disapproval towards the eaten woman. Campbell commiserated with another politically connected reverend. Ellie, who penned a series of letters to the new president, advising Jackson against keeping eaten in his cabinet? Jackson was furious and more determined than ever to clear Peggy's name as a sign of his desperation, he even hired private investigators to suss out the rumors surrounding his friend's wife to his triumph. They returned empty-handed. The president wasn't just upset about the assault on Peggy's character. He was angry that high society, a domain both operated by females and cordoned off to them should have any bearing on male politics. And so on September tenth eighteen, twenty nine, the president called a famous meeting of the cabinet. He hoped they could hash it all out in the open, putting an end to the eaten affair once and for all. Husband Secretary of war, John Eaton of course was not present. But? Neither was Vice President John Calhoun. Calhoun was currently visiting his pregnant Loretta at their home in south, Carolina. She had left Washington earlier that year citing rest and relaxation, but as politician. Virgil Maxxie plainly pointed out Florida was simply determined to shun the eaten woman. Jackson made do with the other cabinet members who are in town, and whose wives and daughters had cited against Peggy. These included Secretary of Treasury Samuel Ingram Attorney General, John. Barren and secretary of Navy. John Branch. Joining them were local reverends Ezra stiles, ely and John Campbell perpetrators in the moral issue at hand. On the sympathetic side Sat. JUST TWO FIGURES POST Master General William. Berry who had known peggy since she was a little girl, and whose wife had been friendly towards Peggy as well as Martin Van Buren. Buren was Jackson's Shrewd Secretary of state as a widower, he had no wife or daughter to cater to making him immune to the eaten malaria as he called it. Over the past few months, then buren had continued associating with Peggy a decision, which actively gained him more favor with President Jackson. Now the men shuffled awkwardly into place, as Jackson submitted the evidence or lack thereof from his recent investigation, he was determined to bend everyone to his way of thinking regardless of the persistent rumours, and when one reverend dared to contradict him, old hickory yelled. As chaste as a virgin. In his bullheaded way. Jackson left the meeting thinking. He had settled the matter though he would still withdraw his membership from Reverend Campbell's church. He was even confident enough to reschedule his long postponed Cabinet Dinner. When it rolled around two months later in November of eighteen, twenty nine. Jackson Sat John and Peggy next to him at the head of the table, making his point clear as ever. Then buren would later state that the dinner had no very marked exhibitions of bad feeling in any quarter. None. The less the guests hurried hardly through courses and back home again, not quite satisfying supper that Jackson had hoped for. The next party was hosted by Van Buren, but the pushback was the same and this time the usual cabinet wives and daughters outwardly refused to attend. Jackson may have scolded their husbands, but he couldn't as easily correct their spouses and eighteen twenty nine turned into eighteen thirty. The president felt more and more powerless over the scandal. As Senator Daniel Webster wrote in January of Eighteen thirty. The consequence of this dispute in the social world is producing great political effects and may vary probably determine who shall be successor to the present chief magistrate. His words would prove remarkably true. Up to this point. Jackson had harbored suspicions that the so-called petticoat war had its roots in the opposing national. Republican. He figured they were propagating gossip against Peggy in order to undermine his administration much as they had with his late wife Rachel during his presidential campaign. But now President Jackson wondered if the main perpetrator wasn't within his own cabinet. Not only was vice president Calhoun, the husband of Florida one of Peggy's I, believes he also seemed to be advising the other cabinet members who had cited against the Eaton's. What what really stirred distrust within the president was cal Hoon's increasing tendency to argue against his decisions. Calhoun had already flipped over from the Republican. Party, where he'd made himself an enemy of former president. John Adams. But even in his reprised role under President Jackson, the man refused to compromise on his pet projects. These included the issue of Federal Taros and states rights, and when a national import tax passed, that would negatively impact. The South Calhoun argued that individual states should be free to nullify federal laws at will. President Jackson disagreed holding firm to his belief that the federal government has final say over US states. None, the less the lines of opinion were drawn between him. And calhoun and the chasm would only continue to widen in the following months. It's impossible to address the eaten affair without mentioning the seminole letters, a series of memos that led Jackson to believe once and for all that. Calhoun could not be trusted. On May twelve eighteen thirty Jackson received a copy of a letter. His Vice President had written back in eighteen eighteen when Calhoun was his boss as secretary of war. At, the time Jackson had been an army general responsible for defending settlers from native American seminole tribes on the Georgia Spanish Florida border. Jackson had received orders to not engage with Spanish authorities or chase the seminoles into Spanish territory. But old hickory proceeded, and two British soldiers were executed in the process. Naturally an international uproar ensued, and those higher up in the US army, including Calhoun had to decide whether or not to condemn Jackson. Nothing ever came of it leading Jackson to assume. Calhoun had supported his decision now. The letters in front of him clearly showed the Calhoun had opposed military tactics. It was old news, but Jackson was dogged about loyalty. Had he known about this before the election? Calhoun name likely wouldn't have even made it on the ticket. The rift between them was now irreparable. At this point, Jackson was already at the halfway mark of his first presidential term, and he had spent a good amount of it, pulling his hair out over the eaten affair, and recently the seminole letters. Jackson knew he needed to do something to ease the tension in Washington and so it was an early eighteen, thirty one that secretary of State Martin. Van Buren proposed a daring scheme. Over the past two years van Buren had been buttering up the president, backing him up on all his decisions and socializing freely with the Eaton's. Now van Buren offered himself up as a sacrifice. If he resigned from the cabinet, it would pave the way for Jackson to ask for the resignations of other members then Jackson would be free to start from scratch building a stronger and more unified presidential cabinet. Hearing van, Buren Proposal Secretary of war eaten also volunteered to resign after all. It was his own marriage that had ignited all this drama. Inherently he and Van Buren knew that they would remain. Jackson's good graces gone, but not forgotten as it were. At his wit's end, Jackson agreed, and in the spring of eighteen, thirty, one barely two years into his first term as president. He fired his entire presidential cabinet. Well, almost all Postmaster General William. Berry was kept on for a couple reasons first, he had treated Peggy Eaton. Well second, he was facing several allegations of corruption and Jackson ever. The loyal friend felt there was a better chance of clearing berries name if he remained in office. And despite his heavy part in this debacle, John Calhoun was kept on as well. He was still vice president after all. It was a shocking turn of events for the watching nation. The press readily traced the cabinets dissolve back to Peggy The Washington national. Journal even compared it to the reign of Louis the fifteenth. Discussions of female influence on male behavior became the absorbing topic of the summer all because of one little woman, who the ladies of Washington love to hate. Meanwhile A- popular toast circulated throughout Washington that went to the next cabinet. May they all be bachelors or leave their wives at home? As the spring of eighteen thirty one turned to summer, Jackson quickly set about organizing his second cabinet. It would prove vastly more effective than the first strengthening Jackson's hand, and thus array sing calhoun chances at running against him in the next election. But for the next two years, Calhoun would remain a thorn in the president side. When Jackson tried to reward van Bjorn's loyalty by appointing him US minister to Britain Calhoun cast the tiebreaking vote against it. He reportedly gloated to a friend that this would kill him. Sir Kill Him Dead Oh. Contraire, Van Buren bounced back with a vengeance, the American public sympathized with him, as being the first to go and Jackson's cabinet, and Jackson granted Van Buren the highest honor possible appointing him as vice president for his second term. The lasting political repercussions to Peggy Eaton were clear. Van Buren who had. remained friendly towards her went onto become Jackson's vice president, and later his successor, reaping the full benefits of his initial resignation. As the eighteen sixties historian James Parton. WOULD SAUSALITO put it? The political history of the United States for the last thirty years dates from the moment when the soft hand of Mr Van, Buren touched Mrs Eaton's knocker. As. It was Calhoun resigned his post in eighteen, thirty two just months before van, Buren was due to take over as vice president. Meanwhile the Edens were appointed to Florida where Jonathan served as governor from eighteen, thirty, four to eighteen, thirty six after this, he was made ambassador to Spain where they remained for four years before returning to the states. And spent his remaining career as a lawyer, he died in eighteen, fifty, six, leaving his substantial estate to his fifty seven year old widow this time Hegi waited acceptable three years before remarrying. The lucky groom was her granddaughters Italian. Dance Teacher Nineteen Year old Antonio Book Ignani. Peggy herself did say that she did not love this third husband. My heart was in the grave with John H Eaton. and Antonio's heart was with her granddaughter Emily. Six years later. The young couple ran off to Italy together. They had two children as Antonio continued to Siphon money from his legal wife Peggy They finally divorced in Eighteen, sixty nine, leaving seventy year old. Peggy alone and penniless. She died ten years later at a home for destitute women in Washington DC. Her someone who had caused such a scandal in her day, her death was anticlimactic. But a small consolation, she had the last word. John and Florida Calhoun Emily. Donelson Andrew Jackson Martin Van Buren. And many others involved in the eaten affair had long since preceded her to the grave. And as Peggy was laid to rest alongside John Eaten, a local newspaper made the astute observation. Doubtless among the dead, populating the terrorists of the cemetery. Our some of her assailants cordially is. They may have hated her. They are now her neighbors. Thanks for listening. We'll be back next week with scandal number seventeen the tale of Richard Helms the only CIA director convicted of lying to Congress. You can find all episodes of political scandals and all other park has originals for free on spotify, not only despite defy already have all of your favorite music, but now spotify is making it easy for you to enjoy all of your favorite park cast originals for free from your phone, desktop or smart speaker. To stream political scandals on spotify just open the APP tap, browse and type political scandals in the search bar. We'll see you next time. Political scandals was created by Max Cutler, and is a podcast studios original. It is executive produced by Max. Cutler sound designed by Anthony. Vowel sick with production assistance by Ron Shapiro Carly Madden and Travis Clark. This episode of political scandals was written by Allee wicker with writing assistance by cake, Gallagher and stars, Kate Leonard and Richard Rosner. Hi Listeners. If you're fascinated by the mysterious and manipulative side of true crime, you'll love. The stories told in the park cast original series colts, every Tuesday step inside the minds of those who lead and followed the most controversial radical and sometimes deadly organizations in history go beyond the headlines and discover the foundation behind notorious cults like Jim. Jones and Peoples Temple the Raj Niche Movement Heaven's Gate and more each episode of cults is full of illuminating details of their improbable origins and sinister intentions. But not all colts are from decades past. Be sure to catch the special four part series on Nexium a Modern Day pyramid scheme turned sex trafficking cult founded by Keith. Rainier Doomsday predictions religious beliefs extraterrestrial orders find out what really happens inside a Colt subscribe to Colts Freon spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.

President Jackson Peggy Peggy Eaton Vice President John Calhoun Washington DC president Senator John Eaton Rachel vice president Jackson Washington Rachel Donelson robards Jackso Calhoun Emily John H Eaton. Florida Peggy O'Neal Senator Eaten White House Donelson Andrew Jackson Martin Martin Van Buren
Benedict Arnold Pt. 1: Turncoat

Espionage

58:51 min | 1 year ago

Benedict Arnold Pt. 1: Turncoat

"Due to the graphic nature of this spies crimes listener discretion is advised. This episode includes discussions of murder abuse war and assault assault that some people may find offensive. This episode also includes discussions of violence against children. That might be particularly upsetting to some listeners. We advise extreme cautioned for listeners under the age of thirteen early. May Seventeen seventy nine in the dead of night. An ailing American general answered the door before him stood Joseph stands bury a crockery merchant and secret supporter of the British monarchy. The general ushered stands. Berry in then quickly locked the door behind him. The one time war hero was unable to walk walk yet. He held himself with Distinctive Regal bearing it was with the utmost confidence that he made his proposal to stands berry. He was ready to turn his coat to trade in his blue coat of the continental army for the red coat of the British army. They spoke well into the night discussing compensation secret codes and how the general turn spy should contact his new handlers the things would be much better in the American colonies. When the British regained power the general thought the senseless loss of life the war had brought this far needed and and after stanbury departed the wounded general knew his life would never be the same again thirty eight year old General Benedict Arnold had just betrayed both his fledgling country and his friend George Washington in doing so he sealed his ignoble noble place in history his name would become synonymous with treason and his actions would be scorned for centuries. This is espionage the par cast original original exploring the missions of the world's most incredible spies in what brought their covert operations into the public eye throughout this show. We'll explore a real world. Spy Tactics required to impersonate exploits and infiltrate the most confidential places in the world. I'm Carter Roy you can find wind all episodes of espionage and all other par- cast originals for free on spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts to stream espionage for free on spotify just open the APP and type espionage in the search bar park cast. Were grateful for you our listeners you allow us to do it. We love so so let us know how we're doing reach out on facebook and Instagram at our cast and twitter at Parkas network and if you enjoy today's episode the best best way to help is to leave a five star review wherever you're listening it really does help this is our first of two episodes on Benedict Arnold melt the revolutionary war hero who became the most treacherous turncoat of the American revolution from May seventeen seventy nine through September summer of seventeen eighty arnold operated undetected as British spy among American soldiers even conspiring to hand the US outpost at West Point linked over to the British army. This week will explore how on old after decades as in on a soldier turn from war hero to trader later as well as the early stages of his plan to end the war by surrendering the American Fort of West Point next week we'll cover how arnold was caught and go over the surprising choices he made after being exposed as a spy benedict arnold was the last man anyone expected to become a spy for the British army in his early years. He seemed determined to become a great hero for his country. Rather than its most infamous traitor born on January fourteenth Eighteenth Seventeenth forty-one and Norwich Connecticut Arnold was a handsome athletic member of the New England aristocracy. His great grandfather also also named Benedict Arnold was one of the founders of the colony of Rhode Island but what looked on the outside like a privileged childhood was very different went on the inside Arnold was named after his deceased older brother and growing up he would witness the deaths of three siblings all of whom died horribly from yellow fever only arnold and his sister. Hannah survived their childhood following the tragic deaths of four four of his six children. Benedict Arnold's father became an alcoholic. He was rarely sober. During Arnold's youth and soon became an embarrassment to the family by the time Benedict Arnold was fourteen his father had spent much of the family's money on booze and other Kavala tease the result was that he could no longer afford the fees to the private school arnold attended forcing the young arnold to drop out seventeen fifty seven sixteen year old arnold finally found a way to escape the stink of his father's reputation he joined the Connecticut Connecticut militia and fought in the French and Indian war a seven-year conflict between the British and French colonies each of whom were aided by local native American can tribes after his time in the war arnold now in his late teens moved to New Haven Connecticut there he apprenticed himself to whose cousin Joshua Lathrop who operated a successful apothecary business arnold showed immediate promise the Leith rips business was successful zestful and quickly expanded they decided to add a general store which required importing and exporting goods soon arnold move from selling pills and remedies to organizing shipments of goods from Europe and beyond it was around this time in in seventeen fifty nine when Arnold's mother passed away forcing arnold to financially support his father two years later though in seventeen sixty fifty one his father died arnold only had one living relative his sister Hannah although he grieved the loss of his parents he was glad to be free of the duty of supporting his infirm alcoholic father he could focus on his burgeoning business but eh arnold grew into a prominent merchant he soon became frustrated with Britain's aggressive taxation of the American colonies the sugar act of seventeen sixty four severely curtailed arnold's ability to import molasses by imposing steep tax on each barrel worse yet the tax hike came at a time when Connecticut was already battling an economic depression furious twenty-three-year-old Arnold joined join the sons of liberty a secret paramilitary organization opposed to British rule. He began smuggling goods into the colonies without paying taxes between his successful business his work with the sons of liberty and his role in the Connecticut Militia Arnold gained a reputation as a leader in his community not only was he earning the respect of his peers. He was also considered a highly eligible bachelor. This pleased Arnold who often courted several women once occasionally sending the exact same love letter to more than one lady in seventeen sixty seven at age twenty. Six Arnold finally decided to settle down. He married his longtime Sweetheart Margaret Mansfield over the next five years. The two had three sons together when the revolutionary war began in seventeen seventy five thirty four year old arnold was elected captain of the Connecticut militia and unpaid but prestigious position he quickly distinguished himself as a soldier for both good and for bad despite winning most of the battles he engaged aged in it came at the cost of unnecessarily risky military decisions. He was loath to order a retreat. Even in the face of impossible possible odds in rumors swirled that he didn't care how many men he lost his long as his own reputation for bravery stayed intact which it did at least among those who counted on May third seventeen seventy five arnold was awarded a Colonel's Commission in the Continental Army as a newly minted army officer Benedict Arnold was hyper sensitive to any perceived disrespect leading to fistfights. It's with his own soldiers although beloved by his superiors including Commander in chief George Washington he was loathed by many of his his peers for what they perceived as selfish on gentlemen lake and even downright malicious behavior one man John on Brown went so far as to commission the publication of a pamphlet warning others about Benedict Arnold Brown wrote money money is this man's God and to get enough of it. He would sacrifice his country. Brown claimed to have witnessed arnold diverting supplies men for the entire battalion for his personal use during the siege of Boston around that same time in May of seventeen seventy five Margaret died making arnold a widower arnold received the news news of his wife's unexpected death while he fought in the capture of Fort Ticonderoga embroiled in battle. He couldn't return home for her. Our funeral weeks later when he did return to new haven he considered staying home to raise his boys but the loss was overpowering powering after just three weeks arnold left his sons in the care of his sister in return to the war by now though Arnold Arnold had serious objections to the economic and human costs of the ongoing war he began referring to it as the public calamity Eddie in spite of these misgivings. He found it impossible to stay away. He told friends an idle life. Under under my present circumstances would be but a lingering death brokenhearted arnold needed the army more than it needed upon returning to the war. Benedict Arnold was dispatched to the Quebec campaign an invasion of Quebec authorized by the second continental congress in the brutal winter march to Quebec City Arnold lost lost five hundred soldiers hypothermia starvation and illness on December thirty first of seventeen seventy five arnold's else troops along with General Richard Montgomerie's attacked Quebec city. The Americans were grievously outmatched and it soon became clear that winning was impossible still arnold failed to withdraw from battle. Even after General Montgomery was killed the reward for Arnold's courage was a musket ball to the left leg sustained as charged a barricade guarded by thirty Canadian IAN soldiers over Arnold shouts of protest. His men ordered him carried out of the fray. After suffering the Musket wound wound arnold could have left the war by reason of disability he wasn't even being paid for his services and now if he chose to continue you to fight it would be with a weakened limb susceptible to further injury but arnold never considered quitting he healed quickly ignoring his doctor's orders to rest and return to the front within several weeks and as the war raged on Colonel Arnold reputation as has a risk taker only grew on that went for his personal life to after his first wife's death. Arnold was quick to be an courting again just like before he married Arnold preferred his women beautiful wealthy and in their mid to late eighteens but now he was old enough for his advances to be perceived not as courtship from a potential husband but as an older man and threatening threatening the virtue of a young lady he was often rejected and arnold even openly flirted with girls from families loyal to Britain this didn't improve his standing in the eyes of his detractors who saw arnold as a self interested opportunist rather than a Patriot tree it and it wouldn't be long before one of these courtships led him down the path of treason. Although many people disliked Arnold feud denied that he was a brilliant strategist commander in chief George Washington admired mired arnold so despite the controversies Arnold kept getting prestigious assignments in October of seventeen seventy six the thirty five year old Arnold now brigadier general commanded a fleet of fifteen vessels in a brutal battle on Valco Bay near Lake Champlain in Canada Arnold ships traded cannon volleys with British throughout the day. Dealing serious blows their navy yet. Arnold's men remained immensely outnumbered by the twenty five ship British fleet the British ships had more guns more ammunition and more men the two largest ships the HMS inflexible and the HMS Thunder together exceeded the firepower of of the entire fifteen ship American fleet by the time darkness fell arnold ships were boxed into a corner of the lake by a semi circle of British British vessels darkness made continued fighting impossible for either side the battle would resume at dawn but Arnold Arnold new if they waited for daylight his men were likely to perish Arnold's man's suggested that they flee through a narrow passage to the north far from the British ships but arnold had a different plan over protests he ordered his fleet to lower all masts and use the oars to sneak through the slumbering British fleet he counted on the days cannon fire to have rendered the British soldiers half deaf jeff so that they wouldn't hear his ships passing in the night they prayed and held their breath as they paddled past the towering British dish fleet only the stars reflecting on the water provided them with light miraculously the British slimmer as the American fleet paddled by sliding almost silently through the black water the American fleet soon reached Schuyler island seven and a half half mile south of Alcorn Bay there they were able to rest it seemed as if Arnold's plan had worked but on the very next day day on October twelfth seventeen seventy six the British fleet caught up to the Americans at Schuyler Island Arnold ordered the hospital ship enterprise to flee carrying many injured men safely away in the ensuing firefight the cowardly captain of the Washington surrendered surrendered followed by the Galley Trumbull. It wasn't long before Arnold was forced to admit defeat. He ordered all five live of his troops remaining vessels to run themselves ground on the shore. After the boats were grounded the men jumped out in mounted a ground defense from the cliffs above the beach in the battle that ensued Benedict Arnold gave an order that cost the life of his good friend Lieutenant Ephraim Goldsmith already severely wounded in the battle on the lake. Goldsmith couldn't be evacuated from the deck of his Galley. When Arnold gave his men the order to blow up the boats gunpowder stores to delay the British Goldsmith was still onboard the site of his friend's body torn apart and thrown into the air would ona-led for the rest of his life as Arnold look down from the cliffs onto the broken remains of his fleet. He felt on the brink of collapse. His own brushes with death. Breath never really affected him. Even the deep wound in his leg had at first seemed like a mere inconvenience but now with the image each of his friend's body parts flying through the air fresh in his mind. The war suddenly began to feel futile the bravest men he knew were. We're dying all around him. It finally sunk in that he could be next. coming up Arnold begins to hear whispers that he's fighting for the wrong side fame money obsession. These things can make athletes seem superhuman but what happens when those in in professional sports reveal the darker side of their humanity every week my show sports criminals investigate some of the most significant sports crimes times throughout the world we explore the dramatic collision course of our most revered athletes and the underbelly of society you'll learn about these athletes. It's rise through competitive sports and how the discipline and motivation that brought them to the top served a push them into their downfall. Whether you're a rabid did fan or a passive observer their stories carry significance for us all listen and subscribe to sports criminals for free on spotify and anywhere you listen to podcasts or visit par cast dot com slash sports criminals to listen now now back to the story in October of seventeen seventy six thirty five year old Benedict Arnold Bravely Wli Lead Fifteen American ships against twenty five larger British vessels in the battle of vowel core island despite a heroic effort by his men. The British fleet triumphed in Arnold was forced to order the destruction of his own remaining five ships. The loss was significant but the continental army ultimately succeeded in turning the British back before they could recapture for Ticonderoga despite his lauded courage Jim Wong his superior officers the battle ironically resulted in arnold making even more enemies though he was aware of the controversy surrounding his tactics Benedict Arnold expected he would soon be promoted to the rank of major general. It seemed like an obvious choice at the time he had the best record in the army and the most experienced he was second in command end of the highly successful northern branch of the army and he was a favorite of General George Washington so confident was he that in early seventeen nineteen seventy seven arnold commissioned a Taylor to produce a major general's uniform but not only did Benedict Arnold not received a promotion he soon learned that five lower ranking officers were promoted to major-general ahead of them already ready feeling frustrated with his status in the army arnold complained bitterly to George Washington himself in one letter. Arnold called all the non-promotion very civil way of requesting. My resignation Washington insisted that this wasn't the case and wrote back with many compliments for his old friend he even attempted to intercede with continental Congress in urge Arnold's promotion but was was overruled Arnold had friends in high places but he had enemies in even higher ones on September nineteenth breath of seventeen seventy seven Benjamin Lincoln replaced Benedict Arnold as second in command of the Northern Army. It was an enormous a slight to make matters worse. The order came from General Horatio Gates a longtime friend and mentor of Arnold's when the battle of Saratoga broke out on October. Seven seventeen seventy seven arnold was no longer an officer in the northern army in fact he was alone in a nearby farmhouse and extremely drunk. Some sources say he was also high on opium which he sometimes used as painkiller yet as soon as he heard the gunfire arnold settled his horse and rode owed into battle. Though he was no longer their commander many of the men still admired arnold for his courage at Ticonderoga Quebec and the battle of alcorn island he mustered up a company willing to follow him into the heat of the fray. The Battle of Saratoga was brutal and Dan bloody just after Sunset Arnold led a group of riflemen charge against a cluster of Hessen or German auxiliary troops groups as smoke swirled in the smell of gunpowder burned his nostrils Arnold galloped towards the enemy as if he thought himself self immortal suddenly a musket ball struck arnold again this time in his left thigh it passed through his femur and killed his horse. Arnold's bone was shattered sending splinters into the muscle and soft tissue of his thigh Arnold Arnold had to fight to convince the army's doctors not amputate they fully expected him to die of infection after refusing amputation but arnold clung to life the pain in his leg was severe everyone but arnold himself knew that this disability was likely catastrophic impermanent but he insisted that he would return to battle and soon in May of seventeen seventy eight benedict arnold was finally promoted but because of the late date of his promotion the five less experienced men promoted earlier would remain officially his seniors humiliated. Benedict Arnold fell into into a depression but one month later as the British formally withdrew from Philadelphia Washington saw this as an opportunity he to make things right with Arnold Washington ordered his old comrade the military command Philadelphia making him a Governor General Arnold should have been overjoyed but by this time he was simply ready for the war to be over. He depleted his entire fortune. While serving in the army he was in severe pain and he lost many friends on the battlefield. He secretly missed the days of British rule when he was a wealthy merchant with few worries the only thing that lifted his spirits. I was eighteen year old Peggy shippen the stunning and brilliant daughter of Edward Shippen a former judge rumor to secretly support poured the British monarchy ever since the death of his first wife Benedict Arnold had preferred to court women far younger than himself and had had been rebuffed by several teen girls. Peggy on the other hand appeared to return his interest. Arnold was elated by September of seventeen seventy eight. He was writing her elaborate. Love letters again sometimes plagiarizing his own previous writings writings to other women despite her family's. Politics Arnold was sure that Peggy was the one for him by Peggy's father Edward Shippen didn't consider the destitute thirty-seven-year-old Governor General and appropriate match for his daughter. Arnold couldn't erase his career career as a continental officer but he could change his bank balance. Arnold began to do things he never would have done before four like uses command Philadelphia to purchase huge amounts of goods to resell before other traders could buy them up. His scheme was quickly discovered and an investigation was opened. The Brazen Arnold didn't let that get in his way arnold knew that if he didn't didn't make enough money to win Edwards blessing Peggy might be married off to someone else whether she liked it or not slowly arnold began to change his financial fortunes while continuing to court the teenaged peggy as they got to know each other she begin to whisper in his ear about the advantages of the monarchy arnold did his best to ignore Peggy's conspiratorial talk but it wasn't long before the consequences for his financial schemes would soon have him listening to what she had to say. By the beginning of seventeen seventy nine arnold's former colleagues were talking about court-martialing him for his abuse of power at Philadelphia Benedict thought this was absurd. He was a war hero sure he was guilty of most of the charges but it wasn't such a serious crime to warrant prosecution arnold felt disrespected betrayed and humiliated by the continental army for me. It was getting harder and harder to disagree with Peggy's praise of the monarchy she often reminded her now fiance that he'd been richer and happier before the war imagine how happy would be if the crown was back in power on. April eighth seventeen seventy nine benedict arnold and Peggy shippen were married laying out enough money to win over her father had required abuses of the power so great he was in danger of being thrown in a military prison he'd taken out an outrageously large loan in order to buy I mansion but in the end Arnold God what he wanted most Peggy playgie hagey didn't have what she wanted most she wanted to see monarchy returned what she's still considered the British colonies and and soon Arnold's health gave her some unexpected leverage weeks after the marriage thirty eight year old arnold came down with a a horrific case of gout in his right leg between that and the lingering musket injury on the left side he couldn't bear wait long enough off to walk at all with her husband disabled under ongoing investigation and now rarely leaving the house. Hagi had plenty any of time to press her case. She knew that if benedict agreed to spy for the British he could potentially turn the tide of the war as well as change his financial situation. She urged him to reach out to a British officer. She knew John Andrei not yet. Thirty Andre was a rising star in the British army as an adjutant general. He was a close confidant of the former British commander in chief General Henry Clinton Andrei spoke. Four languages had a gift for art and entertain friends by composing posing comedic verse on the spot. Peggy adored him. He had often been a guest in her father's home when she was a young girl before the war broke doubt. Hagi couldn't think of a more persuasive man to make her case for monarchy than Andrei. Even the cantankerous arnold wouldn't be immune to andres charms on May fifth seventeen seventy nine. Benedict Arnold was wracked with a fit of guilt. He knew that his wife's arguments were wearing him down his own skepticism about the American experiment was bubbling to the surface office. He fought back daily urges to do as his wife said contact John Andrei to mention he was still deeply in in debt. Perhaps espionage paid better than the army peggy hidden mentioned that a few times too but if Arnold took his wife's advice he'd be risking more than just money a former governor general caught betraying his country wouldn't just be investigated investigated. He'd be convicted and executed. Arnold did what he always done when he was truly really desperate he wrote to George Washington on May fifth seventeen seventy nine. He entreated the commander in chief to please bring his long impending court martial to a prompt resolution writing if your Excellency thinks me criminal for Heaven's sake let me be immediately he tried and if found guilty executed he went on to complain having made every sacrifice of fortune and blood and become cripple in the service of my country. I little expected to meet the ungrateful returns I received of my countrymen. He'd he'd waited too long to write confined to his home and suffering with constant pain. Arnold could think of nothing but the unfairness ernest of his own position. Peggy's promises kept ringing in his ears. He would be free if the British one he would be enrich again. If the British won the British would appreciate him unlike his supposed friends in the continental army deep down down. He knew that nothing Washington could say would make a difference Arnold no longer respected his old comrade in arms and no longer under believed in there once shared 'cause so before Washington could even reply Arnold took the step he could would never take back. He agreed to betray his country coming up Benedict Arnold because his work as a spy now back to the story sorry on May fifth seventeen seventy nine thirty eight year old. Benedict Arnold begged his old friend George Washington to to help him bring to an end the investigation of his abuses of power while serving as Governor General of Philadelphia but by the time he wrote to Washington Shington Deep Down Arnold had already passed his breaking point he was in terrible physical pain and crushing debt his his eighteen year old wife Peggy urged him to give up on American independence and support the British army. She told him it was the only way to bring the revolutionary war to an end just a few days after writing his pleading letter to Washington Arnold took his wife's advice in send for an emissary who could convey a message to British captain John. Dre The man Arnold chose for this secret task was thirty seven year old seller of fine China and author of monarchist poetry named Joseph Stains Berry stands burien Arnold. I met at Arnold House though a secluded place might have been preferred Arnold's inability to walk presented an insurmountable obstacle in terms of travel pleasing Peggy Greatly Arnold Brag too stands berry about how many of the revolution secrets he knew he told stands berry he would gladly share those secrets but at a cost he you need to know if the British were serious about holding onto the colonies and if so how much would this information be worth to them mm-hmm Peggy was a true believer in monarchy but arnold was just tired of sacrificing his body and his pride for no reward. He was an opportunist not an ideologue. He wanted to know exactly what he beginning out of turning turning his coat he sent Joseph Stands Berea Way to look into the answers to his two questions sooner than he expected. Arnold received saved a reply. It was even better than Arnold had hoped John Andre wrote that the British would be more than generous in compensating compensating arnold for any useful information he could provide. Andrei went on to say that if Arnold could help the British Army May defeat a large body of continental soldiers Britain's generosity in that case would exceed even his most sanguine hopes hopes and if the newly minted spy should be discovered and have to flee the British would provide him safe escape to Britain written there he would be received with a hero's welcome for the first time in many years. Arnold felt felt. He was being shown the deference he deserved though the compliments were coming from an enemy state. They were like a bomb to arnold aggrieved grieved soul. It was the kind of answer he had so often hoped for from George Washington and yet had never received and of course there were the promises of money as much as benedict arnold wanted to please peggy and to receive some long-overdue overdue respect his greatest motivation to betray his comrades was financial gain after shutting down his mercantile business miss and spending his entire fortune to support himself while serving in the army benedict was ready to become financially stable once more but before arnold could get paid for his spying. He had to learn a whole new set of skills he he couldn't risk treasonous messages falling into the wrong hands. Luckily John Andre was something of an expert in codes in fact he just been promoted head of British intelligence for the American colonies in his very first letter to Benedict Arnold John established to secret message could use to communicate a book cipher and the use of invisible ink. Andrei instructed Arnold Arnold to choose any commonly available lengthy book for the book cipher then to write a message in Book Code Arnold would simply locate the words words he wanted to use in the book instead of writing words he would inscribe a new Miracle Code identifying the location of the desired word and for instance. If the word soldiers appeared on page thirty seven line nineteen word five of the reference Book Arnold would right thirty-seven nineteen five to reference that word according to Jennifer Wilcox Administrator at at the National Security Administration's national cryptologic museum book codes were very common around the time of the American Revolution Wilcox Fox goes on to state that such codes can provide excellent security if the sender and the receiver each have access to the same edition of the Book Book and the book contains many of the necessary words the only drawback these messages take a very long time time to decipher and if desired word is missing from the book and even more Cumbersome Code must be used to spell it out letter by letter Wilcox writes that Arnold and Andre initially used a method by which arnold would cross out the final number in a new miracle code they crossed out number would indicate that the reader should seek out the letter rather than the word corresponding with that number for instance if Arnold wanted to write Saratoga but that word wasn't found in his book he might use the cross outnumber code to refer for the reader to the s in Muscat the A in alcohol and so on and so forth however this proved incredibly cumbersome cumbersome the pair quickly switched to using a dictionary as their decoding book to ensure that they would have every word they could possibly need wilcox notes that dictionaries were easier to use book ciphers because they contained many words listed alphabetically however the use of the dictionary also made book ciphers easier to break even today book ciphers are fairly secure way to transmit secret information just as long as the message isn't intercepted by someone who knows what book you're using although it's more often seen in movies he's not in real life these days this old revolutionary spies trick stands the test of time but John Andrei wasn't wasn't ready to trust just one method of of the station with Benedict's top secret information instead. He suggested protecting their code in three three ways hagey would write letters ostensibly to a relative about an elderly friends health between the lines of Peggy's is letters Arnold would write his book coded messages in invisible ink then on the upper right hand side of the paper Arnold Arnold per andres orders wrote a key to the proper method of making the invisible ink appear either an F for fire or an a for acid shoot a message get intercepted even a fellow spy who could figure out the book code might be stymied by the invisible ink eh or a spy who could reveal invisible ink might be unable to decipher the book code the Americans also used invisible ink in their our own spying but it's unclear whether or not benedict arnold was aware of this according to historian Christie mccracken author of prisoners. There's lovers and spies some of the compounds used to make invisible ink over time have included Archer all the silver salt of a protein mixture sure iron chloride and lead acetate. We don't know exactly which inks Benedict Arnold used but any acidic fruit juice or vinegar vinegar can also be used as invisible ink when backed against the wall. Even human urine will do after these impoverished. I invisible inks have dried ironing the paper or putting it into a hot oven will reveal its message. Invisible ink continued to play Arolla in serious espionage even after the revolutionary war today most people think of invisible ink as the sort of thing you see in child's let's kit of magic tricks but for Benedict Arnold and later for soldiers in World War One it was the height of espionage technology eh but no matter which method of Code Benedict Arnold used he wanted even stronger assurances of compensation nations from John Andrei according to historian the th-annual Philbrick book valiant ambition Arnold wrote Andrei saying I will expect some certainty revenue equivalent to the risk in service don. He then added with his typical dramatic flair. I cannot cannot promise success. I will deserve it to prove his value. As a spy arnold also included several items of confidential information about continental troop movements and points of potential weakness in the American army for instance. He revealed that the outpost at Charleston South Carolina was too low on supplies to fend off any possible British attack. Thanks in part part to the Information Arnold provided the British army was able to besiege Charleston for six weeks. When the Americans surrendered on May twelfth seventeen eighty it proved to be a decisive victory for the British they now controlled the best harbor in the southern colonies and could began again increasing their military presence from Georgia to Virginia by night Arnold wrote out his secret messages suggest Andrei about American activities but by day he was still in the midst of defending himself against the Court Martial proceedings after Paul. If he were to remain valuable spy he would have to retain the trust of his fellow continental soldiers more than that he would have to to regain a responsible position in the army. Although Benedict Arnold was still unable to walk he was forced to travel to Middlebrook Brooke New Jersey for his trial there he discovered a moment of irony Henry Clinton John Andrei Superior Officer and the very man Arnold was secretly trying to help head launched an offensive that call George Washington away from his duties in the military justice system. The Court Martial was postponed indefinitely Clinton had inadvertently prevented Arnold from being able to spy for Clinton Arnold returned home in June of seventeen seventy nine with nothing to show for his trip upon opening joining his mail. He discovered a coded letter that did little to improve his mood. John Andre had suddenly refused to make any strong wrong promises regarding payment not only that his letter tactfully made reference to Benedict Arnold diminished level of value to the British war effort due to his poor reputation. It's unclear if the British had vetted arnold before agreeing to work with him an only just now discovered arnold woes regardless while the British were still willing to make use of Arnold. They certainly weren't going to to pay in advance. Andrei wrote than Arnold would need to secure a conspicuous command and orchestrate the surrender of of several thousand soldiers at that point he would receive two guineas for each man who surrendered or about three hundred and thirty six dollars in today's currency of course Andrei must have been well aware that this was an impossible task for the badly injured arnold he he wasn't fit to serve much less to command a force of thousands Arnold took the letter exactly as it was intended as a stinging rebuke. Luke meant to make him feel old useless and unwanted Andrea must have been deeply offended by Arnold's arrogant reply demanding manning more firm assurances of financial compensation although John Andrei had a great deal of respect for Peggy. He wasn't taking very well tour blustering husband. Perhaps it bothered him. That Arnold was so clearly a greedy mercenary rather than a heartfelt defender vendor of the monarchy like himself arnold in the heat of anger scribbled out another letter to John. Andrei using Joseph Stands Berry again is a currier Arnold response was delivered to the head of British intelligence immediately but but when John Andrei decoded the letter he found that it was merely a shopping list for various types of cloth and ribbon piggy shopping list presumably presumably the message was clear. I may have things to say but I have nothing to tell you even though he was still massively in debt thanks to the loan he had taken out to win. Over Peggy's father Arnold refused to take Andre slight lying coming down had he been younger and more able bodied man he might have challenged the British spy to dual instead. He traded an insult assault for an insult predictably. This message caused a breakdown in communication between Andre Arnold which which in turn caused considerable worry for Peggy. She badly wanted her husband to follow through on his promise to spy for the British. Her anxiety only became worse when midway through the year. Hegi learned that she was pregnant. It didn't exactly come comes a shock. A couple had a very active sex life which arnold used to brag about in letters to his male friends but the timing was is less than ideal with Arnold still facing a court martial and potentially jeopardizing his status as a new spy by insulting John Day. Hey the expanding family was in danger of total insolvency hagey again. N. begged her husband to give Andrey some information that would help general Clinton but as seventeen seventy nine dragged on the prideful Arnold refused to reopen the lines of communication in December of seventeen seventy nine benedict Arnold's Donald Court Martial finally began this preceding was all about his attempts to profit from his position as commander of Philadelphia though Oh he was guilty of several of the charges. None of them were terribly serious. He was in no danger of lengthy incarceration or execution representing himself. Benedict Arnold mounted a spirited defence that focused almost entirely on how much he'd sacrificed for the country entry. He eloquently told the panel about the blood he had shed. He wobbled on his badly injured legs inspiring pity he ranted and raved about the dangers endured. It was a feeble attempt to gain unadulterated sympathy in in January of seventeen eighty thirty nine year old benedict arnold was cleared of all but two charges the improper issuing a pass to a a friendship and the use of government wagons for personal purposes. His sentence would be a public reprimand. Although this was a very positive outcome arnold was furious. He unsuccessfully demanded that the public reprimand be dropped. It was a particularly securely stinging punishment because the reprimand was to come from George Washington himself steaming and Ashamed Benedict Benedict Arnold went home to his pregnant wife in puttered around the house. He spent much of his time numbing his injured leg with opium and alcohol. Hegi soon distracted him from his misery by giving birth to a baby boy in March of seventeen eighty at at age thirty nine. Benedict Arnold was a father for the fourth time he had no means of supporting this child having served since seventeen seventy ninety. Five is an unpaid officer in the continental army. He and Peggy were forced to move into a small home owned by Peggy's father so that they could rent doubt Arnold's larger home and use the rental income to support themselves in April of seventeen eighty. The promised reprimand demand was finally published. Washington called Arnold conduct peculiarly reprehensible as well as imprudent and improper proper but as Washington publicly chastise arnold he was also to arnold surprise writing a private letter to arnold contradicting the very reprimand in it. Washington exhorted Arnold to exhibit a new those noble qualities which have placed you on the list of our most valued commanders. I will myself furnish you so far. Is it be in my power with the opportunities for regaining leaning the esteem of your country. It was an unexpected boon coming. Just when Arnold was at his lowest. The commander commander-in-chief was personally willing to provide him with new opportunities arnold mentally skipped over the part about exhibiting more positive positive character traits in his own mind. Washington had promised him a huge favor and arnold knew exactly what he wanted over the long months of waiting I for his trial and then for the reprimand he'd had plenty of time to think about and how he was going to be useful to the British without the use of his legs he certainly couldn't lead a large company of soldiers in the battle as has Andrei had suggested in their last terse correspondence but he could command of Fort and he knew just the right the one located in New York state West Point was the crown jewel of Washington's defensive strategy adage heavily fortified in strategically located along the Hudson River West Point was crucial to prevent the British from splitting the New England colonies from the Middle Colonies Arnold handing the Ford over would be a true prize John Andrei in General Henry Clinton Arnold knew it would take some work to convince Washington. He was suited for the command at West Point. It required Washington to replace the current Commander Commander Robert. How after planting the seed in Washington Arnold reopened his correspondence with John Andrei writing as if the command was already his as he waited for both responses. Arnold redoubled his efforts to get his legs to work again his old musket. Injury didn't bother him quite so much anymore these days with a little practice he managed to even get back on a horse. This however had an unfortunate side effect arnold briefly convinced Washington that he was ready for field duty over his own objections. Arnold was ordered to command the left wing of a defending force in New York on August. I seventeen eighty eighty he'd be fighting alongside Washington and his men just like old times but he'd be far from West Point and the attack Washington was expecting would come from Henry Clinton. The Very General Arnold was trying to help lucky for arnold the offensive offensive was called off at the last minute as if in sympathy to Arnold for depriving him of another chance at battle George Washington added a postscript to his general orders on August third reading simply arnold will take command of the garrison at West Point even though he'd been begging for this appointment for months reading the words came as a total shock finally benedict arnold had the resolution to all his financial problems in his hands if he could just turn west point over the British he'd never want for money again and all he had to do in exchange was betray. His countrymen countryman his comrades in arms and his nation. Thank you for listening espionage. We'll be back Friday with the conclusion to our story on Benedict Arnold including Arnold's attempt to surrender west point his dramatic capture and these shocking second betrayal of his country. You can find more more episodes of espionage and all other par- cast originals for free on spotify not only to spotify already have all your favorite music but spotify is making it easy for you to enjoy all of your favorite podcast originals like espionage for free from your phone desktop or smart speaker to stream espionage on spotify just open the APP and type espionage in the search bar and don't forget to follow us on facebook and instagram at podcast and twitter twitter at podcast network. We'll be back next week with another deep dive into the world of clandestine operation espionage was created by Max Cutler is a production of cutler media man is part of the podcast network it is produced by Maxon Ron Cutler sound designed designed by Anthony Val sick with production assistance by Ron Shapiro and Paul Moller additional production assistance by Maggie admire and Freddie Beckley. This episode of espionage was written by Yellen a war on Carter Roy. If you haven't listened yet be sure to check out on my other show sports criminals it explores some of the most significant African sports crimes throughout the world listen and subscribed to sports criminals for free on spotify and anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

twenty-three-year-old Arnold arnold Benedict Arnold Benedict Arnold John George Washington Benedict Arnold Brown Washington Arnold continental army Arnold House British army Colonel Arnold Quebec City Arnold Peggy Schuyler Island Arnold Canada Arnold Arnold Washington currier Arnold John Andrei Washington
No 102: PC Big Brother S3E1

Podcast 42

1:11:44 hr | 1 year ago

No 102: PC Big Brother S3E1

"It's cutting into your exercise time it stabbing you in the back nine and it's attacking your peace of mind. It's pain and it's getting in between you and the life few onto live c._b._d. Medic target your pain at its source. It's fast acting relief with active o._t._c. Ingredients plus the added benefits of t._h._c. free hemp oil. Get get back to your life with c._b._d. Medic available online and at c._b._s. These statements have not been evaluated by the f._d._a. This product is not intended to diagnose treat cure or prevent any disease. It was at this moment. He knew damn son. Where'd you find this joist. I dreams i now listening to the world's most popular inaccurate and sometimes squirrel jay telling if pop culture history it's podcast forty two on the folks in iraq subroto s._o._l. That's all i'm gathering late. Wait what when somebody barges it. You and i are going to be the first to go well. You might be the first to go. Oh definitely the first means uh-huh betting just get outta here you on the other hand not going back to the door. You can't even see what's happening. I would probably shove you that direction in that way it wow you're gonna costanza me totally speaking of costanza somebody it's time for podcast forty two. I'm christopher devos. I'm sabrina pierre. Jail tros as of right now. I'm laura how old you really ditch me. Somebody goes through that door the himself you cannot fit with your back to the door. I am so glad that i'm learning all this tonight of all episodes. I remember number that way peeling back the curtain jails chair is closest to the door in the podcast room and he sits with his back act two it the most vulnerable position well only for you because we're over so many for normal people sitting anywhere in a room is fine in all honesty. I actually need your spot my spa yeah. Have you ever noticed. I still sit with my back towards you because i have to face the door. Somebody were to come through the window. You walk through a window. Nobody eddie oh yeah he he goes through anything annoying man cool in all fairness laura or myself would be the worst case scenario for for kool. Aid man owned oh well. This is one of my favorite episodes we do. This'll be the third year we're doing it. We are playing pop pop or pulp. It works either way but we're actually blaming pop culture big brother. It was pulp because i don't like popa might warns teeth. What if it was like. Pulp fiction does exactly it. Pulp is like a fiction in the thirties. These and i will have a royale with cheese well. I still don't like pulp in my own way so if it was the thirties you'd have a book inside your o._j. So that makes sense. That's really weird fairness. I just don't like o._j. Not ever since the nineties i it opened up the beer cooler who rain all right okay. What did you bring us. I'm here to cover up today so we got from goose island. It's their s. p. F. green it is sunscreen. It's a passion fruit. Ale will right off the bat the labels zero while they changed their marketing. It's very bland now. All i'm losing my hat. It is super bland. Why would you want this. This looks like a like a generic. Mary kay product like a lucky beer cookies market now and almost looks like a can of pepco business now not picked up his move. It's mine lotion. It's pink. It's my signature 'tricolore yeah. It's my signature color but it's not a good pink. It's a like a doll pink. Columbine lotion pink no columbine columbine lucien like a bright. I can't <unk> abysmal arguing over the shade of pink right. Well we can continue arguing over the shade of pink and the taste of beer at the very end of the show. What is what is it from subic millions at something in bashful. I haven't seen steel magnolias. The color is blush and bashful. I think that was the last movie olympia dukakis ever made <hes> touche. Was that a good or bad adamou new link ooh jail <hes>. It's a good one for now. I sip good all right so this is how how we play our pop culture big brother game wanna read out the instructions. It's probably going to be as clear as mud but one inch. We start playing it. You'll be like okay so for the head of household will have a it'll either be. It's gonna be like the show if you're unfamiliar with the show so it's basically like survivor but in a house and if you're unfamiliar with survivor <hes> let's see what the amazing using race. It's like the amazing race but on an island and they starve to death and you don't race oh so it's like deadliest catch. It's like the deadliest catch but not in a boat. You're not catching anything and you're probably not going to die so it's not like america's next top model. It's actually exactly like america's orca. Stop model because there's a lot of people in big brother but and they're snarky but there's not a guy standing over you who is kinda biting his lip and going my husband faceoff. Yes it's kind of like faceoff except there's no makeup and while they do get naked on both shows but <hes> it's more blurred out on big brother anyway. It's a reality competition set in a house else. They have competitions. They usually have it's either divide up into strength or intellect competitions. We're going to do that to pick a head of house that have houses in charge charge of nominating to people to kick out of the house they have a power of veto after that and that's a chance for somebody to save themselves from being kicked out and then and it goes down all the way to one last person whoever the final person standing on the show wins five hundred thousand dollars on the pie you in a tic tac is it an orange tic tac ooh gluten-free banana tic tac and it's been under my bed for two and and half years when the minions came out so let us introduce our teams who wants to go. I i vote laura all right my name. Everyone has five people on their team seems pretty awesome and we're gonna win. I have napoleon ryan. He's pretty cool. <hes> might know what did not going to lie this without originally conquer a short there you tell what your team persons famous for even though should be obvious but you never know there might be a space alien or baby listening to the show is unfamiliar. Okay well for all my peeps at area fifty. One napoleon is a french conquer who ran his way in here. Yes he did. He narrowed him and his way throughout the warriors. He was known for sticking his hand in his shirt contest singer. Yes and he's a piggy. He has the he likes to watch us. Ally the i may or may not have been watching bill tastes expletive into and i picked that person yes so my next one is the war odin sun god of thunder. He's pretty strong amazing amazing <hes> although he has had a run with depression and his gains points it's okay still amazing and then i have robin williams i love him. He's funny a great personal. The guy i think socially he will take my game far. Yes yes speaking of depression. That was mean chris but accurate is accurate. I i just thought that was really weird. Segue wrote them and think of it that way. Maybe it's like a horrible person terrible job well. I'm gonna get the letters yeah you hold on. I have to look at melissa again. We know who's getting voted off. I go timber in. He's pretty awesome weird. I i love him. What does tim burton known for. Only makes the greatest movies ever build houston really you didn't leave what mars attacks like l. martin tax speaking of our area fifty one peeps like ed wood and and what's the vampire one dark shadow shattered pat and beetlejuice in nightmare before we don't talk about his disney remakes. That was good see it. Oh oh good yeah. I have a thing about disney remakes right now and then of course only the best schuyler sister in the world peggy schuyler. I'm not sure what but she's famous for except for being the sister-in-law to alexander hamilton she's famous for being one line one song work and peggy she she went crazy that is true because she wasn't known for anything except for you know been amilton sister-in-law and peggy all right well. I'll go next. I picked for my five people people. I picked colonel sanders who's known for making fried chicken and having a beard not goatee <hes> he's also so known for being played by many different people anymore and his head is really big in his body's very tiny. That's true. I saw that <hes> <hes> george costanza played colonel sanders here. Just recently. I picked also picked steve harrington. He's from the show stranger things. He's the guy with the hair. That always gets beat up. He's the guy ad that was supposed to be the jerky guy and then ended up being like everyone's favourite care. I love steve my next pick. I hope he wins. I like him it on your but i really went on how this competition i get eh. He needs to win something in life. He's pretty is my sleeper pick for this. There's a two year old tick tack on the line. That's what i in here and then my third pick is the reverend run simmons one third of one of the greatest rap groups ever run run d._m._c. Oh i thought it was the b._c. Voice i said one of the greatest beastie boys is up there as well but wren dmc had a huge hand and the beastie boys career so they're just a slight slight bid little bit over the beastie boys number four for me. Is i g eighty. Hey i don't think i really have to explain that one. Everyone knows who are aging there could be some a my alien peeps and area fifty one or a baby listening who does not know i j._d. Is and therefore used the aliens would definitely know who i e. Eighty eight is because he's one of it now. Will you tell her it's one of the greatest bounty saudi hunters to come out of star wars boba fett no idea he's really tall skinny robot looking one that looks it's like he has a lantern for a head. Yes he has no lines in the movie and he only has z role. No he doesn't do anything stand and he's there standi. He's about he's got about. Maybe six seconds of screen time. I'll put it this way <music>. I don't even remember him in any of the movie expect even after kris explain to me who he was and how great he thought he was and having relaxed star worth. I still don't remember him in any of the movies. There's rumors that he's going to be making appearances mandatory in the t._v. Show that's going to be on disney snoop plus ooh. Yes unconfirmed rumors but he be making his boss going to be there too because that would make it. I'm not sure if the whole planet is full of bounty hunters but i would think if that's the theme of the show that all those hunters should appear at some point us well in untrue disney history. Take whatever they say. It's going to be the general idea of what they're doing and take it all out but this is jon favreau and i think he'll stay true to like the history of star wars. I think they'll probably say john. You just do what you think is good. Hopefully that's what they're going to say yeah okay. Who's your last one. Jack black who jack black actor musician <hes> jack black extraordinaire he was in jumanji on june one half today shis d yet one half of today's d. He is allowed fat guy intonations the any movie that he's it now. He was pretty good. He was very loud and jumanji. No awesome job and jimmy carter lumber being very loud in mars attacks. Ah i like the muppet movie. I think he's very underrated. He's one of those actors who you really like are really hate because i couldn't have to ido oh but i totally thinking the original movie what you said it not. The muppets yeah the muppets all right sabrina. I have chosen. Mary poppins practically perfect in every way. Even though i had to lower string score you did because she's a regular person and you gave her a strength score of twenty three. I even know we're only going to ten because she's magical put sh- if she's very thinly perfect and she's not lifting anything over thirty pounds sounds like erin. She'll lifted a table. Okay with the magic doesn't count as magic for strength all the way now that we're discussing this. I do have to think about or no no no. Thor is is naturally strong but she carries that bag full of all that stuff show house in there. That's pretty <hes> no. It's all tiny teeny tiny marble size. She has to blow it up that means. I am shaky right at you because honestly at this point point if she's magical. Why didn't she take baltimore. I didn't have to sit through all those movies too for that. Let's put it this way. Mary poppins then. I think she did he. He go to hogwarts she probably did. I believe you gave mary poppins. Stronger scores then some of jails wrestlers on his list the my probably has he has zero confidence confidence. We'll see how this plays out for. Mary poppins miss piggy. Who is she missed. Miss figures one of the kardashians yes the kurdish pitch khloe before the plastic surgery. Uh-huh missing letters are coming our guys. I'm not affiliated with this. Show miss piggy <hes> career at the frogs girlfriend karate chopper extraordinaire uh-huh that i've got ron weasley harry potter's best friend was brilliant. Can we talk now. Ron ron ron ron weasley and then tina fey <hes> who is a comedienne median extraordinaire. She was the first female head writer fresno. Amy poehler is holding up. She wrote mean girls. I really tried the hard cases. I say that nobody can see how hard i'm trying not to laugh yeah and then last night lisa's gilda radner who was actually the first person cast s._n._l. She's also a comedian extraordinaire. The original cast of us know and married to gene wilder i could but i believe amy. Poehler colored did have a big hand in tina phase saturday night live career because they did ask cat together. I think amy poehler was head of ass cat. That's what it's called. The dan and tina fey don't care they performed under her if i remember right but it could be backwards <music> but i think they gave me polar was one of the heads of ascot. Let ask it's an improv. It's a long form improv game where you tell l. a. story but slinging our long story. It's <hes> it'd be incredibly hard. I couldn't imagine doing it. Are you ready. I'm ready all right so i brought the in my opinion third greatest frontman of all time to the house because you know right after david really roth and freddie mercury. We're getting axl rose whose that's right. He's going to welcome everybody to the jungle and take them down to the paradise city. I'm gonna watch you bead read. That's right foul by the greatest super villain of all time lex luthor your son yes superman yeah. He's gonna run into fences anthony highlander that can be only one then. I'm bringing in the self-proclaimed best in the world for professional wrestling but he's here here within oh into m._m._a. Record punk. He hasn't fought since <hes> no he's done to emma matches and he hasn't wrestled in probably four years. Wow then bono's big brother. Four knows sports bo jackson is going to win at all because bono's he's gonna gonna win and then the big threat of the night the original american idol because she's gonna take it all kelly clarkson so as we were arguing earlier and i think i forgot to mention this but each character's assigned a strength score a social score and al intellect score and their one out of ten and that'll help us determine who wins what competitions all right well. Let's start week one house. Everyone gets to pick somebody from their team to compete every or head of household at random mouth bucket gonna roll a dice to see if it strength or intellect competition. It's a twenty sided dice. One through ten is strength. Levin through twenty is is intellect. Hold paper like the world series of poker like what i picked. Yes nobody can see what you picked. It is a intellect competition as an eighteen is rolled. I have colonel sanders competing with the intellect of eight. I have tina fey with an intellectual nine. I have axl rose with an intellect selective seven robin williams with an intellect of nine okay so to see who wins head of household is going to be your intellect score plus a random score generated from your twenty site dice already one too so combined score. That's a fine score of intellect eight and a roll of twelve twenty for sanders. I ruled three. I know i have. I rolled an eleven so i have eighteen gays ready. I roll although once and so glad you didn't take jerk because it'd be weird it right now. What's funny is we did a practice ronald colonel sanders who has very low scores all the way around and he won the practice round as well. I feel like this game is ranked colonel oleanders. Here's is the seven herbs and spices master other guys. I'm putting colonel sanders up the i can't together yeah that'd be a week player is clearly one to already started so make sure you put on your guys back in your head of household bucket and now colonel sanders gets to nominate two people to be put on the block. One of these two people may be kicked out so we're going with number one. Mary poppins coming and i am. I'm gonna take shots. I'm gonna take big shots and big moves. People who i think are going to hurt my game and dominated so colonel sanders yeah. I am putting up thor no. The lawyer is depressed than the corner. You can't do that to store seriously saliha. You're so mean equally now. I'm no threat can't even rolled so now the war mary poppins have a chance to take themselves off the block how we're going to do this is checking my notes. I because we changed. We've tweet the game a little bit <hes> each nominee can pick one person to play for them and then three people will be picked randomly to help so thor. Who would you like to play for you. I'm going to have peggy play for me peggy. Yes yeah that is not who. I thought you were gonna pick yeah so this is in conjunction to yes. Authorities gonna play a._m. Peggy is going to play ms piggies also gonna play as picky and actually list as in tradition with pop culture big brother are we are tweaking the rules on the fly so we just need one random person from the fishbowl. I think head of household should pick that. I don't think so colonel sanders is terrible person toy really everybody. We should get colonel sanders out. Hey stop conspiring already. I'm sorry the players oh yeah. Let's get pop. Pop pop is overrated. Everybody playing in the veto competition is mary. Mary poppins thor peggy miss piggy colonel sanders and gilda radner. We're now going to roll to see if it's the spring so it's pretty pretty much sabrina his whole team. Yeah looks like it yeah man. Lose your whole team. Just let you down yeah. They say that in the nicest way possible right now it's going to happen. It'll happen to me to later. It's okay so rolling to see this as a strength or intellect competition and it is intellect to figure out who wins this competition it's going to be everyone's intellect plus their social. Don't roll the dice. Nope okay. I have to do math now guys got your mouth got my math. You got all my mirror. We adding again so it's what mary poppins ms piggies and gilda radner cz yes. You have to do a lot of math because all your pizza. I have three people gilda. Radner wins with eighteen where we were going to announce. What's the scores beat you to it. No 'cause it out policies but we're taking too long for me. There was along post scores for scores for mary. Poppins is seventeen four sixteen piggy piggy. Colonel sanders is sixteen and gilda eighteen eighteen gilda wins the power of veto so is gilda. Gonna take anybody off the block or leave noms the same now. I'm taking mary poppins off taken. Mary poppins off the block which means colonel colonel sanders can now pick a replacement on the block and is that at random or is that just however head of household gets to pick okay just like the t._v. Show you'll go back in all right. Can you put somebody else really strong because i don't like the. I don't want to go home. <hes> really cool guy. I am going going to pick. I'm going to pick and think idea de cinco use one of my own people. I said he's also really strong and i am going to pick <hes>. This is a tough because so early. I am going with miss piggy. It's like to that. That's not who i thought he was going to pick here. Do you think i'm not saying jimmy. I i can't show is called a whispered so now what happens so now. I can't vote as house jail. L. decides yes. No who's on the block is okay so yes oh actually to decide by sore. He's too strong ogg. That's not fair if i would've loved mary poppins sup- it out too. It's true so now you take four out of your bucket throws might as well throw online on the floor now. No no no no no next. We're going for colonel. Sanders was not the plan for now working with you not be one of those big brother career say. I'm gonna try to let on your hand can't make funds for live. Hi is this is how you're gonna treat me all alone. In this house i would have kept him around except he was a threat to my beer cooler. The true had his own beer doctor strange with providing it of course i couldn't find thor in the fishbowl. That's that's because it was his time to leave camp. Come back. He's back in the house. Everybody i tried to next year probably need help but to try to do all those little little tiny things that big brother does for chances of comebacks and stuff but <hes> have to really think about it for next year so it's time again to use to put up. Who would you like for head of household random draw from your head of household. I have steve harrington from stranger things. I have gilda radner kelly kelly clarkson. I have a second it can be doctor. Strange used time they they come out on your goal he just he refused to go and he doesn't leaving out here. He's god of thunder and rock and roll robin williams sabrina role to see what kind of competition asus at the three that would be the strength competition. Did you really pick robin williams. Okay all right so roll. Your died to add to your strength score. Steve has five strength plus. My fifteen role for twenty killed her abner s. fifteen now she was a foreign she rolling levin kelly was a four but she wrote a fourteen now. She's in eighteen eighteen. Hey robin williams is a five. I rolled eighth fifteen so twenty twenty all right so we'll do a roll off. I have ten at sixteen. Hey you are head of household mandate. Uh-huh why throw somebody guys. I'm getting for colonel sanders time around nominating colonel sanders understood win <hes> no. I'm gonna also nominate lex luther. Not mary poppins. I was just i'm going to say i was getting ready to pull mary. Not mary poppins vow grudge holder here from from sanders. We all know if mary poppins was in there or would still be in the house. That's not very odd so now we're going to play for p._o._v. It is it is colonel. Sanders lex luthor lex luthor robin williams. Somebody pick somebody you get to pick someone. Can you get picked up randall. Yeah yeah we pick somebody is robin. I didn't from your axl rose axl rose and reverend reverend run and then i pick one from the physio. I'll forget the rules each round to everybody knows hit. Every this looks looser. He's playing twice voice at a repick tactful. Ask ron weasley. Hey that's me run ron ron weasley all right head of house- roll your dice ac- what competition we're playing. It's a four four so it is a the strength competition. It's your strength score. Plus your social score. Oh boy i'm in trouble. Just gonna read them down. In order that i wrote them. Colonel sanders. I has twelve lex luther fourteen robin williams fourteen axl rose thirteen seven-run has thirteen and ron weasley fourteen fourteen so we got a three way tie roll of the dice get they got three. I got twenty twenty eighteen eighteen so ex-oil you win. Are you taking lex out. You're not taking colonel. Well why not he makes great chicken he does but you. You can't colonel sanders out of the house. Yeah i know but i'm not kicking my son out of the house this early. They pick a second nominee to put on the block. I g eighty eight the two people up there now. I can't believe you didn't pick who i thought you would. Mary poppins well. Neither i or laura can pick since i have two people on the block it is jail and dance sabrina hillary and the vote now that there's people loading boat. We'll see if they vote the same or if they vote w we'll get final say if we tie yes. That's how it works writing it down home now. Just go ahead. You go first colonel sanders you really. I guess you're cooking in your own meals in this. Honestly i'm going g-8 either way chew gum. It really didn't even get a chance to do anything and he's my strongest character. Just really wanted more the chance to kick somebody of chris who won the p._o._v. africa laura now axl rose rose p._o._v. What's p._o._v. san for again. Actually wouldn't it be lex luther because his was higher power vida. No eleven fourteen selects whoever it is important yes lex luthor when power of veto tokyo v. so he took himself down by by egging me a second official. This'll become easier as the weeks go on the head of household tina fey bo jackson napoleon colonel sanders. The human got liquid on your microphone over here all right jail l. roll see what competition were playing one. It's a strength strength competition gray man of four a good role one time i have strength of four plus a roll of ten for fourteen. I have a strength of five plus a roll of seventeen for twenty to you have a strengthened nine with three for twelve and i have a strength of four with a roll of twenty four eight twenty. Oh great. I'm going home again. Then polian is head of household yeah he liked waterslide ride from going in the dire room crying the first week everything that's because she wanted the random or hookup hookup by the end of the show is going to be my showman all right who he put up on the block. I am going to put up mary. Poppins already the grabbing sure you were and bella jackson bo bo jackson. I wasn't going to mention that. Jail wins wins every year. I'm going to say that the rules have changed this year. I can't ah i can't play the way i used to. Yes expect the unexpected like they say on the t._v. Show or in my case. I have no idea what takes so so mary poppins and bo jackson can randomly pick somebody for their team. Okay ron weasley. Lex luthor pinhead of house can randomly pick from fishbowl. Axel rothe will look at you jail stuck in the house in your favorite. The odds might not be in my favor all right head of house role to see what kind of competition we are playing. I have no skin in this game whatsoever. I'm completely out one one so it's a strength competition in your strength plus your social okay all right napoleon ten. Mary poppins fifteen bo jackson seventeen ron weasley fourteen lex luthor fourteen axl rose thirteen bo jackson is taking himself out. That's weird. That means changed polian. You need to nominate somebody else. It can't be i g eighty-eight ortho or but it can be colonel sanders. Yes it can be colonel sanders. I am going to <music> nominate miss picky so we have on the block mary poppins and miss piggy that takes sabrina out of voting and it takes laura laura out of voting means to me and jail okay. I think we might say the same thing yeah one two three mary good because because i already marked her up. I would just like to point out at this time that we all lost somebody except for k. l. It's week three yeah. Well things happen sailing. Keep an eye out for him. Who won the power veto. Belle boat jackson bono's ohno's veto. You do realize i'm gonna say bo bo knows veto every week. You're going to say bono's every week. I'm going to say bono's until he's he's no longer there until you can we can. We vote them out next week. Please gunning for bow and annot colonel sanders don't onto don't mess with my colonel sanders colonel sanders darkhorse this entire thing right now all right week number four random pick for head of house- i did colonel sanders get kicked out no no not yet colonel sanders it colonel sanders. Nobody else picked anything. Gilda radner seattle punk right laura role for competition one now. It's a seven seven is strength and really get it rolling. Well numbers guys. I have a strength of four plus a roll of sixteen for twenty. I have a strength of four plus a roll of one minks five. Who is your guy gilda radner. I have strength of seven with a roll of five for twelve and a strength of five with a roll of fifteen for twenty. Oh it's a roll off between me and you. We're not good at this sabrina. I would like to point out the very poppins lasted longer than both laura and chris characters because you all wanted to get rid of th- war. Let's see who got rid of. What what team got rid of eight. I can't remember my best players more it. Let's go with napoleon on the block where napoleon he's so cute. You never know how to spell napoleon. It's the ice cream. I don't know how to spell the crate. Anybody gets that ice cream the strawberry. I always the last one to go yeah and who's going to be good for my game to get out of the house. I will go bo jackson well. There's both bo knows the laura and j. l. You can pick randomly to players to help you out and robin williams. I got 'em punk doc and ron. Weasley is the other one so we have colonel sanders the polian bo jackson ron weasley n._c._a._a. Punk all right so the competition is going to be a intellect competition is year intellect plus. Your social bono's this doesn't look good is bo low on intellect bo strong uh-huh scores. You can say okay colonel sanders with sixteen polian sixteen bo jackson listen thirteen ron weasley thirteen and see. 'em punk thirteen guy. Who's your second guy. What's robin eighteen eighteen eighteen really all right robin. Do you wanna keep nominations the same or do you want to take somebody off the block taking the pulling off the block of course that's weird. Let's see whose team hasn't had anybody also under yep. Somebody has a stacked tea and we're going for it. Oh go for it. Yes famous last words. You may be swayed me here or you may not be. I'm going see punk told me that all right so i cannot vote and j. L. cannot vote leaves it up to the ladies spo- jackson or see. 'em poke now when we do. The competitions strength is strength and social so an elected elected social. What how do we get no. That's only for <hes> the view yeah so how does that. How does that work you add them for the they're going to be strengthened social or reluctant social okay. That's a weird question to ask this far in and i was just curious. Okay who won the power of veto rather than lions. I got going on here. Okay all right ladies bo jackson or see. 'em punk. I'm going bo bo jackson by pipo knows he's done it. You have persuaded me with your words j. l. I think you're correct who has a stack team. They look looking over there but i'm looking over there. Uh but i'm looking well. I know i'm going after next anyway. It's me no. I know which ones i would go after next but i don't know if everybody else knows who they would go after. I know who i'm gonna my goal. I actually don't know who i'm going after next. I do know who i'm going there. I am going after next week. Five live head of house- who ruled the last ice for the head of house- laura six. It's a strength competition. I have steve harrington. I have gilda radner back so rose and timber all right. Steve has a strength of five plus roll of thirteen for eighteen. <hes> gilda has a strength of four plus. A roll of twelve four sixteen axle has a strength of six plus a roll of thirteen eighteen for one thousand nine hundred and tim burton has a strength of four with a roll of three for seven. Oh it's like you didn't even try brian. This is going to mope over here in cornerman. I believe that makes the winter yep. Axel is going to nominate nate. I'm surprised axel showed up on time for the competition. We started late enough. It's okay axel is going to nominate robin williams uh-huh and gilda radner interesting all right so robin is with lauren gildo is with sabrina so you guys can pick for p._o._v. if you hand the fishbowl j. l. so who's all plane. We we have axl rose. Robin williams. I pick napoleon gilda radner napoleon tina fey tina fey and from the fishbowl steve harrington steve. Steve steve is flinging his hair round going. Yes i got picked for something yeah but he's he gets beat up does get beat up so jail you get to roll for what kind of competition we're doing the fifteen fifteen that would be intellect going to be the laura. It's going to be the i for intellect doc plus the s._c. For social. I thought that was just the line between the two maria all right excellent thirteen or fourteen fourteen fourteen robin eighteen gilda eighteen napoleon sixteen tina seventeen and steve has a thirteen so it is a tie between robin and gilda roll the dice fourteen eleven gilda takes herself off the block yep. I'm putting miss piggy and so it's up to me and on the block is miss piggy and robin williams. I am going wean with. I am going with miss piggy. He had already moved her to the side. I i almost picked robin williams robin. Why did you give me a dirty look. That's how this game is played on big brother all right head of household week number or six. Oh i've got a new person in this time. Not a nude person person sanders returned. Take i pick jack. Oh really his new. I have a ron weasley. Kelly clarkson and robin williams <hes>. I'm robin williams is showing up a lot all right sabrina role for head of household competition eight eight. That would be a strength six. Now this goes out. Jack black has a strength of five with a roll of fourteen for nineteen gene. Ron has a string of seven with the role of two for nine. Kelly has a strength of four with the role of six for ten robin. Williams has a strength of five with a roll of eight four thirteen. I believe i went jack. Gonna play the air guitars. He wins. Wow now we're gonna go with robin. Williams robin and we're going to shake it up. We we are going with what go go you own. The black lex luther correct zoro's scratch irate. Jail and laura pick people to play for you. Okay and fishbowl are right. So we have plane jack black robin williams axl rose lex luthor lex luthor and the polian napoleon and peggy work angelica <hes> work work elisa and peggy. It is a strength competition out okay all right. Jack has a total score of fourteen robin. Williams fourteen axl rose thirteen lex luthor sore fourteen napoleon on ten and peggy twelve so three roloff is the three roll off twenty three. I got sixteen so jack is going to keep the nominations the same sabrina so who's nominated robin williams and axl axl rose axl rose that was quick quick way to keep one of the strongest people around around yeah but she's a bad roller. Hey terrible role as doesn't mean anything about the rolling terrible. I guess i should just went with my original thought on what to do for you. Now you like what did i do. You know how vengeful i am. Yes my scene jail. Get really upset at this game with james wasn't it. It was and nicole call because they try ganging up on me all right. It's clean out the fishbowl real quick and we are into week seven. Let's remind everyone who's kicked out so far so far. We've lost four. I g eighty-eight for some weird weird reason the strength of tan hannah. That's why i got picked off mary poppins because she's perfectly kicked off in every way bo oh jackson miss piggy and axl rose and so far it looks pretty even <hes> it looks like jails jails taking the biggest hit no jail sabrina bow take sue biggest hit so far so let's head of household week seven i pick steve harrington ron weasley lex luthor and i'm in a work work with peggy peggy stern she was she was a floater now. She's starting to come and play some more well yeah. She didn't want to get lost. You pick the challenge twenty that would collect interlocked all right. Steve has an elective six with a roll of ten for sixteen. Ron has an intellect of six with a roll of nine for fifteen lex luther as an elective nine with the role of five for fourteen can carry the one well who on twenty one. I had a we're doing intellects never mind yes nineteen clearly not very smart. I have an an elective nineteen. She was a six with a roll of thirteen for nineteen. That's fine. You're just looking at the wrong number. I was really big. Numbers piggy wins since oh work work. I nominate angelica out of and then she's playing. Who are you nominating. Who's actually in the house. I am actually i am going to nominate colonel sanders why he's done nothing gene. I'm sorry it makes me laugh every tie cooked chicken and hello off color southern jokes and where pressed white suits suits and bolo ties said talk about his plantation yes well. Maybe it's his plantation. That's getting him in trouble and i'm also going to nominate jack black. Why jack black has been playing music every night for everybody while he's got tickets to his next movie for free for you. Listen listen. I just don't want blood on my hands. <hes> not on my eight eight so jack got colonel sanders and well. I got to people's pick one and the head of house- can pick to where is the fish bowl we have plane for power lex lex luther and we also have playing for vito tina fey so in the competition we have colonel sanders steve harrington jack black peggy lex luther and tina fey head of house- role to see what competition we're playing. It is nine. It's a straightened straightened nine nine minutes a strength competition out of your strain plus your social so here's a weird question. Why why wouldn't he get to pick since he has two left he told me to pick to. I was just wondering like how we came with the. I don't know i don't know okay guys. Is it 'cause. I think it'd be two stacked pick. No that's fair. I was just wondering how we came to that. Damn colonel sanders but he was nominated is elliot's nominated then lex luthor and tina fey all right all right so colonel sanders has a twelve steve errington has thirteen and jack black has twelve peggy twelve lex luther fourteen and tina fey thirteen lex luther. Would you like to keep noms the same or no. Let's change it up i would because you're dastardly and i'd like to take out colonel sanders. Oh thank you. I'm a little extra spicy the <hes> extra crispy under your bed tonight <hes>. That's the only reason why he did that. I don't know about the chicken. No it's not i have. I have a theory here. I think i am going to remain on gilda radner all right so we have jack black and gilda radner on the block o that leaves jail all with the choice in your hands alone. He's looking at the stats. I am unfortunately it comes down to social because other than that they're pretty much the same aimed minus one digit like there's really one number off of it and i think that social unfortunately gilda because of her perfect ten sociability is what scares gares me in eliminations already moved to the side but numbers wise. I think that they're both pretty even and that was a tough one. That was lex luther that one the p._o._v. right. Yes it was week number eight yeah by the way who does everybody have left on their team. Raanan tina have lex see 'em punk and kelly kelly. I have jack black colonel sanders steve and run and i have napoleon tim burton robin williams and peggy heke speaking of run. That's who i picked the rather than run so i didn't think he was ever gonna show up. I thought he was just playing behind the scenes now time very much. He's been a floater so far he's been laying hello to you say laura. I'll have converted. I got kelly ron weasley ron weasley speaking of people playing in the background. I feel like this is the first time we've really seen him in a main main head of household challenge no he's been in the last three through the challenge. I haven't really written his name down the ones i'm jan you guys put i. I believe it's your turn to roll for competition okay. It's an eleven that would be intellect all right the reverend run has intellect of seven and i rolled a seven for fourteen iran's gonna intellect of six. I wrote a one for seven. That's that's a very weasley thing right there what he's been rolling so rally intellect of eight and i rolled a twelve while tim burton has been elected eight and i rolled one for nine <music> so jail. You're in control again. I'm sorry kelly really clarkson. She is missing independent self-sufficient. That's right all right all right. Kelly who's in your target. It will be robin williams and jack black. Jack black is giving you the eyebrow right now. I know there's going to be like it's like physical comedy by by the end of it so robin and people to help with him fishbowl police and fish bowl to jail sabrina so kelly had a household robin williams who'd you pick we packed napoleon nice who jack black jack black that got steve harrington and from the random fishbowl. It's the m punk though he can't play now he can't he's still in. I'm sorry i thought it got kicked out at some point but he didn't. He survived. No bono's elimination. You're only using that he was well. It's not my fault. He threw it out out there. So kelly you get to pick competition eleven so intellect intellect competition so intellect plus social aright right. Jack black has a score of sixteen steve. Harrington has a score of thirteen kelly clarkson seventeen robin and williams eighteen napoleon sixteen and see. 'em punk thirteen robin wins. Ravin is going to take himself down. Weird eared all right kelly who's going up in place of robin tina fey tina fey j. jack black on the block yep. It's down to you between tina and jack. I'm in the same vision. You're like their numbers off by one you know i'm a i'm gonna go jack black so so. I think that was a smarter decision. You know that's my character is based on what's going on. It's that same development right there great and looking at the numbers for who's around. I had more characters in the pot so it was better to get rid of me. Even though that's me <music> jail if you could grab jack the fishbowl all right this is chris in laura and <hes> in our new format. I had decided that we were never going to do to parties anymore but guess what what this episode ended up being so long and i told everybody i was going to release it as one episode but now it's two episodes. Ooh i'm not a liar. It's two and a half hours long. You told everybody was going to be one nine and tell everybody is going to be one on our no one episode but it's two and a half hours long married two episodes yeah. It's longer than endgame mm-hmm now. It's <hes> oh it's close to being as long as endgame no not even with all the pauses in it it still super super long and i took out all the pauses so we're leaving off at week nine and we will resume it at we tend and find out who is the winner of pop culture big brother season three. We'll find out if jail jail is still as evil as he was and season two and season one vialli sweetie. I didn't spoil anything. I think i can spoil. No don't spoil have to listen to the second part and it'd be one so yea but that's what lord <hes> see. I watch. I watch big brother on t._v. I just watch. I just watched the show. I don't watch the after dark and i don't watch the life feeds. I just watched three episodes. They they do a week and laura watch it with me but it's not her favorite show but she'll watch it with me because she's a good wife like that but then then she would rather read about the show as opposed to actually watching the show. It's the strangest thing ever. They tried to spoil it for me at work today. I had to leave the room because somebody at work does what you do but they weren't. They watched the live feeds which which spoils the show as well but it doesn't you're still. You're still reading ed or watching it. You're still following but you know it is. It's like going to the back of a murder mystery book and reading the ending and then going to the front to find out how the ending happened how you got to that point. Now you gotta take the journey. It's all about out the journey. If you say to them well yeah it takes like four months. I think for big brother yance dance very long time but at the end of big brother you get a banana tic tac yeah so you can find us. All all the podcasts stuff were everywhere <hes>. If you'd like to email us you can email us at podcast forty to show g mail dot com. <hes> speakers acres br the best place to listen for us personally. It's free for you. We get some money and if you'd like to call us our number is three two one two eight five five one two and you can also text us to that number as well part of the pod fixed network. Check out. All the great shows there. There's i take snowflake fourteen shows on the network. Maybe twelve or fourteen. There's a lot there's a lot to choose from and they all have a chris. They don't all have a chris. I feel like they all have. We actually lost a chris show. Oh no yeah more good than is no longer <hes> recording at at this time they might make a comeback and then most still have a crisis and there will be plus chris right now. Minus occurs that said and we could rename you chris now my name's laura and i'm chris so catch pop culture big brother other part to next week to find out who wins will jail take the crown again for third year in a row or will it be me and it's all about me or will it be more. I never win any but we'll see maybe this time. Stay fresh cheese beds. The all celebrity voices have been impersonated toiling. All conversations may or may not be one hundred percent accurate accurate as well. We have attempted to provide you with the facts as best to our knowledge through the help of a case of beer some old man that tells stories down by the river wikipedia the -pedia an old homemade youtube documentaries do not use anything you hosting this show to write a book report with you will get a bad grade a really really really really bad grave just like all of our hosts dick when they were in school. Music was provided by clay. You can find more efficient at kramer dot dot com. This has been a podcast forty. Two production look loop waited be in me. It was a podcast more shows like it. The network you guys are from big brother. Canada and i'm derek from big brother sixteen we are here to teach you how to win big brother and who better to learn from than the winner of bbc sixteen. We'll we'll see. I don't know the first thing you need to remember is it is a marathon not and if you're overweight lose weight in the house you can run faster and longer. That's what you love. It allows slop how you pace yourself in the house. How did you just sorta like keep the pace and remain sort of chill for as long as you did. I've seen people on the password that this is a long term thing and they get in there and they get rattled by one or two things and they start to jump to conclusions and make accusations that they shouldn't. I'm from mistakes and i realized that if i stayed under the radar these people who are going to cannibalize each other and when my time came do it had to do win which wouldn't be for weeks and weeks down the road. What if you know that going into it. You're already had of the game number two. It is very important. If you want to win the game you have to make the right. Alliances says so. How did you decide who you were going to be. Most loyal you know sometimes people will be dead giveaway as you can tell within a matter of minutes based on their conflicting stories whether that they're gonna be truthful or not so you get those people out of the way they're not going to be. You don't want those people for the long term. Then you go to the people who were there to agree time but also by them telling us different things <hes> you know relying on you for information as you're relying on them you start to develop a report and then the final part of business intuition gut intuition no that where you pick you have to ride with until the end regardless of what happens and you can't be a flip flop and know that regardless of what happens you went with your gut and you got to be confident with your decisions speaking of these alliances and these social relationships at the end of your season. You seem to have a very good relationship with almost everybody in the game. So what would you attribute to you. How do people sort of form those bonds and you got everybody to trust you and probably take a final no matter what happened first and foremost and we have to remember knbr big brother's a social game. It's a social experiment so you want to try to find common interests every single person in the house. You wanna cut anybody off as a possibility of working with in the future because there's a saying which i won't say but you gotta watch. What is it the asterik kicking today because it could be the one you're kissing tomorrow. So you have to be careful what you say and like i said you wanna find a real common when bond based on real interest with each and every person so that person feels they have something that nobody else has and as time goes on those people that you are weaker relationships with you and get rid of and keep the stronger ones but never one tunnel vision. You never want to close the door at any possible alliance or relationship because like i said down the road you could need it next piece of advice on and how to win big brother is you need to be super adaptable not just in your social relationships but sometimes you literally need to be a physical physical chameleon. Oh hey you're cool. Do you want to be even the light. How can now listen the obviously want to develop relationship. You wanna it'd be adaptable. You wanna make sure that based on whatever twist may come. You have a plan in strat plan a._b._c. n._b._c. And if all else fails change everything about you including your your appearance because that always right the so impressive literally put on a pair of glasses and to let a little facial hair come in and you're like one of the cocaine's just rolling with the youngsters yeah if you wanna create a character you actually believe in it and there was a long part of that show where i literally believed i was the parks and recreation coordinator the hipster dad who loved rockin beanies wearing glasses even though they didn't have a lenses like these ones don't but nobody really cared about that so yeah wherever works for you to make more of who you want to be in that game do it and if that includes losing weight loss in a beanie rocket out but own all the way to the end until the votes casted then then you can tell them what you really broadcast gonna kill you for saying cast it. Oh yeah it's cat's gas. I'm sorry i still love you. Freak out last but not least is timing timing. It is so important in that game to know when to hold them knowing full them and no one to cut some of your closest allies right. It's all about timing. It's all about numbers right. You want to make picture that whenever the voting is coming that you have the numbers to get out who ever you want to get and keep whoever you want to keep but you have to know when to do it. If you start cutting your lines members too early we could result and you being going from the majority to the minority and that's not what you want to big brother because once they're gone most of the time most of the time they're not coming back. You want to make sure that you're cutting your lowest players on the totem pole when the time comes so that even though you're cutting this person you still have the majority of the numbers to the next personnel. You don't wanna get overzealous. You don't wanna do too through early because if you do you could be on the block and you could be absolutely don't play with your emotions. Don't make any irrational decisions really think it through and always make sure that you in the numbers majority in that house the thing so much time in too much time listening because i'd be remiss point out. There's some luck involved. You gotta have a little bit of the four leaf clover the horseshoe up your to get this done because honestly it's some of the things you can't control how some of the things are twists. Some of the things are game decisions some of the things that just happened to for your way. It's hard to win the game without a little bit of luck so just know going in there that you know say a prayer to the gods question newly winter. I never be on the block. I think so that is insanity that is why they call him the best player of all time in big brother history because hel hello well do you win the game and never once were you on the blockers seen as a threat or a target even though you were slipping and sliding win and five five thousand dollars and stuff and you know all the frank is hoping learn something for all you guys. Do you want to get on big brother. Get on big brother. The idea is to to win it so i hope we've given you some solid tips and then you go up there and kick some acids and thank us later. I want some of that money too if you do the home depot's making it easy to turn your favorite moment into the perfect color for any room with the project color app upload any image then discover the colors and painting match. Now you're swiping liping. Click closer to everything you need for your next project. Explore the most popular colors and trending pallets to find your perfect paint get a colorful new experience with the project color up then shop our best brands with gallant starting from just twenty four ninety eight at the home depot more saving more doing u._s. Only see store for details. Farmers assuras there is knows the difference between a car hitting your bumper and a clown car hitting your because we covered it. Click for more farmers insurance exchange center affiliates products available in every state.

colonel colonel sanders gilda radner mary poppins robin williams laura Steve steve steve harrington Ron ron ron ron weasley robin williams tina fey peggy peggy stern lex luther Jack black levin kelly ron weasley bo jackson napoleon Williams robin
Everything Is Cake, Selective Olympic Memories, and Tea Time Goes to 'Camp Rock' | Tea Time

Ringer Dish

51:41 min | 4 months ago

Everything Is Cake, Selective Olympic Memories, and Tea Time Goes to 'Camp Rock' | Tea Time

"What's up guys and welcome to time? This is a weekly pop culture podcast on the Ringer podcast network. I'm Kelly I'm pete. How well? And I'm Amelia. What am I R- today? We're going to talk about celebrity relationships important. We're going to go through selective. Olympic memories because the. Not Happening and finally we're. We're GONNA do it. We're cringe mode camp rock as requested by you. The listeners is GonNa, be a really good episode or really bad episode like having taken a water. Hopped up on caffeine. Leads, do it okay. I, category is tea time checks in with celeb- relationships Kaya are lovely producer. Talking before we, she had to recording. This is the only thing we can report on is just like who's been Paparazzi, too. Because no one is at any events like barely anyone is doing anything, so we got some good news. I got some bad news. Re Guys. Let's start with the bad Amelia okay I will keep this brief because I know. They talked about it on jam session, but it. It is a little convoluted, but. We're GONNA talk about will and Jada because in an interview that rocks the Internet, Angelo Ye sat down with singer Songwriter. I'll see Ya I. Think I'm pronouncing. I correct. And he talked about how he had an affair just decided to come out with that. He was like you don't yeah. I had an affair with Jada Pinkett Smith that went on verve years, and he this is an actual quote by him. Actually sat down with will and had a conversation due to the transformation from their marriage to life partnership that they had spoken up several times, and you know not involving romanticism. He gave me his blessing. So there have been rumors about the nature of the smiths relationship. If you ask me as completely private, and just if they don't WanNa talk about it, they shouldn't have to totally, but unfortunately August was like which is his prerogative to be like. Hey, this happened but anyway. So I the reps for Jada. We're like this is absolutely not true, but then days later. She was like I'm going to invite myself onto red table. Talk with will, and so will sat down with Jada and it was like a twelve minute interview conversation that I watched all of actually it was it was interesting, but she pretty much confirmed that she had started a relationship with August about four four and a half years ago, and it started out as a friendship. I think they were introduced by Jaden her well, son and he was August was going through some health issues, so she and the family helped him out with that and then. It, the relationship between Jada and August turned more romantic when she and will briefly separated, and they both made it clear that they were fully broken up at the time. And you know he never. They denied the whole blessing thing because it was like she's the only one who can say I'm in a relationship or not. They're like broken up or whatever so anyway. They addressed the rumors. Poor will look really puffy and tired, and just you know it's it's there. You know. I just feel like. Yes, I love celebrity gossip, but this is a little invasive I thought speaking of invasive. The part that I cared. Cared the most about you guys. Follow or care about fifty cents still, but you posted a very private. I've been trying to figure out if it's real or not I have reason to believe it's real because see why would be. Why would fifty cent like lie your Photoshop this? Anyway? He de will. Smith on Instagram your right over there, and then it's like he said yes. I'm appreciative of your concern, and then he goes. Why is she tell you that shit on a show for everybody to see like he basically starts getting in it with Wilson Will Smith at ends, and it's like fuck you fifty. Fifty Way! What did I do I? Don't know why fifty cent of people choosing to insert himself in this story and posted for everybody, but he is. He wants our attention and he goes. Yeah I. Throw positive podcast. Alternative types of marriage are fine. If that works for you I, just feel bad that they were like forced to take this. Yeah, quite so publicly because they seem like it's a good partnership between them. Now it just I'm like I. Don't know I mean I. Guess Our job right now. It's literally talk about celebrity relationships, but this was like Berry. Specific and I just felt bad that they had to like airedale outs. We'll talk stays being hard hitting. News and our only source of good entertainment, this entire twenty twenty okay next one. Very briefly, but we have to talk about it. armie hammer and his wife Elizabeth Chambers Hammer. Filed for divorce, they announced their break up I think late last week early this week. they've been together for thirteen years and been married for ten years, and they posted a picture of themselves like when they first got together as basically babies. And posted a long statement Blah Blah so at first there were a lot of rumors about why this happened whether it was like political people on twitter thought it was political. But some other things have come out recently. There are I'm not gonNA get into them because they have not been proven to be true, but there are some screen shots going around twitter of what may or may not be DM's from Armie, Hammer and various women. The again have no idea whether or not their true, but they have blown up quite a bit and. imply that he was not faithful. We don't know whether or not that's true. However, he has hired basically like the celebrity divorce lawyer. Laura Wasser who has is like just famous for just navigating these huge celebrity divorces she. Representative Johnny Depp Endo Lee Heidi Klum. Ashton Kutcher Multiple Kardashians Britney, Spears Ryan Reynolds Jennifer Garner. From your Schreiber and So she can add our meets her list of clients and I'm just bummed that I. don't get to see. Technically I never saw army, but I did see the hammers family at my family. My farmer's market a few times, and they're so cute. Kids are so cute so yeah, this was a bummer for me. Yeah, yeah, just honestly bites the dust. This reminds you just kristen cavaliers. Where like I don't care about this Jewish? People and I don't care about Armie. Hammer and Elizabeth, chambers people I get sad about the timing like to be with someone for that long yeah. Into a crisis it did I had a weekly. Like what does it all mean kind of crisis earlier this week to high teatime? Pals. Away on lower stakes, bad relationship news, and this is our last one is at bill. Hader and Rachel. Belsen have broken up. They've only been together for about like six seven months. And the only reason why they were like it's notable, and we talked about it in the first place was because back in December they were photographed together in Tulsa Oklahoma, which is rebel haters from and they're like Oh. My God Richardson's meeting the family. Is it serious? Blah, alas, they have split, so we wish them all the best and whatever relationship comes next to them. Yes, okay now to the good. This is yeah, this is good, okay? Whoever separated this into the good Brooklyn Beckham engaged this week very exciting served to this woman named Nikola. Pelts Brooklyn is twenty. One and Nikola is twenty five. and. It's the only been dating for a very short amount of time about ten months, but obviously they're very serious about each other and the thing that everyone's talking about obviously is the ring, and so normally when celebrities engaged like there's all these different outlets that say all is different numbers, the highest I've seen is the dollar quivalent like four hundred forty thousand dollars. They're also reports that it's like closer to two fifty to three hundred regardless, it's fucking insane amount of money for twenty one year old to drop off a twenty five year old especially with his photography career. He gathered that amount, but anyway yeah, it's very surprising. They have not been together that long. They're super young. She was dating Anwar. Hadeed for a long time. So. Yeah, crazy times. Yeah, and also this. They might have not have careers themselves. They're saying that she was an actress, but their parents are not wanting for money. The Beckham's obviously, but then her dad is like an uber billionaire, yes, so like Somehow Brooklyn Beckham like leveled up. Yes, Sir Housing, and it's too fucking do that. Yeah, he is a billionaire and he has ten kids, and it's like whole long story line so. Good for them. Just really happy for young love here. Next one. So, it's the ongoing saga of rage. Aim, Princess Love the last we heard from them. You know they weren't paying the man who found their dog Bugatti even though they're like you good twenty K.. Well so that happened and this whole saga continues in that she. Actually has requested to dismiss her divorce filing from him so. They're back together. And this comes after she claimed that he straight up abandoned her and their battering Las Vegas so I don't know if quarantine helped them. Come back together. Realize that. Hey, we can make this work, but guess what Ray Jane Princess Loved Back Together so happy for them. Think Guide. I did put that in the good, but that was a stretch maybe. The good the bad and the ugly. Okay wrapping up good celebrity relationship news thanks to Juliette Littman for sending this to us today. Quavo and sweetie are profiled in g Qa by Garrick Kennedy, and first of all the photos of them. It's I didn't realize how long it had been since we've had like a real celebrity photos. We had a couple of biles when like blew up for reasons that people were like. This is really bad and Liebowitz this washed, and then there've been a couple other ones, but it's really nice to see just like a really in depth like pre quarantine celebrity photo shoot were like they look like celebrities. It's like super over the top, and that is one of these. Photos are great, and it's just this really sweet profile of Cueva of migos and Sweetie. WHO's just like an up and coming rapper and they are at a pool. Just talking about how much they love each other their whole relationship, there are these really cute little details about lake. Her blushing when she's talking about him and like how they're interacting, and like their body language towards each other, when they're telling the story of their relationship, and it's just really sweet and very real, and they just seemed like they have a really great healthy relationship. Have you listened to my type by Sweetie? I haven't should I. It's yes, it's incredible. It's a great song. I liked icy girl. I Love A. Pool to like there's some underwater pigs and of an TM taught us anything. It's actually quite difficult to pull off and look attractive in, and they're really sick. This is awesome. It's great. Highly recommend the profile. Yes, okay. We move by next category. Do it okay this weekend. Social media slash not worth the t guys. This is a tee times. Episode will start to off. The rails hold tight. You have a lot of a lot to cover Start off. Okay. I have no notes a research on anything here I'm disputing from the heart. This week I would say the biggest name on social media was that it turns out that everything is cake. By which I mean. There is a video that went viral I. Believe it started on talk and then spiralled into all these other videos where people were cutting open. These hyper realistic aches, and like looks like it's nine, and then they cut it open, and it's cake, or it looks like it's a hand, and they cut it in half, and it's actually a cake and people were like what is. Is happening is the Matrix Glitch ing out? Is Everything actually cake? So I think it was one of those things where like it wouldn't have blown up if we weren't all second sight in quarantine, but like all of a sudden, the cake meme was everywhere, so people were making jokes about like anytime in movies. Somebody stab somebody else. They were like. Oh, they're checking to see if their cake. Who is just like a very concentrated twenty four hour period of the same joke on social media that I personally thought was really funny. Every time, but other people were like okay. I'm done with this and it just really dropped off after that twenty four hours. It's like they were done with cake. Which is fine, actually this reminds me of Im baby, and like I didn't under- CNN for literally months on end it was everywhere, and it was kind of like you were cool. If you knew and like, don't ask you don't know and I. Just never really touched. It tried to figure it out stills. Mistry I hope this everything is cake also just. As well. okay next one Sorry yes I just I'm just taken by the cakes I honestly. People are very talented, so shout out to them. Were impressive. I say poorer. Right exactly okay in really exciting news for me because I've just been a fan of her for very long time I'm Tom Birger on Erin Andrews their old news buys you later. Don't let the door hit you on the way out. TYRA banks is the new host of dancing with the stars and I for one so excited because she's Kooky, and she's going to bring the SM- is. She's going to bring the drama. She's GonNa Bring everything I'm so excited I have been meeting her on TV ever since I stopped watching an TM and her day time talk show Whatever happened it. Happened, and so she's getting back I'm so excited I'm just maybe I will actually watch dancing with the stars now. My. Take on this is that you won't have to. Because all tyra banks me, moments will immediately be share on line. So me mobile and she's so like people loved. Make Fun of her, but also like love. Yes and I feel like that's like. I told a million I was like. They're trying to capture that chaotic masks singer. They meet a host that you can make fun of, but the people also love. And Yeah. It just seems like it seems like she'll be a big lake. Social Media BEC-. no transition needed for the next thing. I'm about to say and it is telling you guys about an instagram account that is the handle. At which guy are you? And of course you're talking about guy, fieri and essentially is just a bunch of different pictures of Guy Fieri on instagram grid, and then kind of like a word art name imprinted on every single photo of like duly and Layla, and whatever else fog it is, and it only has twenty two thousand followers, and yet it everywhere on my instagram. Liz exactly they have lizzy, which Kate said it worked I. Sent Them Liz it. Says D. M. S. for names earlier this week. I tried to get you on there because I was. Liz Kelly is guy theory in her heart and they. Do It for me. They probably getting inundated such a popular chair. Yeah, and this is, it's not just Guy Fieri. It's like there have been a bunch of other like Terry styles or you which cursed image or you? which grape or you? Yes, it's just like this dumb sharable thing. which cat are you? Which I feel like? This is one of more dump. Social media trends have come out of quarantine Israelis out blank or you, but which cat are you? You may not know, but the crying at the crank cat. Me Is one of my favorite photos. And one that I use, and we'll just make me laugh literally one hundred percent of the time, no matter the context so I, like which are you, but the has like three thousand followers like I don't know what we're doing really. To say I can't find kate on any of these accounts keys extremely popular name. There's so many people named Kate and I've gone through cats Harry styles and Guy Fieri and Roldan's golden scroll and could not find kate on any of them. What about Katie? That's my nameless. Okay, yeah, yeah, our God God forbid okay, next one. This is very easy to explain I'm an IT's from TIKTOK. Of course, it's that the teens are dressing up as old people to buy alcohol and I also think the masks are helping law because it covers I dunno braces or your lack of laugh lines, or whatever gives away your age, your wrinkly lips, whatever and they're actually going full out pudding makeup on putting wigs on going with a group of friends. Picking I think one of your youngest looking friends, and like walking hand in hand with them into the liquor store and it's working. I never preoccupied, but like I. I don't know how. This is like flying I. Feel like every time I buy alcohol the strapped unmask, and then they like stare at me for ten seconds, but the teens are getting away with it. Good, for them Amelia. I don't know Ford. We're all part I entered we. Impressionable listeners may be. Don't buy alcohol darn up, but I'm also very scared of authority, so don't listen to me. Okay last one kate. All right. This happened yesterday for about three hours affecting all the members of TS I am I believe twitter locked down verified accounts for several hours sort of on and off. It was like twenty minutes, and then they were back then it was ten minutes, and they're back and they did this. Because bitcoin someone I guess promoting Bitcoin tweeted from like Barack Obama, and all these other verified accounts, and so in order to keep it from happening at twitter locked all verified accounts and people without verify accounts, which is obviously the mass, the vast majority of twitter. Got Really excited about it and we're like we're throwing a revolution down with the blue checks. Put them in the Guillotine and I. Don't really have to say about this except for if you don't have a secret burner, I don't know what you're doing. You're hot takes off. It's not a burner account. I have a secret stand account because I don't want to get canceled by the. Fans that have already know it wouldn't be secret. Then Liz he. There's no way of connecting it to me. No one will ever find it. Got To get the takes off without being cancelled by you see the Cape Hop stands sunny. I was GonNa say it was that the the verified lock did not affect me, and everyone should have a backup. Because sometimes you just got a tweet. Yeah, sure. I have a Paul. Rudd Burner, Khoury just tweeted him really shitty. Things and I'm just talking I would be crazy. That's certainly not me, okay. Next category things are only getting weirder. This is tee times very selective. Memories because you guys know how we do things. Here were an emotional bunch. We like to reflect on bygone times, and of course the Olympics the Summer Olympics were supposed to start in Tokyo right around the corner. It's been delayed a year because of the worldwide pandemic, so we're just going to take a look back. Think about pass Olympics Kate and Amelia are both like really really really in on the seven and I just. Just grand people with the facts so before I let the two of them run away with this. I wanted to ask you guys. Which is your preferred Olympics? Is it summer or winter? Because summer you have beach volleyball like the cycling. Diving swimming track. Water Polo Surfing's of and in the Winter Olympics. You have all the scheme. The bobsled the figure skating the Luge Skeleton. Whatever so which are you guys, summer or winter? I feel like the easy answer is summer because it's like the celebrity athletes for the most part you get the gymnastics volleyball, you get like a building funds sports like the really splashy sports, however, I will say is the beauty of the Olympics is getting really into a really weird sport that played by people. You've never heard of before and caring deeply about them for a week and a half, and then like never thinking about them again so by those. Bat, logic! I think the winter is really like has its charms. Because like you know, I could get really into like skeleton luge like. Be like liver die for like the US Lewd Steve and then like never think about them again. Because that's kind of like the appeal of the Olympics see, I would say summer, but I do I. do think winter has its has its charms and key. You fell in love with the figure skaters I. don't even remember their names, but I can see them in my brain as if they're right in front of me. What are those two people there? So by my favorite moment from the two thousand eighteen? Olympics that I, wrote about in talked about at length for the ringer. Dot Com was virtue and more. who were the Canadian ice dancers that everyone was. Really married and had like a love child that they're hiding. Just great chemistry on ice, just just tearing it up out there. And I got really into them. That was my favorite memory from two thousand eighteen and I also just got really into ice in general I have to shout out to the pod ships ebbs. WHO also broussard for? Quite intensely in two thousand eighteen, and obviously our now our favorite ice dancers. If you're listening to this talk about this, I prefer to Canadians, but yeah. I Love I love the ice skating although really stresses me out shore. Yeah. Well on the subject of ice and skating and all that stuff. In twenty ten if you remember ten years ago, I'm sorry. Okay, go for it just. It's just it's like I love this story so much and I don't know why it's like deeply embedded in my mind, and will be there for the rest of my life, but in twenty ten at the Vancouver Olympics, Russian figure Skater Evgeni Plushenko. Who won gold in two thousand six? He took second place to USA's Evan license check and he was like a lice. Check didn't deserve to win gold because he didn't attempt a quadruple, I did blah blah, blah, so he was really just pissed off and he he was feeling petty. So this is what he did. Because he thought he deserved when the gold he put on his website on Evgeni. PLUSHENKO DOT COM photo of him wearing an Olympic medal that red silver of Salt Lake Gold of Torino and platinum, of Vancouver, he awarded himself bladder medal because he won silver i. That I don't how his mind works fascinating amazing just like just to be that petty and that upset over like I get it I, mean it's the Olympics, so I love it. Yeah, you do his our platinum of Vancouver. Guinea Shane Go. Thank you. I remember like firmly rooting against him. He was like the bad boy of ice. Had like. A blonde wholeheartedly. I don't know I think he did maybe I'm this this manifesting that? But I do, and then the guy who won stick went on dancing with the stars and was garbage because skating is not the safest. Ice Skating Emotional though I dunno, maybe it's the Olympics as a whole and like the camaraderie, and like all the people are so into it and like their parents are. They're crying and screaming and S, but there's something about all of these sports and the Olympics in general. That made me so emotional. I, think that's why people also get so attached is because yes, heart in it is like just addicting. They work all their lives for this, and it's just it's so. You can't help but root for that, you know. So like we're talking about the summer Olympics. Obviously, the gymnastics is something that people get really into really root for and I think the two most recent Summer Games both had teams of genetic of gymnast from the US that we're just insanely good, and people got really into so the Fab five was I think two thousand twelve, and like the final five was twenty, sixteen, Rio two thousand sixteen, and that was like Mon byles alley. Raise men all of them. That obviously did so extremely well, so say first of all. It was just fun to like watch. The whole world realized that like there's never been a human being that can do. It's Mon byles. Body like literally in the history of mankind like she like just totally changed the sport because no one else has ever done that before. which is should like amazing to think about and I remember watching like those videos of her that would be on twitter like analyzing like why she was so good in the fact that like literally no one else on the planet can do that which tell ya fabulous. And then I also remember one of the best memes are I. Guess Viral Moments From Rio was. Really nervous parrots. Remember. Her parents would be in the crowd, and they'd be like under their seats or like covering their eyes, which is so relatable. If your kid isn't Olympian. Like I'm doing that. I'm watching from home like I. Literally would not even be in the building or not be able to watch. They also did that thing. Where the kind of do the moves like know what's coming up. Hull their shoulders a little bit because they know it, they're so ingrained in their brain and they data. It's so sweet. Yeah that was great and I also WanNa, say Rio Twenty Sixteen was really fun for me because it was I senior. No. Yeah it was, it must have been one of my last year of college and we had the you swim. Team had a bunch of gold medalist. And? They would come back for some reason that I like Indian. Universities seems like amazing. I guess, but they would come up and like show up in bars, and like people at Chan USA at them, and it was really fun to. Watch them like with Michael Phelps now. They're here, so yeah. That was a fun here for the summer for the Olympics for me. Personally I just want to quickly on the subject of Olympic swimmers I. Just want to briefly talk about America's dumb. Ass Ryan Locked E. Who I have been kind of embarrassingly in love with since two thousand eight. He's really attractive, but he is like he's a dumb ass and. If you remember from twenty sixteen, he and three other Americans. Swimmers were embroiled in a scandal called locked gate, and when they claim that they were held up at gunpoint. By like Brazilian men disguised as cops, but it was actually like security guards confronting them, because they had urinated outside of a bathroom, and he had vandalized a framed poster, so it was really bare fold, and they're idiots, and that was really embarrassing, and they should get shit for it, because like how dare you do that and then lie about it and then do you remember when people were like? Oh boys will be boys, but then they're like Doug. How dare you not smile during the? National Anthem like fucking kidding me. Are You fucking kidding me? On ashy. White and can get away with is just incredibly. Surely, but you know he apologized. Thank you I mean he's still a dumb ass he's. A true idiot and. I- embarrassingly find him funny because he does have a catchphrase that he started like in two thousand, eight or something, and it's J. J., e. a. h., and I just want to read you like a couple of tweets that just really show you how stupid he is just. It's icon conic Please? Okay. This is a tweet. I never knew having a banana and then drinking sprite. You automatically PUKE gotta get my brother to try this Ha. Oh No one's. Here's an twelve. When he wrote there, no, he was like twenty. Thirty five thirty six right now so God. This is embarrassing. Okay, this is just a couple more. Does anyone know the helicopter code? What's there's no explanation, just just that so that's cool and then here is. This is my favorite one. Always reach for the Moon, because if you slip up, you will still be a star, Jair or Hashtag. Wow, I had yeah has become like part of the lexicon. This was an ideal Ryan locked. He was attributed answer in a game I played during quarantine, and it was like whatever. Athlete has. Catch Raises Jad. Rises Dylan my brain well, I know the answer you know it, you know it. Yeah Oh really quick apologies Evan check I, looked it up, and he actually came in second on dancing with the stars, obviously I was just disappointed with his performance, but the world was not so apologies for that anyway continue. Yeah. We've have become like we obsess over these people for a very small amount of time. I obsess over Adam rippon. Figure Skater I still follow him on twitter. What I'm going to follow I knew. I don't I. The maybe when the next Winter Olympics comes around, it'll be worth it again, but like you have these very short term fascination, they can disappear. Go back to their sport. They're obviously a like. All year round, but you literally forget about them I remember when we as a country and then as the larger Internet got Horny for these four specifically pita, I'm GonNa mess up his name, but towel for. Who was the flagbearer for Tonga I'm on Sixteen Rio Games, and he showed up just shirtless covered in oil looking. Fantastic, I'm sorry, but the Olympics make objectify patriotic, and okay and I'm. US He's hot like a not only is his body nicely, oil breakouts, but He has a great face to just a handsome dude. Wow, that was that was rich. Ever spoken brought to be an American. I'm good ending the category there. Okay Okay moving on the highly requested cringe, Mo- Camp Rock. You asked we delivered. We suffered through it. We're GONNA. Talk about really first movie. Next week will be the second and then. Send a camp frog. Well. Want it. Okay. Keep like always. Will you do the honors of summarizing this movie in like one or two sentences? Camp Rock what happened when Disney shallow realized that high school musical was super popular, and they were like what can we do? That will capitalize off of that success, but not be a blatant rip off so camp prog is just like a slightly less subtle, but still pretty blatant. Rip Off of the things that made high school musical popular. Demi Levato goes to singing camp and Joe. Jonas is a celebrity judge and they fall in love through the power of Song. Nice! That was beautiful. We need. Let's go through some highlights. What is I? Like of this movie? You guys okay so the Jonas Brothers are all in the movie it's it's the focus is on Joe. It actually I think was a mistake. I think nick has a lot more charisma, but JOE is like. Be Kind of you. Know Heartthrob, whatever I definitely had a thing for him that unfortunately, when I was what seventh grade came out, but Joe's the main character. The Jonas brothers are like comic relief, so they pop into like talk to Joe on the phone. His name isn't Joe in the movie at Shane Gray, but we're GONNA call, too. So I just WANNA shout out underrated. Jonas, brother. Kevin Jonas. I ride for team Kevin. Except for when he's like problematic and his personal life as a concept, the underrated third brother team Kevin, and he just really made the most of his limited screen time. He is one liners for so much better than Nick. He knows his place. It seems like he had to grow personality because like he wasn't one of the being too. Yeah and I think you can really see that here. Okay sure so fast. cavs who I did I did. I did dress up for Halloween so maybe that's also. An affinity for? Okay I'll have to say I was watching this week I have not seen it probably since eighth grade and I had a total blast from the past moment. They do this this thing that I know people on this podcast will not remember because i. just feel like you're gonNA. Leave me hanging on this, but I know people at home remember, which is the whatever major loser sign. You go on your forehead and you do like three fingers up. Three fingers down and then the loser sign. It's like whatever major loser. Bill School Lake. As in you do it to each other. Like person to a loser would be like whatever majors. As, Joe. Like mostly as a joke, like to your friends but I had no idea was from Camp Rock. Are Yes sure. He went through the halls of my middle or high school, but I believe you. Well. Yours is too cool, but this is a big thing in Indiana. Take my word for it I mean this. No, I, did like loser loser loser. I think Camp Rock appropriated from High School Middle School Day I. Think they did wow, that makes me feel better than that. We didn't just like weren't heading. All Seen Camp Rock the. An another highlight and there aren't many will stay, but. I have never seen this movie. Actually. Watch it for the first time and Demi Levato just has a lot of onscreen charisma, such, a nice energetic, like and like infectious smile, and laugh and energy when she's Onscreen, I never watched sunny with a chance more of a Hannah Montana grow myself as you probably have realized by now, but Yeah Demi Levato kind of killed it. I, feel like in this movie, and she's very earnest and very you could. Could just tell she was just like really up and coming, really starting to get her like you know, get those spotlight and I appreciated by the end of the movie. I thought she was going to stay in her like weird as Disney voice the whole time, but by the end I feel like she fully embraces the actual vocal ability that she has which is just absolutely amazing, so another huge highlight was just like Demi lovato's talent in general. And then also gotTA. Give credit to the writers making these character names because all time good movie names. You've got tests. Tyler premium bitch, ass, blonde, sinewy, new mom, who's APPS and kind of character. Perfect mean girl mailed at Shane Gray perfect pop surname, Msci sweet innocent, you WanNa root for Msci. You know what I mean. Really cute it in these character. Yeah, sure actually it begins about. Had really good character names to whoever is doing the naming at Disney during this period. Really good, really go. And that's about all. We came up with with the highlights, so let's go to. Let's go to lowlights. This was I think this was our toughest watch yet including Liz. Do you think including like the worst twilight movies? Yeah, was this harder for you to sit through? Yes? I think it's just like the inherent awkwardness of like someone singing at you in a very earnest way like there were so many people making prolonged contact with each other and like singing at each other. I really struggled to sit through that it was really difficult for me. I don't know how I watched it. In Eighth Grade I knew it was GONNA be a bad movie from like the title page on Disney and Kevin looks like he just released the biggest far in his life. I just like not inaccurate. This is not going to be good. Yeah, we're GONNA talk about the fashion and the styling choices in a minute by. My, problem with Tess, Tyler, which is a great name. She's such a bargain bin Sharpei. Going from high school musical to this chooses like a blonde who's rich and popular and has minions, but the problem is that she's not bunny like yeah, yeah, but the reason Sharpei works is because she's really funny. And this girl had absolutely nothing going for whatsoever like zero personality. Yeah, sure not to fire more shots, but also pretty bargain Ben Ms Darby's yes, the camp director. I felt like a theater camp. Director should have a bit more possessed. I didn't get much from her performance I want. It was left. Wanting more and I felt like Ms Darvish stepped up to the plate. Elevated that performance so idea free high school musical, really committed other than Demi, other than literally just Sammy. I think everyone in high school musical committed a lot more than people founded in this movie your. He also had a problem with the songs. I just I will be honest with you. You know even through the cringe EST of high school musical songs. I had to fast forward through some of these camp rock songs. I was like this now I cannot waste another second of my life listening to like Nick Jonas Wail on his little. I don't know microphone I. It was just I. It was bad. It was really bad I felt like the problem was. They tried to add too much like pop and techno underneath a lot of the songs it was buried produced. Yes, and you just don't. You just don't need that? Spend camp movie. Yeah! I also felt like the choreography fell flat in. High school musical because the choreography and high school musical on multiple levels. They're like inept. Leisure's all the way as like this two story tall cafeteria quad zone. There's like the bright flashy lights like white and red, really poppy yet yen in Camp Rock. They're like under a would cabin fluorescent lighting. They're all on one dancer which I get is like much more realistic for like a camp, situation and I'm sure the choreography was probably just as good and hard to learn, etc, but. Just say didn't look all that good or put together or were hers I? Don't know it just yeah, you know. That's the main problem is like high school. Musical is a musical, so the songs are taking place within the plot. For the most part other than like the ones that are actually in like on stage, but like camera everything's on a stage like almost everything performance, so people are just sitting there, watching someone saying as opposed to like actually like it. Being part of the plot can't rock makes high school musical. Look like a Baz lerman production. Rightly though. It does sorry. In your opinion, what has aged the best and the worst? We have to talk about the fashion I know. We talked about this high school musical, but the Jonas brothers fashion in this movie is so utterly offensive. There's one the first of all the hair in general whether. Weeks. With its extensions he. What do we think what percent of? Iron and going on. SA! Think they all just have really naturally curly hair, so it's natural, but then they straight it within inhibits. Yeah, so nick has natural curls was actually looked great. He should grows hair back out because I thought the girls looked great. Maybe I'm just biased these. However, yes, we do you think Joe and Kevin actually had their real hair and that was just like flat iron within an inch of its life. Yes, that's so unfortunate. Over processed hair. Definitely, it's awful, and then the sideburns are still because he can't obviously fly. IRONSIDE burn so like their natural hair really bad also just had like these caterpillar eyebrows with like. I get like had strong browser like relatively attractive and like I. think that if he'd like them a little bit, it would have been just like a trim. There's just one outfit that he wears in this movie that I have highly, which is for some reason. He's teaching choreography which I'm like I. Don't think that's something that Joan knows a lot about, but. A lot of the movie, He's teaching dance class and he's in these genes I know skinny jeans were in, and that's fine, but there are. These white jeans were like their baggy around. Yes and the legs are really skinny, and they're the most unflattering. He's wearing a striped shirt. That's also really unflattering and I was like this is the worst I've ever seen him. Look ever at early ever and. He, you can tell in. This film in Camp Rock that he is clearly flush. I don't know if he's just exhausted, I don't know if he is like a fellow sweaty person like myself, but in all of these outfits and they're all like you said there are long pants, and then layered shirts jackets on, and he's got the flat iron hair, and it's kind of long, too. So that adds to the the heat. He is clearly flushed in most of these outfits and I just can't help, but notice his red little face just because I, just one person you. Have Your own short end of the stick in his movie Amelie I know you had a lot of problems with his ability as well. Okay I'm sorry, but this was a tragic event at acting. He was trying to be like a diva esque pop star who is like? God. So famous like I hate this it's is just like what are you? This is embarrassed. This is not. You're not even trying, but you kind of our, but you're really not. You're just really bad at acting, and then he would like quote. Unquote Play Guitar. I don't think that was him I. Don't like Dr. Perhaps, not not to pile on Joe Darlas really hard right now, but I think just the last thing that it's really really is that type of singing the Jonas brother like yet like boy band kind of like really link out, even know it's high pitch exaggerated. It's like really like throaty kind of runs. Boy Bands, one direction has not. That was like a completely different type of vocals what they did like maybe towards the end, Kate, you could probably say more of that, but the bonus brother era singing I just feel like doesn't work now and watching him sing like that is actually very cringe-worthy. The one thing that is aged okay to their credit. Credit is that Joe Jonas, of course Amelia's said is playing the like diva Popstar, whatever but they actually as a group never really went too far sal never really turned into like this didn't end up being a parody of who they actually became. Yeah, because they weren't that famous at their famous at this point, but like the really like continued to blow up over the next couple of years, and they never did like stints in Rehab became like these really notable asshole, guys like the worst thing that they did was lose their virginity, and like that was pretty much the dark mark on their like whole youths career, which is kind of impressive Yeah. Let a lot of bats of his age, but I guess that's like the one highlight is. They didn't turn out to be absolutely terrible men I. Guess that's true and also like looking at how successful they've been lately like with their comeback. Yeah, it was kind of fun for me to look back when they were first like I know we're not huge Jonas brothers fans on this podcast by have like some of their recent songs, and they all have like very successful relationships, and it was kind of fun to look back and be like Oh. Yeah they were so they weren't cute, but like in theory they were acute care wasn't gear. MVP's Liz already kinda stole mind, but I had Demi Levato. She's not a great actress, but she committed she super cute. She's super earnest and she sings so well. Her voice is so good, and she's just like just grins her way through this movie. She's very likable. Yes, very likable I'm you know just say Allison's donor has? She can dance and I've just loved watching her. I guess grow up through the years, and she also has the best line of the movie This happens when spoiler alert MSCI is revealed to be the cooks, daughter and her whole plot of being the daughter of some like exac falls apart and allison's donors character catches her, and she says Oh. This is rich, but you're not to. Him Wow wow that one bird. I also WanNa give her, credit. For putting context behind one of my favorite TIKTOK trends. I don't know if you guys are this deep in the APP. Have you guys seen the videos where it's actually the part of the movie were allison is like low bebopping on her. Top whatever it is making his weird techno garage type, sound and Demi, Levato turns, she goes. She's a really good. That sound has enclosed and put on tiktok everywhere to describe so many different things like your mom is like, or you say to your mom like I'm depressed and your mom's like. No, you're not. And then he turned into like she's really good kind of just like a joke to say it, but I never knew her there that came from and when I heard it. I was like maybe doing other work and then I turn. It was like what the hell was so excited. I had never heard it in the wild before. It was just perfect so they. Can't send us your camp. Rock took ducks. Yeah, please please and then wrapping up his category. Let's go through best and worst musical number so Keiko I. Okay, we just have to get it out of the way. This is me from Camp Rock is just an all-time great song. Is. Legitimately Good Demi Levato great I again have not seen this movie in a long time, but I've watched this clip like whenever it comes up on twitter, because people talk about it all the time, because it's song, and even like the mash up part where Joe comes in and start singing his little song about like finding you just great stuff agreed. It's catchy, yeah. Well all right. And I wanted to say that when I was looking this up I was like. Do we Sophie Turner Has Seen Camp Rock and interns actually has she has talked at length about Cambric, and trying to get Joe to watch it with her because she was a fan before she ever married him, which actually is really cute? But he refuses to watch it with her, and she said that play. My music is her favorite song movie which like Okay So v? It's the song where the Jonas brothers all play together, and it's just a Jonas brothers song, so I'm like okay, so you're just a Jonas brothers fan, which I guess, checks out, but I also again shout out to one other Song Oslo visa which is like the end of the year showcase. It was I. think maybe the most like high school musical ask in turns of like showy staging. They had like trampolines on stage, or wherever was like dancing and the production value for that one was top notch. I WANNA give a shout out quickly to the most unexpected musical number was not did not see this coming at all same thing as the big showcase Blah Blah and one of tests. Tyler's minions name is peggy she. Busts out of left field. It's like Atlantis more set type. John, just repeating like here. I am a million times on the guitar. And it was absolutely unexpected. No other song sounds like that in the entire movie didn't even know they knew about that. As a genre, it was very interesting, and she ends up winning the whole talent show because that's on so. Twist to yes. next week we'll be back with the second movie so I know we're all so excited for that. but on the topic of campaign suffolk got us all thinking a lot about like camp as a whole and our experiences, etc, for the last category TI- times most unanswered question. We're doing camp edition Kate. What's Your Camp Question? Let's actually start with yours because I. think mine ties into my reaction in my answer to your question, Okay my question broadly is camp as it Conn said good or bad, because we can all go round and say like what kind of can't I did feeder camp much like this? But it was not sleep away. Thank God and then I also soccer camp, but that's much less fun to talk about where it Kinda camps. Did you guys go to I remember? We weren't cam people. I hate being outside and I hate force group bonding, so camp for me is just like a no on any possible metric. But my sister and I went to a girl scout sleep way girl scout camp. That was just like extremely traumatic for both of us. We hated it a lot I texted her about it because I was like what was our worst camp experience for this podcast and she hit me back with like a list of like eight thinks. Like the daddy long legs were everywhere. There were more daddy long legs and Campers and they were everywhere, which I do, remember that, and then we also like how to counter pork chop, who is just like a mysterious? figure. We also I, think went to like a Bible camp at some point, but I could be just remembering that that might have been like a daily thing. I just have I truly think. Every camp experience. I've ever had so not for me. It's weird. It's polarizing. People are really thrive. Campaigner is like a camp person. They have these lifelong friendships. He highly living. Stable for decades, people have really terrible experiences. There's no in between I. Don't get it, Amelia. I did I went to several camps I? Did go to vacation Bible school camp. When I was younger, but I also went to several like Ymca out in the wilderness we had to like. Forage for Crap I. Don't remember but and it was like overnight and I actually got heat exhaustion from a canoeing trip, and I had like collusive nations and so. Yeah. I think I was like twelve at the time or something I was really young. So definitely had camp experience which I actually enjoy, and it was an I am not super close to any of my camp friends. That probably says more about me than it does about camp, but. I had a good time I. don't know I mean it was just like one of those experiences you have when you're younger or wool. Some of US have I guess, and it was like phone. Yeah camp, and then also my parents made me go to Korean. Culture Camp to learn about my Korean heritage, so which was I wouldn't say was traumatic for me, but it was definitely. You know was just like Oh. Wow, there's a lot to learn about Korea. And I do remember this one time which I think I was way too old to be peeing my pants, but I accidentally in my pants and. I was probably like eight or something at the time and. Okay well. and. And I don't know why. I don't remember why. I peed my pants, but peed my pants and my, but thankfully that day we were doing water balloons stuff so I just. Played it off as like a water balloon mishap on my butt, and until my friend came up behind me and was like Oh my God. Someone guy you on the button. And I was like yes, yeah, that's that's. That's literally the perfect God was looking down upon you. fucking bone that happen. I know while. Wow, thank you. Yourself at that camp recently, right? In his-. Yeah feeder cab was most it. I mean looking back. Obviously I can't believe aided any of the things that I did which is like I can't sing literally to save my life, but they just give you full solos to sing in front of the room, full of parents and friends, and you just have to muscle your way through it and just like part. Part of the experience. I'm not very good at graffiti. It just looking back. It really stresses me out and I still have I. Still Wake up from stress dreams like I'm on stage, and like I don't my lines and standing there in front of audience. What that means I think about that later, but yet I still have camps like the camps dreams. Well. I'm only anti, camp. Guys Send US camp stories. Please lack. Said! Yeah. We'll be back with more camp talk next week for camp. Rock part to thank you guys so much for listening. You know this is a bizarre episode. Thank you as always reaser Kelly.

twitter Olympics Liz Kelly Joe Camp Rock Kate Demi Levato Amelia Disney Kevin Jonas Amelia Jada Pinkett Smith Instagram Guy Fieri Nick Jonas Wail Tyler Jonas Brothers Jada smiths