4 Episode results for "Pakistan Khuzistan"
Leaders: Benazir Bhutto
"The father used to say that the people of Bacchus thon on my political s there my sons and daughters. Hello from Wonder Media Network. I'm Jenny Kaplan and this is encyclopedia will Manteca. Today's leader was a groundbreaking politician who served as prime the minister of Pakistan twice making her the first woman in modern history to lead the Muslim nation though somewhat controversial due to charges of both corruption and political recall naievety. She was a champion for democracy and a force for liberalization in greater personal freedoms in her country. Let's talk about Benazir. Bhutto Benazir was born on June twenty first nineteen fifty three in Karachi Pakistan to a wealthy aristocratic family with strong a political ties. Benazir's father Zulfikar Ali Bhutto founded the Pakistan Peoples Party otherwise known as the P P P A popular Socialist Party that lead Pakistan in the nineteen seventies sometimes has to appear to be optimistic nevertheless feed that that is you for the future but this is dwindling at the same time I defected. That's lifetime and as your first and primary language bridge was English though. She did speak Urdu on occasion. From a young age she showed great promise and received a Western style. Education prestigious convent schools in Pakistan Khuzistan. In one thousand nine hundred. Seventy one while Benazir was attending Harvard. University her father was elected leader of Pakistan on a socialist platform. Then is your graduated with a bachelor's degree from Harvard in nineteen seventy three and then moved across the Atlantic to the University of Oxford where she studied philosophy political Kossi. It's making in nineteen seventy seven soon. After she finished Oxford and return to Pakistan Benazir's father was ousted in a military Kuu. I'm a Hamad will hawk. Zia became the military dictator of Pakistan and Benazir's father was executed two years later in nineteen seventy jeanine though Benazir and her mother were frequently under house. Arrest from nineteen seventy nine to nineteen eighty-four Benazir took up her father's mantle as head of the PP PP finally having had enough Benazir's political aspirations Zia exiled Benazir on her mother. The to move to London in Nineteen eighty-six Zia ended martial law and Benazir and her mother were allowed to return to Pakistan. Benazir quickly became the foremost member of the political opposition to Zia during her time. In England Benazir admired the work of Margaret Thatcher upon her return she shifted the P P P from a socialist socialist platform to a liberal one. It changed the course of my life. I had no intention of going into politics and had my father lived. Perhaps perhaps I would have chosen a different life for myself. A more stable life. The political shift helped Benazir navigate a political power vacuum created by the mysterious his death of Zia in a plane crash in one thousand nine hundred eighty eight in the ensuing elections. The P P P one the largest block of seats in the National Assembly and Benazir here was sworn in as prime minister on December first nineteen eighty-eight. This made her the first woman leader of a Muslim nation in modern history. As Prime Minister her Benazir tried to enact political and social reforms but was almost completely stifled by the Islamist and conservative parties as such. She wasn't able to effectively combat. The many issues facing Pakistan including pervasive corruption widespread poverty an increase in violent crime in August of nineteen ninety the president of Pakistan Gulan conned accused Benazir and her new government of corruption and nepotism Benazir was dismissed from her position and a new election was called. It's generally accepted that. The following election was rigged by Pakistan's intelligence services to ensure victory for the Islamic Islamic Democratic Alliance or J. I A Conservative Party in the years that followed Benazir served as leader of the opposition in the National Assembly in one thousand nine hundred ninety three the I J I government was also dismissed for corruption in elections held in October of Nineteen ninety-three the P P P again unearned a majority of votes and Benazir was Prime Minister of Pakistan. Once again this time around Venezia's determined to focus on economic privatization and greater the rights for women to areas. She believed were holding Pakistan back three years later. Renewed charges of corruption were brought against Benazir on. Is You're on her government these new accusations along with a series of controversies like the assassination of Benazir brother and a bribery scandal involving her husband. Bend led to her government's dismissal by the president. The P P P took a beating in the nineteen ninety-seven National Assembly elections and Benazir chose to go into self exile. The following year. The new prime minister was continuing to pursue. What were believed to be politically motivated? Corruption charges against her Benazir moved to Dubai and continued to run the P.. From there in two thousand seven rumors began to circulate. That Benazir was returning to Pakistan to run in the two thousand eight elections and she planned to run on a platform of greater military accountability to the civilian government and calls for a stop to the growing Islamist violence. In October tober Benazir officially arrived in Karachi from Dubai. They were great celebrations by her supporters following her return from exile though they were marred by a suicide aside attack on her motorcade that killed many supporters standing nearby. Either plus Sweden me not to come away. Intimidate me into not coming and I'm not going into be intimidated. I've made my decision and I'm returning for better or for us after attending a rally on December twenty seventh. Two thousand seven Benazir's Benazir's motorcade was hit by another suicide attack. This time Benazir herself was killed though. al-Qaeda took responsibility for the attack. It's it's widely suspected that the Pakistani Taliban as well as elements at the intelligence services were also involved in the years following her assassination. Benazir's here's come to be regarded as an icon for women's rights. She's revered for achieving the highest levels of success in a male dominated society tune in tomorrow for the story of another leader this week encyclopedia will Manica is brought to you by hellofresh. One of my personal New Year's resolutions is to cook more. Our thanks to hellofresh. I think it's a resolution I can actually keep. Hellofresh is flexible. You can easily change delivery days and food preferences and you can skip a week. Whenever you need I travel a lot? So that's Buydell for me. hellofresh helps me save meal prep and planning time and most importantly the recipes are delicious. Russia's I love that I get introduced dishes I otherwise might not try hellofresh now starts at just five dollars and sixty six cents per serving go to hellofresh fresh dot COM Slash Encyclopedia Tan. That's hellofresh dot com slash encyclopedia one zero and Use Code Encyclopedia. One zero during hellofresh is New Year's sale for ten free meals including free shipping special. Thanks to Liz. 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#733 Our Hearts Follow Our Money (Luke 12:34)
"Luke chapter twelve verse thirty four for where your treasure is there. Will your heart be also this is about as simple as as it gets and we need to hear it like we all do i need to we need to hear the simple truth our hearts. Let's follow our money where your treasure is there. Will your heart be also what we put put our money. In is where our hearts go so if we spend all of our money on ourselves on the things of this world on provision for ourselves on needs in wants in this world for us then that's where our hearts will be focused on the contrary if we spend our resources put our treasure in the needs of others in caring for others in providing for others in giving into the church in giving for the spread of the gospel among the nations and giving for the relief of the poor then dot is where where heart will be so if you want to know where your heart is look at your bank account now where you're spending your money at your checkbook views checks your credit card statement your cash flow. Oh that is a crystal clear picture of where your heart is in so in this way jesus encourages us to put our treasure in what's gonna matter most in eternity so why he says right before this verse thirty three sell your possession and give to the needy provide yourselves with money bags that don't grow old with a treasure in the heavens the it does not fail where no approaches and no moth destroys says what we saw already in jesus command to rich young man go sell all your possessions give to the poor so this is a theme we see so god help us to do it not the god. It calls every single one of us to sell every single thing we have. We don't see that in the bible. We definitely see that in some cases like the rich young man but he does tell us to report our treasurer into helping those who are in need in physical need those who are poor in spiritual need those who don't have the gospel. We've we didn't ran continuously for all kinds of different people groups in this podcast from pakistan recently the people today in pakistan or million of them mm four million people as far as we know no believers among the most is in pakistan so who's gonna give for the spread of the gospel of the mo chee and pakistan khuzistan. Who's gonna sacrifice money for the spread of the gospel among the motion pakistan and you start to do that. Your heart will start to be for the moji in pockets for them to come to know the love of grace and mercy of christ in the gospel so god bleeds change our orientation toward the money and our materialistic culture. Please change my orientation or money. God please help us l. puzzle purpose to put our treasure in that which will last forever her to give for the relief of the poor for those who are in urgent physical need to give for the spread of the gospel those of never heard it who are in urgent spiritual need god. Please help us in our churches to put our money in what matters most an eternity god. Please change the way our giving looks are our possessions look our approach to money looks so that so that you might be honored in our hearts tsk and that you might conform our hearts more and more and more to yours no god. Please help us. Please help me so you please help us. In this area bar lives our families your church and our day in jesus name. We pray <music>.
Intel official blows a whistle on Trump's interaction with world leader
"This post reports podcast is sponsored by fidelity financial planning that moves with your life learn more at fidelity dot com slash your goals fidelity brokerage services number. NYSE SIPC I P C from the newsroom the Washington Post Ross Helderman Post. How are you This is post reports. I'm Martine powers. It's Thursday September ninth today. Questions about the President's interaction with a foreign leader a states rights battle over fuel emissions and Canada's meets the world of fine dining. We I found out about the complaint late last Friday evening when Adam Schiff the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee put out a letter but he had written to the director of national intelligence or the big chief spy agency Shane Harris is a national security reporter for the Post and would he laid out in that letter was essentially eventually this history that begins in mid August where there was an intelligence community official who filed a complaint now. He didn't say what the complaint was because he didn't know complaint was at the time and said we're aware this person filed a complaint in that your office the deny will not let us see it and that you've determined for the following reasons that we can't and we demand to see it no deny director of national intelligence has ever refused a turnover whistleblower complaint and according to the Director of national the reason he's not acting to provided even though the statute mandates that he do so is because he is being instructed not to that this involved a higher authority someone above the DNA there are only few people above the deny that was kind of like suddenly the Chum in the water by Saturday morning. I think you know like basically as we every national security reporter in Washington was chasing this thing saying what is this. WHO's this whistleblower. What about because there. Was this big question of. If if Adam Schiff is so concerned about finding out the content of this complaint then what is the complaints in exactly and if Adam Schiff can't find out and he's making this public that suggests suggests that he is hit a wall and his efforts to get the information and then you all broke news today of what the content of that complaint that set correct what we reported today is that the allegation by this whistleblower involves a conversation that president trump had with a foreign leader and a promise or commitment that the president made to that leader in that conversation so we don't know who that foreign leader was or what that promise was that was made. That's right so so on offense face. It almost sounds like what we don't know very much that we did yesterday but actually we know a lot more than we did. Yesterday we know now that involves the president himself in a conversation Sion's so that tells us I think the allegation that it involves some kind of a promise the president or really anyone negotiates doesn't make a promise they expect something in return turn so it seems like there was some kind of talk of negotiation that occurred here enough to make this individual who we believe is someone who has a lot of experience in the intelligence community to say wait a second. This is agreed GIS or this is flagrant and possibly corrupt. I'M GONNA ring the alarm bell about it so we don't no who the president was talking to in this conversation that in official flags but we usually do have records of who presidents are talking to when they're talking to foreign leaders or we hear about phone calls and the general nature of those phone calls. Do we have any of that here to help us understand and what this conversation could have been better who could have been with. We have a bit we have some records of leaders that the president talked to during and around the period when the complaint was filed president trump spoke on July thirty first with President Vladimir Putin of Russia emit at the White House with the Prime Minister of Pakistan Khuzistan but in this sort of you can take a five or six week period before this complaint and there's a variety of people that he's met with Oh and of course in all of this period he's exchanging letters with Kim Jong UN and now that doesn't mean that's that it was within six three weeks. It could have been much earlier than that but what's interesting about this. White House is the president has a history of taking phone calls with leaders that he hasn't scheduled of sort of doing calls that don't necessarily get logged in the books taking meetings with with foreign officials without note takers in the room demanding that they be held with no American aides present. This is really I mean. This is unprecedented. People presents don't don't do it. This way. Generally speaking the reason we have a lot of Americans were making records. Note of this is because these meetings are not an opportunity for the president to engage in dealmaking with an individual there an opportunity for him to convey the positions of the United States and to try and get our policy message across. I'M WE WANNA record of that partly Harley because we don't want the foreign officials then going out and telling a version of the story that we're not refuting are telling a wrong version of the story. The Kremlin has done this. There have been meetings at the president's hat or phone calls. There should say with Vladimir Putin that we only find out about from the Russian government and there's anybody that they're telling the entire contents of the conversation and the full story. I don't think so so well. We have a some picture of what the President doesn't this conversation with a foreign leaders. There's this history of him. Frankly obscuring a lot of that which there's one one of the reasons this whistleblower complaint is so much more compelling because it involves these interactions that the president routinely tries to hide from people. Oh so this person heard what the president said was concerned about. It made a formal complaint what has happened with that. Complaint is the Inspector General actually investigating instigating it we'll inspector general did look at the complaint and found it credible and generally would that means an investigation is that there's someone else who can substantiate this so there's some other way to substantiate. It's it's not just the person saying this and you have to take their word for it and also that it met a legal threshold spelled out in something called the Intelligence Community Whistler's Protection Act which basically it met the criteria for something that the Inspector General looks at and says this is what's called an urgent matter so it's GonNa take this seriously under the law what's supposed to happen. Even then is that the g tells deny the director of National Tilden's about this and then he has a week to give the file basically to the oversight committee so thoroughfare of it but that didn't happen here and so what is Congress doing now to try to figure out more about what's in this complaint and to be able to take action on it so congress today heard from the intelligence community inspector general he testified behind closed doors we understand and he didn't really tell them anything new. I think that this is still still the. DA's office is still sticking to the line that they were advised by the Department of Justice which is that there are privileged communications involved here and so oh this cannot be transmitted to Congress importantly also what they're saying is. This isn't really in our lane. We're the director of national intelligence or the Intelligence Career Inspector General. We don't really have oversight at the president does well. That's a great question. Mrs Kind of become one of the recurring questions the trump administration you could argue that the Justice Department is in a position to decide what the president or the White House needs to do in a case like this in here they did presumably the White House counsel would have have a view on that as well. That's the lawyer for the White House or the office of the presidency tellingly according to Adam Schiff the White House and the Eddie and I will not tell them whether the White House was consulted. That's interesting so it does raise this question of who ultimately accountable well under the constitution. That would be the congress. The Congress has a coequal branch of government that gives the check the executive but in this case they can't find out what the complaint is so if the law says that in this case the inspector general is supposed to give this information to the director of National Intelligence who is supposed to inform Congress of what's going on. Why is it that the Department of Justice is stepping in is that normal so it is not normal for the Inspector General to get the Justice Department involved when there's a complaint in this case that process took this detour where officials in the Director of National Intelligence Office consulted with the Justice Department we think probably because of something they saw in the complaint. I think we can assume that given that. The allegation involved the president having a conversation with a foreign leader. They looked at this and said wait a minute. The president is is not really within our purview and there's indicating a little bit worried that they were out of their depth de Department of Justice to ask what precisely and there are indications in the letter that don't explicitly you say the president but in letters from denied the Congress that clearly indicate. We're dealing with an individual. That's not within our jurisdiction. Well okay. That's kind of pointing at the president isn't it and they go to the Justice Department and the Justice Department says there are issues involving privileged communications privileged communications again pretty clearly points to the president but the point here is is that the the law does not anticipate this kind of carve out or this detour or the deny gets to go consult with the Justice Department which is by the way led by a political appointee of the president the attorney me general and asked them. Hey what are we supposed to do here. That's Adam shifts position as laws very clear. You gotta give this to us but that's the impasse that we're at now. So who do they have any tools at their disposal to try to figure out what it is to be able to demand more information yeah they do and they used it this week. The committee issued issued a subpoena to the acting director of National Intelligence Game Joe McGuire compelling his testimony the officer back and said Whoa hold on a second. Let's let's not jump the gun here and we haven't had time to try and work this out essentially and there may be a way that they could meet and give the congress some information or maybe they you could say well. Here's the meat of the complaint but we're going to like you know x. out the communications itself that the president there's a way you could imagine them telling them something without. Maybe not telling them everything. Everything Joe McGuire is now slated to testify next Thursday in open session which is very interesting. We'll see if that actually comes to pass testimony. Tony has a way of kind of not materializing these days but that's sort of where we are right. Now is trying to work this out behind the scenes and people like reporters here. The Post and elsewhere are Paul frantically trying to figure out what in the world this whole allegation is about Shane Harris covers national security for the Washington getting past and this week the White House announced that it's revoking California's L. corneas ability to set its own auto emission standards. What they're really doing is up ending system in which California for decades has driven environmental advancements in this area essentially the reason we have a catalytic converter. Today in our cars is because California asked for it. I Julia Elliot Alpine is a senior national correspondent for the Post. She covers environmental and energy policy. You're having a huge battle. It's not just about what's the mileage of a car or light truck a few years from now but to what extent will California be a player demanding more of industry and having them respond so for decades. California has been able to set its own emission standards for cars that are completely separate right from federal emission standards. Why is that well so yes you have to go back to the nineteen sixties and really the issue is some people might be familiar with the images his of Los Angeles and smog and things like that essentially California had a big air pollution problem in the fifties and sixties and had been starting to address it and and so when the federal government came in and started crafting the Clean Air Act California said hold up a minute. We're already grappling with this problem mm-hmm and it's fantastic that you people are trying to pass a law but we WANNA make sure that if we want to go further and faster that's possible and so the agreement was is that California could ask permission to adopt more stringent standards when it came to not just vehicle will spot you know the farming operations and a slew of other potential air pollution problems but this week president trump announced something that could potentially change that absolutely so this week president trump and his deputies took action to revoke this long-standing waiver that California has has to set tailpipe emission standards for Carson light trucks and why are they doing this. Well there a couple of reasons for why they're doing it. One is that that the administration is currently in the midst of rolling back. Obama era mileage standards for these vehicles and so part of it is is the administration is seeking to weaken the mileage standards and it creates a schism. If California is imposing stricter rules. That's really the immediate reason more broadly. The administration is invested in ensuring that essentially states dates can't be the drivers of stricter environmental regulations particularly in the area of climate that they think that it gives a state too much power to be able to say while these cars can while these cars meet federal standards. If you want to drive your car in our state you have to meet a higher standard yes and in fact anyone who's being honest honest on the left or the right would agree that California has tremendous leverage because not only is it a significant portion of the US auto market but they're thirteen in states and the district of Columbia who have vowed to adopt the standards as a result. The auto industry really ends up being in a bind California. When you want to move ahead with stricter standards they're faced with the prospect of producing different vehicles for different parts of the country and that is something that they really don't? WanNa do been president. Trump's tweet also said that this was about consumers being able to have more cheaper cars for people who want to be buying cars in the future and also to have have more US jobs for car manufacturing. This is an argument that the administration has been making and partially it depends on how you do the math if you're looking at what the sticker sticker price of a car is when you walk into the showroom. It is true that if you're demanding higher mileage standards initially that car is going to be a little more expensive sensitive over the lifetime of the car. There's no question that consumers save money because they're spending less on gas and so that is something that again conservatives. Republican analysts who have looked up to this largely agree with but the administration is making the argument that you'll save money in the jobs argument that president trump is making is is not something that I've seen supported by any kind of independent academic study and it's a little unclear. It's not even something that I believe the administration. Dan has argued in the past. So what is the automotive industry seeing about this because I can imagine on the one hand. It's probably a lot easier easier for them for the federal government to be saying hey we don't want you to have to meet a higher standard to put all the money into creating cars that are more fuel efficient but on the other hand a lot of these car manufacturers had just made a deal with the state of California saying that they were going to create these more fuel-efficient cars. The auto industry is in a bind and they're split on this. It's worth noting that it was in fact the automakers that I asked trump to pursue this weakening of mileage standards and they did that within a week of taking office so they've sparked this entire battle that we're in right now however they were under the assumption that California Gornja and the federal government would be able to strike a deal like they did under the Obama Administration and they would meet somewhere in the middle they wouldn't demand the same improvements and efficiency but at the same time they wouldn't give up on it altogether once it became clear that California and the trump administration were at loggerheads the auto industry really elite pursued a split strategy where four automakers struck a deal with California to largely adhere to stricter targets and the rest of them have remained it on the sidelines and right now. They're being pretty quiet about what they WANNA do going forward for the ones who have not who have not struck this deal and how is the state of California reacting getting to this guy is fired up and ready to go to court one hundred waivers have been approved over and over and over again courts upheld writes these waivers so I'm confident will prevail avail. Eventually we'll take years and years and years Warren certainty more anxiety but California will prevail they had a press conference yesterday where they had the governor saying that they were eager to challenge the administration on court and that they were determined to assert their authority to regulate air emissions from cars but to some extent we do have a record that Congress has repeatedly affirmed the right of California to have its own authority over air pollution emissions so you know there's kind of arguments that both sides can marshall will really have to see what happens in court and where does that leave car manufacturers because if you're an automaker you can't have have confusion about what the regulations are going to be for your car that you're trying to design. That's GONNA come out in just a few years and so. How are they going to navigate this. That's an excellent question and I would love to get a bunch of car makers in a room off the record to talk to them about this. They tend to be pretty careful about it but my sense is from the discussions. I've had with the auto industry industry that to some extent they still need to produce more efficient cars for a couple of reasons one is that they plan their vehicles afford a five of year planning cycle so you know we're debating about what are going to be the federal standards for next year and in fact they're thinking several years down the line line at this point they also face the prospect that of course there could be a different party in control of the White House come twenty twenty one and so they are trying to balance all all of these competing issues and at the same time you know try to live by whatever rules the trump administration sets forth in the coming months so even if this move by the White House is something that was initially requested by auto manufacturers. The fact that it's now happened is just making things more confusing thing for them. Oh yes I think that any auto manufacturer if they're being frank would would certainly say that if they knew it would lead down to this path they would of at least thought twice before asking for this rollback Juliette. Thank you so much thank you Julia. Alpine is a senior national correspondent and for the post What's on your list of financial goals buying the new house strengthening your retirement plan all of the above whatever you're saving for fidelity personalized planning and advice can help you reach those goals with digital planning adding Plus One on one personal coaching all with low transparent pricing to learn more visit fidelity dot com slash your goals or call one eight hundred three four three three five four eight advisory services offered for a fee by fidelity personal and workplace advisors? LLC and brokerage services provided by FIDELITY BROKERAGE SERVICES LLC and now one more thing. It's going to have this kind of rustic. Look it'll have lots of indoor plants. It'll have a really nice terrace Chris. The menu will be sort of inspired by Southern American food and Carribean food too. It's GonNa look like a neighborhood place but with weed. I'm more I'm reporter for the food section. More recently visited a place called logo farms. It's a new cannabis restaurant in Los Angeles. My name is Andrea Drummer. I am a cannabis chef right now. I'm searching it would law and we are opening purpose. I on site consumption candidates restaurants in the country so the Lo Farms cafe is going to be one of the first sort it's not fine dining but like upscale enough restaurant that will serve cannabis on the menu. There are a couple of other places that have tried to have cannabis consumption options lounges and they're usually these kind of like Graham looking rooms attached to dispensaries in Colorado or California. No one has really been able to accomplish accomplish like a neighborhood restaurant more welcoming place where people can make it truly a social experience. The restaurant opens this month but but before that could happen the owners had to jump through all kinds of legal hoops because of conflicting state and local laws around recreational cannabis consumption so one of the biggest obstacles here is that West Hollywood passed an ordinance that would allow these cannabis cafes and lounges to operate but there is no such license at the state eight level. There's only a dispensary license. So on the state level these restaurants are going to be operated as dispensaries which gives them certain permissions on what they can and sal but because of the local laws they'll actually be subject to more restrictions for example restaurants in the city can usually open till two. Am I am but because they're actually a dispensary they can only operate until ten PM. Another example is that they can't actually infuse the food. The experience of injustice esteem cannabis is very different from smoking it of course and I hope to kind of bring that experience to the general public she's not able to infuse food because all cannabis edibles have to be tested at the state level when you're operating restaurant. It's just not feasible for you to send everything to to a lab and so because of that she won't be able to infuse her own food on the Primus and generally opening up a restaurant like this is really hard. Operators operators can't use regular banks. The can't build within six hundred feet of a school. They need extra security and ventilation. They had to scuttle their plans for a roof DAK because you can't actually have a business where cannabis consumption is visible from the street. It has to be behind walls and at the state level campus purpose businesses can't actually sell food so Lowell cafe will operate as two separate businesses under one roof a restaurant and a dispensary that means that there will be three spaces within the building one for smoking only one only for eating and one for smoking and eating people who sit there. We'll get author. Cannabis delivered to the table from the other side of the building and people who order food an cannabis will receive two different checks if you could merge these two concepts of food in cannabis and that is contributing to normalising the conversation and removing the stigma candidates that makes it worth it for me than getting people to talk about it and think about it in different weight even if you're not considering other states were cannabis's recreationally legal will definitely be watching this to to see how it works to see how it works out and how people react to it from. I think a public health standpoint and also from tourism standpoint and how much money it will bring in Colorado Ratto has already passed a bill looking at these cannabis lounges and restaurants and I think other states are exploring it as well and so it is something that we might begin to see soon in other states where cannabis is legal moral. Jedis writes about food and culture for the Post. That's it for today a show thanks for listening on Friday's episode of Post reports. The story of the forty seven dogs who survived Michael Vick's dogfighting ring for some of these. He's rescue organizations. They thought okay. We've got about what fifty dogs man. If we could save ten we could save five Tony Awesome. I don't know of anyone was quite expecting that. At the end these evaluations they would say okay forty seven of the forty eight like time to go home. I'm Martine powers. We'll be back tomorrow tomorrow with more stories from the Washington Post. Who and what's on your list. If financial goals buying a new house strengthening your retirement the plan all of the above whatever you're saving for fidelity personalized planning and advice can help you reach those goals with digital planning plus one on one personal coaching all with low transparent pricing to learn more visit fidelity dot com slash your goals or call one eight hundred three four three three five four eight advisory services offered for a fee by fidelity personal workplace advisors l._l._c. and brokerage services provided by fidelity brokerage services L._L._C.
"Hey It's Andrew the director of Literary Arts Literary Arts. We rely on our community. People like you for support to help make this podcast and all our programming possible give today literary Dash Arts Dot Org forward slash donate welcome to the archive project manager proctor. Executive Director of obliterate arts the archive project is retrospective of some of the most engaging talks from the world's best writers for more than thirty five years literary Arts Portland Support Good for the archive project is provided by Cole. Haan Cole Haan shoes bags and outerwear go with you. While you work your way to extraordinary more at Cole. Haan Dot Com in this episode. We Feature Atanasie Coats in conversation with writer and activist Renee Watson. Tallahassee Coats is the author of the bestselling books the beautiful people struggle and between the world and me which won the National Book Award in Two Thousand Fifteen coats then went on to publish. We were eight years in power a collection of essays from his years at the Atlantic magazine including the article. The case reparations that piece proved so powerful that it helped rekindle national debate that led to the historic congressional final hearing in June two thousand nineteen including testimony from coats himself of H R forty. A bill that would establish a commission to study reparations in addition into his work as a journalist and essayist coats is also the current author of the Marvel Comics the Black Panther and Captain America in October Two Thousand Nineteen Coats published his first novel the Water Dancer taking his career in yet another exciting direction. The water dancer was an instant Number One New York Times bestseller. An an Oprah Book Club Selection the book draws on his previous nonfiction and comics writing to create the bracingly realistic and fantastic story of Hiram Walker a young man borne of the slavery and in the process of discovering and harnessing a mysterious power the Los Angeles Times described the water dancer as quote a spellbinding. Look at the impact of slavery that uses meticulously researched history and hard one magic to further. Illuminate this country's original sin. Codes envisions the transcendent potential in acknowledging and retelling stories of trauma from the past as a means out of darkness coats begins the event with short reading before sitting being down to talk with Renee Watson. Yours coats the now we talked about Safai. Is it. Okay if I read from here okay. All Right Rian have our conversation realizing maybe I was supposed to sit down now. Okay all right well I I was listening. Listen to all of the intro- introductory remarks and I was very happy to hit a number of high school students here. That's always exciting on news. But if I can just be a little small for a moment I didn't realize the Portland Trailblazers had anything to do with me being here. Ah I saw shot Damian Lillard. My wife says there are two types of one house like there's Normal Tallahassee you know just settled you know what I mean Kinda even even straight up in this. What's Tallahassee and I saw that shot and grandmother at all maybe to see his space dame man you know eh something anyway? I'm not here to talk basketball arena talking about the water. Dance is My my first novel and I have to say I don't know if any other spiring writers in in House I say always even now consider myself inspiring writer because every time you start something I it's another lesson and you have to learn how to do the thing all over again. Ah But certainly for a first novel ended the first time novelist to be agreed with this much. Enthusiasm is breath taken so I thank you very much for being here. The what dances the story of an enslaved man. By the name of Hiram Walker a young man and his father is the owner of a plantation. His mother is an enslaved woman who has been sold off by his father. No less Hiram has deepen an impressive natural photographic memory. If he were here right now he could recite everything that I just said and all the introductory the remarks came before that until you everything that you said but his memory failed at the thing that is most intimate to him in. That is the loss of his mother. He says at one point in the book he talks about how he sees everything in colors and shapes and textures but when he he thinks of his mother all he sees his words he knows what's happened to his mother because the community in which he's invested tells him you know what's happened but he can't actually picture that and part of his struggle is the connection of pain and trauma to to memory and what it it does to memory and how how we deal with that how we push things into as he says in the book the down there of the mind but Hiram is not the only character dealing going with trauma in this book there was a young lady by the name of Sophia. Who is who is also enslaved? And she's enslaved to the relative of hi rooms. Father are so high alkyl actually and rain when this man this person Daniels in residence he has hiram bring this woman Sophia over and when she comes over she has to go through this whole routine of dressing up as though she were an an upper class lady gone for a period of time at any returns and has to do his duty and he's having a conversation with her about what she did while he was gone and how that made her feel I will say one of the things I was trying to do with. This book was getting into the Interior Tiriac of the enslaved to take us to a place where we would not simply talking about what had been done to black people in this country during the period of two hundred and fifty years of slavery but what black people themselves did how they felt with their mindset was what the experience was like and so this is Sofia describing to some extent What the experience was like being enslaved to to another man and not having possession possession of a body I spoke up and said how'd you get here was gone walked? She said you walked all the way here. You I did with my costume and effects. Thank God for theater. She watched over my daughter Carolina weekend only had to do it once. Wants but I tell you when I got. That call was a mess but I did. It fit my face. I fit my address and my unmentionable right over there behind them bushes. My God of all the things I'd done did that was the one that left me. Feeling the MO- slow had to strip down to what God gave gave me a number. She's afraid of who might walk by and what they might do. All I could do was saying to myself as I did. Sing low and quiet sing courage then. So fear breathe. How long and heavy and said don't you ever doubt that I hate them? Don't you have doubted. Did and as she said had face shifting into an execution as mask there was no feral or raised eyebrow no spread of the mouth. No light and dark eyes have faced mirror the truth of the hate she now spoke. She shook ahead and said things I would put on them hiring the things that would be capable of you. See me here now in this small body wife my hands my arms whereas as those of men would I would do with my energies. I have thought if it you see I have thought of it even in this body my God I would do while. He slept with a kitchen blade or attention his tea or white powder in his cake. I have thought of it very often and well then I had my Carolina and that was that and I m a good woman how am I tell you I m but what I would put on them giving my time. Uh what I we put on them. Thank you the. I'm so glad that you started with that. I definitely want to talk about their love story. Really and the humanity that is in this novel. So we're going to get to that but I I just WanNa know how are you doing. Are you so much has happened that we're all kind of watching this. But take off and Oprah chose it for her book club and it's hit the New York Times bestseller list has it. Is it sinking in that. You know this book has done what it is doing. And how do you feel about all of that. I'm the Nissan of process. Yeah I like I said I mean you you you don't again. I'm so happy to see you guys. I don't think any author can never take for granted an audience no matter what the audience was for your last you just you just never know. And this one haven't worked on it for so long certainly when I started. This was not the expectation you know and I so funny because I always joke Okuma editor like when we were writing this. I mean you just never know what's going to happen. It's no way we were like this clearly is a oprah's yeah I mean I. I don't know how you do that but you know we. We certainly didn't have at it so it's it's been a lot but a lot of a lot of good. ooh Can you talk about what made you say I'm gonNA write fiction. I mean I know that it is ten years in the making tobe. Between that time other books came out and we know Oh you for your journalism and your essays in for Black Panther and then now fiction. I'm like you are a writer which is a beautiful thing that just I write novels. I right S. as you are a writer's writer can you talk about that risk or did you feel that it was a risk to like put something new out into the world after we got to. I know you kind of in one vein. Yeah thank you very kind of you. I really appreciate especially that part about being a writer's writer so when I started this comes comes out of my. My first book is beautiful struggle. My editor my agent. After I turn that book and suggested that I try fiction there was no way I I didn't really have a large audience then so I didn't have to think about like I didn't think this was going to happen. Any of this everything that came with between the world and we all the. It's very very difficult to actually say. This is going to happen one day so to benefit at is no. I never felt that I would have to take a risk in front of a bunch of people people because there was nobody looking at the time and then by the time it really happened which I guess would be case reparations. Two thousand fourteen. I was like five years in somebody right so it was too late to turn back at that point. I knew what I was doing in private. I I WANNA take your question though Specifically about the book beyond the actual suggestion I think I went to a period of study in the civil war secretary thousand nine two thousand ten and one of the things became apparent to me that there were many less but one of them was that aw people always talk about how the confederacy the army of asleep won the war of history. That is they were able to remake aac themselves as something other than people who are fighting for the right to sell other human beings to expand that right on which was the cord the confederate cause. And somehow they were able to inscribe themselves with a kind of a nobility as those like King Autho and camelot and and you see this all your culture. I mean if you think about the vast vast majority of movies that you've ever seen about the civil war When invoking the civil usually confederacies confederate soldiers are some defeated person who's kind of tragic courageous and mythic and only tangentially if at all ever related to enslave men and I I couldn't the life of me understand how a group or an army that fought for such a horrible 'cause came to to be imbued with such a glamour and it occurred to me that these folks had not just won the war history? They had actually won the war of aesthetics. I wonder who gets to be beautiful and who doesn't get to be beautiful and even sitting here thinking about this now. I think that's one the things or what is parcel to being oppressed. It's not just socio economic deprivation. It's what is held. Held up as beautiful as he roic and that was put in the sharpness relief for the civil war. But I think there's You know a broader statement that that can be made about that so when I when I went to right I was consciously China do something different to construct the different myths or to to write eight or to throw myself into that of ascetics. Now I promise to be brief nine nine. Who got questions? And I'm like given US Michio into my dissertation wanted. This is what they came now. One of the problems with that other people have I think. That's not an uncommon. Thought one of these that you always have to watch again and I tried to in this book successfully or not is you can't take white mythology and painted black because white mythology has all sorts of assumptions. That we probably should not cherry with us so to take at least we really really. You should really should take it back to you. Know those sorts of stories about this sort of loan hero from the fetchy. oftentimes these stories are told with with someone has done something to this person's wife raped and killed and the guy goes to avenge or something like that and the wife. Ace is never really much of a character. The wife is that person's onto their cars and I think given because of the fact lacked that slavery and rape my soul synonymous in this country. You there is a temptation as a black man Dan writing or engaging in that war to just take that and do the same thing. You know what I mean I do and you gotta watch you gotta be really careful. You're going to be really really. That's just one of those about violence also shouldn't be imported but you really have to make a new myth. You can't just insert L. reading this. I was so moved by the thoughtfulness. mm-hmm is that you had towards Sofia and end the women. I'm all of the women and the novel our whole people and not just a caricature Of An enslaved person and they have dreams and goals and we get to see them speak up for themselves and talk talk about what they want and mourn and be just human in a way that sometimes in movies and other we don't get to see black women be the whole people and so I really appreciate that and I was curious as a man writing these characters. What did you do to be able to do that so well? What's what's the practical writing thing that you did to like? Get the women right in this Vick and Matt do the whole hero thing even though it is a left story he doesn't come save. You know and in many ways repeatedly saved right. Yeah Yeah I had a lot of help. I'm not lying. I mean it's one one thing we know you want to do that. But even if you have it as intellectual ambition which I had the ability to execute you need good readers I am probably preaching to the choir here but we are in error where people who are infatuated with their own intellect look like to stand up and say well. We don't need diversity. We don't need this. You know I you know great person with my great brain can just sit here and figure it out. You know what I mean and if you had a great brain to you you could do the same thing you know but you know this is not about anything you know particularly in the bones anything. He's just people have different experiences. And you're trying to write yourself into other people's experiences you know. Maybe you should have some of those people reading an offer some critique to your work Mr hats or hats. It's actually quite simple. Yeah it's actually and so so. I had a lot of help help. We had time to editors Victory Matsui and Nicole Count to editors who read an offer comments. You know my wife always read. When I'm writing off comments so had help I mean I mean that's that's the biggest thing I appreciate you saying that? We have a lot of writers in the room and a lot of aspiring writers. And I think sometimes it can look like someone they wrote the book and that this is the book that you wrote the first draft right exactly. It's never that way so I appreciate you being honest about well. Yes you have helped you have readers. You're going back and going back and going back again to get it just right and I feel like I mean clearly. You did that because it. It seems And singing speaking of sinking a music. I know you have a playlist for the book I saw that you. ooh I love that because I write some music too but I so many writers don't I don't know you have like a whole sound transit. This book late it while I was writing a different different. Have you went over the ten years. I've got like five of them. You know what I mean but I mean it'd be different for different people but I've heard they say what a word is getting my way. My really really helps me with the mood. And you're thinking about this. I WANNA do some craft up to and just talk to you right at a writer. No okay so you reach out to people. Oh you got feedback. You had play list. Can you talk about how music influences impacts your writing. What role does it play in your life as a writer storyteller? I mean I think I'm I'm always trying to use words to get past. The words like you almost want people. To forget that they're reading reading get these imbued in it as possible so I'm always trying to figure out. How do I get to that? You know what I mean. A lot of times in the music music is there like the feeling. Is there like the thing I think about. Say this all the time I think about like distant lover. You know what I mean. Mommy's just listen to that and there's something I mean. Words a great. That's fine but there's something in how he is communicating the words that is almost indescribable. And what you're trying to do when you're writing is trying to conduct conveyed at feeling out of you do you think is the word and hopefully it reaches the person but you have to feel it. I because if you don't feel it there's nothing to give you know and so if anything. I probably used a music music to get to the feeling I'm trying to get to and then once I feel and I say okay. This is how felt just describing. Yeah so the first paragraph paragraph read it yet is a long sentence And I love that. I love this idea of call Oprah nine eleven. I'll call right now. I should say the pass so I appreciate it because I feel and I read it so I read it the first and then I went back once I got to the end and always I always do this and go back to the beginning to remind myself how to story start and I own. Yeah like you said as for the tumbling down the movement the water all of that felt very deliberate with the common the common the communist. It's intense you're not pausing and taking a breath getting so many moments in this book there is no Oh pausing and taking a breath and so. I wonder like was that intentional. Wh How how do you think about the placement of words actually on the page and Gregory question so but that is only in the last draft of the book so all of the dry lesson is not there. That's seen as there but that sentence is not there and I think this is the advantage of writing and rewriting because I knew how I was like. Okay this hands. Uh so now I really know how to start. You know what I mean. I'm absolutely clear on. This story goes so I know exactly how to start to achieve which which you actually really said that once you get if you so chose to go back you see it all laid out right right in front and really for that entire section I was. This is trying to say this is the stories about all here. It's all here and if you ever went back and looked at that section you can see my God. It was all. Yeah absolutely all laid. Now I think about that because also Poetry like one of my. It's my love and I know you love poetry and I think about like poets placement and line break and Stanza and all of that and sometimes I feel like when writers writing fiction or prose. Maybe they don't pay as much attention to how actually structure this paragraph or would look like on the page and how are those words going to evoke a feeling emotion and so I also wanted to ask how does poetry impact or I shouldn't say how does it impact. Your pros is an. Can you talk a little bit about the relate. What can fiction writers land from poets a year? I think people who write pros in general and and I'm might be wrong about this but I feel like people generally regard what they consider beautiful lyrical writing writing as a kind of course and then you had a story you know you have character plateau all those sorts of things you know but the way the census sound is is something that is always considered over there and I just I don't feel that way and maybe as you said I mean. I started off as a poet. I started offering colorful for Shea Yussef Sonia Sanchez bureaucracy. That's what it stuff and so how. Things sounded very very very important. It carried information summation. I have a tough Tom reading anything where people don't think too much about how to where it's actually sound. They think what they're saying is enough but I felt like he's about nonfiction to like like I felt like if I were writing something like between the world case preparations You know it was not enough for somebody to read it and say AH. That's seems correct. You know that that some you know yeah you were trying to get to. There's something here heart to person. Wanted them like get up from it and it'd be disturbed and have to walk around a little bit or call a friend. Learn when they went to bed they were thinking about it and they woke up thinking about it and they couldn't shake it. You were trying to get to that place back in their brain and just Sit there you know what I mean and you can't do that by just being factually correct. You can't do that by just telling a tidy story right. I actually think it's the language that allows you to Barrow in into people's brains so that they sentences stick with them and they just they just have trouble forgetting. It was like the song like a lyric songs. Exactly exactly yes I wanNA talk also about Your research and know that we saw that you did so much taking in people's stories and in so many ways you know that's what you're supposed to do as a writer. I also know that it's a lot to take in other people's story and that These aren't just stories right. I mean we're connected to these stories and I wanted to know how you take care of yourself. And what does it mean to be in black body reading these narratives than having to tell the stories have to live your life. And how do you balance balance taking in so much pain and that carrying that with you. Does that make sense. It does believe it or not. The writing is a tremendous relief. I mean I've I've said this before but was always troublesome to me about America and white supremacy and racism says Was Not or she was not just the fact that the thing I mean the fact that thing is bad but it's the what do they call it the gas alighting. Yes does the lion. None of that didn't happen. And once you get to this place lace of. We feel like I did write it really. Did it absolutely did it. Almost I won't say the white supremacy doesn't matter but the lie lie begins to not a lot and that is a tremendous relief to realize that you're not crazy. Yeah yes so you know I know that mainly yeah poison is bad right but someone telling you you poison yourself who you having to sit there and think of poison myself right. When did I do remember that? That don't go. There was something I swear I saw right. You know what I mean I salute. You saw it you know you do food and to like get the like video camera footage to extend the metaphor. Yes yeah you know that's in writing is like for me it is. The writing is not so tough stuff. Well let's see. What do you mean by me? Just like the fact of having having to live in it is the difficult part for me to the writing is an escape. This where things are true. It's I feel like I've achieved. Some of them. Don't understand we have a lot of young people in the room tonight which I'm so happy that so many Young writers are here. Can you talk to them for a moment and Especially are aspiring writers. Who are here? And they're like I want to be on that stage one day reading from my book. What is my advice that you would give to them? Don't own aspire to be on this thing and why do you talk about why. Why is that not the dream and the goal I mean listen and I hope nobody takes? I'm very very happy you all I really but politely as I can't isn't that for you and honestly I don't think you would be if I wrote it like it was for you. I don't want to bear witness to art part. That is solicitous of me. You know I come to this person express something deep deep inside and they pulled out you know what I mean and rented in some sort live beautiful fashion and so the first thing I would say is you know right for yourself. You know that is different than you know with some people say which is don't be over to critique it's not what I'm saying nothing off yeah I think critiquing find good group to offer. Critique is really really important but some of worse writers and maybe not the worst right if some of the most unhappy writers who I know are writing because they aspire to be on a stage in front of a crowd like this and and that's just as bad Mojo. It'll drive you to do some really really unhealthy things. I write because it brings me tremendous joy. Yeah you know I I have a simple life. I have a family friends. I have my writing and those all three of those things remain tremendous tremendous joy. Now so I would say first of all if you're going to do and make sure you're doing it for for the right reasons. Make sure you're doing it because you feel like you can't almost can't stop yourself from doing that very close to being very good all right. If you can't stop yourself you know I would say read as much as you can read a ton and I would say practice. I would say. Avoid the temptation to think. I'm renee as you said that writing just comes out like this that you know somebody just wrote it down. You know what I mean understand that almost all writers at least the ones I know when they start off their first drafts a terrible terrible terrible terrible and they revised forward. Yeah revise folks. They don't they don't start. You know what I mean as a finished product and you know in writing is not so much written as it's built. Yeah and if you can get to that you can deal with that you know you might be a writer. Can you talk about what comics you have heard you speak about this year when you were younger that that's really what you were reading and I don't know I feel like sometimes comics. Graphic novels get looked down upon our net seen as literature or maybe not the books that a teacher my hand a young person. Can you talk about how they impacted. I mean here you are today and you grow up reading comets. Yeah I mean I am. I don't know it was like my earliest notions. Russians of of of what story was what was beautiful. What was exciting? I think a lot of it has to do with how I came up. I was born and raised in crack. Our was Baltimore. It was not the funnest time to be living in American cities. And I think like everybody else did. I was looking for escape. You know and I found my escape in what I have no problem calling literature I found parallels close to my experience. Always tell people that I use spider man Fan when I was a kid and I never thought of Peter Parker's white it never just translated translate in a way for me. I don't know why I was aware how he looked. Obviously but I didn't think of him as white because his a hero tries to do the right thing. The press hate some people throw things boom all sorts of terrible things and you know living being black living in West Baltimore and eighties. I thought I can. I see that you know if nobody close to me. Yeah no it's all really really close to me. So that's probably one of my earliest forms forms of literature. Who are your superheroes when you think about like living people or people who are no longer with this who are some of you are mentors or people who you look not fire guidance? While some longlist so I mean obviously in this book for the way it was written. I mean hey tubman is probably the old all this you know. Clapper Real Harry. Yeah that's probably the oldest because Harry was from Eastern Shore Maryland families from eastern shore Maryland. I grew up in Baltimore. So there was a close close relation and Frederick Douglass who had a huge impact on hottest book is written but when I was young probably one and I guess because when it happened in formative period probably one. That was the biggest news Malcolm X.. That was and I think because even then I was aware that there was like kind of vocabulary for how people talked about black people and at what emotions black people were allowed to show. Yes and this me too and I can remember it even even then that we should always always be forgiving of white people. Whatever they do that we should be forgiving of the worst of what White America has done and mountains probably first person? I heard any sort of public place saying that after that You could debate back and forth whether forgiveness is correct or not correct. That's not the point. He just sounded so human than me just sounded like yes. I would be angry right right. If somebody hit me over the head. What a night? Stick with the upset about that and that is okay to say that it's okay to say you know I mean even from the reading I I read like like when I was writing so it was very important that she not be presented in her situation as this person who was sorta like yesterday yes but I find a way and every way. Okay Yeah pray through it. I'm not mad at him right. No not what he do breath. Don't hate them all no doubt that I hate him and if I could do it. Yeah you don't if you committee's army black so you don't feel like that. Yes and black women that film and that's why I love. I love her so much because she isn't the like yeah. All the stereotypical roles that we see black women have to play over and over of every tragedy can happen to them and they're still just gonna the have joy and spider still love the man who is a complicated flotman right all of that but forgive him and bring him back and no. She's actually no no. I feel I want. You can't come save me. I'm not just an and she's not just a body right right exactly so it was interesting because I'd probably Kareem finished but I hadn't even thought about this because in that says to write that that was not difficult because that didn't feel very different than the black women. I knew right so unlike stretch why ear that shows up in literature so often differently in the culture so often differently. I think has a lot to say about who is controlling the narrative of what expectations yes absolute and the gatekeepers the thinking about your editor and the fact that you are working with an editor who is black. And we're with does that like how has that that impacted you think you're writing career. Be The freedom maybe to tell the stories the way you want to tell them and use a one person was black. Now that additives that is was black and another was Japanese American. Yeah those are the then. Isn't it happened in publicity and those are the people who had hands on this. Yeah yeah in. Only one of them was a dude so that shit yeah. That'll have the fact that I mean I I I swear. I mean just ninety from charity perspective but just from a craft I again. I'll just go back to. I don't understand I can write right anything and I don't need to talk to anybody about and I can just imagine myself as I don't know a Pakistani guerilla fighter and I don't mean to know where Pakistan Khuzistan is or talk anybody about anything I can imagine it I can be. I don't know I guess well I appreciate that you call people and ask them read. This helped me do this thing because you did it. Well L.. Bring data so well. We're going to go to question soon. But I wanted to honor our beloved Tony More. Yes ma'am the. I was in New York when you were with her. And Sonia. Sanchez was there and saw that moment. The three of you in conversation I mean I tell you a story though. Okay one hundred I got. This is like wow man you know what I think about an a lesson to me and y'all go had had the knock crucify me for this. You know I I love Sonya and I have been talking to someone you know you know. She told somebody had been such a big supporter and was one of my early. We like inspirations and tons of writing poetry after that you know to the little job I went. I went on this but she wrote and asked me to do it. House like doc that was my reaction and I head believe it or not such a hard year with between the world and me and I I. I can't go out in public again and do this and somehow I think somewhere in the back of my head I was like it's not right. You really need to go. You really need to go and that night was so beautiful. It was so beautiful you know and in Jackie Boson was it so incredible that like it really was a reminder about because I think I even felt us at the time is fleeting. You just don't no. You don't know if you're going to get a chance to be on stage with Sonia Sanchez and Toni Morrison again. Don't you shouldn't anticipate that that necessarily will viva forever. But we all I mean. We're not always our worst moments wise. You know what I mean and and again that's why you need people around. You need people around you and that just I mean that was like one of the highlights of my career. It's incredible it was a beautiful tonight and I know you know she loved you words so I just wanted to say her name tonight and and share that moment with no she was special because it is hard enough to be a great writers really really hard is even more difficult to. He'd be a great writer and to touch other people. And so you know kind of lift them up. I don't think between between the world and we would have been between the world and he went. Toni Morrison I just. Don't I mean the book was there but I don't. I don't think that would've went the way it went. I just don't and everything after that hat. Yeah flows I mean even to this book even to being right here so I am. You know indelibly touched by not just writing but her generosity of spirit so for those of you. Who Don't know this is this? Ms Morrison said I've been wondering who might feel the intellectual boy that plagued me after James Baldwin died. Clearly it is time Hussy the solarge. Yeah small. No it's not small it's math mall But Yeah I'm thankful that she saw that in you and and and we're thankful that we have their words so I hope you're writing your questions down passing them to ashes. I have a few that were already emailed in so we'll get started. But if you have questions please please send them. And I'll try to get through as many as it became our first question and that was e mailed in. What have you been reading lately that you would recommend you? I just read this book American spy notice but no. I don't somebody's somebody somebody again. Oh my God so so good good and it's good like I have personal reasons for eleven. I'm from my dad was in the Black Panther party yet and I was. I was raised on the knowledge of what the Federal Government had done to Black Panther why they had done to black beat him struggling Fred Hampton and what they would the CIA had done in Africa and this story is told from the perspective of her is really a black family that works in law enforcement and works in the FBI. It actually works on the other side and it is absolutely fascinating it is riveting is absolutely riveting. I mean I just can't say enough. It was a great great book. Oh and Jackie's book to read at the ball artist. Great come on Jackie for me. Jacqueline Woodson can do no wrong but that book I believe it is. It really is incredible. You'RE GONNA YOU'RE GONNA blurb can't right now yeah once got done. Jags only take a second and read the book. It's incredible incredible book and another writer. Who's just so generous interest to her time and advice and mentoring up and coming up initially can you speak to your choice of the word am task? Slaves influence in the book is we just a lot of parallels but this goes back to where I was before where I was talking about so in the book for those who have not read the worst slave and slavery in the book. But it's very rarely used instead. Slavery is referred to as the task and the people who wants lead-up referred to as the task and a large Wahdat was not once again taking white white mythology painting a black meeting new terms and new ways of thinking about things. And I've said this repeatedly and I'm just GONNA say throughout the tour so one of the things I think about is how we're in this moment now when we have been for the past twenty so is we no longer say rape victim. Can we say rape survivor. And it was a terminology myself adopted but was not quite sure why I was saying I was saying it. Out of out of respect You know what I mean. Somebody acts for particular name out of just generosity respect you give it away but those writing in the book I got like like I begin to see it. You know because the typical terminology that we use in this country is slave right. That's what you've become you become. You are a slave. Yeah not you're slaved not something was done to you. You were the thing you Ashley the thing and like assigned to see like is Kinda evil to that right because society the does something to you allow something to happen to you or willfully neglect or whatever and then it makes you the thing. Somebody didn't you so what that means is all of your identity. All of your humanity is annihilate and you become a thing society did to you right and I I just I mean I thought about that a lot in this book and I mean there's obviously violence in this book but there's one side side two says if you're depicting slavery enslavement. You have to show in great detail. How horrible it really was and I understand? I don't want to argue against depiction of that but Sophia is a situation. Where as I said her body is not our own? So what does it mean to write a five page rape scene like what do you do are you can make the argument. Why did that you know what I mean to show bill? How evil this other dude was you know? But what have you done to the person you know what I mean. Can you know the reader as they go through the rest of the book and they see the person anymore you can actually see them as a human being and all of the other things that make up them as a human being and so in an effort to do that. I just you know you need new terms because I say slave and things. I'd come to mind immediately like you. Almost slavery is when slave act of making somebody into a thing. And then you say the word and the person pitches a thing in their head you know and so the the naming of this. This became very very powerful. Very very important. I said this last night that is a lesson because in this period right now move. Do people want different names. And maybe all of us don't understand why they want those names but maybe we don't have to understand right now UNISOM. They're like maybe it's not for us understand right now maybe use the name out of respect and then you'll get it. It has to get the thing. Maybe he is my for you to get it right now. It's not as much as being a walled of experienced their life. Yeah you're going to and you cannot have been there for all of that experience and that's okay so K.. Does it inconvenient you that much to us really wok. Yeah can you just try to say it and then you know what I mean going with your life be fine on but you know what actually actually actually in fact the phlebitis is maybe won't be fine because maybe your power who is dependent on your identity is dependent on the power to name. I always think about not to get too default field but like I think about how like folks who would have hose marriage equality. They would say well if we pass this measure the Supreme Court does Xyz Wazi. It changes the definition of marriage. And they weren't wrong. Who in the sense that marriage to them means the right to exclude people right like some people like when they say you know marriage is between a man and woman what they're saying is part of how I define my institutions keeping you out you understand and so in some sense? There's some people won't be okay because I hope I was based on excluding people else's neck. Yeah for how is your family. Handled your success breath as a writer. I don't know I don't know I think it's really weird is really with. I'm I I think I would go out on a limb and say on the person who has the most trouble I think so I think so. I mean we'll know more in about ten years but I think look at. There are no on alloy goods in life. You know there is no thing in which you know you get what you want and then you have no problems at all and everything like life can't be strawberry shortcake. It's not like it's not Alexa ever so I doubt way more than I could have wanted. That's very very clear the same time you know you have to this. I did this thing Seattle. I can't believe Mattel. So did this thing Seattle right era and my wife. She's here for this but she usually doesn't come travel with me. She won't come to them. Which is fine? You know. It's okay and then we go hang on. See Me Talk Enough. who come back? Pick up at the hotel we go. We're GONNA have dinner chill out certain Nice restaurants in back to you you and he comes over and he's a fan right and he's really any talks but not because he knew people in common and it's like ten thirty I I just WANNA spend any new and my wife. He's just went on and on on on on and when the one level I'm like cancer. Get the head right on other level. I have to be real about say. Listen you wanted people to love what you did what you wanted. You know what I mean. This is this is what you want it. You don't get one and not getting what he hasn't been here. Yeah like there's no world in which you get everything you got. Yeah and then someone is not so moved by that they stand there and talk like yes they are genuinely moving. And that's not what I said. In the moment after he left upon reflection of Sir difficult challenges that is you gotta take a second yeah. I really didn't win. You got to be clear you another me I want you know and not get into that place where you know what I mean. You don't have clarity around the fact that all of this is beautiful as it is could disappear appear and you have to remember that. That's probably the hardest. Thank you thank. You came out the hoc- coats from a literary Arts Special Event in October. Two Thousand Nineteen this has been literary arts the Archive Project. It's a retrospective of some of the most engaging talks from the world's best writers for more than thirty five years obliterate arts and Portland. Join US next time for the archive project a literary arts production in collaboration with Oregon public broadcasting to hear more from the archive project. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts support for the archive project is provided provided by Cole. Haan on a mission to fuel your big ideas more on Cole. Haan Dot Com. Our show is produced by crystal gory for radio and podcast special special. Thanks to the Literary Arts Staff Board and community the show would not be possible without them. Thanks also to the band emancipator for our theme music and thanks to all of you for listening doc. I'm Andrew Procter and this has been another edition of the archive project from Literary Arts. Join US next time and find your story here