2 Burst results for "Owen John Owen"
"owen john owen" Discussed on Christian Podcast Community
"For. He takes away from God's essence or attributes and still thinks he believes in God because he has left him his name and titles does just as bad as those who set up an image and worship that instead of God every episode. We bring you a different voice from history and a sermon that they delivered. Today's sermon was preached by Richard. Baxter we're going back to the sixteen hundreds in England. Joel we talk a lot on this show about people who there's just not enough time to cover their entire life and Richard Baxter is definitely one of these people. I wasn't expecting him to be. I guess I hadn't really heard a lot of who he was and so I just assumed he'd have a couple of bullet points and it would be you know quick and easy to talk about him but he's not and he's actually a very hard to describe guy and what I mean by that is. I don't really know usually you can say Charles. Spurgeon was a passionate preacher Dietrich. Bond hoffer fearless. But I don't really know how what were you could attach to Baxter. He for example he wrote over two hundred books. Devotional 's he wrote a bunch of articles but he never really aspired to be more than just a pastor to people out in the field very very small church in a pretty small town. He was comfortable right there. Yeah he got involved in. Some of the biggest controversies very divisive. Time to be alive but he himself. He believed he was a peacemaker. But I'll let you listen to this episode and decide if you think he's a peacemaker. Yeah like what you said about him. Just wanting to be a pastor like that's that's something that I saw several points in his life. Where like the dude? He's just chill like he doesn't have. He doesn't have a huge agenda. He just wants to minister to the people but it was funny. Like people in you'll see people offer him something he'll go. I know I don't want that and the later. I really regret not doing that. Why didn't you do it? Strangely relate with that so in this sermon. We're going to listen to. He talks about the nine oneself. And I think you can kind of see it play out. Sheriff Shirt Yeah Richard Baxter like I said mid sixteen hundreds he was born in sixteen. Fifteen would die in sixteen ninety one in Oregon in England. He spent most of his life in England. He comes from a pretty poor family not a lot of money. He was pretty poor growing up in. He didn't get a great education until he was able to get into a school run by John. Owen John Owen. Who He's famous Puritan and we actually have an episode on him in the works that we're excited for. But he helped get baxter going. He'll get baxter a great education and got him real interested in things of theology when Richard. Baxter came to the end of his education with John John in school He's looking for places to further his education and John Owen told Baxter that he shouldn't go to Oxford and I'm not entirely sure why kind of get the idea that maybe John didn't think he was quite cut out for Oxford. But due to that advice heat he didn't go to Oxford. He continued to further his education through other means but he always in retrospect looks back at his life and kind of really regrets not going to Oxford. Yeah Joe that's one of those regrets. We mentioned earlier. We I was GonNa do this and then I didn't and now I wish I had kind of a lot of his story in the Sixteen Forty S. The English civil war broke out. And I'm going to just stop giant Astra's Cure Joel and I from America and I think I speak for both Joel myself when I say that if you couldn't tell by accents but I think it would be for both of us when I say don't understand the single English civil war. It's confusing a lot of our speakers. Come from this era around the English lower and we've dived into portions of time but it is still a very confusing for us in the twenty first century in America. I know I've even watched youtube videos. Like we'll explain the English civil one five minutes or less than you watch it and I still don't know what happened so at some point we're going to do some better research so we explain this to you better but the main point being the war broke out. And he Richard Baxter was like I condemn both sides. I don't like either. The two sides fighting which made both sides hate him even worse than being on one side was being against both of them so they basically kicked out of church and told them to set up shop in a different town. He ends up. Having a mini famous ministers. Spend time in the new church that he starts out It was considered a safe place for fugitives. One particularly famous man was John Bunyan and we did a sermon on him. A few episodes back and very famous guy at the time. He would actually see several battles. He would be a chaplain to the soldiers. During that time he was asked by Oliver Cromwell and I do not know much about it but I know he was one of the big dog so that civil war to get position but Richard Baxter rejected. It said I don't want to do that so eventually. He was brought to London to settle the quote fundamentals of religion in quote in London. But I don't know that they ever did to get sick in the middle this. He goes back home to his home church. And that's when he ends up writing one of his most famous books saints. Everlasting THE SAINTS. Everlasting rest and this being one of the most read books in the sixteen hundreds and that's during a time when people are reading a lot of books yet. Richard Baxter is also one of these guys that he got in a lot of debates. GotTa a lot of arguments but arguments all of the time to and tell me if you know somebody like this. You know someone who I would describe Richard Baxter. Someone who's sensitive to their conscious takes takes their conscious seriously and rarely thinks that other people are doing things the way they really should be doing or for the right reasons right and he makes that now so he's he's always kind of calling out people saying. I don't think you're doing this reasons or I don't think this is the way that that should be happening in. It leads to a lot of conversations and debates and I definitely know at least one or two guys in my in my life that totally meet that description. There's there's there's one story about Richard Baxter where he was having a debate with a guy about baptism in the ideas of that day around baptism and Dane gauged in this debate and the debate lasted from nine. Am to five PM and there ended up being three thousand people that came on looking like look really invested in this conversation. These two people were having and so much so that the sheriffs had to come and get involved to settle down the crowds because the crowds were getting so into it. And we're getting so lively that the type of person that Richard Baxter was. He's the type of person whose whose opinions are so interesting to listen to that. It can get three thousand people riled up all of a sudden right and not necessarily you know he's he's not coming at people with anger swinging hammers. This guy that he was having this debate with years down the road they'll kind of collaborate on some pamphlets and stuff like that work together a little bit and kind of endorse each other's work so it's it's kind of neat to see his interaction with the people that he doesn't always agree with a lot of time. Something else and you have to understand about Baxter. The the way he lived his life his style of church leadership and pastoral work would end up being honestly the blueprint for the way churches and pastors would run from that point on he. Kinda put out a lot of the ideas and people would go back. And let's do it like Baxter. Did it and one thing that he felt very strongly about was home visits. He thought this was just an incredibly neglected part of ministry. He said that he felt half an hour of just one on one time with a person or family would do more good for that person's spiritual walk than ten years preaching behind the pulpit would do for them. History was in a rural part of the country completely. They ended up completely. Outgrowing the church to keep renovating or remodeling to make more room for the attendance. When he when he got to that town it was a town of eight hundred families and just a couple. Maybe maybe just a couple of. We're going part time. When he ended up leaving there were six hundred full-time attendees and he had this weird line is kind of a classic Baxter. Almost we're at the end of it. He goes six hundred people. Come but I I would be surprised if even twelve of them were really sincere in their faith and it's just it's such an interesting just outlook on things. He's he's unique and the English civil war. You know we. We've talked about the English of were a little bit in the trail. We know that he again didn't aside with either side And it was kind of this turning point in his ministry where You get known for something one way or another right in after the war he really wanted to get people back together. You saw this devastation. That the war had caused in the disunity. And that's a big deal for him as this this unity being broken over the war so he wanted to bring people back together and he got pretty well known for it in was doing an Ra job at the Church of England asked him to become a bishop but he refused and that then made a lot of people really angry and he ended up getting his preaching license as it wasn't really a license but basically he was told can't preach anymore right if you had a preacher's license imagine that you're reaching license in air quotes. Yeah he just ended up on the on the wrong side of law enforcement. He ended up on the wrong side of of people in power and so he was getting shut down at events longtime in again he he turned on the bishop because he wanted to. Just keep preaching the way he wanted down preaching to the people who wanted to reach the small church and he wanted to kind of keep going where he thought God was using them. I guess you know people say we have bigger plans for you. And when he said No. Yeah people didn't like that and so now he's getting fined for you know miscellaneous stuff. His events are getting shut down by the authorities. There's a few different occasions where his books would be confiscated and he just took all of this kind of ran with it in stride when he preached. He said that he never felt sure if he would be able to preach again and he said he tried to preach every sermon as if it was his last and I love this quote here where he says that he like he was a dying man giving truth to dying man right so if at any moment like he's he's ready to leave this world he's he's just doing what he feels called the do in the time that he has left to help other people that are coming towards the end of their time. They have left right. This episode is brought to you by Liberty healthshare my name is matthew. Belus I'm with liberty healthshare. Liberty healthshare is a five zero one. C Three nonprofit healthcare sharing ministry a long way to say that we're a group of individuals who have gathered together voluntarily over a common set of L. Principles that share medical bills of one another. We do that without the assistance of any third party insurance or program. Healthcare sharing and liberty healthshare is not sure so people here that they say will. What do you do about largest and frankly? That's what we excel at and Christians use this as a way to express themselves in the realm of healthcare. So it's a way to really fulfill the law price to do as we are commended. The vital to share and mayor one another revert to learn more about liberty healthshare liberty healthshare dot org or call eight five five five eight five four two three seven. That's eight five five five eight five four two three seven.
"owen john owen" Discussed on Christian Podcast Community
"Back. And so had an hour drive, right? After that group. And I was like what do you mean? You want to be saved? Well, I wanna know I wanna know about this Jesus thing. And so I said, I tell you what let's meet this Saturday at my martial arts school. We're going to we're going to you. You will do a private lesson. Staves? A he loves me saying this one of the best night fighters in the world, and he fights lots of nights. But anyway, we did a private lesson and brought in book after book after book, and here's one of the things I believe about the elect is that they're going to get saved as Lilly. They're not one we'll movie, and so I said, look if I can talk him out of wanting to be saved, then he's not one of the land. So I mean, you're talking about Steve I mean, he was into the wicked stuff as well. He wouldn't he was he around. Well, his mother, you know, he's got an incredible testimony at one day. I hope you get him on here. So people can hear what an amazing testimony. I've got drive down about an hour and twenty minutes, but I will. But anyway, my goal was talking about of out of being saved in lotta people. You do what? Yeah. I could. I could we could set a magical prayer, you know, and and and he'd be saved. No, I gave him a bunch of books, and I said look man Christianity's difficult. Yeah. You gotta take you crawl. I mean Christianity is hard. Is this really something you won't? Yeah. And if he wanted it was only because God wanted him to have it. Right. And so we took him, you know, I took him these books. He studied his books, and you know, I won't give away his entire testimony. But you know, he's he's he was radically saved in and in Calvinism was easy for him. Yeah. It was easy for me. You know, I'm fighting it. Yeah. Well, I fought it. But you know, my hangup was like you said it between the unconditional election. Limited atonement limited. It's home at once that once the unconditional election Clint with me it was easy. My hangup was with unconditional election, and the why why would God predestined me not this person? Why why would God I'm still wondering why predestined you do everyday? But look the bible each is. Either is I guess, I don't know. If there's a third option is limited homeowners universal. I think either war. I don't think it can't be both. Well, the the Lutherans actually I had a guy on there comment on there saying that it's neither is either hasn't either. And I really don't wanna get into that. Well, there's not one I guess that's the third option. There's not one I think they're the Latin is thirty quid. But then to make it sound smart in my paper dig enable by the way, and the professor is four point Calvinism on. The bible cannot maintain both of us at the same time. And in the same sense, right? It just can't violate the law of contradiction. But we're not applying logical here. You know, that's one of the big the big attacks against Calvinism. It's a logical system. Not a biblical one and logical. Right. Well, look, it's not like the alot Jains didn't study the bible, and then come up with their theology. Right. That that's that's came up with their theology. And then studied the bible now that would be incredibly difficult, incredibly difficult. You know, I guess if you were pagan and then studied the bible, you you could read your paganism in the bible. Look, I got a friend who believes that the bible teaches God is love, and that's an issue. And that's an issue. Automaker more. So flood is not like, we're only applying logic. We're we're plying her new principal. Right. And we are logically implying Herman principles description and our interpretation. Scripture. I believe to be true in regards to the atonement. Right. And it really seems like a big theme of this us in light of the verses that we went over that speak of the limited Tomo the definite home at particular, redemption of God's let verses the verses that are that are seemingly speaking of universal Tolman is that really the theme behind this is that you really have to let scripture interpret scripture, John Packer. He argues that Armenians only maintained that they could not have gained their salvation without calorie while the communists maintains that Christ security gain their salvation account the bible declares of the cross of Christ. Actually purchase allegation. I grant the claire's we were bolt with the price. What was the price? His atonement Armenians only believed the Christ made salvation possible for all men not guaranteeing it for anyone. How about this? I'm going to. I'm going to argue Armenians limit the atonement not the columnist agree with that when Calvin Calvin she used the term limited. They don't mean that the atonement is limited in the power to save. What they do. They believe that the power price death is unlimited in the Thomann is infinite in its value. They do not believe that though. It was unlimited in scope, but limited and inefficacy Christ intended to save only a certain number not the entire human race right and that flows into while we prefer the terms definite of Armenians Armenians leave Ghada fail. Your did. He not if he attended to save everyone, and he did not say them than God is a failure. Yeah. And you know, we we talked about this a little bit last week. We didn't get into as much detail as I wanted to. But whenever it comes to God's election is that typically argument made Ford is at God. Let down the corridors time. He'll ended those that he elected those who he foreseen would have faith. Here's the thing though. Is that if you're applying a universal, it's home, it is this is very very inconsistent is that you have Christ dying on the cross for people. He foreseen would never come to faith in the first place that he's still trying to save them to this day. Here's when I start playing mind games like the like the Armenians. And I asked him the question. I said, okay. So when he looks down the corridor time and sees those who place faith in him, those are the ones. Okay. So are there anyone else going to be saved? And he already knows are going to be saved. No, he can't overcome their free will get. But how about how about this one this? I'll my I'll mess with their minds a little bit more said look is it possible that the only children that God ever. Let's be born or those that he would know would freely. Choose him. There there. Yeah. There are many children. There are many children who are never born. Why not let those be the ones who would not freely. Choose them. And then nobody would go to hell, right. If that's God's intent is not to let any perish. Then why the world if in of course, we got to know that Armenians all all Armenians without exception. I believe believe that all babies go to heaven. Yeah. Right. So why not if we're if we're we're talking about an all loving if God's loving and not anyone pairs why not the babies that die. Those are the ones that he allowed the dive the ones that weren't going to choose and let everyone who was born be the ones who choose him. But then God, oh, we'll God can't control that. Yeah. That's what I was saying last week is that it really makes got out to be an incredibly weak being not worthy. He's a net. He's a net. He's he's he's not all powerful. All knowing look down the corridors time to see what he had to figure. Out you know, you had to figure it out and the amount of by the way that argument is used by by everyone who starts moving into open, the the ISM, and we talked about that last week open theism, God doesn't know the future. The future is completely open, which is heretical. Look, here's the I wanna I wanna I'll finish up with with Owen, John Owen. If you if you really wanna read the the greatest Calvin est book, I believe a written only atonement the death of death in the death of Christ by John it'll make your eyes bleed bet. It will. I mean, I it'll make your eyes bleed. I mean, Owen is a brilliant brilliant brea man, but it is the definitive book. And that that was the one of the books that really hit home with me in regards to the atonement. And of course, Jon, you know, no matter what you think about John Stott cross of Christ. The name name of his book. Also, the deals with the Tolman very communistic book, but Jonah wins book, really? And I'm going to use one of his arguments that use all my professors. In seminary in its stumbled. So here's John knowing Christ in is office of high priest fulfill the duty in praying for the legged and performing the officer priest by making told for the elect John Owens argues that the sacrifice into intercede belong to the same office into the same person the ransom, which the priest made is no larger than the office of the profit prison king. But these offices only applied to those who believe his church and