8 Episode results for "Oak Grove Cemetery"
Episode 15: Memory Lane
"Welcome to geocaching ventures with me shadow dragon. One where. I discussed geocaching in my adventures with it everybody. I'd like to make a few announcements before we start the podcast today. First of all you may notice that the format of podcast is a little different this week in an attempt to bring you improved. Contents and better the podcast. I'm gonna try to change from a scripted podcast to bit more. Casual conversation podcast. Let me know what you think about the new formats. You can contact me at geocaching dot adventures dot podcast at gmail.com. And let me know what you think. Also geocaching adventures. Now has merchandise available. You can go to geocaching adventures dot org in go to the store. Page to find the link to that. And also i'm excited to announce that we will be bringing interviews coming up in the next couple of podcast. I've reached out to a couple of cashiers lined up a couple of interviews. That i'm really excited about and i hope that you will enjoy them when they're so today we're gonna talk about a mini game called memory lane. That's taking place within the geocaching game right now. It is one of the ways that geocaching dot com has come up with to celebrate the twentieth year of geocaching. And its history to learn more about geocaching history. You can listen back to episode three history of geocaching. The many game launched on june first of twenty twenty and we'll be running through january third of twenty twenty one so if you haven't reached the end of memory lane yet there is still time memory lane consists of a digital gameboard with digital gain peace for each geo. Casher you will only be able to see your gameboard and your game piece. You won't see any other jio. Cashiers gain peace will move automatically along the board as you earn points certain locations on the board earn new special souvenirs. The first souvenir is at ten points. Another fifty one hundred hundred and fifty and two hundred. Each souvenir represents a part of geocaching. History you can view the souvenirs under your geocaching profile on either the app or the website so the ten point souvenir which is the first one that you can earn is to celebrate the very first cash that was hidden. That cash was hidden in beaver creek. Oregon in may twenty twenty again. You can learn more about the history of geocaching by listening back to episode. Three of the podcast. The fifty point souvenir is an honor of the very first gio coin which was created by mountain bike on september. Thirty two thousand one. He kept the first one he created for his collection and placed second one he created in a cash near deception. Pass washington d. One hundred point souvenir celebrates the first mega event which took place on may twenty seven. Two thousand six. It was held in dallas texas. It was a week in long geocaching festival. It had just over five hundred cashiers present which in today's pandemic world is a little hard to imagine. The hundred and fifty point souvenir celebrates the first million geocaches hidden. The one million mark was hit on march eighth of two thousand and ten just shy of ten years. After the initial launch of geocaching. We now have three million geocaches worldwide. So that number of cashes tripled in the second ten years geocaching which is pretty cool. The two hundred point souvenir celebrates the twenty year history of geocaching. This is the final souvenir of the game. And when you hit this spot on the board you've completed the memory lane mini game to participate in the mini game is simple. You automatically start playing the game whenever you find a jio cash during the during the time that the mini game is taking place as mentioned before the points are automatically scored and the game pieces automatically moved across the board but not all caches. Get you equal points. Different caches will earn you different points just finding a cash get you five points any cash get you five points including adventure labs they will earn you five points if you find a multi cash or mystery cash that earns you seven points if you find a cash that has ten plus favourite points. That cash is worth ten points however the points do not stack up. So if you find a multi cash that has say twelve favorite points. You earn ten points. only you. Don't earn the multi cashpoints plus the favorite points. It's just the max number of points available for the cash that gets awarded to you. You can track your progress in two ways. The first one is by the memory lane. Gameboard link on geocaching dot com and huddling to that and shell notes. The other is in the geocaching app if you profile page towards the bottom. There's a button there too long. The memory laying progress. It'll show your game board and wear. Your piece is a long it. I finished my memory laying inboard. And i really enjoyed playing it. I really like these. Little mini games within geocaching. It just adds a little extra fun element to it. I hope you guys enjoy playing memory lane in if you haven't completed yet i hope you are able to get out there and do it soon warning. This part of the show contains spoilers for cash that is about to be discussed so for the cash. Highlights this one is called history not to be forgotten cash. D g c. Five m k h four difficulty rating to terrain rating. To and i will read the description. You are about to discover a piece of history that is not be forgotten until very recently. I was not aware of its presence. I stumbled upon an old book of the growth of my hometown. Saint charles missouri. In this book. I discovered many wonderful things. I hope in your hunt. You will appreciate those that gave their all for moderation. You'll be looking for small magnetic container in a very sacred place. Please show respect to your surroundings and only hunt between the posted hours of one hour before sunrise and one hour after sunset you will be paying honor to a few good men who gave their all in an accident that took their lives just so that the city would be expanded in grow to the special place we hold dear. You will read their names in the cause of the strategy. If you look around you will see that they are lay to rest nearby and that is the reason not forget. Enjoy this quick parking. Grab if you have time to run into the supervisor groundkeeper mark h he will enjoy telling you all about the wonderful history of the park placed with permission. There was no hint provided for this one. I was out geocaching. And i went to oak grove cemetery because i had solved a mystery cash a couple months prior that was located there and i wanted to rabbit in the surrounding cashes in the area a started at this cash. I because it was the closest one to the parking lot. So when i got there followed the coordinates to ground zero. I was surprised to come across this monument. There i lived in saint charles growing up spent most of my adult life here and had no idea this monument was there. The monument was placed in memory of eighteen bridge workers who were killed during an accident. During the construction of the bridge when a cable was being used to lift one of the pillars snapped and they were crushed pretty tragic accident. This bridge was called wabash bridge. The construction of the bridge started in august of eighteen. Sixty eight the accident took place in eighteen. Seventy two years after the start of the construction construction was completed a year later in may of eighteen. Seventy one this was the first bridge to span the missouri river. The bridge saw other catastrophes. It's actually has kind of a tragic history. So portion of the bridge collapsed in eighteen. Seventy nine while the train was crossing over it which caused eighteen train cars to fall into the river and five more deaths came from that there was another accident in eighteen. Eighty one where there was another collapse of the bridge. Where thirty one. Cattle cars fell into the river and resulted in the death of engineer. John kirby there was another accident in eighteen. Eighty four when the steamboat montana actually collided with one of the bridge pillars. I did not see any reports of loss of life for this accident. Thankfully but the bridge had a pretty tragic history. It was very interesting to learn about this bridge. And its history. It really kind of made me think about how fragile life is and how quickly it can all. Just be taken away from you. It almost felt disrespectful to start looking around it to find cash after learning about all this tragedy that this monument was dedicated to but at the same time i thought about the whole reason the cash was placed with so that people would learn about this and not forget about the tragedies so after taking a moment i started looking around the monuments. The bottom half of the monument has sort of a boxing to its. I will have pictures of the monument in the show notes. If you're interested in looking at it as well as a link to the bridges history and to the montana that crashed into it. I peeked in there and found the cash. It was a magnetic. He box magnetic highway key box that was tucked in there. So the find didn't take terribly long. Wants to start looking for so i took out the magnetic key box signed logging replaced it and went on my way. It was really neat to get to find this moment. That's one of the things. I really love about geocaching is the places that can take you to places especially in your hometown that you may not have had any idea that they were there this whole time. You've been listening to geocaching adventures with me. Shadow dragon. One is their topic. You'd like to hear covered. Do you have geocaching adventure. You'd like to share for the cash highlight. Are you interested in being a guest on the podcast. Whatever you have to say please. Don't hesitate to reach out and email me at geocaching. Cash dot adventures dot. Podcast at gmail.com. A reach outs me at the contact page on the website at geocaching adventures dot. Org thank you for listening
Lizzie Borden pt. 2
"This is dan done the host of what we're drinking with dan done on the latest episode we can get deep dive into america's native spirit bourbon with my very special guest tiffany thesis that's right got the throwback whiskey we kelly hausky and it turned out to be everything. Young me could have possibly dreamed of and more. Did you see see some of my alcohol is actually getting a little low and you do have some bottles that are saying let down into my dressing room. I don't let a lot of men in my dressing. This is where i do all my podcasts dressing all completely innocent. I swear also in the latest episode details on how to win a pair of passes to the bourbon beyond mm festival in kentucky next month featuring foo fighters robert plant hall notes joan jett john fogerty and lots of other old people plus. I'll be there with tiffany tiffany thiessen for real. Come drink with us so check out what we're drinking. I'm dan dan reminding you. That drinking can cause memory loss or even worse memory loss. Welcome to murder minute today. The story of lizzie bordon continues what i your true crime headlines a self-described white nationalist nationalist is behind bars facing charges of aggravated menacing and telephone communication harassment after a video he posted on instagram caught the the attention of police twenty year old james patrick reardon of youngstown ohio uploaded a video to his instagram account on july eleventh. The video shows reardon shooting a gun into the darkness with the sounds of screams and sirens wailing in the background. The video was captioned optioned. Police identified the youngstown jewish family community shooter as local white nationalist shameless overburden and the geo location for the video was set to the jewish community center of youngstown ohio. The attack depicted in the video never happened but police took the threat seriously and arrested reared in last week the day before his arrest authorities searched the home of reardon parents where they seized weapons bulletproof armor and communication reared participated in the twenty seventeen unite the right rally in charlottesville he was interviewed at the rally as part of a national national geographic documentary that was being filmed in the documentary a then eighteen year old reardon speaks about his desire for a homeland homeland for white people he describes himself in the documentary as a white nationalist and a member of the alright reardon has pled not not guilty to the charges against him and is being held on two hundred fifty thousand dollars bail a texas man was arrested after he allowed his twelve year old daughter to drive an s._u._v. around an apartment parking lot and she crashed the vehicle striking and killing a man dan who was out walking his dogs police say that forty two year old thomas makiya toll allowed his twelve year old daughter to drive the black ford explorer around around the apartment complex. She was pulling out of a parking space when she pressed the accelerator and struck forty six year old and rica vasquez who was walking his dogs the car struck vasquez and one of his dogs and pinned the man to a tree he and the dog both died of their injuries initially mahia told police that he had been behind the wheel at the time of the accident but authorities later found out that his daughter daughter had been the one driving mahia was charged with child endangerment and criminal negligent homicide. Those are your true crime headlines up next part two of lizzie borden but first a quick break birthdays anniversaries holidays. These are the dates that most people mark on their calendar under the podcast network marks important dates and true crime history with their new podcast today in true crime today in true crime the daily podcast the takes you back date by date to the biggest events and true crime history with the crime is infamous or just plain interesting. There's a crime story for every day of the year august thirty first eighteen eighty eighty eight jack. The ripper commits his first murder october third nineteen ninety-five o._j. Simpson is acquitted november nineteenth. Twenty seventeen cult leader charles manson dies today in true crime his podcast first daily true crime podcast. Get your fix with new episodes each day. You'll never run out of troon crime again. Crime never takes a day off and now neither does podcast follow today in true crime for free on. I tunes spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. Welcome back to murder minute today. The trial of lizzie borden on on august eleventh eighteen ninety two lizzie borden was arrested for the murders of her father andrew gordon and her stepmother abby borden lizzy borden pleaded not guilty at her preliminary inari hearing judged zayas glaisdale pronounced lizzie bordon probably guilty and ordered her to face a grand jury support for lizzie bordon poured in from around the country in the victorian era. Most people could not imagine that a lady of her standing would ever be capable of committing such brutal crime women's groups took lizzy calls arguing that they should allow women to jurors so that lizzie could be tried by a jury of her peers in november. A grand jury met to review the evidence against lizzie bordin among the evidence was testimony from family friend alice russell who stated that she and lizzie sister emma had witnessed witnessed lizzie bordon burning her blue corduroy dress in the kitchen fire. Just a few days after the murders because as lizzie claimed the dress was covered with old paint lizzie borden was indicted and jailed and held without bail awaiting her trial aw on june fifth 1893 almost a year after the murders the hotly anticipated trial of lizzie borden finally began dan at the bristol county courthouse in new bedford massachusetts. It was just eleven o'clock when a closed carriage drew up at at the rear of the courthouse a deputy sheriff stepped out of it and handed out his hand to assist lizzie bordon of reporter from the brownsville daily herald observed served the crowd pressed forward and a sort of frenzy to catch a glimpse of the woman but she slipped quietly into the building before they were able to do so and walked quietly to her place in the prisoner's dock. Lizzie bordon entered the packed courthouse on the arm of her minister reverend augustus buck lizzy was dressed as her attorneys advised in fashionable mourning attire and held a fan obscuring her face with her inheritance lizzie borden bought the best defense that money could buy they were melvin even adams her father's attorney andrew jennings and the head of defense former massachusetts governor george robinson among the three judges presiding at lizzie borden's trial was justice dewey who had been appointed to the bench seven years earlier by george robinson liz's defense attorney prosecuting attorneys were district attorney knowlton and future attorney attorney general and supreme court justice william h moody moody opened the state's case at one point during moody's to our speech either carelessly or deliberately he threw one of liz rocks on the prosecution table and knocked over a bag revealing the skulls of andrew and abby borden the bodies had been exumed and the skin boiled off so as to compare the hatchet found in the basement against the marks and the victims skulls at the site of her father and stepmother skulls lizzy collapsed collapsed into a dramatic faint the hatchet the defense argued was too dull to have been the weapon used in the murders. The doctors who examined the bodies of mr and mrs gordon said that the hatchet head could not have sliced so cleanly through mr and mrs bordon's ends hair was cut through as if by scissors the prosecution focused its case on lucy's inheritance as a motive her animosity toward her stepmother abby her presence at the house at the time of the murders and the lack of any other plausible suspect but the prosecution's case suffered a devastating blow when lucy's defense team successfully had her contradictory testimony at the inquest ruled inadmissible on the grounds that she was never advised of her fifth amendment rights and was high on morphine additionally the state wanted to have the druggist recount for the jury his story of wind lizzie borden visited his drug store store the day before the murders attempting to purchase the poison prospect acid his witness testimony was also thrown out it it was ruled too remote in time and irrelevant to the axe murderers as autopsies of the victims stomachs had shown that they were not in fact poisoned despite the family's fears during their few days of illness prior to the murder the state called it's witnesses on june seventh former made bridget sullivan took the stand during her testimony she stated losey was the only person she saw in the home. At the time of her parents murders that she wore a blue dress and that she heard lizzie. Tell her father father that her mother had received a note and gone out though bridget herself had never seen the note bridget also stated that lizzie does he and emma rarely shared meals with their father and stepmother though she insisted that she had never witnessed during her over two years of service to the family lake any signs of the rumored contemptuous relationship between lizzie and her stepmother she always spoke to mrs board and when mrs born talked with her bridget. It said i did not see any trouble with the family. A seamstress who made a garment for lizzie a few months before the murders disputed british claim she recounted a conversation in which lizzie called her stepmother quote a mean good for nothing thing and said. I don't have much to do with her. I stay in my room. Most of the time the most compelling testimony came on june eighth from family friend alice russell. Alice ellis described a visit from lizzy the night before the murders. I think when she came in she said i have taken your advice and i have written to marian that i would come. I don't know what came in between i don't know as is followed that but i said i'm glad you're going as i had urged her to go before and i don't know just what followed but i said something about her having a good time and she said well i don't no no i feel depressed i feel as if something was hanging over me that i cannot throw off and it comes over me at times no matter where i am and she said when i was at the table the other day when i was at marian the girls were laughing and talking having a good time and this feeling came over me and one of them spoke and said lizzy. Why don't you talk. I don't know father has so much trouble district attorney moody asked alice about the blue corduroy dress burning incident alice said i stayed at the house from the day of the murders 'til monday morning. I was there thursday friday saturday and sunday nights on sunday morning. I got the breakfast after breakfast. I left the lower part of the house for a while. Returning the forenoon i went into the kitchen and i saw miss lizzie at the other end of the stove. I saw miss emma at the sink. Miss lizzie was at the stove and she had a skirt in her hand and her sister turned said. What are you going to do and lizzy said. I'm going to burn this thing up. It's covered with paint. I said to her. I wouldn't let anyone see me do that lizzie. She didn't make any answer. I said to them. I said i am afraid afraid lizzy. The worst thing you could have done was to burn that dress. I've been asked about your dresses and she said oh what made you let me do it. Why didn't you tell me on cross examination defense attorney george robinson suggested let a guilty person seeking talking to destroy evidence would be unlikely to do it and so open fashion alice added. I saw no blood on that dress. Not a drop up. The edge of the dress was soiled. Alice also recounted a conversation with lizzie about the alleged note which according to lizzie he arrived for mrs board in the morning of the murders summoning her to visit a sick friend. Despite a thorough search of the board and home the the note was never found. Alice said that she sarcastically suggested that her stepmother must have put it in the fire. Lizzy replied side. Yes she must have on june sixteenth. The defense called its most anticipated a paid witness emma borden. Emma testified that her sister lizzie owned eight blue dresses. The bedford cord dress was made the first week of may at our home. It was a very cheap dress. Emma testified the painters began work after the dress was made. Lizzy got some paint on this dress within two weeks after it was made. She got the paint on the front breadth and the side. The dress was hanging in the front closet on the day that i came home. I said you haven't destroyed that address yet. Why don't you do so it was very dirty badly faded and i don't remember having seen her use it. For some time. The next i saw of that dress i was in the kitchen saturday saturday. When i heard my sister voice i looked and saw her with the dress on her arm. She said i'm going to burn this old dress. I said i would and turned away. Miss alice russell was there at the time and said that she told mister hence kim a falsehood also hood. She said he asked her. If all the dresses were in the house that were there at the time of the murder and she said yes then it was decided between between us all that she go and tell mr handsome that she had told a falsehood. I have made an inventory of clothes in the closet on the afternoon. It was surged. I i was there when the search was going on. Emma told jurors that lizzie and their father enjoyed a loving relationship. My father wore ring on his finger. She said it was given him by lizzie. She warned herself before and he constantly wore it after and it was buried with him emo also insisted that relations between lizzie and her stepmother were cordial even though she she herself admitted to lingering resentment over the transfer by her father of fall river home to abby and her sister there has never been in a trial so full of surprises wrote one reporter covering the trial with such marvelous contradictions given by witnesses called for a common purpose. The defense poked holes in the prosecution's time line which allowed from eight to thirteen minutes between andrew borden's murder and lizzie is call upstairs to bridget sullivan robinson pointed out the obvious difficulty of washing blood off one's person clothes and murder weapon and then hiding the murder weapon all within the span of just a few short minutes at one point. The prosecution suggested that lizzie had perhaps committed the crime naked to avoid being covered by blood splatter. How how could she have avoided the splattering of address with blood. If she was the author of these crimes i cannot answer it. You cannot answer it. You are neither murderer's nor women you have either the craft of the assassin nor the cunning deftness of the sex the prosecution seclusion rested its case on june fourteenth 1893 busy board and never took the stand in her case simply stating i am innocent. I leave it to my counsel to speak for me. In his closing remarks for the defense jennings said said there's not one particle of direct evidence in this case from beginning to end against lizzie bordon. There is not a spot of flood. There is not a weapon and that they have connected with her in any way shape or fashion governor robinson in his closing speech insisted that the crime must have been committed committed by a maniac or devil not by someone with the respectable background of his client he said that the state had failed to meet its burden of proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt and that it was physically impossible for lizzie to have committed the crime within the timelines suggested by the prosecution robinson ridiculed the theory that lizzie might have avoided getting blood on her clothes by killing her parents while stark naked and argued that the murders might well have simply been committed by an intruder before the jury left to deliberate justice do we. He spoke for the three judges. It was a virtual direction to acquit. I he reiterated the defense's point that the prosecutors scooters had relied on circumstantial evidence then in his final words to the jury before they left to deliberate justice. Dumi reminded them of their duty to lizzie. If the evidence falls short of providing such conviction in your minds although it may raise suspicion of guilt it would be your plane duty to return verdict of not guilty seeking only the truth you will lift this case above the range of of passion and prejudice and excited feeling into the atmosphere of reason and law the the jury of twelve men deliberated for just ninety minutes before returning a verdict of not guilty when the verdict of not guilty was returned a cheer went up which might have been heard half a mile away reported the boston advertiser miss burdens head went down upon the rail in front of her and the prisoner wept with joy emma her counsel and courtroom spectators rushed to congratulate lizzy upon exiting the courthouse lizzy told reporters that she was the happiest woman in the world. She was placed in a carriage and driven to the station where she and emma took the train home to fall river the following sunday. Lizzy did what she had always done. Before her imprisonment. She went to church but when she arrived lizzy found that all of the pews surrounding her families were empty one member of the congregation mrs divall hall remarked the whole town is aghast lizzie bordon attended church today. I don't know but if she did do it isn't church. It's the best place for her undeterred by the town's icy reception. Lizzy determined to remain in fall river. You're after a few months. The borden sisters sold the home on ninety. Two second street and lizzy finally got her house on the hill. Lizzy who now wish to be called lisbeth named her new house which was located on french street maple kroft the sisters now had a full staff that included living made a housekeeper and to coachman and lizzy spent her time traveling to boston and new york to indulge in her love of the theatre just five years after the murder lizzy he was briefly in the headlines again when she was accused of but not tied for shoplifting in nineteen eighteen o five after an argument over a party that lizzie had given in honor of actress. Nancy neil her sister. Emma moved out of maple. Oh kroft years later. Emma would save her departure the happenings at the french street house that caused me to leave. I i must refuse to talk about. I did not go until conditions became absolutely unbearable. I do not expect to ever set foot on the place while she lives some have speculated that lizzie was having a sexual relationship with the actress but there's little evidence to support this at the turn of the nineteenth century theatre people were looked down upon and actresses were seen as little better than prostitutes liz unconventional friendships with nance and others in the theater were seen as wildly inappropriate appropriate and liz parties at maple croft outraged. They're high society neighbors on the hill. Whatever the cause of their you're falling out. Emma had enough she left lizzy and fall river for good and the sisters never saw four spoke to each other again. Lizzie bordon never escaped the events of august fourth eighteen ninety two and was ostracized ostracized by fall river society for the rest of her life. Lizzie bordon died of pneumonia on june. First nineteen nineteen twenty seven aged sixty seven in fall river massachusetts. 'em defended her sister's innocence until her death jeff just nine days after lizzie borden died at age seventy seven from chronic nephritis in a nursing home in new hampshire where she had been living under an assumed name this stirs neither of whom were ever married were buried side by side in the borden family plot next to andrew in abbey in oak grove cemetery at the time of her the death lizzie bordon was worth over two hundred fifty thousand dollars almost five million today lizzie bordon who had had always loved animals lift thirty thousand dollars equivalent to roughly half a million dollars to the fall river animal rescue league and five hundred dollars ten thousand dollars today in a trust for perpetual care of her father's grave bridget. It's sullivan who left the bordon's employment. After the murders later married man she met while working as a maid in montana bridget died there in nineteen forty eight and according to her sister gave a deathbed confession stating that she had lied on the stand in order to protect lizzie bordon today the borden family home at ninety two second street now number a to thirty second street in fall river. Massachusetts is a popular tourist attraction and a bed and breakfast. The most requested did room is the guest bedroom where mrs borden was found murdered over a hundred years later despite her acquittal title lizzie bordon remains the prime suspect in her father and step mothers murders and children. All over america can still be found on the playground and skipping rope. Singing lizzie bordon took an ax gave. Her mother forty whacks when she saw what she eh done. She gave her father forty one. This has been murder minute for true crime anytime download the murder minute app or follow us on instagram at murder minute.
"Townies towns citing news to share with you is already started we are launching a members only version of love dumb people town I'll tell people town plus it's everything you already love about dumb people town with some special benefits to not only will be until her sentencing on December eighteenth a suitcase found in Colorado dumpster last week hundred dollar Gift Card what are you waiting for download Himalayas and subscribe to murder minute welcome to murder minute which vehicles she was passing was a school bus and that she did not realize that the flashing lights meant that she needed to stop by the time she realized the buses lights and stop arm she testified that she slowed down as soon as she saw the bus but watched as shepherds vehicle continued without slowing eighteen accident which claimed the lives of a nine year old girl and her six year old twin brothers a fourth child an eleven year old boy was seriously injured her error it was too late prosecutors told the jury that it was shepherds reckless action that caused the death of these children and highlighted her last on today's episode the murder of Helen Jewett what I your true crime headlines and seriously injured a fourth child twenty four year old Eliza Shepherd faces a maximum sentence of twenty one and a half years for the October Twenty Laya APP and subscribe to murder minute for ad free early episodes and killer bonus content our first five hundred subscribers will we enter to win a five nick contained to the body of an adult woman and now her son and his wife are in custody facing murder charges if you love the murder minute APP and the murder minute podcast we have good news for more true crime anytime download the him striking the children as they cross the road the families of the victims told reporters that they were satisfied with the verdict and frustrated with what they perceived doc an Indiana woman was found guilty of five felonies including reckless homicide for twenty eighteen crash that claimed the lives of three children have breaking as well as the testimony of another driver who was on the road that morning that driver testified that while the road was dark she could clearly see that hello shepherds struck the children with vehicle as they were crossing the road to board their school bus during her trial shepherd claimed that she did not realize that the law sealed the case file against Anthony citing the ongoing investigation into the Crime Act thirty-six-year-old Anthony us who is the son of the deceased woman Anthony Cuevas was arrested on suspicion of first degree murder and eight year old Maria Agnes Cuevas Garcia surveillance cameras from the location captured a man taking the suitcase out of his trunk and throwing it in as a lack of remorse shown by shepherd shepherd and her family quickly left the courthouse after the verdict was handed down she will remain free on bail just three weeks after she was released on Parole twenty-year-old Abdulah Sanchez was behind the wheel when she live streamed the fatal crash wife thirty-six-year-old Melanie Cuevas faces a possible charge of criminal impersonation a judge has to the dumpster then driving away police released the surveillance videos to the media and received numerous tips that led them to their suspect is granted parole in September of this year she had served two years and two months of her sentence last week Sanchez again crashed her car rush the claimed her sister's life in twenty seventeen for that accident she was convicted of driving under the influence and gross behavior man's a quick break do you experience stress or have anxiety water for which she received sentence of six years and four months in prison with time served and credit for good behavior. Sanchez this time after attempting to flee pursuing stockton police officers a man who was in the vehicle with Sanchez ran from the car and was able to escape but have trouble sleeping at least once a week you might after you listen to this podcast or maybe you suffer from chronic pain like I do Sanchez was arrested at the scene she was driving with a revoked driver's license and police found a loaded handgun in her vehicle she is being hangover no addiction and feels offers a free CD hotline and text message support to walk you through it join the field community have you thought about talking to someone but are unsure of where to start the best part is you'll have that sweet sweet satisfaction knowing you're supporting our show dumb people Tom Plus is available on our favorite podcast APP and it is my opinion held on three hundred thousand dollars bail and is now facing six new felony charges she will return to court in early November get all that extra stuff once you do it now yes our loyal listeners we love you townies his widow bump it up to the next level it's time to get better help better help makes it easy to connect with a licensed professional counselor caring profession that's better help dot com slash murder minute sent off your first order with free shipping that's F. E. A. L. S. dot com slash m feels has a better way to make you feel better feels premium. CBD Will Help You keep your head clear and feel your best police were called to the dumpster after report of a suspicious suitcase inside they found a body inside the large suitcase later identified as fifty just place a few drops of feels under your tongue and feel the difference in minutes. I've tried so many CD products but feels is really I get my I get all my podcast I love Himalayas all you have to do is download the Himalayas App that's h. m. a. l. a. y. a. in Search Ford today to get feels delivered to your door every month you'll save money on every order and you can pause canceled at any time feels has me handle the teenager was dismissed from her position and forced to leave home at age eighteen dork historian dumb people town then click become a member is just five dollars a month and you can join up and get those episodes early them at freak at extra content that's what we want you again and began working as a servant girl in the home of Chief Justice Nathan Weston of the Maine Supreme Judicial Court Agile secure video and phone sessions or text your therapist worldwide and you can start communicating in under twenty four hours it's a truly affordable awful intelligent and assertive young woman but at age seventeen after an affair with a banker turned into a ski welcome back to Murder Minute on today's episode the murder of Helen Jewett would it now go to better help dot com slash murder minute simply fill out the questionnaire and get matched with a counselor that you love moved first to Portland Maine then to Boston and finally in eighteen thirty one to New York City where she a northern California woman who killed her fourteen year old sister in a twenty seventeen car crash that she live streamed on instagram has been arrested again final specializing in the issues that you want to talk about join better help and get help at your own time and your own pace to work in what she called her boardinghouse a fashionable brothel located in what is now New York City's tried option and murder minute listeners get ten percent off your first month with Discount Code murder minute if you've been wanting to talk you can get stir again working as a prostitute under the name Helen Jewett and it wasn't long before Helen Jewett failing my best every day and it can help you to become a member today by going to feels dot com slash M. and you'll get fifty has noticed her beauty and intelligence set her apart and she was soon recruited by a woman named Rozina Townsend the best but if you're new to CBD don't worry feels works naturally to help you feel better there's no high no into a highly paid courtesan the same intelligence assertiveness and sexual boldness that had caused dorks doyen in her own made in. Helen's room hung a painting of her favourite poet Lord Byron in her clothes put hung expensive gowns in jewelry collection of theatrical sketches were pinned over her mantle a desk held her father was an alcoholic and her mother died when she was very young by the age of Thirteen Dork historian was orphaned Helen Jewett was born dorks doyen to a working class family in Temple Maine on October eighteenth eighteen thirteen she maintained a select clientele and solicited her patrons by engaging in a literary correspondence with many pens ink and high quality writing paper tubes of her tree and Helen had her own small library of books those are your true crime headlines up next the murder of Helen Jewett but I intimacy imaginary romance was what she sold for a living one of Helen's most free go to Himalayas search that Himalayas APP download it it's free listening all your podcast Himalayas then become a member people town at five dollars a month and so much trouble than main was now earning Helen Jewett a comfortable living add Rosanna she even hired inchoate author of the murder of Helen Jewett described how Helen's education and love for reading was put to use in her new role Justice Weston made sure that the girl received a good education while under his care and over the next four years Dork historian grew into a aca just a short jaunt from City Hall Rosina's Boarding House a three story federal style town quint callers was a young man aged only nineteen named Richard Robinson born in Connecticut in eighteen eighteen additions lawyers journalists and wealthy businessmen the opulent decorated townhouse was by all of her favourite Romantics as well as subscriptions to literary journals like the Knickerbocker Patricia the third tier was reserved for unescorted prostitutes sometimes theater managers gave third tier constitutes special discount rates or even free admission to attract males theatergoers the house located at forty one Thomas Street was home to nine young women who offered their companionship to politics you could come and go more discreetly described by one of her more frequent callers as one of the most young woman outside of one such discrete theater entrances the young man made short work of the thug splendidly dressed women that went to the third tier of the Theater Helen Jewett attended the theater several nights a week of them riding genteel letters of the motion and sometimes relatively frank sexual assertiveness she offered Shen was not illegal at the time the theaters still designated special entrances and staircases for the third tier prostitutes went by an alias when visiting prostitutes soon began visiting Helen Jewett under the name Frank Rivers with increasing Richard Robinson moved to New York City as a teenager and found employment in a dragon store Richard and Helen had met one evening abrupt end one snowy night in April just two years later at forty one Thomas Street around one am on April Tenth Eighteen Thirty Six after Rosanna Thompson thought that she heard the last visitor come in for the evening Rozina Townsend awoke to it sounded like someone tried to get out of the front door which he always kept locked from the inside actually two structures combined into one with twin staircases that met on a second floor landing to large skyline and Helen was so impressed by his heroism that she handed Richard Her calling card Richard Robinson who like many men listened at her door in case one of the other girls needed help with a drunk client she listened as the lights a large drawing room and beautifully landscaped Garden There Helen Jewett transformed herself as commercial sex can often be Jewish strung along her young men with letters of courtship gifts and shared emotional return it to her room when she felt a chill the back door was wide open she closed it and you it's bed was on fire fire fire fire she cried the girls quickly the men slipped out of the house to save their own skin and avoid being caught up as witnesses Marie slowly craft open her door to look and so a man in a cloak go down the stairs carrying a lamp doc she heard a thump followed by a strange moment marie rose out of her bed and has the Broadway of today elegantly dressed courtesans and mistresses who had an escort for the evening sat in the first and second tiers maybe insisted is the better word that her clients play a game of love and romance with her instead of sex without obligation you walked it made her way upstairs to return the lamp and look in on the girls when she but Helen was unresponsive soon the nightwatchman came the only help one could expect around three am Rozina Townsend rose to make her rounds and check on the girls upstairs she noticed a small lamp burning on a table in the hallway and recognized it at Helen's Rozina picked it up and she went to bed shortly thereafter across the hall from Helen you it's upstairs Marie Stevens Kennedy the passionate complicated and Tumultuous Romance followed their fateful meeting would come to an outside of a theater when he was just seventeen the suitors of the Eighteen Thirties in New York or just as beautiful and celebrated noticed a smell when she pushed open the door black smoke poured out of the room and into the hall reached Helen's room she knew that something was wrong Helen chenowitz doors stood slightly open and Rosanna Thompson Townsend and the girls frantically worked together to extinguish the blaze before it could spread to any other rooms men visited the third tier to set up appointments for later in the evening and although everyone knew this was common practice and prostitutes Rozina Townsend through open a window and yelled down the street for help as she waited she called Helen to get her up from bed rushed out into the hall as their gentlemen callers stumbled out of their rooms in various states of undress rather than sticking around to help it was on one such evening in eighteen thirty four that seventeen year old Richard Robinson noticed a man attacking a beautiful you in recrossed the hall opened then closed and the sound of footsteps walked away down the hall releasing exclusive episodes only available to members dom people town plus episodes will be ad free and available earlier for members than anyone else like Marie she assumed that one of the gentlemen we're simply on their way out and she too went back to sleep assuming that Helen visitor was simply leaving Marie returned to then in the eighteen thirties as organized fire and police departments were still in their infancy the night watchman when the fire was finally out and the smoke had cleared they looked upon Helen Jewett lane dead in her bed her white nightgown was burned almost completely one arm was raised above her head the other for early ad free episodes and bonus content follow us and subscribe on. Himalayan murder ordered him to get up they were taking him to the police station before taking him to the police station they took Richard Back to the scene of the crime at the time the young man's shared room Richard Robinson and his roommate were abruptly awoken this is an odd business if she knew who had been in Helen's room that night she did earlier in the evening Rozina had brought sham address in the early hours of Sunday April tenth the watchman paid a visit to the business they soon learned the night watchman asked Mrs Townsend where they might find this frank reverse one of the girls she told Mrs Townsend not to send easy to her instead between nine and ten o'clock a man arrived the alias Frank rivers belonged to nineteen year old Richard P Robinson who resided at a boardinghouse it forty two fire had been set in an attempt to make her death look like an accident the night watchman asked Mrs Townsend into the room and saw the back of a young man that she had seen with Helen many times he called himself Frank Rivers Ahead Helen Jewett had been struck with a hatchet three times as she slept and it was immediately apparent that the this was a common practice confronting killer with their victim sometimes extracted a confession this was not the case the nightwatchman everything she could remember about the night the back garden where Mrs Townsend believed Frank Rivers had exited through the Back Door Dinh Frank Rivers worked for a merchant on maiden lane in a dry goods shop and she knew the as Richard rose from his bed in put on a coat they noticed a white mark on his trousers and remembered the whitewashed fence or was immediately searched for evidence a blood-stained hatchet was found tied with a piece of broken most Saturday Nights Helen entertained a man known as bill easy but on April nine they st they're next stop a pound on the door awoke a servant girl who directed the citizen officers not body on the bed officers were disturbed by his lack of distress or emotion at the Robinson was arrested for the murder of Helen Jewett and taken into custody news of the murder quickly spread with Richard Robinson they led him up to Helen's charred room and forced him to look upon her half burned and on the other side of a recently whitewashed fence they found the clock I said Richard half dressed in bed and seemingly unperturbed by the sudden presence of the authorities in his room accusing him of aged yesterday with most brilliant prospects the authorities were not convinced Richard P competition in the rapidly expanding newspaper trade at the time the sensational story soon hit the Penny depress equivalent to the tabloid papers of today readers couldn't get enough the sun rose refunding site of his lover brutally murdered when asked if he had killed Helen Jewett Richard Robinson responded the media frenzy that followed would changed journalism forever up until now news each newspaper accused the others of falsifying witness accounts to sell papers Chih course only we use year had seen only seven homicides which true little interest but news of the brutal hatchet order of a well known prostitute by her lover appeared to be good business and there was heavy covering his face with a cloak Rozina immediately recognized him as Frank Rivers Mrs Townsend Helen had told Mrs Townsend not to admit one of her Saturday night mcevers the she would be visited by another caller instead he percent written little about crime and brutal murder was surprisingly infrequent in eighteen thirties. New York City the pre active narrative of sex romance and vice with little regard to journalistic integrity or facts don't more papers historian and author Patricia Cline Cohen remarked in her book Code had bronzed her skin along the left side like an antique statue the perfect figure the exquisite limbs reported thereafter up until now newspapers primarily served the interests of merchants and Political Parties Eric I most certainly did not Richard Robinson insisted that he had been in his room that night and the New York Herald became the most widely read newspaper in the country on June second eighteen thirty he went on to describe the sensual contours of her body in detail how it stiffened with rigor mortis how the Fire It's editor James Gordon Bennett sometimes referred to today as the man who made the news was chief among them. Historians of journalism have long heralded the Jewett murder as the event that inaugurated a sex and death sensationalism in news reporting and reported to the public what he saw first person quote slowly I began to discover the limits of the corpse as six less than two months after the murder the five day trial began thousands of spectators route it seems impossible the loop can be found whereupon to hang a doubt that the life of Miss Jewett was taken by any other hand Tom Bennett was a pioneer and innovator who coverage of the two at case set the blueprint for how stories would be his roommate seemed to corroborate the story though he wasn't certain of the actual time that Richard came home added do you think I would blast my brilliant prospects by so ridiculous and act I am a young man of only nineteen years a style of journalism that is utterly from New Year to us now the New York Herald public interest in the story drew reporters to forty one Thomas Street before Helen Chenowitz body had even been it but his for the first time in American history journalists followed the murder case closely writing US hyped around nine thirty and went with Helen to her room later she herself had taken champagne upstairs to the couple belong to him he used it to open crates and that it had gone missing the weekend of the murder he's seen the body looked as white as full as polished as pure Perry and Marple Oh surpassing in every respect the Venus d'amitie the public was shocked Mrs when Marie Stevens who had heard moans coming from Helen Chenowitz Room and seen the cloaked figure walk down the hall the chaos was so disruptive the judge Ogden Edwards was forced to summon fifty extra marshals to maintain order the evidence though circumstantial was stacking up against Richard Robinson but the prosecution he also recognized the twine Robinson's roommate also testified this time he said that he had not been in his bed by eleven as Robinson had claimed a clerk from an apothecary mysteriously died the prosecution opened my calling its first witness Rosie around eleven Rozina Townsend then described she'd been awakened and found the back door open and the fine face the full arms the beautiful Bust Bennett reported oh who's just moments after it happened and it himself went to view the body of Helen Jewett at the crime scene suffered a blow and the trial took a turn when the judge ordered that the clerks testimony was irrelevant and had the testimony thrown out bolt in and around the courthouse for the first time journalists from cities around the country were the defenses basic argument was that the word of prostitutes could not be trusted they pointed the finger townsend she took the stand and laid out the timeline of events of the night of the murder Richard Robinson had arrived testified that about one week before the murder a man calling himself douglas had attempted to purchase arsenic from him but he refused arised had been added to the hatchet and the cloak after the crime to frame Richard Robinson the defense floated jealousy among in a dramatic moment the clerk pointed to Robinson and identify him as a man called Douglas with an Alibi Robert Furlong testified that on the night in question Richard Robinson purchased a bunch of to deliberate the judge gave the jury its instructions as most of the witnesses were prostitutes the judge ordered the jury to disregard their testimony the jury returned less than fifteen minutes later suspiciously just a few days before the trial was set to begin the prosecution lost one of its star and Richard Robinson was found not guilty the public was outraged one would the beauties of a statue of Marvel it was the most remarkable sight I ever beheld not a vein was who testified that he had sold twenty five hundred such hatchets in the city the twine the defense and for the trial reporters streamed to catch the testimony has no official transcripts were made assist under the name Richard Parmalee he quickly established himself in the new community Bennett got the press was boring so to increase sales and readership he said about to deliver exciting rims cigars from him smoke twelve sitting on a barrel and talking and reading a newspaper and departed at ten fifteen saying. I believe I'll go home I'm tired the defense also presented the manufacturer of the hatchet the defence then called a witness thirty-three-year-old Robert Furlong who provided Richard Robinson Richard was initiated as a member of the local Masonic Lodge he became owner of several successful businesses married and Robert Furlong the shop owner who had provided the alibi for Richard Robinson was rumored to have been paid to give false investigators then described what they found at the scene the hatchet and the cloak from the backyard were presented as evidence is troubled him Richard replied not a bit did it appear in court that Helen was murdered by me the girls as a motive for the murder as one of the other girls admitted during questioning that she too had been intimate with Robinson closing arguments lasted ten and a half hours and at twelve thirty that final night the all male jury was sent were dated between August and April of eighteen thirty six in the months leading up to her murder the letters between and obtained the ninety letters between Richard Robinson and Helen Jewett had been suppressed at trial the sensational news coverage continued after the trial a reporter asked Richard Robinson if his conscience hundreds gathered to view the evidence against Richard Robinson that the jury never got to see in houses of ill repute in a final blow to the prosecution ninety letters between Helen Jewett a porter from the dry goods store where Robinson worked was called to identify the hatchet he testified that the hatchet letters and posted them in their windows alongside the murder weapon which they obtained from the district attorney he added only bunglers would've used a dull hatchet to cut up the girl I would sooner use a Jack Knife Russian to rest its case and lift the jury and the public to wonder whether the letters might have revealed a motive Helen and Richard had turned to jealousy anger and frustration. The gazette copied they publish them. The first of the letters were romantic flirtatious but the most revealing correspondence jumping off a ship in eighteen forty eight twelve years after the trial the editor of the National Police Gazette at Rozina Townsend assaulted her character and employed to the jury. That murderous conspiracies or precisely the sort of things that happen you are never so foolish as when you threaten me keep quiet until I come on Saturday night lay on her chest the left side of her body was charred from the fire and she was bleeding profusely from the dealings that Helen Jewett had threatened to expose in his final letter to her Richard Robinson warned heaven gene boat trip he was laid to rest in Oak Grove cemetery as Richard Partly with the last rites of Master masons letters revealed that Richard Robinson had been engaged in some questionable business practices nefarious Senate for true crime anytime download the murder minute APP or follow us on Instagram and facebook at murder minute and now right and then we will see if we cannot be better friends thereafter do not tell any other person I shall come helens lamp on the table downstairs then how she found the burning bed in the body and called for help Oughta farm in eighteen fifty five at age thirty eight Richard Robinson died during an Ohio River testimony within a year his business had failed and in eighteen thirty eight for long committed suicide Richard Robinson that were found in her room were declared by the judge inadmissible this led the prosecute eighty and over the next two decades served as deputy clerk of the county court and as clerk of the District Court and by age twenty one by August of eighteen thirty six Richard Robinson left New York City to escape the hounding of the press and start fresh intact This has been murder.
Episode 174: From Scratch
"They weren't always close to the shore. When you stand there today you might get the impression that they were constructed so close to the water on purpose but time has a way of changing things when they were first built they stood much farther inland but rising water levels erosion have played a magic trick of sorts located at orkney on the tiny island of papua yesterday. The site is known as the nap of power. It's a pair of structures made of stacked flat stones in rectangular doorways all embedded in grassy mounds. The roofs might be open to the sky today but evidence of post holes suggest that they once had proper tops and inside large thin pieces of slates have been used to divide the space into smaller rooms. Some believe the name power comes from the old norse word for burial mounds and if you look at them and made that assumption. I can't blame you. But that's not what they were. These amazing structures were something very familiar to all of us homes in their ancient to they date from around thirty five hundred b c which means they are early neolithic and even older than the more famous scar brace sites elsewhere in orkney but older than stonehenge older even than the great pyramid and they make something very clear wherever humans go. If we can't find a home waiting for us we make one and the same can be said about folklore. If you spend any amount of time reading the stories that have been passed down through various cultures over the years it quickly becomes clear that those stories have spread right alongside the people who told them but just like our innate need for a place to live sometimes that new life in a new place required new stories to make it all come together folklore evolves it grows and sometimes it's invented from scratch to help people feel a better sense of community in one place in particular is famous for its stories both in the ones they've made up and the ones that are two amazing to believe aaron minke and this is lower. There was a reason people began to move there. The area of the united states that we now know as wisconsin started out as a sort of gold mine for early european settlers. Although the gold wasn't literal it was everything else. And the reason was an idea called glaciation. That's when an area of land is covered by glaciers for a very long time which grinds the surface down and smoothes out the hills and valleys but south western. Wisconsin is part of a region in the midwest known as the drift louis area. Where none of that happened. And that meant that. All those valuable minerals and metals were more common on the surface ripe for the picking so to speak. And if you want proof just look at the name of one of the oldest towns in that area mineral points if you were a settler looking for zinc and lead back in the early eighteen hundreds mineral point was the place to be easy picking meant easy money and soon enough people flocked there from all over in fact so many miners move there that there wasn't enough housing for them so they started to carve out little caves for themselves in the hills soon enough. Some people noticed that these caves had a striking resemblance to badger holds and started referring to the miners as badgers themselves. So if you've ever wondered why wisconsin's nickname is the badger states. Now you know when the surface resources were picked over people started digging into the earth for a long while the big target there was lead and mineral point was the epicenter of that industry but whenever humans have dug deep for resources they've also found plenty of tragedy and wisconsin is no exception. In fact mining. Accidents were so common that they didn't receive a lot of attention in the local papers. They were just sort of accepted as part of the job although every now and then reports of larger accidents would appear and when they did. The language was always highly descriptive. One man in eighteen ninety three was described as being blown to atoms when the explosive charge was set off too early and in nineteen o. Nine four other miners were killed when the entire powder house detonated as they were walking past it the men were said to have been vaporized which paints a pretty clear picture of how dangerous job typically was and how creative the newspapers had become with reporting it but mining accidents weren't the only thing putting early settlers at risk all those people packed into wooden buildings and surrounded by thick woodland made for a lot of fires to for example in may of eighteen. Ninety six. massive fire broke out in northwestern. Wisconsin near the city of ashland. Three dockworkers were killed in the blaze and four years later. Another fire claimed four more lives in the very same town then in eighteen eighty. Three tragedy struck a lot closer to home in milwaukee. There was a hotel called the newhall house which had been built in eighteen. Fifty six by a local merchant named daniel newhall contemporary reports claim that it was one of the nicest hotels in america when it first went up but within just twenty five years it had already started to look a bit. Rundown but in january eighteen eighty. Three that no longer mattered. The fire broke out on the tenth of that month. Starting inside the elevator shaft and quickly spreading throughout the rest of the hotel and by the time it was over the next morning the entire building had been reduced to rubble because was more than likely just a product of the time while the outer shell of the building had been brick. The insides were entirely wooden and all throughout the hotel gaslight fixtures provided illumination for guests which meant that there were hundreds of open flames dancing around that any given moment honestly. It's a miracle the place didn't burn down sooner. And while the guest records were also destroyed in the fire. At least seventy six. Charred bodies were pulled from the ashes of the building. Most had died inside while a few had tragically tried escaping the flames by leaping from their windows only to die upon impacts and then burn in the wreckage one bright spot in an otherwise dark moment is how one pair of guests managed to survive charles sherwood stratton and his wife lavinia were traveling performers known all over the united states and they had been staying there at the hotel when the fire broke out they both apparently climbed out onto the ledge outside their window and waited for a fireman to pick them up and carry them to safety and i mean that literally in fact the firemen was able to carry both of them down at the same time tucked safely under his arm. That's because each of them were roughly three feet tall being some of the most famous examples of dwarfism in their day. And while you might not recognize the name charles stratton you will find his stage name familiar general tom thumb clearly. The early days of life in wisconsin came with challenges and risks. But all of it was in an effort to carve out a new home in a brand new place a home that quickly began to brew some of its own stories and legends it. All it takes is a quick tour of that local lore to learn something inescapable all the tragedy of the past certainly left. It's mark some of it was imported when settlers began to arrive in the region now referred to as wisconsin. They brought beliefs with them from their old homes. It's something humans are very good at when we migrates even when we can't carry belongings there's always room for story. Cornish miners attracted by the lead and zinc in the ground brought stories of goblin. Light guardians of the mind called tummy. Knockers and the german and scandinavians who made up a majority of early settlers brought their own old world folklore. But it's the tails born right there. After everyone's arrival that have truly left an impression. One of those stories comes to us from that old industrial center mineral town in february eighteen. Forty to a local man named william. Kathy attended a formal party at the home of a captain. But kathy wasn't the sort of man play by the rules that had a reputation for being a troublemaker. With a violent temper basically he was the worst sort of guests. They could have asked for when he arrived. Caffey discover. The guests were being announced as they entered through the main door so he stepped aside to wait for his own name to be called. When it wasn't he became angry asking why he had been ignored after being told that his name had indeed been called but that he had arrived too late to hear it he stole the guest list and stormed out of the house into the cool night air outside. Cathy was confronted by a few of the more courageous. Gentlemen from the party without that guest list. New arrivals couldn't be announced and they wanted it back. A kathy refused and in the heat of the argument. He pulled a pistol from his jacket and shot one of the men dead where he stood. Kathy stood trial for his crime and in november of eighteen forty two. He was driven to the gallows in the back of a wagon. Local legend says that he sat atop his own coffin there. Straddling it like a horse and tapping. It's hollow sides like a drum once in front of the gathered crowd. He refused to say his final words and drop through the platform to his death. A moment later ever since there have been stories of people who claim to see kathy's ghost walking through buildings in the area of his execution sites. One location is the walker house which is an end today but was a tavern back in the mid eighteen hundreds and while it has been remodeled many times over the years some parts of the past refused to go away guests there have seen a ghostly figure walking through the hallways at night sometimes with his head where it belongs and other times with tucked under his arm others have heard disembodied voices in rooms that were supposed to be empty. Even doorknobs have been seen turning on their own. The in might not sit on the exact location of kathy's execution. But it seems. His story has no intention of checking out. And there is a hotel in milwaukee with the similar guest. Visitors to the hilton garden. Inn have reported all sorts of unusual experiences from doors that open and close on their own to the sensation of being grabbed or pushed. And that would make it a creepy location. All on. its own until. I told you that it was originally built as a hotel called the loyalty house built on the very spot that once held the newhall house hotel. One of milwaukee's darker tales though comes from an area called allen's edition in a house at the corner of alison whitcomb. It was there in eighteen. Seventy four that locals had one of the most unexplainable experiences in the states. And if it's true it gives us plenty of reason to stop and consider the darkness. It might have left behind in august of that year. Mary spiegel reported for work in the kitchen of giddings boarding house. Owned and run. By mr and mrs giddings. Mary was a teenager with a rough home. Life and the job in the boarding house was meant to give her an escape from the anxiety in violence there in the end it only made things worse on the morning of august eighth. Mary was working alongside. Mrs giddings preparing food for the residents of the house. When a number of the chairs around the kitchen table suddenly levitated up from the floor crashed into the ceiling. Plates began to fly out of the closet nearby and shatter on the floor at a boiling pot of tea on the stove somehow fell over splashing hot water everywhere. Obviously both women were terrified as any of us would be if it had happened in our own kitchen and it continued to vegetables flew lamps toppled and potted plants left out of their spots so young. Mary rushed from the house to find help when she returned. She had to neighborhood ladies. Until mrs mead and mrs roland as soon as mary brought him into the kitchen the chaos began again. Mrs mead was so overcome with fright that she reported feeling sick and ran away from the house. Mrs roland stuck it out longer. Watching as objects flew from one place to another with no one near them to cause the movement but eventually they went looking for additional help a short time later to physicians arrived. Dr meecham and dr gray both of whom were struck by flying objects almost at once. And what's amazing about this. Entire encounter is just how thorough the local newspaper was in its investigation. Multiple people of high reputation were quoted with names to support the story. Which stated that these things occurred without human agency is vouched for by scores of eye witnesses. Clearly something unexplainable happened in this house. Some of those. Who witnessed it. All blamed young. Mary spiegel for the activity. Even though they couldn't explain it logically she was never seen throwing things and oftentimes the objects that moved. Were doing so across the room from where she and others were standing but she was young enough that some people just assume that she was a troublemaker. As all children are supposed to be. Mary was sent home after that back to her horrible father and life of loneliness and fear according to the newspaper reports. This drove mary to try and take her own life although someone intervened and taking sympathy on her. Mrs giddings invited mary back to continue her employment there at the boardinghouse the moment mary stepped into the kitchen however all of the chaos and flying objects started up again and no one either then or now as ever been able to explain why Every topic seems to have an epicenter if you want to discuss civil war history. It's hard to do better than visit gettysburg. The history of human flights. You'd better visit kitty hawk in north carolina and if you're interested in exploring wisconsin's paranormal reputation. Most would tell you that whitewater was the place to be. The reason seems to be something that happened back in the late eighteen. Hundreds that's when an unassuming man named morris moved from new york to wisconsin settling in whitewater to work as a farmer but soon enough he was pulled into the growing world of spiritualism attending seances and building his entire social circle. Around it during one seance. It's reported that morris asked a spirit where he might find a fortune. He promised that if it happened he would devote his life and money to the cause of spiritualism to work as its champion and in response the medium related information to him about where he might dig a profitable mine with the location in hand he found the owner of the property purchased it and immediately began mining for riches and it worked soon enough. Morris was a wealthy man and true to his words. He began to put that fortune to work promoting the teachings and the practice of spiritualism now morris was known around town for a lot of activities. He would speak publicly on the subject regularly and engaged in lively debates with his critics. He was even known to get kicked out of local churches for showing up and interrupting their services with his own messages. But what morris needed really was an epicenter for his life's work so in eighteen eighty eight. He started construction on an entire school devoted to it when it opened doors in nineteen. Oh three the school had his name right there. On the sign the morris pratt institute and it had his passion inside with classrooms and curriculum devoted to the study of spiritualist beliefs and practices and the pinnacle of all of that was a space on the third floor known as the white room. Thanks to its white walls white floor and white furniture. It was there that only true mediums could enter and practice everyone who stepped inside had to be dressed entirely in white and then they would gather around the table and make contact with the spirit realm if it sounds like something pulled right out of a horror film with a crazy old rich guy building a mansion devoted to spiritual energy. That's not too far from the truth. And that sort of story has a way of impacting. The community around it morris pratt died in nineteen. Oh two but his school lived on for decades more in the nineteen forties. The institute's sold their building and move to a more modern facility where they still operate today but the old structure found new uses as the years went on and as you might imagine with that sort of story at the center of city life darker legends were bound to pop up giving whitewater reputation and a nickname the second salem. For example there are rumors. A haunted book locked up in the basement of the local library. All sorts of legends have been attached to it to that a number of students and even a local professor have all taken their lives after reading it that the contents could drive a person to madness that it was a gateway to a realm of darkness. But the story is larger than reality. It turns out that the only locked book in the library is an old catholic. Hymnal thanks to its large size ornate gothic decorations and forbidden nature. Being locked in a cage but community has crafted a story to fit it. It's all fiction but it feels like it should be true and it's not the first time that sort of thing has happened in whitewater. There are a number of people who believe that there is a triangle of evil activity in town and the corners of its territory are three local cemeteries and sure enough if you look at a map. Those three points calvary cemetery oak grove cemetery and hillside cemetery. All seem to form an obvious and clear triangle whether the stories set within it are true though is up for debate but geography doesn't lie right in the center of this triangle. Is the granddaddy of them. All the location of the old morris pratt institute and the largest complex of buildings in the centre today belong to the university of wisconsin whitewater. Which has its own fair. Share of tales of haunted dormitories. But there's one building with more darkness than most when sarah posey and her husband bought the place in the late eighteen hundreds. It was supposed to be their home. The house became the center for their life and they had two sons there. Sarah was an artist and help support the family by teaching and one of her passions was tile making which she used to craft a number of beautiful tiles that were placed in among the woodwork. along the grand staircase. They're two of the tiles. Though were special. Sarah crafted one with her own image on it and another with the face of her oldest little oliver and they were mounted in a place of honor. Writes in the decorative facing the dining room fireplace but when opportunities in california pulled the family west. Those tiles were left behind. Just one more part of the house they had turned into a home and it's clear that it held a special place in their hearts because when little oliver died young at the age of thirty seven he was brought back to be buried there in whitewater his mother. Sarah followed him. Six years later also returned home for burial in nineteen twenty six but one thing had changed since their time. Their little oliver's tile on the fireplace had gone missing ever since people who lived in the house reported seen a woman in a white gown wandering the halls others claim to wake in the middle of the night to find the figure of a little boy standing at the foot of their bed as the stories flooded in over the years many began to assume sarah and oliver posey returned to their beloved home but it was clear that they were unsettled. Perhaps looking for something in the nineteen eighties. The house went through a series of renovations to restore an update much of the home and in the process. One of the workers made an amazing discovery. It was a hand painted tile with the image of a little boy on its oliver posey had been found and the tile was returned to its home above the fireplace ever since the ghostly figures of the woman and child. I've never been seen again. We humans have an intimate relationship with story. We build our lives around them we entertain ourselves with them and we hold our hopes and dreams up against them like templates story drives us and arguably makes us more human in the process. There are a lot of stories that we've been telling for millennia. The obvious examples are classic mythologies from the ancient world but even some of the fairy tales we think of as relatively modern like cinderella for example or actually just descendants of older tales from places like china and eastern europe. When we find a story we love we tend to hold onto it and pass it down through the ages sometimes though we find ourselves staring at a blank page and sometimes there's something big and obvious that gets people talking and those things have a way of kicking off stories that are new and fresh and really connected to the community who tells them which is what i think happened in whitewater. A great example is the landmark known as the witches tower. It's real name. is the sterren park. Water tower built in eighteen. Eighty nine to hold one hundred eighty five thousand gallons of water for the community. In fact it's the second oldest continuously operating water tower in the states but it also has an appearance that's generated quite reputation resembling a thick gothic tower crowned by metal tank up top and that medieval image has led some to believe that the tower also serves as the home to a coven of witches who exit the structure at night to perform rituals around it and for a long while it seemed there was proof on the building that the town was trying to keep something trapped inside because the barbed wire at the top of the surrounding fence based inward rather than toward the outside. There was nothing more than a mistake by the installers but it took on a life of its own and i have one last story that stands out as a perfect example of that concept in action to understand it though. We have to return to the home once owned by sarah posey and her husband by the nineteen sixties. The house was being used as fraternity housing for students attending the university of wisconsin. As you might imagine those frat members got up to a lot of mischief during their time there and for one of those students. Those memories were foundational becoming stories. That would live on through his work later in life specifically one of the students reportedly drove his motorcycle up the stairs to the second floor. Very same staircase that wants displayed. Sarah posey's handmade tiles had become a ramp for a wild college student. Who left his own marks on the floor. That student who watched it happened right there in the posey house would go on to start a career in entertainment known for his wild antics and crazy behavior in all of that bold personality fueled by memories of life in that whitewater. Frat house was poured into the nineteen seventy eight film animal house and that frat boy turned actor and comedian. The legend himself john belushi. There's something powerful about ghost stories. When presented in their historical context as we've learned from sarah posey's house as well as other locations from within the center of whitewater wisconsin the two are inextricably tied where there are tales of haunting. 's there's usually a backstory which brings me to an announcement you know. I have a healthy love for haunted locations as well as the historical details that anchor them in the real world and so does my good friend. Amy bruni if you don't know her name. Amy is the star of the hit. travel channel. Show kindred spirits and years before she was a regular on the legendary show ghost hunters and just like me. Amy loves the history behind the huntings. So about a year ago i started talking with her about making a podcast of her own and together. We've crafted a really special show. That i absolutely no. You're going to love called the haunted road in each episode. Amy will take a deep dive into the history of one of her favourite haunted locations. And then sit down with paranormal investigators who have spent time there to hear about their experiences and impressions from the place. Halted road arrives. July seventh on the iheartradio app apple podcasts. Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. Lauren. more and final linked to subscribe over at grim and mild dot com slash haunted road. But since it's a grim and mild. Podcast i have the power to share a bigger chunk with you right here right now and if you stick around through this brief sponsor break. I'll do just that. This episode of lor was made possible by wondering if you're a lifelong learner like me. You know how different the various services out there can be there are streaming services all over that. Turn our brains off for mindless entertainment. But the one. I love is wondering i'm the streaming service that blows our mind wondering am has thousands of audio and video learning experiences to feed my curiosity. That goes so much further than what i'd find on the web wondering m.'s. Content is fun and exciting and gives me access to a world of knowledge from top experts and storytellers with documentaries tutorials and collections. From kino lorber magellan. Tv and craftsy covering practically any subject. We could imagine plus all of our favorites from the great courses. Plus my favorite right now is the real history of pirates and it's been eye opening. Who were the real pirates of the caribbean but were their tactics. And how did their world function. This course covers it all. Join me experience your own mind blowing moments with wondering right now. My listeners can get this exclusive. Offer a twenty one day free trial of unlimited access to the entire library. Go now to wonder dot com slash lor. You won't find this anywhere else. That's w. o. n. d. r. i. u. m. dot com slash lor wondrous dot com slash lower. This episode was also made possible by native. You know what stinks being completely caught up on your favourite show and then having to wait for the next episode to drop but while streaming schedules can stink. There's no reason that you have to. That's why you should try native native cares about the products that you put on your body. They're all about stopping the stink. The right way that's the native difference. You probably already know about natives legendary aluminum free deodorant. But have you tried their body wash toothpaste or their brand new mineral base sunscreen. I've been using it all the time this summer and i love it. Native is on a mission to overhaul your entire hygiene routine by putting the care back in self care with products carefully made to work against odor with simple ingredients. That smell great. You can get there. Deodorants embody wash amazing sense like coconut and vanilla citrus and herbal musk lavender and rose and more you can even build your own personalized product. Bundles mix and match three of your favorite sense and keep them on rotation so you how something for every occasion stay fresh. Stay clean with native by going to native. Dao dot com slash law. twenty or. Use the promo code. Laura twenty at checkout to get twenty percents off your first order. That's native. Dao dot com slash. Laura two zero or use the promo code laura two zero at checkout or twenty percent off your first order and finally this episode was made possible by the good people over at stamps dot com. You know for a lot of us. Life seems to be returning to something closer to normal. We're finally getting back to enjoying life's little pleasures like seeing a movie drinks with friends or going to the post office okay. Some parts of normal life aren't so great but with stamps dot com. You can skip those trips to the post office. Stamps dot com has been absolutely essential to running my business especially over the past year and a half. I can use my computer to print labels ship merchandise by postage and scheduled packaged pickups. Right here for my desk which saves me a ton of time. Plus stamps dot com. Gets you five cents off. Every first class stamp up to forty percents off priority mail and up to sixty six percent ups shipping rates. Stamps dot com has saved me time and money which is a big win in my book. Stamps dot com is a must have for any business. whether you're a small office sending invoices side-hustle oetzi shop shipping out your orders or just navigating this hybrid work life. Stamps dot com can handle it all with ease. No wonder nearly a million businesses use it. Stop wasting time going to the post office and go to stamps dot com instead. There's no risk and with my promo code. Laura you'll get a special offer that includes a four week. Trial plus free postage and digital scale no long term commitments or contracts. Just go to stamps. dot com. Click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and then type in the word. Lor that stamps dot com offer code. Lor stamps dot com. Never go to the post office again in nineteen inv- alaska iowa. A family of six plus. Two of their guests were the victims of a horrible axe murderer. This unspeakable crime took place as they slept in their beds and horrify the small town of two thousand people since then. The house has been dubbed. The va liska ax murder house and is the site of many paranormal happenings attracting paranormal investigators from around the globe. Robert larson is one. Such paranormal investigator from rhinelander wisconsin in twenty fourteen. He was investigating the liska ax murder house with his parents. He told them he wanted to attempt an experiment where he would recreate the seen. The murderer left following the horrible crime. That took place there. He asked them to leave him completely alone. But to monitor the building from outside from their. Dvr cameras robert proceeded to stage the home exactly as it had been found the morning of the murders including covering all the mirrors with cloth drawing the curtains leaving a bloody bowl of water in the kitchen and even laying. A large pile of bacon on the kitchen counter will talk about the meaning of that later. The only thing robert didn't have was an axe so he may do with a knife. Robert lay down in one of the beds in the downstairs bedroom and clutch the knife in his right hand robert proceeded to call out to what he believed to be the ghost of the killer. In the dark he hurled horrible names and insults at the killer and provoked unrelentingly. The last thing robert remembers is a strange light anomaly. Emerging from the closet in the room he was in and heading straight for him. When he came to the knife he had been clutching was buried in his shoulder. He was screaming and his parents. Were calling for help. Robert was severely injured. He was actually life flighted to the nearest hospital where he coded due to blood loss but thankfully revived. The police ruled. That robert did this to himself but to this day. He swears otherwise. He claims the knife was in his right shoulder at an angle. That would have been impossible for him to do himself. And that even then. He is right handed and had the knife in his right hand. Try that for yourself. Hold something in your right hand and try to reach your right shoulder with enough force to bury a knife in it. We will never know the answers as to what happened. That night roberts actions were just out of the camera frame and his parents were so horrified by what they heard on the recorder. Robert was running at the time that they destroyed it now. I actually interviewed robert face to face. I expected to walk in and find a man who may not be entirely truthful. But i believe him. Whatever happened there that night. His left him a different person and it was to this day. Probably one of the most powerful interviews. I've ever conducted with someone. I think that was the first time i had ever met someone who had had a paranormal encounter. That made me question whether paranormal activity can actually be dangerous. Because i had never heard a story like this and the look in his eyes was one of just complete and utter terror. Eventually we were able to get robert to return to the house. And i think that was incredibly therapeutic moment for him that he needed but it was also in the middle of the day and he was surrounded by people. I don't think you could pay him enough to ever reenter that home by himself. I'm amy bruni and this is haunted road. So i am now joined by johnny hauser. Who is the i guess resident. Paranormal investigator the vellisca house. Would that be your title a yeah. I'm kind of a all. Titles with the heck's house the tour guide the overnight guy the website guy. The lawnmower guy. Like oh yeah jack-of-all-trades jack-of-all-trades for that house. I'm the norman bates of the ax. murder house. and so you actually live right next door. Is that correct. Yeah i live right next door in peckham house. And she of course was the neighbor that initially found or notice. Something was wrong at that house next door which is interesting because the more children used to play over in my house. I mean mary was like a grandma to them. I've investigated there for a few nights. And i didn't really find any evidence of the children but i do know that many people have And then we did have an experience that we felt might have been with something more. I don't like to say negative but some some someone or something that was a little more angry and a little more malicious. And you know your thoughts go to. This must be the ghost of the murderer you know but what what do you think that is. Who do you think that is. I think that everywhere on this planet where something horrible has happened. It leaves that negative imprint. It's just like you walk into a room where someone had an argument. You feel that negative energy. It's very real in lingers place had an atom bomb of negative energy dropped on it right. i mean. I think that just in general huntings react to the vibe in the space you know and and that goes for the living and the dead. I wanna give listeners kind of the vibe of the house. Because i experienced the gamut there i experienced that kind of positive moment and the negative moments. I'm just wondering if you could pass on some of those. Oh man over fifteen years of being in this place. I've seen you know just the normal footsteps store opening closing there for like a month. There's a lot of poltergeist activity of things stacking and arranging which is odd because nobody lives there at all empty place. I've seen the positive. I've seen the negative one of the most profound things that i've ever experienced friday night. The overnights cans told for whatever reason. So i thought i'm just going to go in victims some things in the upstairs bedroom. Lock the kitchen doors. Nobody could walk in. And as i'm up there somebody walks in the house. And i'm like people were closed like well obviously idiot. They broke in the. You know because it's like nighttime. And i thought they have no idea. I'm upstairs so i'm going to have fun with this. In a heightened. The kids room closet must plan. Was this scare this kid. Jump out you know and just do the y you break in if you wanna see l. Just show it to you so the walking around downstairs for like ten minutes. That comes upstairs into the room. I man kicked the closet door open. Do the big blah. Nothing there was nothing. And i couldn't even move. I couldn't talk. The i always heard you know. Oh i felt a rush of cold air. I thought yeah. Everybody says that. I've never experienced at that time. I did check the whole house. The door was locked watcher surveillance video. There is nothing. Wow and i've seen a lot of like a amityville quality of the house of mental manipulation. And i've experienced that in there to where especially in the downstairs bedroom. Einon lena's room where you just kinda zone and owl and pretty soon. You're just like out of it. You go out of the house and you know second hour or two later like start coming back to normal and that's a that's a very scary part of the house for me. I know what it can do. So i don't push it anymore. This episode of laura was written and produced by me. Erin monkey with research by sam alberdi and music by chad lawson. Lor is much more than just a podcast. There's a book series available in bookstores and online and two seasons of television show on amazon prime video. Check them both out. If you want more laura in your life. I also make an executive produce a whole bunch of other podcasts. All of which. I think you'd enjoy my production company grim and mild specializes in shows that. Sit at the intersection of dark and the historical. You can learn more about all of our shows and everything else going on over in one central place grim and mild dot com and you can follow this show on twitter facebook and instagram. Just search for lor podcast. All one word and then click that follow button and when you do say hi i like it when people say hi and as always thanks for listening.
Chicken Leg Pride Month
"The! You by? The. Check. Welcome back to the Ross Bowl and podcast otherwise known as our BP presented by Bolan media I'm your host Ross Bolan. And I am officially the Weird Guy in my neighborhood. Even in a city that all to affectionately embraces the slogan Keep Austin Weird. I'm somehow. Foreign away at this point, the weird guy in my neighborhood and I'll be honest. That's not a tag I intended on wearing for another twenty five to thirty years or so. But here we are like I was looking at my dad and I'm like fuck. I can't wait to be like a quirky old guy. One day, but I'm thirty three years old. And somehow I am the standout, weird guy and a half ginger fide neighborhood. In my competition is incredibly stiff to like rock hard so aroused. We've got a couple across the street. That's in their fifties or sixties. I guess retired I can't really tell you never came with Austin. Folks and their entire front yard is a nine foot, high garden, and I use the word guard in more liberally liberally. Excuse me perhaps than any hippie ever has here. It is, IT IS A. Total mess, but they tend to it every day as if it is not as if it is an organized beautiful Gordon it is mostly weeds and Scheidt. It looks awful. It's insanity. We got a couple. We've got a couple of next door, my literal next door neighbor. I. Don't know what they're deal is. I, guess I sort of know. There's a car that is regularly part in the front of their house in the license plate is a vanity plate unfortunately. And it reads massage. Now to go with that car and the license plate that says massage. This couple has put. Security cameras all around their house. There is one in every single corner. There's one in front of the garage, the front door to on the back one on the side of the House one of them's actually pointed directly into my yard. In at one point, there was like this awkward thing where I noticed him like turning it away from my yard because I was in my backyard like smoking weed while he was back there tinkering with the camera. Anyway. It doesn't matter the point. Is this forever? They were just the weird neighbors with cameras to me, and I was like they definitely sell drugs or something. And then I found out about massage thing and I was like well. That makes sense. You need the cameras who knows, but then all all in all. It's just a whole weird day. then. We've got this guy like three houses down. WHO has a TACO truck parked in front of his house, but it's not an operating Taco truck. And it's the same dude i. told the story on the show, but when I bought this house, he actually awkwardly like half threatened to me when I moved in, he was like. Yes, it's really Nice neighborhood. We want to keep it that way. And I was like. What. And this dude walks his dog like it's the most important job anyone has ever done. Like? He could not be more serious walking his dog zero relaxation. No casualness his dog walking total psycho, so I've got a neighborhood filled with people like this in a city that prides itself on keeping, Austin Weird and yet I am the standout Weirdo. How is that? Why is that? We'll give you the reasons. The way address is probably number one. And this is something that on my birthday, a couple of weeks ago. On June seventh. Twenty two days ago, I spent a great deal of time thinking about. I was like. Is it okay them? Thirty three year old man, who was t shirts everyday and hasn't put on a button-down. Since the last wedding he attended, which was at least a couple of years ago. Like, is it okay that I'm not putting on a suit ever again unless someone dies? Or gets married. And even then like. Do you have a? We'd Bar at your wedding? Or you only accommodating drinkers. Just a question. That I'm asking. But, I got to this point, whereas like you just like with everything else I mean this is me addressed the way I dress because. That's the stuff I like. It makes me feel happy. It's not necessarily about anybody else. But as a result of the way I dress, people, my neighborhood or like they have no idea how old I am. I don't think they can really tell. Somewhere between twenty five and thirty five probably. But. I don't know that any of those ages would excuse like never having to dress like an adult or like a stereotypical adult. You know what I'm saying, so that's thing number one the way that I dress sneakers, joggers or shorts and a tee shirt every day. Is like thing number one. Because nobody in my neighborhood dresses like me. That's one thing to keep in mind. You Picture Austin you picture. This city filled with Douche bags dressed like me. That is not the case at all. It's not. Now really. Next is my car situation. The two thousand five silver. Lexus has been sitting in the driveway for months and hasn't moved. That's not true. It has moved to the front of the house out of the driveway so I could play basketball, and then I moved it back into the driveway. That's it. What's the deal with this dude in his car while he always being picked up. By Uber's constantly are they? Uber's who knows picked up by different cars multiple times. A day dropped back off deliveries constantly, sometimes groceries sometimes Amazon sometimes from other places, sometimes very particular packages. Peculiar is the word I meant. There particularly peculiar packages. P. Why is this man playing basketball on a seven foot hoop? In, trying to windmill dunks on a Tuesday afternoon shirtless. Then going for a jog. Wrapping allowed with his headphones. And why does who is this man? Why is he sending up smoke signals from his backyard every night making the whole hood smell out as a result. Is because this is who I am. I'm the weird guy in the neighborhood. There is no wife here. There are no children. Just me. Smoking Weed. Dress like a fourteen year old Japanese high beast. dunking shirtless on a lowered rim. I, also I might add. What I've started doing is Tony Soprano scaring the shit out of like you know how you seen that episode of Sopranos. If you haven't watched apprentice immediately, Tony is lifting weights in his basement, doing bench press, and he's screaming and scaring the shit out of his neighbors, just pumping iron his basement. It shows one of his neighbors like reacting to that. That's me but with sex. Moving on RB threes threes brought to you by liquid, IV staying hydrated throughout. The day can be a real pain in the ASS, right? You Lose Your Cup. You never had a cup to begin with. Life is hard. You're busy. How many times have you gone a day and been like shit that I, drinking water. Believe it or not? Dehydration occurs daily in three out of four people. 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Sleep better more energetic workouts whatever you need liquid IV DOT com. They're also on a mission to change the world by donating two point three million servings in response to cope. Nineteen products are being donated hospitals, first responders, foodbanks, veterans and active military. Look what I've also available at Costco nationwide or You can get twenty five percent off. When you go to liquid IV DOT, com use the code Ross at checkout. That's twenty five percent off anything you order when you visit Promo Code Ross Liquid Ivy Dot, com, get better hydration today at Liquid I-i've dot com Promo Code Ross. Type announcements shouts. TM readings chapters one through nine of the tea FM book. Me Reading them live on twitch. The recorded video is now available on YouTube dot com slash bowling media. If you wanted to watch me, read any of the chapters of the book, and you missed them or you WANNA tune in this upcoming Sunday for chapter ten on Sunday at nine PM. Central on twitch DOT, TV, slash boss role in guess what chapters one. One through nine youtube dot com slash bull in media. You can get caught up right there. Big shouts to everyone who tuned in when I'm live on twitch, DOT TV slash boss. Roland either reading the book playing warzone I've been mixing grand theft auto apex legends I just downloaded TROPICO. Which is a game where you play a dictator and you build an island. I used to play when I was a little kid and I found out I was forty five percent off, and it was like twelve bucks, or some Shit's through that on the card. Twitch DOT TV slash boss Roland listen. If fifty thousand of your will tune in then I'll fucking play NCAA two thousand fourteen if that's what it takes. I'm kidding, but seriously. I segment. Hotline Calls! You know the number. It's eight eight eight W. R. B. O. L. E. N.. Eight, WR, Bolan you dial it? You ask a question. Lee Hypothetical throw a take at me? Sing a song whatever you need. Throw it down on the hotline. Two minute limit on the call two minute limit. That's one hundred twenty seconds. Be Clear. Visa Sankt. Do what you do, get in, get out eight eight eight wr bowl and I've picked one to looks like we've got three calls today FAM-. Here's your first. Ross my name out of this, but I just case you put it on. I just wanted to thank you. this fall of my freshman year of College I dealt with a lot of depression before I'd never had panic attacks. I. dealt with a very toxic relationship in college, and was dealing with the physical and emotional and mental stress of playing. You Know D. One sport. I. Cry I remember the first time it happened I wasn't one hundred percent sure like what the fuck was going on, and it just made me. Think of I can't remember yet. Wish said it was that you know I. Mean there's there's been multiple He basically explained what panic attack attack is and how fell in like how to have stop it. And I think I mean with out that one. I wouldn't know what the fuck was going on, and to never would have known how to deal with So thank you realize what you do for so many people mental. Health Wise Gang Gang. Gangs Jeffrey I've seen did not kill himself. Don't forget having great one space. Thank you man, thank you for calling. It means a lot and I think at this point. We've already gotten the picture. That mental health is an incredibly important part of life that far too many of us. Take for granted far too many of us. Don't take seriously enough and I certainly consider myself to have fallen Party to that before in my life and I understand the thank yous and I i. get that decent. I understand that it isn't easy to do. What I do! An open up about this stuff publicly regularly. But again I would contend goes both ways, and I want to speak to that a little bit more now because it's something I've thought about over the last several days a lot as this last several days has been some of the toughest. I have faced mentally in years. And something happened. It doesn't really matter what, but it really made. Everything I've endured the past several months final. It really put a punctuation mark on Shit, which created another phase of acceptance, and like moving on and mental readjustment for me, and it was right after I went down on my dosage to try to combat the side effects I was experiencing with my medication, combating depression and panic, disorder and then. Obviously. The world is a vampire right now. I had to avoid social media some this past several days. Give myself some space from everything happening and honestly. The things that ended up grounding me. It was love. Love from from people around me, and then it was connecting with people. Listening to your calls in reading your e mails. It serves as this massive point of connection for me. Because my biggest struggle every day with mental health and my own health is that I tweet out as often as I can remember to. You are not alone for reasons because I feel so alone. I feel utterly and completely alone when I have my when I have my issues, mental health wise, and it's it's not only inaccurate in a self. taught lie. I have proven it to be so. Because when I read jobs emails and listen to your calls, and and we tweet at each other and I'm on twitch. We discussed in and. Like. It makes me feel better. When you all open with me. It makes me feel better, so that's why I continue to be open about the things I'm open about because when you're open, it makes me feel better so I. Know How it works because you do it for me, too. So thank you. Because it. I know it's not easy. I know it's not easy for y'all call in and share your personal shit. But it means the fucking world to me. I wish I could express how much it means to me. But the way you feel. This show is helped you just I. Promise you it. It's the same way back in sometimes I was talking to my mom about this earlier in the week to. It's like it can't be heavy for me. It can be a little heavy I. mean you know Dude? For. The first one hundred episodes I. Anytime you want. And I'll get back to you so I get thousands of direct messages from people still people that have just found the show or recently started or whatever. That are going back through those episodes like they don't realize my inbox or my a fucking nightmare at this point, but. That's heavy that I can't get to everybody. Because nobody should have to feel that way. Nobody should have to feel alone. and. That's why it's so important. Did y'all do this? Should to the you talk to your people? Can't just be a two way street between. Me and you on the podcast and we have to be able to do it in the real world too and I'm GonNa look for more ways to do that locally here. In the future, it's something that I very much intent on doing locally as much as I can, and then hopefully one day more nationally and internationally, or whatever that looks like, but I mean with an actual organization. At some point, I will found something that is specifically only for mental health purposes is just right now to focus on building this business I so that I can get to the place where I have enough influence to be able to pull something like that off. And in the meantime we gotta work together so I'M GONNA. Keep doing what I do because is what I do, and it's the only way not survive at this point. But I need I need more help from y'all to and we're GONNA. Get to this a little bit later in the show as well. 'cause I have a segment at the end I'm doing a little call out for you all but. I want to hear from more of you with Shit like this. Not just for selfish reasons, because I know that every time it makes me feel not alone that it makes thousands of people who hear your voices on the hotline, thousands and thousands and thousands of people listening to the show. Get that side effect. That's important to me I. Don't WanNa just share laughs and and laugh about dumb shit. That's fine too I love laughing in dumb ass shit. It's just we have to. There has to it. We have to maintain that purpose. I. It's not an option. It's not really like a decision. It's a thing I have to do so. Please keep calling eight eight eight wr. Bolan here's call number two. Raw Power Virginia listening to three or four at the end. You voiced concerns about shin-splints. My Guy Played College across. There is no fucking way if you can get rid of Shin splints without just have taken all like you gotta get your legs. We go the whole fall. Kids the GNARLIEST since sprints since splints. Way It goes away winter break. You lay off from the only you can do also use ice cops that does help but Yeah honestly. You KINDA fucked, not department Going to say Gang Gang Gang, you kill himself. Don't forget. shin-splints. You're Kinda fucked? Here's the thing. Yes, I agree with you for the most part you do. If you have shin-splints, you just gotTa. Get off your legs right and you gotta take a break, and like I, sure legs and Shit. Yes, okay fine I get that! But the thing for me I went ahead and got new shoes. Because I realized it had been several months since I had up on running shoes and I'd been switching between these two pairs that I figured like I'm good. It's two pairs. Well. They both got worn down, and that was a big part of the puzzle for me so like my new shoes I went, ran today and yesterday notion splints. Okay. It's curious to me as a guy. Would chicken legs HASHTAG CO PM? Do humans with meet on their legs, like Dr have like bad ass, like man, cavs or like Babes, with really hot smoking, hot calves, thighs, and Shit d all have the august Shin splints, or is it just? twig legged fucks who have no? Shock to absorb the the road. There's no meat to absorb that shock from the road. It just goes straight leg. Gone up the bone, you know. By the way ending the call with an Epstein didn't kill himself as such Joe Rogan move that someone literally owes me one hundred million dollars right now. Somebody give me one hundred million dollars. Next and final call. Hey Ron. My name is Natalia on from Jacksonville Florida and I heard I'm listening to another one bites the dust right now and I was listening and I heard. You say that you want us to call in and tell something good. for father's day well. I think I'm driving some Florida to Montana I just quit my job and. I let everything at home I said fuck it. I took this job in Montana, and Yellowstone National Park and I'm going to yellowstone. National Park to get paid to be a fucking fishing God I what I do for fun, and you're telling me. I get to get paid to do it and teach people how to do it. Like. That good news I'm. So fucking ecstatic, I'm thrilled. Yeah. Days to will the bowling. Bowl. Booking Jacksonville Florida to Yellowstone National Fucking Park Baby. Let's go. Fishing fishing guide. Let's fucking go what I say. What I say, you're the comeback. In Italia. Says Fuck it I'm out. Chunks deuce. GETS JOB as efficient guy to yellowstone national park. And she did it for you. Dad Happy Continued Father's Day Dad. For Real though it's funny to me. There is something about that move. That I have so much respect for like that I'm so envious of in a way. It's like I think all of us deep down. Has that like what if I did just go? Do what the fuck I wanted to do. Sort of thing you know, and fortunately for me. In my case, I've actually just sort of fallen directly into that. This is my fishing. This is my fishing guide. Like so. It's not only that it gives me a ton of pleasure to hear the people like just chasing their fucking passion, but it's also. I never had to do that so I don't have it. Just I got lucky. Okay? Frankly, I'm incredibly fortunate that I was. God whatever you want to believe in my case, it's that I. Believe God put me in a position to where this just unfolded the way it did. I just had to like stay on the ride. Not Fall off and it took me here. And I'm very very very grateful for that and I will spend the rest of my fucking life making sure that I pay that forward. But for so many people, it's a huge struggle where you don't feel this sense of purpose, and it's like. Why am I here? What the fuck of my doing I hate my job or I hate this or that or like for for these things that we're just. We feel like we're in good that are ingrained in us. They're like grooves. We slide into at the beginning of our lives, and we never stopped to check and even see. Why did I start going this direction or like? Ask the questions. There's too much of that Spain our country especially, because of it is a side effect of. A blessed nation frankly. Like the the the opportunities at this country affords people. Also plagues them with more shit in a in a in a does in a way like. Because it makes it easy to forget what matters. In, and it really does we. We spent a lot of time talking about this towards inte- last year. Like money over morals, too many of us pick money, but it's not just morals. It's just in general. We pick money over fucking everything. It's like I. Always had this dream of like. You're not I. Love Oh. My people in my family, my friends, but it's not that it's like the dream breaking away from like the system like the road. You know you have to go down. And I think most people just end up going down. Some of US get lucky in fall the fuck off that road into a ditch that it turns out. We're supposed to be in. Filled with gold. But in some of us. You gotta take it. You gotta say Fuck It. I'm going to yellowstone national park becoming a fucking fishing guide. Like yellow is the lamest thing you could say a human being. But also it's one of the most important things you could probably remember as a human being. Like. You'RE GONNA. fucking die one day, DUDE! You're going to be buried in the ground, or they're going to set your body on fire until you turn into ash, put you in a little earn, and set you WANNA counter for the grandkids to look at. It. You're gonNA feel like such a dumb ass that you didn't go do the thing. And it doesn't have to be dramatic increase. I'm not saying Oh, everybody to quit their jobs and go become a fishing guide, fucking care for the pandas in China or whatever like look? NOT, everybody gets to go that route, but it can be a smaller version of this. It can be in the form of something after hours. That's not part of your nine to five like I. Say this all the time, but a lot of us look. We gotta do nine to five grind with shit that we don't like and grind side-hustle. We should that we do love in the really matters to us. That is a fucking way that a lot of people have to go. It's it's I don't even want to say it's unfortunate. It's just the way it's the way it's fucking. Built. But you've got to find joy and purpose. And if that means some crazy shit. Taking a fucking swing and becoming a fishing guide in Yosemite National Park in the midst of an international pandemic, because it's the year, the fucking comeback and yellow, then so be it. Next segment rvp throw. Night is also brought to you by quip. Makers of the greatest toothbrush, oral care products, and all the land longtime supporter of this podcast I do not know about you, but my morning routine has certainly changed recently so more than ever. It's important that when I'm brushing I brush effectively. Lot of us are stuck at home. You're working from home or we're spending way more time at home than we used to. We might as well make sure we have good breath and shiny teeth for when we pop back out into the eventual world that inevitably will be waiting for us. Having new brush heads, toothpaste and flaws automatically delivered to the house when I needed is so huge. That's why love quipped so much. My brush heads never get worn out. Never become crappier credit. I never run out of toothpaste or FLOSS, and after every brushing session. Thanks to the two minute timer buzzes every thirty seconds to ensure a full in even clean I feel like I. Just thought the dam dentist. Dentist seventy five percent of old worn out bristles that are ineffective and even more people forget to floss daily. Sad, not me, not as buddy, not with quip. Good Health starts with good habits. Quick makes it easy, but delivering all the oral care essentials you need to brush and floss better. Quick Brush, heads, toothpaste and flaws. refills automatically delivered on a dentist recommended schedule every three months for just five dollars each a friendly reminder when it's time for a refresh to stay committed to your world, health shipping is free join over three million happy customers in practice, good oral care easily and affordably with quip, starting at twenty five dollars, and if you go to get quip dot, com slash rvp. You'll get your first refill free. That I refill F. R. E., E. AT GE TQ Ip dot com slash rby. GET QUIP DOT COM SLASH IBP free. Refill your first one. The Good Habits Company. Now next segment. Bad Ass vets you haven't heard of. Samo, O'hare still working on the theme music by the way. If you're a veteran, go back and listen to what to ninety five episode ninety five. I'm going off memory. I hope that's right. Please, be right if you're a veteran. Goal is in episode. Two thousand five Samo haired the musician whose made our theme song he wants. He's working on a theme song for bad as that you haven't heard of, and he wants veterans to call in and do some specific things that you need you to do so so. Hollered Sam via that episode. But today's bad ass vet. You haven't heard of William. Harvey Carney. Bill Carney has calling us an American soldier during the civil war. But, he was born as a slave. But due to his service in the civil war, he was awarded the Medal of honor. But he wasn't awarded the Medal of honor until nineteen hundred. For an act that he committed in eighteen, sixty three. How wild does that? Listen to this shit. It's the battle of Fort Wagner. It's eighteen sixty three. The color guard the dude carrying the US flag. Is Killed in the battle. So Bill Carney the way nobody even knows how he got his freedom. It's rumored that he either escaped through the underground railroad, and joined his father in Massachusetts, other members of their family were freed by purchase or by death of their master, so it's unclear uncertain. Bill Carney got his freedom, but he ends up in the civil war. The Color Guard goes down. In Carney's like nope retrieves the US flag and marches forward with it despite serious wounds. What I'm telling you? Is that fucking Mel Gibson in the Patriot? He Jacked Bill Carney swag. That is what I'm telling you. Union troops forced to retreat under fire. The dude struggles back across the battlefield of eventually returning to his own lines, and turning over the colors to another survivor of the fifty fourth saying quote boys I only did my duty. The old flag touched the ground. Their stories like this from throughout history. That I'm that I'm in love. Like not only. Is it that we'll never know how accurate that is? It's also just that it's like I I will never know if it was used in some way to actually be bullshit, fucking propaganda, regarding the American flag. Maybe, it was literally true. Exactly, this happened. It's it's entirely possibly the way. We live in now is far more complicated. Then eight, hundred sixty three was. There was no progressive movement outside of the actual literal tearing of the country in half. And even that was fucking shoddy. By the way you ever want to have your mind melted. Go Look Up. How many people died in the civil war? I know we all learned this in school in the day we learn it. We're all like holy fuck hell, but dude. The numbers are staggering. Staggering! What a disaster! Hundreds of thousands of American lives wiped from the face of the year. Do the internal conflict. And you got bill Carney shaggy asks across the battlefield to keep the fucking flag from even touching the ground. Let that sink in. He was born a slave. bonkers the action for which he received the Medal of honor. It actually preceded any other African American medal of honor recipient. But his medal was actually one of the very last to be awarded for civil war service. Like African Americans received the Medal of honor as early as April eighteen, sixty five, his was awarded in Nineteen, ninety. But, his action preceded any other African American medal of honor recipient, which in some cases has some incorrectly listed? Bill Carney William Harvey Carney as the first ever African American Medal of honor recipient, which is actually inaccurate. Although, his I'm not not to take away from it at all. The point is his action. Proceeded any other African? American Medal of honor recipient, which is wild. His citation on his medal of honor reads. When the coach sergeant was shot down, this soldier grasped. The flag led the way to the Para Para pay. Per Rep for God p. a. r. a.. And planted the colours they're on when the troops still back, he brought off the flag under a fierce fire, in which he was twice severely wounded. After his discharge bill. Carney returned to new Bedford Massachusetts. He took a job maintaining the city. streetlights delivered mail for thirty two years was a finding vice founding vice president of the new Bedford Branch eighteen of the National Association of letter carriers, back in one, thousand, nine hundred, and then he married Susanna Williams. They had a daughter Clara Ho Harania. I believe it is pronounced. died at the Boston city hospital on December nine, nine, thousand, nine, hundred, eight of complications from an elevator accident at the Massachusetts State House where he worked for the Department of State. His body lay in repose for one day at the undertaking rooms at Walden banks, one hundred and forty two Lenox, street at the wish of his wife and daughter, and then he was buried in the family plot at Oak Grove. Cemetery in new Bedford Massachusetts engraved on. His tombstone is an image. Of the Medal of honor, And that you're bad ass. You haven't heard of for this week. William Harvey Carney otherwise known as Bill Carney to me. As bills we can throw that tag on whoever we want. Any. You Name William. I can call you bill if I want doesn't matter if you go by it. We're both Williams. We're in the bill club like it or not. We got a great one here Bill Corny! Next segment. Chicken leg pride month, rant. Look. It's June. In about three junes ago. Many many moons ago, maybe was to Jones. Nobody's nobody's share. Could easily. Fact checked I invented something. I'm an inventor as well as a podcast door, and an author of a novel, and what I invented is called chicken leg pride month. And I invented this because I am a person. With chicken legs. and. Not, only in my person with chicken legs, I'm a person who felt great shame over his chicken legs for many many years. You have had them my whole life. I was born this way. My legs are like twigs. There is no muscle. There is no definition. There is no meat. They're actually quite pretty and would probably look lovely on a on a on a woman. But I'm a six to thirty year old Harry man very hairy men. With twig legs, and in generally twiggy figure in general, which might might my point is is my chicken. Legs are more severe than most. There are malnourished children with better cavs than me. Not like a joke! It's like a fact. I decided well. My birthday's in June. June is kind of the beginning of the really hot summer in Texas where where where I live on born and raised Houston Texas and the now I live in. Austin Texas. which finally people are starting to get the hang up finally. Lets people hitting me up asking me for restaurant recommendations in Houston like how shopping worship? I haven't been there since two thousand fucking six. What do you want me to do? Call my dad and then call you back. He doesn't know he's an old guy de. He doesn't give a shit about the neighborhoods I'm just kidding, does and he knows. But I decided like. It would look I just came to a point where for so many years when I was younger? I looked legit did get made fun of a lot for having really really skinny legs, and it was something that I used to have like this I was I, had self self esteem issue with right? I was self conscious about my legs. and. In Texas, it was unavoidable Bro, so you have to wear shorts in the summer. It's too hot. I know somebody off from other states like shorts. What the Fuck is wrong with? You Dude! Okay. Come down here then. Let's see how you bitch you fucking debt. It sucks. You have to wear shorts. It gets too hot. And if you're in Houston, it's too humid, but you have to put on shorts or you will die. Pick on shorts and show off your disgusting legs, or in my case, just very pretty skinny. Or. Death I pick the legs the stems show them off. That's what she can let. Pride month is all about. It's about embracing the chicken leg. In you. And me. In by that I mean if you have chicken legs by. Don't be ashamed. Wear shorts almost every fucking day now. I realize if you're at the office and you have to wear pants or whatever? That's fine, but when you go home, you wear shorts when you go to the grocery shorts when you step onto the front yard. If that's the only thing you were allowed to do, because you're cities so stricken with covert that you can't fucking leave then you wear shorts. Because you need to be proud of those stems. By God. Do you know what the opposite is? It's KANGOLS. Do! You wish you had that friend. Know what we were given as a gift. You know easily, I can slide between fucking chairs and shit with these twigs. fucking other people haven't asked people to. Oh, excuse me, excuse me, not me, baby. It's like. It's like that. What is that a cartoon with the chicken? Family Guy. They're making fun of some actress who probably extremely offensive and I'm sure she dealt with the eating disorder at some point, but she turned sideways and falls through a crack in the stage. That's me. With, my chicks sliding between movie, theater, rows and seats and fucking. You don't even know I. was there other people that they went? And did you hold? Drink would be knocked over popcorn. Everywhere dam disaster. They have to turn off the fucking movie. Turn the lights on. Call an ambulance me. You don't even know I was there I'm in? I'm out my chicken legs. Don't even fucking raise the sides. It's like that fucking operation game. You played as a kid except my legs. And everything else in the world and I never touch a single thing with them. That's how sly I am because. You're not looking at it the right way. Chicken leg pride. June is generally problem is all about embracing your silly skinny ridiculously thin? comically lacking in half definition, LEGS In loving them massage, them reached out right now. Touch your fucking legs. There's not much there. But by God. To beautiful in. Don't let anybody tell you differently obviously. This has been more important to focus on other things actual injustices. And much more important issues. But we couldn't go the whole month without saying anything about chicken leg pride month. It's a pivotal part of this show. And my life in, frankly, if I don't speak to it than I. Get self conscious again so here we are. This was your chicken leg pride month rent for twenty twenty. Hopefully next year. The world isn't a place where we can better appreciate each other and intern turn. PM But for this year it was it would look. This was not arguing. Skinny leg people. If you were sad about June, not getting as much shine this year. Let it go! Next year next year we'll do a bigger chicken leg pride month. If things are the way they need to be, but until other things get the focus, they deserve. Obviously. We're not going to pull away from that with some silliness so. Skinny, leg people I love you. I'm here for you. I got my legs out all day every day. Man I've been wearing short shorts running around this neighborhood. I look silliest hell. People are intimidated. Fuck to think. Dudes are disgusted by me and they wish they could rub oil on my legs. COP next month. Next year next segment. or VP, impact initiative call. y'All know if you you're on where we've been doing this segment. Recurring segment called the impact initiative and we share stories from the RVP game. The form of emails voicemails, etc, and I've been getting more and more of these e mails recently I. Don't know if the show like an uptick in listenership or what I don't really check the numbers that often, but a ton of people must have been listening to the older episodes where we did this. The impact initiative call out because I've been getting so many more emails. And I think it stirred backup when my dad sort of asked for that like a good stories from people that they have going on right now or whatever? We gotTA Hotline Call From Natalia Today about one of those. And we've shared a few other on other episodes. It's SORTA like brought back up that sort of. Same Vein for people right like they wanted to. There's some people want positively right now. And people want to connect with each other on a level because it's, it's fucking scary out there and shit sucks, and it's. It's just the reality of it for all of us. A little bit. Crappy in terms of this year's gone. About as poor as it could've? On an international scale. I mean for Real, so we all feel that. On God even if it's not because you want to like, you're trying to get on the show. Just send me your story man about what brought you to the podcast or what you've gotten out of it or what you like from it or what you wish we did more of or whatever hit me with your impact initiative. Emails your voicemails. You stories about anxiety about mental health, your personal struggles through depression, suicidal thoughts eating disorders all that Shit, Holler at me, because guess what same thing I said earlier. It's important because other people need to hear it. You don't have to share your name if you don't WanNA share your name. That's totally cool. You just say Ross plea. My name out, or I'm not going to provide you with the name either way works. I will not out you if you do not want to be outed. RVP IMPACT Initiative. Share your stories so that I can share them with other people, and as a result we can all be less alone I'll pick an episode in the next few weeks to focus entirely on our impact initiative I just wanted to do one more call out quickly to get more of your hitting me and my emails because I'm telling you it's not. It's like fucking piece of candy to me. Now like a piece of Candy Piece of Candy. I live for this shit. Is What gets me through my day. So Holly. Ross at Ross Bowl in podcast dot. com is my email Ross at Ross Bohlin. PODCASTS DOT com make the subject our VP impact initiative and tell me your story. That is all I ask. Before you head out to take on the world. It's time for some very important announcements. You've been saddled with three legal obligations as a result of having listened entire podcast first and foremost you must review. Apple podcasts. Rate and review on Apple podcast. If you listen on spotify, I love you if you're listening on Soundcloud, that's dope if you watch on Youtube whatever. Rate and review on Apple PODCASTS. Number to. Tell one person, a friend or family member worker neighbor share the show with one individual this week. Any one person you think might like the Rosebowl and podcast share it with them that your second legal obligation you can check that box and move on to number three, which is to use those sponsor codes. Today's sponsors were liquid IV. Liquid Ivy Dot Com Promo, Code Ross and of course quip, get quip dot com slash our VP support our sponsors. They support us. Keep the lights on. Keep in business other than everybody unpatriotic dot com slash Ross Bohlin podcast. That's how bowling media makes money. That's how we do what we do. That's how we're hiring. Employees Starts July thirteenth. So use those sponsor codes. Get on Patriot on follows on instagram at the Rose Bowl in podcast on twitter at Ross Bohlin pod. And if you're a middle aged onto one of our listeners, find us on facebook. Follow me, Ross Bowling on twitter, instagram and snapchat at W.. R. Bolan at W., R. B., O. L. E. N.. Go to twitch DOT TV. Slash boss. Roland Watch me play video. Games Checkout bullying media's television and film podcast, wasters, clams, and cockles available wherever our VP is available, and that will do it for P. Three. Produced remotely by Mike Moody. We'll be. Okay kid or be three one zero coming Monday Wednesday. Not when not Monday rb three ten coming Wednesday. Wednesday. Patriot dot com slash Roz bowl and podcast AD free Friday episode, coming Friday, as always. You're not alone. Potman gets paid respect Mr Park strengthen on honor, gang gang gang, peace be with you and also with you. Go, low baby!
255 - Live at the Chevalier Theater in Medford, MA - Late Show (2018)
"This is exactly right. Early show didn't stand late. Show resume wooden girl rose so it was so sweet and then she turned around and saw that no one else's but she sat down is the best. I felt i felt it. It was the best strongest ovationhair from the loneliest. It's my greatest fear to stand up in front of people who i assume are standing actually are sitting and staring at my ass. That's probably in the top three. What are the other ones of course moss in a box and everything that's happening today but other than that we're all together. That's what's important. They are late show late show by as we were walking up the stairs. Vince is blocking us to the stage and he goes remember. They've been drinking since five. That's right so have we. I mean look. I couldn't stay on the wagon for too long seventeen. Years is quite some time. Shaking is one of our best new bit. Let's see yeah. We did that guy. If you some you may have been here. But the shell at the end of the show. We had a wedding proposal of marriage. Wedding proposal of mareo she was. It wasn't just any wedding proposal. It was of marriage marriage. And not only that if you follow the my favorite murder out of context twitter feed. It's the people that run that it's that couple. We brought them a- said thanks so much for doing that. They told us the story behind it so cute. They didn't highschool broke up. Lead their lives matt again and i was like. I wonder which ones going to propose. She was shaking so much really and was going to do. You don't take that much not know what's going to happen. And then she said since. I'm broke and pulled a ring pop out song it was. I almost gave her my My mind but it's probably cost less than the ring. That's not insulting events because oh it's not the good one. I guess. I need a wedding ring after we got married. We everything about that gesture saw. I know it didn't mean it that way but there. It is but there was laying on the floor with the road that we brought him home. This is my favorite murder by the pod. Karen kill gareth. This is georgia hard star sake. Thank you were in new york all week. We saw ones me completely make good man and from her hotel yesterday just the one thankfully just one citing thankfully it was only him. And that's good luck. I think one in la. It's if you see angeline lady in pink car that's good and then new york just a fully nude man at night on the sidewalk in front of the hotel that you're about to have to walk through good luck. Good luck. yes that happened. That really happened to and i flashed you if you were. Were here for the show before this. You'll know that. I walked out of the elevator. Knowing who's going to be waiting for me. So i could give her her bag. And that moment. I was like no i'm gonna do. I don't have sleeves on my dress. Pulled it down to my tits. Lucked out of the at midnight on a saturday saturday on a friday night midnight friday night new york city hotel and georgia rolls the fucking dice and hums out topless. Anyone could instead either way. It's a great story. I mean could have even been a better story if there was just a group of businessmen. Stand there talking about the dow jones industrial average. And then i'll bet on you know. And then i was right and then also johnny bet on red in the dow jones. Definitely yes. i think it's it's green and purple and pink and red and then you just bat and they can make friends for me visually. It was shocking. Not not because georgia was topless. Because she's done that. Fun trick to me. Several times surprised nakedness. I highly recommend it as a joke. Also she makes her eyes go like three times wider than i've ever seen them so there's lots to look at us like what's this. How are we doing that. What's it's just a it's the it's the embodiment of surprise. But also that little dress you have. It's like a sundress sundress. An elastic at the top and she just had it right underneath her. So it's kind of like how you do in office shoulder. You have your choice. You're like i dunno. Go off the shoulder. She just like. I'm going to go down here today. Just gonna make it like back and sometimes you have to pick your own my bed. We have to do hallway. Bids stevens not here. Everybody i know he's taking care of my go-to stop hating me doing a great job. Lots of photos. Yes he always does such a good. He dedicates himself to the care of your cats. I think he's figured out. He got a new app or something because now he's he's got a photo of them and then and then hearts appear around. A little song comes on if i if i hit the loud thing on which i never do. I thought you were going to say that. He had cat ears and let cap face on the cats. Kathy's out for cats. You love cats so much. Could an extra kathy based on your cats fade. It'll be great. Is that the end of that. And do that really was really wasn't anything it wasn't is late show. You don't get darning. Strongest anecdotes has an elvis shirt on. Even an elvis shirt on. Now don't you. She did the brief thing and stood right. Chill on your hands by the way. That's why i'm touching her so much also because we're working at our news. Cirque du soleil read just weirdly. Pull each other to the side as the opening of the show we had. We just did a show. And then we do the meet-and-greet actor it's one hundred people hugging and smiling and it's really lovely and then both of us go back. We're not old ladies and yeah both of us. Go back into the green room and just do these stretch. Because both my hips my plantar fassa. It's real sad very. There's a lot of grunting and brian and it's not like this. Is sports strenuous any anything at all hard. There's five minutes is standing. And then there's an hour of sitting and we're like well. How do we get another. No one's ever thrown their backout from hugging people. Before and yet we had a girl meet and greet who said she was went really fast to me walking and she goes my psychic. Italian grandmother knows who killed jon. Benet as she walked away. Got here right now. She goes here and goes she's psychic. And she goes she's a psychic nutritionist. And then fucking walked away nutritionist. I can tell you eight fucking whatever for breakfast. She's like stop with the carbs already. You don't have to be a psychic really. That's a bit of a scam psychic. Nutritious true. I don't know it feels like you're eating into on guard. I don't know why. I feel like you eat chocolate in crumble and hotel. It seems like you lay down all the time. I feel like you ate. Mcdonald's is in a new york hotel. And you're like oh no sorry. Those i burp. I'm so sorry you're not psychic. I have i'm repeating. Should we sit down. Yes tonight's table was brought to you in miniature. No we haven't grown in size able has shrimp magic show it is. I wonder if they use this when they were here for. The recent price is right. Live was a fucking thing i mean i know the price is right is live to begin with taped. Live life been. Yeah so much fucking fun. And i hate everything and it was like drew. Carey was amazing and a dream. It was lovely and did you. You didn't get to run on down back now. You have to be like fun and exciting to be like six the fucking morning and they interview yesterday like dancing poet for my job right now. I'm here and i'm just not what would you say. I'll be announcer don pardo. I can't remember who it is. And then you do the cameras to go like this and then the next contest and low prices very come on down georgia heart star. Sorry i'm so sorry no you should be you. Should you should go. Go go for me. I'm the director cut go again. We're gonna take that again else. Okay now you do it all day. And the next contestant on the right is karen kill come on a i would straight up. Deny i would never be there in the first place. This is a this is the late show. Yeah it is thank you. This is also a true crime. Comedy podcasts before we get started thank you so you know. We always like to run that down for people. Asking people don't know it's true. There's people who are brought to this show by other people against their will and against their better judgement meet-and-greet line they were like three people. Were like so happy and hugging and learn. One woman is just like i guess and the girl because this is my aunt. She thought she was coming to a murder mystery show. She thought we were going to solve the murders. The end of the show. They live to her. And i was kind of looking areas like sorry into win them all. I mean it kind of is. It's like a mystery how this has happened we had in the. This is my my favorite moment happening. In my brain ingredient new york there was a girl who was a we. Call them drag along shoes. A drag never call them up before. But i love it drag along that thing we say all the time and have t shirts of so the drag along was like it was that thing. She was like i brought her. It's my birthday. Or whatever i turned around i was like. Did you find. She was like all right all right. Well okay and then she starts explaining how this friend of hers is so obsessed that every time they get into the car she makes them. Listen to the podcast. And she goes. And i'm like sitting in the call. Like what are we gonna listen to talking. She's fucking rice she's right. Don't make your friends listen to talking. You're supposed to do it with your friend. And then when they're not they're do it with your other friends but i turn. Are you ready to listen to some talking. Good your first. This time i was. I last time i didn't do the full explanation. So if you're here you've never seen this show before to true crime. Comedy podcasts kind of a difficult combination. Sometimes if people aren't used to this setup moore's obviously terrible thing it's very dark and it's very tragic and we are not laughing at the fact that keeps people kill other people. There's nothing funny about it. But in the way that we have the conversation about it because of our personalities and the way we talk to each other. We're funny to each other about the things talking about. It's a complex kind of layered experience. We say this is the top of every you guys know this by heart by now but just for the people who don't know if you don't like it get the fuck out is essentially. That's all i'm saying. That's all get fresh premeasured ingredients mouth-watering seasonal recipes delivered right to your door with hellofresh america's number one meal kit hellofresh. Lets you skip those trips to the grocery store and makes home cooking. Easy fun and affordable. 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You also get a sixty day risk-free trial so there's nothing to lose visit simplisafe dot com slash faith for your free security camera today simplisafe dot com slash faith a and now. I'm going to do the legend of lizzie. Borden has hot. remind suppose to. We'll do it fast. let me go i. I only have one photo at the end. I can't follow that you shit. It's not no no. I don't want to change. Don't change it. weird. Stephen comes out with a clipboard and a whistle. No you cannot change it. You've been very inaccurate about the order for years. Please don't change it okay. You go you go you go go. Go go go go. You're going to lizzie. Andrew borden true was born on july nineteenth eighteen sixty in fall river massachusetts powell river pronounced fall. River were there. I think it's fallen there. When that one came up. I was like i fucking got i fall and then river. There's no extra e. ages at the end or anything so their father was grew up kind of poor modestly he worked very hard throughout his life eventually becomes the director of textile textile. Mills is a commercial landlord. He does very well for himself. At the time of his death he was worth three hundred thousand dollars. Which today is worth how much more than three hundred thousand dollars right over. Eight million dollars so shit. My the bordon's were rich bitches up on the hill. Yeah but andrew the father. I'm going to call him. Andy was a cheap bastard. He even though families of means of the day all had electricity and indoor plumbing basics right as we call them andy was like we don't need that. We know you can't try it once. We flush the toilet one time in your life. You're like wow. They're all while this is incredible. I can't go without poor. Lizzy is out in the outhouse with a candle. I really hate my life. She's an older sister named emma and they're raised very religious and lizzy belongs to lots of fun clubs like the endeavour society of women's christian. Temperance union fucking do not party at all the whole now of it. They don't spike that holy water. Nah ever now no spiking holy water it. Should you just go like this with it unless you spike it with fucking acid. Then you're like. Oh my god jesus. My boyfriend love him. You're gonna go see dave matthews with my boyfriend. Jesus finally so no okay. When she's three years old lizzy and emma's mom dies. Or i should say liz inside her father remarries. A woman named abby frame lizzie and her sister. Never call abby mom or mother they call her missus borden cause they her fucking god even at three years old or i guess older will as i guess as they grew up. Yeah once they learn how to give shade. They were like oh. I know how to be very lightly rude to you all day every day for the rest of your life. Wow we're gonna keep it formal. They both believe that. Abby only married their father for his money so they're not into it. Okay so we're going to cut you. It's the end of july eighteen. Ninety two k. lizzy is unmarried thirty two year. Old sunday schoolteacher. Who don't forget belongs to the women's christian temperance union. Those crazy ladies fly mary. When you got your bitch. Oh can we pull up the first picture I'm not sure. Oh yes so. Here's their home him millionaires. It's very boxy and then on the left. There's the outhouse sheesh a huge one huge pit on the other of that door cool things bleak. Then i think. Could you go to the next picture too. Because i think we've got there she is there's are star. She one hundred percent looks like a character. That hilarious trip from saturday night live would play. You know yet by surname. Yes kate mckinnon thank you yes you know. Why because kate mckinnon when she's being super funny she just crazy is like that. Yeah but lizzie. Had them all the time. Apparently look at those close cropped curl bangs that she's thing those took some work. Do i need to do that. You should do a part straight up the middle. Every time we do old stories. And i see the women's hairstyles from like long ago. It makes me panic. Like i have to have that here right now. Is that shit where you have to wrap braids up around your head like fucking heidi and walk. I mean would have. It's horrifying i think. Just what about the ones like the jane austen time were you had to do braid. Hoops like like they're like big mary. J. blige earrings but braids pulls cyrus phase instagram models. What if the jane austen look came back. Instagram models can have it. That's right and they can keep it and then gave it i do. I do like a nice high caller. The hike tight badeah just right up to choke is right up to the chin. Okay sometimes nudity is hot and then sometimes covering your entire body is also trying to wear a dress. It's all that will do it. Okay there so. Lizzie is living in her father's house. As a sunday schoolteacher thirty two years old unmarried. Nothing wrong with it. No no but back then. They called her a hag a hagit spinster. Did they know that's just my scholar. That okay okay. You can take that pitcher down of lizzie. Bit haunting inches. Like be entire time is she's looking right at me. Okay so a couple of weeks before the time about to talk about yes. I don't know how. I phrase that on the page lizzie. And her sister get into a fight with their parents their dad and step mom because they find out that the dad is giving huge amounts of real estate to abbie's family do the so they're pissed. Okay okay so then a couple days. After this big family fight the whole house will just take in violently. Ill and including their irish made maggie sullivan so abby fears that somebody may have tried to poison them because she knows that no one likes her husband including his daughters and probably their irish made most likely sounds great. Sounds like a healthy fun place in albion house with no electricity or toilet or alcohol fighting stress. Yeah no fucking alcohol. I'm sure tons of bibles. Okay so the everybody recovers but and they recovered just in time for their uncle. John moores to visit and they think he was there to discuss the property. Transfer issue okay. So it's august fourth eighteen ninety two okay and so that morning after breakfast andrew and uncle. John there in the sitting room and john decides. He's going to go into town and buy a pair of oxen. He's just like i'll be right back. I forgot i have to go pick up. A couple of oxen forgot to go to the bodega right real quick and just grab two huge oxygen and bring him back anyone wanting chou bonnie any tate's cookies. Yeah ogre just just the oxen okay. Cac he's also gonna go visit another niece fall river so he says he's going to be back at noon and andrew goes for a morning. Walk around nine. am lizzie. And emma are supposed to clean. John's guestroom because that's one of their chores chores. Thirty two and thirty four and have so much fucking money. They have a ton of money. No one will actually let them touch and they have to pee in a field would still go. Make the bed so amazon away to visit. Friends and lizzie is not anywhere to be found. So abby goes up to clean that guestroom sometime between nine and ten thirty a. m. and as she's changing the pillow cases she is struck on the side of the head just above the ear with a hatchet causing her to fall face down on the ground and then she's struck with that hatchet eighteen more times on the back of the head killing her says that the sentence turns out of kills her. Was it the seventeen somewhere around. Twelve as what i heard. Shit man i'll theory. That is what we hear. Law and order call overkill. That's right. there's a personal issue here. There's a rage issue here okay. But they don't know any of that yet because this is before police work was invented. Okay andrew gets back from his walk but the front. He goes to open the front door with front door key. it won't work so he knocks. The irish made maggie comes down. She tried to unlock the door. She finds that it's jammed and then. She claims that she heard lizzie laughing on the stairs but she looks around and she doesn't see her their knee. Where's page three there. It is fuck wise peach three after page for his nothing to nine. It's actually probably no okay. So according to lizzie she had been out in the barn looking for as we all do during the day when your lady walking around looking for a piece of iron that got lost in translation that the past hundred years so it made sense. Yes at the time. She said something specific that made sense and was like oh good right now. It's like what she was out touching pitchforks like looking for a piece of iron back then was like an innuendo changing my say tampa. Did they have. They didn't have those changing the cumbersome fucking diaper where when i got my period essentially i was out in the red tent. Okay so she's looking for iron morning ritual. You can't wake up without my iron. So when she comes back into the house she tells her father. Abby this step mother had gotten a note from a sick friend and so she left the house of gokhale on that friend and then she helps her father she. This is what she tells police later that she brings her father over to the couch and helps them pull off his boots and get settled on the couch. Because he's going to take a nap. Okay so then. She tells maggie that there's a sale at the department store. And why isn't she go. Check it out. Maggie who probably makes eleven cents. A week is like you go. Fuck yourself actually. I have to go scrub shit in an irish accent. So thank you sound like. Thank you think this lizzy barden telling medical shopping. Grandma grandpa came. I was just possessed by my psychic grandma. Okay maggie's like i actually still don't feel bad from when we all got poison last week so i'm going to go take a nap. And she goes up to her. Third floor look like an attic room and she goes and takes a nap so she is resting and she. Then here's lizzy screaming from downstairs. Maggie come quick father's dead. Somebody came in and killed him. Yeah yeah you say it all like that at once when something like that. Honey yell at magic. The father's dead get. Somebody came to the front door. it was jammed earlier. Remember sick last week. We were always no but we were all sick anyway. Somebody came in a stranger from not from fall river probably from another town. My father died. Thank you you know. There's a movie of this coming out. There's a movie coming out with khloe seventy. I believe i love her. She can be creepy as she can't she she she can do that stare. Guess she can. Oh yeah it's already out because it there's a theater critic here. We have to leave this show and go watch it immediately. Okay so a maggie comes down. She finds andrew is slumped on the couch and he has eleven hatchet wounds to the face into his face. The old face eleven. That's ten in a row and then one for good measure shit out from anger. I'm not gonna put up the picture if you're a georgia then you're going to look a picture up after the show. I was horror thinking about how to take this. Study that photo. It's not good. But here's what's interesting. It looks like a man laying on a couch and who's tried to be funny and just put a bunch of hamburger on his face. That's what it looks like. I'm not showing it to you so you can't be mad. I'm just giving. I'm just painting a picture with words. And that's what i do for a living now. Here's what's interesting when you look at that picture. That crime scene photo. You will see that. Andrew gordon has his boots on. So there's things things aren't adding up. Get your story straight lizzy. Yeah that's really our name. Don't lizzy andrew lizzy andrew. Get in here and get that story straight okay. So the details. His nose was cut off entirely. You'd think so with eleven rushes so obviously there was even more screaming after the fact and then maggie runs to get dr sadly and ironically. Now the neighbors who of course have heard intense blood. Curdling screams begin to gather at the house. Which is what everybody used to love to do it. Crime scenes back in the day. Just come in and start walking around. So lizzie goes out and she starts telling all of them. That was out sick visiting a sick friend. She basically keep talking shit to everybody as her father is laying on the couch dead. She also mentioned how the family had been poisoned the week before or that. She thought their milk was poisoned. How they'd all gotten sick at the same time so the police maggie finally brings the police back and they immediately suspect lizzie. Because and this is the thing that that happens has happened a lot they. She's not acting like a daughter whose whose father has just been murdered with a hatchet. She's very calm and cold and poised but maybe she was like that all the time. The other problem is that hurt story changes every with every police person that she talks to you so i she says she was walking into the house and then she heard a noise but then the next person she talks. She says she came in. She didn't hear anything and everything was normal until she found her father when she's asked where abby is. She tells the police that she's gone to visit the sick friend but then the next time. She's asked she changes her story and she says oh. I think she's actually upstairs. Somebody could somebody go look like can you. Can you finally go find her. I'm sick of putting on this charade. Yes so somebody else. Could you go. Look for the person i know for. A fact is alive upstairs so maggie and a neighbor lady start to walk upstairs. Don't get like halfway up the stairs. When they get level with the ground they could see into the guest room and they see abby lang dead in a pool of blood so there was probably more screaming there now. What's weird is even though. They suspect her. The police do not check lizzy clothes or hands for blood and she tells them that she needs to go lay down so they can't really the only kind of glance into her room. She won't let them into her own to look around and they're like all right. I guess that's just how it is so they do search the rest of the house and in the basement they find to hatchets two axes and then a third hatchet head with a broken handle. They think the broken one might be the murder weapon because it looks like someone tried to add dustin dirt to the blade. Try to kind of cover it up but still they take nothing from the house. There's no evidence there's no they're just like okay. Take a picture with my mind. Got it dirty hatchet. all right. See you guys later at one point. One of the officer sees lizzie and her friend alice. Russell who lives in the neighborhood go into the cellar together and they both leave the seller. But then lizzie goes into the house by herself and he thinks he sees washing something. She's like bent over the sink washing. Something he doesn't ask he doesn't look they all leave. He's like hey. I'm going to be a situation. Two days later the police they begin more thorough investigation. They just had to take a breather. Think through really takes time themselves so they start looking at all the clothing and they start inspect the hatchets and they tell lizzie. She is now officially a suspect. And at some point after this. Alice comes back over the house. And she finds lizzy. Lizzy is in the backyard burning address and clinch right. Yeah so she has lizzy. What's going on and lizzy says oh. I got some paint on this dress. So i can't wear it anymore so i'm just going to be cool about and burn stare on khloe seven years so alice gets the creeps and leaves so on august eight. They take lizzie. And the police take lizzy and for questioning her. I don't know they could have come to her house. I'm not sure if they had a police station or with is worth it go somewhere. They they take her in conceptually. I don't know where she asks. For attorney they refuse. I guess they do back then. All the rules were different. It was totally opposite ear and at one point she freaks out so that she's they have to give her a shot of morphine funds. So as you'd imagine that has that affects her testimony when they big into question her. She can't really track what she's saying and cheese contradicting herself and she's a little erratic maybe kinda sleepy. She says she was on the stairs and she says she never went up the stairs. She says she took her father's boots off. They show her the crime scene photo where his boots are on eventually. The investigators discover that the day before the murders lizzie tried to buy something called prospect acid otherwise known as cyanide at the drugstore in town but the clerk told her that she needed a prescription for my doctor says i need this my bones. It was either back then. It was either of you had an illness or ailment of any kind you either got cyanide or cocaine those choices sometimes. You'd get them together and lucking party speed ball. So there's a trial on august eleventh warrant served lisi's arrested for the murder of her parents days before the trial begins. The i find this to be so fascinating. I didn't know this before five days before the trial begins. There's another axe murderer in the area. Yes and that suspect goes to trial and convicted but the police say that the man was not in the falls river area at the time of the board and double murder. Did i say falls fall. Sorry it's very late so say he's not around but i think that's the most. What is bizarre coincidence. Copycat now okay. So borden's trial begins june of eighteen ninety three. Of course it's a media sensation. They compare it now to like it was like the oj trial of the day. It's all anybody talked about there. Were reporters in this tiny town from new york from boston. All these people packing the courtroom and so the prosecution just brings the facts. Here's the broken hatchet head that was found in the basement alice. Russell gets up testifies about lizzie. Burning the dress. there's different. There's all the places lizzy says. She was brought up all the all her conflicting stories. The lizzy maintains that she was in the barn at the time of the attacks. Witness named hyman lewinsky. I mean would we do. It was the past. He says he saw lizzy leave the barn at eleven o. Three am and charles. The gardner confirms it. I guess he doesn't have a last name at eleven. Ten lizzy called to downstairs upstairs saying that her father had been killed. So they're trying to put the time line together of where she actually was and there was a lot of dramatics in the courtroom of course and at one point when it is revealed that abby an andrews heads were removed for the autopsy lizzy faints dead away in the courtroom altogether. The trial last two weeks which is actually really short and then when the jury goes out there only out for one and a half hours and then they come back with the verdict and they find lizzie. Borden not guilty what she's acquitted of this crime. It seems like a lot of people don't know the jury found her not guilty so when she was leaving the courthouse she told the press. I am the happiest woman initially told them. I'm the happiest woman in the world. can't you tell. I'm smiling now. What's crazy is because of the wonderful children's rhyme that we all learned and the legend lizzy remained the prime suspect in everyone's mind basically to this day and she's been memorialized. Basically as an axe murderer. Why do people believe so strongly that she did it. There's lots of theories and there was lots of kind of good reasoning first of all. It's all the personal elements of the murderers that you know a hatchet to the face to the head. It's obvious somebody that had a lot of rage and want revenge or the attack was personal theorising. So obviously she could have done it for the money she had a lot. She's to inherit a ton of money from her father and clearly if he was like parsing out the millions to his new wife then that met her inheritance was getting smaller. There was also a theory. She was being physically and sexually abused by her father which would then track with the viciousness of the attack. There was also a rumor. That lizzie was having a tryst with maggie. The irish made man. That's right and then because of that Andrew and at abbey or one or the other were witness to that and they had to get rid of the witnesses but none of those proven to be true. That's just all theory and or gossip around the town so the borden sisters get their inheritance. Because she's lizzy is acquitted and after the trial. They buy a huge modern house on in the hill neighborhood of fall river. An anti fuck you suck you. Dad manner they they hire a full staff. Wow just like live. Large up in their manor house lizzie begins calling herself like a college sophomore. That goes to france for one semester. But everyone's in towns like your fucking lizzie bordon and you killed your father with forty wax of an act so get the fuck out so she is ostracized by society and then in one thousand nine hundred five her and her sister. Emma get into a fight and emma moves out of their mansion on the hill and the sisters never see each other again. Yeah so lizzie. Bordon died of pneumonia. June first one thousand nine hundred eighty seven at the age of seventy four and only a couple people attended her funeral. How her sister. Emma died nine days later that sad. They're buried next to each other now in oak grove cemetery. And that is the legend of lizzie. Borden zam for more accurate information. You can also watch the christina ricci series that was on its pretty good christina. Ricci has a really creepy stare forehead as well. She works she can work. That cost. jansher that part down the middle bang. That's someone who can work the part down the middle. It's right okay. That was great job. Thanks so much. You don't do you not think she didn't like i kind of don't care but i like the rhyme. I think it would make sense. It's such it seems like it was such an oppressive household like fathered has millions of dollars and won't get fucking electricity like just as someone who's my father would not bias atari when we were growing us and we weren't poor he just wouldn't do it on principle and then finally one christmas. He got us a used pong like machine. Which is an atari kids. Know pong is like caveman. Atari pong is just tennis. It's it's lines it's like two els playing a game against each other. It was so long after that one right going. Yeah and we were just like why like. What did we ever. duty you. Imagine 'electricity match. Knowing how mad i was about the wrong. This seems like it's very very possible and also just there's things there's things about the fact that everybody got sick. I think maybe she was trying out a couple things and maybe that fight. There's just things building. I also think back then women just didn't it was like she didn't get married you know. She was a sunday school teacher. Just her life was really oppressive. Obviously very dedicated to the family. So it's just like she went off. she just snapped. It seems like that maybe or maybe she's just a victim because she just doesn't react to anything and people hate that. Yeah well and that's our take. That's the part of the podcast called and that's our our take is we don't know aren't taking. I'm sure someone wrote a great book. That's going to explain exactly why it's one way or the other. But i didn't read it taylor. Yeah i know the answer to this question that i know you're gonna answer it. Everyone do you ever want to go to the dermatologist. Bigger too stressed out figuring it all my god. You read my diary. But guess what karen i have to tell you something because now there's a simple solution. You don't have to leave your home to get it. it's called hers. 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Talks base has thousands of licensed therapists with years of experience. In over forty specialties. Talking to our friends is so different from talking to a licensed therapist who has the expertise and knowledge to give us practical guidance. Tax base gives us the support. We need at an affordable price as the listener. This podcast. you get one hundred dollars off. Your first month was talk. Space to match with a licensed therapist today go to talks base dot com or download the app and make sure you use the code m fm to get one hundred dollars off your first month and show your support for the show that's mfm and talks base dot com. Go by this. I'm going to do the eastern airlines hijacking flight thirteen twenty. Whoa you know. I love fuckin- crazy ass hijacking. All right clear it urea. We warm up that instrument. So let me just give you a an overview. Please do history when the government started to oversee aviation fifty. Eight hijacking wasn't a crime yet And the airports were designed in a way that made it so you could just go on in and bring whatever you want on board. You just walked right through on the tarmac onto the plane. You didn't even fucking ticket. You didn't have to put your cigarette out. No they were like please. Smoke on the plane helps right there. What do you mean you didn't buy ticket. You get you get on a train you get on the plane. And then they're like you pay for your ticket from your fucking seat. I swear. I swear. I swear i read this. I don't know it's true on the internet on the internet. Isn't that insane. Yeah that's crazy so the the. Yeah so the stewardess or called at the time which is a fucking outdated term. We all know you just think so. You would just go and they give you tickets. No nothing like that. You just pay for your ticket. And they were great. And hijacking wasn't considered a serious threat by the airlines or the passengers. 'cause so it started happening and it was almost like a prank. It was basically like when the dude would the streaker who would run on the field. That was like that guy or slowing the game down your funny like fish so they would just be people who wanted to go places and they would hijack the plane and just like take me to. Cuba was a normal thing and they would take him there and everything would be fine like from two from. I don't know anywhere it was it was kind of seen as an inconvenience more than anything else. They would be like oh great. We're going to cuba. Honey got hijacked. I'm going to be like three hours late. And there was actually an italian american dude who hijacked a plane from los angeles. He made them take him to rome when he arrived. He was hailed as a hero by all the italian. Refuse to extradite him. Yes this fucking guy and he was also incredibly hot. So the puck and castellina spaghetti western. And that's how hijacking was so. It wasn't no one gave a shit. What is that. Clint eastwood clint eastwood. There's a ninety nine percent invisible. Podcast episode about hijacking talks about this stuff eventually. The hijackers start to become more like classic kidnappers demanding ransom so they were like we better do something about this. So in one thousand nine hundred eighty eight. The faa created an anti hijacking tax task force to come up with solutions. Because the airlines were like. We don't want to spend all this money. It's gonna cost so much money to check. People make sure they're hijackers are not so let's think about better solution and they were like. Hey the public feel free to. I can throw in your suggestion. Well really they were like we want to hear it. They took they took calls. It's a call. They came up with shit. Like what if we do a fake airport that we pretend as cuba. But it's really here in florida and then we arrest them when they get too expensive then someone was like how about an injector seat for the hijackers sucking kidding or a seat where you get a shot of morphine comes up and shoots. The hijacker with sleeping pills. Shit was this. These are all the ideas from a fifth grade classroom. That's right spiderman. Okay so then. None of those worked and did so. One fight was hijacked in one thousand nine hundred eighty nine. This is how little people how not seriously people took it. In one thousand nine hundred eighty nine it was hijacked from newark to miami. And this is an episode of radio lab talks about this. The host of the show candid camera. You guys know that popular show alan. Funt was on board with his family. The fucking the plane gets legit hijacked and when the passenger seat and funds like edwin like this is a prank show and even the hijackers come out of the cockpit. They all applaud. You and i swear to fucking i'd this is not a brain. He's the only him and his wife and kid are the only ones who know it's not a prank. that's hijackers. that's okay first of all. How fucking hilariously frustrating for this hijackers. You'll get everybody get joan and they're like fuck you me. I'll recognize you. It's a great episode. Rail called a smile. My ass. Really funny that's so good and so it wasn't until the plane actually landed in havana instead of florida. And they're fucking plane is surrounded by cuban military officers. That he will finally believed was which is like if something like that is happening. I want to believe it's a joke until it's not anymore. You know what i mean like. What a great way. Yes like you mean like when we were flying here today and the plane just went like this real quick and i was fucking studying this. I couldn't tell you that you know it was scary. Because i'm studying hijacking right now. That's all it was. It was scary but it was scary in that way where i went like everybody went like that and then but then it was just completely normal as if it didn't happen and then i was just like. Please don't have a panic attack. I was begging my brain like just stay in this mode right now and don't just don't think about how that felt well. It was what i do every time. And i'm sure everyone else does is look at the flight attendant. She cool. she's cool. He's cool okay. Then everything's if she's going like this. Then i'm going to have a panic attack. If she's still getting like cups and he did not miss a beat and she was just like ever get these assholes out of here so okay. So this is what hijackings were like in. And that's how things stood on march seventeenth nineteen seventy saint patrick's day. Your favorite holiday. Everyone here boston. So that's when march seventeen seventy when the first death caused by air piracy and us history took place in massachusetts airspace. Wow yeah so here. We are okay so seven thirty pm. Eastern airlines flight bound flight bound for boston from newark. New jersey takes off with sixty eight passengers work. I have the burp. Excuse me shit edit that out of your brain so it's sixty eight. Passengers and five crew members are aboard. Everything is totally normal intel shortly after takeoff. They're passing over franklin and when about thirty miles south of logan airport when the flight attendant comes around to collect the ticket money. You want to buy a ticket for the plane. You're already on. Yeah exactly what happens when you're like i don't have any money well. Well then you'd better go smoke in the bathroom. She gets to a man named john. J. d. vivio. the vivo. excuse me. He tells the flight attendant that he doesn't have any money for the fifteen dollars. Seventy five cent ticket. Well how how. Long ago seventy. I don't have today's money how much that is. But i'm sure it's not the seven hundred dollars it would cost today. It's gonna say. I started things seven hundred dollars. Good hey he says. I don't have the money and ask to speak to the pilot and then pulls out a thirty eight caliber revolver saying he said john devoe is a twenty seven year old. Who lived with his family in new jersey when he was sixteen years old eleven years before he had shot himself in the head in a suicide attempt he survived but the bullet remained lodged in his skull and as a result his behavior had become more and more radic over time. I bet it's fucking happens. Eventually leading up to this hijacking eleven years later and he boarded the plane wearing a chain neck necklace. Skull and bones amulet on it. Cool which. I'm sure every like half the people here are wearing for back. Then it was fucking weird. The flight attendant brings this guy john devoe to the cockpit which was being manned by captain. John robert wilbur junior. He's thirty five years old. He's an air force pilot. Who would only been promoted to captain six months prior he and he is with his co pilot. First officer james. Hartley whose thirty The captain wilbur calmly says to the flight attendant a please let all the passengers. Everything is fine and nothing is wrong. Put on your flight attendant face. Yes and so she goes back. And then the captain and co-pilot expected to vote to demand to be taken to cuba because that was like where everyone wants to go at the time when they hijack a plane but instead vivo tells the cap to fly east until they run out of gas. That's a bad fuck and plan now after. Were like great. We'll do it. But after about fifteen minutes the captain said told him that they'd crash into the atlantic. They didn't return to boston for fuel so they because they had been on their final approach for landing at the moment so they didn't have a lot of gas fuel gas. I'm sure it's just unleaded right. So devoe he's says he says. Okay the refueling trip. But as soon as the plane starts to turn he gets spooked. How and he abruptly shoots officer hartley in the chess. Shit and shoots captain wilbur. Twice one in each arm i know. No it's bananas. Those are his steering arm. Crucial to flying a plane officer hartley collapses but despite being he's one that got shot in the chest despite being mortally wounded he fucking recovers enough to rip the gun from vivid hand. Fucking shoots him three times. Sorry this is a lot of gunfire and then he lapses into unconsciousness and shit. What how we never heard about what a way to go out to your faulk year. Yes he is wounded. He slumps between the seats. But he's he's able to fuck and this is like a magical and he's able to fucking himself he starts. He doesn't have his gun anymore. But he starts clawing at captain wilbur. Attempting to grab the fucking steering wheel enforce it to crash Fucking this okay cut. Let's take a break for a second. Yes please everyone. Meanwhile anyone wanna snack cigarette. How 'bout a cigarette snacks snack. The meanwhile back in the plane. Passenger peggy mclaughlin. She's a nineteen year old boston college student at the time. Yeah so she's not fucking around. She says that they were only dimly aware of the life or death battle going on in the cabin that the passengers didn't even know what was going on. They heard a commotion. Someone said it sounded like a fake gun. Pop apopka sure cap gun a gun thank you. They didn't know what was going on. They didn't realize they were in the midst of an attempted hijacking until the shots rang out. And that when they heard that some people dough from their seats to the floor and that the flight they realize the flight had veered off course because they found themselves flying over the back bay. Peggy thought they were going to land in the harbor so she fucking starts taking her boots off like ready to fuck and swim. Always ready that peggy. Yes right and you know those prime hot like sexy nineteen seventies boots and. Then she's like. I might as well change in my suit while we're doing. It's basically yeah. So meanwhile let's go back to the cockpit so so wilbur. Captain wilbur he. He's fighting with fucking vivo. He grabs the gun that had fallen to the ground. Hits to do over the fucking head with doing him. Beats him with the pistol while continuing to fly the fucking plane and those are those are bullet arms fucking and both of his arms are shy. Then captain wilbur radios the tower and says my co pilot is shot. Where the hell do you want me to put this thing. So hot so hot so hard. He doesn't even mention that he's shot at all. He he this so now. The vivo is unconscious and despite being shot and both buchan arm bleeding badly. Captain wilbur is able to write. The plane plunged during the struggle and then safely lands safely and smoothly land aircraft. They can't do that sometimes. When we're just coming in de la and everything is fine. Yeah smoothly at logan yuck and lands at sea bananas. The entire event took place in only only ten to fifteen miles away from logan international airport at an altitude between three and five thousand feet. Nothing no it is one supply and safety on the ground. If if it was arrested and with murder he sent to bridgewater state hospital for mental evaluation. You can ch- you can cheer for bridgewater state. We have a whole group from there today. Great welcome he's taken for a mental evaluation. But basically like fuck this shit. And he's taken to suffolk county jail at charles street and they're no trial would take place though because on halloween. Nineteen seventy while awaiting trial for air piracy and murder devoe hangs himself in his cell. Peggy mclaughlin are nineteen year old. Boot girl police tell me she marries the ono vs so cuting shit. We'll make it that way in the movie. And she's played by chloe seventy she becomes a librarian and a yoga instructor and she doesn't fuck and talk about this for decades. It was a time period where they were like. You got great. You don't need therapy the end goodbye. That's it you don't talk about it ever again best. If you don't tell any right she said one time the fbi stop by after to ask her questions about it and then she never fucking spoke about it again in tell when captain sully landed the not a boat i it was a plane landed in the hudson and then she's like you know what i have a story tell us. Oh you like landing planes. I got a story great but she says that the memory had never left her. of course. we'll yeah so. James hartley captain wilbur were proclaimed heroes and on march twenty fourth nineteen seventy the. Us senate passed a resolution. Commended them both for their quote. Extraordinary heroism incompetence now retired. Captain robert wilbur. The captain says the captain cut number. The captain i wrote. He says he doesn't think about it. That but peggy eventually wrote a letter to him thanking him for saving her life. No wilbur captain wilbur. Insisted that he was just doing his his job. And that james hartley was the hero. Oh and that you guys is the eastern hijacking flight thirteen. That was it was amazing. It's like it isn't that long. I just hate when i find out how much how many things i don't know. There's just so many things in that story where i'm like. Wait what crazy like a train. You just pay. You're on the plane. Stupid t and seventy was on the plane that flew out here on the. I went into the bathroom and they had a an ashtray the door. It's so scary when that you go skirt. You're like how fucking old is it happens. It's we go in a lot of planes and you the majority of them still have ashtrays and that we're here tonight to petition. We need to start cycling. Those fucking things out for that to stop or let's start smoking on planes again. But i don't want it's terrifying insane to we do actually thank. You picked my various undergarments. The places they're not supposed the ending up. Karen has been harassed. And i think it's really important that you listen to me right now because there are people. I say this part and people do not listen. They don't and then they get picked and then they do a thing that i asked them not to do and everyone in the room doesn't like them because of that and it's not good so listen to what i'm telling you right now when we do hometown murders were in the city. We like it when it's a local story so eight. This date is good locals good. We love accents. We wanna hear something from what happened around here. That'd be great also. Of course. I think you guys know this. It's if you're not so drunk you can't follow your own line of logic. The top two is pretty important. It's very nervewracking to be up here once you get up here. There's like a think you're fine at first and this wave hits you then your mind goes blank. You start remembering weird shit. You did in high school. There's a whole there's a whole experience to it so you might think you have it in the pocket. Just make sure it's good when your story has a beginning of middle and an end for sure. Usually it's good when the the end pays off like our last hometown was amazing because it had this awesome ending. So that's i always recommend that and then finally it's just remember. Everyone in the room hates you because you pay so make it quick all right now. Georgia's going to. I think you want to do it because you guys get this face and it hurts me and my soul and can't see anything you know unless you do it. You look at them to me. It's more of a psychic. It's an italian psychic grandmother. Show me how to do show me. How could you bring the lights up a little bit if it's possible we'll just look at that. You can't do it. Rich pitches in the balcony. Crazy fucking fools is it. This is right there and walk over here. I mean i like your spirit and everything is nice tv thing. You're just gonna jump down the thing. Is we call. We called the balcony rich at the last show. So you just rich. What's your name bent. Thank you abby commuter. Here's a microphone shabby everybody player. Bob's burgers thanks. Where are you from new bedford k. Check check okay. So this is still an ongoing thing. That's going on this is the murder of. She's the first person that was murdered this year. In new bedford. Yeah the case is still going but on january twenty second around two a m choose found outside of her home screaming. She wasn't dead yet and we're not laughing about that part or nervousness and stuff like that. She was stabbed multiple times. It actually ended up being over forty nine times by her neighbor because sh- her neighbor didn't like how loud she played her music or her dog. She had like a emotional support dog that was like smelling yappy named lowly to too loud so he decided to stab her jesus super bad and they texted each other like days before and they actually like us the texts as evidence and stuff and they talked about how they're gonna beat her up and his pit bulls on her but bill. Her and her dog were stabbed and she unfortunately did not make it but her dog did survive. Lalita lives tabby. Everybody thank you. Oh my god you guys. These two shows have been unbelievable. Night truly has been the least drunk yelich crowd with that. We've ever had credible like you know what it is. It feels like everyone's in listening in ten. Just right there listening. It's such a great feeling. Not it's not like you guys have a bad reputation or anything like that ply brooklyn last night with canned wines might have been our own thoughts. You guys two shows have been so much the fact that we sold out three fucking show. Thank you so much for supporting us. We're so frigging lucky to be here to be part of this. We're very every time ticket. Sales start and then people start tweeting us with insanely angry messages about how they didn't get tickets and what we need to do about it. We really take it as a huge compliment because our very this thing that's happening with this podcast is just very rare. And it's very very special. You guys have started your own community your kick connecting with each other. It's just it's incredible and we're really honored to be doing this with you. It's it's really a beautiful thing to see and we really really appreciate it. We hope you know we're so so grateful that we get to be here with you really are thank you. Yes so. Boston stay sexy.
"The christian and i have a little nephew two of them actually and the older one. Who's about those now. Three just had a birthday. He is obsessed with the cartoon character. Nature cat it's show on pbs. I think right where The lead character nature cat The titular killer role. He explains nature to kids. It's really great idea and really wonderfully executed. We recently got nature cat to record a little message for our nephew. And it's truly my favorite thing. I've ever seen the video of our nephew hearing this message. And hearing his favorite character animated character say his name and seeing his mind blown. I mean you can see the moment his mind easily in the top five funniest things i've ever seen in the top five. Most heartwarming agresson. Things together melts in my brain. Yeah oh man. I wish i could show but we can only talk about it because we didn't have our own kids maybe one day anyway for now we do have a podcast and here. It is could be a dream life. Good who dude. You're listening to life short. I've your host justin long night sweetheart shop with me as is one of the worst introductions. It was pretty. Wow okay my brother who's judgment. I trust very much which supportive supportive. He's so right then you feel really suck just now when you call ask you this last night. You've been coughing a lot in the last twenty four hours have. Yeah and. I figured it was just the weather change. I think it is. I'm prone to allergies and sees. No change really affects me. I was just thinking. I knew i was going to say that sentence and i started laughing because i realized how like nerdy i sound insead new cheech. Everyone's i is in change. There are very few people who are above that. I bet uber benches like debut teesta. He'd never he's not i feel like he's never been allergic to anything. Yeah are you proud of me for announcing future guest. I mean were you. I was for like three and a half seconds. But yeah our our nephew when he heard that god. It's i just we. We take so many videos and photos of our nephew's there just the bat. I mean everyone does. This is nothing new but This is one that i know. I will cherish for the rest of my life. This kid is also idaho but he's super special. He's like he's already reading. He's very bright. Adorable adorable yeah. He's so to see his mind who's already very sharp. Mind register that his favorite animated characters saying is news. Name knows him was beautiful. It was like the best thing. I've ever seen the reaction because also as an actor i liked to take notice of extreme reactions. You know when somebody is surprised or taken aback by something. It's it's such. I mean you see it on instagram. All the time all this great the videos and stuff but With kids especially my agent logan who i hope is listening posted Video of his son. Who's a little bit older than our nephew. But it was really cute. He was in the car going through the car wash and he was amazed by just like he was pointing things out and and i was started texting with my age. About like how great it is to when a kid is so Entertained by such things things. We take for granted. And and i. It brought me back to when i was in the remember going through the car. Wash is a kid like how cool it was. It was kind of scary and it was a really a wild ride. It was a wild ride. Yeah the reason we're talking about our nephew and nature. Cat is because our guest today on life is short. Is nature cat himself. Yeah yeah hope. You're sitting down all you. Nature cat enthusiasts. Our guest today is taryn kill who in addition to being nature. Cat is so many more things i in fact only recently discovered he. He was the voice of this Or the record this interview during this interview. Taryn is taryn. He's not. He's not doing the interview as nature cats. So don't because according to him it's a very difficult voice to requires a lot of energy. He is kind of strange. It's if you know the voice. It's a bit like roger rabbit. That's what he says right. Now that's what i hear. But i hadn't heard that in the character before. It's tally ho. It's up. I can't really do that but but it's pretty close. It's it up like this but it's he's so gifted when it comes to Very gifted perform who is extremely generous of him. Slower nephews mind he. He didn't have to do that but he left this really. we'd mess. yeah. I really kind person. And his equally kind wife. is a former guest of the show friend of the show. Yeah cobie smulders. They actually just sent us. Because i did. A taryn organized in another very kind gesture organized a fundraiser fundraising event for when we vote We did it the other day with some some very funny people on zoom and He i thought it was such a nice gesture that he even organized it. He and kobe just sent us a bunch of delicious looking cookies. There's just like what i know. I know you'll hear me. Gosh about them and go on about them. But i just really really admire taryn as a performer. Too and he is such a kind person but have always run away liked him. I remember meeting him. In new york we were. I was with some cast members of snl and it was the first season he was on. I think yes definitely he had just joined the cast and i was meeting up with some other cast members to go sing karaoke and right away i was like who is this guy because he was he was so funny. Obviously singing also a good singer. We all know he's netscape. She goes in the hit show. Hamilton and broadway. Yes he's he's a showman the great white way he's on the show the board once or twice you also might know him home from single parents from snl. Mostly i thought he was the he was my favourite. Snl cast member of that era. I thought yeah diverse. As consistent committed. He was always really incredible on that. Show yeah and kind of watching them on that His enjoyment of performing is so palpable. A horrible You know him through. I met him with kobe at my friend. Nick finesses wedding. I sat across from really. Yeah right away just fell in love with those two and then started going to see taryn perform at the groundlings. Because my friend. Nick was in the that sunday. Cast and right away recognized. What a what. A great performer. He was so funny so funny sent a few weeks ago we did. We can't really tell visit as and aired yet. But justin. And i did a game show over zoom i started called a game sharon And what else you and taryn and his friend were Our competitors right in the game show so we talk about that. A little bit yeah. That's good context. Yes beginning yeah. Hey let's get to it okay. Wow stop beating around the bush. You're killing killing miss okay. I like to lower the bar. The comedy bar. I think it's a nice thing for the guests because then they It's so much so easy for them to surpass it. Well mission accomplished here. He is My catch up with my my friend. Taryn joan sweetheart. We love working together. Obviously i think you can hear that. We know our limitations. We know what we're good at. We know what we need help with. And one of those things we really need help with is organization. Yeah and money dot com has really helped us with that what it is. It's an easy to use very flexible visual teamwork platform. Yeah we have a company with people might not realize one. We still need help organizing. And they have changed our approach radically and and they do it for all size a- if you're a huge team if you're a giant corporation like acme industries exactly monday dot com can customize it to fit your specific workflow. Whatever that is big or small. It's a great way to improve coordination and move faster to reach your goals. It's just a great way to manage your business and obviously when you're teamwork is effective. Nothing can stop you well. Something's can stop you. Fewer things can stop. Yeah you can make it. Stop by some like god. Forbid there's all but if you want to start your free fourteen day trial it's easy. Just go to monday. Dot com so easy. Tis the season to upgrade your wifi. Gotcha well you really did. I thought that was you singing christmas carols. You think it was weird. I was just randomly very weird. When you connected to your world by wi fi be shirt. It's the best because now everyone's doing everything on wi fi. You kind needed to be the best or be wifi six from next year. It's the gift that keeps on giving. It covers your entire home with the fastest wifi. So you can stream your favorite shows and movies video chat with family far away and work and learn from home on devices than ever before in any party or right you can. Stream shows like jerry haji on netflix eggs or family on netflix. It's wi fi worth celebrating. Don't miss this holiday. Season exclusive offer on the best wi fi ever find out what makes net gear america's number one choice for wi fi at net gear dot com slash. Best wi fi. That's net gear dot com slash. Best wi fi. Though meet again. I wanted christian on the show which was very flattered by it. He didn't he wasn't gonna do. It was sorry he's not here. I'll tune in all tune in for the for the post sash. There'd be breakdown who's really interesting. He mentioned his wife a lot that you can. Clearly you can tell us the affection. The relationship and i really. I really liked that also. But he's still very bitter about the celebrity game vase. You can hear it in his voice. It's the first one up. Christon has like h. Jon benjamin at least to me as he got that before i don't know is is shown but always see the bob's burgers. Yes yes yes. Yes but i love. I love this podcast. Thank you for having we love you. We were joking the other day because you joked on the show the kevin hart show that. I hadn't asked you to do this yet and i swear i swear. Guide i swear to god. We've wanted you on for so long but i think because we're we're friends. I always just assumed we do it when we saw each other. But who knows when that now is going to be so really. How are you guys doing without getting too personal. Let's get heavy. we're in trouble. Dustin johnson good fodder. Don't trust my wife. I don't trust her. we're good. We're as good as anybody can be in this time. We have two daughters. They're back at virtual school now which is less than ideal but all of our all the teachers and school administration are working so hard to make it as pleasant and painless as possible. Everybody's trying to rally for someone who doesn't have kids like what does that mean when they're in virtuous go there in their rooms now. You have to be nearby. We have an eleven year old. Who's in sixth grade. So she is. Yeah she's a self managing but even then you want to check in and make sure that she's on top of it because you know kids are small. People people are smart and people are lazy. And so you know she you know. She's quickly finding the loopholes of like well. They just initial worksheet and they did it really fast. So i don't have to be there anymore and god i'd be the worst i. I'm thinking about my in sixth grade but she's but she's also like she's very honest person so the second. We opened the door if she's not fully engaged on the laptop she's like. I just felt i needed to clean my book drawer. Yeah yeah you listen to the show. You've heard me talk about how impressive i think you in. Kobe are and as a couple as people. What did they think of you. What do your kids think of you. I feel like there's so lucky to have parents. But i wonder what their perspective. That's very nice of you and thank you for every nice thing you've ever said about me and coby so in terms of what they think if you're asking what they think of us and what we do in our careers were just always very open and transparent about why we do it. Which is we love performing. We love telling stories. We love the craft and the technique of acting of television of film. Our eldest in particular expresses interest in following down there half and so we go be an. I were very quickly on the same page of we support you in whatever your passion is whatever you want to endeavour in we will support you and except for acting except for attic. So here's your. Here's your chemistry said. Do it It's it's about studying that. It is a skill you can builds even though it's not right it's not easy to define. As being an engineer or mathematician there is techniques to it and there is studying there is history and if and if you want to participate great you're gonna do it with your friends. You're going to do it in a safe environment. And that her age you to educate yourself to develop an actual crap. That must be harder. Turn to impress upon a kid now than when we were kids because of all the avenues to them terms of being performers or just doing it for the wrong reasons as they and the bachelor doing it to be famous or to be popular. It must be more confusing now to kinda guy to get through that. I think definitely with youtube stars and social media and the immediate access that everybody grants it seemingly almost entirely motivated by self promotion and just an attention seeking. I think both kobe and i struggle with but are also very aware that you don't get into this industry because you don't want anybody pay attention to having to define your boundaries and your parameters of what you're comfortable with sharing being in the public eye versus what you wanna preserve for yourself for your own personal life takes time. I think it takes takes trial and error. What's an example of an error that that you may have in terms of that but you may have committed like just getting a little too revealing too much or being when you're finding your foothold of how to balance those two. There's a couple. there's a couple. I think i think our strongest limits our with our children and i think koby ni- we were young parents. We were twenty seven when we had our first kid and we drew very hard line of like. We'll never talk about them. We'll never see their name. Wouldn't you know yeah. And and i think i think in making it a bigger deal like that. I think if you're in an interview scenario we learned this over time. I prefer not to talk about that. That that creates a kind of negative energy and also shines more of a light onto it than if you totally great we love. It's the best thing we've ever done and then wearing answer and then people move right and you demystify. Why aren't they yes. E- yeah but then but then like you know then outside of children. There's just being in a relationship where both performance in your both actors And like i remember early in the twitter twitter career. I was watching. The americans. And i just tweeted out keri russell. You're the other one for me at that was literally the only time like truly like in in a very strong way. The koby expressed like my feelings. That didn't feel good. You're putting that out so publicly. And i and i had to sort of define. I don't actually think that. I'm going to meet harry russell and then able to negotiate some sort of polygamous dot dot dial so i don't want to rule it out because i'm open to all things and i'm i'm progressive as hell but having to then sets a boundary for. Oh yes there are people who invest in a public way in our private relationship. And i need to be conscious of that of of kobe feelings and of my own feelings. And that being flippant or being jokey about what is private is. Maybe you're responsible you know at times. The strange thing is that we are like you said in this business where the truth is. You could very easily work with keri russell. You get a call next week. We're like you know you're in a thing with her now and then it becomes like if in fact you were you were joking but it now becomes like something that she might have to. I think i'm too aware of sort of the the greater than less than i have been a fan of keri russell since the mc mickey mouse club reboot. But i'm only making that joe publicly. Because i know there is no meadow where yeah i would ever leave kobe. I too happy in my relationship with her. And i respect her too much as a person so i make the joke. Because it's so ludicrous. Right even even in keri russell and i worked together you know and like oh we really get along. I'm i'm so in love with koby am so dedicated to her. And and that's been part of our relationship. Journey is sort of defining you know making her a priority and making a commitment to her something that i'm constantly working on but that i'm constantly appreciate to that. I may build this this life this Partnership you alluded to this earlier. We talk about your kids that you know that what you do in the life that you guys have as actors performance pales in comparison to when you've care and at what point did that is that i think that just becomes apparent as soon as they're born i mean. Walk me through that. Because i would love to know what that feels like. But it's an interesting question. Because i would say like my priorities. Personal and career have evolved constantly again. No one gets into this business to be like. I'm going to be a very private person. One said like we're all a little insane. Because you only start doing this. You only start acting. you only become perform. Because you're like hey look at me. I deserve to be looked at and on rights. I have something more than anybody else. kind of. who went. Well well-turned i know we're jumping around. But when did that when when was that apparent to you to your family. When did that start defining you in your relationship to your family. Let's say pretty early on pretty early on. I like i'm a come from sort of a show-bizzy family or show biz jason. At least like my dad was a struggling actor when he was young man. My mom is struggling musician. I didn't know my mother's uncle by marriage was robert stack. Oh wow so. There's the on the biz was in blood already and when i was very young like Five five and a half. My mom Took me in my younger siblings to a commercial agent. Like had the wherewithal to know like yeah. This could be thing. You kids are few precocious. I've seen i've seen the head show. Yeah yeah so. I was only wanted to hang with it. I was only when they can walk into a room and be like. Yeah love milkshakes you know. My parents were good balance of like we think this is something you could excel out but if you say no no pressure like it was balance. So there'd be bursts there'd be like you know anywhere from three to six months where i'd be auditioning and then the second i was like i don't wanna do. This is boring. It's like we're done. Great oh interested in like school plays came into it and then i was like oh i could do that like we moved to big bear when i was seven. And they shot a movie up there and they needed local extras. So i like. That was an event that kind of way. What was the movie it's called. i'm sure you know of. I'm sure you know some people in it. It was called a pig. Taylor's a camp movie called a pig's tail and andrew keegan right. You're yes yes. So he was in. He was lisa. The oldest daughter from mrs doubtfire. Oh kay is a k. Yes not at all not christian. Can't stand. I mean this is. We have to cut this. Exit stream hates the performance. Of the young mara wilson. In mrs doubtfire. He finds really great. Missive scout fire. What adam until the fan then either figuring. Well do your impression of kristen. Not liking mayor wilson. I understand she's a child under stitches. Little girlish the kid. But there's something it's so visceral. It's almost you know what it is. I think it's almost. I think it's like an audible thing i think in the same way. The dogs react to whistles. There is some pitch. Some vibrations from sounder voice literally just like digs under. My skin in wants me to pull out my skeletal structure venstre. It's not a personal thing. I think it's honestly i think science. That's good so when you so when you're up at. I'm also fascinated by the fact that i talk to you about this Your childhood in big bear because if for people who haven't been there it's very It's quite rural and woodsy and it's remote people vacation there. But but for the part. I i've never met anyone who grew up there. It's a resort town. It's very close. La though like no traffic you there in two hours but it is resort town The reason we moved there is that my parents could afford to own land their own a house so as a financial reason they all there's a decent school system but for me and my two younger siblings. Two older sisters were pulled out of high school to move there and so they have a very different relationship to be bad. But my be my it was very idyllic for us in that it was all and it was outdoorsy and it was small town and everybody knew everybody else. We really loved our time. There and i think are are quite nostalgic for it and try to go back at least once once or twice a year. do you still have. They still have the house there. Or you know. When i was sixteen we move back down to the south data. Manhattan beach Because i was going to lacsa which is oh. That's right ronnie with ronnie with josh grobian. Oh really previous life is yes podcast guest to you has not as long as that right again. We're not as close. So i figured oh we should do this thing and then we're going to meet up in prison interview. It's great flipped mentioned. You do did you still know. How do you still people from ronnie he. I'll keep in touch. You know it's like maybe a text every two to three months something like that when we were in your both doing shows he was doing the comet show I should know this. He talked all about it on the podcast. Yeah a name of which escapes me. I want to say harold and the purple comet. That's what it was. Yeah that's definitely what it will always be now But that was literally right next door to hamilton. When i was doing oh there so that was fun. We got to go out to lunch a couple times and reconnect and because we were pretty close in high school. Actually we were. We were buds in high school. And you were on that kind of musical theater. Because he had talked about that a musical theater. Track that you were on what what was said. Why did you. And i didn't know that you did mad. Tv at such an early age. I don't even nineteen. I'm all in all how you do. Really are josh. Said something similar is that people were surprised once he started acting but once you started doing musical theater that that's something that you had kind of been on the path for doing. What derail you into. Sketch the fluke of of of mad tv. So you know. I got infrequent jobs through childhood like like in big bear. I became sag. Because i did like a reenactment front solve mysteries and i did a small part in naked gun. Thirty three and a third that was it. That's what i read. I was like what. Yeah wow y- all over the map and then and then went to this high school and started i was. There was a theater major as was josh and there was like a friday. Elective you could do in the second half of the year where you put on a big musical production and i didn't do that until my last year. My senior year. We did a vida but always done musical theater in you know at the school plays in big bear and stuff that was always a passion and love of mine and graduating from locks. I went to ucla as a musical theater major. I was doing a year college studying for musical theater. Oh my god while also auditioning for guest stars in pilots and stuff and like how. I got real close on smallville to be like super man's best friend. Oh wow and like an almost got that and then like felt that that was my that was my shot and i blew and i needed and then almost a month like it had been within the same month just because i remember like being so down about that and then getting the call from my management going. Hey they're looking for for mad. Tv cast members. And we know you've never done sketch. You've never really done improv. But you're always so funny when you come in the offense that's always hang out in this office. Do and bits in doing impressions of everybody. Is that something you wanted to try. And i was like cool. What a weird. What a chat like the only ever done network pilot movie audition roles And let me tell you so you would do as you did with christian you do impressions of people that were just in your life that you knew. Did you have like a stable as you do now of like known people that you did. Yeah you know what i would do. I would do like at that time. The wbz was huge. Dawson's and like american pie and cruel at your pacey. Yes yeah it christian. I love doing. There's a there's a scene where he says goodbye to an older lover of his career. Yeah by tamra tamara. And he goes by tammy that mine was like more. I'm always like a gimmick. There's always like some kind of game or some sort of rhythm but oh yeah his was that he would have to do long monologues. Josh would like become a little bit lazier this giant pretty lazy joss. Yeah dawson so let me just say. Hey here yeah. You're not listening to me stephen. His was james rendering forcing it up. Oh funny yeah. I think i think the vanderbeek i did was a varsity blues. Oh let's see. Oh yeah like. I don't want your life and it was just like i don't want your wife and i don't want like i just found a lot of words that ride with life and it was just walking around. I don't need on nine exactly exactly what you're just not going into. It was the was nineteen. I had no idea what i was doing. But i just did so. I did so many and like it. Kept spiral they just kept calling me back. They're like yeah. You're on a and like after seven or eight auditions. They're like we wanna hire you as a featured player. And i was yeah does nineteen and and i was doing to me. Impressions are It's like an art form. It's a type of acting that i don't think ever gets its due credit as an acting piece so like the fact that you can do brad pitt. In michael sarah equally convincingly. They're such different people. That shows such range and level of commitment. That i've always admired so you are so wonderful that impression that i know you love them. I struggle with have always struggled with impressions and really and still do. If i'm being honest like taking pride of them 'cause to me it's like it's using mimicry. And where i've been able to kinda give myself more. Credit is is the observational at element to it of noticing tics and mannerisms and points of view That is the role of an act. Like that is what an yup for sure doing like. Hey do do that impression. That thing like one that that version of it is a party. Trick thing that i think like what i just. I'm i'm i've gotten better with it. But they're deaf. I'm where i was trying real hard to break out of that like i left match. Snl did snl force you to kind of figure out how to get better at at that are come to terms with your skillset was it was sort of the build up to it because like jim carey has always been kind my comedy hero like he's always i've had many but he's always been number one just like he came on the scene and where i was in my life at that time. Just every halloween was dressing up. As whatever character. He played recently on the ground. Like just reenacting insurer. The mask dumb. And dumber cable. God yeah yes it is yes it is it is it is to me kills me. I know i know that scene. I there are scenes in that movie that i to shut appetite but i marvel at And the one with the eggs. Don't get called scrapie screamy by next time by why i mean just that the timing that those two good you know the growth for the big part of him is that he started out as an impression as an amendment and then trashed his act like he literally could have been danny gans or whatever and gone to vegas and been making millions of dollars a year with his house. Act doing impression like was easy. I was easy any throw them away for all original stuff. And that's what brought him in living color and like my struggle with like i'm just copying somebody else. I really would love to fine. Those original characters. When i left mad tv. So many the people. I worked with their that. I respected had come from the groundlings so i went back and i started taking classes there. I didn't know you had gone back to ground. Yeah yeah because oh like michael hitchcock. Who's the writer. Imagine as their different joyce. An and michael mcdonald like so many people that i really respected had trained like being cast on tv. They're like if you ever want to come by and do a show and i win. Watch my i guess show. And i was like i could never do this. No i was terrified. And then. When i left i was like you know mad. Tv was exhilarating. Because it was like it was. I'm on a sketch. I've always loved comedy. I've always been fan of the and they asked me to do it. But i just didn't know what i was doing and i knew and by the end of it i was doing better. And they actually asked me to come back. But like at a reduced like episodic number you know there was like my reps at the time like forget them. Move on like we like you. Don't love ya. I know it's like a good job Just new like okay. I do love this art form. I do love this this this genre. I need to kind of train. And so that was going back growlings. And i also knew like if i leave mad now and if i work really hard and i really set my sights on snl. I think it's impossible dream. Sweetheart do shepherd. The holidays are a wonderful time. Obviously but they're also a very stressful time there time when you really have to take stock of your mental health Especially this year. And i don't wanna get into. Why you all know why man. It's not always easy to prioritize yourself when you have so much on your plate now. It is a lot easier with talks base. Unlike in therapy sessions talk space gives you twenty four seven access to your online therapy room. You can send unlimited messages to your dedicated therapist. And they'll respond daily five days a week. How cool you having a problem three in the morning you need to reach out to somebody that this is great. Best of all in entire month on talks based costs about the same amount as a single person session. It's amazing mental. Health should be affordable for everyone and now. This is a way to do it. So as a listener of this podcast. You get one hundred dollars off your first month on talks base to match with your perfect therapists talk space dot com or download the app make sure to use the code long to get one hundred dollars off your first month and show your support for the show. That's long and talk. Space dot com alexander. Meet again looking back. What do you think it was that the mad tv people felt needed work or wasn't right for the show or or that you needed to hone. I just think that. I i just think that i was minimum minimum eight or nine years younger than every other employees. Like it was it. Was you know mad. Tv was a more seasoned cast in terms of structuring. A sketch structure of a sketch. I had no clue about that. High new year's voice they do. Here's what a high school teacher of mine was like and like raw and just energy and just like her but but no focus. No no shape going. Groundlings put a big emphasis on on trying to develop original stuff and trying to develop characters. But when you have this asset of mimicry and impressions and stuff like that. People do love and people do love. I know who that is that they do. They do sound like that. And it is an asset that even getting tests and l. The stuff i got on much more was was going to be impression stuff or the stuff that i would be. Assigned would be impression stuff. 'cause i just had access to that. How does that work on us and on monday. When do you pitch certain people you've been working on You just say hey. I've been doing michael cera impression. I just wanna throw it out there. Yeah it's different. it's there. I think michael sarah's part of one of my three auditions. I auditioned three times like show twice one year and then the third time the following season. Oh keep out now. How does that work turn like if you i would think just my own insecure actor brain would think. Well i didn't get it. I didn't get once twice. What motivates you to go back a third time first time because because that's sort of confident voice. That said like if i ever get a chance to audition. I think i've got a shot. I may never get a chance to audition. I knew that So when. Lauren came sunday company and they're seeing people. I kind of feel the energy and then just go in the audience at the la. I actually he'd actually come to see seem. i think. I think the scene had been recommended by tina. 'cause they had a connection but then he flew me and jillian bill And the seem and then a gregg roman another performer. That was sunday with us. Us went out and just treated that like graduation. I was just like no matter what happens we got we got we got picked and so the first time was just like joy joy joy sell it like a can't believe were here like i rented a limo for all of us to because and i make the all new york song. So frank sinatra's new york. New york's playing as we're coming through the lincoln tunnel. i'm just l. about it. And i was like. Let's go to restaurant to celebrate after and then getting called for the second time then it got called route that it was real and it was like. They're really paying attention to your. They're really considering. You and i did psych myself out a little bit now. It's mine to lose. It feels more like us as opposed to its mind to possibly win. Like i'm in addition i could be a winner and now it's like i have been selected and now if i don't live up to expectation it's my fault right also by the time you're audition your first audition you're like give him my immaterial. I show him. I got i'm gonna cut all the fat and then they go the ten minute five minutes. Whatever you're like. I have to use all the fat and then after that i got called in for a meeting. Because that's the thing like when you go in with a group you're comparing notes like did you hear anything did you seemed op. Flown out to meet with law. So like i knew that at that moment it wasn't for me but we were told by the talent department. He's on our radar. He's still in the mix but it's not never. There was definitely a portion of my brain. The dedicated my the next year performing at the groundlings to developing more material with a specific purpose of something. That could possibly be used on us. Know what did you do in that third audition paul man. So when. Lauren came to see the sunday show. I was performing a a sketch that sarah baker. And i wrote that. We just called french dance. Which was a sketch that we ended up doing multiple times on snl which is just like teen hipsters in a cafe and then whatever. My american mind thinks is a popular song from their comes on the jukebox. Party looks like Kind of combining like the cliches and stereotypes. That i feel americans have about french. People like jerry lewis absurd ism that here like nineteen sixties beatnik hipsters. You know a so. He came in and saw so. I hadn't done that in any of my audition. So i brought it back because i that was the thing that lauren had seen. That made him go. Yeah fly them out. It's just trying to think it must be so strange trying to get into his head based on certain clues that you have from what he saw. But i do think i knew and this has been since reinforced having watched you know years year after year of people. Auditioning like you gotta do. What makes you laugh like that. Is that like the rest of the strategy like maybe but you could just as easily strategize thinking. They'll they'll feel this way. That makes them feel the exact opposite. And it's just like what makes you like what is this is what's funny to me. And and then also cut the fat like cut the air out to the joe and that's that's what betters while. I'm sure a lot of respond to correct me if i'm wrong. Having seen a lot of additions is just the. It's not necessarily. I've thought this about like will ferrell certain people that i've seen the auditions on the dvd's but there's a sense of Of joy and play that is so palpable. It's it's it's not so much that it's like the funniest material or it's just how loose and fun are they. Yeah if you can let some personality shine through. I think that that is a huge part of it too. Yeah but who knows who knows to. It's and then when when you're on when i mean you get that call and you've got a family than in la. I mean just logistically. What what what goes through your mind you you must be excited but then is it like oh boy now. What does this mean. Yeah it was certainly not a breeze. It was not a breeze. And like i was flying back and forth. Kobe was on how i met your mother. Our daughter was a year-old old. I'd also like. I'd been the primary caretaker that whole first year right. 'cause kobe's time i'm just doing groundlings. You know sunday nights in winston. It's pretty much so like she's mine she's i and now and that's certainly the most heartbreaking instill have regrets about the time away time spent There's there's excitement first year and it's your dream job. So there's excitement that helps motivate that. And and and if i'm being completely honest like getting on a plane after taking care of a child for your straight seals kinda nice. Yeah but every. I couldn't believe that you you're saying like you made a commitment to kobe in the show. And that's the first thing that came to my mind was the years that you because i remember seeing you out there and i know how grueling that schedule is i don't know firsthand but i've seen friends go through it and to go back and forth every week you were every every second or third week pretty much like the run a shows and then going into hiatus week i would like stay up after party but the first flight out of jfk or newark like a five six seven am flight. Stay up all night. Go to after after hop in a cab and just get home and i'd be home by ten in the morning because you're flying west but right away you take care of you have time just taking care just like yeah get back. Give me back to my kid. Give me bad. Yeah and. I'm sure i'm sure there are aspects of that energy. That's not healthy of like. I'm here now and what you know what i mean. It's like whoa on down bro. You have not been year for three at the beginning of the season. Possibly even four weeks. Like you need to fricking. Cool your jets. You still have like performance energy like hey sketch. I'm just learning words dude. I'm just learning words. It was not great it was not it was also complicated because there were things that were great like both movie and i were working. That alone is great but then at the same time you're sacrificing the social a little bit right where a lot of the other cast and writers on their weeks offer like hey wanna hang on to see a movie wanna create shared experiences wanna go to on vacation together And so i you know. I have to exclude myself from that. You know i. it's all trade off. Yeah also doing the work with my family there. When they moved out in my a fifth season it got harder with them there because on down. I'm all right. What else am i gonna do. A gotta give all of this show and now with them there. It's like hey you know. There's a winter concert i want to get to. Let's let's write this where we sketch and get out of here. Oh that's tradeoff it's but that's life man. What did you think of as your function on the show. You the guy who do you see yourself that way like i'm what phil hartmann was doing. I'm it was. It was like a big struggle of mine on that show for sure in terms of What i wanted to be versus what. I was being used as were. Yeah what you know. My ego is like i'm not anybody. I'm terry not being so unrealistic to know that there are roles in their services. And there's a familiarity to the rhythm that people watching at home and in the studio expecting. In what i wanted forte is is still like like all time favorite to me. Forte infrared fred. And the absurdity of what they would do and the crazy and like the you know a sketch called the falconer and just like mace and non sequitur and gross insecurity of gruber. And like some of your and sketches like are not sketches that wherever seeing like willing. Kristen did these characters called the hair heads. When did this is still possibly the most expensive live. Sketch ever produced the hair heads. Were just people whose heads were balls of air. And they couldn't talk they just sort of like cousin it from from adamson like yeah but jude law owned a crystal shop owner like mine crystals and the hair heads were like his worst nightmare because they come in and they just break everything off and so it was just three walls of breakaway glass. Crystal things that had to be purchased and the sketch was written as a runner meaning. It came back were times throughout the show. Oh my god my forte called keepers with alec baldwin where it was just alec baldwin park discard the beach and it was a windy day and when it came back it was mostly covered in sand and will forge ahead a metal detector and he found the car and he says it's his car now like what i said. What i just said was more dialogue than was in the sketch. i think. I'm pretty sure. I parked my car here and find burs. What are you doing like nobody. It's my mouth and he launches into a song because he loses. We love the beach. It's the most insane thing. This whole sketches. Just him singing the rules of finders keepers. It's the law the law of the crash. Who who is the guy that did was he had her. Yeah i believe. That's tim. Tim calhoun tim. Calcium yeah i mean so that's a classic forte. Last sketch probably always my favorites that well. That's what i love about. Mckee right which has been in my head all day because i watch mulkey at least at least once a year awesome. Did it become. It must have been frustrating. Then i imagine knowing your strings. I remember thinking like oh. Terrance shouldn't just plain the dad again on this day and like out frustrated me as a fan of yours. That's nice of you. You know. I i've i've done a lot of work on me and my relationship that to that show because it was so consuming and i've been able to take a lot more responsibility for you know for germany there. I'm very proud and my journey. You know you should be remember feeling at the time that like. I'm pitching sketches. That where. I am the star. I'm a weirdo. But when they go back to decide what sketches are in the show. There's i'm in five other sketches doing doing service and support so when they're like who's light in the show. Yeah they're not gonna worry about me they'll be like well. We'll be right that so and knowing that i'm i this is where i'm take responsibility knowing that i'm not writing. If writing sketches that are not get out of the park home runs. They're going to put that in the show. But i feel like even mckee's a knock it out of the park home run thing. It's like a weird thing that's going to connect to a very specific audience. And those are the things that i love that. I'm passionate about the house. Because i am able to do the straight man in utility roles and because i also am able to do impressions like i have. I had a lot of use to the show. I think. I think i took good care of the show certainly was felt. I was missing out on opportunities to to play in my own weird a sandbox. It didn't surprise me when i saw you. Were doing hamilton knowing your skillset in level of commitment but where people rio agents like you wanna do. Was that a strange choice for anybody. In your life or was that that was just a thrill everyb- everybody knew the significance of being asked and i met tommy. Kale through doing twenty four hour. Plays which we. Oh yeah a couple of times. And he and i became close and we already knew. Lynn kaz lynn. Had done some writing. On how i met your mother. He was asked by. Neil patrick harris to do some musical pieces cause neo loved in the heights like like all of us did and so we were already kind of friendly with lynn. But then tommy. And i got became close. It was already such a hit. It was already. The album was out. It was already a non. I felt so honored and thrilled. And the fact that i love to share is that this is one hundred percent true in the three months i was in hamilton. I got more requests for tickets to that. That in the six years really. Yeah which act which you know the people were still asking about. Snl they'll certainly. It doesn't speak to like people not wanting to see us and l. desire how bid of people who wanted to to be in the room where handler see your rendition of king. George how many months did you do the three months. I did ninety nine shows. I had to call out sick one show and all me. It killed one hundred. How sick were you very very sick sick that the show. I'm most proud of like. I'm sure you can. This having done runs the show. That i remember the best. I'm most proud of. Is that show before. I had to call out literally would be sweating and shocking sweating and shaking my dressing room. And then i'd go out for the first song. I performed it. There's i feel very confident. You would not know anything wrong. go off stage. i get the cape off. Add remove the chronic. Go up and i just puke into the toilet on you and and then like yeah and then like trying not to shit my pants. As an insufferable member at the end of that show sitting up you know all star and then like running off stage and evacuating everything like that was taking the willpower commitment to the next level where i just had to go my buddies own right now so my body is and then just crumbling upstate. Well thanks for listening to life insurance been. It's been fun doing the show. Yeah i know that feeling. I had at once. I won't go into detail. But i remember thinking like afterwards the sweat that you're producing like the moisture that's coming out of your body. I didn't know how much to attribute to the sicknesses self or like the nerves anxiety of like potentially shitting your pants on on a broadway stage it would be. I remember thinking like that will my no one's talking about my performance or it's not a thing that's in the news or anything or should it be but that will be in the news that will be held make. It'll be like headline. No certainly on twitter really scary. Patty lupone yells at an audience using their phone and justin. Long shits fans adam. Yeah yeah you do whatever your fantasy. Football are sundays in the kilim. Smoulders smoulders kill household. just reserve. do they just know that daddy is busy that day. No i try not to disappear for the day. I encourage them to participate with me. When there's when there's a rams away game you know a healthy marriage and a healthy. Parenthood is all about communication. And so i just i make i let them know. Hey you know in the morning the rams game and and if there're things they need help with chores day i can balance. Both height is more the home games that require my absence more because until the away games are very manageable home games as sort of like i'm going and they always. They are the first to be invited. Where did that come from. Were you into that. When you're a kid. I always love football. Football is definitely tied to my big bear. Childho- there's a little bit of a friday night lights town quality to big bear high school. Football teams big. Our neighbors mazars were huge. Forty niners fans and non had the god the prospects. I think where there was a family and they were huge green bay fans and they held big super bowl parties. And so i just loved the tradition of it. I loved the gathering and putting your navy box and rooting for your team. And i just never felt like i had a team of my own and then i started doing fantasy football in college and promised myself very early on when ellie gets a team again because i knew he would. I'm all in on him. Oh oh so you were in a rams fan growing up jewish. Did a i tell you this that i was. We're leaving the east coast. Yes for some reason. I well i know the reason. It's it's not very macho. But i like their uniforms. I thought they'd like we did a preseason game together and yes last season. Lose my mind and fight with a child. You really did get you. Squared off with the kid. Who in your defense. The kids started he started. The broncos are and that's what mean about your level of commitment even with something like that enjoying a football game you were you. Were really going at it with this kid. And where does that come from that level of excitement about and it was a preseason game. Yeah i think. I think what i like is about football more than anything is the is the communal feel like you were leading a lotta chance you were doing this and yeah there's a preciousness to the games because there's not as many in the season like it's i couldn't do that for baseball. Oh god i love seeing a baseball game. Because i love sitting and talking and chatting but like yeah or one hundred sixty eighty two games or whatever you can't have so there's depression or you'd have a heart attacks exactly. Yeah i'm sure. I buy into sort of the mccheese mo of americans sport you know. This is the man. The man's game that's diminished over time. I know it started there. That's diminished as you sort of like read the reports on c. t. e. in you understand the the risks and the damage that these players are doing themselves and so i you know i have definitely kind of like altered my enthusiasm for aspects of the game. You know really really graceful throw. I lost some of those cheers brother. My run elusive run safety. I hear control the clock. Yes we cheering for both. I like cheering for the Just a great play. Like i never understood the idea that because somebody wearing different uniform they make a great play. Or why you have to boo them or you know like or even worse. This is what. I hate the most. When i when i watched this happen with football when somebody gets injured like you were saying and here teams taunting still or there's not a sense that like i mean at a certain point it becomes Like what are we doing. This is these are human beings definitely. Yeah i think the enthusiasm there's certainly like a self awareness of there's there's a sliver of irony out like we're going like i really would compare it to going to medieval times i novel and i love getting all in on my night. A low cable guy. I truly right down all comes back to jim carey. Yeah it is so. I love getting a we. One of my best friends hunter. I was his best man. So i organize his bachelor party in vegas and we went to tournament of kings their and drag night the dragon nights out of the villain of the show in his section and our bachelor party. The most obnoxious. Not my. I know that we ruined that experience for others and anybody. Who's wanna who wants to complain. Like how dare you so loud. Like you are at tournament of kings at In las vegas for dinner. Sure yelling your head off. You're not getting your money's worth even when you were having this like a shouting match with kid. The kids parents were right there. They were laughing. There was some it came from. A place of it was just a tiny little degree of innocence. That you had where you were like. Oh really look at the scoreboard. No no no and the kid was giving it back to you and it was. It was like you were two kids who were just like both understood that the stakes weren't that high and it wasn't like a serious thing you were. It was almost like it was like a playful fight with a kid. I've never seen an adult really commit to a playful fight with a kid. A strange kid encompassed union for money to really. That's where i really don't like his uncle or something. Like gave him twenty bucks and he's like go harass that guy's a big rams fan so i was like oh really yeah yeah bring it on. Yeah again the environment of that and none of my answer like you know your pathetic little kid. You're not you're you're going to live a life of sorrow. It's all out of like yeah. Let's do but sweetheart too a harmless harvest the naturally pink coconut water a now sell their delicious organic fair for life. Coconut water online. Nationwide why's harmless harvest coconut water. So good it's a proprietary micro filtration process that locks in straight from the coconut taste. You were there with me when when we found out that we were going to be doing. Harmless harvest were jumping for joy literally. Yeah we love it. Why is it pink. Sometimes that's naturally how it occurs. Those are at antioxidants. That are doing their thing. It's the organic fair for life. Coconut water that even people who don't like coconut water love and this answer. I have had coconut water for many many years. I've tried many many different. Have i have never come across one. That i like as much as this. It tastes like a coconut coconut. And that's why it is pink because if you've ever done that visit shop dot harmless harvest dot com and enter the code long for ten percent off your first order plus free shipping. Can you hear me christian. i can hear you. Oh good because now. I can tell people about the leader of spoken spoken-word entertainment and audiobooks. I'm trying to remember the name. Can i help you. Yeah audible yes. Audible has everything for bestsellers new releases celeb memoirs. Which i know you love. Yes and now. Audible is giving their members even more with the all new plus catalogue. So you'll get access to thousands and thousands of audiobooks podcasts audible. Originals guided fitness program know urine interior s sleep tracks for better rest. All these things are included in your membership. I recently listened to roker book. You look so much better in person. I loved it. I love him and i love his voice. That's the thing. They raided his book and it was a beautiful to listen to. I've been listening to sapiens. I'm reading at the same time And yes to listeners of the show. It is taking me months to get through this. You can start exploring audible with a free thirty day. Trial now visit audible dot com slash long or text. Long to five hundred five hundred. That's audible dot com slash long or text long to five hundred five hundred delegates. Meet again all right. i do all day. I short questions. Correct lightning round. Yes sir. what's your most commonly used emojis. I think i think a thumbs up. Okay yeah that's pretty soon a thumbs up or crooked tears out of the is laughing. Okay and would you do that instead of writing. Ha ha ha. I right i have to write ha ha ha and it comes up and i clicked it. I'm okay. I haven't mastered the quick emoji board haven't either. Yeah if you could have one snack food for the rest of your life What what would it be hot tamales hot tamales. Oh my god. I haven't had a hot tamale in years. Jesus yeah you really into cinnamon. He i like them. I like i like i like them. I like them. I eat them. I like them enjoy him. Move through me all right. It's like Yeah they've they've just always been my favorite movie snack candy. Just put them away. I can not like anything chocolate. He feels pretty heavy very quickly. I'm not our guy. And i'm not as starburst taffy sweet guy either. So it's got the homey and the cinnamon and i a like. I'll really spoil myself with hot tamales amount. Do oh my god. You're my energy company. Should choose not to drink. Man i would no i just ainley okay all right yeah and minimum amount do animal classic taryn that is such a great taryn combination of the session great. I'd love to see you after one of those after you take by. John knows boiling. You're like monkey. How's your nephew did he. Yes ma'am. I hope you enjoyed it what i was gonna ask you. What your favorite movie. But i also want to really quick ask about guns. Killing gunther talked about schwarzenegger woke up. Was that experience like this. Is a movie directed a couple of years ago. I'm not young you yes no for the listening audience. This remember this right. I recall it was. Yeah it was it was the most fulfilling thing i've worked on. Just because i learn more doing that than anything and i was in engaged and responsible for so many elements and this is a movie that i'd written thinking like what's something super stupid. And and and silly. Like in the genre of luke basan or john tiernan in action movie that i love that genre which i would never be cast in none in the style of like a guest guffman mockumentary thing and we'll do it super cheap and we'll do it just on the sly and it'll look stupid in the point of it will be like these are not these people would never be hitmen and you know. There's nothing threatening about these people and then just getting and shopping around him pitching it. We were pitched arnold schwarzenegger for like kind of the cameo reveal at the end of the movie and and he said yeah. He's somehow said yeah. It's it's yeah. It's insane. Because he i mean. Jim carey like my hero. But arnold schwarzenegger movies where the oh the yang of the jim. Carrey in to me yes and so in the first movie i saw was terminator two And just i couldn't believe it. And and i played it cool and i was professional. Tried to wear my directing hat and be respect when this is when you have a meeting with him. Tearing out through skype meetings at first and like him calling from his sun valley home in idaho and be like going to do good to read the script. I if i think it's a great character for me because it's all builds off of things that people for and i was like. Yeah arnold i agree with that. And then wakes me and going to his house and like pitching ham and meeting meeting with him there and like when when when he the first time i talked to him was over facetime and he was in his this lodge valley and he's got a huge oil painting behind him from his pumping iron days like body known and he's sitting there at his desk with a gun is like lsu does the before after. Who's the best definitely done. That joke guy for dan should continue as you should. Yeah it's with paintings for exactly. Oh my god. What at that point had he already committed to doing it when you when you go out there to now so he then he read it after that and then he called me and he said yeah i think i wanna do it. Let's do it. And so then i flew out to la to kinda talk to him about the division. And now i saw the character in the design and everything and this is still during negotiations. So like it's another thing that's sort of mind to lose and yet impressive. You gotta impress them. Exactly and i did. I worked really hard. And i think he had a good time filming it and i think i think him in the movie is certainly by far the best thing people who watch it the you know. They're pretty lukewarm. If anything people. I think mostly didn't care for it but nobody has been like arnold was awful this movie every every like negative review is like. Who are these people. This is not engages in so unfunny but when you get to arnold it's really funny and worth it so that was enough of an accomplishment. I just didn't want to kinda let him down. And and having him up there was the best. Is that something you'd like to do again. I mean the experience good enough. Yeah okay what. What is your favorite movie. What is the movie that you in quarantine have been really has been very comforting. Would you say well. My favorite all time is star. Wars a new hope. That's just like the number number one star wars I can always go back to about a boy that's comforting it's a wonderful life is a perennial that is always an don't always necessarily just watch it around christmas time We've been doing land to you. The girls haven't seen all of the marvel stuff so we just finished infinity wars. We have two more to go three more to go. Yeah i thought man crush university top guys you remember. Do you remember when you saw star wars for. The first time was that you saw it on. Vhs no it's always just been in my mind like like raised on it from before. i was cognitive. Your brothers are younger. Two young one younger brother and a younger sister in two sisters two older sisters. I'm just trying to think. I think you're a couple of years younger so i think you just missed the theater. Run of that one. I was one when jet. I came out in theaters. Okay and have auditioned for any of those movies. This now Either i know. But i heard you also big teenage mutant ninja turtles fan zhiyi and some and got your and somehow got into the movie. Just convince them to give you a small robot one. Yeah yeah yeah. Yeah big office. Jonathan lieberman who directed that like i. They connected me just because i just. I just loved her roles end. Yeah he was he was like Ok sure. I think there's this role that maybe can really a news report. I was I just wanna beatles. And then i remember being on set and do think like do you think like i could put in something like You know we've also got a reports of like organized. Rats stealing little easter eggs of radka king and then a future and he was so not as vested in the law of on the movie. But he's just not clearly wasn't watching it every morning before school like i was like what would you. What would you say about rats. And i was like well. I'll just say like i'm doing lists so different. Things like like human. They say there's a human fly. And that'd be like baxter stockman and stuff and he's just like let's just do. What's what's this before you direct your movie. Yeah yeah yeah okay ours before you knew that that was going to get cut out exactly. It'd be worth doing anyway. Yeah right it's funny. So i wanna see that you. You did a day on that. Yeah so fun. If you had to live somewhere else where where would it be hawaii alley. You guys go there. We used to go a lot. And we haven't we were supposed to go right before the quarantine of it all so now. I'm really really hungry for it. This is the only place i've ever been. Where as soon as you're off the plane like just on the jetway. Just like yeah. Yeah it's beautiful air if you could have done with three people dead or alive whom you've never met walt disney madeline kahn howard ashman. Oh wow what a great lineup. Yeah oh god madeline. Kahn is just a really yeah. I've been i've been What did i see the other tape. Meddling i can and you think about her all the performances. That were my god. The funniest price of yes. Yeah no she's the funniest ever great list. Who's your favorite muppet kermit. Yeah easy rainbow connection like animals a distant second. Do you do any of them up. Sure yeah every. Everybody does occur. It heater yes. I am i drive. John is sit when you reading when your daughters were younger. You reading these books to you. I can imagine you just being the best reading kids books too. I am currently reading harry potter door. Five year olds and how killing it. Who had to be one age. The rest of your life physically. What would you pick now. You have all the thirty four. You're now thirty. Eight thirty eight years on the downslide bra you. Hey what is that cake. I was trying to lead kobe's. Yeah where's the tom cruise. Tom cruise cake. That's right you still get it. Do you still going cake. Here's the thing. So guy who eats hot tamales and drinks mountain dew baja. It's actually kind of sweet for me. The white chocolate of it is too sweet but kobe doesn't like sweet things and she loves it. I really like good but she loves. Did you meet when she was filming. That jack richard you the best. We talk about him all the time just so immediately. Charming as doing everything right. He's doing he's doing research on people he's retaining everything we get called the set because kobe's filming in the jack reacher thing and he walks up and he goes straight to shay our our oldest daughter and he's like. Hey tom i really like working with your mom. It's so nice to meet you. She talks about you all the. You're just like your great and chase holding at the time. Like a gel like lighting gel. Like you got little souvenir there and like idiot than i am. I'm like insert myself and make a joke. I'm like yeah careful. He's a producer so he can charge you for that and he just actually. I'm a producer. So i can tell her she can have it. And i was like the fucking and then we've been waiting. They don't call him until they're ready to roll. You've been waiting and he goes. Have you seen the set. We're going to shoot on shea. It's your mommy's office it's come check it out. Takes a full ten minutes the cruise waiting to like look at. How cool is this. Your mom's like a major in the explaining the character and taking things off the walls shea all about shea and you're just love this is love this man and then my favorite favorite favorite part of my first introduction atop be like taking a adult like notes from my god. How you do it. This is my favorite favorite. Is that they go. Okay okay and tom's only onset because it's a phone call so he's just there to read off camera with amazing amazing. Yeah so people should know that that is actors like with a half his stature. Don't always do. I mean that's something that people will literally phoned it in from their homes out exactly. Wow he's they're doing the other side of the phone gotta video village and and they go. You can walk around and they're like oh you can cut through there but there's a door that's kind of blocked by a c. Stand or whatever. We'll just sneak through there and like shaking secret through and then i go and he kinda like playfully pushes me like he's being me and i'm already wearing a mardi wearing my comtech and he pushes me and so the contact like of my makes you gotta and like i wanna like first of all. I didn't want to show pain in front. Tom cruise of sure you never ever ever ever ever tell him about it. Yeah i thought hersal. And he's fully committed to the rehearsal. Is doing this like watching. The monitor got cool. Cool checking looking bleeding stomach cuckoo. Cool a and then also. I don't know what shape your stomach was in at the time. Exactly but i imagine it's not tom cruise ship. Not a you know access. I was it was pre kito and then and then this is the best. Part of this is the best part of the story. Then i'll stop talking but they do the rehearsal. We're watching shays listening to thing watching the monitors and it's a phone call and then. Kobe is a joke at the end of the rehearsal. There's like that awkward. The scene is over. And you're sitting wait. Got and kobe just goes. What are you wearing. And everybody goes up with tom. Ios and the director goes cut all right and he goes what i'm gonna do wanna just and he turns to shay looks he goes. Your mother is very funny. Turns to me goes kind of like. You're dead. Oh my god and i will die for him up. I'd like to point out to the listeners. That taryn his weeping is currently we parents. The greatest person can be. That's how you be i. It's so strange to i. I want to say this delicately. It's because we do like wax poetic about him often. And i think i love his movies and i'd love these stories about him that he is such a wild impressive performer in person so all that other stuff that i don't even wanna like say is that i don't know what to do with it in my appreciation of him and in a reverence for how. What a charming human moment. That is that like what he did with your daughter. so it's like it's an undeniable movie star. He's one of the most prolific cinematic screen presence in history. And it's almost like you have to talk for. And i have no firsthand experience with the other stuff really. Yeah and that's that. I've learned in being judgmental and cynical learned that about everyone across the board you learned at snl. Having a different host each week is like all i have to. You have to base your relationship in your opinions of people based on firsthand experience because you just never know where someone's coming from you never know what someone's going through you know you. That's right every week. A different imagine a whole different tone whole different energy for sure. And i read that you said eddie murphy was your favorite host is that yeah. Yeah what what was it about. Was he game was he about hosting. I never hosted. When i was there used after he came to the forty s and that lights right wonderful but jim carey hosts laws. There he was. It was like the eighth show of my first year was crazy i got to. I got a sketch on and like doing animatronic physical comedy together side by side and One of the coolest professional moments in my life i did. Did you get to tell him fortieth. Actually i was like i mean you've you've been around and i know we're together but i gotta tell you what you mean to me. He's like i get it. I understand you know. I'm standing here. And i looked down this inigo. That's ville fuck and murray. Excuse that's good. Your face just took on his appearance. That was incredible Okay if you could be reincarnated as a non human animal what would it be. That's the tricky one. I'm going to say i'm gonna say eagle just for the physical sensation of flight. Yeah would you rather be called unattractive or unfunny unattractive. Which golden girl do you most identify with. Dorothy blanche. rozier sophia a. be arthur. Yeah dorothy dodger. Cats do prefer cats really. Yeah did you have dogs so we have a cat. Yeah we have kind of the cat. They're just more efficient and a great dog growing up magic Loved him us half husky half newfoundland loyal dog. But you so much work and do you ever think about. How do you want how you want to be remembered both as a performer as a person versatile as a performer Decent as a person. Well i can. I can attest to both. Yes very good. You just turn just raised his fist. And i just did a judge nelson fist pump. And so you podcast to forget about. Oh man i could talk to you another couple of hours. But i gotta go. This is fun okay. I can't wait to tell christian. I look forward to his analysis after the show. That's what i'll be tuning in four. He's a fan he. He was very flattered by the fact that you wanted him. Yeah here but it's great this show and you're the best and i haven't spent time with him but i feel like i have listening to the show and the lungs are good folk. Well as are the smoulders would you would like each other. Maybe would okay. Thanks buddy thank you. I will i will. I need a tally that happened. It's such a great character and he doesn't give himself enough credit. Because i think it is different than roger. Rabbit also did that. I can't do it. But i can't do please any. It's hard to do that. I remember no but he was a comedian. Who used to perform the comedy store a lot. We met him one night. I think i may be thinking of somebody else. He was a brilliant mathematician. Remember that guy who yeah. He was a brilliant. I knew that. I was somehow aware of and there was something him. Yeah there was something kind of like you know. He reminded me of the villain in babes in toyland either some sinister about him and he was like a genius he was. He wasn't evil but he reminded me of neal's you evil sinister and so talented. It's such a funny but unique performance. Anyway speaking of funding unique. What did you think of that. What a guy what you love him. Well you know knowing i'ma glowing. I knew you you'd really yeah i gotta say i. Are you now hearing his impression of you a little bit. Well i i think his wife. I just met briefly when she was a guest and thought she just couldn't have been warmer and kinder when i met her and and he strikes me as the exact same way yeah. They're they seem that way. In terms of their warmth pretty amazing. They seem perfectly matched. yeah and i don't. My frame of reference is pretty limited when it comes to couples to hate to say this like i know actor couples and couples in my business a lot more intimately than i know other couples i would say and so maybe maybe. This is not uncommon for like people outside of show business to be You know being a very warm to be too warm funny loving people. But i don't know a lot of couples. I would classify them a couple goals. Yeah i think that's fair to i think so. Yeah they and it's not because they just sent us a delicious looking batch of those. That's looks good erin to those to those. Yeah he what did what did you think. I mean the y'all elephant in the room. Is that your impression on me. And that's my impression of him his impression of what's your impression of me. What's your impression of me. Whenever we answered the phone. When i try to like pretend it was you on the phone like if mom or somebody called if somebody was calling looking for you and i pretend to be you it was like Hello yeah you would do. You would always do a slightly deeper dollar version of your own voice. And maybe that's what it is perfect but it's also you don't give up as much as you're not as eager when you answered the phone is i am so i would. Also that's how. I was playing. It was like you didn't give up as much like Yeah blow will. I will say it's not yup it i don't think it was the most flattering impression i've ever heard but i also say that you know. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. So i have. No noteworthy person has to. My knowledge has ever done impression of me. Yeah that's cool It's pretty cool out alone. Makes me feel pretty special. That's what i thought you don't have to think that it's special that anyone's doing an impression of you my friends. This will make you feel better. You've heard you remember togo's my friend. John togas impression of me a very gift. He's very funny and good at impressions of music is what's going on. You know who has a bad impression of two former friend of the show jerry new york. It's terrible it's terrible. Okay do you wanna do you wanna come out today where he just did an impression of of somebody else director friend of mine and it sounded exactly like that and then he did. I think all of his impressions kind of sound like that people who are more beta than he is. I will say though. I heard That h jon. Benjamin comparison before yeah more than a few times. I know made me laugh. And i wouldn't mind getting some of that voice over work guys getting. I'll take some that spill off. Yes some of the stuff. That h can't do you. Would you just come. If h is on holiday. And he's not available. I'll i'll stab in. Yeah h christian long. Wouldn't mind the doing that. Yeah why not. I mean you do have a good voice. A rich a deep rich creamy. It's got timber timbre timbre but yeah it did it. And he was also. He's so quick. It's and then you hear his other impressions than like like like a lot of my favorite impressionist rich. Little where he's like. It sounds joe that purpose guy. He mentioned who performs vegas. it's like. Oh that sounds just like the person he's capturing like an essence of them in a funny way. He's right at his pacing program. Yes yeah you in thanks great. It was like Dana carvey doing george. Bush always captured his innocence. Yeah i mean like church. Bush doesn't necessarily. Yeah it's well said but he did but he did do an impression that was on. Oh michael sarah schwarzenegger was now incredible. Yeah that did sounding schwarzenneger impression was incredible. I bet you can do a better pacey. You do a pacy better tomorrow today. Bad tomorrow tell me. Just live. In as i i was listening to the Interview be again. And i felt the need to jump in and now i wanna take this opportunity to to say how much i'd like joshua jackson like. We should've we were kind of like. It sounded like we were making fun of him. But i don't think so. I think really. Oh it was twenty five years ago. I know but didn't open. His mouth won't talk if he were listening to those. It might sound like. I just want to get right. Well that sir. I don't think i didn't feel like that was necessary. Okay i think he's a really for the record. You like him. I think he's a really good actor. Actually saw in studies really good on that show. Great great by the way. What a great show that tammy goodbye to me But taryn is like you said. He's so quick and he is. Now i feel a little self conscious talking about him. I i'm pretty sure he's listening so so. I'm a little afraid your tiptoes depression of me but i will complement him and say that he is so quick and game willing his like when you ask them to do something. Really do jason impression on me or any or like the way he agreed to do. Mad tv i now. He is so brave well that he he like agrees to things before the questions. Even i i saw in mayerling. Nineteen years old. He was he. Does that show. That was my impression. When i sang karaoke with him that he was getting up in front of all these really like impressive. Snl veterans in like fancy pants actors. Were in that room and he was just getting up having having fun in like a show off way. Like look what i can do. It was all in the spirit of fun. Like i just fucking loved him right away and at. He's like that even the game night that we did. We played mafia on zoom. The other night as i mentioned and he was the host so he was running. The whole thing was so quick and just tap. But i don't know. I don't know how to say just such a fun way. He's like such a great guy to play games with. And you know i would imagine like a party at their house is really fun. Oh yeah who would like an oscar wilde. I don't know who would that. Be a guy like that. Like a guy that you want by the way. He's a guy that i would want if i didn't know him. He's the type of guy that i would want at my. We asked the question about. Who do you wanna have dinner with. He'd be a great facilitator. You know he'd be a guy to mc a wedding. Oh yeah that sounds like an insult. But i like your wedding. Sure taryn or you interest. Attrition is getting married. People know that christian Recently got engaged. You make it sound like it just happened to me. I just came upon you. Oh my god what. What is this speaking of getting engaged. The way he was talking about his wife i could. I could almost hear the female listeners of the show like about you know well because it's a thomas to you can tell that it's honest And he he. He speaks that way about her off. You know privately as well. So i can. I can attest to their affection for one. Another now that you need me to listeners. Here's a criticism or taryn his his choice of hot tamales l. as his favourite weird stack criticism. I think it's really bizarre. And wow really bizarre. Oh usually very open to different types of snacks. well i've had hot tamales. You just don't like them. I don't dislike but have many in a row. Oh my god. It's way too spicy and and gumy to have too many but there's something great about that 'cause also has this great. There's there's like an absurdist side to him. He's weird too know. Yeah so it's sort of fit. Well i've i've never heard someone say i don't like i'm not. I'm not a chocolate guy. i'm not a sour guy. And i'm not a sweet like gummy guy. Like the only thing left is tamales literally. Pick one thing left after eliminating every other essay. I like mike's but i don't like i. By the way. I have nothing against if they became sponsor. Red hot steel used to love. I don't mind. I like cinnamon. I still really like red hot. I'd like them. Yeah but to snack on the picket as your favourite and too many of them to like eat them throughout now. I'm so hung up on like how taryn would respond to your christmas back' tamales. that's just. It's just bizarre that cinnamon should sound to. It's too much to butthead. It's to my job. I'm doing his version of you. I guess it is a little petty. I loved his. Tom cruise story i. It's so fun to picture him. Being around tom. Cruise and being giddy variety. Know i know. I know and i mean like stomach. Bumped into him really hurt his stomach but he couldn't he couldn't press and such made me laugh so hard it's also such a good storyteller. He includes like just all the relevant information right. He's such a good storyteller. He's funny in the reenacting and like self deprecating and he's just all he said about tom cruise. He said he's doing everything right. And i would say that about him. Yeah let's read a lotta okay. Are you forcing your voice. A little bit to sound less is this i am. I don't mean to be a little weird okay. This is a letter from stephanie. S subject cumberland island and an emoji. What else how would you describe that. It's like a gritted teeth emoji. Like my favorite like like this. Oh i use that a lot to I use it for like on. Maybe i do when. I make like a cheesy joke on instagram. Augerai wonder what word corresponds to that. I'm curious how she was using it now in what what started. Read that rita. Subjects cumberland island. Oh well let's find out. Yeah okay we don't have enough information now. That's limited justin and christian. And i love the show have been listening from the beginning. Thank you stephanie. Life is short was my very first. Podcast subscription whoa. That's really cool. Since i've heard it come up more than once. Now i wanted to share that cumberland island is off the coast of saint. Mary's georgia a small town ninety minutes south of savannah. It's right the ferry to the island the ferry to the island. There's no bridge dachshund historic downtown saint. Mary's near the lovely waterfront park saint. Mary's submarine museum and historic oak grove. Cemetery saint. Mary's is also home to crooked river state park in two kings bay naval submarine base. Wow i wonder if she works. Savannah is one of my favorite places visit while there are several beautiful islands. Off its coast. Cumberland is not one of them Thanks so much for hosting such a fun entertaining. Show sincerely stephanie. S a saint. Mary's native and a dorothy. Oh so i should have read that. In more of the author way cumberland island is not one of them. Psi spent dorothy impression is a little bit like you're on many well. The shoe fits. He has spent two summers at berkshire theater festival and enjoy listening to you. Talk about your summer. Stock experiences in the berkshires. I hate snowy places. But i love summers in the berkshires. I love them too. But i also love snowy. Okay would you. Rather i should we. I get to that cumberland island Dis wo you past your is. Your spell. Really cumberland island. I don't think i didn't read it. that way. she said savannah's one of my favorite places to visit in while there are several beautiful islands are islands off. Its coast. cumberland is not one of them. I read that more as there are so many more beautiful than i should be talking about. Yeah well i don't get the credit. They deserve high. It's a nice way of your real. Stephanie lesser apologised. I have always wanted to go to taibbi taibbi island that's where the shot the baywatch remaking among other things. But i'd love to go back there. God i love that place. Was that awesome place in in georgia. That we we stop and that great coffee cooler apu or george. Great taco town greytown greg. Coffee shop I'm curious to what she doesn't like about cumberland island. I just thought it was so beautiful. But i guess they're more beautiful places i should explore or maybe cumberland island has gone to hell since all maybe yeah maybe because it was i was surprised by how untouched it seemed. Maybe she would disagree. Okay would you rather would you rather. Would you rather get a splinter every time you touch something or burn your tongue every time you eat something wolf. That's a good one way. Does that mean every time you go to something or every meal once the meal. Why would imagine it's every time you put something in your mouth then in that case. I think i'd rather get a splinter every time i will just avoid touching things. Yeah it's probably easier to avoid touching all also this you pick up before once you get a splinter you get a splinter from picking up food good question and then you burn yourself have this. How about this if you don't if the splinter doesn't apply to picking up food your hands you're saying right. Yeah i think it's a pretty clear. I hate splinters. I think you you just avoid touching things you get one splinter or you get splinters. All over your hands. Like i'm imagining making a smoothie and lifting the handle i hate that feeling of getting splintering it almost never how. Here's the question what happens to you more. Get a splinter. Ord you burn your tongue. That's a good question. I think i burn my tongue more although this summer. I got more splinters than burnt. Tung's because i was. I was touching a lot more. Would speaking of my impression of terence impression of you. I think i burn my tongue more to. I don't do either very often. don't either you know what i burn more than my tongue. This is probably what she means. This would probably apply that the roof of my mouth I don't burn a lot more than my actual you do. Yeah yeah because you know you get that little. I think yeah because i put the food in like this it gets like i don't i don't set it on my tongue when i first put food in my mouth but isn't it the first thing to receive food. Your tongue is it. I'm trying to imagine eating I think it's the top well actually like pizza thing about that last night. We ate by the way shadow to mike's pizza in fairfield. I haven't been there for over thirty years and it's still delicious. They still got it. They still got it. Mike's pizza fairfield go there yet but like eating pizza the first thing that would burn you bite down if you also if you put a spoon or fork into your mouth. The bottom of the spoon floor acted protected. So then the food is gonna hit the top your mouth so maybe you're right but still i think that would apply to her burning the mouth thing thing right i really. It's a really important. Yeah i would say splinters. Are you can avoid them more. Like you said you can't avoid eating ninety to survive so in touch things to survive. I think i enjoy eating more. Than i like touching things that gives me more pleasure pleasure out too. I mean so you'll take the splinter and just kinda sad thing to say. Now i'm thinking about extrapolating that On i mean like like it's also easy. It there's a difference in splinters between like those splinters. Those like glass plastic lenses that you can't find for days sometimes. It's just out of hurt. You know you have one in there. But i can't splinters. Suck because it's not just the pain you're right. It's not just the pain. It's the fact that there's something now in your body. Now you have to deal with what i was going to. Make a distinction between those kinds of splinters and like if they're just like kind of a big wooden splinter the whole hour that's nothing really. That's true that's why i would You can choose what type and choose. What type of burn. If it's just like a little like if it's like a burn where you're like flicking a little piece of skin on the roof your mouth. I think it's always that you always get a little pick a splinter okay and avoid touching things. Yeah me too and then you enjoy a you only touch things that you really enjoy. I don't think so because then you wouldn't enjoy them anymore because every time you ride linter rights you stop touching thing. Just stay in your house. This is a really good one. Thank you for the letter. You guys would like to write in our email. Address is life is short at once dot com. And thank you to the. What are you doing. I was just you know. It's funny time splinters. I thought i had a little hair growing in near my nipple looked to see if it was in fact hair. So thank you to our guests. Terry kill the kind and hilarious. Taryn kill him and thank you for listening and i hope you'll listen next week. That was very please. Keep your was a little desperate fred. let's just a good show mostly things to taryn. Yes so i think people will be encouraged to listen. I think so too And next week is another very special guest which well we'll leave it for a surprise like we always do and also i'm not too sure who it is. Thank you to tehran. I can't wait to go to every time we watch the rams game i think about him. I can't wait to go to a game with him and to just Again tallyho tallyho listeners. Thank you guys could be a dream life good ship. Life ashore is hosted by me justin long. It's co hosted by you. Christian long also produces it along with the likes of meghan. Monaco senior producer is michelle. Me man's audio engineer is sergio. In re case with two executive producers on this one mars louis and or non lopez for a company of name of mame of wondering voice memo coming up. A tabby. elliott. It's me your cat and urine justin will. I'm a fan of you. And i just wanted to wish i up here. 'cause that's when pumpkin skilled out gins all and pumpkin would goodbye yet.
108 - Lizzie Borden Took an Axe...
"Lizzy Borden took an ax gave her mother forty whacks when she saw what she had done. She gave her father forty one, your Delo ditty. It's been around a long, long time. Macabre schoolyard, rhyme and continual media coverage, including numerous books and films have kept the memory of a Massachusetts, double homicide alive in the public's imagination for well over a century. Now during an oppressive heat wave in August eighteen ninety two prominent Fall River residents. Andrew and Abby Borden were brutally murdered in their home. Each dealt multiple and savage blows to their heads with the hatchet. The only serious suspect was Andrew's thirty two year old unmarried daughter Lizzie who's at the house during the killings. His other daughter, Emma who also lived at home was out of town and they're living made Bridget. Sullivan was in her third floor room resting from a morning of window washing and vomiting. Following the consumption of possibly spoiled mutton stew that may have been behind the whole family. Have you been sick for days prior to the killings apprentice proper church-going woman in a nice well to do. Fall River, Massachusetts neighborhood. Brutally killing two members of her own family with the hatchet was unthinkable. And the case received widespread and constant newspaper coverage. When Lizzie was charged with the murders and went to trial, and then Lizzie was found not guilty by the jury, but the majority of residents in Fall River Massachusetts seemed disagree with the verdict, and she was shunned by most of the town for the rest of her days. When you look at the evidence, it does seem like she almost had to have done it, but did she and whether she did or didn't do it? Why did she spend the rest of her life living in Fall River where everyone assumes she was guilty. This only added to the public's fascination with her and since a crime remains officially, unsolved interest has never gone away. They're all kinds of theories as to why she may have committed the murder. She she wanted her father's inheritance who's sick of living under a domineering fathers thumb. She was a victim of incest at the hands of her father, her father thwarted a love affair. She'd had she was angry with her father for killing her pet pigeons. She hated her father for Marian his stepmother. She openly despised. Maybe all of the above contributed to the deaths. So many theories almost all clearly revolving around your father. I'll have to make make note to be extra nice to my own daughter. Monroe don't wanna don't wanna wake up to an ax ax wakeup call. That's the, that's the worst kind of wake up call. So did she do it the jury said, no. But most historians say, yes. Well, we're going to look into Lizzy before the murders the crime, the trial and her strange life after the murders all today on this true crime and dark mysterious addition of time. So. Harry Monday time, sagas hell Numata, praise, OJ angles gone. Get here, don't get Dan Collins, aka longtime, stand up comic aka the master sucker profit of Nimrod. LUSA Phoenix meet sack minion and the fourth leg bojangles and you are listening to time suck welcome to the cult of curious. Today's time suck is brought to you by the Jim Jefferies show podcast, the gym jeffer- show and comedy central covers the most controversial issues being discussed today is due to fearless. Very, very funny gyms, distinctive brand of comedy, global point of view to show extremely entertaining do does not pull punches. OJ had his accent. I feel like you get away with saying even more crazy shit. If I had Australian accent the Jim Jefferies show podcast slightly more podcast version of the show uncensored uncensored Jim, pure, unadulterated Jeffries. So listen each week, a Jim Jefferies and co host for Shah sit down with friends and guests discuss news polish. Ticks and all the things Jim couldn't wouldn't and shouldn't say on television, subscribe now to the gym. Jeffrey show podcast. Listen to new episodes every Wednesday. On your favorite podcast app, get it, suck it. Yeah. And speaking of an international point of view, I know we've gotten a lot of new listeners lately, especially from Canada, Australia, the UK Sweden elsewhere, Ireland. I'm glad. I'm glad you're listening. Glad you're enjoying time. So thank you for joining us. So let your here always room in the in the cult, curious for new members. And I really want to tour internationally Sunday. So to keep spreading suck in your in your homelands get to it. Nimrod demands it, and I'm going to start stopping a cocker spaniel schools to appease God. If he doesn't get what he wants to. No one wants that, especially now the cocker spaniels they really don't want that by the way speaking Nimrod don't worry too much about the characters. The pop up in our in our little world here. If you're new listener, if you're curious about who they are just go time. So podcast dot com. Download the time, suck apps on the Google play for Android, and also the the apple app store, and you can click on character bios and you'll find explanations of chicken. Teela lose FINA bojangles Nimrod Michael motherfucker McDonald. Aka triple m, and there are of course others Putin ju ju like our own itchy and scratchy little comic book within the time, suck world first appearing in the and suck chicken, Joe strange nineteen seventies eccentric and flamboyant Houston. Pam who showed up in the Candyman episode Bob Bob Legua Biwa all part of the effort to make this podcast little more than just a straight telling of these stories. If you'd prefer a straight telling like a dry or telling these tales, all story, no jokes will then go find a different podcast. You fund killing party pooper the silliness is here to stay and a certain amount of profanity, fuck and profanity unnecessary but enjoyable to me, but can't do my way I'd rather not due to time suck is my tempt to make learning fun. I'm a big believer that knowledge is power and doesn't have to be a chore to attain knowledge. And now times like it's become a community of others who feel the same people who support each other in the colts. Curious, Facebook group, people who have launched their own Facebook groups. People who have started their own podcast, businesses charities athletic, suck, fire them up, started their own little like. Dunston dragons group get together for this, and that's great man. Bunch of people who like hearing tales of exceptional and and the unusual extraordinary, the famous and the infamous people who feel less alone now that they found the tribe p people who have a lead, my weird passion, reignite their own passions, their own creative fire. So hail fucking Nimrod. Benefit since I reestablish what the hell is bell felt needed, feels good time talks about fun education about staying curious, your whole life. Enjoy learning enriching. Your mind feels good, and it should learn. Volve change. Others wash, rinse repeats in time, suck is not about attempting to push any agenda other than the agenda of just being logical person using critical thinking in the world. The feels increasingly illogical and polarizing. Am I going to get a wrong sometimes? Yeah, I'm just another fallible meet sex. It's like you. That's a cake because time. So because also about forgiveness, it's about learning sending your critiques, catch my mistakes, Email to bojangles at time. So podcast dot com. So they can be included in another time. Sucker update that we do at the end of the show. Republicans, Democrats independents white black, Hispanic, Asian American Indian straight gay trans by pro choice pro life, religious atheists. You're all welcome here. You're all going to hear something that's gonna piss you off too from time to time because I'm an unruly miscreants and because time sucks also. About being honest. Now being afraid to say, what you think in a world increasingly seems intent on trying to shut so many of us up and crucify forever. Having a fucking opinion that is deemed politically incorrect. How dare you have thoughts that aren't like the the other people's thoughts. Everything's got to be monitored by the thought thought police now which honors they're out there trying to trying to bring people down. Have opinions just have thought out opinions. You may not like mine, but you know, I don't toss about willy nilly. I think about this shit and be willing to change your opinion. When confronted with solid evidence to the contrary happens to me all the time time suck. So about all that more, it's probably mostly just nice place to get away from troubles past few hours of time which I get that. So thanks for listening. Thank you for allowing me to continue to do love. Thanks for letting us have a job here to tell you interesting stories today, stories coming up quick. I promise you beautiful bastards record in the suck dungeon this fine fall dates crisp outside by like Reverend Dr. Joe motherfucking paisley an Queen to suck Lindsey in the suck dungeon today. Had fun. Thank you for the people who came out to the Huntington beach stand up shows Orange County. It's always been tricky market for me, smaller crowds, but mighty crowds, man, I show Friday was electric. All the shows were fun and pissed off the bartender who apparently is a flatter and did not care for my take on flutter. So you know what? Well, maybe maybe I shamed him into some fucking in. Thanks to all the Portland Oregon times over the last week into man, holy shit. Those shows with some of the best I've ever had. My God Portland's always been so good to me, always going to have a special place in my heart. Most fans I've ever had turn out in Poland by far, so thank you. Thank you. Thank you, five. STAN of show. Just weaken and Tacoma. Let's make these the best to come shows if ever ever ever happened at the coma comedy club, October eleven two thirteenth. Another lifetime. So podcast. On the fourteenth about those narcos. Satan is led by a dull folk Constanzo in the late eighties just across from the Mexican border town of Brownsville, Texas Matamoros three shows in Columbus, Ohio on Friday and Saturday, November. Second, third Friday, early show. Two shows on Saturday lets us do it Ohio as fuck. OH tier that club up helium comedy club in Buffalo, New York, November eighth to the eleventh back to Grand Rapids, Michigan doctor, grins, November sixteenth seventeenth, including my last live podcast of two thousand eighteen on seventeenth tickets. Finally, on sale for Dr grins, small room. So be sure and get them early. So you don't get left literally in the cold. It's going to be freezing there in November more dates. Dan comes out TV links to take. It's always an episode descriptions. Thanks as always for the reviews, especially the positive ones. They helped spread the suck and help us to continue to get new sponsors and do what we do here. Now, let's get into the meat of today's Lizzie Borden sandwich. We're heading down is probably a pretty previously trodden trail for some you the tail Lizzie Borden. Well, I was not familiar with the prior. This past week has been covered in retold repeatedly over the years. There was the Agnes mills, nineteen, fifty, four ballet Fall River legend nineteen sixty five opera Lizzie Borden. The concept recently reimagined the rock opera called Lizzie. The musical. There was nine hundred seventy five made for TV movie. The legend of Lizzie Borden starring bewitched Elizabeth Montgomery who in real life with six cousins with Lizzie. There's of course to Lizzie Bordon tribute band, thin Lizzy on March twenty. Six thousand nine hundred seventy six. The Irish melodic metal band released their most known song. The boys are back in town. That song is about a couple of Portuguese workers who had previously worked for Lizzie borden's father, Andrew, who were later minor suspects in the murders when they showed back up in town on the day of the killings the boys back down, pause back in town. Donna, the ball is back in town. The boys back BAAs back Frieden active addressed to kill data Dino's bound grew. The drink flow in the blood will spill the boys wanna fight. You better let him I denotes was a bar and grill that Lizzie and her family frequented. And of course, that is horsh it thin. Lizzy has nothing to do with Lizzy. Borden would be great. Great. If it did Lizzie Borden story's been told a lot in pop culture though. You know, almost forty years later lifetime aired the Christina Ricci vehicle Lizzie Borden took an ax after that forty years after that first movie followed it with the series called the Lizzie Borden chronicles. Both were panned by critics. Both also got a fair amount of eyeballs on them bringing the case that Lizzie Borden back to the public. I just a few weeks ago, new Lizzie Bordon film, a psychological thriller starring khloe Savini as Lizzie and Kristen, Stewart is Bridget Sullivan. The family made title simply Lizzy hit select theaters. I need to see it, man. I love. Khloe seventy my God, one of my favorite access for sure. Very, I don't know. Jesus seems like really good actors to me. She's like captivating to be one of the most cats and you know, I do think he's very sexy. Also. I have seen the Christina Ricci movie and I liked it better. The most critics lifetime man fucking stepping up the movie game in the past several years. Black keys on the soundtrack stylized thriller. I feel like for the most part, they stuck to the story really well, lifetimes come a long way since pumping out nothing but cheesy Manhattan melodramas in the eighties nineties. We're like, you know, every movie about if you've got like a like an abusive dad or like a drunk husband, you know, in some fucking brow just just put upon wife, see like that was lifetime for so long. Anyway, of course, these murders have stuck with us. The case of Lizzie Bordon is just for lack of a better word odd. Her reactions to questions seem stranger trial. She seems strange her decision to stay in town which was ostracized following her trial and thought by the overwhelming majority of resins to have killed her parents very hard to understand. For me. She never married, never seriously courted anyone. Following the death of her. Father and stepmother. Her sister Emma was forty one the time of the murders also perfectly check. Attractive also chose to be what was called the time a spinster now not everyone has to get married and perhaps both of them were lesbians, didn't like dudes. Maybe they just how we're happy being alone at the very least though it was just an atypical family, not normal behavior for the times, Lizzie hosted lavish parties that lasted long into the nights, you know, into the wee hours of the morning with local actors and actresses which member of upper society, especially a single woman just did not do at the time. She did that after her parents deaths, numerous stakes were made by the cops who investigated the murder says the court made a number of bewildering decisions regarding what evidence should be allowed in the trial amongst other blunders Lizzy burned address. Shortly after the murders, she tried to buy prospect acid, aka cyanide the day before the murders. So so you know so many, just what the fuck decisions were made either by Lizzie Borden or by those investigate. Lizzy Borden. So now let's let's build up to these decisions and also take a closer look at them in today's time. Suck timeline. On those boots soldier when marching down a time, sucker time line. Lizzie. Andrew. Borden was born in Fall River, Massachusetts. On July nineteenth eighteen sixty two parents, Sarah, Anthony, formerly, Sarah Morris, and Andrew Jackson Borden. I shit you not seriously. I am not making his name Andrew Jackson. It's already back. He's on me. He's not me the most polarizing topic. I've I've done here on this. I had no idea. It would be polarizing had no idea he would ever show up get that really is Liz. He's dad's name Lizzie Borden, murdered, Andrew, Jackson, I know based on emails and reviews. Some of you not big fans. We Andrew Jackson or my take on him and I get your reasoning, actual, go over it a little bit the time, soccer updates say. So this may be a bit of a redemption moment for you. Now in this episode, Jackson gets his fucking head caved in with an ax. Definitely good. And you know, I was talking about a little more in the updates, but just know that if former president Jackson were alive today enacted the way he acted in the early nineteenth century, I would think he was a monster. I would hate his guts, right? He would be Mazar and while I respect his bravery in battle a lot of what he did for a nation and I respect his toughness and perseverance, of course. I also think he did a lot of fucked up things. You know, clearly who's not. He was not a great example of of someone having you know, ideal race relations. I'm a little bummed. Some you couldn't see kinda really like the gist of my take and somehow felt betrayed by my take on him, but maybe I should make clear enough that I didn't. I'm not condoning his decisions. I'm just saying, you know, it was a different time. I love are African American in American Indian suckers please. Please know that admiring some of the deeds in parts of the character of someone from an air long, long ago, the didn't share my ideals in certain areas. Doesn't change that about me. I'd like to think I don't mean to say something like that, but they don't people have emotions, and sometimes those emotions can lead to triggers that I'm not always even aware of her feelings interpretations. It don't seem really like fair to me, but you know, we all have our our lens. We see life through just wanted to get that out there film film needed on the same dude. I was before the suck now back to a different Andrew Jackson, Andrew, Jackson, born born in eighteen twenty two was the descendant of wealthy and influential Fall River residents grew up, struggling to get by though came from money fell on hard times and eventually made his own money events. He made a modest fortune in the manufacturing industry where he sold furniture and caskets. You also worked as a property developer director of a textile mill landlord of several commercial properties and was president of the union savings Bank and director of the Durfee safe deposit and trust company. By his life's end, he'd amassed an estate worth three hundred thousand dollars, which would be a little over eight million dollars in today's money. So very solid man. I will never cease to be impressed by the tail. Oh, self made man or self made woman. Yeah, that's part of the appeal of Oprah Winfrey, working your way up from nothing, not leaving the future generations that your family far more than you ever had early in your life man personification of the American dream. And that's what Andrew Jackson board and was in many ways before he met his untimely and gruesome fate, despite being the eighteen sixties version of a millionaire, Andrew, never spent very much money on his family. He was known as a bit of a miser, but of a Scrooge McAndrew Mick, Jackson, MC Borden I get it. Man was porn who's younger. You know, he went through some tough times, knew what it was like to truly worry about money. I I can be a little bit of a miser like a little bit of that. Reve mound, family fucked. Save your money. Not enough. People do the Borden home had no indoor plumbing or like trysofi even the most wealthy homes at a time while they're home was in an affluent area. Ninety ninety two seconds street second street. Excuse me, the wealthiest residents of the fall of fall hill, including many of the Bordon's relatives lived in a more fashionable neighborhood called the hill, a neighborhood further away from the industrial areas of Fall River far, more desirable Lizzy openly complained to her father for years about how they should live on the hill, how embarrassing not live on the hill. You know it was her dream to be a debutante living living on the hill lady of means somebody doesn't have to shit outside a less openly, trashy Paris, Hilton Fall River located sixty miles due south of Boston, only eighteen miles south east Providence, Rhode Island, Fall River lies on the eastern border of mount hope bay, which begins at the mouth of the Taunton river. Starting south from the Charles m Braga junior bridge. The greater portion of the city's built on hillsides rising quite abruptly from the water's edge to a height of more than two hundred feet or sixty meters from the summit to these hills. The country extends back and comparatively level table land on which a large section of the city now stands the area Fall River originally settled by European colonists. In sixteen seventy later incorporate in eighteen three originally named for numerous waterfalls that ran through the town, Steve western portion of the river between downtown and the waterfront originally consisted of a series of eight small waterfalls confined within a narrow rocky bed. Then beginning in the early nineteenth century, a series of small dams erased. Most of these waterfalls there are currently plans being considered that would restore recreate them, build greenbelt through the town was connection to the waterfront. If you're, you know, Fall River listener, the current population about ninety thousand people and in the eighteen nineties already around seventy five thousand people live there. It was a big city for the day in eighteen seventy. Andrew Borden made the beginning of his fortune riding. A huge economic boom in Fall River. The city's population increased by twenty thousand people during just two years on the early eighteen seventy eighteen seventy and eighteen seventy two textile production was big. It was already the leading textile production center, Massachusetts in eighteen sixty eight with over five hundred thousand active spindles, cranking out fabric by eighteen seven two. This number had doubled to more than a million spindles and spinsters. That's the main topic of today's show. Spindles Spencer's ageing Seventy-six city had one sixth of all, New England, cotton capacity and one half of all print cloth production going on the spindle city as it became known with second in the world only to Manchester England in terms of total output in this regard may make sweet spindle money, Andrew and Sarah married on Christmas day eighteen forty five which is that as weird to me. Why don't you get married on Christmas, whatever when he was twenty three and she was twenty two, but they wouldn't have child until five years after wedding day. Until then they would just fuck in for fun. Emma Borden born March. I eighteen fifty one in eighteen fifty. Six second daughter was born named Alice, Esther, but Alice died at age. Two of hydrocephalus water on the brain Lizzie was their third and last child. And when Lizzie was three years old in eighteen sixty three, her mother Sarah Borden died. Now she she was killed as fate would have it with with a tiny child's acts little Lizzie toy to be precise for death was ruled an accident. Even though young Lizzie, it seemed that she may have bludgeoned her mother somewhere between seventy and ninety times with this tiny little axe took that many wax to breakthrough Sarah skull due to Lizzie is weak little baby swings and and the wispy little baby. Hatchet investigators just couldn't figure out why she would just kind of, you know, lay there and take that. Obviously, that's not true. Obviously, a little Lizzie did not hack her mother down with a tiny ax. Her mother died of uterine congestion and a disease of the spine. Ammos twelve took care of. Lizzy. That's what the ruling was. She, that is something else, but people didn't know what things were as much back then m was twelve and took care of Lizzie despite the family living near the girl's grandfather step-grandmother and antler Rana from then on older sister, Emma would continue to be like a mother to Lizzie. The two girls were brought up in the central congregational church where Lizzie taught Sunday school children of immigrants is a young woman. She was a member of the organization of the Christian endeavor society where she served a secretary treasurer. She was also a member of the woman's Christian. Temperance union stop drinking. Fellas, get that evil devil whiskey on your hands as well as the ladies fruit and flower mission. So she just basically doesn't sound like a lot of fun. A real stick of the month. She she liked fruit didn't like drinking and yeah. Okay. And she briefly joined a local acts and through guild, she was put in charge of swing technique when she was young. That's of course that's not true either in sixteen and eighteen sixty five gives me just two years after her mother died when Lizzie was only five. Andrew board had remarried Abby Durfee gray Borden. She was thirty seven years old at the time considered to to be an old maid when they were married to spend starts only spend stirs this tale Abby. It actually put her vagina in a safety deposit box at the Bank few years earlier because she just didn't think she was going to need it established between again. What do you make me? Say, stuff like that. No Abby kept the Durfee name to link her with one of the first families of the area. She desired respect and social status was the daughter of a pushcart peddler came from very little money to marry. Someone of Andrew station was an unexpected blessing, especially age. Many times speculated Andrew had proposed Abby because he was looking. For a housekeeper and someone to raise his daughters. He wasn't exactly known romantic more more likely that the forty three year old businessman needed help raisins daughters. The true relationship between Abby and her stepdaughter Lizzy remained something of a mystery. There's there's no evidence of abuse or neglect, but several persons including prosecution witnesses in her murder trial reported that the relationship was less than loving and that things were tense between them. Some believe Lizzie killed Abby because she hated her then felt that she had no choice, but to also kill her father who would know the truth Lizzy older sister, Emma openly disliked Abby and both girls called her MRs Borden most of the time rather than mother and also rarely eight meals with their parents. There was there is definitely tension in the board and household. Now, since there isn't a lot of, you know, evidence about the day to day going on of Lizzie children or documentation. That's what I wanted us. Let's skip ahead. Eighteen ninety two. The year of the murders Lizzie is now thirty two years old. Her sister Emma is for. Forty one years old. Neither one of them seriously dating. Neither one has a job so weird. Not not not terribly encounter the time. But now if this is desirable, either you were looked down upon if you weren't married by your mid twenty s at at the very latest, you're an old maid. Now. Now we have two very old maids both living on daddy's money. If anyone is going to kill anyone else in his family, I would have thought Andrew, Jackson Borden. We'll have the most motive to hack some family members down with an axe. You know, just I am so fucking sick of pain for your lives. I pay and I pay and I pay and what do I get two daughters who sent me couldn't at least one of you accept any of the men. I talked to pun you up on. Yeah. Something like like that is fucking swinging the axe. I'm so sick of the pain and the pain in eighteen ninety two Andrew seventy years old, still working fulltime to support his wife and two daughters who both wish they lived up on the hill, especially Lizzy now that had been fun, but daddy, daddy, we, we never get anything we want. I wanna live on the hill with the real rich people. Daddy, I wanna use it. Golden forked, ate dinner with I not a silver fork does not fair daddy. Why do you only buy? I last year's fashions. I wanna wear what people are wearing in Paris. Now we're still cruel daddy. You ever spent any time around someone in their thirties or forties who never ever had to fend for themselves generally not a good look. I'm always amazed by the level of entitlement. Some of those people have and the anger they have towards the people who have just paid their way through life. Always gonna, say doing the research this week, Lizzie Borden reeks of that person to me chronically unhappy with daddy and step mommy, but never make an effort to, you know, I don't know, strike out on her own and yes, I can already hear some of you starting to write that Email the it was fucking different for ladies. It was hard as yes. I know. I know. I know the history. I know it was there were not many jobs for women. The the workforce was incredibly unfair towards women at that time. But there were some women working. I mean, Bridget, you know, the house maid. She worked for the families. She wasn't a member of the family, and there were female entrepreneurs that carved lives themselves shopkeepers and saloon keepers and many more type of jobs out west as we've learned in previous sucks at this time in earlier than this time. Like it wasn't impossible. I mean, yes, would have been substantially easier with ads system and funny, but not impossible, but Lizzie Borden just didn't seem remotely interested in that. Just. About it, but she just seemed like a brat. Perhaps she was lesbian, maybe that's why shouldn't get you. Wanna get married. That is a theory we'll discuss later. But yeah, in many ways, it just seems like eight, tiny to her sister, Emma, just kind of perpetually, moody, teenagers trapped in thirty two and Forty-one-year-old bodies, man, forty one to do that. I'm forty one. I can't imagine living with my mom like right now. Mother plays. Would you just make me a shepherd's pie with no Jeter on the talks like I asked for, you know what? Ted or does to my tummy mom and not much salt. I saw my own dinner. I'm not a baby for the thousands time. Please understand. I had to finish my game a fortnight before come upstairs for dinner. It's not about me month. There are other people on my team dependent on me. Anyway, how my God, please? That sounds like a horrible reality, but the back to h. ninety two in may of eighteen ninety two not indulgent enough father, Andrew, Jackson Borden doesn't pretty weird. He kills these pigeons in his barn. These these pages that were like Lizzie pets with the hatchet. He believed there were causing local children to come onto his property in order to hunt the pigeons and Lizzy did not care. She was known to be very, very fond of animals. She would later donate almost all of Andrews money that pass to her when when he died to an local animal shelter when she herself passed away and she'd recently built a root for the pigeons was extremely upset. The dad killed him so upset that a family argument erupted in July of ninety. Two lead both sisters to taking extended vacations in nearby New Bedford. Just father, you murdered by pigeons. Father you murdered them. Did you pay to keep them alive? Did you pay for the materials to build the rules? Did you pay to feed them? No, I did that. My pigeons went. They want Joan pigeons. You get a job, you pay for them. Sure. I, I could have given them away or obviously let them go. But I, I chose to need to see wacked him to death with a hatchet because I look, listen my pigeons, my rules if via father. Also interesting to note that Andrew did kill them with a hatchet considering three months later, he would be killed with the hatchet by the same woman, possibly possibly who cared about these pigeons. Right? Is that why did I could've been over business? It is possible. I learned about the whole pigeon situation. Thanks to today's sponsor. The great courses, plus that's right time suck is brought to you by the great courses. Plus the great courses plus has a course called forensic history crimes frauds and scandals, and the fiery first lecture only twenty nine minutes long is called Lizzie Borden, and the Menendez brothers and lecture begins with a discussion of Lizzie Borden presented by professor Elizabeth, a Murray PHD. She's fantastic. She's a forensic anthropologist and professor of biology at mount Saint Joseph university participated in hundreds of forensic investigations, been an expert on countless. Television shows one tons of awards. She's but one of so many great teachers on the great courses plus. And she told me about Lizzie Bordon and she told me about. You know how an eighteen ninety one the year before the axe murders there have been a breaking at the board and residents where only Emma and Lizzy and live in maid Bridget. We're home having a broad daylight just like the Motors would later the only things taken. We're about fifty dollars and some Abby jewelry. The police were called within a few weeks later Mr. Borden asked the police to stop their investigation. Why? Well historian strongly believed that Andrew realize that Lizzie herself was the thief. She was a known faith. She was known to be a shoplifter in town to the point shop shopkeepers. We're actually just told to quietly Bill her father when they saw her take stuff. So she was a bit of a nut overly indulge nut. I highly recommend watching or listening to this lecture from the the great courses plus to get that much more out of today's suck. And when you check out more lectures from the forensic history course, you'll have a much better appreciation for all of our true crime episodes like next week's chessboard killer suck. So with the great courses, plus you'll get unlimited access to stream this in any of their other thousands of lectures, learn about anything. Interest you people places events throughout history, scientific breakthroughs, even how to draw or take better photos watcher. Listen anytime, anywhere with the great courses plus app. You're gonna love the great courses plus, and now you can get a special free month of unlimited access to start your free month's trials, sign up through the great courses plus dot com. Slash time, suck sign up today and be sure to check out forensic history only at the great courses plus dot com slash time suck. I also learned in his course about a dark lesser-known. Second verse to the Lizzie Bordon nursery rhyme. We kick this off with in this course that Lizzie Bordon took an ax gave her mother forty whacks when she saw what she had done. She gave her father forty one, and then there's this I didn't know about. So close your door and locking latch it because here comes Lizzie with her hatchet. Yeah, dark one look at that little extra knowledge nugget comes straight from the great courses plus Lincoln. Today's episode description also on the sponsor page in the app and on the time suck. Website. Now back to the board ins. There were other tensions within the board and family in eighteen ninety two mostly relating to money. Andrew was gift in real estate, various members of his wife, Abby very well connected family, including abbey sister in this sent Emma and Lizzy into a real spoiled rich kid. They'll tizzy Emily's he demanded to have some rental properties given to them as well. It's not fair daddy, and and their father gave us out there gave them the home they lived in before their mother died. Technically. They purchased purchased it from their father for dollar a dollar. He undoubtedly had given them since neither one of them worked and then a few weeks before the murders, they sold this back to their father for five thousand dollars equivalent to about one hundred six hundred and thirty six thousand dollars today. So basically the each made sixty eight thousand dollars for being whiny and and really haven't sixty eight grand was was extra nice for them because they didn't have any bills room and board pay. For the whole lives of paid for dad, seventy docking to live forever. So they knew they had more money coming to them soon doing all rights, but now dad's starting to give some us some of his other properties away to other people who are not named Lizzie or Emma. So I'm guessing this is making them a little nervous about their inheritance. Another possible murder motive for sure. Well, a week before the murders the end of July eighteen ninety two Lizzy stayed in the local boarding house in Fall River for four days after she came home from New Bedford member, she's she's pissed about those patients still mad was daddy and mommy also the week before the murders the entire family gets sick, you know, or the few days before the murders, right, right. When everybody is back home also live in maid Bridget. She gets sick, Abby visits a neighbor who is a doctor the week before her death complained that she thought they may have all been poisoned Dr. Soon with something they'd eaten this. He told a another neighbor in front Alison. She thought someone who poisoned her milk. She said she'd seen a strange man hanging around the house and barn recently on August third age, ninety two the day before the murders of Andrew Abby, a John Vincent Morse m. and Lizzy maternal uncle of visits and invited to stay for a few days to discuss business matters with Andrew, and there are theories that this visit could have led to the murders John visit with the board frequently in the two years, leading up to the murders and it was not uncommon. For him to show up for unplanned overnight visits. He's a short train ride away. Didn't always send where to head when he came to see Andrew a week before the tragedy. Andrew had been in contact with John about a man who qualified to manage the family's Swazi farm. Andrew insisted that John could come talk to him in person and on the afternoon of August. Third aged ninety two John arrive without luggage or change clothes at the board and home. His arrival occurred just as the couple was finishing their dinner. While some Borden enthusiasts have painted John's visit as mysterious and in John is being a possible suspect. Odds are the two men just wanted to catch up on business at the trial in eighteen ninety three John even produced on the witness stand Andrews letter that had called him to Fall River that day document that was promptly appropriated by district attorney Nelson, you know? Yeah, it was read in court. Everyone every a John had also wanted to do some oxen trading in Swazi. Andrew asked him to fetch some eggs from their farm. While he was over there, invite his brother-in-law back for supper. John declined hoping to catch up catch. His evening meal with another relative in Swazi. He hurried Kirby stables went about his business across the river, returning at eight, forty five that evening Justice. Andrew was sitting down with his newspapers in the sitting room. And as the two men talked Lizzie Borden returned from a visit with her friend, Alice Russell, but our uncle and dad did not see her come in. Instead, they just heard the door closed and footsteps race upstairs in a retreat till his his bedroom, and the two men continue their conversation. And there has been some speculation that Lizzie whose room was just over the sitting room could have heard there talk through open windows, and this speculation has led some to theorize Lizzie overheard some secret business which she was not supposed to be privy to and at the news provoked in her emergence rage that led to a premeditated act of violence. Now, this is pure speculation, whatever she heard her didn't hear by ten o'clock p and the two men are retired respective bedrooms with John settling down in the guest room in the northwest corner of the house. This was the room. Abby was to be found slaughtered in the very next afternoon. Lizzie would later primarily stick to the story that some enemy had killed her father. She would say. Was probably some enemy he'd made through business dealings, and who could this enemy be will Lizzy name some names during her Nishel inquest was a police investigators actually actually only named one name, and then she also mentioned some mysterious, anger, man. She can identify who supposedly visited her father few weeks earlier, roughly a real or convenient product of her imagination to give the police. And then later the jury, another suspect to consider the following is a little bit of from the transcript of the initial inquest where they asked, do you know of anybody that your father was on bad terms with there was a man that came there that he had trouble with. I don't know who that man was win. I cannot locate the time. Exactly. It was within two weeks. That is, I don't know the date or day of the month. Tell all you saw and heard. I did not see anything. I heard the bell ring and father went to the door and let him. I did not hear anything for some time except just the voices. Then I heard the man say, I would like to have that place. I would like to have that store father said, I am not willing to let your business go in there. And the man said, I thought with your reputation for liking money, you would let your store for anything. Father said you are mistaken, then they talked awhile and then the voices were loud her and I heard father order him out and went to the front door with him. What did he say? He said he had stayed long enough and he would thank him to go. Did he say anything about coming again? No, sir. Did you father say anything about coming again or did he know sir? Have you any idea who that was? No, sir. I think it was a man from out of town because he said he was going home to see his partner. Have you had any efforts made to find him? We had a detective that is all I know you have not found him not that I know of. You can't give us any other idea about it, nothing. But what I told you beside that, do you know of anybody that you'll father had bad feelings towards who had bad feeling towards your father? I know of one man who has not been friendly with him. They have not been funding for years who Mr. harem, see Mr. harem, c Harrington, what relation is heat to him. He is my father's brother in law. Your mother's brother. My father's only sister married Mr. Harrington. Anybody else that was on bad terms with your father or your father was on bad terms with now that I know of. So I don't know. So you know she, she's a lot of vague answers now. Now let's go to the day of the murders. So she's now she's been she there's possibilities. Like is it something you know, mystery, man, what's going on to other people mad at him a comment more on a later I don't. I don't think so. You'll see that her testimony is kind of all over the place and you contradict yourself and it seems like bullshit to me to my guts now. But yeah, let's go to the day of the murders. August fourth, eighteen ninety two Abby and Andrew Gordon murdered in their home that morning abbey murdered between nine AM and ten thirty am Andrew murder between ten thirty and eleven ten AM brother-in-law John Moores had slept in the guest room. She said the night before an abbey had went up that morning to make the bed after he left abbey was facing her killer when she was attacked based on the evidence that she was struck first on the side of the head with a hatchet for me to cut just above her ear. Shouldn't have to be faced, but there's a good chance then she'd probably they think she turned fell face down on the floor after which point her killer struck her many times delivering seventeen additional direct hits to her head to the back of her head. Odds are she didn't live past the first blow or first few blows Jesus man eighteen hits the to the fuck and head with an axe direct shots to me. That seems like either the work of some acts Lovin serial killer or a crime of passion. You know, in the sense that somebody like your tact by someone who knows you to build up that much anger towards you. Or someone gets, you've just really loves smashing people's heads it with the next. Now, were there any other acts murders in Fall River Massachusetts, around the time of the board murders? Yes. There actually was would come up at trial, but it shouldn't have in my opinion. And you'll see why here on the morning of may thirty first 1893 less than a year after Lizzie, father and stepmother were killed with an axe hatchet. The mutilated remains of twenty two year old. Bertha Manchester are found in her home on new Boston road in Fall River. She'd been hacked twenty three times in the back of her skull and or between the back of her school and and the base of the back of her school. So so twenty three shots around the back of her head. Her head was obliterated also like the board murders the crime occurred in broad daylight. But unlike the board murders, there was a defensive wounds to and she put up a fight with her attacker. Also, unlike the board and murders her watching a purse containing some money was stolen. And unlike the board and killings the murder weapon was founded the crime scene for sure. The bloody accidents lane outside by the woodpile still very strange, right. Seems like the cases could be easily connected, right? Probably not the man who was convicted of killing Bertha. A Portuguese hired hand of her husband named Jose de Mello didn't even arrive in the United States. Probably Demeo Jose de mail until April eighteen ninety three. So he he couldn't have committed the Borden murders. He was not even in the country. However, the evidence used to convict him was kind of flimsy. The prosecution's key piece of evidence was a testimony of the owner of a local store who claim that Demeo bought a new pair of shoes from him shortly after the murder and tried to pay with a trade dollar Anna plugged half dollar which were some distinctive coins known to be in the purse stolen from Bertha. So I don't know. Maybe he did it or I guess there is the possibility that some unknown axe murderer killed all three people and got away with it. And I don't know of any other future axe murders or previous axe murders occurring in Fall River. Nothing that I could find through a lot. A lot of looking. So while we may never know conclusively who killed Andrew Abby, we do know for sure they were killed with his hatchet. Here. Here are the results of abbey's. Autopsy says autopsy of abbey de Borden age sixty four years Thursday, August eleventh eighteen ninety two twelve thirty five PM conducted one week after death. The autopsy performed by w. a. Dolan medical examiner assisted by Dr f w, Draper and witnessed by f w Draper of Boston and j h leery of Fall River that an a body that of a female very well nourished and a very fleshy sixty four years of age Lau what he clinical and pleasant way to call someone fat the doctor. Would you say that Mrs. Borden was chubby fat heavens, no heavens to Betsy. I would never say such cost woods about MRs Boden I'm offended by very question fat. No. Oh, how dare you? She was well, she she was very well nourished. She. Didn't. She didn't miss a lot of meals didn't push way a lot of plate. She was in a word I would say fleshy maybe two. She was very fleshy. One might say she had approximately doubled the necessary amount of flesh to live for a woman of a frame and height. I wonder if a very fleshy spinster as an adult film category by the way, Dow sorry, I wanna move on anyway. MRs Borden diving back into the official report. Now five feet three inches in height, know stiffness of death owing to decomposition which was far advanced abdomen had already been opened, artificial teeth and upper jaw. No marks of violence on front of body on back of body was first an incised wound two and two and a half inches in length and two and a two and a half inches in depth. Oh no. And two and a half inches in depth. The lower angle of the wound was over her spine and four inches below the junction of her neck with body and extending thence upward and outward to the left on the forehead and bridge of nose with three contused wounds those on the floor had been oval lengthwise his body. When I first read that last part, I thought it said confused my brain just Trittin just turned into that just like three confused words. Contused means a wound that doesn't break the SC. Skin, like a rather causes bruises, which which makes a lot more insensitive. A lot more sensitive confused wound. Just one of those wounds down the face doctor. Well, those wounds confused they can decide at the last rations or contusions, or burns or bone break. So even paper cuts, those particular wounds dumb it in a bag of rocks. Second, the contusion on bridge of nose was one inch in length by one half inch in width. Third on the forehead was one inch above left eyebrow one one, fourth inches long by three, eight inch in width. The other one and one, fourth inches above eyebrow and one and a half inches long by quarter inch wide. On the head. There were eighteen distinct wounds, incised and crushing all, but four on the right side counting from left to right with the face downwards, the wounds was follows. One was glancing scalp, wound, two inches in length by one and one, half inches in width, situated, three inches above the left ear hole cut from above downwards, did not penetrate the skull to exactly. On top of the skull, one inch, long penetrating into it, but not through the school. Three was parallel to number two one and a half inches long and penetrating through the skull, and it just goes on like that to describe a total of eighteen different blows doctors would say that the first blow likely killed her. And then the rest of the report breaks the body into different sections to describe the wounds like head. There was a hole in the right side of skull, four and a half to five and one quarter inches through which the brain evacuated and fluid condition being entirely decomposed, jeez, sorry, anyone trying to eat right now. All listen, man, my God. That is that is the kind of sense that makes you give up on a bowl of oatmeal. The brain evacuated in fluid condition being entirely decomposed, check. Please done done. Now chest the chest and abdomen were opened by one incision from chin to pubis. Now this is it because they just taken out the stomach to have examined for for poison, lungs bound. Down behind, but normal hot, normal abdomen, stomach and part of bowel had been removed. Yeah. Again, they just removed. Yeah, they're, they're, they removed. Yeah, except to examine her organs. Now back to the time line for a moment, they didn't find anything actually, by the way to the, they found the the, they didn't find any trace of poison in their systems. So Andrew and Morse went to the sitting room after breakfast where the cheddar for an hour the morning in the murders, August fourth, round, seven thirty AM and then Morris left to visit a relative at eight forty eight AM Andrew went to for morning, walk at a little after nine AM. He returned at ten thirty AM possibly as late at ten forty five in. But his key was not unlock the door. So he knocked to get someone inside to let him it Bridget Maggie Sullivan, the board and live in maid tried to unjam the door, but couldn't and curse after which point bridge testified that she heard Lizzie laughing from upstairs. Now, this is significant detail because abbey's body was visible through the gap between the bed and the floor when viewed climbing the stairs. But at the top of the stairs, her body would have been hidden by the bed and she had to have been killed before Andrew, got home. You know it just, I mean, it makes sense that Andrew would here. Someone in the house being killed with an axe if he was home. And then she knows she she used to. So if Lizzie would have been upstairs on the way upstairs, she would have seen the body Lizzy would later testified that her father asked where Astra, where Abby was when he returned home and Lizzy replied that a messenger came with the letter asking Abby to visit a sick friend Lizzie stated that she helped remove bothers boots and brought him his slippers before he laid down on this over for a nap. However, in the photo of him dead, would you can find a line from the crime scene. His shoes are visible on his body so that that's not good. That doesn't look good compared to her testimony and who was this messenger? This is one of the biggest things in the story to me that just makes me think that Lizzie Borden was completely full of shit and that she did it what friend of abbey's was sick. This is never revealed, which is incredibly suspicious. This had happened. Then Abby would have been at a friend's house writes that morning instead of the truth, which was she stayed home. Got murdered. So it seems like Lizzie lion's teeth when she talks about some mysterious messenger in a sick friend. That would never be revealed. Also, you know, Abby claim to spend a lot of time in the morning, the murders in the or I'm sorry, Lizzy compl- claim to spend a lot of time the morning of the murders in the barn behind the house where the pigeons used to be doing what like, who just hangs out in an abandoned pigeon coop investigators would examine the barn loft that hot August day in say that the heat was stifling that no one in the right mind. She a quote, no one in the right mind would spend any time there that morning. Also Lizzy would tell investigators that she had gone up into the barn to look for lead to make sinkers for an upcoming fishing trip that no one, but Lizzie knew about also investigators reported. There were no footprints in the law. Just a bunch of dust and cobwebs and look like anyone have been up during awhile that looks really bad. The more you learn about Levy and the testimony from both her and others about her behavior. And whereabouts I mean, the guilt she looks. Now to be fair Lizzie was not the only person home at the time of the murders. There was also twenty six old Irish made Bridget Sullivan and Lizzy told Bridget that there was a department store sale and gave her permission to go to it that morning, but bridge didn't feel well. So she chose to take a nap in her bedroom instead and her room was directly above Andrew Jackson's room and Andrew. Jackson portent bridge also is Maggie to Lizzie and Emma claims. She was in her third floor bedroom. Resting went about eleven ten AM. She heard Lizzie call out from downstairs Maggie come quick father's dead. Someone came and killed him. Andrew was lying prone on the couch and the downstairs parlor where he'd been struck, you know, ten or eleven times with a hatchet like weapon. One of his eyeballs had been split cleanly in two which seems to indicate along with his body position that he was probably asleep when he was attacked, says, if you're awake, you'd most likely, you know, turn your face when the ax is coming for it. When Lizzie and Bridget arrive. He still bleeding out. So it's safe to stay say he was killed somewhere close to eleven AM. Considering a he hadn't gotten home until ten thirty ten forty five AM needed time to settle in and fall asleep for him to end up with his eyeball, cut cleanly into an abbey had been killed a little before ten thirty AM at the very latest right at the corner place her time of death. You know somewhere between nine AM and ten thirty am considering. No one had seen her since sometime shortly before nine AM. You know, it wasn't like her to spend all morning quietly. Upstairs common sense dictates you probably die closer to nine AM than to ten thirty AM which means that the killer savagely and literally bashed her brains and with an axe. And then if it's not Lizzy or or I guess Bridget just hides in the house for at least you know, I don't know half an hour, but probably closer to two hours and then pops out and bashes in her father's head and then vanishes leaving nobody footprints, nobody murder weapon. You know, no one saw some bloody person walking down the streets, Fall River that day. So you know, easy to see why Lizzie getting arrested. Now, here's Andrews autopsy report. This is his. Actually the the doctor described him body that of a man will nourish, or I guess the corner did body that of a man will nourish here. We go with their strange corner, speaking man, interesting that they went with well, nourished instead of the very well nourished they used with Abby. So you know, I guess not chubby but not skinny. I hope some corner makes note that my corpse appears well, nourished someday that seems to be about the best you could hope for actually fit and muscular fit in just nourished enough. That's what I wanna do spend more time trying to develop a fit and muscular just nourished enough corpse. I wonder what the worst corpse condition is. Maybe extremely over fit body that of a man extremely over fit. Extremely flashy excessively. Fleshy man possessed an abundance of flesh. Okay. So back to Andrews report says, age, seventy years, five feet, eleven inches in height, know stiffness of death on account of decomposition which was far advanced. Hernia on right side. Abdomen had already been opened, artificial teas and upper jaw. There were no marks violence on body, but on left side of head and face. There were numerous incised wounds and one contused wound penetrating to the brain. Again, first time I saw this brain reads confused, even though we just went over that house. These people have so many confused wounds who is so confused about this wounds me, I am. I'm the only one confused about the conditions, the wounds to Mr. Andrew, Jackson Borden, beginning at the nose and to the left were as follows. One incised wound, four inches long beginning at lower border of left nasal bone and reaching to lower edge of lower jaw cutting through knows he's upper lip lower lip and slightly into bone of upper and lower jaw to began at internal angle of I in extended to one and three eight inches of lower edge of jaw, beginning four and a half inches in length cutting through the tissues and into bone. Three began at lower border of lower eyelid, cutting. Through the tissues and into the cheekbone two inches long, and one and three, eight inches deep, four began two inches above upper eyelid, half inch, external to wound. Number three, thence, downward, an hour through middle of left eyebrow through the eyeball, cutting it completely in halves, an excising, a piece of the skull, one and a half inches in length by half inch in width, length of wound, four and a half inches. And it just goes on like that for six more wounds and and like ABBIE or with Abby. The I wound probably killed him. And here are the summaries of of the regions are each of the regions of the body head right? Half of top of skull removed. Brain found to be completely decomposed, and in fluid condition, chest and abdomen opened by one incision extending from NAFTA pubis right lung glued to ribs in front left lung, normal heart, normal abdomen. You know, everything normal except for some stuff taken out to be tested for for poison. Which, again, you know, nothing was found a, you can look at photos taken of the andr. Abby or taken of Andrew Abby at the crime scene is pretty brutal as you would imagine. I mean, again, their heads have been just fucking annihilated. Abby struck eighteen times with a hatchet, Andrew stuck a struck ten or eleven times total overkill with both no defensive wounds. Andrew literally did not see the attacker coming. Someone snuck up behind Abby or you know, possibly, as you know, she might have turned around for a second and seeing them as they just smack it with that I blow and then just rained terror down upon her. And then again, waited what for half an hour to two hours, you know, and then you know tax somebody else also interesting. Nothing was stolen from the board and residence at day. No signs of forced entry. And while I clearly wasn't there and did not see Lizzie do, it does seem like if she didn't do it, whoever did it must have been someone, you know, welcome in the home, a family member of family friend, maybe Bridget perhaps although she was never considered considered a serious suspect. No historians point to her as the murder. Maybe possibly the ghosts of those murdered pigeons. All working together, pulled it off Bush's shadow pigeons with little shadow hatchets, terrifying. No, but you know the Bordon's technically I keep saying hatchet next. Yeah, they were not struck with an accident. Unless with the nursery rhyme, say was a a hatchet, was the murder weapon is smaller ex. Yeah, so so okay. Back the time line, eleven ten AM Lizzy screams back there upon seeing her dead father, bridged the mate, aka Maggie Russia's over and sees Andrew and then runs out of the house and across the street to alert a doctor what has happened. And this is interesting to how about just Bridget. Why was she called Maggie? Sometimes we'll because the previous previous maids name was Maggie. That's gonna make you feel good. You gotta know your truly just another servant to somebody that they make. You know, they make it very clear. They don't give a shit about us a human being. When I just so lazy, they call you the name of the previous mate, and she had worked for them for for quite some time from what I gathered, and they just didn't feel like learning the name bridges. You know, they didn't even bother calling her like new Maggie or Maggie do. Anyway. Bridget gets the doctor Dr. Seabury Warren Bowen who rushes over to see the bodies what a name you can call me Dr. Whoa. And if that is what you feel comfortable with, all you can call me what my friends call me Dr. Seabury. Warren Bowen. Reverend Dr. Seabury worn in the fourth Esquire PHD notary public. Anyway, the police were not far behind Dr bone. One of the other neighbors having alerted the police after hearing Lizzy screams and seem Bridget runs screaming of the house to get Dr Bowen police arrive approximately live forty, five AM some speculate Dr. Bone may have helped Lizzy get away with the murder. He may have been fond of her. He had taken her to church when her parents were out of town unshackled around scandal. He may have peaked at her bosom once or twice during the church service that perverse animal horny scalawags would seriously he wandered in and out of the of the crime scene just wondered and back and forth between his house and the boarding house numerous times day. Actually a fair amount of neighbors would wander in and out of the crime scene that day, which would cause further problems at the trial. The police work in the board in case was an absolute shit show. They were just not prepared for a crime like this. When Lizzie was questioned by police that day, her answers very odd. Like I said earlier, sometimes contradictory. She first reported having heard a grown scraping noise or some kind of distress call. Call before she entered the house, but then two hours later, she heard that you heard nothing and she entered the house, not knowing anything was wrong. It was very, very different answers, like extremely different answers. Here's another example of Lizzie, strange confused answers taken straight from the notes of the initial police inquest winded moss come here. I, I don't mean this visit. I mean, as a visitor John v moss. Do you mean this day that he came and stayed on night? No. Was this visit the first to your house? He has been in the east year, a mole since he has been in the east. Has he been in the habit of coming to your house? Yes, he came in anytime he wanted to before that. Had he been at your house before he came east? Yes, he has been here. If you remember the winter that the river was frozen over and they went to cross. He was here that winter some fourteen years ago. Was it not? I am not answering questions but ask you them. I, I don't remember the date. He was here that winter has he been here since he has been hit once since I don't know whether. He has not sense. How many times this last year has he been at your house? None at all to speak of nothing more than a night or two at a time. Oh my God. What an infuriating maddening person to talk to does your come over often? He never comes over. Well, that's not true. Is it considering he came up with just last night? Is that the only time he's ever visited? Yes, but also maybe other times. So he has come over before then? No, never. But yes. Occasionally he's asked by dear God busy, which is it never. Sometimes always. He always comes over. He lives with us. He lives with you really know naturally, but you just said he did, but it wasn't what I meant. What did you mean? Lizzy I meant he always never sometimes comes over. Oh, also I like pickles, they're incredibly crunchy for something so wet. Yes, you really was just odd. I mean, and and this is there is so many examples. I could've used their of like her. Her answers in the inquest. Her answers on trial. They're all over the fucking map like compl- contradicts herself, continually. He'll there's a more question. How often did he come to spend a night or to really? I don't know. I am away so much by myself. Your last answer is that you don't know how much he'd been here because you had been away yourself so much. Yes, that is true the last year or since he has been east. I have not been away the last year so much, but other times I have been away when he has been here. Do I understand you to say that this is his last visit before this one was fourteen years ago? No. He's been here once between the two yet and just on and on and on. So that's fun. Well, she was she being intentionally confusing and contradictory. Who knows so much about Lizzie is not. Now Lizzie told police she she thought her stepmother had gone to visit a sick friend as we said, return back to the house asked if someone could go look for her seemingly not knowing she was dead Bridget in a neighbor. MRs Churchill were halfway up the stairs. There is level with the floor when they looked into the guest room and saw abbey dead on the floor. This of course, is after Bridget had run across the street to fetch the doctor and the doctor came over. He initially thought just Andrew is debt. Now we're discovering Abbas dead. It most of the police who interviewed Lizzie said they didn't like her attitude that she seemed to calm and to poise and obviously you contradictory. And also this is very unfortunate. No-one thoroughly checked her for bloodstains. Not really. The glanced Rover, the they looked at exposed skin wasn't much no thorough inspection. It just didn't feel proper for them to do. So she was a young maiden of some means. And this all happened in the last decade of the Victorian era that began back in eighteen thirty seven and especially sexist period of history. While women are the lower classes were joining the workforce due to the industrial era, women of the middle and upper classes in the Victorian era where viewed as only domestic creatures, their duty was above all to be chaste. Virginal a master of manners, proper etiquettes, hostess, and lady of the manor in a mother. You know, a dutiful wife and mother, the moral center of the home and her husband's greatest champion. And basically basically a faithful servant of the husband and these women were not seen as being morally capable of a crime. Like the board and expert or some Victorian, Eric, Christian woman just couldn't do that. It was just inconceivable for Lizzie to do what she actually probably did. Do women also weren't being seen as being intellectually capable of planning something like those murders, you know, most police, all of whom were men, all of whom are men of lower means than the the Bordon's no matter what they privately privately may have suspected would not publicly aggressively push to tear through her things or thoroughly inspector person for evidence just wasn't proper Lizzie Bordon. If she did kill her. Parents was one of the few women to to greatly benefit from being looked at as a week inferior creature by the men of her day. And maybe there was blood on Lizzie even visible blood that the investigators just couldn't see. Because you know, in addition, not having modern forensic and investigative technology backed in context hadn't been invented and the people couldn't see shit, which brings me today's final sponsor time. So is brought to you by simple contacts, simple context. Let you conveniently renew your contact lens prescription. 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And so two, Lindsey Quinta suck and a daily contact where Lindsay's a busy bee and anything that can save her time helps our family a ton and simple context saves time, which means she can do more for the family, which means I can do more for the suck win, win win. We both found the ad very easy to use and we save money. So how about you? Save some money, get twenty dollars off your contacts at simple contacts dot com slash time, so twenty or enter your code time suck twenty at checkout, simple contacts dot com slash time. So twenty or enter code times twenty at checkout to get twenty dollars off your contacts. Lincoln the episode description or push the simple contact button in the app or click on it at a time, suck podcast dot com to go straight to the deal. Now, back to board, those nineteenth century police did do a search of Lucy's room, but only in initial expect inspection. I didn't cover anything. They didn't really probably look that hard. If the only up fucking context, the trial, they admitted to not doing a complete search partially also because Lizzie was not feeling well. She asked if she could go to her room, she wasn't feeling well could basically could not bother her. The prosecution did seem to criticize him for that lack of follow through there had a man been suspected. He would not have been able to pull off. You'll can you? Can you come back later and inspect my room for evidence that I just killed my parents, I, I'm a little ill and I would like to lie down for a while and get rid of evidence. I truly believe that, yeah, you've been a man man shoot shoot have been hanged in the basement. Police found two hatches are hatchet skews me two axes, and it had it had broken handle, which was suspected of being the murder weapon because the break look fresh and also one of the axes had hair and blood on it, but they ruled, it was cow blood. I don't know how they can make a conclusive determination that without being able to differentiate cabinet from human blood at the time, also the ash and dust on the broken hatchet, which people did suspect to be the murderer. Appeared smeared on to make it look like the hatchet had just been in the basement for a while when in fact it could have been used very, very recently, Jesus man, that's very damning. And then probably because they didn't want to bother to young maidens who just lost their parents. None of these items are removed from the house. Only later is the broken hatchet taken, and of course fingerprint identification. Not a thing. So prince not taken from any weapons or elsewhere just instead of so many times during the suck man so much easier to get away with shit back then it's a police. Find that acts today find that hatchet today it's brought in for testing, and so were you and if one, tiny, invisible, speck of your parents blood is on your clothes and his on the acts, your fingerprints around the axe overwhelming odds. You're not sleeping in your own bed tonight. That night police are stationed around the house. One police officer reported seeing Lizzy enter the basement. Look at the pails containing her parents bloody clothes that actually was never explained what was going on there. Why aren't those clothes brought in, you know, maybe searching for something some kind of evidence of of an intruders. I don't know. I don't know hair DNA or something else. No way of assessing. Then again, God damnit 1892 technology. You made it so hard. I'm pleased investigators on August six, two days after the murders, a police officer in the mayor pay Lizzy visit explain. She's a suspect in the murders, and then later stay home stay. Just at the open crime scene gave her plenty of time to reflect on her defense and destroy lots of evidence if need be like to dress, she was probably wearing the day. She murdered her parents seriously. The next morning, August seventh, Alice Russell a neighbor enters the kitchen to find Lizzie tearing up address. Lizzy said that she was putting it in the fire because it was covered in paint. Unknown whether she was wearing this dress or in the murders, but probably probably at first, I thought, maybe this was common. Maybe people just burn their clothes back then I actually googled did people burn their clothes a lot in the nineteenth century, and then bojangles flew across the suck dungeon and slapped me right out of my chair. He said, it's good to be curious what as bad to be done. And then he growled and he stared at me till I peed a little. And then he went back to watching old Charles Bronson death, wish movies in casually, giving me a dismissive, cyclists. No, it does not appear this how people got close when they no longer wanted to wear the back. Then that wasn't common. You weren't like, oh, I don't feel like we're in this the more. So just let's tear it up and burn. It seems that while local governments were just starting to take responsibility for waste management eighteen ninety s prior to that people were burning paper way. Some burning other types of wastes in remote areas of the property of a burning one dress, especially not as part of some garbage day burning ritual, very suspicious. Not what people did, especially under these circumstances. Her name. Alice told her that burning the dress looked, you know, really, really bad when Alice was later questioned by police and told them about Lizzie, burn in the dress. This will prompt the judge Blaisdell of second district quarter Massachusetts, to charge Lizzy with murder. And then Alice would never be friendly again with Lizzie after the whole dress burning fiasco. Lizzie sister, Emma would later testified that it was her idea to burn the dress, not Liz. She would maintain Emma would that she believed in Lizzy innocence the rest of her life. But supposedly she confess to relatives on her deathbed that she did lie about the dress during the trial to help her sister out. She was just worried that that would look really bad and she'd be found guilty and hanged and and you know, and she didn't want that. I, I'm sure, partly because Lizzie is the only immediate family members you now has left, will the inquest hearing takes place on August eight Lizzy request to have her family attorney present is refused under the state statute that set an inquest could be held in private Lizzy. Lizzy also had been given regular doses of morphine to calm her nerves. So is possible to summer confusion or contradiction. Answers could come from the morphine. I don't know though. I mean maybe think things slowly, but it's like she was beyond confused. Here's some more of her testimony. She's asked. What had you in mind when you said you were on the stairs as Maggie, let your father in the other day? Someone came here and and she let them in and I was on the stairs. I don't know whether the morning before a win. It was what the fuck, just at one at one point in your life when someone came in, you were on the stairs to like, I must have been on the stairs because that's where I am when Maggie tends to open the door. Like that's nonsense. You understood. I was asking you exactly explicitly about this fatal day though. Yes, sir. I now call you attention to the fact that you had specifically told me you had gone upstairs and had been though about five minutes when the bell rang, and we're on your way down and we're on the stairs when Maggie let your father in that day. Yes, I said that. And then I said, I did not know whether I was on the stairs or in the kitchen. Now how will you have it? I think as nearly as I know, I think I was in the kitchen. How long was your father gone? I don't know. So not very long in our, I should not think. So. Will you give me the best store you can so far? Is your recollection serves you of your time while he was gone? I speak with my handkerchiefs and got my ironing board and took them in the dining room. I took the ironing board in the dining room and left the handkerchiefs in the kitchen on the table, and whether I ate any cookies or not. I don't remember. Then I sat down looking at the magazine waiting for the flats to heat. Then I went to the city room and got the Providence Journal and took that into the kitchen. I don't recollect of doing anything else. Which did you read I journal or the magazine. The magazine, you told me you were reading the magazine when you came back? I said in the kitchen, yes. Was that so yes, I took the journal out to read it. It had not read it. It was near me. You said a minute or two ago, you read the magazine a while and then went and got the journal and took it out to read? I did, but I did not read it. I try. I tried my flat stat and went back to reading the magazine. I took the magazine again, yes. So again, it's just like. I'm sure it's hard to recall like detail. I don't have the best memory, but I would like to think that I wouldn't just give like, you know, constant just contradictory answers. You know something happened like were you in the house when the I believe I was in the hammock take you to nap, but yesterday you said you were mowing the frontline. Oh, correct. I thought about the hammock then mode actually, now that I really think about it, I was having lunch down the street. You have another street or were you having come on? I was in the restaurant daydreaming about a hammock while remember. Nice should mowed the lawn like you just fucking on August eleventh. The week after the murders Lizzie is served with a warrant of arrest in jailed. However, the inquest testimony which most modern investigators take is the basis for her innocent for someone's innocent or guilt was ruled inadmissible at trial in June of eighteen ninety three. So now the jury doesn't get to hear what the poison she tried to buy. For example, you know the day before numerous other key points and all her weird contradictory statements. Why? Because her lawyer wasn't present during the inquest and the judge was weak. So the lawyer asked to have a dismissed lawyer was there even though in Massachusetts, you didn't have to have the attorney there legally. So bunch of bullshit gets inquest, thrown out on June fifth, 1893, ten months after the murders the trial begins on June fifth. Yeah, New Bedford. I'm guessing there is usually a good reason for these long waits, but it always feels terribly unfair to me for someone who's been charged with a crime, but not try to court to have to sit in jail for months or years before their trial begins necessary evil, I guess. But there should be legal limit like the court can't fit you in six months tops. Well, then you get to go fucking home. May they'll provide incentive for certain cases to fast track him. That's that's not practical that we need to establish more courts, hire more judges until just practical allocate some tax funds from somewhere else. Maybe go ahead, let some obscure, but federally protected animal too. Fragile live much longer zone anyway, just that die for spending money on courts. Now I'm admittedly talking on my ass here. Joe can, but it is just terrifying to me. The can be charged with a crime later, found innocence. In some cases, obviously innocence only to go home to destroy life because you've been sitting in jail for fucking years while your house goes into foreclosure retirement accounts, you know empty. And then the stigma the trial makes virtually unemployable losing -nificant, chunkier freedom, and and all you get after all that is essentially a ups star about that Jit happens. Best luck any. Who's will the prosecuting attorneys in the case or Jose m Knowlton William H moody, defending Lizzi, Andrew Jennings Melvin Adams, George Robinson, one of the first witnesses for the prosecution, John, the guy who Lizzy remembered that sometimes never always visited her father from time to time or maybe never or maybe coming a decade ago or maybe earlier or maybe a more recent. Here's an excerpt from John's testimony. Lizzy seemed unusual today before and dune abbey's murders. I don't want to accuse her outright of the heinous act, but her actions will peculiar. She excused herself early from dinner, and then I found her new, the pigeon coup. Hoop out behind the house shopping and a hatchet mumbling to herself. When I inquired into why she was doing this, she simply stated, you'll see soon. You'll see soon then before I retired to my room that night while conversant with both and dune abbey in the library, Lizzy walked in giggling and pointed wants to father, and then once and her stepmother using her free hand to make a slashing motion across her throat. And who told me not to worry said she been doing that for weeks and I thought no more of it and went to bid as she returned to the bond to shop in her hatchet. Of course, of course, he if he did say that she was still innocent. No. He said I had not seen Lizzy doll from the time of my arrival on Wednesday until I returned to the house on Thursday after the murders. When I came back Mr. Sawyer was that the dole and I think Bridget Sullivan Dr bone in two or three policemen were in the house. And I think MRs Churchill and miss Russell also testifying was the family made Bridget Maggie Sullivan. Here's a little what she said regarding the whereabouts Eliza between nine and ten thirty am when. Abby was murdered. I didn't see MS Lizzy anywhere about, I can't say exactly, but I think this was about nine o'clock. Then I cleaned off my stove, went into the dining room and sitting room shut the windows. I was going to wash and went down to the cellar and got a pale to take some water. I didn't see anybody in the rooms. So she says, she's walked all around the house. She say, anybody there. I gotta brush in the kitchen closet filled my pale and took it outdoors as I was outside. Lizzie Borden appeared in the back entry and says, Maggie going to wash the windows. I says, yes, I says, you needn't lock the door. I will be out around here, but you can lock it if you want to. I can get the brush. I can't. She's me. I can get the water in the barn. I went to the bond to get the handle for the brush. And this is very suspicious to me because you know, as we already stabs when Andrew came home, the doors locked. So is a fuck. Why is the door locks by the she's out. So you know, it's like it doesn't make sense. Okay. And like, yeah. Okay. Now, here's a digital testimony from Bridget regarding where Lizzie was from ten thirty to eleven ten when Andrew was being murdered. She says, I began. To wash the window next to the front door had not seen anyone since I saw Lizzy screen door. Then I heard like a person at the door was trying to unlock the door but could not. So I went to the front door and unlocked it. The spring lock was locked. I- unbolted the door and it was locked with a key. There were three locks, I said, push push and MS Lizzy, laughed upstairs. Her father was out there on the doorstep. She was upstairs and again, important because of Lizzie really went upstairs, good chance. She would have seen abbey's body line on the floor. And again, what's with the door locking here, you know, clearly it seems unusual to have the door lock for Bridget in this situation. 'cause she's like, why is the door locked? Well, it's fucking locked, probably. 'cause someone inside doing some murdering didn't want someone to walk in on the murdering she must have been. She says, she must have been either in the entry or the top of the stairs. I cannot tell which is when she was giggling Mr. Borden I didn't say, where does he came in? I went back to my window washing. He came into the sitting room and went into the dining room. He had little parcel in his hand same as a paper, a book. He sat on a chair at the end of the lounge. MS Lizzy came downstairs and came to the front entry into the dining room, I suppose to her father. Right? And she's saying that she wasn't upstairs to remember that testimony earlier. I heard her ask her father if he had any male and they had some talk between them which I didn't understand. But I heard her tell her father that MRs Borden had a note and had gone out is that whole sick friend thing? The next thing I remember Mr. Bordon took a key off the mantelpiece. And went back of a wind up the back stairs when he came downstairs. Again, I was finished in the sitting room and I took my hand basin and step out into the dining room. I began to wash down room windows. Then MS Lizzy brought an ironing board from the kitchen. Put it on the dining room table and commenced to iron. She said, Maggie. Are you going out this afternoon? I said, I don't know. I might. I might not. I don't feel very well. She says, if you go out, be sure lock the door. I have more murdering to do. No. She said, if I go out, be sure to lock the door for MRs. Borden has gone out on sick call and I might go out to. Uh-huh. Says I MS Lizzie who is sick and she said, I don't know. She had a note. This morning must be in town. I finished my two windows. She went on ironing. Then I went in the kitchen washed out. Some clothes hung them behind the stove. MS Lizzy came out there and said there was a cheap sale of dress. Good that sergeants this afternoon at eight cents a yard. I don't know that she said this afternoon, but today then I went upstairs to my room. I don't remember to have heard a sound of anyone about the house except those I named then I laid down in the bed. I heard the city hall bell ring, and I looked at my clock and it was eleven o'clock. I wasn't drowsy no sleeping in my judgment. I think there was three or four minutes. I don't think I went to sleep at all. I heard no sound. I didn't hear the opening or closing of the screen door. I can hear that from my room. If anyone is careless in slams the door see, doesn't sound good. The next thing was that MS Lizzy hollered, Maggie, come down. I said, what is the matter? She says, come down quick father's dead. Someone came in and killed him. This might be ten or fifteen minutes after the clock took eleven as far as I can judge. And this is like really damning testimony because she's. Saying that she fucking here's anyone coming into the house and she heard no one coming out. This goes back to think of someone apparently not Lizzy based on the testimony is just hiding in the house waiting to quietly kill somebody in. And if it was someone like that, he had a bad business dealing with. I mean, wouldn't you think human nature? This guy would be like, I've, you motherfucker, can kill you. Now this something, something other than saying nothing. So. So you're you're calm enough to say nothing to someone that you hate enough to kill them with an axe, but then hit them so many fucking times with the axe. I just don't. I just don't see where that why that would happen ever. So get a bridge to tell the truth. I mean, God man seems like she's trying to get out of the house. Seems very guilty. She's very guilty here. You have Bridget her. No one else come into the house. So so now we've we've heard some testimony from the, you know the prosecution side here. Now let's check in with the defense cross examination of Bridget. Now here they're trying to prove that someone else could have come into the house and murdered the Bordon's and they ask the screen door over the other side of the house was open unlocked all that time. Yes, sir. Can you tell me any reason why person should have could not have walked into the door and you not seen him, say, see, see, not here. Why? Of course he could have now. This is so weak to me, but I get there was another door was unlocked. So technically someone could have very quietly wandered in killed Abby. While I'm guessing covering themselves in blood, then they could have hidden the guest room just and blood, you know, and then could could've hacked, entered a death, then just snuck out of the house covered in so much blood, broad daylight, no neighbor notices. I mean, I mean, I guess they could've brought a change of clothes and just what casually changed clothes in someone else's house. You know, after fucking two murders and then leave also make no. Attempt to murder Lizzy Bridget. Why wouldn't they kill them? That doesn't make any sense to me, you know? But I guess in the world is hypotheticals, you know, like some just could have happened fucking Bigfoot could kill him. Maybe the jersey devil, maybe Mosman snuck in maybe warped in from another dimension, killed them, both maybe shadow person. Maybe it was happening man, you know that shadow person with a with a hat where maybe he just, I don't know. Maybe he also just hacks shit out of people from time to time here are some more excerpts from bridges cross examination. British says, when I got back into the house after going from his Russell MS Lizzy was in the kitchen. After I came downstairs, she was on the lounge in the dining room. I did not see any blood on her, not at her face or hands or anywhere. As far as I can remember, her hair was an order. They say, you simply say that you didn't see anybody come in with a note. No, sir. I did not easy enough for anybody to come in with the note to the house and you not know it wasn't it. Well, I don't know if a note came to the back door that I wouldn't know, but they wouldn't necessarily go to the back door would they know I never heard. Anything about a note whether they got it or not. I don't know, don't know anything about it. And so you don't undertake to say it wasn't there? No, sir. And this is again just to meet his defense attorneys which I get you gotta do, but it's like, you know what Bridget is clearly saying is that it was, it would be very, very, very, very unusual for someone to come over and bring a note for MRs Borden telling him to the famous sick, you know, some messenger and the house made to know absolutely nothing about it, but just like Bigfoot could've done it possible. Yeah. And again, this is this, is that mystery note regarding, you know, MRs. Borden did. The stick needs your helping. The secret is never identified. Never come forward this alone again, makes me think that Lizzie is guilty because the media attention for this trial would be insane on a national level on the local level, even even more so the compared to the OJ Simpson trial in terms of intrigue. I mean, just imagine the media attention right in that town, Fall River and then ten months since the trial, Jesus Christ. Can someone God dammit. Oh man, Gada here. Okay, that's fun. Get out of here for those guys. I hear me just be scared. Someone sent in a creepy doll to the suck Tonkin and I'm guessing my mentioned the shadow person made them decide to to go outside. So either I didn't see the face either Joe or Lindsey stuck outside with the creep. One of the creepiest always have ever seen a fan of the time suck. Oh my God. Joseph Lamar. He sent in the scariest looking demon doll thing, and that little baby doll which is knocking up against the window that that's fun. That's fun. That's why we're going to have video hopefully the next few weeks of recording. So when you guys hear me scream and squeal, you can see it if you want YouTube. Okay. All right, man. Okay. That was fun. Okay. So let's get back to this thing though. About this note about the note. I mean, just think about that like ten months since the murders the trial begins in those ten months. Nobody ever comes forward to say, hey, it was me who was sick. I really did send that note what so that makes no sense. Unless you think that the mysterious note sender was the murderer, but who does that who's like I, I shall send the family, a messenger, inviting Abby ova and if they, if if she doesn't come at once to be killed here, I shall kill her and her husband at their homes to the next that I will clean up the mess. Then sneak back home and just trust that my message will never speak a word of this at the trial. It will inevitably follow his is the perfect crime. Get out here Reverend Dr. Seabury Bo in the fourth Esquire the Bordon's physician also testified the trial. Some his testimony was focused on where Lizzie was the time of Mr. Bordon's murder. He said they made no other examination of the time except to feel Andrews pulse. MS Lizzy had followed me partway through the dining room. And as I went back to the kitchen, I asked her if she had seen anyone. She said I have not. Then I asked her where have you been? She plied in the barn. Looking looking for some iron. What looking for Ryan looking get dragged that lead for the fishing trip. You never gonna go on the doctor also testified about giving morphine you now to deal with shock and about how they could have add to confusion answer. She gave it her inquest, maybe that's maybe that's, you know, I don't know, partly why the judge threw it out next door neighbor. Adelaide Churchill also testified at the trial testified about coming to the house directly after here. Bridget say that Mr. Borden was dead says I went over and stepped inside the screen door. She was sitting on the chair. I put my hand on her arm and said, oh Lizzy. Then I said, where's your father? She said. In the sitting room. And I said, where were you when it happened? She said, I went to the barn to get a piece of iron. I said, where's your mother? She said, I don't know. She had to get a note to see someone who's six keep going on with the note. She saying she's in the bar now where then Bridget said she was upstairs, get outta here. So, I mean, I also she said father must have had an enemy for we've all been sick, and we think the milkweed been poisoned Dr. Bone is not home and I must have a doctor. I said, Lizzy, shall I go out and try to get a doctor? And she said, yes, and I went out so get interesting. Why would Lizzy suppose abbey was dead to maybe I, maybe I skipped that part. No. Yeah. Why would you suppose abbey was dead to if she had no reason to think so, except that she wasn't there and claimed have not seen the body and again, the talk of poison. She keeps doing his interesting to me. You know where you know she went. She went to get that the day before she went to go by that hydrogen cyanide. That proves acc- acid. Just, you know, cyanide. The ingredient included in Zyklon b, the gas chamber poison. Using the holocaust, you know what she is. She wasn't trying to poison your parents to kill them, outright make them look sick. So it looked like someone trying to kill him. Interesting to note also when you Google prosecute acid uses the first thing that comes up is parental. Murder, of course that's not true, but it has no practical home use other than trying to poison someone or some animal. Yeah. I mean, I mean, I mean, cyanide is the stereotypical ingredient. One would use when talking about trying to poison someone, cyanide or arsenic industrially around the time of Lizzie sign, I was using mining operation. That's why they were selling it locally used to electric plate. Gold and silver used as a precursor to various chemical compounds ended create certain polymers and pharmaceuticals. Basically, unless you're wearing a lab coat or you work in a mine no reason to buy this poison unless you are trying to poison someone, another neighbor, Alice Russell testify that Lizzie was talking about poison. Now the night before the murders, you know, that was claimed Lizzy told her social visits issues, afraid or families being poisoned. Lot of poison talk feels like she's trying to plant seeds like, hey, you know, my fucking family dies just know that you know a lot of enemies. A lot of people wanna poison them diabolical. She really did that way. Alison said to Lizzie or said that Lizzie told me of a man that came to see her father said she heard him say. Say that she didn't see him, but her father say, I don't care to let my property his business. You know, we talked about that earlier. Told me of seen a man running around the house. One night when she went home, said she'd for said, and, and you know the bar and has been broken into twice. And this is interesting based on, we know about least one of the break ins that the burglar was very likely Lizzie herself. We don't know that a hundred percent, but it seems like it probably was her. So if true interesting for her to attribute this to some other possible murderer hanging around Alice said she told Lizzie, oh, well, you know, well, or excuse me, you know, well, that that was somebody after pigeons. There is nothing in there for them to go after. But pigeons while she says that they have broken into the house in broad daylight with Emma and Maggie in me there. And then she says, I have never heard of that before. She says, father forbade are telling it right father forbade telling it, I just I, I don't believe this and I don't believe that she would like not say Saudi because her father forbade it. I mean, she was a known shoplifter around town. I'm guessing you're also forbade her from stealing shit, but she still did that. Oh, but she's gonna keep this weird secret about a crime. That she actually in all likelihood probably committed. Alice was asked further questions by the prosecution they said, is there anything else you recall anything about burning in the house? She said, I feel as if I wanted to sleep with my eyes, half opened with one eye, open half the time for fear, they will burn the house down over us. What else? Anything else that occurs to you in the conversation? Oshii said, I'm afraid someone will do something, I don't know, but somebody will do something. I think that was the beginning. So she just talking a lot Lizzie is telling everybody she can, you know, who listened to her about someone might burn the house down or someone might poison them all this crazy constant, talk worried about her father's life. You know, reeks of someone premeditated murder, you know, especially she's Yoshi so worried about someone killing her father, but she has no idea who that person would be. How can mean it's very convenient to deplete have no to question about these mysterious people want to, you know, from the kill her dad because you know, she can't name them and she's probably I, I would think not naming them because you know she did name them, then they might have an alibi that would mess up. Story, and then Alice, you know, of course, also testify that Lizzie ripped up address days after the murder. Testified on that note, supposedly delivered a saying, MS Russell to go back again to the day, the homicide. Do you remember anything about a search for a note by anyone? Yes, sir. State what there is about that when we were in the dining room, Lizzy was lying down and I think Dr bone came in, I always thought it was Dr Bowen came in and said, Lizzy. Do you know anything about a note, your mother head and she hesitated and said, well, no, she didn't. He said, I have looked in the wastebasket, and I think I said no, he said, have you looked in her pocket? And I think I said, well, then she must have put it in the fire and Lizzy said, yes, she must have put it in the fire. Again, looks at, you know, the supposed- note the imaginary messenger brought her step mom that are, you know, have known could find. It's even though they looked in the garbage, and then it was what I guess it was burned. Just like the dress. Yeah, so much in numerous witnesses. Also, of course, testified for the defense here is Andrew v Jennings opening statement. This is the defense attorney who says, we shall show you that this young woman, as I've said at apparently led an honorable spotless life. She was a member of the church. She was interested in church matters. She was connected with various organizations for charitable work. She was ever ready to help in any good thing in any good deed, and yet for some reason or other, the government in its investigation seemed to fasten this crime upon her. Now, Mr. foreman and gentleman, I want to say a word about the kinds of evidence. There are two kinds of evidence direct evidence and circumstantial evidence. Direct evidence is the testimony of persons who have seen heard or felt the thing or things about which they are testifying. They are telling you something which they have observed or perceived by the senses. For instance, if this was a case of murder by stabbing, a man should come before you and testified that he saw the prisoners strike the murdered person with the knife that is direct evidence that tends that's tens directly to connect the prisoner with the crime itself. Circumstantial evidence is entirely different than. Want to say right here. Mr. formula gentlemen, I call you attention to it. Now I do not think the Commonwealth will question the statement would I make it that there is not one particle of direct evidence in this case from beginning to end against Lizzie, Andrew Borden, there is not a spot of blood. There is not a weapon that they have connected with her in any way, shape or fashion. They have not had her hand touch it or her is it or her ear here of it. There was not, I say, a particle of direct testimony in the case, connecting her with this crime. It just holding up. So Luli circumstance, you all right. Maybe maybe the circumstance, but that's there's a lot of circumstantial evidence doesn't a lot of circumstantial evidence make for pretty convincing picture or circumstantial evidence always just circumstantial, right? And sadly, if the initial officers on the scene had more thoroughly search Lizzy they probably in my mind would have found a lot of direct evidence now like the like the murder weapon, like blood on her dresser person further, helping the defense, Dr Benjamin handy, Dr handy. That's a strange a physician who gonna go see the doctor handy, Dr handy e a physician who lived nearby testifies that he saw someone suspicious outside the boarding house. That morning. I went by the Borden house on the morning of the motives at nine o'clock. And again, a little after ten thirty saw medium-size young man of a very pale complexion with is fixed on the sidewalk. He was passing slowly towards the south. He was paler than common and acting strangely. I turned in my cares to look at him, never have I seen him before he had light suit of clothes, collar, necktie have searched for him since been to the police station. To look at various persons, but if never seen the young man since now, I think it's important to note here that Fall River is not some little town of a few people remember to bustling industrial small city, zip up seventy five thousand experiencing a population. Boom, the Bordon's lived on a very busy street, not some quite gated community seen. Some pale. Young dude does not seem like a huge deal. I mean, we says, you know, paler than common and acting strange. It does make me think this guy's, you know, pry polish and that that is concerning, you know, because at the time Fall River didn't think to have an anti polish ordinance in place like they should have to keep human safe from those monsters own. If you're new listener, my wife is polish post German, and I love her and I love the Caesar. I've always thought post when you're hot. So the anti-polish comments come from a good place anyway, Hyman Lobinski another person testifies for the defense and ice cream Pedler who is passing by the board and house testifies that he saw a woman leaving the ball. And when Lizzie said she was coming back to the house at eleven. Oh three. So maybe she really. Did head out to the barn. This is not make her seem more or less guilty to me though. And I do feel like the testimony even ice cream Pedler should be taken less seriously than virtually any other person's profession. Right. I'm sorry, what did you say it professionals. Nice. Cream peddler come again. I'm an ice cream Pedler. That's what I thought you said? No, no, get out. Get out of here. Beat it. Okay. Get you a cool job. The mall before he's out. Well, Kasey Ken and small Neopolitan Sunday for my system, but then scrim. I know there's nothing wrong with ice cream you guys and that job title just cracked me up ice cream Pedler Emma Borden Lizzy sister of course not in town in the morning. The murderers. Also another character witness for the defense defends Lizzy about the blue dress. She was wearing that day. Remember she said that it was her idea to burn. It's let's makes no sense. And she testifies had a cordial relationship with her parents which doesn't seem to be verified by the people. But anyway, the truck goes on from June. Fifth, June, twentieth most prominent points made, you know the hatchet head from the broken hatchet, not convincingly shown to be the murder weapon because he didn't her fucking for proper forensic. I was the blue dress which Lizzy was was wearing on the day of the murders. Probably the dress. She burned a few days later. There's an argument made that it's not the same dress. There was a similar ax murder nearby shortly before the trial. Now I can't understand for the life of me why this was allowed to be discussing court. We know that the dude who did the other axe murder. Many months later wasn't even in America. When the Bordon's were murdered. So how is that even possibly related, but I get, I guess, I guess you know if that person wasn't fucking guilty. I, I don't know Lizzy it purchasing process acid, AK Sinai. That before supposedly for cleaning the seal skin coat, the prosecution tried to claim that she was planning on poison. Her parents. However, this is ruled insubstantial by the judge, right, and tossed out. So no-one no-one gets even the, the jury does not get to consider this evidence crazy to me. No one uses cyanide to clean coats, but the judge thought this evidence was irrelevant since the Bordon's were not poisoned they were killed by a hatchet, and you know, and no one has ever, you know, thought of killing someone one way and then change courses and killed him in another manner. Like that doesn't happen if I'm ever charged with murder. Can someone please built the time machine go back and get this judge and bring him back for my trial? How how do you not allow or how? How do you allow an axe murder that for sure doesn't have should do the Bordon's murders but then not allow the poisons situation, unreal to me. Because everyone in the house have been sick for a week before the murder. The bodies were tested reported. Mino- was found the victims heads were removed. This is a big part of the trial during the during the autopsy and then brought in as evidence in court like shown they showed the jury jersey the the, the skulls Lizzy fainted when she saw him on June twentieth eight thousand nine hundred deliberating for just an hour and a half. The jury quiz Lizzie Borden, and she's free to go home following the trial. The board and sisters moved to a large house in that upscale hill neighborhood, they moved to the hill just like Lizzie to always wanted. They called her new home able Croft that live in maids. You know, the numerous servants housekeeper Coachman living it up like she always dreamed Lizzy changed her name to Lisbeth and Lisbeth lived lavishly all of Andrew in abbey's estates went to the board and sisters, although they did give some stuff to Abbie's family in a little settlement later. While Lizzie was now living in the midst of Fall River high-society. She's not welcomed by her neighbors. She's ostracized. She's not. The two parties now welcome in their homes, not helping her. It was the infamous in popular nursery rhyme already. In circulation, you know that Lizzie Bordon two connects gave him other Foti wax when she saw what she had done. She gave a father forty one. Now that rhyme or a slight variation of it. Actually, first appeared at least the first as far as Lizzie Borden historians know of in the news, herald of Hillsboro, Ohio, February fifteenth, eighteen ninety four. So yes, so good chance you hurting the lifetime. Probably a lot. I picture little kids, sing it outside her home, and then just scampering off when she shows up in the window and the rhyme of course exaggerates the crimes. Are parents received twenty nine or thirty total blows not Eighty-one. She was again the recipient of some unwanted local attention in eighteen ninety seven when she was accused of shoplifting Providence, Rhode Island, dad not around to protect, oh, sticky fingers anymore. She eventually gave up on trying to be accepted by the upper crust to Fall River and began to associate with artists types bohemians actors in such throwing lavish parties. Nine hundred five following an argument over one of these parties that Lizzie had thrown for. Chris Nance o.'neil fifty four year old sister Emma moves out and they'll never speak again. She'll never see Lizzie again, following the removal of her gallbladder in one thousand nine hundred thousand six Lizzy was become very ill and then she would die of pneumonia on June first nineteen, twenty seven Fall River. Her sister died nine days later, both of them buried side by side in the family plot in the oak grove cemetery, neither one of them ever had a serious known romantic relationship in their lives, and that will take out of today's time, suck time line. Good job soldier made it back. Ben. Are now let's talk a little about the intense media coverage surrounded this trial incident. Interesting to note that most of the media coverage seem to favor her innocence. I, I kind of chalked that up to sign of the Victorian era times under the headline shocking crime of venerable citizen and his aged wife hacked to pieces in their home, the Fall River herald reported the news of the board murders spread like wildfire and hundreds poured into second street, where for years and do Jay Gordon and his wife had lived in happiness. The herald reporter who visited the crime scene described the face of the dead man as sickening over the left temple of wound six by four inches wide had been made as if it had been pounded with the dole edge of an axe. The left I'd been dugout in cut extended the length of the nose. The face was hacked to pieces and the blood had covered the man's shirt despite the gore the room was in order. And there were no signs of a scuffle of any kind initial speculation as the identity of the murderer, the fall. River herald reported centered on a Portuguese laborer who had visited the board and home earlier in the morning and ask for wages, do him only to be told by Andrew board and that he had no money into call later. Okay. The story out of the medical evidence suggested Abby Borden was killed by a tall man whose truck to women from behind. But later, you know, people who examined the crime who has some French acknowledged. Don't agree with that. A story in the Boston daily. Globe did report rumors that Lizzie and her stepmother never got along together peacefully and that for a considerable time back, they have not spoken. The Boston Herald, meanwhile viewed Lizzy is above suspicion. Saying from the consensus of opinion, it can be said in Lizzie borden's life. There is not one unmade manly nor a single deliberately unkind act. What about the shoplifting? I, I would feel like that would qualifies unmanly the New York Times editorialized. It would be a certain relief to every right-minded man or woman who has followed the case to learn that the jury New Bedford has not only acquitted. MS Lizzie Borden of the atrocious crime with which he was charged but has done so with the promptness that was very significant. So did she do it? And if she did, why did you do it? And if she didn't do it, who did it. Now, let's look a little more debt was a little more dad before you end the as episode. But before we do that, let's check in with today's idiots of the internet. The internet. Under a video titled simply Lizzie Borden documentary uploaded by doc spot, a photo, intellectual Artemis, foul types. The truth doesn't create legends and urban myths amazes me. No one ever mentioned there was a known, serial killer living in the same town. No one mentioned he was a nephew milkman. He delivered the milk. He killed several people with his hatchet and always used excessive force and took the same things. He'd seen a few dollars change a pocket, watch leaving behind other things value, even large amounts of money. He was an illegal immigrant and deported. He was known to the police prior to the board and murders and attacked. Again, while Lizzie was in prison. The DA in the ankle, worked out an agreement and sent the nephew back to his motherland. The only messed of thing about this case is it Lizzie was arrested in the first place. She wouldn't kowtow to the show to the chauvinistic DA an I for one salute her. I hope she's still giving them hell wherever she is. She wasn't. That ought. She was a tomboy lesbian feminist in a time. Women were expected to be in the company of a man across the street. She didn't give a rat's ass who you were, what you thought she wasn't going to play second fiddle to anyone. If you want to know the real facts of this case and not the commercial hype read the newspapers from the surrounding cities, counties and bordering states. Most public libraries still have a microfiche of newspapers. Also read the personal diaries at the DA the judge, the lead detective, the jurors anyone you can find from that time. Artem issue smug blowhard. Fuck you. Phony piece of line shit. Read the papers of the day. Read the diaries of the judge and watch you fucking read that stuff. If you did, you would know that everything you said was nonsense learn how the nephew of the milkman was unknown, serial killer. If you would have actually looked into this case you claim to be such an expert on, you would know there was no hatchet, wielding serial killer in Fall River. You're talking about Portuguese, migrant worker, Jose, Demeo, and he was sent out of the country in nineteen thirteen. After serving nearly twenty years in prison for the murder he committed after the boards were killed. You know, the board is being killed while he was not in the country. You dumb shit. I hate these brazen liars who just blatantly make up shit on the web and presented his hard earned will research facts to make strangers think that they're geniuses. Now he killed one person with an axe after the board Merce and nice feminist virtually virtuous signaling. You pathetic pander, there is no evidence at all. That Lizzie was some, you know, like a feminist, you know, leader or the shoes, even lesbian. There's no evidence that she was some feminist hero. You know, she was so brave. She was so independent. Why don't you tell that it fuck off strike out on her own. That would be the actions of some, you know, pioneer of feminism. Have you read anything at all about Lizzie? She wasn't going to play second fiddle to anyone. Oh, she played second fiddle daddy until the day died. She was a thirty two year old child. And in all likelihood, a cold blooded murderer way to shape a false narrative to suit whatever story you feel like telling, you know, make you cool in front of your friends, I guess. Are you a journalist? Do you write for the Huffington Post? Are you to judge from the actual trial transported to the present? What user three MARTINI played eight, a great user name. By the way, then asked Artemis, fowl a question that sends them into another nonsensical tirade. I guess her, we don't know the gender of Artemis, fowl posting. That's an interesting stuff, but why would the DA benefit from leading the milk man's nephew go to which artists Faldo flies. He'd benefit a lot, especially if it were made public. He had information before that she couldn't have killed her parents. How does he know this? Imagine if you'd reflect on your DA knowing he arrested and tried someone for a crime. He knew they didn't commit simply because he didn't like their attitude will. Actually, it happens every day every day guys, every single day difference being people then when were more hip about their constitutional rights, we're not as complicit and easily manipulated. As people are today, we'll just about to sheep while you guys. For example, our Justice system was designed to let the guilty go. Rather than risk in prison in the innocent. But today, damn near all juries vote guilty where there is evidence or not. The reason prohibition was recalled was because jurors refused to devote guilty on such nonsense. They'd say, how do we know that's really alcohol? If we don't try it and then they drink all the alcohol and then say, there was no evidence, brilliant sons of bitches. When the government realized it lost support of the people. The amendment was amended. Just like in this Peterson case for pregnant women go missing all four women found in the same spot one abducted and killed west gut. While Scott awaits trial, the house next door burglarize the daily. She goes missing neighbors call the police yet police report is changed to say the robbery took place a day after when reporters were outside the house, highly improbable, the arrest the resting officer is on record saying he's going to nail him because he doesn't like his attitude with her. He had anything to do with it or not. What happened every day in America in America is the court of public opinion. And that's the exact opposite of what you judiciary system was designed for. I guess court of public opinion would be okay. If public head a lick of sense, you don't have a liquor sense. You fucking lunatic. Dear God, if artists fowl is ever standing between me in an open elevator shaft, I pray. I have the strength not to throw him down. It gave me the strength Nimrod from locked in a room with this person for any length of time. I feel a good chance. Only one of us comes out who is this douche the head writer for David Eicher, Alex Jones artists seems to share their gift of citing a lot of facts. They've just pulled out of their ass and just presenting arguments based on documents that do not exist. I will concede that most juries do in fact reach guilty verdicts. There's a lot of evidence on that lot of stats out there, but that makes sense by it'd be fucking weird if most juries came to innocent conclusion. I mean police, we're like the absolute worst at their jobs that you can possibly like beat a job 'cause you don't get put on trial in most cases, unless there's, you know, I don't know a lot of evidence strongly suspecting that you did it super weird for most trials, not to any guilty verdicts and prohibition. You're totally wrong about that. Prohibition was not repealed because juries kept coming up with. Not guilty verdicts it was repealed because it didn't work. It was supposed to reduce crime, but it led directly to so much more crime. It led directly to the rise of organized crime. And what are you talking about with your? The juries would just drink all the alcohol say was now that's nonsense, right? Right. Like that was happening. Can we sample some of the alcohol was supposed drunk drank by the defendant? This is delicious. Can we drink all of it? Well, we're not ruin Atta junkie now you guys were not even drunk. So innocent, no, Scott Peterson stuff. What he's talking about. The arresting officer in the Scott Peterson trial did not go on record and say he was going to Scott because he didn't like his attitude lesson up. Everybody as the arresting officer, I would like now to go on record and say, fuck that guy. I don't care if he did kill his wife. I don't like his attitude, so let it be known that I will put him in prison by any means necessary. Now, if you excuse me, I have to go frame more people. In four pregnant, women did not go missing just like lacy Peterson, all to be found in the same spot. Another pregnant woman named Evelyn. Hernandez did go missing on may first, two thousand to almost six months after Lacey Peterson appearance and a portion of a torso washed up on the embark Darrow three months later, the father of her unborn baby was suspected, but never arrested. Her head arms and feet has never found Lacey Peterson's body found about two miles north of Berkeley marina over ten miles from Evelyn's body. So you know, not exactly in the same spot artists you dip shit despite being wrong about about ninety percent of the time. He makes an assertion what's scary to me about people like artists communist on the web, is it most people seem to believe him. If you read the replies underneath them, like Shelly Waylon, who replies what? I did not know this. Thanks for sharing. I think she was innocent. That's great. That's great. Now he's got another person out there too much. Bullshit Shelley. You didn't know that because it's not true. Why do people believe this asshole? Probably because he cites just enough. Factual sounding fake evidence to seem legit just like Alex Jones like David Ike just like other manipulative morons with huge followings. The truth is out there. If you want to look for it, I post my show notes on the website and the app, so you can. You can actually find my sources. These assholes do not because there's not sense. You can choose not to believe everything you read on the web or you can just step right in and just join the continually growing dumb shit parade. That is the idiots of the internet. The internet. All right. So who did it? Well, I think it's clear that I think I think Lindsay did. Lindsey. That was a weird. Lindsey? Fuck, Lindsey. Did it lets you went back in time now? She killed them with an ax to practice for me. No, Lizzy Lizzy did it. I think either leave, I think a combination of an all male jury composed of men who viewed slight chased churchgoing Lizzy through the Victorian era. Chauvinistic lens just couldn't didn't see her. They just couldn't capable of committing such a heinous crime. And and I think the combination of that an important evidence being omitted from the trial is what freed her, but why? What was her motive? I, I think probably greed and freedom from the financial control of her father. I mean, she wanted more than he was willing to give her as shown via her shoplifting. She just wanted more shown by moving to the most expensive part of town as soon as possible after the trial ends is crazy. It sounds. I think she may. She may also have asked him for accident pigeons, right? She she would later donate almost. Everything. She had to a local Fall River animal shelter. She was known to really love animals. She seemed more fond of than than people and dad, and daddy didn't just get rid of her pigeons. He hatchet at them and WikiLeaks be well because she kills only your father, then her father's inheritance goes to step mommy, and she's even worse off than before. Now the purse-strings are being pulled by someone she openly does not get along with. Also, there's a chance that her father was about to write her out of the will, a chance he was sick of putting up with her shoplifting home thefts other nonsense. She's a problem child, and you may have been about done with the Rebecca Pittman a devoted Lizzie Borden researcher and author of the history and haunting of Lizzie Borden thinks that Lizzie initially tried to poison our parents because he was just, you know, because he was just hours away from signing away, her inheritance Dahbi. And if you wanted about the poison because the later they did find that that they weren't poisoned when they when they examined the bodies, they didn't have the tools necessary to examine for all types of poisons. So should they could have been poisoned and gotten sick? And it just didn't show up in the postmortem examination. But anyway, she claims the author claims to verify the identity of two mysterious men who witnesses spotted the board and home the day, the murders, you know, there was always people coming and going from the board and home is Andrew often kept business out of his house and she, she claims to verify there too. Distant family members came by using a ancestor dot com and witness testimony. And she says it supports your theory that Andrew board was about to transfer one of his farms to Abby as a part of a new business deal involving her branch of the family and that if you lived long enough to sign the papers, this deal would have significantly lessened Lizzy inheritance. So you know, not writing, you're completely out of the will, but writing her mostly out of the will which could have prompted a murderous rage is this theory. Another theory that Lizzie was a lesbian kilter parents because they knew of some lesbian affair and forbid her from continuing with it. This is pure speculation substantiated by nothing. She may have been lesbian. There are no records of her seriously being courted by any man. She was captivated by actress Manso Neil, but a lot of people were that that's the actress. She threw a. A party for for her that caused Emma to leave. Nance also remained single until she was in her forties with single to time. So you know people just, oh, to single ladies, you know, Victorian era ladies. They must be lesbians, no, not necessarily. And you know if so, she might not have been having, you know a romance, anybody, pure speculation. Also another theory that Lizzie snap and kill her father because he'd been molesting her for years and Abby did nothing to stop it. Literally zero evidence to support that one that there seems to be based on the following to be based on Lizzie, giving her father a ring as a teenager, and it was the only article of jewelry he wore. He was buried with it that that's like the main evidence for this. Are you? What are you kidding me? He wore a ring. His daughter gave him so he must have been molesting her ridiculous out here. Lizzie bedroom, joined your parents bedroom, her bed was angled as to obstruct the doorway between them like she was trying to prevent them from getting in that or she just fucking that was the best place to put the bed. Lizzy kept her bedroom door locked at all times. Yeah, but so did Mr. MRs Borden someone call bullshit on that. It's possible in the way that we don't know what was going on behind closed doors there, like we don't know what was going on behind closed doors of any family, but no evidence there is another common theory that it was a murder suicide. Now, something to Andrew killed his wife with the hatchet for unknown reasons, and then unable to live with the guilt. You know, he then laid down while he's in shock on the couch and then hatchet it himself to death. Miraculously surviving the first self inflicted hatchet wounds whose own face is crazy to sounds not unprecedented a thirty seven year old man named Harold Baines killed himself with the hatchet in Erie, Pennsylvania in eighteen eighty eight after being suspected for stealing half a dozen rabbits from a neighbor. The previous day, the corner determined that herald survived the I seventeen blows to his own head before killing himself. He severed off both his ears, knocked his teeth out obliterated, both eyeballs, and then the next blow killed him. Now, I think that's true. I did read about it in a book written by artists foul or at least allegedly written by him as he claims on YouTube. So you know, it's got a true, it's got to be true. Now, get out of here. It's fucking crazy talk. Let's move along now to top five takeaways time. Time by away. Number one seventy year old, Andrew, and sixty four year old Abby Borden murder with the hatchet on the morning of August. Fourth, eighteen ninety two in their Fall River, Massachusetts home abbey was struck eighteen times in around the back of her head. Andrew was truck ten or possibly eleven times in the face. Number two, Andrew's thirty two year old daughter Lizzie was charged with the murders of her father and stepmother. She and live in maid Bridget were the only people known to be home at the time of the murders. Lizzie tried to buy cyanide the day before burn the dress. She was most likely wearing when the murders were reported gave a ton of conflicting testimony about where she was and what she was doing the morning of the murders. But she was acquitted number three. Despite what lunatic? Artemis, fowl asserts there was no axe or hatchet wielding serial killer on the loose and Fall River in eighteen ninety two for sure. There was another murder committed months later by someone who had never been to America when Andrew Abby were killed. Number four, maybe Lizzy didn't do it. Truly she was tried and found innocent and all the evidence that she did do it as her defense attorney pointed out at trial is circumstantial. However, there is a lot of circumstantial evidence, but you know, she wasn't found covered in blood known ones killings that we know of. So maybe innocent, but how come on and number five new info did Lizzie Borden stripped naked to commit the murders, then put address on that. Explain why there was two brutal murders of murders committed, but she wasn't found covering blood. Now this theory admittedly comes from Hollywood, the nineteen seventy-five movie legend of Lizzie Borden starring super sexy, bewitched actress. Elizabeth Montgomery forty-one at the time of filming showed Elizabeth getting naked to commit the murders. Well, it showed her getting naked as much as a made for TV nineteen seventy-five. ABC American movie could now why? Well, probably honestly, because. It was a great excuse to show as much of a Elizabeth Montgomery. Sexy skin is possible. Love Seventy-six humbled by the way the hair, the natural look. Fantastic. But could this have happened? I mean, sure. Why not? It would be much easier to wash blood off of your body then to get it off your clothes, maybe what Lizzy you know when she when she explained because you explained it's one point that there was a gravy stain on the dress she was wearing when the police arrived, maybe that was actually a little bit of blood. That's why she burned it later. Maybe a little bit blood. She just didn't didn't wasn't able to wash off. I also hear that the new khloe Savini and Kristen, Stewart, Lizzy movie has both of them getting naked for the same reason in this movie Lizzie, Enbridge or lesbian lovers. Going back to that theory and they team up to kill Andrew Abby, very unlikely. I think Lizzy would have come up with a better more consistent story if she had been working with an accomplice. But you know, it also does make you want to see that movie more hailers to FINA the Christina Ricci movie also has Christina Ricci getting naked for the killings. So maybe just Hollywood. Invention, but you know, maybe a another theory as or definitely not area, but maybe something that actually did happen. By the way. Lizzy Borden has been sucked. An interesting suck. I just feel like I just keep keep doing it. There's just so many different like, well, maybe this happened, maybe this happened, it's just kind of fun to examine the case. Look at it all from testimony had moments in the in the subsidy. It was like, wait a minute already, say this. 'cause I just kept looking at so many things for this one. I see why dominated headlines, you know, they never did charge strongly suspect anyone else in the deaths after Lucy's acquittal by the way. And and one last thing, if she would have been found guilty Lizzie Bordon would have been hanged and something to jury acquitted her because the dudes just weren't comfortable hanging on. Actually, a woman had been hanged recently just before the trial in Massachusetts, there was a big scandal, and a lot of people really didn't like it did not set well with the public. And so there was strong incentive for them to not do that again at the time. Just coach. Lee women were charged with so few crimes of significance that there wasn't even a place to hold a woman prisoner in the Fall River jail. Again, this this is a decent sized city. Should it be jail. Before her trial and nearby town and also check this out. I just can't see talking about Kesse talk to suck. The primary judge on the board in case was Justin Dewey. Justin Dewey had been appointed his judicial seat by the former governor of Massachusetts man named George Robinson and what was George doing at the time of Lizzie trial acting as her lead defense attorney. So that is a little bit of a conflict of interest. So you know, the lead defense attorney is the guy who gave the head judge in the trial, his job so many interesting facets of this case I could keep going on and on and on. But this is more than long enough already. So thanks again to the time, suck team high priestess of the suck harmony village camp. Jesse guardian of grammar donor got it was nice to have him to get the episode to him in time this week. He fixed a lot of mistakes, love it. Reverend Dr. Joe paisley making. It sounds so good times the high priest, Alex Dugan the guy's a bit elixir spanned tastic website, developers, danger brain making everything. We. You have all the new merchandise store looks so fucking great. Keeps getting better space, lizard emerge, wizards, access apparel, white little hill, Nimrod notes on people's stuff when they send it out, how cool is that? So good with customer service. You have a problem with any merge you to send it back. They'll take care of you. You know refunded. If something happened Queen of the sock, Lindsey Cummins, oh, the real brains behind this operation and and big. Thanks to bojangles research superstar DJ Sophie fact sorceress Evans also quick shout outs, longtime suckers in spaces which Greg, Dan, Donna, three spaces in Huntington beach, glad and got to see the shows. And then I got to grab some pizza. Dan donnas pizza place in Anaheim called out of the park pizza man, great food arcade games, ping pong tables, all sorts of fun stuff. Next week, the darkness intensifies dark October. We get into the tail of chessboard killer. The ghost Chica Teela maybe feeling threatened as we head to Russia to examine the life and crimes of another dimension piece of shit. Forty four year old. Alexander. Your vich Pushkin the bits of park maniac. He's believed killed at least forty eight people possibly as many as sixty to ninety. Ninety two and two thousand six in southwest Moscow bits park where number victim's bodies were found two thousand seven cents to life in prison. A childhood head injury may have changed him from a normal fun, loving kid into a demented psychopath who wanted to kill sixty two people to fill up the square's on chest sport. So super-duper fucked up and we're suck him so hard next week, and now it's time for today's time, sucker update. In time. Sunday update coming in hot with an angry. I update it's okay. This is from Katie. I will leave her last name out because they don't want anyone. You know mad at her to send her anything. If they disagree. I don't need to perpetuate any of that kind of stuff. And I like it when you guys disagree. I just so for the record, I'm not upset with Katie hill. Katie wrote master sucker. Damn. I am only halfway through your Andrew Jackson time suck and holy shit. This has made me more enraged than any other thing I've listened to in years. I know I'm only halfway through and I'm hoping you redeem yourself, but I just cannot get past your justification of his slavery. You litter literally justify slavery for about five minutes and then say, I'm not trying to justify slavery. Well, I was trying to contextualize it. I'm sorry, but the fuck the idea that cultural norms make slavery. Okay. Earn any way acceptable now. Now what I'm saying? There are many examples of people living in the US in this time who didn't feel the need to buy own land or no shoot me to buy an. Owned other humans. Okay. Well, first off Katie, I was not justified. Slavery. I was establishing that is historically normal for certain groups of people living in certain parts of the world throughout history to have had slaves. It was just a historical fact. You don't like it, but it's true to pretend is not is frankly, they'll silly and to pretend everyone involved in it was evil, I think is also silly just as weird thing to, you know, like they refer to that, like writing is like bad writing. We make people like black or white. This all bad and they're all good. It's like, no, they do bad things and they have other good illness character. And you know whether you like it and I just, it's just the way things were. I'm not going to sugar coat uncountable truths. I think we should be able to to face the truth. Katie continues, especially screw this motherfucker piece of shit who's responsible for not only owning plenty of slaves and treating them like garbage, but also constructing the genocide of an entire race lived on his land. Well, before him and his redneck family. Okay. Andrew Jackson did not construct genocide. Tonga's voted in favor of the trail of tears. It was more than one dude. Also, Andrew Jackson raised, not one, but two Merican in his own home. You remember when Hitler raised Jewish kids if they were zone? No, exactly. This tells me his feelings towards Americans were not those of genocide and were complicated and yes, they were there before him and based on your non American Indian last name, they were here long before you as well. You would not be here had not the war's been won. Wars, ugly war is hell. Thinking about here of the bomb we dropped. So recently on the poor people of Japan, fucked up, man, horrible things happen. And the trail of tears was a horrible, horrible thing. Then Katie continues. Finally, I'm sorry and I respect you, but your example of, but an African man on slaves. I is not only insulting, but also a relevant this in no way makes it okay. For what white men did Africans for the next two hundred plus years. Again, you misunderstand me the example. He's not a salty, just proof the slavery is not a white man's disease, no matter how badly some people want to force that narrative. It's a meat sack disease. That's just the truth will always be the truth. We meet sacks of all colors have slaved others at various points in history. Again of all colors. If we're going to demonize one group of people like white men, we need to demonize everybody. None of it was okay, and I wasn't saying it made it okay. I was just trying to show that. Yeah. Yeah. He was a slave owner that's bad. Also, other people were slave owners, including people who were not white. I think that it is important to state because he gets left out of the narrative lotta times Katie finishes. I'm going to give you the benefit of doubt and try to listen to the rest of the suck. I'm, I'm guessing you didn't like it, but your take so far comes off as classic whitewashing of American history. It took you forty five minutes to even mention the fact that there were slaves as part of the population in this country so far you you've spent about three minutes on the topic towards that two of which we're trying to make it seem like it's fine. No, just the white girls opinion on what is so far coming off as a white man holding up human piece of garbage, some sort of hero. I hope by the end of wrong. If so, all right, back in. Apologize which didn't happen. So I know you're still mad still a fan enlisted from day one. We'll thank you for getting to listen. I hope you are so listen, if not, I hope you come back soon. I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one though, but my take on the subject I stand by not removing the context and era of someone's life when judge them. And I goes for people of all colors. You know, you can say that what they did was wrong and that it let not there be any confusion about that. It was wrong what he did, Trillo tears, wrong, slavery, wrong. I'm just trying to point out the contextual history for because what we do a lot. Now, this we're logical thing of trying to judge historical figures and judge historical eras by the mo- morals. And by the normal culture of a time that those people never lived in and Saori you can not like it, but that is fucking ridiculous. It makes no sense. What I'm trying to do is not whitewash anything. I'm trying to remain logical in a world that seems to make primarily illogical IMO. Oceano decision. Sometimes to me, you're good. AK eighty. You got a good heart. A hope. We still have you here on the soccer. I see your logic do a love. It's intent. Keep challenging me like everyone else I needed to. Okay. Now an anniversary shut shout out from a wonderful soccer name Caitlyn Nolan, catering rights, dear, Dan, I'm writing to you out of desperation. My husband and I have been together since we were teenagers and just celebrated our thirteenth anniversary lately. We've been going through some really rough times. He worked so hard. He is the most amazing man of ever met. He's a space lizard through and through and I wanted to know if you give them a shout out. Your podcast has been some gotten through some rough shit, and I wanted to know he is seen. He's loved and he's a mother fucking bad. Aw, anyways, if you decide to find in your heart, please just let Nick Nolan from Grand Rapids, Michigan know that his wife loves him with all her heart or some sappy shit like that. It would mean the world to me. We'll Nikola Nolan. You're lucky, meet sack. Your loved man. Kaelin seems fan fucking testing. Give her the biggest longest hug you've ever given anyone in your whole life. Next time. You see her and big allusive FINA like. Kiss and then you know, see things see where things go from there. Maybe they get more exciting. Thank you care that I hope you two are doing well, and that was very sweet. Another shout shout out. Now coming from time, sucker Wendy king says, hey, they're master sucker Neo. So my space Newt Holden is huge fan. He got me into the suck after I got him into your stand up, he's super bombed that he can't come to the Spokane show December since venues. Twenty one. Plus I was hoping you would make his day, give a shout out to him. He just passed driving tests. So he's now an official license driver. Watch him, watch outspoken drivers as new lizard driver in town. Thank you for being you and leasing our little Colt with compassion intelligence and hilarity a leading. Sorry, the and don't forget. Churchouse donate ten o'clock. You're faithful spaces, Wendy. Well, thank you, Wendy. Thanks Reverend in a fun little stand up in their Holden hug your mom, you, you get into hug. They're just don't do the other stuff I'd vice Nick to do. That'd be way too much too much for moms gone fan gear. Really. They'll give your mama a sweet. Hug. Sorry about the age requirement, fucking liquor, loss and drive safe. Don't be a dip shit. Like I was recently where your built and don't be a huge dip shit like used to be and get a DUI unless you want to risk kill somebody not good. Now, last message for merit Langley asking about wackadoo tools says, Dan, I will listen to your comedy since two thousand ten. When I first heard revenge is near, you definitely bought a biased favorite, but I have a question. When did you start using the phrase? Whack. A doodle was taken from a family member or heard on the road. Did you make it up? I've never heard the phrase before and it's so sinked and perfect that I've started using myself. Yeah, man use it. Everybody uses it. Thank you for the wonderful entertainment. Keep on sucking. I think I think I made it up. I mean, if I did hear from someone else, I mean, I could have just don't remember that. I think I made it up to me. What I wanted to do is come up with a nicer word to use, then the more aggressive, fuck face or asshole. Ask clown, dumb shit asks wipe cock face. I wanted to go something little softer. You know, some for the kids know, but something a little softer words like, okay, you're not a horrible person. You're just you're thinking some real silly things right now, and I wish you'd not think those wackadoo. You got some crazy beliefs that I wish you'd reexamine your whack, a doodle. The silliness of the word takes the edge off from me, and that's it. And thank you for writing in you. Beautiful. Bastards. Thanks times. Nine need. We all did. Thanks for listening meets acts. Have a great week, do not kill anyone with an axe or or and or the hatchet much harder to get away with now that it wasn't h ninety two and try not to get killed with an axe and or hatchet, probably just as shitty to die that way as I imagine it was in eighteen ninety two and for the love of sweet Nimrod sweet baby Nimrod key on sucking. Abby actually put her vagina in a safety deposit box at the Bank years earlier because she didn't think she was gonna need it.