1 Episode results for "Molly Livingstone"
Bonus: Man, I Feel Like A Woman, Revisited
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Man i feel like a woman back in the early months of the pandemic. we ran a series of live update interviews with some of the most memorable people who've appeared on the show over the years. These events took place on our members only facebook community. Which if you haven't yet done. So i really hope you'll join in any event. Many many israel story fans tuned into these live interviews in got to ask their questions directly. But since we are a podcast after all we also wanted to share some highlights of these updates with olive. You our listeners. So today we're going to play the original story followed by an edited and shortened version of the update event. We held if you've never heard this story or haven't heard it in years. We hope you listen and enjoy and if you wanna skip straight to the update just go to the last fifteen minutes or so of this episode okay. Without further ado years man feel like a woman. The last time we had people over already feeling separate from each other we were feeling disconnected. More and more. It really was catching up with me. I i was headed towards a nervous breakdown. Basically but the last time we had company over a friend of ours who was just becoming involved in torah judaism and a whole group of them were coming to israel and they wanted to. She wanted to give them a very special friday night so who she going to bring them to. Yaakov and hobbies in the jewish quarter. Because that's where they'll get the perfect epiphany. I was off the whole night. Something was not right the whole night. That's smith she's sixty four years old and actually my neighbor in flow in jerusalem. I pass by your house three times a day when i take my dog. Nomi out for a walk anyway. East co was born in long island as jeff jeff smith. The smiths were a traditional conservative. Big see jewish family. The dad owned local plumbing supply store and the mom was a dedicated homemaker. They have three kids two girls and jeff in our story today. We'll hear how jeff became yakov. And then jeff again and then jessica and finally ska but this isn't just a story or isn't only a story about gender transition. It's really much more about a dilemma. One that doesn't have an easy solution. you know as we've been working on this episode over the past few months. I've thought a lot about a good friend of mine. Let's call him akiva. Akiva has been married a long time nearly twenty years. He and his wife have three kids. They got married when they were really young. Just out of the army. Basically which means like twenty one or twenty two and when they got married akiva was religious and right-wing in israeli politics so as his bride flat and that was sort of the premise or foundation of their marriage. They joined a community of other religious right-wingers in the west bank and sent their kids to religious right wing schools. The only problem was that over time. Akiva began to change. Actually today i would say. He's one of the most secular left-wing people. I know but i'm one of the only people who knows that you see a kiva feels that he made a commitment to a flat to be a certain kind of person to give her a certain kind of life and even though he no longer fits the part. He feels that he has to continue. Acting out this jared. Because of that promise he made her the being true to his own. Identity is to the unity of his family and community. Honestly i've never really understood this position. It seems very sad and painful but on today's show with usca story we'll look at the other alternative which seems just as painful and hard at least in some ways anyway. Let's go back to that friday night. In nineteen ninety in jerusalem's old city. Usca then still yakov met a group of guests at the western wall and then lead them home for friday night meal. I remember walking up on hold hockey nor which goes uphill. I remember working up at almost stopping. I had like twenty people behind me instead. God i can't do this anymore. This is you've gotta help me. I'm begging you. I'm begging you. It was probably one of my most real prayers in my life. I begged guy to please rescue me from this. When everyone was leaving everyone was saying everyone usually would say when they left. Oh what a beautiful family would have beautiful chabad. What delicious food and each time. I would get these compliments. It would be like another dagger another dagger another dagger and this one man came up to me one of this woman's relatives and he said can i talk to you from an alone. I thought he was going to really lay it on like oh. You've just changed my life. Because i used to get that so we went to another part of the of the house was more private and he said i'm going to tell you something and i have please hear me. Please hear me. That was an amazing act performed for us tonight. Take care of yourself whatever's wrong take care of you. I told my prior wife exactly what he said. I said it's over this. God answered my prayer. I slept that night for the first time. Like i hadn't slept in years we first heard about ucla wild back from reporter molly livingstone. Who then spent many many hours interviewing her. I asked malaita step into the studio with me. Hey molly hi msci hiding and get so so molly can you. Can you set the scene for us like where. Where were you. Recording in niece goes home right right. We are in use his home in Which is part of jerusalem. It's kind of a hippie area. Her house it's small it's And it's kind of what i expected from her. She's a very inviting person and our home was very warm and friendly. Describe a little bit. Like what is look like he. S sca is tall. The first thing. I notice about her every time i see her is when she talks you. She looks you in the is. She dresses conservative. But kind of bohemian. She gets her nails done and she uses her hands a lot when she speaks. So that i definitely remember. She has a different hairstyle. Every time i see her she's trying to play it up. Play down she's she's seeing how she looks in different ways and how she feels right so let's begin Molly where where do we start. So we'll see the story in the us. When yiska was still jeff. My whole growing up was was a nightmare. It was like being on a How you hear about some of these ratios and you hear that the they've been running for like ten years and till you realize that they changed the cast every couple of years you wonder how could someone go out on stage night after night after night for ten years. That's what i did. Every morning. When i woke up and i went out into the world i was on stage. So is very difficult very very difficult. I thought i was the only person suffering from this. I really believe that they would have me committed for bean crazy. I have a memory. It was christmas vacation. I had to have been right around. Sixteen and one of the guy yells out to me. Jeff why do you have to walk. Like a girl. And i looked at him and of course i was crushed crushed because it was not meant to say maybe you should transition or maybe a transgender or maybe are you suffering from gender identity disorder. Can i be support friend for you. I mean he used it against me was making fun of me. I just said to myself what isn't even mean that i'm working like a girl didn't even i didn't even know what that meant in my head. I said hello. Tell me something. I don't know then. Journal conflict continued and his life kept moving forward. She finished school matty young lady and got married. The newlyweds gradually shifted into an observant jewish lifestyle. They were part of cod. And then they moved to israel. Jeff became yaacov yaacov in kava. Basically did what religious married couples are expected to do. I don't really want to discuss the private private parts of allies. Look we put it into the world six children so you can share your own conclusion. You know i felt a lot of pressure. I felt a lot of societal pressure. And without her meaning i two. I felt pressure from hard. That i behave like a straight guy. Otherwise i'm gonna lose her. And i didn't wanna lose it because i really loved her and also became very successful in in my programming in the old city so that also made it harder to keep up this image more and more with all that pressure something had to give and that brings us back to that shebab dinner. We opened with when a guest recognized yaacov spain and expressed his concern in a way that for years ago was assigned from above told my prior wife. Exactly what he said. I said it's over. This guide answered my prayer. And when you ended your marriage it was under the pretense that you were gay. Are you gay. No ramada lesbian. I'm a heterosexual woman. So you went from one lie to the next. I went from a hundred percent. Lie to fifty percent knew for sure. I'm not gay but i also knew that is a woman i was attracted to men. There's no way. I would have dated a woman after my divorce i hurt. Her enough wasn't going to hurt another woman. Was she angry with you. Your wife angry angry describes it. He gave one hundred percent of herself. Didn't compromise i owed loving devoted wife. Mother let me. She was furious more though she felt betrayed on abandoned yaacov actually continued to live at home with the family but when a model couple suddenly gets divorced in a small community like jerusalem's old city people get curious and it wasn't long before word got out about the fifty percent lie. The story that yakov was gay soon. The news reached one of the jewish quarter. Smith's respected rabbis and he called me personally. He was the type of person who never called anyone a personally. He had a battery of secretaries. That would call people up and when people would go to him to ask his advice. You'd wait two hours online. And he called me up personally and said i need to talk with you. You need to come to my office and such and such a time. I knew this was not good. I show up and no line knock on the door and he insists the door in shows me. He couldn't he didn't even look at me. I remember he did not look me and he brought me into his study and i started. This is down. He said don't bother sitting. This is going to take just a few seconds. He said someone is despicable discuss the issue. I don't want sitting on furniture. He said it's been brought to my attention that you commit that perverted disgusting behavior of he said i can't even say the word of being with other men and you teach men you teach young men. He said as of this moment. If you continue i will make sure your children publicly humiliated i i. I didn't even hear the second part. I said i just went through a divorce. This is my only means of to give their mother child support. He said i'm going to beat myself because on one really make sure you understand what i'm saying. I really don't care about how she gets her money to feed these kids. You are not to teach men anymore and if you do. Your children will be humiliated in public. I said wait a minute. Did i just hear right. Are you threatening me. My children's being said. Yeah now you got it. I started to cry. And i just walked out. And that's when. I took the keep off. Said nope i can't do this anymore. Not when it comes to children's well-being my whole life is crumbling. Your whole life just fell apart so usca packed up and moved to tel aviv. A city which is much more secular engaged friendly and most importantly far away from her previous community but it was also much farther from her kids. It devastated them. I don't know if they've ever recovered from it. I've got to tell you. I always loved being with my children. The highlight of my week was when they would come to tel aviv. And i got to make dinner for them. And we camped out. Because i had a little studio but i i made deals with their mom that i wouldn't reveal everything i didn't tell them i was behaving as a gay man. I didn't use that. Language store keep piling. They came so you did this with the kids for how long this once a week for about eight months. And what made that stop. I couldn't i couldn't live in tel-aviv. As a single non-observant gay man to it was so shattered. Had nothing to hold onto your skin left israel a move back to the. Us leaving six children with their mother. Another devastating decision really hard a few years later one of the kids who was then serving in the army came to visit. He was religious and yaacov. Who's now jeff again was not. It was christmas time and the son slept on the living room couch right next to the christmas tree sleeping in his dad's bedroom was the current catholic boyfriend. Then that's when they started coming out especially to the older kids an of course it hurt not because that was coming out as gay. But because i knew i was lying to them and children. And how did they handle it. You know it's like one of them set to me years after that. They said every time we saw you we felt we were gonna get hit again. Notes like one macaw to the next mica like it never ended and there were still more changes to come for jeff. Living as a gay man still didn't feel authentic are is never a man. I was in the male body. I was always a woman it was just about like. I was in someone else's body i didn't realize there was a term called transgender. Tillis forty one. It was the early nineties and jeff was living in new york city. I'm reading about this woman. Who at that point was ten years older than me. I guess she's still ten years older than me. And she had undergone what was called gender transition. She was born transgender. Lived on the upper east side as a man married. Once a children completed college education. She decided she had to come out to her wife and children and begin a transition. I'm reading this. I'm reading this. And i'm thinking she's just like made. This is like my story. only. I didn't know that this could happen. So then i'm thinking well personally there besides me. There's gotta be at least another one or another five or another one hundred. And that led me to research even before the internet's but for the next couple of years i started reading articles and the words transgender transsexual sexual reassignment surgery transition started becoming in the forefront of my mind. It was like someone gave me the key for me to unlock the prison door. That i was held captive in my whole life will be right back. You look tired. I take the caffeine toothpaste and adrenaline face. Serum aren't working. Well maybe you should ask santa for a nectar mattress this year. Old guy brings you another unicorn finger. Puppet don't worry because mattresses start at four hundred ninety nine dollars and she gets three hundred ninety nine dollars in accessories thrown in as well as at three hundred and sixty five night home trial and forever warranty go to nick. Sleep dot com today. If you're enjoying this episode of israel's story you'll also want to check out another podcast coming out of israel dasa on-call new frontiers in medicine is an interview show. That goes behind the scenes at hadas world renowned hospital. You'll meet healthcare superstars such as the team that performed the first surgery assisted by two robots. The corneal specialist who reverse total blindness and many others subscribed to haddassah on. Call it haddassah dot org or wherever you get your podcasts in now back to our update episode. What made you really call the doctor to make that switch. I just woke up on my fiftieth birthday. And i felt so lonely on that day. None of my children acknowledged that it was my birthday. My siblings did not. No one in my family did accept my mother. may she rest in peace. I felt very lonely and malone and i said to myself and then i guess i was talking to god. I can't do this anymore. I couldn't pretend that i'm straight male. So why am i pretending that. I'm a game male. I feel i'm living once again. Someone else's life. I knew i knew what i had to do. So when i made the appointment the first question they ask you is. Have you begun your real life experience yet. You have to actually live in the world as a woman before the surgery for a year and only you know when you begin and only you know if cheat a compromise like they don't have a beeper. It's not like your house arrest and they trace you. They have better things to do your life but they want to be able to do this. So that's when. I started really dressing as a woman. I remember the first day that i said today. At september nineteenth two thousand and four. I was travelling to visit some friends in san francisco. That was probably wearing like tighter fitting top probably wearing a bra. Although there was not much to really keep up so i met the airport. And i'm thinking you know. I'm going to san francisco and i am ready and i'm going to do this so i'm going to use the ladies room for the first time in my life and i was so nervous. Walk in and was in on my gosh. This is so normal. This totally feels normal. The tension in a men's bathroom. You have no idea. I mean no one talks to each other. No one looks at each other. they're all uptight. They don't want anyone to their gay. No one would say oh. I really like your shoes when a man says what are you doing the ladies room. They don't get it. It's a whole culture. And i just took to it like oh my gosh. I'm home instead of me. Being nervous i felt like i could breathe like these people get me and then i went for speech therapy and speech therapist told me i have to give you the reality check right from the get go. She said you'll never talk like a woman but you'll talk more like a woman. It takes incredible. I mean i was with her for like two years and she taught me a lot about how to emit a female energy rather than speaking like a woman. Now i'm very peace with my voice. But i wasn't and that for many older transgender women is a really big and for at one time it was now i mean now i don't know i literally don't care after this whole process you were living as a woman. So when did you start dating as a woman. I started dating as a woman. I wanted to wait till after my surgery I had read some terrible tragic tragic stories of transgender women who showed themselves as women to the world but had for various assortment of reasons had not yet or chose not to undergo the surgery and and they dated men. There were some instances when the men found out it ended very very violently sometimes actually death. I said i'll wait. I'll wait till i'm complete. And then i just have to discuss my history. But i don't have to discuss present so i waited all the medical procedures. Were behind her. She moved to a new city to start a new life. I was living in seattle and publishing my life for the first time as a woman as jessica and i went on i put a profile on some of the dating sites and being insecure with my own transition. That that time i didn't write anything about my having transitions was one mess. After the next each one blew up in my face once they found out about me. When did they find out. But the last time that i dated like this this man we went out to some place for drinks and we were sitting and talking and he said you're such a beautiful woman. And i find you very intriguing. Seem he complimented me. And then i guess my hands were just on the table like this and he standard my hands now. That's another catch. All because transgender women tend to have larger. Hands is whole tone changed. Is there anything. I should know about you. I said well this is our first date. I guess there's a lot to you should. Is there anything. I should know about you. Like i turned to right on him. Like what kind of like we. Dick euless question. If you want to know if i'm transgender. Just ask me. So i said are you referring to something in my present on my past so i could give you the right answer because you're after something here. He's little more back to past. So i said yeah. I was born transgender. He said you know. I don't think i could date someone like you just imagining that. You're a man one time and he was quick very quick. So you don i'm not gay. I'm straight. I saw hope you straight. That's why i would go for a drink with you. you know. i'm not a lesbian. Like i kept. Bring him back to you. Initially saw in me was a woman's. Why would i think you're gay. And then he said you know you're nice but the this is just a little bit too much for me just thinking your past. I said you know it's actually a little bit too much from me is what do you mean i said if my past is a reason why you don't want to continue seen me. Your present is the reason. I don't wanna continue seeing you. I'm living in the now. I'm not living in the past. I went home at night and change my profile. I've put it right out. There said this. Is ron look like this is my past. I said one sentence is gender. Transition fully transitioned woman inside and out. The next day. I received an email the site. This is what this man said to me any woman that is beautiful as you and has gone through what you've gone through a woman. I wanna take effort. Drink a couple of nights later. We went out for a drink and he said you really went to gender transition. I said yes. He said you know. I've been married a few times. I have children been divorced like all of us a little bit older. I've been around the block a few times. I feel like i'm with like a woman who's just always been born. A woman born a woman that turned into tier relationship and we got to know many of each of the members of the of our families. We lived together. But at the same time i started to really go further and further into judaism and he's not jewish but he would come with me. Came with me to different shibat meals. He got to know all my jewish friends and he said to me one time something. I remember this one night. He said you know. I'm not looking to get remarried. I see no reason for me to remarry at this stage in my life. I have my children. I have my step children. You have your children and living in an age where neither of us are are religious. He said that i was becoming more with the just. If i were in the market to be married right now i would ask you to marry me. You have made me feel more like the man that i need to feel like than my wife's in the past he said there's just something about your feminity and i said to him you know you've completed my transition. You have made me feel like the woman. I always believed. I feel he was so we thought in a part of us we were going to live happily ever after. But i knew it wasn't going to be happily ever after i wanted to come back to israel. Wanted to be more observant dhavan so hard to husham and they said helped me with dan he so kind and he just can't just break up with him. He never liked seattle. He was texas boy and he couldn't wait to someday. Move back to texas and i knew that and there was no way i was going to texas within. That's for sure. One day. Dan who's working at boeing. Pick just up from work. He told her he had some disappointing news for her. So you're kay he said. Yeah i'm okay. Something came up at work today. And i know this is going to probably upset you. But they want to transfer me to an upper management like executive position in texas. And i would love for you to come with me. But i know you don't want to come to texas if anything you're gonna land up in israel. I said you're moving. You'll leaving seattle and you're going to move to texas. I said barrage and he already knew what borussia meant he said. Are you happy you know. I said no. It's not that unhappy that you're just moving to texas. But i'm happy that god is helping us partways with dignity and love. We both know you want to go back to texas. So this is a dream come true for you and i don't want to spend the rest of my life in seattle and texas. Not even on my list. I want to go back to you. We shall i am so. It's time that we do that. And he said you are a woman that i will love the rest of my life and i said you're a man that all of the rest of my life so if i could find a dan who's jewish and lives in israel enough votes. I'm here i am. You know. I'm not looking to someone to be like dan. That's not what i mean. Dan is dan. Whoever reuven shinola will be reuven shinola when he came back to israel. How did people treat you normal. Just regular this. What i wanted my whole life just to be regular being in israel as an out transgender woman who never has tate's for a second to say that it's been so much easier than i ever could have imagined going to the should going to the dry cleaners getting on a bus and again things like that just like regular everyday living in jerusalem levin we shall i am as a middle aged woman going about her business because there was nothing extraordinary about it. That's what was extraordinary about it. In israel jessica changed her name. It all started to feel as she says kind of normal but for some people in our life. The whole transition thing wasn't so simple to accept her parents for example i it's shattered them. It was a shock it was. They were not prepared. There was nothing to set them up for this where they could say. Well you know we kind of wondered so at first. It was very difficult for my mom who i was always very very close with. She passed away only four months ago. I didn't expect her all my father to say. Oh great and continue on your authentic living charity or you know we're right here for you know her first response to me was we've been with you through everything but this is too much for us and i said i understand so for the first six months was really you know it was very hard for her to speak with me and we always spoke several times a week but she pulled back when she needed time. She needed her time after. My whole gender transition was complete. Eventually she she said. I'd like to see you now i really do. It's been over a year. We haven't seen each other which was a long time and she said but you father does not want to see you. He's not ready to see you. He needs more time. I said fine. Everyone needs their time so with a lot of anxiety. Yiska flew down to florida and drove over to her parents house. So my mom came out as i pulled up. I got out of the car. She walked to me. We could both feel that it was weird because it's the first time she saw me as yes scott and we hugged and then we started to cry and she looked at me and these were her words. She said you do not have to explain anything. I see something in you. That i never saw before peace so while in my mind. This is very difficult that now. My son is like my daughter. And you've gone from just yakub to jeff to now like that's a lot of names for one mother she said but in my heart of hearts i really get it and then she looked at me and she said jessica. I don't like you outfit. Let's go shopping. And it was great because she would pick out a few alfred she liked. I pick out of who. Albert's i like them. We go back into the dressing room. She would try on for me. I try on for her. And i was in bliss and then eventually little by little. My father came around. Eventually i was able to sleep over. He would go away and maybe sleep at my sister's or he'd come back late and then one day he was ready to leave and i was cooking something in other phrase. The way to a man's heart is through his stomach. Well it worked. Yes my mom. Would you cooking smells really good. She said unlike cooking anything. Jessica wants to make dinner. Me he said is a to lay from me to stay so that broke the ice. Now that your mom passed away. Do you still see him as frequent. What's happened is to my amazing surprise. Is that my father has had more conversations with me now than the sum total of what i can remember in the past fifty years. I mean he's devastated. Were married sixty five and a half years. They still loved each other a lot and yet when i talked to him he opens up. I can never did before But yes gusts children and this for hers. The saddest part of the whole story have a harder time making sense of her choices mitchell. June don't talk to me anymore. None of them through the six talk with me a little five years ago. Yiska began writing a book a memoir detailing her journey. I didn't ask their permission. But i told them before. It goes to the publisher. Once it's finished edited. I will send you a transcript and you can read it and then you can tell me if inadvertently i said something about any of you out. It'll come out. No questions asked and i they were okay about it and then when it came down to it they don't care about it and they begged me not to publish it and they said you did keep. Your word is nothing about us senate. That's done then. What's the problem. Basically what it came down to is. They don't want people knowing who i am relative to them. I said that's where i draw the line. That's what we need work on it. That's the problem than me not publishing. The book is not going to solve that problem. The book really cut it for most of them. One of them said to me used to be so angry here so peaceful in so jen tolan so actually so nice to be with now but in my heart i lost my father. I think i'd rather have a father who is angry. So i'm first and foremost to them on their father and they feel portrayed. I'd i've done everything i can to protect them but i don't believe they have to be protected from me and that ultimately is believe what they want it to be protected from still yiska hasn't totally given up on the hope that our children will come back into our life every friday night when i liked my cotton wrote but i light eight lights one for me one for their mother and one for each of them. I say a special prayer that my children will once again. Be in my life would there. Would there mates with their spouse spouses spouse spice and my grandchildren who i don't know i don't know my grandchildren. They could be walking radar. I pray. I don't know what else i can do. The pain that i endured. When i was living as a man nothing could be more painful than that because it was never-ending didn't matter what i did never went away it was always there. I'm at a place. Now that people need to hear making a choice to live in. Authentic life is not like oh than the rest of my life will be all nice and smiles. My life is filled with a lot of smiles. Now they're real smiles but they're not only smalls real. Living is wrong. That was the episode. We aired back in two thousand fifteen five years later in twenty twenty we hosted these coffer fascinating update conversation on our members only facebook community as i said at the top of the show. Invite each and every one of you to join our group. Just go to facebook and search for israel story community. It's easy it's free. Of course any ill immediately become part of a vibrant group of israel story fans. You'll also be able to watch or rewatch the entire conversation. We had with e. ska. It's about forty minutes long. But for those of you who prefer to listen. Here's a much shorter. An edited version of that chat. Okay hi everyone. Welcome to a another israel story facebook live event. This time with my dear dear friend to one of the most inspiring women. I have had the honor to meet Through this show a woman who is a rabbi podcast and author public speaker but more than anything. Really a teacher usca smith. Hi scott shalom shalom me. She high consomme off You will all remember iskoe's amazing tale that we told in a one of our early israel's story episodes and what many of you probably don't know is the back story of what happened the day of the release of that episode and that was a moment that i think taught me more than any other moment working on the show about human spirit generosity and what happened was that we released the episode. I think eight in the morning and The episode was forty minutes long and literally forty two or forty three minutes after we released it. We heard from any scott to to our horror and deep sadness was very upset and east asia Believed that we should misrepresented the story in where whereas in her mind was a story of triumph and resilience. The focus at the end of the story on her children made it sound like a tragedy and she was very upset and we were very upset that she was very upset. Of course you know. This was only our ninth episode. It seems like a lifetime ago but We had never encountered such a situation and we didn't know what to do and i asked for a favor which i had no idea whether she would accept or not. I said he's scott please. Can you just sit with this for twenty four hours. And let's talk tomorrow morning and see how you're feeling and how you're doing and my and sort of deep hope. Was that in those twenty four hours. East co was going to hear from a lot of listeners. Who would infact share. How inspiring they felt. The story was and i no idea how this was going to go. And it's not often that people reverse what they think in life especially when it comes to things that really matter to them and twenty four hours later east said that she had spent the entire day. Yes these guys continuing. I remember telling you that. By sitting and meditating and contemplating as you asked me to do. I realized that in fact the privilege the space of living in with antic life is not always filled with celebrations. A real authentic life has a vibrancy to its tapestry of in ranging the emotional gamut of the human expression and for the first time i felt that i was called upon now through this israel story to talk more about that that living an authentic life is is not linear. There's lots of contradictions. But they're all based in the commitment to wanting to be honest and they thank you for pushing me into my own into my own red sea. Because i was able to see that which was concealed and that is that i needed to start speaking more about the beauty and the complexity of living true life. He's so that's a perfect segue to my first question. So what are some of the downsides of living life. Authentically some of the downsides will. It's it fall out when one no longer empowers either societal values or peer pressure or community expectations in how one goes about making decisions about one's life. The consequence could be rejection and nobody wants to be rejected. We were created to be social beings. It even says them berry sheets. That god said it's not good for a person to be alone so whether it's an intimate partner with it's a close friend an expanded family a community we seek connection. We seek approval. We seek respect. We seek love. And because i built up a life responding very proficiently and effectively to others expected me to live a really was afraid to honor. What i felt was being called upon from within from the divine within me so this rejection and this disapproval and there's a sense of abandonment a sense of betrayal. Were there moments in in which you thought that the price of living or authentic life was just too high that you should just sort of resign yourself to your to your situation at i. Yes i was afraid. I was afraid to jump in. I really was afraid to jump in. I didn't imagine. I couldn't have imagined because it was yet the to unknown future with the fallout would be and they no longer felt. I could live in that fear and there was some serious fallout but then there was some wonderful surprises. And that's part of living moving into the unknown future. We don't pinch hurwitz. I call it a transition not just a gender really was much more than that. It was a transition into living. Clean clear life of transparency vulnerability of truth as i moved further and further into that. I realized all whatever prices being estimate. I'll pay because because i need to. I need to be right with my creator. That's where it all began. So he's i have a question which also touches a little bit about living in authentic life and that is your story has been an inspiration to so many people and you've told it in many different contexts to students to to podcast listeners. To filmgoers and i know from my own life that stories that i tell again and again lose a certain degree of freshness and authenticity. And it's difficult for me to actually to feel them. It's almost like i'm i'm just sort of reciting a script. How do you maintain sort of the fresh inauthentic feeling of telling your story. That's such a good question because at about six months ago. I made a decision. That was that. I no longer going to really tell my story. I was becoming tired. Not target of my life. God forbid but tired of telling about what more and more was my history as i moved further and further into my present that takes more and more of a backseat. Would i do teach spiritual tax. If i feel that piece of my pass can better inform the text. I will do that as an example to bring the text more to the relevancy to audience. But now living in the space that i transitioned to be in i feel now. I don't have this obstacle in front of me. I feel the whole world is out there for me to lower to share to teach to lead to guide also to learn more to research more as a scholar of spiritual texan. I'm loving it. And i'm really coming into my fullness in that sense so he's kayak I know a lot of listeners. Know and please share whatever you feel comfortable sharing. Do you now have a relationship with any of your children. Yes i'm excited. I didn't even wait the british. The question which is not really the way one should be actively listening. Yes and i feel so so grateful. And so celebratory that i have with three three of my children in one way or another A much healthier warmer connection with one in particular We speak almost every day. She lives here in in israel. you know. she has a big family. And i'm integrated inter family with my grandchildren. It is absolutely beyond beyond what i ever imagined and also my siblings two sisters. We've completely reconciled in the past year. We are closer now than we've ever been and it just brings my family and it gives my father who's still alive me live and be well. It gives them such happiness and even set to me on my last visit. I know your mother in heaven is so happy now to see the three of you so close together again so and their close with you know with my my children. I'm getting close to some of my nieces and nephews i. it's just blossoming more and more. Yes it was gradual. A lot of tears a lot of prayers. A lot of leading goes a lot of difficult questions. Yeah yeah but have happened some of the others still not there yet but all my children are very close with each other so they all know and who knows. I have a lot of hope Thank you. That's that's so beautiful and i'm sure now. Many of the listeners will have their own first hand experience of learning from you and loving you in the way that i do. You've really made a big big difference in my life. And i think about you often and love you. Very much michigan michigan tada. Can i say one more thing in conclusion. Of course thank you. i just wanted to leave the audience. You know education. We learn that people. Remember i what they heard last. So if you're going to remember anything. I'd like you all to remember this that whatever price i had to. Hey the lead up to my transition moving through my transition to where i am now. It was all worth it to live a life of truth to be right with our creator. There's no price too high to pay for that. And i never imagined if to having crossed through my own see and the party of those waters and being able to really grasp the beauty the jews i have been able to discover in my own soul by living. A life. Worth to city is more than i could ever ever imagined. So bless you all all the listeners. Whatever you need to do to be more of who. You're supposed to be doing it because you can't imagine how much better much better your life will be and can continue to be scott teaches and podcasts. And lectures in does a zillion other things to share her message of authentic living. If you want to dive deeper into her story. I highly recommend you reader. Twenty four memoir forty years in the wilderness made journey to authenticate living and check out a wonderful documentary made about her called. I was not born mistake. Our original story was reported by molly. Livingstone and produced by bennie becker and choshi schmulavitz with help from row. What lee in rachel fisher. The update was produced by schuyler in and yoshi fields with music from blue dot sessions. Israel's story is produced in partnership with tablet magazine. Our staff is your high may zev levi yoshi field schuyler in joel chupak show on apple bolton autumn. Jeff umbro from the pajama is our marketing director. Maria dirk clarify michael. Viva and eliza vergara are wonderful production. Interns i mean she harmon and we'll be back a very soon with our next episode and he's suddenly like you. You don't think as a christian at all you think like joop so till then. Please stay safe. Shalom shalom an alibi. Take off a this. The book but then ooh A dumb blonde. A shoe key code shot us again home by then rally a us bad a took show ban. You got shot. Shut down. Shut shabby speculation but august. If the twenty four hour news cycle leaves you feeling like you know everything but understand nothing. You need to listen to deep background hosted by harvard law school. 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